uh Because because we're we're planning on all playing on the same server on a pvp server and uh, the brackets for alliance and horde are different So which is kind of interesting, right? It was without without the uh, without the honor system works Like you're you're really competing against your teammates as opposed to competing against the opposing faction, right, but um I mean, I guess that's just how it is, right? Um I think that we would like to have the brackets organized I mean stay safe and I are going to play alliance tips is going to play horde But at least on the alliance side, we would like to try more like organized approach to the brackets But who knows how that's actually going to play out? Yeah, yeah, um, obviously everyone is hoping for minimal honor wars when let's say let's say you have brackets established And you know who's gonna get you know, how many bracket one spots who's getting the bracket two spots Anytime someone like like another pre-made on your own faction steps up and says actually, uh, we want the bracket one spots for our pre-made That's a problem for everyone because the bracket system is is based on a percentile scale, right? and it's like a pyramid that expands the further you go down the brackets and um If there's an honor war the bracket one spots are more competitive more honor required and that trickles down on everyone else And so that uh should be minimized Yeah, that's pretty brutal. I disagree go go all out be competitive Kill each other I can't speak on behalf of everyone on the horde side of the server But I can't say it's going to be fun watching stay safe and s-fan fight over the honor stuff I think it's going to be really funny. Well crazy the bracket 16 is kind of tough competition Yeah, I think um And we've talked about how we want to approach it off stream a couple times We're still not sure yet But I think it'll I think it'll be fun because a lot of it depends on when they want to put the pvp system into right Like I know for me I've only ranked a 10 in the past because I hit a point where I was like wait I don't need to do this because I'm like getting raiding gear and stuff So it'll it'll be really interesting to see how uh when when the gear is put in when When the rewards are put in what rewards are put in at a point if the battlegrounds are all put in at once Or if they stagger the battleground release somehow One thing I'm sorry.  I was I was going to say one thing I'm I'm not like this is a personal issue and it shouldn't influence gameplay or like game design Really, but if they if they add the honor system in phase two Um, that would like let's say I'm ranking for three or three and a half months to get 14 That would spill over very likely in a bwl launch And so imagine it's like week 10 of my 12 week process And bdl will comes out and that that would really be a wrench in the in the grind Right. All right.  See Um, so that's a good question kind of uh, you know talking about pvp and the ranking system. Why not? This is from chris hansen I gotta leave No, guys. My name is chris hansen. Not good, dude. Okay. Not good. Okay. Uh, would it Would it be possible to have pvp and the ranking system in phase one? But temporarily gate the rep rewards and pvp rewards to answer the gear to patch in balance. So Uh, he's he's talking about basically, you know, you put in the pvp system early and then put in the gear later Uh, the thing that I don't like about this is the fact that It it doesn't really like you end up not having the gear Earlier like if you attain the ranks, but if you have the rank then you can just go buy the gear as soon as the Gears put in the game. So, uh Yeah, you can basically you're basically getting like a jump start and like early farming it and and here's here's the issue Here's how the current ranking system works or here's how it worked in vanilla, right?  You can only buy the weapons the week you're 14 You don't retain it. Um, so once you d rank and you will d rank no one retains 14 I wonder I wonder actually how long someone has retained 14 if anyone has like been that much of a super nerd, but anyway, um They would have to change some things where it's like, okay That you can current you can always buy the gear at the highest rank you attained that would change things a little bit Um, I would just leave it as is Yeah, and and and be be smart about when they they launch when they put it in Yeah, right It I don't know if there's any any mmo system that's ever been successful that hasn't been tied to a reward system So if you didn't have like If you had the ranking system in but you didn't have the rewards yet people would play as if the rewards are coming And they don't know exact if they don't know exactly when they're coming then they're not going to bother I mean, I love the idea of having bg's in with no honor system because I think it's just fun But I think I would be sitting in queue forever because nobody else would be wanting to bg because there's no point Probably other other than fun if I you can just go out into world pvp So there there always has to be a reward system tied to any other game system in mmo's Otherwise people just don't do it like how many people play mr Pandaria and just never did scenarios because it there was never any rewards attached to it Like other than eventually they added the challenge modes that kind of stuff But you just didn't do it because there was no rewards So you're definitely right players respond to incentives the incentives have to be there Right I'm not sure for very good I'm not sure if this was covered in the question, but did we talk about cross around bg's? Uh, no, uh, that's something we've talked about before, but I think it's a good thing to address for sure. Um Yeah, I mean people I know I know for me. I've said before that I don't like I don't like cross room. I just I don't like cross room battlegrounds. I I feel like cross room battlegrounds were put in in preparation for The I mean there there were a necessity for burning crusade right with how the arena system works and whatnot Because if you didn't have it like that then you would have one team sitting at the top waiting like two hours to queue Right, you you would have to have it like that um It also was a necessity for servers that had big population imbalance and what they did was they would match up servers with Like oh the server is horde heavy the server is alliance heavy. Let's put them together So now you have basically like, you know, roughly like 50 50 split and Then you do these cross room battlegrounds and you'd you'd package them all together And we talked about this a little bit on the last one Then you had like the like the nightfall battle group bg9. You had all these different battle groups and What would happen was or the purpose of this was basically so people could queue for battlegrounds faster and For people to be able to actually like play all the content in the game as opposed to sitting in like hour-long queues on some servers Trying to wait for 10 alliance to queue for a war song.  So Um, what do you guys think? I uh, I heard a recommendation from tribe the other day and I really liked his idea Um, essentially start off without them And over time as you start to see, you know, which servers are tilted into which factions direction Slowly form battle groups, but when it comes to the actual queuing algorithm Make it. So let's say you queue you queue up for bg Um for the first like five minutes or whatever predetermined number of the queue It would only try to pull you from people from your server And then uh, let's say you don't find anybody from your server Then it queues you up with a another server cluster of like two or three more servers for the next five minutes And then if that doesn't pair you up with anybody then it expands to the full battle group or something like that And you could have different thresholds within within that queue time So ultimately the the final number would be you know, 15 realm battle groups like we had back in vanilla But there would be kind of intermittent pairing on the way to to try to keep you with like a more, uh Community-based group the problem with that Okay, so you want to go ahead first? Okay I was going to say the problem with that is if you have a situation where they have like a heavily populated server Put into the battle group in order to help balance out the rest of the rest of the servers It ends up basically, okay that that server has priority for its own server And then if people are actually active in queuing on that server anyway Then they end up not providing benefit to any of the other Servers whereas they I mean it doesn't change at all for them But all the other servers don't get the benefit of being in the same cluster as them Mm-hmm So that's that's what I would be worried about because if it's like you might have like five minute queues on both sides Anyway on one server and then it never bleeds over Then maybe take away that first step and immediately start queuing from a smaller cluster like three servers and then expand to the 15 Battle groups or so Right. Well, I mean and that's the thing right like and that's kind of like what stays if it brought up in the Past too is like if it's something they have to implement later on um And I'm sure it wouldn't be big clusters like I don't know If if if there needs to be cross from battle groups, you know, they're probably will be at some point Probably not the start, but they're probably will be down the road. I mean if the option is no queue Let's say there's like six like six or seven people per side sitting in the queue and you need 10 to for it to pop Um, you know having like six or seven people from your server and then three three fillers from another from another server I mean that's that's that's better than no queue, right?  