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Hey, podcast listeners, Bill Kasky here.
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Brian is already off celebrating Thanksgiving.
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Man, must be nice, huh?
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In lieu of releasing a brand new episode this week, and we will have new ones starting next week all the way through Christmas, we wanted to replay one that we found particularly interesting.
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So if you did not hear the one where we talked to Lily from New York,
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we thought it would be worth replaying.
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So here it is, and I hope you enjoy it, and I hope you have a great Thanksgiving weekend for those of you who celebrate that.
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Talk to you soon.
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In this episode of the Advanced Selling Podcast, we pay homage to one of our favorite salespeople, Dell Griffith.
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I make a case for pegging my jeans, and we dip into the co-video mailbag with a question from fashion guru, Lili, about the best way to find prospects.
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Welcome back to the Advanced Selling Podcast.
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I m your host, Bill Kasky.
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I can t hear a thing.
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Where s that music?
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That was loud.
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I m kidding.
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I m Brian Neal.
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No, no, we re good.
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We come at you every Monday for the Advanced Selling Podcast, and we love to hear from our listeners.
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So if you have a question, a comment, a critique,
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Make sure you send us a note at listener at advancedsellingpodcast.com.
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We ve got actually a co-video mailbag today from a young lady in New York who has a great question for us about her situation, but it applies to almost everybody.
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Also, if you are looking to bring people in for great content and good programming in terms of sales retreats or sales team meetings over the next few months, Brian and I are ready.
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You can get the ball rolling first by going to listener at Advanced Selling Podcast.
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You re sending us an email.
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and we ll get you to the right person.
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I was just in Chicago and Des Moines, Iowa the last two days, which was great.
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And with a few podcast listeners in both spots, which is just wonderful.
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And it s just really, really great to meet people and say, hey, man, I listened to the podcast.
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And then they bring up something from an episode or something that s really, really, really fun to do.
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So like Bill was saying, if you want us to come out, we always have a great time.
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had us come out, they ll tell you that it s just a really, really, really great experience for you and for us.
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And in my travels, as often happens, something goofy happened to me.
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I wonder if this has ever happened to you.
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I was trying to get a lift from the auditorium that I spoke at in Des Moines to the Des Moines airport.
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Des Moines is a wonderful town.
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It s not like Manhattan or LA.
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It s pretty concise, pretty small.
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Everything s about 20 minutes away.
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So I type into Uber.
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I m a power user in Uber.
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I use it everywhere.
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And I summons this guy to come to the Veterans Memorial Coliseum.
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That s the name of this place, I think, or something like that, something sort of generic.
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So I type it in.
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And I see him coming towards me.
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And he s kind of driving right around where I am.
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And I don t see a car anywhere.
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And I m looking at the.
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I can t figure out where he is.
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He keeps circling around.
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You watch the map, see where he is.
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I m tracking him, and I m like, he s right here.
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I m like, where is he?
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I m looking for this Toyota Prius.
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Can t find it anywhere.
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And I m looking at the streets, and the streets aren t matching up.
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I can see where I m sitting.
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I can see where he s driving, like right in front of me.
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But this is Fifth Avenue, and this is another street.
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And that cross street is another name.
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But it looks identical, just identical to this map where I m sitting.
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really confusing.
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So there for a while, then I finally, I zoom out on the map and he s in Portland, Oregon, driving around looking for me at the Memorial Coliseum in Portland, Oregon.
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And the funny part is it says he s got directions for him to take me from Portland to the Des Moines airport.
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Oh, the fares could be like 6,000 man.
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350 bucks.
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So I call the guy and God bless him.
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He barely speaks any English.
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And you know, he goes, uh, you waiting for Uber?
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I said, yeah, yeah.
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But here s the problem, man.
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Uber goofed up.
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No, I m in Des Moines, Iowa, and I think you re in Portland, Oregon.
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So there s just a goof on the thing.
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He goes, where are you?
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I m like,
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I m in Des Moines, Iowa.
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Where?
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I m like in front of the Coliseum.
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I don t see you.
