All right, we'll call the meeting to order at six o'clock and First on the agenda is to approve the agenda. Does anybody have anything that you want to add? Is there anything extra to put on their trees? No Just a motion to approve the agenda all in favor And then our only appointment is Brian Wright In discussion of the right road and gillie road or just gillie it so we got 15 minutes for you So just take us through what what you're looking for and Talked about it. It's been swept under the rug for a year now over a year And I know that trees instructed you she didn't want you to make a decision tonight, but I want you to make a decision And I'm disputing the decision you made last fall because you guys are supposed to be looking out for the interest of the people the public and Inhabitants of the town and you when you made the decision it was Benefit of one person that was my brother So I think that's I think that rule was broken there number two who I think was broken I went up with a hand shovel and a hole and I put two water bars in and It took care of three quarters of the water I was wrong because I didn't get permission from the town but if you go through Vermont status state statues highway state statues I did everything right to try to get the water off the road as quickly as possible and not let it run down the middle of the road You made the decision to go up instead of finding an alternate route for that water to run away from the road You went up and ordered the water bars filled in and that Made the water run down the road and there's a statute against that Did you know that the statute against that break in the law did you know that one on title 19 talks about the version It is illegal to purposely obstruct a ditch covert or drainage course that Rains a highway, so you people broke the law that you're supposed to That you're not sure that applies to us or to or to others since the town has the right to oversee But what's the statute? I Don't have the number I can get okay I just had the copy of this just that one little one little part there yeah And that I can get it for you. Oh right here title 19 chapter 011. It's under protection of highways That's illegal for anybody to purposely direct the water down the I remember when those water bars went up. What's that? It's I remember when those water bars went in and you know something those two little tiny water bars saved three quarters that water No, but you put him in illegally Divert the water Which is illegal you filled them you didn't find an alternate. That's why we fill them in Well, it's not like you came pretty argumentative tonight because you've started on using the board twice already yeah of things that we didn't do so We can have a civil discussion or we'll be prepared to find ourselves I'm telling you my opinion my opinion rule number three you broke was You put the person that had the most to gain from the sin you made in charge of Maintenance on a class rewrote. How do you do that? That's not even in the statutes anywhere How can you put somebody in charge that has the most to gain? You know what I'm saying with the water bars the town gave my brother permission to maintain a water bar I that protects a class rewrote. How do you just give somebody off the street the right to do that? So I'm asking for a decision. I'm not asking for a lot. I'm not asking for the it's a class three road I'm not asking for a lot, but I want that piece fixed up past where I My right away takes off the class three road that I use my right away takes off And I want you either I want a dish culvert or water bars Whatever up to the height of the land so that water did not run down the middle of the road So this I want to be clear to so I understand so past Andrew's house or Joel's house by past in Andrew's house past then it turns so I know exactly where your right of way is Yeah, so where enters so are you saying you want it from there to your right of way or the height of the land? After you're right away. I want it this class three so I should say but I want it It should be fixed up the whole way, but what I'm asking is fix it up a ways past My for my right away where the height comes up. There used to be a water bar there They used to go down in the field for years and years and years I just want to and also and also do whatever work you've got to do to stop that water from running down from the height of From the height of the land down down the middle of the road. I know that when we had the class four Committee meeting up there It's Carl did say that I didn't put I put one of them was in the bar way that that was in a bad spot But it was for the only place I could do it with a hand shuttle in a hole But there's strategic spots down through there where you could put in water bars and Direct the water off and it would be going into like an area of woods before it even went into Field and it is I mean it's not steep This is not perfectly level, but there's not much of a grade to it. So the water is going to dissipate I just got to get the water off that road. You can't you can't You can't allow water to run down the town road whether it's class three or class four class four I I found health that does the town is responsible for drainage on class four role. Did you know that? Yeah, the statutes are clear on what the town has to do with that The statutes are clear on what the town has to do and class four highways It depends on the you know the statute says on public good and there's a whole you know section there But obviously you have that so well, I found this Let me find it. I got to be bare with me And the town has the right to install culverts across and water bars direct water anywhere They want to cross anybody's land that they need to do You gotta hear someone I don't know. I'm just telling you the statutes that I read out of the Right here the town shall properly maintain the drain ditch or water course and keep it in good and sufficient repair Until upon notice and hearing it is discontinued the road is discontinued. What section is that title 19? Title 19 highways under chapter 009 repairs maintenance and improvement And you do know that several years ago the Department agency of transportation Got a committee together and and to do some sort of you know looking into these class four highways And they they came to the conclusion that it's an advantage to preserve these class four roads for future use because there's so much more people using them for You know hiking for recreation You know who would be hiking bicycle and horseback riding fishing hunt, whatever it's an advantage to keep these roads Preserved and not allow water to run down So I guess right now We as you know already Brian that we've We are we're gonna be talking about The right road as well as the Gilead Road and possibly another one or two other roads in regards to Looking at reclassification or other discussions on what we what we want to do on those now to date we have a class for a road policy and We have been very Straight on that so I don't Not gonna get into all the details, but we don't provide Summer or winter maintenance on those roads However what we do allow just like everybody else is if you want to do any type of work to the road As we've had many people before is is you come to the town There's a class for a road permit that you can fill out with a description of So like let's say you want to put a water bar, right? So you go to the town you get a class for a road permit and say I'm looking at putting in a water bar at this Location and the water's gonna flow this direction and then it's and then signed off way the town manager of the road foreman And then then you can do that work. I know So I think some of the confusion up The right road was Gilead Road we're talking now. Well, okay. Well Some of the confusion on some of the water bar issues where some water bars will put in without any discussion Some so there was what we had talked about last year. We were gonna go up in possibly fix that area By returning it back to where it was before not necessarily putting in an hour like that No, you stated that you were gonna come out some new ditches and some new water bars would need to be installed And that the town is gonna be doing that within a couple weeks. Nothing was done up there It did come up with a grader and it was late in the year and I can't remember who was running the greater I think it was Mr. Saul's Hazen I think it's a no material worker He tried to put a ditch in front of it which doesn't amount to anything it needs to be wide It needs to be fixed that that section and water needs to be stopped from running I'm just going but I know you've got a town a class four policy I read that but the stuff I read you is is Vermont statutes highway statutes for the state of Vermont Yeah, which is what this is to right And I look through the and I look through the orange book there too and there's quite a bit of stuff about your Responsibilities and and getting what a big thing is getting water off the road fast so that it doesn't so it doesn't build that So it doesn't run down the road for 600 feet and then you guys are in charge of doing that It's not asking for a lot. It's been just like Carl's report. You it's been the road has been neglected You know something you can jump on your lawnmower and choose not to grease that baron and it's gonna go for a long time But when it does go you're gonna have big repairs and it's been neglected. It's class three. I don't know if you get We don't you say there's no aid on it, but wait a minute There's no there's no class of there's no definition anywhere in the road statutes anywhere of what a n UTS road is There's either a class one two three four or trail, right? I wrote I actually asked the state specifically about that section and they said that once they have downgraded it Which they have and says it's not up to standard. We do not receive Highway eight for that section. Yeah, I mean when did they I'm sorry When did they downgrade that what year what I don't know? I didn't ask. I'd like to see that I'm not I'm not saying that it's not right, but no because you can see it on the state highway map I did but it only goes back to 1988 Yeah, and and maybe that's it because there was that once it was downgraded after four or five years It could you know be considered a class four, but The town hasn't taken the formal action to change that yet to a class four or a legal trail as it is in Rochester But so but I did write to the gentleman I can't remember his name right now top of my head, but I wrote to the state to find out Because I know from you're right. There isn't it just says on there that from 1988 until the president You know, I looked at the mileage that was taken off from your class three portion but Years and years and years and years and years you've got money on that road It went to other two other places not on that road Well, I'm sure all it takes right unfortunately with the amount of money that that road gets just like any of them Just driving up to take a look at it. We've already spent all the money for the road Like do you know how much money the state really gives you for those roads?  That's a class three road not that road and for a lot of that It's no money. It's a class three road. It's it's did we get no money for that road That's actually I'm saying for a period of time you didn't maybe you haven't for and you're gonna show I'd like to see that where they deducted that my only job I'll email but right now you're getting Approximately sixteen hundred and thirty dollars a mile and if that's a half a mile, of course that that's today That wasn't years ago, but in today's dollars you'd be getting that's point four six miles You'd be getting roughly eight hundred dollars a year on that road. You take that for 20 years. That's uh, that's 16,000 dollars And that money went somewhere else. It didn't go on this road. I'm just asking but that's assuming you're And that's the thing that you have the disconnect here is is we're not Okay, so we're not gonna go down the rabbit hole tonight. We get you 15 minutes We right now are going to as we headset the last meeting that you are here for it Which was last the literally the last meeting that we have been putting together the time for us to go up there to physically Look at it so that then we can That's the process so like it or not You've all been up there you've been up there trees. It doesn't matter. We have to warn it We because you can't just go up and make the ruling tonight You've been up and looked at it doesn't matter it doesn't work that way what he's saying is for the town to take an action to Down officially say they want to reclassify Gilead a Susan example they want to reclassify that section of Gilead as a Class four or a legal trail. There is a statutory process for us to go through I have drafted the notices the town attorney's looking at it and you have to notify all the butters I've been to Rochester. I look at the dress.  