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In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, I share a story involving CPAP machines and the Chunnel Train from London to Paris, Bill uses a plethora of 60s anecdotes, and we pose the question, do you have inflated self-importance?
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Welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast.
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I m one of your hosts, Bill Kasky.
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I m the other host, Brian Neal.
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We are so grateful and glad that you joined us today.
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And we really appreciate all of your comments, all of your reviews on iTunes.
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And of course, we know that we would not have grown as quickly as we have over the last few years without your recommendations to friends.
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We have a fantastic tribe, as we like to call it, in that world.
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And we ve got a great LinkedIn group.
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It s super active.
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People talk about that.
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You email us all the time.
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You send us video and audio questions and things like that.
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You know the show.
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You re friends of the show.
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We re very, very thankful.
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And tell a friend.
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We should ask people to tell friends.
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We should.
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Yeah, we haven t done that in a while.
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Because most people will say,
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hey, my friend put me on to you, or my friend listens, and most people are really happy that they found it.
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So go share the good news of the event.
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It s only a podcast, if you would, please.
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Good.
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So I got the good fortune to go over to London for football.
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I can mention this to you.
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And I decided, because I was going to be there for a couple of extra days, that I would run over to Paris.
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and took the tunnel train to Paris, which was a great experience if you ve never done that before.
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And Paris is just a wonderful country.
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It s just so pretty and everything.
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Well, when I booked my tickets for the tunnel train, did I say country?
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You said country.
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See, that s why they don t like us.
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That s why they don t like us.
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Because we sort of just dismissed them.
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Yeah, this is a nice city you got here.
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This is a country, pal.
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Yeah.
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In the country of Paris.
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That s perfect.
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So I booked the seats.
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And you book the seats on the train.
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And actually, there s certain levels of configuration.
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You can sit across from your friend, next to your friend.
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And I didn t really understand how it works.
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So I booked two seats for me and my partner to sit.
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We sat next to each other.
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Well, I didn t realize that I booked two seats next to each other in a little four-seat pod.
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Okay, so these two strangers are sitting directly across from us.
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This is a very intimate setting We re literally like you and I are across the table from these two people There were from some other country.
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I m assuming.
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I don t know exactly when so the train didn t say No, well, they were talking in another language, and I don t know
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So, um, so we start going and we get out of the town and they come around with coffee service.
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It wasn t French and it wasn t English and I just, we just didn t bother.
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So we re just looking at the countryside and we get probably 30 minutes out, two and a half hour trip.
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And I m going to show you this video and I want to play this audio too so you can understand what s going on.
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So one of the gentlemen decides it s time to take a nap.
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Oh, really?
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So, he decides to fall asleep, and I have got some video of this young man in this peaceful, wonderful, scenic, two-hour trip from London to Paris that s sitting about four feet from me, and I will play this video for you now.
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The audio doesn t do it justice.
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This guy, there s an issue.
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I ll put this video up.
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This guy snored, this guy snored like that for an hour and a half.
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And I tried my mightiest to like, just let it go, ignore it.
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And once it s in your brain, you can t.
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And he was with the guy and the guy next to him was awake.
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And I m thinking,
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Can you not see, can you not, can you bump the guy?
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Does he have a CPAC machine with him?
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Like somebody, it was unbelievable.
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And this is just my iPhone video.
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And if anyone knows this man, tell him he s famous now.
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Oh my gosh.
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That s hilarious.
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So the trip to Paris wasn t that enjoyable.
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What about Mac?
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I switched seats.
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Oh, did you?
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I was in a four pod, so I get a little two pod.
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We re just the two of us, which was great.
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So just know that if you re going on the Channel train from London to Paris and you don t want to sit across from a stranger who snores, get one of those seats.
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How did you hold your phone when you were doing it?
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Was the other guy looking?
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The guy that he was with?
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At that point, I was so perturbed, I really didn t care.
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Yeah, it was somewhat subtle, but you know.
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Because you can pretend.
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No, I was kind of like, I m just like sitting on my, like I am right now, kind of pointing to you, so.
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Yeah.
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OK, so today we are talking about a topic that came up with a couple of different clients from both of us, Bill, and a phrase that a friend of mine gave me called inflated self-importance, inflated self-importance.
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And this is one of those topics that I really want you, we really want you to think about and self-reflect for part of this and recognize where this idea of inflated self-importance might be getting in your way.
