So this program is about strategies for the 50 plus job seeker. And I want to set expectations right up front. And that is this is going to be a really about strategies. We're not going to get into the tactical. I know some people are saying, you didn't tell me how to write a resume. You didn't tell me what I should say in a cover letter. Well, we're not going to do that here. We're going to talk about strategically what you should be thinking about if you're a 50 plus job seeker. We will acknowledge ageism. We will say, yeah, that's not going to go away.  But there are things that we could do to mitigate that, to actually get out there and get jobs. And we know that people have been doing it. So that's something that's going to be important. I'm going to use a slide set. And the slide set is going to be also sent to you by Angela and the librarians after the presentation. There are a couple of places where I'll stop and ask for questions. If you have questions, we have a small enough group. You could raise your mechanical hand and ask a question. Or you can put your question into the chat. Angela is really good at capturing those. And then when we take certain question breaks, Angela will be able to read those out to me. So let me make sure I can share my screen, a new computer. So we want to make sure everything works here. Almost there. And a couple of things in the way. I think this will work. So welcome to Strategies for the 50 plus job seeker. So we should start with me introducing myself and talk to you about who I am. My name, David Robbins, as Angela said. I'm a job search coaching advisor. I most recently worked for JVS as a trainer and facilitator. I've also worked in government, large, multi-national, small consulting firms. But in the last 15 plus years, I've been specializing in job search skills training and job search skills advising. So I do work with clients one-on-one. So that's me. Let's see if I can move things along. Here we go. This might be something that you might recognize. And that is a statement for someone who's out there looking to hire people. We're looking for someone with a wisdom of 50-year-old, the experience of a 40-year-old, the drive of a 30-year-old, and the pay scale of a 20-year-old. I'll be honest, this joke is actually a little old, which is because 20-year-olds are actually doing pretty well as pay scales. So I may have to update that little comment. But the point is it's true that there are certain stereotypes about those of us that are in our older years, so to speak. So we want to talk about that. So here are the topics that we're going to cover today. We want to just get the quick background on understanding ageism is there. But if you understand the stereotypes that are out there in the business world, that may help you strategize how to overcome those stereotypes. There are protections. There are limitations of age discrimination laws. We'll also talk about the fact that they're not going to be helpful in the short term from all the data that's out there. But we want to talk about moving forward. So age doesn't exist, but we want to move forward. So we're going to talk about resources, tips and strategies. And I'm actually going to share with you resources that come from a number of different sources. So some that are in the job search realm and some that are just out there in the news realm. And I'll share the tips there. And we'll talk about what's real. I will also share with you information from my former students that were 50-plus, graduated out of programs, and actually did get jobs. So we'll talk about what they recommend. And then, of course, the last part of it is the old phrase, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. You're going to have to take the actions.  Press this button, and they'll forget about ages. Press this button. There isn't a button. But there are strategies, and there are tips. But that's what we want to talk about. So let's start with the background and get real about ageism, facts about older workers and employment. This is from 2019. 25% of all employed people in the US were over 55. And that's because of better health care in the United States, and that's because people who realize that they're not ready to retire, where people retire regularly at 55 and then maybe at 65, people are staying past 65. So you could see that there are still a number of people in the workforce that are older than 50. The employment rate of individuals 55 through 64 between 1980 and 2020 actually increased from 54% to 60%. And that doesn't mean it makes it easier for you. This is now we're talking about global statistics. But it's important to understand that not everything is negative. It's not everything like this is what I hear from my clients. I can't get a job because I'm over 50. I can't get a job because I'm over 45. I can't get a job because I'm in my 60s. Well, this is telling you people have been getting jobs. Among people 55 and over, and this comes from the Bureau of Labor Statistics and other government organizations, nearly 40% of people over 55 are working or actively looking for work. So that becomes an issue too, which means that you're not alone out there. There are a lot of people that are in our age bracket that are looking for work. The downside of our age bracket is that it does take longer to find work. So again, statistically, 25% longer to find work, people 45 through 64. So young people might be quicker to get work. Just as in the side, I work with a lot of young people also, they don't send in a resume and get hired. They're still out there going through the whole routine that we're all going to go through trying to get a job. So when we get down to the tactics of job search, I'm just going to recommend you take a look again at the library. I'll be presenting a workshop on August 29th, the Sunday, about tips for resume writing, cover letter writing, and how to avoid the applicant tracking system. It's not strictly for people 55 and over, but it covers exactly what you should be doing to make sure that your resume and cover letter have been working. So the tactical stuff is going to come later on. We know that there are laws out there, right? It's illegal to discriminate on age during hiring, promotions, raises, and layoffs. It's great to know that. But here's the reality. I worked for 16 years at Hewlett-Packard. In 2005, a new CEO came in and said, we're going to take a 10% cut across the board. Every organization is going to have to cut 10% of their employees. My group, which was an international group, we had 50 employees. So five of us were laid off. Four of us were the oldest in the group, and one was on an attorney. So we know the law says you can't discriminate, but all they could say is, we're not discriminating. This is our choice. So it becomes a big issue. And in 2009, the Supreme Court made it even harder to prove age discrimination. So I was one of the older people, laid off, 15,000 people were laid off. I knew it wasn't going to pay for me to try to fight that. It was easier for me to go out and look for work, which I did, and I did find them. So most people believe age discrimination begins actually when people hit their 50s, although we hear that some people in their 40s are talking about age discrimination. The law is at 40. But people who are older than 40, what is it, 50 is the new 30? I don't know if that actually works, but we know that there is age discrimination. There's also gender difference, unfortunately, as there's a gender difference in all hiring, but also in the perception of age discrimination, it seems that women who are older have actually a harder time finding a position than men who are older. But that doesn't mean that it's easy for men who are older. Everybody's facing the same issue. You can take action. You can contact the EEOC and you can file an action. You can file a claim. Understand that you're talking about years to settle something like that. And I would rather that you find work than try to deal with the social problems of ageism. So that's why I really put this together. To come up with the strategies. So these are all the facts and the laws. How