Sen. Max Cleland Discusses War Detainees
JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: Joining us now with his perspective on al of this, the detainees and the case against John Walker Lindh is Georgia Senator Max Cleland who is a member of the Armed Services Committee and a veteran of the Vietnam War. Senator, it's a pleasure to have you on the program this morning.</s>SEN. MAX CLELAND (D), GEORGIA: Good morning.</s>CAFFERTY: Your thoughts on the -- on two subjects actually. I think one if the treatment of detainees. And the other is the criticism of the treatment of the detainees.</s>CLELAND: Well, first of all, the secretary of defense is absolutely right on every point. These are people who will kill you in a heartbeat. These are people who will be glad to die themselves, and take you with them, and that is exactly what you're dealing with here. They must be secure, in transit, and in the compound in which they find themselves. I think they're being well treated from what I can tell. I'm sure the Defense Department will treat them humanely. The truth of the matter is, they have a very volatile situation in there, in every one of these prisoners, and these people are people who are really are out to kill somebody. They were out to kill Americans in Afghanistan, and I'm sure they'll -- if given the chance, they will do it here.</s>CAFFERTY: And they even -- some of them even said, reportedly, that they fully intended to kill an American before they left Cuba. Those were some of the statements made, as I understand it, early on. Did the administration make a mistake, hindsight being 20/20, in releasing the photographs of the detainees in the chains, with the hoods on. I mean, did that perhaps inflame unnecessarily the people who are concerned about human right and create a situation that might have been avoided if hadn't released the pictures?</s>CLELAND: Well, you know, it's not the way the prisoners are treated 24 hours a day. That was in a special situation which being moved. You have to maximize your security with these kinds of prisoners, so they don't kill themselves and they don't kill you. Thank God there's not loss of life, on the prisoners or American servicemen and women guarding them. And that's what we want, we want a totally secure situation. When you transport people, you have to do some of those things.</s>CAFFERTY: Let me ask you about John Walker Lindh, who is the exception to the captives from the war in Afghanistan. And as much as he is an American citizen, and now in custody down in Virginia, facing trial on charges of conspiracy to kill Americans. Do you find it ironic that his lawyers, first rattle out of the box, are suggesting they will try to get the case against him thrown out based on the fact that no lawyers were present during the time that he apparently in writing renounced the wish to have legal representation, read him his Miranda rights, and apparently signed off and agreed to talk to FBI investigators.</s>CLELAND: That's ridiculous. I don't think the young Marines risking their lives in Afghanistan and Kandahar and 60 miles up in the mountains have the lawyers traveling with them. I think the young man made a terrible mistake in his life and will pay for the rest of his life, and he should.</s>CAFFERTY: Should he have been sent to Guantanamo Bay with the rest of the battlefield captives?</s>CLELAND: I think he is being handled by American jurisprudence, being handled properly in American courts, and he has certain rights, but the prosecution has certain rights to, and this young man made a terrible mistake in his life. He chose the wrong side, and young Americans were at risk of losing their lives because of him, and he will spend the rest of life in prison. I'm confident in thinking about that.</s>CAFFERTY: You're convinced that he's going to be convicted on the charges?</s>CLELAND: I am. And why not? Because he was found, in effect, right there in the presence of the bad guys, the enemy, and there was also a CIA agent who lost his life right there in his presence. I mean, this is very serious business here, and it ought to be treated as such.</s>CAFFERTY: What about -- and I need a short answer, if we can -- What about his lawyer's contention which is, in effect, that the prosecutor's statements is based totally on voluntary statements that Mr. Walker Lindh made to investigators, and if they can create any sort of suspicion that these were not entirely voluntarily, that these were somehow made because stress, that they were coerced out of him, that he was denied his right to legal representation, that he was denied the right to contact with family, that there was a chance he might get off.</s>CLELAND: Well, he has a right to a lawyer, but we don't have to believe him.</s>CAFFERTY: All right. Fair enough. Senator Cleland, it's a pleasure talking with you again. I interviewed you a number of years ago. There is no reason you should remember that, but I did. It's nice to have you on the program. Thank you.</s>CLELAND: Thank you very much.</s>CAFFERTY: Senator Max Cleland, Democrat from the state of Georgia. TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com