Please give a warm open group welcome to Lakshmi Malhotra. Hello everybody, it's a great honour to be actually standing here and speaking about IT for IT. So, as Steve mentioned, I've been associated with the forum for about two years and am leading the development of the IT financial management stream. So, today in terms of the agenda, the way I'm going to structure it is I'll be first talking about how the business scenario is changing IT. So what are the changes that we are seeing in IT since the business scenario is changing so rapidly. Then we will get on to what are the challenges that CIOs are facing in running their IT organisations and managing the expectations of business. We'll then move on to what is IT for IT. So I'll do a deep dive into what is IT for IT, what is it that the forum is building, how is it that it will help US practitioners as well as vendors. So we'll do a deep dive into IT for IT. And then we will also compare, so Steve touched upon it, but I'll briefly touch upon how IT for IT compares to other standards because there's a lot of questions that come in that how IT for IT compares to ITIL specifically. I'll be covering that and then in the end we will go into that if IT for IT needs to be implemented, how do you go about implementing IT for IT or what is the method you should use, methodology that you should use for implementing IT for IT. So if you look at this slide, what we're basically trying to say is that the business is expecting the IT to be more effective and efficient. So typically the way IT organizations have worked and somebody raised a question in the last session that they work as a support organization or they worked as a shared service organization. But what with the changing business scenario, what business is expecting IT to do is to be more effective, more efficient and the business is expecting that CIOs need to be business leaders. So CIOs need to run IT like a business rather than like a supporting organization. But if you look at any IT organization, the CIOs typically have focused on fulfilling the needs of business. So what you would have seen is that the business says that okay, these are my demands, this is what I want you to fulfill and the CIOs are busy actually meeting the needs of the business. But they have no time to look at the internal IT organization. So the analogy that I like to usually draw is that the CIO is like a shoemaker. He has the worst shoes. So if you look inside any IT organization, you will see that the way CIO has been managing his organization is not the optimum way. So if I take an example, within a large IT organization, you will see that there are a lot of IT management tools. So there are different departments. There's a development department. There is a strategy department. There's an operations department, a support department and all these departments have basically been working in silos. And for each of these departments, there have been different tools that have been implemented. So the development department has been using some tool for requirement management. Somebody else has been using the testing team has been using some tool for test management. The release team has been using some tools for release management. Similarly, the strategy team is using some tool for investment management. And the support team is using something for incident management, problem management. But these departments do not talk to each other. So these tools do not talk to each other. So the way it happens is that these departments have built in their solutions. They need to talk to each other. The support department needs to talk to the requirement department because the defects need to go back to the requirements. But there's no integration between the two. So what has happened is that there are point to point integrations that have been built in within the CIO organization. So the tools need to talk to each other. The defect management tools needs to give some feed to the requirement management. But there is point to point integration that is there. And it is a sort of a spaghetti. So yesterday there was some reference to spaghetti by one of the speakers saying that within the business that IT services, there is a spaghetti organization. But if you look at the IT department itself, it also has a spaghetti architecture because all the IT management tools do not talk to each other. And there are point to point solutions or there are point to point integrations that have been built between the two. For businesses, so if I look at businesses like a manufacturing, there's an ERP for manufacturing. But there is no ERP for IT. So for a CIO to run his organization starting from strategy to build to deploy to run, he needs a lot of tools. He or she needs a lot of tools. But there is no ERP for the IT organization. There are point to point solutions or point to point integrations that are built between solutions. And the issue that happens because of this is that today if the CIO wants to know that what is the value a particular system is providing to business, there is no way he can determine that. So what would typically happen is that there will be one person from the CIO team who would go and pick up data from 10 different systems and create a report which says, okay, this is a value this particular IT system is generating. So there is no visibility for the CIO to ensure what is the value that a particular system or the value that business is providing to IT. There is no common reference architecture for standardization. So every organization has done it in their own different way. So if somebody is using a PPM from one vendor, a project and portfolio management system from one vendor and an incident management system from another vendor, they have built their own integration. And they spend a lot of time and money to maintain this integration. So if HP comes up with another version of PPM and BMC comes up with another version of remedy, they again need to basically change the integration or they need to spend time and effort and money to rebuild that integration. So there is no common reference architecture that drives the standardization. So there is high cost of maintenance. CIOs are spending a lot of money to basically maintain these integrations. And the strategic problem is that the CIO is not able to tell the business that this is the value that I am providing. So it is more like that CIO is working like a support organization wherein there is a budget that is provided by business to IT and he just ensures, he or she just ensures that they build and maintain systems using that budget. But if somebody questions the CIO what is the value that IT is providing to business, nobody has an answer to that. So that's the problem that most organizations or most large IT organizations are facing. Also, if you look at the landscape, so if IT has been changing very rapidly, so if you look at the left-hand side of the slide, what the left-hand side says is that in the past what was happening is that everything was built mainly inside the IT department. So most of the work was done by the IT departments and they would have one or two vendors to whom they would give large outsourcing contracts. So they had a complex legacy internally but it was mainly inside the firewall and they had only one or two large outsourcing providers to whom they would have a connect who would provide them services. But with the digital disruption or with the way the IT is changing, IT is moving more towards a service broker model. And what that means is that IT is getting more and more services from third-party vendors rather than building it on their own. So more and more IT organizations are looking at basically sourcing services from third-party providers rather than building it from scratch. What happens with that is that you have sourced services from the cloud, you've got a lot of third-party vendors, so your interfaces with the outside world increases. So that's one problem, you have to manage those vendors, you have to manage the interfaces with the third-party. So what you see on the diagram, the circles which are there on the right basically represent that these are your interfaces with the third-party vendors and you need to manage them. The other thing that has happened is that with the internet of things there are more and more people who are connecting their own devices to the IT departments. So there are a lot of companies who have brought in things like bring your own device or there are a lot of other devices that have come in and so there are more and more devices that are connecting to your systems. So security has become a risk. So cyber security is an inherent risk because more connections to your system, more threat of some hacking and all that. And lastly, the expectations from IT has changed. So in the past what used to happen is that if there's a particular IT CIO who says that I'll take one year to deliver a release. So I remember 20 years ago when I started I was a product manager and I would say I would give only two releases in a year and the business had to accept that. But today if I tell the business that I'll give you two releases in a year they are going to tell me that I'll go and get it from a third-party service provider. I don't want your services because a third-party service provider provides me better services. He will do things faster. I'll get software as a service rather than you maintaining my service. So the expectations of business have changed. They want IT to be more agile. They want IT to be more faster. So the landscape has changed. Digital has added a lot of agility and improvement but it has also increased complexity. So the old style of IT, the old style which we have been using for IT is not going to work anymore. And that is where you need a new style of IT and IT for IT comes into picture. So I'll briefly touch upon the questions that the CIOs need to answer. So today CIOs are being asked questions like what is the value that you are providing to me? Why do I need an IT department? I could as well go to a service provider and do it. So the main question is how can I measure the return on my investments? The questions like that there are more and more suppliers that are coming in, more and more vendors that are coming in. So what supplier management model should be used? Then there are things like that how can you shrink delivery timelines? So these are the challenges that the CIOs are facing. And unless the CIO has a complete visibility of what is happening into his IT organization, he or she will not be able to answer these questions. So it's important that the IT department cleans up internally to be able to meet what business requests are from them. And that's where I would say IT for IT comes in. So what IT for IT and I'm going to be talking more from a conceptual perspective because this is a relatively new standard and I would like people to understand what the vision of the forum is. So the forum is basically planning to develop or has already developed a vendor neutral reference architecture that supports an integrated IT management approach. And what this means is that if you look at any IT department, they have processes in place. So IT actually prescribes that these are the processes that you should have within your IT organization. These are the kind of processes or the COVID prescribes you. This is the governance structure. But in terms of the interfaces between the different departments or between the different functions in IT, like how should service strategy talk to service development or what are the kind of interfaces that should be there between service strategy and service development or service development and service operations, there's no standard which basically prescribes that. And the vision of the forum is that they have developed a vendor neutral reference architecture. And when I say a reference architecture, we'll get into a little more detail of that. But the reference architecture is more technical when it talks about that within each function of the IT department, what are the kind of software components or what are the kind of functional components that should be there and what should be the integration points between the IT department, between these IT functions. So the forum is basically developing a vendor neutral reference architecture. The other vision that the forum has, which will take some time to realize is that it will provide a set of open standards to vendors. So what will happen is that if you all might be aware that there are some large vendors which are in the IT management tool space. So there are vendors like IBM, there's HP, there is BMC, there's ServiceNow. So these are some large vendors within this space. The vision that the forum has, which will take some time to realize, is that once the reference architecture is standardized, then each of these vendors will basically get their products certified. So ServiceNow would come and say that certify my product for service operations or for service management. What that would mean is that if somebody gets their product certified for service management, they would have to expose the standard interfaces that the reference architecture prescribes. So if I, as a vendor, go and get my product certified, I will have to have all the functional components that the reference architecture prescribes and expose the standard interfaces that the reference architecture prescribes. So I have a question for all of you. What will come out of that? If each of the vendors, or most of the large vendors, get their IT management tools certified to IT for IT, what will be the outcome? Yes. So there is no need of integration because it will plug and play. So if today somebody is using BMC for service management and an HP for PPM, they don't need to build integration because both of them are IT for IT certified and it