What a wonderful conference it's been and it's going to continue to be today. Let us welcome, firstly we have this beautiful lady here, Frances Sue. Frances has a deep calling to go beyond the concepts and lived a life that is guided by Holy Spirit. She graciously accepted to be a messenger, not a member, a messenger of God. So let's welcome Frances and of course he's all color coordinated, happy artist with the venue. David Hofmeister is a beautiful example of the awakened mind and we're all walking in each other home and David's walking with us and he's shining a really bright light for us to follow and I know I'm very grateful for that and I'm sure you all are as well. So welcome David and here we are, hand you over to these lovely people. So good to be back in Melbourne again. See a lot of dear friends and a lot of new friends and this is part of a world tour for us so we've been over in China and Japan and now we've dropped down here to Melbourne. So we feel we're going to have a very intimate day with you and we feel very fortunate to have the whole day with you because we can just dive deep into this experience together and it gives a nice spaciousness so that if you want to raise topics or questions Frances and I are very transparent so don't hesitate to ask any question. You don't have to try to be spiritually correct here with us, you can just ask anything and the feeling is we're all in this together so there are no private thoughts, there are no secrets and that's what we're learning as we connect with God, that God wants to be fully revealed in us and through us and the way that that happens is when we are able to be transparent and able to see that these egoic thoughts are not who we are and they are never a part of our true reality in our identity. So I feel what we all bring and what we offer is a lot of examples of living of course and miracles in our life. A lot of metaphors, we could say parables of David and parables of Frances that we offer that will shed some light in how to live this in daily life because the curriculum is highly individualized for all of us but we can learn from each other, from each other's experiences and it can be a way that parables collapse at the time, make it shorter so we get that resonance in our hearts and we go, oh I see, I see, I understand. We're here to awaken, we're not here to delay, we're not here to suffer we're not here to struggle. Those are egoic reactions to the light. You might say the ego is resisting the light and as long as we're identified with the ego it seems like our reactions even though we're experiencing its feelings and we want to dive deep into a practical experience so quickly that we are not any longer experiencing the ego as a reality that we literally unplug from the ego and experience ourselves as love, as divine love and light and we just flow with that divine love and light. So I just want to welcome everybody, I'm so grateful that you're here I'm so grateful that we can share this time together and let Francis introduce himself. Yeah, thank you for having me today here. It's really an honor to actually come back to Australia to have met you because I left China where I grew up from, I moved to Australia to Sydney and my life just changed completely here. That's where I actually came across A Course in Miracles and I couldn't stop reading about it, I couldn't stop talking about it I thought I need to start a group just so that I can talk about it whenever I want to talk about it. So I started a meet-up group in Sydney, A Course in Miracles meet-up group and from the second time when people came to the meet-up group they started to talk to me about someone called David Hofmeister and now looking back at almost like the whole purpose of me setting up that group is eventually lead me to meet David and be able to really see how deep this pathway is and also be able to devote my life to this because what happened for me in the past few years of really going deep with the Course is that I realized it actually undid my intellectual mind so much that inevitably it connected me with this inner teacher that this book is really pointing to and this is such a journey of experience and this is really why we are so in love with this pathway and with everything that comes across this pathway and curriculum because it really gets in touch, gets us in touch with this internal teacher and the love that we are. So it is an honor to come back and thank you for inviting me I can't wait to share about anything that you want to hear about along this pathway and answer any question you have. I'm here at your service. Thank you. Thanks so much for Kate and Patricia for inviting us and Sophie and what a wonderful auditorium we have today. Some of you know I like to use movies and movie clips, audio-visual and we have the capacity for that today too so as the time allows we may just go to the big screen and in fact I'm feeling that big screen pretty strong. Some of you have heard of Monty Python and some of you know John Cleese he has been such a gift, thank goodness he's part of our wake-up team and created a university setting so we thought we would open up today with John Cleese inviting us into our hearts in a university setting so here's our friend Jeffrey take it away lights, camera, action You are going to write a daily journal and guess what you will start first thing tomorrow morning sit down and you are going to tell the journal your name and about yourself, your life and your world things you don't know the clues to getting those secrets it's like, is that being free day knowing what you think, knowing what you feel is feeling revealing doors are being opened boxes that have not been rummaged in for quite some time it's not being looked through later as we wind the course down and I read your journals I shouldn't know you intimately, perhaps better than anyone else knows you except of course yourself excuse me, sir, what do you mean read our journals I don't think that's going to work for me I'm a very private person but you may as well read now because there is really no point in your stay what's not that, it's not that comfortable interesting she throws reading someone's journal I'm here to give you the tools to help you to it execs a full look at the worst who's Thomas Rodney, is that what you're asking yes, I am are you a college man, Mr. Schiller? community college, two years but I believe education is going to always take you so far it's absolutely true but will you, yes, it will clone you well but leave you cold and alone and undone I promise, I don't choose to leave very well, so when I ask you to terminate your journal for me and me alone to read just do it down to the spelling it's a thing to do here that's the way everyone should start out their course in miracles practice with a good laugh and prepared, like Thomas Hardy said to look at the full extent of the worst see the human condition as we know it is just the surface projection of an unconscious mind that Carl Jung called the shadow so what Thomas Hardy was pointing to was saying in order to really know yourself, know the truth it takes looking at the full extent of the worst that is in you or seems to be in you because we've been tricked to think that it's who we are these are dark thoughts and beliefs in our mind when it's actually an imposter masquerading as ourself using the power of our mind to act as a parasite feeding off the powerful mind of the child of God and using the power of that mind to make a fabrication to make a false self an unreal self and an unreal world that keeps us distracted from be still and know that I'm gone from the still journey that meditation takes us to that all great spiritual traditions have taken us to that all the mystics and avatars and saints all point to this still state of mind you could call it nirvana, you could call it the kingdom of heaven you could call it whatever you want they're taking us in to that state of mind so when you work with a course of miracles Jesus comes right out and says about his workbook at the conclusion of the workbook that this course is a beginning and not an end that we are not going to reach that state of mind or we've reached the truth through words but the ego made up the words and the spirit can use anything that the ego made and even though words are symbols and symbols twice removed from reality they could point us back to that leaping point in our minds where we drop and we sink inward into that stillness that Jesus called the kingdom of heaven within so I think this has been an amazing conference because we had amazing talks on the first day we had experiential exercises there's been lots of joy socializing, coming to know like-minded people from around here locally and from around Australia as a way of Holy Spirit saying relax, I've got it just come and relax and enjoy the ride don't make too much of this don't get caught up too much into theories or into fears and doubts just keep coming, keep coming deeper and deeper in and then with Gary's humor yesterday the beautiful teachings and metaphysics it's another invitation to say relax, laugh come closer, come deeper because the experience is what you've always wanted and you were just looking outside of yourself you were looking to the objects and images of time and space to satisfy yourself but they will never satisfy you these images were made by the ego in one sense we could say they're like idle images they've been made to keep your attention on the surface of consciousness and keep you from going much, much deeper but the call of spirituality is very deep of course the miracles actually we've been having some lunches with the publisher Judy Scutch and during one of the lunches she said that basically the publishing of the course and the dissemination of the course are part of what Ken Watney called Plan B and so Judy was always like Plan B I mean all this work we're doing publishing and translating is Plan B what is Plan A if all of this is Plan B and Ken said the actual living experience of what the course points to that you are guided to give yourself over to the happy dream you are guided to give yourself over to the real world which Jesus calls the real world because this forgiven world is the goal of all practice and you don't want to get delayed in the practice you don't want to get arrested or held back by the practicing tools you have to remember all those tools are just pointing me to an experience that is within me, within my mind and that's what we're going for and that's what we're going to be sharing about today because when I first picked up the course I popped open to a number of passages as answers to prayers but when I really was praying and saying what is really important to Jesus what is the most important thing this is a big book I remember opening up to this course will be believed entirely or not at all and that's a very uncompromising statement in other words no bonus points you don't get any bonus points when you go to open to the gate of heaven you have to go all the way with this where you won't receive the benefits of what's offered you can't really just use this course to brighten up your personal life because your personal life is a mask that's what persona means it's mask and you won't be satisfied with the mask you must drop beneath the mask and we couldn't say you must drop the mask of personality and of time and space to enter into the kingdom of heaven and you won't be satisfied with anything less than the experience of who you are how beautiful that John Cleese comes out and says