the afternoon session with Christian Ast from Stuttgart. And he will talk about superconducting quantum interference at the atomic scale. Okay, can you hear me? Yes, thank you. So, can I? Please point more towards there. I think it's got some connection problem. And the receiver is down there. Not really. I can, I'll just stay here. Okay, sorry about that. No, no, no, right. Okay, let me see. All right, so, yes, thank you for the introduction and also thank you to the organizers for the kind invitation to present our research here today. Yes, so I want to talk about superconducting quantum interference at the atomic scale which we investigate using scanning tunneling microscopy. So in a way this technique is quite a bit different from what we have heard in this workshop so far. But there's also very distinct similarities because in the end an STM is no more than a tunnel junction. Okay, before I start I want to acknowledge the people who are involved. This is my work in the department of Klaus Kern at the MPI for Solar States Research which always makes my daughter giggle because she's wondering what kind of research you can do with solids. But there are sort of things we can do, I guess. Then most of the work that I present has been done by Sujoy and Haonan and some of the work also by Piotr. And then I want to also acknowledge the invaluable theory support that we have received over the past years, most notably the group from Ulm, Joachim, Björn, and Ciprian who really have helped us understand everything a lot better than we could have hoped for. And also Carlos and Alfredo from Madrid. We've heard Alfredo before. And then also Anika who helped us out of a tight spot with the last paper. Those are the contributors to the research that I present today. Okay, so we have interference in the title and interference needs coherence and this is typically a problem in STM because the STM operates in the dynamical Coulomb blockade regime which implies sequential tunneling and makes coherence a little bit more difficult. So we have to account for phase fluctuations in the tunnel junction. However, these phase fluctuations are typically on a much longer time scale than individual tunneling events so that basically if we are happy with a short coherence time, then everything will work out. And this is basically what I want to show you in the following. So one example to also connect to the microwave theme of the workshop, we have started also using microwaves and shining them in our tunnel junction. These are some of the first experiments. We have here a reference junction. This is taken with a vanadium tip and a vanadium sample. So both are superconducting at 300 millikelvin. You see the coherence peaks here. This is our reference junction. Now if we turn on microwaves at 75 gigahertz, shine them into the junction at a very small amplitude, we see a slight reduction of the main peak and we see replica showing up. And if we increase the amplitude now, we see replica and the modulation of the intensity quite a bit. And if you put this on a more continuous scale, you actually see a nice fan of these two coherence peaks here from the bias voltage as a function of the microwave amplitude. You see the coherence peaks here and here as they fan out. And now you see the modulation of these peaks here and these are actually indications of coherent interference of the tunneling electrons with the microwaves. So there is some coherence in the tunneling event or in the tunnel junction. And then the superposition of the peaks here in the back show at higher frequencies, higher amplitudes shows an incoherent superposition of tunneling events so that we can basically say we have coherent behavior within one tunneling event and incoherent superposition between tunneling events. So okay, I don't think I have to motivate coherence and the importance of coherence in this audience really. So there have been, we're all looking for coherence in one way or another. And now we are also looking for coherent behavior in the STM and there's basically two topics for the shortness of time. I can only cover one of these topics maybe in the end if there's still time I can talk about this. What we've done two years ago here, this has been published in Nature Physics two years ago is we were able to actually show demonstrate tunneling between two individual quasi-particle energy levels namely Yushy Baruzinov states inside a super-connecting gap and by changing the tunnel coupling between these two, between the tip and the sample we were able to see some emergent coherent coupling in the quasi-particle tunneling. So what I do want to talk about in the following is the question if we can realize some at least some rudimentary phase sensitivity in the STM such that we would be able to detect for example a pi junction. Similar to what we have in a superconducting squid as you see here where we have the junction of interest with a quantum dot and the reference junction and then we can get the interference between the phase by basically superimposing the phases of the two junctions. And I will show you in the following that we can at least to some extent move that concept to the STM tunnel junction and at least detect a sign change in the phase. Okay, to do that let me start at the beginning. We operate a milli-Calvin STM in Stuttgart in a precision lab. This is essentially a low noise or noise-free environment. You see the dilution refrigerator here which operates at the base temperature of 10 milli-Calvin. The STM sits about here. It's a scan head that's just the size of my fist. We have a prep chamber down here and the periphery of the dilfridge. Then we have a huge concrete slab that weighs about 100 tons to decouple vibrationally from the environment so that we can have really very low noise environment for the STM. And the theme in my group is basically to look for new quantum limits and one of the inherent quantum limits in the STM is to have atomic resolution and this is probably one of the defining differences compared to other tunnel junctions. Here you see an aluminum surface which has nothing to do with the rest of the talk. It just looks nice. You see atoms, the aluminum atoms in Lysli's arrangement of square letters and some defects, some of them are oxygen, some of them are carbon, and some of them are subsurface and you see these standing waves emanating to the surface. And then as we lower the temperature, we get all kinds of quantization effects. We get charge quantization. We were able to see this in the dynamic coulomb blockade. To do this, we have actually pulled one aluminum atom out of the surface and placed it onto the surface so that we can create a tunnel junction between two aluminum atoms which actually turn out to feature just one transport channel and the other transport channels are at least an order of magnitude smaller in transmission so that we were able to demonstrate these charge quantization effects here and also single channel transport through a Josephson junction. And this connects very nicely to, for example, the work that has been done in Sakhle and other places. So from this point of view, the STM is just another tunnel junction. Okay, so how do we create a pi junction? Let's start out with a quantum dot. We have a quantum dot that is connected to superconducting leads here and now if we place a single spin onto a quantum dot, then, well, the short version is we exchange the formionic operators across the junction and then we create a sign change which leads to a supercurrent reversal. So in the STM, we basically have a very asymmetric quantum dot, if you will, because we place a magnetic impurity on the tip or on the sample and this is usually strongly coupled to one side and then we have the tunnel junction here on the other side. And now if we place a magnetic impurity onto a superconducting substrate, we induce a so-called Ushiba-Ruzinov state and this is basically what we want to work with. So what happens now? We have a clean superconductor. The density of states features a BCS gap. We have a vanadium substrate, for example, and we see coherence peaks. Now we place our magnetic impurity on top. The magnetic impurity has some exchange coupling with the substrate and this induces a so-called Ushiba-Ruzinov state inside the gap. So the Ushiba-Ruzinov state is a bogeyube of quasi-particle which is a superposition of electrons and holes and if you plot that in the density of states, you project this bogeyube of quasi-particle onto the electrons and holes and this is why you always see two peaks at plus minus the energy inside the gap here. And what I would also like to point out is that the coherence peaks are actually suppressed. So this will become later on important just as a comment now that you see this here. Okay, so what happens now? We can actually change the exchange coupling. So from the magnetic impurity to the substrate and if we start with a weak coupling, the Ushiba state moves from the gap edge towards zero, both peaks move towards zero and in the weak coupling regime, the impurity spin is free. So that total spin of the system is the impurity spin in this case of spin one-half and the superconductor has a spin zero so we have a total spin of one-half. Now across zero here, we have a quantum phase transition. The ground state changes. You can think of it as a Cooper pair breaking and then occupying the Shiba state so that in the ground state, the Shiba state is now occupied and in the excited state, it's empty. But in the ground state now, the Cooper pair, the Boko-Ljubov-Quasi particle that occupies the Shiba state now screens the spin such that the total spin of the system becomes zero. So and yeah, now we want to investigate that with STM. So it's a local technique. We have a local perturbation. So it's an ideal technique to show that. There's a lot of work has been done starting in 1997 with Ali Astani for example and then continue on later on. Katarina Franke has done a lot of nice work on that and in the past few years, more and more people got interested in this work and so did we. So and our favorite superconductor to do this is actually vanadium. You see this here. We have a vanadium one zero zero surface with nice square terraces. When you see that the surface is not so nice and clean. We, for example, as in the aluminum surface, if you zoom in, you see an oxygen reconstruction. This is part of the preparation process. This is very difficult to get vanadium clean. However, we can turn this nuisance into a virtue because it turns out that a few of these defects actually feature a very nice Shiba state because they have a free spin. And the nice thing about these Shiba states compared to I would say 95% of all other Shiba states that have been prepared so far is that they actually feature a single Shiba state inside the gap that you can see here. And they are, for all we know, very nice spin one and a half impurities. So which makes the theory behind it a lot easier to calculate. So blue is the data, red is a fit and the Shiba state is shown here nice and sharp. And what you see here is also a coherence peak. Now remembering from before that the spectrum on the Shiba state does not feature a