Okay, moving on. Let's go on to the approval of the agenda for this month's meeting. Any comments or if not, is there a motion to approve the agenda? Do you want to approve the agenda? Second, second. All in favor? Aye. Alrighty. No pose. We can keep on track and then approval of previous month's minutes. Is there any comments on previous month's minutes? If not, then is there a motion to approve these month's minutes? I'm going to approve previous month's minutes. All second. All those in favor? Aye. All right. It's all four of us. Okay, great. Moving right along then. Next up is public everybody. Have you heard? Can you have public everybody? We do. Okay. Okay. Then we're moving real fast here. We're moving on to old business, which is discussing the board retreat. I just wanted to thank everyone who submitted the surveys. Appreciate that. I actually do not have the results of the surveys yet, but I think Jeff is going to help me pull them up. It appears that June 8th had the most people being able to attend. I think Sam, you were not available. That's good. And David's not available. Okay. Okay. That's good. And we, I don't think we've heard from Paige. You have not heard from Paige yet? No. We've got a lot of things up in the air, so I don't know if you want to wait a month on this. Maybe everybody will be here next month. Well, we know it's not going to be the May date. Correct. So the names that we will be meeting again. Yeah. And then we can, okay. And while there's three of us and other things that we're going to join, of course. That's okay. Yeah. Okay. If that's the case, then I think we're okay with punting to next month. Do you have a team in it? Table on the edge for now. Do you want to have staff proceed with reserving a spot, like a space for the meeting? Well, we don't know the date. You don't know the date. Yeah. You said we have heard from Paige? Yeah. Oh, you have not? Yeah, that's fine. Okay. Not ideal, but I think it's okay. What about results for the topics? You get results from page, but. We do have that. Now there's a. We don't have to. We don't have to make a decision on this, but I just curious. I think. On the. Questions, I think everybody had responded. But maybe Thomas, did you, did you respond to the. Which of the topics? I believe I did. I thought I had, but I can. No, I guess I had. Yeah. Yeah. You had responded to the date, but not, not that. So we need. Paige and. No, not page. Just Thomas to respond to that. Yeah. Okay. So. Okay. So. We'll, we'll then we'll table that for next meeting. Then. Cool. And then there's just that one open question. And then we have Wilson. Asia follow up. Yep. You know. Okay. Cool. Let's keep moving on then. Let's move by 10 minutes. We might have make this fast. Okay. And after all. Great. Moving on to new business. They're going to start off with the. I don't know. I discussed partnering with Boulder Valley and. That's data. Yeah. So. Items. They're kind of. Combined. Same thing. Yeah. I mean, I do a is hard of. I see. Because we, we just wanted it. We came here to talk to you about open spaces. Acquisitions priorities for. 2024. And only on your C. Great search for your. Yeah. Yes. So we started the year by purchasing a land or car. It's a good stuff to see. Wow. Yes. Are they going to, are we still going to have that. The stuff down below it. Like we have a little CV. Yeah. I don't know why you're. Okay. Like a little. I need to. It's part of the house. It's not part of our ownership. I mean. Over there. The. You know it. Yeah. The oil and gas in the corner. But then we've got the two kinds of house areas cut out. Of our ownership. This is the farm that we bought. We closed on January. This is the. This is the old land reform. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We had the. Sister city. Yeah. We had the sister city. Was it. There. And it looks like it's that way. Okay. This is. This is over. I mean. Thank you. No. No. We're. We're northwest. Northeastern. Oh. Or. Oh. Okay. You've got to be next to me. I am. Which. Which one do you think. I've seen the one. I've seen the one. I've seen the one. I've seen the one. I was never mind. I thought it was. Oh. Land or. I thought it was a. Maybe a. Listen. Remember in the name. Over. Out here past. Oh. Oh. Oh. I was thinking. Yes. Yes. That's it. That's a private piece with a county. County piece next to it. So. Yeah. And they have the. The. I'm. Yeah. The. Yeah. Close. Starting off with the. With this topic. Helping us like. Contextualize it all. Sorry. I may. So now you know where the whole end of. Is that we fought earlier this year. So this was. A big chunk. This was a big chunk of our opium space. Hmm. Acquisition fund. For the years. This was a big. important acquisition that we accomplish and you know back in 2016 Council gave City Council gave SAF directive that it's we would like to see you put in conservation easements on open space that is acquired to give it extra protection. So the O'Langer Farm now that we purchased it is a goal to get a conservation easement on it this year. And then we have this acquisition that really is an important piece because prior to this all those properties if you just scroll a little bit from 66 all the way down now those are all city open space for water property so that whole eastern side of it. Yeah this was a puzzle piece that was missing in the trunk in the corner. So all those properties now are continuous. That's right yeah it does give us a nice kind of buffer between us and our neighboring communities of open space and so we have a local family already out there farming they've been out there for a month already. So we we would like to put this conservation easement over O'Langer this year and we're looking to partner with Boulder Valley and Lawn Maw Conservation Districts to do that. So Sarah approached them and they were interested and they have their board meeting tomorrow morning. So I'm going to attend their board meeting and answer any questions that their board might have. So we so we can go through all of the acquisitions that we have on our list and then we can circle back with questions or you can just yeah. Is there history of the city owned properties having easements owned by that those districts? Yes a couple of our other open space properties here east of Union are our conservation easements with Boulder Valley and Lawn Maw Conservation Districts. We have our Turner, Hartman and French properties there the CE hold around those. So yes and so in terms of what what this might look like with us being the fee simple landowner and then being a conservation easement holder you know typically when you do this kind of thing there's usually a baseline property report done and so they you know that was one of their questions do you want to do that and yes we do it's good due diligence and we looked back at what that would have cost in the past when we did previous partnerships with them and so we're thinking somewhere between five and ten thousand dollars to do the baseline. Is there a standard easement language the city proposes in those cases or is it very easement language? No it's ours. Well actually I don't actually know if they have a template that they would want us to use. We have a template that we usually use I mean we partner with Boulder County as well they have their own template so I think it's just the attorneys agreeing and and our attorney looking it over and making sure that all the tenants of what we expect in the CE are covered. Yeah this should be fairly negotiated. We have both partners typically have a form and we've worked together one. I think we're pretty close on the first draft that we use is something we need to work out. What are the risks to this sort of thing? Let me keep in mind. Are there anything that we... I mean what are the risks with entering into a conservation easement or protecting the conservation values of an urban space? To open into a question here. I mean things that come to mind that are you know they would then come and monitor the property every year or the properties that they will see ease on so I don't know I can't what do you think? I mean I think there's just yeah a little more there's a more eyes on what we're doing out there you know they're making sure we're gonna comply with the terms of easement but that's something the city would like to do anyway so I think it also in a way maybe helps too there's you know there's somebody out there once a year who can look what back yeah there are any violations or samples and trespass. On this property there is like it's an historic farm so a family owned it's you know for for many decades and they had like a place where they just put everything that they discarded from the farm in one area so the tenant from it out is out there now has asked us for a dumpster if you want to start cleaning that up and if we put a CE over it we're gonna say that needs to be cleaned up that needs to be handled we're gonna look at that every year okay and they're gonna monitor it and say hey it's not cleaned up where it is so those type of things will happen. Got it. I think one things that again that one the reasons that former proud boards and council one this is it makes it more difficult for one body just to overturn something so again what the risk are it's probably more of a risk for future council is that all of a sudden that we'd like to build a hotel up here we should just dispose of it or do fireworks that's where things are. I've been taking the whole time. I was just gonna say that too sensitive right now but you look at something like that it has conservation easement on it. Nature area? Not only do we take a farm nature area it has a conservation easement on it. If council would like to do something so remember to have a conservation easement we have to make sure that that other party is aware of that and as we do the terms of that conservation easement so it does make it more challenging to you know do something different than what we purchased that property for so again I think that we're some of the risk I say it's really more down the road so I was like to try to undo this it makes it more challenging. And conservation easements are different like you know I'm sitting here we're sitting here as the open space team telling you that previous crowds and city council have directed to put conservation easements over open spaces whenever we can but there are some properties that the city of Water Department purchased around the reservoir for expansion and those properties have conservation easements over them with very different language that says when we're ready to expand the reservoir the farming operation will you know shrink over to this side of the property so the reservoir can expand so that that'll look very different than the conservation easement language that we want to put for over a year. Okay thank you. Right so we'll update you on how it goes with Boulder Valley Conservation District Board. Also we came to last year