Hello everyone, I'm Chris and this is Scarlett and we're here to do Baby Put Your Shirt On. Oh, and this is Emily. This is Emily. Oh yes, that's the most important person is Emily right now. Yes. Alright, let's get started on Baby Put Your Shirt On. It's the tune of Shortening Bread. Shall we get started? Alright.  One, two, three, arm to the left, arm to the right, wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight.  One, two, three, leg to the left, leg to the right, wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight. Let's do the shoes.  One, two, three, foot to the left, foot to the right, wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight.  One, two, three, hand to the left, hand to the right, wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight. One more time. Yeah. Okay. Baby put your shirt on shirt on shirt on baby put your shirt on one two three arm to the left arm to the right wiggle in jiggle and pull them on tight baby put your pants on pants on pants on baby put your pants on one two three leg to the left leg to the right wiggle in jiggle and pull them on tight baby put your shoes on shoes on shoes on baby put your shoes on one two three foot to the left foot to the right wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight baby put your mittens on mittens on mittens on baby put your mittens on one two three hand to the left hand to the right. Wiggle and jiggle and pull them on tight.


that whole time i thought this thing was on. holy crap. i'm a terrible youtuber. morning everybody it's sunday morning july 17th. bob is off in his misubishi little red sports car he has to a car show and swap meet for barracudas. he's not driving the barracuda because it has an oil a small oil leak and needs a few things done to it. it's actually off to the shop tomorrow morning i'm going to follow him over there in my Subaru we're going to drop it off for about a week or so and they're going to do a bunch of stuff to it so in the meantime he's off to the car show while he's doing that i'm going to go to the kids house i need to water plants for them because they're away and i've got a bag of donations i need to drop off let's grab the bag um maybe i'll stop in the shop and look around i don't know i don't really need anything so who knows um i'm not the only other thing i have to do today is edit video maybe today write the post for the week when bob gets back he needs to work on our pond in the back and put a second layer of sealer on it because it has a leak i think i said that already anyway i need to help him prep the barracuda for tomorrow's trip to the mechanic shop so i'm gonna be kind of a busy sunday nothing wrong with that i'll be back just about have monday's work done on sunday yay i love it when that happens i'm uploading the last video to the patreon patreon to the patreon only youtube channel it is currently 3 52 p.m and i got the two videos edited i needed to edit um the public one which is the vlog it goes up on wednesday there's some creative painting content and stuff in there and stuff like that um and then the patreon one which is um less edited than what you all see here on the public channel anyway um so that's done and the posts are already written and scheduled for next week tours are done i have to wash one bowl out but tours are done bob's back from his car show swap meet drag race thing you went to um so yeah it's a good sunday so far yay all right i'll be back morning july 19th no 18th i don't know hold on it is 8 21 a.m that's right um we are taking adrian aka bob's 1973 play with maricuna for those that don't know and to get some work done on her she needs some things done and uh yeah we're gonna be dropping her off for a few days and yeah so i have to try i have to follow him in the Subaru um so he has a way to get home and i've got a car full of parts for adrian so um yeah we're gonna go do that this morning and then i need to come home and have more coffee because i haven't had all my coffee yet so we'll be back as you saw i think we actually got this done and we're gonna sit with it for a couple of days and i'll take another look at it yes it will be for sale so if you're interested message me uh i also use the extra paint on that one i do already have a plan for that one i think i know where where it's gonna go so my brain is just overflowing with these right now i don't i don't know what to say but anyway um i also got a page done in one of my journals um memories of our time in leavenworth and i'm turning the computer i guess it's unavoidable now i have to go down and do the dishes because you know chores they're a thing i'll be back it's 10 30 this morning thursday uh tuesday july 19th almost thursday holy cow anyway letty um is downstairs cleaning our housekeeper and friend she's downstairs i'm upstairs taking my koi a lot of color boxes apart i've got two of them this one and a bigger one and i'm going to bag the colors up with their swatches in little bags and put them in my box with my backup watercolors um i never use them in the box i'm not a fan of the box but i also have two of these brushes also not a fan of those i won't get rid of them because i will use them for something but the way they are they're just taking up space i literally have not opened these since before we moved to oregon almost four years ago so that's kind of telling right all right i'm going to watch some youtube i'm going to get this done and i'll be back letty is done house is clean yay um client check came in the mail today so i'm going to spend some time wrapping up the painting and sending her on to her new home and the one i just finished which is for sale um it's got her clear coat and she's drying hold on she's got her clear coat and she is drying and then she is ready to be sold and move on to her new home right now my muse is painting crazy yes i've started a new one hey guys good morning it is wednesday july 20th i think pretty sure anyway it's 10 21 a.m had a little bit of a late start this morning i decided to just sleep in because i was tired and so you know but i have already gotten the pine tree schmutz cleaned up out of the driveway which in turn got traced up on my hands which i then had to clean off i got the dishes done all that stuff so now we're gonna go i've got a painting i've got a mail to a client so we're going to go take care of that today might make a couple stops and i might not feel like it i'm gonna play right here um and then i need to do a bunch of filming today tomorrow and friday and i need to work on new painting on the easel and i need to make some more iced coffee and some overnight oats like i have a list i've been writing it down as i think of things because yeah anyway one thing at a time right it's all you can do and if you have trouble remembering like me just write it down and you're not woken up at two o'clock in the morning with that thing you forgot to do anyway all right we are gonna go get it done and i'll be guys i got a little painting done uh a lot of painting done maybe so i got a new painting started it's not done but that's a really good start for where i think i want to go with this love that i think i said earlier that this one is done and it's dry it's all dry here i need to move it it's got its clear code it's been signed and all of that stuff on the back and then i made i did a watercolor this morning for the people who are working on my husband's sports car it'll be nice about working on his car and as a thank you um i did them a little piece and here we go uh north america and muscle cars name that a place and a really nice couple out in the business and i'll put their link to their website down below check them out uh anyway uh i got all that done and i was gonna do something else and i was gonna like write it down before i forgot yeah i forgot so then i bought another pencil sharpener i really don't need another one but i'm looking for a pencil sharpener to put into my sort of go drawing bag watercolor drawing bag because i do take that with me we go out of town um we go visit my dad or whatever that bag goes with me and i really need something that can sharpen my pencil and i'm not like getting shavings everywhere in my bag or whatever that the shavings can be contained because sometimes i'm in public at a restaurant and i'm not that person that's just gonna throw shavings on the ground i have this one this was recommended and i actually had to get it on amazon because my local shop was completely sold out and while i like the way it sharpens and it does a really great job and it's nice and it's flat enough to fit in my bag and it holds a decent amount of shavings this little drawer here a little hole that where you put the pencil in and when you close it that's where it keeps the shavings in if it opens the shavings fall out it doesn't always close all the way so although i like it that's a problem i have another one i will put a picture of here um that i like i got it at digblick it's a good again it's a good sharpener it stays nice and closed so the shavings don't give it everywhere and it's not messy i'm just not crazy about how it sharpens um i also have it's like i have so many pencil sharpeners you guys i have lots of these but they're not contained in shavings go everywhere um and i have this one from prismacolor a lot of people have this one this is great talk about bulky it doesn't fit in your bag easily it's good for in studio but i mean i have these for like large crayon i mean crayon well crayons or pencils i've got this is a crayola one i don't even know why i have this because i'm not like us i do have no i don't even need this one there's so many sanders i've got filers yeah there's a lot