All right gentlemen, I wanna say to repeat after me just how I do it, ready? It is our first time in Magic Kingdom First time yeah, I feel like everybody has been here done that Wow, it's Taylor's first time too. The first time is here. Yeah. What about Josh Josh Have you? Hey what? That's not Josh. Josh is not here with us. Josh has actually gone away. I'll miss him dearly. Is that a fishing campaign off the ocean? Yeah. Oh it's time. It's starting. Let's go do this. Let's go do this. No, no, no. We're not doing that. We're not gonna go ride the People Mover. In fact, the castle is about to light up. Well, Elsa is about to light it up. And Veronica's parents are here and it's the first time they've ever been to Disney during Christmas. Okay, we got ourselves into this. Now we just need to get out. Yeah. Well, tomorrow landed is for a little People Mover. I was just waiting for something funny to happen. I thought it would happen just by pointing the camera kind of over in your direction. They're kissing behind you. That's it. They're getting their separate cars. They can't ride together. And just to let you know there is night vision cameras when you go through Space Mountain. There's night vision cameras when you go through Space Mountain. Yeah, we're sitting together. Not even looking. See, there's the cameras. They see everything. Oh, yes. The big reveal. I think they're looking at the same thing. Beautiful. You going again, Joe? Would you look at that? Nobody was in line for the awesome lantern photo spot right there. I've always wanted to do this. I know. Just you do the picture. I don't want to mess it up because I'm sweaty. But look at that. We ran into some friends from across the bay, across the pond. Why can I never get that right? And look, they're probably getting a little bag, a Google Lamb bag. The shrimp is gone. Finally, the carousel is free. Wow, it's so pretty back here right now. And I don't even know why there's actually space to move around a little bit. I'm loving it. Did you take the sword? Oh, I thought you got the sword. The sword. Where are you? Oh, what do you got to show them? Oh, the Mickey Mouse Ray Bands. You'll buy her those sunglasses? Christmas? For me?  They're not that expensive.  Those are the ones that some random man put on my face. How much are they? 203. Why 203? Why not 200? Look at those babies. Wow. You guys want to put them on? We have fast passes we need to get to. Stop trying to get Ray Bands out of the deal here. Morgan owes them to me. Oh, soon. Keep walking there, Chris. Come on, get her. Get her. Get her. We're getting ready to do pirates. My mom's already in line because she has completely ditched us. She said, get me to pirate. She's riding standby. She's going standby. She doesn't even know what she's doing. Don't even look at her. Don't look her in the eyes. Don't look her in the eyes. We were waiting for Nate because he said he had to go to the bathroom. We were waiting over there for a good, what, 20 minutes? Somehow Nate ended up ahead of us in the lines. Taylor and Josh are in row one. And I'm in row two because I have to supervise my parents because they keep, stop. Don't touch my mom. Don't touch my mom. My favorite animatronic is definitely that little crab right there. She's track of where her parents are here. She is like on the go, go, go, go. I don't even know where she went. That's not yet. Where did she go? Oh, are you trying to get something now again? Well, you see, it's just a small thing. She is, isn't she? She asking to buy her something? Yeah. Our next stop is definitely gonna be the Jingle Cruise because it's the Jingle Cruise. Joe? No, Jingle. No, at during the holidays, it's transferred into the Jingle Cruise. They drop the video. No, they put the U back in it. And they brought the I. See? The Jingle Cruise. You can see that? Oh, look how festive it is in here. Santa Police shop here. Did you run into that pole? Oh, I hope it didn't hurt. Very stylish. Oh, look at it. Oh, my God. It's the little tiny hat on the spider and the beard. Look at that. Wait, we can do a little bit better than that. Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas. Okay, that'll do. All right. The villagers got, could you? Like still, it's a very rocky situation right now. We get stuck right here. I can go 10 minutes with that. What'd you think? You love it, right? Jingle Cruise. I mean, it was probably the best thing you met. That was a good Jingle Cruise. That was a good Jingle Cruise. Thank you. Thank you. Got our spot. I get very emotional watching this. Oh, we're talking about. Oh, wow. I'm blocking mom over here. Oh, she gets emotional. My mom, no, she does not. What? She doesn't want to be in the vlog. She doesn't want to be emotional. Oh, she's emotional. Get a choice. They have to be in the vlog. I know they have to be in the vlog. Dad wants to be in the vlog. So we got our spot for happily ever after. It's a pretty good one. We're going to be here for 20 minutes now. This contact is the one bothering me. Which one? Do you know what I mean? Oh. Guys, have you ever been in this hurdle right here? Hurdle. Yep. Oh, yeah. If you don't like this, wait till they all start pushing forward now. And then when we leave. This is why my parents always told us there is no fireworks at Disney. And I was always confused growing up and I'm like, what? I swear. You said that? Yeah, they did. She said, Veronica, there's no fireworks at Disney. I was begging them one day. Can't we just get an ice cream? Mother, daughter dispute. Is that like a rouge? We're trying to get a corn dog. Wishes through the backstage area and they had all the different vehicles out, but I didn't want to show you guys because, you know, backstage and all. But look at what we walk out to. Beautiful, isn't it? Wow. The other day, we just said, what's your favorite Christmas tree? And that is why I said Magic Kingdom is mine. Super crowded today. So we're heading out. We did stay for the fireworks though. There she goes. She's back on her mission from God. I have no idea why she feels the need to walk so far ahead of all of us. Like, hello.  Trying to be cute and stuff aren't like addicted to Pokemon Go. It's all that they do together. I don't know what you're talking about. They're talking about schnizzles. I think we're done. It was a really glorious evening.  Oh, someone just tagged me in this on Instagram. The puppies, Dalmatian puppies. Good job whoever did the tagging. So I was wondering if maybe we could get puppies. No, not at all. So love the life you live. Good life you love. See you next time. Toodaloo. He's so upset he wasn't in the goodbye video.


