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This is The Art of Charm.
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Learn everything you need to know to crush it in business, love, and life.
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The Art of Charm is where ordinary guys become extraordinary men.
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Welcome guys and gals to The Art of Charm.
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I m Jordan Harbinger.
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The Art of Charm brings together the best thought leaders, teachers, and personalities to teach you how to be a top performer in life, love, and at work.
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We get really in-depth on some of these topics and you can further engage with the AOC team there as well.
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Or if you re new to the show and you want to find out more about what we teach here at the Art of Charm, you can go to the website and we ll email you our Fundamentals Toolkit that covers topics like body language and nonverbal communication,
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Looking forward to meeting you here at AOC.
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Today we re talking with Dr. Rick Hansen.
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This guy is awesome.
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We re gonna talk about brain science and how it relates to happiness.
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Your brain is actually Velcro for the bad and Teflon for the good.
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We re gonna talk about why that is, the evolutionary psychology behind it, and of course, how you can change it, how mindfulness is the key to those changes, to rewiring your brain, and how to register beneficial experiences for a dozen seconds or so to start rewiring your brain.
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So a habit that you can build
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that will start to rewire your brain really easy, almost effortlessly throughout your day.
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And from state to trait, in other words, encoding good experiences by focusing on them to rewire your brain.
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So there s a whole lot of really, really good stuff in here.
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The brain science is solid.
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Dr. Rick Hansen is a really great guy and a great guest to have.
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So enjoy this one with Dr. Rick Hansen.
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Yeah, so tell us what you do in one sentence.
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Yeah, I m a neuropsychologist, an author, and I m especially interested in how to turn everyday experiences into lasting inner resources woven into your own brain.
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I have a question about the term neuropsychologist, because if you re dealing with psychology,
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aren t you always dealing with neurons and brains?
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You would totally think so.
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But most psychologists think about the mind as if it sort of is lifted off from its animal basis, you know?
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And they know vaguely that there s gotta be some hardware underneath all that software, but they don t take it into account.
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Someone who s a neuropsychologist
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thinks about the mind in a way from the bottom up, and for example, thinks about the impact of the fact that each one of us has a certain lizard, mouse, and monkey inside our skull, right?
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The remnants of evolution, over 600 million years of building a brain.
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And a neuropsychologist also thinks about, as I think a lot about,
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damn, why is it so easy to learn from painful negative experiences and overlearn from them for the rest of your life and be trapped in that?
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And why does it take so long for someone, let s say, to start feeling naturally confident again?
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you know, or feel cared about or feel of worth.
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So that s my particular focus, you know, how to overcome the negativity bias, how to, you know, we can talk about it more, of course, and how to just take moment, everyday experiences, five, 10, 20 seconds at a time, to get those neurons firing together in the right way so they wire together in the right way as well.
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Okay, so it s almost like the biology of the brain as it intersects with the psychology part.
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Yeah, it s a little bit like you could drive a car if you re utterly clueless about how the machinery actually works, but when you know a little bit about, whoa, gas, I need some of that stuff, or, wow, that s how a brake pad works, so that funny sound I hear is telling me something.
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When you know a little bit more about how, or your computer works, or your toaster oven works,
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a lot more effectively.
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You don t have to be a brain scientist, but you can be skillful from the inside out.
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And I do find also that...
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When people realize that their experiences are actually changing the structure of their nervous system, they become much more motivated to not just marinate in the crud of negative self-criticism, worry, resentments about other people, stuff like that, because they re changing their brain for the worse.
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Stress is really bad for long-term health, let alone happiness and successful relationships, for example.
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Of course, yeah, I mean, everybody, and you re probably talking about stress at a deeper level, but even at sort of the shallowest level, at least I should say, I can identify with when I m stressed, I m not exactly, let s look on the bright side of this, I m more like, I can t believe that guy drove like that.
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And it s like, who cares?
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It was like 20 minutes ago.
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What s the real issue here?
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Oh, I m closing on a house, and I m going on a vacation, and my kid did something crappy, and my dog puked this morning, and I don t know why, so I m worried about him.
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It has nothing to do with any of that.
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And then, of course, over time, I ve actually got a blood pressure monitor, and I measure my blood pressure all the time, and what I feel like
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even if I see something in my inbox and it s like from our lawyer and I haven t read it yet, my blood pressure goes up like 10 BPM, right?
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And that s just not good for your organs or anything.
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So I can see how latent psychological stress would just be disastrous for your health.
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And that s not news to anybody, of course.
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When we re irritated or frazzled or exasperated or anxious or we feel hurt or we re disappointed, you go out with someone, let s say you go out with a woman and it just doesn t go very well and you walk away and you just feel kind of discounted, dismissed by her, you re not worthy, what have you, and you feel bad about it, all that releases the same stress hormones.
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and drives other processes in the physical body that evolve to enable our ancestors to run away from saber-toothed tigers.
