Hello everyone and welcome to for the minions episode 18 of for the minions the weekly show where we talk about some of the Post Paragon mobs currently in production today We're going to be talking about the news and updates as always Then we'll go over the poll results then we have tech time with Ruba and then our top of our discussion is heroes that we think need reworks from Paragon and then we're going to get into some of jackals ideas, which I haven't introduced him yet but It's gonna be myth ideas for ethereal and then after that, but you know, I'm gonna Plug a youtuber that has very few subscribers But I think he did a great video on course map But I am your host the one and only man goose and joining me as always is my lovely co-host Mandy Malmendi How you doing? I'm doing great and today we're joined by jackal. How are you? Yeah, I'm pretty good. How are you guys? Thanks for joining us Why don't you tell us a little bit about how you got started with Paragon your favorite hero all that good stuff? All right, let's start all the way back in early legacy days beta Free beta, I guess would be so I entered Why bottom so I Started out playing a little bit of Murdoch here in there, right so And throughout my time, I think I actually stopped playing for a few months there in legacy because there is a downtime And then I think around monolith I picked up the game again and never stopped since until the death of Paragon and Then from there, I just mean getting the entire time. So I don't know what any other character is ask me about thing now About it Brux, I know he has a pole and he stunts me out of my own. That's it That's all you got to know and give you and who can stun me out of my old exactly just watch out for the snakes All right, and I just wanted to mention it this time the background footage used to be stuff from casting call now It's on the the cinematic edits that shark does on his channel I'll link his channel down in the description below because they're really cool I'm sure you can see them up above our heads right now But let's move on to the news and updates starting with made a buff and core They released some new merch, which is a ball cap, which is kind of cool. I'm all about ball caps, but uh That's neat and then I wanted to dive into their frequently asked Questions because they have quite a few on their website made about the comm and the first one is how many spots? Will there be available for the alpha? This is a question that gets asked a lot They would they intend to release The alpha with 10k spots, however to make sure we don't overload the servers with 10k people at once We will release the keys in waves. This is to make sure we can monitor the servers properly So our customer experience division is handling all the reported bugs So pay he the 10k spot limit might get revised if the need arises I really wanted to bring that up because people got Really pissed off when they didn't get a key for predecessor on the first date was launched So when you go into core just know that the alpha keys will roll out in waves so If you don't get a key the first day don't get too upset about it because you know The keys will come out as the game progresses same thing with predecessor those keys are still going to be coming out as that game progresses.  I just enjoyed watching everybody play to be honest but I mean who knows we'll see and Another question is how can I get an entry into the closed alpha? Pretty much? How can you sign up for the? for the keys For the first clues you can follow to get yourself access to close alpha go to our twitch page And it is a twitch dot TV slash or the game Once there follow the social media channels down below in order to keep track of what's happening with social community The public figures presented here are being provided with alpha keys that they will be giving away on their streams and through promotional events on their channels You may also follow our social media links available on our website, especially discord So pretty much exactly what I've been telling people main thing is get on their discord follow their discord look for those at all mentions And that's the best way to stay up-to-date on how they're going to be doing that alpha keys also, I'll throw the picture up there Mandy and I are both included on the People that are going to get alpha keys to give away I'm not going to give them away during the show I'm probably gonna have a running giveaway because a lot of people don't have time to always watch a certain stream or Catch the show when it's live or anything like that And I don't want those people to miss out on an opportunity to get a key So I'll probably run it through my discord. So if you're not on my discord, I'll link that down below It's not the most active discord ever So don't be expecting like this great mongoose community or anything. There is a nice little community in there But it's I'm not trying to run a discord promotion. I'm just trying to make it easier on me to run the To run the the giveaway for the keys Mandy what what about you? I Haven't worked out any details yet, but I'm thinking I'll probably just make a video announcing This is the giveaway comment and just it'll be completely random I feel like that's the most fair way. You don't have to subscribe. You don't have to like you don't have to do any of that Kind of stuff. Just give everybody a fair shot Yeah, just wait for the comments. It says give me key.  What are you guys's thoughts on that? You want to go ahead Jackal? Yeah, sure. Um, so I was a big fan of do-man's you do in several knows my jam I played that like once or twice and just Pretty much when I find everybody much often because that's our You know 60 HP down to one HP and just one shots with the Q. It's pretty easy But I mean, yeah, I mean it should be like every other mobile Having locked items was a really bad idea. I mean, there was that one point monolith had the six item I guess it would be the items, but there's no cards But I think that was pretty close to being a unlocked Paragon But they still just kind of screwed it up by keeping everybody Affinity locked Right. Yeah Yeah, I definitely kind of Echo those sentence that it just wasn't a good idea. I mean, I guess they were trying to Be a little unique or have something a little different But that was one way that it it wasn't necessarily a positive Way to differentiate themselves from other mobas. So I like it. I'm glad that that's the way that That core is gonna go. Yeah Yeah, one other thing I think a predecessor, I know they're doing the three I guess the Trinity I Don't know what they call about the elements Three elements. I guess they're still kind of keeping around some of the Paragon aspects In that fact that they're having three elements But of course they're having open items So I think that's still a way of keeping like Paragon alive in a sense with their unique And I think core might have Affinities as well. Just like you said with premises or your items aren't locked to an affinity and Next question if I don't answer answer this one people will riot on what platforms will made a buffer release core It is only gonna be on mobile. I'm just kidding. No closed alpha Has to be released Exclusively to PC the function of alpha is to debug stabilize and introduce the quality of experience elements necessary to pass the quality standards That approved core for a console release meeting those standards is the mark that ends alpha and starts closed beta With console access for the game starting first on ps4 The extended markets for Xbox and switch are open to exploration for us And we do have our developer approval for those as well. The primary platforms are PC and ps4 We will be keeping an eye on the others as options for expanding player accessibility and reducing Q times as needed So there you go. There you go. And it seems like Once they start their closed beta is when they kind of plan to also release on ps4 So no estimated time frame that just kind of depends on how the alpha goes and they will be debugging the alpha on PC So there's your answer for now. Hopefully if something new comes out, I will let you know Maybe don't be hoping for the Xbox and switch for a while then guys, right? Maybe you played on ps4, right? I never played on ps4 a little bit. Yeah towards the end. I Started dabbling on ps4, but I never felt comfortable. I would end up going right back to PC Sometimes mid game. I would actually Up and I'm like I can't do this. I Didn't know you could do that Did you have to put the game or you could rejoin the game as I just I kept it going on The ps4 got it up on my PC and it would join me in and then I would just Not know you do that Yep, yeah, I just logged into my account and it started me up right in the game I didn't have to you know abandon or anything like that. I didn't get any type of Negative, I mean it took a little while but I was still trying to you know I would try to like back and then get it done really quick while I was at base Did you play on ps4 or PC jackal PC of course, yeah, okay The last bit of news we have for core is the map test that you saw us run on the last episode of for the minions It's going to be available to all influencers on April 14th So expect to see a whole lot of streamers and youtubers putting up some some more footage of the of the map and it'll be really good to get a lot more Perspectives on on on the on the map like up when I ran the map last week It was you know, I didn't run it too too much to begin with and I just kind of want to display it I went back and I streamed it with a when do the maze great twitch streamer by the way I'll link his twitch stream down in the description too and he had He brought up a lot of really good points and a lot of stuff that I had missed and it's always good Just get various perspectives on the map. So I think that'll be a lot of fun for everybody Maybe you think you you think you'll stream it or do any video any more videos on the core map Yeah, I'm definitely planning to I'll probably try to stream I like I like doing I like the way that's been working out because I've watched like British streams And I watched when you and when do stream and that was really cool because you can kind of interact right away with the With the audience. So I might try to do that. But yeah, definitely like you were saying I think it's really going to Open up a lot of eyes on some, you know Maybe possible issues or whatever because I've watched British stream and your stream with when do like I said and I was like, oh, yeah Those are some some excellent points that they brought up. So that'll be interesting to get everybody's opinions Do you watch a couple streams jackal? Yeah, I watched yours or actually no, I didn't watch yours. I watched your YouTube video and then I watched The the main street Okay, right on yeah So Moving on to a made a maybe what we got for a made of studios this week Well, we got quite a bit from them they have pretty much Bulldoze their their plan And are kind of not not starting over but redoing a lot of stuff However, they do want everybody to know that progress is gonna go much quicker You don't it's not expected to take too long It's it's a lot faster to redo things and it is to begin from ground zero So and they've already made some really good progress. So what they're working on is some of the main issues and bugs that were reported was that input lag so they've already got a working model and There's zero input lag Much better performance. They've told us than the previous version But they still they still have some work to do. So they're gonna start working on Abilities effect ability effects minions towers combat hard UI there They're kind of just given it a complete overhaul. So I personally think that's great I'm glad to hear that they worked on that input lag because that was kind of frustrating and Made it kind of hard to enjoy the game As far as just going in and testing it is it was fine, you know, but to actually get in there and like have fun I found that personally kind of hindering my fun in the game, but What do you guys think of some of these? Reworks they're gonna be doing Go