Alright thanks for staying with us now. A student loan is a type of loan designed to help students pay for post-secondary education and the associated fees such as tuition, books and supplies and living expenses. Now it may differ from other types of loan in the fact that the interest rate may be substantially lower than the repayment shadow and the repayment shadow may be deferred while the student is still in school. Now with a student loan bill that was recently passed into law today we're asking what the future is of the Nigerian educational system, what would it look like? Now please let's hear what you have to say remember you can join the conversation send us an SMS or WhatsApp to 080384663. Alright so ladies I just want to hear your quick thoughts then I will bring in Uti. What do you think how do you think this student act now the student bill or student loan act how would it play out when it comes to our structures in terms of education? The only fear me I have right I think I had read it out on Monday the criteria something around the minimum amount that should be in the family account should be about 500,000 then also you have to bring two guarantors and again from the list of the guarantors you have to have a civil servant that has a level 12 somebody in the judiciary system somebody you know that's practiced law for over 10 years I'm wondering how do we meet up with those kinds of you know criteria and today I just recently heard again about if you've had any issues around drugs or you've been indicted and all of that you will not be eligible to access that loan so I mean so for me I just feel like I don't know those conditions how would it play out because really the people that truly need to access loans right how would how would they be able to afford that especially the minimum family income you know so I'm not sure when it's 500 I think they say 500,000 and below that's the eligibility oh is it below or above below 500 oh really for you're earning oh okay that means I must have gotten it all 500,000 that's that per annum that's so your income should be below 500,000 per annum not above no okay go ahead below that means my bad yeah so there's that and then I understand where you're coming from saying you don't know how it will affect because these are people first of all 500,000 is even on the family level because if it is a student loan I don't know how you have 500,000 in your account so I think this is from the family point of view in terms of your parents and no that's how that is actually a family family so it's less than you and your parents and less than 500,000 and you require a loan fine but you've been able to then again they have put all these measures in place so somehow I think the onus is on maybe your parents to help out to get like some of this you know the guarantors and making sure that your eligibility is in place like you have everything that would um allow you to be able to get the student loan and I know that they said um I think repayment is after two years so two years after NYU after completion of school after NYU so they're expecting that within the by then you should have gotten a job but also they have to consider the fact that the Nigerian the way the Nigerians assist them is the job market is not very easy so how what would happen and I also know that they have also brought out you know what would happen you know consequences of not being able to repay the loan you know jail deeds that so I'm wondering how how is it going to go it's really surprising because for me growing up I never knew anything about student loan I schooled in Nigeria and I never knew anything about student loan but I hear that our parents had student well between their time and our time it's kind of got scrapped yeah so it's new for our generation so there's a lot of getting used to and a lot of awareness that needs to be made yeah I don't think it is more of I need to understand what it will look like but let me come to you quickly because I need to bring in Otie so I share the same sentiment right um I think the part that cuts me was the part about the guarantors right and knowing that level of people who would need to sign as guarantors and I'm like okay for a family who is supposed to earn um 500 000 and below per annum if you divide 500 by 12 I mean earning that amount monthly is very small so I'm just like okay how would you need to know who do you need to call how would you get to that level who would you call to sign um as a guarantor for you and I feel like a lot of people will be very skeptical to want to sign knowing that okay you don't really have money like that so yeah okay so let me bring in Utie Aloo with experience in various disciplines including customer experience customer service customer loyalty digital marketing strategy content development and training both in public and private sector across two continents Utie Aloo has been exposed to exposed to and benefited from student loan system in the UK quality education various business style strategies and approaches and as you already know she is a proud member of WIS you know sometimes when we see this kind of topic and we know that we have our own we don't bother anybody because we have our experts inside the building with us but thank you so much Utie for agreeing to be with us tonight because I really didn't want us to have this conversation from just head knowledge I wanted it to be an experiential conversation so that perhaps our president allowing us to breathe and listening he can understand how the system works right and how it impacts somebody that have been used to it because I perhaps very scary stories Utie people that are living abroad education is not cheap some people spend their lifetime some people spend 40 years 20 years paying back student loan is not particularly a a good point for some people is a very sore point for them so I mean with what we understand Nigerian system to look like if you want to ask assess what's it called what the future of education would look like with student loan structure in place what do you see well it's a great start to the reforms that we need in the tertiary education sector we have a lot of challenges in that space and what I was most happy to see was that this is going to have a ripple effect because there are a lot of things that this opens a lot of doors but when you open doors what tends to happen if it's windy it blows away dust and it reveals a lot of things so what I see for me with this is first excitement because really what it offers is opportunity for a lot of people who may not have thought that it was possible for them to access tertiary education so first of all it opens those doors it gives access right but it does now this is almost like when you say the first step is the hardest right there are now so many other steps that have to be taken for you to get from point A to point B so this is the beginning of the journey but what does success look like which is the question we're asking today how is it going to impact the education sector so once you've given you've taken away one of the key barriers which is is funding right now I hear you know the comments that I've heard even you know as you ladies were speaking around the challenges with the application the application is actually not that cumbersome the truth is if you are getting a job today in Nigeria a graduate job you provide guarantors you would have to and there are stipulations around who you can provide as a guarantor maybe not as small a list as this but again you would have to provide guarantor so even drivers even not everybody if you are a nanny whatever you provide guarantor well so again let's remember that these you're aspiring to a better life so one Nigerians we make it we where there's a will there's a way so we will find people right for me the the guarantors are not the problem someone said this to me this morning the first thing I said to the person is let's remember first and foremost that university is not for everybody one of the key things that stood out for me in in the act when I read it it's actually a very short act I encourage everybody to go and read it when I read it was the fact that it wasn't just universities so it it comes all the way down to vocational colleges which is great so colleges of education vocational schools you know do we see this in federal and state universities right it covers the entire gamut so the fact is now it doesn't matter what level you want to study at you now have access to funding nobody's saying it's only doctor lawyer if you look historically at where um funding programs like this have started I'll use the american one as an example why did student loans what was the genesis of student loans in america it was the race for space so when the russians were beating america in getting to space the whole spotnik and all of that they asked why are we not why are we not competitive and they said well your education system you don't have enough people so they started off with um technology sort of based sciences math and all of that um those are the first people who had had access to loans in america and then they then broadened it they changed the act and then it became sort of a higher education fund and they've gone through various um circles various uh rewrites of their acts their policies they've gone through in fact i think america has tested it the most both from federal loans to private loans to a mix they've done everything and i mean we all know the horror stories in america the kind of interest rates that are charged of course there they have universities that are for profit and not for profit so by mistake you you you know you end up in a for-profit school well you're in trouble because you are now ending up with lots of debt so it essentially is a good entry point right it's it's the beginning of the journey that we're on and i'm sure as we go through the conversation we'll talk about what that journey is going to unfold and the areas it needs to