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 If you feel like you're not living your most authentic life, not leaning into your purpose, and not living the life that your future self would be extremely proud of, I've written a new book called The Greatness Mindset, and I think you're gonna love this.
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Through powerful stories, science-backed strategies, and step-by-step guidance, The Greatness Mindset will help you overcome all the different challenges in your life to design the life of your dreams and then turn it into your reality.
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Make sure to click the link in the description to get your copy today.
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 Love is being disagreeable.
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Love is saying no.
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Love is standing up for yourself.
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So love is risking being likable.
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You know, I think it's classic.
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Welcome to the School of Greatness.
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My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur.
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And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness.
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Thanks for spending some time with me today.
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Now let the class begin.
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 I didn't write a book as a love guru.
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I wrote this book as the guy at the front of the class taking all the notes, trying his best to understand this, and sharing it with everybody.
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So what did you discover?
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 I discovered that if I love, you don't find love, you don't win love, you don't earn love, you can only realize love.
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So going back to analogies, love is a breeze.
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The only work you have to do is opening your sails.
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And if you can't open your sails to receive love, it doesn't matter how many people love you.
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It doesn't matter.
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You can have somebody worshiping the ground you walk on, you can't receive it, you can't receive it.
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So that was one of the biggest lessons, which was there, you know,
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 Realizing that oh, I don't have to do or be anything to have love in my life I have to do the work to receive the love that's literally I'm being flooded and surrounded by it and I think That was a big thing where instead of me thinking.
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Oh, I'm not with the right person.
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I just need another person another person It's like no you have to address your root issues And if you don't address your root issues, you're gonna have this problem forever
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 What were your main root issues for you?
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My main root issues, insecurity, unaddressed, not addressing racism I had growing up, so now overcompensating, trying to be as desirable as possible and only being able to measure my desirability through how many women were sliding in my DMs, value who validates me, but then realizing that, okay, there's so many places I'm in the in-club,
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 but if I don't feel like, you know, like after Poland, the amount of millionaires that DM'd me saying, how do I get in on this?
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It was a moment where I was like, wait a minute, did I just?
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 fall into the in-club, because it doesn't feel any different, so maybe I need to, the issue isn't who accepts me, who invites me places, it's how I feel about myself.
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And so I think for me, working with myself, having the relationship with myself, keeping promises to myself, voluntary doing hard things, like sitting in the ice, taking cold showers, and then at the same time, choosing love over being likable.
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 What's that mean?
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What's the difference between being loved over likable?
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 Being likable is not disappointing anybody.
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Being likable is being accepted by everybody.
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Being likable is feeling included.
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Love is being disagreeable.
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Love is saying no.
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Love is standing up for yourself.
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So love is risking being likable.
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Love is having boundaries.
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Telling you, you're crossing, these are my boundaries, you have to respect them.
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And not being afraid of being like, oh, that's gonna reject.
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 romantic partner or a friend or a business opportunity because I have rules and I have a code and I have boundaries.
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So I think these are a lot of things because so often when we feel like we're in competition the first thing we'll do is we'll reduce our boundaries to be more accepted.
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 Like I'll work around Lewis's schedule, whatever he needs just so he'll hang out with me.
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That's me reducing my boundaries to be light.
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But now what I'm doing is I'm chasing self-esteem and I'm reducing my self-respect.
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But the more self-respect I focus on, the less self-esteem I need.
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And we all know those people that don't care to impress anybody and then we want their acceptance even more.
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 So I think for me, that's been a really big one, which is like, okay, I have been outsourcing when I feel alone.
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I've been outsourcing that.
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Not understanding that loneliness is not a circumstance, it's a feeling.
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Because what's the difference between loneliness and solitude?
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When you're by yourself, solitude is what it feels like when it's rewarding.
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Loneliness is what it feels like when it's a punishment.
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What's the difference when I enjoy my own company?
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Yeah.
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Why do you think so many people don't enjoy their own company?
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Because
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 We have spent so much time understanding ourselves in relation to everybody else.
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And I think, you know, my parents grew up in a village, so I think for me, it hits closer to home.
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It's not like multiple generations ago.
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My parents grew up in a village of 50 people max.
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What everybody in the village said about them mattered.
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It probably directly impacted their actual
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 Survival right so they were very mindful of like what will people think what will people say that's not as relevant in a major city But that's still still etched in our DNA.
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Yes.
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It's old software Survival software survival software that doesn't serve us in these environments and I think from that standpoint That's why we care and I think on top of that is
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 you know, understand like, okay, I told Louis a story, but then while I'm telling him the story, I can see his eyes gloss over.
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Those are the subtle things that we used to think about.
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Do people like me?
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Do people not?
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Now there's a number attached to it.
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I posted a picture.
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I got this many likes, this many comments.
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Oh, then I posted another picture with a Lamborghini and I got this many, I should do more of that.
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 And I think we're getting these subtle pushes and pulls by all these different platforms and societal kind of tools that tell us this is who you need to be to gain more acceptance.
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And we're not doing it to feel better, we're doing it to feel less anxious.
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 Because we have this constant anxiety of we're going to be rejected, we're going to be pushed out.
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And I think that's, you know, our environments have evolved quicker than our bodies.
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So it's old software on the phone that we can't delete.
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And we just, the only thing we can do is be aware of it.
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 And I think so for me, that's been this journey of being like, OK, well, what do I do?
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I need to be a best selling author.
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Do I need to make a bunch of money?
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Do I need to make sure I'm included in the in the cool getaways and discovery groups?
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And I need to make sure I'm with the you know, with all the cool kids in the wellness group.
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 You know all the other people who are looking at from the outside see me as the cool kid Like do I need that or do I need to say?
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Hey, you're waking up at 6 30 a.m.
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And you did it you taking a cold shower and you did it you promised so-and-so that you're gonna show up to their event and you're super tired and you're Stuck in traffic and you want to flake but you're gonna make it up because you showed up because you said you were gonna show up right all of these things are dramatically more important and
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 And they're going to reveal much more love in your life for yourself.
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And now you're the source of love instead of something that's thirsting and chasing love and trying to find it from everybody from every different situation.
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And I think that's been a huge situation.
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Because I've also realized that I've had so much external validation and it's great.
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You have the moment and then there's a day after.
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 There's a day after the one-night stand, there's a day after the award, there's a day after having an event where you're the center of attention, and then what?
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There's a day after getting recognized on the street, there's a day after all of these external things, you just want more.
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It just leads to you wanting more.
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They're delicious, but they're not nutritious.
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 And I think for me, that's been really the awareness of it.
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And in the last chapter of this book, I specifically say, look, all this book is, is me explaining the difference between French fries and broccoli.
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That's all I'm doing.
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And while I'm writing this book, I'm eating French fries and broccoli.
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 I'm not better than anybody else.
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And I'm saying maybe there's a world where their plate can have french fries and broccoli in it, and we can have a little bit of both.
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Recognizing that one is way more delicious than the other, but one is way more nutritious than the other.
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And when we know the differences, that'll help us make better decisions.
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And here's why we were fooled to believe certain things.
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Because the most exciting couples we've ever seen on TV and in the movies are gonna be dysfunctional.
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They have to be dysfunctional.
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 You know, when you're in a good relationship, it's probably not worth filming because it's not the most eventful.
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It's not super high, super lows.
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I have a friend who produces reality shows and they just produced somebody's wedding on a reality show and it's a happy couple and she goes, I had to figure out how to make it dramatic without making it toxic.
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 So I'm like, so what did you do?
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She goes, well, we didn't force them to fight.
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All we did was we made everything they ordered for the wedding, we made it all get lost.
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Oh my gosh, there had to be some frustration.
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Had to be drama, but at least they didn't allow it to be between the people.
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They're just like, oh, you ordered your wedding dress from this country?
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We sent it to the wrong location.
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So now the episode will be about chasing that.
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So we have to realize that we've been
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 Socialized to think that our relationships have to have drama because drama makes for good television or good movies but relationships should be peaceful and peaceful loving Yeah, kind and which makes us we should make us question this idea of the spark Everyone's chasing the spark and there's that great book attached that says we're not saying soulmates don't exist We're saying you probably passed your soulmate because you thought they were boring
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 And there are studies that prove that the spark isn't something that many long-term couples ever had.
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 And also you hear from a lot of therapists saying like, if you feel that exciting spark when you meet someone, run.
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Yes, it's a fight or flight.
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It's like run away because there's probably some trauma bonding or some type of thing that you're needing that this person might have or may not have.
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They remind you of your earliest trauma and we all choose nostalgia over health.
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If it's familiar, we're gonna choose that more than we're gonna choose what's good for us.
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 And we all do that whether it's a sugary cereal that we grew up with or having people because in our households when we were younger
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 We internalized everything like it was our fault.
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If our parents had a bad day at work and came home and were in crabby moods, we didn't know the context as to why they were that way.
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We thought it was our fault.
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So then we, a lot of us made earning love our default.
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So we find ourselves attracted to people who make us feel like we have to earn our love.
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And then if it's easy, we don't want it.
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I saw a funny video today of a guy explaining all his green flags and then another dude in the back had a big red flag and the girl's like, I gotta go.
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And she chased after the guy with red flags.
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 So funny.
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And it's making fun of this idea, but we've been conditioned to think we have to earn it.
