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The following podcast is a dear media production.
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She s a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire.
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Fantastic.
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And he s a serial entrepreneur, a very smart cookie.
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And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride.
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Get ready for some major realness.
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Welcome to the skinny confidential him and her.
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The essence of meditation is to become more aware.
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That s really what meditation is about.
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When you work to get quiet at some level, you ll start to feel something.
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And then if you can just notice where that feeling lives in you, what it feels like, where it wants to go or move, and you are just to follow that feeling, you become exponentially more tuned to your emotional self.
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The seat of the whole thing is just to become more aware of your thoughts, your feelings, your emotions, and the world around you.
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And with greater awareness, you re able to guide just a little bit better the way you want to live your life.
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Hello everybody, welcome back to the Him and Her Show.
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Today we re sitting down with one of our favorite guests again, Dr. Michael Gervais.
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For those of you who have not heard Dr. Michael Gervais on this show or heard his show or know of him, Dr. Michael Gervais is a high performance psychologist, author, and one of the world s leading experts on relationships between the mind and human performance.
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Over the course of a 20-year career working with world-class performers and organizations, Dr. Gervais has developed a framework for the mental skills and practices that allow organizations, teams, and individuals to thrive in pressure-packed environments.
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Today, he joins us for a discussion on all things human behavior.
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We talk about what it s like to work with narcissists, what people will do for acceptance, what FOPO is and why it s holding you back, the spotlight effect,
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whose opinion you should care about versus whose you should not, core struggles that most people struggle with and how to identify them, tricks to discover your inner self and be more present.
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We are going deep into all these subjects all over the place in a wide variety of human performance.
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With that, Dr. Michael Gervais, welcome back to the Skinny Confidential Him and Her Show.
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This is the Skinny Confidential Him and Her.
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The last time you were on our podcast, you gave me the best advice.
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It changed my life.
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I was asking you about narcissist and you said, Lauren, there s nothing you can do.
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Let it go.
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Besides put them on stage.
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And I ve been putting him on stage since you came on three years ago, and it s working out fucking brilliant.
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Really?
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Oh my God.
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Oh, that is so good.
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I just put him on stage.
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I do the Broadway lights.
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I ask 600 questions.
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I tee him up, and I can deal with narcissists now.
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Yeah, I mean, that s what they need.
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They need to be seen.
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When it comes to the world of elite athletics is where I cut my teeth, is that they re the ones that actually don t need sports psychology from a performance standpoint.
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They might need it in other ways and for other parts of their life, but all you got to do is turn the lights on and they re like, I m here, let s go.
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And they show up and they
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They know how to bring it when it matters.
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Is managing this, and we ll talk about a million other things, but is managing a narcissistic athlete easier or harder?
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Because I would imagine since they re so interested in servicing themselves that you might get the best performance, but at the same time, maybe it s hard to get them to work with a team.
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Yeah, so let s just kind of pull it apart a little bit.
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Narcissistic personality disorder, NPD, is a pretty severe psychological condition.
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Being a bit narcissistic, kind of being about me, is common in elite performing environments, whether it s sport or otherwise.
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And the challenge is nobody can do the extraordinary alone.
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So we need each other.
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And the narcissist is more interested in me than we.
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And so that s where team starts to break down.
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So when you think about managing a narcissist or coaching a narcissist from a team or a business perspective, the best guidance is to be relationship based.
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So if you make a commitment to be relationship based and developmentally minded, so we re gonna work on our relationship and help each other be better.
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that that agreement is far better than make an agreement on outcome.
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So you get the input right to know the person, and then you know how to work with them.
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Interesting.
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Yeah.
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So relationship-based, then developmentally minded is kind of the foundation.
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Michael Treve, back on the show.
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Excited to have you.
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I was saying every time you come on, this audience gets fired up, but I was thinking when you reached out or a team reached out or somebody reached out, like it s a shame because we haven t seen you in so long.
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And the last time we saw you was during COVID conditions.
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And it was like one of the two or three remote interviews we ve ever done.
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We typically don t do them.
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Yeah.
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New book out.
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First rule of mastery.
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Stop worrying about what people think of you.
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Music to my ears.
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Let s dive in.
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First of all, why did you decide to call it that?
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Did you notice this was a common denominator in a lot of high performers?
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Yeah.
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So I ll do a bit of an origin story and then get to how this happened is that I saved up for a couple summers.
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I was, you know, 16 years old, $2,000 to get my first car.
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And I was really excited.
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I m growing up in California.
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I got my surfboard in the back.
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I remember that there was a car going in the same direction of me on my left-hand side that was going to pass me, not too fast, but they were going to.
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And I straightened up, I grabbed the steering wheel in kind of like a cool kid way, and I thought, they re going to see how cool I am.
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And as they were passing, I kind of look over my left shoulder and kind of try to catch their eye.
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They didn t look in.
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They had no interest.
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They were doing their own thing.
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They were running their program.
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And here I was trying to look a certain way.
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And I thought to myself as a 16-year-old kid, what are you doing?
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Like, what is that?
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You just did all of these weird machinations to look a certain way for somebody you didn t even know.
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And I was embarrassed by it.
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I knew that that wasn t good.
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I knew it wasn t healthy, I knew it wasn t cool, but I didn t tell anyone about it, because I was embarrassed.
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Fast forward 20 some years later, and I m a sports psychologist working with some of the best in the world, they had it too.
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So I kept this thing private for a long time.
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And they didn t say that, they didn t say that
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that they had this driving experience, but they were talking about, yeah, I don t want to look bad.
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I don t want to let people down.
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I don t want to blow it.
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I don t want to be the laughingstock.
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And so it was about the opinions of other people, right?
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So I was looking for favor from an opinion from someone I didn t know, and I was shape-shifting for that favor, for that acceptance.
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And they were talking about not being rejected.
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The tying thread between the two is the fear of people s opinions.
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So we had fun, we named it FOPO.
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I wrote an article for HBR, and 12 months later after the article was published, and it was titled, Stop Worrying About What People Think Of You, 12 months later they called and they said,
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You were the number one downloaded article for 12 months in a row.
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Wow.
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You touched a nerve.
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Let s do a book.
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I thought, oh my God, like I got to put science to this now.
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So I thought this was just this private thing that I was experiencing and elite athletes because they re different in some kind of ways that they were experiencing it and come to find out, I think it s a thing that it s like the water that we re swimming in, this management of am I okay in the eyes of others?
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Are you accepting me or are you rejecting me?
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And I m playing a game to be liked and not rejected as opposed to playing the game of just being me and bringing my best self into whatever environment I m in.
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So that second game is quite toxic.
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I think it s the poison that so many of us are drinking and have drunk from a young age that this is just, I m just ringing the bell saying, hmm, maybe we got to put the poison down.
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You know, I think this topic is so timely for so many reasons.
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We have done this show now for almost seven years.
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It s a long time now, but I think- Yeah, congrats on making it to 10.
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It s awesome.
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Thank you.
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But we keep these early episodes up that are horrendous.
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They re disasters.
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If people go and see them, it s just like...
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We re in our kitchen.
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We re interrupting.
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We don t know what we re saying.
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Like we re saying, like, it s just, it s just, it s just bad.
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The quality is bad.
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Audio is bad.
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But what we ve said for years on this show over and over is like launch fast, adjust, and just iterate with feedback.
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And what I ve also said is you, you really can t worry all the time about what people think, because if you re doing that all the time, you just never get to the point where you do something.
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And I know that Lauren and I are not liked and loved by everyone only like
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99% of people.
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Staring at yourself in the mirror in an elevator doesn t count.
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But my point is that I think anybody that s ever done anything successfully that I ve met, it never started perfect and they ve got this little bit of like, okay, I know it s not going to be the best, it s not going to be perfect, but they re just going to keep iterating.
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And I ve also met so many smart people that are much more intelligent than myself.
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that just they fail to put themselves out there and you re like, man, that s such wasted potential.
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Because if they did, they would probably go so far, but they have this fear of just like, whether it s their parents or their friends or their spouse, they re so worried about what people think they never execute.
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Yeah, I think it s one of the greatest constrictors of human potential.
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I think it s the thing that tightens us up.
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It helps us be small, be safe, belong, but it doesn t allow us to get into the amphitheater and really express ourselves and go for it.
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The good life is marked by really going for it.
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FOPO, fear of people s opinions, will keep you safe and it ll keep you connected, but the cost is really high.
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And so apparently this is something that so many of us have.
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And I think it leads to, you know, it s part of anxiety and depression, addictions.
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It s like, it s a bit of the undercurrent that s happening for so many of us.
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And there s good reason.
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250,000 years ago, if we were kicked out of the tribe, let s say the three of us are in the same tribe and we were responsible for something.
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and we came back empty-handed, and we re kind of disruptive when we re doing it.
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We kicked over the fire, we re doing some nonsense, and we came back empty-handed, a bit of a disturbance to the vibe of the tribe.
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And the elders pull us aside and say, hey, listen, I m giving you a warning.
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That s not okay now.
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There s some rules here.
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There s a way that we do things, and this is not it.
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And we re, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay.
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Second time we come back, and it s a similar type of thing.
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Maybe we get one more chance.
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On the third, we re kicked out.
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Now the three of us have to go hunt, gather, forge, fight, protect.
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We have to do it all.
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And that was a near death sentence because it was too big, too hard.
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So that was the rejection from the tribe set this signal in our brain like, no, no, no.
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If you get rejected and you re out in the wild with just a couple of you, you re going to die early.
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So, ancient brain, modern times, we ve got that ancient brain is tuning to make sure that we re accepted and not rejected.
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And so the fear of rejection is a real deal, and we all know it.
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the art of the deal by Donald Trump right now.
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And before everyone breaks out, it has nothing political.
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I m just interested in the foreshadowing of how he became president.
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I want to see what, what the mindset was in the eighties before all of this happened.
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And I also am interested in the art of the deal.
