Interviews With Condoleezza Rice, Richard Myers
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: AMERICAN MORNING begins right now.</s>ANNOUNCER: From the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is AMERICAN MORNING with Bill Hemmer and Soledad O'Brien.</s>O'BRIEN: Good morning, welcome to Friday everybody. We're going to have more on some of the questions that came out of that press conference in just a little bit. Of course one year ago today the first U.S. bombs fell near Baghdad in an attempt to catch Saddam Hussein off guard. Also the war with Iraq began. We've got lots to cover this morning. We're going to get to our conversation with the national security adviser Condoleezza Rice. Also we talked to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Richard Myers.</s>BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It is a busy Friday. Much more, too, on the fighting in the badlands of northwestern Pakistan. We'll talk to a professor at the U.S. Army War College who has spent time in the region and can talk about the unique challenges conducting operations there. This was news hour upon hour yesterday, we will continue with that today; let you know what we can find out from half a world away.</s>O'BRIEN: Fighting there continues as well. Good morning.</s>JACK CAFFERTY, CNN ANCHOR: How you doing? Pickiest people on the face of the earth, us Americans. We want what we want when we want it and if we don't get it we'll invent it so we can have it when we want it. And whoever's in second place is so far in the rearview mirror we can't even figure out who it might be. We'll take a look at that.</s>HEMMER: We'll like it. Thank you, Jack.</s>O'BRIEN: Look forward to that. All right, Jack thanks. Top story now. Pakistani forces say they have surrounded some 200 al Qaeda fighters in a remote mountainous region near the Afghanistan border, and they believe that they have cornered Osama bin Laden's number two man, Ayman al-Zawahiri. In just a moment, we're going to hear from national security adviser Condoleezza Rice, but first let's take you live to the Pentagon where Barbara Starr is standing by for us this morning. Barbara, good morning.</s>BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Soledad. At this hour by all accounts, the battle in Pakistan continues to rage on. Reports coming in that the Pakistani government is moving in more troops and continuing an air operation against these fighters that are said to be holed up. The Pakistani minister of information saying today that his government expects this operation to be finished within 48 hours one way or the other. Deadlines to surrender that have been given to these fighters have now passed. They do believe but are not certain that Ayman al-Zawahiri is holed up in this area. The emphasis is that they are not certain, but they have every reason to believe that he is there. The belief is whoever is there in this remote border region will fight to the death. Now, as far as the U.S. military goes, the U.S. military has in recent days and weeks provided assistance to the Pakistanis. Communications, intelligence, reconnaissance. That sort of thing. No one is saying whether the military is participating in this particular operation, but Soledad, perhaps what is most interesting this morning is what is not being talked about -- where is Osama bin Laden -- is he somewhere inside this potential dragnet or has he already escaped, has moved, and is on the run? Everything quite uncertain at this hour, Soledad.</s>O'BRIEN: And no question about that, Barbara. Question for you, though. Zawahiri -- people have often described him as Osama bin Laden's number two but beyond that, who is he and what kind of real power does he have inside of al Qaeda?</s>STARR: Well by all accounts, he is Osama bin Laden's closest confidant. He is most often referred to as the brains of al Qaeda. The two men met in the 1980s. In 1998, he was charged in the attacks on the U.S. embassies in Africa. 1999, sentenced to death in absentia in Egypt. He is believed to have played a very important role in the 9/11 attacks here in the United States. He is clearly Osama bin Laden's closest confidant, always believed that the two men if they don't move together that they always operate nearby. What communication they have at this point with each other no one knows.</s>O'BRIEN: Barbara Starr is at the Pentagon for us this morning. Barbara thanks. We're going to continue to check in with you throughout the morning, of course. Bill.</s>HEMMER: Soledad, if the White House is at all optimistic today that Osama bin Laden's second in command will be captured it is most definitely cautious optimism. Ayman al-Zawahiri capture or death would be a major coup in the war on terror, especially on a day like today, marking the one year anniversary of the Iraqi invasion. Bit earlier I talked with the national security adviser, Dr. Condoleezza Rice, asking her what she knows today and what she is hearing from Pakistan.