coherence peak, we conclude that we have here actually at least two transport channels, one going through the Shiba state and one going through an empty BCS gap, which is a straightforward conclusion because the spectral features are so decidedly different. Okay, so we keep that in mind for later. Just to characterize the Shiba state a little bit more or this impurity, we have turned on the magnetic field here for example, this is not a linear scale here on the Y axis, we have the bias voltage on the X axis and the DIDV signal on the, as the color scale here, this is the coherence peak here and here and then we have the Shiba state and as we turn on the magnetic field and increase the field, the gap closes and eventually quenches and then we see a very nice condo feature here which as we increase the field further splits up into two peaks and this is already a nice indication that we have a spin one half impurity because the two peaks, if you extend that to zero they cross at the finite magnetic field which also indicates the condo temperature of about one Kelvin in this case. Okay, another advantage of these vanadium impurities is that they are extremely flexible because they depend very much on the local environment, some other defects or structural defects in the vicinity so that we find them actually throughout the energy gap here. This is a histogram of Shiba states that we found on the sample and also on the tip, it turns out that the PhD student Haunan, who did these measurements initially he found that by dipping the tip into the sample he can pick up or modify the tip such that we get a Shiba state in the tip apex and he can do it so reproducibly and flexibly that he wrote a code where he can say I want a Shiba state at that energy so that the algorithm goes and dips the tip until we get a Shiba state at this certain energy and then this takes about 10 to 100 minutes and then we're done and we have a Shiba state at the tip. So now the trick is now to demonstrate a pi junction or even a zero pi transition is that we want to get these measurements with exactly the same tunnel junction to verify that nothing else changes. So now the capabilities of changing the parameters in the STM are quite a bit more limited than in other tunnel junctions because we cannot just slap on a gate voltage somewhere or and tune the parameters this way because it's simply too small. So there's other tricks that we have to do and it turns out that there is a nice trick that we can do here in the tunnel junction. So we have here basically our quantum dot we have the impurity here and we have the bath on this side on the tunnel junction on the other side and so what happens now is if you think about this in terms of the end of the impurity model we have an impurity substrate coupling gamma here and because the distance between the impurity and the substrate is just a couple of angstroms there are atomic forces pulling, attractive atomic forces pulling the impurity away from the tip. So if we now move the tip closer which we can do very easily we change the atomic forces between the impurity and the substrate such that we pull more and more on the tip impurity by moving the tip closer such that we change the impurity substrate coupling as we move the tip closer. So this is our way of changing the coupling. So this has been done, there's a number of publications that came out in the also from us in the past few years. So this is actually quite a general effect and we all studied not just on Shiba states but in tunnel junctions in general. So and now the trick is now to find an impurity that moves across the quantum phase transition while we are changing the tip sample distance and we have to be able to measure the Josephson effect at the same time. So and luckily we found several such impurities and what you see here is the collection of spectra where we have the bias voltage on the X axis and the conductance which is the tip sample distance on the Y axis and what you see here is the Shiba state here changing energy on the left and the right and moving through a quantum phase transition here. The Josephson effect in the center you cannot see because it's small. Yeah, we'll zoom into that region later. So now you see that the Shiba state moves and has a minimum here basically closest to zero and moves away. So it does not cross zero because we have a superconducting tip and a superconducting sample so that the zero point is actually offset by the delta of the sample. Okay, so now let's look at the Josephson effect. This is what the Josephson effect looks like in our STM. So we have dynamic aculin blockade and we can actually describe this very nicely with the P of E theory. The spectrum looks slightly noisy because we are very far away. So the current is also not very strong here. We have just a few hundred femto amps here but now we move closer. Yeah, you see the conductance on the X axis and the spectrum from last slide is actually this spectrum and then we move closer and we increase in amplitude and you see a strange behavior already here across the quantum phase transition. The Josephson effect does not increase monotonically but it actually even decreases a little bit. So we have to look at this a little bit closer by plotting the current maximum that you see here as a function of conductance. In the dynamic aculin blockade regime, the whole spectrum is basically proportional to the square of the Josephson energy. So we can just take the maximum and plot that as a function of conductance. This is shown here in the blue trace here and you see far away from the quantum phase transition here, we see a square dependence on the conductance here and here and something happens across the quantum phase transition. The quantum phase transition is here. You see red is the position of the Schiba state. It has a minimum at the quantum phase transition and then we move across here. So we can rearrange this a little bit. We take the square root to get rid of the square dependence and then we divide by the conductance and we get something that is reminiscent of the ICRN product. This basically results in a step. So we have a maximum here and we move across the quantum phase transition and we have a small value here. So I can tell you already here that this is due to a zero junction on the left side which leads to a constructive interference between transport channels and a pi junction on the right side which leads to a destructive interference. And the slope here actually just depends on the temperature of the system which in this case in the fit turns out to be 75 millikelvin. Okay, how does this work? The STM, the sensitivity in the STM. As I've indicated before, we actually have more than one transport channel, one that goes through the Schiba state and another one that goes through the BCS channel with no Schiba state. This can be realized for example by having one orbital that has a free spin and another degenerate orbital they overlap and then we get, for example, two transport channels. Yeah, and they interfere now. If we plot the energy phase relation here in the tunneling regime, so there's not much amplitude here. We have the energy phase relation of a BCS junction and the Schiba junction here close to the quantum phase transition. If we zoom in here, we get an in phase situation on one side of the quantum phase transition and then the sum of the channels gives a larger amplitude. Now the Schiba side moves across the quantum phase transition and this means that the lower branch moves above zero and the upper branch moves below zero and this corresponds to a sign change in the energy phase relation here that you can see here and now the sum actually becomes a difference and the amplitude of the energy, the total energy phase relation is different. Now in the STM, we are not really sensitive to the sign because we measure the square of the Josephson energy but we're still sensitive to the magnitude and this is what we are actually measuring. To be a bit more quantitative, we have the current voltage characteristics in the dynamic equilibrium blockade regime which involves the P of E function here which gives the characteristic shape of the spectrum that we see and everything is proportional to the Josephson energy here to lowest order and the connection to the energy phase relation is simply a Fourier transform of the energy phase relation and to lowest order we get the cosine dependence and so E1 is basically the amplitude of the energy phase relation here and this is in the end what we are measuring. Yeah, okay, so and we have to still consider temperature so that we have a probability of having the Sheba set in the ground state or thermally excited, P is the probability to be thermally excited now and this leads to the situation where we have a constructive interference and destructive interference here and this is what gives the finite slope across the quantum phase transition and this is what you see here. The red line is a fit to the model that I just presented to you and this gives us a zero junction on the left side and the pi junction on the right side. Okay, and as I indicated before, the slope is given by the temperature. So now the zero junction would be the screen spin regime and the pi junction would be the free spin regime where we have the spin in the junction. The question now is do we have an independent means to verify that we have made the correct assignment and here we go back to the Kondo effect when we turn on the magnetic field and here we plot the full width or the half width at half maximum of the Kondo peak that we have measured with exactly the same junction in the magnetic field and you see that the coupling, so the width of the Kondo peak continuously decreases as we increase the conductance. This means that the Kondo temperature decreases and with a decreasing Kondo temperature we have a decreasing exchange coupling and the decreasing exchange coupling means that we are moving from a zero junction to a pi junction from the screen spin to the free spin regime and this basically verifies our assignment. And okay and with this we have demonstrated the super current reversal in Yushiba-Rusinov junction which is where we have exploited the interference between two transport channels very reminiscent of a squid except that now we have a squid with zero enclosed area because the two transport channels are basically in the same atom or in so closely located that we will not be able to pass any flux through it but still we can detect a sign change in this. Okay, how much time do I have left? Okay, I don't know. I wanted to, I can show you just very briefly the tunnel junction, the Shiba-Shiba tunneling. When we do this with, we can do tunneling through individual quasi-particle levels by taking a Shiba set in the tip and the Shiba set in the sample. So very briefly we have, this is an empty junction with coherence peaks. We move over a Shiba state. We get the Shiba peak here and here. We place a Shiba state on the tip. We get a Shiba state. Now we take that exact Shiba state and move it over the previous impurity and we get an entirely new feature inside the gap here. You see this here, that this is an entirely new