InThe Matter Ofi NACEFT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOUDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, IMA June 17,2003 For The Record, Inc.

Court Reporting and Litigation Support 603 Post Office Road Suite 309 WaZdo$ MD USA 20602 ( 301) 870 8025 . Fm: @ X7) 870 8333 Word Index included with this Min U Script@ NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING NEW BEDFORD, 1cz HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS June 17,200  .___ Page 1 Page :

[ II [ II ATTENDANCE LIST ( CONTINUED)

PI [ z] Michael MitteIholzer National Association of Home [ 31 ( 131 Builders ( DC)

141 14) Tom Newlon Steel Rives ( WA)

151 [ s] Victoria Peters State of Colorado ( CO)

El [ 6] Kate Probst Resources for the Future ( DC)

I71 [ 71 Ed Putnam State of New Jersey ( ND PI ` l` ranscript of Meeting of ) [ a] Mel Skaggs InDepth Environmental Associates 191 NACIiP'l` Supcrlhnd Subcommittee IMeeting PI 0 x) [ lo] Holiday Inn Express [ IO] Wilma Subra Louisiana Environmental Action [ i 11 New Bedford, MA [ I I] Network ( LA) [ IZ] June 17 19, 2003 [ IZ] IMichael Tilchin CHZM HiIl ( DC)

[ 131 [ ia] Jason White Cherokee Nation ( OK)

[ I41 ( 141 Robin Wiener Institute of Scrap Recycling ! I? ~ 151 Industries ( DC)

1161 q16] hngclo Carasea U. S. Environmental Protection 1171 [ I71 Agency( DC)

[ I81 [ ia] Lawrence Starfield U. S. EnvironmenLal Protection (` 91 [ iq Agency ( DC) ( DayTwo)

PO1 ~ 201 John Ehrmann Meridian Institute ( CO)

1211 ~ 211 Molly Mayo Meridian Institute ( CO)

WI 1221 i Iolly Dobson Meridian Instilute ( CO) _______. Page 2 Page 4 [ iI ATTENDANCE LIST [ II ATTENDANCE LIST ( CONTINUED) [ q Raymond Loehr Ilnivcrsity ofTexas at Austin 121 Elizabeth Mc~ Mamus Ross & Associates Environmental ~ 31 William Adams Kennccot Irtah Copper Corporalion 131 ( WA> [ 4) ( Ill`) 141 PANELISTS [ 5] Sue Briggum Wdslc , Management ( DC) [ s] Florence Robinson North Baton Rouge Environmental 161 Doris Ccllarius Sierra Club ( AZ) [ 6] Association ( LA)

[ 7] Granl Cope Earthjustice ( WA) 171 Michael LythcoltThe Lythcott Company ( NJ) 181 James I> crouin Steptoe ; i; Johnson ( AZ) 1 [ a] Charles Utley Augusta, Georgia [ q Richard Dewling I) cwlingAssociates, Inc. ( NJ) [ g] Veronica liady National Environmental Justice [ io] Slc\, c I< lbert I$ I'Amcrica, Inc. ( II.) [ IO] Advisory Council [ i 1, Jane ( iardncr (; cneral Eleclric ( CT) 11fl jiz] <; lcn IIammcr Ashland, Inc. ( OII) h21 [ 13] I) olorcs I Ierrcra Albuquercluc San Jose Community i131 ( 14) Awareness Council, Inc. ( NM) ( 141 [ is! Robert Hickmolt Smith Fret < Group ( DC) ' I151 [ i6] Almcc I loughton Center for Public Environmental ll61 [ I71 Oversight ( IX;) [ I71 ilu] Ken Jock St. Rcgis MohawkTribe ( NY) 1181 ;~ 9] Frcdcrlck Kalisz <; ity of New I~ edf'ord ( MA) [ I91 [ zo] <;: tr y King Sta~ c of Illinois ( 11.) WI 1711 I: tl l. orlnz Alma <; ollegc ( MI) IWI p7j Mlltlrcd Mc( : Iain I Iarambcc I Iousc, Inc. ( GA) PI For ` The Record, Inc.  6301) 870 8025 Min U Scripts ( 31 Page I Page 4 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS III Day One [ z] June 17,2003 [ 3] PROCEEDINGS I41 [ sl MR. LOEHR:  Superfund Subcommittee, this ___.

Page 5 [ 6] morning is an informal component of that meeting. We'll [ 7] be officially starting the activities with a public Le. 1 meeting this afternoon at 1 : OO.

PI But one of the reasons that we came here, as we [ la] did to Phoenix, was to get a prospective of the [ 1 I] activities in the field as to what's going on and our ( 121 chances to meet with the people that are facing Superfund [ ia] issues, both in the different regions and certainly in ( 141 the communities, and we're delighted to be here in [ I 51 Fdirhaven/ New Bedford with the Mayor from New Bedford,

[ 16] Fred Kalisz, who is with us today to start us off into ~ 171 the activities.

[ 181 And, Fred, we're very pleased to be here and [ iq absolutely delighted that you arranged for the weather [ ZOJ that we have. I noticed that may not be always what you [ zl] have up here, but your powers, in terms of arranging pz] these kinds of things for us, are awesome and we [ I] appreciate you doing so.

PI But Fred and his people and the regions have [ 3] arranged for the tour that we're going to be having this [ 4] morning. And let me turn it right over to Fred to move ( 5) us into that activity. Mayor Kalisz.

PI MAYOR KALISZ: Thank you, Doctor, and good [ 7] morning to my colleagues on the NACEPTAdvisory [ a] Committee. It's certainly a pleasure for me as Mayor of [ g] the city to welcome you here to New Bedford because of [ IO] the realities. The realities of what the past has left [ I 11 the community, about the realities that we've been ~ 121 talking about for such an extended period of time, and [ 13] thal fortunately in lhis case, what brought me to the 1141 NACEPT panel I'm able to show and share with you as WC [ rs] begin that process of the fmal determination of the [ is] paper that will be submitted to the EPA.

I171 WhiIe I'll be giving my formal remarks a little jre] bit later today, I just wanted to touch upon a few of the [ 19] points as we begin on this morning's bus tour on our [ 20] IIarbor, our Superfund I'rojccLAs you may Irdvc noticctl PI] I've said our Iiarbor Superfund Project, and although ii IMP] is the EPA with the assistance of the Army Corps of Page 7 [ II Engineers that is overseeing this project, in a very true [ z] and r. al sense it is the harbor of the people ol` the city [ 3] of New Bedford, our Project.

[ 41 During our previous meetings I've stated in Is] testimony that the real mcasurc of success of a Supcrluncl [ 6] Project is not only determined by the Environmental [ jl Engineer, but also by the property owner across the [ a] street and the member of community in general. Long [ g] after the Superfund Staff Ieavcs New Bedford the effects [ IO] of this project will be felt by its residents of this : I t] community. We have lived with the New Bedford Harbor [ IZ] Superfund Project for over 20 years and with any 1131 relationship there has been positive interaction and 1141 there obviously have been some not so positive 1151 interactions.

1161 However, through the good efforts of a number of : 17] people, we have developed a very good working . is] relationship in which we understand each other's goals : iq and challenges tl! at they bring to the tdbblc. It is only Page 6 [ zo] with the understanding of any project WC can hope to I [ a] succeed, and I hdpc that during the tour you will begin [ 22] to see the Superflmd Project has become one of Lhc ..+ ~.~ .~~ ~~~_ ~~~

Page 8 [ I] foundations for our strategic plan for harbor and estuary [ z] development within our city.

[ 31 The City of New Bedford is one of the four [ 4] largest four deep water seaports in the commonwcallh of [ 5] LMassachusetts. It is also home to the largest dollar [ q value catch of any fleet in the IJnited States, making us [ 7] number one by the Deparlment of Commerce StdnddrdS 181 relative to the economic impact of the fishing industry [ q in any community in the entire continental, and to that IO] matter of fact, all of the IJnitcd States, inclusive of I] IIawaii and Alaska.

21 That's the product that flows through this port la] Yet, the threshold is the challenge that WC lind here and 41 it's not the threshold of economic development, but the s] threshold over which we cross over the PCB laden grounds 61 that have been alI part of the Superfund Project.

71 You'll see lhc working clement of New Bedfbrd a] You'll also see some of the historic aspects of New s] Bedford. And throughoul the course of the da); as wc ` 01 interject into the prcscntalion as you now arc in Nc\\

` I] Bedford, you will see how wc'rc taking those challcngcs ` 21 and developing them to not only a strong li~ unrlatron 01 Min U Script@ : .

For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 .."_ _ I,^ IpI NACEI'T SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 9 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 Page 11 [ II launching a strategic plan that is environmentally,

[ z] economically and educationally sensitive to the people of ! 3] this region.

141 MR. LOEHR: We have some other folks with us 151 from EPA. Do you wish to introduce them

161 MAYOR KALISZ: It's a very simple introduction.

[ 71 We've very fortunate to have with us one of the lead [ a] people out of EPA Region One, Rich Cavagnero, who will [ g] introduce our Federal and State partners, who arc working [ lo] with us on the presentations this morning. Rich.

I'll MR. CAVAGNERO: Thank you, Mayor Kalisz. It's ( 121 always nice 10 come down to New Bedford in good weather.

[ I31 I am the Deputy Director in the 0ffice of site ~ 141 Rcmediation & Rcs&) ration, which in our region includes ( 151 Superfund, Brown Fields, Record Corrective Action and the [ i6] Tanks Programs. I'm hdppy Lo introduce the people who [ 17] arc' doing the heavy lifting on the New Bedford Project.

114 To my right is Dave Dickerson and Jim Brown, who [ 19] arc the two project managers; Stacy Grcendlingcr, who is [ zo] our <: ommunity lnvolvcment and Media Coordinator on the [ ZI] project; and WC have two reps from the Massachusetts 1221 Department of Environmental Protection, Jay Naparstek

[ i] could you stand up, Jay  who heads up the IiPA Clean up [ z] Programs for MASS., and next to him is Paul Craffey, who 131 is the Project Manager on the New Bedford project.

! 41 ( 51 And wth thal. I'm going to turn it over lo 161 I> nvc. who will he doing your presenlation.

( 71 MR. DICKERSON: Thank you, Rich. Good morning,

161 evcryonc. Welcome to New l% edford. Again, I'm Dave [ g] Dickerson. I've been a Project Manager on the New ( 13) lscdlhrd site for about eight and a half years now, and : I I] Jim 2% rown, another longtime Project Manager, and I arc ( 121 going to give a short presenlation about the harbor I! 31 cleanup followed by a bus tour. So, belwccn the two we ( 141 hope to answer any questions that you may have.

1151 So, first a Little bil geography before we gel [ ifi] mto the nature of the PC; B problem and the Harbor Cleanup Ilr] Plan sclcctccl in ` 98 and our progress towards that.

[~ ti] llopcl'ully, you al1 know whcrc YOLI are by now, hut New fi9! I\ crlVord Ilarbor is down between Boston and Cape Cod.

pro] Nantucket and Martha's Vineyard arc just offshore.

/ Zll h'lo\+ ng to the harbor, itsell', this is the main [ 22] Ncxv Ucrlhrd llarbor area. Some of the key ltiaturcs hat [ I] we'll be talking about today to orient yourself. The [ z] Aerovox ( phonetic) facility, the main source of the PCBs 131 is up in the northern stretch; the harbor is bisected by [ 4] the 135 Bridge and the Coggeshall Street Bridge and down [ q to the south is the Hurricane Barrier.

KY The whole size of the harbor is about 1,000 [ 7] acres. To pul it in prospective with some other large [ a] PCB sites that you may be aware of, the PCB contamination 191 was very, very extreme. Just off shore at the Aerovox [ lo] plant it was in the hundreds to thousands of parts per [ ii] million. As we'll talk, those hot spots were cleaned up 1121 in ` 94 and ` 95. There remain, however, still highly ( 131 contaminated areas of the harbor as well as the many [ 14] shoreline areas. Still in the tens of thousands of parts [ isi per million.

[` 61 Four key points that we hope everyone c. an take [ i 71 home today. The fist one is that contrary to popular [ ia] belief there are human health risks in addition to [ iq ecological risks at the siteThe fact that so much PCB 1201 mass was, you know, disposed into the harbor, PCBs [ ar] accumulate within the marine food chain and we humans, as 1221 consumers of lobsters, tlounder, clams, et cetera, fmd ____ ~__

[ II that the local seafood is highly contaminate  well [ 21 above both the FDA level of two parts per million, and a [ a] site specific level that's a hundred times less than that ~ 41 that assumes someone who eats purely local seafood as [ SJ opposed to the FDA level.

161 We'll be talking about the fact that we know we [ 7] have to measure the project's success. We'll talk about [ a] how we do that. We'll also talk about the relationship ) ( 91 between the annual funding and the cleanup  length of [ IO] Ihe harbor cleanup. And as Mayor Kalisz alluded to,

[ I I] we'll talk about some of the broader impacts that the [ IZ] harbor cleanup, we believe, brings to the communities.

I131 A little bit of background. First, we'll talk a 1141 little bit about the picture. This is looking at the [ is] northerly most part of the harbor south. This is Wood ~ 161 Street.` l'his is the Aerovox FacilityThis is 195. So [ 17; just Lo, again, orient you.

1181 I'CR USC began in the early 4Os. Two factories 1 [ iq used it, but by and large it was the Aerovox facility / [ zo] that caused the lion's share of the problem.

p1 In ` 79 the Stale enacted a fishing ban on 18,000 / ( 221 acres, including the 1,000 acre harbor, as well as 17,000 I I____  ForTheRecord, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Scripti ( 51 Page 9  Page 12 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 13 [ I] acres of surrounding Buzzard's Bay. In ` 83 it was named [ z] as the State's priority Superfund site. In ` 88 we did p] one of our first pilot dredging studies, as well as a 141 disposal pilot study. In 1990 we signed the Hotspot ROD.

[ s] In ` 94, we started cleaning up the five acre hotspots.

[ s] In ` 98, after spending a considerable amount of time in a [ 7] facilitated consensus building process with just about [ a] every stakeholder you can imagine, we finally came up [ g] with a cleanup plan for the whole harbor that everybody [ to] could live with. We'll talk a lot about that today.

[ 111 In ` 99 we amended the Hotspot ROD to gel rid of 1121 on site incineration, which had developed to be quite a ~ 131 controversy and we changed the remedy to include off site ~ 141 disposal of the dredge sediments. In 2000 we did an 1151 early cleanup of some contaminated shoreline areas under 1161 the second ROD, as well as we did a state of the art ~ 171 dredging study that Jim will talk about as well.

[ I81 Just recently, as a matter of fact this will be 1191 the first stop of the tour, we cleaned up a seven acre

[ zo] the northern most part of the harbor, north ofWood ( 211 Street.

