Donald Trump Lies To Justin Trudeau; Larry Kudlow Is The Next Senior Economic Advisor; Mike Pompeo replaces Rex Tillerson as Secretary of State; Stormy Daniels, Continues To Be Troubling News For Donald Trump
VAUSE: Well, for any other U.S. president, it might actually be an embarrassing, stunning admission. But this is Donald Trump. According to an audio obtained by the Washington Post, Mr. Trump admitted at a fund raiser on Wednesday, he just made up facts in a recent meeting with the Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. On the audio tape, he was mimicking Justin Trudeau, as he was saying this. Nice guy, good looking guy, comes in. Donald, we have no trade deficit. I said wrong, Justin, you do. I don't even know it. I had no idea. I just said you're wrong. You know why? Because we're stupid. He said no, we have no trade deficit. I said well, in that case, I feel differently. I said, but I don't believe it. I said that guy is out -- my guy, they went out, I said check because I can't believe it. Well, Sir, you are actually right. We have no deficit. But that doesn't include energy and timber. And when you do, we lose $17 billion a year. It's incredible. That's incredible. That's my best Donald Trump impersonation. Jessica Levinson is a professor at Loyola Law School. Michael Genovese is president of the Global Policy Institute Loyola Marymount University. Thank you, guys, for coming in. You know, this is one of the more bizarre moments of a very bizarre presidency so far. He gets up and he mimics the Canadian Prime Minister, admits that he makes this stuff up, not knowing what the facts are when the reality is the United States has a surplus (ph), Michael, of $18 billion with Canada. So what does this all say to you?</s>MICHAEL GENOVESE, GLOBAL POLICY INSTITUTE: Well, you know, the general public has a perception that politicians lie regularly. The fact of the matter is they don't. They're generally as honest, if not more honest than most other professions, in part, because they're out in the public all time and you can easily catch them. But in this case, this is not only embarrassing, it's damaging to the United States, to our credibility. The United States has to have its word as its own (ph). And if people doubt us, if the question us, then we live in an Alice-in-Wonderland world and -- and if your word is not your bond, you can't deal straight with other people. And they won't deal straight with you.</s>VAUSE: And, Jessica, it is one thing to be caught saying this sort of stuff, you know, boasting about it at a fund raiser.</s>JESSICA LEVINSON, LOYOLA LAW SCHOOL: Well, I mean, that's the fascinating aspect of this. And that's why -- I mean, that's what hucksters do. I didn't even have the facts and I sold that car.</s>VAUSE: Right.</s>LEVINSON: I didn't even know it was going to rain today, and I sold you a new roof. I mean, this is -- a used car salesman you hope would not take this type of tactic. And I think Michael is exactly right. He's using it as bragging rights and he is saying like look how an amazing businessman I am and I'm going to get in there and pisses one of our allies. And I'm explaining to him things that I don't even know if it's true, but I'm so charming. And this is so damaging because if he's admitting and boasting about lying, then it really means what frankly we've all known, which is that he has no relationship with the truth.</s>VAUSE: I wonder what the Canadian Prime Minister is thinking tonight. OK, let's move on to Larry Kudlow, who apparently is next in line to be the senior economic advisor at the White House. He's not just a TV commentator, he worked in the Reagan administration. Here is the president talking about the man that he wants for the job to replace Gary Cohn.</s>DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm looking at Larry Kudlow very strongly. I've known him a long time. We don't agree on everything, but in this case, I think that's good. I want to have a divergent opinion. We agree on most.</s>VAUSE: So, Michael, let's just say Gary Cohn, he has strongly opposed to tariffs. It's a reason why Cohn walked over the aluminum and steel tariffs. (Inaudible) he likes Larry Kudlow, they get on. Is the president just simply picking people he likes? There is no ideology here?</s>GENOVESE: Well, the president doesn't want people who disagree with him He says I want to hear the arguments. But if you argue with him, or you're likely to be out, or you're going to be on the outs, even if you stay in the administration. And so, you know, I think that at the best, what happens is Donald Trump governs on chaos, but administrations can't run on chaos. It's a terrible strategy for management. And if you're on the staff and you're supposed to bring the president information who's going to bring him bad news, who is going to speak truth to power when you're afraid every day that you could be losing a job? Now, Kudlow and the present have a long-term relationship. Maybe he can be honest with him, but I'm wondering just how honest most of the people around Trump think they can be with him and still keep their jobs.</s>VAUSE: Here is a headline for the Daily Beast because there is this shake-up coming at the White House. Trump wants to staff White House team with Fox News stars, loyalists, killers. You know, Jessica, it is an unusual strategy to choose senior government officials based in part on how they perform on cable news.