changes comments from the chair well the comments I have I think they're going to be taken up in items five and six so I get one thing we probably should talk about is that we have planned and we can talk about this again at the end of our meeting see whether we need to have a meeting is basically what I'm getting at we're not going to need a memorial day so I think at the end of this discussion tonight we can decide if we feel we need to have a place to be there or if we can just sort of mention that um so that's it for my comments from the chair unless we do anything else anyone general business comments from somebody in the public about not on the agenda there is no one present so we will move forward to item five I think I did go to the start presentation. Okay, yeah. If you go Tuesday, it was out in the shields, it was health as well. And we couldn't muster the court. I'm shielding everybody else's life. Was Bob a member of the committee? No, but he was in his heirs. Okay, so three non-members. Did you have a discussion? Well, I don't know. That's right. My favorite to discuss things with. Other things happen. Yeah. I was thinking of saying that the city. Okay, back to the next meeting. Okay, so back to item five update from the city council presentation. Mike, do you want to start us off? Sure, I can give a quick update on that. So first I just want to say Mike did a fabulous PowerPoint explaining what we're doing in the last year, what we're working with, you know, what we do, generally, what we're going to do, and where we would like their support. So we're helpful for framing everything for them, because there's a lot. Yep, a lot of new people. I think there's a lot of different committees to worry yourself. Yeah, and just to get, to make sure the council is aware of some of the things that they, you know, just make assumptions and just don't completely understand, you know, Kevin was in the audience was kind of watching the reaction of councilors on certain things. And some of them were kind of surprised to see that, you know, we were a department of four people, including me. You know, it's like, oh, the planning department is just four people. So, so there was those types of things. I thought it was, I thought it was good. I was tired. So afterwards I, the next day I had to go and just ask Bill. I'm like, that went okay, right? He was like, yeah, we're fine. So, but I thought it went good, gave just kind of an update generally and what the department does, what the planning commission was doing. And then we kind of kicked off a little bit of what we wanted, although we kind of had to pull back a little bit because the council is doing a strategic planning process this week to work on what they would like to accomplish as the new council. I think it was perfect timing. We presented the desire to prioritize the city plan and then prioritize, I mean, allocate staff resources for working on the city plan and gave a proposal of how we would start to do that right before their strategic goal meeting. Yeah, I think it was good. It was certainly good timing, but we didn't get the opportunity to kind of get a decision back from them that said, yeah, go for it because they're doing their more strategic work this week and next week and hopefully in a couple of weeks. Yeah, I think, I think we had a pretty good guess as to where people were leaning and what they wanted. So I think they'll see this as a great opportunity, not just for the city plan process, but just for all of their goals because they really want to, you know, different counselors have different ideas of what they would like to do, but all of them kind of tie back to the city plan being an opportunity to roll those out and explain how we're going to accomplish the goal. So, yeah, I thought it went really well. It's a good segue into item six. Sounds like a good segue. Let's get started on the city plan. We did a lot of the talking, but I did elbow my way into the game a lot more. Well, Mike was explaining the process that we were envisioning for taking off the city plan and I fleshed that out a little bit more. And also stressed the amount of work that Mike does for us and how their support would be really important in ensuring that he would have adequate time to work on this endeavor. So it was mostly bolstering the presentation that he provided but then also elaborating a little bit more about the city plan. Councilor's comments, city plans in general in particular. I bet they don't know what we're talking about. Get into any of the substance. Yeah, we didn't get too much into the substance, but there were a couple of them that were here from last year's re-approval, so Ashley and Anne and Rosie and Jack McCullough was on the housing committee, so he's familiar with the plan. So I think everybody's got a general familiarity, but none of them have been here to go through an actual re-adoption process. That was pretty profound for you last time. Yeah. Yeah, but I think that this process will be educational as it unfolds. Oh, yeah. Very, very well. It's a great vehicle. Council, think about some of the broad issues at the same time. So to label this, we're now talking about item six, city plan update discussion. So as I mentioned, I abled my way to the table and introduced myself to the council and explained that we were talking about or kick around this idea that we would advise representatives from the various committees, in fact the entire committee, to come to a kick-off meeting where they can present their top goals in a five-minute presentation and then stay afterward and socialize and enjoy refreshments. And then kind of on the fly, I realized it would probably be useful if we had two of these meetings because we have one where everyone hears what everyone else's goals are, but maybe we can give them a chance to go back and discuss amongst themselves with our own committees whether anything could be tweaked or tailored to a little bit more nicely with some of the other committee's goals, come back together to another all-committee meeting, and then we can figure out priorities from there. And I figured that some of this process in the front-end will help streamline later. That was my think-how. I suggested that, potentially having a second meeting to the city council, and they really liked the idea. They do want us to check in with them, which makes perfect sense, and it seems like it'll be a great opportunity to do that after the second all-committee meeting. So I wanted to get your feedback on this idea that council was on board with the concept. It wasn't anything that we'd need an official approval for. I just wanted to give them the idea of what we're looking to do. So what would happen if the second meeting would there be more discussion, or would it be...? So I think two things should happen, maybe more discussion. We would have to structure that. And the way I framed it in the letter, which we can modify in any way we like, but I framed it as you can come forward and say your goals again, if they change at all, but also where your committee thinks that those goals rank in terms of priority for the city goals, now that you've heard what some of the other goals are. Just to give everyone a chance to see how theirs fits into the broader picture, it's possible that every committee will say our goal is the number one priority for the city, and we'll have to do it anyway. I don't know if the opportunity might be a useful exercise, but what others think? I think there's some real value in having everybody hearing anybody else's plans vote some thought. So I like your idea of a second meeting. Or if after the first meeting, presumably there's some follow-up work for them to do, and that second meeting is a presentation of everything that they've all submitted, that they've curated in a way that brings it all together to get it done. We're going to be asking too much if we want product as well as... because part of the goal of these meetings is to have people thinking conceptually without being too much attached to their work. I find that once you start actually working on something, it becomes harder for you to be flexible in thought process. So that was one thought. I mean, maybe the end of the meeting could be talking about what an actual product is that they should be doing. That's my only concern with that. Otherwise I'd say, yeah, let's do that. We could make it a tentative second meeting and we could discuss the results in the first meeting and make sure it's done. We think that would be a good thing. I think the idea of having something else that comes next is helpful, I think, for people. You say we're going to come and talk about goals and we're going to come up and talk about just all of them. I think it can be that, but I think it would be helpful