There is what meets the eye, and there what lies beneath the cold, dark surface, full of pain and regrets, living with the shameful past that plagues my mind. In chains, bound by fear, each day, living in a prison cell, devoured by addictions of my sins, echoes from hell call for me, that I don't belong anywhere. The depths of suicide torture me every day. I am lost and isolated. I don't have to live this way. I make my hands ready for battle. This time I won't fight alone. This time I will break free. Once and for all. Everyone, we welcome you here in our studio at Flem of Fire Ministry together with Pastor Vlad Savchuk from 100 Generation and I believe we will have a good time for the next 30 minutes. Break free. The new book just came out after Pastor Vlad and he's going to share more about this book in this program so stay tuned and open your heart. Thank you for coming. Thank you. Thank you. Tell us more about the idea of this book. Well the idea of the book is a lot of people, they see our ministry as a place where deliverance happens. We also have sometimes even people see us as a controversial church because of we do deliverance or we bring people who practice deliverance and practice it on a large scale. But the book was born a long time ago when I was introduced to pornography at a young age. This is where I believe that everything started. When I was in Ukraine I was about 12 years of age. First time I was exposed to pornographic material and then we moved to the United States. Thank you for sharing this because many people they really need to hear this. They struggle with pornography everywhere and everybody is silent. Nobody is talking about this issue. The scene, the spirit of pornography. That's where I opened the introduction chapter with my story. When we came to the United States I was 13 and a half and so within six months of us being in America a neighbor of ours asked us to take care of his house and it was an American guy for seven days and so I, me and my cousin were taking care of the house and of course we're Ukrainians so we're very curious how Americans live so we went through his whole house. We checked the refrigerator, we checked his bedroom, we checked everything and I opened the one closet and it had a stack of VHS tape so it's about 250 VHS, the whole closet full of tapes and it was pornography. I wish I would say that I closed the closet and ran from there, 13 and a half. I remember the thought going to my mind, I'm just going to play a tape just to see if it's not a milligram crusade. I'm thinking I mean how stupid I could be but that's the thought that I had in my mind just to check what if it's like a Catherine Coleman crusade got stuck in some kind of a bad cover and so one thing led to another, two tapes later I felt I still remember the feeling of disgust and the feeling sick, feeling like I got violated or something and little did I know is that something entered me at that time. You felt? I felt that something entered me and felt it in my body. I made a decision that that's it, I'm repenting, this will never happen again. The next day it happened again, the day after that happened again. I was so happy when the neighbor actually came back and took the keys away because at the time there was no computers, there was no internet so I was fine for six months after that and then started a battle that lasted for a few years from about 14 to about 17, 16 and 17. I was already doing youth ministry, I was already preaching on Sundays. No matter how hard I tried once a month and typically before like a big service, Thursday or Friday, like a clock, I would fall into pornography. I always ran to my pastor right away and so I got on my knees, I said pastor I can't preach, I can't minister and my pastor he's a man of faith and grace and he prayed, he would pray for me and he says no you're gonna preach, he says this is the only way you're gonna overcome and so he never stopped me from ministry, he says you're battling, fasted once a week, fasted three days a month against it and I put restrictions on anything and no matter how hard I tried I could not overcome. A book by Jack Hayford, I picked up a book, I started reading books and freedom, anything I could put my hands on. A book by Jack Hayford, something about sexual purity. He mentions a story where a deacon in his ministry who was a deacon for 30 or 40 years for a long time, he had a really terrible past.  He comes to Jack Hayford and says that I'm being tempted, could you pray for me? And Jack Hayford being his pastor and being his staff, having him on the staff, he begins to pray for him and God shows him a vision. But in the vision he sees five holes in that guy's soul and he says these five holes are five sexual encounters you've had before you got saved. And he says though you're saved, he says these are the holes that Satan is using years later to attack your soul. And as I was reading that story, a scale was removed out of my eyes.  The front door is when you were 12. The first exposure to pornography and the back door is when you were 13 and a half. And so I went on a seven day fasting, it was one of the easiest fasts I've ever done because when you're desperate and fed up, it's easy to fast. And only thing I did during the fast, and I said, God, I know I repented for this. I know I prayed for it, but I never saw the connection.  I can say that I felt something different, but I knew that I was freed. A sense of knowing that I never had before. And ever since that point, I still was tempted in exactly same way. The only thing is in the moment of temptation, I almost felt like this one small degree of strength, I had it before. Almost like I had the power to, whether it was a computer, whether it was a magazine, whether it was something else, to walk away and to, to leave that. And so that was my journey to, to freedom. Little did I know that, little did I knew that later on, when deliverance started to happen in a youth group, when people started getting saved about seven, eight years ago, first in our church, and people started manifesting randomly. This wasn't during prayer, this was started first happening during worship. During worship, people would fall. So I thought it was like, anointing maybe, Benny Hinn is anointing, I've been watching Benny Hinn before. I'm thinking maybe that anointing is being released before I get up. That kind of a thing, until they wouldn't get up. So we would just kind of pray for more. Wow. And, and then when they started to manifest, we're like, well, I guess not more out. And so, and one case after another, we, we started to deal with people who started to come to that. And so I started to study a little bit more about the topic. And, and then we got introduced to some other ministries, Tipijasha Jenshi, who brought a little bit more light into that. But if it wouldn't be for the deliverance, I really believe, or freedom, if the word deliverance, you know, scares people, the word freedom, I don't think I would be in the ministry today. Wow. And then I experienced that with my wife from the spirit of loneliness and nightmares when we got married and stuff. So to me, this is not a topic I studied. This is something I lived, I experienced, and, and it's something that we practice as a church. And I believe it belongs to Christians. Wow. I believe many churches need to hear this because they pretend like everything is all right. And many young people, they experience the deliverance, but they never walk in freedom. They don't know how to live in freedom.  You write a book about this. So tell us more about this book. So what, what you pointed out is so true. Every single church, whether they believe in deliverance or don't believe in deliverance, they will come to the point. Of course, many churches, they don't believe in deliverance. They never practice in deliverance. Yeah. So that's the issue. I believe deliverance, one of the biggest thing that we need today. Because Jesus says, He says that a son dwells in the house. Whoever is a slave cannot stay in the house. And anytime people can go through growth track, people can go through membership classes. People can become home group leaders. But you can educate a slave. You can dress up a slave. You can clothe a slave. But there's one thing about slave, somebody who's in bondage to a particular sin or generational curse, is there's no consistency. And I think this is a challenge that we're facing right now, you know, last week, we were at one conference, the second largest church in America, very good with system and everything. And they started to do freedom courses, actually from Jack Hayford, his courses, with a like a freedom weekend, Friday and Saturday, because they started noticing people are serving and they're falling out. And they're like, while we have a great system, something there's a missing link. And the missing link is that people need to receive freedom. And like you said, it's not about receiving the deliverance, but also learning to walk with it. And some people need actually like a rehab center or they need something like a destiny center, a place where they need to isolate themselves or internship. Some people can manage their freedom by just going to a home group, like having somebody walk with them. Some people need to seek inner healing to receive that. I remember one of the stories I did mention in the book, because I don't believe that this story is finished yet. It's one of our losses. A young man, he was 16 years of age, Hispanic, got saved, two months later comes during worship, we're worshipping, and he stands like a pencil. He just falls. And so, and we had maybe 35 kids at the time, so a very small church. And he fell, we're praying for him afterwards. And on the side, I didn't know whether this was Jesus or the whole, or the devil's manifesting. So we're praying, he started manifesting, turns out that the evil spirit entered him. He had a nurse, he had a babysitter when he was a little kid who was a witch and who tried to burn him alive. The crazy part is nobody knows that except his mom and dad, there are scars on his legs. They walked in to the babysitter trying to kill him. And so they fired the babysitter, they cleaned that, they never told him that story. So the demon actually is the one, and we asked how did you enter him? The demon spoke is that I entered through, he was dedicated to me through the babysitter and everything. And so because we record all the deliverances, we brought the parents who were Catholics, and we showed them that and we said, hey, could you tell us a little bit about his beginning and everything? They were blown away, they're like, we don't understand what was happening to our son, but this is true. He was, he had this incident. And so, but the real reason why the devil stayed in him was because of his addiction to Paris Hilton pornography. He was obsessed with a particular Paris Hilton pornography. He wore Paris Hilton clothes, he used Paris Hilton perfume, everything. So he repented, he renounced everything.  