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In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, we wonder what it would be like if someone lives off the grid in the woods and their only connection to the outside world was the Advanced Selling Podcast.
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How weird that would be.
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And we give some advice on someone who is not a winner and a high performer right now, even though they have been in the past, but in the glorious words of my friend and music producer Beck, he s a loser, baby.
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What do you do when you re a loser, baby?
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Welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast, the longest running sales training podcast in podcast history.
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My name is Brian Neal.
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I m Bill Kasky.
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We are here every week.
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Glad that you joined us.
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New listeners, welcome.
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If you re a veteran listener, go tell all your friends.
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Listen to the Advanced Selling Podcast.
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You can even take one of these episodes.
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We asked this a few episodes ago.
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And tag one of your friends, or three of your friends, or five of your friends, and say, man, you need to listen to this podcast.
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It s really, really helpful.
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15 minutes a week, a little free hit of fun, and moderately entertaining.
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Why not, right?
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We track.
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On the spectrum, it s about a five.
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It really is.
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About a five in entertainment value.
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It s OK.
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You know, I did hear something the other day, about two weeks ago, where a guy who s an avid podcast listener, he says, sometimes I ll listen to a podcast.
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Now, he wasn t talking about ours.
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Of course not.
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No.
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But he says, sometimes I ll listen to it.
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It ll be so rich.
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It ll be just so rich with content and ideas that I ll get it transcribed, record it, get it transcribed.
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And then I ve got a permanent record, and I can put it in my ideas notes section of Evernote or whatever, however you keep your million dollar ideas.
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He said he started that.
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And he says, when you go through the transcription of a podcast that you really found valuable a second time,
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You literally read things that you didn t know were there.
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So if you ve listened to our podcast over a period of time, and sometimes we just really hit it out of the park for you, one good way to remember that is get it transcribed.
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It probably costs $10 to get it done.
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And then put that in your notes section somewhere, or Google Doc, or wherever you keep ideas that you feel inspire you, or maybe ideas that are things you can work on later.
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Put it in there.
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It s a great idea.
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You could, I bet if you looked at our 700 episodes, you d find one, maybe.
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I wonder how many pages it would be if you transcribed all 750 episodes.
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Someone needs to do that.
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It s about a page a minute.
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I would love that.
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That s what s so interesting to me.
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It s about a page a minute.
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It s like, there s people that like,
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that are experts in everything, and they know everything.
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So I was on The Price is Right.
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Some listeners know this.
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Many of you may not.
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I was on The Price is Right in, like, 1994, and it s on YouTube.
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There s some guy that put in the comments, like, the episode number, what was on, who won what, and the names of the people.
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I m like, who in the heck is sitting around doing this stuff?
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So someone.
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is going to transcribe all of our episodes and say, I do.
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I ve got all 750 right here in this really nice, neat pamphlet.
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And have you grown your business or your income, or do you just have that?
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No, that guy just lives in a van somewhere in the woods.
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He s off the grid, but you know, podcast is his only life line.
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Imagine if the only thing, the only content you consume was the advance selling podcast.
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Oh, they would know who Fact Checker Doug is, and that s about it.
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An element of insanity there somewhere.
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Oh, that s bad.
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So all right.
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Okay.
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We had a an email actually that just came in
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I don t know if the, this is like breaking news.
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It is breaking news.
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Can we get a little of those red score things that literally came in 10 minutes ago while we were recording?
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Well, this person that sent this email in to us, listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com, is a longtime listener involved in some of our programming over the years.
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We ve talked to him.
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He s a good dude, just a good friend of the show.
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And he has followed us for,
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Sorry, I was trying to give you the stop sign.
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Oh, keep that in there too.
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Yeah, I m sorry.
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Go ahead.
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I sneeze really hard.
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You sneeze.
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I sneeze really hard.
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You notice that you guys are all like running out.
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You re going to come in and a hazmat suits.
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Sorry.
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Continue bill.
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I think I was saying, and he s just been a good follower over the years.
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So when he sent this to us, it caused us to think a little bit, and we only would be talking about this if we thought it was kind of universal in scope.
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So if it was a one-off kind of issue where we say, well, you know, that might be Bobby s issue, but I don t know if that applies to anybody else listening, we don t think that.
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We think this could apply to other people.
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So he says, I want to thank you for the podcast, especially during the time of covid when many salespeople are alone and don t have a great support system.
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It s really helped me.
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I ve been struggling for some time now.
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falling into Brian s danger zone of salespeople, where I am now on a plan.
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They didn t call it that, but everybody knows what it is.
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And he s been told by his managers, look, you can get back to where you were, and you can be the superstar you used to be and all that stuff.
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And there s KPIs involved.
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And he says, look, am I ready to move on?
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He s asking himself this question.
