And also on the fourth floor below, although I don't know the sequencing of where they're at with ending their panel, so just FYI. So if I can have our spotlight talk speakers gather near the front of the stage. Mariba, you're the second up, I believe. No, you're on time. That's excellent. That's what we want. So as people make their way into the room or into the other room, our first spotlight talk will be from Dr. Connie Walker, who is an astronomer at NSF's Nord lab. So Connie is going to talk to us about some of the interactions between the large constellations and our ability to continue to conduct astronomical observations and quiet and dark skies. And so I'm going to wait maybe a minute or two and let folks settle before we play the video. The coffee break is a bit later, however. Folks, if we could please take our seats, we'll have a coffee break after this next session concludes. All right, well, we're going to go ahead and play the video. So our first spotlight talk will be from Dr. Connie Walker again, the NSF NOIR lab, looking at dark and quiet skies and the relationship of large constellations to the astronomy science sector. So if we could cue the video from Dr. Walker, please. Welcome to the spotlight talk on optical astronomy and very large satellite constellations. My name is Connie Walker. I am a scientist at the U.S. National Science Foundation's National Optical Observatory known as NOIR lab and also the co-director of the International Astronomical Union or IAU Center for the Protection of Dark and Quiet Sky from Satellite Constellation Interference or IAU-CPS for short. Three years ago, a train of 60 starling satellites visible to the unaided eye from many countries ignited global discussions of satellite constellations and their many impacts on professional astronomy, dark skies, space debris, cultural sky traditions, and escalating environmental concerns. I will be discussing how satellite constellations impact optical astronomy and they do so in two main ways through their numbers and their brightness. In terms of brightness, commercial communications satellites in low Earth orbit or LEO that weigh more than 100 kilograms typically exceed that brightness target of seventh magnitude. They are seen as orange dots in this plot. Seventh magnitude is the limit at which residual effects like crosstalk in images are difficult to remove and it is also the limit of human vision. So the horizontal blue line refers to seventh magnitude. The vertical blue line refers to 100 kilograms and you'll note that Starlink and one web satellites as of a year ago when this plot was made fell in the lower right hand quadrant which indeed corresponds to being brighter than seventh magnitude and more massive than 100 kilograms. In terms of numbers, the top curve shows the total number almost 26,000 to date of tracked objects in space from the first satellite in 1957 to March 1st of this year. This includes both active and inactive satellites that are more than 10 centimeters in size. Since the launch of the first 60 Starlink satellites, the number of LEO satellites has jumped from about 2,000 to three times as many in as many years with more plan by numerous space actors. The term analyst objects are an additional 20,000 objects tracked by the US Space Surveillance Network but their origins cannot be identified. Note that almost half of the satellites are Starlink and one web satellites. If all the proposed satellites are licensed and launched, this will potentially result in tens of thousands to 100,000 satellites in LEO if not more by 2030. Here's an update on Starlink satellites. SpaceX has the largest constellation currently in orbit 2383 that are active and there has been a change in satellite design. Launches since September 2021 no longer have visors. They were removed for laser communications between the satellites. The new Starlink's generation 1.5 are 6th magnitude in brightness, about half a magnitude brighter than the visor sets were. And they were about 6.5 magnitudes on average. And just to note, the higher the number, the fainter the satellites. Starlink generation 2 satellites, which will be about 30,000 in addition to the 12,000 from generation 1 are more massive about 1.25 tons compared with 250 kilograms. And this is about four to five times more massive as generation 1. So generation 2 satellites will be about 7 meters long. And Starship, which will launch these satellites will launch up to about 120 Gen 2 Starlinks at a time. This is twice as many per launch. And at this point we cannot predict how bright they will be. As a reminder, satellites are visible when they are in sunlight or in penumbra and not in the cone of earth shadow. And that depends on a number of things like orbital inclination of the satellite, altitude of satellite and the time of year as to when they're visible. The brightness of the satellite involves a multitude of considerations. Altitude, attitude, albedo, size, surface characteristics, specular diffusion reflection, self-shadowing and solar phase angle. Taking all of this into consideration, Pat Seitzer has modeled the visibility of these satellites. And he's from the University of Michigan. Shown here is a sample of 10,000 satellites at 500 kilometers, as well as 10,000 at 10,000 kilometers altitude. And they're at an inclination or latitude of 53 degrees. And we're considering right now in the plot only the ones above 30 degrees elevation. And for that many, you can see that there's just only a few above 30 degrees elevation. However, the numbers increase linearly. That is, if you have 10 times more satellites, you're going to have 10 times more that are visible. And in this model, if you just consider the ones, if you consider all of them above the horizon or zero degrees elevation, you're talking about three times as many. The higher the altitude of the satellites, remember, the more visible all night long they will be, as you can see with the blue curve here. How do satellites affect observations on telescopes? A bright satellite streak can saturate a detector and or cause loss of information in pixels, crosstalk in electronics, ghost images and possible residual images. The impact on the science done with optical astronomy has two major areas of concern. One is with low elevation or twilight studies, like with the potentially hazardous asteroid missions, and they will have fewer discoveries and fewer orbit determinations should they be affected by satellite constellations. The second area is the science done at observatories with wide fields of view and sensitive detectors. These will also be very, very affected. For example, Ruben Observatory will be making a 10 year movie, mapping the sky every three nights and hopefully discovering I'm sure they'll discover lots of transient discoveries, transient events. However, with more and more satellite constellations, the majority of Ruben Observatory images will contain one or more satellites each. So to address the impact of satellite constellations on astronomy, soon after the first 60 starlight satellites were launched in May 2019, astronomers organized two workshops in 2020 to identify the issues and formulate recommendations for mitigation. The workshop reports for satellite satcon one, excuse me, and dark and quiet skies one can be found online. And then in 2021 we had the sequels to both of those workshops, in which we identified pathways to implement the recommendations and those reports to our online. Now, in 2022, we are taking those pathways to implement the recommendations by forming the IAU Center on the protection of the dark and quiet sky from satellite constellation deference or IUCPS. And this just started two months ago. The mitigation recommendations that came out of the first workshop are being worked on by groups who are members of the center or CPS. For instance, we have submitted a proposal to the US National Science Foundation to fund software to develop and predict passes over observatories to avoid satellite constellations and also to program around their passes. So the University of Washington, for instance, has a data repository that is opening to store images of satellite streaks. With the assistance of the American Astronomical Society, we have continued discussions with the big satellite companies on many of the other items on this list, and also with other think tanks and the future looks bright. We are also talking with some national governments directly and as well as through the UN COPUS Committee for the Peaceful Use of Outer Space Meeting and its subcommittee meetings of the science and technology, and also the legal subcommittee. The IAU Center is going to coordinate efforts from many of its members throughout the world and endeavor to unify voices of the global astronomical community. The center will bring together astronomers, industry and policy experts, as well as the wider community and acts a bridge between all these stakeholders. The center will produce and disseminate information and resources for everyone to be able to use. And the center will continue to research on the satellite constellation issues to arrive at feasible and implementable solutions in the areas of the four hubs, which include SAT hub and that's a hub for observations. It's also a data repository of observations and will have software that I mentioned earlier to predict passes to mask the trails and more. The policy hub will also address national and international policies and frameworks for regulations. The industry and technology hub will work towards mitigation techniques and best practices. And the communications and engagement hub community engagement hub, excuse me, will be a voice for various communities that otherwise would not have a voice. Please feel free to use these emails to contact either Piero, who's the director, Federico, who's the other co-director, or myself. And we very much would appreciate hearing from you. And if you'd like to become a member, again, that's cps.iu.org where you can find the membership form. Thank you so much. Thank you, Dr. Walker, and we appreciate you recording that for us in advance. It's unable to join in person. Next, I would like to welcome Mariba Jha, who is the chief scientist and co-founder of Privateer, a data and intelligence platform to empower the future of space sustainability. I think moreover, I think you're going to talk to us a little bit about the role of data and knowing what we know about space objects to enable an in-space economy, correct? That was terrible. I apologize for that. You'll do a far better job than me. Let me get off the stage. Hello, hello. All right. Thank you all very much. I'm so pleased to be here. The first thing I'm going to ask people is the folks that are having conversations in the background. If you want to chat, you can leave the room now. Otherwise, I'm going to ask you to actually sit down and either listen to me or leave. I'm serious. You can have your conversations, but you can have them elsewhere, because the thing is I have some stuff to say, and if you don't want to hear it, that's fine. You can find yourself someplace else. Bring up my website, please. Now would be a great time. So with all technology, as we know, all technology works, this is actually supposed to be showing you something, but clearly it's a blank screen. So I've clearly kicked it off with nothingness for you, which I'm very pleased with. We'll see if eventually something happens here. So I only have like 8 to 10 minutes. Here's what I want to tell you folks, right? For one, clearly we understand that space is a very dynamic environment. We're launching one more things into space. In 1957, we started with one satellite called Sputnik. What could go wrong with the whole picture of launching things in space? Well, now we're tracking about 50,000 things ranging in size from your cell phone all the way to the space station. It's a finite resource. We don't put things randomly in outer space. We put things in very specific places. I'm going to call them orbital highways. These orbital highways are becoming more and more congested. The people that are launching stuff into space are doing so without coordinating and planning with other countries and other people in terms of launching these things. Anybody? Show of hands if you've heard of something called Tragedy of the Commons. So here's the thing. For those that have not heard of such a thing, when you have a finite resource, let's call it plot of land, let's say that we have a nice place for cattle to graze and each of us has some cattle. We bring more and more cattle to the land and we don't talk to each other and don't manage that jointly.  