Remember where I let there should be tabs for So I'll call the meeting to order it is 7 o'clock We do not have a quorum of the people that were present for the December 12th meeting So we will not be able to do minutes for either that way We do not have the December 19th minutes as of yet, so we'll go pass by the Minutes for tonight and go directly to public comment. This is a time for In mind if anything See no hands You'll go on into the sewer allocation ordinance amendment and Rick or Erica, I'm not sure I actually asked Eric he had done some stuff work on it So he'll kind of present the summary Happy new year everyone Just give a brief summary the memo that was in the board packet tonight. This agenda item is a follow-up to Raise at the December 5th meeting by represented some chess corner asking for the board to consider Mending the sewer allocation ordinance specifically the section that requires Payment for added capacity to be required at the time of zoning or building permit Options for the board to look at tonight would be to take no action and leave the ordinance in its current form Or act to begin the ordinance amendment process by providing staff a direction for possible changes Staff recommendation on this is to keep the ordinance the way it currently is some key points off of that For sewer capacity is purchased by the owner of a development How and if the owner decides to pass allocation costs and any sewer costs on to a building tenant is a private matter That would be discussed between the two parties staff recommends that In this instance and any instance like that. Yeah, that's a question. So it wasn't clear to me in last week when or several weeks ago when Chef's corner presented to us Did the application come from them or from the building's owner It has to be signed by the building's owner, but the it's their business is looking for the capacity and But the capacity is actually You said it's sold. I just heard it's sold and I read it sold to the building. That's right That's correct corner when they have a lease for some number of years But if they left the capacity would stay with us really it's that was gonna be my follow-up So what you paid for your space at Lenny's that stayed there Yeah, we paid Forgive me if I'm asking at a turn. I just wanted to just introduce yourself, please if you'd introduce yourself, please before The Joseph Aaron chef's corner Scott Sorrell chef's corner so can we In the 20 years that we were at Lenny's space We paid 88% of the water bill because Lenny's shoe store that I use much water We paid 63,200 Over the 20 years it was about 3,160 per year we paid that And we're more likely paid the wastewater permit bill too because I'm sure judge put it in the lease Which really wasn't on I don't think on the lease itself So that's always always very gray when you're a tenant because In our new space, we didn't see anything about the wastewater permit But cynical Animal development paid Close to $24,000 for the wastewater permit for our day operation Breakfast lunch breakfast lunch. We wanted to open for dinners. We had pre-meditated that before we opened in august to reopen in in october But then when we applied We were told that the wastewater permit for the extra seats would be between I think was between 12 and 19 thousand dollars Albrecht development was going to help us To get the permits that might answer your question You know Albrecht development is going to guide us towards the permit for us to do nights They did not want to contribute Any donation because they'd already put up front enough for our seating capacity that we have breakfast lunch But again, they were guiding us to apply for the night ones when we were ready at our own cost Which is a bit Tough for us because we're buying this at night for quite a bit of money like Joseph said, you know between 12 to 20 thousand dollars loan loans and At the end of the day, this is going pretty much to the landlord as our understanding of the whole thing Because we were not owners. We wouldn't own it. We wouldn't own that permit. We lost it at Lennie's judge companies So if we buy this night permit They must remember we're cooks. Okay, so we don't understand this language. We don't understand the lingo But we're very frugal. We have to be within a business 20 years So if if the second waste water permit gets bought that's going to be 40 thousand dollars Towards the cost of that plus we're going to have our water bill We've already spent 60 close to 64 thousand dollars on a water bill for 20 years at the other place Now we had to buy a new waste water permit and now they want to pay another one for night time So we're thinking, you know, this is The one thing it says here that the waste water permit is is It's let's see what it says. It's It's it's more of a prediction. It's not really a meter So it's not it's not a meter. That's they predicted it's an industrial I think that was in the minutes industrial prediction of what you pay for it. It's not a fact It's sort of a standard rule or ordinance that they're made Out there.  You don't pay for two You know i'm saying so this for us we as laymen don't understand that language Why we pay industry standards and not actual consumption Can i be on the board and ret can i ask a couple just background questions? absolutely so None of this is transferable, right? So if Lenny is for example if that i use Lenny's just because that's the spot way i'll know If they're not doing anything with that We we don't have there's no none of that's transferable That's a i can't answer that question It's In case Lenny's moves out And judge wants to put a rest on it again. He has to waste water So stays with the bill But hypothetically could Judge you're using the name we're using now sell to Alcensical capacity or no, that's not allowed Or it's just not allowed that So one of the just to make sure i understand One of the decisions you make about whether you want to stay in a particular location One of the factors that goes into it maybe one of the large factors because it involves so much money is The concept of here the allocation has already been secured when you move to that new space The owner of that new space may put a financial Responsibility on to you to help pay for that new allocation We're talking about that it said Would the town want to allow payment over time for building permits and impact fees? That's not what we're asking we're talking about Allowing us without compensation in full so allowing the town compensation up front Here we pay it's done But because maybe they don't trust the tenants that they might not pound to five years and I can understand that The restaurants got a business all the time 70% of restaurants in the nation got out of business in the first five years So but we've been there 20 years. We have a history We're not just coming in yet from out of town and saying you guys want to Negotiate this wastewater permit paid off So that's all you're asking for at this point then Is that you just want to be able to pay it off at any time right? We wanted to do it over 12 months over a year Because the 19 between 12 and 90 thousand dollars for us right now It's very hard because we invested all the half a million dollars in this new place and we have a big back loan So just to pull out 19,000 dollars about our checking account is all the difficult What what are the mechanisms for doing Allowing something like that Or are there none? Well right now there are none and we're generally not in the business of loaning money with a few rare exceptions Stormwater loan program being one of them Should we let eric finish his piece? Maybe ask a couple of questions. Have we ever dealt with this before? Have we ever Had a situation where somebody wanted to pay it off over time and Go ahead That was the most advice the Points I was touching on you know looking for the owner of the development owns that capacity Not the not the tenant and then the other the other piece more of a policy overarching question is By something like this does the town Want to get into the practice of selling an asset for immediate use without payment in full and that's where I Touched on other development costs over time and if some you know This is becomes a policy change could someone then look at those other Pieces that we charge for land use and come with the same request That's okay, but if we didn't pay Wouldn't we lose our allocation? Isn't that fairly simple process right there? We didn't pay. We stopped ending the matter business. We lose all our allocation What happens to your restaurant? Just opens up the night of an unsettling release when they send the u.s. Worker What do you do? You close them down? You sue them? What do you do? We were trying to sponsor the tape that we're asking the town to help us because our history Never missed the bill 20 years And I guess that's where I would be coming back with 20 years that you've got an outstanding business that's bringing a lot of people into wilson They're coming here for lunch. They're coming here to get it's a lot of revenue that's coming through I would think This might be a case where you might want to consider some very high exceptions And I understand your concern. I do for not wanting to start something that that opens this pandora's box But I think when you have something like this that is in a lot of ways many ways unique I don't know that you can sit there and say we've got a lot of other 20 year businesses here And I have to say in full disclosure, I know joseph personally so I I've had the Pleasure of being with him socially and in number of occasions and I can't speak highly enough about his character and who he is And his wife so in some ways, maybe I need to step back, but I also wanted to do full disclosure to the board I think this is something that we as a board need to consider in a town need to consider of Doing something different, especially given 20 years of stellar service to a community I'm liking the idea I can see concerns because it becomes that question of Who gets this for lack of better words benefit and who doesn't so But there has to be a way to cross up Well, I'm thinking when I'm going to ask is it along the lines of do you think where somebody is replacing capacity in having to buy you know The concept you have is your lack of better words, you're replacing existing capacity with new capacity because of Okay, it's the additional piece I'm just what I would hate to get into a situation is where we're starting to have to say Well, we have one person. We think it applies here. You know the ability to pay over time We have another entity come in. I don't know be it retail be it Office be it something else where we're feeling like no, you know, does it apply there? You know, it's kind of that question of who would it apply to How many years you've been in an existing business that's been here for how long that has never had a tax delinquency That's never had a late fee. That's never on and on and on I think you put it so high up there That you know, you've got to reach an incredibly high ceiling in order to be able to even be considered for this I I understand the concern. I wouldn't want to be in a position of seeing all of these businesses Start paying over time. That's not you don't want to be a bank But I think with something like this. I understand what they're asking and why and I I they're not asking it to not pay Yeah, just pay over time Yeah, okay good It's not it's not on the menu So Eric is this an outlay that the town has to make to is it Essex for the capacity? Do we have to We pay, um, well, yes well The capacity that we are selling now we purchased from The town of I'm sorry the village of Essex junctions at ten dollars a gallon And so we're just charging back The same price that we paid to purchase that capacity And that's the same for everybody, right? For instance, the homeowner gets paid the same Or has to pay the same that's correct that same fee as does, you know an office or just based on your proposed usage So this is just the access fee and then the per gallon fees that you get charged with water and that's separate That's a user fee. Basically the kind of the connection we're allowing it's not really a connection But we're allowing them to book this much Capacity and then we will charge them base. Is it like homeowners based on water or it's okay So like three times the water Right, but that's the water bill usually comes with a sewer bill as well, right? Yes, and the storm or businesses as well, right? Yes, okay, all right So there's a there was an article in the observer the last edition of the observer that quoted Somebody from chef's corner is saying that they were going to front the money To pay the bill. Is that correct? If we actually had to I mean You know it would take a lot for us to be talking about it It couldn't be right now I mean we really had the goal as Joseph mentioned in the beginning to open for dinners in october And we couldn't financially do it So we're going to cross that bridge if we have to in the spring um Yeah, and I mean In the spring the other thing is that it's a lifestyle for us too because to open up at night It'll be a different lifestyle a little bit because we're putting in other business in a business So we might just drop it You know, we might say hey, you know, there's just too much money for us. We just don't want to deal with it Right now, you know, it's like it's like Enough is enough sort of on what we're doing with this the chef's corner, you know when we take me to I could I ask a question I'm wondering have you approached the landlord with possibly of loaning, you know how many because they're ultimately going to be owning that So why wouldn't you're paying for it? So why wouldn't they want to loan? They're getting an asset that you're paying for That's the route you think we should do we'll do it I think well It may erupt. I mean, you know my impression, you know al and albert developments fantastic They're great to work with but I understand that he Did our requirements for us in the beginning for breakfast and lunch for 80 seats, whatever exactly it is And to do dinners. He didn't want to touch that with