He lived about 25 minutes from Tri-Cities. At the time I was very young and had a small Toyota Corolla, no phone reception at the area where he lived. And as we're driving, he starts to manifest in the car. He's twice my size. He grabs a pen and tries to stab his veins in the car. And so it was almost like a horror film. It's dark, there's no lights in the streets. I opened my flip phone and there was no reception. And I'm thinking, how am I, the back of my mind, I'm already going ahead. I'm like, if he stabs himself, how will I explain that to his parents that I didn't do it? I'm like, I'm scared to death and nobody's there. So I'm like, one hand on the wheel and like driving this gothic town and putting my hand on his, on his hand. And I was like, the name of Jesus, Satan let go of him and everything. Cause he wasn't fully delivered. He goes back home. I tell him, I was like, listen, I'm gonna wait for you in the car, but you need to throw all of this stuff away. And then we can go back. And he goes home, he throws this stuff away. The next day he downloads the pornography again and we do deliverance again. We did it for a month and a half, every other day fasted. He was also going to school. So I had to sometimes pick him up from school cause he would manifest like during lunchtime. And so they would, so I would pick him up, put him in and until this day, this man never got delivered. I still believe one day there's gonna be a final deliverance cause I see him in town once in a while. And the moment he sees me, he runs away. And I know that God still has a plan for him and that's why I never mentioned his story but I really believe that when people receive that and there is no continuous walk of freedom cause the challenge that happens with people is they receive freedom from pornography, for example, kingdom domain and they go to some kind of a minister, somebody prays for them. And the deception that comes in is that people feel invincible. People feel like they no longer need discipline. They no longer need to fast. They know, they almost feel like above temptation and that is pride. They need to have discipleship and discipline and discipline. Yeah, you know, the more I travel in and do ministry and ministering to people, the more I'm shocked. To be honest, everyone who's watching me right now, watching us, I think 95% people, Christian people, they struggle in with pornography. A lot of men. It's crazy. It's crazy. Not only boys, but girls too. Boys and girls.  So while I'm so glad you released this book and everyone who's watching us, you need to get the copy of this book. You need to get the copy of this. Also churches, youth ministries, because you have the whole study guide. The study. So at the end of the book, I have a study guide for whether people wanna go through the book as a small group or on the website, hungrigen.com slash break free book. We have videos that are about eight minutes long. And then with the video, it has a testimony of somebody's deliverance. So we have testimonies and I included some of them there in the books and I wanted people to see those that they read in the book. We have testimonies of people who had sleep apnea after deliverance that they were healed. A person who had 15 psychotic medicines, actually the doctor, her doctor said she was on the highest dose of psychotic medicine. He's ever seen anybody in America. And so after deliverance, completely free. She's actually part of our internship right now. Wow. Bipolar, schizophrenia, all gone after deliverance. And so I've seen a person who had a leukemia, two years, two and a half years of leukemia, medically documented now. We have about three to four medical reports six months later after he received deliverance that he was healed. And so what we do is we have a study guide and we have this 10 minute videos where we can share about the open doors to the devil, how to maintain your freedom, how to receive forgiveness, the renewing of the mind, which is a huge thing, how to live a disciplined life, how to submit yourself to mentors. And then we do this nine minute clips with a three to four minute testimony that deals with like deliverance and healing. Because we don't wanna show deliverance as it's only from sin. Sometimes people experience deliverance, they experience healing or financial breakthrough in their life. And then we provide study guides there as well. And all of that is available for free so that people can do it. Actually this week is when we start our eight week with our home groups. All of our home groups are going through that because I want our home groups. So everything in this book? Everything's in this book and the rest of the stuff is on the website where people can download videos. You guys need to get this. I'm serious, it's gonna help you. My daughter is reading this book. Oh really? Yes. Oh Jesus. So she's reading this. And after her, when she's done. You have to understand is that I am a simple guy. I have a high school diploma, which means I'm not super educated. And the benefit and a lot of people that wrote the book. You're much more educated than me. I don't have high school diploma. Oh really? Okay, so then your book is gonna be better. A lot of people that wrote to me after reading it, they really get blessed with the simplicity and they use a lot of examples. I use a lot of examples. It's not a lot of theory. Yes, there's a lot of insight and revelation from the word of God. But I want it to be intervined with first of all practical things, how it works. And I use a lot of life outside of church and outside of testimony examples. Like physical examples when it deals with a lawn or deals with a car with things to illustrate spiritual examples, a spiritual truth so that people can relate and people can understand. Wow. And also you guys will have a conference coming up, right? Next year, race to deliverance. So when is gonna happen? So that's gonna happen April 5th through 7th. It's going to be focused mainly on healing and deliverance. Those conferences are not for everyone. So usually we tell people it's for everyone. Yeah, manage that and invite people. So race to deliver conference is for people who need deliverance or people who feel like God wants to raise them to bring deliverance to other people. This coming conference in 2019 is going to be very different. Instead of doing three deliverance services, it's going to be only two deliverance services and the other two services are gonna be focused on empowering people to bring salvation, healing and deliverance to their community, their home group, their church or other people. So we're really, really excited. Even the way our ministry is going because in our church, most of the small group leaders minister in deliverance. We just had, let's try the training. We kind of teach them. We don't train them too much. We want them to get trained most of it by the power of the Holy Spirit and practice. We give them the basics and in their home groups, they pray for deliverance, they pray for breaking of the curses. And so I'm really excited for that because I believe it's not just the one guy who just stands with the microphone and screams out, out. But it's the body of Christ ministering freedom and people can experience freedom also on their own without somebody praying for them. What I like about this book that it's not only the information and good stories but also you have practical thing that they can do like a homework. So. And each chapter ends with a prayer. Each chapter. There's a specific prayer. So if somebody doesn't know for example how to pray for breaking of the curses. Wonderful. And read them through each chapter based on what the chapter was. They can receive prayer. The book is also available in audio form. Yeah. Please tell us more how to get this. So an audible or iTunes audio or anywhere where you can find audio book is there. And I was the one that read it. And we have quite few of after script moments where I go off into the after script. And so and there are prayers that are offered there also on the book and quite few people that already went through it will really, really bless even people on our team cause I wanted to hear their feedback and it's available on iBooks, Barnes and Nobles in honestly anywhere books are sold. It's there. Good. Thank you so much. Pastor Vlad and everyone who's watching us get this book. And I believe God will bless you. Tremendous through this book and deliver you if you need deliverance. Wow. Where the spirit of the Lord there is liberty and there is liberty. God bless you everyone. Get the book. Read it. Help young people. And I believe God will use this material to help many, many people all over the world. Thank you so much, Pastor Vlad. Thank you. Good to have you with us. Bye bye. Thank you.  There is what meets the eye and there what lies beneath the cold dark surface full of pain and regrets living with the shameful past that plagues my mind in chains bound by fear each day living in a prison cell devoured by addictions of my sins echoes from hell call for me that I don't belong anywhere. Thoughts of suicide torture me every day. I am lost and isolated. I don't have to live this way. I make my hands ready for battle. This time I won't fight alone. This time I will break free once and for all.


