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This episode of the Tony Robbins podcast is brought to you by Tony Robbins Unleash the Power Within.
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Whatever area in your life you want to change, your health, your relationship, your career, or your business, Unleash the Power Within will awaken your spirit and pave the way for breakthroughs to make that all happen.
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Learn more at upwvirtual.com slash pod.
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That s upwvirtual.com forward slash pod.
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Hey, everybody, it s Tony Robbins, Tony Robbins Podcast.
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I m real excited to be with you today because, you know, I ve had the privilege of working with some of the greatest athletes in history, and I ve been to some of the most amazing fights, both boxing and UFC.
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This last January, I got to work with Conor McGregor, which was a great privilege, and watch him win the fight in the first 40 seconds, and all the electricity of that, but also the beauty of sportsmanship, of watching Conor go over there and hug his opponent, you know, afterwards, and sincere, and acknowledge his grandmother, who was cowboy, his opponent s greatest influence.
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So sports can bring out the best in us or the worst in us.
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It depends on our character.
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And I ve worked with a lot of amazing athletes over the time, and during their tough times and during some of their best times.
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But when people see boxing or UFC, I think a lot of times they think it s just ruffians, people who s beaten up on each other, and they don t understand the discipline involved in boxing or martial arts.
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Boxing is often called the sweet sport.
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It s a combination of skill sets and intellect.
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It isn t just physical force.
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in history are the ones that can combine their psychology, their spirit, their soul, and that physical body to produce extraordinary results.
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And I think we all need to be able to face our fears and move forward.
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So I thought in the middle of this kind of COVID environment, it might be nice to visit, you know, ringside with a legend.
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And I m here with an unbelievable legend, the only man to be a four times world boxing champion, Evander Holyfield.
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Thank you, brother, for taking the time to visit with us.
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Thank you.
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Now, we were talking just before we started about interviews.
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I said, how many interviews you ve done over your life?
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Would you share what you share with me?
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I was like, here s this incredibly powerful man.
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And what was it like in the beginning?
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Well, it was the most scary thing.
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It was harder than the fight, you know, just to.
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Guessing what this person may ask me and I answered properly Yes, and how and how did you learn to deal with that over the years you built obviously to now it doesn t bother you But what did it take to get there because I heard it really was tough on you in the beginning.
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Well, you know, it s just thing
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Knowing that if you make a mistake, you know that you made one.
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People make mistakes, but repetition is what make people better.
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Yeah, well that s true in fighting or in life.
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So listen, tell us a little bit about your childhood, a little bit, if we could start there, because you started fighting when you were like seven years old, if I understand correctly, is that right?
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Or eight, when you were in the box?
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I started at eight years old.
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What happened, I was coming from the football field.
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And I seen a guy hitting his speed bat.
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So I want to go in and ask him.
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I said, sir, can I hit the speed bat?
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And the man looked at me and said, no.
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I said, why?
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He said, because you have to be on the boxing team.
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I said, well, sir, I want to be on the boxing team.
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He said, no.
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So the next day, I asked him.
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He said, no.
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And then the next day, he said, no.
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On the fourth day, I looked at him.
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He looked at me.
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turn my head and start walking the other way, he turned his back and I ran up there.
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And I asked him again.
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And he said, yeah.
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I come in there.
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Tell us a little about who influenced your life the most, not only in boxing, but in life.
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My mom.
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My mom was, my mom actually my everything, you know, that got me started.
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And if it wasn t for my mother, you know,
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And I d tell him where I would have been.
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I was so touched.
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At eight years old, is that when the guy said you think he could be world champion?
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Yes.
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And you were at the boys club?
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Yep.
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Tell us that story.
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And then tell us what you said to the man when he said you could be world champion.
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Well, the man told me I could be the heavyweight champion of the world.
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And he said, uh... At eight years old?
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Yeah, eight years old.
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He said, what you think?
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I said, I got to ask my mama.
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And he look, and he s all, you don t want to be there with your, I said, but I got to ask my mama.
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He said, what are you talking about?
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I said, if I don t ask my mama, I can t even try.
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My mama said, no, that s it.
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That s right.
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And that s when the man looked at me and said, you got a good mom.
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And so you did ask your mom.
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Did you ask her that night?
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I sure did.
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And what d you say?
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I asked my mom, and this is how it was.
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We had the little house, and everybody in the front room looking at TV.
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So when I come in,
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They looked at me and they said, where you going?
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I said, I gotta ask mama.
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They said, what you gonna ask mama?
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So they trying to find out if I m in trouble or not, because if I m in trouble, they know they may get a little piece of that.
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And I guess.
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They re older, they should be looking out for you, right?
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Yeah.
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So I go in there and I start trying to tell my mama what this man was trying to tell me.
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And so my mama kind of talked real loud.
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She said, what you say?
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I said, mama, this white man at the boys level said I can be the heavyweight champion of the world.
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And my mama looked, she looked at me, and when she get that look, I got to step back, or she may swing.
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So she- Did you become a great boxer?
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Yeah, I m telling you, I got to get them hands up there quick.
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Always go for the head, she never go to the butt.
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Always shoot the head.
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And so what happened, my mama said, do you know what they re going to do to you?
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So I just act like I didn t.
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I said, no man, they re going to hit you.
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And I looked at her and I started laughing because all my brothers and sisters hit me, I get three whippings a day.
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And now I m a cousin getting hit.
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So getting hit ain t nothing new.
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So my mom said, well, you can t hit them back.
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And she said, yeah, you can do it.
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And I remember going in the bathroom, looking in the mirror and saying, Evander Holyfield, heavyweight champion of the world.
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So when I went back and told my coach, my mama said I could be the heavyweight champion, he said, what, what?
