's still yeah sure i'll put it to that thank you like russell brand is the male gwyneth peltrow you know maybe joe rogan is a bit but joe rogan i at least believe that he believes what he's saying whereas russell brand i don't believe that he believes what he's saying well what lynch might call the duck's eye the point within the point it seemed to me that what you were saying is that our culture is incapable of coming up with new and novel and innovative content and it's kind of like a tomb raider dragging cadavers from the soil reanimating them and then not even respecting them it is that the essence of your perspective on sort of mainstream movie franchises and what do you think that tells us more broadly so like we have to be asking ourselves why is russell brand a guy who literally only does like conspiracy shit now and like literally just like i'm going on rumble and i'm going to be very critical of vaccines in a way that is not allowed on youtube right like that's that's his whole shtick for him to have on like the critical drinkers like what does that tell you right i'm not gonna say like oh that means critical drinkers content what does that tell you but like a lot of it kind of feeds into the same audience you know it's that indeed that is yep as much as that may they may be crossover and everything it's just like but isn't then equal reason in a cynical sense the russell brand would bring on big figures that are willing to come on uh yeah but if they can't have a conversation about the same like kind of culture worse stuff that he regularly talks about then there's really no point just kind of what i was getting at i mean they don't talk about you know he doesn't really i don't i don't know i don't know if he has many conversations that aren't kind of explicitly aiming towards just doing things that his audience wants to hear but like he he had i could be wrong i could be wrong but he had an avenue in this conversation being an actor or he does bring it up at some points like he's talking to drinker about the nature of yeah he doesn't really do that much anymore no of course but he talks to drinker about like even the ather remake right and how that went very bad and that the he they talk for a little bit about how that's like almost part of the course with a lot of projects these days like i feel like there's an avenue here that he would bring drinker on for both monetary benefit exposure and for uh he can talk to him he knows what drinker's talking about he's familiar with the industry and i think he is a fan of his channel he's at least seen his videos i'm just saying that there's a lot of explanations for why he would i i don't even know it i'm i'm not even confident russell brand has ever heard of him before i feel like that could be the case but that he did at least watch some of his videos so there's something he has to like a couple like if he was at least he at least knows what kind of questions to ask him about of his content in a way that feeds into both of their demographics at the same time if i had like a um a person setting up interviews and stuff and they were emailing different people and they got access to a five million uh youtube reviewer person that i'd never heard of or seen the videos of i might you know jump in briefly and then find out what they mainly talk about and then i can ask them about that like i guess what i'm trying to say is they can be a lot more of a disconnected reason for him to come on doesn't have to be that the there's big crossover with their audience in relation to conspiracies yep perspective drinker i think that's wildly wrong because that metaphor you just gave me would have at least been entertaining unlike this movie uh no i like i i think uh we are definitely stuck in a rut as a culture when it comes to just um relying on the past and just like hey man i i can't believe that he said that because isn't that all of his content just saying like movies in the past were better taking up old ideas like you say um bringing back old characters no actors i think that's well we we went over it it's it's the it depends yeah it depends if you're if you're uh media landscape is studio movies or all movies is really just the well it could be both studio movies and all movies and that you're making the commentary about studio movies yeah um and at the same time like that he he misses the days of old for creation of movies not for uh he wants to see more of luke and indiana jones and stuff just kind of humiliating them on screen i'm trying i mean like i think the critical drinker and i agree on this that like they're rehashing old ip's and you need to have new ideas and it would be better if risks were taken like i i think that there are some basic things that we could agree on for sure maybe we have like different political leanings and different interpretations of things in the long run right to use them as this weird springboard to launch like a new generation of characters but they're never any good they're always unlikable idiots who are just um bore people to tears they're never any good they're always unlikable idiots that just bore people to tears like i think that that's a man like it's not untrue what he's saying but it just it reflects like a very narrow media diet you know it reflects a very narrow consumption of films which is always like that that's that's like most of the issue i have with like you know the the types of reviews that the critical drinker makes are kind of like the types of reviews that like ben Shapiro makes where it's like you're you're subjecting yourself to like very few films in a year like of course you're going to be mad at them and that's that's something you do you feel the same way about what did you say that you uh no i can see he exposes himself to more films than i previously thought you're not you're not really going outside of your what what is it called like a your purview your peripherals you know you're not really like trying to experience the best films in a year if all you're gonna say um i know this sounds a bit weird but if there were if you maybe feel there are particular movies that you've come across that you'd love to get more of a spotlight so you think they're incredible um i can of course pass them on okay so things that i think he would like um theoretically yeah but like if it's something that you're not even sure he would like but you just think it's so fucking good it needs to be seen more than i can you know you can try it with him sort of thing okay gonna watch us like the new indiana have you seen the raid the raid do you say the raid the raid were damp oh yeah yeah right okay good so the raid that one's got a lot of people know about that at this point yeah our worries and you know it's been a problem we've lost the ability to create new innovative stuff what we do and i'm sure he would argue and say like he saw the whale right but that's also like a big internet known movie right it's just reiterating the things that have been done before and i think he loved free guy also you can apply it to movies hey we all like movie you like shazam too right yeah but i mean i mean i made a review of it sit it's okay it's okay overall yeah it's fine it's fine yeah yeah tv shows music like i think he did love our i think he actually recommended that he loves free guy and our thing like we're just uh we're just recycling the same things we've done so many times already it's such a sad thing to look back on like generations from now they're gonna look back on this time and just think of it as the time when everyone just lost their imagination they lost their spirit free i disagree because i think it's only gonna get worse i disagree with what he's saying of like oh generations are gonna look back at this time and you know be like oh this is when they lost their imagination like it's gonna get a lot the trend is going in one direction i could buy it as a potential that it could get worse um i'm not sure because i don't know we'll see um i feel like there's arguments you can make one way or the other um the the way of things getting worse would probably be if well i mean i don't know like the ai stuff future with ai and just general trends but at the same time a lot of these films that you could say it as you know computer generated before computer generated right these factory assembly line like big budget films a lot of them are struggling this year and last year two actually so like and they can't keep losing money forever right something's gotta change um i mean damn has disney had like a film that could honestly be considered successful this year except for guardians or is it just guardians uh ant man i don't know you can't you ant man you can't say was successful little mermaid maybe broke even maybe but is that even good it depends how you define because if the little mermaid you can't just count the sales of the film you have to count the sales of the original but this film as well this film served as an advertisement to yeah they have disney stores and all the fucking i guess the only thing you can use as a point of reference is lion king made like 1.56 billion and Aladdin and beauty in the base made like 1 billion 1.1 yeah it was not as success off that so yeah and then of course yeah it's like they're they're post covid's not doing too well pixar hasn't had a successful film at the box office since toy story four post covet disney is not doing good yeah well i i guess the point being that um given that like what do you what do you kind of anticipate in terms of shifts at these because it's not just them right it's like Warner brothers in terms of like dc films um i think a great year for them what do you think what do you think changes in the next i mean well uh the mario movie was a huge hit it was so fast we're gonna see some video make a lot of money fast x didn't make a lot of money compared to its budget anyway i'm i'm just saying i'm saying when something explodes like the mario movie that's the studio uh and the last one was really successful too so and they're they're gonna they're gonna look at that and just be like ooh what do we do that's like the mario movie so well like well we'll see we'll see some video game adaptations maybe we'll see i don't know we'll we're gonna get into a different trend you know it might not be superhero shit who knows um yeah well we're kind of in a transitionary period so we kind of just have to see what what's going on there's a lot of weird like the making of biopic kind of like origin story movies coming out right now but they're all like direct to streaming they're like is the origin of beanie babies or flaming hot cheetos a blackberry right that's that's another one and then it was black bear i i want to take issue with blackberry being lumped in that because matt johnson's a real artist that created something before it was a trend and then unfortunately all these yeah his his film got got made before it started being a trend and i just want to point out that that's a really no i would i would recommend tetris yeah i was just thinking about the subject about yeah you'd very much like tetris yeah i would yeah i think it is informative and entertaining it's not like i think i think i saw the trailer and thought it looks worth checking out yeah it's a lot it's a kind of a movie that you know you'd be like oh good luck with that one being successful because it's going to take a lot of people promoting it to get it well that was apple that was apple tv i think that one yeah that's why no one knows about it for well it's it's strange because apple tv i think has been gone for like three four years and they've made a lot of stuff and i think there's a lot of money behind it but like there's like nobody really talks about anything yeah i don't know what's up it's also bullshit it's also a fucking bad streaming service they refuse to make an android app because they're you know yeah like so you can't even watch out on a plane if you have an android because you can only access it through browser i don't think any of their shits in 4k if it is it certainly didn't look like it their frame rates all fucked on my tv yeah i got it for free with like a frame range thing and so yeah like what i don't know what the fuck it's a terrible streaming service well i mean some of these streaming services have got to die right like they can't all they can't all last forever we're we're entering the age of people going back to piracy which is fine well it's just seemingly each of the streaming services is struggling to become profitable even the most successful like disney plus isn't profitable and that one of the most successful ones you're saying disney plus is not profitable i believe disney plus loses them a lot of money each quarter uh because do we have their their subscriptions are down seven and a half percent from last quarter i can't remember i remember i'm sure i'm sure their subscriptions are down i don't know if i buy it's not profitable uh damn i i remember reading it i don't think it is uh all i hear is that it's having big trouble this is this is something that i that uh disney expects it to be profitable by the end of the fiscal year 2024 so it's not that i mean a strategy for a lot of streaming services is growth growth growth growth and then sometime down the line when you already have hundreds of millions of people subscribed you need to find a way to transition it into being profitable you gotta pay for the infrastructure and then you gotta pay for like contracts for the content and then develop these services too the services are expanded to run the infrastructure yeah which which disney plus is like a better running service than apple tv plus so well i i guess the point being that if you have because it's netflix there's uh amazon prime disney plus peacock apple tv what's the other one i think is really hurting wow it's i i wonder i wonder if it's got because do people understand that that's universal like do people understand that peacock is universal or do they associate it more with nbc well i just learned what it was a second ago so okay well i think they had a on video game adaptations a twisted metal tv show i think came out yeah that's right all right let's keep watching not to not to tangent at all it's just metal just every message saying apparently xqc lost a million dollars in gambling like what just now it's a tuesday like i was going to say it actually doesn't matter every fucking day it's fucking crazy it literally doesn't matter he loses a million dollars fucking opening his mouth i don't know where i was going i lose a million it's funny i still understood what you were saying it's not going back to me that's very interesting that you take it to something as essential as the spirit of creativity we're gonna get ai art in the next like five years we're gonna get like competent ai generated movies in the next like 10 years right itself i've got young daughters they're five and six their favorite band is the spice girls like we listen to the spice all right can you pause here yep so this is something where from my interpretation when you DM'd me that i think that you misinterpreted what was said here so i just want to i want the okay i want i want us to pay close attention to the words here and also this is this is a question that he asks later again in the interview and critical drinker says two things one of them a bit more explicitly the second time i didn't have the time stand i didn't have the time to figure out what time stamps were but so we can just keep that in our memory it's getting dropped off at the school like similar age they will listen into the spice girls it doesn't even even something in the culture which i think at the time i would have certainly regarded as a sort of a commodity even though it had a great deal of