a 10 foot pole. I don't blame him really because that's kind of a a bonus to us You know to use that space at night for more revenue And I really don't think that he would touch that with a 10 foot pole I really don't but it can't like joseph said her to ask and we may consider that option as well I really don't think it would get anywhere, but Whatever the outcome is whatever the outcome is We first appreciate your meetings Secondarily, you can maybe in the future Make a new ordinance for somebody like chef's corner And if the outcome is at the town come work on the side, they would have to go to the landlord and we have to see that route But whatever the outcome is you want it to be positive Whether it's for the future tenants Or some or us whatever it is Can I ask for the for the owner of the property? Do they benefit in some way When you open for dinner in other words, do they make more money? So there is a lease I mean we're drawing business to the complex obviously But there isn't much nighttime business. I don't think so right most places closed But I know that we've businesses increased In several of the businesses there which would mean tall five of business owners Since we've moved in because there's traffic. They're coming us out. There's the one meeting seat So that's a good point. So it could be Drag drag along business For the owner, so okay. I know the Oasis Day spot is going to open on Sundays because us because of us They're going to have open from 10 till 3 Because we Sundays is one of our busiest days So a lot of people come to that spot. It's empty. The rest of the place is closed pretty much except right ads open, except So, you know So going back to rick's point about asking the landlord, there is a vacant space right now that used to be a pizza shop that had some kind of an allocation And they closed and So the question I guess is would the will it would the landlord be willing to assign that amount of water To your facility We heard another piece of that The last question is if we want to go forward with this I think we still have some question at least I have questions in the gallery of How can we could we draft a ordinance that are an ordinance that would Only apply to certain groups of People a number of years of service or whatever. I don't know the answer to that question It would be made responsible for paying it long term Would it be the property owner and what happens if place goes bankrupt and still always money to The town so there's a number of things that I think need to be answered before we can go forward with it I agree with that it I guess a little bit to Eric and rick is Is that something you feel is worth looking into not worth looking into but You'd have the ability you'd be able to come back with Some recommendations Before we ask for recommendations, can I ask from a financial perspective what would be your Suggest and if we were to consider this what would be your suggestion for a payback Time period And let me ask another thing just i'm throwing it out there if if the town were to consider to go forward Would you one consider 10 months? And then would you consider any sort of personal guarantee or bond To for assurances for the town that this is going to get paid All right And I and I ask you that directly because it's something that I want to make sure Eric and rick here so that they understand And I wanted to get it down to like 10 months, but I'd like to see I'd like to see this conversation continue That's my Idea So it sounds like we have Consensus to go forward at least to ask the question was it there? Yeah, I am I think in with a short payback And you know we have to come up with the right wording for a contract And you would have to have your prop probably the property owner agree or maybe like you said some kind of a bond I'm not I think the tenant has to be the bonding one for that because it's not necessarily but anyway That's a different conversation, but it sounds like we have all of us that are agreeing that the conversations move forward Yes, I have two more questions one is when we pay the waste for a permit if we pay it Either through the lab or we'll pay it directly to you. Do we own it? If we had a move to another location, we don't know Okay Should we approach alanbrook this week and talk about our meeting and should we ask him about Putting the money He doesn't hurt you. Yeah, okay So you will move forward in your way and we'll move forward in our way with alanbrook. All right The thing is is even if you do work something out with alanbrook, you've raised an issue that Oh, I get it. We may you know, so he would have to pay you up front and we'd have to pay him back Well, no, I'm also getting at there could be another restaurant that runs into a similar situation Another entity that you know is of value to the town a long-standing A community member that we would want to extend the same to so I think very seldom that will you have a long-standing restaurant move We move very well could be right. I don't think I've not any restaurants in w24 years in burlington of that have moved We moved. Yeah unique You know, and that's why this came up. Yeah Anyway Okay, thank you for your time. Yeah, thanks a lot. Appreciate it. Thank you. I think we've given staff an idea of where we'd like to Have some answers now so we can move on then to the budget review for the library marty fisk and carla karstens are thank you Carla's here and the members of the other members of the board are here and as well. So if you Whoever wants to can come up and We'll talk about operating budget first and I don't think there's too much on On the capital budget Happy new year So the bottom line is that this is an increase of only about 1.6 percent It's basically holding the line on most of the line items or is making even some small decreases in some line items Um, I'll go through each individual section with you I did get the page number for jennifer for capitals when that comes So, um, um Modest increase you'll see for library collection. That's mostly an increase in the periodicals and audio materials It's about a 10 increase that we've been seeing on average each year for those types of materials And we're also setting aside more money for digital materials as we're starting to see increased usage in those areas and another Item that I want to point out ahead of time is our postage levels You'll see when we get to the postage line that we had had some healthy Surpluses in the last couple of years But we have been warmed by the department of libraries that we should not plan for any interlibrary loan Postage or courier grants from them in the future That they expect to see those line items that they distribute out to other libraries cut That was a grant that we received in the past that went anywhere from 350 dollars to 1,400 plus dollars in the course of a year We also have a new interlibrary loan System software and as they're playing with the software Bits here and there we're seeing our Rates of requests fluctuate from other libraries. We're what they call a net lending library Meaning that we loan out to other libraries almost twice as many books as we borrow from other libraries so That's a part of the the things that is required for us to be able to borrow from other libraries We have to be able to loan our own collection So as they're making adjustments in the software for that we're seeing some fluctuations We're not very sure how it's going to All sift out in the end So for the first individual line item the department salary For under regular circulating library There is no changes in staffing here We brought on a person from Almost half time she was 25 hours to full time last year And we're not making any changes in our staffing level at this time We are seeing an increase in a minimum wage and figuring in for 1 cost of living based on what jennifer Sees in the forecast What does this represent in full-time equivalents? Um full-time golly. You would ask me that I think it's something like 7.5 right now What what you're seeing though under this particular line terry is just for traditional library services We have other services that are for library staff that are broken out that have to do with like computer Services and program services. So this is only a portion of the entire salary line Okay, but this this line represents 7.5 No, no this as a total as a total it's a seven around 7.5 as a total for the staffing um Oh, I see there are other services. Yeah, so you'll notice it says like library director 90 percent of full time That's because I spend approximately 10 of my other hours doing program support um, and you'll see youth services 60 percent of 280 hours it's because again, she does Program support and you'll see that show up in another line later on thank you benefits For this line has all been based on guest best guest estimates for jennifer um, the training and conference expenses Was a little bit of a decrease and that's because we had a regional Conference that was in burlington this last year and that regional conference is going to be in rhod island next year We're only going to be expecting one or maybe two staff people to attend not all of our staff So that line has gone down Parking, uh, excuse me mileage though. However is going up because that conference is all the way out in rhod island So it's a little bit longer for travel fees Um, so the book line item You'll see is that approximately 10 increase and a little bit more for Materials in the digital formats that I was speaking of Translates into Less than three thousand dollars increase The bookmobile line you'll notice is down A little bit and that's mostly because we're finding as we're Getting accustomed to the new bookmobile that we're not using as much fuel as we had first estimated We were guessing based on our Number of miles that we knew that we covered in the route With estimates based on the engine type that we had and we're finding we've been able to make A little more efficient so that we're not crisscrossing the town quite as much And saving some in the fuel costs So the um bookmobile line item has been decreased By just a couple of hundred dollars Is that highly used throughout the town it is it's also being used year-round now because we're doing visits to the daycares We visit four largest daycares all year during the school year and So they are getting a visits um once a week plus our two visits to the senior communities So it's now being used year-round The Bookmobile goes out that's a total of six times a month during the school year and then During the the summer months of mid-june through to the end of august It's going out three evenings a month visiting multiple neighborhoods In the bookmobile the replacement car shows up under capital on the capital. That's correct Uh supplies we're level funding Telephone also level funding That line we've seen increase historically decrease in historically because uh emails are decreasing our cost of our mailing our Excuse me our telephone costs Postage this is the line I was speaking about earlier where you see that we did have a a healthy surplus and that our actual usage in fiscal year 2016 was Just under $2,500 and in fiscal year 17 It was just under 1800 but we're requesting 3000 and that's because we expect to see The state grants end So we're going to end up bearing the full costs of the courier service and the postage And the courier services for the courier services for interlibrary loan books. It's only for service Yeah, only for books Only for libraries that are in populated enough areas that the courier service delivers to We're still using postage mail regular snail mail federal postage For the more rural libraries and for colleges and school libraries who are not part of the courier system But also the snail mail costs also cover things like overdue notices Advertisements that we send to other libraries to increase our program attendance things like that Generatorial services level funded Town custodial services, this is a little bit of an increase based on what we Have had foreseen by jennifer for The benefits and costs associated with having the personnel. This is the maintenance staff for the town Generatorial services we had you talked about Doing full-time Staff in the town building So that full-time staff can't also couldn't also take care of the library. I assume this is still contracted It is contracted The the plan and jennifer can help me if I stumble on this The plan as I understand it is that the full-time staff would take care of the town hall the town hall annex And the police station but would not do the library The police station is in addition because currently they do hire an outside service for the police station But there are enough needs within the complex here that Would take the time For of a full-time person to handle Did I get that right jennifer? We get about 1,300 visits A week So we get some pretty high traffic and so it's all it's a pretty high that's good Heating fuel Who knows based on what we saw in the last two weeks, but We base this off of a three-year average of the number of units that we use for heating fuel And that has been going down ever since we had our insulation project a few years ago And luckily we don't get quite as many cold cold nights as we've been seeing The electric water and wastewater is covered under utilities That is a Little bit of a decrease And just about 500 dollars of a decrease Again, our electric use has been going down. We've been trying to keep as many efficiencies as possible I'm actually looking into a rebate right now for switching over to led lights in the library That'll probably need to happen over the course of several years But we're doing everything we can to reduce electric rates Building maintenance. This is a little bit of a decrease Um Just because we didn't have any particular issue that we needed to address in this year We've been having ongoing problems of rotting clapboards and trim that needs to get changed out on a regular basis They go through every spring and we do an inspection and get the worst areas taken care of this takes care of things like the gardens and fire alarms and extinguishers paint and