e doing today the vast majority require significant engagement of the public so this constitution actually ensures that people are part of the lawmaking process when it comes to amending our constitution that's what we have and by the way for those of you who are anglophiles by the way that's not what a British constitution says the British constitution hardly know about the thing called referendum you know it's not enshrined nothing is enshrined in the British constitution although you might want to argue that Bill of Rights the UK Bill of Rights is somewhat entrenched they don't have a written they don't have a written constitution you know but you know what they put us through all of this because they felt that we gotta handle ourselves we couldn't trust ourselves that's a bottom line you know and you're so faithful to the untruth that the British decrease us that you yourself believe in it too now you want to trust yourself you better go and trust the Englishman that's where we are that's the reality that we have that's the reality that that that we have but mr. Speaker free government in the Caribbean that has had a referendum in obedience to their constitution has run into trouble oh no one Antigua got into trouble Greta got into trouble Saint Vincent got into trouble and the Bahamas got into trouble let me tell you how perverse it was in the Bahamas do you know mr. Speaker that in the Bahamas the Bahamian man can marry an outsider and that outsider is entitled to citizenship under the Bahamian constitution the Bahamian woman on the other hand if she marries a man from outside now you understand why the Bahamian women don't like to marry people from the rest of the region if she marries a man from outside that man is not entitled to citizenship you understand what I'm saying now a very patriotic bright sharp prime minister dear friend of mine decided that couldn't be right and since we were they were in the era of clamoring for the rights of women he would go to the electorate he'll propose an amendment to the Bahamian constitution and ask the Bahamian people to vote in a referendum as prescribed by the constitution to make it to equalize the treatment of women in the Bahamian constitution to give women the same rights that men in the Bahamas have you know what happened when you went to the constitution he lost the he lost it you would have imagined that the people of the Bahamas so enlightened that in this day and age they get an opportunity to amend the constitution to treat women equally like men and they turn it on and you must have had women in the Bahamas who also turned it on and you know why because they became the victim of the ignorance of the politics that we have because instead of voting on the virtues and benefits of the referendum what they went to do was to vote against the government because they don't like the government that's what that's happened in all of these islands and unless mark my words unless you do not get agreement between an opposition and a government to amend those deeply entrenched provisions in this constitution we're not going to get anywhere I mean there was one country and there are some countries who have life easier Barbados can amend this constitution easily they don't have no referendum requirements trade out is another that can amend this constitution fairly easy in Jamaica they amended their bill of rights and created a new bill of rights patting it again the bill of rights in Canada because because their constitution was no was much more facilitated that's the reason why so a referendum not tools to play with what the opposition really wants is to go for a referendum where's a pile of money going up and down the country shouting and screaming talk you know and talked about the usual things that's what they want you know it's political embarrassment and political mischief because if you really go for a referendum it's really a vote they want they want to see what the chronometer is saying about the government that said I don't really want to cause mischief but you know what you you cannot on the one hand claim that you are faithful to the constitution you respect the constitution and then on the other hand what you are doing effectively is to try to denature the constitution violate the very safe constitution by imposing a requirement which the constitution does not impose that's what you're doing you have no respect for the constitution if you can't appoint a deputy speaker for five years how can you come to me and claim your respect in the constitution you won't referendum how can you do that and why should anybody believe you why should anybody believe you you create a precedent and there's one lesson I have learned that's prime minister succeeding prime minister is better understand this let me tell you something a constitution can never be a complete document it can never anticipate all the problems you will have a constitution or just bones some might have more bones than others because they have more detail you will meet situations in public life that you never dreamed of or you never thought possible and the constitution will have no answers but you know what you know how we deal with it as our society develops as we become more sophisticated as our politics evolves we try to create certain conventions and practices to fill in the gaps we are a young nation 44 years old I was around when independence occurred in 79 and I was wrong we are a young nation we are hard on ourselves we don't understand that we are evolving we will not get it right all the time we will make mistakes but we can't afford to be as hard on ourselves because say what they what they will we have been able to govern and manage ourselves notwithstanding all the problems we have had we have done it we have done it yes we have problems we have issues but one thing I have learned is this when I look back at the last couple years and what happened with the tenure of the last government what are you going to parliament in the past mrs speaker and I notice I haven't called your name for a while mrs speaker when we introduce legislation sometimes I acted in the belief which turned out to be wrong and naive that my successor would understand why certain legislative postures were adopted and that in turn having come to power will respect what was created and applied whether we want to admit it or not that was an important lesson from the tenure of john Compton says john Compton and he applied it in the context of the deputy speaker when you see the labor party agreed after the debacle of 79 after they were almost annihilated politically to accept the deputy speaker position in those days it was understood between the two that it was an agreement between the parties when we lost the general election of 2006 he sent the member of a castries north to me and asked me whether I would accept or would agree to one of my members in deputy speaker and I told him I will have none of it why because in the face of that victory I needed to protect my six members to be sure that we can deliver the punches we needed to deliver but you know what he did he promptly resolved it by appointing one of his elected members as deputy speaker and that didn't stop the relationship talking to each other never did because you see you act on the basis that there are conventions that fill in gaps in your political practice and so you're going to rely on those commitments now I had expected that the honorable member for miku south would have understood that and would have dealt with the deputy speaker situation because you know why you know why because it is important for the people of the country to see that you have been faithful to the constitution which they accepted you govern them that's why you do those things it doesn't have political benefits like it will necessarily when you vote but what it does it maintains the sanctity of your fundamental document the document you say that governs your life that's what it is but I'm happy that there'll be an amendment and I would want to give meaning to this when it is convenient at that time we now come to this matter of this referendum member for view for itself you have 10 minutes left no Mr Speaker I'm certain that our members will agree that I deserve an hour and possibly more but I'll take an hour remember for Henry north Mr Speaker permit me to invoke for you to turn in the standing orders to allow the honorable member for view for itself an additional 30 minutes within which you complete this presentation you want to you want okay Mr Speaker correction um permit me to suspend 32 8 to allow the parliamentary representative for for south an additional hour within which to complete his presentation on the bill before the house all the members the question is that standing order 32 8 be suspended to allow the member of view for itself an additional 60 minutes in which to complete this presentation and I'll put a question as many as that opinion say aye as many as of a country opinion say no leave his granted proceed member thank you mr speaker thank you very very much sorry I had to extract that from the member for denry north but never mind mr speaker now mr speaker I now turn to the question do we need a referendum as I said earlier this matter has been double law efforts and the government which I led out of deference to the minority who insisted decided to put the matter to the court albeit for an advisory opinion and we know that an advisory opinion is not a binding decision of the court it is not the process of of the liberate of litigation before the court it only offers an indication of how a court is likely to rule and I really want to commend to everybody in this house to read the advisory opinion of the court of appeal but I want to start by saying to the people of seduction that as much as we may criticize the framers of our constitution nevertheless nevertheless it was very clear that the framers of our constitution knew that the time would come when we would have when we would have had to sever links to the prior council they knew that and they reflected it in this document and I want you to look at a particular section we'll be talking about section 41 7 subsection 8 now just just just look at it for a minute 41 right in section 46 it says how you must amend the constitution for those deeply entrenched provisions the ones where you require like a three-quarters majority and a referendum it says that you must have those specified majorities and you will have to have a referendum if you touch those sections like for example the sections dealing with your fundamental rights freedom of association freedom of expression etc then it goes on to say in subsection 7 the provision of paragraph b of subsection 6 of the section shall not apply in relation to any bill to alter it is saying that the provision to have specified majorities to alter a change the deeply entrenched provisions of the constitution like the establishment of courts your fundamental rights etc establishment of the house of assembly etc and you require specified majorities and referendum but in this instance specified on 41 7 you do not need that it says the provisions of paragraph b of section 6 of this section shall not apply in relation to any bill to alter and says section 107 of the constitution in order to give effect to any agreement between st. Lucia and the united kingdom concerning appeals from any court having jurisdiction in st. Lucia to her majesty and what does it mean it simply means it simply means that this requirement for you to have a specified majority and to have a referendum for the deeply entrenched provisions of the constitution does not apply in the case where you have an agreement with the bridge government and you enter