So, it's a fifth Europe item for me and it's really an honor speaking at Europe item because the energy and the vibe is really good. I really love it and it's a good conference. I'm Radoslav Georgiev. So it's Radoslav Georgiev if I say it in my native language or if I try to make it sound a bit more English, Radoslav Georgiev. Sea of Hacksoft, which is an end-to-end software development company based in Bulgaria, that's Eastern Europe. Yep, that's pretty much about it. And as per usual, the goal of this talk is to be practical, pragmatic and provide value for all of you. Me just doing this talk, it's kind of whatever. The main idea is some of you to get something from this talk and try to apply it or read more about it or research more about it. So that's the general idea of this talk. And the context pretty much is at Hacksoft we are currently growing and since we are doing end-to-end software development, we form quite a lot of software teams and when you have quite a lot of software teams, you need to have leadership. It's really, really crucial. If you don't have good leadership, you cannot grow. You cannot do your job well. And the other interesting thing about leadership is that it's hard to hire from outside. Like I'm just going to hire five leaders. There you go. Start working. You usually have to put in the work and grow them naturally from within because leadership pretty much is bound to the context of your specific company culture and the way you do things. So that's the context I'm going to speak from experience. And the agenda that we're going to cover is what's the role of a team lead, managing expectations and responsibilities, unfolding potential communication and at the end how to know if we are doing a good job. So that's pretty much it. And let's start with this. For us, software development is a team game. With opening a bracket, you can achieve a lot doing it solo. You can be pretty happy developing and working alone. And this is okay, but in our context, it's a team game. You either win as a team or you lose as a team. It's really hard for someone really, really good just on his or her zone to have an impact. So we have to be pretty good at team games. And we form teams for quite a lot of reasons. It's usually to solve problems, to build something, to do research, but we form teams. And by forming teams, this means getting a group of people together and setting some kind of a goal. And when you gather people together, call them a team, hand them over work, leadership is going to be established. And there are pretty much two options. Inside are going to be implicit leadership, which means nobody knows who the leader is, but also everybody knows who the leader is implicit. It's this person over here, or it can be explicit leadership like it's communicated. This is the person that's going to team lead this specific team. And since we are at a Python conference, explicit is better than implicit, at least from our experience. And it's always a good idea to have an explicit team lead, or at least start with saying, this is going to be the team lead. And this is going to be the person who's going to carry out the responsibilities of a team lead. So when you form a team, there is going to be some kind of leadership establishment. It's good to make this explicit. And the main idea of this talk, the point of view, is going to be, you are a newly assigned explicit team lead. You've been a software engineer up until now. And from now on, suddenly, snap, you wake up, you are now a team lead. And what now, what do we do now, what's changing for us, and how should we approach this? So perhaps the first important step, if we are in this situation, is to figure out what's the actual role of the team lead? What should I do? I now have a new title. The first thing that I'm going to do is change it in LinkedIn. Okay, check. Get some positive feedback from close friends, and what's next? So at least for me, it pretty much boils down to two things. And the first thing is achieving the goal, because you have a team and this team has a specific goal to achieve, whatever it may be. And it's usually the responsibility of the leader that this goal is achieved. If the team fails, it's the leader that's responsible. So that's the first thing. And the second thing is, of course, you should not forget that you are responsible for a group of people, so you should take care of them. It's like, if you just put the spotlight on you, and I am the team lead, and I am going to make everything an aye, aye, aye, aye, aye, you're kind of forgetting about that you actually have a team, and this team needs to do some work in order to achieve this goal. So you need to take care of them. And this picture with puppies. And this involves... I was looking for a picture of pushing and picture of pulling, and all the pictures were terrible. And then I found this where it involves both pushing and pulling in a single picture. So it involves quite a lot of pushing, which means you need to go around and push people to do stuff. But it also involves quite a lot of pulling, which is setting the direction and making sure everyone is committed to that direction and they walk on their own, like you're pulling them towards this goal. The other thing, and this was a big surprise for me when I started doing more leadership and team management and software development, is involves quite a lot of orchestrating, which means things are happening with or without you, and you kind of need to figure out where you need to jump in, where you need to just let go and don't do nothing, and where you need to direct and focus energy. And for me, the analogy is you're waving your hand and trying to orchestrate everything so it sounds good, because if an orchestra, everybody plays whatever they want, it's going to sound, but if it's going to be good, not really sure. And again, the second point, it's about enabling. So this image should communicate the word enabling. You need to enable the people, and if you don't enable the people, it's going to be pretty much there is work to do. Everybody's going to crunch it. You can push them, you can use authority, and most probably you're going to get the job done, to be honest. And this is the case in some places, let's say, and you can do this for quite some time, but you will end up with a team that just waits for something better to show up, and they will leave you. And this is not, at least for me, not a good way to form teams and not a good way to make something that's long-lasting. So it's kindling the fire within the people, and that's enough with the pictures. I just had an inspiration with using pictures for slides. And your thing, you're a newly appointed team lead, and if you're experienced before this, this is in software engineering, and suddenly you realize you have the responsibility for moving a certain part of the project and getting a job done, you might say, okay, what I'm good at? Software development. So I'm just going to do all the work, no matter the team. I know what to do. I will put in hours because I have this new responsibility, and most probably you will be able to do this. But this, as you can imagine, is, again, not a good long-term and long-lasting strategy, but there's a but. I think if you are new in the team lead kind of sphere, it's a good idea to do this mistake a couple of times. Like really, really try doing all the work so you can convince yourself that it's not a good idea and not a reliable strategy. It's kind of a rite of passage. Sometimes you need to kind of do it in order to understand why people say you should not do it. And this is, yeah, at least in my opinion, it's a good thing. And then you realize that it's not about doing all the work, but rather filling the gaps. Sometimes you need to fill the gaps and you need to jump in and just be there because you might not have all the resources. It might not be the perfect scenario, but it's more about filling gaps. And when people, for example, ask me, what do I do? I'm a gap filler, basically, in the company. That's all I do. Figure out where the gaps are, fill the gaps, push things forward. And there's something else. When you are the team lead, another set of forces start applying. And those are the outside forces because from now on, for this particular team, someone else, if someone else wants to communicate something and does not know anybody else on the team, it's going to be like, who's responsible? Who should I call? And that's the team lead. So that's another set of forces that are going to start working on you. And you're going to have internal forces also pushing towards you. And it's a good idea to realize that you're both external and internal buffer. Sometimes you need to buffer. Sometimes you need to react. But those forces are going to start applying. And if you're not prepared, the question is, okay, something's pushing me. Should I do something about it? Like, there are some folks in the team that are not playing very well with each other. Should I do something about it? Or there is a manager that wants everything shipped for tomorrow, if possible. Should I do something about it? And sometimes, yes, sometimes no. But the important thing is realizing that you are actually a buffer. And sometimes you need to buffer. And sometimes you need to kind of redirect energy and reuse the energy that you've buffered to push back, for example, or to manage if this is needed. And I said the keyword for the next slide, which is managing expectations and responsibilities, which turns out to be very, very, very, very important. And it sounds really boring. It sounds like a corporate talk from now on, where we're going to talk about expectations and responsibilities. It is actually really important. So let's see why. Imagine the following scenario. Everything's going well, but you know that Bob is not doing his best, for example. It's, you have this internal feeling. He's not doing this particular thing that I really want Bob to do. And then, as you are thinking this, your second thinking, your internal monologue, says, but have you told Bob you are actually expecting him to do that? And you're like, well, no. But Bob is smart enough to figure this out by himself, for example. And this is a really common pitfall. And it's really easy to get frustrated when you are in a team leadership or team management position. It's really easy. It's like your day job is to get frustrated. You wake up and frustration floats all around. And the thing is, frustration is actually really good. With time, you will start loving it because this is a clear sign, at least for yourself.  Tell Bob that this is actually expected from him explicitly. And those are the responsibilities. Tell everyone. And that's why it's important because otherwise you start getting frustrated. And if frustration is kept within for too long, then bad things are going to happen. And at least from my experience, this is how it goes. You write down how you see it as a team lead. And then you go and talk individually with everyone and then as a group, how they see it. Iterate, negotiate, communicate. But the final thing is you need to handshake with everyone.  