to the Moortown Select Board. It's Tuesday, August 17th. Tonight, Erin Lee, John Kogogu in the meeting room. Thank you all for coming. I'm gonna start on the first agenda item. We have general public comments. Is there anyone here for general public comments? I just have a comment regarding the legal trail issues that have been brought up a lot lately. We did a site visit on legal trail 15, and it keeps being a mistake if the minutes weren't corrected on 7, 6, 2021. It keeps saying legal trail 18. That would bring you into a whole other part of the town. I think they call it show-eager trail. All right, we'll look at the meeting minutes and rectify those next meeting. Anything else, Travis? No, thank you. Thank you. All right, is there anyone else for general public comments? All right, seeing none, we'll move on to the next agenda item. We have the Mad River Valley Rack District Committee, and we're looking for Mr. Rosenberg. Is that you, sir? I'm here, yeah, hi. How are you doing today?  Yeah, this is my son, Sonny. Hey, how are you doing, son? Yeah, yeah. Maybe you can imagine that. Well, thank you for coming, and you've submitted a letter to take the place of Eric Kittrude on the committee. Right, yeah. Oh, so we moved here about a year ago. We're just looking for opportunities where we can go, and this seemed like a committee that needed a seat filled. This seemed like a pretty straightforward and administrative decision. I've been the president of my condo board and broken for almost 10 years now. Some familiar sort of basic board procedure, and then anything sort of administratively, or a communicator, I'm happy to sort of work on a team and sort of do whatever I can to help keep that committee moving forward. Well, great. I don't think it'll be anything close to being the president of the condo association. It's a small building. Broke by the way. You said broke by the way? Yeah. So how'd you find more town? That is a good question and a long story, so keep it quick. But we came over to the Mad River Valley last summer. We had a rental house in Mormon, but it was really just the house looked nice. So we ended up there. And then as soon as we went in here, we realized that we weren't gonna be able to bring him sort of back safely into school in the fall last year, back in Brooklyn. We decided we were just gonna make it full go of it and live up here four times. So we started looking for property and the house we found happened to be in Moretown. Just a lucky coincidence, because we love Moretown. The location is perfect for us. The towns we grade at the schools are fantastic. Everyone's been super welcoming. So we're very happy to be the planning house we found here. Certainly welcome. I didn't mean to put you on the spot there. I'm interested, it's nice that we have people moving in and we would just like to see who draws them here. So thanks. It'll be a very, the committee is, I'm not even certain how we meet quarterly, Sasha. Sasha, she's our assistant. She's over here. She can get you the information when they're meeting and get you to set up there. So maybe you can get some meeting minutes and find out what's going on. But we certainly appreciate you putting your hand up and willing to do this. Yeah, it won't be a big stretch, but it's a fun thing. It's the Meadow Valley Rack District.  We don't have, only voting is on the fields themselves, other things that we kind of stay out in that area there. But anyways, anyone else, questions for Mr. Rosenberg? I just hope you come in more fast. Oh, we will. 25th. We get to hang out, right? Yeah, you'll be there. Very good, all right, so. Any things? Oh, no. All right. It starts on the greenest Saturday and we're listening to that game driving up, unfortunately. So I would move to appoint Sam Rosenberg to the Maddenberg Valley Rack District. John, I'm going to be glad to hear you. If you know further questions, all in favor, go back. All right, Sam, there you go. Thank you guys. Thank you very much. And if you'll excuse me, I'm going to run now, too. Absolutely. Been very good. All right, very good. Thank you to everybody. Thank you guys. We'll see you on the 25th. We'll see you on the 25th. So Joyce, we have you calming the traffic. These troopers came in, once they heard you were on the agenda, you were going to calm the traffic. So they wanted to learn. Should I come up here? Yeah, please, I'm sorry, please. Hello everyone. Hi Joyce. Hi Joyce. So, calming the traffic. So this is an effort that's been going on for about six months, I think. I've been talking to John and Don about various issues in Moretown. And we've had lots of back and forth with various people at V-TRANS and at the Center for Environmental Planning Commission. And I have sent a document. Oh, somebody has it. Somebody else has it. Oh, you all have it? You all have it? You all have it? Excellent. Excellent. Excellent. So I tried to collect the most informative missives that I received in order to give you all the same information that I have. And I think what has to happen next is that you all have to decide what the priorities are. Because we can't do everything that's on this list. And everything, of course, thinks a little bit of bureaucratic pushing. So we can start with the easy one, maybe. I've been warned that there are people who would like to see a mirror at the intersection of 100 B and the Moretown Mountain Road. Would that crazy curve happen? Right. We had a guest last week that came in and asked about it. Oh, I see. OK. Wasn't really pushed. So we look and see what you think. OK. Well, unfortunately, if you're thinking about putting a mirror in the state right of way, that cannot happen. BTrans does not allow that. And I noted here that they're worried about those mirrors because they can create glare, especially at night. And because they can be confusing to drivers who don't know the intersection and can't tell where they're looking, where the mirror is showing them. So they say. OK. So there is a set of FAQs that talks about mirrors. And if you can get off the state right of way, then you can install a mirror if that's what you want to do. So that's a possibility. Any questions or discussion with that? I don't think so. That was a big priority of ours. OK. All right. So then we'll move on to some issues that came up through John and Dawn. And I finally got a good response from a new guy at BTrans, John Kaplan, who is the manager of the bike and ped program. So let's see. First off, there was this issue about a speed sign before the new bridge right down here on 100B. And at the time that I wrote, there was no sign. And that was supposed to be there. And I was told that it was, I don't know, something happened to it. It was knocked down, but now it's been replaced. So the speed sign, 30 miles per hour, is now there. So that took care of one issue. Second issue was, well, OK, my numbering is not the best. But anyway, then we talked about sidewalks and crosswalks and pedestrian safety in the village of Moretown. So there's lots of information here. And V-Trans has its opinions about crosswalks and sidewalks and thinking that what's there is OK. There is another project that's coming to do the sidewalk on the west side of 100B. And the question is, do we really need that sidewalk? And do we want people crossing the road from one side to the other? So if you do want to change the sidewalk project at this point, it would take some work. It means undoing what's been done to set up that project. So that would take some work. If you want a different sidewalk and a different location or a crosswalk or whatever, then I think Ian DeBattis is the Degoutis. Degoutis, how do you say his name? Ian DeGoutis may be the person to talk to. I think they're already going to have that in their plans. The extra crosswalks across the story of the town hall. I think somewhere in that area, far by the post office or? Yeah, so that's in the sidewalk plans. OK. Well, they did paint one here. I don't know if everybody noticed.  Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, it's just like that. Yeah, they did put that on and painted that one in the other day. Yeah. OK. So that's good. All right. And I also, someone was telling me that Carrie Domen is actually working or brought up some legislation because there's apparently a regulation that in order to have a crosswalk, you have to have two sidewalks, regulation sidewalks. And I guess she's brought up some legislation to see if that can be changed, that it can be a crosswalk without having a so-called rate, nothing to do with water. Sorry, I know Wastefield is working. They have a whole thing going on, trying to work on traffic calming and transportation issues and stuff, and I don't know if that's where that came out or not. And I just thought I'd throw that out there. So it hasn't passed? Oh, no, not that I know. OK, I can check on that. Yeah, I can. OK, that's interesting. All right. And then there was discussion of bike lanes. So there is a description here of what it takes to get a bike lane, minimum width of the bike lane, adjacent to curbing, is five feet. So it talks about how you could configure the road if you wanted to put in a bike lane if there's room. When a paving project comes through, that would be a good time to add bike lane markings, which is, yes. So maybe V-chance is going to measure the next time they come through. So I don't know if you want to push harder on this or wait until they measure and see if it's possible. I don't think it's going to be a problem. You know, these widen them? No. They're going to determine my opinion. Well, if the sidewalk doesn't happen, then there could be configuration. But the sidewalk is going to have to. Not looking good for bike lanes. OK, so the next issue was a radar speed feedback sign, one of these signs that lights up and blinks at you if you're going too fast. And there is agency guidance about all that that I've put in at the end of this. Actually, it probably didn't print out for you, because you've got to print out, right? But you can find it on the V-chance website if you need to. So it says there's already one of these speed signs, a blue-green radar speedback sign. North of the school for self-found traffic. Any additional sign, a radar sign would be the responsibility of the town through an 1111 permit, blah, blah, blah. The cost would be on the town. And you need to have a speed study first. So again, we're running into a little. Can I question you on that? So if there's already a sign, which we've had a speed study for to put that sign up, we've already justified putting up a speed sign, why would we need to do another speed study? Well, apparently they tell you they give you one. They give you one sign for a study. You know, to the same road. Going in and directing? Yeah, I think it has to be where the study is. It would have been right there at the school. And if we wanted to flip one further south on the other side of the bridge, that would be the location to do the study, which could be different. I don't see how it could be more than 30 miles per hour. Entering into the direction. Well, what about the other part of this other idea? And I'm sort of trying to put it ahead of you there. I could move the existing sign to relocate that. So the question is, would you have to have a speed study to relocate some? I don't know. Yeah, I would imagine you would. Probably so. Where are we thinking we put it all the way down by the bridge coming into town? Which is where it should be. Which is really where it should be. And also make before it may. And move the one that's on the hill. Before Maynard's? Well, somewhere up in that vicinity. Before the curve? I mean, it's very different. You go by Maynard's. It's 40 going by Maynard's, which is what it is right now. And then you're seeing a sign that says 30 miles an hour ahead, one of those warning signs. And that's really nice, you get down the hill and you're almost to the cemetery. That's when you first start to see 30 mile an hour speed limit. But coming down that, a car with momentum, unless you're really being a courteous driver, you're coming down the hill at 40, 45, maybe 50. So people are coming past Freeman Hill Road and around that corner. These guys could probably attest to it. So in the town at a good rate of speed until they see them get to the flash out. Maybe before, I think, if you put it before Maynard's, they're going to pick up that speed again going down that hill. So if you go around the corner before the Freeman Hill, the cemetery, maybe right before the cemetery on the right-hand side, although it was a curb there, you would think that would slow people down, but it really doesn't really. But if you see it at the top of the hill? Right, in the deer. Joyce, maybe we could see what kind of difficulty it would be to move those. You were stuck. Yeah, I mean, I would think that if we had a warning sign that reduced food zone before Maynard's. Right, good to know that. Yeah, that might make sense. I'm really supportive of the radar speed feedbacks on that. I think they work well. I mean, I know it's myself. I think they really catch your attention. Right. Even if the town has to invest in them, I think it's still a good investment. I agree. I think one other thought, and I don't know if it was Joyce how this can ever be approached. I mean, it's going to take a long time before we, as a society, come to grips with how we are in our cars and how we share the road and how we become courteous again. But even a meeting I went to once with then Lieutenant Reverend Scott was speaking to us the very same thing about courtesy. The thing that I find very interesting is if you take someone coming here, you come off of 89, you go through Middlesex Village, it goes from 40 to 35, and then you take the turn on to 100B and it's 35, and then you get down to other dam and it goes to 50. And there's not another speed sign until you get to almost, to pass your house where it says to slow down to 40.  But in any event, I wonder if something can be done even there, just to the speeds on 100B could be dealt with. I mean, maybe another sign that says 50 miles an hour or somewhere along the way instead of it just, you know. I mean, I know besides asking for more patrol, you can only do so much to the sheriff and the state police. So anyway, is it just another comment in the traffic comment discussion as far as traffic? I mean, you're supposed to have the sign anytime there's a side road that comes out for people who turn on to the road. I don't know. Isn't that correct? That's the way it was when we put up the village or the signs in the moment. We're heading on the village all the more town. Yeah, more town, yeah. When we change gas speed limits, there's signs I think at every intersection. That's correct. And I thought it was the same way with the state. I don't know. Another thing with the state roads is any road that isn't posted is a 50 mile an hour zone. So most of your state roads that are 50 aren't posted because it's in statute that an unposted road is on a micro 50 miles an hour. So that's true. That's a big issue. That's a large issue. Yeah, I agree with Joe. Exactly. It's like more town nowadays when you hit a road there, waiting for it's posted. Yeah. Now they're doing more of 70. Yeah, and to that gentleman's point, in the traffic calming discussion, it's going to be a continual thing. It's not just tonight. It's something to work on. I think in the long run, if we as a board could try to help figure out how the traffic on our, the speeds on our back, on the dirt roads in our town, all the towns, it's just, it's ridiculous how fast people drive on those roads. You know, 35 posted is, someone's doing 40 or 45. And it's, our society is, I mean, maybe that makes sense if it ever did back in the 50s or 60s or something. But now, especially with COVID, our new world of COVID, people are running more, and walking more, and biking more, and they're out of the roads more. And there's more families. There's more people on our, living on our roads.  And it also translates to the cost of upkeeping our roads, because the higher speeds on the roads chair up the road. So it's, it's a constant, you know, I think it's a problem. And I know I've been told that you can't lower the speeds on our roads without going through a whole thing with the state and doing a traffic study, and it's $35,000. And it's, you know, but the whole thing is, the state should take. Good question about the signs. Do we ever go back over these roads to see if they're properly sign, signage, like Ray was speaking about, like every intersection has been brought up tonight? Do they ever go back, like, after they've been put signs up and to make sure they're still properly signed everywhere? I think we'll leave it up to our, our road foreman to, in his inspection of the roads, I think, here in town. Yeah, Martin, both guys, I can't speak for the state if there's an auditor that goes out on those, but Martin or any of the crew, they're really, usually, typically pretty good, or someone in the community says hey, someone knocked a sign over. We don't, there's no SOP as far as this will do. I don't know, you ever get this or something? I know it's a few signs that we've been down for years, you know, and the posts and stuff are still there, but the sign is. You know what to do, but let us, yeah, let us know. Well, it's still over there. You know, we do count on community input, you know, if somebody sees something wrong, or... Yeah, we're happy to take a look at it and see what the sign was and if it needs to be redone. All right, Joyce, let's move on to Gallinger Acres. Gallinger Acres, right. So, the issue