ahead jackal I Think that they're redoing the effects the minions towers in combat Is is a really good idea I Don't really have too much info on the matter. So I don't really know how to input much on that Yeah, that's why but I think it's definitely a good step in the right direction Then I think I think the input line was probably the people that were playing the game That was probably their biggest complaint Hopefully they also fixed the footsteps because that was the biggest complaint that I saw in the comments of my video That I did about it everybody Hated the footsteps Really not at all God they were so loud I mean they were they were noticeably louder But it wasn't anything that I was like this is hindering my experience like I just I was like whatever I guess it's a small thing. It is a small thing, but it was very distracting. I thought oh, that's funny But yeah, I mean sounds like smokey's got everything back on track and hopefully we'll see something out of predecessor again soon And when they do roll it out, I'm sure they'll roll out some more keys So if you did sign up for a predecessor key, there's still hope there's still hope that you'll get one Yeah, I can't wait to get my grubby little hands back on it Then moving on for ethereal this week I just wanted to remind everybody ethereal is its own intellectual property. It is not Paragon at all They started production well before Paragon even announced that it was closing like Core and predecessor and Phoenix Rising wouldn't exist if if Paragon never closed ethereal would they would still be trucking and It's an absolutely amazing new game that it does include It is a MOBA that operates with the z-axis just like Paragon That's why we include it on the show because it has attracted the attention of a lot of Paragon fans Especially fans that are looking for something new not necessarily their old heroes coming back, but they hit jackal I know loves him some ethereal So, um, yeah, I'm excited I just wanted to let people make sure make sure people aren't looking at ethereal as another Paragon remake because it is not They didn't really have much to announce this week though They had us me some new music from UG white sand So they're gonna have their own music in the game that their own music their own art their own art direction Everything's new for ethereal and then I also wanted to announce I couldn't announce it last week because they hadn't quite announced it yet But the contest winners were UG ace. I say UG because they are now members of undying games So UG ace and UG mystique. So yay Let's platform and jackal actually came very close to being one of those Yeah Good Yeah, I see you in the I see you're you're you're you seem to be a very excited for ethereal I'm glad to see that I'm like I like to see some hype for ethereal because that's the one that I'm really excited for I mean, I miss Paragon and I'm gonna play the shit out of predecessor and core but I'm really really looking forward to ethereal and Can't wait to see what those guys do And moving on to Phoenix Rising we actually have a little bit about the updates for fever rising not not too much Christian was telling me that they're they're going back to their art team for concept work So that means that they are moving forward. They are there is a little bit of progress That's not huge or anything, but it's just nice to hear something out of Phoenix Rising I don't always include them in the show because they are laying very low until they have something solid that they Could show the community. I just wanted to make sure let everybody know that they are not dead They're still going gets another It was very much inspired Phoenix Rising is very much inspired by Paragon But they're using their own heroes their own map their own mechanics So that's very cool to see as well. I'm looking forward to that one I'm not sure when their alpha is going to be or anything like that But hopefully pretty soon we'll see a little more progress from visionary games in Phoenix Rising Yeah, it's definitely another one. I'm excited for to see come out. Oh, yeah, not not just that It's a z-axis. It's that they're recreating something that died Having them restart from nothing is is a huge feat that they're to So it's just it's good. It's good to see. Yeah, they put a lot of work into that And I'm not giving up as a huge deal after losing a lot of their teams That's an excellent point. And I think it's really important to remind people That both ethereal and but particularly Phoenix Rising, you know, they're starting from scratch They didn't have assets or anything like that. They are building everything from scratch plus they took that hit So, you know, just because we're not hearing week after week these huge updates Doesn't mean that they're not still creating something really really cool. So I'm really I'm Definitely cheering for them. I can't wait to to hear a little bit more from them for sure If you're interested in learning about any of these games any more about these games I have all of theirs not all of there But some of their social media is linked in the video description below So there's any of these games you want to learn a little bit more out go check them out for yourself Do your own a little bit of research and find out which one you want to kind of root for and look forward to Now before we move into poll results, we did open our patreon last week We have our first patron it is up suicidal. So thanks a lot man coming in at that siege minion tier Really appreciate it. I'm gonna go tiers with the with the subscriptions like minion siege minion super minion and then Or prime, I guess if anybody goes that high prime So, uh, yeah, that's a great news for us That is so cool. Thank you so much. It'll help us fund some of the uh, some of the stuff that we need for the show Now, uh Maybe let's give them a heart. Let's give them a little heart. Let's put our Um, if you guys can imagine So for the poll results last week out of 937 votes We had core at 62 predecessor at 21 percent ethereal at 14 phoenix rising at three This week a little different. Um out of 1.2 k votes We have core at 78 percent predecessor at 10 percent ethereal at 10 phoenix rising at 2 So huge difference. I guess everybody liked the core map So that was a nice map. It was it was a beautiful map. So I think that got people really hyped up for core um I should also be keeping track of how many votes are on here because that's kind of funny too it just keeps going up and up and uh So I'll go ahead and switch over to the bar graph so you can see How the uh, how everything has been tallying up since I started this poll and that's kind of the end result that I'm going for But that's enough for the poll results this week on tech time with rubo We're going to be talking about distance matching and it's kind of important and applies to core I went to a little bit of it. I kind of showed it off with calari when I was on the map And uh, because I kind of knew that we were going to be doing distance matching this week So let's go ahead and get into tech time with rubon All right, everybody. It is once again time for tech time with rubon this time. We're going to be going over uh distance matching which is something I don't quite have a good comprehension of myself Uh, I did look into it a bit But uh, this is why we have rubo because he knows what he is doing. So rubo, why don't you tell us about distance matching? I'll do. Thank you very much mongoose. So um, you may you may realize that I'm not showing you the Unreal editor this week to the start. We instead have a 100 meter race. Um, you say in bolt lens spoiler it was Seven years ago So we're going to start off this video. Um, and we're going to see a couple of things So what I want you to do is we're going to look at start of the race the middle of the race and the end of the race It's only 100 meters. So, um It should take 10 seconds So they're they're these um runners are stationary Now So this is the point at the end of the race where all these runners they're running at, um, they're pretty much running, um 100 meters in 10 seconds So they're effectively running, you know, like their their average speed is about 10 meters per second So all these guys are running at full speed Okay, so that's the first concept. So these guys are running at full speed Now if I play the video again What we're going to see is that all these guys who are running They don't come to an immediate stop So apart from you saying who runs off you can see all these runners here need about 50 or 60 meters to come to a complete stop Okay, so that's this known as their deceleration rate or their deceleration distance These guys who are running at full speed, like if you're running at full speed with big strides, you need time to stop Likewise, if you're walking down the street and you have to stop suddenly You can almost stop on a diamond come to an immediate stop That's the concept that um, we're going to have a quick look at Um with some of these paragone animations. So got that in your head. This is us running at full speeding coming to a stop Now, um, I've got here, um, I'll go in and have a little look We have shinbi and the reason I've picked shinbi is because her animations are very Long like I don't know what they did or how they how they built them But we have shinbi's animation here and what I'm going to do is I'm going to go back to the start and we're going to play this Um, this particular animation is gen genbi shinbi's jog forward stop animation So this is used when shinbi is running forward. So um away from the screen like towards someone And she decides to come to a stop. So I'm just going to play it and to let you have a look And we'll let it look a couple of times. So there's a lot of waste at the end Um, where she just kind of idles and comes to a stand still. So what I'm actually going to do is I'm going to quickly pause it and I'm just going to Remove everything after there. Okay. So we've got a much shorter animations. This will look So you can see shinbi's running at full speed So she's got this full run and then she comes to a stop Um and because of the way that paragon does animation I think we talked about this a couple of weeks ago mongoose when we started talking about animation Paragon's very template driven. So um because they have heroes every three weeks All this animation in snobcap is incredibly expensive.  