and some of you were here and some of you weren't talking about our acquisition priorities and some of our acquisition priorities are our partnership a partnership that we want to enter into with Boulder County. Did you want an emotion from forward for as you take this forward then you can let me know that I have either support system. Well I was getting there and I was thinking that maybe we get through all of them first and then I talked and then a subset of them are the partnership with Boulder County. Is that alright? Yeah. So we're gonna go through just five. Five on top of Olander. Including Olander. Five including Olander and some of them are going to be so what I was trying to say is that we came here last year to say these are our acquisition priorities and these are the ones that we're taking to Boulder County that we want to partner on and last year we didn't have anything because we had just partnered with them on Adam Farm and so we just went to them and said you know we value your partnership and we're here to like be a supporting partner for you if you need a letter on a grant or anything like that that's what we did last year we were making it a plan in here. So we're doing that again we're we submit this every year to Boulder County they ask all the municipalities for and we have funding available every year what what are you asking the partner on? So Olander we're not asking them because that we're we want to partner with Boulder Valley and Longmont Conservation Districts. The next one though is the Milton C.E. in the Button Rock Preserve area. So this is a private property it's those two parcels right there so the green is the outline of our Button Rock Preserve that the city owns and then those two parcels are private and a lot of it around to the north is Forest Service property so this landowner actually approached Longmont and said I'm interested in distinguishing development rights he mentioned the northern parcel but he's got 235s there and he he's interested potentially in distinguishing development rights on both and so we went and we looked at the property to see if that would potentially meet what we would consider important conservation values for a C.E. and the the thing with this is if he were to donate these C.E.s Longmont is not a state certified agency so we would we would ask Boulder County to hold the conservation easements on these because they are a state certified agency you have to be certified to accept donations by Dora and they are so this is one that we would want to put in our requests to Boulder County this year so Sarah's had some conversation with them about it and they're yeah they're they're amenable to it they're looking into it and the reason that this would be an official to Longmont even though we wouldn't be the C.E. holder is that it's right next to Bunrock Preserve and it would have value in terms of he's interested in doing wildfire mitigation so it would it would be adjacent to us so any work in that arena would really help us out and it would just be more conserved acres near our property and if there's anything you want to add to that no yeah we will need to talk about if there is a Boulder County holds the easement maybe having like a right reserve a right to purchase we do have a question out to Boulder County um if sometimes in these kind of deals if if there's a C.E. holder um you know since the landowner approached us and we're bringing this to Boulder County we're asking Boulder County if in the C.E. language we could write in the right of first refusal so if Mr. Milton ever went to sell Longmont would have the right of first refusal to purchase these parcels so we're looking into if that's a possibility in this deal is that little green spot above uh an island of Button Rock that would now be continuous per a C.E. these would still be privately owned but yeah so would there be something weird between like going from city to county property like would there be any weirdnesses with that like over here we have county property right there so you can have goats like are there like weirdnesses with like emergency response or anything like that in that area that would be public there so those wouldn't be open to the public okay and that that area that is not contiguous is not open to the public okay so in this instance no there wouldn't be any sort of problem with that in this area is all of unincorporated Boulder County so fire services and stuff is mostly Longmont I'm sorry Lyons is the first responder up there so we have good mutual aid agreements with Boulder County Sheriff's office and the fire up there as well okay so we're going through two yeah yeah are there any structures on either of these there are he's got his he's got his second home on that lower self parcel and he extinguished he wants to extinguish every he definitely wants to extinguish on the northern one he wants to distinguish extinguish all the development rights on the southern one there's nothing no structures whatsoever on it he is also interested when I spoke with him last fall in maybe putting a house lot having his house lot carved out at the first one and having CE for the rest of it have you discussed um evaluation of the CE with him yet at a price for that that that'll be up to Boulder County so we're going to go through this you're asking them to fund it and negotiate with them yes yeah I mean there'll be a price fair market value kind of that there'll be something to look at for that yes um there's a reason I asked because if I think you're asking for our input on the priorities knowing what this would cost to make a different area it's important that this is a you know not what would be accessible and not you know close to Longmont property so if you're asking to compare the crisis yeah actually that's it that's a good point um there's not a whole lot of money involved in a lot of these things that I'm talking with you about today with this like this wouldn't this wouldn't we weren't wouldn't really even be in this deal necessarily this would be a CE between Boulder County and the private landowner we're hoping to write in the language of risk refusal but it's a benefit to us with this with this land being next to button rock in terms of um wildfire safety and things like that to that yeah yeah I'm just saying if we're saying we're asking you guys to do this these are our asks there's value to that we could have two other big asks and we don't have money for that because we're doing this from this ass right exactly yeah yeah yeah yeah we don't have we don't have like two million dollars but six million dollars of things to buy right now okay but there could be a year when we come and say that we do when we need your help deciding what to do okay so the third one is in button rock as well um there is a state the parcel is owned by the state land board and um button rock I mean and city of Longmont lease is about we have a lease over the property um do you know the details about the lease that my what what the lease it's called the recreational lease but I think it's just so I don't know if it sure brought something up but on these you know this is the ones that were set aside for our idea of a school board piece that were always intended to raise money for the school districts um be a bit timber or lumber and they really wanted to dispose of those Boulder County has gone through some of these as well and they keep raising the rent on these that's one piece of it that makes it challenging for us we were paying pretty significant amount of rent on this and it's recreational lease and they said we can't recreate it it's not it's not recreational lease but yeah so I think if we if we had this property in our fee ownership it gives us the ability to manage it we would want to not have to worry about ever increasing rent rates and again there's actually some opportunities for some trails and stuff in that area that I think that we could look at as well to make it accessible to our community as well so yes so unlike the two ce's who just come through this one we are we would be interested in purchasing in fee and being the owner of and so in 2020 or something state land board according to price the ranger up there was trying to sell this and um I don't know what happened to that deal I wasn't sitting in this position so I I didn't I wasn't even aware of it um but he let us know that in the past they've been interested in selling so I approached them this year and said are you interested in selling and the person I spoke to said oh I don't think so I don't think we ever want to sell our properties but let me talk to the guy who really knows and as of this morning I haven't heard back but um this is one that we would be wanting to uh partner with boulder on because we wouldn't I'm assuming I'm assuming with um the fact it's almost 90 acres if we you know we're talking on the order of a million dollars maybe more um we'd want to potentially partner with them and or you know come working up a deal with them for this so kind of more to come on that I want to include this one on the list if we hear back from the state land board and they say actually yes it is for sale and here's the price but we don't have that piece yet so we can circle back to that in a minute let me just get through the last two pieces um the the trail priority that we have on our list that we were going to put on our boulder county partnership um ask is just the regional trail planning in the area that was we brought this last year and the regional trail planning in the area is a long month of lions you read a long month the uh rocky mountain greenway master planning effort was set aside when the flood happened and it hasn't been picked up since but Sarah and I were just there in January and their trail planners were talking about potentially picking that effort up again so we want to say we're here to partner with you whether it be you know beyond your technical advisory committee beyond um you know helps with grant support things like that so we just want to add that to the list um as as a partner with them as the lead and that's that's exactly what we did last year but this is the first year since then we've heard them say like oh no we are we are interested in starting so more to come on that um and then something new that we're putting on on our list but it's not a partnership of boulder county it's just long months and acquisition priorities is this water for open space we just bought the old lander farm but it had no water to buy with it so we've got a farmer on there and we're working with our water resources department to essentially rent water move water move city water around so that that farmer can have a viable farm so we're only in a one-year lease because we only have a one-year solution to that problem right now so um we would like to prioritize possibly using some of our acquisition funds if we can to buy highland ditch water and cbt water okay so that's that's all the