becomes more of a plug and play rather than everything. So this vision will take some time to realize, but that's where the forum started from. So the value chain, so this is something that Suresh touched upon briefly. I'll not spend too much time on this slide, but as Suresh mentioned, this is based upon the concept of Michael Porter's value streams or value chain. So what the forum did was they applied the concept of value chain to the IT business. So to run an IT business, what are the value streams that I need? So the strategy to portfolio is basically focusing on plan, how to basically define your IT strategy and how to meet your needs of the business. The requirement to deploy is how to develop or deploy a system because in requirement to deploy, you could either build your system from scratch or you could get it from a third party service provider. The request to fulfill is a new concept in the reference architecture which basically talks about that IT needs to act like a service provider. So IT needs to provide a service catalog to business and business should be able to consume any services using the service catalog. So the request to fulfill is a new concept. Usually it was always plan, built and run, but the request to fulfill talks about how IT can basically set up a service catalog so that business can actually consume services from the catalog rather than asking it a dog. One of the other concepts that the request to fulfill covers, which somebody raised a question in the last session, is that it covers the concept of charge back and billing. So somebody asked that question that how should CIOs convince business what is the value I am providing. So the request to fulfill talks about a charge back mechanism wherein you can charge back business based upon the services that the business uses. So you establish a charge back mechanism and based upon whatever the usage is, IT can basically charge back to business. So that way what will happen is that the CIO is running his or her IT more like a business rather than a supporting shared services organization. They will be able to generate their own revenue because they are charging business based on the services. So these are the four value streams. What you see below are the supporting functions. So these are something that all the value streams basically use. And if I look at the supporting functions, there's not much work that has been done on the supporting functions. The major work that has happened is around finance and assets. And as I mentioned that Accenture has been leading the development of the IT financial management stream because we thought that it is important that even though we're talking about a reference architecture which provides an integrated landscape for a CIO, unless he understands what is the cost of the service and what is the charge back he can do to business, he will not be able to run his or her IT like a business. So the financial management stream is working on how can you determine the cost of a service and how can you do charge back. So the main concepts that the IT FM is working on how to manage IT investments, so there's investment portfolio which is already a part of the standard. We are currently working on the service costing, how to determine the total cost of ownership of a service. And then once we finish that, we will be going to the pricing part wherein we will be providing guidance around how to basically price or how to basically charge back to business, how to price services and charge back to business. So once that happens, then this will even become more powerful because this can be used as a guidance to define or to determine your total cost of ownership of a service and define the rising pricing models within your organization. So there's a lot of work that has happened in finance and assets and as this progresses further, there is work also happening in the intelligence and reporting work stream which is more around KPIs and all that and as there is plan to actually start work on the other work streams as well. So the idea for doing finance was to make IT for IT more attractive to CIOs and CFOs because once you start talking about costing, pricing and charge back, the CIOs, you will immediately get the attention of CIOs because that's something that they've been struggling for so long. Okay. So like if I talk about the strategy to portfolio, the strategy to portfolio focuses more on IT investments, planning and prioritizing IT investments to meet business demands. The requirement to deploy is more about sourcing and developing services. The request to fulfill is more about ensuring that IT becomes more of a service broker wherein it provides a service catalog and does a charge back based upon the business services. And then there are individual supporting streams. So the key things that I want to highlight over here is that the finance, when coupled with the reference architecture, it will help CIOs to run IT like a business because they will be able to track what is the cost of the service, the total cost of ownership of the service and then depending upon the maturity of their organization, they can decide what is the price. There might be some organizations who might decide that, okay, my price will be initially equal to my cost. There might be some organizations who might say that my price is equal to cost plus some premium and that premium is basically their revenue. So when finance gets combined with the value streams, it will basically ensure that IT can run like a business and IT can generate its own revenue. So I think I'll not spend too much time on this slide since Suresh already covered that but the key concept I want to highlight here is that the reference architecture or the value streams are all connected by a service backbone. So if you look at the problems that you see within IT organizations, typically what happens is that when a demand comes in from business, there's some team which created the requirements. Then it went into the design stage and there was a design and development that was done. Maybe there were three or four instances of that services that were deployed and there is no way through which you can basically trace from a conceptual model to the physical model. So the reference architecture has a service model backbone which enables you to actually connect all the pieces together starting from the conceptual service which sits as a part of strategy to portfolio to the logical service which is a part of requirement to deploy to the physical service which is a part which is basically your physical instance of the service. So that is an important concept in the reference architecture and this is the way the reference architecture looks like. So if you look at the reference architecture what you see is on the bottom there's strategy to portfolio on the bottom and there are some blue boxes and some black circles. The blue boxes are basically your functional components and the functional components are, what they mean is that these are the software components that you need for your service strategy to work or for your strategy to portfolio to work. So what the team has done is that they've basically defined that for strategy to portfolio these are the software components you need to basically automate this function.  So the black circles are entities we are saying that these are the primary entities which are there which need to be there as a part of those functional components and the black lines are basically the interfaces. So this is the level one of the reference architecture. There's a level two of the reference architecture which goes into a little more detail which talks about what are the flows between each of the functional components like between the enterprise architecture and the service portfolio what should be the flows and interfaces and what are the kind of cardinality between those two. So for each of the value streams they've gone to the detail of defining that these are the software components that are needed these are the entities that should be there and these are the kind of interfaces that should be exposed. And this is as I mentioned and if you look at this purple circles this is the service backbone which basically connects the conceptual service to the physical service. So when you start from getting demands from business to basically realizing a service then how the service model backbone enables that flow or connectivity from the conceptual to the physical model. Now the way how will this get used so there are two ways in which this can get used one is that I mentioned initially that vendor organizations which are providing IT management tools if they start getting the tools certified on IT for IT and I think the vendor certification program is still not launched it will be launched later in the year but once that gets launched they will be using this reference architecture to see what are the gaps they have in their product with respect to the reference architecture. They will fill those gaps and once they get their product IT for IT certified that means they are following they have these standard entities that the reference architecture prescribes and the standard they expose the standard interfaces that the reference architecture prescribes. So you know that if a product is IT for IT certified it has this software components and it exposes the standard interfaces. So the vendors will be using this reference architecture for that purpose. Organizations or consultants like us how would they use the reference architecture they would basically use the reference architecture to look at what are the gaps that you see within a client's IT organization so if you go to a particular client and the client says that I have got too much spaghetti architecture within my IT landscape you will use the reference architecture to find out where are the gaps and what should be the roadmap for them. So there are two ways in which the reference architecture can be used one for the vendors and the other is basically for the consulting organizations wherein they can use it for the clients to find what are the gaps that are there. So there is a level two of the reference architecture which you can find on the open group and that can be downloaded from there. Now I will briefly touch upon the comparison of IT for IT with other standards. So like Steve was mentioning a lot of questions that come in that how is IT for IT different from ITIL. And most of you may be knowing about ITIL ITIL is more of a process model wherein it says that if you have to set up an IT organization then these are the processes you need to put in place to ensure that your IT organization works right. What IT for IT will do is that it will provide you a reference architecture that can help you connect all these pieces together so it provides you a reference architecture for the software ecosystem through which the CIOs use to manage their IT. And TOGEP and ARCHIMATE you are all aware about that TOGEP is the enterprise architecture standard and ARCHIMATE is a modeling language. And I think somebody later during the day is going to talk about how IT for IT and TOGEP William is going to be talking about how IT for IT and TOGEP William is going to be talking about how IT for IT and TOGEP will be working together so I don't want to steal a standard. So in terms of the implementation how should you go about the implementation of IT for IT? So the way to go about the implementation is that for large organizations the way Shell has been doing it and Shell is one of the organizations that have implemented IT for IT in a big way they have said that they want to embrace IT for IT as the architecture for the business and the way they have done it is that from the top they have a plan in place they have a vision in place and it is being driven from the top saying that okay if we have to comply or if we have to follow the reference architecture for managing our IT then this is the way we will go about. So this basically lists down what are the steps that you could use to basically start for a large organization if IT for IT needs to be implemented the first thing that you need to do is you need to define the problem. So you need to look at what is the current landscape that they have in place what are the gaps that they have do a baseline assessment and develop a business case and get buy-in from stakeholders. So I think this is something that Shell has already done. They've got buy-in from stakeholders so they've decided that yes there's going to be a three-year plan or a two-year plan wherein they are going to implement IT for IT. And then once you have a business case and once you have a vision from once you have a top-down approach where somebody is driving it from the top then you perform a detailed value stream analysis. So depending upon the organization the first value stream that you could pick up could be different. Like I was reading about an example where an insurance company used IT for IT and they said that they will start with R2F because that will help them understand they did not know what are the services IT provides to business. So they said that will help them understand the services that IT is providing to business and they will be able to build a service catalog so that will become their starting point. There's some organizations which decide to start from D to C wherein they say because Detect to Correct is all about service operations so they want to get their service operations right. So depending upon the organization's pain point you can decide which is the area you want to work upon first and you do a value stream analysis and you start working on that. So understand the problem is do a detailed value stream analysis you define IT for IT ownership and governance model so that you ensure that this is driven from the top and then you develop a vision, mission