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The following podcast is a Dear Media production.
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Hello, everybody.
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Happy New Year.
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Welcome to the Him and Her Show.
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Some quick announcements to kick off the year.
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Lauren and I will be switching to a Monday, Wednesday, Friday cadence.
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I know that sounds like a lot of content, but hear me out.
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First, we re going to keep regular programming on Monday and we re going to switch the Thursday episode that s typically an interview or a long format episode to Wednesday.
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Now, the Friday episode will be a little bit different.
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Lorne and I over the years have got so many requests to do all sorts of different topics and solo episodes, but some of these topics are just not full-length episodes.
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It doesn t mean we don t want to address the topic or the issue or the idea.
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So we thought it d be interesting to leave Friday open for bite-sized episodes, think eight to 12 to 15 minutes, shorter episodes on very specific ideas or bonus episodes that if we have a phenomenal guest or we want to do a different solo,
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This is just going to free up some more space so that we can get some of these quicker bite-sized ideas to you and not have to interrupt regular programming.
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So look out for the new schedule, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, the Friday episodes will be a little bit shorter, more bite-sized content.
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If you have any specific requests or topics you d like us to cover, kind of getting back to our roots on how this show started, be sure to write us in, go to the TSC podcast website and just shoot us a message or DM us and we ll be sure to try to cover any topics that you guys are interested in.
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Second announcement, Lauren and I have a brand new show coming out called The Morning Quickie.
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Not to confuse everybody, it s going to be a completely separate show.
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You re going to have to follow or subscribe to that.
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What The Morning Quickie is, is we have had close to 700 episodes at this point for close to seven or eight years.
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I don t even know how long it s been, since 2016.
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Many new listeners, I think, would still benefit from some of the evergreen content with some of the amazing guests that we ve had on the show or some of the ideas that we ve shared.
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But it s hard for people to go back and listen to every single episode.
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So we ve had the team start pulling some of the most meaningful moments of the history of this show.
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Think bite-sized clips that you can get three to five minutes, seven minutes, whatever it may be from past episodes to remind you of very prolific or inspiring or exciting ideas that guests have shared.
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And if you check out our YouTube channel, that ll be there as well.
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So you can check out the Morning Quickie episodes on the Skinny Confidential YouTube channel.
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Check it out.
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It s going to be a daily show.
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It s called The Morning Quickie.
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You can go subscribe to it now.
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We re going to drop the trailer so you can listen to it.
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So check it out.
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The following is a Dear Media production.
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It s Lauren Bostick and Michael Bostick.
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And this is The Morning Quickie, a new type of daily show.
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Presented by the skinny confidential him and her show where we bring you micro takeaways from over five years and things that we ve learned from interviewing over 600 of the most successful people in the world.
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And we re sharing them all with you every single day.
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You don t want to miss this.
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Think daily bites delivered right to you to save you time.
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It s kind of like a bag of Chex Mix.
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You never know what you re going to get.
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Enjoy that morning quickie.
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She s a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire.
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Fantastic.
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And he s a serial entrepreneur.
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A very smart cookie.
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And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostick are bringing you along for the ride.
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Get ready for some major realness.
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Welcome to The Skinny Confidential, him and her.
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Aha!
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Our brain is a super cue reader.
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Like we have this superpower.
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Like if I could tell people, you have a superpower, all you have to do is name it.
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We ve been taught to ignore our intuition.
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We have been taught to ignore these cues.
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Oh, they said they were happy, but they didn t look happy.
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Or you know what?
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I was with my friend, but I left feeling drained, burnt out, and not supported.
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That is because your super cue reader in your head was picking up on the eye rolls, on the contempt, on the disrespect, on the scorn, on the scoff, and somehow your body went, but we re friends.
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And so my goal is to actually teach people there are names for these cues.
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If you know how to name them, you begin to listen to your tuition.
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One subject that I am absolutely intrigued by is charisma.
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It is my number one obsession when it comes to people.
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I love someone that alludes charisma.
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I have since I was little.
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I remember watching certain celebrities and being able to pinpoint the ones that really gave off charisma and I would be obsessed with it.
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I remember like dissecting how they were so charismatic and what they were doing that made you feel so comfortable in their presence.
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I even took it to a different level as I grew up.
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I would find people in my high school or people at my dad s restaurant that had charisma and I would study it.
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My father, if he s listening, is a master of charisma.
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Ever since I was little, he just has this personality where it makes you feel at ease.
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There s a finesse to it.
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He keeps his arms open, his body language, his tone.
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He s always asking people about themselves and it s like very much an art.
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So I ve been looking for someone to come on this podcast for so long and explain the art of charisma and the qualities of a charismatic person, essentially how to be more likable.
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So that s what this episode is about.
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I searched high and low.
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And I found Vanessa Van Edwards.
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She was a guest on the Mel Robbins podcast, and I thought her interview was insightful and educational when it came to the topic of charisma.
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This episode is going to give you tangible skills to improve your communication, your leadership, you as a parent.
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It s even going to help you with EQ.
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Your emotional intelligence is going to go up after this podcast.
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It s also going to teach you how to communicate effectively.
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I learned a lot of really great tips from this episode that I ve been able to apply to my own life, and I know that s what you guys love.
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So, on that note, Vanessa Van Edwards, she is going to tell you about what matters in the first seven seconds of any conversation.
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She s going to teach you how to cultivate confidence, the importance of body language, how to meet people.
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She s even going to teach you about those subliminal cues that we aren t even paying attention to that make all the difference.
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And she s going to give you the three steps of connection and how to change and adjust your self-narrative so you are the most fucking charismatic person on the planet.
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Vanessa, welcome to The Him and Her Show.
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This is the skinny confidential Him and Her.
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So who s more charismatic after meeting right away?
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Me or Michael?
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I m just kidding.
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I m just kidding.
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I m just kidding.
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Let me warm up here for a minute, you know?
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Also, I should preface this.
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I ll take it with me.
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My son, who s one and a half, woke me up eight times last night.
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I m so sorry.
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You can t blame that on that.
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My 10-month-old woke me up twice.
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Yeah.
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I mean, hello.
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And she still walks in with this on.
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Lauren does this thing, and we re rolling, but Lauren does this thing where she s like, wow, I slept great.
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He didn t wake up once.
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I m like, I went up eight times.
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I look like shit.
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Look at me.
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I m falling apart.
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You look amazing.
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Thank you.
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You look amazing.
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It s incredible.
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She can sleep through a thunderstorm when I have a pin drop.
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Or am I pretending to sleep?
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Okay, I like it.
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That s it.
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That s the question.
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That s next level.
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Or is it a fake sleep?
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And I have a bone to pick with you one time before, and I don t want to get too couples therapy here.
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I like to watch.
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And then we got to start the show properly.
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She sleeps with this Kindle on top of her.
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Like she ll fall asleep with the Kindle.
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Oh God.
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And then she ll move in the night and the thing crashes down on the wood floors.
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And so finally when I get to sleep, it s like, it sounds like someone s breaking into the house.
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It is incredible.
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I have an idea for the holidays.
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You could just wrap it in flannel.
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Oh, that s a good idea.
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A little flannel.
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Yeah, give it a little flannel.
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A little cushion.
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A little cushion for your Kindle.
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See?
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Yeah.
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Something.
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Anyways, welcome to the show.
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We re solving problems every day.
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I can t talk when he gets mad at me either because I mouth tape.
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Okay, Vanessa, I am so excited for this episode.
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I think that every single person on the planet should listen to this episode.
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And that s not always the case for certain episodes.
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This is one that is so important, in my opinion, to have this tool or tools in the toolbox.
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First of all, how do you describe what you do?
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I got you.
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Okay.
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I got you.
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So my entire mission is I realize a lot of the communication advice out there, being charismatic, is written by extroverts.
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And if you re not naturally extroverted, you re basically telling people to pretend to be something they re not.
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And it is impossible to connect with people, be charismatic, socialize, express your ideas if you are not being yourself.
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We pick up on that inauthenticity.
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We smell fake.
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And so I m like, there has to be a better way.
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There has to be a way to communicate with confidence.
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So I call myself a recovering awkward person turned behavioral researcher.
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All I do is research human behavior, body language, facial cues, conversation patterns, blueprints, formulas.
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Unfortunately, I don t, I can t read people naturally.
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And so I have to do it a little bit like a foreign language.
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And so I realized I m not the only one who is sometimes in these awkward moments.
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And so I just try to translate that to folks.
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It makes so much sense because you would assume, and not to make a blanket statement, but most of the people that are out there creating content like this or writing books or giving speeches are more than likely extroverted, confident people that don t have a problem putting themselves out there.
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But if you re someone who hasn t gotten to that place, it becomes overwhelming.
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You almost can t even get past step one to get to the other stuff.
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You know, what s funny about that is I actually think that right now we have a huge problem, which is that very, very smart people, the smartest people, the most talented people, they focus so much on their book smarts, on the talent, on being the best graphic designer or the best researcher or the best writer, and they don t know how to share that talent.
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So I get so frustrated by seeing the smartest people I know are often not the most charismatic, and they cannot get adoption on their ideas.
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They cannot get a podcast.
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They cannot get their book.
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They re putting out content that is incredible, but no one s listening because they are delivering it the wrong way.
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And that is the mistake I made for the first 25 years of my life, is I thought, if you have great ideas, they ll speak for themselves.
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Unfortunately, this is just not true.
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You can have the best idea in the world, but if you don t share it charismatically, people cannot hear it.
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best story wins, best storytellers win.
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And he was talking about Ken Burns, the documentarian.