WI Again, let's talk a little bit about Human Page 14 111 Health and Ecological Risks. This map shows the 18,000 lz] acres that the State enacted the fishing bans on, as ~ 31 divided into three areas. Again, here is the main [ 4] harbor; Hurricane Barrier. Excuse me. You can see that 151 the lobster ban continues out quite a way into Buzzard's [ 6] Bdy.

VI Human Health Risks. We spent a lot of time, you 181 know, under the Superfund process quantitjring the risks 191 and found that on a probable basis, a weekly ingestion of [ IO] local seafood, the risks were 40 times higher than the [ i I] lowest allowable risk per the Superfund process. That is [ XX] a concern. Even though the State fishing ban is in [ ia] place, it doesn't have any enforcement mechanism in the ,141 State ban and given the kind of demographics of the area 1151 with the Environmental Justice Components, large emigrant [ js] population, we find that there is a lot of consumption ~ 171 lishing in the harbor.

[ 101 In addition, to the seafood risks, there's risks [, 9] to children and the like who interact along the banks of 1201 the river and the harbor in the inter tidal zone between ~ 211 lugh and low tidc'l'hose risks were about four times ( 221 higher than the ahwdbk Superfund standards. _

Page 15 [ iI Moving onto the ecological risks, any biologist [ z] would tell you that there is a grave risk herc. Thirty 131 times  the water colonist is contaminated higher

[ 4] much higher than the allowable water quality criteria of [ s] .03 parts per triUion. Wc have about one part per [ s) billion routinely, about 30 times higher than that. The ( 71 sediment PCB levels are thousands and lens of thousands [ a] times higher than a one part per million, which is kind [ g] of a rule of thumb standard. Many biologists would say IO] it should even be lower for a safe level.

111 So that's kind of the quick thumbnail on the 121 nature of the PCB problem.& Mayor Kalisz said, it has 131 been, you know, a 20 year effort, but I think one of the 141 messages we want everyone to go home with is that wc arc 151 on the cusp of implementing the cleanup and we'll be 161 talking a lot about that today.

171 This is the cleanup plan that WC came up with in is] ` 98, again after spending a lot of time with the 191 consensus building process. Again, here's the IIurricane zo] Barrier, 195, Wood Street and the Acrovox facility.

? i] The areas in red depict the areas above the ! z] cleanup level called for in the Record of Decision that Page 16 111 will be dredged. The cleanup plan five years ago lz] included these four shoreline disposal facililies. As 131 you might imagine, that generated a lot of controversy,

' 41 but we did a lot of educdtion and outreach. WC talked s] about the positive beneficial reuses of the CDFs and 61 convinced everyone that that was a plan that made sense.

71 However, last year after spending a lot of time a] doing detailed design on the CDF " D", WC eliminated that 91 particular CDE It was largest CDF. It was the most o] complicated. It wds in the Stale designated port arca of I] the harbor. It was in the deepest water. It had a lot 21 of silty soft bad foundation sediments, if you will. hnd 3] we found that it was just  it ma& more SenSe from a 41 number of standpoints lo delete that CDF in favor of offi s] site disposaLAnd that off site disposal is another key 6) piece that we'll be talking about.

71 Ii's a massive cleanup  880,000 cubic yards 01 a] sediment. We put that in lay terms to help people, kind 91 of, wrap their arms around what that means. It's about o] 125 football liclds three feel deep, including the end i] zotics. You tight wan1 to chatngc that ( 0 a lx~ schall 21 analogy age 13  Page X6 ( 6) Min U Script@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, M June 17,2Oa Page 17 Page 11 111 Another important point thal we pointed out to [ ii contaminated less than 50 parts per million, which will 121 pcoplc is that we found that about a half a pound of PC13 [ z] allow us a little bit more economical off site disposal ( 31 per day fluxes from the upper harbor north of 195 1 [ 3] options.

[ 41 seaward. WC found that to be a real call to arms in [ sI terms of needing to clean up the harbor as soon as ( 61 possible.

I71 (: lcanup goals in the ROD. We used kind of a [ a] menu of cleanup levels depending on land use, depending 191 on habitat and where in the harbor  whether or not it's [ lo] in the port area or in the salt marshes.

IllI In terms of the timeframes to mitigate the [ rz] dif'fcrent risks, obviously once we've cleaned up a ~ 131 shoreline are there was an immediate mitigation of the [ IJ] dcrmal risks that we talked about. However, because some [ I;] of the cleanup levels had to be higher than we really [ 16] ideally would want it to be, some of the timeframes to 1171 meet water quality goals and the seafood FDA criteria,

[ ia] according to the modeling that was done, will take ( 191 somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 years to attain.

WI 1 mcntioncd carlicr briefly that we have a site [ zi] spccif> c seafood goal that's a hundred times lower than pz] the l; l> A Icvcl.` I` hat will take even more time after 10 Page 18 ( 11 years because of some of the compromises we had to make [ n] in the cleanup levels.

[ 31 And with that, I'm going to turn it over to Jim [ 41 13rown to talk a little bit about the cleanup process ,5] 11sclf.

161 MR. BROWN: Thanks, Dave Dave's done a good 171 job explaining what the cleanup plan is and what our [ SI cleanup goals arc'l'hcsc next series of slides I'll talk [ s] about how we're going to implement that plan and how [ lo] wc` rc. going to mcasurc that we have successfully [ I 11 implemented that plan. This slide is also on the post [ IZ] board over there. If it's easier to look al, you can 113) look al the poster board.

[' 41 ` l'hc cleanup process is achially fairly simple.

[ i 51 WC would have a dredge operating in the harbor  the 1161 upper harbor or the Iowcr harbor.` l'hc dredge slurry will 11~ 1 IX pt~ mpcd to a dcsanding lacility that we'll bc ~` 81 constructing over the next several months. hnd the [ 49] tlcsancling fzicility will scparatc the coarse grain [ zol material from the scdimcnts and our belief at the moment [? A] is that the majoriiy of the coarse grain material that we p;`: scparatc from the highly contaminated sediments will be L41 ` The slurry separated from the sand will be ISI pumped a little bit over a mile to a dewatering facility [ s] A couple of slides from now I'll explain to you why it is 171 that the dewatering facility is separated by over a mile [ aI from our base of operations at Sawyer StreetAt the [ 9] dewatering facility, the slurry will be dewatered using [ IO] platen framed dewatering technology and a filter cake [ ii) that's generated will be transported off site either by LIZI rail or by truck or a combination of truck and rail.

[ I31 The water that's squeezed out of the sediments [ 14j will be pumped back to our Sawyer Street facility where [ ISI we're expanding our water treatment plant, and that water [ isI will be treated and discharged to the upper harbor.

( 171 The next slide, Stacy. Let me talk a little bit 118) more about the dcwatering facility. The dewatering [ I91 facility encompasses an area of about four and a half [ zo] acres. It's currently under construction. I believe [ ZI] that's stop number four on our bus tour, so we'll talk ~ 22) about it more there and you'll be able to get a better Page 20 [ II look at the size of the facility and what we've [ z] accomplished to date.

w When completed, the dewatering facility  if 141 funding were not an issue, if we were able to get funding 151 at the rate that WC could spend the money, we would be I ' ! 161 dbk to dredge about 1,600 hundred in situ cubic yards of i 17~ sediments per day, which when dewatered amounts to about [ a] 800 cubic yards of filter cake that we would produce at 191 the dcwatering facility or about 1,200 tons of filter [ IO] cake tkdt we could transporl off site daily,

[ I? NCXL slide, Stacy. l'he reason why our [ IZ] dewatering facility is separated by over a mile from our [ i3] sand separation f& ility and our water treatmenl plant is ~ 141 so that we could take advantage of the potential for ( 151 transporting our sediment  our dewatered sediment off [ is] site via rail.` I'his is really the only spot in the 1171 harbor where we could actually link up to an existing 1 [ i a] railyard in the city of New Bedford. So, even though it 1191 is quite a distance, the pump, it is more economical to ( 201 locate it here and take advantage of the rail option for ~ [ Z~ J transporting filter rake off site, which we bclicvc is a / ( 221 more economical way of off site transportation.

I

FOP The & cord, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Nin U Script@ 0) Page 17 _ Page 20 NEW BEDFORD, MA NACEFT SUPERFUND SUEKOMMITTEE MEETING June 17,2003 HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 21 Page 23 I' 1 It is my understanding that later today in a 111 And in the long term we have plans to do bcnthic [ z] wrap up session during a brown bag lunch that Mayor [ z] mo, itoring, which we've actually already started. Wc'vc 131 Kalisz wiU be making a presentation, and I'm sure during [ 31 done baseline benthic monitoring and prior to doing an)

~ 41 that presentation he'll be talking a lot more about the [ 4] sort of major work out in the harbor we'll also another [ 5] city's plan reuse of this area. [ 5] round of benthic monitoring, which includes physical,

[ s] Just as a note, the railyard that wiU be ~ [ s] chemical and biological monitoring.

17) connecting to our dewatering facility  we'll actually L71 We're going to be doing local seafood monitoring [ a] be constructing a rail spur that will connect the [ al and we'll be doing long term water quality monitoring to [ g] existing railyard to our dewatering facility  is a [ g] see that we've eventually reached that ambient w~ tcr [ IO] Superfund removal site and a Brownfield site. [ lo] quality criteria for I'CBs.

[ I 11 This slide sort of wraps up in a little bit more 11 11 Although we haven't started the U scale ( 121 detail exactly how we're going to implement the cleanup [ IZ] dredging yet, we have done quite a bit. In this next ~ 131 plan. It shows alI of the major components of the ( 131 series of slides, we'll talk Itbout some of the major ~ 141 cleanup plan is that the dredge operates in the harbor [ i4] accomplishments that we have made out in the harbor to [ is] and the slurry is pumped to the desanding facility. The [ ISI date.

~ 161 remaining slurry after the sand is separated is pumped [ I61 Design work. Tltis is a very large complex [ 17] down to our dewatering faciIity. The falter cake will be ~ [ IT] project. I won't do through this cntirc list of design [ la] transported off site by rail or by truck or a combination 1191 of truck and rail, and the water is pumped back to the [ zo] Sawyer Street facility, treated in our water treatment [ 21] plant and the water is discharged to the upper harbor.

WI Dave went over what our project goals are and,

Page 22 [ I] of course, it's very important to measure  to come up ( 21 with some very good performance measures to show that ~ 31 we've implemented the project successfully. We need to [ 4] come up with measures of success, not only that wc [ 5] achieved the cleanup goals  the four different cleanup [ 6] goals that Dave talked about depending on where we arc in [ rl the harbor  but also that we've achieved the ultimate [ a] goal of folks being able to eat the fish safely and that [ gl we've achieved the ambient water quality criteria.

[ lOI Our short term goals, initially we will  as 11 I] soon as the dredging is complete we've come up with about [ lz] 45 dredge management units, all about five acres in size.

~ 131 As soon as we complete one of those dredge management [ 14] units we'll do our confiimatory sampIing to make sure [ is] that we've achieved the cleanup goal in that area.

( 161 Also, as we're implementing the dredging,

[ 17] dcsanding and dewatering, we'll be doing a significant [ ia] amount of air moniloring to make sure that the ambient [$ g] levels are not at levels that are unacceptable for human 1201 health and we'll be doing some significant water quality [ zj] monitoring to make sure that we have no adverse shorl

EE] term impacts to the environment during the dredging.

._ .. .~~ .~~~~~~ ~~~~ ~~ ~~~  I____ [: 221 disposal that r& uired a bit of rework. But, you know, ie] activities. We'vT spent approximately $ 40 , Million on 1. 191 design to date smce 1998. Of course, WC did some major zo] re engineering P four concept by elimina6ng one of the 211 confined disposal Facilities in favor of off site Page 24 [ I] we've also had to collect 6,000 new sediment samples to [ z] belter characterize the area and vertical extent of the [ 3] problem.

[ 4] You know, we needed a very accurate characterization lol

151 our cost estimates. If you're off by 20 pcrccnt,

[ 6] 880,000, it can make  it's a h~ lgc difference ill cost.

[ 7] So, we did want to collect quite a few samples out there.

PI We did perform some state of the art dredging [ g] studies, which 1' 11 talk about later on. We have around IO] 200 access agreements, so there has been quite a bit of II] dialogue out in the community. Some of those access 121 agreements didn't come right away, so it required some 131 knocking on the door and some dlscussions with various 141 folks to get voluntary access.

1151 We are involved in some extensive archeological [ IG] investigations out there. Thc Wampanoag Nation dud [ 17] inhabit this arca in the past and wcrc required by the [ is] % tiOfKit IIistoric I'rescrvation Acl to do o? lr ( 191 investigations in areas that we're going to bc removing [ zo] sediment and shorclinc material prior to doing the work.

WI We have dcsignccl two of lllc conlinccl disposal [ 22] facilities and CSO rclocaliorls  this last one I'll

Page 24 ( 8) For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 [ ig] bucket with <; I% positioning on it. It's hydraulic in the [ is] incineration, but in the end all that everyone could 1201 sense that the sediment is dropped into this hopper and 1201 agree to was off site transportation. So, around 15,000 ~ 211 then it is slurricd and pumped to the shoreline. So, 1211 yards of highly contaminated sediments were transported ~ 221 it's a combination mechanical and hydraulic. 1221 out of the harbor in 1994  it was dredged in ` 94 and

Page 26 Page 28 [` I IJut the real primary objectives thal we hzd 12) investigating this technology was lo figure out how 131 accurate we could be horizonlduy and vertically with a [ 4] projccl of this size. a couple hundred acres plusThe ! 5] t@ llcr you can make your vertical accuracy the more 161 cconom~ cally you're going to complete your clcanup. Wc [ 7~ want to dredge to our cleanup levels, but we don't want [ a] to over dredge too much. If you're over dredged by a [ s] l'oo~. 880.000 cubic yards isn't going to grow to well [ lo] over a million cubic yards.

[" i So, WC wanted to see just how accurate WC could [ rz] contain ourselves vcrtically. Wc also wanted to know how 113) accuralc wc could be horizontally also. whcrc we are in 1141 the harbor and WC wanted to come up with reliable dredge 1151 production rates. I low quickly could WC implement the ji6j cleanup? And wc wanted to lind oul with this system 1171 rcaily how high WC could make the percent solids.

[ is] Minimizing the amount of water that you dredge up reduces c: sl your water Lreatment and handling costs.

WI So what we concluded was that the dredging !? I] ac` curacv that WC could get 0111 of a systrm like this is I) 21 pItIs or minus four inches vertically, plus or minus about 111 ` 45, removed from the harbor in 2000. Removed from New ( 21 Bedford in 2000.

