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On today s episode, Brian shuts me out of a discussion, but he has a great conversation with David Meltzer, who you ll recognize, I think, as soon as you hear him.
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Brian tells the story of how they came to a hotel and did a recording that you re going to hear on this week s podcast.
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Hey, welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast, longest running sales training podcast in podcast history.
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I m one of your hosts, Bill Kasky.
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Brian is absent, but he was on assignment about a week ago, and he had a chance to catch up with author David Meltzer.
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And if you don t know who David is, Brian gives you a quick rundown of who he is,
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And what he does right now, he s really an interesting guy.
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He s got some tips for sales professionals.
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He tells his story about how he was very successful in sales, but kind of doing the wrong things on his way to success and how he s changed his life around.
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and some of what he recommends for our listening audience.
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So Brian had a chance to catch up with them.
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They turned on the mics, and the mic quality is very much up to my standards.
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So I m very proud of both he and David.
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And they had an audio engineering team, I think, too, in the background.
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So I really do think you ll enjoy this episode.
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David Meltzer and Brian Neal.
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Hey, everybody.
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There are a few things that would get me up on a Saturday morning.
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One is to catch a flight to go to one of my games.
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Another is to go to one of my kids  events.
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Another would be to interview someone that I admire and someone that inspires me.
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And today, that is the case.
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I got up bright and early, drove downtown, and I am here with a really well-known author, speaker, coach, sports entertainment executive.
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Dad, all the stuff, all the things.
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Thrilled to death to have him on the Advanced Selling Podcast, David Meltzer.
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Thanks, brother.
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Appreciate you being here, man.
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That s great.
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This is great.
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So there s a little story back here that I think everyone needs to hear.
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I was on Instagram yesterday.
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and scrolling through, and I followed David.
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He put up on his Instagram, because he s such a giving guy, you re going to learn a lot about him in a sec, but he said, hey, I m driving right now, and I m going to Indy.
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I was a passenger, by the way.
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He was a passenger.
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I made the mistake of putting I m driving, and so many people were like, dude, drive it next.
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I m like, I m not.
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And he said, yeah, hey, text me while I m riding here in this bus.
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So I said, hey, I m an Indy.
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Dave and I share the love of sports at a real high level.
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And I m off this weekend.
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I don t have a game to go to.
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And I said, hey, man, would love to chat with you, have you on the podcast.
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The instant answer was, love to.
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And so everyone knows Dave s a super busy guy.
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And great lesson in giving of your time just right out of the gate.
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I think from a sales standpoint, that s just a wonderful lesson.
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And I m really glad I reached out to you.
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It s awesome you say that, because I think my love is sales.
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I think life is sales.
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And my success comes, even when I was CEO of Samsung s first phone division, the reason they fired me when they got too big was because I was just a sales guy.
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I was good at raising money.
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I was good at telling people.
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I had no engineering background.
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I m not a great engineer, but I m a great salesperson.
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But you said a word that makes sense, and salespeople have to listen to this, busy.
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It always says Dave Meltzer is so busy.
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No, I m productive and accessible.
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Busy people sleep all day.
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Busy people, you think it s early for you, right?
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6 a.m.
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is 3 a.m.
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for me.
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But I m productive and accessible.
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I live my life in a lens of productivity and accessibility, including when I made my first million in sales right out of law school.
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I joke around, my plan was at 250.
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And I was here in Indy, by the way.
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But plan at 250.
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I worked 10 years and nine months.
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I worked 10 years of work, 10 years of productivity and accessibility in nine months, so I actually was way below plan.
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I just worked 100,000 for 10 years and squeezed it into nine months.
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That s the way it works.
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It works either way, doesn t it?
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Yeah.
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You ve got one thing I appreciate about, and you all need to follow David Meltzer on Instagram and LinkedIn and everywhere you can find him, and our listeners love when we bring
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people like you to them into their life.
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So I m hoping a lot of our podcast listeners are going to follow you and you ll start to hear from them.
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One of the things I love about your story is you are very vulnerable and open and authentic because you ve been up and you ve been down, you ve been up and you ve been down.
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All salespeople experience that all the time.
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I just had some client work this week where people are like, my head s in the crapper, blah, blah, blah.