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I said, I know, dude.
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I m in, I m in Des Moines.
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You re in Portland.
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And then he finally kind of figured it out.
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And he s like, Oh, okay.
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Okay.
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So I had to cancel the trip and I saw it to pay five bucks.
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Cause I canceled within two minutes of him arriving.
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Yeah.
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And I m sure it s a user error.
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I just typed in veterans Memorial Coliseum and didn t look at the, I didn t location it.
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And I thought it would find my location, but it didn t.
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But it was worth $5 to you not to have to wait three days to get there and take you on a 20-minute trip.
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Picture me and him, like, kind of playing the trains and automobiles, trekking through the mountains through Wyoming, you know, from Portland on the way to Des Moines.
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Where are you guys going?
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Yeah, yeah.
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It s the best ride.
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I love this Prius.
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Oh, that is funny.
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Del Griffith.
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You know who Del Griffith is?
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Oh yeah, Del Griffith.
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Del Griffith.
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Unfortunately, Del died.
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The shower curtain ring guy.
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Oh, what a brilliant character.
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We should find some clips from that.
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We should.
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It s one of my favorites.
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Because there is just clip after clip.
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There s so many funny parts to that.
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And he s a sales guy.
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Yeah, for those of you who don t know just google Dell DEL Griffith Dell Griffith and you ll see what we re talking about He s a character in a movie a sales character.
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Actually, he s John shower curtain rings sold this guy a set of rings This guy owes me a favor.
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I sold him a set of rings
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Oh, jeez.
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So if you do meet us at an event or you recognize us, I don t know how you would, but don t ask us to remember more than three episodes ago.
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Remember back in July, you did one on, because Brian and I, we erased that from our memory.
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And we love going, in fact, I love going back.
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We just did it for the podcast today and just look at some of the topics.
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But our memory is not too good when you ve got 700 out there.
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Yeah, and people listen.
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And we love this.
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People binge listen when they first find the podcast.
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They do.
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And so they re doing an episode from 2012, and it s 2017.
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And I think, what, did I really say that?
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Yeah.
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We want to welcome a brand new sponsor to the podcast, TradeStation.
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We got a great question today.
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Well, why don t you go ahead and introduce it as a co video?
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Yeah, sure.
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Yeah.
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So we re dipping into our co video mail get mailbag.
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You know, we talked about this, our partner, if you re looking for a way to stand out, which I know all of you are, and you re gonna, those of you who are on our email list, you already know, Bill, and I are going to start using this as a tool to communicate with you.
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CoVideo is a tool for salespeople to communicate directly with prospects and clients via a really user-friendly app that allows you to record personalized video and send it in the way of follow-up, proposal follow-up, questions, that sort of thing.
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It s just a great way to personalize, humanize you when so many companies these days are doing virtual selling, right?
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So you ve got inside sales teams, SDRs, all those sorts of things.
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Great way to do that.
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Just go to advancedsellingpodcast.com slash CoVideo.
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And we ve worked with our friends here, and they re from our hometown here in Indianapolis, to give you a trial run.
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They re the great people.
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So advancedsellingpodcast.com slash co-video.
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Go check it out.
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OK, so here s the question.
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And it s a rather long question, but we re going to let it all play, because there are some extenuating circumstances around her situation that we think we want to let you hear.
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And then we ll come back and offer some thoughts.
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And she s got a great voice.
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And she s got an awesome voice.
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So here we go.
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Hi Bill and Brian, my name is Lili and I ve been listening to your podcast for the past two years and I ve learned a ton.
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I started listening when I moved to New York City to work for an e-commerce startup as a virtual fashion stylist.
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And my challenges may have been slightly different than many of your listeners.
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No cold calls, door-to-door selling, and I didn t have one specific product or service that I was selling.
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I built relationships, mainly via email, with women from across the country, from homemakers to CEOs, and I helped them build their wardrobe.
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I created shoppable looks for them based on their needs, lifestyle, body, and budget, and I earned quarterly bonuses on those sales.
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I killed it.