Does everyone, or do everyone, I'm not sure, does everyone agree with this? Do we have agreement? And if you have agreement, then you can carry on. And this is really important because if you manage the expectations and responsibilities well, you will achieve something that's usually referred to as team alignment in the big books about this topic, which if you have team alignment, then you've done your, at least you're doing your job that's expected from you and you're doing your job well. Because I really love this analogy. If you are driving a car with misaligned tires, even if the road is really good, and there was an Eastern European joke here, but I'm not going to say it. And even if the road is really, really good, but the tires are misaligned, your head is going to be bumpy. It's like the driving wheel is going to be like this. You're like, okay, the car is good, the road is good, what's happening? The tires are misaligned, most probably. It's the same thing with a team. Like it's a cheap analogy, but for me it's the same thing. You have really good people inside, you are doing your best, and still it's not working out. So most probably you need to kind of better align, I think. And how team alignment usually goes is it's a good idea to write things down. As with expectations, like write things down, have some documentation. This is how we do things here. This is like the team alignment. This is how we do things in this team, and we are aligned for this, which will give better visibility of team dynamics, more explicitness, which as we will see is a recurring theme of this talk, and it's great for onboarding new people because you can have a great team, but if nothing is written, like the team dynamics are implicit, because you've worked for a year, you know each other very well, and you know the expectations, you know the responsibilities, suddenly new folks come in, and they're like, what's happening? So team alignment should be explicit, should be written down, it's great for onboarding, and again it's not setting stone. As with, oh I forgot to, yeah, as with managing expectations and responsibility, it's, this is not a process, this is actually good, and I forgot to talk about it.  So usually those things, especially when working with people, they're not like, let's set up the CI infrastructure once, and I don't have six months down the road, go and set it up again. It's like, if it's working then it's working, I don't have to do anything, but when you're working with people, it's usually you have to do it now, and you have to do it a month later, and you have to do it a month after this, and it's basically you have to do it indefinitely, because people tend to forget, things change, and if you want to be explicit, you need to do it very, very often. And I think this is quite a big shift from doing software development work and doing leadership work. You do things once they work, great, I don't want to touch this again, with people you have to do things more often. Yeah, and the same thing here with team alignment, it's not set in stone. You can misalign at some point, and you need to align again, so it's again explicit, regular thing to do. I have time, I have slides, this is good. And now to my favorite part, when you are leading a team, you need to unfold potential, you need to spread the wings and feathers of people. It's really, really important, because there is a high chance for both you and your team that there is unrealized potential, which means you can get better, your team can get better. There's really, really high chance. If there is like a team where everyone reach their ceiling, that's great for sure, but most probably the ceiling is up there, you're still somewhere here, and you need to see where the ceiling for you and your team is. And more or less this is up to you, this is up to the team lead to, at least this is how we say in Bulgaria, I'm not sure this is proper English phrasing, but to realize your potential you have potential to realize it. And it's a fine balancing act, because you need to balance between comfort for people and something that I love this terminology called proximal development, quick parentheses. So proximal development is when you give someone a task that just on their own, they won't be able to do it, but with a little bit of help pushing, nudging, they will do it. And this is what development looks like with a little bit of help, people start getting better. So you can push this zone further and further with more difficult tasks, and this is how you develop people. So to unfold potential, it's basically a balancing act between comfort and between proximal development, because comfort is good. You know, it's just not going to be this kind of a talk where I'm going to say for 45 minutes, get out of your comfort zone and do things because everybody's saying this, so it must be true. Comfort is productivity. Sometimes you need your folks and you to be in comfort so you can be productive, so you can get some job done, some work done. But if you stay too long in comfort, you might get lazy. People might start thinking they know everything and they need to find another job because there are no challenges for them, but it turns out all along you are just keeping them in comfort and kind of creating a false idea about this. So comfort is good, but you need to balance it. And the same thing with proximal development and making people struggle, because when you are in proximal development, it is a struggle because you cannot do this on your own. That's the definition. And if you push people, if you go to the other extreme and just push people and go do hard things, go do hard things, people might learn that they cannot do things on their own, which is not good, because you will then give them a task which is perfectly fine for their skill level. And they'll say, but I need help. You don't need help, you can do it. But if you have been here for too long, then this might be the case. So it is a fine balancing act between those two. And at least from experience, what I found is if you can somehow explicitly communicate and manage expectations about this with your team members, it's better. It's like we need to ship something quicker now. So we stay in comfort, everybody plays to their strengths. Like you have a really, really, really, really strong front-end team member who wants to do something, for example, back-end work. For now, you stay in front-end. This is not going to be forever. But for example, for this month, we need to ship this thing. And you need to get everybody's, I think, buy-in was the word for it, or you need to align again everybody what you're trying to do and what you're trying to achieve. So again, it's a lot of explicit communication. And again, I said the keyword communication. Going to the next slide, just going to drink water. It's really important to establish a good form of communication. But what does this mean? This is a good question. At least what we try to do is to over-communicate, which means communicate more than needed, which means sometimes being connoined. Like, let me again restate everything and I'm looking at people and if everybody rolls their eyes up, it's good. We know it. We continue. So over communication sounds bad, but I think it has more positive effects than downsides. It's less likely that your people will leave because they're annoyed because you talk too much. They might start memeing you for this, which is good for company culture, than people living because they're not feeling well in this particular team with this particular leadership. And an anecdote from experience. More channels, less DMs. Sometimes we form a team and we join an existing company with existing software development team to help them for a couple of months. And we join, we now use shared Slack channels, but before this, you kind of join their Slack or whatever they use. And all the channels are dry. Like last message was two weeks ago. And our first question is, is everybody on a vacation? No, no, no. We're here. We're working. Then why all the channels are dry? Are you using Gmail? Hoping, no, to say no. No, no, we're not using Gmail. No, no. Your side of relief, okay. But why are there channels that we're not included in? No, no, no. Those are all the channels. So where are you communicating? It's everything is in DMs, like two by two, two by three, which is, at least in my opinion, really bad because it fragments the information, silos things. And especially if the communication is about work, not talking about personal stuff, this should be kept in DM. But if it's about work, it's much better to communicate in channels because sometimes people will just read and feel what's going on. And when all the communication is happening in channels, the team leads and the managers can spot something which might be an alarm for them and follow up on this. And this is really important. If all the communication is in DMs, at least for me, it's not a good sign. And of course, we are now in the era of remote work. It's again annoying having to, if you're doing like eight hour Zoom calls a day, I'm sorry for you. I am a guy who if a meeting can, if one hour meeting can be reduced to 15 minutes, great. If a 15 minutes meeting can be reduced to one minute meeting, let's not do it at all. But sometimes you need to have faces because if you're not working in the same office and you're not seeing with your teammates, it might get a little aliny. I cannot say this word, sorry. You will start distancing each other if you're not seeing faces. So turn on camera. It's good to see faces. Like you need to be okay in the face, then you can wear sweatpants and just be comfortable. And the other thing that we found out from experience, which is again, sounds like a corporate talk, one-on-one meetings are really essential. And if I just put this light and say this thing here and you Google one-on-one meetings, you will find that there are not a couple, but plenty school of thoughts about one-on-one meetings. Like people saying, you should not do project sync in one-on-one meetings. You should not talk personal stuff in one-on-one meetings. You should always coach and mentor in one-on-one meetings. But in the end, you should do whatever you want in those one-on-one meetings. Because this is the time between you, the leader, or the manager, and someone from your team to talk. Regular, every week, recurring event in the calendar. Highest priority, meaning if there is another meeting overlapping with your one-on-one, the other meeting moves, not your one-on-one moves. It's really important. Highest of the priorities. And then you figure out what to talk about. Sometimes it's going to be project sync. Sometimes it's going to be coaching and mentoring. Sometimes it's going to be just 15 minutes of small talk, which is also good, because you're building a relationship. This is about building a relationship and getting to trust each other. So the folks in your team will come to you and say when they have a problem. This is what you want to achieve. Otherwise you're, do you have a problem? I'm poking you. Do you have a problem? It's like interrogation. And that's why one-on-one meetings are really, really, really, really important. And you should do them however you like and you're seeing fit. And being explicit helps a ton, again. At least for me, this was a big problem, because I was always thinking they know what I'm thinking. Everything's going good. But it's not the case. You have to be explicit. You have to explicitly state things, even things that are not, how to say, positive or comfortable. At least in the beginning. But this will build trust. And if you have trust, the rest will come, let's say. And I still have time. I still have slides. So it's going to be no slides, still time, so we'll have time for questions. At the end, what does team growth look like?  