does it manifest in the hiring process right here in the stereotypes? And unfortunately, these stereotypes still exist. People who are over 50 aren't up to date on technology. People over 50 won't be on the job very long before retirement. So they're only gonna work at my company for a couple of years and then they're gonna retire. So why should I hire? People over 50 are stuck and they are not flexible and they're unable to learn new things or they're reluctant to learn new things. People over 50 won't get along with younger staff members, particularly younger bosses. And similar to the third bullet, people over 50 are set in their ways. Now, I have to guess with you, these stereotypes come from people who have gone through the hiring process who were over 50 and they actually show up this way. So if you know that these are the stereotypes, what can you do about it? Right, so if the stereotype is that we're technologically inept, we're not gonna be able to keep up to date with technology, what could I do on my resume and on my LinkedIn profile that shows I'm not technologically inept? I could take classes, I get certified. I could take a class in design. I could take a class in some of the data analysis. And get a certification as a data analyst. In other words, that's the stereotype but you could overcome the stereotype right up front by showing that you're up to date with your technology. The second bullet really is silly because they won't be on the job long before retirement. We know that people who are younger don't stay on the job long either, right? And it's not a few with retirement, it has to do with younger people get a job particularly their first job. They're there for two or three years and then they move on. A lot of people in technology, even though a lot of people are trying to hold on to their jobs now because of the big purge, they still are not gonna stay like I did. 10 years with the state, 16 years with HP, 13 years with a nonprofit. Most people will move on before that. So they put this on people over 50 but this is actually true for everybody. Reluctant to learn new things. Again, show that you're taking classes. You could show that right on your resume to overcome these stereotypes right up front. Now it won't get along with younger coworkers or bosses. That's just in the way that you show up if you can get into that interview, the way that you're gonna show up for that interview, being excited about working for the company, being excited about opportunities that you see for your own growth. So all of these stereotypes that are out there that we can overcome by recognizing them, embracing them instead of trying to fight them and just showing that, oh, they're wrong. I think that will be real helpful. So here's the reality chip. Age discrimination is real. Two out of three older workers say they have seen or experienced age discrimination. It is in fact illegal at any stage of employment and it's pervasive in our society. It's not just in the workplace. Ageism is out there, lots of different ways. But this first bullet is really important because what I hear from clients that I'm advising is I've been in job search now for a long time and I can't get any jobs and that's because of ages. I always ask the question, how do you know that? Well, it's just obvious. I'm not getting any responses. Okay, how do they know how old you are? Oh, they know. Okay, do you put your graduation date on your education in your resume? Oh, sure, well, don't do that. You don't need to do that. See, that's where you get into the tactical information. Right? There's nothing that you have to put in your resume that shows you're an older worker. So if there's nothing in your resume that shows that, why do you think you're not getting invited to an interview? There's something else going on in your resume. And we're gonna talk about some of those in the strategies, the tactical August 20th. So it really comes down to this last bullet that's kind of centered on the slide. There are lots of things here that we can't control and what we have to do is focus on the things we can control, right? Don't worry about what you can't control. Focus energy need to be on the things you can control. So what is it that you can control?  These are things that we can control. So these are things that become real important. And one thing that you should understand is that, and again, this comes again from statistical information from government surveys, there's actually advantages to hiring older workers. And that's why you have to look for a company that's knowledgeable enough and enlightened enough that they're going to understand that by hiring an older worker, they're actually hiring a wealth of experience and knowledge. How can we make them see that? You have to show it. You have to show it on your resume. You have to show it in your LinkedIn profile. Advances of hiring an older worker, one is that we are less reactionary during a crisis. Younger people react very quickly. Well, we wanna let's analyze a little bit what's going on here. How can we work through the crisis? Retention tends to be higher with older workers than younger workers. Where that stereotype was that older workers are gonna leave to retire. Actually, younger people leave before older people. Older people find a job that they really like. They're gonna stay, they're gonna stay as long as they possibly can. And another thing that older workers have is that strong work ethic. Old workers are not usually every 10 minutes checking their social media. There's nothing wrong with checking your social media, but I think we do it different. 65% of employees 55 plus are engaged compared to 58 to 60% of younger workers. Right? So when the name engaged, it means that you're actually engaged with the work. So those are the things that become real important. We have to somehow get those advantages across to the people who are hiring. And you'll see some of the tips that we're gonna share might be ways to do that. And of course, there's this. Don't think of me as a 54 year old job application. Think of me as you're getting 27, two 27 year olds for the price of one. And that's actually also wrong because in the 54 year old, this could be a lot more experienced than even two 27. So where does this take us? I wanna start sharing tips. I have tips from an organization called Amuse. Might go to place for a job search tips, job search articles and also jobs. They post a lot of jobs, national jobs that are out there. I have tips from AARP. We're gonna talk about that in a little bit cause people say, AARP only has Walmart reader jobs. And that's not true. I looked that up myself just to check. And then I have it from US News and World Report. Interesting. So before we get into the tips, I do wanna stop here and just ask if there are any questions that you have about how you think we're gonna be proceeding or any questions that you have about ageism or the stereotypes? I did, but I don't see any questions in the chat. Okay. Then let's move on. So here are some tips from Amuse. And again, go to, you can actually subscribe to the music screen and they'll have a lot of information. But I found these tips listed and I thought there were things that help us with what we just talked about. For example, the very first one, update your skills. If you wanna overcome that stereotype of people 55 plus are not up to date on technology, take online classes, earn certifications. Sometimes it's just a couple of hours investment in learning something new or sometimes even better for many of us out there, getting a certification on something you already know. Right? Because you say you know it. Well, it'd be great if you had an organization certify that you know it. So invest in the class, take the class over again. You'll get through it easily. It might give you information on some new things because technology is not stagnant ever. So you might learn some new things but you'll get that certification that you can then put on a resume or in your LinkedIn purple. Optimize your resume. So optimize, meaning make sure the resume is going to get through the applicant tracking system that