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I was constantly ranked in the top three each month, measured by sales, conversion, and retention rate.
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I was able to implement many of the tactics and tools I learned from your podcast into my daily routine, so thank you.
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Unfortunately, that company folded back in March, and when setbacks happen, you have two choices, to let it defeat you, or learn and grow from it.
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Thankfully, I chose the latter, and I teamed up with two of my colleagues to embark on a new venture.
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We put our heads together, compared client lists, and discovered many of the women we styled struggled most with work wear.
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Not party clothes, wedding, or travel attire, but what to wear to work so that every day they made their best impression.
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So we founded an image consulting firm that we could scale at the corporate level.
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Our mission is rooted in the long standing premise that you have seven
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seconds to make that all-important first impression.
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With 55% of that impression being nonverbal, how you present yourself, especially in the professional world, is extremely important.
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We partner directly with companies and event coordinators to host interactive, informative, and fun seminars that give individuals the education and tools they need to feel confident in their wardrobe choices.
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We cater to both men and women, and the seminars work great in both a structured setting or as content for an internal happy hour or networking.
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Now, on to my question.
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In my prior role, my company provided leads, but now I m on my own.
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I m prospecting, networking, and doing everything I can to meet and speak to as many people as possible about our business.
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Much of my outreach is done through email, and getting a response is proving to be extremely challenging.
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I ve read and seen statistics that say 80% of sales are made after 8 to 12 follow-ups.
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How do you keep those follow-up emails compelling, interesting, and leaving your prospect intrigued?
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I find after the fourth outreach, I become boring, a broken record.
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I ve sent one-sheets, videos, testimonials, and company updates, although those updates are minimal as we re still very new.
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And I ve done this in an effort to provide prospects with a new piece of information each time I m reaching out.
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What are other ways I can engage these prospects and get them to respond to me?
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Assuming all I have is an email address.
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Thank you so much for your time and this great podcast.
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I m looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
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OK, great question, Lily.
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Really good question.
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There s so much here.
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This could be a three-part series.
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And I love the, like you said, when something happens, like your company closed, you have two choices.
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You can either cave, or you can start over.
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Or a third choice is you could pretend like it didn t and just keep going in.
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Like the guy with the stapler from Office Space?
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He just keeps going.
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Didn t we stop paying him like six months ago?
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It s funny.
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I m really proud of you, Lili, for going out on your own, especially in the same business you were just in adjacent, not exactly like the model was.
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A lot of people, I think, when bad stuff happens, like a company folds, they run from the industry.
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And you clearly, in your voice and your brand on LinkedIn,
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love what you do.
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At least that s what I m vibing on here.
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So you ve got to stay in this business and stick to this.
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This is a great thing to do.
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All right.
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So Brian and I have each written down, we listened to your question prior to the show starting.
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And we ve got three or four things, I assume Brian does, and I do too.
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And some of these might not apply.
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But again, we re trying to
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Broaden this out to for anyone who has the same kind of issue forget about the company closing But the idea is I m just not generating enough leads.
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I ve got good email a good email list, but I m just not harvesting it properly.
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So Brian, why don t you give your first and then?
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Okay, here we go.
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And by the way, I would say I ll speak for myself.
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I could use some fashion input
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You know, we re up on stage.
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I m telling you, I m telling you.
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You know what I did this morning?
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I pegged my jeans this morning.
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This is one of those fashion things that has recycled.
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So when I was in high school and college, you pegged your jeans, right?
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You folded them over and made them real skinny at the bottom.
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Oh, yeah.
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And I did that this morning when I got dressed.
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And I texted it to a female friend of mine who s my fashion.
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And she s like, whenever she goes, hmm, that pretty much means no.
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So I m glad we re doing this.
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Yeah, Lely, the first thing I m going to tell you to do is I want you to get out of the sales brain, because it feels like you re in sales mode.
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And I want you to get into service experience mode.
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And what I mean by that is give people experiences, because what you do
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is fun, and cool, and physical, and has an element of it.
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And you re trying to communicate that via email.
