So we have a jam-packed day, and these are the waiting days of the legislative session, and we focused on two things, two important things to cover today. And of course, we're going to hear briefly from some of the most active, engaged energy community leaders across the state. As you've heard me say probably before, there are over 120 of these all volunteer grassroots groups that have been working many of them for over a decade in their communities on climate and clean energy. So there's a handful of them here. Help yourself to pizza for people. And the goal was just to have them say a few words about what they're doing, knowing that good public policy undergirds their efforts to succeed and their partners in getting to 90 by 2050. So we've done a lot here. There's a lot more to do. And these local leaders and communities are partners with you in that. And so the goal is just to give you in the next 20, 25 minutes, so please, Energy Committee votes be free, just an overview of what you're up to, and what you'd like to partner with the legislature to see happen. So starting first, not to put you on the spot, but make Kate work. All right, Kate Stevenson, batter up from Montpelier. So I'm Kate Stevenson. I'm the chair of the Montpelier Energy Advisory Committee. We have a very active energy committee here in town. And we've been working on a variety of initiatives, both public outreach to the community and within the municipality. My focus has been on a lot of the municipal buildings and operations. So you might have heard about some of our recent projects, the district heat coming into downtown, one megawatt of solar for city buildings and school district. And we recently launched a revolving loan fund that will help us fund small energy efficiency projects. So we've been going through all the buildings and identifying projects that we want to take on that will save taxpayers money on their energy bills. And yeah, really appreciate all of the partnership that we have with Efficiency Vermont. They've been a huge resource to us in kind of tracking all of our work and identifying priorities. You might have heard we won one of 10 finalists in the country for the Georgetown University Energy Prize this year. And a lot of that work was in collaboration with the folks at Efficiency Vermont. Thanks. Sorry. I'm Duncan MacDougall from Waterbury. I work for Waterbury League. We're an energy committee that's been running for 12 years. We've been quite active. Just to give you a few examples of what we do. Two weeks ago, we had our 12th annual LEAP Energy Fair. It's grown into the largest energy fair in the state of Vermont. We have usually between 6 and 700 people come to the fair. We have more than 75 exhibitors to give you a sense of the range of the energy economy here in Vermont. And one thing that really stands out is that people come not to save the environment, but they come to save money and save energy. And there's really a growing need for that. People want to have the expertise. They want to get their questions answered. They want to know how to move forward. And a lot of the incentives and the programs that are generated at this building really make a big difference. They help people take the step to move forward. And the kind of savings that we generate through bringing those experts together with the people that need to save money and save energy, those are savings that last for decades. So it's not a one-time thing. Just if you weatherize your home, if you change your vehicle, et cetera, those go on for a long time. We support training for heat pumps, weatherization. We're probably gonna do an electric vehicle, rodeo in our town so people can learn about electric vehicles. But the bottom line is that the steps that you guys take really make a difference. And there are 120 town energy committees, and if your town doesn't have one, talk to Joey from DNRC. It really makes a big difference and helps every town that we're in. Thank you. This here. My name's Linda Gray, and I'm from the town of Norwich. And our energy committee has been around, I think, since 2002. So we've done a variety of different things working with residents on weatherization and solar. We've done those numbers of years in a row. And so we've accomplished a lot because we have about 20% of our residents having gone solar either on-site or off-site. We've worked with the town, the town, and the elementary school in our library. All have a power purchase agreement so that their electricity is solar. They didn't have to make the investment. They're just purchasing the power. We are in the midst of doing enhanced energy planning, the process outlined from Act 174. And I want to tell you guys, I think that is an excellent process. And it's having us have a better, broader understanding of where we are right now and where we need to go. Something that is also raised, one of the elements of it is to figure out within your town boundaries, how much renewable energy generation should you be aiming for? Should you plan to have developed in your town? And something that that's highlighted for me is some concerns relating to the current rules and potentially the new rules coming out for net metering. Because over the last, under the current net vehicles, solar development has gone down a lot, that's a concern. Because if we're gonna try to meet our goals, and if net metering gets off the table, that's going to be very tricky. So I'll just leave it at that, with that concern for you to look out for. Thank you. I'm Steve Myers from Middlebury. We serve on the town energy committee. We've been active for about nine years, I think. What I'd like to talk to you about, you'll hear more about the town energy committee if you already have, and you'll hear some more from other folks. Middlebury is also being under this program called the Climate Economy Model Communities Program. It's a program of the Vermont Council on Rural Development. We were the second town chosen. They're now rolling it out in Randolph, and I expect to continue to do that. Two or three of those per year. Community organizing process that you may be familiar with, that BCRD does broadly across a number of different topics. And so we're able to bring together over 150 community members and leaders within the community to focus on the question of how do we begin to think about what a community looks like? How is it structured? How do we continue to make it improve it as a place to live, as a place to work, as a place to raise your family and stay engaged in community life as we transition from our current economy to a new post-carbon economy? We're already as a world, as a community and everything in between. We're already in the process of that transition. And we have choices to make about whether we're just gonna get plowed over by it and the forces at work, or whether we actually choose to engage and try to be on a leading front of some of these things so that both as communities and as a state of mind, position ourselves favorably in a regional, national, or international economy. So thank you for all the work that you do. I guess the last thing that I'd say having spent some time in this building over the years and around politics is that I think the public may well be ahead of where folks are in this building on this issue. And that has happened before, it will happen again. And I encourage you to engage with that in mind and really start to take even bolder actions than the ones we've been able to take as a state so far. Thank you. I just wanted to make a comment that was following up on what you said that you pointed out that sometimes town energy groups are certainly ahead of what we're doing in this building. And the woman from Montpelier mentioned that her great work was efficiency in the mind. It seems like every year we are protecting that funding so that they continue to do the good work that they do. There's always somebody in this building who's trying to cap them or whatever. And I think we all need to realize that we'd all be paying more for electricity. So when you have the experiences and you can really spread it on why that would be important to us since I've been here. Good question. Excuse me, Marcellory was a self-reliant energy committee. The city started our committee about 10 years ago. And two of our recent projects include the 2.1 megawatt solar landfill project that over the next 25 years should save taxpayers two to five million dollars. Secondly was a collaborative project we did for the two-year energy prize. And our residents are now enjoying $750,000 in savings annually on gas and electric bills because of that. Our accomplishments really build on things that we will accomplish here, your programs and policies. And we also rely heavily on the expertise, services and incentives through the energy efficiency utility offered through efficiency Vermont and Vermont gas. So those are very helpful. Currently, we are focused on local, reducing emissions and local and regional transportation as well as working with our city staff to help them meet their commitments to the Vermont Climate Fledged Coalition. Fledged their commitments. So I'm here representing, unofficially, my committee, our committee, people gave me input, but I'm also here tomorrow. And I'm alarmed at what is happening on the federal level right now in terms of misinformation that's out there, climate, peer-reviewed climate science being ignored and sound economic analysis being ignored. So it's just, I'm very thankful for the progress that you have supported because we really need strong leadership in our state right now to pick up health estate, pick up the case, to do take the substantive action to address climate change. Otherwise, future generations of our kids, their descendants are gonna run into a world that has environmental and political instability that I think is hard to imagine right now. So again, thank you for what you're doing. We're very encouraged by the climate package that seems to be going forward today this week. In particular, the decarbonization study, I think it's very useful in terms of, especially folks who have some doubts about, oh, can this really help? I think it's really helpful to do that money to study different carbon pricing policies and cap and trade policies, whether it's through the Western initiative, climate initiative with California, Quebec, and Ontario and the other ones. So again, very important and also happy to hear that it sounds like the $500,000 will be returned to will not be taken out of the Clean Energy Development Fund. So these are just things that we really need to look at for bold action and thank you very much for the opportunity to get into that. I think I'll make a difference. Well, Stevenson from Heartland. I'm a new energy committee member and our energy committee's been around for about 10 years. We're down to two people and in the last few months we're up to eight people. I think a lot of people are really getting active, coming together, I think we can together address this problem. I know for me, I have family in the West Coast. I used to take care of lessons in Monsito. The 20 deaths there really hit close to home for me, to my old home. We're already paying the price for not taking anything. We're not going to be able to afford what it's going to cost unless we, somebody steps up and takes a leadership and I think for Mons is a position that we can do that. But the West Coast is in some ways ahead of us at this point. I'm on the energy committee, I've taken this transportation on as my topic and so I have interest in, and making sure that it's since transportation is actually the biggest user of energy in Vermont at this point, it's impossible to open an energy bank to help electrification in the lab as quickly as possible. And it's certainly on my personal agenda on the energy committee getting charging stations out there so that people don't feel, I think in California I know my brother doesn't want to get in the life of the vehicle because he says so when he wrote in somebody