into an international agreement and of course where you deal with the matter of appeals to her majesty and counsel the privy council it says I'm going to repeat it section 107 of this constitution order to give effect to any agreement between st. Lucia and the united kingdom concerning appeals from any court having jurisdiction in st. Lucia to her majesty and counsel so you don't need to satisfy those earlier requirements about referendum about specified majority if you are dealing with an agreement regarding those appeals that go to the privy council her majesty and counsel so what referendum you talk to me about when you establish a Caribbean court of justice it was an agreement it was an international agreement why do you have to write to her majesty's government well it's not her majesty the king's government is this why you have to write to the king's about your decision to amend your constitution because it is in fulfillment of that requirement that you have entered into an agreement an international agreement a treaty and you are saying to the king's government we are ready to proceed and we need your concurrence and of course the member for castries is gave you the responsibility so the framers were clearly understood but you know what I find particularly fascinating mrs speaker mrs figure look at it look at it okay you know what I find fascinating is you know I tell you somehow somebody knew and understood that somewhere in time in history that if it may be possible to secure an agreement between caracum governments governments in the region you understand mrs figure to establish a court to replace the privy council I am certain that is what at the back of their minds now but then clear as this is you still have problems so we go to the advisory opinion and then of course that section 41 which is a big issue and I have referred to when the talk of exceeding to the caribbean court of justice came around obviously we looked at all the caribbean constitutions to see what they had though we see as constitutions dominica granados and kids and then we noticed that the commonwealth of dominica had proceeded to the caribbean court of justice and its constitution had a nearly similar provision to ours so the question arose why dominica and not st lucer if the provisions in law we say in paramaterial almost identical but why them are not us now just to explain to you I'm going to read the dominica provision and read the st lucer provision so you can understand this thing a little better don't let them bamboozle you there no need to be bamboozle don't let them bamboozle you now st lucer first st lucer 41 section 41 subsection 7 subsection 8 the provision of paragraph b of subsection 6 of this section shall not apply in relation to any bill to alter a section 1 or 7 of this constitution in order to give effect to any agreement between st lucer and the united kingdom concerning appeals from any court having jurisdiction in st lucer to her majesty council this is st lucer dominica now and i'm looking at dominica section 42 subsection 4a that's the equivalent it says the provisions of this paragraph b of this of subsection 3 of this section shall not apply in relation to any bill to alter a section one or six of this constitution in order to give effect to any agreement between dominica and the united kingdom concerning appeals from any court having jurisdiction in dominica to the judicial committee now if my students were sitting in the how they're sharp enough sharp enough they might pick up they might pick up the little difference although they might need the aid of the difference is this the section in the dominica constitution to which reference is made that section 106 of the constitution of dominica is not the same section that the constitution of st lucer refers to section 106 of the constitution of dominica is referring to appeals from the court of appeal to the judicial committee of the privy council so in a dominica case the reference section was to appeals to the privy council so the dominica constitution made it absolutely clear that the agreement you are talking about has to be in the context of dealing with the issue of appeals to the privy council that's the first limb don't let them bamboozle you i tell you now said lucian what was the problem let's go back said lucian says the provisions of paragraph b of subsection six of the section shall not apply in relation to any bill to alter section one of seven of this constitution in order to give effect to any agreement between said lucian the united kingdom concerning appeals from any court having jurisdiction in said lucian to a majesty council now when you take the solution constitution and we now go to section 107 listen to what section 107 says and this is where the problem lies and this is where the problem lies section 107 says subject to the provisions of section 39 eight of this constitution an appeal shall lie from decisions of the high court to the court of appeal as of right in the following cases final decisions in any civil or criminal proceedings on questions as to the interpretation of this constitution final decisions given in exercise of the jurisdiction conferred on the high court by section 16 of this constitution which relates to the enforcement of the fundamental rights misjudgment and such other cases as may be prescribed by palm in other words the section in dominica is directing us to where the agreement should be with the majesty to the link that is to the privic also in our case it is directing us to the decisions of the court of appeal but who wants to change the structure of a court of appeal a structure that is entrenched by agreement you can't do that yes parliament can prescribe can certainly prescribe establishment of courts so the question then became that if there is a variation in that the reference in seducia was different from dominica then was there an error no you know us in the region you know us in the region white men can't make mistakes you know i'm sorry for sounding that way but we believe because you see is white men in englandy they would rob this constitution and so on they tell you i'm outrageous i'm being racist you know me already always say it's not my fault all kind of nonsense but if the since this constitution is drafted was drafted by the colonial office menu with the input of local politicians they will tell you them fellows in england can't make mistakes the mistake is ours we don't want to make a mistake that's them that's them but the reality is that it was a mistake because there's one other constitution like it which is similarly worded and that is the constitution of the federation of said christopher anivas and the reference which i shall not bother to go through with you today the reference in this constitution despite the differences the reference is identical to the dominica constitution and the court said they are fortified in their view that it was a mistake in the case of the constitutional situation so the question to be settled in saint lucia that is why we need to have respect for the decision of the court the question is whether there was a mistake in the constitution and i'm now going to turn to the judgment of the court very briefly in the majority opinion of the the court and they put that question very well in fact i'm going to read it out i'm going to read it out to you question was whether the reference in section 41 section seven a of the constitution should properly be to section 108 instead of section 107 and section 108 is what governs appeals to the previcom so if yes was a reference to 107 an error and the chief justice again put it differently the question may essentially be stated thus is the reference to section 107 in section 41 7 a of the constitution instead of 108 an error that is a typographical or printing error which would be correct which should be corrected or does the section read as a framers of the constitution intended it that's how the chief justice put it now we decided as i said earlier to refer the matter for an advisory opinion and i want to just remind the public of who appeared before the court it says queens council appeared on behalf of some members of the st lucha bar association who put forward a legal opinion given by dr. Lloyd Barnett prepared the request of the st lucha bar association council on behalf of the other members of the st lucha bar association council on behalf of the leader of the opposition in st lucha so you see the leader of the opposition at the time was was represented also president of the herring was mr. Richard williams attorney at law attending the proceedings on behalf of the attorney general of st vincent the grenadines whose constitution is said to contain a similar reference at section 47 a of the st lucha constitution now there's a story about Lloyd Barnett the eminent Caribbean jurist because the bar association had him give Lloyd Barnett to give an opinion as to whether there was an error Lloyd Barnett is famous he's distinguished he wrote one of the first constitutional treaties of Caribbean constitutions the constitution of Jamaica and he had an incredible history in the courts of Jamaica do you know Lloyd Barnett told the told about association that he agrees that there was an error in in the constitution distinguished council you know told the very persons who recruited him to go and argue for them that he told them there was an error and the judge makes reference to this to this subsequently now the courts concluded in really prominent language that there was an error in our constitution and this is what the chief justice said in paragraph 27 and I want to read it to you to put it on the record because this this debate is too important not to read those things into into the record and we need to do so today this is what the judge said the provisions of the supreme court order entrenched in section 41 subsection 6 b do not deal with appeal to the previous council from any court in St. Lucia it is therefore inconceivable as to what agreement could possibly be contemplated between St Lucia and the United Kingdom regarding appeals from the high court to the court of appeal which is what section 107 concern that I tried to explain earlier which would somehow concern appeals from any court in St Lucia to the previous council the reference to section 107 and 41 7 a in my view makes no sense whatsoever and leads to an absurdity in construing this provision without you have judge use such language judges don't use language like that yes truly talk about manifest absurdity but that's rare a judge is saying that the provision in a constitution is absurd it leads to an absurdity section 107 bears no rational connection to appeals to the previous council and similarly an alteration of section 107 to give effect to an agreement between St Lucia and the UK concerning appeals to the previous council from a court in St Lucia is simply in my view nonsensical as section 107 simply does not deal with such appeals you think a judge would put a neck on a block make a statement like that unless he was not absolutely convinced of what she was writing I don't even think just to keep justice Baron would have could have put it more eloquent and more directly than that I don't think so his language is different is a different quality of erudition and you know this is this is I want you to understand I want the people of St Lucia to understand what Mr Shasne is saying what the leader of the opposition is saying now you need a referendum the constitution prescribed the referendum so you must have a referendum and I hope I'm taking them through in the simplest way that I can to explain this and why our Chief Justice has to say this is nonsense and you know I know what their response is