</s>CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: We really only have the reports that I think everyone has seen, that there is indeed a fierce battle going on up in these territories on the Afghan-Pakistan border. It's a difficult area, it is in fact an area that has been largely ungovernable for more than 100 years and so it's a fierce battle. We don't know who is there, but we will soon see.</s>HEMMER: Why do you think the speculation is so strong that it's al-Zawahiri?</s>RICE: Well, I suspect it's because people are fighting very fiercely and the Pakistanis seem to believe that they've got a high- value target surrounded. They do these operations quite frequently and they know that territory but I think we don't have any confirmation but that is -- that he is indeed there.</s>HEMMER: Are you dismissing the Pakistani claim, then?</s>RICE: No, not at all. I think that the Pakistanis know their business but I think we have to wait and see precisely who is there and to see when we can -- to see when we will find that out, and I assume later on today or tomorrow we will. But it's a fierce battle, there's no doubt about that.</s>HEMMER: Dr. Rice, there's a suggestion that this might be Pakistani hype. We're a partner in the war on terrorism, watch us now. You're reaction to that possibility.</s>RICE: The Pakistanis have been terrific. Many of the al Qaeda leaders that we have rounded up have been thanks to the Pakistanis and so they are not hyping their activities. They've been one of the best of our allies on the war on terrorism. It's just that the situation is of course uncertain because there is no way to verify precisely who they've got pinned down.</s>HEMMER: If you get him, the war continues, the war on terror. You said that yesterday repeatedly. But what would a capture or kill mean for that current war?</s>RICE: Well, obviously, if you can take out one of the most important leaders in al Qaeda that's an important step. Really important step but as we've said al Qaeda is a network and you have to break up the network. We've already captured and killed two thirds of their known leadership. That has been a blow against the organization. And the capture of a major al Qaeda figure would also be a major blow. But we have to do this systematically over time. There is no silver bullet to disbanding al Qaeda.</s>HEMMER: American help in involvement in Pakistan today. I understand there is aerial help. Are Americans on the ground and as you understand helping the Pakistanis at this point?</s>RICE: Bill, I can't comment on any operational matters here, but to say that we obviously would help the Pakistanis in any way that they deemed necessary -- but the Pakistanis are the ones who've been really involved in that area and they are the ones who are putting in the fight.</s>HEMMER: If I could shift our focus to Iraq quickly. A year ago today, March 19, the war began over Baghdad. There's a piece on the front page of "The Washington Post" today suggesting that Commanders on the ground now believe that the extremists, the Islamic extremists, are the ones who are truly pulling the punches today throughout Iraq and not the former Ba'ath Party leaders. Giving the suggestion yet again to the critics who say that Iraq has actually given birth to more terrorists, as opposed to cutting off that system from Iraq. How will the White House defend itself on that claim?</s>RICE: Well first of all these are hardened terrorists and they were not drinking tea someplace. These were people who were fighting the jihad, they were fighting the jihad someplace in the world and many of them were fighting it in Iraq. Zawahiri, the one battle leader for al Qaeda in Iraq was there before the war; he was in and out of Baghdad, he had operatives in Baghdad who ordered the hit on the American diplomat in Jordan. Iraq was in important supporter of terrorist activities. The al Qaeda are coming into Iraq where the al Qaeda affiliates are coming into Iraq because they know that Iraq is a central front in the war on terrorism and they know that when Iraq is peaceful and democratic and more stable and no longer in the hands of a brutal dictator like Saddam Hussein, that their evil designs are going to be seriously harmed by the emergence of a different kind of Iraq and ultimately a different kind of Middle East. Zawahiri knows why he's in Iraq and he's there because he knows that he cannot afford to lose. He in fact said we're running out of time in the letter, the famous letter that was found of his. He said we're running out of time because when the Iraqis take this over it's going to be much more difficult to do what we're doing.</s>HEMMER: National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice moments ago. A $25 million reward has been offered for information leading to the capture of al-Zawahiri. Yesterday the House unanimously voted to double the reward for Osama bin Laden. $25 to $50 million. That bill also allows the State Department, interestingly enough, to offer goods such as automobiles or household appliances as a reward instead of cash. Now Soledad with more.</s>O'BRIEN: On the one-year anniversary of the Iraq war, President Bush noted the capture of Saddam Hussein as a U.S. accomplishment.