starts off with who are you who am I I'll see you next week we need professors like that here we are in a university imagine coming to a big lecture hall like this and maybe fewer like me and I took so many classes that I would try to move towards the back and I would do daydreaming and the back seats I'd get as far back as I could and I'd be daydreaming but if I had a professor like that and asked me those questions you better believe I would engage because that is the most engaging question there could ever be who am I truly really so arts life has turned into this devotional prayer of every second of every minute of every day into living this experience and I remember going through the whole course and I was getting all lit up and when you started to get to chapter 30 and chapter 31 I was like oh yeah rules for decision thank you I need that when he was talking about self versus self concept I kept reading that section over and over because I said oh I see what you're saying you're saying that everything I believe in everything that I'm identified with in this world is part of a self concept that was made to take the place of my Christ identity and that's why Jesus and Buddha and all the mystics and saints have said empty your mind of the contents of consciousness as long as your consciousness is focused on these false images false identities and you can't know who you really are so really it's a course in miracles but it's also a course in unlearning and emptying the mind of everything you think you think and think you know and when I got back to that self concept versus self section he said salvation is nothing more than the escape from concepts he also made it very clear that forgiveness is the only helpful concept of all the millions, billions trillions of concepts in the sleeping mind there's only one concept that leads you out of all the rest and that's forgiveness is the conceptual learning goal of the course but it is an experiential course it is not meant to be simply a play of intellectual ideas it is not meant to be an intellectual endeavor here we are at a university and we're coming together for a different purpose other than learning things about the world we're here to unlearn things and to learn to forgive now he also says in that section that you will make many self concepts as learning goes along so some of you have noticed as you progressed through this seeming lifetime that your concept of yourself has changed from when you were a child from when you were a teenager your concept goes undergoing changes and I would say as we give the self concept in our mind of the Holy Spirit it will continue to undergo a lot of changes because as Gary said yesterday you will not be hurled into reality and the reason you won't be hurled in is because you will be given step by step concepts that you can still relate to as you keep unwinding and loosening and even course of miracles teacher course of miracles student those are just concepts too those will go by as well but some of us had thought okay it's a little awkward I never thought I would be using words like miracle worker or teacher of God but here we are and we start to let the spirit play with us with those concepts for a while everything over when I met Francis it was very clear that she was very determined to go all the way with the course and she traveled around to many different countries where I was speaking and she had to deal with things that most everybody deals with in the human race you set certain things in motion whether it's education whether it's business whether it's family whether it's things to do with politics whatever you set in motion the Holy Spirit and Jesus are saying give it to me and let me start using what you believe in so I can unwind you from what you believe in and take you higher and higher and higher in consciousness toward that abstract love and light that is the Christ that is pure spirit but you have to be unwound from your identification with these false concepts and identities because they aren't who you are they're just stepping stones along the way the spirit will never destroy anything that the sleeping son of God believes in it's just a reinterpretation of what the son of God believes in so that the son of God can awaken to know the Christ the light, the love that is our national inheritance so with Francis she had progressed from lots of years of education from business, working in finance from having your own financial management business right there in Sydney to having a husband that is really on the world's scale it would be a very successful life she had really attained and achieved that success of the world that says you need to keep pointing in that direction otherwise you could really suffer if you are not a success there's only two ways that the ego looks at that it's success in the world and failure and to it you must succeed knock you off the pedestal as soon as you succeed anybody because it's a death wish it doesn't really know what success is even when you seem to succeed it will always throw lots of things to knock you off that pedestal but for Francis she just said ok I want to join in fully and that's been quite a journey it's been a very practical journey of unwinding from these concepts and letting yourself be used in amazing the records ways yeah at the beginning I did talk about some major steps that I've taken in order to free up my life but really free up my mind to allow myself to devote my mind to the practice but many years later I realized that was the beginning that was really not the hardest part of this journey not to scare you but the what is happening is so much more fulfillment that is waiting that Jesus actually has a plan for us that this plan is so fulfilling and yet we were so contained with a little plan that we somehow designed our mind and it's about nothing and because of that what our powerful mind is meant for is never really you know is never going to have this opportunity to achieve what is meant for and there is a huge suffering and pain for the mind that is used for something that is just not there so I noticed that for myself to achieve this major transformation not really about a person's journey or a body's transformation it's really about this mind's transformation from believing in something that is so small and concrete and specific and just conceptual beliefs to completely rise above it this whole process needs a help, needs a helper needs a guide that is a very profound realization that I realized that the mind that is stuck in the matrix cannot wake itself up and I tried you know with a very very intellectual mind when I first came across the Course in Miracles the course was helpful because it fed it it fed my mind to be able to understand it and analyze the ego and also trying to find a way out trying to figure out a formula that applies to a specific situation how to forgive I want a formula that is what the mind energy was devoted to until gradually somehow while I kept practicing and practicing what happened was the mind started to relax and draw all these blueprints that it draw for itself and started to come for something that is very very simple just ask and wait and receive which the ego mind does not understand how things can be this simple how the answer can be this simple because the problems are so complicated and so fragmented and so specific but the Course actually just says in the Course the ego believes in specifics and is reliant on specifics to maintain the separation the answer is very is unified answer comes from this source that is abstract but yet the correction must happen you know we have to allow the correction to happen even at the specifics level so that's where these two meet you know we don't just come from this specific life and situations and grievances and irritations to say I'm all love and I will just affirm that 10 times a day is really good or just saying I forgive I forgive I forgive that's not how it worked you know for me is we have to allow the specifics to be corrected not by myself by something that is really inside of ourselves and yet it's a little foreign to us we have to consistently invite this guide over to say solve this for me help me because there is a sentence that is very striking of course it says creation and communication are synonymous creation and communication are synonymous why is that so important that means to know our creator we have to be like him and to be like him we have to be a communicator communication device Jesus says the only use of the body by the Holy Spirit is communication device that is something that we in our last practice again and again and again watch how we want to use the body for anything else but communication device for getting some pleasure for getting anything getting for attacking for separating but Jesus said okay the only use as long as you still believe in the body is to use it for communication device but I will say actually this mind is a communication device our mind energy is to be spent on communicating with the Holy Spirit and that's it that's it to the stand we can give over our mind to the Holy Spirit we will experience peace and joy and I feel like for me Holy Spirit was such a foreign concept I came to Australia as an atheist I did not know any spiritual book or spiritual idea I think the first book that was a little time for me I picked it up I wouldn't have picked it up unless it actually it's written on the cover that is written by someone who is a Yale graduate and I have to have that kind of credential for my mind to even be able to believe that has some credit that I can spend some time looking into it but from that kind of close down mind the spirit can crack it open and it's not something this body did because behavior, any level for me including behavior has no creative power what does that mean then it does not cause anything it doesn't cause you to wake up whatever you do what causes anything is a desire and a motivation that motivates that so this whole journey for me is a journey to start to open up to okay maybe I can rely on something else other than me and I can call upon him in the middle of a crisis but also in the middle of other times not just crisis but all throughout the day start the day with the call of the spirit start the day start the night start the sleep every moment is devoted to this connection to this communication with him and that happens you know in that in that desire in that connection, in that communication with him my mind started to really spend and open up and behavior happens perception changes belief drops concepts drops yeah it's really a gift when you have that turnaround in mind of that sometimes it can even be a jolt in mind like oh my gosh I've been moving in the wrong direction and sometimes it even comes with this feeling like I've been moving for a long, long time in the wrong direction some months ago we saw the trailer for the movie Doctor Strange and all my friends in America were going you went to see Doctor Strange I said yeah came out a week early in Australia they were like what it doesn't open until November 4th but we went Linda, a group of us went and it's a story too of a medical doctor who's such a genius you know he does brain surgery and he's so articulate, he's so well read he's so good being a physician, a doctor a surgeon and everything but he has so much pride so much arrogance he's so full of himself or so full of this artificial self that the ego has made up he's very successful in the world but he's got this arrogance and pride and then as he