We encourage you to get that done today and we are over a thousand pre-registered already. So excited, it's going to be a packed house, a celebration of sorts on the work that's happening to move the economy of Appalachia, Kentucky forward. It's actually over 90 different booths will be set up that are demonstrating projects or activities that line up with this overarching plan for the future of the region. So it's very strategic, it's not just anybody comes set up a booth. These are people who understand the plan and have done something to move it forward. So we're going to have people like the robotics team from Belfry High School talking about 21st century workforce and the training and education that's going to require stem and robotics are a big part of that. We're going to have the Kentucky Wired booth here talking about broadband connectivity. The people who are working that project, along with lots of local internet providers that are working on building out broadband in local communities. All that under one roof over a thousand people that are connecting in a way to be on the same page and work together to move the region forward. We will be taking registration down soon, the actual deadline is today, you can go to our website and check for updates but for sure go to theirsafuture.org to that event webpage that is where we keep all the updates and what you can see all the projects that are going to be showcased, you can see that entire list there, you can see all the keynote speakers, the agenda and so we encourage you to go do that today. We do have some scholarships, we don't want the price of admission to keep anybody from being able to come so just email our office, you can find our email on there if you need the scholarship or interested in that and students if you're a student and you want to attend we got scholarships for you, email us we can get that out to you but we want people here, we want you to be here and be a part of this movement.


Good afternoon everybody. Welcome to the Climate Change and Monetary Policy How Far Have We Come session. I'm very pleased to see you here back today with the CIF Society webinar. You are important stakeholders and we announced important climate measures today. So I'm really pleased that we have an excellent panel today for you to present the measures we announced and have a discussion with you to answer your questions and hear your feedback. We have in our panel today Frank Alderson, Executive Board Member of the European Central Bank, Toto Silvone and Deputy Director at the Market Operations, the Business Area and Elke Heinle, Head of the Division at Risk Management. Both three of them are very heavily involved in the work and they're, I'm sure they can give an excellent presentation. So Frank, first I want to give the floor to you to give an introduction of all the measures we have taken. So that means actually all the central banks in the Euro system decided to account for climate change in our corporate bond purchases, in our collateral framework, disclosure requirements and risk management. So my colleagues here, Toto and Elke, will tell you more about the specificities of these measures. But before giving them the floor, I would like to somehow set the scene by explaining and recalling what the role of the European Central Bank is and how the actions fit within our mandate and what is next. The ECB takes climate change very seriously. And why is that? Well, climate change has clear macroeconomic and financial implications and has consequences for price stability. As such, the ECB governing council is firmly committed to address these consequences. These measures announced today are designed in full accordance with the Euro system's primary objective of maintaining price stability. And they aim to better take into account climate-related financial risk in the Euro system balance sheet. The measures also support, without prejudice, to our price stability objective and with reference to our secondary objective, the green transition of the economy in line with the EU's climate neutrality objectives. Moreover, our measures provide incentives to companies and financial institutions to be more transparent about their carbon emissions and to reduce them. With these measures, we set important steps to systematically and consistently integrate climate and environmental considerations into our activities. But we will not stop here. Looking ahead, the governing council is committed to regularly reviewing all the measures outlined above. We will assess their effects and adapt them, if necessary, to confirm that they continue to fulfill their monetary policy objectives two, to ensure within our mandate that the relevant measures continue to support the decarbonization path to reach the goals of the payers agreement and the EU climate neutrality objectives and three, to respond to future improvements in climate data and climate risk modeling and changes in regulation and fourth, to address additional environmental challenges within our mandate. Now, finally, before I give the floor to my colleagues, let me put our actions in some perspective. Governments and parliaments have the primary responsibility to mitigate the effects of climate change, because they have the most appropriate toolbox to do so. Monetary policy and banking supervision cannot be a substitute for ambitious and decisive fiscal and regulatory action. But nevertheless, we all have a duty to do our part and ask ourselves how we can contribute to the fight against climate change. And this is a task for all of us, including the ECB. Therefore, I'm pleased to announce that today we also publish our ECB-wide climate agenda. This climate agenda provides a comprehensive overview of the climate actions that we are taking at all fronts, from supervision and financial stability to our macroeconomic modeling work and producing our banknotes in a more sustainable manner. With these commitments taken together, we aim to make a real difference with the tasks that we have been given and within the mandate that we have. So thank you once again, looking forward to a lively conversation and glad to pass the floor to my colleagues. Yes, thanks so much, Frank, for your introductory remarks. Toto and Elko, please, I think you have a wonderful presentation ready, so I have to give the floor to you. Thank you, Frank, and thank you, Irene, and good afternoon, everyone. It's very nice to be here and explain to you what we've been busy with the last 12 months. I thought I'd give a few slides and a little bit of background, and then we have the time for our Q&A and hopefully get feedback of any kind from you. So if you move to the first slide, or let's move to the second slide then, you see, well, first of all, let me just clarify that we are doing a lot of work in all areas, in the supervisory side as well, and then also in the finance stability side, but today we focus on monetary policy. And the justification a year ago for these measures that we will now introduce are given from two sides. The first one is that the climate change and the queen transition, so both the physical risk and the transition risk impact different macro community indicators, inflation but also growth, employment, finance stability, and therefore the transmission of our monetary policy. And that's why we have to take the climate change into account with our operational framework. The second point on the right side is that the climate change as well as transition affects the value and risk profile of assets that we hold in our balance sheet and therefore leading to greater climate-related financial risk which we have to manage, like any central bank. And so that's a natural part of our monetary policy framework as well. And if you move to the next slide, I'll start in the middle. Something that is very typical for any central bank is analytical capacity. And we are, after last year's strategy review, expanding this capacity in modelling and forecasting different economic and financial effects. That's from our monetary policy side. Then the second part of the work for this year is on the left side, which is where we will focus, to incorporate these ideas into our framework and operations. And the third part on the right side is more of the ECB at the micro-institutional level. We are also implementing action plan to our environmental sustainability disclose and reporting. So let's move to the next slide and more specifically on the four focus areas. There's actually six focus areas. We also work on the statistical data side to improve the data clarifications. And we work with the modelling on the right side. But that's not the topic of today. We will focus on these four areas where we have announced actions in each. Corporate bond purchases, disclosure requirements, collateral framework and risk management. So let's move to more concretely what we have decided. If you move one more slide. So here I'll go clockwise. And I should have introduced Elke Heinle also who has been a so-called co-lead with me from a risk management side. Everything that we've done, we've worked together with the markets that I come from and risk management where Elke comes from. But also in very close cooperation as Frank mentioned with the legal experts and monetary policy experts. So that means that we have a very comprehensive and holistic approach on any of the measures that we've considered. So today we have announced that on our corporate bond purchases, I've decided to adjust the market capitalization benchmark account for climate change factors. And I will tell detail in how we do it, how we plan to do it. The second part which also was led by the market side is disclosure requirements. We will lean on the CSRD-based disclosure requirements for issues. I will explain it more in detail. But also there are instruments which are not covered by the regulation. And we plan to act as a catalyst to promote more harmonized mandatory disclosure also for different type of structured finance instruments. And then the third area is collateral framework. We have assessed the different type of risks and come up with a plan for collateral composition limits, as well as integrate climate change risks in our HEGAC reviews. And the final area is risk assessment. We will externally engage for more transparency in credit ratings. And internally we will set up common standards for your system in-house credit assessment systems. So if you move to the next slide, we can start with the corporate bond holdings, which are quite sizable. And these holdings can be under our asset purchase program or under pandemic emergency purchase program. So all together we hold a little under 400 billion of corporate bonds. Our aim is that we now have decided to set up a tilting approach with an aim to gradual decarbonization of all these holdings on a path which is aligned with the goals of Parisian alignment. And our reinvestments, which we'll start basically from now on, will be tilted towards issues with better climate performance at the expense or relative to those issues which have a worse climate performance. And this kind of approach includes three different elements. So we tilt this market capitalization benchmark in favor of, we look backwards, we look forward, forward-looking indicators and then we'll also for disclosure quality elements. So we will tilt in favor of issues with lower carbon emissions. That's the backward-looking part. Issues with more ambitious reduction targets. That's a forward-looking part. And then at the moment issues who have better climate-related disclosures. So all those three elements are included with the so-called climate performance. We plan to start the implementation as of October 22 when we have everything set up in our systems. And additionally, we already announced a couple of years ago that there will be annual publication of climate-related information on so-called non-monetary policy portfolios, but this will include also our corporate bond holdings. And we start this in the first quarter of 2023 and we will plan to do it regularly on an annual basis. Let's move to the second measure. So the second measure is about disclosure requirements. We