I extend a pleasant good evening to everyone. A pleasant good evening to everyone and a warm welcome is extended to everyone. Our consultant this evening, Dr. Paula Kukumakinana. We also have our very esteemed lead person for this session, Mrs. Fortuna Anthony. We extend a warm welcome to all parents in this, to this meeting, as well as any other community members who are joining us this evening. It is a very important session for all of us in the education sector where we engage you, important participants in the discussion of this Reviewed Education Act, which has implications for all of us. So it is a very important session for us and of course I am elated and I extend a very warm welcome to everyone and I encourage everyone to engage actively in the discussion. You have this excellent opportunity to transform, to contribute to this very important discussion on the Education Act consultation. So we proceed very importantly next to our prayers and I invite those who are Catholic to please sign yourselves in the name of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, Amen. O Heavenly Father, we thank you most graciously for the breath of life we are able to enjoy and of course most importantly we thank you for this opportunity for all of us to engage in a discussion on something that is so important to the education system, the Education Act Review. We thank you again Father for this opportunity and we ask you to guide our discussions, help everyone to be comfortable but of course engage in a discussion that is respectful and valuable so that we can, we can make a very important contribution this evening. This we ask in the name of your Son Jesus, Amen. In the name of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, Amen. And of course I have mentioned our consultant for this evening. I also mentioned our lead person for the discussions this evening, Mrs. Fortuna Anthony and for those who do not know Mrs. Fortuna Anthony. She was a former chief education officer and also she has been actively involved in community projects etc. One of those is working with at-risk boys in the society and of course she has also worked with the Unique Universal Peace Federation and one of the important things that they have worked on is character development in young persons so without much ado I hand you over to Mrs. Fortuna Anthony and once again welcome everyone and I encourage everyone to engage in the discussion. Your contribution, your thoughts, your input are invaluable to us in the education sector. Thank you so much for your attendance this evening and most importantly for the invaluable contributions that you will make this evening. Thank you so much. Over to you Mrs. Fortuna Anthony. Thank you ever so much Mrs. Lawrenson, the EO District 3 for your welcome and your words of devotion and asking everyone here to raise their voices. They've got a voice and they can make a valuable contribution. I thank you very much for agreeing to introduce this evening's Tong Hall meeting in District 3 for members of the public, educators and whoever is so willing to understand a little more about the Draft Education Act. Also with us and I'm going to ask my colleagues to turn on the video so that people can see the persons who have been working over the last two years on this project. We have with us and they will say a little bit about themselves. Mrs. Paula Cook McKenon and she will turn on her video and she will say a little bit about herself. Paula. Thank you Mrs. Anthony. Good evening everyone. It's a pleasure to be with you and to be having these discussions about the Education Act and the supporting regulations which are proposed. We have been very busy over the last two years working with educators and stakeholders in St. Lucia to develop recommendations for enhancement of the Education Act and the regulations. My role with this team has been to support the development, to support the technical members of our team and to also support the drafting of the recommended act and regulations that you are able to access now online. Drafting is a specialized function and we are very grateful to Kim St. Rose who has actually done an exemplary job of the drafting. This evening is not so much about us but about you. We are absolutely delighted to have this opportunity to have public sessions, these town hall sessions so that you can express to us your desires for the act, how you hope it will work for you and to give us feedback on regulations which are a first for St. Lucia in terms of recent Education Acts so very progressive and also included in the regulations is a new national code of conduct to support school leaders and teachers to have a consistent approach to conduct of members of school communities throughout the country. So thank you so much Mrs. Anthony and I will turn it back over to you. Thank you and I would like Dr. Monica Williams who is also with us to say a few words and introduce herself. Good evening everyone. My name is Dr. Monica Williams and it's a pleasure to be here as a member of the team that's working in partnership with educators in St. Lucia on the enhancement of the Education Act. It's been a great privilege to work with everyone over the past two years. We've had many consultations and done quite a bit of research and my background is an education leadership and also in school law and also special education and inclusive education and those are the the skills that I bring to the work and it's been a real pleasure and I look forward to the conversation this evening. Thank you so much. Thank you very much Dr. Williams. Dr. Williams has been what I described as the rock to this process moving forward. Next slide please Paula. So this is our schedule for this evening. We want to run a tight ship so we have had a welcome and devotion. We are going to share with you the schedule, the purpose and the wrong rules for this meeting so that we make the most effective use of the time that we have together this evening. We would have you get a brief description of the review and overview and discussion of the core features of the draft Education Act and regulations. Your priorities and hopes for the draft would be very very critical and important to us so we want to have sufficient time to hear your voice and as Dr. Mrs. McKinnon has said for the first time since we've just created history in having an Education Act and accompanying regulations then we will have the concluding remarks and we will adjourn at about 7.30. So far we have done quite well in terms of the numbers of participants and the time we have not run too badly into overtime or overrun but this evening we will want to hear from you. Thank you very much. So what is the purpose or the objectives of the Tong Hall Meetings? We want to describe and review the enhancement. What are the new things that we have brought in? We want to discuss the core features of the draft Education Act and regulations. We want to present those core features to you this evening. We want to listen to your priorities and hopes for the draft Education Act and regulations with the hope that you have had sufficient time to peruse the Act and regulations that have been placed on the government website and if you have not yet done so Mrs. McKinnon has placed that in the chance. We want to record your questions and comments so I hope we do have your permission to record since we want to be able to represent accurately what you have shared with us so that as we move forward any changes can reflect your voices. We want to address the topics and issues raised in the Tong Hall Meetings in the validation and finalization of the draft Education Act and regulations. So we have two words that are very very important. We want to validate and we want to finalize as Mrs. McKinnon has mentioned this process has been on for almost two years and we want you to know since we have the draft what we probably would refer to as a bill because there is a process before it becomes an act. When we have done our nine or ten Tong Hall Meetings we will take into consideration what you have raised and then new edits would have to be done then it moves on to the minister, the attorney general's office and then to parliament so that it can become an act. Next slide Paula. So what are the wrong rules for this meeting, this Tong Hall Meeting? We know we have to remain within a structure so your questions or comments are welcome. If you look at the bottom of your screen you will see that there is an icon that says reactions, you can raise your hand. It says raise hand when you have asked your question it says you could put your hand down or you can type in the chat your comments. We will try to address the comments that have been typed or we will when you raise your hand we will acknowledge and you will take time to share. The facilitators will share the meeting so we work as a team so you might hear my voice you will hear Mrs. McKinnon's voice and you could hear Dr. Williams voice when needed. The meeting will end starting end promptly and thank you Mrs. Lawrence we start the prompt to speak during the meeting I have explained what you do you raise your hand you say who you are and then you have about three minutes we are saying three minutes so that we provide opportunities for other persons to have a voice we appreciate and respect all questions and comments and ask that you do the same no question asked should be seen as invalid so we appreciate that mutual respect in Jamaica we say you know we give enough respect to each person so in Central Asia we learn to appreciate each other's point of view next slide so a brief description of the review how did we go about getting to where we are today you we noted earlier that we started in February 2022 when the St. Lucia Department of Education contracted the mind bloom consultant and St. Francis Xavier University to partner with St. Lucia educators in the review and enhancement of the Education Act so you know there was a meeting process the review was undertaken because the existing act is from 2005 and the Department of Education wishes to ensure that the Education Act that is in use in St. Lucia meets the needs of the modern education system now and in the future those of you who are keeping abreast with what is going on recognize that times are changing and education cannot be stagnant so from February 2022 up to the present time we have had extensive stakeholders consultation and research has been completed we have met with many many many persons based on the findings of the consultations and research intensive research on what is happening in education regionally and internationally the draft education act and regulations were prepared in March 2023 we have provided two drafts and we are where we are today multiple stakeholders provided feedback on this draft we had series of Zoom meetings working with various groups and persons were free to send in their thoughts after the meeting so more than 700 suggestions were received reviewed and acted upon to create a revised draft education act and regulations that we are presently discussing here tonight this is the journey the Tom Hall meetings have been held across St. Lucia from district one way down to district eight and special meeting with all principals of schools to provide the general public has been invited as well if we have been following the Ministry of Education has placed on government URL I have seen it on DBS being advertised