0
SPEAKER_01
In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, Bill talks about a client who doesn t know who he is, I share my thoughts about pilot names, and we tackle an age-old sales problem, how to deal with budget and economic constraints.
0
SPEAKER_00
Welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast.
0
SPEAKER_00
We are your hosts, Bill Kasky and... That s the Remax, Brian Neal.
0
SPEAKER_00
That s right, and we come at you every Monday morning.
0
SPEAKER_00
Rumor has it this release is about 1 a.m.
0
SPEAKER_00
on Monday morning.
0
SPEAKER_00
Oh, is that what it is?
0
SPEAKER_00
I wonder if people stay awake so that they re as soon as... I would think they would.
0
SPEAKER_00
Or they check their email, they check their... So I used to think it came out at 6, but Travis, our
0
SPEAKER_00
producer said that, no, it s 1 AM.
0
SPEAKER_00
1 AM.
0
SPEAKER_00
So anyway, we re glad to have you with us.
0
SPEAKER_00
We ve been running this podcast for upwards of 10 years.
0
SPEAKER_00
We have over 500 episodes.
0
SPEAKER_00
We have almost 8,000 people in our LinkedIn group.
0
SPEAKER_00
So if you have not joined that, you re one of the three people left on the planet who haven t.
0
SPEAKER_00
Make sure you do that soon.
0
SPEAKER_00
There s good discussions and some extras in there.
0
SPEAKER_00
We just walked out of a strategy session.
0
SPEAKER_01
We ve got some cool things.
0
SPEAKER_01
We do.
0
SPEAKER_00
We do.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s exciting.
0
SPEAKER_01
Percolating here at the podcast.
0
SPEAKER_01
So stay tuned for that.
0
SPEAKER_01
We ve got some really, really neat things that we re going to be talking to you about in the fall.
0
SPEAKER_01
Stay tuned for that.
0
SPEAKER_01
So I had a client tell me a story.
0
SPEAKER_01
We talk about sales calls, bad sales calls.
0
SPEAKER_01
I heard what I would believe to be the worst sales call I ve ever heard.
0
SPEAKER_01
Oh.
0
SPEAKER_01
A friend of mine, friend and a client, his name is Phil.
0
SPEAKER_01
Born and raised in, I think, Youngstown, Ohio area.
0
SPEAKER_01
Now lives out in New Jersey.
0
SPEAKER_01
Works for a real big client.
0
SPEAKER_01
Really smart guy.
0
SPEAKER_01
He and I got to collaborate on some projects together.
0
SPEAKER_01
And so we re having lunch out in New Jersey.
0
SPEAKER_01
Last week, we were talking about it.
0
SPEAKER_01
He used to sell for a major tobacco distributor.
0
SPEAKER_01
And he would call on, he was in Detroit, in a rough area of Detroit.
0
SPEAKER_01
He would call on convenience smart owners, like the community stores.
0
SPEAKER_01
And he was in talking to this convenience smart owner person.
0
SPEAKER_01
And all of a sudden, they started to get shot at.
0
SPEAKER_01
He dropped him.
0
SPEAKER_01
Are you serious?
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
He got shot.
0
SPEAKER_01
I thought, are you kidding me?
0
SPEAKER_01
He s like, no, no.
0
SPEAKER_01
He s like, I was scared.
0
SPEAKER_01
I thought he thought he was dead.
0
SPEAKER_01
I mean, imagine that.
0
SPEAKER_01
So I was thinking of all the, I told him, I said, of all the sales call stories I ve heard, I ve never, and not getting shot at by the store owner.
0
SPEAKER_01
I would get that if like, you re coming right here.
0
SPEAKER_00
You re a little too aggressive.
0
SPEAKER_00
Closing too hard.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
But, but yeah, he dropped and apparently there was some sort of a gang activity going on outside or something outside of the convenience mart.
0
SPEAKER_01
and they started shooting at each other and the bullets were coming in at the thing.
0
SPEAKER_01
I was like, holy cow.
0
SPEAKER_01
And then I wonder what kind of liability, because it s a big corporation you ve heard of before that he was working for.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
Do you believe him?
0
SPEAKER_01
Oh, absolutely.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
Sometimes those stories can get a little wild, but I believe, yeah, I believe you believe him.
0
SPEAKER_01
I believed him until, you know, he said he, yeah, they hit him in the right knee and he chased him down.
0
SPEAKER_01
Chased him to tackle and get him a concussion.
0
SPEAKER_01
Did do that, so.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, good.