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And that s not working for me.
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And so I want you to change your mindset around it first.
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So don t get into sales mode.
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You re like a party planner in New York.
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And Lili went to Michigan State.
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So we love when, I don t know if she s from the Midwest, but Midwesterners in Manhattan, running fast, young, going, it s great.
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Think of yourself as an experienced producer, not as a salesperson.
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That s step number one.
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I ll get to some tactical things later.
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Change your mindset about it.
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That s good.
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That s good.
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I had one here.
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You said that you were doing, I think she said she was doing seminars.
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I think that s the business.
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I think that s how they pay.
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That s the business, yeah.
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And my question is, are you not getting enough leads from the seminars?
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So I m presuming you re not, or you wouldn t have submitted the question.
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I would take a good look at.
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How are you doing the seminars?
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Because if people have an experience of you, you re up on stage or out in front of people, and you re probably doing some kind of PowerPoint or you re giving some advice, that s the time where they re the most likely to raise their hand and say, I want what she has.
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And so you ve got to look at that.
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I ve had people before.
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In fact, I just had one of my clients
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who was doing these seminars and workshops for architects, and they were not getting any callbacks afterwards.
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And they d done like 50 of these things, and I really wasn t brought in until after they d done 40 or 50 of them.
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And I said, well, tell me what you do.
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Well, nowhere in that event was any kind of
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hey, here s how to get a hold of me.
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Here s how to call me.
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Here s a card if you want to talk about a project you have going.
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Once they started doing that, they started having people put in their name.
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And here s the project.
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And yes, I d like you to call me next Tuesday at 3.
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Now, not everybody in the room would do that.
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But even if they did this, and there were 10 architects in the room, and three of them had something, if you multiply and extrapolate that out over the last couple of years, they could have had hundreds of leads.
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So look at the journey that you re taking people on in the seminar and ask yourself the question, am I giving them a chance to engage with me afterwards?
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And it s not good enough to say, hey, here s my card.
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Give me a call.
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You ve got to do better than that today because people will throw the card away, and you ll never hear from them.
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So look at that journey and say, what can I be doing?
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And talk to your partner a little bit.
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One thing you could do is you could do a free 15-minute consult where they take a picture of all their wardrobe, and they send it to you.
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And you critique it and help them.
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And you don t have to sell them anything, like you said earlier.
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It s just start being someone different than the wardrobe seller.
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Yes, yes, yes, yes.
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And so I m going to go to the next thing on that, because that s exactly what Bill s saying is, yeah, you re not the wardrobe seller.
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That s going to be the theme we carry through this thing.
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That s not what you re doing.
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creating this experience for people.
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You re in the makeover business.
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So Bill and I just recorded a bunch of episodes, four episodes for August.
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We got some other stuff coming around brand makeover for salespeople.
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This is what you do for a living.
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And it would be a wonderful thing, I think, instead of prospecting people to have you come in and do seminars for their people, offer all the people you re prospecting a brand makeover, a personal makeover, like a wardrobe makeover.
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You take a group of, maybe you re calling on VPs of HR or you re calling on VPs of sales.
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And so instead of doing that, bring them together and or have them nominate someone on their team for a makeover.
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So, you know, you re bringing friends in and that sort of thing, and then do the reveal live at an event.
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And there s a show.
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I cannot remember the name.
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There s a little spunky gal, red dress-ish.
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And then the guy.
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And they d makeover people.
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And it was on forever.
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And I can t remember the name of it.
1
SPEAKER_02
I hate when I do that.
1
SPEAKER_02
Anyway, the guy s name is Colin.
1
SPEAKER_00
I do remember it.
1
SPEAKER_02
He s on The Chew now.
1
SPEAKER_02
There s a show called The Chew.
1
SPEAKER_02
Not The View.
1
SPEAKER_02
The Chew.
1
SPEAKER_02
He s on that now.
1
SPEAKER_02
I feel like his name is Colin.
1
SPEAKER_02
I ll find it.
1
SPEAKER_02
Do that.