and everyone is been invited to join via the link that was provided a description of the review of the education act 2005 and the progress we have achieved to date the access to the revised November 2023 education act and regulations and an opportunity to contribute to the validation and finalization of the draft education act and regulations so what are the core features of the draft education act and regulations we have attempted to to hearing after listening after researching to bring in using our stakeholders plea or our stakeholders suggestions we have a new students centered vision for education for St. Lucia students centered we have expanded the definitions and updated the language we heard from our participants or our stakeholders that they needed to have more definitions and we have done that they wanted the language to be written in such a way that everyone would understand and we have done that the only thing I can say we could not do was to put creole version but somewhere along I would say this even if there's anybody who wants a creole translation they've just got to put it in the chart or raise their hand but we have updated the language in the act so that it is more reader friendly we focus on a holistic education that supports students learning and well-being this is what education is meant to do holistic development of the child so we are looking at the child's mental well-being we are looking at the child academic well-being we are looking at how happy a young one is prepared to come to school universal access to education free tuition and protection from discrimination is one of the key features in the act so we want every channel to have access to school that they do not have to pay and they are protected from discrimination so we will hear a little more about that and presently there is a lot being done and a lot of training is taking place across a number of groups on safeguarding of children their parents and people generally new content on special needs education and inclusive education has been established and placed in the act new national court of conduct standards of behavior and appropriate dress code so the new national code will go across the education system new compulsory school age from 3 to 17 including early childhood age education for ages 3 to 5 so you will see there is a change in the compulsory school age which was from 5 to 15 and we have even gone beyond that in some cases the clear authority of education educators to discipline students and protect safety and security in whose hands have we placed the disciplining of students the protection of teachers and parents and children it is now in the hands the authority lies with the educators new types of education has been added including alternative online and blended education and in spite of everything we know that if there was a plus to covid we will force to move onward so the new education act is preparing educators parents and the nation for if any such matter was to come through again but also asking educators to make good use of let us say the blended approach the online so that the practice usage is always there we have clearly defined the rights duties powers and responsibilities of everyone in the education act so that we have provided clarity an overview of the draft education act there is what we call the preliminary and it is referred to as the long title where recommendations the interpretation of the definition so you will see that there are many more definitions in there so recommendations came in from different stakeholders they wanted a greater emphasis on the holistic student development and the well-being of students and all that they wanted the promotion of inclusive education so all that takes place in the long title we also looked at curriculum etc etc and the proper administration of the education system who is in charge the duties and powers of the minister has been clearly outlined that of the permanent secretary the chief education officer education officers that were not in the education act and now in there and education advisory board stage two of the education stages of education and the types of school stages of public schools types of education offered registration and operation of schools home schooling has been extended and it has more clarity to it special needs education and inclusive education the rights and responsibilities of students and parents universal access there must be universal access to education for all we said it has to be free the rights to appropriate to an appropriate education is also spelled out there there is also the accountability the responsibilities the consequences rights and duties of students and parents admission attendance and records the compulsory school age is listed there how are they admitted to schools the zoning of schools how do you transfer a student from one school to the next what is the process what is the attendance how is the attendance of a student kept the types of registers who keeps those registers how are they used to attend to the needs of the child the school attendance officer and school records who keeps the records what type of records are kept so that the education system is responsive and meeting the needs of the child the national curriculum is in part five which deals with instruction as an assessment of students and we have an inclusive national curriculum inclusive across the board whether you are at an assisted school whether you are at a warm school in you have a national curriculum which everyone should be using the core subjects it mentions what are the core subjects the key stages of assessments balance student assessment it speaks of the collective worship and religious education so in the this section the national curriculum you will see that schools whether you are denomination or not you have the option of adding to the core subjects so for example we know that there are certain schools where instruction religious education must be taught they have the option of adding it to their curricula part six looks at the management of schools what's the management for technical and vocational education and training consoles student consoles parent teacher community association and I want us to take a look at this one we know that there have been student consoles in operation in schools there have been boards at various schools but we normally would have had parent teachers association but we have added because there was the discussion that the management of schools should also be extended to communities so we have parent teacher community so in a district you might have persons who are already unwilling to serve on that parent teacher community to strengthen the work of the school you have the national code of conduct in part seven school rules and discipline this is critical because this national code of conduct how we respond to discipline to student misbehavior suspensions searches and seizures the right to appeal a disciplinary response is all in this section of the act and it is written and clarified so that parents should understand principles will be guided accordingly district education officers would be able to reference whenever they come across an issue that impacts whether it is on a student a parent etc so this national code of conduct is going to strengthen what happens at the school level and it touches on a number of areas part eight looks at the rights and duties of education educators what is the rights of the educators what is the duty of the principal the vice principal teachers school guidance counselors school attendant officers what are their rights and duties part nine looks at the sedentary scholarship and it has been suggested the value of the scholarship what are the qualifications what examinations are there for the scholarships how do you forfeit the scholarship bonding for the scholarship recipients how do you award or grant groceries you can always look at the education act in full detail and see what it says appeals if you disagree if you do not like something if you feel that you have not had just deserved there will be an education appeal tribunal and there will be regulations and procedures as to how one can appeal and there is the miscellaneous section that looks at annual reports contagious diseases closures of school loitering on school premises we did not touch on loitering outside of school premises insurance vendors on the school premises for the vegetation of sale of alcohol drugs execution regulations appeals savings so this section I think you would find certain forms that will guide how you move forward with let us say if there is an outbreak of contagious diseases what is the procedure that is used questions comments are we getting a feel are we getting a grasp of what this enhanced act would look like feel free we want to hear your comments we need to hear your voice we have okay we have no questions in the chat as yet you can place your questions in the chart you can raise your hand we have one oops we have one raised hand from Yolanda would you like to go ahead please good night everyone I see everything they were put in place but I'm not seeing anything on safety and security for the students and parents at school can you explain Monica would you like to respond to this is Monica still with us yes yes thank you for tuna I'd be happy to respond that's an excellent question about safety and security we heard from many persons over the past almost two years that they have concerns about safety and security at school and they want the education act and the regulations to address those issues so what we've done is added several new features first of all the national code of conduct is the whole purpose of the national code is to promote positive behavior and to protect the safety and security of schools including the students the teachers the parents all members of school communities so the national code addresses safety and security also we've added to the education act a new section on search and seizure and what that means is it gives the principles and the teachers the authority if they suspect that for example a student has a weapon or drugs or is threatening to harm themselves or others that the principal or teacher can search their persons if they find a weapon they can seize it and call the police so we've added those provisions to the education act which is new so safety and security have been addressed in several different ways and it is a it is a concern that many people have identified that they want to see clearly addressed and we've attempted to do that thank you very much Monica thank you I have any other question I see you are being technical and I forget the other word for the education system but I don't see anything like the skills such as we need things like sewing sewing schools or joinery arts and crafts and so forth I think we handled that under the area when we speak about alternate education where you will have technical vocational and we are very much aware that the ministry of education is also moving towards the establishment of technical vocational schools so the act does make provision for various different types as well why we speak about the inclusiveness of education okay thank you very much one more you said about homeschooling and you said a national curriculum will be provided how do we acquire the curriculum the national curriculum which is used will be mandated so if