[ 31 ` l'his slide here  wouldn't you know it, there [ 41 just happened to be 15 high voltage power cables that [ sl were running through the most contaminated area of our [ 6] site. So WC, obviously, can't dredge in that area with ~ 71 some old high voltage power cables, the location of which [ al is plus or minus about 100 feet.

PI What we had to do is we worked with a local [ IO] power utility, NSTAR, who really wanted to update their [ I 11 power grid anyway. They had to bring in a new power line [ I 21 to the city of New Bedford. So, WC worked with them on a [ ia] cost sharing arrangement to relocate these power cables.

[ 14] ` I'hc government paid 75 percent, the local utility paid 25 [ I 51 percent. And what we did was we would locate off the [ 16] upper harbor one half width at a time, we excavated a [ I~ J clran corridor to put a new power cable conduit in, and [ is] WC completed this effort in 2001.

1' 91 So, we have a clean corridor to relocate the [ zo] existing power cables too, and the city of New Bedford is ` l? i] getting an updated powerline, 1 I5 kilo bolt line to the I : I [ z] city 01 New l) cdford. And over the next couple of years NACEP'I' SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 Page 25 Page 27 111 mention only because it's consumed vast quantities of [ I] a foot and a half horizontally. It had very limited 12) Dave's time and my time. Real estate acquisitions and [ z] impacts on air and water quality. We did extensive ( 31 business relocations.` Fhese issues are very time [ al amount of water quality sampling and air sampling during 141 consuming. It's never too early  if you have real [ 4] this test. And our production rate in water greater than 151 estate issues on one of your projects, it's never too [ 51 four feet, where you're not impacted by tidal influences,

16) early to start resolving your real estate issues. [ s] you can dredge around the clock without worrying about [ 71 We did, in 1988/ 89, perlbrm some evaluations of ( 71 the tides, is about 95 cubic yards an hour, and in Ia1 various dredging technoiogies and we did dredge the hot [ al shallower areas between two and four feet our production ( 91 spot areas in ` 94 and ` 95. So. we did have a lot of [ g] rate is estimated to be about 35 cubic yards an hour. ( 101 expertencc in dredging New Bedford IIarbor. But from 1995 [ lOI All these perimeters were critical in [ ill to 2000 we thought there were some significant [ I II determining the total project cost and time to complete. ( 121 improvements in the area of dredging technology and we [ I21 Dave talked about his background part of the ( 131 did want to demonstrate one of the latest and greatest [ ia] presentation. We did take care of five acres of the most ~ 141 state of the art dredging technologies. [ 14] highly contaminated area of the harbor in ` 94 and ` 95.

I? 51 So in the summer of 2000 we contracted with BEAN [ is] Those were arC% S of the harbor that were contaminated. ( 161 Environmental to provide us this state of the art ~ 161 Well above 4,000 parts per miUion. They were dredged ,171 mrchanical hydraulic dredge. It's mechanical in the [ I 71 from the harbor in ` 94 and ` 95. The Record of Decision [ ISI scnsc that it is a bucket  it is an environmental 1181 was amended in 1999. It originally called for For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Script@ ( 9) Page 25 _ Page 28 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEFT SUF'ERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 29 [ i] we will be, little by little, rerouting the power from [ z] the existing location to the new cable conduit and we'll 131 be ready in time for our full scale dredging next fall I41 Dave Dickerson will go over some of the more [ s] early action works that we've done and some of the other [ s] significant accomplishments that we've made over the last [ 7] few years.

PI MR. DICKERSON: Thank you, Jim. I mentioned [ g] that the background  or in the background that we [ lo] accelerated some of the cleanups in certain areas where [ I I] the shoreline land use, paired with the high shoreline [ lz] PC13 levels, really required some attention sooner than 1131 the full scale dredging allowed, and this so called early [ 14] action area was in the northern most stretch of the [ 15] harbor. Residential neighborhoods, background  back [ 16] yards with 20,000 parts per million, for example. So, we [ 17] decided again to attack those early on.

[ I81 This shows the cleanup  we're in somebody's [ 19] back yard. The house is just off the screen. It [ zo] certainly doesn't look like a harbor site, but this is [ zi] the Acushnet River. It's more riverine, but it still [ zz] gets the tidal influence. So we removed the shoreline Page 30 [ I] sediments, trucked them down to our Sawyer Street base of [ z] operations for temporary holding until we get the full [ LI] scale dewalering facility up. We'll be stopping at the 141 Sawyer Street stop during the tour.

El This is what the area looks like after the [ 6] excavation with the reStOratiOn Stahng. Moving from [~ j that early action in the same general neck of the woods [ a] we then, just this last winter, attacked a larger seven [ s] acre area. I mentioned this earlier, but just to give [ lo] you a little detail. Some of the shoreline levels are 11 t] shown here, up to 46,000. This is the early action area.

[ lz] This is the Wood Street Bridge.

1131 Basically what we did  you can hit that next [ 14] bullet, Stacy  is we blocked off the Acushnet River [ IS] from the north and the high tide from the south so that ~ 161 we dried up the riverbed over the winter and were able to 1171 excavate those sediments in the dry. We completed the [~ a) excavation just this last March and we're doing the salt [ js] marsh planting now. I believe we'll see some of the [ XI] planting as we go up there today.

Prl ` I` hls is what the river looked like last winter.

[ a~] Everyone compbdincd about the brutal cold of the weather, Page 31 [ I] but it really was good for us because we could put heavy [ 2] equipment out further in the riverbed. I think  can [ 3] you back up, Stacy?

r41 What I want to mention on this is these two [ s] large plastic pipes are the bypass river. We had to set [ s] up a bypass pumping system, which allowed us to dry up [ 7] the riverbed. There's still some water from some small [ a] brooks and combined sewer overflows and groundwater [ s] discharge and run off, all that good stuff, but for the io] most part we dried up the riverbed.

111 Here's the salt berm that is still in place 121 today. We had to wait until the spring immigration 01 131 the anadromous fish run was over before we could lake it 141 down. That was a hard schedule  milestone. We had to 151 complete the excavation by March 15th before the spring [

,[

[ 16] fish run started. Apparently, we've come to learn that ~ 1171 if you mess up a fish run it's forever. So, we didn't ` 1. [. 181 want to mess up the fish run.

191 This is a picture of the Phase I restoration ! o] with the river bypass still in pldce. Agdin, here's the ! I] pipes for the river bypass. And this  at this stage ~ 21 the contaminated sediments, both in the riverbed and the Page 32 [ I] shoreline banks, have been removed and the shoreline [ 2] banks have been replaced with clean backfii and erosion [ 3] protection. And what happened is we waited until the ( 41 weather warmed up before we planted the salt marsh and

[ 5] up in the buffer.

161 We're going to also show some recent progress [ r] moving down towards the dewatering fdcitity.` bis slide [ a] hopes to set the stage for those photos to, hopefully.

[ g] increase your understanding of all the dominoes that had [ IO] to fall before we could build a dewatcring facility. I [ i I] mean, it's a very crowded, dense urban harbor that we're [ iz] working in. We had to move utilities. We had to move [ 13] businesses. We had to move sewers, et cetera, et cetera.

[ I41 So, the fist one  again, here's the previous ( 151 shoreline. The white line here is the heavy duty marine [ 16] bulkhead that we'll see. Before WC built that we had to ~ [ 17] work with the city to relocate a combined sewer overflow [ ie] in the swell. We were trying to do it in a smart way [ is] that works in concert with the overall city's combined [ zo] sewer overflow master plan rather than just moving it ~ 211 south of the facility, tar cxamplc. It's the same cost [ zz] fbr us, but a better product for thr city.

Page 29  Page 32 ( IO) I Min U Script@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 III ` l'hcre was a barge towing operation that moved ( 21 material out to the islands here. We had to relocate the [ 3] Packer Company up to this area. However  you can't 14: really tell, but this area h? ppened to be an abandoned 151 lot with about 15 abandoned fishing vessels just dumped [ 6] of1 short. So. we had to rcmovc the fishing vessels,

171 which we would have had to do anyway because the iSI underlying scdimcnts were contaminated with PCBs. But it 191 also facilitated the relocation.

[ jOI WC also  to move Packer, we had to do ~ 111 envlronmcntal drcdging. That will be coming up this LIZI summer. Once we clear the area WC have to build Packer a ~ 131 new facility and dig him a replacement channeLAnd on ( 141 either side of the facility there's also other businesses [ ljl that we've been, you know, building sustaining 116) relationships with and compensating them for Superfund 1171 related impacts.` l'hey pale in comparison to the Packer,

[ ia] but ncvcrthcless, as you'll see when we go there

1191 For cxamplc, there's a big seafood company.

[ zo] ` I` hcre's a pharmaceutical and seafood packaging company.

[ zi] ` l` hc): at first, didn't warm up to the idea of a large ( 221 Sup'crl'und facility across the street, but we worked [ I] future accomplishments.

PI MR. BROWN: Thanks, Dave. Well, you see, we [ s] have done quite a bit actually to date  excuse me. The [ 41 pollen count must be about bazillion out there today.

[ s] Rut we still have quite a bit to do also.

PI Dave did mention that  did a good job ~ 71 describing the marine bulkhead that we constructed to get [ a] us the acreage we need to complete our dewatering [ g] facility. We haven't actually started construction of [ IO] the building yet, but that's going to start soon. We 1111 have actually awarded the contract for site prep for the [ iz] foundation and for the building. So, our contractor `[ 13] should be out there shortly and we plan to start the ~ 141 foundation work in July and scheduled to complete the [ js] actual building in March of next year.

1161 The rail spur connection, the connection from [ 17] the dewdtcring facility to the railyard right across the [ IBJ street, WC plan on starting construction in September.

[ 19] And you'll see a common denominator. We're trying to [ zo] linish up everything by summertime next year  June

[ 21] so that we're ready to start our full scale dredging in [ zz] Scptembcr of next year.

Page 34 Page 36 111 cxtcnsivcly with them to show them that we really had a

[ z] " you know, an iron tight game plan that really was a ~ 31 safe plan for the neighborhood.

VI , Znd then last, hut not k? aSt, WC had to build [` I We'll be starting construction of the water [ z] treatment plant, you know, this fall and the desanding 131 facility construction will start next winter. The [ 41 estimated start date is January. 151 the bulkhead, about a $ IO Million construction job, to [ EGI give us the elbow room and the square footage we needed 171 for the four and a half acre facility.

PI Illis is what the boatyard area looked like ( 91 before we cleaned it up. Again, this is lo make way for [ lo] the Packer business rclocation. This is another view of :> 1: the abandoned vcssels.` l'his is during the cleanup.

[ I%] A4oving to the dcwatcring area itself, this is 113; the lx~ lkhcad that 1 mentioned. This is the bulkhead ( 141 under construction last winter with the bay frozen  the [ jsj harbor frozen. Hem's another view of thr bulkhead.

1161 I~ ccausc it's in ; I state designated port area WC had to [ I 71 lit1 11 so that it would withstand marinr vessel loads.

,181 It's kind of's  ( inaudible)  dam structurc. Again.

[ 791 thcrc's business related impacts on both sides of the [ XI] bulkhcatt where it tics in near existing water dependent 1;" J i~ lr\ ln~ 5scs.

? 2] And I think I'll hand the mike over toJim for __ _.. .... ..__

For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 PI L; ull scale dredging. We do want to start next [ s] t` all. When will it end? It's unknown and the next 1 [ n series of slides will talk about this uncertainty and [ a] when we're going to complete.

' PI When we complete is very much linked to our [ lo] annual rate of funding and how much we're going to get [ i 11 every year is totally unknown to us. We're not quite [ 12] sure from year to year exactly what the funding scenario ~ 131 is going to be. So this slide puts together various 1141 annual funding levels and shows the years to complete and 1151 the cost to complete once we start the dredging.

[ I61 I talked about that dredge study that we did in ( 171 the summer of 2000. They, you know, estimated our [ ial maximum dredge production rate of 1,600 in situ cubic [ ig] yards an hour. That would be at this funding leveLAnd 1201 Wc would bc able to complete our project in four years ) ( 211 and a total end of cost to complete once we start the ) [ 221 dredging would be $ 290 Million.

..

Min U Script@ ( 11) Page 33  Page 36 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEPT SUPElWUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 37 Page 39 [ II Some various funding scenarios here. I don't [ I] they could partake.

[ z] think it's necessary that I go through every one of them. 121 ' re also use broad outreach strategies. l` hcrc I31 Our annual funding level at $ 15 Million would [ 3] are three municipalities that surround the site. It's [ 4] take about 26 years to complete; and the cost to complete [ 4] 18,000 acres worth of a site. You're looking at roughly [ 5] would be $ 395 Million. $ 15 Million, you know, might be [ 5] 120,000 people in the surrounding areas. Clearly not all [ 6] approximately what we're going to get next year. It ( 61 are directly impacted by the site, but indirectly one can ( 71 doesn't mean that's what we're going to get every year [ 7] make the argument that they are. So, how do you reach [ a] from now on, but I think this Committee knows as well as ( 81 all 120,000 people? It's a challenge. [ q I do that money is tight at the moment and, you know, we [ 91 We gear to maximizing the numbers. We have a [ IO] might be talking $ 15/$ 20 MiIIion a year for the next [ io] mailing list of over 1,000  I'm sorry  over 4,000 [ I I 1 couple of years. [ I 11 people. We sent out fairly regular mailing pieces,

[ j21 By the end of this fiscal year we will have [ 12] newsIetters. We used the local cable. It's amazing how ~ 131 spent approximately $ 100 Million implementing the 1998 ( 131 many people actually watch the cable. WC also have the 1141 cleanup plan. We did recover in the early 90s some costs 1141 forum, which has been in existence for years and has been ( 151 for the cleanup from 5 PRPs who settled in three Consent 1151 an important part of providing input, although its ( 161 Decrees  three separate Consent Decrees in the 1990s. [ IS] dynamics have changed over the years as one would expect.

~ 171 Out of those three Consent Decrees we recovered [ ISI approximately $ 66 Million for response costs. One of ( 191 those Consent Decrees has a reopener. In that Consent 1201 Decree EPA reserved the right to reassert its claim [ zi J against the PRPs when our total costs exceed $ 130.5 [ zz] Million, and, of course, you saw from the previous slide [ I] no matter which funding scenario our costs will be ~ 21 exceeding that reopener amount.

[ 31 MS. GREENDLINGER: I'm going to talk to you 141 about the public involvement aspect of this project, as 151 you can tell from the previous sIides. This is a complex [ q site. A complex site demands that you have a dynamic [ 7] approach and that your  your approach changes as [ EI] situations change.

