Hello, I'm Jonathan Pinkney, Senior Researcher for the Program on Nonviolent Action at the U.S. Institute of Peace, and it's my pleasure to welcome you to this event series on People Power, Peace, and Democracy. In these events, we'll bring together academics and activists, peace builders, and policymakers to discuss practical lessons learned from groundbreaking research at the intersection of nonviolent action, peace building, and political change. We'll talk about how mediation can transform nonviolent action movements, show the strategies grassroots movements have used to pressure warring parties to come to the negotiation table, and how action on the streets can carry those negotiations to a peaceful resolution. And we'll take a long-term look at how nonviolent action and inclusive dialogue and negotiation processes can help forge a long-term sustainable democracy that includes the voices of the most marginalized. We hope these conversations will inform and inspire you, as together we seek to better understand and bring about a world where conflict and injustice can be resolved without violence. Thank you. Ordinary citizens during civil wars might seem to have few options for moving their countries toward peace. And when peace processes happen, they're often dominated by political elites without meaningful inclusion of grassroots voices. But the powerful example of courageous activists who have led many different campaigns around the world shows that nonviolent action can play a crucial role in transforming armed conflict. But how does this work? And what tactics and strategies are most successful for activists and their external allies in these situations? To discuss some of these questions today, I'm joined first by two leading researchers on the topic, Dr. Luke Abbs, a research fellow at the University of Essex, and Dr. Marina Petrova, a postdoctoral research fellow at Bocconi University in Milan, Italy. For the last year, Drs. Abbs and Petrova have been working on a USIP cross-national research project on the nonviolent action tactics that are most effective in promoting peace in civil wars, and that's what we'll be chatting about this morning. Welcome, Luke and Marina. It's really wonderful to have both of you with us this morning. So I'd like to start just with a kind of basic introductory question. Can you introduce us to your research on nonviolent action and peace processes? What kinds of civil wars and nonviolent action are you looking at, and what are you trying to understand? OK, so basically we're looking at nonviolent action that's carried out by civil society organizations in the context of civil war. And what we're interested in is, does these forms of nonviolent action impact civil war peace processes? And in particular, we're interested, does these former actions increase the likelihood of initial negotiations, and then subsequently does this increase the likelihood of a peace settlement? So in this regard, we kind of see a civil war peace process as a series of kind of peace initiatives leading from initial negotiations to an eventual peace settlement. And this, of course, isn't necessarily linear, so there might maybe a few kind of peace agreements. So a peace agreement might fail and subsequently succeed, or there might be a series of settlements that basically pick different aspects of the conflict. So we're interested in, you know, is this action active around these time periods, and is it having an effect? Is it having a positive effect on the peace process itself? So the reason why we've been looking into this is because we know from civil resistance research or research on nonviolent action from the last 10 years that this has a very kind of a strong effect on different types of political change. So for instance, raising change, democratization, and also improves quality of democracy. So we know that nonviolent resistance can have huge, you know, impacts on political change. What we don't know so well is the impacts that this may have during civil war. So there's some kind of emerging areas of research. So there's some excellent case research that's been conducted on Columbia, which is looking at kind of local communities and how they engage with armed groups. They're basically finding that they can, you know, they can create kind of informal agreements that creates conformity and reduces violence in these areas and essentially leading to what they call zones of peace. There's some new research that's ongoing looking at nonviolent campaigns and whether these impacts civil war peace processes. Some research that I've conducted myself with the International Centre on Nonviolent Conflicts is finding some good evidence about this. And basically when nonviolent campaigns are active, the seeming increased likelihood of peace agreements. But this research and it's still emerging tends to focus on specific actors. So nonviolent campaigns or like local actors in Columbia, this kind of misses a lot of other actors that are active in various civil wars and the, you know, the diversity and variety of nonviolent tactics that these organisations are using. So we're trying to take a broader approach to understand what's going on and what the impacts, you know, these various different tactics are having. Yeah. And sorry, if I might jump in, essentially, we we look at four specific nonviolent tactics in this project which we think are extremely important and they have been widely used by different activists and the civil society actors. So we focus on protest tactics, such as demonstrations. In addition, we examine political engagement tactics such as lobbying and bridging activities, non-cooperation tactics such as strikes and boycotts. And finally, we explore intervention tactics such as sit-ins, occupations, and the creation of alternative institutions. And in this project, we examine major, deadlier civil wars on the African continent in the post-Cold War period. In the years between 1990 and 2009. We believe that the focus on these deadlier major wars is important because it provides us with an arena to study the more difficult conflicts, the ones that are perhaps least likely to see a peace process and the ones that we probably will see more difficulties for activists and civil society actors to engage in nonviolent tactics. So all the effects of nonviolent tactics that we find are actually extremely important since we examine these very difficult cases. Great. Thank you so much for that overview. I'd love to hear from either of you some examples of these different nonviolent action tactics during civil wars that particularly stand out to you and a little bit about some of the impacts that some of those specific cases might have had. Yes, I think I can answer this question. So I think that there's so many different cases and motivating cases for this study as well, but I think two probably come to mind. The first is in Liberia, which is a very well known case with the Women of Liberia Mass Action for Peace, which is a women's organisation that recruited from different ethnicities, different kind of religions, came together to basically protest against the civil war in the country and what was going on. So they started initially with kind of mass demonstrations, basically in the capital, some kind of political engagement activities, basically trying to both pressure and support initial kind of peace negotiations and they were very successful in that. Later on they kind of moved to kind of more intervention tactics such as sit-ins, occupations. So towards the end, the kind of conflict got kind of increased intensity and the peace process was actually a threat. And so they actually occupied around the kind of presidential palace, going as far as actually stopping people leaving to try and pressure for peace. They even sent delegations and formal peace talks in Ghana to continue to lobby and try and push the parties towards peace. I think another case which shows, you know, kind of a different aspect, shows the power of protest and how protest can actually change the dynamics of civil war is, I mean, as many cases such as Nepal and other well known cases. But one thing that really comes to mind is Mali because it's a very unlikely case. It emerged in the early 90s in one of the poorest countries on Earth in, you know, Northern and Ongoing civil war in the Northern Tureg regions with a very repressive kind of military government and, you know, a very kind of, you know, small kind of urban percentage of the population. And so it's very difficult for them to mobilize in them situations, but they were able to. And the Alliance for Democracy in Mali led initial kind of mass protests at the end of 1990 and by mid-1991 they'd actually overfro the military government and what this really had is two notable effects. So initially it had an effect on leading to initial peace negotiations with the military government and the rebels, kind of out of necessity because troops were diverted from the Tureg region to the capital to deal with the unrest. But later on it had a real effect on migrating the peace process. So once the military government was removed, the civilian government really pushed for peace. They pushed for initiatives like devolving power to try and give, to try and spread democracy but also give the Tureg some more kind of local powers to basically solve both issues and also engage in a lot of kind of civic activities, you know, different kind of forums to bring civil society together and come up with solutions. So these two cases amongst many others show that there is huge potential here for positive effect of these actions. Great. Thanks so much, Luke. So Marina, you mentioned before that these four categories of nonviolent action tactics that you're looking at from political engagement to protests to non-cooperation and intervention. So what have you found about the kinds of nonviolent action tactics in these categories that particularly affect whether civil war negotiations are going to happen? That sort of first stage that you were talking about. Yes, so we actually uncover a very interesting picture on the effects of these different nonviolent tactics on civil war negotiations. We see that these different tactics indeed produce different effects on the likelihood of negotiations. We initially hypothesized, assumed that protests and political engagement tactics, as we've seen in many examples, real world examples, would have a positive influence on negotiations. And indeed we do find a very strong positive effect, which is extremely encouraging. So this really suggests that protests and political engagement tactics can contribute to conflict transformation and facilitate cooperation between the warring parties and actually help them come to the negotiating table. With regards to non-cooperation and intervention tactics, we initially thought that these two tactics will have little to no direct effect on negotiations because we see those as more having to do with conflict intensity, really. As we have some preliminary indication that specifically non-cooperation tends to reduce conflict intensity. And from anecdotal evidence, we find that non-cooperation tactics, such as dead home strikes, which have occurred in a lot of contexts in Africa in objection to violence, then they reduce battle debts. However, in our analysis, we surprisingly find that non-cooperation and intervention tactics are negatively associated with the likelihood of negotiation. I should stress that these are our preliminary findings and we're still exploring these very surprising negative effects. But our initial reaction is that we suspect that these negative influence could be related to the timing of the events. And basically, if non-cooperation, for instance, is