0
SPEAKER_00
Hi Liz.
0
SPEAKER_00
Hi.
0
SPEAKER_00
Who is here?
0
SPEAKER_00
Like a very short.
0
SPEAKER_00
Monica.
0
Monica.
0
SPEAKER_00
It was me.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m small Liz.
0
SPEAKER_00
You are small.
0
SPEAKER_00
This is really exciting.
0
SPEAKER_00
We have a lot to talk about today.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh we do.
0
SPEAKER_00
Before we even get into our questions.
0
SPEAKER_00
The main event.
0
SPEAKER_00
Welcome to Los Angeles.
0
SPEAKER_00
Thank you.
0
SPEAKER_00
You live here now.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s hard for you to even say.
0
SPEAKER_00
Let s talk about it.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh, God.
0
SPEAKER_00
I mean, I— Are you going to cry?
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
I ve cried all week.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I was just telling Rob I had last episode of Friends vibes of the empty apartment.
0
SPEAKER_00
Of course.
0
SPEAKER_00
But there were no friends because I banned anyone from saying goodbye to me.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh, you did.
0
SPEAKER_00
You hate goodbyes?
0
SPEAKER_00
I m really bad at goodbyes.
0
SPEAKER_00
Even like leaving a party or ending a conversation.
0
SPEAKER_00
I have a lot of issue with just being like, this is it.
0
SPEAKER_00
See you.
0
SPEAKER_00
Bye.
0
SPEAKER_00
And got really emotional.
0
SPEAKER_00
It was like 10 years in New York.
0
SPEAKER_00
So there s like a numerical effect, which I think is always interesting.
0
SPEAKER_00
That s science.
0
SPEAKER_00
It is.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s like a completion.
0
SPEAKER_00
Because in Punjabi weddings, my friend Komal told me, and I started to cry when she told me, obviously.
0
SPEAKER_00
She was like, no, because you know how funerals in Western cultures,
0
SPEAKER_00
everyone s in black, everyone s very sad.
0
SPEAKER_00
I always have wanted to create a cool funeral playlist, like a very happy one where I want it to be a celebration.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I feel like in Indian weddings, and particularly Punjabi culture, it s more of a celebration than a mourning.
0
SPEAKER_00
I mean, there is mourning, but there s also a celebration.
0
SPEAKER_00
Wait, for the funerals or the weddings?
0
SPEAKER_00
The funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, because you said weddings a couple of times.
0
SPEAKER_00
Did I say weddings?
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m out of it.
0
SPEAKER_00
I think you re conflating the two because it is the death of your soul.
0
SPEAKER_00
Weddings are funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, that s how I view, that s a Freudian slip.
0
SPEAKER_00
So basically Como was like, it s a completion.
0
SPEAKER_00
A funeral is like, you ve completed this life and now you re moving on to, and then I started to cry because I was like, oh, I m complete.
0
SPEAKER_00
What a wonderful time that I ve had.
0
SPEAKER_00
I moved to this country where I didn t know anybody, met people who became really like family.
0
SPEAKER_00
And then I have family here too.
0
SPEAKER_00
New chapter.
0
SPEAKER_00
New chapter, new characters, new season, new writers.
0
SPEAKER_00
I love all of that.
0
SPEAKER_00
Now I m realizing it might be Hindu weddings and not Punjabi.
0
SPEAKER_00
So if it s Hindu, we ll take it out.
0
SPEAKER_00
No, we re keeping, you don t understand how this show s gonna work, okay?
0
SPEAKER_00
I m keeping everything, all the mistakes, because that s life.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s a show where it s just the mistakes.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s just the stuff we want to take out and we leave it in.
0
SPEAKER_00
Isn t that life?
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, it is.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, but Punjabis, I think, are Hindu.
0
SPEAKER_00
Hindu is the religion.
0
SPEAKER_00
Punjabi is a area, Punjab.
0
SPEAKER_00
So the people from there are Punjabi, but they re probably Hindu or some might be Christian, I don t know.
0
SPEAKER_00
My secret knowledge does come out sometimes.
0
SPEAKER_00
I can t really hide it.
0
SPEAKER_00
But this actually is very relevant because recently I had to go to a memorial.
0
SPEAKER_00
My friend s mother passed.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I realized before, do I wear black?
0
SPEAKER_00
I think I m supposed to wear black.
0
SPEAKER_00
Are there speeches?
0
SPEAKER_00
Is there food?
0
SPEAKER_00
And I realized I ve never been to one of these.
0
SPEAKER_00
No way.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I ve only been to one.
0
SPEAKER_00
knock on wood, funeral in my life.
0
SPEAKER_00
What?
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
And no memorials.
0
SPEAKER_00
And it is not part of Indian culture at all.
0
SPEAKER_00
I mean, people in my family have passed, but we re not doing that.
0
SPEAKER_00
And then I wondered, what do we even do?
0
SPEAKER_00
I mean, there s no burials.
0
SPEAKER_00
Everyone s cremated.
0
SPEAKER_00
My dad s mother is dead, but I don t think he, like, went there to do something for a memorial.
0
SPEAKER_00
Were you there around when she passed?
0
SPEAKER_00
I was little, yeah, but she lived in India.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so you didn t go to the wedding.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh my god, what am I?
0
SPEAKER_00
No, but can I?
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, can I?
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, oh my god.
0
SPEAKER_00
No, but can I tell you?
0
SPEAKER_00
So I have the reverse experience where I can count on one hand the amount of weddings I ve been to.
0
SPEAKER_00
Not a lot.
0
SPEAKER_00
Funerals or weddings?
0
SPEAKER_00
Funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
No, weddings.
0
SPEAKER_00
I ve been to like maybe six weddings in my life.
0
SPEAKER_00
And before the age of 14, I d been to 10 funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
I have been to so many funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
I know how to funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
I could be your funeral wing person.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I think it s a mix of things.
0
SPEAKER_00
When I was really young, my sister s best friend died of chicken pox, like suddenly.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, very, very sudden death.
0
SPEAKER_00
And my sister was in the fifth grade and I was in second grade.
0
SPEAKER_00
And she was also in fifth grade?
0
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
0
SPEAKER_00
And we would take the bus every day together.
0
SPEAKER_00
And she just, yeah, got chicken pox.
0
SPEAKER_00
Is that because of Canada s health care?
0
SPEAKER_00
It s not about Canada.
0
SPEAKER_00
Don t turn it into a Canadian thing.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m sorry, but I ve just never... No, now kids, they don t even get chickenpox anymore.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, there s a vaccine.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yes, but at the time, again, we were encouraged, you get it and then you don t.
0
SPEAKER_00
Of course, we all got it.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yes, but there are some rare cases that have complications and it s one of those crazy rare.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh, that s awful.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I also think that my parents just have like, it s like a habit of going to funerals.
0
SPEAKER_00
Like I remember being at funerals of the parent of someone and we just would go.
0
SPEAKER_00
We just were like, yeah, that s really sad for this person.
0
SPEAKER_00
Like funeral crashed.
0
SPEAKER_00
You like looked in the newspaper to see what s not is today.
0
SPEAKER_00
We didn t take it that far.
0
SPEAKER_00
But it s like such a common experience and something everyone can understand like losing someone.
0
SPEAKER_00
And it s so devastating that like I would kind of go into a random funeral and just be there to honor that life.
0
SPEAKER_00
And if it s helpful, I don t know.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, it s really sweet.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s probably not.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s very sweet.
0
SPEAKER_00
But I m just wondering if I was throwing a funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
Throwing?
0
SPEAKER_00
Is that the term?
0
SPEAKER_00
Are there funeral throwers?
0
SPEAKER_00
Probably.
0
SPEAKER_00
If I was hosting a funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
Hosting?
0
SPEAKER_00
I don t know what you say.
0
SPEAKER_00
I don t think that s the word.
0
SPEAKER_00
I think it s just having.
0
SPEAKER_00
I don t think it s like a positive, uplifting.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, we could make it that.
0
SPEAKER_00
You re right.
0
SPEAKER_00
If I was hosting a funeral party.
0
SPEAKER_00
Hosting, okay.
0
SPEAKER_00
I like that.
0
SPEAKER_00
And I sent out the invites.
0
SPEAKER_00
And then people came, okay?