I don't really think that's like the end of the world right, I mean, uh, I have distinct memories of playing like when ab came out and My my pvp pre-made would queue up in a raffi in the actual portal Go play a game come out queue back up again Estimated wait time 47 minutes It's like, okay. Now. What do we do for 47 minutes and like, okay? I guess we'll just go hammer like We'll go to hammer mill and we'll just kill everybody that comes out of their Battleground portal or like we'll go do something else And like that was cool at the time because that was the only option available to us but we would prefer to play um Like more frequently than that And that's eventually why they added the cross realms and and I think as funds right like the arena system you need Just a larger pool of people And so when they were prepping for you know tbc and they knew they had the arena system coming They set it up for the 1.12 to do the cross round battlegrounds If I had a guess that we're going to have cross round battlegrounds We don't know exactly how the servers are going to look or how they're going to be built or anything like that yet But if there anything like they were back in classic I would bet they're going to add the cross round battlegrounds Which I think is a loss in and obviously some ways because I like to play against the same people over and over and over again And knowing their names and knowing their tendencies as players and like how that one druid likes to sneak up against the The pole on the flag and like you always you always know the watch out for that One druid because he was always really sneaky like that kind of stuff is really cool and really valuable to classic And I hope that we have that but if I had a guess From a design perspective, they're going to be doing cross realms Absolutely, and I saw a lot of people when we even mentioned cross realms a lot of people were like no You know horrible blah blah blah and and I definitely I definitely prefer that it Is you know restricted to your own server, but the reality is it is so destructive not just for queue times On servers it's so destructive to have imbalanced servers when it comes to bg's Because if the dominant faction is not able to queue up for a bg What you'll see is the dominant faction will just go out into the world to collect honor And you're going to have a situation. Yeah, you're going to have a situation where They've got 40 minute queues. So they're an epl slaughtering everybody level 48 and above a wpl Or or frickin syrian gorge bring steps anywhere Just slaughtering everybody on the on the less dominant faction And you're going to be in a situation where that causes more people From the less populated faction to leave change server stop playing which in turn increases queue times Which means more people are going to be shredding people in the lower zones and it literally destroys the server And we're seeing this on north dill right now. It is literally happening right now on nd You'll only die if you're bad. Okay, so just don't bad and then you just win The result the end result is around like 20 to 25 dominant line skills and like three Good horde guilds and it's it's just not fun. Nobody's having a good time. You know Yeah, well, I mean that's just kind of like the nature how the the privacy result will go as well generally You know, it's okay.  Well, hey news flash buddy. No changes this cross realm that was put in the 1.12 patch So that's that's been a little while That's a change that I mean, it's not it's not even a change. It's just something that wasn't a thing on private service, right? So people just like don't know that Yeah, I don't know. So like a lot of times like people like I don't know. It's it's ridiculous Yeah Speaking speaking to the faction and balancing like tips is absolutely right by the way tips is right I was kidding. Uh, but speaking to the faction balancing what we see on private services is that everyone sort of knows that like alliance Has a higher performance level in vanilla wow than yeah, well, it's just like the average player IQ for alliance is like higher Yeah, right That's true. That's actually true And so you end up seeing like like a 60 40 split or 55 45 split, you know alliance is dominant Player account wise, but I think I think in classic wow It will be more 50 50 because I've noticed I think the retail has more of a horde tilt Um Oh, it's like a heavy horde Yeah And so those people are going to spill over and want to play horde even like they they might not know that alliance is better And so they'll spill over and play horde. Um I think you know, I like we might even see a horde dominant classic route Who knows just because there'll be so many new people that don't know about the meta All right. Mm-hmm. Yeah, for sure. Um I think I Got it alliance everywhere I go. I got that. Are you going to alliance nano? I'm alliance for sure.  I mean again, like I said Uh male male male, okay, that's fine. That's all right. Oh, you too.  Maybe in game in game I'll meet you at moon guard I'll meet you at the tainted scar Wow, okay That was good, dude. That was that was good. Oh, you know what that was good. Uh, okay So Uh, this is this is a fun question, right the the necklace the um Talisman of the binding shard Would you like to see it drop? Would you like to see it drop in uh in classic? Like it's like a Because I know that's something you guys did like only one drop and then it was and then it was done. What do you guys think about this? It's it's so weird. You asked this. I don't think it should drop. I think that should be a special vanilla wow meme I don't think it should be replicated, but it's funny. You asked this the last couple nights. I've actually had dreams This is going to sound super nerdy I've had dreams that I'm leading my guild in classic wow and it drops and it causes a huge drama uproar And I have to deal with it. I've actually had dreams about that. Yeah to yourself. It's fine Yeah, I'm sure it should go drama. It's an inconsequential item if if we wanted to drop for the memes It's it's fine, but it's like reflect damage. So like maybe it's good for taking wilps in the room and like Well, I would say that the thing is let's say they do have it in the game. Um Like I think it's kind of obvious that it should go to a paladin specifically So no, no, okay. Listen, so it's it's got reflect damage. It's got strength and stamina reflect damage It synergizes very well with retribution aura You've got nature resistance shamans are they counter paladins very well So the nature resistance is good for that and fire resistance as well I just want to say, you know, what gets countered by paladins like really hard is warlocks Paladins actually kind of warlocks very hard. Anyway, you can continue. Yeah Everyone knows that All right. Okay.  It's just a running joke People are like what no they don't like what are you talking about? I was like, no, it's just a running joke There's all kind. I mean, yeah, and we all know I mean, that's one thing we should make clear that the classic wow demo was a 100 accurate Right 100 accurate. And I think it was a a perfect representation the epitome of Skill knowledge overall attractiveness Just social ability in general. So I mean, that's one thing that I think we all know That's obviously true. Mm-hmm and in no way exaggerated So, yeah Let's we'll take some questions in the chat as well If you guys have questions and and you guys want to give us some questions in the chat before we wrap up Let's see here, let's see Do you think they will have the older enchant system in place at first where you had to get the dolls in the Primal gear as opposed to the idols in zg the estimated time from stage four to five would be about three months And that's an extremely tight time frame if you want to enchant your whole raid team on idols Yeah, I think what makes the I think what makes the most sense is that they're going to go with That they're going to go with it like in stuff like that in general. I think it's going to be The latest version right the the 1.12 version Um, I think that's what makes the most sense I I forget which one of you said it, but I think it might have been your or tips that said they'll probably run off of 1 12 Uh with with exception right and not the other way around Yeah, right. I mean the the pre 1.11 version of Getting zg enchants is so non-intuitive. It's like, okay, let me go to Dire mall to get this arcanum and then let me get this Like purple item. That's not actually for my class Um, so I can turn this doll in to get a chance on my legs like it doesn't make that much sense So I I you get more enchants that way than you do with idols So that's why private servers have typically just kept it because it gives more people access to stuff To complain, but I think the idle system is how it's gonna Okay, so do you think do you think that going with the the system that you guys used? Do you think that it would be a good idea? Maybe do you think that it would like if they pick one one version over the other? Do you think that it would be? I guess a good or bad idea, right? Let's say if they did it your eyes way It's going to force people to run zg longer if you have the idle system Which I don't think is necessarily a bad thing It'll help for it'll help for those new players who uh Need the zg catch up gear And every all the healers have stopped going because they got gen dosi Yeah, you need to keep going for the for the car buff anyway, right? So you have to get that Yeah Car buff the mount the dvp trinkets zandal our hero charms stuff like that Hmm What about evolved underdogs enhanced feral shadow another hybrid What do you mean another hybrid?  