If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go Mind pump, mind pump with your hosts, Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews In this episode of Mind Poop! Little bit of everything. We had a good time. It's not a quaw and it's not a random episode We actually talked about fitness in this one for the first 35 minutes though We talked about nicknames and how guys like to give each other Terrible terrible nicknames. Yeah, we talked about Adam's Testosterone Grounds. We talked about Justin's testosterone and my testosterone. Yikes. We got our Everly Well testosterone tests Back and so we revealed what those numbers were. We actually got a hookup for you also Also, if you want to get your hormones tested, they have food intolerance testing They have a lot of different tests you could do at home without a doctor. You go to everlywell.com Enter the code Mind Pump. You will get 15% off any test We also mentioned the Juve red lights because that also has been shown to improve Hormone profile and men and women.  We also talked a lot about The fitness truths that there are in fitness, but also when it's okay to break those truths I love being a rebel. Yeah. So, you know, for example, like we talked about like compound lifts before isolation lifts usually true Sometimes you got to break it sometimes. What about form? Should I always be controlled or sometimes go fast and loose? We talk about a lot of these Types of rules and when it's okay to break them and when it may actually be beneficial To break those rules. Also, I would like to mention this month all month long You can get maps anywhere for half off now maps anywhere is the program that is designed Without fitness equipment all you need is bands in a stick. That's it. You can do it anywhere You can build an incredible body with maps anywhere without a membership to a gym all over the world But we also have multiple maps programs like our new bodybuilder program map split We have maps anabolic, which is great for beginner to moderate people Trying to build muscle mass and strength We have maps aesthetic, which is also a bodybuilder focused program Mass performance, which is for athletes and then we have bundles where we take Different maps programs and combine them for particular goals and discount them like 30 off For example, our super bundle is a year of exercise programming all planned out for you You can find all of these programs at mind pump media.com Everyone's doing their homework on our interviews that are coming up this this week And uh, I think Justin's extra excited because one of the hosts that we're interviewing does uh these little intro singing Yes, so I know have you have you thought about what you're going to come with or what? I don't know like you're gonna surprise him. Well, that's the thing like if If we're interviewing and we're doing that like I feel like I should include him So maybe maybe a song that's like familiar You know that we can kind of harmonize and set the tone all of us. Yeah Do something from simon garfunkel. I feel like that'll be a simon garfunkel Hello darkness my old friend.  Do I know any of their songs their lyrics? Yeah, when somebody else sings it, I recognize but I don't I would never be able to just listen to simon garfunkel My mom went to clean the house. Yeah all the time Dude, you know, like hauling oats. Those guys are bad motherfuckers. Yeah. Yeah, like I I totally Didn't give them like what was that one song man eater? She's a man eater I forgot the words though. Yeah, all I know is that part. I know she's a man eater. That's true. Uh, look out boys I kind of if a guy came up to me Let's say I was single and I'm like Damn that girl's hot over there and then some guy comes over and goes listen, bro. Yeah Uh, she's a man eater. I'd be like give me her number now like chow down right this second. I want to call her Because that's what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a man. I'm looking for a man eating woman.  I can't think of anything that's more of a different And and the way that girls even do we do sound effects? Well, no girl girls give each other like cute nicknames Like here, I'll give you guys a story. Here's a story That if you're listening right now guy girl, you know for sure only a guy would do this So I go to my buddy's restaurant He's actually one of the owners of the opa's uh opa's greek restaurants around here So when they first open up, right? So I show up to my friend spiro. Great guy. Love him. Love him to death I used to train him and his brother his brother george before he passed away But good people So I show up to the restaurant and he's taking me around and he's like he's a stereotypical, you know greek dude Which is very similar to a stereotypical Italian dude. Hey, let's go. Hey, do me. I'm sort of walking around And he goes this my friend. This is john. He works in the bag. This is sarah.  I thought you know because nine's a german word I'm like why he's like, oh, that's not his real name. His real name is something mouse I'm like, well, why do they call you nine? He goes nine show him why they call you nine He lifts up his hands and one finger is missing. Yeah That's a typical guy Yes, and and the best part about that is is nine appreciates A nickname like that.   I was nicknamed quarter in high school That's was that all my friends call me quarter. Why is I'm quarter mexican I love it. Oh, yeah, that was my that was my nickname man. I was ghost for a minute Were you really? Yeah, because of my white-ass skin. Yeah. Yeah, it was ghost. Yeah girls don't really do that No girls don't make fun of each other.  Like typically we call her speed because she's fast Guys aren't gonna do that. You know what I mean? You know what I'm saying? I'm not I can't even come up with an example.  You know what though? Hold on a second like dizzle. It's stuck. It's only because you made it stick No, it's stuck because you have the power to talk to 50,000 people on a podcast We're poor Taylor. He's been trying to convince the 10 people he knows It's stuck because it was so terrible. That's what makes it so good. You know what I mean? Don't try and spit at the terrible because he hates it. We still say it. Yeah, that's really exactly And that's the thing if you're a dude I'm trying to get I'm trying to get you guys to switch it to tailor-made tailor-made's cool It's too cool. It's not he likes it. No, it's okay to have a cool. He's cool. We got to keep him cool We don't want to make him a dork No, no, he is he's cool, but I don't you know what I mean? That's if I like someone if I don't like if I kind of know you I'll give you a nice nickname. I was calling him t-pain for a minute. Yeah, or t-bag or something like that These are terrible.  I have to say something that's terrible That because that's what guys do and that's what women don't do.  We've humanized ourselves so much. Do you really?  It's like open season on us.    That was his nickname. Yeah, and I mean he literally mumbled He taught and it was it was an actual problem, you know what I mean? And he appreciated it.  Why do you think we do that? Why do you think guys do that to each other? Well, we talked about this didn't we talk about this? We did and people have speculated to see how resilient you are as a male Like if you you're testing someone to see how they can handle stuff If I if I can make fun of your name or I can make fun of something about you Like a small attribute about you and it makes you fold and crumble.  So it's true. Yeah, I would think it's almost like a natural thing of evolution Which is unfortunate because now we have this You know, uh, the and I know it's good.  No, there's there's real there's definitely bullying There's a difference.  Of course, of course What a hard situation though to be in as a as a teacher or a leader within that Right at this time right now, right? Like, how do I have you decipher? Yeah, right. How do I how do I allow the kids to have some flexibility and like You know friends playing with each other and teasing this nat or versus like hey That's bullying. It's like because then at what point how do you where do you draw that line? What's teasing what's bullying and what's healthy and what's not healthy and being included or excluded? You know, it's like some kids like they just don't want to hang out with you. Sorry, you know, like This is something that like my my oldest is dealing with too like this kid that just the age He just doesn't like hanging out with them.   I'm not going to the other thing is sharing That's a big one a lot of parents will force their kids to share force them Instead I give my kids the option. I'll be like look it is yours You don't have to share But just keep in mind that you're they're probably not going to want to share back with you see them do it on their own Yes, which is great. It doesn't count if you force them. No, it's like forcing your kid to say they're sorry It doesn't really count.  