it is highlighting the experience that relates to the job description that you're applying to at the moment. Now this is interesting because there are a lot of us that spent time coming up with a really good resume. I think it's really important to have a really good resume but when we think of a really good resume we're thinking of I wanted to highlight all my skills but you know the hiring manager for ABC company doesn't care about all my skills. He or she cares about the skills that you have that could help get the job done and they've told you what the job is. They've actually given you a job description. So your experience on your resume should be the experience that relates to the job description. And I'll just give you an example of this. I was president of Theater Bay Area for six years. I'm very proud of him. But if I'm applying for a job as a trainer in job search skills the hiring manager doesn't care that I work in non-profit theater in the Bay Area. They don't care that I was a yoga instructor, right? And it wasn't as a hobby. I actually had my own yoga studio. So there are things that I do not put on a resume even though I'm very proud of them. And you could say well it shows how well rounded you are David. No, that's good at the interview. I need to get that resume targeted so that it gets me the invitation to the interview. So highlight experience that relates to the job description. I've always told clients every job you apply to you may have to restructure your resume to respond to that particular job. Remove dates from education. It is perfectly fine to remove dates from education. And I get pushed back again from some of my older clients and say well if I don't put the dates then they think I'm trying to hide something. No, actually most people don't put dates any longer. Once your graduation date is more than four years ago five years ago they don't care most people don't have dates any longer. And then update your email address. So some of us still have Hotmail or AOL. That's a signal that your email address was instituted a long time ago. I would recommend that you in optimizing your resume because your email address is gonna be on it that you get a new email address. Even if it's just for, I don't think I read your old one but just for job search get an email address that's a Gmail or a Yahoo account. So that's the idea of optimizing your resume from the point of view of being an older job seeker.  Take a look at what the organization really does. Is this an organization that you wanna work for? Are you going to fit in this organization? Higher managers, higher for competency but not only for competency. They ask, they wanna know that you have the skill set but they also hire for chemistry. Are you a good fit? Will you work well with the team? So you have to figure that out yourself and you have to have a real honest discussion with yourself. This looks like a great job but when I research this organization I don't think I'm gonna fit. Well, that's okay. Look for the next one to apply to. And then embrace your experience. Include your direct skills and your transferable skill. So yes, you could have skills from years ago and you might wanna include those on a resume somehow but there are skills that are transferable from what you did a long time ago to what you do now or what you're hoping to do. So you wanna make sure that you at least acknowledge all of your experience when you're deciding what's gonna go on to that resume. Demonstrate your knowledge, so research the company and show how you can match their needs. This is again a tip from the muse. This is not coming from me, this is coming from them but it's all the stuff that I've been teaching in all of my classes for the last 15, 16 years. Also, since hopefully your resume is going to get you invited or you're networking, we'll talk about that, is going to get you invited to an interview. You wanna practice answering interview questions and one of the interview questions that people who are over 50 will get is don't you think you're overqualified for this? You have to have a good answer for that, right? You have to explain why are you applying for this job if you're quote, overqualified and you may be overqualified. So I've worked with people who were directors in one company but applied for a job as a manager in another company and they were asked, well you used to be a director why are you applying for this manager position? And they had to have a good answer and the answer that they had was I learned everything I could in that other job. If I come in here as a manager I'll be able to learn more and grow and yes, eventually I might be looking for a director position in your company but right now I think the manager slot is the right place for me to not only share my value but also to grow with your organization. So there are ways that you could talk about the overqualified without saying I'm not overqualified, I'm not overqualified. Embrace the fact that you probably are overqualified explain then why are you looking for this job? And there's always the compensation discussion. Now one good thing that you should all know in California and in a few other states when jobs are posted on job boards the company has to publish the range of salary. So you pretty much know what you're applying for now. Still, they may ask you questions about that. Is this gonna be work, is this gonna work for you? You've been in the workforce for many years and therefore we're assuming you're looking for something at a higher salary, you could explain and you have to have a good explanation for why this is accepted. Okay, tips from the news include learning how to use video meeting and other current tools, right? So you're all here in Zoom, that's good. So now you know a little bit about how to use Zoom. Zoom is not the only way that some virtual interviews are done. Some use Microsoft Teams and some use some Google virtual environments and some use Webex. So you're gonna have to know a little bit about other platforms that are out there for video meetings. And again, that will help you be more technology advanced. But this last bullet for me is the most important bullet and it really is for me the most important bullet, network. If you wanna get around even the resume you have to do networking. And my students always know the cheer that we would have when we were together as a class. And that was networking, networking and networking. You have to talk to people. And it says here from the news, they say, talk to people in your chosen field or your chosen company. But actually talk to a lot of other people too because somebody who's not in your field may know somebody who's in a company you're interested in. So networking is really important in job search. Most people get jobs through people who know people who know people. That again, statistically depends on the survey. Some survey say 40%. Some survey say as much as 80% of jobs that people get come from networking. The other thing that's important is a form of networking is asking people for an informational interview. And I think, and I'm gonna talk to Angela about this, but in the past I've done a workshop for the library on informational interview. So you might look for that. I'm sure it's gonna be coming up in the future. But informational interviewing for me is the gold standard of job search. That's where you talk to somebody who's in your field or you talk to somebody who's in the company you're interested in pursuing and get information from them. You don't ask them about a job. Matter of fact, they may have no job available. That's okay. What you wanna get is information. What's it like to work here? What's the management stuff? How do people interact with one another? You can get a lot of information which is gonna help you in one, deciding whether you wanna pursue that position if it comes available or it's going to help you if you do get through to an interview, you'll have more information to talk about. But one other thing that's really important about an informational interview is that the person that you're talking to is not only sharing information about themselves or