will base our eligibility requirement for corporate sustainability reporting directive. This was also announced in the action plan last year. There's been a slight delay due to the complexity of the system. But this agreement has been now reached just some weeks ago among different European institutions. And we will apply our disclosure requirements to all companies within the scope of the CSRD. So all type of non-financial companies. And this will have a gradual kind of application starting from 26. There are currently some larger companies which are already under the current NFRD framework. And then there will be some more large companies that will start to disclose on 27. And finally, some large SMEs or unlisted SMEs, no sorry, listed SMEs in 27. So we will gradually implement these disclosure requirements. But not every type of asset is under the CSRD regulation. And we feel that it's important to support better and harmonious disclosure of climate-related data, particularly from asset-backed securities and covered bonds. And this is because we actually quite a lot of collateral for that type of assets. That's what it's mentioned in the first bullet point. This is something that we see our role more as a catalyst that we will close very closely with European market authorities. For example, the European Securities Markets Authority in case of asset-backed securities. And now I will give the floor to Elke for collateral framework. Thank you, Tutu. So on the collateral framework, in line with the EuroSystems Action Plan, the EuroSystem has reviewed its risk control framework to ensure that climate change risks are adequately reflected. As a result of this review, the EuroSystem has decided to adopt two measures. The first measure relates to the setting up of collateral pool composition limits for each individual counterparty that participates in EuroSystem credit operations. So going forward, the EuroSystem will limit the share of high-carbon assets that these counterparties can mobilize as collateral when borrowing from the EuroSystem. At the beginning, this measure will be applied to marketable debt instruments issued by non-financial corporations. This is because here the financial risks are the highest and also because data quality here is the best. And as this data quality improves, the measure could also be extended to additional asset classes, such as marketable debt instruments issued by financial entities, so-called uncovered bank bonds, and also to private sector non-marketable debt instruments, so-called credit claims or bank loans. The implementation of such of these collateral pool limits depends on a number of operational and technical preconditions in the EuroSystem's collateral management systems. We expect a go-live of this new measure by end of 2024. But to encourage banks and other counterparties to prepare early for these collateral pool limits, we will run tests of the limits regime ahead of the actual implementation. Further details on this will be communicated then in due course. The second measure relates to incorporating the climate risk dimension as part of the reviews of the risk control framework. So in concrete terms, we will assess on an annual basis the adequacy of our haircuts that we apply to our corporate bonds that we accept as collateral vis-a-vis the climate risk dimension. So one day, if warranted, we may then apply differentiated haircuts based on this climate risk dimension. For instance, it could be lower haircuts for low-emitting corporates or higher haircuts for high emitters. As also pointed out by Frank Alderson, all collateral measures related to climate change need to ensure that monetary policy continues to be implemented effectively. For the collateral framework, this means that all measures need to ensure and will ensure that ample collateral remains available. Let me then turn to the next slide, please. So in the area of risk assessment and risk management, we had committed in our action plan to scrutinize the credit ratings that we use to determine eligibility for our collateral assets as well as our assets bought in the purchase programs. For our marketable assets, we mainly use the assessments of the credit rating agencies. As you may know, the euro system currently accepts the ratings of the four largest credit rating agencies, namely Fitch, Moody's Standard & Poor's and DBRS, and we have therefore conducted an in-depth research on how these four credit rating agencies currently incorporate climate change risks in their credit rating methodologies. While all rating agencies, we really have to acknowledge this, have improved the level of disclosure in recent months. There's still quite some heterogeneity of climate risk disclosure, and there's also still scope for improvement. This heterogeneity is not only across the rating agencies, but it's also across the various asset classes that the rating agencies provide credit assessments for. The euro system will therefore urge further rating agencies to become more transparent about how they incorporate climate risks into their ratings and to be also more ambitious in their disclosure requirements on climate risks. The euro system is also in close dialogue with the relevant authorities on this matter, in particular the European Securities and Markets Authority, ESMA. So for our non-marketable assets, the euro system has put in place several national central banks have put in place so-called in-house credit assessment systems. In euro system jargon, they are also called ICASAs. So these ICASAs are operated on a decentralized basis by the national central banks and have to adhere to some common rules and principles. To better account for climate change risks in these ratings, the euro system has agreed on a set of common minimum standards for how these systems should include climate-related risks in their ratings. These standards will need to implement it now in all systems by all national central banks by the end of 2024. Finally, on risk assessment and risk management, let me also recall that our action plan foresees the setup of a climate stress test of the euro system's balance sheet. We have already run a first internal pilot climate stress test that is currently being further refined. We plan to publish our first results in the context of our climate-related disclosures in the first quarter of 2023 in line with our commitment in the action plan. And I then will hand back to Irene. Thank you. Thank you so much, Frank, Tocha and Elke for the presentation. I think it all shows that we're really moving into the implementation phase because now we're getting technical. So I want to open the floor to all the participants today for a Q&A. Any questions you may have also on technical clarifications if need be. Just a few housekeeping rules, please raise your hand if you want to ask a question. Secondly, it would be great if you can have your camera on because we can see you and it's a bit more personal interaction. And if you don't speak, please mute yourself. I think you know the tricks for all these conferences. And please note that also this webinar will be recorded and probably expect to publish it soon as well on our website. So that's also good to know. I don't know if I see any hands for the moment. Any questions? Maybe it's all clear. So that would have been great. Because I know there are some experts in the participants room today. So I was hoping that you have questions for us because we're happy to answer them and also hear your observations. Anyone who wants to break the ice. I noticed that I see a hand. And I want to give Martin the floor. Martin, if you could please introduce yourself quickly and then ask your question. Thanks so much. Yes, can you hear me? Yes, I can hear you. Yes. Great. So I'm Martin Charles Reed from Copacic Families Europe where a European NGO representing families and citizens. So I have a question about financial stability and climate change because there was a lot of focus during the presentation on reporting monitoring and creating provisions to mitigate risk. But there seems to be a deeper discrepancy between the debt based monetary system we have stability relies on nice and stable growth, the roll over of credit into infinity. A stable debt to GDP ratio for states and a more or less parallel growth of the monetary mass compared to the total amount of available goods and services. With ideally this 2% inflation, which encourages consumption and discourages hoarding money for too long.   Now, do you believe that the ECB with this limited policy tools, which mostly rely on tweaking the level of interest rates and quantitative easing are fit for achieving financial and economic stability. And are you considering other monetary theories which could replace the debt based monetary system to address this fluctuation that will come about with climate change. Thank you very much. Well, thank you so much, Martin. I think I can give the floor maybe to Frank. Maybe I can kick off and then maybe Tota want to want to add. You know, but I would like to highlight maybe as a more general response to what I might maybe qualify as your critical, which I understand very well. And that is, you know, will what you propose today. And will that actually, you know, make make the difference. And, you know, I think the answer is goes back to what I said in my introductory words. And we at the European Central Bank are not climate policy makers. We are what we say climate policy takers. So the main, excuse me, I have this little cough so you have me to excuse me. The ECB is taking policies as a given by by those who are elected officials who have a toolbox that goes much more directly to to climate policies. And that having been said, it is clear that and I totally agree with you. And the, you know, climate change is, I think the biggest challenge of of humankind in this century. It is existential. So within our mandate. And I keep on repeating that and that is that is relevant within our mandate.  And hence, we see a concrete role for ourselves, but within that hierarchy of actors, if you like, but but total please say Bill. Thank you Frank. I was about to say the same as you started this that we are policy taker, not a maker and measures that we've come up today, they should and they will accommodate any monetary policy stance. The stance is the most important decision that the governing council decides. And then we have now taken into account this climate change risk, which is more complex and the longer term risk. But we for the first time accommodate it or take it in different ways into our monetary policy framework. That's that's one part, but they're also different dimensions. You mentioned the finance stability risk. That has been discussed and agreed or earlier when Frank started in the NGFS. That was the first kind of agreement among central banks supervisors that climate change is a financial risk. And our finance stability side is doing the economy wide climate change stress test to inform which type of all Chinese are in general effective. And then we have the supervisory side, which is doing their own part for stress test. And then on the risk management side, I give follow to Elke, but we've kind of brought that stress that back to monetary policy implementation framework level in order to manage our our risks. So it comes in kind of different aspects in different levels into the central banks activities. Elke, would you? Yes, maybe very shortly. So in line with our focus on the primary objective, of course, what we have done is we really turned every single stone in a way of checking that that climate change risks as a as a matter of financial risk that we appropriately accommodate for that. And so as you have seen when presenting the measures, they all have a financial risk component. And that was what was driving also our broad approach on climate change risks. And as Toto has also pointed out, so financial stability is dealt with in a separate work stream on climate change. Thanks so much. The three of you of giving such a complementary answer of the mandate and also on how the different activities of the ECB work together on this. I hope this answers