Syrian Crisis Escalates; Syria: More than Just a Civil War?
TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. In our world lead, 42 Syrian soldiers are dead from reported Israeli airstrikes. That's according to a Syrian opposition group. These strikes seemed to be aimed at preventing weapons from being transferred to the militant group Hezbollah, which the U.S. State Department considers to be a terrorist group, sources tell CNN's Barbara Starr. While the Syrian government says these strikes open the door to retaliation, an Israeli general says that there are -- quote -- "no winds of war." I want to bring in Hala Gorani, CNN International anchor and correspondent, and Josh Rogin, who has a brand-new job as a senior correspondent for "Newsweek," Daily Beast. Thanks for joining us. Josh, congratulations.</s>JOSH ROGIN, "NEWSWEEK"/DAILY BEAST: Thank you.</s>TAPPER: I want to play for you guys something that the ambassador, the Israeli ambassador to the U.S., Michael Oren, said to me on Friday when I asked him about -- at this point it was just reports that there had been some strikes by the Israelis against the transfer of these weapons.</s>MICHAEL OREN, ISRAELI AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED STATES: We have a very clear policy. If the Syrian regime tries to transfer chemical weapons or what we call game-changing weaponry to terrorist organizations, particularly to Hezbollah in Lebanon, Israel will not remain passive. We're very serious about it.</s>TAPPER: That's about as close to an acknowledgment as you're going to get from an ambassador before news like this breaks. Do you expect this to escalate?</s>HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I don't think that at this point, Israel expects it to escalate, because when you look at Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's trip to China that went ahead as planned, he didn't even mention what's going on in Syria right now on his first day in China. So, it seems as though they're taking some preventive measures in the part of the country where they think there might be retaliatory strikes, not from Syria, but from Hezbollah in Southern Lebanon, which is significant, by deploying their Iron Dome system -- Dome system in that part of the country. So, I don't think the expectation is for an immediate, imminent escalation to a region wide situation at this point.</s>TAPPER: Josh, people like you and me and Hala have been parsing something that President Obama said a few weeks ago, the red line, where there was a story in "The New York Times" over the weekend saying it was an ad libbed red line. But let's go back and take a listen to what the president actually said when it came to chemical weapons used by the Syrian regime.</s>BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have been very clear to the Assad regime but also to other players on the ground that a red line for us is we start seeing a whole bunch of chemical weapons moving around or being utilized. That would change my calculus. That would change my equation.</s>TAPPER: So we're told now that aides were surprised when he laid out that red line. But he laid it out anyway. Does it matter?</s>JOSH ROGIN, SENIOR CORRESPONDENT, NEWSWEEK/DAILY BEAST: It does matter. Words matter. When you set red lines, people believe them. And when you don't uphold them, people lose faith in your credibility to uphold them. We saw President Obama last week say that, oh, Syria has crossed several lines. Now, he's sort of walking back from the red lines. The overall problem is just getting worse. It doesn't really in the end matter what the lines are. What matters is what the U.S. response will be. That's what we're all waiting to see.</s>TAPPER: And, Hala, we've heard from a United Nations official that there are reports, not conclusive ones --</s>GORANI: Right.</s>TAPPER: -- that the rebels may have used --</s>GORANI: That's complicating --</s>TAPPER: Exactly. May have used --</s>GORANI: After we've heard from Israel and other Western countries that they believe the regime has used chemical weapons, now, all of a sudden, we're hearing the possibility, that wait a minute, it could be the rebels.</s>TAPPER: And what are you hearing about that?</s>GORANI: Well, Carla del Ponte, the human rights investigator for the U.N., made this statement on Swiss Italian television. Today, the U.N. came out with this statement that was very short saying, hang on, this is not conclusive. It sounded as though the U.N. was sort of taken aback, surprised by this Carla del Ponte statement. So, there is some confusion at the U.N. I mean, that's the impression they're giving outside observers at this stage.</s>ROGIN: Right. What my administration sources tell me is the State Department and the White House don't believe the Syrian rebels have the capability to produce these weapons nor do they have them in their possession. I mean, we're talking about complicated weapons that are complicated to deliver, complicated weapon systems. And the Syrian opposition simply, probably doesn't have the ability to do that, probably. The most likely scenario was that was the regime that used these weapons on at least two occasions, maybe four occasions as recently as last week.