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And then we ll give you some ideas on maybe how to manage that.
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The genesis of this topic came from a client of mine who s a young person just out of college, first sales job, and he has something that I like.
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He s got this kind of cockiness, swagger to him, super high confidence, which I love in a young salesperson because I can manage that back if I need to versus working with someone who doesn t have that.
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And it s blown up on him a couple of times, specifically recently with a really big potential deal, where his tone in an email that this is how he kind of is came through.
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And the customer came back and said, not so fast, my friend, to quote my friend Lee Corso from college game day.
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Not so fast, my friend, in so many words.
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So we were talking about this.
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And the good thing is, the guy, even though he s really confident with himself, he s also very coachable, which I love this about him, too.
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So this has got my wheels turning.
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It also shows itself sometimes with a couple of other clients in this confidence that I m going to get a deal.
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It s a done deal, right?
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It shows itself.
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It s 95% sure, guaranteed.
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Oh, I got a great long-term relationship with this guy.
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This guy loves us.
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It s just a matter of details at this point.
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It s just a formality of the statement of work or the PO.
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And it s 99% in the CRM and the funnel.
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It s marked as 99% closed.
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And then it goes away totally.
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We lose it, and we lose it to a competitor.
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Never to be heard from again.
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And that s what the other party does.
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It doesn t even come up.
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No.
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And I asked, hey, whatever happened to that one?
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Oh, we lost it.
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And I m like, we were so very confused.
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5%.
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The 5% took over.
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The 5%, yeah.
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And so I think we want to explore a little bit about some of the causes, like how does this show up for us?
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And it s interesting, because if you re listening to this, you have to self-reflect a little bit.
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We say, OK, in what ways do I do this?
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Because I think all of us do this in ways and at times.
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And so we re trying to say, OK, when does that happen?
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How does it happen?
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And then what can I do to make sure that I don t?
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Can I put some rules or parameters in place, rules to live by, that keep me out of the inflated self-importance realm, if you will?
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Well, I just drew a line here with two ends.
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That would be a segment?
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That s a segment.
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That s very, very good.
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My daughter s in geometry now, so that s a segment.
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I cut it in half right in the middle, and on the left side I put I.
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which is inflated self-importance.
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On the right side, you know what this D stands for?
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I m going to guess deflated.
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It stands for deflated self-importance.
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And the challenge to me is the balancing act between being too cocky and full of yourself and being inflated.
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And then the other side, which we also see,
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Yeah.
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Which is people are afraid to call the customer on what they say.
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They re afraid to exert their own truth and courage and all that stuff.
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So I think it s both.
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But maybe we talk about inflated today and then deflated on the next podcast.
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Yeah, that s good.
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Because I think this can be every bit as insidious as this.
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Yes.
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This is almost easier to manage because you can back people off.
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Whereas this, you re kind of urging and nudging them forward.
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Yeah, I think it would be a really good exercise for people on your line segment there.
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So you can visualize what Bill just did.
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Like you dive in the left, out on the right.
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There s a midpoint in the middle.
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On the left side is inflated.
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I m too high.
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On the right side, it s deflated.
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I m too low.
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And kind of graphically and mentally think of where you are with deals and relationships.
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I m probably too confident on this one.
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And sometimes inflated self-importance doesn t mean necessarily that I m cocky.
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It could mean that I think this is a done deal.
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Right.
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It could mean that this one is a great relationship.
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This is pretty much a done deal.
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It may not be about you.
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It may be about the deal.
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And still, you re exposed.
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being up there, I think.
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Yeah, it s almost not self-importance, although what you re describing in the lead up was, it s more just, it s the expectation.
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We ve got a common client that we work with.
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And sometimes these people, because they have a good relationship and have had with these prospects, they feel like the relationship is everything.
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And so all they got to do is show up, and I got a good relationship.
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And I don t know if that s self-importance or just getting sloppy.
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Yeah, well, let s talk about that.
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That s a good, so what are some of the things that trigger this?
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That would be one of them.
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One of the triggers, if you re looking for this, is do you take relationships for granted?
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That s an indicator that you might be on the eye side of Bill s graph here.
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Do you take relationships for granted?
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You just assume, because you ve been doing business with someone for 10 years, three years, 20 years, whatever.
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and you know them, and you hang out with them, you know their kids.
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We hear this, don t we?
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Oh, I know his kids.