Hey everyone Dylan Schumacher, Citadel Defense and we are back with another edition of the Minuteman gear series where we continue to explore the gear and gear setups that the modern Minuteman should have. So today we're going to talk about a 24 hour pack. Now I would like to preface this video with two things. First thing is earlier in the series I think like the second episode we talked about this exact same bag and at that point I had it set up as kind of my three day rock. I had some more pouches on it, I had some more stuff in it and I had it over stuffed for a three day run that I just barely by the skin of my teeth could make it work. However I have since moved to a Crossfire DG3 bag which is a little bit bigger, has a frame, carries the weight phenomenally well and eventually I will update the series with that bag and kind of my current three day loadout. I'm just waiting on that because I want some more time on that bag because I'm going to do a review of it at the same time. But I think in general my made up opinion you should have a good three day bag that you can kind of go out and rumble and tumble for you know three-ish days maybe more and then you should have a good smaller 24 hour bag that you could basically get through you know the rest of the day overnight into tomorrow a little bit and be able to carry enough stuff to be able to make it through those 24 hours. So I just asked that if you haven't fallen the series you're not like confused and think oh wait a second that's the same bag and I thought just you have a brain you're really smart people I know you are. This is a 24 hour bag so let's go through what's in it. Okay like all things on this series this is just an iteration I'm sure it will change and would of course adapt as needed and to be honest it's not like I've run this one a lot I mostly put this together as representative of things that I would have in my 24 hour bag. So first things first I have magazines because hey you got to have bullets. I'm a huge fan of carrying magazines, water, medical and food on the external pouches as much as possible that doesn't always work out but as much as you can you know those would be the things that you'd have to just go and grab quick so I try to keep those things external when I can again doesn't always work out but that's what I shoot for. So four magazines off the back because you have an extra four is always good. Remember this would be in conjunction with other kits right so you'd be wearing a chest rig or your battle rattle or plates or whatever this would either be stashed in a vehicle as your vehicle go bag or like I said kind of your 24 hour sustainment bag but four magazines off the back these are just pouches for canteens of course so right now you know I just have the USGI canteen in there. When it comes to bag setups like this I'm always a big fan of lots of molly so that you can mount more stuff. Okay coming down here so here's real simple right I just got a notebook for all the notebook-y stuff marker a couple pens one of those is a right in the rain fisher pen in here I have extra plastic bags because you never know you might need extra plastic bags garbage collection of other stuff water whatever just extra plastic bags and that's it for that one. Getting into the main section of the bag so this is basically stuff that I have all mined from my three-day bag right I usually keep my three-day bag packed and then I would fill this one as needed that's kind of how I work it so this is just one I'm already obviously it's representative it's pretty clear here I have more room to fit more of those in right I probably put two or three of those in but this is just representative that you know you need food in the bank I put my schmog in here because I always want to have my schmog there's a gazillion uses for this by people who are a lot smarter of the way of the schmog than me but that's here because you need that extra t-shirt because you don't want at least one t-shirt I think you really only need one for the 24 hours right but I having a good change of t-shirt will be in there underwear I have a couple pairs of underwear honestly this is what I just grabbed on my three-day pack so I think there are three in here but you can't have too many of those in socks always carry extra underwear in socks because those things are what you're going to need to change the most my socks are up here right here I have more medical so for here I just put a dark angel ifac along with a ratchet tourniquet again I prefer to have the medical on the outside of the bag but that's where it kind of fit pretty convenient on this bag so that's where it went remember this is in addition to your normal i fact that you're carrying on your kit you don't have to have extra medical but I always just like to because hey that's one thing's bullets water medical are things you can never have too much of in this pocket here this is an emergency bivvy so I believe this is from sol gear and this is yes this is the sol escape bivvy and it's this color it's this green and it folds down to this little pouch here and I like this because this is the only kind of sleeping gear I have in this bag I do not have a sleeping bag I do not have a sleeping pad I do not have anything like that again this is short duration 24 hours or less and so this is mostly like if I need to actually sleep or if I need to not freeze to death this is going to help me do that right but there's no other sleeping gear in this bag again I'm assuming it's going to be 24 hours or less I'm putting on the clothes I got I'm putting on the kid I got and this is just if I have to hunker down for a while or there's a really bad rainstorm or windstorm or snowstorm or whatever this is going to help me do that so I have some kind of small emergency type gear in here and also you know if I just need if we got a couple hours and I can sleep this is what I'll try to use again don't have a sleeping pad so I might be cold but I wanted to have at least something so that I can make that happen because it's 24 hour pack and or a go bag out of a car I wanted to try to keep it as trim as possible I don't want a sleeping pad or other things hanging off of it so that was the thought behind having the escape baby down here I have wet wipes because again you can always need you always need wet wipes carry lots of wet wipes in general I don't have like a hygiene kit in here right like with a toothbrush and all that stuff because again much shorter duration so this is actually the lid off of my dg5 and I just took the entire lid off and threw it in here one because I have the space I don't really need to like be super trying to trim things down but two and more importantly it allows me to organize all the little things that I carry in my other bag that I would also need in this bag so things like paracord right here's a brand new unopened 50 foot hank a paracord because hey you need that uh an extra antenna for my radio because I carry the big flop antenna and sometimes I want to swap out to the little one uh extra cr123 batteries and mre spoon here's just some extra duct tape that I've wrapped around an old hotel key a lens cleaner thing i'm a jig because you need that for your glasses your optics your night vision whatever more c123 batteries because you don't want to get run out of those otherwise we're going to be in a world of hurt a red and sharpie because you need sharpies that's all on this side flipping it over to the top chem lights because having extra chem lights is always good couple zip ties and a couple bungees just for other gear stuff a orange little signal flag thing so this is just for signaling in case you needed to have some kind of identification panel you know you could have one of those full fold out vs 17 panels or whatever but I just have this a beanie because you always want to have a little hat to be able to throw on in case you get cold the matter of the time of the year because even in the summer it can get cold at night and this can save you okay that was all in the top part here now we'll go to the second one and in here remember earlier when I said I don't have like a little hygiene kit well I lied I do have some mouthwash I do have some body powder because that's important I do have chapstick because that is also very important and then I have tape I have general athletic tape can never have too much of that and then this is a tape for getting blisters cuts stuff like that this stuff is super sticky this is luco tape is what this is called I've used this before this stuff is fantastic doesn't strap very well very tough to come off and if you put it in sensitive places like if your legs are rubbing together and you put it on the inside of your thigh when you take this off later you will cry fun story I have a headlamp because you can never not need a headlamp this of course is I just have the red lens in there right now because again if you're looking in the pack or you want to read your map or whatever having a red headlamp is always a good idea so that is it that is my 24 hour bag this backpack in case you're wondering this is the first tactical I believe this is their 24 hour version love this bag I think it's super cool it does it is velcro lined on this side so if I wanted to get velcro pouches and put things in here to better organize I could totally do that again just to reiterate I do think you should have a good three-day bag and that you should then leech off of to create your 24 bag as needed you don't necessarily need to have duplicates although hey if you want to you can this is America knock yourself up hope that was helpful hope that gives you some more ideas for how you should set up your sustainability kit and different variations you can have do brave deeds and endure


I'm sorry I'm late. You know, yesterday a lot of people told me I was supposed to speak at 11 o'clock. And so I didn't actually look on the DEF CON website to see if that was actually true. So here I am at 11 o'clock. I'm sorry for the inconvenience. By the way, I don't mind if anyone takes my photos. Yeah, either John Callis, John Callis is CTO of PGP, or me doesn't matter. We get photos all the time. I figure I've already gotten in enough trouble with the feds so it can't get any worse, right? Yep. Wow, that's a little bit lower resolution than usual, but that's all right. I'm going to demo my new project today. My new project is Secure Voip. I think it's about time we had Secure Voip. How many people here use Voip? Oh, you guys are so geeky. The early adopters. Well, you know, for years we've enjoyed the relative safety of the public switch telephone network. I say relative safety. We're speaking relative to the internet. Of course, we all know that phone calls on the public switch telephone network can be intercepted. But it's a lot harder to do. You have to be like the government or somebody who's willing to physically go to a place and clip on some alligator clips. Or you have to have access to the phone company or the cooperation of the phone company. But with Voip, it's possible for somebody in Malaysia to hack into a machine somewhere and install a piece of software that will intercept all the Voip calls on your network and organize them like a Tivo player. And so, to move our precious phone calls from the sort of well manicured neighborhood of the public switch telephone network to the sort of crime-ridden slum that is now the internet, I think would be unwise without protecting it with encryption. So, first I'm going to do a little demo here and then I'm going to explain how it works. Somewhere in a soundproof booth is an accomplice who will now call me on my Voip phone. Steve, call me. He said he's watching this so he'll be able to tell. Yep, here it is. It's ringing. So now I'm going to answer. This is a regular SIP phone, by the way. It can call any other SIP phone. Great. Okay. I was afraid this would happen. Let me just say, I'm going to exit and relaunch. I'm using an open source Voip client and then I added crypto to it. And so, there are some issues with the open source Voip client that I'm using. And sometimes it has difficulty with NAT firewall traversal. Okay, I'm ready again. Steve, I hope you've exited and relaunched. Call me again. What I did was, you know, many of you are aware of PTP phone, a project that I did about nine years ago. At that time, the internet wasn't ready. No one had broadband. There were no protocols that were standardized for voiceover IP. SIP wasn't invented yet. Steve, you're supposed to call me now. Maybe if I try calling him. Come on, Steve. Anyway, oh, he's calling me on my cell phone.  