PI WC go beyond the legal requirements here at the [ lo] site. An example would be referenced was mdde to the [ it] elimination of a confined disposal facility in " D" and [ 121 going off site instead. Legally we only have to do a ( 131 public notice for that. We felt that it was very [ i4] important to make sure that the community knew what was ( 151 going on and also to provide them the opportunity to give [ I71 We also have really started to employ targeted 1181 outreach invol< ement efforts. As we're starting to go [ iq into neighborh b ods that are effecting particular pockets [ 20] of the commur& y, we are gearing upwards to try to reach a 1211 those pockets. n example would be the Wood Street arca 1 [ zz] where you just saw the work being done with the near dry Page 38 Page 40 [ i] conditions.

PI Well, an example would be we went door to door ~ [ 3] to give advance notice to the people in that community [ 4] what was about to happen in literally their backyards.

[ s] We provided newsletters explaining what they should [ 6] expecl what impacts might have. And then we went door

[ 7] to door in the mid process to check in with them. 110~ is [ a] it going? Were there any concerns? And we did hear from [$ I people  I'm concerned about truck traffic. I'm [ lo] concerned about air monitoring. And we were able to bc [ ii] very responsive and get them the current information : 12] immediately at that time.

: 131 And then we followed up with a door to door near : 14] the end of the completion of that project, again with a : is] newsletter letting them know what had happened, what [ 16] LIS input into the decision making process.

[' 71 So, we went ahead and we had an informational [ ISI meeting, as well as having an official public comment [ 19] period in a public hearing so that we could capture the 1201 thoughts and concerns that the community might have, and [ zjj WC' did cxtcnsivc publication about those different ( 221 efforts so that people really knew what was going on and [ i6] accompIishments and what wds Ielt, so that they had very [ 17] clear expecldtions.

Ii& Another example of targeted involvement, as Dave [? g] and Jim have both mentioned, WC work very closely w1t11 [ ZO] the businesses that wc'rc impacting. We're building thi:,

: ZI] huge Fdcility right in their fron: yards or backytrcls and 1 [ zz] working with them on a monthly basis. No1 only working / .

Page 37  Page 40 ( 121 For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUJKOMMITTEE MEETING NEW BEDFORD, Ml HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS June 17, 200;

~~ ~~ ~~~  , ~~~.. ~ ~.~~ .._. ___..___ ___ _

Page41 1 [ i] together to identiljl any kind of issues and to resolve [ z] them immediately.

PI When we heard that the workers were concerned [ 4] about airborne I'CBs, we immediately put together a 151 newsletter addressing that and put that out in Spanish,

[ 6] I'ortugucse and English to all of their workers and [ 7] distributed that.

PI Seafood consumption is a driving concern at the ( 91 site. We are working with the Massachusetts Department [ lo] of Public IIealth, as well as the City of Social Service [ I I] to develop an outreach effort there and we're going to be [ iz] targeting, particularly  at least as a first step,

1131 pregnant women and young children who are most at risk 1141 from a health prospectivc. And we'll be employing the [ 15] medical community to help us get that word out to the [ 16] pcoplc who are most at riskAnd again, that's another [ I ; J example of the type of targeted involvement activities [ 18] and awareness campaigns that we're employing and as 1191 things change and as different issues come up we'll [ 20] remain dynamic in our approaches.

12' 1 MR. DICKERSON: As you can see, we have a tag [ 221 [ cam going here today. 111 be available for reuse. You know, it's right on the 121 harbor and it will have a rail spur connecting it to the 131 city's redeveloped railyard. So it's kind of a back to [ 4] the future concept. In centuries past the harbor was Is] lined with rail spurs connecting, you know, the marine [ 6] commerce to the inland areas and we hope to kind of ( 71 regenerate thal concept.

181 As you'll see, the railyard has fallen into [ q disrepair. The city is actively working to redevelop [ IO] that now. Some of you who came in by 195 you might have , II I] noticed the new rail structure right there, Route 18. So 1121 signs of this redevelopment are starting to happen.

LiZI Again, promotion of land use changes. We have a ~ 141 few slides that show what's happening. We certainly [ is] don't take complete benefit for some of the shoreline [ 16] changes, but we think the cleanup certainly plays a good ~ 171 part in having that community at large, hopefully,

[ IB] reconnect with the harbor as a recreational and, you ! I91 know, valuable resource as opposed to a waste disposal : 201 area.

WI We talked a lot about the north ofWood Street [ zz] arez'l'his used to be a lumberyard. The city, I think, Page 43 Page 42 111 ` l` hc last of the major points that we wanted to [ i?] make toddy wds that beyond the specifics  and as you've 13; heard today there are thousands of them at the Harbor [ 4] cleanup itself  we believe and have found that there is IS] kind ol' a broarlcr impact to the community in terms of [ q both cconomir developments and community benefits in ~ 71 Icrms of land use cl ranges and the like. We're going to 1~) show a few slides that talk about that now.

PI The lirsl we've talked about a little bit. I : lci] mentioned the dewatcring titcility is smack dab in the [ I 11 State designated port area, so it's almost like an

1121 ( Inaudible)  if you want to USC SuperFund speech. That 1131 wc had to build it up to port standards so that it 1141 wouldn't be a waste of money for the government to build [ ISI at lower standards that would not be available for reuse 116) as part ot the port facility. And we've worked very ` li] cloacly with the city and the Ilarbor Development 1101 (: ommlssion to ensure that they have, you know, a reusable : i9] properly.

Wl And so the bulkhead itself will IX rated for : Plj zoriimc~ rcial vessels, as I mcntioncd. Thc dewatcring ( 2?] warchousc will bc a 50,000 square that lacility Ihat will  .~. ___

Page 44 1 111 used a lot of vision to designate that as a shoreline [ 2] park  future riverside park. As you'll see, we used 131 that area in the transition between lumberyard and park 1 141 as a staging area for the Wood Street cleanup.

[ 51 Right across the river is Achusnet's Riverview [ q I'ark.` l'hey all kind of sound alike. Riverside

[ 7] Riverview. But it's a nice little park we'll also visit [ al on the first stop. There's a few new land trusts that [ s] have popped up and there's a couple properties that I'm [ lo] aware of, anyway, both north and south of 195 that have [ I I] been bought for both conservation, habitat enhancement ( 121 and educational and open space purposes.

[` 31 Another exciting aspect we've seen is some of 1141 the mills are starting to be renovated for various ~ 151 things. This one, in particular, for assisted living.

[ is] They did a real nice job renovating that facility and 1171 reusing it.

Cl81 Another key piece that really, in my mind, might 1191 be emblematic of this transition of shoreline land use.

[ zo] This is our Sawyer Street base of operations. Right next ( 211 door used to be this large, four/ five story, you know,

( 221 typical old brick mill building that kind of walled off For The Record, IX.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Script@ ( 13) Page 41  Page 44 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEFT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS _. ___~~~ ~~

[ I] this nice urban neighborhood from the waterfront. That [ z] came down in the mid 90s and  it was the same time we [ 3] were building consensus for the harbor cleanup  and the [ 4] idea sprouted and green some strong roots that maybe this [ s] would be a good place for a nice public park.

IsI The Natural Resource Trustees  we did mention [ 7] this  but they got a significant amount of settlement [ a] funding as well from the Superfund litigation. They have [ g] kicked $ 2 Million in to help the city get this park off [ io] the ground. And perhaps once we're done with our Sawyer [ t I] Street area that might become Phase II of this

[ I21 ( inaudible).

[ I31 So, I think that's about it. Again, the key 1141 points just to  not to sound like a broken record, but [ is] there are human health risks as well as ecological risks.

[ 16] We are taking pains to measure ourselves and prove that [ 17] the project is successful over both the short and long [ ia] term.

[ I91 We've talked about the relationship between the [ zo] budget crisis and the timeframes for the cleanup, and [ zi] last the broader economic and community aspects of the [ zz] remedy. I think we'll take questions both now and on the ___. .. Page 45 Page 47 Page 46 [ I] bus tour.

121 MS. GREENDLINGER: Our thought was that we would p] just take some clarifying questions here while we're in [ 4] the room and then we'll start  I will continue the [ s] discussion on the bus since we're all going to bc on the [ 6] same bus.

[ 71 MR. LOEHR: A couple of clarifying. Jim.

PI MR. DEROUIN: Dave, you commented on the mass [ g] flux of PC&. What was that  a daily basis?

1101 MR. DICKERSON: Yes.

[ Ill MR. DEROUIN: And is that computed on a steady [ IZ] state condition or after dredging began?

[ I31 MR. DICKERSON: That was baseline, absent any ~ 141 dredging measured right at a convenient sampling point at [ 15] the Coggeshall Street BridgeThat's what we found was [ i6] happening.

1171 MR. DEROUIN: What was the source of that flux,

( la] if there have been no new PCB discharges into the water,

[, 91 per se, over the course of years? Is this just the [ ZO] washing of lhcm from surface sediments?

1211 MR. DICKERSON: Yeah. Let me back up. I ,221 misspoke. Half a pound was what we found during the [ i] hotspot dredging. Other studies had also found

[ z] previous studies have found that without any dredging [ 3] there was also a considerable flux seaward.

141 But we think, yes, that the  Acushnet River [ s] flow, even though it is a tidal area, that most of the ( 61 PCBs will eventually  slowly migrate to the southern ~ 71 lower harbor areas. It's very shallow. We didn't [ a] mention that. So it's  you know, wind, storms come up ; 191 and

1101 MR. DEROUIN: Is the flux greater during [ i I] dredging than in steady state or non dredging conditions?

[ 121 MR. DICKERSON: We found that the flux was [ 13] extremely much lower than the acceptable level that we 1141 had developed for ourselves for the dredging program.

[ IS] And we really didn't think WC developed a 101 of flux [ 16] from the dredging itself So, 1 don't  especially at [ 17] that point when we're dredging about a mile away from the [~ a] sampling point. So, we don't think that the dredging [ rg] impacted a lot of that flux.

[ 201 MR. DEROUIN: Okay. So you don't think that the [ 21] dredging upstream is going to increase the amount 01 [ zz] material you're going to have to remove downstream as a ____.

I21 MR. DICKERSON: The short answer is yes, if we [ 3] do it correctly, which we've done now three times. We [ 4] worked with the EPA laboratory  research laboratory in [ s] Narrangansett, Rhode Island, to come up with what the [ 6] acceptable levels of flux would be. That if we exceeded ~ 1 those flux levels we would have measurable increases of [ a] PCBs in the lower harbor sediments. As I said, we were [ g] far, far below that. And those have been published lo] papers in peer review journals. So, we feel pretty II] positive about that.

121 MR. LOEHR: I have four questions up. That's 131 all I'll take right now. Otherwise, we could probably 141 spend the whole morning in here asking questions.

I51 But we do have a tour and we can continue to ask 161 questions on the tour and then we will be coming back 171 here again for follow up in a closing type of thing.

181 Let me just continue on the four and I'll ask 191 the rest of you to hold your comments and tackle them ! a] either as sidebars going in and going out. or on the 1x1s ~ 11 and so forth.

? 2] Tom, Ed, Sue and Gr: mt.` Lbm.

~~.___ ~__ ~~~~ . ~~~ .~~~ ~~~ II Page 48 [ i] result of the whole program?

MimU Script@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS June17,2003 ..~ .~____. Page 49 Page 51 Ill MR. NEWLON: I just had a quick question  111 mine. But we wanted to do the sediments first before we [ z] ( inaudible). Jim was saying about three contamination [ z] do the shoreline wetlands because we didn't want to risk ~ 31 pl;~ ccs whet c you lirst dredged that were  you know, 20 / [ 3] recontaminating expensive wetlands.

~ 41 percent, whatever, 10~. When you go back and look at [ q those areas, given that there is pretty high sediments [ 6) close by still, are you gelling recontamination of those 171 original cleaned up areas?

PI MR. BROWN: WC haven't started the full scale [ s] dredging yel, so it's  it's hard 10 give you a definite 101 answer on that. Wc did do some  live acres of hotspot I I] dredging, but we're only trying to get down 10 4,000 121 parts per million in that area from that  you know. I 131 think our highest hit out there was 13 percent PCBs.

141 What WC have been finding from the pilot 151 dredging studies that we did in the iate SOS, from the 161 hotspot dredging that WC did in ` 94 and ` 95, Liom the 171 pllot dredging that we did in 2000, is that the dredging 181 operation ilself is having minimal impacl on water 1s) quality and suspension is really not as bad as we would zo] have thought it would have been.

211 MR. NEWLON: I was wondering more about just the zz] existing conditions. Not the dredging picking up new Page 50 ~

if] stul'l, but just existing conditions fluxing things [ Z] aroLlnd.

131 MR. DICKERSON: We do have some conformational I41 MR. BROWN: Was your question  I think I [ s] finally understood your question toward the end. You 161 really weren't worried about the impacts of dredging.

171 Just what's normally going on out there day in and day [ a] out?

PI MR. NEWLON: Right.

LlOl MR. BROWN: Yeah.

1111 MR. NEWLON: I mean, even if you do  forget ( 121 dredging for a minute and just  if you take 25 years to [ 131 clean something up and in the meantime you've got this ( 141 hot shlff sitting there washing around and all that.

1151 MR. BROWN: Well, as we said, there's about a [ i6] half a pound flux per day going through the Coggeshall [ 171 Street Bridge.

wi MR. DICKERSON: Which is this one right here.

[ 191 MR. BROWN: But, you know, the waste disposal [ zo] practice started in the 40s. We've been fmding that the [ zl] majority of the problem is still contained in the upper 1221 harhor.?` hc lower harbor does have areas that are going [ 4] or recontamination samples. When WC did the early action [ 5] cleanup in 2000. I think it was. that lirst accekzrated [ ti] clcan~~ p we did  and you're absolutely right to point [; I out that recontamination is a big challenge here in a [ a] site like this where you've cleaned up arcas.` I'he Is] question is is it going to gel rccontaminalcd just hy [ IO] nalural proccsscs since the rest of the harbor is still ;` i] highly conlaminated I$;` 1 So. we wanted to measure that after we did the ;! 3: shorclinc cleanups. It was the first slcp. We knew it 1141 was a little bit of a risk because of that very issue and 11 s: wc` vc done yearly sampling after the cleanup was done and [ Ifi] WC' have not found increases above our one part per ( 4 7! million cleanup level for that particular land use.

IlW So. that kind of embolden us, if you will.

:,: I] ` l` ha~` s ; tn acccptablc risk to take. We, thercforc, took [ 201 th(. next step Lo do hc seven acre north ofWood Street i:> t] clc: mnp Ix~;~ usc. in gcncral, our strategy will hc to I? 21 tlrc~ tlsc lhc sul~ fitlal  dnd Lhls isjim's lixte more than Page 52 111 to be part of the cleanup also, but still the vast ~ 2) majority of the mass of the PCBs are still north of the ( 31 Coggeshall Street Bridge. And, you know, it's been  it [ 4] started in 1940.

151 MR. LOEHR: Ed.

El MR. LORENZ: I noticed that almost everything is ( 71 located on the New Bedford side of the harbor. Is there [ a] a technical or political reason for that?

