read simpler to understand and then refer to people to this right because I think we're doing this committee though make that executive summary we can do it you know kind of well to build on your point can we just throw this out and see if it comes close Wendy and I took a crack at this and let me explain it when you get it there's no recommendation in here the things you'll see listed are just all the possible options so let me explain to you what it is down the left hand side are 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 options that we came up with possible ways that we could educate the youngsters in the Stockbridge and Rochester communities and it runs all the way from leaving as it is maintaining three buildings fix the priority items all the way down to the last two one of which was mentioned at our last meeting which was offer choice for all students in Stockbridge and Rochester and then one we added we don't think it came up in our discussion but we just wanted to go from the beginning to the end it did it was at the end all right so the last one we added there was build a new unified pre-k6 I guess we don't need unified twice elementary school yeah the columns over here are intentionally left blank because we are thinking that this committee could help fill in those columns in terms of what is the essential information out of that report that we would like to convey about each of these options and here's the hope the hope is it would do a couple of things I too think this report is very dense it's going to leave people I think with misinformation and not necessarily a clear picture of what some of the options are right so if we could come up and I was guessing that cricket Willis and Jenny could probably help us figure out what are those engineering headings that should be up there and I'm sick we're suggesting Linda and I are suggesting that once we figure out whatever this is we take all of these options to the communities and it would be the communities that will say you know what two and five look like the best ones to us we don't want set sure not don't want for sure not that and it will begin to narrow down because I think we're going to get someplace in the process when we're presenting to communities and then the board needs to move towards okay what are we going to do communities are going to part of how they're going to make a decision is going to be what does it cost to do three what does it cost to do six right I don't think like I could sit here now let's say I was a resident Rochester I could sit here now and I could say I want my elementary school to stay open Joanne could sit there and say I want the Stockbridge school to stay open neither one of us really have a good idea as community members what it is going to take to do that right does that mean a hundred thousand dollars does it mean six hundred thousand what does it mean right so I think if we begin to sort of put the information from the report in these columns whatever these columns might be that would be a way of synthesizing the report that might be easier for people to understand than reading this I still think we have to figure out ways to make copies of this available to get information to fill in those three to create right because for example number one maintain all three buildings fixed priority items okay I don't know personally why we would do that we don't need two buildings at Rochester we need one or the other but I think we had to do justice to these different options we put it in there so maybe that has a price tag I don't know I'm going to pick a number out of the air nine hundred thousand dollars I don't know if that's 179 863 for both buildings someone pull it was in there did some math right but I went through I went through and then but then when people are saying yes I want to maintain all three buildings they all understand it's going to be a hundred seventy nine thousand dollars to do that but are we going to just pick I was hoping we would actually analyze what is in the report and actually look at the items that they are saying are their priority one items so that when we're putting a price tag on here we're kind of already sugaring out some of the things that we're saying well that's not really that's beyond the ability of cost estimating at that point they okay like I said plus or minus 50% possibly close to where you're at and they've done a good job of itemizing in some of these pages but getting that detailed into you know the other thing I thought Amy just let me make this last thing that I'm acquired the other thing I thought when this is filled in however this committee wants to build in if we decide to use what we've done there could be backup sheets so let's take Carl's hundred and seventy nine thousand okay we could do a backup sheet that said option one maintain all three buildings hundred seventy nine thousand and list right under and bullet points the main pieces that add up to that hundred seventy nine thousand so somebody knows when they're looking at option one and they're voting for a hundred and seventy nine thousand dollars it means they're going to get a I don't know fixed ventilation system we can repairs to the roof whatever is in there under the high school in the elementary and I would recommend a yearly cost to do that as well that might be a column I mean yeah that's why we didn't try columns right right right because that and there could be more there could be less yeah the cost thing is incredibly hard to get into one column and equivalent annualized cost is what you really need moving forward which involves single one one-time costs for repairing right renovations it also involves cost savings incurred by getting rid of a building maybe a cost realized by selling a building if that's even possible ongoing maintenance costs which are going to be high if you only fix some critical priority items and don't address other things ongoing maintenance costs are going to be lower for the options where you put a bunch of money and up front and fix a bunch of things so you know a seasoned financial person would really have to be the one to flesh out say the two that are the most palatable to the communities because fleshing that out in terms of an equivalent annualized cost moving forward for the next 30 years is a master's thesis I mean so just kind of having a column okay this is what it costs year one to do this it's it's a column but it's a very small part of an overall picture right it's but it's a column start it's gonna start somewhere the other thing we thought might help is that we know you have to pay for information information doesn't come free there's so much more we need to know about the issues raised in this report that are going to have price tags attached to it that if we could even come up with enough information to have communities say okay these are the top three we want to look at and then and I don't want to put words in your mouth but then I think we could dig deeper into those three and it certainly would cost less to get more information on those three than it might on six of these things well like one of the things we said was we want to look at the option of building a new your last choice building a new unified pre-k school so if you dig through the information in this report it says that each kiddo needs about 200 square feet of building to be to be in a quote modern school and we have 150 kiddos so we need a 30,000 square foot building the prices in this report for building square foot on the addition are around 350 so if you take you say we need three acres and that's about 15,000 an acre that's 45,000 plus a 300,000 or 30,000 square foot building at 350 bucks a square foot to build that's a 10,500,000 dollar building and then you add 25 percent to the cost of the building you figure you're not going to have an overage on the land but the building so you could say it's about 13 million dollars to build that one but I think you're I think you probably read you in right but I think we have to put that out there as an option or someone's going to bring it up and say have you looked at the costume right no it's true we have to be fair right stock bridge is 8,300 square feet so if you're going to expand putting it in addition on the stock bridge that addition needs to be 21,700 square feet and that works out to a 7,600,000 dollar building interestingly enough because it's already about a 30,000 square foot building you only need to put like 5 million dollars into the high school but this building you'd have to put like eight and a half million dollars into just to just but that's again to say okay well 350 dollars that's a square foot price and 200 square feet per kid and 150 kids I mean so it's really kind of back of a cocktail napkin sort of calculations but it does I mean I agree it does start filling in these sheets so that you can do things like saying as long as we can have that backup right behind that though how did you come up with these so what what goes into that 2.5 we're gonna just jump and grab numbers about we just jumped and grab numbers well we have to I mean and I can show you I've got a special to share that goes through and that $179,000 was based on me looking in through and saying yeah we do need to move a bus plug yeah we do need to you know they say the fresh air furnace doesn't work at all at Stockbridge period end of reports we have to replace that and so I mean I can I can I share with Brian we can print it and look at it this is just my interpretation of going through them and trying to say we need to do this we need to do that but I mean we have to spoke to that too at the last meeting that what they identified as priority one sorry I think we would all agree our priority one but some of their priority two items are just as concerning almost this or at least as concerning as 31 see I think in the beginning it's okay for us to start with some broad numbers because nobody's asking anyone to make a final decision based on any of those numbers the assumption that Lindy and I made is that we wouldn't be able to do it first of all we wouldn't it wouldn't be a prudent use of money to do a deep dive into all these and secondly I think a couple of these as soon as we present them in the communities they're going to say that's not our first choice put those aside and don't spend any money getting any more money any more information about that option maybe maybe do we present with no columns that's an idea here are some options we've identified one you know with maybe a little footnote that says these obviously all have different costs associated with I think we should have different explanation some several footnotes but then say jump out at you like oh my gosh how did we not see that before yeah and and Joanne and I talked a little bit about that coming up the hallway tonight and then I think if we were to so here's my worry cricket about doing that if we were to put out these options and I'm a lifelong citizen of Rochester I'm gonna say I want you to maintain Rochester elementary school right and somebody else gonna say I want you to maintain Stockbridge elementary school and we don't really know what that means right don't really know that we've got to understand and I and it doesn't have to be on people don't need to do it on a price tag but people need to understand when they're making the decision to keep one school open this is how much it's gonna cost and I'm choosing that even though that's a more expensive item because that's what my community and right I want and what's best for educating our kids but they it has to be a conscious decision with known facts about what needs to be fixed about what the cost of those are and that's what that's what I think we need to do is get that