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You know coach, here I am, I m 65 pounds.
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I m telling my coach, my mama said I could be the heavyweight champion of the world.
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But what was the advice she gave you?
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She gave you three pieces of advice that you ve repeated your whole life.
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Listen, follow direction, don t quit.
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How important has that been in your life?
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That still goes on today.
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Yeah.
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Because things still get tough.
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Of course.
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And you have to not quit.
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Now, you re 58 years old, and one of the reasons I m here is I know you re in the best shape of your life.
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You look like you re 25.
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And you want to fight with Mike Tyson again.
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You had pretty legendary fights in those 90s that you guys had.
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The history you guys have is amazing.
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And what I love about both of you is you re both such incredibly intense competitors, and you tease and taunt each other, but you really do have a friendship as well.
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Tell me what you respect about Mike Tyson.
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You know, these guys here is a lot bigger, but Mike Arnold was shorter than everybody s.
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Yeah, and he still destroyed them all.
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He hit the birds and all this, and I seen him fighting guys, 6 5 , 6 6 , and you know, he get in the peek-a-boo style, and get in there, and he was like a rattlesnake, man.
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He get them so fast and all that.
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All of a sudden, I realized, I said, if he can do it, I can do it.
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So he actually was a role model for you at one stage?
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Well, yeah, because the thing is- You re older than him, right?
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No, yeah, I m four years older than him, but he got in there, I m telling you, he got the first opportunity.
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He beat these guys, and I said, you know, if Mike can do it, I can do it.
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I said, now, I became the Cruiserweight champion.
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When I became the Cruiserweight champion, I thought that was great.
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when I beat the white Miami Coyote on my 12th professional fight.
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Went 15 rounds, lost 15 pounds, and all this.
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And all of a sudden, after I came the undisputed cruiserweight champion, then the thing was is that, phew, Mike get $2 million a fight.
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I get $200,000 a fight.
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So I go ask the Showtime people, what s the difference?
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They said, well, Mike the heavyweight champion of the world.
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I say shi-
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I said, how much you give me as I move up the headway?
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They said, you know, Mike gonna kill you, man.
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I said, no, no.
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I said, we sparred before.
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Like that.
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And all of a sudden, when that time came, the whole big thing was, all right, you beat all these guys.
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So the avenue we took, it was to fight all the people that Mike fought.
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And I saw it.
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getting them guys and your confidence built even more than know what my confidence built but
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the decision that I ve made, I can stay comfortable and just be the cruiserweight champion and make the 200,000, or I can be heavyweight champion of the world and make some millions.
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You want to fight Mike today, why?
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Mike Tyson, why do you want to go back and have that fight?
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Well, the thing is, it s competition.
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The thing in competition, my whole thing is that, now, I only want to do it if he want to do it.
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If he wants to do it, yeah.
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Because the fact of the matter is that, you know,
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It would be fun because both people know how good we are.
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Yes.
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The whole world knows how good both of you are.
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And then people want to know, OK, then, even at this old age, who would get the best?
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Yeah.
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And so the point of the matter, you know what?
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I don t think that Tyson and I can get in the ring and not think about who the best.
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And I know it s not one time in my life I m going to go in the ring with nobody that I ain t think I m going to get the best.
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And I got to sit with you now.
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Now I really want to fight.
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Well, Mike has talked about, he s talked publicly about, of all the fighters he ever went, that you re one of the toughest he s ever experienced.
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Lennox Lewis said that.
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I mean, you look at the top four fighters, heavyweights, they ve all talked about how tough you are.
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Where does that toughness come from?
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My mom.
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All this stuff started at a young age.
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When your parent wants you to be better than them, they start telling you things.
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I m talking about, if they never tell you these things, then how can you be better than them?
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You re gonna be better if your parents start telling you, look, you don t need to make these mistakes that I make.
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You re gonna be a lot farther.
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And that s what my mama did.
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And the first thing was that tongue.
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She said, all right, now.
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She said, my tongue, I can control my tongue.
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She says, you know what?
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I was a fool.
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And she says, let me tell you what a fool do.
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A fool don t get promoted.
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And that s all I did, my whole life got promoted, because I was able to shut that mouth.
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And your mama, you talk about the sacrifice.
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Your mama, you wanted to go to that prom so bad.
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Tell people a story about that and what you did instead and how it shaped your life.
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Well, I had to go to Canada, Quebec, Canada, and had to fight.
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And I was mad.
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And I win the tournament.
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And I was still.
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Instead of going to prom though, right?
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Instead of going to prom.
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And I remember everybody said, you missed your prom, man, you missed it.
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And then, here it is in 1987, and I m a champion of the world.
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And everybody said, man, you ain t coming out the room.
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I said no, because my mama told me, if you learn to, you the talent.
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If you mingling with these people, you re gonna lose.
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But you stand here, and when they have to go, and then when it come Monday, they gotta go to work.
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You got two weeks home.
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That s awesome.
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So you re looking for your advantages that what you have.
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She said, okay.
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You know?
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I don t think your mama was great at getting you to see what you had instead of what you didn t have.
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Right.
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And I think most people, it s like I always tell people what s wrong is always available, so is what s right.
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And your mama really guided that.
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What an amazing gift your mama has been in your life.
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What would she be most proud of in you today?
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Well, I ll tell you, you know, my mama, you know, my mama, all the wars that my mama got,
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Once I became the champion of the world at Cruiserweight, from 1986 to 1996, she get all these awards, because everybody said, I said, I said, not my mom, I said, I m telling you, I wouldn t have been here.
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I said, I said, for all the things, I said, I said, one thing that I realized,
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My mama didn t play.
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When my mama said, zip it up, she mean now, not later.
