Hi everyone this is Jason here from Nathaniel and in this lesson I'm going to show you a technique to build melodies through rhythm. Okay now that sounds a bit weird generally as a statement because melodies are melodies right they are notes which happen on a particular scale with intervals and so on. However we seem to forget that every great melody ever composed has great rhythm behind it. In other words you don't have a melody like this right now there's no gaps between the notes there's no time for the there's no time for the notes to breathe a little right it's just one note after the other and then the faster you go as you divide the beat more and if you play even more notes then you're sort of developing like a machine gun effect on the piano which is like an endless array of notes which I don't want to bore you with right now. So a great approach which I found to develop melody organically what I mean by organically is you don't really need music theory you don't need some prior song or genre to inspire you you can just do it so we all have this innate ability to create rhythmic phrases or rhythm in general because whenever songs are played to us we move we move our body we tap we follow the pattern of the music we all know that we will rock you is right no one even a non-musician can do that right so the whole idea here is we are trying to capitalize on that natural ability which we are all one might argue born with and then we use that rhythm to actually come to the piano take the ingredients of the rhythm and then cook it up into a melody okay so let me just show you what I mean with a with a simple rhythmic example so something like this so I'm sort of now imagining this maybe in any environment maybe while walking my dog or in a shower or while brushing one's teeth or reading the newspaper anything for that matter you know you could be sitting anywhere or moving around and creating something like this so whatever I done again I kind of forgot it let me remember something like and I'm using short syllables like pump pump pump dubba dum or I could even whack some parts of the body like whatever sounds interesting to you right so you could tap it out on your body maybe chest for some lower stuff and your leg for some higher snare drum-ish stuff or you can vocalize it in some rhythmic way like or if you know conical that's a great way to kind of express yourself rhythmically but pretty much anything you could even whack something around you you know so as long as you put any sound into context it will always be music right you could be whacking any piece of furniture around you and if you think about music it will definitely become music so now I've made this pattern it's stuck inside my head so I want to bring it out on the piano now the first thing I need to do is figure out what scale of interest I'm going to work with so I'm going to choose my favorite I guess a major scale which is this three sharps C sharp F sharp G sharp so I'm going to sort of confine myself within those notes I don't want to go out of that for now because I'm trying to also scale across this melody and develop patterns around it which we are going to come to very shortly so one thing you could just do is just noodle around as we call it and just express yourself on the scale keeping that organically created rhythm which was what now okay so something like this or maybe you'd like to just start with one note of course that doesn't make a great melody because it's just one note right so maybe something like you'll mess it up a bit but just start with the notes of the scale start with one note or maybe two notes or just an A major chord or keep your hands very close to each other A B C sharp D E and develop patterns which can really use or use up all the fingers also give you a nice finger exercise so if you don't like the melody it's at least going to become an awesome finger exercise which you're never going to find in any book you've given yourself your own finger exercise okay so I'm going to come up with a tune now confined to just the A B C sharp D E the first five notes of the A major scale something like okay wasn't it still the same rhythm I stuck with the same groove so you see now my rhythm has come to life maybe I had already sung this organically in the shower or wherever or maybe I didn't maybe I just thought of it as a nice cool rhythmic phrase and imagine that it'll come into a great melody at least which I like so now you go and I want you to learn this with me I'm going to slow it down for you try singing that can help articulate it nicely so it creates a nice dynamic and whenever playing music I remember we started this with rhythm what does rhythm need the most it needs people to move so you need to move if you want other people to move so create the pulse somewhere within you so 4 by 4 or 4 beats per bar 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 so what can I do to express the pulse I could just play a single A which is the root of the scale it'll work awesome so just play A or maybe you could go to A is like that just to keep the rhythm and the melody into perspective practice that it's also nice once you've come up with this melody to also kind of put it a bit under the microscope and see how many parts are there in this melody so if I break it down I feel that it has three parts doesn't it part one part two part three so it's sort of like a sentence with punctuation with nice punctuation so you could go you just play that if you like then you could go part two and now finish the puzzle or blend something which has a minimal set of notes which could just be part A and part B of the bigger melody and then put it all together with the with all the three parts something like this that becomes a lot more memorable I guess so you have a lot of ways of scaling up and building the pattern creatively I'm sure you will also come up with things of your own as you go through the journey so let's now move this even forward so I'm quite happy with what I'm doing in the right hand but I think we need to drive it a bit forward and take this melody for a spin right so what we could do in the left hand is just move around your scale and the bass movement is really great because it can also dictate what chord you're going to inevitably play or what someone else is going to play you know in the band context so maybe I'm going to start with the root change it around maybe quite like F sharp it's the relative minor D building up to E and A so I like that I like starting with maybe one four five and six of the scale those are usually the most popular intervals it's used in all the standard chord progressions F sharp four simplified also right so that's how you take the same melody and put it into different perspectives like I like I sometimes say you're just driving the melody which is in a car so to speak you're just driving it around otherwise it's just stuck in the garage or in the neighborhood you're actually moving it forward because of the harmony and because of the bass movement okay so what have we done so far we have a nice pattern which we came up with organically then we sort of chopped it up and created mini patterns and then we looked at the left hand doing some interesting movements maybe the left hand could also do very interesting rhythmic things so we leave a few videos and a playlist in our youtube description so do check that out we have done a lot of work on left hand patterns and left hand rhythm in general using chords and just simple rhythm so you may want to watch a few more of our lessons focusing on the left hand stuff okay so where are we so far now we float the left hand with a consistent right hand melody right so how can we make this even more interesting if this is not already interesting enough we can now look at this created melodic phrase or motif if you will in a very pattern like environment what I mean by that is you can try and restructure it or replay it at different points of the keyboard staying in the same scale so we are trying to still be in A major but we are trying to represent it in different sounding ways so I'm going to show you what I mean by that and then I will explain so the same melody now I can change my hand hold to somewhere here I'm using a five finger handhold so I'm going from A now I'm drifting my hand to D now with A I started with the third note right with D why can't I start with the same third note but need the ring finger to go to G sharp because I'm an A major scale so this one literally copy the finger orders right middle ring pinky like that and then replace it here so it's almost the same rhythm but presented in a very different way right so you have then then right now I moved my hand up to E which is the fifth and played the same pattern from the E shape and then you can go to the F sharp so if you observe with all of these melodies you could also look at an accompanying note so I guess the accompanying note could be the first note of the pattern which you're not playing first but you're you're playing that first but this is the lowest note so you could think of maybe just copying that here and now jumping the pattern to the D which is the four and now jumping it up to the five it even jumped to the sixth come back to the four and now you have a lot more to play with so I like this kind of approach because a phrase was very rhythmic it started by just pure sheer luck I guess because