0
SPEAKER_00
My name is Lee Hawkins.
0
SPEAKER_00
I ve been a journalist for over 25 years.
0
SPEAKER_00
On my new podcast, What Happened in Alabama, I get answers to some of the hardest questions about how things came to be for many black Americans and the truth that must come before any reconciliation can happen.
0
SPEAKER_00
I investigate my family history, my upbringing in Minnesota, and my father s painful nightmares about growing up in Alabama.
0
SPEAKER_00
What Happened in Alabama is a new series confronting the cycles of trauma for myself, my family, and for many Black Americans.
0
SPEAKER_00
Listen now.
0
SPEAKER_01
Dana s and Becky s, I m still on the road, come see me in.
0
SPEAKER_01
Jacksonville, Oregon, July 21st.
0
SPEAKER_01
Eugene, Oregon, July 22nd.
0
SPEAKER_01
Bellingham, Washington, September 8th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Olympia, Washington, September 9th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Torrington, Connecticut, September 15th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Rochester, New York, September 16th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Wilmington, Delaware, September 17th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Colorado Springs, September 25th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Breckenridge, Colorado, September 28th.
0
SPEAKER_01
Boulder, Colorado, September 29th.
0
SPEAKER_01
And then I m doing a huge European tour in October.
0
SPEAKER_01
Look at my website for all of the information, ticket information, everything s there.
0
SPEAKER_01
Make sure you get tickets for my next stand-up special taping in Brooklyn, New York, November 4th at King s Theater.
0
SPEAKER_01
There s an early and late show.
0
SPEAKER_01
Go to tignotaro.com for all show links and ticket information.
0
SPEAKER_01
Also, if anybody out there is looking to get a TIG fix with their eyeballs, I will be on the new season of The Morning Show, September 13th.
0
SPEAKER_01
So tune in.
0
SPEAKER_01
Now on with the show.
0
SPEAKER_02
Interesting about clowning, like if our clowns are sort of versions of our self, whatever, I won t talk about this right now, we ll talk about this later.
0
SPEAKER_01
When would we talk about this?
0
SPEAKER_01
Probably in like four months when I see you at somewhere.
0
SPEAKER_01
That you ll remember that we need to pick up at the clown conversation?
0
SPEAKER_01
This is Don t Ask Tig.
0
SPEAKER_01
I m Tig Notaro.
0
SPEAKER_01
And while I do hope to help, my help may be hopeless.
0
SPEAKER_01
Our guest today is an actress, comedian, screenwriter, and producer who co-starred as Brianna in the Netflix series Grace and Frankie.
0
SPEAKER_01
Her other television credits include Big Mouth, Curb Your Enthusiasm, New Girl,
0
SPEAKER_01
And she s appeared in films like Long Shot, The Disaster Artist, Forgetting Sarah Marshall, and Anchorman 2.
0
SPEAKER_01
She is also the co-founder of the Jane Club, a digital community for women and caretakers in the United States and around the world.
0
SPEAKER_01
June, Diane, Raphael, welcome to Don t Ask Tig.
0
SPEAKER_01
Hi Tig.
0
SPEAKER_01
June, do you remember when we first met?
0
SPEAKER_01
I m curious what your memory is.
0
SPEAKER_02
Teague and I co-starred in a pilot together, and it was Sarah Silverman s pilot.
0
SPEAKER_02
It was a wonderful script and pilot.
0
SPEAKER_02
I met you before that.
0
SPEAKER_02
I don t remember.
0
SPEAKER_02
See, I don t remember that.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
I remember being upset that I was meeting you in an audition scenario because that s one of my worst spaces.
0
SPEAKER_01
I ve seen you in some bad spaces.
0
SPEAKER_02
You sure have.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
That weren t auditions.
0
SPEAKER_01
Maybe that s my baseline, you know.
0
SPEAKER_01
It s just, yeah, like an emptied out purse.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
Should we go to commercial?
0
SPEAKER_02
cut to commercial, but quick.
0
SPEAKER_01
No, I met you when Paul s show, Human Giant, everybody went to Vegas to celebrate, I think, the premiere of it.
0
SPEAKER_01
And Nick Kroll had invited me to come along, and he and I drove out in his Prius, listening to Amy Winehouse the whole way to Vegas.
0
SPEAKER_01
And then I was in full-blown Vegas party situations that I had never been in, haven t been in since.
0
SPEAKER_01
Where it s like velvet roped off.
0
SPEAKER_01
I do remember this.
0
SPEAKER_01
Bottle service type stuff.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I was there for that weekend, just so you know.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I don t think you and I connected at all.
0
SPEAKER_02
I have no recollection of you being there.
0
SPEAKER_02
None of us belonged there.
0
SPEAKER_02
I feel like out of all of us, I probably fit in the most.
0
SPEAKER_02
And even I was struggling.
0
SPEAKER_02
We were at the club and I haven t been there since.
0
SPEAKER_01
I truly didn t know that that was what my weekend was about to be like.
0
SPEAKER_02
Okay, now I m remembering.
0
SPEAKER_02
We were at the club where there were like women that were dancing in sort of maybe like pools or giant human vases.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
Wow.
0
SPEAKER_02
That s where I first met you.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I have no memory of that, Ting.
0
SPEAKER_02
I m so sorry to report.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, because you were ordering bottle service all weekend.
0
SPEAKER_02
Again, I m wondering if I took us there.
0
SPEAKER_02
It s also so not like Paul or Rob Hubel to do something like that.
0
SPEAKER_02
Like, it was...