you're homeschooling a child the national curriculum when you go to register and get permission because there is also a process if you have to homeschool you will be assisted in getting all the relevant curriculum the national curriculum which you should follow if you are homeschooling your child normally you would go the chief education officer you would get your letter you would get your stamp of approval there there is a process homeschooling does not just I mean that you can keep your child at home and do as you please there is a full process that must be followed and the education act definitely supports that thank you so much some one is um I saw avi maria um hand this up huh yes you mentioned about loitering on the school compound and I also heard you mentioned that there was nothing about loitering out of school now that you have mentioned it I think it's a good idea to bring it in my question is is it too late to make that suggestion since this is just a review of the draft right now it's a backstage so it's too late to bring it in we um we are looking and taking down all your suggestions but I also need to mention here that when we are doing this revised education act there are other legal documents that must be aligned or the education act must be aligned too so we will be looking at this it has been raised at other sessions what can be done so we need to get a legal because when a child leaves the school compound where they are within the safety ambits of the principal the the school the security guard at the school and they are on their way home the principal no longer has jurisdiction over this child because he's not on the school compound so this is something that we will need to have a discussion on and see how it can best be handled or whether it can be incorporated elsewhere Monica would you like to add to that thank you for tuna um the the issue of student behavior outside school hours has been raised and as for tuna pointed out uh question because the principal and the teachers have sponsored events but outside school hours really parents are responsible for their children's behavior so this is a a topic of conversation that's been ongoing and we're trying to find a path forward um that honors all the existing laws and um looks at this issue as closely as we can thank you for raising it thank you very much monica i saw um there's another hand up yes miss alphonse good night um my question is regarding school you're muted miss alphonse unmute yourself hello yes now we can hear you my question is regarding scholarships um why is there only one scholarship and why is it limited to keep students when Sir Arthur is also offering associate programs um i will attempt to answer that um these are not um we didn't say one scholarship we addressed the address was um um scholarships okay island scholarships and bus reads whether it is one or it is two this is not a decision that can be placed in the education act the minister and the cabinet of ministers may be able to increase the number of scholarships but we cannot place this in the act and i cannot give you an answer here tonight as to why it is only one or it is two yes we know that they associate um degrees um there are also tape there are also a number of other areas in education where government might decide to consider awarding bursaries and scholarships sir alphonse does that answer your question partially yes okay partially but um i think these are also discussions that can take place outside of the education act i've been mario um i noticed your hand is up yes good night good night it is true that it is a parent's response that left the school however when students leave school you have all that violence that is taking place on the way as they go home or as they come to school it spills over into the schools and you have all it's in discipline taking place where students are out of control in a lot of the schools so i believe that the education act should make provisions for maybe the education minister for principal whatever to address parents nationwide when students are behaving in certain ways mention it to them because i noticed that a lot of times nothing is said about the behavior of the parents need to be reminded okay so the education act should make provisions for those in authority those in control of the schools to actually address parents and call them out on call them out on the behavior of their child when the child has left the school thank you well um if i may respond very quickly to this i think the education act the court of conduct and the education act is addressing student behavior but when it comes to calling out parents and and putting this that the minister should and do this i think um we have seen over the last couple of months that the minister and personnel within the ministry of education have been coming out in public and been you know speaking on the issues the responses to some of the measures been proposed you know have received various comments from members of the public but as we have said when a child leaves school and it goes back and as we speak tonight i am sure in canaries a measure has been taken in that there is a town hall meeting taking place on parenting because many times we say that the root problems lie within the home so one of the strategies being used is how can we help parents to better nurture and tend and raise their children to be better citizens yes we have seen this break out of violence um out of the school in school and this sort of thing and within the school the education act and the regulations will um is going to address how um principles and teachers deal with um any in-school violence and misbehavior so it is there i i i hear the voice i hear the cry but um we have to know um the limits to which educators or principals can be held responsible for behaviors of students outside we must make parents um more accountable and responsible for their children's behavior mrs anthony if i may also one of the one of the um strengths of the new parent teacher community association is to bring community into partnership with parents and educators around creating positive behavior in the community and i think that the vision for this new structure to the association is to i think actually one of the one of those who attended one of the other town halls said it it it actually enforces um the perspective that it takes the community to raise a child and previously parent teacher associations um were not as directly encouraged to include members of community in that so where we are hoping that that uh association can help to address some of those issues um and make everyone assume some responsibility including um the students um for positive behavior both on the school property and in the community i i also if if it's okay with you mrs anthony i'd like to go back to the question about uh i i'd like to go back to the question about the st lusia island scholarship because the way that the the legislation is proposed and drafted is that it does um it does say st louis st lusia island scholarship as a singular scholarship so that that was that observation is quite correct however um section 180 clause 4 says that the cabinet shall determine the number of scholarships to be awarded each year so it actually is intended that even though the section is called scholarship it will be more than it will be up to cabinet to determine the specific numbers so perhaps that might address the question raised earlier yes thank you very much um paula i'm sure miss alfonso is feeling a lot better now thank you um i see um miss immanuel your hand is up hi good evening thank you for the opportunity to ask a question um i was made aware that there is one truancy officer and one officer for i forget the title attendance island wide um can there be something mandated to ensure that there is there are sufficient persons employed for that role to address the needs of those students who are vulnerable and they need the attention can it be included in the act we have um included in the act but um we have not stated um the numbers that the government or the minister of education or the ministry but i am sure in some discourse and communication um there there may be the possibility of an increased number of attendants or officers if i could add to that fortune please because it's a very good question and we've had that question the last couple of nights for example about the number of counselors in school or is there anything in the act about teacher assistance or the number of teacher assistance and with regard to the education act those are all staffing decisions that are made by the ministry of education they don't go into an act um as fortuna has pointed out we have described the duties of a school attendance officer it certainly is possible to have more than one but we can't state numbers like that in an education act um because the ministry makes those decisions and because the numbers fluctuate over time and so the ministry needs that flexibility uh to be able to make staffing appointments and change the numbers as the needs of the education system changes thank you very much um monica and um some of for example this will be a policy decision of the ministry you know when the need arises but um placing it within an education act we cannot mandate numbers do you have any other questions in the chat if we don't yes there is actually there is a question in the chat um the ministry of education uh is now made um sorry mainly or fully responsible for the registration and placement of students in infant schools how does protection from discrimination through universal education work in sync with denominational schools particularly where moral and social issues are concerned yes we are very much aware that um and it's not today that um registration of kindergarten has been managed by the ministry of education when it comes to discrimination i think we have to rely on person's integrity person's professionalism and many times what many parents are not aware of is that before registration takes place the ministry would have carried out a survey to find out the number of school places the population of a school and then because we know very well that um the a lot of parents would have preference choices but sometimes we cannot always and the wishes hoping that um as we said for the education act and that there is a sense of justice and fairness and high level of professionalism in the working of persons responsible for education and i believe we have another hand raised yes mr harrow is with us thank you mr harrow go right ahead thank you um mr anthony and to the team i'm i'm grateful that you have um stuck to this task um since it first started um some two years ago um when i did make a little input i have reviewed uh the what has been produced and i i do intend to comment more fully but i just want to zone in on the specific point um in regards to principles and staffing the language in the act is somewhat ambiguous as to what staffing means staff vis-a-vis teachers um and i think we could um tighten that up because there's when it refers to staff because it refers to people like the janitors the secretaries and all that sort of thing and then teachers i don't see the language in the act um mandating the principles to manage their staff the sorry the teachers i i mean i find the language is somewhat um not um forceful in how principles manage a praise