the like Land rental from the school's level funded Property and casual insurance is based on estimates from jennifer This is where you're going to see the breakout of terry of the other Staff wages. So we've got special programs listed here This is for all of the people who do things that put on public programs for The library Includes our adult services and our youth services This is based on an estimate of how much time that each person spends in that in that duty Oh, I see. So it's it's portions of the people I see, okay So the seven and a half above was were portions. So what do we have entirely for the library in full-time equivalents? What's the I think the total comes out to something like 9.2 now that we've got a full time another full-time person Like to add that we if you take the volunteer work That is about another one person or more. It's actually more than that now It's we have an average of 70 volunteer hours a week. So it's more like one and a half Full-time equivalent of volunteers Benefits based on estimates for jennifer from jennifer And then the program Costs and supplies is a level fund from last year. This is another breakout of the Staff under it wages. This is 50% of a full-time person who handles our interlibrary loan services and does all of our computer maintenance Then benefits for that person And then we have our sort of catch-all computer systems equipment service contracts, etc Tiny bit of a $15 decrease there There is included in this line the $4,800 that we've been including for the last several years for space changes that we've been making at the library We have completed the reference adult computer room. We've completed the teen room We've completed the picture book room and we are currently working on the adult reading room We're just beginning that room That room will probably take two to three years because of the way that we've been breaking out into small Incremental bits to try to keep the budget as level as possible And then after we finish that room, we have one more room We'll go back to the youth reading room and finish up a little bit of work in there This line also includes Wi-Fi and website services computer equipment, copier contracts Support for our library System that includes our checkout loans and patron database And it also will include replacement of the blinds in our community room, which are over 20 years old 20 years old The it's just that the Strings that are inside of it are starting to get dried out Any questions on the operating budget? Total increases about 12,000 dollars, which is pretty minimal pretty minimal Any other questions on operating just a couple things on Capital that's right page 62 on capital So the bookmobile we've been doing an annual savings Sort of a savings account of 7,500 dollars towards replacement of the bookmobile When the current one is 12 years old We're expecting the cost of replacement to be around 90,000 dollars So we're we're making incremental savings towards that each year And then the other item is library shelving This is part of that space reconfiguration that we are doing This is shelving that would replace our existing dvd shelving that was Greatfully built for us by an eagle scout several years ago at the very low cost. We ask what page? That should be the very next page. I think 63 No, I saw I was going through it on the weekend. I don't remember where it was 60 pages in the town hall page 17 17. Okay. Thank you. So that shelving That we have right now is Is working for us, but as the collection grows it started to get filled And we're looking at replacing it with Pullout shelving that is more easily accessible especially handicap accessible The shelving we've got now is rather tall and for somebody who's in the seated position can only reach the lower third of it It will take up less floor space and give us a better line of sight into the reading room and View of the lawn through the picture windows beyond And in that smaller floor space it will also increase the capacity by about 58 So much more efficient use of the space So this is all part of our plan to try to stay into the existing space as long as we can And make it as efficient as possible The shelving is Easily Can be transferred into any space in the future That cost based on what we had for estimates from two different companies Estimating a small increase for inflation would be about $20,000 Rick, this is not being you're not proposing funding this till 2020. That's correct. Okay Questions regarding What year is the bookmobile slated to be replaced? In let's see. I want to say it's in its third year. So that would be nine years from now For the questions on cattle Very much Have you here, thank you Let's move on to the town meeting petition and Guesses there's a lot of people here that are interested in Talking about this if you would please identify yourself anyone who wishes to Please identify yourself So we have a public hearing scheduled at eight o'clock and if Through at that time If there are people here that want to take part in the public hearing on the budget We will recess Until that point and if there's nobody here, we'll go back to discussion of this. So go ahead and proceed. Okay. Um I'm marsy cas brian forest Melinda petty And I just want to make sure that you all have a copy of this Um petition yes petition you do. Okay, great Uh Hello Happy new year To you So tonight we're introducing our petition to you Our resolution regarding renewable energy on A state and local level For consideration to be included as an article for this year's town meeting Our hope is that we will see vermont democracy in action That the need for renewable energy plans will be discussed and voted on On the floor at our town meeting Tonight we want to tell you a how this resolution developed b why we should care about it And the gist of what it says So how it came about, um, i'm a member of 350 dot org This is a worldwide nonprofit. Um, I don't know if you guys have heard of it That started in uh 2007 by middlebury college students and their professor bill mckibbin To address the problem of climate change The idea for this renewable energy resolution to put this issue on town meeting tables throughout vermont Was presented at last year's 350 vermont annual meeting which brian and i attended brian and i brought this resolution idea back to wiliston and with the help of engineer melinda petter wrote the wording in my kitchen Why it's appropriate for our town meeting Taking steps to reduce greenhouse gas emissions Thereby striving to maintain our planet's delicate balance Is our most pressing responsibility Changes in our climate polar ice caps oceans habitats are happening faster than predicted The 350 and 350 dot org stands for 350 parts per million of co2 in the atmosphere This is the upper limit needed to stay within To avoid catastrophic consequences For the past million years the level's been between 172 and 300 parts per million First rising above 300 in 1912 The number now fluctuates around 407 I'm pretty sure i'm not telling you anything you don't already know Boils down to common sense If something's broken you set about fixing it If you need if you get new information that something's harmful you make adjustments to lessen that harm Figuring out how to get energy from sources which don't add warmth to the atmosphere and how to use less energy makes sense Here in wiliston you guys already have done things along those lines installing solar panels and buttoning up public buildings, which is awesome As we see it the issue is not if will change over to renewables. It's when The issue is will it be in time to make a difference? Stepping back and looking at the big picture is a hard sell When people are trying to make ends meet and are busy with daily demands It's hard to say no wait a minute. Hang on Things are really scary and bad. You need to put down your groceries and listen to why you should be worried And maybe global warming doesn't seem like a problem when it's so cold Also climate change is seen by some as a partisan issue. So there are big roadblocks standing in the way on that score And yet This is an issue that has fallen to us The citizenry of our cities and towns to lead the way 90% renewables by 2050 is our vermont comprehensive energy plan target Only 32 years away We can't leave it for our grandchildren to deal with in the last 10 years And the more greenhouse gases that go up into the atmosphere the harder it will be to remediate this problem Job number one In reversing climate change is talking to our neighbors about it Telling our legislature as a town that the time for getting serious about climate change is now Thank you We don't have any questions for marsy or the others regarding The contents of the petition and then we'll ask eric and rick to respond About the process Can I just jump in and say um brina melinda also wanted to say sure Thank you. Thank you for letting me speak and thank you for the action that wilson has already taken to address Energy efficiency renewable resources and climate change I have three reasons supporting a decision to allow this proposed resolution on the upcoming ballot The first one the transition to renewable energy is inevitable While vermont has a comprehensive energy goal And vermont has a comprehensive energy goal addressing this transition But many people in our state in our town Unaware of the slow transition occurring now And the need to accelerate this transition to achieve the state goals in the future This resolution proposed for the spring ballot promotes awareness Provides an opportunity for discussion. It encourages education about the issue It helps bring people along rather than leaving them behind when the inevitable need to change becomes more imperative Second reason Other towns and cities are very active keeping in front of the transition They are taking action regardless of our current national or state leadership Being on the forefront of the transition to renewable resources makes sense economically and for the community And these communities care about economics the environment and their residents Medicine wisconsin has engaged a large consulting firm to help medicine achieve net zero Carbon emissions by detailing how the community can implement energy efficiency renewable energy and efficient transportation Hartford connecticut has utilized guidance from a law school to develop a model zoning code Which helps advance renewable energy generation energy efficiency and protection for the environment Medicine and Hartford are being thoughtful and deliberate and moving forward They do not want to be left behind when the momentum shifts full speed to the future And I Personally, I want our town to be more like Madison and Hartford here in williston Allowing this proposed resolution on the ballot is another step which will align us with these sorts other other types of towns And the third reason This house is a personal one this holiday season I have been delighted to have my one-year-old montana granddaughter Visiting us in vermont and if she is fortunate with her health and a bit of luck She will live to ring in the 22nd century. That's kind of awesome Now if I will be there, but my legacy will and our legacy will be everywhere And what won't what will our legacy look like the transition to sustainable lifestyle and renewably powered Electricity-based economy will be the norm by then Will the transition come in a last-ditch desperate upheaval because we ignored the facts Because we were too complacent to act and plan back in 2018 So when I Is kind of personal here So when the 22nd century comes, I hope my granddaughter knows that her grandmother me Thought about the situation and that I took action in my life to work and in my work to provide energy and a clean environment for the future And that one of those actions was asking her town Is to do as much as it could including putting this resolution on the ballot? Thank you Just a note from the field i've been um knocking on doors and talking to my neighbors about uh, science petition and From the 55 and older community 40 out of 43 have signed it. So 55 and older people are in favor of this. Uh, just a little note from the field We have two, uh, asks of the board tonight. The first one is that The board dean, this is worthy of being on the ballot And the second ask is that, uh, you waived the required five percent voter signatures To get on the ballot So there are two asked. Thank you very much So any members any questions from the board regarding The what we heard about the petition Then what talked to eric and rick about the process So the intent is to inform Right inform the town. So you want to put this on town meeting day a discussion on town meeting day Town meeting night. I'm sorry town meeting night um And given it's not a voter controlled item. I guess we'll hear from eric on this what what it means for um Legally from a legal perspective, but your intent is to inform and Look for the town's commitment to Drive towards the goals that the state has put in place right and also to tell Montpelier To get real and serious about the vermont's comprehensive energy plan to come up with real substantive plans. So it's like a Giving a vote in that direction to our state We want the citizens of wilson to have an opportunity to weigh in on this issue and send that message to the state right Which way ever it goes but We're hoping that it'll be allowed resounding from the from the um The places i've been i've been to a couple of the public hearings that the the governor's commission on climate change has had one st. Oldham to the growington and every speaker at the at those meetings were in favor of a carbon tax were were were concerned about climate change and urge the The governor's commission to take bold steps The time for small incremental steps is is gone Uh, if we're ever going to deal with this issue, we need to take act boldly here And uh, that's swiftly Wait quick. Um, i'm a little bit confused And so my question is um, is your interest in having A discussion during the town meeting portion the actual town meeting Portion of our town meeting i.e. when we meet in the evening as a group I think