your question, Martin. I have another question, hand raised from again from Tilburg from the Sustainable Finance Lab, Rens, for us. Yes. Thank you very much, Irene. And well, I've got one compliment and three questions. So let's start with the compliment. So I would like to thank all of you very much for for taking these very important steps. I think we're witnessing indeed what you can call a watershed moment with the ECB taking action and going beyond the risk perspective there. I think that was something I found very interesting that you put so much emphasis on supporting the green transition of the economy. So I think that's our very good, good developments. Then my three questions. So the first one is there is this focus on marketable depth instruments, partly also because that's where where we have the data for available. But my question is, how do you see the possibilities to actually step up there the action a bit and not only waiting for the CSRD, but indeed setting a standard yourself as an ECB for instance around the collateral framework. So also moving into the bank loans that I've already been mentioned, because I would say my question is do you agree with that that the moment that the ECB would actually put a standard there and say also for the smaller bank loans. We don't want to have too large concentrations in fossil intensive companies. That banks will actually come up with those data. And I think there's also a push from from supervision to come up with the same kind of data. And then we don't need to wait for that essentially what what you put on the table now until 2026. Before we do this for the largest companies, but we can also do it for the smaller ones. My second question is on the one instrument that I think is still very much missing in action, the tel throw, which has been identified by the NGFS as probably the most potent instrument for for monetary policy. Especially for the eurozone with very strongly bank based economy. And I was actually getting some hope because President Lagarde was was was talking about this more recently saying we need to consider this, but I don't see any reference to it. So my question is, are you actually still considering the tel throw. And the third and last question is there's a mentioning of a regular review, which I think will be very important. But how regular will this be so will this be something that we have every year or well, happy to hear, but thank you very much for these important steps. Thank you very much. Let me start really quickly and then I'm sure my colleagues will want to add. Actually, I was hoping that you were saying that we would have gets another gotten from you three compliments and one question, but this is this is good enough. Maybe starting with the bottom, the regular review. I think it's, it's, it's important that you pick this out from our communication from our press release, because it shows that we are not saying, you know, we took a year to think about this action plan and this is it. What we have said is that yes, we have our primary objective, but yes, we also have a secondary objective and the secondary objective without predators, of course, without predators to define the primary objective is there. And it's a legal obligation. And we tend to take legal obligations seriously as you can understand. This again, without prejudice to price stability. If there is developments in, in data and modeling in, you know, also broader than just climate environmentally, we will take further steps and that means, and this brings me to your question was, how often will we do this. Well, and we have not pre-established that is the, is the, the, the factual answer. We have said that we will and talk to you just explain, we will come out with data in terms of, you know, the decarbonization path of our corporate bond holdings. We've also said that we will be in alignment with, with, you know, with, with, with the EU and Paris and climate neutrality goals. So a logical thing to do would be that if we noticed that we were lagging behind that, that alignment, we would see what we could do more. In terms of steltro, I think it's fair to say that, you know, having said what I just said, there is no, no specific instruments that are off the table. But it's also true that the governing council, when it's agreed on its action plan, you know, decided on a number of priorities at those we have now addressed. But it could very well be that in, in these, you know, subsequent revisions, other, other instruments might come up at some point. Maybe I'll leave the other question to you. Okay. First on this marketable debt versus others, it's true that there's much more data available from corporate bonds. And that's why we take this step to actually make a concrete tilting in our reinvestments. But then we noticed when we went deeper that despite all the talk, there's not really anything even in the pipeline for more harmonized reporting, mandatory reporting in certain asset classes within the euro area. And there we are not the standard setters, but I feel that we can do a lot to cooperate and act as a catalyst and that kind of develop together with the institutions which are responsible to have a meaningful and relevant standards that we can then possibly build later on some, some measures. You asked about the, I guess you meant green TLTRO even though you talked about TLTROs. That was discussed a year ago, but it was not prioritized for this first year. So we have focused on all these measures at the moment. If one considers ever such an instrument and nothing is outside the considerations and we gradually move forward with new ideas, but one has to take into account the stance first what's monetary policy stance, what type of instruments and measures you in general take. And the second part is about the data. Do you have a harmonized data from all 19 jurisdictions that you can base and really monitor that if you have a certain conditions that they are fulfilled? So we didn't consider green TLTRO at this stage, but it's not completely off the table. And as you mentioned, how often I would just add that we have always thought that all these measures are scalable, that stance will develop, the data sources will develop. We only have our own sources chosen a month or two ago. So we definitely plan to do this regular review, at least on an annual basis. But we first need to have a certain experience and that will come, for example, when we disclose the emissions of our CPP portfolio during the first quarter of next year. Thanks a lot, Toto and Frank, a very clear answer for me. And I want to, how could you want to add something on this? Just very shortly on the regular reviews, I think as I pointed out on the haircut reviews, so we have committed now to each year to check to incorporate the climate risk dimension and to see whether differentiated haircuts incorporated the climate change risks dimension are warranted. And I would say when we review any risk framework in the future, we will naturally now also look into the climate risk dimension. I think it has become an integral part of our assessments now. And I think this is a very important step that is thinking. We are really thinking now also in the climate change risk dimension perspective. And on the just very shortly on the credit claims and by when we would do something. Let me just point out on the collateral framework on the collateral pool limits. We are not going to wait until the CSRD is out there. So if we were doing that, we would need to wait until 2026. But as I said, we are committed to act to implement by the end of 2024. And this is because we use not data, not the perfect data from the CSRD, but the data from the private data providers now also using self reported data from from the to differentiate high and low carbon issues. And we are now constantly reviewing whether we could also extend this measure to the to the smaller debtors or to the credit claims, but we need some data before we can move ahead. But this with our general scrutiny now, almost on a daily basis. I think these are very important additions to the answer provided already. And I think it also shows that we just really, really incorporated into our day to day business it's not something like climate is, is something we do separately now we really like day to day business incorporating it. Now, I want to move to the next question and I have my list of the new economics foundation, because the floor is yours. I hire and thanks. And yes, I'm from a colleague's foundation is an NGO working on building a more equitable economy that also works within environmental limits. And I hope, can you hear me all right. Yeah. Yeah, so so so thanks very much for inviting us here and yeah I was echo some comments by my others here that yeah we're very pleased to see you taking action that that focuses specifically on things like carbon footprint or climate impacts and track to tackle that up front so again going beyond this pure financial risk approach. So that's something that we really welcome. And I wanted to come back to one specific policy area outline about the corporate bond holdings. So when you talk about tilting them according to the climate performance. And I ask is probably question to talk about to any of you tell us a bit more about about those metrics, and maybe if it's helpful, because I know you've started in the back of England approach to to greedy kids own corporate QE. So maybe if it's helpful you can compare your approach with what the back of England has done and maybe what are the differences are using the same or similar metrics or decided to make different choices. So in particular within that also. Yeah, I would be interested to hear as one of the criteria you list is better performance on climate climate related disclosures. So I would like to decide what one to do you mean by that. Thank you. Yes, for your for your questions. So I mentioned that we have a three different elements and I think a bank of England to a certain degree has also elements but let's take step back down and just consider the size of our corporate bond holdings. 25 30% of the entire corporate bond holdings where Bank of England owns only three 3% and our reinvestment flows will be about for the next few years about 30 billion per year and that's about the size by the way of Bank of England's corporate bonds. So whatever we do we have to think carefully that it still keeps the monitor police stance intact and we don't kind of upset the market with our measures. So I mentioned these three elements and we of course at the moment you can really start only with the backboard looking at emissions because that's the only area where you have more data with different type of sources. But that's only one one part and we put the main weight on that part but then we also want to incentivize any companies to transition towards green economy and towards the Paris line targets. And therefore we have this forward looking target where we look to the ambitiousness of the announced target by any of the eligible issuers and they are about 340 issuers that are eligible for our corporate sector purchase programs. And then we also give a score for the current disclosure quality and level so what share of the assets different assets are are disclosed and we put all this together. We made kind of a climate score and then we are just based on this ranking of the different issuers of our purchases. And we also plan to include the secondary and primary market purchases because we are we are active on both and that's slightly different from the Bank of England. Thank you for answering this question. If I don't think we've covered this one if I see Frank I don't know if you want to add something on this one. I understand we have quite some questions in the pipeline still so so let's try to be as concise. That was indeed my next point we have 15 minutes left and some questions so I now want to give the floor to stand Jordan for positive money. Yes, hello, can you hear me. Yes. Okay, thank you. Yes, indeed. It's difficult to underestimate how much work has been put into this so so thank you for for that and yeah to be with emotion that