Oh, man. That would explain a lot. Okay. Okay, I'll leave this open here. I'm going to put you on the little speakerphone. So you just yell into your speakerphone or into your phone when you want to talk to me. Or you could just call me. Okay, well, anyway, so what I did was, back in the days of PTP phone, I had to improvise my own protocols. There was no SIP. There was no RTP. It was the beginnings of RTP at that time. They were starting to design it. And so I had to just sort of improvise my own. And it wasn't so bad for the time, but the internet just wasn't ready. The bandwidth wasn't anywhere near as what it had to be. So it was a neglected product for many years. What?  Okay. What? Okay. Just call when you're ready. So fast forward nine years, and now the internet is ready for this. Maybe this is not ready, but... So there's still some net firewall traversal things in the open-source VoIP plant. I'm using an open-source VoIP plant called STOOM, which is written oddly enough in Python. And so we had to write our crypto in Python. It's kind of a new experience to do that, to do a secure phone in Python. Or any kind of SIP phone in Python. And so there are some problems with that. So this is why... See, I didn't feel I was ready for this, but Nico Cell persuaded me to unveil this at the Black Hat conference. And I said, no, no, I'm not ready.  What? Yeah, well, it's not. I would notice if it was. Oh, there it is. By the way, we don't have any audio. Oh, I didn't plug in the audio. Oh, it's just a minute. We're going to exit now. This is terribly embarrassing. This is the... You don't work the first time at Black Hat when we were on an outside IP address. We couldn't get it to work inside the firewall. But we got an outside IP address and it worked. Okay, now I'm ready, so call me. Oh, there we go. Oh, man, this is not working. Okay, you know, the crypto is in pretty good shape. It's a good thing they gave me an hour to talk, right? So I can try this several times. I actually got here a little while ago and I wanted to test and test and test, but the Ethernet cable for this was right here at the podium and so I couldn't... Did you exit and relaunch? This is why I... This is why I never use... Why I never bring a laptop to a talk. All right, I'm going to abort this. I'm just going to explain how it works. Goodbye. Okay, I'm humiliating. You have to believe me that it worked at Black Hat yesterday. I might try it again. It's tempting. If you want to bring it up here, maybe we can try it again. But do you have broadband? Okay, that's pretty impressive. I looked at various other protocols that are currently being considered for secure void. There is some IETF-RFCs that define various ways of doing it. Most of them rely on external sources of essentially controlled public key infrastructure to certificate authority. I think that two people who want to talk to each other should not need permission from someone else to do it. And so I just do like I did with PGP Phone. I do a Diffie-Helman Key Exchange. I do a Diffie-Helman Key Exchange with hash commitment so that this means that I can read an authentication digest aloud that gets displayed and the two people read it to each other and if it matches, that means there's no band in the middle attack. This eliminates the need for a certificate authority, a public key infrastructure. There's a lot of feedback here. The other way. Turn it the other way. Yes, I'm using a Macintosh for security reasons. That's just not going to work. Coaches that don't use a public key infrastructure necessarily, but they send SIP packets that use TLS connections and they put the key for the session key right there in the SIP packet, not encrypted. They'll just send that, but they'll send it through a TLS connection. The problem is it's going through multiple TLS connections from server to server to server and each one of them, it's decrypted, and then re-encrypted into another TLS connection. So that means that each of those servers has access to the session key and is in a position to compromise the call. There's another scheme that actually takes the session key and crips it as an S-mime email message and sticks that into the SIP packet and sends that to set up the call. And the other side receives it, decrypts it like it was a piece of email, extracts the session key and then uses that. To use an email encryption standard, I mean it's bad enough they're not using PGP for that, right? But even if it was PGP, I would still be complaining because it's just the wrong approach. You don't send an encrypted email to somebody to set up a phone call. It just doesn't, you know, it just feels wrong. And not only that, but it means that at the end of the call you have persistent key material around that you could use to retroactively reconstruct the call. If somebody intercepted the call and recorded all the packets, they would be able to decrypt them after the fact if they could somehow later obtain the key that was sent through the SIP packet. In other words, it doesn't have perfect forward secrecy. Well, you know, I just can't imagine designing a secure phone that doesn't have perfect forward secrecy. Let's see, there's another one that has self-signed certificates but you have to use a trusted server to get them or you don't know who they are and it could be a man in the middle. So all of the other schemes that I looked at have problems. And almost all the problems come from trying to get somebody else involved in setting up a secure call between Alice and Bob. And it just seemed the wrong approach. So with my approach, just the two people are involved. It doesn't use anything involving another external server. It doesn't send anything in the SIP packet that relates to the crypto. Of course, it uses SIP to set up the call like any SIP phone but not to set up the encryption, not to set up the key agreement. Instead, you get the SIP call started and then the RTP packets start flowing and then it inserts a Diffie-Helman exchange in the stream. Gets the key agreement and then starts encrypting it using SRTP, Secure Real-Time Protocol. When I first started working on this, I thought I was going to have to encrypt my own packets with my own protocol like I did with PGP phone but I discovered something called Secure RTP or SRTP and I read the spec for it and it looks a lot like PGP phone. It encrypts the packets in a manner that is nearly identical to the way it was done in PGP phone nine years ago and I thought, this saves me a lot of trouble. I was going to do it this way already. So I'm going to use SRTP. So this is actually one part of the protocol that is predefined in an RFC. But I do one more thing that I did not do in PGP phone. At the end of the call, I erase all the keys but I keep a hash of the shared secret that we used. I keep a hash of it around for the next phone call. And then when the next phone call happens, I do a fresh Diffie-Hellman P exchange like I do with every call but I also take one more step and mix in the retained shared secret from the last phone call. This means that there is sort of a key continuity model which Peter Gutman I see in the audience right here as he has called this the baby duck security model. He was referring to SSH. With SSH, you have an exchange of key material at the first session and that's locally cashed and you assume that the man in the middle is not present in the first session and if he's not present in the first session it's too late for him to get involved in later sessions. Well, that's the same thing I'm using here. So remember when I said about reading the hash aloud? Unfortunately, I can't show it to you. But for those of you who have seen secure phones like Eric Blossom's secure phone from back in the mid-90s and the AT&T 3600 developed in the early 90s they all involved displaying a short hash code that you read aloud to the other person to verify there's no man in the middle. Well, if you forget to do that it's probably okay because the attacker is afraid that you will do that and so he won't attack. But if he knows that you're lazy he might be tempted to attack knowing that you might not check it. But suppose you made 100 phone calls to your friend and you didn't check.  Well, if on the 50th call you suddenly remember that I really ought to check this and you read it aloud and the other person reads it there is allowed and it checks and it compares and everything is good it means that not only is this call secure but every other call all the way back in the previous 50 calls to the first call you ever made to them it proves that all of them were secure. It retroactively proves there was no man in the middle. That's really good for peace of mind.   But that's something that other secure phones don't do and that my protocol does and so I'm feeling pretty good about that feature.  So you can't go backwards in the hash. I'll be publishing a document describing this protocol. I think this is a better way to do secure void. This is a much better way than the other protocols currently being considered in various IETF RFCs. You know designs tend to resemble the institutions that give birth to them and I think that centrally managed approaches that we're seeing right now sort of reflect the sort of institutional thinking that went into making them and I tend to be more libertarian in my approach. I'm not a big L libertarian but I'm a civil libertarian but it's not only my political instincts it's also from a design perspective simpler to add a certificate authority to a SIP server adds immense complexity. We've seen many companies go bankrupt in the 1990s trying to build public infrastructure. There are companies that try to create the technology for building certificate authorities. Those companies are now bankrupt and sure you can explain some of that by saying the internet bubble burst I don't think it's always from that. Some of them went bankrupt just because of the difficulty of building public key infrastructure. Not only the companies that were providing that technology but the companies that were trying to use the technology they didn't go bankrupt necessarily but their IT departments almost went under trying to deploy public key infrastructure. So I think that if we were to learn from our mistakes we should stop trying to do it that way and when we have a new opportunity to deploy something with a new technology like VoIP the last thing we should do is go back and take a proven technology and I say proven I don't mean proven successful I mean proven a proven failure of public key infrastructure and try to apply it to VoIP and so my design doesn't do that. So for those of you that would like to see this prototype work better than what we just witnessed this thing is built around an open source VoIP client called STOOM written in Python and if you Google for STOOM you can find the homepage for it and for those of you who are Python weanies if you go out and try to fix the open source VoIP client and make it work on all platforms it's supposed to work on PC's Windows platforms too and get it a little bit more stable then this thing will benefit from that all the problems that we just saw relate to the state machine in the VoIP plant and how they interact with a firewall so I'd like to open it up for questions you're asking me to elaborate on my remark that PKI is a failure well you know I don't think PKI is a completely a failure I think it's actually worked pretty well for web browsers and web servers I think SSL connections between your browser and the server seems to work pretty well but it doesn't work that well for email well the PGP PKI works a lot better for email but you know take S-MIME S-MIME is widely deployed and is in fact invented in a lot of Microsoft products I mean bundled I should say with Microsoft products and yet no one uses it, why? because to make S-MIME work you have to have a PKI up and running already so the activation energy is too high with PGP you can run right out of the box you don't need a PKI to be running first and I think that it would be crazy to try to burden VoIP with that same high activation energy that's what I mean by PKI as a failure well let's talk about how a man in the middle attack would work imagine that you had let's imagine that this was actually in a hardware phone you had a phone on your