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, well, that s that was my first I knew Paul and Rob, but I didn t know you.
0
SPEAKER_01
Honestly, I didn t even know you re an actress.
0
SPEAKER_01
I was just like, oh, there s Paul Scheer s wife.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
And then we partied the whole weekend.
0
SPEAKER_01
Then we did that pilot.
0
SPEAKER_01
And that s when I was like,
0
SPEAKER_01
Oh, this is Paul Scheer s wife, who is an actress and is hilarious.
0
SPEAKER_01
Thank you so much.
0
SPEAKER_01
I don t know if you remember having good laughs with me on that pilot.
0
SPEAKER_02
We had some laughs.
0
SPEAKER_02
Actually, it s funny that we met in Vegas because I do remember struggling at that time because Paul was very much so established as a person in the world and feeling like, yeah, I m just Paul s, I m known as like Paul s girlfriend.
0
SPEAKER_02
We weren t married at the time.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
But that s funny.
0
SPEAKER_02
I remember the feeling of people receiving me and not looking at me when I was around him.
0
SPEAKER_02
I still sometimes see that with men like they don t if they don t know I m an actress or whatever and they re talking to Paul like they won t introduce themselves like there s just basic rules of society that they don t subscribe to and I m always shocked by that.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well.
0
SPEAKER_02
But even though I don t remember you I can t imagine you behaving that way.
0
SPEAKER_01
I would say it is rude when people don t acknowledge you, but it s also kind of rude that you don t remember me.
0
SPEAKER_01
It is very rude.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, June, moving on.
0
SPEAKER_01
The pilot didn t get picked up, but had a great time filming that.
0
SPEAKER_01
So much fun.
0
SPEAKER_01
I mentioned earlier the Jane Club.
0
SPEAKER_01
Would you like to tell people more about it?
0
SPEAKER_02
I would love to.
0
SPEAKER_02
Well, the Jane Club has had so many iterations and Tig has been a part of it from the beginning because you were one of our original investors who believed in it and invested in it, you and Steph, like before it was anything.
0
SPEAKER_02
So I m just so blown away by that.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I should add, we started off as a
0
SPEAKER_02
physical coworking space that offered full-time childcare.
0
SPEAKER_02
So that s where we started in 2017.
0
SPEAKER_02
And since then, we ve lived so many different lives.
0
SPEAKER_02
We had two physical locations, both were just wonderful and special.
0
SPEAKER_02
And once the pandemic hit, we had to close our physical location, but it gave us a real opportunity to launch this digital space.
0
SPEAKER_02
And it s just been a wonderful experience.
0
SPEAKER_02
And now,
0
SPEAKER_02
Physical locations are still sort of on the back burner right now, but we ve kind of morphed and pivoted into a digital co-working space.
0
SPEAKER_02
And the Jane Club now hosts these work sprints and full
0
SPEAKER_02
days of working together in community where we have a facilitator who leads them.
0
SPEAKER_02
So if you want to get done, you come, you join in and people are working together.
0
SPEAKER_02
We build in meditation, we build in activism, we build in just getting to know each other.
0
SPEAKER_02
And yeah, amazing.
0
SPEAKER_01
And then speaking of activism, you co-wrote a book called Represent, The Woman s Guide to Running for Office and Changing the World.
0
SPEAKER_01
That s right.
0
SPEAKER_01
Is becoming a politician something you see in your future, June?
0
SPEAKER_01
Tell us here first.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, it is actually.
0
SPEAKER_02
I would love to run for office at some point.
0
SPEAKER_02
I can really kind of geek out on city politics and local politics and
0
SPEAKER_02
all that stuff.
0
SPEAKER_02
So I am interested in it.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I think the core of it, it can be really beautiful and wonderful way to be part of your community.
0
SPEAKER_02
And especially for women, there s a huge representation gap.
0
SPEAKER_02
And it s interesting when we wrote the book, because I feel like now there is an idea that, oh, we have AOC and we have the squad.
0
SPEAKER_02
And
0
SPEAKER_02
And so we re done.
0
SPEAKER_02
And then the truth, of course, is that women are still grossly underrepresented up and down the ballot.
0
SPEAKER_02
And the federal government takes up so much of the airtime.
0
SPEAKER_02
But, you know, local politics and state seats and all that still, there s an enormous amount of inequity when it comes to women.
0
SPEAKER_02
And
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, the book really outlines how one might do it and tries to demystify the process and make it accessible and we kind of get into the granular details of what you actually need to do.
0
SPEAKER_02
I co-authored it with Kate Black, who is the chief of staff at EMILY s List, which is the largest fundraising organization for women in politics.
0
SPEAKER_02
It s interesting, actually, because I started the Jane Club because I was writing that book and I had two small children and was feeling like there s no way to do this unless you have family around you, which I didn t in LA, really, that could come and take care of our kids.
0
SPEAKER_02
I just was feeling like this is so impossible.
0
SPEAKER_02
And that was really the idea of the Jane Club was how do we actually create infrastructure for moms and caretakers and dads and
0
SPEAKER_02
people who have children to do all the things.
0
SPEAKER_02
So that s a little bit about me, Tig.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, I m sitting here listening to you thinking, how are you going to run for office with all the pickleball you re up to?
0
SPEAKER_01
I mean, that s another thing.
0
SPEAKER_01
I don t know if our listeners watched us compete on Paramount Plus in the Celebrity Pickleball Tournament, but I think we all know
0
SPEAKER_01
who didn t make it to the finals.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I gotta tell you, I ve seen you play since then, and I definitely thought, I m gonna be totally honest with you, Tig, I definitely thought after seeing you play with Will Ferrell, and of course, I competed against you with Paul Scheer, my partner.