here is that there are lots of families living in Gallinger Acres. There's no way to walk from Gallinger Acres into Waterbury. And we think that there might be some demand for that. So, yes, they're saying it seems reasonable to think that you might want sidewalks there. You have to put sidewalk in the highway, state highway right away. So you have to get a state highway access permit from VTRANS. They did look at that and they do think that there's space for sidewalks, that's a good thing. I've actually walked that lunch trying to get the snow fire after I get off the bus, the transit bus, and it's all horrible. It's horrible because it's a place to walk. Okay. Yeah, there's another road there. Fairground road. Fairground road. There's folks in there too, right? Yeah, absolutely. Yes. So, they're suggesting that we try for the bike-ped grant program, small-scale bike-ped grant program, which does not require scoping studies. That's good. That cuts down the time a little bit. The next round of that is April 2022. So it gives time to prepare for that a little bit. And they're saying that we could probably get help from CDRPC if we wanted to move on that. There's another alternative, which is the Transportation Alternatives program, but they don't have a small, small-scale program, so they're recommending that we try the bike-ped grant program. They do say that getting some scoping, a feasibility study of a sidewalk might be a good idea so that we know something about the construction cost and feasibility. But certainly, if you want to move forward with that, I can talk to the Regional Planning Commission folks and see how to line things up to get it moving. No, I think that's a great idea. It definitely needs it. We have a lot of people who've been there in the last few years. And if you can keep Cheryl Min copied on your correspondence, because she looks typically... I mean, she looks like she is the one who's doing the grant stuff for us. So if she's aware of what's going on, that would mean a good start over there. Okay. Right, so I included some earlier emails, but basically they're talking about this sign down by the grid that Mr. Pierre did not want to reappear, so that's fair. So there's plenty of information and lots of, you know, bureaucratic stuff to think about if you want to push forward with any of these. But what I've got on my list is investigate moving the radar speed sign closer to the main entrance, right? Yeah, we'll go by just by the street in the hill. Yeah, between main entrance and the street in the hill. Okay. Now, do you go over that bridge, you think? Yeah, maybe we can all take a walk down some time for a drive together and see where we're going. I mean, troopers, you know, some suggestions on that. I was thinking along your lines with that sharp curve there, people can only go so fast through that, but if you're saying they're continuing on past there, it might be good. I think you said back before the new bridge there, as they come down, that's probably it. I think earlier the better as opposed, because most people, you know, even myself included, it's like, you don't want to be the one that's going fast when there's cars behind you.  So the sooner you can get the momentum if there's a line of cars coming out of the valley, I think that's probably your best bet. So whatever you think is a good spot, back it up a little more. That's kind of my philosophy. And on the north side here, what would you think? I'm just trying to think of the geography there. Are you saying as people come... So you come around the bridge there, and they just continue on, and they start smoking it. Yeah, it's a pretty flat stretch, right through there by the garage. Before the sand. Yeah, I would say maybe just past that bridge. I mean, just on this side of the bridge, throw there, because you have the S-curves and then the bridge, right? Yeah. Maybe by the Eckers there or something. Yeah. Eckers, Eckers. He's been called worse. I've called him worse. And also just to throw something out, if you guys are looking at doing additional speed studies, I know several communities have portable signs that they can actually move rather easily that are either battery operated. I think most of them are battery operated. You recharge them, you affix a frame to a sign, and you can actually move them to different places. The sign could actually, you know, you can have it on the north end of the village at one point, and for a couple of days you're going to recharge it and take it down to the southern end, and as long as you're doing speed studies, it might behoove you to do either end of the village at the same point. If the town is purchasing one sign, make it one that's capable of being moved to either end of the village, and that way you kind of get a little bit more bang for your buck. You get two locations where you can put up your speed sign but only have one sign obviously. There's one sign in one spot at a time, but you can move it back and forth. There's several village areas that I'm aware of that do that exact same thing.  Do they record data or do they guess? I think some of them are capable of doing that, but I believe they're going to be like your fixed signs that have like the solar panels and things that are more constant, that have the ability to plug into those. But there could be some updated technology out there that allows you to capture data on those portables. So who's responsible for moving the sign after two days charging up and moving it down the road? I know a town. Yes, we had a road foreman or someone in the town with the best sit interest in moving around. Sasha would be that person. Did her something else. You can put that as conceivably on a back dirt road as well. Anywhere. Yeah, that's really the same thing as you can put it around and get several poles. So does the state rent those to the town or is something the town would have to? You know, it would be a purchase, the town would purchase those, yeah. Do you guys have access to the mobile ones that we sell? We do. Yep. Obviously there's a pretty big demand across the 18 towns that we cover, so we rotated through that different something that we could put more time in the rotation for sure. We'll finish up giving Joyce and then we'll put you guys for a couple minutes. Sure. Right, so I think I'm done. Alright, so we'll do your back for me. You're always good about that. We'd appreciate that, Joyce. Okay. I have a few things on my list. Okay, very good. Very good. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thanks for coming in. Yeah. Spend the time and meet you with everyone. Sure. No problem. See you at work, Joyce. Okay. Alright, so when we're on, we have Vermont State Police, we have Lieutenant White and Trooper Stackhouse. You guys want to roll forward? Sure. First, again, thank you gentlemen. Yeah, these are quick. Yeah. We raced after each other. I'm the champion. Thanks guys again for coming. We have a couple things. We want to bring up the first traffic commonly as you've heard, some speeding issues that we're having, and then Callie and Ray want to and the whole board, but they're looking at ATVs and usage in the town and perhaps opening up a road or something, so we want to get on that. You know what you thought, so. But starting off and also when we're speaking with the speeding, I guess one of the first things is right now, we don't have coverage only with what you guys can afford to do with 18 towns and probably, I don't know how many people are sure you are, if you're people short. You know, it's probably a limited time that you can come through here. So one of the things when you get back in the office is maybe you can put a proposal together for if you're doing that hours in addition to what you're on a contract. On a contract basis. We've done that in the past with the Sheriff's Office. But we like to see kind of what you guys have and you're right close by or close by for the immediate future anyways. Yeah. But we need to share a little bit about what you do in town and then we can just ask some questions. Yeah, so we ran some numbers just in the last from August of last year to August of this year just to kind of give you a 12 month snapshot of what we've been responding to in more town. So in that one year snapshot we had 190 calls for service in the town of Moortown and of note 102 of those are thus far in 2021. So the first eight months of 2021 I was captured more than half of those of those calls for service. On the motor vehicle side of things we had nine motor vehicle complaints most of which were in the winter time for vehicles off the road or things like that issued 38 warnings and 21 tickets within the town of Moortown and of the 190 calls we had arrested eight folks from everything from stocking 3 DUIs restrained order violations theft, disorderly conduct and