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I took off, she said, you did?
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You get it right then and there.
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I said, now, I ve been slapped in this mouth and got soap put in this mouth because of things I said.
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I said, one time.
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I don t like the taste of soap.
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I ve had those experiences, too.
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My mama shaped me, too, brother.
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She really did.
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She was an intense character.
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But you look at it, and it s like what you think you want your mama to be versus what God gives you, always something greater.
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There s always some lesson in there.
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And if she d been the mama I thought I wanted to be, I wouldn t be the man I m proud to be either.
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So mamas out there, we honor you and send love to you.
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And dads out there, too, that decide to give your all for your kids.
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That s what the life s really about, man.
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And you re such a beautiful example of that.
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And thank you.
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You know, I grew up totally poor, too.
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And a few years ago, I went and interviewed 50 billionaires, self-made, nobody from the Lucky Sperm Club, all guys that earned it on their own from the very beginning.
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And I want to learn from them because I wanted to help people, because most people don t understand finance.
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Most people don t get trained in it.
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And I watched so many athletes, so many entertainers.
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Singers, writers, directors, actors lose everything.
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And you went through that experience.
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It s horrific.
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Yeah, sure did.
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You gave up your 54,000 square foot mansion.
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You lost it all, half a billion.
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What did you learn from that?
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Because I see it happen to boxers today and athletes today.
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What did you learn from that experience?
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And what could you tell somebody who s younger today so they could avoid not having to go through the pain you ve had to go through?
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And how did you make it through it?
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Because most people would just be devastated.
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But you just kept going.
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You didn t give up.
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So that s the point of being thankful for where you came from.
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I came from nothing.
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And so if a person came from nothing, they know they got there because of what they did.
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So the whole big thing, if I don t quit striving for it, but one of the big part is to forgive.
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You gotta forgive yourself because you don t wanna let them do this to you.
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You can sit here and blame, I can t believe these people did this.
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If you can t believe it, then you probably still have your money.
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But you got to believe it because you ain t got no money.
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You lost everything because you believe.
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They did what they did.
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Now you got to forgive them, and you got to make some adjustments.
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And I made a lot of adjustments, and it s a part of life, because this is what... So you saw it as your mistakes to allow them to do it to you, as opposed to, I m a victim, they did this to me, so my life is over.
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You just picked it up and said, I learned from this shit, and I m going to move on?
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And how did you forgive?
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That s a part of love.
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You think you love somebody and you can t forgive nobody, you really don t love them.
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You re just telling yourself a story.
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You have to forgive to be able to be able to make adjustment, to be able to receive when somebody else calls and saves you.
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You get yourself to a point where you don t trust nobody, then
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Anytime somebody trying to help you, you got their eye on it.
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And all of a sudden, you make the situation hard on the person while trying to help, and if a guy, hey, somebody don t scare them to death, so he don t take no chances, so I can t work with him.
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People today are so afraid to take chances.
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I mean, if you ve been in business for any period of time, 10, 20, 30 years, you ve got people to steal from you.
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And it s just part of the process of you learning not to leave the candy store open and blame them, right, for a child coming and taking it.
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I really respect you for doing that.
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But how did you build back from that time, though?
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I mean, to go from half a billion to literally nothing, part of it was just your history.
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I grew up dead poor, too.
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So it s like, OK, I ve been here before, so I can build again.
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What was the mindset?
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The mindset is that, you know,
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God is not finished.
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When people go through something hard because something great is coming.
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It s a part of life.
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If, you know, I think about if I was a kid and when my mama kept just telling me and I just, you know, everybody that I knew that was young, that was my age and all that.
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Everybody were doing everything for them and they were grinning, they were laughing, they were smiling, they were going to the prom and all this and stuff.
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And I was like, you know, I started feeling sorry for myself.
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So I still got that same picture that I showed to my son.
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I said, see this picture?
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Well, daddy, you don t look like you happy.
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I said, well, I m happy now.
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I said, but I m trying to tell you.
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It s a decision, it s some things that I m gonna tell you you can t do.
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And you probably gonna be looking just like this.
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I said, but.
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I said, but at the end, I said, look how happy I am.
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You wasn t happy there?
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I said, yeah.
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I said, but that s just a moment.
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I said, but what kind of man you want to be?
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I said, now, your kids want to go this.
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And I said, look, I said, why do y all think that y all got this great education?
2
SPEAKER_01
I said, you know what?
2
SPEAKER_01
It didn t cost me nothing for education.
2
SPEAKER_01
It cost me $15,000 a year for y all to go to this school, this early education and all this.
2
SPEAKER_01
I said, but I m happy to do it.
2
SPEAKER_01
I said, because?
2
SPEAKER_01
You won t have to cry like me, wonder why, because my mama had to come and get my first whooping in school because this guy said, told me, you not smart.
2
SPEAKER_01
And when he told me that, and I punched him right in the doggone eye.
2
SPEAKER_01
And my mama came and gave me a whooping in the school and had to apologize to the teachers and the student.
2
SPEAKER_01
My mama said, you don t hit nobody.
2
SPEAKER_00
So it s a profession.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s not something you just go use randomly.
2
SPEAKER_01
Right.
2
SPEAKER_01
You know, but you know, I said, Mom, buddy, you were talking.
2
SPEAKER_01
So if you re talking, you want somebody to come knock the daylights out of you?
2
SPEAKER_01
Why didn t you hit the big guy then?
2
SPEAKER_01
It s amazing.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s amazing.
2
SPEAKER_01
You got a temple, but you won t hit the big guy.
2
SPEAKER_01
You re going to hit the little guy.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s really cool.
2
SPEAKER_00
Literally, you got a body of a 25 year old.
