Hopefully this doesn't affect the project, but it's going to be good. I'll be back to share. Appreciate everybody showing up and participating. A little bit more of a workout than I thought it was going to be, but hopefully it'll be. Hopefully it'll be straightforward and pretty precise meeting today for kicking off the. You look at impacts of development. Uh, stakeholder repeating the system, this whole process is to. Take a look at the city's development standards that are related to. Uh, land use kind of with infill development, but also. Also in a also in a. So, let's, what spurred this is number of complaints. And here's the people that were downstream downhill from a new development that met right here. We're filled planning, uh, having impacts to their property owner. Their house or whatever property you want to call it. And the difficulty we were having was going back to those folks and explaining against this development. It means all our, it has done everything needs to do to prevent. Uh, letting in damage for our regulations, however, we're still being some sort of an impact in the situation. So, part of what that was was, how do we determine where those impacts are coming from? And part of it is related to the way that we estimate impervious cover on property when we're anticipating development. We assume a certain amount of a certain amount of. Impervious cover is going to be part of that development, particularly in infill situations, we're seeing. More impervious cover than we anticipated. We're also seeing it in a not necessarily an infill situation, but in older neighborhoods where people come in and they remodel. They do things, you know, different than the people that were there for them. They'll have pools. I had some sort of hard escaping something like that that over time. Accumulates to a higher amount of a breeze cover that results in the program and so we, we set out to quantify that aspect of the development as well as looking at how streams are developed and filled in overtime. Well, the old school. It was, it was new school when I was getting out of school, but the way we would develop land in the old days was. The wind, find this nice patch, we were the little creek running through it. We would make the creek a lot more regular and predictable by making it the development pattern. And we wanted. Squeeze the creek again so that in between the loss and then make sure that this channel was efficient enough to pass that water through without flooding. So that that was the way and we left it grass line channels back in the day before that it was concrete channel. So we've been evolving over time, but we still got. If you're 75 years of this kind of channel work in the city of Bore and all of those blood lanes have been approached to the point that they're squeezed in as far as they can go and they're receiving more water now from these more previous cover developments that we had anticipated. So, flooding is happening in those areas as well. And so, how do we address flooding in the stream situations as well as the previous cover situations? We've got kind of this two handed thing and they're related. Because everything that runs off of the neighborhoods runs through the strong trains that want to freeze. So, we can't deal with one without the other and we want to make sure that we're setting ourselves up for success on all of our future capital projects and design criteria so that we don't design new strong brains that are. Essentially, instantly undersized or will be predictably undersized rather than ultimate development conditions that we try to anticipate. So that's the goal is what's ultimate and how do we. Size our fell properly to deal with that now in the future and try to get our handle on how new development is going to happen so that we can prevent new damages from occurring in areas that are being redeveloped or infill, develop, or even it's okay. So, that's the sort of intro, I think we've got a really interesting stakeholder group. We've reached out to all the council members to get some input on who they would like to participate, not everybody replied, but we did get some folks who responded burning here is one of the ones from the play lock. Council member play lock district in her little bit. Well, I've always had some bulk of the job in was it. And then, you know, Bivens had a request for Mary Kelleher to participate. She's not able to make it today. Everybody probably knows Mary. She's very involved in drainage things in the city. So. She's, she's been good to the things interested. And there she's got some particular concern. I know at her area part of town, it was all saw greenfield development that has to deal with this interim development conditions. That's going to be probably an option or what this we're not going to deal with interim engineering situation where the design is constructed. But not all the homes and not all the grass, not everything is installed yet. That's that sort of an add on to this that we make to look at later, but that's not part of this effort. We want to make sure that we're looking at this. The standards that we have now how they apply to any kind of future development. We want to roll out and install and how in bill development areas like liquid and the other case study that we have. Yeah, central, how those areas use that information to prevent the actors. And so, then Tomlin and I, then it was kind of the heavy look around this. He managed a couple of case studies that we looked at two areas, the Lingwood area, which is kind of south of 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, but in that 7, 3. Area between 7th and white settlement, lots of redevelopment going on there just to the east of the guys there want to sell area, but you got redevelopment going on. As well, and then the central part of the price area, which has been kind of our poster child for the storm, our utility overall, there's been so many, you know, development and flooding related issues out there that are not, they're not just related to development. They're related to undersized for a system that were installed back in 1920s, but the solutions to those are going to have to include sizing our system, right? We look at those 2 areas in detail. We had 2 consultants look at them separately. Well, we have 1, 1 consultant do the previous cover. Another consultant do the channel type. The central item heights and the Linwood area we're looked at by chapter attack. They took our existing strong grain models, converted those from 1, 2, 1, 2, D format to another 2D model format. So we've got a really detailed strong grain models of those particular areas. And then they analyze the previous cover changes in those areas. We will go through the kind of the presentation that we may have been and I made to the MITC. Or they have to be ITC, mobility, mobility, but that's so. So, we presented to them late last year as we were getting ready to roll this out. We've had a number of presentations on this particular topic and want to make sure that everybody's kind of up to speed with that. So, we'll roll through that pretty quickly. It was a pretty tight presentation and then we'll start looking at some of the focus areas. I guess, as we get into this, I'll see if it's in cancer on the agenda today. And some housekeeping items will handle introductions. Take a look at our next meeting schedules. And if there's any other items, I'll track those so that we can make sure that we're reflecting on them on in future meetings. We'll go through the presentation looking for that increased impervious cover. And then secondly, the loss of value storage scenarios. And then for today's effort, I would like to focus on the review of the loss of value storage offerings. Realistically, that's probably the simplest of the two scenarios to really look at from an engineering and management perspective. And then we'll talk about some next steps on the next of these and realistically, I'm kind of visualizing maybe maybe four or more of these. If we do it monthly, that gets us towards the end of the fiscal year, which is kind of what we try to shoot for having all of our big thing kind of wrapped up by the end of the fiscal year. But it gives us also an opportunity to have some feedback with council and with the different city plan commission and zoning commission, those kind of. Entities to say this is what we're looking at get some feedback on those folks too. And ideally, we'll end up with something that we can recommend as updates to our. Design standards and then land use assumptions, we've got a bunch of city staff that. Are probably, I was hoping they'd be able to call in another we're working really closely with the folks on the subdivision ordinance side where some of these regulations reside and then also land use on the zoning requirements. So, some of the gets the nutshell, everything comes into zoning is what we pull out and pull into our engineering analysis. So, we're there some loop, we've got a loop, we've got to close there as well, but we'll we can run through this and we just keep our felt on track. Hopefully, we'll be done before 330. We've got the room for the post guard if we need it, we can burn up a little bit of time to try to get rolling here, but hopefully we can stay on track and have a fairly tidy meeting. Any questions at this point? Maybe just sing a few folks because city council meeting was going on right now. Let's listening to it and I'll otherwise a little bit. Not appreciate that because that's that's a good aspect on Tuesdays and we were looking at Tuesdays and Fridays and we just had more people that were able to make it on Tuesdays and Friday. So. But you didn't continue to be a then we might need to think about that. Yeah, or at least avoid where it's either a morning session or afternoon work session. That's good. On the on the introduction side, I've got a list of everybody that has signed up. It's great. We've got some great external stakeholders. I would say I've been able to meet and work with everybody on that list. Except burning till now we've got some great folks that have been involved in drainage issues across the city. So they've been really helpful. Misty Christian is 1 of our consultant review engineers and she's got a lot of experience dealing with the drainage criteria as it's applied and being reviewed. So we want to make sure that we get some feedback from her on how does that affect reviews and those kinds of things and a career here is has been a