you'll be in the auditorium will be in the auditorium again this year In the school auditorium Or is your intent to have it on the ballot that's voted on the next day Actual town meeting day where you check, you know, yes or no Or both You know, I think it's both. I think it's yeah, it's I mean I I ask, you know, I, um, approached, um Rick and Deb Beckett like how does this work? So I think it's sort of like I'm not sure. I think we want We want to raise awareness and have conversations But we also would like You know Just raising it from the floor and not having it on the ballot will I think minimize Exposure because more people You know Right kid take out we'll take ballots an actual vote right when we want to we want to have um The ability for the citizens of wilson to speak On this of this issue to to the state Okay, because our other towns are doing the same thing and this is a part of a concerted statewide effort To send a message to my appeal here From the citizens of each town But you're asking that the 5% be waived Yes, and on what grounds are for why? That's worthwhile That's a worthwhile issue Because it's a concern of issue of vote off-courtness that that it should be waived I was going to say what's five is at five percent of the vote The voting registry or Okay, so what is that number now just curious for 75 That would be that would be five percent. Yes Okay any further questions of presenters Uh, I asked either rick or error whichever one wants to weigh in on the the process Yeah, of course. I I'm a little I I thought the direction you were going in was for town meetings. So I'm taking a little bit back I know we had talked about it. So I know you were ambivalent about it that moment, but anyway It's a little bit different process potentially, but Eric do you I did ask Eric to do a fair amount of research on this so you can weigh in So this would be The advisory article I mean a petition for town meeting that comes before the select board. There are some in-state statues that are required for the board to add into the morning This would not fall under that category So it would be advisory to set the board's discretion whether it as a body would like to add that to the warning or not seeing that the The board doesn't have a complete petition at this point. It can't take action on from that regard The board has the ability to add Articles that as it sees fit to the warning. So that would be a mechanical process for the board could move to add this to the morning without the required number of signatures Would that be for the warning for both town meetings and for the australian ballot? I believe so. I didn't go into the detail for both those I'm confused how that would work. You would have two separate votes It seems like it should be one or the other and You know It just would be odd because it could conceivably be voted down at town meeting and approved by australian ballot or vice versa What would be the purpose of the vote at town meeting night? Well, the the advantage of that particular venue is that you have a discussion You know an active discussion amongst the attendees and then you vote on it We couldn't have a discussion without the result being ending in a vote I suppose so. Yeah, I don't Could be a discussion the night before just as we do for the budget discussion Vote on it the next day. I think that's the way we'd prefer Yeah and I um To um respond to like a previous question of you know asking The board to waive the signatures So is my understanding that Even if we've got the signatures the board could decide that it's not appropriate So why not and that you could also decide it's appropriate and not need the signatures, you know what I mean since you If you decide you have even if we got the signatures you still have the um The option of Saying it's not worthy of being on the ballot. It's still we still don't think right And I think eric mentioned that the board even let's say you didn't even Talk about a petition to begin with but the select board wanted to pursue this as a discussion They could take that action on their own without any petition at all And I want to be clear about this piece I'm sorry if I ask a question if you were to get the five percent five percent plus one of voters to sign the petition We could then still refuse to put it on the ballot the select board could It's not something that the voters have I can understand sort of the rationale. I just want to make sure it was it was clear Having said that The past practice is important here too because of the the select board decision not to include it was challenged The court might look to past practice And I believe there is a case in south burlington where they had refused to place an item on Their warning for meeting and the court upheld it because their past practice had been never to allow these things So they were very consistent wilson Excuse me in general has actually been consistent in allowing this kind of thing. So right and I Which I would kind of agree with But I would want to see that five percent because to me my job as a select board member is to be doing what the will of the town is So without having the signatures, I don't have enough of a sense of whether people actually want that or not That's just my personal part of it Is it is a really 10,000 are there 10,000 people on the voter list? I didn't think it was that That's the population isn't it? Checklist is about the population is 9,500 or something Close to close to about 8,600 8,600 on the checklist Really? Yeah, my guess is is that beckett has a pretty clear idea of how many numbers you need to get to five percent It was 475 numbers. I think it's pretty clear about yeah, it's 475 to be on the safe side I think it was I think it was like a five vote or five seconds. You're over is to give us some margin And you would need to have those numbers by the 17th of january or something right? That's right 18th. Yeah. Yeah Right And the weather's not cooperating The weather's not great But you can't whine any quickly when you're not going to do all this Yeah, I mean, I think I think in terms of waiting for the signatures. I mean It's not the main issue, you know, um, but it's almost like the chicken and the egg like You know, what's the you know if if people are really interested in talking about this subject We would hope they'd come out on town meeting day and Be you know, I'd be more apt without signatures to say let's put it up for discussion at town meeting day and If we want to do a vote there if we wanted to I guess I don't know the process maybe Eric Well, when you say town meeting day, I just want are you talking about the night before the night the night discussion We had the discussion in this would be a nine kind of a non binding resolution Correct, it would be something that would be a statement from the town saying The people of williston who showed up for town meeting day, you know voted Four or against this resolution. So it's a two-edged sword, right? Because But given the town's makeup, I suspect that Would be a An easy one So, I don't know Eric in your research you I know what the answer is is when the folks Advocating for the petition to for the petition I the article to be on on the ballot on the warning What is willison's history when there hasn't been the five percent met? Yeah, I don't recall that ever being the situation The situation I'm sorry, I maybe I misunderstood the question Well, my question. I think you asked Eric Have we ever had a situation where we didn't require the five percent put something out? Well, we've allowed it for lack of better words allowed we've Waved If you will waived an advisory article without the five percent of voter. Well, I don't recall it that ever happening That isn't to say it didn't but I just don't recall we did go back through And look at the history over the past number of years As best we could and we didn't see any examples of that So can I ask from the last town meeting day? We had a resolution that was proposed by I forget the woman's name To Push the president to release their tax records And it came from the floor I believe So what's the difference between having an agenda item and having a floor proposal for a vote on that? Because you vote on it the same way, don't you if you recall Last year when that happened the motion was made in the moderator who happens to be here, right? I said it was not in order to have that discussed and that was challenged the chair was challenged and Was overridden by the members present and then the resolution was presented and passed And is there any let me just ask just from a practical purpose. Is there any difference in the outcome of that? Versus what that's three residents here proposing if I guess I'm not Let me answer part of the what may not be total answer to your question But if it's an issue that is put on the agenda for town meeting discussed a town meeting a voted town meeting the advantage of doing Having it done that way versus brought up on the floor is first of all, you're not guaranteed. It'll be addressed because The people in attendance may just say no, we don't want to address this But it also gives advance notice to people attending the meeting that that's going to be discussed Then presented the following day for a vote No No, there's no way of doing that because the ballots are prepared quite a bit in advance of the actual vote So there's no way of adding something at the last minute. It's only recorded in the minutes of the Well, the message comes out to the you know, so many towns. I think many towns Had that kind of a item on there Depending on the issue sometimes letters are sent to the governor or there are on our state They're u.s. Senators or representatives It depends on the issue, but there's usually some follow-up to a vote like that So the intent I think of the board is not to make a decision tonight But to wait to see whether or not you have a petition with five percent and submit it to us and At the before at the appropriate time before time expires We will make a decision as to what But what we're going to do with that They've actually asked us to Wait the five percent. So are we saying we don't want to wait? But have we made that decision? I don't think we made that decision and i'm not sure what do we want to make that decision tonight Since we have one member missing as well We'll have another question and the the reason for us coming here is You know, I don't think we'll have a problem getting the signatures We might get cold, but I don't think it'll be a problem But if you were to say if you were to decide It's really not appropriate then we would have You know, I mean we still would have had conversations with our neighbors, which it's all good I mean, but we wouldn't have gone to that effort if We know from the get-go now. This is not a great idea. So that's kind of why We wanted to be here sooner than later I would actually like to hear the discussion it's I'd actually like to hear from residents on this point because it's a It's actually a very more complex issue then Especially the financials so I can take a strong vote as to Whether if whether or not they get 5% positions, would we consider putting the town meeting? Wait, I just want to make sure I understand the question you're asking is the question you're asking is if they Let's start with what I think is the more straightforward question is if they achieve if they obtain 5% of voters Signing a petition to add this to the town warning Would I You would go forward with it unless it was a totally not saying this is your case I could see doing that in the case where it's a totally facetious Petition, you know, should donald duck be the state bird, you know, yes, then I would probably say no Even though you got 5% of the voters in in a very legitimate and you know Well thought out petition like this You know, yeah, I don't see how I could say no if you got 5% of the voters. I just that's my personal Sure. Yeah, sorry I I think it would be good to have it on the I'd like to hear from the residents So I think advertising it makes sense and whether they got the 5% or not. I'd like to hear so myself But again, it's so I just want to add something to that. It's since it's non binding. It's kind of like doing the vote on Telling the president he needs to release his tax records. It's it's a message. It says what our position is and how we feel I would think that I mean there is some binding aspect of this if the voters vote for this I I have a you know the town and wills it will do our political pressure We're putting it on the ballot you're having discussion at town meeting right, but if it were on the ballot Let's say and got voted, you know, it was approved. You mean 50 plus one I look at this as something we have to you know, we we are We would put it. That's the will of the voters, you know So you're saying that you want this on the ballot and them I didn't well no, I'm I'm I'm actually that's That that's your decision. What's the best mechanism? It sounds to me like you're coming back saying we would like this on the town On the ballot that we vote at via australian ballot One another point. This is not in a form that you could put on a town ballot So that's something it is something you could use to place an item For town meeting, but you you know, you couldn't add this So not I need to understand if it was is this a binding in any way Okay, that's what I thought Politically binding if to the people that are on the board at the immediate time, but We're going to change between now and 2050. I think Now I spoke to somebody in my peeler like technicalities of you know, there's a little tiny typo in here So I was like, can we change the typo or would that make this people who've already signed it invalid whatever he said that If it got to the point where it was on the ballot the town could take it and Fix the typo or you know, I think I think that I don't know about the legality But I think it could be condensed I personally think to fit if that's how we wanted to go because You know that be it resolved maybe that's what would have legal Legalities you turn this into legal ease for the ballot Well, if the board chose to add