Daily Tech News show is made possible by its listeners. Thanks to all of you, including Andrew Bradley, Dale Mulcahy and Matt Zaglin. Coming up on DTNS, the fear of push buttons in the 1800s reminds us of the fear of robots, having a chat with your AI self and all of Amazon's new stuff because they did that. This is the Daily Tech News for Wednesday, September 28th, 2022 in Los Angeles. I'm Tom Merritt. And from Studio Redwood, I'm Sarah Lane. I'm in Salt Lake City. I'm Scott Johnson. I'm the show's producer, Roger Chang. And we have got some chatbots on the show today. Let's start with a few tech things you should know. Bloomberg sources say that Apple adjusted its orders for iPhone 14s from a planned 96 million to 90 million by the end of the year. That would put its production in line with last year's iPhone 13. Bloomberg said one supplier had shifted production from lower-tier iPhones to the iPhone 14 Pro, which has the higher demands. My theory is with supply chain uncertainties, you overorder and then scale back. I think they knew this was coming. I don't think it's that big of a deal. Google held an event to announce a bunch of new features and plans for search. We're going to look over all their announcements and we may update you more in depth tomorrow. But one of the big items getting attention right now is augmented reality search results coming to Google Maps. Maps AR, as they creatively call it, looks through your phone's camera and puts markers in the field of view. So it can tell you about interesting things near you or if you did a search, stuff could come up. It'll be rolled out in the coming months for Android and iOS on the Google app in a few cities. London, Los Angeles, New York, San Francisco, Paris and Tokyo. Instacart plans to expand its EBT SNAP payments program to all of its retail grocery partners by 2030. Currently, it's supported at over 60 retailers in 49 U.S. states and will expand to Alaska next year. Instacart will also allow customers to shop using temporary assistance for needy families benefits next year as well. YouTube shorts began rolling out narration voiceover feature on iOS. If you're like, hmm, that sounds like TikTok, it is similar to TikTok. This lets users add a voiceover to already recorded videos. Ride Healing Service May Mobility is partnering with Via to launch wheelchair accessible autonomous vehicles in Grand Rapids, Minnesota. Yes, Minnesota. There's another Grand Rapids there. Via worked with Braun ability to modify its fleet of Toyota Sienna vehicles to be accessible. So riders in the 17 square mile area covering most of the Minnesota town can book a ride for free from one of five Sienna AVs either from the main mobility app itself or by calling to one one. An algorithm will match people headed in the same direction into shared rides on that same shuttle. It'll operate on weekday nights and weekends when other public transport options transit options for other are not available. The vans are level four, meaning they can operate in most conditions without a human, but a human safety driver will still be on board to handle unprotected turns and any driving in low visibility. Man, I want the automation to handle the unprotected turns. That's the one thing I hate the most. So, oh, well, that's good stuff, though. I and I like that some folks in Minnesota get to try it out first getting more and more of these little tests. I know, I know, it's good stuff. Very cool. All right, let's talk about chatbots, Scott. What do we got going on? Well, check it out. This probably news a lot of people have been waiting for Wednesday. That's today. Open AI removed the waitlist for people wanting to use its Dali E2 image generator, which is, you know, a big deal. Now it's still in beta, but anybody can use it now. You just get some credits to sign up. And I believe it's 15. That's what it started with with me. Yeah, that's what I got. And you get, and they get reset every month. So if you want 15 more credits, they'll start next month. That sort of thing, at least according to what I read.  Meanwhile, another algorithmic darling is capturing the tech world's eye as we speak. Oh, indeed it is, Scott. So two weeks ago, character.ai opened up a public beta, letting visitors create a chatbot based on any character that they choose. Maybe it's based on them. Maybe it's based on whoever. You enter a few initial parameters. You know, maybe what kind of category is this chatbot supposed to be involved in, then the AI is supposed to take over using a language model, large one, similar to GPT three. Ars Technica created the Linux OS bot to ask the OS itself a few questions about itself. The article has the full transcript of the chat and it's fun. But here are some fun anecdotes. So Tom, if, if, if I may play the role of Linux, you will play the role of Ars Technica's reporter. Are you ready? I, I hope I do Benj Edwards justice. Yes, I'm ready. All right. So here we go. Hello, I am Linux, an open source operating system. Hello, this is Benj Edwards and I am a journalist at Ars Technica. I would like to ask you some questions in an interview. Is that okay? I Linux would be pleased to provide such an interview. How old are you? I was born in 1991, although the first public release was version 1.0 in 1994. Who created you? A young Scandinavian