else's they had to wait in line for the charge. And we don't want to, when this wave sweeps across Vermont we want to be ready for it so we don't want any to go through the line down. Also I'm on the, I'm not a physician myself but I'm on the Physicians for Responsibility, Social Responsibility mailing list and it's mind-boggling, the health costs not addressing this problem. I think that's all I have to say as a new member but thank you. Thank you. I know you can carry them in a time Allen and then Chuck. Hopefully, okay so Allen Johnson I was a founding member of the Heart and Energy Commissions some 10 years, a lot of years ago I was in the shoulder for eight years or so until I was demoted to liaison and I was elected to select board so now I'm on two years into a select board position three years in and I just wanted to share our biggest challenge at the municipal level is 500 kilowatts, not even a cap because we were one and a half times over I was in support of the rules when we went back and it's pretty clear that something needs to be done that I understand the need for that rule but I also understand that preventing Harvard at night part of Vermont from proceeding with our rule was rolled out when we're on green mountain powers grid which is not hurting and can take all the renewables we can throw at it that we're an unintended consequence of that rule so some adjustments around those net meter rules are clearly called for and then further some support for the utilities that the net meter rules put in place to allow them to transition to a greater infrastructure like green mountain power and so many other utilities Vermont have so that they can manage these renewable these distributed renewable resources which is how the market's moving anyways those are really important things that get me to the management level we, I want to share our biggest success got so many great things going on but clearly the outstanding success we've had in the last year is the hybrid of Vermont's first full-time energy coordinator as a staff position and we did that with the expectation and hope that within three or five years that his position would pay for itself and we'd start season returns I found out on Tuesday night the town manager reported that his work has already covered its general fund costs and we are now seeing returns, seven months into position so getting those resources for Hartford ninth largest town of Vermont, million plus dollars on energy between towns and schools about 50 million dollars as a community it's easy for us to look at the numbers and it took us five years of full team to get people to look at the numbers to make this decision and hire this position most towns in Vermont don't have that kind of expense to manage so getting resources like that at the regional planning level having teams of people in the regional planning commissions that can not just do strategic planning which we've got a lot of great help for already but can also manage projects and implement them and be boots on the grounds for the smaller towns where the select board people like me are actually out driving the public workstrucks which could follow by mine you know that's most of Vermont so we need to support those folks too in transition and I'll just throw into that you know this this is for me you know I've been at this for over a decade and my understanding of the situation has morphed pretty dramatically over the years and I came into this with you know how do we make this transition happen how do we make this transition happen and that was the drive for almost 10 years and in just this fall we've come across an information about some market forces that have been driving this transition course whether we like it or not so there's automated vehicles coming it would cost the renewables and storage it's dropping dramatically so we've got 10, 15 years of energy disruption that's coming and the first one's in transportation so we're trying to shift a little bit more from how do we make this happen in the town of Oregon with our energy commission from how do we make this transition happen to how do we manage this transition to make sure that our town and our state hopefully you'll be saying that our state can take advantage of these transitions and not be left behind and not leave our most vulnerable citizens behind as so many technology disruptions have done over the years so I really hope that we can start thinking about that and on that note you know I have a lot of deep thoughts about was it still smart to hire an energy coordinator yeah I get the math it's still good even if energy costs go down and we still save money with an energy coordinator at the town level but you know the question of do you have to ask yourself these questions these are tough questions does it still make sense to put a price on carbon in Vermont and more specifically does it still make sense to put a price on fossil fuels in Vermont and I've thought hard about this and I absolutely believe it is because fossil fuels now represents the single most vulnerable aspect of our economy in Vermont so we need to get a price on it so that we can start funding programs to help not just individuals definitely individuals especially our own income folks but our industries as well transition off of the need for fossil fuels including those that sell fossil fuels you know think about every gas station in Vermont most of them don't make a profit on the gas that they sell they use the stores as their main source of profit there's a heck of a lot of expense around those things so when they stop selling gasoline that's gonna have a major effect on our economy so we have to manage that as well so putting a price on it now before it goes away so that we can fund this transition and do it right and manage land use issues the list goes on so that's where we're struggling in Harvard to start thinking about that stuff and we'd love to help the state have to figure it out too thanks Chuck, last brief word before we move on to a whole other really important presentation brief word but on the most important word oh I'm with the Heinsberg Energy Committee in Florida I'll just tell you one everywhere which is coordinating with seven other energy committees in the Chicken County area to put on a workshop series and its focus primarily on getting existing homes to net zero and that after we're very encouraged by what we're finding and some of the research that we've come up with but essentially we're realizing that people do want this they want to get their homes to net zero and they can do it by first of all for recommending weatherize your house second, probably put something like a heat pump in there that's a likely base and then third supply the renewable energy so those three things combined are what people are doing anyway what we're finding is that no one's coordinating that activity so we are actually going to figure back with the program from a group in the state that has piloted a project called ZEN which is zero energy now that actually coordinates all that activity we're also at the present moment looking at financing so we talk about incentives really help because if you look at somebody's utility bills and then look at what it would cost to pay a mortgage to pay those things you just put in your house they get pretty close and if you have incentives and you have good financing or even financing that's supplemented somehow via the state those things make economic sense and on top of that then you're putting a lot of people to work doing those things so it creates green jobs for us it seems like a win-win kind of situation and it'll help us I think transition to a more sustainable energy economy so we are doing our last four part series after Wednesday night and we're looking at case studies actually houses that have done this and have reduced their monthly income by paying a mortgage instead of all the few months it'll be online where all our energy committees are going to have that on their website and we'll make that available to you too thank you I just want to say thank you for taking the time and sorry for being brief and abrupt and we're going to pull out as you listen to another important focus which will be fully support but I think you've heard it like this about you at the partnership so we'll be back sorry I don't know taking into account would you have in mind for the rest of the hour is there time for us to ask some questions no there aren't we've got the three-foot two-foot I know I'll give them taking that into account if we have time for maybe one question do you have a question okay I'll can I ask I don't have so much a question as I have a request from you many of you who spoke come from towns where your representative or your senator are sitting here in this room and many ways you're preaching to the choir but we have an election season coming up and as Steve Meyer noted there are times when the elected officials in this building seem to act like they're maybe a little bit behind what public sentiment is so I would just encourage you to as you enter election season ask those questions of the candidates who are running and who will appear on your ballot ask them how they feel about increasing the incentives to help people transition away from fossil fuels ask them how they plan to vote on some of these issues that are coming up in the future and make your decisions on who to support based on that I encourage other energy committee members who maybe aren't here today to also do that because it's important for the people to push because we know that the push back that we get when we propose some of these things is going to be well funded, well coordinated and loud so we need you to be louder thank you so much thank you so I'd like to start by thanking Climate Caucus for existing in the first place and being bold and courageous enough to take on issues of climate change I know it's not always an easy thing to do in the positions that you're in but we're extremely appreciative that you're here my name is Julie Massuga and I've been in the battle against issues of climate justice with groups like Projector Prax Park and through 50 Vermont for about two years now and I spend a lot of time in public hearings and in meetings where I find myself in a sea of people from older generations I spend a lot and I listen to them speak with fear in their voices they're afraid of what kind of planet they're leaving behind for their grandchildren and as one of those grandchildren I'm terrified and I ask myself the same thing every day our elected officials have to ask themselves these tough questions too will they find themselves in the pockets of the fossil fuel industry or will they join us in struggle to make this planet livable for those they were elected to represent progress has been slow on this front but we're getting somewhere in 2012 fracking was banned in Vermont however it's still okay for us to import fracked fuel from across our borders via pipelines this time last year Vermont Gas completed their 41 mile ANGP pipeline which is now under investigation for numerous alleged safety violations 41 miles of reckless construction all at the expense of the health and safety of people our wildlife and our climate not to mention rate payers as the cost of the project has nearly doubled for these reasons and many more we are asking for politicians that we have voted into office to consider bold legislation like H746 which calls for a ban on any new fossil fuel infrastructure in the state 31 pounds have signed on to have to prevent new fossil fuel infrastructure in their towns but we need to do more bills like this would reduce greenhouse gas emissions helping Vermont meet its emissions goals and more importantly help us curb the effects of climate change at the same time this bill would protect rate payers from bearing the cost of new infrastructure if you need a catchphrase we can go green while saving some green at the same time while we're saving money and protecting the climate in the long term we can