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He was saying all he really did was kind of, not to take anything away, was he regurgitated a lot of stuff that had already been shared, maybe in a drier way by writers or whoever,
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And he created these beautiful documentaries with music and soundtracks and he was cutting sentences, but like, everybody tuned into this Civil War.
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And he s like, literally, it wasn t the person with the best or smartest information, it was the person who can tell the best stories in the most concise way possible.
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Okay, this is it.
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And actually, there s a really famous story about this, which hopefully, if you re someone who s tried to pitch ideas, and they fall on flat, you were ignored.
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My people are underestimated, overlooked, and often not taken seriously.
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But those are my folks.
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And they are so smart.
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And the reason is this.
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So, Ring doorbells.
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Ring doorbell, right?
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I have one on my house.
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It s on billions of doors around the world.
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That is a great idea, a video doorbell.
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Jamie Siminoff is the founder of Ring.
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He went on Shark Tank very early on in, I think, 2013, and he pitched Ring, which is a great idea, we know.
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He went on Shark Tank, he pitched Ring, and I knew I was watching this pitch in 2013.
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I knew within the first seven seconds of watching this pitch that it would fail.
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It was a great idea.
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It burned in the tank.
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I mean, the sharks didn t get it.
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They were asking him terrible questions.
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And six months later, he went on to get an investment from Shaq, Richard Branson, and Amazon eventually acquired it for over a billion dollars, meaning he had a great idea.
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But the way that he pitched it in that tank made him completely overlooked.
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What did he do in the first seven seconds?
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Let me tell you.
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So I coded this.
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So one of my research team and I, we coded, so shout out to Jose Pina, he led this.
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We coded 495 shark tank pitches looking for patterns.
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I wanted to know why is it, these are all good ideas for the most part.
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I would say 80% of them are good ideas.
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Why is it that some, every shark is like, me, throwing my money at you.
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And others are like, meh.
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and they get the hardest questions.
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So we found there were patterns and Jamie Siminoff is one of the negative ones.
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Here s what he did.
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He made the mistake of using the question inflection.
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Research has found that we decide how confident someone is in the first 200 milliseconds of hearing them speak.
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Which means you can have the best pitch, the best presentation, the best podcast, but if you say, hello, wrong, people don t think you re confident.
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And we don t like to buy from, hear from, or be with not confident people because it s contagious.
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So what he did is his very first word, he gave away all of his confidence.
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He said, my name is Jamie, and he asked his name.
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Actually, even shorter, he said, it s Jamie?
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Like that, he asked it.
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What they have found is when the brain hears an accidental question inflection, so a question inflection is when I go up at the end of my sentence, like I m asking a question, but actually it s a statement.
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When the brain hears an accidental question inflection, it flips from listening to scrutinizing.
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Interesting.
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And that is because liars use a question inflection.
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Liars, they don t believe their words, right?
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So they ask their lie as if to say, do you believe me?
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So when I play Truths and a Lie with people, two Truths and a Lie with people, which is a game I love to play, almost always they ll ask their lie because they re asking, do you believe this?
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So when he said, it s Jamie,
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Our brains went from just listening positively to scrutinizing, and that is exactly what the sharks did.
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The entire pitch, they were just peppering him with questions, and he didn t get a deal.
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What is the right way to say, my name is Jamie?
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OK, so first, I want everyone, please, please do a voicemail audit.
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Go listen to your voicemail.
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Make sure you re not accidentally using the question inflection on your name and on your ask.
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And then whenever you introduce yourself in a video call, in a meeting, on a date, in person, at a networking event, at a holiday party, I want you to use the downward inflection.
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So here s the difference.
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I m Vanessa versus my name is Vanessa.
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So I ll do it even more hard for you.
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So I m Vanessa.
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I m Vanessa.
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Right.
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That first one was good.
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The second one.
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Hey, guys, it s Lauren Bostic.
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That s it.
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That was it.
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So the second one, it s like you re certain of yourself.
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That s what I hear.
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That s it.
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And so when people are speaking, maybe they re nervous.
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They re not certain of themselves.
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They re not even sure they believe what s coming out of their mouth.
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That uncertainty is conveyed in the other person s mind as you re lying to them.
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Or you re not confident.
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Not both, right?
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It triggers all these micro cues in our body to think, you re not confident.
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Well, I don t want to, I want to catch your not confidence.
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Are you lying to me?
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Like usually a name, we don t think someone s lying, but we think, is this person a liar?
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Because it triggers without even realizing it, all those things.
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What I hear often happen is in the first 20 seconds of interaction, the most important for your entire first impression setup is someone uses the question flexion all the time.
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It sounds like this.
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Hey everyone, good morning.
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I m here to talk about our agenda today, and we re gonna be going over all different kinds of things.
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That is basically telling someone, I don t feel confident in anything I m saying.
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It feels weak.
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It feels so weak.
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And so we do sales audits where we find that oftentimes in sales situations, there s the same people who get pushed back over and over again.
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Typically, salespeople who have the lowest close rate and the worst confidence and the most pushback ask their number.
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If you are going to ask for a salary raise or you are charging a rate, never ask your number.
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So don t say, here s what it sounds like, hey, we d love to have your business.
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We d love to work with you.
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And the cost of that price is $5,000.
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If you ask your number, you re telling people, I don t think I m worth this number, and you should question me too.
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So tell us how you would say it.
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Okay, so not this.
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So not, I d love to work with you and my cost is $5,000.
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Instead, I d love to work with you and my cost is $5,000.
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Wow.
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Same person.
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It s not up for interpretation, it s not up for negotiation.
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No, this is my price.
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This is the number.
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So boundaries, numbers, timelines, prices.
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Say it, don t ask it.
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It s almost an energy too.
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It s like a, it s, it s an undertone that you, you can t really put your, your finger on it.
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It feels like even like, you know, in the dating world, like when people, when they ask a question, when they say like, will you go out with me?
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And it s like, they re, they re saying in a way where like, I m surprised that if you would say yes, like, like it s like almost like, I can t believe you would say yes to me.
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When Michael asked me out, I actually remember this.
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You said, go out with me.
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Oh, yeah, that s what you said to me in sixth grade.
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That s how you said it.
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And then I took a club out of my pocket and I hit her in the head.
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Perfect.
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Perfect body language.
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But that s it.
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Like if you remember that.
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Right.
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Like you remember.
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I remember the way you asked the authority.
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And that was a statement.
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Well, it was, I think, I think confident.
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I mean,
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Listen, you re going to tell me more about this than I know.
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I think at that point, I remember just being certain that she would go out with me.
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And listen, it could have been, I could have been completely delusional and it could have been, I could just be like way out there.
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But in my mind, it was certain.
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Or like, I ll give you another example.
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We ll talk about getting guests on this show.
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SPEAKER_01
Sometimes we ll see someone like, oh, I d love to talk to them.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I ll say like, well, we ll get to them soon.
2
SPEAKER_01
One day we ll talk.
2
SPEAKER_01
Like, it s not like, oh, if or how.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s like, I know it ll happen.
2
SPEAKER_01
It may not happen tomorrow, but it s going to happen.
2
SPEAKER_00
You know what I mean?
2
SPEAKER_00
That is the confidence that we are all trying to be infected with.
2
SPEAKER_01
Maybe a little delusion.
2
SPEAKER_01
But is it if it s happening for you?
2
SPEAKER_01
I think that if you personally, if you don t really believe it can happen, it won t ever happen.
2
SPEAKER_00
I also think if you don t believe in yourself, who is supposed to?
2
SPEAKER_00
Exactly right.
2
SPEAKER_00
And that is leaked in all of our cues.
2
SPEAKER_00
So I think that there s two parts of this.
2
SPEAKER_00
One, I want you to believe in yourself because you re smart and you re talented and you re amazing and you deserve that person or that deal.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_00
The second is, how can you match your body language, your voice, your vocal power, your facial expressions to that inner confidence?
2
SPEAKER_00
There is often a mismatch.
2
SPEAKER_00
And this happens because really smart people have great ideas, but they re not confident in themselves.
2
SPEAKER_00
And so they go to pitch an idea, or they go to ask someone on a date, or they go to set up their boundary, and their lack of confidence in themselves is translated onto this idea, and then no one believes their idea.
2
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so in your case, as a self-proclaimed one of these kinds of people back in the day, what did you do to change?
2
SPEAKER_01
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_00
I take a very methodical approach to confidence.
2
SPEAKER_00
So I hope for those listening, if you re a list taker, you like... That s helpful though.
2
SPEAKER_02
I think it s not ambiguous.
2
SPEAKER_02
I like that.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
And also, there s all these self-help books out there that are like, be yourself, just smile more.
2
SPEAKER_00
I was like, what?
2
SPEAKER_00
If I don t like myself, how can I be more like myself?
2
SPEAKER_00
That was fundamentally the issue on a very deep level that I was dealing with.
2
SPEAKER_00
So for me, I thought, okay, I can t just be more confident.
2
SPEAKER_00
I can t just find my passion.
2
SPEAKER_00
But I can find confidence in control.
2
SPEAKER_00
So control is something that I think is a backdoor into confidence.
2
SPEAKER_00
What I mean by this is in an interaction there are a couple things that you can control that can give you confidence.
2
SPEAKER_00
So one being your social intention and your social energy.
2
SPEAKER_00
The very first step is to figure out are you an introvert, ambivert or extrovert.
2
SPEAKER_00
There s actually a middle category and this is the one that s most often forgotten.
2
SPEAKER_00
Introverts, you re a true introvert and not many people are.
2
SPEAKER_00
True introverts, they only get their energy from being alone.
2
SPEAKER_00
They can only recharge from being alone.
2
SPEAKER_00
So they have a bad day, need to be alone.
2
SPEAKER_00
They have a good day, they want to savor it alone.
