Hello everyone, welcome to success stories with Shankaraya's Academy. Today we have with us Ms. Karishma Nair who has successfully cleared this year's UPSC civil service examination with an all India rank of 14. First and foremost Karishma, hearty congratulations from the entire Shankaraya's Academy family. Thank you, thank you so much Arjun. Yeah, so my first question is like how did you know, as I ask everyone, how did you know the results and what was your initial feelings when you saw your name in that holy pdf and that too all India rank 14. How did you feel? So I didn't see my name in the holy pdf. Last year when I didn't clear, this time I told a friend of mine to call me and tell me whatever the result is because I couldn't scroll through one pdf again. So I was in the car, I was dropping my mother and I was getting calls but I didn't pick up because I was driving and I put the car aside and then I checked my phone and I was getting congratulations. So I was like okay I've cleared the exam because I knew my paper went better than last time so I was expecting to clear some rank. But then one friend messaged rank 14 and he called me and he said oh you've not checked and I said okay please don't joke with me right now 14 is not happening and then again I checked the pdf, then I called my father and he was like I went and I hugged my mother on the road and I called my father and he's like yeah congratulations. Then he called me and I said should I tell people? So because it was just very surprising. So the initial stage was full shock. The first 5 people who called me I asked them have you checked the result because I was still very very shocked at the result and then relieved that I don't have to write the exam again. Very true. How do you feel now? Almost 2-3 weeks have passed since the results. Has it all sunk in? How do you feel now? Yeah now it's more of relief like then I saw the brilliance paper and then I was more relieved. So yeah I think now it's a little bit of happiness, a little bit of excitement for the future that okay I get to do a lot of work and also I'm now reached that stage wherein the shock has moved out a little like now it's sinking in. Celebrations have slowly started. Yes yes that it has. Okay now tell us something about your family. You're born and brought up in Mumbai right? I was born in Kerala but brought up in Mumbai. So tell us about your family and their support and their preparation journey. So my family I have an older sister and my parents. So support I do not think I would give this attempt also without them. So initially they were very surprised with the result last year because everyone was expecting, I was expecting myself to clear last year. So when it didn't happen they were there throughout and this year because of COVID I was preparing from home.  My sister has like she's constantly been very supportive so she keeps telling me that okay this is very motivating and very inspiring what you're doing so keep at it. And so if I feel frustrated I do call her and talk to her and yeah so I think family is something that has kept me at this process throughout and it also kept me grounded throughout so I think it like yeah all of the credit goes to them. I was just a conduit to get this. As equally. A little bit more maybe because all the stress made me a mean daughter at times a bad sister at times but they took all of it yeah. That's great. So now let's talk about your preparation journey. So you completed BSE in forensic science and then 22 you started writing the exam. First attempt itself you went in the interview missed it by a few marks and in the second attempt all in their rank 14. This is something which is inspirational for a lot of young aspirants who are in the college or have just started the preparation. Like we tell a lot of stories about how people are clearing in the fourth fifth attempt how UPSC is a life five year plan or all these things. But your story is different like you started pretty early so you how did it all start like when did you actually think about UPSC preparation. When you do actually start the preparation you know tell us more about your preparations. So I wanted to start young. I was when I was in grad when I was in the second year of college I was thinking whether I should do my masters after this or prepare for civil services. I knew I wanted to do civil services it's an end goal. So then I thought let's not divert myself at the masters now just for the sake of it. So I knew I wanted to start young because I had that zeal in the beginning and I was only not confident that I'll have it throughout. So I wanted to start young. In my second year of college I started going for a foundation course in Bombay. It was a weekend class for two hours. So the reason I joined that was I was planning to go to Delhi for preparation and I wanted to know is it something I can do. Is it my cup of tea should I ditch the idea of doing a masters and move cities and do that. So I did that for a year. But then third year I stopped entirely I focused more on college and a few extra curriculars. Then proper preparation started in 2018 I went to Delhi. I couldn't write the exam that year because I was not 21 as of August. So I had to wait for that year. So then I took that year and I went for coaching in Delhi and then I gave the first attempt from Delhi. Then as I already told I was I was very I enjoyed the preparation in the beginning and which is why I was very confident the first time around. And then when it didn't happen the first time then I truly started understanding the exam. So the first time it was more of oh I can do this and the second time it was more of okay let's see what I