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So when I talk about stress from a neuropsychological perspective, it s also an experience of feeling upset, irritated, and we have a brain that s designed through its negativity bias
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to learn super fast from disappointing, upsetting, embarrassing, humiliating, inadequacy-creating, loneliness-creating experiences.
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And unfortunately, we have a brain that is very slow.
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It s kind of dumb about learning from positive experiences, when someone liked us, or we were successful, or we said something clever and witty, and everybody laughed at it.
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That stuff tends to, whoop,
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washed right through the brain.
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I say we got a brain that s like Velcro for the bad, but Teflon for the good.
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And so I m really interested in how to turn that around, just a little knowledge about your own personal neural hardware.
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That s really interesting.
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I think that bears repeating.
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Your brain is like Velcro for the bad and Teflon for the good.
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So in other words, when
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somebody dings your car in the parking lot, you stew over it for three days, when somebody says, hey, Rick, your book is now in its, what is it, like a 25th language for Buddha s Brain?
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You wrote Buddha s Brain, it s in 25th, and you re like, cool, little dopamine rush, and you forgot about it by dinnertime, right?
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Let s say you, still in the back of your mind, is the impact of feeling, let s say, socially awkward in high school.
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That s still in your head 20, 30 years later, or 10 or 15.
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On the other hand, there you are at work and some attractive person smiles at you, well that s nice, whoop, in and out.
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Doesn t seem to have much lasting impact.
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And that made a lot of sense when our ancestors were, you know, fighting and surviving and struggling back in the Stone Age and then even before that.
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But today, it s kind of like a universal learning disability.
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You know, it s well intended, but it tends to make us suffer a lot more than we need to, which is not good for how we feel and also not good for long term health.
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And it also makes it hard to develop, you know, what I would call a confident brain.
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Interesting, yeah, a confident brain.
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What do you mean by that and why is that the case?
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Yeah, I mean a brain, first of all, that is resilient and knows that it s resilient from the inside out.
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So things happen and they re unpleasant, we feel them.
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I m not talking about positive thinking here.
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I don t believe in positive thinking.
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I believe in realistic thinking.
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You want to see the whole mosaic of reality.
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But you basically can bounce back and move forward from things that are hard.
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So building up resilience over time.
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And there are things to do to do that.
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Second, mindfulness.
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If you re not aware of what you re experiencing inside,
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and you re not really aware of the outer world, of course you re not gonna have confidence, because you re not tuned in to what s really, really going on.
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And then, third thing I would just say, is to repeatedly take in the good, I call it, repeatedly, technical language, deliberately internalize beneficial experiences, so that you gradually, over time,
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based on the saying of what s called experience-dependent neuroplasticity, fancy language alert, neurons that fire together, wire together.
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So by repeatedly extending your beneficial experiences, regular mild ones in everyday life that are useful to you,
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you gradually hardwire these critical inner strengths, mental resources into yourself so that increasingly you feel confident instead of insecure.
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You feel strong instead of anxious.
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You feel grateful instead of kind of despairing and depressed.
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And any single time you take in the good, any single time you use my methods to really help your good experiences land and sink in,
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It s not gonna be a transformative white light moment.
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I m a very realistic, work ethic, blue collar, work ethic kind of guy.
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You gotta do the work, but it s enjoyable work half a dozen times a day to let your beneficial experiences really land, especially the ones that relate to what you re working on inside yourself.
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If you re working on, for example, building a confident brain, then when you have those moments with other people,
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especially high-value moments, high-impact moments.
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Let s say you re trying to date, and you have those moments with women where you feel liked, because they do like you, or they do find you appealing.
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It doesn t mean they necessarily want to marry you and run away to the Bahamas with you, but yeah, that s good.
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You re on at least the third rung of the ladder, and it feels good.
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Don t waste those moments.
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Let them sink in, protect them, stay with them, rather than do what most people routinely do, which is to quickly move on to the next thing, or say yes, but inside their own head, or not even notice them in the first place, when there s actually a factual-based opportunity to have a critically important experience for yourself.
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Perfect, so I totally understand where mindfulness comes into play, because if it s not, your default programming is ignore, do the Teflon for the good and the Velcro for the bad thing, but if you were a little more mindful, you go, wow, I just won $5 on my scratch-off thing, or whatever it is people are doing, or my book just got published in another language and that s great, or somebody just wrote me a piece of fan mail that I like.
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You can go, I should let that sort of define more of my morning than
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the fact I got a parking ticket three days ago and it was 40 bucks, right?
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Oh, exactly.
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And if you think about it, just think about a typical day.
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You get up, you move through your day, you start encountering other people.
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So in my larger framework, which is based on how your brain evolved through its, essentially, its lizard, mouse, and monkey stages, reptilian brainstem, mammalian subcortex, primate human cortex, lizard, mouse, and monkey,
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That has to do with how the brain goes about meeting our basic needs.
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We have three basic needs, safety, satisfaction, and connection.