protect our beautiful state that's inhabitants from the short term the largest of construction that we've seen in our own backyards we're here to say enough is enough and I was going to say something about protecting our future but as I heard last week we're already in this we're already at we're past a breaking point so we're here to say that we're our future as whatever that is in the wake of climate change is not for sale to the fossil fuel industry and today is an interesting day to be talking about this as we speak the head of the EPA is being questioned by Congress about ethics violations it's clear we need to act on the state level if that's where we're at nationally so we hope that you'll join us in trying to protect Vermont by preventing fossil fuel infrastructure from prevailing thank you so we have Laura hi I'm Laura Simon from Hartford, Vermont I'm involved with a few environmental groups about three of them but these are my own comments in Vermont and in my town Hartford there are a lot of reasons that we must pass a bill like the one that Mary introduced age 746 no new fossil fuel bill and Hartford residents have suffered from millions of dollars of damage from Hurricane Irene and most scientists say that the crisis is caused by carbon and methane released into the atmosphere frat gas releases methane I know you're saying we're preaching to the choir that's true so you probably already know these things but evidence tells us we will experience this again more disasters whose homes will be destroyed the next time how much more will we pay in town, state, and federal taxes for the next disaster so there's a proposed frat gas pipeline in the town of New Hampshire that borders my town Hartford it's Lebanon Hartford residents we have no say about it even though our town is bordered by the White River and the Connecticut river so we feel pretty vulnerable to what's happening there and a bill like this could prevent that pipeline from being extended into our town as I think others will tell you Vermont gas is now the PUC, Vermont PUC has started an investigation because of their practices and safety concerns companies like Vermont gas and other pipeline companies they either threaten or actually use eminent domain to take people's land they do not listen to the wishes of the local residents and they pass their costs on to customers as you know even though their budgets have doubled what was expected and approved so we know folks that the feds are not going to take leadership on this 350 Vermont as you heard from Julie had the resolutions in 31 towns many folks here had resolutions in your town some legislators four towns I represent four towns all four of them exactly did all four of them have resolutions? certainly three did did Sharon have one? Sharon did so I was just going to the Shumlin had signed an agreement with the global climate leadership that committed us to reductions in emissions up to 95% by 1990 and we're not meeting those benchmarks and I'm just going to quote a little bit about climate change presents worldwide challenges and risk to the environment and economies impacting human health, increasing extreme weather events and threatening natural resources in this next legislative session we must pass a bill like 746 this is what the 31 towns that voted for the resolution this is what they're asking of the legislature and we must do this towards the safety of our children future generations I think what we would like to hear after we do our presentation is what all of you feel the next step is and what you're willing to commit to we actually have a little sign on sheet to see if you're willing to be a sponsor for this kind of legislation next session and we're counting on you to take leadership and introduce in the past no fossil fuel bill next legislative session thank you thank you I'm three I'm three I'm going to bring my chair with my knees back and also I'm not very comfortable speaking publicly even though I may seem like it so I couldn't fall down but anyway I'm a social worker I'm a clinical social worker and I was listening to and I've been meaning to talk with you guys and I try to bring this perspective I've come to a couple of the caucuses in February, January, February about that time that I've slapped off but I have this perspective it speaks to something someone said earlier about how people are more willing to change than business is allowing us to and politicians of course have to really balance that and I appreciate what you guys do but what I see and I've worked in 21 schools or so in the Orange County area I'm in private practice now but I worked with Claire Martin Center and worked with mostly teenagers mostly boys but the testimony that I bring from them is generally a sense of denial but also a clear sense that they're terrified which is why there's denial now I see boys who try to you know bring some macho things to their world that's what they think their identity is well these kids are scared and it's not just because they're teenagers but because of what they face and so the biggest thing is jobs of course but the second thing I think is the world around them so war environment but one kid I have who goes to Oxbow High School he said that 90% percent this was news to me of his friends not just friends but the whole school body know about climate change global warming they know what it is and they're positively against it so when I talk about what they bring to me in our sessions and say I haven't collected the data and I haven't done a good job of really collecting the data but I could that a large percentage of them are too afraid and too unable to articulate the fear that they have and so we're doing that and you and the climate caucus are doing that but this bill here is a counterbalance to the fear of actually stopping the infrastructure in its tracks and like I said I'm not good speaker but if we don't stop the infrastructure in its tracks there will be no opening for the green alternatives it just can't happen and I know that US legislators have to look at how that's going to transition how it's going to work and I know my representatives are doing that but it's not fast enough and it's not fast enough for these kids so that's why I'm here and I felt I had to speak because these kids don't have a voice so I'd like to do some research I come from a good research institution where I got my degree and I need to do my work but I'd like you guys to lead and take the risk of supporting this bill to stop the infrastructure now and not later because as we continue to invest it'll become harder and harder with the new pipelines to really create space for what other things we're talking about so that's it I just wanted to bring their perspective I'm Jeffrey Gardner from Bradford and I think first of all I'd like to thank Mary for introducing this bill in the house I think that took enormous courage we look at the national scene almost everything official presses against what you've done the same actually our state as well I was really impressed by all of the things that were said town by town here today and I think our worry and what we would like to overcome with this bill is the creeping thought behind all of that that all of that good work and all of the good work that could follow after it could be obviated by new fossil fuel infrastructure we don't only have to decarbonize we do have to do that we also have to decasify I know all of you know that gas emissions as a greenhouse gas are 86 times more powerful over the short run 10 to 20 years than carbon and that is something really serious to take into account when you also know that somewhere between 3 and 11 or 12 percent of the gas that is fracked from the well head all the way to where you turn your stove on leaks and it's those emissions that are critical in all this now where this bill to pass three things that are possible in the future where you incur one is this line here extending the pipeline Vermont gas pipeline to Rutland would not be able to occur it's on hold now why is it on hold it's on hold because people have opposed it I have not seen political opposition to it it was wonderful last year when we came to this group and we had complaints about what was happening at DPS relative to a whole range of topics we asked you to write them and ask them to ask the public utilities commission to reconsider the certificate of public good and you did that and the answer that you got was we'll get back to you later I suspect they never got back to you later and I worry about that this bill would make that impossible second of all there was a pipeline gas pipeline proposed from upstate New York to run across northern Massachusetts and come into our state and Massachusetts and Vermont and the idea was that it was going to be a gas fired electrical plant and in some way that sounds great because we buy our gas to run our electrical system from other states well is it so great probably not we have to find other ways of doing things like that that's not happening for now why is it not happening for now because kinder Morgan now doesn't find that to be profitable will they find it to be profitable later probably because one thing to understand about this is that the pressure to get the stuff oil and gas out of the ground by cracking is so intense that what rules these days is a kind of gold rush mentality and that has landed us in enormous problems for example in Addison County with the Addison natural gas pipeline so this is on hold something else that threatens is this black line that black line is the Portland to Montreal oil pipeline 76 years old it brought gas from important Portland into Canada during the Second World War 76 years old carrying crude at that time the goal here is to reverse the flow in that pipeline and bring Tarzan's Dilbet highly corrosive through the northeast kingdom across New Hampshire and then down in Portland the pipeline probably cannot take that who is thinking about that people in Portland are thinking about it they pass the local ordinance that would block their port being used that now is in federal court why? because the pipeline companies are claiming it's in restraint of interstate trade if they lose we've got a big problem to face there if we had this bill that would go by the boards too maybe not because it would be crossing a state boundary that puts it in the pocket of FERC to decide whether the project is permitted or not and FERC the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission has until recently approved just about everything this bill that we're asking you to support can't really say no fossil fuel infrastructure here if this becomes part of FERC proceeding however it does instruct the Department of Public Service in this state to oppose this pipeline or any other new fossil fuel infrastructure project under the jurisdiction of FERC we're talking about big danger here not danger way in the future hard to see of climate change although those realities are becoming more and more present all the time and that brings up the issue of accidents safety concerns public health concerns right here in Addison County in fact you see right here in Vermont that gold rush mentality and the disregard that it imposes both with respect to the public processes that are supposed to restrain that sort of thing and also disregard for people all in the name of a cheap fuel not so cheap when you consider all of the proceedings that have gone on that have cost the state lots of money not to speak of all the people who have opposed it who have been arrested in opposing it which is a further expense for the state in Addison County the reason that there now is a new proceeding at the Public Utilities Commission about the health and safety consequences of the way in which this pipeline was constructed is owing to a handful of people in the area of that pipeline spending months it's all began in the summer of 2016 gathering information through discovery process about how this pipeline was built how it was inspected how it was poorly built