0
SPEAKER_02
One of the best.
0
SPEAKER_02
One of the best in the biz.
0
SPEAKER_02
I definitely thought, Will is carrying this team.
0
SPEAKER_02
I whispered to Paul a number of times, hit it to Tig, hit it to Tig.
0
SPEAKER_02
And keep it away from Will Ferrell and just keep on hitting it to take.
0
SPEAKER_02
And we did.
0
SPEAKER_02
But even then, Will somehow kept you guys in the game.
0
SPEAKER_02
Now, I m telling you this with full honesty and love and transparency.
0
SPEAKER_02
Then I saw you play months later at my tournament that I hosted.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
And your game came up quite a bit.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I want to commend you.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I want to let you know I saw that and I see that.
0
SPEAKER_01
Will and I were truly saying, hit it to either of them.
0
SPEAKER_01
Doesn t make a difference.
0
SPEAKER_01
How dare?
0
SPEAKER_01
You have a pickleball court at your house.
0
SPEAKER_01
Correct.
0
SPEAKER_01
So you should be incredible, like mind-blowing.
0
SPEAKER_01
You re fine, I mean.
0
SPEAKER_02
I know, I actually am quite good.
0
SPEAKER_02
I try to stay medium in my home court because I want others to join me.
0
SPEAKER_02
So I m rarely unleashing my full potential.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, I want to tell you a real conversation between me and my wife, Stephanie.
0
SPEAKER_01
She said, maybe we should try and play Paul and June and get that going.
0
SPEAKER_01
And do you know what I said to her?
0
SPEAKER_01
No.
0
SPEAKER_01
I said, as fun as that sounds, I don t ever want to see June regularly enough to have a normal friendship with her.
0
SPEAKER_02
I actually appreciate that, Tig, because I think our cadence, I m so happy when I see you, but I don t think we want to tip over.
0
SPEAKER_02
No, no.
0
SPEAKER_02
I think we re both quite aware of that.
0
SPEAKER_01
I want it exactly how it is.
0
SPEAKER_01
I want it to be only nonsense.
0
SPEAKER_01
And Stephanie laughed so hard.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I said, but truly, imagine if I got to a point with June that when I saw her, I was just like, hey, thanks so much for having us.
0
SPEAKER_01
So that wouldn t work.
0
SPEAKER_01
I don t want that with June.
0
SPEAKER_01
I understand.
0
SPEAKER_01
You are one of those people I just never want to be that close with that the nonsense disappears.
0
SPEAKER_02
I appreciate that and I actually I think that s a loving gesture.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I m taking it as such.
0
SPEAKER_02
Well, take it however you want.
0
SPEAKER_02
I was going to say, well, we do host, it s a pretty regular event and it s a family event.
0
SPEAKER_02
People bring their kids.
0
SPEAKER_02
No, I think that s probably what Stephanie was talking about.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I was just like, I love June.
0
SPEAKER_01
I just don t want a normal friendship with her.
0
SPEAKER_02
Understood.
0
SPEAKER_02
I want it to be weird every time.
0
SPEAKER_02
I just want you to know that there are people, you know, that I count as like, oh, if I needed to call them and say like, I need, you know, really big ask.
0
SPEAKER_02
I would, I have, but I would be okay asking you.
0
SPEAKER_02
I know.
0
SPEAKER_02
I would.
0
SPEAKER_02
I would be, I m not saying it would be the easiest thing in the world, but like there s so many people who are not on that list.
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
And you are Tig, like it or not.
0
SPEAKER_02
Like if I had to call you for something that was like,
0
SPEAKER_02
Really wild.
0
SPEAKER_01
Like investing in your company.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
Oh, that was easy.
0
SPEAKER_01
Easiest pie.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, now, June, since this is an advice show.
0
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
0
SPEAKER_01
Is there a person out there who you would like to give unsolicited advice to?
0
SPEAKER_01
And it can be anyone.
0
SPEAKER_01
It can be me.
0
SPEAKER_01
It can be Paul.
0
SPEAKER_01
It can be somebody at your local market.
0
SPEAKER_02
Oh, there s somebody I m just thinking of and this is like so wrong, but do you watch Sister Wives on TLC?
0
SPEAKER_01
I don t watch anything.
0
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
0
SPEAKER_02
There s a sister wife, Mary, and she wears a shade of foundation on her face that is way too dark for her skin tone.
0
SPEAKER_02
And it s like keeping me up at night.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I have been formulating in my head, like how to write this DM.
0
SPEAKER_02
in a way where it s not shaming, but just go a little lighter.
0
SPEAKER_02
It s just not the right color for you.
0
SPEAKER_02
So that s someone who s, I am like, there s no way to say it.
0
SPEAKER_01
Okay, and I wanna say something right now.
0
SPEAKER_01
I don t wear foundation, okay?
0
SPEAKER_01
But I would say whoever s listening, if it s this Mary person or whoever,
0
SPEAKER_01
If June is telling you this, I would listen because... Thank you.
0
SPEAKER_01
And June, I think Stephanie and I have reached out and told you this.
0
SPEAKER_01
You are someone.
0
SPEAKER_01
And not that you re not an attractive person at home with your glasses on and parenting.
0
SPEAKER_01
Thank you.
0
SPEAKER_01
But my lord, does June clean it up when she is going out on the town?
0
SPEAKER_01
This woman knows how to put foundation on things and dresses on stuff.