2
SPEAKER_00
Certainly, you re 60, almost 60.
2
SPEAKER_00
You know, you could be 40.
2
SPEAKER_00
You better shape the most 40-year-olds.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s amazing.
2
SPEAKER_00
Tell us a little bit about your training, like this discipline of persisting and this pushing yourself that you ve always done your whole life, pushing beyond what anybody could imagine.
2
SPEAKER_00
How much of a role those two things played in your life and your success?
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, the big thing was, you know, at a young age, my mom would tell me, she d say, if you don t break nothing, you don t have to fix nothing.
2
SPEAKER_01
So don t go tearing stuff up.
2
SPEAKER_01
You don t get no bad habits, so you don t have to cease nothing.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so the whole big thing, fortunately, I don t think it was great being poor, but a lot of time when you poor, people don t give you chances.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so the whole big thing is, so you have to hang out with somebody like you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And my mama would not let me hang out with people who cursed and they did all these things.
2
SPEAKER_01
and I ve become better because I was sitting there by myself all the time because the people who lived a better life, they wanna hang out with me.
2
SPEAKER_01
But the people that had a rough life, I thought I was better than them.
2
SPEAKER_00
When you look at your career, what stands out for you as the most fulfilling aspect of being a fighter all these years?
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, making the Olympic team.
2
SPEAKER_00
So representing America.
2
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, but you know,
2
SPEAKER_01
You know, because we was amateurs.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so everybody wanted to be, who wanted to be one of 12 members who gonna make the Olympic team.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I think I was the last guy that made the Olympic team.
2
SPEAKER_01
And you know, it was kind of scary because I was actually fighting the amateur world champion, this guy named Ricky Womack.
2
SPEAKER_01
He had beat the Cuban, he had beat the Russian.
2
SPEAKER_01
So two people who wasn t coming to the Olympics in 84 were the Russian and the Cuban.
2
SPEAKER_01
But this guy named Ricky Womack had beat them already.
2
SPEAKER_01
He was a reigning amateur world champion.
2
SPEAKER_01
So to get to L.A., I had to beat him.
2
SPEAKER_01
Twice, and I did.
2
SPEAKER_01
That must have felt incredible.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, it did, you know, because I remember Howard Cosell was telling me, he said, Evander Holyfield, what kind of chance do you think you have with Ricky, wonderful Womack?
2
SPEAKER_01
And I said, well, did he make the Pan American team?
2
SPEAKER_01
He tells people and they look through the paper and they say, well, he lost against Evander Holyfield.
2
SPEAKER_01
Then so, he grabbed the paper, he looked at the paper and he said, well,
2
SPEAKER_01
One thing Ricky that Womack hadn t done, he never lost a fight back to back.
2
SPEAKER_01
And he said that to me, I said, I haven t either.
2
SPEAKER_01
It s just a positive thing that you have to realize.
2
SPEAKER_00
So how important is that psychological part of this game?
2
SPEAKER_00
How important is your psyche and that sense of certainty going into a fight and also keeping that certainty when somebody maybe stuns you or they land something?
2
SPEAKER_01
That s like 90% of the whole fight, how you think.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
The whole thing of not quitting, the whole thing of having the certainty you can beat him still.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, you know, I m being in great shape.
2
SPEAKER_01
A person can be in great shape, but he can get hit one time, then all of a sudden, it s a mind change.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_01
He can almost give it up.
2
SPEAKER_00
Tyson s famous for that quote where he says, everybody s got a plan until they get hit in the face.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re right.
2
SPEAKER_00
The whole thing changes in that moment, right?
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re a very spiritual man.
2
SPEAKER_00
You re a beautiful soul.
2
SPEAKER_00
One of the reasons I want to meet you is everybody I ve ever talked to about you said, yeah, he s an unbelievable fighter, but he s an incredible man.
2
SPEAKER_00
And I know the fighting for you, there s almost a spiritual side from fighting for you.
2
SPEAKER_00
Tell me what that means to you and going into a fight and what it s about and both in the preparation side of it, as well as the fight itself.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, it is the same fight that the word God say, I let my son die for you, where you can believe.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so if you keep believing, eventually you re gonna start winning.
2
SPEAKER_01
And you know, because as a kid.
2
SPEAKER_00
How do you keep believing if you aren t winning in the beginning?
2
SPEAKER_00
Because not everybody is in the beginning, right?
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, the only thing I can tell people, as a kid, I was the youngest one, and my brother didn t let me win anything.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I would tell my mama, I said, mama, they don t never let me win.
2
SPEAKER_01
My mama, they don t suppose you.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I just, you know, so I was the only kid that was the youngest of the family that went winning nothing.
2
SPEAKER_01
And two, I went to the boys  club.
2
SPEAKER_01
When I got to the boys  club, I was six years old.
2
SPEAKER_01
I was better than the kids that were eight, because my mama,
2
SPEAKER_01
Then make no adjustment for me and all that.
2
SPEAKER_01
And let me know that if you want something, you really have to work hard.
2
SPEAKER_01
But if you just give everything to kids, kids never gonna say, okay, don t give me no more.
2
SPEAKER_01
They re gonna keep on letting me win.
2
SPEAKER_01
Then all of a sudden you re gonna be- And then they re weak.
2
SPEAKER_01
Oh, yep.
2
SPEAKER_01
That would tend to happen.
2
SPEAKER_00
What do you think about this society that we ve become where parents today give kids trophies for participating?
2
SPEAKER_00
They haven t done anything.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re not disciplined themselves.
2
SPEAKER_00
They re not funded.
2
SPEAKER_00
And it s like everybody deserves a trophy today.
2
SPEAKER_00
How do you feel about that philosophy?