Okay. Anyway, you forgot ret paladin. You say my name, dude Okay, that's what it was We've talked enough about ret paladin today. Yes, but uh, yeah, I think um, I think I think with the hybrids You know, we now have some chance to predict year So can we said when power spikes come to the spec come table? Yeah, so I think uh, the classic meta is going to be different We said this earlier in the show The classic meta is going to be different than the private server in the the retail vanilla meadows. They all have a little bit different meadows one of the things is And I'll just talk about shadow priests for a second is that they're going to have 16 debuff slots from the beginning And there's some you know, it's some people say like, okay Well in a hundred percent optimal raid like you wouldn't have a shadow priest at all or whatever It's like look, we're not always talking about the the the one percenters, right or the point one percenters even um I think shadow priests are a great addition to almost any raid and I know one thing that the staysay is probably freaking liggas shops thinking about is warlocks are going to be very good In classic just the the combination of 1.12 talents from the beginning Warlocks having that from the beginning or everybody having that from the beginning and the fact that having 16 debuff slots available on the targets Means that it's going to be more than viable It's going to it's going to be perfectly fine to bring a shadow priest to a raid from week one You know I wouldn't Put it past them to do eight from the start like I'm not sure what they're going to do still right They very well could do eight early on Maybe I I don't think I don't I just I don't know. I think at this point. I think they would they would I don't know I don't think it makes sense if they say they're gonna go to eight I'm gonna send Ian a harshly worded email Oh, you don't want I actually I I'm a warlock, right? I would prefer eight for the start.  I gotta get my shadow priest buddies Yeah, so it'll it'll be it'll be interesting. I think with the 16 debuff slots from the beginning that they're currently saying I guess um I think what hurts the shadow priests are gonna be really good So I go ahead. I think what hurts the shadow priests the most at the start is just the lack of hit gear um Just no blood vine now. We don't have dire mall Uh dire mall is a couple hit pieces. I'm pretty sure spell cast hit pieces. I'm not mistaken I think um But yeah, just like the overall lack of hit gear Is is not uh, yeah That's uh, shadow priests don't need that much a cure because they yeah, they have 10 plus hit from their talents So they only need they only need six percent more. So Most of the time gets six and warlocks warlocks are the ones that really suffer whoever the warlocks are the most hit I've already complained to kevin jordan a lot about this. I don't know what he was thinking We need to say Classes he was out of his mind. Yeah Man, can you imagine how good warlocks would be with a plus 10 hit talent? Oh, man, dude Think think of the threat problems.  So Yeah, exactly.  Please don't Okay, we're gonna wipe the rain Everybody hates you.  I get like an early nightfall So I was like, perfect. Great And I got the p. I and I double crit My regular shadow bolt and my nightfall did like 9,000 damage pulled aggro Veil came to me, swiped me. I died. I think we still killed it, but uh, it was pretty foot in mouth situation Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, I think um Yeah, I think I think it's gonna be very fun I do I just like I'm getting kind of like just like flashbacks of different stuff like warlocks and just everybody like Every class has the stereotypes, right?  There's there's always something right whereas let's God hunters the okay.  I don't know if it's like certain like Uh, just personality types play those classes Or if it's like the nature of those classes cause you to make certain mistakes like who knows but uh chicken or the egg I guess But yeah, it's it's it's very fun thinking about all that stuff. So no, um We had another question. This is a good question about like, uh And we'll take maybe one or two more questions But um, this is a good question I saw earlier and I made a mental note of it is about gold selling and how people are How how blizzard is probably going to or how they should maybe look at um What are what are they going to do to counteract gold sellers, right? They they eventually in retail wow made the wow token I don't first see the wow token being a thing in classic. I think that's something that people have been very very vocal about We certainly have and it's to the point where it's it's almost like it seems so ridiculous that it's like, okay I like obviously they're not going to do wow token like that'd be absurd. Um, but Do you guys think they're going to come up with another way to counteract gold sellers I think it's a good concern because gold bonding and and selling like gold has a very gold is a very very formative part of Your classical experience, right? Because your success really depends on how much gold you have in a lot of cases um with consumables and respects and and whatever just buying your mounts and whatever for a lot of people That's a big deal. You get your epic amount. That's a big accomplishment for a lot of people. Um It was yeah others we get it for free. That's the way it goes. Um But uh It was it was in one of their first, uh watercour talks where they said they're going to be including updated antechee and an anti-bottom and and like And so so they're a modern ante, you know Anti bad behavior software is going to be which which is a big step up Yeah, I mean there's still gold selling in retail today at prices cheaper than you can get on the wow token I'm sure that there's less people who are willing to do that Because the well token exists, but there's still a market for it. There's probably still going to be some market for it. Um on classic I doubt that they include that because gold is a more Essential thing and classic than it is retail today Like gold today is mostly used for vanity things more than it is actual like Necessary items to be accomplished in the idea of somebody just throwing down 105 dollars for five wow classic tokens so they can buy their epic mount It's pretty anathema to the idea of classic in general. So I would sincerely doubt that They add the wow tokens to the the classic Right. Yeah. Yeah, I'm not exactly sure how they go about detecting gold sellers today Just because of the wow token. I mean I don't like I I haven't seen a gold seller on Calthus out or to chondrous in a while created. I haven't logged into retail in a while, but like um I think you have to kind of deconstruct it from the private server perspective There's a lot of gold sellers on private servers because number one the accounts are free Anybody can plan a private server. You don't need to pay $15 a month for it Number two because the server populations are so high that exacerbates the issue of gold because then inflation kicks in the economy big time So you need more gold to buy consumables that might otherwise be cheaper if there was less gold in the economy And again, it creates this vicious cycle where yeah, you know buying gold is you know might be worthwhile on private servers um, it's still worthwhile on classic servers, but You know if you take into account, hopefully blizzards like and you know not bought detection But what would you even call this like spam detection and and uh, yeah Yeah You want to know what it is every time a gold seller pops up spamming trade chat in in retail Wow, they get right click reported and muted That's the one positive Um, yeah, I think gold selling it's it's probably gonna be a thing. I mean, that's just like what are you gonna do? I mean, hey, no changes there. There's gold so much back then right So it's probably gonna end up being a thing. I mean people are gonna be able to buy gold or whatever I mean, uh, they'll get probably reported for it or whatever. I don't know I don't I don't know what they're gonna do to be able to to counteract it. I think it'll be an interesting thing to see but um I'll tell you this man If you're in my guild and I find out you bought gold every person in my guild It's on my raid roster is an investment right because we're giving them right and so If if someone is buying gold or doing something they shouldn't be doing in risking a ban That's a big deal not just for them But for the entire guild because we're we're maybe giving them gear over someone else that isn't cheating or buying gold or whatever Yeah, I think it's a huge deal I think what I'm gonna do is if I find out somebody's buying gold like let's say they buy a hundred gold I would come up with like a Something that would be like a fair kind of like equivalent fine for buying a hundred gold And they would pay let's say a hundred gold if they bought a hundred gold to me And then you know that way if they get banned then at least the gold that they bought is safe So that's that's the way that I see No, I'm just kidding Let's take oh you want to go ahead. I have one last question here. It's trying to Like gold wander Hey, the versions are great negotiators. What can I say? Well kind of like going off with Stacy just said about investing into a person A big thing of vanilla is people people quitting the game and You invest a lot of time and gold and