It's true.  Yeah, and afterwards.  This is great. You know, I've never been the fact. I've done that many fat guys I've never been the fat guy until I've hung out with you guys. This is a new experience Out of like it is I don't like to dig on that.  Yeah, like it just happened.   No, I'm on I'm on I'm on the gain myself Well, yeah, hence the the drinking shakes again. Let me catch up to you, bro. We can't do that It's been so long. Yeah, you're low and I'm high so theoretically I could get close Yeah, no, you you could but I don't think so though.  I I'm almost I'm about 200 pounds. I haven't been 200 pounds a long time You know jack, you know, what's interesting is even along this this, uh, you know journey towards the Ryan Gosling body that I've been going for Uh, are you trying to look like him or you're trying to go? For a guy with a body like that Yeah, trying to look like okay, okay. No, but I uh, you know, we talk that we we talked recently about like set points and so at that and Man, even with the the lack of movement the low calories everything that I've been doing Um, you know, my body still is maintaining around like 208 210 pounds Yeah, it's very different from when you were oh very very different.  But I mean we we talked about we've speculated that you know What's hyperplasia, right that happens Yeah, muscle fibers you create more of them Right, so I mean I've been training for quite some time now and for sure when I was competing with testosterone too I mean man the level of volume that I did for true I probably if definitely and I and it feels like it to me because what I notice now is like I could I've You know after the injury I kind of fell off for about a month and a month and a half or so And then even the rehab process really slow. I really have just recently Started to get a little bit of my consistency and momentum and like better training sessions higher volume And man, my body is just I mean it's it bouncing. Yeah, where it gets back to right now is I mean that Just 10 years ago that would have taken me a year of consensus consistency of dieting and training just to Build the frame that I have right now So there's something to be said about just you know, plugging away for years and being True because it's funny. I put like was it like two weeks ago. I posted a picture And I was pointing to one of our free hit guides and it was a shirtless picture And I'm kind of flexing from the side because I know my angles. So I know I know how to make myself look better You know somebody DM me about that like teasing you And I was like, dude, what'd they say? Well, they're just they're just making fun of you and I go Like I'm flexing. Well, yeah, whatever. I want to hear what they said Adam. Well, no I'm trying to save my feelings. No, no, no, absolutely not But I mean again, like I think some people just don't realize I'm sure you guys get the same thing too is like Sal's very aware that that's his angle.  It's just like it's just you just are aware of yeah What looks good and what, you know, I'm narrow. I'm narrow, but I have thickness So if I pose sideways, you can't tell I'm narrow I've been practicing for anyway So I post that picture and someone and people are messaging me like dude How long did it take to like look like that or whatever and I'm like, honestly? Uh 25 years. Yeah, exactly. I mean, I've been literally I've been training consistently consistently now Since I was 14 years old with weight training Just to and that's a I am a perfect example of really bad muscle building genetics Because it took me that long to get to the point now where if I work out I have okay decent muscularity But let's say I had never worked out and I started working out now at my age I would never be able to achieve what I what I have it's because I've all those years of training For sure. I've accomplished hyperplasia for sure. Right 25 years of exposure to So that personally that's what that's what I think it is for me and then and then even uh for sure in my legs Which is why I think I've been able to jump Quite a bit of weight from being somebody who would fall back down 180 Oh, now your legs hold mass Yeah, my legs definitely and then they and they respond much quicker than what they use Which is again so nuts to me that this was a muscle group that I struggled with for so many years in my life Like I just no it's not like it's but I I mean I remember and this was really when you and I first met and first started talking It was kind of like one of the last things applied even though I knew it the information I still had fall fallen into the old bodybuilder kind of dogma of This hammering one body part a day type of deal And I never and I you know why I never applied it to legs because I remember how miserable one day of legs was I'm like, fuck you do three days a week legs. That just sounds you know, maybe in the my prime I was doing two times at most but I was still hammering and I was miserable and I was walking around sore for days Once I learned to back off the intensity bring the volume down a little bit and then spread it out throughout the week Oh, dude legs just Totally responded and now it's easier for me to Maintain mass on them and they respond really quick. What do you weigh right now 210? Yeah, I'm 210 right now You'll probably just from looking because your body's changed so dramatically over the last couple months Just because your your hormone level is coming back. You're able to be active I would assume 210 is probably a good or 215 210 to 215 is probably a good lean natural body weight for you Right where you're getting you'll keep losing body fat Keep putting muscle on so the scale may stay the same my my guess like so right now and I have and this is natural Yeah, so that's what I was thinking right 210 to 15 So it's gonna be interesting because you want I haven't been a hundred percent natural in a long time, you know, it's been Shit, it's been five years since I've been a hundred percent natural And and I'm still and I'm definitely on the lower end of the normal like I got my everly well tasked I haven't shared that with the audience.   So when I got tested for my My test levels. God, this is when I was 30 I'm 36 now going on 37 So when I was 30 I got tested back then when I knew something was kind of off And I was in of and I was in the lower A real real law. I think it was 200 in something free test And so then I got on a therapeutic dose For about two years consistently. Um, and then that's when I got into competing So a lot of people don't know this but I those that have been following for a long time that have seen like my Before and after transformation before I got into competing and I was 20% body fat. I look terrible I was on hormones, you know, I was taking testosterone I was taking a therapeutic dose and then when you see my first initial transformation from fat to fit where I got down Sub seven percent body fat. That was still on the same therapeutic. You're still taking the replacement Yeah, I'm still taking the replacement dose I did that all the way into the amateur level when I then went into right after I won usa or Went pro and usa's That's when I started to bump the when I was becoming a pro when I became a pro I upped my dose a dose to like 250 to 300 milligrams a week and I peaked at 500 milligrams On my but even a therapeutic dose will shut down your body's natural testosterone So basically your body hasn't been producing testosterone or didn't for like five years Then you go off And you just recently did your everly well testosterone test and you're You're not where you want to be but you're in the range of what they would consider normal Right, which is good. I'm in a range where some doctors would not give me a therapeutic dose of testosterone They would say you're fine and now the question is for me is I wonder A is it possible to get it back to where it would have been had you never used it Anabolic that's a big question and b This is something that I've pondered for a long time. I wonder if being on So because when you're on testosterone, especially when you take the super physiological doses, right You're taking 100, you know 10 times or 100 times more testosterone than your body's taking And I wonder if that will Change your receptor density for testosterone so that when you go off Those you'll you're lower testosterone level as your testosterone levels start to start to go up Maybe you'll respond better to them. I don't know. You know what I mean? It's it's it's an interesting question I don't know but the thing that I noticed more than anything else that has been the greatest challenge because it's now been Let's see here December. So what are we in right now month six right now? So it's been seven months That I have been off testosterone completely So and I tell you the hardest part