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I think coming from him, there s a lot to learn, but
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He does not give a shit what people think about him.
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He doesn t give a shit in the 80s.
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He has in the book a bravado and a delusion when it comes to the way he writes.
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But he became president of the United States.
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Is he someone that you would look at as a high performer that doesn t care what people think?
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Yeah, so this book is not written for sociopaths, narcissists, or the enlightened.
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It s wild to get in his brain.
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To just read it?
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Guys, is that a thing?
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Political?
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It s just interesting.
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100%.
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And I don t know him.
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I can t do an armchair thing.
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But he is a narcissist.
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I have too much respect for it.
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Sorry, Donald.
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Yeah, but narcissists and sociopaths don t care.
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Literally, they do not care.
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This book is not written for them.
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Got it.
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So he would be classified because of the bravado and the not giving a shit.
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What you re saying is this book is written for people that really care and getting them to understand what caring so much does in terms of holding them back or slowing their pace.
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Yeah, I think this book is written for David Foster Wallace, great writer.
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He says he s got this story about two fish or the fish, an old fish and two young fish, and they re swimming in opposite directions.
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And the old fish, as he s passing the two young fish, says, morning boys, how s the water?
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And the two young fish don t know exactly what to make of that.
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And so they swim along privately for a little bit.
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And then one of them bravely says to the other one, what s water?
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So the old elder is pointing out the most obvious thing in their life, which is we re swimming in water.
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So I think what s taking place is this book is for folks that are swimming in the water of modern times, which is mattering, belonging, being part of something, fearful of being rejected by them, whoever them is, conforming and contorting to be accepted and be liked.
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It s the modern water that we re drinking that s a bit poisonous.
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So I think this is for the healthy, for the normal, for the ones that are trying to find their way.
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You could go do all of the ayahuasca, you could go do all of the modern practice, you get your ass in a cold tub and do all these kind of bio whatevers.
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But until you put down the poison, you ll never be really healthy.
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And the poison that I m pointing to here is that we ve got this obsessive need to belong and to know we matter, and we re outsourcing that to other people.
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So I think this book is for me.
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It s for my parents.
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It s for my friends.
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It s for the world-class athletes.
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Maybe it s for you guys, but you guys seem to be doing pretty well in life.
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I ll tell a personal story.
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I had a father growing up, still have a dad, he s still alive.
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And this guy just was insane.
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He would go and say the most outlandish things, just inappropriate, out of control, walk into places.
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You look at a guy like, I can t believe you get away.
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But he would do it in a way where
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It was endearing and people would like laugh and love him for it.
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But it s just like most people would be like, holy shit, I can t believe this guy said or did these things.
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Did you marry your father?
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And my mom... We tend to.
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My mother, no offense mom, was maybe on the opposite side.
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She was half Japanese, a little bit more like, hey, you know, got to do good in school, a little bit more worried about what people think, maybe not so much anymore.
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But I remember seeing these two examples and I probably,
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fall in between that a little bit.
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But what I realized quickly is that even though my dad would do all these crazy things, people weren t so offended that they didn t really care because they were more worried about themselves in that setting than what he was actually doing.
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So what I realized quickly, I was like, okay, even if he s doing all these crazy outlandish things, people were so worried about themselves that they didn t have time to think about that characteristic of him.
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It sounds like you re really aware of what s dubbed the spotlight effect.
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There s research around what you re talking about.
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And Professor Gilovich from Cornell did a research project and he took about a hundred students, put them in an auditorium or a classroom.
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And then he took a handful of other students and he wanted to understand the experience when the handful of students would walk into this larger auditorium with a hundred or so folks, if they were wearing a really ugly t-shirt.
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And so it was a t-shirt of Barry Manilow on it.
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And you know, the kids would be like, kids, the 19 year olds would be like, you want me to walk in there with this thing on?
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Oh my, are you serious?
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That s what you want me to do?
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You want me to walk in front of the class?
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All right, and then so Professor Gilovich asked, how many people do you think are going to notice what you re wearing?
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And it was this radical number of a percentage.
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Come to find out, less than half of the estimate actually noticed the other person, even when they were wearing the most ugliest shirt they could imagine.
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So he dubbed it the spotlight effect, which is, in essence,
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I ve got a spotlight on me, you ve got one on you, you have one on you, and you re thinking about your hair and the clothes you re wearing, and I m thinking about my hair and the clothes I m wearing, when actually we re not really tuning to each other, we re tuning more into our own experience, which is thought to be one of the core seats of suffering.
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is when you re self-focused in such a way that you re not able to see or feel or connect with another person because you re just trying to take care of yourself.
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And so it s not until you can damp that down and recognize like, get me out of my fucking spotlight.
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Like this is too much now.
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And so there s a bunch of ways that we talk about how to do that in the book.
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Well, I guess the lesson from that, I didn t know it was called that, but for me was, and I think it helped me, it was realizing that, okay, even if you go and mess up or you have a failure or anything, people really aren t paying that much attention to your thing.
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They re paying attention to their thing.
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And so in my personal- That s cool.
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That s a great healthy insight.
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Say even if it went for pursuing a woman.
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Sure.
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Like my dad also, you go up and you talk to eight women, you get denied by seven of them.
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It s like, they re not all be like, this guy got denied by every, it s just like, you just need the one to say yes.
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And it sounds kind of crazy, but it got me into a place where I m like, nobody really is paying that much attention to your failures or even thinking about it or talking about it because they re all worried mostly about themselves and their own issues.
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And so this is where if we study the good life, and Harvard did an 80-year study about this, and it was really cool.
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Two of the main themes of the good life is one, we have relationships that matter, and two, there s a sense of purpose.
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So those two things fall into place.
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And so to ring a second bell here is when you know your purpose.
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So in that case, it was like a little mini mission of meeting a female, right?
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But when you know your big purpose in life,
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you are less interested in their opinion of you and more interested in the compelling future that you re trying to work towards.
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So this is one of the things that athletes and professional sport teams and even some modern businesses, but let s just stick with athletics for a minute, is the purpose is very clear.
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The mission is given to them.
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And so they fold in, like your mission here is to whatever on Sunday in the NFL.
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The greater purpose of what we re trying to do is, and it s given to them,
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And one of the really difficult experiences post career is that there s their purpose last.
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Mission last and so there s a floundering that takes place and we know that eighty seven percent or more.
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two years after retiring or getting kicked out from the NFL or any sport league, they re broke, divorced, a bit of a mess.
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And so there s real suffering that happens when you don t have purpose, when you re kind of out of the fray of a collective approach.
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Your point is well taken.
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When there s something that you re really getting after, it s so much easier and it damps down that, am I okay?
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The point of this podcast in the beginning is we wanted to get to a certain number of podcasts and because we had that number, of course we want to take feedback and improve, but I can t have one person say we suck on episode one and then quit.
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If our number is 100, we re just going to keep going until we get to that 100.
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The feedback s relevant, but also kind of irrelevant.
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Does that make sense?
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Yeah, so the subtitle of the book is not stop caring about what people think.
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Caring about some people s opinions is really important and it s incredibly healthy.
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This book is about not worrying, so that s an important distinction.
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Then it begs the question like, well, whose opinions should I care about?
2
SPEAKER_01
Whose opinions matter to me?
2
SPEAKER_01
And I just have a round table of eight people and I have a seat at that table.
2
SPEAKER_01
Two things have to happen.
2
SPEAKER_01
One, you have to know my scars.
2
SPEAKER_01
You ve had to have time under tension to invest in knowing my ambitions, my dreams, my traumas to really understand me.
2
SPEAKER_01
Because when I ask you, what do you think?
2
SPEAKER_01
It needs to be in context.
2
SPEAKER_01
not something that s serving you, not something out of context to my way that I ve lived my life, but something that s really tuned that is meaningful.
2
SPEAKER_01
And the second criteria is like, they have had done something in their life.
2
SPEAKER_01
Like really, you could be the best parent in the world, but you ve really done something.
2
SPEAKER_01
It doesn t mean that anyone knows what you ve done, but you ve done something.
2
SPEAKER_01
You ve gotten your ass into the amphitheater, you put your ass on the line, you stood for something, and you know what it feels like.
2
SPEAKER_01
to go for it.
2
SPEAKER_01
Those are the two criteria to have a seat at the table for me.
2
SPEAKER_02
I love that.
2
SPEAKER_02
You said earlier something about something is a core struggle.
2
SPEAKER_02
What is a core struggle for people?
2
SPEAKER_01
I don t know how I said that in context, but many of us, the foundational thing is, do I matter?
2
SPEAKER_01
And that s a core struggle.
2
SPEAKER_01
Another core struggle is not knowing how to organize your inner life so that you can be fully present.
2
SPEAKER_01
So we ve got this radical, powerful machinery of a brain, it s 3.2 pounds of tissue that sits in our skull, and call that the hardware.
2
SPEAKER_01
And then we ve got software, which is our mind.
2
SPEAKER_01
And the brain is so powerful, 250,000 to a million years ago, the beginnings of that thing was formed, pass on to us today, and its primary dictum is survival.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s kind of it.
2
SPEAKER_01
Scan the world, find the danger, and without having to think about it, fight, flight, freeze, run, do your thing.
2
SPEAKER_02
I call it, when Michael does it every second, I m like, there s no saber tooth.
2
SPEAKER_01
There s no saber tooth.
2
SPEAKER_02
That could be your next book.
2
SPEAKER_00
Well, there might be.
2
SPEAKER_01
There might be.
2
SPEAKER_01
Real or perceived danger, our body responds the same way.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so the mind is the software, and when you invest in the software and you upgrade the software.
2
SPEAKER_01
You kind of get out the patchy bugs that your parents passed on to you and your neighborhood friends and whatever magazine that you listen to or a famous person that you were informed by.
2
SPEAKER_01
You got to get those buggy patches out and do real work from the inside out.
2
SPEAKER_01
You have the ability to be in the present moment more often and feel a certain way about being safe here.