The carrying capacity of that land is saturated. So very similarly to that, when we have these orbital highways, we have this carrying capacity that can become saturated. What does saturation mean in orbital highways? What it means is that our ability to prevent undesirable things from happening, things bumping into each other and that sort of stuff, we can't prevent that anymore. As much as we try to decide and act for people to be safe in space, bad things are happening.  So the thing that we need to understand is that near-earth space is a finite resource. The carrying capacity can become saturated in these orbits. We have to find a way to communicate with each other and jointly manage and utilize the resource. Interestingly enough, Connie talked about the impacts of astronomy and trying to understand and predict light pollution to astronomers. One of the things that I'll say is that the space sustainability rating that we talked about earlier in the whole detection, identification, and tracking incorporates a lot of the data and the understanding of how to predict these things. Part of the SSR will address ground-based astronomy. It's not just for space operations and that sort of thing. Good things are happening when it comes to the SSR. When it comes to data, how many people believe data and information is the same stuff? That was the trick question. Of course, everybody's not raising their hands because they're embarrassed. I don't want to be the dummy. So here's the thing, right? So data exists everywhere. Information only exists when you ask a question to data. That's the way it works. Now, what's the data problem when it comes to space? Everybody has different eyes and ears about what's happening in space. And one of the things that I tell my students is if you want to know something, you have to measure it. If you want to understand something, you have to predict it. Prediction is the key. Anybody can tell you what happened in the past. That's easy. Tell me what's going to happen tomorrow, then I'll be impressed. And so the thing is, in general, and I'm going to get a bit philosophical here. I don't care. Just bear with me because you gave me eight to ten minutes, so I'm going to use it the way I want to use it. So here it goes. So there's all this stuff happening in space. How do we know? We have to measure this stuff. Okay? Things are happening. We measure it. The observations generate data. The data tend to have structure and follow distributions. There's a pattern. There's an emergent pattern in the data. From that emergent pattern in the data, we can infer a model. We can hypothesize something. We can say, this is what we believe explains the evidence. That belief helps us predict what's going to happen. The difference between what we observe next and our predictions constitutes a surprise. If we can predict the truth exactly, there's no surprise. We live in a boring universe. We're yawning our way through life. I'm not in that position. If anybody here is, let me talk to you because I want to make some money. So the thing is, surprise is an ability to learn. It tells you there's something that you have not understood. Okay? Very good. Now, once you can learn something, you can start refining your ability to predict. And this is where we need to get to, because in order for space to be safer, more secure, more sustainable, we need to be able to make it more transparent, meaning, what's up there? Who does it belong to? What is it doing? We need to make it more predictable. What's going to happen in the future? And given any two space actors, Chinese satellite, US satellite, here's some conjunction, what are they going to do? So it's more than just physics. It's anthropological. It's social scientific. And then we need to develop a body of evidence to hold people accountable for their behaviors in space. So this whole cycle of some stuff is happening, observations, hypothesis, prediction, surprise, that's the process that we're into. And one of the things that we're trying to do with privateer is we're trying to say, look, people have different beliefs and opinions about stuff in space. But if you can look at the news, you can see somebody says, oh, there's going to be a collision tomorrow. The other person says, well, based on my evidence, not so much. When we have different pockets of evidence, we're going to come up with different conclusions. They can't possibly be the same. This does not work for space. If the US has some belief, China has some belief, Russia has another belief, and we're all behaving based on our own evidence, but we don't share the evidence to have a common pool of evidence from which to infer, this can't work out well. One of the things that we're trying to do at privateer is we're trying to work with a global community and say, here's a platform where we're trying to crowdsource and bring in multiple sources of information and statistically understand the nuances of this so that we can have a common pool of evidence from which to draw conclusions so that we can make informed decisions of what to do in space. Space is not really different from the land, air, and the oceans. The way we've been behaving, the way we explore land, air, and oceans has been to the detriment of the environment. We have marine debris, we have ocean plastics, all these sorts of things. We're seeing stuff like that in space. And part of it is because people don't understand that all things are interconnected and that stewardship is what we need to embrace to solve the problem. So with that, I'm going to get off the stage. I'm going to say thank you very much for listening to me and let's bring up the next person. Thank you, Murray, but I appreciate the wider perspective. The information we can take from our data, if I've got that right, I hope, but there's the behavioral and the contextual aspects to that or something we always need to think about. We're going to stay on the theme of space situational awareness and strategies thereof. I want to introduce Dr. Marie LePelke. Does that get that right? All right, good. From the Australian Space Agency, who's going to tell us here are the space situational awareness lead, I believe, and space sustainability lead for the Australian Space Agency. And you're going to talk about some of your agency's viewpoints on these topics. Thank you. Hi, everyone. So yes, I'm going to try and talk about Australia space sustainability, but I'm just wondering if everyone knows what Australia is actually doing in space. So maybe I will start there, a bit of background. The Australian Space Agency is quite young, but in terms of Australia's story with space, it goes back to the 50s. It's about the rockets, tracking stations, helping with Apollo program. So we have been active in space and it's just not, it's not just about size or number of satellites. We have a bit less than 30 satellites there at the moment. It's really about this old journey that we're on. So if I go back to the agency, so the agency was established in 2018. At that time, it's interesting to look at the strategy that we put together and the charter that we also established at the same time. If you look at the strategy, responsible is one of four pillars of the strategy. It's also in our vision and it's also the first value of our charter. So really we need to deliver on safe and sustainable space activities. The question is how? I'm going to try and show you three examples of what we do in the space sustainability aspect. We are working on a space sustainability framework. The goal of this framework is to do sustainability as part of everything we do, not as something we would try to do on the side when we have time, but to embed it in everything so that it is less effort, less money as well. Because we're a young country in space and we can't afford to just do a massive sustainability plan, but we want to do sustainability everywhere. So the roadmap is the first example. We have roadmaps for several space priority areas. We develop these roadmaps as setting the scene and providing a vision of what could be the industry growth for the next 10 years. It's basically giving opportunities for technology development, for investment, trying to help the industry. You can see on the screen that there are three roadmaps that are out and the one that is blurred is actually the roadmap. I'm leading space situational awareness and debris mitigation. It will be published soon. I will try and talk to you about what we do in that space as an example of how we use and we look at sustainability there. So as I said, sustainability is embedded in everything we do. In the roadmap, it's considered as a key enabler, a key facilitator of what we do in each priority area. And for SSA, I think you understood it now after these two days. We know that we need to do something about space debris because it's about what we could do in space in the future if we don't do something about space debris now. There is no future of space activities. So yes, we have to do something. But the way we looked at it in the roadmap is also saying, well, sustainability now is looked at and we need to do something. So there might be an opportunity, a market opportunity for us in that space. And we look at two buckets. The first one is we need to stop creating more debris. So we need responsible missions, responsible systems. And we can actually create technologies that will support that to be better at tracking, maneuver even the end of life of missions. So everything that Australian industry can do in that space, it's a market opportunity for them. So we're trying to look at these advantages and try to make it an opportunity. The other bucket is, well, we know that there are space debris. We need SSA, we need STM. So what are the technologies that we have in Australia to share with the world and have, again, a market opportunity there? So obviously we have advantages. They are technical, but also, well, you all know that Australia has a quite unique view of the sky and, yeah, it's down under. So we look at all that and that's part of the sustainability aspect. It's what we do for every SBA, so priority area. We also provide funding for SSA. I will give you three examples that are related to the funding that we provided. Silientium, a passive raider that we're supporting. Industrial Science Group, and it's a tool to predict and have solutions for collision avoidance. And then Sabre, a mission control centre that includes SSA capabilities. It goes beyond SSA, I said it before, and it goes beyond the agency as well. There are other initiatives that are done in Australia, and I just wanted to give you three of them. EOS with a research project looking at changing the orbit of a debris with a laser so that it can avoid a collision. Another one that we've been looking at