And we're live. Take it away. Hi everyone. I just want to say thank you for spending some of your Friday evening with us. And I'm excited to spend the next hour and a half talking a little bit about this moment that we're in. Post-Trump election. And I want to, before we get started, just express a lot of gratitude to the group of folks we've got here on this panel to talk a little bit about where we go from here in this moment after Donald Trump has won the election. And before we dig into introductions and a series of questions for this group of leaders and organizers and activists from across the movement, I just want to welcome what I imagine is a pretty broad array of places that people are coming from. So not just physical places, but also ways of being that people are coming from.  I want to welcome people who are experiencing a broad reactions, outrage to shock, to despair. I want to welcome people who feel like this isn't really that big of a change. It's just more of the same, but a little bit more transparent. I want to welcome people who haven't really wanted to get out of bed for many days. And I'm hoping this will just go away. I want to welcome those who also see this moment as an opportunity or a chance for hope. And I believe that folks who are calling in are probably coming from a variety of these places. And I imagine that those of us on this video call are probably coming from lots of different places too. And so I want to name before we get started that I don't know that we're going to land with any cohesive single call to action. I don't expect that from this call. But I do expect that we'll hear some beautiful analysis and emotion and updates from many different vantage points in movements for justice in this moment. And I want to welcome that. And I'm excited to hold each other as we have this conversation and feel a lot of gratitude for all of the different perspectives that are being brought to this call. So thank you all. And I was going to ask folks for bios that I could give introductions for each person on this call. But as I thought more about it, I actually think that that no one will give a better introduction for each individual than themselves. And so I'm going to ask folks to introduce themselves and share a little bit about who you are and what you're seeing at this moment from where you sit in the world. So just a minute or so on that and I'll call folks and you can go from there. So Roberto, do you want to tell us a little bit about you? Yeah, so my name is Roberto Juarez. I'm from Maryland. I grew up in Frederick, Maryland. I'm a member of Kosetcha. Kosetcha is a nonviolent movement that's working to make sure that we protect our immigrant community that we have dignity and respect for our immigrants. We're just about a year old. So our first training was actually about a year back. We have 18s around the country, 18s around the country and about 15 different 15 full-time organizers and looking for more. I think for myself, I was born in D.C. My mom is from Peru. My dad's from El Salvador. My mom came here as a domestic worker. My dad came here during the Civil War when he was about 16, 17 years old, crossing the border and just coming to a new country. But they came early enough that they were lucky enough in 1986 is when they could adjust their statuses. And ever since then, I've known the story of my parents and worked with a lot of undocumented youth. And about five, six years back, I got involved with the immigrant rights movement, especially the immigrant youth movement. And one fought and won campaigns where we were able to protect young folks from deportation. And our community right now is really scared, I think, especially with the young folks. One of the first things that Trump said he's going to do on his first day of his administration is take away the executive orders that President Obama has done. And that's how we were able to win protection for undocumented students, was through an executive order. So on day one, millions of undocumented youth from across the country are going to lose that status. And we all know the rhetoric of building the wall of deporting folks of all these horrible things that he's been saying. Fear is going into our community. And it reminds me of the times where we had Arizona making those laws that were going to turn police into ICE. I remember going into Alabama, Florida, other states like that, where I saw folks packing up and moving and leaving. That same type of uncertainty and fear is starting to come across our community. So we're in a place where we need to stand up and fight even more. So I think that's where we're at. And that's what we're seeing is seeing folks fearful, but also seeing folks step up and know that they want to fight for themselves, fight for their families, fight for their friends. And we're trying to create that space and bring folks in to do that along with us. Thank you. I'll pass it next to Charlene Sinclair. So I'm Charlene Sinclair. I am now the director for reinvestment with the Center for Community Change. I've been an organizer pretty much all of my adult life and came into organizing first as a leader in my community and then went on to actually do organizing professionally. But most of my work has been in the economic justice arena, particularly around welfare reform for years. And right around 2005, I ended up going to seminary because I was really interested in this intersection between spirituality and movement building. So sometimes you'll hear some of that in my language. So for folks that don't have that type of a framework, know that that's only my wellspring, and I'm not bringing that as a mechanism for proselytization. That's just where I find my personal strength. And currently, most of the work that I do for the Center for Community Change is still framed around economic justice and emphasis around dealing with questions of incarceration and criminalization. And looking at what the role of incarceration and criminalization is in the broader spectrum around oppression and oppression of black people. And also, what are the economic mechanisms that continue to allow such a system to thrive and to be able to be this weapon that is used in black communities in particular. And so do we go into the, what are we seeing question that you asked? Should I take a couple of minutes for that? Yeah, just like a little bit on from your perspective. Right. So just, you know, just a minute around that I think that the interesting, the most interesting thing that I'm seeing is the different ways in which people are reconciling this moment. And so for a great deal of my white colleagues, there is a tremendous amount of despair, a tremendous, tremendous amount of sadness, and a sense that somehow their country has let them down. So I've heard a bunch of folks begin to start talking about is this, this is not the America I know place, etc. for my black colleagues where, you know, the folks that I run with, you know, the, the sentiment is, if not this, then we would have been more surprised. And so there is a lot of rage, and there is a tremendous amount of fear, and that there's also a deep sort of resolute feeling around what will we now do to resist. So I think in, in a variety of different communities, the responses are based on your experience of what America has been for you. And so in, in immigrant communities that I am in also, you know, I was born in South America before coming to the US, you know, there is tremendous amount of fear around what will happen. And, you know, the other interesting thing that is the level to which young people and I'm not talking about millennials, I'm talking about eight year olds, nine year olds, seven year olds are so attuned to what is happening. And the ways in which many folks have had to console their children, because they fear for what this means for their own lives, which has been something I've never experienced before. And, and so the last thing I will say, which is sort of a challenge to me and I think a challenge to us as we think through this moment, it's interesting that you used, where do we go from here, you know, out of Martin Luther King's book, where do we go for here, community or chaos. What it makes me think about is, do we have the temperament to deal with chaos, because we want order so deeply that we automatically run to a place of order. And for many of the folks that, that myself and the folks that I work with order is actually the way in which structures of oppression continue to oppress us to make other people feel comfortable about the life in which they're living. So are we prepared to actually be in a more truthful space of this order, in order for us to generate, you know, a new and different reality. And I think that's going to be a big question for us. So I'll stop there. Thank you. I want to pass it now to Mohammed Khan. All right. Thank you, Jenny. And thanks to everyone for having me on here. My name is Mohammed Khan. I'm the campaign manager at Empower Change. I also organize locally here in New York, where I'm based in Queens. I organize with Citizen Action in New York and the New York State Working Families Party, which I'm on the state committee of. And I also do some civic engagement work in Muslim communities here locally in New York. Before that, my background is mostly in electoral and political organizing. I've worked in a few local campaigns here and done some civic engagement work. Before that, I also did some organizing in grad school around creating labor organizing for graduate workers. For those of you who don't know, Empower is a grassroots Muslim organizing platform. We're also relatively new or like about just about a year old now. And we work within Muslim communities across the U.S., both online and offline to kind of push a movement for justice for all people. And for us, you know, things have been super challenging this week. I think the environment for a lot of Muslim communities is very similar to the environment after September 11, except in a few ways it's actually, it seems worse, right? Because after 9-11, I think the main fear that people had was from the government. And now we have fear from the government, but also from these, you know, vigilantes and these races and other folks who have been kind of emboldened by the win of Trump and everything that he represents, especially, you know, the far-eyed elements that seem to be in control of his campaign.  