2
SPEAKER_01
That is one of the great unlocks for us, spending more time in the present moment.
2
SPEAKER_02
How do you get the patchy spots out?
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, there s three ways that I would point to.
2
SPEAKER_01
One would be conversations with people of wisdom.
2
SPEAKER_01
So you re working out who you are, you re understanding the wisdoms that they hold.
2
SPEAKER_01
So that could be a psychologist, it could be a coach, it could be your neighborhood pastor or whatever, like wisdom.
2
SPEAKER_01
The second is meditation and the third is journaling.
2
SPEAKER_01
And that essentially is leading you to work from the inside out.
2
SPEAKER_01
And then I could give you a laundry list of practices, like you can practice being confident.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can practice being more calm.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can practice being optimistic.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can practice trusting yourself.
2
SPEAKER_01
There s a whole set of skills that sit underneath that great athletes have demonstrated enough of a weight to it that we ve studied it for the last 60 years.
2
SPEAKER_01
And those skills can be built and developed for all of us.
2
SPEAKER_02
Meditation, that s exactly what it does for me.
2
SPEAKER_02
I ve never heard someone articulate it like that.
2
SPEAKER_02
It gets out the patchy spots so I can be clear and have clarity for my day.
2
SPEAKER_01
What does your practice look like?
2
SPEAKER_02
I try to meditate to Joe Dispenza 24 minutes every morning.
2
SPEAKER_02
And if I can get that in, it s a different way.
2
SPEAKER_02
If I can t get it in, I have a life hack.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s me go hide somewhere until she gets there.
2
SPEAKER_02
I take my son on a walk and I do a walking meditation while he s in his stroller.
2
SPEAKER_02
That s cool.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s 16 minutes and I m outside in nature.
2
SPEAKER_02
I m not on my phone.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s just, I m listening to it.
2
SPEAKER_02
And I did this morning and it works.
2
SPEAKER_02
The 24 minute one is like, I m going to be like really great.
2
SPEAKER_02
The 16 minute is like, I m going to be okay.
2
SPEAKER_02
But it whatever it is just to be quiet and just be like, what is my day look like?
2
SPEAKER_02
What is my week look like?
2
SPEAKER_02
What is my year look like?
2
SPEAKER_02
How am I showing up?
2
SPEAKER_02
Am I being am I being a good mom?
2
SPEAKER_02
Am I being a good not wife is usually I m just am I being present in my business?
2
SPEAKER_02
But it s that s what it does for me.
2
SPEAKER_02
It almost like gets rid of the patchy spots.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, the essence of meditation is to become more aware.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s really what meditation is about, is increasing awareness.
2
SPEAKER_01
And it s like when you work to get quiet at some level, you ll start to feel something.
2
SPEAKER_01
And then if you can just notice where that feeling lives in you, what it feels like, where it wants to go or move, and you are just to follow that feeling, you become exponentially more tuned to your emotional self.
2
SPEAKER_01
So there s thousands of meditations.
2
SPEAKER_01
The one you described is one, and there s a thousand others.
2
SPEAKER_01
But the seat of the whole thing is just to become more aware of your thoughts, your feelings, your emotions, and the world around you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And with greater awareness, you re able to guide just a little bit better the way you want to live your life.
2
SPEAKER_02
Do you have a meditation practice?
2
SPEAKER_02
I m going to guess you do.
2
SPEAKER_01
Oh yeah, I ve been practicing for like 25 years.
2
SPEAKER_02
What do you do?
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so there s two basic types of meditation.
2
SPEAKER_01
I ll give you some details.
2
SPEAKER_01
But the first is a single point meditation and the other one is called a contemplative meditation.
2
SPEAKER_01
So a single point meditation is, this is how my first teacher introduced it to me like 20 some years ago.
2
SPEAKER_01
He says, I want you to focus on your inhale and your exhale as if a loved one s life depends on you getting it right.
2
SPEAKER_01
And that s like, oh, that s pretty intense.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so it s meant to have like a sharp stick in your back, like get this shit right.
2
SPEAKER_01
And that was the way I was first introduced to it.
3
SPEAKER_01
And that s not easy to have that type of deep focus.
3
SPEAKER_01
And what ends up taking place is nanosecond breath number one, my mind is shooting out, did I do it right?
3
SPEAKER_01
Am I doing it right?
3
SPEAKER_01
Is someone going to die?
3
SPEAKER_01
No, no one s going to die.
3
SPEAKER_01
Wait, hold on, what am I doing?
3
SPEAKER_01
I m thinking, come back to my breath.
3
SPEAKER_01
That s my only job.
3
SPEAKER_01
What is wrong with you?
3
SPEAKER_01
Maybe you can t meditate.
3
SPEAKER_01
So that kind of inner narrative is a content of your mind.
3
SPEAKER_01
But your job during meditation for single point is to say hello to the noise and come back to the signal.
3
SPEAKER_01
And the signal in this case is maybe your exhale.
3
SPEAKER_01
And then with all of your essence, with all of your might, focus on the exhale.
3
SPEAKER_01
And then focus on the inhale.
3
SPEAKER_01
And your mind is going to wander a thousand times in two minutes.
3
SPEAKER_01
And your job is just to gently refocus over and over and over again.
3
SPEAKER_03
So what s your ideal day?
3
SPEAKER_03
Do you do it in the morning?
3
SPEAKER_03
Do you do it at night?
3
SPEAKER_03
Do you do it every single day?
3
SPEAKER_03
Do you miss a day?
3
SPEAKER_03
Do you do TM?
3
SPEAKER_03
What do you do?
3
SPEAKER_01
So the early, when I spent a lot of time, early days in it, it was a 20 minute practice.
3
SPEAKER_01
I d like to say seven days a week, but of course, days were missed.
3
SPEAKER_01
And now I m a little bit more patchy with it.
3
SPEAKER_01
So every day I commit to doing something, but sometimes it s only one breath.
3
SPEAKER_01
And so it starts in the morning for me.
3
SPEAKER_01
And the reason the morning is so important is because it sets up my awareness and it also, there s a bit of a glow.
3
SPEAKER_01
There s like this glow that happens when you re tuned.
3
SPEAKER_01
So I don t want to have that glow as I m falling asleep.
3
SPEAKER_01
I want to have that glow about the way that I m experiencing myself in life early in the day rather than late.
3
SPEAKER_01
And so I do it first thing in the morning.
3
SPEAKER_01
Sometimes I do it, it s like before I get out of bed.
3
SPEAKER_01
And so I m just laying down and my commitment there is to not fall back asleep, but to just focus on one breath at a time.
3
SPEAKER_01
And when my mind wanders, I notice what s pulling my attention and then I gently bring it back.
3
SPEAKER_01
That s single point meditation.
3
SPEAKER_01
So I make a commitment to do something every day.
3
SPEAKER_01
Sometimes it s 20, sometimes it s one breath.
3
SPEAKER_03
You said single point and what s the other one called?
3
SPEAKER_01
Contemplation.
3
SPEAKER_03
Contemplation.
3
SPEAKER_03
And that s different than what you just explained.
3
SPEAKER_01
In structure it is.
3
SPEAKER_01
So the single point could be your inhale and exhale.
3
SPEAKER_01
It s just the one thing.
3
SPEAKER_01
It could be the sounds in your environment.
3
SPEAKER_01
It could be a mantra that you re saying.
3
SPEAKER_01
It could be the flickering Kung Fu candle on the wall.
3
SPEAKER_01
It s just one thing.
3
SPEAKER_01
And the reason that that is single point is because it creates a bit of
3
SPEAKER_01
a contrast between the one thing and the noise that s pulling your attention from the one thing.
3
SPEAKER_01
So it s like this thing.
3
SPEAKER_00
It just gives you like a focal point, yeah?
3
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, but the focal point, you are training refocus, but it s giving you a moment to recognize like, whoa, my mind is somewhere else.
3
SPEAKER_01
It s not here.
3
SPEAKER_00
You got away from the thing.
3
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, that s exactly it.
3
SPEAKER_01
So contemplative meditation, oh, let me finish a simple point, or a single point.
3
SPEAKER_01
It helps you live in the present moment more often.
3
SPEAKER_01
And that s where the unlocks happen.
3
SPEAKER_01
That s where truth is experienced.
3
SPEAKER_01
That s where insights happen.
3
SPEAKER_01
Oh, that s how this works.
3
SPEAKER_01
And that s where wisdom is revealed.
3
SPEAKER_01
The more time that we spend in the present moment, the better at life we re going to be.
3
SPEAKER_01
Period.
3
SPEAKER_01
Full stop.
3
SPEAKER_01
And you can train your mind to be in the present moment more often.
3
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_01
Contemplative is another way to do it.
3
SPEAKER_01
So I can t believe we re talking this much about meditation, but it is awesome.
3
SPEAKER_01
Contemplative meditation is where you have a thought stem or a question.
3
SPEAKER_01
So you take a couple breaths, you settle in, you just kind of get into your body, quiet, close all the mental files of your mind.
3
SPEAKER_01
There s lots of ways to do that, of course.
3
SPEAKER_01
And then you ll start with a thought stem or a question.
3
SPEAKER_01
A thought stem or question could be, who am I?
3
SPEAKER_01
And then you just watch.
3
SPEAKER_01
Where do you go?
3
SPEAKER_01
Where s your mind go?
3
SPEAKER_03
Which one are you more drawn to?
3
SPEAKER_00
Probably the single point.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m just starting to practice.
3
SPEAKER_00
Are you?
3
SPEAKER_00
When I ve been, you know, in and out for a while, but I ve like now for the last two weeks, I ve done it pretty much every morning.
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Every morning I wake up, I go and I take my probiotic.
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Probiotics are absolutely amazing for bloat, constipation, your gut, immunity, better sleep, just all the things I feel like it s an easy one to add to your routine.
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I ve also implemented a lot of meat, which I think has helped.
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I m all about the supplement.
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And then I m very specific about how many times a month I wash my hair.