successful engineer for several years. I don't want to say too many years. I've known for a long time. She's she's been involved in small and big projects. That's a really great perspective on how to apply those same criteria in those situations. And then, Don is really kind of I'm hoping to be kind of the voice of the home builders association and bring that perspective to this discussion. So I think it's going to be critical. It's probably not going to it may not affect the way home builders deal with developing a site because all that work likely done before the home gets in. But it's still going to be something for y'all to be aware of and get the feedback also really looking forward to some some feedback and some back and forth on that topic. I know you're looking forward to that well. And then the Rissa is kind of representing our larger land development type engineers. LGA doesn't really make some divisions in Fort Worth really active on the East side, West side, Fort Worth now, East side pretty well gone. But a lot of the work that she's been doing out there would play right into this kind of thing. And so we want to make sure that we're getting a good perspective there for Travis with Dak. Sees all those all as a good set of fields on what else is going on in the development world. So hopefully you'll communicate that back to that group, but then we'll be presenting back to them as well. On the city side, Eric is here with planning development. No, it's not going to be an analytics. And so, I think this we've had a lot of interaction with PDA on. Standards that are related to blood playing and blood zones that are part of the future land use work we've been doing recently. And then everything that would tie in back to. Like the comprehensive plan would be important here, I think, too. So, I want to make sure that we're keeping y'all involved. And then Daniel from develop the services not be able to make the meeting here today. Obviously, he's tonight in the zone inside of things. He's the boots on the ground for how the zoning gets changed and implemented. So, we want to make sure that we're keeping those folks involved in that discussion as well. Other on the city side, we've got Ben Thompson. We've introduced you to you. You want to box star engineers who handle all kinds of things when they come up some of them are ugly and some of them are not so ugly. He's excellent with that. My friendship is our also rock star for 2D model expert and then land use and hydrology hydro all things magical and modeling kind of go through his side of our group. He helps us out on the other consultants side to understand the models that we get a little too sophisticated for us to review. And so that's been super helpful. Stephen Murray with development services to her candle. I think they're both upstairs, but they'll only be able to participate in the people. We get a schedule right. They're all on development services and Royce Hansen is with our legal department and we ask them to participate in this so that we, if we start going down the road that is related to something that may be tied up with state law that I don't know. I don't want to recommend things that are going to go counter to state law. So he's been helping us out on the group side of that is to make sure that we're being real about the type of things that we want to recommend. So he's not like a attorney here to note on it. He does, but he's making us much more in rule of providing recommendations that are going to actually stick and work for us long term, not something that will be reeled because something is going to be illegal or something like that. So. It's just me, right next to Claire, Royce, I did not recognize you. You said, where are you? Where are you? I totally thought you were someone else. I we've been talking a lot online. So. Help yourself, we can sit over there. Do I say anything incorrect? You're going to keep us for now, that's great. We got our introductions out of a way on the. When it comes to scheduling next meetings, I sent out a little old to try to find time to definitely work well. It seemed to work okay for me and I've used them in the past, but in time. I don't know. I never know if it is a pain in the butt or if it's not worth doing it, but that continues to be okay. I'll keep sending him out that way. It sounds like Tuesdays are not better than Friday's. At least when it comes to council time, so all which to pay. Yeah. And so I'll have to pay attention to that. And that was, that was not on my radar this time. I was looking to get it scheduled as soon as possible and didn't. Cover that. I should, I should be fine. Yeah, yeah, there won't be council members because. And the sea, so, and real quick on the, I guess, big picture is a monthly. Return schedule, okay, that's definitely okay for me because I, there, there are enough things going on. It's hard to really stay focused and get a good turnaround on stuff. I feel like everybody's probably in the same boat, but if monthly is okay, then we'll stick with that. And then the next meeting days, we'll just take those with a grain of salt. What I'll do is I'll, I'll do a closer die on these to see which ones are going to be, you know, morning or council if it's going to be a Tuesday and then I'll send those back out to the group. Just looking for a big conflicts generally, I know I've got some conflicts that are coming up. They're not going to follow these days, but I've got a conference and put me down for a week. Kids are graduating and things like that are happening. So, I'm trying to avoid that on my schedule. Hopefully that's all in line with all schedules if you have those concerns. So, if there's something that's jumping out, can't make it, let me know. I'll try to work if it all possible. I'll just say that May and the July time frames, we have that on Thursdays. Oh, or that means on Thursday, the technical groups for my unit. Okay. Yeah, we've got that. So that schedule in this room is also another hurdle because there's a lot of that happened in this room. These, this timeframe happens to work on Tuesdays and Fridays to go all, all the people as well. And hopefully we finish by August if we need to pass the other stuff out. We can extend it, or we can create some sort of a focus group on either. I would need to I mentioned the conditions. I see that as something that we'll have to focus on, but that's again, not this group. It's a separate thing to do some special attention. So, we'll put some special attention on it and then on the staff coordination side, we'll be working with city council by providing informal reports, reports after the planning commission and then our zoning board that might see those are separate groups with separate meetings. And we'll probably have a 20 minute update on what we're doing with this as we go, just to make sure that those groups are informed so that when the recommendations come in, everybody understand. Where we're at, I'll say that in general, it seemed like we got a lot of support for this. I think everybody's for a lot of planes. We got a lot of interest. So, I think everybody's interested to have some sort of a solution to this type of problem. So, this is the presentation that we did at my PC, Ben and I back in September. The nutshell very wide, we've got a missing grant here that we need to update. I'll walk through this as we kind of handle all it's already other than the same, I did. Identify that these are we're not the only city dealing with these concerns and we identified them as a priority action item for us. 2016 plan and then a level 1 priority in our 2018 strategic storm water program master plan. And then the goal against to evaluate our value or existing standards and make sure that they're appropriate. And then the focus analysis is really how much greater is the runoff and how to create a problem. So that was kind of the core mission, the sense of our contractors. We didn't want to assume that there was a problem we wanted to figure out if there was and if there is how many of a problem is it because. Let's not solve a problem. It's just a miniscule thing. So, they were able to come back and quantify that for us with these 2 reports. And I'm going to solve the whole through here, but then we'll be able to. Provide some color detail on these comments will get there. Again, the purpose, this is we're looking at the cumulative impacts of previous covered here. God is couple of our sample areas on the left is Linwood. You can see the town is being constructed on the right and then the little tiny. The whole box houses that he used it out there and would neighborhood forever prior to that. And so there's obviously a lot more in previous part of this going in, but from a zoning perspective, it all behaved the same. And so, and so the goal again is to really. Analyze the result in cumulative impacts development. All stormwater expected land use and valley sword changes. The infill side is typical of what's going on in Linwood on the right hand picture. You've got a nice straight screen channel that. Close right to subdivisions. This is up in the white branch area. It's not 1 of the streams that I developed when I was consulting world back in the day, but it's real near there. There isn't those, but it's it's 1 of those situations where the floodplain used to be quite wide and now it is a very narrow. My straight channel is very efficient and flows water off really quickly, but that quickly aspect is really where the problem starts to come in. I'm not sure the camera here, but so. Center attack again, they did our infill development focus with the previous cover being the main aspect of that. The 2 study locations are in Linwood, which is kind of the purple drainage area. And then the center calling pipe, which is green to the south. Both of these have been studied in detail about the city, which is a big driver on why we want to study these areas. We had investing. Now, see already so we weren't reinventing the wheel to get more detail out of those. We looked at our criteria manual and then. Here, what we anticipated being full build out to what was actually out there. So we ended up with 3 kind of 3 situations. The existing conditions today. What could be bill and then what we anticipate being the full max build out here. We looked at the hydrology hydraulics of both of those and then use multiple rainfall events to kind of model the pipe network capacity and also the overflows going down the streets because that's what. Kind of