Protesters, Police Clash in Ferguson; Community Meets After 12- Year-Old Killed; 49 Million People Traveling This Weekend
CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: If you're just joining us, we're edging toward 7:00 o'clock in just about 15 seconds. Welcome. I'm Christi Paul.</s>VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Victor Blackwell. Coming up on it. We've got an update from Fergsuson, because there were days of calm.</s>PAUL: There were.</s>BLACKWELL: There were.</s>PAUL: Yes, there were, at one point. Fresh clashes, though, did erupt overnight outside the police station specifically. We know of at least 15 people were arrested as demonstrators and officers faced off over that fatal police shooting of Michael Brown.</s>BLACKWELL: And not just in Ferguson, there was more unrest across the nation. Let's take you to Seattle where police used pepper spray as some demonstrators threw flairs there. And at malls, arrests were reported as protesters tried to disrupt Black Friday sales.</s>PAUL: And back in Missouri, Governor Jay Nixon announced he is calling back lawmakers to figure out how they can pay for state patrols in Ferguson.</s>BLACKWELL: And on Monday, Attorney General Eric Holder will be in Atlanta, kicking off a series of meetings focused on race and policing in minority communities.</s>PAUL: Stephanie Elam is in Ferguson this morning. Stephanie, after what happened last flight, I'm wondering how things look there right now.</s>STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A lot calmer than what we saw last night, Christi. Good morning to you both.</s>PAUL: Good morning.</s>ELAM: It's what we've been seeing here in Ferguson. What you see in the morning, throughout the day, it seems calm. And then at night, then you may have some protesters show up. Sometimes, it's full of people, some nights, a lot more as you're seeing right now. We know those 15 people were arrested. But overall, it was not violent. So, a change of what we saw perhaps earlier in the week, a very different tone. But these protests continue, not just here in Ferguson, but throughout the St. Louis area. And as you were saying, throughout the country, we saw a small group of people protesting down by the Justice Center yesterday, wanting to go out there and protest. They wanted to have a moment of silence on private property. So, police shooed them away from there. We also saw in the mall, people were gathering and protesting inside the galleria mall here in St. Louis yesterday. And they were expecting this. There was a police presence there that was ready if protesters upset the stores. The stores did temporarily close, but they did reopen, Victor and Christi.</s>PAUL: So, talk to us about this event, I understand it, the NAACP picking off what is a powerful event today.</s>ELAM: Right, it's seven days long. They're calling it the journey for justice. And the plan is to begin marching out of the Canfield Green apartment which is where Mike Brown died here in Ferguson. And they are going to march 120 miles to the Missouri governor's mansion in Jefferson City. The plan there is to bring focus to what has happened here in Ferguson and ask that the leadership of the Ferguson police department be changed. They want the chief to step down. It's a renewed call for Chief Jackson to be removed from his position. And they also want there to be reform -- actual reform to find out how police interact with the community that they're serving. And they're saying it's not focusing on here in Ferguson but on the relationship nationwide. And as you can see, it's a tone that has resonated throughout the country, and not just the country because you also saw those protesters this week, 5,000 of them in London, taking to the streets there, too, talking about Mike Brown. But it's something resonating with people, this relationship with police and people in the community. And that is something that continues to be the drum beat and something that these protesters keep asking for, Victor and Christi.</s>BLACKWELL: All right. Stephanie Elam in Ferguson, Missouri, for us live this morning. Thank you so much.</s>PAUL: Thanks, Stephanie. We do want to turn to Cleveland now, and here's why, because there's a story similar to Ferguson that's getting a very decidedly different response.</s>BLACKWELL: Yes, look at this. This was last night. You saw -- you look at Ferguson on the left. On the right, this is Cleveland where some people are gathered at a forum on gun violence and police relations. This is after a shooting of a 12-year-old boy by officers who thought that an air soft gun that shoots BBs, little pellets, 6 millimeter pellets, that he was holding was real. Now, Tamir Rice, that's the boy's name, he died the next day. CNN's Rosa Flores joins us now. Rosa, again, a decidedly different response there. Tell us what came out of this meeting there in Cleveland?</s>ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, it's such a tragic and painful time for the family, of course. Now, their response is really resonating with some observers because it's created a constructive conversation, a dialogue of sort between the police and the community. Now, I want you to take a listen to a gathering at a church in Cleveland yesterday, you're going to see how church members first voiced their grief and then also applaud the police.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a hate crime that hurts into my heart. I have to pull it back. I couldn't take it.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know that there is a great deal of unrest in the community and, God, that's why we call upon you, because you are a God that can make things better.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've been a cop (ph) for almost 30 years and I never had to shoot anybody. And I've been out there.</s>FLORES: Now, you heard those applause there. It's a conversation triggered by the death of Tamir Rice, a 12-year-old who was shot and killed by police. The surveillance video shows the boy walking around, sometimes brandishing the gun, sometimes pointing it at people. Now, some of those people ended up calling 911, telling dispatchers about a black male, probably a juvenile, who was pointing a pistol and adding that it could be fake, that the pistol could be fake. Now, two officers respond, the video shows that within two seconds upon arrival, the 12-year-old is shot. The police saying that the officers asked the boy to show his hands three times before shooting. The boy died a day later. It turns out that gun was fake. It was actual a toy. All the details, of course, still under investigation. And the two officers involved are on leave. But again, Christi and victor, what resonates here, the request from the parent for constructive dialogue and how the community is honoring that request -- Christi and Victor.</s>PAUL: Very good point.</s>BLACKWELL: All right. Rosa Flores for us this morning -- Rosa, thank you. Let's talk about this. So many legal questions here, we've got HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson and CNN commentator Mel Robbins with us to kind of sort through this. Good to have both of you this morning.</s>JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning, Victor. Good morning, Christi.