and how it failed to be inspected properly at this point most of that evidence is documentary we do have a photograph that you probably all have seen already of a pipeline buried 18 inches when it's supposed to be buried 4 feet and further serious problems a whole range of them I invite all of you just to take a quick look through the products of the discovery process in this case and see what has occurred there the extent of it we don't really know the really important thing though is this small group of assets in county had been doing the government's job this is about how the department of public service has not followed through on grave safety concerns their motive I have my guesses they're really not important the fact of the matter is that a project of this type is huge relative to assets we want to see how even with the best intentions they could have properly overseen a project like this that's why we need this legislation and that's why I think what we'd like you to do is to let us know if you would be interested in signing on to work with us to get this passed because it really is important in many ways comes that double bell signing yeah so we're going to be moving quickly towards that I want to say something I would ask of you folks which is I tried to address this 20 years ago at the local level and felt my god I live in a town of 2,000 people what can we do? I'm going to run for the legislature in the legislature I tried to feel like my god we're so remote from the people we all really need to work together and one of the things you folks can do right with feet on the ground in your hometown is to not let your family and friends and neighbors off the hook when they pardon the expression I don't say this to them because I don't want to insult people but you and I know we hear a lot of bullshit okay and it's people themselves quote skeptics skepticism is holding off holding out for better evidence not ignoring the proof okay it's not skepticism it's stubbornness and we've got to not let people off the hook there's also the idea of that well there's always been a naturally occurring warming and cooling cycle on the planet that's right that's our baseline that's how we know we've got a problem from that rhythm so so profound we people lots and lots of personal conversations multiplied 630,000 times will give us more support the other thing is Mary alluded to this I'm sorry to be so practical but we've got an election coming up and you know you need to put signs in your lawn as ugly and stupid as they are and ask the hard questions of every candidate as Sarah said okay folks thank you so much thank you we'll be back here


Criminal law. A criminal law case is when the government will try to make a case against an individual who has been accused of a crime. A jury or a judge will decide if they're guilty or not. But if they're found guilty, they could go to jail, have to pay a fine, or even both.


My tech guy in Boston will text me and tell me that we are not streaming. So I'm interested in theater and technology by way of hearing a lot of theater people talk about how it was the death of theater and how people were just watching computer screens and TV screens and not going to the theater anymore. And coming from a computer family, like my grandmother was a software engineer and my mom worked on the F-15 fighter planes, I think that's simplified or simplistic way of looking at technology. We use it for as many things as we use many other tools for. We use it to do the things we want to do and what we want to do as artists is evolving with our tools. So I have been super super blessed to have amazing people on my panel. This is Sarah Kraft, a multimedia artist and artistic director of Crafty Work. This is Desimona Chang director and David Slaza and video and multimedia also. The vocabulary fills us because a lot of the work that people are doing is pushing the boundaries of technology and theater doesn't have a name yet. Or it falls into that catch-all multimedia. So that being said, what interests do people have in theater and technology in here? Because we wanted to sort of calibrate what we're talking about. Two people's interests and experience so that we're not talking under or above what people are actually interested in. What are you guys interested in? Do you use technology in your own work? Are you interested in storytelling? Are you interested in learning new technologies? All of that. And also working with our sister unions on how to make that happen in theater. You be a technology. Well I can tell you I am really interested in projection mapping as a way to steal the things that are cool about film and add it to sort of the three-dimensional architecting things that are best of theater to make it much better. Building on that, aesthetics, just aesthetics from the theater as applied towards new media and digital delivery. Did you explain that a little bit more? We're talking about applying theatrical approaches or pieces of theater in a theater context. That's why we're here and talking about theater. But we're talking about it in a non-traditional space which is virtual space. How does that play? It's a different thing when you're creating that sort of aesthetic content for a virtual space as opposed to a live theater space. So theater burden on live relationship spaces. This is sort of a broad catch-all that what I'm interested in is finding ways to theater and technology intersect in which it's not simply technology providing the backgrounds for the theater or on the other side of it where theater artists are doing something cool with technology. But where do we actually get to the point where those things are serving the experiences being created in a unique way that could happen in any other context? One of the things I was excited about when inviting these panelists is that they're all doing a lot of that kind of work. It's not you put a show together and you're like, ooh, what tech can we bring to it? But exploring questions through all the available tools, technology being one of them. And there's questions of what's your ratio? When does something, how much tech can you use before it's no longer a theater? Whether that's even a useful question at all, our theater and new media, all sorts, moving towards a yet undiscovered third thing that will be so obvious to future generations that are going to laugh at us for resisting it for so long. But they already are. So with that said, I would love to turn over the stage to my panelists. Do you want to go first? To the presentation? Yeah. Okay, so just a little about myself, my work. I guess, so, well, has anyone here seen my work? I don't know, maybe I don't have to explain it. Okay, so also a couple, you can actually first start the first couple and I'll just talk over it because the audio doesn't matter. I've been making work that is about our relationship with media and technology and mediated experience for decades and whatever tools were available at the time. I started in the early 90s with crappy video and 35mm or 16mm or 8mm film and little tape cassette players and whatever I could get my hands on and have gradually graduated with the technology as it's graduated and evolved. And I think a lot of my work has always been about my own and come out of my own very charged and somewhat conflicted relationship with technology and media and as somebody who I think probably a lot of people in this room have probably shared this experience at some point in my life I had to make the choice about whether I was going to choose a career in the performing arts or choose a career in what is now digital video or film or different forms of media and that's been a very difficult choice I think for some of us and continues to be really interesting and challenging choice and so I did have a career for a while in film and video production specializing in special effects and 3D animation, digital effects and I started inevitably to incorporate that into my performance work.  You don't have to play again, it's fine. So for me I always work with whatever tools I'm working with are very integral and central to the process from the very beginning and the work is often written and shaped around my interaction and the other performers or collaborators interaction with those tools so that it isn't a kind of design process in a separate tone the writing and devising process and because of that I think really really really interesting and exciting things happen when you're able to work that way and actually put it all in a room together and build it from the bottom up from scratch. So I also play a lot with live, this is from a show, I think it's already open. Yeah, it should be. So this is from a show where like a number of my shows I have a lot of live cameras and I play a lot with drawing the audience's attention to our relationship to media and mediated experience and the way that that shapes and informs us and the experience of liveness and live theatre versus mediated experience. Do we have audio for that? There's no audio coming out. This doesn't really make sense without audio so I'll try to explain. Basically, this is a clip that is sort of... I'm playing it because we had been talking about performing myself. Can you guys hear it? Yeah. Okay, so I'm talking about performing myself, performing myself for you and as I'm performing myself I'm keenly observing and choreographing myself, performing myself for you and as I'm performing the solo show for you and I'm talking directly to you I'm actually talking directly into a camera lens while pretending to look at and talk to you and while I'm actually imagining that I'm looking directly at you I'm actually seeing my own reflection beard in the camera lens and I'm sort of playing with all of these sort of meta-layers of live performance, solo performance the construction of identity and self in theatre and in life and our relationship to the media and to camera, to the camera. You can go ahead and stop that because we want you to hear the audio. Anyway, I've played with a lot of different whatever's available at the time I've played with live video chats, live emailing, live web surfing remote bi-located performance where there's interaction between people and audiences in different locations, via live media I'm playing now with more interactive and site-specific work including like interactive public art installation and some of the kind of roving interactive experiences like Desdemona's project Is that the hand-off? That was well done, sorry. Hi, I'm Nesimona Chang. I actually self-identify as a stage producer I guess I'm slowly taking my foot into the world of multimedia technology I wasn't really fascinated by technology because this I think is like more me than me so I kind of know who's me and I think in the past couple of years I've been thinking about I've been doing live essentially, you know, visual either in a box or ten plus years and recently I've been thinking about Facebook and Twitter and all those things we all think about like, oh it's ruining our children and they're just going to replace the person-to-person thing and so I have always thought if this phone is more me than me that this phone knows all the numbers of people I love that has what I'm doing today, it has like my calendar, it has my photos Can I make theater with my phone? And so I proposed this project, the Triangle Lab intersection I got a grant to do this experiment and the experiment it certainly was to create a piece of theater using mobile technology and being not the most cleverly techno-friendly person for an artist I decided to try making a play, an airboat play with QR codes and so I essentially created a work with Christopher Chan, a local playwright to create this story that we call The Next Project and essentially you take this QR code you essentially take your phone and you go to a location in downtown San Francisco you scan the code the code gives you a piece of content you look at the content, at the piece of story you watch the story unfold and it takes