goes to meet the ancient one I guess Tilda Swinton plays that character she's like this very wise woman who has gone way down deep into the mind and he doesn't really go to meet her until he's had an automobile accident and his body was just torn up and his fingers he had to have multiple surgeries just to get the fingers, the bones back he's taken a very humbling way through a very devastating crash and it's only through that rock bottom of like oh I'm not going to be able to do the things I've done that he begins to question maybe he's more than this genius doctor and don't we love that in all the movies where the arrogant one gets humble and begins an authentic spiritual awakening which is so precious because they start to realize that they've been going in the wrong direction there's a so much more than meets the eye in this world it's a very deep inner journey and we've had other movies I've got this thing called Movie Watcher's Guide to Enlightenment so way of the peaceful warrior a similar story an amazing gymnast but very prideful, arrogant and then motorcycle accident to derail him from the path that he was on and then he comes to meet Socrates his teacher he's already met him but he's having an arrogant phase with the teacher as the motorcycle accident so it can seem as if things are even taken away from us as we would judge it in the world but it's actually all working together for the good to help us turn from the pride turn from the false make-believe self and Jesus does tell us in the Course that you're so confused in this sleeping state or you're sleeping and dreaming that you can't judge your advances from your retreats you can't even tell when you're moving ahead or you're falling back because when the mind is asleep it's so confused it's lost in the dream world and that's what makes it so frustrating that's why Suicide is the number one cause of death on the planet it's so frustrating when you don't know who you are and you keep going and you circles going in circles and they aren't going anywhere so this journey I feel like all this goes through that and yet it does not have to be a long journey it can be shortened immeasurably by our desire for miracles miracles will collapse time miracles bring the outfit and the omega together they bring us back to our true self in the moment it doesn't have to be struggle and difficulty if we're very willing to tune into guidance and be very intuitive it could be a gentle journey and that's really what we're encouraging all of you to do is go for the gentle journey the bigger your yes is to spirit the bigger your yes is to God means in your heart of hearts you're saying I want to go home kind of like the Wizard of Oz there's no place like home there's not a place it's a state of mind that Jesus is called heaven Buddha called Nirvana when you put that as first priority in your life things will move swiftly the journey and the parable of David seem to take decades but the people I meet are going through this much much faster we have the mighty companions Jesus calls them or down in Australia they call them the mighty mates they come in floods when you are ready the mighty mates will start showing up and their reflections of your desire to wake up when I'm talking about wake up in some far distant future lifetime we're actually coming into the experience that if you really open your heart up and go for it you can have this experience we were just meeting with a publisher of my book in Japan the book is Awakening to a Course in Miracles and this man owns a publishing company but he only publishes profound deep spiritual books he's only publishing you know Buddha, Lao Tzu Krishnamurti but he won't touch anything he's not interested in the New Age he's not interested in a lot of things he's only publishing his deep books and he met with us in an interview with the Star Magazine Spirit Natural the name of this company but he's very shy but then he started talking about enlightenment and asking all kinds of questions enlightenment and he just was very sincere looking at us he said is enlightenment possible in this lifetime and we were nodding to him because we are living in an experience the course is pointing towards we don't have struggles and difficulties I know we could talk about the past which for me is a distant past where there was a lot of ego reactions and resistances but actually we're living in a state of mind we're used so fully in communication as Francis mentioned all day long all Skype calls, communing and meditation everything is only about communication there's nothing else but communication and in my case the travel has been going on for 25 years that's a quarter of a century and work with the course is three decades old so the course is not something that I necessarily have around anymore as a book I've been put in touch with the internal teacher and the internal teacher does everything through me so to speak there's no need to go back and refer to lessons or refer to things the spirit can quote those things and can use those things but even that would only be helpful if your attitude and your state of mind demonstrates what the words are talking about because as we know with little children if the parents are trying to teach them something but the parent is not demonstrating in action what the parent is speaking about the kids will just turn off and turn away if a parent tells a teenager stop smoking and the parent is still smoking that sends a message to the teenager like can't count on this look elsewhere for instructions I'm going to turn this parent off so we have to have consistency we have to have integrity we have to have honesty our life has to become a living demonstration of joy, of glee, of happiness and you're going to meet a lot of people in this world as you move through this lifetime and most of them are not going to be course numerical students they're not even going to be esoteric physical students so you're not going to be going around talking metaphysics I've been traveling for 25 years and I will talk metaphysics in these gatherings if it's helpful although people are actually more interested in the practical application because many people have been studying metaphysics for years they're very familiar not just with the course but there's great nominal traditions that have been around for centuries and how do I put this in practical application without exception that's where the focus is so for us it's a very gleeful experience and it propels us this meeting we have with the publishers like don't you get tired and all this travel and do you get jet lag and we get all the questions but we're also transparent because we put so much out on the internet we do that I've been doing that for so many years that people follow along we were at a crosswalk in Tokyo, Japan we just went to a mall and we went to have a bite to eat and we were coming back and we were walking up to this crosswalk and there were two Japanese women and the crosswalk was going to take us across to our hotel because the conference is the next day and then these two Japanese women and they're making this big deal a big fuss almost ready to jump up and down they're just so excited and then as we're standing there waiting for the light to turn green they're just going on and on about how excited they are they said are you both still doing your liquid diet? this is in Tokyo, Japan with two Japanese women at a crosswalk for instance of what we did have juices and everything in our hands but it still was like it's all one mind you know it's all reflections of our mind and our appetites drop away as they will when you focus just on communication your appetites for the world to start to fade away because you have the prana we use the Easter term that you're truly living off of but to have it reflected back on a crosswalk in Tokyo that was kind of fun it just starts to be more natural to start to realize the love that you are the connection that you are and as it feels more natural then questions just disappear from your mind the first question Jesus says that was ever asked was asked by the ego and the question was what am I but spirit doesn't have a question spirit is just a state of perfect beingness so the human part the ego part that seems to have identified with the body and with the world of images asked the first question what am I and then every question since then has always also been a part of the questioning aspect of the mind which is the ego spirit is not asking any questions the spirit can use what the ego made so initially it can have you start to ask questions about what do I believe in what is my perception showing me about myself where did this feeling come from you know the spirit can even use those questions to point you back in the right direction but ultimately it's for a leaving off point where you cease to have questions you are the answer all the answers are within you and they come bubbling up and you're ready to receive them and then the questions drop that's how the process goes not about inventing more and more questions or trying to analyze things figure things out that's all practical to the ego and the world in engineering you've got to ask questions about vectors and stresses and pressure points engineering without those questions you couldn't have mathematics you couldn't have any of our academic areas without those questions but the point of the course is to let your mind drop down beneath the questions not from a sense of trying to push something away even for myself I spent 10 years in a university this is a very familiar setting to me after 10 years of full time in university but once I left there Jesus was saying okay that's all behind you now and I will use what you learned in a helpful way for the whole universe but I don't want you taking your mind back to academia anymore that's not who you are the professors aren't your teachers anymore and I was sharing at a conference over in Colorado that Gary and I were at that basically somebody from the audience asked me who is your teacher who has been your teacher and I said Jesus has been my teacher and he said how does that work out with a 2,000 year old dead guy and the thing was I actually had such a desire to connect with Jesus that I started getting a lot of signs and symbols from the radio, from bumper stickers from billboards Jesus was reaching me through all the symbols but after I immersed my mind in the course and used it as an oracle for 2 and a half years and read for about 8 hours a day then the stream of thought that was Jesus came into my mind and began directing me specifically where to go what to do what not to do he gave me very specific guidance to start unwinding from the dream of time and space and therefore that was my connection with my internal teacher and I have to say too it helped speed up my work with the course because the whole purpose of the course is to connect you with your internal teacher but after 2 and a half years with the course I got in touch with it and so he was always when the ego would try to distort something he would come in, no this is what I meant and when I would get off into a little bit of egoic guidance he would say, no that's not what I want you to do I want you to call someone so do this even when I was listening to course teachers traveling around listening to the teacher teaching and Jesus would be doing a commentary on the teaching on the course teacher from my mind he would say that's a good point and that's a good point this is a little off this is what it means this is what it actually