Hi everyone, I'm Joe for jazby's casegraves.com. Happy Thursday. We're coming at you with 2020 bowman's best baseball eight box Pick your team number 18 There you go. Pick your team 18 on the 18th Any famous fate I'm terrible with the athlete numbers like jersey numbers Any famous players that are number 18? Famous baseball players number 18. It's 18 a weird baseball number. I feel like Maybe there's just haven't been haven't been any famous 18s is Johnny Damon in 18. Oh, okay, okay Oh Daryl strawberry Joseph is saying was an 18 You like when Sean breaks optic hobby he calls out every rated rookie to the person who hits it. He's got to stop that It makes the break too long. It's not efficient any other famous baseball 18s What about 18 and any any sport? I think Peyton Manning's an 18, right? That's the only 18. I know Randall Cobb Isn't 18 Kyle Cook didn't see who you have this was not a random team break Kyle. Do you remember what team you bought? If not, there's a receipt That you get a order confirmation that you get and I'll tell you the the break the break number so on and so forth All right, here's box number one. What is it? We got two out of four autographs box. Yeah, four autographs a box You have the yeah, you're As laughing.  Yeah, it's not a ram team break friend. No, I'll tell you right now You got the you bought the brave and the Red Sox We posted this today too, so it wasn't like you bought these teams last week and you forgot nice Brandon McKay 38 out of 99 rookie auto for the raise TJ on the board with a Brandon McKay could be a great two-way player This year was Ramon. Loriano die-cut and these ones kind of fool me because I think they're numbered, but they're actually not There's a Luis Robert rookie card remember all card ship in this So you'll get you'll get everything ladies and gentlemen including Luis Robert up and coming prospects like Zach Veen Tyler Soterson, there's our first a's autograph. I think Coppola who has the a's also Had a little prop bet for us and was like, hey Oakland a's autos set the line over or under set the line at three There's one already Spencer Torkelson right there For the Tigers, there's your number one overall pick Randall well grizzle has the Owns the a's so grizzle be able to keep track. There's Ohtani For Nana to tease junior monster deal that he signed keeps him locked in With San Diego for a long time There's one Soto cracked atomic that is Logan Webb Coppola with the Giants barrier teams. So that's three autographs plus the redemption underneath Shohei That'll make it four. There's a Heston Kirkstad nice to 50 It's a great one for the Orioles That's gonna be for Alex and the o's all right Best of 2020 autograph refractor parallel You'll see the team name there to see Chicago Cleveland Cincinnati Colorado Cincinnati Cincinnati, it's Luis Castillo Like they write the team names on there that goes to Dennis and The Reds good news Dennis. Not only do you get this nice Luis Castillo redemption? You also get a free top load rather than all right. Good luck everybody I think it was all over Soria who was saying earlier that the son that at one shop in Vegas they have the Dodgers win total at 104 and a half wins now. I'm a big Dodgers fan I'm fairly optimistic about my team But but it's it's hard to win a hundred games Especially with the way the Padres have retooled as well seems like a lot, but then again, I'm not very good with future plays so It feels like a lot Right, and if yeah, and if COVID continues to be a problem throughout the summer I mean, I guess they're maybe banking on Vaccines to be more widespread or something like that. But yeah It's already short in season with 150 games and who knows I mean if the worst-case scenario happened I mean, are they even getting to a hundred games? There's Yamamoto for Miami TJ with the Marlins Starling Marta to 250 and we got Carter Keeboom for Capola and the Nats Nice Joey Bart atomic Justin Verlander Dustin May Another Luis Robert Rookie card It'd be weird to see Nolan Aronato in a Cardinals uniform. There's JT Real Muto. He busted his thumb ladies and gentlemen re-signed with the Phillies Zach Loomis and promptly busted his thumb. I think he's out for two three weeks. I don't know which thumb it was The catching thumb maybe He's a righty, right? So broke broke his thumb and there's Nick Solak for the Rangers that'll be for Patrick Davis There's Tizia Aquino Ronald Acuna Jr. and Boba Shett some great show hair there. I'll be for the Blue Jays That's gonna go to Capola Boba Shett. Is everything is everything with a big free agent name squared away a bower went to the Dodgers JT Real Muto re-signed with the Philly. I don't think there are any other Big names. Has there been any big moves? Maybe some last-minute spring training trades? Everything's kind of squared. D.G. Lemay who re-signed with the Yankees, right? Maybe those are the biggest names in the off-season Yeah, the big names are pretty much gone, right? I'm glad to have some Baseball back. Oh, there's still names like Taiwan Walker still out there Maybe the one-year deal guys There's Jason Dominguez. Oh We've got Cap Martin Capucin Martin with the Jason Dominguez got the Yankees straight up Wow, the camera came in focus on it It's too hot Too lit for this camera nice Right on card. That's actually a good audit. I don't know if I've ever seen his autograph before. No, we have It's nice. I think I'm always surprised at At how nice it is There's Robert Hassel big future star for the Padres. That's what San Diego is hoping Yeah, that's true. I guess the Benin there is the Beninteni trade I guess Chris Bryant could still be on the move that could be a big There's Luis Ken. Why was he a redemption before? Cincinnati at goes to Dennis. I guess did he sign half his cards and decided not to sign the other half? Oh, maybe he didn't sign parallels Come on, Luis Bobby Bradley Bradley that is atomic Grizzle is thinking what Bryant will be a met eventually. Yeah, they were the Mets. We're looking at Justin Turner There's Jesus Lizardo another Athletic for Coppola. It's Grizzle in the chat two out of ten. Hey Zeus Lizardo Nice low number on that one, too But yeah, the Mets were looking at Justin Turner. I don't think the numbers worked out It was Luis Roberts goes to Alex and the White Sox. So yeah, they may be looking to trade for For someone like Chris Bryant Reed Detmer's angels Martin with that one Capucine Martin And no worries Grizzle But what are we at now, too? I still have a lot of boxes left. There's Trent Grisham to 150 for the friars. That's gonna be for Capucine as well and Next box Pat had the over would you have taken over three and a half as well? Well, no, yeah, you're thinking Laureano Murphy will be next maybe a Chapman or two a Sheldon Mucey. Oh Yeah, what Grizzle is hoping for is is is Robert Possum. All right, so in here are the final four boxes right here Good luck another redemption And we got a Tim Anderson for the White Sox Alex with the South Siders. Come on Lakers I have their last six There's Shunyama Gucci for the Blue Jays to Capola.  Well, there it is Robert Possum It's exactly what Grizzle wanted Sometimes it works out like that ladies and gentlemen Dustin May atomic Yeah, no worries Grizzle, thanks for getting in and your redempt best of 2020 autograph of San Diego San Francisco Robert Hassel San Diego Robert Hassel Padres nice Capucin Martin San Diego Padres Robert Hassel two strong prospects back to back halfway through this break. Here's the second half Good luck Robert Hassel not a hassle at all Wait, is that is that you basses loaded? Oh, did I get the name right? I would it I Went with cap and then I was just like, let me let me just talk to talk out that name Good, I'm glad I did. Gotcha. That's wifey. All right, and you're Gary right I gotta keep track of these user names and names Right the one that makes the good burgers, right? Oh, oh, look at this Franchise favorites on card autograph 18 out of 40 Cal Ripken Jr. for Alex of Alasacos and the Baltimore Orioles Nice I was unexpected It's pretty sharp He is definitely a fan franchise favorite. That's the cool-looking card atomic Dustin May and a Jalen Davis for my rivals The Giants Capola was my dog. Oh, that's my Dodgers too. That's a cool-looking atomic. There's Cal again cool-looking atomic Refractor there there's Mitch Keller The Pirates are expecting a lot out of him this year Aaron Gaston with the buckos Here's your number one overall pick Randall Ness Another Torkelson There's a franchise favorites atomic Robert Hassel and we got Casey Schmidt for the Giants Capola with the You got this Yeah, I miss baseball too. I'm happy that spring training is coming around I don't know if that actually don't know if the Dodgers reported yet Soon I think I know there's some pitchers and catchers been reporting Everyone's reporting this week at some point 2021 spring training FAQ dates to know dates no Well, when are our pitchers and catchers reporting? Well, the first spring training game Is gonna be February 28th against the A's See new faces to know on The roster for the Dodgers. It's Trevor Bauer of course Garrett Clevenger Tommy Kainley Cory Kineville Alex Vassia and Sheldon Newsy There's some prospects to keep an eye on camp. That's right Josiah Gray The number 58 overall prospect and baseball will get a lot of attention. Maybe make the 40-man roster Hebert Ruiz could start getting into the action as the catcher Cody Hosey is the Dodgers number three prospect Michael Bush number four Bobby Miller number seven Jacob Amaya 10 DJ Peters This is the bit. This is a big year for Gavin Lux ladies and gentlemen Big year for Gavin Lux.  