2
SPEAKER_00
True extroverts, and again, there aren t actually many true extroverts, only recharge and get energy by being with people.
2
SPEAKER_00
They have a good day, they want to celebrate with people.
2
SPEAKER_00
They have a bad day, they want to commiserate with people.
2
SPEAKER_00
Most of us, 82%, are ambiverts.
2
SPEAKER_01
I don t think I ve ever heard someone talk about ambiverts on this show, ever.
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay, this is going to change your life.
2
SPEAKER_00
No joke, I think it s going to change your life.
2
SPEAKER_00
Ambiverts are able to flip into extroversion and introversion based on their goals.
2
SPEAKER_00
But if you don t have a social goal, you re not in control.
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so give an example.
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so if you say, okay, I m going to this networking event and my goal is to close three ideal clients or to find three ideal clients.
2
SPEAKER_00
That social goal just flipped you into extraversion for a reason.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s going to make the event way less draining for you.
2
SPEAKER_00
It also value tags for you.
2
SPEAKER_00
It tags the kind of person that you want to see.
2
SPEAKER_00
So you re not going to waste your energy on the person who is a bad conversationalist or doesn t vibe with you.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re going to be like, no, excuse, sorry, excuse me.
2
SPEAKER_00
I m going to go try to find someone else.
2
SPEAKER_00
We re not going to say that, but we re going to have nicer ways to say that.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re looking for your people.
2
SPEAKER_00
That flips you into extroversion, which makes you conserve your social battery.
2
SPEAKER_00
And if you re really smart about it, you make the event work for you.
2
SPEAKER_00
For example, ambiverts should always stand where people exit the bar.
2
SPEAKER_00
The reason for this is because a mistake you will make at a crowded event, at a bar, nightclub, party, office event, conference, is they try to meet people right when they get in the room.
2
SPEAKER_00
That doesn t work.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s way too Hungry Tiger.
2
SPEAKER_02
It doesn t work.
2
SPEAKER_02
Hungry Tiger Beaver.
2
SPEAKER_02
You got it.
2
SPEAKER_02
That s not the... The Hungry Tiger Beaver combo.
2
SPEAKER_01
No, but it s like... Dangerous.
2
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, don t sit.
2
SPEAKER_02
Don t sit.
2
SPEAKER_02
It looks like a dog waiting for like its owner at the window.
2
SPEAKER_02
Right.
2
SPEAKER_02
We can t.
2
SPEAKER_00
And you re going to get people who excuse themselves.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re looking over your head.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re trying to find someone better.
2
SPEAKER_00
So do not stand right where people come in.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s the worst place.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s you re going to get people who are excusing themselves.
2
SPEAKER_00
Don t stand by the bathroom.
2
SPEAKER_00
And I also wouldn t stand by the food.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s another critical mistake people make is because people are focused on their eating.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re not really focused on you.
2
SPEAKER_00
And they often are going to take their meal and go sit somewhere else.
2
SPEAKER_02
Like, John, I m trying to eat a pig in a blanket like move, leave.
2
SPEAKER_00
I can t talk to you.
2
SPEAKER_00
I have a pig in the blanket.
2
SPEAKER_00
I can t do it. 
2
SPEAKER_00
Right.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
I m with you.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re like, I need to focus on this pig in the blanket.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s my snack.
2
SPEAKER_00
Right.
2
SPEAKER_00
So your best bet is, first of all, go stand in a line.
2
SPEAKER_00
I love standing in lines.
2
SPEAKER_00
Ambiverts, lines are our friend.
2
SPEAKER_00
Why?
2
SPEAKER_00
You re in line.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s so easy to talk to the person ahead of you and behind you.
2
SPEAKER_00
Like so easy.
2
SPEAKER_00
Like no social pressure.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re like, so what are you going to get tonight?
2
SPEAKER_00
What brings you here?
2
SPEAKER_00
How do you know the host?
2
SPEAKER_00
So like low social energy, like neutral ground.
2
SPEAKER_01
Everyone knows they kind of have to be in the line.
2
SPEAKER_01
There s a reason.
2
SPEAKER_02
And also you look a little bit you look like you re not an interesting person if you re in line just scrolling your phone all the time.
2
SPEAKER_02
So you re almost like off your phone because you don t want to look like disinterested.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, and also gives you a purpose.
2
SPEAKER_00
You look very purposeful.
2
SPEAKER_00
Confidence comes from purpose, right?
2
SPEAKER_00
So if you re in line, you have a purpose.
2
SPEAKER_00
So what I would used to do in the very beginning of my awkward stages, I would go to these networking conferences and I would just get in every line I could.
2
SPEAKER_00
So I would like get in the Starbucks line, the longest one, and then I would get my coffee, a really small one, and then I d get back in line to get a snack.
2
SPEAKER_00
I would just get back in line.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s smart.
2
SPEAKER_00
I mean, dozens of people.
2
SPEAKER_00
And that s why during the breaks, because the breaks were so overwhelming to me, try to walk up to someone and strike up a conversation that that purpose worked.
2
SPEAKER_00
So you can either get in the longest line possible, which always works.
2
SPEAKER_00
And then once you get your drink or your food, stand where people exit, because that s your money moment.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s your charisma moment.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s where people turn to the room.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re in a room, you have a drink in your hand, you re like, who do I talk to?
2
SPEAKER_00
Who do I talk to?
2
SPEAKER_00
you become the social savior.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re like, hey, that drink looks great.
2
SPEAKER_00
Or what brings you here?
2
SPEAKER_00
Or isn t this a great night?
2
SPEAKER_00
It s like a win-win for everyone.
2
SPEAKER_00
You have the best conversations.
2
SPEAKER_00
So we can hack an event.
2
SPEAKER_00
We can hack where you stand, what you say.
2
SPEAKER_00
And also, you can build in your social energy to make sure that you have recharge time before or after.
2
SPEAKER_00
The other thing that ambiverts have to do is look at your calendar, open up your calendar, and scan what you have in the next month.
2
SPEAKER_00
Who do you see on your calendar that immediately causes you dread?
2
SPEAKER_00
Who is the person we were like, oh I don t really want to go to coffee with them or I don t really want to have happy hour with them or I don t really want to go to their home.
2
SPEAKER_00
Those are people who are going to drain your social energy so quickly and they re gonna leave you worse off.
2
SPEAKER_00
And so it s also about social energy maintenance.
2
SPEAKER_00
Amberverts, we do not have unlimited social energy.
2
SPEAKER_00
So we have to be able to maximize our time
2
SPEAKER_00
with people who fuel us.
2
SPEAKER_00
And there are people who give you energy.
2
SPEAKER_00
You just have to figure out which ones they are.
2
SPEAKER_02
So, wow, I mean, that makes a ton of sense.
2
SPEAKER_01
So how would you, if you were to line up 10 people out of those 10 people, how many would you say 82 or so?
2
SPEAKER_01
Eight out of 10 would be.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay.
2
SPEAKER_01
Wow.
2
SPEAKER_02
I also think that, and you are the perfect person to ask.
2
SPEAKER_02
There is also a way to, and you, you could tell me the tools to do this, to elude a confidence where people actually want to come up to you at a social event instead of you having to go up to them.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_02
How do you do that?
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so now we re getting into the advanced stuff.
2
SPEAKER_00
So we are constantly doing this.
2
SPEAKER_00
We re in advanced settings.
2
SPEAKER_00
We re in advanced settings right now.
2
SPEAKER_00
So let s just do body language cues.
2
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so there s a couple of cues that indicate approachability.
2
SPEAKER_00
This is not just romantic situations.
2
SPEAKER_00
This is any situation where we are reading someone to think, could I approach this person?
2
SPEAKER_00
So actually it begins with our feet, our toes.
2
SPEAKER_00
Typically when we angle our toes towards the person we re most interested in, I can almost always, my favorite game is to go into a room and try to guess who s the boss.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s like my favorite game, my friends and I play it, my husband and I play it, where we try to look and see, because usually people s toes are pointed towards the boss.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re subconsciously oriented towards that person.
2
SPEAKER_00
Are your toes pointed towards me right now?
2
SPEAKER_02
I can t see your toes.
2
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, turn your chest towards me, bitch.
2
SPEAKER_00
I also can usually tell office crushes, typically.
2
SPEAKER_00
by where someone s toes are pointed.
2
SPEAKER_00
Like, if you re sitting in a big mixed room and you want to see if someone has a crush on you, see if they angle their toes towards you.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s a subconscious reason.
2
SPEAKER_00
The reason for this, by the way, is because if, as humans, we re interested in someone, we re kind of, like, wanting to see, like, what are they doing, right?
2
SPEAKER_00
We re, like, kind of, like, glancing over, but glances are hard to see.
2
SPEAKER_00
So our toes will, without even subconsciously realizing it, point towards that person because we re, like, our mind is with them.
2
SPEAKER_00
If it happens with crushes, it happens with bosses.
2
SPEAKER_00
So you want to angle your toes towards the room.
3
SPEAKER_02
Right, instead of towards the person you re speaking with, if you re open to approachability, you want to make sure your body and your toes are angled out and or the person you want to approach.
3
SPEAKER_02
The toes being angled.
3
SPEAKER_00
I feel a lot of people subconsciously know about a lot of this, meaning Lauren asked me all the time, like, hey, when you re not with me, do you get hit on?
3
SPEAKER_00
And I honestly do.
3
SPEAKER_00
I never do.
3
SPEAKER_00
And I think and it s like what might be nice once in a while.
3
SPEAKER_00
But
3
SPEAKER_00
But I think there s an energy when it comes to dating that you put out to show like, hey, I m ready and I m available versus like, I m not.