Welcome to class 22 on topics in power electronics and distributed generation. We were looking at economic metrics for evaluating distributed generation systems. We are talking about four of them initial cost, payback period, cost of energy. So, we have been discussing the payback period, examples of payback period and cost of energy in the last class. So, one way of looking at cost of energy is you are purchasing some equipment, installing it and you are getting energy out of it and you are operating the equipment over long time frame may be multiple years. So, you want to look at the cost on an annualized basis for which you make use of things like interest rate, annual maintenance cost, annual fuel cost. If there are secondary benefits you look at it as a negative cost on an annualized basis and then you look at what is the energy produced on an annual basis and you can calculate the cost of energy. So, we looked at started with a simple example of cost of energy for a diesel generator producing electricity and we looked at the cost of the fuel to be diesel fuel to be 50 rupees a liter and the cost of electricity from your distribution supplier to be 7 rupees per kilowatt hour. When we work through the example we found that the cost of energy in this particular case from your DG set would work out to be rupees 15 per kilowatt hour. So, which is much greater than 7 so it does not make sense to produce electricity in this manner except when absolutely necessary. So, in a second situation we looked at when you are operating this gen set as a combined heat and power unit where the fuel in the diesel is being converted into electricity with a given efficiency and the waste heat is also being captured with some given efficiency. And then based on the fact that you could make use of this thermal output which might potentially be originally heated from electricity you can then calculate what your benefit is and in this particular case the cost of energy we worked out the example worked out to be rupees 6 rupees 10 paisa per kilowatt hour which is less than 7 so potentially this is can be a situation where producing electricity in this manner might be economically feasible. But we have neglected the capital equipment cost there is a cost in the internal combustion engine, the alternator, the heat exchangers etcetera the control system. So, we will look at an example we start with an example where we are looking at the capital and operation and maintenance cost. So, we will start in this example we will we are given the thermal load is 150 kilowatt thermal and the cost of your electrical part of your dg system is 4000 rupees per kilowatt hour kilowatt rating of the system and the cost of the heat exchanger part is again 4000 rupees per kilowatt thermal and we are assuming an interest rate of 15 percent and we will assume that the operation and maintenance cost is 10 percent of your capital cost of the equipment that you are purchasing. So, in this example we can calculate what would be the energy required to at the input because we know the fuel to thermal output efficiency is 45 percent. So, we can then calculate what your p input is because this is p thermal which is given. So, your p input is p thermal divided by 0.45. So, that works out to be 33 kilowatt and then you can calculate you know your efficiency from your input fuel to electricity which is 35 percent. So, you know your electrical output power electrical which is 0.35 times 333 this is 117 kilowatts.  So, you can calculate the capital cost. . So, we will work through the example. So, your capital cost is you have a system which is your thermal system is rated at 150 kilowatts and the cost of the heat exchanger equipment is 4000 rupees per kilowatt and your electrical system is 117 kilowatts and its cost is also 4000 rupees per kilowatt. So, you get 10.6 into 10 to the power of rupees and your operation and maintenance cost is 10 percent of your capital cost which is as which is assumption 1.06 and you could then also calculate your fuel use is 333 kilowatt is the energy in the fuel that is used on a kilowatt into on a per second basis. So, if you divided by 9.4 kilowatt hours per liter into 8.760 which is the number of hours per year and multiplied by 50 rupees which is the rupees per liter. So, this works out to be 155 into 10 to the power of 5 rupees per year and if you look at the number over here 155 into 10 to the power of 5 is a fuel cost per year is much larger than the capital cost which is just 10.6 into 10 to the power of 5. So, you will see that the fuel cost is much larger than the capital cost you could also calculate your thermal saving. So, 150 kilowatt is a thermal output and if it was being formally heated at 7 rupees per cost of power from the grid which was 7 rupees per kilowatt hour 760. So, this is 92 into 10 to the power of 5 rupees per year. So, then you could then calculate your annual electrical energy production electrical energy production which is 117 into 8.760 is 10.2 into 10 to the power of 5 kilowatt hours per year. So, then you can calculate your cost of energy capital cost into interest rate which is 15 percent plus 1.06 into 10 to the power of 5 which is your annual operation and maintenance cost 155 into 10 to the power of 5 which is your fuel cost and 92 into 10 to the power of 5 which is your thermal saving divided by 10.2 into 10 to the power of 5. So, this works out to be 6.39 rupees per kilowatt hour. So, you can see that even when adding terms for capital cost the cost of energy did not increase significantly over the fuel cost which. So, ignoring the capital cost it was 6 rupees 10 paisa with the capital cost operation and maintenance it moved up to 6 rupees 39 paisa. And in many fuel intensive technologies one may observe that the cost of fuel can be a major aspect of operating a system. Whereas, if you look at a comparative say other technology like renewable energy there the fuel cost is essentially 0, but then your capital cost would be the dominant term. So, also this implies that say in this example we assume that the diesel cost is 50 rupees per liter suppose the diesel cost went up by some amount then the that would reflect quite dramatically in the cost of energy. So, when you are generating power based on fuels you have to be having control over the risk of fuel cost going up and down whereas, if you look at a system such as renewable energy system the risk of operation over time is lesser the risk has to be evaluated up front whether the capital can be invested, but once done you have a fixed rate of return over a long longer time frame assuming that the reliability etcetera are as per design. Next what we will look at is an example of making use of this cost of energy concept in designing a d g system in this case is an example of a photovoltaic system. We will assume that the this is a 2 kilowatt photovoltaic system the module cost the PV modules cost 1.5 lakhs per kilowatt or you have a choice of power electronic inverters. So, you might have choice which might be a older design current design may be a more futuristic design it might have different efficiencies it might have different performance capabilities and also it might have different cost something which might be lower performance might be lower cost the 92 percent efficiency inverter cost 15 rupees per kilowatt and the 95 percent efficient inverter cost at 25 rupees per kilowatt and the question is which inverter would be an appropriate choice for your design and could you make use of the cost of energy as a possible basis for making a design decision. We will also assume that the installation and wiring cost for installing this photovoltaic system cost 50,000 rupees and there is no major annual maintenance you might have to clean the PV panels and we will assume that it cost 1000 rupees a year to for as annual maintenance cost. We will assume the interest rate of 15 percent we will assume that the power is being produced by this panel 12 hours a day obviously it is not going to produce 2 kilowatts early morning late evening. So, we will assume that there is a peak capacity factor of 0.45. So, on an overall day basis 0.45 of the peak power is being produced. So, the question is can we make use of the cost of energy calculation in making a design decision. So, we could actually go through the calculation of what would be the annual cost for these 3 technology options. So, you have the panel cost which is 2 into 1 and half lakh per kilowatt. So, 3 lakhs would be the panel cost for this 2 kilowatt rated unit and the panel cost is the same for the 3 inverter choice. The installation and commissioning cost is also the same it is largely wiring how you mount the panels the civil works or the mechanical structures etcetera associated with it. We will assume it is the same then if you look at the inverter cost for the 88 percent inverter it is 10,000 rupees per kilowatt. So, 2 kilowatts is 20,000 rupees for the 92 percent efficiency it is 30 kilowatts for the 95 percent it is 50,000 rupees. So, you take the capital cost and multiply it by your rate of interest rate which is 0.15 and then you add your annual maintenance cost which is 1000 rupees to calculate your annualized cost. So, the annualized cost for the 3 options works