Arizona Governor Will Likely Veto Bill; Holder Advises State Attorneys' General
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Right now, the fate of a controversial religious rights bill rests in the hands of Arizona's governor. If she veto's it, gay rights' groups say their rights will be upheld. If she signs it, Arizona could face a very costly economic boycott. Also right now, Democrats are bringing out the big guns. Former President Bill Clinton, he's out there on the campaign trail in Kentucky trying to help his party pull off an upset in a key Senate race. And right now, the report -- a report says the NSA and the Pentagon were prepared to launch a sophisticated cyber-attack against Syria, but President Obama rejected the plan. We'll explain why. Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting from Washington. We start with the clock ticking for the Arizona governor, Jan Brewer. She has until the end of the week to decide whether to sign or veto the state's controversial religious beliefs law which many say is blatantly anti- gay. The law allows businesses to refuse service to anyone if they believe it violates their religious beliefs. But Brewer is expected to veto the bill. Joining us now on the phone to talk about the upcoming decision is Chuck Coughlin. He's a key political adviser for the governor, Jan Brewer. Chuck, thanks very much for joining us. What's your advice to the governor? We know she has got some time to make this decision.</s>CHUCK COUGHLIN, POLITICAL ADVISOR, GOV. JAN BREWER, ARIZONA (via telephone): First, Wolf, thanks for having me on. It's a pleasure to be here. You know, the governor has always been very deliberative when faced with very difficult policy decisions. She's had a history of -- she assumed office in 2009 dealing with very difficult issues from one of the worst budget deficits in the country to the immigration discussion in 2009 and 2010 that continued on to today. And so, this is familiar territory with her. She will -- she will take her time. She has been in the nation's capital with some governors' meetings. She's on her way back to the state today. I presume she will meet with supporters of the bill to hear their cause, meet with people who are -- have expressed their views in opposition, and also meet with legislators who have subsequently changed their mind after the vote. And so, I would expect her to make a decision sometime Thursday or Friday, and -- but she'll be very deliberative in decision. She vetoed a very similar bill, if not nearly identical bill, last year. It's funny how much attention this one has gotten since she took that similar -- took that stance last year. And all of those reasons why she vetoed it last year are relevant today.</s>BLITZER: So, still presumably she'll go ahead and make that same decision. She's under pressure from both Arizona senators, John McCain, Jeff Lake. They both are suggesting this is not the right thing to do, to sign this legislation into law. They're deeply concerned about the economic impact on the state because, presumably, tourism, which is so important, as you well know, in Arizona, could be impacted if this legislation became the law in Arizona. Is that right?</s>COUGHLIN: Yes. The -- I mean, again,</s>BLITZER: And if she vetoed very similar legislation a year ago, I would guess and, I assume you would as well, she'll veto this legislation, right?</s>COUGHLIN: Well, I never guess what the governor will do. I -- she -- I'm pleased that she's allowed me to talk to her about this issue. She is always a very open person in terms of talking to folks and hearing them out. And that's all we can ask of folks, that are elected representatives, is that we're heard. I did convey to her my thoughts about that, and that -- you know, my concerns were that we have, you know, 50 statutes on the books in Arizona that protect religious liberty in Arizona. We all know, we have our first amendment rights as well. There's a whole statutory framework for that currently. My personal concern on this one is it's just written in -- if you look at all of the other statutory makeups, it's much too broad. And it could be construed in very unusual or different ways and cause havoc on the system here in the state. I was fortunate as a young kid to have my father argue a case in front of the Supreme Court which was in 1971, Dewey versus Reynolds Metals which was a first amendment case about a 7th day Adventist who wanted to -- reused to work on a holiday -- on a religious holiday or have anybody else work in his place. That was an interesting case. I was a kid at the time. But we still debate these types of issues in our country. And she's at the epicenter of that debate right now, and I'm sure she'll take a thoughtful approach to it with her staff and her team. And as I said, I believe she'll make up her mind sometime Thursday, at the latest on Friday.