You've been doing this for, let's say, a year. Things are going well. You have this internal feeling that things are going well. And now the question is, how do I measure it? Or what do I look for? And for measurements, I'm not going to talk because I don't have experience with this. How to measure if you are an effective leader, like with metrics. But it's rather things that you can spot. And at least internally, we have this definition called rhythm, which is an entire article, which I'm not going to explain right now. You can imagine that rhythm is a flow state for teams. Like personally, you can be in a flow state doing work and making progress, rhythm, flow state for teams. So if you see that your team is in a flow state, is in rhythm, that's a good sign that you are most probably doing your job well. Alongside your, as we said, it's good to have explicit leadership. But people are people. And alongside your explicit leadership, implicit one is going to form, nevertheless. Unless you're some kind of authoritarian leader and you don't allow any kind of leadership. This is not what we want to do. Implicit leadership is going to form. And this is a good thing, especially when you start spotting it. Because when you start spotting it, you can start using it. You can start relying on people to help you out. And this is a really good sign that at least maybe you're doing a good job. See? And the ultimate test, of course, is what will happen if you suddenly disappear? It's a bit, I don't want anybody of you to suddenly disappear. It's like a little bit morbid.  New career opportunity? You're changing?  What will happen? Because if you do your job well, you're going to have implicit leaders. And most probably those implicit leaders, someone will rise and become an explicit leader. So this is an interesting thought experiment. Just sit down, get in the mood for thinking, and ask the question of what will happen if I suddenly disappear, work-wise. And this can give you insights of what to do better, what to improve, what you're not doing so as good as you'd like to. And personally, at least for me, this is one of my biggest motivations for doing this, seeing people grow and develop. It's a really good thing because first, they are happy about it. Second, you have more people that you can really trust and rely on and not do all the work that needs to be done. So it's really a win-win situation. And of course, leadership is a vast topic. It's an important topic. And I was really thinking about what to recommend. Like, there are plenty of books, but I don't want to put like six books on the side. I just want to put one book. Most probably you know about it, but this book has references to other books. So what you can do is get this book, read it, it's good. It's really good. And then just do a breadth-first search on the references mentioned in this book. And you will most probably find something that speaks to you. Because that's the other important part. You need to find something that's relatable to you because you might read books that you're not feeling it, but for sure there are other books that you can feel, you can relate to, and you can improve. But this book is really good. Really, really good. Highly recommend it even if you're not in a leadership role. And then a lot of references. If you follow the references, it's going to be more than enough. I'm going to tweet it. Why not? And yeah, I think that's it. That's still time. No more slides. Time for questions. Thank you. Yeah, thanks very much. So if you guys have any questions, please walk to the mic. Hi, I just want to say that's probably my most favorite talk so far. And as a new team leader, it resonates with me a lot. And I have a creepy feeling that you've been watching me for the last half a year or so, because it covers all the areas that I struggle with. So it's a very short, a very good intro.  And for me, the question is now, I don't want to always deal like all day, just with Google Meet, Google Calendar, Slack, email, Google Sheets. I am still an engineer inside, right? So how do you balance it yourself if you actually still do it? And how can you actually save your sanity and still be able to be passionate about engineering part of it? Got it. That's a good question. Not really sure I can properly answer it, but at least for me, for example, I'm still doing some engineering work, although I should not be doing it. And I know this, but yeah, this will come. And if there is no other way of doing engineering work and you love and like doing engineering work, I think open source is a good way of venting this energy. So at least this is my opinion, but I'm pretty sure there are folks here with better answers about this. But I got you. Take care. Thank you for your really great talk. I have a question about assigning tasks, because you mentioned that it should be balanced between a comfort zone and development and so on. How it corresponds to using methodologies like Scrum, Kanban, and so on? It's a personal, yeah, very personal question, because I have a lot of problems with this, especially with Scrum and assigning tasks based on... It's both of us. Yes. I just rolled my eyes when I heard methodologies. For example, we don't follow any particular specific methodology and we have the freedom to do it, because we kind of assign ourselves to the work, but I really cannot answer this. If someone can answer this, I would really like to listen to this talk. Someone with more experience, how to balance those things and fit within a corporate structure that requires you to also fit within some structure. But I cannot answer because we're not a corporate structure. We don't have experience with this. Thank you. So thank you for all this wonderful packed information about unfolding potential... Yeah. You said that, okay, sometimes we need to push people outside of the comfort zone, and... But one other thing I'm thinking is that some people, everyone has some superpower, and sometimes you don't know it, and people, if you don't ask them, they don't tell you. They'll think, I'm just going to do my job here, and if they ask me something, I answer, otherwise. So how do you learn that your team has... The members of your team have these feathers so that you can help them unfold them and gain from that? That is a really good question. One of the ways are by talking regularly to them, which is the one-on-one meetings, and the other... So it really depends on what's your style of leadership and management, but sometimes you can just shake things up. We're changing roles for a week. For example, this is only that we've been experimenting for some time, like assigning a team lead for this particular week, or just changing roles, or just rotating, so you can see how people act in different circumstances, but I'm still learning, because I really cannot answer... Give you a comprehensive answer about this, but for me, shaking things up when you have trust established might do the trick. Hi. Hi. Thanks for the talk. You talked about communication and seeing the phases from time to time. What do you think about remote work and coming back to the office? Is it... I feel that it's much better to be in the office in terms of communication, and do you maybe impose or in your company like a couple of days a week or a month or something so that the teams gather? So we are a relatively small company, 25 people, so the policy is do whatever you want. Work is hybrid. You can work from office. You can work from home, but the teams themselves, they kind of try to see each other at least a couple of times per two weeks or per month, or if it's been a long time where we haven't seen each other, then, for example, I try to step in and push some kind of team building activity that we can do just together. So, again, sadly, working with people and leadership is so about knowing your people and having an explicit baseline of rules, but then trying to see that this team is not communicating very well. Let's see what we can do about it. But remote is great. Hi, thank you for your talk. It was awesome. So I have a question. Can you tell us about a situation in your experience while leading teams? Like something that was totally unexpected for you? I believe some of the changes are common, but something that you totally did not expect. Okay, so I will mention two things. The first is I was really not expecting people. When people start realizing their potential, it's a game changer because then you can relax and rely on people, which is a great feeling. And the other thing is I have not mentioned conflicts, but the other thing is that you need to be prepared and aware that conflicts are going to happen. And even if you're doing the best and having the best leadership, people are people and conflicts are going to happen. And again, you need to resolve them with more explicitness. So those are the two things. Yeah, thanks for the insights. And I wanted to ask a question related to keeping your sanity. Now specifically regarding the buffer part. So you can be pushed a lot maybe by an external client. You may have also additional responsibility than just leading the team, like keeping track of deadlines, budgets. And so you may be pushing yourself also. And how do you stay sane and keep your team sane while at the same time managing to, you know, keeping track of the budgets and deadlines and whatnot? That's a good question. Most probably in most cases, you're going to have someone else being like a manager or a lead for you and you should leverage and use this. And if you're like feeling a lot of pressure, ask for help. It's not all on you. In our situation, it's a bit easier because we work with end clients and sometimes when we get too much pressure or we cannot work with those clients, we're just like, it's not a good fit. Here's another company. We're going in a different direction, but it's all about how much freedom you have to maneuver. And if you don't have much freedom, then you have to use the tools that are given to you. If you have a manager or a leader yourself, use this a lot. Like communicate, talk about different situations and how they would handle them and just use the tools available. And sometimes you just have to say, no, push back. This is not a career advice because again, we're not in a corporate environment. And most probably if you put me in a corporate environment, they're going to fire me after the first month. So I may not be the best person to answer, but this is what I do. Thank you. Hi, thanks for the talk. So you mentioned channels versus DMs. How do you suggest to push people towards the channels? Because you set up the channels first week, it's fine, and then they kind of are empty. My suggestion would be to be very annoying until people start communicating in channels without going to straight up conflict, this or that, like setting ultimate items. But you can nudge people and be very annoying, and most of the times it works. But it's about explicitly communicating and a team alignment. Team alignment. We're going to communicate in channels and we're going to discuss it. We're going to agree on it. And now if people are not doing it, they break alignment and then you can be more... So harsh is a bad word, but this is the word that I know in English, let's say. You can be more harsh with them and say, all right, we have alignment, but you're not following the alignment, so let's resolve the conflict. But be annoying. It works. If I may add a comment on this, I've seen that keeping irrelevant people out of the channel helps much. Because sometimes I've noticed the director or the division director is in the channel just because they like to take a look at everything and then people don't want to speak on the channel. Yeah, that is a good comment. And sometimes, for example, developers might not feel the freedom to express themselves if they're way too much upper level and senior executives in the channel. So then just create a channel where the developers can communicate more freely. This works, yeah. All right, thank you very much.