0
SPEAKER_01
Well, yeah, that would fall into the top five of my worst sales calls.
0
SPEAKER_01
I just wonder if any of our listeners here would let us know if they ve had anything that can top, if you ve got a sales call that can top getting shot at, or if you ve been shot at during a sales call, send us an email, listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com, and we d love to hear about that, even if it s close to getting shot at, even if someone just did something like threatened you with a tire iron or something, a squirt gun.
0
SPEAKER_00
Okay, topic today.
0
SPEAKER_00
I had a coaching call yesterday with a fairly new client.
0
SPEAKER_00
And he was lamenting because the person his prospect on the phone was saying that they just didn t have the budget for his solution.
0
SPEAKER_00
And his solution, in this case was about $50,000.
0
SPEAKER_00
And the
0
SPEAKER_00
The prospect said they only had 25.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, my guy can t do it for 25.
0
SPEAKER_00
And he had sort of botched it up a little bit earlier.
0
SPEAKER_00
One of his other people had.
0
SPEAKER_00
And so they weren t getting the right information.
0
SPEAKER_00
And so he called me and said, look, I ve got a couple of choices here.
0
SPEAKER_00
One is just to quote him the 50 grand and know that they re going to say no.
0
SPEAKER_00
Or I need to go in and have a conversation with her.
0
SPEAKER_00
And of course, I said, well, you can t just quote him.
0
SPEAKER_00
I mean, don t waste your time because you don t want to do that.
0
SPEAKER_00
I gave him three or four ideas of how to think about this situation.
0
SPEAKER_00
So rather than just, here s what to go say, I wanted to educate him a little bit as to how to think about this in the future.
0
SPEAKER_00
Because if we can do what we can to prevent these kinds of scenarios, they don t become as burdensome.
0
SPEAKER_00
And he s like, oh, you start to think about it.
0
SPEAKER_00
And you burn a lot of calories thinking about, what am I going to say, when really, the solution should have come up front.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yep, agree to this.
0
SPEAKER_00
So I have a few and you have a few.
0
SPEAKER_00
I do have a few.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I would also mention that this happens all the time.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
So this would be one of those episodes I think you d want to continue to play.
0
SPEAKER_01
Because all of you, no matter how long you ve been doing sales and selling whatever you re doing, this happens, doesn t it, all the time.
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
So can I go first?
0
SPEAKER_01
You bet.
0
SPEAKER_01
All right.
0
SPEAKER_01
Fire away.
0
SPEAKER_01
Number one, for your client, does he have a name?
0
SPEAKER_01
Can we say his name or no?
0
SPEAKER_01
My client, let s call him Bob.
0
SPEAKER_01
I wonder if the millennials, when they kind of do a scenario, let s call him Trevor.
0
SPEAKER_01
Let s call him CJ.
0
SPEAKER_01
A little more boy bandish.
0
SPEAKER_01
A little more boy bandish.
0
SPEAKER_01
Let s call him CJ.
0
SPEAKER_01
CJ.
0
SPEAKER_01
I like CJ.
0
SPEAKER_01
OK.
0
SPEAKER_01
So I would say to you this first, CJ.
0
SPEAKER_00
Ralph.
0
SPEAKER_00
You know, like Ralph.
0
SPEAKER_01
Exactly.
0
SPEAKER_01
Here, Oscar, Ed.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know, I have a thing about that, don t you, with pilots?
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so it used to be when you and I were growing up, and you d go to a pilot, you d say, hello, this is your first officer, Michael.
0
SPEAKER_01
And he flew it in Vietnam, and this is my Captain Bill.
0
SPEAKER_01
Now you get on, and it is like a boy band.
0
SPEAKER_01
Hey, I m Drew, and this is the first officer, AJ.
0
SPEAKER_00
We re going to take you up to Chicago.
0
SPEAKER_01
We re going to go the long way today.
0
SPEAKER_01
It s just funny, because the pilots are all 26 years old.
0
SPEAKER_01
They re Drew and AJ.
0
SPEAKER_01
OK, I digress.
0
SPEAKER_01
Number one, CJ, check your head, man.
0
SPEAKER_01
Check your head on this.
0
SPEAKER_01
This can be really frustrating.
0
SPEAKER_01
It feels hopeless.
0
SPEAKER_01
There s nothing you can do.
0
SPEAKER_01
final and that sort of thing.
0
SPEAKER_01
And so make sure before you go into the act and the say mode that you re checking your head and say, no, don t take the budget as an indication that your solution is not worth 50 grand.
