Okay, I see guests and I'm counting members 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Okay, we're here. Okay. Good evening. This is the meeting of town services outreach committee of the town council pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 extended by chapter. This meeting will be conducted via remote means, review of the public who wish to access the meeting may do so by zoom or by the instructions below. No in person attendance of members of the public will be committed. Every public health director here but I think every something effort will be made to ensure that public can adequately access the proceedings in real time by way of via technological means. And I will call the committee to order from Andrew Steinberg.  Present. And I need to look. And shall any ball mill. Present. And I don't think him. And I will acknowledge the guests that we have. We have Haley Bolton, the director of the senior center and Rosemary from the friends. I think it's the friends of the senior center is that correct rosemary. And also the council on aging. Council on aging, right. That's fair. We have our three CFOs, Jennifer moisten and Brianna and Angela mills, and we have our town manager, Bob Ackerman. And we have a public comment. So we are here. And there was some discussion about when we would have public comment and we are moving it up to be the first item of the agenda. So it would be seed the discussion of the senior center and senior services overview. Is that that is my understanding is that correct is that how you'd like it Haley. Yes, that'd be great. Great. Okay. So is there anything else I should do. Well, we're all set to go now. Can we start our presentation. Just to clarify, you're going to do public comment, then you're going to do the presentation by the senior center. And then you'll do the presentation by the CPS is that the way it will end up. We can have another public comment after that. That seemed okay. And I think for tonight, we, you've already agreed that the transportation advisory committee charge is going to be post postponed to another night. And if you want to talk about speed limits, I can give you a brief overview, but that should probably go at the same time you talk about with tack. I think that makes sense. And you have some appointments for us. I want to point one set of appointments. Yes. Okay, so we should have a nice meeting tonight. I'm looking forward to it. Okay, so public comment. Public comment on matters within the jurisdiction of the TSO committee residents are welcome to express their views for one to three minutes at the discretion of the TSO chair based upon a number of people who want to speak TSO will not engage in a dialogue or comment on a matter raised during public comment and the directions for participating in public comment are given. So, let me just see what we have in terms of attendees. I see seven and any attendees who would like to speak at this time, please raise your hand. Okay, and so I see Richard Yorga has his hand up. And let's see, there are a few more people coming on I see that. Okay. So, I'm going to move this. So I have a little screen that tells me who's here. Is it blocking your vision of people, or is it only blocking my vision. Okay, I'm going to see if I can't pull it over to the side, but it's not working. Okay. So, okay, so, Mr. Yorga, you have the floor. And can you unmute yourself so that we can hear you. Okay, I have a thank you for the opportunity. I've lived in Amherst now for it's hard to believe 59 years. So I've been a taxpayer in the town of Amherst for many, many, many years. I don't even want to know how many thousands of dollars, I've contributed to the town of Amherst and I'm happy to have done so. But now, I think it's time for the seniors to get a little recognition for all the money we've paid it all the committees we've served on all the help we've been to everyone at every age in the town. I'm very active at the senior center currently serving as president of the of the friends. And I'm also president of the Amherst hall council. So many years at the senior center. And now I'm starting to look around and seeing what our neighbors have and what our neighbor communities of much smaller populations, and what they're providing for their seniors. So I think the Amherst should be embarrassed realized this has lots of responsibilities, lots of needs as every town does. But I think it's time for the Amherst seniors to speak up and get in line to get better representation better services from the town that we've spent our entire adult lives, many of us contributing to its time. It's time for the town to do better for its Amherst seniors. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much. Okay, so I'm going to take a look at the attendees again, and see. Okay, I see Ching Ching sonata. Could you please unmute yourself and you have the floor. Actually, it's George George sonata. Oh, thank you. I'm just going by what's in front of me. Hello George. That's because I have her iPad. I don't know how to use it. Okay, thank you. Thank you so much for correcting so I'm going to make sure I put that in my minutes. Okay, so go ahead and give us your thoughts on this topic. Well, like the gentleman before me I, I retired about 20 years ago in Amherst. I quickly became a member of the senior center group, and I participated in many, many programs, probably over these 20 years. I delivered meals for five years, and I organize the memoir writing group for over 15 years. The memoir group is no longer working space problems at the center. So much construction was going on with the, the, this was before COVID. We were sort of like ran out of space. I dance class that we were in has disappeared for lack of space. I was in the pole room, which was never quite up to standard. My wife having fallen down a couple of times in there given the terrible flooring that's in there, and me having once been knocked down by the poles are in that room. I always thought pole room was something a little different than what they described it as. But anyway, I just want to say, we, I've seen the development of the center over 20 years and I have to say, it, it, I'm not sure that's any worse than when we can we thought it was wonderful. Over the years, the whole physical structure has deteriorated. I mean it was so evident to me when I appeared the other evening for the celebration, and I thought to myself, I saw a person trying, trying to get down the stairs. And everybody was standing in front of it and I think people aren't cognizant of the fact that we have so many balance problems as seniors that of an age, the structure there just isn't working for people and there isn't enough room. I know that things are being done elsewhere but we're not, we're not, we're not getting in, I think. I could say much, much more but I think that's my, my input and I just hope that we can do like, you know, the plans, we say we're going to serve the senior citizens but I think we're not doing a good job with this anymore. We really are. Thank you so much for your comments. I see that Kay has her hand up. Can you identify yourself and, as I should have said to the previous speakers. Give your address and Amherst, or give your address. So okay, I'd love to hear from you. You need to unmute yourself. Good. Yeah, me now. Yes. Yes, I can. So if I would like to thank everyone here for giving us at the senior center an opportunity to voice our concerns. I am a resident of Amherst I live at 23 green leaves drive. I am a member of the friends, as well as a volunteer. I volunteer three days a week, which I absolutely enjoy I work at reception desk. And I also do the lunch program. Working at the reception desk, I have firsthand knowledge of what is lacking and what is needed at the senior center. I get a lot of complaints over the phone. For example, there is they complain about the inadequate talking space and costs for parking. They also there's also complaints about not having enough programs because we lack space. The other thing is we also don't have enough adequate staff to run classes at the senior center. And we also I mean there is a list to go on and on. Also we have very little budget to plan for events. And last but not least is we lack transportation services which I think our seniors need desperately, because at one time we had transportation to provide the rides to medical doctors for the doctors visits. And right now we don't have an adequate van or then is broken. And so I can't imagine us not even having one at this point. So, and also the atmosphere is very dismal, as far as I'm concerned it gets very depressing when you walk in there. I have looked at several community area senior centers and by far it outshines ours. And this situation has been going on for a very long time. The needs of our senior population, which exceeds over 5000 and growing has long been overlooked and neglected. We seem to live in an age where youth is is more important, you know we we have a youth oriented society, and we have an aging population and I think more emphasis and focus has to be on on needs as well. We have contributed as as Dick has said, where we have long standing taxpayers. And right now, I feel that what we need is a commitment from the town of Amherst to build a new senior center to accommodate our often neglected senior population. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, I'm going to go back and check the list again. I don't see any more hands raised. So I will close a public comment unless somebody pops a hand up real quick. Okay. All right, so that is the end of public comment. So, now Haley would you like to start your presentation. Yes, I'd love to. So thank you for having me. I've got a brief presentation, and then I can take questions after. So I'll start by sharing my screen. So, I'm here tonight with Rosemary coffler council on aging member of the leadership team there, and on the Amherst friends group. And we're going to talk about your senior services so one of the questions that we get asked a lot are what we what are the essential senior services. We could really break them down into four groups. So we've got monthly brown bag program emergency food pantry referral to programs like the Amherst survival center. We know that our seniors live on fixed incomes. We are facing unprecedented gas prices inflation. So seniors really have to do more with less pretty constantly. So it's important that a senior center be able to offer them ways to save money on their food bills. And we also know that meal preparation is a burden right if you think about the time and the energy that it takes to prepare to cook to clean a meal. It's quite burdensome to our seniors and particularly when they're caregivers for a family member. So senior centers ought to provide a meal, at least one some senior centers provide two or three a day and home delivered meals as well. So that social connection is important arts and crafts, music activities group fitness games, book clubs, even just coming in and being able to read the newspaper, having an opportunity for seniors to connect with one another be visible in the community, engage. Those are all really important they help you know alleviate depression. They keep your mind sharp. We know that we want our seniors to be involved in the community that they've been a part of their whole lives. So it's really important to offer seniors educational workshops, you know how do you age in place how do you get modifications to your home. How do you navigate Medicare what are the onset symptoms of dementia, how to live with diabetes you know all these things are topics that we face as we get older and senior centers need to be able to educate the public on that. And it's also really important to have health clinics, foot clinics, blood pressure, hearing aids, ear irrigation those services are really helpful to seniors to be able to get you know all in one place if I come to do a music activity, I can get my blood pressure checked and I can have a meal and that saves them from having to get multiple trips out. So those are all important. And then there's the individual services right so application assistance snap fuel assistance license social work counseling case management computer tutoring income tax preparation all those things help save seniors money and time. And all those things we already do at the Amherst Senior Center so we provide a lot of essential services to the population already. We also provide a lot of essential services we need to also be thinking about you know who's using the senior center right. So we know that there's 39,000 people in town, and that number does include off campus students it's really important to note that someone had mentioned earlier over 5200 seniors live in Amherst that's 13% of the population that's a really statistically significant amount of people. You know the number of individuals were serving each year. So the last pre COVID year FY 19 over 2100 individuals access senior center services during the course of that year and you know that's an unduplicated number. If we looked at duplicated it would be much higher. And then during COVID last fiscal year, almost 1800 people. So that's about 35% of the town seniors are accessing services at the bank center again we're seeing a large volume of people. And when we look ahead, we have about 1500 people living in Amherst between the ages of 50 and 59 over half of those people so about 900 people are 55 to 59. So within the next five years we're going to see an even bigger demand on senior services. And that's not taking into consideration that the Pioneer Valley is quickly becoming a retirement destination. They really want to come here they want to spend their golden years