So what paragon want to do is the other animators, they wanted to make it as inexpensive as possible For doing animations and stop distances is this stop matching It's also called reverse root motion was one of the ways that they wanted to do that So what we're going to do is we're going to take this animation and we're going to walk through it backwards To give you an idea. So shinbi stood here. This is her stationary And if we go back a little bit You can see that um as shinbi backs up You can see how she's slowing down So she's going really fast in a forward motion And then at some point in the middle She decides she's going to put on the brakes right there You can see that the weight moves from her legs change shape So her legs are running and then they change to the knee comes in And her thighs compress and she slows down So she's like throwing her weight into it and slowing down till she comes to a complete stop Now because of the way this animation is done, I can either be going really fast and slow down Or if I stop a little bit there, you see that I can actually control how much of the animation I use Okay, yeah So if I say I'm just walking, you know, I don't actually have to go all the way through this stop animation Because it'll look really really long if I'm going really slow And I go through all this animation my feet are going to slide I'm going to take forever to stop and that's not what you want in a video game Like you want if I stop I stop if I start I start but you still want it to look good So this um this section down the bottom this curve that you can maybe see This is known as a distance curve and it's um something that's in paragon It's used in fortnight as well It has not been made available to the public properly like the curves here But unless you know what you're doing, there's nothing really that you can do with this curve So you cannot use this technology unless you're very familiar with the unreal engine So for the time being You need to either work around it or do something differently But this curve is known as the distance curve and what it does is it calculates where shinby's going to stop So if you imagine shinby's running along And she's coming to a stop This curve is used to predict when shinby will stop So for example here, um, she's probably going to be traveling Maybe I don't know six foot Maybe a little bit less not about six foot. So shinby's going to travel six foot So what that means is the game knows that she needs to come to a complete stop and six feet Um, and it uses this curve. This is a this curve is almost like the distance away from the stop So you see this marker here at the end of the curve this one here it says zero That is when shinby comes to a complete stop So her feet aren't planted yet But she shouldn't have any forward motion So you can see that her her feet are just settling So this foot her left foot Give you a better angle Scoot round You can see here at this point here her left foot doesn't actually move Okay, she stopped Right that left foot is planted on the ground So even though her right foot is just settling and coming to normal shinby is done So this marker here is that I'm done stopping And yeah, she'll like sit and move but it's done there And then if I move back away, you'll see that the legs start to travel away And so okay. Yeah, I can use this curve to figure out exactly Where I need to stop So if I'm on a controller and I'm only pushing a little and I need to stop a little bit It'll just use a little bit the animation to come to a stop like it would have to do the full thing Likewise if I'm running really fast, I've like I've got like blue buff and I've got I don't know Like a movement card or a dash or speed or nabash speeds me up I'm probably gonna be really fast. So I might use more of the animation Um, give you one more example I know People were quite keen to see boy Boris He's looking at no, no, I'm just digression. How cool does Boris look? Yeah, right when you look at the fur. He just looks so cool I'm looking really looking forward to the the remake games Getting him out in the players hands So we can properly play him for the first time Um, but this is his jog left stop So you can see that as he comes to a stop Um, his uh, his stock is actually quite abrupt because he's a much heavier character And the animation required is a bit different. So you can see again We're looking at this foot. So has left on your right You can see as a back out How the uh, that's the stop point and then the animation sells from there on then So he kind of does the same so depending how fast he's going You can come to a stop and again, it uses this distance curve It calculates where Boris will stop And then it uses that driven from the game to play the right level of animation So that means that regardless of the speed you're going Your feet stick to the ground Um, and it looks natural. So it doesn't look like you're playing excessive heavy animations Yeah, um, and that's that so that's it kind of in a nutshell I don't know if you had any questions or anything else you wanted to see No, that that's absolutely fantastic. That's uh, that's really cool. So yeah, so it's it's basically they're they're manufacturing their own inertia Yes, exactly. Yes. Um, or calculating the inertia that the character is going to have Um, to figure out how much they need to back out from it like that this technology is called distance matching But it's also called reverse root motion So it's figuring out not where my character is but where my character is going to be Um, right and calculating from that using and then assigning the animations Yep, basically it goes mostly where are you stopping and then it picks it on the curve And this curve then drives the animation in game. It goes, okay So yeah, you actually see here. Um, this point is time is point three and the value is minus 55 So that looks uh, that looks for when Boris is going to be stopping at 55 units say Um, and then it then plays it from this time. So it calculates that and then plays it out. Um, And this is this is like really really this is like the the top fancy stuff for paragon Um, and it was really driven because when you've got heroes coming out every three weeks If you're able to half or quarter The amount of animations you need for these heroes and still make them look as good Um, like that's a massive saving and a massive time saving Saving for their mo cap team their animators Um, all the all the people that have to put the animations together all the programmers It's super super simple, but you still have that amazing paragon level of animation quality Yeah, that's really cool. I really appreciate you showing us this this uh When I when I watched this myself I didn't get it at all like that was I was lost in the sauce But yeah, you broke the way you broke it down and I actually understand this now I really appreciate that. Um, you're very welcome and like, um, it's worth my note of thing I just want to find one more here's one here. Okay. So this is a shinby one and this is a really really clunky one Um, no, no, that's not the right one. That's not the right one. Um, there's another shinby one That's that's really bad. I think it's her This is sinks one. Yeah, here's another zinks one. Um, that I just wanted to quickly show Um Some of the feet sliding and you can see here the feet are much snappier For some reason shinby is really bad. Um with her animations and a lot of the other characters are much better So you can actually see the curves a lot shorter But when you go through these curves are all over the place. Some have really long animations. Some have really short And it's because their animators didn't have to worry about the length and doing all that extra work They could just record this hero stopping Um, and does she have it? She should have it where her feet notifies Okay, this one doesn't have it. Um, I want quickly See if this shinby has it. She doesn't have it either. Does she have notifies? She does not Uh, see sometimes some of the heroes have what are known as foot notifies, which are the uh The feet stopping they actually record them to do it as well, but these ones don't have them And I take it well too good, but hopefully that kind of gives you the idea and the gist of uh Distance matching and it gives you an idea. Um, but I will say longest This distance matching stuff is gonna be one of the hardest things That um, the remake teams are gonna have to bring in if they want to Like capture all that paragon animation stuff. This is the uh, this is the the the tough tough one Okay, um I recently got a I got a chance to run around one course map, um Kind of giving away the time that we're recording this but uh, they're they're calari um Kind of had this As far as like take off and um in stopping there was you know, there was a bit of inertia involved However, they they actually had like you were actually slower as you took off not just your animations But the speed of your hero is is a little bit slower as you take off And i'm kind of wondering if they uh, if they did any of this I I tried asking but I don't think I was asking the right person Yeah, and then maybe it's like it's not hard like this stuff's not impossible Like the only thing that um, like they've given us everything to do it You just have to have a programmer that goes in They like definitely like there's definitely possible like there's ways you can get around not having this Like there's a couple especially especially um as we talked about like if you're not using controller There are a lot of ways that you can make it look as good because you only have to worry about starting stop You don't have all the analog stick 5% 10% 20% um But yeah, like if you add in some speed warping and then some Um, like figure out the stops to start You can probably make something look good without it just not like when like but again when you get to controller time in ps4 That's when this is going to be a lot more critical right, yeah Right. Oh man. I really appreciate really appreciate you explaining to us the uh the distance matching because that uh That definitely broke it down for me. Uh, hopefully hopefully everybody was able to grasp that and understand It a little better and uh realize what it takes to make these heroes come alive Uh, yeah, very welcome as always if you have any questions either file it on to mongus, um, or come find me somewhere more than happy to help All right, I appreciate it ruba. Well, uh, I'll go ahead and link his uh twitch and youtube down in the uh video description below All right, everybody. I hope you enjoyed tech time with the ruba. It's always very interesting I think so at least so we're going to move on to our topic for discussion this week Which is which paragon heroes do we think kind of needed a rework? Um jackal you had a lot of input on this throughout the week. So why don't you kick us off and let us know Uh, who you think needed reworked and how you would rework them Yeah, okay, so um, originally I thought howitzer needed one of the uh reworks Um, his ultimate was very unreliable as everybody knows it was it was good crowd control and only really good synergy with uh decker um And being able to control the final nuke would be a big game changer I think uh, I think it should be kind of shot like an r2000 where he's up in the sky and just Shoots down the final nuke after all the mines go off. Um, and then the slow mines I think that the way they shot out and the way they activated were a bit uh finicky uh, so I thought that instead of just going off and being a slow mine dealing damage They go off and be a slow field in those little target areas And then with an initial damage explosion, uh upon, you know detonation um And then uh, I mean the knock mine really didn't really need to change much. Um, But it doesn't really knock howitzer Uh high enough to do uh any sort of escapes Um, I guess it I it was really good for escaping enemies who were close to you and you can just knock them away Uh, but if you're an experienced player, you could easily just uh know that it's coming And then uh, his r2000 was easily the best in his kit. I think by far Um, it was an extreme range poke which you know, uh Getting would be the next person who would be extreme range poke. Um, but having the r2000 Was think a little bit bigger uh of a range and I think it did a bit more damage too um And then I think terra obviously She was like the last hero to come in the paragon and uh her kit was not great Uh didn't really help with her um release Um, her ultimate was probably the most unique. Uh, I mean cc immunity and being able to run through everybody was probably what made her kit what it was But every other ability in her kit really didn't complement it well enough Um for her to be able to do anything with that fault in this because all she would do is run in and then just kind of sit there Yeah, yeah, you're right there. I I didn't get an opportunity to play terra all that much.  Oh, yeah, and uh apparently from the overview I kind of hit it on the head with her but I had a few I've been doing these videos on my channel called call to arms where I'm talking about stuff that I think should be changed from Paragon with uh predecessor and core and I was actually putting a lot of thought into terra. Um I think worthless assault. I don't know if you've ever played balona in smite But I think uh or ruth has called it worthless assault, didn't I ruthless assault? I think could use the balona treatment where the initial first swing The more people you hit with that first swing Amplifies the damage of the second swing. I think if they did that with terra I think that would be really cool on a really unique thing for her Maybe uh increase the range of that initial swing So they should uh grab more minions I think an armor shred would go great there uh to amplify that damage and having it as kind of like a utility for the Rest of your team to be able to deal more damage to whatever she's targeting as the tank You mean like the first swing does armor shred and the second swing. Yeah. Oh, yeah, that would be cool. Yeah, that would be cool And uh the other stuff of her kit.   