1
SPEAKER_02
Do that in front of people.
1
SPEAKER_02
So let people come and watch their.
1
SPEAKER_02
Another fun thing would be is if you could nominate, have staff people nominate their CEO for a makeover.
1
SPEAKER_02
And you do a fashion makeover on a bad dress CEO, and you do it in front of the whole company.
1
SPEAKER_02
Kind of like when a principal of an elementary school says they re going to camp on top of the school until the school raises $1,000 for charity.
1
SPEAKER_02
Right?
1
SPEAKER_02
People love to put their boss out there.
1
SPEAKER_02
I think that d be a really fun thing to do.
1
SPEAKER_01
But throughout that process, you re just getting people more engaged in you, and they re starting to see before.
1
SPEAKER_01
I love the before-after thing.
1
SPEAKER_01
I wrote that down here earlier, is can you demonstrate before and after?
1
SPEAKER_01
Before, Lili has a chance to work her magic, and after, it s the Lili magic.
1
SPEAKER_01
So I had one too here that is similar to that.
1
SPEAKER_01
I think they re all kind of the same.
1
SPEAKER_01
And you talked about, Brian, you texting a picture of your pegged up jeans and your knickers, or whatever they were, to a friend.
1
SPEAKER_01
They weren t knickers.
1
SPEAKER_01
They were jeans.
1
SPEAKER_02
I stopped wearing knickers back in 07.
1
SPEAKER_02
They were white polyester.
1
SPEAKER_02
But we re good now.
1
SPEAKER_01
But some kind of a poll, an online poll, where you say, does she look good in this?
1
SPEAKER_01
And you wouldn t do faces.
1
SPEAKER_01
You would only do wardrobes.
1
SPEAKER_01
But maybe you have funky shoes.
1
SPEAKER_01
Maybe you have shoes that don t match the skirt.
1
SPEAKER_01
Or you have a dress that s too revealing.
1
SPEAKER_01
Whatever those are.
1
SPEAKER_01
And you get people to engage by voting.
1
SPEAKER_01
On yes, this is perfect or ooh, I would never wear this and start to get people engaged Then people look forward to that every week like oh I get to vote and before you know it now It s something they re looking for
2
SPEAKER_00
And then you could offer these little 15, 20 minute, 30 minute makeovers as part of that, give away one a week.
2
SPEAKER_00
And then people can t stand it because then they start looking at themselves and say, well, I wonder if my picture was up there, would people vote yes or no on it?
2
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_01
Really, really good.
2
SPEAKER_01
The guy s name is Clinton Kelly.
2
SPEAKER_01
And the show is called What Not to Wear with Stacy London.
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SPEAKER_01
Like, emulate that show.
2
SPEAKER_01
It was a great show.
2
SPEAKER_01
Really, really great show.
2
SPEAKER_01
OK, my next bit of advice, and you re hearing this theme, Lely, I think, is I m going to go back now to what you re doing.
2
SPEAKER_01
You re prospecting people.
2
SPEAKER_01
When you re sending 12 emails to the same person within the same company, you re right.
2
SPEAKER_01
You probably do get boring after four or five.
2
SPEAKER_01
You have to navigate around to the other people.
2
SPEAKER_01
through LinkedIn these days, through just using the old-fashioned telephone, cell phone, pick up the phone and call into there, and just find some other people to talk to.
2
SPEAKER_01
So if you re calling on the VP of HR, trying to get him to come in, you know, 12 emails, 13 emails in, stop pegging that person.
2
SPEAKER_01
Go peg somebody else, right?
2
SPEAKER_01
Go find the VP of sales.
2
SPEAKER_01
Find a salesperson.
2
SPEAKER_01
Find an admin person saying, hey, we do makeovers.
2
SPEAKER_01
We do fashion makeovers for companies for people like you.
2
SPEAKER_01
I don t know if that s something you d be open to or someone in there.
2
SPEAKER_01
Some of the ladies or some of the guys that need it desperately.
2
SPEAKER_01
So we have some fun with it and just want to talk to you about what we do.