0
SPEAKER_00
And I looked and I thought, who s that?
0
SPEAKER_00
I don t remember inviting that person.
0
SPEAKER_00
And then I went up and I said, oh, hi, I m Monica.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m hosting this.
0
SPEAKER_00
How did you know Rob?
0
SPEAKER_00
Rob s dead in this.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, Rob, it s Rob s funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
It d be kind of weird that I m hosting Rob s funeral, but I am good at hosting.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, my family was all killed in an accident, so that s why you re hosting.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh no, oh my God, that s really sad.
0
SPEAKER_00
See, would you go to that funeral even if you didn t know who they were?
0
SPEAKER_00
I feel like I would go.
0
SPEAKER_00
No, I think that s disrespectful to just like pop in where everyone knows each other and they know the life of Rob and Rob s funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
I don t even like, I don t want to, I don t like this.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m knocking on wood again.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, my friend Barry, okay?
0
SPEAKER_00
I m hosting for my friend Barry.
0
SPEAKER_00
Let s role play.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay.
0
SPEAKER_00
Hi, I m Monica.
0
SPEAKER_00
I m hosting this funeral.
0
SPEAKER_00
Welcome.
0
SPEAKER_00
Do you like the decorations?
0
SPEAKER_00
I want to take back the premise of this because it wouldn t be like,
0
SPEAKER_00
oh, there s a funeral, let s check it out.
0
SPEAKER_00
But again, I have been to funerals of people I ve never met, but it was like the sibling or the parent of someone that I knew.
0
SPEAKER_00
And in that case, yeah, I didn t know Grandma Teresa.
0
SPEAKER_00
But there is a person there that you are supporting.
0
SPEAKER_00
I wouldn t actively seek out funerals, but I also think that I could enjoy the experience of mourning life, even if I didn t know who the person was, because life is life.
0
SPEAKER_00
That s really beautiful.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s so early to be talking about funeral crashing.
0
SPEAKER_00
That s crazy.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so you ve barely been to any weddings.
0
SPEAKER_00
I ve been to so many weddings.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, no one gets married in Quebec.
0
SPEAKER_00
We just buy condos and have kids.
0
SPEAKER_00
So you know a lot of people who are not married but with children.
0
SPEAKER_00
So many.
0
SPEAKER_00
My best friend Kat s parents have been together for 35 years.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s her boyfriend.
0
SPEAKER_00
My parents got married at the courthouse and like, it s just not a big wedding culture.
0
SPEAKER_00
And so I don t have an aversion to weddings, but I feel weird about it sometimes.
0
SPEAKER_00
It feels like a weird performance.
0
SPEAKER_00
Wow.
0
SPEAKER_00
I love them.
0
SPEAKER_00
I feel very life affirmed at weddings.
0
SPEAKER_00
Like life is beautiful.
0
SPEAKER_00
Love is beautiful.
0
SPEAKER_00
Really, a lot of it is seeing the two families.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yes, I like that part.
0
SPEAKER_00
And not just the families, but it s everyone in this person s life is here.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
Everyone in this person s life is here.
0
SPEAKER_00
And all of these people have contributed to getting this person here.
0
SPEAKER_00
Weddings are just so happy.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh, you re mixed messes.
0
SPEAKER_00
You love funerals and you hate weddings.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, it s like I find airports more romantic than a wedding.
0
SPEAKER_00
People saying goodbye at the airport, like you ll see, and that s like a quote, you ll see so much more sincere I love yous at an airport terminal than in a church.
0
SPEAKER_00
And funerals to me are like such a deep expression of love.
0
SPEAKER_00
There s no performance.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s the opposite.
0
SPEAKER_00
You don t want to be there.
0
SPEAKER_00
You wish you weren t doing this.
0
SPEAKER_00
And so there s something very like real and raw about it.
0
SPEAKER_00
There is.
0
SPEAKER_00
You re right.
0
SPEAKER_00
And beautiful.
0
SPEAKER_00
It makes sense.
0
SPEAKER_00
You enjoy crying much more than me.
0
SPEAKER_00
Do you enjoy sadness?
0
SPEAKER_00
I think I have an issue.
1
SPEAKER_00
I think I enjoyed nostalgia too much.
1
SPEAKER_00
I need to like work on that.
1
SPEAKER_00
Well, no.
1
SPEAKER_00
Unless it s causing you harm.
1
SPEAKER_00
Are you a nostalgic person?
1
SPEAKER_00
I used to be and I did have to detach.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
It was becoming almost pathological.
1
SPEAKER_00
Like it was becoming unhealthy for me to be living in this sort of melancholy longing.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
for a time I m never gonna get back.
1
SPEAKER_00
And also it kind of manifested in weird ways.
1
SPEAKER_00
Like I had this period where I was obsessed with taking pictures.
1
SPEAKER_00
I think it was because like we have to save this memory and capture it.
1
SPEAKER_00
And it just, then I like, wasn t having fun at the parties.
1
SPEAKER_00
And it was a fear of losing that moment.
1
SPEAKER_00
I think so, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s like, oh, I gotta capture this or else it will be gone forever.
1
SPEAKER_00
Where do you think that s from, that fear of loss?
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, that s so old, which again is ironic because as we just said, so much wood knocking.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
Can t use this.
1
SPEAKER_00
I have had very little loss.
1
SPEAKER_00
I ve been extremely lucky.
1
SPEAKER_00
Well, no, you had 10 funerals by the time.
1
SPEAKER_00
I know, but no one actually in my, I mean, my grandmother, grandparents.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, but I ve been very lucky too.
1
SPEAKER_00
Healthy family, friends.
1
SPEAKER_00
I know.
1
SPEAKER_00
And so almost because of that, perhaps I had no connection to that feeling.
1
SPEAKER_00
And it is so scary.
1
SPEAKER_00
The idea of it is so astronomical.
1
SPEAKER_00
I feel like I would never overcome it.
1
SPEAKER_00
So I live with a lot of fear.
1
SPEAKER_00
Also, I just live with a lot of fear because my parents have so much fear.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we talked about this the other day.
1
SPEAKER_00
When I was home most recently, thinking of the airport,
1
SPEAKER_00
I got to the airport and I just shook my head and patted myself on the back and said, you ve come so far in the fear department specifically because they are so scared of everything.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I think a lot of people would say that about me, which is why I felt like now I ve just been gaslit by all these people because they have no idea what I ve accomplished from where I came from.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay, this weird thing happened.
1
SPEAKER_00
I might have to cut it because it s like embarrassing by proxy.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_00
We went to this restaurant, my family, the four of us, in like a kind of hip
1
SPEAKER_00
And it s a bit far from my house.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then Atlanta traffic s awful.
1
SPEAKER_00
So it took us over an hour to get there.
1
SPEAKER_00
I could feel my dad getting anxious because of the traffic.
1
SPEAKER_00
I was like, it s fine.
1
SPEAKER_00
They know we re coming.
1
SPEAKER_00
They know we re going to be a little late.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s not a big deal.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then he s like, I knew we shouldn t have come at this time.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m like, what else are we doing?
1
SPEAKER_00
What else?
1
SPEAKER_00
And then I get in that tone, that like mean kid tone.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then we can t really find parking because of course it s a hip area.
1
SPEAKER_00
So there s going to not be a parking lot and you have to park on the street.
1
SPEAKER_00
And my dad,
1
SPEAKER_00
This starts to park.
1
SPEAKER_00
It was a huge spot.
1
SPEAKER_00
So he could have parallel parked, but also he could just go right in.
1
SPEAKER_00
And so he was like, should I parallel park?
1
SPEAKER_00
And we were like, no, my brother and I said, no, just go in.
1
SPEAKER_00
And like, we kind of, again, have that sort of mean little voice.
1
SPEAKER_00
And so I think he kind of panicked and like went in.
1
SPEAKER_00
so fast at a weird angle.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I was just like scraping the rim of his car.
1
SPEAKER_00
Well, he just wouldn t stop.
1
SPEAKER_00
He was just continuing to move forward.
1
SPEAKER_00
My brother and I are just staring at each other with mouths agape.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I screamed, dad, stop.
1
SPEAKER_00
Like he s a child.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I said, let me do it.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I made everyone get out of the car and I parked it.
1
SPEAKER_00
I know.