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But love isn't something you earn.
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Why is that?
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Why do certain people go after individuals with all the red flags trying to earn or change them or be deserving of that person?
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Why is that?
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 I think it goes back to our upbringing.
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I think our first models of love were the people who raised us.
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They weren't perfect, but we had developing brains.
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We could only look at life in terms of black and white.
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If you're like 9 to 12, your brain's not even fully developed in any capacity.
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It can still develop until 25, 26.
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 And then we're going to look at that and be like, okay, I had to earn their love.
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I had to earn their attention.
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I had to compete with my siblings to get them to notice me.
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I had to do all of that.
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That becomes a coping mechanism that never gets revisited when they become an adult.
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And then that's what feels right.
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 It's familiar.
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It's familiar.
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It's familiar.
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And it's like, it's no different if there was two identical pairs of shoes and one was $90 and one was $100, I can logically say I'm going to pick the $90 shoes because they're $10 cheaper.
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But I can't logically tell you why I'm picking vanilla ice cream over chocolate.
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 There's no, you know, it just feels right.
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So that's when we chase people, it just feels right.
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But we don't know why it feels right.
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It feels right because it reminds you, it matches the flavor of the trauma that you had growing up.
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And you're still feeling that trauma and it feels like a safety blanket, even though it's the exact opposite.
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 And you talked about in the beginning about learning how to open your sails and receive love.
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When we chase after unhealthy relationships, whether it be friendships or societal relationships or intimate partners, do you think that we're not able to receive love like in a healthy way if we're chasing an unhealthy individual?
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And how do we learn to receive love in a healthy way?
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 I think receiving love means being open to it and I love the Preto-Corona idea of creating pathways to love.
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You can't say I love you, you say you show me where love is and you create a pathway because chasing somebody is more so we're chasing things that
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 are facsimiles of love.
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You know, like the bootleg version of love.
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Attention, affection, adoration, success, power, control, validation.
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All of these, they look and feel like love, but they're not.
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And they're quick fixes.
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They're fast food versions of it.
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You know, you can eat a bunch of fast food and feel full, but you're not going to feel any nutrition.
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And you're going to get hungry a lot quicker, and you're probably not going to feel so good.
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 But it's addictive.
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It's extremely salty.
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And there's nothing wrong with any of us being addicted to that.
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The subtitle of this book is going easy on yourself.
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I'm pointing these things out not to judge you, but to be like, look, all of us can't have just one potato chip.
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And if you're chasing validation from somebody and you've spent your whole life chasing validation from people, I understand how it's addictive.
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And addiction often can come when the rewards are unanticipated.
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 You know, so when people gamble, they don't know when they're going to hit it big.
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That's why they do it.
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When people are in abusive relationships, they don't know when they're going to have a good day.
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That's why they stick with it.
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When we're on social media, we can scroll for an hour and see things that make us sad, see things that trigger our emotions.
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 see things that make us compare ourselves to other people, see things that make us feel depressed, and then all of a sudden, a cute puppy, and we're like, oh, it was all worth it.
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It's always these unanticipated rewards that make us feel addictive.
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And I think that's the same thing with these relationships, where it's like, you know somebody is in a good place, they're gonna compliment you every morning, they're gonna say all the right things, they're gonna take care of you.
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There's almost this lack of excitement that comes with it.
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It's not as salty, and it's not a potato chip.
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It's healthy, it's nutritious, it's broccoli.
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 And that's what we need in the long term.
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So I think, as I said, my only goal is to help people become more aware of that.
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Be like, this is why I'm chasing this person because they remind me of my dad.
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Or I'm chasing this person because they criticize me the way my mother used to criticize me.
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And it feels comfortable, but if I want to have a different life, I'm going to have to do different things.
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 On a scale of 1 to 10, 2 years ago when you were engaged and ending the engagement, scale 1 to 10, how lovable did you feel to yourself?
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10 being like totally love yourself 100%, totally lovable, you believed you were a lovable person, 1 being unlovable.
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 Where were you on that scale?
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Two years ago?
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Probably a three.
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Three?
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I was probably a three.
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I think there were definitely parts of my life where I wasn't as insecure as maybe other people.
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I've never really experienced imposter syndrome, for example.
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Like, I quickly understood that, oh, I'm just as capable as anybody else in that capacity.
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I know
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 I can write, I know I can do the things I can do, I know I deserve to be in the rooms that I'm in.
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But in terms of receiving positive feedback from people, receiving, feeling seen by people, that was a very weird situation.
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And I think also my upbringing
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 had taught me, unintentionally, without blaming anybody, that vulnerability was a weakness.
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And I didn't realize that vulnerability is the only way to connect with other people.
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And you know, when we were in Poland, that was a wonderful example of everybody being vulnerable, me knowing a bunch of guys for five days and developing lifelong relationships till this day.
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But it was through vulnerability.
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It was through us being scared as crap to go on the ice, through us sharing stories and crying together and holding each other.
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 And these aren't things that I ever realized was a thing when I was in a long-term relationship because I always thought I had to maintain a level of protection.
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And I didn't realize that the fortress I was building was a prison.
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 And what I thought I had to do to protect myself, because I had a few negative experiences as a child, and I was thinking very simply, were not serving me as an adult.
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So my ability to receive love isn't there.
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And I think a lot of people, a lot of people can't, even today, can't receive compliments.
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They don't know how to accept compliments.
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And I think that's a good sign right there that we don't know how to be open and receive love.
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And I think that's the first step to understanding that it's just not a lack of love.
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 in anybody's life.
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It's a lack of receiving love.
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Yeah, again, the breeze can be there.
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If your cell is closed, then you're not going anywhere.
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And it's more about doing the work to open yourself up to this.
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And it's scary.
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And it will blow up in your face sometimes.
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And you may be vulnerable with the wrong person.
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 And it may totally feel like you just dumped your heart in a situation and nothing came out.
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But it's not about what you got from it.
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It's what you become through doing it.
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And I think that's been the journey for me realizing.
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It's like it's being more and more uncomfortable every single day and realizing that
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 I'm only entitled to the work.
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What comes from the work, that's not my concern.
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The results you don't know, yeah.
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The results I don't know.
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What were the two or three things you did over the last two years to create more lovability within yourself, the ability to love and receive love more?
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 So what I learned through, and I believe it was potentially Jordan Peterson in one of his interviews, was the definition of sin, the actual word sin, the definition is to be without aim.
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And it helped me realize that I was actually avoiding setting concrete goals and concrete directions to anything I wanted.
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 One of the first things that I did was realize that I need, you know, if you want to get in better shape, you hire a trainer.
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If I want to be a better writer, hire a writing coach.
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So I went and I got into therapy.
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And again, that's the dating process in itself.
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Took a few therapists until I found the right one.
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And once I got a therapist, one of the things we did when it came to romantic relationships was she had me relive my entire romantic life.
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 Ooh, all the relationships you're in.
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I mean, even the little ones when you were like seven, eight, the little crushes.
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How long did that process take to relive those?
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That was probably two full hours of just storytelling.
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And she paid attention to my face and whenever my face got bright, she would write that down.
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 And what we ended up doing was we ended up becoming aware of what qualities actually make me excited, or actually make me wanna be more vulnerable.
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Or actually, because I think.
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Feel more loved, all those things, yeah.
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Feel more loved, and I think also what I'm actually enthusiastic.
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Because I think everybody will have this generic, like this is what I want in a partner, or this is what I want in a friendship.
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And they'll all be the same answers.
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And I think what that did was it really pointed out to me the unique things that actually mattered.
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Remembering the very first,
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 Person that I dated that had said to me you know what the world needs to hear what you have to say like the world needs to hear humble a poet like you need to stop doing all this other stuff and like thinking about okay Versus dating somebody in the future when I was telling them my plans and they're like, but what if that doesn't happen?
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 Like can't we have a plan B, you know and realizing that okay the two very different directions that people can take me in their influence on me So I need to be with somebody who's gonna constantly push me out of my comfort zone Who constantly wants that for themselves and then also learning that hey, not only are we just discovering qualities in a person?
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We have to relate.
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How does those qualities make you feel?
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Mm-hmm
0
SPEAKER_00
 Just last month, the late co-founder of Microsoft, Paul Allen, sold his art collection for the record-breaking sum of $1.6 billion.
0
SPEAKER_00
So what does this have to do with you?
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, the market for every other investment is cratering, but art is reaching record prices.
0
SPEAKER_00
There is a way to access this potentially lucrative market safely and for a fraction of the price, and it's called Masterworks.
0
SPEAKER_00
 They qualify their paintings with the SEC so you have the highest level of protection while you invest.
0
SPEAKER_00
Masterworks has been delivering real results.
0
SPEAKER_00
Like early last month, they handed their investors a 17.8% net return.
0
SPEAKER_00
In fact, their last three sales have delivered 17, 21, and 23% net returns.
0
SPEAKER_00
 As a result, Masterworks even has a waitlist, but you can skip it by using promo code greatness at masterworks.com.
0
SPEAKER_00
That's promo code greatness at masterworks.com.
0
SPEAKER_00
See important regulation A disclosures at masterworks.com slash CD.
0
SPEAKER_01
 So instead of saying, I want someone attractive, the question is, first off, what is attractive to you?
0
SPEAKER_01
Because beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
0
SPEAKER_01
And what does that do for you?
