What Is The State Of Race In America
LEMON: So everyone knows what's going to happen tomorrow, the president will be speaking before some empty seats when he delivers the State of the Union tomorrow night. Some Democrats won't attend saying they cannot be part of what they fear could be another divisive speech from this president. So I need to ask now four members of the Congressional Black Caucus what they're going to do as we discuss the State of the Union, President Trump and race. Congressman -- Congresswoman Marcia Fudge of Ohio is here, Congresswoman Robin Kelly of Illinois and Congressman James Clyburn of South Carolina and Cedric Richmond of Louisiana. I'm so glad to have all of you now. Thank you so much.</s>LEMON: Thank you so much for joining us. This is an important discussion. When asked about the State of the Union today, Sarah Sanders, Congressman, said the State of the Union was incredible. How do you see the State of the Union under President Trump?</s>REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D), SOUTH CAROLINA: Incredibly troubling. That's the best I can do with that word incredible. I think that we're facing some real vicarious times in the country. And of course, having studied history and having taught history, I can only equate one period of time with what we experience now, and that was what was going on in Germany around 1934 right after the 1932 elections when Adolph Hitler was elected chancellor. He began to do things to discredit the media, to disrupt the judicial system, and if you recall from your studies, they had swastikas hanging in churches all over Germany. And when I see and hear, and experience what's going on in the country today, I think back to that time, and I really believe that we as Americans had better get a handle on things. If we don't, we could very well see ourselves going the way of Germany.</s>LEMON: You know that's a stark comparison. People are going to say, he's comparing him to Hitler and the holocaust, and all those things.</s>CLYBURN: Well, Don, one difference in this, if I were making that comparison, then this president would be Mussolini and Putin would be Hitler.</s>LEMON: Yes. Congressman Richmond, members of the Congressional Black Caucus, a number of members say they're not going to attend, including the civil rights icon John Lewis. Do you support the decision not to go?</s>REP. CEDRIC RICHMOND (D), LOUISIANA: Absolutely. We have several members that won't go at all because they just don't want to sit there and hear hollow words and divisive rhetoric. And if you look at the president's first year, it has not been friendly to African-Americans. Then if you look at the other half of the caucus, they decided that when you see racism, when you see injustice, when you see inequality, you look it straight in the eye and you don't run from it. And so you will see a number of persons there tomorrow looking the president straight in his eye because that's what we do, we confront it. So those are probably the two areas you'll see most members, members we either boycott or will sit together in solidarity and stare down what we believe is inequality and injustice and racism.</s>LEMON: I want to get to, Congresswoman Kelly. How difficult is this decision for you?</s>REP. ROBIN KELLY (D), ILLINOIS: I went back and forth but...</s>LEMON: But you decided what?</s>KELLY: I decided I would be in the room where it's happening.</s>LEMON: You wanted to be in the room where it's happening?</s>KELLY: And stare down racism and I want to be there to listen to everything that he says because I know I'm going to be asked about it later. But, you know, my family was never one that, you know, took itself out of where it was happening or the moment, so I want to be there, so I can talk about it. And, you know, be part of the group that's not going to be clapping, not going to be smiling.</s>LEMON: Do you support your colleagues who are not going to go?</s>KELLY: Oh, definitely. Definitely.</s>LEMON: What about you, Congresswoman Fudge?</s>REP. MARCIA FUDGE (D), OHIO: I intend to be there and certainly I plan to be there because I do, in fact, respect the Office of the President. I am a patriot unlike many of my colleagues. Because if they ever decide to put patriotism over party, they would be doing some of the same things that we're doing and seeing and saying some of the same things we are. It wasn't a tough decision for me. I don't respect the president, but I respect the office.</s>LEMON: Do you think he respects the office?</s>FUDGE: I don't think he respects anything. I really don't.</s>LEMON: He just said to me that he is the least racist person. Do you think that this -- he said a number of times. Do you think this president has shown himself to be racist?