priorities and then so there were five things the olander c e the button rock area militant c e which was the private landowner the button rock state land board parcel which we would want to buy and see concentrating on buying water and the regional trail planning efforts so that's five things and then the ones that we would want to put on the boulder county application are the militant c e of button rock with the two parcels the state land board parcel there and just just you know reiterating to them that we we do want to be part of the trail planning rocky mountain green with planning process that was a lot but yeah good job and what i consider only i think is that there's not like there's other properties out there that you didn't include this is kind of the best list we have this is the best list we have i mean sometimes there are things that come up during the year like there's always there's we don't know like tomorrow there could be an opportunity that i didn't talk to you about tonight um those sorts of things or things that aren't ready to be shared publicly um but yeah this is our list this is our current list for 2024 knowing that we made a big big acquisition just in february and so you're looking for support or thinking of this or yes are you looking for me to say i move that we accept what you just said and um that i mean i do move that i mean i think that all sounded good and logical to me like good acquisitions um to go to blover county and then also yeah like conservation easement as well and i move that so i don't none of that's official and i jump in here the motion is not to reputation the city council it's just staff right it's it's so that staff can exclude it it's so that we know that you don't like our whole list acquisition priorities for 2024 and then separately i want to be able to say on our application to boulder county we took this to prav here are their thoughts they like it all they don't like it all they like this and not that so it's kind of two two things got it i like what you said thanks for the time like i i think what you said that was all good i mean there's something like more excited about than others and but it's it's okay but awesome good to me so it's what i say who else wants to say the only question i had was the this school board special non-recreational recreational easter if we buy it do any of those funds then switch back to the school board like it was intended for or that was just a timber pricing thing that's that so we basically lease it now and pay a lease rate so that would go away yeah we would own it yeah so okay and then yeah no i was we were just briefly talking about maybe the school collects some sort of return on it but they lease it out just because they're trying to earn more money right okay no i think they're all across the state trying to rather get along some cash and best that and get it better that's probably paying off more in the temporary yeah you know that's what yeah i was just wondering if there's a valuation any other concerns you want to raise before we move into a motion you want to try again it's a tough one to the last few weekends um i move that we go to boulder county with the proposal the acquisition the acquisition proposal that it was that whoo okay all right motion on the floor then we have a second a second all right all in favor okay i wish it was a better well it's great it's great yeah like they don't care they just don't know if they like it or did they not like can we like it would be just good right like that's great thank you you don't need great wording yeah we'll work with it another time go okay now does that mean that we're done with both a and vita do we want to say anything about the full list or just that was the boulder county list oh there's more yeah there is this is the whole there's five things three things are going on the list to boulder county right i think we'll start it all on i'm confused and i would understand that and i move that we partner with boulder valley and longmont conservation districts on the parcel above me and reservoir that's all under all under parcel sorry i didn't want to say alone farms okay thank you okay awesome thank you uh all those in favor all right okay run we're we're gonna send that as well great now we're better now we're good okay sorry for the miss out there i have continues i think you're in for for that okay um so that would mean that we're covered on both a and b right right awesome okay so then let's keep moving on to the next item which is discussing 2024 capital of room projects and 2025 proposed projects is a media topic i think uh david or or jeff i'm gonna start i'm sorry jeff's like i'm sorry so i can yeah i i've heard his so one of the things we wanted to do is just do a kind of a overview of the cip process we are we as staffer in the midst of that right now and that process will end on may 6th each division in department in the city has about 30 days to develop or update their projects in the system and you know parks must have 100 projects on its own i think recreation has about 10 of them uh and and so during that process we update the the cip's and the cip's are are unique in that it's a five-year plan council will only review that's prove the 2025 but it gives them kind of a a guideline of what's going to happen the four years after that but again they only will approve the 2025 dollar amount any questions on process that's kind of quick because we do have a lot of projects we want to go through any questions someone's great thank you thank you so i also don't want to know stephanie you know glade is usually here to talk about her projects less than majority of our cip projects with that big piece it was s i by council and leadership referral um was the eight and five projects um daniel has a couple of us as well and we talked about those stephanie's husband was in a pretty specific car accident so she is at home with him right now it's been a week at a hospital and it's going to be a while before she can probably be back in the office so um i'm having to cover for her tonight we actually just did this with heral though so i think as jeff talked about what the the challenging things with this group and jeff and i had was a lot too is how we help you be more involved in this process when it really is a a list of projects that aren't always completed when we started it we've already laid it out for the next five years um and we roll through those and they'll get densely carried forward so for us right now probably the biggest things we can look at are those eight and five projects and that's where stephanie's team daniel team are are working on those and of those eight um clover metal is in the process of going right now and that should be completed um by fall of this year um dry creek is set to the fields um should be ready for play next year sounds like 20.5 and then box meadows is looking like january 25 so we got three of those that are looking that they have a completion date um and then daniel has right now which we have the union sir i'm sorry let me roll it out yeah the union loop trail which is part of the bigger master plan um and that would start we would start designing this year and or just construction in 20.25 phasing construction um and then you have a st. grain greenway face plow is another 85 and that's the western extension of st. grain greenway to airport road that should it'll eventually connect so it would be currently designed as along the north side and it would connect to future polar county extension of st. grain greenway so we have that plan for design in the probably the second half of 20.25 and then construction in 20.26 yeah that's it for you after going ahead thanks table so we're having a trail that goes to airport world scrollable why why do we need another one on the north side so this is a project part of the greenway trail where we've done 11 phases of the trail in the city they're complete we're doing uh the 12th phase how phase 13 is connecting sandstone ranch to st. grain state park and then the last piece of it is this phase 12 that would connect us into boulder county system so it's it's a project that's been on our books since the 90s um the 90s yeah uh so it's a project that our team is going to be working on which we have not started on so we also our team also inherited st. grain 13 which we're starting construction on and we were we inherited the project we inherited an idea about where the trail should go and we did not end up close to that because we did our very initial analysis of the trail and it didn't make sense to us after you know two decades had passed it didn't jive anymore so we came up with a new plan that made sense for today so the same process is going to occur on 12 we're going to do a very initial alignment analysis and ask questions just like that what are we doing here does this make sense where does it make sense so none of that has even started there's big heron mess there at that the heron recreate golden ponds yeah yeah so for the record golden ponds is one of my favorite areas and my what i have talked with david about is that we already have the connection to airport wouldn't we be money ahead to be able to get all the way to public crossing by not having to do that another trail all over doesn't sound like a bad idea let's i mean so we start by putting all the ideas on the table with with 13 i could bring up an image and show you about 10 different trail ideas that we have i'll just i'll just say like i write that like it's going to show up that area and i'll start to work right now there is sidewalk on airport road that is protected nice bike path all the way the same thing road but not all the way past the farm and all the way up to night avenue so that's my point is that you could use that money to do that work rather than paying for another trail on the north side all the way to the airport yeah definitely it's worth an option i mean like it's got kind of dead ends and we know it's right now so i haven't looked into it it'd be nice but um it also be much the green ways look a nice direct path a lot of it there'll be a big deviation we're looking at it i'm just saying stop it's just so this group knows i've been working with stepney because the land along saint green phase 12 is so deep slowly dedicated within like 90 days after it was annexed that was seven years ago now and it still hasn't been dedicated so we're working that and the land owners are pushing back and saying why are you going to drill here and make more sense here so one of the things we did is really commit to saying is that would then help to set we have we've inherited an old plan we're going to look at it we're going to see what circumstances change what makes sense and i'll tell you from the natural resource side and trying to get quarters that's an important piece for for us um user experience is important and when you hear about our budget for upcoming projects budget is a big piece too so if