impact because one of the key things for me that i said with this was you are going to bring in or rather let's take for example that this program is hugely successful as we hope it will be and you pull out a million graduates then you don't have a million jobs that's how loans start to default it's so interesting so when you talked about um expanding it to colleges of education and all of those things right do you see this like improving the quality of the education that we begin to get from some of these schools right things i am paying you know okay they say there's availability of loans and all of that and i'm paying for it why can't i get a standard quality education right if you see this improving impacting on the not just the fact that okay people will now go to school but the quality of what comes out in terms of the the graduates what we're turning out do you see this improving it in any way yeah so again there are other reforms that we expect to see first of all let's be clear when we go abroad Nigerians are happy to pay more for education but in Nigeria we like to pay peanuts right um and we expect it to be subsidized by the government we we've largely had that culture for a long time good things cost money right equipment education good lecturers good professors who are world-renowned these things all cost money when you look at CVs of md ceo you see harvard you see ncer you see as you see all these schools right all these schools they're not cheap if you just do one week two week three week program you are spending a few million naira just for the tuition not for full degree just a few weeks you know they just tell you this person has attended bum bum bum bum they're spending a lot of money so the reality is what we are paying today needs to increase the university will need to so now that you are being given a loan i expect one of the things i expect and the reforms i expect to see in that sector would change the way universities are charging and the way they're being won because they have to improve because now today what do we say about graduates they're not employable right now if i'm going to take a loan that i have to pay back then we must make sure that i'm employable so it also means that the government now needs to hold the education sector accountable now in the act as well it talks about providing reports about the performance of the students and that is part of the accountability because if you're not educating this guy well enough if he's not passing you cannot i can already see the default ahead that this person is not going to be able to pay my loan if you have students dropping out one thing the act doesn't account for is dropouts it talks about two years after nyc but if you don't graduate you can't go to nyc so what happens if you don't make it pass year two and you drop out there should be a clause for that so the fact i mean it's an act policies and and things once the the committee set up which is supposed to then run the fund i'm sure all of those things can be worked out those are finer details the act doesn't need to be that detailed but the fact is you need to make sure that everything that's that's the basics with loans because the money you're repaying as a as a as a someone who has taken this loan goes back into the fund which means more people can access the fund there was a there was a nice line in the act that says from i think application to disbursement is 30 days uh subject to availability of the fund must be funded so we have to make sure for this to be successful there must be reforms in the education sector the quality of information of education must improve the quality of the graduates must be improved that then leads to higher employability but then that also means that other parts of the economy must improve because there must now be jobs for them to go into when we're even looking at the the schools and things that so the remember i talked about the colleges of education and vocational studies you now need to look at you're creating a better standard of teachers people who are now going to you know what i love about it it's a ripple effect the minutes we get better teachers who are going into our primary schools and nursery schools you start to get a better quality of people going into the tertiary situation level because right now we're missing for a lot of people the skills that children learn as children when we talk today about Gen Z and we laugh a lot of the challenges we have there is an accent of critical reason these are things children pick up as children the ability to unwind your imagination because you've been taught the art of storytelling of creative thinking all of those things are missing right now so you can see that the quality of the teacher there is no quality of education do not thank you so when you look at all the other curriculum these curriculums are developing as they go on the Nigerian curriculum is still one plus you do you know what i mean so you when you're talking about how it's going to impact the system you can start to see that beyond even just money and the graduate you can see the ripple effect then you talk about on the vocational side today when we all talk about artisans we pull out our hair but the truth is imagine if we had well-run vocational in fact i want us to come back to that because there's something you talked you touched on when you were talking about america that i want us to revisit but let's go on a very short break when we come back from that break we'll continue the conversation all right thanks for staying with us now if you're just tuned in uh we're discussing the future of Nigeria um of course Nigerian education and we have our very own with us remember you can join the conversation then there's an sms or what that was where it one eight zero three four six six three so i want to come to the ladies do we have because there's something i just want to quickly follow up on what uti said linking it up to the vocational school you remember you said that america saw that there was a gap they wanted to go to space and all of that and they said why we're not going to space what what's happening nigeria currently we have gaps and i believe that um the schools that we truly need to really empower are the technical schools and vocational schools because those gaps right if we are able to quickly um you know bridge that gap some of the challenges that we have right now are not meant for university graduate they are meant for people that are coming out of technical schools and all of that right so do you think that i mean like speaking to to the people that are in charge of this would it be a fair idea to say you know what let's narrow this funding now because i remember there was something that professor yemi oshiba had talked about when he was trying to fund was it fund now or something they were supposed to do something around the educational and they were focused on specifics right i can't remember it now top of my head so do you think that it would be nice now for us as a way of incent incentivizing some of the gaps that we already have this channel this funding first of all at this first phase to things that we believe that okay for instance we have issues with infrastructure we have issues with rather probably road networking and all the so all those kind of costs courses that you would study that will bring immediate the solutions and immediate change to our current challenges would that be a wise thing for the government to consider well so if we take what has happened you know remember i said that university is not supposed to be for everybody um generally the government creates policies and creates you know bills and things like this to stimulate the nation the economy things that keep the wheels turning increasing the the gdg all of those things so sometimes we want the government to be altruistic charitable we think that they're just doing it for the good of the people what they're doing it for is the good of the nation right and the people are a part of that so typically i'll use the uk as an as an example at one point everybody was going to university nobody was going to vocational college so there was a shortage of plumbers there was a shortage of electrician there was a shortage of work like literally artisans what we call artisans so what they did was they had to make the vocational sector more attracted by incentivizing and in fact you could sort of see at that point in time that the call out fee for a plumber was huge so people are now looking like i want to become a plumber right so the fact is i mean when i worked for the australian government we used to get tons of young people from ireland all in vocational speed going to australia why because they had shortages they're building houses shortages of shortages of electricians if you're standing on the road with billboards going have jobs will hire right so imagine given the capital human capital that we have in this country if we were training our artisan to that level that they could go abroad because their certifications they have to have to be able to be eligible for this kind of program then effects is flowing into the country we're expanding the diaspora so it has that kind of ripple effect where yes do we need to focus on those people yes do we need to streamline it no i don't believe so because right now we have a huge funding problem so everybody will benefit from this right but we do need to look at those places for me why i say it's more important is because we have a larger informal sector than formal sector so our graduates and the job they're going into is a smaller number now if you were pumping out more teachers more carpenters these are people who would most likely be entrepreneurs and will be paying back their 10 percent because we're building houses they're constantly working mechanics they're the cars they're getting jobs they have more opportunity to hit the ground running quickly than the graduates who are trying to get maybe into