</s>BLITZER: All right. Chuck Coughlin, who is a political adviser to the governor of Arizona. She's got a tough decision to make. We'll see what she decides to do. Thanks very much, Chuck, for joining us.</s>COUGHLIN: Thanks, Wolf. Thanks for having me on.</s>BLITZER: Three Arizona lawmakers who originally voted for the law now say they want the governor to veto it. They say the law was supposed to protect religious rights but that opponents have now made the state look bad. Joining us now from Philadelphia is our Political Commentator Michael Smerconish. Michael, thanks very much. She is expected to veto the bill. Was this the only decision she could come to, given these serious threats of economic boy costs to the state of Arizona?</s>MICHAEL SMERCONISH, HOST, "THE MICHAEL SMERCONISH PROGRAM", SIRIUSXM: Well, I'm shocked that she hasn't already vetoed it. As a matter of fact, I predicted, Wolf, on radio today that I expect by -- this is just a prediction that by the close of business today, she will veto this. Because the longer that it festers, it's not only a black eye for Arizona and for Governor Brewer, but it's also negative publicity, I think, for the GOP brand at a time when the party can ill afford it. This is a no-brainer. She is certainly going to veto it, in my opinion, so why not get to it sooner than later and remove this issue from the public discourse for the rest of the week?</s>BLITZER: The legislation that passed in Arizona, but potentially could be vetoed by the governor, it does underline a divide in the GOP, right?</s>SMERCONISH: It absolutely does within the party, between libertarians who have a Rand Paul live and let live kind of mentality and so-called traditionalists. I think they're on the wrong side of where the public is and where the public is trending. There's some very interesting cases out there in a variety of states about what I regard as the so-called wedding planners, those who are photographers, and those who are bakers, and those who are florists. And, you know, could they be obligated to provide goods and services for a same-sex wedding where they have some kind of religious objection to it? These are great philosophical issues. But as a practical political matter, I think it's a stone cold loser for the</s>GOP. BLITZER: And he -- and both senators now want her to go ahead and veto it, John McCain, Jeff Blake. I don't know if either one of them is really a libertarian, but they both see the economic impact on the state of Arizona. Michael, stay with us for a moment because there is another subject I want to discuss with you. The -- even though Arizona looks like that legislation will be vetoed in that state, it might not have been enforced anyway. That's because the attorney general, Eric Holder, is telling state attorneys general that they don't necessarily have to defend laws they feel discriminate against their citizens and that includes laws banning same-sex marriage. Here's Holder from this morning.</s>ERIC HOLDER, ATTORNEY GENERAL: I believe we must be suspicious of legal classifications based solely on sexual orientation. And we must endeavor, in all of our efforts, to uphold and advance the values that once led our forbearers to declare, unequivocally, that all are created equal and entitled to equal opportunity.</s>BLITZER: Let me ask you a question, Michael. Something you tweeted out yourself this morning. You said, doesn't Holder's encouragement of state attorneys' general to not defend laws run the risk of creating 50 new judges? What's the answer?</s>SMERCONISH: Well, I think it does. And as an attorney, I'm troubled by this. I want to get to the same place where Eric Holder wants to take us on the issue, but I question the way in which he's going about it because I think he's advocating a usurping of the court's function. You know, if, in fact, those bans need to go, then courts should find them unconstitutional, or a legislature should decide that it wants to revoke the ban that they have implemented. But when you empower 50 different attorney's general across the state, I think you're setting a dangerous precedent and you're putting far too much discretion into the hands of those individuals. Now, Wolf, when I said that on the radio today, many people, who identified themselves as attorneys, called and they said, Michael, you're wrong. Those attorneys' general already have discretion. They exercise discretion each and every day. But that doesn't turn around my thinking. I'm worried about the precedent that this would set.</s>BLITZER: Michael Smerconish joining us. Thanks very much, Michael, for that. A plan for deep and significant cuts to the U.S. military budget, but some fear the cuts could turn the Pentagon into a triangle. Senator Marco Rubio will give us his take behind closed doors. President Obama and the House speaker, John Boehner, they're meeting over at the White House. Gloria Borger standing by, will give us her take on this get-together.