I think it was October 14th But I spoke to the attorney this afternoon He'd been away and I'm gonna be out the rest of the week. So we're not gonna be able to do that date in Particular but yes We not all of us, but at least Chris and I have been up and seen the road That's a true statement But for them to if part of the statutory process to reclassify or discontinue a road You have to have a quasi judicial hearing. There's a whole, you know Processed so that's what Chris. I understand that but you know something right now tonight is a classroom road I'm asking you to rule tonight. You're probably not gonna.  You only you only made a decision to benefit one person And you're wrong there.   I'm sorry Well, again, how do you feel and how it is isn't always okay? Well, I'm trying to say if you're not gonna make a decision tonight to fix up that say I'm not asking to plow in the winter. I want that I'd like that section Wide and so in the brush they did the best job they could with hand tool You need a machine up there. You need it. It's it's it's a jungle. Yeah Yeah, they were probably for what they got done But yeah, there's still no line of sight. You can't yeah road is this wide because we don't have a roadside mower I know so we don't and when we did the sections of town Obviously the price gone up and we only have certain sections. So they did go up and with probably that hand tools There may be a chain. So I don't know but Yeah, we don't have a roadside mower which is probably what it something sturdier Yeah, it needs something like Gilman's got one on his excavator. You know the mulcher, you know a big heavy duty Yeah, yeah, unfortunately, we don't know anything like that. So Morgan and AJ bringing you aware of what's been neglected all these years that's that's what I'm doing and Obviously, you're probably not gonna make a decision you can make a decision to fix that section up Not tonight. Okay. That's all I need to know Well for to be on the record anyways We have three board members here tonight and it was not put on the agenda to make a decision on this particle I'm asking you to make a decision. That's that's why I came here, but that's not the way that's not the way our board function So it Teresa asked you though to she recommended that you not make a decision tonight. So you're going by her recommendation. I Asked them not to make I wasn't sure what you said to hear me through and yeah, but not to make a decision because we I thought that your issue was More comprehensive than that one section So I thought they can't make a decision outside of that statutory process if they were going to Discontinue or do something like that to the road and if they decided they During that process if they weren't going to discontinue the road They were going to do maintenance. I felt like they were was going to be a process for that. So you wouldn't be ignored It's just going to be six weeks until we get through the process So that's common. It's been pushed under the rug for a year I'm just telling you if even if you downgrade it to class four, which is simple enough to get the votes I can get the votes in ghillie roll five percent of the voters. How many voters by the way in the town? That's Registered voters. Yeah, well, I can find out you can ask Pam. I want to say like 1800 1930 yeah, I'll say there's I was trying to How many actually both years are registered? No, that's registered voters. There's different amount just because you're a resident doesn't automatically make you a registered voter So two different things so that way but a petition can be signed by it doesn't a landowner or a Taxpayer you know what you may have to I mean, I'm not a landowner of A registered voter right a registered. I think the petitions may only be signed by registered voters But I haven't been a town clerk in a long time. So I you should ask Pam I don't want to quote the statute and election laws change So I'm getting that even if you do succeed in downgrading it to a class 4 your water running down the road doesn't go away That's that's still that's still up to the select board to the sleight or the town of Bethel. I will review that you said title 19 chapter 09 or 011 is a Yeah, because I'm not finding one one as a chapter or a section it was it was that it was a This is how title 19 is this big. So sometimes it's like finding an evil. No, wait a minute. That was I'm sorry. That was a dish My book work issue Thank you And then you said oh one one This is the one This is Purposely obstructed ditch culvert a drainage course that drains away. We don't know Title 19 chapter zero zero zero zero zero So thank you and So your problem with drainage isn't going to go away even if you reclassify it and I'll you know what I'm saying Yeah, so I will definitely look at it and I mean we have a meeting in two weeks. So I'm happy to that's not one of the statutes that I had marked or reviewed because I was focused on getting moving forward with the Reclassification of that of a portion of right road and Gilead. So I was not looking at that You know statutes chapter and verse on on water So and Chris is correct usually when people come as an appointment. It doesn't automatically make a decision item If you're requesting that we can add it to an agenda You know next year sometimes well in two weeks, right? I'm not trying to argue with but I was just reviewing the letter that you had submitted to us the Bethel Select Board The purpose of the meeting on 912 and you said is to discuss the deteriorated conditions Okay, I mean so there in your letter. There's no there's nothing in here like I would like the The select board to make a decision on You know, I mean I understand that but that's why I'm here tonight. That's why I'm requesting tonight That's why I wanted this time to request tonight, but what we're seeing at this time as well as that Right now we're talking internally with our Well, you probably got to talk it over with the other select board too, right? Yeah, so I could put it as a we can't I will happy to list it as a decision item an action item for them in two weeks So when will I get a definite decision in two weeks? So that's I'll get a definite decision on whether you're going to fix that or and fix a drainage come down or not One because I'll have a chance to read the statute. Let me just tell you guys hang live with that September 26 It's been a year. Okay, so we from today. Yeah, and So that's But mess we'll put it as an action item then and then it also gives me a chance I'm looking at that statute right now, so it will give me a chance to read it and understand What? And then we're moving forward on the and we are moving forward at the same time with reclassifying the section of right road basically from for lack of a better description the turnaround the farm Up to the end where it hits Rochester town line and looking at portion of Gilead Where it is the not up to standard class three So basically after Andrew's to the Rochester town line so that so we are working on that as well and I had got your information and Terrence like I said I'd gone to Rochester and figure out who's a butters who owns property because there's you know in the Same process and the same thing goes with nothing. We're discussing the fact But the same thing that goes with the right road is if you downgrade that to class four the other issues don't go away Right, and that's why I want to read and understand the statute. I haven't I'm not familiar with this section I'm you know, there's a lot of them I would just want to make sure what the select boards what they actually have to do because it also says It doesn't say that where they talk about other road maintenance like the select board can choose to do certain maintenance class for it Whereas, you know, I certainly understand it a quick glance your interpretation of this So I just want to make sure I understand what the select boards full obligation is and that that they carry that out So I appreciate you giving me that I wish the other two two people were I know, you know Every time I come to a meeting I hear Chris talk a lot. I don't hear anybody. What do you think they? What do you think about don't you?  Don't you think they should be preserved in some way get at least get the water running off them? Ever I think I believe that every road has its own Need okay now. I'm in my mind. I'm thinking and What you want to do on that road? But what about I tried to go on that road years ago and the Randolph part or Rochester part You're saying they're broken law by not fixing it up. So it's possible. Is that what you're saying? Water running down the road whatnot. No, there's a statute against you guys filling in water bison purposely instead of finding Well, yeah, but you went beyond that and said that if they're also there's a Statute in there that says you can't you have to take care of the water on that class board road Yeah, there is there's a statute that I'd like you to go up to cushion mountain and drive down to your land that way Tell me how they took care of the water down there. Well, you can't get down through there Well, that's your truck, but but nobody disputes that I'm disputing this if somebody disputed that you may or maybe And I'm from looking at the pictures I Haven't been up that far. I've been to Andrew's house as far as I've been I Guess I'm looking forward to having a whatever warned Visit whatever they whatever you want to call it to look at because of the pictures show I'm not sure how you'll get the water off that road from the pictures I'm not saying that that's it can't be done, but I know how some of these old roads are So yes, I ball for keeping class four roads open Also Since I've been sitting in the seat and how much how much money the town has And I know what it costs today to run a greater backhoe or any kind of equipment truck and buy material or whatever And I'm not saying that I don't believe that you're being singled out by anybody Yeah, well we can dispute that too. Well, I'm not being single that one But anyway, I'm and I'm not asking for you guys to maintain this road all the way to the Rochester line I'm asking to fix up the session that affects me that I have to use to access my property and And to stop that water that's that's what's ruining this road to stop it from running from the height of the land down A lot of this damaging the road. That's all I know I don't want to understand I understand that you looked up those statues And I understand that you have you have a belief of what they mean I Need to hear Teresa understanding of those statues also I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just saying I want to I want to hear after we've talked to somebody higher than us That's why Yeah, so I found them. Thank you, and I will ask for I'd be all read it and ask for clarification if I need to from Teresa you and you but thank you. There's a little asterisk at the bottom that I think that says It was that that law was added in 1985 could be yeah, this is the newest book And I think it's a 1985 it could be so I will and I will I'm gonna be out the rest of the week But um The phone we got emailed this gentleman from the state and asking about the state highway aid thing because I I Don't know. Yeah, find out find out what year they start doing it and show me the chart of the mileage Where they deducted that my only job in class three it could be that I have seen that We submit ours, and I have seen where the state will send one back edited where maybe they fix something or you made an adjustment But I'll ask them they should have it so I'm happy to get that G. What do you any thoughts? Most I think the most silly of thought I'm having right now is that I'm not willing to take any action until we have the verification of The law what is mandated and if that does not happen by it within the next two weeks I would not be willing two weeks from now to make a decision until we have heard have some final Final word on what is actually said what is made what is actually mandated and what remains that you just discretion what needs to be worked into a town's road maintenance schedule all of that is continues to be and and I'm at a disadvantage because I do not know the property lines I Can I mean I can look at a map, but that doesn't help me Without actually going up and physically with somebody who knows where the lines are where the access roads are Whether this is the only access to your site. I mean, there's a lot of information That That need that I need and I Will act when I will be ready to act when that