0
SPEAKER_01
Is it you want someone attractive because you want a piece of arm candy to impress your friends?
0
SPEAKER_01
Or do you want someone attractive because you want somebody's symmetrical face that you can look at?
0
SPEAKER_01
Or do you want someone attractive because you have a commitment to beauty and you want to enjoy being around beautiful people?
0
SPEAKER_01
Or you want someone attractive because they smile a lot.
0
SPEAKER_01
 There's different definitions of that, and I think forcing me to go deep made me become very specific with who I wanted to be around.
0
SPEAKER_01
And even this morning, I had a therapy session, and she was explaining to me, people either fly, fight, freeze, or fawn when they're nervous.
0
SPEAKER_01
And she goes, fawners are people who start to manipulate the situation to be more likable.
0
SPEAKER_01
She goes, listen, when you discover a fawner, run the other way.
0
SPEAKER_01
 Don't be around any women who prioritize being likable over communicating clearly or conflict resolution.
0
SPEAKER_01
Be around people who can communicate successfully and in a straight line to you.
0
SPEAKER_01
And she goes, don't spend time and energy around those other people.
0
SPEAKER_01
 And that's a tricky thing because we want to be liked by everybody, but this requires you to be like, okay, you're not somebody I can invest time and energy in.
0
SPEAKER_01
And again, not just romantically.
0
SPEAKER_01
This also means work relationships and in friendships.
0
SPEAKER_01
So being clear with what works for me and what doesn't work for me versus wanting everyone to like me, I think was a very important step into revealing and realizing more love in my life.
0
SPEAKER_01
Because being like, okay,
0
SPEAKER_01
 Everyone listening to this interview may not like me and that's okay.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, let me be around the people I need to be around with Going through this process of selling a book.
0
SPEAKER_01
We're playing the attention game, right?
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, there's endless things I can do to catch people's attention on social media But a lot of those things might you know might not be things that are in line with my core values so reminding myself like
0
SPEAKER_01
 Even though your career and your paychecks matter and relate to this, ensure people find you for the right reasons.
0
SPEAKER_01
I might not be able to play certain games or make certain type of content, but then I'm also not trapping myself on that journey if it works.
0
SPEAKER_00
 Yeah, you're not doing dancing videos all day or something that doesn't work for you or make sense for you, right?
0
SPEAKER_01
Completely.
0
SPEAKER_01
Or even relying on controversy.
0
SPEAKER_01
Or relying on, you know, polarization and saying things that... Or news or whatever it is, yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
News-related topics.
0
SPEAKER_00
Whatever it might be.
0
SPEAKER_01
And we've had that conversation before, too, where you've had people over here where you could, you know,
0
SPEAKER_01
 ramp up the controversy, but you don't, because that's not what the school of greatness is.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think there's a beauty to that, and it may make the growth slower, but it's more sustainable.
0
SPEAKER_01
It's healthier.
0
SPEAKER_01
It's way healthier.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think that it's choosing health, the slow long-term over the fast immediate.
0
SPEAKER_01
And it was you who said to me, and it's always stuck with me,
0
SPEAKER_01
 Good things happen to people who defer gratification.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think about that all the time because in front of me is always this gratifying option and then there's the long hard road and I was like, okay Louis.
0
SPEAKER_00
I know and you also have a tattoo that says remember the future, right?
0
SPEAKER_01
Which I got watching this show.
0
SPEAKER_01
Joe Dispenza said this on your show and I remember
0
SPEAKER_01
 hearing it over the pandemic and being like, I love it, and yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
I think it's thinking about our future self, you know, as frequently as I can.
0
SPEAKER_00
It's funny, I had a therapy conversation last night with my coach, and I'm gonna be 40 in, I don't know, a few months, right?
0
SPEAKER_00
March.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I never really pay attention to birthdays, right?
0
SPEAKER_00
I acknowledge them, I'm like, I have my lessons, and I reflect on them, but I don't really do big things, because I try to celebrate every day, right?
0
SPEAKER_00
Anyways, not the point.
0
SPEAKER_00
 But she was kind of like bringing it up and saying, you know, what's your vision now moving forward, like going into this new decade, kind of like what's the dream, what's the vision, what's the aim?
0
SPEAKER_00
 And I was like, I wanna look, I wanna be talking to myself now as my 50-year-old self.
0
SPEAKER_00
And coaching myself on all the challenges or fears that I'm faced with.
0
SPEAKER_00
And seeing like all the actions I know I can take that I feel like are gonna be scary, but then when I'm 50, I'm gonna say, that was nothing.
0
SPEAKER_00
You know, that was...
0
SPEAKER_00
 Good job.
0
SPEAKER_00
Like I'm glad you went through those fears.
0
SPEAKER_00
I'm glad you conquered that You got us here, but really that wasn't that big of a deal, you know It wasn't that big of a deal.
0
SPEAKER_00
It just feels like a big deal before we do it.
0
SPEAKER_00
So But it's funny.
0
SPEAKER_00
I was having the same similar type of conversation about Remembering the future.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, because I'm trying to make a few big decisions in my life And she was like is this gonna feel like a big decision ten years from now?
0
SPEAKER_00
I'm like, no, it's gonna feel like a small decision.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah ten years away, but it's something I need to do in order to
0
SPEAKER_00
 Feel it now as opposed to delaying it in order to feel that later.
0
SPEAKER_00
So yeah It's interesting.
0
SPEAKER_00
What's the biggest thing that therapy has taught you?
0
SPEAKER_01
 Therapy has taught me, and I think this is a great way to define therapy, therapy has taught me that a lot of our challenges come from our black and white thinking.
0
SPEAKER_01
We think it's either this or it's that.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think a lot of that comes from childhood when we had less developed brains and that's how we could think.
0
SPEAKER_01
We couldn't think in terms of the complexities.
0
SPEAKER_01
So we thought mom's mad, she's mad at me.
0
SPEAKER_01
 You know, it's either that or she's not mad.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think as we get older, we're like, oh, that person might have had a hard day.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, we can see the complexities.
0
SPEAKER_01
We can see all the gray in between.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think it's oftentimes we've made so many decisions when it comes to our personality, how we're going to handle conflict, how we're going to handle challenges when we were young.
0
SPEAKER_01
And we don't upgrade that software.
0
SPEAKER_01
We don't upgrade those choices.
0
SPEAKER_01
So for me, it's having these conversations with my therapist and arguments, me and my therapist.
0
SPEAKER_01
 She says are you fit we I love to argue and she says I'm one of her favorite clients for it and she wins every time Which is which is funny, which is why I keep her around cuz I'm I'm a very stubborn individual, right?
0
SPEAKER_01
She did a lot of that those moments.
0
SPEAKER_01
She catches me all the time and very often is like She'll simply be like why is it only this or that?
0
SPEAKER_01
Why are those the only choices?
0
SPEAKER_01
Why can't there be other options and I?
0
SPEAKER_01
 It's really interesting because it makes you discover the root.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, I'm the child of an immigrant.
0
SPEAKER_01
I grew up in scarcity mindset.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, the vast majority of the emotions that human can feel are leaning in the negative side because negative emotions keep you alive.
0
SPEAKER_01
 But I don't live in scarcity.
0
SPEAKER_01
I'm doing okay.
0
SPEAKER_01
I don't have to, but I think, you know, I think the way my mom raised me, you know, which is if you can make it, don't buy it.
0
SPEAKER_01
Now realizing that making it takes way more time than buying it.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
I have a puppy and I still use a leash my mom made for me, you know, because it's a sentimental value to it, but that's how her upbringing was.
0
SPEAKER_01
But none of us, you know,
1
SPEAKER_01
 My parents don't have a mortgage.
1
SPEAKER_01
They don't have bills and I'm the youngest and I'm doing very well So like it's a mindset, you know, it's like why does this have to be this or that?
1
SPEAKER_01
It could be this and that and something else we can live in contradiction.
1
SPEAKER_01
We all do live in contradiction We don't have to play play these games.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think therapy that's been the most important thing for me It's helped me realize how often I've created a cage for myself Because I'm looking at life through duality and life is beyond that and what I've also realized is in terms of love
1
SPEAKER_01
 Love is what exists beyond duality.
1
SPEAKER_01
When we stop looking at the world in terms of duality, what's left is love, because love is everything and nothing.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, when you are in love with somebody, that's when pretty much your ego boundaries start to melt and you view them as you.
1
SPEAKER_01
 There's no I, there's no you and me, there's we.
1
SPEAKER_01
And so you cease to become something, but at the same time you feel everything.
1
SPEAKER_01
And there's that beauty there, and it's kind of like the center, you know, it's not on the outside looking in, you're not on the inside looking out, you're in the middle looking everywhere.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think there's a beauty to that.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think having that realization in therapy has been amazing.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And I don't always catch myself doing it.
1
SPEAKER_01
So having these stories, having these conversations with the therapist, and then having her quickly realize like, okay, well, what are your choices?
1
SPEAKER_01
And I say the two choices.
1
SPEAKER_01
She's like, why?
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm like, well, what else is it?
1
SPEAKER_01
She'd be like, you tell me what is the choice.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And so often like well, I didn't consider that an option.
1
SPEAKER_01
She's like why not?
1
SPEAKER_01
I mean like oh, it's because I was raised a certain way.
