Former President Goodlock Jonathan has stressed the need for electoral management bodies in Africa to be free to discharge their responsibilities in order to deliver credible elections. He also enjoined African lawyers across the continent to use their calling to promote justice, equity and the rule of law. We're joining us to discuss this, our lawyers, Obinachiku and Emeka Mwaduki. Thank you very much gentlemen for joining us. Thank you for having me, thank you so much. So this is a clarion call of sorts by the former president, of course it's not just talking about Nigeria, but he's talking about electoral bodies across Africa, but we're Nigeria so let's you know use Nigeria here as the case study. Now it's very interesting that we have so many governments, departments and agencies that have the appendage, independent, but are not necessarily independent in reality because of the person who decides to pick the head of that ministry or that department or that agency and this is detailed for INEC. And so a lot of people have queried the independence of INEC over and over again and the question again is here, how independent is INEC? I'm going to start with you Barsanwaduki. Is INEC anywhere close to the independence that begins, you know, its name? Thank you so much. It's a difficult one to really say, you know, that INEC is independent. A lot of commentators believe that the independence attached to its name is essentially nominal. And although we can say that maybe over time INEC has tried to do one or two things to improve on its performance and maybe try to, you know, strengthen its independence so to speak. But essentially we can say that it's working properly. But the fact that the person who leads or heads INEC is nominated by the president, whoever it is, and then of course ratified by the National Assembly, does that not call to question where he's allegiance or where he takes his orders from? Because that's also been part of the debate over time. You have virtually raised a very fundamental issue because appointment of key officers of INEC is a fundamental drawback on its purported independence. So you see a situation where INEC German is nominated by, not appointed by the president but ratified by the National Assembly, all the national officers or national commissioners are appointed by the president. So it's a major, major challenge because when, for instance, you can see a situation where perhaps the sitting president who is seeking reelection has a mandate to appoint all these people. As they say, he who pays the Piper, or he maybe in this instance who nominates the Piper, he pays in tune. So it's quite a major challenge and maybe as we go on, we try to explore how we can tackle this major drawback. Vaisachukku, it's, again, some of the issues that have been raised in terms of independence of INEC, just as I said, is also the fact that they still have to depend financially on the federal government per se. There's a lot of signing off that has to be done by the presidency or the federal government instead of it getting independent because independence is not just about it not being nominated or, the head not being nominated or appointed by Mr. President, it also has to do with his finances. But looking at the Nigerian constitution as it is, how easy is it for us to single-handedly make INEC independent without having to go back into the constitution to change some things? Okay. Let me once more say thank you for having me. Before I go to this question, I will say that I, appointment of the INEC officials to me, I may not, I may not be the reason why the INEC is not independent. It may not be the reason because no matter how you juggle it, no matter how you weave it around, somebody must still appoint somebody. Nobody will just wake up and announce to Nigerians that he or she is now the chairman of Independence National Electoral Commission. Somebody will still have to appoint the person. But what I want to say is that appointment is not the problem. The problem is to, is the institutions, weak institutions that we have in Nigeria, that's why it's as if whoever that is appointed can now or has the leverage to pander towards a political party or live in accordance with the apron strings of whoever that appointed him. If we have strong institutions, for instance, let's say the security agencies, the police is independent, the institution of the police is strong, the military is strong, and all other, the anti-corruption agency is strong, and all the other institutions that have sought an invisible check on other institutions, that won't end. Then again, secondly, from what you asked, whether or not we could do that without the constitution. I do not think that we can do that without the constitution. Look at what has happened in Nigeria within the past three or four years. There were state governors, or even the president in Nigeria, where Nigerians came out, protested and shouted, this government must go and all that and tried all kinds of ways to protest on the streets, at least to have the government go. The government will not go white because there is a constitutional provision that provides for how a president, how a governor can be removed from office. So it doesn't matter what the governor does. It doesn't matter what the president does, even if the president is not really Nigerian or not first starting or spreading economic largesse to Nigerians, no matter how protest you carry out on this street, the president cannot go because, again, the constitution has provided or has provided for ways through which a president can be removed from office. It therefore means that once those processes are not activated or utilized, the president cannot be removed from office. Neither can the governor. It doesn't matter how the governor is behaving. The governor may be apologizing, the governor may become recalcitrant, and yet the constitution says your position as the governor will still continue until the end of your term, and I see that is not even enough, section, I think section 308 or 305 or so. Also we've around the community. So for us to independent electoral commission, number one, we must ensure that their finances are come through the first line. It must not be the executive that must or neither is it the legislators that gives them money. The money must come the same way that the executive gets their money from the first line charge or whatever, their money must be there. And secondly, they must have immunity. They must have immunity from actions taken in order to conduct free and fair elections. And thirdly, they must not be removed until put it in the same process, in the same procedure, tedious procedure that the constitution provided or provides for in the impeachment of a governor, in the impeachment of a president. If you do all this, anybody, even if the president appoints the person, if the person gets there and becomes corrupt, strong institution will pick up the person and the needful will be done. But if we say to do all this, I can tell you will continue to talk, it will always perform a talking point and no action will be taken. All right. Let me go back to Bair. So I want to take it quickly because we're almost out of time. He's saying that we need strong institutions as opposed to worrying about who appoints who into office because, of course, an appointment or nomination has to take place for someone to occupy the office. And he's given us some key points that he thinks that if we follow, we can help to change the situation. Is I not going to be the litmus test in building strong institutions? Is there a real power to even want to start the idea of building strong institutions when we know or if, for example, and when I say we here, I'm talking about everyone including the politicians know that they might one day have their day in court or they might be the ones who will be receiving the short end of the stick. Do we see that happening anytime soon? Just like my colleague said, it's essentially about financial independence and maybe, of course, the level of appointment independence also. So you are looking at the situation because, presently, anyway, their fund comes from the consolidated point. So to that extent, you can say that funding wise, they are OK. But then again, you also look at the aspect of even remover and you discover that probably they cannot be removed without to third majority in the National Assembly. But the fundamental aspect is still this appointment is if we can be able to weave it out of the ambit of the president or the state government. Look at the phone. So are you there? I think we're having connection issues, unfortunately, but we have to wrap things up because we're almost out of time. Make your mind OK. And thank you very much for speaking with us. Unfortunately, we have to go. Thank you. All right. Thank you very much. We will take a short break now to see what Nigerians have to say about women and youth participation in politics. And right after that, I'll be saying my goodbyes. OK. I think we need more inclusion of women in politics than it is presently.  Because if we look across both in different organizations, we've seen women doing great and massively well in whatever thing they do. And of recent, we've been seeing the very much more inclusion of women in the banking sector in the being the empty of several banks. So women in politics, they are on the low side, and we think we need more of them because of what they can do, though, even though I'm not going to subscribe 100 per cent, what a man can do, what a woman can do better, but definitely the word is what it is, what a man can do. A woman can do much more OK and very well also. In Nigeria, I don't think we've tried a lot of women and they failed us. Like the former minister of petroleum is only one that if till date they will still be inviting her, but she's late now, Dora Akunyili, that was the, would I say, the Nafda lady and the former minister of finance. Those are just the two women. Outside, as most of them you see, I don't know how they are using them. They will just embezzle money and so maybe the younger ones coming up, maybe they will be better. I don't know. So my opinion is they should give them chance and see. Women are no more in politics and we advise a government to allow them to join in politics so that everything will go well in this country. Women in politics, it's like, it's both sides, but sometimes when they give the woman the chance to be in politics, they provide more, but when they don't give the woman the chance in politics, they don't provide more. So that is it. OK. Well, we want to thank you all for staying with us. It's been Plus Politics on Plus TV Africa. I am Mary Anakun. Thank you for watching and I will see you tomorrow. Don't forget to follow us on our social media on Instagram and on Facebook and you can watch our shows live on YouTube at Plus TV Africa and Plus TV Africa Lifestyle. Have a good evening.