to have at least... doesn't have to be a defined product or something that's done, but at least the next step, whatever that is, I don't know what that would be. So are we thinking not to have the goals necessarily stated in the first meeting? I think that's important to have it in the first meeting. You think it's important to have it in the first meeting? I thought I was hearing the meeting reports, maybe asking them to come back with goals in the second meeting in the first one being more of... I was thinking they might revise their goals, but maybe not. Maybe that's not worth... Maybe it's more confusing. Well, I mean, following up on Stephanie's, maybe the proposal would then be on the second meeting to revise your goals and then to start thinking about what would be some of the strategies you might use to implement those goals, just to start to get them thinking about those next steps. So it's not rehashing the same thing. It is a little bit, but we're kind of taking them to that next level, which will be... All right, now let's start thinking strategically. If you're in economic development, what would you do to... If your goal is to create more jobs or to create more whatever, what's your thing that you're going to do to help move that forward? Or energy or transportation or housing? So we want to reframe the goals piece and say... How about this? What if the letter says we invite you to come in the second paragraph. At the kickoff meeting, we ask for a representative and I have some template language here from your committee. Present that committee's top three goals for the next ten years in a five-minute presentation. So I think there's some... I put some common bubbles here to say do we want to ask for a range of goals, three to five goals or limited to three? And what do you think is the appropriate timeframe? Ten years or twenty years? So I think based on this conversation we could say top three goals or however many number we want to do for the next ten years or whatever length of time we want to do but we could say in terms of we could use the language to evolve, maintain transform of how... I think we need to explain that a little bit in the letter too though if we're going to use that. Instead of using the word goals we want to pick a timeframe and say in Montpelier in ten years what would your committee like to see different? Pick three things that are going to be different about Montpelier in ten years and frame them in terms of what are they maintaining evolving or transforming something about our community. I like that because it's more with the content and not can we work... one of the concepts that we're trying to get to and then the second meeting could be pick one of those goals or whatever we want to call them and do a five minute presentation on the strategy with measure goals of how you propose we might get there or just what are measurable targets for those how will we know that that will we will accomplish wherever you want it to change. Mike, give them that for all of the committees. Most of them. Give them the basic idea of what we're trying to accomplish. Not within this context for all of them but most of them have heard the speech about language? Yeah, but they really haven't spent a lot of time teaching them and given the idea of what we had thought about when we were going to do this two years ago. Well, I think that's a big part of the whole community. Well, there hasn't been a lot of time to follow up with them to... Or else they're deciding that. But if that's the case then I think you're going to have to carry this thing up. This is what a city plan is and what goals it means to get there and we need some way to measure it. I mean, that's critical about your style of planning which is tell me what you want. Tell me how you're going to get there and don't just... Yeah, there's a lot of hand holding to force people not to you know, and that's for all of us to not take the easy road and just say we'll encourage it but maybe at the beginning and the end of the first time for Mike and the planning commission to address those expectations and I also agree I think Leslie said earlier about explaining out the way that John described it some concrete things that will better what expectations are about those goals in this letter. I think the better we explain in the letter, the very first letter about this what they're going to provide is what we want. Well, I think how do you want to see this city develop in your interest? So for the TDS task of editing I'm just curious what language we want to use for getting away from top three goals what do we want to replace it with? I think we'll put some things kicking around but I'm not sure I know how to edit this right now. Yeah, um I can try editing right now if you want. Sounds like educating and then asking for the first meeting makes sense. Then for the second meeting asking for how they propose and framework whatever we were calling Yeah What are the benchmarks? What was the terminology you used within the plan to do your goals and then what term did you use for the things to get to the goal? We had strategies for the second set and those were really kind of breaking into which I presented to council which was into those permits, programs Yeah projects, policies, so we're kind of breaking things into those how do you actually plan to accomplish those goals? Is it through regulations? Is it through one time projects? We don't have to necessarily get into all the nuts and bolts but we get certainly for the second meeting when we send out the second letter I don't think we have to describe fully how we would have the second meeting in this letter. I would think we could just go and say in the second meeting we're going to have one where we talk about the concepts of how we would implement or we would be asking you to come in and give a presentation of how you would implement one of your goals and we would give them not necessarily those specific things, would you do it through regulations? We could do I think more leading questions would you do it through regulations? Would you do it through a program? Would you do it? Well I think we could present that concept in the end the first thing Well, ultimately we're supposed to pull all these things together in this planning commission so maybe the second meeting is part of these goals and combat them You know, I can see a lot of goals and I can see kind of how it always is so I imagine it will work. So ask them to identify goals that they see as incompatible with the ones that they're advancing? Well we have our necks of how transportation and energy and housing and historical preservation and all of our housing which I don't think it does but I accept what you do so now I'm crashing out to see what it's really about for goals and combat and if it is real to what extent? Instead of asking about conflict when we ask about common ground now we ask how can historical preservation help housing help historical preservation? I just think it's going to land on our land so when we get the goals we're going to have so well A is A and B is B and we've got to talk to these people because if we invite them it's really a step So now you've seen these other committees that we have where you see places where you can collaborate with some groups and I'm not sure how else we can pull out the conflict in a more positive way Recognizing that we all have to be in the same situation together but the first moment for them is not thinking about what each group is trying to do What I thought I had was put the second meaning when we talked about implementation strategies to probably better for a second letter like what you were saying in the first one I think it might be worthwhile to try to to give the categories of implementation tools like regulations ones you mentioned I think a lot of folks might immediately go to a regulation and think in that world into maybe force people to think about using a variety of tools to get to their goals require something to be addressed in every preset of categories that we pull out and you know what those are we would be in a broad categories I think it would be a good idea to give that kind of format and ask for feedback on those categories I mean the other thing is depending on how we structure the meeting we've got the presentations from the different committees and depending on how much of the time it takes if there are any breakout groups maybe at the second meeting we have a session where we've got great people into groups where you can try to ask people to think about things in different think about how would you address this if you had to address this through regulations but now think about how you would address this through a program think outside the box is there a program or a project