information is available And I I think at this point Brian it We got we all have opinions right of every single topic in town But for myself, I have an opinion, but I'm more of following policies. So we have a town for You know class highway policy that we follow and and try to be as consistent with that policy as possible So right now, you know, we are we are working off of the policy that we have But you've also got to go by the state statute highway statute as well and incorporate them together And we give us a little bit of time to research that because we're not going to sit here and make a decision That is ill-fated in not knowing or catching us in a catch 22 or something like that We're not playing the game. So it's it You have requested we've received what you what you were asking for It's already in motion. So to tell us that we're not doing anything about it. It's already in motion. We've been working on the proper warning for reclassification hearing to have which takes time and and we will research the The title 19 information that you gave us and and go through that with the league of cities and towns and our lawyer and We'll figure out, you know, what how to make a decision on that Again, we we we don't know just like Jean was saying we don't know all the all the laws of the land of Vermont You know, so I mean to make these decisions. That's why we have to have The correct information in front of us, so I will say is I will send the turn any email I wrote those down. I found them in here will ask them a question and I will say it's interesting because of what you're, you know, those Those email or a statute references because the class for road policy That actually comes from like vlct. So it's interesting to me that they don't reference, you know what I mean other statutes, but I will email him Wednesday And but we'll put you on so they'll make an action item decision and hopefully we have a full slate of people here in two weeks at Two weeks you said 14 plus 12 Yeah So we'll do that And currently I have no Appointments, but if there's an appointment it would come on just before you so just so you know And you're going to get a you're going to get a date set for the meeting on the other road Both gilliet and right. Yes. I I'm not sure if I'm going to have a date set before the 26th I don't know. I'm waiting for the lawyer to review Our notices then they have to obviously get to right now. I'm hoping but I'm going to be out the rest of the week. So I'm I'm hoping I'll have it done into vacation No, actually not work. No. Yeah sick One of my kids done surgery. So I need to take care of them. So um, but anyways, so but will um So that will be, you know part of the process. So hopefully I'm hoping to have all the information and the date set on the 26th That's for that's for the reclassifying right road and A portion of right road may be clear about that and a portion of gilliet. I don't want to start a rampage So just portions of right road and a portion of gilliet and that's with the physical meeting at the Yeah, so what we would do is we would meet here Chris would call the meeting to order and then we would go and then the select board can you know Is there then you have you come back and you take a it's a quasi judicial hearing So the plot to take an oath the meeting has to be recorded and you take testimony People you can say what you want to say and if somebody else was there that they could question you People have the right to question each other and um And then the select board You know, everybody leaves they take testimony and then they have 60 60 days such to really to make a decision And of course the select board has options. They could Well, they could reclassify as a class four. They could make it a Trail if they make it as a trail, then it goes to state of vermont forest parks and recreation And they can decide if they want to make it like a legal trail So there are options. It's like we're just has to decide You know how they want to move forward. Oh, okay Did you put the stake in about the farm here? You think the town last rewrote chris and I did yep, you're about uh, you're about 70 60 feet short, but that's all right Well, I measured it Eight times with a wheel. I'll go again We measured from I asked the state where they measure from To you know, because they obviously are the ones when you look at your state highway map It's the state that sets those and they said from the middle of Gilead Where middle of gilead road where it breaks off that's they start there Up point how many ever miles that is To is the length of right road. And so we felt we were within We thought we were good 15 16 feet You saw the stake there with a blue tap We thought we were within 15 or 16 feet I don't know why they why would they start in the middle of a roll? Uh, it's the state way they do their measurements. I don't know we asked I think I'd question I'll question that a little bit. But anyway, that's okay I asked because everything every taking the state of mont does is from the middle of the road Well, because we we were going up. So I asked somebody to make sure so we felt we were within, you know Taking the camera old bridges were at one time Did let's say let's say you replace the bridge Between the time you set it over make the road straighter You're right. You take out a certain amount of feet. Oh, no, I bet I've taken into account too No, because when they took out, you mean right road replace the bridge after that going after Irene Yeah, so it would have changed the yeah, I don't I don't I don't I doubt it because the state doesn't go out and remeasure roads so if so that change I think the original You know, probably would have been certainly before Yeah, because they They rarely come out But we just put that stake there just kind of to get a visual of where we you know the interpretation of that and But if we obviously would get it professionally measured well when we reclassify the road We're going to reclassify from most likely the turnaround the farm because it makes it easier for our truck to turn around So most likely we're going to reclassify from there. So where it specifically starts or ends is probably not You know a big deal because they reclassify the whole Section we'll see why yeah, I mean Just one more issue with the Yeah, I guess instead of putting it on the public. I guess I'll bring it up now The class four section. It's a class four now on right road I know you got to get permission from the select board to do everything I'm going to take a contractor up there before our meeting a physical meeting up there And have him mark the trees there's a shift on the trees that are going to have to come out to upgrade the class So for me to fix up the class four road Up to my what I want to make Or I want the the electricity and the road to go There's a bunch of maple trees. I'm going to have and what I'm going to do is get a contractor to come up and tell me Roughly this one's got to go this this this this has got to go so that they're marked I want to mark them a little bit of paint So that when you guys come up for a physical view I can show you this this is what's got to go So you're going to get um like a logger Forester or contractor Justin 48 or Gilmour or Ray Harvey or He doesn't need permission from the town to mark. Well, he as long as they're on his property if they're on his property in countries But what's happening is that they're endangering the road. Yeah, so we'd still he yeah, he would I think we'd have to go over there, but if you want to mark the trees That's fine. I don't have problems. I just want to make sure that they're on his own property, right? Right. I mean you can you can no the ones that are on on their side I get that they're going to have to come out to widen this road Well, the why there's there's road there's trees up there. The road hasn't been able to well We drove it. Chris and I went up and and obviously it gets very narrow at a certain part and You could have a contractor give you an inventory of you would need to remove X amount of trees on your side and X amount of trees on the other side It's got to be on there It's got to be on their side because you can't go on my side the ditch is there already And it's got to go the other and these are trees that because nobody's been able to use this This road for almost 90 years They they have encroached in the road and nobody's done anything to them and they're endangering the road And there's actually a statute that says if trees are in danger and you roll they need to be removed Right. So the road trees have got to come out to so I so I can so you can maintain it in the winter time to have To to plow the road and get rid of the snow You're going to have to give it so the um, and I'm pretty sure that after your lawyer sent us the last letter And our lawyer sent a response The town attorney sent a response saying, you know that there was a licensure You know that there was an agreement and everything that had to happen if the town was going to prove that but We haven't gone any further with this. So obviously no trees can be cut or anything like that without a permit to work in the towns Right away, but I want to mark so you can see in the one dwe mark On your own side. No on your side. Well, I would just recommend staying on your own. I mean What's wrong with a piece of weight can show you one we're over our 15 minutes Okay, so you had a 15 minute appointment. It has been 40 minutes, you know something it's good to talk about these roads because no But I'm saying we're we're not gonna the board is not here to get into a civil dispute between the two families Okay, I would recommend as the board chair or just a random person that marked the trees on your own property I wouldn't go across and mark trees on my neighbor's property. You know, the road is here. The tree is here The road is here doesn't make a note of it at this location. This is the tree I'm concerned about inventory of how many trees Because remember you can't deny me the the opportunity to fix a road up to to access my property Why we don't know that we're we're investigating that All we want is to not give you permission to go on somebody else's land and if Andrew's certainly stating he doesn't want that then We can't give you that authority. That's all we don't want to add so for right now We're gonna we're gonna do some research on the class for stuff. Yes, absolutely. We have the ball in motion To figure out the date for the meeting for reclassifications So I don't I think We'll let the lawyers handle it and so on the 26th, you'll have you'll get your answer And I will look at those and I appreciate giving me that information and I will email the state and get you the information about the Highway, just remember just remember. This is town right away, but you guys have the control of not the firm Do we understand that no more favoritism no more No more there hasn't been favoritism. Yes, there has. No, there has. Yes, you know it, but anyway Okay, I guess that's it. I got one thing one quick thing on public or I guess I could do it now and then you can be rid of me Dave you want to be rid of me? I don't have any issue with listening to anybody who has what they have to say I would but I I have to agree with Jean and the fact that I don't have enough information to make a decision. I guess it's going to boil down to the legality Sure, that's why that's why we have people that represent each other. They are more adverse than that. So All right, so we'll move forward to the public comment period So there's anything on that's not on the agenda that somebody wants to comment on public comment Ellie's the only one out in the digital world Everything le you good Okay, Ellie's good I just just one thing I wanted to ask a question. Did you do the mandatory cleanup of plastic flowers on Saturday? It we didn't do it. I put a notice in the paper and stating that the people that the People put they had to have them gone by the 11th By Sunday September 11th. I let um Cecil know we spoke. He said he only had one Plot that had plastic flowers on it Everybody else that was he that had put plastic flowers out had removed them So I think he was going to remove them from that one Location so he was happy that Everybody had done, you know, what they said they would for one Mike assumption And he couldn't remember the name on the grave My assumption is they may have been somebody from out of state who just come up on a Holiday or something and put it in left. So that's good to hear. Yeah Otherwise Cecil's back And in charge so it's working out good Any other public comment right? We'll close public comment And we'll move forward. We have the appointment of Cory Richards and Jason Rogers as deputy fire wardens Their