with the spirit mission is simply to test the SSR that we've been talking about. What we wanted was really to understand how it works, does it work for our industry, does it work for a CubeSat, a university project, and just to test it so we can see if it is measurable, if we could work with it with our licensing process, everything that we can explore to have tangible results and measurable results. And the last one that I wanted to mention, Newman Space. They are working on a project for a propulsion system that is able to use recycled metal in space. So again, sustainability is large. It's not just about space debris, in my view. It's everything that we look at from all our priority areas, dark sky, spectrum interference, everything, and that's what we're trying to look at with this sustainability framework that we're developing. Another important aspect of the framework is recognizing that technology is not the only thing. We talked about it earlier. It's also about regulation, coordination, international collaboration. So we know that we can't do it on our own and I think Moriba said it quite clearly again. So we participate in international discussions and Australia was one of the funding members of CubeSat and we continue to participate in these discussions. We are committed to implement the LTS guidelines. We participate in different working groups to try and identify recommendations, solutions for space sustainability. But we do know that this takes time. It has to happen, but we also need to do our part on our side with national activities that will move quicker and with quicker solutions. So at national level, we did review our space act and now there is a requirement in the act for a space debris mitigation plan and it has to be based on intrusional standards. So that's the kind of thing that links to the LTS guidelines and the implementation of the guidelines. And we are going further with more regulatory refinement. I didn't have the minister to say it now, but yeah, we are working on that as well. And the last one that I wanted to mention when we talk about space and sustainability, in my view, sustainability is not just environment, it's social, environment and economics. And I want to talk about the social side a bit more because we talk about space heritage. For Australia, this space heritage and heritage is actually important because we have something special that is our aboriginal background. We do recognize that the first nations people are, they were actually the first, the oldest astronomers and that's why our logo on the Australian Space Agency is a tribute to what they've done with the constellation aboriginal constellation. But a tribute is not enough. We want to use their expertise. We have a program to use their expertise inside the agency and more globally so that we learn from what they know about astronomy, but they were actually also very good at sustainability. So we want to use these expertise. Again, that was really just a glimpse of what we do at the Australian Space Agency and in Australia in general. I came all the way here with a non-that-sustainable travel to meet with you. So please come and talk to me, try and identify things that we can do together, opportunities for collaboration with the Australian Space Agency, but also I'm happy to facilitate discussions with our industry. Thank you. Thank you, Marie. Quite a holistic viewpoint of the way to integrate sustainability into strategy, policy and I guess culture as much as anything. So thank you for that. Our next talk will be from Frédéric Ronell of the European Space Agency. He's a project manager there and he's going to talk about the European Space Agency's perspective on space sustainability. It's yours. You manage? Great. Okay. Good afternoon, everyone. It's a real pleasure to be here. I'm coming not so far from you, just from Oxford, so it's almost sustainable transport. Yeah, it's really a pleasure to be here today. I have a good news. I have only one slide. The bad news is that I have a few paper with me and you will have to support my pitch. So I think we all agree after these two days that, at least as a vision, shared by several agencies, including ESA, that space is fundamental to building a sustainable future. Is this, I would say, the key statement for today and I will repeat several times. For ESA, for the European Space Agency, sustainability means acting on two aspects. Sustainability from space that you have on the left side and sustainability of space. And it's really, let's say, the two elements, the two challenges for the European Space Agency and we consider the two sides of the same coin. Let's start by sustainability from space. There is a lot of initiative and I'm sure that you'd share with my colleagues in the last two days coming from ESA. They present you different initiatives we had in the European Space Agency and this is supported through different directorates. I am representing the directorate of telecommunication and integrated application. I will focus so on three of them. There is a lot, but maybe we will discover a little bit what we are doing in telecommunication to support sustainability. We have one initiative, which is a green accelerator, one which is a digital twin-hearth and the last one, digitalization. Few words, very fast, on the green accelerator. The European Space Agency has a space for a green future accelerator and this is a major ESA initiative aiming to accelerate the use of space, helping Europe, and I'm sure it was repeated by a lot of you and a lot of colleagues from ESA, to be the first carbon neutral continent by 2050. Our director general, by the way, put the goal a little bit higher because we have announcing 2030 so we are ready to work hard to make it happen. On the digital twin-hearth, a second initiative, this will provide, let's say, a very dynamic and interactive representation of the Earth system processes and this mainly based on clouds. This is why I really appreciate what you say on the data. It's something very often we forgot and the high performance computing and also the artificial intelligence and we will use these for predictive analysis. It's quite obvious. Based on our data collected, so through ESA, our fleet, but also the European Commission and all our partners because we share the data of our planet. Last but not least, digitization. I'm sure you are certainly familiar with smart cities, smart grids, smart connectivity, smart mobility concepts. By driving the digitalization, we are unlocking new application and new way to better manage the planet's resources. Basically, we are moving from the data to the information and from the knowledge to the action and this is one of the key challenge for the agency. Here's the telecommunication and integrated application directorates or the directorate from where I'm working for. It's based in Harwell in Exat, so we are UK flag and we have to mission to develop and to integrate the space solution in our systems. Systems means the ground one, the space one and the hand-to-hand system. For this, we need to develop better connectivity, better security, better sustainability and this is why we have the three pillars, space to connect, space to secure and space to sustain. A concrete example, let's be concrete after this very diplomatic introduction, a concrete example how the directorate is contributing to the green accelerator I was talking about a few seconds ago. We are working with the automotive industry in order to deliver a seamless satellite and residual connectivity. And in fact, by boosting the vehicle connectivity, the connected car will be able to optimize not only the safety, it's something that we hear several times today, but also its operation and its energy efficiency. So basically, by boosting the vehicle connectivity, we will be able to optimize traffic flow to reduce the fuel consumption and of course at the end to optimize and reduce the CO2 emission which is also one of our challenge. To make a transition with the second element, so the sustainability of space, I should say that we cannot only protect and manage our resources on Earth and we cannot, sorry, we cannot do it without protecting and managing our asset in Europe, our space assets and see the second challenge, see the second, let's say, element of our strategy. I say the moment ago that I will say it again, space is fundamental to be a sustainable future for Europe and for the world and this is why to protect and manage our access to space is fundamental. To illustrate the second element, I will very fast talk about the space debris removal. You heard a lot about it and space traffic management which are two important aspects of this challenge, sustainability of space. Regarding the space debris removal, I will not enter you had fantastic presentation, technical, commercial, etc. I will just say that at ESA, we have created an accelerator protection of space assets and this will unite all European industry participant to the end dependence on non-European source of space other of debris but also data and debris mitigation services. So it's a concrete example of what the European Space Agency in support with the member state and the industry operator for the space debris removal. Regarding the space traffic management, it's also an excellent topic I think for the sustainable economy. A decade ago, less than a decade ago, ESA, so the European Space Agency and EXATS, so the entity telecommunication team decided to support MRSAT. So the UK operator to improve the air traffic management basically by bringing connectivity to plane. Last week, I don't know if you notice but EasyJet has announced to be the first aligner partner to use this system which we named, sorry, Iris. What we did basically for the air must be done for space and this is what we have to do now and maybe in the last decade we have just eight hours to make it happen. Indeed, the number of satellites and large constellations and you see it today in space keeps rising. We need common rules on use and we have fantastic presentation on the regulation and law of space but we need also smart industries and operators proposing innovative solutions and I think this morning you had excellent example. One example I can give you to illustrate this topic is the program Sunrise. Through the Sunrise program which is a telecommunication partnership project satellite constellation operator OneWeb I'm sure you know is committed to responsible space. OneWeb spacecraft are designed with passivation capabilities. They orbit real abilities. Crabling feature for active debris removal and the orbiting. So basically OneWeb in collaboration with Astroscale by the way developed and demonstrate technology required for debris removal services. If I take one second for this example I would like to illustrate that the sustainability challenge is not solved only by optimization of the operation which are more and more complex. I would like to share with you a little bit about the industry on this topic or by improvement of the ground asset but also by acting on the space asset at design level in the early stage of the project and this is what the agency tried to support. We are here an enabler. The industry is bringing the answer. In conclusion I have to say that we should not be afraid by the challenges of the position of global leader. Here our position is not the one of the agency only is the industry is the operator is the society. In particular by supporting the innovative industry operators for business that are commercially sustainable. I join your points and socially responsible. So let me finish by how I start my speech. Space is fundamental to bringing a sustainable future. Thank you for your attention. So sustainability from space and sustainability of space and the activities between them. Thank you. So our final spotlight speaker in this session is Mr Jeremy John Pauley who is a lead space systems engineer for Northrop Grumman based here in London and with responsibility for the UK, Europe and MENA region. Jeremy is going to talk to us about in-space servicing and the space logistics activities. So let's get started. I still have that mustache. I know you all wished that I did. My facial hair kind of goes in cycles. So you'll see me again and I'll probably look different. Also something else that wild happened a few minutes ago was Mariba got a predominantly British audience to have audience participation at a conference which I've never seen before. So that was fantastic. Yeah. So I'm going to talk a little bit about space logistics apparently. I can chat without them. Space logistics which is a Northrop Grumman company. Oh, great. Well, something's happened. Is this working now? Oh, epic. Great. Space logistics is a Northrop Grumman company. Rob Haughey is our president. Unfortunately, I'm not seeing circumstances. He can't be here today. But you have me so I'm kind of the lead systems engineer based in London. The accent may lead you astray and so starting I mean thinking about 60 years ago when the space industry started this early bird which is Intel sets first satellite it launched June 28 which is my birthday. So I accept presents as well if you'd like. Thanks. It was 1965 which I'm not 60 years old so not really my birthday but kind of just the point of we've been doing this the same way for 60 years, right? You build something on the ground you fold it up really nice.  