of the low testosterone is the To muster the the energy to want to lift Because not only do I just don't have that Anabolic drive to want to train But then I also am extremely weak In comparison to what I'm used to also so it's like a double mental fuck at the same time So that's been more challenging than anything and then just being able to be really consistent with it to see If how much that's going to help I also was really consistent with The jubelite and then our infrared sauna for quite some time And then I actually Intentionally kind of have taken a break from it right before I did the everly well test Because um, I don't know if I told you guys that's not but I think it's Mike Mike mincelle or might not mike mincelle is no no no it's not it's my I forget metabolic mike He interviewed us. He's got a youtube channel. I really like mike and he's I know he's an avid listener He had shared with me He did the test right before he got on a protocol with the jubelite And he is muscle. Is it muscle? Okay. I was right. Okay. So he he was Shout out to mikey metabolic mike. He's got a great page So you got any puts out really good content for those of you guys that haven't seen mike's content on youtube and on his instagram But uh, he sent me this and he showed me that I think he was uh 400 where was where his free test was before then he went on like a protocol jubelite He said he really kept everything else the same diet regimen everything else was normal And he was doing 15 to 20 minutes of the jub either every other day or three times a week I forgot what he what he texted me And then he showed me his lab results afterwards and he was 750 dude Yeah, so he huge almost double people don't realize how much so I'm really things can affect So and I and because I told you that I was consistent with it Then I would then I kind of then I purpose intentionally stopped kind of doing it for a while You're gonna do it again Yes, now I'm gonna do it again consistently with my ramping up my training. So combine the two of them together So what I'm gonna do I believe if there's anything that's gonna get me higher It's gonna be that so something I'm gonna do I'm gonna do something very similar Because you guys know like I go On and off keto, but usually largely keto-ish with my diet because of my gut Well, my gut health has been very good So I've been throwing in starches more and more starches because it feels good and my body's reacting well And I there is some evidence that long long long term Low super low carbohydrate diets may negatively affect anabolic hormones So so I want to I want to do another test to see if my testosterone and this is what I've I've been going through this Because of the fact that I know the environment has shifted to where we're sitting more and like I'm getting less activity I used to train and be on my feet and pick stuff up and like constantly do stuff And so I've you know changed my diet to where I don't really eat I mean consistently I won't eat till like eight o'clock or you know, or I'll eat like midday But like I'm just always like more in Um, you know like a fasted state like and have that window of like eight hours But like I need to change it up man I need to do I need to start adding more food and then getting you know that hard intense training back So really interesting that you're doing that because this is something that I was kind of I thought the same thing was going on with me because I've been more keto for I haven't I hate saying keto because I'm not fully ketogenic, but just really low carbohydrate. Yes I've been very low especially in comparison to how I was eating before And one of the things that I've noticed in the last week and a half two weeks is I've reintroduced more carbohydrates and I've really just used white rice white rice has now made its way back into my diet Easy to digest. Yeah, it's very easy on me. I like it Um, and I've started to incorporate like a cup to two cups a day now that I wasn't having before And my workouts are are feeling really good right now And I'm wondering if there's something there that you know, maybe the the high fat low carbohydrate diet for me As well as it helped mitigate putting on bad weight and I felt healthy as far as inflammation things like that But maybe You know, there's something to be said about the the anabolic effect of it and how it was affecting my workouts If you go too low fat your cart your testosterone below I think if you go if any time my belief is if you go If you take something out for too long, you may start to notice negative effects now the science is A little murky on this but there is some science to suggest that keto diets for long periods of time May in fact lower Anabolic hormones Now does it change receptor density with androgens and maybe it makes up for that? I mean, I know when we had what's his name on the show Carnivore diet guy. What's his name?  I got my test results back and I was kind of right in the middle Right in the middle of the range that they give you for the did you get yours back yet? Yeah, I did get it back, but it's um, I I literally haven't even been able to get Yeah, it's like, uh, yeah, if you open it, I'll look at it right now It said negative 45. No, like literally we just got my wife just picked it up from from the post office So I'm gonna I'm gonna check it out. What? Yeah, I didn't they text message it to you.   I got it like like four days. I know You know what's sad about this Adam?  I'll show you what it looks like.  I can figure it out You're gonna let the tech retard help you out.  I flex between 230 to I mean two. Yeah 230 to 233 to 220. I'm like that's like my range I've gotten down to like 215 and that's that's what I'm lean. You just care. You carry so much in your What were you when you did that whole the did the whole transformation on mine pump? Oh, yeah Yeah, it was like two Two Ten, I believe okay. Yeah. Yeah.  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You were still like beefcake.  I know everybody's oh, you look good I hated it.   I mean, I've seen you or even 230. I've seen you move. I've seen you work out You don't move like your like if I was 230 I'd be huge at 230 even though you and I are the same height Right. And if you saw me move at 230 besides deadlifts and squats and bench press You guys would laugh. It's well distributed across my body. That's my biggest fear right now of kind of ramping up the calories and trying to gain right now is that I've put so much work into my mobility That I don't want, you know Part of the reason I haven't I'm now putting it out there right I hadn't put this out there that I'm like trying to gain again right now because I didn't want to commit to it because if I started to notice that it started to hinder all this mobility that I've put So much effort into Getting to where I'm at now that that's still more of a priority to me that's like You know, I think if you train right and just let your see where your body goes Just see where it what it kind of heads to you know, I mean I know I have a feeling you'll you'll be a naturally. I have a feeling you'll be around 210 215 Which that's what's your body fat at now 215. Uh, I'm I'm definitely in the low teens Oh, yeah, I'm definitely low teens like 13 12. Yeah, I would I would guess I would guess between 13 14 percent right now I feel like you at 210 215 at like Eight nine percent would probably be like a nice. Well, think about that. That's a lot of extra That's I mean, yeah, but you're coming off of a nasty layoff, you know, I mean and you're just starting to get it back on Yeah, it's totally doable if I if I'm if I take my time to get to that that number I think you're right What tends to be easier is to kind of aggressively get up to 220 then come back down than it is to like Really slowly take my time like I should I know that 100 percent. It's just it's easier for me to make that mental switch of Okay, I'm on the game That's the priority like make sure I'm consuming what I need to and Lifting the way I need to I just we'll see I have no idea where my body's at I'm just really happy the place. I'm at right now mobility wise my My back my shoulders like I mean that was a big deal for me. We're all feeling healthy. That's dangerous. I don't know if you saw Yeah, I know right it is that was uh, it is dangerous if we all feel healthy It's been a while since we've been all training really hard at the same time And we've since mine pump has happened. I mean the beginning of it. I felt like The business was so one of us was doing some at some at any moment one of us was dealing with some shit Yeah, yeah, I know right there was always some something happening that was like crazy But I feel like everybody's good right now. Yeah, no, I mean for me.  