PI MR. DICKERSON: By everything, you mean  well,

[ IO] certainly the contamination is on both sides of the [ I 11 harbor.

lfiZ1 MR. LORENZ: Ilight.

I[ 131 MR. DICKERSON: I assume you mean the confined 1141 disposal facilities and the various cleanup [ I51 infrastructures.

lr61 MR. LORENZ: AU your facilities are located on 1171 one side; your disposal area

LIeI MR. DICKERSON: Yeah.

1r91 MR. LORENZ: When you look at  the did not use [ zo] properly, there seems lo be more on Ihe other side of Ehe j pi] river.

j22] MR. DICKERSON: Yeah. It's the combination of .. __ I_

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Page 53 111 everything. Certainly there is that political undertone [ z] that Fairhaven thought that New Bedford carried the 131 burden of the problem.

( 41 But from a technical standpoint it made sense to ( 51 put the confimed disposal facilities on the New Bedford [ 61 shore because we gain the benefit of the deep  the very 10 deep sediment contamination that was within the [ B] footprints of those facilities that we then didn't have [ 91 to dig up. So, it made technical sense as well as

[' 01 < End tape one, side one.)

IllI MR. BROWN:  industrialized area for  you 1121 know, since the 1800s and earlier, so the shoreline has ( 131 already been, you know, impacted by man. It already has ( 141 all the anthropogenic impacts over time whereas on the [ ISI Acushnet side it's pretty more a natural shoreline,

~ 16) natural wetland area. So that was another reason why we 117) didn't want to for, you know, ecological value reasons ( 181 build structures over there.

1191 MR. LOEHR: Sue.

WI MS. BRIGGUM: Yeah. You mentioned that the ~ 211 Trustee had kicked in $ 2 AMillion to assist with some 1221 rehab. Was that most of the recovery or how much else is ~ I_

111 out there that might help these projects?

121 MR. DICKERSON: I think they have over $ 20

131 total. I don't know if they all still have it. They've ~ 41 been starting to spend it. They have more than $ 20 [ s] Million or had more than $ 20 Million from the sale,

[ s] including interest. As well as we have gained about $ 43 17~ Million in interest from our original $ 56 Million 181 settlement.

IQ1 So, I think the $ 2 Million might be 10 percent [ IO] of their total $ 20 Million.

L1 ` 1 MS. BRIGGUM: And they're going to be spending [ jz] it later on this project, or they're spending it 1131 elsewhere?

1141 MR. DICKERSON: The  I'm sorry. The $ 2 [ 15] Million or the $ 20 Million?

Cl61 MS. BRIGGUM: The $ 20 Million.

1171 MR. DICKERSON: They have gone through  they [ la] are starting to spend it now and they will continue LO 1191 spend it.

WI MS. BRIGGUM: In New Bedford on this

P1I MALE VOICE: No, throughout the estuary. Some ( 22) parts of Dartmouth, some of the areas that have been ___ Page 54 I[

[

I I [

I;

F [: [ I] impacted. Fairhaven, Massachusetts; the West Island arca [ z] are all " Jeneficiaries of this. The IIarborTrustccs ( 31 Council has a very tight set of perimeters of which they [ 4] use before they start awarding the money. IL is not [ s] everything being dumped in the city of New Bedford and ( 61 its

( 71 MS. BRIGGUM: It's not all associated with the [ a] site itself becdusc

PI MALE VOICE: No. The entire estuary that's lo] within the area. Now, the other interesting point is i 11 Dave mentioned that for much of the period after the iz] award  the cash award wds made by the Courts and the 131 money was put into this fund, it wds not in interest 141 bearing accounts and tremendous amounts of money were 151 lost. It was only during  this is not a political 161 statement, but just timeframe.

171 During the Clinton administration. when an la] effort was led by Barney Frank to put the money omit of ! g] Texas banks and into interest bearing accounts so that ! o] there was a resitiual, that $ 20 Million grew to almost,

zr] within three ye& s, $ 26 Million and a tremendous amount ? z] of money was b: eing put  growing wilhin the availabiliLy Page 56 [ I] to be distributed.

( 21 It is a very slow draw down on the bureaucratic [ 3] side from Noah, who is Ihe administrator of the fund,

[ 4l which is a good part. But there is an cvcr increasing [ s] amount of money that is there and is put in lhcrc l'or the [ s] remediation of the coast fines in this estuary as it's ~ 71 been impacted.

PI MR. LOEHR: Grant.

IQ1 MR. COPE: Yeah. I jusl had a quick question [ ro] regarding the Consent Decrees. It' 1 heard you right you [ I I] said that one Consent Decree has a rcopcner if cost [ iz] exceed and then if thal's  if that's the case, whal ~ 131 about the other two. Whal happened thcrc? Why dlon'(

~ 141 they have reopeners?

1151 MR. BROWN: I don't know. 1 can't answer that.

[ is] Part of a settlement. Maybe Dave was around back then.

( 171 MR. DICKERSON: I think the main answer . I [ ra] wasn't around then either, but I'm told by my attorneys [ IQ] that the main reason was th; il thy were, by t', lr, the most [ zo] culpable party.

PII MR. BROWN: The one with the rcopcncr was the 1221 most culpable party. Page 55 Page 53  Page 56 ( 16) tin U Script@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING NEW BEDFORD, MA HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS June 17,2003  Page 57 Page 59 [` I MALE VOICE: None of us were actually involved [ i] of the Mass. Department of Environmental Protection and [ z] in that  ( inaudible)  ability to pay issues from the ( 31 settling parties as well as  < inaudible). This was a ( 41 scttletuent that came out of 1itigation. A nice little is] trial that went on for quite some time and we only have 161 the one  ( inaudible)  reopener, which we are [ 7] evaluating along with the Justice Department. Whether or [ a] not that will bear anything in terms of losing more money p] for the cleanups, I don't have an answer.

1101 MR. LOEHR: At this particular point, we do need ! I I] to move on to the tour. Thank you all for holding the ( 121 rest of your questions. I'm sure, as I said before, you ( 13: coulcl stay in here for the whole morning, but

[ 141 Let mc also thank Dave and Jim and Stacy for a [ is] great presentation  ( clapping).

1161 They also will bc around while we take a tour 1171 and into the Visitor's Center. Thcre arc  before you [> a) all get up. WC have a few housekeeping things.

I191 First, let me turn to the Mayor and then I need 1201 to turn lo John and Molly. Fred.

1211 MAYOR KALISZ: I just want to point out that ( 721 thcrc is a number of suits in the room and I'll Page 58 il L 1 characterize them as that. These are members of my ( 21 pcrsonncl stafl`; Mike McCormick, whom you have seen ( 31 before, my Chief of Staff, , Matt'I` homas, the City ~ 41 Solicitor for the City of New nedford; Scott Elfonz ISI ( phonrtic) i:, in the back. the ( Iity's llnvironmental ( 61 Planner. Doug Model& who is a graphic specialist with my 171 oft&; and Danny Romanowitz, who is in the front. These 181 pcoplc are around throughout the day.

I91 If for some reason you've got to get back to the [ IO] hotel, signal one of thcm. Therc is a car that will be [ I 11 following the bus.` l'hcy'll get back. lf you need ; 121 anything that you may not have that we may be able to ( 131 provide for you, these people are hcrc to provide that ! 141 resourrc.

1151 Ihug is going to be out. If any of you want to [ 16] capture a picture of any spccilic element of the site,

[ 17] that's why he's around. Just tell him your name and he [ rs] will take IX: plctm c, log it and before you Icave he will fig] make sure that you have what you riced to take back with [ ZO] ) Y) l,.

[% l] MR. CAVAGNERO: Just one mot c introduction. Wc 1221 do h; n'c I) eirclrc Mcnoyo, who is the Assistant Commissioner 121 she will also be speaking at lunch.

PI MS. MAYO: Rich, are there any others you might 141 want to introduce to the rest of the Subcommittee, so [ 5] that they know there are some other resources in the room [ s) that will be on the bus with us. I just want to make [ 7] sure you have some names with those faces. Okay. Great.

[ e] Thanks.

PI MR. LOEHR: Last logistics, Molly  John.

101 MS. MAYO: Yeah. We would like to do a quick,

1 I] maybe hand count  just an informal hand count because 121 we've got a lot of guests  for how many people will I 31 want lunches. We have box lunches that will be available 141 at the Visitor's Center. So, if you could raise your 151 hand real high and we'll do just a quick count.

` 61 All right. Thanks, everybody. And so $ 10 also.

I 71 I'm sorry. Why don't we leave so everybody can ruh to 181 the bathroom real quick. You can leave your stuff in the 191 room and why don't WC take  why don't we make sure that ` 01 we're on the bus by 930 and it's right out in front.

111 So, you have a couple minutes to run to the bathroom.

! 2] ( End tape one, side two.)  I__ ____

Page 60 111 ( Tour of site by bus.)

I21 ( A lunch break was taken.)

[ aI 141 PI PI [ 71 WI PI IlO1 PUBLIC MEETING 11 ` I MR. LOEHR:  quit onThursday at noon.

1121 There's a lot that's been done since the last meeting and ,113) I compliment all of you who have took part in the many [ 14] work group meetings to get lo where we are. I'm going to ( 151 adjust the agenda slightly in terms of the presentations [ t61 in case there's some of the audience who are not here yet ~ 171 LO provide a statement of the charge and the summary of `[ IS] the last meeting and so forth.

Ii91 This is officially then the opening of the fifth ( 201 meeting of this particular NACEPT Subcommittee. It's [;? I] been a year since we started this, almost to the day. I [ zz] was trying to look it up and see if it was exactly the ..

For The Record, Xnc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Scrip& m ( 17) Page 57  Page 60 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17, 2003 NACEFT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS __..~

[ I] day, but it's the same time period that we got together,

[ 2l June ` 02 in Washington DC to start this. And I did not p] know and my guess is none of you knew where we would be a [ 4] year from then.

El Well, I think we came a lot in terms in activity IS] and synthesis and we have this document before us to be [ 7] able to synthesize the material that we have.

PI We've also had some changes in the membership of [ g] the Subcommittee. One of our members, Mark Eastfeld [ io] ( phonetic), had to step away for some personal and health [ I 11 reasons. But we have two other additional members who [ IZ] have joined us who, for the first time, are here, and for [, 3] the audience, but also as a reminder for all of us, in a 1141 minute we'll go around the table to introduce ourselves [ is] so people in the audience know who's who in case they [ 161 care to knowthat.

[ I71 But we have two individuals who are joining us [ ia] for the first time today and off on my left is Doris ( 191 Cellarius and I'll ask her to just briefly give us a [ 20] quick rundown, and over here is Gary King to participate ~ 211 as well and bring their expertise.

WI Some of you have also asked in noticing what's  ~ Page 61 Page 63 [ I] in the report and the list of everybody about Mark and,

~ 21 indeed, we will list him in there. He is not so listed [ a] in the list today as part of the membership, but we will [ 4] so do that, as well as others who may not be as active as [ 5l WC have had them in the past. But everybody will be [ s] recognized for their contributions.

VI But as I now gave you a little hint, Doris,

[ s] maybe you can give us a quick rundown and I'm asking Gary [ g] to do the same thing, before we go officially around the ( IO] table.

[ 111 MS. CELLARIUS: Well, thank you very much.

[ A?] Everyone has been very nice  ( inaudible)  to meet [ I31 people.

1141 I live in Prescott, Arizona. I moved there [ is] three and a half years ago from Washington State where I [ 16] was  ( inaudible)  our State cleanup program called

( 171 ( inaudible)  site specil% ally. And in Arizona I'm

1181 ( inaudible)  about Arizona  ( inaudible)  and water [ jg] quality issues, and 1  ( inaudible)  Co Chair for the 1201 National Sierra Club, which is an oversight of all of OLIC ~ 211 national pollulion commitlees, air, water  ( inaudible)

[ 22] .. corporate accountability. [ II So this is a very bureaucratic sort of job, the [ z] Sierra Club, and I love the opportunity LO do

[ 31 ( inaudible)  real places and meet the people who

[ 41 ( inaudible). So thank you very much.

El MR. LOEHR: Thank you, Doris. Gary.

161 MR. KING: My name is Gary King. I'm from the [ 7] State of Illinois and with the Illinois EPA there. I'm [ a] kind of the Senior Manager in charge of cleaning up [ g] messes. So, that's  and did many years of working on [ IO] State program, cleanup sites and working with EPA and [ i I] various projects.

[ 121 MR. LOEHR: ` rhdnk you. Again, welcome to both ~ 131 of you officially on behalf of the Committee. I know ~ 141 you've been meeting with part of the work groups and part [ is] of conference calls and you got the letters liom EPA [ 16] appointing you and so forth. But it's a pleasure to 1171 personally have you here participating in thcsc sessions [ ia] for the next two days.

( 191 Let me also just now go around the room for the 1201 audience, who may not know who everybody is, in case you [ ZI] really care to and we'll go around in this particular [ 22] direction. Myself, John. And then go around. .~

[ iI And, as usual, it's simply name and aff& ation [ 2] and anything else that you care to say for the record and [ 3] for the people who care to understand that.

L41 But I'm Ray Lochr, the Chair 01. this particular [ 5l Subcommittee. I'm affiliated with the University of ( 6) Texas at Austin.

[ 71 PI MR. EHRMANN: John Ehrmdnn, Meridian Inslilule [ g] and lead facilitator for the Subcommittee.

[ 101 MS. McMANUS: Elizabeth , McManus with Ross and [ ii] Associates. We are working with Meridian on Ihc [ iz] facilitation.

[ I31 MR. CARASEA: Angelo Carasca. I'm with WA.

~ ~ 141 I'm the DFO.

[ IsI MR. JOCK: Ken Jock. I'm the linvironment [ 16] Division Director foor Ihe 9. Regis Mohawkl` ribe.

1171 MR. LORENZ: Ed Lorcnz. I'm from the Pine River [ ia] Community Advisory Group in Michigan and Alma College [ I91 MR. DEWLING: Dick Dcwling. I'm the President [ 20] of Dewling Associalcs, I~ nvironmental I; nginccrs and [ 21] Scientists.

PI MR. ELBERT: Steve Blbcrt, BPAmcrica  age 61  Page 64 ( 18) Min U Script@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 I NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, M.! June 17, ZOO?

[` I MR. DEROIJIN: Jim Derouin. I'm lhe [ z] l~ nvironmental Practitioner in Phoenix, Arizona.

PI MS. CELLARIUS: Doris Cellarius, Sierra Club,

[ 4] Prcscott, Arizona. Page 65 1 Page 67 [ II MR. LOEHR: Molly.

PI MS. MAYO: Molly Mayo, Meridian Institute.