discipline call teachers to account there are we have um and it's perhaps the elephant in the room but we do have across our country teachers who bring very toxic environments to the staff room um and a very difficult at managing and principles find it very difficult to manage those teachers because the teachers know that there's very little that the the principles can do to them the process is somewhat ambiguous as to whether the discipline and accountability of teachers lie within the ministry or within the teaching the teaching service commission but or is it the deo or is it the chief education officer this is problematic and it certainly affects the um the the the school environment and the productivity um as far as the students are concerned and the overall efficiency of the school you made a comment um mr herald that um you think the language needs to be titled or is it needs to be more forceful um yes both um and in particularly i i mean i'm referencing um section one i think is 176 where you where you have listed the duties of the principle yeah um and we go from a to into uh i don't know uh double b monica you want to come in on this because thank you for tuna um this is a uh a really important point in terms uh on a couple of fronts thank you for raising it first of all as you've referenced um throughout the education act there is crossover between this proposed legislation and other laws in st lusia uh for example when we look at discipline and prohibition against alcohol on school premises we also crossover with the liquor control act um we there is a question that you've raised about the jurisdiction in terms of where does it rest with the teaching service commission and there is an act governing the operation of the teaching service commission or with the department of education so this is an issue that crosses those boundaries um that we're attempting to navigate um it's really important to hear uh the perspective that you've expressed about the need for greater clarity and as fortuna pointed out at the start of the presentation one of the things we've tried to do throughout the act is to have plain clear language so if you're finding that there's ambiguity there it's important that we know about it and we can follow up on it so thank you very much for raising that issue thank you thank you very much because you see even at section um subsection two uh i'm referencing subsection 176 you see that it says that the principal who fails to perform a duty specified in the section is liable to disciplinary action by the teaching service commission but we don't see any subsection sanction where the principal can control his or her staff um or or his or teachers and that's the working arm of the um the act or what happens in the school on a day-to-day basis uh thank you and one of the the questions that has been raised as well is that um we haven't explicitly addressed uh staff like support staff in schools in the act in terms of it may be teacher assistance it may be um housekeeping personnel bus drivers what have you um and so you're pointing out to the importance of differentiating between staff and teachers explicitly um in order to make that clarification so i've just made note of that yes i think um we would need to look into that and um probably most likely there will be need to revisit that section so we thank you ever so much mr. Harrell for bringing that to our attention because this is um very very critical for the functioning of the act and the regulations the code of conduct that has been developed to support the act so thank you very much um sister rufina i see your hand up yes put your divisions and send in everybody else my interest right now is the denom national school and the agreement in writing with the minister are we going to revisit that because i'm not sure there was anything in writing before um revisit the agreements um between the if there was one which is anthony if there was one so i think this is an opportunity now that we are revisiting the education act to put things in order okay um very good very good observation system very good observation because we would need to find out if there has been a written signed agreement between the denom national schools and the ministry of education or teaching service commission so we have some work to to a bit of research to do thank you for bringing that to our attention thank you um if i could add we had a question in the chat box how do we define homeschooling which is a really good question and we do have a definition of homeschooling now in the interpretation section of the act and i'll just read it out for you homeschooling means the education of a child of compulsory school age at a site other than a school with the approval of the chief education officer and the homeschooling is provided under the supervision of a parent uh uh and also may be provided by a parent or teacher using an education plan approved by the chief education officer so what back to what mrs anthony had referenced earlier we now have a process in the education act that's spelled out for applying to homeschool your child and that there has to be an education that's approved by the chief education officer and this is the process for homeschooling i um i think um this is the process further clarified and added that for homeschooling the family who has chosen to homeschool their child is mandated to follow the national curriculum because we have had instances of children beginning the process of homeschooling up to a certain level of grade and then transitioning into the public school system so that gives clarity to what happens i also think that i'm part of the conversational interview when one applies for homeschooling the qualification of the person who is going to be the tutor or the teacher for the child depending on the age or the grade of the child so the process is well spelled out okay um if we have no more questions can we move to the next slide paula so we said for the first time centrusia is creating very positive history in that there is draft regulations to accompany the act by law the act does not carry with it the kind of i'll say power needed without the support of regulation so we have developed draft regulations and this is what we have done we have part one the administration of school it defines the school year i think um 195 um days and um what is the school calendar year when does it begin does it begin before um first of september but no later than eight of september and when it ends school vacations during Easter Christmas all that is defined the school time table what are the textbooks what's the school admission process what are the school registers what um why do we have school registers and the process of assessments what kind of assessments are we going to still look for the final um end of year exam to promote a child or during the school year are we going to use summative formative or whatever other forms of assessment that are necessary and school zoning has been addressed there the national curriculum has been described including aligning it with the national qualification framework for primary and secondary curriculum and so we have done all this so that there is consistency across schools school management for public schools assistant schools private schools boom schooling school visits school inspections the schedule seven speaks and describes the matters addressed during school visits and school inspections so you have a completed approach to how schools are managed so the district education officers what do they do they go with the ministry of education the um counselors you know so all that is spelt out clearly in the regulations school councils and associations we know about um the school inspection somebody said such a little uh on school inspection i know a couple years ago one district education officer was sent to the uk and came back with um qualification as a school inspector i am sure at some point in time since this is now in the regulations the ministry of education would probably need to train because a school inspector would go into the school look at not just structures of school but look at the curriculum how the curriculum is been um delivered look at the strengths of teachers so you have a whole process and they look at the strengths the weaknesses and reports of forms of filled out to feed back where there are gaps and what has to be done so school inspections would help further um strengthen and create the avenue for what i'll call early interventions you do not wait for everything to begin to fall apart before hearing that at a particular school x y and z is not happening it the school inspectors would also help um in what kind of training is provided for teachers across the education system so this is um the the the school inspectors and the district education officers would think also inspection of schools as it used to happen um before where you had um the persons within the ministry of education in charge of school maintenance etc etc visiting schools to check on those other issues but not the issues of teaching and learning um mrs anthony if i may um and dr williams um um yes and dr williams jump in here but my understanding of the the purpose of this new schedule seven actually is to provide more detail almost in the form of a guide or a checklist so that everyone knows what is what is to happen during visits and inspections so that it creates a sort of uh an understanding among all about what uh what would happen uh during visits and inspections and provides clarity around what does happen is that correct dr williams um yes thank you paula that is correct so the checklist to build a mark fortune has has said provides guidance for um the personnel who are doing the visits or inspections to check various aspects of the schooling that's provided to the children and the operation of the school itself for example they they would look at the school timetable the students at student attendance register the um programs of instruction that are provided at the school they'd also look at samples of student work and look at the school policies and rules um the discipline methods that are used in the school the assessment methods um community relations and also safety features such as the school safety plan and emerge emergency preparedness plan including fire drills and fire safety protocols so all those different aspects the other thing i'd like to point out is that with regard to inspections in the draft education act and regulations we have strengthened the emphasis on them we've provided definitions and we've also recommended that homeschooling programs undergo uh inspections as well as schools and so we recommend it for example that homeschooling programs uh undergo inspection at least once per school year if not more so we really have tried to provide more clarity and um to support regular inspections to ensure that students are receiving a quality education and there's a a comment in the there's a comment in the chat um i see school curriculum for primary and secondary but not for early childhood you are quite right that was raised in an earlier town hall this week and we have noted it and we do uh intend to make some suggestions around what would be included in early childhood education or to address it as part of the national curriculum so that it's not silent so we're we're not yet sure about what should be said there but we do know