I can think of the first report we we wrote years ago and see that we checked. What if you pretty asked there so yeah that's a pretty moment for us today. Along the lines of what Lucas has asked, I wanted to be clear on one point which is on the carbon emissions. Are you including scope three there. Because that obviously that that's an important one and something the Bank of England did not do a thing. And on the quarter framework, the limit. When you say limit, I mean, can a limit go as far as basically completely excluding certain assets. Or, or, or not other limits to the limits. I guess. And yeah, third. On, on the on the green text shows and we understand that it was not in this package because this was bad. Implementing decision a year ago. And I am very pleased. I'm very happy that this package will be reviewed regularly at this annually that that's good. My question, perhaps a bit more broad, but is there a sense in the governing council or in the city that decisions made a year ago. You know, how do they match with the new reality that we have today with the war in Ukraine. This is the very high energy prices that are a big source of inflationary pressure. And from that sense, you know, is there a possibility to rethink a bit those those decision a year ago because now the new reality. And I think this is for even more proactive action, I would say, you know, the more DCB could support accelerate investment in energy efficiency and renewables. The faster this would reduce some of the sources of inflationary pressure right now right in terms of the effect of Russian gas and so on. I agree is the ECB considering this and then if you start feeling that way, then this is not just a single remandate issue. This is actually primary mandate consideration, I would say. So I'm, it's a broader question, I guess, but yeah, how is the ECB feeling about this or at least you Frank as a member of the board of the government and of the government and consider how do you feel about this particular issue. Are you one of those members that Christine again mentioned as being open to re-planning the discussion. Thank you very much. Thank you. Maybe I take the third part of the question and then my colleagues can take the other ones. I noticed that when I said that we were going to be a little bit shorter to give everyone the floor, the questions became longer. But that is that's very much forgiven and I understand your questions. You know, I would say that climate change has as a as a and everything that we are doing here today as a longer and a broader time frame than, you know, looking at, you know, at current current inflation, current. Geostatistical developments if you like. It's true that, you know, the terrible war in Ukraine has underlined for all of us. Yet another reason why it is so important to actually make progress in the energy transition. So if you allow me what I would draw from that is that the likelihood of the transitioning happening has increased. It is not just being pushed now, solely by by climate considerations, but also by if you like energy independence from this consideration. So, so from our perspective, it means that the policy makers in terms of climate policies, i.e. in the EU in the end, you know, the co-legislators are probably more likely to continue on a path that they were by the way already pretty determined to continue. In that sense, I would say these developments are are valid. But over to you. Maybe I can take the second question and then total takes takes the last one so on on the collateral limits. So, in fact, indeed, if you put the limit at zero. One could completely exclude bonds, but then we would have said it's in exclusion. So we are not going to put the limit at a level of zero. So because we do not want to exclude any assets. And also, as I mentioned, so we it's important that ample collateral remains available. That means for all asset classes. So we we have to duly calibrate the measure and also this in particular this limit such that we do not until the constrain the sufficient collateral availability and also the measure needs needs to be proportionate. But as mentioned before, there will be more detailed announcements on the details when we come closer to the implementation date. So thank you Stanislaw and glad that you asked the first question because that's one one difference. As you alluded to, I mentioned the three elements we use for the tilting scoring and we use scope one and two for all those elements. But then in addition, for the back vote looking part, we don't use at the issue level scope three, but we have included it at the sector level. So we kind of do a combination of a best in class and best in universe in order to take the most meaningful sectors into account. So so that is now taken into account and we see that it will be in the future EU benchmarks and the regulation as something that will be reported better and better. And we felt that it's not yet appropriate quality level on the issue level, but we can take it into account to a certain degree at the sector level. And just to complement the second point on the sales or exclusion, Elke mentioned collateral. I can just mention that a year ago governing council gave guidance that we should think about an inclusive approach and not sales at this moment and we can make the tilting so that we will align towards the Paris line path without the sales with our portfolio. Thanks again for the answers to the question. I see we're running a bit out of time so I would like to ask everyone to put their questions in the chat in case we don't have time to answer them all. We can come back to you in another way and with the format. But I think we have time for one last question and that is from micro human from Children's Investment Fund Foundation. Michael the floor is yours. I mean, it's a short one follows a couple of prior. Obviously, looking at emissions, disclosure and CSRD is an important starting point, but we have many NGO partners, technical partners, many investors and governments, the UK, for instance, with its transition plan taskforce, which is really looking beyond this base basic disclosure towards really more detail about what companies are doing to transition their businesses and their performance in doing that. And if you had any thoughts, you could share quickly about how you might be looking to evolve the technical frameworks here over time and the opportunity for all of us to partner with you in doing that because we obviously need to ultimately focus on on detailed transition plans and performance alongside these baseline disclosure indicators. Thank you. Well, thanks for your question. I think that's a very important topic that we will focus on more. We've so far used the kind of entire your system of force to learn these things together and and being in touch then on an individual basis, but that's something that we plan to do. Maybe think more in the future that which would be the best way to focus on the ambitions of those transition plans. Of course, we try to follow the kind of best standards which exist in the market and I think we probably come up with more details closer to October when we start our our building. And maybe to add more generally Michael to your question or your offer that you stand ready to engage. I think more generally I would like to just invite all of you. You know, we have we have a climate change center Irene as many of you know leads that and you know, we have a team of people that stands ready to engage also outside this a little bit more formalized conversation that we have today. So, so, you know, in the coming months, the coming years, whenever you have insights trying to understand what we are doing, you feel that you have, you know, knowledge that that could be helpful for us. Please reach out. Yes. Thanks. Thanks so much. And I just want to echo Frank, please, please reach out recent ready and it's a journey we're on together and your input is very much valued by the European Central Bank. With this, I want to ask, I think we're closing soon and I want, I think a survey will appear soon on your screen if you have a few seconds or minutes to fill that out that would be would be great. Maybe Frank, you want to say a few last words for now or you've done that already. Well, I mean, I can do that.  One, that many of you who have. It's a super useful role that you play who have critically followed us are critically following us are saying we recognize that today, the ECB is making real progress. I think that's that's valuable that that is something that you give back. And at the same time, you stay true to your role by saying, but, you know, there's so much more that one could consider. And we continue to have ideas that we want to share with you and we want to invite you to take seriously. So I think that combinational things is, you know, is extremely welcome. I hope that that you on the basis of the last years and what we're doing today, that you feel that we do try to take seriously any any insights that you give to us. And, and I hope this sets the tone for many years to come so that together with all our stakeholders and you are a very important part of that. And as I always say as a lawyer within our mandate, we can do as much as we can in this, this, this, this super important challenge of climate change. Can I can I just add my thanks as well to all of you because many of you have contacted us and sent your proposals and as Frank mentioned, they're very important. They give us thoughts. We then work with the nuts and bolts kind of level and see that what's possible, what's appropriate with all the considerations we have with monetary policy and legal, legal issues. But the ideas are really, really welcome and we can also check that whether we have thought everything. So many thanks to everyone. Thanks a lot, Alka, Frank and Toto, three of you for setting out our measures that we have taken and answering all the questions. Thanks a lot of all the participants today. Thanks for listening to us. Thanks for engaging with us. Now I want to round up this hour with you and I'm looking forward to further engagements with you and wishing you a very, very nice day. Thanks so much.


Imagine that you're infinite consciousness, all right, you're everything. There isn't anything that isn't you or could not be you, right? One of your most prized creations would be a place where you could experience the illusion of being separate from yourself. Boom, what's up everyone? Welcome to Simulation. I'm your host, Alan Sakyan. We are still in Los Angeles, California. We are now on the gorgeous Venice Boardwalk. We are going to be talking to David Alexander English about all things related to life, his art, and the way he communicates the inventory of his mind out to civilization. I'm super excited to have this conversation. Thanks for joining us on the show. Boom shaka laka. Huge shout out to Jason Pinsky for introducing us. Definitely. Pinsky! Pinsky! 20 dwarfs, 20 dwarfs, 20 dwarfs, 20 dwarfs.  Good question. So, you want to hear the story of my name? Yeah. Okay. So there was this woman named Avis Bean, who my mother knew was Aunt Avis. She was my mother's great uncle's girlfriend during the Depression, and they all lived in the same house when she was a little kid. Avis was in a coma in the hospital and wasn't expected to live. And so my mother and grandmother went to see her. My grandmother was standing there in the doorway talking to the nurse and my grandmother. And my mother walks up to the bed and she puts her hand on Avis' hand. And Avis comes out of the coma, sits up in bed and she says, Hello, Mitzi. My mother's nickname when she was a little kid. She said, you're pregnant.  She went back into the coma. And a few months later, she died. So growing up, I heard this story a lot. And so in a way, it was kind of like in the background of a walking meditation.   