and strategy for IT organization. So I remember one of the speakers yesterday also said that it is important to develop a vision. When you're doing an enterprise architecture also it is important to develop a vision because that vision actually helps you drive the entire thing and then define your target state using the reference architecture and then put down a roadmap for implementation. So typically these are long projects because if you're talking about a large IT organization which has a budget of about 3 to 4 billion dollars and if they want to set their IT organization right they might be using multitude of vendors they might be using several incident management tools because every vendor has come up with their own incident management tools. So it is typically a two to three year roadmap wherein for large organizations if you want to implement IT for IT. So that is one way in which you can implement IT for IT if it is driven from the top. The other if a particular organization has not bought into IT for IT or they're not sure about the value that IT for IT is providing and they do not have budgets to get their IT organization right you could start small wherein you could basically take some use cases. So things like that they could say that for any new service that we are launching we will try to use IT for IT. So for example if they're launching a new service and if they're using a third party service provider for that service then they could say that the tools that you come in should be IT for IT certified or in the RFP they could mention that the tools that you provide for IT management could be IT for IT certified. So that way you could start small wherein you don't have a big bang approach you don't need a full-fledged budget but you start with your newer services and you ensure that the principle of the reference architecture is included in those new services and then slowly actually take it to the top. So this could be another approach that you could use IT for IT for a smaller organization or for an organization who is not ready to actually set aside a budget for IT for IT. So this could be another approach that you could use. So I think that's what I had for my session. The idea was to give you an overview of what is there as a part of the reference architecture and thanks everybody for listening.


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Thank you so much Martina. Yeah, hello everyone. I like to talk about the 3D scanning. Can you see my screen? Yes, it looks good. Awesome, good. I like to talk about the 3D scanning in the 3D production or like in the 3D print. So all the time when I get in contact with people that they need a scan or need a 3D scan, especially conservators, I look at a lot of problems in that matter that the pieces are most of the time broken. So in the normal way you have like your art piece here, this SLA print, like a whole print, an SLA print, from there you have the data and with the data and the G-code you print. But what's happened when the print has a damage? So what happens when something gets broken or gets missing and you don't have the file or the G-code anymore, you need to reproduce the data. So that's happening with a 3D scan. So you start scanning the broken part and you do like a reverse engineering and with this data you're able to print again and fix the sculpture or you do like the whole sculpture again. In 3D scanning there are different methods. I go through them. We have like structure, light scanning, photogrammetry and leader scan and then there is like CT and emery. I don't touch them because that's like a total other field and when I work with this kind of scans it's a lot like the amount of work gets like tremendous. So there are like so many scanners out there. Probably you all saw one of them and we tried to sort them in different groups like in the first group we have the structure light scans. The structure light scans is like the biggest group. There are so many structure light scans out there from different companies and they change like the changing and the progress in their quality is like really enormous. It goes really fast. The next one is the photogrammetry. The photogrammetry is all about cameras and drones of course. And the leader scan it's also a big field. It comes like from scanning like topology and in these three groups I work the most like we're in the structure light scan the photogrammetry and the leader scan we have all the tools to scan art pieces or parts of museums. And the first group the structure light scan works like this we have like most of the time to cameras and the two cameras look at the object and projector is sending out. And a structure or a stripe pattern on the object. So on the right side we have like this loop and on the loop we produce with the scanner the pattern that is written by the scanner. In photogrammetry in the next step we make a lot of pictures and these pictures get written by the software and the software is checking for like identical points on the on the pictures and with that the software can reproduce. The whole 3d image and makes like point clouds of it. So we have like here on the right side we have the sculpture still in the box and we took like a lot of images. I think it's about 100 120 to get like the 3d model on the right side. So as more picture you take and as higher the resolution of the cameras as better days. The last one is like last group is the leader scan the leader scan group is quite a special group because first like the scanners are crazy expensive and they're used more for like scanning bigger objects like houses or streets or something but we use them also in museums for for bigger sculptures for whole installations and to get like a 3d scan of them how it works like a laser is shooting out of the scanner and gets back to the scanner and then the distance or the time between this shooting out and the coming back gets an information for the scanner and like this the scanner can make also like a point cloud for for the program. And as you can see here on the right side leader get used also to do art and on the top we have like a picture of a whole valley. It was made by a leader scan. So all these points that the scanner was taking from the landscape. I got into a file and the file was displayed as an art piece. And on the right side on the bottom we have whole museum scanned. It was also an installation through the whole museum and as a conservators aspect. They decide to scan like the whole museum with the sculpture in it. So that makes a lot of sense if you bring it back to the museum or if if you want to have like a data set. Just to save the art piece. So we have the three common versions of 3d scanning on the top we see the three technical drawings and on the bottom we have like the outcome of this three technical specs. So on the end the software is all the time doing like a point cloud. This are like 3d points in the three dimensional room and out of that the program is doing a poly mesh. So you actually have like a surface or like an object as a 3d object. So all scans normally work like this we have like the object we scan and then we go to the computer and process the scan. And after that we bring it through a slicer software to the printer. Especially here like the one scanner that you see here has like actually everything in it so the scanner already processes data and you can go directly to the slicer and to the printer. In my experience I work a lot like daily with scans and the biggest workload is like working with the scans after they got scanned. So for like work make like the workload in different parts I would think one fourth of the workload is like the scanning and then three fourths are like data correction also modeling and then making the file ready for print. And here you can see like the three steps on the computers is like the 3d scan software, the modeling software, and then also like the 3d slicer software. So for scanning. The big issue with a scanner is that you can't scan everything. I got a lot in contact with with museums and also with artists, they bring object to me or they show me objects. They're really hard to scan and this little scanner shows what works and what doesn't work or on the left side what works with a lot of effort. So like a really dark surfaces, reflective surfaces, shiny, clear, hairy, close geometries and undercuts. What I mean with like close geometries are like a ball with holes in it. It's really hard because you can only scan what what you can see by your eye. So, because they're all like optical systems. They only work what they can actually see. So if you have like a 2d poll in an object the scanner is not able to reproduce this whole or like on the pineapple, especially on the leaf part. There are so many undercuts and really deep holes between the leaves. They're really hard to scan. Also, for like the fox here, the light or the optical input that gets a shoot at the object just disappears. So the scanner gets no information back and also with glass and mirrors. There is like so much distortion that the scanner doesn't work. And then on the other side on the positive side everything else works quite well so most of the time in in museum. Museum calls me the most of the time there is gold involved or glass involved, or a fabric involved that is hard to scan so it's a lot that we have to find a solution to scan the part. If it doesn't work, we have to go and take a CT scan or emery and to actually get the parts they can't be scanned by the optical systems. That's also like a picture that I showed a lot my students what I want to say with this picture is like you really have to decide which scanner you use for which kind of object like size wise. It doesn't make sense that you take a scanner that's like a bigger resolution like a too big resolution, but it's not able to scan like huge objects. It's all the time. There is a question between resolution and scan like the field of of you of the scanner. So if you have like small parts of course you can go with the much higher resolution, like if you have a coin, you go with the little brush on the left side. You want to catch all details. But if you have like a huge sculpture. You go more like with the big truck on the right side because most of the time, you want to catch on the coin you want to catch every detail. And on the huge sculpture. Normally, you want to only capture like the overall geometry. Of course, there are some expect exceptions, where you go with the little brush to the huge sculpture, but then you have like a crazy workload, and also like data that goes like into like terabytes of data. And in my daily daily work. Normally, my files are around three to eight gigs. In one file and you use a strong computers, only to handle them. Of course, on the end, the output is much smaller. But because the scanner, they don't scan just the surface one time during scanning you scan the surface like many times and so you the data gets really huge. And now we show you some examples from my work. Here we have a little swan. The city of Syria was afraid that because of the bronze and the value of the bronze. People would steal the swan. And so they decide to scan it, just as backup. So we took the swan and scan the whole sculpture. And on the end, it went back and the backup stays now at the city, and they were able to reproduce the swan. If it gets like stolen, because of his value, like metal value. That's like the final scan. Another field that I work with it's like with the violin conservator. Here, we do some some patches. So we first scan the bottom of the violin. And then you can see the pattern that is thrown from the scanner to the surface, and then the two cameras picking up the information. And then the 3D scan, we do a cheat code. And with the cheat code we mill piece that gets into the bottom of the violin. And on the end, everything fits really well. So one of my work is to help conservators. Also, when there is like defection or like broken pieces on art works, we scan the works and we reproduce the surface on the art piece so the conservator can work on the copy actually. And on the end, the new piece fits exactly to the original broken piece. I hope that's understandable. And here, it's a foot of a Chocometti sculpture. And on the left side, we have clay, like the original clay scanned. And on the right side, we have the bronze with the signing of Chocometti. And what we figure out here or try to show is like if is the bronze sculpture really from the original plaster. And as you can see, we did some calculations. And there are really, as it shows the lot is green, a lot of the surface is green that means like it fits really well so we have like a 0.1 millimeter from the shrinking during the casting process. So actually like the clay like the original clay, sorry plaster sculpture, and the bronze sculpture are both originals. And the last work, just want to show because it's a really nice work from the artist Maya France in Zurich. It's a part of the Trevi fountain in Rome, and cast with coins, Euro coins, the sculpture stands in the backyard of the final Institute of the University of Zurich. So what we did, we went to Rome and took a lot of photographs from the Trevi fountain. And after that we did the photogrammetry, all legal. And because there was a big distance between the fountain border and the actual sculpture, we had to do a lot of sculpting. And the data was like milled in styrofoam and afterwards got casted and ended up as a fountain made out of Euro coins. They're the one that are thrown into the fountain. And they stay now in the backyard of the final Institute of the University of Zurich. In that way I say thank you. I hope I was able to show you an overview about the different techniques for 3D scanning. If you have any questions, please reach out to me and in this way. Thank you.