1
SPEAKER_01
I ve done that for someone before.
1
SPEAKER_00
But for a parent?
1
SPEAKER_00
No.
1
SPEAKER_00
I feel really guilty.
1
SPEAKER_00
Don t.
1
SPEAKER_00
This is the first time I ve said it out loud.
1
SPEAKER_01
People are bad at parallel parking though.
1
SPEAKER_00
I think my dad is extremely tough and I don t believe him to have any feelings of humiliation ever.
1
SPEAKER_00
That is humiliating, what I did to him.
1
SPEAKER_00
I don t think he processed it like that, because I don t think he s that type of person, but I think I might be protecting myself by saying he s just not that type of person.
1
SPEAKER_01
Set on the curb sad, watching you.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh no.
1
SPEAKER_00
What if you had been a man though?
1
SPEAKER_00
Is it the fact that you re his daughter?
1
SPEAKER_00
If Neil did it.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh, that s a good question.
1
SPEAKER_00
Do you think he would be as sad?
1
SPEAKER_00
Because I feel like that changes it a bit.
1
SPEAKER_00
Maybe that like his little girl has to parallel.
1
SPEAKER_00
But again, I m projecting this on him.
1
SPEAKER_00
He didn t say,
1
SPEAKER_00
Anything and that s why it s extra sad cuz he did just like get out and let me do it Sounds like maybe you should call him and ask him if it made him say I don t want him ever to think about that.
1
SPEAKER_01
Maybe that s not even sad Maybe that was like I don t want to do it anymore or he raises a tough daughter.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, right.
1
SPEAKER_00
He s good at driving I don t think he thought that in the moment
1
SPEAKER_00
I mean, I don t know how to drive, but I feel like if you re in a position where things are going badly, it might just be a relief for him and none of the sadness or embarrassment.
1
SPEAKER_00
Like maybe that s what you re projecting.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s nice.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh, we have a visitor.
1
SPEAKER_00
Hi.
1
SPEAKER_00
We have a dad.
1
SPEAKER_00
Just in time to hear a horrible story that you re gonna judge me for bad.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh my God, did you puke more hot dogs?
1
SPEAKER_01
No, we re not talking about that.
1
SPEAKER_00
I didn t puke them.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh no, well the experiment s complete.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m not talking about that on this podcast.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_01
That ll be out by then though.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s been compartmentalized into.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay, I puked a hot dog once.
1
SPEAKER_00
A whole hot dog?
1
SPEAKER_01
And blamed a single mom.
1
SPEAKER_01
It s a sweet, sweet story.
1
SPEAKER_01
One of the family s last hot dogs.
1
SPEAKER_00
Ever?
1
SPEAKER_01
This is the last money they had they spent on the hospital.
1
SPEAKER_01
She was a little girl.
1
SPEAKER_01
She was a 10-year-old little girl.
1
SPEAKER_01
No, we decided you were in fourth grade.
1
SPEAKER_00
Probably nine.
1
SPEAKER_00
I was probably nine.
1
SPEAKER_01
No, ninth is 10 years.
1
SPEAKER_00
I know, but I m young for my age.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh, okay.
1
SPEAKER_00
Are you?
1
SPEAKER_00
That s not even a sentence.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m in grade.
1
SPEAKER_01
But no, but you re not, are you?
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
You didn t graduate at 17.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes, I did.
1
SPEAKER_00
You did?
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes, I started college at 17.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh my goodness, you re a wunderkind.
1
SPEAKER_00
A little bit.
1
SPEAKER_01
A Douglas Hauser.
1
SPEAKER_00
I started kindergarten when I was- Two.
1
SPEAKER_00
Two months.
1
SPEAKER_01
Two months old, two months, days old.
1
SPEAKER_00
I was four, but yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so she was nine, fourth grade, and she was at her girlfriend s house, single mother.
1
SPEAKER_01
Apartment.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yep, yep.
1
SPEAKER_00
Why do those parts have to be retold?
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, I ll tell you why.
1
SPEAKER_01
If you threw up at Richie Rich s house, you d be like, oh, fuck those people.
1
SPEAKER_01
The stakes are there.
1
SPEAKER_01
Their butler cleaned it up, not the single mom.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yes, the single mother who s already worked to the bone and frazzled.
1
SPEAKER_01
Now worried she had poisoned this kid with her tainted hot dogs.
1
SPEAKER_01
And then poor Monty threw up in the middle of the night.
1
SPEAKER_00
In bed or in the toilet?
1
SPEAKER_01
In the child s twin bed.
1
SPEAKER_01
You know, the trundle.
1
SPEAKER_00
And did you have to go wake her up?
1
SPEAKER_00
No, I had to lie about it.
1
SPEAKER_01
Here comes the deceit.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so she was embarrassed, naturally.
1
SPEAKER_01
And she just pretended she had no clue why there was puked up hot dog in the bed in the morning.
1
SPEAKER_01
You kept sleeping in the puke?
1
SPEAKER_00
She had no choice.
1
SPEAKER_00
I had no choice, it was for survival.
1
SPEAKER_00
I probably asked my friend in the morning, did you do that?
1
SPEAKER_00
I don t remember that, but I know me and if I m in survival mode, I m sure I did do that.
1
SPEAKER_01
You have to play it like someone who didn t puke last night.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m good at knowing me.
1
SPEAKER_01
Your motivation, you re an actor, this is the beginning.
1
SPEAKER_01
I wonder if it was obvious it was you, like you had to throw up on your face and everyone just played along.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m sure, I m sure.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay, Monica.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s probably all over my shirt.
1
SPEAKER_01
T-shirt on says I love throwing up at sleepovers that no one noticed until that morning.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay, we recorded this yesterday.
1
SPEAKER_00
Now we re really exposing ourselves, which Dax hates.
1
SPEAKER_01
Three months ago.
1
SPEAKER_00
We recorded this many months ago.
1
SPEAKER_01
In 2020.
1
SPEAKER_00
And the whole reason we got into this is because I brought up something from Dax s past.
1
SPEAKER_00
He got a little sensitive about the fact that I brought it up.
1
SPEAKER_00
Go ahead, tell her.
1
SPEAKER_00
And he didn t have control over it.
1
SPEAKER_00
He pooped in the bed in an orgy.
1
SPEAKER_00
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I kind of was like, oh, it just came out of nowhere and we just dropped right into the punchline of the story.
1
SPEAKER_00
Right, because he s talked about it many times.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s not like it was a story I knew and nobody knew.
1
SPEAKER_00
He s talked about it.
1
SPEAKER_00
Sure.
1
SPEAKER_01
Right, right.
1
SPEAKER_00
So I brought that up and then it gave him a little bit of the jolt.
1
SPEAKER_01
You see, already now I feel like I need to tell Liz.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m back now.
1
SPEAKER_01
She just heard the punchline too.
1
SPEAKER_01
It was oily.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay, okay.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh yeah, that was his cover up.
1
SPEAKER_00
It was just oil.
1
SPEAKER_01
Let me be honest.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh yeah, we were supposed to cut that part.
1
SPEAKER_01
Hold on a second, hold on a second.
1
SPEAKER_01
what happened, Liz, was obviously 20 years ago.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think it was one of the first times I ever was in New York to do a late night talk show.
1
SPEAKER_01
Went out.
1
SPEAKER_00
He wasn t sober.
1
SPEAKER_01
Great night, doing a ton of coke, hanging with some other people.
1
SPEAKER_01
We all end up back at my hotel room, a guy and his girlfriend and this gal I met, sex on the bed, all of us at the same time.
1
SPEAKER_01
Now, there was no swappy swap, but it was a very heightened kind of
1
SPEAKER_01
70s playboy experiences.
1
SPEAKER_01
It was wonderful.
1
SPEAKER_01
They then got hungry because they were not doing as much cocaine as I was in.
1
SPEAKER_01
It s a suite and I m putting that in quotes.
1
SPEAKER_01
The hotel room was a suite, but really it was like the beds here in the couch you re sitting on right now.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s about the gap.
1
SPEAKER_01
So they were like in that little couch looking that way eating this breakfast.
2
SPEAKER_02
they had ordered to the room at like 8 a.m.
2
SPEAKER_02
I m now sitting on the bed still, I might be having a cigarette or something, this is post-coital, and I think, hmm, I just have no fart.