spirit and there's aspects of the spice girls i like the details i certainly won't be going into right now what i'd like to say is that it's odd that even something that's commercial you know we're not talking about like jones yet we're talking about the spice girls you can i mean okay i understand what you're saying you can say that i have said that depending on what culture you're in depending on like what you're exposed to like there's still new things that like newer generations are being exposed to right like you know the spice girls wasn't like the cutoff point for creativity in music or like even catchiness in music right like me as a child my brother as a child like we were exposed to like what my dad listened to like he listened to a bunch of 70s music right so for you to say like oh my daughters listen to the spice girls because i showed them the spice girls and also their friends listen to the spice girls because their parents showed them the spice girls that's just indicative of you being from a generation that listened to the spice girls and also other generations of parents having children that listened to the spice girls right like there were plenty of kids my age when i grew up in my brother's age that listened to 70s shit because their parents showed them that right that doesn't mean that they didn't listen to new shit right yeah i think that's totally fair russle yeah there's plenty of reasons why they might be listening to the spice girls those kind of commodities aren't being replaced and also we've like glastonbury elton john being the sort of closing act it makes you wonder well where's it gonna go now do you think this is because of economics do you think it's all right i thought he was leading into a question that i was familiar with there isn't a new raft of movie styles coming in what the fuck are you talking about you're not watching the right movies is the problem this is what pisses me off about this this is the same so uh before listen so your understanding of saying there aren't movie stars do you take it to be a strict definition of very popular actors i'm right now i'm confused as to him saying stars or styles on my stream i i responded as if he said styles and now listen listening to this multiple times i think he meant stars but he says it in a way that's like his accent it's kind of difficult to tell but i think he meant stars and critical drinker responds as though he uh was talking about stars yeah so my actual answer my actual commentary on this is after critical drinker talks because i heard russle brand say something else and i'm talking about styles and not stars for reason i was pissed off like when people were acting like crazy rich agents was like oh yeah finally we can have Asian people in the movie i'm like i'm trying to recommend like fucking korean movies this entire time like telling people to watch this shit you know like like i get it it's different it's like Asian American whatever like i've updated my perspective on that but it's it is frustrating as a person that is actively seeking out art and like trying to find experiences that are meaningful and like purposeful to me and then people are acting as if those those experiences don't exist when they just like they don't even make the effort and they don't even try to like see these things out like you know thank fucking christ parasite got as popular as it did you know like but part of the problem is like it literally takes the movie being such a big hit and like winning best picture for like people to see it like it has to spread so vigorously through not only word of mouth but through like heavy advertising right whereas like people just like i don't know why people are so scared to like go to a film festival why people are so scared to like watch i mean uh as much as i i want to agree with you completely like there is a fairness of understanding the average person doesn't treat movies this way they treat them as like in the same way we treat a lot of things in life which like sort of go in go out and do other things not like living i'll agree there but i think i think that there's a large amount of people that want something more out of a movie that are looking for more out of a movie and if if the the if the barrier towards accessing uh smaller independent films was the same degree as the barrier towards accessing smaller independent video games then we'd see a very different landscape we'd see very different conversations and more people would be getting what they want but like um the average person looks to someone like drinker or at times someone like uh i was gonna say like pretty much anybody and they want advice because they don't want to spend time looking they want people to tell them where to go and of course mainline theaters are going to have all the mainstream movies uh something like the whale i think i wanted to see that the second you recommended it and i was like how do i see this like you will be able to for like a year i was like oh cool but obviously i could go theoretically unless you go to film festivals yeah um i just uh there's something that i think makes a lot more sense for my sort of area but the average person i just i don't really uh film festivals are publicly available no i know but like i'm trying to say like do you think the average person is like yeah i'll go because how many films do you watch on average per day in a film festival as many as you want but for me personally like three but you you can watch one movie and then leave but you can you know of course but like there's a lot of factors right like there's the the travel the cost the time for any normal person there's film festivals happening fucking everywhere people act as if like they're not all over like it really there's a there's a london film festival there's there's fucking atlanta film festival there's vancouver film festival there's like seattle every major city has a film festival pretty much uh they don't all have the exact same lineup but there's a surprising amount of good shit that you can find at like most uh film festivals yeah um but like it just sounds like you you you find it like hypocritical but you would you buy the argument if they said to you that they're not they're not doing that they've not got the time and patience for it that they want to get recommendations from someone else uh i'm not sure that question is what we were i'm not i'm not sure what that question is i'm confused it doesn't necessarily contradict anything you've said previously i'm just assuming that would be a position you agree with wait i'm sorry we gotta go back okay wait back in the video or back up so you were saying uh no just like wait so let's just repeat the question uh would you be would you understand a person that tells you they love film but they're not spending any time on discovering it they're gonna look at recommendations instead um yeah which is which is something that i acknowledge in part of why my channel exists when i say i don't know why people are so afraid to go to a film festival that's not a statement directed at the critical drinker specifically that's a statement directed at like the general audience i wish part of what i try to do to my you know that's part that's part of what i do on my channel is to help people get more comfortable with the idea of doing something like that and help to legitimize it and popularize it and have it become a normal part of film conversations instead of star wars i mean i assume you agree that a healthy media diet would also include maybe reading some books playing games uh watching tv shows here and they're trying to spread out a bit in all forms of media and in the same vein i doubt people who love books go to so to speak book fairs or video game conventions necessarily they could and you could encourage them to to discover more but they you wouldn't necessarily you know compel them to no no no no no but but movies movies are particular here because again with books are the exact same way as video games are any exact same way where like music is where self-publishing is like the easiest fucking thing in the world you can put your own like critical drinker publishes book on kindle or amazon or whatever right like and you can just share it to your audience and people can find it that way right it's a different barrier with movies and that's why i feel like film festivals are beneficial and necessary at least for now maybe they won't have to be forever but right now that's how you expose yourself to interesting new subversive challenging artists and you know actual creators that aren't just doing whatever the studio thinks will be the most profitable thing at any given point in time right so that's why i talk about that way with film uh and i i don't think that that really applies to video games music and books like no one no one's saying like uh all books why modern books are bad right because we don't have that same issue when it comes to the barriers for people to access them and people to get exposed to them um so that conversation that's the case because movies just tend to be the most talk to file cultural event even though video games seem to be the ones that have the most engagement which is kind of interesting um it's it's not it's not to do with how much it's talked about it's it's to do with the barriers that are put up by studio interest and ownership of movie theaters like when you play a game it's on your computer you don't there's no gigantic let you you don't have to go to the fucking amc gaming room where they get to decide which fucking games you play right there's it's entirely different barriers of entry and accessibility so that that's oh and it's worth mentioning drink is not self published um he's not but it doesn't change your point um the yeah the the the nature of it to me though i i would assume is uh could you argue the other direction that the fact that you can i have so much access to all kinds of video games music and books without having to go to film festivals necessarily is probably part of the explainer why people are uh much more ready to engage in something like that and reasonably speaking that's exactly what i'm saying yeah well that's why i'm saying it's which is why i'm trying to make people more comfortable yeah i'm trying to make it less stigmatized and less like you know the the taking the first step into doing something is the hardest part of doing it right cool the the whole idea of like building it up what you were saying earlier like you know the travel the time the blah blah blah blah a lot of those things you don't really have to consider depending on which festival you go to or how you do it um you know location or like you can make it a part of another trip anyway if you want to like if you're thinking of visiting vancouver because you think like oh i would like to visit vancouver someday maybe plan it around the film festival or something if the film festival thing doesn't fucking work out you can just have a nice vacation if you if you you know fuck that up but there's really not you know as you get there's subreddits for like there's a tiff subreddit where people ask each other questions unlike you know like should i buy this type of ticket pack or like what should i expect for this you know like there is a know-how to certain festivals but really the barrier of entry is not um it's it's it's more intimidating than it actually is and i'm gonna say i don't like to help break down that personally i don't think it's about discomfort or intimidation i assume it's almost explicitly just i'm not doing that i got time for that apathy yeah i think that's a part of the same thing i think that's a part of the same thing if people if people don't see a good enough reason to do it they're not gonna be interested in it right part of that is is to say like hey you could get you could see the whale fucking six months early if you just see it in fucking vancouver film festival there's still tickets i tried to get fucking charlie moist critical to come to vancouver for that but then he's he's scared of playing so oh couldn't do it well um yeah which i didn't know before and then he's made videos about so i just uh for me i guess what i'm trying to get at is i i wouldn't see it as a problem if someone said i had dual film but i ain't going to film festivals if i if i went to london film festival i don't know where how close you are but if i went to london film festival and i picked out some movies or whatever with you would you go with me um we could talk about it baby sounds like it could be fun watch an indie movie all right but you understand the main reason i'd want to do that is to do it with you not because i'm going there in general oh yeah and if and if that's if that's what it takes for you to show up and be like oh this is actually pretty cool and not intimidating and there's some good shit here and you know you might want to do it again the next year you know be more engaged and more interested in in the type of media you consume like why are people so like it seems like nobody fucking talks about the shit that's interesting to me and that's part of what's frustrating about this you know of the culture is that because of technology and of course i know those two things are inextricably linked but what do you put it down to yeah i mean i think um the the last movie star that we have still active really know that tom cruise it's possible coming out soon that's probably gonna do really well this summer top gun man what do you mean by movie sir do you mean action star so uh what i'll give you here is that he's not been asked by russle to explain exactly what he means but my assumption i don't even i don't know if he's uh necessarily made this explicit in videos but obviously i talked to him for like a good five hours per week about all these subjects i believe he's specifically referring to uh actors that are able to sell a movie on their acting sort of uh reputation alone that they are a guarantee of entertainment on their own and that that's gone um i i i go into further detail about this in the stream so i guess i'll hold off on my comments until that point tom cruise isn't the last movie star maybe he's the last person like i i think i feel like that's a real generational bias when you say that tom cruise is the last movie star like ryan gosseling is gonna be like pretty fucking famous by the time he's like 50 60 something right like if he isn't all i've noticed that my you you mentioned ryan gosseling i've noticed that my mom for whatever reason has taken quite an interest in watching a lot of ryan gosseling movies on like netflix streaming services he's been big for a while he's like a i find this one an interesting point because tom cruise has been you could say like a movie star since he was in his 20s ryan gosseling is in its 40s so but then you also say like well yeah maybe when he's 50 he'll be one almost it kind of sounds like that's what you said i find that strange i feel like but i also sorry go for it go for it i also i also think that there's like a bit of a disconnect between how we view the term movie star because i think a lot of people that might be brought up as examples by critical drinker or anyone else making this argument would be people like tom cruise jackie chan you know like arnold sorts of nigger like a lot of these a lot of these people aren't necessarily just movie stars but like they also come with the the the whole package of like ooh they do their own stunts or ooh like they're like this huge bodybuilder sort of thing so i get that in the sense of like this weird parasocial celebrity star power like we're not i don't know if we're going to see another michael jackson in the music industry i don't know if that means that music's getting worse right i think that let