1
SPEAKER_01
Sure Well, you know I was raised to think that I can only live at one place at one time And I can only play pay rent at one place at one time and I can only I would only pay rent if I'm actually living there at that time Why would I have a place in this city and in this city?
1
SPEAKER_01
I have to pick between the two versus why not live in both right and
1
SPEAKER_01
 And I think that concept has been really important to me.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it's helped me with friends who have reached out to me.
1
SPEAKER_01
I can quickly identify too that they're just living in black and white mindset.
1
SPEAKER_01
And again, there's nothing wrong with that.
1
SPEAKER_01
We all made these decisions when we were kids.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I used to be a school teacher.
1
SPEAKER_01
That's how kids think.
1
SPEAKER_01
They can't think.
1
SPEAKER_01
 in terms of complexity.
1
SPEAKER_01
Because their brains are still developing.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I recommend everybody see a therapist and if you can't afford a therapist, journal every day.
1
SPEAKER_01
Because even the process of journaling and getting these thoughts outside of you and getting them on paper will help you start to realize there's way more options than what I just thought.
1
SPEAKER_01
And this wasn't as heavy as I thought it was.
1
SPEAKER_00
I want to go back to people-pleasing.
1
SPEAKER_00
 Because you mentioned about trying to be liked with everyone and I think a lot of people have lived that at some point in their life or are still living that.
1
SPEAKER_00
What would you say is the mantra or the strategies that supported you from moving away from people pleasing?
1
SPEAKER_00
Because I feel like it's a spectrum probably.
1
SPEAKER_00
It's like okay, I used to want everyone to like me and now it's like less of the time and then it's just I have my friends and I don't care what people think or whatever.
1
SPEAKER_00
But what is the mantra and the strategies you've used to move away from needing to be a people pleaser to everyone?
1
SPEAKER_00
 Towards towards reclaiming your energy and loving yourself completely.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think the first one is realizing that people can only receive you where they're at you know, if I'm not in a good place and Let's say something's not going well in my career and then I see you post something about something wonderful in your career I'm gonna interpret that as negative, you know, and if I'm not in the space of self-awareness, I might even take it as an attack and
1
SPEAKER_01
 So you start to realize that even when people leave mean comments on your post, they're telling you their story, not yours.
1
SPEAKER_01
I've also had to make peace with the fact that, and there's a line in Sikhi that says, you know, a saint is unimpacted by praise or slander.
1
SPEAKER_01
So it's not just caring about when people say negative things to you, you have to be equally unimpacted by the positive things.
1
SPEAKER_01
Because you have to realize that these are, especially if you're a public figure, these people have a limited view of you.
1
SPEAKER_01
 So they think you're amazing, they're wrong.
1
SPEAKER_01
And if they think you're a piece of garbage, they're wrong.
1
SPEAKER_01
Because they're sitting in the nosebleed sections of your life and have a very small view of who you actually are.
1
SPEAKER_01
So not all opinions are equal.
1
SPEAKER_01
And we can't chase the praise and ask ourselves to be unimpacted by the slander or the negative sides of it.
1
SPEAKER_01
So for me, it's become, I'm unimpacted by, if you don't know me, I can't give a lot of value to your words, even if you're saying things I like.
1
SPEAKER_01
 So chasing likability from that context is not there.
1
SPEAKER_01
And also realizing that I don't like everybody.
1
SPEAKER_01
You can be the juiciest peach in the world and some people just don't like peaches.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I think that's.
1
SPEAKER_00
I don't like peaches.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, if you don't like peaches, I can show you the most expensive beautiful peach.
1
SPEAKER_00
Love this, I like it, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Exactly, I think for me it's caviar.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it's like, I don't get this.
1
SPEAKER_01
I don't get the expensive stuff or the cheap stuff.
1
SPEAKER_00
And it's like.
1
SPEAKER_01
 So being okay with I'm not everybody's cup of tea.
1
SPEAKER_01
Everybody's not my cup of tea, right?
1
SPEAKER_01
So spending my time in this arena is not something I need to do and instead I have 10 to 15 years now of friends who have been there for me giving me couches to sleep on put money in my pocket have made Introductions for me have put me in positions to really realize my potential These are people I care about
1
SPEAKER_01
 Doing work with the motivation of proving them right has always been something that has really given me something to be proud of.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, I never want someone to put me in position and feel like they wasted their energy or time or reputation for doing so.
1
SPEAKER_01
So that's been something that's been really important where it's like focus on the people in your life.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it was actually a musician who taught me, he said, listen, when you make music,
1
SPEAKER_01
 1% want to know everything about you.
1
SPEAKER_01
10% will listen to everything you do.
1
SPEAKER_01
And he goes, the other 89%, your background music while they're studying.
1
SPEAKER_01
And if you don't give them what they want, they're going to move on.
1
SPEAKER_01
He goes, focus on the 1% to 10%.
1
SPEAKER_01
 Focus on them.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it's not about, you know, when we all start out, the people who support us are our friends and family.
1
SPEAKER_01
Create more friends and family.
1
SPEAKER_01
Create these deeper, meaningful connections and doing all of that.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think for me, that's been a big thing.
1
SPEAKER_01
And being out here, especially in Hollywood now, it's just hard to see the correlations between the city and politics.
1
SPEAKER_01
 you know, where a politician's job is to keep everybody happy because that keeps them in power.
1
SPEAKER_01
And they'll say everything and do everything and make a bunch of promises until they get the power and then they break the promises and then they do it again.
1
SPEAKER_01
But it's this idea of the people pleasing, that's the only job where you actually have to be a professional people pleaser.
1
SPEAKER_01
And for the rest of us,
1
SPEAKER_01
 we have to say something.
1
SPEAKER_01
And to say something means having a group of people to disagree with you.
1
SPEAKER_01
And that's okay.
1
SPEAKER_00
And being okay with it, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Being completely okay with it.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think for me that's been a really interesting journey.
1
SPEAKER_01
And also the reminder that
1
SPEAKER_01
 Again, it's not reward or punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's not either I'm being rewarded by social media for participating or I'm being punished.
1
SPEAKER_01
Either I'm being rewarded by society or I'm being punished.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's really, you can be rewarded for doing certain things or you're just being left alone.
1
SPEAKER_01
 You know, so if I don't play the social media games, I may not grow, but that's not a punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
Nobody's making it hard for me to still log into my phone and be on social media and do all the other fun stuff.
1
SPEAKER_01
I just may not be rewarded with growth, but that's not a punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's the same thing if society, society has its own agenda, society wants us to
1
SPEAKER_01
 work certain hours, contribute to the economy, buy a bunch of stuff.
1
SPEAKER_01
This is what society is built upon.
1
SPEAKER_01
If we don't participate in that, society doesn't throw us in jail.
1
SPEAKER_01
It may not reward us with nice things, it may not give us cool opportunities or cool experiences, but that's not a punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think for me it's that reminder of not going to the event is not a punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
 You know if Lewis wants me somewhere and I couldn't go it may result in him not inviting me again That's still not a punishment.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, that's just I'm that's not gonna get the rewards of that And I think that was an important thing for me to understand because I only have so much time energy love focus and attention in my wallet and I should be mindful of how I spend it and Making everybody happy is an impossible task.
1
SPEAKER_01
So are it is impossible.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, and it feels so more self-happy as hard
1
SPEAKER_00
 It's like trying to make yourself happy and everyone else around you is challenging.
1
SPEAKER_01
Nipsey Hussle said it really well.
1
SPEAKER_01
Do you want to be at war with the world or do you want to be at war with yourself?
1
SPEAKER_01
You're at war with yourself to make everybody else happy or to keep yourself happy is going to potentially cause some conflict with people around because
1
SPEAKER_01
 People want you to meet their expectations.
1
SPEAKER_01
They want you to be who they think you are based on their limited view and I think for me that's been a really interesting thing to really pay attention to and sometimes it's as simple as if I needed to turning off comments or Downsizing my lifestyle if it means I can't go further and make a bunch more money.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I think I
1
SPEAKER_01
 that piece is Way more valuable than this constant growth and chasing if it requires me not to be my authentic self So if I'm not my authentic self, then there's not gonna be a lot of self-respect And then now I'm just chasing it on the outside, right?
1
SPEAKER_00
No, what do you feel like the next level of?
1
SPEAKER_00
self-love and growth for yourself after this, you know a few year journey the discoveries the book the coaching and therapy and Reclaiming, you know your ability to receive love what's available for you next?
1
SPEAKER_01
 Think recognizing, you know, one of my favorite quotes in the book and eventually I'll put it on a t-shirt is love is fuel not the glue Love doesn't keep us together.
1
SPEAKER_01
Love is what keeps us working at it so really recognizing love is the verb that it is and when I say Instead of sounding kind of pie in the sky anything.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm committing my life to love Committing myself to service said again.
1
SPEAKER_00
Love is fuel not glue.
1
SPEAKER_00
Love is fuel not glue.
1
SPEAKER_00
What does that mean?
1
SPEAKER_00
I
1
SPEAKER_01
 So a lot of people, the assumption is when you love someone, that's enough to keep you together.
1
SPEAKER_01
Or when you love your job, that's enough to keep you going to work.
1
SPEAKER_01
Love is fuel.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's what gives you the energy to put in the effort to make, to keep two people together.