What do you say we go in the Colorado Trail? Morning. It is a lot colder today. I think it's because we're at about almost 10,000 feet You see my breath a little bit And now it's time for the frozen Nutella peanut butter tortilla wrap breakfast extravaganza Good morning, Henry. How'd you sleep buddy? Yeah, it's a little cold. That's all right. How long to take all you goofballs to pack up in the morning? Usually kind of a long time. We're not very efficient, but Can't get out of the tent. There's still somebody in the tent. Oh, man. Come on. Wake up, buddy Wake up There's biking to be done. All right, it looks like I have everything packed onto the bike You always want to double check make sure you're not leaving anything in the field Thank you ground There's the goofballs, let's go say goodbye. Well, it's fun camping with you guys. You guys have a good one Best of luck down the road. Yep. Same goes for you. You're gonna have a great time. It's so good to meet you, brother Have fun out there. Thank you. Yeah. Bye. Bye. Adios nos vemos Here we go another day in beautiful Colorado Paradise Today I will head back on to the Colorado Trail In about seven miles be done with this wilderness detour and I'm excited about that You know as much as you can crank out miles on these detours. I came here for the single track Really enjoyed meeting those young guys, you know, it's inspirational I never did anything that big when I was in high school and they're out here on their own their first bike packing trip They've barely been mountain biking in their lives and they're just figuring it out as they go, you know And I like that I'm very impressed The sky is a little bit hazy.  It's usually because of forest fire smoke So today I'm gonna try to get to Silverthorn, which is a little bit off-route but It's very on-route For my life because that's where my brother lives and his wife and his cute little kids And I'm gonna try to make it there There's gonna be two big mountain passes in the way first Kenosha in Georgia pass And I should be able to make it It's about 50 miles away and guess what it's time for a little bit of no crashies no flatties no whammies It's gonna be a beautiful Sunday. I Can feel it. You know when you wake up and you just feel like It's gonna be a good day That's how I feel right now. That's how I feel most of the time, but especially when I'm on a bike trip The days out here are just So spectacular in every way This is when I feel most alive when I'm on my bike all day and sleeping under the stars and just Loving life to the max Well lucky here we're back on the rad ale It only took 70 miles to get back to this point and I'm excited to be back on this beautiful single track Oh baby Feels so good to be back But I found it's my lucky sage And it smells really really fresh. It's got a powerful smell Gonna keep this with me. It's my good luck sage Nice little downhill to get it started But now it's up And you can tell by how hard I'm breathing whoo, there's not as much oxygen in the air up here Even though I'm from Boulder. This is about twice the altitude of Boulder So I'm feeling it and the sign back there said six miles To Kenosha path so on these long steep technical uphills I get into a bit of a meditative mode.  He's such a great companion. I can talk to him the whole time. The thing I say most often is Henry wait wait Henry Henry wait Because he gets too excited because he's so far ahead of me and I don't want him to run into a bear Yeah, that must make you feel more comfortable at night time, huh? Yeah, they're bringing a stick a little closer. There you go, buddy You're just like my friend Mira. You want to play with Mira someday? Oh, okay. Let it go Let it go. Oh, you're exactly like Mira There you go. Let it go. Let it go. Okay. You ready? You ready? Oh This feels so good. I love playing with dogs Well, I wish you all the best on the trail. Yeah, all right by Henry. Are you coming with me?  This is incredible The dangerous thing I do today is probably crossing this road with Sunday camper traffic Gosh, what a zoo. There's a lot of people here. All I need to do is get there Hurry All right. I might have an opening Okay, it's close. Okay I did it All right So here I am daydreaming amongst the aspen that I run into this group But I'm like on your left and I go by they're like Ryan van dozer. How you doing? Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. So you actually watched the videos, huh? Oh, yeah, all of them.  Well, I I was in desperate need of some weight loss and I Have a lot of COVID. Yeah. Well, we were home I'd had a bariatric surgery to lose weight and I'd lost all but about 40 pounds Great yet to go and I said, I just discovered you accidentally on YouTube next thing You know, I was on my bike every day lost the final 40 pounds lost a total of 115 pounds and And we're now vacationing in Colorado Doing hiking. Yeah, I love that used to be on the couch That's so cool. You got out there. You did it. Yeah, and where are you from? Independence, Missouri. Oh, really? Yeah, no way. So we still watch you. Oh, I appreciate it It means the world to me. Yeah, and what do you love most about this newfound life of being outdoors and stuff? It's a mood lifter. Yeah, that's exactly what it is. It's like if I'm indoors. Yeah, I'm depressed I have to get outside. It's a desperate need to get out You know, I didn't have that before for a decade or so in my life And you're proof that it makes a huge difference in your life. Yeah. Oh, that's so awesome I think the kids are happy. Yeah. Yeah, these are the kids. Yeah, these are the kids. Hi. Nice to meet you. Welcome to Colorado You love it here? Cool. And look at these smiles. Those are genuine smiles from being in the outdoor time Yeah, that's so cool. It was so wonderful to meet you. You just made my heart happy Thanks for being patron supporters Yeah, I love it We talked about going to Boulder to actually try to run into you Yeah, and and because you get a we get a cup of coffee or something, right? Totally. It's on your thing or something. That's right Yeah, absolutely. This is better. No, not coffee a burrito It was a burrito. A burrito, yeah Yeah, yeah, well, this is your patron reward I came here today because I knew you'd be here and I wanted to say hi What kind kind people so glad I ran into them and was able to wish them well on their Colorado vacation drove out here all the way from Missouri Got all the kids with them Love it, you know, I don't want to sound like I'm bragging but it's just it's cool to know that people watch my videos all Over the place and that it really impacts them in a positive way That's always been the goal is to make the world a better place you know and inspire people to get outside and When I meet people in real life who tell me that it just hits home. I call that the emotional paycheck You know because YouTube doesn't pay big bucks But when I have an encounter like that, that's worth 10 million dollars Beautiful I am in heaven It's gonna take me forever to finish this trail as much as I stop and talk to people and film flowers But I don't care. This is absolutely Stunning Oh, man, I was like, why did I do that? I Was really close to falling off that it would have been catastrophic So I figure this is my lucky creek and I'm gonna fill up Cold mountain water. I don't think I've ever seen so many columbines In one place in my life whoa Way to go Colorado The flowers are awesome. I like to see this trail magic and it's gonna be a surprise. It doesn't say what the magic is All right, I found the trail magic people Hello How's it going? Very good. You're lucky. You're like the number two person for the day. Oh really? Yeah, and what do you have here? What's the magical? We got hot dogs. We got quesadilla. Are you kidding? We got What else we have we're gonna do pancakes if people wanted them. That's amazing. Whatever you want. What's your name? I'm Luke, but my friends call me bus. What's up, boss? Nice to meet you. What's your name? So great to meet you. This is amazing. This is amazing. I love it. It's a whole setup So I make these sticker designs. They're all based on my own through hikes I'm on the PCT and AT and yeah, these are my silhouette ones. And what inspired you two to be out here today? Luke and I connected over social media and Luke you tell the story. I Don't know. I feel like we just became friends because we both Hike and do things that are fun. So you did this last year you said? Yeah I did it last year. It was a good time. Now. I'm just trying to give a little back and Yeah, this is what we're doing. So you hiked all of this in here. We did this morning Yeah, that's impressive and we hiked it in yesterday morning and we'll hike it out We have to hike it in and out every day. Wow. Yeah, it's impressive And so what are you gonna make now? Quesadilla for you, man. Quesadilla. Oh, oh man That looks good. I'm gonna go. Look at this cute little monster. Oh Yeah, just lay down there, buddy Feels good, doesn't it? Oh Yeah Luke, thank you so much for this quesadilla. You're the man. Yeah. Oh, it's so nice to have some hot food Have a good one. Keep on spreading the love Thank you. Well today has been a great day so far. I haven't gotten very far, but that's okay Having the time of my life Sometimes you got to go slow and take it all in and now I'm on my way up Georgia pass Which looks very steep. So it's a good thing. I got that quesadilla So these cameras never give you a real good idea of how steep things are, but let me assure you This is very steep I'm gonna be going up to 12,000 feet. I think I'm at about just under 10 right now So I've got a ways to go Helps to grunt Get sipping over the big stuff Oh Says the grade is 8% here That's pretty good And sometimes you just have to stop and walk so I've been riding full blast for like 30 minutes and I've barely made any progress on my altimeter But poco a poco keep going forward you get there Water Here we go. We're pedaling We're going. I'm getting above tree line now Getting higher This has been a long slog uphill It's hard to ride a bike with one hand When you're going uphill technical train Excuse me. I'll get back to you shortly. That wasn't so bad Top of Georgia pass almost 12,000 feet And it is beautiful up here. There's really like not any clouds in the sky My favorite part This is so fun So fun I'm loving this can't go through that on a busy highway And my brother is nice enough to come and pick me up I'm five miles outside of where he lives and felt silverthorn and then tomorrow. I will start right back There I've been dreaming about this meal all day. Do you know that Carter? So I'm here at my brother's house at the van dozer restaurant Carter is the chef of the day This made us in a great meal. This is my brother. He was too shy last time to be on camera for the great divide videos That's my wonderful brother. He really doesn't like to be on camera So I'm just gonna hold the camera here and make him awkward And this is his wonderful wife Haley. Hi. Thanks for having a stinky biker over Yeah, so these are the sauteed mushrooms a la Carter Thank you all so much. This is really special This means a lot to me. Thanks for coming over. Yeah. Thank you guys It is time for our special summer tradition making Sticky Perfectly smored so Brinley you're gonna give me your bed for the night. Yeah, you're very nice. I promise not to pee in it No, seriously, thank you very much. It's been good hanging out with you too and tickle your feet. Good night