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Talk about what you learned from the low points, the places where the stuff just didn t work for you.
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You ve got a really great story about that.
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Yeah, so for me, I learned four things, believe it or not, that you have to have a stake in principles, meaning that there are no ups and downs.
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Life s just about lessons, and the lessons keep on coming, and they ll keep coming the same way until you learn them, and they result in pain if you don t learn them.
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And so although my energy and focus on money
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was in the wrong direction.
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It was in taking, manipulating, overselling, back-end selling, lying.
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And you talk about being vulnerable.
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People think because I tell people, look, I was an overseller, back-end seller, manipulator, and liar when I sold that somehow I m vulnerable.
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To be honest, I think it makes me invulnerable.
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What is someone going to say about me now?
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Oh, Dave Meltzer oversold me way back in 1995.
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Yeah, I did.
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And I learned my lessons.
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Maya Angelou was a prostitute when she was 20 years old too.
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She learned a lot of valuable lessons that have helped everybody in the world.
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And that s truly the perspective that I have.
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I also learned about perspective.
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When you hit lows and you hit highs, you get a broader spectrum of perspective and perspective
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dictates your subjective value in life.
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Now I m talking sales terms, right?
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Subjective value is so important because people sell on subjective value and they get in trouble because it s very hard to control.
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Your credibility is hard to control.
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Your emotional attachment to the issue or the business issue is hard to control.
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I tell people all the time, subjective value is a circumstance of every single moment of your life.
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So focus in on quantitative value when you re selling, then the subjective value is all cherry cream and spice on top.
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And moreover, when you re on the quantitative value and you provide more of it, your subjective value raises because your credibility raises and your emotional attachment, they trust and like you more.
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And so I have a very systematic way of my spirituality.
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Which relates to sales.
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Why wouldn t you?
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You know, our friend Blaise Pascal said if you don t believe in God, or if you believe in God and God doesn t exist, there s not much harm done.
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But if you don t believe in God and God does exist,
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much harm is done, right?
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It s like past lives.
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It s like you might as well find something, right?
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That s the biggest lesson you can take from this podcast.
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People ask me all the time, I believe in more than one life, right?
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And not in a religious context.
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I believe in all dogmatic religion, but I ask myself, what s a better choice?
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This is it, or there s more?
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I ll take more.
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Thank you.
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I m a sales guy.
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I ll take it more.
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I love it.
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I love it.
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I want to talk about, because in my referee inside of my business, like all of us, started at the bottom, now we re here.
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But where is here?
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What is here?
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So I want to talk about, everyone looks at people like you and they say, well, gosh, he s different.
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He s different than I am.
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He s got some gift that I don t have, or he had some privilege I didn t have, or he s got a choice.
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I don t believe that at all.
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And I d love for you to talk about, so salespeople say, well, Dave s got a better territory than I do.
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That s why he, or he, they re- I heard that a lot.
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All the time, it s crazy, isn t it?
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Yeah.
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So talk about that, like the idea of what you have versus what you don t have in selling.
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I believe people are born with different gifts.
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Right?
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Yep.
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We have a quantum memory that s at least four generations, grandparents, parents, right?
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Grandparents, parents, all the way down.
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We have to take and be aware of what those gifts and curses are that we ve inherited.
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And then we have to use certain values in order to reach our own potential.
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Yep, the minute you waste energy focusing it on other people the minute you spend energy worrying about what type of territory you were What made me such an extraordinary why they had to change the comp plan for me at West publishing?
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They put me in the outskirts of Indiana the outskirts where nobody worked.
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These are my people Davis where I m from the best That s why I m here.
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My daughter goes to I love this place Hoosiers.
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Yeah, it s amazing but
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I believe that what makes the difference, people ask me, what do you think the biggest advantage you have?
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I ll tell you what the biggest advantage I had, I grew up with a single mom, six kids, and nothing.
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Matt Higgins and I from RSC Ventures, right, we talk about it all the time, I feel sorry for the kid that grew up with everything.
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Because, you know, Tom Brady s the best quarterback of all time because there s a chip on his shoulder.
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Right, you know?
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Every other fan should be cursing the people that did not draft Tom Brady in the first round.
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They should be cursing the people that didn t let Warren Moon play quarterback for six years in the NFL.
