Rep. Eric Swalwell (D-CA) is Interviewed about Russia and Iran Interference
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back. The director of national intelligence, John Ratcliffe, says that Iran and Russia are attempting to interfere in the election. He says both countries have, and this is key, obtained U.S. voter registration information with Iran posing as the far right group Proud Boys to send intimidating e-mails to Democratic voters. Joining me now is California Congressman Eric Swalwell. He serves on the House Intel and Judiciary Committees. Congressman, thanks for taking the time this morning.</s>REP. ERIC SWALWELL (D-CA): Of course, Jim. Thanks for having me back.</s>SCIUTTO: Now, I know you've been briefed repeatedly on intelligence regarding foreign threats to this election. A headline here seems to me, beyond the politics, is that both Iran and Russia have obtained voter information. To -- without getting into classified information, is this public voter information that they've accessed or have they hacked things that are private?</s>SWALWELL: Well, you know, following what was said yesterday, you know, obtaining any voter information is concerning. Still trying to learn more and hoping to get briefed in the next 24 hours on this, Jim. We know that Russia, you know, sought to do this in 2016. I'm concerned, though, that the DNI, the director of national intelligence, Ratcliffe, continues to conflate Iran's scope, intent, preferences and capabilities with Russia. Russia had done this before. They had a preference to tear down Hillary Clinton and help Donald Trump. We know right now they have a preference to help Donald Trump and to tear down Joe Biden and that they're going to continue to do that. So to put them in the same league would be like putting a serial killer and a pickpocket on "America's Most Wanted." It just -- it's a different league that they are in.</s>SCIUTTO: On the issue of how far a Russia might go in this election, or an Iran or a China, in 2016 the nightmare scenario was not just disinformation, right --</s>SWALWELL: Right.</s>SCIUTTO: But accessing actual voting systems, whether it be registration or vote counting.</s>SWALWELL: Right.</s>SCIUTTO: What is your level of concern, based on the intelligence you've seen, that Russia or another foreign actor will take that step and, you know -- and it doesn't have to be nationally, right, it could just be in a few targeted counties here and there.</s>SWALWELL: Well, we know that a few targeted counties here and there, Jim, could make the difference.</s>SCIUTTO: Yes.</s>SWALWELL: And we know 60,000 votes in three states last time made the difference. And so what we have to be mindful of as voters is, the best thing we can do to outvote Russia is to show up ourselves with our feet at the polls. And so what we're encouraging folks to do is to not let voter, you know, interference by Russia stop us from achieving the result of showing up. We'll sort this out in a Biden administration. We'll hold Russia accountable. But right now the best thing we can do is to just vote with our feet, show up and make sure that Russia does not have, you know, a bigger impact on this election.</s>SCIUTTO: I get that, but are -- but are -- is there a concern that Russia will take a step it didn't take on 2016, which is mess with vote counting, try to stop people from being allowed to vote, right, by messing with voter registration rolls?</s>SWALWELL: Yes, of course, that is still a concern. But if you don't have a president whose giving directives to the intelligence community to stop that, the best thing we can do is to encourage people to show up and vote because that could be the antidote to it, Jim. But they are interfering right now. They are laundering information through Congress. You know, this Andre Durkosh (ph) character who's been working with the president's lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, has had manufactured dirt on the vice president that he's been able to get Senator Ron Johnson to use in his committee hearings. So they're still actively trying to do that. I think the country's inoculated that -- inoculated against that in a sense that the president was impeached for trying to do this. But Russia's not going to stop trying to help Donald Trump.</s>SCIUTTO: We -- former Deputy FBI Director Andrew McCabe, last night, said that even in the midst of the politics or alleged politics of the statements last night, that there is a positive note here that shows the intelligence community, agencies like the DHS and the FBI forward leaning on foreign interference in this election. There's a lot of concern among our viewers, understandably, that that kind of interference might make their vote not count. What level of concern should they have or should they be confident that, listen, even if the president's not talking about this, the FBI, the DHS has their back.</s>SWALWELL: Well, the president is the one behind the steering wheel with his, you know, hand on the pedal and -- or his foot on the pedal and the brakes and he steers this country and people may be in the car pointing to the president saying, don't go in that direction or go in this direction. But if he doesn't listen to them, he could take our democracy off a cliff. And so you could have the best FBI agents on this task, but if the president is not giving directives, the president is not telling Vladimir Putin, stop doing this. If he's not putting tough sanctions on Russia and having our allies do the same, then you're going to have uncertainty. And Russia looks at this president and they have a green light. And so they're going to continue to press against us. And that's why, again, we just have to outvote Russia and entrust that a new administration is going to make sure our democracy always belongs to us. So it's going to be a bumpy ride, Jim, but voter turnout is the best way to stop this.</s>SCIUTTO: Final question. "The Washington Post" is reporting that the president, his advisers, have repeatedly discussed firing the FBI Director, Christopher Wray, for, among other things, not acting on this demand that the FBI investigate Joe Biden and his son, Hunter Biden, before the election in 12 days' time. Do you believe the FBI director's job is in jeopardy and what would your reaction be to that?</s>SWALWELL: I hope not. The FBI director has spoken truth to power. This president knows that in the last election, you know, while he was down in the polls, ten days before, he did get assistance from the FBI reopening an investigation. So I can see why he would want that. But the best thing we can do in a new administration --</s>SCIUTTO: Yes.</s>SWALWELL: Post-Donald Trump is to really increase the independence of the Department of Justice so no president can ever seek to abuse it the way Donald Trump</s>SCIUTTO: Congressman Swalwell, thanks for joining us this morning.</s>SWALWELL: My pleasure. Thanks, Jim.</s>HARLOW: Well, the president's former White House chief strategist is pushing a conspiracy theory about the origins of COVID-19, but, again, it's just not true. The CNN investigation into that is next.