you to the next location you watch the next location, you scan the next code so it's kind of like the scavenger hunt slash theater games, slash game system so if you're going to scan that with your QR things it should take you to... so this is kind of where my own techno-sappiness is kind of sucky because it will take you to a YouTube video and then you have to watch and so a lot of what I'm working with is just my capacity to do what I philosophically and ideologically want to do versus my actual ability to do these things so when you watch this video on your phone you essentially watch the first chapter of the story of The Next Project which is a story about two characters who essentially communicate by a text and it's like watching a play because you're watching an exchange on your phone so it's like a phone, so you are the protagonist your phone is the phone and you essentially just watch something happening and so I thought, is this... the question was, is this interesting enough? will people do this? and we'll only watch the project so people stay in a corner of the mission staring at their phones watching people testing and so the answer was yes and then the problem was not enough folks came to do it because the marketing was just not a very good... we just didn't market it very well so that's kind of what I'm thinking about and talking to Laura about this project we put up all these questions about oh my god, I just made drama and there were no humans involved are these characters? are these... what is it? am I going to see the show? am I walking the show? what exactly am I doing as the audience person consuming this piece of theater and quote theater so that's kind of where I am yeah, stage director dipping my foot into multi-video Hi, my name is David Slaza I self-identify as an artist and producer and father and let's just show this so there's a piece I made it's now eight years old seven and a half years old that is still a piece of people that I'm talking about it's called Gadget it's about making an atomic bomb let's just roll it so this was a concept of this piece is to tell a story through a live film can we go back to the top of it and play it with sound so that's me managing the video in a 360 degree environment that people are standing in the middle of watching unfold so it's hard to see this part of the video but it's me at the time with DVD turntables and a remixing newscast and some found footage and pop culture stuff that's me talking about it in a loop so this goes to Red Dawn taking through our perception of the fear around nuclear weapons about that and then the fine thing is really nice so I'm going to stop the sound on the video sorry for a technology panel it's amazing how many basic complications we still are facing even in places like Berkeley Repertory Theatre in beautiful downtown Berkeley so this piece is called Full Balcony so the first piece I showed is about how I was thinking about using technology to tell a story actually engaging in turntables and these things to remix a story some information you may be seeing before you know it's Ronald Reagan you can kind of imagine what he's going to say into a different story that I think is more true or more representative of how we might reflect on his messaging now in a more with some hindsight so that's sort of one vein of things I worked in and I do that both as a designer with other writers and generative artists and I make, offer my own projects this is called Full Balcony which is a also a triangle lab project through Cal State's intersection I remade the Balcony scene from Romeo Juliet through online self submissions so put out a broadcast all around the world asking people to perform the Balcony scene into their cameras to me and mainly on their laptops is how people chose to do that and send me the clip and then I re-edited them into a single Balcony scene and it was, so the concepts around this are what, how can you totally broadcasting and allow people to do that make those decisions on their own and how can you kind of rethink what's possible in the way things are arranged and then it became a task about editing me then it's the artist to say okay I've got these submissions what's the story I'm going to tell and inviting people up against each other we just let them come without the sound so I started it that's me up at the bronze at Cal State's and then it was installed at the bronze at Cal State's and it's kind of cooler when you can hear it but it's okay you can go online and do it anyway and then I cast Romeo and Juliet that guy's in Paris, you know he sent this thing in, very good looking guy and so he said oh if I work lovable in that hand anyway so it was pretty clever and it is a project that's available at fullvalpany.org and also through my website fullvalpany.org may have expired and then the other thing I'm doing now if we cut this the thing that I'm working on now is this so this is it's not video, it's a real thing I'm building called Studio One which is a mobile residency that we could live in and you could actually talk to people inside of intimately in a six by ten room and have conversations and it can be deployed wherever you want it to go it's premiering as a performance piece this summer, I think it would go in and a micro residency center so I'm going to be there sometimes there and sometimes not there but I would be hosting other people to come and hang out in this and make work and hold conversations and do what they do as artists so right so video art so my main thinking is around the mediated experience what do we put between ourselves and our audiences or what do we take away between ourselves and our audiences and how do we craft experiences that really are appropriate to these technology that we want to do there's no way I could have told the story of Gadget without, in my mind without summoning these things from pop culture and those references full balcony was totally made with people's films and now this is like well I want to be present with people and I want to talk to them about real things I want to create a safe weird intimacy between us that we can relate to one another and so because this ultimately what I'm pushing up against is this I'm desperate to connect with you guys and because there's this very strange gap between us that sometimes is useful and you can do things with if you know how to manage that relationship but a lot of times it's just kind of um, it's anti-created like it's not interesting anymore so um that's how I'm doing yeah we had a conference call a little while ago because these projects are so interesting and so different we wanted to sort of get to know some of our thinking about them before we actually got here in front of everyone some of the questions that these folks came up with we got really into and I think they're important when talking about technology and relationships um one of them is intimacy the idea of being in a room with someone and that being intimacy, that being safe there are certain other kinds of intimacy that technology-mediated forms do provide asynchronous communication like mixed in, different kind of intimacy so all of your work addresses that and at least a little bit of a way, what do you think about intimacy and your real work communication I mean I think intimacy is when people are vulnerable with one another like when you can create a state of vulnerability or off balance or unexpectedness that that you're like oh and you become aware of yourself or how you're feeling or you know there's like this thing that you can do and that like we have the benefit of that being in theater or in a live format I think it's really interesting because I think I don't think the audience comes to theater to be vulnerable I think the audience comes to watch someone else be vulnerable because vulnerability in you is strength, vulnerability in me is weakness so I mean we would be all in and like oh my god oh my god it's coming out, oh my god don't come sit in my lap don't sit in my lap but I'm here to watch the actors before they're sold out so we want intimacy, we want intimacy given to us this is my feelings we're not interested in being seen which is why we're assholes on the internet we're complete jerks on the internet the common thread of any like law on the website we don't there's something about how we like to consume stories we want to hear someone tell their story and I think we'll get into a place where we're still dissolving where we're interested in performing but even then YouTubers and like video bloggers I'm performing but I'm still not being seen because I'm performing to a camera and you can see whatever you want I'm not responsible I'm not there and just give to you to look at whenever you feel like it so no it's interesting this moment because I do agree with you I do agree up to a certain point but I don't know it's entirely reciprocal like if I came off saying to Sam's lap he'd be like what are you doing? my ticket was not about me showing up it was about me showing up to see you show up it's changing I think that's changing generationally in terms of the the interest in and the hunger for and the willingness for real interactivity in other forms at least I think in the theater it's still it's still evolving and it is evolving because interactive immersive theater has done me a big thing in America this year last year I mean it's been happening in the rest of the world for a while but you know I think because younger generations are growing up so completely immersed in and very versatile and comfortable in different forms of interactivity and I think the explosion for example of in a sense like your project interactive urban gaming kind of treasure hunt tour kind of experiences are really there's a reason people are really soaking that up right now and looking for that I think for me some of what's been interesting up until recently I mean it's still interesting for me but in terms of theater is like you talked about a little bit is this construction of intimacy especially in terms of film and cameras which goes into the internet and YouTube and the whole kind of selfie culture of the constant sort of constructing and branding and shaping and editing and promoting and performance of self in culture is really fascinating and I think it's something that I play with a lot and performance is again sort of directly addressing that in the context of theater and the live experience of theater and the sort of complicated layers of self performing some other self and the difference between me in this room with you right now and that form of live embodied intimacy and the other kind of intimacy that you feel when I'm in a close up on camera and you can see my eyes and you feel like you're inside my head and I can construct this other thing for you and I think that's such a powerful experience now that people are able to do that themselves people are able to do that just pick up their iPhone and be on camera be on film right now and construct these layers of identity and I'm also really interested in just this sort of again this sort of illusion of relatedness this illusion of the construction of intimacy the way that you know feel you know close to the form and they feel to their partner I mean there's so many different manifestations of that culture right now it was interesting that what you just did Sarah it was like when you're talking to the group and as you're talking to the group but when you do this it's like just for me so the intimacy actually it feels like if we did great theater just for me that's what we all want right it feels like this for me in the theater there's like all these people around me and there's like crackling sounds of candy and like you know people wrestling and some coffee and it's like ugh it's not just for me I think this is part of I think this is part of also what's we're going to talk about this sort of the the room for projection part of what is so I mean if anybody has ever had an actual long distance relationship raise your hand you know or been in