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Almost everything you can think of falls into one of those three buckets.
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And in terms of connection, which is what basically we re talking about here, how to build up resources inside so you can actually be more successful in connecting with other people and connecting with the kind of people and in the kind of ways that you really, really want to do that.
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Okay, so in terms of that, let s say you go through your day looking for little jewels of connection, little opportunities that are real, where something real has happened that can build up a sense of feeling cared about by other people, feeling attractive, feeling respected, feeling resilient, feeling like you are a catch, right?
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How do you build up that sense?
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Well, look for opportunities to have that experience.
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And little ones, so you walk through your day, you make eye contact with some, let s say a woman walking down the street, it s a little moment, it s nice, there s a little connection there.
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You feel connected, you feel validated, you don t feel scorned.
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Don t waste it, stay with it, open to it, receive it.
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Maybe you have some friends, you re hanging with them, and they like you, they think you re a good guy.
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Don t waste that.
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Stay with it.
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Feel it.
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Let it sink in.
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Open to it in your body.
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The longer those neurons are firing together, the more they re going to be wiring together.
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Deep down in the basement of the brain, it s pretty mechanistic, which I find really, really helpful.
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You don t have to do some kind of, you know, or have some white light experience.
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Just stay with it a dozen seconds in a row.
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It s gonna naturally start encoding and getting wired into your body.
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And I ve had the experience many, many times with people and I ve run a, I created a training on this and we ran a study on it through UC Berkeley and we got very positive results.
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The people quite quickly start experiencing something different is happening.
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when they just take half a dozen or a dozen times a day, usually less than half a minute at a time, to really register beneficial experiences and to stay with them, you know, a dozen seconds or so, so they can really, really sink in.
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What makes it cool is that these experiences are real in your everyday life, you know?
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It s not like, oh, Angelina Jolie has gotta send me a text saying she wants my body.
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They don t have to be like that.
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You re with someone and they include you.
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They think you re cool.
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Or your best friend s wife, just really from her heart, she looks at you and you know she s telling the truth when she says, dude, you re fine as is.
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Or let s say you worry about something.
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Maybe you re going bald.
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And she looks at you and she says, buddy, nobody cares.
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Women don t care about that stuff.
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They just don t.
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Instead of having to brush off yourself, like, you know, Teflon, right?
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Don t waste that.
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And I gotta say, just to wrap here, I see all kinds of people, it s so interesting, they wanna get good at lots of stuff.
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Okay, they wanna get good at operating Excel or their, you know, Snapchat account or what have you, but they don t take on getting good at getting good.
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They don t take on how do you change your brain and therefore your life for the better over time.
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How do you learn how to learn, you know?
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Because that s what we all want to do.
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We re all developing, but we rarely spend a minute thinking about, wow, how does development actually occur?
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And that s the secret sauce, meta-learning, you know, learning how to learn.
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That s the X factor where suddenly every day is full of little real opportunities to turbocharge and steepen your learning curve, you know, as you go through life.
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Now back to Rick Hansen.
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This makes a lot of sense, and of course it s why bad habits are so easy, because people who, say, start smoking to get a little dopamine rush, they ll definitely
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take that many breaks per day and counting to build that habit, but we don t take the habit of going, oh, my boss just said he liked my report.
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I m gonna sit down in my office, not check my email, not send a text to a bunch of people, not jump on the next call, but sit down and just enjoy that for like 30 seconds.
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Yes, you totally got it.
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That s exactly right.
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And at a larger level, we could step back and say,
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There s something poignant about that, almost as a kind of look at our culture, especially in the Western world, especially in America.
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It s like we re driven to have various positive experiences.
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Okay, there s a place for that.
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But when we have them,
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We don t savor them.
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We don t take them in.
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We tend to not dwell upon them for 10, 20, 30 seconds in a row.
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We rush on to the next thing, kind of greedily or anxiously.
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It s sad.
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Here we are, the richest nation on Earth, et cetera, and I know a lot of people who are quite affluent, all their needs are met, and in their core, they re quite unhappy.
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I totally understand that.
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Just from a common sense perspective, taking out all your fancy degrees and everything and all these subjects, honestly, if you ask me about yesterday, I ll probably remember three problems that I had that I maybe had to solve or that are still unsolved.
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And the reason is because I thought about those things for a few minutes.
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There s probably other reasons, like the stress attached to it and blah, blah, blah, but if I sat down and thought about good things for a while, I m totally gonna test this.
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If I sat down and thought about good things for a couple of minutes, not even necessarily consecutively, I d probably remember those things too.
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So then if you ask me about my day tomorrow, I might say, well, I did this really great interview, I signed closing papers for my house, because I actually did, and I had a good Chipotle bowl, or whatever, and that would be something I would remember, maybe, to be fair, in addition to things that stressed me out during the day, but at least I wouldn t only remember that I stubbed my toe on the corner of the bed and I dropped my water filter on the ground and had to throw it away.