out to 6,000 rupees for option 1, 58,000 for option 2 and 61,000 for option 3 and then you could also calculate what is the annual energy production from these 3 units. So, we will assume that the panels from these 3 units are identical what is different is just the inverter. So, for the energy production it is 2 kilowatts is the rating of the unit it is working for 12 hours a day with a P capacity factor of 0.45 365 days a year and there may be some losses in the inverter. So, you multiply it with the efficiency. So, you can calculate what the annual energy production is it is 3469 units for option 1, 3627 units for option 2 and 3745 units for option 3. Then you do the cost of energy calculation you get 16 rupees, 29 paisa for option 1, 15 rupees and 72 paisa for option 2, 16 rupees and 2 paisa for option 3. So, if you are looking at what is the lowest cost of energy you will find that just going with the lowest cost unit or the highest performance unit may not be the most appropriate something appropriate might be what gives you most value for the technology that is being introduced. Again the numbers like the 1 and a half 1 and a half lakhs per kilowatt for the photovoltaic panel might be a little bit dated number if the cost might actually be lower today. So, these are numbers, but as these numbers some of these numbers change over time you could see a trend, but then you could see what would be an appropriate design decision based on what power electronic technology you are adopting. So, again you can see in the cost of energy from the cost of energy calculation there is no fuel cost the reason why you are having numbers like 15 rupees to 16 rupees per kilowatt hour is actually the capital cost. So, capital cost is critical for renewable energy or also true for things like nuclear technology where the cost of construction is quite massive your fuel cost is 0 in this case also a important factor is the interest rate if the interest rate is lower your cost can come down quite drastically. So, government policies towards these technologies is important factor because the interest rates can be affected by larger societal policies. A drawback with the cost of energy approach when you are doing such a design is that the differences between the performance matrix is really small you are trying to make use make a power electronic design, but then the power electronic numbers are buried by the larger numbers of the overall system. So, the differences appear to be quite small when you are looking at it from a cost of energy perspective and the cost of the power converter is actually a small fraction over of the overall system cost. But you can see another factor here if you look at the annual energy production for the 95 percent unit and compare it with this particular unit you have about plus 3 percent 3.25 percent energy production in this particular unit. So, you may not need a 2 kilowatt panel you can actually reduce the size of the panel by 3 percent and you can see that the panel cost is quite significant. So, there is benefit from other balance of system to because of the power electronic unit because it is actually sitting closest to the point of common coupling where the energy is being sent out. In this particular case even though the capital cost the cost of the inverter is low you are actually producing 4 percent lower power in this particular case in which case to get the same 2 kilowatt you need 4 percent more panel area. So, your panel cost would go up proportionately. So, you can see that there can be system implications for power electronic choices and it would also be good to have a method for evaluating a power converter choice which take into balance of plant benefits rather than just the power electronic cost. So, if you look at a few examples of say balance of plant benefits say for example, in a photovoltaic system it is a power conversion unit say for an example in a photovoltaic system you might have a power converter which has say MPPT that can be incorporated in it and because now because of your power converter with the MPPT you might be able to produce more energy which means again it reduces the size of the array required. So, you have balance of plant benefit also you might have a situation where maybe because of your topology choice maybe a string inverter or a module inverter rather than a centralized inverter can actually harvest more power which means again you can have a smaller array which is producing more power. So, you might in a similar way if you take a wind turbine some of the early wind turbines where fixed speed just a machine induction machine connected to the grid maybe with some power factor correction they were operating at fixed speed base depending on what the grid frequency is and maybe some limited speed change based on your pulled number changes in your machine. But, if you are able to operate it variable speed with a power converter you could actually operate your wind turbine at the maximum power point and harvest more energy. So, if you are able to capture more energy for a given size blade it might mean that for a fixed power output you can maybe reduce the size of the blade height of the tower etcetera which can actually give you a cost benefits. Also you say you have a power converter which can have a high say rate of change of power can be set at quite rapidly because of higher bandwidth etcetera then you might be able to damp out resonances in the blades tower etcetera which means that you are you can have lesser margin the amount of steel required in the tower etcetera can come down and you can actually reduce a cost of structural cost which is a major cost in things like wind applications. Or if you take an example of a diesel generator if you look at the traditional gensets they will be running at constant speed irrespective of the load. So, to produce a 50 hertz output at providing 230 volts or 415 volts you might operate at the same speed irrespective of whether the genset is fully loaded or half loaded or at no load which means that you are consuming quite a bit of fuel and you might be operating your genset at not the most optimum point. Whereas, if you have a power converter in between which allow you to slow down your genset and your inverter is providing your output waveforms then you can allow your genset to reduce its speed when the load goes down which means that now your fuel consumption can potentially come down and you saw that in systems such as gensets the fuel cost is a major cost. So, because you are now adding a power converter you can reduce a major cost such as fuel which can be attractive. So, such a systems are also used in hybrid vehicles etcetera where your genset your actual IC engine might operate at the maximum efficiency point and the additional torque required might be provided by a electric motor over and above your average torque level that needs to be produced. So, that way you can operate your combustion engine at its best efficiency point and giving you lower fuel consumption. So, similar principle applies to vehicles also. So, one would definitely like to incorporate some of these benefits to the larger systems when you are considering whether to take one particular power conversion technology or some other power conversion technology because one particular technology might be more efficient at capturing some of these benefits. So, we will just look at a quick number of say an example of a wind turbine blade or a wind turbine. So, if you look at the cost breakdown we say assume say 35 percent of the cost of a turbine may be your blade cost there may be some composite materials carbon fiber possibly your tower cost is a major cost balance of plant here you are looking at gear box the generator the yaw pitch systems transformer etcetera your power converter might be just might be just 10 percent of the cost. But then if you look at the flow of energy in such a system say you have the blades may be your gear box and say your objective is to generate one megawatt being injected to the grid and then you can calculate what would be the power input will assume that 40 percent of the energy in the wind is being captured by the blade say 88 percent efficiency in your gear box 98 percent efficiency in your generator and you have say a couple of converter options one might be 95 percent the other might be 96 percent and you can see what would be the energy in the wind that needs to be captured corresponding to the one megawatt output for these two options and so for the 95 percent efficient case your P N P wind is 1 megawatt divided by 0.95 0.98 into 0.88 into 0.4. So, you are talking about 3.05 megawatts and you are looking at the 96 percent case the number corresponds to 3.02 megawatt. So, if you look at the delta P in your wind divided by P output. So, you get the difference which is 3.05 minus 3.02 by 1 which is your output. So, this corresponds to about 3 percent. So, a 1 percent efficiency difference in your inverter implies a upstream efficiency difference of about 3 percent. So, it is magnified by 3. So, the amount of stresses in the blades etcetera can be reduced and you can because your power converter is now sitting at the end of a chain right next to the point of common coupling it forms a crucial