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Welcome, everybody, to the Advanced Selling Podcast, the longest running sales training podcast in the history of podcasts.
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My name is Brian Neal.
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My name is Bill Kasky.
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We re here every week, aren t we?
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It s Friday.
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Usually, we record on a Monday.
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It s Friday.
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I think we re already in a better mood, Bill.
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I do, too.
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Spring has not sprung here in the Midwest.
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It did, and then it sprung back about the time our clock sprung forward.
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kind of sprung back so that s sunday we do this sunday the day we re recording today yes it s sunday yes it s spring forward it s when everybody loses sleep what a silly thing that s a tangent we don t want to talk about that s so dumb it s so dumb uh hey if you re a first-time listener glad you re here uh we have a linkedin group lots of people maybe 13 14 000 people in the linkedin group
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And I d love to have you there.
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And we have another program called Insider that s live coaching with Bill Kasky the first Friday.
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And Bill, you have a little fun thing.
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I have a surprise.
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I do.
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And I didn t realize where you were with this project.
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Oh, you didn t?
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And then you just now held it up.
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I m like, holy shnikes.
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So we have this program Insider, and every month we get together, and it s 70, 80 people in there.
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And we do coaching.
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We have a topic, and then we coach.
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And I went back at the end of last year and looked at the, I pulled out what I think are the 12 boldest moves, the 12 things that we all learn, not just from me, but from each other.
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And I put them into a booklet, and I want you to get it.
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It s called 12 Bold Moves, Insider Secrets to Reinventing Yourself and Your Results.
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And if you ll go to 12boldmoves.com, we ll put it in show notes.
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12 Bold Moves, there s a video there.
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It talks about it, what you re going to get in it.
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But these moves, I think, are really important that we start to reinvent ourselves as sales professionals.
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We talk about it a lot on the podcast.
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But The Insider really gave up a lot of really good techniques and strategies.
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So 12 Bold Moves.
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And there s also a little offer there to get into insider at a very low cost so anyway.
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Everybody should get the book everybody should be an insider twelve bold is it the number twelve or spot twelve number twelve one to lose number one to bold moves dot com and i would also say that looks like more than a booklet to me.
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It looks like a book.
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It s 35 pages.
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35 pages.
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That s a book.
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Yeah.
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B. Neal s world.
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That s a book.
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Yeah.
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It s right at the edge.
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I m a big reader here.
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Hey, before we, so we have a guest today.
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We re going to pull a Taylor in here just a second, but before we do Bill, I have a, just a little scruples question for you about some food.
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I have a pet peeve food, and I want to see where you are on this spectrum.
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I love caramel corn.
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Love caramel corn, especially homemade gourmet caramel corn.
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Love it.
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I love cheddar popcorn, homemade gourmet cheddar popcorn.
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I cannot stand when they re in the same bag.
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And we had a bag of blended caramel and cheese popcorn here and people love it.
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And I m like, what is wrong?
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You re in my case, the whole suite doesn t go, doesn t go.
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But no, I m, I m a purist there when it comes.
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Thank you.
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God, I feel validated.
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I was afraid you were going to be like, no man, it s blended up.
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It s like, and then some, some people, it s a huge popular, people love it.
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The blend.
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Yeah, the blend.
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And you can t even you can t even enjoy either one of them.
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You know what I mean?
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That s the problem.
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I m like, I want to enjoy as soon as I started enjoying.
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Oh, there s a couple of caramels.
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Oh, there s some cheese.
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Now the caramel.
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I m like, you know, it s very, very confusing.
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Yeah, very confusing.
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I ll tell you my quick popcorn story.
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I love pop.
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Oh, yeah.
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Almost every day and get a bag.
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I didn t know this.
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Neither.
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Oh, I love popcorn.
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It s just plain popcorn, but it s really good.
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And the other day I was I was chewing on it and thought, Oh, boy, I got a kernel and took it out, spit it out.
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It was part of my tooth.