I Don't think he's gonna be like I think he's too good to be like a bust, right? There's Austin Hendrick for the Reds That's a good one to Dennis so I think he'll still have a role on the team, you know, maybe he ends up You know being you know a Rotational guy, but you don't want that We want to be an all-star Dodgers have had some struggles with that second base spot in spite of all the Talent they've had over the years. Oh nice Louise Robert 15 out of 150 speaking of talent white socks Alex Chicago Southsiders nice. There you go But yeah, second base for the Dodgers has been a bit of a black hole for a little while We got a cool wit Maryfield going to Guy and the Royals Gilo. What's going on? Speaking of Kansas City, there's Gilo. Wait, was that Jason Dominguez gold? Man, come on Joe Power producers Jason Dominguez gold 42 out of 50 like Jason Dominguez Yankees Capucine Good-eye Grizzle. Good-eye. Good-eye. You know, that's what I was just talking about Gilo that Gavin Lux kind of a Sort of a not I don't I don't want to say maker break sounds too dramatic Um But it's like to this year's the year where where is he gonna be the starting second baseman for the Dodgers for for years to come or Is he just gonna be a role player? He's good enough to just be a role player and that's fine For him personally but for the hobby we wanted to be a starting second baseman for the Los Angeles Dodgers There's Logan Allen for Jarella and the tribe Yamamoto to 99. We've got atomic Joey Bart Supposed to be a big deal for the Giants and Marlins TJ with that Yamamoto to 99 Bases loaded saying oh the Yankees. What was the was the wife's choice nice now. She's hooked a Couple that breaks together stays together. Listen. We want We want the the women to get involved In the hobby and enjoy it a lot a lot of collectors out there. We cater to everybody You know They don't get to get the wife involved get the whole family involved aunts uncles brothers sisters Maybe even some co-workers the co-workers that you like what I think of the Ben and Tendi Royals trade. Yeah, I I Just thought that it was a bit of a I don't know it seemed sort of unnecessary. It was just a lateral move I don't know if it really if one person one team actually won the trade or not, you know, maybe Maybe they were just like yeah you know Ben and Tendi's not gonna get the playing time that that He would get maybe in Kansas City And we want we want to replenish our farm system and get a couple crop prospects back or whatever Whatever they move back. So For now, it feels just like a lateral move like didn't really Help her hurt Too much. All right, there's Josh Stomach speaking of the Royals this for guy Justin Verlander to 150 For Houston that'll be for Pat Ace of Lacey Hopefully a future star for the Royals So what so if Fernando to tease junior made the money that he did? What do you think? Kind of deal this Juan Soto again There's Dylan Dingler Detroit Randall Ness and power producer Shoei Otani Autograph 95 out of 99 who has the halos cap who's seen with the halos man Gary you're gonna have to have her choose the teams every break. It's a big year for him to to see If you can say healthy How are the angels gonna deploy him or is he just better off being just a just a hitter Or just a pitcher. What are they gonna do? I always thought they should maybe Have him be a closer so he can pretty much hit every day and be available to pitch almost every day But I don't know and we got Jalen Davis right here Tahiti. You're welcome Jalen Davis for the Giants Coppola There's Chris Bryant. Will he get traded Ryan Wilson saying he hopes that Kyle Lewis pans out There's Anthony Rendon for you guys to the 250 There's a refractor too. I mean he he looked pretty good. I Feel like he was I mean he won rookie of the year was he I mean some people may argue he was low key better than Low key better than Louise Robert who I think Had a really hot month and a half in a pandemic short in the season But Kyle Lewis seemed a little more steady And I'll be it'll be interesting to see how Lewis throughout the throughout the whole season And Gilo saying you bought a bunch of Ohtani stuff recently So what do you think what's your what's your take? I mean you must you must believe that Ohtani will bounce back We actually had someone in the shop earlier today Was also asking me and the crew. Hey, what about Ohtani? You know tiny prices have gone down a little bit, you know He still has the international market, but a little bit of the shine has come off of Ohtani values Especially since his rookie year, which he had an excellent rookie year But I don't think it'll take much for him to really To to really bounce back again, so it'll be interesting to see But the angels have to figure out how to how to really get the best out of him, you're the best All right final box here pick your team 18 of 2020 Bowman's best baseball. I only saw one case of this in the back. So I don't know. We'll try to get some more obviously Yeah, Gilo's thing. You think Ohtani makes a bit of a comeback at least more than what is what is? Cards are worth at the moment. There's Max Meyer One of the top picks for the Marlins TJ. There you go Yeah, the thinking the pandemic shortened season was kind of messed him up coming off an injury Maybe he never got into the flow. There you go. Teach is Nate Pearson To 150 for the bluebirds. That's for Kapola as well There's Ohtani again, and there's Logan Webb lots of giants in this one. Let's goes to Kapola and San Francisco Wait, how many a's autos are we at Pat thinks so tiny used to play it just a position only give up on the pitching Yeah, maybe then that might not be working out for him Because you're losing you lose two days of him in the lineup to a few pitches Right the day before the start in the day after the start There's a Patrick Bailey That's another giant for Kapola. We're gonna get the over on the a's There's your dawn Alvarez and a Dustin May Dustin May autograph. I don't know where he's gonna fit in in the rotation this year 104 out of 150 Kapola with the Dodgers nice grizzled grizzled bees and There's the franchise favorites your dawn Alvarez Pat Cologne with that one former Dodger Atomic and we have one more or is that it? There's a Zach vene purple nice color match there Trent Grisha matomic And I think that's it to teased junior and forest Whitley. There you go ladies and gentlemen I'm Joe for jazby's case breaks calm. Thanks for breaking with us. Thanks for watching Thanks for chatting. Thanks for hanging. I appreciate it a box pick your team 18 in the books Keep your eye out for more bowman's best baseball on jazby's case breaks calm. Bye. Bye


Okay, so this is where we are right now with this to give you quick background. Mike threw together a draft for us. I first went through with with some light edits, because I didn't have a lot of time but then I went decide to revisit it later. Just because I felt like it was hard to read with the suggestions in there I went ahead and just did like a rewrite of the first few paragraphs anyway. That's pretty much it the I did not do that throughout I just I kept my smaller edits for the rest of it they edit there wasn't as much there. I had this one question about whether we even want to bring up the parking garage since it's a sore subject I guess you could say, and that's that's all I've got for thoughts right now. What do other people think about the chapter. Yeah. Why I Kirby I liked it I had a chance to look at your rewrites. I think the same kind of thing about the garage or the not the garage the the hotel question and I guess the other question I have is like how far down the road do we need to be knowing that we're going to have some community input and some other things like that need to be in our final draft what is it we're trying to get to just as a newer member. We at this stage I think we do want it to be in pretty good shape, because I don't know how much we're going to be. I don't like counting on us doing anything like spinning spinning. I don't like counting on on spinning a bunch extra time later I mean that might happen but it might not so I'm more comfortable when we pass these out for them to be at least like near the kind of final shape that we would like. And then they may or may not be changed later as we start to put them into the website but I try to make sure they're as polished as as we're comfortable with at least for now. So I guess I guess as it relates to I mean I like to you know the questions about the hotel. I imagine the back in the day there was there were studies done by the city right before bond, you know was proposed saying that we needed a convention center hotels that correct Mike. Yeah there were studies that were done there were a couple of studies that were done. One that we had commissioned and then another one that was done. The Becheris had their own that they did it's it's a pretty well known. The fact that the the city of Montpelier doesn't have enough hotel rooms. Based on it's you know it's a track it's attraction and all those other things. Maybe we could just cite the study and you know whatever it's aspirational goals you know suggestions or something like that. That's a little tricky to write on the fly like this. Oh Mike can you. We could give it a shot here if we plan to pass it out right now, or could we want to just Mike can you hit me. Like a girl and over here. Okay thanks. Okay, so. Yeah we could. Wait and do like a cursory vote next time and then polish it up before then does that sound good for people and I'll just throw in a placeholder for. Yeah I think Mike if you want if you could throw that in we can you know kind of words meant the language and stuff and I like that I don't know what other people starts were but otherwise I thought it was pretty well done. Do you have any other thoughts that people have thoughts about a need for me to do a similar thing on the rest of it, or are we fine with with these bottom paragraphs. A