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So they don t have like parabens or hormones, especially if I m going to be using this all the time.
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I want to make sure it s a great hair serum.
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I never had thought of a hair serum
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for my hair, until I started interviewing a lot of celebrity hairstylists.
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And they were like, Lauren, you have to try this with scalp massage.
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When someone is such a high performer and
4
SPEAKER_02
And they want to perform in the major leagues.
4
SPEAKER_02
What are tools that you can give them to help them do that?
4
SPEAKER_01
There s plenty.
4
SPEAKER_01
The commitment is to work from the inside out.
4
SPEAKER_01
So we re going to talk about internal skills, right?
4
SPEAKER_01
We re going to talk about psychological skills.
4
SPEAKER_01
So the first practice that we re talking about is increasing awareness.
4
SPEAKER_01
Again, there s three ways to increase awareness, meditation, journaling, and conversations with wisdom, okay?
4
SPEAKER_01
So it begins and ends with wisdom, or I m sorry, it begins and ends with awareness.
4
SPEAKER_01
If you re not aware of your thoughts, if you re not aware of kind of how thought one and thought two work to create emotion A or emotion B, you re just a grinder.
4
SPEAKER_01
You re grinding.
4
SPEAKER_01
That s cool.
4
SPEAKER_01
I got you here.
4
SPEAKER_01
I m not saying you, Michael, but like it got us here.
4
SPEAKER_01
There s a better way.
4
SPEAKER_01
And so it begins with awareness.
4
SPEAKER_01
Once you re aware, then you can make some micro-choices.
4
SPEAKER_01
And those micro-choices are really about what thoughts am I going to have?
4
SPEAKER_01
How does this thought influence that emotion, my state of being?
4
SPEAKER_01
And so with awareness, you can make micro-choices.
4
SPEAKER_01
So the second thing I would point to after awareness training is arousal regulation.
4
SPEAKER_01
So arousal regulation is really about managing your internal state.
4
SPEAKER_01
Breath work is what we point to.
4
SPEAKER_02
I thought you were going to say something else.
4
SPEAKER_01
I knew both of you were going there quickly.
4
SPEAKER_02
Okay, I m like, what s that?
4
SPEAKER_01
I don t call arousal regulation to my 14-year-old son, 15-year-old son.
4
SPEAKER_01
Good thing Taylor s not here.
4
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so arousal regulation, the technical term for arousal, we think of it like body activation, like how switched on is your body.
4
SPEAKER_01
And for most people, a way to think about it, if you re going to walk on stage and you think about a scale of 1 to 10,
4
SPEAKER_01
walking on stage is pretty nerve-wracking for most people.
4
SPEAKER_01
So that s like a 9 on a scale of 1 to 10 is like, I m about to throw up.
4
SPEAKER_01
I think I just threw up in my mouth.
4
SPEAKER_01
I m not like, I m a mess.
4
SPEAKER_01
A 10 is like a full-blown, like, I m a disaster.
4
SPEAKER_00
Can t do it.
4
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
4
SPEAKER_01
A 2 is like yawning, like, God, what am I doing?
4
SPEAKER_01
This is so boring.
4
SPEAKER_01
and a five is that sweet spot.
4
SPEAKER_01
So it s like the porridge is too cold, too hot, and just right.
4
SPEAKER_01
So four, five, and six is kind of the state that helps us be in an ideal performance or ideal competitive state.
4
SPEAKER_01
So five on that activation scale is your unique sweet spot.
4
SPEAKER_01
And so if you re too high on the scale, like you re revved up, anxious, you re feeling your body, the first bit is to be aware of what s my number, let s say.
4
SPEAKER_01
I m at an 8.
4
SPEAKER_01
I m glad I caught it.
4
SPEAKER_01
So how do you go from an 8 to a 7?
4
SPEAKER_01
That s an easy question.
4
SPEAKER_02
You become aware that you re at an 8?
4
SPEAKER_01
That s the first step.
4
SPEAKER_01
The second step is?
4
SPEAKER_01
Maybe breath?
4
SPEAKER_01
We all kind of know this.
4
SPEAKER_01
And so the more you practice breathing, the more powerful that tool is.
4
SPEAKER_01
So if you re unpracticed at breathing and you really want to get down to a five, it might take you a while.
4
SPEAKER_01
But if you re very practiced at it and over time, one or two breaths really kind of get you into that slip stream of being relaxed, like when you need it, when you re a bit
4
SPEAKER_01
wonky, then a couple breaths will be more powerful.
4
SPEAKER_01
So that s one way.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s a down-regulation practice, breathing, and it s a way to become just a bit more calm when you d like to.
4
SPEAKER_00
It s interesting you say that, because I talked about it again on the show.
4
SPEAKER_00
I used to be terrified of speaking in public, and now not at all.
4
SPEAKER_00
What changed?
4
SPEAKER_00
Well, I think doing this show and just getting practice in, even though it s not in front of a live audience, help.
4
SPEAKER_00
But I think also speaking on stage and doing it more and more.
4
SPEAKER_00
But even now, once in a while when I go on, as we just recently spoke at a school,
4
SPEAKER_00
And you get a little tinge of like, oh, I m feeling a little nervous.
4
SPEAKER_00
It s just breathing a couple times and I m completely normal.
4
SPEAKER_01
But your body s supposed to key up when something important is.
4
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It s supposed to tell you like, hey, this is a time to kind of amp up.
4
SPEAKER_00
Turn on.
4
SPEAKER_01
Like we need to have all of our faculty here.
4
SPEAKER_01
This is important.
4
SPEAKER_01
This matters.
4
SPEAKER_01
So it s a really good skill.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s just knowing like, what number would you say you are on that 1 to 10 scale?
4
SPEAKER_00
Honestly, I mean, Lauren might tell me more.
4
SPEAKER_00
I think before I used to edge on the seven, eight, and then maybe sometimes if I was low energy, it d be like three, four.
4
SPEAKER_00
I think I m probably like a six now.
4
SPEAKER_00
I feel a little hyper, but also, yeah, I m in the pocket.
4
SPEAKER_00
What do you think?
4
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, I think that s about right.
4
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, but again, it took a while.
4
SPEAKER_00
It didn t just happen.
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SPEAKER_00
I had to practice a lot at it.
4
SPEAKER_01
So that s the grinder approach?
4
SPEAKER_01
Cool.
4
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There s only three things we can train as humans.
4
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We can train our craft,
4
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the technical thing we want to get better at.
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We can train our body, like our carriage, and we can train our mind.
4
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And the best of the best of the best, they re not leaving one of those, certainly the mind, up to chance.
4
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So you grind it.
4
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You did rep and rep and rep and rep and you figured it out kind of by force.
4
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And what I hope for my son and the next generation is that we re doing such a good job of now pointing to the mind matters and psychology s foundationally important.
4
SPEAKER_01
We re not doing a great job.
4
SPEAKER_01
We re doing better than the previous generation did, better than the boomers and whatever.
4
SPEAKER_01
They hit it.
4
SPEAKER_00
Well, my advice that I got back then was like, just get your ass up there and do it.
4
SPEAKER_00
I m like, I don t think that was the best advice.
4
SPEAKER_00
I mean, that s the grinder approach, right?
4
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, there is like, I mean, true, you got to get back up there and do it, but like how?
4
SPEAKER_00
There s no how.
4
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so the worst thing is like, I don t know if you remember as a kid when, or even like, I don t know, as an adult where someone says, are you okay?
4
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Just relax.
4
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You re okay.
4
SPEAKER_01
You ll be fine.
4
SPEAKER_01
I see you.
4
SPEAKER_01
You re nervous.
4
SPEAKER_01
You re a mess, is what they re saying when they say, hey, just relax.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s going to be okay.
4
SPEAKER_00
Just get over it.
4
SPEAKER_01
Stop bothering me.
4
SPEAKER_01
How do you want me to do that?
4
SPEAKER_02
I do that all the time, Dio.
4
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, yeah, all the time.
4
SPEAKER_02
I mean, I m like, just relax.
4
SPEAKER_02
It s fine.
4
SPEAKER_02
It s fine.
4
SPEAKER_01
Does that work for you, Michael?
4
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No, of course not.
4
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I mean, I m the meme that s sitting in the fire everywhere and I m just like, it s fine.
4
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I say in a strange, I mean, I think to your point, the previous generation, it s like there was no feelings discussed.
4
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And if there were, it was like very uncomfortable.
4
SPEAKER_01
You need water?
4
SPEAKER_01
What are you talking about?
4
SPEAKER_01
Get back out there.
4
SPEAKER_00
Exactly.
4
SPEAKER_00
And I think we re maybe,
4
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sitting in between those generations now where we re the first ones are kind of like, hey, but I think the generations below us, like hopefully they don t have to struggle as much because people are talking more and sharing more.
4
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I mean, even the amount of mental health conversations we ve had on the show, and I m sure that you ve had on yours is like those go back 20 years.
4
SPEAKER_00
They weren t happening abundantly like this.
4
SPEAKER_01
No, it was, it was embarrassing to talk about because of the stigma about weakness.
4
SPEAKER_02
I have a friend that is always telling himself that he s not confident.
4
SPEAKER_02
And with everything he touches, he doesn t bring a confidence because he s told himself he s not confident.
4
SPEAKER_02
Is confidence.
4
SPEAKER_02
Cause you mentioned this earlier, something you can teach and you said, you said earlier, you could teach it, but how do you do that?
4
SPEAKER_02
What are the tools that I can give him as a friend?
4
SPEAKER_02
Because I think for me, number one, it s like, stop telling yourself you re not confident.
4
SPEAKER_02
If I m not something I tell myself I am.
4
SPEAKER_02
So is that, does that work?
4
SPEAKER_02
Is that just like, I m being delusional.
4
SPEAKER_01
No.
4
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so confidence is a trainable skill.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s at the cornerstone of being great at anything is understanding how to get into that state.
4
SPEAKER_01
So confidence is a state of being.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s temporary.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s fleeting.