that you could do to accomplish the same thing we can require everybody to update their windows or we can give a tax credit to people who do that it's not a requirement but we're doing that with the sprinklers we had a sprinkler requirement that was obviously regulatory and then we also had sprinkler tax credits to try to encourage people to do it how they eliminated the regulatory one for homes but the tax credit piece is still out there so there's still an incentive for people to go through and put in sprinklers into their homes and there's a lot of those that certain ones have an easier time you know transportation is easy to find regulation that works for transportation and a program that works because the CIP program are replacing a bridge as a project so there you go we want to put in bike lanes we have a side money and we put in a bike lane there's no regulation so they'll have easier ones to go through but I think some of the other ones might be more challenging we told the council that was part of my presentation last week was to let the council know that part of this is deciding who's handling what piece public transportation is that transportation committee is a community services somebody has to be responsible for planning for that and ultimately the planning commission is going to be the arbiter of those areas where there's conflict where energy committee might want to see those old historic windows get replaced while historic preservation wants to protect them somebody's going to have to be the one we'll make the first round of recommendations and we gave them the heads up they will be the ultimate arbiter of what our policies are going to be but I don't think we don't need to worry too much about because I think there's going to be few of those conflict points but they're going to come out would it make sense for the second meeting to be more of a community wide meeting? we can do anything we want we can have four meetings the two suggestions from the council one was that they thought maybe we would benefit from a facilitator than having us do it and then the second one was that there was concern that while we were working a lot with committees we weren't doing enough to do public input and whether there's a different avenue for that or this is built into this one so if the second one is more of a community wide one facilitated by someone like a Paul Costello certainly many can certainly ask them to explain that as part of their presentation would it make sense to we talked about using the second meetings to flesh out implementation and then for after that meeting it seems like this group will have a lot of information to kind of consolidate once we kind of put a draft together we possibly have a public meeting on that this is what we put together from everything we've got gathered so far from the committees and start the public stage at that point what about this I like what everyone's saying I'm just going to reshuffle a little bit I know well we're bouncing off each other it's helpful so the first meeting I think we kind of all we have to fine tune it but I think we've got the concept down the second meeting could be inviting public and have more of a community-wide discussion about the goals for the city at that point then the third meeting could be developing the strategy for measuring whether those goals have been achieved in any way and then we would have that to work with that we will have the public input before we spend the time working on the strategy one thing that would be supportive of having a third meeting being about implementation you get the committees longer which could be a concern for some of the committees so that again they would have longer between the goals and coming up with implementation we can do this as much as we can I could just send an update to the council we've decided to add in a couple extra meetings but the concept that I pitched was that more process up front is probably going to help us streamline later they seem supportive of that I think after we have all this information we've identified where the conflict points are and how we can present what our conceptual recommendations are to the city council priorities for the city and get their feedback before we tell everyone okay let's start really thinking in one thing I've noticed through my day job is that people are asked in the abstract do you get feedback but if you put a document in front of them to respond to oh my goodness you get all the feedback so if we can think about that whenever we do reach out to the public giving them something to respond if our goal is to rather just kind of get a feel for things and have it be not reactionary maybe not put something in front of them but I think we would get a lot more feedback and probably get more stronger opinions if we put something in front of people so just like some of this is something to remind depending on what we want from the public yeah yeah the problem though we just have to balance that with the perception that we've made our minds of already it's the having something that looks really polished can be a bit and I think the amount of time it's going to take to put together a draft I think we do need to have something but I think if we were focusing on our goals and aspirations and just trying to get those ideas out to the public and start to say this is where we want to go because ultimately we're going to have to sit down and take a lot of time to actually put together the writing of the the document when it starts putting pen to paper and reviewing it with committees and stuff it's going to take a lot of time but we do want to get their input early in the process so they help the public helps to set the direction if we think oh we're going to go over this way and they're really not going to be interested in having that that be a policy it is to catch 22 though if you don't have it there then you can put out a lot of the committees ideas from the first meeting hours and say here's what we heard what do you like and what are we missing that way we're not starting with sure we should throw out any horrible ideas right away probably but something tells me we're not going to get too many horrible ideas and get a sense of what people's priorities are how would we put that out though I mean I think that's the piece that we've got to figure out the details and we don't want to have a draft of the city plan obviously but we don't want to have something that's too abstract we won't get any feedback on at all so maybe we're going to be working on this public document portal like a little better word we could use that we just have to figure out how to present the information in a way on that whether it's through a memo everyone loves memos right well sorry I'm a lawyer I write memos maybe not memos like a bullet list of what the goals are you want a map I want a memo I think the point of having something that makes me nervous that makes me nervous and I never practically speaking we're so far from that even being possible but an outline that looks real or looks like these or what the goals are it looks like the goals will be at this stage I mean something like that we have one page I think we could have that from the first meeting from someone who's been working and have something that people can respond to but also say that this is a moment of this is what our process is going to look like we'll have these other opportunities for you to get involved so that they know what's coming but I think if it's there I think if we had even if it was just a one page not really type but it was just you know that describes each of the committees that came up you know what ended up coming out from the parks committee what came out from the conservation committee these were their goals and this is what they wanted to accomplish in the next ten years now what does the public think about that you know and you might hear from people that goes and says all the parks committee ever cares about is Hubbard Park we want to see parks that aren't Hubbard's parks and we want to see parks that are in my neighborhood and that's great that's you know that's the input we would want to hear from the public is don't worry about that and if the goals for the parks committee were Hubbard Park Hubbard Park Hubbard Park that might be a valuable thing to hear back is well maybe we need to think a little less about that I don't think that's their goal I actually think their goal is actually the exact opposite they are trying to get to reach out to these other neighborhoods as an example only as an example only yes but I mean it's the same idea you know what transportation committee how they prioritize if they say look our big thing is to prioritize complete streets and getting the bike lanes and if you