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My name is Lee Hawkins.
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I ve been a journalist for over 25 years.
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On my new podcast, What Happened in Alabama, I get answers to some of the hardest questions about how things came to be for many black Americans and the truth that must come before any reconciliation can happen.
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I investigate my family history, my upbringing in Minnesota, and my father s painful nightmares about growing up in Alabama.
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What Happened in Alabama is a new series confronting the cycles of trauma for myself, my family, and for many Black Americans.
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Listen now.
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Jamila, it s just going to be me and you, and everyone will be listening.
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OK.
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Ready?
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This is Don t Ask Tig.
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I m Tig Notaro.
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Here today is Jamila Jamil.
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You ve seen her on The Good Place and she has her own podcast, I Weigh.
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Hi, Jamila.
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Hello, how are you?
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I m good.
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Thank you so much for coming today.
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No, I m a I m a massive fan and big friend.
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So I the pleasure and honor is all mine.
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Oh, well, the feeling is mutual.
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And I think that there s gonna be a lot of people thrilled that you re making an appearance on here.
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You
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You very famously got your role on The Good Place with almost no acting experience.
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Would you say that takes a lot of confidence?
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What does that take?
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I think it takes shamelessness.
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I think it takes my fundamental belief system of thinking that failure is cool.
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And I have had this belief system for like 15 years where I just think
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the only true failure that really exists is not trying at all.
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I think when you take a risk on something where success isn t guaranteed, I honestly look at it as a heroic act.
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I like your style.
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And do you have any, do you have any advice for people that might be wanting to take a big leap to do that sort of maybe their own version of what you ve done?
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Yeah, I think it s really important to just look at life as one giant bucket, you know, really, we get one shot at this, not to quote Eminem, for too much of this podcast.
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But I think that it s really important to remember that, that fear should never navigate any of your decisions in life, it s really important that you don t let it do so.
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And it s really important that you don t allow the fear and projections of other people
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to navigate your decisions because a lot of people are just fear-mongering us because either they re afraid for us, or they have put too much importance upon the shame of failure, or they don t want to see you succeed.
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at a risk you re taking, because then that will make them feel like shit about all the risks they didn t take in life.
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If you go out there and win, like so many people told me not to move to America.
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So I mean, I d say 99% of the people when I was 28, I was at the top of
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my career in Britain, and I was just going to leave the whole thing behind and just start afresh in a much bigger country where no one knew who I was, where I was pushing 30, I was not a size zero, and I am South Asian, and there are what, five South Asians in mainstream media at the moment in the United States?
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Exactly five, yes.
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So I was told by everyone that I ll disappear without a trace.
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And I was like, at least I won t be haunted by truly two of my most hated words when put together in the English language, which is, what if.
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Don t be haunted.
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Those words, the sting never dies off of regret.
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And I only regret the things in life that I don t do.
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Yes.
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And I try very much to live my life similarly.
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And I ve always said,
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when people ask if I have regrets, because I do fully believe that every step has led me exactly here, and I m more than happy to be exactly where I am in life.
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I did realize recently that I do have one regret, and it s I wish I had never smoked a cigarette in my life.
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I bet you looked so cool while you were smoking.
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Just kidding.
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I have to say, I did look really cool.
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You know, it is crazy that that is exactly the only reason people start smoking.
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Yeah, because it tastes disgusting.
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It s the only thing.
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I got bullied at school for refusing to smoke.
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People bullied me at school.
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So that s how intense we were in the 90s about smoking.
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It was just like, well, you re never going to read Kate Moss.
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Oh my gosh, it was even more so in the 80s.
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Anyway, I really.
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Yeah.
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Now, this episode is going to be our first episode in the new year.
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And are you somebody that does resolutions or anything like that?
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Or do you?
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Yeah, but my resolution is always the same to continue to get better at the word no.
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You know, just to use the word no more times this year than I used it last year.
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I don t believe in new year, new you.
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I believe in new year, happier you.
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more honest you, real you, you know?
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It sounds like you do a lot of no s and yes s based on what you were just talking about before.