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Those are the things that I remember right now.
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I think, like you said, if we just sort of wire those neurons together, wrap them together a little bit tighter by spending that extra 30 seconds doing so, then we start to remember things.
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Why don t you correct me on the science here?
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Then I start to look back and say, last week was really good.
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Last month was really good.
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All these good things happened.
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Last year was really good.
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All these good things happened.
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Because I feel like when I ask my friends, what did you do this year?
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And I send people messages on their birthday, for example, they re like, I got married.
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Or they re like, it was fun.
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I went on vacation.
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But they literally can t remember anything else that was significant the whole year, which is, of course, impossible.
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Because if I ask you what you did yesterday, you could remember two or three things, good or bad, that happened during the day.
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And people have the same number of things for the whole year.
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Right, that s great.
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Well, two things, okay.
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The first is that most of the opportunities we have in going through a single day, like today, most of those opportunities in terms of growing and changing for the better, right, becoming more confident, building that confident brain, for example, most of those opportunities are going to be based on beneficial experiences you re already having.
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not ones that you deliberately create, like for example, reminiscing about the good things that happened yesterday, or deliberately thinking of things to be grateful for.
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There s a place for creating beneficial experiences, but usually where the opportunity lives is just noticing beneficial experiences you re already having.
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So that s the first thing I want to say.
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The second thing is to distinguish between conscious and unconscious processes.
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And what I mean by that, not going into the twilight zone here, is that there s a place for what are called recollections, or what s technically called explicit memory.
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So, for example, the example you used would be an instance of that, in which you are deliberately calling up recollections, let s say, of good things that happened yesterday or over the previous year.
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There s a place for that, but mostly where the action is.
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in what it feels like to be Rick or what it feels to be like Jordan or Sally or whoever.
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Most of where the action is in terms of what s called implicit memory or basically unconscious processes, the underlying collection of expectations we have
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assumptions we have about other people, the way we interpret things, our perspectives on things, and our underlying basis of mood, what it really feels like inside to be ourselves, and also our capabilities.
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You know, what can we muster that we ve learned or acquired to deal with life, including, you know, social things.
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and so forth.
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So while I think that it s important to register the conscious recollection of, oh, that was a nice moment with that hot dog vendor.
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Actually, what s more impactful over the long term is to really register in your body that sense, I m going to make up a little story here, of what it felt like when that hot dog vendor was a jerk.
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and tried to cheat you and people were watching.
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And instead of doing what you did in seventh grade or what you felt like doing in the moment, which is to kind of crumble and feel inadequate and unmanly deep down, instead of doing that, you stood up to that hot dog vendor and you spoke up and you insisted on getting the correct change and you walked away and it felt good inside yourself.
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right, registering that sense in your body of feeling strong, manly, warrior-like in a healthy way.
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You didn t go ballistic, you know, you didn t hit him on the head with a brick, okay, and so forth.
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But to really take in the feeling of it in the body, that s actually gonna have more impact on you, building up, let s say, a confident brain than the explicit conscious recollection of that time you stood up to the hot dog vendor.
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I wanted to clarify something really quick.
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Are you imagining different outcomes from a situation, or are you, maybe that was a little bit confusing.
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I understood that you re focusing on good outcomes, but was that you rewiring a bad outcome, that like maybe the hot dog vendor was a jerk and you just took it and you felt stupid, and so you reimagine it?
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Or is this something that you said you want to try to actively discard those and focus on the time when it actually went right in real life?
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I m talking about being in real time with your own experience.
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And looking for opportunities in real time in your experience to take in resources for yourself, to build muscles inside yourself.
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The neural net worth that you re talking about.
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Yeah, in your neural net worth, growing neural net worth, exactly.
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And to use my made up hot dog vendor story, what I mean is that
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First, I want to distinguish between the recollection of the memory, consciously, of the time you stood up to the hot dog vendor.
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That s worth a little bit.
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But I m really talking about the implicit memory in your body and in your emotions and kind of in your belly and bones is how it actually feels.
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You re opening to the experience and you re really taking it in of what it felt like in your body to be strong and confident and assertive and proud in how you dealt with the vendor.
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That s what I m really focusing on, in real time, making the most out of that, the experiences we re actually having in real time.
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Like I m having a good experience here, talking with you, looking at your face in your cool leather jacket, and I think it s leather, purple leather, it s cool.
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And you know, feeling like, yeah, this guy, this celebrity guy, you know, Jordan Harbinger,
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We re connecting, we re doing a good job here.
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You know, that s an opportunity for me and you, actually, as well, in real time to register that experience.
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Yeah, there s some value at the end of the day.
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There s quite a lot of value, actually, looking back on the day and pulling up two, three episodes.
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You really want to kind of rewind in the memory box.
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You want to rerun that loop again.
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And that s good, rerunning that loop is gonna get those neurons firing again, and therefore you can deepen and reinforce the emotional body learning from that experience.