a key to the 2 areas is that the pipes bill out quickly and you have a lot of water that runs down the streets and so we've got this kind of. Urban drainage, urban river situation that's running right down the street, the streets are supposed to carry water. They may not be supposed to carry that much water and so that's really what we wanted to look at. See what's going on here. In Arlington Heights, we have land use the existing versus full build out on the left. The green doesn't necessarily mean grass. It just means the percentage of. Pervious cover there and you can see that on the left, there's quite a bit of non impervious area. That's still available in that neighborhood. If we look at how full build up occur almost all of that is gone. And so this is this is what could be constructed for our criteria today. And given the trends of how things are developing these areas, we should probably expect something along those lines because the the law lines, the laws that they're small and people trying to maximize their work, but it's a little space out there. Just full bill out, I mean, all land is used. It's used to the maximum extent extent that can be constructed for our regulation. And so, yeah, if you go from 1000s per foot from below to 4,000 per foot by mansion, that's allowable. And then you can also pay all of your backyard without any restriction on that and then 50% of your primary. So that's kind of what we looked at for maximum. And it's only right. It doesn't. Building area, building areas, I think set for a lot and then we'll put it on. Yeah. So, that's what those were reflected is if you. Maximize what can happen on that little hay by water, whatever they were, but that's that's what you would end up with. And those the barcode, they're kind of the percent of impervious that were located about there. It's not like. Red is necessary, a hundred percent per view, red is that number is I can't keep that right? I guess my question would be. Initial building, you know, about that, but a lot of, you did 25, but it's where it would have been built now. I put it in driveways inside. So, they should 25, max. What happened to deal with those full and the nations that drove all those those separate that your office to get the view. It's in the backyard is not reviewed at all, but it's in the front yard. Only the board of adjustments both looks at it. Look at it. Once it exceeds 50%. So, yeah, there's, there's no look at that stuff, but we know it's happening. You can see it in here. That's that's part of what we need to look at. And this also is are we going to look at every single patio that come in? So, how do we deal with that? I kind of receive some sort of automated way, or we just start standards to reflect the reality more than looking at every single piece of flatwork that comes in because we don't review driveways now. We don't look at it. So, here's the situation with Linwood Linwood is currently got a bit of relatively. Open residential on the West side, but the potential is there for it to also get fairly dense. And then the monosality, you can see kind of things sushi area right there in the middle of that kind of grounds here over some of the stuff that's going on up there. Particularly around Linwood arc upon the right hand side, I don't think you have my mouse works. So, there's Linwood Park right there. There's a lot of drainage and infrastructure problems in this particular area. A lot of this runs down this way, and then there's the only ways out or through the stone brains that ran out through the levy here and then up to the north. So, this is a a constricted system to start and then with the additional development that's coming in, it's been complicating for quite a while.  Was it August August last year? We had a 3 or 4 feet of water and temples activity that people have just moved in there will stay Asian with more of the guys that bought a house and. You know, is that 50 got in the driveway had water for the dash and he had. A couple inches of water grab a full bottle for the house the day after you got the furniture and so. He's been like number 4, but this is 1 of those 1 of those issues that we we know about and we're trying to deal with trying to not make things. Get work to monitoring our needs of. Improve remember those things. So, I was trying to get on on the team. Another 1 push 2, we were all on the right. She was like, oh, I sent a new invitation. Really? Yeah, she said there were 3 people on she said 2 of them up and she's like really trying to get in. You don't have to go to the meeting invitation and switch it out and pull out and see. So, I, so I, yeah, I'm sure. Yeah, I put the long counter. You're my, it's not 1, 4, 3. Alright, yeah. It's a place. Yeah, I didn't really teams doesn't work in this room. Or does the coordinate with the teams. I've replaced it with a WebEx. I started with teams right now. So, she was an edge. You're about to go to the other team. Yeah, right there. There you go to your out of calendars. In the middle 10, thank you. If you go to that 1 years. That 1 right there, but we're back to. There's the WebEx and the ball, I think we did the team and put it in the way. Yeah, and send them. I feel like there's a team staying on like all of our. So, your mind, what I'm going to leave it. Okay, so thank you for that. Yeah. Yeah, no worries. I'm going to see she's going on now. Yes, the email. But the email has to buy this. I'm here. Jennifer, did you put that table that we're showing? Yeah, thanks. Is the red, are there, are you there? I am. Do you hear an echo on your end, Stacy? I do not worry about what I missed. I could catch up later. I guess. So, I'll just mute myself and. Okay, so again, this is back in Linwood. Again, the same type of situation where we're anticipating. A maximum potential level of development that could occur. And that's what's reflected in the full build out on the right. So, it's going from a less dense to a more dense situation. And we've seen a lot of that around the Templeton area, where the small homes are getting replaced by townhomes. With much more, the purpose of cover on each of those types of situations. And yet the map for existing doesn't show all that much density exactly that location, right? Well, yeah, not, I mean, it's less dense there now. And we're expecting it to get more dense, but it's definitely changed over time. And listen to the trend kind of in that Linwood area is to. You know, townhomes and apartments. That's that's zoning now on the left. Bar the machine, right? They didn't do a new takeoff on this is this is a percentage that they used our. And he's covered for existing conditions. And then spot check, so this is as close to existing once out there today, as you can get. And then they did a second scenario that they did take the criteria manual as likes, like. Larissa you would do they have for subdivision and you would assume a certain percent in purgulous based on that zone. And so, so what they found, they covered us, what they found is that. Even in these two criteria manual. Shows less percent. So like the resulting. People lows and things were lower. We're assuming they come. They come out of that. So we're under. Destinating your not to make sure that what we're thinking when you're home plan. And they're comprehensive plan goals, which is to have more intensity, right? Yes, in central city. That totally makes sense. And that's, I think we want to make a little front of me support of that. I feel it's all great. Well, you're going to get creative and that's maybe that's what we're doing right here and get created. So, there's, there's obviously some a lot of interest in being closer to the center part of town. We're anticipating this kind of development to continue. And then we want to like travel saying we want to be able to support that, but also make sure that we're not. Creating these use for people that are already there, businesses that are already in place and have some sort of recovery. So that's the. The overarching goal is to let's understand what our systems are and see how our standard are addressing those. Those divisions already and 1 of the things we saw in the types, there's a variety of types that have already exceeded the level of impervious cover that we anticipated for. The zoning criteria, so that's. That's kind of like a call right there. Um, zooming in on on Linwood again, this is a kind of 1 of our flood maps. This is basically an inundation deaths for a 5 year storm under existing conditions. Right here in this area again is is the Linwood Park. Templeton drive is is multiple feet deep in this 5 year storm. That turns out to be what we experienced back in August. Uh, was it was 2, 5 years storms that were separated by some, you know, not a large period of time, but enough that the ground was saturated. We have 1st, I'm right up with the other. And not all the water from the 1st at left for the 2nd storm came in. And that's really what I've created. Mostly like a 50 year type. Uh, frequency for the total event, it ended up being around that level, but 2, 5 years from together really caused a lot of damage down there. And so that's, that's kind of what this show on this map. We've got this. You know, very either, you know, 2, 1, 2, 3, sometimes by and that's what we're seeing some of these areas and we've known about some of these hotspots. They're, they're work on to resolve some of these, but it's going to be a while before we get solutions in place to really manage even these. Frequent storms like this, and then you're going to have to explain this one, but I have not focused on this one. I know that you've been somewhere to really come. Yeah. Really, the big thing to know, we've got 1 year storm, which is happening very frequently. 