2
SPEAKER_00
And you re a father of 11, right?
2
SPEAKER_00
Is it six girls, five boys?
2
SPEAKER_00
So what s your philosophy with your kids?
2
SPEAKER_00
And what do you think of this philosophy?
2
SPEAKER_00
Everybody gets a trophy no matter what for participating.
2
SPEAKER_01
Well, I think that even though they may get an award,
2
SPEAKER_01
but it s the parent s job to let them know, okay then, well what did you do?
2
SPEAKER_01
And so, we re kids, you know, people ain t gonna reject.
2
SPEAKER_01
Now, Seth Anderson, I didn t even know this as a kid.
2
SPEAKER_01
I would go to the fight, I would go to the fight and I would hope my guy didn t show up.
2
SPEAKER_01
I didn t want my guy to show up where I wouldn t have to, because I knew if I go to the fight, I m going to eat, and I m going to do this.
2
SPEAKER_01
So all these things come with the fight.
2
SPEAKER_01
You re having fun, but the rough part, just fight.
2
SPEAKER_01
I was hoping my guy didn t show up.
2
SPEAKER_01
And he showed up every time.
2
SPEAKER_00
I bet afterwards they wish they hadn t shown up.
2
SPEAKER_01
The thing is that you won, but you still had to go through that, which gave you even more confidence that you could do it again.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
Every fight kind of felt like the first fight.
3
SPEAKER_02
You say you grow, but I still feel the same because the intensity get greater and greater.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
Like that.
3
SPEAKER_02
How do you keep increasing your intensity over the decades?
3
SPEAKER_02
Well, because repetition makes you better.
3
SPEAKER_02
Even if you think you ain t getting better, if you re practicing, you re getting better.
3
SPEAKER_00
Yes, repetition is the key to mastery of anything.
3
SPEAKER_00
But if you keep doing it, you start at a different level, start at a different level, and you just keep growing from there.
3
SPEAKER_00
Is that the essence of it?
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, because you don t forget nothing.
3
SPEAKER_02
You keep practicing.
3
SPEAKER_02
And that s just like, if you stop asking, then you may not want it no more.
3
SPEAKER_02
If you stop asking, if you keep asking, that lets you know you still want it.
3
SPEAKER_00
and that hunger, where does that hunger coming from you that you still have at 58 years old, the hunger that gets you to, you re doing two a days at 58 years old and you don t even have a fight you need to prepare for.
3
SPEAKER_00
Where does that hunger come from?
3
SPEAKER_00
So every person I ve ever met who is extraordinary in business and finance and entertainment, the one thing they have is this hunger that is insatiable and you clearly have it, not by what you say, but by the way you live.
3
SPEAKER_00
Where does that hunger come from for you?
3
SPEAKER_02
Well, I think that everybody,
3
SPEAKER_02
or that anything that you love, it got a hunger in, so you ll know by the love that you have, this is the reason why, you know, somebody may try to be like you, and it s hard, and it s a joy for you to do it, it s easy.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m like, you know.
3
SPEAKER_02
Because you love it.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, because you love it.
3
SPEAKER_02
So that same thing, getting up early in the morning and stuff like this, I get up four o clock in the morning, I get up and I read this word and all this to prepare me for what the day may be.
3
SPEAKER_00
You know, there s so many people that want a better life, but they don t do anything about it.
3
SPEAKER_00
And it s like, very oftentimes they even make a decision to do it.
3
SPEAKER_00
But to me, the thing they re missing is the rituals.
3
SPEAKER_00
Like, you ve got rituals that you have drove in and you just don t break them.
3
SPEAKER_00
Like 4 a.m., most people s idea to get up at 4 a.m.
3
SPEAKER_00
I go to bed at 4 or 5.
3
SPEAKER_00
I have a different time zone than you do.
3
SPEAKER_00
But the same kind of discipline that like, you know what you do, you give it every single time.
3
SPEAKER_00
How important are rituals to being the best in the world at something?
3
SPEAKER_02
Well, they re very important because it starts by habits.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
Now, all habits not bad.
3
SPEAKER_02
Right.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m talking about a good habit allows you to see when you re not even trying to.
3
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m about to end a bad habit.
3
SPEAKER_02
You know, you feeling when you don t even know you re feeling.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
Like that.
3
SPEAKER_02
So this is reason why you have parents.
3
SPEAKER_00
What are your top two or three habits that throughout your life have caused you to keep growing and succeeding?
3
SPEAKER_02
You know, I think
3
SPEAKER_02
the love that I have for the Lord Jesus Christ.
3
SPEAKER_02
And my mama told me, my mama said, all right now, boy, you better stop calling, you know, anything happen to me?
3
SPEAKER_02
When I was a kid, I was going, mama, mama, you know, I would cry and all this.
3
SPEAKER_02
I thought my mama can save me for anything.
3
SPEAKER_02
My mama said, let me tell you something, boy, you better start calling Jesus, boy.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so,
3
SPEAKER_02
The first time I know that Jesus worked, and my mama whooping me, and I called Jesus don t hurt.
3
SPEAKER_02
And my mama stopped.
3
SPEAKER_02
So, which is the first time.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s a miracle all by itself from what you told me.
3
SPEAKER_02
That was hand in.
3
SPEAKER_02
The first time I lost a fight, and this kid beat me, and they ceased the calling.
3
SPEAKER_02
How old were you?
3
SPEAKER_02
I was 11.
3
SPEAKER_02
11, wow.
3
SPEAKER_02
Then he beat me when I was 12.
3
SPEAKER_00
You still remember his name?
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
The same guy, that same guy, after I beat Mike Tyson the first time, he stopped boxing at 13.