information out that says to use this school this is what needs to be fixed and this is how much it's gonna cost can we dumb this down one more level and say before we do this and maybe this is ridiculous but can we have like priorities education which is obviously yours and ours too but yours education priority one what's the second priority community what's the third priority financial if we can start our presentation with what goes into our thoughts here as well then maybe it will be accepted a little bit better and from that from that then go to the options exactly about because I think if we have the three or four or whatever numbers we can come up with as a presentation that we came up with this from this mm-hmm and so that when the communities actually come in and they make their comments or whatever they see that it wasn't just financial it was not just educational it are whatever I just think that would help I know that's not coming from a engineer mind because I live with one but so I don't want you to think I'm saying I'm I'm just trying to there is going to be an emotional piece sure and I think that that might help that side of it as well okay just in our introduction I think the other piece we have to get at and again I wrote myself this note right here remember the chart no recommendations the other thing we have to understand is in my thinking the only thing we should be presenting is what's in this report that's the only task and we take three out it's going to be other reasons as well right so you can say it all you want but we all know that you know we have in our hearts what we want for our communities right when you said we join you meant the communities take that's right that's right I just gonna be in clear of the communities right right I think that I mean we had this discussion and we wrestle with it last time and I think you know again part of yes we have to present what's what's based in here but we do have to you know I think it's important that you have you know the two choices that aren't expressed in this report which are the what would it be to just put everything at one school what would it be to close all the schools here's the average tuition for you know for elementary school school kids in this area it's gonna cost about that so we have we have an idea of what our ongoing operations are even though that's not in this report so with the saying going to one building right it's not in this report but we should at least be able to say this is one of the options that you all have to consider not like it but it might be like I said it may be something we look at maybe an educational column because I feel like I've been educated just by coming to these meetings about option number one and how sustainable that is on a long term or even medium term right and what can happen that's completely out of our control if we choose option one for too long and what kind of position that puts everybody in and Bonnie and Wendy have educated me at these meetings as you know the whole idea of you know what's called the penalty phase or something I didn't really even understand that prior and so I don't imagine a lot of the public understands how kind of close we are to that type of right so you know while option one can appear appealing for a lot of reasons low cost keeps in the communities what what they've had all along it it may be well and from a sustainability standpoint and I think that's exactly what we need to do though is we need to get the information into those columns so that we can look at it and say oh my that is way out of our range of cost or oh it actually is not as far out as I thought it was right but remember also we have to go back to the articles of agreement and it was one building one building no it was not that the articles of agreement do not specifically state that actually you're right it was in the handouts that Steve Dale gave us you're right it wasn't well I mean that's what we voted on exactly but the point I'm gonna make about that is so I'm just saying that the people in our town think it's one in one right and the point I'm gonna make about that is that it's not exactly a move point but it's pretty close because if we try and maintain all three of those buildings for much longer I know I'm not I'm not making a recommendation but we I think we'll hit the penalty because we're pretty close right and I think that's what we need to do now is get those numbers in there so we can all see that we can present that's the tough conversation to have part of the reason some of these buildings are in the situation they're in is because things have been tried to be maintained and then it's like oh wait no we're gonna do this for kids which I'm always in full support of we're gonna do for this for kids and we're hanging on to something too long and then right now we're in a situation where we've got these really big fixes and we just can't that's in my opinion not a sound way to continue to operate it's going to push us like everybody keeps saying closer and closer to the penalty for not careful well when I went through in my process so the first thing I did was I went through and I looked at all the level one and some of the level two recommendations and kind of tried to sugar that out for the three buildings figuring that no matter what as we as we discussed last time you know this roof is that we can't have this roof leaking in the winter we can't you know we we have to have buildings that are safe and and and and so on and so forth and yeah and that's where like I said when I went through and just listened you know thought about what Wilson said thought about what you had said and just identified things that's where I got like that hundred eighty thousand dollars for what and that breaks I can show the spreadsheet yeah I love that did you do that with all the options or just the I did that with some of them I didn't get to I didn't get down to doing an analysis of tuition yet but the thing that the thing there is it's like it that also sugars out to one of the important figures we always need to keep in mind I think is you know we talk about equity between the two towns between the two communities is that it's a 60-40 split it's not a 50-50 split there's 60% of the grand list is Rochester 60% of the kids are Rochester excuse us are 60% of the expenses are Rochester you know 40 percent of the expenses are stock rates 40 percent of the kids are stuck with 20 percent of the yeah I mean we had the we we can pull I can pull the numbers again but yeah that's it's 60 and 40 yeah basically and you guarantee it'll be that every year after this year no but I can't guarantee anything after this year that's the but the point being the point being is that 60 40 is a good rule of thumb at least in my mind and when I look at the cost of the emergency stuff that works out to about 43% of that $180,000 is to fix problems in Stockbridge 58 is to fix problem fix problems in Rochester so that seems to fit around the general the general feeling and I think that we all sort of thought that we needed we had about a quarter million dollars or so of work that need to be done right away so I'm okay with that where I where I what I started looking at the next question which was one campus in each town and going through these numbers so what I started with was they have their suggestion they said okay this is what we suggest if you're gonna ongoing operate in in in these towns this is what we suggest and one of my assumptions I made was that we paid for this report we trust its opinions I'm not going to completely second second guess all of it I'm going to change some things because I don't think like when I look at the square footage they want for an art room and a music room in this building I say well you know you could subdivide that gym you don't need a full-size gym you could put rooms in there and that's all gonna be a lot cheaper than doing that so I tried to kind of look at some of those things like they said well be this much to replace the ventilation system in the high school but you could probably get away with cleaning it for 40 grand so I'm you know said okay let's go with their suggestion of the cheaper ways and the big thing that worried me there if you're not limited by like equipment that you just can't fix right maybe choose one thing but right right I'm trying to you know look at the numbers of our port and look at the ones that seem like like they said we could replace the whole ventilation system for 340 or cleaner for 40 I said well let's let's let's look at the flip let's say we can choose the 40 and bring that down one thing that's important about what you're doing it goes to Amy's point if we were to just this is a great example if we were to ask the community just blank straight out question do you want to replace the ventilation system or do you want to clean it that's all we ask people the obvious question is going to be well what does it cost that's why what you're doing is so crucial so somewhere in some part of our presentation at some point we have to give people numbers yes here's something that's really about for me I think what that you're doing is really great and I think you can make a simplified version of the chart a simplified narrative of this but the problem is I wouldn't go to the Supreme Court with these numbers you know these are they make clear in here it's a broad range and they're saying we don't know and the minute you start opening the walls up whoa so I think there needs to be some way because for most voters I'm I'll bet you a buck it's going to be about the money they're gonna look at the figures of what's gonna do their talks that's what they're gonna that's what their eye will be drawn to but but everything has to we have to find some way to be tentative enough about this that an honest with people because because you can't I mean one of the first things you said as a professional engineer was I'm uncomfortable with this so it seems to me if you made a kind of a simplified do do what Carl's doing best you can and that would give you a kind of a menu of options and it would be very obvious very quickly I think right which we're gonna come forward well the big the big thing I found is that when you look at the percentages to do all the recommended things and again going over it with a little bit of a fine-tooth comb you know that that's where both the Rochester buildings are you know looking at about five million dollars worth of work and the Stockbridge building is looking at about a million dollars worth of work and you say you know it's it's that that's that's a you know that's where I think we get into a harder conversation because the that's a lot of money and I think you're I think to your point Rob that's what we were that's what Lindy and I were trying to grapple with we're trying because I'm gonna go back to something I said before you have to pay for information we're not going to get better figures without paying somebody to give us better figures so our wonderment only was if we put up these six or seven will four of them get pretty clearly rejected in both communities then we figure out how do we get better information about the three that are standing because I don't think that I don't I'm certain we do not have enough money to fine-tune all six of these options or seven how many there are here of these options does if we just number them for five and six the kind of consolidation type options are definitely not once you're gonna be able to clean information out of this because like I said there was direction to not look at that right so right I think what you've done is very helpful very helpful and I and I like to like dive into that more and have that those numbers of picking out that