I'll just take you through kind of the state of tourism right now. You can go to the next slide, please. So first we start with a statewide overview in 2000. And I'm giving you basically 2018 numbers because every year the Wisconsin State Department of Tourism hires a third-party research company to do research on the economy of tourism. And we don't get those numbers in until the May after. So in 2019 in May, we finally get to see the last year and then we have to use all the trends from the past years also to look at going forward. So in 2018, Wisconsin had over 112 million visitors to the state. The economy of tourism is worth 13.3 billion in visitors spending across 72 counties. That is a plus 5% increase and the largest increase since 2014. The most notable increase is in money spent toward recreation and that's outdoor recreation. 1.9 billion was captured and that was the highest growth overall, highest growth rate at 8.4% more than hotel spending on hotel or food and beverage or any other type of entertainment. Next slide, please. So this is where Sheboygan County ranks. We're 15th in the state. Sheboygan County has visitors spending at about 240 million per year. That's the highest growth rate ever and among all of the top 15 states at 7.64%. Next slide, please. So along the lakeshore, Sheboygan County ranks fourth. And since 2011, we've had a $59.9 million increase in visitors spending into the county. Next slide. Now we drill down a little farther across the county. You can see that Sheboygan County represents about 42% of room tax collected. The other municipalities that collect room tax rank in Destination Coal, which captures about 37%, Elkhart Lake, Plymouth, and then Sheboygan Falls Tourism and those are the areas that capture them, actually collect room tax in the county. Next slide, please. So the Sheboygan Area Tourism Zone consists of the city of Sheboygan, the town of Sheboygan and the town of Wilson. And in 2019, we projected that it would capture about 1.1 million in room tax when we did the projections. But we are actually on track to go past 1.2 million, so it looks like we'll be surpassing the estimates. Next slide, please. And this is just a different way to look at basically how we rank. And this is room tax collected in the tourism zone since 2010 and what we're projecting through 2020. You can see by next year, we're looking at 1.4 million. Next slide, please. And just one more visual for you to show how the increase looks when we chart it out. Next slide, please. So I'm sure a lot of you have seen the new building going up on 8th Street at the bridge, Crestrum Superior Liquor. And this will be the new visitor center that's going in. It's not a building that we'll own. We're actually a tenant there. It's a partnership that we're doing in conjunction with Leslie Kohler's personal development business. In the visitor center, we'll be located the new offices for the Sheboygan staff. Obviously, tons of tourism information, a whole gallery and lobby area committed to the guest experience. There will be a film viewing area with videos and films that we're shooting around the city and in the tourism zone to show all of the different sites and attractions to visit. There will be exhibit installation for some hands-on experiences, a gift and souvenir shop, free on-site parking. No visitors could actually park their vehicle there for the day and go experience the tourism area. We're planning on having the bike share program there and a trolley stop. Next slide, please. But for the new experience, we're calling this full steam ahead. Our research has shown that eco and environmental hands-on experiences are trending very, very high right now, which also goes with the actual increase in outdoor recreational experiences. So a science on the sphere will also be in the building. Not sure if you're familiar with that. When it was at Spaceport, it's owned by Leslie Kohler. It will go in the new facility. It's a six-foot globe that projects real-life online experiences about what's happening on the planet, such as real-time volcano activity, real-time earthquake activity, how many people across the planet are online at that very moment. This is something that's fed from NOAA. So we'll be installing that in the visitor's center. That will probably be on 24 hours a day, so it'll be a nice visual from the street as you drive by there. We're also working on a science in the sky project. That's the top picture that you see. That will be self-contained eco-environment lab. That will actually have aquaponics experiments, hydraulics experiments, an edible garden. It will capture some of the plant life that's in our Lake Michigan beachfront area, so really giving people the experience of the environment, of the area and how precious the Great Lakes resources are and the shorelines that accompany them. Inside the visitor's center, it will also be a classroom and lab. We're partnering with SEAS on this, the Sailing Education Association of Sheboygan. And we'll be holding actually tour groups through there, classes through there, with hands-on experiences that even visitors can pop in and take advantage of. We've already been talking to the school district about working with us on some of these activities as well. In the future, we're planning to add a research vessel to the community. This is also in partnership with SEAS. The research vessel will be able to take tour groups out on Lake Michigan. An ROV remote-operated vehicle program will also accompany that. So we'll actually be able to put robotics or remote-operated vehicle robots underwater to look at shipwrecks and take soil experiments and then bring those back into the center and have some hands-on experience with that. Also along the area, the riverfront area where the visitor's center will be built. We'll be looking at partnerships for sup and kayak rentals for visitors right out of that same space. Next slide, please. That is slotted to open, by the way, in April 2020. So just a little research here, our target markets right now, basically ecological and education tours are high, high in demand and it's growing every day. This is just a new cultural trend, which I'm sure some of you are quite aware of as you have your daily experiences. But these groups are looking for very rare experiences that educate, share local and inside information that immerses them in the culture and also kind of a protection of the future. And I think as we look around us, we can all feel that that's a trend growing, especially with the younger generation. Next slide, please. Outdoor recreation is king right now. You can tell from the state's numbers that it's had the most growth in the last year where visitors spend their money. But also just Friday, the Wisconsin State Department of Tourism announced its new position that it is searching for, and that's it for a director of outdoor recreation office that they've just added. So that tells you the type of emphasis the state's putting on it and how important it is and trends. So we'll also be following that lead in focusing on this. Next slide, please. This will just give you, this is a little bit of the state information that we've gotten. Over 146 million Americans, or almost half, basically participate at least once in an outdoor activity. You can see on this side, it might be hard to see, but about 19% of Americans living in the South Atlantic do, and that is the highest rated area for outdoor activity. But number two is the Pacific region and the East North Central region at 16%, each where Wisconsin is located. So it's a very, very large market here. Next slide, please. Just gives you a little idea on male participation and outdoor activities. The green line is outdoor, red line is inside, and the blue line is sports, or sports membership or participation. So you can see that outdoor experiences are actually more important when they're a hands-on kind of individualistic experience than any other category for males 21 to 40. Next slide, please. For women's same age group, it comes in a little bit lower, but definitely very high up there and still worth working towards that market as well. Next slide, please. Just to give you an idea, visit Sheboygan's mission is to create and market experiences that reflect emerging cultural and social trends at the forefront of next-generation travel. So we're always looking at the cutting edge, finding new ways to offer what we have, but in different ways that reflect new cultural and generational travel trends. Next slide, please. So the vision of Visit Sheboygan is to excel as the destination leader of next-generation travel. We've been doing pretty well at that, actually, along the lake shore. Fulfilling desires for a connection to place, environment, local engagement, and innovative adventure. Obviously, as our long-term vision goes forward, we're focusing right on target market with what the new trends in the market are telling us. Next slide, please. So our competitive advantage, and as we look at this, and I know everybody's looking at the economy right now. Last year, everything looked great. Three days ago, we're going, what's going to happen? But either way, travel to Sheboygan is in a very, very good position, because even in down times, as long as we're looking at the right markets and new trends, we are an accessible, affordable, very affordable destination that offers an exceptional opportunity to leverage waterfront recreation and leisure activities. And it's close, contemporary, and adventurous. And these all stay in line with the marketing trends coming out of next-generation travel. I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but by 2028, millennial travelers will actually overtake baby boomers in the population. And more than 88% of them travel each year, as opposed to 75% of all Americans. And they're worth about over 220 billion in travel dollars. So that next-generation travel focus is really, really important to us. So that's where the focus will be.