information was in the packet Yeah, so they were interviewed by the state. I think there's a gentleman in the state who comes down interviews them. Yeah, so They pass monster So here So you need to sign here and then the other members need to sign here and You need to sign here and then they'll sign there So Jean you just need to sign And just make sure if you didn't sign then just make sure you sign in. I don't know if you signed it or not So right there through the record You're all If I have sharpening maybe Right, exactly. All right, so we'll get these to the Back to the State of Vermont Okay Then we had the reappointment of oscar and justin As constables. Yeah, so I had Apologize I didn't write in the I've written march 2023, but it's actually march I want I was in march 13th 2023 because that's your organizational meeting, which would be the second Monday in March and then we can get them back on a regular schedule so that they would get appointed every March like Fence viewers and everybody else Okay, just need a motion to accept that So I'll move All in favor We're still working on the Any other possibilities to do policing in this town? It's in yep with the budget discussion Coming up and uh, but gene I just I did um That help you Okay. Yes. Good. All right, perfect. I still have a question because you may have to ask the police officer I mean, I may have to ask a lawyer. Yeah, you know, what is uh criminal procedure Versus. Yeah versus. I mean I didn't see a rest No, I had just so It's uh I don't know. Yeah, I had just defined it Way above my pay grade. Huh above what I had just gone through to define Civil or criminal process and then I went to vsa, you know, 691 and sometimes the statutes are just I mean there's a lot of those callouts Well, we'll get to it But like when you get into like more of the criminal code callouts Yeah, like they normally handle that with multiple officers. So let's say our constable was Going there. There may be a Vermont state police and then they take over the Arrest or investigation or but what's funny is so here it says the service of civil or criminal process You go to that and then it gives you this where it says either civil or criminal process And even in when I was looking through title 12 They don't define Civil or criminal process. So I had to go try to find a legal definition So it's it's it's interesting sometimes how some things in statute are spelled right out But then something like this is not so I figured I'd find a definition So I was I was reading through that and saying so what's the difference? Yeah between a constable and a police officer Not much. Well, and that's the thing is nowadays. It's it's it used to be a very large difference Okay, and that's fine. That's what we're talking about like when Oscar came on he was Whatever is it to we you know, so it seems like a majority of individuals were at that certification now which years ago I can give an example my brother in law who You know has no police back whatsoever was a constable for years in another town Probably decided to take a couple courses And and he we just got elected as a constable and I think that was very common throughout the state of Ramon And then they slowly are dangerous, isn't that and then slowly You had The state started saying okay people have to have More training to be pleased and that to be constables and then they had to go to part-time academy But once upon a time it could be anybody you could have been constable and so so part of the whole But part of this whole conversation To be held in 21st century Yeah Means that there is Little Distinguishing so we really are talking about policing. Yes. We're not And Yeah, yeah That's an important thing for us It's not just traffic control and And dog catching exactly Like it may have been like it may have been so we need to throw that Into the hopper of our discussion and then in my opinion We need now to pay more pay as much attention to Some of the concerns nationwide about police abuse And and how we minimize that and whether policing Is doing social work, right or whether it's doing law enforcement. That's the those are too They are and and one of the things on the books Which was interesting when I was doing this research for you and then Something had just come to me from the criminal justice training council about constables And I had gone back to do some research to figure out when and Beth will you had voted to have the select board appoint the constable there is still On the books that you can vote at town meeting to limit the authority of a constable. So Right. Yes. Yeah. I did see that so we could limit the authority You could and and this select board the select board had not done that Nor had the voters at town meeting that would have to be a town meeting vote, right? So but it but it's interesting, but yes, I think Just anybody was a constable Back in the day. All right, right. So well, that's not anymore help play Yeah, yeah, no, but again it's still it wouldn't change our current policing it No at all Because we've been we've been with a 2e for Four four or five years now. So, I mean we are I would I understand what you're getting at, but it wouldn't be like all of a sudden there's New accreditations and we're going into a different. I mean we this Constable or the constables that we have currently one of them has been with us for four almost five years now And has been 2e certified and has the full authority So we're in bevel we're not changing anything, you know I under yes But the my other question before we Move forward You see I see that we've budgeted 20 hours a week That's what we currently have and that oscar worked 53 and Half hours in Twenty three and a half weeks. Yeah, that's our problem right now is so they're he's And You didn't show How much of that difference was made up by just none. No hardly any So we're definitely not so we're not we we've budgeted for 20 hours We're right now getting 15 Oh, if that not I know at the last pay period it was what seven hours or something like that. Yeah, it's very some of us we get none so Having Pointed that out. Yeah, I mean I will move that we We continue the current or that we reappoint them until time meeting and Or or or our decision on it or if any a future decision We reappoint them until time meeting if we make a new decision We'll deal with right because your new budget would pick up your right exactly So the motion they've made was to re-empoint Constables oscar gardener and just in cram until march 13th 2023 So you're good with that motion. Yeah, I see you're gonna second it I think we already are you already voted on so I said no second. All right, you guys gotta listen You've seconded one article, but not two so either Okay, let's be consistent Otherwise the minutes are gonna look funky and then I just wanted to point that out. Yeah But we all know but I know it's thank you for your yeah, no happy to look. Yeah, sure That was interesting I appreciate you guys time. Yeah, have a good evening. I think it's really good Talking about roads I watch out. I'm not here very often, but I look at all the Selectments know, you know meetings the notes. You read the minutes. They go and uh You guys eat twice a month Say two hours. It's actually four hours a month 48 hours. I don't think we've discussed 40 minutes of roads in the last year Or two years. So it's pretty good So we'll have a good evening All right, and then ellie you're probably uh snooping behind the scenes there in regards to some recreational facility grant stuff Does that sound right? Yeah, I just I just have a question about it. Um um when you went when you um Talk about the information and then can I ask a question before you approve it I just um, I was just curious because it it's really needed and and I agree with it and stuff like that because Because in fact, uh, we used to have a bike rack at the center, but I don't know where it went. Um, but when it when you're saying it that the 50 percent match Comes from the recreation general fund budget Is that because in it in the town report under under maintenance for proposed 22 23 6500 is that where that match is going to come? Yeah, yeah Yeah, did you he's going to take it out of the you know the budget that she has for the pool? Yeah, it's not coming out of capital fund Right Just working it in around your budget that you have between now and june. Yeah around her budget. Yeah, yeah And it sounds like this grant Yep, 22 23. Yes. Sorry.  I'm assuming for the pool. Yeah, this is what D tree D tree wrote the grant and she wrote the Is it specific to those certain things or is it a wider nope? You had to write it. She had accessibility types. She had to get pricing So it had been a complaint that people there's no seating real good seating inside the pool area So that and a bike rack um for kids who go to the skate park or go to the pool There's no bike rack there. So it had to be um and we also need two deep end exit ladders So yes, she her grant had to be specific and she had to provide quotes and estimate in with her along with two letters of support so So, yes, it wasn't any these guys usually Is this a grant that it's one of these like done deal grants or we don't know We don't know. That's why she's she's going to send it in but she needs you guys So she's just asking permission to send in the grant as as well as use the 50% match yeah part of the Yeah, because that's part. Yeah, because that's part of your grant. Gotcha. So so 20 29 I just want to make sure I had right 29 73 55 is the total amount Is of the grant or is the total amount 58? Well 59 something. Yeah, right. Probably right. Yeah, 29 is Well, because we get 29 73 from this is what 29 73 55 is what they would be given us using for match Yeah, and they're giving us the same. Gotcha. The state is funny like that They like to use the total when in fact you're only giving you half. Yeah, I just want to make sure I Yeah, no, sorry if I wasn't clear Okay Yeah, roughly. Yep That's what it sounds like Okay, all right any further discussion on that or just need a motion to Motion to accept or allow to the application of the Facilities grant recreational We have a second Jean you got all the power tonight All in favor One two. All right, then we have babes bar request to cater for the board festival event Yep, they are requesting that their hours of operation from beginning to end are from three to ten Approximate number of people 200 and this is the same um The numbers that they put out last year And obviously they you know has to be fenced in they're well aware of the rules And they would be enforced by you know department of liquor control. So and we didn't have any issues last Okay Did you hear gene he moved? Okay. That was just finishing reading it. Yeah, uh second. Yeah, all in favor And we had errors uh listers errors and emissions Yep, the they put that in here. It's a new form very fancy Dennis woods property. Yeah, and Judy and mo they went back and they cannot Figure out how the value changed so she wrote computer slash lister area because she said we cannot Figure this out how it had how it had changed. She said I might have hit a button when I was you know doing something. So um But so it just gives you the change from and to the grant list all right And just need a motion to approve Just need a second you're gonna second that no Okay, we're not. Oh, we don't need to Okay, that's fine think of your mind. Yeah, what do you want? I want them to be one or the other All right, how about we just do yeah drop the second Okay, all in favor All right, perfect. So you guys have to sign these new forms. So just on this side. It doesn't Signify just this one form. Yep. So up you're over here. You guys are over here. No, where it says All that's going around Do we Have a clear idea of where those roads are White right I mean Those are some you do know where they personally are. I'll take you for a ride. Yeah And they're a few times. Yeah I mean Okay So the right-of-way can be measured very easily Well, it's going Necessarily if you want to get the right right-of-way you need to hire a surveyor to find And they had both had their land surveyed and out and mr. Lana had done some work up there So we do have some good That was my question But there'll be some questions in that manner Yeah, especially yeah on one road more so than the other one All right Yeah, so let me turn that over now. Is that working? No, that's why it's oh, I think all the other ones All right, that's a balloon. It's just that one. That must be all the bulbs are out. Really? Yeah, she's pulling me new electrician That was on last time I don't I didn't think so. I thought they were all out last time. I don't think so Gonna find out he'll start flipping switches and we'll see Oh, hey You go