going to be to be to be you know oh ah Chief Justice they have to go to the Pripyat Council I don't know the Pripyat Council will say the same thing but I'll come to that in a few minutes and the court concluded that there was an error in our constitution and if you then as I said read paragraph 27 and proceeds to answer all the questions put before the court and again for history I'm going to read paragraph 41 of that judgment of that decision so and these are the questions the court was asked to answer Mr. Speaker question one whether the reference in section 47 47 of the constitution should properly be to section 108 instead of 107 if yes was a reference to 107 an error answer yes if the answer to question one is yes whether the error may be judicially corrected merely upon the determination of this application or by an application of by the Attorney General to a judge of the High Court or must the error be corrected by an alteration to the constitution answer yes the constitution ought to be read and construed as if section 107 in section 41 subsection 7 subsection 8 were deleted and section 108 substituted there is no need for further application to the High Court which in any event has no jurisdiction to determine a question for an order the power to interpret such a question having been given by Parliament to the Court of Appeal by virtue of the Act question three if the answer to question one is yes is yes whether the agreement established in the Caribbean Court of Justice signed on February 14th 2001 and ratified by St. Lucia on July 5th 2002 and enacted into the laws of St. Lucia as a Caribbean Court of Justice Agreement Act number 34 of 2003 constitutes an international agreement to which St. Lucia is a party for the provisions for the purpose of the provisions of section 41 subsection 7 subsection b the answer is yes if the answer to question one and two is yes whether for the purpose of an alteration of the constitution to replace appeals to a Majesty in Council with appeals to the Caribbean Court of Justice the agreement between St. Lucia and the United Kingdom reference in section 41 subsection 7a may validly be entered into by St. Lucia alone or in common or more other the more other states of the organization of East Caribbean state which may have similar constitutional provisions may validly be entered into prior to the passage of bill referred in subsection 41 to yes such an agreement must predate the presentation of the bill to alter the constitution to give effect to the agreement and here we have it that was the process that is the logic that is explanation why we need no referendum because our constitution did not contemplate any referendum but there are other important issues and a member of castries is was heavy on the point of access and I too want to say a few words about this you know we can talk always one about justice about the rule of law and what the value of justice is but you know unless citizens enjoy the protection of the law which of course translates into unimpeded access to the courts it can never be just all right it they can never ever get the full benefit the fruits of justice they will not get it access to the courts become critical and the point is clear this is this thing has continued for too long it can never be just all right that access to justice is only for those who can afford it it can be rights that's why I will quarrel when my courts if you vote across for months it can't be rights it cannot be because access to justice is critical and in our judicial system yes three tears we have a magistrate court and if you prefer a high court although high court has different restrictions the magistrates court the court of appeal and pretty comes when you go to the magistrates court you're entitled of course to appeal your whatever whatever decision against you go to the court of appeal if you want when you go to the high court you're entitled to appeal from the high court to the court of appeal but then of course from the court of appeal then you are entitled to appeal to the private council and the member of country east is right we have thousands of cases being filed every day in this country how many of these cases widely aware to the private council in the last 20 years as he rightly said we have roughly had 17 appeals in 20 years and you will tell me that they're not ordinary solutions who won their cases heard a third time by a third court to determine whether the issue was that with failure and justly at the court of appeal or the high court but you know what what they can't get there they can't get there is it you will believe you think they don't have no right to appeal to the people because they have no reason to appeal to the people council like the member for castries is the issue has always been cost and it's no joke it's no joke massively these days massively these days we can follow deliberations by zoom as i'll tell you in a few minutes and look at some of the costs to file for an interlocketry matter in other words a matter to interpret the rules as to whether you follow your form the proper procedure to put it simply in the uk is 700 pounds and you're talking about almost three three thousand dollars if you're filing an appeal that involves damages monetary damages no you have to find about five thousand two hundred pounds immediately and if you're going to how if you're going to engage an english solicitor or barrister whatever to go before the premier council for an hour or two just in a matter to sick leave for example if it's not paper leave know that you have to find two thousand five hundred pounds which purpose in st lusia can find two thousand five hundred pounds now don't come and tell me that in the case of criminal cases they get appeals done freely because i've told you why that is done in the uk a lot of that is done in the uk not because maybe they are decent lawyers in the uk that believe in human rights but also because it fulfills and sustains the agenda of the premier council to abolish hanging in these islands so they are busy making sure that those who commit criminal offenses for one reason or another are properly represented and you can't persuade me otherwise you know now but talk to sedition lawyers who have gone to the premier council and they'll tell you the kind of money their clients have had to pay talk to seditions who have had recent cases before the premier council asked them how much they have had to foot for the bills and you know the system in the uk is divided between solicitors and barristers solicitors of course are the ones who do the initial leg work the administrative arrangement and so on and brief the barristers etc the barristers do the actual argument most importantly we're not like that in st lucer our lawyers do both the work of solicitors and barristers although you'll be careful what heart you wear when the solicitors fees in the uk for filing and and i'm engaging in the administrative management of a matter will cost you between 65 000 to 75 000 appearances by barrister the upwards of a hundred thousand dollars so mr speaker what you put your light on for who in st lucer mr speaker would be able to pay for this kind of money pay this kind of money now contrast this mr speaker with costs at the canyon court of justice filing fees are divided into two categories namely applications for what we call special leave if you have problems where you leave it will be refused by your own court or appeal without a right an appeal for special leave to the ccj will cost you us dollars 250 for civil cases and i like that that consumes less than a thousand pages if you want to file a case and you're going to file a thousand pages the filing fee is us 250 dollars mr speaker for a similar period that consumes more than a thousand but less than 2000 pages the filing fee is us dollars 750 for a similar appeal that consumes more than 2000 pages the filing fee payable is us 1200 in effect no little gun will ever pay more than us dollars 1200 if special leave was necessary and us 250 dollars if special leave was necessary in filing fees is the ccj this is irrespective of the amount of money involved in the litigation incidentally mr speaker no fees are paid in criminal matters and let me add mr speaker every applicant for special leave or every appellant is entitled under the rules to apply for waiver fees there's a rule 10 18 in the rules of procedure that allows the ccj to completely waive all filing fees for a poor person who has an arguable ground of appeal the rules set other criteria for determining who is to be regarded as a poor person that's the reality mr speaker and i am confident that the day the ccj is the final court of appeal we will begin to see a rush to seek judgment by sent lutions in a way they were never able to do under the previous counsel and you are trying to tell me that sent lutions don't deserve this don't deserve the right to find out whether the courts below have made the right decisions and they tell you you that it's a creature politicians and you know what is the worst most perverse it is a uwi train cabal that set up the court and that is in league with the court now i take deep offense to that and i take deep offense to that i am a uwi graduate and i have two degrees from uwi with first class honors and i'm as good as any student anywhere in the world look i'm returning that nonsense u is far better than many universities in canada and the united states why you believe they're number five university in the hemisphere look i'm in a stupid argument and and we feel you can contaminate me and divide you me because i have to you i've been university in the uk i did the bar in the uk i know what it takes i did my phd and the bar together in two years two three years before nonsense you come and tell me and try to do the value of my my degree and tell me that your uwi cabal and i would say this because i know mr speaker time is coming away i will say this mr speaker no community of nations in the world today has taken steps to ensure the integrity of a court that it has established then the car come nation states why do i say that mr speaker and don't don't come to mention to me about united states you know i come in there you don't come to me and tell me about united states or i'm coming there you know or the uk you know you see mr speaker let me tell you you the member of the cathedrals is i told you no government can hold a decision to run some because we established what you call a trust fund the government's borrowed a hundred million dollars to finance the court and the court has been financed from the earnings of the trust fund so no government can see if you don't do my bidding i'm not i'm not going to fund the court as has happened in the region i admitted it has happened mr speaker their government was guilty of that you know in our region and they had to be taught a lesson they had to be taught a lesson mr speaker and i'll come to that in a few minutes secondly the member of cathedrals speaking is for the independence of the courts the mechanism for appointing judges the judges have regional judicial legal services commission no politician has access to that even though we may be quietly disgruntled with the decisions of the of the judicial and legal services commission i have seen them make choices and i disagree with the choices but i'm not going to berate the court for that or lose confidence because of that nonsense and i want you to tell them compare and come today as has been a case of independence in the united states judges to the supreme court in the us are selected by the senate a political body and today in the united states their democracy facing pressure could possibly implode internally why because what they did when trump