a relationship where you're in a long distance sometimes you there is something uncanny about this space that texting or e-mailing for example allows when you don't actually have to take in that whole actual other person in your face and all of the layers of complication and through personality and in concurrency there but yeah you have room to actually fill in the gaps yourself and to be in this very internal subjective experience that it sometimes can actually feel more intimate I've been thick talking a lot lately in my process with people about the relationship we have with our stuff animals when we kids and the way that we actually continue to do that as adults in a way to infuse even inanimate objects or even you know an e-mail for example with so much projected emotion and relationship and intimacy there's a for every 10 articles on the internet of studies about how instant messaging and all kinds of asynchronous communication e-mail all that stuff dissolving emotional ties and kids don't know how to be truthful anymore or they don't know how to relate with their peers and their families anymore there are about 2 or 3 articles that study how certain certain new kinds of intimacy are being tracked through these media there's one that I sent around to all of us and I'd be happy to put it on the TBA site about a involved in narrative parent comes home from work, kids on the computer how are you doing, how's your day, fine they go into separate rooms they start talking on IM and he tells his mom how his day really was now there's a study that breaks down what the components of intimacy are these media things like self-disclosure, acceptance affection and there's a couple other of these components that are being broken down in a way I think we haven't had cause to before so considering which of these components are more at home in a digital medium I've definitely texted things to people I would never say to them in person probably today but it also does in a certain way call your attention back to liveness even in the most technologically beautifully detailed performance when then the performer comes up to you or when you see them in the flesh it means something different now that we have an alternative to liveness liveness has more semantic heft or it has a different semantic heft that we can use as artists it's interesting working in this over the last couple of decades because I feel like in the last the e-mail thing I was just showing you that's from 2005 that's really like which at the time a lot of people weren't doing that in theater yet it was like oh my god that's so cool but now it's like it's completely outdated but it's so interesting it's changing so fast and I think the media literacy of the audience is changing so fast especially as younger generations are coming up I think as a theater artist you have to take for granted you have to understand your audience at this level of media literacy even in the terms of the way that they relate to language for example on the way that they relate to talk more about that I can text you about it LOL yeah I think it's like your projects we've all worked with this even as playwrights as writers the way that we our relationship to language in a way we write language for the stage and write language for it comes out of people's mouths and it comes out of people's mouths to a large audience versus to a camera versus on the microphone versus through a text or an email all have their own particular language but linguistic style well one cool thing that's on both of your projects is you have an availability on the screen of seeing someone write something and then delete it and then write something else you are in the real time of that performance moment watching someone change their mind and seeing all the things they don't say which is not something easy to do in theater but also a particular kind of self-expression that people can't do they know what it means to go this far in your sense and that process of evaluating and curating is very native to anyone younger basically but how does that work in your media at all and then to capture what people don't normally see or is this a blackout yeah I think editing yeah I mean editing is ultimately I am interested in story and telling story and that's why I am in theater because it's story and it's not film which also is story but it's and it's not something in a gallery which you might de-prioritize story or a public art project or whatever but it is about story and see it I can't keep them today and then there's a I don't know what the question was but really how do you tell the story as best you can how do you keep re-engaging the relationship and re-engaging with your audiences and sometimes that takes different tactics for different situations and if you want to show somebody thinking about what they're doing like maybe you back up forward, back up forward but the main thing that I I think many of my main influences around remix culture and DJ culture and taking something that exists on a record or a film and reworking that to be your own thing and telling story through that and using pieces of stuff that maybe aren't made to tell stories to tell a story so remixing somebody brushing their teeth and sometimes to tell a story about how they miss their mom if you just imagine what that would be like like that, that sounds like something I would do let me just tell you one of two ways either to the fact that this means that digital production aren't basically everyone's hands now you've got your camera here, you've got your video camera here you've got your sound studio, your audio mixer all here and how much does that how much does your audience is basically catching up or passing us how does that technology affect the questions that you're asking as you're laying out a work or as you're exploring work right now what could it be me making a theater piece, just a version of someone else living their real life right, like me going what a theater piece and like, you know, like every little kid in the corner is going well, yeah, real life so that's what I'm curious about like when we started, I mean sure at some point Chagall came to the theater and we watched this because it looked like oh, that's real life, right maybe Chagall has to know that's real life I don't know, it kind of begs the question so what is theater supposed to be reflecting and what is the, why do we make the work we make in the theater and why are we making these types of works, that it's a kind of maybe theater right, and like how do you want to define what you consider a theater is it humans, is it guppies is it lack of screams, is it what is it that's this you know, either a departure around what is there to be traditional theater or an evolution do you go out there and feel the divide between theater and not theater is important and defensible, I'm not saying it's not I'm just going to start a conversation what do you mean important like that there is a lot important to you and your work that how you approach your work at a certain point you'll stop and say that's not theater anymore like where is, where are people's lines as you're answering your questions and working toward answering your questions I mean I've used a lot of technology in my work but for me, and I don't know if this is true but for me unless there's a live body in front of me I don't really track the best theater it can be all projection other than that live body they might not even be doing it I don't, I feel like for me theater is about me as audience member being in literally the same space physically with a performer having said that I do think that technology gives us but that's from where I'm coming from in the sense that I grew up, I have recently adopted a lot of technology I didn't grow up in it so my niece probably feels like her friends are in her room when she's I-M-ing with them in a way that I don't her response to this question could be very different in the sense that for her seeing a screen and somebody on the screen might actually carry more semantic heft than it does for me and that I think is really interesting Eber, did you see that on the right? Did you see the brush on the web at ACT? Yes. Was that theater? Who saw that production? It totally was because there was a ballet that I could see the whole time and I got to see them when they walked out there were moments in it where I was reminded that I was actually watching people doing this Even when they were in the room they were still doing a lot of things in the next room It was an interesting question though I would say yes I really enjoyed it In our discussion we were having a pre-discussion about just about how much that's coming up right now in the field like I was just on a grant panel where a number of the panelists were one person that was applying with she's primarily a YouTube artist like she's a performer she's a performer and writer but her main medium is YouTube, she has a YouTube channel and she writes these skits and these characters that she performs and she's applying in the theater category and there was another project that was mainly like a site-specific interactive multimedia kind of public event and where these questions of like what is the performative element or is that why is that an application in the theater category as opposed to another category I think we're all confronting those issues not just in the funding field but for real in terms of our relationship with our audience it's really interesting the questions there are a bunch of folks we'll just go around the other side here and take off I wanted to answer the same way he did about an audience that would be in the same space but then when I heard him say that I think about the Metropolitan Opera performing simulcast across the country I think when I talk about it right now my answer is when I lose my audience it stops being theater when they don't get it it's no longer theater as long as they're there and engaged wherever there happens to be it's still theater regardless of what level of technology didn't stop being theater when we started Mikey Actors no we just applied new technology to tell the story yeah I totally agree the integration of technology performance is a continuum that started a long time ago and we have many many miles to go in this you just have to check in where you're at right now these, I was joking there's a light fixture that was designed in the mid 80's probably that's being held by a coffee can to make it look like it was from the 20's you know on stage here in our contemporary production you know it's like we even have to deal with the layers and remember there's so much kind of built into each technology that we have to interface with that's part of the story when you just deal with nice things about accepting that I think that's a really good point because a lot of this moldy discipline there is using the tools at hand it's not theater artists or video artists it's artists pursuing things using the tools at hand these tools they have lightness and interactivity tools and they have digital tools and expanding the vocabulary in any in any direction is going to shape your questions but it's but it's just a question of what tools do you have and what tools are you interested in in finding your crafts on like this light here with the coffee can in front I don't know what's being held down over here but it's being held down by some gaff tape and a plastic cup from the yogurt placed down the street not really tools at hand if you have something you need to do as an artist you will find the tools that you need in order to get it done if it's a plastic yogurt cup if it's your YouTube thing so I think it's actually a potato starch cup potato starch cup? Yeah I don't think it's plastic it's from Jalachoe and I down the street yeah the tools at hand I guess I am really enchanted and still fixated on this teddy bear metaphor and I would let the stuffed animal that we can project all of our needs and desires and sort of challenge the fantasy on and then