So thank you to everyone who is joining us today to learn about the amazing strike and transformation that is happening now in the UAW. I'm Lisa Xu, I'm an organizer with Labor Notes. I'm gonna be facilitating this call and introducing the other speakers. I'm just going to start with a quick overview of what's happening right now. So Labor Notes has been covering the strike pretty closely. You should definitely go to our website to read about breaking news and investigative stories we've been doing. So briefly, the UAW has launched a major strike at select plants of all of the big three automakers for GM and Solantis. Last Thursday, 13,000 auto workers walked out at midnight. And yesterday they were joined by thousands more at GM and Solantis at 38 highly profitable parts distribution centers across the country. And also yesterday, the UAW announced some substantial progress at the bargaining table with Ford, which is why they were spared from the walkout yesterday. So there's some evidence that the standup strike escalation strategy is working. So examples of what Ford has agreed to would be the reinstatement of COLA, which was suspended in 2009. Some historic improvements on job security, including the right to strike over plant closures during the life of the agreement, which is a first for the UAW, as well as two years of income security and healthcare for workers who are laid off. The immediate conversion of all temps have worked for at least 90 days upon ratification of the contract. And there were no concessions on the table.  And this is also being reflected in a new spirit of solidarity and class struggle among the rank and file. And we're gonna hear today about the incredible amount of creativity and militancy that has been unleashed. So we saw the video about the Jeep convoys between plants. We're gonna hear about practice pickets and the collective refusal of voluntary overtime. And it's inspiring not just workers around the country, but all around the world. So the UAW has received solidarity messages from workers in Mexico and Brazil, South Africa, Malaysia. So it's truly incredible. So let me just quickly share the agenda with all of you. Okay, so we're first going to hear from James Slaughter of Labor Notes about, how did we arrive at this historic moment in the union? We're gonna hear from UAW region one director, LaShawn English, about the UAW strike strategy. And then we're gonna hear from some amazing rank and file workers at the big three about what they're doing on the picket lines and in the plants to win the strike. And then we're gonna hear about from members of UAWD, the reform cock is in the UAW about what they're doing, what UAWD is doing to build up the strike with some really interesting tactics. And then at the end we'll go to Q and A and you'll be able to submit questions through the Q and A function, which should be at the bottom of your Zoom screen and in the chat. And then one more thing I'll show you, if you haven't seen this map yet is, this is a map of all the big three worksites across the country and the ones that are out on strike now are marked with little lightning bolts. So this is available on the labor notes website. So, take note of the site closest to you and join workers on the picket line. Okay, so I think we'll just get to it and go to our first speaker, Jane Slaughter, who is one of the founders of labor notes and has been covering the UAW for a very long time.  Yeah, my job is to talk about how we got to this beautiful place that we're in today. The excitement here in Detroit is just something I've never seen before. So labor notes, as many of you know, for years we've been an advocate. If your union is breaking your heart to your job to organize, try and fix. If necessary, you form a rank and file caucus, you organize your fellow workers to fight the boss. In other words, you do what the union ought to be doing. And if necessary, you run for office, you take over and you do it right. Our friends in the caucus of rank and file educators in the Chicago teachers union, they're sort of a textbook example of how to do that. And you can read about them in our book, how to jumpstart your union. And similarly, none of this would be happening today in the UAW, if it wasn't for the facts that four years ago, a small group of activists founded a reform caucus called Unite All Workers for Democracy, UAWD. This is the caucus that President Sean Fane belongs to and it has a majority on the executive board. Won all the seats that it ran for last year and this year. So if UAWD had not existed, and if it hadn't organized really hard, this current fight, the one we're seeing that has the potential to shake up so much in the labor movement, it would not be happening. In the face of these record profits that we're seeing from the big three automakers, I have zero confidence that the old guard in the union would have known how to try to get a fair share of that for the members or would have bothered to try. So a little bit of history, this fight started with a fight for democracy. Starting in 2019, UAWD campaign to win members right to vote themselves on their top officers because there was no accountability under the old system and they won that vote.  So they ran seven people for the executive board, not really knowing what would happen. And their slogan was no tears, no corruption, no concessions. And this was coming after decades of concessions that you probably know about. You'll probably hear more about that from other people. A lot of bad stuff. Well, lo and behold, the members wanted a fresh start. Enough of them did to get rid of the old corrupt regime and their concessionary ways and they voted UAWD in. The turnout was small, the margin was small, but it was enough. So then one of the first things they did was try to push for drastically increasing strike pay because they wanted to make it easier to strike, not harder to strike. And at the convention, they won that strike pay would start on the first day of the strike instead of the eighth day. And we're seeing that now. So UAWD came into office with a membership where the majority had not even voted and they were demoralized. They were cynical about their union. And yet Sean Fain and all the rest of the members of UAWD, they believe this, they commend people over and activate them. People who've been uninvolved, skeptical, even despairing about their union. They said, if we do this right, we can get people involved. So they set to work building a contract campaign which we saw this summer that included pledge cards that people were willing to strike, practice ticketing, lots of communication, lots of media. And that builds up to the strike that started last week. They were really just pushing to do what they had promised and they went directly to the rank and file and went around any officers that were not on the program and the results have been just stunning as you're gonna hear in a minute. So for me, a lesson of this is to grab your chance even if you're not quite ready. UAWD was small, but it was bold.  And another lesson is to learn from the people who went before, as Lisa said, I've been covering this for a very long time. There were earlier reform movements in the UAW and some of the leaders of UAWD go all the way back to the 1980s. There was always somebody in that union, even if it was small, it was trying to keep the spark of reform alive even when it seems like the old guard was gonna be a permanent fixture. So now, of course, UAWD is in it with both feet. You're gonna hear about what people are doing. For example, campaigning to get the people who are still working to refuse voluntary overtime. And they are well aware that despite this big victory, they had us a top. There's the work that they need to do to transform the union is really just beginning. So that's one topic for our town hall today. Some of our speakers are in UAWD. Some of them are not, but they're all working together to win the strike. Let's hear how they're doing it. Back to Lisa. Thank you, Jane. I also just wanna shout out over 150 participants on the webinar. Not everyone can see how many here, but there are a lot of people tuning in and watching what's happening in the UAW right now. It's such an important fight. So now I'm gonna turn over to LaShawn English. So LaShawn is the director of UAW Region 1, which is the region that spans the Detroit area. And she ran on the same reform slate backed by UAWD as Shawn Fain. So she is one of the new wave of reformers we swept into the top leadership of the UAW. And she's gonna tell us a bit about the UAW strike strategy and how things are changing. So go ahead, LaShawn. Good afternoon, everyone. And anybody that's on here that's on strike, we really, really appreciate the strength that you guys are showing. I have to say, as Jane said, I am so proud by the energy and the commitment from the membership. I don't know if the membership, I think they've been ready and overwhelming, ready to fight. And we're just looking for someone to fight. Some of the strategy, I can't say as it was stated that we all ran on the slate and we had numerous talks about, because we went around the country and campaign and we heard everyone's concerns. And we were tired of being here in concessions at the concessions or different issues of tears. I myself was a union president. I have been on the national negotiations before and I can say these strategies right now are great. I wish I had on, I was a national negotiator because as a national negotiator, I could tell you we were starting June and the company will not, we will have meeting scheduled. They wasn't coming to the table. You will spend 12, 16, 17 hours sitting in the building, waiting to even talk about demands. There was no urgency from the company or either side. We were never told full disclosure of the president's demand. So that was a problem too, because you really never know what the big table was doing compared to the little table. And so some of the discussions because Sean also was on a negotiation teams before and he was also in 2015 when I was there, he was on staff. And that was some of our frustrations of some of the things that we will fight and argue about wasn't getting heard. I can say in 2015, I might've been the only person at the time that was a national negotiator, told them that contract was gonna go down because you were not listening to the membership and what you did and it took them to come back. So the strategy that Sean is doing is phenomenal because he's keeping all the negotiators. It's no separation. There's no separation between the GM negotiators, the foreign negotiator and the Chrysler, it's a stallant as I should say, negotiators. In the past, you were in one building, everybody was separate building and no one kept in contact as to what the other departments or other big three were doing. So you always thought you had true, solidary to say it was patterned bargaining, but it's really not if you don't know what the other team is really bargaining about. So all of them, so from the beginning, when your members' demands were came in, every single vice president made sure that every single demand was heard, they did not allow them to pass all the demands without discussion, every single demand was passed or what's got passed I should say was heard and gave a reason which gives it a story as to why that demand was very important. Sean was not actually the president at the time, but he was there on a couple of them and he made sure. That was the thing, he really made sure. Then once he became the president, he went back and said, listen, we need these people demand set. Following that other strategy, which I thought was very, well, we did not shake their hand.  