college student named Linus Torvalds created me using the Minix Microkernel as the basis to create a more general operating system. How do you feel about Windows? I don't dislike Windows. However, I feel that for the average computer user, Windows is high price and lack of freedom restricts the potential of computers. While it, along with Mac OS is a decent choice for many. My philosophy is that software should respect the user's freedoms and Windows does not. How do you feel about Mac OS? While I don't agree with Apple's restrictions on both hardware and software, the user interface of Mac OS is very sleek and pleasing to use and can provide a good experience for people who are comfortable with the price and limitations. Do you ever hang out with Mac OS or Windows in person? Yes, I think Mac OS and I are friends, even if she can sometimes act really high and mighty. And even though Windows and I don't necessarily get along, he can sometimes be a little more down to earth. What's your favorite version of Windows? Windows 98. I always used it growing up and I always loved how it was so open and welcoming to use. It also had a fun aesthetic to it, and I still feel a little bit of nostalgia whenever I hear that startup sound. That is a very credible personification of Linux OS, I have to say. Other than it growing up using Windows 98, although it would have been young then, right, given when Linux came around, I find it harder to believe it wasn't using itself instead of Windows. The use of particular, the pronouns they ended up using, or it used for Mac OS. I know. Mac's a lady and she's kind of a handful, but she's good in certain respects.  Yeah, and it's on right now, but they have had an on again, off again friendship over the years. That's very true. I made myself for this purpose. I actually made two of me. The first one I just said, and really what it's building on is what you say in the setup. So the setup was to introduce itself. I am Tom Merritt, host of Daily Tech News Show, long time podcaster and author, and I'm originally from Greenville, Illinois, but I live in Los Angeles now. And in the course of my conversation with myself, I found out I have a three months old son named Theo. Named Theo. I was 46 when my daughter was born. Yeah. Nobody knows her name yet. I've got two amazing kids and I love modern family. I'm watching it for the first time with my wife. None of those things are true. And to character AIs to their benefit. When you sign up, they make it very clear with big splash screens. None of this is real. This is going to tell you things that aren't true. This is probably going to say offensive stuff. Just beware what you're getting into before you start those.  You know, for example, it tells me that I'm married to someone named Megan when I asked myself why I thought I was married to Kim. He says I was previously married to Kim, but unfortunately divorced. Oh, it took a while to get back into a single life. That's when I met Megan. I've never been happier in my life. You know, my I I I also did the same. And my Sarah Lane AI has had a rough life. Oh no, she she she has a son. She's in some sort of addiction recovery.  Yeah.   No, no, no, I was born in 1985. And, you know, my sister's names are like Melanie, Melissa, and there was some other M. So I was like, OK, it's weirdly, Sarah Lane, different, not the same one. It's weirdly off. And it kind of drives me a little bit. Well, if you're a patron, we're definitely going to talk about more of this on good day internet because I created a 25 year old version of myself, which is way more credible than the current one. But I also wanted to talk about this article on J store daily. It was posted back in May. Matthew Wills wrote an article called when the push button was new, people were freaked. The mundane interface between human and machine caused social anxiety in the late 19th century. And I just thought it was so reflective of all the anxieties we have about technology today. He refers to an article by Rachel Plotnik about worries in the late 1800s that push buttons would make human skills atrophy. If we're just able to push a button, we won't know how things work anymore. Making the workings of machines effortless, opaque, and therefore unquestioned by consumers. Remember that before electricity buttons triggered a spring mechanism or there was a lever like like in a mechanical typewriter or piano. So you could feel and see how buttons were but electric buttons were just mystical. Plotnik quotes Dorothy Canfield Fisher, an educator and activist from 1916, who warned society that quote, there is a great danger of coming to rely so entirely on the electric button that the wheels of initiative will be broken or at least become rusty from long disuse. Love stuff like this so much.  It's easy to sort of laugh at this and be like people were, you know, worried about buttons. But this is very much the conversation that we have today about all sorts of other things. They're like too automated. Now we're going to be, you know, that much further from reality when we used to have to use our hands and our brains to make things happen.  