Welcome to Psychic Medium Tony Green Live Edition. I need I need like fake background noises how annoying would my show be then as though I don't do enough already just saying solidly saying okay everybody we are going to get started right away thank you everybody in the chat for being here and being so patient everybody who is called in if you would like to call in and join the show live ask a question about love life career finances any aspect of your life at all or connect with a loved one on the other side the number is<PHONE_NUMBER> one more time<PHONE_NUMBER> is the call in number okay now if you are in the chat and you would like to ask a question I would love to answer that for you also if you are watching or listening on one of the many many podcasts radio stations or television stations that I air on you can join us live every Monday at noon or Wednesday at 7 p.m. both of those are central time today's healing on or clearing on tiktok is clearing any self-imposed prisons so yes I'm on instagram tiktok linkedin facebook and youtube and here we go so before the show started I was getting a name and I'm going to say that name right away so if you have somebody on the other side named Betty or your name is Betty somebody on the other side is trying to I hear that song knock knock knocking on heaven's door yeah and my voice is super salty this evening so whatever songs come out and however they come out I take no pleasure in how they're going to sound okay um next um okay sal sal online hey sal sal says he claims Betty it could be there could be a couple beddies here but thank you sal thank you so much Betty was here a little bit ago I even put it in the chat like who's who's Betty who's Betty here for or however I said it Cindy is here Heather is here Jake Francis is joining us um fawn is joining us I love you guys Patrick if I didn't say Patrick Patrick's here I think there might have been other people um or not um so okay uh the next I'm going to go straight into peeps from the other side so this may be their name this may be your name if you hear your name that means somebody on the other side is saying hello if you hear the name of somebody on the other side that means they are saying hello to you um so I'm just going to start doing names right away because before the show show started I was already getting names okay and there are like the names at me so Betty John Donald um Michael I have a Makayla here also she came in on Monday Monday show or some show a little while ago there was a Makayla also then I'm hearing the name Peter and then the name Joshua the name that's a name Jolinda I feel like that should be more like a song like you know I need a round way girl I just feel like we should take that beat and put the name Jolinda in there and make a song out of that go for it I I think it will come very quickly I just I just feel like Jolinda should be a song anyway back to names um I know this is a whiskey I think it's yeah it's a whiskey Jameson but I also know it's a name so Jameson I'm hearing the name Jameson and then I'm hearing the name Brittany and April I'm hearing the name Ricky I have a little dude sitting here with me he's in a diaper that's all he's wearing don't be inappropriate and he was still young enough to be in a diaper and to have to crawl up on the couch and right now little dude is and I know it's a boy because I'm calling him little dude climbing up on the couch to sit next to me and watch he's like just with his big blue eyes and blonde hair looking at me love you little dude so there is a little guy here so if you you have somebody who passed who was younger um very light hair blondish hair blue eyes white skin still in a diaper but could walk and could climb up on a couch by grabbing things and climbing up he's here um the hair isn't long enough to say if it's curly Jay Francis the hair is a little bit shorter so it does not look curly to me but he's just like the cutest he's just like this like just staring it's so adorable this is like one of the cutest little dudes I've seen come through in a hot minute this little dude I do I feel like he might not be in a talking stage like he might know a couple of words so he's here to join the show with us okay we're going to go back to names um the name playing all songs shuffled no no that is that is not what we are doing they are always listen I can't turn it off I don't know what to do here folks hold on so sorry oh they are always listening how did that even happen on my computer little dude did you do that somebody's gonna I have the feeling I had this feeling before the eat show even started today that this might end up being a bit of a spooky show so you guys if you notice things if you're watching on youtube and you notice things type them in right away because a lot of times I have my eyes closed and I don't see things um like the flashes on the screen all the time but that was crazy oh my freaking beacon oh I think it's gonna be a spooky effing show folks get ready I feel like I should light some candles because that won't make it more spooky next Wednesday night the show will be lit by only candles wait till you see what we're gonna do for our Halloween night show yep there's gonna be a Halloween night show yeah expect everybody to dress up okay I'm dressing up you guys can join me I should have a Halloween show at my at some place with everybody dressed up wouldn't that be fun okay back to the show now okay um maybe I should just have a Halloween party a Halloween costume party this is pretty much how my whole brain works all the time and forever okay back to the show now okay um next we're gonna do songs uh so the song could be a song that somebody on the other side loved a song that you loved it answers a question that you have it could be a song that both of you loved or you listen to together whatever it is I'm hearing knock knock knocking on heaven's door again I'm hearing um beer beer barrel so beer beer oh poca we got the blues on the run ha ha ha something something something okay that one um I'm also hearing um I'm at this song the guy has like a deep raspy voice and I know I mentioned this I think I mentioned this on Monday's song but the guy has a uh a deep and I can't think of any of the words to this song I should have looked it up after Monday's show I didn't think it would come back again but the way you chore good females work it I don't know that's all I can sing up that song if somebody can figure that song out for me in that little bit of a mess please please put it in there please um okay focus Tony focus the next um the next song that I'm hearing is uh give me a second I'm trying to get that oh on the road again on the road again uh walk into a restaurant strung up from the cold you can feel the eyes upon you and you just want to explode okay that song is coming through um I'm hearing meatloaf meatloaf meatloaf so because it is a food I'm gonna say this could have been somebody's favorite food or it could be the group meatloaf dashboard lights I can't think of anything else meatloaf saying okay okay I'm seeing prints prints right there I wonder if that's really prints or if they're just showing me prints and print songs and I'm hearing purple rain um and then I am not gonna sing purple rain and you are welcome you are welcome and then I'm hearing the song give me a second let me focus in rain drops keep falling on my head those are not that is not the words so that's not the next but that doesn't mean I'm not gonna sing what they're saying because I know it's not the words to that song but rain drops keep falling on my head is the next song and then they're the song I can't sing this even if I try um stairway to and I'll be climbing the staircase or the stairway to heaven um listen I'm not putting anybody through that singing thing of me trying to sing staircase or stairway to heaven um and then that song from the that song from the hunger games or the catching fire games movies um are you are you coming to the tree they say I killed killed killed a man and something about three I don't know but that song is strange things are happening and something something something that song is coming through okay now I'm gonna do a little bit of channeling everybody so if you're not familiar with the channeling um that's where angels step right in and they talk directly to you to give you a message that will help you moving forward I'm going to keep the channeling short this evening and I want to remind you if you'd like to call in the calling number is<PHONE_NUMBER> you can ask questions connect with loved ones on the other side and somebody is saying like before I get to do the channeling somebody is saying that um papilo papilo papilo is what I am hearing okay papilo whatever that means to someone okay okay um okay next is the channeling I'm really trying to focus in on the channeling and I know they're here and I keep thinking of things okay so I'm so sorry here we go okay here we go we would like you to know that we are always around you for each and every one of you you have all of us around you each of you has a minimum of two to three angels or angelic ancestral beings angelic beings being beings of higher ascension and your ancestors are always around you and you need not worry if your ancestors are around you can they also be around somebody else but of course they can they're omnipresent whenever you think of us we you will feel us much stronger we need you to share and focus in on the thoughts of us in the upcoming months we need you to focus in on what you really want your existence to look like but only the good we need you to focus in on the fact that we do exist and we are here and we are here to help you we work on requests it's like if you have employees at a business and you never ask them or tell them what they're supposed to do for or you to help then they will just sit there waiting for their orders please call us in to bring peace and love and don't worry about bring peace to the world if each of you calls on us to bring peace to you individually it will shift everything if each of you calls upon us to bring light and love into each and every one of you it will shift the balance immediately everybody is always so consumed with outside of them create world peace create world love create world prosperity it starts with you and expands out it's as you would call it the 99th monkey or the 100th monkey by the time a certain percentage has it everybody will get it and that is when the shift happens you talk about the shift and you're waiting for the shift you you you are the shift you are the shift okay i am just going to stop there because that was really i really like that message and i hope it helps everybody who's listening i hope everybody got that and it helps them and little dude is still here just like looking all over the little room here there's also a jake here and a jasper a jake and jasper are also here okay so i'm going to start taking questions and callers and so many more people are online turn the page that's bob seager yes patrick i knew you would know that song too um i actually do like that song and one more song is coming through and i adore this song um that song i can feel it coming in the night by phil collins and here's i've said this before on my show and i'm going to say it again if anybody knows how to do a song mashup um if you could take i can feel it coming in the night i don't know why i'm acting like i have hand puppets on i can i can feel it coming in the air tonight by phil collins and mash it up with we will rock you just the beginning just the beginning like i can feel it coming in the air and then we will we will i think that would be the greatest mashup of all times mm-hmm i do i do but not the not the rest of the song just the beginnings just those two that would be the greatest anthem at the beginning of all games let the games begin okay okay okay okay okay okay okay oh we have fun in here who is um i think i saw Mimi come in Mimi hey Mimi how are you um Margaret welcome to the show we have Angie in here welcome to the show Angie if i missed your message um i apologize and if you do have uh a question please do post it i'll be happy to answer it