means so it helped me zoom in to the experience in a faster way and because I could go so fast into undoing my need for the book then I could be used in terms of music in terms of movies in terms of letting the presence use all the symbols of this world that people use and enjoy to reach the people in a very direct way hence we have tools like the movie watchers guide to enlightenment which actually has become so popular that I think now people are choosing it as their pathway to God there's Buddhism Hinduism, Christianity movie watchers guide to enlightenment because they've been synagogues they've been sitting on their rear end for years meditating they've been doing all these practices that seem very long and quite tedious and boring at times and they enjoy movie watching and they're having these huge expansive insights and experiences of their identity from watching these movies with commentaries so it's become quite a popular pathway to God but you could come in through music as I did, there's a lot of other ways too, it's just that's what we're seeing emerge how are we doing on time we can go for a while we do have a a microphone a roving mic so maybe it's time to open it up for questions, comments anything that you'd like we can go in over here thanks David I'm just wondering do you still have any I know we can't destroy our ego but we can unfold from it do you still have any egoic reactions but you're not attached to them you just see them pass through your life and so is it some level but without the connection to them and also for us that are still living in our ego we have a primary question and we've noticed an egoic reaction or did you used to can you suggest a primary question for us to ask of ourselves to get us out of that to step in around yourself I don't have egoic reactions I would say that there was a phase of where you become more and more consistent but then a reaction will just kind of rise up rapidly and the proper perspective or attitude with that is really to welcome it when it happens not to try to slam it down with some kind of a judgment like oh this isn't right or this isn't good or something like this so I would say there's a phase of allowance to really allow everything up into awareness you're not going to try to push anything away you're going to actually welcome anything that comes into awareness and I call that allowance you have to have a huge willingness to allow anything to come up into awareness because you're going to undo the denial and the repression and there can be times where you can just be aware of thoughts it helped me when I was reading the bible and there's all those great scenes in the bible including the seamries with I think the Pharisees and the Sadducees and this woman comes in and she comes in basically to wash his feet and it's a very famous scene where she's getting down to bring out her oils and to wash his feet and the Sadducees and Pharisees are judging her and start judging Jesus even like well, he can't be the Messiah because if he knew who she was he would not let her near his feet and he's very aware of their thoughts and he's very aware of her heart and she had been perhaps a prostitute and all the things from past which he didn't take as anything real at all he just felt her heart opening up and coming there really to drink up the truth and when he started talking about the thoughts that were going on they were astonished basically the Sadducees and the Pharisees and it's kind of like a woman at the well when he meets her and he says she's not been with one man she's been with lots of men and he can read her thoughts but he's not judging the thoughts and it turns into a parable where she goes away and she comes back and he basically says, drink of me and you will never thirst again so when the Spirit is using we could say the miracle the miracle is pointing to the truth and it's never using private thoughts against anyone or anything in other words they're just you're able to observe them and be aware that they're not true and that's basically a part that Jesus talks about in the manual for teachers how do God's teachers deal with magic thoughts he says the first responsibility is not to attack them it kind of gets to what you're pointing at where you can be aware of the thoughts but you know that they're not true and therefore the Spirit can use those thoughts as part of a teaching device to teach perfect love and perfect innocence and nothing else but that so that's really the goal of all this mind training is you can be aware of those thoughts but they don't affect you in any way you have no reaction to them I remember years ago my mind opened up so much and it felt like it was one of the giant satellite dishes where I could pick up all the nuances and I was going to a retreat in the country I think in Kentucky in the United States and I thought I'll just come and I'll just go into my room and I'll just have a little rest before the retreat starts and I went in and I laid down in my bed my antenna was picking up everything a lot of the retreats had come they were very frightened, they were very scared they were gossiping whatever in the other room and it might as well they were in my mind and at the time I was asking Jesus what is the purpose of this he said I want you to view these thoughts with me and just watch these thoughts they are not you they have no impact on you so it was one of those real telepathic phases of learning to just join with spirit and be aware of the thoughts without identifying with the thoughts in any way and I did meet a friend of mine from England who was going through the same phase as I was so we would be walking along we were visiting Ken Watnick and walking along the path and then I would pick the thoughts up she would pick the thoughts up we would look at each other and she would swirl around and look and we would both laugh because we knew that thoughts weren't coming from a body we were just picking up with our antennas we were becoming more and more telepathic and we were learning to laugh together at the thoughts to not react to the judgments of them to not wanting outcome to occur just to be able to see the false as false so that's the goal of the course just to be able to see the false as false and let the spirit come through you with great love regardless of who you seem to be with or whether they seem to be present in body or not all of that is basically irrelevant material okay where's here's our microphone here it is could you please tell us your three favorite movies of all time well that's interesting I don't have any favorites but people have heard me say on over the years at one point years ago I was saying I landed on the desert island and you had one choice left of the movie you could watch before you laid the body aside I said watch Solaris with the George Clooney in fact I think we have a site online where that movie with my commentary and people go into mystical experiences with that one it's symbolic of moving toward the divine law of all that I give is given to myself which is represented by this light planet called Solaris and all grievances and all unfinished business comes up and even people who have died they return because they're still in mind of thoughts so that's one there's another one this is Star Trek episode in which I think it's Deep Space Nine Captain Sisko and they go through a worm hole and they go into the light and so it's not any other species like the Klingons the Romulans, the Boer or whatever they actually go have an interaction with abstraction and that's such a good teaching tool I think I use that in the book Quantum Forgiveness it's called The Emissary it's the episode and I've been in tables where I'll just bring out my iPhone and say would you like to take a journey with me and everyone's like yes and so we all at the table go into The Emissary with commentary and it's very deep because it starts to give you reflect an experience that is beyond this world it would be like Star Trek encountering abstraction and then humbly starting to see that you can't convince abstraction of anything you have to let go of everything that you think you think and think you know in order to experience the love of abstraction and I particularly the island is Francis's favorite not long ago we were going to go to Brazil but we decided to do an online workshop a weekend workshop with using the movie The Island with Ewan McGregor Scarlett Johansson and it was so mystical we had people joining from Portugal and from Brazil with Portuguese translation but you can share the experience it was a mind blowing experience because that movie is such a perfect demonstration of what's going on in this world but while within we don't see this is somehow bizarre or is a lie in any way it feels fish in the water all we know is water we have no reference or position to see the falsity of it and that is the same experience that is set up in that movie The Island they're in this artificial controlled environment and promised a future that's very similar to the condition we live in we live this moment for a future hope we see we give everything over to a future safety, security, health plan retirement, whatever but that's exactly what is going on and watching that movie is very beautiful parallel you can really see through a lot of the things that is taken as granted or taken for granted or taken as that is a very nice teaching movie as well we've just come upon this technology where we can join with people online around the world we can do setups watch the movie with them and have commentary and already I saw people from the United States a friend of mine from California said you saw Doctor Strange commentary please it doesn't come out for a week it's like well just be patient it won't make it to the theater first but because we've given ourselves so fully over to that it does feel like that the movies and a lot of stuff is coming through we're kind of just channeling it through now is part of coming to an exponential awakening or what we might say a comprehensive awakening of planet earth it's really just the mind so when you accept the atonement for yourself everyone accepts the atonement it's not like 7 billion separate minds where you have to wait for the 100th monkey or the 100th Christ to come along and go we have enough now we're not waiting for a threshold really it's just come to accept the atonement for yourself and have your whole perception healed but Jesus did say in his talks with Helen there hasn't been a comprehensive awakening on this planet yet and so the people I live with and I work with and I join with I'm like saying is there anything else more important than a comprehensive awakening what else could we put our energy into I'm so into it that I'm looking at joining with all kinds of people like with scientists I can sit down and I can speak even futurists or scientists I will sit down and I will join with them in quantum physics is my language I will use with the scientists because they can relate to that they're not relating to Jesus and Holy Spirit but we can relate in that way and people who are involved in sports for example they love being in the zone they love that state of mind where everything is just flowing there's absolutely no judgment they feel so high and so connected I had went through a lot of those experiences myself with different sports tennis and basketball and golf and so forth so I can relate to that we're just really looking we're looking now at a lot of new stuff they're coming out with inventing the goggles and they say