couple of comments but I'll maybe we should address that. Okay. I was just, well there were two things that I noticed. And this growth in the hospitality and tourism sector. I mean one thing I was just thinking of reading that is that I don't actually have a proposal for language to deal with this but you know we talked so much about housing and it's important for economic development and then we're talking here about outdoor recreation as important for tourism. And I don't know somehow I guess I guess partly because of the Northfield Street discussion I was thinking about it like these two goals can be in conflict at times outdoor areas and housing. Now I mean if we don't expand any of our outdoor areas are you know but I just to, because I feel like that's something that could be brought up. So we're, you know, talking about a new housing development later, like, oh well this we've, we're also talking about how important outdoor recreation is to our tourism sector so I'm just kind of a little bit worried about the conflict between those two although I don't, again, have a proposal right at the moment of how to address that. And I think that was that too actually when working on it. And because there is attention there. It's been brought up legally I'm not worried about it because as we talked about the last city council meeting, Mike and I both talked touched on this. The plan is a goal like housing. It's not like other parts of the plan can then counter that goal, like, so if we're trying to build housing, just because there might also be some trails put in somewhere doesn't mean the housing doesn't go in like that's not how the city plan works and the practical world, but even that said I would like to get ahead of this and I think I would like to throw something in. Also, I'm not sure how much authority really the chapter has either. It's more of the strategies and things. But, but even with those caveats I think we could put something like something in like something like to the extent that it doesn't unduly interfere with housing development or something like that. So, so I think the crux of that issue though like we could just talk about the expansion of the space and in public parks right the issue on Northfield Street has to do with private property, which is, you know, not an issue that that's that's not a real that's illegal taking right if we try to grab somebody's property but we do want to see expansion of all these resources where it makes sense and I think acknowledge that, you know I think one of the conversations that we all heard there was that there's that for, you know, that part of the city, right that there needs to be some more public parks or public access to things right and I think we can say we need to expand that how do we do that, right but that's different than, you know, construction that's going to take place lawfully inside areas that are zone properly for housing. Yeah, well I think, I mean, I think this came up, although I wasn't deeply involved in the discussions about the expansion of Hubbard Park but you know there are potential housing lots there when when Hubbard Park was expanded so I think it can it can come up and yeah. Yeah, no I know so Gabe what are in talking about is like there are people in town who will bring up a need for parks or a need to prioritize open space or natural resources or however you want to put it whenever housing comes up it's it's something that they that they say there's an argument that's made so I think it is I think it's nice to to try to to try I don't know to try to have something in here that that. I like the language you just added I think I mean I don't know what area on things but I mean that. I think that's sufficient. Yeah, I think just acknowledge that that sounds good to me what you added there. Just to kind of, yeah, acknowledge it even just a little bit is what I was going for. And I think we're going to have multiple goals from time to time. Really the parks plan is what's called the green print and you know I think if we were looking at a project we would want to go through and make sure that you know either our zoning or our master plan or city plan. You know we want to implement that. Green print because that's our basically our outdoor recreation master plan so. I think that's really the benchmark from a project standpoint as we would look at a project and see how it matches with that with that plan and whether there's something and then it's a matter of tools and that's what we've talked tried to talk to the conservation commission and the parks commission about is what tools they want to take to accomplish their green print because we can't use zoning and that's where they keep running into logger heads is is wanting to use the zoning to accomplish the green print which they really can't do so. It's it's that it's going to be it's a tough balance it definitely is but I think we need to accomplish the green print making those parks on, you know, for example south of the south of the river. You know this this parcel may be on the green print and maybe identified as as a priority parcel to put in a park. But we can't use zoning to make that to build that park into reality that has to be done by working with the developers on a willing bell willing buyer willing seller basis to purchase the property and so that's that's a different process. And so I think people just have to recognize are going to be different tools and we may not fully build out the green print plan because we aren't timely enough about getting things in but I think that's that's something that just has to be addressed over over time and addressed project by project. And I think Alec is doing a little bit more of being proactive now and I think that'll be that'll benefit his is getting that network built out. So I think we'll have to just see and we'll have to educate people. And I think getting to Kirby's point the chapter is really about it's it's not the the regulatory it's not the strategies. It is it is trying this is the piece the public is going to read this is really about educating it's about telling the story. It's about letting the public know what is economic development why it's important and what we're doing that kind of storytelling that we can put in there because this is this is where the public is supposed to learn about what is economic development and what's our plan for it. What's our vision for it and what are we going to do about it. Thanks everyone. So are you set a couple things I want to make sure we don't move on if you have something else. Oh, the other thing was just further down the paragraph before the next section, our workforce profiles similar to our business profile. I just just a comment and again I don't, I apologize for not having my own language to suggest but I thought it was a little bit confusing in that I wasn't sure whether we were talking about whether Montpelier can live in Montpelier or people who are not affluent in Montpelier can have better job opportunities like maybe we're talking about both but I thought the paragraph was a little. I was a little confused by it so just that comment. Okay. Maybe before we vote next week I'll try to clarify this paragraph. I feel like I need to spend some time with it, but I understand what you're saying. And I mean I can take a stab at editing it too but you because you do so much work with playing commission I feel badly but you also are already like sort of in it so. Yeah, I get what you're saying because because the paragraph touches on both the things you were saying but yeah I think I think we should be clear when we're talking about one and the other. Yeah, maybe we're talking about both and that's great, but I just wasn't I wasn't 100% sure reading it. We can. Are you on can you say what what's the two what are the two things that you're I'm reading the paragraph to and I'm realizing that it is kind of confusing but I'm what is. What are the two things you're getting confused. Oh, well one is people who work in Montpelier but live in like Barry, because they get forward to live in Montpelier and two is people who are not well off in Montpelier, getting better job opportunities. I think there was something in there about that. So I, it seemed like maybe we were talking about both of it, but I wasn't clear. Like creating job opportunities for less than pathways for less well off Montpelier residents. Right okay. So it touches on both of those things but I think we can. We can discuss them in ways in which it's like clearer. So we can do it. Just need some like segue type language going from one topic to the next. We can do that. Yeah, I like the idea of us just looking over it now and then giving ourselves a week to still tinker with it if we want and then vote next week. Do we have any other comments for now on it. Oh, just the one other comment was that Montpelier is Michelle sometimes so but I think we can do a search and word check is very weird on my computer I've never quite figured it out. It's on everything. It's amazing how many things my spell check just does not pick up on. I think Google where Google docs is particularly tricky. Yeah, mine does it on anything though even on word docs. Oh, yeah, I'll write up some memo and I'll send it to somebody and they'll go through and do all the spelling corrections on it.  