We're at Kettlemarine High School where this afternoon the Lutheran Crusaders take on Central Wisconsin Christian in a sectional final game. The winner of this game will head off to state Christian won to get here over a Catholic Central 53 to 46. Sheboygan Lutheran beaten Milwaukee Academy of Science 68 to 53 in what was a very close game until the fourth quarter. Chris, Central Wisconsin is much taller than Sheboygan and their best player, at least their high score, Tyler D. Young averages 15-8 and he's 6-4. He could be quite a load for the Crusaders. Yes, Marty, he is quite a load. He's basically a second team all-conference player a year ago. He's a junior this year averaging, like you mentioned, 16 points a game and nine rebounds. He's a force out there and their two best leading scorers go 6-4, 6-4. They've got a couple of 6-3s, so Ryan Shealy's going to probably have a lot of work in the paint along with some of the other guys as well. Even though they're taller, that could play into an advantage for Lutheran because obviously they're not going to be as quick as Sheboygan and Sheboygan does like to run. Well, we talked about it over lunch and we mentioned that one of the keys, I think, is pace. Pace of the ball game is going to be very important. Sheboygan Lutheran comes in averaging 70 points a game. Central Wisconsin averages 56 points. As a matter of fact, Marty, they only had one game in the 70s. One game in the 70s and when Lutheran's averaging 70 points, we've seen him score almost 100. So I think pace is a key. I think one of the keys for Central Wisconsin is they got a defense of three and once they go out, that's going to open up the middle a little bit for Tyler's Astro and he likes to get in the lane. Tyler had a great game in that second half the other night. Basically brought a team back that was kind of struggling against the Milwaukee Academy of Science and had a huge fourth quarter and led that rally, so he will be important. Christian comes in 20 and 6. Sheboygan Lutheran 22 and 2. Also a big factor for Sheboygan Lutheran is going to be Jacob Jerse. Jacob Jerse just went off a week ago and he's going to have to have one of those nights again. He averaged 16 points a game. He'll even settle for an afternoon like that. All right, we're going to shut up and get through the national anthem. Nice job with the national anthem by that young lady from Central Wisconsin Christian. A lot of crusaders here. Number three is Jason Braunschwag. Number four, Cody Zonafeld. Number five is Logan Gans. Andrew Greenfield. Number 42 and rounding out the starting lineup is number 50, Tyler D. Young. He is their high scorer. Hunter tickets to pre-sold, Marty. They came out from Sheboygan Lutheran. It looks like Wappan brought a good crowd, too. Starting lineup for Lutheran. Number three, Jacob Jerse. He's the only junior in the starting lineup. Number four, Ryan Shealy. Chris, that's your favorite player. Number 15 is Jeff Hasse. Number 23, Phil Leipholm. And rounding out the starting lineup is Tyler Zastrow. Just over 20 points a game. Our officials this afternoon are Jim Lemon, Steve Lukie, and Jeff Brewster. And as you know, Chris, the further down the line you get in tournament play, the better the officials are. Yeah, I'm sure it's going to be physical tonight. Tonight, one o'clock in the afternoon, I apologize. I'm sure we'll make that mistake more than once this afternoon and the buzzers are going off. It's just what you want in a sectional final. Something's not working right. We are going to get your attention no matter what. Christian comes in at 20 and 6, 14 and 4. Oshkosh Lourdes went undefeated in their conference and they are playing in the Division Four finals tonight, today against Dominican. Randolph is the team that used to be the power in this league and they are now, they've finished fourth. Lutheran ranked number three in state. Central Wisconsin, Catherine won, oh boy. Zastro was a leap and leaner, couldn't get it in, but he gets the rebound, has it blocked out of bounds. Well, size advantage is definitely going to go to Central Wisconsin Christian. I said, Wisconsin Christian won their first ten. They were ranked as high as number five in state. Lutheran right now ranked number three. Leipholm on a nice pass, put it up and in for Lutheran. Central Wisconsin Christian to do a lot of running. They'll want to get in a half court game, use that height advantage. Good defense by Hess. That's the guy you got to be aware of, number 50. Tyler DeYoung. Going to get physical, that's for sure. We have a great seat right behind the basket that Christian's coming to. Central Wisconsin Christian being very patient and stepping in and creating the steal was Jeff Hassan and we got a foul. Good play by Hess. I think it's a big, big advantage Lutheran has. All these seniors, some of these players played on a state championship for Todd Decker just two years ago. They've been in a house like this. They also got to play down in Concordia, which had a big crowd of people down there when they played Burlington, Catholic Central and Fall River. I was thinking about the conference they play into and I don't know too much about the trailways, but Lutheran is facing teams that are in division four frequently and especially when you have to play a team like Usberg. Shealy from outside the line. Rainbow three is down. They're going to try to make them play fast. Shealy's got DeYoung. DeYoung rolls it in but couldn't get it.  I think that's going to go on Cheboygan. They're going to get Juris. No, Shealy. They never took the foul from the first off the board. I think it was on Juris. Nope, it's on Phil Leipholm. There's going to be a lot of contact. That wasn't a great deal. There's a turnover by DeYoung. Well again, they're doubling up on DeYoung. They're not letting them just catch it and make a move. Pass on a great spin move. Goes right around DeYoung for basket. A timeout by Central Wisconsin. Great start by Cheboygan, Chris. We're going to keep it here for timeouts today because we don't have a truck but you are exactly right. Big lead already. Did I miss a basket? I've got it down as seven to nothing. I have it seven to nothing too. They're going to have to fix that. It is seven to nothing. I have a three, a two and a two. That's what I have. The only thing I can think of is if they threw it in and Cheboygan scored again and then they call the timeout. They've got it. Now they changed it. You're right. Sectional final and they're goofing up on the horn or goofing up on the score on the board. We've got to get that stuff straight. They are doubling down in all sorts of trouble. There's a jump ball. Going to go back to Chris. They're just smothering DeYoung. I know I've been a little critical on dry penetration before Luther and I have to play a little better D. But first two minutes here, Marty. They've been pretty sharp. Oops. Drive to the basket is good by Braunschlag. Just as I mentioned it. Yeah, nice going, Chris. Luther running the weave, gets it inside, pitches it back out. Luther kind of forced into a half court offense now. Not able to get the break point. Pass was laid. Interception by Gans. I'd like to have that one back. DeYoung was open on the cut. The pass just didn't come in time. DeYoung's spin move to the middle is no good. Shealy with the rebound. DeYoung all for two. Juris with a three from the top of the circle. Two for two from three point range for Sheboygan. Ten to two. Great start for Sheboygan. I didn't know if Juris was set there. But obviously set it off. Yeah, really? He looked a little off mark. They're going to let them play, Chris. I thought that was a foul. Yeah, they're going to let them play. This is sectional finals. Juris with a two pointer. We don't see that very often. It's 12 to two. Well, Juris hustled in and around there. Make it to steal. That's three turnovers already for Central Wisconsin. Oh, that should be all right there. Lower the shoulder, yeah. We had a great look at it from our vantage point. And you could see him lower the shoulder. Zonafeld now has two fouls. Coming in for him is going to be Lucas Vandenberg. Zonafeld, the second leader, score on the team with two fouls early. Comes in averaging 9.8 a game. And now he's on the bench. Their top two players are juniors, Marty. Yeah, they should be good next year. Oh, there should be another foul. In and out for Juris. They fought right through Azastro's screen. Pushed him right down to the floor. Clearly, no call. They are big and strong, Marty. It's hard to believe this. You see the size of some of these division five teams. They only got 106 kids in their school. Basket is off. Looks like it was halfway down and popped out. Juris comes away with the board. Now he's trying to push it to the basket. Couldn't get in. Better passes. Another incomplete pass by Luther. And the ball is tipped out of bounds. Should be Sheboygan's ball, and it is. Fifth turnover already on them. I know we've talked about it, but they're not only big, but they're long, too. It's going to be hard to make good passes. Well, that's why you've got to be smarter with your passes. They're just forcing it. That's why they have those two turnovers. Pass. Three ball. Shooters' roll. He got it in. Another three basket for Sheboygan. A five central Wisconsin Christian. Don't be afraid to call another time out. And he does. Good call, Chris. Second time out of the quarter. There's still 3-0-2 left. It's 15-2 Sheboygan. Well, this is one of the days you bring the hammer.  There is no... You don't play to kids tonight. What a start. This is an awesome start. Luther has three two-point baskets already in the quarter. And the interesting thing about it, Chris, is three different players have those baskets. We're not just depending on jurists. They're off to a good start. They're 6-9 from the floor. Just four shot attempts for Christian. Central Wisconsin Christian. They seem to be trying to knock it in. Two to young. But I think great defense so far by Sheboygan Lutheran. Nick Berhegan, the Lutheran coach, has a great plan coming in. Anytime he touches the ball, we're doubling down. You've got to imagine that throughout the season, they've seen this before. Christian, the double team on the big guy. But they certainly haven't handled it very well so far. Braunschweig. And again, the dribble drive, Marty, is just something that they haven't done a great job of this year. They've got to stay off of him and let him take the 15-footer instead of getting to the rack. Sastrow commits a foul. Braunschweig is shooting the free throws and he missed the first one. He looked nervous, Marty. No knee bend at all. He just kind of chucked it up there. It's tough to play in a big house like this. Much better there. It's an eight point run until that made free throw. It's now 15-3. I'll take another 8-0 run, Marty. Exactly. Sastrow, not a good shot. Not a good shot. He had a player open in the corner. That wasn't the best decision at all. Braunschweig has it on top. He's the senior, Chris. 5-9. Runs a show of D'Young from outside. Couldn't get it. Braunschweig with a good hustle. Rebound and he makes a basket. Center with Scott. Christian getting their sea legs back. But Juris takes care of it with another 3. 18-5. Braunschweig on top. Locked down to 2 minutes left in the quarter. A lot of game left too, Marty. Off a lot of game. 3-point attempt by Greenfield is no good. Passes. Yeah, and they got to keep hustling too. Juris, bangle, baby. Another 3 for him. He's got 3 of them, Marty. He's 4-5 from the floor. Interesting. Taylor's Astrow coming in before Jacob Ames. Maybe because of his size. Turn shot is no good. And then Braunschweig taps it out of bounds. I like that Braunschweig, Marty. He's a hustler. Very much so. I know he's only 5-9, but he's all over attacking the rebounds and things. Good call on the Taylor's Astrow. Substitution, Chris. You're right. Get another big body in there. And he can draw people away from the basket with a 3-point shooting. Astrow pull up in the lane. Taylor's roll coming away with the rebound was DeYoung. Braunschweig looking to punt. Pulls up from the free-throw line. Couldn't get it. Shealy with the board. DeYoung all for 5, Marty. Juris. He's feeling it. Oh, man. Left. Is there anybody guarding him? Let's hope not for another 3 quarters. Yeah, really. Much of a load for Shealy that time. 24-7. 