U.N. Ambassador Haley: North Korean Leader "Begging For War"; Ambassador Haley: We Must Adopt Strongest Possible Sanctions; Mattis Warns North Korea Of "Massive Military Response"
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Listen to this.</s>NIKKI HALEY, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: His abusive use of missiles and his nuclear threats show that he is begging for war. War is never something that the United States wants. We don't want it now, but our country's patience is not unlimited.</s>BOLDUAN: What exactly does that mean? This comes a day after the rogue nation conducted its most powerful nuclear test so far. That blast set off a chain reaction of concern and condemnation around the world as well as serving to increase tensions among allies. The latest developments and there are a lot for this. The regime has made new threats against the U.S. and Guam. South Korea claims its neighbor is preparing to launch another intercontinental ballistic missile. They're saying this could be days away. And Defense Secretary James Mattis says any threat would be met by a massive military response. President Trump has also speaking out on Twitter by accusing South Korea of appeasement and threatening to cut off trade with any country doing business with Pyongyang. A lot to go through. Let's get started with CNN's Kaitlan Collins at the White House with the very latest on this. So, Kaitlan, we heard from Nikki Haley this morning. Some strong words from the U.N. ambassador. What are we hearing, though, from the White House?</s>KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, we heard from Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin yesterday who said that he was drafting this sanctions package to send to the president that would place economic pressure on North Korea. And the president essentially doubled down on that yesterday when he said on Twitter that the United States was considering stopping, quote, "All trade with any country doing business with North Korea." Now that would be incredibly significant, Kate, as you know, because China is North Korea's biggest trading partner and they're the second largest economy in the world. Then we heard Nikki Haley, the ambassador to the United Nations really echo all of this calls for diplomatic means during that emergency session just a few minutes ago. Listen to what she said.</s>HALEY: We have kicked the can down the road long enough. There is no more road left. This crisis goes well beyond the U.N., the United States will look at every country that does business with North Korea as a country and the United States will look at every country that does business with North Korea as a country that is giving aid to their reckless and dangerous nuclear intentions.</s>COLLINS: And Kate, the South Korean government announced earlier this morning that their president was scheduled to have a phone call with President Trump this morning. So, we will keep you updated on any details we get from that call today?</s>BOLDUAN: No wrap up yet. No readout yet from that call, but we'll be sticking closely here exactly what happens. It seems, Kaitlan, that would be the first call since the nuclear test over the weekend and also the first since the president's tweet?</s>COLLINS: Absolutely. Yes. It would. We know that he spoke to the president of South Korea on Friday, but this phone call this morning would be the first one that he's had since that launch of that missile. The White House has not provided any details. They don't typically confirm these phone calls until after they've already happened.</s>BOLDUAN: Let's see what comes from that. Kaitlan, thank you so much. We really appreciate it. All right. So that from the White House. Let's head overseas right now where reaction has been coming in, of course, CNN's Will Ripley was in North Korea last week. He is joining me from Tokyo with more reaction from the region. So, Will, what are you hearing from there tonight over there?</s>WILL RIPLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Lot to unpack, Kate. Certainly, that shot across the bow aimed at China with Nikki Haley saying that anyone who trades with North Korea is trading with a nuclear pariah. China's ambassador saying that they will never accept chaos and war on the Korean Peninsula. China has said via state media editorials that they would step in if the U.S. launched a preemptive attack. That wasn't an official statement, of course. But it was a statement through the "Global Times," which often reveals some of the opinions, the hawkish opinions of the Chinese government here in Japan, continued messages in sync with the United States even though Japan is a passivist country. The Japanese ambassador on CNN's "NEW DAY" was talking about appreciating that the United States has Japan's back and is willing to keep the military option on the table. And then in South Korea, there's a lot of nervousness because it took more than 30 hours for President Trump to call President Moon Jae-in even though he had two conversations over that same time period with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe. And then you have North Korea with more threats, threatening to launch attacks against the United States, threatening to launch missiles toward the U.S. territory of Guam. So, you have escalating tensions, escalating rhetoric. Just right after North Korea's most powerful nuclear test to date. The chance they could launch another missile possibly to coincide with their major national holiday, their foundation day coming up on Saturday.