Maybe here's a set to like a different language. I think I got them all. Unless unless Montes misspelled somewhere. But okay. Anything else. I just want to see does it, but doesn't really tell you something's misspelled in the text here. Anything else or should we move on for now and then we'll just plan to do a quick vote next week. So let's go and move on. Sounds good. I think I'll close all my tabs earlier. So that's fun. So the next next thing on the agenda was to discuss doing policy outreach for solar access. And then, and then, and Michael you'd put rather than amendment language I mean I was, my assumption was we would be doing both together. I mean we necessarily would do the outreach before doing amendment language, but maybe I'm not remembering something from our discussion next last time. Do we have thoughts about what order we should do that in or something about that process. Yeah, that was what I wanted to kind of talk a little bit about. What I was thinking was, you know, John and Jeff and everybody have has really put together some interesting educational points and rather than starting with a draft set of zoning changes and and arguing the case. Maybe it's just a matter of going out to public with what we know and what we've figured out and just start to have a conversation to go through and say before we write. Right regulations to implement a policy. And right now we don't really have a policy. So maybe the best thing to do is to go to the public and start having a conversation. We kind of know where we would go in certain. Well, we already voted where we really want to go. But if that doesn't work out then what's the public or the city council willing to kind of take as a policy step and maybe it's. You know, and this is a second while the second question on this, but you know, maybe it's a matter of just doing public input with the public going to city council having the same presentation and then. Following that up with, you know, asking city council to give us direction as to what the policy should be and then we'll draft something that reflects that policy. Because I think going in with the answer kind of puts city council and others in the position, the same position that they're in right now, which is they go in, they see it and they're like, that's not what we want. We're going to vote no and it gets kicked back. Whereas sitting down with them to go through and have the first conversation of what's our policy going to be. What is our policy to protect gardens in the middle of winter is our policy to protect, you know, no shade ever on any piece of housing or, you know, what are the costs and consequences of each of those. John's map showing how many buildings are non conforming, you know, kind of getting that information out there to go through and say this isn't taking into account topography this isn't taking into effect a lot of pieces. This is just the world we live in and, you know, I think there's there's a piece that goes in regarding education and and I think that would be an easier place to start. The second very related question is going to be about timing. How much of a priority is is having this conversation at this time? Because, you know, we all know, you know, we look on our agenda here, you know, we're talking about the city plan, we really want to crank through the city plan this year and get that done. And sometimes holding these public hearings and getting these things there. It's going to that's going to take up a couple of public this can take up a couple of our meetings and how much time do we want to take away to work on the shading. I mean, this has been in effect for four years now and impacted almost impacted. It didn't impact but almost impacted games project. And that's it. So it's from a permit standpoint. It's not really a high priority. That said, we have five housing projects that are on the horizon and how many of those would be impacted. And that's that's an unknown until we run some run some analyses. But it's part of the reason because we just haven't had a neighbor or someone bring it up though, or or for the administrative approval aspect of it have we looked closely at that for every project. No, it just hasn't come up much we've worked. When this was proposed, you know, I could see a little bit of the writing on the wall and knew this was going to be a problem. And, you know, as I said, there was this, there's the architectural standards for the two that I thought were very problematic. So I very conveniently maneuvered them into the major site plan, which is used only in very limited cases, including doing large construction projects. So the architectural standards and and the shading only come up in very few cases of which Gabe's project was one of them. So you have to build a new project and it has to be bigger than a certain size to qualify as a major site plan. Most of our projects are additions, renovations, sheds, porches, gazebos, changes of use. Very few new buildings get built. If you were just to think around Montpelier, you know, the timber frame was built after the zoning went into effect, but that's out in the rural district. Not a big difference. Caledonia Spirits was before the zoning went into effect, so that was under the old zoning. Well, none of this stuff is in the building. Yeah. The solar or create a problem in the building, which is supposedly one of the most. Yeah. So it's really with the infill projects where this is going to come up. So yeah, it hasn't come up very often. So and that's, you know, that was a little bit by by design and by how we moved it. But if we were to build, you know, the either of the Northfield Street projects, they're they're going to both be major site plans. It's going to it's going to come up in other cases. The question is if it's going to be a problem in those other cases. If we're not thinking that it's going to be an immediate concern. What if we put it into the housing and the plan and then we kind of use that. We could kind of use that as like outreach time. And more education time we could make it like a strategy or that's too specific for is it too specific for a strategy. We could I mean if we had trying to think we can always combine some of it with another public input piece. So if we let's say we're working on the city plan and we're working our way through and by August or September, we're ready to do some public outreach on the city plan. We can always build in some public input on some zoning changes as well. Whether it's this issue or you know the next round of zoning changes is going to come up and maybe we just do some zoning outreach hearings that we put out that talk about a number of things that we want to change in the zoning and this just is one piece of it and we talk a little bit of policy. So I think the original conversation was that we need to get some policy input right and so we could kick it down to the latter one. It was just just a, you know, interesting fact I went searching around I was trying to find other cities or states that have anything like this. And I could see how it was how it compared, and I couldn't, I couldn't find one I mean I went to do it you know nobody does. I don't know who the consultant was the recommended this I understand it's based on solar panel design. But, you know, even even California who's the leader and in solar projects, they stop at a certain point they don't get to this. And in fact all the lawsuits are about like whether or not you can plant a tree. And anything to do with us. This is, this is, you know, really interesting so it's almost like it's such a total anomaly that we at some point maybe it isn't a priority right now. But when we're doing the next zoning like you almost have to ask the city council, what is it you're really trying to do because this was, I mean I don't know maybe it was a mistake. It's not benchmarked off of anything I could find anyway. Well, okay, so what do you guys think about this plan. I like the idea of striking while the irons hot mean. Yeah, like Mike said, Jeff and john recently did work on this. I know from my own experience when I work on something for my day job, like a, you know, tax law thing. And then someone asked me about a year later I gotta like, I gotta do it over again.  What if we with, we don't let anything that we're doing get in the way of any of the city plan work, like, we're going to do the city plan work as soon as it's ready. I mean, but, but, you know, sometimes we have some gaps to fill because because Mike's very busy and can't always be working on that. So with our gap time in the next month or so month or two. We can work on some outreach about this where we put the stuff that's fresh in our minds together into some outreach. We don't necessarily needed to publish it right away. We can publish it closer to when we think we'll do the hearings. It's looking like the timing for the hearings is probably going to it's going to make sense that we have the plan finished maybe this summer early fall and then we'll do the hearings right after we're done with the plan work and that's been, you know, passed on to the consultant at that point so that's what I'm remembering the timeline was like. So I mean that's what that's what I'm thinking we could, and I like the idea of doing the outreach before we start working on doing the amendment so do some outreach stuff. Mike mentioned, maybe a presentation to city council which would mean like a PowerPoint or something that we put together. And then plus, I think, like an article or something. We can start with the article maybe and then turn the article into a PowerPoint thing or I'm assuming Mike would end up if there is a presentation to city council on this, then Mike would do in the presenting so maybe he can just take whatever we do for Mike and turn it into his own presentation. Totally defer you Mike on on what process you want to do there. The point is we maybe put some of this down in an outreach type format in the next month or two when we have the space for it. And then we can shelf it for a couple of months after that, and, and then publish it and work on it further when when it's time when it's closer to time to do a hearing on this and consider it. How does how does that plan