hear more from people that says we're actually more concerned about expanding and building on our sidewalk network or parking is the most important thing then okay we could take that under advisement that but I think if we had just a brief thing for each of the committees the public would have something to react to to go and say this is what we hear from the committees what does the public think of the committees ideas what if in between after we have sort of an initial kickoff with the committees we have an opportunity like a one question survey that goes out that asks people what would they want to maintain the Volvo transform so that we collect those ideas when we present them it's not just the committees it's like the committees and anyone from the public who can submit it any time and we can collect those in the centralized place the last priority is if we can promote alternative forms ways for people to participate that aren't necessarily meetings which don't work for everybody yeah I mean now that I have a young child I don't know why a whole demographic is missing during that hour or two hours but I think the maintain evolve transform is a good basis to work from I think a lot of the a lot of the comments that we heard in the zoning process a lot of it came back to not trying to change my neighborhood there was a lot of that maintain and we don't want that to come across as being a negative thing it's like you guys just want to change everything it's like well no now this the opportunity to go and say if there are things you don't want to change valuable is hearing about the things that you do want to have changed so right and be specific don't say you want to maintain the character of your neighborhood that's the most useless thing anyone could tell us what about your neighbor alright so let's see where we are um the first meeting we're going to ask the committees to have a representative give a presentation of areas that they would like to see maintained evolved or transformed it would limit that to three to five items uh we'll also give them a little bit of an overview of how to use that language and I think we're going to have to do it in a letter if we want to if we want them to do that at the meeting itself so I can take a crack at it and send it to you for editing might because I'm probably going to get something wrong um and then at the end of that meeting we'll say okay we're going to take what you told us today and write up summaries that we're going to send out or no you think that we should just do a survey without like a cold one yeah I mean we can put all of that up what those responses were but then we can also people can see those but they can also just put out a cold survey with some introduction to here's a creative plan but I don't think I'll hold up so we can do that simultaneously how do we find a lot of people know about how to do this in a bit I think from porch forum we'll get us pretty far there's a lot of people in from porch forum I assume we could post a link on the send Kim door to door huh second I assume we could put a link on the city website and then we could put a front porch forum reminding people of it yeah and a call to a reporter yeah and the second meeting is that where we sit alone for that are we going to do more public input there or are we going to just take public input not in the meeting and do a second meeting talk about strategies for getting accomplishing the first and the second meeting after okay if we move towards like I'm sorry I was just going to say I like still having a second meeting for public input even if it's just to go and say so far give people you know give people multiple venues to provide comment and still use that as an opportunity to get more I think that the union audit program could be good for that oh right but it's not huge but I don't think we're going to have if you're worried about there's a mistake there I'm going to facilitate there and ask about if you go through the goals as they look like they are now they're going to be back that way a goal, a goal have people go around with their stickers each committee has its own little section in the room and they have to convince the public that their goals are something else to be standing there and talking about I don't know some sort of breakout like that I think it could be a couple and I could start with what is that what is that what is that what is that what is that more urban design that doesn't tell me much at all like trying to have some sort of design problem oh it's a problem you get a hypothetical to start to work on and it's supposed to start thinking about how to it's kind of an education slash public it helps to educate the public on you know here's your map where would you put the 100 new houses if you had to put 100 new houses in town where would you put them and so you start forcing people into different scenarios where they've got to start to think about do we put a couple in every place or do we put them all in one place or so for our second meeting I mean I know Kim's opinion is that we should probably wait and see how the first meeting goes which is a valid opinion obviously and maybe that's what we want to do but the other suggestions I'm hearing are we could invite the entire community to a big place like the union school auditorium and have an initial presentation about what we've learned from the survey results and how that correlates with what we've heard from the committees in the all committee meeting give have more of a general opportunity for people to give feedback or after that presentation we could then say okay we're going to have the committees in different sections of the room and they're going to be able to talk more about why this is something they want to see over the next 10 years and you can go visit them so that way people can go from one place to another I do think there's value in having something like that maybe not as a second meeting but at some point where people can wander around and really understand why this should happen or why these goals are conflicting or you know just what are doing more deep insight if you can access any committee at one time or if you're just shopping it might be really useful so that being said I don't think we have a clear direction of what we want to do for the second meeting we can have a plan from that yeah we could they will present next steps and get public input it seems that no matter what at some point there will be an implementation oriented meeting with the committee that would be the third meeting we're still going to have a second public meeting in the third implementation meeting we don't need to know for the meeting yeah I just think if I can be as detailed as possible in the initial outreach then it's going to save me from having to respond to live emails and phone calls because people will understand what the process is I think of that first letter just being as important as please present your ideas at the first meeting using these three terms yeah you have three slides and three minutes I'm just going to give them five minutes isn't there a lot of committees quite a few that's a question for Mike every time I start to write them down I always end up with keep finding more I think three minutes is good they're just going we ask them to get we'll have like an on deck thing and they have to stand on obviously we're going to put Stephanie and John in charge of yeah I don't think we do need a facilitator I could be the MC I could be the MC we're all here today folks Stephanie is going to hold you here I'm going to switch the slide when I decide to I hate sitting in the dark looking in the screen disembodied voice talking how are you going to plan that well it can't be this the answer is I like your idea of somewhere else maybe smaller which ones standing right next to me yeah three slides is a good idea three ideas I don't think we can get away from the PowerPoint all together Kim which is I think where you're going but I think there needs to be some visual yeah exhibits if you've got a presentation if you've got a place where you can do presentations that's set up for it you don't have to be in the dark I mean you can watch you know TED Talks they're not all standing in the dark they're standing in the light and they've got PowerPoints going behind them it's just a matter of getting the lighting correct on the screen don't know facilities here there might be some here there's a pavilion that's the presentation I think the planning department should check this out and find out how we can have an effective if we want this slide to look very specifically we can find out one template that isn't really extensive it just says committee name one quick thought and if you remember the words that is it's not like a huge