2
SPEAKER_02
Just the tiniest bit, and they re very far, well, they re not very far away, but they re far enough away that I m just gonna test and make sure that it s odorless.
2
SPEAKER_01
Can I roll quick?
2
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
2
SPEAKER_01
There s no test.
2
SPEAKER_02
There is, you can crack the bottle just like if you re opening a Pepsi, you know, and then you quickly close it and screw it back.
2
SPEAKER_01
Then it will still smell.
2
SPEAKER_02
But the volume you ve let out will be manageable.
2
SPEAKER_02
You ll get a hint of it and you re like, oh, don t do that.
2
SPEAKER_02
Go into the bathroom.
2
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
2
SPEAKER_02
Conversely, you, and then you, no, no, no.
2
SPEAKER_02
In the end, this is totally fine.
2
SPEAKER_02
I m going to let a little more out.
2
SPEAKER_02
And then step two,
2
SPEAKER_02
and then you close it, wait around.
2
SPEAKER_02
And this is a safe way to determine whether there s gonna be some offensive.
2
SPEAKER_00
Have you ever done this?
2
SPEAKER_00
You are nodding.
2
SPEAKER_00
I do this.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re testing sound too.
2
SPEAKER_02
Cause you don t know.
2
SPEAKER_00
Sure.
2
SPEAKER_00
And so you ll have an idea.
2
SPEAKER_01
No, I m gonna stop you right there.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can t test for sound.
2
SPEAKER_01
Either the sound will come out.
2
SPEAKER_02
Well, you re right in that monocade.
2
SPEAKER_01
You guys act like you have so much more control over your butts than most.
2
SPEAKER_02
Largely, that has been the case, but obviously the story I m telling, that wasn t the case this time.
2
SPEAKER_02
I had underestimated whatever impact the cocaine had on my stomach and no eating, and that was another thing.
2
SPEAKER_02
I hadn t eaten in 20-some hours, so I wasn t really concerned that there was even gonna be a smell.
2
SPEAKER_02
And then all of a sudden, I just went,
2
SPEAKER_02
Oh, and now they re right there.
2
SPEAKER_02
And I m like, oh my God.
2
SPEAKER_02
And then I, in a panic, I just grabbed the sheets and I walked into the bathroom and I shut the door and then I hop in the shower and then I am making sure there s zero evidence.
2
SPEAKER_01
Smart.
2
SPEAKER_01
Smart.
2
SPEAKER_01
Liz, be normal.
2
SPEAKER_01
That is not smart.
2
SPEAKER_01
You bring all these sheets from the bed into the shower and try to act like it s normal.
2
SPEAKER_01
What else are you going to do?
2
SPEAKER_01
Thank you.
2
SPEAKER_02
Work backwards from the options, Monica.
2
SPEAKER_01
If someone did that in your hotel room, wouldn t you be like, wait, what s going on?
2
SPEAKER_01
They took a sheet into the shower.
2
SPEAKER_01
They obviously puked a hot dog or shit in the bed.
2
SPEAKER_00
Those are the options.
2
SPEAKER_00
Would you pull them out and be like, who brought the sheets?
2
SPEAKER_00
Did you bring the sheets in here?
2
SPEAKER_00
That s what you do.
2
SPEAKER_02
You just like gaslight.
2
SPEAKER_02
So I m in the shower and I m in a bit of a panic now and I m cleaning the sheets up and then I m quickly trying to think of my explanation for why I went to the shower with the sheets and then I decide
2
SPEAKER_02
This is as bad as you asking your buddy.
2
SPEAKER_01
Have I never heard this?
2
SPEAKER_02
What I said is like, there was kind of some sex on the sheet that needed some cleaning.
2
SPEAKER_01
No, but you said it was the girl.
2
SPEAKER_02
No, I did not.
2
SPEAKER_02
I did not.
2
SPEAKER_02
It could have been the guy.
2
SPEAKER_02
I think you went straight there.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, cause you re embarrassed.
2
SPEAKER_01
I don t think you d be embarrassed if it was calm.
2
SPEAKER_02
Well, no, I wouldn t, nor would I be embarrassed if there was sex, but I thought that was a plausible explanation.
2
SPEAKER_02
No one seemed to really dig deeper.
2
SPEAKER_02
I mean, look, we went out 15 hours before.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_02
They re trying to get that free breakfast and then hit the road.
2
SPEAKER_01
Were they strangers?
2
SPEAKER_02
The dude, I knew a bit.
2
SPEAKER_02
He was a guy who was a club promoter in New York.
2
SPEAKER_02
You know, there s this whole industry in New York that doesn t really exist in LA.
2
SPEAKER_02
And when I was young and partied and I went to New York, I knew some of these promoters.
2
SPEAKER_02
And you would go to clubs and you d get free everything.
2
SPEAKER_02
And then they d drive you around and they knew who had drugs.
2
SPEAKER_02
And so, yes, I knew the dude, but no, I didn t know him well.
2
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
2
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_02
Wow.
2
SPEAKER_02
It was up until that little fiasco.
2
SPEAKER_02
Nice night for everyone.
2
SPEAKER_01
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I feel like I m proud of you.
2
SPEAKER_00
I feel like you are very intrepid and resourceful.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s my takeaway.
2
SPEAKER_01
This leads me to what I really want to talk about today.
2
SPEAKER_02
Okay, good.
2
SPEAKER_02
We found the thread.
2
SPEAKER_02
We had a lot of threads going.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s about Liz s mixed messages.
2
SPEAKER_02
Oh, good.
2
SPEAKER_01
How do I wanna get into this?
2
SPEAKER_02
How can I jump away?
2
SPEAKER_01
No, because I find this extremely fascinating and I do think this is the second episode of our show and I think it s going to be a through line throughout for both of us.
2
SPEAKER_01
Where we are very smart, you re too smart.
2
SPEAKER_02
To be forgotten, that s what I wrote in your yearbook in seventh grade.
2
SPEAKER_02
Too smart to be forgotten.
2
SPEAKER_01
And you are extremely knowledgeable on feminism, on how the world truly should operate, how the patriarchy infiltrates every single one of us.
2
SPEAKER_01
And you speak on this publicly.
2
SPEAKER_01
You go on the news, the actual news.
2
SPEAKER_01
America s news.
2
SPEAKER_01
To talk about this because you re an actual expert.
2
SPEAKER_02
That s the context.
2
SPEAKER_01
I m afraid of what s going on.
2
SPEAKER_01
No, no, no, but also.
2
SPEAKER_02
I know where you re going.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yes, I know you know, but I m gonna do it.
2
SPEAKER_01
Also, you re a real person.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_01
And you have some conflicting actions to your beliefs.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_01
And what I really want to be clear about is it s not hypocrisy.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s what we all do, which is we have a set of values and beliefs and what we know the way the world should be.
2
SPEAKER_01
However, the reality of the world doesn t always add up to the way the world should be.
2
SPEAKER_01
And there s often conflicting pieces there.
2
SPEAKER_01
Again, for all of us, for me majorly too.
2
SPEAKER_01
My therapist always says, let s try to do this so that your actions match your beliefs or your values.
2
SPEAKER_02
Knowing that often they don t and that s why you have to actually make a huge effort to do that Yeah, the statement humans are full of contradictions is like the most concise For me and I believe that and I support it and I don t think it s something to be ashamed of yeah It s not hypocrisy.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s contradiction
2
SPEAKER_01
we re going to be talking about this throughout this show, because we are in a position where I do think people for some reason have been interested in listening to what we have to say, which is very flattering.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I want to be very open about the fact that we live in reality.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so there s gonna be contradictions.
2
SPEAKER_02
Actions that might seem inconsistent.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I wanna dissect that, like it s fascinating that we know how things should be and then sometimes we don t behave that way.
2
SPEAKER_02
I would argue it s the only thing interesting about humans.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s the number one thing.
2
SPEAKER_02
When you re watching a show you love, generally what you love is that the lead character, the protagonist that you like is trying to juggle many different objectives and goals and desires and often they re at odds with one another.
2
SPEAKER_02
And that s drama.
2
SPEAKER_02
That s what s interesting.
2
SPEAKER_02
That s what makes humans fascinating, is the tension and contradiction and the challenges.
