Barr: Didn't Use the Term Spying in a "Pejorative" Way.
TAPPER: Lawmakers are just now arriving for round two of the testimony for Attorney General Bill Barr. Listen to this exchange with Rhode Island Senator Sheldon Whitehouse on Barr's previous use in previous testimony of the word spying.</s>SEN. SHELDON WHITEHOUSE (D-RI): Have you ever referred to authorized department investigative activities officially or publically as spying? I'm not asking for private conversation or comments.</s>BARR: I'm not going to abjure the use of the word spying. I think -- you know, my first job was in CIA and I don't think the word spying has any pejorative of connotation at all. To me, the question is always whether or not it's authorized and adequately predicated spying. I think spying is a good English word that in fact doesn't have synonyms because it is the broadest word incorporating all forms of covert intelligence collection. So I'm not going to back off the word spying except I will say -- I'm not suggesting any pejorative and I use it frequently as the media.</s>WHITEHOUSE: When did you decide to use it, was it off the cuff in that hearing that day or did you go into that hearing intending to use the word?</s>BARR: It was actually off the cuff, to tell you the truth.</s>BLITZER: All right, let's bring in our CNN law enforcement analyst, the former FBI supervisory special agent Josh Campbell. You know, Josh, the whole issue of spying, the allegation was that they were officials, sort of deep state officials as a lot of the critics call them who were inside the FBI, your former agency, inside other parts of the U.S. Government who were spying on the Trump campaign during the election.</s>JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes. It's interesting to hear the attorney general doubled and tripled down on the use of that word because if you talk to anyone inside the Justice Department or the FBI who I've talked to many, they were very much perplexed by the use of that term. Because I will agree with the attorney general that it is a good English word but within the halls of the Justice Department and the FBI it's only used to refer to what foreign governments do to us for example. When you're trying to stop spies, stop foreign threats. So, to hear that used by a lawyer is very curious. I also think it's important to note that, you know, there has been this kind of back and forth about whether the Congress or others should be looking into the actions of the FBI during that election. And I think that they should. And a democracy law enforcement can't just say trust us, they have to obviously have that oversight. And I talked to people who actually welcome it and say, look, this -- you know, we want to be vindicated here, we want to be reviewed. The problem is that there's a question as to whether Bob -- Bill Barr is the person to do that review. He appears conflicted based on the fact that he appears to be running interference for the president whether willingly or unwillingly. He misled the American people on the nature of the Mueller report. So, people inside the Justice Department and the FBI, they want to be looked at. The question is should he be the one leading that effort.</s>TAPPER: And Josh, one of the other questions you heard a lot of Republican senators bring up questions about the investigation into Hillary Clinton and Peter Strzok and Lisa Page and their text messages in which they said rather nasty things about then-candidate Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton destroying more than 30,000 e-mails, et cetera. Is that all currently being reviewed by the inspector general of the FBI at the Justice Department?</s>CAMPBELL: So the FB -- the inspector general already went back and looked at the FBI's actions as related to Hillary Clinton's e-mails. They have put out this voluminous report in which they actually -- it's a scathing rebuke of people like, as you mentioned who were texting each other. And, you know, again, I talked to people inside the Justice Department and the FBI who think that those two especially did great harm to the agency and the reputation. The question is, did they actually impact an investigation? And I think that's where the president and his allies and Senator Graham, for example, to try to conflate the two that you had bad behavior that the attorney general has looked at. Those two people are no longer in the department. And trying to conflate that with the FBI getting to some kind of political motivation and so they were out to get President Trump. Which I have said this before, I'll say it again if there's repeating that if you believe this conspiracy theory that there was this deep state inside the FBI trying to bring down Donald Trump, why didn't anyone know about it in the public before they went to the ballot box? The FBI kept that investigation secret as they do with most and conducted their work and then -- you know, eventually came and announced that it was under investigation. And when the Justice Department authorized that announcement but at the time, they didn't announce that because they were focussed on the work, not trying to bring down Donald Trump.</s>TAPPER: All right, Josh Campbell, thanks so much.</s>BLITZER: You know, I was going to just point out that you see the chairman Lindsey Graham is about to gavel this round two into the session. Bill Barr, the attorney general is in the seat. They always give the photographers a chance to take some pictures, Jake, as you and I know having covered these hearings many times over the year. But by my count, there are still about 14 senators who will each have seven minutes to ask questions.</s>TAPPER: And three of those senators are Democratic presidential candidates, Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota, Kamala Harris of California, and Cory Booker of New Jersey, the third one. And obviously, we expect that they will take advantage of the opportunity to have a national stage when they are running for president to make points that are probably broader than ones that have to do with this specific hearing. Pamela Brown, let me ask you, what are you waiting to hear resolved or asked at this hearing in the remaining hours?</s>BROWN: Gosh, there is a lot. But I am not so optimistic that we're going to hear it given how the attorney general hasn't been fully forthcoming it appears or has been hairsplitting as we've said. But I would like to --</s>BLITZER: Hold on a moment.</s>TAPPER: Sorry to interrupt, we're going to listen into the hearing.</s>SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): -- is Republican Senator Kennedy.</s>SEN. JOHN KENNEDY (R-LA): Thank you, Mr. Chairman.</s>GRAHAM: Oh yes, something you wanted to say, Mr. Attorney General about one of your statements?</s>BARR: Just briefly, Mr. Chairman. Senator Cornyn asked me about defensive briefings before and as I said there were different kinds of them. And I was referring to the kind where you are told of a specific -- you're a specific target. And I have been told at the break that a lesser kind of briefing, a security briefing that generally discusses, you know, general threats apparently was given to the campaign in August.</s>GRAHAM: Thank you. Senator Kennedy?</s>KENNEDY: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thanks to my colleagues for letting me go out of order. I promise to be as brief as possible. Mr. Chairman, thank you -- or Mr. -- or general, thanks for coming today. Humans have the universal need I think to be listened to, to be understood and to be validated. I think we all share that. I have listened to the Mueller team, I validate them. But I want to be sure I understand them. Has Mr. Mueller or his team changed their conclusions?</s>BARR: You mean during the course of the investigation?</s>KENNEDY: No, today. It's clear at least according to press reports, excuse me, general, that at one point, the Mueller team was unhappy. I think it had to do with your letter. What matters to me is -- and I'll get to this in a moment, I want to know first, has the Mueller team changed its mind on its conclusions?</s>BARR: Its conclusions as to what?</s>KENNEDY: As to collusion conspiracy and conspiracy.</s>BARR: Not that I'm aware of.</s>KENNEDY: So the decision not to bring an indictment against the president for collusion conspiracy with Russia has not changed?</s>BARR: No, it hasn't.</s>KENNEDY: And the conclusion not to bring an indictment against the president for obstruction of justice has not changed?</s>BARR: No.</s>KENNEDY: OK. I take it from your testimony that the Mueller team was unhappy when you received the letter from Mr. Mueller.