</s>LEVINSON: Well, this is interesting. And it is kind of vintage Donald Trump in one way. We know that he garners an enormous amount of his information from cable news, and that he thinks that this can be used for instance in lieu of security briefings to just turn on Fox and see what people are saying or to turn on another channel. But think it's important to recognize that some of Donald Trump's appointees have really been far outside the bounds of what's normal. But Kudlow is being largely applauded by the Republican establishment. And so, in some ways, he is a pick that is somewhat within the mainstream that another Republican the president can pick. So, I think it is important for us to keep these two things separate because certainly President Trump has packed a lot of people who a mainstream Republican would not pick. But in this case, it is two things. One is it shows that Donald Trump actually is running away from his populist message, so Kudlow has been extremely consistent in being wrong on almost every major economic indicator. And he's been extremely consistent in being in favor of Republicans and against Democrats.</s>VAUSE: Listen to what senior Republicans lawmakers have been saying about this White House and the chaos.</s>REP. CHARLIE DENT (R), PENNSYLVANIA: There is a lot of chaos and anarchy. And this is just more of it, this type of instability and uncertainty is really not helpful for America or for the administration.</s>GOV. JOHN KASICH (R), OHIO: I mean, you have to have some stability to get things done. So I look at it and I'm just like, wow, where is this going?</s>SEN. JEFF FLAKE (R), ARIZONA: To find out you've been fired by tweet is not exactly, you know, reassuring in terms of the conduct of the government.</s>VAUSE: And, Michael, this chaos comes with a cost especially when it is cabinet secretary, because there needs to be an approval for replacement. They need to get the staff. You have these departments, which are left essentially idle for long stretches at a time.</s>GENOVESE: And it takes a while to get someone through the confirmation process. And if you keep having shuffling chairs in the White House and cabinet, you're just going to go through hearings and hearings and hearings in the Senate. But Donald Trump -- Donald Trump thrives on chaos. Most people who work for him don't. And so, what you get is a completely dysfunctional White House. And it's evident in the kinds of the problems that we see. The president says there is no problem, everything is fine. But we can see the problems. It's just so obvious. And he just has trouble governing.</s>VAUSE: This is why people say nothing gets done in Washington. Case in point with this in is the high-level delegation from South Korea, apparently heading to Washington for these talks about the proposed meeting between President Trump and Kim Jong-un. Let's go to Paula Hancocks now. She is live in Seoul. So, Paula, the Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, he is gone. It's not really known when Pompeo will take over, his replacement. So, exactly, who will the South Koreans be talking to and is there any point?</s>PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's a good question, John. I mean, this is the foreign minister of South Korea, who is on a plane right now heading to Washington, Kang Kyung-wha. She was supposed to leave today. But yesterday, there was this flurry of meetings trying to figure out whether or not she should still go because of course, it was the Secretary of State that has just been fired Rex Tillerson, she was supposed to meet. So, she will meeting with the Deputy Secretary of State, John Sullivan, because clearly, Mike Pompeo hasn't been confirmed yet as Secretary of State. But the foreign minister was stopped at the airport here. She was asked these questions why go, is there any point in going. She pointed out that they can't lose the momentum they've built up ahead of this North-South Korean meeting between Moon Jae-in and North Korean leader Kim Jong-un. And to be fair, they don't have the luxury of waiting until Mike Pompeo is or isn't confirmed as Secretary of State because it's just a matter of weeks away before the North Korean and the South Korean leader meet. It's incredibly historic and important. And it is ahead potentially of the Kim Jong-un and Donald Trump meeting. So they really don't have the luxury of waiting until all the people are in position. She was also asked as well, the foreign minister about what it's difficult as there is no Secretary of State. And she said it's not an individual that moves an individual's leadership is important, it's an organization that moves. So the foreign minister here is really trying to put a good spin on it clearly, as she is heading to Washington. But quite frankly, they can't wait. They have to have these meetings ahead of these summits. John.