You know, when you feel like, no matter where you are, no matter what's happening, it's like, okay, so I've got to make something happen. I've got to do something with this. You know, I can't just be a dishwasher. I can't just be a taxi cab driver. But if I am being a taxi cab driver and a dishwasher, there's something here for me to learn. There's something in this moment. The universe has brought me to this moment for a reason. You know? So it's like, you know, how do I harvest that? So who the heck is David Alexander-Irlish? That's, I guess we'll know when it's over, right? Seriously. In the meantime, it's all about, you know, creating as much work as I can. Creating as much of the work that I... You know those moments when you feel like, this is why I was born. This is why I came here, right? As many of those moments as I can possibly create, you know? And the more time you spend in that zone of, you know, I can't wait to create this thing. I can't wait to, you know, get to... What do I get to do today? Okay, I get to paint this painting. I get to write this novel. I get to make this movie. I get to fly this plane. Or just stay in here and just, like, fly to the air. Isn't that amazing? I mean, I love seagulls. I can just love seagulls. I can appreciate the infinitude of my and everyone else's being. Anytime I choose, I can marvel. I can be in wonder, right? Whatever's coming at me, I have a choice.  Because we all have spiritual sovereignty. No matter whether we want to abrogate that or not. No matter whether we want to surrender to that to somebody else or not. So, who am I? It's like the blossoming. Take a snapshot. Right? Even this moment. I mean, this is just... This is right now. It's cool. It's cool. It's yummy. It's friggin' yummy. But then... What's the context? Do you need the context? You're gonna learn something either way. If you're, you know, those that have the eyes to see and the ears to hear, right? So, whoever's watching this is there's an agreement that was made before we chose to come into this world that there would be a moment of possibility, of inspiration, of self-initiation. Right? And honestly, I get... I feel totally empowered and totally nourished when I know that I've inspired people. You know, to remember who they really are and that we're all infinite and immortal beings. Right? So, you got another question? You want me to keep going? What? All right. Well, there's a lot of good stuff that you brought there. I like the... You gotta do what... You gotta do what you love every single moment of life and you gotta think about what the realization is, is the educational lesson that you're getting in every single one of those moments. Whether you are doing something that you may think is mundane or ecstatic or sad or whatever, it may be it's all a lesson in this growth that we have. There are a lot of good things. It's all fertilizer. Yeah, it's very footing. Yeah, it's all fertilizer. We have a choice, you know, to pay attention or not. One thing that we do say is that one's faculties need to be trained to see things as everything is fertilizer. The children need to be trained to know that. Not really, not trained. Once again, we're infinite and immortal beings, right? So we all have chosen to be here to take part in this unfolding and this remembrance and this reawakening, right? And nobody needs to be trained unless they've chosen to be trained. We need to remember though. Exactly. But don't we need assistance remembering from other people? People do and some people don't. Yeah. Right? And what are we remembering exactly? We're remembering our what? Infinitude, our immortal nature, our tourist cell. How are we immortal? And our reason for choosing to be born. Our reason? Okay, what is our reason for choosing to be born and how are we immortal? Exactly. Oh, so that's what you're supposed to remember. It's different for every person, right? Okay, so I am born with an intention to manifest some sort of destiny on the planet of hopefully creating some sort of benevolent value to the system of Earth. Right, right. And each one of us has a different intent that we landed here on Earth with. Right. And we have to remember what that intent was. And some people don't. Some people come with no intent. No, some people don't need to remember. Because they came here for what? They came here for whatever their reason was. But to know, to realize and remember would be antithetical, anti-productive. You know those times in your life when you're like, I really want to know a universe and there's like crickets. You don't hear anything. You don't get the information that you're asking, right? One of the reasons why that is, from my experience, is that to know the answer to that question might be counterproductive to you actually doing what it is that you came here to do. Interesting. Yeah. So you have to remain in the discovery mindset. If that's what your mission is, there are loads of people, like 90% of the people on the planet, they're not in discovery. They're not in, that's not their thing. That's not what they're here to do. They're here to fully immerse in the experience, in the illusion of being separate from the one. They're here to immerse themselves in the separation. In the illusion of being separate from the one. From the source of the one. And that's their lesson. I wouldn't say it's their lesson. I'd say for some people it's their lesson, but for some people, it's for them to say what it's for and what it is. Okay. But every person comes here, before they get here, they sit down with a kind of a group of super conscious beingness, right? Their own higher self. And there are certain aspects of the universe that present themselves as super conscious beings. Their sole job is to remember what this whole soul group, every life path, every member of this whole soul group, all 7.8 billion souls of us, is doing what your mission is and what the mission is that you've chosen for this incarnation. And to weave whatever that mission is into the highest good, right? The agenda of the highest good. So that no matter what it looks like on the surface as a mortal person to infinite consciousness, it all makes perfect sense. Not only does it make perfect sense, it already knows what all the possibilities are. It knows what you were going to do before you entered the realms of density. The realms of density are the physical realm, the aetheric realm, the astral realm, the causal plane, right? And those places that are more dense than the physical realm. We all come from beyond all that. That's a super conscious, a place of super consciousness. A higher self place. Right. I try not to say higher self because it's, you know, higher is relative to what? To what, yeah. You know? And we come in through this physical form. And it's misleading, because it's actually, it's all within you.  It's all within. It's all within. Yeah, within. You know? So, as you said, 9 of 10 you think are here to experience the illusion of the separation. Right, to be totally, thoroughly immersed in that illusion. In the self, in the illusion. Yeah. And the reason is, because the source of the one, that's its agenda. It's to experience the illusion of being separate from itself. That's the source. Okay. The source of the one, the source of infinite consciousness, the source of infinite love. Okay? It's, it's agenda. Because, okay, so let's take a step back. Because that's the learning. That's how you learn. Okay. Hold up. Hold up. Imagine that you're infinite consciousness. Right? You're everything. There isn't anything that isn't you or could not be you. Right? One of your most prized creations would be a place where you could experience the illusion of being separate from yourself to the point where you would savor those things that helped you remain in that illusion for as long as possible, because let's face it. As long as possible is still just a blip in your infinitude. Right? To the point where you would savor those things like fear or doubt, anger, confusion, you know, all that stuff. Pride, greed, all those things. Because they, energetically, those are energetic structures that keep you in the illusion of being separate from you when you're everything.  Right? You are the creation and beyond the creation. There's anything in the creation or beyond the creation that isn't you. Right? So what's the first thing that happens when a person gets born? They forget everything.  Probably 30 years. Yeah, easily, easily. And most people never remember who they really are. Like 99.999.999% of the population never remembers who they really are. Because most people, they use the term soul, recognizing that a soul is immortal intellectually, but they don't recognize, we don't usually recognize that we are immortal. Right? That this is our spacesuit. You know? This is a spaceship. How are we immortal? You tell me. Yeah, you do. All right. Yeah, you do. I mean, if I was to hypothesize maybe this, when this flesh vehicle spacesuit ends, the last heartbeat goes that maybe that I revisit another space suit. Maybe. Yeah. If that's what you, you know, if that's your mission, right?  All right?  Every day. Every day. For dreams? Dreams. But also in trance. In thought. You know what's faster than the speed of light? Look at that face. Consciousness. Right? So it takes 26,000 years for light to get from the center of the Milky Way galaxy to your nose. Right? And if I say the center of the Milky Way galaxy, you're there in your mind. Boom. Instantly. Okay. You know? This is the metaphysics. The word metaphysics, a lot of people, they hear that word, they're like, What? What? Because it's a big word. You know, there's more letters in it than most people use in their regular vocabulary and everything like that. But let's break it down. Right? Meta is Greek for beyond. Physical as in the physical plane of existence. Beyond the physical plane of existence. Right? So what's beyond the physical plane of existence? Us. Us. Consciousness. Right? Our dreams, our emotions, you know, our aspirations, our thought forms. You know, one of the things you learn in metaphysics, in studying metaphysics, is that thoughts are real things. Thought is energy. You know? Energy is vibration. Everything in the physical universe is vibration. You know, the flower of life is the is the standing wave, the standing wave of energy that is the physical universe. Right? Everything in the physical universe is in the flower of life pattern. Right? The flower of life is the electromagnetic field of the universe. Right? Of the physical universe. This is what some of your art is about. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So tell us about this, the flower of life, the electromagnetic field of the universe. Tell us about this. Right. So so everybody knows the star of David. Right? The star of David is shorthand for the flower of life. Right? It's a star tetrahedron. It's three-dimensional. So it's a star tetrahedron. The star tetrahedron, you know, it's upward-facing tetrahedron and a down-facing tetrahedron. Right? So every line in the tetrahedron is essentially take a step back. Basic principle of physics is a moving electrical field creates a magnetic field and vice-averse. Right? So as an electron moves from point A to point B, it warps the ambient field around it into a magnetic field. Right? So if you picture a tetrahedron with four, you know, there's four corners and four lines running between them all. Right? Those four lines are the electron moving around. Right? And each one of those lines has, if we're going to draw it in two dimensions, it has two curved lines on either side of it. Right? The two curved lines are the magnetic field, the straight line is the electrical field. Right? The flower of life is made of basically two spheres of star tetrahedrons interfacing with one another. A lot. Electromagnetically, you know, all these electrons moving around, but they all have, they all do the same thing, which is they create a magnetic field as they move. Right?  