people over time are becoming less uh uh tricked or less um i think people over time are learning a bit more about uh celebrities and culture in a way where they're not like attached to it in this weirdly parasocial way or uh i think that's maybe celebrity culture is like dying down at least to the average person i don't know if average is the right word maybe it's i think that it's becoming more popular to not care as much about celebrity culture i think that that is a growing thing well i think it's more become like influencer based and internet based and in that kind of thing maybe that's pulled away some of the attention from what it used to be which was you know movie stars but now that you know technology and social media and the way that we interacted with those things socially it's become more of the um the the tiktok youtube internet influencer that kind of celebrity sort of thing well either yeah kind of the question depends on the generation and it depends on the demographic maybe we're just more split what do you if uh if the movie star as a selling point for movies is going away what do you think it's being replaced with i don't i don't think that it's gone away entirely like i don't know what is the right i mean i mean like going away what do you think it would be like if it's decreasing what do you think is increasing then as a selling point for movies i i don't think that it necessarily has to be or is uh being replaced by anything i think i say at some point in this stream that people are becoming more director conscious which is a good thing and i think that that is a thing that is happening in terms of why someone would watch a movie there are more uh the average audience member has a higher understanding of uh directors names like there's a higher pool of directors names that can sell a movie than there was in the past i think that's a good thing because i think that directors are the most responsible for what their film turns out to be um i don't think that's entirely being replaced but i mean like the reason people saw Oppenheimer sure maybe not everybody but big reason why studios trust Christopher Nolan is because people will see it because of his name on the film right uh the thing is i'm not i'm not convinced by the the idea that directors are getting more well known i feel like there's specific people sure but like if you ask the average person to name 10 i think i'd be curious to see what their list would be and if they could well even if if let's say if let's say the average person had a list of five i would argue that fucking 20 years ago their list would have been three you know i think i think that and uh maybe George Lucas uh for us would be yeah at least god James Cameron but but again like a lot of a lot of those names even are not like we're we're talking from like a person i know that a lot of us that talk about movies on the internet are like film nerds or like science fiction fans in that respect you know like yeah i don't think the average person watching a fucking Ridley Scott movie throughout his career was like oh yeah the new Ridley Scott i don't think the average person i don't even think he's like a big enough name that the average person is aware of that whereas i think like i think more people might be aware of like Wes Anderson at this point yeah i don't know maybe as a name uh Wes Anderson's a fucking tiktok meme right now like people are like oh i'm doing sure with like the the ai stuff and everything i guess me maybe i'm speaking relatively right like the equivalent director of his time back then would have likely the equivalent notoriety but maybe not and maybe this is an anomaly because there's more names you know like the old ai Wes Anderson stuff conversation about film is a part of internet culture and discourse and is naturally spreading to people in a way that you know people that might not even be looking up things about film will inevitably find i think that i think that conversations about directors are getting more popular and i think that well people are becoming more aware of people you know controlling behind the scenes and shit guess the Wes Anderson one isn't because asteroid city that's Wes Anderson right and that's made 47 million dollars yeah i mean you can know of his name without wanting to watch one of his movies but i thought the context was uh names of selling points yeah the conversation about movie stars is that you know them and your interests like will smith right was he was yeah he had every film debuted at number one that's like that's what that's probably what people mean when they say movie star no matter what film is attached to people are gonna there's gonna be some interest in it whereas i don't know i mean it can increase your likelihood of selling a film for sure i think people are more aware of directors names not more than movie stars not not by a long shot i'm just saying it's becoming a bigger slice of the pie than it was before and that that's not necessarily like oh because i know a director's name that means that i'm you know the average person is going to watch every one of those movies like there's some things that people get excited for and some things that other people don't get excited for Wes Anderson's got a lot of fucking haters too right like what there's tons of viral posts of people being like wow he just does the same thing you know like so there's a so it's not necessarily like that that translates to money in the same way that like you can have a somebody a star that everybody knows fucking after earth bombs you know will smith was in that wasn't that the special thing about it though the trajectory of what's special though it ended his streak um that was unexpected yeah exactly word now in the same way that like a director being known doesn't necessarily translate to that an actor doesn't necessarily either i think it's fine if we break away from that yeah but the the idea with the label of movie star was you could say that up until after earth like what smith was just guaranteed to make you money with like maybe one or two exceptions whereas now i don't know i don't know like what actor you could attach because scholar jennison was an asteroid city she's one of the highest paid actresses in the world it's like well that didn't get that film above like 100 200 which maybe it was never going to yeah the rock in the black adam like people also like yeah i also have to understand with wes anderson movies is that the the studio strategic approach when it comes to releasing them is very very different uh than mainstream films right like um you have like a big universal disney warner brothers movies like they'll they'll be putting their films in fucking like ultra uh sony whatever blot d box and like all the big theaters or whatever but then you get like a more more indian artists like wes anderson who still works with studios and production companies like fox searchlight which is now owned by disney and what they've done even before they were owned by disney what essentially their strategy with his films was put it in a small amount of theaters have a small release and then base whether or not they're going to expand the release on how uh how many seats are filled within those smaller theaters asteroid city is a is a film that you know a lot of his fans checked out i'm sure it had like a pretty good uh seat filled ratio at the beginning but i'm pretty sure it dropped off too because it's pretty inaccessible it's not like it's not an it's not a wes anderson film that you'd immediately go to someone else and be like oh you got to watch this new one whereas like a lot of his other films the the studio approach the fox searchlight approach is just see which one's spread by word of mouth to the point where we can put enough faith in it to put it everywhere like this it's it's a problem with distribution that has been a long time issue with wes anderson films and a lot of uh you know not huge disney marvel blah blah blah properties is there they're not willing to they're not willing to uh put a lot of faith in the distribution unless it proves itself and sometimes that's just a self-fulfilling prophecy of like okay well nobody saw a trailer for this it wasn't it was barely in any theaters like of course like you know didn't reach a huge audience right so may my explanation for that would be very much included in a lot of the stuff you just said but also because i don't believe wes anderson would be able to sell a movie to mainstream audiences just on his name alone anyway like i don't know how much that really truly would add meanwhile it felt like once upon a time audiences had faith in in being entertained by individual actors and that we moved away from that what does that mean definitively i think there's a whole bunch of conversations to be had there i i don't i don't know how much we have moved away from it because the rock like he's had like maybe one or two flubs right like black adam and baywatch the rest of his movies are like one again like wil smith one was like the rest of the jungle thing like guaranteed to make a hundred dollars exactly like that made money didn't it uh no i kind of think i did no i don't think so uh and he was on a streak for a while though and dc's league of super pets he had his big his name and big bold letter both from that that wow but i mean still doesn't that speak to like their advertising dwayne johnson and then dc you know league of super pets and tidy text they thought he'd sell the movie and it didn't didn't work yeah but i feel like he has a like it's a more modern example of wil smith in terms of like yeah it's not a 100 guarantee but there you know he has a big streak he has a big streak and he's not you know i don't know what else to call the rock other than a movie star uh well i guess that's the the interesting thing is that people you know if you ask somebody who's like modern movie star people would point to the rock and it's like uh-oh waning a little bit you know and i mean mission possible definitely and just to clarify just like i imagine a drinker would agree with this as well like there are plenty of very famous and talented actors and actresses that that's not really got anything to do with it necessarily also this is very uh america centric because there's tons of i think they are talking about america though social yeah yeah and i guess united kingdom like that wasn't necessarily a criticism it was a reminder no yeah you're right already like star of the barbie movie star of like so many the drive and all the shit like i'm sure you love drive you know like i'm sure drive the drive is a very easily accessible movie to like even people like critical drinker right like ryan gosseling is you know maybe not like action star like tom cruise like i don't know like we're i understand what you mean i understand what you're saying but i also feel like tom cruise has been along like around way longer than current generation stars in the in the sense that like maybe we'll see movie stars that are just as big but they're not from america maybe we'll see movie stars that are just as big but they're not necessarily known for action right like i don't know if i'm comfortable saying that it's like the last where we're gonna see chris pratt that's a good example chris pratt's like probably fucking huge yeah i say that that's the one i actually kind of agree with i think chris pratt's the closest beyond tom cruise which to be fair tom cruise did not sell dead reckoning enough did he no dead reckoning is not not doing that also he decided to release it during barbenheimer like yeah i i don't know why people keep saying this i think that it like use mission impossible fallout made 800 million dollars it's a big franchise it's got a bunch of actors in it and tom crew and top gun maverick last year made like 1.3 billion dollars i don't know why people keep saying they should have moved it's like they thought they were gonna make more and it wasn't reasonable they yeah i mean understand the hype culture i'm willing to agree that barbenheimer is drawn from it but i also really like controversially want to say that i'm pretty sure it's partly to do with its poor quality dead reckoning is nowhere near as good as fallout i'm sorry yeah i mean yeah maybe maybe if people were shouting from the heavens that it's the best movie ever then it would have helped it out but i think so like it's also long person the average person watching like two movies in a weekend is already a huge part of especially when one of them is three hours right part of a movie's big success would be the legs right and like a lot of them need repeatability or at least recommendations and i just don't think dead reckoning had much of any of that as much as people would say like what do you mean everyone recommended it's like yeah but i wonder how much i wonder how much that reflected like a conversation between friends and people being like i gotta go see dead reckoning gotta go see it as opposed to other films that were out at the time yeah i wonder i just don't think i don't think many people re-saw it too i think they were like no one was enough i think well everybody's moved on i think everybody's already moved on it's not fun that people want to talk about anymore whereas a lot of the films that prove successful are the films people were talking about weeks and even months lighter my my autistic cousin re-saw it what do you think and what do you what do you think it was a joke i'm sorry oh there's a plan there is an autistic cousin re-saw it was set up a additional joke totally yeah yep in so many places right and you felt for it last year i'm so done there's a problem now in movies particularly where we don't have movie stars anymore we have characters that people are excited to see yo so it particularly with comic book movies with all this superhero stuff it'll be this is not necessarily untrue it is an observation that i've definitely seen probably again i've said it um have fun no problem yeah let's hear him out okay so hey we're gonna go and see the new captain america movie we're gonna see the new thor movie we don't care about the actor that's playing him really it's just like the character that we're going to see and so that then the amendment that i would probably add to what drink is saying is because i think if you appeal to character i think that that has more value than what it probably is which is that people are really invested in intellectual properties like they're interested in a franchise more so than like so people it's not like i'm invested in the character ethan hunts it's like i mean it's probably more so like oh it's mission impossible you know and tom cruise right compared to yeah because investment in the character seems more like that that's more rooted in the actual like material in the story rather than because like robert downey jr i guess is probably the interesting one right nobody saw do little even though he was yeah nobody's gonna watch uh an iron man without him it's like this interesting exactly where people want to watch robert downey jr as iron man specifically uh with an investment in marvel as a broader ip which is kind of like a fascinating sort of thing you know like it's it's kind of an interesting look hello we're just talking about uh actors plus characters what sells versus just the actor these days or at least in particular spheres a star did my chair provide adequate commentary i'm sure it did it was it transformed the conversation that's this is a weird one because it is kind of a trend but i don't necessarily like i think what we're seeing like i think we kind of agree that we might phrase it in different ways where it's like we see a lot of actors that are going into superhero roles and reprising those roles and so it's like robert downey