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I m like, I don t care if you know his kids.
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That doesn t mean you re going to get the deal.
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That would be an indicator that you re on that high side, I think.
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That s good.
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I think.
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I think the lack of self-awareness too.
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And I don t know, that s kind of hard because if you don t, if you lack the self-awareness, it s hard to get the self-awareness necessary to not lack the self-awareness.
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So yeah, it s an unforgiving loop.
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But I think
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If you just take a step back, and I like what Brian said, you just take a deal that you re working on right now.
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Doesn t matter what it is, but something that feels like it s moving forward.
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And just take stock of that.
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Look at it and say, have I cut corners anywhere?
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Have I made any assumptions anywhere?
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Have I lacked self-awareness anywhere?
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Have I interrupted?
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Every time the prospect calls, do I interrupt them and prove how smart I am?
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I mean, it could be a lot of different things that really
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kind of channel back into this self-importance factor.
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That s really, really good.
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If you are, I would say another, this is a tactical indicator that you re on the I side of this graph, is if you are renewing business at the same thing we did last year, that to me is an indicator that you re up here.
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So a lot of our clients, they ll have existing relationships.
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And they ll go on for a long time.
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And they ll do a marketing program or a buying program.
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And they ll buy a certain tonnage or whatever.
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And they ll go to renew the contract.
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And they do the same thing they did last year.
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That s usually a sign to me that it s a comfort sort of deal, that I m like, OK, I m safe.
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I m good.
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I got a good relationship.
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I don t want to.
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Because it takes a little effort.
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And it feels risky to push the client to say, you need to do more than you did last year, and that sort of stuff.
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Because that was my topic for show two.
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It s this exact thing.
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And I think that s exactly right.
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Well, looky there.
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We can get locked into a comfort zone and say, you know what?
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Path of least resistance.
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They did a half million last year.
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I can expect five and a quarter this year.
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I don t really want to rock the boat.
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I don t want to upset the apple cart, whatever those beautiful little lamb.
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Phrases.
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Analogies are from the 60s.
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But so instead of going in and saying, well, let s re-look at the problems you have this year, what you re trying to accomplish, almost starting from ground zero again, we take the path of least resistance.
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Yes.
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That s really good.
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Stay tuned for show two.
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Yeah.
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But I like this.
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Do you have any others?
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Yeah, I think there is a need to look good internally to my manager and to my team in this situation.
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This is a symptom I see that happens all the time.
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So when we go to do
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Every sales manager does some sort of funnel review, update status, business review, quarterly business review.
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They do all sorts of things like that.
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And when you re on the call, the conference call, or you re at the meeting, you never want to be the person who s negative.
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You never want to be the person that says, that one s a toss-up, or the odds of that are low.
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You don t want to be that person.
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You always want to be the, yeah, that s a done deal.
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Met with him.
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It s like I m reporting this resume so that you go on to the next guy.
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Just slightly more optimistic, maybe, than it really is.
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But I don t want to be the guy who brings a group down.
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And really, that s the time.
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And you leaders should listen to this.
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Simon Sinek wrote a book on leadership where he talks about safe environments.
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And he says, if you expect to get the truth from your people, you ve got to make it safe for them to tell you the truth.
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And those kinds of situations don t, because it s kind of full of ego and testosterone.
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Well, you re a 75 on yours.
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I m an 82 on mine.
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I m an 85.
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Oh, OK.
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And really, none of these are going to close.
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Exactly.
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But we don t want to be the first guy to say, you know what?
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I m not feeling good about this.
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No.
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No.
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No one does that in sales meetings.
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And listening to this, I want to start to encourage you to do that.
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I want you to be the realist guy or gal in the sales meeting who s got the most accurate funnel.
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Because the other thing that happens, if your manager knows, hey, this deal that we got a great relationship with, this thing s on thin ice now because of this, that, and the other.
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I need your help.
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Now your manager can come and help you.
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And a good manager will.
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They won t execute you for telling the truth about the deal.
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Well, if they do, you find somewhere else to work, because that s not a good place.
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I wonder what the over-under would be.
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So we ve got 10 salespeople in the room.
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And I start with you.
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And I say, Brian, tell me about your funnel.
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And tell me about this Smith deal.
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And you say, you know, oh.
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Oh, man.
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I m not.
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I was feeling good about it.
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I m not.
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You know what?
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I think it s a 30% chance.
