Welcome everybody. Thanks very much for joining us. Today's webinar is one of a series that the RTA will be delivering on our coming Tenancy Law Changes. The topic we will be covering today is on ending a tenancy. My name is Mark Fidler and I am joined today by Lynn Smith, our senior community education officer who will step us through the new changes. Hi everyone. Before we start this morning, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the land on which we are holding today's webinar and where you are joining us from and pay respect to elders past, present and emerging. Today we will provide detailed information regarding the topics you see on your screen with a focus on the new grounds to end a tenancy that will come into play as of 1 October 2022. We will look at how these new grounds apply to landlords, agents and tenants in any a tenancy once these changes come into effect. Once we have got through that information, we will run through a few scenarios to provide some practical examples of how these changes are going to work and look to answer any questions you may have. I would like to point out that we had over 600 people registered for today's session and we may not get to all your questions but rest assured the RTA has a lot of information being released over the coming weeks that will help everyone in the rental sector understand these new changes. We will show you how you can submit your questions in a moment. Today we would like to hear from you. As mentioned, we will have a Q&A session this morning before we finish the webinar. We would love to receive your questions and for you to submit them, please click on the chat function or speech bubble in your Zoom toolbar or if you can't see it, click on the more and look for chat there. We would also like to hear from you on how today's session went as well as any future topics that you would like to know more about. So please look out for a survey when our webinar closes. To start us up today, I would like to get an understanding of you, our audience. I am about to launch a short poll where we are looking to see where you are today and also which group in the rental sector you belong to. So if you can answer those questions for us, I will give a few minutes to do so. And while you are doing that, we would like to make a big shout out to all of our 10 days right across Queensland, both regional and rural areas and those in Brisbane that are joining us. There are plenty of results coming in and it does look like we have a large percentage of property managers and agents around 60% at this stage and around 25% of property owners and landlords. We've got beauty housing support workers. So yeah, thank you very much. I'll leave that up for a couple more seconds just to give us the details. All right, so what I'll do now is hand over to Lynn. So as I said, about 60% of you on the line today are property managers or agents, about 25% property owners or landlords and a mix of tenants and residents, community housing workers, rooming accommodation providers or park managers and a few others as well. So Lynn, I'll hand over to you now and we can get things rolling. Great. Thanks, Mark. And good morning, everybody. So I'll just over the screens here. So just quickly just start on the rental reform. So the Housing Legislation Amendment Act was passed in October last year and that amends the residential tenses and rooming accommodation Act 2008. That's the Queensland Tenancy Laws. There are four key areas in these amendments, domestic and family violence protections, which are already in place as of one October last year. And from so as of October last year and as of one October this year, the framework for negotiating, running with pets, change of reasons to ending a tenancy. And as of one September, the minimum housing standards for all new tenancies is next year and also for all tenancies the following year. So one September 23 is minimum housing standards and for all tenancies from one September 24. As Mark mentioned, today's webinar is just focusing on today's topic, which is the ending of a tenancy. So the RTRA Act outlines the rules in how a tenancy or rooming accommodation agreement can end. The time frames will apply and will vary due to the reasons to end the tenancy. And whether the agreement is for general tenancies such as your houses, excuse me, units or your townhouses or it could be for movable dwellings in a caravan park or for rooming accommodations such as your boarding houses, your student purpose built accommodation or supported accommodation. So a property manager or owner can end the agreement by issuing a notice to leave. A tenant can issue a notice of their intention to leave. The tribunal may make an order. It could also be that there's mutual agreement to end the tenancy where both the owner and the tenant agree in writing. Other reasons also include abandonment and issuing an abandonment notice, death of a sole tenant where the representatives of the tenant may end the agreement, and also too you've got mortgage in possession. The process is still applied. However, as of 1 October we have new reasons to end the tenancy and also the time frames for some of those reasons. So from 1 October the without grounds provision has been removed and new reasons to end a tenancy have been added. These new grounds will apply for general tenancies and rooming accommodation. The new grounds includes ending of a fixed term agreement. So if you have a fixed term agreement coming to an end and you would like to end that agreement, then from 1 October you would issue a notice to leave on the grounds of the end of a fixed term agreement. That would require the two months notice. The other new grounds being introduced is the owner undertaking significant repair or renovations or demolition that could be change of use. So when we talk about change of use it could be changing a property from a permanent rental to maybe like a holiday or near B&B. The owner or their immediate relative is moving in preparing the property to sell or the sale of a rental property and these are all from the owner's or manager's point of view. There is a new section 297B, an application to terminate because of a serious breach under general tenancies. This includes illegal activity intentional or recklessly destroying or damaging the property or endangering another person. This will allow the owner or the manager to apply to the tribunal for an application to terminate the tenancy but this section also does state that the less or may form a reasonable belief that the premises or property has been used for illegal activity whether or not anyone has been convicted or found guilty of an offencing relation to that activity. So this section further links to section 347A about a serious breach and this is where a tribunal adjudicator would be looking at the relevant actions, damage costs, recurrence or frequency and any adverse effects to the person or any financial loss. This does exclude public or community housing however section 298 knows to lead because of serious breach of public or community housing still does apply. There is a new section 290B and this is a notice to leave for a state government program so this would be a program