was president was to load the court load the court with their political appointees and the americans are now beginning to feel a bite of it that to exist in the carabin and when i tell you we sell our country short it is things like that that i remember that we don't even know and understand our inheritance our democracy now look at the united kingdom i had to tell you about the privet council and how the privet council is distant and they did not know that until until now the judges of the privet council are the same judges in the house of lords and the house of lords was the second legislative chamber in the united kingdom that they sat in the house of lords just like other lords who are funded by political parties that's why they call it the house of lords what more political connection do you want from that but you know it was on the blend our blood did something very interesting this is bigger blood did something very interesting black turned around when he realized what was happening he then established a supreme court and you know where he took the inspiration from he took the inspiration from these constitutions in our region and the constitutions handed down to african countries to establish a supreme court to try to make it independent and change the method of appointment that is you come and tell me about political the only point the only point of interaction comes when the president of the caribbean court of justice has to be appointed and the procedure is clear the regional judicial legal services commission they invite applications they assess the applications and they make a recommendation because somebody has to appoint the president of the court and to this day every recommendation the judicial regional judicial legal services commission has made the governments have gone along they've never questioned that really the appointment by the heads of government of the president of the court there's nothing more than a shall we say a little convention to signal appointment so what are you telling me about political interference I tell this when I served as head of department of the faculty of law I participated in training many graduates of the universities in law I'm very proud of what we produced and today I see many of them are judges in our region different parts of the world I'll tell you another sadness for me is that when I see them I can't talk to them they're my ex-students she just is rolling start from what she just is rolling sat in my class at Gabriel I can't talk to him when I see him hi hello because of the respect and of the reverence your judge and it is this this service that continues and at that close mr. speaker this argument about fixing judiciary before going to the ccj only needs to be stated to be rejected why mr. speaker the council has been around this time what impact has the privy council had on the quality of the justice in the region apart from rendering appeals what reforms can you say you can direct to the privy council all the privy council has done sometimes is interpret our constitution to do that your logical bidding I've not tackled the problems that you have in the law judiciary mr. speaker how on earth how on earth you're going to stay and retain the privy council to tackle those problems what is the specialty about the privy council should be around when you tackle your problems it is the our failing over the years and we have not followed in in our case the example of the former labor government to bring changes to the judiciary and we must we are the ones for goodness sake that establish a criminal jurisdiction of the high court and all the changes that exist the evidence act etc we don't want to do so and we need to continue bringing changes to the court this business and i come back to that the people in my constituency cannot get access because of the problem of the magistrate court that should not exist we're different now let me conclude do i say two things this is fair of the caribbean court of justice and politicians you know mr. speaker i am so very proud of the caribbean court of justice and whatever can be so far you see every politician around this table should have a mortal fear of the direction that the jurisdiction of the court is taken in respect of the accountability of politicians and there are two cases that i want to mention very briefly but i know i don't have the time to go through them with the detail that i need mr. speaker i do mr. speaker you're generous then i will proceed and barren nine mr. speaker okay yes you know the door to blue very nice speaker the caricom treaty exists to give us certain rights we have expanded our rights as citizens of our country and as citizens of the region now it is a right that we don't understand that's not explained to us and it isn't because i see the venerable president of the ccj here or the former chief justice of the ocs whatever one of the most important decisions that was ever given by the court was a decision in a case called myrie where a jamaican national who had traveled to barbadas was unlawfully detained and searched the airport in barbadas and the court said you cannot do that under the caricom treaty you are wrong that she's entitled to the rights conferred by the treaty it was a path-breaking decision and since then we have had a free tour of other cases our own eddie ventus the solution professor at the at the faculty of law of the university at the very last hour on the eve of the general election was able to accede to the jurisdiction of the court and asked for a ruling as to whether he was a citizen entitled to be registered as a voter on the eve of election in barbadas and the court heard him on a sunday afternoon by an exchange as you know about through a portal that he be registered as a person entitled to be on the voter's list and to vote in barbadas and that is it what i'm talking about enlarging the rights we don't properly grasp it but that is in respect of the treaty or rights under the caricom treaty and citizens of the caribbean are not making use of it as they should and then mr speaker you had a famous case and belize has been producing some famous cases there's a case called florin marin and jose koi and the attorney general of belize decided upon by the ccg and it is a judge doing that concerns redress against former ministers for corrupt behavior in public office or abuse of ministerial powers and privileges for personal benefit which result in financial injury or loss of the state of the crown now you're always here they're not interested in politicians and in a lecture i did recently i traced the history of the courts dealing with politicians and in fact i was pointing out that politicians in our region are gradually being encircled by the courts and they don't have as much room to move like they think they did in that case the attorney general belize filed a claim against two former ministers of the belizean government alleging that during their respective terms of ministerial office they arranged a transfer of 56 egg passes of land to a company beneficially owned or controlled by one of them it was further alleged that the consideration paid by the purchasing company was almost one million dollars below market value and that this transaction was undertaken deliberately with outlook for lawful authority and in bad faith let me go over the facts again briefly and i'm doing it so for the benefit of our people who are listening the allegation is that two ministers arrange for 56 acres of land that belonged to the government to to be well and they were dealing with 56 acres to be dealing to be made available owned by a company of which they beneficially owned or in fact was controlled by one of them to benefit themselves now you i'm sure you have heard echoes of that before and the amount paid by the benefit one of those one million dollars below the market and and this was well below the market value so the attorney general claimed that there was a significant loss of the crown in the amount of nine hundred and twenty four thousand and fifty six dollars so the crown was denied an additional sum of money for the land and the question was which you need not focus on because that was a debate between the court was whether the attorney general could maintain an action against two former ministers of the deletion government for the tort of miss pheasants in public office now there had never been a judgment that confirmed that you can file and succeed in a tort of miss pheasants in public office yes you can have miss pheasants in public office in public law but not in tort and a majority of the court decided yes the time had come to expand the boundaries of tort to our ministers to be held liable for this tort that there was nothing standing in the way of preventing this tort now you know the fascinating thing about this case the persons who made that decision of the court were very young jurists and two of the leading members of the court just the sounders and of course the former president of the court disagreed and you're telling me you try to tell me it's a court of cowards a court of cowards and in that is a message for all politicians because rest assured that the same law that was applied in belize also applies here it also applies here and the good thing is that in the prevention of corruption act of the special prosecutor legislation parliament ensured that the tort of miss pheasants in public office was a ground was a ground for those politicians who may have engaged in corrupt acts they took no chances the second case i want to touch on and this is one i disagree fundamentally with the judgment concerns a matter of accountability in electoral matters and i disagree with with that judgment is the case of rusevelt's carrot regional austry and and one default now there's an old english term they're called treating and in england in england on english common law treating is unlawful in other words treating means that if you are engaged in a political campaign and other campaign the rally you are serving people free rum free food you know i mean free bear then according to that you are engaged in treating and you are there for committing an unlawful act and therefore if you the person was elected by virtue of those activities then couple smoke your pipe now you want to tell me you are though you should i mean the prime minister should make this case mandatory for all of you you know why because come next election couple smoke your pipe big i wouldn't be wrong couple smoke your pipe because you may well find yourself engaging in treating now what happened in this case for me it was an astonishing judgment the court of appeal the high court i think it was hell that it had jurisdiction to consider the charge of treating before it against rusevelt and his team of ministers it went to the court of appeal and the court of appeal i think ruled against the high court judge and said no no no if there's an allegation of treating because it touches on the issue of membership of the offender in parliament then in that case it's a constitutional matter and a constitutional claim should have been brought the ccj reversed the high court of appeal the cj said the magistrate is right because the magistrate was conferred at the restriction and the magistrate was right to hear the charges and determine the charges even if the question of membership becomes a secondary question would you imagine placing elected members accused perhaps of treating at the mercy of a magistrate who is at the lower rung of the judicial ladder on such a significant matter and i'm paraphrasing i don't have the time and yet the caribbean court of justice said yes a magistrate can make that decision and should make that decision you know the intriguing