we can save a dollar to make connections and make things happen they give a good user experience and connect you know an area without having to impact habitat we're going to get all into consideration one thing about that is that one of the properties right here there is sky pilot part of the county just purchased so the other options also for alignment that they're interested in okay what is that property but it's not all your private which could yep and so we didn't include this one in our 2024 acquisition priorities but in terms of partnership with boulder county we are trying to connect into their system with this last leg of the saint green greenway through the city so we'll probably be talking about it to you this time next year uh in that capacity as well and again this dangles project again it's just so super serious all these extra people that's this great happy people work on something that's up down but when we get these done i mean you really are talking now from i-25 how odd it's pretty impressive um we're sending that that so let me go back then so that is now the union trail base 12 which is at 8 5 the clover meadows dry creek and fox males that's 5 8 that's what yeah that's what he said because i get five of them there um when this really kicked off one of the driving forces was um you know a lot of your members just like steves sitting here for a while to cap you up with one person trying to do this project so we have pile of money and we couldn't get things moving because all this work was getting held up at the ERC project most of it were responsible for another cipc cipc work in the city um now this work is getting done but we had to burn through that it was a pile of money no one to do it now we get people to do it and we got a pile of money so we're really having to start you know looking at what kind of permits coming in to refurbish funds within these different fund categories how conservation trust is lining up how open space can be used along some of the greenway projects so it's going to be really starting to be creative on those those next group we also talked about in this piece even at the projects we're doing because we wanted to do so much at once um step back kind of joke is saying we're getting five really good parts done there's nothing to be a calculator because we had to kind of cut things a little bit more bare bones to make sure we could try to use these funds try to get parts in areas we've been waiting for a long long time we talked about you know Gallo that's in this process too that we made some commitments about moving from two pickleball courts to four pickleball courts and try to make sure that we um give a good experience over there we don't want to hide anything in that area so we really are going to be getting a lot of work done but it is not super creative so we've talked about do we do the next three or do maybe one really well or do we do two really well or we look at recreation say what really is your biggest priority and we slow it down a little bit to try to make sure that we're able to to do these parts in a way that we kind of want standards of quality and again let's take away is there gonna be quality parts that are great but are they ever in this field? Pleasure in this room especially inside the table they want to see really cool stuff really cool stuff cost a lot of money and it's amazing how much it costs anymore and that's one of the things that um one of the staff members top down is really looking at that we're working with Denver a little bit on it's called place right easy people are going well they found out is that when you build a really cool park because we had this idea of wanting to have a park and walk in just 10 minutes but the minute you build something really cool people stop going to that really close to these because other ones they're really cool ones so it could be not have 50 parks but scale that back and that's what Denver's finding out and really builds up the community wants and again I think with our trail system you can get about anywhere in our park system it's really easy to do that one close to that one close to you actually gets you on a greenway that can get you to someplace else too so I think we have to have some conversations about how we go from this group of CIP projects into what's in that it's not going to be a conversation we have with this group but we're probably starting to honestly what is what is recreation what do our project managers see is the the gaps in our community and again this place right here we're really seeing where we are having gaps especially in neighborhoods that are underserved you know do we have the ability for them to have that park in the backyard but they don't have to get into the car to drive someplace so I think I see a people making great positive progress on about five of our parks right now that we can say we're on time with ten budget I'm going to be doing a great job but after that we'll have to come back as we can say hi we can move forward. I have one question for Sarah on union could you just briefly cover the sequencing of the county road realignment the reservoir expansion and the trail for those older acts yes that's what we've seen for a year in our notes that we're waiting on what kind of road to change sure I see that's the CIP but we did partially funded so is it fair to prioritize a trail that you can't actually they actually on these other things haven't happened yet right so we had a meeting a couple weeks ago where a decision was made that union reservoir company is going to work as like a separate project to basically do a tech sort of an interim widening of Sierra 26 that would allow us to build the trail on the older portion then of county road 26 because yeah that's like the transportation TRP 128 I think it is they don't have the funding for I think they said like three to five years to actually do that realignment so our plan currently is to do the design and then phase instruction and we don't know what design will look like there are a lot of environmental constraints here that we want to be cognizant of and also we're trying to balance union reservoir companies needs because this will serve as a maintenance road for them and then the rangers too so there's a lot of unknowns for what the trail will actually look like we were calling it a loop trail but we're not going to call it that because we're not really sure what that'll look like so that's the idea now what what are you what are you looking at not a loop what well sharing the interim yeah like not going this is really prime habitat up here so currently can it get to the dirt roads yeah so having like there's been discussion I don't know exactly where but using some of these already these roads that are already on cityland and like having that be a connection and maybe like an emergency access route to the trail but then having you turn around because another thing is they want to keep it fee-free they want to keep it free so and they all the rangers also only want one point of access into union reservoir so there's a lot of things to consider with that yeah the roads on the north side are beautiful quiet flat dirt roads that they never use those that would be awesome yeah it's like oh it's already like a free trail it's there that the one car an hour I see trucks there I don't know what's happening over here but it's a big dairy but yeah that's why you can't decide this my god ran cross country in that road when it when they're doing beat harvest when they're doing silage harvest it gets pretty dangerous out there so yeah I think those things we definitely again trying to spike that balance of how do you get what the community will ask for which is only the trail looking at going all over the county road by looking at 28 on the north how do you tie these things together to try to still give the recreation experience this trail trying to protect those natural resources that we have in this area has also been the um because there's also the 12th county road 26 trail study plan as well right yeah that's currently happening just going to design this trail right now too for you he's got 12th that's a great problem for you and you can do I mean we have seasonal trail closures for all sorts of other things right you just have the agseasonal trail closure probably a good idea I mean maybe it's never gotten done all the rest of it around the rest of the world but a lot of money it's not paid the way so if we take a step back 185 started 2023 right yes right so we have until 2028 correct if I'm looking at the packet there's three right now that are like in the in the process in the works so three those are instep these and you have yeah sarah which is the other unit is the union interim trail which is the fourth okay and then she she's talked about 12 that is right out there as well too so those are those are the ones in 85 they're pretty much locked in right now okay which leaves us with three that are not correct actively being worked on right now yes and and then the question that we talked about is like greater focus versus more yeah at the same time we can do it all fast right now it may not be the standards we want we have to you know scale back and how we typically do things along the line we could take longer let some funds build up and you know really try to do them well that had to be pushing these out by past that eighth year or we can scale back and how many we do and say it's a really nice thing we do for six or seven so we definitely have opportunities I mean if you want to give us the time to build up funds we probably could do them all but probably take more than that eight years five years yes eight five years yeah yeah so that's what we have to kind of look at we wanted to be doing one really well we want to be doing two kind of well we want just do three you know bare bones I just kind of want to know what Nina Gallo would be like about pickleball courts would come in on budget then the neighborhood doesn't care about pickleball courts they just want a place to play that's safe to play and they want to play around these on a good playground that's what they want and you know again I think what things is as we look at all of our park system you know we really try to engage the neighborhoods to see what they want but again even in the neighborhood park you try mine that's a fox knows neighborhood or our others that really is still these are open to the community at large you heard from you know our community that pickleball is a big piece so how do you balance that with what the neighbors want plus what the community at large wants well I was just saying this far as budget yeah we could be put in later maybe you know like when yeah okay where do we go from here in this competition in the game where would this group like to go or would you like us again I think with Jeff me is how do we engage you as we kind of move forward to make sure that we're hearing our voices before it's