I think folks are really fearful. But at the same time, like Charlene said, you know, I think there is, beneath that somewhat, you know, rising to the forefront over the past couple of days is the same sense of fines and the same sense of, you know, we're not going to, yeah, we're not going to allow ourselves to be pushed around. And we're going to find ways that we can organize and find ways that we can, you know, build coalitions and build a movement with other communities to resist what we see coming down the pipeline. Thank you. And Yong Zheng, I'm glad you made it back on. Do you want to go next? Yes, thank you. Hi everyone. My name is Yong Zheng Cho. I'm 26 years old. I am a woman. I'm a daughter of immigrants and I come from a family who lives paycheck to paycheck. And I'm one of the co-founders of All of Us 2016, which is a new multi-racial millennial movement to build in America that's going to be for all of us for the first time ever. And, you know, over the last two to three days, I've been really inspired and grateful for the hundreds of thousands of people who free each other, texting each other, calling each other, checking in and seeing how people are doing and just showing each other in the world and the country that we want to be a people that sticks up for each other and takes care of one another. And I think that the next four years are going to be much harder and where we will be fighting much harder for the things that our movements have been building on and where we will be fighting for the soul of our country. And I think it will be really painful and I think it will be hard. But I'm like really grateful for all the people who are on this call and I really want to have hope in our movements and our capacity to work together moving forward. Thanks, young gentleman. We'll pass it to Annie. Thank you so much. My name is Annie Leonard and I'm joining everybody from Berkeley, California today. I'm the executive director of Greenpeace. And before I had this role, I worked with a project called the story of stuff project that made a series of sort of popular education style films like the story of stuff. I hope some of you have seen it. Greenpeace is a global organization. We have offices in over 50 countries and we really do run as a global organization and we are independent. Just like 350, we don't take money from corporations and we don't take money from governments and that allows us a greater ability to do what's right rather than what donors want. We're supported almost entirely from individuals sending us $20 a month. It's really amazing. Greenpeace was founded by Quakers and was founded on the Quaker principle of bearing witness, which means that if you see an injustice, you have responsibility. Once you know you owe and we're really leaning on that now as we lean into these next four years. I'm seeing different things. One of the things I'm seeing as the other panelists have said is fear, just absolute intense fear and vulnerability. And it's really important that we recognize that that vulnerability just like climate impacts and pollution and so many other things is not equitably shared among people in this country and that some communities are more vulnerable today than others. And so those of us with privilege are taking this very seriously.  I have a teenage daughter and she came home from school and she said her classmates were in tears because they said, is my mother going to be deported? And that's not just a problem for immigrants. That is a problem for all of us. And so we need to figure out how we can really look out for all our brothers and sisters in this moment. On another side, on the sort of activist side, what I'm seeing which gives me a bit of hope. I hate to even use the word hope because it's like so tiny compared to the despair. But I am seeing an increased appetite for the long game and people realizing that saving a forest or banning a chemical or individual policy things are just not commensurate with the scale of the problem. People settling in, wanting to regroup, work much more cross movement and intersectionally and really think for the long haul. You know, this is going to take more than one congressional session or one presidential term to fix and what are we going to do? So I'm excited that I'm seeing so many of my environmental peers more ready to grapple with the hard questions than I've ever seen. Thanks, Annie. I'll pass it next to Charlene Craithers. Hi, everyone. My name is Charlene Craithers and I serve as the national director of the Black Youth Project 100, also BYP 100. And I'm really thankful for the opportunity to join y'all tonight and do some thinking and do some talking. For folks who don't know, BYP 100 is a national organization of young black activists who are committed to freedom and justice for all black people.  And essentially what that means is that we wholeheartedly believe that none of us are going to be free unless all of us are free and that we live in a legacy of dope black feminists, black women, black queer trans folks who've been in resistance and struggle for centuries at this point. And so for many of us in this moment, and I can't speak for all people in my organization, I can hardly fully articulate how I feel on a date since, you know, in the aftermath of Tuesday. But last night, I had the opportunity to be in space with our Chicago chapter members and we have chapters all over the country. I live in Chicago, so I was able to join our Chicago chapter meeting and listen to what folks had to say about how they were feeling. And it was a mixture of things from despair to not feeling anything to feeling ready to fight. And so all of those things at the same time. And I think one of the most important things that folks lifted up was that, you know, we're not starting from scratch. I'm thankful that we've been doing work. We've been organizing and that for us, this is not a get started moment. It's a rethinking moment, doing things differently moment. What are some creative opportunities to work with people who we haven't worked with before? What are the basic assumptions about the country in which we live in that we didn't get, that we didn't catch? And so I work with young black folks every day.  At least according to the most readily available data, to my understanding, we went down one point from 2012 amongst black voters. And so this wasn't on us. And so I'm thinking very deeply about how to engage in conversation with white progressives, white liberals, white leftists in general about accountability for what happened and what continues to happen in this country. And the people who are left out of the conversation and the people who are not engaged while folks work at, you know, organizations in black and brown and indigenous communities but don't work in their own communities in mid-western towns, rural places across the country. And so that's something that I'm grappling with and I think is extremely important. While it is important for folks to be in camaraderie and solidary, which is a very difficult word for me to even say, it is important for white people to do that with black, brown and indigenous people. And I think in this moment it's even much more important for white folks to organize white people, and particularly white folks who are operating from an anti-racist framework, anti-capitalist framework, and also very explicitly anti-sexism and patriarchy and all the patriarchy's cousins, homophobia, transphobia, all of those things. So those are the things that are weighing on me. And lastly I'll say it's how we're going to keep our people safe because we are already asking the question of how we keep our people safe from state violence and state sanctioned violence from police and vigilantes and other systems. But now we have these newly empowered vigilante militias, the KKK, newly empowered. They're not new in existence, but they're newly empowered due to the regime that is about to hold power. So those are the things I'm holding right now. Thank you. And last, we've got Bill. Hey everyone, I'm quite conscious at the moment of the fact that if you added up the age of everybody else on the call, it would about equal mine. And it's, so I don't have that much to say you guys have a better sense of what to do and where we're going, but here are my thoughts. Obviously, this election came at a bad time for dealing with climate change, which is what I spend most of my time on, because there was a little momentum finally behind the shift away from fossil fuel and all the work that people have been doing on a lot of things was beginning to go somewhere. And now it's hit a ditch, maybe deeper than a ditch, a kind of pervass. That's bad. And it's entirely possible that we won't recover from it in time. I would guess that the damage from this election will be measured in eventually a degree of rise in the temperature of the planet and a few meter or a few feet of sea level or rise and things like that. But all that said, I'm not sure that that's the first place to turn in the wake of Tuesday's events. It seems to me that it is a moment for people figuring out, as others have said, how to make sure that the most immediately vulnerable people in this country are made as safe as is possible, which will not be easy. For all of our brave talk, the Trump folks are going to have a great deal of momentum and a great deal of power, and they are going to win some victories early on in this new administration and do some difficult and heinous things. So we better be thinking as best we can about how to protect the people who will be the first targets of that. Tuesday, around the country, I think now there are 207 demonstrations planned at Army Corps of Engineer facilities. We've been asked by the elders of the Standing Rock Sioux tribe to try and nationalize their fight over the Dakota pipeline. This is one good place to begin to show some resistance, not just to Donald Trump, but let's face it, this particular one's on the Obama administration. They were ready to go stick this pipe in the ground. And as day one comes, as Roberto said at the very beginning, everybody's heard this bromide a number of times over the years that dates back to the holocaust about how first they came for the Jews, but I was into June, so I didn't react, and then they came on and on and on. It's entirely clear who they're coming for first. I mean, they've, as much as said it, they're coming for undocumented immigrants on day one, and so one of the jobs of people in every movement across the country is to make sure that on day one, we're figuring out how to protect as best as possible undocumented immigrants from the incredible cruelty that's headed their way. So that's how it appears to me at the moment. It's really a time for everybody to be focused on the things that are most dangerous to autocrats. Autocrats like fear and panic, and they weakened by kindness and by rationality and reason. And so I think that those become our great weapons as we take on what in some ways really is a new phenomenon in the country. Since I've been around a long time, I can tell you that we've had many bad presidents before, but Donald Trump is a new phenomenon. We haven't ever before had someone clearly be a strong man and disrupt disrupt the entire order of the country. And so it will be a remarkable challenge best met by the thing that is the opposite of what he thrives on, and that is human connection and human kindness. Thanks, Bill. Thanks, Bill. So we haven't. I think we've lost our facilitator. Yep, Jenny, we seem to have lost you. Are we just marked onwards? Yeah, sure. So the next question that we've got here is for our panelists is in this moment, what's being asked of your leadership, how do you see your work changing under a Trump presidency? And I'll kick it to whoever would like to start. I'll start just to keep things rolling. This is Annie. In some ways, it's not so much that we have to do things different, it's that we have to do more of the things that we knew we had to do. And one of those is really ensure that justice permeates all of our work. And that means the solutions that we advocate for on climate and other things, but especially climate, have got to have justice at the absolute core of them. It also means not just the outcome has to have justice, but the process has to have justice that when we are working with our, our neighbors and friends and allies and others to figure out what we're going to do about climate. We've got to make sure that all the impacted voices are at the table, and especially those most directly impacted. So that that's one piece. Another piece though that I feel especially as Greenpeace is it one of Greenpeace's hallmarks is that we do nonviolent direct action. And I have to say we're really good at it because we've been doing it for 45 years. And it's a skill that more and more people are going to need. We're going to need it on the individual level so that we can intervene and deescalate when we see harassment or justice. And we're going to need it at the societal level because we're going to need to be blocking ice vans and blocking ships of coal and we're going to need a lot of frontline nonviolent resistance. We do a lot of trainings for nonviolent resistance. Charlene came to our action camp last spring. We have a week long action camp every spring in Florida. The announcements coming up soon. I encourage people to sign up for it, but it's just increasingly clear that a week long action plan camp is not enough to disseminate these really crucial skills for nonviolent direct action. So that's one of the things that I'm thinking a