their company or their industry, they're asking you about yourself. And they may then decide, wow, David's a good candidate for a position. We know that's coming up soon. And then it doesn't matter how eligible. You just had a great conversation with somebody. You were energetic. You were knowledgeable. You were excited. And they think that you might be a good candidate for a position and you know what they're gonna do? They're going to refer you to that position for two reasons. One, they may wanna work with you. Two, in many companies, in these days, most companies, if they refer someone who actually gets hired successfully, they get a bonus. So an informational interview is a lot of good things that come from it. And again, I do always try to add personal stories when I teach because I try to teach from personal stories. I worked at JVS, Jewish Recreational Service, as a job search instructor and advisor for 14 years. Why did I get the job? Well, I have to tell you that there was no job posted. There was somebody that I was talking to at a meeting and I said, well, I'm working hourly as a job search advisor for Lehigh-Tarrison, but I'm not getting enough hours. And the woman said, oh, you should talk to my husband. Now I knew her and I knew her husband. And he was in the lobby, so I went to see him. I said, Howard, your wife said I needed to talk to you. And I told him the situation and he said, oh, you have to go to JVS and talk to Abby Sney. She's the executive director. And use my name to get introduced to her because I was on her hiring committee. I said, thank you, Howard. And I did. I used his name. I got a meeting with Abby Sney. We, I asked for 15 to 20 minutes. We talked for about 45 minutes. And then I thanked her and left. I learned a lot about JVS as an organization, about nonprofit workforce development. It was a great situation for me. Two weeks later, I get a phone call from somebody who introduces themselves as a manager at JVS. And they said, Abby said that you might be interested in a position that we're going to open up soon. Would you like to come in and talk about it? I did. And 14 years ago, I got hired as an instructor and there was no job open at the time. So that's where I always have to, I can't say strongly enough, informational interview as part of networking, networking, networking and networking. That gives you a much better chance of getting a job than seeing an open position on a job board and sending in your resume. Even a targeted resume, a well-targeted resume, you're still competing with all the other people that saw that same job opening. If you can get around that, you're a much better show. So that's what these tips are all about. Okay, so those are the tips from the muse. Let's go to what we know from AARP. I don't know how many of you aren't members of AARP. It's pretty inexpensive. They always send more things out there, helpful. But let's take a look at what they talk about. And this is tips from AARP for job seekers over 50. Here, the first bullet is network.  So we see that, okay, that's an agreement with the muse. This other one is interesting. Get comfortable with LinkedIn. 90 plus percent of recruiters and hiring managers use LinkedIn to find candidates or vet candidates. So I know the library has a number of instructors that are teaching LinkedIn, how to put together a good LinkedIn profile. I have that class here at the library also. But also then beyond the profile, how else can you use LinkedIn for job search? And that's whether you're 30 or whether you're 65. LinkedIn is going to be very helpful for you. I have to be honest. My older daughter is visiting from New York right now. I'm here in Oakland. And this morning we worked on her LinkedIn profile. And she's doing fine. She's not looking for a job. She's a school social worker in Brooklyn. And she just knows that LinkedIn can show her more opportunities. So getting comfortable with LinkedIn could help people find you if you have a really good optimized profile. In order to have a good profile, you have to have a complete profile. That includes a photo. And here's again, pushed back from people who are over 50. If I see my photo, they'll see that I am older. It's absolutely true. This is pretty much what my photo looks like on LinkedIn. I have a white beard. My hair hasn't turned completely white, but it's pretty great. And if someone is gonna want to talk to me, they're gonna understand that I'm probably an older worker. Now, if they don't wanna talk to an older worker, that's fine. And all of you should be considering the same thought. If they are agist, if they are practicing ageism, do you wanna work there? So you could say, well, I won't have a photo and I'll kind of trip them and I'll get into the interview. When you get to the interview, you're gonna bring your same face, right? And that's when you might actually surprise them and they might go, oh my God, this is not what I was looking for. Better early that you allow them to make that decision which is only helpful to you. Because I have to tell you, I would not wanna work for a company. Even if I forced my way into a company that is agist, I'm not gonna get trained. I'm not gonna get growth. I'm not gonna learn more. I'm not gonna be on really good teams. So having the photo works actually to your benefit. But also you need it. Or if you don't know a photo, recruiters will skip over your profile completely. So having your photo is part of having a complete profile. Okay, other tip from AARP, have a great resume. And this is what they say. Make sure it is customized or targeted to the position. Really important. Call outdated information on your resume. So, and they have here including outdated email addresses. So that's what we said before. AOL, things that come from a long time ago, update your email address. Also, information on your resume, I mean, I've been in the workforce for over 50 years. There are things that I've done that I don't have on my resume. Not just because they were a long time ago, because they're not pertinent any longer to a position I'm applying for. So if it's outdated or not relevant, keep it off your resume. Use local and national resources. For services and training, include professional associations. The idea of professional associations could be really helpful. Again, for your networking and for your showing that you're up to date with technology and you're up to date with systems. I belong to the Association for Talent Development. Association for Talent Development. They're basically the professional trainers association. So I keep up to date with those, that information that they have on there. Also, the local chapter would have chapter meetings and I have the opportunity to attend those and network with more people letting them know, hey, I'm looking for work. Also, the local professional associations usually have their own job board. So that becomes more specific to the field you're looking for. And that again, helps you target the jobs that you might be applying for. Another tip from the AARP, which doesn't show up in other places too much, but try to get an internship. And some people think, well, internships are only for people graduating college and that's not true. They're all different companies that have available internships. But many companies also offer what they call return ships. And you can actually just Google that. You just Google return ships and you'll find companies that are offering, they only take applications from people who have been maybe not working for the last two years but wanna return to the workforce. So pretty much that includes people our age, right? You know, people who are 22 have not been out of the workforce for two years and looking to return, they're looking to start. Return ships are real. When I worked at JVS, we actually brought people, the clients at JVS to return ships by companies that were offering those. So look for those. It's another way to get in similar to an internship, they're hiring you in order to train you. And even if at the end of the return ship, which might be six months to two years, depending on the company, even at the end of that, they may not offer you a full-time job but you have that on your resume now that you worked at that company and you were trained. And that again, boosts up your credentials. Shopping your skills, get training classes. And I love this quote, show that you have a learner's mind. Show that you like to learn because that's that other stereotype, right? Older people are stuck in their ways and they don't wanna learn more. Well, show that you do wanna learn. Take classes. Demonstrate you're keeping up to dating your field and that again is best with certifications and classes that you take but also the way that you can represent yourself on your resume.  