gear Into certain players a gear that doesn't drop very often and then they quit What are you thinking about the account sharing stuff like like right now like on nd, right? If somebody quits the guild that I'm in their account goes to the guild and you know people do whatever they need to do With something like that. I mean I would assume it would be against blizzard policy right now But it is 100% is It will and it should remain against policy I think that's best. It's actually funny you bring that up going back to the talisman of binding shard hypothetical drop That's that okay. I actually decided that I would take it because I know that I'm not going to quit and it's such a rare item So just that True true. That was that was a big problem. That was a big problem. I had in uh My last guild like whenever we're doing loot council stuff like we would give stuff out and I always try to be like, you know As as fair as possible And I think one thing that I learned is is being as fair as possible Is not necessarily distributing the loot as evenly as possible, right? Because what's fair is That the guild keeps the loot at the end of the day. So like we would end up like losing out pieces of gear To people, you know, like I said, we lost we ended up losing like five dfts, right? Yeah, it was it was rough. So like it's just like we we gave it to one guy. He uh drake drake fang talisman Okay, uh, no, no, it was good because it because some people might not know like I thought you were Asking Okay. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's how we were like for a while Because we got we finally got one we gave it to a guy and then he ended up quitting like two weeks later And then it was just kind of like the same thing. We didn't get one forever and then we got some and it's just how it goes Um Were these people quitting or were they leaving guild and going to different guilds? Uh mostly quitting. Okay, but that's that's also part of the private server thing, right? So like tips you mentioned like people quitting that's that's a lot of that has to do with private server because they jump ship and They they go play on a different server or or what not and like I said I I really only have like my my original character that I played on back before like one of our streaming on youtube but um That that is how it worked, right people would quit and they'd go play on another private server or Uh, they wouldn't really have they wouldn't feel as invested into it because it was for you, right?   I'll just make another account It wasn't it wasn't as big of a deal on private servers and I think it's going to be a little bit of a bigger deal on uh In in classic it's much harder to account share in in today's system of accounts Anyway, in terms of blizzard, right? It's like everything is tied together in the the B.net account system or like my license for Starcraft 2 and overwatch and you know everything else is tied with my my same account that I used for wow So the idea and and with 2fa like being necessary like the authenticator Like it's just really difficult to account share like and and I mean I would imagine I don't know but I would imagine that if you log in from california one day in the new york You know three hours later and then back in california four hours later That probably trips a red flag or something, right? Like I would imagine that so I mean, I haven't shared An account with somebody that wasn't in finella like ever Like it's because like once they came up with a new bnet system. It's just like it's just not practical Right Again, I've been yeah No, that's true. That's a good point. Um one last thing we want to get to and we kind of Fox tango has asked this a couple times and uh, we kind of talked about this earlier, right? Whenever we're talking about itemization and whatnot. Uh, he was asking about um Should we assume they'll progress item changes Uh, or they'll progress item changes or that they will import 1.8 to 1.12 data items How are these types of items handled for nost? Uh, and and that's that's kind of the big question, right? Just to address this one more time because we talked about this earlier, but Um, that is that is the big question right now is do they want to Uh, how how much of progressive itemization are they going to implement into the game? Right because they've talked about adding in new items later on Uh, I mean they might have just been using the 1.10 as an example, right? That's what I think I'm sure they're going to Um, it's not just going to be the 1.10 patch items, but that's like the big chunk and it's easy to talk about that in a post Uh, because you know, there's not like you know turbo nerds like us, right that we're we're going to look at every little thing Um, but I'm assuming that when it comes to adding items into the game That's one side of progressive itemization another side of it is updating items. Uh, I think when it comes to adding items They're probably going to put them in at the right time Whenever it comes to updating items, who knows that's that's the question. I think, uh, I think it's it's maybe less likely. So what do you guys think? In terms of the dungeons, there's two different times where they really added a lot of items to the dungeons themselves so 1.4 also adds a lot of items to five man dungeons like Like your fell, uh Uh Something hat the the wizard hat that drops off magistrate. It gets out at 1.4. Um Maliki's slippers for the shadow damage boots those kind of things The one that's going to get added I think as well at that point Yeah, so there's a lot of items that get added to five man dungeons in 1.4 And 1.10 is when they make really good items to compete to catch people up for being able to do a queue um So whether they do the 1.4 ones, um, it's hard to say 1.4 would be phase two with dire mall Based on what they're saying with dire mall. It might make sense for those hold back some of those items because They they can be good and compete with some other mc find an mc So we'll we'll we'll see. Um I think it'd be good if they did do that because again I'm in favor of anything that makes raid items better more powerful than dungeon items. I'm typically in favor of Yeah yeah Yeah, I think uh, I think There is I think that's one of the interesting things of vanilla Right where that you can have some items in dungeons that'll that'll be on par to kind of like help players get into Get into raids and stuff And maybe you know, we've talked about this before so much of vanilla might have just like been on accident Right, and you know when we talk to john stats, uh, really we talked to we've talked to more current We talked to john stats. We talked to kevin jordan All those guys said things that are just kind of like yeah, we just kind of did this thing and it worked So like a lot of it was planned, but also a lot of it was kind of on on accident, you know Um, and it's funny just because you never know like what things were uh, well, you you don't know what was what right? You don't know. Okay. Was this did they do this on purpose and did it just turn out to be amazing or you know, um But yeah guys we've been going for for quite some time Uh a little bit a little bit over time. So we're gonna go ahead and wrap it up guys Thank you so much for joining us today. Please. Please. Please if you haven't yet, please feel free to follow Uh follow nost or follow nano nost follow stay safe tv follow tips out baby on twitch Also their youtube channels their twitter everything's on the everything's on the screen right there My twitter my youtube is on the screen. You know remember to hit the bell all that stuff. Thank you guys for joining us We do classic cast Roughly every two weeks, right, you know on monday nights this week. We changed it on to tuesday night For some scheduling stuff Tips is going to be continuing his stream tips is going to be continuing his stream after this and I will host tips And yeah that you can you can hit their links right there in the chat explanation point follow you can hit their links So again, thank you guys so much. We had a great time with you guys today. I thought this was a really fun episode and We'll see you guys later


one of the council people and I've never been there because of COVID. Yeah, I know it's kind of a weird thing having meetings again, right? What, what is this? We don't do this anymore. Where, where are you meeting them in the, in the city manager's office? 100 something. I don't have in front of me, but it was, it looked like, is that on? Yeah, so our, the whole address for, for the city, the main campus of city halls, 100 Santa Rosa Avenue. That's it. But there's, you'll, you'll need to know what room you're going to. Well, good to know. Okay. I know, I thought this is campus. You're probably going to meet them at the city manager's office because they have their own offices there, work rooms there. So if you go, it's on the second floor of city hall campus, like proper, and you'll see council chambers is like the biggest thing you'll see with a title on it. And just to the left of that, right by the elevator, that's the city manager's offices. Oh, excellent. Thank you. I think it's room 10. And don't forget to check out too, because you were going in there, one of the art pieces are the, one of the installations, alterations that we approved is there. And that's going to be, Oh yeah. Yes. Nothing's, nothing's there yet. Not yet. Okay. Yeah. Check the before. Yes, exactly. I'll check the empty space. Yeah. I did hear recording is started. Well, Kristin, you are, you are free to begin the meeting if you'd like, or if you'd like to wait, we do have our artists waiting to be promoted for their presentation. So if you're listening, VJ, we will get to your item shortly after we start the meeting. Thanks for your patience. Great. I'm going to give one more minute for any of our other members to join, and then we'll start the meeting soon. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the November 7th meeting of the art and public places committee pursuant to government code section 54953 E and the recommendation of the health officer of Sonoma County art and public places committee members will be participating in this meeting via zoom webinar. Members of the public can participate in the meeting via zoom or by dialing toll free number and entering in the webinar number. Lonnie, will you please let our members of the public know any other ways to participate? Yes, I can. So if you're a member of the public participating, you can select the raise your hand icon at the bottom of the zoom screen. If you're calling in, you can press star nine. Great. Thanks. Like to move on to roll call. Lonnie, if you would be able to take a roll call of all of our public places members. Yes, I can. Can I ask, when you guys do it, do I call out each of your names or yes? That is typically how we do it. Okay. Are with me. Board Member Baumgartner. Present. Board Member Puentes. Come here. Present. Vice Chair Jones Carter. Thank you. Chair Kiefer. Present. Let the record reflect that all members are present with the exception of Board Member Azterian, Board Member Nathanson and Board Member Sayers. Thank you. Item three, public comments. This is the time when any person may address matters not listed on this agenda, but which are within the subject matter of the jurisdiction. The public may comment on agenda items when the item is called. Each speaker is allowed three minutes. Lonnie, do we have any public comments waiting? We do not have any at this time. No phone messages nor emails. Great. I will then move on to item four, approval of minutes. This afternoon we have two draft minutes to approve. Tara, will you remind me, do these need to be different votes or can we vote in one for two? Let's see. I believe they need to be separate because there were different selection of members present. So if you could call them in two votes. Great. Okay. First off we have the draft minutes from October 3rd, 2022. Members of our committee have received a draft of these in an email. Are there any corrections or comments made about these draft minutes at this time for the October 3rd meeting? Seeing none, I'd like to move towards a vote. What anyone like? I moved that we approve the minutes as written for October 3rd. Can I get a second? I second that. Great. Thanks. Lonnie, we would like to take a vote. Typically we've just raised our hands on these votes if that's agreeable. I can't vote. Oh, sorry. I think we have a quorum. Yeah, I was going to say we don't have a quorum for that one. Vice Chair Jones Carter, you weren't there for the October 3rd meeting. And we do have a few people who were not here for the October 13th meeting. So I don't think that we will have a quorum for that either. Can I just double check? I think you can abstain. You still have a quorum. A quorum remains. Is this correct, Tara? No, we would have to have four votes to pass the minutes. So we're going to have to the table both minutes until the next meeting. And will these need to be tabled until the next regular scheduled meeting or could these go on to the next special meeting? I'm not sure exactly. Typically we put them on to the next regular meeting. That is correct. Okay. Well, then we will return to these at our December part in public places meeting. Moving on to scheduled items. Item 5.1 is the Community Mural at Dutch Floor Park. Artist V.A. Carisane will present a proposal for a self-funded community mural on privately owned fences that face Dutch Floor Park in Northwest Santa Rosa. The property owners have provided permission and the parks department has approved the location for temporary artwork with no obligation to maintain the artwork. Our committee's recommended action today is a proof of artwork design. I will now pass a torch over to Tara and to welcome our artist. Great. Thank you so much, Kristen. And I'll turn this over to the artist in just a moment. I just want to provide a little bit of context that the committee often receives items like this to approve when it's a project that's privately funded or sometimes has other sources of city funding but not through the public art program. Or when the project is on city property. And so in this case it's kind of a little bit of hybrid. The property itself are privately owned fences but the artwork imagery faces a city park. And so we reached out to the parks department. They've approved this location for a project and the artist has already obtained property owner permission from the fence owners. And so he's here today to just share what the project would be. He had a short proposal that was attached to this agenda which we can share to review today. So I'll turn it over to you, Fiji. So this fence and this park had issues with like vandalism and graffiti and I like frequently saw a lot of graffiti that's been had to be constantly painted over. And I think adding some kind of artwork to that fence would help prevent this vandalism and help with the maintenance of how the fence looks. And I also wanted to make my mural have like a positive message instead of just like something to be aesthetically pleasing. And I chose to make the mural about a message of unity within the city of Santa Rosa. Like the people, how they've all come together like different groups of people, different professions have all came together to help us with problems like all of the natural disasters and things that have been happening here. And I think that message is really strong and I think it would be a nice message to have in this park. And then in the design it shows alternating pictures of hands joined together to represent this unity and then between each of these pictures there's like a famous landmark in Santa Rosa to kind of convey that message of unity throughout the city. And then the general area of the fence is about eight feet by 112 feet. And it stretches across the fences of three houses in that area. I think that's all for the design. Great. Thank you, Vijay. Would you walk us through a little bit of your plan for how it would be painted, where you're getting the paint, any plans for maintenance and any other information you think would be helpful for the committee? For the paint I'm going to get it at a local Sherwin-Williams store. And they said that since it was a community project they would give paint for either a reduced price or for free. But in general the cost of the mural would be about two to three hundred dollars depending on if I would need to do a second coat. And for one coat it would be $40 per gallon and about three and a half gallons which would be about $150. And then for two coats it would be about 300. And then for maintenance I know an organization that I could get like a sealant that's made for murals that I could put on top of it. And that may be for free too, but I haven't thought about maintenance right now. So I've just been focusing on budget for just the paint and the brushes and rollers and other equipment for the actual painting of the mural. Okay thank you so much. If there's anything else you'd like to add please chime in and I'll turn it back over to the chair so she can facilitate any questions from the committee. Great. So for our committee's discussion first off we have questions then we will take public comment then we will have discussion and then voting. So order of operations. First off are there any questions for our artists VJ and Tara or our city of Santa Rosa staff? Tara or sorry Lisa. Yes hi. Hi VJ I have a couple questions for you. Is this a collaborative project or is it just you're behind this you had this idea and it's just you being the project manager on this this mural. That's one of my questions in my then my other question is I know I when I was looking at the location I can see it from like I think that's Whitechapel that one road but then there's another main road too that's larger. Can you see it from there because I know it is pretty it's in the back of the park. I think that parks a couple of acres and that's in the very back so I'm not sure if you can see it from there but I think since it's gonna it looks like you have really colorful colors that you're wanting to use so I'm assuming that you can and then also too I was wondering are if since you're getting some of this paint are you also looking for donations of paint to you from just from the public? For the people that are painting the mural it will I was planning on just doing it like a project on my own and then I might get help from people just for like priming the fences or like basic things like that but the majority of the actual painting is just I'm planning on it just being me and then for the paint donations I wasn't planning on like asking for public donations because since the Sheridan Williams said they would help get like free or reduced cost paint I was just planning on getting everything from there. Okay thank you oh and then also I'm sorry really quick I don't know if you're finished and I'm interrupting or not just I was wondering how well you would be able to see it from the other I think what was that the road because I know it's like if you drive down that white chapel you can really see that area it's very visible but I'm just wondering from the other streets and stuff but if it just