Tillerson, Russia's Foreign Minister Discuss Airstrike; Nikki Haley Says U.S. Prepared to Do More in Syria; How the Syrian Uprising Ended in Carnage and Civil War
ANA CABRERA, CNN ANCHOR: Targeted by dozens of American missiles and a harsh warning from President Trump's team. That Syrian air base was up and running less than 24 hours after that U.S. surprise attack. Syrian warplanes are even taking off and landing again. This video is new video and it comes as the Trump administration sends a blunt signal to Syria's President Bashar al- Assad that this is not over. I want to you hear what U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, Nikki Haley, told CNN's Jake Tapper.</s>NIKKI HALEY, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.: He won't stop here. If he needs to do more, he will do more. So really now what happens depends on how everyone responds to what happened in Syria and make sure that we start moving to a political solution and we start finding peace in the area.</s>CABRERA: The U.S. strikes were retaliation for the brutal chemical weapons attack Tuesday in Syria that killed nearly 90 people including 33 children. Just today more bombs fell on that same town hit by that deadly chemical attack. Sources on the ground say at least 16 people were killed, and it's not clear who exactly is behind these new air strikes but Russian and Syrian planes have gone after rebel targets in that area recently. This comes as Moscow is sending a warship armed with cruise missiles to Syria's coast. And promising to bolster Syria's air defenses. All just days before Secretary of State Rex Tillerson is set to land in Moscow for his first visit in his new role. We have a panel of reporters and analysts covering every angle. I want to begin with senior international correspondent Matthew Chance in Moscow. And, Matthew, we know Secretary Tillerson called his Russian counterpart today to talk about Syria. What are you hearing about that conversation?</s>MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the State Department was very tightlipped of what the content, Ana, of that conversation was. But the Kremlin have been, you know, uncharacteristically open about what was discussed. They're giving us a readout saying that -- that the Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov told Rex Tillerson that when you strike against the government that is fighting terrorism -- of course, that's how they regard the governments of Bashar al-Assad -- it plays into the hands, said the Foreign minister, of extremists. The Foreign minister also telling Rex Tillerson, the secretary of state, you know, that the allegations there was a chemical attack were without basis in reality. And that of course talks to the version of events the Russians are sticking to, not just that they support their Syrian ally but they deny their Syrian ally carried out any kind of chemical weapons attack, instead saying that the deaths that were witnessed and the chemical poisoning that was witnessed was as a result of rebel chemical munitions being destroyed by a Syrian air force air strike on a storage facility. And so, you know, a heated exchange. Different opinions obviously between these two figures, these two Foreign minister figures from Russia and the United States. And that conversation is going to continue next week when Rex Tillerson, as you mentioned, comes to Moscow for his first visit as secretary of State and we'll continue that conversation with Sergey Lavrov and meet the Russian President Vladimir Putin as well.</s>CABRERA: And Ryan, I want to bring you in, has the White House sent any more messages to Syria or Russia today?</s>RYAN NOBLES, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Not specifically other than that conversation with Lavrov and Tillerson, Ana, but the public messaging on this issue is certainly walking a pretty fine line. I was in a briefing with Mitch McConnell who is the Senate majority leader and ally of the Trump administration, somebody that's been in close contact with the White House during this strike, and he said it was his impression that this was a one-time thing, that it was just designed to try and send a message about the use of chemical weapons and that we shouldn't expect much more. But then you played that bit of sound from Nikki Haley that's going to appear tomorrow on "STATE OF THE UNION" where she says that the president is prepared to do more in the event that Syria does not change their tactics there in the country. So the White House wants to make it clear that they don't want to have to do more if they don't have to but they also want to make it clear to the Assad regime that they're not afraid to if it comes to that point.