3
SPEAKER_02
When I beat him, I finally beat him at 13.
3
SPEAKER_02
Okay.
3
SPEAKER_00
It took you two years to beat him.
3
SPEAKER_02
No, no, the only way I beat him,
3
SPEAKER_02
I called Jesus.
3
SPEAKER_02
Please Jesus, help me beat him.
3
SPEAKER_02
Help me.
3
SPEAKER_02
I, you know, I called him.
3
SPEAKER_02
I only did everything to try to beat him two times and he don t beat me two times.
3
SPEAKER_02
I like so.
3
SPEAKER_02
I called Jesus and I fought him.
3
SPEAKER_02
I win this fight.
3
SPEAKER_02
So he didn t fight no more.
3
SPEAKER_02
In 1996, when I come home, I walk in the house and I see this white guy sitting there and I go, Ceaser calling.
3
SPEAKER_02
And everybody said,
3
SPEAKER_02
You still remember him?
3
SPEAKER_02
I said, how can you forget the first white guy that beat you twice?
3
SPEAKER_02
I said, hey.
3
SPEAKER_02
I said, man, you didn t grow.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m talking about he s still about 5 5 , 5 6 , weighed about 147 pounds.
3
SPEAKER_02
Wow.
3
SPEAKER_02
And he still had his hair the same way, just hanging in his eye.
3
SPEAKER_02
But at this point, I remember, that s how I was when he beat me.
3
SPEAKER_00
What happens when two fighters both call on Jesus?
3
SPEAKER_02
Well, you know.
3
SPEAKER_00
So Jesus gave me the strength.
3
SPEAKER_02
What happens then?
3
SPEAKER_02
See, that s how it was when it was me and George Foreman.
3
SPEAKER_02
And everybody mentioned, oh, you know, George is a Christian too.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I said, who God gonna go for?
3
SPEAKER_02
I said, well, have George been a heavyweight champ before?
3
SPEAKER_02
They said, yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
I said, OK, then he had his turn.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s my turn.
3
SPEAKER_02
That s it.
3
SPEAKER_02
That s it.
3
SPEAKER_00
That s it.
3
SPEAKER_00
You not only brought great boxing, what I love about you, man, is that you just, you got such a beautiful heart.
3
SPEAKER_00
I know you send, you know, I know you re a strong Christian, and regardless of whether it s religious belief is, you live your faith.
3
SPEAKER_00
Right.
3
SPEAKER_00
And Sandy was telling me that you send out every morning, like 4 a.m., you send out another piece from the Bible to like 300 or 400 people.
3
SPEAKER_00
Is that true?
3
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
3
SPEAKER_02
Yeah, I sure do.
3
SPEAKER_02
I m like, well, this is what- That s your mission, man.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s- 4 a.m.
3
SPEAKER_02
comes back, you know, I feel that,
3
SPEAKER_02
So you have to be thankful for what he gave you.
3
SPEAKER_01
Yes.
3
SPEAKER_02
And now, I see a lot of people that, just like yourself, speak real well.
3
SPEAKER_02
And I said, man, I ain t get that gift.
3
SPEAKER_02
Then I start thinking about it.
3
SPEAKER_02
you have to be happy with what you ve got.
3
SPEAKER_02
And this is how you get a little bit more.
3
SPEAKER_02
And you have to be thankful and happy for what you have.
3
SPEAKER_00
So part of your philosophy is to live in a beautiful state then, right?
3
SPEAKER_00
To live in a happy state, a appreciative state, a grateful state.
3
SPEAKER_00
So how do you balance that out with killing somebody?
3
SPEAKER_00
Because a lot of people when they think of boxing, they don t understand the level of discipline.
3
SPEAKER_00
They don t understand the art.
3
SPEAKER_00
They understand that there s a set of combinations here, there s patterns here, and there s thinking here, and there s an art here.
3
SPEAKER_00
You know, it s been called the sweet science boxing, right?
3
SPEAKER_00
Or even martial arts, you know, because I work a lot of warriors, I call them, right?
3
SPEAKER_00
Boxers, athletes, UFC guys.
3
SPEAKER_00
And the level of discipline is insane.
3
SPEAKER_00
Mike, you know, I ve done an interview with him recently, and Mike s talked about how he was kind of, he was forced in the game, you know?
3
SPEAKER_00
He was shaped by people that he feels didn t really look out for, and they turned him into a killer, and he doesn t want to be a killer.
3
SPEAKER_00
And so it s like he s gone through this transition in his life of hating that part of himself that got honed, but you gotta be able to destroy somebody.
3
SPEAKER_00
But you seem to be able to destroy him in the ring and still love on him afterwards, it seems like.
3
SPEAKER_00
How do you do that?
3
SPEAKER_00
How do you balance that?
3
SPEAKER_02
Discipline.
3
SPEAKER_02
So the thing is, is the fact is that
3
SPEAKER_02
you ve taken a chance.
3
SPEAKER_02
So life is taking a chance.
3
SPEAKER_02
It s almost like walking in faith.
3
SPEAKER_02
You got to feed your family, so you go find a great job where you can feed your family.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so consistently, somebody else wants your job.
3
SPEAKER_02
And then everybody competing for jobs.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so your job just as important as my job, because you got a family you got to feed.
3
SPEAKER_02
And so this is what life is really about.
3
SPEAKER_02
They got the enemy.
3
SPEAKER_02
The enemy tried to look at people s skin color, their height, why he got the job.
3
SPEAKER_02
I didn t have a job.
3
SPEAKER_02
And then, you know, God made people.
3
SPEAKER_02
And when he made people, made everybody the same.
3
SPEAKER_02
And they just got different colors.
3
SPEAKER_02
But the devil s job is to divide to conquer.