cleaning the ventilation system versus repairing it and looking at those numbers and plugging these numbers into these buildings with the thoughts behind it of what those numbers mean to show us what we have are we leaning toward the minimums and the maximums with their recommendations or we do that question because if you do the minimums it's a whole different story if you do them the maximums you know I mean I don't know where we're doing the minimum I was looking at the I was looking at the individual spreadsheets that the spreadsheet source the front that had multiple columns. So like where it said I was looking at the page 12 where the Stockbridge preliminary scope and budget summary is yes well for the for the first part where I looked at minimum numbers I looked at the column and said minimum scope items for the second one where I said where I was looking at what you know to have a you know the one school in one town I was looking at what would take to make each school viable I was looking at the suggested scope numbers I did not bother looking at the extended scope because I was looking at in the beginning where they showed like the minimums and those two correlate with pages 12 through 20 so their executive summary numbers from the blackover design executive summary. They do correlate with so those executive summary numbers are are a good snapshot of the Excel spreadsheet. So those numbers are these numbers. Yeah right kind of condensed and put into a range. And then like for the for the elementary school I looked at you know whatever the appropriate columns were for their suggestions if it stayed as a school. Well and it kind of brings up a question like here in the page 13 their priority one is the flooring that red tile in in Stockbridge and then we'd gotten the asbestos. So that number is in the number that you've created as a as a cost of priority one item in Stockbridge. Yeah so when I what I went through so for the for the do the minimum piece I went through and looked at all the items and chose the ones that seemed like they I didn't care as much about the staff bathroom not being ADA but the kids bathrooms not being ADA. I said okay we need to they say the fresher furnace doesn't work period we need that $17,000 fresh air Yeah it doesn't work at all. You know the bus plug that plug that's a hazard you should probably fix that. So I kind of I picked and chose a little bit but I tried not to be all like how cheap can I go and how much could I double you know double question things I tried to you know thinking it was how much how million for the to do the minimum in Stockbridge is 78,000 and then it's a hundred and it's a hundred and seventy-nine thousand to do a minimum in everywhere when I looked at the three buildings it was 259 for so that's when you went through I took stuff out yeah yeah I mean I'm gonna say they do all the back bridges 140,000 for highest priority to two million for full scope right so like when I did the suggested scope I ended up with a million one for Stockbridge and I ended up with four million seven for each of the two buildings here yeah so that's but again that's going through and doing stuff like okay we don't really need it talked about this much square foot expansion was the minimum and then it just made it a little bit bigger so I cut that down so something similar to what's actually already on page one or two the architects executive summary did a similar thing he made some different judgment right which is understandable everybody would like but we do have some of that we have two right which is awesome because Carl's more familiar with this district so you know so we have some of that and we can and I did double check that this stuff and the architects executive summary match their spreadsheet goals witness though that anybody who wanted to could take a could take a chart like this and then go back into this and say oh what about the teachers bathroom you know because here there's so many variables and the barriers aren't exact yeah I sounds like what's required is a two-phase thing something that gets it down into it and then a second once once you've got it down in the second phase whether that's with input from the public or input from so whatever so you don't have to solve all the problems of the universe right I think what we're struggling with is do we don't even have that other huge column we're still trying to grapple with the one time that is definitely important to yeah oh yeah one of the things that I didn't really understand and this is just my reading and I hadn't like tried to put the numbers in the column because it was blowing my mind a little bit but like it really looks like when you look at all the options you know I think like we really need to have the conversation with Rochester because for a lot of these you know when you go beyond just doing the minimum if you're not going to use this building from that from a lot of this analysis almost like cheaper to knock them down you know because you know the roof is shot the furnace is shot all the you know all the electric is shot the fire if you do any renovations over this much square feet in this building you're going to have to put in a sprinkler system so it's like now you're now you're coming up up on that thing that now I have been talking with the Arsford board for a couple of years because we knew some of these big ticket items were on the horizon and we're you know we'd get right up to thinking about how do we plan for this and then it's like well what if it's not here in four years we just put $500,000 in 30 years that we're going to tear you know Stockbridge is about keeping their building as Rochester is of keeping the the buildings is going to need to take a lot of but I also think supporting documentation that is the absolute bestest thing and yeah yeah no and that's why I began by saying just in reading this I was really surprised I didn't couldn't because it blew my mind but the one way it makes sort of sense you don't have any ongoing cost when you got a feel on a field the Rotland Island and Ron mall is getting knocked down they just they built that way after any of our schools and they're not going to have some more efficient to rebuild sorry no no it's okay it was it's what seemed pretty important to see in to Rob's point and I don't want this I don't want this to sound crass but I think the reality is I know very few of any people who would make this decision based solely on education and it's hard for me to force those words out of my mouth right but finances are important to all of us so in some point I think those there's going to be a cost benefit analysis that's going to have to be done right and I wish I could say we were miles away from the penalty but we're not that's got a filter into this somehow big responsibility it's a decision it is and I think what we're trying to get Rob is and I feel this tension myself we're trying to get detailed information on a project that we haven't yet defined we've got this list of several projects we need to figure out how do we give people enough information and what is that information so that they can make an informed decision on telling the rot the R said board throw out all but these three and then look further at at these three over on the other side of the mountain where I'm on the board we just authorized an expenditure of forty seven thousand dollars to do the same very thing we're now looking at a deeper level on a possible six through eighth grade middle school at the Otter Valley site but we had to go through all of this what were the what would happen if we renovated Lulterup what if we renovated Nashaby what if we renovated Lester and we had to keep going through these steps to get it down to something we could manage to pay for to get additional information about and and to feel bundles as a voter yeah okay my question and and no I'm sorry I'm just wanting to make sure you saw oh no I didn't yeah in this evaluation flood plain cost that's another disgusting the report that those are not flood mitigation which are about Terry down the building isn't like to know how the flood plain cost relate to this they were they're clear that it's not there mitigation costs are not included in there so that would be an additional if we had to do right right the other thing that they're very clear about is that they have not they they did not we're not able to rate the stock bridge roof for whether it was strong enough for solar and it was the same for one of these one of them didn't and one of them they thought did I can't remember which is which one of them was strong enough they thought high school didn't or did we did it must be this one that they weren't sure I wouldn't go to court with that my only question was in your numbers were you also putting in the addition of the new kitchen and all of that that Rochester High School would get yeah yeah right it's going through the it's it's well it the renovation the for if we were if we moved to the high school the the numbers that I pulled out of this report the the column ends with their suggested cost before they put in the 25% soft cost for the high school BRD says it's four million three hundred and seventy six thousand two hundred ninety two dollars you lose I said well we're gonna take three hundred thousand off that for cleaning the vents and not replacing it we're gonna lose the two grand for the shop I wash we're gonna have the lighting upgrade but we're talking four million dollars we're talking four million dollars and I'm talking and telling you how I read yes okay I went through I went through all the a bunch of the numbers and said you know we don't need to redo the reception area for thirty thousand dollars we don't need to we can we can have the classroom we reworks for a hundred and ninety five so take a hundred ninety five thousand dollars off the multi-purpose room they say twenty four hundred dollars twenty four hundred is the square feet required they put in a twenty six hundred dollars I reduced that a couple hundred feet so basically the to go through and to change to just for me to get go through and try to be yeah that seems dumb and just you know being very one past pragmatic not being political just saying okay how can we save money because I don't want to spend five million dollars if I don't have to right I got it down to with the 25% soft cost four point seven million dollars they had twenty five percent they added twenty five percent contingency and so four point seven million for the renovation of Rochester High School that's moving and that's just drawing numbers and I don't forget about this one correct exactly what you know correct and then the this I mean see I really thought this building would be the four million five you know four and a half million dollar building because it's needs a roof and furnaces are dead and it's steam heat and it's blah blah blah but they're pretty much the same because of the you know some is the general that's within the yeah what if what if we back I'm a details person but what if we back out of the details and talk about like a relative short-term cost column relative long-term cost column where we just have like an index like low moderate high that makes that's that for for our ongoing costs you know a short-term cost column where we say this has a high short-term cost we're not even putting a number on maybe a range for me right maybe less than a million when we're saying hi we mean 50,000 way over a million dollars and north of five point seven and a fit into keeping that cost under the penalty that would be high yeah right so that would be hard I don't think we should worry about that right now do it I think we should use this no no wait let me finish because I know I think