</s>VAUSE: Yes. But maybe that organization is understaffed. No one manning the position is also a problem. Paula, thank you. Paula Hancocks there live from Seoul. I just want to get back to our panel here, because looking closely at the cabinet -- because, you know, this is cabinet, which has been plagued with a lot of scandal and controversy. If you remember the HUD Secretary Ben Carson and the $30,000 dining room setting. Last month, a spokesperson for the housing department insisted in an email Mrs. Carson and the Secretary had no awareness that the table was being purchased. OK. Now, according to an internal staff email, which surfaced and dated August of last year, which has now surfaced, this is what it reads. I believe Allison (ph) has print out of the furniture the Secretary and Mrs. Carson picked out. I think this is a very reasonable price and the funds are available. So we went back to that same spokesperson from the housing department. We got this email reply. When presented with options by professional staff, Mrs. Carson participated in the selection of specific styles. Secretary Carson also said last month he was surprised by the cost of this dining room setting, and that's why he cancelled the order. He had no idea that it had been bought, and that kind of stuff. In the scheme of things, it's small beer, right. But, you know, it's a lie. And it's the stuff that voters care about.</s>LEVINSON: It is so pathetic because there is so many important things that HUD has to do.</s>VAUSE: Yes.</s>LEVINSON: And there are so many important things that every cabinet member has to do. Instead, what we are talking about is their terrible judgment in spending extravagantly when it comes to furniture. And worse, they would lie about it. I mean, if we have ever learned anything from American politics, it should be that it's always the lie. It is always the cover-up that will get you. And in this case it's Ben Carson, as like Donald Trump isn't bragging about the lie, but it's -- I mean, it's just -- it's silly season to the extent that there are so many unbelievably pressing issues. And now, we are talking about lying about furniture.</s>VAUSE: When did he know -- when did he know that the dining set cost 31 grand?</s>LEVINSON: Yeah.</s>VAUSE: It's ridiculous. I want to go to Stormy Daniels and what could be troubling news for the president. And it came from the lawyer for Stormy Daniels. Listen to this.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have more women come to you?</s>MICHAEL AVENATTI, STORMY DANIELS' LAWYER: Yes.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How many?</s>AVENATTI: I'm not going to answer that.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dozens?</s>AVENATTI: Not a dozen.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not a dozen, more than five?</s>AVENATTI: I'm not going to answer that.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Somewhere between five and a dozen or more women. We look forward to making you regular here.</s>VAUSE: OK. Michael, so somewhere five and a dozen women have contacted the lawyer of Stormy Daniels about President Trump. That would not be a surprise given the track record of Donald Trump. But it would be a big problem.</s>GENOVESE: Well, you know, there are so many women coming forward and it has gotten no traction. For some reason, the Stormy Daniels' story has legs and it is not going away. And it seems like every day, a new little wrinkle. Today, we now know that the Trump organization itself was much more heavily involved than they said. And I think, Jessica, you're right it's - the lie hurts, the cover-up kills. And so, they're just making more news for themselves by lying. The strategy is very clear. Get it all out, get it out quickly, and make it your narrative. Otherwise, you're the victim. And so, the Trump administration keeps on stepping on its own feet. And they seem not to be aware of just how much damage they are doing to themselves.</s>VAUSE: Jessica, the White House is constantly reactive rather than -- as Michael (inaudible), but why is the Stormy Daniels' allegation resonated? Because it didn't for a while, but then suddenly, it's the -- it has become a story that people are out here interested in and are concerned about.</s>LEVINSON: Well, I think it's partly this. The president's lawyer paid a porn star to be quiet. If you were to utter that sentence with respect to any other president, we wouldn't have a discussion about why the story has legs. The other thing is though there are serious legal consequences to some aspects of the story. And there is -- to me, the most interesting part is actually the issue of her -- of Trump's lawyer paying Stormy Daniels and how he got the money, how closely affiliated he was with President Trump at the time, whether President Trump knew, whether there was a campaign finance violation, and how far the suit will go. Because as we all know, the suit isn't really about the cause of action itself. It's about can we depose the president and get additional information from him? So you know, again, any other scenario, president's lawyer pays off porn star, we don't have to talk about why that's a story.</s>VAUSE: Yeah. This administration, apparently we do. Yes, it would be interesting, if in fact the deposition about an extra-marital affair which brings about, you know, legal trouble for a president.</s>LEVINSON: Paula Jones.</s>VAUSE: Yeah, it has happened before. Jessica and Michael, thank you so much. Good to see you both. Well, in California, resistance to the Trump administration has gone beyond legal challenges and protests. When we come back, an exclusive report on the underground network being built to help undocumented immigrants targeted for deportation by federal officials.