because it looks like what you have there too it's just going to really brighten the area up and it just looks I think it's going to look really nice and it's going to be colorful invisible from definitely from white chapel I was just wondering about the other being road. I think it'll be visible from that road too because only like about a half of it is covered by some trees but most of it would be visible from both roads. Okay great thank you. I have a couple questions I wanted to understand your connection with this park had neighbors living here reached out to Artstart or the sorry I know you were a lead artist with the or a junior lead artist with the monarch project had anyone in the neighborhood reached out to the monarch project about this site or was this something that you had come up with? This was just my own project like not related to any of those organizations. That's fantastic I think that the idea of proposing a mural to beautify a fence where there had previously been vandalism is a very good use of space in a very I commend your design for being focused on unity. Thanks for proposing something that is so bright and to enhance this area so hopefully there won't be as much vandalism here. Thank you. Seeing no more questions from our committee I would like to ask if there are any public comments received for this item or anyone in our meeting wishing to give public comment? Chair Keifer there are no hands raised and there were no emails or voicemails related to this item. Great going back to our committee is there any further discussion that you would like to weigh in on before we move to a vote? Emotion should be on the table before discussion. Thanks. Is it too late for me to ask a question? I just pulled up the image. I'm looking at the image before the proposed mural. I'm just how many panels is it? I see this as a really long fence so I just wondered is there an endpoint to it or are you just painting into the very pushes or you know like how many panels VJ are there? I know you showed something but it's not up right now so I didn't know if this was an example of some or it was going to be bigger so you're proposing ending right in those two spots. Oh thanks that's helpful it's bigger than what I have here. There was about I think 12 panels. Okay okay and this is all older wood is that what it is? Is the fence pretty old? Yeah yeah I just wondered it seems like that makes it sort of porous. You know what I'm saying? Right so I'm taking more paint so I just didn't know if you had experienced painting on old porous wood. Do you have and I know there's lots of different kinds of surfaces to paint murals on. Are you familiar with painting on wood? I did a small mural in my own backyard to test how paint works on wood and I think it will be helpful because I found that when I paint on wood it takes less coats because the paint like holds like the wood holds the paint better and it dries faster. Right super yes right um the last question was um have any was there any interface with the neighbors about this or is just the parks has the has the jurisdiction just to okay it and obviously the person owns the fence but it's not a fence that faces their house so just was curious is there been any reach out to the neighborhood? Are they aware of this? Yeah before I sent this project to the parks department I made I got the help of my dad to create like permission slips that we wrote up and then gave to the three people who the fence who is property the fence takes up and they all locate it and like the idea. Fantastic like that is just very forward thinking excellent I just want I just was thinking about all the different kind of layers of this super good work. Thank you. I had one more question uh Vijay what do you expect is the timeline or how many days do you expect that it will take to paint this mural? I think it could be done by the end of the year because right now this month I have a lot of college classes so it'll be a little slower this month but in after like early December I'll my semester will be done so I'll have a lot of free time to like spend a lot of time each day on the mural in December so I think it could be quick during that time. Great all right seeing that we have already gone through step for public comment I would like to see if any committee member would like to if we could get a motion on the table so we can continue our discussion. Make a motion that we move forward with the project as proposed. I second sorry great the language in our agenda is approval of artwork design is that agreeable to your um to your motion Melanie? Yes okay mine too thank you second okay great thank you. Lonnie I would like to take a roll call vote. Board member Baumgartner? Hi. Board member Puentes? Hi. Vice Chair Jones Carter? Hi. Chair Kiefer? Hi. Okay so this passes with four i's. Thank you for your presentation Vijay we look forward to seeing your mural go up in the next few months. Thank you for the approval. Tara don't we have to discuss it and then go on to do yeah I it went very quickly from the motion to the vote if there was further discussion you you can always join in chime in yeah usually you make a motion and then add any comments or discussion. I'm good. I have one just one question is it is it can I ask a question now? Technically we've moved on to the next item now. Great thank you um we will now be moving on to item 5.2 program and project updates. Thanks Vijay. Bye Vijay. Okay great so for this item I'm going to turn it over to Jessica to give most of our updates. Just got a couple updates for everybody um with unum we broke ground um in courthouse square last monday on halloween um and we are on track to um fingers crossed have it finished by the end of the year so um if all goes accordingly and where once we get the dedication ceremony in order we'll be sending out that information to the appc um we've got arts around is still kind of um we're still plugging away at arts around we're waiting for the artist contracts to be approved and as soon as there's any new steps with any of those projects we will keep appc members posted. For our rotating art exhibits we've still got two up at at the finley community center and the person senior wing those are up through the end of the month at the finley center we've got the artist workshop of sonoma county and at the person senior wing we have the california native creations by the pomo project um I'm also working with the national arts program to do a couple of special awards because this year we're going to be celebrating our 20th anniversary and that's the coming up show at the finley center for our city wide art audit tara and I have now met with all of the task forces individually so our next step is that we're taking all of your really fantastic suggestions and we're going to relaying them to our gis team so we're starting to work on editing that online form and we'll get back to you all with that and that's all I've got for project updates um tara should I do uh some of the department updates not till we get to that item so okay hold off on those thank you so much jessica sure we can answer any questions though on those updates now before we move on if there are any I do have a question so um the dedication for the unum project um how far out should we start how long ago should we have started working on this that's a tricky uh balance because we do while we do want to plan ahead for it we don't want to plan it and have the project take longer than anticipated so um I will say that the artist is planning to leave town mid december so if it's looking like the project is going to run past the 10th of december then we're we're going to push the dedication ceremony into January so I guess I didn't really answer your question um I think once we have a firm uh finish line in view then we will then we'll have a date for the dedication ceremony yeah yeah I think um after next week I think we should have a better sense of that given there are certain milestones we should be reaching with the foundation construction and so if we're meeting all of those milestones then I think we'll have a better idea that we'll be able to meet the rest of the project timeline and um so hopefully expect an email from us maybe by mid week next week and we can try to get working on planning and we do have a budget right we do have a budget yes okay yeah thank you and I don't know I'm I know this wasn't planned or anything but we do have some photos we could share of the installation site would that be exciting to anybody to see though photos are always good right okay hold on the fence the fence was exciting yeah I know well yeah just seeing the fence you're like working I know yeah okay well hold on one second let me get these open really quick and then I'll share my screen is is the sculpture finished the sculpture is fabricated um and will be brought in I think in two pieces but the site work that is being done now is all for the foundation work right and um this sculpture will be sitting on a four inch raised platform or pedestal to make it ADA compliant and so the the images you see here are the forms of the platforms for the footing so this is its placement within the square hmm it was a good idea for scale yeah okay and let me skip to the next day see the daily progress all of the pavers had to be taken out once they were marked because they'll have to be put back after their cut right to match the anyway there's been a lot of a lot of little details to work out and then they're being very careful about protecting the rest of the pavers on site as they're digging and removing soil and this is part of the artist's