Some Trump Allies Defend Him as Many Republicans Stay Silent
DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, there's no question he is. He seems to be just unspooled, rambling around, travelling around the Ukraine fumbling and bumbling through everything that he does and says. You know, people are wondering about whether Giuliani is compos mentis, does he have his wits about him? Or is he kind of, you know -- his egotism is so overweening that he's just wanting TV time and doing anything that Donald Trump says for him to do. I'll be interested to see if the American Bar Association starts questioning what Giuliani's doing, which is charging people, Americans like the Bidens, using Ukraine in this sort of weird way. I've never seen a lawyer behave in this fashion at the behest of a U.S. President.</s>TAPPER: Carl, let's talk about the abuse of power allegations against President Trump and against President Nixon. Just on the issue of abuse of power, on this issue having to do with Ukraine, how did the two -- how does President Trump stand up when it comes to President Nixon?</s>CARL BERNSTEIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, both Presidents wanted to undermine the very basis of American democracy which are free elections. In Nixon's case, it was a campaign of political espionage and sabotage intended to get the Democrats to nominate George McGovern, his weakest possible opponent as opposed to his strongest opponent who would have been Senator Edward Musky of Maine who was cripple by this political espionage and sabotage. Just as and what Nixon did not do was involve a foreign power in the attempt to undermine American democracy and free elections, whereas Trump has involved several foreign powers to try and come up with dirt on the strongest or the person he perceives, Trump, as strongest as an opponent to him, Biden. And through this patently unlawful, unconstitutional, corrupt behavior. And if Republicans, and here's the big difference between Watergate and what we're seeing now. If Republicans are willing to go along with this, it is going to change our history. Because Republicans became the heroes in Watergate who finally said, we cannot tolerate a corrupt President who undermines our electoral system and this is far worse than just undermining the electoral system given the rhetoric and what we've seen of the President's unraveling in the last week or two.</s>TAPPER: Doug, and what do you think about that in terms of how much Republicans on Capitol Hill are willing to tolerate? We've seen some of the President's most loyal defenders, the Lindsey Grahams and Jim Jordans out there supporting him. But really a lot of them have just been holding their tongues. I don't know where we are, vis-a-vis this scandal versus Watergate, but do you see any difference between how Republicans are acting?</s>BRINKLEY: Yes, I do. During Watergate eventually you got Republicans whether it was Barry Goldwater or Howard Baker and others standing up to the power of Nixon saying that he lied. And we also in Nixon years had a State Department with William P. Rogers and Henry Kissinger. For whatever problems they might have they wouldn't have damaged the State Department as an institution and become a henchman for the President. I'm afraid that's what Mike Pompeo did by going to the press and lying that he wasn't on the phone call with the Ukrainian President, he is no longer credible in the public arena as Secretary of State.</s>TAPPER: OK. That phrase from that era, credibility gap is coming into play here as well.</s>BRINKLEY: Yes.</s>TAPPER: Douglas Brinkley and Carl Bernstein, thank you so much for your time and expertise. Appreciate it. For Attorney General Barr, the development that he might mean he will need to recuse himself. Our legal experts weigh in next. Stay with us.