linked to lower conflict intensity, this does not really mean that this would then bring a green light for the negotiations to take place. There could be a lot of dynamics going on. And as mentioned, these are preliminary findings. So we will be exploring this in further detail as we move on with the project. Thank you. That's really fascinating about kind of, you know, it's not just that nonviolent action sort of writ large has a uniform effect on the likelihood of negotiations in these situations, but that the specific tactical choices that movements make may have differential effects on outcomes like this. I'm curious about that sort of second stage as well. And once negotiations have started, how do these different kinds of tactics then affect the likelihood that a peace agreement is going to come out of those negotiations? Yes. So we're also finding divergent effects in terms of peace agreements as well. So subject to initially being a peace negotiation and then, you know, looking later at whether there's subsequently a peace settlement or a peace agreement, we're also finding these kind of interesting divergent effects. So one of the things we expected and I think everyone would expect is the same kind of protest and engagement activities that we're finding really good evidence for that kind of increases and, you know, the initial negotiations and initiates a peace process. We're not finding much evidence at the moment that this is also related to subsequent agreements. So which is kind of a surprising finding because there is emerging evidence of mass nonviolent campaigns and mass kind of protests against the government are increasing likelihood of peace agreements. But what we suspect at the moment, we're not too sure because it's still kind of preliminary, but what we suspect this could be is civil society organizations might actually start to lose influence as the peace process continues. And this is something we need to kind of look much more into. So it's very hard to sustain this kind of culture for peace and sustain that kind of level of mobilization for the whole process. And the second real challenge for civil society organizations is they don't tend to be included in formal peace negotiations or eventual peace settlements. They tend to be excluded from these processes, which is a real shame because if they're having a really good effect in the beginning and they're unable to sustain and continue to support the peace process, that would be a real shame. But we're not really too sure and we're still kind of exploring this prospect. But what we are finding is more evidence for intervention. So these kind of stay-at-home strikes and also the creation of alternative institutions, occupations. These kind of more kind of stringent kind of forms of action. And we basically find that this increases the likelihood of a peace agreement. And what we think this might relate to is, I mean, for example, this really fits the situation in Liberia where we have the kind of initial engagement, we have the initial protest activity. And then later on when the peace process looked like it was going to fail, there was a kind of switching tactics, more towards kind of occupations, sit-ins, pressure the parties into the agreement. Perhaps because they were kind of excluded from the process or not as included as they should have been. And also, you know, in other contexts, we know the importance of alternative institutions that are created by civil society. So if we think of, you know, in South Africa, when we think of the committees that were set up in the townships, we're basically running their own kind of education, their own kind of healthcare, their own kind of politics. It basically undermines the legitimacy of the government and government institutions. But what alternative institutions also do is they provide a blueprint for what the future inclusive institutions might look like or how they might work.  So we're finding some evidence there, but of course, you know, this is still very preliminary and we need to look into this further. That's really fascinating that kind of the impact of particular tactics in a way switches depending on sort of what stage you're at. And I think, again, it's a really crucial lesson for activists and civil society groups that are interested in influencing peace processes that, you know, you may like, you need to be aware of the strategic situation and cognizant of how that not all nonviolent action tactics are going to have the same kind of effects in different contexts. I'd be curious to hear a little bit more from both of you about, you know, this kind of question of practical lessons. You know, if you were to give some key takeaways from this for activists who may be interested in influencing or like helping their countries move towards peace, what would that be? And perhaps for, you know, external peace builders as well who are interested in promoting peace and supporting activists and civil society groups on the ground, what would be some key takeaways or lessons that you would emphasize from your research? Right, so we really find in this project that different nonviolent tactics in civil war contexts are likely to produce divergent effects on conflict dynamics and the likelihood of a peace process. And the general finding, as you don't incorrectly mentioned, is that different tactics also work differently at different stages of the peace process, so to speak. But one thing that emerges from our research and we think is quite important is that protest and political engagement tactics in initiating negotiations in a peace process. And this really suggests that civil society actors, activists, ordinary people do have the power to really engage in productive nonviolent action and not just be bystanders and observers of the violent conflict but actually use these nonviolent tactics strategically to change the course of the conflict. And perhaps a key takeaway message or lesson for activists and ordinary people is to use these specific nonviolent tactics strategically at the different stages of the peace process as we see that not all forms of nonviolent action work at all stages of the peace process. And Luke, do you want to add to this? Yeah, so I think in terms of international stakeholders, I do believe that these kind of stakeholders are aware that there's nonviolent action going on on the ground especially kind of international peace building organisations and various other kind of stakeholders that are involved in the conflict. I do think they're aware, but for the reason of this research some of these kind of stakeholders are not sure what the kind of impact of these actions are and there may actually be some suspicion that maybe these forms of action might actually make things worse might actually escalate a conflict. So I think there's genuine fear there, but I feel what our research, although again it's preliminary this stage what our research is showing is that them fears are not really being seen in our data. So if engagement and protest activity is really supporting a peace process I really think the main message is that external actors should support these organisations should support this on the ground, these bottom up processes. And I think for two key reasons, right, because we know from research on civil resistance against dictatorship, we know that when there's more international support from abroad they're more likely to be successful. So perhaps with these kind of different actors on the ground with more kind of technical support, more financial support they might also be more successful and able to make a bigger impact on the civil war and the peace process. And lastly, we know from other research that when civil society is included in these peace settlements that peace is more likely to be durable. So if we are having this process where civil society is starting to be drowned out and not included in later parts of the peace process and definitely not the peace settlement itself, that's a real shame because not only could they do some good from the bottom up, in context that they obviously know well it's there operating in their own countries, that would be a real shame because it wouldn't also not just support the peace process itself but also there's more evidence that leads to more durable outcomes. Great, thank you so much to both of you. I think just to wrap up I'll ask is there anything else from your research that you'd like to share anything else that we didn't cover that you think would be of interest and important takeaways that we haven't gotten to yet? Any final thoughts? I mean we could just add in terms of, so we've also looked at kind of conflict of density in which Marina was talking about and so what I mentioned in terms of the case research at Stony Columbia so a lot of kind of nonviolent resistance against armed violence I think of this in terms of kind of violence reduction strategies we're finding evidence of that as well in African context these really difficult African contexts, these kind of stay at home strikes which are common in different kind of contexts we're showing that this is actually reducing conflict of density so that's the other kind of main finding that we have at the moment. Yes indeed and also we in our research we also wanted to kind of also it's looking to conflict intensity and nonviolent tactics different types thereof because sort of the set the same way for a peace process we cannot capture all these dynamics in a very very granular way but we do try to take care and really explore also conflict intensity and how these conflict dynamics can also in fact the likelihood of a peace process. Great. Well thank you so much to both of you for sharing some of the findings from this groundbreaking research with us. It's really exciting to hear and we look forward to the final publication of your work. So Dr. Abbs and Petrova have shared some of the broad statistical patterns the shape nonviolent action in civil war peace processes but we're also curious of course of what this looks like on the ground and so that's the question that we'll take on with our next panel coming up right now. I'm joined now by three outstanding panelists to discuss nonviolent action in civil war peace processes and a little bit more depth. First Dr. Estra Chouhadar is senior expert for dialogue and peace processes here at the U.S. Institute of Peace. She conducts research on a wide range of peace building topics including inclusive peace processes, mediation, track-to-diplomacy and the role of civil society in peace building. Jacob Bolbior is an activist focused on promoting social change and active citizenship in South Sudan he's a founding member and the media coordinator of Ana Taban a youth-driven initiative that uses art as a platform for the youth of South Sudan to speak out on national issues. And finally we have Wahid Zahir. Wahid is a journalist and peace building trainer working to promote sustainable peace and justice in Afghanistan. Thank you so much to all of you for being here this morning I'm really excited to get to have this conversation with all of you. And I'd like to turn to Estra first. Estra, I'm curious about how Dr. Abz Patrova's research resonates with other work that USIP and you yourself have done on dialogue and negotiation processes in the context of civil wars. Thank you, Jonathan. It actually resonates a lot. And as someone looking at their research from a dialogue negotiation mediation perspective I found a lot of connections between what we're doing and the dialogue literature and what they're working on. To begin with, let me just give you two examples but to begin with I think it is really great that they have shown that different tactics different