Confirmation Hearing to Be Held Today for A.G. Nominee; Donald Trump: 'I Never Worked for Russia'; Washington Post: Trump Took Translator's Notes after Putin Meeting
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I never worked for Russia. It's a whole big fat hoax.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Russia could not have asked for a friendlier United States president.</s>CHRIS WALLACE, CNN ANCHOR: No way? No interview.</s>RUDY GIULIANI, ATTORNEY FOR DONALD TRUMP: They're a joke. Over my dead body.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am beginning to feel as though I'm on the set of "The Manchurian Candidate.</s>SEN. BEN CARDIN (D), MARYLAND: Make no mistake. This shutdown is caused by President Trump.</s>SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), MAJORITY LEADER: So here we are. The speaker of the House has decided that enforcing our own laws is now immoral.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's no longer a political issue now; it's a human issue.</s>ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Alisyn Camerota and John Berman.</s>ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: I want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is New Day. It is Tuesday, January 15, 6 a.m. here in New York. Day 25 of the government shutdown, and the Mueller investigation is set to take center stage again. It is expected to dominate the confirmation hearing for President Trump's attorney general nominee, William Barr. In a few hours, Barr goes before the Senate Judiciary Committee. Democrats will press Barr on his past criticism of the Mueller probe. Barr is expected to say that Mueller should be allowed to finish his investigation and that the report should be made public, even though he has been quite critical of that in the past. So you'll remember that unsolicited memo that Barr sent to the Justice Department last year, claiming that a president cannot obstruct justice. We now know who Barr shared that letter with, and we'll tell you about that.</s>JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So what's historic here is that a president is under investigation. And today, the Senate will question the person who will oversee that investigation. In just the last 24 hours, that investigation led the president to proclaim, "I never worked for Russia." In just the last 12 hours, CNN has learned that the president's team rejected a new request by the special counsel to question the president in person as part of this investigation, with a source telling us, Mueller is not satisfied. We have a lot to discuss this morning. Joining us now, Garrett Graff, the author of "The Threat Matrix: Inside Robert Mueller's FBI and the War on Global Terror"; former New Jersey attorney general, Ann Milgram; and former FBI supervisory special agent, Josh Campbell. Garrett, I want to start with you here, big picture. A president who says he never worked for Russia under investigation for working with Russia. We have the man who will oversee that investigation, who we now know shared legal theory with the president's own defense team, nominated for attorney general, facing questions from the Senate today. Not your average Tuesday.</s>GARRETT GRAFF, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: It is not your average Tuesday. I mean, this is, as you started off the segment by saying, an historic day on many, many different levels. You know, I'm unaware in the entire FBI's 100-year history of it ever opening a counterintelligence investigation on the president himself. Certainly, we've had FBIs investigating the president before for criminal investigations. We saw that during Watergate. We saw that during Iran-Contra. We saw that during the Clinton years. But the idea that the FBI, which is charged with keeping foreign influence out of the United States, is so worried about our commander in chief that they fear that he is acting under orders, witting or unwitting, from a foreign power, our chief traditional adversary, is truly a stunning and historic moment.</s>CAMEROTA: And another historic moment: we've never seen the president of the United States have to deny, and to reporters, that he is somehow working for Russia. But that happened yesterday. So in case people missed it, here was this moment.</s>TRUMP: I never worked for Russia. And you know that answer better than anybody. I never worked for Russia. Not only did I never work for Russia, I think it's a disgrace that you even asked that question.</s>CAMEROTA: I mean, I'm not sure what people did want out of that question, Ann. Of course, what's he going to say? Of course, he's never going to say, "Yes." And furthermore, as we know from all of the surrounding information and evidence and reporting, it's possible that Putin so expertly played some members of the Trump team, including his family, that they didn't know they were doing Russia's bidding.</s>ANN MILGRAM, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Right. Well, even the fact that we're having this conversation is a stunning thing, about the president of the United States being potentially an agent or working for Russia. So I think that alone is worth noting. The second piece about it is that this has been the conversation, is this question about why did the president do all this? Why does he continue to have these meetings with Putin? What's the motivation here? And I think this -- this sort of inquiry from "The New York Times" really gets at the heart of what was going on? Why would the president be making these decisions, which area really hard to understand?</s>BERMAN: And that's the backdrop for today in Washington, Josh Campbell, where William Barr, our former attorney general, who will likely be the next attorney general, faces questions from the Senate if he should be overseeing the Mueller investigation. And CNN learned within the last 24 hours. We know he shared this memo with Rod Rosenstein about why he didn't think the president should be investigated for obstruction of justice. But we also learned that he shared that memo with the president's own legal team and even had conversations with Jay Sekulow and the Raskins, who are doing the president's defense here. A discussion of defense strategy by the man who wants to oversee the investigation.