jr for 10 for like a fucking decade at least is not robert downey jr he's iron man right um chris pratt it's still chris pratt like he's you know chris pratt's a really good example to kind of contradict this isn't he like chris pratt is still getting so many roles like he was in the fucking mario movie right like why did he get cast for that um and he's doing very well that's true um like chris pratt is interesting to look at in reference to all of this outside of yeah like people people don't see him as star lord and even even in the context of guardians in the galaxy it's not like people saw it because star lords in it it's because chris pratt is playing star lord yeah um well i see that as with all the characters like i don't think thul will do as well without chris hemswith and i don't think uh i can't make the same argument the hulk actually how you see it i think the interesting thing with with you you know i'm like oh chris pratt is a movie star it's like oh yeah that's a mario war what was the name of the character he played uh john jam john something come on john no no james james nine ham try again uh it's not john it's a different uh no a jacob jingle irish mint pratt so so the character's name is actually dan forest dammit dan oh i couldn't guess that i'm sad that i didn't guess they're making a sequel i think they're making a sequel they are making a sequel what did you what did you guys think about that awful what a load of poor shit it's actually one of the worst movies i've seen but it's funny yes it is funny it is funny but it's terrible and yes they are making a sequel because it was that was an infuriating movie that was an hated it that's a day i hated it world i mean that's done but still you know massively financially successful um i don't i don't know if i necessarily wholeheartedly agree with the idea that there's no movie stars anymore but i will say that i guess it feels kind of different with stars in general so like you could say the same thing about music you could say the same thing about like we'll never see a music star as big as michael jackson and i think that has less to do with the quality of music that's available and more to do with people maybe like over time globally getting kind of more level headed when it comes to the idea of like celebrity worship culture like maybe that has a bit something more to do with it like i think people worship tom cruz in like a very obsessive like weird fucking way in the same way that like people did that recently with like i don't know kanye and kim kardashian like all these tabloid people like brad you could say the same thing about like brad pit and like um i can i don't know jennifer aniston and who's the other women need a tomb raider you know like be on jelena jelly queen b that like you could say the same thing about a lot of people i think that maybe we've kind of like been more level headed and gravitating a war sorry away from celebrity worship culture in a way and that's nice do you think i'm not i feel like the celebrities have just shifted from like the movie star to the tiktok influencer youtuber twitch streamer when i say shifting away i don't mean that most people don't do it i'm saying i'm just saying i'm just saying that there is from at least what i can notice which you know no one can do this accurately kind of just see what you see in the world but it feels like enough people are shifting away in a way that is noticeable to me but i could be wrong i was careful in this stream i i think i even said the word maybe yeah yeah because well because i think there's arguments in both directions but my intuition says like we're in it's getting worse and worse with how crazy everyone's getting online with like worshiping individuals but you know maybe we'll see we'll see how it goes maybe it'll be easier to tell in 10 years not necessarily indicative of like the quality of the art that they're creating or the quality of movies or the quality of the actor or the quality of the musician right like i don't i don't i don't know i agree with what he's saying in terms of like there's been a notable trend in how people worship celebrities but like i don't know if that necessarily translates to translates to that means that you know like stars are worse or like actors are worse or something right and get people to go to the movie theater and see his latest film you know back when probably you and i were kids the the dominant forces of the box office were like oh i'm gonna go and see the latest Arnold Schwarzenegger movie you know what i kind of agree but i think that this is a step in the right direction because i would rather i would rather have people seeing the new movie made by the director and as we've seen recently you know people saw the new fucking Christopher Nolan movie right like there's directors that have made themselves prominent enough to connect with people in a way where they know their name and there's very few of them actors are the most obvious because they're the ones on the screen and so many people would just be like oh i like Hugh Jackman and they go see the new Hugh Jackman movie right i think that's a step in the right direction to not weigh so much in terms of actors but think about more of directors right like i think that people are growing in that sense where they if um if i completely believe that that we'd move to respecting directors instead of actors i think i'd be on board i just don't know that we've done that at all i think it's just we've just lost on the respect do you think that even sorry i didn't mean to interrupt no it's all good do you think that even if it's not replaced by directors do you think that it's a bad thing that people aren't seeing movies because of the actors in it i think it is a neutral thing until we figure out what the context behind it is what it means and like i said i think in drinkers case he doesn't get to say what he means by it yeah because that's what's confusing to me about um i guess this interview is because i like it just seems to be like a common sentiment among people but it just seems to just kind of be one of those things where it's like this is new and it you know the implication is that it's bad i think you know you take a step back it's like oh wait so wait if this is a trend why is it bad and that's why i'm confused the what is probably better is that people are rooting their interest in things that they want to see based on the people who are creating it just simply for the fact that it is focused on that creator side which seems like it's going to be more and more relevant right as AI becomes more prevalent of like a focus and interest in the people who are behind the thing that you enjoy and to some extent the actor you know obviously the director is in charge of the creative process of making a film but the actor you know lead actors play an important role in it too and if it gets replaced with oh yeah new ant-man movie or something and then nobody knows who's writing or directing it like i don't know that that would be and people aren't necessarily watching it because pull rods in it but because you know how does it connect to like a future marvel project i don't know that that's better you know that's the big depressing element is the writers are barely cared about at all nobody yeah like how often you see except for like aron sorkin maybe maybe the average person probably still doesn't know who aron sorkin is yeah yeah if if if it's being entirely replaced by just ip then yeah that's a bad thing i don't i mean i feel i feel like although there are more ip focused movies now in terms of how they sell a movie i don't know if i don't know if people's sensibilities have shifted in terms of if let's say in the 1990s this this trend of remakes and blah blah blah if let's say it existed then i don't know if people would be any less susceptible to it uh in terms of like oh you know just because whether or not jackie chan and tom cruiser a thing i don't think influences how susceptible people are to nostalgia uh marketing so i don't know if it's necessarily being replaced by that is what i'm saying nostalgia marketing is an interesting one because it seems to me like it's it's not working as much anymore remember obu on kanobi remember how hyped everybody was getting with the uh when i planned you know i was relatively hyped myself i was so hyped i'm not even kidding because i adore ewan mcgregor as obu won and that fucking shit was awful i'm not going to say that i thought it was going to be good but i didn't but uh i was willing to give it a try you know and and if the people behind and or were given full control of the obu one show i guarantee you would have ended up with something pretty strong that would have been really exciting but oh well if only they realize that just as an and or but nice a movie doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be good so i you know i i agree with this as being a trend in that direction where like just because an actor's in a movie doesn't mean it's going to sell i think that's a good thing personally i'm going to see the latest alone maybe the latest bruce willis movie all people like that they were stars that could sell films just on their star power we don't have that anymore and that's a fucking good thing in my opinion and it's the same problem with the you know with them i would like okay so here's my issue so he's he's he's explained this as an issue that he has he goes you used to be able to sell movies on star power let me take a wild fucking guess and assume that by the end of this video he's not going to explain why that's a bad thing because essentially what he's doing right here which is a lot of well which is the content that i've seen from him is he's kind of appealing to this like the past was great which i mean you know i'm i'm not saying that he has every belief that every conservative commentator that i've seen talk about things that are not movies i'm not saying that they're all the same person but it appeals to the same audience in the sense that like there's a lot of old people there's a lot of people that are getting older i'm fucking 32 right like i'm getting older you know like i don't consider myself to be ancient but a lot of things that people in my generation millennials are experiencing are based in nostalgia they they're based on like oh you know like i have good memories of these things in the past it's a very like easy thing to get like sucked into it's a very easy thing to just uncritically just accept and want right um but i think that there needs to be a bit more of an argument than just it was in the past and therefore it's good right um there's the box office for all people like that they were stars that could sell i want to hear him talk about why it's a bad thing that an actor doesn't draw box office numbers by being an actor alone i want to hear him justify that and i don't i think in the shortest answer possible you give you is the audience is don't have as much faith in the actors being a part of something that's going to be entertaining which he sees as like a loss i don't uh i don't see that as a bad thing i i think i agree with you that it would be a neutral thing but the the fact is like the background i would assume many would argue is that it's brought on by too many bad projects in a row involving all kinds of people like there's no necessary pattern for the mainstream studio productions that like it connects to a particular director particular right a particular actor it's just all over i mean i'm speaking from the perspective of someone who has no issue finding things that i think i will enjoy based on the people creating them and again this just goes back to like i wish the tools are available i have these tools i know how to use them i'm just trying to help people understand how they can find those tools to find what they want but this still exists in um because the mainstream is huge there's loads of stuff going on and the idea that i could be like i'm going to see the new james cameron film and then be like jesus fucking christ that was terrible okay ridley scott what have you got and then i see like alien covenant or something it's like oh god and they're like well who else we got uh you know you run to someone and just like okay these aren't reliable anymore i can't guarantee myself exactly yeah but meanwhile they may very well be even actors or writers or directors in uh further indie markets that are much more reliable and i think it's admirable to try and promote them absolutely but that uh this sentiment would still be true it's probably what i would uh argue what he's saying because the the context for their conversation is all within mainstream okay i don't think he's gonna do it by the end of this video if he does then i you know whatever but like i've i've only ever heard people talk about that in the sense of this is something that doesn't happen anymore and you know without explaining further we're supposed to think that that inherently because it doesn't happen anymore is why it's bad right but i you know things change like i'm sorry like there's a lot of things that change um and i know change can be scary uh but we all have you know individually societally generationally we all have kind of tests as to how we can accept change and how we can deal with change how we can adapt to change right like adaptation is you gotta adapt you know like shit's gonna move on without you if you don't adapt right so you can't i don't know what we'll see if he ever explains why that's bad but i've never heard an argument for it which is why i'm not expecting it oh film is just on their star power we don't have that anymore we don't have it anymore um and it's the same problem with uh you know with um films in general you know we we um we don't want to take the risk now of inventing new things because one movies are massively expensive and so they don't want to take the risk of investing 200 300 million dollars on something that's completely unproven and so all they'll do is say well what's a surefire hit well i don't know star wars used to be popular let's do that indiana jones was popular let's i agree i completely agree with what you're saying right now do that you know let's just keep recycling the things that older people remember um and two we don't i've criticized this exact same thing have the the talented writers with with really interesting life experience i completely disagree we do have the talented writers in the mainstream is he ever clarifying that in in this video that all of this is in the context of the mainstream that's what russell brand introduced to this okay and you with your two million almost two million fucking subscriber channel are not promoting them this is part of the issue that i'm sorry like and to be fair he does promote mainstream writers that he thinks are good as well he doesn't like because obviously he's been hyperbolic he's not saying every single film made within you know over a 50 million budget or more or 50 million are all bad he obviously he's reviewed many that he thinks are very good and that he would promote the creators of those in those he's just saying that the general trend that were overwhelmingly in a bad place for mainstream writers which uh you know like it's depressing some of the stuff you discover like i was talking about earlier with the marvel writers i don't know what the fuck they're thinking um i don't know if you've seen the comments from like a lot of them when their projects come out and everyone hates them like what they end up saying um the director of secret invasion said that uh people need to understand that when it comes to action scenes like those are mathematical there's no emotion in them and so they're kind of boring to film sometimes or straightforward anyway well