Breaking Down the Taliban Video
BLITZER: Tense moments under a white flag of truce, U.S. troops face to face with Taliban fighters, retrieving an American soldier held captive for five years in Afghanistan. It's all captured in a stunning Taliban video, complete with commentary. Our chief national security correspondent, Jim Sciutto's here in THE SITUATION ROOM. Walk us through, step by step, what we see.</s>JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: No question. Well, this was a massive propaganda exercise for the Taliban here, sold by a media-savvy insurgency as a victory over the United States. And there are signs it is working to some extent. So many downloads today it crashed the Taliban website, they claim. More broadly, this was the first prisoner exchange between the U.S. and the Taliban in the 13 years of the nation's longest war caught on camera. And in these images we get a rare view of both the Taliban and U.S. Special Forces in action.</s>SCIUTTO (voice-over): The riveting eight-minute Taliban propaganda video contains intriguing clues about Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl, his Taliban captors, and his American rescuers. A thin, aging Bergdahl blinks repeatedly while seated in the pickup truck, and again as he stands looking at the approaching American helicopter. Signs his eyes were unused to natural light or signs of emotion. At one point Bergdahl manages a brief awkward smile, evidence of happiness or nervousness. One captor then taps him three times on the shoulder and says to him, "Don't come back to Afghanistan. Next time you won't make it out alive." And ominous threat, and sign of fear between captor and captive. A Taliban narrator sets the scene.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We waited in the area for around ten minutes before the helicopters arrived, and there were 18 Mujahidin fighters with me in the area. And we had armed Mujahidin on the peaks of the hills around the area.</s>SCIUTTO: And he's carrying a white plastic bag, the contents unknown. Then, the unprecedented face-to-face meeting between U.S. Special Forces and the Taliban fighters. Handshakes. An American places his left arm across his chest, an Afghan sign of respect. Another quickly frisks Bergdahl. The Taliban narrator recounts what he claims they said to each other.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They first asked us about the health condition of the captive and told us to tell them the truth if he was not well. But we saw that he was fine and told them that.</s>SCIUTTO: The soldiers wave, one keeping his eyes locked on the Taliban, even as he walks backwards. Bergdahl keeps his eyes focused straight ahead. He is stumbling, the legs of a man repeatedly shackled or just a nervous walk across rocky terrain. At the helo, Bergdahl is patted down once again, this time much more thoroughly, a precaution against a bomb or booby trap before the Black Hawk helicopter disappears into the sky.</s>SCIUTTO: So what did U.S. military officials see in those two proof- of-life videos they obtained, helping to spark this exchange? A U.S. official tells me there were several signs from the video released in December that led the U.S. government to be greatly concerned about Bergdahl's health, including the fact that he looked frail. And regardless of what we saw in that video today, which was the evidence was strong enough to accelerate efforts, Wolf, for his return home.</s>BLITZER: Jim, stand by for a moment. I want to dig a little bit deeper with body language expert Chris Ulrich, who's here in THE SITUATION ROOM. Also, "The Washington Post" associate editor, David Ignatius. He's the author of the brand-new book, "The Director," which I recommend. It's a novel, a spy thriller. Also, the former U.S. Navy SEAL, Brandon Webb. He's joining us from New York. Chris, let's talk a little bit about the video. You've had a chance to study it. It's a long video, 16, 17 minutes or so. The smile, what do you make of that? Because he does seem, as we're showing our viewers right now, to get a little smile going there.</s>CHRIS ULRICH, BODY LANGUAGE EXPERT: Yes, oftentimes, Wolf, sometimes it's not what it seems. We see that smile with him. We laugh for three reasons. We laugh because we're happy. We laugh because we're in a duping delight mode; we're evil and we're trying to get something over on somebody. And we laugh because we're anxious. Here's what we see is a much more anxious, nervous laugh, almost relieving stress. He's surrounded by Taliban. Helicopter -- or gunships are over him. There's a lot of stress around him. And we also see it in his blink rate.</s>BLITZER: David, you know a lot about this kind of stuff. You've written a lot of books on it. The interaction that he seems to have with his Taliban captors, what do you make of that?</s>DAVID IGNATIUS, ASSOCIATED EDITOR, "WASHINGTON POST": Well, the thing we're most curious about is whether he in some sense felt part of his captives' -- captors' world, and whether there was a Stockholm syndrome kind of experience for him. I don't mean to sound glib, but there's a way in this amazing video looks like a tease for an episode of "Homeland" in which this person who's been held captive for so long under brutal conditions comes home. And you just wonder looking at him, who is he? How has this experience changed him? What's he going to behave like in the future?</s>BLITZER: Jim, you've been speaking to experts, too. If you're looking at the body, it seems like the soldier and the respect that is shown, I don't know, by both sides, if you will, what do make of that?