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For sure, the thing to do is just in the flow of your day,
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Man, when you re having an opportunity to take in key resource experiences that you know are high value for you, you know they re really what you long for and you want to grow, like feeling more assertive, more attractive, more confident, more like a catch, more worthwhile in your bones, or more skillful, just registering what it feels like to navigate a conversation with somebody in a more skillful way.
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man, every day has half a dozen at least opportunities like that.
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Don t waste them.
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Excellent.
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Yeah, I definitely can see why this is almost like a brain disease that everyone has, almost everyone anyway, has wrong with them, right?
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I mean, it seems very unusual to know people that always focus on the positive or let that sink in.
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It s a habit that they ve formed clearly and is not the default for most people.
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Can we use something
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similar, the same type of mindfulness to develop things like courage, motivation, calm, confidence?
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Yeah, and when I say positive, I use that word occasionally, but I m a little leery of it, because it s so easy to make it sound like, oh yeah, man, smell the flowers.
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Now, there s nothing wrong with smelling the flowers, right?
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Especially if you like their smell.
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But a lot, exactly what I m saying, when you have a moment of courage,
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If you think about it, how do you change for the better?
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How does that actually happen?
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Well, in terms of the brain, it s a two-stage process that goes from state to trait.
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In other words, you have to have an experience in the first place.
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We don t have brains or technology these days that s like iPods or like Neo and the Matrix where you plug a cable in and suddenly you know Kung Fu, right?
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No, we have to have an experience in the first place that s beneficial.
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But then, really important, we need to install that activated experience in the brain or it s only momentarily beneficial or pleasant.
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It has no zero, no lasting value if we don t encode it in some way as a lasting change in neural structure or function.
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So what I m talking about here is the fundamental technology deep in yourself of changing yourself for the better over time.
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And most of the experiences that we are going to wire into ourselves, we re gonna suck them in and make them part of ourselves, they re usually mildly pleasant, but they re richer than that.
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Like you say, they re a moment of courage, they re a moment of connection, they re a moment of accomplishment.
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They re a moment of getting through a tough workout and knowing that you can survive the pain of that last rep.
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It s a moment of registering that this kind of person, even though she s really attractive, is never gonna be the kind of person that s gonna really meet your needs deep down long term.
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Any kind of learning.
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It s really helping learning land.
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And I kind of think about it is like, what s the rate of return on your savings account or investment on any day, right?
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And the difference between
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5% and 4% or 10% and 9% is not very much on a given day, but gradually accumulating over time and compounding that little extra is going to make a big difference over time.
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I would say to people or ask people is, what s your average learning rate per day?
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from your ordinary beneficial experiences.
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How many of them actually sink in to make you a little bit happier, a little bit wiser, a little bit tougher, and a little bit more loving at the end of the day than you were at the start of the day?
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And that is, to me, the key.
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a profoundly powerful question for anyone, but especially for people who are wanting to grow and develop, and especially for people who, as many people do these days, you feel kind of pushed around by massive external forces, the economy, politics, whatever, and also kind of pushed around by the reactions still inside their own head.
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When you start doing what I m describing, you kind of go through your day like you got a vacuum cleaner, hoovering up.
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those ordinary little jewels, those ordinary little opportunities for learning and growth, it changes how you see your life entirely.
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Instead of feeling like a nail kind of pushed on by powerful forces, you start feeling like a hammer from the inside out, inside your own head, changing yourself for the better every day.
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And so are you measuring this somehow?
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Like, are you looking at?
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Neurologically?
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Yeah, but for example, when you say how many of these positive experiences are really sinking in, I don t know.
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I mean, do you tally them?
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Are you journaling this?
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Are you like, do you have some sort of mystical device we need to talk about?
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I mean, how do you know?
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Yeah, that s right, and I m selling for only $99.
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Right.
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No, I m joking, not happening at all.
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That s a great question.
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When people first start to shift in the way I m describing, what really helps is to have a little checklist, you know, and just say to yourself, okay, break up your day if you want, keep it simple, into thirds, morning, afternoon, evening.
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every morning, every afternoon, every evening, I m gonna take 10, 20, 30 seconds to really register a useful moment, okay?
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And maybe I especially do that for key experiences that grow psychological resources inside, like confidence, that I m especially interested in.
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or feeling cared about by attractive people of the opposite sex, let s say I m heterosexual, whatever that might be.
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And then you can make a little chart if you want, or just kind of know, all right, that was the one, you know, ba-bum.
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It helps to make it kind of deliberate in the beginning, but with...
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Very quickly, what s nice about this approach is that it s very motivating, because these experiences are usually rewarding.
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They feel good.
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They feel good because they are good.
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They are good for us, and their enjoyability is usually a marker that they re actually good for us as well.
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So that s really a good thing to do.
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In studies that I ve run and similar kinds of things, you can do before and after.