This doesn't show up on your resume but this shows up in networking and informational interviewing and actually job interviewing. So this is where it becomes real important for you to project that aura of confidence that you actually embrace ambiguity that you're targeting for success. Physically and mentally fit really helps. These days, people are now going in for interviews live. Well, if you walk into the interview like this, that's different than if you walk into the interview like this and extend your hand to say hello to the interview. That's gonna show a little bit more about who you are and how the energy that you're in.  Why don't you start your own job? So this is a link to a program called Kickstart, your business at 55 plus. AARP has a number of training workshops on entrepreneurship. Again, the library has some of those also, but AARP, they're specifically targeted for people over 50. Okay, so let me just throw it out to Angela. Any questions that are coming up in the chat? Yes, sorry. So someone, Michelle's asking, could you address strategies for the older worker with a job gap and older workers who have worked outside their chosen field for some years and wanting to reenter their chosen fields? Okay, networking, networking and networking, that's one of my automatic responses to that. Interesting gaps on, I've worked with recruiter advisory councils and talk to recruiters. They don't look at a gap necessarily as being negative. What they look at are people who work a year and then a gap for a year and then they work for two years and they have a gap for two years. Then they work, in other words, people who look as if they're not being successful in a particular company. That's the kind of gap that's very good to a recruiter. But the fact that you took time off, what did you take time off for? So, and let me just give you an example. I could be rhetorical, I don't want to put anybody on the spot. I used to teach a class called Returning to the Workforce for Mothers. And of course, there's a gap.  And when I talk to those people, I say, okay, so you have a recent job and then there's a gap and you have a job because what were you doing during that gap? I was raising my children. I said, okay, but what else were you doing during that time? What do you mean? I was raising my children, that's a full-time job, David. I said, I know, I'm a dad, I got it, but what else were you doing? For example, my wife worked with the PTA of the school. And she was the co-president of the PTA. And then you could say, well, what did you do as president of the PTA? What did you do for the PTA? Oh, well, we raised $30,000 for the school every year. Put that on your resume. Well, they say, well, they don't care about what I did for the school. Well, they care about the skill of being able to put together a project that raises $30,000. They don't really care where you did it. Whether you did it as a volunteer, whether you did it as a paid position, whether you did it as a paid fundraiser, or whether you did it for fun as a hobby, that's a skill set that might be really appropriate to put down on your resume. So when there's a gap in your resume, I always ask, what did you do during that gap? Also, how would you put that on your resume? You can't just say, and here's my gap. So I worked at ABC Company, and then I didn't work for two years or three years. What I would put then for that timeframe, I would put sabbatical for research and ongoing training, sabbatical to attend school, sabbatical for family care. Sabbatical is a great word. I was introduced to it by a client, and I said, but that's great, because everybody knows what a sabbatical is. Sabbatical is when you're taking time from your current position, but professors go on sabbatical sometimes just for vacation, but sometimes to do research. So explain what you did in that gap, and that's one way to fill that up with skills. The other thing is the fact that I'm pivoting, I'm doing something that's really different from what I did before. Again, we could talk about this more tactically when we talk about how to write a resume, but the key is whatever you did before, did you use skills that could be transferable to what you're going to need to do on this job that you're applying to? And that's what we mean by transferable skills. So that means you have to call that out in the bullets, in the accomplishment statements of the job, you have to not say, here are all the things I did at this job, it's here are the things I did at this job that actually relate to what you might be interested in. Right, you're gonna pick what you're gonna put under that job as things that most closely align to the job that you're applying to. And I have to tell you, that's not only for people who are over 50, that's for people who are in their 30s or 40s who wanna pivot. So those are a couple of tactical ideas that you could use. I hope that helps. With any other questions, Angela? Yes, I think there was like two similar follow-up questions to that, someone was asking, how would they make the gap when they're explaining caring for a sick family member into a positive experience and not a negative connotation?  And then what did you do? And honestly, were there any classes that you took while you were taking care of your sick family member, right? So you don't have to call out your reality, call out what it is that they would most likely be interested in. And that is what you're doing during that time. And that's where you really wanna talk to somebody one-on-one. So if you work with a career advisor, the library has brain fused where you can work one-on-one with a career advisor and ask them to help you figure out what could be the wording that you would use to fill that gap. Thank you, David. Someone has a very similar situation where they had inconsistent work history due to illness. How would they address that? Would it be a sabbatical for illness? Again, I wouldn't have to put illness, I would put, what did you do? I know you were trying to heal, right? But you could put down sabbatical for family issues, right? Sabbatical for personal growth. And you could say sabbatical for dealing with health issues. And you don't even have to put that sabbatical, right? Time needed to work on, I don't know what it would be. So this is where we get into word smithing and it's hard to do that. You and I would actually have to sit down and really talk about what happened. I would ask you all the questions and you would start realizing that in trying to make yourself better, what did you learn about yourself? What did you do to get better, right? Did you have to go to a rehab program? And in that rehab program, what did you do? How did you strengthen yourself? How did you fix your diet? So there are lots of things that we could talk about that we could then try to figure out how we're gonna include that onto a resume. But remember, avoid the resume. Network, right? Talk to somebody in that company, have an informational interview. And as you're learning about what the company is looking for, they're gonna ask you about yourself. They're not gonna say, what gaps did you have?  