it absolutely batshit man you you don't know you yeah what was the thing you don't want to like that like the film because the show wasn't people didn't like it very much it was he said he's happy people don't like it because he'd prefer to create something that like has all kinds of reactions i think something like that but the thing is nobody likes it and if it was good you'd say yeah this is a disappointing outcome because everybody likes it and that wasn't one of the yeah i hate it what everybody approves of my work that's like Lars von Trier he's happiest when people are pissed at him i you know what because ryan john says that he wants he wants all reactions i see that validity is that but the thing is the secret invasion one is absolute cope because there's nobody talking about how good secret invasion liked it everybody hated it it didn't get watched by many people it was complete failure and a waste of hundreds of millions of dollars a fascinating waste if you were actively seek out like there's so many people writing so many different things there's so many people directing so many different things like the type of media that you want to see exists it's out there and you would fucking love it and all you would have to do is just like look for it and you could use your platform on the internet to help to help promote it like i want to see charlie kaufman get his fucking next project out the ground i want to see it have money like i want to be able to like promote whatever kickstart he has to do like i want to see more films from the creators that i love and i man like it's what he's talking about like what he wants to see doesn't exist and that's it's frustrating like oh man experiences that they can translate into the scripts uh so they don't have the ability to create new things that are really he just says like writers are bad now like talent didn't disappear like whatever you think is good writing from the 80s or whatever it's not like people can't do that like you're just not promoting the people who can right surely you know you got rustle crow on your channel surely for the record he definitely does i'm just saying like you have enough exposure and connections to be able to promote the people that can right like you know make your make make a fucking movie studio or something like i don't know like i'm trying to do artistic well yeah and then of course it was it was a strange comics i assumed you may have known it i don't know but like he was in canada right like when you was streaming this uh on set i think it's just i was not aware of that fair enough projects like my problem is time right now and i'm trying to fix that um i would like to do like actual writing shit you know interesting and cool it seems like i'm trying i'm trying to make steps towards doing that hamill has almost been trying to publicly have any ideas for what you want to make out of curiosity i have fucking it's fucking hundreds of fucking the challenge is like just organizing them into a cohesive idea i i uh yeah i need to restructure what i'm doing in my life to move basically make more time for that because i i have i have like solid ideas of what i want to do and how i want to do it and i hit a roadblock of being like wait a minute but i'm trapped in this cycle of needing to do this other stuff to make money so i gotta increase the amount of money i'm making for like i've never done a sponsor right so i'm i have to start doing that basically sometime soon um so i can actually have enough time in my schedule to be able to properly focus on fleshing out a script and you know actually creating something okay yeah well good luck with that that's that's cool yeah um yeah like what the franchise has done to the character of luke skywalker that he personally feels offended and affronted by it sometimes it seems to me that you're driven by a kind of a love of narrative and story and almost like joseph cambell like ideas of how a hero should function and what a story should do i've got a few things i want to run by i'm like i used to think it's like a little hypothesis of mine but american movie stars somehow embody how they regard how that nation in particular and let's face it it's still the nation that defines our planet like how it sees itself at a particular time like when it was fought to the guns alone it was a kind of rebooted 1980s america with heath you realize arnold sorton agar is like not not american really hard disagree with that on which was very american as a like an immigrant he's an american citizen he was the governor of california he was the governor i know but he's not he couldn't he couldn't be president he wasn't like born there so yeah you're right that the way i phrase that was improper well it's just he he's an american like he's an american citizen i just i american political office and i agree with you i agree with you we're talking we're talking we're also talking about a period of time where he was like before way before he was governor right it's like i believe that he was an american citizen before even the first terminated movie i i believe he was like for years yeah i believe i agree that he was a citizen i just think that it's it's a funny example with an accent that thick is what i'm saying we're talking about like he has a he has an interesting accent a very distinctive accent but he he definitely isn't that awesome though like that he'd be seen as quintessentially american when he's so clearly not got an american accent like i feel like that's a good thing that's not a bad thing well because he he would because uh his uh documentary on netflix which was really cool like he talks strongly in the bodybuilding episode about how strongly he identified with american culture uh that he needed to be in america he wanted to be over in america and i mean he he got about as fully involved in being an american as uh as you can get in terms of the impactful culture and and being in political office governor california the the if i were to think of like quintessentially american i guess i would think more stereotypically american and not just an american immigrant uh i well about it's like moa said right isn't that that's kind of interesting that anord schwarzneger could be considered american when in certain in some ways he doesn't come across as like i guess what you would consider like a hypostereotypical american action hero movie man and those and he influenced it right as a perception yeah as a man he wanted to capture america he said like he's he considers himself austrian and american and that they're like incredibly important to him as identities and of course what they're talking about which i completely agree with is he uh the the stars of the times will represent like attitudes toward um you know from whatever particular point of view as representative of american culture like it feels like it's um itself qualifies we all we're all very familiar with him being at the top of american movies for a long time yeah yeah he he was the governor of georgia eventually but like he can't run for pretty much california but yeah he's kind of like an insanely austrian accent right that's funny that i said that uh adam sandler i i did a movie with actually and who i think is really interesting and brilliant performer on comic and he like at a time when we were starting to learn for example that there weren't actually weapons of mass destruction in iraq adam sandler had this kind of our shucks i didn't mean it i like kind of mentality that aligns neatly with america that's trying its best and erring sometimes now perhaps what we have is man it's so crazy it's so a lot of the people that are doing like this weird like every every unexpected death is caused by the vaccine shit you know a lot of people that are doing this are like using the same sort of like feelings of like okay there were no weapons of mass destruction in iraq you know and it's like you're taking true things where it's like okay the government wasn't you know being honest with us at this particular point in time and they're saying like okay therefore every single thing that has been approved by any sort of governmental agency is you know like bullshit like i don't know they did put fluoride in our water so watch out but now my teeth the vaccine is not safer than getting than not getting a vaccine if covid didn't exist but with covid existing and the fact that it's so contagious that everybody who's going to get it the vaccine is safer than getting covid it's so insane that people are like oh yeah like obviously uh we're here to talk about the drinker and boofy stuff this is uh it would it would be it would be too long to unpack if we were it is no problem everyone's welcome to talk as much about their own uh covid things wherever they want yeah the the antibodies you get it's better if you just get covid it's like but what about what covid does to your body right like i can't i can't i can't do this right now it's been so it's so fucking i can't believe how stupid the world got covid broke so many people's brains covid broke so many people's fucking brains like people people got sucked into conspiracy nonsense within the time of like apparently it was just such a large world event that everybody was like looking for some reason to consider every part about it a conspiracy you know like there's some things where it's like okay yes i can understand why you would believe this part about it or this part about it but like the way that it's just so sucked into this like insane like right-wing conspiratorial culture like i just man there's it's frustrating it's frustrating and then someone's gonna look at me saying this and assume that i believe like x y and z and being like oh you're an npc you must believe this exactly and we'll say that's the part i agree about ever we'll assume your views on everything to do with anything if you say anything about anything this exactly it's like you don't know my beliefs right i mean you would if you watched my channel because i'm very public about my beliefs but yeah a lot of people misrepresent those america that doesn't know what it's trying to sell itself anymore trying to present a kind of ethical and moral face to the world while clearly being backed by commodity as you say the motivation behind these um ips and these franchise these franchise movies is no one's willing to take a risk you know matt daemon says matt daemon like that you know you'd never get a good will hunt in type movies no more because no one will back a 30 million like that they need to have ip behind them but why would i get into just before while we're still on huge i mean i was very glad that matt daemon actually talked about that that like that there was this sort of like middle ground between these massive like summer blockbusters and indie films there was this sort of middle ground that is becoming harder and harder to survive and thrive in it's like the destruction of the middle class well it's uh it's something that's been talked about in video though i think i think it's safe to say that the video game market is kind of rebounding in terms of a a healthy middle market between big triple a game and smaller say the double a yeah indy double a level stuff is really popular there's a lot of great stuff out there i haven't played bouldersgate three but larian right they're like not a huge studio right i don't think larian's a huge studio but they're not triple a um but it's just like um it's just like ghost ship and deprot galactic um it's there's tons of that indy double a gaming experience that people love because they can do something and focus on making something really excellent that people gravitate towards and find value in and my drink is finished but yeah i like that's one of the reasons why i am i'm so like i am really optimistic about the gaming you know like environment i'm very optimistic about gaming because it seems like it's so easy for everyone to pick up all of the you know the crumbly bits of where you know triple a level stuff is falling behind um whereas of course as you know adam has explained in the movie biz that's not quite as easy and simple how many people watched air because matt you know and talk about wait matt oh my god my brain matt was matt damon in air i don't know what i'm thinking of that i think you might have been exactly ben afleck at least yeah ben afleck was in it oh yeah matt damon was the lead sorry my brain was frazzled there it's air how many people saw air that was a cool movie but i don't know how many people saw it and that's definitely in that space um it seems like maybe streaming is the place where like those types of films can sort of end up having a place but even then i'm not i'm not sure i don't know it's uh but he put it pretty succinctly it didn't make any money how much money did tar cost 10 million what's the most expensive original ip that's been made in the past fucking like 10 years like it sucks i wish more original ideas got i don't know i'd be curious to know the answer to that actually yeah 25 million wow before we leave you too bad that shouldn't have that shouldn't have gotten that much money because it was i mean maybe after 30 years you can make it back because like it got a 4k blu ray i'm gonna be pimping it out and i'm gonna be like talking about it and dissecting it but i was afraid it's not gonna make that money back tarry's gonna for sure in mind drinker that we're still in a place where censorship is possible over time how do we marry together the idea i'm sure okay this is on russell brand's official channel let's ignore the fact that we don't even get enhanced bit rate 1080p but listen to how shit the audio quality is it's like it's like 96 kilobits per second on youtube before we leave youtube so do do better you've got the worst mic in mind drinker that we're so funny he's using the mic i'm using uh yeah well however it's going through the the output bit rate yeah his audio is shit what's that the sure sm7b something like that yeah i believe so it's gonna be on a star is kind of born there in chat on your chat true who are who's chat on screen in the uh if i could just say i'm gonna be infinitely more entertained by why i'm as his breakdown of tar than tar i i agree that's totally fine i would see here the thing when i when i talk about like oh there's all these other artists creating things like i'm not just saying like this i know that my favorite movies are largely inaccessible to the average audience member uh the types of things that i appreciate i wouldn't recommend to everybody it's fair yes but but there's a lot of things that i watch that might not be my favorite thing well you know it would be like in my top 20 or 30 of the year where i watch them like oh fuck everybody would love this shit you know like so by the way i have no like big criticism of tar i just found it boring i would actually probably defend it is very well made yeah i think tar was a really great movie but i did find it incredibly boring and long which happens and to be fair it just flew by for me flew by oh you're an opposite for me elvis flew by that movie flew by real fun that's a wacky movie that's a wacky movie but i liked it this is the question i thought he was getting this is a good question oh i love how he has to like caricature that with the quotes too that's worthy of caricature um i was gonna say have you heard but he means it sincerely though he means it sincerely and he's he's doing the quotes in a caricature way to kind of because the word audience where we're strong has been abused right like strong when we say when we say a strong female character or male character we're probably not referring to their physical strength in universe unfortunately a lot of people got that mixed up and like there's um the newest one that i've come across hero