4
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It moves quickly.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s determined by one source and one source only, but it is so temporary that we re constantly having to reconnect to it.
4
SPEAKER_01
So when I ask you, where do you think it comes from?
4
SPEAKER_01
Most people, well, I ll ask, where do you think it comes from?
4
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I think it comes from keeping the commitments that you make to yourself and seeing them through, whether you fall short or not.
4
SPEAKER_00
I think that s what it is.
4
SPEAKER_00
Like say that s cool.
4
SPEAKER_00
I mean, I don t know if that s fully it, but for me, like I m confident, even if I fall short of something, as long as I have committed to see that thing through to the best of my ability, I agree with you.
4
SPEAKER_02
And I think that s how you maintain it.
4
SPEAKER_02
But now that I ve analyzed it, I actually think it comes from your parents.
4
SPEAKER_01
A lot of people say that too.
4
SPEAKER_01
I think both of you are onto something.
4
SPEAKER_01
One is your parents were informing your sense of self.
4
SPEAKER_01
They had a lot of work to do that was going on.
4
SPEAKER_01
I don t know how good your parents were, but mine did not have an advanced degree in parenting.
4
SPEAKER_01
They were trying their very best.
4
SPEAKER_01
There s a lot of programming that happens at a young age about your sense of self, about the world around you.
4
SPEAKER_01
They re basically installing or building your psychological framework.
4
SPEAKER_01
Okay, that s cool.
4
SPEAKER_01
So it s influenced by them.
4
SPEAKER_01
It s influenced by the work you put in, the promises you make.
4
SPEAKER_01
But ultimately it comes down, it s not past success, it s not hard work, what it ultimately
5
SPEAKER_01
What drives that is the way you speak to yourself.
5
SPEAKER_02
It s self-talk.
5
SPEAKER_00
So it s like my favorite Louise Hay.
5
SPEAKER_00
You re on it.
5
SPEAKER_02
I was going to say something, but I didn t want to sound like a full psychopath.
5
SPEAKER_00
The way you speak to yourself in your head.
5
SPEAKER_00
Oh really?
5
SPEAKER_00
Did you have FOPA on that?
5
SPEAKER_02
But the way that I speak to myself in my head is like, of course that s going to happen for me.
5
SPEAKER_02
And of course I m going to get a girl like Lauren.
5
SPEAKER_02
And of course I m going to be able to speak.
5
SPEAKER_02
And I know it sounds psychotic sometimes when you say it out loud.
5
SPEAKER_02
And people say sometimes it s a little bit of arrogance.
5
SPEAKER_02
But what I ve always told myself and people around me is like, if I don t speak to myself like that in my head, nobody else is going to.
5
SPEAKER_02
And I have to speak to that way myself or else I m not going to do the things that I really believe I can do.
5
SPEAKER_02
Does that make sense?
5
SPEAKER_02
A thousand percent.
5
SPEAKER_02
And I know that like that, like some people feel uncomfortable saying that out loud because it makes them feel egotistical or arrogant.
5
SPEAKER_02
But I just know like, if I don t do it for me, nobody else is going to do it for me.
5
SPEAKER_01
So you re a thousand percent right.
5
SPEAKER_01
Now, when you get down to the art of what you actually say to yourself, it must rest on credibility.
5
SPEAKER_01
Sure.
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so we know when we re lying.
5
SPEAKER_01
And when we re lying to ourselves or saying something that we don t really believe,
5
SPEAKER_01
We know that as soon as we get chin-checked and somebody kind of pokes at us in a way that it s like the Easter egg bunny that s hollow on the inside.
5
SPEAKER_01
You poke it and it kind of falls apart.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, like I can t look in the mirror and be like, I am 6 5 .
5
SPEAKER_01
You cannot do that.
5
SPEAKER_00
But do you also think it rests on what you said earlier?
5
SPEAKER_00
I think it also rests on awareness of thought.
5
SPEAKER_00
Well, that s where the whole thing begins.
5
SPEAKER_00
For him to even be aware of the thoughts that he has… That s why awareness is step one.
5
SPEAKER_00
Sometimes when you re meditating, it s so amazing to be able to look at the thoughts that pass.
5
SPEAKER_02
I ll give you a perfect example.
5
SPEAKER_02
In my career, and this happens to anyone, if you re going to do anything in life, there s going to be failures, micro-failures.
5
SPEAKER_02
I don t believe it s a true failure unless you fully actually quit and give up and stop.
5
SPEAKER_02
But in my life, I have had failures and business failures, and there s been moments when people in my personal life have wanted me to fully acknowledge and wallow in the failure.
5
SPEAKER_02
My resistance to doing that has irritated people.
5
SPEAKER_02
But what I tell them is, if I start to tell myself I m a failure,
5
SPEAKER_02
And I start to say, you know what?
5
SPEAKER_02
You re right.
5
SPEAKER_02
I can t do that.
5
SPEAKER_02
And I shouldn t have done that.
5
SPEAKER_02
Even though I can admit there was a mistake.
5
SPEAKER_02
But if I sit in the place of telling myself I m a failure over and over, then in my mind, that s what I will become.
5
SPEAKER_02
So what I do instead is I say, that was a mistake.
5
SPEAKER_02
And you can correct that mistake.
5
SPEAKER_02
But you are still meant for this type of greatness if you do X, Y, and Z. And that s how I think about it.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
This is the rite of passage to adulthood, is to know how to work with your own thoughts.
5
SPEAKER_01
Say it one more time, it begins with awareness, you need to know what the content of your mind is about, and then have the most productive type of relationship with yourself that is
5
SPEAKER_01
based in reality.
5
SPEAKER_01
And so the exercise that we ll do with athletes is we ll ask them, it s like a, just imagine a line down the piece of paper.
5
SPEAKER_01
And so you got a left and right half.
5
SPEAKER_01
And then on the left-hand side, it is your epic thought.
5
SPEAKER_01
So a thought that you say to yourself that feels really good.
5
SPEAKER_01
Like when you say it, you feel like a badass or whatever the feeling that you want to have.
5
SPEAKER_01
Epic meaning amazing, right?
5
SPEAKER_01
So what is your epic thought?
5
SPEAKER_01
And then to the right of that, you ll have an A, B, and C.
5
SPEAKER_01
So I ll tell you the story of where this comes from, but A, B, and C are three things that you ve experienced in your life that give you the right to say that epic thing.
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay?
5
SPEAKER_01
Now that epic thing puts you in a state and that state is like, I can do some shit here.
5
SPEAKER_01
I ll give you a concrete example.
5
SPEAKER_01
I ll tell you a story is the concrete example of like, okay, Mike, what is one of your epic thoughts?
5
SPEAKER_01
I can do hard things.
5
SPEAKER_01
Now I ve got three things that I can point to right underneath the surface that I ve honestly earned the right to say, no, bring it.
5
SPEAKER_01
I can do hard things.
5
SPEAKER_01
And I ve got a couple more that really work for me.
5
SPEAKER_01
Nobody else has to vie with it.
5
SPEAKER_01
It has to work for me.
5
SPEAKER_01
So I m sitting, I spent a bunch of time helping fighters in the UFC.
5
SPEAKER_01
This is early in the UFC.
5
SPEAKER_01
and I m in a small little office, it was early in my career, and it was a championship fight, and this guy s got tattoos crawling up his neck, his shoulders are popping out of his ears, and a bald head, and he s got the entire look that you would imagine.
5
SPEAKER_01
I said, what s it like when you re at your best?
5
SPEAKER_01
He goes, there s nothing.
5
SPEAKER_01
I go, right, like he s talking about flow or the zone or whatever.
5
SPEAKER_01
I said, when you re really working,
5
SPEAKER_01
and you re in a really powerful state, what s going on inside your head?
5
SPEAKER_01
He goes, oh, that s pretty simple.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m a tough motherfucker.
5
SPEAKER_01
And so I didn t want to be like, that s cool.
5
SPEAKER_01
I said, can you back that up?
5
SPEAKER_01
And he looks at me and he says, yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
I was in an end game position.
5
SPEAKER_01
I broke the choke hold, put him on my back.
5
SPEAKER_01
Walked him across the cage, dumped him, and finished him.
5
SPEAKER_01
Like, I m a tough motherfucker.
5
SPEAKER_01
So unimpressed, I said, you got anything else?
5
SPEAKER_01
He leans in, like, kind of frowning a little bit, and he goes, I whooped my dad s ass when I was 14.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m telling you, I m a tough motherfucker.
5
SPEAKER_01
I said, I tried my luck one more time.
5
SPEAKER_01
I said, all right, anything else?
5
SPEAKER_01
He goes, if someone were to ask me one more question, I just might choke him out.
5
SPEAKER_01
So that s where this science meets application, is that he could quickly back it up.
5
SPEAKER_01
And get to that place.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m a tough motherfucker because bang, bang, bang.
5
SPEAKER_01
And as he was saying it and he was reliving the stories, he was chin-checking me right there.
5
SPEAKER_01
I don t want to go any further.
5
SPEAKER_01
What s your problem, dude?
5
SPEAKER_01
You re not seeing it?
5
SPEAKER_01
Because I m believing it right now.
5
SPEAKER_01
So the way we speak to ourselves, the way we remind ourselves of what we re capable of shows up in how we, how the feeling that gets expressed from it.
5
SPEAKER_01
So confidence is not arrogance.
5
SPEAKER_01
That s like, I got to show you something.
5
SPEAKER_01
Confidence is this knowing that you have what it takes to adjust.
5
SPEAKER_02
Going to your, to your book.
5
SPEAKER_02
I think a lot of people would feel uncomfortable saying some of these things.
5
SPEAKER_02
For example, if I say that I talk to myself like I m the greatest person in the world, a lot of people are like, oh, that sounds very arrogant.
5
SPEAKER_02
I m saying it because it s for the benefit of my personal psyche as well as the people that I care about in my life.