0
SPEAKER_01
Is that how it s said?
0
SPEAKER_01
No, it s not.
0
SPEAKER_01
But I would listen to her.
0
SPEAKER_02
I really appreciate that.
0
SPEAKER_02
I do feel like that s an area where I really love it.
0
SPEAKER_02
I love makeup.
0
SPEAKER_02
I love clothes.
0
SPEAKER_02
I love all that stuff.
0
SPEAKER_02
And, you know, especially I think for some older women and they can get in the headspace of like, oh, this looked good 20 years ago and nobody s ever told me it didn t.
0
SPEAKER_02
And
0
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, it s just a shade off.
0
SPEAKER_01
It s just a shade off.
0
SPEAKER_01
Now, would you say you or Paul give better advice?
0
SPEAKER_01
We re about to transition into listener questions.
0
SPEAKER_01
Just teeing you up here.
0
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
0
SPEAKER_02
I think we both do.
0
SPEAKER_02
That s a hard one.
0
SPEAKER_02
Paul s really thoughtful.
0
SPEAKER_01
He really is.
0
SPEAKER_01
He is such a gem.
0
SPEAKER_01
I know.
0
SPEAKER_01
He really is.
0
SPEAKER_01
I mean, I m obsessed with him.
0
SPEAKER_02
I don t know what to tell you.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, I m happy to hear that.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I m happy to now transition into these listener questions with you.
0
SPEAKER_01
Let s do it.
0
SPEAKER_01
You re a big fan of The Real Housewives, correct?
0
SPEAKER_01
Of course.
0
SPEAKER_01
Our first question comes from a listener who could very well be a future cast member of that show.
0
SPEAKER_01
Savannah in California writes, Hi Tig, I m a 21-year-old woman who is struggling between wanting to be a housewife but also wanting my own money and independence.
0
SPEAKER_01
I just want to be hot and put my taste to use.
0
SPEAKER_01
Should I even bother trying to pursue a career?
0
SPEAKER_01
Whoa.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_02
I m going to say something about this term housewife.
0
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
0
SPEAKER_02
What does that mean exactly?
0
SPEAKER_02
Because I think the way she s positioning this question is interesting because I think she s framing it in a way where it sounds like to her housework, keeping a home, potentially raising children, doing the work of domesticity.
0
SPEAKER_02
has no value.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I think that that has historically been true, that we don t put any value toward caretaking, mothering, working inside the home, but that is work.
0
SPEAKER_02
It s unpaid labor for most of us, or it is paid and it s domestic work, which is still undervalued and still can be a very unsafe space for women to work in.
0
SPEAKER_02
And we don t see as professional work.
0
SPEAKER_02
And I question that.
0
SPEAKER_02
So what I would encourage her to do is to take a step back and think through what she believes
1
SPEAKER_02
it means to do the work of a house, or the work of keeping a home, creating a home, and what the world thinks of that.
1
SPEAKER_02
Because the truth is, we are not paid to do it.
1
SPEAKER_02
It is all unpaid, unless you re a domestic laborer, a housekeeper, a nanny, a home nurse aide, or working in the domestic realm.
1
SPEAKER_02
It s unpaid labor.
1
SPEAKER_02
But that doesn t mean it s not valuable.
1
SPEAKER_02
So I don t really know what housewife means to her.
1
SPEAKER_02
And she said something about using her design eye and creating a home.
1
SPEAKER_02
But I really do believe that it s a damn shame that we consider that work to not have any value to it.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I think it positions
1
SPEAKER_02
women who are working outside the home to feel badly about doing that and potentially leaving their kids to do it.
1
SPEAKER_02
And then it also makes women who work inside the home, well, all mothers are holding that work, but make them feel like their work isn t valuable.
1
SPEAKER_02
And that s sad to me.
1
SPEAKER_02
So I really like reject that whole conversation around like, are you a housewife or do you work?
1
SPEAKER_02
It s like, no, being a housewife is work.
1
SPEAKER_02
It s just, do we consider it valuable or not?
1
SPEAKER_02
And does the world?
1
SPEAKER_02
And Tig, I wonder if this book would be helpful for Savannah.
1
SPEAKER_02
I would give her the advice of picking up the book, Forget Having It All, How America Messed Up Motherhood and How to Fix It by Amy Westervelt.
1
SPEAKER_01
Hmm.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
1
SPEAKER_02
And again, I don t know if that s what she means by housewife.
1
SPEAKER_03
Well, I think that, you know, this is a show called Don t Ask Tig.
1
SPEAKER_03
So more importantly, Don t Ask June.
1
SPEAKER_03
But that s the advice I think that we can give is like, read this book.
1
SPEAKER_03
Maybe this will lead Savannah to some
1
SPEAKER_03
answers or some bigger, deeper questions.
1
SPEAKER_02
She s absolutely right.
1
SPEAKER_02
There s a stigma around it.
1
SPEAKER_02
There s a stigma around saying like, oh, I don t want to pursue a professional career.
1
SPEAKER_02
But I really reject the idea that women shouldn t, if you don t pursue a professional paid career, that you are not valuable in this world.
1
SPEAKER_02
That s absurd to me.
1
SPEAKER_03
Okay, Savannah, I hope that helps.
1
SPEAKER_03
June, it s time for a break, but we ll be back shortly with more questions.
1
SPEAKER_00
a six billion dollar con.
1
SPEAKER_00
It didn t take long for it to spread like wildfire.
1
SPEAKER_00
You got to take a look at this really crazy gold stock.
1
SPEAKER_00
A buddy of mine got in at a dime.