5 years. Pretty big, but not in 100 years, a massive storm. Really, the only takeaway here is that. All of this infill development affects the more frequent storms more than it does the big. So scenario 1, which is today versus scenario 3, which. The option is parents and you wanted a worst case scenario. We didn't want to have our consultant do a bunch of play. What do you think really would happen? Because who knows what's really going to happen. They did look at trends and had to make some assumptions based on base zoning PD zoning out there. So. So they did look at a worst case and based on that, so I mean, what Claire, you know, full impervious a lot of my zone. And 1 thing they came across was. There's a lot of zoning types that are not in our design criteria. So they had to talk with us, what do we think, make some decisions there? And so that was 1 thing that. We'll have to incorporate into our, our next design material, but yeah, the big takeaway is the acres of inundation. See today, 22 scenario 3 makes a lot bigger for that for that small, frequent storm. A lot of that's in the streets and on, you know, on property, that's not touching any strikers. So that's something to consider, but a lot more fled from properties. So from 522 to 623 is it going to go up to 623 likely now somewhere in the middle though. And so. The big thing is the question, you know, the residents on people finances, why don't you just fix the, fix the problem. And unfortunately, that problem is in that 1 particular problem and what's. We can get about 15 million a year with our storm, our utility. Which doesn't all go to this type of stuff. So would last. That's 1 of the reasons we're weakness. What do we do with time yet? We can't fix everything. And this is just 1. What do you do? You treat certain area very differently. There are some kind of big ideas and that's what we're hoping. I think a number of councils don't want to know when we show this to them is the 623 potential properties. How many of them to make sure. Yeah, 1st, I think we have that. I try not to improve the giant. I think we do have that structures. I think it's actually a structuring data structures. But that's a good. Um, in terms of because the property is flooding, but it's not touching the footprint. That's a different kind of issue than if. You know, your 1st floor is different. Sure. Absolutely. Yes. So, so yeah, they use our most recent building footprint layer at a time, which was. I don't think we have all those something. Um, and the models as soon as the water wouldn't go through them. So the weights, but I don't think I think it would have taken a lot of effort to every building. We didn't have something to get them. So. Are you just saying where it's flooded out here? Yeah, I hear the biggest problem is actual structure. Side yards that much less serious problem. So, if there's a difference and we've got lots and lots of properties that have flooding on them. But structures are not flooding at all that we should know that before we start crafting, you know, big ideas that may not be necessary. Obviously, is an issue and that's clear that has to has to be that. That was 1 thing too with the modeling that Ben was saying is we don't have that structure necessarily. So we have that. And I'm going to squirt the cereal box that was there versus today, the whole footprint is all building and then it's trying to go in the back or something. And to make that leave, we were trying to use near map. I mean, so it seems like it's an area that's updated about every 3 months or so as close as we can get on some of those. We could we could go back now and try to figure it out. But even then, it's kind of a guess because we don't have they will not everybody reports, you know, they uploaded. You have a nation.  Yeah, that's when you get an older part of time after more life. They're either here being for their cloud. And a lot of newer stuff is, but it's not going to be as well, but so there's a number of. Assumptions and. All parking we had to do just to get the studies out, but I don't I don't know. I mean, you're talking about number properties. That's that's 1 thing, but the recent runoff was less. Less questionable on what those results were just from a, we know more than went off. Does it doesn't get any dark to get out of the house? Well, that's that's what we don't know for sure. But we're reflecting that there's definitely increase as we're seeing these norms. And these scenarios increase. So there's a trend there that we want to make sure we pay attention to and that we can we'll be able to drill into those probably as we refine our. Some things here we want to do for quality, but the bigger belief was let's let's establish whether or not there is a problem. We know there can be more water running off, but does it cause a problem or not? That was. That was kind of the 1st, there's a problem that we need to deal with it. So that's why we're here now. This kind of wraps up when would. The white branch study is an interesting study is on the north side of 4th. Again, I have some personal connections out there, but 1 of the 1st areas where I did any kind of hydrology, hydraulic work back when I was working for Carter burdens in the day. I just heard this on its own again. But all the people you know. So it's an interesting basin because it was it was largely undeveloped. Since around 1975, we started getting some development out there by the time you got into the 80s, the lower end of it would really turn to boom. And then the upper end of it blew up in the 90s. And it's essentially called and built out since late 2000s. And so we have a lot of really recent information on that going back to looking at the original screen study as it drains down into big fossil creek. And so this was also a good one for us to look at on how relatively recent development friends have changed the streams and approached into the flood plant causing. Basically less area for the blood to to run off into. And so the goal here was again, we're going to look at land use our 2 contractors coordinated on how land uses were changing. But in this one, the focus was really on the stream and the flood plants himself and see how. How any of our greatest part, including some of the ice cream design pressure played into the stream for development, how they impacted flooding and. And again, this is looking at what was the baseline in 1963. What was a bunch of cop aspires without even a whole lot of stock tanks out there. Versus existing today, pretty dang dense. And there's some some green spaces up there, but I think that these are parks here. That's, I don't think that's apartment there. No, I saw lines. Yeah. That's all. It's all been built out and this was probably done or nearing that point. Anyway, well, it couldn't be built. I mean, all that green, you haven't been at squares or embedded offices. Yeah. So, this is a good opportunity to see kind of how things have changed. And you can see also that there's a lot of park down through here that that's where the bloodline wound up. And so that's kind of a natural use for. Bloodline land is some sort of a park system, but it has been encroached to the point where it's as much narrower than the bloodline used to be in a lot of situations. So that's, and that's just the way things were done. And that's part of what we want to understand is did that encroachment cause things to increase flooding elsewhere. Then here's again, this is that this is that channel we looked at in the early photo, looking at that very narrow channel. We were looking from right here looking upstream. And so this is the pastry that was out there before the little stock tank that was there. Well, it's not near anymore. And you guys is really efficient channel that runs right down this way. So that's how things were managed back in the day. And so you can see that over here on this table with clothes in it. The baseline historic clothes and then the revised existing and the percent change. Well, the big changes again are going on in the frequent storms. And 1 of the, I guess, an interesting aspect that 1 of the, what the study found was that the detention funds that have been constructed out there kind of do a good job of managing that 100 year really intense norm less of a good job. I'm really pretty. So that's a thing and we kind of, we try to kind of paper that up here. It could be that, you know, some, some solution to that could be, let's look at more sophisticated detention funds. What's that? So your baseline story was based on developed wrong. Yeah, okay. Yeah, this, this one we try to pick somewhere that have already been fully developed from. Retrastered this like when that full development is done. And also, not fully down the road like the, like in heights, Linwood where it's redeveloped, but it's kind of done its thing and got a lot of single family residential and commercial stuff that's out there, but it's all pretty stable. It hasn't really started flipping into the redevelopment side. So, because you're about to speak to me, sorry. Doesn't say is that fine. I was like, you know, there's a hard point with Chen brothers and where is that only analysis. This particular area. Yeah, we have where's your or, or these flows calculated. Is it going from. Yeah, that's at the outfall clear to go back to that. Down here. Is that. Yeah. And there was existing with modeling. So that's the entire. So, what are we going to include information? Currently 2 versus what we've done. Signed. 20 years ago, we did the main ball. Right. These were all signed prior to us. Okay. Yeah. So the existing model is done. Originally by half associates. That's going on. Here. Yes. Yeah. So it is. Rainfall. Okay. And then. So really what. What these guys did was. They did like a. Sensitivity analysis. Matrix. She can different parameters. That balance. So. Languages or second birdies. To see which ones were. More sensitive over the years. If they kind of twisted some of those knobs. You know, did it, did it turn out like. Really. My question would be kind of Dawn's question was. This was designed in the frontier. Are you back then. No, I slam different rainfall data we have today. Yeah. What is that? What's what was planned for? Well, we're dealing with today. That's a good question because I don't think, because Claire was saying that 100 year work well. I don't think they designed. Right. Right. Yeah. Or 2006. I think that's the only storm. Hard to hear. Hard to hear. And so. That wasn't even considered and hasn't been any. Right. No, we went in and modified those out. And this. This was more of an analysis to. Infer. That. And so in the next five years, got that increase in frequent events. That's not more people flooding. It's just a little bit more water in the channel. It's still contains it. But it's the border. And that one that contains it. The various. That's right. But again, again, I think it's important to know that it's not just. When you're presenting this to the council. They go like, well, gee, something's not working. This was, I think it's important to notice this was decided or criteria. Right. So that's a lame and understanding this. Would, would see that. Okay. Yeah. It's bad. And it's, you know, it's a lot of water. It was anticipated. But it's also. It's just, I know there were previous criteria. Right. So. So they'll apply that same. Appearance to. More. More. That was. Right. That's that. That's that. Right. That's that. In the middle. That's what people are going to get. Right. And that's all that's going to be that. Right. That's an important part of our. Or that we want to be able to call again. I'm pretty forward with that. It's changed over time in the year. But it's, you know, the 1964 manual was the manual. Until 1985. Or. You know, maybe. 