2
SPEAKER_01
And just move around, because this is so unique.
2
SPEAKER_01
There s not a buyer for this.
2
SPEAKER_01
And so anyone could potentially be the buyer.
2
SPEAKER_01
So move around in the company.
2
SPEAKER_01
Get off of one person doing 15.
2
SPEAKER_01
emails in a row sort of thing.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
In fact, I was even thinking that if you did this event where you had the makeover, do a Facebook Live.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yeah.
2
SPEAKER_00
And get a camera person and get a microphone and stream it to the world.
2
SPEAKER_00
Let the world see what your magic is and how you work it.
2
SPEAKER_00
Yes.
2
SPEAKER_00
But these are not traditional marketing.
2
SPEAKER_00
I know you said something about, I heard it takes 8 to 12 contacts for people.
2
SPEAKER_00
Maybe, maybe not.
2
SPEAKER_00
Maybe it just takes one if it s done properly.
2
SPEAKER_00
And they see themselves in the story that you re telling, maybe it only takes one.
2
SPEAKER_00
So I wouldn t buy into that myth of 8 to 12.
2
SPEAKER_00
I think that s an old antiquated conclusion that marketers came to because they wanted to sell you all the ads.
2
SPEAKER_00
So the ad guy says, hey, it s going to take 8 to 12, so you ve got to run a one-year schedule.
2
SPEAKER_01
And then I get those stats like that, and I go, well, it takes you 12 contacts before someone responds on average.
2
SPEAKER_01
And I go, OK.
2
SPEAKER_01
So it s not necessarily my world.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s just like a generic broad stat.
2
SPEAKER_01
As long as you know, you know.
2
SPEAKER_00
So if you do believe that, though, and you want to continue to believe that, then you have to, well, I mean, that sounds bad.
2
SPEAKER_00
bad, but you have to figure out, OK, well, what are some other touch points?
2
SPEAKER_00
And again, maybe there s a poll.
2
SPEAKER_00
Maybe you could come up with the biggest problems that people have if they re not dressed properly and ask people a question about that.
2
SPEAKER_00
Have an ask poll, where you say, hey, I m doing a poll on professional women and their wardrobes.
2
SPEAKER_00
What s the biggest question you have about, I don t know,
2
SPEAKER_00
about professionalism, professional dress, or professional dress code, or the biggest question you have about color, using color.
2
SPEAKER_00
What not to wear.
2
SPEAKER_00
What not to wear.
2
SPEAKER_00
So you ve got to engage them, because right now it sounds like all you re doing is you re sending stuff.
2
SPEAKER_00
And sending stuff, it will take 12, and I don t think it needs to.
2
SPEAKER_00
But we appreciate your question.
2
SPEAKER_00
It s a great question.
2
SPEAKER_00
And so some of you who aren t in that business, you still could have picked up a couple of things.
2
SPEAKER_00
I love that.
2
SPEAKER_00
I love that idea of making over clients or making over people.
2
SPEAKER_00
And we have so much response to that personal brand makeover.
2
SPEAKER_00
I would figure out a way to use that in your business.
2
SPEAKER_01
OK, good stuff.
2
SPEAKER_01
Remember, go to advancedsellingpodcast.com.
2
SPEAKER_01
Remember, go to advancedsellingpodcast.com slash covideo to find out what our friends at Covideo are up to.
2
SPEAKER_01
And they ve got a great program for you there.
2
SPEAKER_01
You can also go to our website, advancedsellingpodcast.com.
2
SPEAKER_01
Check out the products page if you ve not already purchased the product all in.
2
SPEAKER_01
That s a must-have for all podcast listeners, especially you newbies.
2
SPEAKER_01
You need to go there.
2
SPEAKER_01
We ll also be talking to you and visiting with you in the LinkedIn group in the coming weeks.
2
SPEAKER_01
So be sure, if you re not a member of the LinkedIn group, you go there, advancedsellingpodcast.com slash LinkedIn.
2
SPEAKER_01
We ll see you next time on the advancedsellingpodcast.com.