and like none of them it might this might be the next drawer i have to go through and none of them are like great i can't get it closed oh yeah yeah none of them are great and so i found this one today at my local asian market they have a little section from dye of stuff from dyzo and um the dot this dial is for um changing you know the size of the point that you want on the pencil this is where you empty it and what i really like which i didn't know when i bought it this is like a door like that's going to be i think hard to accidentally get open maybe maybe i don't know we'll try it we'll see i don't know it's all we can do right anyway you wouldn't think that would be a hard thing to do find a decent travel pencil sharpener but evidently it is unbelievable anyway first first world problems right all right i'll be back that was a successful morning so four journal pages four videos all filmed and in the camp so to speak i feel good about that all right time for lunch before we figure out what we're going to do next and we're going to go we've got to go water the kids plants when bob gets off at work so we'll do that when he's off all right i'm going to shut things down i'll be back okay lunch is over and i actually have turned the computer off early it's about one just after one o'clock i think i could do a lot of other things but i'm going to go for a walk it's a little bit warmish out it's like 79 80 degrees so i do have some water with me i don't think we're going to go too far i didn't bring any art supplies i'm just going to go walking we haven't been in a few days because of the weather last night it didn't cool off until like 10 o'clock or 11 o'clock or something last night it's been 90 plus for a few days so we haven't hit peak heat yet today it will get hotter uh our peak is usually about three o'clock here where we are near portland but before it hits that i think i'm going to go get some steps in all right let's go see what we can see i'll be back everybody i can still say that because it's not noon yet but it's close it's just about 11 30 and although i did sleep in a little bit this morning it has been a busy morning um so and i haven't even edited the videos i shot yesterday i shot four videos yesterday i have different journal pages one including an rt trio and i haven't even touched any of that footage yet i just put the sd card into the computer i've been working on an online art portfolio probably a new website um and maybe that'll include a blog an actual written blog um i'm also putting the entire etsy shop on sale starting august 8th and um yeah because i'm going to be transitioning i think away from etsy i know right um there are purge boxes for sale and um they are listed and they are included in the in the sale price um and so there are sort of mystery boxes they include stamps and stencils so i mean you know i don't remember what all else is in there to be honest with you um it should say some kind of description in the in the listing description uh anyway um yeah i'm just transitioning away from etsy it's not really benefiting me at the moment and we're going to be doing something else and i will be also probably pursuing more custom artwork and client work and selling some of my artwork privately and so if you're interested in something let me know um i will still have digital downloads available but they'll be on the new website for now they're all still available on etsy and they're gonna like i said they're going to be on sale now if you're a patron or supporter you get access to the sale now and you get a discount code that is for a bigger percentage off than what you're all going to get in a general sale i know right in fact i got to create that patron um message over on patreon right now patreon's not too expensive it's like two dollars a month the link is down below if you want to support the free content here on youtube plus you have your own private youtube channel for patrons and supporters only and and a private facebook chat where you can get ahold of me and we can chat and i can share things as they have in and all of that stuff so anyway that was a big choice but i'm glad i made it it feels good all right i guess it's time to video edit uh all right i'll be back all four videos edited and loaded to youtube and then realized i forgot one so i had to film it really quick open clean off the table and then film it really quick um edit um it actually turned out really cute for something that i completely forgot about anyway so that'll be coming up and uh sent out a few messages via facebook to people um posted the sale of the etsy shop everywhere um i'm waiting for the video that i just did really quick to load and then i'm turning the computer off for the day it's only 2 50 p.m but it's friday it needs to go off i will go down and have a snack but some youtube well bob i'm waiting for bob to get off work and then we're going to go to the grocery store so anyway that's it for the minute i'll be back everybody it's just before 10 a.m saturday july 23rd and i've got kind of a lot to do today i've got to water the plants i've got to do the dishes normal chores i need to play with moving the vegetable pots around to where they might get watered by the sprinklers we have a few upcoming dates where we're not going to be home long enough and it's going to be hot enough that if i don't do that then i have to find somebody to water because they're going to be dead when i get home so that's a thing um i am going to have to find somebody to water plants for me too but i think one of the girls can do that so anyway um i also have a friend coming to visit in a couple months i'm so excited about that so i want to start planning what we're going to do while she's here um but first i guess i better do chores because breakfast dishes are clogging up the sink all right let's get to it bob's back from getting the Subaru cleaned and he's right now getting the tree sap off of my car because that's a thing when you live in Oregon near the woods it's just i think all the chores are done i drank my bone broth of a few minutes to kill so i'm going to surf the internet a little bit then we're going to go to one kid's house and water their plants and check the mail and then we're going to meet the other kids for lunch and then we have to go run a couple errands but it's all good i'll show you guys this so if you haven't seen my um series of videos yet called the messy journal or i'll link the playlist down below um but i work in a specific kind of a journal and although i do try to protect the finished pages i don't worry too much about things getting messy and spilling over and i guess that's a good thing because the cover looks like this and although some of it's covered with plastic it's not all so yeah oh yeah there we go yeah i just took the plastic off so i guess it's a good thing i don't care too much about it being messy i think it looks pretty cool i'll be back i'm still working on the car i finished some work in the yard plenty of seedlings to share with the kids after i planted the ones i wanted yay um got it all watered got myself a quick shower changed my clothes sat down to have some water and watch a couple youtube videos and thought to myself i really should get up and do took me five minutes i thought of it one second forgot about it in the next second i i remember what it is now so i'm gonna go i gotta refill my pillbox it's time to fill all right i'll be back i mentioned lately that we love the wildlife i know it's ridiculous but we do all right i'll be back nobody over here at this one just that one the yard setting off the cameras let's see what it is anything i think it was a cat there's a lot of cats in the neighborhood strays and otherwise so i don't know anyway it's been a fun week and it's been a fun day i can't believe it's seven o'clock already um but yeah it's been a good week i hope you guys have had a good one check out the video description for relevant links um happy mail address links to my patreon all that jazz i'd love it if you want to support the free content they do get access to me that you all don't and they get videos you guys don't have access to and all that stuff so i would love that um you don't have to but i would love that like share and subscribe if you haven't already stay safe stay healthy stay creative and go out and do something nice for yourself because you deserve it i'm gonna go inside and sit and drink some more bone broth and just relax for the evening i'll see you next week bye guys


