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In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, Bill shares his disdain for an exercise version of close talking, I flash back to childhood with a Little Red Riding Hood reference, and we talk to you about deflated self-importance.
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Welcome, everybody, to the Advanced Selling Podcast, the longest running sales training podcast in the history of sales training podcasts.
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My name is Brian Neal.
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I m Bill Kasky.
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And we are here every week for your listening enjoyment and for your sales growth.
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We are glad that you are with us.
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We are back on the road again in 2018.
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Bill and I are available now, for now, to come and visit you.
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We ve been on the road a ton this year.
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in 2017 and would love to come see you.
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So if you d like us to come to your sales meeting, regional meeting, national sales meeting, sales breakout session, any of those things, we can come separately and or together.
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Together is really fun.
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I m just telling you right now, it s fun to have Bill and I together.
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We get two different slants, two different angles.
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It s a really, really enjoyable thing.
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And we pass out cash in our deals.
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We do?
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You pass out cash in your deals?
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We do now that I said that.
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Send us an email, listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com.
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Just put in the subject line, come see us.
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We ll get the ball rolling.
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We ll start with a conversation and see if we can work a deal to come out and visit you.
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That would be really, really fun.
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I ve got a question for you about judgment.
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And this is not you.
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I m not going to cite your judgment.
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OK.
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I was at the workout center that I go to yesterday.
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And the room is a very large room.
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It s where the weights and the mats are.
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And I d say it s 60 feet long by 30 feet deep.
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So it s a couple thousand square feet.
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Really big.
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Good size.
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And there s TVs and all that stuff.
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And so I put my mat down.
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I was doing some kettlebell work and do some swings and push-ups and sit-ups and stuff like that.
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And all of a sudden, out of nowhere, a guy gets a mat.
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And he puts his mat right at the foot of my mat, touching it.
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No.
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Touching it.
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No.
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And then his wife, about two minutes later, comes over and puts her mat kind of staggering.
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So his mat s here.
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My mat s here.
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Her mat is there, three inches from my mat.
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And we ve got this 2,000-square-foot space.
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Oh, people are funny.
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And I m like, and I wanted to pull it away.
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And then I thought, no, I really don t.
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What I want to do is go down and stick my what in his face and do some push-ups at the other end.
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I m not sure I know what, but what I have in my imagination is OK.
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Well, I mean, come on.
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But it s that whole idea of judgment.
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We talked a little bit about that last podcast.
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But where is the judgment here?
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I mean, 2004, and there was nothing that he needed to have in that space.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Yeah, there s a whole.
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I should have taken it.
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I didn t have my camera.
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I would ve taken a picture, we d put it online.
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We have to.
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Because some of these things you can t believe people are this way.
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Well, the same thing with your picture last week on the channel.
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Yes, the guy s normally like, and it was with his buddy, didn t wake him up.
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It s just unbelievable.
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People are seriously unbelievable.
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It makes you at some point want to ask,
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Can I just ask you, like you re talking to this guy, can I just ask you kind of a silly question?
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Is there a reason you put your mat so close to mine?
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I m cool with it.
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But there s like 4,000 square feet here and some more.
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And I don t know if you re lonely, want someone to talk to.
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You want me to rub your back?
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I mean, what do you want?
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Exactly.
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If you re drawn to me energetically or physically or something, I m not sure what s going on.
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But what s the reasoning, pal?
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That s just really funny.
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In a yoga class, I get it, because it s part of the deal, right?
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You are in tight quarters.
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But for kettlebell swings, what you should have done is waited until the bell was like, do push-ups and do kettlebell swings.
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No, and actually drop one.
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Exactly.
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Whoops.
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That s a good thing to do.
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OK, topic today?
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Yeah, topic today, we re going to talk about deflated self-importance.
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Last episode, we talked about inflated self-importance.
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This time, we re going to talk about deflated self-importance.
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If you ve not listened to the last episode, you need to go back and listen to the episode about inflated self-importance, so you ll understand a little context here, because Bill drew us a little diagram.
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We re going to work on the right side of the diagram today, as opposed to the left side.
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Yeah, you know, Brian, when you brought this up last week, I thought it was a great topic.
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And that idea of, do we ever get out ahead of ourselves?
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Do we get arrogant and cocky a little bit, and we get a little sloppy, and we think we re better than we are?
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And the closing percentage odds, we say they re 90%.
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Really, they aren t.
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But we don t want to.
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risk the feeling that goes along with us telling the truth, so we inflate that.
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And as we talked, we thought, well, there s also a problem at the other end of that, too.
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And the other end of that is we deflate ourselves sometimes.
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And both are bad, but deflation, to me, is more common.
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Yes.
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Would you agree with that?
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Yes.
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It s more prevalent.
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Yeah.
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It s that same word as common, I guess.
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I d say, yeah.