You've got this kind of constant state of inflammation. Yeah, you know So and my workouts are totally I mean just way different. You know, I feel like you guys have been really bad friends lately, man I'm gonna tell you that what? Yeah, I just feel like I couldn't believe that you guys didn't even reach out to me and say anything about My latest post because that was such a big feat for me.  Yeah, oh, yeah, that looked amazing I've never been able to do that ever Yeah, that's really ever ever. Yeah, I've never seen you do that. So I guess I was just like curious I was watching it and it's like, oh, wow.  I've never have you been able to do that I can't do that. I hope you're not looking at me. Yeah Yeah, no, I know you can I mean that's just and that takes the depth Oh, that's gnarly especially like to be able to control that and then keep it everything Bracing your back. I'm impressed with your shoulder mobility because I know that was your limiting factor forever Yeah, you know the ability to hold my shoulders my hips my ankle all of them were limiting How long did you have to prime and stuff before you were able to pull that off that day? Yeah, so I mean I'm just practicing with the same movement with the bar and going heavier No, no, I I actually that was my first real attempt at it And the only reason why I attempted it because I felt like man, I feel really I haven't felt this good In uh, that deep of a squat ever and I just I was like, you know what I hadn't attempted that in a long time The last time I attempted that it was remember when we were all together with uh, Mike slimy and on it Yeah, and remember when he had us to hold the the 45 pound plate over or the 10 pound plate I think it was it was a really lightweight over over our head and then squat down. Oh, yeah Oh, I mean I was shaking like a like a true. I mean it was so bad like a shitting dog Yeah, and I couldn't get all the way down. I couldn't mine's low. Sorry. I just finally pulled it up Is it low? Yeah, let me see Let me read it for you. Is it low as low as mine It's like 57 or something.   I don't feel so bad. What a waste. You should have taken steroids Yeah You need to get more sleep and take it again.   No, you know, it's not a it It's all about how you feel. I think that you said you let me see where you're at. You were at 57 Yeah, okay, so let me see since we're talking about this. I'm actually really interested to see I know I took a picture or a screenshot and I will for those that are listening So you don't feel like you're left out here in my insta story I will put that up there so you guys can see what the fuck we're talking about So what we're talking about if you don't know so if we you don't know everly well Was a company that we did advertising for for a few episodes And we all did the hormone test. Yeah, yeah to test our testosterone levels and I was really interested to see Where mine was gonna land and why am I not like can I find it right now? You were at 50 something. I was that's yeah, that's what I'm curious to see if just and I see and I like yeah All the excuses that come to mind. Is that why you sleep? I didn't yeah, I was on That's why you guys turned down my advance my advances and stuff. You're just not feeling Didn't yeah, I wasn't up for you're not feeling hot. I wasn't up for it So mine mine was at 112. So I was which is kind of in the middle.   Let's start punching things again. Doug. Make sure you know why because I stopped doing moitai. I was 58 What was Justin 57 he beat me. Oh, wow Wow, god, you totally lost see see Imagine me on steroids in last place. Let's name this episode sal got first. Uh, make sure you write that down I'm the oldest too, huh That's actually cool though. That gives you something to kind of work towards I mean because that's kind of how I'm treating it right now I can guarantee you I know what the problem was with yours, Justin because you literally said when you took the test I haven't been getting any good sleep. No sleep and you did look shitty Yeah, you did look like thank you because right now if you got your testosterone level checked you look more You look much more more vibrant. Yeah No, for sure. I was a low sleep and like for some reason stressed out at the time But yeah, whatever that all affects it, dude I really want now that I took it the way I did, you know, we're gonna do we're gonna Let's do this. We'll take another test and let's all go on a testosterone protocol I'll put together all the supplements. We'll get the four sigmatic together. I'll get us together with the organ I'm on it already. I'm on the train.  Yeah, you need another you need a skin disease first Oh, maybe I'll get them It's not supposed to sunburn you but I still have air though, so you know what I mean? I'm winning there Only only just so we get tan from a jude light. I feel like a red glow. Yeah Be red reflecting You know, it's funny because I was I was in our spa and the infrared spa and like after I was done I felt like I was a little bit red, you know, like it's just like yeah the heat the core temperature But it looked like I got a little bit of sunburn. It's just from the heat. Yeah, you know, I mean Anyway, you know Doug wanted us to to do an episode. I know what he gets goes crazy when we do these random ones Oh, you know what I do have a talk just talk about bicep. I do have no no no I have a good topic because uh, There you know, there are general rules and fitness that we talk about all the time But there are times when it's okay to break them and actually might be When is that okay? It might be a good thing to break them sometimes. So I'll give you guys an example One that most trainers and fitness enthusiasts Believe to be true 100 of time and that is when you start your workout You start with the compound heavy movements first and you finish with the isolation movements That's just this is common knowledge, right? Like if you're hitting chest You start with your bench press and your incline press and then little by little you move down In the last section the reason why I don't like you using that as an example is because I actually disagree I don't think that's as common as you think it is the only people that I catch that do that are people that understand programming or Olympic power lifters strength trainer like people that like really understand programming do that everybody else Gravitates to machines first Almost everybody I know goes to a machine first to warm up Well, I rarely ever see someone go straight to the squat rack or the deadlift, you know, I guess Generally speaking it is true that you should start with the compound movements, right? Right, but there is a time with good programming. So forget the people that know anything about exercise, right? The people that just do whatever I'm talking about for people who actually understand exercise programming There is a time and a place where you will benefit from going isolation first In fact, in fact, we wrote some of that in map split We actually in phase three. In fact, we do have a lot of that where you start off with an isolation movement first Well, yeah, if you're not getting a certain muscle group to fire properly or like be engaged in the movement That's where we want to dive into why, you know Like let's let's figure out where the disconnect is and like let's really try to get that involved in You know these these multi-joint. That's how I learned The first concept or understanding I have of I had of priming In my career was maybe 10 10 12 years ago Where I didn't understand what priming was but I did understand that I have a client who Never feels her butt when she squats or I have a dude that never feels his lats when he does a back exercise So what I would do with them is I would do an isolation movement first Get that muscle kind of pumped and then go to the compound movement and boom Oh, shit. Now I feel my lats I remember doing that for the first time myself when I was a kid The first time I ever got a lat pump, which by the way for The first time you feel a pump in your back Is amazing because it's difficult for many people to ever feel their back And the first time I ever did it was I did pullovers I did a whole bunch of pullovers and then I went and did pull-ups and for the first time in my life I felt this pump in my lats from a correctional standpoint.  