2006. Somewhere in there. It was a long stretch of their work. That was the manual. Yeah. So what in the hell. So, okay, this is this. That's that. That's that. And then. From today's standards or from standard. Maybe for both. What would we anticipate along right now. Have we. Have we help. In. In a. Same development under a different set of standards. Maybe. This. The clarification is. This wasn't nobody's flooding. Just say. Yeah. So what in the hell. So, okay. This is this. That's that. And then. Just say. Either of these. The point of this whole exercise. Was to say that we. Took away all that natural farmland agriculture. But in streets subdivisions and then fill the channels all the way up. Straighten them out. Perfectly straight. That kind of fact. And that was what this exercise was to be was to see, well, what's the effect then of doing all that. So. My point is you're, you're applying to old examples. That's not, you wouldn't get this. I don't know the answer is, but you wouldn't get that same effect. If you analyze if all of those had been designed systems that have been designed. Under your criteria since 2006. They still work. They work on the old criteria and you still work. Is that right? You're saying you have this big jump in. Small ones, but you're, you're, you're analyzing. And also, you know, I'm just, I'm just saying the way you present it is be sure this is all criteria. If you did that same analysis and all these have been designed post 2006 under more recent city criteria. That increase in incremental flows for any. You know, the science for free will be, could be, would probably be lower. The delta will be lower than it was under your old criteria. That's a good point. Well, I guess there's a, I think our percentage would be the same. For the more frequent, what do you say? More frequent electricity. For the more frequent storm. There's still a part that is going to be the kind of the focus of this area, though, is the flood storage. Which is not looked at in our criteria. Right. And it's not looked at by FEMA. But when you lose it by compressing those creeks in. That water going to go somewhere and go downstream. And so. All of this to say, we're going to look at our criteria back then and now. And we're going to see if there's a change that's going on related to this flood storage thing. And then if there is this kind of situation, just all over everywhere in Fort Worth, except for the green river. Right. We don't deal with that storage. Well, this is to help us understand do we need to deal with blood storage in some way, either by leaving it in the flood plain. Probably easiest and best. Or some sort of regional detention, or we managed that attention some other way, but somehow you got to recoup that storage some way because what's happening is we aren't still getting. Increases as as the basins continued to dump down into the Trinity. Yes. That's the other part is even under current. So even if this was designed under the current. Let's say those detention. Smaller arms. We're still higher volume. Yeah, I'm just saying the wall. I'm just saying. Yeah, I totally get. You know, they're going to take that and apply mentally to my neighborhood or my counsel is right. Quite a gross. That might have a new relatives in the answer. Yeah. And you get it again. You go back in now. So this was built in the 20s 30s 40s. The Delta problem to be bigger. Yeah. Yeah. So that was really. By what we are. Yeah. And then what it was also. The law is a better story. So what it would help us. Repose is. What we do about that in the future because we do have so many people and I'll say. More and more water to come down our creek. More and more like, I know there's a development out there and it's like, you're not wrong. There is one. It's just not.  You're seeing more water and it's because there's more runoff. And so if that storage is, it's not. During a big event about storage and counting more than it is going to let you. So this is how you, how do you deal with that? So this was kind of going backwards, but yeah, I get what you're saying. And that is. Yeah. Yeah. How do we. It's kind of. Well, this is the wrap up of the. I guess the basic comparison or adjusting versus baseline. Very. I guess this will basically a summary of our findings. And that's the draft recommendations. That we consolidated out of our 2 reports 1 is. Increasing impervious power associated with development increases wrong. Well, we, we kind of all assume that, but they help us quantify that which was. That's going to be useful for us as we develop our policies. Some important to the study areas have already exceeded. The design previous assumptions to our criteria is already missing some of these areas. And they're not fully developed in the maximum they could be at this point. Decreases in Valley store to result into decreases in peak flow, particularly with the more frequent storms. Again, that's. It's interesting that the 100 year hasn't really blown up, but I think that kind of tracks in line. When you get those big problems, you've already got kind of separated soils. You've got to pose a maximum situation. And. Ultimate development hasn't really increased that too much as compared to the more frequent storms. And then the existing detention that was in some of these areas tends to mitigate people's build our form, but was less effective on smaller form. So. When we look at recommendations, it could be, you know, something that boils down to adjusting engineering and land use assumptions to reflect reality. We can say, well, instead of a point 65 residential something something needs to be pointing. That's easy to do. That has direct relationships to storm grade sizing, all those things. So it's, that's a thing, but it doesn't necessarily address all of the other nuances. We could say, is it impervious cover above a certain point? If you want to say 55% impervious cover on your property that maybe you can't do any more without some sort of offset in some way. What does that take? We can allow increased impervious cover if you have mitigation by that measure is like green infrastructure alone. In fact, the bone by mitigation better. Those are those are things if somebody wants to put in a pool and you have to have like a little micro detention or something next to your pool. Is that. He's full who does that? How do you, can you. I'm going to go back to that. It's a little bit of a pause. Because you get the tone. I get six minutes later. I'm going to wait for this. My race a lot. Yeah. So we're not so. Well, my older neighbor, but he said that already. But another whole problem, right? My whole pop up dealers. My neighbor. Well, but my neighbor does have to spoil it. I put it next to my pool. I got to think that thing out again. Yes. My name is school. But all that green infrastructure stuff is like, that's my maintenance for whoever owns the property. It's like, yeah. Yeah. So that's well in 10 years ago. I got to redo it.  It's going to be important to, you know, folks like Don use to deal with those brand new customers and then folks like. Stacey on our screen up there and then Bernie over here, deal with real people, real neighbors. Letting each other or doing something that's affecting the brand. How do you. How do you manage some change like this? We just want to make your property better. This, this all is linked in that way. And then I guarantee we're not going to review all those individual 20 micro permit things. You got to be some way to make that manageable. And hopefully that's something that we can come up with through the process. And you look at neighborhoods, a few white, white, white branch, pick a neighborhood. And see how much you had when the bill was done. For some people coming back and adding shows and pools. I had a basketball. It's all hungry. So, you get the 50% coverage. And you're doing about a dollar square foot.  We're going to be back there. Not everybody's got eight kids. We'll get the same somewhere that fabulous. So if you were a cashier. And that would be doable. We had. I wouldn't use all the time. Yeah. I mean, you can, you can do that in a term for. What we're seeing on the ground. And what kind of additional impact that has that we're not capturing. You know, when it's being up and is there sort of, you know, on average, we get another 30% coverage that we didn't anticipate our standards. Do we need to tweak our standards? So that we are anticipating that happening. And that maybe that would be your function already. That's all stuff. I would say that for care change. Who does it go to? Who usually uses it in an individual home? Obviously different areas. The room's hard. It's right after dark. You have like, then you watch where you have like home building. It's going to be taken on to the next block. And they develop that. In individual limits. It's like a small house with the idea that they're going to tear it down. Build it later. The information is not one. I'm not going to capture the same. I developed for them and then they go. Use it. And, and then probably, of course, if it doesn't come to that, I mean, every accessory structure and then they were concentrated. Right. There could be some disconnect there versus in. Updating criteria and getting into the end. That can't play the right important. Right. And that plays into that last bullet point there. Determinators are reasonable threshold for review. Is there something that's so small that we don't mess with that? That's the thing.  