So I think with a slower pace. I think that'll be a much better and more effective ability and I think uh Her ultimate would be perfect For dunking in core like yes, it'd be very close to the core you activate her ultimate run through everybody's bullshit and just dunk it Yeah, uh, I think that um in her kit um Having the uh cc immunity Uh, it wouldn't I guess I guess it would be really good for uh dunking. Yes, but um, it would also be really Um, I feel like it would destroy the game a little bit at the same time too because if you just have a terra And you get the core, uh, you pretty much can just run through the entire enemy team without worrying about it And then don't work. Um, I think I watched predict one of predict's videos where he touched on like a delay Uh for the core dunk.  I think that's uh, a pretty good idea to counteract any sort of, um Uh special ultimates that would or like special movements, uh that you could beat someone there or whatever Run through an entire enemy team unhindered Yeah, uh, I think it's a a good spot I mean even if you like run a muriel and muriel's on the other side of the map with the core buff somebody runs into the pit Um, and not the pit the core dunk spot and then just flies across the map Which was a common strategy and legacy. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, it was a huge strategy. I was always annoyed that a lot of me I mean other heroes too like If you gave revenant the uh the orb He could just ult one person and then it's just him and that person And then he could just go dunk without having to worry about the rest of their team. Exactly. Yeah, and then, um I think Tara's uh shield block thing is a lot like gravestone in uh, I think they'd kind of just reuse the ability there That was like a sense of reusing an ability near the end there Um, and I think to expand on it it would it should take a percentage of the damage that it would have dealt as a shield instead of Uh a flat shield per level Okay. Yeah. Yeah, that would be cool Uh, Mandy who do you think needed a rework? The first hero that came to mind was wukong. Unfortunately, um, he just was Kind of kind of broken kind of op. Um kind of had skills that were Unnecessary almost um because he was already so Powerful like why why did he need a stun? Why did he need you know? And I don't know that I mean, I think that's kind of a common one And I definitely didn't do uh the research that jackal did and to come up with Ways to fix that. Um, I'm very very impressed by that And I actually love your suggestions for howitzer because howitzer was one that I would play around with from time to time And had a lot of fun with and your suggestions would make him 10 times more fun Um, but yeah, so I don't know how I would personally fix wukong. Um, because I really didn't even play him I just know from playing against him It was like infuriating sometimes the way he could just shred a tower With that 10 000 hairs or whatever it was and or you know, I don't know just a little little op in my opinion Yeah, not only could he shred a tower. He didn't even need minions. He could just jump in there to exactly And have the tower dead before he the tower could kill him It was even worse than legacy rampage Yes, it was it was worse than legacy rampage and it was far worse I mean gravestone used to do that.  So it wasn't as bad of a problem when gravestone used to do it But yeah, that that that's the one I picked was wukong I think something they might be able to change to make him A little less overbearing in the split push department, but still keep his kit functional in a team fight I don't know if they they may have even tried this in in paragon, but I don't remember that if they did um Towers took less ability damage than they did basic damage. They took very very small amounts of ability damage They just changed 10 000 hairs to deal ability damage instead of basic damage That would kind of prevent him from being able to just destroy towers um Yeah, I don't know if they ever tried that though. They may have no, I don't think they ever did unless they did it off Off scene, but to be to be real. They didn't really try enough with what the community wanted. Yeah That seems like a very small simple solution just change His ultimate to deal ability damage instead of basic damage.  It would just I mean his attack power Is a basic damage. It would just you know scale with his ability power So I don't know. I think that would be a nice change for wukong. It might fix him Probably not because he was just too good at escaping Hmm. I think one of the main problems was that wukong kind of also had his ultimate crit Um, I think if you would have put it over to ability damage, you'd have to exchange for that crit Somewhere in there. Um, yeah Because he was not only was he getting split pushing, but he was obviously like one of the Like main solo lane dueling types um So I think changing his ultimate to that would fix it, but it would also break in uh, completely And pretty much got him You think so. Yeah, it might yeah Yeah, I don't think you'd be anywhere near as played. I think you would actually become a tank If that happened Yeah, he there was he was a problem though. I mean epic had to remove him from the game for a while He was such a big yeah that yeah, that was that was insane Well, hopefully all period the people behind the minds behind predecessor and core can figure out a way to bring wukong back without having him be so Damned broken I mean, even if they can't they'll listen to the community Yeah, yeah, they've done a great job of that so far So moving on from the topic of discussion Let's talk about jackals brainstorm. He wanted to talk about some uh, unofficial myths some myth creations for ethereal This is something that a lot of people really enjoy doing is creating their own heroes for Paragon or whatever or what have you and uh, you can't really create new heroes for paragon because those heroes are already in place Those assets are already there maybe way down the road But for ethereal and phoenix rising we can you know Maybe come up with some good hero ideas, you know submit them to uh to both teams and see what happens So jackal, what was your uh, what was your idea for a for a myth for ethereal? Uh, so everybody knows uh, I I mean gideon so Uh, I came up with a gideon type arc mage. So arc mage would be kind of like their uh, their mage uh, pretty much Um, and uh, I pretty much just gave him everything that gideon had Uh, and including I brought back the uh legacy meteor storm Where deal damage has a rain down I know that ability wasn't great, but I feel like um having an extra like effect with it would fix most of the problems um on top of that I also gave him a passive uh of every fourth every fourth spell cast a um, you would get extra pen And your next ability would have an extra effect. So, um, for example for my meteor storm, I would give it um A burn damage every three seconds or sorry every like 0.5 seconds But it would reapply and stack every time uh, you would take damage from inside the burning field that would be placed on the ground after the meteor storm Okay, right on. So it's kind of a mix between gideon and crunch. You would have to time How many abilities you had used to know which one that you want to add an effect to Exactly. Yeah, and then I kind of mixed in um I can't I can't really place which which hero this would be but um, I gave him a debris field that would uh, essentially block uh projectiles from hitting him For four seconds. So, um, I I gave uh the ultimate also a um I kind of uh like gideons all but you could cast abilities while in that ultimate phase So you'd be sitting there in the air sucking in people and also dropping meteor storms and the debris field around you. So you'd be dealing constant extra damage and then you could um, even just hit hit like debris field and have No projectiles hit you but you can still be stunned out of it by Uh, say like abilities. So when I say projectiles, I mean like uh basic attacks. Okay, gotcha. I was gonna say that seems a little overpowered if he's yeah, yeah Yeah, that that would not be fun, especially for the full duration. Um, yeah, and then Uh, I kind of had two ideas for an ultimate Um, so one would have like a black hole that you'd place and you'd select another enemy to be sucked into the black hole And then they would be executed if they're below a certain threshold Um when they were sucked in the center and then everybody else inside of the void would then uh be slowed But wouldn't be pulled in Okay, um, and then the other one was just uh getting to all the ultimate but with the uh with the um casting inside of it and uh And then just a massive explosion at the end of it. Um for its uh level up So it it would be like a big bang and just float everywhere and deal extra damage. Um It's slow and yeah, it would just be Uh a game changer if you could pull that off in a team fight where you're losing Now when you say debris field, do you mean just like like something that surrounds him kind of spins around him? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, sorry. It would be it. Yeah, it'd be something that spins around him. Um, and it would tick damage But I don't think I gave it a slow unless you Uh had that fourth extra um Ability built up Yeah, that would be pretty cool. That would be a cool thing to have for sure Especially if you want especially as a caster when you're trying to take down a um a ranger hunter ADC whatever you want to call them If you can have a way to negate their basic attacks You actually have a chance against them late game as opposed to just getting shredded instantly Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean if you want I can give it to you and you can either put in like the description or something Yeah, I'll throw it up there luck for whatever. Yeah Oh, yeah, sounds good. I'll give you a picture of yourself here Maybe you got any uh any ideas for myths or anything? No, I am definitely not creative enough. That's why I didn't bother with the lore content or anything That's all good. So uh if you guys have an idea for for a myth or a uh What do they call them in phoenix rising again masters if you have ideas for a myth or a master Let me know in the comments below and maybe we can feature it in the next for the minions for now Let's move on to the community builder Um after I did last weeks for the minions I had a couple people ask me if they could use the uh the footage of the core map And of course I let him do it because I don't care And uh one of the one of the people that asked me was a guy named jelly knees And uh his youtube channel like I subscribed to it. I was I was the third subscriber like it's very tidy But his video was awesome like you would think that he'd been doing it for years Maybe he has been doing it for years and just decided to start a gaming youtube channel because The video was on point. It was well edited. It was what he was really well spoken. He had a lot of good points So uh check out jelly knees um I'll like uh, I'll like the video at the end of this Video in the uh on the end card.  We'll pump him up Cool All right, uh, I think that's it for this time. Let's move on to plugs. Uh jackal. You got anything you want to plug Uh, I guess just my twitch. Um, I guess just jack will fell That's my uh twitch plug. Um, I guess that's I don't really uh stream too much though I just kind of wanted to get on here and share some stuff with you guys and And uh, hopefully get some extra pointers out there and the the myth talking all that Yeah, it was great to have you on here, man I hope to come back soon Absolutely Mandy anything you want to plug? um, I don't have anything new out as of yet not since my last video about the core map but I am going to be doing some more of like the cheapskate gaming and mediocre gaming and stuff like that right on right on right on that'll be coming soon And for me, I'll just go ahead and plug our patreon again. Um, it is uh patreon dot com slash For the minions go ahead and check that out if you want to support the show that the money from that's going to go Towards trying to improve the show a little bit But uh, I think that's going to be it for this episode. It was a fun one I appreciate everybody coming out to watch, but that is going to be all for now. Goodbye everyone Amanda Goose