Welcome back to Geneva and WISIS Forum 2022, and with me is Jonathan Chen. Jonathan is the Deputy Permanent Representative to the UN for Singapore. Welcome, and congratulations on your prize in the data management category. Can you tell me all about it? Thanks so much, Sam. I'm personally delighted to be here and I must say that Singapore is extremely honoured to receive this prestigious award on behalf of ASEAN member states. I think this is especially since the WISIS Prize is a very important process towards recognising global efforts that contribute to sustainable and inclusive development of ICTs. And I think this is very relevant because we are seeing a world that is increasingly digitised, and I think more than ever it is necessary to ensure that the benefits of digital economy are enjoyed by the broadest number of people possible. I think key to this really is enhancing regional and international cooperation, the opportunity to learn from good examples, exchange best practices, and I think this is really what the WISIS Prize encapsulates. So, today I was hoping to share a bit more about ASEAN's digital context. Yes, please do. And also the background behind the ASEAN data management framework and the model contractual clauses, it's a bit of a mouthful. What specific sustainable development goals were you seeking to address with the project? Or what range of goals? Presumably there were quite a lot of work there, quite a lot of ambitions for your project. There were quite a lot of ambitions but I think really just to set the context. When you're talking about ASEAN, which Singapore finds itself at the heart of, it's really a region with immense potential. We are talking about 650 million strong market and 3.2 trillion regional GDP, which makes us currently the fifth largest global market and I think by 2030, we are on track to be the fourth. And on top of that, I think 61% of our population is currently under the age of 35 and they really embrace digital technology. So, if you drill down a little more to specifically digital economy, I think that the prognosis is also very positive. During COVID-19, we onboarded 60 million new internet consumers, making us the third largest internet base with 400 million internet users. And on top of that, our digital economy is expected to hit 1 trillion in terms of regional GDP by 2030. So, there is recognition amongst the ASEAN member states that it's really key to come together and focus on digital cooperation and that's precisely why we are also looking at commencing negotiations on a ASEAN digital economy framework agreement by 2025. And I think if you drill down a little more, there is great awareness that data is a core building block of the digital economy. The key really is to unlock its potential. But I don't think that this is easy because for data to have value, it has to be transformed into insights, applications or services and this is typically found within individual companies. And so, if you're talking about a data-driven economy, the challenge here really is creating that ecosystem, the network that allows the access and process of high-quality data. And the challenge here really is that it's typically located in different organizations and across borders. So, one, there is a need to better use data so that companies are able to make smart decisions and scale up both domestically and internationally. But I think more critically, there is a need to ensure that these companies have the capabilities to manage, process and transfer data across borders safely. And I think it's really key for the ASEAN region because 95 to 99 percent of our SMEs are data-driven and they form more than half of our economy. So, what really the DMF, the Data Management Framework and the MCCs do is provide a very simple toolkit, easily implementable toolkit that allows companies to create a governance framework. To manage personal data and also include terms and conditions in their agreements that allows the safe and legitimate transfer of data across borders. So, there's a lot of potential in these initiatives and they're also part of our digital framework goal for 2025. And as I mentioned earlier, they're a later foundation for our digital economy framework agreement. There's such interesting insights and impressive statistics and congratulations on the recognition for your projects. Jonathan Chen, thank you very much for joining us. Thank you very much.


尊敬的各位來賓、女士們、先生們、大家Satellite TV, welcome to Dalian, okay, I'm very glad to arrive in here. This is our third time to stand on the stage together. And for the third time I realized its difference is changing, it's getting more and more beautiful.And then the unchanged thing, the unchanged thing is our interest in Chinese economy and the global economy. We not only care about the Chinese economy, but also how Chinese enterprises is performing on the global stage.So in one hour's time, we have with us five very important panelists with us to discuss this issue. And as Yuan has mentioned, Chinese enterprises is on the rise on the global stage. In fact, some of our panelists just came to Dalian from Paris, some from Washington and some from Milan. So they really gathered here through thousands of miles.And with respect to introduction, I will follow the lady first principle. I would like to first introduce Ms. Marguerite Cross, founder and executive chairman of ACO Worldwide USA. And she has a very beautiful and poetic Chinese name.So, my name is Guo, welcome to China, welcome to Dalian. And for me, I would like to introduce to you the four handsome gentlemen.So, Mr. Liu Jiren, chairman and chief executive officer, New Soft Corporation. And the one in the middle is Mr. Chen Feng, chairman of the board, HNA Group, China Airlines Group.And this gentleman, you are very familiar with him, Mr. Liu Changle, chairman and chief executive officer of Phoenix Satellite TV station.And I believe here, many of the young entrepreneurs would like to become your friend, Mr. Xiang Bing, the professor and the dean of Chang Kong Graduate School of Business.And so, Yuan and I will take turns to moderate the session and ask questions to the panelists and later we will open the floor.Now, but as according to lady first principle and as we are all guests here, so please be welcome.You can take a glass of water first and with more water and you can have better speeches.And while Ms. Cross is taking rest and taking some water, I would like to introduce her costume because this has Chinese element in it.This is specially designed for the Dalai Lama forum here in Dalian.So, thank you very much because she's really spent a great amount of effort into this.And APCO is a worldwide PR company.So, I would like to ask Ms. Cross this question.So, honestly speaking, you are in the international PR sector.So, you deal with government, various governments of the world.So, for this topic, global rise of the Chinese enterprise, do you really see they are on the rise to agree with that?And when you are dealing with various governments, what do you think is the greatest challenge that the Chinese enterprises face?I think that first of all, I'm very happy to be here.It's always special to come back to Dalian.It's my fifth time, I think.I think that there is definitely a rise of Chinese entrepreneurship.And I think the world welcomes that because I think it will help to, in the long term, to provide a lot of stability to the Chinese economy.And a lot of jobs, as we heard this morning from your Premier.I think that the biggest challenge is one of market entry.We do the broadest sense of communications and we help a lot of companies enter new markets.And one of the challenges I think the Chinese entrepreneurs have is that the lack of attention sometimes paid in Chinese companieswhen we work with them compared to others about investing in branding, investing in their reputational