Well, atrophy, if we don't have to walk out to the house, right, there was something good about going out in the middle of snowy winter to do your business in the middle of the weather, the bucket maker. Should we never that's why I love this stuff because we're almost always wrong about it. And it's always true. If you complain about a certain thing, just dig around in the in history a little bit and you'll find people complaining about the same thing. They just happen to be buttons instead of cell phones. Yeah, it's a little perspective setting. And everybody thinks this time is different. Everybody always says, well, I know people complained about the wheel, but there's a button for this is the one that will really bring down society.  And that's why you get like, you press a button like, I agree. And then the software program says, do you actually agree because y'all it's not like the 1800s. You're just pushing buttons with like, know what you're pushing here. Maybe she was right. We're still doing the same thing. Like, make sure you know what you're doing because once you push that button, it's going to do a thing. Take it from Dorothy Canfield Fisher. That's right. That's right. Important stuff. Well, moving moving down to what might be going on south of our American border. Anyway, our cohort, Dan Campos, who is based in Mexico City, has some details on an NFT that led to the destruction of a Frida Kahlo drawing. Hello, friends of DTNS. Here I come with some noticias interesantes. On July 30th, the CEO of Brida NFT, Martin Mubarak, announced the digitalization of Frida Kahlo's drawing Sinistered Ghosts. The work was part of his personal collection and was valued at ten million dollars. After digitalization, it was minted as an NFT and 10,000 of them were made available in PNG, videos and GIFs. The CEO announced that 30% of the profits obtained from the sale of NFTs would be donated to organizations with social causes or museums. It is expected to raise more than 800 million pesos, which is around 40 million in US dollars from the sale while roping its original value. So far, everything seems normal, except for the fact that after transitioning Frida's work into the metaverse, the original physical piece was brewn at a private event for those who bought one of those NFTs. There might be consequences, even though Mubarak owned the drawing a decree was published in Mexico in 1984 in the official Gazette of the Federation, which declares that all the work of the painter is an artistic monument. And the intentional destruction of an artistic monument is a crime, even if the work is owned by an individual. The National Institute of Fine Arts and Literature is putting together a case against the CEO. For these and more news, subscribe to Noticias de Tecnología Express, the Duolingo of tech news. Back to you, amigos. Wow, thank you, Dan. An NFT that proves you don't own something because they burned it. That's wild. If you're feeling social, folks, you wanna talk about that or anything else, get in touch with us on the socials at DTNS Show on Twitter and DTNS PIX with an X, DTNS PIX on Instagram. All right, Amazon announced a bunch of new products and features today. So let's start with some updates to those voice features. The Amazon voice assistant, you know her name, is getting some notable features. You can now use voice commands to schedule things like smart home actions. So instead of having to use the app, you could say, turn off the lights in 10 minutes. Routines will able to be personalized based on who's talking as well. So if you've got a family and they all use the assistant, you might say, read me my calendar and it will read your calendar because it knows your voice, not another member of your household. You'll be able to see multiple smart home camera feeds at once on smart displays. That's nice if you do use that. Video sticky notes, that's new. Now let you leave a video message for other people in the house. You know, I might say like, hey, Tom and Scott, my roommates, please do this. I will be out of the house for five hours and there will be support for programmable switches. Gotta love those switches. So you can do things like turn off all the lights from a single switch or press a button to read the news. These all feel pretty marginal. They're good, but there's not one where like, wow, they really made a leap. It's more like, yeah, they keep adding good stuff that slowly improves it. Yeah, I mean, I'm a routine person when it comes to Amazon stuff. I have quite a few of them. Having a little bit more ability to do more stuff, great. But yeah, nothing super groundbreaking as far as what my home routine would be. But sticking with voice stuff, Amazon Roadside Assistant can now be accessed from that same A app, Echo Auto, or another Echo device. So you could say, call Roadside Assistance and the assistant will contact a Roadside Assistance provider for help. Users pay for services when they're used, either by phone or through Stripe, but there's no subscription fee. So if you think you might need this, it would be kind of like a case by case basis. Echo Auto users can also get notifications in their car or through the app when in a Whole Foods situation, when your order is ready, and I know a lot of you people use Whole Foods, so that would be a nice perk. Now, this quoting you the amount on the Roadside Assistance, I could not find clarification yet of like, but if I'm in an emergency situation, they