paragraph on the screen it's just two lines of text I don't even see the speaker have a person visible or something's going on I don't even get a place out I think the auditorium just have the lights on at the stage probably got a lot of negotiations for the presentation I volunteered to call venues and I haven't so I'm wondering if someone else wants to volunteer for the channel because it's available I can I've got a lot of letter writing I can't make any promises that the lighting is going to be selected it sounds like there's a pretty high standard it makes us a herd of such a place I've seen I've been to places where they've had presentations and you're not standing in the dark I think the only concern is a dark enough unless there's a place that's got a large screen television I think I know that's our first goal you can bring their lights yeah I think we could say you're in this order you need one person for your committee and if this person's on you they have five minutes and you need to be up here so they can go next it's a quick transition number 12 I just think the whole of the audience is attention so do we have a projector available I think we'd have to look at what the location is we can get projectors probably the planning department has one that's now I think on loan over at the senior center we have a portable screen we do but it's not it depends how big you're looking so how do we prefer there's movie night on the state lawn in the summer how are we doing that there's the equipment we need right on the state house well yeah but I mean that's the equipment that we need is for that so I'm assuming Montpelier alive puts that event on so maybe just a call to Montpelier alive could be give us what we need about the equipment we have available yeah some ideas I mean a projector can go onto a wall as long as it's white so we have a good wall and we don't need a screen but but I was just asking to see if we were flexible if we could run our own yeah yeah it's going to be a small projector on this guy well I mean she's that's her business projection yeah projection that's another score that's our next that's our first city goal is a presentation space we can do anything the first meeting you want people to watch a projector we want to do yeah I can find a venue we'll need a second projector to say who's on deck but you can handle that can someone in the back have like how much time you have left with that like law school does that person also have the button over next well we have some fine tuning to do for our first meeting but I think old man is okay so you'll check into equipment and venue that the timing for this the last week in June at the earliest so we have to give everyone an awful notice yeah so June or July yeah see what availability is and what day of the week in time do people think could be good I mean nothing's going to be perfect for everyone so we could do it at this time Monday evening at our usual time but that might not be I think that's the way to do it I might just get to this for the clutter you're meant to be retired I know I'll be cluttered okay so I guess our meeting time would be June 25th June 25th or I'll keep my fingers crossed it's usually hanging time but I'll keep my fingers crossed actually I'm supposed to be on that week so we appreciate a July okay and then July 2nd probably sounds like not a good day well we're second and fourth so I'm going the first two weeks July 16th is it July 30th you're still going on the 16th no I'm not you're going on the first two weeks I'm going on the first week second or fourth Monday in July July 6th to July 9th or 23rd at 9th and 23rd there's also a fifth Monday in July I think we want to push the late I'll see you from July 23rd and then we'll see what if we do an off week for us what about July 16th that's DRB we'll just cancel their meeting yeah I'm convinced you could do that right you're appointing our plan July 23rd or 30th 30th thing about that day right because the DRB doesn't meet on the fifth right okay the 23rd or 30th thank you Kirby yes I think my turn is up everybody's going to get reappointed we'll get kicked off the next month you're all getting reappointed what did we do wrong was there a a charter charter change yes yes because what we've had in the past for the charter was that everyone gets appointed for two years regardless of when you get appointed so it's not like a seat that everyone we're going to reappoint in the June meeting and you know if somebody leaves in October they're reappointed to finish out that seat for the next year or two years whatever's left that's not the way the charter is written now so what we have they're going to go through and reappoint everybody's seats so everybody presumably they're going to reappoint most of everybody I would think yeah and they're going to go back and stagger everybody and have a conversation do we know who's up now I think that I mean I haven't heard but I know if legislature is going out I assume they've approved our charter change so probably in the next few weeks the council is going to go through and reappoint because they've got to redo the DRB as well who's really messed up they've got nine members of a five seat commission so there's plenty of alternates for any applications just like a house gets cluttered after a while gotta clean it up yeah okay so the next thing is do we want to talk about technology in the context of this letter it sounds like the letter itself is going to have enough to address without talking about how we're going to file sharing so we can do that and it's presented as the meeting yeah okay I did talk to Seth beforehand and where we ended up allowed us to say Seth could go home because I don't think necessarily would have got a lot to go over although I wasn't we didn't ask about if we have any web options for public input but we can follow up and ask the upshot though was that Seth will create essentially a folder on the city's Google Drive and then give me edit ownership over that folder for which I can add everyone so that they can edit it and within it we can create essentially a framework of either forms or Google Sheets for how we want these different elements of the plan structure so part of it will be like the what so like goals and measurable objectives and then like the how so actions, policies or strategies or whatever you want to call them and then identify with all of those what do we need to know like is it going to cost money who's going to do it when is someone going to do it into the high priority to low priority collect things in a systematic way and then allow all the committees to have their own if they'd like and we can just have them all funnel into a single place so that you can see which ones are actually could be combined or it also allows this to be totally transparent so we can allow anyone to have a view access to what's in there and also the other part of this was to create essentially a site like a page for the plan that we could all control and add to and edit fairly easily and quickly so that could be a landing page for anyone to go either to find out about what's happening or to provide input also a place for all these other documents like the economic development strategic plan that was developed or the all the NITS-0 Montpelier plans they can all have one centralized place where you can go get a lot of that background information That's great Are there questions or thoughts or concerns about that? I'm not sure if you work on this because I don't know anything about it It sounds like you haven't anything to do with it Yeah In the next meeting you can give us a quick tutorial of how you're managing it working and then we can provide that for the all committees but we'll just make sure we all understand it first Yeah throw some drafts around to try to tackle that initial piece with me So here's what I see as the next steps for this. So I'm going to redraft this letter and send it first to Mike because I'm going to be introducing the language of maintaining and transforming the world and I'm going to want to make sure I've described it correctly and I will send it to the group but we're going to need the venue information before I send it out anyway So I think I'm going to ask you to take a look at the letter draft when I send it to you but also if you can put together a list of all committees we need to send it to that would be very helpful Kirby's going to work on finding a venue for July 23rd and 30th Jon's going to work on the Google Drive shared doc stuff Stephanie are you up for drafting some language for a survey? Sure We could all work on or take a look at the next meeting because we're thinking about sending that out making that available to the public simultaneously with our first meeting so it doesn't need to be a