ahead. What was the deal I flipped the switch on the bottom. Oh, are they on dimmers give me the emerald dimmer Someone had a dimmer all week $150 just to do the Miranda switch. Uh, yeah switches. We're not oh, they're on but not There you go. You have light. Thank you. Yeah, I was wondering. I was sitting here going That's what I was thinking. Oh my god. It's too dark. I know exactly. Oh my god Oh, no Sunshine All right now that we can see we'll continue on here So we'll just uh continue on with our uh discussion in regards to kind of going through the police budget As well as trees had thrown in there some heating oil options Yep, and town hall. I had done the town. Well, because there was instead of talk about especially with the town officials um So I did the town officials town hall constable budget um So if you want to serve the top town officials I see the um, what was the oil one? Uh, um, I had written. Oh that uh, yeah, it's in your thing. Yeah All right, so I don't what do you want to start with budgets? I don't want to just do the heat and oil pieces. Sure feel one first. Yeah, so I had Spoken to see the oil regarding diesel gas and heating oil prices and Currently our agreement is that we pay 15 cents over rack price for diesel 25 cent over rack for gas and 0.438 over rack for heating fuel um They are currently offering us a heating oil pre-buy at either 469 to 470 gallon But with our existing rack price deal on the 8th Our price was at 4028 a gallon and um, so I did had a good conversation with charlie And at cb oil and he said boy when this started trees. He said it was I finally went to changing my price daily and when he used to have the ability to buy smaller quantities of Of fuel or you know, and when this came about He could no longer do that So they actually put him in a position where he ended up having to buy like over a hundred thousand gallons And he'd been getting a lot of pressure from people to do a pre-buy pre-buy pre-buy and then so he bought and Then three weeks later Try to exchange So he was so I did talk to him about it and I just asked him what his crystal ball looked like and I said my gut says to stay with rack price but I told him that I would ask Yeah, the the only thing my crystal ball I would like to see is who's going to be elected in november Yeah Well the well mine's just not that good the indications on the energy markets Anyways, is that it's going to continue to go down and stabilize So that's you know, and I work in the energy market all day So that's kind of what we're preparing for and spring is going to be cheaper than now And I would say if rack price is cheaper now Yeah, then I mean of course that can all change in right one night, right? I mean something happens somewhere in the world, right? Right, but I would say right now just looking at it. I mean the rack price right now is what 60 cents cheaper Yeah for us to stay the way we are gas is higher than at the pump, but he's But he said that's buying albany that people he said i'm having a hard time and with any even branched out to get more distributors, but So yeah, my gut How reliable that is so stay with rack, but I figured out You're trying to predict the future in any case a lot of the a lot of the convolution of the energy crisis has Subsided most I know we point the finger at certain things, but yeah most of it was you know, there was That people don't know is that there was a refinery that had caught fire Um down in louisian area right prior to cobin. Yeah, so oh, I remember it reduced our capacity to refine Certain fuels in the United States and then very soon after we had cobin, which then Right, we reduced that as well with percentage of working forces being able to to work And even though energy and gas was a Um Mandated one, you know, you still had a lot of you know Half capacities or whatever So all that snowballed and you had all the other things that had jumped on top of that And they had said by by this fall the energy was going to come down Anyway, it's just due to the capacity to start to come back online So, but I mean again, I mean it's If I could predict that thing I wouldn't be sitting here Right Dave no doubt Sorry, all right, so I would say the math right now makes sense that we you know 60 cents less on the You know, it seems to make that Yeah, like I said gals price are we empty? When we fill our fuel tank, how much do we buy at a time? Uh for I can't I couldn't answer the question off top of my I'd have to look at an invoice I don't know diesel we get two deliveries a year. Yeah, so say to um two big deliveries for diesel But um as far as heating oil I you know during the year They keep us topped off and then I don't Remember as far as if we got it's probably pretty often probably once a month or something like that Yeah, yeah heating fuel for sure the gas price right now that we're getting charged is exorbitant But the only one spending it is the constable so um because the fire has very little gas as does the town but um Morgan will most likely he told me beginning of diesel delivery. I think it's october and then he's usually good to the spring Yep, that's another good reason to stay with rack. Yep. All right. I just wanted to Make sense to me. I remember okay. I remember when the opaque folks put us in crisis Long time ago Yeah It was in New Hampshire and yes 50 years ago Price gas went up to a dollar a gallon and I had people who couldn't afford to go to work And then I happened to have to go to texas for something down there. It was 30 cents Wow Yeah, because that's where the refining is sure absolutely and it just Made my blood boil And so, you know rightfully so So the budget I had we start with town officials at the top So I know at least I these are the price I put in as far as the select board you guys can decide what you want trustees of public funds Was used to just go to one person The 250 was always just paid to care. I'll catch them because he did everything um, so I don't know We had gone to 600. I don't know if you want to stay at that as far as 200 each um Then health officer um I spoke to Chuck davis and he said in three months. He'd spent maybe eight hours So I just up to 10 and he's said that he's going to keep track of his hours and let kelly know um And then elections. I left the same obviously Cemetery commissioner, I up to the price agreed on Fire warden we'd at 600, but I don't know what you want to do now that you have deputies. So In the fight of medis calculated based on the You know the numbers so Uh, I know this is something that you wanted to look at so Here you go And I mean it and again until we're able to like see all the departments Together because we don't know where we're landing at right overall total dollar or four cents per you know um, I mean, I guess one thing that I would have here is You know, I obviously would like to see us do as much as we can for the Pointed positions that we have available that makes sense You know before like myself or something like that. I that's my feeling on it, but I just just Dave just agrees I was thinking like just trying to get people like somewhat motivated to want to do something to be a part of it and um So we can we obviously have you know, once we see the whole budget then we'll be able to see a little more of Can we do more or can we do less? What makes sense? I'll give you something to think about I guess so Was it 1.8 or 1.6 million budget?  Oh, no, I agree. I'm just yeah So I mean, I guess for now like I would suggest to start thinking about the uh, we're going to have deputy fire marshals or fire wardens Yeah I mean the job is still the job was does he not able to do the job? So you need the assistance or he just needs them because he might not be available I think it's more of a training like it's a health issue going forward, you know What I'm saying is if the job is worth six hundred dollars, I don't care if you got ten people They just get 60 bucks. Right. Yeah, that's what I'm saying So, I mean, I don't I don't know what the fire warden does Oh, so firewood warden issues all the burn permits and if there's any Calls about you know fires or illegal burning the fire warden has to go You know investigate all those they can take samples. So those samples of someone's burning trash They're the they can go investigate. Um, they can issue Tickets municipal tickets for someone who's you know burning illegally But they manage all that the chances are not all three of them are going to go anywhere It's only one person doing the job. It's it's the the fire warden is gary coogler and But because of circumstances beyond his control he wanted a couple of deputies so that if he was unable to we had The duties were being fulfilled. Do we have any type of like knowledge of how many hours I can ask him because I know we're trying to like Rebalance that and I don't want to take away, but I'm just no I'm I'm spitting out things to think about Let me Special Yeah, he did that's right. I can email gary and ask him how many permits he issued You know since he's been I mean, maybe we're nowhere near enough money. We know we weren't in Cecil We're not even I don't think 1500 is enough. Yeah, and he was happy so we I'll email gary and ask him But I would tend to this you know to agree with dave is if the position Is a certain appointed You know then regards to how big your umbrella is, you know, that would be you know, I guess I'd be like if there was an assistant by our select board chair then I don't know But Right We do need the budget for that. Don't we I mean that was my thought but I I don't know Let me email gary and get some information from him As to estimate of time, you know, it takes for you and then you could possibly use the same salary based number that you used for the health officer for the fire warden So let me email gary I know you're not I'm just asking the question. I know that's a good question But it's a good one to have is If somebody does have deputies or underneath them is what are we going to do for that? Do we keep it as a It's a flat sort of the whole thing or the whole all right. Yeah, let me ask No, that's a fair question for his opinion, too If he's how does he feel about stipends for his deputy so he's Well, you all know gary. He's great. So we'll ask him I'll ask him if I can And the tree warden is very new and I'm not sure but at this point that she's been called on to do anything So in the town hall piece Oh, I'm sorry. No, okay. I want to jump to her head Town hall piece he had The building repair you know More times than not two a couple of years ago We had more in the building repair because we were trying to do pieces of the wall Something with that. No a building repair. It's not like it's the $4,000 for building repair Is that is that going towards something that we already have planned out or that's just a filler in case we need it or It includes um, we pay someone to clean the building. It includes our $1,500 From tasco and then if there's anything say something broke and we needed it fixed, you know If we had to pay for lighting Okay, uh Furnace, you know repair that type of thing. I think you originally had six thousand. I think Something about the clock was budgeted for for a while, but we weren't using the money Um It's really awful because I'm sure that there's parts of this building that could use repainting or well That's why I was getting at like is this a it's I had but it is um A request that we got something in mind that we want to do. No, this is tasco Building as you can see we spent 3500 last year. We spent 1,300 um As last year if I'd updated that number, I think I did um, but So again, it's uh, we both we also had to use it or lose it to well We weren't using it either because of covet. Nobody was using it. So we weren't having to pay somebody to clean it um So That's the I like to have a little bit of cushion in there just in case You know, we maybe there's a seal. Oh, actually no and there will be because dave aldergetti is going to repair Where it was leaking we had a roof leak and I had that repaired by bob conif I'm actually the he hasn't sent me a bill yet because the sleeve around the um Exhaust on this side had leaked and so dave aldergetti came in and and I had him go look at he's gonna go up and repair that So the 4000 He doesn't get to it over the winter which will come out of our current year budget But those are the only that's the only repair I have and then bob put a new I guess while we're on the topic is what are we We probably don't have any type of maintenance plan for this building Not so if something I'll make it up heating related or something large related does that come out of the capital reserve Fun or you probably take it out of the capital building if we didn't have money in this budget Um, is the