administered by the state under an act and it could be something like that the property is required because of an expansion of a highway or potentially like a train line. There is only one reason that has been removed from ending a periodic tenancy and that is the without grounds provision. So periodic tenancy can still be ended by an owner or manager on the reasons that you see on your screen. So if there is a breach then obviously following that breach process. The tribunal order if an order comes from the tribunal to end the tenancy and in addition is the new grounds to end. So these following reasons will include two months notice for general tenancies and generally it's one month's notice for roomy accommodation with the exception of demolition or redevelopment. Significant repairs, renovation or demolition, change of use or the owner or their relatives looking to move in, preparing the property to sell or the sale of the rental property and we do recommend for owners and managers to have some documentation for transparency or evidence to support your reasons. So in other words it could be if you are looking to sell a copy of your sales agent appointment if you have a relative moving in a written statement or if you are doing renovations or repairs maybe a trades quote. Amendment has also been made to repeat a breaches section so this will now include that if there is a repeated breach of a body corporate bylaw or for caravan park managers if there's a repeated breach of a park rule. For roomy accommodation it's also added if there's been a breach by a resident for body corporate bylaws if they are applicable or also repeated breaches of house rules. So this section follows what is already in place in relation to repeated breach process so that still continues it just now has added if there is a repeated breach of those bylaws park rules or house rules. Additional grants has also been added for general tenancies and roomy and this is in relation to tenants will have the ability to end a tenancy due to the property not being in good repair. The tenant will need to give notice in the first seven days when the tenant occupies the property. So as of one September 2023 this will also include if the property does not meet minimum housing standards. Currently the legislation has if a sole tenant passes away the agreement can end and this is not at least broke. So the new rules coming in as of one October is if a co-tenant passes away and it's not practical for the remaining tenants to continue or would cause them hardship they can end the tenancy and give 14 days notice and no penalty again it's not at least break. If the premises are primarily used for to provide student accommodation and the resident stops being a student as what is outlined under the act they can give a notice of their intention to leave and likewise to if the student accommodation provider is providing accommodation for the purpose of students they can also give a notice to the resident if the resident is no longer a student as well. The other reasons that tenant can end is if the owner does fail to comply with repair orders they can also give notice and remember to a tenant experiencing domestic and family violence can also end their interest in the tenancy and leave the rental property. Other sections added in include the tenant applying to the tribunal to terminate due to misrepresentation by the owner or their managing agent regarding the rental property or its inclusions. The tenant will need to apply within three months of the tenant occupying the property this is a non-urgent application and needs to come through the RTA's dispute resolution process first. There was also a new section 246a regarding the tenant taking action or applying to the tribunal if the tenant recently believes that the action taken by the owner in giving them a notice to remedy breach increasing the rent or ending the tenancy or refusing to enter into another fixed term agreement is due to the tenant upholding their rights in requesting a repair or requesting reimbursement for emergency repairs or applying for a tribunal order. This section also does state that the tenant may apply the tribunal for an order to set aside the lessor's action if the tenant recently believes the action was taken to intimidate or punish the tenant for matter mentioned in subsection 1a which is regarding the tenant taking action to enforce their rights such as instead issuing a breach requesting repairs or the emergency repairs or applying to the tribunal or complying and complaining to an authority. The application must be made within one month of the lessor's action and this also does apply for rooming accommodation as well. So just a caution here there are penalty provisions applying for up to 50 penalty units for providing false and misleading information in a notice requiring a tenant to leave. This again is for rooming accommodation providers and agents and landlords so an owner needs to ensure that when they do issue a tenancy due to issue a notice to end a tenancy due to the sale contract, significant repairs, redevelopment demolition, change of use or the owner or their relative moving back in that it is true and correct and not used as a way to end a tenancy. If you are an owner or an agent and have ended the agreement because of an owner or their relative moving in change of use or sale of the rental property you cannot offer a tenancy for the premises for six months after handover date of the vacating tenant. It would be to the owner to provide reasonable evidence as to why this did not occur if there was an investigation. So just to keep in mind too the not re-learning of the premises for six months after tenancy for these reasons also do apply for rooming accommodation except the owner moving in. To clarify these sections the change of use the again the lessor would need to prove that the change of use did not happen for the reasons beyond the lessor's control. For a property being sold the lessor genuinely made the premises available for sale but no offers acceptable were received or the lessor entered into a contract for sale but the contract ended without the premises being sold. And for owner occupation the lessor would need to prove the intended occupants that means that the owner or their relative need to occupy the premises ended and unable to occupy the property. The lessor did not offer a tenancy until after the intended occupants needed ended or become unable to occupy and the premises remained vacant between the tenant vacating the property and also the offer of the occupants being accepted. So now that was a little bit wording there but that's literally what was also in the legislation. So within your amendments they will apply to room accommodation as I mentioned before but the owner moving back in and also the owner moving back in does not apply. So for any accommodation that is purpose built for student accommodation only the new reasons to end a tenancy if the resident is no longer a student and needs to leave they can provide one month's notice and leave and likewise if the provider is providing accommodation primarily for students and the resident stops being a student again it's also one month's notice. With