movies yeah but fuck it why not why can't they make them we didn't have to do that before it's not like anyone said like oh leah needs to be buff in star wars or that um any of the you know like black widow wasn't like like a she was also kind of like the not really that important of a character in terms of like what she was doing in the movie i don't know why you don't think so leo organa i mean she had her she had her own like fucking side quest and shit but like what side quest they weren't really like um i'm not a star wars buff clearly i know it's okay i know it's all right it's all right it's okay um because i was going to bring up is the uh quanta mania is my next video and behind the scenes shit like this is this character i think her name was gen torah she's just a like a spear wielding like tribal uh sort of badass character in in the quantum realm the whole thing is leading everybody and being awesome stuff but there's like barely any character you can actually draw from here and then the behind the scenes she's talking about how she played a um an empire affiliated character in uh mandalorian and of course uh she was like uh you know it's nice to play uh a strong female character that's on the good side and she's like strong does she just mean that she's strong and she kills people because that's basically all you get which is such a fucking shame and then with russell what can we do to fix this how do we get the strong female characters that aren't the strong female characters because they can be strong it's just like physically strong but you prefer to be written strong in movies right i do for my girls i want them to watch films and not always to be it's just guys and blokes and you know i want guys and blokes there to be diversity but how do you marry that what do you think is the concession that should be made to make oh this is a great question i can't believe you're asking him this movies more for one of a better word more diverse where do where do you stand on that mate like yeah interesting points you've made there because it's like when you talk about the stars that they're different eras like the the seventies was like deniro al Pacino dusted hoffman like the interesting character actors you know i don't know i don't know if like saying those names is different than saying like chris pratt you know like ryan gosseling i don't know if that's that different it's just because like we can look back at the seventies retrospectively and be like yes we know these names now because we're in it like is it really that different than just leaving off like i think uh if i'm not wrong drink is about to go into talking about what those characters represented not necessarily that they were uh able to sell films on their own that might be yeah i mean like even so like i would say ryan gosseling and walkie and phoenix and you know there's tons of great character actors today too because i find this part really interesting in terms of what does it tell you about the state of what people want to see in like leading characters and that um a lot of people make the point and i'm not sure where you stand on it but the lately we feel a little identity less in terms of trends or preferences for cinema like we're all over the place uh especially with the destruction of like the superhero dominance yeah we're in a transitionary period i don't necessarily think that's a bad thing though yeah i think that's fair big name actors of today like that's such a so weird the eighties was the big buff muscle man it was the time of like american confidence we're going to kick ass we're going to dominate we're going to do also we're going to get this austrian man to give us the american confidence yeah why not part of america that's part of being american yeah yeah you know i think it's like slightly more uh vulnerable heroes the 2000s was very much reflective of the war on terror so there was a lot of um you know uh military themed stuff there was a lot of thrillers there was a lot of secret agent things going on and then yeah you look at now there's nothing we just i literally just said there ain't no movie stars i don't know if he knows what question he was asked because i was very excited to hear him like so russell brand clearly asked like hey i want to see more representation in films you're calling out things in a way where it's like okay there's clearly some sort of agenda being pushed on people and movies are bad now because there's no good characters blah blah blah blah blah what if what if it's better that it's not just buff white men as stars in movies and i have two daughters and i want to see them represented in movies and i want them to grow up and know that they're represented and maybe it's not just white people he's went on a giant tirade of just listing what was popular in each decade without having answered the question let's see if he does because because he does right eventually drinker gets onto that question but uh i was gonna say i just have no idea what he was talking about well so this was prompted by russell talking about how adam sandler and characters like him represented that era and drink has gone through 70s 80s 90s to now because he was this is the thing he was genuinely interested by what russell said and he wanted to build on it that's all that happened okay like the country doesn't even know what it is now it's in a conflict of identity uh so i think i was yeah it's a self-evident point of like it doesn't even know what it wants to be anymore so that's that's kind of really sad to see because we always you know as a brat i always looked up to america as like the model of the world like okay i i thought that i was gonna watch this whole thing and not like come off too hard on on critical drinker like i'm pretty open to like other political perspectives and other like i don't believe in free will i believe that like both of these people all of you watching at home are just people that are products of your environment right like i don't i don't i don't have any like ill will towards anybody like you know like i'm pretty loosey-goosey easy going right you didn't answer the question this is the country that leads us the free world um but yeah when it comes to to marion what you talked about thank you god or like the um rather than just having straight white guys as like the movie stars how do we how do we include um people of different genders ethnicities all that stuff i guess what i would say hey we did it 20 30 40 years ago we just didn't make such a big deal out of it like we have oh man like okay i get it i get it like it when when what was it jennifer laurence who who said this shit we're like they're like i am the first female i'm glad you're aware of that quote because it was so cringy it was so dumb main character like if you want to respond to stupid shit like that yes you know bring up ripply ripply from the alien series like everybody brings up ripply i get it there are strong female characters there are female directors who have been making movies for a while there are you know female writers who have been writing movies for a while you know like there there has been representation of different genders different races there has been that technically right but it seems like a lot of people are taking issue with that being like a little bit more representative of the actual population in the slice of the pie right where like yes you can take examples from history and say yes this has happened there are good examples of this you know it's not like this hasn't happened before i completely agree whereas like the the argument towards like oh including a bit more representation is saying you know there's women women are actually the majority of society which i'm gonna i'm gonna have my like most fucking red pilled fucking sexist based take here and i'm gonna say like hey uh oh you can't complain about anything politically if you're the majority vote okay cancelled your shit together yeah you are empowered what i will say it sounds like the point you're making now in response is the okay sure we could have the Ripley's and Sarah Connor's vote don't you think we should have a hell of a lot more than just the selection people were referenced it's it's not even it's not even to suggest that i want there to be more but to try and explain why there are attempts being made by people in the industry to include more which seems to be you know depending depending on the reviewer depending on the person talking about movies a lot of criticism is not necessarily like oh the the representation was included and it was also a bad movie a lot of it is under the lens of the representation in of itself being attempted in the film is the bad part which is the impression i get from maybe not every critical drinker video but like it's it's uh well we'll hear him answer this question in this video and this is the question that he gets asked twice and his his takeaway from it at least what i remember and i listen to it like twice so i'm pretty sure i have a good memory of this is he phrases it in a way where he's essentially saying that it's a problem that needs not to be addressed and that uh because there has been good representation of women uh in the past and that uh nobody made a big deal out of it when it happened that therefore uh attempts to try and make women or insert minority here therefore attempts to make them more represented at all is uh like a useless and not correct thing to do or uh like a something that needs not to be fixed which you know the more i think about it like with him in that perspective it it it seems kind of incompatible with his other content because true uh you know the yeah because because the the way it's not his position how well but well i mean if it's not then i don't blame you at all but let's hear him let's hear him talk in the interview because that's what i'm basing his so so far um what i've gathered and we can roll it back but if you want rustle asked him what's the solution then if we're not going to be if we're going to be critical of all these strong all the buff ones that don't have characters what are we to do and drinker says we cracked this already we know what to do the formula is right over there and he's referring to the strong characters that we've had before that are female obviously there's a fucking laundry list now the impression i got them from you was that you were like yeah sure that's the formula but don't you think we should be getting more of them we don't have enough of them which i actually think is a fair thing to say in response but that that's not necessarily something drinker even disagrees with he's simply saying we don't need to solve the problem of better written female characters as some kind of new and innovative innovative idea we've got it already we know how to do it we've known how to do it forever it's embarrassing that we've managed to regress somehow and by the way i think you would agree with this we've regressed on male characters as well like we've regressed on character writing as a whole yeah in general in mainstream studio productions yeah but um i would like to um i would like to if possible uh save the majority of of this conversation for the second time that it's asked because yeah the critical drinker gets asked this exact same question closer to the end of the uh video because i i guess uh wrestle brand wasn't satisfied with his answer either and he he does add like an extra bit to to his answer that i i feel is more reflective of why i uh am interpreting his answer in that way um so yeah okay so i'm gonna give i'm gonna give one to i'm gonna give one to the mrs here okay like women are the majority vote so you can't complain about anything that you vote on right half serious but like come on i mean it's it's what i'm saying here is there's a difference between something existing in the past and having like clear examples of it versus the conversation of taking an issue with it because it's happening more often right let's see what he says i have to do now and that's the thing that annoys people that's the thing that turns people off when you make the identity of the main character the main actor the sole focus of everything people are just like well why are you making such big of this why why should i care about this they used to just do it okay here's an interesting perspective just like how he called you just said they used to and he's referring to how they used to write the characters instead of that the fact that they exist at all yeah yeah what if what if we were to say that although it is stupid if the identity of the main character or you know their inclusion in a film and you know like disney goes like this the first gay character or whatever like i'm i'm a superhero that's a woman and like this is why you should care about me what if we agree that that's stupid but we also say but we also say that that is essentially also something that has happened in the past with white men but you just haven't noticed it what what if we also what if we say that that's stupid but we also say that like there are movies that are like rid if you found any examples of like characters from the 80s the sort of celebrated just for being a white man or something like that i think drink would agree with you that's that's retarded ridiculously white and ridiculous but like is it is it fair to say that like the you know a lot of like mainstream films that people don't really often attribute to in that way or just like a normalized version of that like you know like what is you know what is james bond or like we were just talking about how you know art old was embodying this whole like american culture thing like he talked very heavily about like how stars and the media landscape was like supporting this type of identity and culture like is that not like kind of i mean american culture like obviously it spreads far further than any white man um and i would go as far as saying that james bond has an extensive character history that is part of why people don't like the new ones is that they're getting it wrong sort of thing it's not just about being a white man yeah like specific generations of james bond yeah but like very as a james bond enjoyer like i love the character and i don't associate james bond with like he's only good because he's a white man or that he's that's his characteristics you know yeah what i when i say okay i think it's important to recognize that in order to in this generation of films um and perhaps this will get better as time goes on as it gets more uh like i guess normalized but in this generation of films it's nearly impossible to include any kind of minority character in prominent ways without it feeling like it's being political um whereas like you look further back in time in the the landscapes of film like you could argue that it's just as political for there to have for a black person not to have even been allowed to be a main character essentially before like fucking like uh what was it night of the living dead was like a huge fucking controversy it was like a stepping stone of just like oh you just have like a black man character who is not a dubbing character because he's black he was just like a regular guy right like in in the same sense that some that a decision in that direction can be considered political i would argue that it's also political to not have that decision made that it is inherently political in the other direction that we just don't consider it to be that so uh obviously that this would be something you could theoretically discuss with them but i assume this is kind of the argument you would lay out that we can have the motivation to create art and then the art itself and of course the he would tell you or he believes fully that when your motivations are so like as