131 MR. LOEHR: Thanks all of you for doing that and [ 51 MS. HERRERA: Me. I'm Dolores Herrera. I'm from ~ 61 hlhuqucrquc, New Mexico. I'm a career activist, I guess,

( 71 over SO years now. I strongly represent the [ al I! nvironmental Justice movement and while I am  I work [ 4] hopehdly it will help the audience in case you wish to [ 5] address a question to anybody or follow up on particular [ 6] issues.

[ 71 We had a greal morningThis is, of course, the [ al official start of the NACEPT Subcommittee activities, but ( 91 on  ( inaudible)  in my Latin0 community in

1~ 01 ( inaudible)  and my community in San Jose,

I" 1 ( inaudible)  <; ounty, hll~~~ querque, New Mexico.

L'? MR. HICKMOTT: Bob IIickmott, Smith Fret Group,

[ i3] Washington DC.

[ f41 MS. HOUGHTON: Aimee Houghton, Center for Public [ I51 linvironmental Oversight.

[ 161 MS. PETERS: Vicky Peters, Colorado Attorney [ I?] General's Office.

1' 81 MR. MITTELHOLZER: Mike Mittelholzer, National [ I91 Association of' Home Buildcrs, Washington DC.

ra MR. NEWLON: Tom Newton, Steel Rives in Seattle,

1211 Washing! on.

P;` l MR. PUTNAM: Iid Putnam, State of New Jersey,

[ iI Dcparlmcnt of Environmental Protection.

PI MR. KING: Gary King, Illinois EPA.

PI MS. PROBST: Kate Probst, Resources for the [ 4] Future.

I51 MR. SKAGGS: Mel Skaggs. I'm from Dallas. I [ 6) work for InDepth Environmental. I'm an engineer.

i71 MS. SUBRA: Wilma Subra, Louisiana Environmental [ a] Action Network.

pj MS. WIENER: l< obin Wiener, Institute of Scrap [ lo] Recycling Inclustrics.

[ I' 1 MR. WHITE: Jason White with Cherokee Nation.

[ 12] MR. TILCHIN: MikeTilchin. CII2M IIill.

[ I31 MS. BRIGGUM: Sue Briggum, Waste Management.

1141 MR. COPE: < irant Cope. I'm an Environmental [ i5] Allorncy in SeaLlle, Washinglon.

1161 MR. ADAMS: l% ill Adams, Kennecot Utah Copper,

[ IT: Sail I.; rkc City 1181 MS. SUTHERLAND: 13ctsy Sutherland, Office of [ ICI] limcrgcncy and Remedial Response in Washington DC.

[ ZO) MR. BREEN: Barry Breen. I` m an Deputy 1211 Assistant Adminislralor a1 thr t; S Environmental [ 221 Protection Agency 1 [ sl we had a great morning in terms of a site visit through ~ [ io] and around New Bedford.

`[ Ill First, for those of you that weren't here, /

[ IZ] leading off with a presentation about the activities and , ll31 a bus tour of specific parts of the site, listening to ( 141 the sidehar comments and so forth it reinforced my own ~ 151 personal feeling that it was a very good use of time 116~ understanding that and so forth and I would Iike to thank [ I 71 Ihe Mayor, who  Fred is not right here, but Fred ~ 181 Kalisz, who helped facilitate this and all of his staff,

[ ig] Mike McCormick and all  et al. Mike, I don't know [ zo] where they are. Maybe they're ail back at work someplace [ zl) doing things to accommodate this.

I also would like to thank the folks from the fZZ! ~~~ ~ .~.  ...~ _ ___. .______ Page 66 Page 68 111 EPA, Rich and Dave and Jim and Stacy, who helped do this [ z] Is Deidre still here or did she take oft? Deidre Menoyo [ 3] from the State of Massachusetts, who gave a fine [ 4] presentation at the luncheon that we had  a luncheon IS] that was a presentation of a box lunch that we had and [ s] used that time to learn about more of the facility.

I71 But I want to personally, again, thank on behalf [ s] of the Committee all of those who did such a fine job of ( 91 making sure we understood the local situation, which is ( 101 exactly why we're here to see the real sites, the real [ I 1~ world's activities. And thank you all for that.

[ I? Before getting into the specifics of this,

( 131 Angelo  where's Angelo?

' 941 MR. CARASEA: I just wanted to remind you that [ ts] the brown envelope is for you to complete your travel.

( 161 It is appreciated if you send it in early.

[ I71 MR. LOEHR: ` l3~ ose of you who need it, it's this [ ia] one. Barry, you have any thoughts or comments before WC ( 191 move on?

I [ 20] MR. BREEN: Thank you. Just one. A word about [ z!] the HI%, OECA members, Phyllis IIarris, Larry Starfield [ zz] and I, none of the three of us can be here all three days .. z For The Record, Inc. " ( 301) 870 8025 lMin U Script@ ( 19) Page 65  Page 68 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEI'T SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS [ i] this meeting. My daughter graduates from high school [ z] tomorrow and  it wasn't even a close call. I'm here [ 3] where I had to be and in Larry and Phyllis' case, it's [ 4] similar.

ISI Larry will be here tomorrow. But among the [ 6] three of us  and none of us will be here on Thursday.

[ 7] So, among the three of us, we have asked Betsy [ a] Sutherland, who is also a member of the EPA Senior [ g] Executive Service to be an extra OECA member for this [ IO] meeting and to be here for you and to help keep some [ i I] continuity with EPA.

114 So, I wanted to make sure you knew  my ~ 131 apologies actually. Well, it was unavoidable. She'll [ 14] graduate once in her life and I'm there for her. That's 1151 it.

Us1 MR. LOEHR: Thank you. Any other  John,

( 171 Molly, Elizabeth, Holly, administrative things before we [ it31 start on a roll.

1191 MS. MAYO: Only that everybody needs to get meet [ zo] Holly, that's right, if you haven't already.

PII MR. LOEHR: Where's Holly?

PI MS. MAYO: Holly  we'll point her out

[ I] ( inaudible)  Holly Dodson. ( Inaudible.)

PI MR. EHRMANN: And we'll say more later about the 131 logistics around dinner, et cetera. So we'll still focus ( 41 on that

El MR. LOEHR: Let me then move on a little bit to Page 69 Page 71 [ iI As I pointed out, we have had a considerable [ 2] amount of effort over the last year; fist of all,

[ 3] getting to know each other, then understanding various [ 4] points of view; then writing things down, and things have [ s] been pulled together into what we have now, which is a [ 6] frost rough draft. And that's What it is.

~ [ 71 It's an attempt to pull things together from ~ [ a] work groups that have not really attempted to cross over , 191 to other work groups as much as they, perhaps, even would [ IO] like. It's a very good attempt to do that, but, again,

[ I i] more for the audience it should not be read as anything [ I 21 like a final document. And some people, I think, are [ I 31 perhaps looking at it like that.

( 141 It's almost like the old Yogi Bear saying  I [ IS] wasn't there, of course, but  what is attributed to [ 16] Yogi, you know, it's never over until it's over. And [ 17] sometimes you're not even too sure of that.

[ I81 But over for us is December. All right. This [ iq is the beginning of the polishing. I like to look at the [ 20] kind of document that we have, the diamond in the rough.

( 211 We think inside of this rough thing that we have is a [ 22] true diamond that we can have some thing meaning of value [ 6] some comments that I would like to make about where WC [ q are and where we think we would like to go and what we [ a] have.

[ 91 Many of these comments probably are more [ IO] appropriate for the audience and so those of you around [ I 11 the table will, perhaps, be reminded more than find a [ 12] whole lot new with that.

[ I31 And, Molly, if you could kind of bring that up.

114) There's a handout that you have in front of you. It's ( 151 called a Review of Draft Final Report, Overview Comments,

[ 16] and my name is on the first piece there. And I only 1171 bring it to your attention because I think it's important [ le] for the audience especially to make it very clear where [ 19] we are and what we have. I perceive from calls I've got [ zo] and some of you have seen things in the mail and in print [ z] that suggest something different and I would like LO 1211 clarify that. Page 70 Page@ Page " 72 ( 20) [ I] for the Agency and a value for those who might read the [ 2] report.

01 But, like fmding a diamond out in a field, it's [ 4] got to be polished. It's got Lo be chipped away. It's [ s] got to be roughhewed into something that people will look [ 6] at and say, hey, wow, that's nice. And that's what we're [ 7] about to start. So, people should not take a look at [ s] anything beyond it as beyond that point.

[ 91 Another point that I would like to make is to [ IO] have some general comment and we understand who the ` I 11 audience is because, at lcasl in my own experience, if : r2] you're going to prepare a document it's very helpful to : i3] know who the heck the audience is and the level of .14] expertise.

,151 Certainly we arc empowered by EPA to produce ' 161 this particular document and it will be read by people ' 17) inside, not only the document called Inside EPA, but 181 inside EPA, the Agency, as well. But there arc also a is] number of other parties interested and aftcctcd partics,

ZO] stakeholders, however you choose to idcntil'y them, State zi] Agencies, people in Corqycss, knowledgeable publrc.

221 These are all individuals who arc familiar with the

Min U Script@ ForTheRecord, Inc.( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 Page 73 1 [ II Superfund and related cleanup programs, but haven't spent 121 this last year going over things the way you have.

[ 3] They're all knowledgeable with Superfund issues, but to 14) different degrees.

151 My own take is we don't have to go back to the [ cl beginning and start describing Superfund, but we do have [ 7] to make it very clear where we're coming from and the 181 logic framework for all these statements. And I think [ gl that's in there, but that's part of the diamond.

[ jOI ( Xearly the draft is a draft report and does not [ j 11  let me emphasize that one word that I got underlined ( 121 up there  does not represent any final statements,

~ 131 recommendations or conclusions. Not know. Again, maybe ( ra] not until I) cccmber.` I'hen WC may have something that we [ 151 can all truly say is a product of the Subcommittee.

I161 So. as one reads into this don't conclude this ~ 171 time  clon't conclude the September draft  probably [ ial not even the one after that that this is what the 1191 Subcommitlee concludes or rccommends. Anybody who makes ( 201 that slatcment, verbally or in writing until this [ ZI; Subcommittee so says so is wrong. Flat wrong. Make no 1221 doubt about that.  ~

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[ iI We have sccii some attemptsThere was a piece [ zl of paper, a document tlrat came out about a week ago that 131 kind 01` inferred that WC had some recommendations. We 141 don't. I don't know of any rccommcndations that are in ~ 51 111crc. I low that particular organization got a hold of it 16) so quickly is an amazement that is only due to the ( r] electronic : trl that WC have out there. Hut lhey do.

PI I% UI anybody who writes or says that this is the 191 Subcommittee's recommendations until the Subcommittee : ioI makes those and agrees to them is flat out wrong. Make : I 11 no doubt about that those of you in the audience and 12j around the table, until you agree it's not an agrccmcnt.

' 31 So, another point to make is that you can expect 141 some very considerable changes. I do. I mean, I look at is] this document and. as I said, what it is it's a start and 161 I expect that today we'll have : I lot of changes and 171 suggestions and discussion, and what's in this draft,

181 wl~ l's in tiic ncsl thf1 may not survive to 111~ last 181 cIr; IJi Ant1 what's in this draft may disappear. Other 20) things may appear. Isut lha~` s lhe way it is and thar's ii] tlkc i1alr1rc oL` thi5 particular oiic.

221 Again, for those of you in the audience, one can I 111 Again, mostly Sot the audience, I would just ( 21 like to refer to what we've agreed to in the past and the [ q way we seem to have been effective in using our time. As 141 we've said before, everybody respects the comments of ~ 51 others. No one monopolizes time or conversation.

El Everybody has the opportunity for input and,

1~ again, fhr the audience the way that  at least the 181 Chair recognizes people is those who wish to talk puts [ s] their name tag in a vertical position so that I can see [ IO] who it is and we'll make sure everybody gets a chance.

[ I 11 There arc, obviously, no stupid questions or comments.

[ izl There are only questions or comments to try to clarify [< 31 something. And I get the chance to recognize an [ 14] individual to speak, and I'll do that. So, that if you [ ISI have a comment and you wish to speak, that's fine. We'U [ isI keep track. We'lI make sure that everybody gets a [ I 71 chance.

1181 So that, Ibr the audience, is the way that we [? sI have worked in the past and we're contending to work this [ zo] time unless the Subcommittee so directs me to do [ 21j somclhing diffcrcnt.

WI My own take on this is that we've got this good ..^ .....__

For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Nin U Script@ ( 21) Page 73  Page 76 Page 75 [ iI expect some considerable and possible, some very heated [ z] discussion. I would not be surprised at that because [ aI there are very interesting points in here, but not [ 4] everybody is going to agree with everything. It's an ~ 51 amalgamation of work group products to get us to think,

~ 61 to get us to look at these things, to consider that [ 7] audience and figure out how we wish to say things. I [ 81 personally expect not agreement.

( 91 We need to separate the relevant from the [ IO] interesting.` l'here's all kinds of interesting things.

1111 The relevant things are the things focusing on our charge LIZ] and 1 would ask all of us around the table or writing and ~ 13) those of you in the audience to reflect upon the charge.

~ 141 ThN's what we have agreed to provide in terms of a [ isI rcsponse. There are other things we may wish to add and [ i6] lhat's perfectly okay. But we do need to make sure that 1171 we focus on the points that are relevant to the charge [ 18] and other issues that we feel, as a Subcommittee, are the [ I91 important aspects to put in there. And I expect some 1201 very explicit changes that will take place. It will be a [ zi] very surprise to me if we didn't have something like pn] that. I __ NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEX'T SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Cl41 We need clear points and logic. We need to have ( 151 an identification of six to 10 key points. I don't know ~ 161 what those are, but I doubt that this is a report that's ~ 171 going to be 1,000 points of light. We need somelhing ( 161 that's going to be able to make the key points that we ( 191 feel are important very clear to that particular [ zo] audience.

I211 What are those six or 10  and if you like more [ zz] or if you Iike less  I doubt that there's going to be [ i] less than six. That's just not the way it works. Let's [ z] make those very, very clear and let's make it very clear 131 also where there are differences of opinion because we're ~ 41 going to have differences of opinion and, hopefully,

[ 5] we'll have some areas where we, indeed, can have some [ 6] agreement.

PI A suggestion, and this can be modified as you [ 6] wish, but in order to keep a role on things  going 191 through here I found a number of editorial things that [ IO] might be changed. My suggestion is that we simply note [ I I ] those, make the changes that you would like to see, and [ iz] hand them in. We'Il talk in a minute  John will, Molly [ 13] will  about well, how is the next draft going to be put [ 14] together and, for one thing, all the editorial changes [ 15] will take place.