spectral feature which is related to tunneling between two individual quasi-particle levels. And this is basically the smallest tunnel junction that you can possibly create because if you take any of these components away, the tunneling current is gone. This is you see here. Anything is missing then the feature is gone. It is easier to see this feature actually as a current because then it's a peak. And if you zoom in, you see a nice peak and this is actually a direct measurement of the POV function because the intrinsic energy levels are roughly 100th of the width of the POV function. So we're basically mapping out the POV function and you see that we have zero current before and zero current after this. And so we basically demonstrate tunneling between two individual quasi-particle levels. So what we can do with this, just very briefly, we can measure this as a function of conductance. So tunnel coupling and we can plot the area of this peak. This is a very unique situation that we can actually have access to the area and this moves from linear regime to a sublinear regime. And this is basically, the sublinear regime is an indication of coherent coupling and the transition point here, linear sublinear indicates can actually be used to infer the lifetime of the Shiba state of about 48 nanoseconds. Now, in some ways this is a large number, in some ways this is a small number, we have done no optimization of the superconductor. So we are basically limited probably through quasi-particle interactions. But this actually shows that this tunneling is actually extremely efficient and allows us to go to the probably the largest tunneling resistance that we have ever measured of 22 tera ohms. The set point is 0.18 femto amps and we can measure a peak of about 1.2 femto amps. Here this is the Shiba-Shiba tunneling one side, Shiba-Tiba tunneling on the other side. And this shows how extremely efficient this is because you're basically tunneling through two singularities. And with this I conclude, thank you for your attention. So thank you for your interesting talk, are there questions? So this picture you presented in the first slides applied for classical impurities, this quantum phase transition. While in your case, if I understood properly, you are dealing with the spin one-half, right? Yes. These observed signatures of quantum effects. What would you describe? What would be a quantum signature in your? I mean, somehow you translate the zero, the s equals zero to the condo case. But condo is not exactly the same thing because condo is a true one-half model with the... Yes, okay, so we... Quantum, but while the other is classical. We use basically the mean field theory to describe everything, yes, but it actually turns out that we do see signatures of residual condo coupling in the superconducting state, yeah? This is, we're quite certain of that. I don't have a spectrum here to show this, but it would be present here as well, but you would have to look at the current voltage characteristic. It's not visible in the differential conductance, yeah? So you have to know what to look for, but it's basically there, and this in the end means that the spin is not entirely screened, free in the free-spin regime. It's partially screened, but it's always fully screened in the screen-spin regime because then the condo effect basically takes over. But we haven't, I mean, the model works so well in this sense, but for what we are doing, it works nicely, but you're right, it can be refined to include the condo effect also in the superconducting state, yes. Okay, any other question? Yes, I was curious about the final peak in which you see the POC imprinting in the IV curve. So there is a slight asymmetry, is that the finite, it's the detailed balance? Is there anything here? No, no, no, in the Shiba, Shiba. Oh, Shiba, Shiba, yes. Yes, there is, if you look closely, there is a slight asymmetry, yes. So that's the detailed balance of your energy. Yes, that we attribute to this. Yeah, and what kind of environment do you have in order to have this? Okay, part of the environment is vacuum, yeah? Which, if you want to call it an environment, but the most dominant part is actually the tip in the junction acting as an antenna, yeah? Okay. And we see, it's not obvious in these, but I don't know if we can see this in the Josephson spectra here. No, I cut off too early. But if you move a little bit further out here, we actually see resonances from the antenna resonances, yeah? And we can move them by changing the length of the tip, by changing the length of the tip, yeah? So the tip is a lambda quarter, quarter lambda resonator or a quarter lambda antenna, like a monopole antenna. And we can model this very nicely, even quantitatively, yes. So that's probably the biggest contribution to the environmental impedance. Okay, we need to move on. Let's thank the speaker again.


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Welcome and thank you for joining the New America Fellows program for this discussion of Adam Harris is the state must provide why America's colleges have always been unequal and how to set them right. I'm Van Newkirk class of 2020 11th hour fellow and a senior editor at the Atlantic. Thank you to the education policy program for partner on this event. Before we start, we have a few housekeeping notes. If you have questions during the event, please submit them through our q amp a function at the bottom of your screen. And we'll save about 15 minutes at the end for q amp a and the event. And more importantly, copies of the state must provide this wonderful both are available for purchase through our book selling partner solid state books, you can find a link to buy the book on the event page. If you already have one that's great. If you don't have one please get one and if you already have one get another one for family members a great gift. And now for the person of the hour, Adam Harris 2021 national fellow is a staff writer at the Atlantic where he has covered education national politics, since 2018, three long years. He was previously a reporter at the Chronicle of Higher Education, where he covered federal education policy and historically black colleges and universities, Adam. Well, thanks so much. I must say before we begin, you have two HBCU grads talking about HBCUs about inequality and education, and about the development of America's higher education system, Adam. My first question for you is, as an HBCU graduate, what's it feel like to have written this book. You know, I, when I set out to write the book actually even before I have the idea of writing about HBCUs I just, they were sort of the family institutions right my mom went to an HBCU my dad went to an HBCU both my sisters went to HBCU and my uncles on to these are the places where these are places that educated my family. And so, you know, to write this book about, you know, the sector of institutions that not only for my family as you know for your family, how important these institutions have been for, for black people, and you know, kind of social socioeconomic mobility in the black community. And I'm talking about the ways that these institutions have historically been, you know, underfunded and discriminated against the while still doing such yeoman's work in an educating black students, particularly in this moment. I don't know it's it's indescribable. So I've been I've known you for years now, I've known how it's been really neat reading the book and seeing a lot of these individual stories that you've been talking about for years, become part of the book. I wonder if there were things that you thought you might like to write about or things that have been on your mind, since you were in school, what are the things that have motivated or inspired you since then. Yeah, you know, at the beginning of the book I write about my experience at an M, you know, having great professors having, you know, a nurturing community around me but also seeing some of other things you know older buildings, you know, our air conditioning you know heat never seemed to be working in the winter. The buses never seemed to be running when it was coldest out you know they were, they were sort of deferred maintenance on campus and all of these sort of different things that I saw and I would drive across town, you know, Alabama Anims in Huntsville, Alabama, and there's another institution other public institution. It's about 10 minutes away University of Alabama Huntsville and I remember going there noticing one their library was open three hours longer to they had newer buildings. And I learned later that they had an endowment that was larger than my own institutions, which, you know, had been open for 75 years longer than the University of Alabama Huntsville had even been an institution. And it was, it was, it was sort of jarring to me and then as I got into covering higher education I knew that I wanted to cover historically black colleges and universities because it felt like there was a story there that was that was being untold or or, you know, a picture of what was going on with the sector wasn't wasn't being told and, and so, as I covered you know federal education policy I really learned the ways that this wasn't, you know by happenstance that that my experience wasn't anomalous. I think that going to an M and going over to you a h and seeing the difference that that wasn't an anomaly but that that was the, you know, very direct result of, of state and federal policy over, you know, over more than a century. That experience of reporting on higher education. I mean, was that kind of validating for you did that help you explain parts of your own experience. You know, and I think what I first learned is over, over the time that an M in particular right and M is an 1890 institution so the 1890s are the institutions that are land grant universities the HBCUs that are land grant university. And for so long, I knew that an M was founded in 1875, but I was like, so what exactly was it about 1890 that was such a such a big deal. And the sort of the easy explanation for it is 1890 is when HBCUs would states received money to help fund HBCUs but as I started poking around and you know you look at an institution like Auburn, which is also a land grant university when you look at an M. There's, there's this vast disparity and resources, even though both of these are land grants. And what I learned was, you know, you go back even further to 1862 when Congress passes the first morale act and so they give states land expropriated land from Native Americans taken through lopsided treaties and murder and violence. And they gave this land to states that they could sell in order to fund an institution but those institutions of course could not be attended by black students and this is, yeah, think about this is the largest investment that the federal government ever made in America's colleges, and, and it was, it was a lopsided investment and so by 1890, you know, there's this acknowledgement that well, you these institutions aren't rolling black students. And, and so, in the second morale act when predominantly white institutions wanted more money. They went back to the government and the