sound for people. Do you have any concerns or thoughts about that Mike. I mean that that sounds sounds like a good idea I mean I would. You know I think what you want for outreach material is just to, you know, explain, you know, start out with the, you know, explaining the problem. What's the existing problem that we're trying to address and you know what we're trying to. We're hoping to achieve and then giving some some background information that kind of, you know, identifies why this is a problem and what are some of the options that people could consider and then we want to figure out what people's thoughts are. And I think there's a certain obviousness that comes out that most people will see when you start going at, you know, most most buildings today don't don't meet this requirement. You know, and we can go through and explain that and I think I think there's a number of ways that we can kind of present that problem that maybe invites an obvious answer. It won't make everybody happy and I can, you know, name three or four people that automatically won't like anything that we propose but I think it's important that we start to have that conversation before we draft the rules. It'll make that it'll make it smoother next time. I totally agree with that. And I think it just goes to some of the conversation conversations that we've been having around like the density thing to I like the approach of like talking about policy and talking about and inviting education and inviting conversation before we have like an actual rule thing to bring to to change, even if that's the end goal. To do that, it would probably be good to have john at the meeting when we actually talk about putting into outreach format. I'm fine doing it but I'll need all of the, all of the research that we have so far on it. You know, I'd like to have that my possession before trying to draft something. I would also open if anyone else wants to volunteer for that also, by the way, was not mentioning that because I want to hog it or anything. So, so maybe yeah, we'll, next time we have john at the meeting wall, gather all of the info we have together. Jeff, do you have like anything like notes or anything to share. I would be able to put something together that builds off the notes I provided to the council. Good. That reminds me I haven't gotten actually I haven't got to sit down and read your paper, but Jeff shared a paper that he that he wrote and published that on a similar topic on planning topic. Okay. Sounds good sounds like a plan. Do we have anything else on this before we move on to the next item. Okay. So the next thing is the draft outreach letter I'll share screen. So what we have so far for this is Marcella Mason changes. I said I wasn't going to touch it and just let other people have at it. It doesn't look like there's been any like significant additions or anything Marcella just wanted to like custom things. I'm not going to like Marcella stuff does anybody else want to drastically alter or change any parts of this. You're fine. I mean I'm definitely not married to the intro in the opening so we're comments about last week. If we wanted to modify that. Open the suggestions about that. Okay, so let's get into Marcella stuff I see okay cutting that out. Just general. Well and just just I think they kind of the priest is really just kind of pulling. I just did it in an effort to make it a little bit shorter. Maybe a little bit simpler. I think that, and I didn't look I didn't think about adding language to the top but I do think it might be good to add a sentence about the intent of the letter to the top, rather than, you know, like more so than just let you know what we're doing. Maybe say something like we could, I could help think of a sentence of like, you know, we're intent with your letter letters to make you aware of A, B and C. And then, because it's a letter that is intended I think to be more of the like just, we're here and you can engage with us. Rather than outlining very specific solutions or projects other than the city plan. I was thinking the shorter is better and you know maybe I think you outlined the housing problem well, but maybe we think about shortening that just a little bit to get to the point about how we can engage the community a little bit faster. That was that was where the edits were coming from. Okay. Okay, so the first things first, trying to flesh out the intro because you mentioned that. I would just say this. Yeah, you can expect and how you can engage maybe you can expect from us in the coming year and how and how you can participate. Well what specifically do we want to say about participation, what do we want to invite them to do come to meetings, send us emails. Yeah, I think you say all those things at the end right. And then if this is, I know it was intended to be in the bridge right so it would be printed but they do do they do an online person as well we could have like links to those things. I don't know I guess it was just planned for to be in print. Okay. So we should add a wrapped sentence and with like the link to the website and that should do it. What's the best website to put your mic. Well that would just be the, the Montpelier. I don't know you just probably want to go out to the city of Montpelier page and pull the homepage. That's probably it. Shortest URL. Yeah, www.montpelier-vt.org. Okay, people are likely to call me if they have to sign up from there. I shouldn't if there's one place that people usually can find it's the, the links to agendas and minutes. So I think we took out some of my. Thank you, Mike. Some of the stuff that was just trying to get people energized about the thing. I think I took out things that I felt like just weren't necessary. I tend to be a heavy editor that way so I would defer if other folks feel like it would be helpful to have some of that stuff still in there. I think it depends on the audience, but I think some people do respond to with to the cheerleader type approach. Just a little at the beginning, a little at the end, take it out of the middle. I have to go tend to a four year old you guys can discuss that for a second I'll bear back. I'm just pointing at one particular one or not, but I did kind of throughout take out some of the language that I felt like was editorial, maybe is the word. Like, you know, solving the problem takes some serious work with all. I think if we wanted to have that kind of language we could do it at the top just saying like, the plan will be better if we have more folks engaged. And so, you know, or heads are better than one that sort of thing and then we could at the end when we say we would love to hear from you, we can play that up a little bit but I think I just feel like it makes it longer than it should be to have and just feels a little bit like how to feel about paragraph when the paragraph is very clearly written to make sure people feel like this is a problem. Does that make sense? We don't need to tell them it's you know, we just, it's clearly a problem we don't have to also tell them it's problem. Yeah, I think your edits make sense. Okay, and I think short is better shorter is better too. And just thinking about some of the conversation we had last week about what the actual problem is and what we're trying to achieve and it has to do with that engagement. So, putting it up front that we want people to be involved and we want them to be involved because more ideas makes for better planning. Okay, I think I heard most of that. Remember here is to signal a change. People think that that's flows. Okay, and I guess that's fine. Okay, so it looks like the only thing left will be kind of lost my train of thought about what this the intent of this sentence was going to be I think it was on people where to look but that's at the end, I guess. Anything else to change or should I think there, I think there was this those couple bullets at the top and maybe you were going to go there and adding that in I thought there was like, these are the things we're going to go through I was going to add them in I got in there today and I'm like, I don't remember all stuff that working. So I couldn't add it, but I thought that was some of the intent was just to telegraph a little bit of like here's some of the big you know like, we certainly talked about the city plan but what are some of the other big things that we're looking at. But you know this density issue. And that's one. What are the other things we think we need to introduce at the beginning. But otherwise I thought it was good and I grew the edits. That's another one just so I can throw in three here. Yeah, soliciting intensity here because those are going to be two things we're going to be doing outreach on so it makes sense to name them specifically anyway. Maybe talk about the plan later but maybe we talk about the plan here, and then we can shorten it later, like update. Should I, should I call it the city master plan this time Mike since like so many people okay we want to get people off of that. Okay. Just give some people a background because you don't know. It was called the master plan for a really long time we made the conscious decision to change it to the city plan because that's the more accurate term for what it is. But people who've been around for a while and know, you know, in the planning area in the public they, they've used the term master plan and so that's the word that they use a lot. It's the same thing as the city plan. If you ever hear someone say master plan just so you're not confused. Could you say a major update of our city plan rather than a total rewrite. I think the total rewrite actually is important because some people are like, don't realize that we are totally rewriting it and they say things like we need a total rewrite. And