you just gave yourself that chance to organically construct the music but then you held on to that idea you don't want to leave it and just let it go back into the air from where it came from so then we try to go to our piano think of a scale in this case a major try and enjoy it a bit try and see where where it takes you and then we landed up with a tune like somehow that seemed to sound nice and then we really extracted all the juice from that tune by then you know moving our left hand looking at the melody in fragments or in smaller sub melodies and then what we did is we converted the melody itself into a pattern and we started floating the pattern from the root then we went up the fourth just changed our hand hold and this is also very common on guitars and other stringed instruments they just change the they retain the same scale but they just change the shape or where their hand position starts from next okay so this is basically an approach I'm sure there are many approaches and there are many approaches which even I will probably discover in my lifetime as I continue to grow as a musician myself but this is an approach which I thought you would find quite useful because sometimes we overthink a music composition a lot of ideas we come up with interestingly enough don't even come from our primary instrument it may just come by a singing which is why I encourage you to have some idea of singing as a piano player it can really help and also you could just figure out rhythm like I said at the beginning of the lesson rhythm is something which comes to human beings the most naturally again this is Jason here from Nathaniel and there's one more thing which we have waiting for you you just have to click the link in the description and it'll take you to our Patreon page and on that particular page I've put together a set of files which you can download at your convenience and you'll have a lot of patterns which I've come up with okay to get you started like what we did now I've also come up with a few more all on the A major scale you don't have to leave A major for this exercise and I've also come up with a few rhythmic things so I would encourage all of you to to check out the Patreon link and consider also supporting us it'll be awesome for our channel to move forward and if you haven't already do subscribe to our Nathaniel school channel for a lot more lessons like the video hit subscribe turn on that bell thing for notifications and share the lesson with all your fellow musician friends I will see you in the next one cheers


Welcome to the Tuesday topic here on Peyton, joined by Les Roberts, ex-road and a back, back, back with a vengeance. Every week we ask you to send the video in, some of you do, other times you don't bother. So today I'm just making this one off the back of a Twitter discussion, shall we say. It's never level headed one though is it?  But that's what I'm going to make it on. Basically because I can, I understand some of what people are saying and other people are saying things that I don't understand, which is mad. We're going to talk today about our right hand side and I don't want anyone to think this is needier. I don't want anyone to think well you know we've lost one game and it's bloody, bloody, bloody. Because it isn't that I'm just, it's just a general conversation. Because we're 10 games in now and I don't feel like our right hand side is working as well as it should be. That's what I've taken so far and I'm not talking, I'm not one of these, I've seen it this morning again, Coleman's finished. He should get rid of them bloody, bloody. That's been great but trying to move them on and the same with Walcott. I'm not one of them, not on that side of the fence. But I am on the side of the fence that will question an important part of our team. You know, if it was good enough for people to criticise Leighton Baines. Yeah, it's, there's a bit of a strange relationship with someone that's coming.  He's a sound fella, he's a good right back but he's not beyond criticism. Now, I've had grimes with him for a while to be honest. And the part of his game, I think you said in the final word, is game. It's getting the ball, getting it forward, that energy, that dynamism. It's kind of dropping off a bit but my biggest criticism with him is he's a fullback. He doesn't block as many crosses as he should and his crossings terrible. And there are two fundamental parts of being a fullback which you know, he's 29 days you know. He's probably not going to get better but he needs to work on it. He needs to work on picking up the ball. I think for me he's a very instinctive player.  Like in Old Trafford yesterday when he showed a ffisder across and he's hitting him behind everyone.  And he doesn't have to think about it. There's no one better. I think he just needs to find that form and he needs to just stop being brave with the ball again. Is that confident? I think so, yeah. I think it is, yeah. Because it is when you're going through a crisis of confidence with anything. You just don't want to tear up for it. Especially with football, you get the ball, you just want to give it easy, you don't want to take your risk. And it is game, it is about taking risks, isn't it? Taking people on getting to the line, whipping it in. So yeah, I think it is down to confidence with him. But I think now he's not being helped by Walcott either, who seems to be going through a similar sort of... I don't know if it's a confidence crisis or just a bad run of form because he's not performing either. So then it becomes the whole of that side. I think yesterday United started to target the right hand side. The start of the game, they were getting it out to the left-band side quite a bit. But that's pretty solid now. So they started targetting the right. And Martial had the beaten of Coleman a lot of the time. So I don't know, it is a tricky one. But it does need discussion. You can't just say, just because Coleman started and he was a great siren and he's been great for 10 years, he's not beyond criticism. No, it's weird having the discussion because the both for me still very important members of our squad. Walcott's been great. Since we signed him, I think he's still got a hell of a lot to offer. He's fit, he's fast. You can still come up with goals, no question about that.  I'm not one that is getting rid of him and everything else, because he has come back from a poor injury. I remember a few seasons ago before he'd even had the injury started, the season really poor. He got in, Coleman's first season. He got in when I don't think he should have done. The goal gate was doing okay. Coleman brought him back in and he struggled for two months. His form was terrible and then he got into it and then he went up to his normal level. You know, when he ended up breaking his leg, I don't know. Cos obviously his retain game against Lester was incredible. He was the best performance I've ever seen from an injured player coming back incredible. But my gripe is from an attacking sense. You're right about the crosses. It's mad and basic, fundamental. I've been a fullback, stopped the crosses into the box and he doesn't, he backs off. But the problem I've got with him is in the attacking sense, because it is the best part of his game. And I don't understand why he doesn't drive into the box mo. Because he still got the opportunity. He still can do it. He done it on a couple of occasions. When we should have had the penalty. So he does that because he's no more than anyone. Opposition fullbacks don't like that. They don't like someone running into the box at the moment. Cos once you get in the box, it's game on there, isn't it? You need to get your crossing or you get fouled, maybe. So it's too many times at the moment for me. He's doing what a criticised Cucamartina for last season when he played at right back and at left back. And what I've criticised John Joe Kenny at times for doing, which is receiving the ball facing your own goal almost. As a fullback, you should, and a good attacking fullback, and it's what Seamus was very good at, is receiving the ball and opening his body up to go forward with it. Too many times at the moment, it's stopping it, turning. And it's like, I don't want it. I'm passing it back to Keane or whatever. I don't want on Sunday and put Keane in loads of trouble and me ended up having to play away out of it because he'd give him a terrible ball back and it's like you could have got that out your feet and gone. Now all right, he's not always going to be able to take it out of his feet and bomb pass players of course, he's not. But he could be carrying that ball and making himself available.