to be colic there's the influences of the college is vibrant art scene people want to be a part of our community. So we'll see more numbers. And again just to kind of go back and talk about the budget. So the town allocates 235 thousand thousand dollars to the senior center 99.9% of that budget is salary. So with about $2,700 to spend in a fiscal year on operating expenses, maybe programs, you know we do pay dues to the Massachusetts Council on aging those dues are over $900. So we really have to get creative with how we fund and sustain our programs and what that means is that we're reliant on grants and fundraising. Our senior center are critical to our success. They allow us to do pretty much every program that we offer. But the flip side of that. When you think about who's donating money to the friends group, it's seniors. So if I'm a senior in Amherst, and I want to program, I have to spend my own money to donate to sustain that. It's an unfair burden on our seniors, you know they shouldn't have to put money out of their own fixed incomes, you know those limited incomes to sustain programs. And I think it's really important to to look at neighboring communities. We hear a lot about you know this town is doing this this town is doing that. So let's look at some numbers. If you look at the square footage of a senior center, we are dwarfed by just about every other community, 20,000 square feet 10,000 square feet, you know most of these buildings were built. You know, 20, 2000 and beyond so they're much more modern than the one that we're working with. The figures that I really want to talk about are the budgets right let's look at dollar per senior $45 and 53 cents versus $99 and 63 cents for our closest neighbor in North Hampton. You know, North Hampton has 5100 seniors so they're pretty close in population to us they're spending double what we do on our seniors, and they have nine full time staff compared to our three. You know other communities Belcher town that's almost $200 per senior. You know these numbers are pretty jarring. When you look at you know what other towns are investing in their older adults. So, I'm going to talk about a needs assessment survey and Rosemary if you want to jump in. She can speak a little bit more about the history of the long range planning committee at the senior center, but Rosemary you muted. Thank you and thank you to the committee for having us between 2011 and 2017 various members of a long range planning committee for the console and aging visited 17 new senior centers in Massachusetts and Connecticut. Information was gathered from the directors of each of those centers about the building sites project manager the architect the construction bids and the building process. One member of that committee also met with architect William sterling of sterling associates. He's an expert in senior center design. On sterling's recommendations and the number of seniors in town. It was recommended that Amherst have a building that went would include a one story structure on two acres of land with 20 to 25,000 square feet of space and a minimum of 129 parking places. The Amherst is the only center of the 17 visited and perhaps the only center in the state where seniors have to pay to park in order to use their facility. The standalone senior center was recommended as opposed to a shared facility or a community center, which might include a leisure services or a teen center. The space needs for for a leisure center or a teen center were considered. And although there are some common areas or rooms that can fulfill the needs of both a senior center and a community center. The needs are different enough that they require separate buildings. And if you look. We, we recently had the age dementia survey, and some of the responses revealed many comments from seniors who are not happy with our current space. If you look at that please build us a proper senior center. We heard that people will come. And we heard that from many of the other directors at senior centers that were new they said their numbers went up greatly once they had a new senior center. The senior center is housed in a very unattractive unwell thinning space. Other towns around Amherst have new nice spaces. Why when we pay such high taxes is a senior center such a low priority. And senior center does the best with what they have town is overall not supportive of senior center compared to other towns senior center is small and doesn't have a lot of staff. We understand that the town has many priorities, but seniors are pushed aside. And I'll go forward now if you're ready Rosemary. The issues yes, thank you. The issues at the bank center. Well inadequate program space you've heard that before scheduling space for programs as a juggling problem the bottom line is we need more classroom space. The most desirable classroom has to double as a lecture room and a yoga classroom on instruction instructors want to use that room as a first choice. The computer room has to double as a game room. The lunch room is occupied for lunch from 10 to two limiting one a dance or exercise class can be held. Rooms are not designed with seniors in mind. Most older adults have hearing issues. Most rooms at banks have poor acoustics and they're very echo week, especially for those with hearing aids. Rooms lack assisted listening devices. There is no dedicated space for specific activities. Examples the computer room doubling as a game room makes it noisy for those working on the computer. The center lacks a crafts room, a proper exercise room, a proper dance space, and a game room. The dance room prior to COVID had poles throughout the room, making it dangerous for movement, as you've already heard. You can imagine 16 people swing dancing and trying to avoid pumping into poles. And a dance room should also have mirrors for safety purposes. Safety features, bathrooms like pole cords in the event an elder suddenly needs help, always have no handrails along the walls for those with balance issues. And there should be surveillance cameras throughout the building. Deficient out of code, kitchen facility. The food area prep area is extremely small. And one of the stoves is not even functional. One sink, which violates health safety codes. In fact, when food is prepared for a party, public health has to look the other way. Eat and cooling issues are a long standing problem. The lower level at the large activity or lunch room are often cold, while at the same time the lounge and offices are overheated. In dark rooms, most of the classrooms for seniors are on the basement level with no outdoor windows, a very depressing feeling. The most desirable classroom is on the first floor with good windows and natural lighting. Obviously instructors prefer that room. If it's not available when they need it. The next semi appropriate classes is in the basement with no windows and no natural lighting. There simply is not enough storage space for at the bank center. We need storage space for exercise equipment, convalescent loan equipment, craft supplies, office supplies and the food pantry. We need to use large metal storage cabinets for such things now. And then they have to line the hallways or the walls in the rooms. It's also a safety hazard. So, thank you. All right. So the reason that we're here tonight is we want to we want to make some asks. The senior center desperately needs a building that has thoughtful considerations for seniors, you know, a lot of the issues that we're talking about are also tremendous safety issues to not have pull cords in the bathroom. We're not outside the realm of possibility to imagine someone on a Friday afternoon at a program goes to the bathroom in the basement and has a fall and we have no way of knowing that that person is there. How can we attend to their needs. You know the handrails. We heard a lot of people talking about balance issues if someone falls. The handrails going down the corridors and particularly in the kitchen, you know, you're in a galley setting. So it's, it's not safe to take something out of the oven where someone is going to be back to back with you. You know, I worked in professional kitchens before it's not suitable to do any kind of large scale meal. And if you remember what we were talking about in, you know, at the beginning of the presentation we need to have a way to get seniors meals is really important that a senior center does that but we can't safely provide that service. You know, the way finding is challenging is very dark in the bank center if someone has, you know, low visual acuity, you know, they're going to have a difficult time navigating where they need to go. The parking it's expensive it's hard to find particularly during the school year and really that that's very atypical for a senior center. I've not been to really any in that I know of that has seniors pay for their own parking and doesn't have enough of it. There are specific rooms for programs a specific arts and crafts space, a nursing facility a room for games, a room for dance classes a room for exercise equipment. You know, these are all things that our competitors right if we can think of them that way in Hadley and self Hadley and Holyoke where they have brand new buildings. These are all things they can offer, but we can't and it's difficult to compete with that. You're trying to get people to come and enjoy the programs and the services that you can offer. The building is a big ask. And in order to do that we really need to identify some funding sources to get some design and architectural estimates and, you know, and perhaps a feasibility study so that we can you know assess where's the best location is it a new site is it remodeling a school. Those are things that we're going to have to consider. If we want to move forward with a new building. I'm sharing my screen now. And I can take questions I'm happy to take questions if anyone has them. Okay. Paley you had said 2109. People use the services. I think in 2020 or 2019. Those are all Amherst residents who are seniors. The vast majority. Yeah. Thank you. The vast majority, like 90% like roughly. Oh, I'm sorry. So about I would say, like 96%. So very small subset of people will come from other communities but we are primarily serving the Amherst community. And then, but they were all seniors. Yes. Okay. And then my other question was how do you, and this is more curiosity. So we have places like Applewood that serve our community very well. Do you work with them on programming do you work with them. Is there collaboration between the senior center and Applewood and if so what does that look like. I did not yet. You know, it really wasn't until very recently that I could even offer in person activities at the bank center to that scale so certainly we did actually have Applewood attend our open house they had a table. And I know that we, you know, that's a community that we want to be working with pretty closely. But I envision collaborations is certainly you know folks from Applewood are welcome to attend programs. I want to hear what they're interested in what they're not getting at Applewood that they might like to come and enjoy downtown. Can I take you back on that a little bit about the number of people that are using the senior center when we did a survey in 2010. Of course, that's a long time ago that the keep one of the key points in the survey is that the senior services are heavily utilized with 46% of all residents 50 and older having used center services. In other words, of all residents over 70, nearly nearly 75% of those residents over 75 have used seven center services. It's very heavily used at least before COVID. Thank you. Okay. I need to I saw your hand a minute ago. My question was answered but I just wanted to add it I'm sure that that that outreach would include a green leaves as well. Oh yeah. Thank you I was like so zoned in on my five people in Applewood. Well, I have a question then. One of the other things that I have noticed. I do know that I saw the kitchen you showed me the kitchen was miniscule. And I was a director of a senior center and I will say that the main draw was it's incredible. Old dinner hot meal at lunchtime. You know, roast beef chicken that kind of stuff. I think it's important to have people from all income levels in, which is very important because I mean when the centers were founded they were mainly the main purpose was joint eating because they found seniors were not eating well on their own. So, do you in your plans. Bad lunches and things and simple things. Do you plan real dinners of that sort at midday, or you're thinking of more like light lunches. In the perfect world, I would do meals like that. You know when I was the director of the burners and senior center, we had a, an area agency on aging called life path, and they would provide us meals and you might get there 35 to 40 people. I had homemade chicken soup once and I got almost 100 people to show up, you know, all seniors, they want home cooked. I know that's a fact. It really just comes down to staffing and volunteers and an adequate space I would not feel comfortable doing large scale food preparation and with the facility that we have now. But I would certainly like to be able to do so.  