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It s going backwards.
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And going backwards.
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And the manager says, what are you talking about?
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It was 80 two weeks ago.
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Yeah, but we had some issues, and 30%.
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I wonder how that influences the other nine people.
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Oh, interesting.
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I wonder if that brings that their rating down on theirs, because you had the courage to go first and tell the truth.
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Or if you d have said 90, I mean, I wonder what the over-under is.
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Is it plus or minus 20?
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Yes.
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That s confusing.
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Or does the rest of the crowd pile on it?
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Yeah, that s right.
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Like, well, that guy s dying.
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So let me tell you how great my funnel is.
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And they do what we re trained to teach them not to do.
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Yes.
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That s true.
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Because this is the most frustrating thing for sales VPs.
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The most frustrating thing is the junk in the funnel that s not real.
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And all of them want to change that.
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And this is part of it, because we re afraid that inflated self-importance.
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Like, I better look good here.
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I got to do good.
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That s about me.
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That s not about anything else.
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And so I m going to say, yeah, 95 percenters got this, got that, met with them, waiting on the PEO, next.
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They want to do that right past the mic.
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SPEAKER_00
There s so much behind that, too.
1
SPEAKER_00
So much behind that, too.
1
SPEAKER_00
Because then you wake up in the middle of the night saying, oh, man, I told her 90.
1
SPEAKER_00
I got to prepare.
1
SPEAKER_00
I got to figure it out.
1
SPEAKER_00
I got to get her up early.
1
SPEAKER_00
And I got to prep.
1
SPEAKER_00
harder, and then when you press harder, the customer resists more.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yes.
1
SPEAKER_01
And then it happens what you said earlier.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think maybe even the show we were prepping is that we talk about this deal for three months, and it s 95%, and then it s never spoken about again.
1
SPEAKER_01
Exactly.
1
SPEAKER_01
And you re like, where did that one go?
1
SPEAKER_01
And we lost.
1
SPEAKER_01
Why d we lost?
1
SPEAKER_01
It wasn t our fault.
1
SPEAKER_01
It wasn t our fault.
1
SPEAKER_01
It just wasn t time.
1
SPEAKER_00
No.
1
SPEAKER_01
It just wasn t the right time.
1
SPEAKER_01
No, it wasn t our fault.
1
SPEAKER_01
The CEO s got a relationship with the competitor.
1
SPEAKER_01
I m like, OK, well, maybe we should have known that three months ago, you think?
1
SPEAKER_00
Maybe we did know it.
1
SPEAKER_01
And then we can t learn from it then either.
1
SPEAKER_01
We should always review those lost deals and say, what could we learn?
1
SPEAKER_01
What could we have done different for the whole team to look at?
1
SPEAKER_01
It s like we talk about in football work, watching the film.
1
SPEAKER_01
You ve got to watch the film, right?
1
SPEAKER_01
You ve got to look backwards in the film.
1
SPEAKER_00
But unfortunately, we don t have film here.
1
SPEAKER_00
All we have is our interpretation of where the deal is if you re in sales.
1
SPEAKER_00
But I think we need to get away.
1
SPEAKER_00
Get back to the truth, man.
1
SPEAKER_00
Get back to the truth.
1
SPEAKER_00
It ll serve you well.
1
SPEAKER_00
You don t have to worry about what you said.
1
SPEAKER_00
And you don t need any more pressure.
1
SPEAKER_00
I mean, we all have enough pressure on us to add pressure just because we said 90 when really it s 60.
1
SPEAKER_00
It doesn t make any sense.
1
SPEAKER_00
OK.
1
SPEAKER_00
If you d like to bring Brian or I and I or I in sometime during the next few months or early next year, you can actually email us at listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com and get the ball rolling there.
1
SPEAKER_00
We ll probably set up a little phone call with you or one of your people, one of your teammates, and we ll talk about what you wanted to accomplish.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we ve got some dates open for the end of this year, but next year looks pretty good first quarter.
1
SPEAKER_00
So I know retreats typically happen either the end of the year or the first of the next year.
1
SPEAKER_00
And we d love to have you on our LinkedIn tribe as well.
1
SPEAKER_00
You can go to advancedsellingpodcast.com slash LinkedIn, join the group, and we d love to have your comments there, too.
1
SPEAKER_00
Yes, we would.
1
SPEAKER_00
See you next time.
1
SPEAKER_00
Bye.