20 seconds left. Luther looks like they're going to keep it out. Play for one shot. Braunschweig stays off of Astrow. They're going to get a foul on Central Wisconsin. It's Lucas Vanderberg. It's a third team foul. 9.4 seconds left. It's 24-7. Luther on top. Juris open for just a second. No good. And fired up an air ball. No good. Good play though coming out of that out of bounds. Central Wisconsin has time. There's 4 seconds remaining. They should get a pretty good shot on this. Braunschweig with it. Gets it into DeYoung. Shot at the buzzer is off. And we're at the end of one quarter play. A great start for the Luther Crusaders. They lead it. 24-7. Through the years, trends and styles may come and go. But the important things remain the same. Generation after generation. Consistently there. Creating moments and memories to last a lifetime. Like a true friend, the National Parks have always been there for you. And now, you can be there for them. Support the National Park Foundation and help protect America's treasured places. As days go by, when will you realize that very little will change until you change it? I am empowered. Get connected to make a difference. Take the pledge. Text Empower to 6-9-8-6-6. Or go to I am empowered dot com. The National Urban League celebrating 100 years. Looking at the scoresheet, Chris Luther and Amass. Three runs in that first quarter. They started the game off with a 7 point run. Christian called a timeout. They scored a basket. Then Luther came out and scored 8 straight points. Christian's called another timeout. Got a couple of, got three points there. And then Luther went on a 9 point run on 3-3-point baskets by Juris. Pass cutting through the lane. Out of great pass but he could get the... Finish. Yeah, you're right there. Not tonight. Please don't miss those. Braunschweig kicks it out. They feed Braunschweig with a short jumper. Couldn't get it but Juris comes away with the rebound. They're just 3 of 12. Taylor Zastrow using the body to protect the ball's scores. Zastrow that doesn't play a lot of early minutes comes in. Don't reach Jacob. You don't want a second foul. Good ball movement this time by Central Wisconsin Christian. Shot is no good. By Greenfield. Braunschweig. No good. Zastrow almost had it tipped away but hangs on to it. They are letting them play tonight, today. Yes, got through. And that time he puts the bunny in. To 7, Chris. And there's still 6 and a half minutes left in the second quarter. Young with an easy one. Deep dribble drive. He's 2 of 8. Taylor Zastrow couldn't get it to go. Coming away with the rebound was Zonafeld. And he's going to take it to the wrap. Gee whiz. He lost. Zonafeld is down. He's hurt. His leg gave out on him. You could see it when he went up. He just didn't have that power in his leg. Something gave out. Hopefully it's just a cramp. He's got those two knee braces on too. I wonder if he's had problems in the past. I certainly hope that young man is okay. We did get a foul on the play. It goes on Jason Braunschweig. That's his first. You can tell he's had this issue before, I think, Chris. He's not happy about it. I did not like that drive penetration, Marty. We just saw the young come right down the lane to make an easy basket. There you saw another one there. Zonafeld go right to the basket.  They're up 19. It's 28-9. Six minutes left in the first half. Zastrow pretty good defense at time by Central Wisconsin. Starting five back on the floor. Juris' shot is no good. Had a pretty good look. I'm wrong. Ames is in. I'm sorry. Ames is in for Hess. Inside feed. The young just took it away from Shealy. He's a strong young man, Chris. You have to pay attention to that boy. Good defense by Gans. All of a sudden, Lutheran has hit a cold spell. Who shot that? Zastrow on the miss. Yeah, he's 0-for-5. Gans has it on the wing. Gets it in to the young, and he couldn't put it in. Had a good look, too. Nice flop. Zastrow from outside the line. He nails a three. He missed his first five, but you know, he's not going to stop shooting. We like that, don't we? 31-11. 8-50 left in the first half. Shot off the glass is good by Lucas Vandenberg. They don't shoot a lot of threes. They've only shot 102 this year. That's only his ninth on the year. You can tell that. He forgot to call off the glass. Gans has Zastrow. He goes right around him. Puts it up and in, and he's fouled. And I think we've got a foul there on Greenfield. Greenfield, excuse me. Yep, it is on Andrew Greenfield. His first, fifth team foul. Ozenstein and Hess in. Chers and Shealy out. Hopefully not for a big break. Well, if you're going to give them a rest, you might as well do it now. Free throw is good. Oh, that brought back the three-pointer. They hit off the backboard. Exactly. 34-14. Sheboygan on top. Greenfield had it, gave it up. DeYoung has it inside, but has to kick it out to Gans. No way. And a good play by Phil Ipom. He got the rebound, but knew he wasn't going to be able to stay in bounds, so he threw it off of Greenfield. And Greenfield coming out, Chris, so bringing in Jared. I'm going to get this pronunciation right. Greg Narris, number 22. Jared Greg Narris in the ball game. Central Wisconsin shooting just 28%. You're going to get Hess on the foul. That was a lazy pass to the wing, Chris. You've got to snap it over there. Yep, I agree with you. And now you've caught yourself a foul. And Hess, first, first one. Juris back in. Hess guarding the ball. Ball tipped away. Oh, that's double dribble. And almost an interception, but the coming out of it was Vandenberg. Harris with a shot to the head. And Central Wisconsin throws it out of bounds. I'll tell you that was a disjointed possession right from the beginning. A lot of pressure by Sheboygan, but they were already... They were just swarming. They want to keep the ball. Central Wisconsin does in the hands of Jason Braunschweig. Juris shot off. Reload. Behind the back pass to Ames. No shot for Jacob, so he passes it back out. Ozzie being guarded closely. Kick out to Hess from three-point land around and out. Hess, or Hasegstein's got to grab that one. Braunschweig came away with the rebound. Ragnaris with a three-point basket. I don't understand that call, Chris. The official way over here was calling it a three. 34 to 17. 240 left in the first half. Keep the hammer down, like to be up by 20 at half. Keep it up there. Ozenstein under pressure, couldn't get his shot in. Coming away with the rebound was Vandenberg, and he's trying to push it to the basket and then kicked it off his foot. Seventh turnover now. Ozenstein out. Tyler Zastrow back in. And Shealy back in for Ames. 34 to 17. Luther on top. Both teams are playing a man-to-man defense. Keep the lead where it is, Marty. Never want to see it under double digits. Anne's getting out on Juris to prevent him from taking the shot. Zastrow being guarded by the much taller Zonafeld. Geez, I just don't like that, Marty. Well, he's shooting against a much taller guy. You want to get it to the rack. Yep. Braunschweig had it. He's being guarded by Shealy being fronted. Good double, good double, good double. And it goes off of Ragnaris. Luther's going to have it right back. Good job there by Zastrow. Tyler Zastrow comes into the game with 48th in the state in scoring. Luther had 24 points in that first quarter. Chris, you've got under two minutes left. They've only scored 10. Wow. And they have not shot well this quarter. As you would know, you're keeping track. But it's been a slow, the pace has slowed down considerably. Yeah, they're just 4 of 12 in the quarter, Marty. Good point. And it's not like Christian is doing much either. Ball is tipped out of bounds by DeYoung. Pest doing a lot more dribbling than we're used to seeing him do. Zonafeld is 6-4, Chris. He's guarding Tyler Zastrow who goes 5-9. And that's a generous assessment. Shealy got foul. That's why he lost the ball. Logan Gans is going to pick up that foul. Pest got the inbound pass and they surprised him. And two inbounds play baskets for Luther. And good scouted teams doesn't allow that to happen. But that was two on the moneys for Luther. Shealy leaning on DeYoung a lot. And here comes Juris. He got him triple team. Then he tried to pass it to Logan Gans. But he threw it out of bounds. So the double and triple team worked. He should have just shot it. You would have. I would have. Come on, Marty. There's three guys guarding you. So what? Where are the other two? Zastrow back in and out looking for an opening. But you don't have to force it in there. He gets caught on the baseline too. There isn't a whole lot of places to go. You've got to keep it out on the floor. Under a minute left, it's 36-17. Luther on top. There's 40.4 seconds left. Zastrow got it in the lane and he got it up and in. A great pass by Jacob Juris. And again, off an inbounds play. In the tall timbers that time. And a good hustle by Juris. He makes a steal. Gans wants a foul. No way. Fifth turnover in like the last three minutes against Christian. 20 seconds. Luther will play for one. They're up by 21. It's 38-17. Here's the hammer if you can score here. Boy with a place goal. Just get erupted if you can score. Zastrow doesn't want to give it up. Now he does. Juris open a good ball fake. Come on. Wouldn't go ahead. Had a bunny shot. Couldn't get it to go and we're at halftime. Sheboygan Luther. 38. Central Wisconsin Christian 17. This may be the last of his time. Unbelievable. He's looking for a job in the paper. Let's take it. He'll be okay. 80% of Fortune 500 companies only accept job applications online. Without the internet you risk becoming extinct. Call us or visit our website to learn how to connect safely. We're back at Kettle Moraine High School where at halftime there you see it Sheboygan Luther on top 38-17 in a really great first half of basketball. Let's go over the scoring first for Central Wisconsin. They were led by Jason Vanderberg who came off the bench with six points and Tyler D. Young their high score with six also. And the only other person to score for the Central Wisconsin Christian Crusaders was Jason Braunschweig. He had five points. For Lutheran they were led by Jacob Juris with 14 points and Tyler Zastrow had 10. Jeff Hess nine. Ryan Shealy hit a three-point basket early in the ballgame. And Taylor Zastrow got into the game early and chipped in with two points to total out to 38. Chris just got back. Crazy half but we're not done. I'm always nervous till the end Marty. 24 in the first quarter slowed down to 14 in the second quarter. Christian had seven in the first and 10 in the second. Good feed inside. D. Young is triple teamed and Juris just took it away. And then Tyler D. Young gets called for a foul. I mean as soon as he touched the ball Chris three guys were on him. Yeah and the live hands of Lutheran creates that turnover. 20 Zonafeld is still guarding Tyler's astronaut. Actually I thought Zonafeld did a pretty nice job with Tyler. Hess from outside couldn't get it. One pass and a shot. You want a little more passing going than that I think. Chris what do you think? Working around? Yeah. Drive to the basket by Zonafeld and he scores and he's going to get a free throw. There's that drive penetration again. Zonafeld with the foul trouble early. I mentioned he's the second lead scorer and he starts the second half right away. Three point play. 38 to 20. Talked to a couple people during the halftime Chris and each one said keep the pedal to the metal. Darn right. Long way to go. Lutheran working it around. The light bomb had what he looked like a shot but didn't take it. Faster with a cut down the lane and he gets fouled. Where are they going to get this one on? It's either going to be Greenfield or Zonafeld. Greenfield picked up the foul. That's his second. 