5
SPEAKER_02
But also, I ve gotten to a place where I hope people don t think that arrogance about me, but at the same time, I cannot worry about it if they do.
5
SPEAKER_02
And I think that s the whole core of this.
5
SPEAKER_02
And when you were talking, I was thinking so many of the people that we interact with and we talk with, we get all these questions like,
5
SPEAKER_02
I want to do this, but I m this or I m that.
5
SPEAKER_02
If you were going to work with, say, Jim, and Jim has the ambition to launch an online business, but it requires them to put themselves out there and do something that is maybe going to make their family say, what s Jim doing?
5
SPEAKER_02
Or their girlfriend be like, why would he do that?
5
SPEAKER_02
And the friends say, that s strange.
5
SPEAKER_02
How do you coach somebody to get to the point where
5
SPEAKER_02
They care what people are thinking about them, but at the same time, they re not worried and they can actually take the steps to go out there and execute.
5
SPEAKER_02
It takes time.
5
SPEAKER_01
The software upgrade that we re talking about does take time.
5
SPEAKER_01
So there s no silver bullets, there s no hacks, there s no shortcuts.
5
SPEAKER_01
What we need to do is understand how much does he really want this thing?
5
SPEAKER_01
And if the purpose of that is bigger than the pain of perceived failure, then the purpose can win.
5
SPEAKER_01
And if the perceived pain, like the embarrassment of blowing it or spending all the family money or whatever it is, is bigger than the purpose, then pain wins.
5
SPEAKER_01
So it s first just understanding what s happening.
5
SPEAKER_01
And then from that, there s fundamental decisions that need to be made.
5
SPEAKER_01
And so the fundamental decision is I m going to approach success versus avoid failure.
5
SPEAKER_01
So we understand what s happening and then which direction and then is it an honest decision that you re making to approach success?
5
SPEAKER_01
What does success look like?
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay, got it, clear.
5
SPEAKER_01
And what s getting in the way?
5
SPEAKER_01
And then so we untangle that and then we backfill it with a whole.
5
SPEAKER_01
thoughtful program of training.
5
SPEAKER_01
We re gonna train self-talk, we re gonna train breathing, we re gonna train awareness, we re gonna train the skill of optimism.
5
SPEAKER_01
I haven t met a world s best that isn t fundamentally optimistic.
5
SPEAKER_01
And then as soon as I bring up that word into like corporate environments or business environments, everyone kind of rolls their eyes like, oh, there we go, we re gonna talk about being positive and holding hands and like the wheels are falling off but we re okay.
5
SPEAKER_01
That s not what optimism is.
5
SPEAKER_01
Optimism is a fundamental belief.
6
SPEAKER_03
this out.
6
SPEAKER_03
Something good s about to take place.
6
SPEAKER_03
Let s figure this thing out.
6
SPEAKER_01
Optimism, too, is also being resourceful.
6
SPEAKER_01
If someone says no, no, no, no, no, an optimist finds a yes.
6
100%.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s a belief.
6
SPEAKER_01
It s not just positive, positive.
6
SPEAKER_01
It s about figuring it out.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_03
Positivity is like,
6
SPEAKER_03
I don t even like to say positive talk, positive self-talk.
6
SPEAKER_03
Positivity is having a moment of toxic positivity that we talk about.
6
SPEAKER_03
But there s something really buoyant about finding what s good.
6
SPEAKER_03
There s something very energetic about seeing the good in things.
6
SPEAKER_03
But naive positivity and naive optimism are very dangerous.
6
SPEAKER_01
Oh, talk about that.
6
SPEAKER_03
Naive optimism.
6
SPEAKER_03
So optimism is a belief that something good is going to take place.
6
SPEAKER_03
Okay.
6
SPEAKER_03
And let s say, let s say we re doing a business venture and every time that we go out and to go do something, I drop the ball.
6
SPEAKER_03
And you guys are optimistic.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like Mike, you re going to figure it out.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s okay.
6
SPEAKER_03
You re going to figure it out.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like something good is going to happen here.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like this is going to work out.
6
SPEAKER_03
Let s keep going.
6
SPEAKER_03
but you don t see me trying to fix it.
6
SPEAKER_03
You don t see me investing in learning and I m doing the same shit over and over again.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s like staying in a abusive relationship, believing that the other person s going to change, but they re not doing the work.
6
SPEAKER_03
They re not going to see a psychologist.
6
SPEAKER_03
They re just using words to say, I ll be different later and not doing actions.
6
SPEAKER_03
So naive optimism is very, very dangerous.
6
SPEAKER_01
Self-talk, if someone thinks every single morning when they wake up, oh, I m so fat.
6
SPEAKER_01
I m such a loser.
6
SPEAKER_01
How would you coach them to rejig that?
6
SPEAKER_03
Is it working?
6
SPEAKER_01
Let s say it s not working.
6
SPEAKER_01
Let s just guess.
6
SPEAKER_01
It probably ever can t work.
6
SPEAKER_01
Let s guess.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, right.
6
SPEAKER_03
So the output of that is they re feeling, I don t know, kind of shitty about themselves.
6
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, let s say they re feeling shitty and the self-talk is negative, negative, negative.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, and I mean, do they want to change?
6
SPEAKER_01
Let s say they do.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_03
So the first order of business is like, well, how would you like to speak to yourself?
6
SPEAKER_03
When have you spoken to yourself that led you to feel a certain way where you felt powerful or buoyant?
6
SPEAKER_03
So here s my orientation that I m working from.
6
SPEAKER_03
You already have your answers.
6
SPEAKER_03
They re already in you.
6
SPEAKER_03
Everything you need is already inside you.
6
SPEAKER_03
I don t have them.
6
SPEAKER_03
I need to figure out, ask the right questions to elicit like, when has it been good for you?
6
SPEAKER_03
How did you speak to yourself then?
6
SPEAKER_03
Oh, was it easy?
6
SPEAKER_03
Was it hard?
6
SPEAKER_03
Like what happened that you don t speak to yourself that way anymore?
6
SPEAKER_03
So it s already in them.
6
SPEAKER_03
And so it s just eliciting that insight and wisdom and helping them make a commitment to do it more often.
6
SPEAKER_01
And also the things you re talking about, meditation and sitting in silence is free.
6
SPEAKER_01
Breath work is free.
6
SPEAKER_03
That s right.
6
SPEAKER_01
These are all things that anyone has the tool to do.
6
SPEAKER_03
And all of them help us live in the present moment more often, which is where the great unlocks.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s where performance and connection and relationships and wisdom is revealed.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s about getting to the present moment.
6
SPEAKER_03
Again, that s where life happens.
6
SPEAKER_03
You can train your mind to be more present.
6
SPEAKER_01
Are there any red flags when you talk to people where you re like, oh, this person can t be helped?
6
SPEAKER_01
Don t lie.
6
SPEAKER_01
Tell the truth.
6
SPEAKER_02
He s like, well, your husband just said.
6
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_01
Like almost like a hopelessness with the coaching situation.
6
SPEAKER_03
People pleasers.
6
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
6
SPEAKER_01
It s really hard to break.
6
SPEAKER_03
They re not playing an honest game.
6
SPEAKER_01
Well, I think that they re addicted to pleasing people because it makes them feel needed.
6
SPEAKER_02
That s right.
6
SPEAKER_02
Are you talking about yourself?
6
SPEAKER_01
I don t think I m a people pleaser.
6
SPEAKER_02
Sometimes.
6
SPEAKER_01
Did you see the frown, Michael?
6
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_01
You think I m a people pleaser?
6
SPEAKER_01
That s an interesting thing.
6
SPEAKER_02
I think sometimes you don t like to rock the boat.
6
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_01
I would say that I don t die for confrontation, but I don t think I m a people pleaser.
6
SPEAKER_01
I don t think that s the right category to put me in.
6
SPEAKER_03
Codependence?
6
SPEAKER_01
You think I people please you?
6
SPEAKER_03
Not me.
6
SPEAKER_01
I m going to have a laugh on my ass for two hours straight.
6
SPEAKER_02
No, no.
6
SPEAKER_02
I think maybe people-pleasing is not the right word.
6
SPEAKER_01
That s not the right word.
6
SPEAKER_02
Let s just say sometimes you would rather keep people comfortable and happy than rocking the boat.
6
SPEAKER_01
I like to finesse the experience.
6
SPEAKER_01
I like it to be a positive experience.
6
SPEAKER_03
That slows down the process of growth.
6
SPEAKER_03
We re not going to say people-placing.
6
SPEAKER_01
Pull that clip, Carson.
6
SPEAKER_03
That s right.
6
SPEAKER_01
I would say I m not the most confrontational person.
6
SPEAKER_01
I do know what I like and say what I like, but I would say I m not the most confrontational.
6
SPEAKER_02
Let s say that somebody s in her life- Careful, someone might be listening.
6
SPEAKER_02
Somebody s in her life that is maybe struggling in a certain area.
6
SPEAKER_02
Instead of telling that person exactly what she would, what she thinks, like what she would tell me, she would rather them feel comfortable and not deal with that confrontation.
6
SPEAKER_02
And I, my feedback is you re not, you re better to not do that.
6
SPEAKER_02
You re not doing them any favors, I don t think.
6
SPEAKER_03
Do you want my thoughts on it?
6
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, yeah, go, go, rip me to shreds.
6
SPEAKER_03
No, I won t do that, but it s a great disservice.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s one of the great disservices.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, because I ll tell you that the principle to work from is that unfortunately pain is why we change.
6
SPEAKER_03
Uncomfortableness is how we grow.
6
SPEAKER_03
So one of the great mistakes I can make as a psychologist is somebody comes in and they re in a state where they re feeling vulnerable and they re touching their pain.
6
SPEAKER_03
They re even putting words to it and feeling it.
6
SPEAKER_03
We re in that place.
6
SPEAKER_03
And then I say, it s going to be okay.
6
SPEAKER_01
Right.