And an electromagnetic field around every subatomic particle. And we call it, we call it the flower of life, because the pattern is everywhere. There isn't anything that can exist in the physical universe unless it's that. It's the way the universe vibrates. It's energy and it's conscious. It's infinite consciousness. So the physical plane is infinite consciousness? Everything is infinite consciousness. There isn't anything that isn't... And the physical plane is all in the flower of life, all in the electromagnetic, it all looks in a flower of life. Yeah, it's a fractal. It's a fractal. Right, within every one of those spheres, the whole pattern repeats to infinity, infinitely in and infinitely out. I see your mind is melting down, my friend. Trying to chew on that, like... Yeah, there's a lot to remember. Yeah, exactly. There's a lot to remember. You're getting, like, I don't know, I'm 61. You're getting 61 years worth of stuff in like, what, 10 minutes? Yeah. Yeah, it's a lot, but what led you to these realizations? A combination of this is what I chose to be born to do and this is what I've chosen to pay attention to, you know? I mean, there's... our original, you know, plan that we came into this life to accomplish is always up for editing, right? Like, we have sovereignty. We can change it at any time.  You can remember how to fly and not even deal with a path, right? So I've chosen to pay attention, right? And one of the reasons I did that is because to not pay attention was painful. Agreed. Yeah. Do other people know that? There is, uh, something to pay attention to? I think you, you know the answer to that question. Well, is... What's the answer? Everybody does. Everybody knows that. Everybody knows that on some level. To pay attention. Whether it be just a little bit or a lot and then we make the left or right decisions on whether to pay attention or not. Right, right. For some people, like I said, it's not... They become our habits is what um, enlightenment is not for every soul in every lifetime. It's not every soul's mission in every lifetime to become enlightened, to manifest enlightenment. Because, frankly, everybody's already enlightened. We come from the light. We are the light. Right? We've come into this creation to experience you know, something else that we create. We're creating. We're creating this. We're creating, you know, we've created all this. There's an aspect... I like to say that there's like there's like four main kind of people, right? There's the folks, the souls that help the universe create this. Create what? The universe. Okay. Alright. The folks that help the universe be created? Yeah, they help the source of the one create the realms of density. That sounds like an exciting job. Doesn't it? That's what they thought. A universe designer. And once they created it, that's what we all are. That's what we all do. We all have that capacity. We create universes. Right? Most of us do it on the small scale. We do it in our heads. Yeah. You know, but it's the same thing.  Right? Everybody's got one. Whether it's a bed roll or a mansion. Right? But what I'm talking about is... In the beginning, there was, you know, this group of people, group of souls that decided to create this. What's the beginning? It's an illusion. Okay. I'm just, for the sake of the conversation, I'm saying, okay, so there are these folks. A group of souls. A group of souls. Who are these? They're us. They're us. They're we. It's we. It's consciousness. Where everybody's everybody. Everybody is everybody. Because remember, there's just one. We're all one. Right? So different aspects of divinity decided to create something. Right? And they created this and they created that and they created the other thing and then one day they created the day. Right? They created the universe. They created the realms of density. You know, those planes I mentioned before. Right? And they kept creating, creating, creating and what was really cool in this game and the playground of all that is, was that they could, the more they created, the more fun they were having and what did kids love to do during recess? Pretend. Right? So they went into their playground and they, everybody's, I'll be this and you be that and we'll pretend that we're this and that and the best part about pretending is when you totally thoroughly forget everything else except the game. Right? So, they got, you know, deep into their thing, into their creation and then some of them got stuck in there and forgot completely who they really are and where they really came from. Right? So, but once this thing was created there were other aspects of divinity that realized that, hey, there's this really cool place to go. Let's go in there and see what it's all about.  You know, they're just here because it's fun. It was already, they didn't create it but they came to visit and they, you know, got caught up inside and, you know, believing and believing and believing in it. Right? And then, there's there's these other folks that got invited to come in to this construct and remind those around them of who they really are and where they really came from and, you know, to help, you know, anybody that really wants to not actually be in here anymore to like leave. That's kind of what I feel like my role is. I figured. You could tell who those folks are because they're usually the ones that are in service. Right? They're spiritual service and trying to make the world a better place and trying to help people and it's your natural proclivity and that's most of the people that are watching this. That's your audience. You know, people that are that want to do some good. You know, they'd rather do good than do anything else. Right? How can I help? Right? Then there's this other group of people and everybody knows this group of people at least one of them, right, in your lifetime and their mission is to explore the darkness. Right? Explore the boundaries of the creation. Right? And those folks they are fulfilling the prime directive of the source of the want which is to experience the illusion of being separate from itself as much as possible to go as far and deep into the darkness as you possibly can. Damn. Right? And we all know those folks. We try to help them. They're like, we got no command. No. But that's their thing. That's what they're there for because on some level the universe, the source of the universe knows that we cannot be harmed and we can do no harm because this is an illusion. You know, if you're invested in the physicality of things that just doesn't stand with you.  You know, when the universe knows they have an agreement. You know, in Native American spirituality, there are certain roles. You know, there's a Hayoka. Right? The sacred clowns and the contrary. What are those? They're the contrary. You know, the sacred clown. They're what would, you know, I guess you would call them medicine people that provide a service of reminding. You know, it's kind of the shaman. Yeah. It's to be the mirror. You know, if everybody's going right, they go left. You know, if you go to a sun dance, right? Like, everybody is wearing red and white. And they're wearing black and green. Everybody's going clockwise. They go counterclockwise. You know, everybody gets pierced in the front. They get pierced in the back. You know what I mean? It's a recognized, it's recognized like non-conformist. Right. And also healing. Right. So, example. Okay. So, I'm at this sun dance at Big Mountain 20 years ago. And there is a Hayoka who has, he's been, you can tell when a man takes, Hayoka takes off his shirt. Man or woman, right? And they've a sun dancer. You can just see the piercings, layers and layers of piercings, right? Front and back. Right? And so everybody, at the sun dance, there's all this attention to detail. Like if somebody were to drop an eagle feather, they would stop the whole ceremony. You know, so there's like this intense respect. Because it's, you know, it's a four-day prayer for, not for oneself, but for the world, for humanity, for your community. It's for somebody else that you're doing the dance. Right?  So this Hayoka, you know, goes out into the, into the sacred space and he's got a can of soda and he's got an electric fan and he's just like, oh man, you know, just being profane. Right? But at the same time he's doing that, he's checking on the dancers. You know? He's, he's entering the notion of, of, of light, of being lighter, of lightening up, of humor, the sacred cloud. Yeah, yeah. You know? Yeah. So, that's the, that percentage of people, their job is to go into the darkness. What about the other ones? What are the, what are the rest? Is it just light and dark? The majority of people, like I said, are tourists. Are tourists. And they're just, we're just here to play. We're here to immerse ourselves in this construct as thoroughly as we possibly can. Of the illusion of the separation of the self. Of being separate from the one. Yeah. Of the source of the one. Yeah. Separate from the one. Yeah. So, majority of people are tourists in that experience. Yeah. And some are in the deep malevolence. Well, I wouldn't say malevolence. Of the deep, sorry, the deep. The darkness. The deep darkness. Yeah, they're exploring, everybody is exploring the darkness. Yeah, yeah. Because all of this is just, it's beyond the realm, what I would call, what I tend to call the ultimate reality, which is beyond the realms of density. Where we all come from. Beyond the realms of infinite consciousness. And do we know about that? How do we know about this infinite consciousness place? How do we know about it? Yeah. By paying attention. How do we pay attention to understand that we came from there? It's a walking meditation, bro. Right? Okay. It's a choice. Pay attention.  When you drop into that, you open a place for communion to take place. For a divine communion, you say, I'm ready. Yeah. Let's have a, you have my undivided attention. Yeah, yeah. What's up? Yeah. Right? So imagine if you go into that space without wanting anything, without needing anything, but choosing communion. Right? So in 1993, 94, I went into the desert about 100 miles east of here.  Right? And within three to five days, I started to have this experience of euphoria. And this euphoria lasted, ended up lasting for like three months, 24 hours a day. And no drugs, just paint and... No. The first two weeks, no drugs at all. Then on New Year's Eve, I was given a head of acid. Psychedelics, yeah. And I, you know, I tripped and I couldn't wait for it to be over so I could get back to being high. Right? On life, on flow. On what I was experiencing. The art, the painting your brains out. On being. On being. On just being. I would just, I would just walk out into the desert. Because this world is enough. This world is just beautiful enough to be in ecstasy all the time. Well, there's that. But it wasn't just this world.  