</s>JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes. The more and more we learn on this, we're headed toward the direction of recusal, if he -- if he does the right thing. Now, when the memo first came out, there were a lot of people who looked at that with raised eyebrows, like, "What is this?" I remember we were sitting here talking about it, right, going through it. Is this a job application? Part of an interview he's trying to tee up here? But again, now we see there were additional conversations. This is more, you know, getting in the weeds on the strategy. We have to move toward recusal, because at the end of the day, the American people have to have confidence that he will oversee a Justice Department that will not be conflicted. And you have to keep in mind that, when someone, that doesn't mean that you've done something wrong. It just means that there is either a real or perceived conflict, and you respect the American people so much that you want them to have confidence in the Justice Department. So you're willing to step aside and let someone else manage that. It's not saying he did something wrong, but if he does -- if he does what's right, he would step aside and let someone else manage the investigation.</s>CAMEROTA: But Garrett, don't we now know the answer to what Josh was saying: what is this, a job interview? An audition? Yes. Now that we know that he sent it to Emmet Flood and Pat Cipollone and Jay Sekulow and Noel Francisco and all of the team of Donald Trump's lawyers, yes, that was a job -- that was a job audition.</s>GRAFF: It was, but I don't necessarily, first, agree with Josh that it seems like, under Justice Department ethics rules, he would likely recuse. But remember, Rod Rosenstein's reaction to this memo publicly is, you know, "Bill Barr didn't have all the facts. We do. One of the things that we can expect Barr, if he steps in as attorney general, and if he steps in to oversee this investigation, is he will be read into it. He will know what Bob Mueller knows: sort of where Bob Mueller is heading, what evidence he's collected, what the targets of the investigation are, what the timeline of the investigation is. And there's plenty of reasons to believe that Mueller is very far down the road of this probe, as well, and potentially, bringing large parts of it or, at least, major new parts of it to a conclusion in the next couple of weeks. So I think there's plenty of reason to believe that Mueller's probe could still make it to its natural conclusion, even if Barr steps in.</s>BERMAN: Look -- sorry, go ahead, Josh.</s>CAMPBELL: No, I'm just going to say that I don't disagree entirely there. The only thing I'm saying is that, at the end of the day, especially in these hypersensitive polarized times, the American people have to have confidence that the Justice Department is acting fairly. And this isn't to say that Mr. Barr would act, you know, in an inappropriate way. But again, with so much malfeasance that we've seen across the board, at the end of the day, the American people have to have confidence. And whether he gets read in and then learns more and then changes his mind, OK, that's fine. But if he remains in the same position, the public will be left wondering, did he come in with this, with this intent.</s>MILGRAM: But isn't part of the problem here that he wrote a 19-page memo about something he knows nothing about?</s>BERMAN: Yes!</s>MILGRAM: Right? And like, we should go back to this point. He's a former attorney general. He's handled criminal investigations. Everyone who's done that at that level -- I've done it, Josh has done it -- you know that what you read publicly is not the truth of the investigation. So he knows that. He writes a 19-page memo assuming facts and law that I'm positive we all don't know. And so that, to me, is stunning, and that, to me, also shows that he made a decision about the merits of this investigation with no -- with virtually no inside facts. I'm deeply troubled by that. So for the idea of him to not potentially recuse, it's stunning to me.</s>BERMAN: That is -- that's the most curious thing of all, which is he wrote a memo about Mueller's theory of the investigation.</s>MILGRAM: Without knowing the theory.</s>BERMAN: Exactly.</s>MILGRAM: And without knowing the facts. And so this should be a huge focus of the conversation today, is how do you do that, unless it is a job interview, unless it's really a play to be part of this team?</s>BERMAN: And that's what he will be facing today when he faces the Senate, these questions. Again, I think it is likely he will get confirmed. He has tried to mitigate this by saying he wants to see the Mueller investigation continue and indicating, although with a major hedge -- which I'll get to in a second -- that he wants the Mueller report to come out. This is P-209. "My goal will be to provide as much transparency as I can consistent with the law. I can assure you that, where judgments are to be made by me, I will make those judgments based solely on the law and will not let no personal, political or other improper interests influence my decision." Garrett, that sounds great. However, we know that Barr's interpretation of the law, he believes wide latitude for executive privilege and authority.</s>GRAFF: Yes. And in fact, is historically, if not outside the norm, certainly on the leading edge of the theories of executive power. And certainly, that's one of the places where we can imagine that the Senate, as it provides its advise and consent, and an important check and balance on the power of the executive branch, will be weighing that in their conversations today.</s>CAMEROTA: Ann, not only was it -- does it appear to have been a job application for Bill Barr, sending it specifically to the Trump team, saying, "See? Look at what I could offer. Here's my take." And it worked. I mean, by the way, that's why -- perhaps that's why he was chosen, and we know that the president cares so much about loyalty.</s>MILGRAM: Yes.