[ 161 If there are  another suggestion would be if Page 77 [ I] rough diamond, but we need to more focus  we need to [ z] have more focus on hard questions, how to measure 131 protection, how to determine progress, how to answer some 141 of the charge questions. We need clear conclusions,

[ 5] recommendations and statements. We need to be explicit [ 6] rather than implicit. If you mean to say something,

[ 7] let's figure out a way to make it very clear for that [ a] audience. I would Iike to see less pages, not more. We [ g] can always add things on, but we need to be as logical [ IO] and focused as we can. I certainly don't have any [ I!] problem of going to more, but if we can synthesize, let's [ VI try to do that and more and more let's be making sure [ 13] that we're focused on the charge.

Page 78 [ I] in. Maybe discuss them among ourselves. That would be [ 2] helpful.

[ 31 Any conclusions, recommendations and findings,

[ 4] we need to discuss those so that we have some agreement 151 about that, and clearly where there is disagreement or [ 6] where there is no consensus, we need to understand that,

[ 7] and I certainly would like to see some discussion about 161 that.

PI Note that in all the cases I'd really like to lo] see us put things in writing. It sure helps putting 111 things together in the next draft so that we have 121 something to work from, as well as trying to remember 131 thoughts or write down comments that we have.

141 But those are some suggestions. If you have 151 other ones, I'm sure we can accommodate how you wo~~ ld I'

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[ 16] like to go through here. John Ehrmann will have some [:

1: Page 79 171 suggestions in a minute.

161 For this discussion I would like to see LIS keep 191 a tight focus on the charge, a tight focus on ~ hc issues ? o] I would like us to begin to emphasize what Ihe key items ? I] are that need attention, the key six to 10 points. I ~ 21 would like to see us be succinct rather than expansive,

Page 80 [ I] except where expansion of comments and so forth are [ 2] necessary to make the logic clear.

131 I think we need to keep, at least, two questions [ 4] in mind from an organizational standpoint. Why arc we [ 5] saying this? What are we trying to get across by [ 6] whatever that paragraph or that sentence is, and what's [ 7] the point of the issue? You may hear me in Ihc next two [ a] days bring up those points periodically. I do not mean [ g] to be argumentative. I simply mean to get clarification lo] of what's the poinl. What are we trying to do here?

111 You may bring the same points up and that iz] certainly would be l me. But I think in terms of a 131 report  this report that wc have that's so important WC 141 need to make sure that what we're saying is really very 151 clear. If we don't know what the point of the issue is 161 and can't articulate it, I guarantee you the reader is i[ ' I ~ 171 you have ideas about a different way to organize or a [ 16] different order in which you wish to have things [ 19] presented for logic and so forth, that might be something (; lol again you can note and hand in, or we could quickly agree ( 21) to. If there are clarifications and definitions, again.

[~ ZJ make clear what those are. Put them on paper, hand them [ 17] not going to bc able to do that. And if we don't know [ re] why we're really saying it and how to make that point ; [ 19] clear, it's the same answer.

~ [ 20] Also, I would remind us that Chcrc is going lo [ ZI] be more opportunities to polish and linalizc Ihis. Wc [ 22] don't have to come to IO0 pcrccn t agrccmcnt or polish

Page 77  Page 80 ( 22) Min U Script@ For The Record, Inc. _ ( 301) 870 8025 NACEFT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 Page 81 11) today. Just like somebody who has a rough diamond, it [ 2] takes a bit of time to get that final diamond out.

PI So. we're going to have time in September.

[ 4] We're going to have time in the fall. Rut we got to keep [ 5] zeroing in in terms of getting this thing done. So, if [ 6] WC don't quite get everything done that you would like [: I tlonc in the next two days, well, there will be more time ( 61 and, as John and Molly and others will identify, input [ g] will bc welcome after the meeting so that we have the [ IO] best input that WC` have for the next draft.

[ I ` I The last point that I would like to make is just ( 12) to give some thoughts about what the linal report,

[ 13] itself, might br  how it might be organized and this is ( 141 to be discussed and fmalized, and this is just to put on [ I 51 the table.

IlGl One thing that has been effective in the past is [ I?] to have a very separate document that's an executive [ rel summary, and I'll show you an example of what I'm talking [ I91 about in a minuLc. Another document that's really the [ 2c] final report, which is of the type that wc have in front [ nil 01` us today and the type that RI+ put tog& her and other [ 22] things along those lines, and we have another documents,

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[ I] which is the appendices for other things that we wish to ~ 21 keep track of, but not everybody in the world is ever ( 31 going lo want to see.

i41 ` I'hc type of thing that has been effective in the [ 5! past has hcen things like this This is a report that [ 6] our  thcrc was another Chair out back in 1990 that some ( 71 ol' you may remcmbcr. The Reducing Risk Report. It was 181 this kind of a document that was the summary of that that [ 9] really got a lot of distribution. Ivdck of that were the [ rol thicker reports that people could get if they wanted to,

[ i 11 but this had the csscnce, and I'll pass this one around.

[ 123 it complimentary one is one that came out again [ 13] from a Science Advisory Board more recently. This ~ 141 happens to be one that I had in the file. Framework For ( 151 Assessing and Reporting on Ecological Condition and [ IG] I: xccuin'e Sumnlary followed by the document itself.

I171 We'll scc what that looks like, but I would ask [ ia) that ) ou begin to think about how this might be packaged [ 19] so that WC g: ct the key information across and be able to 1201 gel Chc tnatcrial out in a highly readable fashion to the ` 21, intcrcstctl audicncc thal I trictl to articulate a little p2j hll bctrcr. 111 So, in these opening comments let me just simply 121 close by saying we do need to focus on the chargeThe [ a] people around the table have access to that. Those of 141 you in the audience, on the table as you come in there is ( 51 a statement of the charge, so that that can be clear to 161 youAnd the purpose of this particular meeting is to ~ 71 have a number  a few presentations, and they are [ e] identified for you in the agenda, but to spend as much 191 time as we can in terms of going over the document that [ ID] we have known as the draft report and beginning to poIish [ II] that and be able to have something that we can continue [ iz] to work on and have a second good draft for you by the [ 13] September meeting, which is the first week in September.

( 141 The last item is while we've got three meetings [ ISI still scheduled, the third of those meetings in December,

[ 16] as I recall, John, needs to be finalized in terms of 1171 dates and schedule.

[ lel With that I'm open to any questions, comments [ 19l and so forth that you would like to have and then 1%

[ 20] turn it over to John to kind of continue the discussion ~ 1 of how we're going to get through the next two days.

I' 1 MS. HERRERA: Of course, it might be opened up [ zl for debate, but part of the charge, looking at the 13~ negatively impacted communities, the Executive Order ~ 41 12898 deals with minority people of color, poor,

151 disadvantaged communities. This is a huge Environmental [ s] Justice concern that encompasses a lot of minority [ 71 population, sovereignty tribes, Pacific islanders,

[ a] Alaskan people, and I would Iike to see in the charge IQ] that we arc addressing the Environmental Justice issues.

( 101 I would like to see it at the beginning of the [ i I] document and, of course, integrated throughout the 1121 document. Hut I believe that we have a responsibility to 1131 the people that have been severely and mostly negatively ~ 1141 impacted in the IJnited States.

1151 MR. LOEHR: Thank you. We'll try to weave that ~ 161 in. I don't want to go and change the charge that was [ i7] given to us, but wc can, indeed, interpret that in terms [ ie] ol. context.

[` Ql Other comments? Oh, I'm sorry, Doris. I didn't [ ZO] see yolr.

1211 MS. CELLAAIUS: I wonder what is the possibility / [ zz] of input that members of the Subcommittee that are not Page 84 or The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Script@ ( 23) Page 81  Rage 84 Page 85 [ l] present  how do they influence the document at this [ 2] point?

[ 31 MR. EHRMANN: We're going to, you know, leave 141 open the opportunity for written comments until the 27th [ s] of June, a week from Friday. So anybody  we've already [ 6] received comments from at least two members I know of who 171 aren't here who already have sent us their written [ a] comments.

PI And we intentionally want to leave that period [ IO] open, both to allow any of you to either revise and [ I I] extend your remarks, so to speak, or have time to get ~ 121 other comments that weren't made in the meeting down in ~ 131 writing. But we will also remind the non attending [ 14] members that that is an opportunity for them  and, 01 1151 course, they can call us and express their comments [ 16] anyway they want. But we're going to take written [ in comments until the 27th to provide time for them.

[ 181 MR. LOEHR: Molly.

1191 MS. HOUGHTON: Yeah. Just the comment deadline.

~ 201 How open for flexibility is that? I know personally

IW MR. EHRMANN: We can be bought.

WI MS. HOUGHTON: You can be bought? Just Page 86 Page 88 [ i] rewording or something, I think that's what your point is [ z] and that is one that I could have an understanding and [ 3] agreement with, that's very helpful because there's [ 4] nothing magic about these. It's simply the integration [ 5] of things and there may well be better ways Lo say it or ( 61 emphasize it or integrate it someplace else. And that's [ 7] what we're looking for.

[ 81 Other general comments? Let mc turn it back [ q over to the Mayor. He wasn't here a minute ago when I IO] thanked him on behalf of the Committee for allowing us Lo [' II] have a fine site visit that we had this morning. 13ut you 121 will also noLice on the agenda a placcholder to allow the 131 Mayor to lead us into the official part of the section 141 this afternoon, and for that purpose and any other 151 purpose he wishes, let me turn it back to Ule Mayor.

1.3 MAYOR KALISZ: 7` hdnk you very much, Doctor, and 17 thank you for your patience. I know I was a few minutes 181 kite.

IU 191 I certainly am very, very pleased wiLh the hcl F ! o] that we were able Lo bring this meeting to New Redford aL ! I] this point in time, especially with regards to Lhc ! 2] deliberations as they effect the final preparation of 111~ [ I] personally it's a real hardship for me.

PI MR. EHRMANN: I mean, if you have a special [ 3] circumstance, let us know. It's not like where a Federal [ 4] registered notice said 27th, but we would like to get [ 5] them in so that we can start the next round. But if you ( 61 have a special  you know, you're on vacation this week,

[ n you're on a trip, you got a big deadline on something [ a] else and you need a few more days, you know, just let us [ 9] know so we know that they're coming.

I' 01 But we wouldn't want to extend it more than a [ ii] few days. You know, we don't want to go to two more [ 12] weeks or something like that.

[ I31 MR. LOEHR: Sue.

[ I41 MS. BRIGGLJM: Yeah. In terms of those wriLLcn [ is] comments, I assume that you might fmd it most helpful 1161 if, as we listen and think of things, we can provide ~ 171 more, rather than less, in our comments LO you by the [ re] 27th if we're going to be able to meet that deadline.

1191 So, we're really thinking about the fact that it's most ( PO] helpful to you to get them in writing so that you can ~ 211 have all the input.

P4 MR. EHRMANN: Yeah. 1X refer Lo this in a ~~~. ~~ NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17, 2003 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 87 [ i] minute, but I have Lo say that for the folks who have [ 2] sent us their comments so far  I think we have four or [ 3] five sets  they've been really good. I mean, they're [ 4] very clear. I can't live with this. 1 can live with [ 5] that. Here's some other language. If this was changed 1 [ S] might be able to live with it. That's the kind of

171 here's some alternative wording. You know, that's the [ a] kind of thing that's helpful to us. Not just, you know,

[ q no or ugh or  you know, who wrote this.

I[ 101 But, you know, trying to make those alternative I[ 1 I] suggestions or  if you can't  I'm not saying you have 121 to do that for everything you have a problem with. But 131 the more we can get that language or more just what 141 bothers you about something even if you're noL prepared is] to present an alternative, that helps us undersLand Lhe 161 concern so we can work with folks to try to address it.

171 so, that's very helpful.

181 MR. LOEHR: And especially, just Lo emphasize / I 191 whaL John said, are rewording sometimes can be very ao] helpfuLTo say, you know, I can't  I don't really ? I] understand whal that says, or if I do I can't agree with z] it. But if it had this particular flavor emphasis,

.

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PI As ~ OLI'VC seen already by the fact of the visit 131 this morning, this is not only the home of one of the ~ 41 most complex Superfund projects in the United States,

[ s] but, as it has been pointed out by a number of the [ q Federal partners, it is one of the Brownfield showcase [ 71 communities.

PI As we begin our deliberations on the draft of [ q the linal report, I would like to highlight a few points [ io] based on our Superfund experiences here in New Bedford [ i I] that I hope will add some context to our deliberations [ iz] that now you're very much familiar with by actually [ 131 having been there and visited.

[ I41 When I became Mayor six years ago I sought to [ 15] change the way that WC looked at the strategic planning ~ 161 for the development process here in the city of New [ 171 13ccllbrd. I felt that it was important that we integrate [ ia] and coordinate our planning efforts with the efforts of [ Is] the private sector and other government agencies to [ ro] maximize the benefits of the expenditure public funds,

~ 211 and I've pointed that out during the tunchtime briefing ~ 2) down at the Forfeiture Building.

Page 90 III I've also believed thdl it's imporlant that WC 12) comprehensively address the needs of an area then move on ~ 31 so that the private sector investment could occur without 141 the fear that WC would go back the following year and dig q up the street and do something that should have been done 16: in the prrvious experience.

I71 Finally, I believe that the government has the [ a] responsibility to Facilitate resolution of conflict 191 issues that would not otherwise bc resolved. Sometimes [ IDI this means getting involved in projects that may seem [ r 11 clauntlng, but if we don't get involved the question,

ji2] obVlouSly, is Who will.

1131 And so WC began in our city of New Bedford the [ it; dcvelopmenl of some stralegics for success in dealing [> j) with the Supcrl'und contaminated properties, which led us jisl into the discussion of Brownfields. Before I discuss ;: I) those strategies, I would like to touch upon what WC mean [ la) by s~~ cccss hcrc in New Bcdlhrd because that's a very [ irj! meaningful definition.

w As I've stated before. lhc real measure 01 [ sil suc~` csh of` a Snpcrfund project is not only dctermincd by ,221 ~ hc I: nvironmcntal cngincer, but by the property owner Page 9 [ I] across the street and the members of community in ( 21 general.

131 Does the property now contribute to the social 141 and economic development of the community is obviously [ 5] one of the questions that we ask. Does the property now Is] contribute to the tax rules of the city? And by the way ~ 71 that expenditures are so warranted in these days is a ( 81 very important question that municipalities have to ask.

191 Does the property now further our strategicals?

101 Yes, as a city we began thinking strategically when we 111 came into office. And does the property advance in our 121 efforts of environmental stewardship? Once again, if we 131 don't than who will.

141 These are just as important measuring successes ts] as the completed cleanup plan. The fust step in our 161 strategy for success is an attempt to develop a good 171 working relationship in which the regulatory agencies,

181 the city and the private sector all understand each ,[ 19] others goals and challenges. And ifit wasn't clear that [ zo] there is a real love fest going on here in New Bedford at 1211 lunch, let me tell you you're going to hear about it [ zz] again very, very briefly because that's what I really 1 .~ ~. ~~ ~~  . ... ~. ..