non-violent action tactics are useful at different stages of a peace process. I think this is really something that we needed terribly in this area. So, for example, different tactics are more effective in the negotiation onset stage and different types of tactics are more important on negotiation peace agreement stage. I think it would be really interesting to also look at whether the same tactics or which tactics are also effective in the implementation stage because that's one part that we're really struggling with at the moment. A lot of peace agreements that are negotiated successfully fail within zero to five years. And we also see in some cases that non-violent action or civil resistance movements continue to engage with the process in the implementation phase too. So, I would also be curious to hear what they think about how non-violent action continues in the implementation phase, for example. That's one area that resonated a lot with our work. The other thing, the other example is I think we can use some of their findings in how we think about inclusive modalities and inclusion modalities in peace processes. I think that would be very useful just to give an example. So, for instance, I've done a lot of research on track two dialogues and one key issue in track two dialogues is, you know, how do you transfer the outcomes, the recommendations from these dialogue workshops to track one negotiations or to public opinion, etc. And I think, and one of, usually, you know, we divide these strategies into two, as insider strategies and outsider strategies. But it also, their research gives us a lot of ideas about which strategy can be useful at what stage in order to successfully or more effectively transfer from dialogue to other domains, for instance. Lobbying, for instance, is used as one tactic. And it would be interesting to really look at whether lobbying or political engagement is a better strategy for track two practitioners at a certain phase of a peace process similar to what they found or not. So that's another thing that really resonated with me. And the last comment, perhaps, that I can make is related to my research on, my recent research on inclusive commissions and their role and their effect on durable peace. The authors, our researchers also mentioned that that there is an interesting literature developing on what effects or what kind of inclusion modalities affect durable peace. And the Liberia example they gave is very interesting in this sense, because in Liberia, we see two critical things. Liberia is a case with high-durable peace, by the way. So it's a relatively very successful case. And we see that actually, as the researchers mentioned, nonviolent action, we see that at the negotiation onset. We see actually nonviolent action also in the peace agreement, the agreement making stage. But when you also look at the successful implementation phase in Liberia, we see that, for example, a lot of these civil society representatives, some of them coming from the nonviolent movement, are represented widely in inclusive commissions that are set up to implement the peace agreement, for instance. And one finding that we have in our current research with Dan Druckmann finds that inclusive commissions has the highest impact on durable peace. And Liberia is a case where we see actually many inclusive commissions set up for the implementation phase. And in a lot of these commissions, we see some representatives of the nonviolent movement as well, like these women who were there from the beginning. So I think it is really interesting. And it really raised a lot of questions for me in this sense, too. And another area this research really, I think, could be very useful for us is, can we really extend the effect of nonviolent movements to durable peace by also somehow engaging them in these implementation phase institutions like commissions or transitional justice mechanisms, et cetera. Because we know there are a lot of examples of this, that civil society inclusion in these mechanisms. But how connected this civil society inclusion in these mechanisms is to the initial nonviolent movements is one question to look at, I think. I'll stop here. Thank you. It's fascinating. Great. Wonderful. No, thank you so much, Esther. I agree. And this is a really crucial point about, you know, not just thinking about what leads to a negotiation and then what leads to an agreement, but what makes that agreement stick over time and what kinds of tactics by nonviolent movements can influence that. I think to get sort of some of that grassroots perspective, Jacob, I'd like to turn to you next. I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on the ways that citizens have been using nonviolent action to advocate for peace in South Sudan, both your own kind of experience and then any reactions you might have to the research discussion that we've been having as well. Thank you so much, Jonathan. Nonviolent action has been really a major stone in shaping the peace deal in South Sudan before, during and after the signing of the peace in South Sudan. Looking at some of the incidences that happened before the peace deal, we had individuals writing op-ed doing different kinds of protest based on what was happening in South Sudan. And these individuals were either detained, arrested, or even killed. But looking at that, they had to strategize further and come up with different ideas on how we could use nonviolent tactic or actions to be able to tackle some of these issues and also advocate and talk about peace in South Sudan. So in 2017, actually, we decided to form an initiative called Anatabah and has creatives of South Sudan in order to be able to find ways on how to influence the peace processes or also on how to get the masses involved and be able to speak up on issues of conflict in the country. Because in as much as the peace that was signed in 2015 was a bit inclusive, there were a lot of voices that were not included in the signing of that peace. And we saw what happened. In 2016, the conflict again happened after two months of then Vice President, actually the current Vice Vice President came back to South Sudan and then the formation of the government was done. Two months after that, there was conflict. So we decided on different forms of nonviolent action that we can use in order to influence the process and hold these individuals accountable. So we came together as collectives and used creative tactics in order to be able to speak up and not just as an individual, not just like Jacob, but as a collective, as an artistic platform, Anatabah. And when we did this, we saw some bit of improvement and responses. I'll give you an example of one of the incidences that one of the things that got actually involved in the peace talk in 2017. When they started the peace talk in August in 2017, in December 2017, we decided to come up with an initiative or a campaign called South Sudan is watching campaign. And with this campaign, we brought together different artists, visual artists, musicians, poets and all creators within the country to speak out on the issues that are being deliberated in Addis Ababa by these political parties and telling them that in as much as you're deliberating in that hall, we are here watching how South Sudan is. And we are trying to see what you guys are going to come up with. Is it that you're going to look up to your position or are you looking at the suffering of the people of South Sudan? Those who are in the refugee camp and those who are within the country. And this is something that has never been done before during these peace processes. People have never mobilized and get together and try to question them as they were going to start deliberating on peace deal. So this action actually made some of us to be invited, including myself to Addis Ababa and participate in the peace talk. And while we were there, we also decided to go with some of our paintings that we had done in Juba. One of our artists did a painting of different parts of like the South Sudan that he wants to see and the South Sudan that we are in now trying to unfold, trying to fold the back part of South Sudan and bringing up a South Sudan of progress where the South Sudan where we're living together where we are coexisting regardless of our diversity. And when we did this, we went to Addis and we printed some of this painting in small papers and those who were in the room actually went with these papers and distributed to all the political parties who are in the room. So it created some conversation in the room and some sense of urgency that South Sudanese or the citizens themselves are actually watching us and they're seeing what we're doing here with the action that they have done here and bringing these papers to the room that means they're waiting for us to see what we're going to come back with. So with that, there was some sense of this action accelerating the peace process and the political parties getting to at least reach some level of agreement and that's what came up with the peace deal that we have now. And after the peace deal, we also decided to at least have some sense of political engagement because there were some political parties who were not part of the deal that were out of the deal and I remember we had a group of us who went to meet the team of Thomas Cirillo though we did not succeed in that, we tried to advocate and talk to him on giving the issues that South Sudanese are facing because in real sense, most of our political elites in Juba they do not actually go to the grassroot and they don't know what people are facing and as much as they have their position they just want to be there. So what has seen over time with the civil society and most of the activists engaging the citizens and having them to be the ones to bring forth the issues that they are facing there has been some level of improvement and sustainability of the peace in the country. Thank you, Jacob. It's great to hear that. Wahid, I'd like to turn to you. You've also been involved in Grassroots Peace Building and nonviolent action for peace in Afghanistan. What can you tell us about how ordinary people in Afghanistan are working for peace and the kinds of tactics that you've been using that have been most effective there? Thank you. Thank you so much. First of everything, I would like to say that there are millions of ordinary people in Afghanistan. All of them may not work for peace but at least everyone is praying and wishing for peace in Afghanistan. If we collect all the politicians there may be around 200 and 300 but the public is very large and there are more, there are a lot but the public cannot work, they cannot come together because the problems which are produced due to the war and the problems which are created for war from some people who has some interest at war, there are a lot and these problems could be hunger, incompetence, lack of courage and we can say that even they don't have basic facilities of living so they cannot work in both sides. There are some people, they work for peace. For example, I can mention there are some societies, there are some movements, even there are some individuals who are working for peace and they are using for example, they are marching, they have some poetry competitions, debate competitions, they are working in education field for promoting the culture of peace and for promoting the culture of non-violent intolerance but it will take in here in Afghanistan and I have been engaged and a lot with university students we were working to promote peace through debate and I think it is very necessary and I think we should have started from very beginning. There are some people who are still working in this field and I think it will work