um uh there's a mashup with michael within the air tonight with a michael jackson song ooh i would love that sounds good that sounds good okay so now we're going to get to the show i want to let everybody know i did a um a show with marlo martinson this afternoon and we talked a little bit about relationships and i think it was like um i can't remember what she called it but you can find it on um i'm pretty sure she put it on youtube but she used blog talk also so that's our that might already be available if you want to listen to that okay five zero nine what's your name were you calling from my name is eric and i'm calling from washington state hey i love how can i help you yes um i was hoping to connect to my auntie or my grandpa um my auntie was uh recently diagnosed with something you know um difficult and i just wanted to know what they have if they have anything to say okay can i please get your grandpa's first name love jose okay thank you love okay i'm going to tell you that um i wish i i don't uh okay so um here's what i'm going to say um everything is going to work out and everything is going to be okay however i i'm not going to um so first i want to just ask you do you have a question for your grandpa because i think that will be easier for me personally if we just start with a question for you grandpa because all the i'm going to tell you all the things i'm hearing i'm just not ready to say them to you yet so what would you like to ask your grandpa um i just um i would like guidance because i'm i'm working on the like on the background and i'm trying to figure out like how to help her getting her at the right people and i think that's what i've been asking like um you know guidance to the right people so that they can help her and currently she's in the ER um and so i mean i'm just finding like the right doctors are finding the right the right people you know okay and here's uh here's what i'm going to say those that are in heaven are already working to bring in the best people for the job they're doing everything they can from their side so cut yourself some slack and um go easy on yourself um whatever it is that she's going through they've worked with this before and they already know what to expect and what's coming um they might not be being completely uh honest with you about you might not be getting all the information is the best way that i can say it you just might not be getting all of the information or they might not be telling you it as or you might not whomever is telling you the things about your aunt they might not be telling you everything okay and there's a couple of reasons for that um what i'm going to say is everything the way i need to say this to you is everything is already set in stone um there's not a there's not a um um can i just can i can um yeah okay um uh so so the best thing you can do at this point is tele communicate with your aunt okay thank you thank you so much oh my god thank you oh the best thing you can do right now is tele communicate with your aunt which i'm sure you're already very well aware of that means just like in your mind talk to her and have full on conversations with her that way ask her what she personally needs at this point and what she personally wants at this point and then have acceptance and understanding for that she is able to tele communicate with you and she will will do it especially after eight or nine p.m okay you're already doing everything that you can don't feel like there's more you could or should do at this point um people with a lot more power than you don't be offended but people with a lot more power than you are already working on being in that place to bring in all the right people and circumstances for everything going on um there are so many questions i want to ask you but i i just i'm not going to while we are on air but i am going to let you know that those on the other side um are really working for the outcome that is the best outcome for her at this point okay love are you okay yes um yeah there is i don't know i just was hoping that he would be like oh find this doctor and you know like i don't know just i've been looking for um integrated integrative centers like hospitals and so that way they could be like more holistic but i feel like um really know where to focus on but i'm researching i think yesterday i went online and i was like okay what questions to ask the doctor because i think it's important that we not me but like my my cousins that are in charge they a little bit more knowledge and asking good questions trying to help her basically so i'm going to ask you a couple questions love just for everybody listening and um first even if you find something i'm going to tell you something i'm i'm really grateful for all the energy you're putting into this um but even if you would find something it it would be impossible for you to move her or bring somebody in from the outside to help with her for so many there would be way too many who first of all the people in charge in the hospital rules and just a lot of things okay so there's a lot of of regulations and such that would make it very difficult i i am going to ask you um what what what was her diagnosis love um well um she's still having she completed the testing um we still haven't had official results but i i know that it started as a variant cancer yeah okay thank you love and here's there are things i could say that people would be very upset if i said on the air so i'm not going to say it in a way of anything that you should do personally um but i will say it in a different way okay and okay if i if i found out i had any of that any place in my body the first thing i would do is clean up my body and i would take something like hydroxychloroquine i would take ivermectin i would take benben dissolved any of those things they have been shown to be very powerful to get that out of the body even in people with stage four who have been sent home to call hospice especially the benben dissolved has been shown to be very powerful to get that out of the body and have a complete recovery the problem is that as long as she's in the hospital um it's the law that the only thing and the number one thing that they use is um chemo it's a law which is crazy it's crazy that that's a law but hey it's okay it is what it is um what i will tell you is from this point forward i want you to take all the responsibility or the feeling like there's something you could or should do out of your hands because for the biggest reason is and unfortunately you you unfortunately don't have the power that you need in this situation you don't have any control or power and even if you do recommend things even if you show them proof even if you show them evidence even if you show them testimonials they are not going to want to listen to that because in these cases people are so filled with fear that they're following the doctors and the doctors are doing the things that the doctors also do always do and i'm not saying that's right or wrong i'm just saying this is the process and this is where she is with this i do feel though something i know you said it was start it started you didn't say it started but ovarian cancer i'm going to tell you the thing that i feel and i'm saying this to prepare you not to scare you or make it worse i do feel like there is something that is spreading very quickly now sometimes that it could be it could be it could be it could be a couple different things right um but what i'm going to say whether it's the cancer or subsist or something else i do feel like it is whatever it is it's kind of invasive and at this man this is the hardest message to give over the air um at this point just pray and be at peace with whatever the end result is and telecommunicate with her okay just do the best you can to telecommunicate with her and talk with her and that is all i can do and or say while we are on the air okay love okay thank you yeah i've been since last week since last week i've been feeling very anxious like like very and like i said she's she's in the hospital at the same time i know that she wants to do like a holistic um has been in contact with a doctor who's um you know more about natural um you know i completely really why i completely understand that we often get that feeling when we feel like we have well sometimes when we feel like we have no power or control over a situation sometimes it's when somebody's going to be going home sometimes it's um it can be a number of different reasons why we feel that like maybe you feel like her her wishes aren't being honored i am going to tell you this and just from what i'm getting and what i'm understanding is once somebody is in a regular hospital and they get diagnosed it is very difficult to have them have a holistic or a natural pathic practitioner come in because outside doctors just aren't allowed in but also to even have them leave the hospital will say they're not in condition to be moved whether that may or may not be accurate the hospital will say that to keep the patient and because they're in their perception and in what they're doing they're trying to save that patient the only thing and i can't even i can't even say it on the air um if she because even if you take supplements in from the outside they might say she's not even allowed to have them at this point so don't feel overwhelmed don't feel stressed just communicate your feelings of love with her make sure you you listen to her at this point even if there's nothing you can do about it i do feel like she may have the opportunity to make a choice in a bit but she she has to make it quickly but they may not even if she makes a choice they may not honor her choice okay love okay it like let's just say she decided she wanted to go i know um there's a hospital in mexico that does things in a completely different way they're more holistic they have a different approach let's say she decided she wanted to do that they the doctors may say no she'll never survive that trip she she can't be moved and that's something to think about also okay so even if there was an answer it would be very frustrating because they may not honor that answer okay love oh okay okay that's that's what i was trying to say to you that even if you do find something that may work or may be the right answer they may not honor it or they may not allow it so please just talk with her listen to her tell her just to get healthy enough to get out and you'll get her to the right place i don't know i don't know um how that will work for you but do the best you can with that okay sweetie thank you so much love for calling in i'm so sorry for what you're going through and i want you to know that everybody in the chat is sending prayers to um your aunt so she has a lot of prayers going to her right now okay awesome thank you so much for that you're so welcome and call back in and let us know how everything's going okay okay sounds good thank you you are welcome you have a good rest of the night love and i'm again i'm so sorry for what you're going through um i am going to go to the next caller um and the next caller is 216 216 what's your name and where are you calling from 216 here and i'm calling how are you i'm good thank you and it's funny there are two one two two one sixes in a row so i'm good how are you tonight yeah that's uh that's a little i'm sorry go ahead i just feel so bad for her i know it's always so difficult and you know what it's she's she's a little bit you know if i'm dealing not dealing with but if i'm talking to somebody who's a little bit more mature um yeah but somebody so it sounded young yes and even if she's not young i think she probably has not experienced a lot of this but okay oh yeah so let's get to your question love what's going on with you what do you need tonight i know i know sorry to get off track well um you were very accurate i did get a really really good review thank you so much for that oh my gosh and they and then a week later they changed all of us they they got rid of our department and moved us all the different areas get that out of the blue i'm so glad it was my next week start you feel i'm gonna like this job am i gonna sell at it i think you're