on YouTube channel as well. And before I introduce Dr. Nancy Lee, I would like to introduce the long group a little bit. If you have time, scan the bar code to join our channel. So this is a six workshop we have so far, a bit about long group we are based in Seattle. A local community with 500 members, about 90% of our members are from different technology companies in local Seattle. And then I'm the founder, Carol. We organize hiking activity, fishing and crabbing and also some like beach barbecue during COVID. We organize online book club, career workshops. And if you are located in Seattle, please join us. And today I'd like to welcome our Dr. Nancy Lee, the very honorable guest speakers. She is a entrepreneur, a group product manager and a YouTuber. She moved to the US with $800 in her pocket 10 years ago within just a few years. She became one of our youngest engineering PhDs and now she managed a team of senior product management, Fortune 21 technology company. She's the only female manager in the 100 group product management organization. She's also an alumni of Boston University and MIT. Her goal is to bring more product managers and business leaders to tech companies and help them to get compensation they want. So that's why we have this workshop, how to negotiate a higher salary, especially during this pandemic special period. So let's welcome Dr. Nancy Lee.  I'm on mute. Okay, now you're good. Okay, great. Yeah, thank you, Carol, for having me. And I know lots of you guys are on the West Coast is 11 a.m. your time right now. And thank you very much for making this time and get up early. I wanna make sure this one hour up to 45 minutes conversation is going to be very productive for all of you guys. And let's get started. And something I wanna remind everyone is that for the specific talk, I set the room as a meeting instead of webinar because I encourage everyone to ask questions. I wanna make it live examples. And because negotiation in my opinion is a dance because has a lot to do with yourself and the other side of table, which means you can only control 50%. You need to be very dynamic. So therefore there are many different kind of negotiation cases we can go through. So whenever you guys have any questions, feel free to jump in. I wanna go today, I'm going to go through the very high level, the framework and also two cases. Then I will leave you lots of time to ask me specific questions that you already faced in your salary negotiation case. And in this case, I also encourage everyone to throw in some random salary numbers. As an example, don't use your real salary information because it's kind of unnecessary, a little bit confidential, but you can use like random examples of 100 grand. Assume I get 100, someone give me 120, like something like that, right? So we all feel comfortable to use it as a case for our conversation. Perfect, yeah. Anyone, when you ask any questions, you can just unmute yourself and ask questions or you type in the chat and come back to everyone instead of just to me. And Kara will be the co-host. She's going to manage all the Q&A with me together. And Kara should also add more people into the chat as well. So because there are some songs in the waiting room. Okay, so let's get started. And today I'm trying to cover that. How would you advance your career and go through those negotiations selling yourself strategies without leaving a bad impression? Sounds very simple because negotiation, everyone want to get more money, but you do not want to leave bad impression or like a backlash by a co-worker sometime in the future. How can we find the perfect balance? Today I'm going to give you several examples how I did that and how other people have done that in the past. So let me quickly ask all of the questions to you guys is why you're here today. I guess there's three reasons. So you are motivated to get a new job opportunity. New job opportunity. I can hear you. I can hear you. Maybe you guys can mute. Only when you ask questions, so you can unmute yourself. Maybe it's easier. Yeah, so you are motivated to get a new job opportunities and you were low-bought by your employers. That's the reason you're here today. And second, you're afraid to ask for more as people may dislike you, but you hate being underpaid. Third reason, you feel like people underestimate your capabilities and you want to learn how to stand up for yourself. So for reasons one, two, three, so which one is you? Comment on the chat. You can type in one, two, or three and comment which one is you. Yeah, comment on the chat why you're here today. Or you have other reasons you're here today. We have four. If you type in four, please comment on why you're here today or what specific questions you want to get answered. So we got lots of three, one, four and lots of one, one, one, one, one. One for sure and several, two, three, four. If you're four, please type in why you're here today. So number one is that you're more worried about being low-bought by employers. Yes, I have a specific low-bought case study. I can share with you guys this. Yeah, you're coming at the right spot. And yeah, we're a little bit emotional for two and we also have fours, the reasons. Okay, lots of ones. Let's continue. All right, just quick summary about myself. And actually I teach product management and helping people to become product manager in the tech industry. But whenever you get an offer, you always go into the salary negotiation process. And now today I only want to focus on the salary negotiation part. I think like most of you guys in this specific audience today, myself I immigrated from China about 10 years ago. At that time I got full scholarship to study in the US and I transitioned from fashion industry into engineering field and I got five offers. But when I got here, I never felt confident to really negotiate or ask for more because I felt like I was lucky to get here. I don't know whether you guys felt this way or not. I felt like I was lucky. A few years later I became the youngest engineer in PhD. I also felt very lucky that I got job offers but never negotiated for my first one. Then one year into my job, I realized just I discovered someone else getting paid more than I do and other people doing the same work. And then I start to figure out what's the best ways to ask for more money. Then within a year I got 15% raise and then afterwards each time when I jump ship, I get between 30 to 40% raise myself. And I have YouTube channel. Today we're supposed to go live on YouTube, some integration issues. I'm going to post a recorded video on my YouTube channel later on. Yeah, you guys can check it out called Dr. Nancy Lee and Google my name. And I will be the first one show up on your Google search Dr. Nancy Lee. Just quick background information regarding why I teach. Specifically my long-term goal is seriously to build hundred schools in China for mid and low income families to teach them entrepreneurship. That's the reason I love to share anything I've learned with all of you guys. Hopefully sometime in the future you guys can be the future leaders and be the entrepreneur and help me out down the road. And something I want to tell you regarding the specific observation I had is that so right now I manage a team of senior product managers. Once you become managers, lots of you guys have become a manager already, maybe engineering manager or different managers. Then you start to sit on the other side of the table. Once they sit on the other side of the table I noticed two different things that women and international professionals are not on the decision-making tables. Whenever we discuss as managers, hiring managers we decide or discuss who to hire and how much people will need to pay different things. And I realized that I was the only female manager out of 100 people and very few Chinese or minority managers among all of them. So lots of time I really want to advocate for minority candidate or whoever needs HMB sponsorship to tell them, wow, we need to do this, bring this person on board. Then I realized I was the only one advocate for all of them. So that's lead to what we are today. Now today I want to teach you the specific part regarding the second part, becoming product managers and get a compensation we want. Today we don't cover the product managers, we specialize in talking about compensation. And first of all about the compensation. Let me change your mindset. This word negotiation sounds very, very aggressive, right? Confrontational, you guys feel the same way? If you feel the same way, common yes in the chat. So I didn't like the word negotiation either, right? So people feel the same way, but one day I want to start to shift the mindset of the definition of negotiation. What if negotiation is influence? What if each time when you negotiate, you're trying to bring the other side of people on the other side of the table to your side and have them to help you out? What if you make negotiation that way? It didn't feel, didn't you feel more comfortable to talk about salary, to talk about how much you worth to the employer? So this, so when we talk about negotiation, I myself invented the code below. People do not pay for what you deserve. People pay for the value you sell to them, which is very, very true. That's also the most common mistakes all the candidate made regarding when I need to ask for more money and people talk about this is what I deserve. In reality, heavy managers or employers, they like to