Thank you. Okay, so tell me if today whatever NPTEL has developed, a private person wants to kind of make it more appealing. Can you do that? Can you do that? Yeah. Can do it. The consensus was that we should enable that. No, but now they can do it. I think we took that decision in one of our last meetings. No, we cannot do it. No, we cannot do it. Okay, so let me answer. So when the mission started, when the mission started, so if the mission started, then the different institutions came up with a different policy on the content. How it was set clearly in the mission that the copyrights belong to HRD industry. So a lot of opinions on that. Last PAB meeting, you asked us to detail examine this issue. So now we have prepared a draft policy. We are coming back, so we consulted large number of stakeholders. We consulted CUL also on this. So we are coming back on PAB, which we are scheduling in third week of March where we have now, then we will come with the policy, get it approved with the PAB. We have also consulted large number of stakeholders who have created this content. And once that policy is out, then A, we will share with all of our stakeholders who have created this content. B, our plan is that we will also have a workshop and the big players who are in this business of creating content will share our policy with that. And the idea is that, as you are saying every time, sir, is that we have prepared the basic content and the modification or addition should be done by the private players, primarily so that it reaches the, it reaches the large number of users. In fact, one of the discussion in the first group yesterday also was that the government makes the, the government can only, can always make the basic content. They can make it available and make use of the private players. For example, the comparison which they were making was, however good Rudarshan can be, it can never reach NDTV or whatever it is. Yes. So, so idea is that we have to involve everybody in, so that we, so that we reach to the students with the best possible content. In this today's August gathering, is there anybody who has any objection to making it open? Or another point of view which says that everybody agrees. So that's a good thing. You should go ahead with that. You should go ahead. Okay. So now we, so with your permission, I will. So when we are coming in, this is only content, when we are coming in detail to the PAB, we are talking about all different scenarios. It's not content technology which we are developing. We'll come up with all different scenarios and so these all, all details are there. So I just told the, all those precautions. The standard. Can I take a part? We will discuss this, we will discuss this in greater detail than the policy. Thank you. Now we'll come to the second group. This is group number two, enabling of, enabling and empowering educators. Professor Pankaj Jalota is not here. Dr. Sujata, TFR. She is also not here. Yes, we'll do that. Good, good. Good morning everyone. We are here to give the recommendations from group two enabling and empowering educators which was moderated by Professor Pankaj and Dr. Sujata. But it's being presented by Professor Sanjay Garwal from Netar Bhopal and I'm Dr. Shraddha Kamal from NIT University in Ibrahna. We had a very invigorating and vibrant discussion. It was on enabling and empowering educators. So it was, I think it got extended to a very large extent on how we can actually empower educators. And what was very good was that the focus was on the, you know, the opportunities and not on the challenges. We discussed challenges but we converted them into some kind of stepping stones which we'll be discussing. The role of an educator has become even more significant now that we talk about integration of ICT and technology. We know that technology is a great leveler and it can reach out to maximum kind of learners, maximum number in terms of quantifying it and also different kinds of learners. So whether we talk about learning aptitude or different learning styles, technology has the ability to do so. We discussed models of learning across disciplines as an interdisciplinary approach and some labs and projects that could also be sort of, you know, reinvented using ICT and then specifically how to empower and educate us. I'll request my colleague to start with the recommendations and then I'll join in. Good afternoon. In this group we have the task to answer eight questions. This is enabling and empowering educators and during the discussion we came out certain challenges as Shraddha told you. And then we discussed a lot but at the end we combined three, four questions together. So we came out with the seven recommendation at all, not question-wise, but in total we have the seven recommendation with us. The question was asked, the main concentration of our group was on the first question, there is need to integrate faculty development in technology enhanced teaching learning. And second was related to that, at what minimum ICT level are to be prescribed for the educator. And the third one also related means once we start discussing we find this also can be related together. There is a will that college teachers be threatened by the introduction of technology that are capable of massive education. And our group worked out in that and the first recommendation which came out from there is providing adequate support structure to faculty members for embracing technology. This is ensuring they become the independent and self-directed. So this is the first recommendation which came out with that, that every faculty member should have the minimum level of connectivity as well as having the infrastructure with them so that he can use freely as first group recommend, this authoring tool and other tools can also be included in that so that they feel free to create the content and they feel free to use the content in the classroom situation using ICT as well as the web-based or any live medium. This is the first recommendation from our group. Second is for the existing teachers the number of teachers in the colleges are very large as the data is also provided to us. And our group recommendation was the leverage technology for formal training requires training to use technology effectively using our group recommends this may be a certificate course duration may be decided later on but this can be done through because the number of faculty members are very large this can be done through virtual mode, blended mode or what we can do as knitters are doing that training the master trainer can be produced or trained on the face to face model and then they can also train the other teachers at their end so this model can be applied but for the existing teacher using ICT tools and technology this should be there a formal training should be there. The other recommendation was there that design a mandatory training or induction training program for the new entrants into the higher education because the only qualification does not mean is entitled to become a teacher is a M tech or PSG the group discuss a lot in that say if it's a M tech or something does not apply that it becomes a teacher is required a lot of pedagogical approach, pedagogical training as Professor Mohan also highlight in the panel discussion to the morning it's requires a lot of training in the pedagogical approach and this is our experience and our group also feels that when we go for the ICT based training using a view or any other tool it requires a different style of teaching approach so definitely it requires a training this training of ICT tools and training can include the pedagogical approach also so these are the three recommendation now for the other recommendation I want to shut that down. Thank you so just to re-emphasize the training should be on the science of learning because that is something which is right now not being met and this has to be institutionalized in the sense that if we introduce an incentive process for educators who are able to integrate technology meaningfully in the classroom and demonstrate it then some link has to be done with their appraisals or something or some incentive has to be given so that people are encouraged and people who step out of the status quo and their comfort zone and are doing something which is more research driven should be encouraged. We also discussed that we need to explore ICT for establishing models for collaborative teaching I think this was a very sort of good discussion because yes so Nithar Bhopal for instance we are calling and Chandigarh we are having subject matter experts who can virtually connect so if we are teaching a course then we can have an industry expert who can virtually add some value to the teaching learning process and we don't have to spend extra sort of money on bringing somebody to the classroom because now ICT allows us to sort of have different channels of dissemination and here specifically the collaborative teaching model can be developed which have been demonstrated in many regional institutes. Then allowing a certain amount of autonomy in redesigning curriculum using maximum digital resources could also be implemented although we leave it to the discretion of the recommendation panel because there was some discussion on the flexibility of certain curriculums because they are affiliated to universities. So therefore I think assessments was again an important area where we said that a teacher in order to an educator in order to have a holistic perspective on how to become more empowered needs to be adept in content creation, usage of open educational resources, multiple channels of information dissemination and assessments because unless we have this holistic approach towards educators empowerment if even there is one missing link it will be difficult to implement and the seventh recommendation was to initiate and a social network community connect exclusively for high education like we have a Facebook and an Edmondo which is a learning platform or we have LinkedIn we have micro groups and special interest groups but can we have a larger body which allows us all to share and you know be more participative and