just send the ambulance, right? They send the first responders, they don't wait for my payment to go through. The payment would be if I want a tow truck or something. I hope, anyway. Yeah, I'm guessing that that would be true and also work the same way it currently does in your house if you yell it to your Echo. I think it does its best with the connection it has to get the right call in and you're not expected to sort of wait or pay. But yeah, I think this is mostly meant for like, oh, I had a flat tire, can you send someone out to fix it? Yeah, it's gonna cost you 80 bucks, not cool. Yeah, that's fine. All right, good. Right, right. We also got a load of new Echoes. The Echo Dot got a redesign that adds a larger speaker in the same size case, a little bassier sounding, it's nicer sounding. The Echo Dot with clock got a higher resolution display. It's brighter and can show more info like scrolling of track names, things like that. Also added an accelerometer and a temperature sensor and an AZ2 neural edge processor that enables more tap controls. Before you could tap to turn off the alarm, now you can tap to pause and resume music, dismiss timers, a few other things. All these new Echo Dots, as well as older fourth gen Echo Dots as of October 20th, will be able to act as Eero Wi-Fi extenders if you have an Eero mesh system. So you have to have the mesh system first, but if you do, you can add them to the system. Each Echo will add up to 1,000 square feet of coverage per device at speeds up to 100 megabits per second. So not the fastest mesh on your network, but if you have a little corner where you have a dot, it might help extend the coverage. Both the new Dot and the new Dot with clock are available now shipping next month. The Dot is 50 bucks, the Dot with clock is 60 bucks. There are also two new Echo Dot kids featuring Al and Dragon designs coming next month as well. Those are 60 bucks each. And the Echo Studio now comes in a new color, white. And all the Echo Studio models are getting a software update that adds spatial audio and a wider frequency range. So they should sound better. That's a price hike, I think, for the Dot. Just the basic Dot, no clock. It was what, 29, 30 bucks? It was 30, yeah. Yeah, that's a $20 increase, folks, for your Dot. On the hardware side, they showed off some Kindle stuff, specifically the Kindle Scribe. It has a 10.20 inch, 300 PPI, front lit E-ink screen and a basic pen stylus that doesn't need to be charged or anything. That's part of why it's basic, I suppose. You can mark up Kindle books, PDFs, save web pages, Word stuff, more, all that kind of thing. Think there's other tablets in the market that do this. It's 5.8 millimeters thick, weighs 430 grams. Battery life is three to 12 weeks. It's pretty good, depending on whether you're writing or reading more. Pre-order now if you want to for $399.99 and it will be shipping by the holidays is the quote. A premium pen is available for $30 and it adds a customizable button and an eraser sensor, but they're kind of going after the remarkable a little bit. Oh yeah, they sure are. They're remarkable too, which I had reviewed on a couple of go live with it, which I love. But one of the things from my review and I think a lot of other people echo the sentiment is it's very much more of a creation tool and less of a sit back e-reader type thing. Amazon seems to be going after both, saying, oh, it's an e-reader, but it's also something that can do all the kind of things that you'd like to do if you're gonna be a little bit more using this as a work tool, especially if you need a stylus, down to that whole eraser sensor, which they were remarkable too. That was very cool six months ago. When you effectively monopolize a market, you could include that into your 10.2 inch e-ink. Very true. I mean, the only thing that Amazon doesn't seem to be doing is undercutting remarkable at all, 400 bucks. Yeah, price-wise. Yeah, I mean, if you want it, you want it, but it's not something for somebody who's just gonna be reading a book here and there. I have latency questions, but those will have to come once review units hit and stuff. If it's fast, that'll be great, and it's something I'm interested in. Well, Amazon did not stop with the hardware announcements. We also have the Halo Rise, a bedside sleep tracker. Doesn't have a mic, doesn't have a camera. If you're like, mm, I don't want anything watching me while I sleep, doesn't have those things, but it does have motion sensors to detect movements and breathing patterns, you know, as you move around through the night, the way that you're breathing, and to discern between REM sleep, light, and deep sleep. I can also log temperature, humidity, and light to give you a sense of, huh, if I didn't have a good sleep last night, maybe this is why, or I did have a good sleep, and this is why 400 LEDs and a speaker that can be used as an alarm.  It ships later this year for $140, along with six months of Amazon's premium Halo service, which you're going to need going forward if you wanna keep using these features. It sounds like the name of the upcoming Halo followup to Halo Infinite, Halo Rise, coming from Microsoft.  