Now great news this week for Dunnegall in that the FBD young farmer of the year is actually from the county from Letter Kenney well or just outside or at least that's where his farm is Ballyard just down the road and he's a sheep farmer This is the the first time I think that the young farmer of the year is from Dunnegall And he was also named category award winners for land mobility So I'm glad to say that the winner now Dwayne Shields has joined us in the studio Dwayne congratulations to you first of all Thank you very much Sean. Good afternoon. Good afternoon and land mobility. What what what is that for? What explain that to me? So I suppose that's making the use of whatever lands available to you making the best use it Getting the most productive production out of it and most productive to make use that land Maybe not only land land that you're renting or leasing and taking the most out of that there Okay maximizing it maximizing out there and getting the most out of it yet, right? you're a sheep farmer and One or two farms that you have two lease farms and then our own farm, okay So you have your hands full in with the sheep And you have your hands full doubly as well because you your lecture in agricultural sciences at ATU I don't need to use this last September so we're into our second year now down there Teaching the honours for you the ag science degree down there. How's that? Good. Good. Very enjoyable Which do you enjoy most the teaching or the sheep farming the farming? I think it's kind of nice to a mix of both them and get out of the farm clothes going to the teaching for a while and then What I suppose it's great being a teacher in that you're able you've you've hands-on knowledge Of a lot of the stuff that you're chatting about and stuff that you're teaching I it's nice that you can give examples not in your teaching things nice to be able to work back and give examples of How things are done or how you've done something maybe learn from them examples and if you have an example for them It's maybe easier for them to understand the how it works or how it should be there. Yeah, and And now your profile will increase with this one So they'll definitely know for sure, you know What you do and and understand you're chatting from experience There's a there's quite a process to go through to to get to even get to the final here So first thing maybe I got an email first to say you've been nominated for you've been entered to it And then there's 50 then interviewed first 50 then is interviewed that's an online interview and then the select 15 semi-finalists from that the 15 semi-finalists then went to Port Leish for interviews. So it around interviews two weeks ago in Port Leish 40 months 45 minutes and then the select six from that and then we go Just like go to the Radisson blue on choose to there and the final six was interviewed there then Okay, for the one or down here picked it as a winner on Tuesday Yeah, right and A lot of a lot of questions like they They dig deep they do a definitely do I they didn't leave too many stones and turn there's a bit of pressure on the last interview There was an hour and 10 or 15 minutes like go through everything your productivity your accounts What you do and what and what steps you're using to be innovative in the farm What you're doing to help the environment farm safety Want to see your output Where it's come first of all this you're expected to have all the answers all the facts all the figures I know that obviously did Seem to do it. I went very well So did you I was unexpected and the the land mobility award that separate that separate yes, so that's one sector of six sectors first and That came from the sector so the six sectors came from the semi-finalist the 15 and semi-finalist That interview is to get the six sectors like last year the six finalists. There's five of them dairy farmers So the sector winners come from the semi-final and then the highest six marked out of semi-final goes out or it goes into the final Then okay, so I'm the last four winners have come from dairy farmers. So it's a bit of a change I'm a bit of a surprise. There's a sheep farmer And did they tell you what they were impressed with or he just announced as a winner just now as a winner Talking to the judges after or the entry panel after they can't help me Going ahead of what things so like we're putting in multi species there now for five years and that's right multi species sword So using alternative forage to fix nitrogen into the soil that you're not putting on as much fertilizer It's kind of like things in the fertilizer boom there last year But there's still the news this week that there's grants. Hi, there's grants. There's grants last year for the big grants This is our fifth year didn't know if we're back in a rotation background some of the grounds done for a second time That's so I've seen about it in New Zealand when I was out there in 2018, okay, and And what's what sort of things what does that involve exactly? So same as receding a field with grass You just put in chickpea plantain and clover along with it And the plantain the chickpea then they're maybe taking nutrients from further down the soil Taking that up break in soil pans and that taking them nutrients that if there comes a dry spell or if Ground dries out early in the year. They're taking the nutrients up from deeper down the soil And they also have health benefits in so you get away with there's natural tannins in them So you're getting away with less warmers. There's a big problem with antibiotic resistance in the country or in the world And yeah, you're getting away with less warmers. They have tant natural tannins in them that Killer prevent the animal being affected with worms or reduce the amount of worms are affected with so you're getting used less warmers less antibiotics and So it means that You have to warm you can get away with less warmers in the shape and less fertilizer. That's fertilizer so the land The clover you're putting in is fixing the nitrogen out of that atmosphere and making it available to the grass plant So by under just that clover then you're getting away with less fertilizer to you And you implanted close to rivers there like one of the farms are over and so you implanted right to the bank of the River, you're not allowed to spread fertilizer to the river so you're making the most of every inch of the field that way, yeah, and If I was a farmer I'm listening now I think you know, that's a lot of bother so much hand here just to spray fertilizer. Is it Well, suppose we had a farm walk chagas organized a farm walk out last year and uncle's farm out here And we looked at it as multi-spaces looking receding. We looked at different ways of Incorporate so plowing or mental or what we're going to incorporate Bigot tens that there seems a lot on people interest the price of those fertilizers mad it's well back this year But still expensive you can get away with less it so it's not suited to every system But for system that it is sort of to it's works very well. Yeah, there's big savings to me What's the biggest challenges in sheep farming at the minute? I suppose the weather this year we've got so far. That's all farming That's all farming and prices. They're either fairly strong all year That's the slack about this last few weeks But hopefully about a rise again. They seem to start to steady up and maybe go up again There's always a supposed to have challenges and put costs feet didn't come back the way it should have come back this year Should have been back a lot more. It hasn't got back enough and them usual challenges as well Speaking of challenges, I mean, how do you how do you overcome the time challenge if you're doing a lecturing and farming? Good help there. I've younger brother's very keen at Jardin and mom and dad sure Irons whatever irons have to run Everybody's roped in There's no lambing season Lama season everyone's there and we're looking up a good luck of students there too for lambing season So they might help out with lambing as well There's a lot that's changed in farming in recent years in particular and there's now, you know Are you the move towards, you know protecting the environment biodiversity and means farmers become more aware Hi, and they have to be I suppose. It's that's where we're going to be going in the future There's an eye on us and everyone's watching it to see that and I mean, there's no harm either It's it's getting us to adapt to that and yeah a lot of younger farmers coming on through there Maybe more open to adapting to that as well. So yeah, and and they're sort of when they're starting out on the path That's that's sort of the way it is and they they don't they don't change those those are the practices when they're I suppose Farming in general is kind of become more more and more technical and there's a lot more if you go in there like the green Start here and jaggers and that are Kenny or the degree down there in the ATU there like it's oversubscribed again this year There's yeah working in 71st year students and there's maybe a hundred entered for applied for it like so there's a Definitely there's a want or a desire for that new knowledge in there and that's kind of what they've been showing on them Whether it be the green start Or an honours tree or whatever it may be where they're going a lot more than going for their education now for our culture And that's what they're showing. I think it's gonna be to learn before they and then take them practices that they're learning take them home then and yeah, I'd happen with home. Yeah, and So what would you say to anybody just thinking about taking up sheet farming?  So, you know, what would you say to them? I don't know It wouldn't have been enough the bat and I didn't need to be Fond of them before you'd be into a lot of work in them But I had a passion for passion for farmer and maybe a passion for sheep there But anyone that there's a to return them definitely things don't right. There's a turn on them yet. Yeah well listen congratulations again FBD young farmer of the year and You know seeing this a lot of the previous winners have been dairy farmers most come as like a double shock I had was wasn't expecting it on. I was kind of happy to go into the last six I was very happy that kind of the first entry and then to get the overall it wasn't expect I thought a big one down the dairy route again there Can they've a lot more information available to them their record and milky area yield and they've a lot of information EBA all the breedings available to the source Remember that step ahead and the rest is trying to catch up with them But it's nice to see that I've been recognized that it's not just area that the rest of under zero the rest of sectors have been recognized as well Absolutely, absolutely. Okay, wait, congratulations again. Thank you. Cheers