tell you that it's not about what you deserve, it's about whether they can perceive your value to the other side. You might feel like you, you worse a lot if you don't see that, you mean nothing to them. Okay, so let me ask you this question. What do you think is negotiable? For example, your base salary, your sign on bonus, what else do you think is negotiable? Please comment on the chat. Stock options, yes. Charlie said stock options and Shirley said level, yes. Yes, your title, exactly. You can negotiate job title. What else do you guys can be negotiated? Paytime off, yes. Sabrina said paytime off, yes, exactly. Relocation, totally, yeah. Relocation package can be negotiated. Stock vest plan, exactly. This is sign on bonus, totally. This is a specific extent offered deadline, time, yes. Everything can be negotiated. Myself also, I negotiate the timeline for myself for many times. This is a summary of what I have collected and also my students and other people told me they have negotiated including vacation, bonus, equity and income tuition. If you have certain amount of tuition, one company pay you to go get an MBA or something can be negotiated. Post-series salary is that if you join a startup, they may underpay you, not underpay you. They cannot pay you as much as the common rate, but you can make agreement with them saying that post salary A, my salary need to go back to the normal market rate at ABCD amount. This could be included. And for severance package, severance package can be negotiated if you go up to director level or VP level. It's common for senior level people to discuss compensation package, but you may not get it, but lots of senior people already start to have this kind of conversation because once you're very senior, you move on to the next company. The company probably will pay you a big chunk of money for you not to work for the competitors or all different kind of agreement. They can work with you with, right? So all of this and in addition in real life that I enjoy this the most because I negotiate every week with my fiancees regarding who cleans dishes, who cleans the bathroom, everything. And discount on clothes, honestly. So before COVID, that's very funny. So I got 20% off at Macy's that was before discount for original price. I negotiate those, but not because I really want a 20% off, which is like not that much money. It's more towards, huh? If this possible, is it feasible? How can I figure out? How can I figure out what they want and help them to sell more inventory and in return get the kind of discount I like? This is more for practice, your negotiation skills in real life. Of course, buying properties, you can negotiate. If you're buying properties right now, I suggest you to bargain. Right now it is buyer's market. All right, so the second part of negotiation is a mindset shift that I wanna bring everyone together. And this is not widely talked about, but I really want you guys to think about this from the perspective of advantage or disadvantage. There's a specific case and the research, Stanford has done. What they said is that now they put the pool of men and women together and they slush them in half, randomly select half and half. For the first half of people, they tell the first half that women are better in negotiation in terms of they like, they love fashion and you're going to negotiate on behalf of TJ Maxx for those deals. And for the second half, they told the same candidate to negotiate on top of TJ Maxx, but they said in general, men are tough negotiators, they get better deals for our company. And then they encourage all of them to go off to negotiate. Can you comment on the chat and let me know, who do you think negotiate better, men or women in both cases in group one and group two? Or there's no difference, just tell me on the chat. Or you can unmute yourself if you want to express your guesses, you can unmute yourself and turn on yourself on camera as well. So I see people put women, women, lots of women. So in both cases, the same first one, first half of group, they said group one, yeah. Group one women, Oliver said group one women, group two men.  Okay, the answer is, which is Oliver's answer. Yeah, Oliver's answer was right. For the first one, when they said, women are better because women love fashion, buying things for TJ Maxx, women did better. For the second group, when they told men are better and men did better. Do you see the differences in the outcome that the mindset will control your negotiation outcome? It is not you're actually better or you're a man or a woman or immigrant or American, whatever different combo, okay? All the other combos didn't make a difference, only what's in your head. If for the women, they told them, oh, you're naturally better, they did better. For men, you told them they're naturally better, they did better, okay? So same thing for us. I know lots of people today for this webinar, lots of us are immigrants. There's no difference if an immigrant doesn't mean that you will get underpaid. No, it's all in your head. Yeah, Leo said the most important thing. Yes, mindset is the most important thing. Same thing as bamboo seating glass ceilings, guys. It's totally up to you. If you believe that there is bamboo seating, there's glass ceilings, believe me, you will soon hit your own glass ceilings. If you don't believe that or you think, oh, the very far seating is the CEO or anything under the CEO doesn't consider as a seating for me, then you can go all the way up to the CEO level.  All right, mindset is very important here. Now let's go into the tactics today. First of all, for the negotiation framework, I want to go through this very quickly with all of you guys. Then I will leave lots of time for case study and leave you lots of time to ask new questions. There are four steps of framework in terms of negotiation. First of all, it's the right timing. And second is build your reputation before you ask. And third is actually research market value. And number four is talk about your value with the employers. Let me break this down for you. What I mean always, okay, what do you mean by build credibility before you ask your reputation? What I mean by that is that when you socialize your achievement, whenever it happens, you need to do that, such as whenever you have product lunch, I'm a product manager myself. Whenever I have a product lunch or small wings, I will let other people know about this achievement. And if you have engineering breakthrough, Karl told me that lots of you guys today are engineers. Anytime you have engineering breakthroughs or you help to solve some problems, you need to let other people know. You need to socialize this even before you ask for more money. Of course, if you transition into a new company, you might not be able to show them when product launch happened. You can bring this up during the interview process or several negotiation process regarding your achievement. If you're thinking about getting more money with your own company, whenever those achievements happened, you need to tell others in order to build your credibility. Oops. All right. And then the other part is build your own personal brand before you ask. This also applies if you stay in your own company. However, you can also build your own brand on LinkedIn, like myself or others, that I encourage all my students to do is build a very strong personal brand on LinkedIn so that even you negotiate like Harry Sarri was new employer, they know about you. Your comments show up on the news feed. Check your profile on LinkedIn. It's already very impressive, right? So this is what I define as personal brand in terms of how people describe you. Confident, problem solver or leaders or anything you think other people will describe you. This also a interview question tips. Okay. People will ask you this interview question. How would your coworker describe you? Use three adjectives to describe that. There's also part of an interview questions. So build your personal brand before you ask. Now, even before you ask, you need to do extensive research. Research your market value. So my favorite website is blind. This website is called teamblind.com. They also have like an app version. I think lots of you guys have heard of this before because I gave multiple webinars in different places. I always recommend this website or the app. So it's anonymous place to post your salary like a number and also talk about any gossip of any companies. Anything I wanna talk about. It's all anonymous, fully protected. That's this website is going to help you to find the true market value. In addition, there are other websites such as Glassdoor, right? Very popular. Everyone knows about Glassdoor or another website called Pesa. Myself also use Pesa to get lots of salary information. So get the most accurate salary information before you even start to ask.  