Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the December 19th meeting of the Town of Arlington Redevelopment Board. I'd like to call this meeting to order. My name is Rachel Zembery. I'm the chair. I'd like to introduce our other board members. We have Steve Revillac, Melissa Tentacolas, Jean Benson, Kim Lau, and also joining us this evening. We have the director of the Department of Planning and Community Development, Claire Ricker. So thank you so much for joining us this evening. We have a packed set of public hearings this evening. So let's go ahead and move to agenda item number one. Before we do so, I'd like to let everybody know that we are recording this tonight for ACMI and just wanted to let you all know that that is occurring. So we'll go ahead and take open our first public hearing, which is docket number 3729 for 645 Massachusetts Avenue. What I'd like to do is turn it over first to Claire Ricker, who will provide some introduction on behalf of the Department of Planning and Community Development, then I'll turn it over to the applicant who will have up to 10 minutes for an introductory presentation. We'll then have the board pose any questions or comments that we might have opening this up for public comment and then we'll return back to the board for deliberation and discussion of next steps. All right, so with that, I'd like to turn it over to Claire Ricker. Thank you. So this is a proposal and application filed by Tate Bakery to open a location at 645 Mass Ave, which is the old Not Your Average Shows site on the corner. I think if there's anything to point out about this application, use is the same as the previous. There's been a restaurant in this location for several years. The applicant is requesting relief for parking and is willing to provide some other forms of parking, some other bike parking areas. They're looking to update the existing facade. I think the staff is making a recommendation that any short-term bike parking potentially be located on Mass Ave. They're also looking for some relief related to signage and this project will also be subject to historic review potentially by the Historic Commission as it is listed on the inventory of historic significant properties in the town of Browns. Good, thank you. Thank you very much. So who do we have representing is that your attorney and I say this evening, great. If you could introduce yourself and the applicants for the record, that would be fantastic. Yes, the one I'm representing is the applicant. And I have Brendan Boyle, who's a vice president of the Dolpins. I have Richard Ramsey, who's the owner of the property. I have Mr. McMahon, who is the architect and assistant in Katrina. I'm pronouncing her name correctly. If I'm not, I apologize. Essentially, we think we have a good choice for the site. Now, I've been here before and I was here for the last one. And I remember that very distinctly in terms of comments that were made and I think we tried to go to school on those comments. And I've lived in this, I don't live here now, but I grew up in this town. I went to high school. I have memories of that particular site where Teddy Kennedy would come and have meetings in a restaurant at that site back in the 60s and back in the 70s. It's always been historically a restaurant site. It's good as a restaurant site. Now, if you don't know anything about Tafe and I must admit I did not, okay? I think that if you Google it, you're gonna find that there are different Tafe operations in Cambridge, Brookline, and they do very well. We're gonna talk about the menu shortly as well. With respect to the operation itself, we'd like to be open from seven in the morning until eight in the evening and we're gonna be serving a breakfast menu during the day. We're gonna have sandwiches as well afternoon times if that's what the preference is for people who wanna pop in for that. Now, do we have issues with respect to the site? I don't think we have issues with respect to part. Why? We're close to a municipal park. We have parking out back. We have some parking on that side as well. And even the parking out back is semi-connected to a larger and there's a parking lot as well. There's never been a problem as far as I know historically with respect to parking in place as far as that property is concerned. So I'd be asking that the board take that into consideration because again, we don't have designated parking. I can't tell you that. With respect to bicycle parking, we have a problem with that as well. We can't have indoor by parking. There's no room to do it. The building doesn't allow for it the way it's been constructed. And as I commented in my memo, there could be food contamination issues if you have people dragging bicycles into the restaurant premises during the course of a day. So we have a problem with that. Now, I think we can do something without door bike parking. I think we can certainly provide a bicycle rack. I would be more than willing to talk with the town about trying to get some designated bike parking in that parking lot out back as well. I'm willing to do that to see if I can make something happen with that. I know that having been before you folks many times is you emphasize bicycle parking. So I will do my best to try to make something happen with that. With respect to the number of seats, we're going to have 131 seats. We are looking for some outdoor patio use as well. We're asking for eight to 12 outdoor patio seats. And that's something we have to ask for under the bylaw. And we have to adhere to permission for that. So we'd like to have that as well. I don't want to take up a lot of the comments that are made by the architect, but let me just say this. And Mr. Ramsey is here. Now, Mr. Ramsey is the owner of the property. And of course, he had to go through what we all went through with respect to the prior application. And I only point that out to indicate that the property has been vacant for a substantial period of time. He needs to have a tenant. We all know that we have vacant storefronts and vacant properties on that side. There's an opportunity to do something about that and to have a viable tenant for the property. We have close to 50 favorable letters from folks in town who have said they want to have taught a commend to this particular request. So I would respectfully ask that you take that into consideration as well. With regard to the relief we're seeking, as I say, we need help with parking, relief from parking, we need relief with bike parking as well. With that, Brendan, why don't you just top a little bit about what the offering is in terms of the, so that they understand the menu and the life. Who's the board, Brendan Boyle, Vice President of the Development for Tate? So Tate, if you're not familiar with our concept for a bakery and cafe or a scratch kitchen, which means that we make everything that we sell. So what do we sell? We have multiple morning pastries, desserts, et cetera. Those are all made at our commissary in South Boston and delivered to the site on a daily basis. So everything you see there is fresh made by us. We also have barista bar, so espresso drinks, other customized beverages that are sold throughout the day. And then each location has a full kitchen for the chef. And so we do have chef-inspired entrees throughout the day in addition to the sandwiches that Bob had mentioned. We call ourselves an elegant comfort food model. And so we're really excited to bring Tate to you, share with you a little bit more. Thank you for your time. Claire, I have emailed this to you, right? Have you seen that, uncle? You emailed it to your people on Thursday. Okay. Who don't have it? Yeah, I don't think that that. Okay, that's fine, we can make do. Fine. Share this with you as we move forward. Ah, sure, I agree. Chef and David, all right. So this is the general look and feel for many of the hot cakes. I don't think so, but we're great. I do think some of them, I think some of them. All of the great land we've had. The exterior, we'll start there. I think that's page 12. We have this. Sorry. Yeah, in the CD. It wasn't included in the materials that ended up on the website. So we just go further to the front over there. So this is the proposed exterior elevation change. We're talking about taking off the additional canopy that not sure how it shows and put on. There's an asphalt shingle roof. I think that you see there that we would reshingle with new asphalt shingles. The band is currently aluminum that we think black and we propose to put the name Tate in three locations on the face and then one on the side. The existing brick of the ground floor facade would be left and be straight. You can right-press it. And then all the windows would remain as they are in the paint block. So it consistently stays with pretty much what you see today but it's this door apparently. There is handicapped parking just off-screen here that is accessible to the front door from there. Both the front door and the back door are handicapped accessible and currently the space is divided into three tiered areas of seating. We're going to be modifying that except two tiered of seating instead of three. Here are two entrances. Two entrances. There are two entrances. That's the primary entrance and one sign is here. That's the secondary entrance and the secondary entrance. What's the plan and what is the space? Just a bit of a second. I don't know what to answer. Just an overall plan. Second one. Second one. Second one. Up to the front. Up to the top. Probably a second or third. I think it's another seven packages. I think you had to open two or three different PDFs. Yeah, it's if you go to part one. There we are. Part one. There we are. It's page 12 on the top. Oh, right. I'm going to edit it all out. It's fine. It'll be the work. I think it's page 12. It'll be about eight or one. It's the egress plan. What's the name? Eight. It's 17, right? A-101. A-101. That's perfect. This award. One more. There we are. All right. This will be perfect. There we are. All right. So the primary entrance is here. That's the secondary entrance. Match that is here. So the main line is here. That is a pastry counter, greeting areas, and then the POS is over here. We generally have a commutant table in the middle of the space. There are booths, bankettes, and tables and chairs along the edge. This is the main pass. The kitchen is all back. Restaurants are here, renovated, in here, and this is a ramp up to the second level. These are two steps up to the second level. There's additional bar seating here, overlooking the counter and the main dining room. And then this is the barista station in the back. There's also seating along the backside and booths, bankettes, and tables along the outside edge. There's handicap assessment seating here and here. Basement area has some kitchen support facilities in it, but most of the kitchen is on the top floor. We'd like to see what's in here. Anything else you'd like to highlight for us? Generally, the images that you see there represent the standards of pictures and fittings. The owner and we take a great pride in having a unique experience in every pate, so three or four scours the world and finds found objects, case goods, light fixtures, and brings them to each space. So it's a unique experience in every location. Each location has a different tile floor pattern and is basically white tile walls that are panelized to have a bit of an old world feeling but it's still contemporary. Thank you. Anything else? We did talk briefly about signage, I know that is a part. We'll get back to where we were. On that exterior awning that exists under the there, we have one We have one and it's just basic white letters on a flat background. Here, here, here, and then two on the side and then very small letters, top take if you'd like to find one. And another backwards. Great. Thank you very much. Thank you very much this week. So we're seeking a relief on signage as well. Interesting, the planning department memo indicates we've seen the total number of signs but not the total split footage with respect to signage. We're seeking a relief for signage. Great. Thank you very much. Thank you. Appreciate it. So I just have a couple of questions and comments and then I'll turn it over to the other members of the board. I think first of all, I appreciate the thorough package. I think that it's a very sophisticated design in terms of the signage and the facade. I do have a couple of questions because I do think there are too many signs on the building. And obviously we exceed. I do I'm interested in hearing some of the thoughts of my other, my fellow board members. I think I would be willing to give relief to allow for the signage over each of the individual entrances because I think otherwise it would be challenging to identify that you do have two entrances. And I would ask that you give up the sign in the middle and again only have one awning sign and one well-mounted sign on the side as well because that is our typical maximum. I'd be interested in whether or not you look at leave signs and all as part of any packages you've got in the in the past and if you wanted an additional sign in that central area leave signs are outside of the two sign maximum that we currently have at the side. So that's something that we know Alyssa and I talked with other applicants about the past. That's something I just mentioned that I'd be interested in with considering. One question I do have is about the leave checklist. It looked like there was not one filled out this application which is something that we do require and it looked like there was one for building design and construction that was basically declined to be filled in and it would be interior design and construction actually for a project like this and we would need you to to fill that out. There are opportunities whether they're through or submitting materials or construction management. There are opportunities here and that is something that we do require. So that's just it. Those are right now the only things that I'll mention but I'll turn it over to Kim for these. I want to say this is a really good fit. Thank you for doing this I know it's had empty for a while and I appreciate the fact that you went to a restaurant and it's a good restaurant I'm excited about this restaurant. As far as the relief on the signage, I'm okay with the relief on the signage personally because it's tastefully done enough well enough it's not wearing the fix. So the fact that it's below the sign maximum but it's more locations I'm personally okay with that. As far as the relief to the parking, I'm also okay with that because of the facility where it's at. It has a huge parking lot in the back and it's right on MassEd there's plenty of parking there, same thing with the hand kit okay. So the relief sure asking for it, I'm okay with granted. I do have a couple small questions you said that the front windows are all remain the same it looks like there's grills in your drawings it shows that there's grills in all the windows I don't think that's the case in what's existing there I think I think one side of it doesn't have grills it's just a picture window And then around the corner I think that's one picture window I don't think that's a grilled well what I'm saying is would you consider adding some sort of grill or so it's all consistent all the way around I think it would look much much nicer