0
SPEAKER_01
Don t do that.
0
SPEAKER_01
Don t buy into the fact that it s the end all, that the conversation can t continue either.
0
SPEAKER_01
And so just make sure you do a little self-reflection here, a little self-psychoanalysis to say, OK, OK, great.
0
SPEAKER_01
So the guy said $2,550.
0
SPEAKER_01
OK, that s just what it is.
0
SPEAKER_01
Because I think sometimes we can answer too many questions in our own mind, our mind spends a lot of time.
0
SPEAKER_01
I love that.
0
SPEAKER_01
Check your head.
0
SPEAKER_00
I like check your head.
0
SPEAKER_00
Here s one that I had that was, I would say, falls underneath that, and that is,
0
SPEAKER_00
I think we have to understand how budgets are even set.
0
SPEAKER_00
Usually, they are quite random.
0
SPEAKER_00
There s very little rhyme or reason to them.
0
SPEAKER_00
It either has to do with, well, we spent 24.5 last year.
0
SPEAKER_00
We re going to bump it up by 3% this year.
0
SPEAKER_00
Now it s 25.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, we don t even know why they spent 24.5 the year before.
0
SPEAKER_00
So a lot of times, these budgets that you hear are not something of deliberate intelligence and thoroughness.
0
SPEAKER_00
They re just a number.
0
SPEAKER_00
And so I think that s where your head comes in, is if you think this budget is something that is, oh man, it s carved in stone, there s no way we re gonna be able to change that.
0
SPEAKER_00
No, it s a random number.
0
SPEAKER_00
It s a random number.
0
SPEAKER_00
And my second part of that was, part B, was make sure you re calling on people who are unconstrained by budget.
0
SPEAKER_00
And the purchasing manager and some people in lower levels of organizations are constrained by the line item on a budget.
0
SPEAKER_00
Well, I can t do that because it s 25 and it s 26.5, so I can t do it.
0
SPEAKER_00
The CEO of the company probably is not constrained by budget.
0
SPEAKER_00
And it doesn t have to be the CEO, but somebody in the upper levels of that firm or that company that you re calling on doesn t really see budget as a constraint.
0
SPEAKER_00
Because if that $25,000, if your $50,000 leads to $5 million of new business,
0
SPEAKER_00
The CEO is not going to say, no, we don t have that in the budget.
0
SPEAKER_00
So the question is, are you calling on someone who is in the least bit constrained with some budgetary number that s no rhyme and reason to?
0
SPEAKER_00
I m getting a little agitated today about this.
0
SPEAKER_00
I can tell.
0
SPEAKER_01
I like it.
0
SPEAKER_01
I like it.
0
SPEAKER_01
This probably goes along with that.
0
SPEAKER_01
So this is more of a tactical thing.
0
SPEAKER_01
You think about it, but you also could ask it.
0
SPEAKER_01
So what s magic about the number?
0
SPEAKER_01
How did you arrive?
0
SPEAKER_01
That s a thing I d ask someone.
0
SPEAKER_01
So where d you come up with 25 grand?
0
SPEAKER_01
Because.
0
SPEAKER_01
That s a great number.
0
SPEAKER_01
How d you come up with that?
0
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, yeah.
0
SPEAKER_01
You know what?
0
SPEAKER_01
That s probably the best budget number I ve heard in the last six months.
0
25?
0
SPEAKER_01
Did you say 25 grand?
0
SPEAKER_00
And I was number 25 in high school.
0
SPEAKER_00
You said that.
0
SPEAKER_01
Wow.
0
SPEAKER_01
That is magical.
0
SPEAKER_01
I m going to quote our good friend Dave Catalano here.
0
SPEAKER_01
And Dave, who wrote the forward to Bill s book, Same Game, New Rules.
0
SPEAKER_01
If you don t have that, you ve got to go buy that book, Same Game, New Rules.
0
SPEAKER_01
And Dave used to say this.
0
SPEAKER_01
We worked really closely with him.
0
SPEAKER_01
He used to say, I have an unlimited budget for stuff that works.
0
SPEAKER_01
I have an unlimited budget for stuff that works.
0
SPEAKER_01
And I think that s a great way to think about investing in budgets, both on the buy and the sell side.
0
SPEAKER_00
And CJ s, are we saying CJ s the seller or CJ s the buyer?
0
SPEAKER_00
CJ s the seller.
0
SPEAKER_00
CJ s the seller.
0
SPEAKER_00
CJ s product is that.