1
SPEAKER_01
But love is not enough.
1
SPEAKER_01
Love is not enough.
1
SPEAKER_00
It doesn't hold it together.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's the gas in your tank.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's not the car.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And it's so love so don't think I love this person and because we love each other we'll be together forever and we're fantastic No, I love this person.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I'm gonna get up an hour early and we're gonna go to therapy together You know that that that fuel, you know, I love this job.
1
SPEAKER_01
So those days I don't feel like I want to do it I'm gonna give myself that extra push and make sure it happens So for me, I'm realizing that I want to live a life of love, but it's not a lot It's not this again simplified life.
1
SPEAKER_01
I love everybody.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think what I'm realizing is love is service and
1
SPEAKER_01
 The more love you try to share and provide with other people, the more love is realized.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm creating more pathways of love with people.
1
SPEAKER_01
And learning that service isn't simply giving everybody what they want.
1
SPEAKER_01
Service is just leaving people better than you found them.
1
SPEAKER_01
And, you know, if somebody needs something from you and you can't give them everything, you can still give them something.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And again, and for me specifically growing up in an immigrant household where we had a lot of scarcity mindset, I need to push myself into this mindset of abundance, meaning I can help as many people as possible, but I can also respect myself to be like, hey,
1
SPEAKER_01
 I know you asked me for X, Y, and Z. I can only give you X. But that's what I can give you and I want to give you that versus getting really nervous and just ghosting you.
1
SPEAKER_01
Or overextending myself and giving you everything because I don't want you to stop liking me.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think that's been a really interesting thing for me because when you do that, it also puts you in one of the darkest places that I believe humans can be in and is resentment.
1
SPEAKER_01
 When you don't establish your boundaries, and I have a chapter in the book called Love is Showing Your Teeth.
1
SPEAKER_01
If you don't show your teeth, if you don't establish your boundaries, what ends up happening is you end up living in resentment, which is such a dark place.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's a place where love can't be realized.
1
SPEAKER_01
So often, and I have another chapter in the book that says love is saying no.
1
SPEAKER_01
Saying no to people is an expression of self-love.
1
SPEAKER_01
I can't do that.
1
SPEAKER_01
But again, we don't live in a black and white world.
1
SPEAKER_01
 If you ask me to help you move on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday, I can say, hey, I can't do Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday, but I can be there all day Wednesday.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And I think that's the important process of this, is setting those boundaries, letting you know.
1
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Setting boundaries isn't pushing you away, it's teaching you how we can exist in a good harmony.
1
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And when we're in a good harmony, we're in peace.
1
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When we're in peace, we do less things to chase pleasure.
1
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Pleasure now, for most people, is a medication from a lack of peace.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's not an enhancement of the peace we're in.
1
SPEAKER_01
We're just trying to get back to zero.
1
SPEAKER_01
 People pleasing isn't even making people like us if we're working to make people not hate us, you know We're trying to avoid somebody's criticism.
1
SPEAKER_01
We're not even trying to seek their praise.
1
SPEAKER_01
We're trying to get them off our back So we're doing so much energy and effort and time and focus Spending just to try to get ourselves to a default keep our lips above water that we're not pushing ourselves forward and growing with people
1
SPEAKER_00
 In the sports world they call that playing to not lose as opposed to playing to win.
1
SPEAKER_00
You're playing just to like, I don't want to lose.
1
SPEAKER_00
As opposed to risking and going all out and playing to win.
1
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 and whatever that might be.
1
SPEAKER_00
And when you play to win, you might lose.
1
SPEAKER_00
You might fall on your face.
1
SPEAKER_00
You might, you know, do whatever, so.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's interesting, I just got back from England yesterday and they were asking me about baseball.
1
SPEAKER_01
They're like, what is this sport?
1
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And why is it so long?
1
SPEAKER_01
And I'm like, it's the only, the beauty of the sport is it's the only sport you can't run out the clock.
1
SPEAKER_01
 You can't run out the clock.
1
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So you can't play to not lose.
1
SPEAKER_01
And there's a beauty to the spirit of that, which means you got to stay till the end because anything can happen.
1
SPEAKER_01
And that's how we have to play.
1
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We have to play knowing you can't be on the defense.
1
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 You have to continually, either you're growing or you're not, or you're shrinking.
1
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We're moving in different directions.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think that's a really important idea to understand.
1
SPEAKER_01
And we can't just try to maintain friendships.
1
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We can't simply keep people off our backs.
1
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We have to grow with people, evolve with people.
1
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And I think there's a beauty to that.
1
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And I think just going back to how we met, our entire relationship,
1
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 has always had this foundation of our love lives.
1
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Talking about them, whether we... Going on hikes talking about it, or going to Poland, or whatever it is.
1
SPEAKER_01
Soho house, wherever we were at, it was always talking about it from different places, and I think, you know, that's been the common story, but it's like...
1
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 That's what creates the growth.
1
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I remember Lewis when he was on a high, I remember when he was on a low, I remember when he was trying to figure things out and vice versa and I think that's a really important section to this where it's like we're not maintaining a friendship.
1
SPEAKER_01
 The simple fact that I, when we went up the last hike, I said, I'm frustrated being in the city.
1
SPEAKER_01
I don't have artist friends.
1
SPEAKER_01
You connected me with Reuben.
1
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And the next thing you know, he ends up doing the cover of the book.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it was, you know, the organic beauty of this, I think, you know, for me, that's what I want to honor you for that.
1
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Of course, man.
1
SPEAKER_01
 you know, as I said, you know, I tattoo stuff that I hear on your stuff.
1
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And again, like the amount of lifelong friends you helped me make going to Poland.
1
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And I remember when you texted me about Wim Hof, I didn't even know that was a person's name back then.
1
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And it was, you know, these experiences of just continually being uncomfortable is more important than playing it safe because discomfort finds us.
1
SPEAKER_01
And we've all learned that since dealing with the pandemic.
1
SPEAKER_00
 Did I see you at Thanksgiving with Hussie?
1
SPEAKER_00
I saw you at Thanksgiving with Hussie.
1
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Hussie has become my puppy's babysitter.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh, it's amazing.
1
SPEAKER_00
Because Audrey loves dogs.
1
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She loves dogs and he loves the idea of having a part-time dog.
1
SPEAKER_01
But we're also learning that he won't admit it.
1
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But she has told me that he tries to bribe my puppy to get extra attention.
1
SPEAKER_01
 So he'll, I'll give him a, I'll give them a bag of treats for two days and the treats will be all done.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I realize Hussie's bribing her to sit with him.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh my gosh.
1
SPEAKER_00
So he's, he loves dogs too.
1
SPEAKER_00
I'm sure he loves it.
1
SPEAKER_00
It's the idea of having the dog 24 seven is a lot.
1
SPEAKER_00
But maybe this is going to help him get a dog one day.
1
SPEAKER_01
 Well, yeah, and you know what?
1
SPEAKER_01
I honestly don't mind them co-parenting and my puppy has realized that she can get away with so much more with them.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
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Because I got there and she's barking at them and she's like, what's wrong?
1
SPEAKER_01
What do you want?
1
SPEAKER_01
I was like, you can't let her bark at you.
1
SPEAKER_01
No.
1
SPEAKER_01
She's like, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
So she likes it because it's a place with less rules.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, duh.
1
SPEAKER_01
They got a nice house with a nice yard.
1
SPEAKER_00
They got all this stuff.
1
SPEAKER_01
 I live in an apartment, so like, she loves, and she's the center of attention all the time.
1
SPEAKER_01
But it's a great thing, but it's, yeah, developing these friendships beyond, you know, just what, you know, they could have been had you met somebody once.
1
SPEAKER_01
Like, oh, let's stay in contact, and no, you don't.
1
SPEAKER_01
And yeah, spending, that was my first Thanksgiving ever, too.
1
SPEAKER_01
That's cool, man.
1
SPEAKER_01
I never, I didn't grow up.
1
SPEAKER_01
You had your first American Thanksgiving with some British people.
1
SPEAKER_00
With all British people.
1
SPEAKER_00
I love that.
1
SPEAKER_01
 Yeah, it's my first time having turkey on Thanksgiving.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm Canadian, we have a different Thanksgiving.
1
SPEAKER_01
We never celebrated that.
1
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But it's, yeah, having these new unique experiences and continually, again, as I said, pushing to grow relationships with people.
1
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I think that matters more so than kind of this being a social butterfly, maintaining relationships and not letting them go anywhere.
1
SPEAKER_00
 Yeah, I'm curious, in the book you talk about small love and big love, or little love and big love.
1
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What is the difference between those two?
1
SPEAKER_01
So that's an idea from another one of our friends, Aubrey Marcus.
1
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Me and him have had some great conversations, and small L love being this kind of validation love, again, what feeds your ego.
1
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The pleasure love.
1
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The pleasure love.
1
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 You know and then big big I love being the what fills your soul love, you know, it's small I love being chocolate ice cream, you know after a long day big I love being a hug from your grandmother, you know and seeing that and and again I'm just encouraging an awareness and encouraging people to see that there can be a difference in what we chase and sometimes the immediate stuff holds us back from the long-term more sustainable stuff and
1
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 So realizing that not, you know, not all the things we consider love are actually love and the way he framed it So beautifully is just big L love and small L love.