a lot and it will have a very good result and we also had some competitions as I mentioned before we had some art festivals because we can do all these things and we are working in this regard and what I believe a lot according to my experience I have started peace education five years ago and around six years ago I believe if we have a curriculum for peace in all our academic institutions or academic centres it will have a very good impact for our people because I believe we cannot have a very sustainable and a very peaceful country just in one in two years or just in five years it will take time and we need to work a lot in this regard. Thank you Waheed. I would be curious to hear from either of you Jacob or Waheed. One of the things that Dr. Abbas and Dr. Petrova were talking about was that Dr. Choudler was mentioning just before this is this sort of impact of different kinds of tactics at different stages before the negotiations, during the negotiations and then during the implementation phase as well. I'm curious if you've seen anything like this in your own countries are there certain things that worked better for you when it was before leading to negotiations or during negotiations what are your thoughts on these impacts of different tactics at different times? Thank you. All the techniques which were mentioned before they are very important but according to Dr. Abbas root peace builders current and right now there are some peace builders, some peace activists who oversees this procedure of peace negotiation and they will judge and they are judging that what are good for our future and what are not good for our future so in this situation at least they need to arise their vices what they need in Afghanistan like in the future and if there are some problems and if we need something in this procedure so we can have for example some media, social media campaigns we can raise our vices through media and even we can start some non-cooperations tactics like by cards with some of their things we can say their announcements Jacob what are your thoughts on this question? I think actually some of these tactics work differently based on that what is happening at that particular time because in real sense there are times when practice will work during the process of negotiation before the negotiation or even after the negotiation so for the implementation process but then it depends, it's context specific it depends on how you read the atmosphere on what is happening and how the stakeholders are actually coming forward with the peace deal so I definitely think that all these processes work but they work differently based on how we started the atmosphere first and how the people who are negotiating that peace or the the stakeholders to what the peace deal are so looking at the context specific and the atmosphere itself Great thanks Jacob Esther I'll turn back to you I'm curious we've brought up and you were mentioning before that looking at non-violent action or even just the inclusion of civil society is often something that may not factor into how many international peace builders think about peace processes what are some of the changes or messages that you wish the international peace building community would get and some lessons learned from both the research that we talked about earlier here as well as your own could be spread more Jonathan I think what is really key in this research for the international peace building community is that it really pushes us into thinking more about the complementarity between different tools we have called them tools but different either peace building tools or non-violent action tools and the key here is to find really which ones work better together at what stage of a peace process and in that sense this research project really gives us some really useful ideas in that sense for instance you asked the question about pre-negotiation, negotiation, implementation while all of these different stages of a peace process they have different needs they have different dynamics so a pre-negotiation stage for example is usually more confidential because this is the stage where the elites sort of try to explore whether the other side is willing to really negotiate in good faith or not, whether it is feasible or not they are also testing the waters they are exploring what agenda would be possible and this is a period where you see negotiation commitment as a serious problem so that is a very different need in the negotiation process than later on as the negotiations become more public they become more visible then it becomes more important to generate public buy-in for example it becomes more important that the negotiation process is locally owned is seen as legitimate so there are very different needs at different stages and I think it is really crucial for the international peace building community to think that we know that and this research also shows that it is non-violent action in the same way does not work equally effectively at all of these stages but there is a non-major lesson that the international peace building community should draw I think from this research but I guess also there is also a lot to be learned by the non-violent action community here too, not just the peace building community to really think about what is the need of the negotiation process at this moment and if there is a need for confidentiality and transparency rather than non-cooperation but on the other hand if the negotiations are stuck if there is a stalemate or if the peace agreement if some parties are foot dragging and not implementing what is agreed in the peace agreement then it really makes a lot of sense to think about non-cooperation and other intervention tactics for example so I think it requires a mutual reassessment both in the peace building community and how they engage the non-violent activists and non-violent action tactics but also it requires a lot of reassessment and thinking I guess on the non-violent action community too like what is the proper way to engage in the negotiation process Wonderful thanks Esra Jacob I'll turn to you next just a broad question I'm curious what things do you wish international peace builders knew about the work of activists like yourselves to fight for peace in your countries and how can international peace builders be better partners for groups like yours Great that's a fantastic question I've been actually in so many conversations these things have come up and how we feel like to be supported or being better partners in whatever we do and as I said earlier different context matters to different people at different times because in real sense it's a game of push back with the political elites looking at activists they look at activists at people who are against the political ambitions against their will and all that so they will try by any means to do anything to try and push back the activists and Uma will be competing to influence these are the masses and give them certain information the politician will try in one way or other to try and also counter whatever information you are giving them and at some point some of us have been called the mouthpiece of the west you are doing this and that or maybe you are just advocating for the interests of this specific organization and that so it's good to look at how activists brand themselves and also try to understand how they are approaching some of their issues that they are facing because most of these issues are complex so I think the best thing that international peace builders or partners that I would wish them to understand is that first it's good to understand the context of which some of these or some of us like activists are coming from and how what strategies have we employed in order to be able to try and break through barriers it looks like we may have, Jacob may have dropped off the call or at least his video is frozen so I think Wahid I will turn to you then with the same question actually about what do you wish international peace builders knew about the work of activists like yourselves and how can they be better partners for people like you who are doing this on the ground peace building work Wahid you are muted so if you could unmute yourself please Thank you I just want to say that as I said before it will take some time here in Afghanistan as we are working for sustainable peace and for justice in Afghanistan it will take some time but I just wanted to say for some international peace builders are peace activists if they are listening about Afghanistan or they are hearing Afghanistan Afghanistan may have very bad stories but they also have some very good and positive stories and for a kind of appreciating back and also reflects these positive and good stories of Afghanistan with others and I just wanted to say some international peace builders peace builders that we need such online events even if we cannot manage offline events and in these events we will be able to share our experience with each others I understand that it matters what is the context of a conflict and what is where is the geography it depends upon the culture it depends upon the norms of everywhere but at least we can share our experience we can share where and how kind of tactics work there so I need I need that we should have a very good relationships through social media through such events that ESIP is managing or any other NGOs Wonderful thank you so much Wahid and I think with that we will wrap up our conversation and I would like to say thank you once again to Esra, Jacob and Wahid for sharing your insights with us and for all that you do to work for peace thanks to all of you for joining us as well the next event in our people power peace and democracy series will be held live on April 20th at 10 a.m. Eastern where we will be having a discussion of how inclusive dialogue and negotiation processes can help foster democracy in transitions initiated on violent action and we hope you'll join us


Kumi naku grov Yoni fani? Hi生, how are you?  