I tell I guess it's just is it just you and me today Hi, I hope not yeah, not that there's anything wrong with you, right? I got it. I understand No, just a little bit shocked to come in. I was like, oh my gosh. I'm late and come in. It's well Only two people. Oh, there we go. There we go. Now it's starting to look like more normal greetings my Taylor it was Geoffrey's day to the lead today, but I think he's out so I Might be leading Okay, I just posted the meeting notes books can add themselves to those and add any agenda items Hey, Pankai Did you add a review today to the Sorry, I've been busy with something else. No worries. It keeps showing that like I've hit the Re-request review on a PR and And you keep coming back as if you've already done a review and asked for a change No, something must be wrong. Yeah I'm doing it again. I'm gonna click the little button Strange things that I have it in today in various computers I'm not sure what the hell is going on We had an early morning call and people kept audio drop all the time. We'll figure it out networking problems Greetings folks, we'll get started And I meant it or two here if you have a topic you'd like to talk about add it to the meeting notes Please add your name as well Okay, let's see. What do we got? So I just wanted to say that I didn't do my homework My cat ate my homework. That's my excuse All right But we did had a shorter week last week. So hopefully I'll get to it this week. I Understand hey Bill is that Okay, and there's Watson. I think everybody's connected to audio so meeting notes and Zoom chat And the calendar invite all that this call is being recorded and will be posted to the CNCF YouTube channel for the CNF working group You probably got the notice when you joined hopefully and zoom Does anyone have anything they'd like to add to the agenda? Something's going on with my Okay, there we go Google Docs is phrasing for me this Document might be getting too large I don't know 54 pages November 2020 But we may want to archive Some of it but it loaded for me. So does anyone have anything they'd like to add to the agenda? any are there any Talks that folks know of that have been accepted that you want to Tell everyone about so that we can Have the community now it's interesting for this group Taylor, this is all over I am. I think I kind of missed when you were well I was just too slow to respond when you were asking about adding to the agenda I'm just looking here. Sorry. I was curious if we had this last week We had some conversations and I think we kind of had Did I'm looking for it next week? Yeah, I like progress. I mean there was some No, there was some long conversations there. I'm just curious about one of the things that you know, at least I mentioned I think along with some other comments that were that were aired last last session You know about the potential for some sort of high level Ambition slash gold slash and maybe not objective, but I think we all I think we generally know why we're here but I think as far as Having some kind of vision to when do we when would we like to have some things done along the way that kind of gives us a Sense of whether we're making that progress or or if we're kind of just standing still and doing circles I don't know if that's something we can have on the agenda Or not or if everyone if there's others who feel like we've already had that conversation and we know what to do I don't know how level goals What is a target? Are you thinking like short-term mid-term? What are you thinking Oliver like the goal or further out? If you want what we could do is when we get to this there's there is actually a discussion that was started I think back in March I threw something out there. I think we just had a lot going on I think Ian might have commented on it and I've just you know pushed it again with a sort of to Ian saying hey Is this something that maybe we could revisit and consider so if you look up in the discussions when we get to this point You'll see there's there is something there people want to look at that and maybe Maybe we could iterate there to see if something can come out All right, and are you saying it's in the Google doc in from March? No, no, it's it's a it's just a discussion on in our In our get-up discussion. Oh All right. Yeah, I'll yeah, I was gonna throw it out It's the very first one right CNF working group high-level roadmap slash ambition Sure I Drop this in I feel like we could have a longer discussion about that So I'm gonna maybe put it after but it's related to what I was gonna go over okay, I'm Just kind of like how to get started and and that would tie on where are we gonna go of course, but Let's see I'll go back and see if there's Anything like open Conversation is Tal you're saying you didn't get to something was it about the free diameter. Oh No, not exactly It was suggested. Okay, nevermind That's fine. If you didn't if there's nothing to discuss tal. I was just saying if there's anything for today Alright alright It's come up Well, okay, so I'll just kind of jump in then I had asked if anyone has anything for kubecon then please Drop some links. There is going to be an intro and deep dive and maybe Talking about some of the practices and stuff and going into it at kubecon And From the group so this would be like who's seen a fork group and what are we doing? But are there any other if there's any other Talks that you all know about then please Adam Adam here so that the group knows and I guess same for ONES which is Same time right before I think it's at the start of kubecon Does anyone Involved with MWC or is there something interesting there mobile world Congress in Los Angeles. All right, I'll jump into the rest of the agenda so leading up to and I Would I would work backwards if we already had it all over But if we don't have something I don't really want to start a big open discussion then come back that I guess the General goals right now. I We somewhat have a specific one right now, but where does it go beyond that not be of question and the discussion but we do want to end up with a whole set of best practices That Whether you're ops in an ops team or a developer you could come and say here's a set of best practices and which ones are useful for me and that could be something there may be Will not just make there's see if we'll end up with the some type of Set a subset similar to the Kubernetes conformance program is Is a subset of VD test so there will be some set that's here's the set that's recommended and That's further out But right now it's we were trying to build that list of here's best practices and and then They can be picked I'll a cart I guess for whoever's needing them So if you're implementing great, you're building the certification cool You're an ops team and trying to look for something whatever it is We're trying to build the set right now But we can come back to like Some specific ambitions Oliver and that when we look at that discussion But so if you're coming in the scene of working group and you're saying Where do I contribute? There's been comments about this like how do I how do I know where to get started or where? Can I write stuff? I Think we probably need to put more in a like a getting started or could be a link off the contributor Or maybe a section in the contributor Guide because this stuff will get lost and it might have been mentioned like a year ago But nobody knows oh we have this so that's what this is about so where can you contribute the best practice proposals? Adding for any of this you can get in an ad and that might be async Write in to content. That's there Wherever it is or you can reach out to someone if you want to have like a pairing session working session on stuff I've been doing that. I'm open just reach out to me Other people are as well So best practice proposals the use cases and then I think an important thing is We do want supplemental content. That's why I'm calling it supplemental so the exceptions Implementation examples tell you point out a lot of the stuff where it's okay. How do I actually start using this in practice? I Like the concept, but how do I use it? So we need that content I don't think we're gonna have one document that has everything It's probably gonna be a whole set and then it'll expand and someone will go. Oh, here's my environment So all of that stuff is good And if that's where you're passionate or where you're needing to fix things then we want that That's all related to the context of why something would be useful and how to use it and then general updates You know, if there's people are coming in a lot of y'all have Contributed this way in making things clearer in the documentation Use cases everything else Spelling grammar is always important and then I think a big one is reference links So we're talking about a lot of stuff but being able to go and read like where did it come from those resource links and stuff so When you drop them in to the notes Or the chat let's try to make sure that they get somewhere like longer term so that everyone else can go and Read that and learn So Writing up Existing content so Whether you want to draft Work on a draft that's existing or new content We want to add the references to the external content. So if it's just something that's Idea that's fine probably better for the discussion board, but eventually we need to have enough references that It's clear that this is a good practice or that it's a common use case So that we can make decisions on does this work for me like how does it apply? and Don't feel that you have to do new content So trying to make sure that's understood if if you feel like you can contribute But maybe not start from scratch then we can expand on existing stuff And it may turn out that it's expands enough that we need to split it off into something new And that would tie in with this likes Anything where we feel like a purpose or something as large enough in itself that we can dig into Probably should be split off and then we have smaller chunks that we can complete Opening pull requests of course to add new or two existing content so then I think one of the other items and I see your comment here tell on hack and day is like where can we work so they the github repo itself you can put pull requests in against existing content and the repo itself and We can continue to iterate on that