48% shooting for Lutheran in that first half Marty. Sastro makes the second a two. And there's six of 14 for three point range. Not a good. They're only one of six in the second quarter but Boydose five in the first were huge. Young. Nails a two pointer. Two foot was on the line. But he's taking his game outside Chris. He's four of 11 from the floor. And that's nice to have a big kid like that that can play into the basket and shoot short. Looked like a set play Chris and they got it to Juris with a wide open shot but he couldn't nail it. Six minutes left up by 16. Gans plying the pressure on the ball. Juris trying to take him. Good kick out pass to Leipholm. His three is good. That's a big basket Marty. You've got to get some momentum to start the second half and now you're back up by 20. That's just a huge basket. Seventh three pointer for Lutheran. Good point. And it forces them to come out and guard another of the Lutheran players. Oh that's deep. Greenfield no good. Oh how can they. Young goes right over the back, knocks down two Lutheran players but we'll get it out of bounds anyway. Wow. That's called letting them play. Here comes the rest of the Leipholms. Go Joe go. By 20. Can you imagine the amount of revenue the WIAA would lose if there weren't Leipholms in the building? Zastrow. Zastrow right down the lane. Puts it up and in. I just like this start Marty. Great start. 22 point lead. They've doubled up on the Crusaders. Inside. Lean in with the bodies. Onafell put it up and in. He got called for an offensive fall in the first half doing that move. It wasn't quite as vociferous with that move. He's strong. He is strong. Him and DeYoung back next year. They're going to be big and strong. Zastrow down the lane. Couldn't get the roll. And Greenfield takes the ball away from his teammate DeYoung. Braunschweig had the ball tipped out of his hands by Jacob Juris. Pretty much got a full house in here. Chris it's 445 left in the third quarter. It's 44 to 24. Luther on top. Braunschweig right to the rack. Puts it up and in. Bad defense. Too easy, too easy. Patience, patience. Need to get the ball to the other side. Make the defense move. Good idea Marty. Good call. There you go. Swing. Cher's posting. Oh he's going to catch it first. Yeah. Fighting off the defense too much. Couldn't get both hands on the ball. Layup is up and good by Zonafeld. He's 3-3 in the quarter. Down to 16. Got to come back and counter. Yeah, Luther trying to run. Zastrow from 10 rims out. Had a great look. Couldn't get it to go. He's 4-12 from the floor. A lot of people throw that right to Juris. Zastrow trying to get it. Couldn't. Why? Lypalm with the rebound attempt. Couldn't and then Phil's going to pick up the foul for Phil. That'll be his third. You know Chris, I'm going to cut Zastrow a little slack on that last shot simply because there wasn't too much he could do with it other than trying to shoot. He was sailing out of bounds. Yeah. Good point. Good hustle play. Greenfield on a toss into his teammate D'Young and threw it way over his head. 13th turnover now on Central Wisconsin. Looked across the way at the table.  Oldies? We should get that sign. A little pressure here. Applied. Oh, they had Zastrow wide open down here in the corner. Never saw him. That's where that pass should have gone. Greenfield shot is no good. D'Young with great hustle and then he commits an offensive call not the Luther player right to the floor with his elbow. Braunschweig takes it to the rack couldn't get it. Shealy with the strong rebound and now they're going to get Greenfield with the foul and it looks to me Chris it might be getting a little chippy in there. Yeah. Well, it's physical and Central Wisconsin Christian in desperation mowed down. 16, 3 minutes left in the third quarter. 305 exactly. Gonna apply some pressure here now. Luther in struggle with this a little bit a week ago against Christian. I thought they struggled with it a lot, actually.  Not strong at all. Wide hands. No, you're right. Exactly right. Shot is no good by Greenfield. He'll go to the line to shoot a pair. Don't be afraid, Nick. Don't be afraid. Actually that was Gans. Don't be afraid to use one here. Little mojo going the other way. Jeff Hasse picks up his second foul. Taylor's Astro and Jacob Ames come in. Pass and Leipholm take a break. Gans with another free throw. They've cut it to 14 points. It was as high as 22. He's strong. He's strong. And good time out by Nick Verhegan. Prevent the turnover. Chris, what do you see here in this particular quarter? Well, as I mentioned before Central Wisconsin now in desperation mode a little bit here. So they're going to try something probably they don't do a lot of it. And that's press. It's how Lutheran handles it. Takes care of the ball. You know. You know the officials are letting them go. You have to be strong with the ball. Chin that ball up as they used to teach you in grade school camps all over the state. Be strong with the ball but don't be afraid to attack. Somebody's got to put a basket and just to get the mojo back. They've got to get some points back. That's why I thought that three before by Leipholm was so big. Christian on an eight point run. Chris, they've scored the last eight points and they both scored Lutheran in the quarter 30 to six. Pardon me, 30, 13 to six. Official talking to Greenfield and Shealy. Official very slow getting it to the inbounder. Zastrow in a call to fall on Vanderberg. That's going to be his second. Lutheran three of seven and a quarter. Five of eight, four. Another miss. Zastrow had a pretty good look and I don't fault them for taking the shot. You just want to, we want to make one. He's four of five, 14, Miss Marty. They're using their size. Zonafeld couldn't get it. Ball stays in the possession of Christian. Zonafeld to the basket again. Couldn't Tyler D. Young. No good. Ball being tipped around. Finally, Lutheran comes away with it and flying all over the floor was Lucas Vanderberg and he tipped it out of bounds. I'll tell you, Central Wisconsin pounding the paint. They are really controlling the paint now, Marty. Another interception. Taylor Zastrow with a real bad pass. It's 44 to 30. We're under two minutes left in the third. Here we go. Deep again. Too deep. Tyler D. Young. His shot was blocked on the way up but they're going to say a foul was committed by Lutheran. I don't know. He sure got a lot of places without moving the ball on the floor with a dribble. They are getting deep, deep, deep and pounding it inside. The two twin towers are really making themselves present here in this quarter. Jeff Hess checking back in. There are four of seven in the quarter now on the shooting free throws here. Someone for Lutheran has got to make a bucket. Someone's got to break the string. Lead has gone from 22 down to 12. It's 44 to 32. Ball's thrown away again. The life on back in. Five turnovers now for Lutheran here in the quarter. Yes, sir. They didn't have one in the second quarter. And again, just one shot attempt in the quarter as well. Tyler D. Young starting on the outside. Still remains outside the paint. Zonafell had the ball tipped away and Juris comes away with the rebound or with the loose ball, I should say. Vandenberg trying to get up into Zastrow's grill. Nice feed. The Shealy lays it up and in. That's the basket we needed. Got to finish strong here. We want to be up double digits going into quarter number four. Greenfield working on Hess. Spins to the middle. Shot is off, no good, but he gets called for travel. That one. And here's the buzzer going off. Crazy buzzer. Coming in the ball game is Jason Braunschweig. Big minute here, Marty. Big, big minute. Yeah, 59.5 seconds left. Luther on top, 46 to 32. It's been a rough quarter for the Crusaders of Sheboygan.  Yeah, I guess. Come on, Jeff. What are you giving me the ball for? Yeah, because you're one of the five on the floor. Juris couldn't get it. We had a good look at it. Chris could see it wasn't going down. 40 seconds left. Braunschweig being guarded by Tyler Zastrow. See if they try to pound it in. Here they go again. All to Tyler. DeYoung is three is good. That's a backbreaker. That's his 30th of the season. Luther up by 11. 18 seconds left. The light pump kicks it out. The Shealy is short. Rainbow three is way short. DeYoung with the rebound. Five seconds left. Braunschweig has a chance. Kicks it out. Shot is no good at the buzzer. And we're at the end of three quarters of play with Luther on top 46 to 35. To text and pay attention to the world around you. And you definitely can't text and draw. Every year, deaths due to distracted and negligent driving are increasing. In fact, while drunk driving rates have dropped greatly, negligent driving fatalities have skyrocketed. Find out more at negligentdriving.com. One of the most important lessons you can teach your kids about playing sports is concussion sign and symptoms. After you hit to the head, if they have any concussion signs like blurred vision or headache, they need to stay out of play until they check by a healthcare professional. Play safe when it comes to concussion. When in doubt, sit them out. To learn more, go to CDC.Golf backslash concussion. This is the other thing you can teach them. It comes in handy. They only scored eight points in the third quarter. And a little bugaboo that we saw in that Christian game, Chris, they had trouble dealing with the pressure. They had the trouble of dealing with the pressure of Sheboygan Luther and now Central Wisconsin. Well, they were just three of 11 in a quarter, but the key, I thought, was five turnovers, Marty. Yep, well, that's what I mean about handling the pressure. And Central Wisconsin did a great job of going back to where they earned their oats, and it's in the paint. They are attacking the paint. All their shots are from close range. You know what they did also is they moved the young outside more and they posted up... Yeah, good point. They posted up Zonafeld. Shelly rolls off. Great pass inside. He couldn't get the shot to goal. Got to have those. When I was talking about the pressure before, I meant to say Sheboygan Christian and now Central Wisconsin Christian putting the pressure. Zonafeld basket is good and he's fouled inside. There he is again. They have an eight point quarter. Ethan had an eight point quarter. They had an 18 point quarter. And now it's down to eight points with seven and a half left. You get Jason Braunschweig with the foul. Once again, somebody's got it. We need a bucket. Get the mojo back. Now they don't need a three point basket. They just need some points. Harris is 0 for 2 in the quarter after going 5 of 10 in the first half. Zonafeld doing a better job at defending Jacob Juris. Shelly kicks it out. Inside to Zastrow and he rolls it in. Oh, I thought it was going to be like Shelly's. And going down is Lucas Vandenberg. We didn't see what happened there, but he looks hurt. The lead for Sheboygan Lutheran is back up to 10. It's 48 to 38 with 6.50 left. How many baskets do we have this quarter? One. One. That was the one by Zastrow. Zastrow just now. And they made a three-pointer with three-point play by Zonafeld. That's what I did. I gave it to the wrong four. Lucas Vandenberg did not start the ball game, Chris, but he has been a big asset for the Crusaders from Central Wisconsin. Christian, seven long minutes to go and the pace is much more at the Central Wisconsin level. I told you that they only scored once this season in the 70s. And, of course, Lutheran averages 70. Lutheran's going to have to work real hard to get up to 70 today. They're 12 points down. It's not that they can't do it, but Greenfield, Pumpfake tried to take it to the basket. Hess with the good defense. Drag that foot, too. That's deep. Greenfield, no good. Off of Christian. Might have been off of DeYoung or Brownschweig. But Sheboygan Lutheran is going to have it back. Yeah, they're just controlling the board using their size. Break for Lutheran. It'd be nice to get a bucket here again. Every trip is big. Leipholm breaking the press, but had it tipped away by Jason Brownschweig. Ten point lead, 6-22 left. Rolling down to the 6-15 mark of the fourth quarter. Sheboygan Lutheran up 10. Hess, drive to the basket, scores. Very nice. Very nice. Recognize the opening and took it. Each team with five fouls. Gans had it, gets it inside to Conifeld. He puts it up and in. He's been a force this half. He definitely has. Five of eight and a quarter and a half, Marty. Oh, wow. You want the ball instead? I don't think, you know, it was probably off of Ryan, but if you're going to do that, then you've got to call a foul on Conifeld. Yeah. Wasonifeld, pardon me. Yep. What do you want, the foul? That's an easy call there. Good decision by the officials, too. Pussed way out. Get it over to Hess. 5-40 left in the ball game. Sheboygan Lutheran on top. 50-40 and a steal by Gans. That was just another bad decision. Six turn over and a half and a deep again. Gans' shot was blocked and then Leipholm tips it out of his hands. That's because they're getting deep and they're getting offensive rebounds, Marty. I got Leipholm. If that's on Leipholm, that's his fourth. Lucas Vandenberg coming back in for big Andrew Greenfield. Inside to Gans, he puts it up and in. In the paint. They arched too easy. They're controlling the paint, as they say. Just muscling through. 