And the company was not used to that. The surprise and the shock from the company, it actually made them upset it. They were very angry actually, it was just like very angry, like no hands shaking it too, you can get us a deal. That's when we celebrate. So he's changing to not feel like a partnership because it makes our members feel like we're in bed with them. And two, you can treat our members right. Then we can shake hands. So those are some of the strategies that have changed there. And then when he did the president's demands, he changed them from president's demands to members demand. First time in history ever happened, he brought every single negotiator in and he read to them the members demands. What do we want? So we're being heard on that part. Those are the strategies that's never happened before. And then organizing the membership signing the cards because as a negotiator, I'll be honest, if you're not part of, I'm a skilled trade. So I may not be well versed in another area, but when you start hearing your stories and the membership's action is bring compassion. So that's another strategy that is being used because we need to know each other's story. The union is bigger than an individual. It's together with brothers and sisters. So those are strategies that we're using. Hearing the stories, hearing the mama part, everyone has a story of something that happened to them. Cause we have to go back to caring about everybody. Those are strategies. Because again, we all been broken so long that we forgotten that we do need to care about people that work. You have people who were once a supplemental worker or a TPT then they become full-time. They forget about what it was like to be a supplemental worker. Or, you know, someone who was a not no longer one tier and they forget what it was like to when they first started. So that was not what the union is about. I think so our strategy is make sure we believe we're teaching in such a short timeframe, teaching our membership and the world what it means to be in a union and to fight for everybody, not just the auto worker and that's for everyone. So again, those are strategies. I love, I know a lot of memberships ready. They trust me, I hear it in my region. Everyone is ready to go. Why not our plan? Why not our plan? I will say this, guys. We don't wanna break the bank of the strike fund. We did raise it, so it's a little bit better. But that's the strategy because that was a heartbreak for GM workers. GM workers, I would say in my region, they was like, please don't let it be me. Please don't be, they're ready to support it. But they were, you know, that 40 days did some damage and it was very hard because 250 was not a lot of money. But with the $500, it helps, but it has to go a long way. It also covers your healthcare and a lot of things. So we gotta play chess, not checkers. So those are strategies. We have to learn to believe our leadership. So the ones who are on strike are doing the heavy lifting for all of us. And that's what it said, the strategy of not working overtime, putting things together, making sure we're supporting our brothers and sisters who are out there. And I believe me, I've seen it as amazing. But this also helped our negotiators to go back to the table. And because they're coming out to the lines. When I was a negotiator, we didn't go to the lines. We weren't physically talking to the people. Of course I talked to the people in my plant, but that's why our negotiation, this is required of our VPs to stay active with the people, the membership. This is all strategies, a building a better union. So strike it, like I said, so everyone's ready to go, but just stay ready. As Shine said, stay ready. Your number may be called, but everyone knows strikes are still hard on people themselves too. So he's trying to also be supportive of our memberships and our brothers and sisters. Those are all strategies guys. And then it's also, I will say this, the company is noticing our strategy because they have never put out updates.  My question to them on their strategy that they want to say, where is the offer that you provided? Because if you're leaving one person behind, we're not doing it this time. There is no more behind. So our strategy is our membership. That is the strategy. Building a strong membership, building strong communities. Our research team is the best. We have looked at other industries and things that they try to villainize us because in the media, they always made the auto worker the bad worker. Not this time. Another strategy that we got ahead of the game of. Your story is not there. Everybody want to know why you CEOs are making money. No one is pointing at the auto workers. So these are all strategies to get us a good contract. These are all the strategies that we need. Yeah, thank you, LaShawn. That was so, yeah, I feel like you've touched on so many things that the UAW is doing so drastically differently from previous decades. And so thank you so much. I think now we're gonna hear from a handful of workers out there on the picket lines about the strategies they're using to build up the strike and help win the strike. And the first person we'll go to is Megan Fagan. And I'll let Megan introduce herself. And I'm gonna try to keep moving along in this section because we want to hear from every worker. So please just take a few minutes to, you know, tell us what you've been doing and, yeah. So Megan, go ahead. Megan Fagan, Toledo Jeep Local 12. One of the most easiest and inspiring things we've done is we've had convoys and we've had them a couple of them and at least in the last seven days, we started, the first one was organized just from the need of somebody saying, hey, are we gonna come through? Is somebody gonna come through and support Night Shift? And within two hours via social media, we had 10 minutes worth of cars lined up and ready to go. And it was tricky navigating the logistics and how we were gonna move it and safely was most important, moving those people through and getting them to our plans. But it was something that just grew. And it went from a two-hour planned event to then we were going up and doing one for Local 900 and then they came and did one for us with the Broncos. And it even turned into our supplemental employees wanting to show love and be a part and make a movement for their own. And the full timers went out and we blocked traffic for them so they could have a moment and show the picketers their support and that they were grateful that we were all fighting together. It's been an opportunity to not only teach, but show what the word solidarity means. It has brought everybody together in the most major way and in the simplest form. Yeah, thank you so much, Megan. And again, I just wanna remind her and we were showing a video at the beginning of the call of these convoys and I really recommend everyone to go check out that video. Yeah, the link should be in the chat we can post it again. So next we're gonna go to Cisco Garza who is at the same local, Atlantis Local 12 at the Jeep Toledo plant. So Cisco, can you tell us about what you've been doing on the picket line? Basically trying to hit every place, once a day go there to different things, hangs out with, there's a lot of my family works here at Jeep. So I go to there when they go up to do the picket line I go with them. And then I, plus I go over to Fleet because that's where I originally came from is Fleet. So I go hang out with my brothers over there and sisters over there at Fleet and just trying to keep the spirit up. I cook them breakfast, stuff like that, talk to them, trying to talk to the younger generation, what's going on, why we're fighting, show them the way so they understand what this is all about. It's not just to sit out there and about certain things you better tell them.  You guys want to get rid of the two-tier system. That's the biggest thing around here. You got to fight for everything because when you're at Jeep you're livelihoods are there. You hardly spend any time at home, you're more there. So they're like family too. So you're trying to help them out. Just like you do your brothers and sisters at home, you tell them which way to go and hopefully they follow that path for strength. And the Jeep, that's the person I came out when I went out there at 11 30, I stayed up. I was up, but I worked at 1 30 in the morning, the day before and I stayed up all the way up and waited till Sean Finn said, hey, we're going to strike Toledo Jeep. So I left here from White House, Ohio, that's 36 miles away, I mean 36 minutes away from the plant, got there before they got out of there. And that's where I came out and Lewis came up to me, I said, you know, I think, you know, and it's true because it's the best product in the world. You know, let's show these people what we really didn't get these Jeeps around the plant. Show everybody, you know, if we could do it for the Jeep Fest, we should be able to do it here in droves and show them around the country.  