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In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, Bill shares a grandkid story that will melt your heart.
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And Bill was not chilling as he laments about a pet peeve keyboard experience with a major movie distribution app you all know.
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And in this episode, practice, practice, practice.
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That is all.
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Listen up.
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Hey, everybody.
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Welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast, the longest running sales training podcast in podcast history.
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My name is Brian Neal.
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I m Bill Kasky.
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We just called that the launch.
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We just gave that a name, didn t we?
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Hey, we re glad you re here.
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New listeners, welcome.
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Spread the word.
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Post episodes on LinkedIn.
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Talk about the podcast.
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Podcasting is obviously a really buzzy thing.
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It s all of a sudden, it s cool all of a sudden.
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We did it for like 12 years, and it wasn t cool.
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Now it s cool like podcasts.
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Remember you tell people back in the day, what s a podcast?
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Now it s like, hey, I m starting a podcast.
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It s great.
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So we re glad you re here.
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We have a big LinkedIn group.
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So go to the LinkedIn group.
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There s like 13,000-ish listeners there that talk and get together and gather.
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And if you want some live coaching from us,
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Become an insider.
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ASP Insider program is alive and well.
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We meet the first Friday of every month.
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And that group is rock solid.
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That group is super supportive.
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It s really fun.
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It s Bill and I live.
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It s not taped or recorded.
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It s a really cool program.
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And all of you all need to be a part of it.
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That s all I m saying about that.
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That s what I m saying.
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That s what I m saying.
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Well, speaking of LinkedIn.
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Uh-oh.
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Excuse me.
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You re not in trouble again, are you?
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No, no, no, no.
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OK, good.
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Speaking of LinkedIn, we asked you this the last episode.
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And that is, if you re in the LinkedIn group, go to the group page and give us some input on whether you would like to see Brian and I on a Clubhouse event.
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We are giving some thought to getting a little bit more involved active in Clubhouse.
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And we know a lot of our listeners are already on Clubhouse.
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But we would like to hear from you as to, does that make sense?
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Yes, no, maybe.
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And then what topic you might want us to?
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Pontificate and you wouldn t technically see us on pod on clubhouse.
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That would it s an audio people for that hear us Yeah on clubhouse, which is great because it means we can wear whatever we want Yeah, the insiders a zoom call if you become an insider you actually get to see our face We have to kind of dress up do all that other stuff clubhouse.
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Nah, dress up.
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It s a dress.
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Oh, yeah kind of dressed up
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You said you have a story to tell me.
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Oh, I do.
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Yeah.
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I m sorry.
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I was thinking, is it Brian s turn?
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Is it my turn?
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It s your turn.
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I have twin grandkids, four and a half years old.
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And I don t like to tell a lot of grandbaby stories because it gets boring.
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But there was something funny that happened.
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And my grandson Evan and I have this thing that we do back and forth.
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You re my man.
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I ll say to him, you re my man.
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And he ll go, Papa, you re my man.
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Oh, that is so great.
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And I don t do it all the time, but just sometimes.
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And so the other day, we were up in my office.
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The girl was down on the floor doing some painting on an easel.
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And Evan, the boy, was getting ready to grab this limestone race car that s a model of an Indy car.
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Yeah.
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And it s about 20 pounds.
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And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa, what are you doing?
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He said, I want to hold it, Papa.
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And I said, don t drop it.
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I should have said no, but I m an easy pushover.
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Let him experience life.
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And he didn t have his shoes on.
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So three seconds later, boom, thing drops on the whole floor.
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And luckily, he didn t grab his toes.
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But I said, Evan, and I never get mad.
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I said, Evan, what are you doing?
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I told you not to drop that.
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He goes, I m sorry, Papa.
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I said, go downstairs, you know, go downstairs.
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We ll be down in a minute.
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Your mom and grandma are down there, so just go down there.
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He goes, okay.
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So he kind of mopes over the door and he turns around and goes, Papa, am I still your man?
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I didn t know whether to laugh, uproarously, or cry.
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Hug him.
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That is so sweet.
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All I could say was, you will always be my man, Evan.
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Oh, that s great.
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It makes me cry.
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I know.
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It s like, out of the mouths of babes, just incredible.
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Oh my gosh.
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This is so pure and raw, isn t it?
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Yeah.
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It also tells you where they were.
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The fear of like, oh my god, dropping this limestone replica of an IndyCar may have cost me manship with my grandpa.
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Like, oh my god.
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Just that.
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Just that one thing.
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He s going to be in therapy when he s 38.
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He s like, well, I was walking across the hall.
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But it ll be one of those traumas that he doesn t remember, because he s only four and a half.