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Part of my tooth.
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I broke a tooth on the popcorn and then I didn t have a crown.
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So I ve got the whole crown thing.
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Yeah.
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But that s the first time in my 50 years of eating popcorn I ve ever had that happen.
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Is it really?
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I know.
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Oh, we ll do a popcorn episode sometime.
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Okay, we re excited.
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We have a guest.
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We don t always have guests on the Advanced Link Podcast, but today we do.
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We re super, super excited to welcome to the show Taylor Wilding, VP of Sales for a partner of ours called exactly XACTLY.
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And you ve been listening to the show, you know we ve been building this up.
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We ve been talking about motivation and things, and our friends at XACTLY have some really cool things that they do.
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So we thought, hey, let s bring Taylor on, talk about his view of motivation and compensation and planning.
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CRM and pipeline accuracy and all that stuff.
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So Taylor Wilding, we are thrilled that you re here.
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Welcome to the Event Signing Podcast, man.
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Thank you so much.
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Good to be here, Bill and Brian.
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Thanks for having me.
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We had some fun time.
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So I ve got three first names, Brian, Scott, Neil.
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That s my name, Brian with a Y, Scott with one T, Neil with an E on the end.
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And yep, Taylor came on board and I said, Taylor, how many times a week do you get called Tyler?
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And he said, at least two a week.
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Well, had he known our conversation before he came on, guess who else called him Tyler?
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I said, is it Tyler?
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I raced through that.
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I knew there was something.
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It s awesome.
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Yeah, it s really, really good.
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So thrilled that you re here.
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So this is a great, great topic for our listeners, because it hits both the leadership side and the salesperson side.
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So I want to start, we just want to start with how people tend to do goal setting and, you know, comp and that sort of thing design.
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It s typically from
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the top down.
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I d love to get your take as you, you and your friends that exactly have like looked at this issue and said, okay, this is a good thing or bad thing when it comes to just general, you know, compensation commission, design and goal setting.
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Just start, let s start there, shall we?
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Yeah, of course.
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I think that what you don t measure, you don t achieve is for starters.
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And so making sure that those measures are in front of your sellers and driving that motivational behavior, if you will, that you re looking to drive.
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And so there s a couple of different areas of focus is, of course, you don t want to put plans out there that are going to be absolutely crushed by everybody because you ve misdesigned the plans and ultimately
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you re probably setting your overall targets too low, if that s the case.
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But understanding what the overall corporate objective is, so that top-level understanding of what your budgeted dollars are going to be.
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Then, of course, how do you incentivize individuals to go achieve that?
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If they do it in the right way, if it s designed in the right way, then not only does the company achieve their objective, but
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At the same time, you re putting money in your in your seller s pockets, which is why people are in sales, for the most part to begin with.
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And so, you know, gaming the plan is not a bad thing.
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If you go out and you adjust accordingly and find a way to game the plan, if the plan is designed properly, then it benefits the company as well as the individual contributors.
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It s a mic drop moment, game the plan.
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Because everybody does it.
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No one wants to admit they do it.
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And the leaders don t want to.
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And then the leaders get all bent out of shape.
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Like, well, they re going to game the plan.
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I m like, yeah, exactly.
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Like, that s what we all did.
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Make the plan.
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So gaming the plan is in everybody s best interest.
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Totally.
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That s fire right there.
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Yeah, if I m a VP of sales listening to this, I m like, OK, I m done with this.
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That was great.
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That s fantastic.
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Fun fact, and that wasn t the objective here, but our founder actually wrote a book called Game the Plan, which speaks exactly to that.
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You know, I know 12 bold moves, you know, competing against that right now is not where we re trying to go, but go check it out.
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We should do a package deal where you get 12 bold moves and game the plan for one low cost.
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That s a really good idea, actually.
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So you mentioned, Taylor, that one of the principles, I like to think of principles when we talk about things like this, and one principle is what gets measured gets improved, or you had a different take on it, but generally that s it.