3
SPEAKER_02
To make you hate this person.
3
SPEAKER_02
If you hate this person, you get somebody on your side, maybe y all can take advantage of this person.
3
SPEAKER_02
But the fact of the matter, if you do the right thing, the right thing gonna happen for you.
3
SPEAKER_00
So what s your advice now to the kids that you talk with?
3
SPEAKER_00
Because you ve lived such a full life, right?
3
SPEAKER_00
What do you try to steer them to when you get a chance to influence them?
3
SPEAKER_00
And you have, what, 11 children yourself, right?
3
SPEAKER_00
How many boys, how many girls?
3
SPEAKER_00
I have six boys, five girls.
3
SPEAKER_00
Okay, got your hands full.
4
SPEAKER_02
Ain t no good woman, I put a flag out there.
4
SPEAKER_02
You know, that s how you have to look at life.
4
SPEAKER_00
What s your philosophy as a father?
4
SPEAKER_00
What do you try to instill in your children?
4
SPEAKER_00
What you ve learned?
4
SPEAKER_02
What I have learned is love is the key.
4
SPEAKER_02
I m successful because I found something that I love.
4
SPEAKER_02
Now my mama wanted me to find something that I love, not something that you like.
4
SPEAKER_02
You can like a lot of things, and that s the reason you may not become successful.
4
SPEAKER_02
But you find something that you love, you re going to be successful.
4
SPEAKER_02
That s what love is all about.
4
SPEAKER_02
God is love.
4
SPEAKER_00
I m with you, brother.
4
SPEAKER_00
I agree with a million percent on that one, man.
4
SPEAKER_00
That s gorgeous.
4
SPEAKER_00
So what s one of the fights in your career?
4
SPEAKER_00
You ve had so many.
4
SPEAKER_00
What s one that stands out?
4
SPEAKER_00
Because today, you know, I talk to people about the best story of humanity is the comeback story, right?
4
SPEAKER_00
Because anybody can succeed or get lucky, but being taken to your knees, like COVID has done to so many people, I said, you know, the comeback story, that s what excites every human being.
4
SPEAKER_00
It s the Rocky story, right?
4
SPEAKER_00
It s the guy comes back and they push through it all and they get better than they were before, right?
4
SPEAKER_00
What s been the comeback story for you?
4
SPEAKER_00
What s been one of the tough ones for you that you re proud that you may be able to come back from?
4
SPEAKER_00
Is there a particular fight that sticks out?
4
SPEAKER_02
You know, I have lost 11 times, but in the fact that the time that I lost, it was time where that I actually kind of went farther than I should, because, you know, I knew my shoulders hurt, but
4
SPEAKER_02
The guys that I was fighting, I thought I could beat them, even hurt.
4
SPEAKER_02
That pride kicking in, and you have done, I have done things like that, and you know.
4
SPEAKER_02
So, people said, then why you ain t tell me about it?
4
SPEAKER_02
I said, well, it s my fault.
4
SPEAKER_02
I shouldn t have did that.
4
SPEAKER_02
Why would, with me, just about the end of my career, I started fighting guys that were smaller than me.
4
SPEAKER_02
And I thought I could beat them even though I was injured.
4
SPEAKER_02
I ain t get to sit, I sit there and I go.
4
SPEAKER_00
So what do you do after that?
4
SPEAKER_00
What do you do after you ve disappointed yourself and you, because everybody does this at times, right?
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I always tell people it s like success is always the other side of frustration, the other side of rejection, the other side of failure, right?
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It s like the ability to push through it.
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So when you come back from one of those, can you think of one that was really rough?
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How do you get yourself back, you know, back to your top, back to your peak again?
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Well, the thing is, you have to justify that, hey, this is what I ve done.
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This is what I ve done wrong.
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So you own what you messed up on.
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That s right.
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So then you know what to fix.
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Instead of blaming the other guy.
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Yeah, that s it, because you know what?
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Somebody come and, that ain t your fault, man.
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That s the other person s fault.
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You got to be.
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committed to know that it s to you.
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And so what does boxing mean to you?
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What does it mean to be a boxer in your mind?
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Like, you know, some people think boxing is just as brutal, you know, sport.
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You obviously don t look at it that way.
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What is boxing really?
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What does it mean to be a boxer?
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I guess anybody, when you think, you can kind of think any way that you want, but it s a love to me.
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This is something that I found out.
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What do you love about it?
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the competition, and God gave me just as much strength as he gave everybody else, and it s who is able to make the adjustment they need to make.
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I m like, my... Fail as a boxer, in your mind, because you ve seen a lot of guys fail who were strong, you know, had a lot of will.
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What makes a boxer the boxer that doesn t make it he quit I m trying to say he quit on himself Life is about don t quit on yourself And but if you hadn t been taught that then you get the saying you know what this ain t this ain t for me Yeah, because this guy people get embarrassed if they lose.
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Yeah, think about my mama told me she s all right now She you sit here
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And you know that all these people come to see you, you know they come to see you to win.
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But you got some come to see you lose.
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They can t wait till that day that you gonna lose.
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He said, son, you never lose if you don t quit.
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Give your best.
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I m talking to the point of the matter.
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Your best is you gave your best.
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And say, you know, all right, you didn t win it, but the other guy.
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Yeah.
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You beat, right?
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Yeah, yeah.
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That s wonderful.
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So what s your, what s kind of like your mission now?
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Like what, what, what excites you?
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What are you passionate about this stage of life?
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Well, you know, just inspiring young people, you know, cause you know, I have done what I have done.
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And so ain t nobody chasing older people trying to be like older people.
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I remember when I was a kid and you know,
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This left side for the young people and this side for the old people, and then look over there, man.