I'm crazy I'm gonna build on on Bridget's point I think cricket I think it this boy I was thinking in the morning see when you're 70 strange things happen to your brain you guys don't appreciate that yeah but now I just call it butcher I call it right because I can't think of your name but building but with I'm sorry don't we don't with that as crickets explaining it would that be sufficient do we think for community members to look at it and say okay two three and five out the window because they don't want it don't even get any money don't even get it I don't know I'm making up a number at this point don't even get any more information about those I think threshold is very important we got an absolute threshold it's close it's a relative yes two and a half million plus or minus 50% is brings you up to three and three-quarter million so it's you have to be really really whoa whoa I don't like I was like these numbers in here at this point I mean putting a construction cost estimate on a set of design plans designers always use plus or minus 25% putting a construction cost us and that's when you have an entire project planned out like engineering and you still don't know it within 20 to 25% here I was being generous by saying plus or minus 50% so that's not hard to contemplate when you're saying okay 50,000 plus or minus 50% well that maybe that brings us up to 75,000 for those priority one items these are all imaginary numbers I talk about two and a half million do 50% plus or minus on that so so we can't even that we can't say oh that's our absolute threat that auction will not cost more than two and a half million well no that's it's a relative you know that's why I'm talking about low moderate high where we give like a relative range for that but be real clear about saying cuz you don't want to be quoted as one number and then you know or just say low moderate high you have to have you know if you present this to people you can say puts has to be general because we don't know and because if anybody wants to sit and go through this take the time to go through this I think really think this too wrong to face thing you're talking about where you rough it out right here's the options we came up with figure out some way to get the feedback from it narrow it down and then and then find out a way to narrow down on the cost and maybe possibly engage professional I would suggest like what they did in the executive summary just do point A and point B this is the absolute minimum this is the possible absolute high instead of having the median number in there because then that's because we ran you have several plans right there so if you're at three numbers see each plan I would say just do what they did in summary because that's easier to understand say this is the high end and the low end it could cost anywhere in between I think that would be easier for the than to have three different numbers say well what are these based on we like she's I'm sorry we could pull the numbers out of this and start our chart and then go back and modify them with explanations how we did it and that would take the blame off from us if people ask questions where did you pull that number out of well it came out of the study well I think that they was about this to this I think we have to do right from the get-go we have to say 150 different times because even saying in 150 times there'll be someone who will not think we ever said it right we need to say whatever first cut we take at this right these are ranges so a million dollar cost actually could be anything from one million to three million right and we could say all we're putting these broad brush jokes up here to try and get a sense of which of these do you want the board to further pursue right and these seem to be like hopefully whoever did this did all of them so it's in that person's general they're in a ratio right the lowest they're all the all the schools have the same well same thought process went into right so they're right if the person's a little bit higher a little bit right I mean right I mean no that makes a lot of I would totally always refer back to you so maybe one column is is range relative cost I'm gonna call a range it's short term cost yeah I think I think I think it having a I like the idea for ongoing cost to be able to say because I think it's very important that we say people don't say that okay well you if we throw the hundred and eighty thousand or the quarter million dollars or whatever at the buildings we're good we're very high long-term cost because we're we're still annual cost right that's what I mean so that we're letting people know that these low short these low short-term costs for doing the minimum figures to work in that high school building till the end of time right and that's we can't think another column is like a sustainability adaptability flexibility for future state mandates that we just have to adapt to like is this one does this one give us some ability to adapt to the state saying you guys spend less money we can't support this education changing that equation right and then go oh do we have we picked an option that is adaptable or have we picked one where now we have to just retroactively close one of these buildings and figure it out like before August right well that's true and also okay I'm not on a board so I don't know what you guys do to build your budget it's not easy I'm sure so if we added to your budget right now we added whatever the bond would be that portion that yearly amount it's going to be tight right that may or may not or that close so I can't definitively to say it wouldn't that might put us into a penalty depending how much and that's certainly one of the first questions we would ask the community but then again so the business office you're taking away educational opportunities business office could help us with that because they could say okay a three million dollar bond based on what we're looking at right now you stay below the penalty next year that's about the best they could tell us would be next year on a six million dollar bond you go over the penalty right next year so that would be I think an important piece of information that would help people so I don't know that we'd want to call it the column the penalty but we'd want to have some piece of information that lets us know if a bond of X so what's our bondableness is that even yeah that's how much can we bond for getting into difficulty right it is bonds a fixed interest rate every or knowing on the amount of bonds you take depends on usually what is our what what's the like well as questions and usually they cast that over like they find the average property value in a town and they say this is let's say it's a six million dollar bond this is what it will go on a hundred and fifty thousand dollar house it'll raise it right that's what happened with the error the state or whatever error and that's why our certain people's taxes went up 18% right we don't want to do that so because that was what happened right right seeing that is going to help us continue to refine the direction in which we had right so there's that other third thing education emotional attachment in the community and money so we have those are the three things we have to remember right right so Carl when you gave that four point seven million for the it was it for the Rochester elementary school yeah there was anything they were like 20 grand of each other to be in the high school to be in the high school we're doing was that with was that with what they show here with all these changes that they show here because there's a lot here that I did pretty much I mean I took down I don't think we would have to do ever I mean they're they show the principal's office and administration office being moved out of where it already is and creating a new room for it like I don't know if we would like they did I mean I shared the the document with you you can see I reduced the classroom work rework by half okay reduce the multi-purpose room to what they said the state minimum was you know I should there's some parking changes that I said we didn't need to do they wanted reworked of my school entrance I still think I mean the big pieces is that it's just you know is is that you know the scope seems to be for both of those projects in their minds somewhere around four million and what you've done which is awesome is confirmed there wasn't there exactly the summary pull out of those numbers but I don't I don't know as super glad you did that but I don't know as we need to go further we've got this near the back your text a lot we've got yours right I think it's a worthwhile exercise I just look at it see what I did and run through it yourself if you're bored right and you might come up with 4.8 or I don't know if that's what we need to no I think we need to I think we need to look at just I think understanding I think one of the biggest questions that this raised for me was you know following up on on her suggestion just just a suggestion from from you know reach out to Rochester do you want a building and see if we can see if that's that's something it's realistic and that they're interested in doing it what is the cost of kind of as is using both buildings what is the real cost of you know we have the resources as if it's going to cost us four million dollars to be in one building or the other what does it cost for us to continue to be in both buildings is it only 200,000 this year but right right so that's the question so then where's what's what's what are the costs up ahead and how much you and the other piece about the long term we have to remember is that these buildings got in the condition they're in because there was no maintenance no money so we spend this upfront money and we get them in good shape then we're going to have to continue to maintain them or somebody's going to look back 15 years from now and they're going to be in the exact same shape they are right now when you do hi when you do read if you do reach out about seeing if Rochester wants the school I noticed that the school parcel isn't divided so you would have to figure out if the town was going to be responsible for paying for surveying and division or would the school district be responsible for doing that to provide that for the town the other question that's come up in other towns is you have to go through the actual 50 process because it's probably going to end up being less than 10 acres so that's another cost we have to put right but I think that's I don't think we have to get I don't know but it's option would end in subdivision it would end in either the school or the town owning and then the other entity leasing some releases so I was in a budget meeting earlier today and I raised this question and there was everybody in the budget meeting had some sense of what the cost were not they had said that was that there was a lot of work I was the first thing that came up I would be very surprised at the town of Rochester rushed forward to pull the irons out of the fire given I mean it because we're doing the budget in the town of Rochester and squeezing everything right next I I have a hard time imagining that as a real estate I'm not saying they wouldn't because the emotional thing you're talking about it's a powerful thing but would they want to lose it yeah you know it's coming a lot of money yes you know these things of people voting down the bond issue and having twice up in wherever it was and they want a $30 million you know but still and and I think the only way we're going to get any answer to that question you just ask is to get in front of the communities because we all think at this point we know about some things and we probably know more about some things than