town hall committee still an active committee or no? No What's the status of this building in terms of weatherization? They when they redid the building They did not insulate upstairs antique Because it was source. They actually did not when we Redid another hall in another town same choice was made because of historical preservation My understanding is that bethle accepted historical preservation money and with that comes Copyouts we turn the heat, you know way down up here Um, but they I believe that the downstairs may have been insulated. I think the downstairs is fine And then you had uh the doors were obviously the windows and stuff were re I don't know if you're single pane or reglaze Which they have but but there's certain things that That you're not allowed to do it depends on I don't know the parameters in which you accepted money But um a lot of times It's very difficult to insulate these old buildings and Not through the lack of use that they get I guess that they You're not the only town that had made decisions to not do that To not insulate I'm just wondering should we have some sort of we should have Schedule of maintenance for this building so that all of a sudden We don't get hit with a big bill like We do yep, they were just in and inspected and did some repairs Um, yes, we have them inspected and cleaned and maintained every year I'm just wondering like should we Surely have money like I'll make it up. Yeah $10,000 a year in a fund that well, we do have accumulates over time So that we can take care of some of these big purchases when they come around in 10 15 20 years And we do we have a capital building fund and what we don't have I have a slight schedule for it And you guys have seen it before it was I think it was a town calling any I not yet because I've no one had mentioned anything about here But that's a good idea because I don't know I mean we've taken care of you know If we have a new plumber we hire him electrician You know Dave had done Stuff and then Dave and Paul and mo I think all got all the staging in here and placed all the lights and I know it becomes Yeah More difficult decision than just okay go fix that and do that because we have to follow some of the preservation A guideline possibly. Yeah, I don't I would have to see what you accepted for money I don't know but your answer is no there's no insulation up here I would I suggest that we get An energy audit of the building and that we look into what the possibilities are So my question is why? We we don't hold town meeting here. We don't have Big meetings here. We don't you do you know, some people sometimes the meeting space downstairs is used more I really wonder when your payback would ever Well, there's probably because there's going to be bocu dollars available to do it that we wouldn't have to pay for Oh, okay That's that's part of the deal. Okay Well, yeah, well that might be the first What can we do? We don't know that we can do anything if we accepted historical Preservation money. I don't know what maybe why it didn't get done I don't know what you accepted it for I would like to have that looked at in terms of current the current cultural issues Regarding energy I can email Caitlyn corkins at the state because she does I think she does the store preservation program I could ask her to look back What if that will accept money for? When does that run out like maybe? Sometimes when you get money like that, you can't do something for a few years But I'll make a note to email Caitlyn corkins Right and and what's changed. Yeah, because I There simply may be changes because everybody and their brother is trying to cut down on Well, I'm assuming I'm assuming some things that can be done without needing any it would be like I don't even know but you know LED lighting You know, I mean like that could be something that we could do but without needing preservation Guidelines, so if that's already in there, that's one thing but but it might be best to figure out What are our options with the building? Like what can we do and then if If that is okay, then we then we could at least we need to we need to put our Well, we might want to think just a little bit bigger Jean and you know rather than just energy audit this building if we were going to do that Why wouldn't we do you know the town office and our all the town buildings and energy audit and I mean which we only have just this and the This in the office. I mean the fire department. Oh, I wouldn't eat by the garage. I mean the garage is Well, right, but but again the Last last legislature adopted a law that provide or adopted provides funds for Communities to do the it to do the audits to do the assessments the feasibility Was that the one that they passed legislation said we could borrow money from their energy revolving loan fund No, there's some of a lot of that's going to be grants. Okay technical advice All of that and it will include energy conversion Yeah, because I remember the maybe it was the first iteration of that because I remember But I'll only not take one fork and she's chilled able to tell us what that will accept of money for what it probably won't be And then we'll we'll find out But I do think that it's that we should be thinking about what What we need right And and what will be available to do Yeah, I'll I'll ask her because I wasn't here when you read at the town hall. So I don't I just I wouldn't either. Yeah, that's why I'm asking the question, but I can't I'll find out. Hey, I don't know tell us why you couldn't Insulate the attic I don't know or maybe it was in the wall. I'm not really sure even even within the walls. I don't I don't know I don't know well here, especially you have the brick You know outside overlays. I have no idea, but we'll find out. She's she's excellent. She'll tell us So on the console one, if this looks like The meantime, you're just trying to manipulate Yeah, I'm trying to give our budget to be kind of similar to an option if we did contract out to like Right, so if you look at the proposed budget f y 23 4 column You'll see and then on the that came out to 77 208 and then if you look at the right That's me saying, okay here. We did the contract 60, you know, it's currently 60 hours 60 cents a mile So I went to 63 an hour at 65 cents a mile because the current sheriff did say that the price might go up So the the budget that we're in currently We had priced 57 the sign The boards Have did we purchase those? The 15800 yeah, no not yet. I got pricing and it had gone up quite a bit and So I was trying to so I've got a second quote It's actually on my desk and at the same time we had discussed I believe So those boards were gonna go replace the We were gonna get two more boards to go in two different sections of town Like we have by the school and by um, mascoma drive through We were getting two more of those and a portable speed cart And the portable ski speed car price when we coded it had been like 8800 and now it was close to 10 grand So I was looking at so what so this this 15 that's in this budget. What is that one for? Well, it would be I was hoping to purchase a couple more of those um You know signs and I don't remember if it was You'll have to care. I don't remember if it was here at the select board meeting Or if I was at a better connections meeting But we talked about I feel like it was here, but we talked about this kind of speed bumps slowing people down on main street Um, those was that here Lindley was talking about how it was in jericho that yeah So I also was just reached out to a vendor to get pricing about that So well that's going to be done by a pavement outfit. Well, these are actually um permanent or rubber And rubberized and I don't see you take them off in the winter. I think that you could I was I got the information and so it's on the stock on my desk, but We need more of the Speed signs we only have a couple and we talked about doing you know multiple entries in different places throughout towns So the just take I'm just trying to wrap and oh signage too. We also have to replace some other Sorry, so I was just I just drew it in as a placeholder. So unless I missed it. So I think our Goal our goal was to have some sort of Speed signage on the four legs of the village, right? Right and we only have it on two we currently had two right And the two that we have in the budget right now was to finish the four legs, right? Right, but then we talked about doing You know more in places like on church street in different places where people were speeding more kind of To slow them down as they entered the village Or I mean we don't have one at the entrance of river street. We you know things like that and we have one When you get to the drive-through, but we don't have one say before the town office But honestly, I put it in as a placeholder because I don't know what's coming out of better connections That's fine. I mean it's like so I just I was just curious of what that Was so we can look at it, but and I'm still getting priced So the piece the 158 that we had budgeted and what would you say approximately? The the hardware is going to cost now It's obviously going to be over more. Yeah a little more right now I was kind of waiting to see if I could find a different vendor Right for the speed car because it was 8800 and it went up to about almost 10 10 and then and then that was just for the speed card, right? And that that wasn't for the other two the other two those are normally like five or six grand Yeah, well, I think we got them for I think we got them for under well Do we got a pair last year? No, we got them last year for the 68 24. I think that was so right now Yeah, we're 158 is more like 17,000 or something. I know Okay, all right But I mean it's not like we don't have the money in the budget because the constable is not going to spend his hours, but no, I was just trying to figure out what what more we had So no and I so I found a second vendor for the speed car And I was going to ask Oscar or Morgan if they had an opinion about You know either one so So just change if we could find it and then so so if So if we ended up going to an option of Let's say the Windsor county We would have to find animal control So that would at that point I guess we would have to think would that be an appointed position Or would we hire that out or how how would we you could do that? You could appoint a dog warden or you could hire him. I mean and then because some places in the state had Companies that did that I looked through the vlct salary survey to come up with the 19 Dollars 1950 an hour and the 30 hours a week I came up with using how many animal calls Oscar had responded to and then assigned them two hours each Just as a okay. Well, I was just kind of looking at like Make it up fire warden thinking that maybe the animal control person the fire warden would have Similar time out and about so ones a thousand where ones 500 so that the thousand was for three people This was No, I'm just okay. That and that's what I said in my that's I mean, I'm just Guestimating at the animal control, but that's how we how I did I had Kelly look at how many calls Oscar had in a year The bottom line on those I I see I don't see enough difference Between 77 and 79 thousand to To justify the lack of service Right and and if you look at mine, I have to say the 77 is a pipe dream. Oh, like that would be like Now that would be like if Oscar And Justin were able to devote that exact time we want right now. Yeah, that's what we said we want That's the service we want And also too, yeah So, but I think we're really making a jump from 57 To 76 Right. Yeah, because I it's about $20,000 jump is what we're proposing because I budgeted 20 hours a week at 25 an hour Which is more than the consoles are making now, but we know the competition is high But currently the two guys do not receive Retirement so I did budget the 5800 for retirement just because I wasn't sure um You know it depended where the person worked and then I also said okay if we had a new officer then I doubled the uniform budget. I doubled the gas um I doubled the equipment because we get to take advantage of the fact that they work for other agencies So they maybe have their own tasers have their own stuff So but it's kind of a guesstimate. Um, and the odds that we find someone to work the 20 hours are probably But I'm just yeah, but you're right They're negligible. I was surprised if we project out what we might reasonably be Looking for yeah, this is the number regardless of what we've been spending if we're going to increase that pay We're talking the ballpark. It's the same. Yeah. Well, everybody I've talked to well in law enforcement said, you know 8200,000 to have A person on duty to do what what we typically do in today's current