No, it's not. It's flickering. It's flickering, huh? Okay. Just run it regularly. Let's see if that does something. Second, make sure nothing exciting occurred. Let me, you know what, then let's just run your record here and bypass this thing and see if that makes the same thing. Okay. It's already recording. Yeah. Stop it when it's started. Yeah. Now we'll just pass it through. Okay. So this one's got to go. The news is good news. Okay. And the audio is already recording. The audio will be off of your, just off of the laptop. So pick it up. To this pickup. No, it will just be the speakers built in. So I don't really need to be tethered. No, you don't need to be tethered. Hey everyone. Thanks for coming. I'm going to do perhaps a little bit of a different format today. And I've been talking about change management for a couple of years, but I'm in no way a professional on it. It is simply something that I do on a regular basis as a project manager. Am I speaking loud enough for the folks at the back of the room? Because I can use my like full on voice if I need to. So I'm going to start by basically getting you to tell me why you're here today. And then I'm going to give you some frameworks for addressing some of the challenges that you're currently dealing with, whether it's at work or in the Drupal community or wherever it happens to be. And then I'll share some of the stories that I have from the things that have been effective and the conditions of the conditions of stress that resulted in me needing to find solutions for the problems that we were having. So the first thing that I do want to do is kind of just make sure that I say change management. This isn't one of my get talks. This is the business side of change management. And we're talking about the transformation into a desired state. And so in this case, we're probably referring to Drupal 8 and the difficulties that we're about to undergo as development teams from a technology that we've been using for probably a number of years into a technology that is going to feel foreign and stressful. And from a site builder point of view, not that different from a development point of view, whether you're front-end or back-end, there's going to be a lot of differences. And how do we make that transformation over? My sort of general approach to working with new teams is to start at that point of coming to a common understanding. And I do appreciate that Whiskey is not required. But I have found that in a social setting and sort of that casual conversation about how things are going, what's motivating you, what's the challenge, what's the hard part. It could be laser tag. It could be whatever your team can come together on in terms of a non-work environment. This isn't a scheduled scrum meeting that happens on day X of thing Y. But in a casual setting, you can get a lot more information from people. I mean, one of the biggest challenges that I had professionally in most recent years, the transformation process started when I showed up at a work sprint, so we were a distributed team, when I showed up at a work sprint and said, okay, here's the bottle, Whiskey. And we're going to talk through what's not working. And it was from that point forward that we started to see the small wins that we needed to transform the team. So Whiskey not required, but I have found it to be an effective tool as a project manager. So I would like just to have you throw out some of the things that you're currently dealing with just so that we can get a sense of where the room is at, it may then also be if you look around and see who's got what kind of challenges that after this, you can support one another in whether it's boss here or whether it's just sort of ongoing. If you've got common challenges, being aware of who you might use as a resource in the future. So is there anyone that wants to kick off? Why are you here today? The answer may be because it would be easier than nothing after Karen's presentation. It's really cool with that. I have done that myself. I'm just checking email. Oh, goodness. It's not Karen anymore. I'm being recorded. I should probably not be quite as honest with you. Although transparency is important. Anyone? Yeah. So I've had in project management process. There's often many parties involved. Yes. And as the person who's actually building websites, there are often many decisions being made with personal agendas and competing personal agendas often. And so sometimes I'm privy to those and I can influence them. Sometimes I'm not. So at some point you come down to the chain where like there's a creative madness somehow has made it through the chain of things. And so I find that that is a challenge for I need to initiate change. Yeah. And but I may not be politically in a position. Yeah. In a position to see about actually not a good idea. Yeah. You know, whatever. And so those I would love to hear about creative ways of politely nudging. Sure. Yeah. Hurting that. Yeah. Yeah. Sweet. What are some of the other. Thank you.  Thank you. Thank you. Oh, yeah. Yeah. One recurring thing is how to keep everybody in sync or up to date on what's going on without sucking up all the time and meetings. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. even I would say meetings are even worse for distributed teams because you have the or with when you have anyone who is remote or not because you have the context switching I was doing work and now I need to turn and think about getting into Google hangout is my microphone working is everything set up or Skype or you know whatever you're using even though I've been listening to audio and something else you have this initial friction for a distributed team to even begin a meeting so that they're even worse to suck people into meetings forget yes in the white teacher some of them are great and others just don't care I don't have it in the presentation but you will want to watch Todd near Kurt's who it's from the floor kitchen his presentation on creating empowering people to implement their own changes within teams and I think it was I think that was what he presented at Twin Cities Drupal Camp and I know I know it was recorded but he has given other things so Twin Cities in Minneapolis Drupal Camp which was this past weekend yeah oh yeah absolutely there was a next title to a presentation which was something to the effect it was a low-lot presentation on Martha Stewart something about changing the wheels at 50 miles an hour and they still have this concept of those little changes they want to make having potentially big impacts Jeff Patten's user story mapping that's a book you want to read I think I have it in the resource list but it's kind of different than what we're doing but that would be a good resource for you maybe one more and then I'll go into the framework so yes types in line so that was great I think to hear just a sense of where you're coming from the challenges are you dealing with right now and I talked about this for anyone who was at my presentation last year I talked a bit more about Simon Sinek's why I'm blanking on the full title of that right now and he had this sort of really great Ted talk of 20 minutes long but it's really great statement that resonated with me especially having run for election that we tend to as staff people want to work toward something so we want to know what the vision is and we want to work towards something however I can tell you that in politics working towards something doesn't really work negative attack ads are far easier to win supporters on and so when you're when you're implementing change we have this practice sort of in real life of moving away from negativity and being very drawn by negativity and yet to implement change positively in the workplace we need to teach ourselves how to create a vision and then move people towards that vision and one of the really hard things about change management is that if you can't get alignment if you can't get people excited about your vision expect to have what's the word that I'm looking for attrition expect people to either mentally check out or actually quit the job and be being prepared for that process being prepared for people not coming along for the ride is really what change management is all about I think he's got a lot of interesting pieces in terms of helping people to overcome that resistance and fuel the motivation and it all sort of stems back to well why are you even doing this and certainly for Drupal 8 why are you for saying people to learn Drupal 8 why as a developer have you decided to make that transition are clients demanding it yet maybe maybe not what is it that is your motivation whether you know you're the leader of the company who's decided to make this change or the developer who's decided to take it on because once you have that wide internalize it can fuel you through the process it can get people over that initial resistance of I don't want change changes too hard and if you are keen about it if you can see that future state then you can stay motivated when things get difficult so we we have this sort of less giving up so that's the quote that goes along with that one so that the frameworks that I've got for you there's essentially two with one kind of in the middle of expanding a bit on how to as a leadership team help people through it but there's two frameworks and they are sort of the they're recognized by business school frameworks that you will if you Google change management you'll see and the first one is the John Cotter do I actually say it on there I don't John Cotter eight steps to leading change or leading to change management and it's changed once so this is version two well this is kind of like version 2.1 these are my words on top of his his eight steps and the it was eight steps to begin with leading change which the original book accelerate is the the current book but there's essentially this process that you're going to have to to go through the first step is to create a sense of urgency the second step is to assemble a senior leadership change transformation team the third step is to create that vision that the new version is enlist a volunteer army my goodness does Drupal know how to enlist their volunteer army there's some interesting case studies in one of the Harvard Business School like top 10 blah blah on change management and about how to find your champions within organizations and some of you I like I recognize some of your faces you know that you're the internal champion for your particular company so you may be the volunteer even though you're paid and then enabling people by removing blockers generating small wins sustaining that accelerated pace of change and then finally indoctrinating that change inter-corporate culture now as a project manager I'm typically focused on this these three I don't know if the change is bigger here the