because it's the elegance that you've got that goes on here and I think it's mine I'm not actually going to change windows or sizes or anything I'm just making it look consistent and I think that would make it pop so much more than just having windows there The last thing I do want to talk a little bit about is all the mechanical equipment there's all up in the roof to get any exhaust or anything else down in the back on the side or anything like that It's real as it exists which is on the exterior on the back so it's behind that fence and everything else and then what about your trash and refugees it's going to be exactly the same place as before so nothing changed whatsoever it's not the best place for it but it's pre-existing I'll give you a link on that too I have no problem with that issue there Bob you did bring up one thing I have a question you said you have some outside seating do you want that is there any plan of anything showing that I couldn't find it on my drawings or I have to say though whether or not they show it or not that's actually something that they have to go in front of the select board for we don't approve outdoor dining it has to go in front of the select board so it's yes but we have to give your permission too that's my understanding I don't believe that that's the case but I was told again I don't believe that's the case we typically do not get into outdoor dining we haven't yet I will withdraw my request for that we can certainly identify whether or not the board supports it or not but we do not have any approval granting authority on the outdoor dining can we see it it's on this right here it's on this right here it's on this right here it's on this right here it's just in this package I don't think it's in the package it's right here back to you thank you do you have any okay we can't comment on this right yeah I can comment on it I don't want to spend a lot of time on it because we have a lot of cases here in front of us but we can you're blocking the sidewalk there's no place to walk on the sidewalk that's this that's what this path is almost on tables is it a path and then there's tables under the trees okay thank you I'm all set thank you I agree with my colleague this is a really good fit I think for the neighborhood and for the building and I've eaten in at least a couple of your restaurants numerous times my one concern is they're too proud of it so we'll take the overflow for your business I do have some questions on your application the dimensional and parking information I just need some clarification on some of the information you've put in I don't know if you can put that up on the screen that's under the submission yeah the application package page 6 page 6 of the application there we go I just need to understand a few things property is currently vacant, use is in their gross square footage is 6,400 and yet the next line use is in their gross square feet for the restaurant is 7,439 up near the top of the page so how does it get from 6,400 to 7,439 that is the basement it's only about 4,000 we added that to the ground floor so it's really what we're using for the restaurant there are other portions of the basement that we're not using so I think that's why it's there ok so 6,400 is the first square the difference between that and 7,439 so can somebody help me out with these two numbers and where they came from if there's something we need to get back to us on let's move on and we'll know if that is a question this doesn't seem mighty the present conditions 6,400 square feet proposed conditions 3,826 square feet that doesn't seem correct the lot isn't shrinking so I think that we need to know about that the third down part when parking spaces present conditions 0, proposed conditions 3 can you explain that the upstairs current tenant has 3 or 4 spaces and they've got 3 designated there are 6 or 7 spaces in total behind the building so 3 will be 4 for this apartment for this one and the other 3 for the tenant upstairs space for the rubbish we actually use it thanks thanks for that clarification on the bicycle parking I had a couple questions I understand the preference is to have bicycles come in not no stairs anything like that and the difficulties you've talked about doing that one of the things that another applicant has done is they're buying a box basically a locking box that goes in back that will accommodate a couple of bicycles for long term parking and I wonder if that's something that you could do for the long term bicycle parking in one of the parking in one of the parking spaces is that what you're proposing? well either or somewhere else in back in the architect but just the parking spaces and then where the dumps will be so there's no room? you'd have to take away the parking stuff it's your stuff there's no extra space and how about not so profitable allowing somebody to take a bicycle down into the basement sanctuary that won't let us go to the kitchen then I would expect the outdoor spaces to be enough to accommodate both what should have been inside but outside so that your outside spaces would also accommodate I think there was one bicycle for inside so it would be enough for both yeah whatever your long term and short term parking calculation was but because you can only supply short term that would need to be accommodating the full total of the two thank you I need an interpretation and can those be located on both the sidewalks? if you are able to get approval by the town if the town if the town approves it great for the sidewalk although I'm not sure how that won't clash with the patio but we'll see if that's possible if not and you do it in back and I'm comfortable with that also you will have to have a sign on the front of the building that indicates bicycle parking in the rear you had mentioned the ventilation that you're going to use the existing ventilation system I'm just curious what type of filtration for odors and particles things like that so it's a typical grease exhaust so the interior of the kitchen has a grease hood and within that there's a filtration system so as the grease is exhausted most of it is caught in that filter for it how about indoor air filtration one of the things that we've learned through COVID is really the necessity to have indoor air filtration so I wonder if you had any since you're redoing the inside what your proposal is for nerve filters something like that so we have made it a policy to use nerve 13 filtration on all our ecosystems the patio as we've said you do need to go to the select board for approval for that I just wonder whether the path should be where you propose it or whether the patio should be against the building and the path should be between the patio there are a number of trees in front so that these goes between the trees rather than having people go between the trees he will get a clean shot next to the building thank you and on the signage so it's a very complex sign let's just say that and the way I read it and my colleagues don't always agree with me on this there's no number on the limit of owning signs that you can have there's just a size limit so I'm okay with one exception I'll talk about with the number of owning signs however you're only allowed to have one wall sign on sign I'm not sure there's the necessity to have more than one wall sign on the side in addition we have this very odd requirement at 6.2.3a put up in a second traffic visibility at intersections I'm not a fan of this there it is so we've got an intersection of Nassav that's in way and we're not supposed to have anything within this area and I don't know whether any of the signs fall within this area I don't think they do but it may limit the signs that you have to the right of the main entrance door so I'm fine with the owning signs they're all different than the zandery I'll use the number of wall signs to run on the side and I'm okay on the parking release you requested because the previous restaurant didn't have any parking usually we require a transportation demand management plan which I don't think I saw in the materials which you know how are your employees going to get there things like that so I think that would give us what we needed to be able at least in my opinion to give you the parking waiver that you requested and that's what I've got Great, thank you Gene Melissa Well I am very happy enthusiastic about this use going into this state I think it achieves a lot of the goals that the town set out for the business center beyond its commercial value I think it adds a lot of social value social connectivity and opportunity to you know allow the community to engage with one another I mean that's how I see these faces so I'm thrilled about that I think the enhancements you know kind of using your word that you know are elegant and also sophisticated I can see that I think it's well done so with regard to kind of the the special permit and what we're looking for in terms of the signage and the parking with regard to the signage I guess first of all my understanding is these could be two storefronts that right the length of it could be considered two storefronts given that and that it's all occupied by one unit I think it makes sense to indicate with proper signage that this is one contiguous space and so I would support the allowance needed for signage I think also I would like to look into the blade sign I think that blade sign that signal to have more walkability and more attractiveness in that kind of outside atmosphere that you're creating we looked into that because of the trees okay you don't want your walking it's up in the trees it's up too high so there's nothing smaller lower that you could put down we looked at it we didn't find anything that wasn't going to start to become too low because it would have to be underneath the overhang so you can't see it's a headbang there's enough headroom underneath the canopy and they're going to put it on top of the existing canopy and then you're up in the trees yeah I know I trust you I was thinking more something maybe a little bit more moderate in human scale just for walking and kind of signal less so flat so even if it was just like a little bit offside to building again I understand that what you're trying to do is actually maximum signage invisibility it sounds like if it's under the square footage then that also makes a lot of sense to me that you know they're not exceedingly large signs they're trying to be tasteful but indicate that this is all part of one state especially you have the two levels and the two entry points and that's where we put the two signs on the corner on the white brick and the black letters the blade sign is right in the way of traffic coming into that low way and I was just concerned we were going to fair enough I take that you looked into it but I think you just when well done I feel like they enhance the walking environment initially the owner wanted signs above the front door that would be loose and romantic but that's just two of the people that were running through it I could see what the old world kind of modern theme it would have been lovely but it was right on the awning so it was that way I think with the parking I'm comfortable as we talked about and I do even know some of the history with the space as a long time restaurant or even some Kennedy and so forth I think it's fine I feel like we have a lot of infrastructure on street and existing that I'm comfortable with the allowance on the parking and with the outdoor dining maybe our board could consider a motion to at least signal to the select board that we would support outdoor seating even though it's not our curvy but that it's part of the success and the presentation of this use, of this space I think would be important and I was just curious, my question I guess for the applicant would be just like how is that basement space being used again, is it more storage? It's more storage, it's our walking coolers down there and we have metro ramps for paper storage we're only spitting out about 800 square feet which is the overall basement which is close to 3500 so enjoy that as much as it is not sure how to use it as any other future plans do you see that now? more some storage now and just this is more my curiosity you mentioned 131 seats on average do you see that kind of how is that occupying the day there is location by location our busiest timeframes are 8 a.m. to 10 p.m. and it slows down it picks back up 11 to 2 and then we are open until 8 p.m. but our evening business is relatively slow and I didn't see this but do you service alcohol and beer in other locations like that or not? and I think with the vice parking I guess I was just curious sometimes I've seen this in other places where it's really tight and I don't know it's probably been a question of the property owner and the building integrity but I've seen racks that come off the building as well so that you can just maximize the space on the building and I don't know if that's something worth looking at so it doesn't take on space anymore you need it for vehicles but like a garage you put it against the wall and it's kind of maybe it's for private you need parking we would also consider and I think it might have been for other responses we would consider installing on our cost obviously like parking somewhere in that minutes a lot out back off of our property per se if that would alleviate maybe having to do that I do think there is space in that type of scenario I think there's even those scooters or bikes I've seen a few spots in the back so there possibly could be one there too but I'm concerned this is either sidewalk either the front or the side once you start to park a bike you're going to be closing off on sidewalk pedestrian pathways there might be some opportunity to find a place in and around the parking in the back but it's also very and when I say the park I mean in the back better the deeded spaces right yeah I'd like us to be a little more creative with bike parking too because I think bike parking should be like our vehicle parking in that there's a lot of there's a public parking space for our vehicles so we should start thinking of how to make that public parking more for our bicycles back there I forget where the town line of the town lot begins and ends but that's part of town owned land on the back so I think that would also then go to the select board unfortunately I don't think that's in our jurisdiction but it's another thing I would support would be exploring increasing or maybe a public private partnership with you in to explore some bike parking in that area we could potentially do Melissa's is there a memo from the board for those items you know once we have consensus from this board in terms of what this board supports or if you're used to the select board great okay as far as the cafe and all of that you use a lot of other what they've often done is said we are not in opposition to so therefore to make them you don't say yes you just don't say no thank you I'll concur with my colleagues I think this is a will be a very nice refresh for the site I'm fine with the parking relief you are next to two large municipal lots and there's been a history of restaurants operating in this area bike parking I realize there's some questions but it sounds like we have a general plan for moving forward with respect to signs I I like the onyx signs for my personal case I'd like to see that