3
SPEAKER_00
I mean, at this point I got two kids and I m just tired and lazy.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m so tired.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m probably hunched over some kind of disgusting meal and stuffing my face.
3
SPEAKER_00
They re like, what s going on with this guy?
3
SPEAKER_02
I m eating their meal.
3
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, exactly.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m eating whatever they did not eat for dinner.
3
SPEAKER_00
Exactly.
3
SPEAKER_00
But I think that there s an energy when it comes to dating.
3
SPEAKER_00
Like I see my single friends, they go out and I m like, well, why aren t girls coming up?
3
SPEAKER_00
And they re like, well, you re like, if you re closed off and you re hunched over and you re away and you re, you know, like it just, it s not inviting.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_02
So one of the secret motivations for my career is I think that we all have this amazing intuition on these cues.
3
SPEAKER_02
That s what I m saying.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yes.
3
SPEAKER_02
Our brain is a super cue reader.
3
SPEAKER_02
Like we have this superpower.
3
SPEAKER_02
Like if I could tell people, you have a superpower.
3
SPEAKER_02
You literally have it.
3
SPEAKER_02
All you have to do is name it.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so I think that what I want to teach people is we ve been taught to ignore our intuition.
3
SPEAKER_02
We have been taught to ignore these cues for our, oh, they said they were happy, but they didn t look happy.
3
SPEAKER_02
Or you know what?
3
SPEAKER_02
I was with my friend, but I left feeling drained, burnt out, and not supported.
3
SPEAKER_02
That is because your super cue reader in your head was picking up on the eye rolls, on the contempt, on the disrespect, on the scorn, on the scoff, and somehow your body went, but we re friends.
3
SPEAKER_02
Your brain went, we re friends.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so my goal is to actually teach people there are names for these cues, right?
3
SPEAKER_02
There s 97 cues.
3
SPEAKER_02
That s what we ve just studied in our research.
3
SPEAKER_02
There are 97 cues.
3
SPEAKER_02
If you know how to name them, you begin to listen to your tuition.
3
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, I think I, no, I couldn t agree more.
3
SPEAKER_00
And I, you know, I grew up and I ve said this before, I have two younger sisters and I always would tell them with men, like they would always be like, I need to know if he likes me or not.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m like, I don t think it s like, it s not like a, if you re wondering that you don t, it s not a verbal thing you need.
3
SPEAKER_00
Like you, you could tell from the nonverbal stuff quickly.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, so that was a study that I love that kind of proves how this works.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s a very gross study.
3
SPEAKER_02
Are you ready for a gross study?
3
SPEAKER_01
I love gross.
3
SPEAKER_02
Gross is better.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_02
They brought people into their lab and they split them up into two different groups.
3
SPEAKER_02
The first group wore a sweat suit, so a suit that caught their sweat, and they had them run on the treadmill.
3
SPEAKER_02
The second group, they had them wear sweatsuits, and they had them skydive for the first time.
3
SPEAKER_02
So the samples collected were two different kinds of sweat, exercise sweat and stress sweat, where someone was scared and stressed.
3
SPEAKER_02
And they took these sweat samples, and they had unsuspecting participants come into their lab, and they had them smell them.
3
SPEAKER_02
Disgusting.
3
SPEAKER_02
And they had no idea what they were smelling.
3
SPEAKER_02
So they put them in an fMRI machine.
3
SPEAKER_02
They gave them these two samples, and they went,
3
SPEAKER_02
They had no idea what they were smelling.
3
SPEAKER_02
But when people smelled the fear sweat, they felt more afraid.
3
SPEAKER_02
Their amygdala, where they process fear, lit up.
3
SPEAKER_02
In other words, somehow they caught the fear without knowing what they were smelling.
3
SPEAKER_02
This study changed the way I think about people because it made me realize if you are afraid and anxious and nervous, people pick up on it and they catch it.
3
SPEAKER_02
If you are confident and grounded and know your worth, then people catch that and they feel more confident.
3
SPEAKER_02
That is the definition of charismatic people.
3
SPEAKER_02
You started the episode by saying, I think everyone should have this.
3
SPEAKER_02
We have to have this.
3
SPEAKER_02
Because the definition of being a human who helps people, who cares about people, is that you show up and you make people better.
3
SPEAKER_02
And how does that work?
3
SPEAKER_02
If you are better, you make other people better.
3
SPEAKER_00
Lauren and I are absolutely insane, as you guys know, about what we put in our body, what supplements we take, what we recommend, and we re even crazier when it comes to what we recommend for our children, which is why Lauren and I love Hya so much.
3
SPEAKER_00
Hya are some of the best children s vitamins on the market.
3
SPEAKER_00
Typical children s vitamins are basically just candy in disguise, filled with two teaspoons of sugar, unhealthy chemicals, and other gummy junk growing kids should never eat.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s why Hya was created, the pediatrician-approved, super-powered, chewable vitamin.
3
SPEAKER_00
Lauren and I, every single morning we wake up and look at both of our children and say, who wants a vitamin?
3
SPEAKER_00
They come running and screaming.
3
SPEAKER_00
They both love the vitamins so much.
3
SPEAKER_00
Why would you not want to give your child the best possible supplement that they could take with the best possible ingredients?
3
SPEAKER_00
It s non-GMO, vegan, dairy-free, allergy-free, gelatin-free, nut-free, and everything else you can imagine.
3
SPEAKER_00
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3
SPEAKER_00
Like I said, this is just one easy thing that you can implement into your children s health routine.
3
SPEAKER_00
So if you ve been on the fence, not sure to make the switch, keep in mind that while most children s vitamins are filled with five grams of sugar and contribute to a variety of health issues, Hya is made with zero sugar and zero gummy junk.
3
SPEAKER_00
So check it out.
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SPEAKER_00
We ve worked out a special deal with Hya for their bestselling children s vitamin.
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SPEAKER_00
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SPEAKER_00
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3
SPEAKER_00
A little while back, I was on a podcast called the Meat Mafia Podcast, and they asked what my morning routine was, and I started to think that I didn t really have a morning routine.
3
SPEAKER_00
But one thing that I realized I do religiously and I have done now for years is that I always, without fail, every single day, no matter if I m traveling, if I m at home, wherever I m at, I drink
3
SPEAKER_00
AG1.
3
SPEAKER_00
Prior to drinking AG1, I felt a little sluggish.
3
SPEAKER_00
I felt a little tired.
3
SPEAKER_00
I had under eye circles.
3
SPEAKER_00
I wasn t doing enough to get my prebiotics and my probiotics.
3
SPEAKER_00
I definitely wasn t getting my minerals and I was for sure not getting my vegetables in.
3
SPEAKER_00
And so what I should have said on that podcast is I don t really have such a crazy morning routine outside of drinking my AG1.
3
SPEAKER_00
I feel like this kicks the day right off to a great start.
3
SPEAKER_00
It doesn t break my fast.
3
SPEAKER_00
I get hydrated at the same time, and I get so much bang for my buck.
3
SPEAKER_00
I ve said for years now on the show, if I could only choose one thing, one thing to invest in for my health, it would be AG1.
3
SPEAKER_00
This is because it does so much more than typical products.
3
SPEAKER_00
You have your multivitamin, you have your adaptogens, you have your prebiotic, you have your probiotic, you have your greens, you have your minerals, all in one simple scoop that you can take with water, whether at home, on the go.
3
SPEAKER_00
I use their travel packets as well as their at-home bag.
3
SPEAKER_00
So check it out.
3
SPEAKER_00
If there s one product I had to recommend to elevate your health, it s AG1, and that s why I ve partnered with them for so long.
3
SPEAKER_00
So if you want to take ownership of your health, start with AG1.
3
SPEAKER_00
Try AG1 and get a free one-year supply of vitamin D3 and K2 and five free AG1 travel packs with your first purchase exclusively at drinkag1.com slash skinny.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s drinkag1.com slash skinny.
3
SPEAKER_00
Check it out.
3
SPEAKER_01
Let me tell you about a success story on Hinge.
3
SPEAKER_01
It actually has to do with my producer, Carson, who s listening right now.
3
SPEAKER_01
Carson, what up?
3
SPEAKER_01
Carson met a beautiful, lovely, amazing, charismatic, funny woman on Hinge.
3
SPEAKER_01
If you don t know about Hinge, you re missing out.
3
SPEAKER_01
Hinge is the dating app designed to be deleted.
3
SPEAKER_01
Why?
3
SPEAKER_01
Because Hinge gives you a sense of someone s personality, and it lets you share your own.
3
SPEAKER_01
You get to know potential dates through their unique answers to prompts, plus you get a sense of someone s dating intentions and what they re looking for.
3
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So I got to talking with Carson and he says, and he s tried a lot, that it is the best dating site ever.
3
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He says that it actually is a place where he could find a partner that he wanted to date and potentially marry.
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Can I say that, Carson?
3
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He s laughing.
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He said I could.
3
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Okay, so basically, Hinge gets straight to the point.
3
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Carson told me that his favorite specific feature on Hinge is that it cuts straight to the point.
3
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So when he wanted to reach out to his future girlfriend, he was able to go directly to her without having to go through a bunch of BS.
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He is a huge fan and for my next husband, I will be going to Hinge.
3
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It s the place to be.
3
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It s the place I would be if I was dating.
3
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You can download Hinge and find someone worth deleting the app for.
3
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Download Hinge.
3
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With what you do, you re obviously so good at it.
3
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When you walk into a party, what makes the most
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captivating and compelling person in the room to you?
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Well, I m not invited to parties.
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I know, because you re like, so you re like surveying whose toes are pointed where, who s in line, you re analyzing the party.
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I think for a minute you were like, oh no, is she really not?
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No, I am invited to some parties.