meeting but I just wanted to put it on your radar I didn't want to kind of sign camp but I don't think there's anything else Can you be my cheerleader? At least once You're going to Historic Preservation you've got a lot I think that's it Is there anything else that you want to think of with this? Okay Okay, yeah, so next item Yeah, there you go Consider item 7, consider minutes from April 23rd, Kim just moved approval Do we have a second for I'll second Okay discussion, Kirby has a comment Excuse me I just wanted to point out that it says that I had talked to Eric from Historic Preservation once the committee which I've interpreted to mean Historic Preservation Committee to provide guidance for historical preservation I don't recall Eric saying that I don't recall saying that exactly it may have been I wasn't being very clear what I was saying but so just to clarify for everyone in case they have an impression Eric and I just talked about opportunities for preservation to be that committee to be used to work with us in the future the topic we were talking about was to address affordable housing and stuff like that Probably just for the details and make it in here So if you have I don't, there doesn't need to be a change Well, we want them to be accurate and if there's some things that we can do Yeah, it's a little big Don't Eric I would say just instead of Eric wants to say Eric is interested in working with the planning commission block That's motion to move Any other discussion? All those in favor of Kirby's motion It's still on the table Okay Kim and John are still on the table John's here for a second I was wondering if we knew this Your second still applied to them Looking to amend the minutes It's good to approve the minutes It's been all those in favor Say aye Okay They are amended and approved Final item is adjournment Do I have a motion? All those in favor? Okay, we are adjourned Thanks everybody


Good afternoon everybody I'm Tommy O'Brien coming to you live from TFNN 12 noon eastern time on Tuesday middle of the trading day and we got markets oscillating in both directions you have an S&P positive by one point right now trading at 4526 you zoom in the on the action overnight your size 4542 you give up a lot of those gains coming into the open you trade down to about 4512 since then about 945 a.m. market catches a bid we're trading at 4526 Nasdaq 100 the only index in the red right now might be a little bit of a reversal in terms of tech stocks quite the acceleration yesterday will pull up Microsoft one of the stocks really accelerating Microsoft Google Apple making new all-time highs yesterday as well but given back some of those gains today we get the Nasdaq 100 down about 21 points the Dow's off 53 excuse me Dow is positive by 53 points catching quite a bit early this morning we were down at 35,260 you're up 140 points from where we were just after 930 in the Russell bouncing back to where we were pre-market as well there's some volatility for you on the Russell on the open down to 2256 up to 2270 Bitcoin down about $1300 47,420 gold contract with some volatility in both directions this morning we're trading at 1810 down $2 on the session you got crude down 42 cents at 68 79 and notes and bonds pretty muted action you got the tenure right now down about three ticks trading at 133 13 that is going to correlate to a yield of 1.3% 1.305 to be exact we'll call it 1.3% technically you round up to 1.3 1% if we're going two decimal points to be exact a little bit rising yield on a lower price day for the tenure we jump over to the volatility index with the VIX 1635 we reach 1591 last night jumping around to some of the stocks with action today we talked about it this morning zoom with their earnings down 16.1% jumping over to the headline for zoom before we get to Microsoft zoom in terms of their numbers decent numbers $1.36 a share market was looking for a buck 16 revenue a billion dollars versus 991 expected for the quarter but not good when your chief financial officer says they face headwinds as businesses reopen what we're seeing quote unquote headwinds in our mass markets these are individual consumers and small businesses not quite the growth that they had during the shutdowns originally originally so zoom trading a little bit lower and how about Microsoft they're going to be releasing Windows 11 October 5th fast market just had a great segment to wrap up their program on Microsoft and man quite a run it has been jumping over to Microsoft no real reaction on that news probably pretty expected but man you take a look at the run this thing has had from 240 up to 303 they got 7.5 billion shares folks every 10 bucks 75 billion dollars thanks for tuning in stay tuned we got a man Larry Pez


My entire life, I always look for people that can help me get from where I'm at to where I want to go. Those that are willing to sacrifice, or those that will go to the next level. If there's no sacrifice, there's no next level. Would everybody agree? Yes, sir! I don't want to be anything like normal. So if they're abnormal, then I'm grateful to be around them. Because I don't want to be around normal people. Because normal people work a 9 to 5, they're broke, they never go on vacation. They literally get married and their wives fall out of love with them.   They help no one else in their life. They literally walk around with a hole in their heart. They're going to die with regrets and they're going to be sitting on a bedpan one day saying, I had a decision I could have made. And I took a left and went EZ Road, the four lane highway that most people take, the 99%ers. Or I could take the 1% road. Look in the world, look at people's perspective. Most of you have a perspective right now that you're fucked. And you're in prison or things can't get better. Dude, you're literally telling yourself the lie. Matter of fact, the problem isn't another giant.  You are. I'm saying your internal fire should be like, dude, no one's going to close my deals. You know why? Not because I'm a prick, not because it's all about me. But because I want to prove to myself that I'm as good as I need to be. I'm going to do this for me and my family. I'm going to fight for my family.  Notice I said hungry. If you're not hungry, you're out. Want an opportunity. What does that mean? Grateful. Okay. Grateful.   You know what average people make? Average money. You know what kind of lives they have?  Is that what you want?  You want to know why I'm mad?  What else do you do all day long? Goff. That's what you do.     There's this thing called when the pain overrides, the fear of change, people will finally change. When the pain gets so high that you're like, dude, I don't care how embarrassed I get, I'm going to change that. I'm going to change right now. That's when usually the greatest part of all of you come out.


Everything has now been brought up. We created this wonderful area. The ceiling used to be just at the top of this double plate. We've now extended it up to the floor joist. With the beams, we've now boxed them in, ran all new duct work down to the crawl space because we're putting in a new furnace in the crawl space, cleaning up the room in my utility room with a Panasonic ERV using Swigit. Remember all about this healthy homes that I keep talking about.  That Panasonic ERV gets turned on right away, right to full, bringing that fresh air back in. It should always run 24 hours a day. Anyhow, this is going to be the island. It's 10 feet. We're going to have cabinets on this side, overhang, waterfall going down. It's going to be wonderful. I'll clad the posts in. I didn't block them, but because the structure was different than we expected, I had to work with it. This is now a full kitchen. It was all the way down here, across here, and that's going to be coming in soon. Bit by bit, we are getting this done. Electrical is roughed in, plumbing is roughed in, HVAC is roughed in.


I'm interior designer Ariel Okan and welcome to my home. Curating a beautiful table arrangement is sure to elevate any dining experience. I like to start with laying out the essentials. A beautiful tablecloth, chargers, and plates. When it comes to my tablescape decor, I always mix traditional items with the unexpected, like using my Le Creuset utensil crock to display flowers instead of a typical vase. This is also a great way to get some extra use out of my favorite cookware. Adding candles to the table creates soft lighting and a calming environment for dining. The warm lighting seamlessly complements the other elements of decor no matter the vibe I'm trying to create. When designing a space, it's the final touches, like these Le Creuset mini-co-coats that make all the difference. It's the finishing accessories and unexpected design statements that really complete a room.