1
SPEAKER_00
Which destroyed lives and devastated communities.
1
SPEAKER_00
Every little town across the nation, people have shares in this.
1
SPEAKER_00
We lost everything.
1
SPEAKER_00
And to date, no one has been brought to justice.
1
SPEAKER_00
Somebody knows more than we know.
1
SPEAKER_00
The $6 billion gold scam from the BBC World Service and CBC.
1
SPEAKER_00
Search for the $6 billion gold scam wherever you get your podcasts.
1
SPEAKER_03
And we re back.
1
SPEAKER_03
June, you co-host the podcast, How Did This Get Made?, which is all about watching bad movies.
1
SPEAKER_03
That may help with this next question.
1
SPEAKER_03
Hillary writes, Hi Tig, I m a mom of three small children and feel less and less in touch with myself.
1
SPEAKER_03
With all of the challenges of adulthood and parenthood, how do I keep up with things like new music, books, or podcasts that will fulfill my interests without spending hours researching online or investing a lot of time on something I may ultimately hate?
1
SPEAKER_03
I feel like I m terrible at this because I really only watch documentaries and listen.
1
SPEAKER_03
Me too.
1
SPEAKER_03
That s all you watch?
1
SPEAKER_03
I watch documentaries and like Sister Wives and Housewives.
1
SPEAKER_03
Okay, which is basically a documentary.
1
SPEAKER_02
As far as I m concerned.
1
SPEAKER_02
That s right.
1
SPEAKER_02
How do you find your stuff?
1
SPEAKER_02
I have to start by saying that you have three small children.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like, you will be out of touch.
1
SPEAKER_02
You ve got some time till you return to the land of the living.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I think there s some freedom in just sort of accepting that you re walking in the underworld for a few more years.
1
SPEAKER_02
I mean, I don t know how you feel, Tig, but my youngest is six, and just now I m like, oh, I m a part of the world.
1
SPEAKER_03
Yes, that s how Stephanie and I felt.
1
SPEAKER_03
I think when they hit five, we started to feel like, oh, we can maybe start going out to dinner with friends and take walks.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like, it s just so all-consuming.
1
SPEAKER_02
So all-consuming.
1
SPEAKER_02
It really is.
1
SPEAKER_02
So I guess my piece of advice is also just like knowing it will end and to not let the world make you feel like you re
1
SPEAKER_02
not on the pulse of things or you re an outsider because you re consumed.
1
SPEAKER_02
Motherhood can feel really oppressive at times and you re just like, oh, I m not a part of the world.
1
SPEAKER_02
I remember literally sitting on my couch, looking through the slats and the blinds and singing to myself, singing out loud.
1
SPEAKER_02
Watching people walk by and singing, people are passing me by.
1
SPEAKER_02
Life is passing me by.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like just like singing that, holding a baby.
1
SPEAKER_03
I wonder what I was doing in that actual moment that you were in your house singing that.
1
SPEAKER_03
You were probably walking by.
1
SPEAKER_03
So it s like people are passing you by and life is passing you by.
1
SPEAKER_03
It s so insane what s going on in everyone s house.
1
SPEAKER_03
I know.
1
SPEAKER_03
You never know.
1
SPEAKER_03
Max and Finn used to wake up at three in the morning, like for the day.
1
SPEAKER_03
And Stephanie and I would be, you know, we have these twins that are like, I m up.
1
SPEAKER_03
And so we would get up at three in the morning and they d want to chase each other around and us around the coffee table.
1
SPEAKER_03
And I started laughing.
1
SPEAKER_03
one morning at how tiny they were, and how with our light on at 3am, it just looked like through the window, me and Stephanie were playing chase around the coffee table.
1
SPEAKER_03
I was like, do you realize nobody can see that there are children here?
1
SPEAKER_03
We started laughing so hard because we were, I don t know how we came across to the 3 AMers that were coming home after partying.
1
SPEAKER_03
It was a different scene to them for sure.
1
SPEAKER_03
But yeah, you re probably going to be out of the mix for a beat.
1
SPEAKER_02
That s okay.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like this is a good example.
1
SPEAKER_02
So again, our youngest is six and this weekend we just, Paul and I flew to Seattle and we went to the Gorge to see Brandi Carlile and Joni Mitchell.
1
SPEAKER_02
Joni Mitchell s my favorite artist that s living.
1
SPEAKER_02
And it was such an unbelievably beautiful event and life-changing.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I was like, oh, I couldn t have done this.
1
SPEAKER_02
three years ago.
1
SPEAKER_02
I mean, I guess I could have, but it would have just been so fraught.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I was really free to be there and have like a totally restorative experience there.
1
SPEAKER_02
But whatever feels good at the end of the day, after you ve, those kids are in bed, be it housewives, be it like, don t force yourself to be a part of a cultural conversation if it feels like work, just you re, you re surviving.
1
SPEAKER_02
So survive a couple more years.
1
SPEAKER_02
And unless it feels good to be up on stuff and the New York Times bestseller list and like all the stuff.
1
SPEAKER_02
I was on the New York Times bestseller.
1
SPEAKER_01
Congratulations.
1
SPEAKER_01
I was not.
1
SPEAKER_02
You know, I was not.
1
SPEAKER_02
And my book was really an important book.
1
SPEAKER_02
Right.
1
SPEAKER_02
You know, not just for laughs.
1
SPEAKER_02
So you didn t read my book?
1
SPEAKER_02
No, I did.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I know your book had a lot more in it than just laughs.
1
SPEAKER_02
I do know that.