these sections a student means a person enrolled in a course under the Social Security Act 1991 so it's Commonwealth Act and is an approved course of education or study for this section. All right Lynn thanks very much for running through that information what we might do now is have a look at a couple of scenarios. So if Peter is a landlord and he has a rental property close to the university currently rented to Sarah and Jane his son is now enrolled at the university and Peter is now wanting to end the tenancy for his son to move in. What does Peter need to know and understand first and how does Peter end the tenancy? So with this particular scenario what we're looking at is that Peter being the owner needs to understand what agreement is in place to start with. Is it a fixed term agreement or is it a periodic agreement? If it is a fixed term agreement it is still in place until the end of that term and if it is a periodic agreement then obviously Peter currently can obviously give two months notice to end the tenancy. As of one October he would also be able to give that notice as well but it would be for the fact of that the owner is looking to have a relative move back into the property. So we would also recommend that Peter have you know the evidence for transparency for his obviously his son moving into the property. Okay so considering that you mentioned before if an owner does end the tenancy for moving in themselves or putting a relative in you can't relet for six months. If Peter's son then decides that university is not for him or he finds a job somewhere else or doesn't end up you know staying in the property what's Peter's options in that situation? Yeah you're right Mark that six month timeframe does come into play however if there was a complaint made to the RTA then Peter would need to demonstrate the obviously the intention and the reasons behind you know that the intention was there for his son to be moving in and everything was on track for that and obviously to the reasons behind the change. So again this comes down to that evidence for transparency. Excellent thanks for that. So another situation John who's the landlord and Amy his tenant have a six-term agreement in place until the 7th of December 2022. John is looking to end the tenancy. John is going to be doing some renovations to freshen up the property and he's thinking eventually of turning the property into a holiday let. When does John need to give notice and for what reason? Okay so John being the landlord he's got the fixed term up until 17th of December. Currently he could give notice without grounds to be looking to end that agreement however after one October he can look to end that agreement and give the two months notice and that would be on the reason because it's the end of a fixed term. But if for reason and we've got here the same scenario if Amy was on a periodic lease and this is where the new reasons would come into play. So if John ended due to renovations he can do so however if he did decide to relet after that and change his mind in not putting the property on the holiday market he could relet the property. But if he is on a periodic if it's on a periodic and he's ending because he's turning it into a holiday let then this would be a change of use. So this would then mean that John could not put the property back on to relet if he did change his mind for that six-month period after Amy had left. Okay so the renovation aspect of things doesn't have the six-month application or requirement but the change of use does. Excellent. So with the six-month time frame we're looking at the change of use an owner or relative moving in. So those sort of in the sale of a property those three terms have got that six-month time frame that's applicable. Excellent all right. So Jeff and Mary have been renting from Rod for the last past three years. They started on a six-month six-term agreement and remained in the property on a periodic tenancy. During this time they have had a couple of renting increases. Rod the landlord uses Natasha the property manager to look after the property. Rod is very happy with Jeff and Mary as tenants and is considering what his options are with future leases. Rod also wants to increase the rent. So what are his options at this point? So Rod's got a few options here. Obviously to understand the difference between the two top agreements whether Rod is happy for Jeff and Mary to continue on on a periodic tenancy. If he does want to increase the rent there's some rules in place in relation to rent increases and that would be make sure that's been six months since the last increase and he would also have to give two months notice for that rent increase. He could also offer Jeff and Mary a new fixed-term agreement and on that agreement providing again six months has passed since the last increase. He could offer the rent increase on that new agreement and ask Mary and Jeff if they'd like to sign that and return it by whatever date. I suppose the main thing for Rod really would be going and having a conversation with Jeff and Mary and talking through the options of what might be Jeff and Mary's situation. Are they looking to stay for a significant period of time down the track because they've obviously been a long-term tenant? Are they looking to change the situation in the new future? So again really good communication between the two parties and understanding the difference types of those two agreements being on offer. Whether it is for a fixed term that way then obviously knowing Rod Jeff and Mary would all then know how long that term that tenancy is for or whether if they do stay on a periodic agreement, Rod understanding the reasons in how the agreement can end down the track and likewise for Jeff and Mary. So in effect if they are a periodic tenant after the first of October Rod's options are then limited to the four ways to end that agreement is that? Yeah after one October for the periodic agreements yes we've got those new reasons to end. If Rod is looking to talk with Jeff and Mary now and changes his mind for some other reason he thinks oh you know what I might be doing something else for the property then currently at the time of this recording he could give the two months notice without grounds but as a one October the new reasons to end a tenancy would come into play. Excellent all right so Meg and Frank rent a property they're both signed the lease they're three months into a 12 month lease and Frank suddenly passes away. Meg is concerned she will not be able to stay what are her options in this situation? Again for Meg is probably understanding what finding what are her concerns can she financially afford the property and continue through with the tenancy does she need to look at getting maybe a new flatmate in to help financially and obviously talking with the owner to get approval for that. Again it comes back down to Mary's obviously concerns in the situation however but if Meg does need to leave because obviously a hardship and she can't financially afford it and doesn't want to stay in the property then with the new rules as a one October she could end the tenancy due to the co-tenant passing. Okay so Simon has agreed to rent a unit