Welcome to the last set of news to get top stories in crypto and a big amount of bite-sized pieces today instead of talking about the news What I want to do is really dig into the lawsuit The chapter 11 bankruptcy with Celsius and to a lesser extent with Voyager And there's a couple of questions that have come up actually many questions from a lot of the viewers from the last Videos that we've done and what I did was I reached out To some contacts just to get some information and to experts who could help me answer a bunch of these questions And it came back McConnell and Valdez one of the largest and oldest law firms in Puerto Rico that also branches in Miami in New York and I got an expert and his name is Najuan Zorobani, Trinidad and He is a bankruptcy expert lawyer and he's been doing this for 15 years And what I did is I sat down with him and asked him some some basic questions about the reorganizations What exactly is chapter 11? How does that differ from different bankruptcy? Where things are going how this is going to affect regulation and more so without further ado Let's jump in and talk to Najuan and before we go on just so you know, this is not legal advice So please consult with your own lawyer. So let's jump in All right, buddy. So as promised I brought somebody in here who could really shed some light on exactly what's going on in these proceedings Now, this is just a general overview of bankruptcy because I am not a lawyer So again, I brought Najuan in to tell us exactly what it is. Najuan Thanks again for stopping by this is going to help a lot of people just understand the process Thank you for the invitation. Happy to be here.  How you define that and what are the different chapters in bankruptcy? The next one is let's go over these first day proceedings for the Celsius and just really break it down There's a couple of key questions that I tried to answer But I need somebody who is more of a professional like yourself Next up what makes a chapter 11 successful in your experience because you are going through a lot of those And in your law firm right now, that's what you do and then lastly How does this case transfer to general crypto regulation? I think as time moved forward, we're going to take a look and say well This could actually set precedent especially with the proceedings that are going on right now. So My man First one What is bankruptcy and to find the different chapters in such bankruptcy so we can actually understand and move forward Sure, no problem. So bankruptcy first of all is a legal protection It's a statute on as one of the federal statutes called the bankruptcy code So the concept of bankruptcy is fairly simple The first one is it allows a debtor the debtor is, you know, basically the one who has all the debt cannot pay it out It's insolvent that allows him on an opportunity to pay their debt and get out and get a fresh start At the same time it has a dual purpose a lot. It allows creditors on organized fashion in order to collect and puts them in priorities And enlist to collect so it avoids a run to the courthouse so that the debtor can operate So in a nutshell that essentially is what bankruptcy Is so and then we we talk about the chapters people hear about the concept of chapters So the bankruptcy code is divided into different chapters So that's the reason why you have chapters, but the main ones are And we hear chapter seven chapter seven bankruptcy. It's a liquidation Usually an asset based bankruptcy where you take the debtor's assets And you pay out the creditors as much as you can until you shut it down The next that you have is a chapter nine that does not apply here, which is a municipal bankruptcy I'm involved in a case which is basically a chapter nine Correct Then you have a chapter 11, which is what we have here with the Celsius bankruptcy as well as with Voyager Chapter 11 is a reorganization the it's mostly used by Corporate or commercial debtors Even individual maybe high net worth individuals who could file to chapter 11. It's a more complex process The idea of a chapter 11 bankruptcy is you get a plan a reorganization That ultimately gets confirmed and you pay everyone out does not mean you pay everyone 100 But you pay them what they're entitled to under the bankruptcy code And those are the main ones that you'll see you have others such as chapter 12, which is for family fisherman chapter 13 Which is individual bankruptcy reorganizations and chapter 15 Which coincidentally is what in three hours capital is And that is a multi jurisdictional bankruptcy. It's essentially a foreign bankruptcy that you could file in the united states Gotcha, so that one seems a heck of a lot complex. We'll left we'll let three hours capital deal with that So chapter 11 reorganization not liquidation. We're trying to get us some kind of consensus and move ourselves forward So let's break it down a little bit further So let's talk about the first day proceedings and really go over some some of the different statements that were put forth by council Which I didn't really understand perfectly. So that's why I'm glad you're here So this is the first day proceedings. Again, if you want to find this, there's a link in the description You can find it yourself. This is exactly what was presented to the judge And here's the big questions that came up the key legal questions Let's just go over the first one by the numbers number one Are the crypto assets and celsius possession property? Of the estate is the answer this question different for crypto assets held under the custody versus the earn program Yeah, it's a loaded question And what about crypto assets transferred to celsius to collateralize institutional and retail loans? So really this is like a three for one type of question So najoan, what do you think about this one? Yeah, so This one is going to be a very interesting Question and and by the way these bankruptcies it's important to understand they are cases of first impression on Many of the crypto industries and these type of Crypto institutions which you would deposit and transfer your wallets and your crypto into it So this is really going to set precedence of what's going to happen going forward So let's take that first question A couple of key in order to answer the first question, which is the crypto assets and celsius possession property of the estate It's important to understand the concept property of the estate once uh debtor such as celsius files for bankruptcy You have to define what the estate estate is it's essentially all of the assets that the debtor has as of the petition date Petition date being the date they file for bankruptcy. That's when the estate is created So you take all of the assets Legal and equitable and you put them in their property of the estate So another key component. It's not there. It's important to understand. It's what's a creditor A creditor is any person or entity who is owed money by the debtor by celsius in this case Or who have a claim against Celsius that will ultimately be paid out and you know in money or some sort of payment So going back so the first question the reason why it's a bit loaded Are the crypto assets property of the estate is an excellent question Because celsius and their council similar as has happened with voyager have taken the position That when customers transfer their crypto wallets into their platforms That the platform itself celsius or voyager is now the owner Of that crypto because of the terms of use Which indicates that you know, there'll be the owners of it and they're now taking the position that the customers who deposited Or who transferred that crypto into the platforms are now creditors Because to the extent that celsius is now the owner and you lent it to them You're the equivalent of a bank collecting on a loan, right? So that is a position council is taking now. Let's head on over to the second question Okay, so so before we go on there's gonna be people screaming at the screen right now And they're gonna say but that's not was told to me And these amas and the different proceedings and different tweets and things like that in the terms of service Yes, we we went over that and just clearly states You if you give us the cryptocurrency that is a property of ours. We do with it as we see fit But as it was put out it didn't seem like that's the way it was Can you speak on that? It can you talk to it to that and then how does that work? Is it it's in the terms of service while it's in terms of service even though it was misrepresented outside So it's an important point to understand first things first. Yes, it's in the terms of service And there has been a lot of representations But the important factor before we start talking about this bear in mind That this presentation that we're talking about was put out by Celsius and Celsius council They are not the customers council. They represent the interest of Celsius So the position that Celsius is taking is that these cryptos That have been transferred into the platform now belong to Celsius If that is what the court ultimately decides, that's a big question mark. We do not know And it goes back to the same points that you were bringing Rob, which is the issue is There have been representations different representations different marketing materials Celsius at one point represented that they're it's banking for the unbankable And you transfer your crypto you earn rewards. You could get take loans against it so It gave the impression that you were the owner You know the terms of you say one thing But if ultimately the court finds That this is is it Celsius crypto or is it the customer's crypto? And that also leads to another swath of questions that trickle down from there Such as what type of asset is this Who is the owner of it? Who is the holder? Is it in possession? So these are big questions That the court needs to take into account and the court needs to answer in order to move this case forward Gotcha, so it it makes sense. There's a good thing that you said is that there's a dichotomy here between who the council is for It's for Celsius. It's not for the debtors the creditors and things like that. Okay, so that'll be the first part Sorry to interrupt you. So for the second part Sure, the answer the question different for crypto assets Correct. So this is going to be very important and this dovetails from the first question If these are assets are in the procession of Celsius So does that change if it's in the custody or the earned program? so Celsius is pulsing this question and they're working off of the terms of use And for your viewers, you know, kind of refresh their memory back in april 15 2022 Celsius change their terms of use in terms of what happens with the earned program the crypto that's in the earned program versus the custody program There's language in the terms of use as of april that crypto in the earned program Belongs to Celsius now Does how does that language contrast? To what has been marketed to come to consumers from the first day in Celsius, right? And what the court will rule on whether this terms of use trumps The other circumstances with regard to who the owner of the crypto is This is a huge inquiry that needs to be answered. And like I mentioned It's a threshold question To move this case forward or in fact, how this case will move forward Gotcha. Okay. So that takes care of of that piece right there, but then Let me come back here. So then the last piece which was I don't know if we've gone over this per se We talked about what about crypto assets transferred to Celsius to collateralize institutional and retail loans So this is interesting according to the terms of use If you took out a loan The the crypto would be moved if I'm not mistaking into the earned program I don't recall if it was the earner of the custody long story short It would be in Celsius's possession And in fact an important point is that I think the differentiating factor you're trying to make is that if it's in the earned program It's Celsius's property. I believe that's where they're going if it's in the custody program It's a big question mark on whether they're holding it in bailment or they're hold it in In custody for the benefit of the the consumer in which case the the consumer would be the owner of the crypto, right? If you took out a loan The where the crypto was being kept was transferred. So if it's now in Celsius's Uh, let's say purview There they might try to make the argument that those collateralized crypto against the the margin loan so to speak That is now the property of Celsius again all of this Bear in mind. This was put out by Celsius counsel. This is Celsius's presentation to the world and their view of the world of worth things stand or how it should go forward If that holds in port is a different question altogether. It's a you know, it might be a different reality Yeah, and you know what just what you said it made me think though Which is what you said if the council is there for Celsius The in it would be hooves Celsius to actually say well You give us that collateral because if you're a retail investor like myself You have to 2x 3x or 4x what you were actually taking out and if that's the case And they want to say well, let's keep 2x or 3x. That's a pretty good deal for Celsius Not saying that is what is going on, but I could see where they would make the argument Makes a lot of sense. Okay. So from there Let's break down these next three because I think they're all kind of uh in conjunction with each other What does it mean to unimpair a crypto claim or to pay a crypto in full? Our customers and how the return of crypto in kind and the amount of crypto claim Is determined as to what date what date what time distribution date and everything else?  