1
SPEAKER_02
But I m just saying, my book could, you know, it s about changing... The world.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_02
But it did not make the New York Times bestseller list.
1
SPEAKER_03
Mine did.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_02
So I would just say, buy my book.
1
SPEAKER_02
Oh.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_02
But I think that s good advice, Tig.
1
SPEAKER_02
It s just like, just you re in it and just...
1
SPEAKER_02
I don t know where to get those things.
1
SPEAKER_02
I don t feel like I m on the pulse of a cultural conversation.
1
SPEAKER_02
I haven t finished this season of Secession.
1
SPEAKER_02
I m always behind.
1
SPEAKER_03
Right, right.
1
SPEAKER_03
I haven t seen Succession either.
1
SPEAKER_03
But I do feel like, you know, poking around a little bit online and just giving a listen to something.
1
SPEAKER_03
I mean, I m very plant-based obsessed and I love listening to vegan podcasts.
1
SPEAKER_03
I wasn t expecting this, okay.
1
SPEAKER_03
There s something for everybody out there.
1
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, there really is a podcast for everyone.
1
SPEAKER_03
Truly, you would think, oh, there must be what, five vegan podcasts?
1
SPEAKER_03
No.
1
SPEAKER_03
No.
1
SPEAKER_03
Oh my God, it s endless.
1
SPEAKER_03
And what are you learning?
1
SPEAKER_03
Recipe is just... Well, I m very interested in nutrition and how food can help and hurt you.
1
SPEAKER_03
It s medicine.
1
SPEAKER_03
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_03
And so that s really what I m very interested in.
1
SPEAKER_03
I m not much of a cook, but I can throw things together and get people fed.
1
SPEAKER_03
But I am so interested in nutrition.
1
SPEAKER_03
So it feels like if you just kind of focus in on what your main interest is and you do a little tiny search, you can probably find something out there.
1
SPEAKER_03
I think that s right.
1
SPEAKER_03
Ask a friend or, you know, call June directly.
1
SPEAKER_03
I m not offering my phone number on this podcast.
1
SPEAKER_03
Hilary, I also highly recommend watching everything that June and I have starred in together and separately.
1
SPEAKER_03
Yes.
1
SPEAKER_03
You can t go wrong.
1
SPEAKER_03
That s a great place to start.
1
SPEAKER_03
We re gonna take a quick break to answer a question that came in our therapy etiquette inbox.
1
SPEAKER_03
This segment is where we answer those awkward questions we all have as people getting the professional help we need and deserve and is sponsored by BetterHelp.
1
SPEAKER_03
Today s question was sent in from Jessica.
1
SPEAKER_03
Jessica writes, Tig, I think it would be so helpful to go to therapy, but I hate the idea of my personal thoughts being noted by the therapist.
1
SPEAKER_03
I can t keep a journal for the same reason.
1
SPEAKER_03
How do so many other people not have a concern about their deepest thoughts and feelings being written down somewhere?
1
SPEAKER_03
Thank you.
1
SPEAKER_03
Jessica, it s completely understandable to have concerns about your personal thoughts and feelings being noted by a therapist.
1
SPEAKER_03
Therapy is meant to be a safe space where you can explore your emotions without judgment.
1
SPEAKER_03
Keep in mind that when you start therapy, you ll have an intake process where you can share your concerns and goals with your therapist.
1
SPEAKER_03
This is definitely something you can bring up before you even start your first session.
1
SPEAKER_03
Also, there s as many therapy styles as there are therapists out there.
1
SPEAKER_03
If you re honest about your needs or concerns, it s going to give you the best chance of being matched with a professional that s right for you.
1
SPEAKER_03
Since you re telling me that you think therapy would be helpful for you, I would highly recommend following that feeling.
1
SPEAKER_03
It might also be helpful to talk through, you know, the reasons your therapist may be taking notes, because therapists document what happens in sessions to remember important details for the safety of the client and the therapist, and sometimes billing.
1
SPEAKER_03
If there s no record, it basically didn t happen in the eyes of many.
1
SPEAKER_03
And don t forget, therapy is a collaborative process.
1
SPEAKER_03
You have the right to set boundaries and communicate what your preferences are.
1
SPEAKER_03
Also consider maybe exploring different approaches that gel with your comfort level, like mindfulness-based therapies or art therapy, which may rely less on written documentation.
1
SPEAKER_03
The most crucial thing is to find a therapist who makes you feel heard, respected, and supported on your journey.
1
SPEAKER_03
Best of luck to you, Jessica.
1
SPEAKER_03
And as always, thank you to our therapy etiquette sponsor, BetterHelp.
1
SPEAKER_03
If you have any questions about the unspoken rules of therapy etiquette, share them with us by calling 833-275-8444.
1
SPEAKER_03
or visiting DontAskTig.org slash contact.
1
SPEAKER_03
And now, back to the show.
1
SPEAKER_03
Alright, June, our last listener question was sent in by Rosemary.
1
SPEAKER_03
Rosemary writes, My husband has been working on entrepreneurial ventures for the past four years, which have at times made some money, but nothing has turned into the quote-unquote golden goose yet.
1
SPEAKER_03
He keeps thinking he s on the verge of something, but it doesn t seem to materialize.
1
SPEAKER_03
We are relatively comfortable because I am a nurse and my job is very stable.
1
SPEAKER_03
He is a terrific father and cares for our two kids while I work.
1
SPEAKER_03
I like my job, so I don t resent our current setup, but we aren t able to move forward in other ways, like buying a house or traveling more.