gonna like it a lot you're really going to enjoy where you're moving to i feel like it's gonna be good i feel like there's a lot of promise there but i feel like it's there's going to be another move within the company they're reorganizing a few things another one yes there's going to be another one it might not it okay so this the next move it might be another department that gets reorganized but it will also in a little way affect you but don't worry everything is gonna i just hear that song every little thing is gonna be all right um don't worry so yes that one so what i'm getting i love it is everything is going to work out it's going to be chaotic for three to four months go in and look at every day like it's a bit of an adventure go in and look at every day like it is a bit of fun and but don't get don't be um i don't feel like you would be negative about it i do feel like you're going to be very pleased at the four month mark you're going to be very pleased with where and how everything ends up and they're going to be happy with you just keep a positive attitude as you go through it and they will they will be happy with you you will be happy with them you will be happy with the position you end up with this might be the this might not be the last this might not be your final place um there may be one more move for you while they're figuring everything out but wherever you end up you're going to love it that's what the way i want to say that okay love that's interesting i know it's just they're all over the place right now i know listen that was so wonderful thank you the people are going to be nice and that's so important yeah you know i think don't worry and again don't worry this isn't the final place um there will be more moves so just take everything over the next three to four months as very temporary at the end of the four month mark you're going to be extremely pleased with where you are and what what you have going on and here's here's what i'm getting they're reorganizing for a couple of reasons but one of the reasons is they're really trying not to let people go and in order to make everything work and run efficiently and keep as many people as possible and make their numbers look good this is what they have to do for now okay okay oh i get it thank you so much oh my gosh yours thank you oh my goodness you're so welcome i hope you have an amazing rest of the the night and um have fun with all the changes thank you again for doing what you do oh volunteering that's what i have a nice evening okay you too and thank you so much love and thank you i'm going to go to the other two one six which is two one six three five eight how are you tonight thank you my name is patricia patricia i'm fine thank you for taking my absolute absolutely i like you thank you first i'm sorry go ahead love what's your question for the night is there anything else i'm preparing to relocate next week coming out my trusted house sitters page to be a house sitter and pet sitter something else i could in the way of getting housing for myself um i have memberships on the field of facebook groups but no response i did get one person el paso texas which is about i guess an hour away rather than that um nothing did some outside groups no response but is there anything else no i feel like um i'm hearing that fun joe v song oh living on a prayer take my hand and we'll make it i swear so i'm hearing going like on faith and a prayer and everything is going to work out and be okay the the very oddest message i think i've ever it's not odd but the message i'm receiving for you which i think is a little cute or don't forget your keys like i don't know what that means or if somebody used to say that to you all the time or you used to say that to somebody don't forget your keys don't forget your keys um i feel like that's the message that's coming through for you don't forget your keys um but also don't worry everything once you get to where you're going it will kind of come into place i do feel like be very uh vigilant vigilant when filling out the paperwork and be accurate don't say you'll watch just any dog if you don't like big doberman pinchers be very clear about what you do and what you don't want as far as house sitting and or dog sitting i think that's a really good way to go i do feel like you're going to have a lot of i want to use the word luck with that but i also feel like there's going to be some some people watching out for you and bring bringing it full circle to you getting you into the right places once you get there go to the areas you want to be and instantly start looking at them at night to make sure they're safer at night and as i say to everybody when you're going to an area you're not familiar with whether it's another city town and or state stop into the police department pick up their statistics on crime and then ask them you know hey like i would if i were moving in i'd say hey if my niece were moving in here what would i have to warn her about because they'll always give you different warnings for younger adults than they will for yourself which i don't know why but they will um they're more maybe they think because younger like a niece would be more naive i don't know but get the statistics of every area if you have to be a little further out of the city i always say that's probably better for everybody right now with some of the things going on to be further outside of main cities the further outside of a main city you can be sometimes the lower the rent and also the safer it is um and in the long run especially those are some things you're going to want to look at once you get to where you're going and the the resources that are available in more of the country area like because i look at it as city suburb country anything outside that the the suburbs i call that country because well to be honest i don't know what people call it what the real word for that is i call it country so if the further you out in in the country the more resources they have for people because the less people are using those resources okay so i feel like that's something else you should definitely look at and depending on your age one of the things i'm hearing is definitely there are but you have to really seek them out you have to like get on the box and tippy tap the words like rental living for 55 and above those are some of the safer more well watched locations also especially if they're further out in the country those are the the tips and things i'm getting for you tonight my love i hope that is helpful for you take your time getting where you're going remember life is a journey you don't have to hurry up and get there you'll get there exactly when you're supposed to be there just don't don't try to push it okay beautiful girl all right and i'm just praying and affirming that shift my belongings i have the money to do this by FedEx and i'm just giving away clothing shoes to city missions here but thank you you are so welcome beautiful and i hope you have i know you'll have a safe and beautiful journey and for you and anybody else relocating or traveling the journey is we're going to make sure the journey is going to be safe i get a yes we're going to strengthen that we're going to get there say yes we're strengthening that when we get there everything will work out i get a yes and we're going to strengthen that also okay sweetie the biggest thing i get for you is any whatever they offer you ask don't be afraid to ask a few questions and get into that position those positions as quickly as possible okay love all right thank you have a good evening you too and thank you so much for calling in anybody who would like to call in the call in number is eight four five two seven seven nine one three one i'm here every monday at noon central and every wednesday at seven pm central i also do offer private readings that go 30 or 60 minutes for somebody who has things they want to discuss in a more private way and we do clearings and healings during the reading and if you would like to find out more about that you can go to my website which is t-o-n-i-g dot info tony g dot info and it will give you the information there on all of that i want to let everybody know there are a lot of partnering up things coming in and on monday's show i named a lot of partnering up things ways people were going to meet people for partnering up before the end of today's show i'll go into a little bit more of ways to meet somebody and partner up um and we will we will get into that um i love all of those supplements patrick cd and zinc absolutely um so that is what i'm going to say um but uh do i have time do i have time i think i have time for one more person here we go um hi you're live on the show what's your name and where are you calling from i'm going to go to a therapy change because i wasn't doing well i was not i'm so sorry hello what's your name and where are you calling from this this is team now from aridona okay fatima hi hi how are you yes ma'am i how are you i love talking to you this is my second time this year and i'll make it quick okay okay what's what's your question beautiful what's your question miss well i'm right now uh thank you ma'am for saying that means a lot to me um where i'm right now staying right um i just like to know if i um if i'm not going to have any problems with a person next door or anybody else i mean i'm going to continue to be the same with me he's been very respectful and kind uh and just paid a random time no no criminal problems they still could remain the same yes yes okay so what i'm getting for you love and i'm going to try to um everything is going to go very smooth um they are going to be respectful you're going to be respectful i do feel like when and if you relocate it will be your choice you're going to find something that fits you better something that you wear you want to be that fits you better and then you're going to choose to relocate then you're not everything will be going very well you just might find something that's a little um better of a fit for you not today not tomorrow just down the line if and when you do relocate it will be your choice okay love beautiful because i was thinking about maybe having a second location because what i want to do i need a bigger location so that's possible right yes yes and i am hearing that again if if you do um if you do decide to relocate or have another location it will 100 percent be your choice it'll be something that you choose to do um because you this is what you want um but i do feel like where you are right now everything is going to continue to be smooth and it's it will be respectful um on all sides everybody will continue to be respectful of each other okay love um thank you so much for calling in i'm really grateful for that i just want to say um i just want to do one more thing before the show completes today so don't go any place yet if you are in a relationship already please go back please this is just a message coming through you don't have to do this if you're already in a relationship don't forget about date nights and go back to some of your original date nights or some original ways that you've dated go back to the old school style if you're new to dating if you are just single and out there wanting to date and meet somebody some of the ways that i am seeing people meet each other and i'm not going to give a ton right now and i'm going to try not to repeat the ones from monday but some of the ways that i'm seeing people um meeting each other okay this was one for monday is like fruit picking or apple picking being outside and picking and i see really tall grass like really tall grass like this grass is like three feet high i don't know what that is or where that is but it's like bunches of it really tall and then the other way i see um somebody needing or um kind of a hook a hook up at like a like a wedding i don't think that's the beginning of a big beautiful relationship if you're the person who has a wedding hookup coming in within a month um just know it's just a wedding hookup it's not the beginning of something else um the next thing i see is there are there someone's going to meet someone at a little cafe a little cafe and then the last one i'm going to give okay no a classes i'm hearing a dessert bar a champagne bar okay those are two of them but then classes like a cooking class and or a language learning a language class or and or an art of some sort of art and or painting class it's not a sip and paint it's someplace where you go to learn to do this so like if there's a craft store offering a painting class or a cake a place that sells cake um supplies and decorations and they're offering cake decorating classes i consider that art but some classes like that or and or things along those lines are going to be where some people are meeting people and starting something new so i hope that's helpful if you are single and trying to mingle those are some of the places there were a lot more on monday's show um thank you you guys i just love you all so much thank you so much for being here thank you for liking the show and um subscribing so you know when i come on you get those notifications i love each and every one of you so much um until monday i hope you have an absolutely amazing weekend and um yeah go make miracles in your life go do find something you really love and just do it just who cares what anybody else thanks just find something you love and go do it thank you so much everybody for being here again and um until monday be safe have fun and uh i want to hear about the miracles on monday whatever you did this weekend to create a miracle i want to hear about it on monday thank you so much everybody bye bye