we're very close to the threshold of them being so realistic that you won't just like when you go to a movie and you lose track of the awareness of watching a movie with these goggles on it'll be such a realistic experience that your mind will quickly forget whatever it's seeming surroundings were we're thinking how can the spirit use that kind of technology to have a rapid advancement in consciousness because we're already seeing that when I go to third world countries I can go down and show the matrix and have a good translator next to me and it could be an auditorium this big and the whole auditorium goes down into the mystical experience with me so I'm seeing symbols of this comprehensive awakening like that's what we're here for and there's not a moment to waste you know why would we waste it on delay on worry on concern the things that people thought were important in this world they're only important to the ego they don't have any specific importance so I'm going around just think people join me it's a dream it's a dream we don't need to take any of it seriously no matter what the news is reporting no matter what the newspapers and the outlets of the world are reporting we have such an important function here in terms of forgiveness that for me there's not a second to waste and often times I'll be up in the middle of the night doing emails and communications I was on the I was up last night and I thought I think there was a Facebook page for this conference so I have like 5,000 friends on Facebook I said I'm going to invite them all so I was up in the middle of the night inviting my friends to come join the Australian conference of Facebook page because it's like a synergy of you want that for everyone you want everyone to have the experience of freedom you want the experience where not a slave is left walking the earth because your mind becomes so healed and whole that your perception of them has gone from seeing them as slaves or seeing them as entrapped or caught by the ego you start to see the Christ in them see the light in them and I know that's what the organizers that's when Kate when I was here earlier in the year that's exactly what we talked about we're just like ready we're jumping out of our skin to try to go into the miracles and it feels that way that's beautiful because yesterday even that movie Doctor Strange someone asked about the theme but that is a theme to me when I was watching it it's really a theme of healing because he went through to meet this mystic because of his calling to heal his body and he went through this almost like a mystical training of his mind in order to revive his body as well but it's so tricky because it's only time that makes what we call healing in this earth or symptom removal meaningful if you take the time element out you see it's actually quite meaningless because one symptom can be removed only to come back another time or in another form even if you managed for yourself to have no symptoms throughout the life you still consistently perceive sicknesses in this world or in the end the ultimate symptom of sickness death will come upon us it's like the human condition only when the time stress things out it seems like there is healing going on and yet you have to repeat it but the problem is we always Jesus actually talked about it in the course he said sickness is function of fulfilled and that is what I like about this movie as well it did touch upon that if we are powerful mind of God and we're created as like his mind like God we're communicator to fulfill our function as a communicator with God and we don't use the body to fulfill the function of waking up the mind then there will be stress and pain and suffering and the mind will start to miscreate by project the pain and suffering onto the body or onto the world which is the same as this body so only salvation can be said to cure that is one sentence in the course and when we talk about healing of any kind physical healing mental healing or even just to heal the tiredness or just wanting to have a vibrant day it is in the end all about do we come back to the true source of our function what is our function have we fulfilled our function only function can bring us to life can bring us to vitality and what is the function you know except communication and forgiveness and even that is not even really at the level of the form it's communicate and forgive the egoic thinking by holding the hands of the spirit in every moment that is our function and we bring that into our daily thinking and daily decision making say what is my function here how do I be truly helpful you know because he also said in the course the mind or the one that is truly helpful is invulnerable and the reason it is invulnerable because his mind is completely turned into wanting to give it does not want to protect his ego and when you don't want to protect your ego you must be harmless the mind is harmless when the mind is harmless you cannot hurt anyone or yourself or your mind or your body so that comes back with any single question that we are asking in this world in our lives there is an answer that is so deep and that brings truth to who we are and to all the problems in this world so it is very very encouraging because there is an answer and we have been searching and searching and surrounding this world but feeling like there is no real answer here at this level but there is a true answer and there is only one answer to all the problems and we are holding the spirit's hand to practically go into work that one answer and accept it so that's why we are here using our examples and that's why we are using our movies because that movie every day when we watch a movie every now and then that's what we perceive there is a deeper message if we watch it with the spirit in a way a lot of the spirit will tell us what would you have me see just like our daily life what would you have me see and there is a very deep message that comes through we were open to even having a theme for today and Francis was saying you did a little book about going deeper it's like this little purple book about the covers like the color that you are wearing today going deeper and basically the book is about lesson 79 and 80 from the workbook of A Course in Miracles and basically lesson 79 is telling us that even if you already had the answer to this world it wouldn't help you if you mis-defined the problem so lesson 79 is asking us Jesus is asking us please follow me here and I want you to see the problem first of all exactly as it is because this next lesson let me recognize that all my problems have been solved have already been solved but you see how they go together even if they have already been solved and you know that's the ultimate down here in Australia I first came here in 2004 there was no worries no worries no worries mate that's lesson 80 no worries mate Jesus all the problems have already been solved no worries mate this is a not hopeful statement this is an actual statement of fact of truth but what Jesus is saying in Hossie Lingo is no worries mate is not going to help you if you insist on defining the problem in form if you insist on believing you have financial problems health problems with the body problems with mother earth problems with pollution problems with politicians problems with different people with different ideologies arguing if you think you've got a racism problem if you think you've got some problem that's defined in terms of form specifics then your no worries mate is not going to help you because you've already overlaid an egoic definition of the problem and you've denied that you have a perceptual problem so I've traveled around the world and I would go and meet course groups and go into 12 step groups and 12 step groups in Alcoholics Anonymous they'll go around hi my name is Soso and I'm an alcoholic I was hearing from Jesus that that's what all the course and miracles groups in the world need there's thousands of them greet, meet and then admit that you have a perceptual problem hi my name is Soso and I have a perceptual problem now why would you do that at the beginning of every course meeting it would have to be that Jesus thinks this is very important that it's something that you have to be reminded of over and over and over because how will you accept to make if you're sticking with the idea that you've already defined the problem so you see how humbling this is that if you can just begin to admit that you're seeing a distorted world that this perceptual world the same one that you see every day the one that you see on the news the same world that you see when your eyes open when you first wake up in the morning and you perceive a world of fragmentation is what the Bible called looking through a darkened glass in Corinthians if you can first start to admit that you're looking through a darkened glass and you don't see anything clearly then you see how humble you would be like okay I don't see anything as it truly is Jesus you're with me show me a new way of looking at the world show me how would I see it through your eyes how would I see it with Christ's vision how would I see it that I may be an extension of love because if I keep looking through this darkened glass then I'm going to keep reacting and getting all stirred up because I'm going to see the conflict as if it's external to my mind so that to me it's very practical and then we have this whole day to start to look at where in my mind does it seem like I have grievance for something that I'm still holding more dear than truth more dear than peace of mind that's what the whole course is about removing the obstacles to the awareness of love's presence it's actually a really good use of time to do that we can have an actual break now we talked to patricius he said you keep dropping in there I do I'm going to put it here I still know who I am how is it how is it hello how is it how is it how is it how is it how is it I'm with it I'm actually enjoying it it gets me moving around I get sick of sitting in my spot hello again and we'll continue and I've already asked about the temperature in here down doing my best to get that organized you don't have to ask me So we'll see what happens yesterday. I wanted to turn it up and we were freezing and today it's boiling. So you know what? We might want to be sitting in here in our underwear by the end of the day. Really goodies.  That could be interesting couldn't it David? Did you wear your sexy ones or your good ones? We'll see what happens with the temperature I have asked them. So we're back again to enjoy the beautiful wisdom of Francis and David. So I'll let them take on. We'll use our next segment to go back to questions because we were just kind of getting into some questions there and Francis had one that came during the break. Do you want to share that? Yeah I had a question and I guess the gentleman actually said most people would like to know the answer and this question is what we call almost like the number one practical question that people ask around the world and the question is how do I know which voice is the Holy Spirit? Which voice is the ego? How do I discern in my daily life? Yeah that's really the point of all your practice because it's a question of discernment and it's a question of purpose. Like Jesus says there is one question you could ask with anything of this world. What is it for? That question will start to help you discern the voice of the Holy Spirit. And Jesus has some very specific instructions and of course he's got rules for decision towards the end of the text to help you out but Francis touched on the beginning here that the Holy Spirit only uses the body as a means of communication. So that's the sole function of the body. You might say you could look around, you could look at your smart phone, at different devices, computers tablets.  