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Austin s like the place, right?
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Like everyone, like people are like, come, you re the most interesting person.
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Okay, so the most captivating person is actually not the life of the party.
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So I think that there s a myth, which I would love to bust if we can bust it.
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which is that you have to be the life of the party, have the best stories, I think being a good storyteller is good, but be funniest, be gregarious, to be charismatic.
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That is not true.
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It could be Hungry Tigress.
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Yes.
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In a different way.
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Yes, because yes, that is one flavor of charisma.
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But my work is finding the different flavors of charisma.
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Yes, the boisterous extrovert is one flavor, but there s also the quiet contemplative introvert.
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There s also the compassion, empathetic question asker or healer.
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There s all these different flavors.
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So the most captivating person to me might be different than the most captivating person to you.
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For example, I love deep one-to-one conversations that last into the night.
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So for me, I m actually not looking for like the person who s holding court.
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I m not going to the person who s making everyone laugh.
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I m looking for the person who just got their drink, right?
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Like they just exited the bar.
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They re looking for a social savior.
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And they look like they could be a good question asker.
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So what does that look like to me?
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So that is approachability.
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We can also call it croissant feet, right?
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Like their feet kind of angle out or like open to the room.
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It s also someone I really think that eye contact is a critical component of connection.
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And that s because it produces oxytocin.
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So when we re in a good conversation, there s three chemicals flowing through our body.
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Oxytocin, dopamine, and serotonin.
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So what I teach my students is you want to actually create a DOS, dopamine, oxytocin, serotonin cocktail in people.
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That s what you should be going around giving people.
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Dopamine, excitement.
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This means that they re asking you about exciting things.
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They re breaking social scripts.
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They re not saying, how s it going?
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How s the weather?
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What do you do?
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I wanna do a what do you do diet.
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That question is so terrible for charisma.
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It s low hanging fruit.
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It s fruit rotting on the ground.
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Okay, I m actually gonna put it down there.
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You know why?
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It s wine.
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No, you keep turning into something good.
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It s something horrible.
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It s vinegar.
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It s vinegar.
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It s bad wine.
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It s bad wine.
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Here s why.
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Because when someone asks, what do you do?
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Your brain goes on autopilot.
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You ve answered that question so many times before that you are answering brain dead, right?
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Like there s no activity in your brain.
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There s no dopamine.
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There s no activity.
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So you answer on autopilot.
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And then you ask it on autopilot, what do you do?
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And also, deeper, I think this question is actually asking, what are you worth?
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Like that s what that question is asking.
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Where do you stand in the social hierarchy?
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Not even what are you worth money-wise, but what are you worth socially?
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What s your capital?
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And what a terrible thing to do for someone.
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For someone, like I love what I do, but for someone who isn t defined by what they do, who doesn t like what they do, what a horrible thing to do to them in the first five seconds.
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You re so right.
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Right?
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So when you say, what do you do when someone hates their job, or they re scared, or they re afraid of losing their job, or they don t know if they like their job, you are putting them in a position of cortisol right off the bat.
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So instead,
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I no longer ask that question.
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I want you to ask, working on anything exciting recently?
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This is still a safe question.
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It s not like, what s your greatest fear, which you don t want to go too deep.
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It s giving them permission to tell you what they do if they want to.
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Or also you could be like, I m working on a
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Butterfly exhibit outside my house like it could be anything you re so for me if someone says working on anything exciting recently I m gonna tell you about what I do because I love it and I m excited by it But if it s someone who is not excited about what they do There you give them permission to talk about their butterfly exhibit or their rock climbing or their kids, right?
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And that one gives them permission which I think is a gift
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But two, you re actually secretly triggering dopamine.
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So dopamine is a very complicated chemical, but for our purposes, Dr. John Medina found that dopamine makes us chemically memorable.
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When you re with someone and they trigger dopamine, it creates what he calls a mental post-it note.
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We love people, create trigger dopamine for us.
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And so if you ask someone, working on anything exciting recently, I have just juiced something that already gives you dopamine, but I have associated it to myself.
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Also, if you ask me that at a party, if you ask me that, I m going to give you so much more detail about something that s really important to me as opposed to just like, I m an entrepreneur.
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It feels like awkward almost.
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I think also, and maybe you might agree with this, to me that question also forces people to put themselves in a box.
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If you just said, what do you do, it s like I automatically have to put my, because there s a lot of things technically that I do and many of them not related to business.
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So I think that s difficult because it automatically makes, you have to maybe make yourself seem small.
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Absolutely.
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It forces someone to be small.
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That s like a very beautiful way of putting it.
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And my goal in interactions is to help people be big.
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No small talk, no small box, no small labels, big talk, big exciting things, big dreams.
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Like big is better, I think.
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I m from Texas.
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No, no, for sure.
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It s so funny because we come on this, so we do this show and we refuse to do it now over Zoom.
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Yeah.
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And sometimes people get really upset.
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And we ve passed on some quote unquote, I guess, like names in the space that refuse to do it in person.
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But to your point, like I need exactly what you re talking about in order to have what I think is a conversation that people are memorable.
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Yeah, because we ve had some great people on Zoom in the past, and I honestly cannot really remember anything about those conversations besides they weren t as pleasant as I think they could have been.
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Yes, okay, so that was a chemical reaction.
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So you are not remembering that because one, you had less dopamine.
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It s much harder to create excitement when you re through a screen.
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Two, you had less oxytocin.
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Oxytocin is a second chemical, simplified, very simplified.
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It s a chemical of connection.
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It s that feeling of like when you re with someone, you re like,
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really like this person.
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That s actually oxytocin.
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It s very memorable.
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And the last one is serotonin, which is a sense of belonging.
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Very simplified.
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So it s extremely difficult to do that over screens.
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Like we do produce it.
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You can do it.
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So you can, they ve actually studied it.
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You can produce oxytocin through a webcam, but it s so much less.
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So much less.
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Well, OnlyFans does it too.
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OnlyFans when they do a strip tease on camera.
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That s a different type of thing.
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I barely know what you re talking about.
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OnlyFans is like when a girl or a guy is showing their... They re like webcams.
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Yeah, they re like webcam people.
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Anyway.
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Okay.
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A little tangent.
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COVID was weird running this company because obviously everyone was forced to go remote.
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And then we ve kind of come back and it s been a little bit more of a hybrid.
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I personally running an organization like this feel, and I haven t been able to articulate as well as you just did, that the reason you can t maybe get, and listen, a lot of people really get mad when you say this, I don t think you can be as productive when people aren t working together all the time because of the reasons you re mentioning.
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It s like, you have these screen barriers.
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I don t think people are having these releases.
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I don t think that they re jiving as well.
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I think that it s a little bit foreign.
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It s not to say you can t get stuff done.
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But I think being in a group with people and working together and looking people in the eye and being around that energy is just a whole different kind of thing.
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Also, there s a crazy study, and I don t know if I m going to get these stats right off of memory, but they did this across 11 different companies with thousands of different employees, different sizes, different industries.
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And what they found was the number one indicator for performance was actually who you sat near.
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who you sit next to.
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What they found was a low performer is contagious and infects the people that they sit near, and they lower their performance, I think it was like by 35%, I don t remember the exact fact, and high performers are also contagious.
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You sit next to a high performer and your own performance boosts, which means that the lowest and the highest are affecting us.
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Right.
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So it s very also important.
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One, where do you think you are?
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Right.
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If you think you re a low performer, like there s there s certain things I m bad at.
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I m actually better off sitting next to a high performer to catch their high performance vibes.
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High performers are actually more powerful than low performers.
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But I also want to make sure that I m strategically thinking about my team and who s being who s being contagious and whatnot.
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All my team members are high performers.
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They wouldn t be on my team.
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But we have to remember that even our efficiency, our productivity is contagious.
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When it comes to getting people to like you, and I know we ve covered a few of these things, what are three things or three traits that people can start working on today?
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Maybe they can t change it right away, but three things they can start working on tomorrow.
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Oh yeah, I ll give you really easy ones.
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I m going to give you really, really
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They re a little in the weeds, but they work.
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Okay, so one is the phrase.
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I have like five favorite phrases that I use that are immediate likability.
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So one of them is, I was just thinking about you.
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This is the best phrase in the English language.
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Almost as good as I love you.
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Because one, everyone is worried, do you think well of me?
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everyone.
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And so the gift you can give to anyone you interact with is not only do I think of you, but I think well of you.
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And also we re always thinking about people.
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So if I think of my friend Sarah, I will text her often and be like, I was just thinking about you when I saw this new Netflix documentary.
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Or when I see her, I m like, I was thinking about you this week.
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I saw this amazing Netflix documentary.
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Everyone in my life, I tell them every time I think about them.
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That is like the fastest way to be more likable.
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So anytime you think about someone, text them or save it for when you see them.
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It s like the best compliment you can give.
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I want 300 texts every single second that you think about me every single day.
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I want you to say, I was just thinking about you, blah, blah, blah.
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I was just thinking about you, blah, blah, blah.
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Can we just do a little experiment?
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If I say, oh my gosh, I was just thinking about you.
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Aren t you kind of excited for what I m going to say?
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A hundred percent.
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Who is not?
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It s like magic.
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It s almost like lube for like the ego.
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Oh yeah.
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What were you thinking?
5
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What was it?
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So one, you can say, I was just thinking about you, period.
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But it s even better if you can tie it to something you know that creates excitement for them.
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Like the masterclass that I teach my advanced students is like, it s a formula.
5
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I was just thinking about you plus dopamine moment you mentioned earlier.
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It s like immediate dopamine bomb, right?
5
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Like it s like hits.
5
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So that s one of my favorite phrases.