I'm here today to talk about digital footprints. I usually start with this slide, the definition of sustainability, because I normally don't talk to people a lot that understand what sustainability actually means. I talk a lot to industry people. I talk a lot to software engineers. And it's always helpful to remind people that sustainability is not about just green or environmental sustainability. It's a balance of three things. And today, in most of these things, we don't actually have a way to measure it. I'm going to talk about the environmental aspect today, because we don't have a way to really measure the social impact of the digital world. Now, aside from sustainability, the other really important word, of course, hello, the other really important thing. And I hope I don't have to explain this to you. I feel like you all should know when you're at this conference is the word sustainability development, because that's really what it's about right now is to figure out a way how we can grow our society, how we can evolve as a society in a sustainable way, balancing the needs of today with the needs of tomorrow. And if you have two kids like me, then you have basically direct stakeholders in this process. What does it mean for us at the SDA? We are a non-profit NGO, and we basically have one very simple ambition, is to really figure out the path for sustainable development of the digital world. If I translate that into really simple words, what we're trying to figure out is, how can we digitalize more? How can we have a bigger digital economy that has no negative impact on people, planet, and economics? And I think that's important. I often these days I'm very negative about the digital world, but I think it's at the end, I'm a software engineer. I do believe that digital technology has a role to play, but we really have to make sure we have transparency about the downsides, and we know what we're getting ourselves into when we say things like, let's digitalize the entire society. And then I often get this, especially when I talk to industry people that say, Max, what's the problem? It is already figured out, right? It's perfect. Especially when you have statements like Google, as a non-profit, I get to really point a company, so I enjoy that very much. It's my favorite statement. Carbon neutral since 2007, it blows your mind, right? It's like they knew that there was a problem of carbon before anybody else knew, and back then they already solved it, which I think is incredible. Of course, if you look into the details, you will know that they, of course, lobbied the definition of when they can say this based off the GHG protocol. So the telcos and the tech companies together decided that only energy matters, which is, of course, incredibly silly. If you look at the footprint of these devices and even more so servers and storage systems, then you will know that energy is a problem, that it's definitely there, but decarbonizing the energy system is not the role of tech companies. But if you read these statements, you don't really feel that there is a problem. And that brings us to why you're here, is we need to know what the problem is, right? What is the environmental footprint of the digital world? We don't know. But Lord Kelvin suggests we ought to know. And in order to explain it to you, because it's really difficult, especially when you talk to environmental scientists, I often get this max, there cannot be an environmental footprint of the digital world, because it physically doesn't exist. I'm like, yes, I get that. But I'm still trying to figure it out. So I'm going to take you a little bit on a journey about IT with some mental models that help you think about it and then we can talk about how to measure things, at least in a principled way. And if you stick around a little bit, Anna will come later with a very practical way, Anna Tarara. I'm more the meta guy, even though you can also ask me any technical questions on how to do it. So the journey, the meta guy. So I mean the nerdy word, meta, the abstract guy. Because I think it's important that we have a way to talk about this, right? I think we often get lost in the terminology. Now, when I started building software, it looked like this. There was a software application that I wrote, that I put on a server that I usually installed myself. That server was in a data center. I knew where the data center was, and all of it is connected through fiber networks. Very straightforward, right? Then every two to three years, the IT sector, including me, we introduced another layer of abstraction, which is something we are very good at. So the first one was virtualization. So then you didn't know any more on which physical server you are. It could have been 20, 100s, 50. Then we introduced something that's really hot right now. It's containerization, which is basically to slice the application into even smaller pieces and lose even more connection to the actual physical infrastructure. And then this is the best one of IT, serverless. Why? It's so funny, because it still runs on a server, of course. But you get the idea that we are trying to tell people there is no infrastructure. Don't worry about the infrastructure, but the infrastructure is always there. And then came another layer of abstraction that really made this even more difficult, which is obviously cloud. And it has this misconception that if you are in a cloud environment, you have these availability zones. And there is this misconception that an availability zone equals a data center, but that's actually not the case. So you don't technically know in which data center you might end up in the cloud. You know you are in a specific region, but you don't know where you are. You know literally nothing about the physical infrastructure that your application is running on. And observing all these facts, all these layers of abstraction, and then you go ask this question, what's the environmental impact of the digital realm? Well, I don't even know which server I'm on. I don't even know which server is plugged into which data center. I know nothing. And then you tell me, please measure it. It's very, very, very difficult, which is why, of course, I'm a software engineer.  Of course, you need a different way to think about it.  Yeah, but it makes it a bit easier to think about it and to talk about it with you and others. So to explain this model a bit, there's digital infrastructure. And I'll apply it so that you see how it can be applied in different contexts. There's digital infrastructure, data centers, servers, laptops, fiber that generates digital resources. Don't worry about the definition for now. There is another layer on top of that that allocates these resources. This is what we often refer to as cloud or hosting companies that produce them and then allocate them. And the software application then consumes those resources, those digital resources. And that application provides a product or a service or an experience to a user that is then using that application. Very simple. Now, why is this model very useful? Because you can apply it, for example, to this laptop. You can say the laptop represents digital infrastructure. The operating system on the laptop is a resource provisioning technology, which decides which application, at this point, it's the slides, is getting all the resources. And then you have a software application, which is the slides, in this case, that are consuming those resources. So this works in this context, but it also works in the context of a data center and servers. You have this idea of digital resources that are flowing through the system. Now, if you have this concept of a digital resource, you can do something very powerful. Because you can then assign an environmental footprint to that digital resource. So we're not measuring the environmental footprint of an application, but of the resources that the application consumes. If I know the footprint of all steel bars in this building, I can get relatively close to measuring the footprint of the entire building. And literally, software only consumes these four types of resources. That's it. And a server or a laptop is a converter. It converts electricity and resources into these four digital resource primitives. And that's also what the cloud is built upon. This is what it means to have digital infrastructure that produces resources. And we figured out a way at the SCA, and it's all public. It's all open source, open access. You can just get it on our website. Or we are trying to figure out a way how to basically apply the lifecycle assessment methodology to these resources. Again, difficult because any environmental scientists you ask, they don't like that we're trying to do this. But I think it's useful. Now, with this idea of digital resources on top of this LCA that I can then apply, I can do something else. And that's even, in my opinion, even more powerful than measuring the environmental footprint of an application. I can measure waste. Because the biggest problem in IT is not necessarily that applications consume a lot of resources, but that we have lots of, lots of capacity standing around your laptops, data centers all over the world that are just there to catch peaks. So when everybody goes shopping, then there needs to be a lot of servers to be able to serve all these people. And when these servers are not being used, they're still running. They're still consuming energy. They're still consuming resources. And with this methodology and this way of thinking, you can then not just calculate how much does the application consume, but how much is it wasting on the infrastructure. And that wastage is something we need to address. That is something we can address right now. And, yeah, period. You can do a lot of other interesting things with this model, but it really helps to have this idea of a digital resource flowing through a system because it makes it a lot more easy to communicate about this and the problems in this value creation chain. Good, that was the measuring part. Now, you can measure it. That doesn't make it sustainable. Just because you can measure something, doesn't make it sustainable at all. So there is a second thought model that we use at the STA. And that's very important to me because in the world of IT, in the world of tech, there is no notion of responsibility, like responsibility especially for environmental footprint. There's responsibility for profit, for delivering, for making sure things are available, but there is no responsibility for environmental footprint. And we use this model. We believe that the user has also a certain responsibility. So if you have a device with some software on it and you have functionality in that software you're not using, you should, of course, turn off that functionality. I always use this example if you have an electric car that's charged with 100% green electricity, you still shouldn't drive it in a circle. So you have a responsibility to practice sustainable use. But more importantly, if you manufacture digital products, you have a lot more responsibility. You should use as little digital resources as possible. That's obvious that we have that in other industries as well. But you also, and that is really important, you need to make the user aware of the digital resource consumption and associated environmental impact of their usage. Give you another great car example.  