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Because he ll even tell you that chip on his shoulder is why he is the goat of every African-American quarterback in existence, the only one in the Hall of Fame.
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so many yards that nobody will reach them with CFL in here.
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Same thing in sales, same thing in life.
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It s your consistent every day, every day.
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This is the way the body, mind, and soul work.
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Persistence, I m not a quitter, I m a mule.
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You may be more talented than me, but I knew my quantum, my quantum memory was I am a little mule.
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I knew it because I would listen to the little train that could, I d listen to the don t quit poem, and there s something that literally, I watch Rocky,
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So even when I went bankrupt, this is true how the universe works.
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I was depressed one day.
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I lost over $100 million.
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I was depressed one day, and I lied there in bed.
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I couldn t get up, and I m doing the TV, tears on my face, like, my wife s gonna leave me, I ve screwed this whole up, you know, and three daughters, and a son on the way, right?
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I m really in a bad place, and Rocky comes on, and he s getting torn up, and he keeps getting up.
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You know, everyone remembers the last fight, right?
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And I m looking at it going,
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You P-word, you wimp.
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I m like, if I can look up, I can get up.
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Because I saw him, he d like to look up.
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And I still get choked up.
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And as silly as it sounds, that was one of the things.
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It s like, you know what?
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I have nothing to lose again.
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I got the advantage.
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I got the advantage because I have nothing to lose.
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And now I m going to do it the right way.
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I m not going to do it by manipulating, lying, selling, and overselling.
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I m going to trust the universe and only be productive, meaning I m just going to provide value.
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and I m gonna ask for a little bit back so I can give it to other people.
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And this whole philosophy of abundance has changed my life.
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I make more money, I help more people, and I absolutely have more fun than ever, and my relationships are far greater.
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Isn t that interesting?
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It s the mental shift, and people listen to our podcast forever.
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Our core tenet in selling, the big three, the Holy Grail, are abundance, detachment, and intention.
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I love it.
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That s what it is.
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That s what we have talked about for years and years and years.
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And I love the fact that, what I love most about your story is, because so many salespeople, I always tell my clients, I say, especially the young ones, they want to climb fast.
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I m like, do not chase money.
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Do not chase titles.
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Don t chase money.
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Don t chase titles.
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And they get so caught up in that.
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And I love to hear, most salespeople make a decent living.
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Most of them don t have $100 million.
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Yeah.
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You went from $100 million to negative.
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Yeah, like bankruptcy, you re kind of in the hole there.
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And then then the switch goes off.
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And now look, it comes right back and people really need to hear that message.
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It s so so critical.
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And here s the difference.
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I was always money oriented money was I was attached.
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My emotion was attached to money.
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A lot of salespeople out there listening.
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I bet you when you get that commission check,
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You re extremely ecstatic because you re attached to how I hit my number.
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The next month you immediately go back to that number and then at the end of the year you re sick to your stomach and going, I ll never be able to hit that number.
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They increase my comp plan.
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Look, I went through that for years.
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I ll tell you what I do now, I just tell myself I m gonna double the amount of money I make as fast as I can.
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So that s a different perspective of money.
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I m still motivated to my potential, but mine s about acceleration and growth because I understand math and the exponential nature of math.
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One of the things I teach people, especially in sales, is there s a point called 25% or 10 years.
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So in sales, when you re 25% of your goal,
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Right.
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That s when 99% of the people quit, even if you re on pace.
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Yes.
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It s so funny.
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But the thing is, we don t know what pace is a lot of times.
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So here s the sad thing.
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Whatever amount of time that took you to get to 25, it s going to take you half as much to get to 50 out of that 91% that stayed on 99% are going to quit at 50.
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Yes.
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So now if you want to be in the elite of the elite, you re only half amount of time from being a hundred, half from 200, half from 400, half from 800% of plan.
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So what I always say is if you enjoy.
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the consistent, persistent pursuit of your potential.
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You understand acceleration and growth, you are gonna get so far beyond what you can even imagine, and anytime you use a number of time, money, those actual pragmatic numbers, all you have to do is put the word minimum in front of it, and you are not limited or don t create resistance for yourself.
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So you say, I d like a minimum of that.
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Even time-wise, I say I m gonna focus a minimum of one hour a day on my health.