</s>SCIUTTO: It's interesting. I want to show you just a moment in the film here. And here is the point when they have the exchange. You first see him here. He gives a sign of respect, his left hand over his arm, something -- something, you know, traditional in Afghan society. They do it all the time, a sign of respect as they come in. But you'll notice that the video continues. Then they shake hands. He uses his left hand here, and he uses his left hand here. This is, you can tell, this soldier, he's in a rush. He shook with one hand with his right hand, one with his left hand. He -- this soldier has something in his right hand here. But what's interesting, is the Taliban made a big deal out of this in their commentary. They said, "Why do they shake with their left hand? They were in such a rush, they were nervous." It's part of their propaganda commentary. What's interesting about that, it is an insult in Afghan society. The Taliban knows it's an insult, so they say, "Hey, look at these guys. They were in such a rush, they were so nervous they didn't have time to shake our right hand." It's just reminder that this is a propaganda moment for the Taliban. They're going to take advantaging of everything that happened during this very short, minute-long interaction to their advantage.</s>BLITZER: Brandon, you were a Navy SEAL What did you make of the frisking of the sergeant, once very quickly when he got out of that vehicle, and then just before he boarded the helicopter? Is that standard operating procedure? I assume they're looking for explosives.</s>BRANDON WEBB, FORMER U.S. NAVY SEAL: Yes. They're taking precautions for any explosives. I think that was another reason why they took that plastic bag Bergdahl was holding and dumped it on the ground. But another interesting point on the propaganda piece that no one has really mentioned up until now is they have a Pashtun saying that boys are for pleasure, women are for babies. And the way Bergdahl was presented, very clean-shaven and effeminate, I think is another insult, a purposeful insult to America in the hand-off.</s>BLITZER: What do you mean in? That they shaved him? Explain that. I'm not exactly following what you're suggesting.</s>WEBB: In the Afghan culture, in the Pashtun culture, to grow facial hair and hair in general is to be very manly. It's very effeminate to present Bergdahl as very clean-shaven, his head shaven. His face is shaven, as well. And this is a very effeminate look in that Pashtun society. And so to present him in this way is, I think, another insult and part of the propaganda during the hand-over.</s>BLITZER: Yes. But let me just follow up one more time, Brandon. It's possible -- just tell me what you think -- that they were cleaning him up, if you will, to make him look healthier, better, to show, "Yes, we had him for five years, but we really kept him in pretty good shape. So we're going to shave him. That's what the west likes." These Taliban guys might be more sophisticated?</s>WEBB: Yes, I don't think so. I mean, my experience in Afghanistan, you know, having that facial hair is a very, very big sign of manliness. And to shave Bergdahl and present him how they did, to me, in my experience, serving in Afghanistan, it's a direct, very clear message.</s>BLITZER: That's a good point. David, you spent a lot of time in Afghanistan and Pakistan. What do you make of that?</s>IGNATIUS: You know, I can't comment on the specific intent in shaving him in the way that they did. It is true, this is a war-like, virile culture. My previous novel before "The Director" was about how wars end in this part of the world. And I'm struck by the way in which something that was originally intended as a confidence-building measure -- that's why this prisoner exchange was first devised, as a bridge to future negotiations to end the conflict -- instead has become a confidence- destroying moment. Whether that was the Taliban's intention or not, that's what the product is, and it's unfortunate.</s>BLITZER: What did you make of that, the point that Brandon was just making?</s>ULRICH: Well, looking at Sergeant Bergdahl's body language, he goes into an imploded posture, very subservient, even going back to your point about captives, not trying to aggravate those captives [SIC] in any way. We know when the body is in this kind of contracted position, through research at Harvard University, that our cortisol levels shoot up. That's congruent with what we see with him in his stress that we're seeing on his face, that increased blink rate that we're seeing.</s>BLITZER: Could we tell his health based on the video that we just see when he was sitting in the vehicle, that he walks across the field, boards that U.S. military helicopter? Could you get a sense, watching that frame by frame by frame, is the guy healthy, not so healthy?</s>ULRICH: Hard to dictate whether or not he's healthy, Wolf. We do see him in either a state of almost shock. His blink rate, the average blink rate of an individual is 15 to 25 times a minute, Wolf. What we see with him in that one clip where he's smiling, in eight second his blinks 18 times, Wolf. That's heightened stress. So he is kind of almost like a rag doll, as they walk him out there. Probably not in the best of health, but probably it's hard to say if he's healthy or he's damaged.</s>BLITZER: What are you hearing about his health from your sources?