Just this, like, profusion of just yumminess, the feeling of grace and blessing, blessedness and that which can't not be named. Right? And the next thing I know, I realize that I've been standing there for like 20 minutes, a half an hour or so, you know, just like totally gorging myself on this feast of the feeling and all the information and everything and, you know, I love information. I love knowledge. I love consciousness. Right? And I was, I was in communion with the source of the one. Yeah. Right? And so. It feels like that going really deep into meditation or deep into psychedelics. That's what it feels like a deep communion with the one. Right. It's exactly what it feels like in many ways. Right. So that is one of the ways for people that are trying to help others' communeness to get that tapping into the interconnectedness of the one. Right, right. And that the self is the illusion that there is no, the oneness is everything. Yeah. I want to make, I want to finish something and make something really clear. More questions. More questions, yeah. So the next day I had some friends that came into the desert and they wanted me to smoke this pot and I was like, I'm good, but the universe said no. Smoked the pot. I was like, really? I just want to be, you know, no, no, go ahead. So I smoked the pot and I went out into the desert and once again I couldn't wait for it to be over so I could get back to being high and I asked the universe, I was like, why did you have me do this? Yeah. And the answer was, so that I would know the similarities and differences from the natural high that I was experiencing to these, you know, these substances that most people use, either acid and mushrooms. I think about using drugs in a very similar way to know the real difference in the feelings of being high on life versus high on the drug. Right. Well, it's very, it's really simple that these substances they can only do for you what you can do for yourself. Like they literally only stimulate what's already inside of you to secrete. The problem is that they modify that secretion. Right. So like acid and mushrooms and all that kind of stuff, they all stimulate this crystal palace series of glands to secrete their natural, you know serotonin, melatonin, endorphins, all this kind of stuff. Right. But because you have, you've taken those drugs, like ecstasy, I've never done ecstasy, but I'm told that it stimulates the pineal gland to release all of the serotonin and all the melatonin within it all at once. Okay. And that's why people that, after they've done it, a lot of people don't, you know, a couple of days after, they don't dream because serotonin and melatonin is what stimulates the dreaming. Right. So, your body is physically compelled to respond to these chemicals that you've put in. Whereas, you can do the same thing with just your awareness. You can just, by choosing to be in communion. Right. You can experience that bliss, that ecstasy. You can also do it through the breath. Through the breath, yeah. Right. Yeah. So, you had questions? Yeah. You got some questions, bro? It's an infinite amount of questions. Even picking the next question's hard. Do you feel as though the trajectory of civilization is A-OK, no matter what? Do you feel like we need to be focused on something specific geopolitically to get to the oneness so that we don't cause significant errors in existential threats or anything to let more children birth and experience this and etc.? You mean, do we need to get rid of Trump? Is that what you're asking? Maybe do we need to get rid of nuclear weapons? Wouldn't that be great? Yeah. Let's do that. Can we agree? Let's do that. Let's hope everyone does. Boom! We're on our way. I think so. We're still here. Even after the Cold War, we're still here, yeah? Yeah. When I was born in 57, my father was in the Air Force. I was born in an Air Force base. And there's, you know, DEF CON 2 or whatever, they were on Global Alert. Yeah. Until what? The 90s? Yeah. So my whole life, from 1957 until 1991, when the wall fell, we were under threat of like blowing ourselves to smithereens. And for the past, up until this year, the past two years, since Trump came in, there was no question about the fact that that was taken care of.  Now we've got somebody in the office that thinks that it's okay to be like, why don't we use those things? We bought all these beautiful weapons. Why don't we use them? You know, that's crazy. But I see that you know, this soul, like any other soul, has a mission. Right? And there isn't infinite love, loves infinitely. Every soul in existence. Even Hitler. You know, these souls take on these roles for a reason. And they're catalysts. He's certainly been a catalyst. What has he inspired? He inspired the if he hadn't been elected, there wouldn't have been a women's march the day after he got in and stepped into office. If he hadn't been elected, there are 100 women, in Congress. Because of what of him being elected. Which is not even half of Congress. But we're moving in that direction. I want to return conversation to what is going on in the higher realms, planes of existence. Intent driven journeys are to this earth orbiting the star. And then we remember some don't but some remember and then we go back to renegotiate where we go next. To the next rock orbiting a star. Not necessarily. We go outside of a physical universe in a different style of universe to a different... The first thing that happens is you leave the physical dimension but you don't have to die in order to do that. You can do that in your sleep, you can do that through meditation, you can do it through astral projection, lucid with full with full lucidity leaving your body basically. Here in the physical body, grounded in the physical plane you can communicate when you're out of your body at night or through meditation or whatever, you can communicate with those that are in places that are either more dense than this or less dense. What is more dense and less dense than this? In the physical plane there are places that souls create for themselves when they feel that they have are as yet undeserving of returning to the one. They may feel like they've done something that would make them unworthy of returning to infinite love. And so create these places that try to punish themselves and those places are just more dense. That's one scenario about places that are denser than here. There's obviously not as much light they are more dense. The way to determine all the different planes and everything is kind of just drawing lines to infinite consciousness is all one thing. The determining factor is density. How dense is it? Obviously the physical plane is more dense than the aetheric and astral and causal planes. What are those? Like I said, it all has to do with places that are planes of existence that are less dense than the physical plane. What is the aetheric, astral and causal? Like I said with a musical scale there are certain places if you have a guitar string you have a string that's strung taut there are certain places where if you strum it's not going to sound very good and there are certain places where if you strum it's going to sound pretty good you can hold it down and then there are certain places along there that are going to sound perfect and there are certain places that aren't going to sound like anything you want to listen to. Each one of these planes is like that there is a coherence that a sphere, let's say or zone where things make sense to consciousness that you're tuned into so you can look into because there's an aspect of you on each one of these coherent places in the realms of density you have direct access to those places if you so choose when as if it's not going to impinge on you accomplishing what I'm here to do look at that just trying to understand it's a lot it's exciting to aim to remember so how about one more thing so you know the astral plane is where most people go when they die right and most people when they think about disembodied spirits and interacting with the other realms and all that kind of stuff they're usually just dealing with the etheric and astral planes right so to the astral plane to those folks on the astral plane the causal plane has the same relationship to them it's just as out there and as hard to challenging to commune with it's that much of a step like in music the next chord that make sense are you with me I remember the guitar analogy with where you can strum a guitar at a note that vibrates really well so you kind of want to live your life like that but also I don't know yet when you strum a piano there's a piano over there so if you hit all middle C let's say middle C is a physical plane there's a scale based on middle C that in the middle of the piano key there's 88 keys and in the middle of it there's a C scale so there's C scale below that and it sounds deeper and there's C scale above that that sounds higher so you're going octaves up thanks for giving me that word this is interesting so this is one octave the etheric is at another octave the astral is at another octave how do we raise our octaves raise them how do we go up how do we bring our consciousness up is that the meditation and the one feelings of oneness remember it's important to remember one this is just an analogy two there is an aspect of you on every one of those octaves all at the same time so maybe when I get some of the darker feelings that's the more denser octave and when you get the lighter feelings that's bright and so then what do you do with that so you can only you can only access that if it's your part of your mission to do that and if doing so is not going to impinge on what it is you came here to do that you're in this octave to do but if you feel like you need to communicate with these higher octaves have at it at any time it's your call whether or not they will communicate back with you is it determined whether or not it's going to mess you up in what you're really trying to do came here to do to the physical plane what did you come to the physical plane to do this and what is this what are we doing right this minute just aiming to have a conversation about awakening and oneness so just the further dissemination of awakening and oneness inspiration towards that I feel similar yeah I came to are we inevitably going towards unity or is it inevitable that we get to that to an awakened state for more of the you realize that there is just oneness right yes and the rest is illusion it may be tasty illusion but it's still illusion doesn't it at times feel like the ignorance is a parasite I guess so bro if you say so to you yeah I guess I'm not going to that's how you feel that's cool ignorance is a it serves a purpose yeah you were talking about that earlier that there are experiences being had here that are only possible if you are believing that this is all there is and that there's a purpose to that those experiences being had at this time yeah so everything inherently has purpose and even if you don't think that the universe uses everything right the universe everything is fertilizer everything fertilizes everything else nothing is wasted so whether you're aware of it or not the universe is going to use whatever you're doing and whatever is happening to it's greater purposes straight up like if I died right here right now and nobody touched my body the universe would make my body disappear into the ground eventually microbes would be happy all that kind of stuff and I would be fertilizing this spot yeah so what do you think is the most beautiful thing in the world the world hahaha that's usually my answer too yeah you know the whole thing man it's all friggin amazing yeah just like look at that right there see that airplane that's an incredible feat I might like this phrase look at that I call it see a bird make a plane throw away like a coffee cup hahaha so literally a hundred years ago it was like oh my gosh look we can do that yes and then we went through a several decade process of making airplanes and now almost 200,000 commercial flights happen a day and you get off the commercial flight you throw the idea away like a coffee cup yeah really people get in those things and then they pull down the window I'm like are you kidding me you're flying across America you're not gonna like look out the window I did one 150 years ago people were like have a covered wagon trying to get a horse and people walked across America just to get to California man 6 months yeah crazy what is time that's a great question what comes to mind is that time is a function of gravity it's just something I've heard and I'm like really it's like mental bubble gum you know what I mean just chew that up a little bit it's all relative man whatever time is it's definitely relative because there's an eternity in every moment and there's an infinite number of eternities in every moment depending on your perspective or it could be just us waiting standing in line behind somebody else waiting for something else to happen or we're having an epiphany if all of you is happening in all of the different octaves all at once are you not also happening all at once in all of your ages right now exactly all time is simultaneous the non-linearity of time well see there's once again it brings us back to the source of infinite consciousness right it knows all there is to know it is everything there is to that there is and so at the moment of the creation the first moment of the creation it knew the whole every centil of the creation and so in that model to me it's like the source of infinite consciousness loves to be surprised being surprised is like it's like dessert you know what I mean? surprise me because I know everything but try to surprise me anyway and I think that's one of the reasons why humanity you know because we surprise ourselves every friggin day you know I mean I'm surprised myself right now I mean I look like it but I'm I'm