Syria Tops Agenda At G7 Meeting; Syria Strikes Leave Trump Admin Sending Mixed Signals; Renewed Scrutiny Of Russia-Syria Relations; U.N.: 400,000 Syrians Killed In Syrian Conflict; Venezuelan Opposition Leader Banned From Politics; Policeman Killed In Westminster Attack Laid To Rest.  Aired 11-11:30 p.m. ET
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN TODAY ANCHOR: Tonight on the program, Syria takes center stage as G7 foreign ministers made following the chemical weapons attack that put Moscow and Washington on a diplomatic collision course. I'm going to be joined by former U.S. State Department Spokesman John Kirby, and in Russia, pro-Kremlin analyst, Sergey Markov. Plus, the voice of Venezuela's opposition, Henrique Capriles on standing up to President Maduro despite being banned from politics.</s>HENRIQUE CAPRILES, VENEZUELAN OPPOSITION LEADER (through translator): We have an unpopular government. A government which elected of his way of dictatorship. And we are happy to bring down the dictatorship by way of votes.</s>HOLMES: Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the program. I'm Michael Holmes sitting in for Christiane Amanpour. Now, Syria, the top of the agenda. The foreign ministers at a meeting of the G7 in Italy, most of all for the American Secretary of State Rex Tillerson. In the wake of those airstrikes on Syria, his administration seems in a crisis of conscience. Although, just want its America first foreign policy is. And, oh, what a difference a week makes America's UN ambassador had said that Assad leaving office was no longer an American priority. On Sunday, she had this to say.</s>NIKKI HALEY, UNITED STATES AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: Regime change is something that we think is going to happen because all of the parties are going to see that Assad's not the leader that needs to be taking place for Syria. So, what I think you're saying is, this isn't about policy or not. This is about thoughts. And so, when you look at the thoughts, there is no political solution that any of us can see with Assad at the - at the lead.</s>HOLMES: And the White House Press Secretary has just reiterated that the Trump administration believes Syria will never be stable with Assad at the helm. It's an about face certain, of course, tension in Moscow, where the American Secretary of State is headed next. Well, what can we expect from that visit? John Kirby is a man whom I know, retired Navy Admiral, Assistant Secretary of State for Public Affairs from 2015 to 2017, joins me now from Washington, and thanks for doing so. So, what will Rex Tillerson be looking for from the Russians? Everyone says they should be taught negotiations, a ceasefire transition, and the Russians are needed for all of that. What would you advise him?</s>JOHN KIRBY, FORMER UNITED STATES STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: My best advice to Secretary Tillerson would be, number one, to be able to ride through the Russian criticism that he's going to get, and to be just as pugilistic as he has been over the last couple of days when he talks about Russia and their role, and their complicity in what's been going on in Syria. So, they're going to</s>HOLMES: And that is the risk that you overpromise in a way, by carrying out a strike like this, and then under deliver. What - when it comes to Assad, I suppose the big question is, what's the alternative? If he suddenly went overnight for some reason, what is there to replace him? I mean, these days, the "opposition" is largely a -- just a desperate group of factions dominated in many cases by jihadists and the new</s>KIRBY: You are so right. That is the big fear, and that is why the Russians continue pop -- prop up Assad. It's not because they love Assad, it's because they don't want the regime to collapse in a chaotic unstructured way that puts their security interests at risk in Syria. They've had a long relationship with Syria going back 30 years of presence there. They don't want to give that up. It's their foothold, it's their toehold into the Middle East. That's why they're propping up Assad. And so - and all I would say is I'd recommend that Secretary Tillerson go back and read the four Geneva communiques and one - I'm sorry. Three Geneva and one Vienna communique that Secretary Kerry helped co-author, which lays out the framework for political transition to get to Syria that doesn't have Assad in power but does it in an orderly fashion that gives the Syrian people a say in a vote and a process. And it also calls for a process by which the opposition, which you're so right, is not very well- led and structured. But, it gives them a vehicle to sit down with members of the regime and try to hammer out that transition. It's there. All they have to do is read it and go back and try to restructure.</s>HOLMES: And these strikes seems to have - well, it's changed their headlines but really in effect what else? I mean, you've touched on this. What is the U.S. strategy, the policy? The risk seems to be if Assad uses chemical weapons against, well, where does that road lead?