Yes, there's been new technology there's been higher capacity different uses but it's been overall the same and of course not sustainable. I mean everyone here at the conference you've seen it over and over the number of space to breathe there are it just ends up you have a world that has all the stuff around it whether it's defunct or operational but it's not sustainable and that's 10 to 20 satellites are put into graveyard orbit every year it's just not going well so what if we used kind of that reduced recycled mentality that we have on earth with plastic bottles and cans but you did it in space if you've heard well I'm going to try this audience participation thing has anyone heard of the mission extension vehicle raise your hands oh we got one yeah so about two years ago 2019 and 2020 space logistic launched mission extension vehicle one and two which is kind of the rendering is on this left side and the right are pictures that it actually took in space of Intel sat 901 and 1002 respectively where it actually went up they weren't designed to be docked to it came it got into the liquid energy engine docked and now they're providing station keeping and from what Intel said has told us it didn't actually affect any of their client kind of performance throughout that whole process which is pretty wild something that wasn't designed to be docked to we did it in space and that's I think kind of the first step towards sustainability and orbit servicing and there's kind of three aspects of that right there's the business case right so I know there's satellite operators in the room it's not just a cool ESG thing that we can check off the box and say yes we're being sustainable but it's actually helping your revenues I mean you're able to put your NRE and the cost of developing a new satellite you can push that farther out and instead do on orbit servicing to maintain the life of the technology and the electronics are still working usually it's the lack of fuel that ends the satellite life early then the other aspects of sustainability obviously if you're doing in orbit servicing there's less manufacturing and precious metals and all that just going in on earth as you're building it and then equally it's creating less space junk so one continuing to have enough fuel to move it into graveyard orbit or to responsibly deorbit it at the end of life if needed and two there's not sending up as much as possible another couple really cool images so on the top left is the MRV so the mission robotic vehicle so that's kind of the follow on for us for the mission extension vehicle it adds in a lot of robotic capabilities and epic suite of sensors on there it's going to be able to implant mission extension pods onto existing satellites so in 2024 we're expected to launch this with a few mission extension pods and already have some customers which is pretty again satellites that were not designed to be made with and providing that kind of sustainable life extension and orbit station keeping down in this bottom left you see orbit fab I know my colleagues are here today from orbit fab really key that there's this is kind of an open industry kind of in orbit servicing it's not something to be monopolized and it's not something to be really held tight to the chest but instead we really do need to collaborate on what those kind of standards for refueling and power and grappling are and I know the gents at orbit fab they actually have a hardware model of their rafty kind of refueling port so it's always fun for me when you actually get your hands on the hardware you're like oh this is real we build things for space and then they go a million miles away and you never see them again so it feels lame because you don't get to like touch like the car you're building or something so it's always fun to see hardware but again yeah stressing like so important for industry and governments to be collaborating on what these standards are you know organizations like ISO and AIAA that was talked about I also don't know how to pronounce it confers I don't know it never gets figured out and then the UN committees as well so really cool that that's already happening but again I think from industry we have some sort of responsibility to really start getting this in motion and bringing things up and building the hardware and seeing if we can get agreement on those kind of things yeah the top right is NASA's OSAM so also on-orbit servicing and manufacturing cool to see that there's international governments being involved so NASA obviously is interested from JAXA, the Japanese Space Agency, the UAE ESA of course yeah and the last kind of I'd be remiss if I didn't mention kind of the resilience aspect we talked a bit about just space debris in general of course that Russia ASAT test that we all know happened was a horrible thing but just kind of understanding that space is becoming a contested domain and whether that's direct if you're working with government organizations or indirect just by space debris that could be caused by those things it's important to kind of build resiliency around the high value assets that we all have in space so on-orbit servicing again can kind of provide that ability either whether that's a delta V or just extending the fuel to be able to maneuver around these space debris I think especially as satellite operators there's kind of a regret to maneuver because your fuel is really what's limiting your lifetime and so there's always this trade off right of okay yes I need to save my satellite you know if the data is telling me yes there's going to be a conjunction but we're not sure how close there's almost this cost-benefit analysis of do I use the field to try to avoid this so on-orbit servicing is key to being able to enable kind of that resiliency and the ability to avoid the conjunctions and especially as it becomes even a more and more kind of scary place to be especially Leo Bell as we see all the mega constellations coming up so again if we could bring that kind of reduced reuse recycle mentality of space and if that becomes more of a reuse and repairing and recycling through on-orbit refueling through ports that are maybe data and power enabled such that you can plug and play payloads and you can continue to manufacture things and assemble things on space that's just an amazing budding industry and again it's happening now the MEVs are both on-orbit and functioning so it's not necessarily a 20 years in the future but it is happening right now so if we continue to do that we'll make space safer more sustainable for all of us to kind of expand that space economy thanks and looking forward to chatting with you all later


Facebook, Amazon, Apple, Netflix and Google, we're good. So those are the killer apps right now. It wasn't like this, it wasn't like this in the past. The first killer app that I used was Prince of Persia. I didn't play it in Apple II, I played it in Microsoft, I can't remember which one, I was too small. And that made me dream about what you could do with computers. You could be a prince, you could do magical things. So immediately when this came out, I was the greatest fan. And let me tell you, one of the killer apps still today, for me, is the Zelda Ocarina of Time. But there was a problem, there was a problem with this machine. So one day I was playing outside, I was in my village and there was a big storm, I was on my bike. I was like 20 minutes away from home. I got soaking wet, but I was really hoping that I could go home and play Ocarina of Time with my friends. My boy, that didn't happen because I had left the window open and my Nintendo 64 was next to the window. So the big storm wetted everything and I lost my Nintendo 64. So the enemy for those killer apps was just a simple glass of water. A little bit of water could destroy those killer apps, this Zelda Ocarina of Time.  But you're going to laugh a bit more to these guys in the Metro of London who let the door open when they had some cement going on. So that was terrible for them, but nothing of this would have happened if they had what we have now. So the cloud is extremely convenient, right? The cloud is amazing. The cloud allows us to use everything we want from wherever we want. And this is me using apps as an app. I use Spotify for my music, I use GitHub to check the code of my peers and I use Google Docs to do this presentation, for example. And if I lose my laptop, what happens? Absolutely nothing. I can use it from here. So I know the story is that the cloud is amazing. The cloud is really good, it frees us from the burden of soaring, of backing up. You can access it from wherever, you can do the computation of extremely complex apps somewhere else and use it with a device that is not so powerful. It is very, very inexpensive, as opposed to buying the hardware every time that you want to play a game like my original time, and it's tremendously scalable. So in summary, the cloud is just very, very convenient. Let me prove a point here. Who here wants a theory of note? Alright, be a reviewer. Oh, no, no. That's pretty good. Who runs it in a VPS? Why? It's maintenance and security. Who else is running it in a VPS? There are more people. Why? I don't have a home. It's fantastic, exactly. So basically you run it because it's very convenient, right? It's very convenient. So that sort of proves the point of how convenient, especially if you don't have a home. To run any application that you want, including an ether note. We've looked at the apps that I use and apps that I used to use, but let's look at the apps that the world is using. This is, when I say fang, more broadly, what I mean is this. Those are the apps that people are using the most on their phones right now. And I took the liberty of investigating a little bit where those apps are hosted. Because you have Facebook on your phone, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all the magic happens on your phone. So what I found out is that four of the top five are in Facebook. Facebook has massive data centers. We can call it the Facebook Clouds, even if they don't sell it there. It's our cloud services. Four of them are in Google Clouds. Two of them are in WS. Two of them use a multi-cloud approach, meaning Google and WS, and probably some others like DigitalOcean, who knows. Five of them, they use cloud services, but they're mostly Chinese companies. They do not disclose who those infrastructure providers are, but I've checked on their annual reports and they use cloud services. And three of them do not use the cloud. Why? Because they're media players. And arguably, the distribution of these apps, if it happens through Google Play, happens through the cloud as well. But the app itself does not need the cloud, right? How much does it cost to have this app running? $13 billion on network infrastructure for Google. Last year. This year they have one. Snap, who was on that list, pays $600 million a year to Google and to AWS. Lift $100 million, slap $50 million, Pinterest $125 million.  