can change to do this. So I think the journey has been shot. Thankfully I'm very grateful because I know a lot of people. So this exam is such I really want to mention it here that like I want to stress on the fact that it doesn't mean that because now we got success at a younger age. We are any better than people who are doing it for five times. So this exam is a little unpredictable in the kind of efforts you put in the kind of result you have a lot of things have to align together. It has it depends on how you have done in a paper on how your competitors have done on the in the paper. And also the fact that it's a year long exam takes a toll on on everyone right. So a lot of things aligned together for this to happen. So if you ask me what I did right I think I kept at it throughout. And I so this attempt I was just like okay I'll I'll honestly assess myself what I could do better and I tried and did all of that. And if I didn't make it this year I was not planning to give an attempt this year. I thought I'll do a masters and do it later because I was also even though it was short you say it's over but two years are pretty long as well two to three years. So yeah I'm actually very grateful that it has ended relatively quickly.  Now let's come to some specific preparation related questions. So first regarding problems. So you are someone who cleared the problems and mains in the first attempt. So again as I told you would have you would have done something correct which made you clear problems in the first attempt itself. So what all you did for the problems again second attempt also you cleared so back to back two problems you cleared. What all you did right you know which made you clear these two problems back to back. So during my first year of preparation I was very sure that I have to make current affairs not a burden for me. So I ensured that I was doing current affairs year long. So in the first attempt that gave me a lot of confidence that I will not be boggled by how much I have to study in the last two months. So current affairs was something that I had a strong hold on the first time around. Then for prelims specifically I did a lot of mock papers and I didn't do it from one institute. I took it I took the help of multiple question papers and I kept looking at how I was scoring. What are the subjects in which I was scoring and I developed my own strategy of attempting the paper. So that is something the last two months before prelims I was only doing revision and giving tests and re-strategizing according to those tests. So for prelims I think if you are sincerely preparing for a year and the last two months are giving for prelims. Again this is something that was for the previous pattern. This year's prelims I do not know if my strategy will work. But if you get the static part right and then current affairs do it on a daily basis and cumulatively. Keep revising what you studied 3-4 months ago as well. So that way I think prelims prep can be streamlined. So for prelims why preparation is important is not that what you prepare will come in the exam. You have to be confident to attempt questions that you haven't studied before. That is what prelims is that game to like attempt questions that you have no idea about. Because even the best of people who are preparing for so many years they do not know more than 40 to 50 questions. And this is something that everyone comes and tells you and I am repeating it because it's that true. So yeah the preparation will help you to go with the right mindset for prelims here. Okay so now let's come to CSAT which is actually getting tougher every year. This year I think CSAT was tougher than 2019 so people are panicking about CSAT. So what all you did for CSAT preparation? Was CSAT an easy paper for you or was it a nightmare? Like lot of people have nightmares about CSAT so how did you prepare for CSAT? So the first time around it was very easy for me. I did not prepare CSAT at all. But like you mentioned last year what happened after my first paper I was very sure I am not clearing the exam. So those two hours in between I was in another mode I was thinking what to do for the next attempt. So then my small match problems I was like doing a lot of calculation mistakes. And I think the English in UPSC is not something I attempt. Because even though I think English is decent I don't take chance with UPSC's English. So all in all last year's CSAT I attempted only 40 questions. But luckily most of them were right so then I cleared CSAT. So I took it very casually both attempts I took CSAT casually first time around. It worked for me because it was not that tougher paper. Last time also it was not like very tough as I didn't see this year's paper but I've heard that it is tough. But yeah if math and reasoning is something that bothers you I think you should give very, like you should give substantial amount of your time to CSAT because there are many people who score well in GS. But do not do so in CSAT and it's painful to not clear the exam because of CSAT. So previous year question papers now 2019 and this year's paper will be the template. Like don't follow 2014-15 CSAT because again the standard has changed. So use the new pattern and then keep solving keep yourself abreast with the math problems and the tips and tricks that you can find. Use the internet extensively. I think there are many YouTube videos which will tell you how to solve all these reasoning and all of that. So yeah give a lot of importance to CSAT if you find that this is something that might stop you from clearing problems. Great advice. Now let's come to mains. You have given two mains like back to back and again even though