desk that did this protocol and you bought that phone at Walmart for 100 bucks so imagine that your friend also has a phone like that and you want to call and it sets up a Diffie home and exchange and now you're talking right but imagine that an eavesdropper went down to Walmart and bought two of these phones okay and brought them home and set up the two phones side by side and had one of the phones interposed between you and the other person and the other phone too so that when you're calling your friend you're not actually calling your friend you're calling this eavesdropper's phone right here the one on the left and the eavesdropper knows you're going to do this and has your friend's phone number on the speed dial on this phone here on the right and so when he sees the phone ring and sees that you're calling and you're calling your friend hits the speed dial, waits for your friend to answer and as soon as your friend answers he answers you and now he's got these two phones and he holds the two phones together like this so that the earpiece and the mouthpiece are connected in this kind of sort of lewd and lascivious kind of connection there and now you think you're talking to your friend but in fact you're talking to the man in the middle and the man in the middle can listen in the air gap between the two mouthpieces, whatever and now notice that that the eavesdropper didn't have to have any special knowledge of mathematics didn't have to know anything about how Diffie Hellman works the only important thing is that you know there's these two identical these two phones that they bought at Walmart right and now there's a random session key between you and one of the phones a different random session key between the other phone and your friend well if you could figure out a way of discovering the fact that the two session keys aren't the same you would know there was a man in the middle well what if the two phones could hash the session key and display that on the little display and you read it aloud to your friend well they better match because if they don't match that means there's a man in the middle and that's what we do here only I couldn't show it to you it did work yesterday I swear it worked yesterday it's worked in a lot of places but in some places there's some firewall problems and I can't get it to work you know a lot of the SIP phones out there have difficulty with firewall nat traversal but there's better protocols coming out all the time you know Skype does overcome these firewall problems and I think we can overcome them in the SIP world too back there could you yell really loud now unfortunately it's written in Python so it would have to be sort of refactored into C the question was can this code be ported to other open source clients but it has to be rewritten in C in fact I'm looking for volunteers to do that I've actually got a series of products on the roadmap you know this is starting out just like PGP you remember PGP was started out as a private project without any money I paid for all this myself actually I did get some help Jeff pover who is a well known in the VoIP world put in some of his own money too but most of it came from me paying I hired an engineer full time to work on it for a few months but I was paying him really very low wages and eventually he had to take a job with a real company that paid him good money so the development has slowed down there is some development still going on with it but it's at the slower pace and I am going to try to start a company for this and I'm actually talking to some investors to get some funding for this and I got funding now from two sources so far I put some of his own money in and I got a little bit of money from Dick Clark I don't mean the guy from American Bandstand the other Dick Clark cyber security he left the Bush White House and wrote a book on they called Against All Enemies it's a really good book but anyway it's too late now so I'm going to start a new company and commercialize this but I will publish the source code with PGP that's what I believe is necessary to get people to trust it so more questions yeah could you yell really loud could you get up and just absolutely yell you mean the retained shared secrets you just need a little bit of memory for that yeah okay yes you want to be able to take sort of an identity with you from one machine to another well I thought about doing that you could put your configuration files and carry that around and copy it but I don't know I think we'd have to do something more elaborate to do what you're talking about because do you really want to copy that onto a computer in a cyber cafe well it's okay because the first time you call somebody there isn't any retained shared secrets so you just read the hash aloud and it just works the retained shared secrets feature it kind of makes it nicer but it isn't necessary yes right yes that's right I'm using SHA-256 SHA-256 yes and for the Diffie-Helman exchange I'm using a 4,000 bit Diffie-Helman and for the block cipher I'm using AES-256 running in counter mode for you know it is defined by the SRTP protocol so I think I'm doing that I you know I picked the right algorithms for this and actually you know even the collision problems that we've seen in some of the hash functions I think are not likely to be exploitable in the particular scenario that we're using them here even if I were using one of the weaker hash functions John do you want to say anything yeah we've been working with Phil on this too and supporting him and getting him contact with these and I've been controlling him into demoing at places like this as well okay I've been saying that you know we at PGP have been helping Phil with this that we've been getting him with VCs controlling him to demo the thing because I believe that getting some exposure to this is going to be important to get it properly funded and out there the really important thing in what he's doing is that this will go nearly anywhere I mean it can go in a handset it can go in a handheld computer it can go on a laptop the protocols are also directly layerable on top of what's going on sorry that we don't have a good network here to do the demo but the system that he's running is an ordinary VoIP phone you can call any other VoIP phone in the world with it and it just so happens that if somebody else has one that has the security in there poof now all of a sudden you've got a secure phone call and that's a really important aspect of what this does because it means that the network effect of getting people to get secure phones is lower that if you build a infrastructure that is a secure phone infrastructure that doesn't interoperate with regular phones it makes it increasingly hard for people to go on because they have to make a decision do I want secure do I want easy well this gives you both easy and secure and other things like you know that you only really need to do the hash once or maybe even not do that I make phone calls all the time and I can tell from the person's voice whom I'm talking to and you know from the Rhetarian shared secret that you are talking to the end point that you were talking to last time so you know if you have anything that tells you that that was a good phone call you know that you are in the same state you were before so again this makes it be very easy and understandable for people who are not crypto savvy who are not security savvy it can be put into all sorts of devices that's right the question is what about a non-technical person using this phone if your mother wants to use this phone she doesn't have to read aloud the little hash digits that are displayed she could just talk on the phone the protocol would work the same way the packets going back and forth are still you know the same packets it's just that final check that you do to verify to yourself to assure yourself that there's no man in the middle you would skip it and presumably the man in the middle doesn't know that you're going to be lazy and you're going to skip it so he's afraid to to do his attack it's an active attack he has to actually sit in there and generate packets and inject them he's going to be afraid to do that because he's afraid he'll be discovered because maybe your mom isn't as lazy as he thinks one of the other advantages of this is that you know that if there's anybody listening to a phone call they've always been there so this also makes it very difficult for the attacker because there is no way for them to get in and get out they have to be in at the beginning and stay in because the minute they drop out they are also detected this is a non-cryptographic security property that is very nice because it serves as a real deterrent to the attacker it makes their life really difficult yeah well you could the question is what happens if you try to call somebody who's using a regular POTS phone on the public switch telephone network in that case you would have to go through a gateway that connects the VoIP world to the PSTN world and that means that you're not going to be able to make it a secure call end to end now theoretically at least you could make it a secure call between your phone and the gateway where it touches the PSTN and then that last mile hopefully it's only a mile would be in the clear but that gets you across the Atlantic or across national borders yeah in the worst case it's no less secure than a regular PSTN call so that means that the vulnerabilities the new vulnerabilities that come from being in a VoIP world have been largely solved by this yeah the question is the US government is requiring people to put back doors in their VoIP software I believe you're probably referring to Kalia well you know they may change the way Kalia works but my I'm not a lawyer and I don't have the most perfect understanding of this but my limited understanding of Kalia is that it largely applies to the service providers it largely applies to the people who have gateways to the PSTN or the servers I don't I don't think it applies to end users so if you're running some software on your laptop computer you know and it sets up an encrypted link between you and the other party without the involvement of the service provider and you're not going through a gateway to the PSTN then I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that Kalia doesn't apply to that case now it's possible that they could change the laws you know make it more aggressive but we'll have to worry about that when that happens yeah I haven't worked out the protocol to make this an anonymous system it you know it's pure to pure you know unless you have to go through a proxy because of some firewall problems yeah probably if you do the anonymous part you're probably going to sacrifice your man in the middle protection yeah there's not that much overhead for the encryption the SRTP adds a little bit of extra to each packet for an HMAC an authentication code that gets stuck on to each packet it's long but it can be short to 32 bits and that's not you know it's not that much of a bandwidth and the only reason why that's there is actually not to encrypt it but to authenticate to prevent someone from sending in packets in a denial of service attack so that the packets can be rejected because they don't they don't authenticate it's not actually necessary for the encryption it's necessary it's part of the extra protection you get from SRTP against a hacker coming in and injecting packets that aren't part of your phone call I don't know if that's very clear we can talk about it later if you want more details or go and read the spec for SRTP there's an RFC for it it'll explain why you want to have that extra stuff you know it isn't only political reasons why I'm doing this it's also business reasons I think that if we're going to successfully migrate our phone calls to VoIP to the internet we're going to need this kind of protection and and in order to make a simpler design I'm doing it this way and so it isn't just my instincts for civil liberties it's also my instincts for simple design and the need for having secure calls you know we need to protect critical infrastructure and this is a good way to do it that wasn't in response to any question but I just wanted to add that I don't want everybody to just think I do everything for political reasons yeah well you know the question is what's the timing on the release of the source code first there has to be some source code what you just didn't see is a demo