the point where decisions been made yeah and that's what I think I heard from the football times you know we already have budgets decided how do we get to have a say in this and and it's really a difficult year to have a say because of the 85 it's pretty much set for us right now but you know what's that future look like what it says right so maybe that's the direction we're going in right so we have sandstone ranch baseball we have the quail campus and that is one that we've talked about as you know going with pickleball courts over there to kind of near the courts of the tennis courts over there to before you move on to Aaron's point if we're going to build pickleball at quail dude can we save money by not doing that you know so that's I mean yeah I mean it's that pickleball people with pickleball play pickleball have access to cars people that live in countryside village need a place for their kids to play that hopefully they're not a third shooting at for this year you know like they're like this is like that neighborhood has been so underserved for so long here's what I'm saying is that like since I've been here you've been telling me that there's no room for community voice because the community was that we were already up but it just keeps getting pushed back getting pushed back I can't really represent that community but I know they don't play pickleball if we can save the money and have pickleball at quail which is a nice little walk for anybody from there like then could you know yeah oh happen like could it happen could there just be open places for kids to play and a good a good non-rickety because the playgrounds in that area are pretty rickety and pretty swag like it's already designed we're trying to find ways to bring it within budget yeah but I want to say is you've probably already got a good playground there so let's keep the playground take the pickleball and like you can have the pickleball later maybe you know I agree but I think I'm dry creek I think you guys did this for if it was built out as doing the park but not all the things were installed right it's planned right I think that you're looking at ways to speed up progress with limited funds doing the infrastructure of the park but not all the things in the park is well in person doing that you could leave us the grassy space that if in 10 years demand for pickleball develops you can certainly install it there but until then just we're getting grasses 100% cheaper than the courts I'm just prairie we're just prairie we had we had that open hearings about design and in those designs we include a pickleball that's a that's a can of worms that's already kind of been opened up a little bit as you all know right and but the pickleball folks being so aggressively vocal about that and wanting more and more I mean I hear more from them than I hear other folks about that that thing and I would I would I would agree with your point there it's one of those situations that yes we could and probably shouldn't wait on it to make this thing happen to make it get to the level that we want but I can see see a lot of grinding of teeth and consternation going on too that would make people it would just be a another thing that people say well you know why why my tax law is not being used you know the way that we first initially plan and then that is a really fine line to block in regards to what we're trying to achieve here I'm not against you know saying it's going to come in phases I'm saying that one of the first phases when the earlier you know even if that's phase two or phase three it's going to have to come into a relatively quick job because privileged people because privileged people are vocal and the people that aren't privileged aren't vocal don't have access so I'm on this board to represent the less privileged people is get that part going is what I said get that part going playground in it yeah and I think that those are good we've talked about phase and lots of stuff and that's one of the things that again we've talked about that one to Harold specifically say this is one of the parts that we're not going to hold up on doing is we have to bring this back so that again that was not one of the eight five but it's one that's running parallel to that and it came in silver budget we had to go back and re-bid it so that's sort of down the order that we're still moving forward and still hopefully that just throws us off by about 90 days um so uh Nina Gallo was not 85 no oh no okay so the reason we didn't do that the eight five because remember we did eight five that was one of one of the things that Harold bought was an idea what he was doing um the dba the value added process which is a bidding process yeah yeah yeah Gallo was down to a part of what we had to design on already they thought it'd be hard to take that and put it into a package that basically had blanks like projects so yeah that's again for their community it's great because they have eight five plus we had that part still going too so okay so I think you're going back to Ben's question then though it was um the picket balls at at quail um the sandstone phase four and then the the completion of the dry creek um community park phase two the build of that I'm not a little much about how um brush demand there is a sandstone I assume there's a lot of demand they would use up that space that was space four was done it's it's designed as a ball field area so but there's demand for both of that access yes sorry you walked out yes okay and dry creek phase two is moving this sled hill back so is that right no that that goes back in that process yes that's part of that there's more to it there's more to it on that ball fields and there's a water feature there is the permanent uh snow up there almost right all right okay so really it's just so a couple of the stories we can talk about this so we there's sounds like there's at least five that are in the hopper in motion so it's really just the three that we're looking for some feedback on about kind of what we're thinking about them and we can go a different direction than this we can either say we can talk about like stack ranking those three and get somewhat helpful but also I think so we kind of implying was more so like do we want to take our time with those at risk of missing our five-year deadline versus uh you know trying to fix the deadline and and more so looking to cut the phase things things out yeah okay those are the two open questions I guess kind of that I think you know that's what again I think you've been enjoying the recreation I think you know for us you know those are the questions exactly you ask would we rather like proceed with you know dry creek or is it better to get sandstone phase four where we know we have the demand that's again from our side building it we don't really demand yeah I just throw a vote towards uh to sandstone because with uh spring gulch this is the craziest name spring gulch to phase or whatever you know have an alarming problem end of same frame trail to to where that is of how people navigate on bikes or by foot between basically the playgrounds to the oh can you show on there yeah with this what's that piece yeah that's how why would it like putting ball ball fields you want to don't know how that will help what I say is from Steve so ball field playground so yeah so you're coming back through here yeah um and so there was I remember the conversation with Steve with it with the realignment of the ball fields which I guess goes here right is that there was going to be an alignment of a trail to go around these fields somehow or connect these fields so you're not getting into the playground traffic because you have a bike pedestrian traffic that will be picked up there today and connect so the trail ends the trail ends down here right and then there's you know questions of you know where base 13 where it goes right and then how are you going over to here and so um then we're seeing what we have is that part of this expansion would be figuring out this alignment so you're not messing with people I'm not sure I'm not I'm not sure we don't have to take a little bit of value back to you and because no no one can ride in those right that makes sense and against way too many people so you're on this or was it you're thinking that somehow we just confused myself down through everything to the self those ball fields easy you're just looking for a tie-in so yeah some way to tie in without going out to the street right um that would be that seems that would be like the the lowest stress way for someone right I thought for some reason you're like a we're thinking we're just gonna bop out the guy there's just so much oh yeah there's so much other exact stuff we said I got a whole concern but up in here I'm just I can pretty easy tell you this is that we definitely consider I don't see recently what how do you think it's really I mean I I know I know how much once you guys get done go on the union there's going to be so many people coming down through there right yeah and you got well yeah it's running around and so I think that would be I feel like I'd be on that on the east side of it I mean I don't know because I never ride on that west side and I always ride on the east side no I I always ride that like the parking lot in the street but intuitively people get stuck and they're like I don't even it doesn't occur to them to go away from where they know that's right should be you know like how do I even get there what's going on and then next to no there's a soccer game going on they're riding that bikes to people so I'm back to next question yeah I'm going back to why I think this is a good conversation I appreciate it but this is where this down here is a border planning conservationist in nowhere too so when you start saying getting Caesar to trail and I thought you're just like a straight line oh yeah it's like that's not going to happen and if we all say one thing we have to go to the border county and have them convince and they're going to say no to you so yeah that's again why conservation easements matter and can become challenges right however we have a conservation easement up by haze we have a conservation over haze that had been planning on the trail coming through so that conservation is this one I was going to say this because um freeway face 13 also rewinds the trail along the road yeah yeah you're right it goes along the road and then because that would change how people come up right I don't go off the road and then go off that way that trail well that's a disconnection yeah I mean the intuitive part is if it's that small parking not mulch area yeah there's that way they both using the street you just designed a cool new job yeah I did did it have like steal the technology what's that it had like steal the technology no it was going away from birds um Um, the whole, oh no, the whole vision zero, but, you know, traffic is playing, I mean, soon, like, we'll be able to see an interesting spinning and all that, but, I mean, that aligns really well with getting bikes out of, out of meaningful traffic areas. I mean, it, it doesn't sound like the hardest to sell in the world, does it? So Scott, you, you started talking, you said that you, of the three, um, sandstone, drag creek face to go over the ball, you're most interested in sandstone, that's somewhat contingent on what actually is part of that project? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay, so then there's just an action of just dominating that, somewhat contingent on that. Okay. Can you, can you circle the area where the ball fields would go? How much of that space does it take? I don't know, I just, yeah. Is it like, is it designed to? There's a, there's a conception. It's a concept, but not a product, it's not here, it's not here to lead to it. I mean, take this right here and figure it out. I would see, it's almost, it's perfect here. Yeah. This is like, venture ball. What is that? Relieve the prairie, and people have an adventure while they're playing their ball, and you really have to look for it, and you have to run for it. When she said, when she called it, yeah. Adventure ball. So, part of this, the thing of that design where the concession stand was in the restroom, it was intentionally put there because of the two complexes. That way, if we were running concessions, you didn't have to build two of them. Yeah. Well, that place just, I just was so impressed after that drilling in Irish football. Yeah. That was just, it just was so perfect for the, yeah. Are there any other, so of the, again, going back to the three, between Sandstone Ranch, Phase Four, Directing Phase Two, or Coral Road, Pickleball, the three. Any other thoughts on the board on which of those are most interesting? And there, and I, you can also speak up as if you're thinking something different. I, yeah, I don't even know, like it's just a lot. I think my, my take would be that taking care of what we have to me is more important than new things. Yeah. And generally, like, adding Pickleball Accords to Oak Creek when we just failed to get money to repair the rec center, let's see that money go to the rec center, if we could, as an option. But, not that there's enough to do anything, but, yeah, since our budgets are tight, adding Pickleball Accords to Oak Creek is the lowest interest made, even as a local community, like we just, they just opened the 30 court private facility in Bowland that started wanting to need for that too. 30? No, it's not worth it, it's not worth it. I don't, yeah, and they, they paid $75 now. Yeah. So, but you understand Pickleball, Pickleball players who were talking about paying nothing, that, that's their audience. They're not Dale's audience. That is a small part of the entire Pickleball community. The people who aren't always at everything talking about Pickleball, they want it like tennis. They want it everywhere all the time. Oh, yeah. And that isn't, that's a, that's a, it's really costly for the city to build those things for a very small number of people. It was so smart to take some of our tennis courts and move them into, like, do it around, uh, Hover Park there and turn them into Pickleball Accords because they're used nonstop. I mean, even with this wind event, you'd be like, how's that supposed to work? And, you know, they're about there. Yeah, I'm glad it works the same way. Yeah. So, getting the sense that we're not going to come to a consensus of like, if we're trying to score stack rankings three, it's probably not going to get, you have to rely on that. Well, the other thing that we can do is really this, as this first update is we start looking at budgets and looking at where we want to go and I, I do think that, you know, hearing from recreation, what those kind of pushes are, that trying to get to the point where we start looking at budget, looking at these from that side of the table and the side of the table and having a little bit more robust conversations. And I think it really just was giving you all the heads up that, I think we're going to be pushing through this first group pretty well. It's going to be super tight. We're being as creative as we can, but it's going to be that next group that we want to talk about what we really think we need. And I think, so that gives you a half here. I think Harold's and Council would be open to that is, are there ways we could use that to update things? Are there parts that maybe we don't need to be pushed another area to try to increase value to those areas? I think those are all meaningful conversations. In other words, can't get to five of that. Could, I mean, that's again, it could be five and five, or you go because we definitely want, we want, standstill phase four, you know, cool those dollars, make your really significant push at sandstones, make that it. And then we'll wait on the other two or, I can't say good ideas. And you didn't mention this, but one of the things we as staff have talked about is the need for a special event area. Fourth of July has really brought that to the forefront of, there really isn't a place in our community to do those kind of large events. And maybe the sister's property at some point. Or even Montgomery, one of the two, could possibly become that location. That's what we're doing. Yeah, sorry. Instead of doing a talk about the land and the like. What about the big parking lot at the Sugar Beach factory? It's already paved. Well, that's going to be, it's such a complex facility that it might, it's, and it's not ours to, I know. Yeah, so this is, you know, right here. And this will be the community park up here.  It's just right here doing prone shows. And maybe this is something that's closed. It could be thought about as a community gathering area to do some of those things. But again, we also have Montgomery up here. So we have kind of two that again, aren't on the five-year plan at all, that maybe we say that's what's really important. What? Yeah. Karen? This might be like the weirdest thing ever. And it's like, not what people do. What if we partnered with the county to make the venue that we have, Boulder County Fairgrounds that's in here, make it a joint thing that really serves needs. The county's trying to improve the fairgrounds right now. And if we went to the table with county and we started actually doing things together around the fairground, I just feel like I just see a lot of like half done stuff with the county there, but it's like that they need support on and things that we need support on. We need an event place. Well, that is an event place. It's a pretty good event place needs to be better. And things like, well, you know, we run all these special things for all these concerts and then the fair languages, the fairs ours, you know, it's City of Longmont Fair with Boulder County Fair at the same time. Nobody knows the difference except for the people that sit at these tables, right? So if we start partnering in like that more creative way, like what we're bringing money to the table, that's already developed land. What if we're bringing money and ideas and time to that table instead of just redoing starting from square one and like doing jointly just makes more sense to me. It's right there. It's right in the center. Yeah, I definitely think with the peripheral parks as an event space has the same problem that we just, that's the same stuff. We said, why don't we go to the federal system? Well, it's hard to get there. There's no transit buses. We get stuck, traffic's hard. Any other peripheral parks would help that? Well, sisters, that's one thing. We've had some discussions because of the lifetime. And sisters, we do have the quail campus area. So that's a big advantage to that, just that particular spot because we do have large parking lots there. Another phase going at some point. So that's just a thought there. That doesn't discount these other ideas. And it's just another thing to consider it. I'm not sure it would even be the staff's number one thing. All right. So, it turns to close road. They're very connected. The trails are in there. Yeah.  It's empty for the end of the year. And that's that they're really useful in the city. I mean, there are actually, there are events there. There are three events there at every single week. But it could be more, it could be more utilized. And I don't want to take it away from the ag community at all, ever. But if the ag community is looking for support from the urban community as well, it would be a good crossover. And I don't know. It would just take a lot of negotiation from clever and open-hearted people to work together. Let me just take this, the words of echo. Thank you, Erin, for showing it. Um, let's just set aside where the event space would be. Whether it's, whether it's Montgomery or Sisters or the Collaboration with Boulder for the fairgrounds. Do we, just a good check. Do we think that having an establishing event space where it's top of mind because of the July 4th show, but we find that more urgent and more of a need as compared to the other three, eight, five projects are not in the queue? For me, it's hard to tell with that. Because I don't play baseball. I'll play pickleball. I know pickleball players. I know baseball players. And that's what I'm seeing those others are towards those things. But I guess an event space serves a larger cross-section of our community than pickleball or baseball or anything for even, sorry. But that's frequent use, right? I think that, I agree with you. I don't disagree with you. I don't know. I would just say when it comes to baseball, we haven't added a baseball field in long months since 1990. And our community is from a lot in that time. So I do think there is a need for more athletic. Well, if you are enlarging that, that makes it for a tournament like we're certainly, that's big dollars coming in from that community. To a high school teacher, I can tell you how many club kids there are doing that stuff. Yeah. Sorry to answer your question. Jeff, do you know what the demand is on the UOPP side for other spaces for events, coming from outside or from an event? Or are they able to serve? Well, I think if you build it, they'll come, sort of thing. Because people know what we've got. And so when they call us, they're saying, yeah, parks. So the events we see, I'll go look at Roosevelt. And that's like the main one. So I wouldn't say there's a clamoring. We've seen on that group, but our spaces are in demand. And this community supports a lot of events, not just ours, but a lot of private events. So it's, I don't know if you can answer that. So I think the answer, no, I don't see a clamoring for that. After a situation that they thought they were going to have that game of football in somewhere in Denver, and that fell through the Astro Double. I talked to the guy that arranged it and set it all up. And his file was just my damper. And they came to my mind, they're so happy with that