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A really small one is, have you ever had that awkward moment where you get interrupted by like a waiter or someone else and like you don t finish your story or your thought?
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It sucks.
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Everybody has.
5
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It sucks.
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So a gift you can give socially is like when you re at a restaurant or you re like someone and someone gets interrupted and you re like, oh, you were saying something so interesting.
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Finish your thought.
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like gift, like immediately likable.
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And the third one that I can remember off the top of my head, I have these written down that I use all the time, is giving someone a compliment that isn t complimenting the tall guy on being tall.
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SPEAKER_00
Oh, this is so good.
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Go off on this.
5
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I think we re told, give someone an authentic compliment, but the tall person, one, they can t control their height, and two, they re told that all the time.
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It s horrible.
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So if you re going to give a compliment, I d rather you give a compliment that s super unique and validating them in the moment.
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So if someone says something interesting, be like, you are so interesting.
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Or every time I talk to you, it s so interesting.
5
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Or if someone says something funny, oh my gosh, you always make me laugh.
5
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You re so funny.
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Or if someone says something really vulnerable, you always make me think.
5
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It s always like the hot girl wants to be told she s smart.
5
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Right.
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Or like the guy with the good hairline wants to be told he has a big dick.
5
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I think that s universal for every guy.
5
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I think that every guy would like that compliment.
5
SPEAKER_00
What is the third one?
5
SPEAKER_00
You have a third one.
5
SPEAKER_00
No, I got him.
5
SPEAKER_00
I got him.
5
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Don t interrupt my story.
5
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I was just thinking about you and like that s your so.
5
SPEAKER_00
Oh, your so.
5
SPEAKER_00
Got it.
5
SPEAKER_00
Your so.
5
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It sounds like a lot of this and correct me if I m wrong.
5
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is not stating the obvious all the time or not going for the low hanging fruit that everybody else goes for.
5
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Yes.
5
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What do you do?
5
SPEAKER_02
Oh, you re so tall or you re so pretty.
5
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It s just like boring stuff that you could universally apply to almost anyone you encounter.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I just saw someone do this by mistake on Bachelor in Paradise.
5
SPEAKER_00
I don t know if you ever watch that show.
5
SPEAKER_00
I watch it for work.
5
SPEAKER_01
You re writing shit down every second on that show.
5
SPEAKER_00
I mean, yeah, it s like the best.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I saw a guy use a social hack, and I was like, interesting.
5
SPEAKER_00
But it didn t really work, and here s what it was.
5
SPEAKER_00
So he came down, if you watch Battlestar in Paradise, like for work, like you could always say that you, like blame me, be like, oh, Vanessa Van Edwards told me that I should watch it for human behavior research, which is great.
5
SPEAKER_00
He comes down the stairs to like this room, this group full of singles, and the first girl he sees, he s like, oh, that blue looks great on you.
5
SPEAKER_00
I was like, oh, great, that s, all right, like that s a good comment, because she probably thought about her outfit, and I thought to myself, that s a good, kind of like not obvious compliment.
5
SPEAKER_00
And the next girl he saw, he was like, man, that orange looks great on you.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I was like, oh, dude, no, that is your that is your comments, not authentic, lazy and lazy.
5
SPEAKER_00
And then he did it again to the same girl.
5
SPEAKER_00
No, the same compliment, because he forgot.
5
SPEAKER_00
So later in the day, same day, same girl, same blue.
5
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He was like, God, just love that blue.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I was like.
5
SPEAKER_02
But it sounds like to me, it s like almost something you can t, I mean, you might have some of these cues, but to me, it also sounds like you have to just become a more interested person.
5
SPEAKER_02
I mean, that s the secret.
5
SPEAKER_00
Every tip I m giving is not easy in the sense of like, I m not giving you a line that you, you can t just be like, you re so interesting if someone wasn t just interesting.
5
SPEAKER_00
So all I m doing is creating, I m trying to create a like radar in your head that s looking for moments where you can be very charismatic.
5
SPEAKER_00
You have to wait for your moment, right?
5
SPEAKER_00
You have to wait for the moment where someone s exiting the bar.
5
SPEAKER_00
You have to work that at that.
5
SPEAKER_00
You also have to wait for the moment where someone says something actually interesting.
5
SPEAKER_01
Because there is there is a thing where you can over compliment.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
5
SPEAKER_01
And that s that s also too Hungry Tiger, too, because it s like when you re complimenting something on everything, it feels overwhelming.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yes, and I don t want you to do that.
5
SPEAKER_00
I d rather you wait for the moment where they said something funny or interesting or heartfelt or vulnerable.
5
SPEAKER_00
And that s like your capitalization moment.
5
SPEAKER_00
Think of it as like a bold or a highlight.
5
SPEAKER_00
If you highlight the whole page, nothing s highlighted.
5
SPEAKER_01
If we are going to Vanessa s advanced settings masterclass, what are some tips that we re getting from the advanced layer that are maybe not in your book?
5
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so this is not in my book.
5
SPEAKER_00
It s in my advanced module in my course, and I ll just share it with you.
5
SPEAKER_00
We have a whole 45-minute lecture on it, but we can do it together, which is the three steps of connection.
5
SPEAKER_00
So I m actually considering doing my next book on this topic because it s so powerful, which is this.
5
SPEAKER_00
So I ve always wondered how people connect.
5
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As an awkward person, I sometimes have trouble getting past that acquaintance phase.
5
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A problem I used to have in my life is I would meet people and I couldn t – we d go out to lunch.
5
SPEAKER_00
I wasn t actually making connections.
5
SPEAKER_00
So I found this research by Dr. Dan McAdams that found there are three levels of connection that to actually connect with someone you have to move through these three levels chronologically.
5
SPEAKER_00
The first level is called general traits.
5
SPEAKER_00
This is your occupation, your hometown, your family status.
5
SPEAKER_00
This is why in every early interaction you go, what do you do?
5
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Got any kids?
5
SPEAKER_00
You married?
5
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And then you re stuck.
5
SPEAKER_00
You re like trapped there.
5
SPEAKER_00
Because in that general traits like bracket, you stick with the basics.
5
SPEAKER_02
But do you have to go through, like you have to?
5
SPEAKER_00
You have to.
5
SPEAKER_00
Okay.
5
SPEAKER_00
You have to.
5
SPEAKER_00
I had you ask, working on anything exciting recently?
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Because you do have to talk about something that excites them.
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You can t skip that.
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SPEAKER_00
You can t.
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You can t.
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If I met you for the first time and I said, what are your hopes and dreams?
5
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Yeah, too much.
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You re like, what?
5
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No, it s like I tell Michael, fill me up before you fuck me.
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Like, you got it.
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Like, you got to, like, kiss.
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SPEAKER_01
Like, you got it.
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SPEAKER_01
You got it.
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You got to go slow.
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No one wants to be like when someone comes up to you and starts to tell you everything about them within five seconds of meeting him.
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It s too much.
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You know what?
5
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Also, and I ll just like.
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Lauren and I have been together a really long time.
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We met at a really young age.
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It s somewhat, I guess, unique how long we ve been together.
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We ve been together over 16 years.
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SPEAKER_00
My husband and I, 17 years, too.
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So you get it.
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We have a lot of friends that are mid-30s, and they re dating, and sometimes they will say they want to start settling down.
5
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They sometimes almost skip over the dating phase and go straight to the end.
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I know you were finishing a thought, but go off on that tangent for really quick because we need to play this on TikTok.
5
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Yeah.
5
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It s like they almost are like they re trying to play house and settle down.
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And I m like, this is 16 years.
5
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It took us 16 to get here.
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And you ve been two months and it s going to look different.
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You can t.
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The research has found there s a hierarchy of facts.
5
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There is something that I do every single day that is a non-negotiable that has absolutely transformed my life.
5
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And it is so simple, but it has been so profound.
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I take a walk every morning with my son.
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I put him in the stroller, and I do a walking meditation.
5
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And the app that I use is by Melissa Wood Teppenberg.
5
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It s called MWH.
5
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This is a platform that has the best meditations, you guys.
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They have legs up on the wall meditation.
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They have sound bowl meditations.
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They even have a walking meditation and the one that I like is 16 minutes.
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It s so beautiful and it truly sets the tone of my day.
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I am so obsessed with MWH.
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I screenshot it.
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I send it to my friends.
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It s all about strengthening both your mind and your body.
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The platform has workouts, meditations, nutrition, and lifestyle.
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I personally am drawn to everything on this platform.
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I m so obsessed with it.
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I have been a fan since Melissa came on our podcast years ago.
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Melissa s workouts offer a blend of yoga and Pilates, and her meditations are just so calming.
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I love Melissa s voice.
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I meditate with her every day.
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And as Melissa says herself, don t trust me.
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Try me.
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She s right.
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Visit melissawoodhealth.com and use code skinny at checkout to get your first month free off your monthly membership.
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You guys free.
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That s M E L I S S A W O O D H E A L T H.com and use code skinny for your first month free.
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There are three products that I use every single day, and they are all by Primal Kitchen.
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The first one is Primal Kitchen s ketchup.
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It is so good.
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I m telling you, it is the best ketchup.
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It s not made with cane sugar.
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It is the ketchup that I give my kids on their burgers.
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I eat it every single night on my burger with no bun.
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Michael eats it with his French fries.
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We go through bottles of this ketchup a month.
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This is the ketchup.
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The other thing that we use is Primal Kitchen s avocado mayo, but I m also not mad at their whipped mayo.
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We use the avocado mayo on Zaza s sandwich every single day.
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She likes it like turkey sandwich.
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And then I ll use the whipped mayo on a BLT.
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It s so good on sourdough.
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And then lastly, we also use a Primal Kitchen s dressings.