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Are there any other principles that we need to look at and live by as we get into this comp conversation?
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Any other big picture things that would help us put all this together?
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Well, clearly we ve been in dynamic times in the last few years.
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And so designing plans that people feel like they can achieve and at the same time, uh, are, are once again, thinking about the right things.
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And so thinking about things like durable revenue or enduring revenue, that is not the short term, Hey, we got the dollars today.
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Every dollar is not created equal if you will.
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Um, so those dollars that have a greater potential for churn, um, you know, in a year s time or two years time is not as, as, uh, important to a company as something that s going to be.
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you know, keep growing as you go instead of churning.
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So, thinking about just the value of each dollar in a different light is something that s important.
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So, incentivizing the structure of the contract as well as just not just the ARR, MRR, whatever you re comping on is really important to ensure that you re putting holistic
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good structured contracts together for your organization.
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That s excellent.
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Yeah, yeah, great principle.
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I never really thought so you will so you exactly or your clients or even you all you will incent for contract structure, let s say so you might pay more for a longer term contract that would make some common sense to me things like that.
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Is that what you re talking about?
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Yeah, and anything as well, you know, if you have things like payment terms that are really important to you, of course, the cash that you collect earlier on and things of that nature.
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So incentivizing towards that, of course, everyone s concerned about
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profitability these days as opposed to, you know, growth, growth at all costs.
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So thinking about, uh, elements of the contract, like, uh, you know, year over year increases, you know, most of the time you think you get a multi-year deal, you re going to actually go down in costs, but now looking at things like CPI and year over year increases in the contract structure allow for that continual annual growth rate to continue to, to climb up into the right.
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You like up into the right.
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I ve got a question.
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Yeah.
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Um,
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You know, here s the conversation I have with salespeople who are in either my program or in the corporate work that we do.
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I say, well, what s the comp plan there?
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And 80% of the time, they say, oh, god, it s confusing.
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How important is it for the comp plan to be understandable, simple?
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I know it sounds like a silly question, but I just see so many.
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There s so many gates and levels.
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And people finally, it s like, look, what do you want me to do this year?
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What do you want me to bring in?
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It becomes so confusing, we don t pay attention to it.
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How do you feel about it?
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Do you see that when you go into companies?
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I ve seen of course a wide array of comp plans come across my desk or our team s desks and and You know really the three components or three measures within a plan is really that sweet spot So if you re exceeding three measures, then it becomes very hard to understand where you re getting paid and how what behavior you know The organization is looking to drive and so at the same time
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You ve got to prioritize at that point if you have more than three components as to what s really important to my organization and how do I make money.
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And also maybe how I lose money because if you have discount modifiers or things of that nature that disincentivize or you get knocked a point or two, that s something as well that you want to make sure you re weighing out.
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I like that, rule of three.
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I m interested now, I m taking this stuff that Taylor s given us.
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I m thinking about my own clients, Bill, I m sure you are too, of things that you ve seen.
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I m like, man, I wish I would have had this conversation a couple of years ago.
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It could have been more valuable to a couple of my clients.
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So when you say there are three, you mean that s kind of the minimum number of gates or elements of a plan.
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Are there three specific things or just generally three for a client?
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Just don t get 10 in there.
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Yeah, don t don t get 10.
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And if you have 10, there s probably a good reason for it.
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But it s not going to be easy to understand to your earlier question, right?
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Three is really it s not there s no cookie cutter approach, because what s important to one business might not be important to the next.
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And so ensuring that you re driving the appropriate behavior, if you re looking to, you know, some companies are
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you know, sitting at 12 to 18 months in of cash kind of story, right.
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And so making sure that they re getting those sales in the door at all costs right now is important.
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But then you have the other companies that are looking three, five, seven years down the road.
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And of course, you re trying to build that enduring revenue.
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And so putting the contract structure, and comp plans in place to cooperate with one another to build to that is important.