They're just gonna say, so what have you done? And you might say, well, in the past, I've done this other thing. And they say, well, why are they looking to work in this industry? You have to have a reason. I have to tell you how many people are telling me I wanna pivot into UX design. And I say, why? That's a good job. Sorry, you're not gonna get through an interview that way. When they say, oh, you were doing this other thing and now you wanna work in UX design. And you say, well, cause it's a good job, they're not there to give you a good job. You have to figure out what is there about UX design? That's gonna be growth for you that you see opportunity in. So you have to start figuring out how to answer those questions. And again, informational interviewing and networking get you sometimes right past the interview stage. I mean, get right, never past the interview stage, but get you past the resume stage. And I've worked with people who got hired at companies from the LinkedIn profile and an informational interview, as I did, before they actually asked for a resume. So just start thinking differently about, cause sometimes the questions are coming from, well, this is what I've always done. Tell me how I could do it better. And I would like you to get, how can I do it different? Not the same thing I've always done better, but how can I do it different? And that's what we wanna talk about. So let me go on, cause we have a few other things to talk about and then give you some examples of people who have actually done what we're talking about here. So thank you for the questions. They'll keep putting them in the chat. We'll have more time to answer some of those questions. More tips, tips from US News and World Report. One is if you lose your job, start job search right away. Don't kick back saying, well, I got a nice severance package. I could take some time off. Avoid the gap. Start looking for work right away. Use your network. That's again from US News and World Report. I didn't even think that they would have something there about job search, but this was brilliant. Find a job through personal contacts and it avoids discrimination, all kinds of discrimination. Reassure a younger manager. Clearly let them know you're excited about the job and the company and that you appreciate a good manager. Without ever saying, I'm okay working for a younger manager cause that sounds silly, right? The thing is you have to show that you're really excited about the job and the company and that you really can appreciate a good manager. They will then understand that what you mean by that is it doesn't matter the age of the manager as long as they're a good manager. Don't mention your age or the interviewer's age. Make no reference to age, right? Some people think it's real cute to say, well, you could have been my grandson. It's not cute. We're not trying to be personal with people. We wanna show that we're a profession. Target your resume to the job description, leaving out experience that's unrelated as best we can. Explain why you are not overqualified. Be proactive to explain you're the right person for this job and then show fluency with technology, including social media. So make sure that you are not only have a LinkedIn profile but the LinkedIn custom address, the LinkedIn URL customized is on your resume and then show classes you've taken, follow the company on Twitter, follow the company on other media, that's no longer Twitter on X. But the idea is show that you are fluent with technology. Now we went through tips for three different sources but what else can we say, right? From other sources that I've researched, sometimes people who have so much experience are actually sometimes a little obnoxious when they're talking to somebody and they get a question and they say, well, of course I've done that. Okay, so be humble, yet confident, right? So it's not, of course I've done that. It would be better. Oh yes, I've done that before and I'm really excited about learning new ways to do that. Right, so there you're confident but you're also showing some humility. I'm ready to grow. Point out your continued education to show that old dogs can learn new tricks but don't ever say old dogs can learn new tricks. Don't say that. But point out your continued education. Focus on your most recent work even if it's volunteer work. So sometimes we were laid off but we've been volunteering at the library. We've been volunteering at the church, at the synagogue, right? We were accountant. We lost our accounting job but I'm doing some accounting work for a nonprofit. That could show up on your resume. The resume doesn't say paid work experience. It says professional experience or just experience. So if it's relevant experience even if it's volunteer work, show it. If you are overqualified then you have to really show that you're interested in working for the organization. Focus on what you do bring. Present your value. So the goal of all of this is to earn an offer not eradicate the reality of Asians. And I think that's really important to actually call out and that's why I put it bold. I have had clients that say, yeah, but ageism is terrible and we should fight against it. And I always say, well, get a job first. I mean, if that's what you're here for, get a job first and then fight ageism. But trying to fight the battle, there are a lot of lawyers fighting the battle for you already. You wanna earn the job offer and then deal with the reality of ageism if you care too. So in all of these things, what stands out? Key factors. Networking, networking and networking. A custom targeted resume targeted to the job description that you found on the job board. Having a LinkedIn profile that's optimal. Be comfortable in the social media. Have, surely you have a learner's mind by showing you up to date in your field. Know what the hiring manager is looking for and what they need and that's research beyond just the job description. Look at the company. And then again, more networking. Information interviews is down there as another form of networking, but accountability buddies are something that really important because job search is isolating and that's hard. Well, find other people that are also a job search and help one of them. So when I worked at JVS, we would encourage people who were being trained in the same class to find a few people in that class that they can continue to work with after they graduated the course. And some of them did. They would continue and like every Thursday morning, they would have their own little Zoom meeting. Every Thursday morning, they might need a cafe and talk about their job search and help one of them. Accountability buddies, very helpful. Okay, so we went to the formal, let's go to what we've heard from our own clients when I was at JVS and working also at Lehigh-Tarrison. So when I was a job search trainer, advisor, coach, this is what one client said. Age does show on the outside, but it's the inside attitude that connects or repels people. So are you experienced and helpful or are you experienced and trying to prove yourself? Now, these three tips here actually came from a woman who got her job when she was 73. And she wanted to explain and I was looking for people who would talk to my older clients and she couldn't come in but where she was working, but she sent an email to me and these are some of the tips I picked up out of there. And then she said, are you still growing? Are you learning new things and up to date on the latest trends in your industry? So she was in her 70s and keeping up with the industry. Being open and interested in learning is huge, very appealing to employers and everyone else. And how do you look? Are you still wearing the same styles from 10 years ago? There's always the joke of somebody who says, hey, I got an interview. Luckily, I have my interview suit, right? But it's from 15 years ago. And I can still fit into it, which is great, but it may not be up to date.  So basically don't overdress. Another client, are you happy? That's interesting. If you're down, it shows. If you think you're old and have nothing to offer, it shows. If you're interested in life and open to new things, it shows. So this is another person over 50 who did get a job and gave us these tips. Are you afraid of younger people? If you find yourself saying negative things about some trends in the world, they call that music. And I live through that myself, right? Don't be defensive.  