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We have the best dressings for salads.
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Sometimes we ll marinate chicken.
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I also really like their avocado oil.
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If you cook for your family, I m giving you the skinny on why Primal Kitchen is one of my go-to brands.
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All my other busy moms out there know how crazy life can get between work, taking care of kids, staying fit, and all the other things on our daily to-do list.
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Eating right is really important to me and Michael, but let s be real, I don t have a lot of time.
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I m sure you don t either.
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Primal Kitchen makes it super easy to whip up delicious family meals that we feel good about and even picky kids will love.
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I always keep some of their grilling sauces in my pantry, their ketchup, one of my favorite mom hacks, like I said, is marinating chicken in their dressings to add more flavors.
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And of course, we have a code for you that I will be using myself.
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You can find Primal Kitchen products at Target, Walmart, or your local grocery store.
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SPEAKER_00
I stock up at Target all the time.
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SPEAKER_00
Or go to primalkitchen.com and get 20% off your whole order with our personal code SKINNY.
6
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Use code SKINNY at checkout.
6
SPEAKER_00
That s primalkitchen.com.
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We have to move through the hierarchy of facts before we can actually feel connected.
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It does not make us feel safe if we jump to hopes and dreams without knowing who are you.
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And so we have to actually hit that level as quickly and as on a non-autopilot as possible.
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So I don t like what you do, because you re on autopilot, it s scripted.
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But you can ask what exciting things are you doing?
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Do you have any fun plans this weekend?
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What s been good?
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What s the highlight of your week?
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Those are all great questions that break autopilot, but you re getting to, are you married?
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Or like, I would rather you ask on a Monday and a Friday, Monday, do anything fun this past weekend?
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Friday, do anything fun this upcoming weekend?
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That s a secret way of asking, do you have kids?
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Are you married?
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What do you do for fun?
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But it s not socially scripted, right?
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Even on a date asking someone, what do you do for fun?
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Like it s like, if someone is so, that s so scripted.
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So that s level one, you have to go through it, but don t do it on autopilot.
6
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Level two is where things get more interesting.
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This is personal concerns, what Dr. Dan McAdams calls personal concerns.
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Personal concerns are goals, motivations, worries, values, personality.
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It s a big bucket.
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You know, so if you think about an exercise I do with my students, we can do it right now, pull out a pen and paper, write down the 5-10 people you interact with most, okay?
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It can be in person or virtual like texting.
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So the 5-10 people you interact with most, and I want you to ask yourself for each of those people, do you know what keeps them up at night?
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When they are very worried, what are they worrying about?
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Do you know what gets them up in the morning?
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Do you know what motivates them, what gets them excited?
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If you know the answers to those two questions, you re on level two with them.
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If you don t know the answers to those two questions, you re probably on level one with them.
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That s interesting.
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Right, that s like a very quick self-attack.
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So do a lot of people make the mistake of thinking they re further alone than they are?
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That s why you have them do the exercise.
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Yeah.
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Okay.
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Is there level three?
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Yeah.
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What s level 3?
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Okay, so most people stay on level 2 their entire lives.
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Like, you are lucky if you know your partner and your best friends and your kids level 3.
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Level 3 is very hard to get to and you have to work towards it.
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I think this is why you ll have couples who fall out of love.
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Or you have couples who feel disconnected and they don t know why.
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It s because they re not on level 3 and they don t know it.
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So level 3 is called your self-narrative.
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Your self-narrative is the story you tell yourself about yourself.
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It s how you make sense of your journey and purpose in the world.
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This is how you explain your actions, how you explain who you are.
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It s the answer to the question, what forces shaped your personality and made you who you are today?
6
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So what s really important is, one, you have to know your own self-narrative.
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Some people don t even know their own self-narrative.
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What is the story you tell yourself about yourself?
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I ll give you three examples.
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So in my work right now, I m researching what are the common self-narratives or common archetypes.
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One very common self-narrative is a hero self-narrative.
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You really like, you want to be around people with hero self-narratives.
6
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It s a great one to have.
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The story you tell yourself about yourself is, I ve had a lot of challenges, I ve had a lot of really difficult times in my life, but through smarts and hard work and grit, I overcame.
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That is a beautiful hero self-narrative.
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What we found is that if you have a hero self-narrative, you have it in every area of your life.
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And does it fall anywhere into arrogance or ego or is it still – because I think many people are listening like, oh, that sounds egotistical to have that narrative about yourself.
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No, because you still have the challenges and it was really difficult.
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People who have a hero self-narrative will say, man, those hard years were hard.
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It was not easy to overcome.
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grit and be creative and get lucky.
6
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No, so it s a lot about like that.
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The struggle is actually the hardest part for a hero.
6
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And then when they ve overcome, they feel like redemption.
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And everything is like this.
6
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If you work with a hero, I have heroes that I work with and every project is the same.
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This project is hard.
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Man, we don t have the resources.
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It s too expensive.
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It s too hard.
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And I go, you can do it.
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You can do it.
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It s like someone who figures it out and also doesn t have a victim mindset.
6
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OK, so victim is another self-narrative.
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And this is one where you really have to be careful of being in a relationship with someone of the victim self-narrative, working with someone in a victim self-narrative.
6
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Victim self-narrative has the same start as a hero, but they don t overcome.
6
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They have challenges, mistakes, and difficulties.
6
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They work, they sweat, they try to use their smarts, and they cannot overcome it.
6
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And they typically repeat that pattern over and over again.
6
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And here s a study that proves that idea.
6
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So one way that you can tap into your own self-narrative is to start a question, which is, I ask this to all my students, do you think you re lucky?
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You don t have to answer.
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I think this is actually a personal question.
6
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Do you think you re lucky?
6
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And how lucky do you think you are on a 1 to 10 scale?
6
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So Dr. Richard Wiseman did a study where he had people come into his lab and he tested them on their perceived luck.
6
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He asked them a series of questions and had them ranked on a scale of 1 to 10.
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There were certain people in his lab who thought of themselves as super lucky and some people thought of themselves as super unlucky.
6
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Then he gave them a little test.
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He handed them a newspaper, and he had them count the number of images in the newspaper.
6
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And there was a trick.
6
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There s always a trick.
6
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On the second page of the newspaper, in giant letters and an ad, it said, there are 43 images in this newspaper.
6
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Stop counting.
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Every single one of the lucky people saw the ad, closed the newspaper and said, there are 43 images in this newspaper.
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None of the unlucky people did.
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So people who perceive themselves unlucky literally see the world differently.
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They missed that ad.
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They kept counting and got more wrong answers.
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This is so weird, but I have this weird aversion to people who use negative words.
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So like if someone emails me and says, unfortunately, I immediately tune out.
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If someone starts texting me, it can t be done.
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I don t know how to do this.
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This is the problem.
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It s an undertone of negativity.
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And I would choose the word lucky just because it was
7
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was a positive word.
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I know that sounds very weird.
7
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The word unlucky turns me off.
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I m like, get away from me.
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Yeah.
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But I think like even the words that you talk, like if you re like, I can t afford it.
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I can t make it happen.
7
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Like what a drag.
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It s like a fucking anchor dragging you to the bottom of the ocean.
7
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The research proves this.
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The reason you don t like those words is it s a symptom of a victim mentality.
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And we don t like to be around victim mentalities because they don t overcome.
7
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They feel unlucky.
7
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And we are primed by the words we are sent.
7
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One of the things we do in our advanced class is doing a priming audit of your email sent folder.
7
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So a little quest you can do right now, open up your email sent folder, pull up five emails you spent some time on that like had some stakes, right?
7
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Like not all emails do.
7
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And I want you to count the number of positive words and the number of negative words.
7
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Even if there s a no in front of it, it doesn t count.
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So if it s like no worries, worries is a negative word.
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I don t know.
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I don t think we can make that happen.
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I don t think this time it ll work.
7
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Uh-huh.
7
SPEAKER_00
Oh, uh-huh.
7
SPEAKER_00
Oh, even even I can t wait to see you.
7
SPEAKER_00
I d rather say looking forward.
7
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, like it just like it s just like using those words to like make the whole experience more productive.
7
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Yeah, I think like I think and I ve never said it this way, but I think the problem I have with quote unquote victim mentality
7
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is it also indicates a level of ignorance to me.
7
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And I know this is going to go, these people aren t going to like me saying this.
7
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Ignorant in the sense that there s too much data and too many stories and too much written history of people that started as extreme victims and terrible circumstances that went on to go and be incredible successes.
7
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So like I, as an individual, if I look at all that data and say, look at how rough this person had it, or look at this person who immigrated with nothing and became something, or look at this person who
7
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you know, had the worst family upbringing and went and made... As long as you see that that data exists, you understand that it s possible if you have the right mindset.
7
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So to me, a victim mentality is just not self-serving enough to have.
7
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It doesn t harm anyone but yourself.
7
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
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And people with victim mentalities, all the data, they say, I am so unlucky, I m going to ignore the data, which is a terrible thing to do.
7
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Or I m so different and so much more unique than everyone else.
7
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And that s actually more narcissistic.
7
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
7
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It s actually more narcissistic to say, I am so above everyone else s data.
7
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I get such, I m so unlucky that I can t have a success, so I need more help.
7
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I need more, I need people to make excuses for me.
7
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They re constantly making excuses.
7
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There s actually one more narrative I would love to talk about, because I bet you people listening are this one.
7
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The one that interests me the most actually is the healer self-narrative.
7
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A healer self-narrative is someone who their entire story, their entire way of seeing themselves is being of service.
7
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Typically they pick service-based industries, teachers, counselors, doctors, coaches, and that is because maybe because of their parents or their childhood, they have found that helping people, being of service of others is the only way that they can find value.