Hello and welcome to Think Tech Hawaii and It Never Got Quiet. This is a half hour program that explores the Hawaiian connection with the Vietnam veteran and the Vietnam War. I'm your host, Vic Kraut. The Vietnam War began over a half century ago when Congress passed the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, giving then President Johnson extraordinary powers in dealing with the conflict in Southeast Asia. There were close to 9 million uniform members of the United States Armed Forces who served during the Vietnam era, over 3 million of them being deployed to Southeast Asia. More than 58,000 were killed. Many people today either do not know about the war or have a vague recollection of it. As time goes on, more veterans of the war will pass away and the experiences and wisdom these people gain will be lost forever. This program is an attempt to capture some of those experiences so that we may benefit from them. Wars are fought by individuals. The grand strategies and political goals become meaningless to those who World War II cartoonist Bill Baldwin termed the benevolent and protective brotherhood of them what has been shot at. The domino theory is irrelevant when hot lit is flying past your head. We named this program It Never Got Quiet as most of us from the time we arrived in Vietnam to the time we left were never too far from the sounds of war. Some of us have never truly become rid of those sounds either. In this program and in future ones we will talk story with the Vietnam veteran who will explore their experiences, motivations and how the war affected them, their family and the life after the nom. We begin with what we hope to be a long running series here on the Vietnam war and in think take away with what many would consider the most essential element in the prosecution of war. And that's the infantrymen. Our first guest is Miles Nishimoto. Miles was attached to the first air cavalry in the central highlands between 1966 and 1967. Miles received the bronze star and purple heart for wounds sustained in combat and was medically discharged from the army after spending two and a half years a tripler. Miles spent 11 months in country before being wounded. Welcome Miles Aloha thank you for being here. Well thanks for having me on the show. I'd kind of like to start off with what did you do before you went into the service? Well what had actually happened right before I got drafted into the military. I finally landed a job as an apprenticeship program with the heavy equipment mechanic and at that time my hobby was more or less pulling out with the automobiles anyway. And I had this one passion to build racing cars. So if you can imagine whatever money I earned was all invested into my speed machine. And that continued to be a great great hobby I would say as well as during my past time. And I really enjoyed it. So along came the draft and plucked you from that experience to sending you to the mainland. Yeah and what had actually happened we knew that the draft was going to come mainly because of the fact that there was a new order that increased the draft per month from practically zero to almost 30,000 personnel per month. And this being the case it says hey all our friends we got together one afternoon it says hey so what are we going to do? We're going to wait for the draft or we're going to volunteer. And majority of them says you know what I'm going to volunteer for the Army. The other guy says well maybe I might consider Army Reserve. The other guy says well Air Force is for me. And finally when it came down to me I said you know what guys I think I'm going to wait for the draft mainly because of my apprenticeship program. And by the time I'm done with it hey I can get drafted go in there serve two years.  It started that way. I was going to say I look at the time line and you were in country probably what a year after you were or less of the year after you were here. Oh yeah I think it was about five to six months. And then you spent 11 months in combat and then we're wounded. That's right. And then spent two and a half years as a tripler so you didn't get out before they did. No. So long story short they came up to the hospital and visited me and they said hey are you still in the military? Well but then of course I mean on the other hand friends are always great to have around but don't forget we also meet some new friends while being in the military and also being in Vietnam. Yeah. So friends was always part of my memories yeah good. So when you went through basic training and AIT or advanced infantry training you went through I think you went started at Fort Ord for your basic. I started Fort Ord California that was a basic training and if you can imagine being a typical local boy from the islands being adjusted to military life was not an easy task for me mainly because I felt that the military was very organized and that wasn't my style. But after a couple of article 15 I said you know what I'm going to start paying attention it's not being able to change my ways to adapt to the military ways otherwise I'm not going to graduate I'm going to be out of the military you know. Well we ought to explain to the audience what an article 15 is that's part of the universal code of military justice an article in there it's a disciplinary action but I never expected that for me and Miles. Oh my god like I said I did have my challenges with the military when I first joined but then of course everything worked out pretty well I was able to graduate my class. You know being at Fort Ord it was a different experience too because at that time they had that meningitis crisis and if you can imagine sudden I mean in Fort Ord California it was already cold and in the evenings we had to sleep with the windows open and wow I mean it's quite a challenge but there were a few guys that came down with meningitis and but I was one of the fortunate ones so everything worked out well and thereafter upon graduation I was transferred to Fort Polk Louisiana and Fort Polk Louisiana if you can imagine was more for advanced infantry training and jungle warfare training and that by itself was a new experience too mainly because like being a local boy from Hawaii you know Hawaii is more like the melting pot we've got a lot of different ethnicity here and we all got along and being over in Louisiana the first experience that I have experienced was like wow you know there was so much segregation going on between the blacks and the whites and we couldn't believe it that one afternoon while going out to the PX to have a beer all of a sudden we see this one car driving on the sidewalk and we see the black jumping over the hinges we want in there how is that you know but that's what there was more or less like our first first exposure to hey this is what has been happening here in the mainland U.S. and if you can imagine now that was what just a little more than 50 years ago so there has been tremendous changes as far as attitudes and acceptance and being able to live together I would say you know so all in all it's it's a good story but yeah but for us it was quite an experience I can imagine so from Fort Polk I remember some of the stories of guys going over by ship I don't know if you're one of the lucky ones that went in a stretch eight or now what had happened was when we received the orders to go to Vietnam we shipped out from Oakland and Oakland was more like the repo depot at which they're rather going by ship though we flew out there was a more like a chartered flight and we were fortunate because we got there pretty fast instead of the ship you know otherwise my tenure would have been that much longer right but yeah we got into country and I was assigned to the first aircraft division which was in the Central Highlands in An Cabe Vietnam and boy there was a home of the first aircraft division and was really quite an experience to be attached to a first aircraft I remember you telling me one of your first assignments was with a fire team or in a platoon you were the M60 carrier yes the M60 is we've discussed it as the grand piano of the concert orchestra in terms of combat weapons that's correct and it is a heavy son of a gun or it sure is but then of course I mean even if it was heavy I mean when you looked at the amount of firepower that you could have out of the weapon there was really remarkable then of course I mean I'm sure glad that every one of the platoon members or the squad members helped carry with the ammunition and I didn't have to carry the whole thing with myself otherwise it would have been a problem yeah but yeah from there from being a machine gunner and I got a chance to think of as a squad leader and from the squadron's position it became part of our responsibilities to also participate in the Long Range reconnaissance patrol which is called the LURPs and we all had special training on that and we're able to select a team to go out into enemy territory to do some reconnaissance and it was really quite an experience quite exhausting if I must say because boy spending some sleepless nights you know just worrying about your people there was responsibilities that even at a young age it was quite tough to cope with you know but I'm glad everything worked out all right though you know Well you participated in a couple of significant battles if you want to call them battles I know that uh were you in the second battle of Yodering? No, Yodering battle was the first one was in November 1965 and that was the one battle that they had a movie on and by the time we came in we were more like the replacement of those who lost their lives there and got injured and but then of course we also went back to Aidrang for a couple times and Aidrang is a name of that valley if I remember correctly was like the valley of the dead right and it was a funny feeling when you got there you know it's eerie but yes we did have several firefights in there but we lost a few but again I was very fortunate to have been able to survive and at the time I didn't get wounded or anything I was one of the very few that made it back and we're talking about battles I mean they were out of battle areas that we participated with in the right outside of Pleiku and the Bong Song Happy Valley and all of which was quite an experience though you know because when we first got in country we didn't really understand the purpose of why we're down here but then our company commander one day shared the beliefs of the objective as to why we are there we were there and it was mainly to stop the invasion of communism from the north into the south and I'm pretty sure there was much more to that however that was the only reason that we can understood from the simple