</s>GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And so in one year's time, Saddam Hussein has gone from a palace to a bunker to a spider hole to jail.</s>O'BRIEN: This morning we asked one of the chief military planners whether he considers the operation in Iraq a success. General Richard Myers is Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and he joins us from the Pentagon this morning to talk about that. Also the prospect that al Qaeda's number two man might be on the verge of being captured. Sir, good morning to you. Thank you for being with us.</s>GEN. RICHARD MYERS, CHAIRMAN JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF: Good morning, Soledad.</s>O'BRIEN: Let's in fact begin with al-Zawahiri. The big question, of course, is is it him or not. What's your suspicion? What's the likelihood about the action that's going on in the remote area of Pakistan right now? Do you think it is him?</s>MYERS: I think we have to wait and see. I think there's a lot that we need to understand about what's going on. The one thing I think we heard Dr. Rice a little earlier is that this is relatively new territory for the Pakistani armed forces. We've conducted now several operations in the so-called travel areas. This is one of them. Apparently, according to their sources, they have a pretty good fight on their hands. We're just going to have to wait and see which high-value target they have.</s>O'BRIEN: If it is him, what do you think the capture would mean for the war on terrorism. How far does it go to dismantle the network that we just heard Dr. Rice talking about?</s>MYERS: Well, it's like the capture of Saddam Hussein in Iraq. It's -- and the other al Qaeda operatives that we've -- the high-level operatives that we've captured -- or killed -- it's one step in a many-step process to defeat international terrorism. So by itself it's not going to stop plots that were already underway, it's not going to stop some of these operatives from continuing to operate, but when you take the head off an organization it's obviously going to have an impact. He's been around for a long time in this organization, supporting it and leading it so it will be a significant event but it will just be one more step in many steps that have to happen.</s>O'BRIEN: Is your expectation that it would lead to the capture of Osama bin Laden?</s>MYERS: Well certainly if you capture somebody like al-Zawahiri, that would be good news because presumably he knows where UBL is or where he was and if he talks or if he is captured with documents or other material you might be able to find out where some of the other leadership is, absolutely.</s>O'BRIEN: I'd like to turn now and talk a little bit about Iraq and the one year anniversary, which begins today. As we approach the June 30 handover you have 120,000 troops now inside of Iraq. When do you expect these troops to go home?</s>MYERS: Well, we're going to stay there until the job is done. And I might mention it's just not 120,000 U.S. forces, we have 24,000 coalition forces. Totals up to 35 nations in Iraq right now trying to give hope and freedom to the Iraqi people plus over 200,000 Iraqis in various security organizations. And as we've noted recently some of the attacks from the Jihadists and the former regime elements are against these Iraqi security forces, yet there are more people lining up to take part in freeing their country.</s>O'BRIEN: In the wake of two bombings in just a couple of days, it appears that Islamic militants are now entrenched in Iraq. It's not clear of the hit and run attacks that we've spoken about earlier done by the supporters of the regime. Is this progress, then as the war on terror been made worse or has been made better?</s>MYERS: Well my view -- you know -- it's just continuous progress and providing security in Iraq is a very important thing and first on this anniversary I think we have to pay tribute to those members of our armed forces that have participated in this war on terrorism all over the globe. I mean, they're the reason that we're being successful. The nature of the threat has changed a little bit in Iraq. It appears. And but we'll be successful; we'll continue to develop intelligence. We're taking the fight to the enemy. Both in Afghanistan and in Iraq and other places. And we will ultimately be successful. I would also say after a year in Iraq that the political progress that's been made has been tremendous. We now have a transitional administrative law going to Iraqi sovereignty here at the end of June on the economic side the infrastructure, as dilapidated as it was all productions about at pre- war levels, electricity exceeds pre-war levels. Security -- we've got more work to do. And we must continue to improve.</s>O'BRIEN: Hans Blix said that the action in Iraq has made the war on terror worse, not better. Your reaction to that?