from Max. Max has advised that he will install air conditioning in the main bedroom and also repaint the bathroom within the first two weeks of Simon moving in. Simon signs the agreement on these conditions now Simon says that Max is not returning his calls and has not done these things and it is now two months into the tenancy. What options did Simon have? Simon's probably got a few options here obviously you know the RTA has always recommended self-resolution and having owners and tenants and managing agents talk with each other if there's issues and try and resolve the matter. Simon could issue Max with a breach he could apply to our dispute resolution service to get assistance but with the new laws as a one October Simon can also apply to the tribunal for misrepresentation so that could be in relation to the fact that Max has misrepresented on the fact that he is going to put the air conditioning and he was going to redo those painting for the property. So with the misrepresentation new section Simon does need to come through the RTA's dispute resolution service first to get a notice of unresolved dispute if it's not resolved before going on to the tribunal. The main thing that Simon needs to probably understand in this situation is that if he is looking to take action he needs to do that misrepresentation action within the first three months of moving in. Alright okay so just a reminder and thanks for that Lynn for those explanations just a reminder that the process for ending a tenancy due to the breach notice not being rectified has not changed. So if in the current situation up until the 1st of October we're all aware of how that breach process works come the 1st of October and when we're working under the new changes the breach process hasn't changed at all so you're still in a situation where a periodic tenant for example although it falls under those new four ways of ending a tenancy you'll still have the option to issue a breach and if the tenant doesn't rectify the breach then they can still be issued the notice to leave so none of that has changed. So remember that the reasons to end tenancy are outlined in the legislation and the new grounds to end a tenancy replace the without grounds reasons from the 1st of October and of course timeframes all still apply to end tenancies. Okay as I mentioned before with resolving disputes we do recommend property managers and owners and tenants respectfully speak with each other to resolve any tenancy issues and try and work together to find a solution. Now communication is key to resolving most disputes so remember respect, empathy, negotiations and exploring all the options if you can. If you are unable to resolve the issue the RTA's free dispute resolution service is available to help you and the other party try and resolve that matter. The RTA does resolve over 70% of disputes where parties participate in the telephone conferencing. It's a voluntary process so we cannot force parties to participate although we do encourage it. The conciliator is impartial they're not there to take sides nor make decisions the parties to the dispute own the dispute outcome and it is a confidential process so we do have information on the RTA's website in relation to our dispute resolution service along with tips in resolving disputes. So just clarifying in relation to applying to the tribunal which is the Queensland Civil and Administrative Tribunal it's just a reminder too that there are urgent and non-urgent applications under our legislation and timeframes apply in relation to applying to the tribunal. So for non-urgent matters it does require a notice of unresolved dispute first from the RTA before proceeding to the tribunal. With QCAT so with an urgent application the urgent applications are defined under section 415 so if you don't see the reason to apply for being urgent and where you can go directly to QCAT then you need to then it would be a non-urgent matter and you need to apply to the tribunal. There's information on the QCAT's website in relation to the applications your timeframes your fees and everything so that's QCAT website qcat.qld.gov.au. Just to let you know QCAT is currently looking at releasing an online portal for tenancy applications in the near future as well as they will continue to accept the paper forms. Remember going off to QCAT is all about the evidence so it's really important that you do have the information you require copies of your tenancy paperwork any notices or forms photos or evidence that's going to help support your case. QCAT is self-representation and more information can be found on their website. I was just going to say Lynn sorry it appears that we had some issues with the chat function I think it is now working so if people want to pop their questions in please try that chat again and and see how you go thank you. Oh awesome thanks Mark I didn't realise we had an issue there sorry thank you. So we will be providing more information and education on the changes so all our forms and our publications will be updated as of one October and we will also have education available through other resources on our website such as webinars like today we'll also be releasing podcasts videos and fact sheets and also too if you are subscribed to our eNews just make sure that you are or your colleagues are and we can let you know more information as well through that channel. We are also working with our key stakeholder groups so that would be like the Real Estate Institute of Queensland, the Property Owners Association, Tenants Queensland, Qshelter and Arama and quite a few others. The webinar series on the tenancy changes will also include topics of renting with pets, repair orders and other amendments so the invitations to these webinars will be available soon and a copy of today's recording will be available on the RTA's website over the coming week so over to you Mark I know that I can just see my screen just flowing up there in relation to a whole pile of questions and I'm sorry that we've actually had a slight problem with our chat but it looks like everything's all coming through now. Certainly are Lynn so just to start the first question if we have tenants on periodic leases now that we have to issue sorry if we have tenants on periodic leases now that we have to issue with our grounds notice to leave how we facilitate this we've seen media and tenancy organisations reaching out to tenants they've experienced a fixed term agreement with a notice to leave saying this is not the correct course of action so I think this is in relation to some of the media we've seen around fixed term agreements and notice to leaves being issued together. Okay so and I think there's quite a few questions just having a quick scan at that so we'll just quickly address this situation for everyone so just to summarize that what we think that question is about is the fact of signing up a new lease and with the notice to I think the questions from Amber the notice to leave at the same time whilst it's it's not unlawful as such obviously it's probably not necessarily in the spirit of the policy behind the legislation changes so changes have come in obviously it's it's more about having the tenure of tenancy as