1
SPEAKER_03
He gets down on himself sometimes because he s not quote unquote providing and his dreams haven t been realized.
1
SPEAKER_03
Should I continue to be supportive or should I encourage him to get back into a more traditional job where he can earn a salary again?
1
SPEAKER_02
Oh, God, that s really hard, Tig.
1
SPEAKER_03
It is.
1
SPEAKER_03
And I think my initial response, especially if your job is stable and he is a good, supportive, involved father, I would let him still give it a go.
1
SPEAKER_03
That s my feeling, is I would still encourage his hopes and dreams.
1
SPEAKER_03
Maybe you guys could come up with a time of...
1
SPEAKER_03
Maybe at this point, if things haven t come through, but come to it together, because I would hate it if I was wanting to pursue dreams, or if Stephanie was wanting something, and if she was a great mother, which she is, and a great spouse, which she is, but if things just hadn t quite happened, I would still really... I would be rooting for her to see it through, you know?
1
SPEAKER_02
I totally agree.
1
SPEAKER_02
I cannot imagine saying to my partner, like, it s time to give up.
1
SPEAKER_02
If she were to say, we re not able to take care of the children, you know, but that seems to be, and also sounds like he might be doing some work in the house that they might have to pay for otherwise.
1
SPEAKER_02
So even though he might not be bringing in the money, maybe they re saving some there because he s picking it up.
1
SPEAKER_02
I think it s a really challenging thing for people to talk about.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I wonder if she can t suggest, not that he give up his entrepreneurial pursuits, but if she can t suggest that he heads into either therapy or finds a coach of some sort.
1
SPEAKER_02
to help him navigate, because it sounds like he s feeling badly about this.
1
SPEAKER_02
And I think that he ll have a better shot of being successful if he feels like, although he might not be making money, that she s fully invested in him.
1
SPEAKER_02
That, to me, the sort of timelines, the kind of parameters of how long you can pursue it for, when you should find something more stable, I think are better off coming from him through his own work with someone else.
1
SPEAKER_02
If possible.
1
SPEAKER_02
If it s not possible for the family and she feels like, no, they re at financial risk, then that s another story.
1
SPEAKER_02
But if she is comfortable and has a stable job and feels like they re financially comfortable, then I don t think it should come from her.
1
SPEAKER_03
Yeah, it s tricky, but good luck to you and your family.
1
SPEAKER_03
June, one last thing before you go.
1
SPEAKER_03
This last segment is called Best Advice, Worst Advice.
1
SPEAKER_02
Oh, wow.
1
SPEAKER_03
What is the best advice you ve ever been given, June?
1
SPEAKER_02
Oh, I know.
1
SPEAKER_02
So I took a clown class at NYU.
1
SPEAKER_02
Excuse me?
1
SPEAKER_02
That was a clown nose.
1
SPEAKER_02
I did wear a clown nose.
1
SPEAKER_02
I did wear a clown nose.
1
SPEAKER_02
Congrats.
1
SPEAKER_02
And it was a very difficult class.
1
SPEAKER_02
And we were, we had to do this exercise where we all had to sit in a circle.
1
SPEAKER_02
None of our clowns spoke.
1
SPEAKER_02
It was all just sort of physicality.
1
SPEAKER_02
This exercise was called the ring of fire.
1
SPEAKER_02
And we had to, without language, make every single person in the class, including the teacher, belly laugh at the same time.
1
SPEAKER_02
And we couldn t leave the Ring of Fire until we had done that.
1
SPEAKER_02
It was terrifying.
1
SPEAKER_02
And there were students who were in there for like 45 minutes, an hour, just trying things and sweating.
1
SPEAKER_02
And, you know, a lot of times the rest of us would laugh to try to get them off stage.
1
SPEAKER_02
And the teacher wouldn t accept those laughs until she laughed too with us.
1
SPEAKER_02
I literally before going into that class would have to say to myself, like, June, you re not dying.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like you re alive.
1
SPEAKER_02
Your family is healthy.
1
SPEAKER_02
Like things, this is not the worst thing that could be happening right now.
1
SPEAKER_02
That s how scared I was.
2
SPEAKER_01
And... One of the hardest moments in your life?
2
SPEAKER_01
Performance-wise, yes.
2
SPEAKER_01
I remember the teacher said to me about my clown.
2
SPEAKER_01
She was like, you are resisting failure and are so scared that it s gonna happen.
2
SPEAKER_01
Like, lean into... She kept... She used the phrase, live in the drop, which is, I guess, a very popular clowning phrase, which is most clowns
2
SPEAKER_01
actually get their biggest laughs having, I mean, you, you do this take on stage.
2
SPEAKER_01
I mean, this is for, I think for standup comedians, it s a very different thing, but like, for me, it was such a lesson in like, oh, I actually need to look forward to flopping, to dropping, to living in the drop, to
2
SPEAKER_01
working in a way where I m not just like trying to succeed, where I m actually like, let s try so hard and be so brave that I ll probably fail.
2
SPEAKER_01
And that changed for me the way I started to work.
2
SPEAKER_01
which was like, oh, it s actually like the way I want to work.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I don t do this all the time at all.
2
SPEAKER_01
I ve only actually experienced this like artistically a few times, but as opposed to like trying to do well, actually looking for moments where I can be fully humiliated, vulnerable, wrong, not right.
2
SPEAKER_01
So that I can find something that s real and true.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so that was the best piece of advice I ve ever been given.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I think it translates across the board to all areas of life.
2
SPEAKER_01
Mm-hmm.