I'm not doing it, I'm not doing it and I would like to be senior center that could provide meals like that for people. Oh, absolutely and you know we are so blessed to have farms all over the place you know I would certainly love to see collaboration with our local farmers and local produce and and cook healthy and delicious meals for seniors. You know again meal preparation is a burden. It's a burden for any age but particularly our older adults, and again, particularly when they're caregivers. Are there any other questions that we have at this moment. Okay. Oh, Shalini, go ahead please. I just wanted to thank Haley and Rosemary for and all the others who came today to speak and inform us about what's happening and what I mean we kind of knew it but it's a powerful to see all of the numbers and everything that was shared. And so thank you for doing that. And just like, I mean, of course we're going to have more conversations I'm sure with Paul afterwards and even amongst ourselves what we can do. But meanwhile, in terms of partnerships I would think that UMass and Hampshire College like in terms of programming or even food like the dining services there are so amazing or are there any conversations with them. Certainly for programs. Yes. We have the members of the UMass psychology department coming in next week to do a presentation on mindfulness. We had a nutrition demo a month ago with a class there so there's lots of opportunities and you know now that we can kind of plan a bit more I want to do the food programs UMass is renowned for that so I would love to get a piece of that. Yeah and I wonder if Paul it part of our negotiations with or ongoing conversations with UMass that that could be something that we I mean unless we're already doing that to get them to to provide it could be you know their fine arts and their entertainment like those the talent there and the food and you know just so many opportunities I think for contributing and given that you all have a staff of three. I'm just wondering how we can take off some of the burden that you're not the only person who's reaching out and building these partnerships but how that could be spread out a little bit and if there's an overlap already. So typically that would not happen at the level that we're talking about a lot of those kind of collaborations happen at the department to department level. It happens you know where people will connect directly because UMass as you know is pretty decentralized it's not going to be like the chancellor negotiating what meals get delivered. I think there'd be a connection we can help forge that connection. But it's something like that at that will wouldn't be at the strategic partnership agreement level but we certainly help with the support that kind of collaboration but there's a lot of collaboration like the board of health has tremendous collaboration. The health director with people at UMass directly that's not negotiated. It's sort of connections that people make right and I every time I've spoken with Nancy before and Tony Maroulis at their community outreach office. And what I've understood is that they really emphasize that for any of our issues in town reaching out to them and then they can help find on campus who is the you know the contact person or to make that introduction and everything so I would really encourage making that contact and figuring out what how they can help us. Okay, Andy. Rosemary and Haley thank you for the presentation those make very helpful and sobering the two questions about what we've heard from including some of the comments just out of curiosity one is. I thought at one time we were had a parking pass program where people who are patrons of the senior center would be able to get parking permits for when they're using the center said no longer in place. No we do still have the parking permits but the issue with that tends to be the availability of spaces. I struck me today I was walking back and forth to town hall. You know it's really hard to use the law by Johnny's a lot of times there's trucks dropping off food picking up supplies so that cuts into the availability of spaces. And just in general downtown it's very hard to find a parking space and the senior center parking permit is limited to just the immediate spaces by the bank center. So it's not. It's not as attractive an option as you as you might think. And also is not free. They do pay for that parking pass. And of course it's a lot cheaper than putting money in the meter, but it's $25 for the year. And if a senior only comes twice a year that's not worth it. I have a question when you say limited to the parking places by the banks. Do you mean, five or 10 spaces, or do you mean 20 spaces. Believe it's the lower lot that's in front of and Wayland. So I think it's more than 10 spaces. I'm not sure if it's more than 20. Oh, they can use the boat would walk and the boat would walk. Okay. I mean the boat would lot. Any other questions, your hand is still. Yeah, no, that was helpful. And I guess I need to get a little bit more report back from some of our parking supervision staff fully understand the other questions about the van is, I know we had a van. Do we still have a van? What is the situation with this? We have a van. It's at DPW. It's been there for the duration of COVID. But it's not a usable van. So there's significant rust damage in the undercarriage. There's a lot of mouse activity in that van. The lines are rusted. Now I have been working with PBTA. We are set to acquire one of their retired vans, you know, there, but it's not a brand new vehicle. It's a blessing for sure. Don't get me wrong, but it has 137,000 miles on it. So it's not a new facility, but it will be a tremendous help for us to be able to resume our trip program. Thank you. Is that right for you, Andy? Yes. Okay. No, Shalini, I see you have a question. This was a question for Paul, maybe, you know, the table that comparison table that Haley shared with other senior centers. And I'm wondering, like, what explains the variation in the non salary part of the budget. Like, where we have $2,000, 2,700 and other towns have like 68,000 or 9,000 or 85,000 or 107,000. So what, how did, I mean, yeah, what's going on here. Yeah, I think that's really a discussion. I mean, that's a topic the finance committee would be looking at. And I'm sure see Haley will be talking to the finance committee about that. So I have not studied that we'd want our finance officers here to talk about that. Okay. Anything else, Shalini? Maybe for Haley, then do you know what, like, what is that money being used for in the other towns? Without having spoken to their director, I can definitely make inferences that, you know, office supplies, like I said, you know, each council on aging that's a member of the state councils on aging they pay membership dues. And a lot of senior centers will use those operating expenses for things like volunteer recognition, special events, events, right, things like that. Yeah, and we do that through grants and donations. Primarily, yes. I'd like to add a comment here when I was a director I had a budget and I hired singers violinist comedy acts. I also did performances I directed a silly thing called Dancing Through the Decades, where the seniors perform songs from like the 40s to 50s to 60s and the 70s and whatever. But, you know, we had more staff, and we had a budget. Your statistics were extremely useful. I was very, very surprised at them. And, you know, I hope that we've got so many things on our plate right now but I hope we can figure out some way to do a better job, a fairer job. Well, this has been fantastic, you know, and I do appreciate everyone's attention to senior topics and the commitment that we're all showing here today by talking about it. And I see Shalini has her hand up again. A question for Hayley as we're like discussing these things without you being there. You know, like a building project is, yeah, I'm not going to even go there, but but we have needs, right, and so transportation, programming, funding for programs and events and all of those things. So as we're talking about those things. And is it a possibility, is it a possibility at all to have like a focus place for like all the dance classes that may happen, you know, like you have center dance studio for instance or bar, you know, some other accessible place and is that not going to be user friendly for seniors if or do they, does everything have to happen in one place. So you're talking like if we did them off site. Yeah, like if all the dance classes removed to a place that we can rent or something. I think that that would be okay for our younger seniors. But when we're talking about people, you know anyone who has, you know, a physical limitation. And certainly our older seniors that's not a good fit for them because you just think put yourself in their shoes, take so much energy to get ready to get out the door.  You know, I hope that it sounds exhausting as I'm explaining it because for somebody like that is that's the reality. Thank you. Okay, I think Paul, you've got your hand up. I just want to start sum up with this. I mean, this has been a need that's been articulated by the Council on Aging and the Friends of Senior Centers and they do a very strong job and I've encouraged them to advocate for themselves and this is great that they are doing that. The challenge we have obviously is that is another capital project. And the other challenge is location so right now our senior center is adjacent to the largest concentration of seniors in the town. But there's no parking. If you move into a place that has parking then you also need to provide transportation for folks because transportation was identified by the prior directors being the number one priority for seniors. In terms of knowing that we had a, not the newest facility, but we'd make do with what we have. We did make improvements to the senior center last year and I think we made, we invested a fair amount of money and to making it a much more agreeable place, got rid of some of the lower furniture, you know, the furniture that wasn't appropriate for a location like that got furniture that was higher up. And I think we made a significant innovation renovations in the senior center that made a significant investment into the existing space recognizing that it's not suitable. And the other thing that we did just trying to make the best we can is that with the prior director, I changed the title to director senior services instead of senior center because my belief is that we should be delivering to people where they are to utilize many spaces because we have to, you know, we have lots of we have other spaces months and library, we'll soon have a North Amherst library available, a meeting room up there that we can utilize for additional services, and also just to is what we're trying to do with recreation department as well, take the activities to where people are and gauge them. Haley's been phenomenal at engaging with people and you know we've had COVID for two years which sort of inhibited everyone but you know just so you know that the town is investing in the in the space where we're hiring talented people. And we have social, social workers available. And, you know, trying to get some of the services that we've lost along the way back in place, and I think the, I think truly I recognize Rosemary's leadership and the other folks in the audience who've done a really tremendous job of helping us through the change of leadership from a director who's been here was here for decades to marry Beth and now to Haley and it's I think the leadership is really strong. But we have a lot to do and I think one of the things for the Council to consider is where how does this fit in to our needs, and I think that it has to be articulated that the need is there. I want to add one question. In a conversation that I had with Rosemary and Haley. I mentioned the fact that you just brought up that that where the placement of the center and why did we need to stay in the center of downtown, because of being near Clark House and and Wayland. And I believe they said that the attendance from those two houses was not actually that high. So I wanted to verify that. Another place in town, particularly if they were a brand new center. If we had transportation would work, but I want to ask Kaylee if I understood that correctly. I think that a different location would work. You know we do have we have a woman who comes to the senior center every afternoon she does a little walk around the neighborhood and then comes and place cards. You know, I know I know that you live nearby but if we had a different location would you, if we had our own van would you come to that and she said yes absolutely. If you if we had a van that could pick her up and bring her to the senior center she'd be there on a heartbeat. So I think that really having you know the pvta bus route the existing bus route is very helpful there's the paratransit and then if we had our own senior center bus that gives people ample opportunities to be able to get to the senior center if it was not downtown. Anna, see your hand. Yeah, so this is Paul I'm going to funnel this through you I guess I'm looking at the we all have budgets on the brain, looking at the capital improvement program, the capital budget for the next five years I mean I don't see the senior center van on here and so I'm curious if if there's a plan to work that back into the capital budget, or is it offline and not getting brought back like what's the, what's the thought there. Sean or whoever down the road that's yeah I'm not sure if it's been presented as a need, but we can, I can check with Sean on where the status is on that. Yeah, that would be great. And if it could be electric plugin. We had a long meeting where I kept talking about plug in cars and Paul's sick of me saying plug in cars but yeah it'd be great to see that down on the five year plan maybe Andy has a good answer for me to, or he's going to stop talking about plug in cars. Andy, your turn. Actually, I was thinking of a different topic. You're talking about vehicles. But I, it is something that needs to come to JCPC. Because if it's not on the list of things to consider doesn't make it onto a long