2
SPEAKER_00
For sure.
2
SPEAKER_00
Does it resonate?
2
SPEAKER_00
I mean, I also want to say I ve done a lot of things that are hypocritical.
2
SPEAKER_00
Like, I think if you re a smart person, actually, you are able to reflect and be unsure about your own positions and your own behavior.
3
SPEAKER_02
behaviors.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I think that that s actually something that I wasn t always good at doing.
3
SPEAKER_02
I was so convinced of the way that I thought that I was and of the way that I thought other people were and systems, right?
3
SPEAKER_02
Like, I don t think I m the only one.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s all in the sort of air of this moment of everyone has their own reality that s reinforced in all these different ways.
3
SPEAKER_02
But I think it s good to reflect on our contradictions.
3
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_03
Originally, I wanted to name this podcast, Mr. Jones, off of the movie, Burnt, that Bradley Cooper stars in.
3
SPEAKER_03
He s a chef in that movie.
3
SPEAKER_03
He plays a very Anthony Bourdain-type character.
3
SPEAKER_03
And he s a dick.
3
SPEAKER_03
I mean, he s awful.
3
SPEAKER_03
He, like, shoves this girl across the kitchen.
3
SPEAKER_03
Sienna Miller.
3
SPEAKER_03
By all accounts, a bad dude.
3
SPEAKER_03
And I am watching this movie- Spraying in your pants?
3
SPEAKER_03
wet, like turned on.
3
SPEAKER_00
Turned on.
3
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
3
SPEAKER_00
Turned on.
3
SPEAKER_03
Turned.
3
SPEAKER_03
He is so hot in it.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m getting turned.
3
SPEAKER_03
I know, I know, I know.
3
SPEAKER_00
Can you describe him a little more?
3
SPEAKER_03
Well, he s got those eyes and his hair looks great.
3
SPEAKER_03
At one point he s walking and it s just the back of him.
3
SPEAKER_03
It s just the back of his neck and it s hot.
3
SPEAKER_03
And I got so angry with myself during this when I was watching it, because I thought, why do I
3
SPEAKER_03
like him, he s awful.
3
SPEAKER_03
To me, that was an example of this, right?
3
SPEAKER_03
Where I know that this is a bad dude.
3
SPEAKER_03
He s hurting women.
3
SPEAKER_03
He doesn t give a shit.
3
SPEAKER_03
He s so entitled.
3
SPEAKER_03
And that is not a person I should ever want to be with.
3
SPEAKER_00
And there you are all fucked up.
3
SPEAKER_00
But here I am.
3
SPEAKER_03
Dying to be with him.
3
SPEAKER_00
Equipment out of your nightstand.
3
SPEAKER_00
Oh my god.
3
SPEAKER_00
But yes.
3
SPEAKER_02
Do you feel like that about women?
3
SPEAKER_02
I feel like guys have that with women too, like women that they re attracted to or women that they want to, and they re like, this doesn t align.
3
SPEAKER_00
Okay, I m going to join that.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m going to answer that.
3
SPEAKER_00
But I do want to just say, you might tell yourself as I m a proponent of this, and I m outspoken about that, and I believe in this.
3
SPEAKER_00
And if you know this thing about me, it will discredit the other things.
3
SPEAKER_00
And I will lose the thing that I like because I will have lost credit.
3
SPEAKER_00
Which, if you distill that even further, it s really just the most fundamental thing, which is, if you know everything about me, you won t love me.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m not worthy of love if you know all about me.
3
SPEAKER_00
And then we dress it up as like,
3
SPEAKER_00
the economic model of it, that your livelihood s on the line.
3
SPEAKER_00
And then so that becomes a justification that feels very real and defendable.
3
SPEAKER_00
But really at the core, it s the same thing everyone s struggling with nonstop, which is if you actually looked at all of me, you would run away from me.
3
SPEAKER_00
And in my experience, that fear is just that, it s a fear.
3
SPEAKER_00
And in fact, all the things that I m afraid you ll hate about me, probably you ll like about me.
3
SPEAKER_02
And that s a rejection of ourselves.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m rejecting this facet of me that s attracted to someone that s not aligned with who I want.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s repugnant.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yes, and that s your rejection.
3
SPEAKER_02
I don t think anything differently of you because of that.
3
SPEAKER_02
I think it s in our self-rejection and what kind of story we make based on certain feelings or certain attitudes or certain behaviors that we have.
3
SPEAKER_02
I don t think there s anything wrong with being attracted to the kind of guy that you re like, this isn t who I would want to marry.
3
SPEAKER_02
But that s not also who you want to marry.
3
SPEAKER_02
And that s not probably who you re going on dates with.
3
SPEAKER_02
And there s a difference between a preference and like making life decisions.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
I do see what you mean.
3
SPEAKER_00
It could also be an application.
3
SPEAKER_00
Like, Oh, this guy s good for this application.
3
SPEAKER_00
Crazy horny in my bed, but not for the other application.
3
SPEAKER_03
Yes.
3
SPEAKER_03
What I think is fascinating personally is me as someone who is hyper aware of the problems of a person like that and what it does to women specifically.
3
SPEAKER_03
The fact that my body can still react like that is interesting, minimally.
3
SPEAKER_03
It s just interesting that we can hold two things at once.
3
SPEAKER_03
And like you said, my actions, I can force to more match my values, but our innate selves sometimes betray us.
3
SPEAKER_03
And I think we re going to explore that.
3
SPEAKER_02
But I don t see it as a betrayal.
3
SPEAKER_02
I really don t.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I think that s actually like an old version of me was like, that s bad.
3
SPEAKER_02
And anything in sex that s like aggressive or dominating or playing into any kind of power dynamic, that s patriarchy.
3
SPEAKER_02
I don t think that s true at all.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I think that s the most feminist thing you can do is be free to explore all of that.
3
SPEAKER_02
I think thinking that there s something wrong with wanting that in a sexual way might be what you want to, like, think about.
3
SPEAKER_02
Because I don t think that s what you want in a long term.
3
SPEAKER_02
And maybe we can think about, is it bad if a woman wants that in a long term relationship?
3
SPEAKER_02
I don t know.
3
SPEAKER_02
Can we judge her?
3
SPEAKER_02
But I think, yeah, there s like a sexual
3
SPEAKER_02
component for you for that.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I think that s a great thing for you to explore.
3
SPEAKER_02
And tons of women want to be thrown around in bed and like be handled in a certain way.
3
SPEAKER_02
And that s, I think, a positive thing to know that and to explore that with someone who s respectful and doesn t throw you around when you re eating breakfast next day, you know, that contains it in a certain environment.
3
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_03
Well, the reason I brought this up is now I kind of forget, but you said something to him.
3
SPEAKER_00
You pubed, I shit.
3
SPEAKER_03
I know, but you d had a reaction to him that I thought was contradictory.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_03
Maybe it was you saying you re proud of him, because you re not.
3
SPEAKER_02
I am.
3
SPEAKER_02
You are?
3
SPEAKER_02
No, I fully mean that.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay, I don t even want to tell the story.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s not like great.
3
SPEAKER_02
Do you think Monica s and I were really I ve had poop sure and like slept over this guy s face.
3
SPEAKER_02
I just started dating wearing his boxers He goes for a shower and I do the test.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m like, I m just gonna let one little and it wasn t it wasn t a problem
3
SPEAKER_02
but there was some clean up mess in his boxers.
3
SPEAKER_02
And then I was like, same thing where like, oh my God, this is the worst, I m in his apartment, I can t go anywhere.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I was like, take off the boxers, put them in your bag.
3
SPEAKER_02
And the fact that I figured it out and that he never knew, I was like very proud of myself.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so that s what I mean where I m like, then it s shame and it s, you know, humiliation and that you re able to be like, I figured it out and like problem solved it without going into a bad behavior or other coping mechanism that would be negative.
3
SPEAKER_02
Like you just figured it out.
3
SPEAKER_02
And that s what I mean by I m proud.
3
SPEAKER_01
You survived.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yes.
3
SPEAKER_02
Poop emergencies are like throw ups.
3
SPEAKER_02
There s this sense of like, oh, you know, I have to manage this and what am I going to do?
3
SPEAKER_02
And I think what people are able to do and I think it s good.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_02
For some reason, this is weird.