financial services or telco with a more limited spec you know so that for me is where i say this i mean every other street has a school we need teachers we need quality teachers so that we can start that chain off the right way so i think yes we need to look at it but we're just starting let's even kick off let's see how this is going to governize the entire education sector but we need to start okay ladies so for me um i love uti she has said a lot on this but for me i come from i have more questions than yeah that's why yeah i know i have more questions so for me i i you know i saw it in the in the news that how they plan on actually where these funds will come from and you know they mentioned um nigerian one one percent from certain um agencies which would include uh customs nigerian immigration firs and i also understand that in the bead probably that's the reason why the firs has been you know on a lot of businesses and just trying to get their money out because one percent of that is supposed to go which should amount the combination should be to amount to a start off about 200 billion but would that work is that sustainable it is sustainable i mean first and foremost we all need to get into the habit of paying taxes so i pay my taxes so so um i mean we need to also collect taxes in a manner where it also doesn't hamper the SME sector the smaller micro you know enterprises because sometimes it's a bit the tactics there are a bit you know yes draconian but we need to get into the habit of paying taxes so we're expecting one percent from taxes tax levies and and that we're expecting one percent from the proceeds of petroleum product um but the part i actually want to touch on um and this is where i think that people also need to get into the habit of giving back so there's endowments there is contributions so again imagine if you've benefited so today a lot of people had cheap education all the people that are jackpot and that went to ui that went to us that went to all these places cheap education it's time to pay it back it's time to actually give back right how do they put that structure in place because most of the ivy league schools right they are alumni they is an alumni structure that actually all this one i say you have full scholarship to this to that it is somebody that is funding it they're paying back so how do they put that structure so again remember i said that this is early day right and everybody so far has talked about the one percent one percent because again we still have that mindset that is from the government is from central money but you can actually do something we we all have to collectively come together to fix our problem it can't always be from the center right so yes a lot i mean that committee when it's set up i mean i like the spread of people that are in the committee so minister of finance minister of education even representations of astute vice chancellor so we have a lot of stakeholders who you know we have conversations like this in terms of how it's actually going to look on a day to day but i like that you talked about scholarships because there are many ways in which to fund education right today when people go abroad you see people saying oh i have a scholarship for a phd in this because why somebody's given that scholarship to drive research in that direction so if you remember in the past one we've talked about astute strike and we've talked about how universities should start to raise money and become a lot more creative a lot more creative reason so again these are the places we're looking at these are some of the reforms that we that have to come for this to be successful because our universities have to change it can't be in this current dispensation putting out the type of graduates we're putting out now that we expect that we will then change the system because i mean the thing is given that you are so imagine your one percent has gone into the fund right and we need to monitor this we need to see the numbers so in the uk they went from a bursary structure um had mr bursary god it was like by one year so i was going to go into university in september they ended the bursary people that went into university the year before me so i was the first set to take on the new student loan student loan structure and it was it was they they increased school fees also at the same time um these loans help people to come into university help the universities to get tuition it keeps the system running it's like you know a lead generation type of thing there so we got the loans now these loans by the way that this act speaks to is only tuition support so it doesn't have any maintenance fee the the uk program looks at tuition and which it pays straight to the university and then you can also you apply for like um for living support living support yeah and all of that and it pays that as well um and that one is paid to you i think i remember correctly was on an annual basis school was a long time ago um on an annual basis but essentially right you came out of university so here we've defined our moratorium as two years post nyc so technically it's about three years because if you graduate it takes you like maybe six months to start nyc one year to do nyc so maybe let's say at least minimum three years but more like three and a half or so so you have this moratorium right um they haven't set and this is what i think is missing a minimum standard of what you should be earning so what they just said is 10 right whether you are a salary earner or you're a business entrepreneur 10 percent now let's look at entry salaries right i mean the entry salary is barely enough to live up now you want to then take 10 percent 10 percent doesn't sound like a lot but when you earn 80k or 100k or even 150k somebody removing 10 percent you're gonna feel it because the money itself is already not enough so perhaps what was done in the uk was they set a threshold right so you you graduate you start earning this amount when you start earning this amount then they only take a percentage of what you earn above that amount so it makes it a little bit easier for you so you kind of have worked and you're earning quite a bit before you start to feel it because if you're earning only maybe a thousand pounds over whatever it is you're then they're only taking i think about nine percent of that so it's it's not choking right because remember that this is targeted at low income families they are also the most marginalized so when you tell somebody that can afford you to take a loan you know people use loans to make money they use loans to do business they don't have a problem with it because you know but when you tell a small person to take a micro loan it's like you're almost you know so these are the most marginalized of people so you kind of almost have to sell it to them to say this thing is going to be better for your future so some of these thought processes around that because it will help to sell it it will help to get it to the people who need it because for me to like you said go and find the guarantors the justice of the peace the lawyers and all of that i need to believe that i'm going to come out on the other end of it trust me if i go and find all those people by the time i beg the 50-50 key every month my scope is complete you know that brings me that brings me to my question right we've talked about the positives which is really amazing and i love the fact that this is giving a platform and an opportunity for people who cannot typically pay for school fees to be able to go to school but um i know that there are always risk to things like that there are always challenges so um what are the foreseeable um challenges that the government faced with this loan in place and how can they mitigate it so foreseeable challenges again um i like to use the american system when something starts to pinch you you start to shout when something like this is not properly run which can sometimes be a risk we know we're in nigeria right um the voices can get loud because one percent might not seem a lot but when you are working as living and your one percent is going into a pot that is then being mismanaged we start to complain right when we see that the people who should benefit from this are not benefiting from it we start to complain one of the most likely things today in nigeria we know that we have a corruption problem now i'm going to be trying to get a loan um if this process is not fully automated you have to sign you have to sign you have to sign and i have to bribe my way you don't you've killed it right so the things that we know that are particular and unique to us as nigerians and our culture it needs to be addressed so it says now that the application comes through the classes bank again i have a problem with that because even banks there's enough problems there already this is a system that can be fully automated because one you my my process of getting an account getting my admission all of those things jam has been sort of digitized all of those things have been digitized so it is a process that can be automated that can be done even in collecting these various details right it can be automated it doesn't need to go through the thought of going through the banks is like okay because i'm going to pay money but you're not paying money to me you're paying money to the institution directly so cbn to the fund fund through the deposit money banks to the schools i don't actually think you need the deposit money banks in that process at all um the funding itself could have its own funds warehouse somewhere and the fund could move money directly to the institutions you just need to get financial experts that understand the system to run the organization to automate that process so that i can go in and i can do it fully digitally so that takes away the need to see because they've said 14 days 30 days in terms of feedback and and displacement and all of that for you to achieve that technology must be involved for you to