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I wasn t trying to be like them.
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I m trying to be like these people like this, but it s the older people who have to have confidence and help them.
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And the wisdom.
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And come back and tell the young people how to help them.
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Now, I would never have been who I am if these older people didn t help me.
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I m like, you know, I remember
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At the boy s club, the first time I went to boy s club, I was six years old.
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And- Is that the first time you fought, six, seven?
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No, no, no.
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My first fight was when I turned nine.
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Turned nine, oh my gosh.
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But when I was six years old, when I was six years old, we walked to the boy s club.
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We walked about three or four miles to the boy s club.
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Yeah.
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And so now when we get there, my friend didn t tell me it cost a quarter.
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If they would have told me it cost a quarter, I would never went.
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Yeah.
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So, you know, we walked three miles.
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Yeah.
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I went to this boy s club and found out when I get up there, they had cards and they scratched their number off and they left me up there.
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And the lady named Miss Hawkins, who was white, and she said, are you a member?
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I didn t know what member was.
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Do you have a card?
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And I go, no ma am.
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She said, well, you re not a member.
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I said, well, oh, well, okay.
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And she said, do you have a quarter?
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Which shocked me.
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I said, a quarter?
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I get nickels.
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I don t get quarters.
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And so after that, she said,
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When you live, and I told by the stadium, so she know that three miles, she said, that s a long way.
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I said, I can walk.
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She said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
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And she turned around and she reached in her Brazil and got me a hot quarter.
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This is awesome.
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And this is how, this is what changed my life.
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Wow.
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The kindness of just one woman and seeing this little boy.
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If I never would have went to that boys club, I never would have been the person who I am.
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I was at the boys club practically till I was 21 years old.
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Wow.
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How often during the day when you re not in school, how often would you be there?
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Well, you know, when school get out at three o clock.
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Yeah.
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Then I leave and go to the boys club.
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When I get from the boys club at nine o clock, when I get home, it s time to get in the bed.
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So you d spend five, six hours at the boys club.
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Yeah.
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Wow.
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And the thing was, my mama used to tell me, she used to say, now,
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Now, you got a house in the ghetto, but you don t live in the ghetto.
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Oh, that s beautiful.
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What a beautiful thought.
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That s gorgeous, man.
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So let me know that if I didn t have this time with these people who are trying to correct people and trying to put people in a great position, I wouldn t be who I am.
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Yeah.
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Who were one of your first mentors or coaches?
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Like, who was the man who originally said you could be champion of the world?
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And what did you learn from him?
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Well, Carter Margin.
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Carter Margin, he was older.
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And when he seen me hit that bad, and he- And you re bleeding and you kept hitting.
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And he go, and he tell his son, he said, oh, this guy gonna be the champion.
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And you know how- Of the world, when you re eight years old, he s looking at you.
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He said, this guy gonna be champion.
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And his son, he said, I didn t say nothing.
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Then all of a sudden, and you know, so when he passed at 16,
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And his son, so he d tell his son, you know, because they knew he was going to pass, and he told his son, you need to go over there and all that.
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And his son came over there, and his son seen me hit that bag when I was 16.
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I went 139 when I was 16.
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Wow.
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And he seen me hit this bag, and then, oh, my goodness.
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Dad, it was all going right.
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I was wondering, how in the world are you going to be crazy about this kid?
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Even like, we played, his son and them in football.
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His dad would sit on our side.
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He said, your band ain t going to run by two or three touchdowns.
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And I ve run two or three touchdowns too.
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He said, y all kids are smart.
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These kids here train hard.
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But this man, he paid for everything that I ever did.
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I actually thought boxing was for free because he paid for everything.
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Then all of a sudden, one day the people told me, said, you know, boxing ain t free.
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He said, your coach paid for everything.
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He told us to take care of you and all this.
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And I realized, wow, yeah, I am thinking that boxing s the only thing that you can just go free enough.
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And I find that you have to pay for all the tournaments.
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But that man took care of me like that.
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And see, but this is a reason why I do give.
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Because I realize that he had to get it.
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I wasn t his kid, but he made sure that everything was right for me.
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When you look at your life today, what are you most grateful for?
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Well, I m thankful, you know, number one thing is Jesus.
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Yeah.
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And second thing is Jesus, my mom.
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And then, you know, they re going on that third and I think about my coach, Carter Morgan.
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Yeah, yeah, that s beautiful.
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Well, I m going to see Mike.
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What does knowing that God is in charge do for you in terms of giving you peace or giving you strength?
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Like, how does it affect you knowing that God is in charge?
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You still got to do your part, right?
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But the fact that God s in charge, what does that do for your psyche?
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Well, it let me know that he always, because he already telling.
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I m not going to forsake you.
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So you got to know that he s not going to forsake you.
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That means that he s going to give you another chance.
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Well, God, if you don t quit, he ll give you another chance.
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Yeah, that s beautiful.
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Evan, you re a beautiful soul.
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And I m so grateful to get to spend a little time with you here and really feel who you are.
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Because everybody knows who you are as a boxer.
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You re a legend.
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But as a man, you re a legend as well.
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Thank you.
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I know that your mother has to be one happy, grateful human being to see what her boy became and who he continues to become.
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Such a giver, such a lover, so distant and so driven, and a man who s constantly contributing and pushing himself.
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I think those are values that we all can value for ourselves.
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If we did, our whole world would get better, because we get better.
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We ve got more to give, don t we?
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Exactly.
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Very beautiful.
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Thank you, brother.
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Remember?
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And thank you for the little lesson here.
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The Tony Robbins Podcast is directed by Tony Robbins and produced by the Tony Robbins team.
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Copyright Robbins Research International.