That's a lot of mistakes candidate made. You didn't do lots of research. Research are from as much as you can. So let me give you a specific examples regarding how much a product manager get paid because especially in this, which is the product manager salary ranges between 120 to 300K. 300K is more towards Google or Facebook type of salary and you have worked for many years then you join Google or Facebook type of companies. You can go up to 300 grand, which is a total compensation which has like a Facebook stocks, Google stocks in it. And it'll also give you big sign on bonus for lots of company as low as 5K. Could also go 100 grand. And they might also best those number over multiple years is totally up to you. And some companies they give you cash. Lots of cash are from as well. So it's up to you how would you negotiate? When you negotiate, think about this before you even walk into negotiation. So today I'm teaching you how exactly do it right. I bet lots of you guys see don't do this. What's their budget? What's the competition? What do they value? What's negotiable? What's in the entire package they offer to you? Doesn't have to be just salary. Could be something else. The package of relocation, everything together or some daycare. I don't know. Nobody offering daycare stuff. I don't have kids either. I'm just coming up with this. Maybe the package could also allow you to work from home, right? Or Ian, you should also develop question to ask to understand what's on the other side of the table. So question to all of you guys is that among all the questions I've listened here, how many of those questions have you considered in the past when you negotiate with an employer? How many of this I mentioned have you thought about or did research before you started negotiation? How many of the six, actually five, I'm just kidding. How many of those five questions have you thought about or prepared when you talk about the negotiation before even you walk into the negotiation? How to know the answers of these five questions? You can ask. I will give you, do I have, yes, good question. And you can ask, you can develop the right questions to those, you can also ask the recruiters. Lots of time, I figure out honestly, depends on how you ask. You need to make friends with those recruiters. And for example, lots of time, the recruiters would tell me what's their budget, what their range, and who else is in the final round of this interviews, right? Recruiters told me this. You can also ask recruiters, so what's the most important for this company? What do they value, right?  What's their specific growth strategy? What's the top three priorities for the company? What's negotiable is that what's inside of the entire offers they give it to you. And all of this, you need to start a conversation to take information from the recruiters to extract those information. Okay, this, this slide is critical, important. I encourage all of you guys to take a screenshot for this slide right now. And this is specific negotiation tips that you're able to extract those information that I mentioned above. And first of all, you need to understand it is illegal for HR to ask you a current salary. So do not tell them your current salary because it's not going to benefit you. Or unless your current salary is much higher than the new offer you're taking, then you tell them the current salary, right? I assume you're jumping to a higher offer position. Then your current salary max is lower than the current offer. So don't tell them. And in Massachusetts, it is illegal for HR to ask you this question. You can tell them that. I don't know about California or Seattle or like your cities or your state. You should do your own research. My recommendation is that unless your current salary is higher than your future job and don't tell them your current salary. You can also get competing offers that will help out significant to do market research and why you're worth this much. Ask your ex coworkers and friends in the company. They can give you lots of information and go or rent ways to ask questions. And maybe sometimes you can keep the same salary. If they cannot change the salary, you can, whoa, why don't I jump to the different band? So sometimes it's not, they, HR don't want to give you more salary was because it hit the band. You can talk to them. Can we jump to a different band so that there's no seating anymore or like a bigger, bigger room for you to grow, all right? And let me go to the next one. Now let me show you a specific examples regarding how my student Annie did that for herself and specifically Annie herself to protect her identity and herself is a scientist, is a senior scientist working for startup in San Francisco. Eventually she got 40% raise. But let me show you regarding what has she been through to get 40% rate. Specifically in, I think with last August something and when someone get, she got an offer, she doesn't have a competing offer, first of all, but she got a low ball offer and the recruiter directly gave her a specific salary that equals to her current salary. Let's say it's 100K base. All the number I gave you is very, very random guys. Just take it as an example. Let's say the offer is 100 grand, but this is a real person and in real case, but we do not disclose people's salary here. But in general, what this means is that they put up 100K base. I said I give you 100K, but this 100K is the same as her current salary. And she felt very undervalued. Then she reached out to me saying I was low ball. I was very unhappy about the situation. Then what Annie did was that I asked her to do research about what's her market value. Let's say this artificial number to protect all the confidential information. Let's say we found the material scientist Saturday in the Bay Area with five years experience should be 120 grand or 150 grand. Let's say it's this number. And it's clearly that she was underpaid based on the entire, the market is offering. And what we did next is also very, very important for all of you guys. If you happen to work for startup and understand the funding situation of the startup, what we realized is that her startup actually just raised $300 million. And specifically the startup is actually doing very, very well or also doing very well during COVID time. And that startup also have a reputation of great life for funds. And they take every Friday off. And within the company, they have very little like in-house material scientists like a strengths capacities within the company. So therefore specifically we understand she has a room to grow. It's just the HR was using some type of lower wall strategy to give her a really low number. Now next part is that bring HR. So what Annie did next is that now she knew what in reality, how much she need to ask. And then she brought this back to the company based on her research. She brought up the number based on her research. And in addition, when she communicate with the current company, hold on a sec, this is cool. And when she communicate with the current company she would say things in this way in terms of I really like your company. And I really think we can work together to address this issue. What do you think the hybrid manager want? And what I believe is that the market research is this much and I want to join the company. I just wanna get a compensation that's comfortable for both of us. And the way she communicated is make HR feel like they're on the same side because HR was thinking about it is hard for HR to recruit and hire the best candidate, right? Now if she can pass the interviews and get offer the company is ready to give her an offer. The HR didn't want her to lose the offer either but HR also understand internally there are certain type of like a constraint or banned or how much money other people is paying because she positioned herself this way then HR start to let her know, well the hybrid manager was comparing you with another senior scientist in the company and that's the range we usually give for senior scientists. So basically we extract lots of information from the HR side. That's what I mean making friends with HR bring them to your side. Oh, did I miss the, oh, sorry, I missed the slides is that actually Annie's value to the startup when she talked to HR she also brought up the value to startup is that she actually had 90% the prior experience of the new equipment she's going to use as a material scientist and she also had experience leading a team has many PhD publications. Her value to the startup is about how she can help the startup achieve their long-term vision to launch a product or achieve certain amount of financial success. That's when we talk about negotiation you don't talk about the number you talk about the value you can bring to startup helps them to achieve certain type of go and make friends with HR. So the HR understand that this person did bring in lots of value to the company and she does want to work with me but I have a constraint from the hybrid manager about the range and budget I can spend on this candidate. And then HR will start to help you to tell you what's on this other side of table and how exactly we can, how much more room we can move. Sometimes maybe they cannot change the base salary but they can give you more sign on bonus this all in the entire package can be worked on. And finally Annie herself on one hand I think is really cool. She changed from a bike company to a flying car company. I think just based on the type of company jump is a career promotion for her. It's much cooler flying car company. And second she got a 40% raise in terms of the total compensation that was she had. Let me, oh people ask me questions in the chat. And so let me read the question. Do you need to provide proof when competing offers or your current salary if not how does HR know it is true? Sometimes some companies will ask for proof because there's a public conversation that I do not tell you which companies but I can tell you that multiple companies will ask you to provide the competing offers number to show that this is real. So therefore don't lie. Okay guys, I never recommend anyone to lie about the competing offers or any other like current salary. Don't lie, if you do have a competing offer they might ask you to provide those competing offer in order to give you the matching salary, okay? But they can ask for this and this happened multiple times in my experience as well, okay? In most states employers are free to ask job applicant about the current or prior salaries. However, many state cities are considered history banned. So more than a dozen state have passed this. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Thank you for the information on fake. The next question is Texas. Oh, you talk about which state are banned or not. Hey guys, do your own research and see figure out which one was banned or not. I know Emma's true sense will ban about two years ago is your advantage not to tell them you're old salary especially if your old salary is not high, okay? So now let's move to the next question. Our next example I want to give you is complete separate. It's a nothing to do with offer negotiation. I just want to broaden your vision regarding negotiation is that negotiation happens a lot. If you ask any like a negotiation expert when do you negotiate? They will say only 20% of time I use the same skill set as for more money. Another 80% of time, I learn how to influence other people to bring them to my side. As a product manager, you need to use the specific skill set a lot in your current job as well. And here I just want to give you a different example if we don't talk about offer negotiation what else you can do, right? And this is another student of mine. This is ongoing cases very interesting that she's a real estate agent selling single family for 600 grand. Of course we are not comparing this number with San Francisco number. San Francisco is probably $6 million, not like 600 grand. Okay, take easy on this numbers. Let's assume this real estate agent is selling a single family for 600 grand and eventually it was sold for 700 grand. But she only is taking 1% of the commission because originally they want to go to off market. She also needs to share the commission with another buyer's agent. And eventually she was able to only get 1% of the commission. But she sold the property much higher than before when she talk about the specific uncomfortable situation and let's say Megan brought this up to her client saying that my value to you is I was able to sell your property for 100 grand more. It was 600 grand listing price. I sold it for 100 grand more. And listen, she sold it in March. Can you believe this? That was at the beginning of COVID. She was able to sell property at the beginning of COVID for 100 grand more. Then she brought her value to the employer of not employer to the owner of the property saying that the additional value brought to you is 1% of additional value bring to you is 100 grand. But if I want to ask additional 1% it's actually only $7,000. Right now her commission is 1% $7,000. She want to get another 1% which is like 2% in total. What she asking for is only $7,000 which is very, very little compared with additional like 100 grand more money that her client's getting. So which means her total value brought up to the client is 93 grand. So through there she was able to clearly demonstrate the value she brought her client was much higher than originally the 1% of commission. So that's as an example of how can you negotiate with others outside of work as well not just offer negotiation. My last piece of advice for all of you guys is that you might thinking about well my manager or hybrid manager may not feel comfortable when we negotiate for lots of money. Actually your manager want you to negotiate and as long as you don't go off rack you don't go too much, right? And there's a specific examples like protecting the person's information. Let's say hypersatically speaking there's a person who's also put a manager with 20 years experience but if this person go into interview didn't negotiate when he got offered what would you think the hybrid manager would think? Huh, John probably do not have any other competing offer. We made him offer then he took this offer and he needed to be bounced. Probably may not have the best hire in this market, right? So therefore I recommend everybody to negotiate a little bit more you may not get 30% and 40% whatever percentage more what you need to do is that you need to try to ask for more and figure out what do you think your value to the company what is legit regarding the market rate and when to ask. Now let me ask you a quick question in the chat. When do you think you should ask for a raise if you decide to stay in your current company? Comment on the chat. When do you think you should ask for a raise? Before annual review? Yes, that's a correct answer. And for promotions, media review get an external offer when you ask for raise. Those are great answers. Let me tell you in general there are three timing that you need to ask for raise from the internal company. When you jump ship to a new company when you switch to a new role in your current company or in addition which is also very important regarding you need to ask for raise before decision was made. Lots of people wait until the like a performance review as in a year in December when you do performance review then you go ahead you ask for more money. Usually it's very late because the decision was made ahead of time. That's why I encourage you guys to bring this up for your credibility and different timing to your, to your hiring manager as early as possible but you also need to understand the decision making process of your current company. Actually with my YouTube channel video. Okay, on the right corner on my YouTube channel I made a specific video about do not ask for raise during end of year performance review season was because people didn't understand the negotiation time frame the decision making process was in your own company. And I made a specific cheat sheet for all of you guys download which tells you roughly when the companies made decision and lots of companies when you ask for more money in the as the end of year of performance review but decision was made already which means you need to move up your calendar much earlier. You can take a screenshot of this cheat sheet and you can scan the barcode to download specifically regarding how and when you can ask for raise is based on the decision making process within the company. All right, cool. You can also head out to my YouTube channel to watch this as well. You should take a screenshot now. Now let me, my final words to all of you guys is that the only thing with guaranteed return is to invest in yourself. Negotiation or like job hunting or public speaking or any kind of new skills or how to be a leader, how to manage people. Others never come that easy. But what I know is that the best way for you to continue to be the next level is continue to invest in yourself. This really changed my mind a lot which has a lot to do negotiation training and how that teach me as well. The reason is that earlier this actually last year I start to teach negotiation. Even if I call my like a course that she negotiate is teaching her for women but lots of men reach out to me. It's very interesting. Even if men are getting paid higher than women in general and more women want to learn and more women want to get paid even higher. For women, it's data have show women getting paid like 80 cents per dollar. Women need them more for sure but lots of women always feel hesitant. Maybe next time, maybe what if I get fired? What if I don't have it?  Successful become more successful was because they consistently to invest in themselves to do better. So therefore my final words for all of you guys is continue to invest in yourself in any aspect of your life and your career as well. I personally spent $25,000 in any new skills. I want to improve. So I encourage you guys to continue to do this as well because I was so surprised to see that success people continue to invest in themselves. Someone who need more help was always hesitant in investing in themselves. That's when we see the gap became bigger and bigger in the society. All right, and just something one minute about what else I do. So I teach product management book camp to help people to become a product manager. You guys can check out on my website, DrNancyD.com, which include unlimited job referrals. And I also help people to negotiate salary. What it means is that if any, if you have salary offer for 100 grand and help you to negotiate to 120 grand, I take 20% of the gain, which is a cut, but the first $5,000 is free, which means if I cannot help you to get even $5,000, I don't want to waste your time and I don't charge you either. So feel free to ask me any questions if you want me to negotiate any job offers for you. So as the end, this is my contact information. You guys can take a screenshot for the slides with my WeChat, Instagram and email and website. And feel free to ask me any questions. And now we go into the Q&A session. And I do need to close at three o'clock in Boston, which will have eight minutes for Q&A. So feel free to unmute yourself or type questions in the chat that we can answer your questions directly. Thank you so much Nancy. It's a very great workshop that, so we have so many great workshops because we want to change people's mindset. This is a very good lesson that we learned that, so usually we think maybe