language spaces that hey that was basically our purpose but as I mentioned while I was stationed in Fort Ord I was really exposed to the type of segregation that they had but while I was in Vietnam I gotta admit one thing our leaders in Vietnam were tremendous leaders they clearly explained the real purpose of why we as soldiers need to look at each other and support each other and even if a person gets wounded it is our responsibility to make sure that hey we're going to do our ultimate best to bring that person back to the line and making sure that we can accommodate this need for a minute back and everything else so I think the idea of getting close with our comrades was a key lesson that was learned and I think those experiences of being able to interact with others has been a very good key learning something that you're going to remember for the rest of your life and even those that we had lost good friends good comrades I mean it was very very hard to accept however you know there was never a dull moment they made you think and dwell on those periods so I for one I can be extremely extremely happy of the fact that I was able to cope with the changes cope with the circumstances and also looked at different ways that we could still contribute to our comrades that myself was something that it can be with me for the rest of my life yeah why don't we go ahead and take a quick break here and we'll be right back with Miles Lushamoto this is Think Tech Hawaii raising public awareness welcome to Hawaii this is Prince Dyches your host of The Prince of Investing coming to you guys each and every Tuesday at 11 a.m right here on Think Tech Hawaii don't forget to come by and check out some of the great information on stocks, investings, your money, all the other great stuff and I'll be your host see you Tuesday research says reading from birth accelerates the baby's brain development and you're doing that now oh yeah this is the starting line push this is over you're dead read aloud 15 minutes every child every parent every day welcome back to it never got quiet we're here with Miles Lushamoto and we're talking about his experiences in Vietnam Miles we kind of left you there with you're talking about the leadership and the quality of the people there I think that you had a great life lesson we've discussed this before I don't want to bring back any hard memories or bad memories but Miles and I belong to a group that's sponsored by the Veterans Administration it's out the West Oahu Vet Center and it's a very it's where the rubber meets the road as far as getting in touch with veterans and that's how Miles and I got to know each other and it's an excellent program and we get together on Monday nights and you held a spellbound one night with one of the stories that you have and I don't know if that was from your experience when you were wounded or it was from some other engagement but when you end of the story we were just everybody was silent we couldn't say anything and it was very emotional and I don't want to bring that up but I will bring up the business of you going to the hospital after you were wounded as we said we were joking about it saying yeah the guys who got wounded most were the ones who first came in country or the ones that are about to leave country that's correct you got lucky I got lucky you were the one that was about to leave country 21 days before you de-roast that's correct yeah you know as a matter of fact you know as I mentioned about the comradeship and the relationship that we built over that period of time that we've been in Vietnam together I can still vividly remember the day that it got shot and when I came to I knew I needed a tunicette because I could see but a mom was down and my other half a mom was up in the air and at that moment I asked my my buddy there hey by the way help me out I need a tunicette and when he turned to me and he saw what was happening to mom and he started crying and he mentioned that you know when I was in this and he first said class I don't know how to make a tunicette I said you know what I'll talk you to it and slowly but surely I talked him through it and it was very patient and I had this excruciating pain and everything else but yet I didn't really want to put him into a panic and I think because of him I my life was saved mainly because the fact that I never went into shock and because I had to talk him through the procedures and after that I thanked him for it he felt so glad that wow I saved the life you know and even when I was ready to leave he came up to me and he thanked me for talking into that procedure but you know it's just exactly like what I'm saying I mean those are some of the the moments that you kind of cherish a lot you know knowing that here it is a person from San Antonio Texas and here's another guy from Honolulu away the only time we met was in in the war and how it became closed but yet it didn't matter what nationality you were and basically the leaders had always mentioned about making sure that we tend to the needs of our comrades and that was one example you know so I'm really really grateful for that very grateful now I know you spent two and a half years a tripler and that had to have been a heck of an experience that a lot of us I don't think we've wanted yeah experience but I know that afterwards you had your mindset and what you wanted to do and I know you've been successful and in business and as a parent and got two great kids and in professional capacity but do you think your military experience had anything to do with that or is what what direction you took I personally contributed a lot of my successes to what I've learned in the military and for example while a patient in a hospital if you can imagine right after the Ted offensive that hospital was absolutely full they even had beds in a hallway so this being the case now the amount of help that the hospital needed was insufficient they had some uh volunteering notes from the outside seven and one coming down to help out and I for one I was watching it that I had my significant other to come in there and wash down my wounds and making sure that it's properly clean and the funny thing about all the help and support that we needed especially with the other patients in the hospital knowingly that they went into surgery at certain times this morning knowing about approximately what time they're coming out we're all made at the point that hey somehow whether or not we'll chair or somebody can push us on the bed or whatever we're going to be there when they come back to to welcome them and to congratulate them that hey the surgery went all right you know and I think more like a more outbooster and I think that by itself had helped a lot of the veterans to really recover and still look at their lives on a very positive basis but I think that by itself has also been a key learning for me and even when I got out on the military and started with my business that by itself always helped me to understand exactly who people are what must we do to continuously help them to develop themselves to have the patience of course and to even thank them what is what it's so hard to thank them for a job well done in this crucial day and age you know right now is everything is a hustle bustle businesses got their own personal challenges and one of the things that I think a lot of the leaders fail to realize is hey how to treat people the way they would want to be treated and I think this by itself part of the learnings that I've had in the military about helping each other I would say was a good listen learn and has lasted a lifetime would be anyway so those are some of the skills and knowledge that I stated that I needed to continuously try to improve on them so what is it that you would like people to remember or learn from our experiences in Vietnam well I think when I look at today's existing situation across the country people always say that it's really quite divided but you know when you really think about it back in 1965 it was also divided I still remember when I first came back home and I didn't have no we didn't have no welcoming committee we didn't have no parade if anything there was a riots going on even at the local university and we were known as baby killers and otherwise you know and it was just a funny feeling like wow why is it like that now compared to yesterday year and what is happening right now cheerfully what is the big difference is the opinions of others I think that is created this dividedness but until such time that we can continue to look at how do we make things better it starts with us no matter how you look at it you know and just like what I mentioned just imagine a little more than 50 years ago there were segregation and look at it today I mean we're past that but now it's different circumstances so again I think you know that's become some of the key things that we all need to realize that everything will happen but how do we adapt towards accepting the changes and trying to overcome those things you know I think that becomes something that we all need to be working ourselves to be committed to doing that's great yeah what else do you think we could learn from this well I think the the other good things about it is you know people will always give you the dismal side of any situation that a wall may bring on fairing to realize that you know I can still remember this back end wow we're some good times too you know and just the idea of being able to be an out to give out in a field and like that local to say talking story and being able to kind of understand what is that for this guy who is living in New York I mean what is so different about his lifestyle versus my lifestyle here in Hawaii but you know there were a lot of similarities after all you know and the good thing is that wow I'm pretty sure I was fortunate and I just hope that they were also fortunate that they were not able to dwell on things they were able to look for it and kind of get over that you know and I know it's a it's a problem for a lot of people but a lot of comrades but you can see that the VA now we have so many different support and help and like for the here and now group at Kapolei under the leadership of Ed Deguzman I mean wow you know he is a terrific servant of the veterans and I for one can admit that this is one person who goes above in the yard and just imagine now he doesn't have to do it but he just enjoys doing it to help the veterans out and you know there aren't enough people like him really big oh when I was trying to get at it I think that a lot of us have lost a sense of service or at least those who haven't served in the service and we look at our generation and what we were faced with I was drafted twice once when I was in basic trading the other time when I was in Vietnam so my number came up or whatever I look at it and think of the things that we take from there and what we learned and what we can bring into the community is that sense of service and I know that you have that sense of service and have brought it not only to work but in your life and you brought it through the rest of this and I mean that's our contact with one another and I want to thank you for that because you've enriched my life in that way and I appreciate that oh I appreciate it yeah but you know like the last thing maybe I can close with is that sometimes we take things for granted and we look at our success story I was like wow you know I became successful because of me failing to realize that you know we've got significant others that we should be very thankful about because my significant others being the fact that I did a lot of traveling because of my national business she was always there to act as a mother as well as a father and I still remember this one occasion I came back from Japan and my wife told me hey you better go start throwing some ball with your son man I enrolled him in Little League Baseball oh yeah fine so I get out of there and say to her to throw some ball so he throws the ball back to me and says hey by the way who's teaching you how to throw a ball you're throwing that like a girl you know and he says mom but again that's the reason why I'm saying you know behind every person is always a greater person so I would support you that is that is something that we tend to forget is the support that we've received from family and I know it's caused a lot of friction and a lot of different people and seen divorce rates and a lot of spousal abuse and things of that nature but and one of the things that we try to do is enlist a lot of the kids from the Iraq conflict so and so they don't make the same mistake that we did exactly yeah yeah I would like to thank the staff here at Think Tech Hawaii and their support and assistance and truly without them there would be no never got it had never got quiet I'd also like to put in a little bit of a pitch for a photo exhibit that's at 4th to Russie right now it ends at the end of the month or the 31st of August if you're interested in some of the photos it's at the US Army Museum very historical and very interesting and I believe it's all free too it's just a donation if you want to leave a dollar at the door so thank you very much for being with us hope to see you again here next week