government said well, we will give you more money, but you have to at least create a separate institution for black students or at least endow a separate institution for black students. So, you know, not only did those predominantly white institutions have that pot to start with in 30 years to build on that pot, but then they also received additional money, money when when you know the land grant the black land grants were given additional funding. And really, it solidified this idea that that, again, this was not an anomaly that it really validated the idea that that the federal government and state governments have had a hand in not only creating this unequal system that we live with but but also as I reported in the court cases dug through, you know, old records, state audits, you really learned the ways that states and the federal government defended sustain and maintained the system over the last century. I think we do a really good job of in the book is showing how, like you said the roots of this of higher education in America, and this initial investment by the federal government came at a time when it, you know, most black people in the country could have been put to death, just for reading. And that's a really stark and Frank way to put that. It is it. What was your, you know, thinking behind how you portrayed this history. I know it's billed as a history of any quality of higher education but it also doubles as just a pretty good history of higher education. I think what I what I really wanted to do was not only explain the experience of just simply like black colleges but I also wanted to explain how black students were sort of isolated in higher education more generally and the ways that discrimination manifested itself in higher education so I'm not only saying that, you know, HBCUs were discriminated against all foreign states receiving fewer appropriations, but also looking at the ways that states broke apart integrated institution so I look at Berea college you know the first integrated co educational college in the south, and the way that their mission that original mission kind of built out of acts chapter two saying God have made the one blood, all the people of the earth. And the only way that that mission was broken apart was through state action, going back even further to say, to look at the ways that even sort of abolitionist minded scholars at different institutions were unwilling to support black education, looking at the ways that philanthropy also failed black education. And so, like you say, I think too often we think of HBCUs in this way that's like this is sort of a parochial offshoot of higher education as opposed to like an integral part of it and and you know the reason why this book I wanted to make sure this is more holistic and it felt like a more robust look at higher education discrimination higher education as it stands is because it's like, no it's, they are these institutions this sector of institution is doing work and educating a population that the the rest of higher education a lot of higher education does not you know. And I also I look at community colleges because the way that stratification works now is the institutions with the most resources, have the few black students, the institutions with the fewest resources have the most and that includes community colleges in the state like North Carolina, more than 70% of black students in North Carolina, go to the five HBCUs or the community colleges in the state, and so you know I really wanted a robust look at higher education inequality and higher So, as those of you who have read and those of you who will read will probably pick up. I think if I had to identify a single main character in the book. It's actually very college. It's the story of the institution. Why was that particular school and institution and history so important for this larger in there. When I first learned the story of Berea college. It struck me as fascinating because you know, Berea and its founder john fee, you know he actually shows up and some of the, some of the slave narratives in the 1930s when people are saying, you know, formerly enslaved people say that you had john fee this was a true believer this was an actual I was already sort of interested in his story. And the more I learned about the development of that institution and it's it's current iteration right, the fact that it has been tuition free since 1892. The fact that it is, you know, trying to get back to that place you know this was a place that where its founder was literally run out of town before the Civil War by enslavers. And he came back to form an institution integrated co educational institution that was effectively 5050, you know, half white students half black students, until the late 1800s, early 1900s when the state passed the day law which which was aimed at Berea college because it was the only integrated institution there. I've always been really interested in how they clawed back that original mission how, and it hinges in large part on the fact that they had that original mission of equity of equality in the in that in the middle of the century and so, you know, the rest of higher education isn't necessarily built on those same ideals. And so they're having to learn them anew. And so you can kind of look at a place like three and say, it's possible, you know, the, what you're trying to more broadly moved if you're trying to more broadly move towards equity and equality higher education it's actually possible. You have to have that that sort of rooting mission, and I hoped to sort of take that mission throughout the full book. One thing you make really clear is just how, frankly, rare that kind of rooting mission has been in higher education. I think it stands out that very college up until I mean, maybe ever still is one of the few institutions founded on equal education on providing education to people all races at the same time in the same place. And it's one of the few that was not necessarily dragged kicking and screaming into the era of integration or in the case of lots of schools not really drag at all. And it made that kind of why was that mission so rare. Why was it something that we didn't see pop up in more places or at least that it wasn't allowed to flourish in other places.  And then you know as you as southern states start to rejoin the Union you have places like the University of Mississippi that where the professors say they would actually rather reside than to educate a single black student on their campus. And so you use you have that that sort of thread running through running through really the middle of the 19 or the 20th century, until it sort of enters the federal lexicon that you cannot discriminate against students based on based on race and then these institutions are saying, Oh, you know, you have to start looking at our student population with 1% black students 2% black students. And, and, you know, only when that federal policy start to change did institutions start to, you know, really kind of get their act together. But even even in that reality, right institutions sort of remain as segregated as conditions allow so, for instance, a place like Auburn University, which has known, you know, at least since the middle of the 1980s that it has had issues with its enrollment of black students right on the same day that Bo Jackson is named the highest is the best college football player in the country. There, the federal judge says that Auburn is the most segregated institution in the state of Alabama they had about, you know, two or 3% black students at that time, you fast forward to 2002, they have about four or 5% black students but now today they have fewer black students than they did in total number than they did in 2002. And, and so it's like this sort of complacency that states have gotten to, where they just assume that the federal government is not going to investigate these sort of vestiges of discrimination that continues to imbue these systems and, and, you know, the fact that Berea had that original mission and that most institutions did not actually plays a pretty significant role in in the reality that those institutions have today. Another thing I think the state must provide does better than any book I've written a long time is it shows the absolute levels of absurdity and contortion that white institutions had to go through to maintain Jim Crow law. And I think a lot of people as you learn it. It's, it's, you know, you think about water fountains and you think about separate interests is which themselves are absurd levels of dedication to the to the to the form but when you're reading the story of George McLauren and, and you're reading people in classes where they're building literal rails between the students, then it really becomes you see this level of almost I don't want to say comedic because it's not very funny but absurd dedication to preserving this thing. Why were they fighting is hard to preserve it. You know, it's, it's interesting and I'm glad you pointed to George McLauren story because, you know, there was one point where Thurgood Marshall comes down to Oklahoma to see where George McLauren is he's like that man was sitting that man is sitting in the hallway. And you have, you have other students in class learning and, and it really is this sort of dedication to to segregation and oftentimes like the University of Oklahoma said well, our hands are tied because the state law says that you know we have to maintain segregation so we have to, you know, figure out ways to segregate with and also abide by what the Supreme Court is telling us. But, you know, even so the first major decision the first kind of major higher education decision came down. The late 1930s in the games case and they said that states at least needed to provide a separate option for black students in the state, which is actually remarkable that you end up having, you know, able to least simple Fisher's case and George McLauren's case, because those cases are proved positive that even after the Supreme Court said you at least need to have a separate option that states weren't even creating a separate option. And so it was really, it was really this sort of commitment to to maintaining this inequality that that I think that, you know, we often sort of gloss over and and it's like, you know, okay, the slavery happened and then you have the 1314 to 15 and then things change a little bit, but then you have Jim Crow, and then you have Brown v Board of Education but but in the meantime, there were all of these little things that were happening all of these ways to preserve the status quo that institutions were not just sort of passive partners in but that they were active participants in. And, and, you know, in a lot of ways, it's sort of proof positive of this the way that these institutions need to atone for for the ways that they were active participants and in that system of segregation. Yeah, one of the things that I am was really impressed by in reading was just how in the playbook of every single institution dedicated to segregation. was such an important part of the package. And it seems to me, especially when you think about the actual instructions on the order that came with Brown v Board. There has not been, even now, a whole lot of deliberate speed in creating any sort of just or equal environment and one thing you do really well in the book is show that in every single juncture even outside of these really big cases outside of place to be Ferguson outside of Brown v Board and outside of the fight for affirmative action. It takes positive, difficult action from black folks and from advocates of black folks to force those institutions hand and forcing the move. Was it ever. I don't know frustrating for you.  