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But it ll be there.
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Yeah, it ll just manifest itself in some bad behavior.
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That s right.
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Wait for TikTok to uncover it.
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That s a fun TikTok trend.
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OK, so topic today, practice, practice, practice.
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We re going to talk about practice today.
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And sales practice is a really interesting topic, because so many of you listening hate it.
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You think it s dumb.
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You think it s silly.
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It s not real.
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That s the thing I hear all the time.
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It s not real.
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And you listen to ideas like we give you ideas like this, and you don t practice.
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And so I
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am a changed person around that.
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I used to hate to practice.
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And I used to not even as a sales coach enjoy practicing.
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I thought, why make people uncomfortable?
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And over the last few years, with some help of some clients actually pushing me on this, I ve decided that that s not a good approach, that I think we are in a performance business.
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And luckily, we have the ability with iPhones and technology, we can practice all the time.
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And we can self-evaluate all the time.
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So I d like to hear your thoughts on just your philosophy of practicing.
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And maybe we can share some observations with you as our listener.
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about how to reframe your thought, if you need that, about practicing.
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And if you are a good practicer, how to make you even a better practicer.
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And both will probably, in this episode, talk to both the sales management group and the salespeople, because both of you play a different role, oftentimes, in practicing.
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Yeah.
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And I would say to salespeople, if you have a manager who doesn t do this, recommend he or she does this, because it s going to help everybody.
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Think about an athlete.
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An athlete doesn t say to his or her coach, you know what, coach?
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I m not going to practice this week.
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I m just not going to do it.
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I feel bored, and I ve got some other commitments that are important.
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No.
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A great athlete has a great relationship with practice.
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They love it.
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They go.
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They get to hang out with their teammates, and they go to practice and get better.
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And so I think salespeople have to be adamant to their leaders
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is we want to practice.
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And maybe you practice on different things, and maybe not every meeting, but be a solution here.
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And the way you ll do that is just to make the recommendation to practice more.
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I love that.
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The whole idea of it, I think, is the advice you gave is brilliant advice.
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And I bet some people are like, I m not going to go to my boss and ask to practice.
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They just don t want to do that.
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Yeah, but it s because role play.
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It s because we have thought of practice as role playing.
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And I don t think role playing effectively describes good practice.
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Sometimes practice could just be practicing on one little part of delivering your message or shooting a LinkedIn video.
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It doesn t have to be the entire sales process.
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It could be practicing an email.
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You can write an email.
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You can practice follow-up emails and send them to yourself, or send them to a couple of friends and see how it goes.
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Say, hey, I m thinking about using this as my follow-up email to our demos.
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How does it hit you?
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Is it too authentic?
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Or just get some feedback from it.
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That s practice.
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Practice typing.
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That s absolutely right.
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Right?
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A-S-D-F-J-K-L semicolon.
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Practice typing.
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Remember that?
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What?
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That s home row, man.
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Typing, right?
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You know how to type, don t you?
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I do know how to type.
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Are you a two-finger person?
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No, I do, no, no.
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Are you a hybrid typer?
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I m an 11-finger person.
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You are, yeah.
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You got a good reach there.
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But what I do, but you just opened up just a hornet s nest for me.
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Oh, gosh.
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And that is, when I go on Netflix or anything, why do I have to literally go letter by letter to search on something?
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Oh, don t get me started.
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Why is that?
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It needs to be voice recognition.
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Why isn t there a voice?
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There should be.
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There should be.
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And there was, on our old TV, we had voice and that was easy.
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Now I ve gone, and then some keyboards or ABC, some are what you just described.
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Yeah, the old school ASDFJKL semi-colon.
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If anybody knows what, if that was home row, I ll give him 20 bucks.
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I shouldn t say that.
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Everybody s going to know that.
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OK.
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So I gave you one.
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You give me one now.
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Let me see.
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Like lament about something?
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Something I hate about Netflix?
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Oh, no, no.
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Oh, OK.
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Let s get back to the topic.
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Yeah, the topic.
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So I think you need to think about what practice is for.
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And practice is for trying new things and messing them up.
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Practice is not for perfection.
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Do not practice to be perfect.
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Don t practice to say it absolutely perfectly how you re going to say it.
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Try new things and say them wrong, and then try them again, and try them again, and try them again.
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I love, more than anything, when my clients are in the middle of a sentence, and they say in a practice session,
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I don t know where to go here.
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I m stuck.
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Let me start over.
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Let me start over.
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I m like, brilliant.
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That s not bad.
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People think that s bad.
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That s good.
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I praise that kind of behavior all the time, because it tells me the person is looking at practice the right way.