the wall signs limited to just near the doors but overall I mean what you put together is fairly tasty the only question I have is if you were planning to propose a transportation any sort of transportation to man-manage I think it would be difficult to come up with three out of the seven I mean one I can come up with bicycle storage because I can't get inside the building so I think it's going to be difficult to do that if you have suggestions I'm certainly willing to take them up with my but I thought about that and I anticipated that that question might come up I just don't have an answer for it do you have the notion of those dedicated one or two of the spaces to take out and become the absolve of the sensing it helped out a lot nothing else okay any other questions we'll come back and we'll have a discussion after public comment any other questions before we go to public comment from the board members okay I'll just state for the record that as attorney Nesse mentioned we did receive quite a few letters of support from the public for those who have submitted a letter of support there's no need to read those to us this evening they have been filed for record at this point I will open the floor for public comment who would wish to make comment on this particular application please raise your hand and I'll call on you you'll have up to three minutes to speak about this project so this time is for anyone who would like to speak okay seeing no one we will close public comment and I'll turn it back to the board and what I'd like to do first is run through the list of questions and clarifications that I've been keeping up for items that have been requested for clarification one is to submit a lead checklist related to interior design and construction one is to clarify the square footages on the application I believe that was page six of the application the table the third was to create a in order for us to be able to grant relief to create a transportation management plan and I can speak to a couple of suggestions when we get through the list here I think we should talk about as a board what our thoughts are related to the wall and the awning signs and the last is to consider adding grills to the existing un-divided windows are there any other items that I missed so regarding the transportation demand management plan there are several suggestions within the zoning bylaws including consideration of items like employee subsidized transit car pulling incentives any type of manual for employees for alternate ways to come to work without needing a vehicle so again those aren't architectural they're more operations related but there are several items and what we typically would request is a plan that outlines any which the owner would be willing to okay great and that would then allow us to be able to review that for let's see any other items that I missed before we just talk a little bit about signs if I can say something about the transportation demand management in addition to what the chair said I think the other things to think about is putting something on the website for this particular location which sort of says bicycle parking in the area where it may be that's right off main bikeway sort of things that you might want on the website anyhow for this location great so for signage I heard that the majority of the board I think I was the only one who took any exception to the number of awning signs there seemed to be support for the three on the front and the two that were proposed on the side there was discussion around the number of wall signs it looks like there are four proposed for the front let's move over to my elevation three on the front and one on the side is he four on the front in the rendering there are four on the front in the rendering is that correct yes one on each side of the main door to the right one in the middle and one to the left of the door I personally would prefer two and then you have one on the minor side of which again I would personally approve either the wall sign and one awning sign or the two awning sides that you have but that is my opinion can I be interested in your take I have no problem with any of the signs okay I have no problem with the awning signs the member I'd like the idea of one wall sign at each of the front doors I'm not sure you need a wall sign on the side as I have the two awning signs on the side but I'm not opposed to having a wall sign on the side I just think it's unnecessary what was that I'm generally comfortable it seems like a lot when pointing it all out but I feel like when you're on the ground it will be helpful and if we're not able to they didn't play inside what we talked about they could just the kind of wall sign help and give that feel you're fine I'd like the idea of having a wall sign near each door so you have three board members who would like you to limit the number of signs to one to each side of the wall signs to one on each side of the door and other than me you have consensus on the awnings and I am certainly not going to go to the mat almost take that with as you will any other items it sounds like there are a few items that we'd like for them to come back with please I would like the motion so that to approve it with them coming back and have an administrative approval I was going to suggest that let's start with that talk I would like to go in that direction there just to get this going and not cause any harm to the ownership and to I'd like to get this best line in as soon as possible I'm okay on everything except for the lead checklist which I don't think administratively they'll see the lead checklist but I think we need the opportunity to take a look and see what they've done and whether there are other things that they can do to increase the points so I'm okay on everything other than the lead checklist Melissa I lean towards what Ken is saying about administrative approval on this I think the lead checklist on this project if it was a redevelopment project a tenant use that was a restaurant before great Steve I concur with Mr. Doppels great and I agree with Ken's suggestion as well and perhaps Jean if we add in as well that the sustainability are they a direct manager to sustainability manager within your department yes would they review the lead checklist would that meet your yes I think if they don't reach I'm a couple agreement with the applicant then it has to come back is that good with you Claire? yes okay great okay well let's make sure though that we're clear about what we're asking for so the transportation management plan you're clear on what the board's requests are they're correct and the checklist that would be a lead ID checklist instead of the BDNC and we do then need to be specific about the signs when we make the motion in terms of the number of wall signs and I think that was it Claire? yes please for your signage to approve wall signs except the middle two on mass avenue all the ordering signs are okay all the ordering signs so the only two wall signs so no wall sign on the side just one two just two wall signs on the front yes and then just one on the side none on the side that's what I propose and that's again what I that's what we need to clarify right so Steve were you saying just what I said was just one at each entry on the front of the wall signs if we're going to have two awning signs on the side I don't think they also need the wall sign but I'm fine with them keeping one awning sign on the side and one wall sign yes I agree that's what I was thinking on the eastern side of the building the one that says yes two awning signs and zero wall signs great four wall signs and one awning sign correct two signs on that side so we're clear though when you're walking down the alleyway you're not going to be as a pedestrian you're not looking up at the awning your eye level is at the wall sign then they need to take one off at the awning and we'll probably take the one closer to the rear of the awning and leave a wall sign on that that's fine I knew we'd get there okay great so is there a motion to excuse me I need to get the docket number back up 179 thank you I have something to find just for my own clarity of mind there's a total of four awning signs and three wall signs correct okay so is there a motion to approve docket number 3729 with the special conditions of completing the lead IDNC checklist for review and approval by the department of planning and community development as well as the submission of a TDM plan for review and approval by the department of planning and community development and a reduction of the wall signs on the Mass Appasad 22 one adjacent to each entry and a reduction of the awning signs on the on the the same of that street David Lansing the David Lansing way facade to one and at least four short term bicycle parking one space one awning and one wall sign correct so the reduction the only change on the David Lansing way is to remove the one awning sign correct and to ensure that the quantity of short term parking spaces available are equal to the sum of the long term and short term parking bicycle parking spaces that are required and if it's in back you have to put a sign on the front of the building saying bicycle parking it's a motion is there a second let's take a roll call vote starting with Steve Melissa Jean Ken congratulations for really looking forward to welcoming you to the town thank you thank you very much alright that closes docket number 3729645 Massachusetts Avenue we'll now open the public hearing for docket number 3730 at 185 Massachusetts Avenue thank you all so if the applicants could please move to the front and take your seats in a minute or two we'll move forward this is just one second so I'm not going to go through the whole spiel again around what the process is going to be it's going to be the same as the last time but I would like to give director Ricker an opportunity to speak first on behalf of the department that's fine and then we'll move on to you for the presentation that's okay thank you very much for so many years totally understand this is an application for a restaurant at 185 NASA called the proposed use of signage is allowed by right in this district this applicant is asking for a reduction to the parking requirements and that is why it's before the board they are looking for reduction in vehicle parking requirement but can provide some bike parking it's like in front of their federal establishment at 185 and I think that's it so change of use and reduction in parking all right so attorney NSE and that is why we're here is we're not going to affect I'm sorry for the record could you please introduce yourself I have with me Alex and Pont who are two of the principals three actually in the in the fat Greek the fat Greek is a restaurant a Greek restaurant in it's done very well over the years and the property by the way is owned by another client of mine Nick Poulos who happens to be Greek and Nick thought it might be a good idea to have Greek cuisine in the town so he's spoken with the three principals and that's why we're here the property itself historically has been used as a bakery and a yoga studio was used as a yoga studio for a couple of years I actually represented the applicant on that endeavor as well we are basically asking for the ability to have the fat Greek type business operation successful and able now moved on now we have some problems and everybody down there has a problem most of the restaurants over the last 40 years that have come in and gone out down and the problem is parking nobody has parking done and the buildings are constructed in a way that you can't get parking there's no way to get parking now the parking that you do have is on Mass Ed and the parking is on some of the side streets I spent the case for years I was told as a young lawyer that it was a fiction that you had parking that people would simply read into the situation that you had parking I'm telling you we don't have we don't have the ability to have right parking either now I misspoke on that in my mental I said we would endeavor to get right parking inside the building and I have the same problem here that I had on the prior application with respect to bringing a bicycle into a confined quarter with the potential for contamination so we can't do that and I'm told by the clients that we also don't have the ability to have right parking on the back is that correct? it's different building we don't have that ability either so we have a problem with right parking as well with respect to the restaurant itself the restaurant as I say is going to offer a brief cuisine and is going to be open from 7 days a week from 11am to 10pm and other restaurants down there I think operate in a similar manner and by the way none of the other restaurants down there have parking so this is not unusual that we're here before you we're going to have space on the first level for the restaurant itself we're going to have 18 seats we're proposing 18 seats we're going to be doing some cooking in the basement but most of the cooking is going to take place on the main level as well the I said this before the there's a dearth of parking in that area and there are vacant stores in that area over the years that people could not fill and they could not fill them because they couldn't get the right kind of a business operation to inhabit the space I think we have a good information that can inhabit the space but in order to do so we need relief we need relief for parking we need relief for by parking as well and with that I'm open to any questions you may have and Alex who's going to talk about the food I'll tell them about the food just briefly we do have your menu so you submitted that so happy to it's a simple menu Greek street food a little bit of Mediterranean food we primarily focus on heroes we have some dinners some sides what's our main thing is the gyros some desserts you can want this spinach pie how about when you talk about the menu how about the interior in terms of what you're going to be doing on the 18 seats tell us something about that I believe we have the schematics yes there was a kind of an axon plan and then a fourth plan so that was clear plan 3 and plan 2 nope if you actually go to the submission words of plan 2 or plan 3 those are the 2 I think there you go let's start with that one so yeah it's pretty basic up to 18 seats we're going to have a bar stool type in the front window and then the kitchen itself basically a couple of filers we have the geostacks where we put the meat on there a couple of grills one is to cook the fish cooking the meat the other one is for the peanut bread and then the majority of the prep is going to be downstairs downstairs we're very limited on cooking we might have one electric oven to cook the spinach pies but the majority of the cooking is done in front of everyone right on the line the walls one wall right there the brown one is all brick so that's going to be exposed brick and the kitchen is going to be kitchen grade tile on the ground and then subway tile on the walls and then downstairs is going to be basically a commercial kitchen for all our prep work prep work that's something else about it maybe some refrigeration also as well and I think we've seen the signage and the planning has indicated that the signs doesn't have to apply so I'm not going to spend a lot of time on that could you just tell us what the face of the