Apple $360 million per year. Did you know that Apple Cloud is actually Amazon Web Services Cloud? So just five clients bring us to one and a quarter billion US dollar a year. If you look at some of the forecasts of the industry, it's $83 billion in three years. That's a lot of money. And those apps are free. Mind-blowing. There's two apps that are how subscription level, Netflix and Spotify. And two of them, Uber and Amazon, it's a big review. So the app is free, but actually if you want to use the services, you have to pay. Those apps are free. And they're spending billions a year supporting the infrastructure. You guys are in this room, I know I'm preaching for the choir here, but you know what happens when apps are free, right? But there's somethings you're doing. And that's cool, nobody cares. It's even fun. Everybody knows that. Everybody knows it. And we laugh at it when we read. Apple contractors regularly hear confidential details. They hear people having sex. They're doing funny, right?  So that's a little bit less fun. There was another example of data that was misused when it fell into the wrong hands. So we're in March 1940. Germany invades the Netherlands. And the Netherlands at that point was one of the most progressive countries that we have in the world. They were a secular country. And they had one of the most just ways of dealing with religion, which means that they had a religious budget on their annual accounts. And they split it accordingly to the percentage of the population than was of one religion or another. Which means that in the census they knew what religion was. So the Germans come in, they just go to the census office, they look and they have the name and the address of every single Jew in the Netherlands. That's where the Netherlands has the biggest interns in percentage and in absolute terms of Jews deceased during the Second World War. Right, so we don't have to go so far. We don't have to go to Germany in the 1940s to see examples of how diet data can be misused. Everybody knows about Cambridge and Leadinger. Now they've boomed. We probably... Probably, if it wasn't for them, you guys would have a different outcome. Probably, the what-if scenarios have never been my favorite. But it is for sure that they used data to target people that were on the fence and take the balance to one side. There's another person that used Cambridge and Leadinger services, another president, and as you know, you know how much he paid for Cambridge and Leadinger services. Make a guess. How much does it cost to win an election? Ten million. Low. Lower. Oh, five. Five million. Five million. A cool five million. You get data of pretty much everybody that has a Facebook account and you can go really deep. This year, this is the former CEO of Cambridge and Leadinger, and they based their work on... I can look it up for you guys. So there's a researcher that's created back, like a long time ago, created a series of algorithms that with 150 likes on Facebook, they could know you better than your best friends. They knew things about you. There are more things about you than your best friends.  Right, so this data is dangerous and can be used for the wrong things and this is happening right now. Does that make people not use these apps? Is privacy really a value proposition? Look at how many users do we have on WhatsApp which is owned by Facebook. One billion daily users. Daily users. I am one of them. Messenger, almost one billion. TikTok, 200 million. You put everything. You're almost half naked there. They know everything about you. Facebook, 1.6 billion. That's a lot of people. Daily users. And just for comparison, let's look at this. This weekend I look at the set of the apps and that's the 3,000 results. But what are we doing great? I mean, we're fine. I think we need to improve. And I suggest that we take another model. We take another approach. We take another approach that takes the power out of that, out of all these cloud services. How do we get our decentralized apps to get close, even close, to the traditional apps level of adoption? Well, first of all, they need to be... Free. Free, okay, yeah. What else? What was the magic word convenient for? Convenient. Convenient. They need to be convenient. They need to be convenient. There's this unswoken rule written that says that more or less the technology, just because it's bare, will not take over the previous technology. It needs to be 10 times better. So we need to be... We need to make things that are 10 times better than the things that are just the killer apps right now, which are not Ethereum at this point. And what's better than free? Pay for it. Okay, pay for it. Okay, pay for it. And we're paying a lot of money to this cloud provider. So I suggest a personally owned student cloud that sheets the transfer of volume from the cloud to the user. So this is the current model right now where the data is paid... Well, the money comes from sending the data and goes to the cloud provider. There's also other flows, but I want to focus specifically on that flow of money because we have one thing that they don't have, and it's a native way to transfer value. So I suggest that if I want to do a decentralized Spotify, we do it like this. We pay the users to host this task for us. For us. I'll use the Spotify that pays me. I'm sorry for you. You couldn't be here and have a house. You can't have it in your house, but maybe you can put it in WPS as well. It should be fine. So I suggest that here, when we have Spotify, somebody pays... Yeah, okay, most of us are free. We're going to touch into that. They'll be here, and we transfer the value to the user. We're far away from that. We're far away from that, and I'm going to try to make a list of what pieces need to come together to create a model where this would work. Number one, it needs to be as convenient, as accessible from anywhere and all the time like the cloud is. This is not a 10X. This is a bare game. We need this, and we don't have it right now.  But we're working on this. We're working on the infrastructure side to make this infrastructure better, more accessible from everywhere. So how? We're working with Archival. I'm going to use some two DevOps concepts here. A high availability cluster is... Everybody knows what it is. It's a series of nodes that are connected, and when the first one goes down, the second one takes over. Archival is developing a system specifically targeted to eth2.0, so anybody can start staking from their own homes. You're going to Federation with your friends, and your node goes down, the second node takes over, and then you avoid being slashed because of downtime on your node. So good. We're getting closer to high availability here. There's another thing called load balancing in DevOps, which is basically distributing the load through the nodes for the servers that are there.  So we've got high availability. We've got load balancing. We're getting somewhere there. But this is just the bare minimum. This is not a 10X. Another thing that's not a 10X is throughput and scalability. There's things that are going to help us get better with scalability. I'm not an expert on that. I'm not going to touch on it. But the roll-up with zero-nodes groups, Ethereum 2.0, I'm sure you guys are absolute experts on that. This is what we need. It's a bare minimum. But we're starting to get somewhere with privacy. We said that privacy wasn't a killer proposition. It wasn't about your proposition, but it is. It's just not on your zone. It's not 10X there. It is 4X there. Why do I say that? Because given the chance of using a private app that sells your data, and they work exactly the same way that they're exactly the same level of availability and the same level of transactions, et cetera, et cetera, you will use them on the spread. But we're at the bare minimum right here. On the infrastructure side, what we can do to ensure privacy, we can include, in that hardware, we can include environment-structured environments like the one on SGX, we can create and then with zero-nodes groups, we can create them within those enclaves and that's available for the app users to do whatever they want in a secure, environment way. Also, we've seen that the model means it worked for apps that had the Spotify worked for somebody that was paying for subscription, then you pay the user to host it, right? There's other models. There's DataFun, for example, which is a way more ethical way of using the data. So we don't have to just throw away all the data, but we should be able to let people opt in on what data they want to give and to whom. Another thing that needs to happen is instantivization. Pocket Network, ETH 2.0, Storage, Rain and Vidno, there are many projects out there and one of them will not give you enough money to run a project, but if you stack them on top of the other, on the same machine, you start having a money box in your house that gives you enough money to sustain the box itself. So that's... That's not 10x yet. There's one more component. There need to be apps that people use that people can't use and they can be easy to use. Give value to user. It's not only UX and UI, I'm sorry, I should have changed that. It's basically value proposition. Give value to the user. Most of the apps right now use the hoop. I don't know if it's familiar with the hoop model here, but basically what they do is they trick you into using it all the time.  So when you develop apps, please make sure that you're not a dealer. Make sure that you actually want to use it and make sure that it materially improves the user's life. This is the way we're going to have apps that can compete at least with the hoop model. So what we're doing at that note is taking care of the infrastructure side. We are working on the first part of the infrastructure, having this infrastructure being available from everywhere. Through the scalability of the Ethereum foundation, everybody is very, very much focused on that. Privacy, we're including SGX and we're including systems inside our boxes that you can leverage for your apps and make them private and secure. Instantivization, with e2.0, that will help us a lot, but you need to do the last part. You need to create apps that give value. And I suggest that the next time you're doing a human-centered design system to create an app, think about this model. Think about instead of giving money to the cloud providers who are going to take this data and they're going to use it for God knows what, think about this. Think about making people host, incentivize people to host your apps. If you want to know how to do it, please get in touch. We can help you design something on that note that will be hopefully almost as good as using BPS or even more convenient. Thank you very much.