And, you know, he, their build their places on the University of Missouri is campus named for him now, but he was never able to step foot on that campus, and it is it was incredibly frustrating. But also, like there's there's always a piece of it that's like, yes, I know that, you know, we come from a legacy of people who really fought for their rights but, you know, knowing that they should not have had to do all of that they should not have had to give up all of these years of their life fighting for something that that is a basic right of theirs. You know, he was just trying to continue his education, Ada Louise simple Fisher, which is trying to continue her education, you know, she started that fight 1945 and wasn't, you know, enrolling in the University of Oklahoma's law school until 1950. You know, the airs case right it started in 1975 you don't get to a settlement until 2001, and even that settlement is incomplete so the amount of time that people had to spend fighting for for basic rights.  So I want to remind everybody before I ask my next question that the q amp a form is open if you have any questions, and you want me to ask them in the last 15 minutes of this event just put them down in a form on zoom. One of the. If you haven't read again, one of the things about the book that is also interesting and striking is you tell it, you tell the story of higher education through what are really a bunch of small biographies. Is it important for you to center these stories of people in this larger big, you know, clash of institutions and forces. It was in part because I think we often, we often think of higher education is like this abstract thing. And it's in the same way that people. They don't like higher education but they love their local college right because they see their local college they can connect to their local college they're the personal stories their friends their family that attended their local college. And I think that our tendency to make higher education abstract really pulls away from our ability to see the people who who make up higher education and who have fought to make higher education more equitable. I wanted people to be able to to connect with with those people with their stories right, so I could I could have written about, you know, okay the more elect past and Iowa was the first state to accept the land grant and this is how Iowa State was formed and it didn't enroll any black students and, you know, move on to the next thing but you, I can also give you the first black student who enrolled at Iowa State what the experience was like for him. For George Washington Carter is the first black student to enroll at Iowa State and and he doesn't enroll there until 30 years after they accept the land grant and only because the federal government is like, Well, you either need to create a separate school for black students or enroll black students in your university.  And I really wanted the humans to sort of shine through and in the book. Now I know you've been reporting on all this for a very long time. And you know all the ins and outs you probably knew the rough shape of the book would take take for a long time. But is there anything that you came across while you were researching and reporting that surprised you. Yeah. So a couple of things. I mean, we talked a little bit about like the lengths that states went to to maintain segregation. So, like the little details so when, when the state of Oklahoma and the federal government's Supreme Court's like, Well, you guys need to create at least a separate law school for a loose official or enroll her at the University of Oklahoma School of Law, the government created a law school in five days. You know, they said, Okay, we're going to use a floor of the Capitol building and we're going to hire three part time professors for what will be full time work and we're going to create a curriculum and this is going to be equal to the school that's been around for 50 years. And even when you know you sort of know intellectually that states were going, you know, as far as they could to stymie black education, it's jarring to see the kind of at a granular level, like that in practice. You know, even if I knew the broad outlines of the day law I knew the broad outlines of you know how state segregated education to see up close and to dig in the archive see what people are saying in the newspapers in the early 1900s about why they're doing something was was remarkable and then again to see the ways that states and the federal government has studied their underfunding of HBCUs in particular. For years and years. So to see that, you know, they've studied this, and they've known about these issues, and then they just sort of let them sit and let the institutions languish. And they did a study of Kentucky Normal and Industrial Institute now Kentucky State University in the early 1900s. And so the fact that, you know, you still see some of those same problems today that that you know this research is coming down was identifying in the early 1900s is really galling and was jarring to see as I was researching the book. One of the people who gets a little bit of the biographical treatment in the book is Carter G. Woodson. And it made me think about the lineage, the tradition really to which this book belongs there's been a lot of scholarship a lot of work, situating black education as kind of the cornerstone, or maybe not the cornerstone but the thing around which all of the rest of the education policy is built and influenced on whether that's positive or, or in segregation negative. How does it feel for you now to be a published part of that tradition have something where your children where people who are going to be attending universities can are going to be able to go to libraries and check out for years and generations to come. Um, you know, it was, it was while I went to the bookstore on pub day, and I saw the book there it's like, you know, you know, people can buy this my, my brother went to, you know, Barnes and Noble in Ohio and picked up the book and did a Facebook live. And so that that part of it in itself is this kind of surreal but but thinking about this this more general intellectual tradition. This book would not be possible without the work of scholars of journalists of researchers, you know, past who have really cataloged and thought critically about about black education about education policy and as you say, right. If, if we are to move towards a more equitable education policy in America, not only in higher education but also K 12, you know, the foundations of that can really hinge on whether or not the most, you know, marginalized minoritized populations in those spheres are being treated equitably. So, I don't know, situating, situating this book, you know, and having it in conversation with, you know, with these titles that you know I grew up with and is is is remarkable and I think that my hope is that this book can at least you know, speak to someone so that they might want to kind of take up the mantle from here and and dig in a little bit deeper. And so to kind of continue this this conversation. Again, I don't want to give away too much about the book, although I mean I think you all kind of know where this ends. Unfortunately, the status quo is there's been a lot written about it, we know that it's not just talking about the legacy white supremacy and segregation we're talking about very real structures that still exist. And in some ways are even more powerful and intractable today so I'm sorry if you came to this session and didn't know that. But I'm sorry to spoil that for you, but I do want to point out one part of the book that did that got me to thinking a little bit. And I'm still going over and over again in my mind. During George McLaurin's fight to integrate the University of Oklahoma. One thing one of the officials in opposition to him said and I'm reading from the book. It says, he argued that desegregation would make discrimination by individuals more robust and intense. He argues and I think it's kind of, you know, it is obviously a self serving argument that the state and illegally enforcing segregation was not trying to humiliate and degrade McLaurin. Instead it was doing his black citizens a favor. Now we can toss aside the part that's obviously self serving for the state. We can toss aside, but this argument that the legal enforcement legal creation of segregation kept sort of individual level racism at Bay that seems like a sort of accidentally profound observation in some sense. So if you look at school systems today that I've created a de facto segregation that is as strong in many cases, as Jim Crow was, I don't really have a question behind that. Just an observation I thought was that got me to thank you. And it's been interesting to see the ways that the cycle. It's almost like the momentum that the system of segregation had is sort of perpetual right there. There's still several states that haven't proven to the federal government that they have desegregated their higher education systems in part because of how they treat their privileges in part because of things like unnecessary program application and all these kind of wonky things but at their at their root, you know, it kind of comes back to enrollment it comes back to finances and it's, it's, it's been interesting over the last several years to see how you've created this sort of increasing stratification, where, you know, resources and higher education like I said are sort of concentrated in these institutions that tend to have the fewest black students and, you know, until there is a concerted effort to break that cycle, you know, an effort that is strong as the moment momentum from segregation that was pushing this kind of pushing against it. You know, I fear that we won't have. There won't be that that sort of genuine equity and equality that that you know one might hope for and the higher education system. In the past few years, we have seen in the past couple years, a spike in enrollment in some HBC use we've seen things like mega donors like Mackenzie Scott, who is giving millions and millions of dollars institutions. We've seen what appears to be a moment for black college attendees and graduates in the last couple years, but that sits kind of uneasily with how your book ends when we talk about the clock that's ticking that's due next year for Mississippi for funding in Mississippi. How do you square your conclusions on the policy and the piece and what most people would say is a feel good era right now for HBC use at least. Yeah. 2020 was a record year for