such but as I said we are hearing quite a lot in the media and everything about that particular process and as I said you know the legislation outlines the timeframes required to end a tenancy but yes it's probably not necessarily in the spirit of probably why the legislation was changed all right thank you and everyone else who has asked very similar questions similar questions uh Lynn can a fixed term agreement be ended early for an owner to move in uh thanks Paul for your question um a fixed term is a fixed term and obviously if an owner does want to move in during that time they're probably going to have to have a conversation with the tenant and maybe look to mutually agree to end that tenancy if the tenant does agree otherwise the other option would be that the owner if they are in a hardship situation could potentially apply to the tribunal um and seek a termination order that way there could be compensation um that could be involved in that as well all right uh at the end of a fixed term do we need a new written lease or can we agree in writing to an extension of the term to say two years um you can actually amend or put in a next year um or next year notice I suppose to change the end date of that fixed term agreement um alternative you can enter into a whole new agreement as well all right and quickly I'm a landlord when the fixed term lease ends can I increase the rent for the new fixed term lease and what is the required notice period yeah thanks Jane for the question um you can offer a new fixed term agreement with a rent increase um and that's fine um just make sure that obviously it's been that six-month timeframe since the last increase um the other thing too is that um if the tenant doesn't sign that new fixed term then and they do lapse into a periodic you would have to give them the two months notice in writing but you can offer a new fixed term with a rent increase mark I am conscious of time and I know that we've got a lot here so hopefully you've been able to summarize a few um they look like they're very similar as well yeah so uh I've got a question here can I usually notice to leave without grounds which expires after the 1st of October is this still valid I think this is probably in regards to the transition periods uh sorry I'm I've got lost in the little clauses all right can I issue a notice to leave without grounds which does expire after the 1st of October so I think currently you can issue a notice to leave without grounds now but obviously the new reasons to end a tenancy will come into place as of 1 October yeah and if the if a tenancy ends prior to the 1st of October then we can issue that notice uh at this point in time yes and as long as you're providing your minimum um of two months notice yeah um there's some there's some issues obviously in relation to some timeframes and transitional arrangements at the moment and can I just let you know that the RTA will be early next week releasing a Q&A fact sheet in relation to the transitional arrangements and the timeframes and things like that so please do jump on our website next week we will actually have some more information available for everybody and just talking about those transitional arrangements please confirm a form 18a executed prior to the 1st of October is automatically covered by the new legislation what is this applied for yeah so um come the 1st of October uh regardless of where the tenancy agreement started those new laws will apply in regards to effectively what we're talking about today ending the tenancy uh just scrolling through there are a lot of questions here as you said so just confirming it will still be permitted to end a fixed term lease by giving two months notice minimum and for the reason solely let the fixed term lease has ended yes that is correct Sandra uh so in relation to that the without grounds has been removed to end a fixed term agreement and has effectively been replaced by ending of a fixed term agreement so um clarification in relation to an application to a tribunal for misrepresentation is three month timeframe from the date of moving in or the date of lease commencement um I think you find it actually is from the uh it does say from the uh three months from occupancy I think you find in the legislation but we can probably come back and clarify that with you Monica there will be um some as I said before some fact sheets but we also will have some quick guides also available on our website over the coming weeks as well I think it says from occupancy like I know that we we are already over time so um thank you everyone for your questions as I said I think what we are seeing is some themes that's coming through quite a few people Pam Ashley David Rebecca um you're all asking very similar sort of same questions in relation to the time frames and things like that as well as the issuing of a notice to leave at the same time of signing a lease so rest assured that as of early next week there is going to be that information on our website just to put some clarification around those questions for you okay we might have to leave them up I'm just conscious of time yeah and I appreciate that the slight delay that we've had with the chat coming through as well all right so as Lynn mentioned there will be a lot of education and information available please make sure that you sign up for our monthly rta news email so we can keep you informed of any key topics or changes podcasts on the new tenancy changes will also be released along with upcoming webinars and we will be running more of these webinars on different topics as we go along you can follow us on LinkedIn as well also the website is there for you and obviously our contact centre number and the contact centre is available from Monday to Friday 8 30 to 5 p.m excluding public holidays we do thank you very much for attending today's webinar and we look forward to seeing you in future webinars we'll now close and a quick one minute survey will be available for you to complete thanks very much for coming along


I'm Georgie Westway and I'm currently a JMHS Strong Young Minds champion. I'm currently in year 10 and I've been a champion for nearly two years now. What is Strong Young Minds? Strong Young Minds is a group of people in Herefordshire who are working to raise the awareness of mental health and help reduce the stigma around mental health and there are many groups across Herefordshire who are taking part in making a difference. So how and why did you first get involved with the Strong Young Minds project? So the Strong Young Minds project store had been running for a year at my school. I'd seen what they'd been doing and I wanted to get in on the action. One of the main reasons I wanted to do it is because I wanted to find out more about mental health and I wanted to be able to help people including myself in the future and others who were suffering with it at the moment or in the future. And why do you think it's important to engage young people in your school and to hear what they've got to say? I think it's very important to engage young people in schools because they need to know that they aren't alone in situations and need to know what is going on, what might happen and I think they need