The pump is just absolutely insane No, I I agree. That's a great one another one that we we talk about because we talk so much about The overuse of intensity. Yes that I think it's important that because I know because of that We we've been labeled as team no sweat and then sometimes I think that People feel like we're giving them we don't actually do hard workouts Right that we're giving people the green light too to never train hard like that's not the case whatsoever I think the message of us coming out and talking about You know intensity was to tell people that a majority of people that are just getting started in their programming should probably Pull back quite a bit on the intensity. Most people overdo it, right? But there is definitely a place that you know Where you you should apply and one of the strategies that I like to teach somebody like well, how do you go? How do I know How much intensity or how do I know when to go beast mode or when to kind of do that And I try and ease people in for example regardless if you're doing a split routine or a full body routine You know when you're working a muscle group that the last set that's all it takes You know the last set of that muscle group of that day Taking that to failure would be that what I would do Instead of what you see a lot of guys doing is and girls warming up and then Going I mean each rep there are each set. They've got somebody spotting them through the reps from the beginning of their workout all the way to the end and that to me is where You're going to see a lot of breakdown and then you're really just yeah Because if you start in the beginning with a bunch of sets to failure you've ruined the rest of your workout It's typically what'll happen. It'll ruin the rest of your workout.  Yep. And all exercises are not the same Like I could go to failure on bicep curls and try to pick, you know extensions And I can do that much more often than a set of squats to failure In fact When's the last time any of you guys did an actual a real Not hard, but a real set to ultimate failure and barbell squats. Yeah, do you remember what that was like? Yeah It was horrible. It's it's terrible. Yeah, because then you You can't walk the next few days.  Like it hurts like it's sore. It's like It's it's beyond sore when you when you take a you know, squats to that level and uh, I remember Vividly, I don't always have that spotter there You know to make sure I got through all these sets of like these heavy reps and I don't use spotter at all Anymore like there's no need to have a spot for me the last time I went like to real failure with barbell squats And when I say real failure, it's because if you haven't gone Till you can't do a full rep anymore on squats It's actually failure is more reps than you think sometimes and this was I want to say six or seven years ago And I was competing with a friend of mine to see who could squat 315 the most And so my goal was to be able to get 20 reps with with 315 And uh, and I and so I worked my way up to being able to do Multiple sets of like 14 reps with the squats, but they were so hard I was like, I'm never going to be able to hit 20 Well, the day came where we were going to do the competition and I belted up and I got under the bar and I just It's like I got to 15. I got to 16. I'm like, there's no way I could do another one But I kept pushing kept pushing kept pushing and I got to 20 I did 22 reps with 315, but that 22nd rep Was uh, terrifying. It was actually I couldn't see out of my eyeballs while I was doing it All the pressure I was pushing so hard and then I fell afterwards I just laid down on the floor and almost puked and then the last time I went to failure on deadlifts besides maxing out Because that doesn't really count right going one set one rep. That's not really that's easy I did uh, I got 315 on the bar and I did 10 sets of 10 reps with 45 second rest in between And the goal was to see if I can complete that and uh single-handedly Caused myself to over train for like two weeks took me two weeks to recover from something like that.  Yeah, we just did it I think it was 10 rep like so we would get up to I think It might have been 315 a little bit more but just like we would go one for one So it was me and my friend. We just go one. Okay, you go for 10. I go for 10 We were there for two hours like just doing squats And then just until we collapsed basically So that was fucked, you know, it's another one that we talk a lot of shit about that I think there's some value there also but and again the reason why we talk a lot of shit about it is because I think it's It's utilized improperly and it's overused and that is these creative weird angle type of exercises Yeah, that's a good point and there's something to be said about having strength in these Weird positions, but you know like doing like a tricep extension with your elbow completely elevated and tweaked out to the side Or doing something weird like that You know, it seems like and we've teased people for doing things like that Because you see a lot of guys doing that as a first like again first exercise or Whatever or doing it as finisher and their main goal is to build their triceps And it's like well There's so many other moves that you could be doing if you want to build your triceps and some odd weird angle that you're doing but There's also something to be said about You know your your joints are going to be in weird angles and positions in life and the gains you get are very specific Right and to have strength in those weird awkward positions could benefit you or and potentially protect you So finding ways to incorporate that occasionally there is some value to that there is and it's in From a biomechanics standpoint like if you take a reverse grip on a tricep press down And you're doing tricep press down so my palms are up right my palms are supinated My the whether or not my wrist is supinated or my hand is supinated doesn't affect the action of the tricep however Where I can see potential value and by the way, this isn't applies applies to a small percentage of people Who are out there, but since we're talking about the whole like, you know What's what are we talking about like breaking rules? Yeah, I feel like this should be this episode should be titled like every you know The opposite of everything that we've said and how how we still would use that because there is some there's a lot of things That we've talked about that Still get Utilized within our own trading protocol So so when you get the when you use that reverse grip the reason why somebody who's experienced may benefit from that Is less has has less to do with the grip being supinated And more to do with the fact that when you grab a bar with a supinated grip and then you press down You're not able to hold on to a lot of weight and you have to slow down because your wrist is not strong And in that position like it would be when your hand is facing down So really what's ended up happening is it forces your elbows in And it slows down the fucking reps and so people feel it more same read the same thing Why people will grab a cable you ever see this people will do a tricep exercise and not even use a handle Right, they'll just grab the cable itself and do a tricep extension now. Why why do people find? Potential benefit in that Well, it slows you down like you're not able to drive through and press their weight stupa hard When you've got a grip on a cable or the end of the cable it's forcing you to slow down and concentrate and You know improve upon your technique and I think that that's where a lot of this comes from is Changing your grip or changing the angle Many times just forces you to go light and to slow down because you're not you're not used to that Now can you do that without changing your grip and the handle? Yes But sometimes we have to be forced a little bit to be reminded Uh to slow down in which case, you know, there's your and then there there's another one Here's another one that just popped in my head Control Okay, we'll always say control the weight you have good controlled reps Yes for the most part, but is there any validity to going a little loose with your reps? No, I think I think uh Cheat reps are a Valid tool to be used but I also think that is for pure breakdown There there there's a there's a place where you need to be and this is I've I have taught clients especially my clients that are Well trained or have been lifting for a long time on how to do a cheat rep Like there there is some value to being able to do that But also being able to control the rest of your body to maintain good neutral spine and good core Engagement while you do a movement like that. There there is some value to that But would I ever teach the average person? Is it that important that it needs to be in your routine? No, absolutely not, but can it be used as a tool? Yeah, I think so. Yeah Well, I feel the same I mean on that on that topic about like plyometrics and using like really explosive movement and like Because it's so it's so unique like it's If I use that before I was going to go into a squat Like we talk about paps But like the way that we would do it as far as like using You know these explosive moves to really like heighten the central nervous system and give you that max output So and I'm I'm bringing that energy and connectivity into the actual like compound lift That's a great technique, but it's very advanced So it's not something I bring up a whole lot, but it's it's something I do use with athletes to get them to hyper respond With