they describe in a lot of these behind the scenes stuff like oh we can't wait to have the first female villain in star wars which is how they kept describing captain phasma doesn't have characteristics at all and in her interview she keeps talking about how amazing her character is and no one has any clue what it is and it's like it's such a shame because they thought first and foremost that she's a woman and that's good enough and we're going to promote her that way that's terrible if we had the equivalent where they said uh you know in the 60s 70s whatever but like we're going to have a whole cast of white men and then like don't you think you should have characters and then they're like nope they're white men and that's going to be that's going to be we're going to celebrate it as a big cast of that would be awful too but ultimately that is essentially what happened for a long period of so i was about to say the second half of that though it was considered controversial for like black people to the second half of that would be that the art itself could still be really strong so the equivalent for that could be that that film full of white men as they motivated in the like shady rooms where they produce it all turns out the film is amazing and it's irrelevant of the fact that they're white men it's all about the writing that's amazing and then in the same vein uh i think drinker concedes in this interview at some point there are films he may describe as woke how he defines it but also really strong and i think arcane was the example he gave uh where someone could have been motivated behind the scenes of arcane to be like we need a lesbian main character and we need several women main characters and that's what i care about and then someone else writes them do you do you think that it is um what what is your perspective on like categorizing that as woke because i don't typically purely just because there's like a lesbian character in it even if you're not saying that it's bad because it's woke like if critical drinkers argument paraphrasing but i'm pretty sure it's accurate he's saying it's good despite being woke i'd have to see that that's like at all like every time i come across anybody using that word i have to ask them what they mean by it i don't because like it's so fucking buzzwordy at this point i have no idea i i i get that but i feel like in the the context at which critical drinker has used it and correct me if i'm wrong but you know like for him something woke appearing in a movie is essentially like oh you put this in for a political agenda or you put this in for representation politically right um i'm wondering if we could ever reach a point where a lesbian character a character could just be in a show without it being perceived as woke because they exist in a show right that's a part of my criticism that makes a lot of sense and i don't know what he would say to that necessarily and he might say to you because like um we love a lot of media on like like i was going to say blind man would be another one right that's a lesbian lead is uh is that woke because you would automatically assume in this day and age that they would have pushed for that and then the writing comes after it if that's an assumption he has or he has proof of it either way i would call it cynical um because it may be true and you may be able to find proof of that being the case like behind arcane they say oh we knew we had to have women at the forefront we knew we had to have a gay woman at the forefront because that is what is important and then the writing came after that would be unfortunate and if that fits his definition then i guess that fits his definition and and do you feel where the despite comes in i guess would be that he's focused on trying to explain that that should not be your foundation for creating a story in the same vein that you shouldn't be like we have to create set pieces for explosions we have to create all these opportunities for white men to be on the screen you know i mean like any kind of agenda but he believes that that's the most prominent and arguably like damaging one in hollywood right now do you do you feel as though it's possible that uh a wide variety of movies especially historically maybe not as much today but that there are people and have been create people creating movies where it is important for them for the main character to be white but it's not seen as as much of a political statement and they might not even materialize those thoughts in their own consciousness because it's not seen as a subversion and it's already kind of seen as like oh this is just a thing that i can do right whereas like they never even wrestled with the idea of a character being a different gender or a different race they just want the character to be white and male not because of any sort of supremacist reasons but because they it's important to them that that's the type of experience that they're trying to reflect in their films right like i feel like that same thing does exist for people of varying genders races gender right uh you know gender identities um but it's the problem is like it's only necessarily seen as political if it's one that is against what is traditionally known as the norm right and i feel i feel like i i want to push back against people that are trying to um or at least jumping the gun or uh misattributing uh films that they shouldn't be as things that are trying to force like a political agenda when most people creating art you know if they're creating art that is uh are doing so because they want to express something right i don't know yeah well and as you know i feel like we've gotten a plethora in this day and age of evidence that they are using non-normalized race and gender i suppose to promote um their films in media and it's like gross and weird a lot of the time it'd be like you've got to see this because it's doing this and it has this so like a lot of the time with like marvel films or even disney films or whatever in the promotional material they'll be like this film has uh seven people of color in it and that's why you should see it it's just like what the fuck like what why aren't you yeah i i don't think that that's like a good reason to what i'm suggesting is that that's why it would be the identity matters to you i guess but that's why it would be on people's minds compared to the times of old where i don't think you'd find many interviews what they're saying like we've got them white men in there so you've got to see it like it's much more prominent i know exactly what you mean i think that there's a handful uh a non-zero a notable amount of films that do exist that don't do that marketing bullshit but still get incorrectly misattributed as being woke or political merely because of just the gender or race of a character or the prominence of the gender or race or i think that would make for a really good question for drinker is uh is it possible that arcane isn't good despite being woke it's just good it doesn't have to have anything to do with what but it would depend on his definition it's not even woke yeah exactly like obviously if rustle asks that we may have gotten an answer but it's a brief interview at best great and ridiculously male in a way where like it parades that as an identity but you haven't noticed it and you haven't criticized it what if we say that both of those things are stupid what if we say that both of those things are stupid without having to make a big deal of it when we talk about the great female characters in cinema we have characters like ellen rippley she was an alien from the seven it's funny that i it's funny i said rippley before he did because it's like it's the it's like one of the like there are so few that you know exactly which ones they're going to say and this is like part of this is part of the argument right like is like before he says anything you can say rippley right like you know like and it's not to say that i thought you said it was a good example it is but there's very few and so if it depends on it depends on how he's answering the question and we're going to get clarification more clarification for this the second time it's asked so in my perspective he's answering the question in a kind of way to say like oh yeah well this is an issue that doesn't need to be addressed because there's been rippley because there's been sarah connor because there's been trinity and all these examples that he lists from the past whereas i would argue against that saying like okay well the issue isn't that there hasn't been any strong female characters it's just people are trying to make that more representative and it's not necessarily a bad thing if people are if people creating art wish to portray more women in films that's not necessarily a bad thing it doesn't take away from there being men in you know films i guess like maybe like if you look at the total number of projects i guess the number of men in films go down but like it's not like you can't watch the same types of things that you're you're looking for if there are more women in in films right so we have a disagreement on what his intentions are in terms of how he's answering this question and that's why i guess we're going to have to wait for the second time because he he adds to it and he makes it a bit more to run the um the alternate would be that russell says how do we solve the writing good characters he references one of the greatest female characters of all time it's like we did this we cracked it all the way back in the 70s that would just be the simple i seriously think that's exactly what he's saying it's just the same formula the way she's written right all women characters take them seriously respect them have them be layered simple as that yeah yeah i i'm also kind of like anti-formula i don't think that that i don't think one would say the right like it's not like all we're gonna get is exactly what ripply is he means like the approach the discipline yeah i just i just think that at no like he doesn't well we'll wait until the second time he's he's answered the question because yeah well he's a bad character i love ripply she's she's logical she's like commanding and like confident and like like she's a great like what a fucking character i love ripply she's like something that i really love about the alien prejudice but the fact that like you know when people are having these conversations about like oh you know like maybe there should be some more women in movies and you're like ripply like it's the top of every reddit thread like it's it's a really basic bitch thing to say like i'm sorry like it's like the most obvious thing it's the most obvious thing and like that's why i said it is still completely valid a popular example was also just a completely valid answer the answers the question i don't think i buy into this whole like you can't name more than ripply it somehow diminishes the answer when it's true no no because he's he's like the it depends on what question you're answering which is why i said like well then it wouldn't be about ripply if you're responding to if you're responding to jennifer lauren saying i'm the first female hero or whatever like fuck that shit yeah obviously tell her about ripply and all these other people but if the question he's being asked is like hey i have two young daughters what sort of like how do you reconcile with your beliefs about um you know like wokeness and inclusion and hollywood what sort of things would they be able to watch and then you start listing movies from the 80s that are like almost exclusively horror science fiction that you know but so that doesn't really answer the question you genuinely believe right now and what are you saying i guess you genuinely believe right now the drinker believes himself he's been asked to name what characters can inspire women and he's like fucking ripply from the 70s there you go like well he's kind of do you not think at this point that it's already potentially possible that he's definitely not talking about that instead talking about writing discipline i this is this is why i would like to wait for a second uh time he's asked this question because we have a uh we have a disagreement on how we're interpreting what they're talking about because like it's everybody everybody said it you know like that's a part of the conversation you know that's before i was even born they got this right sexism is no more because ripply is existing yeah that's not even i don't know it's what that i have pretty nuanced takes on gender gender identity and you know like gender related issues i think that like each gender has their own struggles you know like there's no like all men are bad or all women are bad like you know we're just people most people are shit you know if you have a bad experience with you know if you have a bad experience with like the type of gender you're attracted to and you're not like socially involved with them all the time and your only interactions are your bad dates then you might think all men are bad or you might think all women are bad you know like turns out most people are just kind of shit i don't know about that you know it's not it's not exactly gendered it turns out most people are kind of shit you know hey man i mean i don't experience i don't know i don't i don't agree with that do you know most people oh my god there's shit surround yourself with good people surround yourself with people that you like surround yourself with people that get you people that understand you people that accept you people that don't judge you right surround yourself with those people don't don't think that like an entire gender is like bad you know i get it i get it or an entire race you know you've got Sarah Connor from the 80s again fantastic did i mention both of those before he did fantastic actually one of you in the comments mentioned Sarah Connor i don't know if i said that out loud it's like it's like the most obvious this is oh man like i'm trying do you think there's value as well even in your interpretation that he's appealing to people people recognize as opposed to if he started naming characters from things you don't even know about yeah yeah but it but it all depends on what question he's answering and how he's answering it but you're right now taking issue with choosing Ripley and Sarah specifically not that you're that he's got two examples i mean yeah he he's listed the the obvious ones yes yeah my suggestion is and the the issue the issue comes with how we've interpreted the question and the answer but we're we're not going to be able to hash it out until the second time i'm sorry not to be like a drama horse but we can we can listen to this whole thing and keep it all in like it's there i think there is some i think that a lot of criticism against the critical drinker is overblown i think that there's a lot of people that know that they want to hate him but can't articulate why and can't really articulate why they don't like him and i don't agree with it i think there are legitimate criticisms to make against him i don't think that he's like a bad person i don't think he's a piece of shit i think that he's a person just viewing media the way that he views media and and like you know whatever makes sense to him is going to make sense to him you know i don't think that it's coming from any sort of malicious perspective but i'm you know i'm gonna say why i disagree at the very least well character really interested yeah trinity from the matrix from the 90s like they got all this stuff right they just didn't feel they need to make that the sole focus of these characters they were interesting characters first and foremost whether they were female whether they were women or sorry whether they were black white whatever it didn't matter that the