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That s awesome.
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We re talking with Taylor Wilding, VP of sales for Exactly, X-A-C-T-L-Y.
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People always need to know how to spell that, spell it every time.
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By the way, at the end of the show, we re gonna give you a really cool invitation to an event that they re having, a little love on the ticket.
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Bill and Brian are gonna pay for part of the ticket, aren t we, Bill?
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Let s talk about this now.
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Let s talk about, so we got commission, comp, motive, that sort of thing.
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Let s talk about how
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pipeline and accuracy come into commission planning, that sort of thing.
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And I had one of my clients, a chief revenue officer of a customer client here in where Bill and I live in Indianapolis, Indiana, said this yesterday.
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I ve never heard someone say this this way.
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He said, your CRM should be so clean I could eat off of it.
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And I m like, that s it right there.
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And he said that because his isn t and his company s isn t.
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This is a great company, great results, but it s still dirty.
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And I m going around all my other clients and I m going, how clean is it?
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Can I eat off of it?
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Nobody.
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So let s talk about how do you all approach accuracy and cleanliness of pipeline in commission and planning and structure?
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Yeah, I think it s a
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you know, he shouldn t feel like he s alone, first and foremost.
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I think that it s widespread that folks feel this way.
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And I think a lot of it has to do with, of course, the actions that are required in order to keep it clean.
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And ultimately, if you don t have a clean and healthy pipeline, then you don t even know what sufficient pipeline is, because you might have a security blanket that you re feeling really good about the pipeline you have, and then the coverage that you need in order to
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to hit the number that, you know, if you re sitting on dirty pipeline, then that s a false sense of security once again.
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So it comes down to going from, you know, a CRM is great.
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Everyone needs it.
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It s the source of record.
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You need a source of action, right?
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And so how do you go keep that healthy pipeline?
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And sometimes as sellers,
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Let s just be real.
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We need a little bit of a nudge.
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Sometimes we need a little bit of a reminder to go do X, Y, and Z. And so, um, having those things that are more prescriptive and based on what you know about a healthy deal at your organization, how do you nudge the, uh, you know, your sellers to go update things in order to generate that clean and healthy or, or maintain clean and healthy pipeline.
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So.
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Um, once again, having solutions in place that allow for you to, to make those adjustments and, and based on the attributes of the opportunity that are maybe behind where they should be.
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That helps you to have that clean and healthy pipeline, which allows for, of course, more accurate forecasting because you know what your pipeline actually is, as opposed to having that false sense of security.
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Yeah.
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And I think the biggest issue here for the salespeople listening today is you have to understand that the accuracy of your pipeline is accuracy for your own income.
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And if you re any sort of responsible adult and want to accurately plan your income, you need to have accurate pipeline.
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Cause I think what so many salespeople do is they just like keep working all this stuff and they see what spits out.
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They get surprised by their commission check each month and then it becomes harder to plan.
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You know, then you get, you know, you re married or something like that.
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And then it s like extra difficult, right?
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So honey, how much are we going to make?
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Is it 20 grand or 10 grand this month?
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And it s just, yeah.
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I wish more salespeople would learn to lean into it for themselves, not because they have to because the company wants it for their own, make it their own tool.
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So, Bill?
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Yeah.
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I totally agree.
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If you have a comment on that, Taylor, I d love to hear it.
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But yeah, I agree.
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Well, it s interesting because I think that organizations provide you with a quota and then you understand what the coverage and pipeline that you need as relation to that quota based on historical trends within your organization, right?
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So do you need that, you know, three X pipeline?
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Do you need four?
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Do you need four and a half, whatever it is?
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Maybe you need less, but you guys execute really well.
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But ultimately that s the company assigned quota.
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Therefore the company assigned pipeline that you need.
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And so an exercise that we run here and I think is very interesting is how much money do you want to make?
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If you want to make just what your OTE is, your on-target earnings, I d be surprised.