sign is is made of there wasn't a lot of detail I'm just curious what the I'm not sure if we can make the sign out of what the company is we like to do it the way we did in April yeah it's an acrylic material it's not backlit or anything but yeah just an acrylic material and the letters are raised off of that yeah they are raised off of that no no no no it's a nice I believe we submit it if you raise letters that's fine that's all I need okay great thank you very much so I appreciate the application and you coming in front of us now I'm going to run through the board and see what kind of questions there are I'll say again I'm okay with giving you a relief of parking it's because of that area there and I'll treat parking I think that that's fine I do have a couple of questions in regards to street life I really want every new business to add to the the legitimacy of the street life there okay so you have an awning is that awning lit underneath so just light that along the street I still want it out of the dark yeah I know we don't want it dark we want it as bright as possible some underlit light light up to the awning or light down it's a good question we'd love to put some lighting all around maybe some lighting coming back to the side so that's what I'm going to do because I think with a new edge you cannot up light to the sky it has to be can it be from the side or from the top maybe it can be down so Ken just to be you're talking about the socket the recessed at the recessed entry to make sure we have down lights so I'll light it up a little bit currently we have a light spot but under the awning we have some lights as well that is a black awning that's already there it must just be in the photo that you have in your application material there's no awning shown to see the black part when I drove by earlier there it is so we have some sort of light there that's what I'm talking about and then you have a bar in front of the window there you're not going to have any you're not going to have any window graphics you want people to drive by look inside to the restaurant the restaurant is nice so from the bar down you floss the glass modestly for us it's fine alright that's the thing I'm trying to look at you guys are also going to the sidewalk is pretty wide you can put some planters out there or whatever else make the place look nicer it draws people in that's the approach I want to talk about when we talk about putting places in we're willing to give you a leaf of parking and all that stuff but somewhere in the turn I want you to say we're going to make an attempt to put a light in the street and that's key alright everything else there looks fine the only thing in the back now since it was not at restaurant before so you're going to put some grease bits up there how's that going to affect your neighbors and then how you can take care of your garbage well it is one-story building so everything from the grease from the hood system is going to be on the roof you know if we're going to put an AC system that will also be on the roof and the grease strap usually you know the mushroom hoods they usually put it straight out and hopefully it makes everybody hungry that's what I'm going to say behind you you said this is someone else's property right it's somebody else's property right are they right up to the property line we have egress we're allowed to go back there is there housing back there I think it's a duplex so that's what I'm sort of getting at okay so there's already existing housing there so if your grease hoods I'm assuming should be back above the kitchen I'm actually we offset that it will be towards the middle so we can put it and also the other restaurant right next to us has the old Olivia so yeah they're closer we're more by the parking lot area so yeah the town tavern has their stuff but we have it probably towards the middle of that structure right there okay so you're going to try to centerize your that's okay and then I'm assuming you're going to have trash disposal yeah on the side of the building basically what town tavern has all their trash that's where we're going to have ours as well so you have an easter all the way back there or you're going to have to bring it down the alley way there there's a hallway that runs in the basement and then that land up there where they have that driveway here in there that is where you do no doubt in the basement of the building the basement wants all the way there's a hallway in the basement that wants a link of the building and the entrance is to the right of her arrow right there see where that car is yeah there's an entrance to the basement right there so everybody brings their trash out there and puts some of the trash bins on that side street the whole basement is right in the back of the basement so it's been happening right now all along that all the trash is left on the street you picked up that day there are bins out there there are big trash bins out there like town trash bins that's cool they're dumpsters are they dumpsters in the back they're the ones that have wheels on the bottom oh I got it okay I think that's 75 gallon yep okay and that's out in the street all the time on the sidewalk right there the bakery next to us they use it the yoga studio uses it and the town cabin use it too sorry yes I'm swimming and that's what else do we have over here that's what they call this where do you store your grease we haven't decided yet the town tower actually stores it inside that hallway so we're trying to work with them to use the same to the same well if that grease bin narrows down the hallway it's illegal and if it's an egress hallway a petroleum product in the hallway so I've done it in the past where you store it in your basement and your grease collector has come all the way down the hallway he gets it and then brings it out and dumps it if that's the range we have I'm okay with that but if you have it stored outside that's not good if that's what we have to do then that's what you're gonna have to do okay I don't think we're gonna allow I appreciate you pointing it out because I think it's good for you to have a heads-up on that but that's something that you'll absolutely need to work through with the building first with trash bins right there alright I drive by there all the time I'm sorry I don't notice that but I'm I'm the big one now okay and it's been that way that's the driveway the back for the back building that belongs to most of the next door to the restaurant right but then that doorway, the first one to the left is your access down to the basement all the way down to your space and that's how you get your provisions that's a weird one I'm gonna let's see what my rest of my colleagues able about one bigger let's it's been that way for years I've represented the Livios before the town's camera I believe in nothing has changed it's pre-existing yeah are you all done? I'm done move on to Jean in just a second I'll just note that because we allowed the previous applicant to follow up with a transportation demand management plan that is also something we would require of this applicant as well we work on that yes this board so moves that may be something that we are able to do through a follow-up with the staff Jean I think I apologize I stay here this is good so on the bicycle parking there have been some other restaurant type places we've approved in the past they've been required to make arrangements with the town so that the restaurant would pay for bike racks on the town side so for this you basically as I see it you need to touch base with the town and see if there's a place either right in front of your place or close by where they would agree to have a couple bike racks and we have a list of acceptable bike racks and you just pay for them and they have them in store so I think and then if the town can find a place then you don't have to do it obviously because right in front of your place there's a nice bench that I think is a town bench that they put there the only thing I want to follow up on what my colleague said about the odors because we got some I want at least a letter or email with a lot of concern about cooking odors and food odors coming out and I wonder what you can do about that if you expect it which I think you probably do and what you can do about it to minimize it or eliminate it because there are houses where people live right now let's come up on my other restaurants down there as well and we could not come up with something you could do about that and we had I think one complaint when I did Olivia I was from a neighbor and the restaurant got up and running and we never heard from the neighbor again so obviously the odor wasn't initially with respect to into a neighborhood in permeating the neighborhood so I think that it's not an issue I don't know if my colleagues know more about this that I have any suggestions I'll wait and hear if I do that's a bit of concern to me and I think that's it thank you Jean Melissa in general I think in support of the allowance on the parking for sure I mean I think in a lot of spaces like this there's no parking requirements in these type of areas there's a trend in the US to remove parking requirements so that we can tenant these type of spaces understanding that parking is a challenge with or without the parking requirements so I think in terms of the odors I guess that was kind of the other talk people are talking about on our board you know one man's odors is another person's aromas so I think it's a little in my mind the nature of a mixed use environment that we've been supporting I mean I'll be it with proper controls on as much as we can with the HVAC air filters and so forth but having been you know on the other side supporting restaurants going in these type of spaces I understand kind of that is the balance a little bit of the nature of these spaces I think overall I mean I I'd like to see some more facade improvements I think if there is anything more we could do on the design as you can see from that previous tenant they really tried to enhance a little bit more of that front space and granted we are not in a position to authorize outdoor seating but to think about that and I guess Mr. Nessie has they talked about being part of the capital square the business alliance and anything like that we have not yet but we're going to so there is I think it's a rather informal business of the district but it seems that that is really given that area identity and definition and there is a cohesion around the business owner I'd like to see an effort being made there and I think that's it I think the idea of complimenting the use that's already there with the bakery that has potential obviously the owner probably saw something like that too so I support this and it's coming in thank you Steve I I like your menu I was wondering how to describe it and then Greek street food seems like it makes a lot of sense there's as far as you know I'll just I'm largely going to echo what some of my colleagues had said before with capital square challenge one of my favorite bits of town parking trivia is the capital theater under today's regulations 1100 theater seats and two stories of apartments would require about 300 off street spaces the building has five so I mean this sort of you know I completely understand the and sympathetic to the need for a parking reduction I would request that you pursue the possibility of having a bike rack installed in front sort of next to where there's a bench now it's okay with the town we'd love to put one out there right there right on the red would be perfect you know we have no and just again as far as to you know the extent that it's practical to minimize odors around the residential neighborhood that would be wonderful I have nothing further any other questions before we open the public comment I just want to clarify we said relocate exhaust exit on the roof as far away from the back as possible also I like to say aimed exhaust toward Mass Ave 90 just look at as far as you can and have it face that way okay so that you know just looking for a commitment from you guys to do that absolutely to make that happen yeah two things one I forgot to mention which is something I mentioned to the first applicant which is you're going to have even more seating so it would be good to have an air ventilation system with at least no 13 filters so I think we need to talk to the contractor about being able to do that that basically takes out a lot of stuff in the air in the place and I just don't know if aiming the rent toward Mass Ave is enough I'd like to know what state of law could be available for restaurants well if I may I don't know what it is but I'd like to know I can tell you what I've done in the past and that's a good story I think we're getting a little out of out of scope here I think that asking them to include um order control measures um with you know potentially some of the placement recommendations that we've made is appropriate but um we don't have specifics to require of them nor have we required it of others in the past we feel like we would be going beyond um because we do that and the other one obviously gives them any specifics on what they're order controlling they're not required to I again this is not the first that's around the week I mean just kind of building you know living by Blue Ribbon even if you're three you know walks away you know I know I just don't know and I'm not saying I can call that I just want to know with the maximum things that they could reasonably there's nothing reasonable there's nothing reasonable it's high expense what you want to put in the most permeating food smell in this area is buttered popcorn it's the theater across the street and you can sometimes you can smell it for lots so I'd like to put a pin in that and at this point open if there's any other questions for the applicant no I understand let's now open this up for public comment at this time if there are any members of the public who would like to speak please raise your hand what I'd like to do is ask for you to I'm just going to get my timer at for you to please introduce yourself by your first class name in an address and you will have up to three minutes to speak that's a great point when you want to call on you if you could please come and we'll ask you to sit in the seat right now so that the microphone can pick you up and we'll start with this that's my my name is Gerard Cooges I'm a 221 NASA from a couple hundred feet away I don't have a car or a bicycle so I don't fully support any of the assumptions and the only thing I'd like to say is I wish we could be open a little later because of our schedules and what we're talking but as far as the older situation be right in the neighborhood occasionally you know what town town is cooking it's probably a mission I don't think these people are going to be cooking as much meat as town town and so I can't say the things of the mission at all frankly it's just that's all great thank you very much you've got other members who would like to speak please hi yes I'm Cheryl myself 10th legal industry parent and I'm going to ask that no special permit be granted to these applicants unless the permit contains the condition the fully effective pollution control be installed and maintained on the property I want to make three points tonight one is restaurant orders or wellness orders where you'll recall them