Okay It is this very important to under to explain I indicated previously that the purpose of a chapter 11 Uh bankruptcy is you have a plan of reorganization Right in that plan of reorganization you classify creditors And you have them into different groups They vote in favor or against the plan And the bankruptcy code requires that you provide treatment to those creditors in a certain manner The concept here that we're talking about is impairing or unimpaired The that concept what it means is if you're let's say a typical creditor Let's say I have a loan with you and the terms of the loan say you'll pay me back 100 with three $100,000 with three percent interest If you honor those terms to the g my claim is unimpaired It means I have and it means I don't collect and fool will not have a problem However, depending on the type of creditor you are you might collect just cents on the dollar 20 cents 30 cents I'm just throwing numbers out there. I'm not sure sure not saying is yeah correct So in those cases you're being impaired Because you're not collecting in full and you're not collecting under the original terms of the agreement So going back to this question. What does it mean to impair or unimpair a crypto? This is another of those You know first impression matters that a bankruptcy judge will have to define with regards to crypto and bankruptcy when you're a creditor You typically when you fill out a proof of claim and I believe it you put out a video showing the form Right and you state the amount of the debt And what is your creditor and what is the basis and the nature of your debt and you file it etc That proof of claim is important because I don't entitle you to get your foot in the door to collect under the plan There's a bar date. You don't file a proof of claim by that date. You're out. Can't you can't collect Right assuming you're a creditor So let's let's assume the position that Celsius is taking they're saying that all the consumers who deposited in there the million plus Uh, they're all creditors, right? That's a decision whether the court holds that the different story altogether Then all of them would need to file a proof of claim and they need to say, okay Fine. Let's assume that I had 20 bitcoin And I didn't say not alone. I don't have any usdc I just had 20 bitcoin at the moment Celsius fall for bankruptcy I they're saying i'm a creditor right because they're saying that I loaned them the crypto I need to file a proof of claim What's the amount of my claim? So remember bitcoin is not a stable coin. It's not tied. It's not pegged to a particular currency or some commodity Which you know the value of crypto ebbs and flows in terms of usdc value Let's say that at the time of the bankruptcy filing that bitcoin was worth 20 000 dollars But it's today now it's worth 18 000 dollars. So going back to the concept of impairment If they pay me 18 000 dollars when at the time of bankruptcy it was worth 20 000. Am I being impaired? Or is that just an operation of the market flow of the value in usdc? Another question is and and it it goes In part of that same presentation. Does that mean instead of paying me 20 000 dollars or 18 Do they just pay me back with you had one bitcoin with one bitcoin? Is that the equivalent of being impaired or unimpaired? These are all You know legal conundrums that a bankruptcy judge for the first time has to analyze Usual run bankruptcies a chapter 11 bankruptcies chapter 9 bankruptcies specifically a title 3 in promesa Or I represent a 2 billion plus creditor for years now. Yeah It's in dollars. It's in usdc. They may have bonds. They may have other type of property But at the end of the day you value it all in usdc Crypto has the ability of it being valued one bitcoin Or do I need to value it in usdc? Right and you know what this now I remember so when you were talking about the the file of claims So we took a look at this on our last video and again There's a link in the description that you can find this stretto But on the very top case info court docket case management file of claim if you click on file of claim It'll take you here to an electronic claims filing and when you click on that it'll ask you for a password But all you have to do is request a password. They'll send it to you in your email And you'll get it and you'll be able to actually fill this form out when we filled this form out I thought it was very odd because it asked for a dollar amount and people ask me the same question like well What's a dollar amount? Well, you know what like is it now is in the future? Is it in the middle? So the so the question is because this is so ambiguous if they're asking for a dollar amount just between and of course The joint you don't have to answer this but me personally if I had to figure out a dollar amount I would probably pick the dollar amount for that bitcoin at its highest point Maybe not its lowest point and then go from there And that is that is to say if they even do dollar amounts because as I remember one bitcoin is still one bitcoin I would rather have my one or 10 or 20 bitcoin back on the dollar amount I kind of defeats the whole purpose of whole of all investing So now it makes a lot of sense what you just said because I think it's the mentality of how things are usually done But that's not the case and there's a lot of new nuances in this one for sure Yeah, it's a brave new world with bankruptcy and crypto When the code was written the rules the forms all the regulation No, no one had envisioned a concept of a bitcoin or a crypto As a payment in kind or legal tender as opposed to the us dollar Which you would value the claim or is how you would get paid And now you could get paid with bonds, etc. Maybe you could get a substitute That has happened in chapter 11 complex cases. You might get a substitute stock Substitute bond. Maybe that would be the most equivalent But it all depends on whether the parties are willing to go that route The typical rule of thumb is there's some sort of legal tender some sort of currency to pay a credor The bankruptcy code was not written for this and it hasn't been updated. We don't know if it's going to be updated anytime soon But but that's why these cases are so important It's a brave new world. We're entering into new territory And it's going to be up to the bankruptcy judges in the celsius case and the voyager case To start defining the rules and limitations on how these things are going to move forward Perfect, you know what that would lead me to the question number four. Well, which we'll get to in a second Is how this will actually How this case will transfer to general crypto regulation to set president But before we get into that let's talk about this last one This is the one that I got the most pushback and question about which was number four here can Celsius recover customer withdrawals or loan liquidations completed In the 90 days before filing as preferences meaning can they claw this all back? That was a big shocker to me. But what do you say here? Okay, so a couple of key concepts, which is very important I know you mentioned it in your in your video Which is can they do that? so There's a section in the bankruptcy code that allows for the clawback of certain payments That are made to creditors with the the 90 day period Before the filing on the bankruptcy now. This is what's called a preference And the concept of the preference is There's a presumption that within 90 days before the bankruptcy filing the debtor was insolvent And what they're trying to avoid is a situation where the debtor knowing that it's insolvent is going to say listen I have a hundred creditors I don't have enough money to go around but these three I like them So I'm going to pay them in full 90 days before filing for bankruptcy And what the preference concepts looks into is whether this credor it's in the it's in the title was preferred By the debtor to the detriment of the other creditors Right. It was preferred by the debtor. I'm sorry to the detriment of other creditors And that's why it has this clawback powers to bring the money back so they could distribute all of the creditors evenly The the idea behind the preference is that that credor cannot collect more than it usually would have in the bankruptcy Okay, so that's what the 90 days in the clawback means now. Let's transfer that to celsius So the position that celsius and their council are taking Is that if i'm a customer who deposited my crypto in the platform They're saying that I lent it to them, right? I became a lender They are a debtor and i'm a creditor, right? So to the extent that I withdrew or made transfers within 90 days, I collected on my quote-unquote debt And air go I fall within the scope of a preference Okay, so this opens up another can of worms which The preference litigation is very common in in chapter 11 cases. It's while this is separate Basically like a complaint under the bankruptcy, right you have different defenses that the reason I say this opens a separate can of worms is This force is a separate question. I know you and I discussed about this previously Which is okay fine to understand whether There's a preference or there isn't a preference We need to understand the basic question. What is crypto in the eyes of the bankruptcy? What is crypto? Is it stocks? Is it a commodity? Is it a currency? Is it a general intangible? Is it a bailment? I'm throwing a lot of legal concepts I'm not going to go through each and one of them, but let me tell you why that question is important For example under the bankruptcy code if it's considered a currency or could be considered a currency There are protections in the bankruptcy code that would Not allow the preference to go forward potentially We'd have to look into it, especially if they treat it as a swap agreement So I I could foresee someone taking litigation posturing In challenging what the crypto is in the event of a litigation of a preference And that also bears into mind if it's security it could have ramifications and consequences Goes back to the fourth question that we talked about right a currency. It also could have ramifications down the road in fact This also leads a big question Going back to the bankruptcy in the first day Which is could have Celsius and Voyager even file bankruptcy That's a big question, especially we talked about with SIPA and broker dealers So so let's talk a little bit about that So it's important to understand The bankruptcy code Identifies who can be a debtor who can file for bankruptcy right and there are certain entities who are You know who can either file a particular type of bankruptcy or cannot even file for bankruptcy at all So you mentioned SIPA. That's a securities investors protection act If you're a broker dealer and in the typical stock market, etc broker dealer, right? Do you have under SIPA? You would be regulated under SIPA Do you have an ability to wind down under the statute? Or if you choose to go to bankruptcy, you're limited to do a liquidation You know a stock broker bankruptcy, right for example The type of operations that Celsius and Voyager had Was a commodity broker broker. They say that crypto is a commodity. This is a commodity broker Then under the bankruptcy code, you could only liquidate as a commodity broker. That's in section 761 onward. Okay So this if it's a bank That's another question bankruptcy code Does not allow banks to go into bankruptcy. They're So if if you start