part in the link in the overall system and that can be significant upstream benefits even though your cost of the power converter is only 10 percent it can have implications on the balance of plant which is 90 percent of the cost. And another aspect of issue with the cost of energy approach is when you do the cost of energy you may not know your overall system cost upfront. Say you are designing a power converter for a wind turbine you might know the power converter cost roughly, but you do not know your wind turbine cost which where its design may be happening in parallel. So, your overall cost to evaluate cost of energy may not be accurately known, but the power electronic designer might be aware that by adding some particular feature in the power converter operation you can get a benefits in the balance of plant and that might be easier to quantify. Also as we mentioned we do not want to get buried by the cost of the overall system which is much larger than the cost of the power conversion unit. So, before we look at the effective initial cost we look at what would be the ideal characteristics of say a power converter. So, if you look at the ideal power converter if you look at power loss ideal converter should have 0 power loss in reality you might be talking about a converter which might be 95 percent efficiency or something in that range. So, we are talking about power ranges of 100 kilowatt to megawatt level if you are talking about converters which are may be tens of watts 100 watts your efficiency numbers may be lower and if you are talking about power converters which are used in larger transmission systems in HVDC, STATCOM type of applications your efficiency might be as high as 97 99 percent, but here we are looking at an application which might be used in a distribution system. So, we are talking about something of the range of 95 percent. If you look at the ideal volume your ideal volume is 0 your ideal power converter should not occupy any space in say assuming that the volume of the converter depends largely on the type of cooling that you are going to use whether it is natural cooling liquid cooling force dare etcetera we will talk about say 3 to 9 meter cube per megawatt. So, you are talking about on a 3 to 9 into 10 power of 3 cc per kilowatt note that 1000 cc is 1 liter. So, it is about 3 to 9 liters per kilowatt. So, you might look around say maybe you might seen a UPS sitting next to your computer and you may have a 1 kilowatt UPS and its volume may not be much larger than 3 liters in the cabinet if you exclude the battery. So, you can get a range for what the volume would be of typical equipment around you and also it depends on the type of enclosure whether it is dust proof open frame etcetera. If you are looking at weight your ideal power converter has 0 weight whereas, your realistic converter you are talking about 5 tons per megawatt again these are making assumptions of say typical force dare cooling filters being present in the converter etcetera. So, you are talking again of the or if you are talking about a kilowatt you are talking about 5 kg per kilowatt again you may not be familiar with a megawatt power converter you may not you will definitely not lift it single handedly, but you could try lifting a UPS which is there next to your computer and you would say if you ignore the batteries it would cost may be weight may be 4 or 5 kgs if you look at the cost your ideal cost is 0. So, if you look at again the cost which might be realistic again it depends on the application you might have applications where the cost it might be of the form of some consumer goods which is being mass produced. So, the cost might be lower or it might be some custom made product for space application or some strategic military type of application where the cost might be higher, but we are talking about something typical for a megawatt range commercial type of system you are talking about again rupees 50 into 10 to the power of 5 per megawatt. So, again to scale it down you might say on a per kilowatt basis you are talking about 5000 rupees per kilowatt again if you look at a UPS that you might purchase with for your computer in your lab you are talking about 5000 rupees you might be able to purchase in UPS in roughly in that range with some variation around it. Again another important aspect is the failure rate and ideal power converter never fails. So, it is always working whereas, your practical power converter it is failure rate depends on the components the application in which it is being used. So, we will look at the you might have components such as DC link capacitors might have IGBTs which are being cycled thermally you might have inductors transformers etcetera which whose insulation might degrade at higher temperature you might have circuit breakers contactors who have a defined number of cycles before it needs servicing you might have connectors which might experience fatigue after so many mechanical cycles. So, you have equipment where the failure rate is not 0 it is finite. So, depending on the particular application one can actually try to back calculate what your failure rate is and what could be potential replacement durations of within your equipment. .. So, if you look at the ideal power converter it is a ideal middleman who provides all the service, but is invisible it does not take cost any money it is always available there is no failure etcetera, but you are trying to achieve that ideal, but it may not be possible to meet that ideal requirement in all situations, but as a engineer you are trying to make these numbers to get to be as close to 0 as possible. And one thing to also keep in mind is some of these numbers are actually present in a tradeoff form for example, if you try to reduce your power loss your cost might increase similarly if you try to reduce your failure rate again cost could increase if you try to make it more compact by reducing your weight and volume. So, again potentially your cost can increase. So, there is a tradeoff between cost and the performance numbers. So, just trying to make it ideal in terms of performance will magnify the cost and that may not be always going for the highest performance or conversely going for the lowest cost of the power converter may not be the ideal situation. You could also look at now given these previous numbers what these are fun exercises to carry out here you know the cost per kilowatt of a power converter and you also know the weight per kilowatt of the converter. So, you could ask what is the cost per kg of a converter you may not think of power converter as you purchase in kg's, but you could look at if I purchase a equipment what would be the cost per kg or cost per volume. And these are fun exercises to do you could look at equipment that are available around you electrical equipment that are there in your house say consumer items, microwave ovens, mixes, grinders look at their weight, their cost etcetera and look at a cost per kg number and see whether they correspond to some of some do they tend towards some number that you could actually make use of in making rough engineering decisions. So, next we will look at making use of some of these characteristics in deciding to look at it from your effective implications from a effective initial cost perspective when you are looking at a decision to make a take a particular approach and we will look at a simple example of may be purchasing a vehicle. If you look at purchasing a vehicle you might have initial cost the initial cost might be what is the cost of the vehicle in the showroom. So, the cost of the vehicle in the showroom might have the manufacturing cost the margins that the manufacturer wants for producing the equipment it might have some tax element that you have to add you might have some cost initial cost associated with the registration of the vehicle getting license etcetera. So, you might have ongoing cost there can be a number of ongoing cost one major one would be a fuel your petrol cost you might periodically need to go to a mechanic for maintenance you might need spare parts you might have annual insurance payments. So, you would have things that are done on an annual basis and you might also have a end of life cost in which case here it may not be a cost you might get some money back when you sell the vehicle after so many years of operating it. So, you would like to reflect all these cost to your initial point when you are making a decision rather than just making a decision based on what the initial cost is. Because in fact when you are making a decision you are actually not just committing to the initial cost, but actually all the other cost associated with it. So, people talk about it as a net present cost or a net present value effective initial cost etcetera they all imply the same thing and the design methodology by which these costs are evaluated people call it as cradle to cradle design where you are not just looking at the initial upfront cost or the manufacturing cost, but also eventually you might not just sell the used vehicle eventually after a number of sales it might have to be recycled or dismantled or disposed in some manner. So, if all the cost can be put together that particular way of looking at a design is what