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I m trying something new, trying something new.
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I got the benefit of my refereeing business to watch NFL team at practice, lots of them, for hours and hours.
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And they do this all the time.
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Now, they practice fundamentals that they know how to do.
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They also practice branding.
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new stuff.
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And they re like, reset, reset, do it again, do it again, let s try it this way, let s do this.
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They re always trying new things in practice as part of what it s for, repetition.
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Yeah, I would also say that if you re practicing something that is, let s say you re practicing presenting on a webinar, or presenting some kind of remote thing,
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I think it s also good, and you know I always harp on this and I ve just seen it work so well, is write down what you re going to practice.
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That s good.
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So for example, let s say you re practicing the first three minutes of a webinar.
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Yes.
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And you just want to nail that first three minutes because that s when everything kind of gets set.
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And practice it, write it down, or transcribe it, look at it, make some modifications, ask then your boss or your compadre, say, look, this is what I m thinking about doing.
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Do it.
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Have them.
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And by the time you go through about four or five iterations of that, you have nailed it.
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And it really hasn t taken that long.
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It s not like a six month process.
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It s just an hour.
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But now when you go to that webinar and you are dialed in for that first three minutes, no one can stop you.
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You re unstoppable, because you have it.
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You know it.
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You can be creative.
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You can be funny, because you know you ve got a track that you ve got to get back to.
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Yeah, the confidence that comes from practice is second to none.
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You will be so much more confident if you practice your sales process, your sales language, than if you just each time hop on there and go, OK, I hope this goes OK.
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You re constantly, constantly.
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And every time it s a little different.
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Yes.
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And then you can t really correct.
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Yes.
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I ll speak to the managers this time for practice.
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I think it s important that you facilitate a good environment for practice.
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And so practice shouldn t be over-pressured.
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You should contextualize it by saying, this is a place to screw up.
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We want to try new things.
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I think coaches need to demonstrate also.
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I really do.
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In selling, of course, an NFL coach who s a receiver coach maybe isn t in the physical shape
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to demonstrate a route.
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But in sales, you ve got your brain in your mouth.
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That s all you need.
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And so I m a fan of managers.
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And what I want them to practice and demonstrate in practicing is that they can screw up, too.
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They can screw up.
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So I try to do this.
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I m sure you do, too.
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When you re saying something, I ll say, OK, what I just said is too wordy.
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Scratch what I just said.
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That was too wordy for me.
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Let me try it again.
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And I ll do that.
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No one has to be perfect.
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Never.
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No, no, no.
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But create a good environment.
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And here s the second thing for managers.
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Practice with real scenarios.
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Too often, we set up this generic.
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We have so many.
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Everybody has so many deals to pull from to practice.
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Be the real deal.
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Like, OK, I want you to be X company.
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I don t want to say one.
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But I want you to be Procter & Gamble Bill.
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And I want you to be Bill Blair.
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And Bill s a GM.
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And he s been there for 15 years.
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He s a little hesitant to bring sales coach in.
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And he s kind of set in his ways.
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And I want you, as my buyer, play Bill Blair.
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That s a real person, by the way, at P&G.
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And be him versus like, OK, let s pretend you re a sales manager.
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That s too generic.
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Be real with it.
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Have real scenarios to coach and teach with.
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best scenarios you can pick that are real are those that are coming up.
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So you ve got a call next week on a Wednesday, it s a closing call with somebody, and you kind of feel like, the last call didn t quite go the way we wanted it to, so tell us what happened and let s role-play it.
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And that way you get that nailed for next Wednesday, now it s useful and relevant, and not just practice on some kind of arbitrary, conceptual, theoretical, hypothetical... Keep going, keep going.
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I was at four in
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And then I started getting inside my own head.
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Well, I mean, you re kind of channeling some 80s rap people, 90s probably, you re probably more in the Eminem with the poem last time and then that.
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I mean, I m seeing it.
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What is that?
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I m starting to feel it.
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I m starting to feel it coming around.
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I think it s the room.
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I think it s the checkerboard.
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Yeah, it s the music production center over there that we re calling that.
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It s quite a studio.
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It s quite a studio over there.
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I ve got a music production studio over there that A, isn t set up, and B, hasn t been touched for six years, but one of these days... My studio s the same way, but why are chords everywhere?
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I didn t even notice that.
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We live in a chordless society, I thought.
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My favorite Bill Kaskyism, we need a chord management system.
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I mean, we need a chord management, and mine s even worse, but there s chords here, there s chords here.
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Well, you do it.
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Look at this.
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Well, that s good.
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That s kind of on there.
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It s not just flopping around.