</s>MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR: Great to see you.</s>PAUL: Good morning.</s>BLACKWELL: We just showed that video, we're going to show it again, it was released this week, at the moments that police shot Tamir. And again, we're going to warn people at home that is disturbing. I'm not going to say you may find it disturbing.</s>PAUL: It is.</s>BLACKWELL: A child is shot. So, it is disturbing. You can see the car pulls up, within two seconds, Tamir Rice is down. The deputy chief says the officer in the passenger seat yelled for him to show his hands, show his hands, show his hands. But he would have had to have said it that quickly and at that speed to get it out at two seconds before he was shot. Let's start it at one when you look at this, that's so close to pull up next to this kid. Obviously, there are things they should have done differently. Mel, I want to start with you.</s>ROBBINS: Yes, you know, this is -- this is a painful video to watch, and one of the things that's troubling, that's coming out of this. I'm sure Joey is going through a litany of things that are problematic, first of all, that the dispatcher never relayed the pertinent information that the gun was, quote, "probably fake." That the police officer never asked for other information, was he alone, where was he in the park, what did they see him doing. So they didn't know what they were pulling into. Then we get into what is hugely problematic and for me, outrageous, which is the "Cleveland Plain Dealer" is reporting that there are inconsistencies already between what the police originally reported they saw versus what we see in the video. One of the first things the police said, guys, is that Tamir was sitting under that gazebo with a group of people. That they saw him reach for the gun on the table and approach the car, and this claim that we all find to be preposterous that at they're pulling up on the grass, that he was warned three times to put the gun down by police in a moving car with the windows up and the doors closed, and then, of course, that they don't even stop the car barely before the kid son the ground and shot. So, this is a major problem. And then the other thing that I find just chilling guess how they're going to investigate it. It's going to a grand jury, Christi and Victor.</s>PAUL: Joey, what do you say to all of that?</s>JACKSON: Well, Mel brilliantly hit it all. Now, the issues are so many and so vast in this particular case and it starts with the dispatch information as Mel Robbins pointed out and there was, of course, clarity in that -- excuse me, there was clarity in the 911. And the clarity was it's probably a fake gun. Why was that information not conveyed to police? It certainly would have affected the police's state of mind. Number two, the police certainly should have asked for more information so that they should have been aware of what they were going into. Number three, under what circumstance do you approach a potentially armed person or someone that you know to be armed, and you approach him at that distance. There was no safe distance in terms of perimeter between the police officer and between the child. Under that circumstance, how do you do that? How do you train to do that? With no safe perimeter, obviously, it's going to cause the police officers to act more quickly, but why should that have occur? Number four, would they're not have been, if they kept a safe perimeter, an opportunity to warn appropriately the 12-year-old? I don't know that they know. Of course, they didn't, apparently, because they referenced him as a 20-year-old potential person. But wouldn't they if they kept that safe distance have said, hands down on the ground, hands down. And given some useful and valuable opportunity for the child to have his life.</s>BLACKWELL: Yes.</s>JACKSON: And obviously, number five, the actions in terms of what they did, suggesting that within those two seconds as Mel Robbins aptly points out that you say three different times with windows down and it just -- excuse me, with windows up and door closed, it just defies common sense, it defies logic and it really has great concerns. Finally --</s>ROBBINS: And the law.</s>JACKSON: Absolutely. And finally, the fact that it goes to a grand jury, it's problematic. I'm one that believes that police cannot investigate police. And prosecutors who are local to that community cannot prosecute police. There needs to be some independence, because that's where you get community support. That's where you get community trust. And that's where the system works.</s>BLACKWELL: Mel, quickly, we just had on a split screen the response to the Michael Brown shooting. And the small response, just a few people we saw at that community meeting after the shooting of Tamir. Why do you think that we're seeing this obviously much smaller, more restrained response, in a case that has fewer gray areas. I mean, there are a lot of questions still in the Michael Brown shooting. This seemed to be a little more cut and dried?</s>ROBBINS: Well, Victor, that's an excellent question. And I think one of the main reasons this is happening because from the very beginning, the police were proactive. Unlike Ferguson, they were proactive in Cleveland in reaching out with the family, and meeting with the family, and showing the video to the family. And so, the family was involved and respected from the very beginning which had a profound effect. But one thing that's also the same is that if you guys can believe it, that the local press has already started victim-blaming, smearing Tamir Rice's parents, and somehow putting out in the public that this was a kid from a broken home and that somehow that should play into it. So, there are sickening similarities as well. And in my mind, you know, look, the police have a hard job and they make split second decisions that they think about for the rest of their lives. But in my mind, this split second decision was completely riddled with all sorts of negligence and problems. To me, I keep thinking about this as one of these wrongful death cases. And also, I think there should be criminal charges. I mean, when you look at the inconsistencies between what the police initially said in their report and the actual video that we're now seeing, that's very troubling. I understand that you react in the heat of passion. But to Joey's very well stated points there so many problems with how they pursued this, that I hope we see a very different result in this case in terms of what comes out of that grand jury.</s>PAUL: We'll wait. That's waiting to be seen. But Mel Robbins, and Joey Jackson -- always appreciate your perspective. Thank you for being with us.</s>BLACKWELL: Thank you.</s>JACKSON: A pleasure, Christi. A pleasure, Victor. Take care, Mel.</s>BLACKWELL: All right. Ahead on NEW DAY -- Ray Rice has been I guess cleared. His appeal, a judge sided with him in that indefinite suspension related to domestic abuse. He won. And now, he's free to return to America's most popular sport. But will any team pick him up?</s>PAUL: Plus, the White House and the hunt for a new defense secretary, the fourth in six years. Chuck Hagel is leaving. Who's going to replace him?