5 minutes up by 8. Juris right down Main Street scores. The first basket to the second half, Marty. Pick them, Jacob. Got a score, Jacob. Puts it up and in off the pressure. No foul called, but another basket by Lutheran. They're up by 12 under 5 minutes. Braunschweig trying to make penetration and doesn't score. It's a great play by Jason Braunschweig. 10 point Lutheran lead. And we're going to get a foul. That's going to go on Zonafeld. And doesn't like the call, but I thought it was a good one, Chris. And I'm a homer, but I still think it was good. Each team now with 6, Marty. 4.5 minutes, 4.32. Up by 10. For Cody Zonafeld, Chris, that was his third. Nice pass. Shot off the glass is good by Shealy. Keep it above double digits. I love it, Marty. I'm with you there. The young leaping leader is good and he's fouled by Ryan Shealy. It's turned and shot. Ryan Shealy didn't have a chance. The official doesn't need to talk here. They're in ease and control. You stay in control as an official. The young has a chance to cut the lead from 10 down to single digits. 74% free throw shooter. They're best and he misses. Leipholm almost had it tipped away. Shealy, I think, got away with the walk, Chris, but they'll take it. Halfway through corner number four. Pass leading in the bellion. Couldn't get it to go, but he is fouled. Tyler D. Young picks up his third. Coach for Hagan looks real calm over there. He's probably calmer than us. Second season. Todd Decker and John and Carol are here to cheer on Luther. State championship two years ago. Good support by that family. This is only going to be the fifth free throw of the game for Sheboygan. They've made four of the five. By a little pressure. You don't want a lot of pressure, though, because you don't want to foul when the clock's going here. Almost tipped away from Braunschweig. Oh, that's not going to go. Getting it back is Gans. No good. Got to get it. Leipholm with the rebound. I look like it went off the head of a Christian player. They're not a big three-point shooting team. They've only hit an average of three per game this year. Three-thirty left. Sheboygan and Luther are up by 12. They're running a little bit of clock. Little leave action. Tyler D. Young tipped it away. A lot of contact, but they play on. D. Young with a three attempt is no good. Juris with the rebound.  Jeff Hess is right there. Jeff Hess was right there. Still there. D. Young moving in the way of Zastrow. Zastrow be shooting the one-in-one. Both teams sitting with seven fouls. Let me tell you, Tyler D. Young is winded. Look at him. Look at him, Marty. There you see right in your camera right there. He is beat. Might be a good time for a timeout for that young man. And we call one. Hey, whatever it takes. You know, Marty, we mentioned it last week. It's so difficult to just come back and then get over the hump. He's exerting so much energy, and then they pressed. We were talking after that game to Mike Thebil. He said, you know, you expend so much energy to get into the game, and then there's nothing left at the end. But I think... I lost my train of thought there for a second. But I think you're right, Chris. You know, you expend a lot of energy. He's just where... I mean, he's tired, and... Zonafeld, who didn't play much in the first half because of foul trouble, has just been a force here. Yeah, I remembered my thought. And that is, you know, Luther likes to push the ball and get quick shots, basically. And now you're in a position where you need to slow the ball down. You know, it's kind of playing out of character. Very much so. A lot of these kids played right across country. State team for that. Some of these kids were on a soccer team. That had a lot of success. Conference championship team.  They're all big now, Marty. Cool as a cucumber. Tyler Zastrow. He's been around the wars for... For a long time. Yeah, yes. Oh, just rolled out. That would look good. Yeah. That's DeYoung's 10th rebound. Average is nine and a half. Let's hope he doesn't improve his average next week. Greenfield looking for the three. Couldn't find it. Braunschweig to the basket and scores, and he's fouled. The old bugaboo. Yeah, Jason Braunschweig. They have trouble. Well, they got trouble with any of the guys that drive to the basket. Doesn't matter if you're big or small. 243 left. 59-58. Luther on top. Nick Verhagen, deep breath. Looks over by Coach Decker. He was announcing a game tonight in a missed free throw. Again, back-to-back misses for them. Come to the ball. Come to the ball. Come to the ball. 230 left. Come to the ball. Luther looking to run clock. And a good job of it so far. Zastrow inside feed. Deschilli lays it up and in. Bingo baby. 61-48. Reball is no good. Zastrow gets the rebound, Chris. And he's trying to dribble out of pressure. And does. Three timeouts for each team, Marty. Three timeouts for each team. There's a foul. That one's going to go on Lucas Vandenberg. Good to see that young man back in, Chris. You can just see central Wisconsin. Hands on their knees. Hands on their hips. They are so tired. The battle to come back was so difficult for them. The last two minutes for them is going to be hard. We got to let them work to make baskets so we can't allow dry penetration, Marty. Another miss. Back-to-back for us. Bad pass. Juris with the steal and a quick follow with 153 left. Lutheran up 13. It's not over yet, but the more they have to follow. And I believe Lutheran will be shooting two from now on. 16th turnover of the ball game for them. 16. That's way too many. And 10 of them are in that first half. Can't have that many turnovers. Expect to win, not at this level. Marty, I have Shaboygan Lutheran. Five for five. No, that's wrong. Six for six from the floor. Oh, look at this. Light pump off the glass. Couldn't get it in. Zastrow trying to steal it away. Don't follow. We cannot follow there. That's our first miss of the quarter. Point-brank range. Three ball is good by Zonafeld. Oh, man. That's just his ninth of the season. Under 100 seconds, Marty. 11 points lead. Zastrow had a real bad pass. I used to see that from Tyler. Still 11 points. Inside the green field. Basket is good. Cut into the lead again. His first basket of the ball game. One of seven. Oh, bad pass again, but Lutheran keeps it. Zastrow had it tipped away. Not aware of who was around him. Got to have better court awareness, and then Hess steals the pass.  Lutheran up 53 to us. 62 to 53. Getting nervous. Well, it's not that, Chris. It's just, you know, you get, you're at a point now where your season is so important in terms of going to state, you know, and repeating what you did a couple years ago, and you're playing lackadaisical. Yeah, maybe not lackadaisical, but you're not playing sharp. Yeah, we got 63 seconds to the point lead and the ball. You have to be strong with the ball, and you got to be, you got to at least make one of two free throws when you get the opportunity. I believe that was the third timeout for Lutheran. I got him with three. Okay, good. Zastrow's going to get fouled. I want him there. I was just going to say that, Chris. I'm with you there. I want him at the line. We need at least one. Two would be great. Right now it's a three possession game. So you know who I'd really like to see at the line? Me. He didn't get that first one, Marty. What is that? Three in a row they've missed? Let's see. One, two, three, four, five. Four out of five. Really, I thought they missed a couple before. No. Juris made the first free throw when he was on the line just before. At a chance. Oh, this is going to be green ball.  But a good no-call. Empty trip, Marty. Empty trip. 56 seconds up nine. Three possession game. Under 50. Zonafell leaning in on Hess draws the foul. It stops the clock. Gives them an opportunity to score without the clock running. That's Hess's third. Think back to those Christian Lutheran games and how well Lutheran shot their free throws tonight. It's just at the most critical time of the season, it's been escaping them. Well, Zonafell is just a 57% free throw shooter, Marty. He got somebody there. He's the one. Still a three possession game. 47 seconds left. It took them basically nine seconds. Taylor Zastrow in the ball game, Chris. I find that being an interesting substitution. I would say so. I want to fill that out. Well, we don't know what Phil's free throw shooting is. I don't know. But Juris going to the line. We like him there. He's had a rough second half. He's two of four, both two-point baskets.  Four threes in the first quarter. Dan Tennapo from the head coach for Central Wisconsin. I thought made some really good adjustments in the second half. Especially offensively. Good point. Phil Leipholm coming in for Taylor Zastrow. Nine point lead with that made free throw. See if you can bump it up to ten. Four possessions. Four possessions. 64-54. Rolling down to 40 seconds. Ron Schweig had it tipped away. Went off a Lutheran player. Christian will have it back. 39.9 seconds left. It's a ten-point lead. Ron Schweig pulls up with the three ribs out. No break. Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. And Zonaphyll committing to fall. Sends Zastrow to the line. You can get to 67. You can put it in a bank and book your ticket to Madison. Because there's no way they can get 13 points in 30 seconds. Zastrow's missed three in a row. Four in a row, pardon me. He had a one-in-one that he missed earlier. Makes one there. He found a three. Three-point attempt is no good. Ron Schweig with the rebound gets it inside. And it's blocked by Gans. Gans' shot is blocked. And then they call a foul. Looks like a fine block for us. Wow. As I mentioned many times already, they've only hit 102 threes this year, Marty. That's an average of about three a game. And when they need threes, they can't make them. Boy, oh boy. The free throw shooting in this fourth quarter has been atrocious. Central Wisconsin one of seven from three-point range in the fourth quarter. Good one there. 65-55. Oh, the clock's running. Another second clicked off. And they're going to bring the officials over and say it should be about 2.4. Come over here, ask me, I'll tell you. I thought it was over 20. 20.4. I think you're right. 66-55. 