a lot of HBC use in terms of philanthropic giving in terms of attention this year right HBC user expecting about $3 billion and you know at a typical year across about 15 programs they get about $1 billion from the federal government so you know it is a sort of a moment that HBC user in the spotlight they have not been in the spotlight like this for a sustained period like this in the past but I also the reason I mean one of the reasons why I'm hesitant to look at last year's philanthropic giving you know this is this is fantastic. It was in part because you know an institution like my own wasn't the recipient of you know one of those large gifts there are a lot of HBC use they were not recipients of those large gifts. And on top of that, you know in 2021 the Chronicle of Philanthropy has this database of, you know the largest donations period but also to colleges and universities. If you look at that list this year, you know the top 100 gifts gifts about $5 million there, maybe one or two of them that are to historically black colleges and universities. And so, you know, the idea that that one year was going to address this historical pattern of segregation is, is, I think that we would, it would be to the sector's detriment and it would also be a sort of fallacy if we were to understand what happened last year as as changing the entire narrative of course there's some HBC use that are that are thriving in this moment. But they are thriving in spite of that historical discrimination not not sort of because things have changed so radically that everything is okay. I'm coming with the ultimate conclusions in the book because I think it what you show in the end is essentially the system is held together and moved by every couple years these band-aids right these, you get infusion of funding from a lawsuit you get a breakthrough in a lawsuit for inclusion, you get a have hearted affirmative action mandate from the federal government. On what level do you think we should be thinking as if we really want to. I guess it's a little bit too bad to say create equality, but to actually address some of these structural inequality. Yeah, I think, you know, on one level, it's important for state governments to accept sort of the responsibility for for their role in creating and fostering and equitable systems. It's also on the federal government for creating the environment that allowed right when when Elizabeth Warren was running for president. You know, I spoke with with Heather McGee, and she, she told me something, you know, that was, you know, public policy created the racial wealth gap, and only public policy can fix it. And in a lot of ways public policy is what created, or at least allowed for the system of an equitable education to exist. And so public policy is going to be necessary to fix that. And it's also the responsibility that that some of these institutions have right the institutions that were actively blocking and stymied black education while you know HBCUs were doing the work of educating black students so you look at a state like Mississippi where, you know, the air settlement sort of came and will now be going phasing out the black colleges got $500 million over 17 years between three institutions. And you know, Mississippi can make $500 million and you know five years of private donations. And if you go back to the 1800s and mid 1800s when University of Mississippi was keeping black students out and you look at a place like all corn state that was educating those black students in 1871 they're supposed to get a guaranteed appropriation for a decade of $50,000 a year. Years later when the, you know, the so called redeemers sweep in and with their quote unquote white revolution. They reduced that appropriation to $15,000 a year, then next year $5,500 a year. And so you sort of see the ways that that inequality is sort of stacked up. So you start to ask yourself, well, do not only state and federal governments have a sort of role and making this system more equal but also do, do these institutions that profited and flourished in the era of slavery and segregation do they have a responsibility to help the institutions that that served black students when they would. I want to remind the audience, I'm going to go to Q amp a shortly so if you do have any questions, please drop them in the form in zoom. Last couple questions, first of all, the state must provide where's the quote, where's the title come from. So the quote comes from the Fisher a really simple Fisher case, when they said that state must provide an equal education for as soon as it does for for any other student. And that's really the crux of this because as much as this is about, you know, a history of higher education as much as it's in history of HBC as much as it's sort of an examination of inequality. And it's really about that the students because the institutions, you know, exist to serve those those students and, you know, as I write in the introduction, you know, higher education has a dirty open secret it's never given black students an equal chance to succeed and and so the state must provide really grows out of that that notion that the state must provide an equal education for black students as soon as it does for anyone else and and that has not been a practical reality. Now, last question from me and then I will turn it to our q amp a here. One of the really elemental things that moved me when reading was seeing all these stories of going back to what we talked about before, you know, this story begins in an era when black folks could have been put to death for reading. But they read, and yet they learned and yet in the span of a couple years after the end of slavery, there were several institutions of higher education, not only run for them but run by them. You saw a really unprecedented proliferation of education of the quest for education among people from its seems so dangerous and difficult to seek that attainment. So as we go into the audience questions is, has that has seen all those stories has living and seeing through all those people's eyes has it made a mark on you. And, you know, I don't think questions about hope and optimism or a little, you know, not for me, but what is what do those stories mean to you.  So the amount it took to sort of fight for for basic rights and and knowing that in some ways this book is a continuation of that that sort of push for for equity and equality and higher education and I think that for me. As I was reporting this book out as I was digging into the archives, I really got a sense of, you know, okay, I'm staying up a little bit late at night to finish writing but but, you know, not too long ago right you know, my grandfather's grandfather's generation. You know, this would have not this not this wouldn't have been a possibility for them. And so it's like knowing what we've been through knowing that, you know, states would literally, you know, you could literally be killed for being found with a book.  And I think it for forecasting for and I think that it really shows that even after I'm gone the fight kind of continues to sort of push for for equity and equality continues. And it's almost kind of comforting knowing that but it's also a little bit knowing that it's been going on for so long is in some ways depressing so there's like this this mix of like, like, knowing that it's been going on for so long is kind of depressing but also knowing that people have dedicated their lives to this and continue to fight actually does sort of provide a form of hope. So I have an audience question that will segue directly from that response which is from Alex and it's what readings or writers inspired you the most while writing. So, a couple. I think at the root is like the boy I read black reconstruction and sort of his examination of sort of the education pieces of that and then also, you know, reading and really kind of digging in deeply to the ideas around education and how people are thinking about black education in the early night as you know, the Atlantic archives are full of, you know, the debates between the boy and Booker T Washington and thinking about, you know, on the trainings of black men and you know, casting forward thinking about the writings of Carter G Woodson on black education, and then even more, more currently, there's really great histories of HBC use that I actually have on my shelves here. So like, Bobby love it. America's historically black colleges and universities and narrative history from 1837 2009 was massive. The origins of federal support and higher education really sort of helped me kind of cement some of the ideas around the ways that the Morrill Act was structured and how the federal government got involved and has stayed involved in higher education now that sort of excluded black students so I think there were a range of folks who I was leaning on as I said it's sort of, you know, even even up to now, Catherine Wiedel's dissertation on on the second Morrill Act, you know, from the Lumina Foundation incredibly helpful and helping me think about you know, the ways that the federal government has as sort of stymied black education, even as it was sort of, you know, creaking the door open right it was never willing to kind of throw the door wide open what it would at least sort of unlock it. So now question from Vanessa Vanessa says thank you for this conversation. I am really enjoying Adam's book and wanted to ask him, given the incredible resistance to integrated higher education. How long do you think we'll be we'll be living with this legacy of stolen public resources. I think as long as in some ways right so the late 1960s early 1970s through court action, the federal government really started enforcing its policies on discrimination and higher education systems. And so, until there is an environment where where states realize that they cannot kind of continue this, this cycle that has momentum of sort of believing that the federal government will not strictly adhere enforce these laws that are on the books that bar discrimination I think that we will continue to see, you know, the state sort of be complacent right there. There are a couple of ways that states can get out of a federal monitoring and one of them is through these these settlements that we talked about a little bit earlier. So Maryland is recently settled with his HPC use. They offer $577 million over 10 years but between four colleges, and we really start to do the math it's like okay 10 years it's like all right that's, that's $57 million a year $57.7 million a year. And so when you really start to break that down you see how, you know, if that's supposed to make up for a legacy of the vestiges of discrimination that's going to be wholly insufficient. And so until you start to have a real accounting for for, you know, the damage that has been done and the fact that these institutions have been able to persist and and produce successful graduates and educate, you know, black people in spite of this this sort of regime the Jim Crow regime they lived under is is a testament to the institutions but also should be a a sort of wake up call to say that what with these institutions have been able