</s>SCIUTTO: Well, this is what you'll hear frequently from officials today. Don't conclude too much from what you see from these 30 seconds, 60 seconds of video of him here, that they have a lot of evidence that made them confident that his health was compromised. They have two proof-of-life videos, one that came in December, another in the same, similar time frame. Plus other intelligence which made them very concerned that, for instance, his frailness in these videos based on comparing them to previous videos. And they have experts like you who look at these things to make those conclusions. So they say whatever you can see in the video today, remember we have a lot more information leading up to this to back up our decision.</s>BLITZER: You know what? I -- we're just connecting right now with Matthew Chance, our senior international correspondent. He's at Landstuhl at the U.S. hospital, a military hospital there where Bergdahl is being treated. What are they telling you, Matthew, about his -- you know, he arrived there, what, Sunday, he was picked up in that helicopter on Saturday. What are they -- officials there in Landstuhl saying about his health?</s>MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, since that arrival, we are seeing no sign of Sergeant Bergdahl, of course, but we have had a number of statements that had been released by the Landstuhl Regional Medical Facility, where he's being treated. They're saying he's in a stable condition. They're not going into any great detail about the medical issues he's confronting but are saying, for instance, part of his treatment is to address some dietary and nutritional issues that have emerged as a result of him being in captivity for nearly five years. But the sense you get is there's nothing life threatening. It's not like there's an imminent threat to his life or he's in a very poor situation, describing his situation, as I say, as stable. No indication, though, as to when he might be going home. One of the areas they're going to be focusing on, Wolf, is the psychological damage, of course. He's been in captivity for so long that would inevitably have had a traumatic effect for him. That will be part of the reintegration process that they're focusing on here in Landstuhl -- Wolf.</s>BLITZER: Yes. They're not saying when he's going to be flown to San Antonio to a U.S. military hospital there for treatment. In the meantime, he's in Germany. Brandon Webb, you're a former Navy SEAL, that kind of mission, to send Special Operations Forces in a helicopter -- I assume other helicopters are hovering overhead, fighter jets are hovering overhead, you've got to be worried that this could be a trap and these guys' lives could be in danger. How do you mitigate that?</s>WEBB: Well, it's tough. You know, traditionally, Special Operations operate exclusively in the nighttime environment where you can leverage technology, the night vision and thermal imagery. So to do a daytime pickup like this is extremely risky. The AC-130 gunship will not fly as standard operating procedure in daylight condition. You have an overcast which makes it -- overcast which makes it extremely difficult to put a predator drone overhead to monitor the situation. So daylight pick up like this is extremely risky. What's interesting, too, is our sources, in a story we wrote on sofrep.com said they had for three months the Joint Special Operations Command had eyes on Bergdahl. So it makes me question this whole sense of urgency around this exchange, when they had eyes on him for three months leading up to this.</s>BLITZER: I assume that they were thinking at least of sending in a mission to rescue him without this kind of exchange but I guess in the end they probably concluded that would be too risky, too dangerous, is that right, Brandon?</s>WEBB: Yes, potentially. It's still begs the question, you know, why guys weren't sent in, we practice hostage rescue missions like this all the time. But to me, it's a clear sign of an attempt at diplomacy with the Taliban. You know, the same organization in 2001, the U.S. sent over to stamp out, and now we're essentially -- it looks like we're, you know, having these diplomatic relations with the Taliban and it really makes you wonder what the U.S. has accomplished in Afghanistan over a decade of war.</s>BLITZER: That's a fair question, too. David Ignatius, you think the Qataris, the government of Qatar, which arranged this whole deal, there's more there than meets the eye. You're suggesting that maybe this is part of a broader effort to got some sort of peaceful arrangement there?</s>IGNATIUS: It was originally conceived that way, Wolf. These discussions in secret go back to November 2010. This is not new. In February, 2011, Secretary of State Clinton said publicly that it was the desire of the U.S. to have a political diplomatic settlement of this conflict and the secret negotiations came out of that opening that she made. She sent her emissary Mark Grossman to meet secretly with the Taliban. There have been extensive conversations with the idea of stabilizing the country when U.S. forces left. I don't think anybody imagined that it would backfire in the way but it clearly has in terms of American public opinion in the last several days.</s>BLITZER: David Ignatius is the author of the brand new book "The Director" which I recommend. David, thanks so much for joining us. Chris Ulrich, thanks to you.</s>ULRICH: Thank you for having me.</s>BLITZER: Jim Sciutto, of course. Brandon Webb in New York, thanks very much for joining us. Coming up, a separate video just surfacing showing a couple that went missing in Afghanistan. This is an American woman and her husband being held captive. Are they being held captive by the Taliban? Plus, was President Obama in any danger when he was secretly photographed working out at a gym in Warsaw, Poland? We have the dramatic video and a lot more coming up right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.