can impair a budding resident's quality of life we are already subjected to terrible orders every single day from town tavern we can't use our back porch anymore and by the way this is newly town tavern so Olivia's different we can't use our back porch or back yard anymore it's too misery we can't open our kitchen and bedroom windows because we can't get fresh air all we get is fried fish and french fries and charcoals grilled meat and fried food from another restaurant would be in power it's completely unbelievable that we are denied the full enjoyment of a miss of the property we've owned for 30 years due to unhealthy restaurant exhaust schemes and that brings me my second one restaurant emissions aren't simply odors they contain high concentrations but dangerous air pollutants include particulate matter and organic air pollutants the NIH found that both of these pollutants cause respiratory and cardiac illness as well as increased odors these are serious health risks these pollutants are known by part of cooking food that has back in it from cooking food you think that it's just part of the deal scientists at Carnegie Mellon have shown that high volcanic aerosol concentrations are found in most restaurants they also found that neighborhoods with multiple restaurants have the highest levels of unhealthy attitude to matter more restaurants in a particular pattern Carnegie Mellon measures pollutants during peak dinner and commuting times in Pittsburgh an experiment they conducted and they found that 70% more than two thirds of the pollutants that they tested for the collected came from restaurants and only 30% came from vehicles so restaurants were twice more than twice as polluting a vehicle traffic at rush hour in Pittsburgh science is clear meanwhile kids and seniors behind the car at a restaurant are already breathing these emissions which will increase the new restaurant is allowed that is exhaust don't have to live with this because there are solutions you may not like the solutions but there are solutions many restaurants and consulting firms have teams that deal with this problem along it's a known issue equipment is widely available which can significantly limit both odors and one consultant says if you can smell my okay thank you very much just remember the ARB standard that says we have to minimalize the impact on air reserve thank you thank you alright are there any other members of the public who would like to speak please I'm sorry she's speaking to this okay that's fine please come ahead now I'm going to stand to it first next slide my name is John Leon I'm also the trustee of the AML Realty Trust which can you bring that over here this is our property directly in but this row of buildings the property line is near inches away from the edge of the building they have no access to that site of the property our main concern here is as stated before we were speaking of odor control we do experience a lot of odors from town cavern there is a solution to charcoal filters we made monotony grill and tavern was required to put them in I believe common ground was required to put them in because they were going to generate a lot of smoke and it directly impacts the neighborhood sister and her husband live on the second floor of that hall they can't open their windows when town caverns cooking which is everyday to add another restaurant and right there without charcoal filters it's going to directly impact them to a great extent the bakery next door Arlington Bakery is that so classy on I think you pronounce it their idea of a vent is a big old fan in a window going directly into our yard we already have that to deal with we don't complain to anybody because they're our neighbors but we have a chance here to do it right from the beginning and something this commission should do is just require these charcoal filters for every new restaurant that comes in because we are very densely populated in Arlington you can see we're near feet from that building and to have that option available and not utilized really not taking advantage of what we have out there as you can see right on Cleveland street you have those neighbors right there prevailing winds go that way right towards our house right towards all of those houses and the other issues we have is the trash pickups they come at 5 in the morning I'd like to see if you put something in your special permits to make them go during business hours and not at 5 in the morning because it wakes up and lock it pins at our house as well as the 6 or 7 floors of the summit house from Stonk Condominiums and the other issue we have is road and control I know Count Tavern is very diligent about that and they get after it whenever they have rats they have all the time getting their exterminator in we'd like to make sure that you guys be very diligent about road and control because they're in our yard and that's just you know we didn't do it, we don't want it so you could put those simple things into your special permits especially the charcoal filters and I urge you to do that for every restaurant from now on thank you are there any other members wishing to speak my name is Suzanne and I live in as my brother John said the house that's right there and I've lived there for 26 years someone in our family has lived in that house for 65 years when we bought the house it was a five and dime in that location in Brown Drugs I've lived there during Cafe Barada, Olivio's Tom Tavern we never complained about Olivio's it didn't smell bad that's why when Cafe Barada is open my father came to the meeting he was alive at the time and insisted on some filters and things in the vent and in the top I don't know if it's a different if it's the same vent that Tom Tavern has but it's every morning at 10 30 you smell the fumes when they turn on the grill that's all the grease is burning and it wasps into our house we need to shut the windows then the hamburgers and the meat starts up and it goes all night and it's horrible and this place is going to open at 11 so I assume that their grease thing is going to start at 9 30 also the trash cans on the side they're owned by Tom Tavern they're not trash cans like John said the garbage trucks come they're private garbage trucks they come at 5 in the morning and make a lot of noise and wake me up every day or every other day and I'm also concerned about the noise generated by the air conditioners which is always an issue in the summer Tom Tavern all the businesses there I always knock on the door and say your air conditioner is acting up again some guy comes the ladder up on the building and has to go through our yard to do it goes up the ladder fixes the air conditioning but it's constant those things are noisy we can't even watch television it's so loud you have to shut the windows again and that tree is not there anymore it fell down unfortunately last November so we don't have that nice little filter area either and and it's actually a two family house not a three family house yeah we have a lot of cars but property extends behind that barn too and the only other thing I'm concerned about parking is the least of my concerns but it would be great if people do take out you could put a sign on the door that says don't block the neighbor's driveway because that is an issue for a lot especially the beef and then they get all upset people are harder than I thought so I think I covered everything really fast you're in time too so thank you very much I appreciate it one more person yeah my name is John Linder and I live in this area as well the 7 winter street I just want to address some of the things that I heard yeah the smell from the town tavern has really ruined our quality of life I really believe that we don't notice it as much in the winter because our windows are shut and our storm windows are down but it's almost like I dread opening the windows in the springtime because the smell comes right into our window and just for clarification I heard about positioning the vents near the street or in the middle of the restaurant it really makes no difference whatsoever town tavern's vent is in the middle of the roof facing the street but the wind often blows just directly towards our house and that smell you can see it visually you can see the smoke and you can smell the odor so I don't really think it matters what direction the vent places unless you do have some sort of charcoal filter or filtration device at one point we were promised by town tavern that they would do something with their ventilation it was kind of a gentleman's agreement oh yeah as soon as we get funds we will upgrade our system never happened I don't think it ever will happen unless you know we really pursue this with a lot of health trash cans on winter street I think are unsightly and I don't think it's just a matter of using the same trash cans because you're going to need more trash cans you're going to generate more waste if it's a takeout there will be a lot of packaging paper we've had a rat problem in a yard I've seen rats running across our driveway from the trash cans I've had to dispose of three dead rats in the last year that has increased over time even though there's several poison boxes placed all along the wall so I think it's a matter of increments right if you have some food we're sort of dealing with it now but honestly I can't wait till I have enough money to move away from the smells and the rats that I live now it's really ruined our quality of life and just to your point Mr. Ovalek I've never smelled popcorn in the neighborhood except when I'm actually standing in front of the capital theater I have smelled from the bakery when the bakery was going full blast we used to get a sort of anise, licorice kind of smell coming into our yard quite often wasn't so offensive but the grilled meat and grilled fish is I mean it's literally like living right next to a McDonald's with the vent blowing in our window that's what we're facing right now so I think to have more restaurants in this area is a mistake and it will only hurt the quality of life of the people living in the neighborhood are there any other members of the public wishing to speak on this docket at this time we will close public comment and move it back to the board for consideration I think first what I might ask well first I'd like to to state that with the trash pickup times and noise I would definitely recommend to the neighbors again if you haven't been able to seek relief with the owner of the adjacent restaurant for you to please use the resources of this left board and other folks who in town who do deal with with noise complaints that is something that we have put in our in terms of pickup times typically 7 a.m. is the time that we put in our conditions for the start of refuse pickup that's typically one of our standard conditions so I do want to address that point to start and I would ask the applicant at this point hearing from what would be your neighbors the concerns that they have about the odors and filtration I'm not sure if you have a kitchen consultant on board to be interested whether it's or use the applicant can address some of those concerns well yeah we definitely don't want to have upset neighbors that's the last thing we want our neighbors to address who so we're definitely open to looking into the charcoal canisters comes down to cost if there are a hundred thousand dollars there's no way if it's a reasonable cost if it's the difference between or getting charcoal ones and doing that we're definitely open to doing that fixing it does sound like it's a talent application though you know it wasn't we are a little further away from that particular house but I do understand their concerns and you want to address those and it is a B3 zone and the restaurant is allowed B3 zone and that's why the zoning bylaw was written that way so it's not that we're coming in with some sort of an aberration this is something that is contemplated by the zoning bylaw we're going to work with neighbors and I'm going to adopt what Alex is saying look into what you can do to try to alleviate any issue that might arise great, thank you so we'll start with camp and we'll move through with the members of the board again I think what we've discussed just if I can summarize so far we've discussed a transportation demand management plan being required administratively as part of the parking relief request again we talked about the fact that you were looking to frost the glass below the bar at the front and but there would be no graphics or frosting above that so that people can see into the space and we I think can put in to the requirements limitations on the time the start time for trash pickup we'll discuss any requirements we might want to put in regarding filtration for your exhaust systems and the other item that I might suggest as well is to work together with the landlord to see if there is again this I believe that that's the town sidewalk where the, is that correct where the refuse cans are currently kept I don't know where the property line is because again that's our town tavern so I might suggest that it looks like it's a public life for you to work together with the landlord and the other tenants to identify a containment area that's screened perhaps for the trash pickup I'm just going to suggest that to my colleagues that those be the items that we that we discuss that property has no area to have a screened area for trash it's a really tough area I don't encourage and I'm not saying you guys have but put the trash out in front of the mass app that's a mountain starter I know a couple of restaurants up the street do that and that's just not what we want to encourage I'm not sure how we can stop that as we do what they call it drop on demand drop off so they come in during business hours and just go down to your space and get it it costs a little bit more for the trash refuge but that may also mitigate the fact that you're controlling where your trash is so it minimizes the rat problem because it's not out on the street where they get the food I'm assuming you're going to keep the place where your store trash cleans so it's not going to encourage that problem there so you're not leaving food out on the street to encourage rats those plastic bales are not rat safe they're just barrel frozen okay so that is something I would encourage you to look into similar to the grass the grease pickup don't store it outside don't store it in the hallway store it on your property and then when you make a deal with the trash haulers hey, it's here, you have to come get it and it might be a little bit more but it's maybe just during business that's what you're going to have to deal with I would suggest using charcoal both because I am not sure if that would work or not in the past I have not seen it work well I'm not trying to say that don't use it I would try it and what you're trying to do is also by turning lower up to front and trying to disperse it it makes it regular so it's not as strong is it going to get over there? yeah but is it going to be strong because it's already had a chance to mix that's what I would try to allude to it when you blow it to the front I'm not saying put the rumor right at someone's window that's the maximum it's not a central strength but you pull it further away it has some chance to mix with the regular air so it's not as strong that was just all I was saying I'm not saying it's