specially to come out of the silo centric mode which we all feel we should. So these were the recommendations and on a closing note we sort of were just wanting to emphasize that a teacher and educator can only be empowered if we are able to create a meaningful experience in learning engagement and effectiveness in the classroom and for that a systemic integration model has to be developed. Thank you this is only one recommendation which the group is having certain question mark that is curriculum design including the maximum thing which is related to ICT in the curriculum design so the autonomy to the college or the university level this need to be discussed because the now at present the university is doing all the curriculum design work and assessment work how can we include this ICT in the curriculum so that effective utilization of this ICT is a question mark with our group sir. Thank you. And just one last thing with this recommendations it will be possible for us as educators to become contributors and not just consumers of ICT technology so that's it. Thank you very much. Thank you sir. Since IIT Bombay and now jointly with IIT Kharagpur we run large scale teacher training program we have consistently felt this need as was mentioned even by Professor Mohan and others that there should be some mandatory induction training and perhaps a mandatory annual or biannual training as a revision map. In any case we now realize we have been realizing it for some time when we were injecting some elements of pedagogy into our subject specific training. As you know our 10,000 teachers training program was originally conceived to be subject specific training but we now realize the importance of introducing teachers to the use of ICT and to the use of pedagogy. So I'm glad to announce that we have been including such elements albeit indirectly some of our recent programs but now onwards every training program for 10,000 teachers that we conduct will necessarily have these elements. So the MOU as a last time in your presence we entered into MOU with State Technical University and one of the component of the MOU where we are talking about is also exposing to all the lecturers and teachers to this education technology. The second issue sir which I also discussed in PAB earlier that the talk to teacher infrastructure which is available is primarily used during summer vacation and winter vacation. The idea is to develop NITR as a nodal point. Four NITRs will be the nodal point and all the 400 remote centers which have been created in the talk to teacher program will be used extensively for doing this education technology training to all the lecturers and teachers. Doing that so that our whole effort was to see that this network which has been created, this infrastructure which has been created under this 10,000 to 10,000 teachers is maximally utilized. Now I request the third group for the content delivery. Dr. Leena Wadia and Professor Umma Kanjilal. So I think first we should say thank you to our reporters Satish Sangameshwaran from Microsoft and Shri Pradeep Kall they did a brilliant job so we had absolutely no work to do. So we were very lucky so thank you both very much. Our group had about 24 attendees and I'm not going to go by the question sequence because I've sort of tried to club things in terms of the title was content delivery and usage. So I'll separate out the delivery discussion and the usage discussion. So the first question was on the issue of delivery that DTH is available, MOOC platforms are available. How do you think about the trade off between coverage versus effective use? And I'm essentially saying exactly how our reporters wrote it down. The industry view was and that was a surprise at the very beginning that e-learning has not worked. And their point of view was that there is not enough students to keenness and motivation, there's not enough teacher connect and there's not enough back channels to help students stay motivated through the course and for example Microsoft said that they got better results when they continuously interacted with the students through some of their modules. But the academic perspective was that there are even practical considerations on the ground like the EDUSAT model, somebody said that we don't even know what router to buy, what equipment to buy and even that becomes a roadblock in us accepting technologies for use. And then the other point which naturally came up and which has overlapped with what has gone in the two previous groups and in the next group is the issue of acceptability from faculty. And then UMA is a member of Sakshat, sort of cautioned all of us that teachers play a critical role and because they play a critical role I'm just going to expand on what was discussed there that they need training, they need incentivization to use these materials. The other thing was that in the first question itself it came up that somehow e-learning courses have to be made mandatory if we are going to have to drive adoption and maybe think of making say 10% of the courses to be taken through e-learning methods and so on. Or certainly you must incentivize students by giving them credit so that was important too. And then in the context of DTH there was a lot of discussion and thinking was that who is DTH targeted towards? Is it the students who are already in the classroom? Or are they students who are watching at home? And if they are watching at home when will they watch in what time slots? So the cautionary statement was that one needs to think that DTH through very carefully how we use it because for example the example of I think Mr Praveen was in the room at that point and he said that one set of target audience could be students who have no classroom experience or in open university courses or for remedial teaching and so on. So we decided at that point that look we are discussing infrastructure, we don't need to say how the infrastructure will be used but we do want to caution that somehow the DTH has to be thought through so that it is maximally useful to everyone. And yes we would certainly like to say that experiments like DTH, online moaks etc. on delivery platforms have to get started and we can make corrections as we go along. And at that point Kannan was in the room and he clarified some of the questions that were on our group where he asked, posed this question that we are concerned about the percentage of students who finish a course online then should we even consider putting in a small filter, a simple filter not very difficult but some test of the students intention to try to complete the course and so that created a lot of discussion but I think the general feeling was that no any filtering goes against the philosophy of online courses and mooks and so it's better to try to do whatever you want to do post the courses over. So at least that's what most members of our team felt. Better to filter at exit stage than at pre-filter and if we are concerned about students finishing the course then let's look at other ways to help students stay incentivized to complete the course which includes assistance and support through social media, course credit, certification and so on. So yeah just to close the DTH discussion I think there was very clear thinking that DTH needs to be used I just want to reiterate that I've written it down here and in the context of usage I think several thoughts came in and we took cognizance of the fact that the reason why we in India want to use mooks and online education is slightly different from why they are doing it in the West. For us we absolutely absolutely needed to extend reach and to help improve quality because it's a new tool and we can rethink the way we do things and therefore in that context we discussed usage issues and I think one important suggestion came from Rajasthan technical university saying that going online has to be a faced approach an inclusive approach it will take time and we have to all get started but wait a bit and then the other thinking was that the dynamic between universities and affiliating colleges will play a very very important role in the extent of usage of online technologies we didn't elaborate on that but yeah again integration with the curriculum will make it easier to get from teachers, students and administrators in the university system and one specific suggestion that came was that perhaps regulating agencies could say that if there is online material available then that should be referred to in the course syllabus somehow so that it becomes at least there is a pointer to the online material for the students and then which can perhaps drive absorption and yes the consistent certification and maybe recognition of the online course as on par with the classroom course is very critical and for that of course it means that we have to do online courses with high quality but if you could make it on par then certainly it will drive usage and there is a strong need to practice flip classroom models because then one can make maximal use of contact hours to emphasize the learning outcomes and in terms of content I think people felt that some kind of wiki type model where people can vet and comment and review and content would be a good idea and so there we go straight into some of the issues of content, there are some overlap with previous groups. The question from the private sector was what about all the content that is available