enable enable people by removing blockers the generating wins in terms of helping people closing tickets and sustaining that momentum through an entire project so that's typically where I'm focused and often where developers will be focused as well as they work with me as a project manager leadership team those ones up at the top may be very very different very new concepts for you to grapple with but I bet you're really good at these three at the bottom if you are used to working on whether it's your own internal projects or or client sites so what can we do to actually ensure success during the project from again this is using my frameworks the external kind of like business management approved techniques they there's a lot of language and discussion around change needing to benefit the leaders because the the bottom-up approach is quite difficult so two of you managed some kind of senior leader position whether it was marketing or VP you know top-level folks if they're not on board that change management piece is going to be exceptionally difficult and so your sort of number one priority as a bottom-up change management person is going to be to figure out how can I phrase this what is the Machiavellian technique that I can use to make eat and just went Machiavelli what is the technique that I can use how can I phrase this in a way so that the leadership sees that this will be of benefit to them so is this faster to profit more clients like what is it that's going to motivate them the leader and how can you pitch it to them in a way that they can start getting on board with it the next one is to figure out again the why piece but coming up with those key phrases or key ideas that you can use within the company to explain why we're doing the transformation what the final vision is and providing the skills and upgrading for folks to be able to engage safely that's really important now a lot of cases what the training is that folks want is they don't need to know they don't like they don't need you to read the documentation for them they need to know where the documentation is stored and the rationale behind what the change was so why did we move to blah whatever twig why did we move to you know insert whatever the technology is here I can look up as a technologist I can look up how to actually do stuff you don't need to handhold me through those parts but you need to explain the thinking that went behind why that technical change was made then we need to acknowledge resistance and help to overcome or counter people with the overall strategic plan well if you won't have a strategic plan of why you're upgrading to droop a late guess what it's going to be really really tricky to get people in alignment hate the word but it's a word with why we're actually making this change and then finally which I think this is a really interesting one is to provide counseling to alleviate fears and this is personal counseling this is not just we're making this change here's the you know here's the thing that you need to read in order to understand why but actually giving that that personal mentoring time and that support recognizing that changes hard people fear for their jobs and helping to make it an exciting change and then finally monitoring and fine-tuning so those are sort of some of the steps and then the the other thing that's referenced a lot is these sort of five stages of grief and although Elizabeth Cooper Ross's original definition was to do with with how we deal with death and it comes up very frequently in the business world for people who are going through a change management process if it's sort of imposed on them you're likely to see these there was a very funny tweet this morning which was a little bit different but their five stages of grief was something like and I it wasn't for programmers but it may as well might have been it was sort of self-loathe self-loathing anger hatred more self-loathing like I'm sort of like yeah I can see how not having a process to go through these steps may result in simply negative feelings and I think I think the final one was sweet sweet acceptance I I favored it but I can't I can't quite remember all the steps on it yeah so so recognizing there's a structure that other people have come up with there's some steps that you're probably going to go through as a company there are pieces out there that you can read more about and these are some of the emotions that you're probably going to be confronted with as your team goes through that transformation so a few of my kind of tips and tricks and I in the original presentation description I broke it into three sections these stories are very loosely tied to those three sections but I I think that that I I became good at working with burnt-out teams because of it's fair to say this because of my incredible aversion to conflict but I actually I'm a fighter and so I would rather not get started in conflict because it never ends well for everyone in the room and so I started getting really good at figuring out how do I read a room how do I interpret the information that's coming to me so that I can redirect some of those energies I can restructure a situation to reduce the potential for conflict and there's there's another book that's you know there's to do with team dynamics and one of them in forming a team is you have a storming phase where conflict is inevitable so I'm very quick to try and get out of that storming phase and figure out okay well this person is an introvert they fantastic person they're going to bring positive amazing ideas to the table but I need to give them the questions ahead of time so they can show up feeling prepared and empowered to actually present that information and not come to me three days later a very passive aggressive kind of way unintentionally be like hey so I've been thinking about it some more like no give them the time ahead of time to think about the problems but but a lot of these tips and tricks that I've come up with and are things that I've stumbled into and I think the the trick for me was as I started doing these things recognizing that it was a technique or a pattern which I could apply in other situations and starting to take notes about what I did at work and what did work and what didn't and thinking of it thinking of my management as an iterative process thinking of it in terms of like split testing like I'm gonna try that with this group and that with this group and see which one's effective and then maybe you know drop the technique that's not working so the first one that I have was the the agile schedule and I I have begun to think of the scheduling as sort of a marathon training and I have never completed a marathon but I've trained for marathons and the the basic structure is that you build up and then you have a recovery week you build up and you have a recovery week you build up and you have a recovery week so as you are planning out the sprint the project that you're working on with your team think about structuring the tasks that people will be completing in a way that they learn a little bit learn a little bit do something like they already know learn a little bit learn a little bit do something they already know learn a little bit do something they already know now I didn't taper it quite as much but there's also this concept in sports training where you have a taper at the end so the taper at the end in terms of the agile sort of more like client delivery process this is going to be your your final perhaps your final QA period if you do that as a separate sort of final push this gives you this visor a little bit of time at the end for unexpected things but really you know not ending on hard stuff ending on really easy stuff so that you've got that extra time in place so the the I guess the the one that is the story that comes to mind or the story that I've got written down for this one is to also think about how can you over the course of the sprint or over the course of the project rather sorry iterate through and plan to replace what you're actually building so how can you learn incrementally during the project while exposing functionality and I do if you go to your new computer open get the teams calm there's a link there on the home page to the resources for this there's a link about five steps to innovative infrastructure and the the line that I keep remembering is plan to replace and I've done this in springs where we knew at the end we were going to have to build a PDF generator it wasn't a Drupal site but we knew that we were gonna have to build this thing and quite frankly the dev who was going to end up being responsible for it was kind of freaked out by needing to learn how to do this thing and kept kind of putting it off I would put it in a sprint it wouldn't get finished was like hang on a second let's figure out how to slice this down into smaller pieces so we started with a print friendly style sheet and some extra templates and then we moved to a an extra page that people were redirected to that wasn't a print friendly style sheet that was actually the style sheet that they saw so that we could test to make sure that people were going to be actually meeting those PDFs and not wanting the web-friendly version we checked the browser stats at that point we validated that we did need to move forward to a PDF server and then we move forward finally to the hardest piece which was actually generating that Docker container with the WK HTML to PDF service in place that could accept information from the website it accepts different URLs different printers so we got up to that point and then it's the sort of taper off we deleted what we had originally created in terms of