1
SPEAKER_01
That's great And I think that and you know chase the big L love because that's not immediately gratifying But that's the stuff that's gonna keep you going keep you energized.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah full of nutrition and life.
1
SPEAKER_00
Mm-hmm
1
SPEAKER_00
 And so do you still feel like the need to please people today?
1
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Is there like this thing that pulls you back sometimes?
1
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And if so, do you have like a mantra or a saying that you say to yourself to keep you like grounded and peaceful in that people pleasing?
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes, yes.
1
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I am constantly catching myself being a diplomat and a politician.
1
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And I think there's a reminder of, hey, you know, the people who are around you, they care about you.
1
SPEAKER_01
 Everybody's super busy not hearing from somebody that doesn't mean has anything has changed.
1
SPEAKER_01
They haven't Not speaking to Lewis for six months doesn't mean his opinion of you has changed.
1
SPEAKER_01
He's on his journey He's on his mission.
1
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You're on your journey and your mission make time for each other That's a big one And I think it's also a reminder of if you go down a road to make more people like you and that road isn't authentic to you You're building another prison and I'm always reminded of my friends when I first started coming out here I first came out here with Lilly Singh
1
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 And when I came out, I was staying with her and she exposed me to this world of YouTubers.
1
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And what I was meeting with, I was meeting certain people who had very successful YouTube channels that they made in their teenage years, you know, and they might be doing goofy, you know, prank videos or whatever, stuff that makes sense for a teenager, but now they're in the mid to late 20s and they couldn't change what they did because that's what they built an audience of.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it almost felt like this prison that they were stuck doing, you know, like,
1
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 You can imagine yourself at 80 still talking about greatness.
1
SPEAKER_01
This is authentic to you.
1
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But I think when they were younger, and I don't think they did anything wrong, but I quickly realized that they had created a prison where now they were in their late 20s still trying to make prank videos.
1
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And it wasn't feeling authentic.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And it didn't feel real, and they weren't enjoying themselves, but they created lifestyles and had bills that required them to keep doing this.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think that was something I always remind myself of.
1
SPEAKER_01
You definitely have an entire dictionary of options that you have never explored to make more money, to grow your readers, to grow your exposure, to get more famous.
1
SPEAKER_01
 But once you start that, you're going to have to keep doing that.
1
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And do you want to keep doing that?
1
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And if you do keep doing that, how are you going to create harmony with that?
1
SPEAKER_01
Now, all of a sudden, you're going to have to take more vacations or turn to substances or do different things like that.
1
SPEAKER_01
And right now, I'm in a good situation where it's like, okay,
1
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 I write for a couple of hours a day.
1
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I go for nice long walks.
1
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I have good friends who are my actual friends that I can trust and believe and I have childhood friends that I still have in my life and I measure my success and how long how long have I been doing this without losing anybody that mattered to me in my life and I can you know live you know and I can always have more as we all could and
1
SPEAKER_01
 And the higher we go on this journey, you start to meet people with more and it does make you think and identify gaps in your own life.
1
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But I think choosing that peace is I think the first step to ensuring that I can realize more love.
1
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And I feel like everyone's...
1
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 definition and motivation for why they do the things they do is to receive more love.
1
SPEAKER_01
And again, it's not our fault.
1
SPEAKER_01
In order for people to sell us stuff, they have to make us feel like we're not enough.
1
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You're not enough.
1
SPEAKER_01
You need to own more than
1
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 seven pairs of shoes.
1
SPEAKER_01
You're not enough, you need to own five cars even though you can only drive one at a time.
1
SPEAKER_01
You're not enough, you need to take pictures of you in business class or on a private jet.
1
SPEAKER_01
You're not enough as you are.
1
SPEAKER_01
But the truth is, there is no such thing as enoughness when it comes to a person.
1
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Enoughness isn't a measurement for people.
1
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Worthy isn't a measurement of people.
1
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These aren't things when we think about the people we love, the people we authentically love in our lives,
1
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 We know all their imperfections.
1
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None of those imperfections disqualify them from us loving them.
1
SPEAKER_01
We've also fallen in love with our nieces and nephews when they were babies, held them for the first time, and we were flooded with love.
1
SPEAKER_01
We have no history, never had a conversation, they might have pooped in our hands, and none of that disqualifies them and makes them unworthy of love.
1
SPEAKER_01
 Love doesn't require worthiness.
1
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It doesn't require qualification.
1
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These are ideas that have been given to us because we live in a world that requires us to buy stuff.
1
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And the only way you're going to buy stuff is if you feel like you need stuff.
1
SPEAKER_00
It's like you're separate from it.
1
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You're separate from it.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's like, oh, you need the latest this.
1
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You need the latest that.
1
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And if you don't have it,
1
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 then you're feeling you're left out.
1
SPEAKER_01
And remember, feeling left out is triggering our ancient feelings of being, you know, unaccepted by society that feels like death.
1
SPEAKER_01
And if we're not in a situation of awareness, then we're going to clamber to that and we're going to line up outside the building and spend endless amounts of money to get the newest gizmo, gadget, shoe, car, whatever, to feel like it matters.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And I think it's a really interesting thing, especially, as I said, social media puts an exact number on it.
1
SPEAKER_01
You're like, OK, I want people to see me in the latest.
1
SPEAKER_01
I want to see people see me with the coolest.
1
SPEAKER_01
And then, you know, the invisible they will accept me.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And that's the big one, you know, Khaled always says it, you know, they don't want you to win, God did.
1
SPEAKER_01
It's like Khaled, man, who's they?
1
SPEAKER_01
Who is they?
1
SPEAKER_01
And why did they get so much attention and validation?
1
SPEAKER_01
Whereas, you know.
1
SPEAKER_01
Why do you put all your energy on they?
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, when they aren't even a thing.
1
SPEAKER_01
They are the people that comment on you.
1
SPEAKER_01
They're not individuals and
1
SPEAKER_01
 whoever they are, they're telling their story, through their pain, with what they're going through.
1
SPEAKER_01
And also, you know, I'm sure for the next week, if I left mean comments on your Instagram posts, even with us being friends, I would get more attention.
1
SPEAKER_00
Probably, you get validation for it.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I would get external validation.
1
SPEAKER_00
If you posted- And you get followers, and you get all this attention.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, if you post something and I said, congratulations, brother, it would mix in with the 9900,
1
SPEAKER_00
 Congratulations one.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, but you sucked here.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, but if I said oh, yeah, of course Lewis did this I heard he paid off someone to get it done and then it was create an argument and would create you know polarity and all of that and That you know, it's like it's it's creating a car accident for people to notice you But then I would be doing me myself down that journey forever.
1
SPEAKER_00
You'd have to keep doing that to get the attention.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh
1
SPEAKER_01
 And we've seen that a lot and it never lasts.
1
SPEAKER_01
Controversial creators and artists, you can only be controversial so long until people will be like, oh, okay, I'm used to this controversy.
1
SPEAKER_00
I feel like it sucks at your soul too, right?
1
SPEAKER_00
It's got to.
1
SPEAKER_00
You're just constantly trying to attack others or create controversy.
1
SPEAKER_00
I feel like it's gotta...
1
SPEAKER_00
 Eat at you in some way.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, and I think also just if you have a position on something that's enough You're gonna find people who disagree with you anyways And I think you know people as it going back to the original conversation people can only meet you where they're at So if we start talking about relationships there might be someone listening right now who feels attacked because this may apply to them being an unhealthy relationship and that may motivate them to lash out because that's a lot easier than correcting their situation and
1
SPEAKER_01
 And I think, again, that's not something that I need to internalize for myself.
1
SPEAKER_01
But as I said, I'm grateful that I have a lot of friends in this where I see the prisons that they've built for themselves and try to encourage them not to be in those prisons because it's a slippery slope that you're going to be trapped in forever.
1
SPEAKER_01
And again, we're not politicians.
1
SPEAKER_01
We're people here trying our best to share
1
SPEAKER_01
 And as I said, through writing this book, I'm not an expert on love, I'm just a guy who's so desperate to figure out why his situation didn't work, that he read all the poets, all the philosophers, all the science-backed research, all the people who've written the dating books, watched all the interviews, did all the research possible, and this is me sharing my notes.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I used to be an elementary school teacher, so I don't use any words bigger than mayonnaise when I talk about stuff.
1
SPEAKER_01
 And every chapter is two pages, and the goal here is to help people become more aware of what love actually is, and what may look, feel, and come across as love, but actually is a waste of our time, energy, focus, and efforts.
1
SPEAKER_00
I'm excited for you, man.
1
SPEAKER_00
How do we love?
1
SPEAKER_00
Is it how to be loved or how to be loved?
1
SPEAKER_01
 Well, that's the interesting part.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think, you know, I actually learned from Hussie.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, you have to meet them where they're at.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I think a lot of us want to be loved.
1
SPEAKER_01
You have to meet love first.
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, to be loved, you won't need to be loved at that point.
1
SPEAKER_01
 when you realize you're a source of love, now your cup is full of love and you want to devote your life to sharing all the extra love you have, then you don't need to seek it from others.
1
SPEAKER_01
And again, we have these relationships in our lives.
1
SPEAKER_01
If you take care of a child, you're not getting anything in return for taking care of them.
1
SPEAKER_01
That doesn't make you feel resentful.