lot about is how can we ramp up our offerings to equip as many movement allies as possible with nonviolent direct action understanding and skills because we're going to need it. And we're going to need to know how to respond to violence too because we know it's coming from the state, from vigilantes, we need to be prepared. So that's what I'm thinking a lot about how do we share these skills broadly. I'm sorry I dropped y'all it sounded like the question about folks leadership, how what is being asked of folks leadership and what that means for their work got asked about right. Okay, thanks y'all. Yeah, I'm curious to hear particularly like if there are new ways that you feel like you're being called into leadership. I see Roberto went off mute. And then maybe there's a trick that we use 350 where there's a side chat that is invisible to people who are watching because we're fancy like that. And you can drop a little note in the side chat to say if you want to go next. Go ahead. I can I can go next. I think I think the one thing that I just want to touch on was in terms of the, how do we change under Trump presidency. I think with Kosecha it's more of our work getting accelerated. So Kosecha is working towards really lifting up the power of immigrant workers are really lifting up the consumer and production power of folks are out there working in the fields working the factories cleaning homes. I just, we know that undocumented work is what really holds up this country. So that work needs to be accelerated we we feel like we need to we've been planning to do a boycott to do a mass mass strike. So those are things that need to be pushed in and done more quickly. So we had a long term plan, but that's what our leadership is doing now we're trying to call folks to action, bring folks in to be able to join us for those efforts. So the first thing that we want to do is call to our community and to allies or community to boycott those who are really supporting Donald Trump and show our economic power. So we know for example that the Home Depot CEO donated to his campaign that Johnson and Johnson air to the to the company has donated to the Trump campaign. So start off by doing that boycotting those companies to support them. Also we know that we need to protect ourselves. We knew that from the get go underneath the Obama administration 3 million deportations have happened. Democratic Party hasn't protected us Republican Party has been one who's turned into Trump turned into folks who are calling for building the wall calling for deportation of all the folks here rounding people up. Having a deportation force, which is what he said. So we need to protect ourselves need to create sanctuaries for our community safe spaces for folks to go to. So just recently, I think there's a call yesterday that we had folks college students from around the country join. I mean now we have 20, 20 campuses that are working to make sure that those those campuses become sanctuary campuses that they're places where our community, our friends, our family can go to be protected from deportation and from those who are looking to harm and split our community apart. So our work has accelerated our work is is one that that just needs to step up and and call on new leaders to join. So this is Charlie. And I'd like to answer in two ways what in terms of what the leadership is calling on themselves to do it to follow up on what my other sisters my the other Charlene has stated in terms of what we need to call on our white brothers. And sisters to do. I think all too often. So many of our movements are based on a level of collaboration that's not built on radical truth around what communities are really up against. And so in order to to hold and keep the coalition, we tend to water down that radical truth telling to make sure that folks are comfortable enough to stay in. And what we've seen in this election is that you know our propensity to make folks comfortable is actually leading to a structure in society that can that will lead to the death of people, whether that is through village vigilante or violence or through the structural violence of the kinds of policies that will move forward. And so a huge part of what must happen is that we've got to own, you know, our white brothers and sisters have got to own the fact that many of our movements do not deal with questions of deep capitalism, deep racism, deep heteropatriarchy, and we've got to really begin to start questioning how have we structured our movements that support those various systems. I come out of Saul Olinsky organizing when I first started and one of the tenants of that that organizing movement was that you stayed away from those issues that you thought would break up the coalition. So many of us have been trained to actually go to the lowest common denominator rather than to rise up to the real things that are impacting society. And if we cannot is in my in my opinion, the fact that we have created organizing such that we actually go for oftentimes the low hanging fruit, and those low hanging fruit actually mean the death of people. Then how do we save the planet. If we have actually structured society to say that the killing of human beings is actually okay, then how do we then also create a movement that says every living creature every little every living being every every living organism is important to the survival of the whole. And so the first step towards being able to kill folks. You know, Orlando Patterson talked in his book, slavery and social death, the first step towards that is to create such a deep alienation for each other, much less of the planet. And so, one of the ways in which we must move is to actually begin to create an obligation to the full and complete humanity and living of of everything. And so I see within our movements, a level of truth telling that is zeroed in, where folks are not prepared to let, let their comp let well, let me say this. Folks are not prepared to call people comrades that are that will not take that step to do that kind of radical work with themselves and in their communities. The other piece from that was Charlene from Charlene sake. Now let me talk about Charlene at CCC. And one of the things that we are talking about with at the Center for Community Change is that, you know, just about every social safety net program will be under assault in this country.  And the challenge for us will be to begin to determine as a broader community of justice seekers, what is our best and highest purpose within this movement and how do we operate in such a coordinated way at our best and highest level for the next few years, so that we can move with a laser focused towards upending some of this. And so, and that's something that we actually don't have a whole lot of experience doing, you know, figuring out what that is and in that lane and gets that job done, and how do we coordinate across our movements effectively to get the job done. And I think that we're going to have to really strive to figure that out in ways that we had not been called upon before. The, as I said, protecting immigrants, etc. But the other piece around it, and I think Roberto pointed in that direction, people are talking about the fact that we need to stop looking at the short term wins, but really begin to think about long term ideological shift in this country. You know, a long term move where the short term wins are constantly pointing us in that direction. And they're not wins for the win sake like a friend of mine says sometimes we have to lose forward and make choices to do the things that point us towards a different ideological foundation in this country. And, and then finally, figuring out how we can build a multi racial multi ethnic political strength that is targeted and clear for a different power structure over a period of time. And so those are some of the things that we've been talking about within CCC as things we have to take seriously as we think about what's what's the direction of our work over these next few years. Awesome. Thank you so much, Charlene. It's always great to be in conversation with you. What's being asked of us right now in this moment. I feel, well, I have mixed feelings because usually folks blame black people when Democrats don't have the outcome that they want. Right. And I think for the first time, possibly, there's a much more accurate narrative being told about the outcome of the presidential election when you look at a state like North Carolina, where, you know, at least the numbers say that, you know, we ousted a Republican governor and candidate or secretary Clinton did not win in the same state. Right. Even though a Democrat won on the gubernatorial ticket. So the hard questions to ask right and then we also know about voter suppression, fewer places to vote fewer opportunities to vote in the state of North Carolina. And so usually around this time we're being asked to turn out black people more being asked to do our jobs, more all of those things. Well, I think what we're being asked of from our people and demanded of from our people in our in our country was necessary is for us to not move to the center for us to not become less radical in our stance for us to not become more moderate, more centrist because there's an extremely extreme right regime, extreme conservative regime that is moving into into more power. For us to also to continue to imagine what's possible for our folks and do do work to actually do things, not just dream, but to do things, and to why we defend the things that we need to defend from abortion access to the Affordable Care Act, DACA, things like that. We also need to create the type of society that we want to live in. And like, as an abolitionist who believes you know that we can live in a world without police and prisons and other systems of punitive or other systems of punishment. This is an opportunity for us to continue for folks who've been doing that work because it's not new. And for those of us who haven't done that to start building those alternative systems for how we deal with conflict and harm, and to envision what economic justice looks like, you know, on a on a local level in which we're in right relationship with the planet. This is something I'm learning more and more from the movement generation. And from the blackout collective about how do we actually create regenerative economies and in the extractive economy that we live in. And so I think there is a lot of organizations that are out there. I know there are a lot of organizations out there that are doing amazing work, and they've been digging into these questions and have a holistic understanding and I can't talk enough about movement generation, and the work that they do and the work they're doing in collaboration with the blackout collective. And it's extremely important for me to think about how do we create, you know, the type of economy, the type of organized society around where people are saying that the planet is actually treated in a regenerative way. And we have a very good relationship with land on many levels on this particular, on this land in this country, that we can be engaged in that type of work where people can actually eat and our people can have access to healthcare. Those are the things that I'm thinking about when we're facing the potential loss of access to healthcare to, what, 20 million people in the U.S. possibly, possibly facing higher restrictions, deeper restrictions, or no access to abortion and healthcare and other reproductive healthcare services. So I think that's, this type of presidency, because I still have a hard time saying this man's name if I'm going to be honest with y'all, it requires us to ask different questions to challenge the assumptions we have, right? And to dig deeper into our work and start and continue to build and do more around alternative systems to what we have now. Thank you, Charlene and Charlene. And I'm wondering if we can take one more answer to this question, and then I want us to dig into a little