that if they can get an opportunity to do that again, and they go through a cycle of big cities like Chicago, Boston, and New York, and so on. They love us. They were so happy with it. They love us. And they're doing some filming of it. And it's getting out there. And what's going to happen is they think because of something like that, that's going to be one of our Tencent and Range is going to get really, you know, busy. At the same time, I don't want to build recreational services for people that don't live in Longmont, or in the surround. I mean, I'm fine with building recreational services for people that live in, you know, the Lafayette, Longmont, Louisville kind of coalition, you know. But I don't want to build recreational areas for people in Kansas. That's not our job. You know, they're coming out for a baseball. I'm like, that's great. And I like traveling with my kids and things too. But like, I don't think that's our priority is building things for people that are coming from Kansas and Chicago to come here. And I know they bring money, but I'm not like, frankly, I'm never interested in that part of it. And I know you like, we have to be, but I'm not like, that's not what we're, we're not here to make money. We're here to make, we're here to serve the recreation and open space for our area. That's why we're here. I would agree with that. But I do think there is a push, not only from within staff, but there's a long mod has a big push of trying to get large events to come to long mod and the more facilities that we could have available, the bigger events that we could end up drawing to our community and then reaping the benefit of the sales tax. I mean, I'll say, as far as ball fields go, we don't build them for apartments. We build them for the kids in this area. Which is good. That's what I think, yeah. The tournaments are free to us. Yeah. Are there any sort of projections or like soft numbers that you guys get that might tell us where money numbers go? If you do build it, like, wow, revenue. No, yeah, like how much? No, not what we're not how we're going to build it. But if it was built, if that's going to help get you guys above, that 78% or whatever it was, sorry, 60%, like is it, or that's just tertiary. There's a number, for example, if we build three ball fields in the same stone, we could come up with an estimate of how many more potential tournaments, how much more mental, you know, we could do that. And it's, you know, it's in the tens of thousands of dollars. Yeah, that's not that's not pushing. I don't want to say it's dropping by because it's not. It's that's where we're at, man. But it's great. Yeah. And a lot of time hasn't been put into that because the fields are so far down the road right now. This was a great conversation. I'm going to be in the end of it a little bit. That's okay. Because we're all learning here and growing it. But I don't think there's any immediate action necessarily from today. I think it's a highlight. And I think, you know, Jeff can say what he thought too. But I think Harold was pleased that we were doing what we didn't direct it to do. We're spending money and we don't have, we're not really asking for anything more. We have, you know, the ones in the eight and five already, but his big push is, you know, don't ask for more money if you haven't completed what you already done and you don't think you have the capacity to do it. So right now we have projects that are ongoing. Staff is fully engaged in those and the ones that are on the horizon. I think we do have the capacity to do those with staff we have. And if I'm doing my math right. So the ones that are in progress now, they're design, they're like construction, the most part of 2025. 24.5, 24.25, yes. Which means that we could start design for the next batch. And late 2025, 2026. Right. And that's the one that we did talk about tonight. And that's probably Sierra's phase 12 of the zinc rain. Got it. Trail. 13 was a little less capacity. Yeah. Okay. Well, we did move pretty quickly to the earlier Brexit agenda. So we still, we could stay on with something for a little longer. I have four questions. We can start off talking about the CIP and then talking about 8.5 quickly. So the 8.5 are our most significant CIP projects as we talk about CIP. Those are the big ones. We also have the one we track of and these are kind of, and then we did hire a position for that. And it is the maintainable we have. And Lisa really is the project manager side. Stephanie's team that really is doing the Kensington's and the Roosevelt's and the Thompson's to make sure that we're staying up on our renewals and maintenance of our projects as well. But very good. So I have a couple of CIP related questions. I guess, as I've tried to read through the CIP document, understand what it means. And I've been very on time with that. But I just grab on a random. Sisters Community Park is in the CIP listed as a funded project. It lists $328,000. This is last year's CFD PDF. $328,000 for 2025 to build a bike skills park at Sisters Community Park. What does that actually mean? So that should be... We've never talked about that. It was a four-year. And that's next year. So that way I believe should be, that should be unfunded now. That was something that Steve, because we're doing the earth work, we were doing earth work. And we knew we had a need to get me in for that bike skills area. This really was the kids were building stuff along. Up the creek. So we're like, what can we do to build that need? Can we just dump some dirt, take stuff that is really similar to where they make something? And whenever you do that stuff, it's going to take permitting. And it's going to take design. It's going to take staff. And it's going to take work. So we really kind of kind of goes back to Harold. He's, do you have staff to do it? And do you have dollars to do it? So that example should be... You guys will be updating both the text description, the funding timeline, and changing the status as part of this year's CFD process. So you've got to look through all the PRO projects and say where we are with these, what's kind of shifted around, what's there. And that's kind of what you're looking at today. Because my first got here, I really wasn't sure how I was willing to do what. But there should be a little initials. There are parts of the rec projects it says. Okay. Yeah. Now I know my work for that. That's PRO 206 with sisters. That's just an example. I don't care about that. It's more just understanding like, you've asked us for input on CIP. I've had a hard time knowing what you were looking for from us because I don't understand how the funding in the CIP document works.  And it comes from different funding sources. And that's the part I came going back to when you say what are we looking for from you. As we're working through this and getting it to the place to get it to council, a lot of those decisions that I'm looking at for 25.25 are being made in, as we talked about, the base 12 in the 90s. So there's these projects that are continually going forward. That's the hard part to say what we're looking for. Because mine would really be prioritizing what we know is coming up. And then helping us look that further piece out. Because again, if we use it and it's done in 25, we'll be having that need. And then when we get back to that CIP thing, say what was funded? What are our gaps? How can we pull things forward then? Make this comment tonight. We can do it in 50. What I was thinking is maybe a better way for us to give feedback would be to say here's all of the CIP projects. What are the funded parts of funding that are un-funded? As proud knowing these as they're described in there, how would you rank those in terms of interest?  Because you're saying we're, for example, sisters, we're going to take that funding and move it somewhere else. Probably is not important. If we could look at all of these together and give that feedback, that's useful, we could do that. But otherwise, I don't want to have to help on the CIP process. Because it's so complicated for you guys already. I can use it every day. Yeah, yeah. It feels like we don't know how to help. And I think that's a very way of putting it. Because four years now, this has been a challenge. Because it's such a complex process with so many different pots of money, it's hard to really get a feel of what you all want. Other than us continuing to have the, what are the next three or five projects that would be your priority, which maybe helps council make their decisions down the road too? I would agree. I kind of want to hear, as a council member, I want to hear from you guys what you think. You know, you got into this this year really engaged. And you wanted to have a say in it. And this is kind of your passion. And as it being your passion, I'd prefer, you know, I'm not into building big facilities to bring in folks, as you were saying there, from Kansas. I just know that those weak facilities from Kansas, those weak facilities sometimes pay for the things that you really value and want. And in this more localized pocket parks and things like that, that people actually use every day, especially community neighborhoods. And that's, that's what's more important to me. You know, I grew up just at Old Town. And Thompson Park was used for everything from football games to baseball games. We never had anything lined up with anything like that. It was just, you know, this stump over here in that tree there. And that's the important part. That, so that's my stance on all of it. This less is more in a lot of ways. Like, let the kids build their bike skills park. Like, it's fun, right? Like, what, like we don't need to build so much stuff. We can use what we already have. But I do think, like the pocket park, I'm just saying that if you look, you live in a trailer and there, there's no kid with any place to play. There's no place to play the only playground in that area. There's a small playground in Countryside Village. There's a very small janky playground.  