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You can have people say, okay, for the next 30 days, let s say, I m going to do this daily practice that takes less than five minutes a day, less time usually than brushing your teeth altogether.
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I m going to do that.
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And then at the end of the 30 days, let s say, people fill out a questionnaire and they go, oh, wow.
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I m actually measurably fill-in-the-blank, more grateful, more compassionate for other people.
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I feel stronger, I feel tougher, I feel more confident, I have more self-esteem, more self-worth.
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In other measures that are more hardwired,
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With humans, you ve got to be kind of careful because you can t do invasive assessment of the brain and our current technologies are pretty gross.
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But obviously, as you said earlier about psychologists versus neuropsychologists, evidence of mental change is evidence of neural change.
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Otherwise, we re kind of left with magic, right?
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And so, if people are actually experiencing, after 10 or 30 days of what I m talking about, that they feel different inside, they do feel more confident, they do feel, they bounce back faster from social rejection or disappointment.
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They have a background feeling of worth and happiness that they haven t had before.
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If you re getting that kind of mental change, there must also be an underlying neural change as well.
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All right, back to it.
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Excellent.
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That makes a lot of sense, right?
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Because we re talking about, essentially, there s a physiology that has to follow or come first.
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That the brain is just a really complex machine at that point, right?
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Like a semiconductor, people think, well, this is the brain of the computer, yes, but there s a lot of ones and zeros in there and little magnetic currents and things like that.
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Those have to change before your behavior will.
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Yeah, that s exactly right.
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And what s interesting is that in the early part of the 20th century, Freud, Jung, those early people, they were way ahead of the bench scientists in terms of thinking about and figuring out stuff that actually helped people and made a difference.
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These days, the hardcore neuroscientists are way ahead of the psychotherapists.
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and other self-help, let s say, broadly defined human potential type teachers, they are doing stuff now, sometimes in invasive animal studies, whatever the ethics of that may be, where they are demonstrating down at the cellular, molecular level, genetic level, sweeping changes in the underlying hardware based on the experiences.
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that these animals are having, including human animals as well, in various kinds of studies on human beings, they re seeing structural changes within minutes inside the human nervous system, based on the experiences that people are running through their nervous system.
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And especially based on people doing the kind of things I m talking about, which make common sense,
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You know, the longer you stay with the experience, the more you open it to it in your body, the more intense it is, the more you see how it s personally relevant, the more you deliberately kind of have a sense of absorbing it, receiving it, letting yourself actually give over to it and be changed a little bit for the better by it.
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Mo Betta, right?
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I grew up in LA.
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more episodes of learning in a day.
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Listening to you is an opportunity for people, not just this program, any program, to actually, when they have a beneficial experience, including sometimes just getting a new good idea, or realizing that something is actually really true, or forming conviction about something, that s an experience, to have a thought, to have a belief, that s an experience, but especially,
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When people are having experiences in their bodies that are emotional, motivational, you know, they have traction, wow, you know, they re real down in there.
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You re having those experiences.
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Don t waste them on your brain.
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And when people do that again and again and again, you know, they start feeling really different as they go through life.
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Right, okay, that s really interesting.
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I have a random question, actually.
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Is there any gender difference between this?
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Because I feel like maybe it s just my circle of female friends.
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but they re so good at being positive, and the guys in my circle are far less able, seemingly, or willing to do that.
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Is that anything that you ve studied at all, or is this just my weird anecdotal evidence?
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I think that s really interesting, Jordan, because as a rule, women report much more, on average, obviously we re generalizing, much more mental health issues, including garden variety, and yet still very consequential, anxiety and depression.
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So the fact that your circle, the women in it, are more oriented around positive, pleasurable, beneficial experiences.
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They re more optimistic maybe, more kind of seeing the glass half full rather than half empty.
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That is interesting.
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I do wonder a little bit about what s called social desirability.
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Women are supposed to be kind of upbeat and chirpy.
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Guys are more allowed to be kind of grim, stoic, warrior-like.
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I mean, I look at, I think it s interesting to look at ads in which men and women are portrayed and just take ordinary ads, you know, sunglasses, cars, life.
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The guy usually looks pretty, usually kind of grim and studly, and the woman looks friendly and sociable and kind of ornamental.
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And that s, you know, there s a lot of gender, you know, socialization around that.
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Yeah, I think part of it has to do with what I look for in female friends, because my guy friends are a mixed bag, of course, but I don t want people generally in my life who are going to be negative, because there s already enough stress around me.
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Not like, I m positive, man, and everybody else has to be too.
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It s just like, no, I get enough crap just dealing with running a business, et cetera, that I don t want to
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then bring more of that in.
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So there s an element of filtering there, and I don t think any reasonable person can argue that it was statistically significant portion of the population, so.
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I think you re totally right.
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You know, when I think about the opportunity for guys, one thing I do like, and because I m a guy as well, is what I m describing is that number one, it s private.
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this internal process of A, notice good facts, B, let yourself have a good experience as a result, and C, take in that good experience.