bit of what it looks like for these many movements to work together. Looks like Young Jung might be next. Yes. I just wanted to just like lift up a lot of what Charlene, I just, you know, right now there's a blame game of people trying to blame who is responsible. And I think that the Democratic Party needs to take responsibility, losing millennials and most of America to defend for, and then working to acquire us to vote for the Democratic Party. And I think we need new leadership. The Democratic Party, the Democratic Party, we're going to wait and see, wait and see approach for Donald Trump and with him in the future. And we just say no. That is absolutely unacceptable. They're an entire year and a half long campaign. Donald Trump has promised, has run on racism and hate. And we see what he is promising for this country. And so it's clear that the Democratic establishment's politicians lives are not on the line. And I hope that our movements and the American people can see through that and hold Democratic leadership. Jenny, can I add something there to follow in Young Jung? I think she's really right. I think that I've tended to over the years sort of ignore the Democratic Party as an institution, because I don't much care for electoral politics. And I don't think it's where most things really happen. I think that the work we do as in movement politics to kind of change the zeitgeist is probably more important in the long run. There were two things about this past year that were really important, I think. One was that Bernie Sanders demonstrated that there was a remarkable constituency across many different parts and demographics and everything else in this country for quite dramatic change. And the second was that the Democratic Party showed itself to be a pretty incapable of responding to any of that desire for real change. And it's sort of captured by establishment, by Wall Street, by whatever else. It was profound and I think contributed dramatically to the outcome this week. And so I think we probably behooves us to, if we're, if I think it's an open question whether the Democratic Party is going to emerge as a useful vehicle in the future. But if it is, it's only going to happen. That's only going to happen if it changes and changes in pretty dramatic ways. I was really happy to see that Keith Ellison is stepping up to run for the person who, whatever they call him, the chair of whatever it is of the Democratic National Committee. I happen to think he's a really fine human being and a great ally. So I'm going to break my usual rule of staying somewhat away from party politics and things and do what I can to see if we can't get Keith in that role. It strikes me that'll be a good test of whether it's actually possible to make the Democratic Party into a useful vehicle or not. And if not, then we're going to have to figure out some other stuff and who knows quite what it's going to look like and whatever. But this is the sort of occasion the election of Trump is such a major rupture with kind of the way that things have gone in the past that it, that it raises those kind of questions. And I think we best answer them sooner rather than later, so that we don't find ourselves for years from now, just stuck with the same old things that we've had before. And so I want us to shift from here to talk a little bit about zooming out from our own leadership and our own work, sort of what the broader movement of movements work looks like in the next four years. Because it sounds like from hearing a lot from y'all around ways that old narratives are changing the need for your work is being intensified. Or like assumptions about the way that the electoral system are changing that we're on somewhat new terrain, at least in some ways. And I'd love to hear from the script about whether there is a change in the way that the many different movements in sort of like the broader left should be working together.  Yeah, sure, absolutely. I mean, I think it's one thing from kind of a tactical perspective is, you know, I think we can expect a lot more. I think we can basically expect that, you know, as a movement, we're going to have to operate the same way movements or like opposition parties do and other authoritarian regimes, right? And especially if you look at like the massive surveillance state and militarized police that President Obama has built up over his two terms in office is now, you know, I think a lot of people were ambivalent about it. Because there was this kind of this, you know, sense that Obama was sort of a benign operator of this massive machine. Obviously for Muslim communities, we had a very different perspective because we're often at the receiving end of some of those, you know, implements of war, both here and abroad. But now that that's being handed over to someone like Donald Trump, I think that's, there's, you know, I think that's kind of a wake up call for everyone to kind of reexamine how, you know, number one, how do we get here and number two, how do we, how do we prevent these sorts of apparatuses being used against us and, and, you know, also how do we, you know, keep that in mind in terms of our tactics and how we organize and how we pursue our work going forward. So it's like the major, you know, kind of tactical change that I see. And I think, you know, some of the my fellow panelists have already gone over some of the like broader themes here, you know, I think the work definitely becomes a lot more urgent. I think there has to be a complete end to like, you know, the sort of respectability politics is sort of, you know, good old boy network like we're actually all on the same team and like we want to work with our friends against the aisle.  Right. It's a difference of agreement over whether certain groups of people should exist in this country or not, or, you know, whether, yeah, whether certain groups of people should exist. Right. And when there's those sorts of differences of opinion, you know, it becomes a lot more dire and it's not. I think we have to kind of abandon that idea that, you know, I think like Young said that we, you know, we can all kind of work together and have a sort of like, you know, approach to things. Yeah, I think that's kind of the, those are the main, main changes I see, and how we're going to have to change the way that we operate as movements. Well, I'll say that I think one thing that's going to happen in a structural sense is we're going to have to keep working on a national level. But we're also going to probably find ourselves doing more work than we've been doing for the last eight years on state and local levels, politically, and have to get good at forming alliances and coalitions in state capitals and things, and in city, in municipalities, as well as at a national level. Having lived through and organized through the Bush years, I can tell you that there is, and I think the Trump years will be worse than the Bush years, but there is an enormous difficulty sometimes in getting anything done at all. And it was hard enough to get anything done in DC the last eight years. And so that'll be one place for, and I think we're probably better equipped than we've been in the past to do some of that organizing that's connected, that's on a local level, but also connected together enough so that when there are big national occasions that allow us that we need to come together for something, we can do it. We're seeing it a lot in the environmental movement, even in the last year, where people are working on different pipelines, coal ports, oil trains, whatever it is in the area. And then when the Dakota Department became an issue, and clearly required kind of national presence, everybody was able to come together around that. So I think that that dance may be really important going forward. So really quickly, I think what is required of us and how our work needs to change, actually, we need to go outside of this two-party system binary. I don't know what the answer is. If it's the Green Party, the Green Party to me has been insufficient. And it's field organizing and what it just looks like on the ground. So perhaps there are opportunities there. I know the Working Families Party exists in some places, but it's not like the full scale nationally. But I'm not in this. I'm not going to fight for the next four years to strengthen the Democratic Party. Not going to do it. I'm not going to fight for the next four years simply to destroy the Republican Party. Not going to do it. And so I'm really interested. How are we using this as an opportunity to rethink what partisan politics look like in this country? It is very clear that capitalism is deeply jeopardized if not experiencing deep fissures and failures. It is clear that the major parties, even with the bringing in this new regime, they have a number of fissures, a number of problems. Why do we not see this as an opportunity to transform partisan politics in this country and to build more independent political power? I think that's what is called of us. And, you know, organizationally, we've never moved in order to support candidates. We've never prioritized candidates. We prioritize issues. You know, I was trained back in the day by Alinsky Organizes too and kept some things with me and left some things behind as well. And I understand that, you know, when it comes to allies and or friends and enemies, you know, the Democratic Party, the Republican Party, I think they've shown themselves more than once. And it's like, when are we going to start listening as a broader movement? When are people going to start listening? Because some people have already heard that message and people have felt that message in their actions. We got to do something different. Yes. If I could offer three things from my end. I think the first is protection of our neighbors and brothers and sisters. I think I'm tonight that as soon as Donald Trump assumes office, he, yeah, a lot of our neighbors and friends are so we need to protect each other. I think second movements need to keep what movements do and push and protest and participate. And then the third thing about what Charlene said, we need a real political revolution. We actually just system. And they do think that we need to move party system. And what I was at around the Democratic Party, if the Democratic establishment is not going to follow the people in our movements, then they need to get out of the way so that we can take charge of the Democratic Party shape we wanted to represent. I'm wondering if there, I'll go ahead. Yeah, I'll jump in. And so definitely echo the need for a vanguard power, political power, and grounded in local and state fights. And, and I think we need to take, really take seriously the model that millennia movements have been giving us over these last few years around, how do you have a leader for movement together for collective power. And I think that's a piece that that we, in terms of like the broader movement have not been able to figure out how to do, because many of us have organizations that are very clunky, and have real structures and, you know, all kinds of things in place that actually bog us down around the ability to do that. I agree with Bill that we've got to move to local and state fights and I will also say that we need to be able to do a lot of that at the same time. And, you know, which is also something that we're not used to doing is having multiple things occurring that is pointing in the same direction in conversation with each other. But we need to have the temperament to to be okay with the fact that different strategies will emerge from different ways of being of different organizations. And the other thing too is that, you know, Bill thinks he's the one of the mature ones there bill. I think I'm right behind you nipping at your, your, your ankles. And so I remember the days of acorn. And we have to understand that in this climate that the possibility of organizational attacks are real. And so the question is not whether or not they will happen. The question is, how