And that's it for those kids. And it's how you go over to quail. And they don't have access to the quail because they don't have parallel supervision. So that, to me, at the community park, I don't think there should be a community park there. It's too close to Sandstone. It's too close to Quail. I don't think we need a community park. I mean, we need a neighborhood park there. I think unless there's more, just places that are OK for kids to play, and they can have places where occasionally they get a scraped knee or whatever. We don't have to, like, you know, it can be stumps. It just needs to be a place with a bathroom that's not exploding and people to check on it and make sure that there's not trash in there and it's clean and it's respectful of the community. And I think with a lot of our parks, we don't have to make them, like, we don't have to make a cooler pavilion at the museum. I worked at the museum for a long time. You don't have to make a cooler pavilion at the museum necessarily, you know what I mean? We don't always have to keep making things the best and the brightest, but we do need things to be nice and less as more. Like those stumps that you played on, Sean, those are great, but we don't have any stumps at Thompson Park anymore. Yeah, I'm just going to go down. Oh, was there? Okay. Oh, we're going to stop. Yeah, awesome. But like having those areas for people with small yards and things like that, if we're advocating for denser cities, which is a mobile home thing, it's a density kind of thing. We're advocating for denser cities, then we've got to put the place for people to be in access nature. Like I said, I prefer to hear from you guys. And you're reaching out to people that are members of the community. They're conveying the same thing, but that's the direction of reaching them. Thank you, Aaron. Any of the thoughts on outside of 8 and 5? Actually, I think you asked last year that we have time to talk about CIP before you guys are in the system. And I think we should actually decouple it and talk about this after you've done CIP. This sounds like you have updates to all these projects that you want to go through in the video. Look at the funding, and then maybe in the summertime, after that whole process is done, we could then help you give you that feedback about prioritization and adjustments to those for the following year outside of that process. That makes a lot of sense. There's a, you know, intuitively it seems like, oh, it's too late, but actually you just put it under way around it. Okay, no, we're actually quite early. Okay, I like that. Scott, I mean. I'm sorry, just to please, that being late, you're right, we started these conversations and October, November, December really is when we start putting our calendars. I was the same way when first got here. It's like, all right, I'm just going to open up on the stage. You can't start this conversation when the budget opens up. It really has to be, and then it was like, oh, we can't do anything unless the budget opens up. It's like, so let's just make spreadsheets and then we'll have these conversations and we can put it into budget. So it really has been for all of us to keep pushing it back, so we really have good conversations. So that's a really good idea. But on the calendar it says that the CIV system opens on mid-March. Does that... The what? The CIV system opens on mid-March. So where we can work in spreadsheets, we have conversations, all the stuff we have to do, the budget system has to be on the line, budget doesn't even open there. We say, well, we can't do this because budget's not open. Okay, okay. We should be ready to put stuff into the system when budget opens up. Because you can, in 30 days, start developing number of the data that we have. So my piece is really, you know, when you do this in spreadsheet, then this is a kind of paste in the budget system. Several hours of just sitting there and hammering it down. Yeah. Thomas, got any last thoughts on this topic? Any other closing thoughts on this? No, I appreciate the input. I think having this conversation as we, you know, move into the summer months that we get ready for upcoming years, I think that we'll have that idea to work. But just that, and I appreciate you saying that, so that's what you'd like to hear. So that's what I want to hear. I have direction right now to do 85, but if really this group is saying, we'd rather see six and five or rather see five and five and think about doing a venue area, I think that's what council really wants to hear. I think our first bunch of ours, we have a lot of undeveloped cars, we have a lot of money to spend those dollars and get some stuff out there. And I think taking some time and re-evaluating, now that we've checked some boxes. I think it's what council in here would like to hear rather than just plugging through to these guys. I love checking boxes. If I can get 85 done and say we did that, it'd be great if I'd rather do it where the community wants it. And again, I'm not sure. No, but it's a good time to reassess. It's how did those projects get into 85? Four big projects didn't make it into 85 because they were already grown. We're seeing grade 13. It's already gone. So we're going to go ahead and call it. Great, awesome. Okay, then I guess we'll move on from here. Closing parts. Okay, so moving on. Do items from the packet? I'm going to have the item from the package. Raise. Stop. So how big was the differential from? Bids in versus expected budget? I was going to say, Devin here or Steve here, so I don't know how I'm going to answer these. I know that was like a million and a half over what we had expected. Okay, so I think, well of course it was going to be 60. We basically, we found some other ways. It takes a village of people looking at different projects, different funding sources. I think we're going to find ways to do this. But it was like, again, it was taken out, took a while, it was taken away from the dog areas. It was taking out, I was taking out so much stuff. It's like, we can't do this, this community. We have to provide something that is there. So I think we found ways to face it and use some savings in other areas. Be able to save it. Again, we have, that's another problem. As you had dollars in there, partially done, you know, they had a master plan that was done that doesn't inherit it. Well, that's the key, basically. Adsign, we're going to play here every year. We get some of these years, every player doesn't even mean anything anymore. Those numbers are so astronomical. Some of the years you're caught by, you know, factors of 10 that you really don't want to start about. But yeah, that wasn't like that. So they're already on your budget. So if you take out the dog park and the bit of the ball. It was, we still weren't there. We were, yeah, it was. So I mean, once again, it's a neighborhood park. Is that certain pickleball is not like, frisbee golf doesn't serve that. Dog park doesn't serve the area, you know. I think the problem is we're not talking about, like, nothing in these boxes with 250,000 dollars out of it. So, but is it cool in my understanding that? Like, is there a single thing we can outline and go, oh. Yeah, the basic point of that is our state's policy is that we use wild water for parks. That wild water requires us to put in a pond. That pond has an activation process. We're going to go with the dirt that was going to be used for the bike park. So that was one of the things that we put it on to domestic water until we face in that, because we don't need that full-size pond until the community park comes on and the innovation centers expand in either paper. So it's going to have that pond to be paid for by the innovation center at the school district with their new, I think it's a Montessori school that's going to be over there in the community park. So that this whole neighborhood park is taking the full cost of that pond. That was one of the things we really looked at. So the pond is one of the bigger events on that. Yeah, that would be a big cost. Yeah, man. I would guess also that there's like a pretty significant baseline cost of just getting a contractor on and setting up, and that's a big part of it.  Which is an argument to do it all at once, come to what I was saying earlier. It is. There's a mobilization cost to set up and redesign. It's not an interesting thing for us to do in a future meeting is going to have data and budget like that for parks and the better understanding of those things as there's less of a study of sorts. Yeah, the mobilization is a big piece. Other items in the packet. Yeah, I had two little problems. Was Isaac Walden Reach II awarded or not? It says both in the packet. I don't think it was awarded. What's that? Well, the Isaac Walden Reach II, the RV Corps Projects, says it was awarded and it says it will be awarded in October 24 now. I know, I know, I know. It was awarded. Yeah, that's the great thing. Okay, cool. That's great. You can just put this right here on right here. Oh, right. In like two sentences. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think there's loads of data. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember reading that. There's good words at the chair. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, I didn't like it. I remember it was for Danielle. I didn't realize there's this idea of open space to look from last year up. That's a great idea. If you're able to make it happen, I'd love to come and hear about some of those topics and the topics that are in there. I would love for them to come. We are putting out, you know, trying to figure out what, trying to figure out council schedules. Yeah. But I have to do the pull-out soon. Okay, that was all. Good idea. Obviously. Okay, nothing from me either. Okay, then I think we're over. Kate, I'm going to move on to items from staff. The only thing I've mentioned is council will be talking about the 4th of July event tomorrow and we, as staff, hope we get some direction from council on how to move forward. Oh, I doubt that, no. I have a question on that. So when I go to tell them what I think, because I sent out an email that ended up being like, oh, you can't do that because that means people are meeting. Like, if I had no idea, I don't know the protocol. Like, if I stand up and say something, you know, and I'll just like, am I allowed to mention that I'm not representing Parks Board, but I'm on the Parks Board. So I've been thinking about this for a while so that they know that it's not just somebody who just like heard about it 15 minutes ago and stopped in for the free bottle of water. I think it's important that if you mention Crab, that you're not there representing Crab. Unless you all take a... Unless you all take a camera. Which we were not able to pass that notion of Crab last meeting. Sorry, David, I... No, I was going to say you can, if this group votes and says you're speaking on behalf of them, but I think letting council know that you spend your time for me to go to these and you volunteer as a Crab member, we must be, but it's well worth doing what you're allowed to do. Okay, sorry, you guys, do you think? That's all I have. Okay. I think all we want is your design for St. Mary in 12. Yeah, and then my desk, the money. And then my friends at the farm. 300,000 of designs. We have saved all that money because of hearts. You only do? Yeah. I'm good, thank you. Okay. Items from the board that are not packet updates. Oh, no, that means you have to adjourn, but I love being here. Is there a motion to adjourn? I'll move to adjourn. In a second. All those in favor? Okay, we're adjourned. Thank you, everybody. I have to call in for the next two or three minutes. I want to figure out the little closet today about the video, like figuring out all the other stuff. It was being covered the next time.


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