main focus was that they were a well written character that's the difference that's what we can't do now see isn't that it he's well he i mean he said their main focus was there were well written characters we can't do that now that's what we can't do now and russell brand is like asking him like but surely that clarifies the confusion there we'll wait for the second time we'll wait for the second time i'm sorry do you okay here's my question do you think that like part of the perception of them making that a big deal is to do with how people are reacting to it because i think from a marketing perspective i think that they were thinking like pretty much the exact same things in terms of representation in terms of like you know like mulan like they were they were trying to go for the asian market they're trying to go you know there's definitely stories where they created female characters and they were intention of the writers was to be hey let's make a story with female characters to try and you know make a movie for the female market and that's going to be our selling point that's going to be our advertising point right it's not like that didn't exist in the 90s or the 80s or whatever you you know your idealist version of cinema is it's that a lot of people didn't freak out about it as much right yeah but i think part of it goes to the quality of how those characters and those movies were written right well that's going to be drinkers point but we're waiting for the clarification i assume yeah and so you look at like this weird backlash culture and i think it's important not to mistake the amount of people criticizing it for the actual intent of the writers and the producers right like i think that that existed in the 80s in the 90s like etc like for sure there were people in hollywood and writers and directors that were trying to be representative of a culture they were trying to be woke or whatever you want to call it right like it's not like that didn't exist that like this is such a weird thing to say right it's just there's more people talking about it in a not just critical way but in a very narrowly critical way where people are essentially like parroting a lot of other talking points and people are essentially you know giving a lot of uh it's like a feedback loop is that the term i'm looking for like i think that that can cause people to believe that maybe it wasn't a thing that happened in the past but like it's all there right like if the movie moulin was like a thing that got released today everybody would be like oh so you're trying to make a movie with an asian female character and she's playing a man and it's trans or whatever like um i don't disagree that they would be people reacting that way in many ways but it's with keeping in mind obviously the new one came out people despised it and a lot of the videos were focused around how good it was no yeah but it could have been good there's nothing stopping it from being good necessarily like theoretically the moulin was released today independently of it being released what i'm saying i'm saying if moulin didn't exist i think that is i'm not saying that these people wouldn't also admit that moulin was a good movie from the 90s i just think that people perceive it differently because we have a warped perspective of like what intentions are whereas i'm saying the disney moulin film from the 90s is something that could very well have been just as political in its intentions just as like oh we're trying to have more representation we want to get this market uh we want to see this people represented in this way it very well could come from the exact same intentions as the filmmakers i think what blows it out of proportion and why it's such a huge issue right now is not necessarily that it's a thing that's happening but the fact that we have the internet and movie studios have really cringe marketing on the internet in a way like a lot of the times you don't see this shit in the trailers right even for these current movies like the the way that these these identities are paraded around is not even necessarily from like the primary marketing it's coming from like the twitter accounts it's coming from like the news articles right so this is this is like the whole clickbait culture is a very new thing and i think that that's part of why it seems like it's happening more in this way from the intentions of the filmmakers whereas i'm arguing this exact same thing could have been taking place and very well probably was but we just didn't have fucking clickbait articles and we didn't have twitter accounts and so the the the viral marketing aspect of it is mainly what to criticize and not necessarily the inclusion of characters in the film or the even the intentions of the writers as they include those characters in the film so with regard to the original anime film if it was to release today brand new no other context there would be plenty of people saying it is woke and it is an allegory for trans stuff they're trying to show blah blah blah blah but i actually think that it would be an easy win over for most of the culture to agree that Mulan is pretty damn good and it would be because of the character writing that's what people would argue and i guarantee you drinker would have argued that in that alternate timeline but it was really good i think i i think that most people even if like there can be conversations on you know whether or not a movie is trying to be woke or whether or not the marketing is trying to be woke i think that most of the outrage just comes from like the marketing and even like before the movie is released for a lot of films like you know there's plenty of plenty of films that one would incorrectly attribute or perceive as woke that just wind up being good movies and then like it's you know most people just don't give a shit so just seems like an overblown i would reassure you something that um there is cringe on every side in terms of a film comes out and everyone like runs wild with a particular interpretation blah blah blah but there's a lot of pushback within those spheres themselves like you know a lot of people thought arcane was absolute shit and drink would have been one of the people to push back on it you have the um dead space which we got a big old blast of they made a woman look so early and breasts were reduced in size and people went fucking nuts saying it wasn't hyperwoken they made a woman wet they reduced her breast size from the original to the remake oh they made a woman older yeah they what they did they had well they it's um we're in the age of like mo cap and stuff is becoming prominent so they had a character in the game be played by her voice actress uh tanya clark who was 51 um and in the original her character was uh seemingly younger than which character nicole nicole yeah nicole wow i never played the remake you should it's really fucking good play the remake it's really good highly recommend it and so you got that and this is it like is it is it like a that much worth playing if i've played the first one it's better than the first one i yeah i adore the first dead space the remake is but are there like more levels is it like each and more is one big interconnected ship now it's really fucking cool i mean of course there's just uh well the tram is hidden loading yeah i mean but yeah but like a lot more of it is interconnected than in the original game and of course there's just the vibe and atmosphere is uh improved pretty considerably by new technology it's got incredible lighting amazing like visual atmosphere is top design and uh there's a lot of cool additions to the story as well to improve it yes nicole gets a lot more material the fact that isaac can talk is really beneficial because we get to understand how he feels about the things that are going on and he gets to interact with the characters yeah it's gonna write these isaac in the remake it's it's uh whereas like resident evil four remake is a different game to the original uh and that's value in playing both i still think there's also value in playing both of the dead space games but if you only you only had one to play it would be the remake i would recommend and uh yeah and so the reason i bring it up of course is that's one of several examples including stuff like um what was the was did resident evil four remake it hit for woke as well uh yeah i think people yeah because they thought that ashley wasn't attractive enough yeah yeah some people thought that ashley wasn't attractive enough which is so they turned her into a mouse and so we've got that and thought it will ragnarok and then like i said okay some other stuff where uh drinkers come out and said like all of these are excellent and that there's no need for criticism of that regardless like ridiculous and so what i guess i'm trying to say is that these kinds of fights against the more insane sort of like jumping to conclusions i think happens in literally all of these different communities that are currently popular for uh seeing a film in a particular angle and by the way this applies to everyone and so like you know uh you don't need to be told this because i know you're you're aware of it from how people can speak about you or whatever but just try to avoid lumping him in with with any bigger group of maybe thinking something crazy about a particular piece of media yeah like lulon for example i think i make a lot of yeah i think i make a lot of clarifications or you know i throughout the stream i'm like trying actively not to even if you know it's not 100 it has more to do with the reaction right then i mean it was a thing that got remade today yeah yeah i know but it has more to do like in terms of like what you're trying to claim is the intent of the filmmakers it's not like that wasn't present in other films like you can argue you can argue with the films of the eighties seventies nineties or whatever any films that you love that were like how does he watch so many films that can if he's going to pee every year i don't know go for all the short ones i know when i go to the theater i do not like buy a soda bring a drink anything like that i'm like nope because i know i'm gonna have to get up in pee bro america you just gotta schedule it better right make sure you get one big old piss before you go to the theater i always do but still you know sometimes there's always one you know lined up there's always a pee ready to go second string uh pissaroonie well i mean if you worried that that's a case when you get to the cinema you just gotta go again right just in case to get the last little sure but like an hour an hour and a half later i might have to pee again because that's just you know that's how it works i mean yeah i guess some blood is some blood is a different some blood is a different i just i drink a lot of water i got i got a pee you know fair enough muscle you know like i'm muscle i'm gun police whatever like those are all equally politically and culturally and racially motivated in terms of like what the filmmakers decided was market what they decided people wanted to see right like you could make the same arguments of like oh you're trying to represent this for political reasons you can make those exact same arguments to the films that you love right you can make those exact same arguments there's gonna be um ever there's gonna be something behind every decision that's made for sure but of course the categories of uh how egregious those decisions might be is gonna be different for everybody um i you know like if someone or how much how much it's noticed right because i i think it's easier to notice something when it's not considered the norm or it's not considered familiar right it's more of it's inherently more of a political statement if it's going against the grain otherwise you're just doing what people are doing um sure but of course like the as we went over before it feels like that's just like absolutely and thoroughly plugged into the marketing now versus when it before where i just i didn't hear the equivalent of that for a lot of stuff growing up in the 90s yeah because we didn't have fucking clickbait in twitter they had marketing they knew what would they market films on it'd be like it'd be like movie stars it'd be the events themselves we'll get some fucking like microfiche newspaper slides or whatever let's go to the library and see if we can find some articles about like them being like oh the diverse cat you know like they were celebrating the lion king being like an african story you know they were celebrating that that portraying the culture of africa in the marketing before that came out like it was it existed it existed for sure i'm not going to say it's not existent it's just it wasn't twitter and it wasn't like we don't have like this weird like self-feeding uh outrage culture right like we just we don't have algorithms that are incentivizing us uh we we didn't in the 90s we didn't have algorithms that were incentivizing us into just saying the most like fucking provocative thing or engaging with content that actively makes us angry right so like a lot of a lot of marketing nowadays i feel is intentionally being provocative and intentionally being things that they think people will get mad at because people share it right i think that's the biggest difference in terms of like well but wouldn't that still then be indicative of a change of time and that's why people are reacting to it they're like if it's all self-filling yeah but that's less to do with the movies and more to do with just the technology and the type of marketing that we have right i mean the marketing's got to be considered alongside the studios that make the movies and so it's all a big package even if it's caused by our jump in technology and the interest in clickbait and exaggerations it's like well that would still all be a part of the culture that's worth criticizing from the point of view of several different people including drinker sure i i just think that you know i i i think that what we just discussed is a more uh detailed well because what you've talked about is they have incentives to do so but that's still choices they are making yeah yeah i just don't think that that should be confused with like necessarily the movies themselves or even the intent of the writers creating the film because a lot of films a lot of films especially in the 70s and 80s and 90s were kind of propaganda and that's not to say that they're bad movies right that's going to go over really badly with a lot of people because the word is very spicy but um it really that's going to be a semantics thing it just depends on how you define it and how it's used it's it's it's literal it's true i mean uh depending on the film i'd be inclined to completely agree but it's such a like i think that's going to come across really insane to a lot of people because they'd rather call it something like this way of storytelling as opposed to well some kind of you know some of the word because propaganda is too closely associated with like war and way the highest shit for a lot of people but i get what you're saying i mean we can pull up a definition but i don't mind if people think that that's a weird word to use because i i don't think it's untrue well like i said i'm pretty much in agreement i just think that semantically people are gonna get like what like a lot of these films work out you know have you noticed like the the trends of like what race the villains were have you noticed like when we had so to make people understand that you don't necessarily take issue with the presence of propaganda in film correct yeah it's just i i mean it's a it depends on the context but i mean it doesn't inherently make a film bad i would say all right there's been a lot of conflict in american history with russia a