domestics. A whole gamut of different types of calls here in town in the last year and just to speak on where we're at not unlike any other law enforcement agency or any other barracks throughout the state or throughout the country right now we're experiencing staffing shortages the biggest majority of us for middle sex is we've got three folks that are deployed currently and aren't due back until at least February or March of 2022 we have one individual who's away on four months of extended training but when she returns the entire area will benefit because she's training up a new canine so our former canine handler retired her dog and now has a new dog so they're going through basic training so we will be back up online here towards the end of the year at least for tracking and then early next year, February and March time should be gone for another six weeks for drug training but then the dog will be up fully online for our canine asset back at the barracks and then above and beyond that we have two outstanding vacancies at the barracks which brings us to six which in retrospect that's a little more than one quarter of our workforce on the average on a weekly basis we have we have between 42 and 48 shifts that we cover so that's about three people per shift and so with those three people per shift we're covering 18 plus the interstate from Waterbury down to Frostbury so we're stressed pretty thin right now but I think like I said it's not unique to middle sex everyone across Vermont and across the country is having staffing issues right now so the good thing is we're slated for one individual we graduated the basic academy on Friday and due to COVID the academy had kind of had to shift normally they do two classes every year one in January and one in July with COVID they had to cut that back so they started in May so and originally in 2021 they were a calendar year in 2021 they were only expecting about one class they're actually starting another one right off in October right now we have 17 people that are assigned to go into that class so overall just the state police it's going to take us a while to get back but at least the academy is helping us out by going ahead and jump starting and kind of have that class really quick so and then it'll be having state police put 17 through that accounts for over half of the normal compliment of the academy class so we're taking up as many spaces as we can get with the hopes that come February and March they'll kick off another class and then hopefully by the end of 2022 maybe we'll be on the same back in the same schedule having two classes a year it doesn't sound like much when you say we've only missed one class the last two years but when you think about 12 bodies that we don't have just in state police much less the rest of the state so it accounts for a lot and that's without the normal attrition of retirements and people looking elsewhere and going to the feds and different stuff like that so which we've had our fair share of so it's a little grand right now but we're looking for the lighter the light at the end of the tunnel so that's the direction at least it's 190 calls that actually shocked me I was going to add that's probably a lot lower than a normal year because we experienced during COVID that the call volume although the severity of the calls was I think there was more family fights more DUI crashes but there was much last last year so I'd say in a normal year I should have looked into that maybe 2019 but I would guess maybe it was cut in half but I think that's a pretty low number and it's kind of shocking to think oh just a little more town you know yeah well thank you appreciate what you guys do it's our job we certainly appreciate what you do but that is what the trend was throughout the country that COVID the whole shutdown of COVID really brought on a lot more yeah we just found there's a lot more stuff going on in people's houses and people weren't getting out so for sure well we have certainly lots of challenges especially when you tell that we have that many calls you know certainly when you are going through speeding is a priority here it's one of the things that really you heard different people talk here tonight that's the one thing that's visual too we don't see many calls so in that contract that's what we'd be looking for not just in the village areas but in the back roads watch one of us get pulled over it happens we used to do the contract for East Montpelier I've met a lot of people the first time on the side of the road it's one of those things that I think we all tried but that's why those blink and sign saved me I just on the road all the time and not I don't try to speed but just sometimes you know that so I think those are very effective so the other thing and maybe Cali and Ray you guys want to talk about is the ATB ordinance that we're thinking of or roads that we're thinking of opening and what you guys thoughts are about your experience in different areas so what do you guys want to tell them kind of where we're thinking of doing that and what's going on around here yeah sure so it seems like more and more towns are living in ATBs and ATBs on the roads and you know more town particularly I live on the Jones Brook area there's a lot of last four roads you know so there's a fair about ATB traffic on the roads and even now even though they're not supposed to be there and I'm of the feeling that that making an ATB ordinance and enforcing that is better off than where we are in it which is you know I can honestly say in that area are ground destroyed riding and you know the older people like myself but there is a lot of people that come in from like Berry and ride the other roads up there and it gets a little wild at times but that's not the only problem it's a lot of problems also with Jeeps and other big trucks as well so I guess we're looking for a little feedback what is the experience any towns that have the ATB ordinance thus far how is it working out for you do you guys partake in the enforcement or is that Fish and Wildlife so I guess my first question is are these the roads that you're looking at do they link up like the VASA trail system in any way so the Fish and Wildlife VASA actually is contracted through has contracted Fish and Wildlife to enforce the laws on the VASA trails so the ATV violations and stuff like that unless they happen right in front of us they're typically not something that that we deal with we don't have ATVs so we don't have any the ATVs that we have are for search and rescue or you know just different stuff we don't have anything that's kind of tied in for patrolling that sort of stuff snowmobiles is a little bit different but the ATV stuff we don't even have an outlet to patrol that that's all fishing game so just knowing that if there isn't any link to the VASA system I don't know how that would translate into enforcement not sure if the game wardens would be up to coming in and enforcing that stuff so that would be the first thing if you are going to open roads just I would suggest that they actually link up some of your trail systems to keep the riders off of to keep them within certain areas to access the trails otherwise even to drive anywhere offside of any one's property it has to be registered and inspected and from a town I would certainly mandatory helmets posted speed limits that sort of thing but again there's no way to really enforce that which is again initial places that I've known about that I know about that have had town roads that are open it becomes like a racetrack after dark when people start getting their adult beverages in them and decide to see how fast their razor 1000s will go down a road and it just typically will generate a lot more complaints about that from anyone who resides on those roads just late night driving so we've had several fadels in Washington at least two that I know of with ATVs up in the notch in Washington so again that late night party and you mentioned maybe let's regulate it because it's happening you know either way I like the philosophy but I think I was at a fatal off at Jones Brook Road one of the roads on the right where ATV crashed a couple of years ago and went off the road he was going from his barn through his own trail on the property and then was heading back down to what was Jones Brook and he went off the road and died five or six years ago yeah again just there's no helmet drinking you know went off the road but and I'm thinking of Washington again as far as dirt bikes and ATVs and neighbors calling down stop and they want it to end and they want us to come down and magically make it stop but it's see and that's I guess that's the crux of the whole thing why we were thinking of having you know making it legal you know we've tried to signs up private property too and they go up there and they go off