going to get rid of it I'm just trying to figure out ways to make this zoned area work for what you want to put in there you know I think that's all and I do want to add one more thing that you didn't have there we asked them to look at to increase the lighting to make it more welcoming and more street friendly so I would like to add that into that it only helps you guys open it free so on the trash do you have to contract with the trash pickup or is that in your rent in the landlord with the contact in the company so we could put something in the special permit for them that says they need to you know have the person go down in the steps to pick up the trash and we usually put something in special permits that say the hours of trash pickup and it's never a five in the middle it's seven so I think it's usually seven to five or something like that so something like that so we could put that in that's for that's in general yeah so it's deliveries and pickup but that's that's fine that's standard I thought you meant by having quite a pickup that's the extra piece that Jesus suggests that's something the next authority is putting on as a right because there as a right have business there because what I'm going to suggest is that we should find out who in the town we should contact to say look these trash cans are kept out on a public sidewalk I don't know if it's the board of power and I'll use an example when you know we do a project in Newbury students some of those have dedicated dumpster some of them don't either refrigerated trash area for on-demand pickup or on-demand pickup as opposed to so this is not dissimilar in Arlington you have some areas that have dumpster areas for dumpsters that don't we haven't had one come in front of us recently that does not have a dumpster area I don't want to I totally agree about not wanting to put it on do burden on somebody I completely understand but at the same time I think we have to come up with a solution that works and leaving those unsecured refuse cans does not seem you know what I'm saying I agree with you, that's not the thing and do we ask where I'm going to speak to the head of the board of power or do we not know about this well I don't want to tie in town cabins this is separate nothing to do with this I hear and if the but the neighbors the neighbors can certainly talk to the select board about that also if the neighbors think that charcoal filters is a potential solution I'd say let's have them put it in if it's cost if it's cost effective yeah I mean I don't really think I have anything to add okay, Steve nothing further from you Adam Chair great so not knowing personally enough about the different types of filtration systems I don't feel that we have dispessed it at length enough to specify a specific filter type that's my concern with this but I think that we can identify that with the applicant to employ enhanced filtration techniques to decrease the amount of odors that are in placement you know we can talk about placement and again enhanced filtration but I think that that's as far as I would propose that today we can go as a board and perhaps Claire that's something that in future we can work with some of the staff members to identify some future measures with more specificity yeah can we ask that the staff do administrative review we could we could we could do that okay and then what if there was one other comment I'm sorry can you repeat that louder so that it can be picked up just the last item Adam Chair one comment that we also heard about the do not block this driveway exactly where that was but given that we do know that parking we are really parking if there's some signage that we could do to support that I don't know if that's offsite but is that something we could consider as a enhancement to this project? I think adding a small site is not a problem I think it's less the issue for them it's the corner market that's right at that corner that when you come you turn and just park your hook if you run into the market grab something this is in the middle of a lot much so but adding a sign is not a problem so you don't block the neighbors I think that's fine common courtesy don't see why people don't have that okay just taking this can I add something please I don't have an issue if I could buy them a sign if they want to put it on their property right by their parking lot I don't have a driveway we're talking about putting a sign in your restaurant please don't park in a neighbor's or block neighbors' driver that's all we're not talking about finding your counter just reminding your customers to be mindful of the neighbors work with your neighbors your customers are blocking you in talk to your neighbors please don't block them please your neighbors okay so I would propose to see if there is a motion to approve this docket number to approve docket number 3730 for 185 Massachusetts Avenue with the following conditions that trash pickup and delivery times be specified in the special conditions to be no earlier than 7 a.m. to include the requirement for on-demand trash pickup since there is no dedicated dumpster space or trash enclosure available at this property trash and oil in the U.S. half way to to specify enhanced filtration for the purpose of odor in particular mitigation and orient the exhaust towards Massachusetts Avenue that proposal is to be reviewed administratively with the staff what you propose for the enhanced filtration and for you to include a transportation demand management plan using the training strategies that we had discussed earlier which again will be reviewed administratively with the staff so any and I'm sorry and the last item is to ensure that the entry underneath the socket is well lit is there anything else is there someone who would like to make that motion so motion second we'll take a little call though starting with Steve yes Jeanne yes appreciate it thank you very much for everyone who came out to speak this evening great so that now closes docket number 3730 for 185 Massachusetts Avenue the next item on our agenda is the continued public hearing for docket number 3717 at 80 Broadway and I would invite the applicants to please join us here in the front I'd rather keep keep moving so that we can all get out of here at a reasonable time find your application here give me one second 80 Broadway here we go great is your entire team here you ready to go okay fantastic no worries so at this time we will reopen continued public hearing docket number 3717 for 80 Broadway and take this the same format that we did previously we'll ask Claire for any updates that she has from the department we'll open it up to you for 10 minutes for you to be able to excuse me 15 minutes because it's a slightly larger project for you to be able to give us an overview on any of the updates that you've made we'll then take questions from the board open it up for public comment and then back to the board alright so Claire please take it away we have an updated memo provided after the continuance of the previous meeting in early November where the applicant has provided the board with the materials requested including shadow studies, e-checklist TBM plan some additional designs along to bike parking in a few minutes basically the items and issues that were brought up in the previous meeting the applicant has addressed those that's it thank you thank you I just want to just briefly I'm sorry if I could ask you since we're recording this for the record if you could please introduce yourself again thank you I'm Robert Costello I'm joined by Paul O'Connell we're the principals of the projects and David Freed is our architect we thought that in the interest of efficiency we would the board had a lot of nice suggestions we went back the best we can to bring it back to you and we thought we'd just itemize them and go through them so if it's okay we can just go to the shadow studies for the record my name is David Freed I'm a technical company you speak up some of the items that came up at the last meeting was about the orientation of the sub studies so we had gone and we looked at that and these are accurate for summer this spring and the fall and we've added the additional house for the neighborhood that is here Robert and if you look through the different periods and solstices you can see that we really don't cast much shadow on the butters and you don't cast shadows on that one property with the solar panels on it which was a concern do you want to please revisit the orientation question because I think it's one letter that I read we did we did have you work there on every drawing and if you want to verify that I could include the existing conditions plot plan which also has the north arrow and salient mutation just for these verification there was there were some questions about the orientation of the open space at the yard so in the beginning of the presentation you should have calculated the first word for the commercial versus the west yard presidential to the landscape you want to flip to the plans we did build out the unit plans the building again has nine units one of these would be a commercial unit the other units are all of the bedrooms and they range from about 700 to 800 I gave intentions to try to keep the living spaces on the front here especially on the corner this unit it didn't work out that way but basically the phases we have activated by the living space I'll give you some answers step backs if we go to the site plan in one we've mentioned all the setbacks from the hotlines so we have a 7.5 foot setback off of Broadway and we also have more than three for a setback on a a 8.5 foot for the 5th floor created adjustment on the 4th floor to setback the corner of the building on the 3rd and so we would contain too much without really affecting the unit but actually tool softens that and is a possible possible project we explored some changes on the 1st floor facade of the elevation in 2-1 there was a discussion about possibly providing some public space on a roof deck so we would some sort of metal version on the top of the roof deck and we kind of put that voice on with some interviews over the windows and then again some screening of the other folks working there to get the scouts in there and it just really makes it a bit more available scale-wise but while you're gathering your thoughts before the lead unit and which space you would utilize in looking at it with the exception of the top floor which is a 2 bedroom that's the only 2 bedroom they're all 1 units so we saw them as all pretty much equal so we were open to down the line to count and choose each one they thought was the best to utilize there was some comments saying that at the back they're all fairly equal and we'd be open to that instead of us dictating we also looked into lighting for the parking and we provided a lighting plan and I submitted a photometric plan to Kelly basically that generated the photometric plan which basically showed the intensity of the cameras on the surfaces of the asphalt so it's really right around here but it gets dark very quickly so that there's really no light pollution on the neighbors on the white space I think those were really all the issues that came up and the team addressing those and taking us through those changes personally I'd like to say that I appreciate the changes that were made the scale that we talked about really comes through in terms of the pedestrian level and the screening options as well and the way that those are in the same language but some visual interest at the various places where they've been used is very effective so thank you for that I will now turn it off to my colleagues for any further questions or comments starting with Kelly I agree with Richard there we have a very handsome project there and I like it I think it fits in well the changes you made I appreciate I have you have wall packs on the west elevation that's facing your neighbor can I ask you to take those off and put in broader lights in the parking there so you have enough light and safety for the people parking but the lights are shining back not away from the building I have a feeling that even though the light bulbs are fairly low they're below one you'll see a light pack but if you face the direction facing you know what I'm talking about are you referring to this elevation here nope, the other one this one we're going where up there is the WP that's the wall packs you have them up like they're shining down but your neighbor is going to look right at that thing so if you take those off put them around on the parking parking level there and shine down at the parking field so it's a safe field you'll be fine and also I do the same you have a wall pack on the other side on the south side and I don't see one so I think you'll find on that side there having some light on Broadway is good if you're alive in the street with your commercial space I appreciate that but just when you face the neighbors I just want you to get the light to go which you got there is fine there are all one better routes I don't think that's adding a big burden tent any school system or anything like that you know so I think this is a great fit and I think it'd be good for the neighborhood great, thank you thank you Ken, Gene one of the other things you did was submit a transportation demand management plan and I don't know other people had an opportunity to look at it but yeah I have a lot of concerns about the transportation demand management plan where do I start the the commercial space doesn't require any part right and you require nine spaces for the residential units are asking us to reduce them to six so in my opinion the six are reserved for the residents and yet your transportation demand management plan says that the commercial tenants can use it I think unless you can come up with using why that's necessary I can't see why we would allow the commercial tenants to use the residential spaces it also the plan also didn't say how you would allocate the nine units the six parking spaces so think about how you do that I think the easiest one is three people are told in their lease to have a parking space or something like that I think that's going to be absolutely necessary can you put up the pay I'm going to stand up can you put up the pay can you just scroll up yes there you go so the regulations say 24 but the regulations say 24 feet these are 24 feet this is less than 24 feet so I'm not opposed to it but we're going to have to grant a little bit of a waiver one of the other ones had to take the longest so it's not can you go to the that's it this one is a year and so it really is 24 so we're going to have to do something with the lease because we're not going to have space the can you put up the shadow study can you put up the window sausage that's it window sausage okay so can you help me out with this for 9 a.m. I went there two days from now and this shows lots of shadow rich shadow is your building going to pass a big shadow I'm sorry can you just project a bit because we can't sorry that's okay thank you I think if you just sort of transmit this line that's our building and then this is winter and this is the house on Broadway here this is just the shadow that was generated by this so I understand this correctly then at 9 a.m. on winter morning your building is casting no shadow on this house and a shadow on a front third maybe of the house in front