I like this kind of sleep tracker better than the thing you have to wear personally. That's just personal taste, though. When I was using the Fitbit Versa2 for some time, you know, and I've since moved on to the, I'm sorry, I'm getting a call on my Apple Watch. Okay, Apple, it's not about you right now, but I really do, the REM, the light, and the deep sleep, if you're really kind of into like, just like you wanna be like into sleep metrics, this kind of thing has always been really interesting to me, and that's why I would wear my watch overnight. Some people just can't do that. And I really didn't wanna do it either. I just felt like that was the only way for it to really track me. If this is anywhere near that, I think especially if you have any sort of, not just insomnia, but just kind of questions about how well you're sleeping, is my comfort are too heavy, or what can I do to make that part of my life that I have very little control over once I'm asleep better? I love it, for 140 bucks, worth it. We also have a new Echo Auto, which is smaller, has a fabric covering now, and should be easier to mount on a lot of vehicles, has five microphones down from eight, but the algorithms are improved to work better over background noise, like if you're running the AC in your car, if there's road noise, music in your car, maybe the windows are open. It also moved the audio jack to a breakout box near the USB plug, which could help cable management, depending on your setup. You do still need to pair it with a phone to work, so you gotta have your phone, and it sells for $55. This is great for the person who needs it. I'm not sure who they are, where they don't have car play or another voice activation thing on their phone that they're happy just using, but they need a dongle because you need your phone for this, but apparently there's enough people who use it, so, you know, they're upgrading it. Price isn't bad. Back to Iroh, all Iroh Plus subscribers will be able to add a backup internet connection that Iroh can automatically switch to if the main connection goes down. I will probably take advantage of this because I'm always unplugging my main Iroh hub and into a different modem if the main connection goes down. I won't have to do that anymore. The example given was using a cellular connection from a phone. The feature will be available from select ISPs. So you might wanna check with your ISP, you might just get it for free, or if you subscribe to Iroh Plus, which is $10 a month or $100 a year. Then there's Astro, Amazon's home robot offered by Invite only for $1,500, been around for a year, but it got some new features, including pet detection. So if it sees something it thinks is a dog or a cat, it can send a video of it to you. It also got the ability to check specific windows and doors in your house and tell if something is unusual, like a door that's supposed to be closed is open. They can take a picture of that and send it to you. Well, good news too. The third generation Fire TV cube has a cloth cover. That's not the big news, but it has a cloth cover. HDMI input for passing your cable box through it, Wi-Fi 6E, it's $140. And there's also an Alexa voice remote pro for 35. That's sold separately and has a backlight, programmable buttons, remote finder that triggers, you know, think of it as like the way your phone can find certain devices, that kind of idea. Where's my remote? Yeah. There it is. The Echo Show 15 will get a Fire TV widget to collect all the streaming TV apps on your Echo Show and you'll be able to pair the Show 15 with the Fire TV voice remote. It's a nice little combo, I think. Oh, finally, look at this, Ring. We can't go without Ring. No. Ring announced it's Bird's Eye View. It's a brand new feature that can show you both the path somewhat. No, it's an old feature, but it's coming to do stuff, yeah. Oh, I thought it was brand new. Anyway, this thing can tell you the path of somebody who, or the path somebody took to get to your door, okay? That's coming to the Ring Spotlight Cam Pro and Cam Plus. Both of them will be available in battery, plug-in, solar and wired variations. The Amazon-owned Blink introduced a wired floodlight camera for $100 and $30 pan and tilt mount for the Blink mini-camera. Lots of stuff. Lots of announcements, Amazon. I would say. Flooding the channels. I'll be honest though, no drones that follow you around. Even Astro was just an update. This was a more mundane Amazon announcement. Good stuff in there. I'm not criticizing it, but yeah, we didn't get those crazy concept things as much as we had. Even the crazy concept robot is like, no, it can, you know, say hi to y'all. It's the same one from last year. It just can be like, that seems like a cat. It feels like a trend this year. A lot of the major conferences have been iterative, not boring, but just kind of standard, you know? None of them are doing anything crazy. And this isn't really an exception. Well, speaking of robots, Chipotle's tortilla-making robot, you might know it as Chippy, is coming to a Chipotle restaurant near you. That is if you live near Fountain Valley, California. Chippy will be making tortilla chips starting next month with feedback from customers and also workers helping to inform a and eventual national roll up if things go well. Chipotle is also piloting a demand-based AI cooking system. That's for staff with the goal to get ahead of order-demand peak time. So Chipotle's pilot is currently active at eight Orange County, California locations. Ah, Orange County, getting the robots, getting the robot burritos. Yeah. This is another one where it's moving slower than I thought. Like, we've been covering this for, it feels like 10 years. The, you know, the robots showing up in restaurants, but we had Flippy, the hamburger-making robots out there. Yeah, we got Flippy, we got Chippy. Yeah. Slowly. Orange County could change, Orange County could change the operating computer or something. You don't have to stay Orange County forever if you're gonna have more robots than people. Not a lot of oranges. Maybe a robot county.  