I'm a smufat with a pH 80. Okona swag. Ah, Santi. Hangi kata? Tell me what you know or think about. Sheng ni ni? Sheng ni, how do I put it? Sheng ni slang, kitwenye unafaku wangi, akama it's only meant for a certain audience. For example, mi na ushrat na zongia, kama tu taki to communicate to you, na jokunata putia talking and communicating. Kama mi na ushrat na takaku wangi, na tu taki wa ushkanise, tu zongia slang. It's like a coded language. Na iku everywhere, sheng iku kila place na inenda nga ikiriki, ikii evolve. For example, watu wa rongai na watu wa dandora utapata wa nongia sheng different kabisa. Watu wa karen na watu wa kibera, yes, watu wa nongia sheng, but different. Kama kenda kibera utapata wa nongia completely different from when you say wa karen na toongia. Yes, bana. Yes, bana, language kama hi yon utapata place kama kare, but it's okay na place kama gedorai utapata pia ni different. Like it's just specifically coded for them. Okay. Do you know there are thesis papers out there kuhusu sheng? Like watu wa menda, wa kare search, wa kramdika vitru, and they decided sheng is a mixture of... Okay, sheng by definition swahili na English sheng. Kikuyu. Yes, yes. So now, I think in the initial idea ele kwa kumix English na kusahili. But now we have ata kijaka, kuna kijapesa watas na ni mokoro, kuna vitru za kikuyu, kuna vitru za uluia. Like we are like that together. But why isn't it a national language? I don't know. I think otako in denial. I'm serious. It's like the new generation language, honestly. Like sheng is the language that represents Kenya. Honestly. Ya ni tukusemu kweli. Allah fusheng, wana kama bini kichambuku na wahenga na wahenguzi. Kuna wahenga skwezi. Like vitru kama kwa ground vitru ni different. Honestly, it's up to you kanda rate it. But it's only me semo. Like when I say that you get what I say. Then you kweli. Then you kweli. That's like the new generation language. I don't know how kata. Sheng is a dope language. That language, it's our language. Ina represent Kenya sana. Like mtuwake bongashwana jwa ah, wew wew. Nwa kweitu. Wew kweitu. Ya, definitely. It kind of separates us from the others while we speak. Yaa, exactly. Ya, ma tanzani ya, sigiwi nana. Wew wew wew wew, shawana bas. Fahamu. Like plagi nukon ahadi accent. Is it a problem if you don't know sheng? Ya ni kila umtumu ni hajazi eka ni paka jwe sheng. Amata kwa msham. See some of us to repeat, here group of schools. So it quesak jwezi. But sometimes I think it's a stage when it comes to sheng. Juna patele periodi ya on your youth stage between people from 10 to 30, 10 to speak sheng, but una fi lukipata, certain positions in life, you tend to withdraw from the sheng language. So una patele 2 watua raki onge, you're able to relate kwa kuskia, but you don't want to talk to them the same language. I think it's not something you're supposed to grow with causing you to pay enough, the way you are bringing your kids will determine the reason why you arebign about this sheng. You do not see it's a degree in the sheng and language of the Flandic language I swear to the whole family auxora yama. kutu ome grukuyo sheng culture kuna place flari naero bita uislando Umisa rajui enya dar language ajui deno mulkis ohe ni Lek sheng isa language, it's a whole language But at the same time I'm talking of the aspect of upbringing Will you like to be a brother in… Na authenticity maze authenticity Why not? Yoso, yen yelukwami uilesa, mbona hi gro ni from mentality ni amasa mma Group of school, sodo si baya What is wrong with embracing sheng We understand from the point you have made, nini nimbaya na embracing nisheng This is our language It is what makes us authentic, I swear, honestly Very few, very few Kenyans, let's be real Very few Kenyans, one hasongia straight English I am a straight Swahili Very few of them So, but it's very comfortable for them speaking in sheng Tukona wa tuka kina mikesongko, kina sakaja, kina mutula junior Those guys, like when you wanna say mati you are supposed to outgrow it Those guys are still speaking sheng It's a language Just like put a ceiling on them mati wasi go Coz they are speaking sheng It's something you are supposed to That's why I asked you, are you comfortable bringing your kids? I am very fine, why not? You know, actually let me tell you something You don't need authenticity, you should not forget that You don't need authentic When I come out to call a calligraphali kwa best Afrima, calligraphali only one Ya wimba rap na kisohili, yes But what makes him unique na represent kena Is the fact that you rap na swan And that is sheng Like the moment we embrace our own That was on a play kei music That's how we speak Honestly kuna shushu wa na bunga sheng Ya niwewe, honest, atokimu mongilisha Soa or English hajuwi It's a language It's a very concrete language Okay, vitu ni mbele When I was growing up, okay Nikiwa shule Tukotu na ambiwa eda unongia kizungu sanif And Maxwelli sanif Because now if you speak in sheng Apparently hukwana future Your future say kwa api Because now we have a whole musical situation Genre that has erupted from nino sheng But Pia kwa serikali wu kena kwa interview mazeid Honestly, just tell me honestly Tanapu mwambe rada, mlambez? No, obviously waziz Kuna kitu ya kila place The same way No, listen It depends with where you are And who you are addressing You understand Akuna weni interviu kamewa T-show up na Na sketches Unangets The same way Wuki kuja kwa interview kumewa iwa wu jatakin Mista kupatia job Sabu na faku kujumewa wenye na faku patia job Lekin tia job watu cha tisha If you bring to yu waku Na yu sheng culture Una explain to the interviewer When what is the sheng culture? The sheng culture See, they don't even say Maseid mwa tisha No, listen Listen, bro Mi mi Siku bring you up na the sheng culture But the sheng culture iini follow Place iini li enda Kusyu Kenyan A yes, kutza wim Kenyan At the same time Akame li kufolo You can withdraw from it Why? We see, Val Mi mi When I was in high school and writing my shopping list there was a time li li And I said three k So I said E kini ni ni He called me E kini ni ni ni ni And I said thousand So you see Ha ni kamaambia Akamembia He iina manisha ata wewe Whesi perform kwa shulia That's why you're writing Misiyonik tumbayana sheng, imagine when engineer, what is the purpose of knowing English. It's sometimes too chachisha bede, naf kagapo enchotu na tuchya, link your physical appearance, the way you speak. It's about skills at the end of the day. I'm going to be in a juna bunga sheng kazi ya ita ndeleya. It depends, come on up in your news rankings, English uten apu bunga English. It just depends on the context. But sheng, otunafakwe kata, it's we supposed to embrace it. It's a good thing. It's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. It will not happen to you. Kablatu ndeleya, there's a question here. And again, this is out of research. Please, usi, nipiyesi mwanzu kumimbe oval, oh no, no, no, no, no. Val is not trying to say anything, she's just presenting to you facts. So sheng is sometimes linked to criminal activities. Kengasheng miwa sewa geto, amavitu kamaisu. Usi niyanga lego, it is what I have read na nimiongia na watu ni kama iwa ndokunenda. Onasoma the wrong things, where? Onasoma the wrong things, where? No, nimi kujana knowledge. So to refute, amatui kubali. Aisa suni ni nilmono na kacha? Tabuana. Sheng, actually, okay, I'm not the biggest fan of Gengetong.  But na appreciate that the fact that sheng imetu amavijana kwa streets. Gengetong ime employ a lot of guys, masikoa like, like they're just, they're not doing crime anymore. Na ono na. At least, Gengetong imetu fanya, at least for a minute, kacha kuskiza a lot of Nigerian, Asian, Zyanian music. Hashtag play case. Onanige. Onaze ima jinkami nimi yenge kuja pani uli zewum sopa. Kujambo daa daa. Aji. So saia ni nimi, naizu na dobitu zi ni wuseb yana. Aki, kujambo. Atu masaheri. What for? What do you ni mean? You, you see you kaikam. This language in primary na iskuli kujambo. Right. But it's too young English. See, wange kisuli basi. Kuskujo na ni ambiatu ujambo, ujambo ni nini.  Let us agree that people who talk in shame have a way of dress code, have a way they walk, the way they talk. I speak shame. I look at the way. That's my language. You are behind the scenes. Let us say we are a better motto. This one it is so wrong. Like honestly, this attack na nifana ni jamb. This one is so wrong. Shinga kuna banyana dito criminal activities. But the fact that shame may originate islando. Una geto. Most of the times na nerebeta, most of itima familiar, the islando bit.  So lots of na na shame. It's not the shame. It is not the language. It is umtumonyewe definitely. But seriously na nga julakwa na juwanze kwa na criminal activity. Aji manze. Niza zia kiyonuna hangouts na atuwa na juwa sheng sheng. Stop it. Stop it. That one is a bad influence. Nene twos. Nene twos. Nene two gaji. I don't know. Stereotype. Nika kusimam rasta nimpakavute banyana. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Yama nipakavutafu. Sata na kumira baya kuntiae bach nisa wa. We say statistics never lie. No. We have to go with statistics. Sata. I told you, mimi na mufosikopa na bongasheng kuwan tu na ka. We wouldn't give us a job. We would give us a job. We would give us a job. But are we seeing criminality in Karen? Are we seeing any criminality? Is it said up for me? Criminality in Karen but differently. Maybe to you and me. Listen bro. Sabunongia in a certain way. Mark is not seen as an influence crime. There are times we say say she's on a committee. Now you're English. Let's agree奇weiz we'll be getting aход in a call day beard. Aren't you at women courts hearing the cry of desirungs, ... This is the Latvian solchen crime… A new trend we are talking of… Nardapu na bongasheng kuwan a judge. We should agree that Sheng is related to a certain way of criminality. So we must admit it? In what way? I can't say 90% of people take wanga shengu wana wuta baki I can't even believe what I'm saying I don't want to know English I can't even say it I can't say it in English they don't smoke weed at the end of the day we smoke weed We smoke weed with theyl clipper 90% We smoke weed with theyl clipper we smoke weed with theyl clipper We smoke weed with theyl clipper OK We can tell We will say We have people like Jay-Z because obviously they are not going to talk like the Sheng, Swahili and English What are kwa na their own way of pronouncing things or mentioning things of looking at everything from their own perspective So these guys I want to ask you one question Let's say my brother is around 30-35 What is your Sheng size? It's your brother What is your Sheng? As in Sheng is a language, honestly we can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language Sheng is a language honestly It's like English We have to embrace it What makes us authentic honestly What makes you think that you are an insinuate Sheng and that you are an outgrow Sheng? Exactly And it's very true Sheng is a kind of a campo I don't know I am not planning to grow up Sheng I am an outgrow I don't know if you understand it or not but you can relate to it Yes, Ajay Why not? It's been 8 years but I don't know if you understand it We can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language We can't say it's a language We can't say it's an outgrow I am just saying from a personal fact When I was in primary I was through a private school When I went to high school I went to a public school When I came to Nairobi I didn't realise people talking Sheng So I thought it was a Sheng but I didn't know if it was a Sheng because I feel like he or she is confused Yes I don't know I don't know if it's a language but it's a language I don't know Sheng is a language I don't know if it's a language but it's a language but it's a language I don't know if it's a language I don't know I don't know I don't know Ok, wait I don't know I don't know I don't know We are 2-5 Facebook I wish we had seen the criminal Godzha I don't know Let's go to Facebook and see what they are saying despite her timesexplosions being cut, Her husband from Rwanda Shinga Miskam Who gave up to give up a nine money payment for this family gathering? and Kadeibal ... Kholi Kare Yyisk descendants Kkiswa mung어� izar이는o but Shinga Miskam even tastes the public He selects for the folk church youth councilおっ, so sorry If you Short, she say the  atheism are not communicative this is from the media kadu kwa kizungum kuti huku afrika veni wa tu wali tya bidi waju ingleshwa na fakute the same bidi waspitu na akati wao wao kwa waju miski ayo kudu badman Carlos Sian says majaoni bamboo rea just luck kevin shirao from Mosoriot nandi counti am just watching you na semi kitu sawa shirao miki fanya one of my exams nili kwa nimeshunda kwa nika jina jw nili kwa nandika because this is a scam from nibs technical college usiwa na cha tisha bidi siki kama me notice kitwenye me fanika bifu tu kuja kwae interview seviya ame pigiyama beseza kya wao waju ingleshwa na waju wao kina kwa waju kina kwa waju sba uiswa na Shien where ssi Izmi hi ssi Izmi hi Let us firsthand Joseph Ovoquas from Tehmun insa Shien haina fikti Wajutun yutia into society when you use sheng to do evil then we have a specific place where we talk in language man James says mawa na zakiku zungu nama ode ni sheng Ima amata of conteksh mo na sishi kira Pelekeni na Riyeng Dufumpa raro Isini song by the way Dufumpa raro ni song Alberto Shakespeare give the right well-tuned big