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Which, by the way, the number one piece of sales advice I can give you is find a way to focus on your health for one hour a day.
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I don t care how money driven you are, that s the best piece of advice I can give you.
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I asked my wife when I went bankrupt, what can I do for you?
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That s what I came out of the room with, is what can I do for you?
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And she said, take care of yourself, because I know if you take care of yourself, you re gonna take care of everyone else.
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Sorry I get choked up, but it s true, right?
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And that s why everyone knows their why.
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We all, especially salespeople, we re driven to take care of other people.
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We don t even want the money.
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We pretend like we want the Ferrari.
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No, what we want is our kids, our families, maybe a charity.
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That s what we really want.
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And every salesperson that I ve ever met, they re not into the money.
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They re competitive.
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They are.
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They want to matter.
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Brendan Burchard says, live, love, matter.
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They want to matter.
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And you re listening, and people can hear David s voice.
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You can t see his face.
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The emotion is raw on his face.
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I want everyone to understand that.
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And I tell you that because, again, someone who s had $100 million to zero to back up to double commas and big money.
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It s not about that.
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It s not about that.
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That doesn t make you cry or well up in your eyes or your face for Clint.
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That s not what it s about.
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So everyone listening to this, there s a deeper, and it doesn t mean that you have to sell all your things and travel the countryside.
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I m not Mother Teresa.
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I m not walking the street.
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Right, exactly.
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I am a huge money man.
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Let me tell you why money matters.
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Yeah, so purpose matters like Brandon said money matters people It does not buy you happiness, but it allows you to shop and if you shop for the right things, you ll be happy Yeah, if you shop for the wrong things, you won t be and that s the dip, but you need money at this level Yes money and faith are the only two things that you have and I don t care what religion you are Yes faith is the aggregate think say do and believe all the right things understand your personality traits characteristics obsessions and addictions
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and activate the ones that are most positive, productive, and accessible, and you will be happy.
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And that s the end all of what you want to do, even as a salesperson.
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You just want to be happy.
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That s it.
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That s all you want to do.
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This is awesome.
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Talk about, I always get asked when I go give talks, as I transition from, you know, peewee league, to high school football, to small college, to big college, Big Ten, into the National Football League.
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People always say, what s the difference between the Big Ten
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football field, the players, everything, and the NFL.
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And I always tell them, everyone s like, well, bigger, faster, stronger, mm, kinda.
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The difference is at the margin, in my opinion.
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So the difference between a National Football League wide receiver and a college wide receiver is the NFL wide receiver doesn t drop a ball in practice, and the college kid drops two.
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So talk about the difference, the margin, as you climb up to bigger things.
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It s in every sport, and I use sports as well to learn this, and it s in every sales rep.
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The margin is who can get out of their own way, meaning who can lessen the interference between the most powerful source of light and information and everything and themselves and themselves and others.
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Golf, there s a kid that just shot a 59 at Greenbrier.
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I don t know if anyone saw that.
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So what s the difference of that guy and Tiger Woods?
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Tiger Woods stays out of his own way more than anyone else, or did.
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Yes, now when his life changed guess what the difference in time wasn t his back injury It was in the back injury could be a manifestation of him getting in his own way and the energy that was created for it Yes, yes, and the people who get out of their own way consistently Yes, and Warren will tell you this about quarterbacks Jeff George, by the way, we represented all the great Corbett young moon you guys name it I ll ask Lee Steinberg who are the two greatest
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quarterback talent-wise, Jeff George and Ryan Leaf.
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That s what he ll tell you, but guess what?
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Those are two of the people that were most in their own way, so sometimes the people who have the most talent don t have the ability to get out of their own way because ego is the thing that causes a corrosion or interference.
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Ego is the need to be right, offended, separate, inferior, superior, anxious, fearful, frustrated, resentful, guilty, all of these feelings, and guess what?
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Those are all feelings of salespeople.
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all feelings of salespeople all the time at some point.
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To me, the trick is you ve got to let them come in and go out.
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Because they come in like, oh, there s that thought.
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I m going to leave it now.
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I cancel it.
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SPEAKER_01
I don t even leave it.
1
SPEAKER_00
I cancel.
1
SPEAKER_00
Exactly.