manager don't want us to negotiate or HR don't want to negotiate, but actually they are on our side. Sometimes most of the time HR is on our side, just depends on how you say that. Thank you Nancy. And we have several minutes left, seven minutes. Feel free to ask questions. You can unmute yourself. Yeah, feel free to unmute yourself when you ask questions. I got a question from Sharon. Sharon said for negotiation internally, promotion change team, given that HR know the prior salary, how do you negotiate things? Again, your future position is independent of your prior salary. The thing is that what you need to emphasize is that did your scope increase? If you are managing bigger team or working on a more important project, even if they know your own salary, so what you're doing different things, right? In addition, if you know, if you can find out, okay? Everything I teach you is to find out those information, you've got to find out those information through influencing. If you can find out for your new team that the new team members are getting paid 20% higher than you are, you can ask for more money. The reason is that we need to have, first of all, when you have equal pay and the second, you're doing different things. So even if they know your own salary, that doesn't matter. You're thinking about different reasons when you negotiate. For PM, do I need to wait until successful launcher product before I ask for raise? So put this way, this depends on the scope change. You don't have to wait until successfully launcher product. As a PM myself, we also know that when we launch product is we do MNP and VP, different phases of launching product. It might take you several years to fully launch a very mature product. And the way you need to quantify this is that, well, my company in the past, you asked me to build three MEPs or work with five partners, whatever. That's part of your performance agreement session. However, because you're not able to, oh, sorry. Not only you hit everything you talk about bringing in like three partners or three MEPs, but you did five or 10, something like that. Your scope increase, when you build those products, you can also bring this up to your employers as we're speaking. You don't have to wait until complete launch a product. Caroline's question. HR usually will ask expect a salary before interview. Can you revise and negotiate expect salary after you get offered? Okay, good question. Again, you need to do your research.  If you don't know what the market value for your position to say that I will do some research, I will get back to you next time. I don't have the number right now, say it. If you throw down some wrong number, for example, you put on some number, I want 300 grand for this position.  Your impression is really bad in this process. I recommend you to not say anything. But if you accidentally say something that's ridiculous, if you know it is ridiculous, you can come back to change it. But I highly do not recommend to say anything ridiculous at the beginning. If you said it, yes, you can change it. Or you can also come back to say that I have competing offer. Yes, I want 150, but a competing offer is 170. You can also do 170, right? There's many different ways to do it. Again, negotiation is a dance, 50% of the time it's used, the other 50% of the time it's done. You need to read what's on the other side of the table. That's the most important part of negotiation. So, someone's speaking. Yeah? Hi, Leo, what's up? What's your question? So how do you know your colleague is a salary? How do you know how much money? Guys, as I said, negotiation is influenced in real life. Everything I teach you is truth, okay? I do this all the time. During drinks, I can make my coworkers to tell them they're salary. Not everyone, the success rate is not 100%. During social hours, some random guys will tell you they're salary. Sometimes when some, you have to build relationship with those guys first. Well, men and women. And sometimes when you're old coworkers, you really have a great relationship with that person. He's leaving the company. Then you can ask, of course, you say it in a nicer way. Saying, I felt I was underpaid. I'm not sure you have been in the company for so long at the lead. Do you mind to tell me your salary or whatever? Like that. But whenever you ask someone's salary, it's based on your prior relationship with that person, how you influence. I know how much my ex-co-worker getting paid. I know lots of salary information, even before I teach negotiation. So when you start to drill down negotiation's influence, everything starts to change. Yes. They tell me this during social hours. When they leave the company, they have great, we have a great relationship. They feel comfortable to tell me as well. That's the truth, yeah. Okay. What are the questions we have? Should we, when we have competing offers, should we ask for the same number or a little bit higher than that? Good question. You should package it together and saying that if you like your current company, if you like, let's say, if you want to work for Amazon, but Amazon's salary is lower than Google, right? You know, roughly it's like that. And then you tell Amazon that I really like your company. Can you make the offer as high as Google so that you bring this up? If you want to tell Google to give you a higher salary, but Amazon's offer is already lower, I don't think it's wise to ask Google to even increase the number again because Amazon's number is already lower. It just doesn't make sense, but you can ask Google to give you sign-on bonus. You say, oh, it's very difficult for me to move from Seattle to Silicon Valley. I like to hire sign-on bonus, right? So the entire package is different when you negotiate. All right. We have many questions. Oh my goodness. Okay, so guys, I'm teaching my book at three o'clock Boston time. I do need to leave, but I welcome new questions. I will leave my contact information. I also have a Facebook group that you can ask questions in my Facebook group that let me show you my contact information here again. Feel free to take a screenshot right now and I will continue to answer all your questions in the Facebook group, okay? Which is my own Facebook group and feel free to contact me offline as well. All right, I'm gonna see you guys next time and thank you very much. Sorry, we don't have time to answer all your questions, but those are really great questions. I need to jump. All right, talk to you soon. Thank you very much. Have a good day. Thank you Nancy. Thank you everyone. Let's meet maybe next week or the following week. Thank you. Have a good weekend. Bye. See you, bye.


I'm bringing you tips, tricks, hacks, secrets, whatever you want to call them. These are what I have learned through the past few years that have helped me so much perfect my makeup technique and I hope that you're going to enjoy all of these tips that I've rolled into this video for you. Let's get into it right now. Hi there friends. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with me today. I'm going to be going over a few tips and tricks that I have picked along the way that I have kind of developed for my more mature skin. These are really kind of special to me. More of my secrets and tips and tricks that I have developed just for myself personally. These are ones that I have kind of developed just because I'm 53 and I really feel like my skin changed, my eyes changed, my lips changed and I wanted to be able to look as youthful as I possibly could. Before we get started I want to let you know that I do have a numbering system that I use. I will put up a number somewhere in one of these corners right here that will be from one to however many products that I'm using. That number will go up as I'm using that product. Just remember that number or jot down that number. Go into the description box, open up the description box and next to the number that you jotted down you're going to find the link and the product and you will be able to see the product that you're interested in. Also I always love to share with you what I have on for a top and my jewelry today and I will share with you that these little earrings are so much fun.  Silver I think these are 925 silver along with the necklaces. These came separately. They are two different necklaces that I put together today. I can link those for you and of course my top I can show you a little bit right here. So the video is called Tiny Tweaks with Powerful Payoff for Makeup. Let's get into that video right now. Alright so the first tip that I'm going to share with you is actually one that I came up with out of necessity for my aging skin and particularly my aging neck. We all have this loose skin down here as we age. It's just one of those lovely things that we get and what I decided was I was going to find a way to make that look longer possibly disguise this a little bit so that it wasn't so badly seen and so that's where I decided to start experimenting with more contouring. I have a focal or contour right here. It's an 04 and I've really been enjoying this powder particularly the contour color is a nice color. You're not getting a warm warm color that's going to bring attention to that area.  