Dozens Killed in Istanbul Airport Attack; Imagine a World.
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN HOST (voice-over): Tonight: a day of mourning in Turkey after a suicide bombing at Istanbul's Ataturk Airport, killing at least 41 people. The country's prime minister blames ISIS. So how can their terror be stopped? Also ahead: a disastrous outcome, the deputy first minister of Northern Ireland on Brexit and why he is calling for a united Ireland.</s>MARTIN MCGUINNESS, IRISH DEPUTY FIRST MINISTER: I think there is a considerable amount of anger across the community in the north of Ireland at the decision that had been made mostly by people in England to effectively drag us out of the European Union.</s>AMANPOUR: Good evening, everyone, and welcome to the program. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. Turkey is in mourning again after three suicide bombers with guns attacked Istanbul's Ataturk Airport, the busiest one in the country; 41 people are dead and hundreds more are injured. Surveillance cameras captured disturbing video like this one, showing the terrifying moment when one bomber blew himself up. Turkish officials say signs point to ISIS and U.S. President Barack Obama reacted by vowing to defeat the extremist group.</s>BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's an indication of how little these vicious organizations have to offer, that, beyond killing innocents, they are continually losing ground, unable to govern those areas that they have taken over, that they are going to be defeated in Syria; they're going to be defeated in Iraq. They are going to be on the run, wherever they hide. And we will not rest.</s>AMANPOUR: But they're still a force. And we're going now to our Nima Elbagir at Ataturk Airport. Nima, can I just first start by asking you, you were there for the Brussels attack, too. And there are a lot of similarities in terms of the target, in terms of how the terrorists got to the airport.</s>NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, a chilling similarity that is the exact same M.O. You had gunmen wearing suicide vests, targeting a vulnerable area of congregation just before the security parameter began. So they start a little bit further back from us but they managed to shoot their way after detonating that first explosive through the sliding doors, where you can see -- this is where the security line begins. This is where the security check-in begins. So very similarly to the way that those -- also three attackers in Brussels forced their way in; one of them was even wearing a coat which sparked the suspicions of authorities. And you'll remember the infamous man in the white coat from the CCTV pictures. Then, when they went in, again, a very sophisticated attack. They used the mayhem created by that first detonation to move further and deeper into the airport, where there were more vulnerable congregations of people. And just the stories we've been hearing, Christiane, they bring back so many of those awful, awful memories. One woman described the havoc that was wrought by the falling shattered ceiling tiles and having to slip and slide on blood-soaked tiles. Again, exactly what we heard in Brussels. What we're hearing from intelligence officials is that mirroring, they believe, is intentional and that's why -- that's one of the main reasons they think that this bears all the hallmarks of</s>ISIS. AMANPOUR: And Nima and, yet, you have been watching them clear up. The airport is working again. It's quite different in sort of the aftermath, right?</s>ELBAGIR: Yes. This was a very quick cleanup. And this is a very different airport. It is much more secure than Brussels. And the security parameter is much further out. So this was a lot more difficult and yet a lot more successful than what they managed to do in Brussels. But you have seen people stream behind me. This doesn't just feel like a normal day in the life of an airport. This feels like a very busy, very normal airport. And the sad reality is, Istanbul has reeled from so many terror attacks in the last few months that they have unfortunately become expert almost in patching back those ragged edges of --</s>ELBAGIR: -- normality. And it is also politically intentional. Erdogan, President Erdogan, after every attack, wants to show the Turkish public and the wider world, OK, this happened; but we are not on our knees, we're getting our lives together, we are fighting back. And fighting back here in Turkey today means normality -- Christiane.</s>AMANPOUR: Do you have any idea how they managed to get through in a taxi? Apparently the guy was arrested and questioned, the taxi driver. But there is a lot of security. Any clues as to how they managed to get through?</s>ELBAGIR: Well, this was the weaker end of the parameter. And these are the questions that are now being asked, how wide does that security parameter in airports have to start? Because you drive through and, at the initial checkpoint, cars are only stopped if they trigger intense suspicion. And this car, these individuals, clearly didn't, sadly, unfortunately. It's only when you get past the dropoff point which is where they detonated the first explosive, then you finally come to a solid security parameter. They did their homework, Christiane. Everyone I've spoken to calls this an incredibly sophisticated attack.</s>AMANPOUR: Well, it seems so. And a huge loss of life. Nima, thank you from Ataturk Airport there in Istanbul. And of course, it was the 14th attack in recent months in Turkey. And they've had a huge spate of terrorist attacks. What does it say about security? How will the Turkish state react? Joining me now from Istanbul is Akin Unver. He's the assistant professor of international relations at Kadir Has University.