That's the main car of every country is Jeep, especially down in Florida, California, all over.   We're not asking a lot. We're just asking our share of fair and that's it. And looking at the younger generation and thinking about their generation beyond that. Thank you, Cisco. It's a lot of exciting stuff happening at the Salantis plant out on strike. Next, we're gonna hear from Shauna Shaw, who was at the GM plant out on strike. You wanna introduce yourself, Shauna, and what's going on at the picket line? Hi, guys, my name is Shauna Shaw. I'm a UAWD member, as well as a UAW Local 2250 member in Wentzville, Missouri. What's going on on the strike lines? Unity, it feels like a family union. It feels completely different since 2019. Our members have their boots on the ground and they're ready to go. They're chanting 40, 30, 18, 6. Corporate greed has got to go. I'm there every day. I'm an elected official. So my roles and responsibilities are a little bit different. I feel like I'm a flying squadron where I'm out to the lines, I'm out to the gates, we mobilize, we rally, we bring food, we bring drinks. It's a different feeling of uplift. It's a mess around and feign out is another one they like to yell because we can't say another word. But the atmosphere is quite amazing. I do wanna thank you for allowing me to be here. I don't know, it's a whole different atmosphere. I do truly feel people have become alive at this point in time. We're eight days into this and people aren't wavering. They know that they have leadership that's standing for them and standing with them. So that makes a huge difference. We have a massive rally tomorrow scheduled at three o'clock as well as our convoys are gonna start on Wednesday. We had to look into logistics of it and for the safety reasons. We are off of pretty, I know it says highway A but it is a pretty major highway. The camaraderie is pretty strong. We're ready to hold out until we can't. And I don't think anybody's gonna be able to say the word can't. So we're in it for the long haul and whatever is needed. We were honored to be chosen and our members are holding out. Well, thank you, Shana. That's so great to hear. It feels different from 2019. That's really- It's night and day. It's night and day. The mobility and the feeling and everybody's inspired. They're feeling heard for the first times. It's the members' demands. So when they were talking about the strategies, you feel like you're a part of it. Everybody has to say, I've never seen so many people in our parking lot listening to the announcement by President Fane where we had our whole shop committee standing around a truck and we hooked it up to the speakers of the truck because we're all working, we're all running around but it's time stood still and you're seeing everybody putting their fists up in the air and like, yeah. Just that atmosphere is completely different. It's the communication, it's the participation. We know we're making a difference and it's not just for auto workers. It is for everybody that's living paycheck to paycheck. It's not just us and we feel like we're standing out on the line making that difference for everybody. Yeah, thank you, Shauna. Yeah, y'all are making history. All right, next we're gonna go to a Ford worker at a plant that is not on strike but as Sean Fane said, you can fight just as hard if you're not on strike right now as if you were on strike. So James, do you wanna introduce yourself and tell us about practice pickets at your plant? Yes, how are you doing? I'm James from A62 KTP in Kentucky, right outside Louisville. We're here, I mean, we hear you guys up north and south and all around us and we've been ready. Like these practice pickets, they've been escalating. We've had a couple so far and the last one we had, I feel like it tripled the first one. The support we have from the community. We see Walmart and UPS drivers and their semi trucks laying on the horn when they roll by and we love it, especially when we see it from Walmart. That's not something you'll usually expect because we feel like we're talking for them too even though they're non-union and they're not going through the same thing we are, we're kind of fighting for them and maybe they can get something better in the future.  Every single day we come to work, we work hard and one of my favorite quotes is from, remember the Titans, attitude reflects leadership. So when you see us out there fired up, it's from years and years again, beat down. Our attitude is a direct result of what's happening in our leadership and how we're treated daily at work. I'm looking at forums saying, oh, we're doing mindless work, that we shouldn't deserve this. Well, when you got a first year person coming in as a 10, two to three years and they're getting the same kind of wages that people are flipping burgers at Chick-fil-A, we're tearing down our bodies. This is super hard work and people don't realize that and I challenge anyone to come do one of our jobs for half a day and tell me you're not sore. Tell me you're not hurt and beat down.  So this year it's basically a boil over from the last contract. We didn't deserve that last contract. That contract was trash. It should have been thrown out. And so we're here to fight for it this year. And I love it. Another thing, I'm just fired up right now. I'm getting chills thinking about this. I'm sorry, but I could break this table in half that I'm looking at this computer on right now because the stuff we've been going through, when I started at Ford almost eight years ago, it was like, they considered it to get in here to be a lottery. And I was just like, that's what everyone in this community look up to. Like everyone says, oh, you're at Ford. You are that person in this community. And now it just feels like we went backwards, like Fane said. When I got here, I thought they cared about us. I was like, this is the best place I've worked. We're treated, we're getting good pay. And that money's not adding up anymore. And then one day I just woke up. I saw a girl pass out because we didn't have air condition. She passed off from the heat. And the first question the supervisor asked was, can someone else do her job? I ran over to her, gave her a Gatorade as she was getting up, but he didn't check on her. He was trying to hit the line to get a starter going. And that doesn't sit right with me. That's some morality issues and that's where your attitude reflects leadership. And that's not just dependent on that supervisor, but it's also dependent on what he's hearing on his walkie from the headquarters and CEOs, because they're on them the same way our supervisors are on us. So we got to fight for this. And some of our supervisors, they might not say it, but we know and they might say it behind the walls, but they're fighting with us. Thank you, James. You got me kind of emotional too. Okay, that was a great group of workers we just heard from. We're gonna hear from a few more before we go to Q&A. So members of Unite All Workers for Democracy, the Reform Caucus that propelled Sean Fain, LaShawn and our current reform leadership into office. And is now organizing to build the strike and supporting workers who are organizing 10-minute meetings, practice pickets, rallies, refusal of voluntary overtime. So turn it over to Scott Holdeson to start. And Scott, you wanna introduce yourself and explain what UAW is doing now. Well, first of all, thank you to the 170 people that have joined to learn about the UAW strike. My name's Scott Holdeson. I am a worker at Ford Chicago Assembly Plant. I chair the Steering Committee for UAW DM, one of the founding members. I wanna thank you, give a big thank you to Labor Notes for inspiring us for years to keep this movement alive until the moment was there for us. But what UAWD has been doing to prepare for the contract campaign, we started back in the early summer preparing for this contract campaign. Basically, as soon as the bargaining convention was over, we started organizing for teaching what a contract campaign is because it was foreign auto workers. We held workshops, we held online workshops. Those were first, we did online contract campaign trainings and then we transitioned to in-person contract campaign trainings and taught the people that were watching the video presentations to do them in person with their co-workers and start building those escalating tactics to put pressure on the companies. Can you hear me all right, Lisa? Yeah. Okay, just wanted to make sure. Okay, and so we were building the escalating tactics way back in the beginning of the summer when the international was trying to get consensus on what kind of a contract campaign they were gonna get behind. We got out in front of it and started pushing it from the ground up. So we had a ground up strategy and then we went into sending out informational leaflets basically to agitate members about what had been given up over the years, what they had lost compared to what the companies could afford to give us. And those started to get members excited about a contract campaign and then we started doing trainings on 10 minute meetings. And the next speaker is gonna tell you about how those 10 minute meetings really came all together in the local 862. But we learned from the teamsters at UPS how to practice pick it. Their contract expired, was sent to expire July 31st and we got out there on their practice pickets and learned from them and took those lessons back to our membership. Then since the strike has happened, we've been working on organizing, playing squadrons, getting members to support the picket lines and we have a pledge and online pledge to refuse voluntary overtime. And we're continuing to support the contract campaigns and locals that are not on strike, encouraging them to continue with the practice pickets, continue with the rallies and just keep building the pressure on the companies to win us a great contract. Cause we all know that the power of the union comes from the shop floor. It does not come at the bargaining table. The bargaining table receives their power from us. So the more prepared we are, the better deal they're gonna get. And I wanna say their names. We've touched out a lot on Sean Fane, but let's not forget the rest of the UAW members United, Slate, Margaret Mock, Secretary Treasurer, Mike Booth, Vice President, Rich Boyer, Vice President, LaShawn English is here with us today. Thank you LaShawn, Dan Vincente in region nine and Brandon Mancia in region nine eight. I'm just so thrilled with the performance that they've all been doing for our union. And I'm gonna wrap it up and send it back to Lisa. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you Scott. I believe Scott may be calling from the plant. So thank you for taking the time to call in today, Scott. That was very well said. One more thing. So you mentioned the refusal of voluntary overtime, this pledge, UAW relating. I understand it's really taking off. A lot of workers in the plants right now are choosing to refuse voluntary overtime and coordinating with their coworkers to refuse it. So as to, you know, not do the boss any favors right now. So I'm gonna turn over to Chris Budnick. Chris, you wanna introduce yourself and, you know, tell us how the 10 minute meetings are going. Absolutely. I might throw a couple extra plugs in there, but my name is Chris Budnick from local 862, Ford Kentucky truck plant. I'm also co-chair of the steering committee of UAWD. Yeah, I just wanna plug in like that, just a little bit about my history of being, I've had to go through four plants with Ford, three in Michigan and then in 2016, I moved to Kentucky. I've been with Ford and UAW for 11 years and I'm super excited. Just overwhelmed with how much progress we've made as a union and as a membership. But I like to touch on, you know, tears a little bit before I go into my 10 minute meetings. You know, that's the number one issue for me. I'm a living, breathing concession. I'm what was given up so that the big three can make it through the bankruptcy, right? And the thing is, is the plant I was at before was Sterling Axle and it really hit home yesterday when I found out that they're gonna come to parody Sterling Axle, they're the tier three, I call them. Cause they only made it, you know, 24 bucks an hour after eight years, which is crazy.  So as Scott was saying, you know, with the 10 minute meetings at our plant, at my plant, I just started, just started. I didn't think about it. I just kind of went with an example format for an agenda and started asking folks to come on into the break room before work and then let's go. So 16 people showed up to my first meeting and I was nervous, you know, but it's not a big deal. I just went with the agenda, worked it all out and now I run these meetings every single week and I did them all throughout the plant, throughout my department. Sometimes I do surprise meetings. I'll just show up, especially with skill trades.   But my main purpose was, you know, I used UPS as an example, the Teamsters, what they've been doing with the practice pickets. I was getting everyone ready for that, but the main thing, the easiest thing folks can do, wear red on Wednesday, you know, wear the strike button every day. And it's such a great thing to see folks in the plant wearing red on Wednesday. And then there's a lot of folks that are just wearing the buttons every single day. I'm like, this is amazing. And then, you know, the 10 minute meetings progressed and they built, I think the most I've had was 26 folks in my, you know, meeting.   And then the, but for us, we haven't had that much time. It's new to us. Contract campaign, we got to get everything up and rolling. As Brother James White said, you know, we've been doing practice pickets and all that. And this strategy allows us to use the rest of those tools in the toolbox, you know, and if we get to that last tool where we have to all go out, so be it. We'll see where we are there. So, but one thing I want to mention about the something I realized yesterday is that all these years, all these contracts, I've only been through a couple of contracts, but a pattern contract was always shoved down our throat. You know, Ford was never first. It was always shoved down the members' throat. And having Sean Fain leading and encouraging engagement of the membership, making this all happen, we're all making this happen together, you know, for once in our lives, the membership is shoving down. I was basically going to end up shoving a pattern contract down GM and Stellantis throat. If Ford ends up getting a really good contract first, you know what I'm saying? So that's huge. That's a big, the ties have turned. It's wonderful. I'm excited for it to see what happens next, but that's kind of like what I see. And I'll leave it at that. Thank you so much. Thanks, Chris. That's just, I don't know. It's great to see, I don't know, people feeling happy about the progress being made at Ford. Next we'll go to Mary in Buffalo. Mary, you wanna tell us about practice pickets and rallies at your local? Sure. My name is Mary Host. I'm from Buffalo Stamping Plant, local 897 Ford. We've had several practice pickets at our location. We've had one for each shift. We just had people come out. They could ask questions. We did like a practice walkout and we all carried our signs and the amount of people beeping their horns was amazing. And then that leads into like we had, we answered people's questions, which there's so many rumors out on the floor. So that was an important part of that practice picket was answering people's questions. But then we went back into the plant and everybody is talking about it. Everybody's talking about the practice picket. Everybody's talking about the contract. It has the consensus in the plant seems to be one of backing up Sean Fain finally. And we were also a little upset that we didn't go on strike, but we do know that that is part of the strategy and we are waiting in case we need to. As far as the rallies go, we are scheduled, I think we're scheduled to do one next week. We haven't finalized our plans yet, but I feel like the practice pickets were, the knowledge and the education of people is the most important thing that we as a union can do. And I think that that was, whoever came up with the practice picket idea is a genius. So that's pretty much what I have to say, but it has opened up the lines of communication immensely in our plant. Yeah, thank you, Mary. I think we can thank the teamsters for inspiring a lot of UAW members to take this on. And I think everyone has been so insightful about just why it's so important to have these actions leading strike. And even if your plant is in a strike, like why these actions are so important, they're building up the membership and education and communication and the readiness. So speaker, before we go to Q&A, is Marcy Pedraza. Marcy, you wanna tell us about practice pickets at your local? Hi, yes, so thanks for having me. Labor Notes has been following for years now. And first I wanna give a shout out and solidarity to all my UAW family that's on the picket line right now.  And I like to say I'm still standing ready to walk out if we have to. Like she said, my name is Marcy Pedraza. I'm an electrician. I've been a union electrician 24 years, but I first started in UAW. I'm also a member of UAWD. I started 10 years ago. I worked at the time Fiat Chrysler at Belvedere Assembly Plant. And then I've been at Ford Chicago Assembly Plant for seven years, local 551. And I just wanna get on some of the issues first that we're still wondering about with Ford anyway, but like the pensions, I don't think that's been announced yet. What's going on with that? I'm sure we'll hear something soon. I hope retirement healthcare, shorter work weeks, everyone's burned out, like working almost every day, 10, 12 hour shifts. And as for me as an environmental activist, I like to see a just transition to EVs. That's something that's important too. These plants aren't organized yet. And green jobs should be union jobs. So as far as organizing, I first started with just passing out campaign literature for a contract campaign. And then with the buttons and the stickers, and the next thing I know, people are asking me, hey, do you have any more buttons or where do you get these buttons from when we ran out at some point? And then we were doing strike trainings at the hall and we did like two or three of them I think and everyone got bigger and bigger, like more people are coming out, people were asking questions, like even the people that didn't go, like can you do, can you post it online? Can you do a Zoom? And then we were doing, we've had three practice pickets so far and they also were getting bigger and bigger, like we've had local electeds from our alderman all the way up to US Congress representatives coming out, Reverend Jesse Jackson came to our union meeting. And so yeah, safe to say that people are fired up, definitely in Chicago. And I'm just coming from the, we had our region four women's conference in Ottawa, Illinois. And we were watching the live stream yesterday morning and everybody's on edge. I've heard that it's kind of like, waiting for the draft, like who's gonna get picked next. And so just great to see like, that people are interested and just waiting for these updates, the transparency has been great. And as one, somebody was saying earlier, like this is not just about UAW, it's about all workers. And then just watching that video again in the beginning of this meeting that really resonated with me about the Jeep because I have a Jeep, I bought it 10 years ago. I was proud to use my discount from Chrysler. And now every time my car makes a noise, I'm dreading like, oh, I don't wanna have to buy a new car because they're so expensive. And even with the little discount we have, I don't think I can make that extra payment a month. So people have been saying like our wages have been stagnant, but in reality, they've been going backwards. So again, thank you for having me. Thank you, Marcy. So that was great. We've heard from so many rank and filers. And now we're gonna open it up to Q&A and we have a bunch of questions. I've been taking a quick look at them. And I think let's start with Lorenzo's question. So I'll read that out loud for those who haven't seen it. Are the UAW workers being educated that the eyes of America are on them? We are rooting for your victory because your victory is our victory. So, and this is a question for anyone if you wanna jump in and answer our UAW members aware that all eyes are on them. Oh, we're fully aware. We have news crews around the clock outside of our gates trying to get into our hall. And we know this issue is not just auto workers. We know it's the rank and file of every American. I don't know anybody that's not living paycheck to paycheck. I don't know anybody that doesn't have to pick up more shifts and work a little bit harder and work a little bit harder. And it makes me so emotional to think that this is acceptable, that the society that we are in, that this is acceptable. We should not have to kill ourselves any longer to live like this. It's not just us. It is everybody and the UAW, yes, it has always set that standard. It has always set that benchmark. And that's why they are fighting us tooth and nail. And that's why we will continue to fight back into our last breath, into the last breath that I can scream because it's not just about me.  