do we make sure that we are tight institutionally tight, but still brave. And that's going to be the hard part because oftentimes what that means is that we shrink in order to protect. And this is, this is a case where we have to lean in and take risks and be courageous and and understand the attacks will come so what must we do to prepare ourselves, but that preparation cannot be shrinking back and being safe. I just want to say, I think that's absolutely right. People are going to be under the gun in a serious way. And we got to be prepared to come to everybody's defense. You know, I mean, everybody's already under attack in the Obama years, it's going to be intense. And everyone from the IRS to Justice Department everybody else going to be doing their thing. And we've, we see this happening all over the world. It's, you know, the space for democratic dissent and opposition is getting smaller and smaller and smaller. And along with all our other tasks, all the things that are kind of our day job. It's all of our jobs to help keep that space for democratic participation open, because there's nothing that the Trump folks would like to do more than close it down. So I want to leave just a moment for any other, any other additions on this cross movement work. And then I want to ask a little digging question. Actually, I will chime in. I was thinking about when, how we look out for each other our neighbors and also our organizational and movement neighbors. Remember when so many people were being evicted from their homes in after 2008. And sometimes when the evictors would come all the neighbors came and surrounded that home and said you're not getting to the front door. What's the movement equivalent of that now, that when one of our groups come under attack, Bill's group and my group are both being challenged by Lamar Smith right now and we've been subpoenaed to hand over to Congress all of our communication since 2012 and we've said no and so now they're going to threatening to find us in contempt and we have a huge corporation suing us who the CEO said he wants his legacy to be to destroy Greenpeace and we are just getting sued and attacked right and left. And it, as Bill said, more and more people are going to see it. So how do we protect each other's organizations and what is the current movement equivalent of surrounding our neighbors tunnel and saying, sorry, Victor, you can't get to the front door. I'm curious if there are any like direct reactions or responses to that question. I guess the thing that immediately comes to mind for me back in the days of welfare reform. The idea that the welfare rights movement had was that you actually flooded the welfare offices so that the very nature of the fact that there was so many people doing so much completely crack that system. And I think that, you know, part of coming to each other's aid is the fact that we have to, you know, and I think I said this before like, there's got to be so much movement and activity and coordinated and clear. And it's got to be coming from multiple fronts. And we've got to, as you said, and any like, be prepared to actually step in and support each other and not just figure out how we become the best organization on the block, but like our how do we all move so that we can actually make change happen and how do we coordinate that in an effective way and how do we begin to figure out how we share some of our best principles, our best strategies, our best ability across these different movements so that we can sustain ourselves. And quite honestly, so many of us don't even understand how to do some of the work I'm thinking about when you first started, and you talked about your small donor work. Like how, how do we share that, you know, just the, there are many of us that have different strategies that over time, we've been able to perfect how do we share that across our movement. I mean, so I think, you know, circling the neighbor is about all of that. And in, I think in this moment we're being challenged to see if we can actually step into or lean into that different way of being. Thanks, Charlene. So I want to, I thought this was going to be a tougher segue than it is to this question, which is there's been a lot of conversation on this call about both like aiding our neighbors and protecting our neighbors and also accountability around our own communities and I think particularly for white folks that's allowed, allowed and clear call that I'm hearing and a lot of white folks are Trump voters. And I was reminded by a colleague of mine when talking about Trump voters to acknowledge that like, there's some overlap between Trump voters and people in movements. And, and that is real. And so I'm curious to hear from y'all, what do you see as our larger movement of movements job with regard to Trump voters for people who saw something in him that we didn't with the acknowledgement that like that's going to look different depending on your group, your community. I'm curious if folks have things to say about that. I think I can talk a little bit, but I think for myself, I grew up in a rural community. So Trump voters are my neighbors. I think it's understanding is trying to understand a little bit of their perspective in terms of what are the underlying issues which are issues that are affecting us in terms of just not having opportunity not seeing their future really also being scared and easy manipulated. So I think for us to understand that and be able to see that. And not just and not just to not just put them off as someone who will never never join you someone who will never really understand the movement. I think I think you mentioned that there's folks who may really care about one aspect of the movements that we're talking about, but are not knowledgeable at all about another one. So I think it's our role to try to try to understand, bring in those folks, but also with white folks. I really do think it is the responsibility of white folks to go out there and talk to your own community, to your own friends, family who are out there to really understand and explain and open up their perspectives because they're coming in with insumptions are coming with views that are laid out and and and something that that we can't easily break down. So there's a lot of work that needs to go in there. And at the end of the day, we're going to have to find out who's our ally, and who's really going to step up and go along with us. And and we're going to have to put up a fight. I mean, there are going to be folks who are against us and we have to acknowledge that also and be ready to step up and into the scary situations. And I can see already the hatred and racism and all those things that are coming out into our communities, the fear that's happening. And it's something that we have to grapple with and and and it's a reality that we have in front of us. I can chime in. I'm calling from Berkeley, so I'm the total opposite. I've never even seen a Trump supporter, except I actually saw one in an airport a couple months ago. I wanted to stop and talk to him because, you know, Berkeley is such a bubble. I actually asked at my polling station what the makeup was of my neighborhood and they said here in North Berkeley, greens outnumber Republicans four to one. That must be a very rare place. And but I think it's because I live in such a bubble that there is an extra onus on me to get out to other parts of the country and listen and I think a couple of things I've been thinking a lot about the Trump voters. One is that we need to remember they're not homogenous. There's a lot of different kinds of people that voted for Trump so let's not paint them with a broad brush. I think we need to really listen to them. A lot of them have are really, really economically struggling, not not all of them, but some of them are really economically struggling. Some have been left behind by the globalized economy and are hurt and we have a situation where one party ignored them and not only just ignored them but actually over the many many years between Clinton and Obama created policies that increased their economic struggles. And then you have another party that comes and lies to them. So one party is ignoring them.  And that's just not that's not true. People are confusing correlation with causation that the demographics of the country are changing and they're economically struggling. Those are both happening at the same time because of other things they're not causing each other. So I think we need to really listen, validate their concerns that the globalized economy has left them behind. I saw a chart the other day of the number of jobs available in this country. If you don't have a college degree and the chart went like this for a long time and then boom, just plummeted. So let's hear them and validate them and say that we see this suffering and let's include them as we figure out how can we make this transition to a clean energy economy be a just transition. So that we don't the global economy doesn't leave so many people behind. At the same time, we got to just hold the line on the racism and the sexism and the misogyny and Islamophobia and have zero tolerance for that.  We have to decouple those things. So when I think about what it is that my job as someone who works with young black people when it comes to to Trump voters is on one hand, it's about how do we form deeper partnerships or new partnerships with vulnerable communities who are likely to be physically mentally, digitally attacked by people who are aligned with Donald Trump and his beliefs and his ideologies, whether they voted for him or not. Many of those folks are newly empowered. And so, and I think there's a lot to say that they're not a monolith, definitely. That part of his support does exist. It exists and there may even be more folks. I'm under no assumption that, you know, racism or domestic terrorism and vigilant vigilantism lives in the South alone. It is alive. I live in Illinois. It is alive and well in the state of Illinois and Missouri off Indiana. I mean, I'm right next Indiana. We're going to talk about the Ku Klux Klan. So that is a strong element when I when I think about the safety of our people that is huge. And then also, you know, thinking about the folks who actually share many of the same concerns as as the folks in my community do about politicians about the government. What do we do? That's not my work, though. I'm going to be real clear about that is not my work in my in my organizing that I do currently to go organize white people, or to organize Trump supporters who are white, or Trump supporters who are the very small percentage of voters who were not white who voted for Donald Trump. That's not my work.  