they're not, they don't realize that's what we're doing. Mike, what do you think? A little loose cannon to me total rewrite of the city plan but you know it's like on schedule it's not like, it's not like we're just flying by the scene of our pants. I know it's way overdue. I know it I mean really like we've, we haven't had a major rewrite and a few iterations right so, or a couple iterations anyway. Do you have thoughts Mike call it a rewrite or call it a major update. I think it's more accurate to call it a total rewrite. Gabe did you think that we needed to make any more changes I should just accept ourselves. I agree with all the edits there is good. So I'll probably give it one more look at it just to make sure there's not any errors anywhere. Guys, I, I'll, I'm in the meeting. Sorry to that. Okay, so, so I'll send it off more or less like this after doing a review. Let's take a vote just I don't know if we let's just let's just vote on it for just the sake of being thorough. And it's going through the cans it's going to the bridge it's going to both. Cans and bridge. Yeah, that was what we had said before. And that's the extent of my plan right now. Yeah, no, I, I, I motion that we approve the letter going out. Okay. We have a second from Marcella. Do we have any further discussion on the letter. Anybody have anything else to say before we vote. Thanks Kirby. Yeah, no worries. Thanks everyone for actually going along with this, I think it's important. Okay, so I don't, I don't hear any other discussions so those in favor of approving this letter outreach letter for publications say hi. Hi. Any opposed. Any abstain. Okay. That is done. Mostly. Okay, I stopped sharing right. So we're going to, yeah, we're going to get in. We have an hour left in the meeting we have an update of the RFP for the plan consultant and we have to consider the minutes and then we have the executive session so we can get to the executive session and the next 15 minutes that would be super without going to pass it to Mike for the update on the RFP. This one shouldn't take too long. I was kind of hoping we'd have john here so we, we're still trying to figure out exactly what we're, we're doing. So we have our one proposal. We've got one, another, another team that's interested in sending in a proposal, knowing that we've got additional funds. So we're kind of a little bit betwixt in between. I'm going to reach out to the state to see what their procurement policy says. I would like to find at least one more if we're going to invite the other, the second group to apply. I'm trying to keep everything fair as I can. But it's a little bit, it's a little bit tricky. So I'm going to try to still work with John because he wants to put together some quick things so we can get a better proposal back to the consultants, but I also am trying to find one more. But also, as I said, also reach out to the state. If the state says we have to repost, then that'll be a big inconvenience. So we can always go with the one applicant that we got. There's nothing that says we have to repost just means we can't consider others. And I don't think that, you know, I won't get into reviewing and analyzing these right here right now. But, you know, it wouldn't be a bad thing if we ended up with the one proposal that we did. It's just nice to have a couple options to consider. And that's all I was trying to do is just to get us a couple of things in front of us so that way we've got opportunities to evaluate because this isn't, other than John, none of us are an expert in this field. So it's kind of nice to get to hear from a couple of different consultants so you get a couple of different viewpoints and perspectives and you can kind of get an opportunity to look at it and say, you know, I really like their approach. I really like their quality of their products. So that's all I was trying to do to get a few more folks for us to consider. But I'll contact the state because it is with the state grant. We do have to make sure we meet their procurement requirements. I'll follow up with them and then I'll follow up with John and, you know, I think the worst case is I don't want us to get behind. So I think if we get to a point, you know, if I follow up with them, I'll probably work with Kirby and make, we'll have to make a decision at some point that says we're going to put this out. I'll probably do it as short a window as I can. If I have to do a full RFP, then I'll probably give it a really short window and make sure we contact a few people directly and do a few list serves and try to make that go, make it a go. But we'll probably have to make that decision quickly. So I may have to email you guys and have you guys make a decision or just, if you guys want to give me the executive power to make that decision, I can also do that too. Based on what I find out. So personally, make plenty of feedback. You mean your second. Yeah, so my thoughts are you're going to be working with this consultant, you know, quite a bit. So you're, you're, you have way more skin in the game than us. So, so I'm comfortable deferring and like what other people think comfortable to Do you, do you want us to like to, to vote on crunching that mic or just is it good enough to know that we're, we're fine with it. It's probably good enough to know that you guys are okay with that. I'll let you guys know whatever.  I'm just picking on whether or not we're doing a full RFP or whether we're doing a narrow RFP. And, you know, that's really just going to be based on what legally is required by the state. And if it's, you know, if they say, no, you can choose three to, you know, choosing three special folks, then I'll find, I'll work with John to find a third firm, because he knows who the top GIS firms are. So we'll, we'll get three of them at least and then we'll give a two week window and let them submit based on the targeted RFP. If the state says no, you either take the applicant that came in or you repost in which case I just turn around and repost it to everybody and just keep it on a shorter window and kind of take that route. So I think most of it's going to depend on what the state's up to but I'm not I'm not picking or hiring anybody so I think it's perfectly fine. Okay, does anybody have anything else asked Mike about the process. Did it did it work out okay working with was it it was Aaron and john right. I go okay. We didn't actually end up get to work getting to work on anything that was a little bit of the problem. So john got hung up and Aaron I guess there were some folks that were sick in his family and so that just turned into a big mess so we're still trying to get through that step, but we'll try to get, as I said we'll try to work out and get john and Aaron back to make a quick decision. Okay. I saw the emails back and forth but I didn't realize that you guys didn't get to meet at all. Okay. Do we have anything else on this before we want to move on to the minutes we can do that in a few minutes and then move on to the executive session. Nothing else on this. Okay. So, if folks can take a look at we have a couple of sets of minutes. April 11 and April 25. And we'll just take those together when people are ready. After reviewing them. First, let us know if there's any edits to be done to the minutes and then then we can approve them when when people are ready. I was good with them I wasn't in one meeting so I can't the first meeting I can't comment on. Fine with the one I was in. Anybody need more time. If not, I'll take a motion to prove the minutes to make changes. And I move approval of minutes where I wasn't attending. I forget if that's. Yeah, sure. We have approval of the April 11 and April 25 minutes. Okay. Do we have a second. I second. Do we need any further discussions you will need more time. Okay. Those in favor of approving the minutes. Hi. Hi. Okay. And it's approved and then we can move on to executive session. So walk us through how this is going to go down, Mike. Do we just tell Orca to go away or you're muted. So we'll have to do a motion in a second to get the to go into executive session. So, and then pass that so that's the first piece. And I was just trying to look up really quick to get the specific language one. So what we'll need is a motion to enter executive session per one VSA 3313 a one F. Which is a confidential attorney client communications made for the purposes of providing professional legal services to the body. So that is one of the reasons under state law that we are allowed to go into executive session and that is what we will be talking about. So if somebody wants to make that motion and then what will happen is when it's approved, we will end this section. And then everybody should stay by your emails. And in about a minute, I'll send out another email link so you guys can open that link and be in the executive session. So that way it's in a separate separate room. So if everybody's okay with that. Yeah, I can, I can help you up. The session based on that. The statute cited by Mike. I was going to say, do we have a motion to begin executive session under one VSA 313 sub a one F. Just to be totally above board. Do we have that motion. Yes, that's my motion. So move by gay to a second. Okay, it was like it from Ariane. So we're going to close this session then. And we will start executive session after that. I do have to vote and I'm glad I didn't leave me. So those in favor of entering executive session, according to Gabe's motion. Do we have, do we have any discussion first. Those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed. Okay, so the motion wins. And we will enter executive session and in this session. Should we also adjourn. No, because that would not work. Okay, so with that, we're going to enter executive session under a different call.