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It s a bigger word, three syllable.
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I also feel it also is easier to diagnose.
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So that s different than more prevalent.
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It s easier for me to see, because I think sometimes people can hide under the inflated self-importance.
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Oh, it s easy.
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Yeah.
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Right?
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We just kind of blow by those people.
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And we never step, because they always got a bunch going on.
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And like, oh, their stuff s all closing.
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That s what we want to hear.
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It s not, but they say it is.
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But the people that don t have stuff going on, we re like, we don t have anything going on.
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Or your deals are at 30% likely to close.
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Yeah, that s a big, big problem.
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So as we get into this topic, we want to make it clear that this is not a therapy session, nor I don t think this topic gets fixed with,
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Brian spouting off three ideas and me spouting off three.
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I think this is the opening Dialogue that you need to have with yourself and that we all need to have with ourselves not just you but Brian and I as well is that sometimes we can drop into this it can be very situational it can be when when we feel like we ve got an empty funnel and
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I think we act differently than when we have a full funnel of people.
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And we will often deflate ourselves when we are in more need of the business than we do when we re chock full of prospects and opportunities.
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Or when we think we re chock full of prospects.
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So when do you see this happening the most?
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When do you see us self-deflating or losing a little bit of our self-worth in the sales process?
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Yeah, this is a good, like you said, it wasn t a therapy session.
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I might run the risk of turning it into a therapy session now.
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Because this all starts with you as a human being first.
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And it s a really hard thing to look in and reflect.
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Some of us are very self-aware of these things where we feel like, OK, we re not good enough, we re not smart enough, and all those things.
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And therefore, because it starts with the person, I feel it can show up any place in the sales process all the way through.
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Where I see it mechanically showing up the most would be in the process section of the sales process.
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And that is who I actually talk to and what I m comfortable doing in the process.
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So I see this all the time, where I see a person talking to what they perceive to be the decision maker.
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And it goes to someone else or a higher level.
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And they don t have the guts to,
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interact with that higher level person.
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They don t have the guts to say, hey, we can t go on if I don t talk to that person.
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They don t have the guts to bring that person in.
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They justify it all with like, well, I don t want to upset them, or they re really influential, or these other things.
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So that would be a place I see it all the time.
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Decision making process.
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Absolutely.
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Yeah, I agree.
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And I like what you said there about it s, we re really good at justifying.
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Yes.
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We re just experts at justifying our behavior or lack of behavior.
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And again,
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Brian and I are not saying anything today that we don t struggle with so this is not we re sitting here on top of the mountain saying you guys are This is we all struggle.
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It s a human.
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It s the human nature.
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It s a human problem Yes is we ve got to keep our self-worth and our self-image in check But also we have to keep it inflated as well.
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I think a lot of this happens I see it when
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It s in the process where we we need to follow our process.
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They want to follow their process Yes, and whether it s decision-making or whether it s in
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and what the conversation centers around.
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For example, I ve got a client who one of the things that they have put into their process right up front is sometime in the first couple meetings, they need to talk about money.
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And they need to talk about not only the investment in their solution, but also what s this costing the customer not to have their solution.
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And if you re not talking about both ends of that spectrum, you re not really talking about the whole picture of money.
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And so there s a little reluctance, though, because a lot of times they ll say, well, you know, the person I m calling on really doesn t know that they don t know the numbers to which I usually respond.
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Well, let s find the people who know the numbers.
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Yes.
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Someone in that organization knows the numbers or it may sometimes the numbers are it s not like they pull out a sheet and has a number on it.
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You might have to work
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through it with them a little bit.
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Yes, yes, yes.
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There s no doubt that shows up there.
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A lot, yeah.
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And the whole idea of deflated self-importance is that we ll say, well, that s not really my business to tell them.
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I m like, it is your business.
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If you re trying to help them, it s all your business.
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Maybe they don t.
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Maybe there is someone that nobody knows their cost of pain, cost of issue, whatever you want to call it.
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And so you be the one to say, OK, I m going to pull you guys together, and I m going to teach you how to do this.
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Go.
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But we don t have the guts to do that.
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And we justify it.
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It s not really my business.
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They didn t ask me to do that, so I don t know how it starts.
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Yeah.
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Here s the answer, though, to all that stuff.
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And I just said there s no answer to it, and now I m going to give you the answer.
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In the pre-show prep, Bill s like, be careful.
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We don t get, you know.
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Drumroll, please.
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Well, the answer is you have to identify what your role is in the process.
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If your role in the process is merely to answer questions, to be nice, to do whatever they ask,
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to provide information, then you will act in that manner.
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So you will rarely act inconsistent with what you think your role is.
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I think your role is as a guide.
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And we ve talked about this on this podcast before.
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You re the guide that s going to help them get from where they are to where they want to be.