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You have to say yes to a lot of things and you re also saying you got to say no to a lot of things.
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But also you have to say a lot more no s, I believe, in life to have the opportunity to say yes to the right things.
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You know, I have to turn down the fear mongering of my team where it s like, if you miss this opportunity, and I m like, I just don t think it s going to be very fun or interesting for me.
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Or I say no to toxic people because they drown my mind in toxicity and in all of their bullshit.
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And then I don t have the clarity of mind to make good intuitive decisions.
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Right.
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And I wasn t always like this.
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I think I became like this at 19 and I ve just never looked back.
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What changed at 19?
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Because it seems like you have such crazy clarity.
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I was hit by a car into another car and broke my back.
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And I just think everyone should be hit by a car into another car as a teenager.
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Listen,
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Okay as a teenager, I ll tell you something.
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Yeah one time I was sitting at a red light and there was this woman that was 9,000 years old in a car next to me and I happened to be looking at her when I saw her get rear-ended and I saw her poor little old head slam into the into the steering wheel and I thought
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Oh, she was she was probably days or weeks away from getting out of this lifetime.
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What on earth did she need that for?
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No, that s that s totally inappropriate.
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Yeah, no, I think when you can bounce back and obviously, I m being very flippant and tongue in cheek here.
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I m not being literal to anyone who, who is on Twitter, who s listening to this right now.
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But what it did is it woke me up.
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I was 17 when I got hit, but then I was stoned on morphine for like a year and a half.
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And it wasn t until I was kind of almost 19, starting to reemerge, and I had this kind of existential awakening about how I was going to live my life and that I was suddenly so
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horrifyingly aware, in a way that you never get to be that young, or so rarely get to be that young, of how easily life can just be taken away from you, how fast everything can be taken away from you.
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It slips away.
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And this year, I think, was a huge example of that for everyone, of like, Christ, the whole world stopped turning, and everyone lost all of the things that we had become so complacent about just having access to.
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And so I felt way less shell-shocked by 2020 than I think a lot of my peers, because it s kind of happened to me just in my own personal space before.
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And so I think after that, I left with what I hope other people leave last year with, which is a, fuck, we just don t know how much time we have.
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Run at what you want.
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Run at happiness.
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Get off the fucking
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treadmill and the rat race of life and actually do what you re going to look back on with joy.
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Because I think a lot of people looked back on their lives last year with regret of what was quote unquote normal.
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Was that good for me?
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Was I happy?
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Did I spend enough time with my friends and family who I now desperately miss?
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What did I do it all for?
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I think that there s a lot of existential crisis that came out of 2020.
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And I hope that people channel it into a positive direction this year.
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We re in a new year.
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This is a fresh start.
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and let s let s let s throw everything at our mental health every money every bit of money you were going to spend on cellulite removal cream which doesn t work anti-aging cream doesn t work and so offensive uh i beg to differ i use all of those creams and they have really made a difference in my cellulite and my anti-aging so what you re looking at right now
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It s all thanks to those creams, all of my beauty creams.
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If you want to know about my beauty regimen, I am here to discuss it.
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Great.
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Well, aside from TIG and Pharrell Williams.
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I say throw all of your money at beauty creams.
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Okay.
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Okay.
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Well, controversially, I disagree.
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And I think you should spend all that money if you have it on therapy.
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Honestly, therapy and good times.
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Look, I have spent a lot of money on therapy since I was about 17 years old.
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And I just had to finally make that switch to beauty creams.
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And it worked, look at how successful you are.
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Look at me, I will be 50 in March and I do not look anything but my age.
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You re barely pubescent, barely.
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Now, Jamila, The Good Place taught a lot of people about ethics.
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Yeah.
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And do you feel like you learned more about how to be a good person?
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on that show or have you just been nailing it since you were 19?
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No, I ll never nail it.
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I ll never nail being a good person because I ll always be untangling my own trauma, internalized bullshit, internalized misogyny, internalized bitterness.
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perfection is death, you know, there s nothing further to learn once you get there.