term plan. The other thing is about the building. I think that this has been very helpful and Dorothy when we write the report for the next meeting I think that it's important to present some of this information and possibly include the slide deck if everybody is agreeable to that as a appendix to the work, because I think it speaks to itself. But the reality is, and I think the way I'll know it that we've already have a council policy of making commitment to four projects for capital buildings the library, the elementary school fire station, and the pw facility which are all long term needs but you know I've been involved from the old finance committee to the select board to the council for a long time. The senior center has been out there is sort of like one of the next things. We've had very strong statements of support for a youth center, and it has been presented by a couple of committees, and I'm not trying to put in a hate to even see competition between those two projects. But I think that it is important through this presentation and our report to the council to at least put the senior center there so that the council is aware that there's multiple requests to be next on the list. And the senior center is in fact one of them, and has been asking for many, many years that I know from my own experience that I just described. It's useful Rosemary. You're, you're right about that Andy. Back in 2017 and actual fact, we were told at a meeting with Dave Zomac, that we would be put on the capital projects list that 10 year capital projects with. And I, I thought that was had already happened, but clearly not. Do you remember that call. It doesn't have the same recollection that you have Rosemary I've asked him about that specifically, because we had, it was in all of our notes. Yeah, so he again I asked him about that because I know you have. I trust your memory. But he does not recall that. So I recall from the select board side and the finance committee side from before having seen any actual list for next projects. I think that it was more that we were just aware of that through discussions and presentations that the need was there and have been presented in numerous occasions. And I'm not sure that any official body either executive or legislative within the town that take an action to create a list and in this policy and something I certainly don't recall anything. Okay. So question of the list is something that we will talk about, shall we And this is what I'm proposing is no way in lieu of a senior center but we know it's not happening in the near future and maybe we will find a location in the near future so I'm hopeful. So I will remember that yeah okay I'm hopeful. And meanwhile, is there a space in the Jones library I haven't looked at the plan which is designated you know just the way we're thinking of a teen space are we thinking of a space for seniors in the library. No, I mean, not, not a senior center for sure. I mean, Yeah, I don't know about a separate senior space that I mean, we have not discussed that as a member of the Jones library building committee. But you know I think the point Andy made and I think it's really important is that we need, you know, we are looking at lots of their last pieces moving and this is I talked with Rosemary and Mr. Well, that's why it's so important for this scene that counts on aging this in the friends of the senior center to be out there here saying what they need because as we start looking at things that we know there's a need for this teen center. They're moving pieces Hickory Ridge there's you know there's, we need to South Amherst school for instance is something that we can say well what about that for you know let's look at different options available to folks. So we, as we look at all the needs that are piling up in front of the town, we look at the resources we have and try to line them up and sort of. Sometimes some things come together fortuitously, and we say, ah, this fits here, and let's move on it. But I think the first thing is to get a group together to start studying this, and I'm prepared to work on that with with the senior director. In their discussion of what they wanted into building one story, lots of light. I did think of a good group that could be co located and this has been mentioned by other people. Early childhood. A new building, which does not have stairs to, you know, beautiful stairs but it's very, very easy access that would be suitable for young and old and that would, I think Haley had said that she was interested in some intergenerational projects and I thought of that but I'm not. Not sure. Could you comment on that Haley. Yeah, I intergenerational is really important, but it's also important that we have a distinct space. So, you know, most seniors I would say, like intergenerational programs they enjoy being around, you know, high schoolers elementary school students, but not every senior does. So it is really important to to not have, you know, a community intergenerational center, it really has to be senior focused, but we can have, you know, the elementary school students come in we can have you mass students come in we can certainly have those types of programs with the space itself has to be dedicated to seniors that's probably the most important piece. Thank you that's that that's clarification that there's lots of people are putting ideas and writing letters. Absolutely it's it's really distinct, you know, need sets you know going back to pull cords in the bathroom handrails, making sure that it's easy to navigate the space you know the the experiences that we have as we get older or so drastically different from when we're younger that you know again just separate spaces. So, I think we're going to wind up the comment I do want to make one final comment I loved it when George said he'd been retired for 20 years. And I thought about it and actually I've been retired from my last real formal job for 20 years. And the point is, I might be here for another 20 seniors live a long time. It's a long process. And we really are a very important part of the population. One of the advantage of seniors as taxpayers is that they no longer make use of the schools they don't use that many services they do use the MS, and they would love to use a wonderful senior center. And it was interesting to hear I hadn't heard the facts that Pioneer Valley is becoming a desirable retirement place for seniors. So college towns drew intellectually active scene. Okay, so I want to thank very much Haley and Rosemary for coming in. And we should then it's 730. Do we have a need for further discussion amongst yourself before we have the CPOs discuss or should we go forward with the next topic. I just wanted to make sure we're all on the same page about the next step so I heard Paul say that you're going to work with Haley with around the feasibility study was it like I didn't hear what study was the feasibility study. We would have to put together present a request for funds for feasibility study but I think what we want to do is start to get a group together to start looking at the need for it and I think that's already formed actually just sort of more formalizing it is what I think we were talking about. Okay, and at our end of the time console we're going to include the presentation in the in our in the in Dorothy prepares the summary and what was the other thing and these and we have to get this put on the capital projects list. Who does that and when. So the department had typically some it's a request for capital projects at the during the JCPC process. So you're saying that daily. Is that correct. Okay. Shalini I really hate your attempt to sum up the action items here. So you're saying, Paul you're saying that you're going to be responsible for working with that exists now. Is that correct. Yes. Yes, okay. I will ask for the van and either. I know that we've, we've talked about looking at the site that Hickory Ridge for many, many different purposes and you mentioned the, the Southeast school too. I just use those as examples of spaces that are becoming available that we look for opportunities and timeliness, right. So, and, but in terms of what Shalini was asking, have we firmed up what's the next steps are, or is there something more that we need to do. I think we just said them. Okay, great. Okay. Wonderful. All right, so does the group now want to go on to the CPO's presentation. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you. Hi, everybody. Thank you. But I'm glad you stayed around. Okay, thank you. So I don't know with these three powerful people. I really don't know who I am asking is leading it but maybe it's Angela how about that. We'll see. We're all set to hear you. Okay, so we have a moment to share our screen. And since there's three of us, I would just maybe ask our kind, whoever has the hosting capability to perhaps spotlight the three of us while we're speaking, if possible. It's not me. I'm happy to do it Dorothy if you want to make it go. I don't know how to do that my dear. Athena has that capability. Okay. And now that I lost you can, can everybody see our slides. And I don't see Jennifer yet. Don't see Jennifer state. There you go. Hello. Wonderful. It's got to go. So I will ask before we give introductions and launch I'll just ask that my fellow colleagues here unmute themselves so that we are going to kind of go through our slides and you'll be able to experience three people trying to give you information all at once so hopefully it's not too jarring. So let's get right into introductions for those of us who don't know us and I'll go back to that slide so here on your screen. You'll see your community participation officer team you'll hear that abbreviation for the rest of the night CPO for the sake of having it roll off the tongue a little quicker but that's what it stands for. And we three were appointed by your town manager Paul balkaman at the end of December in 2018 so I'm going to ask Angela and Jennifer to introduce themselves first and then I'll say hello. Hi, everyone, can you hear me. It's Angela. I just want to thank Brianna for pulling together this slide presentation and I just wanted to take this opportunity to say I've really enjoyed working with these two women. And I've learned so much from both of them, and we are delighted to be with you tonight and just, you know, to throw out there that there's no reason this can't be fun right. Thank you Angela. Jennifer would you like to introduce yourself to our. Sure, great. Hello, everyone, and thank you for having us. And similar to Angela, it's really nice to work with a Bri and Angela as CPOs because I think that we all have our own connections as well as overlapping connections to reach out into the community to kind of help bring the community into local government so it's, I think it's always fun Angela. Thank you Jennifer. And my name is Brianna I've worked for the town for almost seven years now prior to that I worked for the city of Worcester, almost exclusively working in the local government space of technology and communications so for anybody who didn't know us well hopefully that helps a little bit. I am going to backtrack just a little I said earlier, quickly what CPO stood for. I can't go backwards I'm sorry. Just a second. So we, we, we talked a little bit about what community participation officer CPO stood for. I won't read all of this but I wanted to give a little context to how the three of us came to, to this work in the end of 2018. And from the Amherst homeroom charter that was updated that changed our form of government. So, just some quick points here about the, the language from the charter that created the community community participation officer, and what the goals that were highlighted within that document. You'll see us talking a little bit about some of these goals, and further in the presentation we'll talk about some of our goals and maybe and re envisioning or expanding of some of the things that are put in the actual charter itself. So, a little, a little quickly and then I'm going to invite my colleagues to kind of share some of their thoughts as we go through. We thought it worth talking about a little bit about what we bring to the work. In addition to our professional skills and our experience and local government. We all have children in the Amherst public schools. We all live in town, some of us grew up here in town and are very Amherst. And some of us currently attend UMass Amherst. Some of us went to Amherst College. We all are in the local dog scene for Amherst. Some of us are fluent in Spanish, some of us are coaches, and we all serve in other capacities within our community on nonprofit boards and some of those are listed here. We thought that was important to mention. I'm going to talk about a little bit of some of the things that operationally we have done to try to meet some of those goals that we looked at earlier from the charter. So I would invite Angela to kind of go through some of these. This is not an exhaustive list of course. I had lots of fun planning the first and the subsequent inauguration of the town council. I had a great time with my colleagues planning for the state of the town events. And that includes coverage by Amherst media. We learned so much from doing both of those, just what it means to do a minute by minute tick tock of an event, and how to make sure that things flow smoothly and we were really lucky at the very first inauguration to have help from Tony Maroulas, who is an expert at things like developing a tick tock and making sure that we pick the right people to be MCs. And Brianna has been stellar at hosting the coffee meetups with the town manager, both in person and as we switch to virtual format during the