up guys Una jua sheng, unapenda sheng Let us know We have an Eric Okoth watching from Riyenda NCI The show is lit Okay Wa Misifaba but of says slang does not have any effect on society The problem is when and where to use it For instance slang at him or chilling out but Oh at home sorry or chilling out but at work Use proper English Ha Hema princess napenda sheng sano Finally Moda Hiruranju ki says haina effect Boraitu mi keveni na fa Lakini wenei wako system Kauko Gbless Suta sa hauna the real words ko exam Wuhat kaukona Gbless Wai Hema bprinces Molo nipo ndra ni Okay So what we are saying is Hema according to the results Ki jaza sheng sana ni kauta toha kizungu na kusueli ama Let me respond to that one Let us stop being ignorant Sheng is a language Ni kama wenei zo jamani Ni kama wenei zo French Ni kama wenei zo English Ni wenei tu semech maybe sheng ekonamix Rojoa Sheng atasikwantika because in short form Sheng waz kama morio Mogi mauru As in it's words, words, words on their own Akuneti wenei na jua French It's all of a sudden says yungi English because I know French As in, amma tia kuna wenei na do evil Alafu na brem ju nimebonga English Na wana tia kuna wenei meiba What are those? Man say if you don't know that's your fault Like it's a language Na filka ni bomb There's no way you can blame Waz ima tu seme wukweli Right now, ambassadors of sheng It's a gang eto Right? We have to agree to that What are they saying? Abuses Nima tu situ Haa Ibiarewe No, no, no, no, no, no, no Nia is open up to Tisha sana by the way Haa ishia Haa tia matisi Wana ni tu seza sa kashen Did you used to listen to kina isa, kina nonini Yes What is the difference? Ni language imevolva I used to sing sheng Only that it is the same gang eto music But differently Na bide you people should be so thankful to gang eto Nkos mabu gang eto dwe me fanya ken Tu kol raskiza tu bongo Why it's not for gang eto Trust me my friends Akuneti wenei kei in musicin Gekuena ju kana ina Apishiii Apishiii Abiarewe Ni ufana tu kuchatisha by the way Okay, my last question before we wrap this up Who do you think decides venei sheng in evolv?  Zikinais I'm just happy Lik nimi wad bika wne geth Rosafi Okay, kuna zingina kabla stoke Meimei says nikawa pijinia Nigeria That's a very good point Pijin, sana sana ina sondkani Languja iao Samir Kamaus Sheng makes us who we are Jack Wawer says Sheng do logai He kizungu sometimes Kwa kizungu mkwitini Kuna brand hami He says Izi ni gani Sevia na bonga Sheng is a wakata Ya ya li toka unko Then ya kudin language ni mother tongue See on your mother tongue Okay, see see Ati sasa gengen do our mother tongue Then we have Monda Derek People call it Sheng I grew up knowing It was very normal swahili To me I considered Kenyan swahili And it's never seen a way to me at all So what I'm saying is Kuna iao That's how it is Ya, to be honest Imagine Sevia, sorry The crowd has spoken I have no issue with the Sheng people But I understand them Muna ske wa ziki cha tisha Ziki wa boost Ziki wa nice So Sevia, where they know Sevia, what I want you guys to change From today in Kitoka Hapa Just because I speak Sheng Just because this Sheng does not mean I don't have a brain that says Yunga English Sheng is a language Yunga language ni mtu wa munga That's what we understand Kuna mta me groki bonga Sheng But I understand Yunga English ni kisahili At the same time You must be factual Nani na mese mma it's a language It is a language Kwa ni what is it You can insert something It's a language So that has made it one language It's not a language yet Yutu nakata But that is our language My friend I understand Sheng I can talk Sheng But you see The way I was brought up That's why I don't take it seriously That's why I will draw with time I understand it I can talk it But I can't embrace it What I like about Sheng Is ni come up Like ni Uki wu semawad zingine I can tell how old you are Ama wu ligro e ragani Wich sa zingine inachawama But it's okay It's okay So last remarks Kima Lizia Okay Most people think In a society You want a crime But I want to say Me I speak Sheng I went to those group of schools And I embraced Sheng Sababu inachawama youth out of the Out of crime I mese diawa say we ni sana And it's us Sheng ni sisi Nani get Some sisi kids out Kama kina savior Kuna guest planning li kwa ni interview And he is an artist Ya ni wan goma So kaja kusima Val kuna veniwato na tutarao Ya ni wa kizungu mingi It's like a measure of intelligence Nis kizeni nan Uni ambi kani wa ungeze Kujwa kizungu Haima ni shiwa ni mo intelligent The more you know English It does not directly correlates With your intelligence Together So ungependa kuwambia Ni ni watu anyana fukiria Munya jui kizungu Ako nakak Honestly at the end of the day Kwae life see all about Kujwa kizungu Kwae life ni all about Kujitambua Kujitambua is a person And knowing what you want Wanto kabut sheng Look at a guy like Katelo My friend Katelo Is endorsing deals Why Kujibonga sheng Weshinda pona kizungu Ako my friend una tamak And then it's all about Kujitambua na kuwakha And it's all about the language Ala fu'i notion Please let's change it At Jumtuna bonga sheng Ata kupugangeta Mu bonga sheng My friend naka kupugangeta Mazeve ni nakaagudga But the reality is Tutuia your notion Like honestly sheng is a language Na PSU asesi Nisi u bonga sheng Tony Shaw say we can do anything Let's speak the English Let's speak the Kisweli Kwa na jo French Jamuonga yabado At the end of the day Siti mtu na jo sheng Tonya yubo yubo yubo No, we can still relate With you guys, Xavier Tutuia group of schools Nuskata So elitake kuna accent Bogope She knows As a loyal citizen In coordination With the Ministry Of Education And Interior I know only two national languages Kisweli And English Aya So when wakito A sheng ka language Ingi na yo kachap Ta inga bongo Ata kuchapu Chapa lessons Kuchadaro Tutuia Tutuia ikuapa Pesam kononi Thank you so very much for She's a real one Wow Hey, I tried 5-4 Facebook I tried 2-5-4 channel on Twitter He's doing for me like this Should we? Okay, let's Na takakulezaku Ume sama jamo jamo ni nin Jamo zin Jamo ume sama French jamo Oh, jamo jamon Jamo ni Awesome Oh, I'll squeeze Ureza Jerino Nuku fundishana Nuku fundishana Okay, it's okay Don't worry Okay, one more Ati See, tuambiwe Some modern sheng words We? Tuambiwe kata Okay, miss, jubati bogegen Jai sofa Kuna witu zengia Na tunafaku joka ma shengla Kuntua kumbe kitu nimbaya Kitu ni daily Na macha kitu ni poa ya Nisu simsa kumbe kitu nimbaya Onza kukira nimbaya Na macha kitu ni fitire Na, na punabitu Squeeze you with it To me in a sentence of you Of you Kuni Miwa Mti Boga Mti Just be very, very careful Nizi But not monkey Monkey Sibini To me in a sentence of you Very, very carefully All right, thank you There's a repeat from tomorrow from 2 p.m. But Keshon skuya pesa So you don't want to miss out Thank you for staying with us Please have an amazing day and we'll be ahead This is Satwa Wewe


Live from New York, it's theCUBE. Covering Big Data New York City 2016. Brought to you by headline sponsors, Cisco, IBM, NVIDIA, and our ecosystem sponsors. Now, here are your hosts, Dave Vellante and Peter Burris. Welcome back to New York City, everybody. This is theCUBE with a worldwide leader in live tech coverage. We're here as part of Strata plus a dupe world. This is what we call Big Data NYC, kind of a show within a show. Todd Brannon is here. He's the director of UCS Marketing at Cisco. Todd, welcome to theCUBE. Good to have you on. Thanks guys, good to be here. So I have to admit, back when Cisco announced that it was getting into the server business, that was real skeptical. A lot of people were. I said, wow, this is like oil and water, fish out of water, whatever you want to say. And I have to say I was wrong. You guys changed the industry. I misunderstood the strategy. Obviously hindsight is 20-20, but I got to give you props. Thank you. No, well, I mean, I think it's because we didn't enter the server business per se. Exactly. That was the last thing we wanted to do. What we wanted to do is really re-architect the way it was all connected together. Because if you looked at the compute, the networking, the storage elements, the complexity in each of those wasn't too great, but it was all the connections together, especially when you dial back to something like, oh nine, when we entered the market, everybody was trying to virtualize. I don't think anybody had in mind that continuous delivery models are out there today. And we actually, what we built then, really kind of shot ahead of the duck in that sense in terms of programmability, but at that point in time, we were really focused on creating a singular platform with the network fabric at the center, and it's really paid off. Well, even then, I have to say, I was skeptical. And the reason was organizational. I said, well, it's going to be hard to heard all these storage and networking and server cats. But what happened is, correct me if I'm wrong, is the organization said, we're doing it. And then the organization sort of followed along. Is that what happened? Yeah, that's fair. I mean, there's still some of that, but I think you're right. I mean, the technology's converging, and the organizations are converging. They have to, right? You can't have people that are just kind of very narrowly focused on one of the technology domains. The real premium, I think we're all seeing now, is on the IT generalist, especially in infrastructure. Well, yeah, and we just wrote a piece on this. We called the Iron Triangle, we're overcoming the Iron Triangle of IT, where the Iron Triangle is the technology and the invested interest from specific technology vendors. The degree of automation which has been built around specific types of technology and the skill sets that have been specialized to specific types of technology. If you're gonna have hyper convergence of technology, you also have to have hyper convergence of automation and hyper convergence of talent. And that's not a trivial undertaking. It's not. So one of the things that's interesting, if you think about what is happening with infrastructure for the longest time, the server was the centerpiece. It was, yep. Now we're talking here at Hadoop World and elsewhere about the ascension of data as the dominant resource within how you think about your IT organization. We're increasingly thinking about data and the role that data plays and the physical constraints associated with data from a speed of light standpoint or an error propagation standpoint, whatever else. Data gravity. Data gravity, how that impacts your architectural decisions. So we're seeing a shift from the server out to the storage. But what everybody forgets is all of that is made possible by what the network's able to do. Well, it's crucial. I mean, when you think about distributed applications of this sort, the data center fabric becomes the backplane of the application or the backplane of the system, if you will. So that fabric element is critical. And that's why, you know, when we looked at the hyper convergence as a particular solution, we didn't know it at the time when we designed UCS but you take the clock forward to when we introduced that this year, we realized we'd already done the heavy lifting of making a fabric-centric approach and then we could put that software-defined storage stack on top and all that east-west connectivity and the programmability there, really essential and a really great foundation. The network's the backplane. And Flash changed the game. The disk used to be, the spinning disk used to be the bottleneck and now with Flash, it's like, oh wow, network has become so much more crucial. Or puts, and David Floyer, who is one of the Wikibon analysts, does or not has done a leadership job of articulating this. It's the fact that spinning disk created enough latency, which you didn't have to worry about how everything else coming. Now with Flash, that goes away, which has an enormous impact on the characteristics of designs and the architecture elsewhere. Only shifts the presser point back out to the fact. Right, right. So, and that has affected your partnerships, right? Because people are now realizing how difficult that is. Cisco's a leader. So a lot of companies are like, wow, we do business with Cisco, that's great. So you started with the whole VCE thing. You've got now business with IBM.  