to done if they were provided with the resources they were just supposed to receive. And I think the more we we ask these questions the more we have these conversations. You know, the better off we will be in the long run maybe the more we'll move towards it sort of equity. What are some of your favorite sources to work with in your research and your reporting. Newspapers. So I really enjoyed digging through digging through old newspapers and, you know, you always have to figure out the political bent of the new sources and you know, you would read like the Utah Wagon observer and then you would go over and read like the Utah Democrat they would have two completely different perspectives. And you really kind of had to to square it down and pair it down to okay what's what is the base roots of this where where's this paper coming from. I really liked digging into the news archives because you would always and on top of like finding the interesting thing that was relevant to the book you know you and and inevitably run across an interesting story like, you know person throws 13,000 pound boulder like across the Mississippi or you know, but you would run into these interesting stories I really liked working with newspaper archives but I also like digging through Supreme Court records that the just over at the Library of Congress and seeing like the internal conversations that the justices were having about affirmative action seeing the letters that were flying back and forth where you know Thurgood Marshall says that you know what this case hinges on when he's talking about the Bakke case is, you know, it really just on whether you think of this as, you know, we're keeping students out, or whether you're thinking about it as students who have historically been excluded, you know, getting it you know, and you know the way that he and before their justices thought about that case was, it was about people getting in. These are people who institutions have not enrolled to have institutions have actively kept out of these seeds. And so, yes, it will take some time we need to take race into account in order to get past race right exact same thing that was written in the Atlantic in 1977 right in order to get past race you must first take a counterface. And so to see that working with those archives was was really interesting and illuminating for the book. All right, we have a question from Anna, and asks, what lesson does the educational model of HPC use offer for the non HPC use that now educate a majority of black students in higher education today. I think so Jelani favors has a really great book is shelter in a storm. And, you know, he talks about the sort of second curriculum that HPC students often receive that it's not just about the, you know, learning the arts and the sciences and all of this but it's, it's about learning how to navigate in the world how to navigate the sort of dearth of resources you might receive how to navigate navigate the job market and how to navigate racism. And not from a place of okay we're going to throw you into an environment where you're just going to face racism but but really sort of nurturing the students and I think, the sort of emphasis that sort of mentorship that students get from HPC us oftentimes right I am sure you had this this experience where, you know, I remember they were days where I would just walk over to the Department of Behavioral Sciences at the time, hang out with professors and talk, and like just kind of sit in their offices, not during office hours, because it was sort of built into the mission of the institution that these were, these were places where, you know, that sort of extra mentorship was was not peripheral to the job of the HPC progress but it was it was sort of almost central to that position. And, you know, you have to think about what the rest of higher education is right now where you have a series and I mean of course this is also user issues that face HPC as well. But, you know, the sort of emphasis on, you know, getting to getting to the next level, and then also the racism that black professors are facing at their, at their institutions where it's like, you know, I'm also trying to navigate racism within within my institution while trying to help students and it becomes this additional burden. So, so I think the more work that institutions can do to make themselves, you know, more equitable not just for students but for faculty, better working environment for faculty so that they they can do that extra kind of that extra work and then also kind of compensating for that extra work. I think that the better off those institutions will be as well as the students who attend them. In addition to that, you know, a large share of black students now are at community colleges. And so the more states can do to fund community colleges provide resources to community colleges so that, you know, they can have those additional supports that students need in order to be successful, the better off students and those institutions will be. Yeah, I named my kid after one of the presidents of my PCU so I'm all in on the sort of extra extra legacy of them. Benjamin Elijah. Yeah. What's one thing you wish you knew understood better before you started the book. I think, you know, the process of writing the book or, you know, writing a book generally is advantage, you know, it's kind of like, it's an exploration.  And so, you know, all of the little things as I mentioned a little earlier kind of about the extent that states went to, you know, Oklahoma rushing to law school into existence in five days. You know, what a reintegration of Berea College look like how an institution that had this original mission sort of reclaims that mission after integration. I think all of those, all of those little things. I think, I think, added to the experience of writing the book and in some ways made the experience a, you know, pretty fruitful and interesting learning experience for me too. So I hope that that readers, I hope that in my writing that readers can sort of get that, you know, it's always this was this was a learning experience for me too and I tried to pour as much of what I learned into into the book. And the last question I'll say this one for me before we wrap up. Who is your ideal reader who do you hope gets their hands on this book the most. Yeah. So I mean of course you hope that policymakers read this book you hope that college leaders read this book. But really, I hope that anyone interested in history anyone interested in understanding the ways that, you know, the machinations of slavery and Jim Crow and the systems that they created did not sort of.  But people who are interested in understanding how a system of higher education, the colleges higher education that that you know the founders are really talking about higher education is the place to build a good citizen. How over time, black people have been systematically excluded from the greatest benefits of that. So, honestly, anyone who was generally interested in in that sort of accounting of history, I'd hope we read the book. Well, Adam, thank you so much for joining us I know you have a very busy week so thank you for taking the time. Thank you to everyone who joined us on the zoom today, and there's still time, please go and order a copy of the book at solid state books, even if you already have a copy get another one. Thank you all for coming and see you later. Take care.


Penguin Audio presents What Alice Forgot by Leanne Moriarty Read by Tamara Lovett-Smith Chapter 1 She was floating, arms outspread, water lapping her body, breathing in a summery fragrance of salt and coconut.  She lifted her chin and the morning sun shone so brightly on the water she had to squint through spangles of light to see her feet in front of her. Her toenails were each painted a different color, red, gold, purple, funny. The nail polish hadn't been applied very well, blobby and messy. Someone else was floating in the water right next to her. Someone she liked a lot who made her laugh with toenails painted the same way. The other person waggled multi-colored toes at her companionably and she was filled with sleepy contentment. Somewhere in the distance a man's voice shouted, Marco! And a chorus of children's voices cried back, Polo! The man called out again, Marco, Marco, Marco! And the voices answered, Polo, Polo, Polo! A child laughed a long, gurgling giggle like a stream of soap bubbles. A voice said quietly and insistently in her ear, Alice! And she tipped back her head and let the cool water slide silently over her face. Tiny dots of light danced before her eyes. Was it a dream or a memory? I don't know! said a frightened voice. I didn't see it happen. No need to get your niggas in a knot. The dream or memory, or whatever it was, dissolved and vanished like a reflection on water and instead fragments of thought began to drift through her head as if she were waking up from a long, deep sleep late on a Sunday morning. Is cream cheese considered a soft cheese? It's not a hard cheese. It's not part at all. So logically you would think something. Something logical. Lavender is lovely. Logically lovely. Must prune back the lavender. I can smell lavender. No, I can't. Yes, I can. That's when she noticed the pain in her head for the first time. It hurt on one side a lot as if someone had given her a good solid thwack with a baseball bat. Her thoughts sharpened.  Nobody had warned her about pain in the head. She had a whole list of peculiar symptoms to be prepared for.  That one should really have been mentioned because it was very painful. Of course if she couldn't handle a run-of-the-mill headache, well then... The scent of lavender seemed to be coming and going like a gentle breeze. She let herself drift again. The best thing would be to fall back asleep and return to that lovely dream with the water and the multicoloured toenails. Actually maybe someone had mentioned headaches and she forgot. Yes they had, headaches for heaven's sake, really bad ones. Fabulous. So much to remember. No soft cheeses or smoked salmon or sushi because of the risk of that disease she never knew existed. Listeria, something to do with bacteria, hurts the baby. That's why you weren't allowed to eat leftovers.  The brutal responsibilities of parenthood. For now, she would just go back to sleep. That was the best thing. Listeria. Wisteria. The wisteria over the side fence is going to look stunning if it ever gets around to flowering. Listeria. Wisteria. Ha! Funny words. She smiled but her head really did hurt a lot. She was trying to be brave. Alice, can you hear me? The lavender smell got stronger again. A bit sickly sweet. Cream cheese is a spreadable cheese. Not too soft, not too hard, just right. Like the baby bears' bed. Her eyelids are fluttering like she's dreaming. It was no use. She couldn't get back to sleep even though she felt exhausted as if she could sleep forever. Were all pregnant women walking around with aching heads like this? Was the idea to toughen them up for labor pains? When she got up she would check it out in one of the baby books. She always forgot how pain was so upsetting. Cruel. Sample complete. Ready to continue?