others but until we get in front of the community we don't know for sure and are they willing to give up this building and have it torn down or whatever in our town like we've had a Christmas program there at the meeting house like that is such an emotional attachment to people that have lived there forever right like generations like if someone said we're gonna take we're gonna tear that meeting house down because we can't afford it anymore it would be devastating right so I understand why losing the auditorium and their history and using it is devastating I get it but I would never ask Rochester to pay for the meeting house just because it available the tax payers don't even pay for it privately owned but the big question to me but no I think we should really ponder this right why should Stockbridge pay why should anybody pay why did the why I mean at some level of voters of Rochester gonna say is it worth with the windling and you know the SU has the figures of the dwindling right is it worth poppin for this kind of like they haven't finished paying for that building yet for the number of students we have and and the way things are going is this kind of expense they really want to have a school that much well I think that's a conversation both towns need to have is is what if the population of of Vermont our student population continues to fall as it's projected what are we gonna do as a town what do we individually right hopefully we don't have to make that decision but I think I was going to say I think Julian's to Julian's point what I would argue is that we're already there we are there I don't know how many exactly I don't have it at the tip of my tongue how many kids we were off in this count that kicked us into the penalty but it wasn't right so one family could move out and we're there well family could move out if we're right there again and here's the other thing that we're going to we're gonna have to grapple with and I just bring it up for the point of information is that the state is changing its way of funding special education you're going to give school a fixed amount right local dollars are gonna have to pay for all the rest wow right and that's gonna add a significant amount of money to local budget and now one of the things that might argue for that building versus this building and again I'm making no recommendations but every school district is going to look at the number of kids they're tuitioning out to special programs and try and build those programs in their own district because it's a difference between thirty thousand and in some cases a hundred thousand dollars to have a child out of district special program special programs for so flexibility is certainly one of the criteria I think we want to keep in our mind but when we I think we have kept flexibility in our mind when we put these six or seven together it's going to be one of the things we are going to want to talk about when we present information that we've got to maintain as much flexibility as we can you know speaking of that and speaking of this idea that maybe we're on a timeline you're concerned that we're already there that starts begging the question of if we need more space in a stock bridge are we going to are we served by putting on an addition or are we served by renting or leasing a a mobile classroom a temporary classroom are we served with looking at some of these really short term you know I mean not a 30 year roof but what is there you know or not a replacing an entire heating system in a high school but cleaning it and saying okay yeah this stuff is end-of-life but if I can kick these furnaces down the down the road for five more years because they still work do I want to do that to save my money as best I can because saving the money and not bonding it out and not dumping it into into long-term renovations that we may not be able to take advantage of but is doing that is that going to give us more years of running a school because we haven't incurred a long term a long-term debt we haven't you know we've we've we've we've tried to say let's let's just keep going with this and let's rent something to put outside stock bridge to solve that space problem rather than you know building 2000 square feet at 350 bucks a square foot it's a stock bridge issue I'm just thinking the big question is what are we going to do here like one building two buildings which building that's really it I'm right that's right that's like the big that's the big that's the one that's the biggest ongoing expense right is heating that building right but I think to kind of drag us back on the point all these conversations are what's gonna come up when we present exactly so it's really good that we get it's good that we're having them but how are we gonna present okay you're right I I enjoy all these conversations we're not gonna solve them in their conversations we need to have with both communities and to facilitate those conversations we need to provide facts some information on you know because one of the things this this report does do is it's longed and I think I said I tried to say this last time I probably didn't do a good job of it but this report really talks about these buildings as you know when it talks about the fixing them it talks about fixing them for a 30 you know for another generation lifespan versus like what I said replace everything those detailed costs are they are in here they're hard to find but they are so if someone if we just give some like low moderate high ratings here and if someone really wants to dig deeper yes it's one group of consultants interpretation but at this point that's it's decent it's what we have and it's you've verified it to be you know close in the ballpark so they they can dig deeper so in here I think we need to keep it super simple like short-term costs long-term costs and a sustainability index low moderate high you know bondability how close I don't think it's where there is a word but I don't know well I wrote in my mind here equalize her pupil link how that impacts our penalty well close to a red flag important for the communities to see under the penalty maybe it's not maybe we haven't read that right right who knows who knows how emotional it is you know to whatever keep your little school you don't know really right yeah we don't but I so that would give us three columns I'm sorry go ahead you were saying no I I did have a parent say to me though I said well if we surveyed people the feedback was don't just give us like our our one description with no information I don't think they want to line line item but they just felt like the last time there was a survey done it just was too simplified too simplified and it was yes or no and they kind of wanted a little bit do you want kids in town yes right I guess that's what I know that's what it sounded like it was so I think these columns so we have three okay so yeah there any of these that we would eliminate right I have to well but we were saying tonight there might be some that but I do agree if we don't say it to everybody then there will be a portion of the voters who say well you didn't look at what I'm passionate about you give them eight choices we have here and that just also shows that we're really thinking about everybody and trying to right I mean I think it's I think it's okay not to put a ton of work into fleshing out a lot of a lot of options like I you know I didn't get a chance to go and average some tuitions but I think the closing on closing all the schools we just need to ballpark that I don't think we need to really show you know a detailed because that's not what people want I mean of the when we when we merge these two these two towns together you know the biggest thing people that are at least that I got was that we wanted to have us a school in each town and so I think that you know that's where we should be starting and working from and you know and going from there and some of the I think some of the the outlier ideas we should be addressing just to show we're complete versus right like I don't think we're gonna build it I don't think we're to build a $30,000 my catcher would love to sell us those three acres that straddle the stock for July I really thought about this on my commute where would it be I know I just said don't go down the rabbit hole but a new building because I'm driving and I'm like playing here it looks like it's all me when they were going building this high school they were also building the Bethel High School at the same time and they were building which is what the 70s all of our buildings were in the 70s all of them like in all of our towns and there was talk about doing one central school right around where advanced animations and I was gonna say it wasn't up on the hill up here right and and very well do you do okay and Marvin so I just thought that's interesting that you know here here we are everybody consolidating so if you were sitting in the audience if we were sitting in the audience and we were looking at these list of eight things and we were trying to decide which ones aren't worth pursuing anymore what would we want to have over here in this column to help us make that decision we've got short-term costs long-term costs variability what would we what would we be sitting there thinking I could answer this question better if I knew should we make a column that speaks to community or is that already I don't think they can quantify that there's a one person's community is another person's idea but I think it's these these these all speak to that anyway that it's threshold that I don't know can we generalize or do you want to get right down into the tuition part for that one to wish close everybody up in tuition right I think unless I can see people particularly old grumpy retired people saying nobody's just got to be an option right I think the best way probably to do that to me and would be to take all of the schools which our youngsters attend right average those out and multiply it by the actual kids there's 200 students pre-k through 12 right about 200 because we have more high school kids oh but you know where we're gonna get we're gonna have to get another fact is most of we don't tuition any elementary kids and the elementary tuitions are typically less than the high school tuition 16 for elementary 18,000 no we don't tuition any elementary kids out like we don't know but it's a number of kids 200 kids yeah right pre-k through 12 elementary is about 16,000 little high okay secondary is 18,000 the average is 17 right so so 200 times 17,000 is about 3 million 400 a year I mean that's raw and what's the budget now 44 million big money and it would mean a kids you would lose the keep in mind keep in mind that there's there's a revenues that are that are built into there in terms of small schools grants revenue that that would be lost right which is gonna be gone in five years anyway you're still gonna know you're still gonna go away until they until they take it out even knocking them down wait so house here amazing story just within this whole conversation you know one thing that the state should be more responsible for for helping is to give a better picture of how the state recognizes that if climate change is real and we have people all over the United States giving up and they're gonna move someplace all of a sudden we have a population explosion in the state of Vermont not here never here well that does speak to the flexibility right of we do need to be flexible on both ends we need to be prepared for a population drop we need to be prepared for a population swing I do have to I understand what you're saying Mike my sister is around 30 she are your kids about that age on did they have a large population in there tons it was a huge