equity.A lot of tension is played on ROI, return on investment, not so much on ROR, return on reputation.And if the Chinese companies are entering these markets, it's very important for them to be able to build brands that people will trust and respect or the companies won't grow.And there's an interesting dichotomy.What works well in China, especially having China in the name, does not work well overseas.And so one of the things, and we can talk more about this as we go, is how Chinese companies can think about their face as they go abroad to avoid some of the problems and create some of the greater opportunities.Mr.Cross,女士哥哥特意強調,是在中國…Yes, just now Mr.Cross have mentioned that you need to establish your form into core values and brands.So this might be the greatest advantage when you are dealing with various governments.But how many Chinese brands do you know, may I ask you?Or what Chinese enterprises do you think has a really brand building internationally?Interesting, we did a survey not too long ago in the U.S.And there are quite a number of Chinese companies in the top 50.I think there is something like a dozen.And in the American survey 97% of the people couldn't name one, not even one.And so that tells you a little bit about how difficult that step is.And so I think as Chinese companies are acquiring new brands,especially if they already like Lenovo have brands.We've worked for many years for Costco.I think that there are bigger companies.Certainly the airlines are one of those.And I think some of the newer companies are also doing a better job at this.But I think that basically the Chinese companies aren't as well known.I think people are surprised at how big they are.And they don't have an understanding of what their core values are,what they stand for.And I think that's a shame because some of these companies are doing really great things.Miss Cross特别强调了,你看中国的品牌.In investment in the operations.So what's your take on Miss Cross's opinion?So what do you think is the greatest challenge for Chinese enterprises to go abroad?And what are the rules or the challenges you have?I think this is an interesting or funny questionbecause 30 years ago we struggled to get ourselves feed.But now after 30 years we still have the same appetite.But we use that appetite.We are getting diabetes and we can't get used to it.But we still have to learn from the Westerners,from the Germans, from the Americans.But as we are learning from the Western teachers,the teachers get into trouble themselves.So we are on the stage as we putting on our leather shoes.We step on the global stage.Now this is an inevitable path.We have to go out Chinese enterprises have to go globalbecause this is an error of globalization.So it's important for Chinese enterprises to learn how to go globaland how to learn from the mistakes.Will you get well known very soon?You won't be very fast.Just like a local guy gets on to the local again.It takes time for him to become the big shot.So time has proved that highland airlines is okay.It's all right.Now we are one of the five star service airlinesand it's no problem that we can be the serviceof the American Airlines.Now some of the airlines is fine,save.For example,American Airlines,they have the anti to serve,but it's fine.But they are putting on professional smiles.But for our ass doers,they are youngerand they smile sincerely from the heart.So I think Chinese people are capableof building good brands,but it takes time.It takes time.We have to make some mistakes.We have to pay our costs in order to achieve that.And I have realized that the lady next to youis putting on an awkward smile.So how about Mr. Xiang Bing,what's your take?Because Chinese people,Chinese learning from westernand teachers on the path of economic developmentand how to develop economy.But now the teacher is getting problems.What's your take on that?Well,we have a long way to go.We have many things to learn.While being confident,we need to be very,very humble.This is very important.As we look back on the 30 years history,China's economy was globalized.It's not active,but it's a passive sense.Because even though we are at the second-largesteconomy,our management is not as good enough.We have Japanese management,Korean investment,not to mention American management,much better European management.So we have to learn.So we are in a passive globalization path.So a few years ago,Bua For made a very bold speculationthat a few years later,20 years later,the globalization will play an important rolein Chinese economy.But then it comes really fast.The Chinese outward FDI for the first timeis greater than the inward FDI.So as we are going out,you need to have resource consolidationand to establish a core competitiveness.Now as we compete on the global search,we are not even as good as the Indian global companies.So resource consolidation is a necessary partto survive and to be better.On the other hand,in terms of the global perspective,the global vision,Chinese economies and Chinese enterprisesare not doing as good.And secondly,in terms of the proper responsibility,Chinese companies are not doing very good.Because for US companies,they are talking about global issues,global problems.But for Chinese companies,they don't really talk about it.Now we are the second largest economy.People expect you to take the responsibility.If you don't talk about that,people are not only envious,not happy with you.So that's another problem.And thirdly,Chinese companies are not goodat managing infrastructure.Because in the past,as long as they get good government relationship,the business is very good.But then internally,Chinese companies needs to improvethe internal managementand especially human resource managementbecause they are now taking advantageof the global human pool,talent pool.And we are in the very rush.So if you rush here in China,it's fine.But if you rush in other countries,you might get into trouble.I'm pretty impressed by Mr. Xiang'scomment or statement that China was globalized30 years ago.And then it happens really fastthat China is global.And one of the fact is thatsome of our foreign delegates,they can speak fluent Chinese.Now as we are aware that Mr. Liu Changle,the chairman and CEO of Phoenix Satellite TVjust came back from Milan,which is holding the world export right now.So the world is interested in China.So what's your take on that?Thank you,Yi Hu.So I am a frequent visitorover of an expo.I think this is perhaps relatedto my professionbecause media naturallytake a great concern on the expo.Now this on the expo in Milan this year,his center topic is agriculture and the food.Now I went there and I was greatlyinspired.A few days ago I visited China pavilions,English pavilions and American pavilionsdue to the restraint of time.I can only have time to visit this few pavilions.And as a result of the special arrangementI can visit some more.Now as I visit the Japan expoa few years agowhen I compare itwith the Shanghai expoand compare it with the Korean expo.So the people queuingin Milan this year is much longer.The queue are much longer.There are many foreigners queuing.They are very interestedand very few Chinese are there.I don't get the exact number.Later I was told thatthat day was the highest day for visitors.And the day before that 26,000 people cameto see the Chinese pavilions.The British pavilions is themed on bees.It looks like a bee nestwith a lot of flying bees simulation.English,Italian and Chinese.The three languages are providedfor the tour of British pavilion.But there were few British visitorsto the British pavilion.And I was quite impressed by that.Even there are some Asian languages.The first maybe Japanese or Koreannot Chinese.And now the only Asian languageand the British pavilion is Chinese.It's quite impressive.Indeed China has got close attentionfrom the international community.And years ago Chinaand Chinese investment.So last year