3
SPEAKER_03
I am proud of you.
3
SPEAKER_03
About the boxer?
3
SPEAKER_00
Yes, yeah.
3
SPEAKER_03
I think you handled that perfectly.
3
SPEAKER_03
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_03
I m very sorry that happened to you.
3
SPEAKER_00
I m excited that that happened.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s a great story.
3
SPEAKER_00
And it definitely makes me like you more.
3
SPEAKER_03
Anyway, I am proud of you for doing what you had to do in that moment.
3
SPEAKER_03
I do think that both of you are clearly wrong about opening the Coke bottle because both of you have made huge mistakes.
3
SPEAKER_03
So I would advise everyone listening to never test it.
3
SPEAKER_00
Can I defend us?
3
SPEAKER_00
Sure.
3
SPEAKER_00
Oh, I can t speak for Liz, but I ve cracked the Pepsi bottle in the three to 500,000 times in my life range.
3
SPEAKER_03
It only takes one time.
3
SPEAKER_00
And I ve had a few mix-ups.
3
SPEAKER_00
Those are outrageously good numbers.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s true.
3
SPEAKER_00
Those are above 99%.
3
SPEAKER_00
I agree, I agree.
3
SPEAKER_00
So it isn t a very effective technique, but you re right.
3
SPEAKER_00
Once every five years, you re hiding some boxers in your purse.
3
SPEAKER_03
And what s 100% is not doing that.
3
SPEAKER_03
But so what do you do?
3
SPEAKER_03
If you have to, what do you have to do?
3
SPEAKER_00
I can t wait to hear this.
3
SPEAKER_03
You have to suck it back in.
3
SPEAKER_03
But then it like, you can do that to a certain extent, but it starts cramping.
3
SPEAKER_00
Listen, Monica doesn t know her privilege.
3
SPEAKER_00
This is one of the rare situations where Monica cannot own her privilege.
3
SPEAKER_00
For some reason, she doesn t have to fart as bad as the rest of those people do.
3
SPEAKER_00
And she s convinced herself it s willpower and integrity.
3
SPEAKER_03
That is exactly what it is.
3
SPEAKER_03
It is not about privilege.
3
SPEAKER_03
It s about my fucking hard work that I ve worked to
3
SPEAKER_00
This is what white people think.
3
SPEAKER_00
They re like, I ll work my ass off.
3
SPEAKER_00
What do you mean?
3
SPEAKER_00
Of course I m CEO.
3
SPEAKER_00
I ll work my ass off.
3
SPEAKER_03
Oh my God.
3
SPEAKER_03
You have no idea what I ve been through because I don t want to be excommunicated.
3
SPEAKER_03
I ve never been allowed to fart.
3
SPEAKER_03
This is real.
3
SPEAKER_00
Will you acknowledge that you pee one-tenth the amount that normal people pee?
3
SPEAKER_00
Let s start there, something we can agree on.
3
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
3
SPEAKER_00
Wow, I m so jealous.
3
SPEAKER_00
Okay, so anatomically, I don t know why.
3
SPEAKER_00
It s so curious.
3
SPEAKER_03
I do.
3
SPEAKER_03
I ve also had many bladder infections.
3
SPEAKER_03
Like, it s to my detriment.
3
SPEAKER_03
It s not like, my mom used to tell me, you need to pee.
3
SPEAKER_03
You need to force yourself to do that, because I would get sick.
3
SPEAKER_03
But there s something about going to the bathroom or... Stop.
3
SPEAKER_03
That is embarrassing.
3
SPEAKER_03
I just was very scared of embarrassment.
3
SPEAKER_03
I would do any, obviously, obviously with the puke in the bed.
3
SPEAKER_03
I would do absolutely anything to avoid.
5
SPEAKER_01
It s hotter when I think that you re... Hot.
5
SPEAKER_01
All right.
5
SPEAKER_01
Well, I was telling, before you got here, I was telling a very sad story about my dad.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m sorry.
5
SPEAKER_01
Took a turn.
5
SPEAKER_01
Now I really took a turn.
5
SPEAKER_01
That was a good turn though.
5
SPEAKER_01
Let s get into a couple, because I ve declared this show is going to be an hour and 15 minutes.
5
SPEAKER_03
Well, I may leave you guys for this then.
5
SPEAKER_01
You don t want to do this part?
5
SPEAKER_03
Oh, I ll do one.
5
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
5
SPEAKER_03
I just want to be pumping iron by 10 30 so that I can fart.
5
SPEAKER_03
I thought you were going to take another dump.
5
SPEAKER_03
Let me put my pants down there while I m squatting.
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
5
SPEAKER_01
Let s do this one.
5
SPEAKER_01
This is from Ariel or Ariel.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m a grown woman obsessing over a celebrity.
5
SPEAKER_01
How do I stop help?
5
SPEAKER_02
Oh,
5
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so ever since I watched Wednesday, I ve been obsessed, just like Monica.
5
SPEAKER_01
But the obsession kind of grew and it became more about Jenna Ortega.
5
SPEAKER_01
I have no idea why I, a happily married 31-year-old woman, care about what a 20-year-old actress is doing, but I can t stop listening to her interviews, watching her movies, and even going down some TikTok rabbit holes.
5
SPEAKER_01
I feel like it s weird, but I can t seem to stop.
5
SPEAKER_01
Am I a weirdo?
5
SPEAKER_01
Help.
5
SPEAKER_01
First of all, no, you re not a weirdo.
5
SPEAKER_01
Or if you are, you re in good company with other weirdos.
5
SPEAKER_01
Obviously I have opinions on this because I go down so many.
5
SPEAKER_01
You do too.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
Who?
5
SPEAKER_00
Very few select people.
5
SPEAKER_03
Who s your most recent one?
5
SPEAKER_00
I got a little obsessed with her too, actually, in a weird way.
5
SPEAKER_00
She has a certain kind of way to like absorb you in.
5
SPEAKER_00
And Ryan Gosling, particularly Ryan Rosling and Ryan Gosling.
5
SPEAKER_03
And Ryan Rosling, his uncle.
5
SPEAKER_00
He s not as known, but he s really hot.
5
SPEAKER_00
I m so obsessed with him.
5
SPEAKER_00
No, like the Rachel McAdams and Ryan Gosling era, I ve seen every photo.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, you sent me a video.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yes, the MTV award kiss that we found out that they were dating.
5
SPEAKER_00
And like, I ve gone down the rabbit hole, even though it happened 12 years ago at this point.
5
SPEAKER_00
You revisit it sometimes.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, I revisit it.
5
SPEAKER_00
It s like very calming to me and soothing.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I m like, why am I watching this crusty video?
5
SPEAKER_00
I have a theory about why it s getting worse.
5
SPEAKER_00
You know, it s kind of been out there that
5
SPEAKER_00
Like parasocial relationships.
5
SPEAKER_00
Exactly.
5
SPEAKER_00
We re spending more time away from our friends and our real life interactions.
5
SPEAKER_00
And so these virtual connections just become that much more like couples that you hardly know.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
5
SPEAKER_00
You re like, they re not posting photos anymore.
5
SPEAKER_00
I got to go on a deep dive and figure out what happened in their relationship, even though you don t know who they are or barely, and you get very interested in people that you don t know.
5
SPEAKER_01
You project a lot onto these people about what your life could be like if they were in your life.
5
SPEAKER_01
I think that s a big part of this sometimes is if I had their life or if I was somehow in their life, I would feel like this.
5
SPEAKER_01
I would be so happy or I would get to have this banter with them or they re so funny.
5
SPEAKER_01
I mean, look, I did this with Kristen.
5
SPEAKER_01
And so I have a very full circle of
5
SPEAKER_01
Having watched videos of her and was obsessed with Veronica Mars, thinking, oh my gosh, I could be her best friend.
5
SPEAKER_01
I know it because I understand her and we re the same, like the way we talk.
5
SPEAKER_01
And then that happened.
5
SPEAKER_01
Then we had a real relationship, which is so different.
5
SPEAKER_03
Turns out Kristen doesn t investigate a ton of crimes the way Veronica Mars did.
5
SPEAKER_01
Well, she does.
5
SPEAKER_03
That s one of the immediate things you re a little bit struck by the fantasies.