7
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So a healer self-narrative is beautiful because they are givers, they are changers, they are teachers, but they struggle with people pleasing, they overextend, they say yes to too much and burnout, and they also can attract takers.
7
SPEAKER_00
Dementors?
7
SPEAKER_01
Dementors, yes.
7
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Like Zagara.
7
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Dementors, that s all I can think of.
7
SPEAKER_00
I would like to know if you were to wave a wand and give everyone who s listening six quick things.
7
SPEAKER_00
On your book, there s six.
7
SPEAKER_00
Maybe you could go through the six of things that they can do.
7
SPEAKER_00
And I know Michael asked this a little bit, but I want to go really broad.
7
SPEAKER_00
I want to do six that people can go leave this podcast with.
7
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OK.
7
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First would be check your profile picture and never ever show contempt.
7
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That is in person, that s on face, that s on video, that s in your photos.
7
SPEAKER_01
So contempt, one of the cues on Captivate is a one-sided micro-expression.
7
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So I have a very symmetrical face on that book.
7
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And profile pictures, the big mistake you will make is they do like an asymmetrical smile.
7
SPEAKER_01
And asymmetrical smile is actually a universal expression of scorn.
7
SPEAKER_01
So if you actually hold it, you ll end up feeling kind of like, better than, contemptuous.
7
SPEAKER_01
It s a very negative expression.
7
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We don t like asymmetry in the face.
7
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So it s a very weird one, but I would wave my wand and I would get rid of every contempt or smirk in profile photos, in meetings.
7
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Dr. John Gottman did a marriage study and he studied married couples for 30 years.
7
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And he wanted to know which couples would stay together and which couples would get divorced.
7
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And he found that there was a predictor of which couples would get divorced.
7
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He can tell you with 92% accuracy if a couple will get divorced within 30 years by looking for contempt.
7
SPEAKER_01
He found the couples who got divorced in the initial intake interview showed contempt towards the other.
7
SPEAKER_00
Contempt to me is so vague.
7
SPEAKER_00
What does that mean?
7
SPEAKER_02
If Lauren answered a question here and I was giving her a stupid answer, something like that.
7
SPEAKER_00
Contempt would be like... Making me feel stupid?
7
SPEAKER_00
Explain how we could show contempt.
7
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so it would be like in a couple, in Dr. John Gottman s research, it would be like the couples were talking about how they keep their home.
7
SPEAKER_01
And the wife might say, oh, he s just so dirty.
7
SPEAKER_01
He s so silly about that.
7
SPEAKER_01
And so there s this one-sided mouth phrase, which is like, I am better than him at that, and I feel disrespected.
7
SPEAKER_01
Contempt is a sign of disrespect.
7
SPEAKER_01
I feel disrespected by how he treats our home.
7
SPEAKER_01
It s not a great example, but it s a very direct.
7
SPEAKER_01
It s a good example.
7
SPEAKER_01
It shows a little bit of disrespect and a little bit of better than.
7
SPEAKER_01
So we see contempt in our lab.
7
SPEAKER_01
I love watching lie detection videos where I have people lie to me on video, and then I watch their facial expressions.
7
SPEAKER_01
Contempt usually happens when someone feels like they ve bested you.
7
SPEAKER_02
Like, I would never do that.
7
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, I would never do that.
7
SPEAKER_01
It s almost judgment.
7
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Judgment, for sure.
7
SPEAKER_01
So the marriages that break down are the marriages where there s a seed of better than, disrespect.
7
SPEAKER_01
I can do better than you.
7
SPEAKER_01
I m judging you.
7
SPEAKER_01
And so if I could wave a magic wand, it would be to get rid of that judgment piece.
7
SPEAKER_01
Get rid of that better than piece, because no one is better than you.
7
SPEAKER_01
No one is better than you.
7
SPEAKER_01
We think differently.
7
SPEAKER_01
We have different opinions.
7
SPEAKER_01
But even if someone has a victim self-narrative and you have a hero self-narrative, it doesn t make you better then, which makes you different.
7
SPEAKER_01
So I would waive the feeling of I am better than you and judgment.
7
SPEAKER_01
And I would also waive the physical symptom that shows up on dates and meetings and interviews and negotiations on profile pictures.
7
SPEAKER_00
Where can everyone find your books, Captivate the Science of Succeeding with People, and also Master the Secret Language of Charismatic Communication Cues, Small Signals, Incredible Impact?
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Okay, so if you re into body language, if you want to know the 97 cues that we coded, you want to read Cues, that s all about very micro hacks to changing your behavior.
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If you want to read more about being likable, being captivating in conversation, I would try Captivate.
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I do the Audible if you like my voice.
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They re, of course, wherever books are sold, and all of my YouTube videos are free, and I have tons of stuff on sciencepeople.com.
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One last question before you go.
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Why is John F. Kennedy so charismatic?
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Okay.
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So this is a case study I did in my book, and this is that the reason why we like John F. Kennedy is because he uses poised, elegant nonverbal.
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And this is, we like people who don t have extra movement.
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It s like a crazy thing.
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But nervous people, like nervous gestures, or people who fidget a lot, or they have gestures that don t help their cause.
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Kennedy, or people who use gestures, are using their gestures to help you comprehend.
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So the best TED Talkers, John F. Kennedy would say, I have three big ideas, and hold up the number three.
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That was a gift to you, the listener, to be like, wow, every movement is purposeful.
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So we can actually use that with if you want to come across as powerful or elegant, you want to control your movement to make it extremely purposeful.
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So it s almost like grounding movement without a lot of fidgeting.
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Yeah.
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No fidgeting.
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I would actually say no fidgeting and no self-touch.
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So self-touch is really, I m trying really hard to not flex with my hair.
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Like this whole interview, I m trying so hard to not touch it.
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And that is because research shows we touch our face, our confidence scores immediately go down.
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Immediately.
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We touch our hair, confidence scores immediately go down.
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That s so interesting.
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So I am trying very hard.
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If I m using a movement, I m using a purposeful gesture.
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I m using a punctuator with my hands.
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I m not self-touching my face, my hair, my wrists, my ring.
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I don t have pockets in my dresses because I don t want to touch them.
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So purposeful, controlled movement shows purpose of movement.
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Wow.
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Damn.
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Because I ve always wondered, ever since I was a little girl, I always like associate charisma with him.
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And I wasn t even alive when he was, like, that s wild.
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The memory.
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Also another purposeful movement is nodding.
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So nodding, so look at the difference.
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So if I m like, uh-huh, uh-huh, I look contemplative, I look like I m really interested and engaged versus mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, like a bobbleheader.
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That is a purposeless movement, right?
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Bobbleheading is a really, another wave of my wand would be no more bobbleheading versus a purposeful triple nod shows I am in agreement.
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And Kennedy was very, very good at that.
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Tell me more.
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Yeah, and the bobble almost makes me feel like you re speeding me along.
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Yeah, it s impatience.
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Do you think that he knew what he was doing innately, or do you think that it was actually strategic?
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I think he was very charismatic naturally, but I know from history that he was coached very specifically before his
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that he he Nixon believes he lost the entire presidential election in the first 30 seconds of their debate.
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So I break down the first 20 seconds of the debate in my book, like second by second, because Kennedy is very still.
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He does a very slow nod, which we love, whereas Nixon is like self-touching.
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He has like jerky gestures.
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He s like touching his legs.
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He s gripping his chair with like a white knuckled fist.
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All those cues before they even speak.
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You ve decided who s the winner.
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I think what s so interesting about this is even if you re naturally charismatic, you can always refine it.
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Always.
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And I think the real pros are constantly refining it.
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And if you re not, you re not evolving it.
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Yeah.
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And you re missing it.
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Well, I think the worst thing, and again, I say this to my… I just fidgeted this way here.
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Lauren says this is…
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Laura says this is harsh, but what drives me nuts sometimes is when people say, well, that s just who I am.
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It s like, well, you can change who you are.
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If you know who you are is not working for where you want to go.
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Listen, if you re being who you are and you re happy with where you re at in your life, God bless you.
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But if you re being who you are and you re not where you want to be in life, maybe you ve got to change a little bit about who you are.
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You ve got to improve yourself.
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You ve got to change.
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There s nothing that drives me more nuts when my friends, and I ll just relate it to dating, are maybe trying to date a girl, and they re like, well, I m just being myself, and this is who I am.
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I say, well, buddy, that s why it s not working.
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You ve got to change a couple things.
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Yeah, and also, I think the most charismatic people are constantly working on their charisma.
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Constantly.
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For sure.
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I love this episode.
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I find this whole topic fascinating.
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You re welcome to come back on.
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I know you ll write another book whenever you do.
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Yeah, and I m four minutes down the road.
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Now that we know you re local.
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Yeah.
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I mean, I m not going to fidget.
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You look great.
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You look great.
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I was just thinking about you.
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I love it.
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Are you working on anything exciting lately, Vanessa?
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Thanks so much for coming on.
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SPEAKER_01
Thank you, Vanessa.
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Thanks for having me.
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Two things before you go, you can watch us now on YouTube.
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SPEAKER_00
So you can go on YouTube, search the Skinny Confidential and watch our entire episodes on your computer or TV.
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Also, you should know Michael and I are doing a him and her newsletter.
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So basically it s a him and her tip of the day, five days a week.
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SPEAKER_00
And the tips are very specific as you can imagine.
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And then we also have a monthly favorites.
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SPEAKER_00
So basically we collect all our monthly favorites, everything we ve bought and used and tried and put it in one monthly newsletter for you to subscribe to the him and her tip newsletter.
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SPEAKER_00
All you have to do is go to tscpodcast.com.
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That s tscpodcast.com.