with the private sector how can it be made relevant to students and so I think Uma came up with the statement that Saksha is going to become a content repository and then that started a flurry of discussion on if it's a content repository what is needed and that included the wikipedia discussion but it also included things like insisting that people who create content file the content with appropriate meta tags and indexing and all syllabus information and so on so that it becomes easier for students to find it and also that there must be community rating mechanisms we are now familiar with Amazon rating and YouTube rating and so on and so those need to get incorporated into any content repository that is created but a content repository is a very good idea so that a lot of content can come in and we'll get to see where the gaps are and I think this brings us to two very important recommendations that we have and I'm going to say them both quickly, I'll let Uma expand on it because one of them was her own suggestion which we thought was a very good idea and she said that we need some kind of sustainable long-term engagement with this whole process of online education it has to be somebody's responsibility to coordinate, to share, to keep resources fresh and so on and she felt that enemy ICT is a project, Sakshat is a portal but there should be some organizational structure that takes care of this to ensure longevity as well as more use it has to be somebody's business to disseminate what is learned from these things so this is one major thing that we have and the other statement that we'd like to make is that I think there should be some technology enable learning related policy that helps to sort of deal with all the crux issues like how do you incentivize teachers what happens to their API scores, Hemlata brought it up a little earlier and how do you give credits to students and so on that needs to be discussed just two points I think that's not required see when we talk about content delivery we are talking about multiple platforms but we have to remember that teacher is one and already we are talking about shortage of teachers now how do you expect a teacher to go in for different platforms and delivering so can we not think in terms of maybe a single delivery point but distribute in different platforms that is something we need to look into how we have convergence of technology convergence of media for the delivery purposes that is something we need to look into and the idea about this sustainable model it is perhaps western world we have something like a consortia where I mean we can group together people I mean efforts that are there for delivery and similar thing was started in the name of Meta University perhaps that's sort of a model we can think of where we offer programs from different universities and have a credit system there I mean a bouquet of courses can be offered and from that platform if we can have online programs available thank you thank you so much thank you very much any observation any clarification I just wanted to note that I am very happy that they said things which under enemy ICT IIT Bombay is going to launch from this July as some of you might have read my paper so the two courses that IIT Bombay will be offering will both permit recognition of the online course grade except that we are also asking the local college teachers who will be the helpers to the students in the flip classroom model to contribute to the evaluation and that would be recognized by the university so there is no double work is one of the reasons why people drop out there is only one problem it's not like a giving a choice they will not have a choice of giving the regular conventional old style exams they will be studying only this and of course we will be as I mentioned we will be training teachers extensively and thanks to the input from all of you now we will be explicitly building in pedagogical training into that training so this is regarding because Lina mentioned my name just wanted to mention this is based on the observation about our own teaching program massive teaching programs it is not clear how many people are not serious about the program and they still come and attend and basically we are wasting money on them so can we come up with some entry barriers in the sense that demonstrate that you are serious about the program because the government is going to spend a lot of money and then you come over so basically this suggestion although was not acceptable to this cotton delivery group the educators group thought it was a great idea I mean one third of the people have minimal make available learning material it could be recorded material like conacademy spoken tutorial it could be web material books let them learn simple test let them score 20 marks we are not talking about grade filtering and then so that the troublemakers are removed they don't come so everybody who comes there is already at some level then we can actually conduct this program at a much higher level we could even have it in a flip classroom people can bring their problems to be solved the same problem can get analyzed from 100 different angles and more the students more the participants the quality can actually be higher so that was the proposal I made but the educators the previous one thought it was a good idea and they have a commodity thank you now I just wanted to say Lina that you preempted us from saying something which we are going to include in the Mumbai statement you'll hear about it soon now we coming we come to the last group this is on assessment certification and policy Dr. P. Anandan he is left for Sanjay to go there are two people Sanjay and Venki I would request both of them good afternoon everyone Secretary Sahab Phatak Sahab Prakasi and Pawanji thank you very much for giving this honor to speak before you and try to consolidate what has been done by the group especially I would like to first thank Dr. Anandan the moderator for this session and the reporters here Radhika and Mr. Arora thank you very much to all of you I was just a participant in the group and it was really lively discussion in the group a lot of discussion but especially we focused on policy issues many of the things that the other three groups have also talked about were also discussed in the group what I felt that we were not able to focus largely on assessment and certification issues which was listed in this but we discussed more on the policy issues overarching teaching and learning using technology I take the liberty of some of the things in the order that was discussed routine questions to reflect upon and Dr. Anandan made a good framework of 5 to 6 different areas for us to discuss and we reflected on those areas identified by him and certain general points that has emerged in this discussion I would just like to highlight that there is a lot of clarity of course online education opens the possibility of separating the process of assessment from teaching and learning especially it may be possible to have a more centralized or common set of assessment for different subjects that can be utilized and used by the institutions many of these recommendations are very generic we have not come out with specific things that it should be done for example assessment one of the things that we were discussing is that there are different ways how assessment can be done and how open infrastructure for assessment can be established including using the open badges so that you can incentivize people to use our badges for online learning the second one is there is a desire to encourage significant use of online learning especially blended learning methods in higher education especially for institutions which are facing challenges to meet their teaching and learning needs it was also discussed that technology may help in customizing the curricula and learning needs of special students in each institution this is something that we were looking at trying to reflect on issues related to how much of blended e-learning may be allowed in our educational institutions I think one group told about 10% mandatory there is another recommendation somewhere else in the country about 15% and recently in the document it is shown that Dr. Pathak and myself we are a member of a group who has submitted to UGC to accommodate around 15% our group didn't talk about the percentage but definitely talked about that there has to be some mechanism to give to encourage teaching and learning online methods in teaching and learning the next issue discussed was regarding open source and rights related to content and technology I think the first group during the first presentation this was much discussed but I will read what we have almost articulated and there are two topics in these issues one is related to licensing and commercialization rights related to content and technologies created under enemy ICT funding the other is use of open source technologies in creating content and related technologies in enemy ICT project there are two or different things on the first issue there was a kind of view that the general sentiment was towards that the products developed by a public should remain in public domain we are not going by the legalistic definition of public domain here that the government and government use these materials freely however it was noted that this issue is not specific to MHRD or enemy ICT funded projects