curb any shall practices technology must be involved so i'm hoping that when this committee is set up because the act gives them space to you know make whatever partnerships do whatever they need to do to run it so i'm hoping that they will leverage technology to deal with some of these risks again the reason why i say so this is where ghost students will start to turn up and the minute we start to have ghost students that means that we're increasing default loans in the future and we're making the pot smaller which means that in the long run because i understand that there was a student loan board that again due to defaults and and issues like this it was scrapped sometime in 1984 so the reason why we did not benefit from it was because of these problems so again risk wise if those learnings are not taken if the shall practices are not dealt with we will end up with monies because the money goes to the university if the university has autonomy to spend the money let the money come to me and we will all share the money it's possible so there are those leakages and gaps that we need to plug the quality of ge education like we said it's a huge risk so we've talked many times about how we manage performance if the corporate sector can manage performance well the government needs to learn to manage performance because we now need to hold the lecturers accountable if your students are feeling what is the problem i really love that i love that because again now i'm just thinking in my head how it would work right there's already a an automated system for even from their point of way all the way to the point of their jam and all of that you already see it so admissions would then be tied do you get so these things is even a function of you even as the this is sending as you are sending the admission letter and all of that you can also send that this is the opportunity for you to also access in case you would you be needing let's say we bought another way for you and they go ask you would you be needing some some loans to you know if you do do click this click that i think that automate automate automation of the system would change the face of education again this now means that a lot of these schools must be fully you know automated in terms of their digital processes of results and all of those things so all those moments they say pasting and a lot of everything they are males coming in and all of that well i mean in trying to wrap up this conversation and tie it nicely right we all say that i think recently i mean i just heard a breaking news that the ecc bus have been suspended you know so there's there's a lot that is going on all at the same time in nigeria right and it seems to me like um because again we we've i think we've said this thing several times that the the key um sectors that have really suffered the most right and if they were running well some of the problems that we are facing will not have it education is one of them healthcare is another one and of course transportation infrastructure you know and all of that agriculture you know if so and the direction power power sector if you see the direction of where the president is going he's touched on power he's touched on education he's touching on on on the finance the economy right with the cbn now with the money policy about you know the dollar market market process again determining and all of that there's a lot happening yeah right but how do we get these loans to really really be the the interest to be a bit variable some economies we want to breathe some economies uti two percent are on their loans actually for like people that want to do businesses like if you want to start off a business two percent yeah you know since we know that this sector is really critical to the transformation that we seek in the country how do we get how do we bring that that interest rate well i mean first of all for the education sector we're talking about these loans are interest free so that is great another reason again why we must keep the defaults low because there is no additional money the money that went out is what is coming back and that money is not only servicing the loans it's going to service the employees of the funds whatever is being spent all of that is coming out of that bucket so really tightening and making sure that that money one mirror one couple in fact doesn't go missing is very very important um the concept of interest for loans there are many factors that go into what the interest rate is monetary policy and but this one we've seen that's one percent of all of us who really work the one tax yeah but this one is not going to be interest free there's no interest you are sure yeah they are interest free okay because no uh me and Julia before they wake up say managing the money your banks will not tell us that uh they have to ask them just like Uzi said we'll have to wait to find out because it's tight in the name so eventually we'll find out they'll make adjustments i think that's why i actually went through the act i kept reading and reading i was looking for that interest i kept looking okay that's good so we have a comment here from Osage in Benin he says madame uti is our lecturer today yes so yes so allowing us to breathe she's allowing us to breathe our educational system is not rooted in our social cultural experiences it is very foreign and alienating to us other nations like us build their educational system within the context of their culture they learn from their culture they study from the known to the unknown while our educational system is very imaginative we imagine a lot of things our educational system is very theoretical without practical relevance until our educational system is made more practical in its approach it cannot contribute much to the development of the nation in us in us for example students can walk while they study the students can walk while they study but here we they gather us in one place in the name of school without the hope of giving giving work after school we must create the educational the education that encourages students to work while they study this is from santus and so santus makes sense but we actually don't so that is not really the fault of the education system we don't have an employment culture for part-time work what we have here is graduate you must be a graduate so there are reforms there are reforms that are needed there but he does make a point um so we will bring you back for employment reform but thank you so much we had so much for thank you ladies now before we go and show you follow us across all social media handles that we show africa you can interact with us further to your comments and more importantly follow all our engagements on social media likes and invite your families and friends to watch and follow now if you missed our quote for today that certainty isn't always a bad thing a mortgage can help you afford a home student loan can be a necessity in getting a good job both are investment worth making and both will come with fairly low interest rates we'll see you guys tomorrow at 8 p.m as we bring another great conversation to your screen ciao bye


Okay, hello everyone and thank you very much for coming to this webinar on open education. Does it work for iCare educators and learners? My name is Sally Parsley, I'm the technical lead on the open education program at the International Center for Eye Health and I'm hosting this session today. So before we get started I just have a little bit of housekeeping information. We're going to hear our two presentations first. They're each about 10 to 15 minutes so it'll take about half an hour in total and then we're going to have a short Q&A session for the last 15 minutes. So during the talks please send in your questions using the question box on the webinar menu tab and I'll collate them and ask them to these questions to our two presenters. You can download the presentations from the handout section of the webinar menu tab. This will open up the menu options by clicking on the orange arrow on the tab and that's also where you see the chat menu where you can ask the question, the menu we can ask us questions. And finally we are recording this session and I will be sharing a link to the video and also to transcript in a few days time. Okay so let's get started. This is the second in a series of five monthly webinars that we are hosting at the International Center for Eye Health and the aim of the webinars is to explore how we as eye health educators can use digital technologies, the internet and this concept of open education to innovate and improve our practice and address some of the really big challenges that we know are currently facing eye care training around the world. You know issues such as the need for more trained professionals to deliver universal eye health and the lack of and maldistribution of faculty and resources. So we looked in these issues in some detail in our first webinar in January and if you missed it and are interested to see it you can view it and download it from our web page. If I just go back, there is the link there, ich.lshtm.acoerwebinarist and you can download this presentation to get a hold of the link. Okay so today we are going to move on from looking at that big picture about open education and the need for innovation in eye care training to look at some of the evidence that research has been finding about the impact of open education activities on learners and educators, the benefits and the challenges. So we are going to hear from our very own Dr. Daksha Patel about the experiences here in our open education for eye health program and we are really delighted that we have also have Dr. Rob Farrow from the Open University who is going to talk about the work of the Open Education Research Hub, OER Hub and summarize some of the really interesting results they have found in a recent OER impact research study. So thank you for joining us Rob. So before we get started, I just wanted to summarize what we