okay that you on a winter day if I read this correctly how much shadow is your building casting so our building like that this is our shadow no shadow on either of the two buildings correct let's take a look at what time is this 5 3 p.m. that's 7.15 that's 3 p.m. on the left okay 3 p.m. so 3 p.m. the shadows are going this way so is it fair to say that all of these the shadows are arranged on the house two over or not being shadow either of them that's a good study show and they're accurate in terms of the direction of the orientation of the building and the sun so yeah I would say that we're not casting shadows on that but we did this study we had a modern program so can you just do the fall spring okay so fall so fall at 9 a.m. is your building casting what shadows is your building casting are building this so just again casting on the front for the let's go to the next one which is noon and it's not casting any shadow on the building and again it's not casting any shadow on the building did you see the letter we got from someone that showed something else how would you respond I did see that I saw it I know it's any extremist area so I didn't study I believe the gentleman was saying but I looked closely at this with David and his team and I don't know how to end up their analysis but I don't want to judge it one way or the other okay yeah thanks that was helpful and we don't understand that are you going to have an electric charger or cannot for electric cars we certainly can't we hadn't I mean it's not in the regulations what we're usually asking people to do that would be great I think more people are getting electric cars will have in terms of attracting people to be there so the setback if you can go to one please that shows the parking area I'm sorry I didn't do it in the order of that's good so this is supposed to be here is there like a five foot between if we could go to A10 I have that to make sure so our plan for this Nero's to two foot three six we have almost nine feet to the side of it here it's five feet Nero's kind of called for a six foot two tall building fence just to walk any hand like this yeah can you step back on the fourth floor of the building on the two foot on the side we don't on the Broadway side on the Broadway side you could say that the building does step back along the street because we started seven and a half a year and it gets larger the number increases and then here we have a setback of eight foot three on the fourth floor and 18 and a half feet on the fifth floor great thank you thank you Jean I appreciate the applicant coming back with the revision and study and I feel like I like the design so I like the enhancement I have a few questions could we go back to we just had it up sheet A10 the planting by apple side yes that one so there's a planting schedule down in the bottom left now our conservation commission has assembled a list of preferred native plants and I went through those and found that most of them were down the list and I was wondering if you would consider trying to find substitutes find native substitutes and if this could this seems like something that could be done administratively so that's number one number two is just a question can we go to sheet A2.2 it's got an exterior view of the south side of the building is this one for you that one the section in the middle without any fenestration it looks like that's where the stairwells are located it's not really an opportunity to put in more windows there and still have them alive we can put we can put some windows on them sure I can put some windows up here on these our landings would be about here so I can put windows here sure and eliminate the stairwells and the side and also for the people down the street that see that side it's better not to have a big solid something to bring it up okay long-term bike storage so I saw the the Dero racks that you did propose and it looks like they're the kind with a little hangings you basically put a stuff the front wheel through a stub there's a property at I think 117 Broadway that uses a similar system I'd ask you to consider a different option if there's room for it so the same manufacturer Dero makes a rack called the Decker and it's an over-under configuration but there's a mechanical assist for getting the lights to the top racks so you basically slide out a tray put the bike onto the tray and then it helps you lift it back up I'm sorry I did explore that, it's a double Decker and I was only able to get three racks in there 12 bikes so that's why I went to the other version to whatever that worked on first I think the requirement is 14 spaces and it sounds like you've already investigated the alternative that I'm suggesting I looked at it a bunch of ways I was trying to really tight on space, I was trying to make it work but you want the dimensions to work so people can get in and out of access to the bikes so I didn't want to cram them in there not in all of the dimensions of the manufacturer so you've already thought this through so that's fine next now at the time I reviewed the updated materials I didn't see the transportation demand management plan that was uploaded yesterday or alright for Friday my apologies for asking you briefly summarize it but could you briefly summarize it I believe it I think basically sorry are you looking for in terms of the goals summarize in terms of there's a lot in there so what specifically are you specifically one of the things maybe in there I apologize for not having founded these are rental units would you consider unbundling parking spaces from rent so basically there would be a base rent for the apartment tenants that wanted a parking space would pay an additional fee tenants that didn't need a parking space would not pay the additional fee would certainly be open to it I'm just going to Mr. Benson's point there was a question as to who would use which ones so what you're saying is no one unit automatically has one and then as there's at least turnover we decide okay there's a space available we were certainly doing that is a method of allocation which is what Gene had suggested yes if I sub method that is one certainly I'd prefer it's a method of allocation and it's also a method of demand management because someone who discourages from someone just keeping the car just because they have free space so regarding the signs I believe there is the two signs are just slightly so yeah the Broadway sign is 39.9 square feet and the winter street sign is about 37 and a half now we limit wall signs to a maximum of 40 square feet per business so you're asking for is the intention to have two different areas for two different businesses I know they both show monotony why I've read that it was one wall sign for frontage and two signs maximum for property so that's why I put one on the dirt and one on the Broadway just to clarify this is are you including a request for signage approval for that particular sign as part of this package if not then I would say let's take that off and let's typically include as a special condition that any signage be separately reviewed in it and approved once a tenant is identified that would be great and I just have one final question for the fifth story since this is a dual height district one of the things that we have to find or we have a determination that we have to make is that districts would not be adversely affected due to existing user topographic condition basically that the other the additional floor doesn't impose an adverse condition and I was wondering how would you make that case I think that the fact that the floor is set back substantially on all sides reduces the visibility of the fifth floor I think the rendering show not the best if let me get an 825 or an 825 so it doesn't look like a full story it seems in the street that's just because we have to make a determination I was curious how you would make that argument for that determination that's it Madam Chair great thank you very much any other questions that we applicant from the board before we open this up for public comment I can probably don't know the answer to this but what I was hoping what we didn't ask last time was to have a shadow study that we carried together without the fifth floor and with the fifth floor can you just give me an estimate about what the difference would be in terms of the shadows let me see let me see if we could if we could zoom in on all of these for instance on the fifth floor in this study the fifth floor really cast a shadow itself on top of the floor below if we want to the first floor when there's always that shadow we're just going to get to this we're just a bunch of shadows where the floor is I look at that there it is it's hard to really discern that without taking that off we're generating less study for that I can't see the fourth floor how high is the fourth it's a 10 for 4 10 any other questions? alright so at this time I'd like to open for hearing up to public comment any person who's joined us this evening who would like to speak please raise your hand and we'll call on you yes and as before if you wouldn't mind you can use that seat right there or stand and introduce yourself by first, last name and address and you'll have up to 3 minutes to speak okay I'm going back up at only 7 that's our community yes please go ahead thank you so much yeah so I've got a few points there I think the most important things are really being addressed here this building sits in the president for buildings in the town higher than most residents being acceptable in the odds and latest master plan for small groups are just a general point I would like to use sunlight and solar panels so while they've done the study I think there's eventually another studies to look carefully at and you know just you know the refill record is in allowing the residential developer without enemies for open space okay so the detail points here and you know I heard seven and a half feet setback on the the Broadway side well right here I've got zoned by section 538 requires 20 foot setbacks on both Broadway and the street frontages okay so the plans show okay so I guess it's changed since this was written no setback on Broadway but it's seven and a half feet I heard and then if you go to the street I see there's seven and a half but no there's some required seven and a half so that's not that's not adequate um so also there's there's a number of zoning by losses this filing and you look to carefully down very close to this disregarding of zoning laws the photo last any useful open space is only by law section 5 321 the required is useful open space to at least 20% of the residential floor area okay and due to this location near Watts used for two fairly homes and it's limited it's limited to a height at the most four stories and 50 feet you know unless you find there this property wouldn't adversely affect the existing use and the type of traffic condition obviously this is greatly different anything on Broadway setting a terrible precedent but maybe there's some things that could be redesigned about it like this I don't know setbacks let number of levels or whatever but I don't see that just approved at this point so you're right at time so you could back up that yeah great thank you so much anyone else wishing to speak this evening please I did some across the street so I think maybe looking at the problems that we should contact the shadow studies they worry me because I think that the shadow is not going to hit two houses to the wall the shadow is going to hit all across on the triple trackers in Broadway that's where the sun's going to hit and not just on interstates all winter so I think that I'm so sorry to interrupt you would you mind just speaking a little bit louder no that's okay I can't hear you I think that the shadow is going to be cast across the street on all the triple trackers not the two houses so it would have been good to see the effect more context across the street and where the shadow is hitting so that part worries me a lot because if you look we don't really see anything across the street then that's right you can see the path of the shadow it's just the people all across on Broadway and then maybe if you showed the scale of the building if you showed context what is there existing next to the scale of the building maybe it's easier to understand maybe inform and set datums that exist around in the neighborhood right now it does seem overwhelming but maybe respecting the triple trackers across the street and creating data across that line maybe it's set back there either financially that's not desirable maybe but creating a set back where the existing datum liners may be helpful and just easing it making it fit in the neighborhood just respecting the context thank you anyone else wishing to speak please Terry Chew thank you Terry Chew, 88 Broadway just wanted to say that I don't understand why 5 story building is being allowed it sounds like in the more recent zoning updated for this building in a block like mine it's limited to 4 stories this block in particular is not very long any large building will overwhelm the look of the neighborhood and I appreciate the architect updating the shadow studies but I'm still a little suspect about the winter mornings that hopes to me like it is still shadowing significantly but even though a little more than half of the residents on my block are renters that don't have any arms or haven't been here for a long time I was raised in Arlington I've lived on this block for over 15 years and I've been working remotely for 3 years the majority of my sunlight is coming from the direction of winter street for anyone pointing out the large trees on the southwest side of the house the houses on my block all have back porches and back stairwells there are only a couple of windows on the back of the house they are not getting majority of the sunlight in that direction I do worry that allowing a special project will encourage other large buildings to be built on Broadway Broadway is a smaller street than Mass Ave and less commercial large projects will negatively affect the looking feel of Broadway in 117 Broadway which was completed not long ago I think sticks out like a sore thumb it's listed at four stories high the block that 117 Broadway is on is only commercial buildings and you see there are no residents around I implore the board to consider the well-being of the residents in the area thank you is there anyone else who would like to speak please Mr. Street two questions basically what is the height to the top of the penthouse 55 now what is the zoning requirement in this district if you want to ask your questions we can reply to all of them in terms of snow removal you have a place on the site push it up I didn't see much I don't know I can just drag it up to the street that's basically good questions thank you I do think that in terms of snow removal and fortunate that the building is part of the parking lot so there won't be snow that we have any time with and I'll just add that snow removal conditions are special conditions in terms of the owner being able to deal with snow removal on their lot that is one of the special conditions that is there any other questions or comments from the public this evening thank you I'd like to listen to just a few of the deficiencies I think are still in the part of the materials the application materials the application