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OK, I have another one for you, because I think that s exactly true for the VP of sales, sales leader, is you ve got to make it a safe environment.
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One thing that I would do after every role play is ask the person in the role play or in the practice, what were you thinking?
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What was the dominant thought there?
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When you said, I d really like to serve you, Mr. Prospect, what were you thinking?
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And then you can come back and say, well, I was thinking that this thing is slipping away, and I got to save it in some way.
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And that s when the VP of sales should say, OK, let s change the thinking there.
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Because that thinking led to the words and to the actions.
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And if your words aren t right, it s because your thinking s not right.
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Absolutely.
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But you can t always catch that on your own.
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You ve got to have a moderator, coach, facilitator, manager there to say, OK, right there.
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Right there when you did that, what was going through your mind?
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That s fantastic.
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That is fantastic, because we always coach the mechanics, don t we?
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We do.
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We always spend the time with mechanics.
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SPEAKER_00
We don t coach the thinking.
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SPEAKER_00
And I m guilty of that.
1
SPEAKER_01
As a coach, I m guilty of it.
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, how about if you say it this way instead of, what was going on in your mind?
1
SPEAKER_01
Because that s why it came out that way.
1
SPEAKER_00
Absolutely, yes.
1
SPEAKER_00
And why did you say it?
1
SPEAKER_00
What was behind that phrase, that statement, or whatever?
1
SPEAKER_00
My last bit of advice is I think that the best way to get, if you re hesitant to practice, the best thing I recommend you do is to practice by yourself.
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SPEAKER_00
Because these days, we have tools all around us.
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SPEAKER_00
One of my favorite things to do now, and I love this.
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SPEAKER_00
So I ve got my Zoom studio all set up here and everything.
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SPEAKER_00
I record my own Zooms by myself now, because all my Zooms are recorded.
1
SPEAKER_00
So all I do is just start a meeting in Zoom, and I just start talking.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I use my whiteboard, and I hold it up, and I can go back and look at it and say, oh my gosh, the whiteboard, the lights were reflecting.
1
SPEAKER_00
It looked like crap or whatever.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I never knew that or noticed that.
1
SPEAKER_00
And how can I change that?
1
SPEAKER_01
So what do you do then?
1
SPEAKER_01
Do you just play the Zoom for the people when they get on the call?
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SPEAKER_00
No, for me.
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SPEAKER_00
Just for me.
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SPEAKER_00
I just watch it myself.
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SPEAKER_00
That s what I m saying.
1
SPEAKER_00
I practice myself.
1
SPEAKER_00
I write it.
1
SPEAKER_00
I hold it up.
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SPEAKER_00
Then I go back and I watch it.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s like I do my football games.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m like, oh man, I didn t realize it was making a glare.
1
SPEAKER_00
This is a true story.
1
SPEAKER_00
Pens.
1
SPEAKER_00
I switched.
1
SPEAKER_00
I don t like black pens because they re boring, but they re the only thing that shows up.
1
SPEAKER_00
So I was using a blue pen and a green pen the other day.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m like, this sucks.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh, thank you very much.
1
SPEAKER_00
I appreciate that.
1
SPEAKER_00
Are you clean?
1
SPEAKER_00
Did you wash your hands?
1
SPEAKER_00
I sanitized that.
1
SPEAKER_00
Thank you.
1
SPEAKER_00
I ll have to sanitize them too.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then you have your voice memo on your phone.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
And you can play any recording into it.
1
SPEAKER_00
You can leave a voicemail.
1
SPEAKER_00
Practice a voicemail.
1
SPEAKER_00
Back to your point about what s happening.
1
SPEAKER_00
Oh, I ve got to leave this customer this voicemail.
1
SPEAKER_00
Why don t you record it for yourself before you do that and listen and see how it sounds?
1
SPEAKER_00
You ve got to practice by yourself.
1
SPEAKER_00
Before you hit send.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
1
SPEAKER_00
When I started with you in this business, I used to spend hours, and people thought I was crazy because we didn t have any technology, on the whiteboard by myself with an empty room.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then we had these big windows, and people would walk by like, what the hell is that guy doing in there?
1
SPEAKER_00
There s no one there.
1
SPEAKER_00
Does he know there s no audience?
1
SPEAKER_00
But I knew that that s how you practice.
1
SPEAKER_00
And then you bring you in, and bring a couple of people in, and do a practice session, and it just keeps going.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s great advice, and you can do that on video too, if you re practicing on, if you say my LinkedIn videos just don t look good, well, get them to look good.
1
SPEAKER_01
Get the right angle, get the right this, get the right lighting, get the right background, have the right microphone, and at some point after 20 takes, it ll be good.