understand is open education. It is a little bit of jargon. So we thought this would be a useful thing to go through just ahead of the two presentations. So in essence, we can define open education as activity aimed at reducing barriers to participation in education and learning, by reducing the cost of education or by reaching learners at a distance or by removing the need for prior qualifications to access a course. Open education is not a new idea. So for example, the public library movement of the 19th century, such as this Andrew Carnegie Library from Trinidad that is showing on the screen, it gave many working people access to printed information for the first time. Radio and TV have been used for many years to give health information talks and even the University of Buenos Aires in Argentina engaged in open education by allowing entry to anyone with a secondary school degree since the early 20th century. So open education often makes use of technology, but it's also about cultural issues as you can see from those examples, you know about empowering learners or improving the equity of educational provision. So with rising access to digital technologies and the internet, the focus of a lot of open education activity has moved online and digital and that's what kind of what we're looking at today in terms of impact. Open online courses such as the ones we're developing at ICH and open educational resources which Rob is going to talk about. Now these can be defined as digital materials which anyone can download, use, change and then share again for free without asking for permission from whoever originally published the material. And this is done through a special copyright license which is often creative commons, that's the most popular one and that's the one we use. So I've kind of raced through the definitions of open education. I hope that's helpful for you in our two talks and I hope you can start to see how we feel as proponents of open education that it can play a significant role in shaping how we address the issues that are facing education globally today. So now I'm going to hand over to Daksha, those of you who are new to the International Center for Eye Health might not know that she's our e-learning director and she's been with us for many years, firstly as our director of our MSc in community eye health for more than 14 years where she heard about the frustrations and challenges that more than 300 students from all over the world were experiencing in their own settings around eye care training and learning. Before that Daksha was actually an ophthalmologist in Kenya for nearly 10 years and laterally since 2014 she's been our director of e-learning and has been grasping funding opportunities to develop e-learning and open education at ICH. Thank you Sally and thank you for the overview on what we sort of covered on open education last week. So building on from that I thought what we'd do is discuss very briefly the relevance of open education particularly for eye care and what have we learned so far from the experiences that we've had since we started to dabble in open education and then looking forward to where can open education in eye care be used to support curriculum development of learning resources and also keeping in mind that at all points we want to ensure that there's quality in the content that we produce. So from that perspective I take you back to this slide that we had last time looking at the magnitude of visual impairment which is 285 million people but as you can see from this rather distorted map that if we go by this where are these blind and visually impaired people we find that there are the countries that are shown in rather swollen perspective is where they are mostly that's where the visually impaired people are whereas you can see within the Americas and in Europe that these have shrunk down quite a lot from its actual size because the numbers of visual impairment is less so you can see uneven distribution of the burden of visual impairment across the world. Now compare this with this image and this is an image that's showing us how is public health spending that is taking place around the world and then it's complete opposite picture so the money that is being spent would now give the Americas particularly the United States it's much more enlarged and they have a large budget for spending in public health similar to Europe and when you look at Africa and India and even China and even to some extent within the islands around the Pacific you find that the funding is almost non-existent in those settings so as a result of this we find particularly in eye care that the distribution of ophthalmologists per million population is again so varied where you find places around many parts of Africa where you can have less than one one ophthalmologist per million population compared to many parts within Russia where you have over a hundred ophthalmologists per million population and this disparity in the distribution of health providers is further seen in this mapping survey that we carried out across 20 African countries and what we found that of course what's immediately obvious is that there is no one carder that provides the service but there's a range of different carders and again their distribution is so varied between urban and rural regions of the countries so we're faced with a range of challenges we have a wide range of practitioners and wide range of teams that provide services a large number of them work in isolated remote settings and these are often the allied eye health workers across the board what we had found was that the clinicians develop as trainers and the resources they have are very limited and when you look at what continuing medical education is it's often deprioritized when looked at the clinical activities that need to be conducted looking at the curriculum that these practitioners are trained with they're mostly clinically driven that is looking and focused on the one patient in front of them which is correct but at the same time we feel there's an urgent need to also look at the public eye health approach and at present there is limited or no resources in that at local level it certainly lacks trained faculty and there overall there's very few resources available to people to use to teach public eye health so coming from that perspective we asked ourselves about three years ago can open education work for eye care and what we did look and know that we had is that we wanted the content to be purposive and practical for a wide range of practitioners in the field we knew that the content had to focus on key conditions that can be used to manage avoidable causes of visual impairment which is like cataract and refractive error and the technology that we chose to use was online and open education gave us that added extra to allow us to share adapt particularly to localize the knowledge where it was needed how did we go about doing this well we were funding funded by seeing is believing a standard charter project and we were able to develop a six-week online course we pilot tested that course in three countries in Kenya Ghana and Botswana and across a wide range of practitioners from ophthalmologists optometrists clinical officers ophthalmic nurses and even refractionists so we took what was known to us which is our face-to-face content that we had tried and tested and used for many years we took 60 hours of that content we redeveloped it to have an open online course made up from that of course with the Creative Commons license and then shared it with our partners in these three countries and we took a bit of learning from that and all this was funded through these bodies along with the London School what we then did was we created the content with this online and used the specific elements on planning and managing cataract and refractive services so making it very specific and we delivered it to all these cudders within these settings each of our country facilitator was then a key partner in making sure that the content was made available to the right people in the right locations we did a pre and post course survey and a follow-up one year later on what was happening what we found with the 88 participants that we enrolled in these three countries for our pilot project we found 83 percent this was their first online course experience we're very encouraged that 64 percent actually completed this course 32 percent completed more than half of this course and only about four percent were unable to start the course when looking back on the post course survey it was only one person who actually felt that by participating that this was not a good experience for them so we were very encouraged by that strong agreement on good learning experience we followed up a year later to see and define very closely what were the key characteristics of some of our completers and we looked and developed some case studies around that and very often we found that many of these practitioners were based in remote settings they were completely challenged by both internet and electricity access and they worked at weekends and at night to do the course they used a variety of tools which is 3Gs and smart phones and the reason why they did it was they felt it was a very important source of information for themselves and to share and they used the content to apply it to their practice which is to understand local cataract backlog plan service to increase their cataract surgical rate and to address patient barriers so they were very specific on how they use this course the partial completers had a very similar profile but they were very strategic learners they only downloaded what they wanted and they could go back to use it as as they required their challenge was their workload the clinical workload set them back and personal motivation and time management issues were raised as major concerns our course facilitators in each of these countries felt that this was a great way to move forward and actually