the effective initial cost is trying to approximate. So, if you look at what goes into the effective initial cost calculation you might have your capital cost which might have the material, labor, markup etcetera you also have upfront cost corresponding to installation commissioning of a DG unit. You might also have shipping cost say your wind turbine may be produced somewhere in Goa it might have to be installed in Tabernardo. So, depending on if you want to ship huge towers blades across multiple states it depends on how big it is how much it weighs if you are trying to install something in a urban area the cost of land in a urban area might be quite high. So, the size, weight, area etcetera can actually reflect on the initial cost. You might also have change in balance of plant cost as we discussed earlier you might have benefits in balance of plant which has to you should be reflected in your effective initial cost. Also we know that a practical power converter has losses. So, ideal power converter would have loss of 0. So, whatever loss is being encoded in the power converter you could look at it as one way as that is a loss that you are incurring or a cost that you are incurring by operating that power converter you are having a fixed annualized loss cost associated with the loss in the power converter. Also you would have the operation and maintenance which can be reflected which might be on an annual basis it can be reflected to the present time. Also depending on the power plant or the type of plant you might have a decommissioning cost. For example, if you are as I mentioned if you have a wind turbine you might be able to get some value above from the scrap steel or copper in the generators etcetera. But you may not be able to get a value from say old electronic e-waste which might be there in your system or suppose it is a nuclear power plant if you want decommission some part which is radioactive that might be a lot of expense in disposing say something which is radioactive. So, depending on what you are trying to dispose there might be different types of decommissioning cost. And the idea is that effective initial cost is does not reflect actual physical amount spent. For example, you are not spending an amount because of cost of losses it is unearned you could have earned more if it was better that is the idea behind it. So, it can be used for a design comparison or making a design and it is not actual number where you can say this is the actual so many lakhs or some amount is the actual physical amount that is there. So, these some of these values are values that are available up front this might be ongoing or future values which are reflected back to the present. And then you could say how could one reflect the cost to the present say if you have amount C today and you are assuming an interest rate R then at the end of one year you might have C into 1 plus R at the end of the second year you might have C into 1 plus R into 1 plus R. So, it would be C into 1 plus R the whole square at the end of your P it would be C into 1 plus R to the power of P. So, if you have a cost C of P in your P if you want to reflect it to the present you can you just have to divide it by 1 plus R to the power of P. And if you have a annualized cost every year you have an equal cost of C A N N and you are assuming that this is going to operate for N years you can reflect the first years cost as C A N N by 1 plus R second years by 1 plus R square. So, you have a summation over 1 to the N years over which you are operating the equipment and the summation can be simplified to a fairly simple expression such as what is shown over here. And then one could also look at how to incorporate other factors we will consider a simple interest rate number R which reflects on a annualized basis, but you could also include terms for depreciation inflation rate taxes etcetera which can be captured by using appropriate values for R depending on the particular application that you are dealing with. So, you with this framework in the next class we will look at an example of how to use the concept of effective initial cost in making use of it in deciding power converter whether it is appropriate what could be a design methodology to make a decision of what power converter use would be appropriate. Thank you.


Hello, my name is Sam Jenkins and I'm Director of Operations at Tech Impact. Today I'm going to be giving you an overview of the five licenses that are offered to you by Microsoft as part of the Office 365 nonprofit offering. I want to start by discussing the things that are included with all Office 365 plans. Those include document collaboration in OneDrive for Business for your personal files for things that are just for one user, and document collaboration among multiple people in SharePoint Online. It includes the Office web app so that you can modify files in a web-based version of Word, Excel, PowerPoint, and OneNote. It includes a 50 gigabyte mailbox with Exchange Online, so that's 50 gigabytes of storage for your email, calendars, and contacts. And it includes social collaboration with Yammer. All of that is included with all of the plans. Also included is an SLA or a service level agreement. Microsoft guarantees that Office 365 will be available 99.99% of the time. You're not going to do better than that with an on-premise server. And also 24-7 technical support. So that means that you, as an administrator, can pick up the phone and call Microsoft anytime you want. If we take a look at the Office 365 Business Essentials plan, it does include all of that functionality I just discussed. I want to mention that this particular license is limited to 300 users. So if you have more than 300 users, this is not a good fit for you. In that case, you would simply move up to the Office 365 nonprofit E1 plan. And that E1 or enterprise plan includes everything in Business Essentials and also includes unlimited seats. So you can have as many users as you would like to have in Office 365. And that is a real commitment from Microsoft. As many employees as you have, Microsoft will give you free E1 licenses. So let's move on and talk about some of the offerings that are available to nonprofits at a discount. The first is Office 365 Nonprofit Business Premium. This particular license, like the Business Essentials, does have a 300 seat limit. So you can only have up to 300 seats for this particular license. You can see that added into this license from the Business Essentials is the mobile apps and the Office desktop applications. What that means is that you are getting a copy of Microsoft's Office that you can use on your local computer and in the mobile app at a subscription model. So every month you pay that $2 per user per month and you get access to Office 2016 for your local machine and Excel and Word and PowerPoint for your mobile device. Next up is the Office 365 Nonprofit E3 license. So this license does not have any limit in the number of licenses that you can have. So again, the Business Premium is limited to 300 and the E3 is unlimited licenses. You will note that this includes everything in the Nonprofit Business Premium. Something very critical that is not included in this chart that I want to mention is that the E3 license includes some significant security benefits over the free E1 license. That includes data loss prevention and end-end email encryption and file encryption. Moving on, let's take a look at the Office 365 Nonprofit E5 license. This is a new license that is available to nonprofit organizations. The main thing that is added to the E5 licenses is integration with phone systems. And that takes two main paths. The first is that you can set up video conferences and audio conferences where users can dial in using a phone. So if you are using any of the other licenses, Skype for Business is included and you can set up a conference that can include people inside and outside of your organization. But everyone would need to be using audio through their computer so they would need to have a headset or speakers and a microphone on their machine. With the E5 license you can add a dial-in conference number so that some users can dial in using their phones and others can use audio on the computer and everyone can hear each other. The other thing that is included is something called Cloud PBX. And what that allows you to do is it allows you to assign extensions to individual users and you can actually call each other using Skype for Business the same way you would with a traditional phone system. The other thing that is included with the E5 license is advanced threat protection which provides advanced email scanning functionality to keep your users safe. I wanted to take another look quickly at the difference between the three different E or Enterprise plans. Again, the E1 license is free. The E3 license is $4.50 per user per month. And the E5 license is $10 per user per month. So you will see that with the E3 license the Office Desktop app and the mobile apps are included but there is also a great deal of other functionality that is included. Usually organizations that are more compliance driven or security driven organizations that need to comply with various federal or local regulations are going to be the