that something should be said so thank you very much for pointing that out yes thank you um very much um miss McKenon and um i could recall at our first town hall meeting we were also told that some persons had been exposed and trained to the high school curriculum in early childhood so we will look into what has happened from there thank you so we go on to looking at discipline um discipline complaints a herring of a disciplinary complaints who do you appeal to what is the process what is the procedure what how do you respond to the different kinds of or level of severity of discipline either for students or or teachers or staff and who do you go to by the chief education officer so there can be disciplinary herring but there will be a clear process that would have to be followed in fact only today i was asked the question does the principal of a school have the authority to dismiss a cook and what is the process used who can dismiss a cook so these are the things that um we have been asked that require some form of clarity but we have it clearly set out in the draft regulations the education appeals tribunal tells you the notice of appeal how much time the process of appeal the herring of the appeal the decisions and the cost is all spelled out if a parent of a teacher is not satisfied there is a process to appeal there are miscellaneous schedules zoning schemes application forms for permit to operate a private school operates a private preschool the fees etc you can find all of these and the forms will be formed in the um miscellaneous section as you rightly know as we go through and hear your voices um and we edit there might be changes based on your voice and what you have said next slide please before we before we move forward if you don't mind mrs anthony i'd just like to um uh comment a little bit more on the national code of conduct if that's okay with you yes go ahead um the um for those of you who have not yet looked at the proposed national code of conduct i we would really appreciate your looking at it the intention is to make um make positive behavior um everyone's business in the school community so the the idea of the national code of conduct is to number one make sure that everyone receives a copy of it and that it that there's opportunities for it to be discussed in schools um and to have uh schools as communities that include school leaders staff teachers and students to talk about what what acceptable positive behavior is and as a community consider what is acceptable what are acceptable responses to misbehavior so in it is intended as a positive approach to behavior but also recognizing the fact that we don't always have positive behavior and when we don't how can we respond to the misbehavior and in the code of conduct um there have been from many suggestions made uh over the last year in particular many six we've received many suggestions about acceptable responses to misbehavior which include things like in school suspension um and and other types of responses uh restorative justice um and and different forms of um support supportive types of responses to misbehavior um and so what we have tried to do is provide schools with as many options uh to address misbehavior as possible while at the same time giving them a code that provides them with a statement about about positive behavior so I just um we would encourage you because this is so new and and because um uh uh because this is so new um it's uh we really would welcome uh persons input on it um and mrs anthony I do believe there's some other questions in the chat here so I'm just going to uh yes Paula while you um read um let me go ahead um encourage all the principles that are here tonight to make the time even before the closure of school or before school reopens that they meet with their staff um those who have already looked at forming the parent community um associations to sit and discuss that code of conduct so that um they can get a good grasp of it and then they can share with us their thoughts on that okay and I think there's a hand up yes yes there's a hand up and you said there are a few more questions I'm just yes I'm looking in the chat to make sure that we haven't missed any questions so go ahead thank you um this is anthony um I am somewhat on this occasion going to be a little devil's advocate um I noticed that um the buzzword the buzz phrase equity inclusivity and diversity have now crept in and at some level it is euphemism for the acceptance of lgbq t i believe the expressionist um values now even in the code of conduct it is also reflected um and the issue of gender um has arisen is it that we are at the point where we are accepting um that in our school systems issues of gender transgender and the full gamut are now acceptable word is it that we are accepting that a boy can identify now as a girl and turn about the convent and sister Rufina um must accept um the student and vice versa in a nutshell I um I would say we the national code of conduct does not want to discriminate but at the same time I have raised this same issue and question and I was told this is not going to happen in the education system of central Russia okay so I I know that the world is moving in one direction but where do we as a country stand where do we as a ministry of education stand and how do we help our principals administrators to do the best to make sure that every child is educated it's a um yes it's a very good question um but I do not know if we can give you a definite answer I do not know um let's hear from Monica and let's hear from you know Paula um you know what their thoughts are on this thank you for tuna um and this it is a a difficult question but a very important question to address and we have heard very different opinions regarding this whole issue I would point out on page 40 in the regulation in the national code of conduct which is contained in the regulations so if we look at page 40 section 2 part h where it talks about diversity which is one of the issues that you raised by definition in the national code it talks about respecting diversity such as differences in language culture ability disability religion gender political affiliation and ethnicity and refraining from discrimination so when you speak about gender when you ask the question about gender the discussions that we've had about gender have been more about ensuring that for example that girls are not discriminated against uh and prevented from enrolling in advanced science and math classes in secondary school on the basis of their gender um so we've had discussions around equality that that girls and boys have access equal access to programs and services at school so it's been more of that conversation around gender just to clarify in response to your question and in the world there are many many um very complex issues emerging um but that has been the discussion around that part of the national code of conduct I just wanted to clarify that since you raised the issue of gender Paula did you have further comment from no that's that's fine uh Monica thank you just as I said earlier I think um you know we have to it's a complex um matter and we would be guided but um thank you very much um Monica for bringing back what our discussions have been in terms of gender um diversity etc etc Mr. Harold do you um how no that that's okay miss Anthony um I will feedback differently on it but that's okay thank you for the answer yeah thank you yes Mrs. McKinnon yes there's a couple of more um questions back to the uh question of numbers uh there's a question about if a number cannot be given for a truancy officer for example could we have a ratio like one officer uh two uh a thousand students or something like that um of course uh if people want certain things in the Education Act it can be placed there but the the the challenge with staffing is we are sitting here in uh 2023 looking at an Education Act that um uh was developed in 2005 now we know that there were a couple of amendments but um in in essence um Education Acts aren't changed frequently but yet best practices in education can change quite rapidly and people may want to have those changes and you want to have the flexibility to respond to new and creative ways of managing the education system so our approach our recommended approach is to not constrain by putting ratios or numbers I mean the um by putting ratios or numbers in the Act that would constrain moving forward having said that it doesn't prevent policies from being developed um to ensure that those sorts of things exist and those policies can be changed over time so in in terms of our recommended approach it is to not dictate numbers that's a management responsibility but rather to ensure that the those types of positions are there in both spirit and by definition so that one can ensure or the public can ensure that for example in this case attendance is addressed and I think there's a couple of more here I'm just um going down there was a question we we did post in the chat where persons can access the draft of the the proposed bill and the proposed regulations and and I I think just in in terms of our approach to access to school as or access to education I think one of the things that we have done in terms of of inclusive language in the proposed Education Act and in in the regulations as well is to ensure that barriers are not created for persons who wish to be educated and and have endeavored through the wording and the spirit of the act to make sure that people understand that the education system is open to all um and and we have um and if there are ways that you believe that the act could be enhanced with obviously we're having these town hall meetings to encourage um to encourage uh feedback it is your education act um and and and education is a public good and we want to be sure that the Education Act represents what St. Lucian's want in terms of education so we've endeavored in the as as Mrs. Anthony has said in in the well over 700 responses that we've received to capture as much as possible um in in the Education Act for you to consider but the door is still open to consider more and and that is exactly why we're having having these open town hall meetings so that we can consider things that appear to not have been uh addressed in a way that St. Lucian's would want them to be I think that's it's for the chat I think yes so thank you can we go to the next slide or I think perhaps we've done this yes so having done and listened to the process what we have done and where we wish to complete and validate this act or this bill we need to know what are your top three priorities that need to be addressed in the draft education act and the regulations we as we had the discussions some of them have come out we have noted them down but we need to know again if there is anybody who has a burning priority that needs to be addressed we have heard about the need for early childhood curriculum Mr. Harrell has brought to our attention the the need to probably be a little more forceful we need to define what staff means and teachers and and definitely the kind of languages so we've been making notes um on what what you have been seen as some of the gaps or some of the needs so do you have any any um priorities that you would like seen in in the education acts for um let me just gently say that yes some questions were raised but we have also explained to you that there are some