those print friendly style sheets but I sliced it down into how can we expose that epic into chunks that don't seem that difficult print friendly style sheets totally straightforward to build a page that is what they're going to see in their printer totally straightforward okay no they really do need to trade PDFs we knew that all the way along the client tonight did but we you know gradually built up to we plan to replace we expose the functionality we proved that it was going to be useful and then we finally throughout the original piece so thinking about how you can schedule that information and coaching people through the the complicated pieces okay we're going to start with the old way of thinking about how to build a theme but using the new technology we're not going to worry about best practices we're just going to start writing things with twig templates okay now that we're writing to twig templates now let's start thinking about what the best practices are and we'll let's refactor what we did throw it all our old way of thinking now that we understand just the technology of how to make a twig file now let's learn best practices you know some teams may want to work with the best or start with the best practices and then you know on drill seven let's start building out components and let's start thinking about how we structure our SAS files and then all we're learning is twig when we move over to drill eight so how can you break things down and structure them in a way that allows that sort of slow build easier hard hard hard easier so in terms of the mitigation of learning curve there are I guess three things that I have seen used effectively one at these two we call it a technical review board that's pretty scary sounding it made sense for a company of 150 or 200 or whatever they're at now but you plan a document and then you have all of the across the entire company all the senior level architects come in and they help to critique if you're used to design if you ever have a design crit you put the technical plan up and you have people from other projects come in and critique that plan and you start to say what works what doesn't work based on my experience you may want to do your migration sooner you may want to leave this to the end but you have a cross functional or not cross-functional I'm sorry same job title different teams and you spend maybe two hours on that technical review I like working in a Kanban style for teams who are learning new things so that you don't have the stress of not being able to close out a sprint anything that's unfinished simply rolls over into the next unit of time and then finally I really like taking time to do weekly internal demos which are not about proving finished it's about proving problems so I again they can be very experienced programmers but when they're learning new technologies I love to have both get on a call and say this is what I currently can't solve sort of the and we tended to do them on Fridays at the end of every week there was absolutely nothing technical that was blocking the team starting Monday so they could get rolling at the very beginning of the new week now so those are the sort of three points plan and review that's my technical review board allowed fluid scheduling Kanban and share learning often so we converted what was a weekly demo into just a really great it was essentially pair programming and I know Drupal isn't really into careful programming the way some other communities are but the more and more I see how again this is I've mostly working with distributed teams but the how delays can really frustrate people and slow them down in terms of like hey well I need help I have to wait for this person to answer my question like the issue queue something that could go a lot faster is going to take a lot more time but sitting down at the same time and going through pair programming whatever you want to call it I love parent code reviews so you sit down with the original developer and the person who's doing the review and you do that together I love that synchronous experience for learning and then finally we've got the motivation piece and I in the first development team that I worked with I've been I've been a manager of my own business and a manager of learners for quite some time as a college professor as a producer of Drupal training workshops and my sort of unfortunate advantage in those situations is that the folks who showed up wanted to learn they were in you know they would show up for class or they would show up for a workshop because they were ready or because they wanted change to happen now maybe they had been told to show up but generally speaking I was going to treat people in the room as a motivated I don't learn so I took this approach in my first development team experience and this is a team who had been trying to upgrade from Drupal 6 to Drupal 7 for close to a year if they hadn't been able to set the time inside to do it they were burnt out they were stressed out and I showed up with that can-do attitude of I'm going to tell you what the tickets are and you will happily do them because you're a developer and you love developing so there were some challenges and this is the one where I showed up with a bottle of whiskey but we you know one of the things that we talked about was how in the resources there's a presentation by Joe Schindler at DrupalCon Austin on called something to the effect of how to motivate how to motivate me as a developer that the project manager is complaining about is me but I'm in the audience heckling him so it's okay but one of the things that blew my mind initially was he would tell me what he needed to work on next I would make sure that the ticket was in the sprint and assigned it to him and he would get irritated because he didn't want to be told what to do well I wasn't telling him what to do he told me what he wanted to do I will put it in the spring and assigned it to him like your idea but we made this really minor change of allowing him to choose whatever ticket he wanted to work on so he would tell me what he needed to build next I would put it into the spring and he would assign it to himself and not really really minor change maybe massive amount of difference and one of the first things that he did in a charmingly I absolutely loved Joe he was just he changed the way I thought of it project management but one of the things he did back-end developer he was like I'm gonna take front-end ticket I was like all right we've been trying to you know save you from this magical place of front-end development it's actually a little bit harder than you think I'm gonna take it I'm gonna like it and yeah he took it all right he sure learned what he'd never used sauce before if I remember correctly there was a lot of learning that happened in that first week and it's sort of he came out of it a much much stronger developer in front-end technologies and with also a little bit of like okay I see why you were picking those to get for me now but that that degree of choice and that degree of autonomy people know what they need to work on but not telling them and letting them self-assign and be like I hang over Monday I want an easy ticket today I don't want the hard stuff but just just a minor bits of choice so don't assign get choice and celebrate wins and have very very high standards but in that high standard don't necessarily make we need to build this amazingly huge thing your very high standard can also allow for rewards and creativity and by rewards and creativity I mean can you think of a cheaper way to expose this business value can you think creatively about how to duct tape the solution to get something exposed to the client so that we have the opportunity to behind the scenes plan a fuller scaffolding that we can and again this is my PDF server example you know we like we duct tape together the CSS style sheets with the plan of building out a proper interest infrastructure later on so high standards but not for huge monolithic systems or huge fully built functionality but for amazing work finally ask the developers what motivates them have the conversation in general I found that contractors or outside companies are terrified of having choice because they don't have the context to understand which ticket will give the the best win or the highest value to the company who they're working for for the client who they probably have no context or no contact with rather so in in the cases where I've had an internal development team and an outsource plus plus one or plus some so I've worked with with the Ukrainian development teams I've worked with Indian mobile app developers who were sort of like doing some add-on stuff those two out certain like those two outsource companies did not want to pick tickets no thank you they want to know exactly what is expected of them they want to know exactly what the deadline is and the more prescriptive you can be and how that ticket gets completed with what technologies and like the more you can give them the more they're like okay that's perfect thank you very much I'm gonna go do my work now exactly the way you want and it's I don't think it's a cultural thing I think it's just I don't have a horse in this race you make the decisions and I'll make it happen so that you know that don't assign good choice that's a really bad tip for some people so ask them how do you want to work how how can we make this work for you as a team and that also means if you're talking to people you can't have one system that's going to exactly work in every single team across the entire company you can have a framework you can have a set of guiding principles but you're going to need to