climate right there right in the ballpark Either way and I think our thing is really more Numbers right now not so much What our policing is going to be because we don't know all of our options yet, you know, I mean like Like we don't know what's going to happen at the sheriff's department until after the Yeah, the November election, you know, they could get a new sheriff or there could be a different direction or Yep, but if we can get a number that Makes sense that we can go one way or the other and still You know, yeah, you could build your budget around 80,000 and the challenge we're going to have is if we go to the voters with I think anyways the challenge is if we go to the voters with 77 79,000 versus the 50 some odd thousand I don't know though because the majority of the responders wanted an increase in police To that I know but we haven't definitely given, you know, no, I know that decision hasn't been made, you know I'm just playing doubles advocate You know what we did go up and we go to town meeting and they say well The increase is for you know, and we can't say at that point. Well, we're definitely going this route It could you know instead we're saying well We're thinking about either filling it in with, you know, Windsor County or if we can hire A person, you know to do Yeah, you're still the same price range. Yeah, and obviously we can get into all the details after that, but Yeah, and it's interesting too because I think I told you outlined in the town The report where the one with the packet was that, you know, the Oscar obviously will take some call answer some phone calls things like that Which the sheriff's office won't do and they have very specific Hours in which they patrol. I did ask the current sheriff if he'd be willing to do some nights Because you know, we have a bar in town and Activities in the evening at times and he said they might but I think he kind of leaves that up to Basically the who's the deputy see who of course if we did go to Windsor County, let's say then we would have to talk about you know, what do we want to do with the Equipment that we have do we want to keep it sell it? You know, I mean I guess sell it because you wouldn't want to at that point. They might be one buy it Yeah sitting garage and rot Exactly. Um, and two is you know, as we talk about or heaven. There's a transfer of liability as well you know, the thing is once the the Yeah, and professional liability and training and there's some new stuff coming out from the criminal justice training council and You know right now we assume we we are lucky because we know that the Rutland County Sheriff's Office and the Royalton and Royalton police are making sure the officers are trained and meeting those If we hire someone that worked for us solely We have to make sure that they are adhering to all these things and yeah, they're so short like We can't even find them to go on the road to do Patrols with us right now. Yeah, we have a night job going right now in the blue lights that normally You it's not mandatory, but you have blue lights at night Sure. No, and and that is one thing that can't get them that the current sheriff said was that you know Their busy times as as for Windsor County that they're trying to pick up. Yeah, you know as much because the When we pay county tax it doesn't include the cost of the sheriff's office. So It was an interesting conversation. Anyways, so So that's how I got to those numbers And Good jumping off point Shocking on yeah, well, that's it. No, and it kind of is you know, when you look at it, so I'm just But Anyway, so let's see Leave him in there. See what it all looks like.  It was like it was big like the second one is coming And I'm like, what we get more or is that is just so that was stuff that we had already gotten So that it's part of this so our 583 was one and two Right, exactly. Yeah, because we knew we were gonna we knew we I know you did. Yeah, you were like But the way they in the article I read they phrased it as though like there's more money coming I know I felt a little bad. So I'm thinking tree. So we get more money. You're like exactly So So no So, um, yeah, no, sorry. I didn't hey, have you gotten any more warm and fuzzies on what? Like with some of this money that we have left like can we use it as match money towards I did I Federal I did do that grant or something or so I talked to um or your money, right? I wrote I wrote to um The program managers that we had for the grants that we have so we can Use it as match for pretty much all of our v-trans. I wasn't sure about like the bike pad Grant so I put it on that spreadsheet, which you don't have but the v-trans grants Okay, um, we but you don't know about the ped one. No, we kid. Yeah, he him. Oh, you can't yep by head I talked to v-trans Some of the grants too on that list. We'd already paid the match for Like better connections. We'd already paid the match for out of budget. Um, a couple of them. We'd already paid The better roads grants we can use Um We can use the ARPA for match so So the only one the only question mark would be the earmarked money, right? Right. We cannot use the match for Um, I don't believe we'll be able to use the match for FEMA for our e-raff But Right. I need to ask. I have to ask him kanareki. No e-raff. I don't think so, but I don't know for sure And then the question mark is on the earmark one. Well we had The earmark match. I'm hoping to make up out of our state When we get the state money, um From them the portion of that is federal so they don't allow us to use some of it is 100 percent Some of it's like 75 percent. So we I think that we'll be able to be pretty close in covering our Match for this earmark with state funds. Okay So because I did ask Permission It sounds like we wouldn't but it sounds like we wouldn't want to use that match towards Towards the next water phase because that may put us in a different It'll it will category for funding and stuff. We won't get any aid So I was waiting the auditors are coming next month.  So since it's income Replacement then you could use it for anything you wanted. I wrote to her and said look I we deposited in the general fund. I just tracked it separately another fund So I asked her two-part question. She only answered one part which Basically what we could really do to just Clean the whole thing up is put on the warning in march and say We have x amount of dollars left. This is what the select board wants to use it for and just let everybody vote on it So I am waiting for an answer a second an answer to the second part of my question from sarah or to ask the auditors Because last time I talked to him When rick came in july they were waiting on some Guidance from the feds. Well, I think I think the feds don't even know what you can use somebody towards You know, my concern is the other thing is or we just take this four hundred and sixteen thousand dollars. We decide Whatever we're going to dump it into the roads and or Pay up if we do that then When we put everything out to bid we're still going through the rfp process So we've adhered to all the regulations and the strings that could have come attached to it. So I guess what's your plan? Are you thinking about holding it and just paying all the match and not doing extra work? No, I'm just trying to get my head around what all of our options are And then again like I what how do we best position that money because again like We wouldn't want to put it towards something and lose potential funding because we got put in a different category or level It's true But and we've had plenty of you know public input. I mean a lot of people were Very upset last year after I think we need to put it into the roads It's going to put us ahead of the game and we could bid contracts But I'm not talking about like FEMA repairs where we were just going in and fixing the damage I'm talking fine segments of roads that are really bad in doing a rebuild from Underdrain up just like we're going to do on a christian hill as part of the paving ran With the remaining Exactly and not But you know, no, no, right just blow my house, right? I'm saying kick when I grade they scraped lunch Yeah, and That's that's you know, still my belief is that you know We've we've had this on every agenda and um, so I'll have more guidance from you for That but you we talked about making a decision in september But you could decide that you just are going to put it on town meeting and Make a decision that I don't kind of want to wait that long just because I want to get everything out if we're going to do road work I want to get it out to bid sooner, but I really want to keep some of it and maybe a good pretty good hunk for the Better connections thing Well, remember you we first of all we have no idea exactly what I we've been told that better connections We're going to be able to qualify for more grant money Or give me get more points so we will qualify for more grants or put us in a better position At first it was we're going to get more grants now as we get more points We don't know what's coming out of that. You have to have the money obligated by what 2024 And You know some of that stuff that's going to come out of better connections are Ideas they're not like fully flushed out plans and So I don't know. I mean and then they just extended the grant. So I'm not sure we're going to even have answers By town meeting. So I don't know. We'll have to I'll have to ask our next better connections meeting Because they just did an extension And we can only hold it, you know That was the meeting that I missed I personally think we've got a bunch of stuff that we let go That needs to be caught up. I mean Not against better connections, but you want to move forward, but You haven't fixed us behind you yet Yeah, and I tell you we have we are drastically horribly bad on taking care of our roads And if we could put it out You know we and everybody else I didn't say I didn't say it wasn't everybody else, but I think we got losses on on these roads with kids in the winter And they're their drivers are people who are used to driving in their little Prius And they throw them in the bus I think my only suggestion would be I'm game for Wherever we put the money other than I wouldn't want to see it be put into something that's going to revolve Yearly so like I wouldn't want to see us create a new position No, I mean I something like that that they agree with that make it up two or three years down the road Now you have to make a decision You know the money's dried up. Are you going to keep the position or you're going to increase your tax base? Right for that. So I I wouldn't wouldn't make any suggestions on anything that's going to be No ongoing. That's why you made a good choice on like like a one time or You got your 40 years so that those sewer rates didn't go up. So right but anyways, I will So anyways, we I'm just still waiting for an email from sarah macy to answer my second question, but um So what's on the agenda it'll be on again for next time Anything left on the manager's report that we didn't get to Let's see that all you did. Oh, yes, we have to talk about the shooting range um so Dave Griffin god bless him is Did a great job, but he was done as of september 1 He brought in the 700 dollars that they'd collected you put that in the general fund But we currently have no volunteers to oversee it. I gave you a sample Of the sign that I'm having made to put down there And we put out a front porch form and facebook post obviously rebecca Sandborn someone had emailed us some information that came out During you know another process. So she got some information I think from better connections, which was helpful So So how many trips does one have to make over there before they become like the defaulted Foreman because I made three in like a week and a half every time you hear bang bang I I drive over and one time I got there. Nobody was there. Yeah, and then and then two times I one gentleman that That I know that uses the range often. That's really good about everything and the other one was somebody that had been And Here visiting family and was taken advantage of the range that kind of had to just go with the So did the gentleman who is Normally there was did he interested in being on? Well, they all say, oh, I don't know. Let me think about it. I know and I I think if it wasn't You know, we were spoiled. So I've run over there anytime. I hear something going on now if I'm available, but What dick Adams did was amazing He devoted his whole day I mean every day if he heard it he was down there and we're not going to find that So my hope is if we could find a few people So somebody could take one day and one another and it wasn't such a burden and You know would be nice. So But so far We've had a