</s>CABRERA: All right. Ryan Nobles, Matthew Chance, our thanks to both of you. I want to bring in our panel now joining me. CNN global affairs analyst and Reuters national security investigations editor David Rohde, CNN military analyst and retired Air Force colonel Cedric Leighton, and our intelligence and security analyst, former CIA operative, Bob Baer. First I want you to hear more of Jake Tapper's revealing interview with U.S. ambassador to the U.N., Nikki Haley. Let's watch.</s>JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Is regime change in Syria now the official policy of the United States?</s>HALEY: So there's multiple priorities. It's getting Assad out is not the only priority. And so what we're trying to do is obviously defeat ISIS. Secondly, we don't see a peaceful Syria with Assad in there. Thirdly, get the Iranian influence out. And then finally move toward a political solution because at the end of the day this is a complicated situation. There are no easy answers and a political solution is going to have to happen but we know that it is not going to be -- there's not any sort of option where a political solution is going to happen with Assad at the head of the regime. It just -- if you look at his actions, if you look at the situation it's going to be hard to see a government that's peaceful and stable with Assad.</s>TRUMP: Well, of course it's hard to but is it the position of the Trump administration that he cannot be ruler of Syria anymore, regime change is the policy?</s>HALEY: Well, regime change is something that we think is going to happen because at all of the parties are going to see that Assad is not the leader that needs to be taking place for Syria.</s>CABRERA: Now, Bob, I want to come to you first. Candidate Trump said again and again removing Assad was not his number one priority. Trump even suggested the U.S. fight ISIS with Assad. So how confident are you that President Trump will stick with this apparently new position on Syria now?</s>ROBERT BAER, CNN INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY ANALYST: Well, it seems to me a big shift here, this attacking Syria. We've never done that before in Syria's history, period. I mean, we've always avoided that country. There is an ethnic sectarian divisions there. We were always afraid to touch. This goes back to World War II, in fact. People -- just the French could never control that country. And, again, I go back to the fact that Assad -- Bashar al-Assad is merely a spokesman for the Alawite minority. You can remove him today and you might get somebody that's much worse. Much more ready to use chemical weapons. I don't think this administration, the Trump administration, understands the complexity of Syria. And you know, we are wandering into a quagmire here just enormous consequences with Iran and Russia on the ground. This is not going well.</s>CABRERA: Colonel Leighton, the U.S. has opened this door with those U.S. airstrikes. Do you see any downside to having launched those strikes?</s>COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, there are certainly downsides to it. I mean, the idea that you can act with force and do it in a very decisive fashion is something that's very attractive to most presidents, but there are possible downsides in that it could, if things go wrong, it could definitely galvanize the Syrian government against us and it basically already has. What's worse is if something had happened on the civilian side, if we had killed innocent civilians as part of this then, of course, the Syrian population, even those opposed to Assad, would have been against us. And as things ramp up, that is one of the big risks that could happen is that you get civilian casualties, unintended civilian casualties, and that could definitely be a downside. Other downsides would include, you know, some type of conflict with Iranian forces in Syria and Russian forces in Syria, so there are absolutely potential pitfalls here.</s>CABRERA: Right. It's not just about Syria but about some of these other countries that you just mentioned, Russia and Iran, who are also backing Syria. David, at what point do you think President Trump needs to get Congress to sign off on some kind of military action in Syria?</s>DAVID ROHDE, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, I think if there are more strikes, you know, and it continued over a long period, you know, that would be the key. And one of the things that Ambassador Haley mentioned that struck me with that phrase about getting rid of Iranian influence in Syria, I agreed with both the other guests. I mean, it's really about the Alawite minority and Iran has backed them and sort of saved them with more ground forces than any other country. Iranian support has been much more important to Assad and the Alawites than the Russian support. That's a very ambitious goal that she mentioned. She may have misspoke. I don't want to overread it. But, you know -- so what is the policy going to be here? Is it to stop chemical weapons attacks? If it is, maybe this one strike has set a precedent. Is it to push Assad out and Iran out, that's much more difficult to do and much more complicated.