</s>TAPPER: I'm told now that CNN correspondent Fred Pleitgen is in Damascus. Fred, can you hear me?</s>FRED PLEITGEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I certainly can, Jake. We're having trouble with the line here. But I think we're good now.</s>TAPPER: So, what are you hearing from Damascus? What's the latest there?</s>PLEITGEN: Well, I mean, I can tell you that over the past couple of days, the Syrian regime is angry, first of all, of course, at these air strikes that went on. One of the things that happened is we were basically sleeping from Tuesday -- from Saturday into Sunday night. And, then all of a sudden, the night just absolutely erupted, and it was several initial explosions and there were secondary explosions that went on for well over an hour. And that seemed to indicate to us that some sort of major installation had been hit, probably some sort of ammunition depot. And , then what happened is that the Syrian state television put up a banner saying that Israeli rockets hit a research facility. But people living in the vicinity there say that they felt the wave, the blast wave in their houses more than a mile away. So, clearly, it must have been something much bigger. The Syrian government is absolutely angry. I mean, one of the things that we have to keep in mind about all this is what was hit is really the power center of the Syrian military. There are several units of the elite republican guard that are in those military facilities. There is that research center. There's also a big weapons depot there as well. So the Syrians are absolutely angry at this. And as we've been saying, they are threatening retaliation. At this point, it's unclear how they want to do that. But people here in Damascus are on the edge, the government is on the edge and the military, I can tell you at this point, is licking its wounds, Jake.</s>TAPPER: And, Josh, this wouldn't be the first time if the Israelis conducted this and it certainly seems like they probably did. But it wouldn't be the first time that the Israelis had actually bombed a site in a local Arab country and there really hadn't been all-out war as a result.</s>ROGIN: Right. Let's remember that Israel attacked Syria's suspected nuclear reactor in 2007. They attacked another arm shipment to Hezbollah in January and then there was the attacks on Thursday and then probably Saturday. So, that's at least four we can name that haven't gotten a big response. Let's remember, this is not an Israeli attack on Assad. It's an Israeli attack on Iran and Hezbollah. That's the battle that's going on on the streets of Damascus as increased Hezbollah and Iranian activity forces the Israelis to respond.</s>GORANI: But this enforces the narrative of the Assad regime. From the beginning, the Assad regime has said these are outside forces working against the Syrian people. And this reported Israeli strike that strategically is on the site of the rebels, ironically now, you have the unlikely bedfellows here, reinforces that narrative, just as the killing and the atrocities continue.</s>TAPPER: All right. Hala, Josh, and, of course, Fred in Damascus -- thanks so much for joining us. Josh, congratulations on the new job.</s>ROGIN: Thanks.</s>TAPPER: New information just in to CNN about last fall's deadly attack at the U.S. consulate in Benghazi. In an interview with congressional investigators, a former diplomat in Libya, U.S. diplomat, expressed more could have been done to stop the attacks. Greg Hicks, then the U.S. deputy chief of mission in Libya, told investigators last month that a show of U.S. or NATO airpower might have been able to frighten off the attackers before they were able to fire a mortar at the CIA annex in Benghazi. Defense officials have disputed that any assets were in place to take any sort of action that would have made a difference. Hicks also said despite that White House suggestions to the contrary, he thought it was a terror attack from the get-go and that his jaw hit the floor when he saw U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, Susan Rice, go on TV and essentially blame the violence on protests against an anti-Islam YouTube video since she was contradicting the Libyan president who had gone on TV that morning and said the attacks were conducted by Islamic extremists with possible terrorist links. Ambassador Chris Stevens was killed in the attack along with three other Americans. We will have much more on this story on tomorrow and on Wednesday, when there will be a congressional hearing. Next in our "Sports Lead", it's a Kentucky Derby first. Not the come-from-behind win for Orb, but one woman correctly picking the top four finishers. How much did her first-time $1 bet win her? Plus, "Iron Man 3" topped the box office this weekend. But that wasn't the only recognition the film received. It also struck gold at the golden trailer awards. What's that? Find out in our "Pop Lead". That's coming up.