China's outbound investmentdid 230 billion US dollarsexceeded for the higherthan China's inboundfoley direction investmentfor the first time.And in the years to comeChina will invest more in other countriesthe other countries invest in China.I also agree with the previous speakerthat China is not well knownfor its overseas investmentfor two companiesone years huawei,the other years sati these two companiessell more equipment overseasthan in China.For huawei 70% of its salesin overseas marketsand for sati 51% of its saleshappen in overseas.The boss of huawei keeps low profilein those far away countriesin the Middle EastI saw a lot of advertisementabout huawei.And in the top 10most recognizable brandseight of them are American brandsone years Korean brandand the other one is Japanese brand.And we know thatglobal 500 companiesin the world China hasone head of them includingHina Airlines.But in the most importantone head of brandsone of them is Chinese brand.So thank you Mr Liufor your remarks.And some people actuallyactually onto a global company500 company.NewsoftI wish to invite Mr LiuNewsoft to make some remarks.And would like to share with usyour observation on theinternational market.Newsoft was establishedabout starting its operation24 years agoand our international operationstarted from that time.More than 20 years agoit was very difficultto travel aroundand many peopleoutside China questionChina's protection ofintellectual propertyand they questionChina's political system.So all these thingsin their eyeswe have not establishedbasis for trust.So after more than20 decades of reformand opening up the brand ofChina years undergoing changesand this indicates thatalthough we have some problemsit's much easier for Chinato achieve something.In the past it was verydifficult to hireinternational talentsand now in ourEuropean office we have100 staffonly 1 or 2 of themcomes from China.Due to our pastisolationdue to our rapidincrease in wealthwe do not pay closeattention to brandingparticularly individualbranding will havebig impact on commerce.For example,we respectno colleagues.In Europe they have alot of holidaysand at the beginningwe did not respecttheir holidaysand there is aone month holidayin Europe and forthat month theycertainly disappeared.We nowunderstand thatwinter inFingland is very shortand in summer very longso they need thatwomenimpose our culturesupon themand we do not want toexport cultureto those countriesand it is notthe fact thatit is notthat you are richso you can getthings done.They appreciate their wayof life.Thank you.And I thinkfive panellistson the podiumagree thattime is neededforChinese companiesand the three speakersmentionedthey have a problemandcompared towith otherthey always companiesthey always local governmentsthere seems atrust deficitChinese companiesand their counterparts.My questionfirst goes toMr.Chenof Hainan Airlineswe know thatin mergers andacquisitionsyou used alot of moneyandHainan Airlinesemphasizedthat the importanceof exchange ratedo you thinkthat the exchange ratewill help yougo out.Who tell youthat we careabout interest ratesI do notcare aboutinterest rateswhen yourincome reachinternational levelit is aglobal companyandthings may changeseveral years agowhen thereminbi wasstrongyou would getsome benefitsbut youcannot getbenefits all the timeI thinkwe should nottoo muchand thequestion iswhether you canbuy by the rulesofinternationalyouneed tohaveglobaltenants andglobalresourcesandrecentlywe havequite biggermovesSwiss porthas more thantwo hundredairportsand morethan 60,000peopleI acquiredthatairportmanagement groupfromSwisslandforbigcompanygetfinancing frominternationalmarketI thinkitlending is akind of wayto relocateresourcesandif youworkhard enoughthenyou canrecognizeby yourinternationalpeersandyouincorporatemind ityou can hirepeople wheneverthey come fromandwe need tocreate acalporate cultureand so thatthis culturewill be acceptedby peopleandwhat elsethe governmenthas done for youwhatyou need mostactuallyit'sstreamlining theprocesshoweverit takestimefor ideato come throughand sometimeswe needto movefasterif youworktoo fasttoo slowyou willlost many investment opportunitiesandotherwiseit willadd the costto the exchange ratefor examplemy overseasofficeneed to remittheirmoney backto thecharter of my companyandit wasalso important jobso forChinese companyto go globalslowt prochaineand emotionandit issochcoreandst Auatsandyouhave有些人在電視台上會想做更多的評論謝謝,Finnix TV也是中國語言機我們也有些計劃在新加坡和美國的國家我們會找到三個國家的國家例如,我們也會遇到一些困難,我們也會提供更多的資源,而交易領域也很重要,若你沒有合約的交易領域,或若你提供交易領域交易領域交易領域交易領域,28億美元的資源是一個大增長的大增長。我認為這與其他領域的關係,我對 Mr. Chen 說,我們不要太有心。我對於空中的賀頓,空中的賀頓意味著你不關心任何事,你只要拿走你希望的。最後,20,000 中國的銀行在 90 個國家,90% 中國的銀行,新的銀行,我們遇到一些問題,但如何通過網絡,因為我認為,Mr. Liu 基仁,新的領域的領域,進入了國際健康領域,所以,國際健康領域,國際健康領域,會不會是中國的銀行領域?過去,中國的銀行領域,中國的銀行領域,中國的銀行領域,但新的領域,我們在銀行領域工作,我們在銀行領域工作,我們在做一些不同的事,現在,從最初,通過網絡,如何通過公司,如何通過公司,這些問題,我們要解決,現在,在國際健康領域,我們的工程,我們的科技藝術製造的物品,他們剩下的工具,他們公司剩下的工具,他們公司剩下的工具,我們在他們公司製造他的工具,我們將他在於他們公司製造的行業,投放 their Eyes of management他們公司製造的ing실,我們 분化為,服務,及應用的公司製造他們的公司 procedures,我們在港市,我們當需求,就使用我們的技術,因為它們的鍛鍊品牌和空中的 nice所以很多大企業都使用我們的技術所以我們支援他們的產品所以我們面對最大的挑戰是人人人人人的領導所以這並不是只是信任兩者的領導我們需要信任兩者的領導所以,這兩個人,他們都在做得很好。但是,如果他們把關係打敗的話,我們會有問題。而中國的經濟是在發展中。我們要成為一個類似的經濟,而我們要成為一個類似的技術,他們都很不同。所以,在國家發展中,我們也需要改變他們的經濟。所以,我會重複一下,我們需要成為一個類似的經濟。我們看到中國的旅遊者在做什麼,或者在國家發展中,他們可能會認為,只是幾個旅遊者,但他們不認為這樣,他們會認為中國的旅遊者是這個方式。所以,就像中國的經濟,我們可能會有幾個旅遊者,但只要我們有幾個旅遊者,我們的整個畫面會變得相似。所以,我們需要重視他們,讓他們能夠建立一個人對人的信念。好,現在, President Liu 提到一個重要的技術,他的技術是最重要的,中國的經濟發展,所以,我想問一下,我想問一下,因為,中國的商業學業,你會帶來的,是否在中國的商業領域,在發展中,中國的商業領域,所以,特殊的業者,特殊的業者,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,他們想學習,我們沒有理解這類的事件所以,像 mr. Liu 也有提及的我們去社會,我們要尊重社會我們要尊重社會的價值因為他們的價值,他們的夢想是非常不同的,他們的生活是不同的我們要尊重社會,很多國家都要做這個並不是因為他們想要做一個生活而是因為他們想要解決問題如果我們都要尊重社會,因為錢我們沒有新的能力我們需要有不同的夢想我們需要努力,我們需要尊重社會我們需要把人類的東西,進入他們的學校我們需要做同樣的事,我們可以跟他們合作現在,在西方國家,在歐洲,美國,美國他們會提出,要做多少錢,要做多少錢要做你的生意,要做得更加強但是,在一個國內,最高級的學生從強亢生的學校,他們只要照顧要做更多的錢,我們不可以影響整個社會的影響所以,我們要想為何要做錢要做多少錢,要做什麼所以,我們不只要學習從強亢生的學校,我們要做更多的錢不只這樣所以,我們需要有不同的能力我們需要有不同的能力我們需要有不同的能力所以,這是我們看到的地位因為,在過去的西方國家,我們需要有更多的體驗我們需要學習從那裡因為,在過去,我們要追蹤所以,我們是永遠的第二級永遠我們要做最高級的戰爭因為,我們沒有新的技術我們沒有新的技術但是,當我們看見地位的地位我們可以有更多的能力만許,中國無法更換地好的,我們回到產品我們回到產品好的,我們回到產品我們回到產品所以,回來為產品我想 Director'sغagh我再回答一下,我可以跟您分享一下嗎?這很重要我認為有一點錯誤我們在教育上在做更多的錢我認為這並不是問題我認為我們都在說我們要如何讓公司和學生創造重要的價值他們的存在在做更多的錢我們做了一個國際研究什麼令一家公司一家企業或者一家美食人物還有什麼令另一家更多我認為這很重要的討論在中國公司在看待他們的 own way forward創造的模式這有四個因素第一個是公司和學生在公司他們懂得公司的任務第二個是公司的認識他們走開他們做什麼他們說他們要做第三個是關閉你如何創造對公司的感情和你們的客人其他人為什麼他們愛這個公司為什麼他們飛你的航班和其他人但最重要的最高層是公司的任務為什麼公司存在存在做一個很好的航班但也存在賺錢但用這個錢為了公司的利用你們想有很好的工作你們想買你的產品或愛你的公司你們必須回答這個問題關於公司我認為這就是中國公司需要想像公司如果你們想香港公司他們必須繼續在美國公司他們他們我要你們生產他們他們他們他們他們他們他們他們 are我我我所以現在回到你的問題關於 crisis or reputation我認為如果你做這些事情你會經常有 crisis因為業界經常有 crisis我們有辦公室三十四個地方的世界每天我上班有很多好事在發生但如果你建立你的 reputation正正的方式你會有 deposit in the bank for crisis你會有 reputational equity你建立所以有一個層次如果有一個層次人們會給你免費的所以我覺得很重要你認為這些事情那是為了你認為你會做的而建立這個層次不僅在中國包括中國的公司但在國際上沒有更重要的今天年輕人如果你想要最好的工作他們想要工作他們相信的公司如果你想要貿易的工作他們想要人們把他們的工作不管他們的工作不管他們的工作不管他們的女性生活是因為他們關心他們的公司而這就是領導的工作和公司的工作是為了建立那種層次所以至少你沒有辦公室在中國你有任何計劃嗎當然我們從1989年來在中國在APCO我的公司是在這裡對我們在這裡很久了所以這就是為了這一個特別的地方我看過所有的很大的增長我認為30年內會發生什麼事但我認為如果你把時間轉回當我們開始在中國日本正在面對一些同樣的問題他們學習如何改善國家的文化他們花了很多時間和努力學習如何教育公司如何成為我認為有些 parallel在於在國際的品牌上產品的成績都變得更高我認為這是一個非常彩繪的國家我認為這是一個很大的機會但對於中國我們公司已經是一個非常重要的公司已經是很長時間的有了APCO這麼好的公司我們居然不知道它在中國的大陸已經哦APCO是一個很棒的公司我並不是很擔心在這裡你必須有更多的通訊和發言她是一個很棒的客人你還在哪裡我還有我還有有關的新聞你也知道楊明MBA他大大但最大的原因為何楊明在MBA玩是APCO所以如果你利用分析其他公司是其他楊明他們想去玩MBA所以你做了一個很大的活動在幫楊明進入MBA所以你做了一個很大的活動為了幫助中國的公司我們現在有很多的公司我們 oldest中國的公司COSCO他們有過難處理中國的船航我們我們工作我們在他們工作我們我們是一個很棒的 honour我們我們有很多的公司我們是一個很放鬆的公司我們是一個很放鬆的公司我們是一個很放鬆的公司我們是很放鬆的公司我知道了有關一些商業機密的部分不適合在這邊跟大家透露了所以某些部分可能是很自然的而且是很自然的所以她比較不喜歡回答我們有很多的朋友從媒體所以最後10至20分鐘我們會有我們的媒體問一些問題所以請給這位先生攝影機請自己提供你們的工作謝謝你們我是第一財經日報的記者謝謝從21年中央市場的新聞中國市場的新聞所以桂林 Air Lines買購場這是我的問題我們知道旅遊 air lines是經常接觸的低價 air lines所以我的問題是如何保護你買桂林 Air Lines還有前輩的桂林 Air Lines沒有做得好所以海南 Air Lines不應該如何不可以錯過還有也有一個問題問題是我已經在海南 Air Lines16年了我們有更多 than 500 air planes我們有18 Air Lines和海南 Air Lines是世界上最好的海南 Air Lines在世界上我們正在接觸地位的情況在一路開啟我們有做一些例如在廣西在福州以及在國際上像卡薩克森桂林 Air Lines桂林 Air Lines是一間名叫的市場中國旅遊我們希望我們會更加提供旅遊在中國還有還有旅遊有不同的需要在海南 Air Lines是他們的大企業旅遊人員我沒有想過現在的問題會發生大挑戰我確定這件事會更加提供旅遊在桂林是最重要的問題我並非媒體我可以有機會提出問題在美國的經驗以及日本的經驗以及我們的經驗在中國我認為在國家要變得強是經驗必須強在經驗必須強經驗必須有很多強的公司和公司投入68億元從市場和我認為所以我們必須檢查與Mr. Chen68億元對嗎是的是的基本上是研究和經驗案件的海南航班我是川崗學業學校詢問是你你會停止你的市場行動謝謝Mr. Fu從新中國組織Mr. Fu自己是很成功的創業他是我們知道中國其實中國沒有大量創業所以我們都知道對IPO我們的創業是我沒有我的想法關於海南航班我認為它是對海南航班是對嗎是我們也會海南航班不會停止我們的航班航班因為我們有好產品和我們未來的資料總預料,一旦被淘汰掉了,我們不能增加錢市場,我們認為中國豐富的救命活動和能力跟進行的結構,我們認為中國豐富的救命活動和能力跟進行的結構,我們認為當中的中國豐富的救命活動,所以,我們需要一起建立足夠的中國公司,加入中國公司。