</s>KIRBY: Yes, that's tough. It's tough to say that. So they've indicated, and I just saw Sean Spicer say again just a few minutes ago that they're willing to do more. But I don't know what that means. Do more if he does another chemical attack? Well, if he doesn't do that but he continues to kill and by large the hundreds of thousands of Syrians, most of them have not been killed by chemical attacks. Are you going to step in when he does something in a large-scale conventional way? So, where is that line? And what are you going to do if he crosses that line again? And I don't think that they thought this thing through too carefully. I don't think they have a full appreciation for the power of diplomacy here. They did a successful strike that was targeted for limited purposes and they achieved those purposes, but obviously Assad still has the capacity, the capability to visit violence on his own people. Where is the line going to be?</s>HOLMES: And, John, and then you mentioned this, and it really is the point. And that is, the people are dying, they've been dying for years. There were more airstrikes today. That bloodshed goes on. What lesson has Syria learned as you point out, the vast majority of death by conventional weapons, although brutally indiscriminate, barrel bombs. No one sends a message about those.</s>KIRBY: Right. I think that's - I think that is the quintessential problem now that the Trump administration faces, as it looks at Syria. The only - the only way out is a political solution, a diplomatic solution. The entire international community agrees on that. No military solution is going to solve the Civil War, but now they've put their thumb on the scale in the Civil War in a way that the Obama administration wasn't willing to do in terms of using military force against the regime. So where does that go; how far are you going to employ that if it doesn't have the deterrent effect that you have now tried to have it - have it -- make it -- make it occur. So, I think this is a real dilemma, a real problem. And I don't know that they have thought this carefully through enough from a policy perspective, as they should have.</s>HOLMES: Because you can back yourself into a corner here pretty quickly. I mean, if you're going to start dealing with Assad's brutality, what that requires a level of escalation engagement. So, let's face it, there is no domestic appetite for.</s>KIRBY: No, that's right. Look, military action should always be a servant to the diplomacy, not the other way around. Unless you're an all-out war, obviously that's a different matter but in any case like this where you can escalate or deescalate tensions in military solution should really be subservient to diplomatic ones. And I'd like to see that they are going use this visit in Mosco which they absolutely should to try to build some sort of diplomatic consensus going forward.</s>HOLMES: John Kirby, as always, great to get your analysis. Thanks so much.</s>KIRBY: My pleasure. Thank you.</s>HOLMES: All right. Let's get the view now on how this is playing in Russia, Sergey Markov former M.P. for Putin's United Russia Party joins us via Skype from Sochi in Russia. And thanks for doing so. Before I ask you a question, I actually just want to play you some sound from the U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson speaking about Russia. Let's play that and come back on the other side.</s>TILLERSON: Regardless of whether Russia was complicit here or whether they were simply incompetent or whether they got outwitted by the Bashar al- Assad regime you would have to ask the Russians that question. But clearly, they have failed in their commitment to the international community.</s>HOLMES: What he's referring to there, of course, is the 2013 horrific chemical attack by Bashar al-Assad after which Russia was put in charge of getting rid of serious chemical weapons, getting them decommissioned, and then this latest attack happens. Does Russia as some in the U.S. suggest bear some responsibility?</s>SERGEY MARKOV, FORMER M.P. FOR UNITED RUSSIA PARTY (via skype): I think that Russia don't have weapons</s>HOLMES: So, that</s>MARKOV (via Skype): We're saying that in the moment when there are real war against jihadist and</s>HOLMES: When it comes to the U.S.-Russia relations, I mean, it was in November that you said a Trump presidency would make it more likely that the U.S. would agree with Russia on Syria. This month, you said Mr. Trump was weak, domestically isolated, and that he uses action to lift his popularity. How do you see the Russia-Trump relationship right now?</s>MARKOV (via Skype): Now, Russia</s>HOLMES: What do you - what do you think Mr. Putin's aim down in Syria? What do you think he wants?</s>MARKOV: I think Mr. Putin want a Syria that no chance for jihadist or Islamic State and Jabhat an-Nusrah to take</s>HOLMES: Sergey Makarov, thanks so much.</s>MARKOV: My pleasure.</s>HOLMES: Now, from Russia to President Putin's pick for the French elections, the National Front's Marine Le Pen has provoked uproar for claiming that France was not responsible for the World War II round up of years. Which sent tens of thousands of French