Thank you, Dan, for the mood lighting. Welcome to Grand Rounds. Today we have the Williams Brothers presenting. First will be Lloyd Williams. He has a patient presentation, a 78-year-old male with an intraocular mass. Our second presenter is Bryce Williams. He is presenting, Is It a Third and Early Worsening of Diabetic Retinopathy? All righty. Good morning, everybody. Dr. Bernstein asked me to present this guy yesterday. So sorry about the short notice. Hopefully, everybody had a chance to see him. He's a 78-year-old male extended to the VA with a complaint of floaters beginning three weeks ago and a new brownish discoloration in his superior temporal visual field. He also, of note, has a history of having a skin melanoma on his right cheek, a family history with melanoma, and one with macular degeneration, and a pastocular history that includes IOLs in both eyes and an inferior temporal nevus in his right eye, which was followed by optometry at the VA. And he was last seen by them in 2006. And at that time, the nevus was noted to be two disc diopters by two disc diopters and flat. So when he presented to us on Friday, the, sorry, this is not working. And this is the lesion we saw. It was a relatively large, darkly pigmented lesion with surrounding retinal detachment that appeared serious. There were no regmetogenous aspects to it. There were no breaks seen in the retina either. And this is inforo, yeah. And it is located inforo nasally in the right eye. I also wanted to comment that the patient requested to be able to hear this talk. So he's in the room right here. So these are just some more pictures of the same lesion. As you can see, it's outside of the arcade and the macula is on. His vision was 2060 in that eye. Fluorescene angiogram was done yesterday in the retina clinic as well. And they had some difficulty focusing on both the retina and the lesion. So you're getting out of focus view of the lesion here. But you can see quite a few vessels coursing over the top of the lesion. And that's an earlier view. So, you know, it's not really a diagnostic dilemma like a lot of the things that we present. But it was something that Dr. Bernstein felt was an opportunity to discuss a very important ocular disease which also has some important systemic ramifications. So in terms of how do choroidal melanomas present, 41% have no signs and they're found incidentally on an exam either for a lesion in the same or other eye or just as part of a routine exam. The most common presenting symptom would be visual field defects or visual disturbances which is what this patient was experiencing as well as flashes and floaters is about 15%. So he had flashes and a visual field defect. 3% can have pain which occurs if the tumor invades into the nerves and about or a small percentage in this particular study by Abramson in 1992, one of the 193 patients presented with metastatic disease. From our standpoint, the signs of ocular melanoma, things we see when we look in, include often a darkly pigmented mass but not always darkly pigmented. In fact, they can have almost no pigment at all. There are sometimes overlying drusen, orange pigments or RPE changes. However, even the orange pigmentation can be associated with some benign tumors as well. So, you know, a darkly pigmented mass with orange pigment over the top is very suggestive of melanoma but it's not necessarily a guarantee. Antietumors can also have sentinel vessels that are seen on the sclera going into the tumor. An advanced tumor may present as a blind, painful eye with proptosis secondary to transcleral extension of the tumor into the orbit. And rarely it's possible to also have a melanoma that spreads diffusely in the coroid. These can be relatively difficult to diagnose because they don't have the characteristics that we're usually looking for. And these often result in a serious retinal detachment. So, when a patient presents with something that you think is likely to be a coroid or melanoma, it's important to do several tests. One is ultrasound. Although imaging modes such as CT and MRI exist, the ultrasound is still the best way to characterize the tumor in this case. A-scan ultrasound not a great photo but it shows initial high spike and then low to medium reflectivity in the tumor and then the second spike of course is the sclera. You can also sometimes see vascular pulsations as fine oscillations in the low to medium reflectivity spikes here. In addition, B-scan ultrasound is used to characterize the size, thickness, diameter of the tumor and help you with prognosis and with choosing appropriate modes of treatment. UBM can also be used to look to see if there is anterior extension of the tumor or some tumors can actually occur at or in the ciliary body. And so, UBM is a good modality for looking at tumors that are much more anterior than this particular patient. In addition to those, FA is commonly done and it will show vascularity in the lesion usually. It also tends to show late diffuse staining. A CT and MRI could be used. You can see these lesions on those two modalities but due to cost and lack of sensitivity, they would be impractical compared to ultrasound. But it would be potentially possible to pick up one of these lesions in the process of doing a CT scan for some other reason. So that might be one way that a patient could potentially present. In addition, if there were a non-pigmented lesion that you were very concerned about you could potentially do a biopsy. Unlike retinoblastoma, this is a tumor which is much less likely to have a transcleral escape secondary to a biopsy. Although the papers that I read recommended beginning treatment essentially immediately after the biopsy to prevent that. Another important factor is that the patient needs to be screened for metastasis which is, if present, an important factor in determining treatment. Most patients do not present with metastasis that can be detected at the time of their initial diagnosis. In the collaborative ocular melanoma study, publication number 23, only 1% had metastasis at presentation. The five-year cumulative rate, however, is 24%. And metastasis is, of course, the most feared complication of choroidal melanoma. Most metastasis, depending on the site, studied in this particular publication, ranging from 56% to 100% of metastasis occurred in the liver. Other sites can include skin, subcutaneous tissue, and lung. They recommended screening with liver function tests and in patients who had at least one abnormal liver function test, the sensitivity was 14% and the specificity was 92.3%. So that's a pretty excellent specificity, but the sensitivity is poor and there aren't really other practical good ways of screening. So it's still advocated that patients have liver function tests every six months to a year in order to screen for metastasis. The prognosis, a 10-year survival, depending on the study, ranges from roughly 50% to 70%. Concerning factors include large size, anterior location, if it has escaped the eye through transcleral extension, growth through Brooks membrane, which appears as a mushroom-shaped tumor, optic nerve extension, lack of pigmentation, increased vascularization and histologic features such as mitotic activity and cell type. And for the sake of time, sorry Dr. Mamo, so I'm not going to go through the histology. Potential treatments for corridor melanoma depend in part on the size of the melanoma. Most sources recommended enucleation for large tumors, although I have seen examples of proton being more gamma-knife being used on tumors greater than 10 millimeters in thickness and greater than 15 millimeters in diameter. In general, however, radiation is used in medium-sized tumors and in some cases can be vision sparing depending on the location of the tumor. So for example, a tumor in the macula or at and around the optic nerve is not likely to be, you're not likely to have a vision sparing outcome, but a peripheral tumor, you may actually get a good vision outcome through one of the radiation treatments. The most common would be sewing a plaque designed for the patient's particular tumor onto the outside of the eye and using that to deliver radiation. Proton beam is probably the second most published method that's limited by the need for a particle accelerator, which are rare in the United States. When I last looked it up, there were seven, there may be more now. Some other less commonly used techniques would be used for small tumors, such as laser photocrygulation and transpupillary thermotherapy. In the literature, there was no difference between using a radiation plaque or a nucleation in terms of survival or metastasis. Coridomelanoma is the most common primary ocular tumor, about six to eight in a million. It's slow growing. The prognosis in terms of survival is probably better than for say an advanced skin melanoma, but still in terms of ocular diseases is a very serious one. And the modality of treatment has not been shown to affect metastasis or survival, but the tumor volume and location and some of the other things I showed on the previous slide have been. And it's thought that perhaps the most important thing with regard to survival is whether or not it has metastasized and so even though less than one presented with already known metastasis, it's thought that the patients who go on to have metastasis even after treatment likely had them prior to treatment and so essentially the cat was already out of the bag. And these pictures just show a melanoma before and after treatment with a radiation plaque. And these are B-scan ultrasounds of a tumor before and after treatment. And these two come from a study I did with Jay Duker on this subject. Any questions? Yes, that's correct. Absolutely. But the carotidonevis was noted to be in the infronasal quadrant. So this patient actually has as I noted an interesting family history of five family members including one who died of a skin melanoma and it's thought and he also had some genetic testing done at the Huntsman which indicated that his family and himself were at increased risk for melanoma. It's thought that the genetics of skin melanomas and carotomelanomas are different. And so an increased risk of one is not necessarily an increased risk of the other. Just point out that a lot of those analyses can be common. Dr. Harry's gonna see him at 9.15. So I don't know the size. I would suspect it's medium and large. And interestingly too from the genetics standpoint some studies have shown that tumors that exhibit monosomy of chromosome three are much more likely to metastasize. And it's not known whether that information can yet be used in a meaningful way that would affect patient survival or treatment. Yeah. And the COMPS trial now actually has quite impressive numbers over 7,000 patients have been entered into the trial. So for something which is pretty rare that's a good number. Dr. Patel. Yeah, thanks for that input. Dr. Harry. And it can sometimes go from the eye to the skin too. That's in my reading that would be probably more common. Yeah, so he'll be referred on to Dr. Winwood. And we'll see. Yes. Thank you very much for coming in. Any questions?