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And so no, of course, I will, I will, I don t think I ever have been or ever will be, I always refer to myself as a feminist in progress, because I believe that we are always in progress, and the world is always updating.
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And if we re not going to be open to that, then truly, what s the point of life?
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I, you know, I have always felt very thankful for my mother would tell me if anyone has a problem with me, or with what I want to do, tell them to go to hell.
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And I have carried that
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vibe with me.
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Yeah.
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Belief system and vibe and people are always like, why are you how come what, you know, looking at me with confusion with moments in life that should have maybe gotten a different reaction from me.
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And I m always like, look, I was raised by somebody that told me to tell everyone to go to hell.
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And so yeah, it s, it s something that I m forever grateful for.
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100%.
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And, you know, for me,
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It s not possible.
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So why try to please or be approved of or be believed or understood by anyone when at the end of the day, even if you live your life so perfectly, and I know so many women who do, people will still find fault with you.
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And if anything, look at like Taylor Swift or even, you know, I mean, co-stars I ve had, like when they live this perfect existence, people say that they find them annoying.
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because they re too good.
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They re too much of a good girl, a goody two-shoes, too much of a perfectionist.
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It s grating, you know?
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So you can t win as a woman, so why f***ing try?
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I m just not playing the game anymore.
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Look, I like that you think Taylor Swift is perfect because we are once again aligned, me and you, all right?
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Well, we have a lot of people that are waiting to learn a lot from you.
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And we have some, we have some questions to get into from our listeners.
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Are you ready?
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Oh, so ready.
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All right.
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The first question comes from Grace.
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Grace asks, I have a nemesis.
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We work in the same field.
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She overcharges and underpays and she threatens and spies on her employees.
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Most of the time I never think about her and just on my own life, but sometimes I fantasize about bringing her down.
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Should I be the bigger person and just move on or should I destroy her?
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Destroy, destroy her.
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I don t believe in being the bigger person.
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I believe in being the smaller person.
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I honestly think that my health suffered tremendously from my obsession with trying to rise above.
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I realized that rising above is just an abusive tactic taught to us by people who want to be able to make us eat shit and then feel somehow good about ourselves and smug for just swallowing it.
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And so I fundamentally disagree.
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Report her to HR, take her down.
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I m a Patan, which means that I come from a part of the mountains where one of the most fundamental definitive traits of my tribe is that we live for revenge.
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And so get it out of your system.
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Don t swallow it.
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It ll turn into some sort of terrible autoimmune disease otherwise.
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I am on your side, call HR, deal with this.
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What about our industry where there isn t an HR?
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What if somebody s working in a world where there is no HR?
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And how do you?
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I think there are HRs now in our industry.
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I just got a very, very powerful man fired from a huge network for legal reasons I can t talk about.
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But I found him to be very, very toxic and abusive and disturbing and reported him.
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And I m sure I ve now risked my relationship with that company going forward.
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And it was not an easy process.
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But I refuse to just tolerate bad behavior because it reminds me of school.
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It reminds me of all the shit that I ate at school from other people because I thought I was supposed to.
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But what are you asking us in between acting or between comics?
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Oh, yeah, all of that.
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I mean, I ve certainly spoken up about people and, and risked my safety, whatever that is in my career, to speak out about people or on topics.
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But I m just,
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There are people out there that are very powerful, that are very much in control of a lot.
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And then you, you have people that are scared to speak up or protect themselves.
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Totally, and look, and I have the upper hand, not only because now I am fairly powerful, not that powerful, but still I also don t care if I lose my job.
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I feel as though I m ready for any kind of twist and turn in life, and I don t ever put the importance of my happiness in any single thing outside of myself, be that career, be that a love, be that anything, thinness, et cetera.
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Where do you come from?
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Nobody speaks like this.
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I come from so much trauma, Tig, like such a terrible first 26 years that have just kind of morphed me into the Terminator, where I just keep coming back now.
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I personally just, I am my own fucking HR, as far as I m concerned.
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I just love hearing that.
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I think it s, you know, I feel very similarly.