You could distract yourself. I had a friend of mine who in the early years she was receiving all these songs from the angels. She received like 270 songs from the angels but then sometimes I would see her on the computer for long stretches of hours and I said what are you doing with your computer? What's going on with that? And she said I'm playing hours and hours of solitaire. It's a digital version of solitaire. And I said hmm. So I said you might want to ask Jesus if that's the purpose of your computer. We went down to Argentina and while we were in Argentina that topic came up again and I just happened to say a line from the Bible, the branch that bears no fruit will be cut off. When she got back she came into the house and everything. This peace house that I had, nothing was ever taken from it but on that particular trip we came back and the LAN cable to her laptop was cut. Literally cut and the laptop was gone. That's the only thing that was ever taken from a peace house. So that's kind of an extreme example of the branch that bears no fruit but some of us can relate to that where we have an iPhone gets dropped or cracked or something happens where we're using something and suddenly it doesn't function anymore. That's a pretty obvious example of purpose, unfulfilled, a function unfulfilled. Or Francis said that the body seems to break down or his symptoms. That's just another example of function unfulfilled. The sickness is function unfulfilled. The other thing I would say is that it's going to be a lifelong journey of discernment but just try to stay as open as you can to the spirit reaching you using all the symbols of time and space. Instead of thinking you have to hear a voice and getting upset when you don't hear a voice just open it up and saying reach me. Reach me in any way that you can. Make it obvious. That was always one of my prayers I would say over and over to Jesus. Make it obvious, make it obvious, please make it obvious. Sometimes it's extremely obvious you really see that. I do want to say that even just the willingness to ask that question in the mind what is your will? It's so tremendously helpful. This is the most helpful thing we can do by just starting to ask this question. Because Jesus says in the Course that truth will come back to your awareness through desire. It's really not through any method. It's through the desire because it is through the desire of wanting something else. The truth is pushed out of awareness. So if our mind is connected with God and our body is purely a communication device then the fact that we can't hear the Spirit is pretty bizarre. So the fact is that we need to start to tune in. Start to be willing first and foremost to have this desire to turn to Him. I would say that is probably the most important thing than whether how many times I can hit the mark. You know hitting the mark and counting on it is not really important. We don't need to do that. That's the ego of mine who wants to judge how far along we are on this process. But really the process in the moment is tonight in this moment remember to turn to Him. That is actually the biggest progress we can make. I think as you progress the more confident you get into listening to those little prompts and those little nudges whenever you can notice a prompt or a nudge or feeling and you act upon it then you feel joy. You feel this burst of energy and that's a real strong indicator that you're on the right track. And imagine doing that for months or years where you have that prompt or nudge and you go for it and you follow it. That's a key component. It's not just hearing it but following it. Because when you follow it it strengthens the awareness of spirit in your mind every single time you do that. So it just gets stronger and stronger. And it gets to the point where you work towards all through all those characteristics of a teacher of God starting with trust and moving into honesty and then moving through those to the end which is open mindedness. An example of open mindedness was not too long ago we were over in Amsterdam and we were leaving Amsterdam. We were just getting ready to fly out and we were at the airport and we had a little bit of time and so we had a bike to eat with some friends and my friend Helena was flying back to Sweden and we were getting ready to fly out and then we were so open we didn't have anything in mind. We were just giving it over to the spirit. But we didn't have anything clear to leave the airport or anything like that. Well we had mentioned some ideas to friends of ours who were having lunch with they had gone away and they came back and just when we were saying okay what's next they put these beautiful silver and colored train tickets in our hand at the airport and we were like okay they invited us to come on an adventure with them so we left the airport, went on this adventure and this woman had heard me speak in Belgium years ago maybe five years ago and she was guided to start this trust cafe right in the heart of the busiest streets in Amsterdam where they had a cafe with the most beautiful vegetarian food that they would all make. They were all core students. It turned into a little cafe community where they would make this amazing food in one of the busiest sectors of Amsterdam and have no prices at all on the menu. Everything was to be felt out. People would come in there and have a big feast and feel in to what they would offer. And then they had the government city saying well we've got to hold these cleanliness standards and things have to be at certain temperatures and everything turned into a five year forgiveness lesson and they were just the happiest people. They came out serving us and telling us all the miracle stories that they had from joining with people saying feel in to it and the people go come on tell me what the price is. No, feel in to it. And then the forgiveness lesson sometimes when people would have a big feast and leave nothing and then the chef and all the people would let all their emotions up it was just letting the whole thing be used for forgiveness to let go of expectations and they called it trust cafe. They took us on a train and walking. We were on a tram. We had a great feast. We saw all their hurt all their vehicles and then they got us back to the airport where we flew out. But we had no idea that was coming and the more open you can stay and the more trusting then the spirit can lead you on all these miraculous spontaneous adventures which takes you away from all this belief and structure that you have to the whole day is so planned and structured and ritualized. Some of you might know too when you get into the work but when you get into lesson 135 that healed mind is relieved of the belief that it was planned. Jesus says in lesson 135 now that's calling you into a very spontaneous life and I have to say it's what an adventure. Wow, these last 30 years have been such an adventure of listen, follow, listen, follow and then the discernment grows stronger. To the point where you don't even doubt it you don't even question. We're just sitting there looking at each other one time we were in a hotel in China we've just completed a round-the-world trip literally a round-the-world we're in a hotel in China and then I started to get this swirl of energy like Jesus is saying do it again but I looked up to Francis because I thought well we'd just come all the way around the world so are you feeling it? She said I'm feeling world travel so she spent the day on online booking tickets for us literally around the world she booked tickets around we zipped around again we went just again around the world for us it was no big deal we're just having fun with Jesus and following the instructions he is so playful the more you get to know him the more playful he gets and the more you trust him he gets even more playful he's throwing things he plays with the climate he's playing with the weather the temperature in here freezing cold for dairy it's hot today and they ended up in Tokyo they said it's going to be cool we'd better dress for fall up in Tokyo we landed there it's like 30 some degrees and I'm wearing shorts in Tokyo I come down here to Melbourne it's 9 degrees coming down here and they were saying better have your shorts ready for Australia and then it's 9 degrees when we land and I feel like Jesus is just always playing with little things like that don't expect anything don't think you know what this world is don't try to figure it out even just have fun have some fun with it do we have our groggy monkey yes I've got a question 14 years ago I was very unwell and a lot of people used to say to me oh you've created it it was your creation now you need to feel yourself and ok I went through my treatment and I got it all fine at the end but always that guilt left with me like oh how did I make this if I created that means I can create it again but how would I fix it how I did it in the first place and not just that but also that fear that then you would come back again and so there was always the you know how do I know that I created or was it meant to happen and I would take some lessons from it because I ended up living with fear for almost 14 years that I would be able to create it again if I was able to have done it in the first place I'm glad you're asking this a lot of us have read different metaphysical ideas and new age ideas and I think one of the most popular ideas right now in terms of metaphysical ideas is that you create your own reality the course of miracles is not teaching that it's teaching the opposite of that that God is the creator of reality and you can accept the reality that God created for you but you are not the creator of reality and I would say that's a classic example of love confusion where the mind is told you created that cancer you created that illness Jesus just uses the word create with spirit and spirit doesn't create cancer spirit doesn't create heart disease spirit doesn't create pollution remember that spirit is pure love and basically the course is teaching us that you can't bring the truth into the illusion you can't bring God into the hiding device you can't bring spirit or love into the distracted device there's a lot of great nominal teachings that even ponder about how this projected world came about and we'll still use that word creation like the Bible does Genesis at the beginning God created the heavens and the earth well God did create the heavens and the ego projected the earth and all the rest of the cosmos that's the theology that we're going into the course even in the workbook says the world was made as an attack upon God a place where God could enter not well that's helpful metaphysics to know if I'm wanting to wake up to know God and God didn't create this world and I'm wanting to know God and spirit in essence and that's where forgiveness comes in I need to learn how to see something as an illusion and pull my mind's energy away from believing it as a reality I just need to see the false as false so I can wake back up to that divine reality so for me it's been very helpful to be clear of these metaphysics and to start to realize 25 years and I would go to course troops and that was a common thing even back then you created that illness you created that starving child