on the private property and they're destroying that so maybe if we have law but it doesn't really sound like it can be really enforced yeah that's the probably the biggest thing is the enforcement portion of it really the problem with talking up with VASA and I like VASA but the their state maps it becomes a magnet an area for people from out of town and more without association Lynch Hill is already a magnet my property is bordered by Lynch Hill on one side and Herringbrook on the other and it's a circle all the way around and especially there's one set of kids up the road that come down half the time I mean one kid basically said I ride from Northfield over here on my dirt bike and he's 15 so but they come and just like back and forth I'm thinking of one kid in particular who's probably generated 30 calls for us this year with ATVs so so you're suggesting probably your best alternative if we want enforcement is VASA going through VASA well I mean it's a double-edged sword at least through VASA you can at least have an enforcement outlet because they are contracted with Fish and Wildlife but with that comes VASA now all of their trails are loaded into the latest Polaris coming in it goes right into the GPS for those expensive Polaris it's right in it so it's it's difficult because otherwise like myself I don't like to ride around on my own I would certainly you know if just establish some sort of a speed limit and just some very strict requirements for helmets and stuff like that you know it just go ahead there it come in and see what he thinks I would highly recommend that obviously he would probably know a lot better than I what steps would have to be taken to get that VASA I think I know one of the guys at VASA too they must be they have a huge trail system they must be stretched just as thin as to try to do enforcement I wonder what the trade-off is you get tied into the system because they don't really how much can they really enforce another section so to speak I think it's probably good to speak with them to see what it is before we jump into it I'm from the eastern side of the state so if you haven't already talked to towns like Towsom that have been they've had their town roads open for years and just see how they got into it most of my experience with the race track and having that stuff running all hours of the nights is over there but some of their town roads are paved roads you can get a razor 1000 going pretty quick until it hits that telephone pole or something else and then some of them aren't registered either most of them are that's all I need to inspect them for the road but they at least have to be registered and inspected unless you're driving on your private property your own personal property so if we live right here and I wanted to cross I would have to have it registered and inspected just across the road legally 90 degree angles there was someone on the railroad the other day I saw it was driving without any registration just you know well I don't say those plates do fall off so maybe alright any other questions for the gentlemen while we have them here just a quick one and I think you already answered this do you have any authority for your department on class 4 roads or legal trails to like pursue or is that fishing game like you mentioned yes we can but it's we have authority everywhere in Vermont but it's you have to be right there when it's happening but we will not pursue any ATVs under no circumstances how have you got a cruiser down some of those roads what's that how have you got a cruiser down some of those trails you'd be surprised you'd be surprised when you could squeeze a I've squeezed the crown back in the long time yeah alright about well we really appreciate you guys taking time you dinner or whatever and it's good to have a face to the name again we've been here before we appreciate it thank you thanks for having us any follow-up questions pop up feel free to email either one of us as far as the town contract stuff I'll look into that I can get something to do I'll just show you where we're at for numbers and things like that good I do in my car I congratulate that would be good that way sure thank you guys thank you for doing what you do yeah thank you thank you for doing what you do so long Chuck how are we tonight alright I want to check go up go up to the big table big table big table still alright we've all got the period it's fantastic I am not going to go through this in detail it's a lot of actually repeat material from the last time I was here so I'm just going to kind of highlight what's changed since I was last here and then we can get to the need of it so a couple of major things have happened since I was in here in June 1st of all we have launched our high level design initiative the idea of this is a design across our we have launched our high level design across the entire district obviously we are focusing on certain areas first is the under served people but we do want to make sure we're building something that would be viable across what at the time was our 20 communities since then Waterbury is actually joined so Waterbury is now part of the community which is good because it gets us access to some areas in Duck Street that are going to be a little bit challenging before and as part of that there's still the poll inventory which I was talking about last time I was here and that is kicking off any day now we're just waiting for a grant to hit our bank account it has often got held up a bit in the state and was waiting on somebody to hit you know approve and that hadn't happened but it had been approved so that has now been issued and we're just waiting for that to hit our bank account we're going to go and we're going to start seeing trucks with C.B. Fireworks Louisville out doing this poll inventory since then we have also announced our first towns that we are focusing on as I indicated in the last meeting war town is one of them but we are focusing on Worcester Middlesex, Moortown, Callis and Eastmont Piliers are first areas they represent the towns that one make a nice contiguous network two have a great deal of underserved population Middlesex in particular has a great deal of underserved population Moortown doesn't have as high a population but is part of a good balance of network design along with the fact that it's the north end of our town that is particularly underserved and we also had really high interest rates people who were surveyed were very very interested in Moortown and said they would definitely subscribe and I think you know there's population demographics in effect in Moortown that make that the case so the last thing I do want to call out is there's actually a map between the presentation on slide 11 that will actually show you a map of the areas that are considered underserved in Moortown specifically so if you did get a color print out you'll see that the houses with blue dots are served at the 25 slash 3 megadit per second or better that is the FCC definition of broadband or actually I think 25 three we are looking to try to get 100-100 there are a number of areas in the town that do even have 100-100 but all of those red dots are the people who have access to 10-1 or worse and I can tell you from personal experience most of the Moortown common road is 4-1 or worse and so with that I'm pleased to announce that actually Moortown common road is going to represent one of our pilot projects where we do one of our first builds there are a few reasons for that and I wish I could say I was personally responsible for that I'm not, fates aligned and a lot of it has to do with some CARES Act funding that is likely to be coming through before the end of this year to allow us to do that build out so that's kind of everything that's changed we've refined some of the numbers in here in terms of the figures and costs they haven't changed exactly so if you look back the last presentation versus this presentation you'll see that the numbers are fairly similar and certainly in the same ball parks I think when I came in here I mentioned full-on pole data and design would be somewhere in the ball park of 66,000 I think we've refined that to about 73,000 now and so the next steps here are if the town is still interested in perhaps directing our co-funding towards our direction as a potential build out for community infrastructure we would love to get into that conversation to that end so we've passed you a memorandum of understanding that you drafted it is worth noting both Middlesex and East Montpelier have hired the same attorney to review that draft on behalf of them I forget the gentleman's name at this point in time I will pass that on to the board but there could be an opportunity for the town to save some money I can tell you there have been some pretty substantial changes to the MOU on behalf of those