thing was that accessing the magistrate the jurisdiction of the magistrate was a very simple thing because you know accessing the magistrates was relatively simple and what is my message to you one my message to you is that the caribbean court of justice is a fearless institution it has never been afraid to rule against politicians it has um it has delivered some of the most painful decisions that affect politicians for which politicians will have to be on their guard and perhaps doing things that no other court could do now i disagree with a judgment in that dominican case i think they were wrong is that a reason for me to lose faith and confidence in the court mr speaker the answer is no and i'm all reminded of religious individuals and churches and so on when pastors sin whether it is a catholic church or the anican church and they come in all manner of sin and then engage in all kind of infidelity and the general blacks should i lose confidence in praying to our god or going to church because of their human errors and human mistakes no i would still go to church i'll do it anyway i don't go to church i don't know where to get those things from but be there as it means so i disagree but that doesn't mean that i should lose faith i agree with the court of appeal ruling that really this touched on the issue of membership that really that should have been dealt with by a constitutional motion i agree that's my view and in my own writing on the issue i've criticized the court for it but the wider point is that they've had the courage courage mr speaker to rule against political elites of our region mr speaker i want to end on this note mr speaker an event took place yesterday that has monumental implications for the future of the laws of this country and the courts of this country i'm aware that the matter was touched on in sub july k but i'm not in a business of program making any pronouncements regarding the outcome what i think about the arguments and so i'm not gonna do that that's not what i'm about this speaker so you don't need to invoke a standing order to strike me down mr speaker it's an issue that was before the court and i'm talking about the case that involves two members of this chamber the leader of the opposition and the member of castry south in issue before the court was whether an article in our civil code which allowed for the importation of english law meant that in those areas where references were made whether the law the term law for the time being meant that the meaning was ambulatory such that it referred not to the law that existed in 1957 when the amendments were made but to all english laws after 1957 put the single mrs speaker the question was whether a defamation act enacted by the united kingdom in 2013 was by virtue of that provision the law of st lucer in 2023 now if the privy council agrees with the court of appeal this would lead to the most dramatic and revolutionary interpretation of the laws of this country and what it would mean is that in those subject areas the defamation awkward eye contracts or otherwise that if you want to find out what the law of st lucer we have to go to england to find out what the english did know what their laws are and apply down here what they call mutatis mutandis if the argument is right what does this have to do with all of this i am not saying that a ccj would have cured this that's not my point i'm far from a mrs speaker but you know what the chickens are coming home to ruse it is our objury refusal to tackle our inheritance that's a problem everybody i wrote about this matter extensively i know how much of justice baron is aware of it it has found itself in his judgments and we should have dealt with that a long time ago but we did not we did not because for some of us it pleased us that somehow we allowed for the importation of english law to govern our business 44 years after independence you want to tell me that if solutions want to find out what the law is they have to go to the english parliament find out what the english parliament enacted find out which provisions apply to them and you want to tell me i must accept mrs speaker the retention of the preview council i must accept that inheritance you know tell me that mrs speaker that's what the problem is we don't want to look at our inheritance because we believe all things handed down from the imperial throne was good and right and proper that it protected us not knowing not knowing that we're injuring ourselves our legacy our reputation our thinking our being who we are and what we are no matter what decision the preview comes comes to comes to there's no question that this provision in our civil code will have to be reviewed and the attorney general better start to work on it now how could say blusher 44 years after independence tell me that its laws can only be understood if we know what the english parliament has enacted you think when they sit in the house of commons passing their laws they remotely remember that a little country like st lusia is interested in our laws or they'll have to follow their laws you think they care who supports st lusia they will snide and make their snide remarks you think they care what are we saying about ourselves and so mrs speaker on an end on this note this constitutional amendment is about us it is about ourselves it is about our future it is about our honor it is about integrity it's about the fact that we understand we as good as any anywhere in the world and we must never ever make the mistake of continuing to short change ourselves by believing that others are better than us our judges are as good as any anywhere dispensing justice all over the world and yes i have problems with judges yes i have problems with court decisions but that doesn't mean that because they are problems that they issues that we should dispense with what is rightfully ours and that we don't recognize the quality and brilliance of what we have mr speaker i asked the people i said lusia to give me the opportunity to speak to them i have been robust i admit i have been very robust in what i've said today and i hope i have said it in a way that they can understand me and why over the years i have championed the caribbean court of justice why i have been at the forefront of the caribbean court of justice and i said in this house before under no circumstances would i betray what i have believed in and what i have said i've said so before and there are times that some of you hear uncomfortable when i say that but you don't have to be uncomfortable because i want to be faithful to what i preached and if i sat and i come and participated and guided the drafting of that agreement sign it in 2014 commence the process that has taken us this far now being completed by my successor you expect me to come to this house repudiated on this fanciful notion of a referendum that is so unnecessary i can't do that neither my trading my conscience or my philosophy allows me to do so i thank you mr speaker for your tolerance and understanding remember for dan rino mr speaker i move for the suspension of the house until 3 15 p.m. on our members the question is that this shouldn't be suspended until 3 15 p.m. and i'll put a question as many as of that opinion say aye as many as the country opinion say no i think the eyes have it the eyes have it sit and suspend it all right kawaii blamem with a pre-prime minister present a motion say premier moon keep a lady city doctor kenny anthony if a guy on the on the store the store as to situation effective he'll be able to get an editor as a situation a big doctor antony women women women can play as a on situation he'll come he'd be a keep which a vexing he by a he'll be able to play a pill a very by total detail poem as to say he can pass a new guy new guy the view is here at There are three of us, and there are two of us in prison. As we are in prison, we have Dr. Kenny Antony and a student. A student who has come to attend the school. This is Arthur Lewis Community College. He has come to teach, and he has come to listen to what has happened. We are going to take a break, we are going to watch TV, we are going to visit the NTN TV station and the studio. We are going to avoid wasting our time. We are going to have three of us, and we are going to continue our journey in a simple way.


you're recording yeah yeah ladies hello i have a quick question would you like to participate in our video no thanks all right all right cool ladies i have some quick questions you want to participate in our video no thank you okay yo brother do you want to participate in the video i am in fluo state i do not touch me while i inflow yeah i inflow yo i have some questions you guys want to participate in a video you want to participate in a video we're asking some cool thought provoking questions all right cool cool all right let's come over here let's come over here let's go we'll do this way we'll face it yeah yeah all right what's up what's your name jason jason i'm atlas good to meet you awesome well jason our first question is do we all come from the same source oh yes now does that mean we are all one yes all right jason next question does that mean our consciousness our awareness is shared interesting and will you elaborate a little bit on how you've come to the realizations that we come from the same source that we are one and that our consciousness is shared um i think it goes back to uh a belief in a higher power greater than myself i think we're all spiritual creatures and we all share energy i think we are all breathing the same breath and that's yes yes yes so another way to play with this is to ask you how many different ways are there to paint a blank canvas how many different ways are there to organize musical notes into songs how many different ways are there to vibrate vocal chords to make languages how many different ways are there to put food together into recipes made this reality just be one expression of infinite possibility appreciate it thanks for letting me be a part of your life and thanks for being a part of my life it's that simple right yeah one appearance out of an infinite possibility i love it beautiful gason thank you very well that was so nice that was so nice you rock bro thank you thank you thanks for joining us yeah cool youtube yeah that's how it's trippy huh yeah yeah man that's a good start yeah good start yeah good start nice you know do you guys want to speak to the video answer some thought-provoking questions it's super fun yeah exactly yeah questions like that questions like this shirt all right cool cool let me uh let me come here it's kind of like the middle year all right so so my my name's atlas what are your names char char cool jamal jamal christa char jamal christa all right so our first question is what do you think is the nature of reality what is the point of reality the nature of reality to live every moment as much as you can the nature of reality to a really big distraction to get your mind off of what's really going on with being human with like the human experience like distraction from the human experience basically okay he's like i think it's whatever you want to be what is the role of consciousness in reality guide you to making choices in life do we all come from the same source what do you mean by source what do you mean by source i mean i come from my mom so where does your mom come from um i mean i'm a chemist either it's i think we're just all particles in this universe combined together i think we all would when you die you know you become the particle again and somebody else becomes human do we share our source we all share our same source and then would that then mean that our consciousness is also shared if we share our same source so could it could