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The culture of my company s changed.
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They will call it being more accountable, but it s more than that.
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Anyway, I need to make some decisions about my career direction.
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And so we wanted to read that there s other stuff there But it s probably not as pertinent to the conversation of yeah How do you know when it s you and how do you know when it s them?
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And how do you know when it s time to move you on from them?
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Time to move on, time to get going with Tom Petty.
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I m also inspired.
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It s not you, it s me.
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Right, it s not you, it s me.
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I m inspired by Beck, musician Beck, who wrote his first song, a little four track in his apartment called I m a Loser.
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It s called Loser.
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And it s like, you feel like that.
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And what do you do when you feel like a loser?
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Whether the scoreboard shows you re a loser, or it still looks good, and you just feel unfulfilled.
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You just don t feel like you re doing a good job.
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Because we talk so much about high performance, and being good, and great, and all this stuff.
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We never talk about, on this podcast, when we suck, or we feel like we suck.
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So I think that s a great topic.
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And don t you I mean you ve known a lot of people over the years as of I we listen to a lot of podcasts We listen to people who are great interviewed.
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Nobody I ve ever heard had a straight line to the top It s always a zigzag always it s always down and up and down and up and they look back and say man I ve been through the
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the crap, but look where I am now versus where I was, but it s never a straight climb up the mountain.
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And so I think sometimes, and this may be a little pie-in-the-sky, Pollyannish way to look at it, but I think sometimes the universe says, look, this may not be right for you anymore.
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Maybe your skills have outgrown the company.
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The company s not going to say that.
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The company s going to say, you re not performing well.
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But if you ve performed well and you re less than 80 years old, you probably can find those skills again and bring it to another company or another situation.
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And sometimes there s energy.
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All the time, there s energy in that.
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You will create so much more energy with change, but it s hard to pull the trigger, especially when you feel like, you know what?
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I m failing.
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Do I want to throw in the towel?
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That doubles up on my failure.
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That s just not the way to look at it.
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No, not at all.
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And so I think the first kind of surrender point here is that everybody goes through this.
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There is not a performer on the earth who doesn t go through this.
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And if you pay attention to high-performing people in the media, so like rock stars, movie stars, and they get the fuglies.
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That s what we call them in our house when you just look in the mirror and you feel f-ing ugly, the fuglies.
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And they don t like their body, or they don t like their voice, or the player doesn t like how they re playing, or whatever.
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You re a salesperson, and you re not performing.
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Everybody goes through this.
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So you have to first step back, because it can feel very lonely.
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Especially if your peers are performing high, it can feel very lonely.
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So that s the first part of is accepting.
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Bill and I, a long time ago, hired a friend slash consultant coach to come in named Chip McLean, right?
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And Chip came in, and he did this really cool exercise with our team called Peaks and Valleys.
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Remember that?
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Mountains and Valleys.
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Mountains and Valleys.
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Sorry.
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Mountains and Valleys.
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Yeah.
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I changed the word so I could steal it.
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No, I m kidding.
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I don t use that to teach with.
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But it s a really cool episode.
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And what you realize when you go around the room with the team, everybody s got them.
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Everybody s got them.
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So that, to me, is step one in this, is just recognize this is so normal.
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It is abnormal to do what Bill just talked about.
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Nobody goes straight up all mountains.
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Nobody does that.
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That s a great title for a book, Nobody Goes Straight Up.
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Nobody Goes Straight Up.
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Or Nobody Scales Straight Up, except for Han Solo.
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You got it.
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Yeah, I think that s That s the first thing to realize is you re not alone in it at a time when it feels lonely and it feels yeah Yeah, that s the best way I can describe it Especially now that none of us are have the some of the personal one-to-one contact and connection.
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It can feel even lonelier Yeah, so how would you?
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express, if you were coaching this person one-to-one, to what are a couple things that you feel like they could do to start to move out of that?
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Yes.
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So I m a huge fan, huge, huge fan.
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man, and a proponent, and a flag carrier of this idea of tour of duty with your work life.
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I am not a fan of the way that it typically goes, where someone thinks they re just going to work somewhere forever.
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That s sort of gone.
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But still, we go and we look for a job.
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We take a personal day and put a suit on on a Tuesday and go interview.
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And I just don t like that.
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I love the tour of duty idea.
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And it s two-way street tour of duty.
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The company thinks I m up for a tour of duty.
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And I think the company s right for me at the time.
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And then we both have a choice.
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So the coaching I would give to this person is try to figure out first, is this an end of a tour of duty?
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That s one thing.
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Or is this just this little season within the tour of duty?
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Because sometimes we mistake the two.
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We mistake and we say, oh, maybe this is an indicator that my tour of duty is over here, when really this is just a natural, our friend Dave Catalano says, reversion to the mean.