team or is this the city center as a workers it's a combination um the the work that's been done most of the work that's been done so far is the the um the artist fabrication and installer team it's a company out of San Francisco called gizmo that the artist contract contract contract with um however our city construction crews have been and electricians have been assisting with getting electrical to the site and with removing pavers um and they will also be doing the concrete pour uh okay okay let's see let me show you just a few more that look a little bit more impressive I think the rebar ones are impressive oh wow so the concrete pour is going down a couple feet into the ground okay here's the rebar yeah wow very nice they didn't realize how deep it had to start at yeah for a sculpture that's what 15 feet by 12 feet um but also you know is a unduly you know that doesn't move but it's a natural form um that creates an archway that you walk under everything has to be very structurally sound and all their plans have been reviewed and approved by structural engineer and approved by the city um and how deep is that they said four feet or is that what you oh I said a couple feet that okay couple feet it'll be raised up above the pavers by four inches okay that's right you did yeah but yeah the the the rebar and the support has to be underground quite a bit well the team leader said that it's that but it's like really overbuilt essentially so that's that's reassuring because the weight of the actual sculpture is light since it's right you know panels and all oh thank you thanks for the construction photos yeah those are great those are exciting but I totally love seeing them I had a question regarding the online public art mapping um so you had mentioned that you had met with all sub subcommittees and are moving forward with the city's GIS team yeah we have a full page of notes from all of the committees to make adjustments to the to the form great uh when you met with GIS were you um met with some of them being or sorry were these items agreeable to GIS or did they have any questions or concerns about how to implement some of this or I just wonder about our input we have yet to see how it will be received we've just compiled everything so our next step is to meet with them great but I'm sure they'll be amenable to all of our suggestions and we will be presenting once we have a a new final draft of the way that the website will work and the way that information will be collected and displayed we will be presenting it to the committee the full committee so um you won't you know you won't it won't be a surprise when it is finished you'll know that we're getting ready to put it out there it'll be presented back to the group and then for my clarification um will this be a sub page under the art and public places website on the city or will it be a link to or um the out there page the audit form itself the submission form will live on the city of santa rosa's website in our art section the public art pages but we will have a link to that page on out there santa rosa great thanks for the clarification great were there any other questions or comments from our committee on our project updates being none i would like to move to item six committee reports item 6.1 is our ad hawk task course reports and discussions would anyone like to make a uh or i'll just go down the list uh is there an update from the diversity equity inclusion and access task force yeah anna and i don't have an update we did have the workshop that we did and we were getting we had a really good discussion and i i feel that from that discussion it definitely can it is going to help us and create um a path to um to which way we would like to just go and how we would like it basically it told us what is important and um and it really made me think that for me i i need to rethink a lot of things that um i was originally um had these ideas and stuff and um it actually was it was really good so it's going to give i think our little section definitely um some better uh some better ground to play to just to you know some just everyone am i trying to say here it's just i'm not making too much sense but it's going to give us i think a lot better um ideas and some just some con to some ground that we're gonna um which way we're gonna go and what we'd like to do and um definitely hearing from the artists and what they had to say and their number one priorities and um their number one issues that they had on presenting their art um was it's very important and how we structure um the way we want to move forward i'll just dive in and say i was not at that meeting but i watched the entire thing on the video which was really great i was really impressed with you all um i mean i am always impressed with you all but the way the way you just engage and really listened and then just what came out of it naturally that you allowed to come out the discussion which was just some real you know self reflective thought and you know reflecting on behalf of the institution of the city and yeah there was some exciting sort of ahas i think i just kind of got to be a fly on the wall because i wasn't in the room but um yeah it was great to our especially your closing comments were super helpful and i hope that there's more discussion so i know it sounds vague if you weren't on that call people listening but um it's great i agree great thank you guys for that recap uh community engagement melanie um we heard you talk a little bit about the preparation for the dedication ceremony for unum um yeah we i mean we haven't really talked anymore about it that after our first little one with the mural it just made me think that you know we really need to get ahead of the game a little bit with our game plan about what we want to do and um i was actually on one of the mayor's calls and all the other board chairs were there and i reminded them that they were all invited nobody came and they said don't stop though they said keep keep inviting us and we'll try and get there so um anyway um it just you know we need to really make sure we get the community involved in this in a number of ways so that um we get a good response and people know about what we're doing um and then jeff and i had a call with um kevin i think that yeah um with our committee and uh that went really well as uh probably yours did too or others did um which kind of keeps us a little centered and we're going to do a few more but yeah i felt good great and i'll remember to keep the dedication ceremony in the talking points for the next uh mayor's boards and committee meeting next we have project development um our committee has not or our task force has not met recently um but we've uh last time we met we enjoyed talking with tara and uh jessica about the art audit um map on the website so found that to be a very fruitful conversation and i'm looking forward to um how we can kind of learn or glean some ideas from that map about um to better educate or describe our our city's inventory of public art as we go forward and think about project development so that's been a great talking point all right moving on to seven department reports this is time reserved for city staff to provide a briefing on issues of interest no action will be taken on these matters except to possibly place on a particular agenda or sorry item for a future agenda for for consideration thanks christin um jessica i think you just had the one this time and um i don't have any others and risa if you want to join in you're welcome to add anything as well okay so um tara and i wanted to let you know that the staff is working with the economic development department um to incorporate a free art component into an upcoming small business facade improvement program so um small businesses will be able to uh add add some sort of art component to their facade improvement if they would like and we are contracting with both art start and rough edge collective which is nj and joshua to to manage those individual sites and projects so it's not quite in the works yet but it's just at the beginning and it's pretty exciting yeah thanks jessica i don't think we have anything else to add um that's separate from that i'll just add to that item that um um the you know the purpose the purpose of the program is to support small businesses in santa rosa who have been affected by covid um and the funding is coming from the america rescue plan act funds that the city received um a small amount of those funds and so the program will include a grant component where businesses can apply um for a grant to help them do or pay for um facade improvements such as painting lighting signage awning things like that and then there's also an opportunity for a site to request a public art installation most most likely a mural maybe some other type like a mosaic um would be a better fit and then we will pair that business with either art start or the mural project to do a public art project on that on that site um and so we're working really closely with mj and joshua to identify possible locations that that would be good opportunity sites for murals or other public art the other component of them of the program is to support the build out of permanent parklets so downtown especially had many temporary parklets during the covid um kind of shut down timeframe um but now the city has a permanent mural a permanent parklet program and so the funds um can also be um given out in grants to businesses who need help doing a permanent parklet um and art can be a part of those projects as well so having the public art program partner with this program really really helps