towns in my personal opinion I think they're good changes even though they're representing the other side so to speak but I do think they're better for the towns and better for everyone involved and so if you were to piggyback off of that that would save the town some money in terms of getting it reviewed so I guess the ask today would be to see if the board wants to move forward with something like this or what other sort of questions I can answer or information I can maybe provide you over the course of the next two weeks if you wanted to defer it for two weeks from today and make it done were you asked for the 73,000 is that what you're asking for today you know I do know the Veronica of cities and towns has put out some statements around how they believe towns should be using this money and it's typical they're advising a conservative stance and I think that's smart so I would say it would be great if we could get that as a first tranche if you will come six, eight months if other opportunities haven't come before the board that seem as compelling maybe you could consider a little more in our direction but for today that would get us through the poll audit and design for more towns specifically so are you saying like you're expecting the town of more towns total cost to be took to the town absolutely to the town and this is money that we won't get back directly the town will not get this money back through any part of the fees or anything like that this is just investment money from the town for the community with one caveat which is more money that doesn't come with debt service means we are able to have lower subscription rates for all of our subscribers but we would spread that across but there's no direct fee on top of the fees that goes back to more towns not on that I will remind you that as part of joining CB fiber there was an obligation to be willing to lease some space for some equipment at which you would be able to retract some fees on that to be a reminder on that things folks that already have a blue dot a blue dot of people that have a power right now correct yes there are probably those folks aren't going to switch over by you know they could but they won't be in the poll how would they be able they couldn't switch over unless that zone got into your system so we are doing a poll inventory across the entire district regardless of whether people are served or underserved our aim is to eventually serve everybody in our districts and just give them another opportunity for competitive choice as well but that's not our priority our first priority is the people who need it most so you know the people in the southern end of town that have Weitzfield Champlain Valley Telecom it would probably be five, six years best case scenario before we're lighting it up unless they happen to live in a space that we have to cut across to bridge two places that are underserved and it is worth noting that we are in conversations with Weitzfield Champlain Valley Telecom actually be our operator part of this is we have to establish the company that's actually going to have the infrastructure to find people out there to fix things when they come down and stuff like that so it might be that there are a few other people who are vying for it as well but to raise question is that so certainly the people who are underserved it's you know, I know people during the COVID thing they were sitting in their cars in the middle of the winter it's a period where the town hall so I do get it that it needs to happen but the people who already have it they'll be contributing but still they won't be a subscriber but they're contributing as a member of the town I pay my school tax I'm not a kid and I'm not saying that it's happening but some people might say hey what's going on here I don't know it's an important call out I don't know how that some communities have this consideration some don't, again as I mentioned middle of sex it has a much larger percentage of their population that's underserved compared to us we do also have a member of communities in various cities in Montpelier where you have 95% surf now are we going to build there anytime soon? No and we've been transparent about that they often do but is the state taking any role in this or we have applied for grants from the state as well and received some and there's probably going to be more to come as the overall project was calculated to be about $50 million before we added waterbury it's not like we were going to get that much money from the state but we are going to get some I mean now with the filing pass but the infrastructure bill that could be funding through that right now we're talking about the American recovery money but the infrastructure that's one of the things they're talking about is we are optimistic that we will have some opportunities there so the other towns that you brought proposals to are they giving you what you're asking for or what's been your reception so far? It's been positive middle sex did talk a little bit about whether they wanted to give the full amount to us they haven't committed to that yet or would I expect that to happen quickly because it's a large amount of money but they're the only town to my knowledge that's talked about diverting the whole thing to us I think East Montpelier was going to do a pretty sizable portion but we do have some communities that are not in our area A that we're approaching as well such as Marshfield, Plainfield, other areas where there are high underserved populations that we want to get the ball rolling as well I have a question. Callis $135 bomb so as everyone recalls we have $165,000 currently through the American Recovery Act funds we have a couple years to spend these and there's I've spent some time on a couple different conference calls there's a lot of strings and eyes to dot and tees to cross when you're making these allocations and so I think what I want to make sure is everyone around the board has taken an opportunity and gets and I'll have Sasha pass on the link for the documents and there's a few different documents for the VLCT any read for us very exciting but it's important that we know where it can go throughout the town because a lot of times I've been approached in different towns people say hey can you take that money and put it into this road and those are the things that we can't do so it's best we have this knowledge so when we start allocating money to the CB5 or the world or such that this is why we're doing it and this is why we can't do it and some of these might be other obvious spots where people would say why don't you take this money and put it here or lower the tax rate or something like that there's a lot of places you can put it but really there's just a few that are available to us here in more town and I think if we all have a good idea of that we'll be more comfortable looking at these type of proposals when they come in because you can see although it's a lot of money the options are somewhat limited to what we have to do I think it's it's a good project you know certainly the pandemic illustrated to all of us the need for connectivity whether it's school, work social meetings like this so you know what I would like to do is if not the next give us a month so we can pick some time I'm busy the next week because I really want to make sure we get this right get Cheryl and the treasurer involved as well she's handing out and doling out the funds so I want to make sure she's comfortable with what we're doing as well because she signs off and she's responsible so she wants to make sure too but what do you guys think is that a good plan in the meantime is there anything I can provide that will help in your discovery of this space my only question is how much we can allocate without a vote without a vote you know my understanding is it's not on the budget if it's over $5,000 or whatever we'd have to have a vote or something to spend on anything am I not correct on that we'll have to give a legal opinion on that too that's good I really hadn't put it in that perspective I mean we're getting it in the year I mean we could actually put it in the budget if we wanted to know that way for next year as it's not on the budget this year I'm just wondering what we can do right of course you'd ask you mean with the ARPA funds or well with any of the funds if these funds are only $168,000 that still leaves us $1.8 million I'm sure of that and how we're going to do that I'm in support of the project I've just got to really think about how we're going to pay for it legally I can tell you that there definitely has to be some sort of difference in how these are accounted for from typical funds because we are not legally allowed to dip into tax revenues from the towns and is actually forbidden based on the legislature however this is allowed I'm not aware