you went till the interview last year your mains mark has improved this year in general studies as well as public administration option. So what all you did right in general studies so that you can improve your scores as you compare first mains and second mains. Okay this is the question which I wholeheartedly want to answer because I think I can help somewhere. So in mains last year the result came around 4th of August. So after my interview which was in March to August I did not study anything because I was very confident I am clearing the exam plus I just got home because of COVID and all of that. So it is a lot of chilling. But then when the result came I started panicking because I did not do anything different. How will my mains be any different. So even though in two months there was prilims I was studying a lot for prilims. My entire mind was on mains because I knew that okay mains is something that I have not gotten enough marks in. So in that two months while I was preparing for prilims I ensured that I had enough sources accumulated. So for public administration I searched for blogs like Lohit Matani sir has a blog which I religiously followed. Then there was an IWA channel which is also by a former IS officer. So all of these channels which are openly available I found all of these sources ready. The second thing that I did is I ensured that this time I will not take anything lightly in the syllabus. So the first time around I did not have notes, mains specific notes at all. I would read okay GS2 I know this I know this I know this. I was very overconfident that I can write something or the other. But this time if there was something in the syllabus I had something or the other written about it. And how I made these notes were I used the internet extensively. I would copy paste this the like I would I had a syllabus I copy pasted it put it on Google and I just ran a Google search. Whatever 5-6 links I got I read all of that and then I accumulated my own notes. I also followed a lot of toppers notes they have uploaded a lot of them and which is what I am trying to do also. I am trying to upload my notes so that it helps others. So make your own notes for mains. It will really help you for two things. First of all you will start streamlining your preparation based on the syllabus. And also you start making points and you start making schematics while making notes. So that will also help you in your presentation of the in the real paper as well. And lastly it will help you in revision. So because I made all my notes between the time of prelims and mains I cannot tell you to read it 8-9 times. Because I myself have not gotten the time to do so. I revised my notes 2-3 times but because I made them on my own I remembered most of it. So I think covering every part of the syllabus and making notes and also keep value adding. Like I keep giving this example about cyber crimes which came as a question last year in GS3. So I read somewhere that you should use a 4-D approach that you deter, you detect, you destroy and document in cyber crime. So and this is the last question I attempted and I just wrote it in the conclusion as a schematic. So even though I don't know if I got marks because of that I got out of the exam hall very confidently. Something I studied has come in the exam. So I think that is something that you should work on the syllabus and that. In optional I think we will address the public administration part of it a little later. But for GS I think this is what I followed. Use the internet properly and make notes and try and revise the notes as much and I forgot. Keep giving marks okay. Because when you give marks the 20 questions that you attempt you have to increase the consistency of the quality of your answers. So that keep giving marks as well. Now two papers which people find a little bit not difficult. They are confused about how to tackle in the mains is one is essay paper and the other one is ethics paper. Like there is no set strategy, different people advise different things. So what, how did you tackle these two papers essay and ethics specifically? So first I will come to ethics. I scored the same marks last year and this year. But this year it was decent marks last year it was an average mark. So what I changed this time is last time I did not have examples prepared. Again the same thing I did for GS 1 2 3. I copy pasted every topic. I read a few standard books but I didn't rely only on standard books. I had my own notes for it. I used toppers. There are very good notes available. Like Rishikesh Reddy Sir's notes are available on the internet. I used them extensively and I gave a lot of examples. So I worked on my examples a lot. I collected them from toppers answer copies. I also collected them from the newspaper as much as possible. And even if the question did not specifically ask for an example. I tried to incorporate an example in all my answers. And even I tried to write as many ethics answers as I could. Because I felt that last year I was like hey I am an ethical person. But this time I was like no I need to be a person who can write something which is good for ethics. So writing is very important and that is something which will improve your ethics scores. Coming to essay. I remember when I used to prepare. I used to watch toppers strategy video for essay. And I read one YouTube comment section saying that every time I look at a video. I hope that someone will tell something magical which will improve my essay. But I am always disappointed. So I am going to disappoint you all again. Because there is no magical thing for an essay. You have to like develop the essay writing by practice. One thing you can do is find out all the previous year questions of essays. There are a few questions that are repeated. Try and get content for that. And have a framework. For the philosophical essay one thing I can suggest is.  