felt it was a great way to involve people in remote places and the relevance was that it was applicable at the practical level and huge numbers wanted to participate but what we had only done was a pilot so we then went on to develop this course as a MOOC on future land platform and eventually had over 5000 people who joined a large number of them were active learners many of them were from low and middle income countries and this for us has been very encouraging and we are at present running our third run of the MOOC this year the key takeaways from the follow-up of the people that participate on our courses has been that the materials were useful they could be adapted it has changed their attitudes towards empowering patients have developed specific school screening programs for visual impairment and are now monitoring their cataract surgical rate so what is done we are often trapped within this conventional relationship in education and this is not just specific for african universities this can be found across a wide range of settings that people come to one institution to get the knowledge they require what we are wanting to do is if we can with open education replace that with a network relationship and make the sharing of knowledge easier and practice improves what through the sharing of that knowledge there's a lot of potential for open education whereby we can take this generic content that we've created and of course enable it for reuse adapted for local settings increase its accessibility so through online but also through other technologies and this includes now loading it on to USBs but also embedding it into curriculum and this process has already begun for us we're now working with three partners again in Africa in Nigeria in Kenya and at the University of Cape Town in South Africa what they're doing is they're taking the course that we've got they're localizing that content using the Creative Commons license they're adapting it for again an online version for that local setting but also using that content to facilitate and support the teaching that's taking place within their classrooms and they're providing it accreditation so what this is giving us now is that we've got a framework within which we're looking at the course through this Creative Commons license to give us products platforms partnerships policies and promotions to make sure that we've got relevant content selection our experts are contributing it and therefore providing quality partnerships with educators are ensuring that it's going to become relevant for the users increasing digital literacy and this webinar is part of that package that we're developing uh the adaptation by those experts at a local level and aligning them with their local curriculum and this is where we feel that there is lots of quality measures that allow us to keep improving and embedding the course in a practical manner so in conclusion there's a growing demand for knowledge delivered outside the classroom open education is driven by the Creative Commons license and its use reuse adapt and share all its key strengths and certainly this has allowed us to shift the balance a little bit and there's a lot of ownership of learning particularly as people are taking on and embracing self-directed and self-paced learning we believe the content has a lot of merit in how it's been selected the completion as a marker is in is insufficient we believe that there would be strategic users of the course who would use what they want and and that is also a practical for their own settings our key interest is to maintain quality for the resource and ensuring this quality is through experts and use of peers so in summary I think we're we're expanding our open education program to involve a lot more different subject areas over the next few years so we certainly believe that if we've lit the candle there will be others who can take the light and share them in other places so thank you very much for this opportunity and for listening thank you so much dacha I think one of the key things for me from your talk was how learners and educated are empowered in some ways to take control of their their own self-directed learning okay so I am just going to we're now going to hand over to Rob so I'm just going to introduce Rob to you so he and he's going to present on what the research into OER impact has been finding through this OER research hub so Rob is a philosopher into disciplinary researcher and educational technologist as a research fellow at the Institute of Education Technology at the Open University here in the UK he's been involved in a range of projects allowing him to develop expertise in accessibility evaluation mobile learning and the use of technology to support research communities and most recently open education um Rob is a key member of the open education research hub which is leading research into the impact of open educational resources on teaching and learning practices and in the OER research hub he's built a strong personal network through collaboration working with a range of key stakeholders to research non-formal and institutional use of OER he's also acted as a research consultant for the ROR I never pronounced this right the R OER 4D project which is based at the University of Cape Down in South Africa and which is looking into the impact of OER use in the global south and he's also worked for the Open Knowledge Foundation his research interests are wide-ranging gravitating mostly around communication and ethics in policy formation decision making knowledge transmission and teaching and learning thank you so much for joining us Rob I'm going to now switch over control to you if I can just find you okay thank you very much um thank and thanks for the invitation to come and speak with you today um what I was going to do was basically give you a kind of overview of some of the work that we've been doing over the last few years and um include a kind of um I suppose some of the findings that will maybe offer some context to the data discussed in the previous presentation so if you're on Twitter you might want to follow the project it's OER underscore hub we're a team of five at the Institute of Educational Technology at the Open University and again we're all there on Twitter individually as well if you want to connect with us that's a good way to do it so um we've been doing quite a lot of stuff over the last few years and I suppose it's fair to say I could I could speak for a lot longer about some of the findings that we've had um one way to just give you an overview is to think about stuff we've done over the last sort of six years um starting in 2012 when OER research hub was first constituted as a project through to the work that we're doing at the moment so to start off with I'm just going to talk about the first three years if you like with the sort of core impact research stuff for OER research hub so um we worked in collaboration in this project with lots of people who were involved in um producing and using open educational resources and in our collaboration model we had four sectors of focus so higher education schools what they call k-12 in the USA community colleges or further education and informal or non-formal learning and um when we were funded to do this work the um there was a lot of talk and around the potential of OER to transform education and widen participation and so on and so in this project we looked at 11 hypotheses each one um designed to focus in on the evidence base for these particular claims um about the potential of OER uh so we built quite a big set of data this was a global project we had um more than 20 surveys did more than 60 interviews various focus groups collected impact statements and so on um I'll go and talk about a bit more about this data towards the end and you can see here that we had um I think it was about 180 countries represented as part of that data set but predominantly um based in the USA because that was where the focus for the work was that's where the funder was based and that's where a lot of our collaboration uh collaboration partners are based um the data that came out of that um part of the work we did um was mapped and um we did some data visualization with some of it as well and if you want to check any of that out it's OER impact map we also took some of that um survey data and um made an experimental tool so that others could use it so rather than just releasing the data set openly we also um created a tool for people to explore the data themselves um if you want to read the reports themselves um they're available for free on our website um the evidence report summarizes for each hypothesis um I'll talk a bit about some of the findings from this at the end of this presentation so uh we had a change of focus so rather than being purely focused on um research into OER which is open educational resources uh we widened that focus to include um other aspects of open education such as MOOC and open educational practices and so on but increasingly we've also taken on a kind of um research capacity building role and a leadership role in this area there's actually still a quite a new area um open education um and methods for doing research into something like what's the impact of adopting OER um are not established so there's quite a lot of um experimental and exploratory work going on around this um so under our new kind of aspect as OER hub we have this broader focus I'll just tell you a little bit about some of the projects that we've got going on at the moment um the biz MOOC project is an EU funded project um which is focused on the potential of um MOOC for um learning about business and learning the kind of skills that are useful in business across Europe the explorer project um is about producing an open online course to train teachers in the practicalities of OER reuse we also run the uh GOGM which is the global OER graduate network which is a network of PhD students involved in research projects around