i think get more art out there it's great for place making and it really helps um with hiring local artists as well so um the program and we'll have more information on when that um is going to be completely up and running what's um in my music note what's your dollar amount or how does do you know yet um for like the amount of the grant yeah yeah so um right now it is it's proposed to not have necessarily a cap um but to be uh kind of appropriate for the size of the business and their need and appropriate for the size of the project they want to do and so it'll be kind what what we'll say is that most grants will range in the like 75 percent of your total project cost range um but we're not but there will be a certain selection criteria that will determine um how much they that they will be able to be eligible for and is the art and public places committee reviewing the art that or no no these are not considered permanent projects um and they i mean the the murals are on private property they are technically city funded but they're grant funded well it's it's a separate source of funding it's not public art funding i think the way that we would propose handling it is having um all of the art projects be shown to the committee so you're aware of what's being done but i don't believe we'll be setting up approval processes for all of them and i just want to jump in and clarify that the art component will be free to the business owners but the facade improvements um we are not art and public places is not involved in any of that is that what i'm understanding okay unless it's art right okay yeah and even in that case i mean the art projects in don't that the the type of art projects and the type of funding that they're receiving technically don't trigger the the requirement for the committee to approve them is so it's really more a matter of us making sure you know what what we're doing it is a part of what we're spending our time on it's a part of the public art programs efforts so we want you to be in the loop about it and to share the projects that will be happening Tara i have a question about this scope um and what time in a project do you see them applying for this type of improvement grant um well we're structuring it so that it will be retroactive back to july 2022 so the if a if a business has already done a project since july 2022 then they would be eligible to submit that project to receive reimbursement for essentially um and that the time frame we're proposing for grants moving forward there's we're looking at the two phases phase one would be potentially starting as soon as we can get the applications up and running um through i think we said july of 2023 and then to have is that is that right right so i don't have my notes in front of me if you remember something else please chime in um and then to have phase two be after that but there is a time limit on when the funds have to be um uh kind of allocated to a project and when they have to be fully spent to meet the federal guidelines so there are certain um requirements for that that we have to adhere to i just thought of something at one point we talked about doing something you know downtown like coordinating benches trash cans but kind of stuff is that kind of this stuff that will be going on as well with this with this funding or it's not not to know up to the owners okay i mean i think what what what falls with within the definition of facade improvements really is is restricted to the business front itself so it's paint signage it can be landscaping exterior lighting security system awnings and canopies windows doors um parklet buildouts obviously um so not necessarily adjacent street furniture but um but i think that like like if it's a parklet then that is somewhat related so i think that there is an opportunity to to look at how that all fits together i have a question too it tara is this just for um downtown or is this all of san rosa that this is all of san rosa is an opportunity so um phase one is um so there's there's phase one and phase two which are slightly different areas of san rosa but but both areas were identified through looking at our um qualified census tracked areas our opportunity zones and um our equity priority areas so we kind of took an overlay over that and then also looked at commercial corridors and then identified these areas so essentially it's in roseland it's a sabastopol road um sorry yeah sabastopol road corridor um it's san rosa avenue and petaluma hill road corridor commercial corridors and then downtown including railroad square commercial areas those are all phase one and then phase two expands certain areas and also includes a um section up in north uh west san rosa so like piner road industrial um those types of areas so um i i would be happy to bring back a map and more information on it at a future meeting um with more details we just wanted to make sure we mentioned this during um department reports so that uh it was um on your radar yeah definitely and then another question i had on this too sorry and um was so when we have phase one and then phase two comes is just just phase two so let's say phase one takes a um advantage of if most not all of the funds and is there a certain portion that's set aside just for phase two or um how does the funds work when it right yeah right now we're just looking at phase two if there's funding available okay good to know thank you um my question was just um curiosity about we have you have the artist um mj and joshua the rough edge and then the um art start is there any targeted um crafts not crafts um fabricator type people to do the other kind of stuff are they are they helping out other local businesses to do the other kinds of services they would supply for these businesses that want to improve you know what i'm saying um most so i i think so so like a business who needs a new awning would we be sourcing a sign company or you know creative carpentry or like that people needed some sort of i just wondered if we've targeted any other kinds of experiences besides paint to offer um for people for the art project component of it no we focused on um those two organizations and and our our the services that they would be providing are essentially their project managers for the art project and they source and pay the artist through their contracts with us so um so so that's how that component of it works if a business is wanting a grant to do improvements on their their storefront on the facade itself um we are happy to be a resource to make sure they're getting connected to the types of services or providers that they need for their project um some of the businesses we surveyed in in planning this project have indicated that they already you know they don't need assistance in that area but some may need assistance in that area so it's hard we want to be as flexible as possible and make sure we're providing what is most helpful for yeah that's what i meant i was just more like kind of more an array and also just thinking about keeping the quality at a good place if people want to do creative things yeah i love it i'm just curious thanks tara i would love to see a map um with the area um the phase one would be um applicable for uh if there will be a webpage associated with this uh grant i would also love for our committee to be included on that um yeah there is already so what i'll do is i'll send um when jessica sends out which is awesome that she does this the updates on things that we've um shared today uh we'll include a link to that website so you can take a look and there is a link to the map on that website great thank you wonderful well thank you jessica and tara for going over committee first committee reports sorry department reports for us today uh we have future agenda items as an item on our agenda are there any members who would like to suggest an item be placed on a future agenda seeing none um i would like to keep this conversation going so feel free to um reach out between meetings and we can see about expanding our conversation um but until then our next regular scheduled meeting of art and public places committee is monday december 2022 uh thank you everyone for participating today and um have a great afternoon wait hope what date december fifth okay thank you thank you thank you everyone and just also keep an eye out for emails from kimson creative nico at am or most likely kevin on scheduling the next workshops um they will be special meetings held in november and december thank you we say uh thank you to eileen she probably won't be here next time thank you thank you eileen thanks thank you all and have happy holidays and a good new year you'll be missed thank you bye bye okay and thank you lani and um yep we appreciate you too yeah yeah thank you guys all right bye bye bye everyone


So, we are all very excited that we won this award recognizing the impact the project had on teaching and learning at the Open University. The last four years we've been working closely with teachers and other academic staff at the university to use predictive analytics the best possible way to support our students and it seems that with this award today they recognize the value of the project and the contribution we made. The award legitimizes the tool and will enable us to gain more acceptance amongst the tutor community. For the last five years we've been really focusing on how the predictive analytics can help the teachers and we still want to go further with this work but we really want to focus on getting even closer to students so we would later like to deliver the analytics directly to the students in the next years.