to know also what services. There are out there to help them or to help others and they can then refer others on to other people. What have you done in your school to raise awareness of mental health? So in my school for children's mental health week in 2018 I helped coordinate the activity we did so we managed to do house assemblies where we spoke to all the students in the high school which we got a lot of positive feedback from. Also we did information stand one lunchtime so people could come along and see what we were about and it was mainly come along, have a laugh, see what we were about. And also we did a teacher workshop but in this teacher workshop we were very very surprised to find out that none of the teachers in our school including the support people in what we call the house office at school where students can go for support. None of them had ever had any mental health training which was very very surprising. So we were very pleased to give them their first little taste at it. And from this work I was able to represent all the strong in mind champions in the heritag at the heritag community champion awards. And at these awards the strong in mind champions in the heritag won in the youth cast group. And from this we received some donation to help us carry on with our work. Fantastic, you must have been really proud. Yeah, brilliant. So if other schools were thinking about engaging young people in this sort of project what do you think they could learn from your school? What's gone well in our school is that we've focused the topics head on so we haven't strayed round them, we've gone for it. We decided that when we wanted to do events during this week we decided that we wanted to do them to the best of our abilities and do them well. And we didn't want them to be something that didn't really cover everything. And is there anything that's gone less well that's been challenging? I think there was always a challenge of sitting in an assembly where we have all the people sat in the assemblies. You're always going to have the people that don't let their make faces at you. But then I think once we've done the first two the last ones including the last one went really really well. And we were really happy with how that one went. And I think that once I think it's one then things once you get in and do it it's then a lot easier to maintain doing it. So kind of keep going would be your tip there. Are there any initiatives that you think have been particularly successful? Well the assemblies I think that they've helped lots of certain students and with the assemblies we had the form tutors in there which then gave the form tutors a sort of idea of what is available in school and what is available outside of school so they can then if they're worrying about some sort of form member then they can easily refer them. And what did the assemblies cover and who ran them so it was Strong in Minds your group? Yeah so we did it as Strong in Minds champions and Patricia came along and we focused on what the signs of mental health, what mental health conditions are there, what have we already done, what are we planning to do and how they can get involved if they wish to. Finally is there anything else you'd like to do in your role as a mental health champion in school? As a mental health champion in school I would like to encourage the new generation of champions to come through because in a year time I will be gone and I don't want all the work to just finish when we've gone through. I want there to be the new champions coming through and currently we have got that in place so they are very encouraged to take on the higher roles which I think is really good. So you need to plan for the future in that sort of sustainability and kind of passing the baton on really. Brilliant. Is there anything else you want to say? Ffio Strong in Minds champion.


We have forwarded the changes and people have gone through reports of co-leaving in the past, but nowadays, the president has left some of the measures that were put to cover the Covid-19. So we are seeing more people coming in asking for spaces because they are now able to travel into the country all into Nairobi, Mombasa even Kisumu where we have our locations. So we have people basically embracing the new normal. Absolutely. And you mentioned something which is very important. You know the niti griti is small things that are very much important when it comes to cleanliness and you mentioned a couple. You mentioned on how you use the privacy aspect of it but let's look at how my safety, right? Are there rules to be followed just for safety for your clients? Yeah. So basically we have common standard rules for co-living and as a company we've been able to establish that through a contract that we give to all our tenants and if they agree to a bind with the rules then if they follow them very well they will be able to co-exist with others. And the aspect of furnished, are they furnished apartments? Oh yeah. So they are all furnished apartments. I mean when Isaac mentioned and you also stressed something that they are small things. So when we were coming up with the solution we asked ourselves the questions of okay so people ask us why they should share spaces. People don't even want to share spaces and so we went and started doing research on why exactly don't you want to share. So we were just trying to get clients from the clients to actually think and why they think they shouldn't share. So that way we don't address problems that doesn't exist. So furnishing was one of the main issues because if we left the space empty and then we brought people together to furnish then we're going to have a problem. People say are probably brought in a coach more expensive than the dispenser you brought in and then it would be like a huge issue. So it starts from furnishing the entire apartment providing like the quansage services, the cleaning aspect and probably people who might want extra services like if you want food cooked for you well you can just make like the request and you'll get your food prepared. If you just want to make a normal order from a restaurant you can still do that and yeah your food will be delivered. So we're providing more than just a space to live. Giving people the lifestyles that they're actually looking for but at affordable cost. What sort of experience will your clients have when they get to be part of the village world and how many branches are there and where you guys located at? Yeah so you know our slogan when we're starting was redefining modern living but over time we realized that co-living is supposed to be fun. People are supposed to enjoy living in a space and we realized that by building the community aspect that we keep on mentioning since we began this was actually the best way. So you have a couple of friends you're living with and then you're like okay so I've been working since Monday to Friday what am I doing for this weekend? And then you have these friends so like oh so I know there's a show in town we could actually attend. I know the best restaurant we could actually go to. You form kind of a social cycle where you also get to have fun beyond just where you're living and where you're working. So that's basically one of the experiences but also the other experience is life is much easier in a co-living space for the fact that cleaning is done for you, right? Most of the services are actually done for you and then you can make the request that you want.  