這項目的是中國公司和我們的貢獻。我們一起做這項目的。所以, Mr. Khrush,你認為中國公司總共有500公司,200公司,還是150公司?你認為這項目是可能的?是的,我認為這項目是一個大國家,一個大經濟。我認為我們會看到大變化,在接下來20年,所有公司的公司,我認為我們不會認識半個公司,他們現在在這裏,這是一個很大的機會。來,我們看吵架架。吵架。這邊這位,第一排。下一個問題。我正在討論,在新的媒體網站上,我的問題跟Mr. Xiao說,從中央學院上學,很多美國的學生,在中國公司中央學院建立了。我跟那些人談,他們說,中國有什麼問題,中國的國際教育,那是為什麼他們來到中國。我以前是一個教育員,我認為,中國的教育,是不夠,是為了中國的學生,特別是他們想建立自己的公司。所以,這是你認為的問題。幾年前,我們有談過中國的媒體,中國公司中央學院的三代學生,第一代學生,香港的國際教育,這是一個特別的例子,第一代學生,他們邀請了中國的學生,我們是一代學生,我們不僅僅是學生,我們也會建立自己的學生,只能在中國公司中央學院,在國際學院的層次。所以,我們不僅是,我們也要建立中國的學生,我們會更加多的貢獻,我們在世界中央學院,我們也要建立中國的學生,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,我們要更多的貢獻,你自己的学校,会有合作伙伴的学校。我们学生需要他们的教练。我的学校有教练技术、研究生、学校的教练教授、学校的教授、教授和技术。可以把学校的学校都拿出来。我是国际教授,世贫教授。我的问题是,人生社会被提出的问题,而国际的地方的问题,为什么我们没有更多的交易和互联,學生們去學生、學生們去學生、學生們去學生甚至在小時候的學校我們給了機會為國際社會跟中國一起行動而不是在看中國只能從媒體的眼睛看這不一定是對的如果我們能有一些一些需要的業務不僅是一家公司或另一家公司為何不來與一些新的項目聯繫在一起與一家中國公司與一家西方公司在這裏的結構是一項合作和聯繫在兩項項目的西方和西方公司謝謝請問哪位主持人在這裏嗎我會問一位朋友從新西方公司來訪好 劉劉協我覺得你謝謝我想這是一個正確的問題我和我的公司我們已經有四位同學我們有三位同學可以給我們一位學生和一位同學我們也有四位同學是一位醫學同學我們有四位同學在這四位同學我們有給我們三位同學我們會嘗試創造一個國際環境我們有四位同學讓我們學生可以在他們的學習中花時間我們四位同學我們也有三位同學我們也有國際學生我覺得這是一個很好的機會跟外國的學生一起學習他們可以學習如何一起學習他們可以學習外國的學習我們在同學的學生是在職業中跟我們同學的學生你的問題是在職業模式的方式並不是只是學生和教育我們會嘗試創造一種傳統模式我們會有新的模式我覺得是我們中國的學生在學習新的模式與我們學習的模式我們會學習的模式謝謝謝謝你的問題到這裡即將結束了我們看到台上的嘉賓為我們提供的那種從容 淡定和理性我們需要時間不著急是在不著急慢慢來的時候我們需要時間我們需要更加改變我們自己我們花了56分鐘我們有很多學習從我們五個學者身上我們需要我們可以學習從新的模式和航空線陳先生他的生意當他只有16歲我們會等待海南航空公司的IPO從新的模式他在職業模式24年我們是國際公司我們必須知道我們自己的經驗然後我們必須知道你們不是誰從FinnixTV提及過有時候你需要等待你不必動手你必須知道你們不是誰在第三個步驟你必須忘記你們是誰所以陳先生從航空階級公司提及過你必須忘記你們是中國公司你們是國際公司你必須看著地面從航空階級公司所以你必須忘記現在我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待我們需要等待所以請參與給我一張牌給我一張牌給我一張牌一張牌


Hey Bolo buddies, thanks for watching. All right, you guys. I've got 22 bread and butter bolo's coming your way items that I bought for a decent price and sold for a decent price, no Items that I bought low and sold for a decent price $35 or less is what I'm gonna share with you in this video. I call those my bread and butter bolo's Typically easier to find items so I pick items up at a state sales garage sales thrift stores Facebook marketplace That's where I like to source We're gonna get started got 22 of them here for you Let me know if you have any questions in the comments. My name is Courtney if you're new to the channel Thanks for being here in this video. I'm gonna tell you where I got the item what it paid for it and what it sold for So hopefully when you're outsourcing you can find these items. All right, let's start with the first item here The first item I sold is this Fisher price little people little kingdom castle king princess horse and carriage And I got this at a thrift store for one dollar and I sold it for a best offer of twenty dollars The buyer was all in for thirty dollars and sixty five cents. So Fisher price little people you guys I always pick them up. I actually have a tote that is so full I've got all of these play sets. I picked them up like Last summer or maybe the summer before and I have a problem with just like sitting things To the side and never getting to them. So anytime I get Fisher price little people I just throw them in that tote, but these never made it to the tote I got these at a different occasion and I just listed them So I know they sell I've sold them quite often actually If you can find some of the like the Thanksgiving or the Nativity some of the Christmas ones they can be big money Bolo's so definitely Don't overlook them. The next item is this toothless toy figure. It lights up its wings open I got this at a garage sale. It looks like for one dollar I sold it for eleven dollars and twenty five cents. The buyer was all in for 1931 I really enjoy selling toys. That's not all I sell but We're gonna go through some stuff here This is an octanauts underwater diving helmet. This is a replacement part. It goes on a toy figure It's just like a Diving helmet for a toy. I sold this for seven dollars. The buyer was all in for twelve dollars and two cents Got it at a garage sale probably had like twenty five cents in it But I'm gonna take you over and show you something real quick This is my reseller testing Bolo products and sometimes when I part things out I will make videos over here. So if you want to know more about parting out octanauts You can come check out this video right here. It says I parted it out and it's octanauts that little piece in my hand Is a replacement part for a play set I sold that for thirty dollars plus shipping the buyer was all in for almost forty dollars So in that video, I show you a bunch of octanauts items that I parted out and How I listed everything so definitely go and check that out again. That's on my reseller testing Bolo products I'm also doing live working hangouts where I list things and help people learn how to list or if people just want to list at The same time and hang out in the chat. It's just a great way to kind of network So definitely subscribe and links are down below in the description Okay, so that's the octanauts definitely a great item to pick up these I got these at a Thrift store for one dollar and they sold for twenty two fifty the buyer was all in for thirty one seventy two These are measuring tape suspenders you guys I saw these and I'm like yes, I'll take those for a dollar. Those are so cool Yeah, aren't they cool I mean they're pretty cool, right? Would you would you sport these? I like them. All right. I had a feeling they would sell pretty quick and they did So this is a lot of four bunk beds in one chair. These are from the calico critters This is another thing that I will buy the doll houses and I will part them out because a lot of times they come Incomplete they're missing a door. They're missing a window. So what I do is I take the doors off I take the railings off. I take the windows out and I part them out This sold for ten dollars and the buyer was all in for seventeen fifteen and I got those at a thrift store for about a quarter I think this actually came with a doll house that I got that I ended up parting out The next item that sold is this vintage 1984 Disney Mickey Mouse roly-poly chime mirror toy This came from a thrift store for two dollars. I sold it for It says I sold it for seventeen I wonder if I had this on auction and somebody offered me seventeen or if it's just I messed up So it either sold for fifteen or seventeen the buyer was all in for twenty seven twelve The next item is this Paul patrol bullet. Okay, so how do I know that this is a Paul patrol bullet? Well, I would not normally know But I got the actual toy that it went with and the toy was broken. So I knew that this bullet went with that toy So I sold this bullet and This bullet same thing the toys just were not in good condition. They they don't come They don't seal right so I just decided not to list them and I'm like, you know what? I want to try to make some of my money back So I'm gonna list the bullets and the same person bought both of these they were in all in for twelve ninety six for two bullets With tax and shipping $17.82 you guys for these two bullets so it really pays to know replacement parts and toys Again, I would have had no idea. I don't even know if I would remember if I saw these again that they were Paul patrol but That's what they look like The next item is this Jamestown pennant flag I picked this up at a garage sale sold it for ten bucks 1910 the buyer was all in Would I buy it again? Hmm Pennant flags are tough. I don't like to ship them so what I do is I take cardboard and I Like I cut up a box and I take two pieces of cardboard and I flatten it in between and I ship it first class It just takes a little while it's kind of inconvenient to ship So for ten dollars, I'm kind of like and now if it's a higher dollar when it's probably worth doing it I don't know you guys will have to decide but that's how I ship them I don't roll them because I'm afraid I'll mess them up The next item is this Mary Engelbreit which Bats dessert plate. It's an eight inch plate. I actually got two of these I got them at the Goodwill. They were a dollar each Mary Engelbreit usually does pretty well for me I sold both of them this one I took a best offer of $15 and I think the other one sold for a full asking price of 18 and the buyer paid shipping on those so The next item that sold are these vintage hair clips if you guys missed my video.  