But modifying or doing a direct commit Let's just say you bring up the editor in github Then unless someone's sitting with you or you're doing like a zoom share then probably that modification is going to be you working solo Now you can do I do zoom and whatever else so we can do that But if you want actual collaborative editing then we want to support that and we've created different places to do that so in the the telecom user group the CNC f-drive we actually have a a sub folder called CNF working group and You can drop content in here. So this could be the supplemental content new use cases whatever else and This will be accessible to whoever Has a link to that and you can modify that and We have a hack and D. This is a like a whole Area with different Docs if you're if you're like using markdown For those who aren't familiar with hack and D. It's a markdown editor and it allows Multiple people to modify at the same time You have this split view so you can see what's rendered versus what you're editing or go straight edit and You should have access Automatically if you don't and then there may be a setting that's changed. I can check that out or I Can always add use directly if you send an email. I can Add your email address so that you can access the hack and D so I guess for right now just If if you want access and you don't have access then ping myself I'll try to make sure like a Jeffrey and Ian and and some other folks also have Can make sure and add people but you should have a capability to go in there and work You feel free to go use whatever you want I'm just talking about stuff that we've tried to set up for the group So if if if you're wanting to use another markdown editor or some other sharing Google Docs type thing by all means do it. We've used it's Diagram Lee had a different name. I don't remember what that was. I'm just gonna click go here Yeah, whatever This is a Diagramming software that supports collaborative editing draw IO. I think that was what it was originally called now It's diagram Lee, but you can if you want something besides say a Google presentation then you can You can go into that and Share these and this actually can go into I don't know if you saw it Kind of went there quickly, but you can have it saved to Google Drive So you could actually select like the scene of working group drive and then have The diagram saved right in there and then they can be opened and modified by other people easily But you can also just upload, you know like a if you're Doing something and Dia or whatever you're using you can do it there as well and then of course the The other thing is the get up discussions so We can keep adding here and I think Tal one of the things that you were promoting was That the discussions were not lost like the importance of the discussions happening in the PRs Would continue like if people are wanting to talk about stuff So bringing those over into the get-up discussions so that they can be ongoing We also slack in the working group and stuff, but for a collaboration. I think the hack and day the get-up discussions and then being able to do any type of Google Document or whatever in the Google Drive would be the main ones. So that's really it I just wanted to bring these back up because I think some of them haven't been mentioned and you know Over six months that they're there and if you just didn't happen to catch them You may not even realize that they're available any questions comments Anything else? Yeah, I just to say, you know, we have a lot of ways to Contribute and to collaborate But it's kind of up to all of us to take the initiative and start generating content Eventually, it'll be boiled down. We believe to you know, very useful documents that consumers of this working group would be be would be able to use but Yeah, I think we just have to start doing it It's a note for everybody including myself Yeah, I agree. If you look at something like 12-factor apps it didn't start Like this this is not what they had when it got started I don't maybe if we could dig in an old archive or something but This is expanded like you now have the diagrams and I would say some use cases and other content here that you didn't have when this came out But that's where we are right now and I think if if you Feel that you can't have you don't have the time or whatever else whatever reason To have a completed thing where you say I'm going to write up something that totally covers concurrency in a way that Everyone is going to be satisfied. That's not what we're trying to do right now. We're trying to get any content and Build towards this will eventually get towards something where we can say this this concept We're happy with where it is today and so let's say yes We can tell people we like that one and then move on we may come back and update I know personally from looking at like the 12 factor apps and some other places where they have things listed Over the years they'll get updated But right now what we're saying is anything that you can contribute and try to help add to Will help us move towards that goal and that's what's important And exactly what you're saying tell just we're we're wanting people to move forward and if you want help Then if you'd like to do something, but don't know where to get started like here's some ideas, but reach out to me if you are Jeffrey Ian or any of us and just say what where would be a specific area, you know That you could work and do some contributions All right, let's move on to Oliver your Ambitions high-level roadmap Yeah, I mean this well, let me just say two things one is this is fairly old this as you see it's March So I had just at the time when we were you know, we were already several months into it Just trying to for myself think about you know, I think even bill was you know early days We were saying well, maybe by the summer or you know by cube calm We might have you know our first set of best practices So, you know, I was just kind of trying to play out with the idea of something lightweight, you know Just to try to give us some some some goals I'm not sure that the right way to do this is to have a you know I think we need to either agree or disagree to have one and then if we do maybe we work on it you know offline because I Think it'll be more efficient way of working But you know the first question is then really do we feel like we are there others who feel like we need this as well? This there's a second part to it as well for myself at least And and and daily you just walked us kind of through all the different ways that we can help and contribute I'm not sure if it's just myself, but I sometimes start to lose the picture of for example We know we've been very focused on generating use cases. We have some use cases that are now, you know been approved and You know, I don't know how many more we need, right? I know we need more. I don't the point is What at what point do we are we able to start to extract? Will we know it when we get there and everybody starts to feel comfortable? Or is it something that we can already say today that we're gonna need at least 20 30 use cases before we can Start to extract so it's a little bit of what are we trying to achieve? but it's also how are we getting there with you know, just a High-level view for people who may not really fully follow The steps that were that were taken. Does that make sense? Makes sense to me Let other people respond Yeah, it makes a lot of sense to me as long I like that you called it ambition Rather than roadmap maybe because it's going to be evolving What we don't need is a gun to our head telling us, you know, get out those best practices by this state To an extent it will be ready when it's ready, but you know, we we need to work towards something So we can keep this You know, I kind of wish sometimes we have so many ways to contribute But I feel like the the most natural way for us at this stage is something like a wiki, you know it could be Google Docs or hack and D or other things but You know, this isn't a discussion, but to an extent it should be linked You know up front so anybody coming to the work group will immediately be able to see The roadmap as long as you make it clear that this is the roadmap is something that's evolving and You know, we can we can keep updating it when we feel we're not going to reach that target right now So we'll just move it forward Yeah, I agree with you Tal as well. I mean it and I Was struck as you can see even when I wrote I was like, you know struggling to recall us a road map and ambition I mean the point is just to simply say Why am I here? What am I trying to accomplish until we change it? You say, you know, okay q1 q2 q3 This is what we're hoping for and we can you know, we can always adjust it But I think it at least allows us to also reflect, you know, wow We were really ambitious, but we didn't get to where we wanted to be alright. No problem You know, did we learn anything from that great, you know Move on and try to be you know, try to use every lesson learned to the for the next step My key here or the key word for me is this should be lightweight, right? I mean, it's it's not meant to do anything else than help us navigate Yeah, and to the point you made Olivia earlier that you know When when are we actually gonna have enough use cases to do something? Well, we already do I think even one use case should be enough that the trick is Somebody needs to take the initiative to say, okay I'm gonna tackle this and start writing the best practices for for this use case and Maybe we're just being timid about starting with it, but I think I'm I'm always in favor of just start sneezing things on paper Just just start writing nothing is set in stone um part of the reason why it was Not so happy with the github process of writing things that everything feels just very formal and You know, you do a pull request and then there are different people proves There seems to be the the barrier of contribution So far it's been a little bit difficult but if you know If you feel you have something to say about a use case you can just start a Google map a Google doc And add a lot of to-dos in it. Nothing has to be You know, I don't think any of us is expecting like a complete thing like the 12 factor Website that Taylor saw right now, right? We're gonna work towards it But we we we should nothing is stopping us from starting it right now with just one use case It's just a matter of somebody saying, okay, this is something I know a lot about and I want to give it the opening shot It's a great opportunity to you get to really influence kind of the the ongoing discussion on that topic, right, so Yeah, an example I give you know the work I did on CNF operators, right? I definitely need to follow up on that and and turn it into something more integrated with our work, but It helped me a lot just to start writing and give me the the topics, you know the The list