It's so easy like that. Exactly. So I mean these experiences are just really small we're just doing the very small stuff because we realize life is about those very small things. Those are what actually makes life more fun. You salary might matter, like a lot of things might matter but then what you do beyond something you could actually hold down to at the end of the day is what is really critical and that's the space and the environment you're actually providing. But the other thing that I might want to stress is we have monthly events for these young people so we can say it's a coffee, it's a normal meat and grid people are hanging out. I mean basically we have different things for these events depending on what we did like last month so if we did meat and grid then I mean most of these people then know each other then now we can go into maybe a space where it's a professional networking session so we bring people beyond the community so you're able to interact with people also outside that network that you already have within the village and it's fun for us, we're hosting expatriates we're hosting locals we also host expatriate locals so like if they're people from Kisumu and they're living here in Nairobi and they're like, so I'm in Nairobi and just want people to hang out with I'm here to work for maybe one month I'm attached here for a program or something I'm living in the village community and then you get to just connect with other people in Nairobi from other countries, from outside Kenya so there's just so much to be experienced in the village What I'm getting is that you just have an opportunity to experience different culture, self-development as you just communicate, just making life easier and better when it comes to community living Advantages, currently we are located in Mombasa of course we're here we're in Naivasha where is here? Obvious, Nairobi we're in Nairobi and then we're in Kisumu so if you're from the lakeside like me I would probably want to go to Mombasa for Naivasha, right? so if I'm sharing a space in Kisumu then on our platform you can actually just get an access for one week you can book a one week vacation to Mombasa in those same spaces because those co-living spaces are located in different places so now you don't have to spend a lot of money booking for a different accommodation all you need to do even hotels, ya? Ya, exactly so all you need to do is you just moving from one home to another home different people, different experiences probably much cheaper but you also get to experience the culture and there's usually strict restriction with certain institutions probably like hotels also but here we just give you a home so the way you operate in that other co-living space in Kisumu the same rules since it's the same company they still apply alright, I just want to ask if I'm travelling maybe I want to go to Kisumu so all I have to do is just reach out to you guys and tell you how being in Kisumu for this particular period if it's a week, two weeks a month I just let you know prior and you're going to just make it work for me Ya, so the process is pretty much easy you just give us a call or you send us an email or you actually go through a website where you can be able to book from and the process is very easy you just tell us the dates we confirm the availability of the space and the timings then we're able to book you in and you're able to make a payment okay, going back to the business aspect of this what are the some of the financial lessons that you've learnt since back in 2018 till date right now very great lessons financially and especially now after covid happened there are so many things that had to change like your spending our spending budget had to slow down because we were unsure when covid was starting out and some things that we learnt is during pandemics or crisis customers can react in very different ways so if you had some specific financial metrics you had set forth then it will become very difficult to achieve them but because you want to be a dynamic company then you want to adopt very fast to the new changing norm and so we've been able to find out ways to manuva through the covid-19 with very little funds minimizing our movement as a team and being able to only invest in what we require so those are like our key major lessons specifically after covid-19 and then the thing that we discovered with covid-19 is people need to make money and so we have people who have furnished apartment who are relying on maybe tourists so for the last six months we've not had tourists come into the country so for us we saw that as an opportunity and at the moment we're able to work with people who own furnished apartment we're able to tell them our model and how it operates and if they agree we sign an agreement with them and then we're able to get guests for them so all actually long term members to be able to take up their space because they need to consistently make an income from their house so we are telling people you must not rent your full apartment one single person now you can rent out to a few other people maybe if it's a three bedroom apartment you can give it to three people and then they're able to share cost you have maintained financial income coming in as well as giving an opportunity for young people to be able to experience a specific location and they can pay at an affordable rate and Bumfez, I would like to find out what's the average price for one bedroom apartment in your buildings in any of your buildings I mean before I give average it's really ideal for me to just give a few issues just the housing space was everybody understands that pricing depends on one location so affordability question is also directly attached to the location and of course the services that are being provided so I think we have arranged from about 20,000 on the up market and I mean we go way up to about 80k and per room and for like the 80k is I mean it's modern furnished swimming pool, gym close to the mall you get cleaning seven days a week literally you I mean we call it luxury living right so yeah you get like literally everything but also on the downside is we realize that even though young people are able to afford these but they also get strained at some point because of the salaries that they are actually earning so I think we've been working day and night to try and get as low as 15,000 for these people because then in the up market if we can get that then I mean young people will be able to get value for that money in terms of vacation homes if you're looking at places in Mombasa we get as low as 2,500 and probably it's close to the beach it's probably a beach house in Kisumu areas like Donga beach Milimani again as low as 2,500 but you can rent an entire villa if you're looking at that you're balding like lad so I mean one thing about villa by the way is that we decided that even though we are targeting a market one thing you need to give a people the