in Ethiopia you created that tsunami you created that nuclear disaster the only thing that the course has in terms of the projection is a workbook lesson I have invented the world I see meaning I believing that I'm an ego I invented the world I see and to the extent that I identify with the ego then I will feel the guilt of miscreation so the whole point is not to make the error real it basically Jesus says you are not responsible for the error you are responsible for accepting the correction for the error and the correction is a torment so instead of focusing on the beliefs of you I have a personal mind that mis-created with some type of illness that involve the body even though you've gone through a symptom removal now there's still something haunting you like wow if I did it once what's the stop me from doing it again the Holy Spirit is the correction the Holy Spirit is our we could say in terms of our mind our life insurance policy if you're going to invest in something invest in listening to the Holy Spirit because you're investing in the correction you're not investing in the problem you want to keep investing in listening and following the correction and not try to get into analyzing and figuring out the problem because remember no worries made is that there is no problem so why would I use my mind's energy trying to figure it out he does tell us to don't project the error to time so every time we blame somebody every time we look at any aspect of the cosmos and we think that's the problem we are attempting to project the belief in separation to something in form and the ego wants us to do that because it will tell now project over there project over there blame here little blame there before you know it you feel terrible, you feel depressed from playing the blame game so it's really just level confusion of starting to see that there's really nothing in form that caused anything and there isn't even a private mind in in form that caused something it's bringing it all the way back to practicing with right mind of guidance if you keep practicing right mind of guidance you will be convinced that that's where you live so to speak with regard to earth you live in your right mind and in the perfect innocence of the right mind where there's no guilt you have no problems that's the step back towards heaven is to come back to right minded perception so it's a glorious message it takes it away from trying to figure things out because we've all come from that belief system, diagnosed the problem and then go for the solution and even Dr. Strange he was the epitome of a medical doctor but when he was finally told by his teacher that he could choose to go back and seem to heal his fingers his body but that would be the lesser in the plan and Jesus even says in the Course there are those who have laid aside the body to increase their helpfulness the ego shakes the head of that one it's going how does that work it can't figure out the plan but there are those that transcend this realm of time and space that their mind is being used for the greater plan and they don't even have the need of a body at all they're like the saints they've literally transcended the body completely and if it helps to have their image of care for you like if you pray for Mother Mary or you pray for Jesus or Yogananda they may have an apparition just as a symbol to your mind but they have no need of a body at all they have no need to teach with the body thank you Francis could you help me distinguish between not making it real and as you put it Thomas Hardy said looking into the worst of it I used to have a panic attack for the morning and I would try and get out of it by meditating practicing yoga getting on to something they kept coming back and I didn't really know what it was and the heart would be fast and I'd perspire and I thought this can't go on and I did what Kenneth Watwick says try to see the fear, the hate before uncovering the love so I kept looking at it into the heart of it and the ego I wanted to get away it tried to leap away but it kept coming back to it and in the end I was just laughing there was nothing there at all it had all been for nothing and I'd just like to know that I'm on the right track with this I'm not making it real by looking into it please I think this is when we talk about see beyond the error or not making it real we're taught Jesus is to an experience that what they were just talking about the right mindedness comes from that perspective when you see the things from the spirit you see through what the wrong mindedness interpret as problems as hatred or as interpretations but I think what happens is this phase does take some degree of purification to come to what normally seems to happen is because the course talks about do not make it real or this world is an illusion then conceptually people want to jump into that conclusion very quickly even before that become a genuine experience we know the concepts and we want to talk about it as if that is the answer but it doesn't really provide any real authentic healing unless it becomes an embodiment of our experience and how to reach that step is actually going through a purification process and in this process we actually need to be very very authentic we have to allow the emotions and the thoughts and the things that will not leave our mind come up to the surface by allowing it and not judging it and not too quickly saying how do I fix it now what mechanism do I need to find to fix it is giving it a little patience and permission to say what are the emotions right now that is being triggered and underneath I was just talking to Karen at the break all the thoughts and beliefs are still a lot of them are very unconscious and that is a reason that they still seem to rule us if they are fully conscious they are not going to fool us anymore so the purpose is to actually allow all of them to come to the conscious and once they arrive at the conscious mind they evaporate in the light so the allowance is actually inviting them to come and knowing that if we have a trigger or a charge of emotion it indicates a thought and if you leave underneath that is still running us so we just allow and give our attention to them and then sometimes you probably sit with it for a while but sometimes as you allow the spirit might give you guidance also to go to talk to someone or write a journal or you know in the end all the healing comes through inviting the Holy Spirit to guide you that is the healing I have to emphasize so much on that the purification is to prepare for that there is so much conditioning we just came from Tokyo and before that it was China but for five years to China and helping people to get in touch with their emotions because it was almost like an explosion when we started doing expression sessions it was like an eruption of emotions like it's been a systematic cultural in the family and with the government of pushing things down and you know we can talk about other cultures as well but most cultures are designed by the ego and stuff down emotions and so we have two guidelines that we use in our daily living and in our different communities around the world no people pleasing and no private thoughts and this can be like going against a lot of conditioning of just swallowing emotions holding the stiff upper lip to maintain decency and politeness while there's a rage under the surface that hatred that you mentioned Ken was talking about so I've done some videos that are on YouTube about facing your rage facing the hatred that the world was made in hatred and the Holy Spirit gave it a new purpose and we need to zoom in to that forgiven purpose for the world in order to see it a new way but some of the most difficult steps in the journey are the beginning ones of getting away from this sense of pleasing and politeness and it happens in all kinds of situations in institutions like family and at work, people say well I can't say what I'm thinking to my boss I can't express my feelings you have to start practicing somewhere and with a trusted friend or a trusted companion and partner you start speaking what you're feeling and we use a lot of different movies for that there's a very funny movie with the British comedian Ricky Gervais the invention of lying where great stretches of the movie is just people basically speaking their stream of thoughts and it's a comedy because everybody just roars laughing when they see the characters you know on a day tour preparing for a date and the mom calls in no he's not very handsome no he doesn't make much money it's kind of funny looking nose too and he's taking all the reactions the thoughts are just uncensored unfiltered and it's great to even have movies like that that show us those kind of things act it out because it's actually healing when you're dealing with relationships where you really have things that you've been sitting on for a long time and you need to give them over to the Holy Spirit and it's just symbolic if you can talk to a trusted friend or close friend and begin to get in touch with those emotions and what's under those emotions I think that's a rapid way towards healing and this whole thing of trying to wear a mask or the macho man or trying to keep your emotions intact doesn't help you get in touch with your thoughts or your beliefs that are underneath those emotions so in one sense you're twice removed from healing and you're trying to act polite but you've got hatred and rage going on underneath so it's been amazing that we've been able to practice that so much in our communities and does it rock the boat yeah there could be some times when the boat is rocking at lunchtime when those expression sessions are going but if the purpose is real strong if you're doing it for release and for healing then that prayer seems to carry it through it's just going to be sexy don't it as I'm going through my healing I'm getting less I'm going to say patience the word but more the distractions the mobile phones, the emails the social media, the facebook the other media and I'm in business so I have to use email and I have to answer the phone but I'm becoming not intro I get to a point where I'm just don't answer the phone but I have to run my business it's like these tranquil mind states are interesting because I'll get into this process of feeling very peaceful, the tranquil mind stuff and then the ego comes up and says this doesn't happen all the time but occasionally comes up and says well is this it? and I really won't feel like doing anything but I feel like I have to do something it's sort of like this interesting I don't know and what's the best thing to do because we've got responsibilities in the world but at the same time it's hard to run a business all the time there's a camera on the way to this or just not just me other than just me you can write too that's beautiful I think that's the unwinding that we talked about where the spirit will meet you where you believe you are and so with whatever the situation is including a business there's going to be a rinsing that's going to occur in the mind because the businesses are based on reciprocity businesses are based on the profit motive and you can tell that the spirit is going to take your mind in a very different direction but in a very practical way and that's why we need miracles to show Francis owned her own financial management business and had to go from some steps of having her mind plugged into that and then having times I think you were so drawn to go back and read the course a lot of people who get in the course are very