You say you want to be aligned with the most vulnerable and the most marginalized. Go move your people on our issues, because we know that if we live in a country at minimum where everyone has a living wage, just on a base level that that's all that's something we fight for in our organization. We fight for full we put access to reproductive health care. Yes, we talk about it for black folks that would impact everyone when we talk about non discrimination or in the I'm sorry that in a non discrimination at the federal federal policy, when we talk about divesting from prisons and investing in our communities. Yes, we are talking about black folk, and that would impact everyone else as well. So I'm really clear about the work that the work that we have to do. I don't have a prescription for the work that the deep level work that white liberals radicals and progressives have to do. I don't think I have to have the answer for that. And I also think we need to be honest. And this is this is not my brilliant idea but talking with folks about this that when we don't have the answers. Like, it's okay to say I don't know. It's okay. It's okay to say that, because it's in saying that we don't have all of the answers that we can actually spend the time to figure it out with each other and recognize that we don't. We don't all have it. Yeah, because if we did, if we had all the magic peel, things and things would be different. So I want to see if there are any last comments on this question and then I'm going to move us to to close. I just want to note that I think it's interesting, and maybe obvious. You know, the Trump supporters are not a monolith this group and our movements are not a monolith and that we have different roles to play in calling in Trump supporters you have really similar concerns to a lot of social movements for economic justice especially. So I want us to move towards a close and I think we can go in the same order that we started with. And I'll preface this with a lot of folks are reeling from from this news and so I'm not imagining that anyone has like a complete and full plan for where we go next. So I want to give folks an opportunity to make any calls to action that you may be organizing around right now, or give any like concrete next steps that you think folks listening to this may be able to take. So, I just want to do a last go around and give folks the opportunity to share any concrete next steps that that people can take. Pass it to you. It's been a really powerful conversation and I'm glad to have been able to be a part of it. As I mentioned before with Kosecha, our work has gotten accelerated. So we do have some concrete next steps we do have some things that are coming up, because we've needed to react so quickly because we basically have a countdown until until the Trump presidency begins. So the big thing that's happening right now and that folks are really working on is creating sanctuary, creating safe spaces for undocumented folks to go to, whether it be a church whether it be a community organization whether that be wherever it is creating those spaces where we could have a sanctuary and safe spaces for undocumented folks to be protected. And the big one that's happening right now is those college campuses. So we have 20 college campuses that have already signed on next Wednesday. They're starting off with a walk out to start calling on their administrations to create safe spaces on those campuses. You can easily follow that by going to hashtag sanctuary campuses or hashtag sanctuary campus and find out more information about that. But we also have the boycott to really lift up the economic power and lift up the labor power that we have within the immigrants community. So there's a pledge already for folks to join the boycott and move towards a general strike. And that's you can find that at lajuelga.com. Lajuelga you spell it L-A-H-U-E-L-G-A.com. And that's where you can find more information about the boycott and we're asking folks to really join us on that. And again, our work is accelerated. If folks are willing to step up and support us even more, you can sign up at that website also to support us in that work. And any support, any help that you can give will be really appreciated. We can count on y'all and count on us to support and all the other movements that are going around that we know are so urgent in these days from the Trump administration coming into power. And a pass it to Charlene Sinclair. So at the Center for Community Change, we work directly with local organizations that are on the ground and move across a variety of areas. And so, you know, underscoring the move for various sanctuary communities, looking at what local organizations are doing. I think that the one thing I would encourage is that we do on the ground what you just did with this call. I think it's going to be absolutely important that we get into relationship with each other and look at the work that is happening and figure out how do we either sequence or come together for greater power around it. And how do we make sure that we are, you know, duplicating actions in a way that actually dilute the potential power sequencing or coming together around that. In December, we're bringing together leaders across movements into D.C. And right now, doing a lot of work to figure out what the political landscape is. One of the things that we are thinking about is what is the strategy for protection, not just people protection, but which of the safety and policies are we going to focus in on. Not only because it would be something good to do, but because it will lead us in that direction of figuring out how to build the kind of political power on the ground that will be needed for us to point towards the larger level of power we're trying to build. So that is going to happen in December. And in the meantime, what we're also doing is really loving up on each other. And I think that that is an important thing to do in this moment is, you know, to continue to affirm each other, to continue to support each other, to continue to say, you know, like we're in this together, there can't be enough of that in this moment. And so that's what I would leave us with. Like, let's love up on each other. Thanks, Charlene. I'm going to pass it to Mohammed. Cool. So yeah, thanks everyone for being on the panel with me. I was honored to be on the panel with you all. And what I would say is, you know, one concrete ask I would say is like don't fall into complacency and don't allow yourself to, you know, get jaded or tuned out. I think especially for like the more privileged folks among us, you know, maybe things are going to continue to be the same for you over the next couple months. And maybe they'll even continue to be pretty similar for you after January. But for some communities, like the communities I come from, like black and brown communities and Muslim communities and undocumented communities, things have already started to turn significantly for the worse. They're going to start to get worse, you know, at an accelerated pace beginning in January and beyond. So, you know, if you're more privileged and you don't see these things affecting you immediately, just keep in mind other folks who are starting to see the immediate impacts of the Trump presidency and, you know, wherever you can help out folks do that. And then also very shamelessly say like as an organization, we're looking for more more resources, financial resources if you have them and also, you know, capacity in terms of if anyone wants to volunteer if anyone has like resources they can connect us to for communications for organizing for digital work. Yeah, where we welcome all those all those resources. Thanks, Mohamed. And thank you everyone so much. Just being there for one another and I'm excited to be part of this fight with everyone here. And with all of us will be let congressional or that was Donald Trump's racist and greedy policy at every step of the way if we want to protect and defend our community, they need to get out of our way. So I hope this, I hope that you all join us in calling for that fight. Thanks Young Jung to Annie and then Charlene and Bill. I'll tell you that for me the thing that most gets me through hard times the two things are community and resistance. And the good thing is we can get both those at the same time in this moment. And what I most recommend people do is get involved, join a march, you know, change yourself to some corporations front door. That's one of my personal favorites, but get involved and take action. Because there is nothing that feels better than actually being involved. I think Bill will probably give more details about the Standing Rock Day of Action on this coming week. I'll be there. I hope all of you will be there tapping all over the world. It's an excellent chance to both get a little dose of community and a little dose of resistance, which we're going to need a lot more of both of those. So thank you again for the opportunity to join this conversation and talk with folks. Two things.  It's gotten it's hit people. Is that for white people, I want to see y'all on the front line. Like, and I'm not talking about the front lines and places after just after a black person has been killed, or been brutalized. I want to see you on the front lines in your communities and will in places across rural America. As these vigilantes hit the streets, I want to see you on the street. I don't want one of my comrades has been saying we don't want you to just be care is we want you to just be there to support us. We want you to actually show up and put some things on the line just as we've been putting on the line for the past several years. And we believe in nonviolent direct action as a tactic. And we believe in in more than just solidarity without people putting things having things at stake as well because we all have something at stake in this particular moment. So that's what I want to see happen. I want to see white folks on the front line. The second thing that I encourage everyone to do it, particularly for any black folks who are listening right now, is to take the time to listen to each other, to build with each other and really ground ourselves in the history and what our ancestors bring to resistance, right? Black resistance is not new. It's not going anywhere. And we are in a lineage of people who have faced even tougher opponents than the regime that is about to come in right now. And I'm not of the mind that, you know, we survived things before, so we'll be fine. All of our people did not survive. And so in this moment, we have to be able to truly embody what Asada Shakur says about loving and protecting one another. And that's on a basic community level. How are we looking out for each other? How are we treating each other in the work that we do? And I think that better positions us, especially when people's basic needs are met, it better positions us to be able to build the type of movement that we need to build and the type of political power we need to build in order to create the society we want to live in. And if you are in one of the states where we organize BYP 100, join us. Young black people between the ages of 18 and 35. If not BYP 100, join another organization or start an organization if there's not one where you live that's dedicated to, you know, dedicated to black liberation. So that's that's what I would like to see happen. Is it my turn, Jenny? Look, this is really good. And all such good ideas for some reason I couldn't quite hear what Young Jung was saying when she was talking and then my computer was screwing up but everything everybody else said. And I hope that Jenny that maybe we can send around some of these links to various projects and things. I'm going to get on this sanctuary campus stuff as soon as I have the website and stuff because I spent a lot of time on colleges and that's a that's a good idea. Everybody's got a hope will come out on Tuesday for this Dakota stuff. You're definitely near someplace where it's going on because there's I think at the moment 207 of these actions taking place around the country and I think that the website is no dapldayofaction.org. Not the most euphonious website in history, but there it is no dapldayofaction.org. And it'll be a good, it'll be a good thing. And the final thing I would say is, again, since I'm notwithstanding by far the oldest and crankiest person here. One thing I've noticed myself this week is I'm just the tension and craziness is just made me a physical mess. And everybody needs to get some sleep too. This is not a marathon actually it's endless series of sprints that we're going to be going over the next while but that doesn't mean that we can't we mean just physically and emotionally. We've got to actually get some sleep now and again. And, and, and all of that. So, so good night y'all. I have been instructed by our team to let y'all know that we'll be sending out an email to everyone who tuned in or signed up for this with links to everyone's websites and action steps. And I just want to say, there have not been so many things in the last few days that have really given me life and this conversation has given me some life so I really appreciate y'all and your time and I'm excited to keep building together. So thank you all and take care. Good night.