of my prototype it's a prototype it's written in python you know it's not the product and it does work I swear it works just doesn't work here but what I'd want is I want a product written C and there isn't one to get one I'm going to need funding so I don't have a timetable for that but what I might do a lot of people have been asking me I've gotten tremendous number of requests to just release the prototype for people to play with and for that I'm looking at I've got a whole lot of travel in August and so I'm going to really try to get it out by the end of August I actually considered trying to get it out yesterday for Black Hat but I called a law office there's a lawyer I'm talking to about the export controls well I had to file documents with the commerce department to tell them about it because you know there's still a little tiny bit of export controls left I mean we fought to get rid of the export controls in the 1990s and we won they got rid of the export controls but there's just a little bit left the only thing that you're required to do is that you just have to tell them about a product like this you don't have to ask their permission you just have to inform them telling them about the product but there's one other last vestigial remnant of the export controls you're not allowed to export it to about six or seven countries like North Korea and Iran and Sudan and you know those countries they're at the embargoed countries and so to put it on a web server I have to put in special checks to make sure that it's not being downloaded by someone in one of those countries and I don't know how to do that and so I couldn't figure out how to do it in time for Black Hat yesterday if I could have done it in time for Black Hat you would have been able to download it today if anybody wants to give me a hand on that contact me and I'll put you to work there's a lot of Unix weenies in here and I'm sure that somebody in here can help me set up a server to do the reverse DNS lookups and all that kind of stuff there's even some commercial packages that will do it for you but I don't want to have to pay for them yes got a yell really loud we got this loud air conditioner and we got a lawn mower and whatever else is going on so I can't really hear you conference calls what about conference calls well in order to do a conference call you would have to do one of these calls here just take this exact protocol and you'd have to do it between you and a server and every other person who participates would all have to do it to the same server server would mix the audio together and you got to trust the server also which isn't so bad no each person would have a different encrypted Diffie Homan exchange there would be a different session key and the server would just treat them like they were all separate phone calls and then mix the audio together and distribute it back out at least that's one way to do it alright now let's not always see the same hands ok well maybe I finished early you got any other questions you can ask me later so what do you think is it going to work I'd like to get your opinion about one thing is this going to do you think that this is a better architecture than the other architectures for those of you that have been reading the encrypted VoIP approaches what do you think my phone is ringing I think it's the guy in the back oh you want to try it once more why do you have a reason to believe it will work this time oh hey they opened up something in the firewall we're going to try one more time to do the demo just a minute if you want to wait one more time and to see another spectacular failure just wait a second ok let's see if this works I did you know I hit the call button we're not getting any evidence that ok I'm going to hang up well incoming call hey it's secure look at that going secure but we have no audio is there any audio can you give me some audio ok just a minute wait let's try no audio we're not getting any audio ok what we're going to do is hold the microphone up to the little tiny speaker on here where's the yell it yell say something I don't hear anything now yeah ok yes there's sound coming out here alright now listen to this you see this secure button the secure light here watch this I'm going to press this and this is what a wiretapper hears this is the first reg in the program ok watch that's taking the encrypted packets and playing them without decrypting them first so it sounds like white noise I'm going to do that again wiretapper hears this and that little that little staccato you know there's a lot of gaps there it's because of jitter and bandwidth problems but anyway so encrypted text sounds like white noise so let the meat cipher text and we have a go clear button here for the weenies here now it's just like making a normal plain text call and if we hit go secure it goes back to secure mode alright but I'm sorry we have no audio oh can you give us audio say something please say something say something audio sorry say something please listen to this call actually these buttons here go clear and go secure are not necessary in the real product but we put them in so because we're engineers and we like to fool around so I'm going to say go secure here and it does a little calculation for diffie and now that little bong that you just heard is the bong that says you're now secure oh the hashes let's see is there a man in the middle I say 5sz 3ua 3ua that's right there's no man in the middle so it's great no one knows what we're talking about we have a secure call here you have anything secret you want to tell me so we're done I'm going to hang up and that's it see you later thanks Steve alright finally we got it to work we got it to work I told you it worked I wasn't just making this up oh yeah you had one more question what the open source voice


Let's talk about it. Hey guys, so don't mind me, I just woke up but I normally don't comment on these things or I usually just ignore it but honestly sometimes I'm blown away by the amount of racism and rudeness in the comments especially now that I've become pregnant. People saying that DNA is ruined or why are you married to some Chinese guy or it's actually mind blowing and it makes me so sad that that is something that people genuinely feel and comment and they think that's okay. Another thing people comment is fatherless child and who's the father. I've been nothing but open about my marriage with my husband who I've been married to for almost five years. Anyways, I am so excited for my baby and my husband is so excited and we're just, this is something that we've always wanted and something that we've just been looking forward to and to start this new chapter as a family and I'm so blessed and so thankful that God has blessed us with a baby boy and I just also want to say thank you to everyone that is commenting kind and genuine and caring messages because those mean so much and yeah I'm not going to try to dwell on the evil mean people but yeah I just wanted to address it because it has been super bad since getting pregnant and anyways I just want to say thanks to all the kind people because you guys are really amazing and I appreciate you. Boom! I mean pretty self-explanatory I mean there have been multiple articles written about STP Peach's relationship with a Korean American guy over the past like six seven years. I don't know too much about this like twitch streamer gamer discord world but I know that it's relevant because there's a lot of internet comments stirred up about it. Yeah shout out to her for handling it pretty well obviously if you are a streamer you know you get all different types of comments some that are not very appropriate in different ways right so shout out to her for handling it shout out to her Korean husband they seem like a happy couple but we're gonna delve into it we're gonna tell you how we feel about it and what other people on the internet think about it so please hit that like button right now but you know what you don't need to worry about yeah don't worry about small sauce because it is tasty so just order it right now smallsauce.com I mean I guess my quick thought is this sounds like pretty standard internet trolling but obviously for some people who like they're not aware I guess of how uneducated angry in spells and the only reason we use the word in spells because I don't want to say the name and have it track but like of any type of dude right like would you say that like people when they're doing bad themselves they're gonna reach for the most hateful I guess negative stereotypes about a group of person to go against them right yeah yeah I will say this you know and I don't think every comment is racial and some of it's not a being about being Asian some are like oh it should have been like a black baby and then there's a lot of like comments and apparently Spanish and I thought that was really interesting so I guess she has a big Spanish speaking audience so I guess like Spanish speakers are also getting in on it but anyways David what are your I mean overall thoughts I mean before we get into the comment section I would say this man anytime it seems like a group of people in any sort of thing that wasn't normally good at that thing is coming up it causes a lot of cognitive dissonance in people's minds because it's violating their order of things and not only does it violate their like order of things like in their mind of like how things should work but it sort of indicates that they themselves or their group is starting to take a loss yeah and yeah I get what you're saying where it's kind of like there's a lot of dudes out there Asian I mean well non-Asian but even some Asian guys who had accepted the hierarchy that they were like yeah hell yeah Asian guys are at the bottom white black guys here you know basically the overarching internet trend was like the light-skinned black guy takes the white girl the white girl takes the Asian guys girl I'm saying that the white guy you mean the white guy takes the Asia yeah yeah I'm saying that that's how they thought that the pecking order went yes and they had accepted everybody was okay with that pecking order on the internet apparently but now that some Asian guys are starting to move up then now people it challenges their whole way of thinking they're just getting to understand it they're violating the order order of things things must be yeah what does it mean I mean I guess would you describe it I always had this analogy under where it's like you are like you know Nike makes a lot of different shoes Nike is an American brand Tesla is an American brand Apple's an American brand but they don't only make premium products they make a variety of products some of their products are entry-level however somebody else sees like a good product from like Sony or Samsung or Neo which is a Chinese EV manufacturer like OnePlus or OPPO or something and they can't believe that their low-ranked Nike is not doing as well as like the top leaning shoe because for a while all leanings were worse than all Nikes right so they're almost like well there there's no way that a leaning while 10 is the best basketball shoe of the year I'm a Nike all the shoes from over in Asia or trash well if these girls start being attracted to Asian men in their features and what does that mean for me does that mean I have less of a chance right and let's be honest if you're commenting on STP just life at all it means you're probably giving your attention potentially money or coins or whatever to her twitch stream you're probably not a very high-ranked product of whatever brand brand you emanate David are you saying that the guys leaving negative comments might not be the highest value men on earth how dare you say that about how dare I make a blanket generalization of guys who leave angry comments on the internet right I guess to be fair though so that being said Andrew is it true that you don't see a guy who looks like the Korean husband and ST peach all the time in public life sure I guess I mean they definitely look like a couple that you might see in Asia more commonly right but they're in what Canada so shout out to them but anyways let's get into the comments section David I think there was some interesting insight from Reddit some people were shocked that it just wasn't only like for example white guys leaving the comments because some of the comments are in Arabic some of the comments are in Spanish some of the comments are etc etc like somebody