it be then that the same observation or the same witnessing is happening from all of our perspectives at the same time right i would say yes but that kind of ties back to the first question of what is reality you know your reality might be different from my reality i think we're just all in puzzle i like very little small pieces of that puzzle but what you see what i see it's kind of all add up to a picture i think we're pissed off but it's so why is it not more simple than you know camping but it's not how many okay last questions okay how many different ways can we paint a blank canvas i mean how many different colors do you have what's the last question right there pay the way every one is different could we say that our nature is limitless possibilities um human nature is that what you mean our nature in the most macro level possible is our nature limitless possibilities i think we're limited so we have a huge uh um there are a lot of possibilities but it isn't how would painting the blank canvas get limited you only have somebody somebody let's say there are an endless amount of colors how many then why would it be limited um you run out of ideas is it possible to run out of ideas maybe for you not for me right here that's not limited this is constantly moving endlessly different colors endlessly that might be our nature and your perspective that's right you can you can run out of perspective space it's shut off it's got it's got it's got it's got it's got it's got it's got it's got it's got it's so cool and last question what do you think is most beautiful you mean uh human connection you need specific aspect that you rather like a lot uh i think that we can relate to each other more so than you think it's beautiful nature we're all part of it amen thank you guys so much that was dope thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you yeah yeah yeah for sure if you guys want to um check out i'll also i'll share with you go to youtube yeah so my name's atlas what's your name uh ryan good to meet you ryan thank you for are you the king of atlantis or you know yeah he knows you know i'm a custilian so nice nice ryan thanks for stopping and answering a couple phone questions first question is what do you think is the nature of reality i mean reality's perspective you know i mean believe me if you're looking for general answers you're talking to the wrong guy on this because this is what i'm out here searching for you know so i mean uh but you know it's your reality is what you make of it you know and uh it's as simple as that you know i mean if you want you know things can be i mean i got my wallet stolen on the bus the other day you know so i'm kind of stuck out here for the time being but if you gotta be stuck somewhere you know we're better than here like mm-hmm will you elaborate a bit on the answer of perspective reality being so deeply rooted in perspective perception well i'm pretty sure the roman catholic church wrote my family out of history you know and has been hunting us down for the last 2400 years you know but you know that's not the perspective anybody else is gonna have on it but you know it's all interconnected you know science uh if i get spiritual i don't call religious you know that's you know you're perverting faith at that point you know for some for your own personal gain and uh you know i mean it i love the generalness of it man you know i you want to be a little more specific i might be able to you know help dial you in you know do we all come from the same source i don't believe so elaborate uh i believe there what was here before you know and then you know what it's hard just talking about with you know but i you know like i said i've been doing a lot of research here over the last three months and i took this test and uh you know i know who my parents are and i'm trying to figure out how my dna trace is back and i come from the ancestry dna 11 different regions you know with my mom being full blooded scottish and the rest of it i am about a percent each scandinavian uh the rest of it comes right out of the heart of the niger river delta molly uh nigeria you know and you know but there's nothing in between so how does you know how do you get from there to scandinavia you know and so go back in the lineage far enough we all come from the same source you know i can't i can't say that for sure and i don't want to you know fair fair but uh would it would it be that the perspective the perception that we were talking about earlier could that be shared could that witnessing or the observer that's here in these units could it be shared absolutely you know i think i mean just the fact you know you're standing here doing this you know and i mean i don't know what you know your end goal or your end game in this is you know but it doesn't seem to be for any you know malicious intent or you know it's you know i believe understanding is the highest form of blood you know and you know i grew up in the church so you know that word's thrown around very uh loosely but you know what is are you really going to put the work in you know or you know it's just when the time comes to say it in front of the camera you know are you willing to you know you know say it then but when there's come time for the rubber to meet the road you know you're nowhere to be found i mean that's yeah i don't know it's uh it is what it is i mean it's that's right that's right but so what do you if you don't mind me asking you got what are you you know what is it i mean like obviously you know you're just out here asking questions and you know i'm a big fan of asking questions i kind of like to be the one to ask because i got a lot of tough questions i think i need answered you know but what are you guys here for yeah we'd be happy to field your questions well we came out here to ask people thought provoking questions to capture solid answers stitch them together into a project called infinitive log okay and then disseminate that across our channels social channels so and what you know i mean i you have social channels which i mean you know that's what life is about being social what is your involved in this you know what i mean obviously understanding it seems like you know something you're seeking but have you heard this song by nwe express yourself you know it's been a while you know i am familiar yeah yeah but that's that's what we're doing okay um yeah that's uh kind of threw me for a loop there you know but i can dig it um it is a the entire creation is one expression how many different ways can you paint a blank canvas infinitely you know i mean it's uh you can leave a blank you know and it's up to the people to determine you know what's you know you can take a blank canvas and paint it white and you know i mean does anybody know the difference or made that then be what this is it's one way to paint that way it absolutely can be you know it's then like i said it's come down to your perspective you know i mean you're out here doing you know this and what's the best question that you have for us oh well all mine are science related i mean i don't um fair uh you know people want to know how they built the pyramids you know you know who John Herrera is not sure so according to the people you know he's a architect you know i i know you guys get your phone here but so as far talking about my lineage this is as far back as i could trace it and so you have a deep interest in anthropology and archaeology how we got to where we're at today is that right exactly you know and i mean more so how i got because i was adopted out you know my you know my birth mother you know i couldn't you know handle responsibility she made the right choice but and i don't want to put anything but you know i feel like the people took responsibility for me could have done a better job and helping me find myself you know instead of me being 34 you know out here wandering around you know and but so this is what i found looking here at maybe that's the point of your adventure i you know i mean i believe every you know i'm a united fan excuse us but uh i'm a united fan like we just got a big win against city today you know we played it the right way and it's i believe it's in how you do things you know it's so are you familiar with the Alcazar of sygobia no you can show mariah also yes here we go there's uh okay tell me what he's looking at on that piece of paper there yeah you can go and blow it up i'm not you know i'm not one of those people like just don't swipe too far left or anything you know i am human would you call it a stargate maybe oh that's a good way to put it yeah a gateway stargate just like the show like i mean and so people ask how they build the pyramids you know and let me show you the alcazar here we want to yeah please that that little stargate right there i mean this like i said this was a picture it's hard to see it it's hard to see yeah you know like i said i was just looking at the picture you know looking at the beard thinking hey you know and then all of a sudden like i started looking at what this man's looking at in the paint you know and i'm like you know it made me wonder and then let me find the alcazar here for you okay i call it the it's in it's in southern spain it's now property of the spanish government but you know uh for 10 generations it was the residence of the castilian kings you know king alfonso and you did the alphan scene tables uh it's you know that's the other thing you talk about archaeology but not just that i'm interested in astronomy i look to the sky you know and totally but you know being from southern india ever looked at me like i was crazy because i wasn't drinking beer trying to drive a big truck you know and you know what's that matter you know and the guy out here i don't see much boy they're playing beer drinking but you know there's not a whole lot of big truck driving being dumb hillbillies you know and like there has to be more to the world and you know i had a friend of mine who set out you know four years ago he left the chicago stock exchange is very successful commodities broker and sailed around the world went down to the caiman islands you know bought a boat told his buddies he took a captain's course to come to find out it was just the booze cruise you know but that's the kind of guy he was you know but you know he was the warrior he was the one who'd bring the others home you know and it's uh would it be fair to say that you're seeking the nature of reality right now you're seeking the nature of your expression in it you know i i don't quit but yeah i would say that would be a fair you know uh assessment you know i don't you know i mean reality is like i said reality is what you make of it you know i could be out here you know like complaining about all this down here you know and all that but you know that's somebody else's you know that's their reality you know and if that's they're happy in it you know like i said i'm for 33 years i'll ask a follow-up question okay ryan have you spent time investigating the seer itself that which is seeing your consciousness your awareness have you investigated that yeah i feel like that's kind of where i'm at now you know i'm kind of you know it's almost like you know i hate you know there's so many there's so many cliches out there like being woke you know and like you know people say that shit you know and what do you really woke you know i mean i mean that sounds cool to say and music and stuff and all but i mean like i feel like in describing myself i'm an empath you know like i can relate to anybody because i've been in everybody's shoes you know i've been at the top of the top you know and i've literally lived in a you know 10x10 climate controlled storage unit before you know for