This is JSA TV and JSA Podcasts, the newsroom for telecom and data center professionals. I'm Carl Sketchley, and on behalf of the team here at JSA, welcome to our July virtual round table. Over the past few months, we have been running a special series analyzing the effects of the COVID-19 fallout on our industry. Thank you to everyone who joined us on that journey. But as we've all been reminded recently, our industry continues to face the ongoing challenge of safeguarding our network infrastructure in today's rapidly evolving world. For the next 45 minutes, we will come together as one network infrastructure community to engage with top industry thought leaders on this subject. As a little sunshine, hopefully at your door today, we provided lunch, or if you chose a gift card to a local restaurant for the first 100 registrants. So for those of you who received, please enjoy your JSA lunch while we get started. Just a quick reminder, this is of course a round table. We do want to hear from you and answer your questions. So please go ahead and type them into our question box. Time permitting, we will answer them here. But of course, in the last 15 minutes of the hour, we will be taking our conversation over to LinkedIn for a chat with our speakers. Just search for hashtag JSA virtual round tables and our feed will come up or click on the direct link that we will be sharing in our chat box shortly. Once there, we will be reviewing the questions that we don't get a chance to cover in the next 45 minutes. So go ahead, post your own questions and thoughts to our panelists there as well. If you have a speaker suggestion for next time or simply to register for our upcoming monthly virtual round tables, visit jsa.net. Our next one up, we'll be taking a look at top tips for hurricane season network preparedness. That round table is August 20th at 1 p.m. Eastern time. Check it out and register. Now, let's get started. Today's topic, safeguarding our network infrastructure in today's brave new world. And for today's chat, we have over 200 registrants joining us. Thank you for your continued support. And thank you as well to our all-star panelists here today to help us introduce them and to guest moderate. Please welcome Jeff Omalchuk, Executive Director of Infrastructure Masons. Jeff, thank you so much for joining us today. The floor is yours. Carl, thanks very much. And I wanted to thank everybody at JSA for making this opportunity available to all of us here. It's great to be here. It's a sunny, beautiful day and things could be worse. So thanks so much for having us. And thanks to all the attendees for joining. It's great to have people coming together as a community in these times. I want to thank particularly our panelists and I'll go around and let them introduce themselves in a minute. Let me introduce myself first a little bit. My name is Jeff Omalchuk, as Carl said. I'm one of two Executive Directors at Infrastructure Masons. The other being my colleague Simon Allen who's based in London. I'm in Portland, Oregon. And Infrastructure Masons is an association of people in digital infrastructure. It's association of people like you, the builders of the digital age. And would love to have you all join I Masons. So let me ask our panelists to introduce themselves. I'll call you out one at a time. Eric, do you want to start? Absolutely. Good afternoon and I look forward to our discussion day. My name is Eric Dahl. I'm the Vice President of Business Development for Strategic Venue Partners. And we offer wireless infrastructure as a managed service, basically the fourth utility. We manage the entire development process, the initial design system commissioning to monitoring maintenance and repairing the system 24-7. We basically fund 100% of your distributed network system. No wireless carrier contributions are required, ensuring time for certainty of delivery. We have SVP technology, we can do DAS, CBRS, the on-go private LTE network, Wi-Fi, public safety systems, IPTV. So we bring all of our carriers day one. We look forward to the discussion today. Thanks, Eric. Sam? Hi, I'm Sam Reagan. Glad to be here. I'm the Business Development Manager with ColoATL, which is a data center in downtown Atlanta, as well as ColoATL is owned by American Tower. And we're also in the process of introducing micro-edge data centers into our tower infrastructure all over the country. Thank you very much. Great. Chris? Christopher? Christopher Lodge, Interim CEO and COO for United Fiber and Data. We are a, I'll call it super regional because of the span that we encompass from New York City down to the data center capital of Ashburn, Virginia. And we provide both dark and lit services on an alternative route of the I-95 Route 1 corridor. Great. And Suji? Hi, Jeff. Thank you for having us here. I'm Suji Tanda. I'm the CDI of BDX. BDX is a data center, a Spanish data center company with assets spread across China. We have two large assets in China. We have a presence in Hong Kong and Singapore. And we are expanding toward the emerging promise of Asia. Great. Well, a really impressive group of panelists. Thank you all for joining.  So I'm an avid cyclist. And I recently began using a Garmin cycle computer with a radar tail light, which is pretty cool because as you're writing, it tracks on your display on your handlebars, cars approaching from behind you. It's cool and it's amazing and it works really well. I've really enjoyed it. And I went for a ride the other last week, actually. And when I got back, it's supposed to sync your ride data to, you know, your profile thing. And it wasn't doing it. And I didn't think too much of it, but I heard later that day about the ransomware attack on Garmin. That was a wasted locker ransomware attack that really took down their entire system. So my service is back up, but I don't think even quite all of Garmin services are yet up. I understand they've actually paid the ransom to get their data restored and they're still struggling, I believe. So, you know, I use Garmin for recreation for just fitness cycling and recreation cycling, but they also host services for pilots, both, I think primarily small plane pilots. They host a back country wilderness rescue service called Inreach that people rely on for their lives and they have a Garmin pay system that presumably has credit card information. So, you know, this outage didn't affect me all that much, but man, it could have had real consequences and we may learn that it has, I don't really know. So my first question to the panel, this really brought digital security home to me and my first question to the panel is, you know, has logical security and resilience improved enough to keep hackers out? Are they always gonna be ahead of us? Who's beating who here? Let's start with Sujit, you wanna go first? Yeah, I kind of, you know, the way I look at this is that you need to look at the attack continuum, right? Saying that are the hackers ahead of us, I think, you know, you will never be able to arrive at a definitive answer to that, right? So instead of trying to say that I will protect my assets, you have to be prepared for what are you doing before, which means how do you protect, right? What do you do if you are under attack, which is during an attack, right? What is the BCP plan that you have, right?  So that's what you do during and what you do after the attack. So what do you learn during this attacks and what is the steps that it will take to ensure that this doesn't happen again? So unless and until you prepare for the attack continuum, you're never going to be saying that I will be ahead of somebody, things will keep changing and the pandemic has taught us that, right? So cyber resilience is what I talk about and that's where we need to get to instead of trying to talk about cyber security only. And that's what you're doing in BDX, the talk about cyber resilience. That's interesting. Christopher, any comments?  I think it's interesting though that everybody that's looked at moving to a cloud-based system and how it's made the industry vulnerable is interesting. I know we look at a lot, what are the interfaces? How many APIs you start looking at some of these systems out there that are just running or have the ability to run 100 plus APIs into it? And I think it just opens it up. But I think as he touched on to the most important, and I know we talked very briefly before, what can we do to learn from it? We don't publish anything about it. Everybody wants to keep it hush-hush in the back room that we got attacked or what our vulnerability is. I think if there was, I think Jeff, you had mentioned an anonymous way to put that information out there and allow others to learn from it. What happened? What can we do to prevent it?  Will they be ahead? I think it's an effort-moving scale. Yeah, yeah. Sam, do you have any comments on either, you know, who's beating who and who will beat who or what can we do as a community to learn from each other's mistakes? I think it's hard for us as, you know, companies to stay ahead because we have to be right all the time and they only have to be right once, right? They can continue, continue, continue to attack. They only have to be right once. We have to be right all the time. So I think it's very difficult for, you know, enterprise companies to defend everything all the time. And I think that any CISO that you talk to, it's not if we're going to get, it's when we're going to get. And, you know, what do we do to help mitigate it, like Sam Jean said. So I think that's really the key is, you know, do everything you can to protect within what happens when it happens. And I agree if there was some way to share all this information, that would be great. Unfortunately, I don't think everybody wants to be first. Yeah.  And we, you know, the good guys won't be the only ones to have AI. So Eric, do you have any comment on any of this? You know, I agree with the panelists at this point. And, you know, I concentrate a little bit in the healthcare sector.  And just to give you a couple of stats, in 216, 27 million patient records were hacked, 5.6 million in 217, 15 million in 18, 41 million in 219. I mean, it's just absolutely incredible. And what you don't realize is that it's the second targeted profit center for the black market because of all that healthcare data, which has social security, personal information, phone and the like. So it's an absolute problem that a space that I'm in all the time, absolutely has to get a hand on it. Do I think we have the upper hand? Absolutely not. Wow. So being from the healthcare sector, that kind of brings us around to, as Carl kind of introduced the panel, one of the focuses is just how the world is different.  But, you know, there are other impacts as well. As an example, we've driven so many, you know, people online because it's the only way to interact. And so many of them are relatively inexperienced users. I'd be interested in you all's opinion if this presents new challenges for security, just the shifting use of the infrastructure. Eric, do you have any comments on that? Yeah, you know, I think one of the things that, you know, there's two schools of thought. The one, of course, that my company's most interested in is the infrastructure, you know, on site.  And so, you know, I think 5G will be a big help for us from a security standpoint. I'd also put out there that, you know, people have relied on Wi-Fi over the last number of years and Wi-Fi is definitely not one of the secure architectures out there. So, people just don't realize that the breaches that happen in that space are there. So I think, you know, 5G will definitely help us. And I know that's one of the things that we're targeting from a healthcare, hospitality, educational system in order to bring that infrastructure up to date. So that will limit the incidents of it, as well as have private LTE as well as carrier LTE service, which is more secure than typical Wi-Fi. Yeah, good points. Christopher, what are you thinking about 5G? I, again, I mean, we all know 5G is, I'll call it the buzzword of the last two years, for sure. I definitely think it's going to help the industry. We're already seeing some of it. But I also think it brings a whole new level of physical security. Now we have that many more devices planted out there because of the densification that we need with 5G radios. So now we're getting into a whole nother level, you know, back to the earlier question that you had Jeff on, you know, security in general. Now we've got to secure those devices. We've seen some of the things, there's a, you know, myths out there about what 5G is doing and things like that.  