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Most sellers are looking to make a lot more than what their OTE is.
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Taking that, understanding how much business you need to close in order to achieve your variable desires, if you will, and then working backwards to how much pipeline you need to generate in order to hit that target,
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that becomes your personally assigned quota.
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And we all know that that gives you another level of conviction to go do the tasks, especially prospecting, which everybody just absolutely loves to do.
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And so making it more intentional, making it more personal, allows for you to buy into it a little bit more and breaking it down as well, on a weekly basis, as opposed to like, okay, on the year, I need to have $10 million for the pipeline.
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That s, that s a big wall.
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Yes.
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How do I go break it down to a weekly basis?
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Yeah.
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That brings me to one of the questions you brought up behavior or action.
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And, um, it s, you re right.
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It s okay.
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You got $10 million, but I m starting in January and maybe I ve got three that are already coming in, but I ve got some kind of gap.
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between where I am and where I d like to be.
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At some point, and Brian and I talk about this a lot, especially at the end of the year, we do a business planning session where it s really all about inputs.
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What are you going to do to generate the kind of interest and opportunities that are going to get you to that 10 million or whatever?
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How does that figure into comp plans?
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Is there a trend toward, well, there s a top line, but you need to do certain behavior, and we re going to pay you on that behavior?
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Or is it just, no, we re not going to pay you on the behavior, we re going to pay you on the results only?
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Yeah, I think you ve got to be very careful activity for activity sake is not going to get anybody anywhere.
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And so if you re comping based on activity, you need to make sure it s the right type of activity.
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It s it s, I would say that s pretty rare that we see folks doing that.
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But it s definitely something that that s out there.
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And then of course, if you re incentivizing as well, something like 3x coverage,
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Then you end up with the dirty pipeline most of the time as well, because at that time it becomes an intelligence test.
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You re going to have 3x coverage because you re going to get paid a percentage of your variable on it.
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What do you mean by 3x coverage?
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3x your quota?
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Yeah.
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So if you need, let s say you have a $100,000 quota just for round numbers, you need $300,000 in order to execute upon that.
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I think listening to this conversation, listening to you and just thinking about this, and Bill talks about this a lot in his work, I do also.
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is, and I m almost thinking of it in a different way, so many people plan their income goal based on what their company gives them for quota.
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And I m thinking, so I m flipping this going, that s like the man, right?
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The man coming down, thumb on the back.
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I m going to almost limit how much you can make, not can make, but will make based on the goal that I give you, versus an aspirational look to go,
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Because how many, Bill, how many of your clients have a capped commission plan?
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Not many.
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Zero is mine.
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I mean, there s a bunch of them.
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I haven t found anyone s like, yeah, we will pay you up to 250, but it just stops.
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No sales comp plans.
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I don t do that.
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So again, crazy dream.
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Like you can make a billion dollars a year selling for most companies.
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And so it s so interesting to hear this reverse engineer from you, Taylor, about this, because I don t think too many people,
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Um, do that.
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I don t think too many salespeople feel like they can do that.
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You know what I mean?
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Yeah.
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We don t like them, but when the man gives us a number, we say, okay, yeah, yeah.
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Okay.
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Or we ll complain.
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I m like, they re trying you, but you make more money.
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It was too high, too much for me.
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I m like, but you get paid commission on it.
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It s interesting.
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Taylor, what do you have to say about that?
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Once again, I like the thumb idea there.
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It s an interesting thing because if you re driving towards the minimum, that s the minimum that you re looking to accomplish, right?
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And so I ve always been a believer in having those realistic goals and then the stretch goals.
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Because once you hit that realistic goal, then you re just hands up, I m done.
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That s not the behavior we re looking to drive.
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We want those folks that are gonna wanna go overachieve on their number.
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And the plan is typically not designed to do that across the board.
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You know, you want 80% of your reps to hit 80 plus percent of their number is kind of how the design mechanism should look.