the implementation and evaluation of um OER in educational institutions um um building this network is um quite an interesting um aspect of what we're doing at the moment um we're aspiring to get um I think about 100 people uh as part of that network at the moment we have 45 and you can see here that they're they come from a range of different countries they had our first alumni um assigned to come through now um this work as well as um the OER research hub work was funded by the Hewlett Foundation who um really take take a lead in supporting OER research and OER programs around the world. We also have the opening educational practices in Scotland project um this is um about collecting evidence around the the way that people use um OER in practice um and thinking about um you know some of the assumptions that we make about what people actually do with with OER um we also have the OER world map project to this this kind of develop some of the earlier mapping work that we've done um the idea here is to create a database of um OER activity around the world so one of the kind of um criticisms people make of open educational resources that can be hard to find hard to find good quality um resources in the area that you need so um part of the approach here is to create a better way of indexing and a better information architecture about the resources themselves um but it's also about putting um people in touch with each other and um supporting the development of communities um around open educational resources. Another piece of work which you might be interested in which we did um we did last year still being written up is to have an ongoing kind of consultation with um the open education community really about what the next step should be how best to organize and what two areas to prioritize research in. We just launched a survey today for a new project um UFAT which is open online flexible and technology enhanced models um this is collecting examples of best practice for sustainable business models in open education um you can read if you like this textbook we've produced on um the process of open research and how to sort of become an open researcher um this is another aspect of the work that we've been doing um but just to give you a flavor of some of the um sort of headlines if you like coming out of um some of this work going back to this uh dataset that I mentioned before there are some things that we can say which I think uh echo some of the findings that actually was talking about um so when we asked people um including both educators and students in the institutions which we're called calling formal learners here um 37 percent of educators said using OER improved student satisfaction and more than half of formal learners agreed with that uh we had about a quarter of educators and about a third of formal learners say that uh OER use um results in better test scores it's difficult to triangulate that data because it's quite hard to get institutions to share something like um pass and failure rates for their students but it's a finding found consistently um across lots of different surveys um another area that I think um is something that's quite interesting to reflect on we we asked people um who use OER whether they adapt resources to fit their needs and by that we meant something like do you engage in the behaviors that you're enabled to do through open licensing like remixing and reusing and so on and this came out nearly 80 percent and in in one one cohort which was the non-formal students that was as high as 85 percent so there's an interesting question there about oh well did they mean the same thing that we meant by adaptation um possibly they meant I just took something and made it fit you know with what I needed for um it's often said that low cost is the reason that people use OER we didn't find much support for that um I think freely available online was probably a more significant um element and when you look at the number of student learners who are not registered for a course of study let's say they're using OER that was as high as 75 percent but you might say at this point well you know what's OER in a way does it have to be the stuff that's in an OER repository or that's designed to be used as OER um we found that a lot of people especially teachers are actually using OER for a quite a wide variety of reasons it could be just to brush up on something quickly reading Wikipedia it could be that they're planning a lesson and looking for inspiration for something you know a new angle they can take on it they're very unlikely to actually type OER into a search engine but they're looking online for materials that are freely available all the time and learners and educators are both doing this and one of the things we're interested in at the open university is the extent to which people can be uh encouraged into formal study through the use of open educational resources and the OER has the open learn platform which is the OER repository there um you get an interesting sort of polarization around this people who've used these kind of resources roughly say 20% say it makes them more likely to go on to formal study but 20% say it makes them less likely you can interpret that in terms of a sort of quality issue um but it's not maybe not so much that as people having their learning needs met by what they're finding free online i'm not feeling any need to go to any extra sort of level with that um this is not my uh graphic this is um someone else's there's a citation on the side um but I thought it might give you a sense of how um there's lots of different elements to all this and different things that are happening and different layers to all this um when we talk about something like impact what we imply is a kind of nice neat causal relationship so we did a and b happened um but obviously these things are much more complicated than that and um furthermore I'd want to say I suppose that um most of the time impact is contextual so the difference it makes is dependent on what the context is like um and I would I'd be tempted to sort of frame this in terms of openness itself being um being basically directed toward removing barriers and an increasing freedom and increasing people's autonomy so the more free you are there's lots of different ways that you could realize that so it's quite hard to say well this is the result that will happen if you introduce OER um in some cases um the priority is more to do with if you like not really changing the way people teach and learn but doing the same thing with open resources so rather than using proprietary materials they might um start using um a free or open textbook this is a big thing in the USA where um the cost of textbooks can be huge um other communities are more interested in the if you like more kind of revolutionary aspects or more radical aspects of this which lets people take more control over what they're doing and how they're teaching and how they're learning but I suppose I'd want to also sort of offer the caveat to that that that you still need to be able to um be a good learner to access a lot of this stuff openly even if you're an educator who's interested in using it there are certain skills around it and partly their skills like this sorry their conditions like access and accessibility do you have an internet connection can you use a computer and so on um but it's also things like do you have the confidence and the mindset um do you have the right language skills the right kind of time management skills the right digital and critical literacy and these kind of things so even in an area like um medical education where obviously quality is paramount there can still be a role for OER in supporting these kind of secondary skills and the sort of culture of learning that's um that's desirable I would say so um so yeah I think that's I think it should stop because otherwise it could go on for a long time so um thanks for listening and I'll take any any questions that you have um the slides are there for anyone who wants to um have have a look through and there's some links on there to follow at the end here you can see um I've given um links for another couple of open education research groups the open education group in the USA and the war4d project um plus a bunch of links where you can check out more stuff from OER hub we have a long list of publications if you want to find out some of the nitty gritty details um and uh yeah get in touch if you have any questions okay thank you so much Rob um that was so interesting I'm just going to take control back yeah thank you so much OER research hub is doing such interesting work and so many areas and just small team I don't know I don't know how you're doing it and that was and that was a really interesting point you made at the end about the need for OER users to have good learner skills as well that was um there's something we're definitely starting to think about here yeah um so I've we have a question in from Lindsay syndrome which is for you Rob and that is um are there any GOGN members in Malaysia um is it only open and is it only open to PhD researchers and alumni thank you so I don't know if talking my head if we've got anyone in Malaysia um I can check and let you know um we do accept people who are not necessarily doing a PhD and there are different levels of membership as well so um you anyone can join just as an associate so anyone who's just interested in that in that area wants to stay in touch with the project um but um we have some master's students who are thinking about going on to doctoral study for instance um so you could definitely join it's just a question of what um specific role you'd want to join as um it might be easiest to join as an associate first and you get all the emails and everything and then um uh you have access to the group and you have access to the to the staff to talk about where you might want to go with it next um so yeah just just uh get in touch with the website and and go from