but it is so for all government projects and it should be taken in a global approach on the second area the use of open source technologies the discussion was towards not to specify use of open source alone and therefore leave it as such and encourage use of open source technologies so that's leaving a lot of flexibility in the developments because I think this is a better way to look at encouraging open source than to fix open source because appropriate use of technology is more important than specifying something else and the next is that incentivization of use of the enemy ICT materials I think many other groups have told and this is also the same thing that came out we should encourage mechanisms to incentivize use of enemy ICT materials that has been created some other things the other groups have also talked about last in specific discussions was that uniform and consistent policies regarding to education and educational technology should be there in the country this was not very specific to the enemy ICT project but it was a general point that came out in the discussion if I take the last one as an overarching suggestion that came out and probably this suggestion is for all the four groups probably will come out that there is a need for a standing committee of the MHRD on issues related to technology in education I think this is something what was the group three also talked about and others talked about and when this group was making this suggestion this came one thing that came to my mind and I'm just taking the liberty of sharing this information that in UK there is something called JISC joint information systems committee which actually decides largely about teaching and learning practices in UK higher education technology use per se I think there is a need for something like that at our level which can form a standing committee and advise, provide guidelines for use of technology in education in general I think this is what I would like to say and Janathan you want to add something My name is Venkatesh Hariharan, I had a non-profit called Knowledge Commons so on behalf of all the four groups I would like to say that the four groups felt that there is a need for an independent body at the national level possibly called the Digital Education Foundation of India this representative body should be jointly led by institutions of higher education, public and private corporate sector and NGOs and other stakeholders and supported by the government the primary role of this body would be to enable digital transformation of India's higher education sector through advocacy and behavioral change and by organizing events and programs and disseminating good practices and toolkits for technology in education so I would say submit that on behalf of all the four groups thank you you believe all the same platform Digital Education Foundation of India is a name that was suggested I think that is something different this is an idea we will park for the moment because our original ambition for what we wish to achieve from this discussion was slightly different, it has come as a useful suggestion but I think we need to park it for the moment and I request Pawan to provide the general conclusions for the conference as well and his favorite Mumbai declaration which he wants to make I think as this conference had evolved can I request Praveen also to join me as the conference proceeded we thought it may be a good idea to capture all the thoughts synthesize them together and bring out a statement which we can appropriately call or may be possibly call it as Mumbai statement on use of technology in higher education so we worked from 9 o'clock to 11.30 5.6 of us last night 2 of us had a standing meeting we were standing for 2 hours standing committee the outcome of all of it was basically to synthesize what has come from the groups which the four group moderators have already presented here there are some elements in the Mumbai statement which are not presented as part of the group report I'll request Prof. Kannan to begin with that and then I'll say something we will add something preamble and then the recommendations of the four groups and then we will conclude that's the way this is going to come out I also want to point out that the points for this discussion again that was quite a bit of work it was initiated by Mr. Agarwal then all of us pitched in and then added and so on that also was that work was done late nights and early mornings Mumbai statement on use of technology in higher education in India although it was done in a very short time about 3 weeks and in spite of the short notice there were 85 vice chancellors, deans, heads of institutions of higher education there have been 25 NME ICT PIs about 28 people from corporate sectors and NGOs 12 key policy makers all attended this yesterday's morning session we set up the stage for discussions in the afternoon we decided right in the beginning Mr. Agarwal emphasized right from the beginning that the main portion of this conference main aspect of this conference would be the group discussions that happened yesterday and so the yesterday's morning session was so organized to set the stage for that and we had Dr. Anup Gupta distinguished scientist from Microsoft Dr. Anant Agarwal, Professor MIT and also President edX gave keynote speeches yesterday and Professor Mark Russell, King's College London gave the keynote speech today this was organized at IIT Bombay with planning commission and MHID through NME ICT supporting the British Council sponsoring this so this was an occasion because now we are talking about can we improve the quality that is we have tried with lots of ICT based technologies now we are actually talking about quality through that is it possible IIT Bombay itself has an education technology program in which 20 people are doing PhD in just three years so we are in the cusp of a change so this seems to be an opportune time so I am really glad that we got an opportunity to host this at IIT Bombay I'll hand the mic over to you so in addition to the preamble and all that specifics on the four groups that are included in the Mumbai statement there will be a few expectations and those expectations are not expectations from the government that is expectations from the sector as a whole wherein all stakeholders are involved the expectation is that while we should encourage adoption of technology in all institutions of higher education over the next five years identify and enable 100 institutions of higher education both public and private institutions to use technology in the most effective manner and become exemplars in technology enabled learning in and reaching to the global standards so we need to understand what is happening globally in institutions around the world like MIT or in Warwick or any other institution which are doing a good job and at least 100 of our institutions should try to see how they can reach those standards and use of technology so that is one expectation second expectation is that we have a unique organizational model for higher education in the country which is the affiliating college system which has been the main constraint in providing quality education but it could now be leveraged with the university acting as hubs and colleges as spokes to deliver high quality instruction to students enrolled in hundreds of colleges affiliated to the universities and that is precisely was the focus of this conference focusing on technical affiliating universities this along with efforts on faculty training at a scale like your T10KT will ensure training 10,000 teachers such efforts will ensure that the issue of availability of quality faculty in large numbers is somewhat addressed thus the role of affiliating university is redefined under the new paradigm and such universities will be central and will play a transformative role in quality enhancement in higher education in the country so that is a central focus on affiliating universities to improve quality of higher education third is I think review of initiatives under NMICT so far reveals including QEE a presentation was made in the morning where technology is being very intensively used to improve quality that while engineering field is being adequately covered other fields of study require specific interventions learning from this experience and they could be replicated and with suitable adaptations and at least 10 fields of study such action will be initiated in the next five years we already have made some beginning with social work under leadership of TATA Institute of Social Sciences their representative attended the two day event and they're coming up with a proposal in the next meeting of the Standing Committee and the PAB so we expect in at least 10 fields of study we have similar initiatives where more intensive use of technologies facilitated and enabled massive online open courses you know they have potential of reaching a very large segment of learners both inside and outside the formal higher education system some of our institutions of higher education have initiated some efforts in this direction a lot of work is required to be taken to make their main history this involves setting up necessary platforms supporting assets for blending them with local support mechanisms educating teachers defining models for institutional use evolving new net pedagogies and establishing certification mechanisms it is proposed