so I'm not going to articulate on why you know if it's not tax the recovery funds are right the recovery funds are right but then there's going to be still funding after that and we're going to be going for revenue bonds and all sorts of areas of funding right that 2 million that Chuck talked about they're not presenting us with a bill of $1.8 million that's what the cost is here in town where they're getting that but yeah they'd like to get it all from us but they know they're not guaranteed we could potentially come to the 73 for this first phase and then you might need another amount a year from now depending on what we have for money and they've done really good for this amount but there is counting money that is available and the problem had been when the federal government allocated that money they were looking at counties there's a lot of counties in the United States that are working governments and so there was money to the counties and the towns obviously here in the state of Vermont we don't have governments that are working so just recently I just thought in the last couple of weeks there is a solution that has been a solution to that for states that govern like we do I don't know you know how they were going to break those funds out but it seems like you guys feel that we're getting another $367,000 that is our estimate the math gets a little fuzzier at the county level but I believe the methodology on this was to break out the counties by population and then essentially defy the overall sum based on the county population so we'll find out more of that and actually I had asked Cheryl Lim she just got back to me the last couple of days about that she hadn't seen that definitively what we're getting at but she has been looking at different stocks so that question is out there but by then within a month we'll know what that figure is to definitively so we can make a more informed decision there and just in broad brush strokes the kinds of limitations on the ARPA funds and I would encourage you all to read resources yourself but it's things like water infrastructure, sewage infrastructure there are some relief purposes around business business relief or businesses directly impacted by COVID and I think rent offsetting certain rents might be one of the options and then telecommunications infrastructure is the other major category but other than that it's very restrictive as to what the ARPA funds can go to for it right now whether that were retroactively opened up in the future I don't know but that is as it stands today very good, any other questions for Chuck? well is he up? I will expect to come back in month's time, Sasha I'll work with you to get on that agenda thank you everyone how would I see you? yes you as well thanks for all your hard work it's a lot so are you working for C5 now no but I chair the communications committee so all of the emails that go out and all of the broadcasts and advertising we do and all of that stuff I end up helping push through all the news letters if you're on the email list so it's a lot but because I'm also chair of the communications committee I'm a member of the executive committee and the overall board so I have meetings multiple times a week plus you're consulting now right? no actually I took a full-time job back in March what you did? I worked for a dog DNA testing company so we do like when you want to find out what breed a dog is which company do you own it? I don't know if it's in Bark that's my company I'm not asking you get some free TV advertisement here that's what it's all about yeah what about the WRC what do you do? I don't know I don't know he's a good dog that's what really matters that's what really matters alright take care we'll see you later alright so let's go ahead and move into forced communications so actually when we start with you what are you guys forced to do? I've got a whole list I've got your email about the executive committee can you say it so that I can correct it because I had already posted the minutes on the website and I didn't want to fall off if that's where we've done it are you good with it? yeah the RFP through the time we're working for RFP I left a copy there for everybody to see I just want to make sure it's going to go ahead and get to the paper tomorrow is this going out to the contractors that were on that list? I've sent it out to two contractors already that Ray and John had asked me to but that's going out to the paper tomorrow looks good to me is anyone seeing any questions I've been working on the RFP for the reappraisal does anybody have any ideas on dates and who do you like to be the concept? for re-praising the town? the contact is like within the town for people to call and some dates deadlines why don't we ward nine and then we're mad at the ward and we'll sit with Cheryl she probably wants to do that and anyone else have any ideas and the green mountain power letter is there for signing if you're all good with it that's the for spraying yep and then I'm going to send everybody the email information yes and then there was Cheryl had a contact I think it was Wilson it actually I sent out anyone for more best to Jolly that's done I have an appointment set up for the basement guy at the town hall in September and working is asking about re-wacking over at the actual library building I don't know if that's anything that the guys do we certainly can't around all the owners we're going to list the little things to put together for the road crew is that the basement guy that Callie was talking about that company what is the name of that company Matt Farks not the basement and then the plumbing issues at the town hall I got Trevor Clark to take a look at him yesterday he called me this morning and said that a faucet needs to be replaced toilet seat needs to be replaced and the toilets need to be receded on the floor he had a toilet seat and a faucet and he said he was just going to try this oh great that was pretty cool that was Trevor Clark the junkyard John was asking about the last time we signed was August 2018 for Cheryl retired and it won't be up again until 2023 where are that so we what are we signing off on that it's just difficult to approve so that's all that's only you for that I don't think anything's changed they're doing the same thing just a different company I don't know maybe they're doing the same thing but they're all the fencing and all that stuff is all down not all of it and there's dates open and for Frank it looks pretty bad it looks like a junkyard and it's not supposed to be real visible from what we're seeing John do you notice does the state ever inspect that is there any state things right on the river or anything like that the state must do anything you would think they would wouldn't yeah I'm sure there's no way they would have had to permit that this is a century officially where they were because they were way down wasn't even further yeah you could walk down there's a hill that goes down all the bank goes down my dad and I used to go junkyard shopping a lot I'm not involved in that I've been in a lot of junkyards I've taken scrap there and they used to take it all the time you know little you know why don't we have just David take a little while the zoning regulations and there's got to be things that they're not doing I mean I don't it's a business that's fine but let's just make sure we're doing what's supposed to be done because I don't think we are at this point regulations are methods of operation that they have to comply with I don't agree I don't think that they're doing it because there's the fence and there's stuff outside but in front I don't even think they don't even own it anymore no they don't they try to sell it but somebody else that's and that's why it carries over to the new owners but that doesn't mean that yeah they've done everything that Browns were doing we'll take a look at it and then have that one a primary for David maybe one of the petitioners the end guy is going to be here we'll just ask them what he needs yep, nothing just goes here alright, Sasha I think that's it alright, well thank you we'll sign off on those things when we get to business we'll talk about the owl Ray, what do you have for us to talk about? I had Joe, Gabrie, I believe fixed the door in the hall at the counter hall we had a conversation about it and I think it got done and he's also working at the price and fixing the memorial put it in the old counter office we'll have something for next year fix that up so I've talked to Joe about that regarding Martin again that I'm willing to help out with his computer paperwork I did not talk to him about having having him help out frankly I've been pretty busy at work there I'm one month away from retirement trying to rack up a lot yeah, full retirement well I'd like to think so but probably not that's