</s>BOLDUAN: So Will, you've been in North Korea more than almost any other reporter. Do you get a sense from your time there -- do you get a sense of the end game right now? Everyone seems to have a take on it.</s>RIPLEY: Well, a lot of people are wondering why North Korea's leader, Kim Jong-un, would now be apparently preparing to launch another ballistic missile possibly an ICBM just after his nation's largest nuclear test to date. And the only thing that I can think of is that if you have to look at the messaging from North Korea. So last week, there was an editorial calling on the United States to change its view on North Korea, to accept North Korea as a nuclear power. Something North Korea has wanted for a very long time. Ambassador Haley saying that's not going to happen. Then you saw that picture release of Kim Jong-un standing in front of a hydrogen bomb, a miniaturize warhead, that they can put on an ICBM. And then few hours later, they blow up a hydrogen bomb underground, the largest artificial explosion that some seismologists have ever detected, magnitude 6.3 earthquake, a secondary 4.3 earthquake, likely a collapse underground as a result of this massive explosion. So, they have proven now that they have the largest nuclear weapon they've ever created. And then if they launch an ICBM toward the Pacific potentially in the direction of the U.S. territory of Guam, they're sending the message that, OK, they have the warhead. They tested the warhead. Now they have the missile. They're testing the missile. They're trying to tell the United States they need to change their view because North Korea is trying to prove that they have this weapon in their arsenal. And frankly, Kate, they may be trying to do it to get some discussions going before these sanctions really start to take effect. Because eventually if the round after round of sanctions is imposed, it is going to start hurting. But when I was in Pyongyang last week, I didn't see any visible impact of the sanctions. Cars are still on the roads. Lights are still on. People are still dining out at restaurants at least for now. But we know that sanctions take a while to take effect. So, maybe this is a blitz that North Korea hopes will lead to talks although the tone from the United States, from Nikki Haley, just within the last hour doesn't seem to indicate that. The U.S. still wants to punish North Korea and put pressure on them.</s>BOLDUAN: Yes. Not at all. If you hear Nikki Haley, that's not going to happen any time soon. That's for sure. Great to see you, Will. Thank you so much. Here with me now to discuss, Balbina Hwang, a Georgetown professor of Asian Politics. She was also a senior adviser to former U.S. ambassador to South Korea, Christopher Hill. Retired Colonel Steve Warren, he is a CNN military analyst and a former spokesman to the Pentagon. Jim Walsh is an international security analyst and MIT researcher, and Jamie Metzl, a former staff member of the National Security Council and State Department under President Bill Clinton. All great to you have here. Jamie, we played a couple bits of what we heard from Nikki Haley, the U.S. ambassador. We kicked the can down the road enough. There is no more road left. Nikki Haley wants stronger sanctions. The next step in sanctions would be what?</s>JAMIE METZL, FORMER STAFF MEMBER, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL: Well, there will be more sanctions. There will be stronger secondary sanctions. Those sanctions will affect Chinese companies and other companies that have been doing business with North Korea.</s>BOLDUAN: Do you get the indication that China is ready to sign on to those sanctions?</s>METZL: They'll sign on to stronger sanctions, but they're not going to sign on to sanctions or an embargo that is so strong that it threatens to undermine the stability of the North Korean regime. That's the essential point here. The North Koreans are making three big bets. One, that the U.S. doesn't have a realistic military option. Two, that China is going to feel ultimately that it's better off even with a nuclear armed North Korea than it is with Korean reunification and reunified allies with the United States. And three, they're betting on the fecklessness of the Trump administration and so far both -- all three of those are pretty good bets.</s>BOLDUAN: Well, in light of this, Balbina, speaking about China, the Chinese ambassador to the United Nations, the Security Council meeting has been going on this morning. And China said, the ambassador said that China will never allow chaos and war on the peninsula. What does that mean at this point?</s>PROFESSOR BALBINA HWANG, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO AMBASSADOR CHRISTOPHER HILL: Well, that's a very clear articulation that China will not do what it takes to destabilize and lead to the collapse of the North Korean regime. Look, I think the important thing about sanctions is not necessarily just to punish the regime itself or to create chaos in the society, but now it is very clear that we need to target sanctions to prevent that further proliferation and development of these weapons and delivery systems, the missiles.</s>BOLDUAN: And speaking about the missiles, Jim, you now have South Korea saying that they see North Korea preparing for another missile launch, a missile launch -- I mean, it could perhaps be less than a week since this nuclear test that happened just yesterday. What does that do? What's your take on that?