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And like I said, I ve acted very similarly.
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And I think that it s good to for me and others to hear that because it s just it s tricky when somebody has an upper hand, and you feel
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Powerless.
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Powerless and mistreated beyond comprehension.
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And I remember when I did my TV show exposing the producer on the TV show for sexual assault and harassment, people were telling me,
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I would never work again.
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And I remember saying, then that is how it goes.
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But I know that what I m doing is true.
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And so that is where my power comes from is that I have gotten truth from victims.
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And that is where I stand and feel powerful moving forward with this.
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And if my career goes away that easily, then I was never firmly planted here in the first place.
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That s amazing.
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That s an amazing sentence.
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It feels as though more often than not, you do what the fuck you want.
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And I think that that s really important for people to see.
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And I despair of all of that.
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And it is pretty
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predominantly women, but also a lot of men, who make us feel weird for doing so.
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Because what we re doing isn t actually weird.
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It might feel new.
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The other stuff is the weird stuff.
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The other stuff is weird.
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It s insincere.
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It s dishonest.
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There is a dishonesty in tolerating bad behavior because you know it s bad, you know it hurts, and then you are smiling and kind of grinning and bearing it.
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that s a dishonest, unintegral thing to do.
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And please understand that that comes from no place that I m not judging your dishonesty.
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I understand that you may be in a situation where you can t get out or you rely on that job or you have to feed dependents.
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I get that.
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I m just saying that let s not treat the people who are looking for liberation at all costs
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as the odd ones out, let s look to them as reassurance that maybe it ll be okay if I also say no to this oppressive situation.
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Do you know what I mean?
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I do, and I just love you more and more.
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So I was gonna say, I hope that helps, but I feel like that will for sure help anybody and everybody listening.
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We are going to come back after the break with more questions.
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I m Ben Nadafafri, host of the history show The Last Archive, and I want to tell you about a new series we re running in our feed.
1
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It s called The Deadline, six essays written and read by Jill Lepore, the New Yorker writer, American historian, and founding host of our show.
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These are incredible essays on everything from the history of cryogenics to the Silicon Valley gospel of disruption.
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And at the end of each essay, I interview Jill about her craft as a writer.
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You can listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
1
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Jamila, this next question is what I call a hoo-boy.
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It s the messy ones, you know?
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Hoo-boy.
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Hoo-boy.
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All right, Trish writes, my boyfriend s a bad kisser.
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Everything else in the relationship is golden.
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Do I even bring this up?
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It s truly not a big deal for me, but I can t help but wonder if there s a solution.
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First of all, can you imagine after everything you ve said that your answer to this is just suck it up?
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Be grateful that you have the love of a man in this world.
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Yeah, no, tell him.
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I ve told people before that I don t like the way that they kiss and I think it s really important.
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I bet that turns them on.
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No, well, no, it s honestly like it s a choice, isn t it, right?
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It s like you might not find me a good kisser.
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Like we might just like have different kissing techniques.
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And so I ve said before to someone on a first date during the kiss, I was like,
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I m sorry, but I didn t enjoy that kiss.
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And I would like to enjoy the kisses more because I really enjoy you.
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And this is how I enjoy kissing.
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If you don t enjoy kissing the same, then we probably shouldn t do this.
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I m not going to tell you that you have to kiss like this in your life.
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But if you want to kiss me, then that s what I m going to need.
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And feel free to tell me what you would need.
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And it was awkward as, but then he rose to the challenge and I was very, very impressed.
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And then he became a very good kisser, almost instantly.
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So I say, have the conversation, be kind, be respectful of someone s pride.
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And just make sure that they know that, you know, it s their choice.
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If you would like to keep kissing me, you would just need to meet these requirements.
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And I don t know that I fully believe that Trish thinks it s not a big deal.
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And so I m a firm believer in the tip of the iceberg theory.
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And so if it even
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just that if it even surfaces, there s a whole triangle behind that tip, you know?
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And so, I think that for you to write in having an issue with this,
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Trish, I think you do have a problem with it.