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And guides don t just do what the tribe wants them to do.
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The guide says, no, no, no.
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I m protecting you from your own decision making.
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ready to make a huge mistake here.
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If we don t go over the cost of this problem, I can t help you.
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Right.
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I don t know how to help you if we can t figure out what the problem is.
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So you have to change your role.
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If you have these self-deflation issues, check out your role and say, well, am I really clear on what my role in this process is?
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Yes.
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And I would coach you to, that s really, really good, by the way, because the role that you show up with in your mind is the one that you re going to behave like, right?
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If you re in a play and you re playing Little Red Riding Hood, you re gonna play Little Red Riding Hood.
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You re not gonna play the big bad wolf.
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How about that for a little throwback, huh?
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Good throwback to something, I don t know what.
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I don t either, I don t even know who wrote it, but I remember watching it on cartoons with Bugs Bunny s version of that.
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Harvey Weinstein.
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Oops.
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Not that one.
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Important to clean this up for you.
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So this is some advice and it s also a bit, it s an inner game thing.
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It s a thinking element is your intent clears you of all this fear.
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Your intent clears you of all the fear.
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If you re afraid to go around someone, over someone, if you re afraid to talk about money, if you re fearful if you ask a question, they ll get upset about it.
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If you re worried about any of that, as long as all of that behavior is coming from a place of pure intent, you re clean.
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It doesn t matter anymore.
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And you ve got to check that if your intent is to
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not lose, if your intent is to not upset, if your intent is to get a deal, all of the stuff we re talking about will blow up on you.
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All of it will.
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So that, to me, is the root of this thing that cleans it all up for you.
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Once I m clean, there are three primary principles that Bill and I teach.
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Abundance, detachment, and intent.
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There s massive amounts of abundance in the world.
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By the way, when you travel out of the country like I did, you see it.
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Oh my god.
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It s unbelievable how much abundance there is.
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In my detachment, I m going to move through the world and things are going to happen, yeses and noes are going to occur.
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In my intense pure, I try to help people.
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Once you buy into those three things, you re free to do anything you want, say anything you want.
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It s all clean.
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It s just real clean.
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Nobody can get to you.
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They might throw you out of their office, but they can t
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They can t attack you.
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They ll be sued.
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You can sue them.
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Nobody s going to get to you unless you let them get to you.
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And the way to cover up that opening is to see abundance, believe in detachment, and have high intent.
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And those three things act as an armor, almost, that you can be in any situation, any situation, and prosper from it.
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Even if the answer s no.
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Yeah.
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One of my gurus, and I know someone you enjoy too, Bill, is Wayne Dyer, who s passed away this year, last year-ish.
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And he tells this story of people commenting on his books.
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And it s a story, an older story from the 80s, where people used to write letters, like physical letters, and mail them to people.
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And he wrote this book.
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And he got a couple of letters after the book was released.
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On the same day, he tells this story in the speech I heard.
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And one of the letters said, this is the greatest book I ve ever read.
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It s changed my life.
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And this other book said, this is absolute baloney.
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This book is awful.
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I want my money back.
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And he quoted another author that he heard.
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The response, he always gave the same response to each letter.
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Do you know what it was?
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Thank you.
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You may be right.
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You may be right, which is great, right?
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And so all these things we re talking about are opinions.
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Your solution sucks.
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It s too expensive.
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You may be right.
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And that s clean, to your point.
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I love no one can get to you.
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Because when you do, you may be right, no one can get to you.
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Well, you re a jerk, Bill.
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You may be right.
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Bill, you re a super sweet guy.
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You may be right.
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That s all opinion stuff.
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But you re not agreeing with it or fighting.
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You re not letting it in.
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You re not fighting it, exactly.
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And that s what we do.
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We resist these things and fight them.
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Oh, this person doesn t think I m qualified to help them.
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So I have to show them that I m qualified.
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Well, it s their opinion.
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It s like, yeah, OK.
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So if you like some of the things that you heard today or want to weigh in, go to the LinkedIn group page.
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If you re not already a group member, make sure you join.
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And go to advancedsellingpodcast.com slash LinkedIn.
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We want to hear from you on this.
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This is a really interesting topic.
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And almost any sales problem that Brian and I see when we go into a company has something to do with the deflation.
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Yes, sometimes we re inflated.
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Our self-importance is inflated.
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But most of the time, it has something to do with somewhere in the process, we ve deflated ourselves.
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And so we think this is an important topic.
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So we ll be on LinkedIn.
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And if you want to take a stab at bringing us into your organization, either for a retreat or a sales meeting or some kind of a regional meeting, we are good to go on that this fall.
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And also next year, you can get the ball rolling by going to listener and advanced selling podcast dot com.
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We ll set up a quick meeting.
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We ll be off and running.
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See you next time.
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See you.
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Bye bye.