my goal I may help him out as needed but my goal is to be fully retired here it's a good being right you deserve it I appreciate all the time you take it it's pretty full and I'll try to get over there and talk to them too and if you do have them look around the library the weedwacker also when they have the weedwacker out check the sign I know the sign on the north coming into town welcome to Moortown it hasn't been moored in that area yes, I noticed that too the other thing the other weedwacker maybe Joan or whatever the other day I came down the mountain road over here the store seems like this is a crack and I don't know about three quarters of the way down anyways is that something we should maybe put some filler in not asphalt or whatever there was a rubber seal in the asphalt coming down the hill it's towards the bottom there may be other ones there but I noticed I don't know two years start having big potholes there so we can do something to put some sealer on it you get a moment when you drive by just take a look and see if maybe I was exaggerating because I don't think so thank you Don, what you got going on down there this is this is an old business a new business it's just what this is like when you have new things that you want to do if you want some news something new we got the ADA report from Bill Gallup this is I've been just looking it on my computer and I'm going to get some drawings made that are a little bigger we're going to meet Thursday the town hall committee is going to meet Thursday and to go over this and see what we think and how we might incorporate the ideas that Bill, well some of the cold things that he brings up that we have to do but also he certainly came up with an idea that addresses keeping the whole community dance, so called dance for meeting them for achieving ADA access by just you know, utilizing the basement and changing where the lift is it's quite it's quite interesting so it's the first step maybe next week or two weeks we'll talk about it again if everybody gets a chance to look at it and we'll have our committee meeting and we can give some feedback so it's really to look at it now and there's a lot of information and the other thing I had started to print something that's been back in March I did a walkthrough of the sand pit and again I could maybe talk, I was going to ask if someday we could maybe before meeting all meet down there or something especially with this hot weather I pulled in there and looked, I mean the cars, the park and the people that get in there it's just, you know it's an accident waiting to happen sometimes in there and especially for mine to have access to equipment and this so the fire trucks to get water and busy with people swimming down there I just think it's something we could we're not going to solve in a walkthrough but as time goes by maybe we can just keep picking away at what we can do to change the landscaping a little bit there does that oil tank need to be right next to the river and stuff like that So Sasha, why don't we take some of the good to look at our properties anyway so why are we next to meeting one we can start at the regular time just be there for half an hour yeah about 15 minutes really keep it a half between traveling and whatever so that people aren't we'll be back here at 6.30 but I think that's a good idea to take it's kind of a massive and then we can talk I got some other things going on there too that we can talk about great, okay so yeah that's that's what I got for you anything going on? no John? I just wanted to bring up the data on the student outbreak of Covid it was the WREC what a very WREC program and there were 35 out of 150 kids who tested positive so they just closed it down but just I don't know what's going to happen school starts here it's just unbelievable if you look at the cases in Vermont and we're back to where we were before the vaccination and it's because and now as you know you'll be able to get booster vaccinations so anyway I was going to mention that there's been more new cases today that's what there was 107 on Friday and well more time out now that Martin did cut the tree that I was concerned about that's good and I don't have anything else thanks I don't know what we can do with this so let's go ahead and let's we are having a go to meeting on Thursday regarding the parking lot storm drainage Thursday at 9 o'clock Thursday at 9 o'clock I didn't see that she just stepped out tonight I think 9 a.m. oh and so do you have a key to the car along here I grabbed I lost one I lost my keys you know I'm sorry about that John that's alright thank you for coming to the rest keys at the bottom so no one's going in but they went car keys too that was a problem oh boy yeah so alright so let's go ahead we have the meeting minutes for 8-2-2021 how about the motion for the minutes there's only one thing I don't have time that my meeting notes Sasha is that there's a line that something about the cracking of the floor and that to tell a pack about it but what I was talking about in that was that is it packed yet? no peek they wouldn't check the floor I was thinking I was referencing I think I was just referencing that they could also look at the at the town of the rocks the next sentence which is regarding that town of the rocks so I think that's what I meant that maybe they could take a look at that project as well and I did send their office manager an e-mail a while ago but I never really asked if they were interested but I never heard back but maybe you guys would have you know we could send them the RFP now that we haven't really because they do that kind of stuff yeah alright so there's one change any other changes alright is there a second? second alright alright old business I'm going to start old business we have we've talked about the meeting the price is $9.99 you know where you look for it is good reviews based on the need I think you may not have coming up but certainly we may have guests companies or places that are restricted so I think that we should go ahead and purchase the alley and we can do that with those RFP funds that is allowed so I'm going to slash it out we can go ahead and do that and move to purchase the e-mail second alright rating everything for old business I do not Don, what do you got good good that's not going right Calla I'm just going to check in I can't remember the name of Adam I'll check in with Adam because he does that at least in like the Berlin area yeah if you do that Sasha maybe you can reach out to Chad Barrett see when he might be able to stop and see if I think he would be a good person it seems like they know about that stuff right? give us an idea of that good John in terms of the mirror 100D should we perhaps check the words and see if they are in a little bit of that I don't know I don't think it's personally what the state said there's a lot more that it would be the benefits of it whether it's in or out of the right way it's still not the same in fact other vehicles coming in not knowing what they're looking at thinking it's coming at them I think the negative exceeds the positive as far as the mirror to me but we should know why they got a key name can you let Mr. it might be interesting to note that he travels these roads but he lives in Waitsville just John went out and asked him where they live and they live up they got to go up South Hill Road but then they cross into Waitsville where they come down so they're not really more count resident we need to put up a hold which for those people right or something like that I know although I did have over a year ago I did have something to ask about that at that time I would let them know of it but it's not a wow we all know it's definitely a tricky intersection I'm so sure maybe that's why there's never been an accident there is because we all you know you actually stop there because we don't you're dead you're dead or possibly dead so we looked at C.B. Fyre, the 18 Orvins Orban Moils here was obviously the trails tracks thank you for bringing that up we'll look in the meeting minutes for that and hopefully we'll rectify that in the next meeting also it pertains to you as far as some of our legal trail issues Cheryl has been trying to meet with the attorneys to get things on all our trails both sides of the mountain taking care of that we have going on and so hopefully we'll get that finished up here within a short period of time is there any new business that anyone has? I wonder about the the potholes at the end of the drive here do you get those taking care of it? I'm asking the boys to take care of that they're in our driveway right John? Yep. So actually we're about you anything new that we need to be looking at we just have a few things to sign here and we can get out of here so I'm going to adjourn also thank you alright thank you you're welcome