a hundred bucks a month i will countless and you know so i can't you know that's key if there was one of the things for your questions you have for people recognizing consciousness or awareness and being really fundamentally aware of being aware is instrumental in the nature yeah you know if somebody's gonna tell you they're aware and then turn around and you'll run into that sign you know i'm gonna have a hard time believing you know that you're really aware of your surroundings you know it's not aware of surroundings it's aware of awareness itself being aware of perception itself now at some point now let me ask you do you feel at some point becomes a little too you know i mean because they're you know depth is infinite you know i mean you can go as deep as you want you know but at some point we still live in a world where they're walking by you know they're standing there how do you reconcile that reconcile the you know the infinite depth with the you know i don't want to say shallowness but you know there has you know we you can't have a thousand people existing on a thousand different planes you know a society you know will not function in that manner a successful society i mean you have there has to be levels but it can't you know here here this this would be reconciliation comes from the investigation like what you're doing right now exactly okay now the investigative process the more that it focuses on the external the less quick it will be the more you'll encounter suffering the more the investigative process internal focuses on the actual awareness or the consciousness that is present on a moment to moment basis here with you and here with me and there with mariah and each one of these agents okay the more that we recognize that that awareness or that you use the word agent there i have to because to me an agent you know they that person has an agenda you know i mean that's you know agent okay you can use unit right okay so that's what you meant when you said you know a you know a look i like to call it a soul you know whether some people have it okay so now the next thought is to go from the place of being super aware of consciousness or awareness itself to then recognizing that that awareness of that consciousness is shared among the eight billion units and that's where i'm at right now you're exactly that that's what i'm trying to you know i know who i am now you know it took me 33 34 years to find it you know now i just need to find it you know i guess that where you know that eight billion units you talk about as a society i refer to you know how everything interacts and you know you know that's i'm trying to find that sweet sweet middle ground you know and uh so that next step that you said is where you're at which is recognizing that the awareness around the eight billion units is shared getting to that point makes it so that when you see another unit like here mariah or here ryan here atlas that these units don't actually have separate awareness that the awareness is one awareness seen through ryan it's costume seen through atlases costume seen through mariah's costume but the awareness itself that is seen through those costumes is the same shared awareness and then the utility of it is that then what happens is that i would never hurt myself you're exactly right you know it's i mean and that's where kind of like seeing these people you know ten years ago you know i would have been oh yeah just that you know but you know what after being there you know and just make you know like you said they're they're the kind of people that it's you know they're externalizing it it's taking them a little bit longer you know to find you know but you know you have so much thrown at you today especially in this day and age of social you know and you know i've been reading a lot you know i'm a big fan of science as you can tell like 90 percent of what's being put out there is scientific news there's nothing more than thoughts or conjecture you know and you know as like i was taught away like going to catholic grade school that you know when i got out into the real i guess you know the the scientific you know there is gravity you know there's something that keeps us from floating away you know it's like and you know i was taught creationism like god created the world in seven days but the logical me you know is like there's no way one man created all this in seven days you know i mean now so the god that is referenced that's been perverted by religion which is what you mentioned earlier yes that the god is no different than consciousness no different than awareness awareness or consciousness that is shared among the eight billion units that is what is meant in the spiritual traditions exactly by god yes yes so you are the seer you are god god is consciousness god is awareness we all are that so it's not separate in john john ten thirty is i and my father are one ta tafam asi in the sanskrit tradition means we are that you are that you are you know and then you can go back to you know the philosophical play-doh you know i think therefore i am you know i mean if you're not thinking what are you you know and i mean you know it's a question you know but that question that everybody has to answer for themselves you know not everyone's gonna come up with the same answer i feel like that's where you know that community is finding the people that have that same answer to the question you know and living you know at that point you know it's not having to worry you know it's like do you think there's one truth i i have to believe there's one truth because anything that has more than one version is why you know i mean now it there's perspective and stuff but that's just that it's a perspective it's not a truth or a lie you know i mean and but people want to put their perspective to being the truth and then everybody else who you know disagrees with that you know either they're liars they're wrong you know and now you see how we can merge what we were just talking about where there's the eight billion units that have their subjective perspectives and then that have the one truth of being conscious or aware which is what we shared so the one truth is the consciousness or awareness and then the subjectivity is the unique experience or perception and then i think that even that the subjectivity is coming to that up because you know i mean totally you know because i mean i'm sure you might feel a little differently than what i've said you know i don't know a whole lot about how you feel you know but i you know i feel like you would be somebody i consider of my try you know a thoughtful person you know somebody who likewise you know and that's all you can ask for you know i mean like i said i've i've been walking up and down here you know for a few miles you know and it's like everybody wants a bug you know i mean there's some people just doing their thing skate and ride you know but like i mean interaction is what humanity is you know i mean if you know everyone wants to live this life on their own you know or live it in their little box and you just can't do it you know and uh it's a mirroring of that awareness to each other i don't see a different awareness when i look at you i see the same awareness undergoing a mirroring process right and like i said i you know you guys are obviously out here doing this so you know you're you know you have a avenue a you know media to express it in you know i'm you know i've come to realize this is where i'm gonna come back to the right you know and beautiful i mean it's you know there's certain but there are certain things you know i mean people like you know i need to like clarify you know like i believe i'm big on the fine you know like people don't like definition you know but that lead lends itself to ambiguity you know there's a difference between freedom and security you know and there's a difference between objectivity and subjectivity you know but people don't want to recognize that they just want to you know yeah i don't you know we just talked about that a moment ago right eight billion units have the subjective perspectives but the one objectivity is the awareness or the source the consciousness itself okay source okay i like that word you know like what what source what is your you know i guess your source you know because mine is my you know we all share go back go back go back as far as you can science calls the big bang go back as far as you can we all come from the same source so in that you know yes i do believe that you know i mean there you go so then the is the awareness shared in that sense yes absolutely now here's my question though what you know because i am a fan of astra like how do we know what we know about the universe because you know like i fully you know they talk about pancia 250 million most people can't remember what they did a year ago so i mean how are you telling me these scientists have a concept of 250 million of those you know like to me if you ask me like the earth is you know from pancia was probably around 30 000 years ago you know and stay with you already know that you're coming back here to write and to be present here because you like the vibes right the good vibes so the thing is ryan recognize not the externalization of perception but recognize the very act of perceiving itself and recognize the act of perceiving here and there and here recognize more and more perception itself and recognize that that itself that conscious inside awareness that that is the nature of reality that that is that agent is the nature of reality that we need this perception this awareness and we're able to experience this okay question last question yeah what is most beautiful nature i mean what time takes to build you know i mean you can't i mean like i said i'm out here from colorado you know from southern indiana you know so for 30 years i grew up with nothing but you know dirt bags and you know flatland i moved out to the mountains and you know it was good for me but it wasn't what i was looking for you know i mean it's a different kind of active out there than it is out here you know and you know it's just i feel like everybody's time takes to build nature yeah it's you know i mean it's you know it's dave mathews you know i mean it's uh you know like you talked about you know in w a but like you know to me like there's songs like kind no church in the wild you know what's a god to a non-believer you know and uh you know like i said music is something that's helped me get to where i'm at today and uh revolution the album courage to grow i mean if you're looking for that you know internalization you know listen to that album you know because that is one thing that kept that got me out of the corporate ground i mean and here's the thing i've sold telecom for AT&T i've sold software for auto desk uverse yeah yeah yeah hey would you take part i think so that was at the time the icl you know like it's been a long time yeah where'd you work for 2012 was when i was yeah so it's been nine years where were you at were you out here very very okay up north so uh i can't put Malcolm alive you're running that area maybe that sounds familiar yeah yeah big larger black guy you know about like yep yeah Malcolm's a real good dude you know but um you know like i said that's one thing that i got out you know i mean i'm sure that taught you a lot about that's how you can walk up to people like you do me and you know sales is such a key and that says build rapport fast and not just that but like when you're you know here you know we're in neutral ground you know back then we were walking up to people's houses you know and getting their credit card info in five minutes exactly you know it's a five-minute friend deal you know like so many people i've worked with doing that you know that's a crop that's a scam it's a multi-level marketing uh last time i checked a walton hasn't stepped foot in wal-mart probably in 30 years so how's that any different you know except for all we're doing is we're just providing people with a better service if they choose to we just educate them about it that's it and most of them had AT&T on the old stuff anyways you know so like i said you know i mean that's that's funny man you know this has been great right hey alex it was a pleasure i'll be up and down i might catch up with you again i love it this was a blast you too man guys okay see you thank you bye