active in the drawings of this world and then they feel this draw inward and the ego will say watch it there you better watch you better not make too much time because there's these important things you have to do and for me it was like a symbol of once I got in touch with Jesus it was more like okay you're going to have to convince me because I've just gone through 10 years and I'm so trained for business and I'm trained to succeed in this world and you're you're going to have to convince me of this new direction you're going to have to show me that my perceived needs are still met by you and not by my own learning my own condition my own striving that's a big transition we've all been taught to strive we've been taught to push and to succeed and to work hard and so on and so forth and I had that sense from Jesus he's like you have to take that same dedication perseverance determination and devotion and aim it at me and aim it at your mind training because everything you've ever done in this world where you built up your stamina your determination you've got a focus you even learned how to tune your mind in and be attentive he said I need all that I need all those things too but without the profit vote instead of thinking being so concerned about the bottom line and how much money am I making and how much money do I have in my bank account and all those things that seem very practical and important I had to be convinced by Jesus over and over and I have to tell you these last 30 years since I've worked with the Course it's like talk about being a rinse it's like Jesus was using a fire hose he was in there just firing away with so many miracles synchronicities things just showing up just when you need them oh that's nice well just multiply that by many times after a while okay that's nice like this is getting easier and easier when things are still working out still being provided there are some spiritual allies that will teach certain things like television's evil or technology's evil or Facebook is evil or this and this I find it just the opposite I find that as I'm tuned in and listening Jesus uses everything I mean over the years I have to say you're talking to me about communications and broadband connections what's a broadband and then YouTube what to YouTube YouTube how do you spell it U-T-O-N-O U-Y-O and all these different technologies that have come in that people find that that's how they come in contact with me through watching YouTube's you know this thing called Spreaker came in too and it was like what is that is it Spreaker no it's Spreaker Spreaker is an art oh okay so these technologies get used to share and extend and communicate but there's no like a profit noted and people always you may have to be saying you can monetize your YouTube Jesus is like no you're not monetizing YouTube this is freely you have received of me and freely you will give you know people most of everything that I have I put on the internet freely I think 100% and then some of the stuff people design like search tools to kind of get at the topics faster and they put a fee for that but it's all there but basically it took me a while to start to get into that mentality of freely extend everything and don't expect anything in return because that goes completely against business there's no bottom line in that accepted washes away the bottom line even yeah and it does seem to be a challenge I remember having these longest sessions with Jesus I'm in my late 20's just when you're supposed to be building a career and afford mobility all that and I'm just saying to Jesus listen I don't know if you've ever visited this place I was there 37 years but I said down here you know there's this thing called money and it doesn't grow on trees I'm trying to lecture Jesus on how earth works after 10 years of university and he said yes I know you believe that and I'll work with your beliefs but I had typically in 20's I had career goals I was very much in the future thinking and he was like saying just relax and trust me I will provide everything that you even seem to need for you if you'll trust me and so every time I would go out on the road you know I would be like a road trip with Jesus I would come back wow and then another six weeks out with Jesus on the road wow and then he took me on the road for basically five years with no place to stay you know for the majority of the time no not even a tent that had a tent with me one time and that got taken away so he was like almost like no stilts no props and people invited me into their homes and said me and said thanks for five years it was like a thorough rinsing of all those old work ethic conditions and all the pride that went into that too like I personally can take care of myself and Jesus said yeah that's one of the biggest blocks to heaven it's personally believing that you can take care of yourself even and I said that's highly valued down here not value taking handouts from the government and taking handouts and he's like well you better learn to take handouts from me because that's the way I work I'll make sure you're provided for but you have to relinquish control of even the survival mechanism and I was like that's a bit extreme why is that so important because your survival mechanism is tied into your bodily identity as long as you keep in that fear of striving and conniving and competing and struggling to make a living so to speak you're not letting me give you a living and show you that you have a divine guidance in you that will help you unwind from everything that you believe in so it not only worked in my life but I have people that I live with who have done the same thing about St. Francis did St. Francis that's F-R-A-N-C-I-S back in the 1200's and now St. Francis F-R-A-N-C-E-S but she basically let go of her career her husband her two houses her financial planning and even a lot of the skills and abilities that were learned through higher education to live a life of devotion and trust some people could say is Francis a teacher of a course of miracle the more you get to know her it's safely you don't think of saints in terms of the particular pathway they took their life becomes a living sensation of the living presence of God in everything that they think and say and do and so the tools that they use well Francis can talk very well about the course but she can talk about a lot of life experiences because it's become integrated in her mind so she's not interested in becoming like a course teacher or a famous this or a famous that it's the presence of love in her heart that's been the focus and I find that that's not even odd or unusual I have people that I live with that are having mystical experiences I mean it'd be hilarious if they did a reality TV show with me because I would be like laughing singing doing all these things all the time and then the people around me they go off and drift off into these mystical states to help Kirsten out because Kirsten had been in such deep meditations that she lost the function of her body she couldn't walk and she's getting ready to go on a tour and I'm thinking okay she's got a book out I'm married a mystic about her days with me but she's losing functionality in her body so I said I'll go help you out I'll show up the mystic will show up on the I'm married a mystic tour I do a cameo appearance you know it's like a movie you get a cameo so I'm getting ready to go out there and Suzanne's been having those experiences in our community and Jackie and now Kirsten so I'm going out to help out with the little cameo experience and then I get a text message from Francis Francis is supposed to take me to the airport and she's gone into a mystical experience so I'm trying to help out one who's having mystical experiences and then she went to cut an apple and she went close to the apple she got the knife out and she started to cut the apple and then she went into this mystical experience and Francis couldn't cut the apple he couldn't cut an apple I mean her mind just went so into God that the apple everything that seems relevant in this realm was totally gone and then she had the thought of trying to cut a lemon she went from an apple to a lemon she thought I won't have an apple I'll just have some lemon water but she couldn't have a lemon either so she text me just like in the morning close to fly the next day to help Kirsten out I don't know if I'll be able to take you to the airport so she's typing out she's able to at least type it out but I'm thinking we're all going into mystical experiences we're all going down that's what I mean you can see where this is heading you know yeah that's it it's hard there are times when it's hard to do anything but you have to have the trust that's what I've done over these years where I kept praying with Jesus like oh you're going to have to work this out because I had a lot of beliefs a lot of expectations I said you're going to have to show me you're going to have to show me and talk about standing and delivering Jesus is like try that one and here what about that and try that and that's what the course is he keeps saying the same thing over and over in a circular pattern here try this here try this one didn't get that one here try this he's very playful and very persistent but at some point you yield okay alright I get it then things become natural you merge with the guidance so there's not even an esker anymore it's more like your body is like a puppet and you've given the crossbow over to the spirit to move the puppet and it's so natural and it's so easy and you're not struggling anymore with what about the future those things just keep happening and Francis has got so much to share now from living this devoted life and it's also practical we still the bodies can move around through time and space and airports and all kinds of logistics but there's almost like trinity in the matrix can you fly a helicopter just a minute you see her eyes flicker she gets the download and she can fly the helicopter that's how our lives are we find ourselves frequently in a situation where we're just looking at each other like what now boom jesus download okay we got it next thing what's this jesus download and that shows you how practical the guidance is you are never bereft of a helper it's always there well Samuel's got a question we'll make this the last question and we'll go to lunch break also Samuel is traveling up the coast the east coast of Australia from here up towards Brisbane over these coming few weeks so if anybody along the way your course group along the way please invite him I'd just like to affirm that there is an alternative way of living we don't have to live egos way 20 years ago I had an experience and what I needed most of all in my depression was peace and I was guided to open the book where it says that you only find peace within yourself never out there and I also got a message straight from Jesus saying seek first the kingdom of God and all things will be added unto you all things you need is all things is no need really to work hard in the material world because Jesus has said all things will be added unto you and that has been my life for the last 20 years I have retired from teaching and now I'm simply teaching the course of miracles and traveling around the world and visiting groups, encouraging groups and starting new groups just by putting out impact and lead ups so there is an alternative way to live which is much more satisfying and gratifying and fulfilling than having a business ok that's our lunch break that's a testimony for God praise the Lord