21 seconds left. Looking a lot more secure now back in the third and early fourth quarter, Chris. Yeah, they gave it a run. I'll say that. I was a little nervous entering the fourth quarter. 67 games over. Book your tickets. Braunschweig, no good. Rebound putback is no good. And the rebound putback again by Gantz is no good, but he is followed. You don't make, well, not that it matters so much, but it does matter. You got to make the first shot so you can stop the clock with a timeout. And Gantz makes that one. It's 56 now for Christian Lutheran as 67. Lutheran, 6 of 8 in the quarter, shooting. Christian, 7 of 18 and continuing to miss free throws. That gets hostile and he can't hit any. Shealy had it stripped away and we get a jump ball situation. Tie-up situation, pardon me. 3.6 seconds left. Lutheran on top, 67 to 56. And the Central Wisconsin Christian is clearing the bench by Van Buren. How about that, Marty? Yeah. State tournament. Koeiker also in. Coming in for Sheboygan. Kuczic, Welch. Good job, coach, for Hagen and your staff. Jacob Berg, shot is no good and that's the ball game. Sheboygan Luther going to state again with a 67-56 win. Richard Barts and our cameraman Chris is going to try to get some interviews hopefully before we leave. It's been a good afternoon, a very exciting basketball game. Lutheran pretty much had it their way in the first half. But western Wisconsin Christian really came back tough. Wow, the first quarter I thought was the key, Marty. Shooting 10 to 15, 5 of 8 from 3-point. Put the pedal to the medal and never look back after that first quarter. This team had a goal to get to the state tournament and not all teams who set goals that high reach it and congratulations to Nick for Hagen and his staff and all the boys. I'll tell you what a senior group here opportunity to get to a state tournament and a lot of these boys get to go for a second time. We're here in the second half by western Wisconsin Christian with 39 points Chris, they also were able to hold Sheboygan Luther to only 29 second half points. It's a key to that. They're handing out the medals for sectionals. There's Johnny Decker behind Marty. That's a Wisconsin finishes 27 this season. They lose their guard play Marty, but their front line is going to be I don't know, I really like that Jason Braun, Braun Schweig number three, he really hustled out there. Yeah, he did and scrapping. Finished the game with 11 points for Luther Juris at 23. Zastrow at 18. Jeff Hess at 13. He's the athletic director, Jacob. You know, another thing, these Lutheran kids are nice kids. They're really nice kids. They're very active in a lot of things. I've seen these kids in plays and musicals and things and it's not just athletics that they're that they excel at. Not often an athletic director gets a hug. Tyler Zastrow laughing about this. We talked a lot about Zonufeld, Cody Zonufeld had no points in the first half because he had 14 in the second while he had all that foul trouble and boy, they just controlled the paint in the second half which we probably expected in the game started was going to happen, but just the blitzkrieg of a lightning attack to start the game by Lutheran was too much for Central Wisconsin Christian overcome. Yeah, their big guy, Tyler D'Young came into the game averaging almost 16 points a game, ended with only 12, because they really were able to control him. Now he was 5, a 14 from the floor, Marty. So a good job, not just by Ryan Shealy, but you're right, the whole team. Dan's had a nice game finished with 6 points all in the second half. Complete, but I've got a couple, let's run through Sheboygan, Juris at 23, really 9, Haas 13, Tyler Zastrow with 18, Taylor Zastrow had 2 for Western Wisconsin Christian Jason Braunschweig had 11, Cody Zonafeld had 14, Logan Gantz had 5, Vandeberg, Lucas had 6 and Tyler D'Young had 12. Coming over is Nick Verhegan. I'm going to talk to Nick a little bit. Nick, you got it? I got it, I got it. First of all, congratulations. It was a really great game. Your guys came out really gunning tonight, this afternoon. Yeah, absolutely. It's what's got us here. We can't go away from the things that have got us here. We work a lot in our shooting. We work a lot on attacking with the ball and off the ball and off the pass. They believed in what we've been working on for what I've been working on for four years with a lot of these guys. It's paying dividends. These guys are awesome. I'm going to talk about the downside just a little bit. I thought against Sheboygan Christian you guys really struggled with pressure late in the second half and I saw a little bit of that here in the second half against Western Wisconsin. Talk a little bit about handling pressure. Oh boy, the pressure was there. Those are things that we replicate in practice and we get guys just grinding on guys, double teams, six on five, seven on five kind of stuff. And today it's just credit to the teams. As you mentioned Christian and CWC here, give credit to those guys for battling back and putting that pressure on us. They could have easily folded and they didn't. That's a class act and just a great competitor and that coach and all those players. They deserve to be here. I'm proud of the pressure they put on us and I'm glad the way they put that pressure on us. On the upside I thought your team down the stretch handled the pressure very well and got into a half court game and were able to get some penetration and easy shots especially for Sheley. Yeah, at the end the message at the end was our next buckets are going to be wide open layups and free throws. We struggled from the line terribly at the end but we handled the pressure as you mentioned the pressure was something that got to us but it wasn't unheard of. On the quarter you missed about five out of six I think or so but down at the end when it came pressure point you made six in a row. And that was huge. I mean I trust in all these guys I want Tyler to get to the line and Tyler wants to get to the line. He's our best free throw shooter. Hey, the only guy I wanted at the line instead of him was me. That was me. Oh, you! Absolutely. We want to get him to the line. You're right. He's a good free throw shooter. I thought you did a great job of coaching two call timeouts at the right time. Had some adjustments that you made. It's nice to be able to call timeouts when we're up and we were on a run and be able to embrace what these fans are bringing. I mean look at this. It's crazy. How many fans we have. It's hundreds and hundreds of supporters. 500 tickets they sold yesterday. And how many guys walked in. How many families walked in. For them to dedicate so much time and travel to come here and support these 14 young men and these four coaches and three managers it's a special thing. I'm so blessed to be a part of it. We're going to send Phil over here. Have him talk a little bit. Thank you very much. Hey, Phil. Congratulations. Thank you. Great win. I thought you guys really handled the pressure down the end. Down at the end really quite well. A little better than you did maybe against a Sheboygan Luther but a great win here tonight. Yeah, that second half they brought the pressure. We knew it was going to come at high. 2-2-1 Coach prepared us for it and we ran it pretty well. Got the ball to the middle and it could get some layups on it. Talk a little bit about the game plan going in with Tyler Diem their big center. It was just to double him down low and whenever he gets it for some left you like to go up right finished strong and he's a good player and he can also shoot from the outside so we had to watch that. Ryan Shewe did a great job on him today. It was nice to double him down a little bit get him frustrated a little bit but he's a good player. I thought it got a little chippy out there late in the first half because you guys really had it on him in that first half especially in the first quarter. What was going on out there? Jake was on fire first half. He was 5-5 in the first quarter. You could tell they were frustrated whenever he'd shoot, drain it. I could see some of their guys just deflated right away. They'd open shots. They didn't follow the first half for him. They got some of the second half but on that first half they were frustrated. They played some pretty good defense on him but you could tell they all rattled from that first half by Jers. I want you guys to take it home on Thursday and then hopefully I can get down there on Saturday and watch you guys play all the best. Great game tonight, Phil. Great calling your games this year. Thank you. Thanks for coming. With that we're going to wrap up the ball game again. Sheboygan Lutheran a winner by a score of 67-56. We want to thank Richard Bartson for making the trip down here. Phil, I know Chris is really happy and the only downside to the win Chris is you should have been sitting in my spot doing these interviews. No, no. You deserve it. What a great day. What a great day for Sheboygan. Like I mentioned before, a lot of teams set out goals to get to state and these gentlemen accomplished your goals and hopefully it will be a very enjoyable week, a week that the young men will never forget. Sheboygan Lutheran, all the best. Congratulations for a fine season to western Wisconsin Christian. And with that for Richard our cameraman for my partner Chris Wright, I'm Mike Martin saying thanks for watching everybody and we'll see you down the road.


When organizations enter foreign markets they make decisions about what kind of marketing an organizational setup to choose. As marketers we talk about making decisions about an organization's entry mode. However before we start let us list the learning goals for this video. Firstly the goal is to understand what an entry mode decision is and how it's connected to the rest of the internationalization process. Secondly why this decision is important and subsequently how we can go about making an informed choice by looking at some of the factors that influence our decision. We will also provide an overview of the different entry modes available for us to choose between. So let us begin. So how is the entry mode decision connected to the rest of the internationalization process? When an organization goes from marketing their products and services only on the home market to also target one or several foreign markets in different countries or regions we talk about an organization's internationalization process. The internationalization process starts with a choice of which foreign markets to target. We call this the market selection process. Ultimately we will define our marketing mix the four or the seven Ps for the foreign market. The marketing mix we use on the foreign markets may vary to the one we use on the home market. We would address issues regarding standardization and or adaptation of the marketing mix. However before deciding on the marketing mix we need to address how to organize our entry to the foreign market. We discuss which entry mode to use and many factors will influence our decision. Choice of entry mode is what we will address in this video. So why is choice of entry mode important and how can we go about making the right choice? Let us use an example. This French business located just outside of Paris produces French cakes and desserts. In these modern production facilities well educated confectioners develop recipes and create delicious cakes and desserts ready to be sold and distributed to cake-loving customers. The cakes and desserts are frozen immediately after production and are then distributed to a variety of catering companies, restaurants and cafes around France. So what might impact French cakes choice of entry mode to a foreign market? French cakes internal situation will have an impact. Some external factors about the particular country, region and market of choice will influence that decision. Some conditions related to possible outsourcing of activities are addressed in transaction specific factors. And finally French