5
SPEAKER_01
Disappointed, yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
The show is the gateway.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
No, I m just teasing.
5
SPEAKER_03
I know what you mean.
5
SPEAKER_01
Like Wednesday is the gateway for her for Jenna Ortega and she s watching it and she s imagining what her life would be.
5
SPEAKER_01
This is subconscious, but it s imagining a life side by side and it must be so good.
5
SPEAKER_01
And you know, the reality is it s not, but you can t know that.
5
SPEAKER_00
You can t know that.
5
SPEAKER_01
So I can t tell her to just say, well, I know that the reality wouldn t match up.
5
SPEAKER_01
I think she has to do some practical things like go to dinner with a friend.
5
SPEAKER_01
Like if it s starting to get really deep, force yourself to have an actual connection with a person in your life as opposed to this kind of fake one.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_03
I think first and foremost, it s an interesting question conceptually, which is what s the problem?
5
SPEAKER_03
I think a big thing maybe is like, we are all prone to like, I m doing this thing.
5
SPEAKER_03
How do I stop?
5
SPEAKER_03
Why am I doing it?
5
SPEAKER_03
I was like, well, first of all, is there anything wrong with you doing that?
5
SPEAKER_03
What s the objective wreckage from this obsession?
5
SPEAKER_03
Are you not present when you re talking to your partner?
5
SPEAKER_03
Are you not present with your kids?
5
SPEAKER_03
Are you distracted at work?
5
SPEAKER_03
If these things are happening, then yeah, maybe this is something, but also maybe lighten up on yourself.
5
SPEAKER_03
Maybe it s fine that you daydream about this person.
5
SPEAKER_03
I, you know, in AA, a common saying is like, find someone who s got what you want and ask them how they got it.
5
SPEAKER_03
And that could be a million different things.
5
SPEAKER_03
It could be being a good parent.
5
SPEAKER_03
It could be that they have a cool car.
5
SPEAKER_03
It could be that they re financially, whatever the thing is you want, that someone has asked them how they got it.
5
SPEAKER_03
Learn from them.
5
SPEAKER_03
Look, I got obsessed with Jen R take a two.
5
SPEAKER_03
I haven t requested someone from a TV show that I ve watched in at least a year and a half to be on armchair expert.
5
SPEAKER_03
And I came, I was like, we got to get this girl.
5
SPEAKER_03
I m obsessed.
5
SPEAKER_03
She s such a wish fulfillment.
5
SPEAKER_03
She seems to have zero codependency, which all of us carry a ton of.
5
SPEAKER_03
So that s aspirational.
5
SPEAKER_03
That s great.
5
SPEAKER_03
That might be why you like her is that she moves through the world without saying sorry and she s driven and has purpose and she doesn t really give a fuck what the fallout from that is.
5
SPEAKER_03
Maybe that s what you re obsessed with.
5
SPEAKER_03
maybe that is a great characteristic you need to be aiming for.
5
SPEAKER_03
A lot of my thoughts would just be like, maybe don t worry so much that this is happening unless there s actual discernible wreckage.
5
SPEAKER_01
Well, she s saying I can t seem to stop, which means she has now found this to have been sort of out of her control.
5
SPEAKER_01
And I know what that feels like.
5
SPEAKER_01
That s living in fantasy land, which is a different thing than just admiring a person and wanting to know about a person.
5
SPEAKER_01
and wanting traits of theirs.
5
SPEAKER_01
There s a level of that.
5
SPEAKER_03
It s all in the nuance, right?
5
SPEAKER_03
It s like, when is it crossed the line into, you re not living your life because you re living this fantasy life.
5
SPEAKER_03
But a lot of us have a knee-jerk response to, I have this compulsion to do this, so that must be bad.
5
SPEAKER_03
Any compulsion to do something might be bad.
5
SPEAKER_03
But then you also go like, you got a lot of hours to fill in the day.
5
SPEAKER_03
Some kind of compulsive thinking, if it s not about that, what s it gonna be about?
5
SPEAKER_03
Food?
5
SPEAKER_03
Is it gonna be about your diet?
5
SPEAKER_03
That s your brain.
5
SPEAKER_03
Maybe it s a safe one.
5
SPEAKER_01
I also trust that you know when something has gotten out of hand, even with Alice and Roman, for me with cooking videos, every now and then I will have to take a second and say, this isn t very healthy.
5
SPEAKER_01
Am I avoiding something?
5
SPEAKER_01
I ve been in this for too long.
5
SPEAKER_01
I m trying to escape something.
5
SPEAKER_01
And to an extent, that s fine, but you can t let that get out of control because you do have to live in your reality.
5
SPEAKER_00
Even with Ryan Gosling and Rachel McAdams, there was a point where I was like, why is this so comforting to me?
5
SPEAKER_00
And I was like, oh, because that s the kind of relationship I would want.
5
SPEAKER_00
This very raw, and again, romanticized, and made up from my perspective, 100%.
5
SPEAKER_00
Why is that a fantasy that I escape to?
5
SPEAKER_00
What am I avoiding?
5
SPEAKER_00
Being curious, actually, instead of indicting ourselves.
5
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, judgmental of ourselves.
5
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, I go to that so much and I ll just be like, oh, this is so bad that I m doing this.
5
SPEAKER_00
And I m like, wait, what if I approach this just by asking questions as opposed to coming in with self-judgment?
5
SPEAKER_00
Not only could she learn something about it, it doesn t mean that she ll stop necessarily or it ll dramatically decrease the amount of time that she spends doing it, but at least she ll learn about herself through it.
5
SPEAKER_03
Also, every now and then just reminding yourself, we re little monkeys on planet Earth, wasting time until we re dead.
5
SPEAKER_03
That s that.
5
SPEAKER_03
There s no big moral force in the sky evaluating our every decision and levying a verdict of hedonist, glutton, you know, whatever the seven deadly sins are.
5
SPEAKER_01
I agree with all of this.
5
SPEAKER_01
And I also think practically, if you feel like this is getting out of hand, I would connect with a real person.
5
SPEAKER_01
Real social connection is scientifically better for you.
5
SPEAKER_01
It s why friendships lead to longer lives.
5
SPEAKER_01
Parasocial relationships don t lead to longer lives.
5
SPEAKER_01
Real intimate relationships do.
5
SPEAKER_01
So it is important to make sure that it s balanced.
5
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_01
All right.
5
SPEAKER_01
Well, let s do one more, or maybe two.
5
SPEAKER_01
We ll see how fast we can get through.
5
SPEAKER_01
This is from Corey.
5
SPEAKER_01
What perspective advice can you give to a single dad reentering the world of dating?
5
SPEAKER_01
I m a 31-year-old father of an eight-year-old boy and moved to a new state in order to continue to co-parent with my son s mother, now ex-wife.
5
SPEAKER_01
It has been a challenge feeling comfortable in the dating world again, especially with a relatively older son given my age.
5
SPEAKER_01
And a big challenge with that has been navigating emotional vulnerability with different women I ve been romantically involved with.
5
SPEAKER_01
While I understand having a child and not being married can easily lead to the question of,
5
SPEAKER_01
quote, what happened, it s been hard to separate healthy emotional connection and trauma dumping at times.
5
SPEAKER_01
What are some recommendations for navigating that well?
5
SPEAKER_01
And what type of things are important for me to consider and understand from the point of view of a woman I enter into a romantic relationship with as a single dad?
5
SPEAKER_03
Have you dated some single dads?
5
SPEAKER_01
Oh, yeah.
5
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
5
SPEAKER_03
You kind of like single dads, don t you?
5
SPEAKER_00
I love single dads.
5
SPEAKER_00
I love a divorced dad.
5
SPEAKER_00
I really, it was my best relationship.
5
SPEAKER_00
Like I was a little younger, like I was 31 or 30.
5
SPEAKER_00
Our friend set us up.
5
SPEAKER_00
I was like, oh, divorce, two kids.
5
SPEAKER_00
Like it was not like a turn on.
5
SPEAKER_00
But at the time I was like, okay, I ll go on a date with him.
5
SPEAKER_00
And it adds complications to a relationship for sure.
5
SPEAKER_00
And like there are a lot of other people in the relationship, you know, who are,
5
SPEAKER_00
involved in the relationship, but he was the most responsible, generous planner, and he had two daughters.