this to the ballot it then yeah, it would have to be reworded Um, but I think Jeff is right that there are There are asks here And one of them is to develop a plan to achieve the goals of the comprehensive energy plan That means like Williston would have to develop a plan No, we're just urging the state to do that Okay, yeah, okay I mean, I think that to me, you know when we sat down and and and worked this out We wanted to put the issue on the table But we didn't want to You know put to find a point on it that we would Get caught up in You know you can't you know Something that would Like be a deal breaker into just generally Getting getting the issue Right, I mean, I think that that some other towns Um do put a finer point on it and ask for you know, No new infrastructure bill, you know very very definite and I think that the wording here is Is um For Williston, I think for where we're at we want to start that we want to kind of start the conversation I think it also informs the town about How passionate the citizens of Williston are about this issue that and that gives those working towards these goals in the in town government Some uh, when at their back to help them Achieve achieve what they wanted to I'm trying to get an answer to the question that was proposed to enjoy your response could be I want I would want to see the five percent of the signatures and then I Would consider it for a meeting I at this point I'm not inclined to see it be a ballot item For a whole number of procedural reasons and everything else I would agree that we would put this on the ballot whether or not we got Five percent or not for the town meeting night discussion Not necessarily for the For the australian ballot So I need to go to the public hearing but shape and you had a comment But this particular issue I think is much more suited to the discussion that you can have the night before Um, and if you can't advocate and tony can correct me But I believe you can't advocate for things that are on australian ballot that night. You can only inform And so it becomes a much harder presentation if you're trying to just inform On on monday night Whereas if you can have a full discussion monday night to vote it's with a smaller number of people But it's a much more appropriate venue in my view But my question So who you still vote on it But who couldn't advocate But typically I think shape it's right that the things that are items on the Uh They're on the town ballot on the vote day by australian ballot Do not have the broad discretion discussion that Something is worn for the evening meeting And so it's it gets cumbersome as I mean Shape it says you you can only inform you can't advocate And it's fun to watch people try to only inform and not advocate See the town meeting is a blood sport. That's one of those things It's all the tasteful so If you want to have a discussion that should be warned I would suggest that be warned for the evening meeting You have a better discussion And you still vote That's kind of what I was advocating for as well I also heard though that um if it's not Warned if we don't get the signatures that it could go like way at the end of the evening Well, it would not come up until other business Okay, so it would come up under other business and then I would typically rule it out of order because it's not warned And then the voters would decide whether they want to stay and discuss it Or whether they don't or whether they think it's appropriate or not. I mean, that's that's not my decision I think my decision is appealed to the assembly and then they vote And if my vote were ruled One other thing I'd add to that though is that I think if it's warned It carries greater weight than if it's raised there So if it's warned and the newspapers are aware of it and they report the vote of it's just something that comes up under the business And not as likely to give you what you are really looking for So I think uh We've done what you can do for tonight And we'll be discussing this at the time when we're approving the town morning Another select board meeting later in january Would that be after the 18th It'd be the 16th right two weeks from today I think they have to have their signatures into us So I don't think we have to approve it until the 23rd, but what can check on that? We have to have them in by 17 Okay, we figured out we don't have a quorum to approve an agenda item without signatures on town meeting night Is that what i'm hearing my understanding was it was three out of five because we only need three of us right so did we actually I'd say I'd like to see it on town meeting night Get discussed without signatures or not. I think three of us said that yes I mean My point is that's fine, and I'm I'm happy to support that but i'm also happy to support If your preference is that it actually be on the australian ballot that we vote on You know the next day after the actual meeting If that's your preference and if you get five percent of the voters then my feeling is is My job is to put it on the ballot Or that you know to have and if we and if we don't get and if we don't get Yeah, so that I think that would be our choice is to put it on the on the ballot Right, we wanted to we wanted to be warned so that people are aware that's going to be brought up for discussion and Will be discussed on town meeting night. I think they excuse me I think I got this I feel like i'm getting mixed because Is it worn for the the actual meeting or is it worn for the ballot that we vote on? I think the ballot I I think we need to have a discussion on that Okay, so let's me Maybe maybe I can make this a little more clear I think that the the position that you have can be warned as it is For the town meeting night When you get to the town meeting warning for the australian ballot, that's not going to look like this Which could be confusing to people it sounds like it's a possibility tonight that the select board could agree If they have enough votes To put it on to warn it for the discussion on monday night, right? But if we want to if we only want to do the australian ballot And we have it sounds like we have to do one or the other We only want to do the australian ballot Then we have the work ahead of us to clap to the signatures But they could also decide That to wave the signatures to put it on the australian ballot That's another whole process, but if you're willing to accept that they'll do it on monday night They can maybe talk tonight. Do you want to do it on just monday night? I think we should I'd rather Uh You need to discuss things with us What we have agreed on tonight, I believe three of us anyway Is that if you whether you get five percent of the signatures or not We would put it on the town warning For the night of town meeting And that's all we've agreed to tonight and that's been a straw vote that has not been a motion made What we will come down to is a motion At the appropriate time to do whatever the majority agrees to So I think we're through with this issue tonight. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you So we'll move on to the public hearing which we're a little late on And notice is shared by given that the Willisons Select Board will hold a public hearing on tuesday in January 2nd 2018 at 8 p.m at the blueston town hall Meeting room to receive comments on the proposed operating budget for fiscal year 2019 capital budget and program for fiscal years 2019 So the public meeting is now open and anyone who has any Things to discuss on the budget is welcome to discuss tony I'll be brief Most of you know i'm tony lamb I'm chair of the board of trustees of the wilson federated church with me as the reverend paul ire who's our new pastor came on board in october and is Wandering around trying to keep me honest, I think So in the fall I wrote a letter to Rick maguire asking if the town would contribute $25,000 to the cost of the renovation of the wilson federated church steeple It's the big white one down the street And and the reason for the request of the town is that as people may know or may not know The clock in the The steeple itself is owned by the town And in fact the town pays someone to wind that clock It's a mechanical clock and if you look at the And I was thinking about this why did the town fathers back in 1900 put it in our our church And the first reason obviously there's a picture on the second page It's you can see it from all the way Everywhere at the top of the at the top of the steeple But it's a mechanical clock which means that it runs by falls it has six foot tall three foot by three foot pilot a box of rocks That goes from The top of the window on the front of the church all the way down to the floor And it's wound up. There's a town clock winder who winds it once a week Well, he now he used to by hand crank now He has a bicycle so he pedals the bike and it pulls this box of rocks up And all week it it pulls and there's a mechanism that keeps the clock going so it's purely mechanical without out any electronics or any modern stuff in it the the The reason that in it that that there are several parts of the People that are used above the window is where the room is where the bicycle is and where various chains and pulleys are Above it above that about where it says eyebrow Roof is a room where the mechanism for the clock is actually housed and the reason that we need to repair the steeple is that the The outside frame of the steeple has begun to rot We did it about 20 years ago. We did the Many people remember it actually came down and was off the steeple for about a year off the church for about a year And when they did that they were doing the structural part of it They're doing structural innovations and those were quite successful. Unfortunately, they were in a Not unreasonable Preserve as much of the old as you can But the old was really worn out and so it very quickly deteriorated and although we've done a number of repairs over the year since It is really it's coming apart at the seams in the last windstorm. We had big chunks of stuff coming off the top Uh, and We talked to a number of steeple jacks. We're going to use jay south gate from a berry He proposes to replace the whole thing The internal structure will be the same, but we would like to in and this is not before you this will be before the historic preservation and the drb But we want to use some alternative materials particularly copper Uh, that will be painted white so that we don't have to come back here every 20 years trying to fix it So that's what we're doing and we're asking for the town to make a contribution towards it In effect, we're rebuilding the the area where the clock mechanism is the jay has a proposal to make a If you go up there, it's really tucked in and it's hard to get into He's talking about making that room bigger and more accessible for people to work on it I kind of think that's what I should tell you about If you're interested and you have more interest in this at our website steeple.org We have drone videos of flying around it We have an interview with jay south gate about the work. He's going to do He's done he did the steeple downtown that we Was destroyed by fire. He did the one in showbren. He's done a lot of steeples He has an old granite shed in berry and he builds them on a spit And so everything's that Right here so we can do a really good job as opposed from dangling from some boson's chair at the top of the steeple He was up there last friday and he suggested that he wasn't happy doing that in the winter time But but uh, so we're optimistic the total cost of the project is 240 thousand dollars Um, we hope to raise a hundred thousand dollars from individual contributions. We have about 25 pushing 30 000 and already Significant portion that is from our church members We have another portion which is uh 50 000 dollars, which is cash we had on hand We were without a pastor for a while and so We had some savings there and so we set that aside to put towards the steeple We're hoping to get some grants outside of the town. We're working on that And then if we don't get it we're going to have to finance some and that's For a church, that's uh, that can be difficult It's not difficult. It's the wrong term typically want to spend our money on other things doing the works of the church, but That's where we are. Are there any questions? Figure in mind 25 is the number I suggest the last time I think he contributed 20 and it's It seems it seems like a It seems like an appropriate amount. I don't know Other people may have a different idea It was it was under found budget. Yeah, the town did pay the money. I wasn't Here for all that part of it But I do remember it being off the church for about a year and then I remember when it was Put back on and I do know that the town paid money towards it but It was an oddity at the time because I'd never heard of the town paying for improvements to the church, but the fact that there's a clock there and it's a town clock Help justify the town expense for that And the 25,000 is included in the manager's proposed budget My only question is and and given it's a town clock housed in a church I guess this subject is already broached to a degree, but It's that question of separation of of church and state and if that has a role in this This meaning this issue of should the town participate in funding reconstruction of the steeple Well, I can't give you a legal. I mean I have a legal background, but I'm not sure that I'm The right person to ask for a legal opinion about that my own sense is that it is not It's not it's supporting a historic It's a historic project is what it's really doing. This is this is something that was been there for over a hundred years It's iconic for williston One of the things that's interesting for me is that we have a an online presence Where people can make contributions and when they do they can make notes And the notes are really kind of moving people talk about, you know, I drive by that church And I'm glad to see our community is our community is preserving it They rarely talk about us as a church. They talk about the steeple as part of the community Or as a spiritual item So I And and I think