cakes preferences for the different characteristics of the various entry modes will also affect their choice. As we will address these four sets of factors for French cakes we will use this visual to indicate in which direction the different factors are pointing us. Some factors might indicate a move towards internalization. In other words that using a hierarchical mode is appropriate. Other factors might indicate that a move towards externalization using an export mode is more suitable. And some may indicate a more moderate approach and thereby point in the direction of an intermediate mode. So let us apply this visual to our example with French cakes as we address the four sets of factors. French cakes have set their eyes on the UK. And their initial idea is to enter the country by setting up a sales and production subsidiary in the UK. The characteristics of hierarchical modes are high setup costs. A production site and sales force carry a large investment. High risk as there is no guarantee that the initial large investment will pay off. A low level of flexibility as the large investment will make it difficult to quickly pull the plug on the UK adventure should business not prove to be as successful as hoped. A high level of control as French cakes would hold on to complete ownership of all value chain activities. Being in the position to make all decisions about target groups, distribution channels and so forth. Let us address the first set of factors, the internal factors. Let us use this visual as we evaluate French cakes internal factors and let us see if this will indicate a move towards internalization as French cakes are considering. French cakes is a small company. Their resource availability is low and therefore a large investment would be risky. They have no international experience. Making use of an external partner's expertise might prove advantageous. The cakes and desserts are not technically complex and although their cakes and desserts are good, French cakes doesn't carry a large product differentiation advantage in terms of for example brand image. An evaluation of French cakes internal factors has revealed an indication towards externalization and not towards internalization as French cakes initially suggested. French cakes also has another suggestion. Meet Mr. Thompson. Mr. Thompson is a UK based agent. He would be happy to represent French cakes and sell their products to appropriate intermediaries around the UK. Using Mr. Thompson would be using a direct export mode. The characteristics of export modes are low costs as French cakes would not need to set up any facilities, start production or hire staff. Low risk? As the investment is low French cakes will not be taking a great risk with this setup. A high level of flexibility as the ties to the UK market will be limited it would be fairly easy to pull the plug on the UK adventure should business not prove to be as successful as hoped. But also a low level of control. French cakes will have little control of how Mr. Thompson markets and sells their cakes and desserts. Will he choose appropriate sales channels? Might he favor possible competitors due to a more advantageous commission rate? And will he miss opportunities that French cakes would have been able to take advantage of if they had had their own sales staff in the UK? Let us address the second set of factors the external factors. These are factors that address the foreign market of interest in our case the UK market for cakes and desserts. Let us use the same visual as before as we evaluate the UK market for French cakes and see if they indicate a move towards French cakes second suggestion of using an agent. Although the UK is geographically close to France, research will tell us that the sociocultural distance is considerable. This would indicate that having a partner with local knowledge could prove to bridge this gap. French cakes have researched the UK market and concluded that the market is of a decent size and that it is growing at a moderate pace. Currently there are no trade barriers standing in the way of exporting goods to the UK. French cakes have discovered that the competition is intense. This would add to the level of risk should they wish to use a hierarchical mode. Therefore this indicates a move towards externalisation. Research has also shown that there are a large number of relevant intermediaries available. Mr Thompson is just one of many options in this field. Although the market has experienced growth, Brexit is believed to cause some general instability and uncertainty in the market. So an evaluation of the external factors has also revealed an indication towards externalisation. This supports French cakes second suggestion of using an agent. French cakes are still considering both options. One, a sales and production subsidiary. And two, an agent. The decision isn't made until a thorough investigation of all four sets of factors have been carried out. Some factors might prove to be a showstopper, making other factors less important when making the final decision. So let us move on to the third set of factors, the transaction specific factors. These address to what extent outsourcing, i.e. using an independent partner to carry out certain functions, is advantageous and safe. Let us use the same visual as before as we evaluate and see if they indicate a move towards French cakes first or second suggestion. The know-how and product benefits connected with the cakes and desserts are not considered difficult to transfer and explained to an independent partner. French cakes consider it unlikely that an independent partner will show opportunistic behavior. Marketing and selling their cakes and desserts will not reveal secret recipes. So an evaluation of the transaction specific factors has also revealed an indication towards externalization. Let us move on to the fourth and final set of factors, the desired mode characteristics. We will evaluate French cakes wishes in terms of the main characteristics of the different types of entry modes. French cakes have expressed that they can't afford to be too risky. They have no desire to be in complete control of the operation. They see the UK adventure more as a first and trial and error step in their internationalization process. Therefore, they are also very keen on a high level of flexibility so that they are able to pull the plug on their UK adventure should business not prove to be as successful as hoped. An evaluation of these and the other three sets of factors indicate a move towards externalization, which support French cakes second option of using a UK agent, a direct export mode. Now we have evaluated four sets of factors that will influence French cakes decision of entry mode. We have addressed the internal factors, the external factors regarding the UK market, the factors evaluating outsourcing suitability, and which mode characteristics French cakes desire. Conducting a systematic evaluation of all four sets of factors has enabled us to recommend a suitable entry mode for French cakes. We have now established what an entry mode decision is and why we need to know about it. We have also gained knowledge of how to evaluate four sets of factors, which will help us decide on a suitable entry mode. And we have established the connection to the rest of the internationalization process. So let's move on. Organizations might choose one or a combination of different entry modes during their internationalization process to one or several foreign markets. The different entry modes will not be discussed in detail in this video, but let us just provide an overview. Export modes include direct export, cooperative export and indirect export. Direct export is the mode we recommended for French cakes in the example used in this video. Intermediate entry modes include joint venture, strategic alliance, franchising, licensing, contract manufacturing and management contracting. And finally, with the highest level of internalization, the hierarchical modes, transnational organization, region centers, sales and production subsidiaries, resident sales representative or subsidiary and domestic based sales representative. Sales and production subsidiary is the mode initially considered by French cakes in our example. In summary, we have now obtained an understanding of the what, why and how of entry mode decision. And finally, we have provided an overview of the different types of entry modes. Do you want to learn more about entry mode decision making, market entry strategies and each of the different entry modes, the internationalization process and global marketing in general? I recommend that you read Global Marketing, seventh edition by Svint Hollinsen. My name is Tina Wade. Thank you for watching.


Aloha. This is Think Tech Hawaii. And this is the show Politics for the People. I'm your host, Stephanie Soul Dalton. And our topic is how Biden can build back better for his presidency and save it from the currently descending poll numbers and rising disapproval ratings. Welcome also to the panelists who are our guests today to join in the discussion of this issue. And that we wanna say hello to Jay Fidel and Tim Appichella and Winston Welch. So welcome to the program and being on the panel. Now, moving on to our questions for the day to start that discussion, Jay Fidel, you know, Biden's first year ratings seem to more reflect his misses and ignore his gains. But what does he do now with this feedback that he has from the polls and the disapproval data? So can you tell us what you're thinking about this and what he can do? Well, I start by saying it's a combination of his own mistakes, which is hard to get away from and Republicans attacking him. And those two things, you know, they interact and make it hard for him. And some of his appointees aren't working well. You know, I get Merrick Garland who manages to spend more time making decisions that you and I and my puppy can make almost immediately. And he takes weeks, months to do it. Really remarkable. I'm not sure that Tony Blinken is doing what I would want him to do in terms of foreign policy. And there was an article recently by Ron Klain who I thought was a really good pick. Maybe he's not so good a pick. So Blinken has surrounded him. So then, of course, he's really vice presidential in his approach to things. And he's going to kind of work it all out. And now after a year of being beat up and undermined by the GOPs, he's realizing that you can't negotiate somebody who has determined not to negotiate with you. I mean, any first year lawyer could tell you that. So I don't know if there's anything much he can do because it's a momentum now. It defines his presidency. A year is a long honeymoon. If he were going to change his approach, his style, he would become stronger or consistent. He would get his cabinet to be stronger, more consistent. And he would generally act in a more affirmative leadership way. One of the things that was in the article, I think Winston said around this morning, which I was very impressed, was that they, that's Biden and his administration, as well as all of us have to cope with people on the other side of the spectrum, the aisles, who are determined to bring him down and bring the country down. This is very hard to do because the old techniques, the old strategies don't really apply. He has to be stronger than he might have otherwise been. He has to take more affirmative stances. He has to deal with pathological people, who are taking pathological positions. This is hard for anyone, any one of us, but it's especially hard for him because it's not his style. We know his style is not like that at all. So he's got to learn on the job, he's got to learn soon, he's got to learn now that his whole orientation has to be different. He has to speak truth to power. He has to take steps to argue back. He has to make it clear that he's on the high road. He has to tell us what we already know. He has to repeat what he said, just like a Republican stew. And he has to speak to people who are very hard to speak to. And finally, this is my biggest point of all, if he wants to recover his administration, he's got to develop a democratic party infrastructure around the country.  