ones that are purchasing E3 licenses. So if that is you then you might want to take a close look at this. So with the E3 licenses we are including unlimited mailbox and legal hold. The legal hold is very important. It allows you to place a mailbox in a status where deleted items are not permanently removed so you can go back and get them. And that might be important if you are ever involved in any litigation. Data loss prevention which allows you to make sure that users are not sending confidential or privileged information outside of your network and that they are not saving files with privileged information into insecure locations in SharePoint or OneDrive. File preservation and e-discovery so that you can make sure that files that are deleted or modified aren't permanently removed from the system and you can go back and get them no matter how long it's been. And then online info path form completion which is a somewhat esoteric feature of SharePoint that some organizations that are migrating from SharePoint on-premise may require. The E5 license takes all of that security and adds in the advanced threat protection, the dial-in conferencing, and advanced delve and analytics. And that is a somewhat new functionality of Office 365 that gives you some capabilities to better understand how your users are spending their time and what they are doing. The mobile applications and the Office desktop applications can be added to the E1 license along with some of the other functionality. So if you only need some pieces of the E3 license, you may not need to pay $4.50. You may be able to simply add that on to the E1 license. So if we take a look at this slide, the most common add-on is that online archiving add-on. That gives users an unlimited mailbox and gives you the ability to place that mailbox on legal hold so that you can go back and retrieve deleted or modified email if you ever need to. You can also add on that Office Pro Plus so that is the downloadable Office to your desktop. It also includes the mobile applications for $2 per user per month. So if you just need the Office licenses, you can actually get an E1 license and add that $2. If you're interested in the advanced threat protection for advanced email scanning, that's $0.65 per user per month. You can add that on to an E1 license as well or to an E3 license. I also mentioned that dialing phone numbers and receiving calls from other people on their phones with Skype for Business requires an add-on to the E5 license. And that add-on is $12 for domestic calling and $24 for international calling. And that price is per user per month. Finally, I wanted to mention some other services that are available to you as part of the Office 365 family. The first is something called Enterprise Mobility Suite. This allows you to manage your Windows machines and your mobile devices remotely. Do remote light, make sure that they are encrypted, make sure that users are using them properly, even install software remotely. Dynamics CRM is an online constituent relationship management system that allows you to track your contacts and your grantees and your grand tours in an online database. Power BI is a very powerful web-based visualization tool. You can connect this to an Excel spreadsheet or that old-access database you're still using. And you can create very powerful web-based visualizations that anyone can view. That's it for this video. We hope this has been helpful. Please let us know if you do have any questions.


Good evening and welcome to another edition of Ask Me Anything. My name is Jay Gerber and we're down here this Monday evening with a live call-in program. We have an interesting topic this evening, one that probably will be of interest to just about everyone who's watching. It's Retirement Planning and I have as my guest this evening Larry Olson who is a principal with Carbohal Olson Financial Services here in Davis and Larry welcome to the program. Thanks Jay, it's a pleasure to join you tonight. Before we get into our topic which is retirement and how to plan for it, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself. You have a pretty familiar face. I think people have seen you around town for a good many years. How'd you come to Davis and what have you been doing since you arrived? I've been in Davis since 1976. I went to school at Sac State but my wife was going to school here at Davis and we ended up getting married in 1977 and we had worked in different restaurants. I myself worked at A.J. Bumps. I think we all remember A.J. Bumps. And I was there on their opening night and my wife worked down the highway in Dixon at Cattleman's and in 1983 we had the the the gumption to take on our own restaurant and have been at Cafe California ever since. So about seven years ago my wife suggested that maybe one of us leave the business and start a new career and she made the decision that I would be the one to do that. You enjoyed the short straw? Not true. So I decided to pursue a career in the life insurance industry as I knew a recruiter for New York life. Yes. And he convinced me that I had a career in the financial services field and so for a couple of years I sold life insurance and quickly discovered that not all of a person's financial goals and aspirations can be solved through the use of life insurance and there was many other avenues for me to delve into mainly investments. Yes. So I got my securities license in 1996 and have been working diligently in the investment and planning field since. Well I'm guessing that many of the people that come to see you have an interest in retirement and planning for their retirements. I know there are other financial goals people have educating children buying properties who knows what they want to do but retirement is one that seems to affect just about everyone I guess at some point or another in our lives we will all probably retire. What is the kind of the broad definition of retirement in your from your perspective I mean what is it that. Well from the financial planning side of things retirement issues probably consume about 70 to 80 percent of what we do in our office. Yes. It takes on many different aspects from helping people you know set some goals look at what kind of lifestyle they want to have in retirement and coming up with a plan that they can put into place starting with very small investments sometimes as they grow with age their investing capabilities grow and hopefully by the time they get to that golden year we have planned well enough that they've met their goals and it's a fairly you know long ongoing process it's not a when should someone begin planning for their retirement there a particular age hopefully as early as possible but I think in reality if you can get started in the early part of your working career with a 401k plan or a pension of some type the advantages are tremendous to start in your 20s. Realistically most people don't think too much about it till they get to that magic age of about age 35 where they figure out that they're just not going to you know live forever and and that there is an end to their working career and they may want to start planning for that. I'd like to ask you to expand a little bit on you mentioned pensions and the 401k plan before we have you tell us a little more about those two terms. I want to remind everyone this is a live program so if you have a question about your retirement plan or a general question about retirement please give us a call at 757-2419.  Okay good let's hope we hear from her. All right you mentioned 401k what is a 401k? Well 401k is probably the most popular plan for private businesses in this day and age and typically what it is is a salary reduction plan where an individual may have money drawn out of their paycheck and sent off to an investment management company and then they can have a variety of decisions on how that money would be invested from a conservative to an aggressive type of an investment typically in in the mutual fund side although many 401ks now have capability for you to invest in individual stocks and individual bonds. I noticed in this morning's Sacramento B there was a lead story on 401ks I think for the first time in anyone's history the average value of the 401k has declined a little in year 2000 as opposed to 1999 and it's down even a little bit more in 2001 but that's kind of the nature of investing and markets so no big surprise in that in that story.  Are there limits on the amount of money a person could put into his or her 401k plan? In a 401k plan you can put up to $10,500 a year out of your own salary reduction yes you can have as much as 25 percent of your income put into a 401k plan when you include matching contributions and potential profit sharing that employers might do then you're getting into the more complicated types of plans that some employers will. Are there other plans that are popular and available to most working people? Well in Davis of course with the University of California right here there's a tremendous number of employees that live here in town and so we see a lot of work with a lot of people that have what's known as a 403b plan. 403b plans were started back in the early 60s by John Kennedy as a way to encourage people to go into non-profit employment and also into teaching so they made it available to both of those groups. 