population that age group so that age group is starting to have babies now baby boomers grandchildren so are we going to see that I don't know we might not but it's something that people are having children yes but that was a larger group so we might average back out to the normal so flexibility I think is important we need to have not no powers that were variability is that I write the wrong word flexibility it used to be a once when a lot of people moved here because of education to Vermont it could be that the next move to Vermont is good because it's environmentally safer than a lot of other places it's just it's just a fact that Vermont's sitting in a sweet spot in the climate arrangement there's no jobs the business manager in the district that I live in just put out the Vermont population projections and they went through a very detailed explanation of how they got them for Washington County every a child bearing age group is dropping significantly over the next 12 to 14 15 20 years according to their projections I don't know that something won't change but at this point that's what they're saying the possibility is what is 10 more kids let me finish sorry Mason and I was there when there was a lot of issues with mass and what I'm seeing in Vermont is going down the same way that happens the other on that yeah no offense great idea Mason but I think we need to prepare for more lower it's a national trend it's a national right it's a national trend but especially in rural County only one environmentally friendly places the government should out especially a lot of locals yeah a lot in Stockbridge where it's kind of become a runoff of like killing 10 where there's a larger thing right yeah so we have three columns are we thinking we need another one do we want to use this document I think we should start filling this document in and if we find we need another column let's add it I think that's not I think we're getting we're starting to get to to kind of pick you so but I think I think putting starting to complete this and and I don't know whether we want to try to do it as a shared document or whether we want to send information to someone to to compile so we can be looking at it and thinking about where we're at my fourth was about that I keep hearing about the penalty like I think it's a valid point I think for some people it's a really big deal of whether we're over the threshold and I think it is in Stockbridge right and some people it's not yeah I mean they know in Stockbridge but if you have to if you figure out that you're gonna have to take a bond out for them I figure that's part of our bondability though right so that's why I kind of didn't know if you do it for every single I don't know maybe you can't but I think we got it put it in there put it in there we're conscious and it's not even bondability but if you're all the sudden putting $150,000 every single year into the budget for buildings yeah building on a short and that's on a small side that takes away some opportunities I feel willing to avoid going over the threshold I'd be willing to call Terra and see if we can get a handle on what we would put in this company right like if the relative cost was 3.6 million over 30 years what's that in principle what's that interest all we could do is add it to this year's budget because we don't know what next year's but there could be less revenues there could be more expenses it'll be a different place what happens if the kids if the numbers shrink even more and then we're forced to not have schools anymore we still obviously have to pay that bond so is it still 40 60 I mean is that it'll be forever like I don't know what the details are on you know 5 million on one building and in you know 500,000 on the other that's gonna be a tough pill for one town to swallow right but that's that's I think that's figuring out you know how bonds work I think it's something important no it is absolutely it absolutely is what happens to that like right Sunpounds have defaulted because they've just run out of money they are not necessarily in Vermont but there's been some small towns in Massachusetts the Connecticut well I mean I mean one of the one of the things is you know the way that act 46 is structured if if the town of Rochester or the town of Stockbridge agreed that one of their those schools should be closed you know that town then has the option to get that building for a dollar and yet the town tries to sell that building all of the improvements done within the previous five years the town has to pay back to the school district right but be it but you know the big question would be if you know if there's a big bond to do a lot of work on either our building or your building or any building in this district and then the building you know if the bond if the bond is unbalanced and the building is turned over to the town is that equitable so I don't know I don't know who you could bond if you know if the assets if the assets are in two different towns if the bonds did are the bonds assessed across the district or the bonds assessed by the town that's a bigger and I think yeah I think is I think as we move forward those are all questions we're gonna have to figure out if you think about if our taxes if the town and you did budgets all day can you imagine adding that payment into your budget it's right I deal with them right so you know so there goes the salt there goes the sand there goes see in that new truck and that brings us back because when we sit in a town if the school budget pays for it it comes out of your left pocket and if the town pays for it it comes out of your right pocket it's but it all comes out of art the town exactly right and that's bringing us back again to at some point I think the question will be asked in both communities what is it that we can afford we want to educate our young well to that but it's people's ability to pay and I I said in the beginning of our first meeting that I've tried form these two questions that I try and keep in my thinking as I'm doing this work and that is how do we educate our youngsters as well as we possibly can at a cost that our communities can afford back to what was contentious at the beginning of this meeting I think one of the things that I was thinking about or asking to maybe be put on the table is the idea that if it became impossible or the state mandated that's that say one of the communities if you know if it was Stockbridge didn't have what they weren't allowed to continue to try to make it work would it be preferable to at least be able to go to Rochester versus having to go somewhere completely outside of yep you know it's an option but it's an option for all but then we're going to put five million dollars in a building in Rochester and who knows that that goes up and then we're paying a five million dollar bond in Rochester see I think so I think that's gotta I think that's the laundry we're caught it's a big decision right and I hope that everybody understands that we've got to take care of our we've got to take and help but we can't we can't use one another no we can help each other but we can't be used by each other right and I think so a bonding question is important to know right to be able to put in footnotes like this is what it looks like under act 46 now because it is something different that we never crossed right I will tackle getting that information if Rochester wants to do that more power to him and then when they have this fabulous school maybe our kids will choose to go to Rochester right so we could that that's something we all should let us go let us go and make the choice to send our kids to Rochester but again that's not in the Bailey no but maybe that should be maybe that should be option nine well what option nine is is you're saying option nine on March on merging yeah and then when and then you fix your building you pay for your building and we'll come because we want to come not because we're paying for it because we're forced to pay for it I just don't think to me and that's within our charge I know what you really the elephant in the room right because you have more votes than we do right and maybe that involves the state I mean it's not like we can get together and say yeah but let's oh well no it didn't there's I've already looked into it I know how we can do it but you've got a lot of skull you've got to let us free vote why would you do it because I'm gonna just bring us back here cuz no I really want this answer before I leave I don't know that there is one I think it needs to be addressed what is the question my question is why wouldn't what as one of our options let us go let's stock bridge out of the merge and see what the financial implications from that because honestly that was you you want yes because well because little grants would go away which is how much is that 200 and a couple hundred thousand but 50 50 schools in the state have decided not to merge why I mean there's reasons there's reasons but think about that some of the reasons are like you know but there's no there's no one next to Sharon for Sharon to merge with for example there's a lot of states because they can't so they lost their small schools grant and they're okay with that and they're doing fun I mean two hundred thousand dollars a year that's what so it'd be a hundred thousand for each town no I'm not sure the exact what the exact split is but that's what I thought it was sixty eight thousand but I'll tell you what sixty eight thousand for Stockwoods is a lot cheaper than paying a bond payment for building in your town and and I think like you're talking about that is a conversation that the town it's that population as it's dwindling the towns have to decide what it's gonna be exactly for them and to be ready that should it get so low what does the town want to do do they want to to break away well with forty four kids in our town right now do we want a five million dollar expense well we don't know if we went there though sure that's the same question does Rochester for ninety nine kids or whatever it is do they want to have well that's right that's right that's exactly right but at least it's in your town so we don't know I think we're jumping to the the conclusion that the way the bonds work is that it's gonna be bonded to the district and you know not and not to the town and that the the unbalance is going to be a five million dollar bond or a four point seven million dollar bond for Rochester and a one point one million dollar bond because yeah we could throw another million dollars into whatever we wanted to do with Stockwoods put solar on the roof put massage rooms in and that still wouldn't get to that sixty forty split so certainly I understand that what wait whoa whoa what do you mean by the sixty what is the general just the general the general idea that that the balance of things is around sixty forty before the towns I'm recognizing that this report talks about in general to get the buildings to quote suggested somewhere you're around four point seven million dollars for either one of these two buildings and then you're one point one million dollars for the Stockbridge building so you're not you don't have that same sort of equity that you do in terms of student count in terms of population you know what that is doesn't matter sixty forty no what it would be with the one million and the four million it's like eighty one eighteen eighty two percent but what I'm saying is would run if that that should be an option that we discuss because every person that I've talked to in Stockbridge has said why would we do that it's a price tag too yeah and the answer is we're stuck and they're like we can add as an option but I don't think the answer is we're stuck I think that's that's