I don't think you're going to stop everything, but now we've just taken a city that might have had, you know, 100 vulnerable points to 5,000 vulnerable points within a, you know, within a major city. Right, and that's not going to change, I don't think, with the kind of push to the edge. I think not only what we've seen more sensors in the urban environment, as you said, from, you know, a few thousand to potentially millions, we'll also see more compute infrastructure built out in those environments. If there's a, you know, a rack of servers in every Starbucks or Whole Foods, what happens to physical security then? Suji, you look like you want to jump in. Yeah, that's correct. I mean, that's, I come from a telecom background, then move to data center. So the way I look at 5G is that, you know, you perhaps, you know, 4G itself, you know, attack the number of vectors that you have for attack increased in 4G, right? Now 5G means that what you could do in three years, if you were released, if you're getting to a couple of billion devices in three to five years, you in 5G you will get to a billion device in less than a year, right? So that's what 5G is going to bring us. That's the first piece. The second piece is how do we look at, you know, the mobile edge? So in the data center industry, 5G will ensure that the edge becomes bigger growth area than the core, right? So the core feeds into the edge. Now, interestingly, what it means is for, from an attack surface perspective, if I'm somebody who wants to attack, right? It gives me the dimensions that it gives me is 100 times, right? So the world will become, like I say, universal security is one thing that we talk about, right? It will become universally vulnerable. So everybody will become, so I can actually launch an attack. Just if I look at a city, I will pick up the least pieces. I will pick up the alarm bells to launch an attack, right? So I'm no longer looking at laptops or mobile phones or iPads to have watts. I will look at IoT devices to have watts. And that means that, you know, for me to get to those numbers, I just need to scan, you know, look at what is happening, what's where, the vulnerabilities in the firmware, and get a million devices in a day's time. That's what 5G could do to us. Yeah, well, Sam, I wanted to get your thoughts. You work with Colo Atlanta, and like Christopher, you guys are involved with 5G and towers, and we recently heard of, you know, people burning down 5G towers over concern of God knows what actually, but I don't know if you have any comment on security in this age. Yeah, so a lot of our tower infrastructure, American Tower, we have, you know, 50,000 towers in the US, 180,000 towers globally, a lot of it's in rural areas. So we do have security, we have fencing, we have barbed wire, we have cameras at most of the site. So we are doing everything that we can to make sure that those facilities are secure. We're also now building these micro-edge data centers at the same facilities also. And so that gives us another level of security because there's more cameras, you know, two-factor authentication to get into those. And so we are very concerned about the physical security. More infrastructure to risk too, if you're putting more assets at the site, yeah. Yeah, so we're definitely looking at, we have 24 by seven monitoring of those facilities and we're making sure that, you know, you have to make a phone call to get in the gate and you have to have two-factor authentication to get into the data centers. So we're really trying to push the core data center security out to the edge as well, not just the compute and the storage. Yeah, yeah, so I want to open it up a little bit and just have a more open discussion about, and maybe we start with the topic, you know, to your mind, what's the greatest risk to the security of digital infrastructure in the next, say, three years? Does anybody want to start the discussion? I would say it's continued to be what it is now, right? I think that, you know, especially with COVID, like you said, we've pushed a bunch, all these employees out to their homes and they're not really as security conscious as they were before. And I don't think we've done a good job of locking down all those systems, people using their personal devices, like we said before, to access their business applications. And I'm not sure all the companies have caught up with that yet.  So I think we're going to continue this, I don't see this changing very much in the next two or three years. I think we're going to have to really look at all the security for every single device that every single employee has, whether they're personal or whether they're business. Yeah, and I would add to that, you know, Jeff, I mean, you look at now IT managers and, you know, starting my career in that field, you're not just now managing, you know, your building or your two buildings or the devices on your building, you're now managing all the devices that are sitting out there, you know, so you have 3,000 devices, that's fine if they're all consolidated into a couple of buildings, but now you have 3,000 devices sitting across 3,000 different networks. I always tell people, you know, from somebody that's traveled a ton in my career, go open your laptop up in a neighborhood and look at the number of networks that list up that you could connect to. And I'm still amazed to this day how many are not secure and or they have the security symbol next to it, but how easy it is to really connect to them, you know, and then one of the things that, you know, Sam mentioned about, you know, the increase in attacks, I read a very interesting statistic. Normally we measure things, oh, that went up 10%, 20%. Spear phishing email attacks have increased 667% since COVID, you know, not 5%, 10%. I mean, that alone, you know, for an IT manager or a security manager in a corporate environment. And then, like I said, the devices now, you know, where I'm sitting, you know, I got kids that are doing school or whatever the case may be, a spouse working remotely all, we're all on the same network. So I think it's gonna be real challenging for, you know, the IT infrastructure manager.  And, you know, as you said, as we bring more people into using the network and using it from unsecured locations on home computers, we are our biggest problem, you know. I think AI will play a huge role in it. You know, as we discussed earlier, I mean, it's got its own challenges, but I think that's going to, I don't think it's gonna be the savior for it, but I think it's going to help, you know, the IT manager or enterprise manager as that progresses. And do you think the good guys can use AI to advantage better than the bad guys? And, you know, when I asked that question, I'm acutely aware, I don't know if you read Kai Fu Li's book about the AI race between the US and China.  So I wonder what AI is gonna do to the security landscape, you know, will it be a net help or, you know, can AI engineer attacks that we are simply incapable of dealing with? It's, I mean, it's a good, I mean, it's definitely a good topic. I think if you look back at all the greatest technologies that we've seen, they're as much of a pro they are, they are a con because it gives other people the same tools.   The one comment I'd make on AI is that although it will help both the good guys and the bad guys, it also gives additional access points to a network. So, you know, if you think of all the AI in just a hospital environment, medical facility, you name it, it just doubles, triples and quadruples the amount of access points that, you know, the network can become vulnerable. An interesting stat that I read this morning, which I just was blown away at, that just came out that if you look at the healthcare data breach, it's the most expensive per breach incident at $7 million and it outpaces that by 10% of over last year. When you think about that and the number of incidents this year or 2019, there were 572 data breaches in the healthcare data industry. Just look at them up, crazy. I'm not a security expert, I just deploy infrastructure that hopefully that works and is secure. Yeah. Well, I think Jeff, one comment that I would want to go in is that you spoke about the fact of one of the three or four big things that the COVID thing, when you look at the pandemic, what has it got to the four? One of the things that I think, instead of looking at what are the big issues or the big security risks, I look at what is the solution to that? So one of the big things that, at least we tell our customers at BDX is because we specialize a security solution and try to go and tell our customers, how do you protect yourselves? In respect of, this happened, we created the product much before the pandemic, but how do you look at identity? At the end of the day, if you can recognize who's doing what, it's a camera that is trying to access a network or if it is a human that is trying to access a network and if it is a human, who is he? So our focus to security starts from that. So BDX armor that we speak about, we start talking about it in terms of who is the person? What's the identity? If I can manage the identity of that person, then, and I use a reputation database to look at the identity, then I think we've looked at 30 to 40% of the problem being solved, right? So that's our first focus area identity. So I look at that as among top three solutions to the problems that we face. And we've seen so many jurisdictions, particularly in the US and in Europe, going away from some of the identity basings, facial recognition and other things, to understand the identity of people and places like China that have done such a great job of managing COVID through security means that many in the US, as an example, would find unacceptable. I mean, that certainly had health implications because we're unwilling to go there. But again, Kai-Fu Li in his book, The AI Superpowers made the point that, AI and AI development, the fuel for AI is data and databases on which to learn. And China is way ahead of any of the rest of the world in collecting data and feeding that into the AI engine. I thought it was a fascinating book. And his conclusion is that China's gonna beat the West in the AI war, and he has the background to have an informed opinion. I thought it was a fascinating book. I don't know if anybody has any comment on any of that as it relates to security in particular. Well, that's an interesting thing. I mean, how do you balance privacy with identity, right? And then you look at a global company like us, right? How do you look at bringing a reputation and signature with the AI engine that builds up reputation, right? And without infringing on the privacy piece, right? So, and that's where we've done some really good work and created our entire security architecture based on that, because the fact that if you put the China way, you will not probably be able to look at a global customer base. And we have a pretty much top names in the industry. So they will not look to us in terms of providing solutions with respect to BDX armor. If I go and say, hey, you know, we a little bit here and there as far as privacy is concerned, that might not sail through, right? So we're very concerned in terms of the way identity is used, but there are a lot of ways that you can use the AI which you brought out very clearly in terms of looking at an identity signature which can be anonymized. And that's where we have specialized it. Interesting. Eric, you've brought out a number of points specific to the healthcare sector. And I wasn't, some of the sort of level of breach and the impact of breaches in the health care sector is to be candid, a little bit of news to me, I'm more familiar with some of the big commercial breaches that we read about, but what do you think are some of the top challenges that healthcare networks face, particularly as a result of the COVID epidemic? Yeah, I think one of the biggest thing that all healthcare networks are feeling the pain now is the distribution of all of their remote employees, their laptops, their networks. And you've really seen kind of a lull in the last couple of months, but just yesterday or the day before, lifespan, which is a system up in Rhode Island had to pay $1.4 million on one laptop that was disposed of improperly, that was unsecured and didn't have the correct encryption. And so you'll see HIPAA and the office of, who else is doing it, the Office for Civil Rights, I mean, they're gonna start levying some just massive fines. And that's gonna catch the attention of these IT directors that they've gotta get their houses in line. And if they don't, it's gonna be a very expensive lesson to learn. Unfortunately. And I just bring up those two examples just because I came up on one of my feeds this morning and I'm going, well, this is a perfect topic for today. And that's one laptop, one laptop. 