Now I will leave a link to a brush that's pretty close to this. It's not the identical one but it's one that's very inexpensive on Amazon that you can get. So what I did was I started here on the actual chin part right up under the chin and I put powder there. Now this can go along the gel line. If you have really pronounced gels just put them right on top of there and kind of sweep it out a little bit. That's going to help disguise the gel line just a little bit as well. It's going to just give you more of a crisp looking gel line not gel line and it's going to really help that. Then you take the powder and you're just going to sweep it back and forth right there on the chin.  We're just creating an illusion of darkness right there underneath the chin. It really quickly will define your jawline and give you a crisp look to your neck. It's very simple. One, two, three and you're done. Okay tip number two. Take a look at that eyebrow on this side that's done. It has lifted that eye and framed that eye to where it looks like it's being lifted up and that's what you want to do with your eyebrow. You don't want to bring your eyebrow down on the tail here so that it gets pulled down. You don't want to leave them undone because obviously look it doesn't look like anything is happening up there. You don't want to do a very small line because that's kind of a dated look. You want to look as youthful as you can with your brows. In comes this product that I have been absolutely in love with and it is the Ulta Beauty Brow Tint and I have shown this just very recently but I'm in love with this product because of the size of the wand and also the product inside of here almost gives my brows a laminated effect. I have been re-growing my brows but they're still fairly sparse. There's not a ton there. There's some but there's not a ton there and I really want my brows to look more natural. Not just paint it in or even with the pen or anything. I want them to look as natural as possible but I need that to lift so that my eye looks lifted. So I'm going to take that. It's already loaded and please keep in mind once again. I say this often in my videos and I do it because I don't want anybody to think that I am nervous. I'm not nervous. I have a disability which is a palsy in my hands. In this instance the palsy actually shakes my hand so much that it helps me get those really fluffy brows. So we've got a little bit of a positive going on even though we have a disability.  What I do is I'm actually touching the skin. I want to get all of the product off the spoolie and onto my brow hair. And the other thing that I'm doing is I'm almost painting in the eyebrow and then I am not having to use three or four products or however many. I was using three I guess for a long time and I am just fluffing every single hair. When I come right here to the peak of my eyebrow I want to build that up quite a bit so that I have a little bit of a lift there. Again a little bit more lift and I'm just filling these in as much as I absolutely can. And then I'm going to go above them. Don't ever go below them. Go above them. So I just work with it. I mess around with it until it looks fairly close to the other one. I've said it a million times. We don't have twins for eyebrows. At least I don't. They're not even sisters. They might be cousins. Third cousins. Who knows? But they really don't have to be identical especially as we age. Embrace those little imperfections. Don't worry about them being so symmetrical. Now you can see how much that just raised that eye. The next tip I actually came across also out of necessity for a very long time on my channel. I was outlining the bottom of my eye underneath right there just with stark liners. I was actually water lining or tight lining in the water line with black or a bright color in there and then I was also lining. And it was just really making my eye look dark. It was making me look a lot older. Some of the videos that I have of older videos, they really, it didn't look that good. So today I'm taking from the Sephora Collection the Retractable Waterproof Eyeliner. This one is just in the color purple. It's really pretty. It's going to match my eye look really well. And then I have a Sigma E30. This is their pencil brush. And what I'm going to do is instead of taking the eyeliner all the way across, I'm just going to stay out here on the outer. It's not even a quarter. It's like an eighth. And I'm just going to put the liner in there. Sorry about the bouncing, the shaking. Just really pack that liner on in there. And I'm going to keep pushing it a little tiny bit. So there's a lot of liner in that corner right there. I'm pushing it just a little tiny bit towards where my eyeshadow goes up to. Now I'm going to take that brush and I'm just going to just gently and very lightly trail the shape of my eye just to soften it. But because I'm not bringing it all the way over, it still gives that beautiful lift to the eye that we all want. The next trick also came about out of necessity for me. As I aged, I noticed the skin right here kind of turning down and flapping down. And when I would outline my top lash line with anything, I would bring it out there. But what it was doing is if I brought it all the way out, especially if it's a black like I like, because I want it to be really close to my eyelashes to give my eyelashes a good look at the base, then it would really pull my eye down. That dark liner would make my eye look even more downturned. So now what I do is I go in and again. Here we go. I go in and I go as far in as I can on the inner corner. And then I'm just laying that eyeliner down. But I keep it about a quarter inch away from the outside. And this is a dark brown. This is the NYX Epic Ink Liner. And it is the brown color instead of the black color today, which I do like very much. So I'm just really tight lining without going underneath the lashes to do that. And in not bringing that liner all the way around, clear to the outer edge out here, the outer corner. I'm really keeping that lift because I'm not putting more darkness out there than just what my shadow is. So I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to do my mascara off of camera and I'll be right back. All right. So that eye is done. Some people don't like to have mascara on their bottom lashes.  But if you don't like it, you don't have to do it. This is just what I do. So I concentrated my mascara on these outer parts as well and really filled those in and tried to fluff them up and get those as long as possible to continue on with that lift. All right. The last tricks have to do with the lips. And I get a lot of really sweet compliments from you all on my lipstick. My lips are very thin as you can see here. But I have tricks that I do to make them look bigger. So I'm going to bring you in just a little bit. Now, the trick to doing the lips is having a good contour. That is the first part that you want to get down. If you get that down pat, everything else is going to seem so easy to do. So I use this one particularly from Maybelline because it's the gone grayish color. It's an automatic pencil. Oh, has a sharpener on the bottom and a smudger if you need it. But it definitely is a beautiful, perfect contour color that just gives you a shadow. You really don't want a color there unless you're wearing a bright, bright color lipstick that you really want to go for it with. That's okay. I'm not saying don't use anything but this because I use a ton of different liners.  So I'm going to do the lip liner without talking, but I will walk you through it in a voiceover. I started right here in the middle and I made that really big or underneath my lip, completely underneath and about a third of my whole entire lip I outlined underneath my lip. And then I did the same thing on the Cupid's bow where I went above. But once I got over here, I started to bring in that lip liner, putting the corners of the lips on the lip line and then matching it or meeting it with the part that you've overdrawn will help you to make that lip bigger. Now here's the trick that I want you to think about doing. And I know so many people said, why not a tissue? I do a piece of paper. The reason is is because when I use a tissue, it's usually too fluffy and I get little pieces of lint on there. You can also use a towel if you don't mind getting your lipstick on there, but paper works great. So just go in and blot.  But what you've also done is you've pressed it into the skin and now we're going to go and we're going to do on top of that again the same exact thing that we just did. Starting at the middle, we're overlining and now we're going to connect the edges or the corners of the mouth. Now what we've done is we've reinforced that lip liner to be on there and almost budge proof. Of course you're going to eat and whatnot and it's not going to be completely budge proof, but it's going to be pretty darn close. Now I chose to use a very bright pink lipstick today. This one is from Revlon. I believe it's one of their mattes and it's in primrose. Nope, it says it's a cream. Press your lips together to really pack it in there. And once again, I want you to take your paper and I want you to blot. Now that you've blotted and everything's kind of mixed together, go back in one more time. And now you have a super budge proof once again lippy. And you can stop there if you want to. I usually don't stop there because I'm a girl that loves her lip gloss. This is from Sephora and this is one of my favorite ones. It's called the Glossed Glosses. And I believe this one is in Wild. And as you can see in the tube right there, it kind of looks like it has some pink, purple, blue, reflect. Once you get it on your lips, all it does is brighten up whatever lipstick you're wearing. And I'm just going to strategically place that right in the middle, blot. And then I'm going to put it on again, blot again. That's how I get a much more juicy looking lip than I actually have. My lips almost look double the size and there's no fillers. There's no nothing going on there. But I love this look and I love that contour. I hope that you did enjoy seeing some of the tips that I have found over the years that have helped me feel very flawless with my makeup. And once you get these down, they're like second nature, they take you just a couple minutes. Keep in mind that I was in teaching mode. When I get in teaching mode, it gets a little bit more in depth because I want you to be able to see everything and the reason that I do it. So if you did enjoy this, please give it a thumbs up. I would really appreciate that as you are on your way out of here. Thanks so much for joining me today. And as we go, I'm going to throw up a video right here of maybe some more tips and tricks that you would enjoy. So go over and check those out and see if there anything that you can use as well. I love you all very much. I hope that you're doing very well and I'll catch you in my next video. Goodbye my friends.