But the reality is, is she going to be able to? If we continue the way things are right now, that is not a possibility. That's why we are fighting. It is not just for us. It is for all. I'm tired of seeing women and men struggle at the grocery store just as I am because they can't afford their groceries, that they can't afford their bills. It's not just our issue, it's society's issue. But the difference is when they ask me that question, I tell them that the UAW members are tired and we're taking a stance. And they could join us. And if they don't believe in our 40% wage increases or how do they get that, I tell them they can join a union because we're the ones that are gonna be fighting.  And we're gonna be allowing them to watch us because we are gonna set that standard for America. Because when the international made those signs that says saving the American dream, that is exactly what we are doing.  It's so huge, it's blocks around. You see, not only our people see it, but our city of Toledo sees it. They come out and droves support us. They beat porns, we got the fire department, we got Toledo police coming by us, beeping the horns, dang.  They're not just saying for, they're not saying Chrysler, they're not saying GM, it's the UAW. It's all three. And that's what makes this very historic on the point. If you look at reality, it's never really been done that all three went out at one time. Everybody's seeing it, and we're not just seeing it here in Toledo. We're seeing it over there, and we're fords that, we're GMs that. You see it across seas.  Everybody's coming out supporting us. You know, that's the best part about this. That's what everybody talks about. I know here at Jeep, that's what we talk about. We're in the pick lines, walking, doing the thing that we got to do. Everybody's talking about it, and they're seeing how, hey, did you see CNN was here? Did you hear on the news that Selantis here and Jeep, you see about Jeep, how they're bringing up the Jeep? You know, that's what all the younger generations finally getting to see with the like, I ain't saying I'm old, but you know, I've been with the old timers. I've been where Parkway is before it got destroyed. So I got to see the first hand where everything was hand manual labor. And then you come here and it's more economical. You know, I see the difference in between the two. And that's where I try to educate the younger generation. Hey, this is what it's like. If you guys don't change, you've got to fight before what you want. And that's where the eyes and the world comes on you. And they don't understand the hours we put in. Like here to our plant, you got people that works 10 hours. Then you got the mechanics. They work from 12 to 16 hours, seven days a week. And then like with COVID strike, everybody was at home, but the mechanics painters were all in and mill rights were all in working that, you know, and that's what people don't understand. That's the kind of lifestyle we got to deal with. And we're willing to do it to help our families out and make our thing. I'm, my uncle was in first, I was second.  So you're talking generations here of people, each one, not only here in Chrysler for GM, just like the one guy was talking about, and I'm sitting there like, wow, they're talking about the management, how all that is. We got the same thing here at Chrysler. They're dealing with the same thing down there in Ford. You know, and that kind of hits reality, you know, it seems like everybody's the same. And that's what I'm saying, you know, so we do understand, we see it all. Yeah. Thank you, Sisk. I just wanna maybe get a couple more perspectives on this.  Can I respond to that? Lisa? That was the shot. Can you hear me? Yeah, I was gonna give Megan a chance first.  Yeah, I don't, okay. No, it's fine. My connection might be. Oh, I was gonna say, that's okay, Lisa, because it was, it broke up a little bit. But they are very aware, and that's why they are standing strong and they're energetic. And when Sean touched on that, this whole thing is different than it's ever been done before, right? Gone are, now are the times where, yes, we're on the line with our music and we're cooking food for each other and we're really making it family style and we're keeping the energy high. And we want the world to see us, to know and understand that this is a fight, this absolutely is a fight and one we're not taking lightly, but we are out there and we are strong and we are going to bring a good energy and be in solidarity with our city and with ourselves and we're showing that we can be out here on a positive vibe at all times. Oh, thank you, Megan. And yeah, LaShawn, go for it. Now, what I was just gonna add to it on another note, as being a director, so some of the things to make sure that the membership was aware is that I made sure we had training and I did media training. And I expressed to my membership because this is the time that you want everyone to talk. We were taught to don't let this person, don't let this, no, everyone needs to tell their story, that's how you hear. So I think that as people were telling their story, because I can't say in the beginning, I did go on a couple of, and it was still a lack of education on some areas where we went. I'm not gonna talk, I can say more areas of leadership was more aggressive. And the more aggressive, like 551, some of your locations out here at Toledo, presidents and stuff and some of those locations were very good locations. And when the world is start watching us, is they're at all the picking lines. I mean, you cannot go nowhere that the media is not following you. And then when I will say three times at the rally that we had in Michigan, we had people from everywhere in the world there.  So if you don't know, or we had people from Mexico because which we met at Labor Notes two years ago, I mean, what a year ago in Chicago, they came up to our rallies and they came to the picket lines. So I think as we see in our, so this was so different about this time is that our people are out there, we're on the news. So I think that helps us to be more aware because again, if you were, most of us in the auto plant we have went to sleep. So you know, you still like, is this real? Is this, you know, how does this feel? We still didn't think the world really concerned about us. And I think the more realness it feel because there's no time that I can't turn on the news. There's no time that I don't see one of you guys on a UAW international website. I don't, if I couldn't click on the X, you know, the Twitter or something, we're out there in positive numbers. So I think that also make us self-conscious of where that we're being watched. We're being watched. We're being watched and it's in a good way. And I think that we want, and the leadership shining us as we continue to say, not just the auto workers, it's all workers. And I will say this about labor notes, it's the best conference that I've ever been in, I've been to. It teaches you that you see outside your box. And we do have to start caring about each other. So I think as he said, watching the world, I think just knowing that each one of you guys, the things that you guys are doing, it lets me know that we are worried about the rest of the world. So teach one, grab one. I love it. I really do. I do. So we are worried. We are here. And the guy on there tell him, we are. We're ready to help everyone. Sorry about that, Lisa. I'm like, I get passionate. It's like, you make it in the shadows. This is a different kind of feel. I mean, it's just a feel of pride. I don't know. I don't know how to explain it. It's just amazing. I don't know. It's amazing. Lisa, can I say something? Yeah, sure. I just want to say that I don't know if everyone can see. There are a bunch of questions that I'm just trying to keep on top of it. I think we're going to get to like a couple more. So sorry to everyone whose questions aren't going to get answered. But I'm just going to, so after Shana goes, I'm just going to try to get to a couple more. Go ahead. This is just real quick. The reality is, is we actually have communication this time and it's not hush hush. So the world is seeing what's going on and they are hearing what's going on. And that gives us a power and that gives us a voice because they're finally seeing what we're actually dealing with and the realities of the truth of our contracts and what has happened and what we have given up. And then they see that we're just like them. We're no longer on this pedestal. They have the reality that we're just like them. So I think that the world does need to watch us. And I think we do need to tell our stories, just like what Shana English said, it's very important that we speak our truths. So thank you. Thank you, Shana. All right, so we got a number of questions on the same general theme of how supporters outside the UAW can help. We got a question about, is it possible to donate to the UAW strike fund? To my knowledge, I think it's not we got a question, but please correct me if I'm wrong. We got questions about, how can I find the closest picket line to me? So earlier, we shared in the chat this map showing where all the picket lines are. We can reshare that. And I was wondering if anyone might want to just want to answer that question. And then we'll move on to another question after that. Well, my best suggestion would be to call the locals and ask what they need. We've been, I know at local 12, we've received huge support from the community. They are constantly asking us, what do you guys need? We don't know.  