of the church as being part of the community. So for example We contribute to the community in a variety of ways The the part how many people know that the parking lot at that end of the Of the bike path is owned by the church And it's used by ccta with our permission as a commuter parking lot that the school in bristol uses it to Pick up and drop off their kids on a bus route every day. Um, so there's there's In and it's not I mean, it's just something that people that members of the community do and so Um But going back I do think it's it's primarily it's the historic nature of this clock the tradition of it being there Um, the town owns it Um, you know You have an obligation to preserve it. We're not asking you to pay for the whole sum We're asking you to pay a small portion of it. So that would be my Maybe my question was poorly worded in the sense that I hope I didn't express any reservations here It's more. I just want to make sure we're not going to get down the road and find there is some issue that had We been aware of it? We Might have done something differently And I just I would hope so not but I historic buildings and the typically the reason you use something like a steeple It's the tallest part of the town, especially as old as this church is I don't think anybody can guarantee that someone won't raise the question And I think being fairly direct trying to be fairly direct about the answer that it's a historic thing and It's primarily based on that I mean to me and I'm sorry. I'm just gonna take a second if it was to do something like to fix the clock I would kind of get it but it's it's It's to fix the structure holding the clock All right, but and so it the clock doesn't exist without a structure to hold it Yeah, I just so yeah, and it's it let's you know if we took the church out of it Then we would still have periodic expense to maintain the structure to hold that clock That's the kind of the way I feel it And I get I get all these arguments. I'm just want to make sure Yeah, it's hard to say that the town owns the clock. I mean the clock was Put into the church some 100 years. Was it 100 years ago? That's still I mean we paid one in We paid to contain it but From an ownership perspective, it's So there was an article a legal article in the legal cities and towns Bulletin about two months ago that talked about the separation of church and state and what the town could fund for A structure like this and then my recollection of it is said if it has no bearing on the religious part of Of it then it's okay for a town to fund Something towards it So are they interested to ask the vlct about that kind of ruling that they had My question is why won't we put it on the ballot and ask the voters to decide? Well, why wouldn't we why wouldn't we do that? I've seen other small things, you know, you vote for certain items on a ballot Why wouldn't we do that in this case? We're going to come up against this issue very soon about what part of the budget would we contemplate pulling out and having as a separate and You know my my feeling about Setting let's just say we get a reply back that absolutely no issue church and state We're good to go from that same point. My feeling would be would be about that is It's I don't even know how to correctly how to explain it, but it's When you start separating everything out you you lose the sense of you know, it's the town budget It's it's almost a line by line item And and I don't think that's I don't think that's our role as the select board is to decide What should go into the budget that the voters vote on and I once we start pulling items out whether it be, you know Money towards this project money towards preserving land money towards I don't know what else We we lose that sense of you're voting on a budget now. You're voting on a bunch of line items and to me it's a different thing I totally agree with that and I also think you're setting you're setting up I think you're opening door. You don't want to open So we've done this in the past for very big issues like Money's for the conservation fund the environmental fund years and years ago Yeah, look at it as discretionary funds, right? Yeah, things that are more This is a very discretionary item So I think we could have this discussion when we get down to discussing the budget entirely Let me ask you if you don't mind. Let me ask you a question then Terry Just think of it this way would we want to put the clock winders Is it salary we pay stipend stipend as a separate line Separating further voters to vote on and I would think we probably wouldn't because that's a town function and I you know I'm not saying funding This is a town fund. I mean, it's not the same as the clock winder, but it's along those same lines of You know, when you start pulling these items out, you've lost the sense of what's the budget What's our role in determining what the budget should be So let's go and find our talk tonight about Request that we'll have it here and we'll have that discussion. Yeah, I'm good with your present. Thank you. You're very helpful Anything further for our presenters? No, I don't have any questions Okay, thank you very much, but I remind you if you want to see the neat drone video steeple.org Interview Yes, the bike permanently mounted or does he bring it does he wheel it in it's gotta be no, it's mounted. It's it's right there Let me know I'll give you a tour. All right We talked about that Is there any other discussion on the budget for the public hearing tonight? Yes, sir Can you just identify yourself, please? My name is jim fuller I guess I have a question regarding the proposed budget for 2019 Just referring back to this year's budget There is in this year's budget a line item pardon my getting the line items under parks and recreation for Supporting Seniors activities The best of my understanding and I may be all wrong. So you'd have to excuse me That what was established to be done under this year's budget hasn't been done yet But my question is what is in the 2019 budget? To pursue those same long-term goals of establishing a senior center in williston For williston seniors, which is a very large piece of the town population And maybe it's getting bigger. I don't sure if not sure the statistics But my question is what is in the proposed 2019 budget? To support the establishment long term of a williston senior center So there's really nothing for a building at this point. There is continuation of the programs and establishing um, I think a Money is for a person to Provide some services towards the seniors, but that's what's in this year's budget. That's what's proposed for 19 That's my recollection We had the discussion in one of our meetings during the year. Well, if it's in this year's budget It's hard by ignorance, but why hasn't it been done so we can proceed on to an expansion of that in next year's budget? Maybe I can jump in here Money that was put in this year's budget was to hire a part-time person to help develop programs for the seniors That person was just very recently hired And so those programs haven't even been created yet. So we're going through a process of Working with that person and establishing these programs and That was the intent of the money that's in the budget and that's what we're doing As far as next fiscal year our plan is to continue that and expand it and We'll have a full year of that person's experience and and That will be a gauge as to how much interest there really is for the various programs that we're trying to provide And until we have a sense of that It's way premature to talk about a building I guess my question is how much more is in next year's budget to continue and expand from this year's objectives How much more is in next year's budget visa v this year's budget? I I'm not a hundred percent certain, but I believe it's about the same The difference is we were not able to hire the person We had some staff issues We had a recreation director who was out for extended time period And he was not able to get the position in place sooner than we would have liked So We're about halfway through the fiscal year. We're just now getting this person aboard Next fiscal year will have this person aboard for the full fiscal year and we should see the full Impact of having that person available for developing senior programs Your answer is the funding for such an activity is roughly the same in next year's budget as issue's budget Right, that's correct So the the goals for next year's budget Are really no different than they were for this year We should have a better chance of achieving that Yes And that's a good step forward Um Okay, that was my question. What's the next year's budget visa v this year's budget? Um, just as a general question Was there a copy of the draft town budget? That we are being asked to comment on tonight available to the public It's available online So in that sense it's available or if someone wanted to come in and look at it. We certainly oh, okay It's a it has been available online. Yes. Yes, sir Yeah, I could probably find it. Thank you very much. Yeah, I would um what you can do there's a I think I can look it up here under Under news briefs There's an item called learn about the town budget And you click on that and there's a whole bunch of information about more information You don't probably want to know about town budgets. Okay, but is it under like a williston.gov site? Well, it's a um, it's town.wilston.vt.us Okay, or if you just google it or use some sort of search engine and title wilson, you should be able to find it Yeah, I could get one of the more capable people to me to find it online. Thank you very much My name is jones stoddard and I do have a question about the individual that was hired To for activities for the seniors Is there a possibility that we could speak with that individual and go over some things that perhaps that we would be interested in? We had spoken to the Individual in charge of the cafeteria at the school And they're very willing to make Meals for us We had hope to start with one meal A week and the federated church has made an offer that we could use their common room over there to hold these lunches We would charge for them because we do have to pay the williston school for these meals So there would be a charge Is there an opportunity that we could speak with this person about other activities and what People might be interested in absolutely this the the new person we have is very interested in talking to as many people She can possibly reach Because she needs to have a sense of what people want and so I would suggest working with our recreation director Todd So just contact Todd. Yes, and say that we would like to meet this individual. Yeah, and he'll he'll make the connections for you Okay, thank you any other discussion on The budget for the fiscal year from the public Seeing none the motion to close the public hearing would be in order Do I have a second? Sorry discussion on motion Almost in favor of closing the public hearing say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Thank you all for attending. We'll move on then to the budget review for general administration revenues and outside services rick and jennifer Operating budgets if you would I'm going to focus first on general administration So the general administration tab of your operating budget page the general administration tab It's about halfway through your book So for um The select board, we're just budgeting a slight increase of 2 percent increase in salaries Sure. Well, I appreciate that. Um There is um One change to discretionary fund that's we're just upping that to be more in line with what we are actually experiencing Based on 2017 actuals 2018 budget was a little low for that item um Just remind what the describe the type things the discretionary fund is used for And so I don't have that page open in front of me. Sure. Um some of those items I'm Trying to think what they are Because the regular expenses are your things like your recording secretary Retreats things like that. Um discretionary fund. I believe this year we use some of the discretionary fund for some hiring for assistant town manager hiring I think we use some of that discretionary fund You said a 2 percent increase is that over? 2 percent increase of salaries select board salaries that first line Oh, just That big trip is now on the horizon Yes Um, if we look at the town manager's office, um for the town manager we budget, um Kola at Just 1 percent cola for the manager this year. Um, and then the rest of the managers um married increase Or any other Compensation comes as a discussion with the select board at its annual review time Um, there has been a change this year Of the manager staff salary So the only person that's included in this for this year is um, eric. So it's just assistant to the town manager The admin assistant position has been moved solely into finance. Um, so If you look at those items and look at those together They equal out it looks like finance has gone way up And the town managers gone way down as far as salaries But if we add them all together It's the increases the cost of living So to curiosity, what's the reason for doing that? Um for moving that more into the finance, it's just where most of the work happens Okay, so it's work related. It's work related The finance human resources functions. We're trying to budget that just more appropriately in finance Just split it or something like that. Well, it's a it's a bookkeeper position. So it kind of makes sense Okay, I better to show him the puzzle then you know where you're spending your money Yes, I thought it was more of a it played a administrative role also But at one point it did but it it's gradually morphed into more of At one point it had the title of administrative assistant But for many years now, it's been a bookkeeper and the amount of support provided the manager's office has gradually gone down each year Then that makes it over time. I should say Yes, that was one of the things. Yes Great. Um, so training and conference fees for the town manager's office has increased because we now have Two people that'll be attending conferences in that