looking at the building block, okay, so I transferred my wallet Into Celsius. I started earning rewards. Is that interest to my deposit? I started taking a loan against it. Is that just a general loan? It's it starts raising questions if it quacks like a bank, but walks like a stock broker. What is it? What is it? That's the big question and that that's where that this really will come down to What the judge decides to how far this will go and what they define it as it seems like and remember everybody So we're just going through one page of this First day imagine how much documentation that these everybody has to go through. This is a complex Way more complex than than what I gave a credit for okay So we broke those things down as you want. Thank you so much. That makes a lot more sense A lot of things to consider Let's go into I think what what people are really wondering, which is this What makes a chapter 11 successful in your experience and you've had You know years and years of experience doing this So how do people get to a resolution? Is it all just okay chapter 11? And then all the businesses just go away. They all get liquidated or Is there a way through? so I've been doing bankruptcy for 15 plus years Been involved in a lot of chapter 11's like I mentioned the latest case that I've been involved is the largest bankruptcy in the history of the united states Which is a municipal bankruptcy of the commonwealth of perico under a special statue that is similar to chapter 9 You start seeing after so many years particular trends Chapter 9 operates similarly to a certain degree to chapter 11 and in the other chapter 11's as well But let me break down the basics of it. Okay, you have a plan To pay the debt and you group creditors in classes So what makes a chapter 11 successful? The chapter 11 case that is has the ability to reach More consensus than less consensus One of the things that I mentioned I want to highlight in chapter 11 after you group the creditors into classes Each class prior to confirmation needs to vote on the plan So they either accept or they reject the plan if you're able to get a hundred percent acceptance You still need to go through some legal requirements that the that the court has to look into But it makes the case quote unquote easier because you start seeing a trend of everyone moving towards confirmation So what typically happens in these particular cases? There's there might be some litigation You probably it's very rare that you see a chapter 11 case that it's all or nothing litigation that is resolved exclusively on litigation That it's not practical So at the end of the day you litigate to reach resolution. So you might litigate some points You might win some lose some or settle some right? But at some point you start getting momentum on settlements to the extent you're Able to reach more settlements quicker And faster with more groups that is usually a good indica statistically that you have a higher Percentage rate of success in the chapter 11 doesn't mean it's absolute because at the end of the day If the plan for example is illegal Violates of bankruptcy code completely the judge is going to be hamstrung is not going to be able to to confirm it But assuming it passes muster and you're able to garner that support quicker faster and easier With more people that increases your likelihood of success I don't I believe that this case is will operate under the same dynamics Gotcha. Yeah, and the case that you're working on now. Uh, this is for the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico How many years has this been going on? And you're just getting now that case was filed in may 3 2017 The case was finally confirmed on january 16 2022 And we're talking about Huge amounts of litigation that ensued But at the end of the day the building blocks were there Consensus started to get reached with different group of creditors And you started seeing a momentum Gotcha I can kind of on on on some of these on some of these days I can feel I can see that there's there's some kind of momentum going on But then there's always like a little roadblock. So hopefully this Catches acceleration and we can move forward, but that makes a lot of sense consensus Everybody votes on it moves forward.  Hopefully we can make some of these investors are Celsius and Voyager can make these investors whole. That's not our job though. That's just our job And as a saying goes it's better to have a bad deal than a good litigation sometimes So That's that's a max and some lawyers operate off Yeah, I could I can see that so that so that answers a big chunk of that now Let's just go to the last part which I think is is what I'm always preaching on this on this show It's not very popular, but I do believe we need regulation to move forward especially just to get out of the The the conundrums of of the downfalls and pitfalls of what crypto Can be and should be and I think that we just need a little bit of just not Stifling regulation but the question is how does this case transfer to general crypto regulation because the judge has to make a Lot of decisions and will this set precedent and how can this move forward? What do you what do you say here? So It's going to be very interesting here. So the way I see it Crypto is getting to that point of our relationship where someone needs to stand up and ask What are we? Where are we going? What's happening here? Uh, this is not uncommon. For example the dot-com Uh, you know the bubble that happened at one point Faced that similar question and had a watershed moment And did that mean that the internet went went away? No, it didn't Uh, but there were a certain a set of rules and an understanding of how things would move forward Afterwards, so we're talking about after the bubble burst in the 90s So I don't know if we're there yet But I can definitely tell you that just looking at the legal questions That celsius posted itself many of them will require a hard conversation Either a resolution by the court or a hard conversation moving forward. Let's start with the first thing What is celsius? What is voyager? Are these platforms banks? Are they broker dealers? Are they commodity brokers? Do they need to be regulated by sipa or not? In fact, the judge in voyager flagged That they had a concern On whether voyager even filed the correct bankruptcy It seemed to imply that they were looking at voyager as a broker dealer And if that's the case, it would have to go through a chapter seven liquidation under 741 at sec, right? So we're not talking about hypotheticals. These questions are actually being posed And then that brings us to another subset of questions after to identify what type of relationship are we? But the typical what are we here? The next question is, you know, how does this work? It goes back to is crypto currency Is crypto stock Is crypto commodities general intangible bailments? You name it that the The different type of situations on how you define this type of asset in the bankruptcy Right and depending on how that so the first thing is if those questions are posed and answered Depending on the answer you'll start seeing Parties who need to take action. So if a bankruptcy judge were to be inclined to believe this is stock That'll generate pressure on the sec to start to look into it Any question if they believe this is a broker dealer, the sec will be pressured into having to look into this uh also And whether it needs to be under sipa, etc Other questions that arise is who is the owner here of this going forward Can we trust these type of platforms going forward if there's a determination that you use these platforms? And you lose all your ownership rights on the crypto and it becomes the debtors in the event of a bankruptcy Will you ever trust a platform like that going forward? Do we even need a particular regulator for these type of a marketplace? These are all the things and see like like these things like the the last thing you just talked about first of all Thanks for that that concise answer The question then then becomes well will anybody ever trust these type of platforms these earn platforms? And then we had talked about this before and I said I don't think anybody is going to however I just remembered there was this hack in 2014 for mount gox and after mount gox they were the hap the hack nobody Trusted exchanges and now fast forward eight years later. Actually just a couple years later for that Look what happened Exchanges are abound Everything grows and there's just more more around there. So the optics just the optics of it I think people's memories are very short Unfortunately, I mean not for my subscribers. They're all very very genius smart But it's it's uh, it's important to to recognize these problems that are going for it so That's concerning, but I can understand why if the sec and the cftc is going to have to come down and say well What is this? This is security is as a commodity the occ is as a currency and go from there But I can understand now why these cases are bigger than what we are What we may have believed in the beginning so Ajuan you answered them all to to uh to my delight and I appreciate you coming by I really do Any last last things any comments that we uh, maybe have missed we've covered a lot of information a short amount of time I believe we we have covered a lot of information in a short amount of time Honestly, I believe we're going into uncharted territories. This is Crypto is trying to get into a point where the rubber beats a road. It's becoming more mature It's definitely become a big investment has an impact in the economy I wonder viewers who understand that Back in 2008 when the economy fell And the subprime lending, you know, there was some sort of regulation But it was not heavily observed and followed as it currently is in fact when that market crashed The consumer financial protection bureau was created. So bear in mind I don't know if we're at a juncture where there's a big enough crisis That you know heavy-handed regulation needs to be taken in or the government needs to step in But going to exactly what you mentioned what what happened in mount gox There was the theft with the with the blockchain recently by these two individuals that was Investigated by the justice department. Now we have to these two bankruptcies. We're starting to see a lot of very important and benchmark questions on the marketplace and on cryptos that are starting to be raised and They start creating little crises So the question is is if we're at a tipping point On those little crises that need this needs to be taken a look into but what I would just generally say is You know It's happening the questions are there They have to be posed and unless everyone is able to reach a complete absolute consensus in this case And when we avoid the questions altogether Some hard answers need to be brought in and those will Have repercussions down the road. So I I for one. I'm actually looking forward To seeing how this develops. I do not want to be the sitting judge in any of these cases to answer these questions But it's nonetheless very very interesting Yeah, it's interesting for for you the justice department for gary genzler the sec for the cfdc and more importantly The people that had trusted these two platforms to move forward So anjuan, I want to say thanks again for stopping by if you have time later on I'll we'll have you back on again. We can talk about it, but I know you're a busy guy, but I want to say again. Thanks Thank you. All right, everybody. So let's jump back All right, so that was pretty comprehensive and I want to say again Thank you anjuan for coming by and just answering all these questions that can kind of give us a little more clarity Now, I know there's a longer road to go But at least we know Exactly the stipulations and different parts of this chapter 11 and we can move forward So if you like today's video and those a little bit long to give me a thumbs up that'd be great I'll also consider subscribing a lot of things we talk about are very time sensitive Especially these types of instances. So thanks so much for stopping by. I do appreciate it I'll see you on the next one