We try and prove a sentence through examples. Like if they are something about kindness. We will give examples about Gandhiji or Mother Teresa. But just giving examples and elaborating on an example is not what an ethical essay should be about. So try and question the premise of the topic. And answer those questions in different paragraphs. So don't give a social, political, economical angle in everything. Try and be more innovative in how we are addressing a philosophical essay. I think that will help you in your general writing of essay as well. So if that helps I think it might improve your essay. I think very valid. Not many people actually speak about how to write philosophical essays. Because content-driven essays you can write. You know, this is social, political. Philosophical essays people do find difficult to write. I am sure somewhere it should be magical. I hope so. Now let's come to optionals. So after BSE in foreign science you chose public administration. Public administration is an optional which people are confused whether they should take. Because there are ups and downs. It was a highly performing optional. Then they started making the question papers very difficult. So it started declining. Then again in all India rank one. And ups and downs are there. So people are actually confused whether to take public administration as an optional or not. But you chose public administration. Two attempts and you did fairly well in both attempts. So why public administration? So when I was looking for which optional to take. My reason was that I didn't want to do something. In which I'll have a lot of people who have done their bachelors or their masters in that as well. So I thought public administration most of us will be new to it. I read the syllabus I found it interesting. And I thought that it is something that if I put in the efforts I can like get marks. By actually to be honest I did not check the trends. So had I known that this was a trend maybe I would have like not thought of it. But I chose it because I read the syllabus I saw a few questions. And I also thought that okay this is something that is doable. Secondly then I also saw that it had an interlap with GS2 with GS4. That is something that has in the first attempted backfire. Because I was so over confident I was like I don't need to study GS2. And then I bombed the GS2 paper. But this year I put that effort in both public administration and GS2. So the reason I chose it with these. And also you get a lot of material but how to utilize that. That is something that I think was lacking on in my part last year. Which I tried to improve this year like I mentioned I followed these blogs by toppers. And I tried and did the same sources they did. And through some perspective there are a lot of YouTube videos available online. In which they explain every topic. So while having lunch I started watching all of that. So I used my time well in public administration. I gave multiple tests last year as well and this year as well. And I tried to improve my answer writing in public administration. Because it's an arts paper. It will be tough for people with a science background to get the knack of it. I still don't think I have a hold of it entirely. But I think yeah if you complete the syllabus properly. And again make your own notes for public administration. I didn't have a lot of notes last year. But this year I worked a lot on those notes. And try and include anything that you find in the newspapers. Try and include them also in your answers. So if you see my answer copies I might not have done it in all the answers. But I was also learning in the process. So I think by the end of it I try to incorporate more. Another thing I'll address is now the paper has become tricky. In the sense that they are asking simple questions. They are asking GS level questions in paper too. So try and look at that. I thought that my answers are very mediocre. Because I didn't know what's special to write. So now because you know that there is some pattern like that. That they tend to ask GS questions even in optional. So please try and think on those lines that what extra can you add in those points. Like how do you add a public administration perspective. Because you'll have the benefit of a precedent. This has happened earlier. So try and reorient your preparation accordingly. I think that would help. Great. Now like as a person who has given two mains in public administration. What are the do's and don'ts which you can suggest about public administration. For aspirants. So do's first is cover the syllabus. Focus more on, so about focus more. Last year I scored poorly in paper one. I scored decent in paper two. So this year I worked hard on paper one. And now my marks have inverse. So now I've scored well in paper one and not so much in paper two. So the first do would be to give equal importance to paper one and paper two. Don't repeat the mistakes that I have done. Secondly it would be to cover the thinkers unit really well. Because that you can use in other units as well. So get a strong hold on your thinkers and keep revisiting them. Because you tend to forget what they are saying. And have like short crisp notes that you can revise on the go. Thirdly another do would be to give marks. Because the writing style is something that you have to develop. Try and write as many answers as you can. Because public administration as a subject is intuitive. So when you read it you think I know