heavy weight. Well, it's it has less to do with the form and more to do with the explosive nature Of the form and the problem with speed with your reps is that people don't typically have the control This is what makes the limit has to be there first. Yeah So, you know, someone is experienced like I know Adam and Justin can can do a fast explosive Barbell squat or bench press or a cheat curl or a cheat lateral for their shoulders And I know that they're going to have control over that speed Where they're not going to hurt themselves and there may yield the benefit of that Because fast contractions Applying force or speed to your force does activate fast twitch muscle fibers more so than anything This is why there's a lot of benefit to as however technical olympic lifts are Do you want to talk about a muscle building benefit? If you can see growth Look, I'll tell you what my my traps. I've worked them out forever hard to get them to respond You know snatch grip high poles Blown them up like never before and that is not a controlled movement I mean it's controlled in the sense that my form is good But but it's explosive and it's fast and I'm throwing the weight up and you know that application of that that kind of technique to You know just hypertrophy training I'm able to generate way more force into the lift and that a lot of times that's what creates the The speed and the momentum the acceleration that you know, you transfer to the bar You transfer to the ground and create those ground forces But yeah, it's a totally different mindset instead of like like controlled strength It's actually hard to teach That's a good example too with like the traps because the traps are such a small muscle that if you tried to Isolate the traps to develop them There's only so much weight that you can either you can shrug or lift with them where you do something more explosively like that Where you use momentum and and they're and they're primarily there for a stabilization muscle, right? That's primarily what the traps are utilized for so when you do something explosive and they have to stabilize You can do something much heavier than doing like these little Isolation type of trap movements that you're trying to do so there's a lot of benefit to that That's that what that's what blew my shoulders and my traps up was doing high poles And I used to just do like a snatch to an overhead press And that was like a those were staple movements when I was competing to help develop my Yeah, that's a good point because you can you can modify olympic lifts to make them The potential safer if for hypertrophy like there's no reason to do a a total a full clean Right if you're trying to build I mean you you'll get to get benefit from it But let's be honest is very technical But you could do a hang clean. That's exactly what I do hang clean to a press Yeah, hang cleans are easy to learn still require. There's still a learning curve So if you're listening, you've never done it start with no weight And get the same benefits and really that's that's where you need to start anyway to really master that The first part of that movement is the most essential anyway to to master And then the rest of it is just how do I manipulate my body and move it in a way that I'm Loose but then I can get into position quickly I remember too one rule that I thought was which we've talked about many times is not really a rule But for a long time I thought it was a bad idea everybody said never train a sore muscle remember that Like training a sore muscle you'll impede its recovery You'll prevent the muscle from you know building or whatever just let it rest let it recover In fact, I would tell my clients, you know, they'd come in and be like, oh, you're still sore here Okay, we're going to avoid that area because it's still sore Well, that's not true at all. Well, I broke that rule today today. So I'm my legs are pretty sore from yesterday And I went on the three mile hike or walk this morning early this morning and yeah every mile or so I would do walking like body weight lunges I would have never done that in the past if I was really sore the way my mind worked before is like it needs to recover Don't train it anymore. Let it rest feed it that type of deal Where now it's like if I'm really really sore and I know I overextended myself a bit That doesn't mean I won't still train that muscle It just means now I'm going to do things that are going to take it through its full range of motion And maybe do some kin stretch type of stuff. So really just promote more blood flow oxygen getting there It's only going to facilitate and speed up recovery. Absolutely. Yep And that's the biggest thing that I noticed from it is in you know Part of the creation of trigger sessions was discovering just that like if I get a pump in a muscle that's sore It recovers faster and it's almost like a turbo to How it builds and adapts and that was the fuel behind you know Figuring out that frequency could really be applied if you manipulate intensity, you know in the right way You know, so do you think there's any value to doing that like right after or you know fairly after Fairly shortly after you eat Like if you something that we used to do and this is a total this is total bro Oh, I know what you're gonna say this is total bro science right here to force the glycogen to muscle. Yes And I you know how long after eating what you'd eat carbs and then wait Well, when I was competing you got to think too being I would this is like me getting closer to stage time And I'm living in a deficit and then when I would eat I could just feel my body like absorb it pretty fast So it would be about 30 minutes or so Post a meal and I would do trigger workouts And man that I just it made me feel amazing. No, is it the pump? Is it that I was depleted? There's so many variables like that and so much so the theory is that that you you fill your body You eat carbs and then the goal is to drive those carbs to your muscles by Doing a light workout versus Where your body may turn it store it turn it into body fat And I can see the I can see the rationale behind it I don't know if that necessarily works or if you're just burning Off some of the glycogen so you don't store as much body fat. Maybe that's the case But there is something to be said about going into a workout Hydrated and then having carbohydrates in terms of the pump and it totally speaking I notice it, you know, I notice a big difference. Yeah, yeah, huge huge difference Absolutely That's one of the things that I had to get used to when we went when I went on this high fat low carbohydrate diet is My pumps are just nowhere near what they used to be and again That's what makes me wonder too that how much of the You know, carbohydrate intake that I'm doing right now is literally related to maybe hormonal like increases Or is it more the psychological piece? Because I tend to get these a better pump again because I'm shuttling more carbohydrates in there So, you know, this is a lot of this stuff is is, you know We are 100 certain exactly or I'm not 100 certain on, you know, if it is more psychological Or is it actually something physical that's happening? You know, it's one of those things in with resistance training where it's been observed by so many people And so many people say, yeah, I feel it this way or this is how it works And many times they're proven false, but sometimes This stuff that comes out and they're like, oh, it looks like there was some wisdom in what we've been saying, you know For so long that, you know science starts to support it. That would be an interesting one To figure out because I definitely noticed that as well. I've done that as well Where I'll eat carbohydrates and then an hour after especially if I'm hydrated I'll work out and it's like I get this really intense. I'm actually enjoying playing this devil's advocate that we're doing right now because there is a lot of things that Oh, here's a good one. I'll give you a great one If you do cardio, it will take away from muscle gains Not if if your activity consists of only weights and you're super inactive all day Because I remember that was my that was me. That was my mo Lift weights never do any other activity because I thought I had to conserve calories I thought I had to you know, didn't want to burn anything And then I started incorporating like walks like 30 minute walks post workout or whatever And I think it's just the improvement in my health that contributed to more muscle gains And I actually would do posts about it and say hey cardio If if it improves your health and you've got shitty cardiovascular health May actually contribute to well and also the better state Like stimulating my muscles in a different way when I would sprint or I would do explosive movement as in terms of cardio Like running hills and things like that like in do bursts I know the significant