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But nonetheless,
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Making it personal is, I think, really key in the whole pipeline generation.
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So if I m a VP of sales or CEO, and I m listening, because probably 30%, 40% of our audience is management, how would a guy like you work with somebody?
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What does the model or the offer look like when you go into a company?
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Give us a minute on that.
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Yeah, so we like to meet our customers, our clients where they are.
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So sometimes our solution allows for, you know, upstream planning, so territory quota management and territory quota planning.
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You know, we can help with plan design, we ve got in-house consultants that can help design the plans along with you.
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And then of course, coming downstream from the territory quota management and planning is the commissions aspect.
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And then so we can automate the commissions and make sure that people have
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those behavior drivers in front of them on a daily basis to understand what that is.
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And then furthermore, of course, the entire revenue cycle with pipeline management, forecasting, and understanding where the risk is within your pipeline, having those coaching elements that we talked about, those nudges to ensure that everything is cohesive and the data is flowing upstream, downstream, and every other stream that you can imagine.
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I love it.
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Go ahead, Bill.
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Well, I was going to say, so how do I know?
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Again, I m the VP of sales listening.
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I m an avid listener to the Advanced Selling Podcast.
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How do I know I have a problem that would warrant you coming in?
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How do I know that?
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What is the problem?
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So there s a couple of ways.
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One, I ve spoken to a controller at a publicly traded company before, and the exact question that I asked her was about errors, right?
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Do you guys have a lot of errors?
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Do you guys have a lot of inquiries coming in from your team?
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And she said, No.
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And I said, You don t have any inquiries.
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You have 2500 sellers, and there s no inquiries.
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What is that?
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What is that?
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What does that tell you?
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And she paused.
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And she gave it a good solid, it felt like in a minute, probably was 10 seconds.
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And she says, we re overpaying people.
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And I said, so you have 2,500 people that are not inquiring about their commissions.
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You are overpaying people more than likely, unless you re using a system and there s transparency and they know exactly how they re getting paid.
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Because I can guarantee you that as soon as somebody gets the wrong payment on the underside, you re going to hear from them.
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That s one, that s one big trigger.
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And if you re doing that, then of course, you re impacting your organization tremendously, because you re paying a lot more than what you have budgeted for those particular transactions.
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So that s one big way.
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And then of course, on the opposite end, if you re, you know, have every transaction has an inquiry associated with it, then you also are having a problem.
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So those are some indicators there.
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I love that.
SPEAKER_00
And I think you both, those listeners, if you re a salesperson and you spend Friday afternoons on the last day of the month, like reworking your comp to see, and you re comparing, contrasting, going to meet the CFO, you got a problem.
SPEAKER_00
And if you re the CFO, CEO, VP of sales, and that s happening, you got a problem, right?
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Yeah.
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On both sides.
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Yeah.
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Brian, you make a good point.
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I don t know if we ve coined that or where it comes from, but shadow accounting.
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So if you re doing shadow accounting,
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You re spending time away from prospecting or reaching out to a customer because you re sitting there doing the job of a comp, someone in the comp team.
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That s not the right behavior.
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I love it.
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I would think a good exercise for a VP of sales or senior executive is go to a handful of people, salespeople, and say,
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You got a minute.
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Explain to me the comp plan.
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Oh, that s great.
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What a good idea.
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And if all of them can do it, like, boom, I got that.
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Now it s a question of what are some other things?
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Are we all making quota?
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Everybody missing it?
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But I think that might be a good way to determine whether you have a confusion problem or not.
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It s just to have them explain it.
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I love that.
SPEAKER_00
And then you used a word, Taylor, that you need to use again.
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Do you remember what the word was when we were prepping for this?
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So people don t know this, but Taylor is also an accomplished baseball player.
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He was drafted in the major leagues, which is really cool.
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You don t talk about that a lot.
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I think that s really awesome.
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But this is a baseball term.
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Do you remember what it is?
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I think all salespeople should be this.