1
SPEAKER_01
The service is what creates the love.
1
SPEAKER_01
We can serve others, we can love them.
1
SPEAKER_01
Love is a gift, it's not a loan.
1
SPEAKER_01
I don't have to love you
1
SPEAKER_01
 Wanting it back and keeping track of how much love I gave you versus how much love you gave me I should be giving you love because I'm a source of love and I have so much of it I want to give it and I think so for me It's understanding the only way for me to feel any love is to be loved.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, I
1
SPEAKER_01
 And that's why it's how to be loved with the D in there.
1
SPEAKER_01
So that's the big spoiler is I'm not teaching you how to find love.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm not teaching you how to craft a text message.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm not teaching you how to pick up girls at the mall.
1
SPEAKER_01
I'm teaching you how to realize the love that's always existed, how to clear away the blockages that have prevented you from opening your sales.
1
SPEAKER_01
And a lot of that has to do with our relationship with ourselves,
2
SPEAKER_00
 our past from a lens of understanding trauma and coping mechanisms and prioritizing our future and realizing that hey so often I'm trying to be liked by everybody but I'm denying myself realizing love and experiencing love and I don't require anything other than
2
SPEAKER_00
 the ability to enjoy my own company, to feel this love that we all crave.
2
SPEAKER_00
We all crave it.
2
SPEAKER_00
And for some people, it's wearing expensive clothes and peacocking to get noticed, because they think attention is love.
2
SPEAKER_00
And then for other people, it's having admiration or power or control.
2
SPEAKER_00
So we have very wealthy people getting into politics, because all that stuff didn't do it for them.
2
SPEAKER_00
Now they're like, I need influence.
2
SPEAKER_00
I need power.
2
SPEAKER_00
I need control.
2
SPEAKER_00
But love is surrender.
2
SPEAKER_00
It's the opposite.
2
SPEAKER_00
 And some of the best stories ever told, I was very lucky and fortunate to sit down somehow with George Lucas, the creator of Star Wars.
2
SPEAKER_00
And he explained to me that Darth Vader lost the only thing he loved, so he wanted to control the entire universe.
2
SPEAKER_00
What he never understood is you can't control everything.
2
SPEAKER_00
 It's like trying to pick up a river with your hand.
2
SPEAKER_00
And that's how you saw things get deeper and darker for him.
2
SPEAKER_00
He kept trying to control more and more and more.
2
SPEAKER_00
Because when he was in love, he was able to surrender.
2
SPEAKER_00
But the moment he lost it, he wasn't in a situation where he could love anymore.
2
SPEAKER_00
And I think that's a really important idea for us to start to see with certain individuals that we see that we're taught to look up to, the extremely wealthy, the extremely powerful, the extremely influential.
2
SPEAKER_00
Taking that route is actually showing that they're lacking.
2
SPEAKER_00
 their life and they think just a little bit more just a little bit more just a little bit more and they keep doing it versus the people who are content and at peace and again they wouldn't make for good media they wouldn't make for great television they wouldn't make for a great reality show but those even keeled individuals who have found peace who will
2
SPEAKER_00
 who instead of having everything, they want less every single day.
2
SPEAKER_00
That is authentic love.
2
SPEAKER_00
And we've all had those experiences.
2
SPEAKER_00
When we're so madly in love with a person, with a project, with an activity, we are completely present and we're not thinking about what else we need.
2
SPEAKER_00
We're not thinking about what happened yesterday.
2
SPEAKER_00
We're not worried about what's happening tomorrow.
2
SPEAKER_00
We're in the here and now.
2
SPEAKER_00
And I think making more choices to create that for ourselves,
2
SPEAKER_00
 without needing anybody else, will put us in a position to attract more like-minded people and beautiful people to have a significantly more abundant life.
2
SPEAKER_02
How does someone heal after they lose love?
2
SPEAKER_02
How do they get back to that place?
2
SPEAKER_02
Like Darth Vader, he lost the love and then he went darker and darker, but how do you get back to a sense of love if you've lost it?
2
SPEAKER_00
 It's so ironic that you asked that question.
2
SPEAKER_00
One of my favorite lines is from Jay-Z, you can't heal what you don't reveal.
2
SPEAKER_00
Tonight, I am booking my ticket to go back to Trinidad, which is the place I got engaged.
2
SPEAKER_00
And realizing that I initially was like, oh yeah, we used to party there every year.
2
SPEAKER_00
And realizing that I'm not framing this as a journey to a party, I'm framing this as a challenge to go revisit
2
SPEAKER_00
 Place that I you know I could easily avoid because it's gonna trigger so many negative emotions and pain And I'm voluntarily doing it.
2
SPEAKER_00
It's beautiful 7 p.m.. Tonight.
2
SPEAKER_00
We're booking our tickets and It was something I wanted to avoid I was I was sure I'd written out 12 paragraphs to my friend who was organizing the trip saying why I couldn't come and then I realized that
2
SPEAKER_00
 Fear is a compass.
2
SPEAKER_00
I should definitely go.
2
SPEAKER_00
And I should make more wise decisions.
2
SPEAKER_00
I might not party as hard as I normally party when I'm there, because I'm not at a place of peace with this.
2
SPEAKER_00
So I'm not going to medicate my lack of peace.
2
SPEAKER_00
But I'm going to go there.
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I'm going to face it.
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And I think that's important.
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That's beautiful, man.
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Many, many, many years ago, I was violently robbed in New York.
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And I don't think the healing and the PTSD was ever addressed until I went back to the spot.
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And I sat there.
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 Again, the negative feelings aren't the enemy.
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The anxiety isn't the enemy.
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We have issues with mental health when we try to suppress the anxiety.
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And I mean, Dr. Leach spoke about that at the Summit of Greatness.
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And it was such an eye-opening idea, whereas when we go to these places and we revisit these pains, feel what we feel.
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And as men, I think we feel that as a big challenge.
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I think that's one of the reasons men are problem solvers.
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 When someone comes to us with a problem, we want to solve it, not because we want to solve it, it's because when people come to us with their problems, it makes us feel pain.
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And we don't want to feel pain.
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So you want to shut them up by solving the problem, you know, but empathy is feeling it.
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You know, attunement is being in their skin and saying, I know what you feel like, and I'm going to feel it with you.
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And let's just sit in this pain together.
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So in order for us to heal, or I think a better word would be integrate, integrate the learning that comes from these.
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We only, you don't learn when you're happy.
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 You learn from unpleasant experiences.
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So integrate the learning that comes from these situations means visit them.
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I had to go back to that dark alley where I got beat up and robbed and I had to sit there with feeling my body shake from the pain of it.
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But that's a step.
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And doing that repeatedly is what's gonna help you integrate the learning.
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Because there's things that I needed to learn from that experience.
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 It was done for me.
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It wasn't done to me.
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And I think it's the same thing going back to Trinidad.
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It's going to be the exact same thing.
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I opened the book with that story about the engagement.
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I know the exact spot where everything happened and I know I have to go back there.
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And I'm not going to say it's going to be a triumph.
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I'm there and I am healed.
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But it's going to take me
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 And this is a big idea that we talk about in the book too.
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I'm not looking for perfect.
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I'm looking for progress.
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I'm going to make more progress by taking this trip.
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I'm not going to be completely healed and unimpacted by seeing her on social media or running into her in person because we have so many mutual friends.
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 I'm not promising myself that.
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I'm promising myself progress.
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And I think when we prioritize progress over perfection, then we're able to make small moves every day.
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We set New Year's resolutions.
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 But we set these goals like I need to lose 10 pounds.
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I need to make this much money per month.
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And then we're subconsciously telling ourselves we're not good enough until we do.
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But instead, instead of doing that, let's set intentions.
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I need to live healthier.
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I wanna wake up earlier.
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Every single day I'm gonna wake up five minutes earlier.
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Or this week I'm gonna wake up five minutes earlier.
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Or I'm going to just go to the gym whether I do anything or not this week.
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And then let's focus on progress.
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Okay, I got there every day this week.
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 Now I'm going to go there and do at least five minutes on the treadmill or something.
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And that progress adds up instead of us saying, oh, I didn't hit my 10 pounds, I'm a piece of trash.
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Because the truth is, you're going to hit that 10 pounds, the next voice in your head is going to be like, what's next?
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I need more.
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I need more.
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So instead, let's just focus on the progress, steadily making progress.
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So I think for us,
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 I don't want to minimize what people have gone through in their life and I don't know if simply revisiting a space or being in therapy or writing in a journal will make it all go away.
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But it will make progress.
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And progress is better than nothing.
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 I love this, man.
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How do we love the simple truths for going easier on yourself, embracing imperfection and loving your way to a better life.
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And I think one of the biggest things is going easier on yourself.
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I think a lot of people are so hard and demanding on themselves.
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And I think it's one thing to be disciplined and organized and also be easy on yourself.
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You don't have to be perfect.
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 It's definitely surrender and going easy, as I said, pointing out why we make mistakes, it's not to judge you and be like, stop chasing after unavailable men because that's what you're used to.
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No, like, just realize it.
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Because being nice to ourselves, I have a chapter in here saying, you know, love is being your own nurturing parent.
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When you revisit your past, you're going to realize that the people that raised you, whoever they were, were flawed human beings.
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 Instead of just going back to them and being like, you messed me up, realize that now you have the capability of filling in the gaps.
