'Human Events' Reporter Ambushes Biden
KURTZ: Jason Mattera is a reporter for the conservative publication "Human Events." But on his Web site, Mattera portrays himself as an ambush artist. Here for instance, he initially acts friendly toward Congressman Barney Frank and winds up asking him about a 20-year-old scandal in which the Democrat had a relationship with someone who turned out to be a male prostitute.</s>JASON MATTERA, HUMAN EVENTS: Congressman Frank, Jason Mattera, pleasure to meet you, sir.</s>REP. BARNEY FRANK (D), MASSACHUSETTS: Where are you from, Jason?</s>MATTERA: From Brooklyn, New York, actually. With the bad economy and all -- with the bad economy and all, can you give me advice on how to start my own brothel? I know you have experience in these matters. Maybe I can make some extra cash on the side.</s>FRANK: No, it's silly</s>MATTERA: Too silly? You have one running out of your apartment.</s>KURTZ: When Joe Biden was in a Senate hallway recently, Mattera started by asking the vice president for a photo.</s>MATTERA: Do you regret using a rape reference to describe Republican opposition to the president's bill?</s>BIDEN: I didn't use it. No, no, no, what I said, let's get it straight, guys. Don't screw around with me. Let's get it straight.</s>MATTERA: You didn't use the rape reference?</s>BIDEN: No, let me -- listen to me.</s>KURTZ: So, was this a case of unethical journalism? Joining us now to talk about the Biden incident and the latest undercover involving James O'Keefe -- Glynnis MacNicol, media editor at BusinessInsider.com, and Paul Farhi, media reporter for "The Washington Post." Glynnis, was that outright deception what we just saw by Jason Mattera?</s>GLYNNIS MACNICOL, BUSINESSINSIDER.COM: It sounds like it. I mean, he did have some sort of a badge that said he was a reporter.</s>KURTZ: Not clear whether it was visible.</s>MACNICOL: We're not clear whether it was visible.</s>KURTZ: He says it was.</s>MACNICOL: Right. He certainly presented himself as somebody who wanted a photo. But I think we're seeing this as sort of a repeated over and over again. They know they can get a good video clip from it. They know it can go viral on the Internet. They might get a prominent person in an awkward situation. So, yes.</s>KURTZ: On the other hand, it was in a public hallway in the Senate, Paul Farhi. He asked an aggressive question, certainly. Did he sandbag the vice president?</s>PAUL FARHI, THE WASHINGTON POST: Well, it's kind of hard to sandbag the vice president of the United States. Joe Biden's been around for decades. He's a big boy, he can handle himself. And in this case, he didn't handle himself particularly well. The confrontation depends on getting a response that's a little outraged, a little angry so that you can make the clip and you can make the viral video that you're seeking in the first place. Biden gave it to him.</s>KURTZ: Well, I didn't see anything particularly wrong with Biden's response. He got a little testy. But let's have -- let's hear what Jason Mattera had to say, he was interviewed this week by John King.</s>MATTERA: Journalists can't take pictures with the vice president.</s>JOHN KING, CNN HOST: I think it's unethical.</s>MATTERA: I'm looking to get politicians who are used to spin and their messaging teams. I'm trying to get an honest reaction, a frank answer, a gut reaction.</s>KING: Amen. Amen.</s>MATTERA: Especially because so much -- so much of the media is made up of drones who gave Biden a pass.</s>KURTZ: So, the explanation seems to be that anything goes when it comes to penetrating the bubble that does indeed surround high- ranking public officials.</s>MACNICOL: Right. I mean, here's the thing -- you want to get a face to face with somebody. He's thinking the media is not questioning the vice president enough. I think it's -- I think the vice president actually handled himself fine. I watched that clip and thought, well, that's typical Joe Biden. We're not seeing a different person than we see every day.</s>KURTZ: And how did Mattera handle himself?</s>MACNICOL: I don't find the sort of journalism sheds the greatest light on the reporter who's trying to implement it. You sort of think -- well, why can't you just find a better way to get face-to-face time with the vice president? So I just -- I always think they come off sort of looking unprofessional and silly. But --</s>KURTZ: Unprofessional and silly. Was there anything wrong with Mattera's question?