jumping to a lot of stuff I don't know I mean would they get look I mean would would Rochester let us go I would I don't know what they would I don't know I appreciate that yeah I really do because I'm not like people don't want to be part of be together right then I didn't find but I want the majority unmerged we're gonna put this as an option I think we should figure out financially do you mean unmerged as a district I understand that I'm sorry clarify unmerged and Stockbridge goes to school twice like so now like it's a but it changes the financial yeah dollar amount yeah I think that would have to be discussed that way unmerge and and shut the school down unmerge and keep and keep the school yeah two different yeah but I truly don't think we can that we would I don't think everyone would agree with you Amy I think the important piece we'd want to know if we unmerged was would be could either school operate at all unmerged right because they might both kick into the penalty and so we were fine before without the 65 that were whatever the school but we're also paying for the debt so the debt is what how much is it a year 65,000 your debt 60,000 in the small schools grants what 65 so it's kind of what you received um 158 from we had came in with 158 and you guys came with 68 I might be a little bit wrong with those numbers right pretty close right and so we put them together so we could right in our town also pitched in 9,000 for the private funds I mean we could go back and forth but I'm just saying it should be an option and we can certainly we can certainly put the big thing we need to reach out to is I'm not clear where where the AOE in the state board it's all happening all over the state right but I think we need to understand where where the state board stands in this because I think one of the things that I've had a problem with people in Stockbridge in particular have been saying well you know they're they're they're forgetting that when Rochester voted to become a K6 the the secretary of education said flat out that she didn't care about whether or not we were we were independent or not if Rochester was a K6 she would merges that was you know that was the statement from the Secretary of Education she's not there now she's not well yes the point being yes absolutely the point being though what is the the lay of the land in terms of can we can we do that great questions though sure exactly and I'm saying that that's let's let's let's get that investigated so we know where we're not sitting here saying oh yeah we can you know we can we can always just just unmerge and understanding what the state's gonna let us do and then we can make the decisions sure no right and that way we have the answer no we do and that is a fine thing our town can and your town we all can be educated on what our choices are right not just stone of her packet and say we have to make this decision and these are this is why and then we find out half of them are wrong and that's important to the people in stockings option 9 option 10 Rochester can revisit the issue of becoming an independent school this could solve the issue around either tearing the buildings down or expanding ourselves to be including students from around the world but it would see it's and that's a great idea I don't I do see how we can get some costs on on this other option I'm not sure how we could get costs and I think that's what we are trying to do is not really tell everybody a box of stuff that we can do you know any idea out there let's get some colleges in here let's I'm gonna go back to our cards which is to understand the report and figure out a way to present it these may come up on merging may come up becoming an independent may come up I actually broke it into two Joanne and you know allow Stockbridge students to have school choice and unmerge and I'm saying this I'm like firing you at the same time I think the important thing is to just look at everything and no absolutely I appreciate that very much means that Rochester looks at being independent school or not I'm not sure but I think I think saying you know can we unmerge and you know short of because it may well be that you might be able to break that down to short-term cost I don't know I think that you know putting the choice on the shoe we will find that we can't get the information to accurately represent one of the choices I know but I'm just telling you I am representing everybody but I'm also wearing a stock for chat and when you are looking at this and the money and the future I'm saying that there was a charge which is driven by this document and I'm saying this document doesn't include unbuilding when the merge I wanted included I think I know you do I hear you I hear you I just don't see it in here and it seems to me to be another a package of information something tangential that I'm not if we had a community meeting nine out of ten people would say that I think it's I think I think having the car you know putting the row on the list is a valuable exercise if we can't complete the row we can't complete the cake can't complete the row I you know I think the most important thing art you know we remember that our charge is to understand this document and to unpack that to you know as I said earlier I think one of the biggest points at the during the course of the merger conversation was that both towns were interested in having a a viable elementary school you know a viable elementary campus in their town and that's you know so I think we need to we need to you know keep most of our most of our information on that but yes I think it's important to say that we have all the options right but when you're talking five million dollars then that is definitely something we have to put in the back of our head sure absolutely and I think that I think that I think that understanding how that five million dollars would be raised is an important part of that of that conversation just like understanding what what kind of hoops we would we would be able to jump through you know to to to to to to unmerge is is also part of part of that conversation and both of those facts aren't in this document so we may not get the answer first I think our first charge is to go through that document and break that up and get that reported to the board of the community and then you know it may well be that there's going to be a Montpelier committee community that or Montpelier committee that has to figure out how you know you you're going to interface with the AOE around some of these around some of these questions you know just around the one about building a new school a lot of places seem to be talking about that just because there's rumor that Montpelier is going to bring back new school construction funds and so you know knowing whether that's true or not makes a big difference in whether we whether we build a new school if they give we get 30% or 40% from the state so we have number nine is unmerge yes do we I mean we have to get ready we have to present this in what two weeks we're supposed to go back to the board that was my question we can certainly go back to the board and say you know what here's what we got here's what we don't got you know I think we need to give them what we can have three or a couple community meetings too maybe we can answer the question kind of get into the logistics of how we're going to fill this and then maybe it'll bring out how we're going to be able to then report it when we're ready to report it to the board yes what if you because obviously unmerging is probably going to open a whole ball of questions and like Carl said hoops that the town would need to jump through to do so why not put in another row that says categorize the options on a priority of one through ten what and just for numbers for people to say I'm more interested in this option but if I can't have that this would be my second option oh like as when we're presenting this right right right the community right so it's not like yes or no right right and I think that was the issue with the other questionnaire of the yes or no question it didn't give options for people to say yeah I want my kid in town but I prefer going this way or I prefer driving that way or right I'm okay with having a new building like there wasn't that to actually understand what the community was saying to granular right strongly agree somewhat agree neutral right so but how how are we going to populate I think we all need to populate you know either we make a copy and we share it or we all send comments but I think we need to you know gather our input and then put it together and then try to try to consolidate and see what that looks like right by going through no so I was going to say I'll volunteer to get the bonding information and make some sense out of that okay and also the the the penalty piece we just go with low moderate high for short term well I guess that was my question I wasn't clear whether we were trying to put dollars amount dollar I think maybe we copy transcribe the the general dollar ranges okay for the for the general project costs but I think yeah in terms of maintenance and ongoing we can't do anything more than saying low moderate high but are we gonna are we gonna get the actual expenses from the business office of what we've been spending for fuel and electricity the engineers had that from both buildings when they developed we had to send three years but where did where I don't know where it is in the report I just I would like that is but I didn't see it either I'm just saying they were I don't know if it was for efficiency first I don't know how they use I can ask yeah it would be nice to see like I mean my monthly summary for building over the last three years would be excellent cost analysis in here it was well I don't mean long-term cost I mean like currently what what is the utilities right just just that's it yet yeah well whatever you said to them most of the years right just ask for those back I put it into a spreadsheet right right right right yeah I would like to see that but but any so that doesn't really answer the question I can ask for that and see where it ended up about utilities and into Carl's point about tuition we would have the number of what we you know what we would pay what our budget is now but the tuition isn't it just straight tuition that's the only cost we pay for a choice student right so I mean there's no question about there's no question about getting money grants and all that it is what it is which is right what's the tuition that's an easy number for for clothes all and and opera choice yeah but do we have to build it I was just gonna say what we still have three buildings that we have we have to we have to we have to put that in there there has to be a that would be the long-term because the buildings just don't go that would be huge then I think it's just all the buildings even if you're more calling them and even I would hope that I mean I would think at least our building would have some viable source that we could use it for the town wants to buy it yeah I'm sure that they would okay well that's I mean again that's a conversation we have to have yeah so short term we're gonna do a range based on the report like the dollar for the for the stuff for the stuff we can put and I think we started putting in words and we can fill in ranges we do and we try to you know we see what what numbers we can plug into a sheet so do you want me to send a blank spreadsheet to everyone how do you want to do this I'm perfectly fine sharing a Google doc I don't know how what everyone else is comfortable with with a Google spreadsheet I'm so you're suggesting everybody does it right we were she said she says out of blank spreadsheet and you fill it in and