5
SPEAKER_00
There s just, like, another level of reflection and understanding and caring.
6
SPEAKER_01
and I even think like nurturing that comes with being a father.
6
SPEAKER_01
Like there s something that s more important than you.
6
SPEAKER_01
So not that all dads are necessarily perfect and don t have egos, but I think that there is like a little bit, not an ego death, but definitely like a knocking down of it.
6
SPEAKER_01
And so I think it actually makes you appealing to women.
6
SPEAKER_01
He s straight, right?
6
SPEAKER_01
He s dating women.
6
SPEAKER_01
And yeah, I view it as like a total plus.
6
SPEAKER_00
Out of left field question, do you think it s possible that women who have a pattern of being attracted to people who are unavailable would naturally be drawn to a single father?
6
SPEAKER_00
Because on some level, you know you re going to be second.
6
SPEAKER_00
And so the challenge is kind of there.
6
SPEAKER_00
The pattern is there.
6
SPEAKER_00
I think that s an interesting thought about being in his shoes is like trying to determine if the people that are attracted to you have that pattern.
6
SPEAKER_00
And then how does that pattern ultimately always play out for people that have that pattern?
6
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, I do think that is a trap for a lot of people who are attracted to unavailability.
6
SPEAKER_02
But I wouldn t want him to enter every relationship worried about that.
6
SPEAKER_00
I just think the simple fact that as you like a guy like this, he s going to tell you, Oh, I can t see you on this weekend and that weekend on these days and that day, because I have a kid and I m not introducing the kid to anybody for at least a year and a half right out of the gate.
6
SPEAKER_00
You re hearing like, well, there s some major boundaries here.
6
SPEAKER_00
That s weirdly kind of attractive.
6
SPEAKER_00
And it s a weirdly, you can t have enough of the thing you want, which makes the person more attracted.
6
SPEAKER_00
There s a lot of dynamics that go on in these.
6
SPEAKER_01
I loved that part.
6
SPEAKER_01
There were like four days a week where we could be together and then three days where I was like at my apartment doing my own thing.
6
SPEAKER_01
Because when you re in a relationship, you don t have the amount of time to just do whatever you want in the way that if you re waking up with someone and going to bed with someone, you re kind of like on the same flow.
6
SPEAKER_01
So I enjoyed that part, but we were committed and we truly loved each other.
6
SPEAKER_01
And in the end, actually, I wanted more and it wasn t happening.
6
SPEAKER_00
And so if I were him, I would want to be dating the person who has a very full life on their own so that on those days when I m not available, they are enjoying that as well.
6
SPEAKER_00
I don t know, like that s something I might be trying to screen for is like, Oh, I want someone with a big old life of their own because I got this big old life of mine and let s
6
SPEAKER_00
have these four days or whatever it shakes out to be.
6
SPEAKER_00
But is there a question in there, Monica, about something about emotional?
6
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_02
He said it s been hard to separate healthy emotional connection and trauma dumping because people want to know like, Oh, what happened?
6
SPEAKER_02
Like you have this eight year old and he, I think it may be a struggling with connecting and being vulnerable and open and honest without giving all this information.
6
SPEAKER_02
And I think he can just have boundaries around that.
6
SPEAKER_02
I think it s just knowing that if someone s really interested, this can happen over time.
6
SPEAKER_02
It s not like on the first date you have to divulge all of the information.
6
SPEAKER_02
They re not entitled to that.
6
SPEAKER_02
Exactly.
6
SPEAKER_01
Vulnerability, right, is this buzzword.
6
SPEAKER_01
I think it s great that we re all talking about it more, but vulnerability doesn t mean saying everything.
6
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
6
SPEAKER_01
Because even like, I don t know if I want to talk about your ex.
6
SPEAKER_01
wife like on our first date anyways, right?
6
SPEAKER_01
And maybe if it ends up coming up, I don t think that s an appropriate sort of time to be sharing all of this.
6
SPEAKER_01
Like, share it with a friend and talk about all of the difficulties.
6
SPEAKER_01
Or maybe once you ve been on more dates and you ve established your connection more.
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SPEAKER_01
But yeah, I think it s weird.
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SPEAKER_01
We think we owe everyone.
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SPEAKER_01
And if we re not sharing all this information, we re not being vulnerable.
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SPEAKER_01
And it s like, no, there s appropriate moments to share and appropriate information to be sharing with appropriate people.
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SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
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SPEAKER_02
And I think if you re on a date with either someone who s recently divorced or has a kid, it s important for you to remember, just like if you went on a date with a single person, you wouldn t say, so tell me about your exes immediately.
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SPEAKER_02
Like there s something about someone divorced or someone with a kid that you feel.
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SPEAKER_00
There must be some big story of why this ended.
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SPEAKER_02
And I feel like I m allowed to know it immediately and that s not the case.
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SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00
I would just also say like, put yourself in the other person s shoes.
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SPEAKER_00
I had a girlfriend who talked about her ex-boyfriend nonstop.
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SPEAKER_00
And all I thought from that was like, oh yeah, she very much is still in love with this dude and is still processing and can t understand why they re not together.
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SPEAKER_00
There s nothing that makes me feel close or that she shared some intimate secret.
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SPEAKER_00
I m just like, oh, she can t shut the fuck up about this guy.
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SPEAKER_00
Clearly this is unresolved.
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SPEAKER_00
That to me is a red flag.
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SPEAKER_00
If you re on a date with someone, you can t shut the fuck up about your ex.
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SPEAKER_00
I don t want to be on a date with that person.
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SPEAKER_02
you know, if that s what you re doing on first dates, maybe like, well, I guess to be fair to him, he didn t say first date.
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SPEAKER_02
So I think maybe it s in dating how to navigate this, where your new deity is like, well, so what happened?
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SPEAKER_02
Like wants to know more.
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SPEAKER_02
I think you just have to have some sort of solid boundaries around it.
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SPEAKER_02
Totally.
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SPEAKER_00
I ll also add unsolicited advice is if I ask someone what happened, why did their nine year relationship or their eight year relationship or their two year relationship?
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SPEAKER_00
dissolved and they tell me all the things that the other person did.
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SPEAKER_00
I don t want to be with that person.
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SPEAKER_00
That s a really good clue for me that they re not on the path of bettering themselves.
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SPEAKER_00
They re on the path of monitoring what everyone else does.
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SPEAKER_00
So again, if you find yourself going, well, she just was so unavailable emotionally and then she never, she always, she had this friendship with her boss that was,
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SPEAKER_00
Like, oh, great.
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SPEAKER_00
So nothing, you re clear on this?
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SPEAKER_00
You re a hundred percent.
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SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00
I think you should only want to hear what the other person did wrong and what they learned and what they re going to change.
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SPEAKER_00
That s the only thing that would interest me.
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SPEAKER_00
I m not dating the fucking ex.
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SPEAKER_01
Yes.
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SPEAKER_01
And that s interesting conversation too, right?
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SPEAKER_01
Cause it s between you and me, there s not a third person at this date.
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SPEAKER_00
Yes, and vulnerability is saying what you did wrong.
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SPEAKER_00
Vulnerability isn t telling you how someone else harmed you.
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SPEAKER_00
It s admitting how you have harmed someone.
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SPEAKER_00
That s vulnerability, because that s the part that could be ugly or unattractive.
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SPEAKER_01
And that s hot.
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SPEAKER_00
Yeah, I think so.
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SPEAKER_00
Find out a girl threw up some hot dogs or shit some boxers.
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SPEAKER_00
You re like, what are you doing next Wednesday?
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SPEAKER_02
Oh man.
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SPEAKER_02
Well, I think that s what we have time for today.
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SPEAKER_00
You guys, thanks for having me.
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SPEAKER_00
That was very funny.
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SPEAKER_02
Glad you joined us.
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SPEAKER_00
I certainly think that this farting debate has some legs.
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SPEAKER_00
I don t think this is the last time you ll hear all of us.
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SPEAKER_01
It s going to be a lot in the comments.
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SPEAKER_01
It s only the beginning.
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SPEAKER_00
It s only the...
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SPEAKER_02
Oh my God.
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SPEAKER_02
All right.
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SPEAKER_02
Well, this was super fun and we ll be back next week.
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SPEAKER_00
Love you guys.