Be curious instead of defensive. And it's not so much what you did in the past, but what you learned in the past that can help your employer now. And that's why I say you're gonna look for things that are in fact relevant in your former employment. So you have to start thinking about what is your value at? They're not hiring people just because they're warm bodies. They're hiring people that can provide value. What are you good at? What have you learned? What are your best skills? What are your strengths? You have to start thinking about that yourself and come up with answers to those things. Some things to avoid in job search when you're over 50. And that is when asked if you can work with a younger supervisor, the answer should be, I'm really interested in working at this company and I'm working at this position and I'm really looking forward to working with a good manager. Rather than, you're the same age as my daughter, I get along with her, it'd be no problem. That's a little flippant. You wanna keep focusing on the job, the company and working with a good manager. What to avoid? Listing jobs that go back 40 years, depending on the industry, it's okay to go back 10 to 15 years. My resume goes back about 25 years. Oh, then people know I'm older. Well, of course they know I'm older. Look at me, I'm older, okay? But the reason I go back that far is that there are relevant skills that I've done years ago that are relevant to any job I'm going to be applying to. What to avoid? Being unwilling to accept current job search approaches. And this is what people say, I'm just gonna keep sending in my resume to job boards.  So networking is how people find their jobs. LinkedIn is how they find you. But even if you get a great resume and you're invited to an interview, before that interview, the hiring manager is going to not only look at your resume, they're going to look at your LinkedIn profile. Have them. And what to avoid? Not framing your early experience with phrases like before you were born, or I did that when Reagan was president. I thought both of those were kind of cute so I put those in there. So comment from other people who were job holders. One is a guest service representative at UCSF. And one is an app or cloud support associated at Accenture, the tech company. The question was how are you successful at landing a job? One answer was just be persistent, stay positive. Do your research for each company that you have to interview with. Don't be discouraged if an interview doesn't go well. Sometimes the company may not be a good fit for you. Really important to understand that you're not gonna get every job that you applied to. You're not gonna get invited to the interview. And then sometimes you'll interview once twice, three rounds and still not gonna get invited for the job. That's the perfect opportunity to thank them for three rounds of interview and say to keep you in mind. Because maybe you didn't get this position but there's something else that they might have that's a better fit for you. Another question when I asked them is did you encounter age discrimination? And this was a great answer. And the rest of the question was if you did how did you overcome it? And the answer was not sure if it was age discrimination. Some of my interviews kept getting rescheduled. One of my cohort who was younger with an MBA and less experienced than I did the job. She was a better fit for the company. Now after I met with the CEO I felt it would not have been a good fit for me but the right job will come along and you'll know when it's the right one. So don't dwell on bad interviews, keep pushing forward. So don't think that I didn't get the job because I'm old. It could be you didn't get the job because the hiring manager's first cousin came and she had to hire her first cousin. Okay, there are lots of reasons that you weren't chosen. It's not automatically age discrimination. Any tips or advice? Know that there are still jobs out there that value your experience and maturity. One example within my current job was when I was in training for two weeks. The majority of the current hires were straight out of college. Each of one of us had to interview for the project we wanted to be part of. A few managers were already looking for a seasoned person who was older and mature. That gave me an advantage over the younger employees. So don't look at your age as a negative. So all of those are things that are coming from people who were over 50 and did get jobs and they're telling you how they did it and they're giving you advice. All I can say is take it. And if you need more help, again, the library has brain fused, talk to a career advisor, someone who can really help you word Smith. Come to some of the other workshops. Again, August 29th for tips on resume, cover letter and avoiding the applicant tracking system. Okay, before I take it to the end, any other questions that people might have? Hi, David. Yes, there's quite a few actually. Denise is asking, do you have any tips for persons with disabilities who may need to request reasonable accommodation? I know a very well educated young woman wheelchair user who has been denied work opportunities for years, though she has so much to offer. Abelism is also a barrier for older workers. Absolutely, same thing. Networking, networking and networking, okay? She has to talk to people in the companies so that they could see her as the person she is, not as the disability she might have. So again, there are laws against it, so it doesn't matter. But I have to tell you one thing. Asking for accommodation, there are companies that actually would like that, and not only because it might be altruistic, but they get tax benefits for hiring veterans. They get tax benefits for hiring people who might have disabilities. They get higher, they get benefits, tax benefits for other reasons. So sometimes announcing the accommodation you need upfront actually could work to your benefit, even though it may seem odd to say that, but it actually might. Again, it's networking, networking and networking. Finding people who know people who know people to get you in to talk to that actual hiring manager. And again, having a good resume, it doesn't matter what disability you might have. You still have to have a really good targeted resume. And when I went to JVS, I have to tell you that, and we did it virtually, we were working through Zoom.  So all these things are the same. The key is, again, you might also be networking with other people who are in the disability community that could give you advice about how they work through, so that there's a lot of that that might be helpful also. But again, networking, networking, networking. Thank you, David. I think this question may be off topic to this one. I don't know if you want to wait to the end to answer it. Why don't you hold it till the end? Okay. Yeah, because I want to go with a couple of other things. One is, I actually did a podcast. This is an organization, this is a podcast called Not Born Yesterday. It is actually written and produced for people who are over 50. I actually participated in a podcast called No Such Thing Is Overqualified. There's a link to it here. You'll get this slide when you get the slide set, but it's not just what I talked about, because it's similar to what I'm talking about here. They have a lot of other podcasts all targeted to help people who are over 50. So I encourage you to look at the Not Born Yesterday podcast. Resources then from AARP. There's a link to Back to Work 50 Plus program. Again, more strategies to compete for full-time in-demand jobs. There's a workshop that they have. There's a sign up for it. And then a couple of links that AARP has. San Francisco Public Library, good resource. The Jobs and Career Center, which is how you found this. They also have a link to the Senior Community Service Employment where they will help you get employment. I think it's actually at minimum wage, but help you get recent employment on your resume, and they will help with placements as they can find them. Digital Literacy Assessment, it's good to take your own assessment to make sure that you are up to date on your digital literacy. And again, all of this is you have