Hey guys, this is Austin from the surf station just gonna talk to you a little bit about one of Channel Islands newest surfboard models the twin fin The twin fin was actually originally created and designed by Brit Merrick when he was invited and asked to surf in a contest where shapers had to ride boards that were only created and shaped by themselves the remade twin fin is actually based off of a Twin fin from the 70s that was shaped by Brit Merrick's dad Al Merrick They actually found this board at a garage sale and Brit Merrick took the template outline and basically drew it on a whole new blank and Updated a little bit give it a little more of a modern feel give it a little more rocker pull the nose and tail in a little bit Just to make it a little faster little drive here allow it to pivot and be put on rail a little more and not as Skatey and slidey as much the twin fin has been tested and rode by a bunch of guys at Channel Islands from Britain Self Dane couple other guys that work there doing the quality control a couple of the other team riders Feedback on it is the board catches waves really really well Can kind of actually be surfed somewhat like a shortboard for the outline and for the fin set up It works good anything from kind of weak mushy smaller beach break surf to good fun more hollow surf good point break surf the board comes with two twin fins given by Channel Islands and Then also has this little nubster Fin slot just to kind of give the board a little more bite little more control a little more hold if the surf's a little bigger Or if you feel like it's tending to slide out a little bit doing open face turns and whatnot The CI twin fin is made to be written about one to four inches shorter than your height and about a half inch to an inch Wider than your normal shortboards. This is all depending on your weight and level of surfing of course We just got a bunch of these in stock here at the surf station So be sure to check them out online at surf station store calm or come on in the shop and check them out in person


proudly we hail where the American stage begins here is another program with a cast of outstanding players public service time has been made available by this station for your army and your Air Force to bring you this story as proudly we hail Patrick Henry loved his country of a man who was wanting to live and die by that love yet his was no blind emotion but a clear disturbing thing he knew why he loved America to him her name was an ideal how that idea was revealed to him and with what agony he struggled to uphold it that is his story we all share freedom help share its defense join the army team yes now as always the United States Army is dedicated to the defense of freedom your freedom you can do something about it the time for decision for action is now the need for trained technicians in every field is urgent and you can be trained in the most advanced techniques using the world's finest equipment visit your nearest United States Army and United States Air Force recruiting station for full detail remember we all share freedom help share its defense join the army team and now your army and your Air Force presents the proudly we hail production no life so dear of the early years of your life you remember only fleeting moments warm casual glimpses of the places you knew your family your friends you remember the sunny day spent on your father's farm in Hanover County Virginia back in the late 1740 it wasn't a very large farm there was a lot of open country where you could go trapping and hunting there were caves to be explored and the South Anna River flowed just a few yards from the house yes you remember Hanover County you remember your father and his nightly tirades at the dinner table believe me if this taxation continues I I swear I'll burn my tobacco on the wolves before I'll send it to England some more vegetables that thank you every day the news goes tighter and tighter every day our chances of earning a living wage becomes more difficult I won't stand for it you hear stand for it father you mustn't raise your voice at the dinner table think of the children that's just what I'm thinking of and just why I'm raising my voice perhaps if we all raised our voices the king of England would hear our protest and curb this taxation your father's words had no particular significance for you at that moment you were too busy just being a boy too concerned with the pleasures of growing up but in the years to come his words would echo in your heart perhaps if we all raised our voices words to someday shape your destiny yes you remember your father very well you remember to the soft smile of your mother and you remember another smile the smile of a girl with hair like molten gold and eyes the color of a blue Virginia sky she came to visit you one summer's afternoon when you were sick in bed she came to visit and she stood shyly in the doorway and you heard her say I I brought you some wild jasmine Patrick I found it in the woods below the dam no what's the fella want with flowers that sissy stuff oh I just thought you'd like to have them oh they're fine Sally honest I was just fooling you're only saying that to be nice oh no I'm not a real pretty and how school Sally oh fine we miss you all of it how's miss weevil oh you mean oh well we will wrinkly old and evil you know we said the same thing at the same time come on link fingers you're ready what goes up the chin smoke what color is it blue your wish and my wish I always come true what do you wish for me oh yeah well it won't come true I'll tell you mine if you'll tell me yours someday someday Patrick I'll tell you my wish more words than you would remember and a wish you would hear someday but not just then you first have to learn to walk alone in a young and growing nation and it was a long road which you walked long and difficult and when you were still young you met failure for the first time Patrick Patrick come here a minute yes mother sit down here on the porch I want to talk to you yes mother Patrick the summer's nearly over have you thought at all about September about what you'd like to do well when father opens his store I thought I could run errands for him after school and on Saturdays I could learn to be a clerk but Patrick suppose you don't go back to school oh I want to go to school see that's important and this year I'll be in the seventh grade we start ancient history this year and miss weevil says that Patrick miss weevil came to see me yesterday while you were visiting your aunt miss weevil came here to see you you know dear this year there are 14 more children joining the school it's going to be more than over crowded and miss weevil says he'll only be able to take care of the boys and girls who are showing real progress in their studies he had a list of names and my name wasn't on the list never mind Patrick we'll study here at home you and I together every day we'll read together and your father can help you with your arithmetic it'll be just the same as school no no it won't Patrick oh I am sorry I'm so sorry but don't worry everything will be all right just wait and see everything will be all right just wait and see but waiting is hard when you're young waiting is loneliness in the bitter taste of disappointment and a lack of faith in yourself you sat by your mother and she listened while you read aloud and your father helped you with your son and you were growing and never knew of the coming glory which would be yours years past you were chief clerk in your father's store as you turned 17 then more years of learning at home and learning in your father's store but storekeeping was not as interesting as talking with the villagers who would come in to pass the time of day fill the local printer and Jasper the amiable crackerbarrow philosopher I tell you Patrick unless we stand up in our two back legs and fight we're going to lose everything we've gained so far well that kind of talk and late you into a parcel of trouble Jasper someone's got to speak their mind we can't just sit back and let him trodden our toes and pushes around like we were nothing but a sack of flour father says there's a new tax he had a friend up Boston where they've even put a tax on tea in Boston Patrick they'll be putting a tax on the air we breathe for very long but what can we do how can we stand up against the country as big and strong as England or size don't mean a might son not a might if a person or enough people make up their minds to do something then if they stick to it no matter what happens they stick to it they'll win out in the end but where does a person start where does it begin we need a voice now a good strong voice to speak for us for us the common the little people we need someone who isn't all dressed up in a white wig and satin breeches smart young lawyer who's one of us that's what we need a lawyer that chance of running a lawyer here in Hanover County Jasper morning father if it isn't the old storekeeper himself pull up a chair by the fire and set a spare we have been talking about something you'll be interested in in just a moment just Patrick may I see you in the office of course five watch the stop on me will you bill oh sure oh father what is it is anything happened at home no no not at home Patrick I've just been to the bank trying to get a loan they refuse to give me any more money looks like we're going to have to close the store close the store but I thought we were seeing as the store seems crowded with customers but we're losing money talk won't pay our bills Patrick there's no hope we'll close at the end of the week I'll go back and work on the farm and you son what are you going to do with your life I don't know I just don't know and you weren't to know for several more years years that might have been bleak and terrible except for one person someone with hair like molten gold and eyes the color of a blue Virginia sky and a soft unspoken wish I Patrick take the Sally for better or worse or richer or poorer in sickness and in health you settle down after your marriage on a small tract of land near the outskirts of the village to try your luck at farming but something always seemed to go wrong the first year it was bad seed the next season you planted too early and there was a sudden frost it was always something in the evenings you and Sally would walk in the field and she would hold your hand tightly and smile at you and say Patrick Patrick darling you mustn't worry though now stop worrying about the crop Sally don't you think I should give up go to work for Mr. Brady he offered to give me $25 a week to work