constantly amazed by where I find myself what I find myself being doing and I I think if I'm capable of it most people are as well you know so hmm look at that how do you feel about exponential technology? exponential technology what are we talking about? just that we now have these incredible computers and phones that are super incredible better than what was used to get to the moon helicopters biotechnology neuro technology just mapping things out really well in the brain and in the body genome sequencing etc it's all just dropping in price and increasing in speed etc yeah it's wonderful isn't it it's friggin amazing do you think there are any negative aspects to exponential technology? right so positive and negative are on a spectrum of being in existence so it's all love even the negative is love ultimately it has to be because all there is is an infinite consciousness and infinite consciousness is infinite love right but to get a little more specific there is you know I'm an astrologer and I'm a student of history I look at the big picture I spend a lot of time big history you know like the history of the universe the history of existence civilization 100 billion people lived and died to build this world right so it's obvious that there is in 1903 the Wright brothers flew in and and 66 years later we were walking on the moon that's pretty great 66 years that's pretty good before that it's actually incredible that's probably the biggest human accomplishment ever right in the fastest time period ever so the computing power in this in my hand right now is more than what landed us on the moon yeah which was almost 66 years ago right exactly exactly isn't it credible so it's obvious okay okay so I got you all excited yeah yeah population up until 1900 around 1900 the human population was under a billion souls incarnate at once yeah it was around that time then we had 6 billion in the last 100 years yeah so yeah right now we're approaching 7 7.8 billion souls that's how many souls there so there's a soul in every person right but there aren't like there's not fractaling of souls like there's not one soul being shared across of course there is remember what part of all is one that we not forget yeah yeah so then your soul bathes in mine and mine bathes in yours and what not the interconnectedness of things yeah ultimately we all come from the one but there are 7.7 plus billion souls and we're approaching 7.8 frequency of the earth the human resonance for the person the base frequency of the earth is 7.8 hertz is that the frequency of the crust or where it's a frequency of the planet overall based on the 3 to 4 thousand lightning strikes that happen every day cause the frequency of the earth to frequency 7.8 cycles per second which is in a harmonic with the ambient vibration of the universe the wavelength of the ambient vibration of the universe is 7.3 sine cosine centimeters so it's like we're in this for the first time in recorded history the number of incarnate souls is coming into a harmonic with the base frequency of the earth and the ambient vibration of the universe in our life time sometime within the next year so but why so but no I say so but I know I know cause I'm trying to understand this so I'm trying to paraphrase it because otherwise I don't think I understand it so 7.8 billion 7.8 hertz frequency of the planet and that is a synchronous check it out since the last world destruction around 12,000 years ago to 1900 less than a billion souls at the same time on the planet world destruction 12,000 years ago what was the world destruction so according to the Hopi oral tradition there have been 3 previous world destructions in the past 100,000 years the first time by fire the second time by ice and the third time by flight the most recent one what was it Hopi what's Hopi the Hopi are the Native American that live in northeastern Arizona 3 previous their oral tradition goes back through previous world destruction and the most recent one damn they've logged that's good lineage they've had the information they've had the oral tradition now it's only been within the past you might want to know this yeah while I was having that spiritual acceleration back in the winter of 1993-94 I discovered an archeological site in Big Sur that I feel may be connected to the Hopi story of the survivors of the last war purification by flood and their place of emergence into the fourth world and I made a movie about it and released it in 2010 yeah it's on YouTube you can watch it for free David Alexander English.com David Alexander English.com D.A. English.com and the links in the bio and you have your books there and you have your music there and the paintings I discovered the site the first site and then over the next 20 years I discovered two more sites within 5 miles of that first site they're all have something to do with celestial observation celestial observatories and It turns out that they are in the National Forest and the Forest Service didn't know anything about it until I showed them the photographs of the sites that I took in 2004. So I made a movie about this whole thing. For the first 10 years afterwards, after the first initial discovery, I thought that it was common knowledge. I thought that the Forest Service knew about it and that other people knew about it. And I tried to find out what they knew and then it wasn't until 10 years later I was actually able to talk to the zone archeologists and discover that they had no idea that the sites were there. And so I made the movie in 2010 and then I made it free. I put it on YouTube in 2012 and published a book version of it. It's a straight transcript. Excuse me. Around that same time, I was working on the sequel to that movie in the book. And all this information started to come out, the scientific information. I've been trying to understand when did these previous world destructions take place in terms of just history and science. And it turns out that around 2012, we discovered when the middle destruction took place about 41,000 years ago. And that was by fire? No. The first was by fire and the second by ice and the third by flood. That was the ice destruction. And there are two different scientific studies. One was looking at the Greenland ice cores and one was looking at the North Sea lava flows. And they both determined that there had been a polar shift, a magnetic pole shift that happened 41,000 years ago. And the oral tradition of the Hopi say that when the Nephi of the Great Spirit was ready to purify the world for the second time, he told those to remember to keep the tops of their heads open to the rest of the universe to go into the earth and join the ant people for the second time. And once they were safely inside, he told the twins who were stationed at the poles to leave their station. Immediately, the earth rolled over twice, fell off its axis, rolled over twice. The oceans flopped over the land, the mountains fell into the sea and as everything froze. And the earth wandered through space for years before starting up its rotation again. That's crazy. That sounds crazy. It sounds crazy and what's amazing about that oral tradition is that is an eyewitness account of witnessing a magnetic pole shift. And then how did they retain that through generation? Oral tradition, brother. If there was an Ice Age, though, that killed everyone. The Ice Age didn't kill everyone, obviously. And according to the Hopi, the second world, excuse me, the third world began again after the earth started to rotate again. And it was a very technological age. So much so that there were actually what they called shields that flew between cities. That's how technological that age was. And that age was ended by a flood. So around the same time, between 2012 and two years ago, this other scientific information came up where they've discovered that there was a flood and when that flood took place. That flood took place between 12,900 years ago and 11,600 years ago. And then what was the significance of having just one billion souls and now up to something? So after the world was destroyed the third time by flood, it wiped out the majority of the population of the world. So right now there are more souls incarnate than there have been in the past since the last world destruction. In the past 10,000 or 12,000 years. So how we got into this part of this conversation was you were asking me about my take on the exponential growth of technology. So we are at a place that it's obvious that just in that there's an exponential growth in population is an exponential growth in technology. And that all of this is being driven from the other side of the veil. What does that mean? The veil is the membrane separating the physical universe from the rest of creation. And how is the population growth and technology growth coming from the non-physical side of the veil? Right. And it's really simple. That's where we come from. Nobody is here by mistake. Nobody just kind of stumbled into being born. Every soul that comes into this life arrives here through agreement with their higher self and the super conscious beings that are keeping track of the whole soul group. And you construct a lifetime as a healing or as a gift to the collective consciousness. So nobody gets here by mistake. Everybody gets here by agreement and by choice. And the only way, like what you said earlier, how many life times did it take to build up the physical infrastructure to support 7.8 billion souls being incarnate at the same time? Ten thousand years. Ten thousand years and all of our ancestors. What they did helped to create enough of a physical infrastructure that could support 7.8 billion souls. And where did all those souls come from? They came from the other side of the veil. How does somebody get technology? You get it from paying attention to the universe. Right. From ideas and from the metaphysical realms. And then you can tweak the science because you understand the rules, the laws of the nature. It's all coming from infinite consciousness. Being in communion with infinite consciousness. You get an idea. Through your dreams, your visions, your thoughts. So what I'm saying is that all of this is coming from the, you know, there's an agenda that's manifesting. Is it our agenda? Yes, they are we. There's just us out here. It's our agenda from the higher. Yes, all of us. And we bring our intent here. Right. We're doing this. Quick, quick, quick. This one we got to wrap it up. So this universe is designed with math and science and love and consciousness. And it's designed with rocks orbiting stars in space. What other kinds of universes have you imagined? Have I imagined? Yeah. It's boundless, bro. It's whatever you want to. What about you, though, specifically? What other kind of universes exist out there that may not have green grass, green trees, blue oceans, but rather completely different Dr. Seuss shit? Why do you ask? Because I love universe design and I bet your mind has wandered into some of that.  That's what I do all day long, you know, is make stuff up. I'm a professional and make stuff upper. You know, professional and dreamer. You know, that's what I do. So, you know, how many hours in the day? You don't have enough tape. Yeah, it's the batteries. It's the batteries. Yeah, the batteries, man. Well, yeah, because I spent the first half of another interview today. Yeah, and I still want to cap some b-roll. Okay, we'll have to do another episode when I'm based in San Francisco. So come when you come and visit, let us know. And you can join us in the studio up there. I'll let you know when we come back to LA.  Watch us in pleasure.   Everyone, DA English, check out the links in the bio. Also, go and spur these conversations with other epic people around you. Let's get these conversations rolling. Also, go and build the future, everyone.  We love you so much. As if you could do something else. As if you could do something else. That's right, that's right. We love you so much. And we'll see you soon. Also, support awesome artists. Yes. Like David English, like Alan Sock, and what we're doing here with Simulation. All those links are below. 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