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Remember he used to talk about that?
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That s that up and down.
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So I ve been a high performer for four years, and I ve been above that.
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everybody else, and then I have a bad year.
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That s just math.
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That s just normal distribution of math saying it s going to revert back to average.
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And it s that versus it s time to move on.
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There s no right or wrong answer in either of those.
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But looking at your situation through the lens of that tour of duty versus season within the tour, and sometimes you just need a little two-week break.
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Sometimes you need a break from the tour too, so I like that.
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Do you know, ever heard of a guy named Bruce Lipton?
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T-guy?
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Bruce Lipton is not the T-guy, I don t think.
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But he s an epigenetic specialist, I guess.
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Not sure what that means, but OK.
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Well, it s the idea that a lot of people used to think that your genes were a given.
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Just however you were born, that was your DNA and genes.
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And he has found that that s not true at all.
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Your culture impacts your genes.
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And you can actually change your genes based on the culture you put it in.
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He uses the example of stem cells.
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He says, when I take stem cells, and he s been doing research on stem cells for 30 years, and I put them into a certain culture and context and liquid, they will grow muscle.
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If I take that same stem cell and put it into a different tincture, it will grow bone.
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And he says the lesson there is it s your culture.
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It s about the surroundings and about how you ve set up your life, how you set up your business.
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And sometimes the culture can stink.
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And it can start to deteriorate and nobody in the culture and i m talking about business culture now not liquid but Nobody in the organization is saying, you know what?
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Our culture sucks right people at the top.
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Don t they say we got a great culture We were listed on the top 40 businesses to work for in omaha last year.
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I mean And and yet the culture can stink.
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Yep
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And so what you ve got to make sure I think part of the tour of duty idea that Brian said all of us have to look at what s the culture that we ve created around ourselves or the company has and can we still operate within that culture or has that call is the culture wanting to spit us out?
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Yeah, because we re either Too advanced to you know, not following quick.
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It could be both it could be you re not coming along quick enough You got to get out of the culture
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Yes.
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And start to establish some awareness and consciousness of that, I think, would help.
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That s really great.
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And I think, too, which this is probably baked into the cake, but I also like to think of there s the culture of the company, there s the subculture of the sales team, that both of those matter also.
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Absolutely.
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Because there may be times when you say, culturally, the company s really great, the sales culture s not great, but you may want to go try your hand in social media marketing or something like that and stay within the company culture.
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That s a consideration there.
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I don t think sales leaders and executives spend nearly enough time taking a pulse of their culture.
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No.
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And I think it all gets back to, what are you doing for me today?
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What are the KPIs, scoreboard, results?
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You re just not making enough calls.
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And if the culture is right, and my daughter works for Salesforce.
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Yeah.
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If I had anything bad to say about Salesforce, I wouldn t bring it up, so you know I m gonna say something good, and that is the culture there.
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And some managers better than others, but generally, what s his name, Benioff, has created an organization that really depends on the culture of work.
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And I think a lot of tech companies are like that, but if you re listening to this and your culture sucks and you re a leader, you better get busy at it, because you re going to lose good people, like our friend here.
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Yes, and I ve also found that good cultures
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This gets handled by the people, not by the system, if that makes sense.
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So in a really good culture, if I see one of my peers is struggling, as a teammate, I m reaching out.
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Versus HR.
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Yeah, exactly.
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Versus going on the old performance plan.
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We re going to put you on a performance plan.
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But it s not a bad thing.
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No, no, no, no.
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Oh, it s not.
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No, this is about growth.
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Feels like a bad thing.
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This is all about your growth.
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Yeah.
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We re going to be holding you a little bit more accountable, monitoring your behavior a little bit more.
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This has nothing to do with documenting ourselves so we don t get sued after we fire you.
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It s got nothing to do with that at all.
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That s right.
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No, it s only about your personal growth.
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That s your imagination running away.
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Here we go.
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That drives me nuts.
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OK, the last thing I would say is if you are, and I m looking at myself here as I give this advice, but when I feel down or, did my voice crack there?
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When I feel down and just blue, I wouldn t call it depressed, you re just kind of like, oh God, you know, I lost this deal, or Jesus, this all life s about, you gotta move.
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Tony Robbins says, motion leads to emotion.
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And if you re not moving, and I mean moving your body, whether it s physical dance, running, lifting weights, swinging kettlebells, playing tennis, playing basketball, if you re not moving, then you get clogged up.
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And your emotion needs to move.
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And I feel like when I m moving a lot, which I am now and I have for the last two or three weeks, trying to work out, lift something heavy every day for an hour,
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I know that I just feel better.
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I don t let the little stuff bother me as much.
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And my dreams get bigger, but it s because I m moving.