It's a big restaurant here, even though it's locally owned. And we went and picked them up and just took them out to the line and passed them out to whoever wanted them. And that's something that I know they love and it makes them feel supported. Just bringing anything to the line and just handing it out to people, they'll always take it, will always be appreciative. And then if you're not sure, please go ahead and give our locals a call and they can direct you better on anything that our current needs might have. Well, thank you, Megan. So, region one, we got to think of me because our Blue Cross, so I will say this and the public has been very good with the Big Three, but we also have other people that are on strike like the Blue Cross, Blue Shield. And this is also affecting our IPS plans, which a lot of people may not know. So that hurt and they're not, they only get unemployment, so they're not receiving a lot of money. So I would suggest, like I said, I have a lot of politicians dropped off, but some of your regions also are setting up, I would say region one, I'm gonna speak on region one. We also started food pantry and a lot of our members go to Costco's and just have the Costco drop it off at the region. So anything, but I'm agree with Megan, please go to the local halls and call the local halls and do that. It's nice to drop off food on the line, but I will say, please be very cautious of some of the lines when you're doing it because some of the areas are on high traffic. So, and it's easier to drop it off at the local because we have strike captains who will give you the ability to make sure that people get what they need. Because a lot of times when people are on the line, they're just on the line and we have captains, but region one has on our website, a list of things that a lot of members need. And like I said, Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan and Lansing, Grand Rapids and Detroit areas on strike and there it takes them, people may not remember, it takes them 20 years to get the top wages guys, 20 years. So I mean, so if you wanna give, look at the list, but I also advise you to go to the local union halls. That is the best way. Okay, so just thank you LaShon. Just to summarize some of what people have said, you know, reach out to your, the closest. So we just posted the map of the, the live map of the picket lines and the UAW locals on strike right now in the chat. So reach out to them. Many pickets are running 24-7. So organizing groups of people to go out onto the picket lines and bringing needed supplies. So the UAW strike fund is not accepting donations, a way to support some of this organizing that's happening that we talked about is to donate to UAWD, which is helping a lot of workers right now organize practice pickets, meetings and refuse voluntary over time. And I think let's just do one more question since we're running a little long. So, you know, one thing we've touched on a lot, but I don't think we've really directly asked everyone. So what are some of the top, and we have a lot of questions about this, what are some of the top issues in the contract that, you know, you'd be looking for, hopefully to vote on it in a tentative agreement. And I want to start with James, if you want to answer that, James. Okay, so Fane mentioned, trying to get these 32 hour work weeks where it's kind of confusing. I think a lot of people believe they're thinking we're gonna only work 32 hours, I guess what, not even three days a week, but I think it's more or less that we're gonna get over time after 32 hours because we've worked so much. A lot of people don't realize we're not like a normal nine to five. So if we're going in at 6 a.m., I don't know where the other plants do. We go in at 6 a.m. here and we get off with the potential of about 5.30 to 6 p.m. That means I live two minutes, two to five minutes from work. A lot of these people live an hour from work and then you factor in traffic, that means they're up at the crack of dawn. I mean 3.30, 4 in the morning on the way to commuting to work. Who's taking their kids to school? Who's getting their kids on the bus stop and getting them ready? And what about these single parents who can't get their kids to daycare so they gotta hire someone? And like for my instance, I don't have family in Kentucky. My girlfriend does, so we got grandma here, but not everyone has these things to fall back on to take care of their kids. And then with the JCPS school system, the bus is messing up this year. The first week or two of school, the buses were running so late, they weren't even, the kids didn't even get home until 10 p.m. So just imagine the amount of time you're getting with your kid and the amount of time you get with your kid directly, it directly impacts your community. I mean, when kids don't get enough attention, I come home, I'm 6 p.m., 7 p.m., I'm standing on my feet. I've been on my feet since 4 in the morning almost and now my kids wanting this, wanting to do this, wanting to do that, wants to play, wants, and you're exhausted. And so we're just trying to do things where we can get more time with our family and get back to being a family. There's so much thing going into work. And a lot of us, like another thing in my instance, a lot of me, like I and a lot of people on my team worked several other jobs. So I've been two jobs about the last 15 years. So I'm working six days a week. My kid's having a birthday party right now. So after this call, I'm going straight to a birthday party. And then I'm going straight back to work tonight, but it's just, we want to be able to enjoy the fruits of our labor. They want to give us just the labor and no fruit. So it's hard to get time off. Like we want to be able to enjoy what we do too. We don't want to just every day work, work, work. We want to have a life. So that's just one thing I wanted to pitch in. I can comment on that too, actually, cause I mean, that's something very important to me. You know, as a working mom, one parent household, you know, like you said, we just want more time with our families. You know, we shouldn't be living at work. We should be living at home. And like, you know, it's just crazy.   So we need to be able to take care of our families. Bottom line. All right. I think we're gonna move toward wrapping this up. This has been a really amazing call. We've heard about how, you know, this is not just for UAW members, it's for our whole communities and for workers around the US and the world. So with that in mind, I'm just gonna screen share this map again so everyone can get a visual of all the facilities that are out on strike right now. It's really from coast to coast. Okay, there we go. It's from coast to coast, you know, so not just in Michigan or the Midwest and who knows, maybe it'll escalate even further than that. So, you know, the link to the live map has been shared a few times in the chat. Please take a look at, you know, where the picket lines closest to you are and make an effort to go out and support the workers. When UAW workers stand up, we're all standing up with them. So with that, I really wanna thank, again, all of our amazing UAW workers and panelists for joining us today and all the participants from around the world who joined us and the link to the recording will be available, it'll be up on our website and we'll make sure to share it out. So thank you again and we'll wrap up now and, you know, we'll see you all on the picket lines and let everyone get back to their organizing. So solidarity. Solidarity. Solidarity. Solidarity. Solidarity. Solidarity. Solidarity, thank you. Thank you. Solidarity. Thank you, everyone.


I was reading for pleasure the other week, a fantastic edited collection called Senses' Surveys and Privacy edited by Martin Bulmer in 1979. The arguments that I read in that book, which is now 36 years ago, are still many of the arguments that are being brought out about the protection of data now. There's a lot that hasn't been done and also I think in terms of our law making we are starting to look quite regressive. The EU regulation is probably the tip of this legal iceberg that is going to make things more and more difficult in the future. But you don't want to hear from me, you want to hear something more and challenge our speakers on the issues that they've raised so far. So, I'm going to hand a microphone to somebody who's going to rhoave with it. Chris Martin of Crystallize. Can I ask Andrew a question? You mentioned something about enabling predictive analytics while harnessing new methods to enable predictive analytics whilst protecting data. And I wonder if you had any more information as to how that, this seems to be the big issue that we're grappling with and if there are methods being developed. I think it's what you do with it, isn't it? The classic example that is often referred to, is it the LAPD or NYPD, where actually through the predictive analytics you end up in a situation whereby you are sort of almost identifying communities and you know sometimes by further inference individuals who are also types of people who are those people who you are saying are likely to commit more crime. And that is a dangerous thing that crosses various ethical boundaries. So, I think that's probably what I was referring to. A sort of probabilistic analysis that leads to a situation where you are with a degree of surety and certainty targeting individuals almost around things with which they don't want to be associated and with which they have a right not to be associated. So, the other side of the coin to that same question. Can I not use those same predictive analysis to make my case for resources for my