Dr. Lou Rockwell, chairman of the Ludwig Mundt Mrs. Institute, which defends the free market. Hi there, good evening. What's it to be, default or a last minute salvation here? What do you think? Well, I wouldn't call it a salvation, Kevin, but I think there probably will be a last minute deal. I'd like to see a default. It's the only way we're ever going to get a balanced budget that forces the government to live on its income and stop borrowing. It's far too much borrowing by the American government. Really everybody in American society is too much in debt. We need less debt, and if we want less debt, the only way we'll ever get these birds to do it in Washington is just don't raise the debt ceiling. Well, I'm sure many people agree with you, but the knock-on implications would be at renderswood. Not only in America, but in the rest of the world, too, if that happened. No, it'd be wonderful, the idea that the whole world is sustained by growing American debt, that it has to be more and more borrowing in order to make everybody prosperous. It doesn't work, by the way. Unemployment rates are horrific rates all over the Western world. None of us feel comfortable economically. We're all worried about the future. The government is harming us. So the idea that less government is somehow harmful, it's just the reverse. This is, of course, Keynesianism, that we have to have more government, more spending, more debt perpetually, and that'll make us all wealthy. No, it doesn't. It helps the banksters. It helps the government. It helps the military-industrial complex, and all the big companies associated with the government. It hurts regular people. So we want an end to the debt, and we want much less spending. I'd like an end to the spending, but unfortunately, that's not going to come. But there's a slight chance that we might see an end to the debt. Come 48 hours, if there is no agreement, central banks are making contingency plans around the world to try and shore themselves up. Could they actually protect against the worst of the fallout here, if it does happen? Well, first of all, the government does a huge amount of spending that's so-called off-budget. It's not part of the budget, so it's not affected by a lot of these alleged restrictions. That goes on, and of course, why do they need to tax anybody? Why do they need to borrow the money? Why doesn't Ben Bernanke just print it all? I mean, we're told that this is wonderful for us, quantitative easing. Why don't they quintuple quantitative easing, and just handle everything that way? So you can't believe anything they say. It's a good, you know, it's the old British saying, never believe anything until it's been officially denied. I think that's, I don't think we should believe the Republicans or the Democrats. They don't have the people's best interests at heart. They only have themselves and the special interests. Lou, while you're on the line, it seems to me, when the economic crisis was raging in the Eurozone, Obama and Congress both had a lot to say on the matter. We've got a clip from Obama from a couple of years ago. Let's take a quick listen. We're going through a financial crisis that is scaring the world. And they're trying to take responsible actions, but those actions haven't been quite as quick as they need to be. The biggest headwind the American economy is facing right now is uncertainty about Europe, because it's affecting global markets. Well, on the shoes now, back on the other foot. Why should he be taking a bit more of his own advice there, begs the question, no Lou? Well, it's always somebody else's fault, right? It's not his fault. It's not the American government's fault. It's, you know, those guys in Europe. So the nation that's fundamentally at fault for the trouble in the world is the U.S. government. It's got the biggest economy.   Why don't they bring the troops on from Afghanistan and Iraq and Yemen and Pakistan and all the rest of these places, stop killing people? That would save a quadrillion dollars. That would solve all the budget problems. That's my advice to Mr. Obama. I'm sure there's a lot of people out there that would say what you say makes perfect sense. They're a little rockwell. Thank you for your time, Chairman of the Little Big von Misses Institute. Appreciate it. Thank you, Kevin.


Hello everyone. In this video you will see a sample Emily format research paper. So as you can see, for the research paper in the top left you will have the student's name, the instructor, the class, and the date. The title of the research paper will be in the center, and the page number will be in the top right. So it will be the student's last name followed by the page number. Now the works cited page, that's going to go all the way at the end of the research paper and we'll have it on page. Works cited is at the top and centered. Each of the citations are in alphabetical order. And for each citation, each line after that first line is going to be indented. As you can see, now intact citations will look like this. They will have the first part of the citation, which is normally the author's last name, and the page number. So here we have Nieto and page 45, which is a book. So it's a book by Nieto and the information that the writer of this research paper is referring to is found on page 45. Now as you have learned from your previous exercises, if it does not include an author's last name, we put the next best thing, which is normally the title of the work, privacy policy. There is no author included. And because it's an online source, not all online sources are going to mention a page number, so we'll skip it. So that intact citation where there isn't an author included, there isn't a page number, we're just going to have the title of the source in quotation marks, so that's the proper way to cite it in parentheses. Now let's say that we're looking for Nieto. We're going to go to the work cited page, and it's a good thing that you put our citations in alphabetical order in for Nieto, and there we go. So now we see where that source is coming from, beyond inclusion, beyond empowerment, developmental strategy to liberate everyone. That means that we can go to that source, which is a book, we can go to that book, open it up to page 45, and see the information that the writer of this research paper used in the paper. So that is the work cited page. Remember the citations are in alphabetical order. Every line after the first line of that citation is indented. That continue on with the rest of the module, and thank you for watching. Bye-bye.


Hello and welcome to the session. In this session, we will discuss the relationship between the circumference and area of a circle. First of all, let us realize what is the radius, diameter, circumference and area of a circle. First of all, let us discuss the radius of a circle. Now here you can see a circle with center O. Now a line segment from the center of a circle to a point on the circle is called radius of a circle and here is the radius of this circle. So here this is the line segment from the center of the circle to a point on the circle. So this is the radius of the given circle. Similarly all these line segments represent radius of this given circle. Now let us discuss diameter. Now any line segment whose n points are on the circle and passes through the center is called diameter of a circle. Now here you can see that a b is the diameter of the given circle as its n points a and v lie on the circle through the center O. Now let us denote the diameter by d and radius that is the line segment starting from the center to the point on the circle is denoted by r. Now we can see that length of diameter carries the radius that is d is equal to 2r we can say r is equal to d upon 2. Now let us discuss of a circle. Now circumference of a circle is the distance around the circle it is given by c which is equal to 2 by r where is a constant with value 22 by 7 and r is radius of a circle. We can also write circumference in terms of diameter. Now we know that diameter d is equal to 2r. So circumference c which is equal to 2 by r can be written as pi into 2r. Now here we know that d is equal to 2r so it is equal to pi into d. We have written in terms of diameter of a circle. Now let us discuss area of a circle. Now area is and area of a circle is given by 22 a is equal to pi r square where pi is a constant with value 22 by 7 and r is the radius of a circle. Now let us express area in terms of diameter. Now we know that diameter d is equal to 2r equal to d upon 2. Let us put this value of r in the formula of area which is a is equal to pi r square. Now r is equal to d upon 2 so it will be pi into d upon 2 whole square which implies is equal to m into d square by 4. And now let us derive relationship between area and circle. Now we know that of a circle is given by c is equal to 2 pi r or we can write c is equal to pi into d where pi is a constant and d is the diameter of a circle and this implies d is equal to c upon pi. Circle is given by a is equal to 1. In terms of diameter we can write a is equal to pi into d square by 4. Now let us see equation number one. Now putting d is equal to c upon 1 pi whole square this whole upon 4 which implies a is equal to upon pi square and this whole upon c square upon 4 pi. So this implies a is equal to c square upon 4 pi. Therefore area of a circle is equal to square of the circumference of a circle divided by 4 pi where pi is the constant with value 22 by 7 the relationship between area and circumference of a circle. So in this session we have learned the relationship between area and circumference of a circle and this completes our session. Hope you will have enjoyed this session.