consumers is options it's options what can I choose from so if this month while you're balding as we're saying you can choose what fits you but if you're also looking at to really extremely cut down on cost but still get the experience then we still have those options for you All right Isaac, how are the investors looking at this situation I don't even mention that one of them were streams of making financial help one of the streams is three investors how are the investors looking at this situation of co-living basically it's been a global trend co-living and if you look at markets like US Europe and even some parts of Asia co-living has been well spread but here in Africa because of our cultural beliefs of not being able to share a space with someone you don't know or even sharing a space with both genders it's something that most people are not very open to but for us we want to tell people if you know you're dignity then you can be able to live with another person and because of that investors are very excited because of co-living spaces they are trying to solve unaffordability issue and like you remember affordable housing in Kenya is something that we might not be able to achieve 100% by constructing building but if we can be able to also look at alternatives to technology then that is something that will be viable for the market because Kenya is a tech driven country and the youths are tech savvy so basically if you are able to give them a service through a platform then it becomes interesting for the investors investors are excited and they are looking at how how fast can you grow how fast can you be able to attract more people to live in your space and if you can be able to achieve that I definitely assure you that money will come along your way and we are looking for more investment opportunities with various organizations out there both locally and externally it's an exciting journey I'll say basically and with COVID-19 people are adopting to the new norm where you actually believe that you can work from home so if you're working from home you're going to look for a location that has everything that you might need not to move so many places so that you're able to settle in one place, work from home and be able to earn your money and also access a community so it's an interesting change of dynamics we have in the country and specifically if we are looking at how does the next 10 years look like for the young people and you know most African countries they have like very young ages of people like an average age of 19 years if you remember that was done a few years ago so we are looking at how do we actually bring trust to these people that they can be able to share spaces as early as today so that within a few years the person who is 19 today when they graduate from campus they are able to work in a location that they feel comfortable but also live in a location where they feel like they are they are part of it it's a home, community, family what are a couple of challenges what are the major challenges that you are facing I would say the major challenge at the moment has been able to break the cultural barrier in the Kenyan society and especially people ask how do you share spaces with other people especially the gender part yes, especially the gender part I believe most men and women you went through high school as a boy school you went through campus and you lived in a domituri that was male gender or maybe female gender and so it becomes very hard for these people to actually think of sharing an apartment as an alternative to affordable housing so that has been the greatest challenge we've been trying to tackle and we believe we will be able to tackle as much as we are able to talk to people because when you have conversations with people you give them another aspect of life and those who are open enough they will adopt it the rest will adopt as they go by ok, boomfix will find out a couple of achievements just as you wind up achievements I think for me and also as a company one of our achievements one thing that we look at the top one is the impact that we are able to create for the few clients that we have been able to sign up because I mean if we are able to help one person cut down on cost get affordable housing and live in a space they feel secure safe and reduce just the constraints that comes with another alternative not so affordable housing then I think that can be like one of the things we can be most proud of but also the other achievement I think it's just being able to build a team around these startups are no easy running businesses is not easy I mean if you're just starting up you're trying to build system you're trying to build structures a lot of you think in a very different way but our team has been able to just build up around that specific system and just believing that this will work despite people feeling like co-living is not something that could happen but we've really been insist insisting on just doing the research we now understand probably more of frequent research getting client and customer perspective around these how they want us to provide more efficient services and I think with that data we're able to just tell the market this is how you need to work this is the path you need to take if you're going to create an impact to these young people and at the same time also make money but the other of course impact is building a village for the last two years I mean I think for me that has been an achievement and I don't know what Isaac will say about that but for me that has been achievement building a company to where it is actually but we still look forward to just working on this we look forward to hosting more young people we look forward to people changing perspective and just having a different eye to like see this but most importantly to co-living changing gender issues around housing aspect like you kept on mentioning sharing an apartment and he is a male gender and a female gender I mean he shouldn't be like these are two different things I mean this is a humanity by the nowhere I thought people were created to be separated to be defined by their genders this is one of the things that I'm looking forward to and if village is able to break this I think it would be kind of a lifetime achievement alright as you wind up Isaac I would like to find out for the sake of my viewers how can guys reach out to you if they want to give this conversation going and just learn more about village so you can find us through our social media platform we have Facebook the village T-H-E V-L-A-G-E and Twitter the same Twitter handle at the village LinkedIn at the village and we also have our website www.thevillage.com alright as simple as that that can reach out to you find out more about the village thank you guys for creating time to be with us this was a very interesting conversation to have concerning co-living so if you have any question what you have to do is reach out to them the village world limited that's their website so at Y2F4 channel is where you can find us across all our social media handles at michelleashira is where you can reach out across all my socials so right now we are taking a quick break and we'll be right back