Jussie Smollett Indicted On 16 Felony Counts; R. Kelly Expected To Be Released From Jail This Morning
PAUL: Seventeen minutes past the hour right now. "Empire" actor Jussie Smollett is set to be arraigned on Thursday now. Court records show he was indicted yesterday on 16 felony counts of disorderly conduct stemming from alleged false reports that he was attacked in Chicago. Now, the two men who were detained in connection with the incident have been cooperating with police and they say Smollett paid them $3,500 to stage the attack. Mark Geragos, one of Smollett's attorneys, said the actor maintains his innocence and calls the indictment "prosecutorial overkill." CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson with us now. Joey, what do you make of that? Do you see prosecutorial overkill here?</s>JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning to you, Christi. You know, I see prosecutors who are motivated to get to the bottom of what occurred. Mark Geragos, a outstanding attorney and a very good individual, I might add, a colleague here obviously at CNN. You know, look, the prosecutors, what they did is they took out every particular factual statement that Mr. Smollett made and they made it into a crime. So essentially, the counts that you see in the indictment, he spoke to one officer initially and told them a variety of things as to what occurred and those things that he told them, right? Being attacked by masked men, it being a hate crime, the noose around his neck, they made each and every one, that is the prosecutors, a false statement, a false report. Then, again, he met with a detective and at that time, reiterated the story, adding some details and prosecutors did that again. Did they need 16 counts? I don't think so. I think, you know, Mark certainly has a point as it relates to the prosecutors being overzealous here, but, you know, at the end of the day, it matters little. The fact is is all you need is one count for a conviction and the evidence in this case appears to be somewhat compelling ...</s>PAUL: Based ...</s>JACKSON: ... the stuff that we know.</s>PAUL: Sure. And based on what we know, how reliable do you see these two witnesses?</s>JACKSON: You know, I think ...</s>PAUL: These two, men, the brothers.</s>JACKSON: What happens, Christi, and that's the great question and that's the essence of the question, but how reliable you see someone always depends upon whether they're corroborated and from what we know, and again, I'm relying upon press reports, having examined the evidence, having, you know, Mark Geragos has the evidence or certainly will get the evidence. So he'll be able to examine it, but you don't have to rely upon someone's word. What do I mean? We see that the two are talking to the police as to what occurred. The police are not just saying, oh, is that what happened? Really? Let's march you in front of the grand jury and then we'll take you to trial. No. They're evaluating. So they go and they say, hey, we went and we went to the store and we picked up the mask and we picked up the rope and we got the bleach and all we need. Where do police go? They go to the store. We have surveillance video from them being in the store. You know what else he did? He paid us with a check. It was $3,500. What do police do? They go and get the check. The argument, of course, is that, ho, those were for personal training services. That's for a jury to vet out, but when you talk about credibility, when you have that credibility matched up against evidence ...</s>PAUL: Yes.</s>JACKSON: ... it's hard to argue that someone's lying.</s>PAUL: Joey, I've got to -- I've got to play this from defense attorney Mark Geragos. Here's something else he brought up yesterday. Listen to this.</s>MARK GERAGOS, JUSSIE SMOLLETT'S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: What is happening here is, frankly, a media gangbang of this guy of unprecedented proportions and that's the reason I got into this. I've never seen a media pendulum swing more quickly and more viciously and rob somebody of their presumption of innocence like this case. It's startling the way people assume that he's guilty.</s>PAUL: He brings up that bigger issue of innocent until proven guilty and the fact that that seems to be, to some degree with a lot of people, absent here. Your thoughts?</s>JACKSON: You know, Christi, everyone has the presumption of innocence and as a defense attorney, I'll stand by that every day and twice on Sunday. You're presumed innocent until proven guilty. A judge will instruct the jury every time that leave -- they leave that room. Do not make any conclusions. Do not draw any conclusions. Having said that, why is this in the public discourse? Why are we speaking about it? Because of the nature of what was reported, because of the fact that you say you were attacked, the fact that you say this is MAGA country, the fact that they called you, you know, epithets that relate to your sexual orientation. And so obviously it's a case that resonated and the police took seriously. And then they put 12 detectives on it, they spent 1,000 man hours and they uncover that it just ain't so. And so yes, it's out there. Yes, people have attitudes about it, but that's, in large measure, to Jussie Smollett himself. Let's be clear, let's be honest about the narrative that he put out there about the the police trying to get to the bottom of, oh my goodness, how could this ever occur? Let's catch the person. And then when you go and catch them. You track the two people down. They don't happen to be white, they happen to be black. You discuss it with the people after you arrest them. You say, I'm not going to arrest them. You detain them. You learn their story. You learn that they were paid for it, allegedly, and the story unravels.</s>PAUL: Yes.</s>JACKSON: So yes, it's something that we're all -- you know, people are really motivated to speak about, but that is in large measure to the narrative that Smollett himself put out there concerning what happened to him.</s>PAUL: All right. Joey Jackson, it's always so good to get your perspective, sir. Thank you.</s>JACKSON: Thank you, Christi.</s>PAUL: Absolutely. Victor?</s>BLACKWELL: R&B singer R. Kelly is expected to post bond to be released from jail this morning. He was arrested Wednesday after failing to pay his ex-wife $161,000 of child support. Kelly was out on bail in another case when he was arrested. Now, last month, a grand jury indicted Kelly on 10 counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse accusing him of sexual acts with children between the ages of 13 and 17. Kelly says he's innocent and maintained that innocence at a "CBS News" special which aired last night.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you done anything wrong?</s>R. KELLY, MUSICIAN: I've done lots of things wrong when it come to women that I apologize, but I apologized in those relationships at the time I was in the relationships. OK ...</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you broken any laws when it comes to women?</s>KELLY: Absolutely not.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you ever had sex with ...</s>KELLY: No.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... anyone under the age of 17?</s>KELLY: No.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Never?</s>KELLY: No.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What they say is you like very much being in control and if you're not in control, it becomes very bad for the woman in the relationship.</s>KELLY: You're saying me? I like to be?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Yes.</s>KELLY: No, no, no, no, no. See the -- see the thing is is that I'm not a controlling person. It's just that I am in control of my household. Like, say, if you live with me, I consider myself the king of the castle and you're the queen of the castle.</s>BLACKWELL: If he's convicted, Kelly could face between three and seven years in prison for each of those 10 counts.</s>PAUL: Tough week ahead for the President's former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort. Critics say he was handed a light sentence this week in Virginia, but next week he could a very different fate in a Washington D.C. Court. That's coming up.</s>BLACKWELL: Plus, traveling to Europe without a visa will be a thing of the past come 2021. Coming up, the travel restrictions are changing for the European Union.