things that cannot be placed in the education act we have attempted to address some in regulations and some of them will have to be addressed through policies because the education act is a long document and we cannot um add everything in their legislation because this education act had to be aligned to the constitution you know the labor laws and a number of other um um Mrs. um William met Dr. William mentioned the alcohol when we spoke about children and vendors at schools and outside of schools and this sort of thing we had to make sure that it is aligned to already existing laws of the land but we know that the Ministry of Education when they receive this they might need to create some additional policies to support implementation of the act so do we have any um other priorities yes sorry in the chat in the chat um um uh Raphina Donat said I would say all that was presented this evening are priorities and uh and so that that's wonderful to hear that that people think that the the discussion this evening um uh brought out some of the priorities for the act and areas where we should re-examine re-examine in terms of um what is contained there in thank you Paula and I think um Sister Raphina has also asked us to find whether there's a printed agreement between the ministry government and um denominational schools so this is a task that we'll have to follow through with so thank you sister for that um if all um I do not know how many persons would be in agreement that um all can be considered priority I would ask um what do you hope will come out of the draft Education Act and regulations enforcement is the critical issue we have noted thank you scenery enforcement of the act and regulations we can forward anybody else okay um we have agreements coming up on the screen if not by everybody but um I think Yola and has said she agrees um could we move on to the next slide please so the next step we are sharing with you that the questions and comments provided by the participants in each town hall meeting is being recorded it will be analyzed to identify main topics and issues that have been raised so we'll do after the nine or ten we will look at it with the look pull out all the similar themes all the gaps and then move towards any amendments these topics and issues will be addressed in the validation and finalization of the draft Education Act and regulations so your input will be taken into consideration at the end of our nine or ten town hall meetings the final draft and the company report will be prepared and submitted to the Ministry of Education these are the next steps closing comments well I think um I want to thank everyone who made the effort to turn out this evening at what point will teachers be engaged I would hope that the principals the teachers who are part of the general public hearing about this teachers have been involved in district one there were a number of teachers teachers were also invited principals will now probably if they think their teachers have not been exposed should do one more step take the education enhanced education act the regulations and spend a day with the teachers give them lunch and you know have a discourse on it so that people are not taken by surprise or see the neighborhood well they should have been about Mrs. Henry yes but we will leave it here Mrs. Henry um everyone was invited there were public announcement everyone was invited but we know um I will use the word culture you know and inverted commas so we know that we will have a little more work to do you know and I just yes if I if I might Mrs. Anthony I just would like to um I just would like to be um or to acknowledge the role the teachers union throughout this process they have been very active um from the outset and as a matter of fact it was the teachers union who spoke to the importance of the regulations and and to ensuring that that we built upon draft regulations that were developed years ago and and so the the union has provided significant input and and I believe wants to continue to provide input through the process and we are open and very appreciative of the efforts that that the union has made on behalf of its members to this process and so if there is a sense that teachers are have not are not aware or not involved I think we have several avenues to ensure that teachers feel that they've had an adequate time to review this current draft and comment if they if they so desire thank you um Mrs. McKenna yes so we can go on to the next slide somebody says they are not getting access to the code of conduct and the draft regulation I think um you would need to probably um call the ministry of education or um check the government website where they have posted them all because there is also a number of frequently asked questions that were prepared so that people could have read them beforehand or before coming to the tom hall meetings all this was done and shared so that it could be shared with the general public so if you are not getting through to download it yes Mrs. Anthony I put one website I'm just going to go pull the uh second website for persons just in case so yeah oh thank you uh Mrs. Miss Emanuel just put the equip one which is what I had also put earlier and if persons are having trouble with that one please go to the ministry of education website because it is there as well that's right and if they're having any difficulty I am sure in person the ministry always welcomes members of the public interested persons who are seeking to continue their own education and show an interest in education this is one thing the ministry of education does all the time so I want to thank you and um I am back I want um to ask Dr. Williams if she wants to make any closing remarks and the same will go for Mrs. McKinney any closing remarks from you all thank you very much Mrs. Anthony and I want to thank everyone who's participated in the town hall meeting this evening it was a very rich conversation and we learned a lot and we have additional information going forward thanks to your contributions so a sincere thank you to everyone and have a pleasant evening and I would just echo Dr. Williams comments I would like to thank Ms. Laurence for opening this evening and and in advance for her closing and and thank all of you for coming um this is important it's important to have these rich conversations and we find them um just critical in our recommendations for ongoing enhancement of the education act to ensure that it's shaped in a manner that will serve all all citizens of St. Lucia well thank you all very much thank you very much and I want to say a special thank you to Miss Emanuel for being here with us this evening Mrs. Laurence and um thank you very much um Mrs. Henry and everybody who made that special effort to be here with us and I am sure we will get some more feedback from Mr. Libby Harrell thank you very much and over to you Mrs. Laurence if you need to make any closing remarks I say a great thank you to you the team our lead this evening Mrs. Anthony our two consultants Mrs. Dr. Williams and Mrs. Makinan and I thank you parents for your very um valid very invalid um very invaluable contributions this evening I made notes of all the points that were made and Mrs. Anthony you did um mention them but I want to go over them again there was reference to safety and security um there was a great concern about that inclusion in the act someone spoke about skills the inclusiveness of education to incorporate skills education third addition of loitering out of school and it is a very great concern to us all educators in this meeting as well as of course parents especially since our schools are within the inner city area and we have a major issue with loitering and and it does put our students at risk within the school walls someone spoke about scholarships for Cape only and of course this is Anthony you explained it very ably someone also mentioned the ambiguity Mr. Harrell mentioned the beauty of the language as well as um they need to make the language a lot more forceful to allow principals to carry out their duties if they are to be held accountable and um Cesar Rufina mentioned the agreement that may have existed between the ministry of education government and denominational schools someone mentioned home schooling and of course an explanation was provided someone also mentioned the importance of school inspections also there was mention of the absence of a curriculum for the early childhood education um sector we also spoke about discipline how do we address discipline and of course there was mention and discussion about the education appeals tribunal um Mrs. Anthony you spoke very ably about the national code of conduct and of course we need to do our little homework and do some research on what's in there so that we can fully understand what support that the education act has in that document and I believe it was mrs. McKinnon who mentioned um the focus on positive behavior and looking at schools as communities where we have school leaders students etc all involved in ensuring that persons behave in positive manners but also and we are all listening I believe to that how do we deal with misbehavior and of course you mentioned or there was mention of in school suspensions restorative justice some of us did the training and of course supportive the focus on supportive types of responses to misbehavior but we also look at sanctions how do we deal with appropriate responses or sanctions to those behaviors um mr. Harold spoke about equity inclusiveness and diversity well let us say looking at gender in the education act as it relates to inclusiveness we also looked at the truancy officer and how do we deal with the one truancy officer at present and um I can't remember if it was um dr. Williams who mentioned that as the education act we need to ensure that the education act allows us some leverage as to how do we deal with the dynamics of education so instead of um specifying a ratio or number of truancy officers we can look at policies supporting policies to enable us to navigate um those situations and the focus really is on dealing with attendance or poor attendance among schools um we also look at the regulations um supporting the act so I believe we have had a very lively discussion this evening and I'm hoping I believe on behalf of all of my community members from district three who I thank immensely for being here um I hope that those concerns will be reflected very diplomatically I believe in the education act continuous review coming from this town hall meeting and mrs. Anthony you explained to us the process what is the next step and I think we really greatly appreciate that so thank you so much team the consultants and mrs. Anthony for this evening's proceedings and of course behind the scenes we have missy manual from equi who is you know behind the scenes as I said doing what it is that it takes so I wish everyone on behalf of district three the very best as we further fine tune the education act to really reflect what the education sector really needs now because we have all of our duties to perform but we need two legs and two arms to stand on so that we can you know expect accountability and efficiency and all of the best from our community members from district three and of course from district one to eight thank you so much very good evening to everyone and those who are the two physical locations we wish you a safe return to your home thank you so much all the very best thank you again thank you thank you thank you mrs. Lawson excellent summary excellent you know in every way and we thank you for coming and being such a supportive member of the team of district three I say thank you to you again and everyone especially as mrs. Lawson has said if you're at a physical space please get home safely god bless and all the best thank you good evening thank you good night recording stopped