</s>AMANPOUR: Mr. Unver, welcome to the program. First and foremost, the security, that's a problem. People there with guns. They came in in a taxi and they managed to get through at a time when we know that these terrorists are threatening airports.</s>AKIN UNVER, KADIR HAS UNIVERSITY: Yes, exactly. And I think this is quite problematic in terms of Ataturk Airport being one of the most secure airports in the world. First, you have an initial pre-check-in security measure screening. Then you have another one after the check-in. And sometimes with flights to the United States or United Kingdom you have a third layer of security, another screening before boarding. And in a lot of times, this actually frustrates a lot of people and people actually say that this is too much security. Now to the best of my knowledge, the only airport in the world which has a fourth layer of security is Ben-Gurion airport, which essentially monitors cars. There is a pre-entry into the airport screening. Other than that, if this kind of an attack took place in Europe, for example, I'm afraid the casualties would have been much higher.</s>AMANPOUR: Ben-Gurion, of course, is the airport in Tel Aviv in Israel. You say you think the casualties would have been much higher had it been elsewhere and you've tweeted, though, about this one. "Victims, almost all Muslims. Given this was a planned attack, attackers didn't even go for Western Europeans." Tell me what you got from that.</s>UNVER: Basically, in order to carry out this attack you have to monitor everything quite carefully. And a lot of analysts are actually, sadly, stating that a lot of ISIS members, you know, foreign fighters who flew in from abroad, they actually know Ataturk Airport quite well because they have been there a lot of times. So the attack suggests that this was actually planned, studied for quite a while. They knew which way they had to go in from, they knew which way to run, essentially. They knew what kind of security existed at which part of the airport. And this basically suggests that they knew what kind of a sociology, what kind of a group they were attacking against. And --</s>UNVER: That's a very good question. Any answer to that would be highly speculative at that point.</s>AMANPOUR: OK.</s>UNVER: But when you look at the list of the deceased, there is only one Ukrainian. Otherwise, all of the dead people are all Muslims.</s>AMANPOUR: So how is the Turkish state going to react, do you think? Because two things, the prime minister has blamed ISIS, even though there has not been a claim of responsibility as far as we know yet. And also the prime minister gave a press conference not long ago, in which he said, regardless of who it was, ISIS or PKK, there shouldn't be any discrimination because there is no such thing as a good or bad terrorist. Where do you think the --</s>AMANPOUR: -- government is coming down on who is to blame and how will they react?</s>UNVER: I think they're first studying attack types. There is a particular attack type specific to the PKK and another attack type specific to the ISIS. Both groups use suicide bombers in different ways. And basically, the use of machine guns, killing people and detonating oneself when you basically have no other choice, looks more ISIS than the PKK at this point. But the prime minister himself told that we need about two days to properly confirm. Essentially the literature on terrorism study actually says that terrorist organizations don't really claim attacks if there is substantial civilian casualties because civilian casualty is a very sensitive issue. And when there is a substantial civilian casualty then there is higher tendency to not claim those attacks. So at this point, this is the only, you know, measure that we have. And based on what kind of investigation that there is going to go in the next two days and if there is ISIS, then we can expect more and more concrete Turkish response against</s>ISIS. AMANPOUR: Well, interesting. First of all, the CIA in the last couple of seconds has come in and said it bears all the hallmarks of ISIS. Really interesting that you say ISIS people really know this airport because that airport is the gateway from the West and elsewhere into Syria. Turkey has been reluctant to join the fight against ISIS because it wants to go after Assad as well. So what happens? Does anything change now in terms of the Turkish response?</s>UNVER: I do think that there is going to be a change because one of the reasons why previous prime minister Ahmet Davutoglu was forced to end his tenure was because of the foreign policy identity that was associated with him. Now apparently Turkey wants to open a new chapter in its foreign policy and fundamentally change things. This may mean that Turkey would drop its insistence on regime change in Syria and, instead, focus on more pressing issues domestically, such as a very large number of ISIS cells or what to do with the Kurds in the southeast. So I think there is a change in focus right now, away from foreign policy adventures and more into maintaining security and order within.</s>AMANPOUR: Akin Unver, thank you very much. And you raise that point at a time when President Erdogan is reestablishing relationships with President Putin. And obviously he has his own views about the way things are in Syria. Mr. Unver, thank you very much indeed for joining us. And coming up, the U.K.'s continuing crisis: first Scotland, now Northern Ireland. It voted firmly to stay in the E.U. So will it become another part of the United Kingdom to want a separation? I speak to Sinn Fein's Martin McGuinness about an Ireland with one foot in and one foot out of the European Union. That's after a break.