</s>MYERS: No, I don't think -- I personally don't subscribe to that theory. I think we've been able to keep the pressure; the international community has kept the pressure on the war on terrorism on all fronts. I mean this is -- this is not something you can just pick and choose one country or one area to fight in. It's got to be fought all over the world and it's got to be fought by the international community. This is one time when the international community really has to pull together because this threat is very pervasive, these terrorists are everywhere. We've seen bombings literally all around the world. To think that we can ignore one area is -- would be a mistake.</s>O'BRIEN: General Richard Myers, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs. Thanks for being with us this morning, sir. We appreciate it.</s>MYERS: Thanks Soledad.</s>HEMMER: We mentioned at the outset this is a very busy news day. I want to get you to Taipei, Taiwan. Earlier today shots rang out on the campaign trail. The president and the vice-president of Taiwan were shot while campaigning along a parade route. Both were grazed slightly. A spokesperson says the president shot in the stomach. The injuries not believed to be life threatening. The vice-president also wounded. The shootings come as the island gets ready for a weekend presidential elections including this controversial referendum that China considers a step toward independence. We are told that both were taken to the hospital and since that time reports indicate that they have been treated and released and are said to be all right, and weekend elections are still expected to go on as scheduled. Get you updated from there as well. Mike Chinoy is working that story in Taipei for us today as well.</s>O'BRIEN: Let's get -- see what's coming up this morning. The fate of former Tyco chief Dennis Kozlowski. The jury now holding the cards on that. Andy Serwer will talk to us about that.</s>HEMMER: Also an officer helping a stranded motorist gets an unexpected jolt. That story as well when we continue right after this. A busy Friday morning here on AMERICAN MORNING.</s>HEMMER: Time to check in with our friend Andy. The Tyco jury considering the fate of Dennis Kozlowski. A huge case in the financial world. Also the latest shopping spree from the folks at Adelphia. Andy Serwer first check on our Friday morning, "Minding Your Business." Good morning. Tyco first.</s>ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Yes, let's do our DTU again, right? Daily trial update.</s>O'BRIEN: Daily trial update.</s>SERWER: OK, startling developments you guys out of the Kozlowski trial yesterday. It appears perhaps the jury may be siding with Dennis Kozlowski and Mark Schwartz. The CFO and the CEO who allegedly looting hundreds of millions of dollars from the company. Why do we think that? Well, the jury sent the judge a note saying can a defendant who believes he or she is not committing a crime ever be found to act with criminal intent? Well, you know, silly me. I always thought ignorance of the law was no excuse. I mean, I found some of my kids with a box of cookies in their room and I said hey, what are you doing? They said we didn't know it was wrong. Well, it's wrong. And this could be really interesting. Also an alternate juror interviewed yesterday saying he thought that the prosecution appeared to be clumsy and the defense lawyers were suave. Wow. May not bode well for prosecution.</s>HEMMER: CNN analyst.</s>O'BRIEN: Andy Serwer.</s>SERWER: Yes, well.</s>HEMMER: Giving Toobin a run for his money.</s>O'BRIEN: Senior junior analyst.</s>SERWER: Yes, thank you. And then if we move on to the Adelphia trial...</s>O'BRIEN: Out of control. You know you'd think Michael was bad and then you move into Adelphia it's like completely out of control.</s>SERWER: And the implications here are if it's OK to do this stuff and you didn't know it was wrong maybe these guys would be getting off too? I don't know; maybe we're really early on this one. The Rigas family -- you got to hand it to these people, they do like golf. They spent a lot of money playing golf. Company money that is. Going to Pebble Beach, playing golf at courses in South Carolina. Yesterday in testimony we learned they spent $13 million of the company's money on the golf course. Building a golf course. Well, nice work if you can get it. Also, I loved this here in Coudersport, which is where the company was founded, headquartered -- they spent money on a bed and breakfast. The Old Hickory -- B&B; there -- filled it up with a half a million dollars worth of antiques. And the beat goes on.</s>HEMMER: Has there been much market reaction to all this?</s>SERWER: No. There's not a whole lot of market reaction. The market is very interested in who's going to buy Adelphia. That's possible, including Time Warner, our parent company. But you know it's just -- it's fun to watch. It's interesting and we're seeing this fallout from a period in our economic history that was not so rosy.</s>O'BRIEN: They seem to have better taste than Tyco folks but that's just my personal feeling.</s>SERWER: That's your personal take. OK.</s>O'BRIEN: Thanks Andy. Still to come this morning, we'll take you back to Pakistan to find out if troops there are getting closer in the hunt for al Qaeda's number two leader. A look at that as AMERICAN MORNING continues.