And we move to the next talk, which is called Efficient Publicly Distance Bonding Protocol by Andan Kilianj and Serge Vaudnet. And Andan is giving the talk. Thank you, everyone. Today, I'm going to present you our new Distance Bonding Protocol, as you see from the title. First of all, I want to give a quick introduction about Distance Bonding. So all of the applications that you see on the slide are actually in our daily lives. And the common feature of all of them is that they let us authenticate without contact. Unfortunately, all these applications are one before relay attacks. I want to explain it with this following scenario. Here we have butters, our victim. And also we have our adversary, Cartman, here. And Butter has the credit card. And Cartman just comes close to our victim. And then he has also his phone. And we have also Cartman's friends in this firm market, which waits the signal from Cartman. And after they pay the phone and credit card and also this phone and the payment terminal, Cartman received a signal from Butters' credit card. And then just he lays it to his friend's phone. And his friend's phone lays it to the payment terminal. And the same happens in the reverse order as well. Like that, in the end, Cartman is able to do payment with Butters' credit card without his permission. So the most promising solution for this is distance-bounding protocol. And it was introduced by Brans and Sean. And this has a very simple idea. We have two parties, Verifier and Prover. And in distance-bounding, Prover authenticates himself and also proves his proximity. And we have two types of distance-bounding, public key distance-bounding and symmetric key distance-bounding. In symmetric case, the Verifier and the Prover share a secret. And in the public key case, the Prover and the Verifier know each other's public key. And in most of the application, it is more feasible to use public key distance-bounding because we cannot always assume that the two parties share a secret. However, public key distance-bounding, sorry, public key, Crypto has some problems. It is slower than symmetric key operations. And also, the devices that we use distance-bounding has limited resources. Therefore, it is very important to construct efficient public key distance-bounding. So we want to have less public key operation while preserving the security. And this is the outline of my presentation. First, I will give formal definitions about public key distance-bounding. Then I will explain our new weak authenticated key agreement model, which we use in our protocol. And then I will describe our constructions, new protocols, APKD, and its private variant. And I will finalize my presentation with a conclusion. OK, first, let's define what is public key distance-bounding more formally. So we have a B. It is a distance-bound, which is known by all the algorithms in the protocol. And we have two key generation algorithms, KV and KP. They generate secret key public key pair for the verifier and the prover. And also, we have other algorithms, verifier, algorithm, and prover algorithm. In the end of the execution of verifier algorithm, verifier outputs a bit out V, and the private output PKP. And out V means that either reject or accept. Now I will describe the security model of the distance-bounding. We consider several security issues here. The first one is man in the middle. So what's basically we want here, that we want to protect, understand far away prover from the adversary. And it is defined with the game. So in the game, we first generate the secret key public key of the prover and the verifier, and send the public key to the adversary. And in this scheme, we consider all of the instances of verifier and the provers. What I mean from the instance is that it is each new execution of the prover algorithm and the verifier algorithm. For example, it is an instance where the prover algorithm is run when prover is far away from the verifier, and here is the adversary. And this is another instance where the prover is just close to the verifier, and so on. And between all of these instances, we consider one of them as a distinguished one under the condition that there is no close and honest prover to the verifier. And in the end of the game, if the distinguished verifier accepts the prover and outputs its public key, then adversary wins. And if a distance-bounding protocol is made in the middle secure, the success probability of adversary should be negligible. And the other security model is distance fraud. In distance fraud, we want to prevent malicious and far-away prover to authenticate himself. And again, we define it with the game. Here, we first generate the verifier's key and send the public key of the verifier to the adversary. Here, our adversary is the prover. And then prover just generates his secret key and public key with an arbitrary algorithm. Again, we consider all of the instances of verifier and prover. For example, here, he is far away, and here, he is close, and so on. And between all of them, one of them is the distinguished one, and where we look at the output of this distinguished verifier. And in this distinguished one, there shouldn't be any close prover to the verifier. And in the end, if the verifier, the distinguished verifier accepts prover, then the adversary wins. And we want that the success probability of this, in this game, the success probability of the adversary in this game is negligible. And the last security model is distance hijacking. Actually, this is the more generalized version of the distance fraud. Here, we want to prevent far away and malicious prover to authenticate himself by getting advantage of close and honest prover. And again, we define a game for this model. So, we generate the public key and secret key pair of the verifier and the honest prover. Honest prover is represented by P prime here, and then sends the public key to the adversary here. Adversity is P. Then, adversary, the prover generates his secret key public key pair by an arbitrary algorithm. And as in the previous games, we again considered all the instances. For example, here, honest prover is close to verifier and malicious one is far away. And here, both of them are close and so on. And between all of them, we consider one of them is a distinguished one under the condition that there is no close and malicious prover to verifier. And in the end, if the distinguished verifier accepts the malicious prover, then this prover means. And as in the previous games, we want that the success probability of adversary is negligible in this game to have distance eye checking security. Okay, lastly, I want to define the privacy very briefly. So we use HPVP model here. And basically what happens here, we have many provers and adversary. And adversary can corrupt any provers, which means that he can learn their secret key. And in some moments, he just picks two provers and sends them as a challenge. And challenger simulates one of them. And in the end of the game, if the adversary can recognize who is simulated by the challenger, then he wins. And if a distance spawning is strong private, the adversary, the advantage of adversary in this game should be negligible. And before proceeding the next section, I would like to give the overview of our protocol. So in our protocol, what we do is that the first verifier and the prover agree on a secret S by a key agreement protocol. And then they run a symmetric key distance spawning protocol with the agreed key S. So the part we need public key operation is this key agreement part. And we wonder that what do we really need from this key agreement protocol to achieve MIM security, DF security and DH security? When we look at the previous key agreement protocol security models, CK and ECK, and also the protocols here which achieves these level of security, we see that efficiency actually is not good. Here efficiency shows that number of exponentiation is done. And we wonder do we really need that level of security from this key agreement protocol? And the answer is no. Therefore we define weak authenticated key agreement. In weak authenticated key agreement, we have only one message which is sent by the party B. And this message is picked from the distribution D. And after receiving this N, they both compute secret S by running the algorithms A and B. So this is the framework of one pass key agreement protocol. And also we define a security model for that by defining a game. And the name of our game is the A-K-A game, decision authenticated key agreement. Here the challenger first generates the keys for the party A and B. And then also we have oracle B and oracle A. So oracle B is inputted by secret key and secret key and public key of the party B. And oracle A is inputted by secret key and public key of party A. And we have these oracles which runs the algorithm B and A. After the challenger just sends PKA to the oracle B and oracle B sends N and S0. So N is picked from this distribution and S0 is the output of B. And also he randomly picks a secret S1. Then he just picks a bit B. And then sends this SB and PKB and PK to the adversary. So here SB is either randomly picked or it is generated by the algorithm B. An adversary can access all these oracle except that he cannot input PKB and N to the oracle A. In the end of the game, he outputs a bit B prime and if B prime equals B, he wins. So if a one pass key agreement protocol is DAK secure, the advantage of adversary should be negligible in this game. And also we define DAK privacy for one pass key agreement protocol. Here we want to protect the privacy of the party B. So here challenger generates the keys for A and B. And we have only oracle A. After the challenger sends PKA and also secret key and public key of party B to the adversary. Adversary also generates secret key and public key payer for the party B and sends them to the challenger. After that challenger picks a bit B and computes the message N from the distribution D and runs the algorithm B, either from the secret key that he generated or the secret key public key payer that adversary generated. And then sends the S, the output of B to the adversary. Adversary can access oracle A and the anti-outputs a bit B prime. If B prime equals B, then he wins. If a key agreement protocol is DAK private, the advantage of the adversary in this game should be