so all this has to be done in a more organized manner rather than leaving it to institutional efforts so I'll stop here and request Praveen to take this opportunity also to propose a vote of thanks before Vidya formally and Sir speaks and Vidya formally proposes a vote of thanks Sir on behalf of ministry I'd like to thank both Prof. Fartak and Prof. Kannan they were one stop portal for all of us they really arranged this program for us was a booting arrangement for all of us so as you keep telling me again and again in the ministry and I would like to reiterate in front of everybody that the core of technology neighbor learning has to be the connectivity and the networks in the colleges that will be our central focus we'll spend for the mission more time to see that we provide a robust network and the connectivity to all the colleges so Prof. Kincha is here in his evaluation report he mentioned about integrating the private sector the best in private sector both at the PAB level and at our apex committee level which has been accepted this recommendation has been accepted we'll be adding from the private sector representatives both in apex as well as in PAB however sir the need here was that apart from the representatives who are there in our NME ICT from the private sector there will be independent body which will primarily look at the issues of technology neighbor learning do the advocacy of technology enable learning will have representatives from the government and from the private sector and then we'll work with the government and the private sector in the university that's also one of the recommendations of this technology enable learning also in this meeting sir I would like to say that you have been a great support to us to this technology enable learning I would like to share with all of you I have not done PhD like Prof. Fartak or Prof. Kannan but I can get a feel of when a person does a PhD technology enable learning is a subject which is so new one day you freshen up you get up and say you can do everything and the next day you have another meeting and you realize that nothing can be done I mean somebody is a friend who was doing PhD explained me this that when you do one does PhD these are the experiences and you have been always a support to me I remember the last meeting which we had with BSN and I was extremely depressed after the meeting and you said no no there is a hope you must keep working towards it and I said sir before you came I also told this gathering that we are at the tipping point for the engineering education and if we don't succeed in this technology enable learning in India at a national level initiative will be very very difficult to succeed in other areas in your presence I solicit the support of all the representatives of state technical universities who are present to make it success so that the technology enable learning remains as a big thing and makes a difference in the life of the students of our country. So I think how do we take this Mumbai statement forward so a draft of this is now available this is a draft form and we will request first the coordinators or the moderators of the group and those who made presentations because your report has been slightly reworked to it so you kindly validate whether all your points are included or not so kindly give us a feedback in 48 hours and then professor Kannon you will go through it and then we will run it by Dr. Anup Gupta our guest from abroad and maybe Anand Agarwal to get their inputs as well and we will post it on the web in a draft form then for a few days you can give your comments and after that we will request sir if we could formally release it from New Delhi if the code of conduct does not come into so I think and one of the ideas which was also discussed and we felt very strongly about is that this entire space of learning science is becoming very very interesting space and the world is trying to figure out how the technology will play out in the field of higher education so in the field of education so maybe we could think in terms of setting up an inter-institutional center which brings in expertise on the brain science from psychology and educational technology and so that India can be at the forefront in the creation of knowledge on learning sciences so this was one area which can be supported under NMICT and I would now personally on my behalf to organize this event was in some ways a dream for me personal dream which I have been thinking for over a year now and we had chance meeting with Dya and others who really worked very hard to put it all together and I was waiting for Praveen to join in the ministry even before he joined I told him we have to have such an event I'm so grateful that Praveen and sir we got your support in putting it together I'm personally grateful to our guest from overseas you know Dr. Anup and Mark Russell and Anandthu participated in the conference I think they really added a global perspective on what's happening in this particular space and if we work together and I want to recall one of the slides you know in which he was describing Mark was describing what is ICT it's not information and communication technology alone it is information and collaborative technology or connective technology I think we have connected together in these two days in a way to work out and synthesize to develop some kind of a vision which is not a government vision the Mumbai statement is not essentially a government policy document you know we want it to be co-owned by all of us by this community and as we move forward by the larger academic community and by all stakeholders to address some of the challenges that India's higher education sector faces so I'll end here sir and thank you very much Thank you very much Praveen a very short conclusion may I request Vidya to join me we also have Richard from British Council we will request him to join us yes I forgot Richard can you join us this is a very pleasant job of expressing a vote of thanks the reason I have called Vidya you must realize that there were multiple organizers of this conference it was kicked off by Pawan's initiative and somebody spoke about the chance meeting I now understand his method of working he had a chance meeting with me over lunch in Delhi and he imposed this entire conference organization within that span frankly I have organized many conferences but never in my life I have attempted to organize a conference in three weeks where the conference program was still getting developed as the conference was getting arranged I have done it once thanks to God and thanks to a lot of people I don't think I'll ever do it again so Pawan you may at least six months notice for a good call first of all I would like to thank the Microsoft Research and British Council and that is why I have requested Vidya and him to come Richard to come here for helping us so well I think you wrongly call them sponsors of this conference they are not they are partners of this conference that is what we have called them and that is what they have worked as so thank you so much thank you let's give them a big hand for helping you let me I have already secretary higher education for coming here personally I already mentioned how grateful we are all for him not only for coming here today but for supporting us continuously all these years and we hope this support will continue in future without any doubt I would like to thank the vice chancellors and the senior colleagues from the state technical universities and some of the leaders from autonomous colleges for making time as Pawan rightly said this whole conference is about all of us taking the ownership of whatever we wish to do in future and I am glad that many of you came I understand that there is another important conference happening for all the university vice chancellors and that is why several could not come and many have sent their representatives and I am sure that they will take back the message but thank you so much for attending this conference I must also thank NITTRs all the directors and their senior colleagues are here for helping us doing a whole lot of components of the organizational things here especially officials from MHRD and planning commission I would like to name Dr. Arora for organizing things at that end and Bharat Bhushan who diligently arranged to send invitations one after another that was another nightmare I must admit he had told me that the conference will be attended by 60 people the invitations became 80 then they became 120 they became 160 and when I saw 196 I went mad but then statistics helped us and about 50 to 60 percent people actually attend so that is how we are able to manage that but anyway thank you so much for organizing there are no words I have that is a very short notice very senior people from both within the country and elsewhere came and participated and shared their knowledge and begin by thanking Dr. Mantah Chairman AICT, Professor Raghavan both of them gave their talks in the inaugural portion we had excellent keynotes by Dr. Anup Gupta and Dr. Anand Dagarwal yesterday interesting comments by Jil Kaldikar, is Jil here I would like to thank Dr. Jagdish Arora for sharing with us the exciting work that they are doing in FlipNep Dr. Anju, Pankaj and Sujata Leena and Uma, Dr. Anandar and all the SEDA reporters because as we mentioned to you these deep discussions for two and a half hours that each