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There's an activity called self-havening, which is hugging yourself.
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You can do it.
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We don't need to find a romantic partner to be this for us.
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 We can be our own best friend, which is our biggest cheerleader and also the person that kicks us in the butt when we need it.
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The person that tells us what we need to hear because they're on our team.
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We can be this for ourselves.
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These things that we lack sometimes, we create them for ourselves now that we've realized it.
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It doesn't require us to go back and be like, I'm a victim of my past.
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 Like, okay, I learned that, you know, these people who raised me weren't perfect.
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My parents had to go to work every single day.
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They could have been sleep deprived.
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They could have been stressed out.
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And if they yelled at me, I completely understand it.
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And I mentioned this in the book, how my mom raised me versus how I see her as a grandmother.
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And I'm like, who is this woman compared to who raised me?
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 There's her context and her circumstances are different.
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She's retired.
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She can spend all day following around my niece and loving on them Loving on them not being the disciplinary feeding them all the food that they're not supposed to eat because it's not her responsibility And I think that's important.
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So for me now like I need to be the nurturing parent for myself which means and even as a self-employed individual and you know this when you work for yourself and
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 you have the best and worst boss imaginable.
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Because you'll say things to yourself you would never let anybody say to you.
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You would say things to yourself that you would never say to anybody else.
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And I think from that, but that doesn't lead to more productivity.
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That's not efficient.
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So saying, oh man, we were supposed to write 1,000 words today and we didn't, you piece of garbage.
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What's wrong with you?
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Why'd you watch TV all day?
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That's not what you would say to an employee.
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 You got to be like, look, man, we had some goals today.
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We didn't hit them.
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What can we do?
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What can we do to do better tomorrow?
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And it's speaking to ourselves with love because we're still speaking to an inner child.
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And that's what going easier on yourself is.
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It's not just that this is what's wrong with you.
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The goal here is to figure out where the gaps were, address those gaps.
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We have to do it effectively.
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And doing it effectively means
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 with love and speaking to ourselves kindly and tenderly.
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And again, sometimes love is a kiss on the cheek, sometimes it's a kick on the butt.
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You know what you require.
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It's not these romanticized ideas that we've seen in the films and on television.
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That's not what it is.
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We know what true love is because we all have true love in our lives.
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 And all we have to realize is we can multiply that with ourselves.
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And as we become the biggest source, and if we give love and express love without requiring anything in return, then we'll be very surprised to see how much more love we can realize.
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 100%, man.
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Well, I'm excited for you and the book.
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Again, make sure you guys get a copy.
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Check it out.
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Very powerful, inspiring stuff.
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Share it with friends.
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I acknowledge you, Humble, for revealing this and for going through this.
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I know it's not easy to talk about these things and to talk about, I guess, the lessons or the failures that you might think you have had to get to where you're at and start reclaiming the love that's always been inside of you.
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So I really acknowledge you for creating it and using your artistic expression as a poet
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 as a leader, as a creator, to provide this for us as art for ourselves, too.
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So I really acknowledge you for that, man.
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I appreciate it.
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 Where can we follow you and support you with the book, the best place?
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So the book is available everywhere books are sold.
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You can find me on Amazon easily.
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You can find me at all major retailers, Barnes and Noble.
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If you're out there in the UK, Waterstones, your local bookshop should definitely have it.
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You can find me at Humble the Poet on all socials.
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And humblethepoet.com slash love is the easiest way to find all the links for the book.
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 Yeah.
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Love it, man.
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This is a question I asked you before, but I'll ask it again.
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It's the three truths.
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We'll see if it's changed.
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Imagine it's your last day on earth, and for whatever reason, you've accomplished everything you want to accomplish in your life.
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You live as long as you want, but you've got to take all of your works with you.
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This book, every book you've written, your poetry, your music, everything, for whatever reason, it's got to go somewhere else.
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It's no longer here on this earth.
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 But you get to leave behind three lessons to all of us, three truths.
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And that's all we have to remember you by.
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What would be those three truths for you?
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 The newest truth that I've adopted for myself is I have divorced myself from chasing happiness and success and I now chase fun and hopefulness.
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So I want to, and hopefulness I define as having something to look forward to.
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I think everyone needs something to look forward to.
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Realizing that we gain more from wanting less.
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 It's okay that there's so many things around us to want.
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But the happiest moments that we have is when we are in this position of not needing or desiring anything and to put ourselves in that situation.
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And it rarely comes from ticking off boxes.
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It comes from internal work.
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And I think lastly,
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 There will be so many obstacles when you try to help yourself.
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There are next to no obstacles when you try to help others.
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And as somebody who grew up in Eastern philosophy, and I've seen a lot of Eastern philosophy kind of move across the ocean and become kind of packaged here in North America,
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 a good litmus test of spiritual practice should be service.
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If the spiritual practice doesn't include this idea of serving outside of yourself, then you're probably in a pyramid scheme.
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Whatever your spiritual practice is needs to involve living a life beyond yourself.
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And whatever your definition of service is, for me it's just living a life beyond myself, realizing I don't live in a universe of one.
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I am a piece of a system.
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 And love is an essential service in serving people in any capacity that you feel.
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You can go to the food bank, go to the food bank.
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If you can spread the word on social media, spread the word on social media.
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If you can get to the homeless.
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Whatever serving people means to you, make it a priority, put it in the calendar.
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And I think the quality of your life and how much love you reveal will definitely supremely grow more than doing some of the other external stuff.
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I agree, man.
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That's beautiful.
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 Final question, what's your definition of greatness?
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I want to talk about the summit.
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Listen, as I told you, I've been to so many cool events.
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I've been to Google Camp.
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Look that up if you want to know what that is.
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That's one of the most exclusive events on this planet.
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And it was cool.
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It was fun.
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I've been to Google's like us.
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I've been to TED Talks.
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I've been to the World Domination Summit.
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These are all wonderful.
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I am a think tank geek.
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 I'm a think tank groupie.
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Anywhere where there will be speakers and there will be learners, you will see me there.
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And then I visited Just Summit of Greatness this year for the first time and what I realized was a commitment to not cutting corners, a commitment to giving it everything, sometimes not finding the most efficient way.
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 sometimes not maximizing profits, sometimes it's about creating the best experience within your capabilities.
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And I think when I went there and I saw it, you structured it perfectly.
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I've been to events with like 17 speakers, I'm tired, and the best one's at the end and I'm just like, my brain's already shot.
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The way you did that, I thought was beautiful.
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There was this theme, and I don't know if this was intentional,
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 You were making fun of the speakers and they were making fun of you So, you know if I didn't know who you were I thought you were a stand-up comedian because you were in between the speakers and it was a beauty to that and I know I can't share this stuff publicly But some of the footage I have of your after-party was the bananas and I'm not talking about my unique experience I'm talking about when I was up top watching you can share that stuff.
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Why not?
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I
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 So some people aren't wearing clothes.
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But I looked at it, it was be great in your learning, but be great in your celebrations.
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So I think greatness isn't what the outside world sees, it's seeing the effort.
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And I'm an artist and people say art is subjective.
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I disagree when I see effort.
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 You know, when we see Ruben's work, it's like, okay, he's writing the word love over and over.
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First off, him doing it consistently is energy and effort.
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Him getting to that position, him committing his life, there's energy and effort there.
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So I think when it comes to greatness, it's only you know if you gave it your all, irrespective of the outcome.
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You know, you can play certain, you know, you played sports, there's certain games you played gave it 70% energy and you guys won.
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 There's games you gave it 110% and you guys didn't win.
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To me, the outcome isn't as important as the energy and the labor because that's what builds the self-respect.
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That's what builds all of that.
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So to me, that's what greatness is.
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Greatness is what you put into it.
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And I think the summit for me was that because I feel
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 I've been to so many, they've been on autopilot.
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And the way I saw, and then knowing the speakers and having them speak about their experience, what their hotel rooms look like, having the experiences of, you know, the speaker's dinner, having the after party, being like, okay, somebody, all I know is somebody cared every step of the way.
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And then being in the audience, finding people that were coming back there, not just for the events, because they made lifelong friends.
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 And being like, oh, I'm here because this is the only time I get to see so-and-so.
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I've been coming for the last three years.
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And then, you know, hearing all of this being like, OK, this is a beautiful situation.
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And I think the way greatness was defined through that was this energy, effort of love.
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 And I'm sure it could have been, you could have overextended yourself and made it bigger.
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I'm sure you could have charged more for the tickets.
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I'm sure you could have done a whole bunch of different things, but you didn't.
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You kept it the way to maximize it as a beautiful experience.
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And I think for me, you know, I'm proud to know that, you know, as Ruben's been affiliated with the word love, you've been affiliated with the word greatness.
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Because when these cameras go off, you are just as wonderful, if not more.
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 And I think, I want your audience to know that.
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I've known you for years.
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You're just a dope dude.
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Everyone we speak to knows you're a dope dude.
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And you know, so greatness is just putting in that energy and effort and doing things with love.
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My man, appreciate you.
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Thanks Hubbell.
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 I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness.
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Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode with all the important links.
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And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our greatness plus channel.
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 exclusively on Apple Podcasts.
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Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well.
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Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review.
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I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward.
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And I want to remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter.
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And now it's time to go out there and do something great.