</s>CAMEROTA: And so here it is spelled out. We'll also perhaps see job auditions today the panel, who will be interviewing him. There are many people who are running for president, the Democrats who will be questioning him. So there will be Cory Booker, Kamala Harris, Amy Klobuchar. So hopefully, we will get real questions and not just, you know, pontificating. But all of that will be on display today.</s>BERMAN: I'm going to take the under on that, by the way.</s>MILGRAM: I would take the under on that, too. I mean, look, we always think we're going to get great questions. And these -- this should be a very fiery confirmation hearing. There's tons of things to question Barr about, not just the memo. Also his ethics recusal, whether or not he'll abide by the guidance given by Department of Justice officials. There's a lot here. But what I expect we'll see is, you know, I don't expect that we'll see great questioning. And part of it is my experience working in the United States Senate, is that, you know, to be an effective questioner, you have to ask the second, the third and the fourth question. And I think when you watch, you'll see a lot of people are not -- you know, you have to listen to the answers and go back and forth. And I always wish for it to happen and I'm always a little surprised it doesn't. What's interesting, too, is that -- you know, Democrats don't need advice from me on politics -- but from the cheap seats here, as American people watched the last two years and how the rule of law has basically, essentially been under assault, it's interesting to note that, you know, moving ahead, this might be the law-and-order election, where the rule of law is front of mind, where you have lots of issues. But at the end of the day, the American people want to know, are we going to have someone in office who respects our institutions of justice? And this might be that audition. Imagine, you're going to have the whole world watching this hearing, so it will be interesting to see what kind of sound bites they try to get out of this.</s>BERMAN: All right. Two more things I want to discuss quickly, if we can find the time. No. 1, CNN's reporting on Mueller wanting to question the president again. And No. 2, this weird time line, with the president confiscating the notes from inside the meeting. Garrett, to you. We learned that Robert Mueller's team went back to the president's team and said, "We want to talk to him in person." Mueller is not satisfied with his written response alone. Now, we know the president wasn't going to say yes to this. You know Mueller's thinking. What's the special prosecutor doing here?</s>GRAFF: Well, I think -- I think the honest answer is probably trying as hard as he can to get in front of the president. You know, so much of obstruction of justice turns on this -- this idea of sort of corrupt intent. You know, what was the president thinking at the precise moment he was taking these various actions? You know, the president is obviously within his legal right to fire Jim Comey. But if he is doing that with the intent to obstruct justice, that makes it an illegal act nonetheless. And, you know, Mueller is a dogged prosecutor. He's thorough, and you can imagine that he wants to, as best he can, sit down and look across the table at Donald Trump and hear what he has to say.</s>CAMEROTA: Should we save the timeline?</s>BERMAN: I don't know. The time line's really good.</s>CAMEROTA: All right. Do we have time, Meghan (ph)? All right. Here's the time line. This is what -- as you know, there's all sorts of questions about why the president had these one- on-one meetings with Vladimir Putin and wouldn't share, even with his own advisors, top Russia experts, what was said, and confiscated the one interpreter who was in there, confiscated her notes and swore her to secrecy. So now here's an interesting timeline. This went down on July 7, 2017. That morning, "The New York Times" asked the White House for a statement on the Trump Tower meeting, you'll remember, with Don Jr. At 3:45 p.m., Donald Trump and Putin hold their first in-person meeting, and Trump takes the interpreter's notes and insists that the interpreter keep details of the conversation secret. Then that evening, President Trump and Vladimir Putin speak again, except for Putin's interpreter. And then Donald Trump says, "We talked about adoptions." On July 8, aboard Air Force One, as you know, President Trump dictates that misleading Trump Tower statement, citing that it was about adoptions. Days later, it comes out that the Russian lawyer had actually promised dirt on Hillary Clinton. Why is all of this suspicious, Josh?</s>CAMPBELL: Well, any one of these incidents that happened, you know, alone in a vacuum, one would look at that and say, "OK, that's, you know, maybe not an issue there. The president wants to have a private conversation with another foreign leader, and he doesn't want it to leak." But looking at the totality of the circumstances here, where you have a, you know, pattern of the president and these questionable interactions with Russia, we know that he doesn't criticize Putin. We know about the past. We know about the lies. You mentioned the Trump Tower meeting there, which they had to, you know, walk back even, you know, with the special counsel. And so the reason why it's troubling is because it continues to lead toward that one conclusion, which we don't know what it is yet. We can't completely draw a line. But why is the president unable to criticize Vladimir Putin? And you think about this, you know, we saw over in Helsinki the reports about him taking the notes. I mean, it's just stunning to think that the president of the United States wouldn't share the details of that conversation with others in his own government, if only to inform the national security apparatus about, you know, what Russia's thinking is.</s>CAMEROTA: They're first (ph).</s>CAMPBELL: But again, it's a pattern. It's troubling, and I don't think we've seen the end of it.</s>BERMAN: All right.</s>CAMEROTA: Thank you all very much. It will be very interesting to see what happens today. So as the government shutdown reaches day 25, the White House may have a new strategy for trying to get support for the president's border wall. So we'll look at that next.