And I guess one last point is, frankly, he's got to find somebody, maybe a couple of people who will be on the democratic ticket for 2024. He should not run. He should get somebody else to run and he should do that right away. Okay, okay, thank you. You know, the feedback Tim is pretty harsh in the polls. I mean, he's fallen almost as low as Trump and in patterns that are different from other presidents. What do you think about the feedback he's getting in the polls? Is that quality that Biden really ought to be paying attention to? Can you talk a little bit about how he might be processing all of this? Because he certainly has a lot of advice on the other side too, so yes. Yeah, he said he wasn't going to run his presidency based on polling. And I agree with that position. However, Georgia just came out with a polling of his favorability rate. He's gone from 60, 61 down to 33. That's pretty bad. So you may not run your presidency based on polling, but you better listen to it and figure out what you're doing wrong. And I agree with Jay, he's got to take steps. But steps I think is actions and he needs to take actions. And one of the first actions is he's got to get his own party unified and they're not. And particularly that was with Joe Manchin in cinema. That's a disaster that's taken place and that has egg all over his face. And that's part of the reason why he has dropped in the polling. I think in African-Americans in Georgia have lost confidence in Biden and that's why his poll numbers are suffering the way they are. He's got a long road to come back up on and that is not easy once you're this far down but he can do it. And I think he can do it in a couple of ways. One, they've got to stop coming in with the whole enchilada concept when they bring bills to the floor. You know, I think the build back better was the whole enchilada and the kitchen sink too. And you got to stop that approach. You've got to get buy off a consensus on each portion of a bill that you want to bring in and maybe you do break it up. I know he thought he didn't have much time and that the 2022 midterm elections would come and break up his ability to get anything done. But by bringing in such large packages for legislation that didn't work for him. That strategy has failed. So I would go back to Joe Manchin and send him on, say, look, let's break up BBB. Let's find something that we can all agree on. Yeah, we're not getting 3 point trillion. We're not getting the 1.75 trillion. Let's settle on 900, 950 billion of programs that you can live with and the country will benefit from.  You go to, again, some minuscule modification of the filibuster. And then you try to get Republicans on that too. I don't think he's done a whole lot on reaching out to Republicans, certainly according to Mitt Romney, that he reached out for him and tried to bring him over. So he needs to start on those two bills that have stalled and get going on that quick. And then some new initiatives. But he's not going to build back his numbers if he doesn't get something going. Good points. I think I'm hearing he needs to be more flexible in his legislating plans. And do you think that he's mimicking Obama in terms of going in with big things and has that experience to draw on? Yeah, I think that's what he has been doing. Again, I don't blame him for what he was trying to do because he knows that he was going to lose the House in 2022, probably, and he thought, this is it. I got one year to get this stuff done, a year and a half. And so he went for it. He went for the whole thing and didn't work out. So now he's got to salvage his attempt and get that which he can get done before the midterm elections. And who knows if he does get something done that people like. Maybe he can salvage the 2022 midterm vote. OK. I'm starting to hear Joe Biden's name in the same sentence as Jimmy Carter. And that's not good. This is not good, yeah. Well, thank you. That's a very sad point to end the comment on. But we can get back to it. And Winston, I was wanting you to talk about whether he should do something about this. So this is the Supreme Court nomination. I just have to ask it. It just came up last night. So now that we have this new Supreme Court nomination, do you see in that process that he's going to go through any opportunities for him to score or not? How is that maybe going to work for him? Excuse me, in light of what Tim is saying. Well, I think her is right and him. Because he already, this is just a check that he wrote that's being cashed now. Obviously, there was some. Stephen Ryder was looking at what happened with Ruth Bader Ginsburg and decided he needed to retire now, rather than have this come up. But that said a lot of, she was very important in her decisions and her reasonings in the last years of her life. So these justices control when they are going to resign, or if they indeed die in office. So the thing is, as soon as they announce this, the second they announce, the media, they're already done. And the media is all over it. What I thought was interesting, though, was that there wasn't a squawk from the Republicans. Lindsey Graham gave some little minor thing that says, oh, I suppose it'll happen because Joe Biden controls the process now. Well, he's not been able to pass his build back better or whatever legislation he's wanted to get because of a system and mention. But apparently they're going to go for be part of this 50-vote block plus Kamala Harris to push any nomination he has over the line. And of course, he's already promised this to a African-American woman. And I think that it's in the same way that he did for his vice presidential nomination. So that check was already written at some level. And he's just catching it now. I don't know that it will score points. Maybe it will. But his reasoning behind it was that the Supreme Court should look more like America. So in that regard, he's making this slow, steady progress. And Americans don't like slow, steady progress. They've become accustomed to loud, noisy distraction and seemingly random decisions that just have chaos everywhere because maybe I don't know it's more entertaining or it's just exhausting to follow. I'm not sure what that was. But Joe Biden is not that fellow. Given that reality of that Americans have a 30-second sound bite, not even 30 seconds, it's still the next TikTok comes in. I don't think it's 30 seconds long. He needs to send out his legion of very competent, qualified, democratic spokespeople in his cabinet, the Pete Booty judges, the Kamala Harrises, whoever, the Amy Klobuchar, who aren't in his cabinet that want to be there.  And in that, as Tim was saying or Jay was saying, that he needs to reach out to the Mitt Romney's and the other folks and say, hey, you write this legislation. Let's see what you can come up with. If you're really intent on salvaging our nation as we understand it to be. And I think Mitt Romney could be counted. And not in a lot of people with an R after their name could be counted on that. Let them start writing this legislation, breaking the chains that they're bound to right now, seemingly, because they don't want to be beholded to one man or one person who controls that party at this point. Yeah, I'm glad that you got back to that because in saying he's gonna push this nomination through based on the tie and the Kamala Harris vote. But he's obviously just on the razor's edge now. And why is it that cinema will necessarily go along with this? Did you all see Winston that the Republicans were all shaking hands with her? They did a zoom in with the little light at the end of the vote. And the Republic, she was standing there in the back of the door and they were all coming up and shaking her hand. So why is she gonna go along with this Supreme Court nomination? You think this one? That's a good question. And I don't know that she will. I mean, really, she and Joe Manchin could very easily have an R after their name or if they wanted to make it more politically correct or flexible, an I for independent. But essentially, she says certain things about voting rights and yet she's not delivering. So she's really serious about those sorts of issues. Let her write the legislation that she can feels that she can get passed with her Republican friends and reach out across the aisle for something that's common sense that everybody can support. I don't know that it would not surprise me as she voted against the candidates at least the initial ones had been proffered. We don't know who's actually going to be nominated to take this place. But let's just assume and hope and pray that it's somebody that she would be unwise to go against and that this person, that the qualifications will be impeccable. And I mean, look how fast you had. Nobody wants another Brent Kavanaugh situation to come in. Look how fast Amy Comey Barrett went in. I think probably the Republicans realized it doesn't matter who they put in there. We still have six to three and that's not gonna change. Well, that's interesting. Thank you. Well, Jay, let's switch over now with Maiden's dilemma to look at the international side of it.  And which way into Ukraine or back off? What do you think is gonna happen and what should Biden do? I believe he's gonna take Ukraine without firing a shot. I think he's gonna use cyber attacks on Ukraine. He's gonna use political gambits on Ukraine. He's gonna undermine Zelensky. He's gonna use Germany and the rest of the EU in a kind of propaganda war. And he's gonna essentially undermine the Ukraine government till the point where he gets to control it without firing a shot. Let's see what happens. You guys can bet me a pizza on that. There'll be no war. He's a very smart, very clever guy and he has all kinds of tools in his toolkit. And he's playing Biden. He's playing Blinken. I mean, this goes back to your first question. That they are likely to be embarrassed here.  But let me go back to some of the other points that have been discussed this morning. And that is, for example, on the Stephen Breyer replacement, yeah, first of all, my view of cinema and mansion is that they are Republican operatives. There's a deal there.  They've made him wait, they've made him look bad and the result, the outcome has been awful. They've done a just remarkable job. You gotta hand it to them as Republican operatives. They really do have ours next to their names and that's not gonna change. Okay, so then you bring in a replacement for Stephen Breyer. I believe he should have retired a long time ago. He should have given Biden more time. Now Biden is up against a change in Congress on 2022. He'll be less powerful after November. But I think the Republicans are gonna do everything they can possibly do in the current configuration of Congress to stop that nomination. And then if they win the Senate, which I think they will win the Senate starting 2023, there'll be no Biden candidate who's gonna get through. But even now, I don't think a Biden candidate is gonna get through. They're gonna find something wrong with them.  