1
SPEAKER_00
Get a haircut.
1
SPEAKER_01
I ve got to produce a Facebook video.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I m getting ready to tell Travis I couldn t do it because my hair s too long.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m getting a haircut tomorrow.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m going to do it on Monday.
1
SPEAKER_01
Oh, good for you.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
So if you re not happy with it, you re not going to send it out and click Send.
1
SPEAKER_01
So get happy with it.
1
SPEAKER_01
And the way you do that is to practice, practice, practice.
1
SPEAKER_01
There is no shame in this idea of spending a little time practicing.
1
SPEAKER_01
None.
1
SPEAKER_01
What s the ratio in pro sports?
1
SPEAKER_01
They play four hours?
1
SPEAKER_01
No, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Four to 40.
1
SPEAKER_01
I mean.
1
SPEAKER_01
Couldn t even tell you.
1
SPEAKER_01
What if Bobby Knight said one is to 10 as playing is to practice or something like that?
1
SPEAKER_01
Could be, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
It s just 40.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s 10 times.
1
SPEAKER_00
At least.
1
SPEAKER_00
At least.
1
SPEAKER_00
Because you also, there s film study.
1
SPEAKER_00
I heard some stories about the NFL draft.
1
SPEAKER_00
And coaches, they re watching film seven, eight hours a day on one player, evaluating the player, deciding if they re going to pick him.
1
SPEAKER_00
I mean, they re so into that.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we as professional salespeople, we don t need to stay up till 4 in the morning practicing.
1
SPEAKER_00
But good gosh, we got to do it once in a while.
1
SPEAKER_00
Absolutely.
1
SPEAKER_00
Right?
1
SPEAKER_01
And if you have a one-hour webinar or something you re doing, spend 10 hours practicing it.
1
SPEAKER_00
We guarantee you, you ll be better at it.
1
SPEAKER_00
Malcolm Gladwell, 10,000-hour rule from Outliers.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s what that chapter is about, that book.
1
SPEAKER_00
If you ve never read it, it s a great book.
1
SPEAKER_00
Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell, 10,000-hour rule.
1
SPEAKER_00
Rant over.
1
SPEAKER_01
All right.
1
SPEAKER_01
How d we do?
1
SPEAKER_01
Practice, practice, practice.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, go ahead.
1
SPEAKER_01
Take us on.
1
SPEAKER_01
I liked it when you said your point number three there.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m going to fact check this with our producer.
1
SPEAKER_01
What was that?
1
SPEAKER_01
You said point number three is, if you don t like practice, here it is.
1
SPEAKER_01
Just practice.
1
SPEAKER_01
But you said practice alone or practice in the dark.
1
SPEAKER_00
Practice by yourself.
1
SPEAKER_00
Practice in the dark with a candle.
1
SPEAKER_00
Practice by yourself.
1
SPEAKER_01
But if you don t like practicing, just practice.
1
SPEAKER_01
Genius!
1
SPEAKER_00
It s kind of like, do you do yoga?
1
SPEAKER_00
You ever do yoga?
1
SPEAKER_00
Uh-huh.
1
SPEAKER_00
You know, they call yoga your practice.
2
SPEAKER_01
And it s your practice.
2
SPEAKER_01
And yours is yours and mine is my practice.
2
SPEAKER_01
So my truth is not your truth.
2
SPEAKER_01
You re all, wherever you are in your practice is where you are.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s true.
2
SPEAKER_01
So let it be.
2
SPEAKER_01
Take rest.
2
SPEAKER_01
If you need to take rest, take rest.
2
SPEAKER_01
My favorite part about yoga is you get to just lay there if you want to and no one judges you.
2
SPEAKER_01
If you need to take rest, take rest.
2
SPEAKER_02
I like the kind where we bring a pillow and all sorts of things.
2
SPEAKER_02
There s some kind of yoga mantra or meditation that you go through, and you re literally just laying there.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s fantastic.
2
SPEAKER_00
No stretching at all.
2
SPEAKER_00
Exercise.
2
SPEAKER_02
If you re not already in our Insider Group, go to advancedsellingpodcast.com slash insider.
2
SPEAKER_02
Once again, make sure you go to LinkedIn.
2
SPEAKER_02
Let us know on the group page whether you d like to see us on or hear us on Clubhouse.
2
SPEAKER_02
And we d love to have you.
2
SPEAKER_02
If you re a brand new listener, just go to advancedsellingpodcast.com.
2
SPEAKER_02
Snoop around a little bit.
2
SPEAKER_02
Love it.
2
SPEAKER_02
See you.
2
SPEAKER_02
Bye.