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And so I do echo what Jamil is saying in that you should say something, but definitely be gentle about it.
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Because also maybe open up a conversation about maybe what you might
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Yeah, like what you could maybe do differently or better.
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Yeah.
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I end a lot of these questions with, let us know how you re doing, give us an update.
1
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And of course, I mean it, but I really mean it, Trish.
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Yeah.
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Let us know how this conversation went, because... I always refer to these sort of things as a shitmas test, you know?
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Just, I think it s really important.
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It s a good old shitness test.
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How s it gonna go?
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All right, well, keep us updated.
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And Jamila, do you consider yourself a good roommate?
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Yes, excellent, if I dare say so myself.
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Yeah, I am good.
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Why?
1
SPEAKER_01
Are we moving in?
1
SPEAKER_01
Are you inviting me to move in?
1
SPEAKER_02
I was going to see if you would like to live with me, Stephanie, our four and a half year old twins, my father-in-law who lives with us, and a cat and two new kittens.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yes, please.
1
SPEAKER_02
Thank you.
1
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, Stephanie will be thrilled because she is a huge fan of yours.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh, that s very kind.
1
SPEAKER_01
A huge fan.
1
SPEAKER_02
Very kind.
1
SPEAKER_02
What makes you a good roommate?
1
SPEAKER_01
It pertains to our next question.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay, I ve had very, very, very bad roommates before and I remember how oppressive and horrific that felt.
1
SPEAKER_01
There is something very specific about having someone in your personal living space who doesn t
1
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meet your needs or make you feel safe or who just isn t considerate.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think that traumatized me so early on.
1
SPEAKER_01
My first ever roommate used to get high and move all of my furniture onto the roof of our house and who used to piss out of our window that was on a pedestrian street on the second floor of the pedestrian street.
1
SPEAKER_01
So
1
SPEAKER_01
I lived with this maniac who would smoke crack until 7 a.m.
1
SPEAKER_01
with all of his friends, and I had a job that was on live television early.
1
SPEAKER_01
And so I think I became obsessed with never being spoken about like that roommate.
1
SPEAKER_01
And so I m very considerate.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m very careful of other people s feelings.
1
SPEAKER_01
I love giving space, and I like cooking for people.
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SPEAKER_01
I m buying food.
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SPEAKER_02
I think you should move in.
1
SPEAKER_02
I m gonna talk to Stephanie about this.
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SPEAKER_02
I m very excited.
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, yeah, I m asking because Katie asks,
1
SPEAKER_02
I live with a 40 something dude and he laughs like a hyena and sneezes so loud.
1
SPEAKER_02
I feel bad telling him to shut it down because the laugh is obviously joyful and I don t know if he can control his sneeze volume.
1
SPEAKER_02
I m considering moving out, please advise.
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, first of all, Katie, you have written into somebody who sneezes louder than probably your roommate.
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SPEAKER_02
And I have to explain to people,
1
SPEAKER_02
If I tried to suppress it, my brains would come out of my ears and I don t even know what I would do.
1
SPEAKER_02
It s not possible.
1
SPEAKER_02
I cannot suppress my sneeze.
1
SPEAKER_01
I see your bad sneeze and I raise you the fact that I get no warning before my sneeze.
1
SPEAKER_01
I don t know what is I don t know what s wrong with my nervous system.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I sneeze Massively and out of out of nowhere so suddenly that I then scare myself So I sneeze and then I scream which is the absolute worst I have like it s like the bowser level of bad sneezes.
1
SPEAKER_01
Also, how much do you scare yourself?
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, no, I literally start on myself and then scream
1
SPEAKER_02
Katie would have no patience for you.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I feel like the I feel like you re probably not crazy about this guy on other levels because you start out by saying I live with a 40 something dude.
1
SPEAKER_02
I ve lived, I used to live with four guys in a house when we were all just touring stand-ups, and that was our crash pad in Venice.
1
SPEAKER_02
I wouldn t call any of them 40-something or 30-something dudes.
1
SPEAKER_02
I was close to them and I had relationships with each of them.