</s>CABRERA: As far as any retaliation from those missile strikes that the U.S. has already launched, it seems like there's been a lot of rhetoric, a lot of vocal pushback from people like the Russian Defense minister there that we know spoke today to Rex Tillerson, but how do you see the dynamics between the U.S. and Russia in light of the action the U.S. took, Bob?</s>BAER: Right now the Russians are concerned. I mean, the Russians do not want to get into a fight with us in Syria. We have to deconflict the airspace there. There's a lot of American flights going east of the Euphrates. You know, at any time just like the Turks shut down a Russian airplane, we could, too. And that's the major concern. And that should be a concern at this point is we have to continue talking to the Russians. There's still an open channel with the Russians but the cooperation is not there. And the Russians right now, I do not see Putin in a position to withdraw, to stand out in the Assad regime nor will the Iranians. And don't forget there's the sheer precedent that they are in control of Iraq, Syria and Lebanon. We are up against some formidable foes here and I agree with David, you know, talking about getting the Iranians out of Syria is a nonstarter. It's the road to conflict so, again, I'm very concerned.</s>CABRERA: So, David, does the U.S. have any leverage over Russia or Iran in this situation?</s>ROHDE: The only sort of thing it could do is to restart the CIA training program that was fairly effective and actually the Russians came in because, you know, the so-called moderate rebels were making gains against the Assad regime. But the Russians were -- you know, were quickly able to use airpower with Iranian support on the ground and most importantly Hezbollah fighters came in as well to help Assad. So you only win conflicts with force on the ground having, you know, willing to put in ground troops and have them die in large numbers. Iran is willing to do that. Hezbollah is willing to do that. Russia has risked its pilots. So is the U.S. ready to arm proxy force for many months and years to come to win this, you know, effort in Syria? That's the big question.</s>CABRERA: Colonel, do you agree with that? I mean, does the U.S. need to put U.S. boots on the ground in Syria or is there another option if the U.S. wants to have a real impact on that country?</s>LEIGHTON: Well, I think, Ana, if we want to effect regime change very quickly then the only way to do that is to put boots on the ground but having said that I think regime change comes about quickly may not necessarily be in our best interests and the best solutions are usually the diplomatic solutions, the solutions that would allow us to achieve some kind of accommodation with the Iranians and with the Russians that would allow for some kind of transfer to somebody else, but that somebody else would have to be agreeable to us in a way that would allow us to not necessarily control them directly but would somehow prevent them from using chemical weapons against their own people. I think if we could achieve something like that, that could be very different but that is perhaps a very idealistic position.</s>CABRERA: David, back to the American appetite for more involvement in that region. Do you think Republicans like Senate majority leader Mitch McConnell would stick with Trump if he tries to go deeper into Syria?</s>ROHDE: I think it depends on, you know, I think ground forces -- U.S. ground forces will be like a red line that many Republicans wouldn't support, but there is the -- you know, the one possibility here is where there's a use of military force to, you know, hopefully bring about a diplomatic solution. I'm not sure that would work in Syria. This would be possibly, you know, increasing this effort to arm the Syrian opposition, but your goal should be not to win a military conflict, not to drive Assad out or for the Iranians out completely. It would be just a way to pressure them militarily to bring them to the table. I'm not sure that would even work. But that's a much more kind of focused, limited effort than, again, as Ambassador Haley said, removing the Iranian influence in Syria. That will never happen. At best there could be some sort of compromise.</s>CABRERA: All right, David Rohde and Colonel Cedric Leighton, as well as Bob Baer, thank you all for staying with us this evening. A quick programming note, you can catch Jake Tapper's full interview with U.N. ambassador Nikki Haley tomorrow morning on "STATE OF THE UNION" right here on CNN at 9:00 a.m. Eastern and Pacific. Coming up, new details about tensions in President Trump's inner circle. The message the president had for his chief strategist Steve Bannon and his son-in-law Jared Kushner.