In this video, I'm going to show you how to use your stream deck to toggle on your Nanlite, Pavotubes, or any other Nanlites for that matter. Hello, and welcome to Take One Tech, and my name's Alec, and in this video I'm going to be taking you on a little bit of a journey of automation, because there isn't a direct link as far as I know between stream deck and Nanlite, but there is a way that you can do it. And it's not actually that tricky, it's just a few different steps that you've got to follow. So hopefully I shall be laying all of that out in a very clear and easy to understand manner, hopefully easier to understand than it is to say. But what am I talking about? Well, in my case, it is these Nanlite Pavotubes 6C's, the ones that I've got at the back that are illuminating the wall to give me the color on the otherwise gray wall behind me. I did do a video all about these, which I'll leave in the top corner, where I explain the, well I'll do a bit of an unboxing, an unboxing of a re-boxed light. But then I also explained the upgrade process to upgrade the firmware and how to get those working with the Nanlink app, which I'll be coming onto in a moment. Now Nanlite do actually make a number of different lights, so not just these ones. And I will be getting around to replacing the other lights in my studio, so my key lights and, well it's not really a hairlight, but you can get the point. So let's have a little look at some of the other lights that they've got. As well as the RGB tubes, so I've got the Pavotubes 6C's, which are around about 30 centimeters, 12 inches long, but then there is some other length ones of those as well. Who knows, maybe I'll upgrade some of those at some point. But these are the ones that I'll be looking at, something like this, the 60B or something for my key light at the front on either side of me. So there is quite a range of professional grade lights, and with these you wouldn't need to worry so much about the colors or anything like that that you've got going on. So that is a little bit about Nanlite, and as I say, there is an app that you can use to control them that is for the mobile that you can get on iOS. And I believe Android, and that is called the Nanlink app. So let's have a quick look at that. And this is the Nanlink app. I did talk about this at length on the other video I did. So it enables you to go in, set up different scenes rather, can't speak today. Pick different colors and things like that. Make any adjustments that you want to do and basically control all of the controls that you've got on the lights themselves. You've then got those on the mobile app. So that's fine. The issue that I had with the mobile app was it works over Bluetooth. And I found that sometimes the connection wasn't so stable. It was once it was connected, it was fine. But then if I went out somewhere with my phone and then came back to the studio, sometimes the connection wouldn't immediately connect or you'd have to press the thing to reconnect. And so it just wasn't there that I could just easily go with a push of a button, just get them on, which is ultimately what I was after. So I thought, well, there must be another way. Well, fortunately in Monterey and onwards in Mac OS, we can now run iOS apps on the Mac OS desktop itself. And so in fact, that little snapshot that I showed you there, that's actually rather than the iOS app store, that's actually the Mac app store. And so you can just get the NanLink app, just search for NanLink. I'll obviously leave a link in the description, but you can just download it from there. Now it does say design for iPhone and also not verified for Mac OS, but I can tell you, I have verified it, it does work. So it does certainly do what it's intended to do. One thing you will have to do though is we're at installation, it will prompt you to go to your system preferences, go to your security and privacy section. And then in here, you'll need to go to your Bluetooth section. And then from there, you'll need to come down and just make sure the NanLink app does have access to your Bluetooth, because as I say, it is controlled over Bluetooth. From there, you basically go through exactly the same setup process as I covered in that previous video. So going in and adding lights and fixtures. And what you'll then have is you'll have something that looks a little bit like this. So here, if I just drag it up where you can see it, that might be helpful. Get that one out of the way. This is basically the NanLink app. And here, basically, I've got my two lights, pavo left, pavo right, very originally named.   And then now the other one has gone off. Both lights are now off. You can see the little strike through the light bulb icon. And now if I toggle them both back on, whoops, it's Daisy. And then toggle that one back on, they've both come back on again. So that is basically how this app works. It's as simple as that. I'm not going to be creating lots of different scenes for different lighting conditions and things like that. I literally just want to be able to come in. And when I want to start recording, I can just basically press a button and have them both come on. So when these are switched off, basically the lights themselves are still technically on. They're plugged into a power supply. And so the little screen is on. It's just that the brightness is then set to zero. So there's no actual light coming out of them. So I will be leaving the lights on all the time. It's just that I'm then going to be able to toggle the actual light on and off, if that makes sense. I'm probably making a bit too much of an explanation after that. But anyway, I'll move on. So that is basically how the Nanolink app works. So the way that I figured that I would do this and actually automate this is using one of my favorites, of course, keyboard maestro. So what I'm going to do is talk you through the steps involved to automate this process in keyboard maestro. And then once we've done that, it's just another short step to then add in the stream deck integration so that I can do it with the push of a button. I've done a whole series of videos about keyboard maestro, so I'm not going to go over everything in keyboard maestro or a full introduction of it. So I'll leave a link to some of my keyboard maestro stuff just up above my head. But what I'll do here is I'll just start from fresh with this macro and I'll talk you through all of the steps that I've done to actually create this. So here we go at the bottom. I'm going to click on the little plus icon to create a new macro. I'm going to give it a name and I'm just going to call it Nanlink. And then what I'm going to do is I'm going to start adding in some actions. I'm not going to add any triggers because I'm actually going to trigger this with stream deck. The first action that I want to do, in fact, let me just pull this Nanlink app down here so that we can see it next to it. The first thing I want to do is actually just basically open up or activate the Nanlink app. And that is done using the command activate. So if I come here and type in activate, you'll see we've got activate a specific application. What that does is if the program is not open, it will open it. If it is open, then it will just make it the frontmost active application. So I'm going to click on that one, double click rather, and it will bring it down here. And then I get the option to choose which application I want to activate. Now I want to activate the Nanlink app. And normally if you have a look here, you can see a list of active applications. And if I was to click in here, then I would see the list and I'd just go down to pick out Nanlink. I'm not sure why, but maybe it's something to do with this being an iOS app running on the Mac. But instead of Nanlink, it actually says Nanlink and then it says translocated location or something like that. Translocated with a little explanation mark. So what I've done instead, just in case that is an issue, is instead I've gone down to other and I've actually picked out the application itself from the finder. So if I type in here Nanlink, there is the app. So as I say, I'm not entirely sure that that's totally necessary, but I just wanted to be sure it was activating the