So that's been a brilliant market entry strategy. Well, I mean, we, I think with VCE, it was really ahead of its time in terms of converged infrastructure. And it just made sense to follow our customers, whatever storage infrastructure they were most comfortable with, because people build a lot of their data life cycle management around that. Historically, we're building a lot of that around the sand. So it was incumbent upon us to have partnerships across the spectrum there. But I think the pendulum's swinging. You know, if you think about when we, when X86 computing first came about, we called them PC servers, because they were just big PCs, and the storage was there in the system. You know, as an industry, we took it out for a lot of reasons, put it in the sand, but now the pendulum's really swinging back to servers in many ways, especially what we're seeing here at this show. So that idea of storage, you know, and compute being very closely married in the infrastructure is critical to a lot of these apps. You know, we think about something like video surveillance as a problem five or six years ago is really a problem of data ingest and storage, but now you throw on facial analytics, right? In a security context, try and find the bad guys, or maybe it's license plate recognition with a transit type system. So now you're doing a lot of analytic component on the data as it's streaming. Everything's moving from a stack to a flow. And so all of that requires the storage and the compute to be very closely coupled. So it's coming back into the server just full server, full server. But it also requires, and I know you've a strong architectural background and a lot of your brethren, a lot of user companies are now saying, well, do I do on-premise? Do I do cloud? What's the combination? One of the things that's clear is, again, we used to always think about the server and everything else was a peripheral. One of the things that's clear is wherever you put your storage and compute. And again, speed of light's going to have enormous impact on this. You're always going to have a network on-premise. Correct. So talk a little bit about how that's going to impact decisions at an architectural level for everybody. Absolutely. Because to my thinking, and this is why, to my thinking, I always thought, well, that Cisco was going to end up a major player across the hyperconverged because you were always going to need a network. Sure. And I think we see a lot of hybrid cloud today, but we don't see a lot of hybrid applications because to your point, moving that data in and out of the cloud, there's a latency element, but there's also just a cost element. In many ways, the cloud service providers, it's kind of a loss leader, the compute side of it. They make all their money on the storage. So for a lot of customers, the cloud's going to be right obviously for immediacy and the incubated applications, that type of thing. But when you really do the math, the on-prem infrastructure outperforms in terms of TCO, and then there's all the elements of cloud around data sovereignty, these types of things, there's still a lot of server huggers out there. But to your point, the architectures are getting much more horizontal, and we're definitely in an advantage position with the fabric play we've got. What are some of the more interesting use cases at scale, maybe you could give some examples. So Strata, we talk about big things at Strata, right? We just did the Olympics down in Rio. So we did London, Rio, we're going to go to Tokyo. And the scale of that thing was just enormous. So we had, if you think about the event itself, there were something like 15,000 athletes from 200 countries. On the ground, they had 85,000 security personnel, 70,000 volunteers, 25,000 members of the media, and that's before the spectators even got there. And then you've got all the venues, right? All the cameras, the timers, the sensors, and we had one network there that connected all that together. And what was incredible is that that was the most attack network on the planet during the period of the Olympics. We took on about 23 million attacks and blocked those. So kind of a new record, I think, for kind of a security play. But the cool thing about it, what that pervasive connectivity enabled was, NBC, we partnered with them. They broadcast the games to five billion people, but that's kind of the traditional monolithic broadcast approach. There were 170,000 hours of online video content posted out of the Olympic Games. That's almost 20 years of video, right? Viewed 24-7, and my daughter, I think she is online 24-7, watching video, right? And she's of a generation that can watch two or three video streams at the same time. So it wouldn't take her 20 years to get through it. But the thing about it that really changes everything is all these people that can't make it to the games to follow a specific athlete or a specific sport can now connect to the games in a completely different way because we were able to completely connect everything at the games and just all that data and then securely offer it up. So, and there's a lot of weird stuff at the Olympics, right? Like dressage, horse dancing, right? And so there's a lot of things that, you know, these little niche audiences, just the story of the long tail. Well, and it was interesting, the story of how NBC dealt with that. Instead of sending a couple thousand people to the Olympics, they put 2,000 people in the warehouse in Connecticut for the remote video for all that online stuff. There's a lot of tricasters there, boys, at outstanding. Okay, good. Can we go back to hyperconverge for a minute? Can you talk a little bit more about your strategy there? Maybe people aren't as familiar with what Cisco's doing. Yeah, so back in March, we announced a new product series called Hyperflex. And so what we did, we looked at this market over the past couple of years. And what we observed was that the first movers, the first generation players, had really done a pretty good job with maybe the server and the software-defined stack, but they hadn't really looked at the fabric. And these are clustered fabric-connected systems where you're distributing the storage. So the fabric's critical, and we didn't see a lot of that in the first kind of generation design. So we thought UCS would be a great platform for it. We found a partner called Springpath, and they did something really interesting where, you know, again, a lot of the first generation players use the EXT-4 file system out of Linux as kind of the basis. And they kind of glommed their platform on top. The guys at Springpath, they wrote a file system, rather, from Scratch. So an object-based file system. And really kind of changed up the way the data is distributed over the clusters. So we invested in their technology. And so we productized that, took it to market. I think in the first four months that we were shipping, we've taken on 500 customers onto the platform all over the world. So the thing that surprised me, though, is the type of workloads that people are putting on a hyper-converged platform. So I think we've all kind of thought of it as kind of a lightweight play in many ways for virtual machines. But we're seeing customers put CRM systems on there, ERP, heavy database, because the performance is starting to get there with a system like Hyperflex. So we're really excited about it. I mean, it's all about simplicity, right? And again, the automation tools, the control tools are all starting to scale with the ability to add this stuff to the fabric. Absolutely. I mean, our customers want to be out of the business of administering hardware. And we've been talking about this for a long time in the industry, but now we've got to a point where we can come in, after they do the rack and stack, it only takes about 34 minutes, we've timed it to deploy a cluster. And then it's all managed out of vCenter, right? So there's no new tools to pick up, right? That's really what customers are coming to us and saying is like, don't give us new islands of things to manage. Give us something that integrates into the existing paradigm, but make it just dog simple to run. And that's where we're going with Hyperconverge. So strategy-wise, you guys were, I guess you weren't the first in Converge. I guess Teradata was the first, right? But anyway, it's probably right. And maybe Exadata, okay. But in terms of horizontal infrastructure, you really changed the game. And a lot of people, and I know you can't talk specifics about M&A, but a lot of people predicted, oh, Cisco's gonna buy NetApp, or Cisco has to do something in storage. And you sort of listen to Chuck Robbins and you say, he's thinking the internet of everything. And so my question is, when you think about how you change the game and compute, and you look at storage, I've never been one to say, oh, Cisco must expand its TAM by going out and buying a storage company. But rather, things like you're doing with Springpath allow you to sort of change the game. And pure storage and a number of others. Yes, that's right. And using a partnership approach and a software-defined approach, maybe you could talk strategy for a moment. Well, I mean, I think, again, that the pendulum is swinging back, more and more workloads are natively distributing across x86, software-defined storage obviously does that, but like a lot of things we're talking about here at the show like Hadoop, a lot of these applications, they're natively scaling across x86. So a strategic focus for us are the products in our server portfolio that can better power those types of workloads. So you're gonna see us, actually in November at our worldwide partner summit, we're gonna have an announcement in this space because we're investing pretty heavily in technology in that scale-out server domain. But strategically, obviously, the SAN isn't going anywhere. I mean, it's a fantastic platform, especially when you're talking about shared storage for the virtualized environments. A lot of customers, they've just made that leap to virtualizing all their applications or workloads. And a lot of that is based on that paradigm of centralized storage. So our strategy is obviously, we're gonna continue to drive hard with all of our partners on the strategic storage side. But as the pendulum swings to more of the x86, you're gonna see us announce and come forward with some really innovative technologies that kind of pivot back into our fabric approach. And then how do we help people, because the scaling's the key here. These big data environments that don't get smaller, they just grow. So being able to rapidly scale out and do that through automation and give the developer a storage target that they can control through APIs, right? And infrastructure is code. Those are the areas we're really focused on in terms of our investment, is that automation, the simplicity, the control plane, if you will, on the x86 side. All right, Todd, we'll leave it there. Thanks very much for coming by theCUBE. Appreciate it. All right, keep it right there, everybody. We'll be back with our next guest at theCUBE, we're live from New York City, right back.