1
SPEAKER_02
They irritated me as I irritated them in all of our different ways, but it sounds like you don t really like this guy maybe.
1
SPEAKER_01
There were no redeeming qualities at all in the letter.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, and I think I can I mean Yeah, if you don t like someone then they re joyful annoying laugh.
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SPEAKER_02
It s not gonna be okay And they re sneeze.
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I mean, there s just there s no way around it whereas if you cared about somebody you might tease them about their laugh or you might There might just be more of a dialogue around the sneezing or the laughing I
1
SPEAKER_01
also like your home is your haven.
1
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And so it sounds like you need to get out as soon as possible.
1
SPEAKER_01
I know we ve been in lockdown for over a year, but almost a year.
1
SPEAKER_01
But I would say that it is it is imperative to your mental stability, that your home, your your house and your home is a place of peace, tranquility and safety.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know what I mean?
1
SPEAKER_01
I know exactly what you mean.
1
SPEAKER_01
No one needs to be annoyed in their own house.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m annoyed enough being out in the world.
1
SPEAKER_01
I need to come home and finally get a rest from being so annoyed all the time.
1
SPEAKER_02
And as much as I loved my four roommate guys in that house, I remember going to do laundry, and I reached up to take the bottle of bleach off of the washer and dryer,
1
SPEAKER_02
and somebody hadn t put the cap on top of the blue top.
1
SPEAKER_02
And it went all over me and ruined a shirt and jeans that I loved.
1
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And I kid you not.
1
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I put the cap on the bleach and I walked right into my bedroom and I started looking for apartments to live by myself.
1
SPEAKER_02
And that was the end of that for me.
1
SPEAKER_02
I was Googling two minutes later, because I just thought, I cannot complain about this.
1
SPEAKER_02
I cannot bring this to anyone s attention.
1
SPEAKER_02
It is time to move out.
1
SPEAKER_02
A hundred percent.
1
SPEAKER_01
Are you a clean person or a messy person?
1
SPEAKER_01
I m a clean person.
1
SPEAKER_01
I am horrendously messy, but I keep all of my mess only to my own space, sort of like a raccoon.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s so interesting that you re a messy person.
1
SPEAKER_02
Why?
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, I have to say, the secret s kind of out because I can see behind you and it looks a little disorganized on those shelves.
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, this is my boyfriend s studio, to be fair.
1
SPEAKER_01
He s also a messy person.
1
SPEAKER_01
And we similarly keep our mess only to our bedroom.
1
SPEAKER_01
So the rest of our house is fairly neat.
1
SPEAKER_01
But our bedroom is just, I mean, we would win some sort of student award for the floor drobe, you know, we re just but if there s something very comforting about finding someone who not only judges you, but thrive similarly to you in our own like disorganized childlike chaos.
1
SPEAKER_01
And yeah, I live enough a clear enough life in my head, I need some chaos.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it s in my, my bedroom.
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, that s the thing is you have such razor sharp precision with everything you re thinking and saying and then it s just hilarious to think that you are a pagan.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yes, so Katie.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, get out.
1
SPEAKER_02
Move out of there.
1
SPEAKER_02
Go start your Google search for your own apartment or find right now.
1
SPEAKER_02
Right this second.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, right now.
1
SPEAKER_02
Right now.
1
SPEAKER_02
All right, Jamila.
1
SPEAKER_02
Here s our last listener question.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_02
It comes from charity.
1
SPEAKER_02
Over the last few years, I have had major health problems.
1
SPEAKER_02
I m 39 and sometimes now need a cane.
1
SPEAKER_02
I have a gigantic scar running vertically down my torso.
1
SPEAKER_02
I m single and terrified to attempt to date.
1
SPEAKER_02
I am proud of what I ve overcome, but do you have any advice about getting over my intense fear of being rejected because of my health or my scars?
1
SPEAKER_02
Well, Charity, if you re at all familiar with me, you might know that I ve had some health issues and I have my share of scars.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I completely feel you on this because I remember
1
SPEAKER_02
Even before I had scars, when I started to learn that I had different illnesses, I was so scared to share that information because I was scared I would lose work.