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SPEAKER_00
Push it out.
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SPEAKER_00
I m aggressive.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s so true.
1
SPEAKER_00
Last bit.
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SPEAKER_00
As you look back and you think of your mentors and people that taught you things, especially in the sales environment, can you either share a story either about a mentor or something that you learned from a mentor that you wish you would have learned a lot sooner?
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SPEAKER_00
Oh, for sure.
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SPEAKER_01
So most people don t know this name, but there s a guy named Mike Bosworth in Del Mar, California, who started solution selling.
1
SPEAKER_01
SPI bought it.
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SPEAKER_01
And I was an eagle when I came to West Publishing.
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SPEAKER_01
I sold naturally.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I did not listen to him.
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SPEAKER_01
And I was the guy in the back of the class.
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SPEAKER_01
Now, because they hired him every year, eventually it became my life code.
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SPEAKER_01
Understanding reasons, impacts, and capabilities.
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SPEAKER_01
Anyone that s coached by me understands that.
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SPEAKER_01
I have taken it, grown with it, but Mike told me, pulled me aside the first training, he said, you might be the top sales rep here, you may have made a million dollars your first year or more, he said, but I ll tell you your problem.
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SPEAKER_01
I said, what s that?
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SPEAKER_01
He said, humility.
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SPEAKER_01
He said, the greatest salespeople, the ones who last, David, they re humble, and you re not.
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SPEAKER_01
Look, I m 24 years a millionaire, out of law school, come from humble beginnings, and I lost my humility, and I wish
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SPEAKER_01
I wish I would ve listened to Mike Bosworth as a mentor and focused in on my humility through all the success, and whether you re an athlete, a salesperson, an executive, I have two words, and it s not thank you, which I live by.
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SPEAKER_01
Thank you, because that s inherent in my quantum now.
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SPEAKER_01
It s radical humility.
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SPEAKER_01
I post it still today.
2
SPEAKER_01
I write it.
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SPEAKER_01
When I start feeling separate and better and inferior and all those things that ruin your life,
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SPEAKER_01
That humility, that understanding that one tree has no branches, one branch would not go to war against another branch.
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SPEAKER_01
That s what puts me back into the flow of I am here to be of service.
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SPEAKER_01
And how can I best be of service?
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SPEAKER_01
Not like Mother Teresa walking the streets of Calcutta.
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SPEAKER_01
giving away all that I have.
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SPEAKER_01
No, it s getting more and more to allow it to come through me with appreciation to add value, add value, and give it away.
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SPEAKER_01
I live by 120 rule.
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SPEAKER_01
I m giving everybody $100 worth of value, time, money, whatever I can, and I m asking for 20 back.
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SPEAKER_01
Because I have the ability to do that, and I m gonna go and get it, and that s how I live my life.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s beautiful stuff.
2
SPEAKER_00
I really appreciate you being here, man, and taking the time.
2
SPEAKER_00
I know you re super busy.
2
SPEAKER_00
Everybody follow Dave Meltzer.
2
SPEAKER_00
Accessible and productive, not busy.
2
SPEAKER_00
Accessible and productive.
2
SPEAKER_00
I learned a new code, right?
2
SPEAKER_00
You want to tell anyone where they can find you, please do.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so please, you know, I m the most famous person you ve never heard of.
2
SPEAKER_01
So if you remember my name, David Meltzer, David Meltzer.
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SPEAKER_01
You can get me at David Meltzer.
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SPEAKER_01
You can David Meltzer on LinkedIn, YouTube, et cetera.
2
SPEAKER_01
And go ahead and DM me or message me.
2
SPEAKER_01
I ll give you my text number as everybody knows.
2
SPEAKER_01
And if you really need help, I will give you my cell phone that you can call me immediately.
2
SPEAKER_01
I send out all my books for free.
2
SPEAKER_01
So if you give me your address, I ll be more than happy to do that.
2
SPEAKER_01
I love to help people.
2
SPEAKER_01
So please reach out to me and I really appreciate you taking the time to wake up early.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I got a, you got a new fan.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s it, guys.
2
SPEAKER_00
Thanks for your time.
2
SPEAKER_00
Really appreciate it.
2
SPEAKER_00
See you next time on the Advanced Selling Podcast.