think about this cohesive team and this is where it gets really hard it's like well that team needs help because they're currently in fire mode well how can you give that team more time instead of ripping apart this team to throw on another resource who now has to onboard which is going to take someone's time to explain what the problem is like there's and I'm like I've got seven minutes left and I don't want to get too much into like if you have a larger company and you find that that's difficult let's talk later but the the idea of teams with a framework I think is one that works well in bigger companies and it also with something that I use today the eight steps for change management there's a framework there which you can apply you can pick and choose the pieces that are of use to you but the way that you implement change isn't going to be exactly the same as the way someone else implements change because your staff or your team is going to be a little bit different or a little bit further along or a little bit further behind a little less scared a little more afraid of the change that's going to happen then someone else's team so those are my three kind of promises that I made to you in the original description ultimately change doesn't happen by magic you can't kind of close your eyes I know it's a disappointment she tells me it doesn't happen by magic it happens by management and by conscious actions and thinking about what did I do here that worked why did this not work and taking those lessons and moving them forward to the next situation and this URL has the slides already uploaded and it has some of the sort of hit points in terms of the business management things as well as the URLs most of your also I mentioned today a couple of the books we've got sort of five minutes left I'm happy to continue ranting but now you've heard all the stories maybe there's extra questions everyone's like oh sleepy too much talking yes so there's there's a few pieces in there and recently I listened to an agile weekly podcast that was talking about the pace of implementing agile methodologies in traditionally waterfalls and one of the things that I thought was really like the sort of like ah interesting was timing are you being impatient with a team who is getting there but just getting there really really really slowly compared to it's like well I know this is going to be amazing so it should just happen tomorrow so pacing is definitely one and then the other one which I learned the hard way I love to iterate and improve I also love spreadsheets and so my team doesn't necessarily love to have the rub ripped out from underneath them every single week so iterative improvement is kind of special sort of hell for people who don't you know they they don't want to have to contact switch they don't want to have to think about it so one of the lessons that I learned in the process with Joe Schindler was yes a little bit to change or good but don't change too many things too often change like talk about this is the one thing we're going to try and we're going to any the agile weekly podcast I'd like do it for two sprints do it for a month and then say is that working okay what should we keep about that part of the change and what should we throw okay now that we've tried that's the one thing that we were going to focus on practicing now let's try the next thing that we're going to focus on practicing so you've got these sort of windows where you can throw everything out and say nothing there worked we're going to try this completely different thing so as the example I was trying to make iterative improvements on the process when I was working with Joe and that that sort of constant ripping the rug out from underneath was really stressful so we figured out what the pieces were going to be and we went to a and that this is described on the drip-wise me blog and we went to a pre launch way of running the project and then after the launch of the project we all came together as a team or the product the framework upgrade we got together to team and we said how do we actually want to work now that we hit this milestone and in like you know really really positive way I fired myself from project manager because having a self-directed team was really the direction that Joe wanted to head in and so it's like okay I did the the coaching and the the sort of task mastering and all of these things to get us to launch now we're we're at that milestone we don't really need a task manager like three team of three developers you can pick your own frigging team like tickets like I don't you don't need me to do this so you don't need the gatekeeper you don't need that and it as sort of time went on yes some coaching and yes some guidance ended up being useful and Addy provides that that oversight and but it was figuring out what do we what are we trying to do you know what's the vision for this kind of work and how is the most how can we do that most effectively so that I think sort of timing increments and allow yourself to throw things out absolutely I've got two minutes left I see two questions so yes but leadership themselves are in this because they believe they're all the amount of the process where it is good so what are your thoughts on how has changed agents so step number two on this is a sample of powerful coalition and it's sort of the I'm sure that I've not made this up but I I seem to recall somewhere that's like it's referred to affectionately the cabal assemble your team and figure out how to convince the leaders that the change is going to help them specifically as individuals they are going to spend less time tracing people down they're going to get bigger bonuses I have no idea what the incentive structure is in your company but get your group convince the leaders that it's a good idea because without that leadership part it's it is virtually impossible to implement change that ends in a shift in corporate culture so you can kind of secretly do things differently but you're not you're not going to get to the corporate culture shift if you can't figure out how to change and was there there was a third it yeah yeah I was actually thinking about how do you do the reverse yeah in the sense of how do you create friction in a group that just accepts what you say and and you want actually challenge more you throw out a big change thing and everyone goes okay cool yeah I don't know what circle I would so as you were saying you can obviously so the challenging piece and how to get to challenge people I would say go back and watch Todd's talk on empowering I don't remember the exact title of it if someone has Google open if they can check it's something like empowering self-directed teams or something like that and making sure you don't have a blame culture making sure that people are okay I just want to cover my head yeah so some of the things in terms of blame culture which are interesting though so I had a I'm gonna go with time I'm sorry I'm gonna cut myself off I really want to answer all of your questions I I'm not having come up to me and kick me off stage so I think I'm just preventing you from getting coffee at this point but I don't have a schedule anyone confirm that yeah we should wrap up okay we basically just ask the assumptions that creates a conversation and out of conversation facing that conversation evidence and that's the problem yeah you know because a lot of times in friction longer conversation


Hey there friends, thanks for checking in today. We're looking at a tri-star 12-gauge shotgun called the Cobra 3 Marine Check out that finish That's why it's called the marine model It's got this heavy coating that not only looks good, but it's very resistant to the elements We hear so often that shotgun barrels begin pitting over time or they take them into a Moist environment and people have problems won't happen with this Because it's got that coating on there that I think looks Outstanding it has a couple other things that I want to go through because it's got an MSRP of 305 and this is a lot of shotgun for the money It's got about three-quarter inch recoil pad polymer stock Polymer 4-end with a pick rail blade it up front sight. It does have a cylinder bore choke so it is threaded so other chokes could be added and then the magazine tube holds Five rounds and I've got six loaded right now, but there's something else I want to show you that I've never seen before, but I'm gonna shoot these in We'll talk about that. Did you notice anything different? It has a Spring loaded forend check this out Yeah, I'm loaded So the idea of short-stroking this shotgun Will not happen because it's got a spring in there. I'm not sure if you'll be able to see that But all you do is move the action and it will Spring load right back into place Now I have to admit I have short-stroked some pump action shotguns in the past You have to if you shot enough then I know you have and This will prevent that it's got a chrome lined barrel and chamber and I think I mentioned the MSRP is 305 and I think that's a lot of shotgun For the money. It's got an 18 and a half inch barrel. So it's small enough, but yet You know, it is a nice shotgun so far. I'm really digging it and I think it really looks cool Let's load it up. All right, so I have five shells in the magazine tube without one of the chamber Here's Fioki seven and a half shot high velocity So it's a much more powerful load than what you just saw But I want to further demonstrate the forend. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to Rack it back and then let go First shot we'll go right in the middle All right Just like that That's it. What do you think? Have you ever seen anything like that? It's got nice. I mean, I think that's a pretty cool feature now if you don't like that You can take that spring out and you can manually work the Forend as most other shotguns are so or offer so that's that's pretty cool But it's got a kind of tactical look to it with that marine coating in the black accents along with the way the trigger looks It's got the forend release right there All right, and it's a tri-star But every time I do a shotgun review somebody says how come you didn't put slugs in that How come we didn't see you shoot slugs? How do we know it looks up slugs? Well, I've got slugs So let me load up those slugs. All right, so here are three inch one and a quarter ounce Slugs I have four loaded up in the Cobra three. I'm going to shoot at that center tombstone only My targets are phenomenal CTS targets. I love them But I want to keep them. They've with withstood everything that I've ever fired at them. But in this case I'm only gonna use that tombstone Wow Well, those were four Slugs and man did that punch back. I'm thankful for the heavy Recoil pad, but I'm also feeling that Because it's a light shotgun 6.2 Six pounds two ounces would be the way to say it And I'm pretty happy Pretty happy with it hundred percent reliable so far with target loads high-velocity loads and now Slugs here three more three inch slugs.  Are you ready? Here we go. I'm back up a little bit I just watched the shooting on my viewfinder And did you notice on that third one that it did chamber with the help of the spring loading? That's a good example of what could happen because it was a three inch shell It got caught up just a little bit. I think in many other cases with other shotguns. It may not have Fully chambered, but that time it did and I was happy with the way that turned out So there it is TriStar Cobra 3 Marine model There's a look at the loading gate Also has a cross bolt safety But it works great and I do look forward to doing more with this especially some of the shotgun Spreads with some of the various chokes, but a nice setup, and I'm really happy with it Oh, by the way, the chokes are a Beretta Benelli choke So if you have those already or they're easy to find you can throw those chokes in there Get a little tighter spread if that's what you want, but I plan to do more with this It's a it's a nice shooting shotgun it performed well, and I certainly think it looks beautiful If you like videos like this, please subscribe and share I always appreciate thumbs up button Thanks for watching and you guys be safe


I will introduce myself. I suspect that most of you know me, but I'm Steve Gallagher, general cat herder and misanthrope. Mohan Buddu. Did I get it right at that time? Cool. Is our Fedora release engineering lead and we'll be talking today about how a how a YAML file turns into modularity unicorns. Do we have a clicker? Say hello Mohan. Hello everyone. Hello everybody. As Steve was saying, I'm Mohan Buddu. I work as a release engineer for Fedora and we are here to talk about how you can build modules and how they will be available in Fedora Repos. So first part is how you can build them and Stephen is going to help you out with that. Alright, so some of you may have come to my earlier talk where I explained why you might want to build a module, so I'm not going to cover that again. Let's assume for the moment that you've decided that this is the right thing for your project. So I'm going to take an example that I put together fairly recently for a... Alright, I realize that this is not terribly legible. We'll have the slides put up later. But this is a relatively simple example of a module MD YAML file which is the basic recipe for how you put together. This example is based on Hub, which is a tool for interacting with GitHub Raps. When we started the modularity I'd been maintaining the stable version of this for some time and they hadn't done a stable release in well over a year, but their upstream had lots and lots of really new features. So I decided I'll keep the stable release in main fedora and I'll make a module stream for the latest. Just the Git snapshot I'll release it about every month. Great. The first thing I had to do there was I had to create a new branch and I had to use at the time it was Fed repo request, but now Fed package actually has the capability to request from Relinch a new branch for an RPM. So my Hub RPM I asked it for a pre-release branch. It took about, I think it was six hours turnaround to get and that was particularly long, but they were busy that day and I got a new branch that I could commit to. So on that branch just like a regular diskit branch you prepare your spec file, you can do Fed package local and so on and so forth. The only thing you don't do is Fed package build because that is going to get rolled up into the actual module build. So you push to the repo but you don't actually need to do a traditional build. Then you request a module repository in diskit and you drop in it this file. It's a this is honestly but it's a very simple one but they don't really get a whole lot more complicated either. It's a very simple format, so I'll walk through it quickly. Sorry, we're having a little trouble with the speakers. I hope that doesn't get picked up on the recording. Aside from the header information, which just says this is a module in the document for format two, the mandatory entries are a summary which is basically the same as an RPM spec file summary. It's the same for a description. For the license, there are two kinds of licenses. You only need to specify what the license is for the module. During the module build service, this will automatically be populated with the license fields of any RPMs that are built with it as well for compliance purposes. The dependencies are actually, you know, I'm going to do that one last because that's the only complicated part in this run through the rest. References are fairly easy. You just tell it for informational purposes. Profiles are sort of like comps groups except that instead of a cabal of people with commit privilege to comps, you can actually just say I want to have these this set of profiles so that let's say my project has a server and a client, I can choose to say if you install module name slash server, you get all the server bits install module name slash client, you just get the client pieces and the packageer gets to define this, which is a significant usability improvement over comps. API here is trying to... API here is one of the more interesting concepts about this. It allows you to specify which output RPMs from the module build you are treating as acceptable for general use. Thank you. The implication there is that any binary RPM that is produced from the module build that is not listed under API is therefore implicitly included and supported only in so far as it is used by this module.  This allows us a way to bundle those together in such a way that you can say I only care about this for my package and you shouldn't be using it for anything else. And then lastly is the components. These are the things that make up the module itself. The name field that references that will reference a repository in the RPMs namespace of DistGit. The ref is any commit-ish if you know the get term. It's any branch or specific commit ID in that DistGit branch that you want to build from. So normally this will be a stream branch in very rare cases. It's a particular commit if you know that something got broken and you need to build against an older version, for example. So I'll jump back now quickly to the dependency section. The rationale is just a comment, essentially. It's reminding yourself why you put this particular component into the module. It's mostly useful for dependencies. This library is required in order to use this function in the main table or something like that. It's a useful hint for future use, but it doesn't get considered as part of any programmatic decision making. Thank you for answering. No, it can't. And there are historical reasons for that. That's a message of the modularity 1.0 effort where, since we were trying to modularize everything, including the platform, you had to justify and we made that a mandatory field because you had to justify why it got in there. That, I suspect, will probably drop that when we get to 3 of this format. So the dependencies this will be a little bit non-intuitive the way it's written here, but I think you'll find once I explain it that it's really handy. So the build requires and the requires, in almost all cases, they're going to be identical. Then they'll indicate that you'll build this platform and you'll run on this platform. So in YAML syntax, that is an array and that is the reason we specify an empty array is that that's a special case for the module build service, which will tell it build on any currently active platform. Right now, that would be Fedora28 and Rawhide in a little over a week, that'll be Fedora28, Fedora28 and Rawhide. Eventually we hope that'll also be Apple. So this just says when I build this, try for everything. If you want to limit it, you just use YAML syntax and you specify the specific releases that you want to put it on. As long as those two things are the same, what you'll do is the MBS will automatically build for each of those separately and then it will all get pushed out into the repositories. The other feature of that is not quite ready but will be hopefully soon, which is if it is possible to specify a different set of them and have it for example build requires on F28 but be installable on F28, 29 and Rawhide because you know that it has no dependency on the actual platform. You just need somewhere to build. I would like people to