I sold some hair clips for big money That video I believe is on this channel if you want to check it out You can see some of the other solds, but there's a certain Brett and It's a longer one and it looks a certain way go watch that video. I want to say I sold it for 70 or 80 bucks And there was like three or four of them I can't remember all the details But definitely that video is worth watching because most people don't know that vintage hair things are a thing And they definitely are a thing. I got about 50 cents in this Sold for 16 oh sit 1656 the buyer was all in for 2426 The next item that I sold are these carefree panty shields. All right you guys so This is a very very old Old listing I got this at an estate sale. I do remember that I probably paid like a quarter for it or something crazy vintage tampons and Panty liners and pads some of them go for big money. I don't know if they use them for movie props I'm not sure but I just grabbed these because I had recently learned about it at the time So I'm like these look vintage and it said free samples. So I just grabbed it But anyway, I think this actually went internationally Yeah an international sale sold for 719 plus shipping the buyer was all in for 1374 it went through the global shipping program The next item is this pack mates ladybug plush handbag I got this out of a mystery box and it sold for $12 and 99 96 cents plus shipping. So it's like a little purse Not something I would have sourced but it was in the mystery box. So I went ahead and listed it Creative memories custom cutting system. So these are blades you guys.  I don't know exactly I don't scrapbook, but it came with some other stuff and I got a really good deal on it I probably have a dollar or less in this I sold it for 2160 the buyer was all in for 2670 this did not appear to have ever been used. It was still in the original box so That one sold for yeah a little bit more 2160 This came out of a mystery box that I picked up from Donna Telebot Alino on her YouTube channel and I believe this was in one of my earlier boxes and I got two of them and I was like It was just like a little baggie of jewelry that was thrown in And I was like, okay, it's a mood ring. It says main Somebody will probably want it. So I just listed it and I had two of them and they both sold So mood rings they do sell I sold this for seven dollars and twenty cents and the buyer paid shipping The next item is more of the Kinex track. I think that was in the other video I just did before this I picked up a screaming serpent roller coaster at the Goodwill It was a box full of Kinex parts. I recognized the roller coaster. I have parted one of these out before I Forgot how time-consuming it is to part it out will I make money? Yes, I'll probably make Probably at least a hundred dollars maybe more so it's probably worth the time it took me to part it out But it does take some time this is the purple track tubing and I probably have a dollar less than this. I sold it for 18 dollars. The buyer was all in for 30 155 The next is this 1995 cats meow Cathedral series There's three of them here. I sold this for a best offer of 26. The buyer was all in for 38 54 So how you can recognize cats meow is there's a cat on every single one. So if you look right here, you can see the cat There's the cat right there And it will say cats meow Right here in the corner somewhere. It'll say it on there somewhere now These really range from bread and butter Some of them. I think I sold a Christmas scenery like It was like a store department store or something and it had like snow I think I sold that for for 25 A lot of times I will lot them in sets of three to five Sometimes I will do big lots um I would not pay a lot for these unless you look it up and it shows good comps Um, I probably got these I got three big boxes full. Um, I can't remember what I paid for it It's in another video But I'm guessing I have a quarter each in these if that So, um, I do I do pick them up if they're cheap. Um, I actually have a whole nother Lot that I picked up at a garage sale and I just can't get motivated to list them So they're in my money pile. All right. This is a uh, Nickelodeon shimmer and shine magical flying Zara corn unicorn. I got this at a thrift store for two bucks sold it for best offer of 12 and the buyer was all in for 2307 I do have a video showing how this item works and um That is over on my reseller testing volo products. So I do a lot of testing of products over there and then I put them in my Description of my ebay listing to show the buyer what they're getting The next item is this vintage halloween blowed ink pen you guys when I got these I was like, oh, this is gonna be a Bolo, I thought I was so excited. I got three of them And it actually took forever to sell. I don't know why I don't know if like my key words were not good but It was a bread and butter I sold it for 16 19 the buyer was all in for 22 14. So the next item I think this came out of Uh, was it thrift five and 15? Maybe I think um, I put together a A collab video with a bunch of other uh youtubers and I think it was called hashtag thrift five and 15 And I got this at the goodwill for a buck And it finally sold it did take a little while but it's I don't even it's just a generic brand So but it is those flip sequins. So I thought it was kind of kind of cool Let me see here. Yeah, see no brand Uh sold this for 2016 buyer was all in for 39 56 The next item is this vintage signed mexico sterling silver abalone butterfly pen It is marked, uh, right there sterling 925 made in mexico super cool Sold this for a best offer of 19 the buyer was all in for 25 78 and I got that at a garage sale for a buck The next item is this transformers again rest heroes. I pick these up whenever I find them. They're a great bread and butter item Uh, I got this at a thrift store for a quarter and I sold it for 15 84 And the buyer paid shipping. So they were all in for 23 18 All right, you guys if you're new to the channel, I also have another channel. It is called sourcing with bolo buddies Um, I think I mentioned a few things that I got in mystery boxes in this video Um, so I do unbox those mystery boxes over on this channel I get a lot of them from thrift stores and they're just a lot of fun to kind of see what I get I do have other videos over here as well. So definitely check out this channel if you have not already. I greatly appreciate it And is worth point worth it that's over on this channel If you guys are thinking about doing worth point in this video, I tell you why I think worth point is worth it so you can check out that video And again, my reseller testing bolo products come check that out and working hangouts if you guys are ever need motivation to list You can come hang out with me while I list All right, you guys, thank you for being here. Thank you for watching. Be sure to like comment subscribe and share and Leave me an emoji of A hat down in the comments. All right, you guys. Thanks for watching You