There's gonna be delay tactics on every candidate. And this is not only to stop one relatively inconsequential member of the court because it's still gonna be the six to three. It's to make Biden look bad, make the Democrats look bad, undermine their influence, their authority, their popularity. That's what's gonna happen on the Supreme Court. I feel pretty clear about that. And the other thing is, you talk about, everybody has ideas, including that article you sent around this morning, which was so impressive when it said about what can be done. The reality is not much can be done. You can't change the way Biden operates and you can't cast off the mistakes he's made. It's A, very likely he's gonna continue to make mistakes. B, it is very likely that the Republicans are going to attack everything he does. And C, the party is fragmented. The fragmentation was a real undermine for the Build Back Better bill. They were fighting among themselves. I don't know how that's gonna change. You need a strong leader who bat heads and he doesn't qualify for that. So I think we're gonna have more of the same. It's gonna continue, his ratings are gonna be low. And that's why I say the only way out of this little trap that Trump set for him, which is playing out now, is for him to pick a ticket. The regrettable thing there is there's nobody, nobody visibly capable of doing that. And I don't know where that person comes from. But then we do have 330 million people. There must be somebody in the crowd who would qualify. Stephanie, have you thought about this? Well, I like Buttigieg. I mean, there are numbers of them. I think you're right. There are among them.  That have thought about running? Have you thought about running? Oh, yes, certainly. I wanna be the first female president. I think I can pass on that, but I certainly know other people that would be willing to take it on. But I think in that wonderful article, I don't know if you're referring to the one Winston sent that was the seven points of how to... That's the one. Yeah, yeah. So I know that Tim responded to it and I did too. And I wanted to go back and have a chance to just talk about that a little bit too, Tim. So I think that what Jay is saying to us is that he's not expecting a big change for buying to do a huge shift. And that would mean not a shift in his rhetoric, okay? Because that's one of the things that counts according to that discussion, that piece, and it's discussion of how to sustain democracy and interfere with the authoritarianism or autocracy. So one of the things is maybe he could... He looks like he's trying to ramp up the rhetoric. Let me know if you agree with me about that. But the other one to talk about too is if he can ramp up the rhetoric to the point of getting attention paid and being dignified. Can he play the judo? The point of the judo where the game rules are changed so that the advantages of what... Are you asking me this question or Tim? I was gonna shift it over to Tim. But do you have something to say about this? Yeah, the answer is no, he can't. It's not in his DNA. He's not like that. He's had decades and decades of experience in government. We know his movie. We know how he operates. And he's not gonna be able to change his spots. I'm sorry. So that just supports my view that this is gonna continue lurching from crisis to crisis. And he's not capable of getting it resolved. And furthermore, I would go back to something Tim said. The rhetoric is one thing, but you really have to have outcomes, scores. You have to have successes. And query whether he's able to do that. Well, Tim... Oh, Stephanie, I just saw Don't Look Up movie last night. And I feel like this conversation is synonymous with a big meteorite hurling towards Earth for its destruction, or in this case, Biden's administration. I don't quite take on Jay's viewpoint on some of the stuff. And I guess I'll just go with Manchin and Sinema putting an R by their name. I suppose we'll find out exactly where they stand when it comes to this Supreme Court nominee. And in the old finance business and institutional investing, there's an old saying, the trend is your friend. So if you had both those senators, Nick's build back better and the voting rights. And then if they nick the nomination that Joe Biden wants, then I would say that's a trend. And that would put some weight behind Jay's words that they really should run as independents in the future because they're certainly not going along with the Democratic Party. Yeah, well, I see you're saying in the future. Okay, because to change over from their position now is they lose power, Tim. So... Yeah, I know that, yeah. And so they're not going to. But if Biden and administration and all the other Democrats want to see them as their fellow colleagues, that may be difficult if they buck the nominations, the nominee that Joe Biden wants to set forth. So it's up to them. And then the bottom line is Joe Biden's in trouble, but I don't think, I think he can reverse things. I think he's got still a very good staff that and Joe Biden does listen to people. I think that's a good quality that President Biden has versus President Trump. He actually will listen to the people he's surrounded himself with. And I think they can turn this around. But again, without accomplishments, forget it.  And I also disagree with a little bit with Jay about finding someone on the ticket for the next term.  And I don't think he needs that. That's good. He may play these exercises in his mind and do a little on the back of a napkin on who he thinks should take over, but certainly not making any overtures or even any conversations with anybody about it because Washington D.C. leaks like a sieve.  Yeah, well, those are good comments. Thank you. Winston, I wanted to just jump back to the judo question where the GOP has been so successful with, in using the benefits and advantages of democracy against itself, which they've done over and over again. So can you talk about whether Biden has the capacity to maybe move into doing some of that himself? I mean, that's a pretty complicated game if you don't know it, but can he start to play something like that and would that help? Well, for our gentle viewers who may be wondering where the article that we're talking about, it was written by Tri-Giv Olson, the founder of... Tri-Giv, Tri-Giv. Tri-Giv. Okay, he's a senior... Tri-Giv, Tri-Giv Olson. He's senior advisor to the Lincoln Project. This is not a radical Democrat, right? He worked for senior levels of Republican politics and spent two decades training people from 40 countries, struggling to build democracies for the International Republican Institute, which was led by the late Senator John McCain. So this is not a radical leftist... And the name of the article that he wrote for the Lincoln Project is What Can I Do? Seven rules for defending our democracy. It's an interesting read. It's an important read. It's one of many out there that just says, what can I do? What can we do? You know, look, Joe Biden is our president. He's a decent man. He will make mistakes. He's entitled to make mistakes. He's also entitled to change direction and change his mind and pivot to where he can see the best advantages. He knows where he's at. In some ways, you know, given that we're so prone to the, as I mentioned before, this five second rule, you know, about our attention span, he may be here ending up stronger in the long run because he is the tortoise. And we're not seeing all the things that he'd done, but he actually, when I was reading about the nominations for the Supreme Court, he's had more folks appointed there than any of the president in recent memory. The judges, for the Supreme Court. Judges. And I think I read that 80% of them are women and over half were people of color. So he is, you know, moving forward, he's getting work done. It's not glamorous, sexy, noisy, splashy, chaotic, traumatic. It's just getting the work of government done. That doesn't sell very well being, you know, the postal delivery man, but you don't, you try not having the postal delivery man. That's basically what we had for the last, you know, four years before that and it's chaos. And so he is, the post, not delivery man, the postal letter carrier. Sorry, sorry for my slip, but basically sometimes my postal letter carries a man and sometimes a woman. So anyway, the point is that Joe Biden, he is going to, he's our president for the next three years, barring some disaster. And I agree 100% with what Tim said, he should not endorse or suggest that he's not going to run again until maybe, you know, June or March of that election year, if that were the case. And if I were him, I wouldn't endorse anybody. I would throw it open and see who rises to the top for the masses and who's going to be the strongest candidate. And I think that's what he would do. Well, we're out of time. So what I'd like to do is wrap up with just really brief comments just going around the three of you. So why don't we start with Jay and then just finish up with a closing comment for this topic. Thank you, Jay. Well, yeah, I don't think that putting a candidate forward and take it forward, it should happen immediately, but it should happen soon. And I would say sooner than the year of the election. That's too late. But I don't think he's going to make it. If you just look at the way he walks and talks, he doesn't have the strength that he had a year ago. So we need somebody who is apparently strong. That's one thing. The other thing is all the advice we're getting about what to do, it's very hard to avoid the noise. I get, for example, hundreds of requests every day for money from all these organizations. And I have learned to be suspicious of them. I have learned to be suspicious on a wolf in sheep's clothing. And I have learned to be suspicious of organizations which are out there raising money for their own pockets. I have learned to be suspicious about organizations which don't really represent the people they say they're representing and so forth. I wish that somebody could emerge as an organization. They all want money, right? As an organization that could actually do some stuff with that money. But there are so many of them that I can't trust a lot of them. And maybe Vladimir Putin is putting some of those out there on the internet too. You can't overlook that possibility. So what I'm saying is if there was an organization that emerged as a legitimate representative of the Democratic Party and of these principles, that would help. So far, it hasn't happened. Okay, thank you. Tim, wrap up briefly. When I think about what came before Joe Biden was Trump and what could come after Joe Biden as far as a GOP candidate, I'm reminded of an old Turkish proverb. And that is when a clown moves into the palace, the clown doesn't become a king, the palace becomes a circus. And I don't care who's there on the Democratic ticket for Joe Biden or after Joe Biden, it's gonna be a whole lot better than what's lined up as potential candidates in the GOP party because the GOP party has disintegrated into a laughing stock, into a circus itself. So no matter what it is, who it is, it's gonna be 10 times better than any candidate the GOP could put up there. Interesting point. Thank you, Tim. Winston, final comment. Oh, I love that quote, Tim. That's really good, that proverb from Turkey. Yeah, maybe, who knows? Maybe the Republicans will snap out of it and they'll realize that they need to reclaim their party, their principled conservative party, which moves towards the center. And maybe they'll run someone like the governor of the Maryland or someone who is not prone to histrionics and who is a principled Republican, conservative person who seems like, okay, we can deal with this fellow. And maybe, like Tim said, the Democrats could do the same. They just choose someone who is a moderate person appealing to the majority of voters across the spectrum so that we can continue to have a sane, stable, adult person in the White House surrounded by competent, clear thinking, rational and kind humans. And let's hope for the best there. And I still wanna have faith in our country, men and women that we can make those right choices. It's a matter of all of us educating ourselves and each other and making the right choices. Very good, thank you. We are out of time and thank you, Jay. My down, Tim Apichella and Winston Welch for participating today in this discussion. And thank you viewers for viewing. And this show will be on again next week. We'll see you then, Aloha and Mahalo.