community? Thank you. So, Jackie Carter University of Manchester. I was in a meeting recently in Manchester, Northern Powerhouse up there, where local authority people were desperate to get their hands on data, join it up in the way you were describing. And really keen to acquire the skills to be able to interpret that and gain insight and do something useful locally. So, my question, which I tweeted earlier, is, but who pays? So, you know, we have this fantastic infrastructure supported by the ESRC and others for researchers, but at the local level this challenge seems to me to be who pays for that at a time of restricted budgets. And I'm not suggesting any of you have the answer here, but I'd be really interested in your thoughts given the conversation and the narrative around the public good. Well, I think in the spending review we did have an opportunity to kind of bring together some of the kind of digital and data capability in local government. Unfortunately, the investment's not there. You know, government's announced 1.8 billion in investment in digital transformation in central government. Unfortunately, it's going to be an even tighter financial settlement for local government, and it doesn't seem like there's all that much money there to kind of fund that kind of capability building that you mentioned. But it's really important. It's really, really important. I'll have to give my two peneth as well. It's something I feel super keenly. You know, I've got a traditional analytics function. I work in the Greater London Authority, which in comparison to those 33 borers who I've just described is broken, is a feather-bedded environment actually. You know, I'm not on the front line doing service delivery in the way that they are, and I sort of fully acknowledge that. And we need the invest to save models around, you know, these wonderful things that we talk about, you know, in sort of relatively attractive rhetoric. And in some cases they're just not there yet, and somebody needs to take a bit of a leap of faith. One of the things that I am thinking about at the moment with people in the borers though, which might free up some capacity, is around traditional IT infrastructure actually. There are 33 server rooms out there in London, all of which are consuming vast amounts of energy, all of which cost a lot of money, and all of which have large teams of staff operating them. There's an ugly truth in there that they need not exist in such quantity. There's that thing called the cloud in which you can put a lot of this data, and in which you can start to harmonise some of this data in the way that the various amongst us have spoken about. That has the potential to drive significant savings, as simple as that. It's almost a politically attractive thing, I think, the degree to which, sorry, the savings that we could potentially be talking about. But through that you need to be saying we want to add an analytical layer over the top of that data harmonisation and infrastructure rationalisation. And it's through that that you get some money to actually do some of the stuff that you're talking about. And it's a shame Paul isn't here to talk about his big windfall in the spending round, and how he proposes to make sure that, well, a significant chunk of that trickles down to local authorities, because I would argue that it's there where there are the biggest gains to be made. Central government has had its bite of the cherry now, and I think it's in local government where you can exercise, well, some financial generosity and get some significant gains. Hi, my name is Jansef Jamal, and I'm here this evening interested from a variety of angles really. I did postgraduate quantitative study, and thank you to the ESRC for the funding. I've since been working in the private sector, but I'm also a local councillor, interesting following on from the last question. And it's so true there is such a desperate need for data. And it was interesting to hear, Andrew, some of the things that you were saying. In addition to the skills and the analysis, there's also, I think, a challenge with regards to interpretation of data and what we're seeing. So just to give you a very quick example, I chair a committee. We set up a group recently looking at child sexual exploitation issues, looking to sort of see what are the processes in place. Are we trying to be capturing these things as effectively as we can? And I was with some colleagues, and we were presented with some data by the local police force. And one of my colleagues said, I like that bar. And it was actually a comparison of different boroughs across London. And one of my colleagues looked at one of the bars from one of the boroughs and said, I like that bar. That looks nice compared with what it was showing for our area. And I said to be very careful here because we cannot know. Is this correct? Is this not correct? Is one area, you know, the data might have been collected very accurately. The data might not be so accurate in another area in terms of what does good look like. So I think there are a lot of challenges. My question was going to be more about, I mean a number of you mentioned the public policy challenges with regards to sort of, you know, the long term, a lot of processes in the infrastructure in place to get to I think where we'd all like to get to is going to be a long term project. And one of the things that frustrates me about the political process is that it can be a very short term vision that politicians have. So I was wondering to what extent are you hopeful that actually we can sort of collectively put that long term process in place? Well, I was going to pick up on the first half of a question to start with. A child sexual exploitation is a perfect example of an area in which freelancers aglomerate local data into national figures with very little guarantee that that national figure is actually accurate. And you can't blame them for wanting to do it. This is the MSPCC, an annual report. It gets quite a lot of press. It takes FOI requests to all police authorities, which usually come with an explicit disclaimer saying there's no guarantee that's comparable to any other police authority and aggregates it up. There is a huge risk in that. And if you compare that to the careful process that crime figures go through in order to be nationally published, we can see why there is value in data being properly managed and properly checked for its accuracy in the real world. On the other hand, you are getting a higher resolution picture from these lower quality figures. So there is a real problem here about where we invest in the data chain is not just storage. It's how we manage it, how we quality assure it, how we analyse it and then how we present it and make it useful to decision makers. Whether decision makers means us as voters or ministers or police commissioners and so on and so forth. On the, am I an optimist question? Absolutely, yes I am. Our world is being transformed by the intelligent use of data. It's also being transformed by the unintelligent use of data, but we're doing our best to stem that tide. I think one of the biggest challenges there is overselling and I am so bored of hearing data people claim things can be more dramatic than they will be. They can be faster than they would be. Whether it's a technical oversell or a political oversell, it's just boring and it's been done for too long and it is actually deeply damaging. So if we all agree that we are on a long term journey here and we all of us know that some of these things will only be sold when some IT systems get so obsolescent that we finally have to be paid to be replaced, then we need to actually start making that pitch I think because utopianism is useful and not entirely misplaced, but some more realism about what the journey looks like has its place as well I think. Yes, and to echo this, I mean I'd say I'm partly optimistic just because I can't help it. I'm just an optimistic sort of person which I think is useful in this area. It's never going to be an area that's going to get 6 million people really excited. You're just not going to find that many people writing their local MP saying can you please give some more money to local authorities in general for this in the way that you saw with the recent discussions over benefit changes. It just doesn't happen, but I will observe that it is a small P political process and I say that without any lack of sympathy for particularly local authorities which really have been injured so it's all very well us all knowing it might save money in the medium term but up front there's an investment and I say that simply because in my previous role trying to get money out of central government which did better and I saw how hard my analytic colleagues in central government were running just to stay still and it's not just a fairytale that they didn't always have the resources to get data sets deposited or whatever in time so it is a small P political process but that's why I do come back and say it's not just for us it's for up here or data analysts professionally but for those of you in a wider world to think about if there is a public benefit to some of these things and again it's not polarized by saying we don't care about confidentiality it is about saying well we need to be writing letters we need to be signing the welcome trust from different organizations it's really important it's not just medical researchers that are saying this will really affect research so I do think it's partly about creating a climate that says we can do better for citizens if we do this A couple of observations I used to work in that dark satanic mill that's come up a couple of times tonight called Morrie so then Paige used to tell me if it's interesting it's wrong repeatedly so it sort of responds to Bill's points as well about people overselling and misrepresenting things there's an awful lot of that around this thing called big data I'll leave that there but my main substantive response to your question is it's really interesting to look at the states and to look at city governments in a place like Chicago or New York of which had data litter of mayors still has one in Chicago called Rami Manuel and there's a guy there called