Whatever basin that they do have. And if it's not that perspective, what is the. I tear your manual perspective. We go, well, it's not really 6, 1. It's really playing down to be 1.7. You know, or 0.85 for single family residential versus the. 1, 6, 1. If we're going to go down this road or you're also going to look at stop applying 1 factor to the whole town. And start acknowledging that. The density in urban areas and city core. Is different than the urban density and. And more sort of. I think that's going to have to happen. We're talking about subdivision regulations that. Yeah. By a different opposite of land uses. I think that's the only way it makes sense. And realistically. There's going to be some, some neighborhoods are going to be more sensitive. The drainage than others. And. So we have to acknowledge that. And then somehow that plays into our standards in some way. But when we really want to. Focus a lot of. I think that's the only way it makes sense. And realistically. There's going to be some, some neighborhoods are going to be more sensitive to drainage than others. But when we really want to. Focus a lot of development and density downtown. And we've got 100 year old strong brain system. We've done here. Well. We had able that too. So hopefully some of this one form how to prioritize and deal with some of those home brain systems that it could be detention or it could be outsizing or it could be. On stations. So I mean. Right. We. I've been saying for years that. People. So. That. Also. Square foot home. And so. We're still free. Maxed out. How. No. But you can. I think that's a collective dollars. Let's have a good discussion. So hold on. Probably. 110 million dollars. Well, the other thing you have to look at. And is that. How much redevelopment and how much tax base. And you put all my ground and one with all that new development capture time for that. How much. Has gone around. How much is the city going to pay for all that increased valuation is good. That's big enough. We start talking about we've got to spend. Start. The answer. For live. Is. So we do the whole day of starter and get it out of the print. Right. You know, we've talked about that 10 years. You know. Yeah.  But it's awesome when we read it all this, you know, but it's, it's like, okay, we make all this money. And that's great.  But. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the city has some. Responsibility here too. Absolutely. You know, if you want one, you've got it. It's something we spend money to do. Yeah. So that is the other part of the answer is, you know, we can say, you know, we're going to break that. It's not going to get back. It's probably going to do so. I mean, it is just not. The studies don't work with water. No. Unless you. Well, put this in general in the history. Yeah. Turn it on for you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think. Yeah. Those need to be some of the discussion items that. That get brought back up to the bigger folks. So. We're definitely want to make sure that we're reporting those, those suggestions. Yeah. Yeah. So what you're talking about is I captured. And that's used a lot for things like. Well, and then trying to. Create infrastructure to support this high density, this walkable, early kind of living. And it's generating higher tax revenue. To go on a break or basis, then it's kind of percents for an area. Maybe there's a. There's a value capture that needs to be discussed in terms of. You know, making it, meaning in a viable thing in the longer term. And fixing the issues that have to be fixed. As a source of. Revenue related. Good. I'm not addressing where these two. Or anything. Building your pants up higher. And just pushing the problem down. So. We parked the car down there. I guess. And look at that. Yeah.  Oh, yeah. They just fill it with water. I'm good for a test. The. Thank you. The parking. Right. I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah. We have. Yes.  Then we do that. But they had to do it, and that was the solution they could come up with. So, it's a good idea for a good way of doing creativity, though, doesn't necessarily solve the problem. And you've got the benefit of the trend of becoming more flashy. So, we got some, that's coming. Now, it doesn't solve the thing behind the leg. But what happens when the panther on the front gets done? Is there any room at all for them? There's none. Yeah, so what the goal of that Saturday is the panther probably it's got another addition channel that bypasses that north north. So they had to make up a lot of value storage all over to mitigate that potential increase in flooding. So it's it's a balance also. But it's a balance itself. That's not helping anybody. Right, exactly. It basically left the water surface unchanged kind of all around on both sides of Bailey's so that those normally systems are pushing against the same downstream head to get out. So it didn't, it didn't help. Well, the new city hall. So you've got a couple of slides there. One of them does have some some of the solution. Yeah, I guess potential concept is considered. The quarter development certificate is a dimension something that's already applied on this. The Trinity River comes to enter. Interlocal agreement in conjunction with the core of the council of governments and all the cities that are on the Trinity, we hear Dallas to manage blood storage on the Trinity. And we can apply that same kind of thinking to smaller things. It's been really successful. But what it still doesn't deal with impervious cover changes in the basin. So that's that's been on the inside and then really the issue with CDC is that this area is developing back to the anticipated. So fully develop, you know, the 2045 flows are pretty much in the southern name. But that's that's an issue. But from a managing storage on project size done a really good job of keeping those flows are getting much higher. Again, we talked about regional detention and micro or site detention. Linwood's got some of those situations where they're trying to manage run off from individual apartment complexes.  So those are those things that are in some apartment complex from the visual homeowners. Yes. And it's the apartment complex. If it's like an HOA or something like that. We all know this in 20 years. Yeah. You dig out your own personal account in your house. So that should be people in the future. Oh, no, because they're not invested. So those are all things to consider. They may or may not work better in some areas than others. Revisions to our existing criteria. That's that's a realistic way to look at this and deal with it somehow. But it doesn't really keep us keep our infrastructure from being undersized so quickly, but it doesn't necessarily solve downstream flooding issues. Green infrastructure and low impact design. Those are two things that are already incentivized. But not required within our manual though. He doesn't visit there. They're hard to maintain and green infrastructure. I mean, it's just try to do it. Which are unique and all of their work stuff. It's a lot of our funding. Some of it's right. It's a lot of maintenance. So the big, the big player, right? Right. But a little longer. Right. Well, there's still a silta order. And that channel that they restored it by Hillwood, up on Alliance that way, that's, that's neat. Yeah. But that's kind of a one off because they, they want that in there. Yeah. I'm not one of the farms to be. And yeah. We're a second part of now. This is all I thought was on his end. But it's, yeah. So the part we, the amount of money that he would spend is to maintain and do that right. I mean, millions of dollars. Yeah. So that's, that's kind of a luxury almost. Yeah. And so that's not the way to sell this to everybody. That's what needs to be realistic as well. So some housing, you know, installing or increasing for this services, either, you know, permeable paving, that could be something. Those are also kind of hard to maintain. Very, very hard to compare. Yeah. Unfortunately, I think we just send these to those. Yeah. Here's the place. So far, yeah. And let's see. Establish ultimate development, finish floor, period or elevation buffers. Basically what that is, you know, situation like Templeton, we know how high we're going to flood it and how high our finish floor need to be. Instead of stopping out of the flood plain, projecting that out so that everybody outside up to that elevation gets elevated. And though if you're on one side of the street that's in the flood plain and the other side of the street's not, you're not unprotected on the other side of the street. And then there, there could be ways to deal with, you know, some of the stuff through urban 4-3, either exemptions or incentives for canopy preservation, those kind of things. That was something that came up in a conversation with Daniel Liao. And he has some ideas on that that hopefully we can delve into a little bit more. But that's, I think when you're looking at that, have a thing, and then our open space preservation stuff, there are probably ways to encourage those. Yeah, certainly. In 4-3, you might be focused on, you know, the 12-10 or even 1-1-2, or the natural plain. That's probably the 4-10 after 20 minutes. Right.   In an area where you're trying to develop, you don't want to develop an interdiction to get it. If you're setting aside more of this space, the price of the land is saying, you're eating less product to sell, but the process isn't. So that's it. So you increase the density, the smell out, and then the markets go, those aren't there. That's right. You can increase the density, but mainly open space. So it's kind of cluttered all the time. Right. You can use more of the space, if you're doing score density. You can get rid of the red ones on more of that, too. Would you ever consider getting more stormwater districts and having it here in the region for years? I think we probably consider it it's just going to be a 12, like this one, or utility fee with a district, that's only unique issues that contain that area. And if I hope. I can get it out of here. When we got our moment, there was no impact. I was just specifically agreeing. If you're going to pull up $800,000 or something, when you're going to share it down and out of the cost, $40,000 a bill, right? You may get a $25,000 charge to look forward. I'm sure it'll have to pay three per month. It's not really in that area. You wanted to go up and make a mark in mind when you should pay for it. That's part of the view. And we should have started with $15,000. You should have started with $15,000. That would be, it would be any way. It wouldn't be any easier way that from the opening to the opening of that area. You should have had the first of the meeting to trick out her money. That's part of the tax that you're collecting and in which mode you're not directly towards enhancements in that issue. And for this increase, I'm curious, can we look at another scenario that