then you send your numbers back and then we kind of aggregate those and we see where we see where you can bring one off that's totally fine yeah but I think we know I think we data to December 3rd we're supposed to be you know we're at least supposed to be trying to talk to the board in some way what if we just thought of our own and then bring it to the next meeting what do we get a lot and what if we give the board this with three columns that are unpopulated and say this is where we're at this is what we're examining right now so that there's no big rush to do it in the three weeks or two right but if we can put some information in we can I mean it I think it'd be good to but whose information do we pick and how do we it's gonna take a meeting that's the way I said use the numbers that are in the book that's the question are we going through numbers they may be wrong we can say they may they're probably like we have we have a number we paid for it might as well right well again as carol went through though and yeah I know stuff I think he can explain that I think but I think it's like are we always reading out stuff he thought right so are we reading out stuff to that's what I'm wondering are we gonna sit down and go line by line like well we don't really need to do of the drinking falcons thing but let me say this we weren't charged with taking anything out of the report we were charged with presenting the report actually the task becomes easier if we don't take anything you just take the number we just say here's what they said we can decide let's say we by a miracle end up being number three we can decide at that point what stays what goes but if if Carl picks one set of things to take out and I pick another set of things to take out then we're comparing right or you're saying we're just gonna aggregate them and we'll have an average because if I read this right we can pick our numbers right out of these totals that are at the bottom of each building the only the only problem we've had with that is we've identified some of the numbers like renovating a shop space as being as being unnecessary the Rochester numbers the Rochester numbers for example talk about putting external expansions on and not repurposing a gym so it becomes hard to just say let's just take them all out of the book without trying to do some common sense editing on the other hand the common sense editing becomes a matter of apples orange papaya and you can be celery but you know we so we either can just pick them through it and put them all in or we can just you know just take them straight from the report we can do whatever from the port was like with with a list I think that this is what you're saying is it says leave as is this is a number and what that represents is a leg of foot no yeah yeah it does right it rubber it including if it represents of the thing in the shop it's the number they give it includes it and just say and then just and then put the number next to those crazy things you can just take these out because we recommend or we we were assuming that we don't eat so we all come up with our lists of what maybe come out of that or what edit down yeah I think we could present this very blank thing right now to the board yeah I'm sorry all these options came up in conversation after everybody at the table read the report so this is now what we were trying to fill in and in and we're working to fill it in do you have any feedback right you know would you like us to continue in that direction and then that way there's no punch to try and meet before the holiday you know I don't know we can meet before the holiday we can we could submit that we had information right that we could submit it if you're more comfortable saying low medium and high you know I think we could all go through the exercise and then come back to the table and I think the other thing we do is we just make our collective best guess and we present it to the first community and we'll get feedback on how good a job we did or didn't do we'll find out and you're saying your best guess being similar to what Carl did going through and kind of we don't really need to do that pulling stuff out not necessarily taking their numbers or are you talking about taking their numbers well initially I was talking about taking their numbers because I had forgotten about the shop and then there's a new gym out there that I don't think any of us need to be there so the only thing so we should probably I hate to do this but you've made a stab at it do you think that's something you can keep going on or you can send me feedback and I put because I'll take out different things and he'll take out well but that's what we're going to come to the table and talk about okay well let's go one step away from Rochester school as we're going down I took out this oh well you'd really need that because we have to do it okay I didn't realize that that's that's what we do when we've got two options on the table okay not what we do and we have to say I'm just afraid I mean it's going to be said for what you did yeah but I think for everybody to for all theapolis Norges to try to do that so we just take their numbers and we put it here then this committee essentially is done and then the next step is going to be no we have to present it to the communities okay if I have to present these numbers to the community how we got right on and to the board but then then is the next step going to be another committee could be of the same people to then go through on this detailed plane and say okay well the two towns totally took these four options off we're not even gonna look at them so so we're going to then really go down line by line and see what needs to be sure someone to say here's the guidance for the project now it's going to be you know drill into doing x y or z and put together a more detailed proposal for this building or that building or stock bridge or what a lot of lines we need to make some decisions need to be made right and that's all we're supposed to make some decisions can you help us move forward right we need to make some decisions but I think you have there's a step in between there's the community meeting but there's also the community feedback not everybody feels comfortable standing up in front of a room and voicing their opinion so how are you going to get community feedback on these options I like the category that like a ranking category yeah that's that's a great choice but then you got to have a step of what you've got to present back to the community what came from that information before you pursue another twice because then you're or not another choice but you're pursuing before you take a next step see you guys are kind of wrapping up and there isn't another public comment but I just wanted to kind of bring to the attention that a year and a half ago we voted on this merger because a there was going to be good educational opportunities for kids yeah be the communities really want to keep their k through six in their towns and see it was going to be affordable because the state wasn't going to let us operate without merging without astronomical penalties right and tax implications so it's only a year and a half ago our communities decided on this so just keep that in mind that's that's what they wanted and this is I think that's the direction they're assuming we're going to try to keep it right just bottom line I think you're right now we're talking five million dollars if you're hearing what things that were being said tonight it would be what did I vote on yeah you're going to go full choice are you kidding no no I don't know I promise again good district thank you cricket thank you thank you cricket we want to be a part of not to send our little kids anywhere right right just got to keep that in mind and then I think you're going to confuse the voters when you start muddying the waters I think all these options are great and they definitely are going to be asked about need to be considered but just keep in mind we just started this we're only a year and a half can we at least give it the five years before they really start looking at these crazy unmerges and choices and all-in-one buildings nobody nobody is expecting that within a year well yeah when the stock was certainly didn't expect the comments about closing stock for a gentleman or jumping breeze so can somebody some lines where we are I think where we are as we've decided on the spreadsheet format we've added our ninth option about the unmerged choice we've defined columns that we're going to try to think about and put rankings together for I will happily collate them if people want to send me their feedback and then we're going to have something that I'm going to try to distribute at least a few days before that December 3rd meeting where we're supposed to be talking to the board so we can look at whatever one seems to have said and what sort of document we've we've put put together and we give that to the board and we see you know we see where where the next steps are and I'm going to get for this committee not the board but for this committee I'm going to get information on bonding correct I think we created that word bond ability and I'm also going to get information on the threshold and when we kick into the penalty and sure what about what about the additional information about the emerging because I think that's reaching out to the state I can either be okay I don't care let's talk because I'm not sure where we would start all right you and I can do that yeah we can figure that out yep start by and I'll send out what you wanted to dance if I understand this what you want is everybody to make the kind of their best past through this doing what you did day you don't you don't have to do the numbers if you don't feel comfortable going through the numbers and you can just say use the program numbers or use the you know the engineers numbers but I would like it Lindsay can send out or Lindy Lindy you're good if you can send out the final version of this it's got the cop the appropriate column headers and the appropriate nine choices and then we can all come if we can all complete them and get that back to me and if we get it by by the weekend before Thanksgiving and then we're gonna come back together as a committee and talk about what I was gonna send it send out as a summary because we'd be hard to come back together before the third well that's I guess that's my question because we can be presenting I feel uncomfortable with the concept that we would present aggregated information without meeting together again to discuss it to the board I would feel more comfortable with saying this is where we're at and it's blank right now but everybody's working on filling it out and we're still gonna come back together with one more time could we present to the board in January and not December I can't remember was there's I like it's the least try to do we we said we presented some releases try to say something let's aggro before we decided the aggregated data isn't gonna make sense or is it the budget I don't know they don't think so no the only deadlines or deadlines that we've imposed on ourselves to be able to make a decision so that not so that we have time to do any changes on if there was going to be any movement of children in like if if we're going to eliminate the use of one of the buildings how we can reconfigure and have time to reconfigure that to be able to adapt the kids I know what the other reason was the other reason was so that let's say we get it narrowed down to three and we decide we need to ask the board for $14,000 to further explore those three we wanted to be able to do that in a timeline that fit with the budget or although our budget can be a minute