</s>KELLY: Definitely. I mean, just in his campaigning of things he said about Mexicans, the things he said about the Mexican judge, what he said about Haitians and those from African countries. I mean it's -- we shouldn't be shocked because we saw some of it in his campaign, and he has continued.</s>FUDGE: Well, you know, when he first asked the question, what do you have to lose, and he started to talk about when you walk down the streets in our neighborhoods, you'll get killed, that they're like a third world country. What do you think that is? I live in a black neighborhood. I'm not afraid to walk down my street. I don't live in a third world country. I'm as educated as probably anybody around him because he's not very educated. He is -- but what we are seeing is the dumbing down of the presidency of the United States. He is the least prepared, the least educated, the least knowledgeable and the least honest. Why would you think that I would be concerned about what he thinks about me?</s>LEMON: When he talked about -- when you say things like that, that he is racist or he has racist tendencies, or what he said he was racist, or he always points to, well, this is what I've done for the black community, look at the unemployment, look at all these things but he never addresses the issue that you are talking to him about. And he get's to unemployment because that's really Obama's policies that help brighten the unemployment. It is not really just this president's policies. It's gone down at least under him -- lesser under him than it did under President Obama, so that is a talking point. Why don't you think he understands that when you have the majority of African-Americans in this country -- and he'll point to the people who support him and it's not that many black people, and he says it's growing, it's not. That's not true, by the way. It's not growing. Why won't he listen to people who may be trying to help him? Because he is President of the United States, why don't he listen?</s>RICHMOND: Well, I just don't think that's in his DNA. I really don't.</s>LEMON: Do you think he cares about black people?</s>RICHMOND: I don't, if you listen to his words or if you watch his actions. Let's just take some numbers. He's appointed or nominated one black federal judge. He's nominated one black U.S. attorney and when you start talking about the criminal justice system, that's a key area for African-American men. And they just -- and if you watch Jeff Sessions' actions, it's just inconsistent. So I'm not totally convinced of everything in his head. Part of what's in his head is he does what Kelly and Stephen Miller tells him to do, and that's why we see the racism coming out in this immigration overhaul, where he wants to not talk about illegal immigration, which by the way, he made the DREAMers illegal. They were legal until he decided to take action or when you start talking about diversity visas and you start talking about family reunification, you are talking about legal immigration and he -- we could just use his words. He wants more people from Norway as opposed to Africa or El Salvador.</s>LEMON: It speaks for itself.</s>RICHMOND: Absolutely.</s>LEMON: Nancy Pelosi said he wanted to make America white again. That's what she said. Do you believe that, Congressman?</s>CLYBURN: Well, he said that. That's what the Norway thing is all about. You cannot get away from that. And for him to refer to the countries on the continent of Africa, when you disparage our entire continent, you go after a country like Haiti, any one of us who really know the history of this country, you would know how indebted this country is to the country of Haiti.</s>LEMON: Yes.</s>CLYBURN: In fact, you're from Louisiana. And so I think, my lord, Haiti. If but for Haiti, I don't know if we would have gotten the Louisiana part.</s>CLYBURN: So this guy knows nothing as, Marcia, said. If he had some real understanding of our country's history, he would be doing whatever he could to help a country like Haiti. Especially after the devastating storms, earthquakes, all kinds of stuff they have been suffering through, and for him to disparage them the way he has, after going through the campaign saying what a good president he would be for Haitians. You know, he just doesn't know how to tell the truth, he doesn't know how to face facts. This guy is absolutely catastrophically bad.</s>LEMON: I have a lot of questions to ask. One, I want to ask you if he can -- when you heard anything, don't answer now. And also, I see you, you are holding this. We have a lot to lose. What do you have to lose? We have a lot to lose. I'll ask you about that and other things. We'll talk about Jay-Z, we'll talk about black unemployment. There's a lot to talk about. We'll be right back. Don't go anywhere.