know what if it was all this higher person in previous? What would happen now straight or just have that amount of money? So what that would be? Call it. It's under a year plus, or, you know, the book is more higher. But that would fall into like your knowledge storage and give you a picture. If he was kind of got a strategy like that, well, it would be about 100 plus for a year's dorm with some add-on to it. I don't know exactly what this scenario is. That's not uncommon. And you're new to all of this stuff. So right now, what would be my infill development code? So I'm writing separate some of the employees that's separate from bring the right now our policy is for doing stuff outside of H20 and just be natural like we do, right? And build such a different needle on it. So I think I'll be able to merge this conversation of what there's kind of a right on infill development. Every month is paid on that, so I think that it's probably gonna get in the end. Yeah. And so the standards are covered. And you're in a completely different condition than infill development courses. Out of storage, I think I'm going to have a little something. I was going to just ask for the the guy who's really used to doing some of the stats that we missed out on this. So address them. Yeah, that's okay. So we've got a a consultant assisting us with doing some kind of like work like that to what was some different shoulders follow. Well, it's not we're not the only one who's got a problem. Right. So what are you using to do? Yeah, they're doing something. And I'm into the job. But it's different. It's gonna be a right one. That's all. They'll all be curious. But in terms, they're just categorizing what kind of strategies and concepts that might it might be interesting at least to just look at their violence. They do it this way. And I'm gonna go across it this way. Right. Right. So yeah. So it was we're getting some information back like right now that they're looking at on different cities and primarily in Texas. But maybe we have some other stage where we've done some score or use of the condition for the course of your spy.  What's your name? Sure. Sure. I mean a lot of it. You know, the numbers of numbers.  You know, the one set of things what you design for like Phoenix or for some places a totally different several rainbow events criteria and for this kind of a weird spot kind of a boundary between Western era and Easter. And the ground. Easter rainy, not not big massive rains but lots of rain for lots of steady rains. And so we're kind of in a hot spot. So it's like you're right. But it's like there's something that they do a lot of coastal areas. There's that rain on top. Right. You know, they get it, you know, but they have all of them that deal with that. And we have Yeah. And events. Second idea. Yeah. The ninth idea is the question. But I No, no, it is. It is. It is. It is. And we're keeping on going. I don't find, you know, too many variables that are too different probably might be a little bit more and try to like take one solution and move the rent.  That one, we can get one benchmark up. So Arlington, Dallas, Sacramento, Buckeye, then something that they're going all same shoes and with feedback. That one should be it's the infill stuff. And scratching my fist is like a little bit Normans and Houston. And they are doing like they're going fully on the low impact development site specific really, but there's sort of allow for that. So they're, they're making everyone do some sort of site specific something but some treatment leader. It would have the structure. Venturion is being moved which I just thought of it's now right. Yeah, wouldn't it go by line? You're going to do the future. That's the idea but it's so expensive. Yeah. It's pretty good. And then being time available. And I look from the industry standpoint, I mean, it's the secret of knowledge and stakeholders that we're just always concerned. You know, it's like when you add a site specific whatever, oh, that's only $1,000 once a family house, you know, but we just added a $10,000 wire impact fee to it. We just had, you know, you know, it's very easily yelling do this and yelling do that but it never time we do or would, you know, and it was the biggest one of the biggest prices we have regionally all of our taxes correctly is that affordable housing is vanishing.  The kind of house is the three. It's a great moment of the three. Somebody's got a really cheap deal for the nine. And so it's strike. Let's go do all the stuff that you can go housing up by another 20 to 25 that's a dollar from you. Keymill and two or three these things.  I mean, I want a house for $80,000 or as it was not. I mean, oh, yeah, but now people are going, oh crap, you know, well, housing, Portability really it's an issue and we're sure about these new employers and these new jobs with that drinking voice and how it happens. I have to look somewhere and report, you know, you track this new business for the government. You know, and so we would get the oh, well, you know, we don't need all that suburban development. It's like, you sure want all the jobs that go with it. There's some we're going to have firms and people go through the firms. Yeah. And so that's, that's, that's again at the end of the day what we don't, what we don't see has to go to some some really extreme things and we don't want to go to the lost of the model or something like that, which he did really for life. Overly burdensome on the individual priorities. But, but we got to have some kind of animals. You know, we they're, they're a waste of address of a lot. So it's nice to invest in these the life come up with some kind of form of solutions to the city world. We're doing this. Yeah. Yeah. And then frame it down or really like the firms as often as and now the mayor's trying to figure out a housing sheet before the ones ran on that. It was like the first time you get there. So we are working to get some regulation in some of these areas where we've got scummies and models and we know how deep the flooding is roughly so that people even develop it comes in. Isn't making it work. Right. But it's not making it. Eventually, it seems to get has the potential that obviously they've become debatable hot topic political kind of things. Right. We talk about the need for for example, all month, but there's going to be land use and proper land use and managing the things that come along with it. So certainly that's always a challenge about. Yeah. It is. Yeah. But you're right. I mean, I mean, you just that idea from an engineering standpoint could say let's figure out what's going on and how make it works. Like we we have a hundred year old things to fix. Right. Small rooms or size or level over aging. Those are whole things to fix. But there's new land that's continually developed that we could say is there a smarter way to address that not not saying limiting things to just is there a smarter way. Yeah. Good morning. Good morning. I talked to one of the guys that flooded in on this. Yeah. He was he had you know that meaningful access and so he had rendered on the one side that he was two weeks from up and in. Shut up and move it in. He thought this was the nice part. He still thinks. Yeah. I just bought this thing. Yeah. And it was what area? Mm-hmm. Have you asked a pair why I had to be specific on one one. That was when you show that the flooding areas along.  That's okay. So okay.  What map they some model of use? That was a map. They said model. Have you compared it to your flood prone area map and see how they did. So that would have matched very closely to what I'm talking about. It was actually over the 24 hours on their storm. But it was to to death wise it was to get out to your storms and how you had that. Well, that's good validated in your your flow. Yeah, I was like, hey, how much thank you exactly. But you don't have something. Cool. So that would get that much. And did they even put model of the land of all pump stations? That's as yelling there. Are you so jealous? Yeah. What that were? Well, that's part of the deal. I mean, you do swarming but they don't want to they got a plopter. Let me get the river. So it skates pump stations. And you'd still have to to get it to the pump station. So we're going to get the other work. There's a whole lot of strong grade that's involved just getting it to the pump. Right. Right. But then you've got to you've got to extend it pump station and move pump station. I mean, that kind of signal. Yeah. And Dallas have been doing tunneling with those big tunnel systems off the ground. And the water has a place to go. And then you can pump it out. But that's what was that about three, four hundred million dollars and downpounds. It's going to go out. Yeah. Yeah. But that's I mean, that's sometimes it's going to take that kind of stuff. Go. That's probably the discussion we need to have. And you know, but is it is it worth doing something like that to really open up someplace like Linwood or Monticello or pick your next near downtown, you know, near South Side or get something like that.  