What happened is about a month ago I received a phone call from a person from Georgia and it was very hard to hear and where you are and anything I'm renting a room and this gentleman he's engaged to a wonderful lady Mary right here and so let's give her a round of applause. Mary from Othello and turns out that he visited his city prior to coming here and he did not like our city and we don't fully blame him because there's not too many things to do if you grew up in a big city and he decided to come and live here but he did not want to do that and the Lord placed on his heart that he needs to come and live here. He worked as a driver for FedEx. He looked into a city and they were not hiring in FedEx and there was no way he could get a job in FedEx because they were occupied. He had a place lined up where he's supposed to move in as he's driving from Georgia the place he's supposed to move in they don't answer so he gives me a call I was like dude come over he comes over checks out the room I chose out I know Mary from Othello and he comes to the church next day and the next morning I want Brian to tell you what happened how he prayed and how God answered his prayer. Yeah basically what happened was I was talking to the Lord and asking him if it's as well for me to be here that he would make the way you know open the doors you know and I didn't see what was going to happen so I mean all I did was just have faith and basically what happened was I went over to FedEx and he said we're not hiring but I'll take your number and then the next day they gave me a call and pretty much they told me to come on in. Before he gave me a call that morning I woke up the next day and I said Lord you know I really need a job so if you can just let me know if not I'll just go back and and he just opened the door for that. And how did that happen? What do you mean? I know the story. One guy got fired. One brother got fired I'm sorry if there's anybody here over there got fired it's he because of his prayers but he got probably the brother was sinning and so but yeah one brother got fired and he got called the next day and they said hey we did not have a job when you came here but now we do have a job do you still want to work here? So he's like yes and he came in and they gave him the job let's put our hands together for Jesus Christ let's give it up for Brian. Hey man Patrick come here for a second. Patrick is the man just Patrick how many weeks ago you came here for a second week yeah Patrick came here just literally for recently and he gave his life to Jesus Christ come on let's give it up for Jesus and Patrick how long has it been since you've been in the States? Like about two years and a half. Two years and a half and you came here as a student on a student visa which simply meant that if it costs you a hundred dollars to go to CBC and take one class it costs you double of that triple yeah and he's not a son of a millionaire or billionaire yet his heavenly father is pretty wealthy but the earthly father is a different story and so he came and it was very challenging because he couldn't go through school without how many quarters you went to school with? I went for like one year so you found money to pay for one year yeah and then you stopped going to school because of no money and you couldn't work because you did not have what? Like employment authorization and so basically like I came here as a student so I'm supposed to go to school like I can't I can't work off campus but unfortunately like some situations happened back home where I came from and I faced a lot of financially problems and it was I was just going through a hard time like emotionally mentally it was just difficult I couldn't even go to school no more and I applied for to change my status so I can be able to get job and go to school and it was supposedly I was supposed to take like three months for everything to finish but literally it took like seven months every time I keep calling them and they they'll say like it's still pending just wait just keep waiting a lot of time I lost hope sometimes I even got mad at God and when you gave your life to Jesus and I know you met with Ilya and Ilya prayed for you how long did it happen after that prayer that you got something in the mail? About the next week yeah literally literally like I met with Ilya and we were talking and he prayed for me and he gave me a lot of encouragement and it meant a lot like I felt different and then after that I went home for like a week a week after that and I just received in the mail like a letter of confirmation and my employment authorization so basically everything is done I was just it was so amazing like I didn't know what to do and I couldn't I couldn't I couldn't hold myself come on let's put our hands together for Jesus Christ did you didn't you did you call Ilya? Yeah it was late because I came like I came to it was on Wednesday after prayer here I went with my friend like I suck up practice and then I came home late like around midnight and then I found a man I just couldn't hold it I was like I was like I want to call Ilya but it was late but something just told me like just call him maybe he's not sleeping and I did I called him and I apologized I was like man I'm sorry for calling you late but you won't believe it you know come on let's put our hands together for Jesus Christ so imagine supposed to get take three months and it took about seven months and he just lost hope came and he gives his life to Jesus Christ just literally a few weeks ago and then Ilya meets with him encourages his faith and then a week later he gets it in the mail just stand here for a second he gets that thing in the mail so now he's able to get a job and is able to actually go to school for the same amount of money that you and I would pay to go to school come on somebody let's give our hands to Jesus Christ I wanted to tell you some testimonies um they're kind of old some of them uh one of them you've already heard before and it's mine it's how I realized that God was real um when I first moved up here from Colorado I was facing a custody battle for my son and I didn't have a job I didn't really have my own place to be at and I I started to see how my situation just it wasn't right and I felt very hopeless in what was happening and one day I was all alone and this was before I was a Christian I went into the bathroom and I closed the door and I started praying to a God I didn't really believe in at the time and I told him if this is your will for me to give up my side of the custody battle then you have to give my son an angel because I cannot handle knowing that my son would be without me and that he wouldn't be protected so um a week later I called up his father and I told him I was going to drop my side of the case and his grandma came and picked him up and I signed the papers to drop my side and a few weeks later I finally came to this church and I was invited to a cell group now home groups and the girls started praying and they were all encouraging each other and one of them told me and without anybody knowing about what I prayed about they told me that God answered my prayers and that my son got an angel and that that really was the moment that it sparked to me that God was real and alive and he could hear me and um another testimony I wanted to share with you was about my friend Robbie and I've known him for about 10 years and he just spent the last eight years in prison um he was diagnosed with stomach cancer and after I had become saved I tried to tell him about God and everything but he would kind of throw it back in my face you know I just had to endure it but um he was recently released to a halfway house in Colorado and because of my persistence and because of a roommate that he was blessed with he made him go to church and it was on a Wednesday two weeks ago and he messaged me after church and he told me that he gave his life to Jesus the next day he went to see the doctor and his doctor had been you know working for 43 years and he told them that his cancer was receding he'd never seen that happen before when Robbie told me I smiled and said that's because of God there's no other way um and I want you all to know that it's so important that we express what we've learned about God to other people


All right, Lady, what is this? Hey, I just put together a prototype for my QT2040 Trinky. So this is a Raspberry Pi RP2040 with eight megabytes of flash. There's crystal, a little neopixel, and then two side buttons. This is the reset button, and this is the boot button. And then at the end, there's a STEMI QT connector, and this is STEMI QT-sized, right? It's like the same size only sensors. So I have this over here plugged into my computer as a little demo, and then on my computer, it's showing that, yeah, it's reading from the BME 680. And then I did the QT trick that Pymarini came up with, where the boot button is also a user button. So when I press this, you can see the red LED turns on. And the idea is that with a little bit of mechanical assistance, a couple of plastic standoffs, you would have this mount together as one little piece. It's a very handy sensor input for any computer with USB-C.


Hello and welcome to the session. My name is Mansi and I am going to help you with the following question. The question says if A equals to 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, this set B equals to the set 4, 8, 12, 16, 20, C equals to the set consisting of 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 14, 16 and D equals to the set 5, 10, 15 and 20, then find first A minus B. Let us see the solution to this one. It is given to us that A equals to the set 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18 and 21, B equals to the set 4, 8, 12, 16, 20. Therefore A minus B becomes the set 3, 6, 9. Now 12 is there in the set A, it is also there in the set B, so this gets cancelled. Now we have 15, 18 and 21. This is our answer to this question. I hope you understood the question and enjoyed the session. Have a good day.


Okay, track down a simple framework for collaboration in a little programming workflow. All we know that little programming in R is amazing. It can produce high quality documents, presentations, thesis, reports, and so on, using a lot of packages that can support our work. There is a huge problem in this type of workflow and this problem is collaboration. If you ever try to collaborate on this kind of file, you have probably realized that it's very hard. Why? Basically, we have to collaborate with different kinds of people, not people like us, but also with the average Microsoft Wall user. We have to collaborate on the plaintext files, so the stage before the compilation. And furthermore, we have to collaborate without revision tools of Microsoft Word and Google Docs. And this can be really hard, especially for text-based documents. Wait, we have Git. Given that we are working on plaintext file, we can use Git as always. Of course, Git is very powerful, but not for text-based documents. Why? Let's imagine a standard text-based file and modify it with Word. You can change a sentence, a single letter, a word, and everything that is going on is extremely clear. However, doing the same stuff with Git can be really hard because even if you change a little part, Git will tell you that you change the entire line because Git is not made for text-based documents. So in an ideal world, we need a tool that allows us to collaborate in a very intuitive way as Word does. But at the same time, we need a user-friendly tool, but also a powerful tool for experts. And we want all the amazing features of a little programming workflow. Yeah, this tool can be very mind-blowing. And the idea is to use a Traktown package in order to solve this problem, which is a big picture. Let's imagine that we have our local computer and we have our file with R, with Git, and all the framework that we usually use. And sometimes we need to collaborate on a project. And we can use the upload file function in order to upload our document on Google Doc. Then we can share the Google Doc link and review the plaintext document with other colleagues. Once the review ends, we can use the download file function in order to integrate all changes in our local plaintext file version. And then, of course, this process can be repeated as much as necessary in order to produce the final document. But instead of talking about the package, let's see how it works in action. So the first step is to use the upload file function. And basically, we have our local file and loading the Traktown package. And using the upload file function, it's very easy. We can provide the local file name, the Google Drive location, and the option to remove code chunks temporarily. Basically, in a few seconds, we will have our documents uploaded on Google Drive. Then we can share our documents on Google Doc, and the review process can start. And so basically, we share a link. We can make all our changes, comments, and so on. We can use all our fancy tools in Google Doc, such as spell checking, corrections, and so on. That is the entire history of changes. After accepting all our revision, we are ready to download the file. And using the download file function on the final version, we can easily download all the changes and integrate it with the local file version.  The package has a lot of interesting features, such as the support for both Harmarkdown and R&V files. We have this powerful system in order to hide or restore chunks between the upload and download process. And of course, given that there is a great part of this workflow that is local, we can easily integrate the online review process with a local Git workflow. If you want to have more information, check the full documentation on GitHub. And I want to thank all the developers of this package. And also I want to thank my research group at the University of Padua that support our work. And of course, I want also to thank you for your attention.


Can you help the pirate get to his treasure? Help him find his way, collect keys to unlock his path and fight evil opponents through the power of code. Welcome to your Hour of Code pirate activity in Coespace's EDU.