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Don t waste it on your brain.
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That process is internal.
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No one needs to know that that s what you re doing in that business meeting or walking down the street or while you re going out for a jog.
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The other thing about it is that it really makes you an agent.
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It s an active process I m describing.
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It s not passive.
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And so instead of being kind of out of fact, you re at cause when you do it.
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And the third thing that I think relates to, and again, men tend to like that, that quality of, it s called agency, or being agentic, where you re a hammer instead of a nail, including inside your head, right?
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And then third, one thing also I think guys like about this is that it s about getting competent.
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It s about being skillful.
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This is a skill set, right?
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Like Kegels, no one has to know and it s a skill.
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Yeah, do you want to be skillful with your own thoughts and feelings?
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Do you want to be skillful in how you regulate attention?
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Do you want to be, this goes to another aspect of it, autonomy.
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Do you want to be in charge of your own mental processes or do you just want to be whipped along by them?
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in the unfolding stream of consciousness.
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Me, I m really stubborn and determined and independent and autonomous.
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I grew up in a very kind of loving but hyper-controlling, invasive, judgmental family.
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No way, Jose.
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I want to be in charge of my own mental processes and learn how to do that skillfully over time.
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One thing we had talked about pre-show is linking positive and negative material and eventually replacing bad with good.
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How do we do that?
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Because I m with you on having a positive experience, looking for the good facts, turning that into an experience instead of just an occurrence that happens outside of us.
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Like you say, don t waste it on your brain.
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You know, bathe in it, absorb it, let it absorb into you, but this seems to be like the next step to all of that.
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I think that s great.
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And again, just to kind of underline what I ve said, when we talk about positive experiences, sure, some of them are like, oh man, how good it feels to sit down, you know, to, I don t know what, have a chocolate chip cookie or something like that.
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But I m also really talking about any opportunity for learning.
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If you ask yourself as a person, you know, what am I trying to learn these days?
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How am I trying to grow?
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How am I trying to develop?
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What, if it were more present in my mind these days, would, wow, really help?
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When you have experiences of that, whatever it is you re trying to grow, when you have experiences of that, or supporting factors, those are high value, you know?
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They should be surrounded with flashing lights for the next 10, 20 seconds to really stay with it and help it, you know, encode in your own brain.
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Okay, that said, let s say that you re trying to deal with some kind of negative material.
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Maybe lack of confidence, maybe feeling insecure, maybe still feeling sad, you know, about something that s happened as an adult or maybe left over, who knows, from childhood.
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The linking process, which I did not invent, but what I have done is try to think about it and write about it very pragmatically and analytically down to the bare bones that this is what you do.
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This is the takeaway, brother.
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What you do is you re aware of two things at once.
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For example, you re aware of something painful or negative or difficult.
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All right, but it s off to the side of awareness.
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And front and center, on the stage of awareness, under the spotlight, what you re mostly aware of is the antidote, usually kind of the opposite to that negative material.
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So, for example, let s say you re me, and you grew up as this kind of dorky kid who
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I was really young, skipped a grade, and I have a really late birthday, and so I felt awkward also athletically, right?
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But actually I realized as an adult that I m pretty good, and I ve also been interested in stuff that s hardcore like rock climbing.
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So let s say I m having an experience with my male climbing partners where we re doing something hard and I m successful at it.
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I m feeling that in my male mammal body.
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I m moving up that rock.
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and my buddies are like, whoa, that was hard, Rick.
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You did great on that, you know?
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I m feeling it.
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I could, if I wanted to, be aware of the experience of that in real time or recollecting it, either way.
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But let s say in real time, I m feeling that kind of sense of confidence, virility, if you will, you know, like I m not a little wimpy.
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loser, kid, person, you know, deep down inside.
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And I m feeling this good stuff.
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Off to the side, I m pulling up some of those old feelings of being picked last for baseball in fourth grade.
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Or, you know, feeling kind of ashamed or inadequate standing next to these studly guys in the showers in high school.
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You know, whatever.
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or like being nervous around, you know, kind of scary, macho, aggressive, warrior male types, let s say.
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I m feeling that negative material off to the side of awareness, while front and center, in technicolor, you know, live and strong and powerful, is this positive experience, that s the natural antidote to the negative.
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And, you know, in the moment, I m doing it 10, 20, five, 10, 20, 30 seconds in a row, it s not a big deal, but with repetition,
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Research shows that you gradually, you know, neurons that fire together wire together.
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You re naturally associating the positive, the beneficial, to the harmful, to the negative.
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And with repetition, that beneficial material through linking will gradually contextualize and soothe and ease and even eventually erase that old negative material.
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You will remember the fact
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that you are, in my case, a scrawny, bespectacled, dorky, brainy, you know, nerdy kid, but in fourth grade, let s say, you remember that fact.
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But the charge on it or the way it kind of haunts you or makes you feel uncomfortable in different situations or sort of wears or nags away unconsciously as well, that will be erased.