correct application. Now if the application was open but minimized in the finder, or sorry, in the dock I should say, then this wouldn't necessarily actually open the window up so that the window appears here. So what we do want to do is just make sure we check this one here that says reopen initial windows. And by checking on that, then if I minimize this window now and then I click on the run button at the top, it's basically going to bring it to the front and also make sure it's up on the screen. So that's the first step. Now what we want to do is we want to actually simulate the clicking of these two icons here. And the way that I'm going to do that, you can actually in keyboard maestro have it find a specific image on the screen and go and click that, which is very useful if you're doing things like logging into a particular website, you want to click on an icon, click on a button or something like that. But because we've got the same icon twice, what I'm actually going to do is I want to click on a specific location on the screen instead. So the way that I will do that is come down here and click on new action. And then from here, we want to basically simulate a mouse click. So if I type in mouse, you can see that we've got this one here, move or click mouse. Double click on that one to add it into our macro. Now here, you can basically, you could add modifier keys if you want. So if you need to do stuff like option click or command click, then you have the option to do that. We don't need any of that. You also have the option to do things like either click, double click, just move the mouse to a particular place or click and release, triple click, things like that. We just want to click, obviously. The next one you've got is also the left button, but you could also change that to be the right button, center button. If you've got multiple buttons, you can do that as well. So you can get really technical with this if you've got lots of different complex commands that you want to do with mouse clicks. If you want to simulate a particular workflow you've got. But we're going to stay simple and all we want to do is literally just come over here and click on this icon. Now, what we can do is we can define the exact position that we want to click. And you can do this in a number of ways. You can either do it relative to the front window, which is what we want to do because we've made this nanolink app now the front window. So we want to click on a position relative to a corner of that window. This will hopefully make sense in a moment. In fact, let me just go and do this one first and then I'll explain the other options for clicking because we do actually want to do this one. We want to click basically on a position relative to this top corner of the window. Why do we want to do that? Well, because if we had moved this window somewhere else previously and then we minimized it and then it got maximized as part of this or rather opened up again, then we would want to make sure we were still clicking on the correct place relative to the corner rather than just the same place on the screen, which might then not have the app in it. Hope that makes sense. So the way that we actually record the position, you can see here that we've actually got a point from relative to the left-hand side and also relative to the top. So the way that we actually get that, rather than getting our little pixel measure out and measuring how many pixels it is across and down, all we do is we just click on this get button here. There's a bit of a countdown and if I come over here and just make sure I'm clicking in the right place, it will just record that position. So it's now recorded where my mouse was and it's recorded it relative to the top left corner of this window. So it was 214 pixels from the left and 129 pixels from the top. So that is basically it. So if I was to run this now, you'll see that it is basically just toggling that one light on and off. So now all we need to do is repeat that for the other one. So what I'm going to do here is I'm actually just going to duplicate. So this is a quick way to do this. If you've got something in action already, you can just duplicate it. I will just mention the other ways. I mentioned you could actually do it relative to other things. So we've got the front windows top left corner, but you can do it relative to any other corner. You can also do it relative to the front window center. You can also do it in the same way relative to the main screen. So if you've got a 1920 by 1080 display, you can do it relative to the top corner or bottom corner, whichever one you wanted, or relative to the center of the screen. You can also do it relative to a specific image. So keyboard maestro can actually look for a particular image on the on the screen. And then you can do it relative to that as well. So again, if you've got something that's related to a particular logo or graphic and you need to click somewhere relative to that, then you can do that as well. But we do just want it relative to the top corner of that particular window. So all I'm going to do now is I'm just going to click on this one again because I need to update this position with the new position. This time for the second light. So if I click on here, I'll just make sure I'm clicking in the right place. And that is now recorded that position. So we've got this one 214 from the left and 129 from the top. This one is happens to be 210 from the left and 184 from the top. So this now, if I run this, you should see that in fact I need to just turn this one off.  So both lights are now off. And if I click on the little run command at the top, then you can see that it's gone and switched them both on. And you will have also noticed that my mouse just kind of miraculously moved over to that side as well. So if I come back to run and do that again, you'll notice that the mouse just appears over in the other position. And now both of the lights are off. One last thing that I wanted to do was I did want to actually just minimize this after it opened it up so that if it was minimized in the dock, it wouldn't just remain on the screen. So all I did here was I actually run a specific command. So here I did the minimize from the Nanolink window menu. There are other ways of doing this, but this is the way that I did it. So the way that I did it was a new action and this is a menu command. So we basically want to activate a specific menu. So show or select menu item. And then the menu item I wanted was if I come down to menu, you can basically just go down to find the application Nanolink, go to the window and then minimize. So now that is going to minimize it. One thing I also did was just in case there is a slight delay required, I actually added a little bit of a pause in between these two. So the way I did that was came up here and typed in pause and then drag that in and just figured that half a second would be more than enough and yet not really noticeable for me. So now when I press the run command up here, what you'll see is that this now actually toggles the lights in this case back on and then the window just minimizes. So now we've got the window minimized and if I run it again, you'll see that the window opens up, the lights go off and then it disappears again. So that is basically how we set up the keyboard maestro command. So let's just switch the lights back on, shall we? And then what I'll do now is I'll show you how to actually assign this to Stream Deck.  And there is the icon that I've already created, but I'm going to do it again for you just here. In order to do this, the best plugin to use to my mind is not actually the built-in keyboard maestro plugin for Stream Deck, but rather one called KM Link. And to get that, just click up here on the Stream Deck store, this little button just up at the top, come into the Stream Deck store, come into plugins, and then just search for KM Link or one word. Whoops, if I can spell it right. And this is it. It's for executing keyboard maestro macros. You'll find that then on this right-hand side of all the macros. It doesn't actually come in its own folder in the same way that you do for other things like Zoom or PowerPoint or things like that. It basically comes in this one custom because there is only one command for it. So you just come down here and then you've got this one KM Link. And then this is really easy to use. All you do is you just come and select the name of the macro and hopefully when you've just set up a keyboard maestro macro, it will tell you here the last modified macro and what the name of it was. So in this case, it's this Nanolink one. And so now when I press that button, that will then activate that macro, which is toggling the lights on and off. And so that is how you can then control your Nanolink lights with keyboard maestro and Stream Deck. So as I said at the beginning, a little bit of a workaround, but once it's set up, I now don't need to worry about it. And when I come in, I can just press this button, my lights come on and go off as I need them. I hope you have found that useful. If you did, then as ever, don't forget to like and subscribe. And as always, you can always head over to my Buy Me A Coffee page to support the channel either on a one-off or ongoing basis as well. So that's all for this video, but I will leave a link to some more of my Stream Deck videos over on the right hand side for those that are interested. So stick around, plenty more coming up.