Tom Schenk who is their chief data officer and you know they have a chief technology officer as well and these debates whilst not central to the next mayoral election in London because we'll talk about housing rightly so and transport and other things like that that need to be supported by a proper debate underpinned by proper analysis but those are highly professionalized and political roles in the states and the most important P there is political Tom Schenk has made data a political thing it is something that is brought to the cabinet table or the equivalent thereof in a city like Chicago and nothing happens without a proper thoroughgoing analysis of the data at their disposal and these are seriously qualified people doing this and I think we need to move towards something similar in our own city as well Chris Martin Chris, I'm from a healthcare and bioinformatics background I work with the finance industry quite a lot and recently did some work with the longevity science panel on a report on this topic and one of the big issues was this definition of the public good so the pensions industry so I do longevity modelling and the pensions industry need to make estimates of how long people live using aggregate analysis of individual data there is an issue about access to this data now they are very strongly of the view that they are providing a public good and that lack of access to this data means that we spend more our pensions become more expensive now I wanted to know what's the panel's views on what this definition of the public good actually is cos it's hard to find out and what are the key principles that should be the deciding factors in what is and what is not a legitimate public good If you ask me do I think there is an airtight philosophical a priori definition of public good my answer is I'm a social scientist and I don't believe that what I do think is important is that there is an independent assessment which would include scientific peer review but also include some lay review that says is this in the public good and is it proportionate and I hate I can't help it, I'm going to do anything I'm going to mention carodata but I think frankly that was one of the issues there was not having an independent review that says was selling these data to health insurance companies so that they could more accurately set premiums is that in the public good or not now I know many economists who had argued that one way and I know some economists and a few other people who might argue it another so I'm not going to give you my answer to that but I am going to say you need a proper scrutiny process and it seems to me that's why it pains to say much social science data already does this and again I'm not saying it couldn't be strengthened but it does actually take seriously is this going to be the public good but one key indicator is publishing not only your findings but kind of how you reach them so that if people want to challenge that and say well actually you've used silly algorithms or you've made heroic assumptions that can become itself part of a matter of public debate so I absolutely agree with what you're saying about the use of these data for premiums you wouldn't want to rule out I think all commercial use as not being in the public good but what I'm very sure about is locking something up so that big business which transcends all these boundaries can actually share data and public policy and local services can't does seem to me asymmetrically not in the public good I think one of the questions to ask is what's the public view of what a public good is and how detailed is the understanding of an individual when they give up certain data about the uses that it will be put to and the controls that they have on that so I'll give you some examples so we're doing some research at the moment looking at consent and you know we could give people some very very detailed options we could give them 42 check boxes you know I consent for this to be used for academic research but not for commercial purposes I consent for this to be used for healthcare planning but not for insurance companies you could start to give some of those granular permissions what we've found so far is actually people kind of make some very sophisticated trade-offs don't underestimate the public understanding of some of this stuff but equally I think going to that extreme of 42 check boxes I think that would be another extreme of overwhelming people with something that is quite a difficult concept to get across so I agree I don't think there is a definition of what a public good is I think there are complex issues around identity and trust and consent and there's a public perception and public debate that we've got to have over the next few years I'd say as this becomes a bigger part of all our lives we're not there yet I suppose I'd make a couple of observations one is that I wholeheartedly agree and I say this on instinct rather than on evidence that the casual, careless and utterly heartbreaking destruction of trust by care.data frames this debate I think for me and for patients to feel betrayed by the NHS is a terrifying starting point for having a sensible debate about what we do with data in the future and that's compounded by the fact that Parliament is and I say this having worked in a non-party political capacity there for a while terrible at legislating in any area with rapidly changing technology we know this and we proved it four century after century with communications technology and with biology and data will hit and is hitting exactly the same barriers and that's why I wonder if there isn't a role because every time I have a conversation about data it gets forked in very short order the level of confusion the level of nonsense around big data as Andrew hinted not very long ago and lots of other aspects of data is so high that I wonder if there isn't a role for a similar process that we went through in the context of human fertilisation, embryology, Bill and Axe where Baroness Warnock was commissioned to do a report which has provided the underpinning for the legislation in that very fast and complex area of technology ever since where she provided the intellectual distinctions that have remained current even as technology changed and the Nuffield Council for Bioethics has had a similar role in providing an intellectual framework for some of these conversations which I feel is missing in the conversations I have and I hear about data so I wonder if we don't need it if I can borrow their name and take it in vain a Nuffield Council of Information Ethics where people try to create a framework of concepts and distinctions which will remain even as the technology changes around us so yes there needs to be a public debate and yes ultimately this is a question for the public and not for anyone to hand down but actually framing that debate and providing a useful intellectual framework for it is a task that I haven't seen anyone really step up to either that or I'm just not keeping up to speed and one moderate suggestion is if I can have a bank statement why can't I have a statement of everybody accessing my data because if I have that, that level of transparency even retrospectively will provide an awful lot of accountability for uses which we find acceptable and in a sense there will be a way of as things tend to things levelling out over time but actually the way your data disappears and you don't know about the uses prevents that levelling out process and raises the stakes of that initial consent to such a high extent that I'm not sure is entirely helpful or as Dan was suggesting solvable I've been involved in some discussions recently within the OECD about data philanthropy and the relationship between how individuals might offer their data towards things and get some form of reward for it and this is all to me to my old fashioned mind this is almost as bad as trying to think about the monetisation of data but it does demonstrate that there is a really straightforward public belief and this is a majority that data can be used for good I won't say the public good necessarily and I prefer to use the word public benefit because just publishing research is in the public benefit so I think there are challenges there were challenges 30 years ago we've got some way we do have access to some data we have access to quite a lot trying to join up is the message that I'm getting here trying to join up some of the things that we do so that we're consistent and that we are robust and resilient and reliable and that's not just the UK data service as something funded by the ESRC but it's the other data infrastructures as well we can share some of these same standards we don't have to always do everything in a really heavy handed way and we can join together because we do really all have the same ultimate goal which is to try and put data into the hands of people who can use it for some form of good and there are all sorts of challenges around that and they start with understanding how data is collected they move on to making sure that it is described properly that there is the right sort of metadata that we do understand about the statistical properties of the data we still have to look after it one word that hasn't been mentioned yet which is almost in my job title is the word curation we do need to be able to look after these data not just for today or for tomorrow there is an indefinite period of use of some data well into the future and data for academics, data for researchers if it's two years old that's better than nothing from yesterday and if a commercial organisation can't give anything because it is commercially sensitive I think we need to play that game but we do need to let some of the commercial organisations play our game too publish get the public to respect what you're doing what we as a researcher community I don't use the word academic if I can help it I try and use the word researcher it's somebody doing something trying to understand something there are formal definitions of this which make it a bit more difficult so I'm taking away messages of more collaboration to try and widen data access and to try and understand how we can put what is valuable to those who need it into their hands