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And I find this process to finish of this linking, if you know what
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you re trying to heal, and you know what its natural antidote is, your personal vitamin C, that s the antidote to that scurvy, when you know that, then life becomes this fantastic opportunity to look for your medicine, to look for your vitamin C, and when you have the chance to experience it, authentically, often mildly, still, stay with that experience, and if you want, link it to that negative material.
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Excellent.
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Thank you so much for this.
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This has been excellent, and the heel steps are invaluable.
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I think if there s anything we missed, is there anything I haven t asked you that you want to convey?
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Otherwise, we ll wrap and we ll of course link to your book and all your resources in the show notes as well.
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The last thing I would just say is that if you think about it, our natural state as big primates is to feel fundamentally peaceful, contented, and loving in terms of our core needs for safety, satisfaction, and connection.
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That s our home base.
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And it s really good to know that that s our home base.
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We just need to come home again.
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The problem is we get driven away from home
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and we start developing more and more sense of inner homelessness, but lots and lots of experiences.
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fear and anger related to safety, frustration, disappointment, failure related to satisfaction, and lots of little experiences of hurt, inadequacy, loneliness, envy, resentment, and so forth, in terms of connection.
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And we ve got a brain that overlearns from those negative experiences, which gradually drags us into what I call the red zone, as sort of the new normal, as it were.
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And it s great for people to realize that Mother Nature, deep down,
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in our biology is calling us home continually.
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She wants us to repeatedly have, you know, in authentic ways, experiences broadly defined of peace, contentment, and love in terms of meeting our core needs for safety, satisfaction, and connection.
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And when people are having these experiences, ordinary sense of calm, relaxation, strength and safety, you know, safety needs, ordinary experiences of goal attainment, goal accomplishment,
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little things in terms of satisfaction, ordinary experiences of pleasure, gratitude, gladness, hey, take them in.
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And when you re having ordinary experiences of connection, feeling valued, feeling liked, respected, appreciated, even loved, in terms of connection needs, really, really take them in.
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So more and more, you start resting in an unconditional sense.
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of peace, contentment, love, grounded in your own home base so that even when the world is flashing red, you keep your cool, you stay strong, and you continue to feel really good about yourself.
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And I love that fact.
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I love that that s our natural resting state to which Mother Nature is calling us home.
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Thank you so much for this.
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This has been excellent.
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And where can people find more from you?
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It s a pleasure to talk with you.
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You re consummate pro and you deserve all the success really that you re having.
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I m a right speech kind of guy so I mean what I say.
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Rickhansen.net is the best place to find my stuff.
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Tons of freely offered resources, lots and lots of material there.
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Rickhansen.net and then people can take it from there.
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Of course, we ll link that in the show notes and thank you very much for the compliment.
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I m just gonna take that in for a second after the show so that I remember it tomorrow and for the rest of the night.
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And I really appreciate it, this is really solid.
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Super interesting stuff, really love this topic, really love the brain science, really love Rick Hansen as a guest, what a good guy.
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Velcro for the bad and Teflon for the good.
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That s not the brain you want.
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You want kind of the reverse and you can rewire it through mindfulness and through the heal techniques that we talked about here on the show.
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I love that.
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I love building those habits that make you happier.
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It almost involves no time.
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It s literally a few minutes a day.
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It s just the habit.
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you should set maybe an iPhone alarm or something like that.
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So I hope you guys enjoyed this one.
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The show is a fanarchy.
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It s run by you.
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We rely on you to help keep our finger on the pulse.
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So if you know someone who s a good fit for the show, let me know, jordanattheartoftrump.com.
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If you enjoyed this one, don t forget to thank Dr. Rick Hansen on Twitter.
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We ll have that linked in the show notes as well as other resources mentioned on the show, including his book, Buddha Brain, and other resources and other things he s written, because this guy s prolific.
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25 languages, you could read that book in 25 languages.
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Speaking of expanding your brain, I m also on Twitter.
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I post a lot of stuff there that doesn t make it to the show.
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I m at theartofcharm on Twitter.
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And bootcamp details for our live programs at theartofcharm.com slash bootcamp.
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Remember, we re sold out a few months in advance.
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So if you re thinking about it a little bit,
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get in touch ASAP, get some info from us so you can plan ahead.
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Of course, on the website, we have the blog, we have unreleased episodes from the iTunes feed, and of course, you should subscribe on iTunes and write us a nice review.
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I ll love you forever.
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Or you can find us in our Android or iPhone apps.
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Special thanks to the Jasons for their help in production of The Art of Charm.
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Now go ahead and tell your friends, because the greatest compliment you can give us is a referral to someone else, either in person or shared on the web.
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Now have a great week, and leave everything and everyone better than you found them.
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Thanks for listening to the art of charm.
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Get more confidence, relationship skills, life hacks, and everything for the extraordinary man at the art of charm podcast.com.