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That s fantastic advice.
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My last bit of advice on this one, and it s really hard to do, is to separate our human soul from our identity and performance and metrics of what s going on in our work life.
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And we cannot let those two get too close to each other and start to blend and mix up.
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And so just because you re a salesperson, and because you ve been a good salesperson, and then you re a bad salesperson, and you re bad, and you ve been good, doesn t change who you are as a core human in your soul.
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So don t get wrapped up in this.
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People feel like failure.
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You ask anybody who has been fired, my wife who got fired,
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from her job and was, I mean, you talk about off a cliff, da-da-da-da-da.
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As always is the case, a year and a half later was the best thing that ever happened to her.
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And that s not spin at all.
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That s legit business, role, performance, income, all the KPIs, and her personal fulfillment.
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Never does a change like this, when it goes on and sustains, do you go, man, that was really bad.
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It just doesn t.
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to happen.
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And you ll correct it.
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And what are you going to do anyway?
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You can t undo something you already did.
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You can t have done.
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Wayne Dyer talks about this a lot in his work.
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If you quit, you can t have not quit after you ve done it.
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It s over.
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You ve got to move forward.
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Yeah.
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Also, I picked up on what you said there about identity.
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I think we should do a whole episode or a whole year
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on identity, because our friend here, or somebody who s listening to this, maybe you have been in the tech world for 10 years, and you identify yourself as a sales professional in the tech world, selling innovative products to awesome customers.
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SAS?
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Are you talking SAS?
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I am talking SAS, but I didn t want to say it, because I know how much you love to say it.
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I m going to get t-shirts.
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SAS.
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I did read an article the other night that I ll bring in next time we record, because it s
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Kind of agrees with us a little bit.
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OK, good.
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Which we always support.
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Evidence is always good.
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Where was I?
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You were saying that if you identify as the, yep.
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And so our identity becomes such a part of who we are, it s like it becomes the statue, the rock, the concrete.
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And when we go and we say, you know what?
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SPEAKER_01
I served a role as a sass performer, but I m deeper and bigger than that.
1
SPEAKER_01
I may go serve a role as a videographer for a big movie theater.
1
SPEAKER_01
I can learn that in a week.
1
SPEAKER_01
But our identity keeps us stuck.
1
SPEAKER_01
Yep, full on.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it does that in terms of income, too.
1
SPEAKER_01
If you identify yourself as a $200,000 a year person, and somebody says, you know what?
1
SPEAKER_01
I think you should quit and start your own business.
1
SPEAKER_01
And it might go hungry for a year.
1
SPEAKER_01
Like, oh, I don t identify with that.
1
SPEAKER_01
I mean, that s not who I am.
1
SPEAKER_01
We ve heard this before.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s not who I am.
1
SPEAKER_01
Well, who I am, if you re defining yourself by what you have and what your position is, what your role is, what your title is, that s not who we are.
1
SPEAKER_01
No, not at all.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s not pure.
1
SPEAKER_01
Pure consciousness and awareness deep in our true self is who we are.
1
SPEAKER_01
Has nothing to do with how much money we make.
1
SPEAKER_01
No.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think the closer we connect with that, the more money we make, because that s what drives it.
1
SPEAKER_00
There s no doubt.
1
SPEAKER_01
That s really good.
2
SPEAKER_02
We could do a year on that.
2
SPEAKER_00
We could do a year.
2
SPEAKER_00
At least an episode.
2
SPEAKER_00
And maybe it ll be the one episode that you have recorded, transcribed, and put into memory.
2
SPEAKER_00
And then for those of you who are listening to a van in the woods, and this is your only channel into the world, life s still pretty good.
2
SPEAKER_00
Hope you re COVID-free.
2
SPEAKER_00
You got us.
2
SPEAKER_00
You got us.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, and if you haven t done so, join the LinkedIn group.
2
SPEAKER_00
I know a lot of you are in there, but we need more, because it s a really great group, because we re going to try to get that.
2
SPEAKER_00
Why are you laughing?
2
SPEAKER_02
We ve got to have somebody send us.
2
SPEAKER_02
In fact, Denise, if you re listening, send us a shot of a guy.
2
SPEAKER_02
Oh, Denise.
2
SPEAKER_02
Listening in a van in the woods.
2
SPEAKER_02
Off the grid.
2
SPEAKER_02
With his little antenna with Advanced Selling Podcast.
2
SPEAKER_00
And their only channel to the outside world is the Advanced Selling Podcast.
2
SPEAKER_00
That would be funny to us, maybe not to listeners.
2
SPEAKER_00
No, not to anybody else.
2
SPEAKER_00
That s it.
2
SPEAKER_00
All right.
2
SPEAKER_00
See you next time.
2
SPEAKER_00
Bye.