6
SPEAKER_03
So I m taking away the time that they need under tension of pain to get to a place where they say, I m not fucking doing this anymore.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like, you know what, what am I doing?
6
SPEAKER_03
And they need to get to that agitated state to say, I m putting my foot in the ground, metaphorically, what are we doing?
6
SPEAKER_03
Like, let s figure this thing out.
6
SPEAKER_03
So minimizing pain is one of the great codependent mechanisms.
6
SPEAKER_03
And our job is to lovingly help people feel pain.
6
SPEAKER_03
And when I m talking about pain, I m talking about really emotional suffering.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like that s why we change.
6
SPEAKER_01
So someone wants you to do something.
6
SPEAKER_01
Let s say a friend wants you to do something and you don t want to do it, but you don t want to tell him you don t want to do it.
6
SPEAKER_03
Well, that s actually, there s probably some FOPO in there.
6
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_03
I m afraid of what they ll think of me if I say no.
6
SPEAKER_01
I ll leave you here for an hour or so.
6
SPEAKER_03
But to examine why you don t want to let somebody down, why you don t want them to see you a certain way is a really good exercise.
6
SPEAKER_03
Let s just answer it before we go.
6
SPEAKER_03
Why is that?
6
SPEAKER_01
I don t like hurting people s feelings.
6
SPEAKER_01
I like to be someone.
6
SPEAKER_03
So you value dishonesty more than, more than hurting people s feelings.
6
SPEAKER_03
Like that s the game.
6
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_01
I think that I m trying to put myself like as the hero and it s not that I m being heroic.
6
SPEAKER_01
Like if I m calling myself out, I m like, oh, I don t like hurting people s feelings, but you re right.
6
SPEAKER_01
There s a dishonesty undertone.
6
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, I know.
6
SPEAKER_02
In our relationship and like in our business,
6
SPEAKER_02
relationship as well.
6
SPEAKER_02
I would say our personal relationship and our business relationship.
6
SPEAKER_02
Lauren will sometimes be like, oh my, I am, I guess the quote unquote, the blunt one.
6
SPEAKER_03
It s funny because it s super interesting that that is the dynamic that you guys hold because it doesn t feel that way on the other side of your relationship.
6
SPEAKER_00
I found this company, okay, it s called Wild Grain.
6
SPEAKER_00
It s the first ever bake from frozen subscription box for sourdough bread, which is my family s favorite.
6
SPEAKER_00
I love sourdough, it s good for your gut.
6
SPEAKER_00
They have fresh pastas and they also have pastries.
6
SPEAKER_00
Every item bakes from frozen in 25 minutes or less.
6
SPEAKER_00
There s no thawing required.
6
SPEAKER_00
They sent me a new box.
6
SPEAKER_00
There is so many delicious goodies inside.
6
SPEAKER_00
It also gets the kids to like interact.
6
SPEAKER_00
I really like things for my kids that sort of make them resourceful and they get really excited when they see a box of carbs show up to the door.
6
SPEAKER_00
So one thing that we did together was we made croissants, and it was so cute.
6
SPEAKER_00
We got little bowls of jam out.
6
SPEAKER_00
We did honey.
6
SPEAKER_00
We even melted grass-fed butter in with the honey and made honey butter.
6
SPEAKER_00
And I made it like a craft for the kids.
6
SPEAKER_00
So now every single time I get my wild grain box, not only am I having the best time with the sourdough, I m also involving my kids in the baking process.
8
SPEAKER_03
Your pupils change size and I can see just a little bit of sweat on your lip.
8
SPEAKER_03
And I say, hey, what s going on?
8
SPEAKER_03
Nothing.
8
SPEAKER_03
What do you mean?
8
SPEAKER_03
Well, I m noticing, no, no, I m good.
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, no.
8
SPEAKER_03
So it s like when you re not being honest with your actual experience, it just takes a long time.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so safety is what most people are trying to work out is, can I be safe right now?
8
SPEAKER_03
And when people don t trust themselves or have low trust of other people, it takes a long time.
8
SPEAKER_03
It was one of the mechanisms that I would use with the Seattle Seahawks for selection.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so I would support the GM and the scouts in helping find the right fits for the NFL team.
8
SPEAKER_03
And one of the first gates that I would have is, do they trust themselves?
8
SPEAKER_03
If it s low, forget about it.
8
SPEAKER_03
Do they trust other people?
8
SPEAKER_03
If it s low, forget about it.
8
SPEAKER_03
Even if they re a crazy generational talent.
8
SPEAKER_03
They re going to be really disruptive and it s going to take a long time to build a relationship.
8
SPEAKER_03
And we just don t have that kind of time.
8
SPEAKER_03
So trust is one of the big ones.
8
SPEAKER_01
Before we go, if there s someone out there that has failure to launch, they can t launch anything in their life because they re almost scared of becoming a high performer.
8
SPEAKER_02
So they get it right to the point where they have the idea formed.
8
SPEAKER_02
They re ready to go.
8
SPEAKER_02
And at the last minute, they re like, oh, like I ve,
8
SPEAKER_02
Cold feet.
8
SPEAKER_02
Or they decide like, oh, that really, I m not going to do that.
8
SPEAKER_01
They sabotage it.
8
SPEAKER_02
They just say, I m going into something else because it s right in the moment where, yeah.
8
SPEAKER_01
A lot of people that, that I talk to on a daily basis have excuses for why they can t launch something.
8
SPEAKER_01
So, uh, an example is the internet s too saturated for me to do anything, or, you know, I can t do this because I have kids.
8
SPEAKER_01
They create roadblocks so they can t launch.
8
SPEAKER_01
Say someone s listening to have a failure to launch.
8
SPEAKER_01
What would you tell them?
8
SPEAKER_03
Are you guys thinking of someone?
8
SPEAKER_03
Is there someone in your mind or is this just a general thing?
8
SPEAKER_01
I have a couple of people.
8
SPEAKER_01
There s a few, but I think when we... Why, does it seem like I m profiling someone?
8
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, right.
8
SPEAKER_02
So, okay.
8
SPEAKER_02
When we speak, a lot of the times you will see some people we see multiple times and some just like common themes of people that have a very well-formed idea and they ve talked and messaged and shared.
8
SPEAKER_02
And they don t take that step to get in the arena.
8
SPEAKER_02
It s like the thing is ready to go, and then it s time to step in the arena.
8
SPEAKER_01
Ed Milet calls cooling at your temperature down.
8
SPEAKER_01
Say you do something really great, you ll cool your temperature back down to what you re used to to make yourself comfortable instead of putting yourself in the unknown and becoming uncomfortable.
8
SPEAKER_02
It s exciting to the point where it cannot fail, but then when you re ready to go and if there s that chance it doesn t work, it s a failure.
8
SPEAKER_02
they quit before it can be a failure.
8
SPEAKER_02
Does that make sense?
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, a hundred percent.
8
SPEAKER_03
You re describing something that is really common.
8
SPEAKER_02
I think a lot of people experience that.
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
8
SPEAKER_03
To your point about temperature, high heat moments is where we really learn who we are.
8
SPEAKER_03
When you re at the edge of your capabilities and you re not sure how it s going to go, that s where you meet yourself.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so the failure to launch, it s not what I would say.
8
SPEAKER_03
It would be more of the questions I would ask.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so I m much more interested in what they re carrying that s so heavy they can t take the next step.
8
SPEAKER_03
I m more interested in the framing that they re coming from of, you know, is it an excuse?
8
SPEAKER_03
Is it a reason?
8
SPEAKER_03
And just understanding, like, if we played this thing out five times, how would you feel about it on the fifth time?
8
SPEAKER_03
Like, how many more times do you need to get to the start line before you put your hand in the dirt and put your feet in the blocks?
8
SPEAKER_01
I bet you 99% of them would say they re worried about what people think.
8
SPEAKER_03
I think you re right.
8
SPEAKER_01
Which is why, fuck, you gotta buy his book.
8
SPEAKER_02
As you were writing this, did you get to core issues or did you find reasons?
8
SPEAKER_02
I mean, outside of the example you gave earlier about being booted out of the tribe, what is the core reason why so many people care so much about what people think or worry so much about what people think?
8
SPEAKER_03
There s the biological bit that we were talking about.
8
SPEAKER_03
And then there we are, so this is in context to modern times, we are living in an obsessed world of performance.
8
SPEAKER_03
Like at an early age, we re given grades and we re ranked and we re stacked and like that just kind of travels with us for most of our life.
8
SPEAKER_03
So it makes perfect sense that you would develop an identity that s called a performance-based identity.
8
SPEAKER_03
A performance-obsessed world creates humans that have an identity around their performance.
8
SPEAKER_03
So no longer I am who I am, but a performance-based identity is I am how well I do something.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so if I m going to walk on stage or launch into something that could be a public failure, everything is on the line.
8
SPEAKER_03
Not just the performance, not just my attempt, but it s who I am.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so it s overwhelming.
8
SPEAKER_03
And so in essence, what we need to help people get to is how to decouple who I am from what I do.
8
SPEAKER_03
And one of the ways to do that is to create, with great clarity, a purpose-based identity.
8
SPEAKER_03
So you re very clear about what the big purpose is as opposed to the small performance.
8
SPEAKER_01
Is there a worksheet or something that you have or a podcast that you can point to or is it in the book?
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, it s in the book.
8
SPEAKER_03
I talk about how to develop your purpose a lot on the Finding Mastery podcast, so it s part of tier zero conversations.
8
SPEAKER_03
I ll give you a way to practice it because most people, I don t know what you guys think, but most people that I know have a hard time imagining what their purpose could be.
8
SPEAKER_03
It feels too big.
8
SPEAKER_03
And that s because as a young kid, our elders are talking about performance as opposed to purpose.
8
SPEAKER_03
So we re unpracticed with the idea of purpose.
8
SPEAKER_03
So here s a way that you can begin to practice it.
8
SPEAKER_03
Today, what is my purpose?
8
SPEAKER_03
So you thin slice the activity.
