'New Yorker' Cover an Outrage?; Is Obama Backing Off Pledge to Withdraw From Iraq?
HOWARD KURTZ, HOST (voice over): Malice or mockery? Is this "New Yorker" cover on Barack Obama what it seems, an outrage? War and words. The press says Barack Obama is backing off his call for a withdrawal from Iraq. He calls that a media distortion. Should Fox and everyone else have reported Jesse Jackson's off- mike insult against Obama? And why is the senator putting his young daughters before the camera? We'll ask Maria Menounos of "Access Hollywood." Tabloid fodder. Lara Logan's Baghdad affair; Christie Brinkley's sleazy divorce trial; the soap opera of Madonna, A-Rod, A-Rod's wife -- why the media can never get enough. And the passing of Tony Snow, a happy warrior in journalism and in politics.</s>KURTZ: We're throwing out the script this morning. I want to get right to this magazine cover. It's a remarkable, some would say incendiary, cover. There it is up on the screen. "The New Yorker" magazine has Barack and Michelle Obama. She's got the -- it looks like an AK-47 strapped around her, he's got the Muslim garb. There's a picture off to the right -- you can't quite make it out there -- of Osama bin Laden on the wall, and the American flag burning in the fireplace. Joining us right now to talk about this and some other campaign issues, from Seattle, Michael Medved, host of "The Michael Medved Show" on the Salem Radio Network. And here in Washington, Clarence Page, columnist for "The Chicago Tribune." And CNN correspondent Jessica Yellin. Michael Medved, you've had a chance to look at this "New Yorker" cover. What do you make of it?</s>MICHAEL MEDVED, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Well, it's obviously succeeding in getting attention. I think it's tacky, I think it's outrageous, and it's just a bid to actually get to you read an article that is remarkably pro-Obama. And again, in good taste in the middle of a campaign? Absolutely not.</s>KURTZ: I talked to the editor of "The New Yorker," David Remnick, who tells me this is a satire, that they are making fun of all the rumors...</s>MEDVED: Right.</s>KURTZ: ... Clarence Page, and all the false allegations about Obama's upbringing and so forth. Does it work on that level?</s>CLARENCE PAGE, "THE CHICAGO TRIBUNE": You know, look at history, Howard. I remember a few years ago, when "The New Yorker" had a cover at a time of great black/Jewish tension in New York. You had a cartoon of an obvious Orthodox Jewish male kissing a black woman, and this created a lot of buzz. That's what it is, buzz. It's discussion. It's talk. And that's what covers are supposed to do. So I think, you know, it's quite within the normal realms of journalism.</s>KURTZ: But not everyone may react to this thing.</s>JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, it's very provocative. And it both overstates what -- it's obviously untrue. They are not Muslim. They are not trying to overthrow the American government and. And it also overstates what the Republicans are doing. This is not a message machines that's coming from John McCain's campaign. These are rumors generated on the Internet, and it's general buzz out there.</s>KURTZ: Barry Blitt is the artist, and there is one true thing here. It does have the fist bump. They do do that, or at least did it once. And I just think...</s>PAGE: You know what inspired that? On Fox News, a woman who said, "What is that, a terrorist handshake?" Something like that.</s>KURTZ: Terrorist, yes. Right. That was a tease that was later apologized for...</s>PAGE: That's what the cover is about. It's just lampooning all the crazy ignorance out there, and I hope the American people are more intelligent than that. I think they are, most of them.</s>KURTZ: All right. Let me move on now to another subject. You know, the press loves more than just about anything to zap candidates for changing their position, but what happens when the candidate insists that the journalists are wrong, that there's no shift, no flip-flop, no move to the center? Barack Obama says he hasn't altered his stance on with drawing from Iraq at all. Media reports to the contrary. But I'll have to say this: When you have to hold two news conferences on the same afternoon on the same subject, as Obama did last week, you've got a communications problem. Here's the Illinois senator meeting the press.</s>SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have a chance to talk to some of the commanders on the ground. I'm sure I'll have more information and will continue to refine my policies.</s>KURTZ: "Refine my policies." Well, here's Obama after summoning reporters just hours later.</s>OBAMA: Apparently I wasn't clear enough this morning on my position with respect to the war in Iraq. I have said throughout this campaign that this war was ill conceived, that it was a strategic blunder, and that it needs to come to an end.</s>KURTZ: Michael Medved, is Obama changing his position on Iraq and is the press calling him on it?</s>MEDVED: Well, the press isn't calling him on it enough. The one thing that struck me was, you remember how Richard Nixon used to say, "Let me make one thing perfectly clear." Barack Obama was saying just about that. He said, "I want to be completely clear about this." And any time a politician is saying, "I'm going to be completely clear," what usually follows is obfuscation, not clarity. Look, the point is he's a smart guy. He's going -- what's the point of his going to Iraq unless he is going to consider altering or shading or changing somehow his particular strategy? So he's caught. He either doesn't go to Iraq, or he goes to Iraq and says, well, it doesn't matter the fact that I'm going to Iraq, because I'm not going to change anyway. So the guy really is stuck right now.