to take action. So there's a great guide that I found online from Career Sharper, Job Hunting After 50. So a link to that. It's a multiple-page article, and I think again, it's something that could be helpful. Okay, so one more strategy in all of this, and that is taking a step from everything we've talked about, use the hidden job market. What we in Job Search focus on the hidden job market, it's everything that's not up on the job walls, because many vacancies are filled through networking or social media. In a job-vite survey in 2020, 42% of respondents said they learned of job openings on social media, not through job boards. So be aware of networking to help you find potential openings. Internal employees refer job candidates. So that's also part of the hidden job market. And that again, the way to talk to an internal employee is asked for informational interview. Connect with professional associations in your field. And if you go to those association meetings, particularly the ones that are local, you get to meet people, and they learn who you are as a person, not just as a commodity. Highly managers like to hire people, not just a bucket of skills. And one part of working with the hidden job market is to stay on top of industry. So if you're in a particular field, you should have a regular search on Google News for your industry to see what's happening. You'll get to see companies that are requiring other companies that give you an opportunity to then talk to somebody in those companies with informational interviewing.  I'm telling you that there are people who get jobs at whatever age they're at because of positivity. If you think, there's a phrase that says, if you believe you can't get the job or you believe you can get the job, you're right. If you believe you can't get the job, you will manifest not getting that job. If you believe you can get that job, you're gonna be closer to getting that job sooner. So stay positive and be patient. It's not gonna happen this week, next week. It may take longer. Update your skills and certifications. Tailor and optimize your resume for each application. Build and use your network and have accountability buddies. Other people that you can work with, bounce ideas off, you can review one another's resumes. Leverage your experience that relates to that job that you're applying to. Demonstrate your knowledge with accomplishment statements, show your research, learn to use video meetings and other tools and network, network and network. There are a lot of tips, a lot of things to do. What are the five things that you're going to do? What are the five actions that you're going to take when we sign off in what four minutes it takes? Right? What are the five actions you're gonna take?  You're going to look for people who are out there in the field that you might ask for a 15 minute meeting so you can ask them questions about the field or you can ask them questions about their company. What actions are you going to take? That's what's gonna get you to move forward. Here's my contact information. Thanks for being here. I'm D.G. Robbins at sflearning.com and that's my LinkedIn address. And I have to tell you, if you want to connect with me on LinkedIn, I'm more than happy to do that if you, when you're inviting me to connect with you, you actually add a note that tells me why you would like to connect with me. I don't just sign up everybody who says, hi, I'd like to add you to my network. And I go, well, thank you. I have a big network already. I don't need that. So if you tell me what you're looking for and you tell me why you think that it would be good to connect with me, please do. And then I'd be more than happy to connect with you on LinkedIn. Okay. Angela, we have two minutes left to think. Yeah, so we have a question who's from Kamar. They're asking, how does one focus job submissions with different keywords to clarify each job requires that you revise your LinkedIn to highlight different words to rank your submission for that job? No, there's nobody that's going to ask you to change your LinkedIn for every job. LinkedIn is LinkedIn. LinkedIn is your professional persona. You don't target your LinkedIn for every job you apply to. You target your resume for every job you apply to. Okay. And it's not just keywords, it's key phrases also. And how do you know what they are? Look at the job that you're applying to. If there's a job description, analyze the job description. What is it that they're looking for? If they're looking for this piece of experience, do you have something close to that? Put that into your resume. There doesn't have to be the exact word, although that could be helpful. But definitely if they're saying they're looking for one of the requirements is two years of experience working with this particular population. Okay. Does that show up anywhere in your resume? That's a key phrase. They want to know that you have experience working with that population. Even if you have only six months put that in your resume. If you have 15 years, people say, oh no, don't put that because they'll know you're over. No, put that down. It means you're even more experienced than what they're looking for. But then you're overqualified. Well, you'll have an answer for that later. The point is the resume is what needs to be targeted. Your LinkedIn profile, you optimize once. And then you only update it as new information comes up. You have a new class that you took, add your certification. You have a new skill that you added. Add it to the skills section. And then it's also there are different ways to use LinkedIn. But as far as your profile goes, your profile is changed when there are actual changes to your professional persona, not for every application you're gonna apply. That would drive you crazy. Okay. I hope that helped. Thank you, David. Someone's asking, should they dye their hair to cover the gray? I don't know. Do you like your hair a different color? That's all I could say.  I dye my beard white so I look more distinguished. No, that's not true. That's what I was gonna say. There are people in my family that dye their hair. They color their hair. Why? Not because they're looking for a job. They color their hair because they feel better about themselves. So should you dye your hair? Yes, if it'll make you feel better about yourself. I worked with a sales force instructor at JVS and at one point she just made an announcement by saying, I'm letting my hair grow out. I'm gonna go with my natural color. And she did. And she looks fine. So you have to make yourself feel good because about positivity, right? Your self-esteem. If coloring your hair, doing your nails, if that's gonna make you feel good about yourself, do it. Don't do it to trick someone because that doesn't pay.  Okay, any others? Thank you, David. I don't see any other questions in chat. Okay, somebody did raise their hand. Who raised their hand? Okay, maybe they were just waving goodbye. I don't know. Anyway, I just wanna say my slide is up there. You're gonna get this slide set. And actually I haven't, I don't think I sent it to you yet, Angela. So I will get that to you post-haste. I would encourage you, if you really wanna work more on resume cover letter, August 29th, I'm not exactly sure of the time, but just keep in touch with the jobs and careers section and the work it section of the library. And best of luck to all of you. I think it's really gonna be wonderful if you start thinking positively about your experience and about your job search. Thank you so much, David, for sharing statistics, encouragement, strategies, and tips, and advice on how to focus on the things we could control when doing job search as someone who is 50 plus. I'd also like to thank everyone for joining. I hope you found this presentation informative and helpful to you. I'll be sending out a survey along with the link to the recording and a copy of the slide deck. If you guys can fill out that survey, that would be great. Any feedback can help us improve in our programming. With that, good luck, everyone, and I hope you enjoy the rest of your evening.


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