difference in my legs and my legs would just blow up You know, and then I would bring that back into you know The next phase where I would get back into squatting heavy and deadlifting and um just that that change of stimulus and and The the focus of of power and that fast twitch movement was really substantial And we haven't really you know, harped in on that yet as far as our programming Well, staying on the cardio train here something that I do that's you know Contradicts what we understand and know about the science behind it now is fasted cardio And fasted cardio we know now that when compared head to head with fed cardio later on the afternoon or whatever It's it's pretty damn close to what they eat. They burn as far as fat right doesn't really matter But what I have found is and why it's something that I still utilize as a tool Is that I wouldn't get up at six o'clock in the morning to do cardio unless I had this plan to get up and go Do fasted cardio at first thing in the morning and the fact that I'm fasted. I don't need to push myself that hard I don't have a bunch of glycogen stored up that my body needs to burn off So I'm pretty much in a fat burning state the moment I get on there and I start walking or moving So it allows me to kind of just walk for a nice hour taking easy stroll I can I can think I can work I can do what it meditate while I'm walking. It's such a It's such a useful tool for me and because The bros had pressed it so hard and then then the backlash on the bro And I know lane was part of this movement on the other side of talking shit about You know fasted cardio and I think it's because of how the bros had explained it for so long But there's some value to it and I've I have found a lot of value in And and really what it is it's the getting up earlier It's that I'm up earlier and I'm moving for an extra hour that I wouldn't be before and it just Starts my day off really really well and I notice a huge difference and that's something that You know, we've talked about before that, you know, oh, yeah There's no real value to doing fasted cardio and it's silly to do that But there's something to be said about training yourself to get up extra early and go move You know period whether you're fed or not fed and the way I look at it is it's not really hard for me to Not feed myself before I go walk for an hour So another one is uh, what do we hear post workout don't eat carb don't eat fat Right post workout because you need to speed up the assimilation Of the carbohydrates and proteins and there's a lot of myth behind that too because you still will replenish things If you eat later on but one of the best things I think you can eat post workout If you're really looking to replenish quickly and recover quickly It's it's cholesterol dietary cholesterol and it typically comes with a lot of fat And try eating look I tell you what try having like six egg yolks post workout with your post workout meal And watch what happens your muscles suck up Cholesterol at a very high rate in fact your your if they were to test your blood cholesterol right after an intense workout It's much lower and it's because your body is utilizing that cholesterol for Repair purposes so it makes sense to consume Dietary cholesterol just like it would make sense to consume dietary glycogen to replenish or dietary carbohydrates to replenish glycogen Try dietary cholesterol, but they always say like avoid the fat so people instead would have egg whites No, man throw some fat in there throw some some yolks and watch what happens It's if I'm going to eat anything post workout. It's that right there And that's the thing that I'll notice right absolutely another one could be you know We've talked about and I know I've probably been I remember early on when we talked about the Training every single day in the gym. I think there's value to that. I think there's something I think most people struggle with consistency and Scheduling time for themselves to exercise. I think it's just applied improperly I think that you know a lot of people that go go from zero to balls to the wall And and that's who we speak to when we talk about You know doing a full body routine three days a week will probably be superior for 90% of the people out there listening But if you're somebody who's been consistent and you're not a beginner and you've been training for a really long time There's there's I've found a lot of value in having a time that is always my gym time Six seven days a week and based off of how I've been training how I've been eating. I would manipulate Uh the intensity of that. There's always something you can do It's just a matter of scaling down that intensity and you know going through the movements and the skill of whatever you're You know, if it's a lift that you want to improve you can definitely like do that with like light load and have massive benefit from that It is and it You know, there's something I've been pondering to is I wonder, you know back in the day in the olden days Uh Bodybuilders and strength athletes used to take Literal time off from the gym every year like they'd take a month off or weeks off of nothing at all And I wonder if that's got any benefit I wonder if it's if it's a smart thing to do my buddies and I used to schedule a week off completely a week off It was like a something that we did or about it was about 10 I should say it's more like two weeks like 10 to 14 days Where we would take zero weights and it was it was scheduled that you know in the middle And I would do it after we've been training pretty hard and consistent for three or four months straight take it off I found value in it. I see I wonder if it like Reese because your body You know, it starts to adapt to the point where it doesn't want to respond anymore because you do it so often Well, and I think we tend to always continue like fasting from exercise I still and I think we still all continue to flirt with that that fine line of I mean because To make those gains right to adapt we have to stretch our bodies Or bodies abilities right so as you as you do this for a long a long time you tend to stretch Stretch yourself more than you are pulling back, right? So I think there's more value to somebody who's constantly stretching themselves than somebody who never stretches himself So I think it would be very unique to each individual if you're somebody Who finds themselves sore quite frequently, you know through the week and you're always kind of flirting with that line Because you like to train hard and you got serious goals and you're pushing yourself Then I could really see a lot of that in fact I remember I remember the first time I ever gave a client a scheduled week off of training And I remember telling her because she was the first time it was the first time I had ever did that because I felt she needed it I was like, man. I've never had a client this consistent train this hard for this long I've done that with some my and I remember telling her like, hey, you know I know you're not going to want to do this, but I want you to take a week off Like just I think it'd be good for your body. It's we've been hitting it pretty hard for a long time She was in her mid 40s. And I thought, you know, this would be really good for her other than that most clients struggle with consistency Yeah, it's not common. Yeah, like it's not it's more tough, right? And I think athletes or somebody who is like a serious lifter. I could see lots of Even Arnold used to do it. Yeah, there's pictures of him that are hard to fall under the serious Yeah, but yeah, there's there's harsh a little bit There's hard they're hard to find but there's pictures of Arnold that when he would be off season And he would look down right small compared to how he would compete and then leading into a contest many times He would gain weight Walking into the contest where you actually start to put on muscle to Kevin LaVroni I believe you should do that as well. I did that. I did that when I got well, of course I increased my anabolic, right? So I increased my testosterone going into my pro show, but I gained into those shows Yeah, yeah, I came I gained it. I mean I hit USA's Stage okay, this was only two months two or three months before I went pro at USA's 201 I hit uh, Frigno's in November. So it's July August or November. So July is when USA's is Frigno pro show debut is in November. I hit stage at 215 Oh, so you put on almost 15 pounds and you were still shredded. Yeah Wow, so I grew I grew into that grew into that show. That was the best I ever said that was a difference of how much like what in gear? Yeah, yeah, so I was at I was at 250 to 300 milligrams. I can't remember I was right around there So let's just say I was at 300 and then I was I pressed up to 500 when I went pro So that was the difference of 200 more.  