0
SPEAKER_00
If you spend $50,000, you will generate back a lot more than that.
0
SPEAKER_00
So you re exactly right that there s an unlimited budget for something that pays you back.
0
SPEAKER_00
Even if your $50,000 pays you $60,000 back, that s still a $10,000 net.
0
SPEAKER_00
You have to decide if it s worth the time.
0
SPEAKER_00
But throw me that equation all day long.
0
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
0
SPEAKER_00
And it goes over the lifetime of the thing, too.
0
SPEAKER_01
So $50,000, and then it s going to make me $10,000 a month for 10 years.
0
SPEAKER_00
Don t think about this stuff in one-year increments.
0
SPEAKER_00
Correct.
1
SPEAKER_01
Because a lot of your solutions are lifetime solutions.
1
SPEAKER_01
The customer is going to get a windfall for life.
1
SPEAKER_01
You re going to get their fee up front.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
1
SPEAKER_00
Don t forget about that.
1
SPEAKER_00
No, absolutely.
1
SPEAKER_00
I like the language that you said in the build up to this.
1
SPEAKER_00
I don t know if CJ said this.
1
SPEAKER_00
I want to be respectful of the budget, and I want to make sure we re both thinking about it the same way.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s some language for you to think about.
1
SPEAKER_00
So I want to be, you got to acknowledge that you can t just say, well, screw your budget.
1
SPEAKER_00
Sorry, pal.
1
SPEAKER_00
You have to say, look, I want to, I want to stay clean on that.
1
SPEAKER_00
I know you got budgets and you re restrained by that.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I want to just talk through to make sure we re both thinking about it or see how we both think about it.
1
SPEAKER_00
Cause it might be a little bit different.
1
SPEAKER_00
Maybe I can help with that and we ll see where it lands.
1
SPEAKER_00
Something like that.
1
SPEAKER_00
Right?
1
SPEAKER_00
So you ve got some language there.
1
SPEAKER_00
I think is good.
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, that brings up another point.
1
SPEAKER_01
How are we doing on time?
1
SPEAKER_00
Is that one okay or no?
1
SPEAKER_00
Can I pass that?
1
SPEAKER_01
No, I think I ll accept that one.
1
SPEAKER_01
Is this three quarter inch tape or is it a half inch?
1
SPEAKER_00
Where s the cart machine?
1
SPEAKER_00
The cart machine s broken on channel two.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think you ve just hit on a big one, though, and that is if a customer were to come up to you and say, Brian, I m getting ready to buy your product.
1
SPEAKER_01
How should I be thinking about the investment in it?
1
SPEAKER_01
How would you respond to that?
1
SPEAKER_01
And the way most people would respond is with some kind of one or two line throwaway nugget.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think everybody listening to this needs to be thinking, well, if my prospect asked me to help them think through the philosophy of economics with them, how would I do it?
1
SPEAKER_01
And if you can t do it, you can t expect to change their thinking on it.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I like what you said about, let s talk through it together just to make sure we re looking at this in the same way.
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, how are you looking at it, CJ?
1
SPEAKER_00
And here s how we think about it.
1
SPEAKER_00
I bet you re not looking at it the right way.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I bet most salespeople listening to this show right now don t do that.
1
SPEAKER_00
I bet they don t.
1
SPEAKER_00
They don t have that.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s a great exercise to take away.
1
SPEAKER_01
So here s an assignment, and I m just winging this as I m coming up with it.
1
SPEAKER_00
I like it.
1
SPEAKER_01
Get a piece of paper out, and imagine someone asking you, someone who matters, a potential client,
1
SPEAKER_01
And let s say it s on the first call, and it feels like there s really something there.
1
SPEAKER_01
And they say to you, how should I think about the money, or the investment, or the price, or the fee, or whatever it is for your product?
1
SPEAKER_01
You come up with 7 to 10 bullet points on how you would educate them about what their philosophy should be on economics.
1
SPEAKER_00
Absolutely.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s beautiful.
1
SPEAKER_00
I just bought a couple of things for my business that I wish I would have done that on.
1
SPEAKER_00
Because I m kind of like blowing in the wind now.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I m like, is this worth it?
1
SPEAKER_00
Well, nobody did that for you.
1
SPEAKER_00
No one did it for me.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s what I mean.
1
SPEAKER_00
They didn t do it for me.
1
SPEAKER_00
Now I m thinking, do I want to keep doing this or not?
1
SPEAKER_00
Right now, the answer is no, because no one s done that for me.