2
SPEAKER_01
It is what I do as a stand-up.
2
SPEAKER_01
For stand-ups, I think you experience that all the time.
2
SPEAKER_01
But on a set, and especially you re doing a scene over and over and over, it s a different muscle for me to, like, in front of a crew, in front of mostly men and technicians, to really create a space that feels
2
SPEAKER_01
like that is hard.
2
SPEAKER_01
And again, I haven t, I ve really only ever done it a few times, but at least I know like that s the way I want to work.
2
SPEAKER_02
And what s the worst advice you ve ever received?
2
SPEAKER_02
Go to clown school?
2
SPEAKER_01
I think the worst advice I ever received was someone told me before I had a baby that there was like no reason I shouldn t be able to breastfeed and to just like work as hard as I could to do it because it s something every woman should be able to do.
2
SPEAKER_01
And that really like f***ed up my journey with my oldest son when he was born because it wasn t working.
2
SPEAKER_01
I was dealing with postpartum and I
2
SPEAKER_01
wish that I could get that time back because it s such dangerous advice, I think, to give a new mom.
2
SPEAKER_02
Wow.
2
SPEAKER_02
All right.
2
SPEAKER_02
Well, I m glad that you made it through that.
2
SPEAKER_02
Thanks, Tig.
2
SPEAKER_01
And clown school.
2
SPEAKER_01
Me too.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I don t want to see you every week, but maybe in a couple months you could stop by to a pickleball.
2
SPEAKER_01
Okay.
2
SPEAKER_02
But you understand, like you wouldn t want that from me.
2
SPEAKER_02
I don t think I understand, but I appreciate it.
2
SPEAKER_02
And I feel like the way you laughed at that, it felt like it really hit as something like, oh, right.
2
SPEAKER_02
That would be weird if we were just normal friends.
2
SPEAKER_02
I totally get it.
2
SPEAKER_01
Listen, it s how children experience love is through boundaries, through like, oh, actually, no, this is a boundary around you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so I appreciate firm boundaries.
2
SPEAKER_02
Now, is there anything you would like to share with the listeners before we wrap this up?
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, if you head to janeclub.com, you can buy a day and just come see what it s about.
2
SPEAKER_01
So if you use code ASKTIG at checkout, you can get 10% off your membership.
2
SPEAKER_01
And speaking of how did this get made, we re going on tour this summer.
2
SPEAKER_01
If you go to HDTGM.com, you can find out where we re going to be.
2
SPEAKER_01
We re doing a wonderful East Coast tour.
2
SPEAKER_01
We ll be in Boston, New York City, Philadelphia, DC.
2
SPEAKER_01
and we ve done it every summer the last few summers it s been so much fun and we are already almost sold out but there are hopefully some tickets left and we just added a second show in boston so if you go to hdtgm.com find out information and purchase tickets
2
SPEAKER_01
And again, if you head to JaneClub.com and use code ASKTIG, all caps, at checkout, you get 10% off any of our Jane workdays.
2
SPEAKER_02
Incredible.
2
SPEAKER_02
June, thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me here on Don t Ask Tig.
2
SPEAKER_02
Thank you, Tig, for having me.
2
SPEAKER_02
Thank you.
2
SPEAKER_02
Bye-bye.
2
SPEAKER_02
Bye-bye.
2
SPEAKER_02
Bye-bye.
2
SPEAKER_02
Goodbye.
2
SPEAKER_03
so much
2
SPEAKER_03
That s what you heard
2
SPEAKER_02
Don t Ask Tig is hosted by me, Tig Notaro.
2
SPEAKER_02
It s produced by Thomas Ouellette and Shana Deloria.
2
SPEAKER_02
Our executive producer and editor is Beth Perlman.
2
SPEAKER_02
Engineering and sound mixing by Alex Simpson, Derek Ramirez, Josh Savageau, and Evan Clark.
2
SPEAKER_02
Digital production by James Napoli.
2
SPEAKER_02
Talent booking by Marianne Ways.
2
SPEAKER_02
Our theme music is
2
SPEAKER_02
Friend in Tig by Edie Burkell and Kyle Krushem, and Listen to Your Heart by Edie Burkell.
2
SPEAKER_02
Special thanks to Hunter Seidman.
2
SPEAKER_02
APM Studios executives in charge are Chandra Kavati, Alex Schaffert, and Joanne Griffith.
2
SPEAKER_02
Concept developed by Tracy Mumford.
2
SPEAKER_02
Our executive consultant is Dean Capello and Gobsmack Studios.
2
SPEAKER_02
You can always ask for advice at DontAskTig.org.
2
SPEAKER_02
Just write in with your problem or send us a voice memo.
2
SPEAKER_02
Remember to follow us on social media at DontAskTig.
2
SPEAKER_02
DontAskTig is a production of American Public Media.
2
SPEAKER_02
And as always, thanks Dana and I ll tell Becky.
2
SPEAKER_00
I m Christina Cauterucci, and this season on Slow Burn.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s called Proposition 6.
2
SPEAKER_00
The Briggs Initiative.
2
SPEAKER_00
John Briggs is going to fire every gay and lesbian schoolteacher in California.
2
SPEAKER_00
With so much at stake, young people became activists.
2
SPEAKER_00
We can t let this happen in California.
2
SPEAKER_00
And activists became leaders.
2
SPEAKER_03
My name is Harvey Milk and I m here to include you.
2
SPEAKER_00
Slow Burn, Season 9.
2
SPEAKER_00
Gays Against Briggs.
2
SPEAKER_00
Out now, wherever you listen.