403b plans generally work very much like a 401k they have a little bit looser guidelines but typically they're kind of in an interchangeable type of plan. Alright now Larry when people come to you I'm guessing that one of the questions that comes up has to do with social security and the role of social security which we've had in this country for 65 years now plays in the average retirement. What do you talk what do you tell people? Well the common thought process now is amongst most investors is that social security is not going to be there for them. Do yourself have that feeling? I hesitate to go that far I think for unless maybe you're in your early 20s I think it's actually funded through the year 2030 right now so there will be a certain amount set aside for each of us as we move along. It certainly is not playing as large a role in the retirement process as it once did nor do I think people are counting on it as a major part of their retirement plan but right now it's a fairly significant portion as many times as much as 50% and many people we see that that's really their only retirement income. For someone who has contributed for I think it's 40 quarters into the plan I guess what you are sent monthly is determined by how much you paid in over your lifetime. Exactly. Yeah and that number could go as high as I think we're in the 11 to $1,200 range in the peak I think it's still under $1,300 for an individual right now per month or as couples it'd be more than that of course right depending on both they paid in. Well let's get to some of the more specific questions and again if you have questions out there we hope you'll call us at 757-2419 our guest this evening is Larry Olson. Larry what are some of the more common mistakes people make with their retirement plans? Well I think the most common mistake is that people don't get started until maybe they perceive it to be too late but you know we always encourage young clients that we see to get started as early as possible so that's probably the number one mistake is that it's one of those things that you put off in life many times especially for younger people they're not in a career that has a plan option available to them that is publicized on a daily basis to them so for many service employees people working for small businesses there's not a plan in effect for them and so they tend not to put it aside for themselves. Sometimes it takes it's a habit I guess that has to be developed and I know some parents like to start it with their children the idea that you actually save some money out of every paycheck even if it's a small paycheck at the beginning of your working career you know I think I've heard that phrase pay yourself first or some such thing and heavens I've not been able to follow that early on anyway but it's a good habit I know to take a portion a percentage of your income and well I think put it into something educating children about the financial world is something that every parent should take into account at some point that they and if they don't have the expertise to do it they have their financial advisor have their children into their office talk to them about mutual funds stocks how they how they work what happens yeah and give them an idea and then yeah like for myself my daughter you know we've tried to include her in the discussions that we have regarding our long-term financial goals set some goals for her and you know have have taught her to look in the paper and watch certain stocks and many of her classes now is in elementary school have a certain segment on that really and and she's experienced in two of her classes so I think it's something that the educational field should delve into a little bit more Larry I'm wondering if we if it would be helpful tell me if it's not helpful if we could maybe talk a little more specifically about a kind of a typical couple let's say a couple in their mid-thirties with you know not too much income not too little income but maybe one salary one part of the one salary is fifty thousand the other is 35 so there's a total combined income of eighty five thousand dollars there's a home involved probably with some mortgage payments still going on a couple of children what what kind of a saving guide would you recommend for for this kind of couple well as far as planning goes we try to approach retirement planning as just part of their overall financial plan yes and I always liken it to a mail slot cupboard where you have a number of different slots available and you set targets and goals for each one of your financial issues that you're working with so I like to see my clients have an emergency fund yes right off that's probably the most important thing I think that they have three to six months at the rule of thumb three six months and depending on what type of financial stability and job stability they have if they're if they're both individually employed and in fairly risky small businesses say a restaurant or a car wash possibly that those types of businesses fail so somebody like that may want to have a little bit more of an emergency fund set up yeah then beyond the emergency fund then we we we go through a process of trying to determine what's the most important next financial goal typically it's retirement yes then it would work towards college education for their kids yeah sometimes they have goals such as they want to upgrade their home and move to a new home or they want a second home for potentially to live in a retirement or and to enjoy in their you know leisure cabin in the mountains or something like that so it's never too early to start saving for those types of things and then as we set priorities we'll we'll target a certain amount of money each month to go into each one of those slots all right and for retirement you know I would love to see my clients be able to save 10 of their overall income in the in the wage category that we're talking about yes about 8500 to $10,000 a year now let's say this this couple is successful and being able to save that kind of money what are what are their options is and how should it be invested I mean if this kind of gets to the question of risk and I'm sure you discuss risk with your clients well risk versus reward is one of the things that we spend quite a bit of time with mutual funds are a great vehicle for small investors when you look at investing into the stock market if you want to say you have a thousand dollars to invest you can buy you know say 10 shares of a hundred dollar stock and let's just say it's General Motors yes for the sake of argument you're placing your whole thousand dollars into that one company's fortune yep whether or not they make money and are rewarded through investors perception of how successful that company is that also affects the price of when you're investing in mutual funds what you're investing in is a pooled fund so you have my money your money hundreds thousands sometimes millions and some and some funds like Fidelity Magellan things like that yeah you'll have a million investors putting money into this thing and then the investment manager is then picking maybe between 100 to 200 sometimes as many as 300 stocks so you are diversifying diversification so for a small investor you you decrease your volatility by sure diversifying in such a manner so mutual funds are probably where we start with people yes when they get to a certain level and I like to see my clients not even think about investing in individual stocks until they have at least a hundred thousand dollar portfolio of mutual funds yeah how I'm just this is a little aside because we're all aware of the fact that the investment markets here in the United States and worldwide for that matter have not had their best 18 months or so dating back to March of 2000 people still encourage people to look to the good mutual funds to get started well yeah there's an old saying you want to buy low sell high yes unfortunately investor psychology is one that they want to invest when things are going well and and typically for long-term type of investment you want to invest at regular intervals so you're catching both the lows and the highs which brings down your average cost on your purchases so that's what they call dollar cost averaging this is where you invest a set dollar amount every month every quarter so so we are encouraging people to continue investing even through the bad times for their long-term goals on a regular basis if you've come into a lump sum of money say through retirement or through inheritance or a sale of property or something like that then you might want to be very cautious in this type of a market as we've seen it can drop fairly quickly so you want to look at again diversifying across a number of different asset classes stocks bonds and when i'm talking both stocks and bonds that means stock mutual funds also yes bond mutual funds and certain amount of cash money markets and those types of investments and there's other types of fixed income investment pools such as senior floating rate funds that are basically loan funds so larry how does one decide how much of a nest they are going to need at the time they start this retirement period in