notice that there is no dash in front of requires. It's a list of build requires and requires. Just one item. The comment from the peanut gallery, sorry, Petter is that there's a little trickiness in the YAML here. This is actually a single entry and you can have multiple entries but that's a complicated feature that I hope no one ever uses. And people will get wrong. Okay. So the question is what happens when you have modules, other modules besides platform in there? I think. Okay. So the question is what do you do when you map things when the build requires and requires aren't exactly the same? I'm going to gloss over that in this particular talk because it's a fairly complicated case and we anticipate that the majority of cases will just match them. We probably will only support the build on once and run many places case. I don't think it's likely that we will try to do the reverse. By policy, I suspect we will not allow both. So once you have written that YAML file, that was the hardest part of this process from the perspective of the packager. What remains is you fed package push and then you fed package module build in that modules disk repository and in this case you'll see that it submits builds 1978 and 1979 and the reason for that is because I requested it be built on all available platforms and that was 28 and 29. So that I believe is my half of this. So Mohan is going to talk to you about how the tagging structure works and how that gets out to a repository. So now about how to get those modules into the repose basically Koji tagging. How many of you guys know how a normal RPM tagging works in normal world? Okay, four people. That's great actually. So it's basically similar to whatever the normal RPM tagging with slight differences which I'll go through it right now but we have three different life cycles. So we have three different life cycles. One is raw hide, the other one is branched and then released. So we will go through on each of them. First one is raw hide. Basically you call fed package module build and once you call that it will be tagged that particular release. Raw hide modular signing tag where it will wait for signing and once the module gets signed which means all the RPMs in the module once they get signed they will be tagged into the base tag of that release which is F29 in the current scenario and the repo is generated every night in our nightly composes. So and basically when I say repo we are actually having a sub package for federal repose which is federal modular repose back until a week ago I guess yes so in which you contain all the module information and stuff like that but a week before we drop that and now each and every variant we have modularity enabled so guys who don't know about this and if you are using raw hide please go and try it out and please let us know how it is going so that's how you can consume the repose every night it will get updated with modules then we have branched branched is a little bit different because we have both involved so how it works is once you build it it will get tagged into modular update where the update is going to sit until you submit the update in Bode once you submit the update it will be it will be tagged into modular signing pending tag where it will wait for it's signing and once it's signed it will get tagged into modular updates testing pending I think I got it right yeah we release engineers and info people will push updates every day so once it is tagged into that pending tag, testing pending tag when we push updates it will be tagged into modular testing tags and modular updates testing tags where we generate the repose and you can use it as that's the testing repose that you can consume and once it meets the Bode requirements it will get tagged into the base tag and from which these repose are generated nightly again just as raw hide and you can get the stable repose from them and the released for the time sake it's similar to branched but we introduced modular updates tag as a stable tag so once it passes testing it will be once the Bode requirement is met it will be waiting in the modular update pending tag and once the push is completed it will be tagged into modular updates and where the repose are generated and you can consume them as the stable repose and the differences from the normal rpm to current is as Stephen was saying you can build modules for different releases at the same time based upon what your build requirements are so it can generate multiple builds and the way that it will work is with the same module build command you can get two different module builds each pointing to different releases and based upon where the release is it will go through that particular lifecycle if it is raw head it will just get tagged and the nightly compose will generate it if it is branched it will go through the entire Bode process so that's how you get your repose so that's it mostly and I hope everyone will try modularity and let us know how it is working out for you questions question about targets we found out that for development it would be good to have at least a target for the last module build but I think they are pruned currently do you know how long they stay in the Koji and we could reuse them for scratch builds it's a complicated issue but the specific question is how the module targets are pruned so the question is about how do we prune modularity targets in Fedora and up until recently that was a bug they actually they are not supposed to be pruned they were getting pruned right now that pruning is entirely turned off on them and we are doing it manually if we know something is gone but that was just a bug I think I fixed it probably two weeks back so should we do that again? yeah the expected result if let's say you built against platform 28 and 29 and one of the build fails what is the expected result if you build against 28 and 29 and one of them fails pretty much the same if you built the RPMs individually against 28 and 29 and one of them has failed like the updates don't happen automatically well except for raw hide if it doesn't fail you won't have it available to create a BODI update for it you just have to go fix it before you can do that does it mean that you get another build that you want to first push the working update and then fix it and then do another build or? the question was does that mean you have to do another build yes we don't really have a policy on whether or not we want to require you to build them both a second time I mean you can always choose to modify for a single build to have it just build for the one platform by changing that build requires and requires field so if you know that there's no reason to rebuild you can do that and then then uncommit that after you know that change after you have done the build what is the policy about using the branch name in the model and if that I need to do a new commit to take the new content of the branch or what is the policy behind reusing the same branch name oh this is not about policy this is a technical question and what he's asking about is why he needs to commit to the module again when he just updates the RBM ok so the question is why do I have to do another commit to the module repo when I make a commit to the RBM's repo in order to rebuild them that is a question better asked of the MBS maintainers I'm not entirely sure well yeah so when the MBS does its build it takes that branch and then it actually goes and looks up what is the real commit ID and it saves that as part of this build and when you do a and the reason for this is because you have test flakes or issues where the build fails it's recoverable you just try it again and it would go and so this ensures that it actually rebuilds the same thing it was trying to before even if you've made another commit they don't want to change things out from under you while you're doing that so it requires you to make a new commit in order for it to go and look up the latest ID and see if it matches it's a really esoteric technical problem the question from Langdon was didn't we push a change to make sure that wasn't the case anymore and the answer was no let's take that discussion to the expert help desk in the afternoon so the question is if you build something that is available only as a module and not in the standard traditional RPM repositories will a user have to go and enable a module in order to see it the answer is it depends on whether or not you have requested and this is something we probably should have covered in there was you have to request a default stream and if you pick one stream of a module to be the default on this platform and on this platform then it will just simply show up similar to if it was enabled there's only one minor technical reason why it's different than being enabled so defaults are not visible in the builder you always have to explicitly state that in the build requires if you need it to build so the question is can I have a non-module RPM depend on something that is in the default stream of a module technically you can by policy say no the question is can a module depend on another module in build requires yes absolutely I also kind of glossed over that because when that list starts getting long and divergent the number of MBS builds that get fired off gets large that would be one of those cases where you might see more than one list there is if you know that it depends on this version stream in this release and this version stream in that release you can actually dictate that in the file format but we are out of time so I'm definitely not covering that today apparently we have a different clock so I had time to say thanks for coming thank you very much