the table of intentional parking information is not been revised and still contains errors I don't think the information on the plans cuts it and we just submit that revised table with the correct information the shadow study as Mr. Selson points out is very arbitrary in the times it takes you can't just look at the roofs of the buildings that's not what affects people except their solar panels you also have to look at how the walls are and clearly the neighbors will be affected by this I also think the 3D renderings that were provided don't adequately show the neighboring properties particularly on Broadway so you really don't get a sense of how much larger this is I think it's ironic that the developer was responsible for the Johnny Dees development in Somerville they couldn't build this building at that site at the time that that Johnny Dees redevelopment was too tall so they come to Arlington and set a new height record for Broadway this would be the tallest building on Broadway way out of character also the renderings don't show the permanent accessory building unit in the abutting property on Winter Street and finally to spend some time at the height when it is four stories that's the default it's up to the pool to make a finding that there's no afterwards in fact I don't see how you can do that and finally I would just say given the multiple zoning violations on the setbacks of the open space in particular this would be a very easy permit to appeal should you improve it as is and if anyone's interested in appealing please head in touch with them who knows a bit about this thank you anyone else who should speak this evening so with that we will close public comment and turn it back to the board for any additional thoughts or comments and we'll start back down with Steve I would like to address first commenter's remark about section 538 so section 538 is basic is essentially which gives us a requirement that corner lots have to front yards so another section that also plays into this is 536 which gives us in the process of the environmental designer to do the process of the ability to get setbacks based on site specific conditions and without speaking for the board you know the fact that this is if this were an R2 corner next to two R2s then yes 538 would absolutely be what you would expect but the fact that it is a different district than the surrounding ones and the fact that our setbacks are used based rather than district based at least not speaking for the rest of the board is an exceptional commission thank you Madam Chair thank you I guess I'm sensitive to you know the terms around the neighborhood that we have of this design thank you and I'll just build on that I do want to thank the development team I think that you've been very thoughtful again in the way that you've worked through the massing to ensure that we have not only multiple setbacks but also usable space in the various in the balcony that was created and I again really appreciate the thoughtful consideration thank you Jean so the height of this building is allowed under the zone and the number of stories is allowed at this location under the zone that we since the Red Alive Commission it happens to be a business zone with some residential properties around that is concerned about the shadow studies because it's an area that as we already said is as this part of the zoning borrower that says either four or five stories we can say five and we won't say five it has to be four and we can say five unless we find that it will have an adverse impact on the air definition of what adverse impact is in the zoning borrower so we have to struggle with that the properties across the street and it's adverse impact on residential zone one and two and the properties across the street on Broadway are also in the business district so that impact analysis doesn't apply to the properties under the residential in the business district so from strictly looking at bylaw it's an acceptable height we have the authority to adjust the setbacks under the bylaw they've made adjustments so they need one of the two open space requirements and they need to know they're accepting 25 square foot piece in one place which we feel we have the authority to say but we've met close enough so that it's okay we have the authority to reduce the number of parking spaces in which we discussed to have a transportation management plan they need to do some work on it because the bus routes don't even exist very much longer on it they need to figure out a space allocation so you don't end up with six tenants or seven tenants in the park I'm not sure they have enough I could have the right section I'm not sure they have enough distance between their parking and the navy sorry okay so if the room was either 10 feet from all lot lines about any property or power for sliding their lot lines to setback we don't need to do five feet with the setback and the solid roller and fence but I don't think we need to do the five feet it varies so I would say they need to come back to us five feet to meet the requirement of 6.1.11d so they're not quite at five feet so they need to do a little bit of work on that to meet the requirements there are some shadows if the shadows were on the solar panels I wouldn't read about this if the shadows were on some of the adjacent buildings for most of the year I would feel very different about it I'm going to have an actual definition of first impact but I feel like based on these shadow studies there's not enough adverse impact to say no to this particular development because it meets all of the other criteria that's pretty much where I am we need to see a better to the end and we need to do something with the area between the parking and the other and the other projects Thank you Gene, Ken You're very supportive of this project I think it's a good project I'm glad Gene explained all the requirements that we have that you guys can meet that's very well said I do have one more or two more suggestions for you guys on the transportation management plan having the parking spaces separate rent is a good thing but also you might want to say those spaces be shared so what you do is I know in some towns when they say ok if a commuter is renting that space that's their space but during the daytime when they're not there you can become a commercial space I would not agree never mind scratch that one there another way of increasing traffic increasing parking that's all but if you guys are not for that I'm ok with that as far as the other comment about 5 feet where Gene said I would just reduce the two parking spaces at the end over there 16 footers and then get there we can allow yes we can and then you all sit there and I would make that an administrative adjustment I would say too that we've allowed the transportation management plan as an administrative approval as well in terms of what I've heard this evening let me just recap for the board the items that I've heard there's a request for adjustments to the project there are removing the wall packs on the facade of the building that faces the neighbors and replacing those with ballers that are facing back towards the building that's on the parking side of your building there is allocating these six spaces to your tenants and adjusting your transportation to the management plan to be very specific about how those are allocated adding an EV charging station to your parking updating your planting schedule to use native plant species as has been identified by the town adding windows on the south side of your building of the stair landing to decrease the amount of unpenestrated wall space we will add a special condition for separate signage review and approval once your tenant has been identified and has a sign that they are ready to submit we will also ask that you adjust the less two spaces where it can less two spaces to be 16 foot compact parking spaces to ensure that you are able to comply with the with the the landscape buffer thank you is there anything else from the board so sorry I just wanted to confirm that south side window yes it's the side that faces one street that's south they're not adjacent neighbors it's one thing I was thinking about because sometimes I like the idea of the windows suggestion if it's lit all the time it's just a more tight that is a good point Melissa so we can that is not a major break to me yeah the windows could be have many lights in them or something so it would be less white maybe it's just about 15 light so I think the lights on the incident landings so it's basically toward the street more right well I guess what I was worried about is that's adjacent to the neighbor right there right so if they're lit 24-7 like that most of those common stairwells are then you have light so that's what I was thinking that's true it's true check with the bill I'm not sure that's allowed it's not a major break you're not allowed to do that or if I don't know if window tim dig is an option it's just not a major break but I just want to have some consideration of that maybe it's not about a panel maybe it's a window in that way yeah we could panel it it's not I'd honestly rather you not mess with that facade than try and introduce another I personally don't like there isn't much going on on that side of the building well it's balanced, it looks nice to me right now inside the seat you don't see it necessarily from the street to be honest because of the stairwell I was expecting you know we can't do anything there but I just wanted to mention it if it turns out to be a real problem well then we talked about it and decided that wasn't such a great idea after all that's fine but it sounds like a couple options either motion activated light or some sort of shading to diffuse the light we could again leave that one up to administrative review but I would say that personally or we could decide right here I personally I think after talking it through further don't see it as necessary add to that but we could also leave that item up to administrative review after reviewing the lighting options to ensure that there is not light still from that stair to the adjacent property there's a trade up between the light still and the natural light in our space to reduce energy right so I think that's the balance trying to be as straight right and then obviously impact may I just comment I think Mr. Lau's comment about the safety from the fire department standard I think we have done it all the time so just aesthetically I'm thinking it's a fair point and I would like to just leave it alone but it will be in 24 hours I have no issue with it I find keeping it as is definitely not going to be as pride as we know it is for large well even a couple of things we need to make a finding under 539 about the reduced buffer area we need to make the findings so that we can change the setback requirements and we need to accept the slightly different open space setting okay so Jean when we make the motion I'm going to ask you because you stated them so eloquently you can Jean you can and I'm going to ask you to do that piece is there anything else well so here's the thing I'd like to add to this if it turns out that their shadow study is wrong they have to come back to us how are we going to determine the neighbors will tell us if their shadow study is wrong I don't think that that's a contingency that we can put on there well we could always have them come back and we could say that I think we could always have you come back and say you violated the protocol again I let's not get it all okay fine I withdraw that statement so I'm going to suggest a motion and then actually Jean why don't you do the findings first that needs to be part of the motion so I don't believe it does I think we just need to state the findings well we just need to state the findings so if you could restate the findings and then I will suggest a motion yes and the findings Jean is stating the findings and then I will suggest the motion with things the findings under 5 3 19 is that you would not have an adversely not universally effective conditions we are suggesting the setbacks under 5 3 16 thank you 5 3 16 and we are finding that the building needs to be a apartment for story building setbacks and we are finding that the usable open space and the landscape open space is acceptable that's it and we are reducing the parking requirements and expense for the transportation thank you Jean so is there a motion to approve the the project as revised with the following special conditions that with the following changes and then I will get to the special conditions the following changes that the TDM plan be updated and reviewed and approved administratively by the staff including the allocation the specificity around the allocation of the spaces and that they all be for the residents and that they all be for the residents and that that you that the project add in EV charging station that the planting schedule be revised to use native species of plants as determined by the town and we will add the special condition that a separate review and approval is required for the selection of affordable units between you and staff just so you select one this is important we will also have the selection of the affordable units be in conjunction with the Department of Planning and Community Development you have to be after the build you just want to walk it and determine as you work together with structure for it is a motion is there a second take a roll call vote starting with Steve yes Jeanne congratulations for bringing such an interesting project thank you for all the comments and feedback it was very helpful thank you all right at this time we will close docket number 3717 for 80 Broadway and we will move to our fourth agenda item which is open forum so I see everyone packing up but if there is anyone remaining who would like to speak please raise your hands ok seeing none we will close open forum and open agenda item number five which is new business so Claire is there anything that you have for new business that you would like to review with the board nothing all that big news although 10 sunny side has been approved by the state for 40B and then it is a project that will be done by the cousin corporation they are making the initial presentation for select board on Wednesday night they have asked me to write a letter in support I think that is probably fine I think they are looking to do a significant number of units 40 yep it is a great great spot it is right by you know why sunny side has like practically two streets in Steve knows you are great so it is a wonderful spot you are getting some great new neighbors I am looking forward to I am looking forward to the prospect of having new neighbors it is a lot 40B it is a big lift it is a great spot it is close to Clarendon hill it is a short walk to Davis square there is a supermarket right there there is in the 15 years that I have lived on sunny side I have never driven regularly for a commute so it is and the place the current site is blighted so I am really excited to see great walk to Davis square so that is the business I have that project underway thank you so much any other items from the board in your new business alright so seeing no further new business is there a motion to adjourn so motion second alright take about starting with Steve Melissa Gene Ken and yes as well thank you for joining us this evening