in his filing office he put me to a test he said my figures were good Sally I'm I just don't seem to be a very successful farmer but this is a fine crop Patrick your father said so yesterday he said it should bring a good price and if the frost comes early how will we get through the winter we'll get along remember a year back when we saved 20 happers of beans why I should have taken that money and put it in the bank but I spent it on seed we needed that light killed four acres overnight there's no blight now or seven Sally there aren't many men who could be as lucky as I am I love you if only I knew what sort of a future there was in store for me for us look at me Sally no schooling of failure as a storekeeper a failure as a farmer you're not a failure and I won't have you say things like that Patrick Henry you're not a failure but you must be something will turn out you must have faith faith faith in what surely not in myself you've heard what everyone says that no good Patrick Henry and even make a decent living for his wife and child and they're right to their right darling don't you know that I love you and have all the confidence in the world I know you have greatness in your heart and someday all the world will know your name Patrick you must believe you must believe in our love and in yourself you must listen isn't that the fire bell in the village certainly sounds like it we Patrick Patrick look there's smoke coming up from behind the barn it's our house it's our house Patrick you are listening to the proudly we hail production of no life so dear we'll return to our story in just a moment those who enjoy freedom must help support it and in these uncertain times we must remain strong and alert to the dangers that surround us if you are qualified you can join freedoms team by becoming a member of your United States Army there's an urgent need for technical specialists in every field you'll receive the world's finest training and at the same time build an interesting and rewarding career visit your nearest United States Army and United States Air Force Recruiting Station for full information you are listening to proudly we hail now we present the second act of no life so dear before dawn the fire had burned out the fire had burned out and with it the last vestige of hope within your heart you took Sally and your child in the few pitiful possessions you'd save from the fire and you went to your father's home but that evening as you all sat around the big dining room table you haven't touched a mouthful of food please you must eat I'm not hungry mother leave the boy alone mother it's been a bad day a bad day that's a complete understatement Patrick in a bad week a bad month yeah my whole life has been a series of bad years one after the other you know it father all of you know it you found your way Patrick yes I'll find my way but when that's what I want to know when I heard in the village today that they need men in Philadelphia they're going to open up a new shipyard a storekeeper a farmer a ship builder well why not jack of all trades master of none if you'd like to go to Philadelphia Patrick I don't know where I want to go I don't know what I want to do I just want to be left alone I just want to be left alone Patrick Patrick you walked away from the house and into the night you walk down along the banks of the South Anna alone you walked through the night along the banks of the river a million and one thoughts world through your mind mingled with the sound of the river and the sound of the night a million and one thoughts discouraging thoughts and there were voices voices you knew voices coming back across the year if this taxation continues I'll burn my tobacco on the walls your father and Jasper someone to speak for us the common people the little people and Sally always the voice of Sally what are you going to do with your life son smart young lawyer that we need I'll burn my tobacco on the walls taxation too much taxation no one to speak for the little people you must believe in your smart young lawyer what are you going to do with your life son someone to speak for us the little people that chance to find an alloyer in Hanover County a lawyer taxation a smart young lawyer believe in yourself a lawyer yes a lawyer and so at last you found your foothold in the future at last the ultimate shape of your destiny became clear and complete two years went by long years years of study English history Roman law hours of burdensome study Patrick dear don't you think you should go to bed it's way past midnight a little while dear just want to finish this brief hours of work hard work but work you knew you must do to achieve your goals you were 24 when you passed your examinations to practice law at the bar of Virginia oh Patrick I told you so I knew you could do it oh just think my husband is a lawyer Patrick Henry is a lawyer two more years went by over a thousand notations in your fee book moderate charges for a country practice your name became known respected by everyone two years of building a foundation two years of learning and listening listening to the sound of unrest feeling the bonds of oppression growing tighter hearing the tiny voice of freedom echoing across your new and growing nation we shouldn't stand for it Henry we should fight there'll be war mark my words there will be war how do the English there to try to rule our lives in this manner that was in 1764 and in 1765 you were elected a member of the House of Burgess where you introduced the Virginia resolves against the tyranny of the Stamp Act that it be resolved therefore that the General Assembly of this colony have the only and sole exclusive right and power to lay taxes and impositions upon the inhabitants of this colony and that every attempt to best such power in any person or persons whatsoever other than the General Assembly aforesaid as a manifest tendency to destroy British as well as American freedom he has his fruit is the first his crumble and George the third may profit by their example if this week the most of it historic words to ring down through the years down through the pages of American history it was only a moment from your speech before the House of Burgess until another great moment and another speech before the first Continental Congress in Philadelphia it was the fourth day of the Congress for long weary days of arguments of attack and counterattack and still no definite plan the thunderclouds of war were gathering quickly some action had to be taken and taken quickly or the new nation would be trampled under the heel of English sovereignty four days then at last your opportunity arose a committee of five important Virginia planters proposed an alliance with England at that moment you knew you must make the delegates face the facts for the first time you rose slowly to your feet Mr. President Patrick Henry has the floor I wish to know what there has been in the conduct of the British Ministry for the past ten years to justify those hopes with which so many gentlemen have been pleased to solace themselves and the house is it that insidious smile with which our last petition was so graciously received ask yourselves how this reception comports with those war like preparations which cover our waters and darken our land our fleets and armies necessary to a work of love and reconciliation let us not deceive ourselves these are the implements of war and subjugation the last instruments to king resort we are not weak if we make a proper use of those means which the God of nature has placed in our power three millions of people armed in the holy cause of liberty and in such a country as that which we possess are invincible by any force which our enemy can spend against us what course others may take but as for me or give me a magnificent a magnificent speech mr. Henry thank you very much you speak with eloquence mr. Henry you speak also with a conviction can only be born of a genuine love of America a love which I'm sure is shared by all of us here at the Congress and by the people of our 13 states excuse me a moment gentlemen yes mr. Henry you must come at once the wire is desperately ill Sally I knew it was you I felt you kneel at my bedside while I was dosing Sally why didn't you tell me mother says you've been ill for a month why didn't you tell me I wanted to wait until your work was finished my work is finished now they say in the village they say there'll be war yes my darling there will be war there's no other solution and will you go too no no no I'm to stay home now just as you've always wanted I'm going to begin practicing law again coming home for lunch every day getting under your feet again being a terrible nuisance around the house but you won't mind too terribly will you hold my hand darling I know you think your responsibility is here with me and your family but you have a responsibility too with the family next door and all the families who've come to know this great land it must always be home to them always promise me that you'll go back and fight promise me Patrick you have my promise Sally but now you must get some rest we can talk again in the morning Patrick you remember a long long time ago you remember a wish we made when we were children I think I would like you to know my wish now I've known it for a long long time Sally because to know and share your love is all that any man could wish my very dear as you knelt there in the still darkness and the tears of sorrow were wet upon your face deep within your heart you felt a new strength which you'd never known before a strength which would lead you forward through the years of war to become the governor of Virginia itself a strength born of the wish of a boy and a girl to live and love and find happiness together in a free land it's defense the motto is new but the call it sounds is as old as the history of our country today as we stand strong and alert against communism the United States Army is calling for qualified young men and women who join the freedom team and become Army technical specialists you'll be trained in the latest techniques using the finest equipment and you'll be building a rewarding career for yourself for full information visit your nearest United States Army and United States Air Force Recruiting Station the time is now they'll present a transcribed in cooperation with this station by the United States Army and United States Air Force Recruiting Service this program featured a cast of outstanding players this is Kenneth Banghart speaking and inviting you to tune in this same station next week for another interesting story on proudly we have