Good morning, Alexander. I am so excited to have you here. You have such a story I just want people to know that I would absolutely love it if you would leave your comments below My discussion with Alexander is going to be broken down into three parts We are going to talk about his introduction because he's from East Germany and he's a success and mind coach International speaker will be writing a book and He's also a world-class athlete. I could go on and on But I just want you to know I am so eager to see people Understand that they can do any business that they want so long as they have the correct mindset so I would love it if you would go on my YouTube and subscribe to it and Connect with Alexander. So good morning, Alexander. Let's get started on your amazing story Thank you, Jenny. It was a great introduction. I'm Alexander Richmond. I'm a coach I'm a success and mindset coach and I'm helping people as I see myself You know having a calling for helping people just in general so Well, you mentioned I grew up in East Germany East Germany was under the control of the Soviet Union at a time and made it so made a part of their communism system and Well, as I grew up in there, you know, not knowing any better at age six just Entering school. I had been selected to wrestle Basically, I started my wrestling career with age six We have been selected for various sports because East Germany was a very small country and yet If you look at in history like always played a big part at Olympics throughout history the modern Olympics and Through in that time, you know being a part of Olympic program, you know, it was an important part For the individual as well for the country So the selection had been done early. So at age six when I started came there The coach was speaking to all of us after we wrestled and that gave me a vision and that's something I wanted to share when the coach spoke, you know to all of us and I Just had a feeling I could visualize as he mentioned, you know And he pointed to a few people and he also pointed at me looked at me and that spoke even more To me that he said like, you know, imagine you could be one day It didn't matter how you did today, but you could be one day walking up standing on a podium Being put the metal around your neck at the national anthem place You know and millions of people watching You know that event and seeing you receiving that medal and being announced as a Olympian or world champion how does it feel and I don't know I That's how it was I I Go through the motions again. It really woke me up. You know touched me and And That's a vision from there on When you have a vision when you have a desire all of a sudden, you know, you see yourself and that's you decided in that moment That is what you want to do Is the turning point to everything when you have a burning desire? you create a faith a belief in Everything there is the system the coach or whatever you see in a moment, right because all of a sudden I believe every word he said you have a desire you have the faith and you take actions But the action whatever the outcome is goes right back and fuels the desire again and Having the faith, you know, well didn't happen yet you go on but you see improvements I can guarantee you if you stick long enough with it and Issue is with so many people that they don't keep track, but we had to keep track You know for us, we had a journal like boss was important as athletes early on you get a little booklet All your matches had been recorded. Oh Outcomes how do you score? You know, how did you win by points by, you know pinning an opponent, you know How long did it take and and and what was the technique? So it was very scientific and I want to bring it on early because if you don't keep records You know, we forget But so many people don't have that unfortunately, but you know, that's why they always have to look for mentors That's why they always have to go and look around them, you know to create a team around their life In order to become more successful Everything is possible Everything that too, it's all a matter of your mind Yeah, and and but I like the point that you're making here about accountability and having the Metrics keep them written down. That is really important Yeah, the biggest part is the vision first of all true And you have to feel it You know, it's not something like I can put something draw it on but if I don't truly have the passion if I don't have that fire If I don't feel it inside. Yep, you know, then it's not quite the right one true very I Might have some success, but that's not something, you know, it will not be sustainable over time That's what people can also read if it's not your passion. They can sense it Instantly, yeah, if you're intuitive, definitely I'm intuitive so So I made it I made it to go to the Olympics even though I got my butt cake coming back after like Was it August? 56. I don't know anymore after the ceremony The next day we flew back to Schoenfeld and Schoenfeld at the airport, you know, they unrolled the red carpet We didn't make it to the terminal. We stayed on the wall field You know, the team comes out the coaches go first and the support team and you know standing right and left of the red carpet and The athletes come down and everyone is sharing you have like we had like pioniere like School group, but they were there to welcome us. They had flowers and so on then there was music played and Spectators from the media as well as family and friends and Others politicians there. There were speeches held But coming down the stairs so my coach pulled me on the side and pointed to two guys standing on the side And he said like they came to pick pick me up There was my arrest even though I never was officially arrested wow There were no political prisoners anywhere anyway, so not that you knew of anyway Right, you know, I got slapped around a little bit. I got just a beating in my life You know, I got hit from the back and you know shortly after I was out and waking up in a cell you know Just like totally in pain black and blue, but when I found forgiveness in that moment I'm like, you know, they're in great pain. All of a sudden all my rage was gone And I forget it's so amazing that Go a bit like that and I just forgave them and you know in fact, I broke down crying It was emotional at time that you know, just it was a relief Like if the pain was like and really the pain virtually Disappeared the power of a mind is a great You know, if you say that, you know, whatever you Take on as a belief system Whatever you make it mean coming up the past of the experience you have because everything is experienced in the past That will shift Make or break you going forward That is powerful Alexander that is so powerful, you know, and it's so true One day I was taken to the border, you know from prison in the morning early morning you woke me up threw me my clothing and Just a clothing nothing else, you know, I found out later on, you know, I had no ID Know anything with my name on it. No money just taken to the bow Wow and Yeah, and then my life started there and that was like a totally new system best Germany now capitalism It's a new system for me. I Did not have any school papers or anything to refer back to in order to get referrals or whatever. I Started totally new So I immediately went off and look for work and I decided I do whatever it takes just like in sports you do whatever it takes. Yep, and I will develop from there So and it's always like first is kind of like, you know, assessing your environment what it said what becomes available Having your eyes open, right? That was also something as a lesson. I tell some of my clients Because sometimes we just do that coming out of school, right? And then we get lost Because we can you know, there is a way of getting even comfortable standing in manure Oh, that doesn't sound appealing, but I can understand it The reason why I said it that way is because people have to look where they at How many people have excuses For not making a shift in their life Because they just got so comfortable in their misery For not even looking Wow, and you only can get comfortable through your mind if you make it that way You see an excuse is kind of like telling yourself About reality which really does not exist You know, it's an acceptance to that And you pass it You might complain and people complain and complain, but what are they really doing to it? You know, that's the question best part of being is really Be open to everything And attached to nothing Question everything don't take anything as What is what is What is Look at it. There's so many different points of view To get a different approach different, you know Picture of it all What there is And since there's an infinite amount to any point Right before that you go out you can Always create more distance To that point So coming from there there's an infinite amount. So never give up There's always something to it like, you know, if you have an issue, there's always a solution And another part is also whatever you call an issue was created within And said pointing now I could say like, you know, again, that's an issue on the outside But really it was me who had chosen to be a partner You see you're always You can make wrong whatever there is you can always point to the outside But you will never get to the core of the real issue But when you really look the issue with inside of yourself You know, you can become so successful. That's something like a little nugget. I want to leave you here you know for the audience Looking within that's an important part and sometimes it might be an hour of lines part you know, but It is the looking constant Do you call that the ego? No, because so many people make the ego wrong. I tell you this the ego is very important You know everything is in balance Balance is an important part. I want to say like if you want to focus on anything, it's balance balance in all areas of your life And in the next session I will go into that too Because the ego is important if we didn't have the ego we would not have the drive Okay, it is the ego what drives us Oh, you know, it's your thought of it that way. It's behind the desire so Yet you have to be aware of it and keep it in check You know, so for me at least the way I see it the way it occurs to me, you know, we all have different experiences and so on There is an ego necessary in order to do certain things you know And sometimes it really takes some arrogance To go forward And I love all the input you've given Alexander. I can't wait for our next one. As I said We're going to talk about entrepreneurship Is a game and here is why And that is going to be our second Chapter to this story I hope people subscribe and like this interview because You are so fascinating and with that, I thank you very much Alexander You've given so much information I'm amazed at your background and what you went through and where you are today So I look forward to chapter number two Sounds good. I look forward to you. I have a great Thanksgiving talk to you. Thank you. You too Okay, by way