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Do you know what it is?
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A stat rat.
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You re a stat rat.
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First time I ve ever heard that term.
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You said that in our prep.
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I m a stat rat.
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So talk about what that means for a salesperson and then the encouragement to be a stat rat if you re a sales guy.
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Here we go.
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Yes.
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So, you know, going back to the baseball piece is that there were times admittedly and not necessarily proud of it, but I was on the mound and I m sitting there thinking to myself, okay, if I, you know, I ve, if I throw another inning and a third and I don t give up a run, my ERA is going to go below, you know,
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let s be honest, below four, otherwise I probably wouldn t be here talking.
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Doing the calculation and figuring that out, that s the same thing in sales, right?
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I need to go build X amount of pipeline in order to have the right coverage to my number based on how I execute and how our organization executes.
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So looking at things like conversion rates and the like, and so understanding what those numbers are,
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just is information that allows you to be dangerous.
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And I think decisions without data are essentially opinions.
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You need to have some data in order to inform some decisions.
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Of course, we ve all got gut instinct, especially like... Bill, you talked about the VP of sales.
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They ve got the gut instinct.
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That s why they re in the role they re in.
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But how do you have that sanity check, if you will, and leveraging data to do so?
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You ve got to be a bit of a stat rat to do so.
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I think a second question that the VP of sales can ask is, what s your conversion percentage?
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Because I don t find people usually know that.
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Or they might say, well, it s about 20%.
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Then you look at it, and it s 10% or whatever.
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I think that is one of those performance indicators that you have to have, because that s really a lot of what this gets down to.
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Yeah, I m sure there s some cool tools out there that can allow for you to see what those are.
SPEAKER_00
Yeah, I bet exactly is one of those.
SPEAKER_00
You said it, not me, Brian.
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Exactly.
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See, that s what we re here for.
SPEAKER_00
So let s talk about that now.
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So we ve got a little special offer.
SPEAKER_00
So our friends at exactly are having a really big fun meetup in a really fun town.
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And tickets are for sale are going to be for sale, we re going to give you a little discount of tickets.
SPEAKER_00
So tell us what that event is and how people can get a discount code for our friends at ASP to come to that thing.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, so we ve got the Upside Conference in San Francisco at the end of May, and that s gonna be at the Intercontinental Hotel.
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So we re excited to have our users and additional future customers come join us.
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If nothing else, come learn what s going on in the industry of forecasting, incentive comp, planning, that entire revenue cycle.
SPEAKER_00
So we re looking forward to having folks out there and it s gonna be a great event.
SPEAKER_00
Awesome.
SPEAKER_00
And then they can email an email to kind of a long email.
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So listen very closely listeners.
SPEAKER_01
Yeah, exactly.
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Like, like we already heard X, A, C, T, L, Y, user conference at exactly corp.com.
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We ll put that in the user notes or they will.
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So that s for sure.
SPEAKER_00
So it s exactly X, A, C, T, L, Y, user
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Conference conference at exactly X a TL y Cork corp.com.com.
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I said that I m slow on purpose.
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Let s get it off We have a lot of those many driving or you know, almost as many pages as the 12-fold.
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It sounds like see Love it.
SPEAKER_00
Well, please
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a little slack for that.
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I love that.
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That s great.
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It s a book.
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I love it.
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Well, hey, man, thanks for being super informative.
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Love what you re doing.
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If you re a salesperson, and you want to make a lot more money and be intentional about it, you got to go find our friends at exactly and if you re a sales leader or a company owner,
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And you re dealing with a lot of problems and people that don t understand the comp plan.
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You need to go talk to them.
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And San Francisco is a great place to be at the end of May.
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Perfect.
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Especially the intercontinental.
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So awesome, man.
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Appreciate you being here with us and stay in touch with you.
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Thanks, Taylor.
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Pleasure.
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All right.
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Thanks for having me, guys.
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See you, brother.
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Bye.
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Cheers.