there thanks Rob and actually I I'm an I'm an associate member I think recently fan off of defining you and um it's it's been a very interesting there's good emails uh Lindsay I if you're interested I recommend it it's a very good resource um so I think I have a couple of questions actually um for both of you so I'll I'll ask both questions and then I'll hand the mic to Daksha and give Rob a little time to think about his answers so um my first question is which of the reported findings from the impact studies the benefits and the challenges did you find the most um surprising or inspiring which one really made you think oh I didn't I didn't expect to see that and the second question is a bit more wooly and it's about this um idea of community of users how important do you feel the community of users is for generating sort of long-term and sustainable impacts from over there I hope that's hope that may even make sense Daksha um thanks Sally well I guess when we first did the pilot study we were we were going into territory that was totally unknown to us and what did surprise me was number of people who had never done an online course before and um it it made me and what the level of satisfaction they got out of that new experience so it kind of uh was a breakthrough into a completely new medium of education that had not been explored in iCare particularly so for that reason I thought that stood out as the big flag from which we now went on to develop a lot more other online content and using the open education principle and the second point that that um the URA is the importance of community of OER users and the way we're going about this is that it's it's important to have this community and particularly we want to link that community with the body of experts that we have in our subject area so it's it's a very specific and strategic approach to enhance our community through the educators who can directly influence and shape the curriculum so I guess yes the community is very important and and it allows us both a top down and a bottom up approach so of course we've got the curriculum with its accreditation and the educators but then from a bottom down it's the users and how they're sharing that content with their own teams and that creating that whole network is is the way forward we think to strengthen iCare education thank you actually yes yes definitely um Rob yes so um a couple of things I suppose um as examples of potentially surprising findings um firstly I would say there's a kind of contradiction between um the professed beliefs and the behaviors of people who um sort of advocate for open educational resources so what I mean by that is um when you ask people um do you believe that you should be um publishing your resources uh in an OER repository on a creative commons license and doing it all by the book so to speak um about about two thirds agree with that but when it comes to um do you actually do that we've got about 12 percent something like that so lots of people think they should be doing it but they don't do it um and that's quite an interesting um sort of finding to me because probably that's an interesting thing anyway that contradiction um but also if you know you can imagine that there were just these kind of um these kind of cohorts or very committed open education um advocates who were just doing everything the way that they should but most people are actually just kind of online looking for stuff and if it's useful they use it and they're maybe a bit worried about what they can and can't share and sort of um in risk of violating copyright so that kind of contradiction in in between belief and behavior I find quite interesting um another example that surprised me I suppose was um when it came to so some of the work I did was looking at policy and OER policies that were if you like supposedly springing up um to support this kind of growing OER movement it actually turned out to be really hard to find examples of where there's been some sort of piloting or innovation which has subsequently led to um a policy being put in place in an institution to support OER um and what it revealed was that actually a lot of this stuff is happening um sort of below the radar and it's kind of informally shared and people are saying this is a useful resource but it's copyrighted so you know I can only share this so much with you and I'll do it kind of privately on email and this kind of thing so um what I take from something like that is that people are just using stuff you know they're out there they're doing it already um and um most of the time they don't really care very much about what the license says on it um but you know in reality the license is important because that's what gives you the legal protection but the the copyright laws that we have and if you like our sort of channels for disseminating information are based you know the legal frameworks are based in you know the the 20th if not the 19th century so um because we have this ability now to reproduce information anywhere in the world pretty much instantly and at marginal cost so anywhere in the world we know not everywhere um but soon it will be everywhere um you know I don't think that our kind of frameworks have actually caught up with that kind of technical development yeah absolutely I mean I would really strongly really agree with you there that would be our experience as well in fact we sometimes talk about whether talk about creative comments actually confuses people and this focus on copyright that were forced into as institutions through copyright and IPR law is a real barrier and so thinking about that um from a kind of going back to this idea of well you've got the people who just want to keep the system the way it is and replace all the textbooks with open ones versus people who actually really want to change the way that it works I think it goes back to that idea of copyright as a kind of instrument of control effectively absolutely yeah and it's a sort of terms of our employment that we use it it's it's embedded in it's in there unfortunately I could chat for hours as well unfortunately we are out of time so I'm going to have to stop the questions there thank you um thank you first to both of our presenters um I'm trying to uh but thank you both to Rob and Daksha for giving up your time to talk today um two really interesting presentations um here at ICH we very much want to thank our funders who make all of our work possible and to let our uh participants know that we are um I hope you've enjoyed today and got useful information out of it and hopefully perhaps been inspired to look into OER and open education a bit more and maybe even join us next time um on March the 15th where we have a very practical session on finding and using open online courses which will be led by Joe Stroud who is our e-learning manager here at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and we'll also be talking a little bit more about this dreaded copyright issue um with a member of our team Astrid Lek who's going to come along and talk about that so um thanks again everyone um I think I've covered everything Daksha yeah thank you very much yeah thank you and uh and uh and to our participants yeah take everyone goodbye bye bye bye


That's infant hair.     Uh-uh, but what is you doing? Look chocolate?  You better stop I'll be your girlfriend.  Yes Get your girl ready to go outside.     I'm fine something bruh fine something I'm telling wake up Hey, you sleep Don't want to tell you cute. He'll land. No, I Had a dream.  See if the she were real.  What's up gangsta later?      What's up, bro? J. Oh, yeah How you living my name?  They just some ladies, but that's your friend. How long you been friends with this name? You know them since middle school.     Oh Need a ride a nigga brother. What's wrong with you?  Yeah, construction build a car.  Hey, that's your man right there. How long he was he was where to drink you better get it right And it was rude to come on now.     It'll always be a item out like 66 dollars and fives. I Don't know how she did it, but she did it cuz I love some titties. All of them. I accept all the titties Long as it's two of them back at itself. I Love two titties as a set.    She'd know you can't get up bra.      I'm gonna do it It's nigga. Yeah Yeah, the head line from to make a wish foundation.  I Can do long division.  It's a human. Let me see who else over here tonight. How y'all doing over here?   I'm pitted like hey people in the back.     Pearly Aloysius.  I feel you though Pussy game is up and down though. I wouldn't invest my money in it What's the way up and down?  You think you could just sell pussy with a standard price That's a sliding scale I'm not just gonna come in now and just go with what y'all said I would do like to do it on Pawnstaff now I don't know much about pussy, but I got a partner who's an expert.  Well, I wouldn't pay this but Ford Carlos.  You don't work for a la wish to do your young thing Okay, I saw you had the birthmark on your eye and I was like this the eye gang over there Everybody over here got a eye.  I did the slow motion for like 11 seconds.  Let me quit y'all niggas on ecstasy. Um, oh G to your drink finally came a nigga order another it's time for another one there I'm about to bring the squad out here. She about to get real ignorant.  I'm the normal one Ain't no telling what DC might say to a la wishes Not that we know her name a la wishes this don't let you later go in the bathroom if you see a la wishes a Look ladies listen to him. No a la wish us Do we have any other pimps in the audience tonight Shout out to all the niggas who used to be in the dope game, but now you out you good got out safe Still got a bullet in your leg You always welcome at our shows.    You're gonna get in there.  Oh Shit, all right


We got Pineapple Power batting cleanup today. Let's go, Brew Crew. Let's get the win against the Padres. Go, Brew Crew! Go!


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