of points which which are could be pain points could be Points of discussion of interests of controversy We need more of these opening shots, that's what I feel right so I I guess tell you kind of said it as far as the When can we start? I'll expand on that for my viewpoint the It's this is where Any of the contributions are wherever you want. There's nothing where we're saying in in this group You must contribute in this area. So if you feel like Where you can contribute is more use cases we can keep adding use cases and if there's a use case where You're identifying a best practice and we can write that and that's related to you know tells saying you saying We it's when people step up to that so that's Interest, you know need whatever whatever's driving you for that if you feel like it should happen But you can't figure it out That would be where maybe you can reach out The principle of least privilege was the the reason why Ian and I ended up going this path is we had There was a pretty big set of discussions Already Applying principle of least privilege and we felt like we could start here. So there's a discussion around this and and There's best practices that are listed Around around the principle of least privileges. There's already practices that are out there and including the one that we ended up putting forward so the Don't use root in containers as a general best practice that's already out there so something that we could talk about and we feel like Getting to this list of things is What's important in our mind right now? But that doesn't mean that we want to stop use cases or anything So Oliver as far as like how do we get to something? I think is you're wanting to it seems like you're wanting to Get to something past a Set of you know like thousands of use cases which could be interesting, but maybe not Getting to a usable a directly usable goal. So that's kind of my driver as well And I think with Ian thinking about this and talking through As well as reaching out to other folks like what could we do so it seemed like the least privilege As far as Ambitions or the words around this roadmap so ambition sounds good, and I think we could do milestones We could have like an ambition to reach a milestone within a certain time period, but actually Like even with the milestones we could literally use like the the github Let me see. I think I got to go to issues. We could use the milestones There we go. I don't know who created this but 2021 best practices so If we're like we have this no route I don't know if there's an issue for it, but you can add them and we could say as a this is 2021 best practices, but we could you literally have like a q3 and I I personally am have a goal of Trying to move forward some set of some number of best practices in q3 and q4 To have them in place with enough content that we go. All right, we understand it maybe they don't all go through but I would like to get a set and They may or may not come from existing use cases. There may be new use cases that are added Just based on my experience and Then tal you were mentioned so this is kind of a side from Goals, but how do we move forward on stuff? And I I definitely don't just go into github and go I must follow the structure. So my just myself tell I I Don't find it works for me as far as like I guess the creative process and And sourcing a lot of information. I need to have it a little less structure It's fine to have some categories but the When I'm working by myself or collaborating with someone else like Ian or whoever we get on and start working on something and This is the hack and a day that's had several iterations if I go back through the version it started with less of the categories and then we started putting more and more and moving stuff Around but the original Document and we're actually going to end up with a Document I think that'll be added to the this drive Was a lot looser so tal I think this would go with what you're talking about where we're saying Okay, so why would you want these privileges? So this is a little bit? I'm giving you all a little bit of the view of how it works for me. It doesn't have to work for you and Tals, you know talked about how he's worked through stuff But whoever you know y'all on this call or listening later if you have another way of a workflow. That's fine, you know the The github proposal format that we have for best practices is kind of a finished format But that's not the working process. That's when we get there We want to try to hit some stuff that we think is important as a group But getting to there can be all over. So this would be in we I can highlight here. So why would you want least privilege at all and starting to talk about this? So this is just more of conversational. This doesn't have to do with those categories Different ways of helping well, you can see here privilege containers. So this is not the root in containers this is a different topic that popped up and Tal and and I don't know if Victor's on this call I don't see him, but other folks have pointed out like what about this and this and those are all different things that are related to Privilege, I'm sorry least privilege. So that principle of least privilege. So root in containers would be one of them Access to the Kubernetes API and what you can do there. Frederick has talked about The different things you can do with like net admin and how you can affect the whole network and potentially cause massive problems so these are a lot of topics and We've had a lot of different conversations. This is how we're working on it. You may need a literal whiteboard whatever it doesn't really matter that You can do whatever on that and then eventually You start just like if you're doing a draft and you have an outline and then you start working through it We eventually started dropping in more of an organization and that was the hack and D and then Eventually we felt like okay, we have have this hack and D to a point where we can put a pull request in So that's kind of process and Definitely open to Tal I want to encourage people to the workflow that you have to get to something Just use it. Whatever will help you to get to a point where we have Contributions is totally fine and I think back to the the ambitions would be that the high level for me Oliver would be You know q3 is coming up close, but I would like to get a couple more proposals in at least have them going through Probably around least privilege Handling state in a cloud native way is definitely interesting. So I'm open to whatever but I'd like to have some more privilege proposals in place and If a new use case comes in great, that's fine if we go and look at existing use cases and start Extracting the practices as you were saying Oliver. That's fine. But in q3. I'd like to see and And you know this could be a milestone like I said and and the github where we say what you know three practices Could be a milestone and then we have another set or whatever, but yes for having some milestones and an ambition and then Backing up what Tal said as far as like having we don't want to have People feel you're forced to do this and you must ask time off or whatever that's you know, it's we're trying to balance where we're contributing in this open community We want encouragement to meet a goal, but knowing like We're we're all open to contribute or not Would I am something like I don't and we can always list this in a doc. I don't think we have like milestones and We don't have a ambitions roadmap or any type of doc right now in the Repo You know, it's in the closest thing we have is in the governance saying that the coaches can help build a roadmap but the there is no actual thing listed, but What do you think about starting with something like a milestone and we start dropping issues and here? Oliver and then potentially have we could write up something like a 2021 ambitions, I don't know what that doc would look like, but we could write something up like that Yeah, that makes sense. All right anyone else. I have one idea that you know, we have a lot of participants here some that don't speak out speak out quite as often but Maybe everybody can give themselves homework to to pick some kind of contribution It could really be anything as you said it could be Fixing grammar or things on existing documents or commenting or contributing to discussions actually just going to the discussions page choosing something that You have something to say about and and responding is a contribution. I feel because they do move us forward It's easy to get lost in the discussions. I think but they're still there for reference, right? Whenever we end up working as somebody for example decides to go to hack MD and start working on You know BGP issues. Well, here's a discussion that they can immediately reference and actually continue commenting on, you know, the discussions Don't have to stop. They can continue growing in a way Yeah, they have advantages and disadvantages for sure, but it's My point is any way that anybody can contribute. I think We should we should all agree to do so Contribute in the way that makes best sense to you and please reach out if you feel like you're blocked on Contributing and and don't know where to get started or I'm sure everybody here Has experience that would be beneficial That would be beneficial to hear about in some way So just reach out. All right. Well, if there's nothing else we can Stop here. I'll give it a minute. Does anyone have any last? Last minute things I'd like to talk about or Comment on all right give your ten minutes back for your day Thanks, everyone. Thanks. See you next week. Bye