That's where you were 201. Yes Oh, okay, and then you said they told you you're too big So I was too big before that so my amateur show There was my second amateur show I came in at I hit stage at 215 and they told me I was I was too big and so that's where I like and I remember then I think that was when I went to 300 Then I pulled it back down to 250 plus I was training not to get any bigger because they told me that so I was kind of I was leaning out trying to be leaner Coming into a show Then that's that I think it was two shows later when I went pro because then I won my first first Play show after that and then I went to USA's but then when I once I went to pro They they were like all the pros were big real big. So I was like, okay, I can now you can push it Yeah, I can push I'm excited. I can't wait for you to to follow map split under training yourself Yeah, more red right now somebody was asking why aren't you falling split and it's like so funny because I mean, here's the thing. This is why we it's a lot of volume ramp it up Yeah, there's no reason for me to fall a split like it's just I'm not there I'm not I wouldn't work. I'm no word near. I mean, yes, it would work. It would work I would see results. Could I could I do it? Yeah, absolutely could you but the way you're doing it is more appropriate and better? Well, it's more beneficial. I'm going to see more results consistently by You know applying the appropriate amount of intensity and volume to my body I went from being sedentary I mean to where I'm stepping less than 5000 steps a day not training at all to okay three days a week Like there's no I have no business training a six to seven week seven day a week protocol with high volume on top of that Like I first need to work up just to training Four or five days a week consistently first and then I'll start to increase the volume Then I'll go to six and then I'll increase the volume again Which means easily it'll be three four months before I even get to split, you know Yeah, I can't wait to you guys try because I'm now I'm in week like three or four or something like that And it's fucking great. It's a great program Well, it's it's you know, you know what I'm running when we wrote this one I and I when we wrote black I was like, oh, this is just like how when I was a competitor And you've probably heard me get going. Oh split is like when I was a competitor, but This really is the when when we started red was when I before I started competing I went out when you and I first kind of met we're talking and I started following that And then black was when I first Did my first show Split is kind of like the national level or show And I even moved to even greater volume than split, you know So it's the kind of natural progression of how I train what I really like about it Is the second body part workout of the week is the unilateral stuff that we threw in there I forgot all about that, but I've been doing it and I mean It's perfect. It's perfect because you already had a hard workout earlier in the week When you go unilateral you can't push the weight like you normally can But it's the control and technique that you have to focus on because it's unilateral stuff and pausing with the dumbbells You to slow down Yeah, dude, and so I mean I'm getting I'm really enjoying it. I really really enjoy it and it reminds me of how you can jack You 200 right now you said, right? Yeah, what what what I'm really happy what it reminds me is that it's even I Even as much as I know and all this stuff and I know my body It helps to follow a pre-written routine sometimes because I can still fool myself and get caught up in some old Shit, so I look at the program like oh, I want to do this over here But the program says this I'm going to follow the program because I know when we wrote it I was in the right state of mind I was in the middle of a workout trying to you know go do my favorite thing And it's been it's been working out Well, something else another rule that we kind of broke inside of map split or something that we talked about before That we utilize in here is we use drop sets and ramp like we do some stuff like that that's You know and and the idea of the programs Which is what really excites me is that we are now at a place where we're starting to incorporate Some of these techniques that we kind of talk shit about early on and the reason why we talk shit about them Because majority people just it shouldn't be a focus of yours if you're If you haven't followed a consistent routine for even one year of your life before Like getting into amram drop setting pyramid setting like bands chains all this crazy stuff like little to no value Like there's so much work to be done in the in the meat of your Your your programming and your nutrition and things like that that should be where most of your focus should be Now if you're somebody who's been training for years and you've been consistent like okay Like how would I program some of these types of tools or tips? Like this is an example and you get that in split which is pretty cool. You know, it's been you know, it's pretty impressive Is we were I was going through You know Jessica and I were going through so like how she started when she started working out With me and how our bodies changed and she had some old records of where she was at She weighed 135 to 137 when she first started and her body fat was in the low 20s She's now Between 119 to 120 and her body fat is in the mid to high teens like 16 17 percent That is a huge difference in lean body mass and fat if you if you look at that Oh, yeah, I mean in in that period of time and her metabolism went from 1200 calories were she ate anything over that she would gain weight to now She's over 21 200 calories. That's crazy. That's a huge difference In a relatively short period of time, you know, I mean, but I love seeing that because it just reminds me how how impactful Manipulating your training and nutrition can be on just changing Your body just changing how your body reacts to food and how well that's where we saw the biggest deficit Was everybody's focused on supplements everybody's focused on like all these other like factors and and For some reason we got away from the programming side of it and like actually doing something consistently Well, that's because most of these motherfuckers selling shit weren't personal trainers for a long time Like when you like when you've trained thousands of it's one thing if you're a guy or a girl who has got yourself into incredible shape You know that that's respect like that takes discipline Hard work and consistency for sure to accomplish that and I'm not taking any credit from that But there is a fucking huge difference between that person and the person who's trained hundreds potentially thousands of people That's a massive difference and seeing all the variables and seeing what a majority of people Where they're in consistencies are and what will really make the big difference when speaking to like what tops So the knobs to turn so yeah, so when you see these people on like instagram and social media that are posting about Different supplements and getting into these debates about how branch chain amino acids work You know this this latest Minute detail they even need to focus on yeah the time release of it and this one's better than that one It's like dude. Are you kidding me? Like are you even are you even applying frequency and intensity correctly? Are you pales in comparison phasing your programs out the right way? Are you doing any of these other?  How about are you even healthy? Do you know like a healthy body is gonna it's gonna adapt better and more efficiently You're walking around all inflamed and bloated and all this and you're trying to lose weight on top of it It's just like you never even like understood that like what i'm eating is like super inflammatory I just got a message from a young lady. She's like, hey, you know after real intense workouts I get really really bloated. So i'm like, okay. Well, how soon after your workout you eating? She's like all right after so i'm like, okay Why don't you wait a few hours because you're probably inflamed from your workout and see if you can eat and you know We'll identify it's a food intolerance or whatever and so her response is well, then i'll just have a protein shake That way it's easier to digest and it's like no You're missing the whole Yeah, the whole point, you know, I mean you're missing the whole point.  They're very informative. We have a guide to teach you how to do hit training properly How to build your legs you build your chest arms your abs There's like 12 guides. They're absolutely free to go to mind pump free calm Download them now. Also, you can find us on instagram You can find justin at mind pump justin adam at mind pump adam and yours truly at mind pumps out Go add me. I want to be your friend. 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