department Um Building maintenance has increased to be more in line with the actual that we experienced in fiscal year 17 And then discretionary wages. That's where we budget for Um longevity pay as well as merit increases for all town employees are in this town manager budget And that's the request that I brought to you a little over a month ago where I asked To allocate that out to the different departments At budget time it's right here In finance as I said before it's the finance director and bookkeeper salary and benefits And audit fees, um, those are what we will actually experience based on our contract Um board of list listers We're not seeing too much for increases there. Um, basically the same services being provided Tax maps you'll notice in the two years of actuals that are shown here. We haven't had any activity um that um Is now being done this year by a state grant So we won't see any activity in fiscal year 18 either even though there's budget for that In fiscal year 19 it will be the town's responsibility to make any changes and updates to those So we are requesting to keep those funds there even though we haven't used them in the past few years um technology We are asking for a bit of an increase here from Last year's actual and also the improved budget approved budget for fiscal year 18 Part of that is that we have moved to a monthly cloud backup So our backups for the town used to be a manual tape that someone would actually take home with them each night We have now moved to a cloud-based system where it's backed up off-site Who have we hired for that? We are using tech group right now To do that service they have done Our support services in the past Tech group, yes They have their own cloud-based System that they have um one of the things that you will probably see in the 2020 budget heads up Is that I am looking into what it would cost the town to move to a managed it service Right now we use um reactive support as the only way I can describe it Is if we have a problem we call tech group and they deal with it I would like the town to move to a more proactive Approach where they're actually looking at our system and making changes so that we're ahead of What could happen in the future? That is not in here at this time, but I'm hoping to Put together an rfp for that service to so that next year at this time We'll know what something like that would cost us and what services we could get Legal expenses we are looking to just level fund that We haven't hit that the past few years, but we never know when those legal expenses come up Manager salary is split between general administration and the other departments also Yes, that is the same with the finance salary and bookkeeper salary So our salaries are 76 percent of our salaries are in our home departments and the 24 percent is split amongst the different utilities And there's actually a rationale for that That's um, it's not a It's not possible to actually measure the amount of time we spend in each water sewer storm water So what we do is we it's based on a percentage of the total expenses We take the total expense for a general fund and the total expense for utilities And that's the utilities amount to about 24 4 percent of the total expense And that's divided Three ways right now. So that's how that's calculated Any questions on any of the general administrative expenses on the uh, on the on this Company that you hire is an in-state company the computer service company Yeah, they're actually here in Williston Yes Yeah, quite a few municipalities use them. I believe that's how we started our relationship with them and um Our experience with them has been great They do a nice job, but like I say we pay for hours up front for the year and call them when we have an issue Yes, thanks actually the fire department uses a different service they use dominion tech, which is also a williston based company I like I like that you're using local companies. The only question would be is there, you know, is there a cloud Cost they're probably using another cloud. They're probably using Or do you think they actually have their own this is their own product? Um that they have created they call it vt cloud Right, but we're they probably don't host it themselves. Do they I it's my understanding they do but yeah, I can get you more information here just Great, so I just want maybe one question the total increases about About 20,000 And so that is Maybe 2% Great. The next section I wanted to go over tonight is outside services So that's a couple tabs forward. Um the first section here regional services. So those are Services Thank you Um, so these are regional organizations Um, most of these are by request So organizations that we've been working with for a long time chitin in county regional planning When we ski valley park district grader burlington industrial corp And county tax from mont league of cities and towns all of these They send us a request each year saying how much our fees are going up to be part of their organizations Um, the largest increase here is county tax We're a little behind on our budget For that for a couple years. So this year it looks like there's a large catch up Based on 2016 actual and where we're trending for 2018 The increase is not as much as the budget looks right now But we did have to do that big catch up there And this is also where you see the line item for the willis infederated church for the the clock winder Its salary is somewhere Um That might be one of those discretionary items for the select board It is curious. Yes it is like a retired person or Yes, yes Bicycle riding retired person And I remember one of the discretionary fund items of this select board is um, they have waived a tax For some organization. I can't remember the organization. Yes, that's the um The mason The masons that you have Right, there's an agreement you several years ago that the board agree signed Or authorized me to sign rather to waive the taxes But it but they did it by way of a grant to the masons And that agreement by the way is expiring the end of this fiscal year. So I don't know What the plans are to change that I haven't heard from the the masonic people at this point, but Can I ask about the vlct and what is the fee based on? And what do we get I know we we get some opinions in that from them But is that what that it does that 11 000 dollars pay for insurance? No Okay, it really has very little to do with insurance because the insurance is actually a separate wing a separate organization actually They one of the major services they provide is a lobbying service That the state capital for all kinds of municipal issues They run a number of programs for training for municipal employees They have An annual a conference, but it's annual meeting each year They Yes, I I go Not quite every year that maybe every other year One year it's in s-exjunction the next year. It's in killington. I usually go that's It's a long drive down in killington That back it goes That's They also develop publications that we use There's a publication on collection of delinquent taxes For example, there's a guide that they had developed on select board I saw the training advertisement for that recently maybe in the last few months They They also if we have just a general question Well, what are towns doing to handle this kind of issue? That's a resource for us if we have legal questions They have an attorney that Can't go in a lot of detail, but they can go in a little bit of detail and maybe provide a quick answer In fact, we did use them for the question we had on the petition Right, I saw that in the Okay, okay So you feel like you're getting your your money's worth on that? Okay I can tell you they do a great job on lobbying at the light at the same house Can you give me just just for my own, you know an example of Kinds of things they've lobbied for municipalities. Well, they have a large packet of information on all their programs that they're following and So if you go to vlc2, they probably can find that online I've been roamed around there The municipal policy that they adopt every year, which Kind of like our town plan spells out what their priorities are and sort of why and the rationale behind it That might be worth taking a look at because it'll give you a flavor for what it is They're advocating for Okay, yeah, I've gone there for one for the select board itself. They have some information on there The fee that I is well worth reading. I read it every okay, you know The fee I I get frustrated with is the county tax fee We don't really have any say over how it's spent 92,000 and The it's a portion based on grand list value only and I've been arguing for a number of years against using that part of the formula with the musky valley park district Well, this would require a state change in state law and I don't think that's going to happen But I find it extremely unfair using grand list value, especially since With act 60 and 68 The state took most of that grand list value yet. They kept these kind of burdens On municipalities that like wilson, so it's just Where is the county tax being? The county tax goes directly to there's a county government Share of some records. Oh, it's okay Yeah, I mean they provide valuable service I don't I don't mean to imply that but it's just frustrating the way the fees are structured and and Probably don't get our money on that one Is the 92,000 still the right figure or is it? That is that is That was that catch-up you were referring to yes, because if you look at 17 is 86,000 this year we're at We're going to be over budget in this line at them. We're going to be about 89 thousand and so 92 Um, the next section is social service organizations. Um, so the social service committee will be meeting Next week To decide how to allocate this money out to the different organizations. We've received I want to say about 18 different nonprofit requests For this year And so we will meet to decide how to allocate that money if the select board Allows us to use that much So the money here is allocated for us to decide Um distributing The social service committee meets and makes a recommendation for the select board They so we review all of the applications that were submitted From the different nonprofits and you'll make a recommendation to the select board to the select board. Yep Within the confines of the money that it has proposed and some Very very valuable services from these organizations. So yes, yeah, and we saw a few new ones this year We saw one from Habitat for humanity and um hunger free vermont, which we hadn't seen requests from them last year Transportation services, um, I don't get to report this very much but those are going down this year Yeah, um, so the bus service did go up slightly but the ADA program Has gone down based on willowston usage. So this is um, a Those numbers came as a request from green mountain transit in our health section here We're level funding most of that. We did not receive a request this year from vna. Um, so we are At least um level funding that we're not sure when we're going to receive that request Any questions on that? I had a question on the bus service. I guess I didn't realize So we pay Almost $200,000 for green mountain to have stops in willowston I guess I never realized that was um Right Our culture isn't a mass transit. Yeah, we are a member Of Is that correct? That's largely a reflection of our membership. Yes And it's it's not just the bus serves Not just um The village here. There's only only two stops In the morning and two stops In the evening But the main service route, I think There's a stop in walmart and then they go up and down It's an old route Great. We do have a represent representative on their board on jason was here Business that's worth to um the shopping centers that have in the box That's a lot of money A couple years ago we had the route into willowston so increased the routes at the walston How many years ago was it rejoined must have been 10 years ago Yeah But there's very what you're saying is there's very little traffic between around willowston Or will listen to do other places. It's primarily to come to willowston for the Shopping center that Actually, these are excellent questions and just so happens at our january 16th meeting We're going to have a representative from green mountain transit here And you can ask all those kinds of questions for them Things I didn't realize those are all great questions The next section I wanted to touch on is under capital expenses In the operating budget So the first section here is capital projects and so those requests For capital projects from the operating budget capital equipment from the operating budget Um and capital equipment host town funded those all tie in with The main capital requests that the detail that you'll see in the other capital book um debt service Those are all just all of the debt that the town has and these are our required payments for the upcoming year The one that is estimated is the ambulance lease That one is estimated at 38 000 We don't have a lease in place just yet for that So that's why you see it all in principle. It'll be allocated out appropriately Based on our estimates that is Are based on The information that we've received that is a good estimate The new fire engine that we'll be getting at the I believe it's in may We just turned in the bond application for that what we're requesting to do with that fire engine is pay Interest only for the first three years so that we can Then match it up with when the other fire truck debt falls off our debt schedule and then we're Just keeping our debt level during that time and The way that we didn't have to borrow as much because we used a portion of the public works facility Overage that we had there From debt we had already borrowed We applied toward the fire truck So we didn't have as much that we needed to borrow So we're able to do that to take that 10-year note and only make principal payments for seven years So was that truck that trucks then been ordered? It is in may. Yes That process of ordering and getting it bill takes a long time I assume it's the one that he wanted the one that was more reliable Little more money Yeah, your your recollection is correct Great. And the next is under open space. So you'll see here the environmental reserve fund That has a larger request than we usually see there First of all is The 60,000 of that 260,000 is to bring the environmental reserve up to 400,000 Which is our commitment for the catamount property At this point that 400,000 is what the town is committed to do So we would need the 60,000 to get the environmental reserve fund up to that level The additional 200,000 is for a grant that the housing Trust is hoping to get but they can't apply for it until next fiscal year So at this point We think that it should be in the town budget to cover that if they do need it or they will need it actually be Prior to The grant becoming available. Is that how it's working right? My understanding is they're hoping to close on this before the end of this fiscal year before June 30th And this grant is not available until after July 1st And I don't know what the process is for applying for it They seem to be very optimistic that they're going to be successful in getting it I'm not quite as optimistic, but I think we have to If we're going to move forward with this purchase we have to figure out a way to In the vent that that grant is not available that we have the cash Available to complete the purchase That was part of Melinda's Okay, no, I'll hear so Yes, so that is the request from the Williston Conservation Commission Put it in slightly different words if you don't mind to make sure I understand Williston's commitment towards the purchase of the town forest Right now it's anticipated to be 400,000, but it could be as much as 600,000 And this request for 260 is To cover the 400,000 to 600,000 At some point, you know, maybe it's covered in Melinda. I have to confess. I have not read Melinda. Sorry Melinda her memo yet What will be remaining in the environmental reserve fund? If we have to pay this a total of 600,000 I don't want to say have to we choose to pay 600,000 for the purchase of the town forest about $3,000 Wait, did I hear that right? 