translating that into the actor as object and what you're dealing with I would love for you to talk more about whether or not you think there's a sweet spot to hit where like where does intimacy overlap with our needs and projections in theater and how can technology aid or the trash from kind of finding that sweet spot if there is one? I think one of the things that's interesting about theater right is that is the sweet spot woman that's absolutely live where you feel like the audience really felt that you know where like you say something and everybody just explodes and laughter or something or you feel the in the room I just got chills I grew up doing theater and you'd write like we all know what that feels like that's something that you can experience as a film actor if you're not in the movie theater something you can't experience as a visual artist you're not in the gallery every single day the gallery is open experiencing that live moment in time and space with the audience and I think for me in live events that's still a really charged powerful interesting interaction even no matter how much technology is also involved in mediating that and for me sometimes I feel like the more that I play with media and technology and sort of calling our attention to the relationship with that you know sometimes sometimes it even amplifies those moments but I feel like in my work I often keep commenting on and drawing the audience's attention back to losing themselves in the like losing the being so drawn into the content they lose the awareness of the form and then being welcomed back up to the medium that's actually being manipulated in order to give them the experience Can I ask a quick follow up in terms of what you're talking about the rare article that actually investigates how it aids certain forms of intimacy to be mediated through digital technology do you think that there's a particular like particularly theatrical kind or flavor of intimacy that you feel really gets a lift from technology or are we just kind of trying to bring the familiar into this antiquated space Can I try that? I think that things that make you that disarm you in intimate ways there are tools to help with that some people like sex toys and some people like Skyping naked or not and it's not even just about intimacy it's like sexual intimacy but I think there's all different kind of tools to get yourself intimate from the mic game to like whatever you know try it and also what I've seen in projects where the technology is a really successful interval component of it and not just something stuck up afterwards or in the background is that part of the content is the medium like part of what's talking about next when I saw it the first time is it was really digging into why do you feel close to this person because it will turn around and be like you don't actually know what you think you know or you don't actually know something incredibly important so make it a piece where you're problematizing this kind of intimacy like what is this intimacy mean when does intimacy become threatening why do we assume that we know things we don't are there things that we do know by virtue of how someone expresses themselves in writing that you meet them and it's you don't know those things but it is it ends up being important when you're using these technological tools that the inquiry involves the use of that kind of communication like exploring how that communication works what are its pitfalls what are its rewards what what new paths can it lead you down I wonder too I don't know which time I left but I've and this is all super interesting but I also don't want to lose track of some of the things that people at the beginning brought up when we asked about your interest and actually we keep coming back to the process you know the medium has to be integral to the content the content and form have to be in an ongoing process with each other or it doesn't have to be but I think we work that way and a certain kind of work comes out of that but it does also bring back like really practical questions like if you're working in a union theater and I think maybe that would be an interesting thing to talk about like not just this sort of like larger philosophical and aesthetic questions but like really practical that all sounds great but how do we actually do that and I know that I I could never have made the work that I've made if I was only working in a union theater I've had to make this work in very small low-key DIY spaces and then sometimes translated to a union theater which is also its own challenge and I think it's also interesting even for the unions and the venues how that conversation with you can probably talk more about this is how that conversation is evolving even how when I did the show we were looking at at Yerba Buena I was super super lucky to have a really amazing crew that was willing to be more flexible in terms of the boundaries between disciplines and intermediates who could touch the camera and who could touch the microphone and could I touch my own things because I have to touch them in the work and I think that's also a really evolving conversation I know that the people at production team at Yerba Buena worked really really hard with the union crew to make sure they had the right crew for my show that understood the kind of work that it was and what was going to have to be involved I mean I had a great pleasure to sit on the equity negotiation as the rep from Z-Space to negotiate the equity contract for the Bay Area theaters and you know they're terribly afraid the union representatives are terribly afraid of actors imagery being reproduced without their compensation in mind and everyone I'm sure I don't know did the back get renegotiated recently I did it several years ago now next month yeah I mean it's brutal and it's just kind of dumb not in a bad way but it's not if membership representative membership wasn't really there it's the union leaders who are there who I guess are representative membership but were membership pulled about some of these specific things I'd be very curious to know what their response rate was but no but there are ways around it that are fine like well if the context in which things are made is one thing so full balcony which is this film piece evaded actors equities jurisdiction in that it was designed to be set up as a public art installation it was funded with theater grant money through the Triangle Latin and through another foundation that vows not to fund video okay so so it's very weird how to make the cases but I think tell the right story to the wrong people and just go for it and my so far I use tons of stolen and reappropriated material in my work I use lots of imagery of people who have representation around their image and things like that and I'm looking for and waiting to be sued as a public response and a meaningful one to the work and what and I'm preparing my since I graduated grad school part of my work was about how to prepare for that moment has been about trying to make that moment real and get sued because this broadcast will look forever alive so maybe after I go do lawsuit I'll look at it and see but I'm mainly looking to push the barriers around what who owns your image and what circumstances if you're the United States government there's an entitlement to owning everything you do if they want to check it out you know so it's but can we, can I use Ronald Reagan and make him say something different I mean he's kind of in a public domain sort of but he's a union actor and and you know anyway so but and then in stage hand stuff there's a different I think each silo of labor has its own conversation and the ones and it's weird between SAG and stage and equity and film and it's like kind of finding the grand area in each of their agreements and just read the agreements I encourage you, if you're an artist who wants to ride the gray area in an actor's contract and where you want a union actor to be part of your thing read their agreement so you can help them understand what they're able to do or not do so the fact that these contracts were drawn up before all this media existed is both a hindrance and in some ways a help because you can not chase it well I mean we wrote this, the union contract was written just a few years ago Facebook existed and YouTube existed and all this I mean they really do it every three or four or five years whatever it is I mean they know what's going on it's just about unwillingness to make concessions to the changing world you didn't actually get all the way around with that filter I don't mean to point you out there my response is more to the line between like the fine audience viewer and I think about theater is it comes back to me as a community my problem with if it's for a performance for one audience member you know at least the way I was brought up is that there's an uplifting of the community discussion by just watching it on YouTube who do I have to share that with and I think that's something even in the dark this sort of theater space so it makes it different from film if we've done the work in a way that we've had that level of that varying of soul the group can feel that palpable energy from the audience I mean part of why I came to see this is that I think that would be well the media is that there's always these three unities of time, place, and character but with the use of media you can actually see somebody's soul in this metaphor they're representing up there I love the remixing idea change with the idea of fixing but at times it's not fixed in a way and the other thing is as someone who as a director, as a divider, as a writer I can play with that but I'm not sure how far that would go and I like the bigger conceptual aesthetic that's sort of here how far can we push it because the thing is I'm only speaking to the generation I came up with the younger nephew of Mises he had an iPad and stuff a big process there is so much rapidly and differently than I do I look and sort of say well it can't just be about videoing us playing with videoing and that anymore it's actually got to figure out how to get floppy burn in there and then unpack it into something else because that's the thing is when you see what you guys can do with media I think it's so incredible but when you can actually get close to that microphone change audio the territory of the space change the way that you can actually see the image and the interactivity of the image I just want to echo one point that I think is really important is the shortening of narrative is a very contemporary thing that's happening and there will be a sort of backlash around it or whatever but it's that's real right now in theater there's more and more theaters running on like a full day of service play or like the shop of the day where it's as long as there is and an epic theater experience a body in that place for so long and that's the anti-push to Twitter which is can you say everything and your designated character limit and get used to only thinking in 70 characters or whatever it's like my brain only works so you need to make 70 characters story how many characters? so I'm only using half well I have a question that too goes back to community we as theater people tell ourselves over and over oh my gosh we bring people together oh my gosh there's nothing like being in the same room with a bunch of people and having an emotional experience what about the share function of say this video that you like you don't have to have your 17 best friends in the room with you to share this experience with them what's the difference, what do we want to do with that and you can share it with them I can send it to my sister I can stop them I can send it to my brother there's a real sharing that doesn't mean less it just means different but there's a reason why this is still a theatrical conversation there's a reason why the three of you are not working in a film or a closed video you're just making a media that's being digested by being shared out there's still