was like oh wait I thought only white guys who are the same race as STP peach would leave those comments oh no all types of guys want to make fun of Asian guys that's actually the truth right like like all types of guys have a significant number of them who at least on the internet maybe not in person but on the internet want to talk trash about Asian dudes it's true but and but let's get to the core of this because you know when one thing we're not doing in 2024 Andrew is shying away from the elephant oh yeah okay it's because almost all races I guess they feel some sort of what like Western closer proximity to whiteness or the Western narrative than East Asian guys right like East Asian guys or Southeast Asian guys being like quite possibly the furthest thing from like this Anglo-Idea yeah yeah I think Asian guys are just the most outsiders of these groups between black guys white guys Latino guys and even Middle Eastern guys Asian guy like Asian guys being there too right like oh yeah even Daisy guys like South Asians are more in that sphere too but East Asian guys are seen as way outside and we're you know the stats statistics like oh Asian guys were always the most least desirable Asian women are the most desirable so everybody always kind of knew heard this over the years because at one point it was true but do you think they also saw it confirm with their eyeballs like let's say for example I'm this guy in whatever Middle Eastern country I've probably still in my life seen more Middle Eastern guys with Asian women than I've seen Asian guys with Middle Eastern women yeah probably you know but I do think if she was with a black guy she's gonna get a lot of like negative comments too like to be honest like just because knowing the internet that's how it is some people were saying that the internet Andrew it's kind of like a Rhodes rage incident where people just say the nastiest most hurtful more like most cut to the base you know anonymous these are like the most ruthless baseline steering yeah yeah and I think that even these people even some of these people leaving these comments might watch other Asian streamers or might even know of Asian people in their life but at least on the internet anonymously they want to talk trash right that's the weird thing that I honestly think like some of these people in the comments maybe not all might even have an Asian friend of some type but when it comes to this type of issue they want to be mean and also it's not necessarily their Asian friend group is the guy who gets all the girls in their friend right but typically I feel that people who leave comments on the internet they're not popping bottles with models at the club whatever country they're from especially in Romania they not popping bottles with models at the club somebody was just saying well why does she keep putting it out there she knows that also it's attracting attention at the same time that's a little bit more meta if you guys understand the attention economy as an influencer it is true though right like I'm not saying their love is not real but she is putting it out there it's still generating more articles written and more hate but also more love I think overwhelming the comments on her comment section were positive and maybe like 10% well she might have calculated that she's like hey I know that I'm probably gonna lose some guy followers but I'm also gonna gain some from this because maybe more Asian guys are gonna be tuning into my stream but some non Asian guys are gonna leave right so it might have even impacted her audience a little bit you know right um somebody said that basically the reason why people feel that way is they feel that there's these larger stereotypes where for example African Americans are placed as highly creative and highly physical and that Asians are highly nerdish and robotic and have small weenies black guys have big weenies and that Western European guys are placed as the apex like Mario Luigi where they're like in the middle zone you mean they have the balance they have the balance and that's what makes them the most desirable I guess given like at a blanket situation you mean if like yeah okay right right I guess somebody was bringing up that Asian guys are viewed as toad black guys are viewed as Bowser and white guys are viewed as Mario Luigi yeah the normal centerpiece protagonist yeah I would say that those are would you agree that those are overarching stereotypes yes yes yes I would say so to be honest um I'll say this man I just think that a lot of people it reminds me so much Andrew of when Japanese cars were coming up in the 80s and 90s there used to be like I can't believe you want to drive one of them Tokyo cans around I tell you what you get into a crash that thing gonna crumple like a coke can you know what I mean because at that time it's true like Japanese or Asian car manufacturers Andrew they do have a different philosophy they make lighter weight cars that's how they make them fast the American philosophy has always been cramming more engines to compensate for the heavy metal right they Asians have a different design philosophy when they design things but for some people they want to keep the old way why well you know if that thing don't got a hemi in an eight cylinder it's terrible you know I'm saying but I'm saying that like over time people started to see that the Japanese cars or the Japanese phones or whatever obviously Apple has made a huge comeback for American phones but now the Asian phones are coming back up now but it's like like people have to see over time what a great deal and how reliable and how quality the products are from Asia right but is it true that there's still some people where they're like oh no I would only drive like Mercedes or like BMW even Alexis it's like no good for me yeah but if you drive Alexis you're like man this is a great car yeah no I mean listen the Asian imports are just getting better and higher ranked man that's all it is I don't know in every field whether it's a phone technology whether it's drone technology whether it's basketball sneaker technology the cars whether it's car EV technology they're just getting but it's the playing field is getting a little bit more even but what do you what do you say to guys who are like still I guess they're still a portion of people out there who still discount the Asian brands though right they'll be like oh I would never get a Hyundai I'd never get a Genesis I would never get a Kia I would never get even you know like a Toyota or a Honda versus European brands I guess what I'm saying is should people even think about those people who are like discounting the Asian brands yeah I mean if you're racist enough to discount a good product just because of where it comes from then you're not looking at things mathematically or fairly anyways you're not looking at things from a true like metric based standpoint because you're too caught up in your emotions and your replacement theory and your ranking and your racial biases so honestly you're just not being like correct in that you know you're not being precise you're not being scientific right right right and I would say essentially apply that exact same analogy to a T to these internet yeah I'm not saying every Asian guy is equal to every other non-Asian guy by the way I'm just saying that finally the good Asian guys are more on a level playing field and more getting what they deserve or at least getting more optionality that is what right that is all we want really as Asian guys it's probably fair to say that STP peach is better looking than her Korean looking husband but it's almost like you've seen the vice versa inverse of this thing for like a hundred years yeah where there was like a really good looking Asian girl for sure she's attractive I think I mean dude I'm telling you Asian brands Andrew like I said it's a one-to-one analogy vin fast Andrew which is a brand that a lot of people they kind of you know say some stuff okay it's not considered a great brand it's not it's not but I'm telling you the 2024 vin fast vf7 I'm just saying this is still better than a lot of cars on the road I'm not saying it's crushing its segment or whatever for 20 25 releases or whatever I'm just saying yeah look at some of the new key as it looks like a Cybertruck or a Range Rover I'm just saying there's a lot of good stuff coming out of Asia if you keep your mind open to it but of course like we said some people are open to it like STP peach she went and got a Genesis other people they're not open to it let us know what you think in the comment section below guys will this continue is it changing and what is another analogy that's better than the Asian products one to explain it until next time with a hop hop boys we out peace


Live from Las Vegas, Nevada. It's theCUBE, covering EMC World 2015. Brought to you by EMC, Brocade, and VCE. Okay, welcome back everyone. You are watching theCUBE here live in Las Vegas for EMC World 2015. This is theCUBE, our flagship program. We go out to the events and they instruct us to do the noise. I'm John Furrier with my co-host, Dave Vellante, our next guest is Blake Smith, Systems Director, Enterprise Infrastructure, Christus Health, Christ US. I said earlier, but it's a Christian-based Christus Health. Welcome to theCUBE. Thank you, thank you. So tell us what you guys are, what you're doing, and some of the tech that you're rolling out.  We have about 25 hospitals and about 150 clinics, as well as a health plan based in Texas. We also have international facilities in Chile and in Mexico. And we are living a life with healthcare IT. So what's it like? Healthcare is the biggest opportunity right now for companies they're saying to make money. Obviously, we hear all the time, oh, that's a big upside. But actually, from a tech perspective, there's some refresh going on, some regulations appear to. Give us the current reader's digest of top-line points of where the opportunities are for disruption and innovation. Yeah, I think the cost is being driven down by the business. There's really to the keynote this morning, they want speed and agility out of the business, but they want the infrastructure costs to drop. And that is providing all kinds of opportunities and disruptors and adding cloud services and cloud service providers, both internal and starting to explore external, which is a regulatory nightmare for us. Is there an appetite for cloud? Or is it like we have to go there eventually? There is a business appetite for the cloud because they think that it's faster and easier. There is a absolutely regulatory fear of the cloud due to the loss of control of the data. Let's talk about that. What is the biggest challenge right now? Technically, on the data stuff. And what do you see as an opportunity from a solutions standpoint to deal with that? I think one of the biggest challenges with the data is ensuring that you can encrypt it in the cloud, that you own it, and you can extract it as necessary if you have a cloud service provider. Many times the contracts are not very clear on that. So, talk about healthcare, the business. I mean, it's interesting to note you've got overseas facilities, which I think is somewhat rare, isn't it? It's rare in healthcare in the US. We're one of the few international providers. Yeah, so you not only have to deal with US regulations, but you got to figure out what's going on. And you said Chile and Mexico, right? Which probably have different set of regulations as well. In the US you got Affordable Care Act, AKA Obamacare. You got meaningful use. So you've got to show adoption of technology. It's got to be real. You want it to be real because it drives productivity. So talk about that dynamic and maybe how that differs from the folks in overseas. Interestingly, we keep our overseas data separate. That has a lot to do with the Patriot Act and some of the disclosures we might be required to perform for the government. And because it's healthcare and protected health information, we want to keep that data separate at this time. In terms of the adoption, the Affordable Care Act and just the Obamacare in general, data's adding a significant cost to our delivery. But it's also provided opportunities for us to get into big data and provide things that we haven't been able to provide to the business before. Because once you make that investment, the playing field's huge. So do you have a Chief Data Officer? We do not yet, but that position