their lives that's a very good question and that's one that we spend a significant amount of time with because that's that's one thing that most people want to know right off the bat is how much am i going to need in retirement yes so we go through a series of questions again and a questionnaire trying to determine what kind of lifestyle they're going to want in retirement how much typically we'll start with what are they making now and minus their putting money into retirement their house payment things that they they probably won't have to do when they are retired we can subtract out from there and so we can project that over a series of years so if they're in their early 40s we know we have roughly 18 to 20 years to work we can take into account a certain rate of inflation three to four percent somewhere in that range which it historically runs at lately it's been a little bit lower than that but inflation is the big key there and then we use assumed rates of return on their account i like to use eight percent as an assumed rate of return over time um figuring that that's very conservative and when we're looking at money that we know we're going to need at a certain point in time i like to err on the side of conservatism yes so using those assumptions we can set a target for how much we're going to have and then how what it's going to take to get there so if they're currently putting in $200 a month and they have $20,000 in their retirement account and to get to their goal they may have to raise that 250 or 300 a month yes and try to to get a little bit better rate of return so we look at how we might influence their their investment decisions and and get them to take maybe a little bit more risk or less risk sometimes now getting to that that nest egg again the purpose of that is to provide income for the duration of one's life and uh what what is i assume i think you made reference to this earlier that in retirement the the amount of income necessary is probably less hopefully your your homes paid off your kids are educated you may have other kinds of expenses but is there a rule of thumb i mean in retirement you need 60 percent of what you maybe had i think a conventional planner would would would say 60 to 70 percent of your of your current income or your working income yes is what you'd need in retirement i think realistically most people like to think that they're going to live with the same same amount of same amount of income um and i think uh with two income two wage earners in today's society it's pretty common that they're capable of saving that kind of uh of a nest egg yes and putting that yeah forward so okay so many times that there's the old philosophy of your your tax liability will be less in retirement we're finding that that's not necessarily the case that people many times are paying as high a percentage in retirement as they were in their working years so larry i got a question i want to ask you before i do i again would like to encourage our viewers this evening if you have any question about your retirement situation we have a great expert down here and larry ulson so please feel free to pick up the phone and give us a call i think the numbers on the screen larry um when i was growing up it seemed like the magic retirement age was 65 uh you know all my dad's my my friends my my friends parents worked till they were 65 and then they were kind of fully retired i sense that's different now than it was 25 50 years ago people are retiring earlier uh some people are choosing to work even though they could fully retire later they want to keep active what what kind of things are people planning on what what do they tell you well the whole retirement planning uh industry and and retirement people's view of retirement has changed dramatically and mainly around the idea that we used to work for the same company for 35 40 years we had a pension when we retired we typically retired at age 65 and nobody or very few people actually saved in a qualified retirement account meaning a pre-tax account they might save on the outside and invest in properties and and stocks and and and such but it's only been fairly a new phenomenon the last 25 to 20 years somewhere in that range that 401ks and other types of similar salary reduction plans have become popular as major employers have moved away from providing such lucrative pensions and have put company pension and have put the responsibility on to the individual employee so that has given employees a much greater stake in their retirement and much more flexibility and and many of them have chosen because they've been diligent savers have been very good at it and invested well have found that they can retire at an earlier age so it's not uncommon that people have a retirement age goal of 60 or or many people you always hear that I want to retire at 50 realistically I mean most people don't retire till let's say somebody has a retirement goal of 60 years of age because this kind of leads into my next question how many years should one plan on their nest egg supporting them I mean you what this gets into life expectancies I imagine what do you tell people well modern medicine has has dramatically altered the landscape in this area and so I typically now if you're a healthy 65 year old we try to plan on 30 years of retirement and if for people who are in their 20s that that we do projections for many times will project out past the age 100 so and when you're looking at 60 70 years of compound interest the numbers get staggering yeah and a half a percent the rate of return can mean as much as five to ten million dollars in in your overall nest egg at the end so it's it's pretty important to start paying attention so let's let's assume you've started early you've been a good diligent saver you're at that age 60 65 that you've always felt you wanted to retire and this nest egg is there and it's it's a healthy one how do you want to draw on that I mean are there there are obviously some options all right well for qualified money and then again that means money that has been put away pre-tax there are minimum distribution requirements so at age 70 and a half you have to start taking yes money you can't wait any longer than that or you start paying penalties exactly and the penalties get kind of severe if you don't take them out so but typically people will start wanting to access their retirement accounts at their retirement age of say 60 or so and and you want to focus your money and your investment portfolio your your asset allocation that means how your money is invested number one you probably are going to get more conservative with your money because you're going to be accessing it you do want to take into account that you're going to probably live for 35 40 years in retirement if your health is good at age 60 so you're going to want some growth in there so diversification is a must and then you're going to want to start accessing your money from those points that fit your overall asset allocation portfolio I suppose there's I mean these the options kind of range on the on the most conservative I annuities I know are one way of people have done right and that's a typical pension plan usually it's just an annuitization process of a lump sum of amount of money so if say you're working for the university of California you're retiring at age 65 they're going to guarantee you a certain wage every month until you die until you die you can take the second option of having it be for you both you and your spouse yes and then there's different options like that so you know you can work in that direction of of taking a pension such as that and supplementing it with your own 403 b plan or 401k plan and taking money on a regular basis typically you want to pay attention to taxation so you're not taking too much and maybe losing some of your money to taxes that you might have not had to do so Larry I hate to cut you off at this point because I'm getting the signal that we're about out of time this has really been a fast-moving program I knew I can talk I just wonder if you could summarize are there you know what are the big Larry Olson guidelines for successful retirement you have two or three points that you'd like to leave our listeners with this year well one is get started as early as possible and be true to your plan yes be realistic with it and and follow through on a regular basis and monitor your plan at least annually and if you feel intimidated by the process don't be afraid to contact a financial advisor and work with them the professionals in our field make up for whatever you might have to pay them on a typical basis I know that's true well like to thank our guest Larry Olson who has been here with us this evening telling us about retirement planning and how we can all become better at that this has been the July edition of ask me anything we'll be back here next month second Monday and I think that's the 13th of August not sure what our topic will be we may have to follow up with you Larry because I have a feeling there were a lot of things left unsaid well my mom never got through yeah she didn't get through here so again thank everyone for joining us and from the studios at Davis Community Television we'd like to bid everyone a good evening