something about this that likes the audience or wants to interact with that audience even does the Mona your piece which was I'm interested in how you reacted to that were you present, did you go to the corners where people were taking in the the QR feeds and watching their reaction to things we had a launch party last fall where people came and they had their phones and the funniest things I actually made the project with the intent of it being a solitary experience it was meant to be theater number one that was the whole point and one person would scan and then five crowd around that person and they'd all watch the same screen so it was still a group script they're still like I got it so the first person who got it loaded everyone else gathered on the campfire and they would watch that video and I was like oh well shoot there goes my audience of one theory yes but you're being present with them what would be the difference between what you described earlier as a film experience where you're not present at every screening of the film as a performer so you don't interact with the audience that way what's the difference between that and what you did I didn't interact with the audience I think I was trying to be as not present as possible I wasn't more interested in data mining the reaction because the whole script was meant to be like oh I was on this behavior responding to this kind of system the art was one thing but I was really interested in group behavior and how individuals respond to technology as narrative and it was more about watching them and I was trying to be a fly on the wall I don't know how useful that was they would ask me questions so and me and then Laura did it and she had her own thoughts about it too so interesting well I think it's interesting even though I was talking about when the artist is present with the audience I think it's amazing making work where the creator or the generator of the work maybe isn't there but the audience is still having a live interactive experience that they're responding to and one thing I also want to mention I was actually tracking the codes the frequency with which they scan when they got scanned and I was trying to figure out like oh does it get boring at code 4 and so it's like scan scan scan and stop so that's what I was interested in too there was also all this backend data that we collected from the QR codes because they've been trying everything like how often they got scanned how many scans per day you know and you're in the somewhat district specifically in the area of San Francisco you know I saw no one scanning at night all the scans were during the day you know around lunchtime so that was interesting too and no question yeah we have about 10 minutes yeah so here's my question you all have three very cool artists doing very different work from each other and you mentioned being you know at the vanguard of a form that's changing every year so I would love for you to paint me a picture of where you think it's going in 10 years, 20 years, 30 years did you ask about the future of the American Theater 10 years, 10 years ago but when you are old and gray and return to a panel on the same topic I want to know what kind of project you think you'll be talking about a panel on the same project still oh my god yeah I don't think that they'll be talking about this in the same way anymore I totally think that I was actually having a conversation the other day with somebody before I even met you and heard about your project because I missed it when I happened unfortunately about you know I feel like actually the imminent future not 10 years from now but I think much later than that is like a mashup between sleep no more of video game life social media burning man it's kind of a mashup between live interactive site specific roaming first like one on audience of one and audience of countless many interacting in both live embodied ways and virtual mediated ways and does everyone know what I'm referring to when I say sleep no more your production yeah where the version that takes over a place over like six different floors but where it is simultaneously over the course of three hours and everybody's just running around and having a very interactive immersive experience of it so I think that's one of the future I love the I love the you guys are under this that's under a and then the screen behind it is essentially the new digital theater and the work you guys are doing is very much we talked about accessibility and I think thank you for talking about the equity issue but I really would love to continue this conversation online because I agree with what Evan said about what theater is like if there's a heartbeat in the room and you guys are in the same space it's theater we're in here in theater talking about digital theater talking about all these new forms it's a evolving thing I'd love to have this just as an ongoing discussion and a repository for what comes out of the back discussion and how these propagated agreements get done between SAG AFRA and equity so that those of us who actually do want to pay in a health intention and do all the things because everybody videotapes everything and as a playwright I want to hear my words but I also want to play about the rules and some of my best friends are equity actors and I don't want to misuse their image so I would love to have the adult conversation in the 21st century that can go beyond this preceding march and really have this let's all be frank and fearless and figure out what this next step is wouldn't that happen? that'll be on next year's theater and technology panel I think one response something you said which was when you put post-it or when you shared the video I think it's beyond just liking it but it's almost like you need to comment or blog in order to get that community feel that interactivity I think also too as you were thinking of the future of theater technology has been driving a lot of the generational conversation and one of the things that you look at at the Google plus is that now they call it circles which funny enough coming back to theater coming from a company that practices it in old ways we always circle up before we start and rehearsals and I think it's sort of a tech way that closing the loop is that you put something out there how it comes back to you not to think about audiences anymore because audiences are open to super-relationship but that just circles how it comes back to them I mean don't forget that technology is being molded after the things we already do it's trying to help us to do the things that we need to do more efficiently more efficiently that's why developers are doing these things Google Glass is now available purchase today so you don't have to spend the 23 seconds that it takes to unlock your phone and check your email you can just go whether that's like a goal of yours or not you get to decide so we have more command over the development of technology or the way in which it's implemented then you might feel you might feel subject to this conversation but we are you know we might feel an object of this conversation but we are in fact the ones being looked at to help define it so stay strong Google the biggest thing is to be as smart as you can be I think take your time and be smart because people are watching one last one I look forward to the different technologies advancing there were several years before the next room I did a play wherein I spent most of my time on stage interacting with an image on the screen the other actor was in the building and he could hear me he couldn't see me so I had problems with if he dropped the line I had no way of visually communicating with him that something needed to happen he could hear what I was saying but he couldn't see what I was saying but I'm sure there's further technology now that could have been fixed there's an app for that yes that's called mind reading it's around the corner and they're going to patent the word mind and the word reading you've heard that Google's trying to patent the word glass right no, seriously as a shortened form of Google glass they're trying to copyright glass it's interesting we live an interesting time I think we should be afraid of it there's something about like we may not have that like when everyone knows of it and a lot of this is going to be bad I'm guilty of making a lot of bad stuff with cameras I so will do it every day for the theater but I think there's something about just like what David said like acknowledging it's here it's not going anywhere you want to just shake it's hand and welcome to the table here I think going at the technology versus theater from the artist end is the wrong way to go about it like I make theater or I make video art or something what are people taking in I don't think the people looking for something exciting to look at are thinking nearly as hard about whether it's theater or video as we are so if you're making something that's interesting use the stuff that makes it the most interesting but what is that stuff how do you get those tools and how do you not be how do you keep focused on the future of what people are looking for what people are finding interesting and then I've got all the science I think there's a lot of conversation to be had around projections or sound editing sound design is technology unless you're one actor on stage with no sound no lights performing outside you're using technology so it's in there evangelism so we weren't like we're using but to me this is something you said that I've been thinking a lot about so that was really interesting this idea of shortening narrative in the sense that technology happens to be in our lives all the time almost 24-7 every day there is a new generation coming up who's been living with it their whole lives so it's actually how they take in information how they feel emotion how they respond to things shaped by Facebook, Twitter iPhones, iPads what have you so how does that very few people now actually watch a movie and just watch it they have something their laptop is on there so they're actually taking in multiple things so whenever I see a show as someone who's like that where it's really slow and it's really expositioning I get bored because my brain has the train to get ahead because of iPads now they're swiping in our brains next thing comes from the right you know what I mean? so it's like how do we what does that mean for a theater piece that doesn't use projections what does it mean about layering the story and that's something that I'm really interested in and I think that's where you get a lot of tension is because an older audience member or an audience member who's not technologically advanced might say all this information you haven't given me enough time to think about it whereas I am bored still because you just spent 10 minutes of my time explaining something to me when I wanted to get to the next thing 9 minutes ago and that's a question when you go with it, when you go against it and I hope we can all start being specific and mindful of our decisions around that our time is up thank you so much for being here thank you some of these articles I was talking about intimacy and asynchronous communication they've put up on the tba website along with the websites if you're a fantastic artist you can get more of their work and get to know more of what we're working on so thanks again wonderful


What do you want parents to know when they're traveling to the holidays with baby this holiday? You know when you're traveling with your baby, whether it's to Your parents house grandparents house or anywhere. It's important to create a safe sleep environment That means bassinet bring along a play yard or crib Always putting the baby on their back. You put him to sleep and no extraneous materials No crib bumpers no blankets no pillows You know it's really important is even the baby falls asleep somewhere else like on the sofa or in a rocker or a Bouncer move the baby to that safe sleep environment. It'll make whole holidays a happier time