</s>JIM WALSH, INTERNATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, I think you're right. It may be Saturday which is North Korea's Founder's Day. We may be back here in the studio then for that. Well, you know, I know most of our conversation focuses on sanctions. My colleague at Harvard, John Park and I did a study of sanctions. We interviewed North Koreans whose job it was to get around sanctions and they're very good at it. And we sort of keep doing the same thing. It seems to me that there's a real disconnect here. They can build missiles faster and test nuclear weapons faster than we can impose sanctions that would matter. We spend all the time talking about sanctions and they just keep testing away. I think that's -- you know, you keep doing the same thing over and over and over again and it fails, you should do something differently and in particular, small steps. It would be great, for example, if we had an ambassador, U.S. ambassador in South Korea. It's just astonishing that we have a rolling crisis here. It could get very dicey if someone makes a mistake, as a miscalculation or in this perception. And we don't have the president's representative in Seoul to help, you know, to help with our allies at a time when we are insulting our allies and calling them appeasers. I think, you know, yes, sanctions are important, but we spend too much time talking about that and not enough about the other things we need to be doing today to deal with this situation.</s>BOLDUAN: And part of that, of course, Colonel, was Jeff Blake said over the weekend that it's become cliche because there is no good military option and that's what people keep saying over and over again. The last word we heard from the administration though before this U.N. meeting, before Nikki Haley was from Defense Secretary James Mattis. It was a pretty important moment when he came out yesterday to speak. This is what he said.</s>JAMES MATTIS, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: Any threat to the United States or its territories including Guam or our allies will be met with a massive military response, a response both effective and overwhelming. We are not looking to the total annihilation of a country namely North Korea, but as I said, we have many options to do so.</s>BOLDUAN: Colonel, as many people noted since Mattis came out this is not a man that seeks out the spotlight and who wants to be the face on something like this. He is just not that -- that's not his personality. You know him. You heard that from James Mattis and you thought what? COLONEL STEVE WARREN</s>FORMER SPOKESMAN FOR DEFENSE SECRETARY JAMES MATTIS: Well, Secretary Mattis sort of set out two very important stakes in the ground. I think we shouldn't ignore. Stake number one is to remind the North Koreans that there is a military action. Don't forget who you're dealing with here. Sure, none of the military options are good and we've talked about that a lot, but those military options exist. And then I think the second important mistake that he laid out was that we are not interested in annihilating North Korea. So, he kind of put a left and right limit on what sort of how he sees this is beginning to develop and this was very important. Kind of a sober, thoughtful statesman like statement coming out of the secretary of defense that I think kind of frames up where the North Koreans can now move around. I think it's a very important message.</s>BOLDUAN: Well, you say, statesman like and Jamie then -- I'm left with where does this land on the statesman like scale? These tweets coming from President Trump over the weekend. You have one where he accuses South Korea of appeasement with North Korea. And another one saying that we're going to stop -- threatening to stop, he is considering to stop all trade with any country doing business with North Korea. That, of course, would be China. What does this do to the conversation?</s>METZL: Of course, that's a setup question because the lack of statesmanship by the president of the United States is a major destabilizing factor in world affairs and what we are seeing is even with Secretary Mattis --</s>BOLDUAN: Do his words destabilize at this point?</s>METZL: Absolutely, yes. The words and the actions. What does the president do? He assumes office. One, he limits our influence in the region by getting out of the Transpacific Partnership, by continually even more recently attacking our allies when we really need to be focusing on our adversaries. Contradicting his top cabinet officials. These tweets are so dangerous and they are doing so much damage to the United States and our allies at a time when we need to be standing together. And that's what is really worrying. Everybody knows that Kim Jong-un is a destabilizing factor. He's moving towards developing a nuclear weapon, but now there is this additional variable of Donald Trump and nobody knows what Donald Trump is going to do. That is making matters even worse.</s>BOLDUAN: I know Jamie you would like to debate me on at any moment at any time. I for one am interested what comes from this phone call with the South Korean president and President Trump. Hopefully, we'll get a read out. All I really appreciate it. Thank you so much on this very important story. Coming up for us, the backlash from both sides of the aisle after reports say that President Trump is expected to end the program that protects children of undocumented immigrants. Where is he headed? Where does this take the country? Where does it take the Republican Party if he does? Plus, President Trump's EPA says at least 13 toxic waste sites in Texas were hit by Hurricane Harvey. How they're handling the threat and what it means for folks on the ground. That's ahead.