everybody and welcome to Hawaii together on Think Check Hawaii Broadcast Network. I'm your close Kili Ikeena, president of the Grassroot Institute of Hawaii. Hawaii is often ranked as one of the worst states in which to start and grow a business, but that doesn't mean it isn't done. I mean, there are interpreters who succeed all the time. In fact, I'm so delighted today that we get to talk with one who has looked at the challenges and decided to face them head on and is helping to build a whole community of entrepreneurs here in Hawaii. My guest today is Brynn Foster. She's the founder and director of Boijing Foods. Now that's a company dedicated to perpetuating Hawaii's canoe plants, such as taro, sweet taro and breadfruit fruit, which ostensibly came to us via canoe. Brynn's products have been carried by all foods and have been featured in the magazine Food Industry Executive. I would say she's definitely up and coming, someone we're talking with and who may in her own practice have some of the answers that our state needs for rebuilding its entrepreneurial community. Brynn, good afternoon and welcome to the program. How are you doing? I'm so doing so good. Thank you so much for having me today to be able to talk about this important subject and to, you know, spread it to your viewers. So thank you. Well, you sound like somewhat a bit evangelist about your subject matter and I can tell from what you've done so far that you're passionate about it. How did you get so involved in the local food community? Well, it's, you know, a journey, for sure. I started by making my son gluten-free teething biscuits in my home kitchen and that was basically from our dehydrated poi. We had a lot of poi that we were stocking up because he was, you know, teething and that was his first foods that we were feeding him. So we had a lot of poi and when I wanted to start making teething biscuits, I decided to take that poi, dehydrate it into a flour and put it into his ingredient for gluten-free baked goods because at that time, over 18 years ago, gluten-free was becoming more of a thing and I wanted to feed my, you know, babies gluten-free as tarot is naturally gluten-free. So it really started with that base of a need to want to have something that wasn't in the market and then it really progressed into this journey of tarot and, you know, eventually it kind of circled around back to myself, which was my great grandmother gave me a coupi made with poi when I was a little girl and I believe it was a seed planted in me to reintroduce me to my culture through food. So that's really how this became from just like a coupi or a teething biscuit into something that is meant to be shared for Hawaii and the world. Part of that story I hear is your own heritage, your own culture, speaking to you through the teething biscuit, so to speak, but what drove you to actually start producing this kind of food in your home? You said you didn't see it on the market. Did you look far and wide and just couldn't find what you needed, but what I'm really asking is what turned you from a consumer into a producer? That was a really good like aha moment because there are several. You know, whole foods has just kind of started to open at that time and, you know, they were supposed to have everything in the world and they didn't have taro flour and I was like, why don't they have taro flour? You know, taro flour has to be a thing, you know, it's a starch, it's a great, it can be a great flour and it was then when I started to realize, you know, the things that are at the store really weren't always the healthiest for us and they were just more of these commodities and what were commodities and I never, you know, really understood what that was. So I really did like a 10-year, I would say, journey into kind of, you know, de-educating myself on, well, de-educating. I don't know if you call it rewilding or unlearning, you know, about food and how the system is really like meant to really not keep us healthy at all. And I was going on mommy and me field trips with my son. We weren't going to like low E's and we were learning all about the au foie gras and about the system and so I was at that moment like I can't be this consumer anymore, just going to the store to find my foods. I wanted to know my farmers. I wanted to understand how the food has grown, you know, everything about the food, especially if it was going to be going to my child, to my toddler. So that really brought me into this like consumer is the old way and really wanting to have a positive effect on in my community. So I started making my own flower. So, uh, Graham, that's an interesting thing you mentioned earlier that you went through a period of being deep programmed, so to speak. Are you suggesting that we today have been for lack of a better word brainwashed as to what our diet should be as to where our food should come from and so forth. And we've really not reflected enough about that. And you went through a process of doing so and have come up with a different way of preparing food and living. Well, the business of food is serious. You know, it's long. It's been, I think, since the grain revolution, you know, there's been a lot of talk on how we can mechanize food to be better. Well, then that changed a lot of the wheat into wheat, you know, that was more about being mechanized, not for the benefits of our digest, digestion, which is also why, you know, the biodiversity biodiversity of seeds have really like decreased because a lot of it is not mechanizable.  So we have to understand that food is like this business. And until we can kind of go back to the old ways that things were preserved or made, the ancient seeds, you know, the heirloom seeds, and that is really where the story became not just a food company for me because I started, you know, understanding these issues were huge, way beyond me, way beyond Hawaii. But then Hawaii had the answers to a lot of these issues, you know, in the Agua system and the way the land is managed, in the sacred seeds, in the stories of these seeds, and in the place-based foods, and the, you know, variety of the kalo that was available. And that's where I jumped into saying, yeah, this is, I'm gonna make this into a business because I can see that the powers that be don't think that taro farmers should have more than, you know, a month to month lease, even though their kalo takes a year to grow. So that's what made me think of, you know, this economic driver that could potentially help get their leases longer or their water rights back, or I was sort of back-ending into being, you know, a steward of the land by having, you know, by playing into this game of the food business. So, so, Brinn, tell us a story real quickly of how Voyaging Foods, which is the name of your business, came about. How did something that began in your kitchen as is merely a way of meeting a need you had to get for yourself and for your child products that are simply not on the shelf in the stores? How did you go from there to actually becoming a business? Well, you know, like I said, I was going all these mommy and me field shifts where we were going to the low-e, we were talking to farmers, we were understanding what the issues were, how the plants were grown, where the water was coming from, and I started, you know, making these products made from cauliflower, and they were really good.  So then I started making cookies and then having them for sale at farmer's markets, but I didn't have a name for the business. So that, I really believed in like, this was something bigger than me, and the name would come.  And so that's how I treated this business. It's really like divinely led, honestly, because I have no history. Well, I didn't know it. I do have a history in Colorado, but I didn't have a known conscious history of it until I started to work with it, eat it, plant it, put it into my life, then it then it really blossomed. So that's the way, you know, the voyaging food's names came, and then I started learning about the Wukulea. I had no idea. And then I started learning about Polynesian Voyaging Society. So it was all like this, you know, cumulation together. As soon as I was learning more about the moon cycles and how all of this history is really the blueprint for how we are as, you know, children of this land to come and with our kahia and our kuleana, how we are to, you know, operate in this day and age. So that's really how it was. It was because Belkulea was really like, I want to say amused, because the voyaging foods is really the plants that the Polynesians brought on their open ocean voyaging canoes when they purposely came to Hawaii or they traveled around the Triangle, the Polynesian Triangle. You know, this wasn't like we just kind of drifted all those lies. The Kulea proved how skilled our, you know, society was. So these plants are meant to be shared, obviously, but they're also like the emergency kit that you would bring on a desolate island, even though, you know, we were very healthy as a people pre-contact. That's great. And I love hearing your story. What I want to hear also is a bit about the challenges you face in trying to build your business. It would be, it may be the case that people who have a great idea can go after that great idea, but sometimes there's difficulty encountered along the way. What are some of the challenges you found that food entrepreneurs face when they're trying to bring their product to market? Well, I was very specific. You know, I was all about taro, and I was very specific about Hawaiian ground taro. So I had a lot of challenges, you know, it's not, this is a hundreds of year problem, not enough, not enough land, water issues. So I was really coming up with all of that. And I hope that is solved within our lifetime. I don't like to put it into this like multi-generational ecological disaster problem that we inherit. I want to see that gone now. And I believe that happens through food that we eat here around here and culturally. So yeah, the barriers were many. And I spent many years going to all the, you know, aside from, before I decided to put this into a business, I went talk to all the experts that were growing follow, were talking about that there was actually a big push in the 80s to make taro flower. The UH had a grant that was very, you know, had a lot of money behind it. They were building machines. And they had a patent on a lot of these processes. And so I met with all the experts that were part of that process. And I said, why isn't this happening? I need this. I want to buy it from you. Well, it didn't happen because the money failed, you know, the grants failed. And I thought, wow, this is something I need. This isn't like a grant.  And so yeah, I think if you're, the barriers are a lot, but once you find your kind of tribe or your group who get you or who need something as much as you do, then you just stick with them. But I think talking to too many people in the beginning might be a problem because you will find their problems and you don't want to inherit their problems because their situation is not yours.  