pandemic. Town manager office hours are something that I think we have learned that people enjoy attending. And we're definitely looking at new ways to revamp those. So planning listening sessions. I think with the great format and the great tools that we have online those are becoming more and more interactive. And then with district meetings we continue to work with town counselors to find the best way to meet their needs and I hope that you find us to be good listeners and also to be good sports about changing different formats and trying new things. So we've integrated some of the UMass tools for participation and so we're open to new ideas, and we hope to help you innovate those district meetings, as we try hybrid format and as we move towards in person things happening soon, hopefully, budget forums. Everybody loves budget forums, I can't say enough about them. Our two community cleanups have been really successful. The photo that you see on this slide is from the very first one that we hosted in 2018, and then we just hosted one a couple weekends ago and we had so many great volunteers from so many different areas and community partners from UMass and community partners from Amherst College and all of our great community members so we can't say thank you enough for that we filled three dumpsters to the brim. And we found some really interesting items, but the most plentiful of course were the knit bottles. So we'll continue to work on that. And city hall selfie day. That's a, that's a Brianna special I think Brianna kind of fix the day and we all try and look our best. And city, sister city, we are still sister cities with kind ofasaki in Japan, and we just recently host a group of students from Senegal. And that was a very interesting exchange in the town room. We learned so many things that are similar and different from them, and they asked some really good questions. And then we've been fortunate to host representatives from the Attorney General's Office for an open meeting law seminar which is important for people who are new to boards committees and commissions. But we also reached out to the AG's office and they sent a representative to teach us about pranksters and spamming of our seniors and how lots of things that are sent to them in the mail are asking them to share very personal information items and leads to kind of this waterfall of proactive identification stealing so we've been really fortunate and partnering with the Commonwealth, and they've been great about sending us knowledgeable people to host those different events. We hope to continue this in the future. Thank you Angela. And quickly about this and then I'm going to invite, give Jenna, Jenna heads up on to talk about what we're going to move on to next. So some of the local events and groups that we've worked with the survival center and promoting their information and their events and hosting a team lunch there to meet and greet the community members as CPOs. So more of that pre pandemic which will, you'll kind of see as a theme here. You know guests at Cup of Joe's with Paul in the community chat events we try to bring different department heads around to meet community members directly or different stakeholders representatives from UMass from our business community to kind of make those cross stakeholder connections. We did some great work. One of the first things that we did back in person was the Hickory Ridge. Discover that property where we had hundreds of community members come out and learn about that property and share their ideas with it for the future. And also table regularly again at the survival center, the first day celebration and different arts events. The annual block party when we have them to sustainability festival the mobile the mobile market and visiting some of the area Amherst complexes. So, I'd like to invite Jen to talk about some of our flag raisings and cultural events and the, all the work that goes into that and the supporting of those events, especially through her intersection with the working DEI that she's doing. One of the ways that I have seen or I think that we've all seen that we can get community members to that we don't usually hear from is by celebrating the many different cultural teenagers that are in within our community. And so, I think this year for black sister month are online and our in person flag raising probably had the most amount of folks. You know we do flag raising for Arbor month race amity day, the Puerto Rican Heritage Day we help support the school system there. And the Breton Day as well. The pride LGBTQ, a plus Indian Pakistan 75th Independence Day was our first last year. And one of the things that we heard several members, or community member state was, it was nice to see that their culture was being celebrated on June 10. Juneteenth, we're rolling into our second full year of celebration of Juneteenth, a grand opening of the writer's walk, lunar new year, which is a newer event that we've been hosting and Martin Luther King Day celebration, which is, it's different than the one at the school although we do help support the breakfast at the school but I always have to note that the MLK breakfast committee does a wonderful job with their breakfast. I also feel that the town itself has an obligation to help celebrate that day as well. We celebrate human rights day multilingual heritage celebration on the common. There's the list is getting longer and longer and you know I know just this year to we had autism autism awareness month celebration and we will be doing a Asian American Pacific Islander heritage celebration later next week. And so our list just keeps growing and so we do ask that the community members to submit proclamations or request or ideas, you know, we had a former community safety working group member reach out to have some support with an event that they were hosting a couple of weeks ago and so it is really a great way and I think we all feel very honored when we can help in support the different celebrations that happen in town. Excellent. Thank you, Jen. I guess this one will fall to me. So I can talk a little bit some about some of the new systems and technology we've brought online recently. And really this is just in addition to the multiple tools and channels we have to share information I'll go through some of those quickly just as an example. We have our multiple websites, our social media channels. We have many, many different levels of information that you can subscribe to to get things right into your inbox quickly easily or into your text message. So we could probably do a whole session about all the different ways you can stay in touch, you know, subscribing to all of them or getting granular down to the level of just wanting to hear everything on the council calendar for example. Some new things that we brought online in the last year or so we're our dedicated public participation platform engage Amherst. Another another tool that's kind of in space in our downtown area are our SUFA signs. So not only are we pushing information in ways to engage our community calendar are on those signs. We also allow for residents to answer our prompts that we put up there as questions so sometimes we'll get people catch passersby who might not be connected to us in any other way responding to the prompt of what they want to see at Hickory Ridge or what they're looking forward to most this summer and Amherst are just easy ways to capture and interact. And we are trying to expand our research collaboration with the university by offering some of their tools, learning from some of their expertise, and just having a really good relationship with a team of top notch research researchers right in our backyard. So we're looking to kind of expand that as well. All right, so Angela's going to come back and talk to you a little bit about what the pandemic kind of did to what we're doing, and we're getting greater successes on doing before the pandemic. So go ahead and so I think like all of us the pandemic took us by surprise and kudos to Brianna for working with the health department and working with the Commonwealth and all to make sure that our COVID website was robust. We made an effort in our office to make sure that our phones were fully staffed so that when people were calling town hall they were getting an actual live person. We tried to keep people updated on mass initiatives, we work hand in hand with the Amherst ambassadors and helped them in lots of different ways to make sure that they were on message boots on the ground. Helping people understand the mask mandates downtown and how they changed over the course of the first 18 months. We offered public meeting support and that's still going on. We're learning ways to, like I said support district meetings and support lots of different boards and committees and commissions as we all try and stay safe during the pandemic. Virtual community events we learned by doing I think I think we got better and better at making sure that we didn't get zoom bombed. But we learned a lot from those experiences. And then all three of us were really kind of instrumental and working with the health department to make sure that chairs were set up at vaccine clinics to make sure that we had people guiding people towards the entrance and once again we learned by doing. It wasn't perfect the first time we hosted our first vaccine clinic but I feel like it did get better and better, and we had wonderful helping hands from people like facilities managers, and people at the schools. And, and we all kind of pulled together to make sure that we tried to meet the needs of the community so I was really proud of that effort. During that time, as we look to our most vulnerable population the people who are unhoused. I was astounded by the amount of collaboration between so many different departments and from the Commonwealth at the way that we tried to stand up a quarantine center for our, our homeless population at Hampshire College so kudos to us for thinking of taking care of the most vulnerable population during that time. Luckily, it didn't have to be put into action but the plan that we came up with was really solid so that's one of my lasting memories from the pandemic, and something that I feel like if we can do that then there are so many other great things that we can do together. Do you have any thoughts that you wanted to share on on this piece or Yeah, I think I can just say I know that the community also really stepped up in sewing and donating supplies to make masks at the very beginning of the pandemic. And so that was really important and I worked with one of the counselors here to kind of start that and but I really, it was a pretty amazing and the amount of community members who stepped up to sew masks to donate materials for masks, because at that time at the very beginning you couldn't get any masks anywhere so I think that was another really big pivot point at the pandemic was that community, helping each other. Yeah, I'm really glad to each other. Yeah. I'm really glad you decided to mention that because it really isn't wasn't just work that the town was doing. We were working side by side with some of our partners, especially in the community. And I had had one thing to share and while we're in this space is that by doing some of these things by recording all of our meetings by offering an easy way for our community members to join into a coffee chat or a town council meeting. We really started to see participation increase in ways that we had never before. And we had an easy way to through that data and the analytics through some of these platforms that we're using. We actually had real numbers that we could use for one of the first times. Since we started to do this work. And I think through that we've gained we made so many gains that now as we try to re enter these, you know, back to the bricks and mortar so to speak, is really how we can continue that and make it sustainable so that we don't lose out any of of that kind of steam that we gained over the last two years. Okay, so these are just be quick, I know that we probably want to get into some questions. You know, looking ahead, we are going to talk a little bit about identifying, identifying some challenges and limitations we've noted over time. One of the things that we're looking to do is discover and connect with more community partners, we've done a really good job about cataloging cataloging who those people are but we're obviously that list is never complete so we're looking to make sure that it's as complete as possible. And something we think would be really helpful as a team is to outline goals and plans for the future and kind of come off of that charter page, a little bit more and kind of make some more actionable goals that can be measured and really kind of jump off that of what's been put into the charter and, and see what the community needs and what our leadership and what our elected officials would like to see and kind of put that into an operation plan. Does my team want me to just run through the rest here. Thumbs up. Okay. Future goals. One of the things we've noticed, especially through the last few years we've used a lot of technology that had built in language translation, which was great, right, because we know that there's needs there. But it's not enough so we want to expand language access for our community members and really identifying what our needs are, and putting a combination of things in place, whether it's through technology or people or other skills or organizations that we can tap into to expand the language justice in the town. I mentioned this earlier but redefining the scope of our work and finding an accurate way to measure our success. One of the stipulations