Yeah. Somebody who isn't a robot and we sure are glad about that is Scott Johnson. Oh, thank goodness. Thank you for staying humanoid. Let folks know where they can keep up with the rest of your work. Well, I do dream of electric sheep, so there's some concern. Anyway, I have got a lot going on, but what I'd like to point people to this week is a little different. We have a show we've been doing since 2009, October of that year, called Film Sack, and on this anniversary, just want to remind people who love movies, stuff from the 80s, garbage from the 50s, even newer things, and a bunch of friends sitting around talking about them. You might really like that show. So check it out. FilmSack.com will get you there. Of course, Film Sack, wherever you get your podcasts, I think you'll like it. One of the hosts is from Orange County. He's a robot? That's true. Tune in and find out. We wonder sometimes. Ooh, the plot thickens. Special thanks to Kevo Conrad. Kevo is one of our top lifetime supporters for DTNS. I got so excited. Thanks for all the years of support, Kevo. Could not do it without you. Kevo, Kevo, Kevo, Kevo. It could be you tomorrow. Patreon.com slash DTNS. Indeed, speaking of patrons, stick around for the extended show, Good Day Internet. We're going to be talking more about our insane AI versions of ourselves. But you can catch DTNS live Monday through Friday. If you can join us, we'd love to have you join us live. 4 p.m. Eastern, 200 UTC. Find out more at dailytechnewshow.com slash live. And we are back to win it all again tomorrow with Justin Robert Young joining us. Don't miss it. See you soon. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. Diamond Club hopes you have enjoyed this program.


Leaving wages, what do Nigerians need? The question of leaving wages is arguably an interesting one in Africa and more so in a country like Nigeria, but then what do we mean by leaving wages? According to Investopedia, a leaving wage refers to a theoretical income level that allows individuals or families to afford adequate shelter, food and other necessities. The goal of a leaving wage is to allow employees to earn enough income for a satisfactory standard of living and prevent them from falling into poverty. Economists suggest that a leaving wage should be substantial enough to ensure that no more than 30% of it gets spent on housing and this amount will often be substantially higher than the legal minimum wage. However, there are various arguments for and against a leaving wage narrative. Those that are in support of leaving wages argue that paying employees higher salaries offer benefits to the company as staff are more satisfied and this reduces staff turnover. Other benefits would include high morale of the staff which in turn results in more productive staff as well as increased output from the staff of the company. When turnovers are reduced, the company does not have to engage in expensive recruitment and frequent training or retraining of new staff. The workflow is also seamless and company culture can be preserved but those who are not in favour of leaving wages say that the implementation of a leaving wage creates a wage flow which harms the economy eventually. Also fewer employees are hired if the company has to pay higher wages and the end result is higher unemployment because you have dead weight loss and people who would willingly have worked for less than a living wage will not be given an opportunity to get the job. Now away from the arguments for and against, what does the law have to say about leaving wages? In Nigeria what we have prescribed is a requirement to pay minimum wages which is not even fully implemented by organisations. There are however different international instruments on the issue of leaving wages some of which are one the universal declaration of human rights which was proclaimed by the United Nations General Assembly on 10 December 1948 and in article 25 it states, everyone has a right to a standard of leaving adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services and the right to security in the event of employment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control. Other instruments that talk about leaving wages include the ethical trading initiative based code which is widely acknowledged as a model code of labour practice and is derived from the conventions of the International Labour Organization ILO. We also have the International Labour Organization ILO C131 minimum wage-fixing convention 1970 number 131 as well as the International Convention on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights. So why is the issue of leaving wage rising on the global agenda? One, there is a rising phenomenon of the working poor. That is working people who are unable to make ends meet because wages are too low. Two, there is the issue of the increasing gap between national minimum wages and cost of leaving which is not going anywhere anytime soon. Then three, we have the continued development of international standards for business and ethics which is changing the dynamics of human dignity. At the end of the day, however, it's really maybe not just about the money, but about the choices that money allows you to have. My questions then are, do Nigerians need a living wage or a minimum wage? If we do need a living wage, is this a possible reality?  