And they're going to pump whether they're going to water. Yeah. And so there's already problems out there. And they're going to continue to develop whether or not there's strong rains out there or not. How do we want to deal with the problem? And that some of of this will enter some of those questions, but there's notably this looming big cattle who is this. Yeah. Might be might be best answer. But thank you. We're looking for ideas. And I think I said, we don't want just here's the plan. Volume from the community and stakeholders and various state awareness. Do you have any ideas? Do the ideas can they fall at this point just across the board? It is the any kind of more or less. I mean, I think I appreciate that some of them are maybe more practical, some less practical or more specific less expensive. But I mean, I'm learning a lot as I have watched a lot of this. And I see more worries like they're in various percentage of, you know, percentage, you know, so you have nature and the rainfall in a common sense, one year, five years, one year. And then you have the ground percentages. And then you have the infrastructure and strongholds to get away. And so, and then you mean, so we look at like, how much are we building and zoning and regulation and and how much of various color do we allow. So when I'm missing time, where and solutions suggestions fall, it could be in terms of how we build what kind of documents we have in previous cover. It could be in strong rain infrastructure and it could be certain things that deal with the old existing problems and certain that deal with solutions to deal with the newer development. Right. So sounds like you're saying, yes, at this point, yeah, anything else? Anything else? Any suggestions? Any suggestions? And it's great to get both external and internal stakeholders. So if we were to come and say, we think we should do this with zoning, we get zoning department when we get there. We could do that, but that's a terrible idea. We did it in the 5th. Well, yeah, sure. We and so not everything is private. And and then, you know, for the development, both the engineering community, all who will be affected by this fire and water. And it isn't but do do and do nothing is there because that's what current and it's no question that the the available options and the option would actually solve a problem for your thing, Bob, which basin you're in and how the route that it's exactly. So the universe of solutions is pretty broad. Right. It's not going to be one-size-fits-all. Right. And ideally, we ended up with some you know, toolbox of things that we've been having the design criteria manual that says, well, if you're you're in Linwood, then these three things are goals and then you get there by X, Y and Z. But if you're on your south side, we found that X doesn't work over there because of some reasons that you only stick to Y and Z or something like that.  But the pressure is really kind of in the central part of the city where the strong range are older and the things are redeveloping quicker. And so as part of the solution set or the toolbox, can you see that things that an individual landowner or owner resident owner could do that we talked a little bit about that at best of a court and how much of the block is covered or those kinds of efforts practical concepts like because we talked a little bit about how to enforce them and measure them and things like that and how you motivate individual landowners to do something. I mean, if you have to just encourage people to do the right thing. Right. So are those efforts on individual properties useful and practical in this effort? I think so at some point we need to be able to inform and educate individual about what they're doing is impacting their neighbor. And what their neighbor did is impacting them. Right. And so let's if we can raise some awareness of what's going on and why that's a way to I think that's valuable. If we might even bend an ideal with outreach and education all the time on your flood from then the P-Mover perspective. Okay, sure. There's a lot of insurance that goes along with those kind of things. So people are more aware of that but the reality for us is we have as many insurance policies outside the flood plain than in and the majority of our flood plains outside the flood plain. So this is a problem that's not just you know a small problem that's about P-Mover. So there's a reasonable efforts as well. Oh yeah. It's awareness and education and individuals to help contribute to make it better. Right. So one example that I often did was they came down with the A&M Agri-Wide Center and they looked at random barrels people sent us you know so we did like this study to how much that would reduce the storms from the fall. That's about people in the neighborhood for rain business and so there was like a new center a new center somehow be made for something and you had a sort of sign of things say you would keep it at least this fall or so long after a storm of that or you could double out something like that. So I think what we did something like that the flip side of that in order to yeah we're going to you do this you're going to get a benefit that may be something that you can tie to we've got to understand where we start with you know with 50% of a lot or 30% of a lot being impervious but over time that turns it flips and we've seen this happen and it's creating this problem so that it's no longer we modeled it and just this over modeling is really not what's there anymore because everybody's adding sheds and whatever else impervious is you know do you then need to look at yeah for how do you how do you adjust your storm water fee based on people having born impervious surplus is that doable and then you've got okay but if you do this then that that goes up because you've added this and when it goes down because you've done these other writings I think that the the finance side is going to be initiative or disincented well so and we're not as a utility we're not grabbing every single people that purchase power we're not really diligent on mapping each of those things out we're approximating a lot of that if we were to get more diligent and you would see the loss that are 80 percent impervious and then they would get a different bill and when they come in for a shed for a measurement say well that's kind of where you're going to put that you put it on your concrete you're going to put it in your grass or the grass now you're going to 95 percent and now your fees can go up here this is going to be a recurring monthly addition to your water bill from then so that that's probably needs to be part of the special provides some additional revenue to do much more nearer scale or regional attention right all right and we may need to be able to go back right you know design your homework I'm sure you're you're percent very so much so you would actually need to cover your agenda control and then with products within the bill there yeah now let me make some ways because and then you should be back with family neighbor and it's back 20 years you're going to each of ways right there were each of us right now required of each away every time you go in the other so maybe there's something where you get your way since part of the revenue memory who were having no or shit small shit they they're required of all certain standards for making sure your phone or maybe instead of you there all that comes in right in the actual way has you know a little any possible we go to their their design standards or got on why I don't know from these forward or what I'm going to see now let me hear the one in trials later but then if I think your biggest concern when you mentioned your it's not still it's never it's over done 10 or 13 20 years ago it was learning a problem for broken that on sound you're sick so for probably I'm not sure I find something if I'm yeah well we're broken up against our living on time we didn't solve all the problems today we brainstormed a lot we do that so so on next steps I guess we'll work on finalizing recommendations for plus or impact mitigation in the next meeting I'll try to send out kind of a compensation of the notes that I took here and then Ben's got some notes and we'll hopefully have some case studies or local cities that are doing similar things that we can send out and permission related to that as well kind of as a read ahead for the next meeting then I'll have a little more well-developed scope on that I'll send out a schedule or a doodle poll for the timing right and I'll check the casual schedule at the same time when we go around public that way um but what point time when we come back to back and have a conversation about these discussions and possible recommendations and possible ideas well it worked for you what do you think that needs because I'm anticipating talking to them at some point so maybe at least a month away yeah not two months but over so let me show you just kind of get it in the system okay so now I want to metal play them hey it's me me right and that's and we probably you're the two meeting before very better or we're going to try that after mm-hmm mm-hmm two bigger examples in the chop that yeah let's see three yeah yeah no matter is yes so maybe it's not maybe it's two months away I mean no no no do you want to come in never remember that I really want to turn your heads up or I'll look for whatever I just want to make sure they're educated right so that they need to be back before just come in just to figure out how that counts mm-hmm yeah I would I would like to be able to grab the feedback from that team you're not familiar there they all follow through you as far as further react need they don't know how our council and they say go and do this this and this and then we a lot of try back back down through the time finding some things and some yeah that team up to speed on what we're doing as we're going to find that hard makes me get you hard what comes to us as a as a student what it is it's hard I think we could have Valley School you're trying to start first and then try to and then want and feel complicated and part of it yeah for the Valley School or anything yeah definitely I think that's again that's that's kind of the easy victory that's it's easier to manage the Valley School to side than the in-built development side but the wheels are already turning on the in-built development side so that's that's going to be a more nuanced conversation I think getting into what that really looks like so we'll be able to to find some of the the things to do for Valley Board I think and I can sit those out with the information for the next meeting to say this is kind of the the thinking every ahead we talked about these items let's try to have a list of what the you know two or three they're going to work most desire will want to are on the sheet and then you know there's one conversation you can know in the council about 2026 Fonco we are a parent that's from the Fonco family and so our community church we're getting that here at that time bring my head to the let's storage that's the things we're looking at with the Fonco the storage you know that that comes up because it is important is we don't have any data on how affected that is yes it has to happen it's starting to do just to happen the small here is I think a big chunk of it that's that's what is on Baltimore right okay we got same so with some of those some of those some of those some of those some of those some of those of those some of those some of those some of those some of those lists lists danger I mean I mean I mean things are all new t different r r the shutt along yeah y pressure the encontramos what did it could keep the Or was it important? Okay. Okay. Yeah. And I'll attend in person next time.  I'll be there in person next time. Yeah, I forget. All right. Well, thank you. That's how we reported that. Oh, is it was for prayer?