</s>KURTZ: True or false, Clarence Page, Obama is moderating his position a bit, as candidates tend to do in general elections, and journalists smell a flip-flop?</s>PAGE: On the Iraq issue, Obama said in September, during a debate to Tim Russert that, yes, I'm willing to adjust to changes, changing realities on the ground. And we'd say he was crazy if he didn't say that, you know? No, the fact is he still says he wants to get all the troops out in 16 months, but he's also allowing that if that's not possible, or changing realities could change that timetable. That's still a big difference from John McCain, who has also begun to hint at a timetable, but he's saying 2013.</s>KURTZ: Well, I think in tone both John McCain and Barack Obama are emphasizing different parts of their position.</s>PAGE: Sure.</s>KURTZ: But let me play for you, Jessica Yellin, a comment from Senator Obama last week. And this kind of got lost over the July 4th holidays, where he appeared to put the blame at -- well, I'll let you watch.</s>OBAMA: The press -- I mean, I'm not trying to dump on you guys, but I'm surprised at how finely calibrated every single word was measured. You know, I wasn't saying anything that I hadn't said before.</s>KURTZ: He's saying it's all a creation of you knit-pickers in the press.</s>YELLIN: Well, that's a little silly. This is a man who knows the power of words and has to understand what he says on the trail is going to be picked apart. One of the things that's fascinating about the Obama campaign, if you report a story and you're sort of the only person, or you're the first person out there, they will call you up and say, you're alone on this, you're out of your mind, this isn't right. Then when you're reporting what everyone else is reporting it's just pact mentality, you're following the RNC. And that's what happened on this story. They accused the press of just following the RNC. What Obama has done is he's shifted emphasis on this issue, and it's fair to report that, and it should be reported.</s>KURTZ: And Michael Medved, Clarence Page makes the point that Obama, you know, would be silly to stick to a rigid 16-month pullout plan. And, in fact, he's gotten some favorable editorials for appearing to be more open-minded on exactly -- on the pace and timing of an American withdrawal from Iraq.</s>MEDVED: Well, of course he has. And by the way, I think Clarence is completely correct. Barack Obama is doing what any candidate has to do, is going to the center. McCain is doing the same thing. You win your primary on the left if you're a Democrat, on the right if you're a Republican. And then you move to the center. And the fact that he's doing that is not extraordinary. What's extraordinary is the fact that he's denying doing that. And part of that may be -- I mean, Cynthia McKinney just got nominated for the Green Party. She's claiming she's going to go for 5 percent of the vote and that will be a big success for the Green Party candidacy. Does Obama have some potential problems on his left? I think he does.</s>KURTZ: That's the former Georgia congresswoman. But here's the point now. On McCain, I don't see the press making a big deal about the fact that he was at one point talking about, well, we could stay in Iraq for 100 years, meaning in the sense of maintaining a military base there. But now he is at least raising the possibility of withdrawal, and so is Prime Minister Maliki.</s>PAGE: Yes.</s>KURTZ: And this morning's paper report that the Bush administration is considering pulling out additional divisions and combat units from Iraq.</s>PAGE: You know, why aren't we talking more about all of this? I mean, this change is happening in the politics of Iraq right now, but there's also other changes happening, some of which we we'll get to, other stories going on that I think have just crowded it out.</s>KURTZ: But are you suggesting that the media hold Obama to a higher standard, or at least fly spec his words more carefully?</s>PAGE: Howard, he's a better story. He's a better -- he's a more attractive story. Oh, yes, he's got more of the spotlight, good and bad. I mean, McCain is really kind of fighting for attention here, and in some ways that benefits him. In other ways, though, it doesn't help him.</s>YELLIN: While we're honing in on their areas of weakness, I mean, John McCain does get a lot of heat for flip-flopping or inconsistency on issues of the economy. Barack Obama's getting it more on issues related to Iraq and national security.</s>KURTZ: All right. Let me get to the issue that you alluded to, Clarence Page, and that is Jesse Jackson, who was picked up on a microphone before an appearance on Fox News -- and this came out days afterwards. And what's fascinating here is, before these comments, which we'll show you in a second, were broadcast on "The O'Reilly Factor," Jesse Jackson phoned in to CNN and talked to Wolf Blitzer in a kind of a preemptive damage control. Let's watch that.</s>WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: If you could right now speak to Senator Obama from your heart, what would you say to him?</s>REV. JESSE JACKSON, RAINBOW PUSH COALITION: That any hurt or harm caused his campaign, I apologize, because I have such high regard for him. And this is part redemptive moment, and I'm a part of it.</s>KURTZ: And it was about four hours later that the O'Reilly show actually showed the tape, some of what Obama -- excuse me, what Jesse Jackson had been caught saying. Let's watch that.</s>JACKSON: See, Barack's been talking down to black people on this faith based. I want to cut his</s>BILL O'REILLY, "THE O'REILLY FACTOR": We're not out to get Jesse Jackson. We're not out to embarrass him and we're not out to make him look bad. If we were, we would have used what we have, which is more damaging than what you've heard.