3,000? It has never been that low Since it's an inception, of course, we've never had to make a purchase exactly either It's it's yes 200,000 would come from If we get the grant Then that um that would actually mean we'd have 200,000 that would go into the fund balance, right, but uh The 200,000 because we only have 400,000 as a result of putting another 60,000 in which is 40,000 or 20,000 more than last year, but The 200,000 that comes from Well, that would be part of this budget So that would be part of the tax money that we raise for the town from the town It's not part of our um What do you call it general fund balance or It would be Yes, we are requesting to use the fund balance. I'm sorry. I misled you on that We'd be able to use that to cover The difference in the event even in the event long term that Right, I'm confused we wouldn't get the grant if the voters vote to put 260,000 dollars in the environmental reserve fund It doesn't all that money have to go into the environmental reserve fund. It can't go into the general fund What I was saying is the 200,000 dollars we would Pull that from the general fund that we have right We wouldn't be raising taxes as a result of that because we have money in the general fund It'd be like a one-time use correct. Yes, but but the budget says to See i'm getting confused. I just want to be clear budgeting, but the money would not raise tax We would not raise taxes as a result of that Where's this covered in the capital budget So in the capital budget, so the last few pages are open space It's page nine page nine of the capital budget Actually, this is page nine of the operating budget Oh, yeah, sorry Capital section of the operating budget Yes, so Yes, so this year the request is for 260,000 dollars And our next section that we're going to talk about is revenue And so If you look at the revenue section, we are requesting to pull money from reserves For the environmental fund of 200,000 Yes, where would I find that? That's in the revenue section. Sorry to bounce around so much, but in the revenue section Oh, okay on the 17 Yes, but if you pull that from if you pull that out of your reserves We pull it out of our general fund reserve is a general fund reserve And we're going to move it into the environmental reserve So I believe jeff's question is is if we don't use that if we get the grant And we don't use that. Where does that money stay? It would stay in the environment reserve fund stay in the environmental reserve fund unless There was a request in a different budget to move it back Basically, if we if we do exhaust it, but get the grant we end up with 203,000 Right, that's correct. Yes That's right. So just to make sure and I think I'm getting this now So we're going to fund $260,000 going into the erf by Requesting $60,000 to be raised from taxes In $200,000 to come from the from reserves Yes I misspoke earlier just know it's it's it's it took me a little while to get my Brain around it. We've never done that before. Have we used reserves? Yes. We well We did I think we did one year. We I don't remember exactly the sequence, but we took 110,000 and added it to fund To the in-brem reserve fund and that's money that we had actually I believe it came out of fund balance, but it's money that went into fund balance because we had sold some property Okay, and so I think this isn't the first time we've done something like this You mentioned this is a voting item. This is going to be on the ballot We'll be part of the budget But not a separate line. It's not okay There may very well be a separate line item though Well, I'm not I'm talking about the solar panels Because that is that money to purchase those panels is not in this proposed budget So if the board wants to consider purchasing those it would have to add it as a ballot item To be voted on by the townspeople Or or I mean you could do it yourself. You can add into this budget, but That's another option as well. It would work to purchase on when would that occur? So that's in your capital next fiscal year Next by the church, right? Yes We're in the process of evaluating that right now Yes, we we just got the report from the Company was it last week or the week before? Okay holidays And we've hired a consultant to help and Jennifer's going to go through the numbers and Eric's done some analysis on the Zone as well. So we're going to pull that all information and have it ready for you Yeah, yeah So we'll probably have that for you on the 16th And the last line on here is a new item this year the affordable housing trust fund um that was a Something that the select board wanted to start was the affordable housing trust fund and this is seed money to start that The committee hasn't met yet to my knowledge hasn't been established yet Established yet. So we don't know what their request would be. This is on seed money to start that if the select board wishes to do so And of course, you'll find it on the list of possible reductions as well So if the board doesn't want to proceed with this expenditure then It's highlighted there for you to take out If you so choose Um, one more section chance to answer So I you've got me I'm you never should have brought it up the solar electric panel purchase. I'm looking on page 64 of our capital budget Yes, right now in there is $340,000 So that may get pulled out depending on what I guess I'm asking Should that $340,000 be in the capital budget? and Or if yet at the answer that yes What will it be for? to do So the 340 is The the detail of it is here in the capital budget. Yeah, but it is not part of our Oh, it is part of our line item here so it If you look at on page 8 of the capital budget Where it has the solar electric panels that is going to be a separate line item It's like it's like if we were Purchasing a new fire truck We would show that we want to spend the money for the fire truck But it would require a town vote to actually buy the fire truck And what do you use to decide what things need to be voted on what things not How do you decide in other words this one we're going to vote on and something else we're not the Generally if we're if it's something involves borrowing it's going to involve a separate vote This does not necessarily involve borrowing If the board wanted it could certainly include this in the budget As I said a few moments ago It just felt like an item that was distinct enough To include a separate item, but there's no magic to it The board has taken very large items in the past and just plopped them into the budget I know they did that when we first joined What was then ccta and now is green mountain transit It was a couple hundred thousand dollars and the board said we're going to include in the budget And that's it and the town either votes up the budget or votes it down So that's certainly a possibility for this but staff just felt more comfortable Having this as a separate item And it was large enough that it Made sense to do it. So is the three hundred forty thousand part of your budget then? It's it's not included as in other words the money To pay for that has to be raised in some other manner. It can be through use of fund balance. It can be for borrowing So it's not represented in your that's correct. No in those capital items that we just discussed The the solar panels were not included in that In the capital projects from the operating budget, you'll see it's only 184 000 And capital equipment from the operating budget is only 130 130 800 Capital budget was the town hall file file server replacement. So that's just a Yes, that is so looking to replace our server The other item that is repaired by the manager's office is on page 20. That's our building contingency fund that we started last year So this is for our buildings as they age We want to have just a contingency fund that we're hoping to get up to 30 000 and then keep it at that 30 000 level That's for big items Such as hvc systems where it just makes sense to instead of continuing to repair something to replace it And it's where we can budget for those items for all of the buildings at once We still want our department heads making sure that they're budgeting appropriately for things that are Due to be replaced, but this is a backup just in case we have something large that fails Page 20 of the capital budget. I'm sorry. We're about getting a little That's between the capital expenses in the operating budget and the capital budget. Yes, that's on the cap in the This is the capital budget. Yes page 20 And last year we put 10 000 aside for this. We didn't we haven't had to use any of it yet And we're requesting another 10 this year and then In 2020 it'll be fully funded at the 30 000 level What's going to touch on revenue just briefly? Right now the budget that has been proposed has a tax Increased taking our tax rate from point 265 up to point 2747 We're budgeting interests on taxes do just be a little bit higher. We are As our taxes Get higher and we have more taxpayers. We just tend to have More interest that happens and same with penalties a little bit of an increase there Pimmits in lieu of taxes we do Those are just based on agreements that we have in place for those And that's what we're expecting to see this year and sales rooms meals Tax revenue We are budgeting sales tax to remain the same this year and we are Budgeting to see a 5% increase in rooms and meals tax which is kind of what we've been seeing so far this year Do we find out how the holiday season is has been for our Retail February will be when we get the report because they have until the end of january to submit to the state And then the state turns it around to us usually in the middle of the month any indication. Do you get any indication ahead of time? Okay Other items in the revenue sections Just and I probably asked this question before but what's the what's the proportion between sales Versus rooms and meals The breakdown so if it's 2.86 is it 2,500,000 is sales tax revenue And 360,000 is rooms and meals Yes, yes, no Not at this time Yes, sorry, that was a lot of items tonight Any questions on this? Thank you very much A couple of quick items I want to touch on Most of them are reminders reminder first one Oh, I should start by saying happy new year to everyone The first reminder is our next board meeting is a week from tonight We will be covering A number of different sections including buildings and grounds highway storm water sewer and water The last three storm water sewer and water were added or given to you tonight For your review The legislative breakfast is scheduled for Monday, January 29th We'll be asking Interests for those who are planning on attending and we'll also be looking for one board member to serve as kind of moderator And it probably won't be terry because he's Serves a dual role as a state legislator. So One of the remaining four members will be looking for a moderator Is that oh, yes, yeah For our january 16th meeting we're going to have our first discussion on the keeping of chickens Ordnance and we have arranged for an expert to come in from the vermont public health Um, she's a veterinarian, I guess Uh, and so if it would help She's asked if the board has any questions in advance. Please let staff know we can pass those on to her and finally Act 250 permit Was recently issued for That will allow the transfer of the primag soils Designation from the property that's near Pleasant acres to the man farm property if you recall we had this discussion months ago This act 250 permit is kind of the formal legal step that we have to Had to get and it was approved There are other requirements that we have to do in Putting in the trails and the staff is already working on getting those done So we've made a lot of progress on that And that's all I wanted to highlight I have obviously written report that exceeds what I gave verbally and if the board has any questions on either I'll be happy to answer Any questions for rick? If not we'll go on to other businesses. Is there any other business anybody wishes to bring up tonight? Going once going twice We are adjourned Excuse me All right, stay warm