1
SPEAKER_02
I was scared, frankly, I was scared I was going to die.
1
SPEAKER_02
And then living through everything,
1
SPEAKER_02
I then had fear that I was going to be unattractive with scars.
1
SPEAKER_02
I didn t know I would think, oh, how am I going to share this when somebody sees my body?
1
SPEAKER_02
And, you know, oddly,
1
SPEAKER_02
The people that I was attracting found scars cool and sexy, including Stephanie.
1
SPEAKER_02
Scars just represent healing.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I would slowly start to get yourself out there.
1
SPEAKER_02
If you re asking this question, then it sounds like you re ready to check it out.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I just can t imagine somebody s gonna go running from you.
1
SPEAKER_01
No, and if they do, they re the wrong person.
1
SPEAKER_01
I ve had health problems since I was born.
1
SPEAKER_01
I have a condition called Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome.
1
SPEAKER_01
I ve also struggled in my life with tumors and cancer.
1
SPEAKER_01
I have scars across my breasts that my current boyfriend told me he loves, because they mean I m still alive.
1
SPEAKER_01
And this condition I have is a lack of collagen in my body, which means that it impacts every single cell in my entire body, old and new.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it means that my heart doesn t work properly, my kidneys, my skin gets scarred so easily.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m constantly in pain.
1
SPEAKER_01
I swell to twice my size all the time.
1
SPEAKER_01
I am not an easy person to, I m not a completely easy person to be able to care for.
1
SPEAKER_01
And in a partner, I need someone who s willing to care for me.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I only, I consider it,
1
SPEAKER_01
my right to only date someone who s willing to take that on with love.
1
SPEAKER_01
And in other ways, I will be able to emotionally support them or maybe care for them.
1
SPEAKER_01
Another thing I want to say is that I think it s imperative that people do not enter any situation with shame.
1
SPEAKER_01
When you are going through something that is harder than most other people, you re a fucking hero.
1
SPEAKER_01
And go and get the love that you deserve from someone who is worthy of it.
1
SPEAKER_01
and someone who will not look after you or who finds that unattractive is weak, shallow, and boring.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think.
1
SPEAKER_01
Jamila.
1
SPEAKER_02
Jamila.
1
SPEAKER_02
Tig.
1
SPEAKER_02
I can t get over you.
1
SPEAKER_02
I can t get over you.
1
SPEAKER_01
You won t let me live with you now because I told you I m messy.
1
SPEAKER_02
No, I m going to put, I m going to extend my house.
1
SPEAKER_02
You know, we ve been talking about putting a guest house over the garage.
1
SPEAKER_02
Perfect.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I ll just shove you in there with just a bunch of dirty laundry and, you know, old spoons or whatever.
1
SPEAKER_02
I don t know what you enjoy having around you.
1
SPEAKER_02
I fucking love an old fork.
1
SPEAKER_01
books buried everywhere in my house.
1
SPEAKER_01
It s like an Easter egg hunt.
1
SPEAKER_01
It s insane.
1
SPEAKER_02
I just want to say, I m sure that meant so much to Charity to hear.
1
SPEAKER_02
But I have to tell you, it meant so much for me to hear that from you.
1
SPEAKER_02
Because I, you know, I,
1
SPEAKER_02
We forget.
1
SPEAKER_01
We forget.
1
SPEAKER_01
The shame chips away at us.
1
SPEAKER_01
And because not enough of us talk about our health struggles because of the stigma and taboo about it and the fact that we never see disability as something sexual or sexy or desirable.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, look at fucking the crisis that is Hollywood.
1
SPEAKER_01
It is erasure.
1
SPEAKER_01
It is a lie that most of us are not walking around with some sort of chronic psoriasis or eczema or stomach problems or this, that and the other.
1
SPEAKER_01
Or maybe even a mental health problem.
1
SPEAKER_01
We re all suffering and we re not talking about it, and then it makes us feel alone in our struggle, and then it makes us less likely to put ourselves out there.