group did was the crux in heart of this conference that is what we wanted I would specifically like to thank Professor Mark Russell and Professor Kincha my friend for coming here all the way Professor Mark Russell's thing I have noted that you have mentioned things that we ought to do after listening to you they have noted I will be personally doing all of those things at the end I must thank a large number of people in my team in IIT Bombay here I have requested some of the senior managers of the team to come here could they please just stand so that I can acknowledge them and their contributions my team members will they please stand all the team members thank you so much as I said it was a nightmare this nightmare was made possible by the excellent work done by the team these stalls were organized in the last five days I would request you that as you have lunch you all have of course flights to catch and so on but please do spend at least five to ten minutes going through these stalls you do not know how much it will encourage those people secretary higher education himself has spent the time on visiting all the stalls I request each one of you to visit these stalls of course those of you who are interested in visiting the labs later those options people will be collecting and the arrangements will be made Professor Vatak Pawan Agarwal ji from the Minister Planning Commission actually we do not really realize how fortunate we are to have in the 11th five year plan this particular scheme it's 5000 crore rupees scheme and let me just tell you that never in my life have I encountered such a scheme I don't know how it got passed from the cabinet actually incidentally I was attending on that day the cabinet was not there that day I was very petrified because it's totally so innovative that it's scary but fortunately the mood then was very positive because of the overall growth in the economy all the cabinet members were gung ho about whatever they were doing and because of that we have this project let me tell you that you realize how important it is for the economy to grow at the root the crux of everything is the economy if your economy is not growing forget about such projects you'll never get such projects then you'll have some government schemes here and there which totally bind your hands feet everything and you can't do anything so this is a particular project which is so innovative so therefore it is our responsibility to please to make sure that this scheme is used with all sincerity of purpose and all the efforts at our command to make it successful we are very fortunate that the IIT system has adopted the scheme if you look at the initial proposal of the NMA ICT project it mentions about premier institutions but the role of IITs has come voluntarily and that is something which I really appreciate till now the IITs have been basically my experiences that in the past they have been working only amongst themselves but this is such a good departure wherein they have tried to reach out to the universities last time Parveen our joint secretary organized signing of MOU of all the state technical universities and all your IIT partners in this great project were also there so this is for the first time that now IITs are openly reaching out the standards which they have developed over the past 50 years they wanted to share it with the rest of the world and then for us it becomes very easy I was speaking to Agarwal sir that we feel very safe when we feel that this whole project NMA ICT project is being steered by the IITs on the part of the universities I think it's in a way very fortunate that most of the state governments have now created state technical universities earlier the subjects there were lots of other universities and would have become very difficult for us to coordinate but now we have a ready made platform in which states through the technical universities so we really need to work very very closely with the technical universities because ultimately whatever we are doing here has to percolate down not only at the level of the vice chancellors of these universities which has been attempted today we have made an attempt earlier also but also the level of faculty and then at the level of the students now that is the ultimate test each of your products which you talk about whether it's a virtual lab or a virtual lecture program whether it's any other program all the stalls which you see abroad each and every student in India should know anybody who is pursuing a program in engineering should know that these things are there so that is a big challenge we need to see how we can take it forward college should have in their web portal a link or whatever to our Sakshath portal and whatever we are doing here I think that's very very important students should be aware that is something very important I feel and I am very pleased that we seem to be making headway on this in the years to come in the months to come I would like to see that more such interaction whether you can't have physical interaction all the time with 700 universities but to the virtual mode we should have as much interaction as possible through the through the IITs the second thing which I have been requesting Professor Bhattak and our members on the PAB is that whatever we are creating through the NME ICT project today needs to be used through an institutionalized mechanism on a sustainable manner because otherwise NME ICT project is not there for forever so we need to create mechanisms by which arms length body could be created within to begin with probably Professor Bhattak should take the lead on that a body yes and arms length body an independent arms length body in IIT Bombay which starts and it should have a governing body we should have full powers to see how to take it forward all these things which you are creating here and we give you one year advance to organize the next big conference not six months so I think that's very important otherwise the project money will dry up and then at the end of the day you are left high and dry very very important so I hope we will be able to work on this seriously whatever assistance you want from us in creating an autonomous body which actually will be able to generate resources too it cannot be permanently dependent on government that is a warning I am telling you again and again resources anyway I face the planning commission is less this thing but the expenditure secretary some of you have pasted them you know it's very difficult the rate at which the things are happening in the country resources may not be so easily available now years to come so whatever we have we have to do it in a very proper way and have a mechanism by which we can use we can generate resources and make optimum use of it I think we need to really also work today I did not see anybody from the university grants commission now whether we like it or not if you want to deal with the outside world the system you have to deal with this guy called UGC it's a very customer very it doesn't react very easily it takes a lot of time but you have to deal with him because he will it is the UGC which sets the standards whether even for distance education so therefore if you want to do anything with the universities we have to have UGC on board we will see through the government ensure that whatever programs the IITs are not everybody we are going to be very very restrictive as far as MOOCs kind of education we are trying to promote limited to begin with we will see whatever IIT Bombay is doing and then we will ensure that credits are given through UGC's regulation to all these colleges and universities so that means through a regulation of UGC we will ensure that for the program which he is starting on on trial basis credits are given so the students get this whole system should get accepted by the university system that is very very important we should also see that teachers who are the modern ICT technologies way of teaching they are getting trained etc should get some incentive in terms of now UGC has come up with these API scores I will ensure that credit should be given at something for those teachers so the teachers who are who are more avagard in their way of looking at things etc which professor Bhattak has started unleashed from here those faculty members should get we should also have a look within the distance education system which UGC have to create a counterpart of GIST of course the IITs are autonomous they can do within their own system they can do but as far as the rest of the world is concerned it is the UGC which has to come out with these regulations so I am extremely very grateful today to professor Bhattak especially to the planning commission to British council, Microsoft research and IIT Bombay for giving this opportunity and I think it is so exciting to be here and see that education in India is really moving towards a new direction it is so exciting and then very shortly we are going to start 50 DTH channels that is another very exciting area and I think all of you here I would request you people to be center stage in taking this 50 DTH channels also forward as much as possible anchored purely mainly in the IIT system. Thank you. Thank you very much. I have pleasure in declaring the conference closed. I invite everybody to have lunch. As I said please do visit the stores because that will encourage all the people there. Thank you. Thank you.