And I'd love to collaborate in a way that, you know, we're moving forward.  So the kind of thing someone doesn't necessarily think about when they're making good that's in their kitchen, and then want to want to sell them. Oh, what was your experience with that? I didn't know anything about kind of shoots.  So yeah, I think I, I don't want to say wasted, but I might have spent over 13 years putting too much money and time into participating into the regulatory, you know, any time, I think that might be also like my way of, I do love the process of things. I like learning all of these barriers. And then I like to pass on the knowledge. So I like to create doable systems for other people to replicate for the betterment of the whole.  But the issue is, you know, when you're also trying to be vertically integrated, growing and harvesting and processing and being gluten-free, which I started before gluten-free was a, was a thing. So I was certified in it all. I pretty much figured all of the, you know, hurdles out, but yeah, I wasted a lot of money in a lot of years and I could have saved, you know, a lot of things if I didn't go down those routes that I didn't eat to because I'm doing low-risk manufacturing. Colo and, you know, breadfruit and a lot of these canoe plants are low-risk. And, you know, I think also there's a lot of deregulation with a lot of those, especially because, you know, they are cultural and, you know, we grow them and, and it's part of our cultural rights to also process these and, and just like, you know, with boypounding, you know, on boyboards, like there's, there's certain rights that we have as a, as a culture to continue the way processing the way that we now best in a safe manner also. And I think we've come really far and so we do have a lot of the tools now so that we don't need to be heavily regulated and we can be partners with people like the Department of Health to say, hey, we're managing ourselves, you know, probably better than, than you can. And here's the data. I mean, I remember when I started to go into Whole Foods and when we had to get audited, you know, I gave them a Bible that was like three years of just data and information that I had collected and all the details. And I remember, you know, the auditor came in, I think he was from the mainland and he just looked at it and he's like, I trust you. Wow, you really know your stuff. And, you know, looking to the pages and, and saw. So I think, you know, we're working to make, have things de-regulated, but that doesn't mean that we're putting our hands and saying, we're not going to be washing our hands and, and going the distance. We're going to definitely do that. But now one of the challenges you faced was the need for a commercial kitchen, reduce certain kinds of foods. Oh, how did you face that challenge? And what, what do you say to people who were trying their best to produce food to sell but can't afford a commercial kitchen? Yes, this is exactly why I started to get more involved in cottage foods. Because in Hawaii, sometimes it's who you know. And unfortunately, that was even more so 18 years ago when I started, I was calling all the schools to try and, hey, can I use one of your kitchens you're not using? And I finally was able to find one. And so I operated in there for over 10 years.  And I know so many other people that are doing amazing products and gluten free products, things that I needed to eat and my son or my kids, I wanted them to eat the same way. So I was trying to say, hey, you can come use my kitchen, even though that wasn't allowed, but I was trying to start new LLCs with these people. I mean, I was just going overboard, which is the waste of time and money, just because also to be able to collaborate to, you know, pull your resources so that rent isn't so high, so that you can share people that are helping you in the kitchen so that you can cost share with ingredients. All of these things are necessary to be able to have a food business in Hawaii. So, you know, at that time, I was just going off on these tangents, making my own LLCs when I shouldn't have been doing that with people that, you know, were doing great things. But how do you collaborate together and share a kitchen when the kitchen, you know, wasn't allowing you to do that? So there was a lot of hurdles. Now, you mentioned partnering with the Department of Health. One of the concerns of the Department of Health, we've been told, is safety. There are people in the community who need to be protected from unscrupulous practices of producers who put food out there that isn't safe. What are your thoughts when you hear that? And how do you respond to it?  The way that I come at it with is I want to look at with Department of Health as a collaborator. You know, like I said, I went through all the courses that I needed to do in order to understand what they were looking for. And I wanted to now share that with everyone else because I understand that a lot of people don't like to go that distance that I did, but I was in Whole Foods. So I wanted to be, you know, understanding what the barriers were. So to make healthy food, definitely the tools available for that knowledge are here now. They weren't there 10 years ago. They weren't probably there even seven years ago. You know, we have water activity in the nurse now hand nurse that we can see, you know, how dry is this and what's the potential for any issues. So, you know, I think Haasup is a very interesting horse to take because you understand critical points. And you really get to kind of have the knowledge of the big drives, but you can still be, you know, small, but, but mighty is what I like to say. So, so we share a lot of this knowledge that I've taken and some other people in the industry have taken. So to create seafood and what I've heard and I've researched is there hasn't been any problems with cottage foods and, you know, the mainland, there hasn't been any issues with that.  So that's, you know, why cottage foods is so important to me is because we're on more of a smaller scale. So we can, we can change and pivot and really see what our batches are like. I'm really focused on small batch because we also want to understand, you know, the different place-based foods and the different taste profiles of those. So I really believe this industry is all about place-based and in the small makers. And then we can all collaborate together and then it's a really big industry. Thank you. Now, there was a bill proposed in Hawaii's legislature last session. It was called the Access to Local Food Act. And what that would have changed would be some of the rules for what foods may be sold in Hawaii. It would have allowed people, for instance, to sell their homemade foods through the mail or online or through third parties. Do you think those kinds of changes in the Access to Local Food Act would be helpful? Absolutely, 100%. And I'm putting, you know, my energy towards this because I, during the pandemic, I started a collective called the Canoe Black Collective with my partner. And this bill will support that feeling of we need to have this collective of small cottage food makers that are doing big things. Small doesn't mean, you know, many and not important. So yes, these new, you know, these issues that we're bringing forth with shipping, being able to sell at stores and being available on the internet, those are huge to cottage food makers. And it's something that we definitely need to expand the economic viability of cottage foods in Hawaii. We've seen how Maui, you know, needed food and all of these hubs came, but they were all imported. You know, I think that we need to rethink how we're providing food, how we're cooking it, how we're serving it, because there's a lot of options to, you know, create a hub from the farm food. And if there's home makers that are able to safely process this and distributed to our local communities, then we're eliminating shipping altogether, which is important. Now during the pandemic, I was involved in an effort to help local individuals prepare meals for kupuna or for others who were in need. And one of the problems was getting around or complying with, I should say, the regulations that certain foods have to be maintained at certain temperatures. And so the bill that we were just discussing addresses this. It would allow foods like barbecue or poke to be made and sold at home under certain conditions. But what do you think about that part of the bill? Well, I think there's a lot of different parts of the bill that seem to be kind of wide-reaching because there's different regulations for those things. Mike Lleona is a low-risk manufacturing, which is no meat, it's plants. There's, you know, no allergens. So that makes me feel comfortable because, you know, I don't understand how, you know, all the different time-temperature controls that you would need for different, you know, eggs, poultry, meat, that gets into another level. I was trained in a little bit of that, but like I said, Mike Lleona is in dehydration and drying and making flour and teas. So I definitely know that there's a lot of opportunity to share the knowledge and how to do that to make it safe. So I would most definitely, if I knew the makers and was able to, you know, understand their process, I would feel safe consuming it. But that's what the great thing is, is it's more transparent this way because, you know, they will be able to share their process and you'll know who they are.  It's the same concept. It's really just getting to know your producers. Well, Bryn, we've got a minute left and I'm wondering if you could just quickly share one of your own or someone else's success story in terms of how they've been able to make the kind of food they want and take it to markets. I mean, I just really appreciate my own journey and my own story because, you know, one of my successes when it seems like everything's too, too hard and there's too many barriers is my favorite memory was we made a pancake mix with cauliflower and ulu flour for the hopefully when they went to Tiki several years ago. And that was really special to me because it was full circle. It was everything that showed me, yes, this is important. We're doing something bigger than ourselves.  And they open up these, you know, just they open up these new portals of learning. And like I just, you know, initiated the D learning or the, you know, the unlearning of what we used to think was, you know, so important back in the days that hasn't served us well. So that was a success story for me is to be able to have ulu flour and taro flour connecting, you know, the people that were on Hokulea in a place that they hadn't been in a long time. Well, Bren, you've made me hungry. And so your message is getting through not only to my heart, but my stomach. Thank you so much for being here today. I think you share a lot of things that people are very interested in and now can come out and be advocates for Mahalo. My guest today has been Brynn Foster. She's the founder and head of Voyaging Foods. It's been wonderful listening to her story. And I hope you're inspired by it. I'm Kaylee Akena, president of the Grass Fruit Institute, and wishing you the very best. We'll see you next time on Think Tech Hawaii's Hawaii Together. Aloha.