1
SPEAKER_01
Put yourself out there.
1
SPEAKER_01
You never know who you re going to find.
1
SPEAKER_01
I never thought that a 26-year-old front man, Grammy-winning musician, was ever going to want to take someone on, like me, who had so many extra caveats of patience that I would require.
1
SPEAKER_01
I never thought that he who could have all these like, you know, completely able bodied Victoria s Secret models would want someone like me.
1
SPEAKER_01
But, but over time, I like very quickly, I was determined to find my confidence that no, I can deserve this.
1
SPEAKER_01
And, and my, the person I have built myself into, but is reward enough for, you know, some of the patience that is required in order to, to live with me.
1
SPEAKER_01
Now, have I mentioned how much I love
2
SPEAKER_02
you.
2
SPEAKER_02
Oh, no, you haven t.
2
SPEAKER_02
But I think we should talk about it in at length.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, I know you have to leave you have to get on a flight.
2
SPEAKER_02
But I know I could I could hear this.
2
SPEAKER_02
No, no, I could take this.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, I just am so genuinely floored by you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I m so thankful for your brain and your mouth and your actions.
2
SPEAKER_01
And, um,
2
SPEAKER_01
I just can t thank you enough for coming on here and sharing with me and everyone, and I really have had such a unique experience today.
2
SPEAKER_01
I m just absorbing everything you re saying and feeling just inspired and powerful from
2
SPEAKER_01
from you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so thank you.
2
SPEAKER_02
Thank you very much.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I ll go tell Stephanie to, I was gonna say clean up the garage, but I guess just leave it as it is.
2
SPEAKER_01
All right.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, thank you again.
2
SPEAKER_01
And do you have anything you d like to plug before we leave?
2
SPEAKER_02
My podcast it s called I weigh with Jamila Jamil and you know if you can tolerate my bad language Probably don t listen to it with very small kids in the car.
2
SPEAKER_02
Although they re secretly saying these things behind your back anyway I hope that you join me on my ever like Ever-extending learning journey and we can all learn together.
2
SPEAKER_02
So that s it.
2
SPEAKER_02
Other than that.
2
SPEAKER_02
Thanks.
2
SPEAKER_01
Wonderful.
2
SPEAKER_01
Thank you Bye everyone.
2
SPEAKER_02
Bye
2
SPEAKER_01
Don t Ask Tig is hosted by me, Tig Notaro.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s produced by Thomas Ouellette, Mary Knoth, and Tracy Mumford.
2
SPEAKER_01
Our editor is Phyllis Fletcher, executive producer Lauren Dee, engineering and sound mixing by Eric Romani, digital production by Christina Lopez.
2
SPEAKER_01
Talent Booking by Marianne Ways, Production Assistance by Nancy Hsu.
2
SPEAKER_01
Our theme music is Friend in Tig by Edie Burkell and Kyle Crusham, and Listen to Your Heart by Edie Burkell.
2
SPEAKER_01
Special thanks to Hunter Seidman, Lily Kim, and Alex Schaffert.
2
SPEAKER_01
Our executive consultant is Dean Capello and Gobsmack Studios.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can always ask for advice at DontAskTig.org.
2
SPEAKER_01
Just write in with your problem or send us a voice memo.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can also follow us on social media at DontAskTig.
2
SPEAKER_01
DontAskTig is a production of American Public Media.
2
SPEAKER_01
And as always, thanks, Dana, and I ll tell Becky.
2
SPEAKER_01
Hi, I m stand-up comedian and sex symbol Tig Notaro.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I m actor and writer Cheryl Hines.
2
SPEAKER_01
Before Cheryl and I got into the big business of podcasting together, we were just simply friends.
2
SPEAKER_00
And we re still friends.
2
SPEAKER_00
But now we talk about a different documentary every week on our podcast, Tig and Cheryl, True Story.
2
SPEAKER_00
So whether you love documentaries or just want to hear us slowly lose our minds, check out Tig and Cheryl, True Story, wherever you get your podcasts.
2
SPEAKER_01
Alright, cool.