this. But when you sit with pen and paper and try and write. It becomes a little tricky. So keep writing answers and keep writing tests as well in time. So I was someone who couldn't complete my paper last year also. This year also. Last year I left a 15 marker. This year I missed a 10 marker. So finishing the paper also becomes a challenge. So please try and work on that. I don't think I have any do's. Like please work on the do's and I'm not don't. I don't think there is any don't. Don't neglect the optional maybe that is something. And don't neglect the do's maybe. Yeah great don't. Actually I would like to ask a lot of more questions regarding public administration. Me myself being a public administration faculty. But because of time crunch we'll ask lesser questions. And if depending on your availability we would like to do an exclusive webinar maybe. On public administration books you followed etc. Lay on a later date. Yes. Now let's come to the interview. So again two interviews you have attended from UPSC. How was your interview experience. And any interesting questions which you got from UPSC. So the first time around I scored a 160. The second time I scored a 187. Interview experience both times I came out very happy. I thought I've nailed the interview but first time around it didn't work that well. Second time it was a decent score. There were a lot of inter. So the first time it was more of hobbies and a little bit of facts and all of that. This time it was interesting in the sense a little. They asked me some science questions also that if I have a glass and a burner. What are the things that will change in that. Do you push a grass cutter or pull a grass cutter. Which I didn't know the answer to. But yes such questions were there. It was a good experience altogether. And yeah I'm happy that I was able to improve Mark. So I'll really mention that this time I worked a lot on. I had a very strong peer group for interview preparation. And I worked a lot on the discussions and on my DAF. Again so this time note making is my mantra. I made notes on my DAF also. So last time I was like who writes things about themselves. But this time I also had an introduction. My name is Karishma Nair. I am from this place. So that itself was written. And this year I used Evernote extensively in the preparation. So that has changed. So yeah interview experience was good. Even the first time I thought it was good. But turns out it wasn't that great. But yeah this time also it was good. Interesting questions. I don't think I'm that interesting a person maybe. It's not true actually. Yeah so it was a good experience. I enjoy giving the interview at UPS. Yes. Great that you know you happily ended like. Yeah yeah I'm chatting. Now one thing I wanted to ask in the general entire preparation journey is the role of newspapers and Hindu reading. Which actually students find you know it takes a lot of time. Especially those students who are taking classes and all. They have two and a half five hours of class. After that they start reading Hindu which is taking them two hours three hours etc. So they want either shortcuts or they want to know how you can spend lesser time on Hindu. So how did you spend time on newspaper reading and what was your strategy on reading Hindu. So when I first started preparation it took me a lot of time to read Hindu just like everyone else. But I ensured that I gave it the time it needed. I was it was a little hectic I would study a little less also it's fine but I was doing the newspaper because I knew that if it had to be my habit I had to do it regularly every day because in the in the future it will take you less amount of time. Initially I was also making notes from the Hindu for the first four five months of my preparation I had notes from the newspaper but I felt that it was taking a lot of my time but this is also a journey I think when you're starting preparation you have a little bit of time right. So if you start making those mistakes in the initial stages then you will automatically realize ok this part of Hindu I don't need to read because if someone's telling that to you if coaching classes also tell you that and I tell people you can follow that. But initially when you yourself realize ok this is something that is not needed for the exam when you read your old notes you realize hey why have I written this. So that way I think giving especially if you're just starting preparation and you're in college read as much like give as much time as is as it is demanding for the newspaper. Firstly because it is needed for content in the exam secondly even for your writing and all of that and for the perspectives it is important because we are not used to when we are in college my father keeps telling you always a Bombay Times person Masala news and to get from that to a UPSC level writing and UPSC level understanding Hindu is a good transition Indian Express I actually used to read Indian Express only in college but then I switched to Hindu because people scared me if I don't read Hindu you will not hear the exam but both of them are equally good papers and I think you should follow newspaper and the as you mentioned people find shortcuts shortcuts are good if they tell if the coaching classes are telling you these are the headlines you should follow if you are if you don't have the benefit of time you can use that as well but still read the newspaper don't read just summaries because sometimes what happens is they might miss out on something or when you read it you might connect it with something you've already read so it will work as revision as well so newspaper reading is crucial. Now let's come out of the preparation