1
SPEAKER_00
Somebody.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think there s a whole body of knowledge here around economics that we touch on.
1
SPEAKER_01
And I think we re getting somewhere here.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think this is a little bit deeper swipe at it.
1
SPEAKER_01
But I think that the whole economics thing, because as somebody
1
SPEAKER_01
One of the criteria that your buyer will use to determine, do I want to do business with this person or do I want to buy this thing at all, is financial.
1
SPEAKER_01
And they re going to be comparing the price of you to the cost without you.
1
SPEAKER_01
And if you can t help them think through that, as you said in the language that you use, if you can t help them think through that, they will think about it on their own.
1
SPEAKER_01
And here s what they ll go to on their own.
1
SPEAKER_01
They ll go to price.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m going to spend 50 grand.
1
SPEAKER_01
I don t have 50 grand in the budget.
1
SPEAKER_01
And now you re in a duel about budget and 50 grand.
1
SPEAKER_01
You need to be comparing the 50 grand to the 500 grand that he or she is going to benefit if they buy from you.
1
SPEAKER_01
If you can t do that, you can t get other people to do that.
1
SPEAKER_00
No, no doubt about it.
1
SPEAKER_00
There s no doubt about it.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s a great exercise.
1
SPEAKER_00
You re banging a pen.
1
SPEAKER_00
You re off the pencils, I see.
1
SPEAKER_00
I am off the pencils.
1
SPEAKER_00
Can I give one more?
1
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, go ahead.
1
SPEAKER_00
Last one is also then once you talk through this like Bill s talking about, we re saying, then you engineer a deal.
1
SPEAKER_00
Engineer a deal.
1
SPEAKER_00
Bill and I actually just
1
SPEAKER_00
signed or working on close to signing an agreement with a client here.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we got done in this economics phase.
1
SPEAKER_00
We collaborated with this prospective client of ours, who we re going to work on together, to engineer a deal.
1
SPEAKER_00
We got a place where we both landed that we felt pretty good about.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we engineered it together.
1
SPEAKER_00
You have to do that at the end.
1
SPEAKER_00
Don t think of this as binary, like, well, it s $50,000 or it s not.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m not saying go out and discount.
1
SPEAKER_00
I m saying be an engineer.
1
SPEAKER_00
Think of ways where it can work differently.
1
SPEAKER_00
That s what that is.
1
SPEAKER_00
Be creative.
1
SPEAKER_00
Be creative, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_01
Okay, so if you have not sent in a question, a voice memo question, please do so.
1
SPEAKER_01
Send it in to listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think we ve got one that we haven t played yet, so we ll have to do that next time.
1
SPEAKER_01
A couple of weeks ago, we asked you for any kind of entries into our personal business makeover contest, and we ve got four that we have decided upon.
1
SPEAKER_01
And here s what we re going to do.
1
SPEAKER_01
The month of August is makeover month.
1
SPEAKER_01
And we re going to be running these interviews and these coaching calls with the four people that we ve selected here in the next couple weeks in July.
1
SPEAKER_01
And then starting in August, we ll be releasing each one of these episodes.
1
SPEAKER_01
And each episode will have a different person on it.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we have someone who used our friends at Co-Video to send us a Co-Video.
1
SPEAKER_00
Voice, if you want to get on the show, use our friends at Covideo.com, right, to get the video to us.
1
SPEAKER_00
It s really, really good.
1
SPEAKER_01
It was first, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
Covideo.com.
1
SPEAKER_01
She made it just because she did it.
1
SPEAKER_01
It was great.
1
SPEAKER_00
She didn t have to say anything intelligent.
1
SPEAKER_00
No, she didn t, no.
1
SPEAKER_00
And she did, but she was.
1
SPEAKER_00
She did, yeah.
1
SPEAKER_00
It was really, really good.
1
SPEAKER_01
OK, so make sure you go to Listener and Advanced Selling Podcast and send us your question, and we will answer it on upcoming episodes.
1
SPEAKER_01
And if you have any training meeting or retreat
1
SPEAKER_01
or sales, I know we re getting into that August, September, October timeframe with a lot of retreats and you want to invite Brian and or I out to spend with your sales team, make sure you send us a note at Listener and Advanced Selling Podcast.
1
SPEAKER_01
We ll get the ball rolling.
1
SPEAKER_01
We d love to come visit you.
1
SPEAKER_01
See you next time.
1
SPEAKER_01
Bye.
1
SPEAKER_01
Bye.