</s>FARHI: Not at all. In fact, Biden confirmed the substance of the question. It was a reference to a speech that Biden had made earlier. He asked him if he was using rape as a way to justify passage of the jobs bill.</s>KURTZ: Basically he's suggesting that if the president's jobs bill did not pass Congress, crime including rape would increase. A number of journalists have asked about that, including Candy Crowley when she interviewed the vice president last week. And I didn't think the question was asked particularly rudely.</s>FARHI: I didn't think so either. And I thought Biden basically said, yes, you're right, I did use that reference. And I'm now telling you again that I'm using that reference.</s>KURTZ: This story got a second life when there were a number of news stories that portrayed Biden's office as seeking perhaps to yank the credentials of Jason Mattera. I misstated something earlier this week based on stories that I saw which left me with the impression the vice president of the office had initiated this. In fact, our reporting shows that the Capitol Hill committee, the credentials reporters, was looking into this matter. Contacted, we actually got a statement saying no formal complaint was submitted by the vice president's office. But, you know, if the Hill contacts the vice president's office and says what happened, there were security concerns, of course you would answer questions. It was a misimpression, I think, that Biden was looking to retaliate against this reporter.</s>FARHI: But there were no security concerns. He was in a public place. He was in the Capitol building. There were Secret Service around. He was wearing a press credential. Would he have gotten the same interview if he had said "I'm Jason Mattera from 'Human Events', I'm here to ask you an obnoxious question" -- probably not. But the misrepresentation, very, very gray area.</s>KURTZ: An omission. I mean, that's the thing -- you know, I think -- I don't think there are too many reporters who haven't try to sneak in somewhere and get themselves close to somebody where they can ask a question. But you would say "John King, CNN," "Paul Farhi, "Washington Post" -- he didn't say that. But, of course, as you say, Biden is not exactly new to this game.</s>FARHI: And in fact, if you look at what Mattera has done, he will walk up to people on the street, just as Michael Moore will, and say, I'm Jason Mattera, and then he will ask his obnoxious question, and he will get a testy answer each time. But it's a public place and it is fair game.</s>KURTZ: So what is the goal here? Is the goal to get the public official, the target, to say something revealing? Or is the goal to draw attention to yourself so that you get to be interviewed by John King on CNN? You get to do a bunch of interviews with Politico, et cetera? And it is a way of making a name for yourself?</s>MACNICOL: Right. I think probably more the second than the first. But I think what we see over and over again is they're trying to create these embarrassing moments which then turn into these great viral clips that go everywhere and change what the conversation is about.</s>KURTZ: When you say they, do you mean certain conservative activist journalists or do you mean journalists of varying political stripes?</s>MACNICOL: I would say more the activist journalists we've seen recently. But I would say a lot of people are interested in creating viral video clips now. It's sort of the easiest way to promote yourself, promote your argument, to get yourself out there. We're talking about it on a Sunday show right now. Clearly he's changed the conversation.</s>KURTZ: It used to be you had to go and cover city hall, the state house for years and work your way up. Now you just have to have a viral video clip. This is what I'm hearing this morning.</s>MACNICOL: But I think (inaudible) -- I think you may remember Mayhill Fowler, who caught Bill Clinton in that off moment, and that turned -- during the 2008 campaign -- and that turned into a huge thing.</s>KURTZ: She was a blogger for the Huffington Post and she did not (ph) identify herself - she also snuck into an Obama fund-raiser. The rules are clearly changing. Let's talk more about this on the other side. I've got to get a break. Up next, conservative activist James O'Keefe accuses a reporter of getting his sources drunk. I'm serious. The evidence pretty watered down.