questions and something in general UPSC preparation is a stressful journey you know you have you have to invest a lot of time in the preparation so what are your hobbies what are your hobbies and during the preparation did you get time to pursue any of those hobbies so how did you spend your you know free times during the preparation if at all you got some free time. Yeah so hobbies I enjoyed reading fiction but again I did not follow I did not pursue that during my preparation because I get very invested in books so I have to live with it and cry with it and all of that so I think I couldn't handle that during preparation so during preparation for stress relief I used to watch a lot of YouTube videos like Ted Talks and just and I tried to make them a little educational so it reduces guilt and then I would yeah I didn't I am one of those boring people who didn't have fine I couldn't balance both of it so when I was preparing I was intently doing that and I I was talking to family a lot and that was my stress reliever I didn't follow all the people should because for mental health it is important to have a hobby and I really respect people who can handle both of them but I just was not one of those people who could but it's okay like there is the result speaks more yeah now you have a lot of time to pursue whatever you want to do I hope so I sincerely hope so so as an aspirant who cleared it at a very young age you know what would be your advice to those people who are watching this interview maybe they are in the first year of their preparation or they are planning to write their in their college they are planning to write the exam in the next couple of years what would be your advice to them to clear this exam in maybe as lesser attempts as possible yeah if you are in your college and you know for a fact that this is what you want to do you can start like start young because you have you your interest to learn is higher but I'll tell you something honestly I didn't prepare with the job and that is something that bothered me from time to time because you will see your friends excel after college you will see them getting good paid jobs and you will see yourself being unemployed reading six standard textbook seven standard textbook so it will be a painful journey for you even though you are young and you are still unemployed right so if you think that a backup if you ask me if you need a backup I would say there are days when I prayed I hoped I was like I was cursing myself for not having a backup because if I come and tell you my backup was keep stick to the plan a it was not true there were vulnerable days too but when you're young the benefit you have is there is no like there is no pressure of you're not like starting a family or you still have those years left in you so that's why I think starting young helped me because I didn't have anything to fall back on so the Tina factor which is there is no alternative factor worked for me because I was like hey I don't even have a job I really like public services there but now I'm just sitting at home so that guilt and that fear of like not doing well pushed me again this is all like really negative emotions that pushed me but yeah I think first if you start young don't get boggled by the exam trust yourself and give see this exam I keep telling people it requires two things from your time and effort so respect the exam enough to give it both and at a young age you have the benefit of both of it you have that zeal to give the effort and a little bit of more time because you are not if you're not a working professional you can give it full time so if you're using this benefit don't like we ever in between that is what I would say and there will be moments of self-doubt everyone goes through it but keep at it and if you want don't talk to those friends who are doing well for a bit because later on you can talk to them late so yeah that's it's not even an advice it's just like it's what you did actually yeah it works it works so it is actually a good inspiration for a lot of young aspirants yeah so my final question to you Karishma is we would like we would be happy to hear about your experiences with Shankara's Academy in your appropriation journey so I just came to know that Shankara Academy is who makes the Shankar environment book so I have read the Shankar environment book like everyone else I think it's a good book for the environment part of the syllabus and also I was associated with it for the mock interview and I think it was a good panel and it was a good experience and our sister was one of the panel members and he actually would even after the mock he would like send me content he would be like hey this related to women and they might ask you this so he was someone who didn't leave me after the mock interview so that constant support was there so and even now like I feel that when I've come here also it doesn't feel like a very commercial thing it feels like people are generally caring for the aspirants here so I think my overall experience with Shankar has been good really happy to hear those good kind words from you Karishma and I'm sure that you know seeing the energy level I'm sure that this is going to reflect on ground too as an IS officer and we don't know which cadre you will be getting into hope that you can come to Kerala if not wherever you are I'm sure that you are going to do a great job all the very best for that you know Karishma, Nair, IS we would be happy to hear all the good work you are doing and once again hearty congratulations and thank you so much for the time which is being spent with us. Thank you Shankar IS and thank you Arjun for having me and thank you so much.