couple people call We've answered some questions and they haven't called back And I saw some of the french port front porch forum pieces Yeah You know, I trying to get it off I mean, I and that yeah, I mean without opening the whole canal over again. It's yeah, I think ideally Even before whatever it was Seven years ago when we talked about this um You know ideally if we had a nice piece of property outside of town Would be where we'd like to do it and I think we've all understand that we don't have that piece of property and the safest Best available piece that we do have is the current piece that we're at right Because the other thought too was the concern of if we closed it down then people will Be shooting they're not going to stop, you know target practicing things They're going to go off and be more off to be at home where maybe not as the safe of a place or Those were kind of the arguments before um, and and we had you know, we had one gentleman that was You know That you may not find again that you know took took care of that place, you know, um, and you didn't have to worry about it so I mean, I don't So, I don't know so we'll see I see the pros and cons to it I mean, I know there's it's hard because it's bats everything and I'm just figuring you know what if it's vandalized again Eventually somebody's going to call and and tell us that you know because Skip and Dave repaired it So it was everything was in good, but this has been and I typically, you know most times So in two weeks, I've been over there three times and I heard gun shooting And that was that I've only heard three times in two weeks I mean, I hear I'll time just because my windows open I can hear but so we're going to put the signs down there In hopes that you know one where the rules are and the kiosk and one on the gate when you walk in Um, you know people ignore the no-shot gun, but hopefully maybe they'll read this one. Um, and see I don't know. It's it's just High usage Going to be siting in for rifle season I mean, I know this opens up a whole nother of the cantalumns But when I was over there the other day I got thinking and with all the technology that we have like Couldn't we just like at my house like I have those little our low cameras that I can Go on my phone and I can look at them right now like At home, you know, well, we like couldn't you just put a little camera up there? We don't want to kind of looks at the range at least so that I'll just make it up that And you can have it so that can be cloud based so You could have a couple of people in your community that have access to that Yeah, so, you know, I mean so you don't have to necessarily drive over there, you know Yeah, I want to see what was going on or Or they you know, they do record You know once there's a movement they do record So if there wasn't anything you can go back through and look but then I know it gets under like Surveillance and things like that and I think we could because we put signs of the saying the cameras But there's not a great place there We've obviously tried other places in town and people you know take them shoot them out But I did talk to Richard about putting one on the water on the pumps, you know Well house right there because they have wi-fi. They have electric They have so you could at least get the comings and going so you could get plate numbers and see people and you know So if it was vandalized we could get ideas for a time frame With you know vehicles coming and going but as far as placing them there I mean you just ask it for people to shoot them out on the range, but across the street We have power and wi-fi No, I just had one of that when I drove over a few times. So I don't know Dave's thinking about being the if you're gonna be that far away You're gonna have a very expensive camera to do what you want to do. Yeah and number two these I'm probably very very pessimistic But someone's going to know that they're and they're going to start shooting at the water place Yeah, instead of the other which is shooting towards town. Yeah, because we did talk about mine And that's maybe not a good idea either. Yeah I know It's just it that that whole thing is I mean to be honest with you what you do is you do what Place up in my library did you have a indoor shooting range that is manned Five days a week or six days a week business or is it run by the state? It's a business Nice. Yeah, and I think you've started to see a few of those popping up I think rumor had it there was one going in somewhere in the upper valley area But the thing that always like when I hear shooting down at the pit here I don't ever nothing ever comes to my mind like bells and alarms But I do have somebody that has taken an interest of shooting on north main street And I know because I drove by that residence that the only way they're shooting is My way, so when I hear them going then I'm thinking they're not shooting into a bank or anything You know and that and that's the fear that I have is you know, even though it's I don't know make it up Three quarters a mile from my house to that residence You know that's kind of an unsafe to act but Where the sand head at least There can always be that one person or two people that don't obey the rules of just being Gun owners, but Majority people when you go there you do see that they're safe practices They might need an education on some of the rules of our establishment, but So I don't know so for right now, I guess we're just you know, we're People are checking out as they can and we're Still looking for people so it's been on front porch forum and facebook and You know we're having signs made so hopefully we get it So um, the only thing I had is did you get my email with my contract? Yeah, okay, we need to talk about that. So if I just ignore I mean we're all good, right? I'm ever well. I just wasn't sure what you want to do. Is that the way it works? What I asked was if you wanted to do if you just renews automatically, right? I don't think it says that no I just wondered if yeah, you said october. Yeah, I had forgot I came Yeah, so I just wasn't sure if you Wanted it sent to the town attorney just in case you thought something had changed or whatever I don't know we'll figure it out, but I just want to like make sure you got the email I think for the right to get in yeah, I think we would it would May be difficult. I don't know about you'd have to fence that entire have you been there There's no fence. There's only like that little game.  I don't even know how you'd anchor It's pretty steep up to the and I don't know if we could I have the email into a and r about the pit as it is so I don't know outside the fence outside the gate Yeah, some people. I mean I I don't know but the people I've seen over there have been pretty responsible Who is going in it gives you a time that they were there right And it gives you a place to start sure we would just I'm just saying we have it's not Fenced so we would have to completely contain it somehow Um, if you haven't been there drive over and and you can pull in and walk out and then you can kind of get The topography is tricky. I'm not saying it can't be done. I know I And Yeah, I'm just trying to think of it. No, no, I don't think I That may be better than a camera. Yeah In terms of who's there? Who is it? Right? Yeah, I'm hoping whoever Got that out of their system and so we'll see but you're right. I mean you're and you're going to see Certainly responsible gun owners are going to be their sighting and rifles So that also may discourage Because hunting season, you know people are going to start soon sighting and rifles so So how do we want to do the contract piece of it? Should we put something on the agenda for next Meeting for executive session do it in october I think we should do it. I know but our next meeting is the 26 right? I know but i'm not going to have had a chance to go through it to read it again And I think you and I could talk about it. Don't worry. We all said So maybe we should just have a conversation next week about it And sit down and look at it together and see and then Certainly As you're right as I said to you is if you want to send it to the town attorney I can give you a name and you can do that So if you want something else to look at I don't think anything has changed I think we're really just looking at the time frame and the possibility of changing the notification from 90 days to something else So But I figure we can handle it Or or we could you know we could put it on the the agenda for maybe You know a motion to allow myself to negotiate with you for a contract or something like that or whatever We're going to be a part of the conversation. I would like to see the contract sometime before Of course to discuss it And I think what we've Overall what we've talked about is more of a a year-to-year contract Yeah, we're two years. Yeah, typically it's a three-year contract But three years means what like Any point she'd give us 90 or in the past, you know Last time we had, you know Yeah, so all so we're talking about doing a yearly a yearly Yeah, and it may be like 18 months. We got to kind of figure that notification out because I mean obviously right now it's 90 days and so we'll we'll look at three years notification Yeah, exactly three years. That's right. So we're the one-year contract I'm so dazed You were you were already on this like we're ranking so I would assume you guys all have the original contract, but I'll send it to you If I do I have the one that you and I signed. Yeah If I do I probably would take me longer to find it. Okay, I'll make sure you have it Okay, and I'll put that on the next agenda The school board paperwork was like this high, but this is only this high. Yeah So I'm all set with the timing. Okay Uh select board meeting minutes from the 22nd changes to them or we Or if not a motion to approve Move to approve as printed Okay, all in favor. All right. All right. Nice have it spot here Um, other communications or some pool statistics that was in there. Yep. Um, we did have um I just wanted to just make sure I'm not going to go into depth with it, but um We had talked about the last board I had brought up the last board meeting about the More specifically the ADA accessibility on church street with vehicles parking on the sidewalk so, um, so treason treason the office had sent out um some information to um The local well, I'll say the church is because there's no businesses on that street I've just you know talking to people about um, not blocking the sidewalk and and You know, let's try to keep the cars off it and So we we did receive one One, um communication back, which I think the individual might have been slightly confused on why we had issued it So it more went into like Uh, this person went into more of uh The harm that it would do to the sidewalk, um, which there's harm that is done to it But more specifically we had asked it was to clear to give the option like I saw that day You know, you had people parked on the sidewalk and then you had a person in a motorized Um wheelchair That was having to go down the street rather than on the sidewalk So that was just so that we have that cleared up that was the And it said that the reason for it and we had addressed that It also deteriorates the sidewalk and yes, we understand that clown in the sidewalks There's times where the blade sinks in and there's There's wear and tear to that too. I understand that but the biggest thing was the 88 compliance piece. So So hopefully anybody that Is able to watch the meeting or get the notes they can Uh, maybe if we you know, maybe in the um The minutes if we can make that piece a little bit more detailed that it was more of the 88 compliance piece Um, so that everybody knows Sound likes a lot of people didn't understand that so Other than that, uh, and terry said, uh Sent us the post there the legal notice of the Oh, the way I put it that was the cemetery will That the cemetery was changed and we put an add in saying they had to be up And I had I had the question there the follow-up but brian had hit it on the flower how that went So it sounds like so it's good. It sounds like it was favorable. So So that's good Anything else to come before the board? All right, just need a motion to adjourn All favor Good night ellie. Thank you Yeah, I mean it's it sounds like that's a that was a good win-win with the With the um artificial flowers, it seemed like yeah, if if individuals did go out of their way to make sure they were picked up I mean, you're gonna have those. Yeah couple that maybe Well, I keep thought maybe on a memorial day that left and didn't come back, but yeah sounded pretty favorable. So that's good Worked through that. So so we had You heard did you hear him? Oh good? I wasn't sure I was like