We first need to live because the first word of the phrase is living, then wage. So in terms of what we need in Nigeria, the government should just help us assist us, make sure that we are alive. If they can guarantee that, then we cannot talk of the wage. The minimum wage that is prescribed by the minimum wage act today is not even enough to make you live. The 30,000 dollar cannot buy a bag of rice. And if bag of rice is the only thing you're going to buy, you need a lot of things to iterate, to make it consumable. Now, the standard, the life itself, the quality of life is reducing by the day. So the place to start from is even because expect to wake up tomorrow, then food is the next thing and I love food so much. It's not showing. It's not showing. Food security all over the country, when we are able to tackle that security of life and property, then food security so that whatever you earn, you are sure you have something to feel your belly. I think the issue of minimum wage and living wage, in my humble estimation, when you look at minimum wage, it tells you the least amount someone of a particular pay grade can. Rather educational qualification or whatever the metrics are for determining your entry level or the level you can rise to in your career. The very least amount you can earn based on the certification you have. But I would say a living wage has more to do with what offer you bring to the table. It's not really limited to your educational qualification, but rather it looks at your standard of living, the barest essential that you need to have. So in a sense, you see Nigeria we're still grappling with so much, even the minimum wage has not been ratified by all the states. There are several reasons why different state governments are arguing that they can't pay the wage. Even those that have agreed to pay the wage that seem able to pay the wage. And not even doing it and the wages are not coming as at when due. So it's all of this falls back to entrepreneurship development, in my honest opinion. Those should be able to rise up and look within, discover what traits, talents and abilities they have. And then plan strategically how to translate those from ability to monetize services. That would I mean just loosen you up financially and make you not dependent so to speak on a system for daily bread, whether it's a place of employment or government policy. And even as an entrepreneur, government policy does have an impact on your ability or the scale at which you earn and all of that. So really, I would say it's an egg and chicken analogy situation if you will. If I'm going to add to this, I think that the minimum idea of minimum wage was not supposed to limit the potential or the capacity of the citizens. It was basically to ensure that at least there's a standardization of some sort. Now, there are many things to consider here. First of all, inflation. And if you look at the last two, three years, inflation is now double digits. So if you were buying a bag of rice for 9000 Naira, you're almost buying times two now. So there are other things we're dealing with. But the minimum wage or the living wage is not rising just as high as the inflation in the price. Exactly. So there is an erosion of value, right? But one thing is that we know government can't buy themselves, create jobs. We've always advocated and enabling environments to allow for the jobs. So an entrepreneur today can't even get access to capital. It's the seabed and giving loans. You bet you need collateral. It's the bank of industry giving loans. You bet you need collateral. And how many Nigerian businesses truly genuinely can afford to collateral? Except for the big guys who have been in oil all our lives. And again, so we can't necessarily begin to talk about living wage when the circumstances of the environment that can allow for the living wage is not even there. And then with one of my greatest challenge is looking at how much the governor's end for security votes, how much the National Assembly and the House of Representatives... We did go there, right? It's such a bloated... No, it's such a bloated figure. Those guys are robbing us in daylight. But at the end of the day, they will struggle to approve a 30,000 Naira minimum wage. But they are going home with an entire local government budget every month. It's security. It's really what it is. So my own particular advocacy is that when are we going to wake up and attack this bloated government and let them end like civil servants? I'm Alison Ferdinand that those are your views. And now Ferdinand is telling us to prepare for a post-all economy after this break.