You have instantaneous feedback of your behavior to the environmental impact that you might have. And in the digital world, we don't have that. If I upload a petabyte of photos to any provider, pick the one you like, you'll never get feedback saying like, hey, just that you know this petabyte is now going to consume, it's now going to create a footprint of a ton of CO2 a year. You don't get that feedback, right? Never. You have no transparency and no awareness of such a thing. And I'm not saying that that then transfers the responsibility to the user. I'm just saying that that transparency is needed for all of us to have a better understanding of what our behavior is doing to the environment. The other layers also have a responsibility. And I just talked about waste. Waste is something I'm very passionate about because there's a lot of it in the digital space. And I believe that the resource provisioning companies, so cloud hosting companies, have a responsibility to remove waste from their systems. And last but not least, if you're in the digital infrastructure sectors or if you run a data center or you make laptops, you must produce sustainable digital resources. So you must figure out a way how to make a laptop that has no additional environmental impact. And it always sounds extreme, but it's completely possible. You can recycle most of these parts. Chips are not getting faster. We are now exactly at that point where that becomes possible. And then at the SCA, I'm not going to talk a lot about that. Of course, we're nonprofits, so we're trying to figure out all these different instruments that you need to create in order to create markets around these things. We are not very good at it. I'd be very honest with you because we're too nerdy. We're too much in the technical details most of the time. But we're learning and we're trying to figure out how we can enable these responsibilities in our European society, but also on a global scale. Last one. Then I'm done. We can ask some questions. This is more like a personal pletoyer, is the German word, I think. So I always ask this question. So we have this idea of transparency. We have this idea that we know that there is an environmental footprint. And I hear it here a lot about digital sovereignty and all these things. But I really wonder, digital sovereignty is now becoming, especially in Germany, this discussion around giving some competitive advantage to industry and figuring out business models on data. And I'm like, is that really what we want to bring to the internet as Germans and Europeans? Is that our contribution? We haven't contributed in the sense that we created all these big tech companies. That wasn't us. But we can contribute by bringing our values and figuring out how to bring our values into the digital realm. And one of those values should be just sustainability but also transparency. And I think we should not focus so much on this fear, security, privacy. We're going to be attacked. We're not going to have sovereign infrastructure. Oh my god. But rather, focus on how can we shape this global space with our values. That's it. Yeah, I thought if we have 20 minutes and 10 minutes presentation, 10 minutes questions. Sorry? Yeah, of course, yeah, I will. Are there any questions? Let's start here then. In my view, that's the end user. But is it more about the owner of the other? That depends. So the question is, is it about the user or the owner of the application? The challenges that in our modern digital space, you don't ever really own an application anymore, right? You always are in a rental relationship. So that's why I call it a user. But I have to say I generally hate this idea of a user and I haven't figured out a new way because it's a good joke for your friends. What does the digital world and heroin have in common? Both call their customers users, right? And that really tells you a lot about the space. So I agree with you. I don't have a good answer to that. Yeah, thanks a lot. It's pretty interesting. And when you presented the value chain, I mean, you said something about the different responsibilities of all the different stakeholders there. That makes sense. But do you feel like there's one part of the value chain where we can make the biggest win? Good question. So the question is, is there some part in this picture where we can have the biggest impact? And I, to be honest, for a long time, I was working on the bottom layer because I thought it's there. But these people will not do anything if the other two are not asking for it. So I think there's a lot we can do in terms of just basically deciding that we don't want waste and setting thresholds in the provisioning layer. Say, you shall not waste energy, right? And on the layer above, so if software people make software to consider, so to say, the resource consumption as part of a non-functional requirement, same as accessibility. For example, for government websites, it's always to be accessible. It has to be designed in a certain way. It has to be inclusive. But never nobody ever says, and it should minimize the amount of digital resources it uses. So introducing this non-functional requirement could be very powerful, I think, on that layer. But those two green layers, I think, is where the party is at. However, I think the user also plays a role because at the moment, I think a lot of people aren't completely unaware of the relationship between environmental impact and their digital usage. And raising that awareness is equally important because otherwise you don't have political will in that sense, right? Yeah, so the green layers, so you're saying that you should be taken here by the service provider and the developers, right? But what are the incentives for them to actually do so? You know, I want to have my ability, 100% less problems for the users and what's the incentive and should we price into the, like, how do I think should we have a market for that and what kind of approach would you suggest? Yeah, good question. So the question is how do we price in, or what's the incentive for these people to change and should we price in externalities? That's an interesting one. So I'll give you an example. Maybe you all know this to-do list app called Asana. Their monthly operational cost that goes to infrastructure is about 60%. So 60% of all the revenue goes basically back into a cloud provider, in this case, AWS. And that doesn't seem to be a problem to them. And you would argue, same in energy efficiency, that cost should be an incentive enough to minimize resource usage. But in practice from what I've seen and what I've learned, that doesn't work. So I don't have the perfect answer either. I do believe that we can have a good play between labeling digital resources and differentiating them, but also setting thresholds. So if we have this mental model that somebody's producing digital resources, we can say, when you produce a digital resource, it cannot have more environmental impact than this. And then you don't create an incentive for the developer to change, but you just change the infrastructure under them. All right, same as we are changing the energy system right now and none of us have to do anything in that sense about it. It's just being changed for us. All of a sudden we just get green electrons.


babes wajimo comes under fire for shaming baby mamas babes wajimo comes under fire for shaming baby mamas and they're out of wedlock kids i got married then i had a child so don't compare yourselves with me babes said gom singer and dancer babes wajimo has left the internet in a vexed mess after taking a dig at women who have children outside marriage in a scathing rant in a facebook live video from earlier this week babes told those tuning in that she doesn't want to be compared to women who have children and aren't married to their baby's fathers you see this thing of crying about your baby daddy who left you don't do that with me i got married then i had a child so don't compare yourselves with me do not compare your baby daddies with me this has nothing to do with me the woelalo hitmaker also questioned why people give birth at such a young age your baby daddy made you pregnant then left you with the baby i wonder why you gave birth at a very young age so i don't want nothing to do with that she said when twitter users got hold of the video they flooded the tl sharing their verdicts on babes this resulted in babes landing and staying on the twitter trends list for hours twisa livee he reached out to babes and her team west inc records managers bukjav said that they see nothing wrong with the video or comments she made on facebook live he reasoned that babes was responding to a user in the comments and further stated that it is a free country so babes was well within her rights to say what she said she was responding to a comment from her live video he said on twitter many people felt that her comments were uncalled for while others were there for the laughs babies have been on babes mind ever since she gave birth to her baby boy nicknamed sponge with hubby mampincha in june this year taking to instagram the star showed off their baby boy to the world after months of speculation that the star was pregnant uncollin collo emul and jalo god is always good our beautiful blessing is finally here in lanla yetu babes revealed