' [ I] credit much of our success to. Page 92 I4 The evolution of the preferred Superfund 131 disposal method from incineration to confmed disposal [ 41 facilities, the dcwatering and removal, is the best 151 testament to this part of development of strategy,

161 The second step of our strategy is to ~ 71 incorporate the Superfund planning and development into ~ 81 our strategic project planning and development. This is [ q even more difficult than it sounds. Not only must we [ IO] coordinate all of the elements of our strategic project,

[ II] but in addition we must work to keep the projects on [ IZ] track with the Superfund schedule so that neither ~ 131 adversely interferes with the other.

'[ I41 A good example of this process we evolved ~ 151 through mediate and revitalize a 25 acre former railroad [ 16] yard, which is now our terminal area into an intra model 1171 transportation l` acility for freight and passengers that $ 181 will be ~ rscd by IX4 vendors to transport dewatered PCBs 1191 from the harbor to an appropriate landtW. Again, this 11~ 01 requires quite a bit of a coordinated effort and i [ ZI] facilitation since most of the Superfund project managers [ zz] are not accustomed to coordinating with municipal For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 Min U Scripfz@ ( 25) Page 89  Page 92 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 NACEFT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Page 93 [ I] schedules.

PI Fortunately, in New Bedford, our Superfund [ 3] project managers, Jim Brown and Dave Dickerson, have been [ 4] great to work with us and we thank them for their [ s] efforts. Dave is not here right now and on my way back [ 6j from a family issue I saw him pumping gas at a local gas ( 71 station. I got to tell you, the window went down and I'm ( 81 yelling as I'm driving down the street, Dave, thank you 191 for this morning. It went perfectly. You know, we got [ lo] that type of easy name recognition, the one on one [ 1< 1 understanding of what their job is, but more importantly [ jz] they now understand what the municipal site of that is ~ 131 about.

u41 The third step is advocating with EPA decision ~ 151 makers to include the city's municipal goals when they're [ IS] evaluating alternatives for their actions. This is [ i7] really counter intuitive as usually it requires some ( 181 creative thinking, but the results, as you can see in the ~ 191 city of New Bedford, are obviously worth it.

PO1 In constructing the dewatering facility from the 1211 Superfund project site, we were able to work with the EPA ~ 221 to relocate two combined sewer overflows in a manner that Page 94 [ I] was cost mutual, but in practice assisted the city in [ 2] developing an adjacent railroad yard and a more closely ~ 31 conforming with the Clean Water Act.

[ 41 The interrelation of projects, steps two and [ s] three encourage  requires that the municipal officials [ G] be ready to advocate with Congress on the Superfund 171 project and we do and we have and it has been part of the ( s] success. This is something that we should do in any [ g] case. The more involved in the Superfund project that we [ IO] can become, the better the project becomes, obviously,

[ I I ] for our community.

[ 121 You know, I sometimes wonder as we discuss about 1131 the funding of the Superfund, if we're not looking at the [ 14] root of the problem. We should recognize that Superfund [ 15] is underfunded and advocate for additional funding as the [ 16] measure to protect the public health. OP course, we ~ 171 should ensure that the funds are spent efficiently and ~ 18) most cost effectively. But Superfund is a cleanup ~ 191 program intended to clean sites that could not otherwise [ zo] be cleaned.

P'l And as I've spoken with so many of you in our [ 22] previous meetings, there's also a lesson to bc learned in _ ~__ ['

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[ 1 [ 1 l Page 95 i] New Bedford with regards to that expenditure relative to 21 the amount of monies that have been spent, in regards to 31 the planning process, the community be upset, and then $ 1 the joint effort. It has led to tremendous amounts 01 , s] money being spent that unfortunately the process costs to , s] have happened.

` 71 The fourth step entails advocating with EPA for 81 protective use strategy for former Superfund sites. 1 lere .9] in New Bedford we have an example of a situation where 01 the city did not become actively enough involved in the 11 reuse planning and resulted in a 12 acre site that is no1 21 reusable for development, although it is adjacent to an 31 exit ramp to a State highway.

41 We've also had the example of the harbor s] dewatering facility, which has been designed to perform 61 its Superfund function and then once the project is 71 completed can serve a marine industrial USC in our a] harbor. And you all llave heard Dave Dickerson and Jim g] Brown make spccilic reference to the fact that we` re lo] planning for the firture, not just taking care of the past ! il activities.

! 2] Once again, it is only that the municipality is Page 96 [ i] strong  a strong advocate of the Supcrfund projccl.

[ z] Sites like this can obviously have a future like this.

[ 31 Finally, we must recognize the connection [ 4] between Superfund sites and 13rowntields. In many [ 5] instances, the connection is as obvious as mcrc [ 6] proximity. Our harbor is a good example of 11~ s.

[ 7] Eighteen thousand acres, more than 28 square miles ol [ a] marine environment are conlaminated by Superfund and [ g] Brownfield levels. The SuperPond cleanup will bc the o] impedance for us to clean up the acres and acres 01 I] Brownfields under the water as well, approximately 75 z] acres of Brownfields on the land abutting the harbor as 831 well.

141 AU too often thcrc is a tendency to allow the 51 programmatic differences in Superfund and Brownfield 6) programs to get in the way of true coordination that will ` 71 promote more effective and efticient USC of public funds 81 I hope that these brief comments provide the 91 context as we proceed through the discussions over the ! a] next two daysAs I said, as the Mayor of this communilp ! I] and as a participant on this l~ ancl with each and cvcr)

! 2] one of you, I'm very plcased Lhdt 1 can sllow you not Ollly Page 93 _ Page 96 ( 261 iWin U S cript@ For The Record, Inc.  ( 301) 870 8025 NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS NEW BEDFORD, M June 17, 200 Page 97 [ rl one of the causes we're investigating, but some of the ~ 21 progressive movements we've been able to work together 131 with the Federal Agencies, with the community, and as a [.+ I strong city to overcome and to put into place for the ( 51 future reuse of this land that has been so contaminated.

161 MR. LOEHR: Thank you very much, Mayor.

17) Comments? Many of you who are on the table were on the [ 8] site visit. You have been lo these places. You can [ q relate io his comments and the situalion. Any thoughts [ lo] that you would like to share at this time? Mike.

I111 MR. TILCHIN: Just administrdlive. Mayor, wiU [~ ZI you make a paper copy of your presentation? Thank you.

[ I31 MR. LOEHR: Well, let me again, since you ~ 141 weren't here, but it's my pleasure to do it again, to [ is] thank you  MR. L:. IIRMANN: Vicky's edging. She : 16] wants to gel something out.

[ I71 MS. PETERS: I have a question.

Cl81 MR. LOEHR: Oh. Go ahcad, Vicky.

I191 MS. PETERS: I just don't know if you're the [ 20] pc'"" n to ;* nswcr it.

( 2' 1 MAYOR KALISZ: We'll try.

PI MS. PETERS: In the NIV. work group and a lot of [ iI the related efforts, we're struggling with the question ~ 21 of lisling these mega sites and how to list them and [ 3] aggregated sites and identifying hot spots and all that 14) kind of stuff. And I was pretty confused during the site : s] tour lo ligurc out exactly what is the New Ilcdford site?

PI I didn't hear any discussion about  I can't [ 71 renicmber now the name of it, but isn't there an entire [ a] river  another river that didn't get funded last year 191 and whether that's part of the New Bedford site?

[` O! MAYOR KALISZ: No. That's the Atlas Attack [ it] IVoject. That an industrial site about four miles due [ iz] southcast of us at this point. That was the project that [ i3] did no1 get funded That was an industrial waste site.

: I41 MS. PETERS: Okay. But we also heard that Aero [ IS] Jet. the building itself, is not on the site. We heard [ i61 thal Ihrrc was  at the water lrcatment facility is 1171 lrcatmg copper, but the copper manufgcturer, you know,

[~ a] wasn'l a part of this sctllemcnt. So, I'm kind of [ IQ] confused ! W AI some point do yowl know if EPA drew a tine pii around the silt or was lhc site considered the I'<% from [ 271 Acre Jcl or  you know Page 9'

1' 1 MAYOR KALISZ: Aerovox.

I. 4 MS. PETERS: Aerovox.

L31 MAYOR KALISZ: As it was point out by Matt, my [ 4] City Solicitor, who has a little bit better of an 1s) institutional legal memory on  Matt, come on down if [ s] you want to answer. The issue came  at that point it [ 71 appeared to bc the deep pockets theory. You know, who 181 was going to be able to pay for it. And I beIieve it was 191 Grant that raised the question between ROD 1 and ROD 2.

[ I o] What was the differentiation? And I believe, Matt, you [ I I] alluded to the fact that it was that deep pocket concept. \

( 121 MR. THOMAS: Yes. Rased on the information I've [ 13] gotten because I was not part of this either, there were [ 141 some decisions that were made at the time  this ail lls] started 20 years ago and to some degree  I had this [ is] conversation with somebody earlier today.

1171 We're looking back at this 20/ 20 hindsight.&

[ is] the time the Consent Decree was written, at the time ail [ t 91 of these deals were made and settlements were reached,

[ 20] this was probably the largest recapture of funds that had [ 21] happened to that point in time and probably the most ( 221 aggressive.

Page 98 Page 100 [ II part of the problem came from  as I understand p] it from whenever they were doing the negotiations  a ~ 31 lot of the PCHs that were discharged were done so legally ~ 41 when they were done pursuant to normal permits back in is] the 7Os. The potential responsible parties used that to [ s] their benefit during the negotiations.

[ 71 And so certain decisions, some legaI/ some [ aI political, were made at that time as to where to include 191 the site  for exampIe, Aerovox at that time was 1101 employing 500 people/ 600 people. If that had been [ I 11 included as part of the Superfund site those jobs were [~ ZJ have been immediately lost. And so apparently there was ( 131 a decision made at that time to keep the jobs, keep the p41 place running and not include it in the Supcrfund site.

Ii51 IkIck then also you did not have to include the [ is] source of the contamination in the site Iisting. That's pr] changed since thcn. There were other determinations that [ IS] were made as to who they went after and who they didn't 1 [ IQ] go after. As WAS mentioned, the reopeners with AVX,

I[ zo] which was one of the potential responsible parties, they [ zt] had the deepest pockets of all of the parties at the [ zq time. I  I _

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( 27) Page 97  Page 100 NEW BEDFORD, MA June 17,2003 111 So, if you look at what the site is, the site [ z] basically starts  and probably Dave or Jim could ~ 31 explain this better than I could  starts at the head of [ 4] the river and goes further out into the harbor then what 151 we actually saw today, out to Myshawn ( phonetic) Point 161 and down and over to Wilbur's Point in Fairhaven, and [ TI from there back into the 18,000 acres.

IsI So, it was difficult decisions that had to be [ sl made at that time that, to some degree, have colored the [ IO] decision making from that point on.

1111 FEMALE VOICE: So, basically it's driven by the LIZ] contaminated sediment as opposed to chlorosis or PRPs or [ lq anything like that?

[ I41 MR. THOMAS: At that time, yeah. And I think 11s) with regard to the copper, Revere, while they've been in [ is] the harbor since the project has started and they've 1171 started to clean up to these levels, while Superfund gets [ 181 a waiver on the procedural requirements of the various [ igl laws, they have to meet substantive standards that are [ zol set by all these different lawsAnd so once they were [ zl] in the area they had to start addressing other types of [ zz] contamination as they were doing the types of the NACEPT SUPERFUND SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS

Page 101 Page 103 111 half after that, the company went bankrupt. But it was a [ z] matter of quick response.

PI Your question is one that constantly is on our 141 minds. What is next to fall because long after the [ 5] settlements were in place we get the white glove test ( 61 under major contributing factor into the issue and then [; 7 the economic displacement continued. So, it's been a [ a] concern but there's nothing that surfaced in the past 191 five years.

101 MR. LOEHR: Other questions for the Mayor. for I I] the New Bedford site or for other things that are Il. 121 relevant that the Mayor can address at this time? Sue.

I' 131 MS. BRIGGUM: Yeah. I wondered if you ever

I' 141 since you're in Massachusetts and you have 151 representatives  not without influence  if you ever 161 have sought separate appropriations to contribute to the 171 project because, you know, we've heard about in some [ ia] cases, and I'm aware of other situations, where you have `[ igl this kind of very large widespread site legacy, dccadcs [ zol of industrial development: lots of parties, concerns [ zi] about jobs who they managed to Tmd under Federal  [ zz] appropriations, the extra money in order to address Page 102 ~ 11 projects that they were. So, I think that's why the [ z] copper is being addressed as well.

PI MAYOR KALISZ: Just to wrap up the comments. In ( 41 1997, November, two days after I had been elected to [ 5] office, I was sitting in my campaign office and I was [ 6] visited by several representatives of the business [ TI community, including AVX, Aerovox and their business [ al peopleAnd it was ironic at that point in 1997 they had [ g] just received an order that the plant had to be shut down [ IO] because of what was basically a white glove test.` l'he [ I 11 PCB contamination on the workplaces, in the lunchrooms [ IZ] and all of those areas were now causing the concern that [ 13] since we were well into this, the marches have taken [ 14] place, a ROD had been broken, all this. Now, EPA had 1151 stepped in at that point and was ordering the plant shut,

( 161 which meant 600 people immediately being terminated.

[ I71 We worked very quickly in the fflst months of [ is] January and February to facilitate a fast track 1191 relocation and building with a lot of assistance from the 1201 community to build a new plant in the industrial park ~ 211 that was put up within seven or eight months, transferred \ zl the 600 people, and unfortunately, within a year and a 111 something that's clearly larger than Superhmd, you know.

[ z] It sounds as if just by picking a few deep pockets you're [ s] not really going to solve the problem. That's one of the [ 4] complications you found, and I wondered if ~ OLI had an)

[ 5] success in that regard?

161 MAYOR KALISZ: Yeah. We're very fortunate.` l% c ~ 1 Federal makeup of this community is obviously Kerry and ( 81 Kennedy at the Senate and Barney Frank at the Congress 191 level. Barney has worked to champion the cause on a [ lo] number of different fronts, but even in meeting with them [ I 11 they recognize the magnitude of the numbers that would 1121 have to be brought lo bear as you saw in the slide this ~ 131 morning  $ 80 Million a year for four years.

[ I41 Even in the best political environments those [ is] were big, big numbers when you look at so many dd'fcrent ( 161 projccts. They are very conscious of them.` l'hey have 1171 not been in a position to feel comfortable that they ( 161 could win them over alone at any one given time given the ; I91 series of national events, and that's how it has best 1201 placed.

: 2' 1 They have been strong advocates for us at IiPA 00 : 22] a number of the projects and in making tbc changes that Page 104 I'

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