What if one event could change the course of the world forever? The morning of September 11th 2001 did just that. As the sun rose over a seemingly ordinary Tuesday in autumn, a sinister plot was about to unfold. 19 terrorists, members of the extremist group Al Qaeda, had managed to board four commercial airplanes. The targets, iconic symbols of American power and influence. American Airlines Flight 11 and United Airlines Flight 175 took off, unbeknownst to the passengers, with a deadly mission. Their journey ended tragically as they were flown into the north and south towers of the World Trade Center in New York City. These towering symbols of financial might reduced to smoldering ruins. Meanwhile, American Airlines Flight 77 embarked on a path of destruction, crashing into the Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. This symbol of military strength, now bearing a gaping wound. Yet in the face of terror, there was also defiance. United Airlines Flight 93, originally aimed for Washington DC, met a different fate. The brave passengers, aware of the other hijackings, banded together, fighting back against their captors. Their heroic efforts led to the plane crashing into a field in Pennsylvania, far from its intended target. In the span of a few short hours, the world looked on in horror and disbelief as the unimaginable unfolded. The twin towers, once standing tall and proud, crumbled to the ground, engulfed in smoke and flames. The Pentagon, a symbol of American defense, was now a scene of devastation and loss. The human toll of this tragedy was staggering. Nearly 3,000 lives were extinguished in the blink of an eye. Men, women, children. Each a story cut short. Each a dream left unfulfilled. The echoes of their loss continued to resonate, a painful reminder of the cost of hatred and extremism.  The aftermath of the attacks was a time of national trauma and vulnerability. It was as if the very fabric of American society had been violently ripped apart, leaving a gaping wound that stretched from New York City to this furthest corners of this country. The images of the twin towers collapsing, the Pentagon inflames and the wreckage of Flight 93 seared into the collective consciousness of a nation, causing deep psychological trauma and a sense of vulnerability among the American population. It was a time of heartbreak, yes, but also a time of unity. A time when the nation came together to mourn, to heal and to respond. The United States, under President George W. Bush declared a war on terror, a war not against the nation but against an ideology. This war aimed at eliminating terrorism and its sponsors wherever they may be found around the globe. In the immediate aftermath of the attacks, the USA Patriot Act was swiftly enacted. This legislation granted law enforcement agencies expanded powers to counter terrorism, a move that was both applauded for its decisive action and criticized for its potential infringement on civil liberties. The balance between security and freedom, the cornerstone of American democracy, had been upset by the events of that fateful September day. This balance was further tested with the establishment of the Department of Homeland Security. Created to coordinate domestic security efforts, the department represented significant restructuring of the American government. It reflected the new reality of a world where the threat not just from abroad but also from within. In the days and weeks following the attacks, the American people grappled with a new normal. A normal where fear and uncertainty were constant companions, where every plane overhead could be a potential threat, where every unattended bag could harbor danger, but it was also new normal, where resilience and unity shone through. The nation was at war not with a country but with the concept of terror itself. And while the wounds of that day would slowly heal, the scars would remain forever shaping the nation and its place in the world. The war on terror had begun, and with it, a new chapter in American history. The United States, under President George W. Bush, declared a war aimed at eliminating terrorism and its sponsors worldwide. This was not a war against a country or a region, but an ideology, a concept, terrorism. The first step in this war was the invasion of Afghanistan. The country had been the safe haven for al-Qaeda, the group responsible for the 9-11 attacks. The Taliban regime, which ruled Afghanistan, had harboured these terrorists. The US, along with its allies, set out to dismantle al-Qaeda and remove the Taliban from power. This marked the beginning of a long, complex, and costly battle that would last for nearly two decades. But the war on terror didn't stop there. Two years after the invasion of Afghanistan, the United States turned its attention to Iraq. In 2003, under the belief that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction and its perceived connection to terrorism, the US led an invasion. However, no such weapons were ever found. This decision sparked controversy and debate, both domestically and internationally, about the justification and consequences of the invasion. Beyond these invasions, the war on terror extended to a global scale. The United States, working with allies, engaged in counter-terrorism efforts around the world. From intelligence sharing to joint military operations, these efforts aimed to prevent and respond to terrorist activities wherever they might occur. This war was not only fought on the battlefield, it also took shape in policy decisions, diplomatic efforts, and the implementation of security measures. The Patriot Act, the creation of the Department of Homeland Security, and enhanced security measures at airports and public spaces, were all part of the United States' response to the threat of terrorism. The war on terror would shape US foreign policy for years to come. It influenced decisions related to security, diplomacy, and military interventions. And while the war has seen successes and failures, it continues to be a significant part of the American narrative in the 21st century. The echoes of 911th still reverberate today, influencing our daily lives and our view of the world. In the aftermath of the attacks, the United States underwent significant changes, particularly in terms of national security and foreign policy. Enhanced security measures became the new norm. Airports in particular underwent a transformation. The simple act of boarding a plane is now a process involving detailed security checks and screenings. Public spaces too are under constant surveillance, all in a bid to prevent a repeat of the horrific events of that day. The impact on US foreign policy was just as profound. The war on terror, initiated in response to the 911th's attacks, led to military interventions in Afghanistan and Iraq. The goal was to dismantle al-Qaeda, the extremist group responsible for the attacks, and to remove regimes that harbored such groups. These interventions, however, were not without controversy, and they continued to shape the United States' relations with the rest of the world. The war on terror also led to a shift in the United States' diplomatic approach. The emphasis was now on security and counter-terrorism, and alliances were often viewed through this lens. This had far-reaching implications, influencing not just the United States' relations with other countries, but also international politics as a whole. But perhaps the most enduring impact of 911 is the ongoing discussion about the balance between national security and civil liberties. Laws like the USA Patriot Act, which expanded the powers of law enforcement agencies in the name of counter-terrorism, were met with criticism. Critics argued that these laws infringed upon civil liberties, sparking debates that continue to this day. In the end, the long-term impact of 911 extends far beyond the immediate devastation caused by the attacks. It has shaped our laws, our policies, and our societal norms. It has influenced the way we travel, the way we view security, and the way we interact with the world at large. 911 was not just an event, but a turning point that continues to shape our world. Behind the scenes, there were stories of missed warnings, survival, and acts of heroism. Let's delve into the unseen narratives of that fateful day. There were earlier warnings that pointed towards the impending attacks. Intelligence agencies had received snippets of information that, when pieced together, formed a chilling prophecy. But unfortunately, these signs were not fully understood or acted upon, leading to a catastrophe that could perhaps have been averted. In the face of such overwhelming destruction, tales of survival emerged. One such story is that of the World Trade Center's stairwell A in the South Tower. In the midst of chaos and confusion, those within this stairwell found themselves in a pocket of safety. Their survival amidst the collapse of the Twin Towers stands as a testament to the human spirit and the will to live. Then there were the haunting phone calls from United Airlines Flight 93. Passengers on board, having learned about the other hijackings, made calls to their loved ones, conveying their final words and their plans to try and regain control of the aircraft.  And let's not forget the first responders, the unsung heroes who rushed into the chaos to save lives. Their selfless acts of bravery resulted in many of them suffering from long-term health effects. The dust, debris and toxins they were exposed to have led to a myriad of respiratory illnesses and cancers. A bitter reminder of the price they paid for their heroism. These stories remind us that in the midst of tragedy, there are often unseen heroes and lessons to be learned. The unseen narratives of September 11th, 2001, shine a light on the resilience, courage and selflessness that emerged from the darkest of days.


Other classes touch on a little bit of everything from salsa to folk and everything in between. For this week's in focus reporter Mel Meyer put on his dancing shoes at the Susie and Hondo School of Dance. Saturday night we'll expect to see that executed with precision. Tonight's lesson is all about line dancing with a little bit of cha-cha. Legend says that the dance was named for the sound of the lady's shoes scuffing across the floor. At the helm is Susie and Hondo who have been teaching twists, shimmies, and turns for almost two decades. I was lucky. My mom taught dance. And so I grew up with it from the time I was tiny. But for Hondo it was a career that almost wasn't. He had dropped out of his first college dance class. Nice job you guys. But after building up the nerve, he got back out there dancing in the spring show at his alma mater Bemidji State University.  So it just, it was, for me, I caught me. One and two. Susie says her favorite dance to teach is the waltz because it has some of the more basic steps. So you can take those beginners that really are quite terrified and by the time you're done in 10, 15 minutes they're like, oh, this isn't so bad. I think I can do this. From there the dynamic duo can move their students on to different dances. Then they find one or two that they really love and they say, well, I want to be really good at the cha cha. Over the course of 12 weeks they'll teach 12 different dance styles. Even competitors like Makaya Graham learned a thing or two. It's a fun one. I really enjoy it. It's a little bit new for me so it kind of took me a minute to pick up on it. Brian Westerman and his wife Judy have been moving and grooving for years but they came to the studio to improve their skills. We've learned lots of new dances now. We're not big line dancers like we're doing tonight. We probably know 12 different dances that we've learned here at Hondo and Susie's. And for those who think they don't have what it takes, it's worth a try. You're never the only one that doesn't know what they're doing. Susie and Hondo teach a variety of other classes as well at their dance studio. In Bemidji with this week's In Focus, I'm Mal Meyer, Lakeland News. If you've enjoyed this segment of Lakeland News, please consider making a tax-deductible contribution to Lakeland Public Television.