</s>KURTZ: Now Clarence, you talked...</s>PAGE: Who's that...</s>KURTZ: Yes, I saw that guy.</s>PAGE: The one that he was talking to.</s>KURTZ: Moonlighting on other networks. You talked to Jesse soon after.</s>PAGE: He called me.</s>KURTZ: He called you.</s>PAGE: He called me before I could call him. I mean, you know -- and...</s>KURTZ: Did he call you because he thought he would get a sympathetic hearing? Another Chicago guy who's known him a long time?</s>PAGE: Well, you know, he didn't have any guarantees. He thanked me after the O'Reilly show for not being tougher on him. But, no, he was very concerned about his image, very concerned about this whole flap, because the story hadn't even broke yet, and here he was sending out statements. And you could see the confusion at CNN. You know, what's he talking about here? But this was very damaging for Jesse Jackson. It exposed a side of Jackson that he has not wanted exposed out there. He was trying to start his own little whisper campaign, or keep it going in regard to Obama. I think because he wasn't getting his phone calls returned from the Obama campaign. I think this is both ideological and personal mixed up here.</s>KURTZ: Well, if you're going to have a whisper campaign, don't whisper in front of a microphone.</s>PAGE: Thank you.</s>KURTZ: Michael Medved, are the media going rather easy on Jackson here? By which I mean, it's being treated like he just let a curse word slip, when, in fact, he made a racial attack on a man who he professes to support for president.</s>MEDVED: Yes. I think there's much too much attention on this, because, look, the truth of the matter is that Jesse Jackson isn't a significant part of the Obama campaign. As a matter of fact, remember, Bill Clinton got in a world of trouble when he tried to compare the Obama campaign to the Jackson campaign. In some sense, I think that people say that, well, this is -- people are going very hard on Jesse Jackson. This may be something that Reverend Jackson actually relishes, because who even was paying attention to him until he used some extremely rude language? And by the way, if he had said the same thing but said it more politely, I don't think we would be talking about it this morning or it would have gotten national attention at all.</s>KURTZ: But you know, Jessica, Jesse Jackson may not be part of the Obama campaign, and clearly there's a testy relationship there, but somewhere along the line the media decided that Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are the two black leaders that we would turn to, that we would call in any crisis. Whether they actually are black leaders or have a significant following, as opposed to a media platform, is another question. Now I wonder if Jackson kind of feels eclipsed by Barack Obama's candidacy.</s>YELLIN: Well, Barack Obama just told reporters that he hasn't spoken with Jesse Jackson since this happened, and Jackson has made it clear that he called the campaign. So certainly this seems to be at least in part related to a generational change. The torch is being passed, but maybe not so willingly.</s>KURTZ: Now, here's the interesting -- you know, there was no obscenity in there. I use the word "nuts" all the time. I mean, "nuts" obviously here was a synonym for something else. The "L.A. Times" and "The Chicago Tribune" used the exact quote. "The New York Times" said it was a "vulgar reference." "The Washington Post" talked about "crude language." And in your column, Clarence Page, "Twin objects of male anatomy." Why all this tiptoeing around it?</s>PAGE: Because I'm an old prude, Howard.</s>PAGE: No, I -- you know something? I agonized over this, you know/ And it's become a story in itself in media circles, because you're right, the word itself is not obscene, but context makes a difference. But, you know, now there's this product called Obama's Chocolate Nuts, which has had a surge in popularity now -- I mean, from Seattle or something.</s>KURTZ: I had missed that.</s>PAGE: Well, that was a nice plug for the product there, and indeed they are getting it. But, you know, we're all kind of caught between this -- the rails of understanding it.</s>KURTZ: The last question to Michael Medved. Clarence said a little earlier that Obama maybe got more attention on Iraq because he's a better story than McCain. There was a flap involving John McCain with Phil Gramm, former senator, former presidential candidate, very -- a co-chairman of his campaign, saying that the recession in this country is mental, and that the Americans have become a bunch of whiners. That got some coverage, but nothing like this Jesse crack.</s>MEDVED: Well, again, neither one really deserve the kind of coverage that it received. Phil Gramm, when he spoke to "The Washington Times," if you read the entire interview, you can disagree with it, and that's fine, but it's not an outrageous gaffe. And there's a great deal of this on the economy that I think is terribly unfair. When people say, well, the economy is not John McCain's strong suit, John McCain was chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee. And the idea that somehow he needs Phil Gramm to speak for him on the economy, and that Phil Gramm is the guy, again...</s>KURTZ: I've got to go, but Phil Gramm did speak for him on the economy in an interview with "The Wall Street Journal" editorial board.</s>MEDVED: Yes.</s>KURTZ: All right. Michael Medved, Jessica Yellin, Clarence Page, thanks very much for joining us this morning. When we come back, Barack Obama's kids get a star turn before the cameras. We'll talk with Access Hollywood's Maria Menounos about her interview with the presidential candidate's daughters.