negligible. So basically here adversary knows the secret keys but he shouldn't able to distinguish which secret key is used. Okay. And also we propose one pass key agreement protocol which is DAK secure and DAK private. We call it as non-STH. In non-STH we have public parameter, a group, a prime order group and its generator G. And the parties picks their secret key from ZQ and the public key is just G to the secret key. After that the party B picks a message from L bit strings and sends it to the party A and then they compute this function H. So if you look at the input of the function H you will see that they are equal. And we prove that this protocol non-STH is DAK secure and DAK private in the random oracle model assuming that gap defilement problem is hard. And so now we can look at the previous pay protocols and our protocol. As you see we are much more efficient. We only need one exponentiation. We have bigger security but it's not problem. It is enough for our purposes too because our main purpose to construct secure distance bonding protocol. Okay. Now I can explain what is our protocol. The first one is FPK DB. Here prover just picks N from the distribution D and sends N and his public key to the verifier. And then verifier and the prover generate secret S using the algorithm A and B. After that they run a symmetric distance bonding protocol S using this S that they generated. And after verify just output his message which means it's either reject or accept. And we prove that FPK DB is the MIM secure, DF secure and DH secure under the conditions that you see here, the bold ones. For example, when we look at MIM security we need from SIM DB to modify one time MIM secure. And we want from the key agreement protocol to be DAK secure. So what I mean from one time MIM secure is that it is enough to have security, MIM security, even how can I explain? So if we run the SIM DB one time it is secure. So if we run second time it is not secure anymore which is weaker security notion than normal MIM security. So basically what we need from weaker distance bonding protocol, SIM DB, we can construct a fully secure MIM security. This is the private variant which is very simple. Here the prover's public key has two parts PKV1 and PKV2. So here is usual prover generate N and encrypts this N with his public key, with the public key of the verifier and sends it to the verifier. And then verifier decrypts and learn the messages then they generate the secret S and run symmetric key distance bonding protocol with this S. Here PKP is the private output of verifier. And we prove that the private variant of APKDB is strong private in HPRP model if the key agreement protocol DAK private and the crypto system is in CCH secure. So I gave you a framework about our protocol. What I said that we first need to use the key agreement protocol and then run a symmetric key distance bonding. So this is an instance of our framework for FPKDB. So for a key agreement protocol we can use non-STH, the pink part is non-STH, I explained already. And then for a symmetric key distance bonding we can use OTDB, which is a one-time secure distance bonding protocol. And how it works? Here first the verifier picks a non-STH and sends it to the prover. After that they exhort the secret S and non-STH and get A. And then challenge phase begins. In challenge phase the verifier sends the bit CI which is challenge and starts the timer. After receiving it, the prover computes the response is like that and sends the response to the verifier and the verifier stops the timer. After and runs like that, the verifier checks if all the responses arrived on time like that by checking if the round trip time is less than to be or not and checks if all the responses are correct. So if everything is okay, in that the verifier accepts the prover. And output his message. And I want to conclude my presentation by comparing our distance bonding protocol with the previous ones. So here you see column for security, privacy and the public key operations needed to compute this distance bonding protocol as number of competitions required. So for example, when we look at HPO and our private variant of FPKDB, we have a stronger security and stronger privacy and we have less, we need less operation on the prover side. And the pre-DV security is the same with our private variant of FPKDB and we are slightly more efficient than this. And also we have one more advantage against pre-DV which is that we have also non-private variant, FPKDB. Like that, since not all applications requires privacy, in this case it is feasible to use FPKDB instead of right variant of FPKDB. And this is the end of my presentation and I would like to conclude my presentation with an announcement. So our lab is searching for postdocs. We are at EPFL. So if you want to apply for it or if you will know someone who wants to apply, this is the contact me. Thank you for your attention. We have time for one question. Just if you consider to remove the gap assumption using the twin differential man tweak. Sorry, I don't hear it. Did you consider to remove the gap assumption from your protocol using the computational differential man assumption, for example? We couldn't prove it with computational differential. If it's right, it didn't work. Even with the cash kills shub technique? We didn't try that one. Okay, let's thank Andan again.


Here's a major key to clearly hearing the voice of the precious Holy Spirit. Obedience. Yes, we should know the Word. The more familiar you become with the written Word, the more clearly you can hear the Holy Spirit speak directly to your Spirit. Yes, we should pray. Time in His presence makes you more sensitive to His voice. Yes, we should remove outer and inner distractions. Silence and stillness make His voice nearly impossible to miss. But add to these the important key that is obedience. When we live in disobedience, our minds and emotions become cluttered with guilt, shame, and fear, and those make it very difficult to hear God. Why would God give us the next instruction if we fail to follow His first and most basic instruction? The Lord directs the steps of the Godly. When we acknowledge Him, then He directs our path. You want to start hearing God clearly? Obey what you know He's already spoken.


So it has been a bit of a really rough year and one of the ways that I have been coping in a healthier way than I was previously coping is by getting like a lot of tattoos. First up, we got my Lincoln Park One More Light tattoo. We got the LP logo in the middle along with a reference to The Best Song. Traveling right down the arm, we got my little lion here filled in. Previously it was just an outline and now he looks badass. Probably my favorite one. We've got my yet wrist watch. Two remind me in the moments when everything feels like too much that I haven't figured it out yet. I don't see a way through yet. Yet being the operative word. Then we got my geometric rose tattoo. I've always loved tattoos that kind of have more of a geometric shape to them. Geometric means shape. But you know what I mean? I think it's pretty. Ready nerds. Now we have my Lord of the Rings Shards of Narsil tattoo. And then most recently, I got some Colorado wildflowers. I'm matching tattoo with one of my best, best, best friends. Kind of easier to see this way. But then it's upside down. And more to come. Look at all this space we got to fill in guys. I think it might be time for some more tattoo therapy.


Hello creatures Welcome back to another video glad to have you guys here, so it says about a day ago I did post a poll on my channel and I asked you guys what you guys wanted Monday's video to be which is today So today's video is gonna be it seemed like scary piggy one by the way So I guess we're gonna do some scary piggy videos it all right and guys Yeah, I know most of you guys have been asking me where the streams are at I don't have a stream didn't love about like a month. Oh been a cool minute already. It's been a while since I haven't stream Okay, I am guilty. I am admitting that I haven't streamed just because I haven't streamed Which might be one of the worst Reasons well at least I'm being honest, right? So with that being said Tomorrow Tuesday, I will be streaming for you guys because I know you guys missed me Psych you guys missed the robux man.  Okay, you're still in the center. That's a minute like a flamethrower Torch The torch is usually the ones you hold with fire and that is a light that is not a torch Powers out silly Figures cutting a hole in the cardboard box make it our own television I Hear siren The heck I was on the TV. Oh All right, well it seems like they're about to get ambushed by siren head And we came to an end Okay, so our next video we got last night for Peppa's family meeting with the siren head Oh Pigs like any spaghetti Your bedtime can we play outside for just a time don't sleep please mommy, please daddy All right, why is the sun in red?  Siren I got a story once the little piggy went to the store then he got kidnapped and they turned her into bacon tragic There we go They're doing that windmill and siren head Stop yawning i'm gonna get sleepy man Jump's high he never oh mr. P Oh, they're gonna go to sleep all right siren head is gonna make sure they all get some sleep Oh, all right, so he did an attack the house He just kind of showed up at the end for our final clip. We got Oh camping is what I haven't been camping but I've been like hiking just haven't stayed out there in the mountain Dude that thing is super tiny that is the smallest 10 I've ever seen Dude the parents did not fit in that it was big enough for me when I was a boy Boy, have you seen yourself lately?  They just left him out. Dude why is siren head so tiny?  He's dead man, and they are clueless about it. That is totally messed up All right, you guys well those were some scary peppa pig videos or pigging videos whatever you want to call it man It's been a while since we've seen some of these Well, like I said, I will stream tomorrow around 11 or 11 30 a.m Pacific time by the way, which you should uh check out with times on your end If you don't know or if you're confused about that because there are different time zones Well, thank you guys for watching. Thank you all for the amazing support as always I truly appreciate it and I will see you all in the next one. Peace