8
SPEAKER_03
You can get your head around my purpose for today.
8
SPEAKER_03
And then you practice that enough, you re practicing the skill of setting a purpose, and then you think, okay, let me make it a little bigger.
8
SPEAKER_03
What is my purpose for this month?
8
SPEAKER_03
What is my purpose for this quarter?
8
SPEAKER_03
What s my purpose for this year?
8
SPEAKER_03
And then before you know it, like underneath what s happening is you re starting to tune to what could be my purpose.
8
SPEAKER_03
And there s three legs to purpose.
8
SPEAKER_03
Nobody can give it to you.
8
SPEAKER_03
It has to matter to you.
8
SPEAKER_03
That s a leg.
8
SPEAKER_03
Number one.
8
SPEAKER_03
Number two, it has to be bigger than you.
8
SPEAKER_03
Number three, it has to have a future orientation.
8
SPEAKER_03
So it s down the road.
8
SPEAKER_03
You can t solve it right now.
8
SPEAKER_03
So purpose, again, it matters.
8
SPEAKER_03
It has personal meaning, it s bigger than you, and it s time bound in a way that it can t be solved right now.
8
SPEAKER_02
Can I ask you something strange, but I think this could be applicable to a lot of people.
8
SPEAKER_03
The weirder, the better.
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
8
SPEAKER_02
Could your big purpose be telling yourself that you re a great father?
8
SPEAKER_02
And let me give you an example.
8
SPEAKER_02
If my big purpose is my great father and as a great father, what I do is take care of myself and stay in shape so I can pick up my kids.
8
SPEAKER_02
And as a great father, I run a successful business so that I can support my family.
8
SPEAKER_02
And as a great father,
8
SPEAKER_02
I speak to my kids calmly and with love. 
8
SPEAKER_02
Could that purpose, even though it s small, could you attach things to that thing as characteristics to make it bigger than just saying, I m a good dad?
8
SPEAKER_02
You re on it.
8
SPEAKER_00
I didn t hear the word wife.
8
SPEAKER_02
The purpose is to be a good dad.
8
SPEAKER_00
Where s the word wife?
8
SPEAKER_02
I didn t hear the whole point.
8
SPEAKER_02
Do you want to redo that?
8
SPEAKER_02
Okay, so I ll give you another one.
8
SPEAKER_02
If you re saying, I m a great husband, then part of that would again be, I speak to my wife this way, or I care for her this way, or I take care of myself to stay in shape.
8
SPEAKER_02
Meaning, I think sometimes people get overwhelmed, and I ve done this for sure, where they say their purpose is I ve got to be the next Jeff Bezos.
8
SPEAKER_02
And that s just like,
8
SPEAKER_02
maybe so crazy or I got to be the next crazy performing athlete, but I think... I wouldn t call those purposes.
8
SPEAKER_03
Okay.
8
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
8
SPEAKER_03
So those sound like goals, you know, and you re on the right path because you ve got this idea and then the rest of your life is organizing to be about that idea.
8
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
8
SPEAKER_02
Meaning I don t wake up and say, like, my purpose is not the business.
8
SPEAKER_01
Does that make sense?
8
SPEAKER_01
So what s a work purpose or is that not a big enough purpose?
8
SPEAKER_02
No, what I m saying is like, if I package the purpose into like, say, I want to be a great father, some of the, all of the other stuff in my life kind of fits into that, being able to support that bigger purpose because it s a future thing that I want to be able to look back in my life and say, oh, I did that thing well.
8
SPEAKER_02
And the other things serve that bigger thing, but it s not, it s not like I want to go and be an athlete or I want to go and be.
8
SPEAKER_03
Those are not purposes.
8
SPEAKER_03
And you re still kind of tuned to a goal.
8
SPEAKER_03
Like I want to be a great dad is more of a goal than a purpose, but the, the structure
9
SPEAKER_01
of what you have is working.
9
SPEAKER_01
So the structure is I ve got this idea and I m going to layer in how I organize my life for that idea.
9
SPEAKER_01
Be a great dad, fill in the blanks.
9
SPEAKER_01
But a purpose, so it matters to you.
9
SPEAKER_01
There s a time horizon, meaning that you can t do it today.
9
SPEAKER_01
It s like it s the life of yourself or your son or daughters.
9
SPEAKER_01
But where it s not quite squaring is like it s bigger than me.
9
SPEAKER_01
It s about somebody else.
9
SPEAKER_01
But I would press to say, why be a great parent?
9
SPEAKER_01
Why be a great partner?
9
SPEAKER_01
What is the thing that sits on top of that?
9
SPEAKER_00
So it could be the greater purpose, be you re setting an example for future generations to model that behavior.
9
SPEAKER_00
And so you don t want someone to look back and be like, if you re not those things, then all of those other- Or you re breaking the cycle of how your past family did things.
9
SPEAKER_00
But anyways, the reason I bring it up is I think sometimes when people hear about their purpose, they attach like a material or goal element to it.
9
SPEAKER_00
And I think sometimes that can be unhealthy and maybe derail people from finding their true purpose.
9
SPEAKER_01
You re on it.
9
SPEAKER_01
I would not square.
9
SPEAKER_01
It s easy to think about the difference between a goal and a purpose.
9
SPEAKER_01
In my mind, they re worlds apart.
9
SPEAKER_01
Sure.
9
SPEAKER_01
A goal is pretty transactional.
9
SPEAKER_01
A mission is like action oriented that is like, I m going to go get that thing.
9
SPEAKER_01
A goal is what will support the mission.
9
SPEAKER_01
But the bigger thing we re talking about is purpose.
9
SPEAKER_01
What is the deep why?
9
SPEAKER_01
What is the thing that you are really committed to that is not transactional?
9
SPEAKER_01
So my purpose is to help people live in the present moment more often.
9
SPEAKER_01
That s it.
9
SPEAKER_01
And so how am I going to go about it?
9
SPEAKER_01
I m going to use this beautiful science and art of psychology and the best practices of the best in the world and translate them for the rest of us.
9
SPEAKER_01
And that for me helps to create a rising tide where we are all better.
9
SPEAKER_01
So notice that s my purpose is to help people live in the present moment.
9
SPEAKER_01
What s my vision?
9
SPEAKER_01
It s kind of guiding the whole thing.
9
SPEAKER_01
It s a world where people are flourishing.
9
SPEAKER_01
And I don t want to be Pollyannish about it at all, but the worlds that I m in, I want to make an impact where we are better.
9
SPEAKER_01
And so my mission, not to be too confusing here, is one in five people in every environment I m in.
9
SPEAKER_01
If I can reach one in five, I know that according to good science, we can create a critical mass.
9
SPEAKER_01
We can create some disruption.
9
SPEAKER_01
If we have one in five people that are about it, like really about
9
SPEAKER_01
being their very best or being better or adding to the center, now we can create a disruptive factor to be better.
9
SPEAKER_01
So I don t know if that, you might need to rewind some of that.
9
SPEAKER_00
No, that helped me a lot.
9
SPEAKER_00
No, no, it helped a lot because I think sometimes people get the goal and the purpose confused and mixed up.
9
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, and it is, I would never get in the way if you say my purpose is to be a great parent.
9
SPEAKER_01
Epic, like that is awesome.
9
SPEAKER_01
So I think though that when you do that, your grand purpose, you re excluding your bride.
9
SPEAKER_00
No, no, I was just using that as an example of could it be something like that.
9
SPEAKER_01
It could be, absolutely, yeah.
9
SPEAKER_01
Purposes do not have to do with yourself alone.
9
SPEAKER_01
It s either like better for another, better for the planet, it s better for others or animals.
9
SPEAKER_01
Those are kind of the three things that hum around purpose.
9
SPEAKER_03
The first rule of mastery is stop worrying about what people think of you.
9
SPEAKER_03
I m going to guess that the next time you ll be on this podcast, there ll be the second rule of mastery.
9
SPEAKER_01
Let s do it before that.
9
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
9
SPEAKER_03
Let s do it before that.
9
SPEAKER_03
You guys, I m so excited for everyone to go by this book.
9
SPEAKER_03
Tell us where it s available, where they can find you, where they can stalk you on Instagram, all the things.
9
SPEAKER_01
Thank you.
9
SPEAKER_01
I love the conversations with you guys.
9
SPEAKER_01
We always have fun.
9
SPEAKER_01
So thank you.
9
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
9
SPEAKER_01
You never know where it s going to go.
9
SPEAKER_01
Some rabbit holes.
9
SPEAKER_01
Findingmastery.com is the website.
9
SPEAKER_01
The Finding Mastery podcast is where- Great podcast.
9
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, thank you.
9
SPEAKER_01
Where I spend most of my time and the book is sold everywhere.
9
SPEAKER_01
Local bookstores are really cool and we ve got a little assessment online and if you want to see if you have FOPO, you can go to the website and we ve got a free assessment there as well.
9
SPEAKER_03
Cute.
9
SPEAKER_03
I m going to do that.
9
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, that s fine.
9
SPEAKER_03
And I need you to sign my book.
9
SPEAKER_01
Love to.
9
SPEAKER_03
Michael, thank you for coming on the podcast.
9
SPEAKER_03
We appreciate you.
9
SPEAKER_03
Thank you.
9
SPEAKER_01
Come back anytime, man.
9
SPEAKER_01
Thank you.
9
SPEAKER_02
We have launched a newsletter.
9
SPEAKER_02
Every single tip on this newsletter is applicable.
9
SPEAKER_02
It s a him and her newsletter.
9
SPEAKER_02
You get it weekly.
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Everything is stuff Michael and I have just been obsessed with, like all the things.
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Anything from relationship tips to finance tips from Michael to how to be successful in your habits, all in one newsletter once a week.
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And also, we do a monthly favorite roundup of all of our favorite products.
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All you have to do to sign up is go to tscpodcast.com and subscribe and our newsletter will come straight to your inbox.
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Thanks so much for the support.
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I hope you love this episode with Michael.