in the charter is to analyze data on resident engagement. And so we really want to know what that means, put in place things that we can measure so we can see our progress over time. What we want to do, kind of as a core tenant is invite people to learn more about local government via civic education seminars or opportunities, and really create some rungs on that ladder of community engagement so people can feel comfortable. Not only getting involved but knowing that they can get involved. I want to everybody's favorite part and again I'll read this but I invite my team members to kind of pop in and add anything that I don't articulate extremely well at the moment. So challenges. I'm sure many of you can relate to some of these challenges they're not unique to our town or to our team. So things that we've noticed over the last few years of doing this work we we hope to bring to your attention. Just overall resources and staff capacity, you know, do we have a budget to put in place some of the things that we want to do. What's the capacity of our existing staff in order to kind of scale up and scale out and do that in a sustainable way. I mentioned earlier, the general mistrust of government big and small that's a that's a very big problem that needs big solutions and that needs to be solved beyond just our team of three. So the something that we, we wanted to mention because it's been on everybody's minds but just the scale and scope of the larger projects that we have going on in all of the outreach and engagement requirements that go along with them. The library the schools and being able to support those efforts as best as possible. But again, having that be sustainable for our team. All right we're coming to the end I promise. What's next, we want to continue to build community pride through good works, continue and further collaborations with our speed chamber our ambassadors again that that list that's not exhaustive, we want to continue those collaborations to scale our work. And redefine what the stewardship stewardship piece of the work means. Before we flip it back over to questions I just want to invite Jen and Angela to kind of put any other last thoughts that they want to share that I may have missed. Then do you want to go first. No please go I'm a little distracted because my dog has something he shouldn't have so just trying to get to one. So, I think one of the conversations we have up on the mezzanine as Cpo as often as outreach means different things to different people. And so when we say you know, you're responsible for outreach. To everyone in our community that word has has has significant meaning, but is is a word that is kind of heavy with meaning. So we are trying our best to meet people's expectations on the term outreach, but we need to hear from the community kind of what outreach means to them, and that will better help us do the work. Okay, so counselor Pam. Oh, I'm here. I just, I also want to say to like, when it comes to community participation it's kind of, I'm always can you hear me. Yes. Okay, I don't have my headset on sorry so. You know, not everybody wants to be on a board or committee so it's how do we continuously get people to still be involved with local government or what's the town without necessarily being on a board committee, even though that they're, their voices and their thoughts are so important to the decision making and we need that to influence how we make decisions so it's a struggle, and it can really be a struggle. I have a question comment for COVID. You're having outreach events at various housing complexes in town. And I went on as many of them as I could and I really love them because there was no other way for me to get to know that area so they none of them are in my district, but you know I serve not just my district but the town. And they helped me understand the town more. So, and they were all outdoors, which means they could take place, even though we're in a COVID situation again. I do plan to do more of those this summer this spring. That's my question. Can I go, can I go. No. So, Miss Dorothy Pam, we have a whole series, sometimes connecting with the apartment complex and getting the word from the upper management it takes a little bit more time than we would hope. But we do have a series of events will will be introducing crests and so at the same time that we will be introducing crests of the apartment to folks in these neighborhoods. We will also be asking, you know, it's a townwide initiative and we have so many initiatives so we will be asking folks from the library attend counselors are always asked to come and I'm glad that you enjoyed going to the different places and neighborhoods to meeting folks. So, yeah, right. And I would just love more. See, sometimes we thought we could go to the farmers market and sit and talk to people but when you check out where they're from. And most of the people at the farmers market don't live in Amherst. So it was really and a wonderful opportunity just to engage in casual conversation and to learn things. So I do appreciate that. Shalini. Yeah, well, thank you all so much for everything you're doing and it's always fun to engage with you all and that's one thing I really do want to appreciate is the really positive energy that I always had no matter. I don't know when or what time of the day it is and what we're talking about all three of you have been so willing to help and find a solution. So, yeah, you are. My question now is in terms of as we are thinking about expanding community engagement to different stakeholders in our community. And I think Jennifer already alluded to that that many people are not connected with the issues that are happening, but they impact them. And sometimes after the fact we hear like, oh, we weren't informed in. And so, and I know that we like we are relying on you, the community participate or towns office I don't know who and but very. I mean, it's a town managers responsibility to do the outreach. So my question was, when we are working on certain issues like town services right now is working that's in water and sewer by law, and we want to reach out to different community people who are impacted by that. So what would that look like, like, when do we communicate that with you, and who do we communicate with so that and then where would you go about putting that information out so more people hear about it. And do you have lists of stakeholders like, you know, we're doing rental registration so that impacts renters, students, landlords, business owners. So it's like, do you have lists of people that. So, if you're working on something we come, you know, whoever we go to and we like, okay, we need this to be sent out to this is this group. Would you have the capacity to then send it out and how will it be sent out. I don't know I think there were 10 different questions. Do you want to do you. I think the three of us have been pretty heavily involved with the agent dementia survey that is the most recent kind of townwide project of the scope. Yeah, and, and breathe you want to talk about how you've been involved and do you want to talk about how you've been involved, and we can kind of tackle it three problems. Yeah, definitely and I think it's a really great question counselor thank you. So, um, we do have. We've got like a binder full of stakeholders or whatever the, the, the, the meme is but we do. For example, I know leading up to the inauguration. This team and Angela put together a very extensive list of stakeholders like who should we invite who should they be there just to kind of, and almost think of it as a community mapping exercise and really kind of peeling up and saying, Oh, did you think of this group. So we certainly have lists like that and when it comes to being able to communicate we do have contacts within those groups. And I mentioned a part, one of the slides about the tools and technology we have for lots of people to subscribe to things right but it's really an opt in. Because of best practice we have a method for people can opt in to our information but that's not like we can't end there. So we do have lists of stakeholders we have lists of the apartment living communities and how many people live there and who's the manager at that property because a lot of times we have to seek permission before we can go give them flyers because we can't drop things off like that so it really depends on the audience. Oftentimes we'll have an individual relationship with somebody in an organization or at the school where the pipelines really smooth to make a communication or send a flyer do a request, and sometimes it's more boots on the ground. Can we put this up here. And share this with you. And in some things we do just as a matter of course is you know, making sure it's on our website making sure it's on our calendar making sure it's on all our different channels that we use for regular communications. First, so that we can refer new people back to those pieces of information. And I'll just say quickly we do. Sometimes it feels like a, like an internal consultant group, the CPO team we will get requests coming from the planning department who's about to do an initiative on x, y or z, or the age and dementia friendly community survey and they'll approach us and say this is our plan. Could you help us get the word out about this and what will that look like and we'll talk about kind of the buffet of options that we have available to us. And if they'll tell us that you know we really need to get this into the hands of seniors from x age and up that gives us more information helps us help them better get into that community. So I think that would be my response there I hopefully I answered your questions. Can I ask a follow up question. Okay, so, yes, and Paul then would like, like I said, like the rental registration we want people to know that we're discussing this and we want them to look at it and get feedback. So would we send it to you Paul that he can you send this out to all the line because I'm sending out randomly like to six people I know who are landlords and renters. But like I would want it to go to butternut or all of these bill apartments and, and to have the people, you know, systematically be sent out to the landlords and the renters and then students and get like maybe send it out to Tony so he can find the right group to send it out to students so so would I would be send like let's see if CRC is working on that would be send it to. Yeah, so I think with CRC for instance you'd work with Dave who is the staff contact there and say we would like this distributed. And I think as Brie said, the more specific you can say is to the audience you want it to hit because there are different audiences in different ways to hit it. We don't spam people, we don't just send things randomly, we do it very targeted. And we, because we, we do have a lot of information that we do not utilize, you know, everything to everybody. So, I think it's also a certain point it's about staff capacity. These three women are incredibly talented and dedicated but they also have a lot they have other jobs too. And one of the miracles of this is that we've got, I mean, I'm going to say, they're just they're doing a lot already and so, and so I leave it to them to sort of judge how what they can take on what they can't because they're out weekends and nights already anyway. Yeah, yeah, like you're here right now at eight o'clock. But then, could we get the list like, if, you know, like if I'm working with, you know, I'm just envisioning because we're working out our community engagement from the town council site so I'm wondering like if in each committee like in TSO, I don't mind being the designated person who's looking into coordinating that. So, would it be preferred if the committee then sends out the emails. I guess we have to look at case by case understand what you're really what you're what you're trying to accomplish. Yeah. Yes, I mean as I think Angela or Brianna said that a lot of it is just personal communication is personal relationships that people have developed because they're also integrated into into the community. So I think you identify the topic and what you want to do identify what needs to be done and then we try to support you with that. And I think there's that thing of building the relationship so let's say the TSO can build a relationship with the sort of stakeholders we think we're going to be working with. And, you know, like even the racial equity groups or whatever because we want the groups that already exists to then reach out to their members. And it's a two way street you know I just sent you something yesterday I think asking you to help to spread the word about new district voting areas, because you have each of you has your own extensive list as well so you know if it's a town thing and you can choose to do it or not but that there's a lot of different ways, both sides are doing the same work and collaboration. Thank you for pointing that out because that's the other thing I was going to say that if you all have events that you all want the CPOs or in town, then let all the council know so that we can then send it out to in our because most of us have newsletters or we do district meetings where we can then share it out as well. So I have more questions that I'll wait. Okay, I just lost my picture here. But I know that Anika has her hand up and I'm still trying to get my picture back. Maybe Brianna I didn't know Brianna had her hand up to answer a question so I'm happy with Brianna going ahead. Okay, great. I did had a follow up to the counselor ball mills question if you'd still want me to go I'll share it. I try to protect our promise to the public and when they share information