is being investigated. Okay, I mean, it's not uncommon for healthcare to be one of the leaders there. What is being discussed is a conversation. Talk about the consolidation of data centers because the Cloud House is an economic benefit, but at the same time, consolidation doesn't mean reduce costs and not invest. So talk about the, as you consolidate the data centers, what are the dynamics for actually continuing to invest in a data modeling, data backup? So we have, in the last four years, we've closed over six data centers. We've consolidated out of multiple regions into our two primary facilities and that has produced a huge capital savings, but it's also allowed us to reinvest in basically internal or private cloud technologies. So we have a very robust 95% virtual infrastructure that's fully replicated with SRM to our backup data center. So you guys like to stand there one day, tell them we're going to consolidate all these data centers and like, then what? Or was it more of you follow through saying, okay, if we do this, we have to have a hit the ground running plan. And could you take us through the mindset of what was the conversation then? Really, the plan was produced initially out of a capital refresh plan. When we looked at the cost of running the remote data centers, the cost we were providing services there, we were actually in co-low facilities, we were paying monthly rents. And from that really grew a plan to build a private cloud and consolidate to our central data centers. And was virtualization a key part of that? It's a key part of it. Four years ago, we were 30% virtual. And then how did that affect your data protection strategy? When you went into the virtualization. Totally changed our data protection strategy. Can you talk about that a little bit? Absolutely. We were traditional tape backup with 10 year old tape libraries four years ago. We were backing up hundreds and hundreds of tapes and ejecting them and setting them off to tape faults that we were maintaining in these remote data facilities. We'd have runners that would take the tapes to those locations and pop them up. That was popular, right? Here's the best part. And when a hurricane would be coming to South Texas, we'd get someone to take those tapes, put them in a car and drive ahead of the hurricane to the recovery site. That was our plan. That was your backup and recovery system. That was our backup and recovery plan. Put someone out there in harm's way and hope he makes it through. So it was not popular. All this manual work involved. What did you guys do technically? Was there automation involved? We took two steps. The first is we put a virtual infrastructure in our remote data centers. We actually added data domains in those remote data centers and began replicating that virtual infrastructure back to the San Antonio data center so that we could use that as recovery and eliminated the tape backups in the regions. No tape in the regions. We have one tape library left and that's maybe not after the 9,500 was released today. Okay, so the goal is actually to eliminate all tape, even as a last resort, no tape. And then what changed in terms of, how did it change your operations? Talk about any results. Operations changed significantly. Our availability went up. One of our primary systems, which was running like a 98% availability after it was 100% virtualized, we've been running at 99.99 or better for over two years. The largest change we did to our tier one protection strategy differences is we used to use a 30F replication between four different VMAX systems. We actually reduced that to two. We went to recovery point and now we do continuous data protection of that primary, our tier one applications. And then with the addition of site recovery manager, we just did something we've never been able to do before we brought up and are still running a complete copy of our tier one application, Meditech, which is our primary hospital information system. So we're doing ICD-10 testing or billing testing in that live environment or that copy of a live environment. We've been doing that for about two months. So that's a recovery site. That's not a recovery site. And you can test that recovery site now. So you couldn't test before. Yeah, we'd tested before but it was always kind of a circumstantial. We brought it up. We could prove that we could log into it but we never did transaction work. We're actually doing transactional work. Right. And it was too much effort. And it was VMware, the virtualization. Yes, VMware, virtual platform. And so your RPO and RTO obviously were affected. Oh, yes. The original RPO was 12 hours and the RTO was 24. The test we just performed, the RPO was two hours and the RTO was four hours. And you're taking, so you're taking snapshots how frequently? We're doing local data protection with RecoverPoint and remote data protection. So we're going to change the snapshots but at the time, metatectives support them. You guys happy with RecoverPoint? It worked for you? It's worked much better than we thought. I'll be honest with you. We were a little skeptical. It's a lot of data with high transaction. Until you really put it in production, you don't know. Skeptical eyes and fingers crossed. Was EMC like on supporting you guys? Oh, absolutely. EMC has been great. But we were kind of bleeding edge. We were one of the largest customers for metatec to ever. So everyone was happy then. It worked. It did. That's my approach. And you're doing, yeah, right. Pray some more. And you're using Vplex as well? How are you using Vplex? We have Vplex. We originally purchased Vplex because we were hoping to do active-active. Metatec hasn't released support for that. So what we've done with it is we've totally virtualized our storage infrastructure in our primary data center. And with that, we're using Vplex to split the data for SRM. And so that's all of our primary VMC drives that your standard data stores are all replicated through RetarverPoint using Vplex. So you have a lot of EMC products. We do. I think we probably have every EMC product they've made. Really? You got a VNXE? I don't, but I have four VNXs. We have six VNXs. I'm going to try to stop you. Yeah. Yeah. Guy Churchwood talked about it. Stephen Manley was on, talking about it. We had some of the product guys. So from your standpoint, you've got a lot of different products. How are they being integrated? And what do you like about what's going on? What could EMC do better? That is absolutely the hardest challenge we have facing us right now. We have all these products. They're all at a different release cycle, upgrade cycle, performance cycle. We are struggling with bringing all of those technologies to full use, you know, if you will, that full, perfect private cloud. We're very interested in the EMC cloud infrastructure offering that 28 days to bring all those tools up to a fully functional. Are you using converged infrastructure, V blocks at all? We have built our own V blocks basically. Yeah, it's okay. So you've done that in-house. Somebody, which servers are you using? UCS. So okay, so you got UCS, so essentially. We have 248 UCS blades running our VMware infrastructure. So what, looking forward, what are the big things on your agenda that you can talk about? Microsegmentation for the network NSX. Getting to that truly fully deployed cloud infrastructure with self-provisioning, Vipers on that path list. Really? In the data protection, we want to expand our testing of site recovery manager to the entire site. Most importantly, we probably are going to refresh it. Well, we know, I think we can say it, my EMC rep knows, we're going to refresh our Vmaxes with Xtreme IOs and then start replicating with Xtreme IOs technology. So no Xtreme IOs in there today? Yeah, two Xtreme IOs, or two four brick Xtreme IOs. Take a little taste of that and you'll like it. Yeah. Well, we got it for the VDI environment. Worked great. Oh, right, okay. Now we're really just pushing all our SQL server loads over there and actually pushed all of our C drives for our Meditech over there to reduce our patch window. So we can now reboot a thousand Meditech servers in 15 minutes. The application is down for 15 minutes a month for patching. Great. Well Blake, great to have you on the queue. I want to ask you one final question. What's the big learning that we're magnified out of this process? Obviously, huge task. I mean, your old process was, a lot of people go through that. There's a lot of manual work and certainly sending runners in front of hurricanes and putting them in harm's way is a great, highlights the critical nature of how this is part of your operations. What did you learn the most out of us? What taught you about this exercise, this transformation? You did a lot of work.  So what's the big magnification? I think we learned, because we had some struggles along the way. We've learned you've got to have a strong partner. You're, in this case, EMC and VM work, have to be strong partners at the table with you. And also, and I'm not the person, but I wish my team was here. You've got to hire champions and you've got to put champions in the roles to do their job the best they can. You mean internally? Internally. Internally to your group. And advice for folks out there looking at the same road that you had. What would you, what scar tissue can you share? And what would, you know, what would you do? Frey and hire champions. Okay Blake, thanks for coming. Blake Smith here inside theCUBE sharing about his journey with RecoverPoint, all the transmission from tape into automation, getting cloud ready, virtualization, state of the art in an important area. Of course, it's theCUBE. We'll be right back after this short break.


Wiki. Build knowledge together. If you've ever gone to Wikipedia to look something up, you might have noticed that you can actually edit the page. You can add information to it because it is a wiki which is collaboratively created and edited. Moodle has a wiki too, which you could set up for your learners, for instance, to do a group project, doing some research, or to write a combined essay. To add a wiki, we go to our course page and we turn the editing on. Then in the section where we want our wiki, we click Add an activity or resource. This brings up the activity chooser. Wiki is an activity because learners interact with it. Click once to go straight to the setup screen, or click the information icon for more details, then the Add button. The name is important because it's what the students will see on the page to access it, and you can then give a description of what you want them to do with the wiki, and you can tick the box display description on course page. Normally, a wiki would be group work, collaborative, but you can, by changing the drop-down menu here, have an individual wiki, and then each student would have their own copy, for instance as a personal notebook. We are going to keep it as collaborative, however, and the next thing to do is to choose the first page name, and this must be carefully thought out because it cannot then be altered. There are other settings, but for now we just go to Save and Display and get our wiki started. You see now that we press a button to create this page. If you don't understand any of the other formats, just leave it as default, it's absolutely fine. And we now have our first page of the wiki. To set up links to make up the other pages, you put double square brackets around the name you want to give the page. So here are a couple of examples, and this is how your learners would also make new pages on the wiki. When we scroll down and save it, we see that we have links, but these aren't yet pages until we actually click onto them and create those pages in the same way that we made the first page. So if we click on the reading link, we're then prompted to create that page, and we can start adding information to it. This is how your students would then add text and information to a new page too. Now if we scroll down and save that page, we can take a look at some of the other links in a wiki. If we look at the tabs at the top, map takes us to pages which have been created, and we can access them from there. Currently we only have two pages. History is a useful way of the other learners and the teacher seeing who has changed what on the wiki, and in case of any problems, that's a handy page to go and revert changes. And if enabled, comments allows you to see and add comments to the wiki.