1.1 million, 400,000, Ms. Grace. I just think the way the networks are structured, you can listen to all of them if you go into Becker's or whoever, you see all these CIOs coming out and saying, look, we've deployed all these devices out in the field and we didn't have a choice. Now we're in a motive like, did we do it right? What do we have to mop up? What do we have to fix? It's gonna be an ongoing issue from now until a long time. I thought to Suji's earlier point that is, that, I think every IT director is, loses sleep over, what if it happens to me? Trust it, it will happen to you. So, just to develop those plans, what do you do then, have those plans in place? Yeah, it's not if it's when. I mean, that's the attitude you have to take. Absolutely. I think one of the toughest things that we do as a company is to try to convince an IT organization within a healthcare environment that hasn't had surgeries going on so their revenues are falling, they're dealing with COVID, and now all of a sudden it's time to rebuild this infrastructure and they're like, I don't know where to go. But if you don't do it, then you're back in the same situation you were prior to COVID. So, it's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Yeah. So Sam, are there anything special in the Atlanta area that, how are these challenges affecting you guys? Yeah, I think that for our KoloATL business, we've just seen a big influx of customers buying more bandwidth in general, adding more carriers, buying more bandwidth, adding more capacity into their networks that they have. And I think so, unlike the rest of the economy, we've been on a kind of a slow steady growth phase during this whole thing, which is great for us, but I just think that we're gonna continue that. And in the American Tower business, the same thing with the 5G rollout and all the new communication infrastructure that's going in, we're continuing to grow during this whole process. So, we're probably one of the few right spots that is out there because just what we do. You know, at I-Mason's, we had a set of meetings, global member summits. And the first one was focused on the Americas region. And one of the speakers was Noel Walsh, the head of cloud infrastructure for Microsoft. And this was April 22nd. So, a little early in the pen, it had fully set on, but kind of right in the upswing, I'll say. And we were talking about increased traffic. And she said, within Microsoft, they had ramped up their capacity by 100 megawatts in two weeks, increased capacity. And they were able, you know, her infrastructure group was able to deliver that. I thought, wow, holy cow. You know, change your base load by 100 megawatts and pull it off in two weeks. That's impressive. It's a big, it's a big capable team, but geez. That's a lot. That's a lot of data center. Yeah. What does anybody else see in terms of just volume increase and it's a funny industry to be in this times. I hear so much, you know, paying an economic devastation and then to be in our little bubble of infrastructure here and to see the, as you said, not only steady growth, but rock being growth. And in some ways, I, you know, I think it was April where I read that the market cap of Zoom who'd been in business, I don't know, a year or something. And I forgot what that exactly, but it was, but exceeded that of one of the big oil companies, three of the biggest airlines and, you know, a few other kind of traditional businesses combined. It's like in a year from launch, it's like, wow, what economic upheaval we're hearing. Geez, it's incredible. Yeah, Jeff. I mean, we haven't seen a ton of change in traffic. We've seen a ton in the traffic patterns.   And I think a lot of people expected certain things to crash and, you know, burn to the ground as a result of everybody going home to work. And it was quite the opposite. I mean, yes, were there pixelation and some bandwidth issues across different networks? Absolutely. You know, I think the security aspects out of it for now, but I think a lot of people were pleasantly surprised that most networks held their own just the way the patterns had shifted. But I think it's going to get a little more interesting now with how that shift, as I said earlier, you know, with people being home and the devices and the security aspect of it. I think that's where it's gonna be our biggest challenges over the next 36 months is definitely on security.   Next year, it'll do 600G, be able to turn that up, you know, at the flick of a finger as well. But now I got to secure it all. I'm worried and I made a small, you know, list and, you know, preparing for this, things like, I know, probably like a lot of you, I can go on an app on my phone and unlock my car doors, remote start the car. You know, what happens as that expands and gets more, the other one that I noted, supply chain hacks or attacks.  Again, that's part of that supply chain. You know, what happens when that gets attacked or, you know, there's a detriment to that industry. You know, the FedEx is the UPS is DHL's, the Postal Service, down to the manufacturing side of it.  How can you now surpass biometrics? Because some points to people to start to consider. Yeah, it's a brave new world indeed. The name of this webinar is crazy. So, you know, one of the other things that I want to look at is, you know, Chris actually brought it very, very, you know, pointed, pointedly, is what's happening on the IoT world, right? So you look at, you know, just look at the data center industry, what we focused on, the network is going, you spoke about Microsoft, you spoke about 100 megawatt in a couple of weeks, and that's huge, right? And you're talking about a couple of terabytes of, you know, network bandwidth increase in a data center. And we've seen that, right? So that's a huge amount of, so if I look at my Singapore facility, we've got around 11-0 operators out there, right? In the MMR room. You've seen everybody making good money, right? So when we looked at how we run our data centers, we believe on minimally manned data centers. We use a lot of IoT in our data centers, a lot of automation in our data centers, which means if this is hacked, this entire facility could go down just like that. So how do you ensure that, you know, you look at securing all of these, not with the thought that, you know, it's never going to happen. I've put up the best in place.  So what's the next piece? So making a failsafe data center is all about looking at what if this happens?  You never get it in control. Yeah. Well, Eric, I want to maybe wrap with, to invite you to give us any, you know, wisdom from the healthcare sector in this time of COVID, with I imagine not only are the, you know, direct service providers, you know, the doctors and nurses and staff under stress in the healthcare sector. And we all, you know, admire their service and dedication, but I imagine the IT side of healthcare is stressing right now too. Any comments there? Yeah. So I've got both personal and professional experiences. My wife is a COO and a CNO of University of North Carolina healthcare system here. And so I watch her come home every day after dealing with just crazy loads of stress based on patients, you know, staff, visitors, what have you. If you haven't thanked a healthcare hero, you better do it because they put up with a lot of stuff that nobody ever sees. It's just crazy. And then professionally, the good news is that hospitals are starting to accept visitors, accept, you know, business meetings, it's still pretty virtual, but, you know, I've got a few things scheduled the next few weeks where I'm actually going to be walking into a few hospitals and, you know, I've been in the healthcare space for 30 plus years. So it's a space I'm very familiar with and not afraid. And there's a lot of misinformation out there. So educate yourself. That's all I can say. I appreciate the opportunity today. Well, I think we'll let this wrap up the discussion. Let's all thank our healthcare providers and the frontline workers. And I think our industry deserves to be thanked as well. We are the builders of the digital age and without the work that everybody on this call does every day, we wouldn't be having this, you know, go-to-meeting conference, this virtual conference. So let's recognize the good work that we all do and thank the healthcare workers. So I want to thank Sam and Eric and Christopher and Sujit for joining the panel today. And Carl, do you have a segue here to usher people off to the LinkedIn discussion? Absolutely. Yes, again, thank you everyone for your insight and time on spending with us today on this panel.  I just want to, you know, once again, shout out to you, Jeff as executive director of infrastructure masons for keeping us on point today. And yes, absolutely. Our speakers are staying on for the remainder of the lunch hour. We're moving over towards LinkedIn. Just search for hashtag JSA virtual roundtables or click the direct link that was placed in the chat box to continue the Q and A. And of course, if you were one of our first 100 registrants, we hope you enjoyed your lunch. Go ahead and visit us at jsa.net to register for upcoming JSA virtual roundtables, including our next one on August 20th, which will be offering tips for hurricane network preparedness. Well, that's a wrap. Look out for the playback of today's roundtable coming soon to JSA TV and JSA podcasts on YouTube, iTunes, iHeart, Spotify, and more. In the meantime, see you over on LinkedIn. Happy networking. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks everyone.


Neurodiverse students are essentially special needs learners who possess academic challenges related to conditions of brain functioning. The initiative, which ended last week in St. Lucia, focused on the educational needs of children specifically diagnosed with autism, ADHD, and dyslexia, delivered by Lesley University's Institute for English Language Programs Beyond Borders in collaboration with the Authentic Caribbean Foundation, the ACF, the activity benefited some 100 teachers locally. Education officer for special education, Dale Sashis, says this will boost government efforts to provide critical support to children with special needs through the specialized training to teachers. The idea here is that rather than send children away to be supported for their educational needs, we want to be able to provide educational support within the classrooms, within the normal spaces, together with their pairs. So what will happen as a result of this training activity is that these teachers will now be able to go back and know how to provide differentiated instruction in the classroom so that children who are typically developing as well as those who have special needs can both be educated in the same setting. The Authentic Caribbean Foundation, ACF, founded in 2012, is a non-profit organization based in Boston and is committed to transforming the lives of Caribbean children and their caregivers impacted by disabilities and HIV AIDS through the provision of health and educational support. Teacher assigned to the special education unit Vanessa Menal says the ACF collaboration is delivering hands-on training that will redown to efficient support to neurodiverse learners. These are the children who are in the typical classroom, so the teachers have to be able to provide the necessary interventions for those children, especially because now we are in a time when there is a very push towards inclusion. These children are in the regular classroom, so yes, they need that support. I must also say that it is not only for the teachers who are in the general ed setting providing the support for the students, but we also have the teachers at the special schools also attending this training. The initiative was created in partnership with the Ministry of External Affairs, 3D Island's Embassy in Washington, D.C. and Miami Consulate. This program will be offered in the future. It will be offered to healthcare workers and the community stakeholders to deal directly and indirectly with persons with disabilities. The follow-up training initiative for social and healthcare workers and other community stakeholders has been planned for later in 2021. From the Communications Unit of the Ministry of Education, Innovation, Gender Relations and Sustainable Development, I am Chris Satney reporting.