to us and what they sign up for that we, for example with the rental registration we promise those individuals that their information would be to contact them for permitting or things of that nature and so I think if we're asked to access those pieces of information that it just needs to be super relevant and in a way that fits in with that original promise. So that's something that we we take very seriously when it comes to communication like formal official communications from the town. You'll probably probably heard me say that a few times but it is something we we value and we take very seriously and work within within that system to to share that information appropriately. I don't mean that if you have a list for a different purpose to use it for a totally different purpose would be completely an invasion of privacy so I didn't and so I think we need to then build a list. Maybe the committees need to but I don't know and that's what the dialogue is that who's going to build that list with the stakeholders for the purpose of community engagement that if a council is working on these issues and we want to inform them and get feedback and let people know about these projects. Do we have your permission as a faith organization as a racial equity task force or all these different groups do we have permission to reach out to you for those purposes. I just want to jump in on that one because we have to be very careful. If the council acts, we support individual counselors, you know, because we we don't want to break any campaign laws or anything like that and that's there's a danger with that. So we if the council is taking an action or saying we need this then or committee, we can we can support that but individual counselor saying I really want to know about this that's not what we can help you with. Absolutely, I have no interest in reaching out to people and my personal, but in terms of like as I'm creating the community engagement plan. The idea would be that each committee would be appointing perhaps and this all has to be better I'm just hypothesizing but but the idea would be that TSO wants to reach out right right now we're getting a call, you know, asking us to go and let people know about the water and sewer by law and the impact of blah blah blah. So, things like that, or the CRC is working on rental registration so then the committee. It's not the individual counselor but the committee wanting feedback so yeah. I would like to. It's, I know we're in the middle of a discussion but it's 10 after eight I would like to have a five minute break. Is that a question so that they the CPOs can go after probably. So they don't have to wait around for a break. Very good. Okay. I'm going to take a minute to give praise and comment to these three.  And I really can imagine, especially TSO not coordinating with you all I know I've had amazing experiences and you know having visions that I have, you know, come to life. You know, and Angela was so helpful and really, you know, starting getting me through our first district meeting and run the fun with a webinar and, you know, so I mean there's there's just so much that comes out of you three so I'm really appreciative of that and yeah within, you know, of course within what is sustainable and what is your time also I want to have time, you know, also great help going on with the Jones library building committee, you know outreach so I mean I think to Paul's point. This is a collaborative effort like we do have, you know, we have something sent to us and we'll as counselors have range within our networks. And so I think whether that's through our social media are mailing lists collaborating together I mean just the potential is huge. And I think especially throughout, you know, bring out that oh and outreach which everyone in the community really seems to want so. Thank you all so much. And thank you for that presentation. Thank you, and they could very nicely said. So I would just my last little word is that, as Paul knows we just received a nice thank you for Angela's quick and enthusiastic response to the paperwork for a block party. And yes, the time was not what was not quite within the two weeks thing but she got it done instantly and connected them with the police department for the saw horses within the road and all the rules. So it was done so quickly so nicely and so cheerfully that the people are happy. So that's really what we like outreach that serves the community and makes them feel happy while they do it. So, we really appreciated your input today, and we may ask you for more questions later. But now Shawnee, can I hold your question till after the break or did you want to speak. I can send my questions to them afterwards but I also actually needed to ask to be able to leave because I'm in Florida. And so if it's okay I will also not return back after. Unless there's something really urgent that we're discussing. We're going to talk about future agenda items we have to do the minutes we have an appointment. We're going to put you in the circle and loop you in later on. Okay, thank you. Thank you for showing up. Okay, so we're having a brief five minute break and the time on my watch is 815 will be back here at 820 so please turn your off and Yes. Oh, I thought that that was already said earlier but someone else I didn't think I had to repeat it. Thank you for being here. Thank you very much. Bye bye. Miss the chair. Yeah. We are so recording. I know it's fine. I've probably done worse things on the reporting. I mean, we have to have breaks because I get up and I can't walk. I'm so sitting here for an hour and a half. I never sit anywhere for an hour and a half standing desk. All right, I'm ready. I'm focused again. So, okay. Getting back to our agenda. We're in the discussion. And I think has does anyone want to say anything else on the question of outreach. Cpo's. Okay. And the next item is Paula's going to give us a brief comment on we had speed limits on our agenda and we knew that it was a question of what's the word who's in charge of what. And you're going to tell us some of that. There, there was legislation passed the municipal modernization act that allows cities and towns to introduce 25 mile per hour speed limits in territory continues to any way which is built up with structures devoted to business or the territory continues to any way where dwelling houses are situated at such distances as will average less than 200 feet between them for a distance of a quarter mile more anyway. So, and what so there's about 60 cities and towns have adopted this and makes it it just makes it sort of citywide that it will be 25 miles an hour. Unless it's already posted a different speed it doesn't sub, you know, take other speed, you know, if it's posted for 40 miles an hour that stays at 40 miles an hour, you can't, it doesn't override existing speed limits that have been posted many of our roads do have posted speed limits right now. So, and so what we can do, I'm not sure where this initiative came from I think it was a council initiative, or if it's a counselor who's sponsoring it. There was a pedestrian accident at UMass and the recent performance from the community. Okay, so we put together a, I'm sorry Dorothy I'm sorry. I think that was in our first year of town council. And did come and a young man and a friend of the person who was killed spoke, and we've had it floating around since then. So we can put together a memo and I think doing it when Guilford is here is probably the wisest thing which I think will probably be at your next meeting, sort of that outlines what the opportunities are for that. And it's been done with many other communities. And so we can sort of outline what actions need to be taken so I just want it was on the agenda someone to address that a little bit. Okay, hey, Anna. When that happens. Is it simple enough to provide us with a map of which roads do not have posted speed limits. I think so. That'd be really helpful. I got very excited because I was like looking at how far away my neighbor's house is worth for a little 25 mile an hour on Bay Road but that probably won't happen because it's marked. So it'd be really helpful to have a map outlining which streets are not posted. Thank you. And a question. Wouldn't this be something that we would talk the tack about. Sure. I mean that's the other topic that you has on your agenda is was what's rolled you want the tack to play and items like this. And should they be. Yeah, so we can talk about that when they're here. Just to see if they have research on it. Anika. Mr. Clarify you may have covered this so if there is a street that does not have a limit posted. Is there, is that just like an assumed 25 mile an hour or can people go do whatever. Right. No, right now the assumed is 30 miles an hour. Okay. Very good point. Thank you. Okay. And Anna, I see your hand is still up. Another question.  I'm not, I'm off a road, but we, I get a lot of calls from constituents about streets that are marked. And I know we're talking about this specific act, but could you talk about the process to, to work with our constituents if they feel their road is marked too fast. So the example I get a lot of Shea Street. So they do a, if you, if there is a street like that, and this happened, I think, with Northeast Street as well. The way the, and I'm not the expert on it, but the way I understand it works is that they do a traffic study, they do a speed study, and they market at 80% of what the travel speed is. So it, unless there's some extenuating circumstance like a, like a school be in there or something like that.  So there's there's some rules about the, that the state has but again I'm not the expert on that that we'd want our traffic engineer to talk about that. I'm fully not expecting you to have an answer to this either though. So increased increased building on the street increased residential on the street doesn't impact it at all as long as it's. So okay now I am back to Bay Road, because the other end of not selfishly but the other end of Bay Road, folks keep bringing up, you know, there's a lot of new houses down there on south middle on and things like that. And even in the past, you know, 2030 years, Bay Road has has seen more houses go up but the road itself is one of the oldest roads in Amherst it's big and flat and, you know, it is the oldest road in Amherst and so. Yeah, I think that's right. So, it, people go really fast so 80% of the average speed might actually raise the speed limit and projecting so how do. There's a question for Jason, but how do they factor that and if there's increased presence residential presence on the street, it doesn't really impact it. It doesn't know. So roads are just going to be fast. Yeah, I mean unless it's sickly settled which is a very they, you know that you sometimes you'll see signs sickly settled and there's a definition of that. I don't think they wrote a sickly. Okay, thank you. So follow up on this. Is there any way for a road like Bay Road to have its speed limit lowered. We'd have to do a study about it. Okay, so I, I suspect that that on a you've brought this up a number of times that you think that perhaps a study should be made of Bay Road in terms of it. So that's what I was just asking Dorothy not if the study, honestly not sure but if the study is the way that Paul outlined and it's based on driver speed not based on any other factors other than like a school which obviously doesn't apply. Then no it's not worth the money to do a study in my opinion because I don't think it would change the speed limit. So I guess I had trouble following that argument that I mean if people speed on the street, and you go and you record that, and then say well we're going to lower the speed limit to 80% of what they're doing that doesn't sound rational to me. And that is what I think you said, Paul, they would do.  Right. And you can't hit and that I mean I think the state law is that not everybody can say everybody has to drive slowly in front of my house and so they have these sort of statewide rules so that everybody's playing by the same rules. So, and I think it's the design of the road that defines how how what is a safe speed for someone to drive not people's perceptions, nor accidents though that was the other part. Accidents can play into it yes. Okay. All right, they're going to have a shot. Yeah. Okay. All right, so that you will formalize that because I know you know how to do that. Good. Okay. I had a comment so yeah I am on on Chestnut Street or this isn't something I've witnessed. I've had quite a few emails that come in complaining about accelerated speeds from some of the traffic coming which is like coming in a passing the middle school. The intersection with the high school so I'm not sure how that that I complained or even really so what is the limit on speed limit on trust. So I think the first way that we address that is if there is a complaint we get a number of complaints and how their stone is a road that we often get complaints on and then what we do is we enforce we put traffic when we have available people have someone sit up there and sort of have a speed, you know, monitor speed and pull people over. What we often find is that it's residents of the road because those are the people who are going home they need to get home fast or something. But, but that's the first order of business is to put in some directed patrols to say sit up there for, you know, a different person for a couple weeks and we've done that on Bay Road multiple times, and to try to let people know that this is where we're trying to slow traffic down. So the first that's the first easy, we can do that right away thing, you know, if that's where we need to go. So if that's an area that you think is the concern I can let the police chief know and he'll factor that in. I mean it might be worth looking at just because you do have, you know, especially at a certain time there are like a ton of the students coming from middle school and even high school. Okay. I think aren't there separate rules for school districts. School zones. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah, and I want to be fair. I know that speed limits aren't actually like speed limit signs aren't actually the necessarily the most effective way to stop speeding right and can sometimes make it more dangerous I get that. I think you know the other. This is it. It's probably one of the top things I have been hearing about right I hear Bay middle station, not station chase. Yeah. And so I think that it's the other thing that might be helpful is to, if you're collecting things to ask Jason, asking what else we can ask for. So, if we, you know, if we know that speed limits aren't going to necessarily make the difference, or, you know, like on Bay Road, lowering it to 25 would actually probably be more dangerous because someone would come up really fast around a corner during the speed limit. So, what other measures we might be able to tell our constituents that we'll, we'll try to get. And beyond just patrols I think that's they're great for the week that they're there they slow them for an area and they go away but what else can we talk about what are the price what's the cost of those flashing signs have we ever looked into automated ticket or automatic parking. I meant to send you a really fascinating article I read about New York. About that recently but I'd love to hear more just generally about what our other options might be. And I think the most effective thing is our design instituting design constraints. So, what that means narrowing roads taking away, making the sides very narrow, making, you know, just creating bottleneck areas that slow speed down and then you anger people you take away space for people to pull to the side and things like that but the one thing that really does do thing is I mean roundabouts work to calm traffic down there's a lot of traffic calming measures that can happen. But, you know, probably the biggest thing for Bay Road is the current condition of Bay Road near. Look, you will not see me fighting for quick. The only caution I would have is, is, I agree with you about the narrowing, and we're also really trying to push bike lanes and, and I know they don't go together so that's, I recognize that that is a challenge. You'll see me out there with a little pickaxe making some more bottles. I don't like the, the idea that a terrible road is traffic calming such as that horrible block from North Hampton Road to Amity on Lincoln. That is an insane block. And I bring up that if you can't run your car, drive your car over control this traffic calming, but on something like Bay Road, couldn't you have cameras, I mean couldn't you have a camera that flashes and actually tickets people for speeding. Wouldn't that take care of it. They do have devices like that. We'd have to look at how I mean the council has a surveillance by law that we'd have to look at because they're very controversial. They're very significant in terms of their help. Interesting. All right, so, Paul you were going to tell us something about was was this the message you're going to give us on the roads because I thought there was what it said on the agenda was. And Massachusetts General all chapter 9017 C and 18 be is that what you were telling us. Yes. Okay. All right. Good. Right. Is that Paul do you think that'll be ready for the next meeting. You know, we've just added a lot more things because I was just on the 25 hour. So let me, I've summarized I'll summarize right to them. Guilford's away for the next week. He's on vacation next week. So I'll see if they if it's going to be available for the next meeting or not, but we're already asking Guilford to look at all of our water and sewer comments for we're supposed to we're getting him those at the end of a week from today. And asking him and Amy to look at those so I just don't want to put too much on them, and then we have through them at our next meeting so I didn't want to pile on too much. Obviously it's Dorothy it's up to you I just was tracking. I mean the first question is how long will you think this will take given vacation schedules and stuff so I'll post that first and then come back to you. Okay. So, but I'm suggesting. Well, we have transportation advisor committee. We and we have what I want to do is to do a little bit of agenda planning, but should we at this moment, should we have your appointments and then future agendas. So you have a memo, this is a portion portion of the committee of the solar bylaw working group Janet McGowan, who represents the planning board, Dwayne Brieger Energy and Climate Action Committee, Laura Pagliaro of Conservation Commission, Jack Jempsack for the Water Supply Protection Committee, the no one initially volunteered from the Board of Health they're going back to see if there's anybody who really will do it. I think that's going to reach out again. We have been trying to schedule interviews with the, we have a lot of interest for the two resident members so we will hopefully have that done. That's actually scheduled. So hopefully have that done for your next meeting. Okay, but you want us to approve the names you do. Yeah, you read them all just then. Yes. Okay, and they all are tied with a particular with some kind of a board or something officially they're filling official spots selected by the board itself right. Right. Okay. So do we need to anyone want to do a motion. I have a motion but if Andy had a question before. No, I think what heaven was Paul answered my question. All right. I moved to recommend to the town council the approval of the following town manager appointments to the solar bylaw working group, Janet McGowan representing the planning board, Dwayne Breger from East Energy and Climate Action Committee, Laura Pagliaro from the Conservation Commission and Jack Jempsack from the Water Supply Protection Committee effective for terms effective immediately expiring May 31 2023. Okay, the motion has been made and seconded. Now I'll call the roll. Okay. Yes. Andrew Steinberg. Yes. And Anna Devlin goat yay. Yes. Dorothy Pam. Yes. Okay, so we have four yeses and one absent. Okay, that is done. Okay, so now we're going to talk about future agenda items and I have a bunch of stuff here, but what I don't have is a neat list of dates, Andy, a future meetings. So I can slowly look through my date book to find them or maybe somebody has quickly. I mean I know we have. Okay, I can do. We have one June 2. I've written down somewhere that couldn't find the place June 16. And June 30. And then the next one is July 21. Now is that correct. Yes, I think that's correct. Yes, so okay so that's nice that's nice. That gives us a bit of a break there. Okay, so what we know we have on June 2, we have water and sewer. Is that correct. That's a reminder everyone needs to send me their track changes by Thursday at the very latest or you out. Right. Okay. Okay, water and sewer wouldn't get sent on so please send them to me by Thursday. No, I've been trying to do it my dear. Just, I had almost no time. It's okay sending that to everyone that just not it not anyone in particular. I certainly feel guilty. So let's see where's this list. Okay, then we have tack. And that we can we do that on the same water sewer meeting or should we do that on June 16. I don't know what your comments or what kind of comments you're getting on the water so if there's a lot that will take time I think. Yeah. I mean, I guess it's hard to say without looking ahead, I could see just based on some of Rob's comments, my comments, Mandy's comments, we've got a lot. And we are going through it line by line and it's too long documents so I, I could see it taking the meeting and I wouldn't want Tracy to have to sit through the whole thing and then not get, you know what I mean. We'll do water and sewer and we're going to we Paul thinks he's going to have another appointment or two. Okay. All right then June 16 we would have tack. Dorothy can I ask a question. Yes, please do. Right here. Okay, so this is clarifying the role of tack and reviewing their charge. Is that correct. Yes. Are we supposed. So, reviewing their charge. Are we the ones who would the charge comes from you Paul right so it's just reviewing for our understanding. It does but you know they, since they're advisory advising the main time they're advising the council. And there was some confusion early on in the council's life where tax sort of took on some things and got sort of castigated for weighing in on something that wasn't perceived to be within their purview parking specifically. So, just sort of like, I think they would like to know it and the original charge was a mishmash of Andy knows this have multiple committees all coming together and sort of saving everything I think it's worth it to make some time what does the council one and in terms of advice from tack and when do you want it, and it gives them clarity for what it's worth. I have those same questions for ECAC and so it's helped for us to think. And what I'm thinking about is like whatever we, whatever questions we're, we're figuring out for tack would be really great to do for ECAC and disability access advisor DAAC as well. Two memos that Tracy sent me and I think that will really inform our discussion. They were very helpful and thoughtful, and we can discuss this and then get things clarified. And so I see that as a friendly meeting, but hopefully it should be but it involves a lot of things, you know, transportation partly in the complete streets, there's a lot of pieces to it, and a lot of complicated aspects so Sorry, you mentioned complete streets which is like a big other thing. Are you hoping to talk about complete streets as a separate item. Well, it's just one of the items that is part of or possibly part of tax, an area where tax does not have a control or province of its own. What it is is this advisory. And it brings information on two topics that we bring up. And certainly we in TSO have a lot of areas where their expertise is useful. All of it or not is up to us and you know, whatever but I do understand that. Oh, sorry, go ahead, Paul. So yeah, I don't think we have to talk about the substance of it but the keeper of the public way do you want advice from an independent committee to give it to you and that's the question. And then then the content is what you're going to talk about during that meeting. Yeah, I got hung up specifically on the phrase complete streets and wasn't sure if you were also asking for review of the complete streets program. So that should be in their in their purview or not. Thank you. Thank you. So it but as you can see there's a lot of topics there so I'm just trying to. So if we have tack on June 16. Then there are a couple of other things that when I was trying to organize my papers. I thought about and wondered about whether we they should get an agenda so for example, the question of zero waste there seems to be some some work on that. Do we want to talk about that. Do we have certainly there's some questions about the parking garage, the engineer for the checking out the boat with garage when is that happening. I do suggest that including Andy that north, just as a tryout north pleasant street we made a one way street and that we have better signage to the parking lots there. I do know that there's a very organized counting of cars parking that's taking place every day now that people are making records. So I think that part of this exploration could include Andy suggestion you Andy you may want to talk about it. It was not worth pleasant, however, his prospect. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. No wonder Paul. The question was, if people were able to come from amity street to that parking lot, whether it's a lot of garage, would it increase usage because people would be starting from closer to the library, the cinnamon the Drake, which are the what's drawing them, and they would sign finding that parking lot down that little alley next to CVS is less visible and more difficult. So, that's why the question was in Guilford had a second suggestion, which was instead of making it one way all the way just make it two way between amity street. And the parking facility whether it be a lot or a garage, so that people could come in and out going towards there and do away with parking on that section of the street. He just threw that out as no approach. You know thank you so much for clarifying that I remember that something had been said, and I didn't get it at the time. Now I know I get I can visualize it. So I think the, you mentioned zero waste. I think that the next my understanding of the next step in that is that some other counselors are considering working on a bylaw I don't know what I'm not one of them but I think that would be the next step I don't know what TSO I'm curious what you would want TSO to do with regards to zero waste. And then the other thing that I was, and she's shall any left but she said she was working on an outreach matrix and that's something that I don't know what what the status of that is but I don't want to lose that because I know she's, I think she's working on it. Right. So, so we have the print of outreach. Okay.  Follow up on it just said, if there are a group of counselors who are thinking about working on zero waste. You really need to tell them to get in touch with me, whether I have an active role in joining them or not. There's a committee that existed for not for a long time the recycling refuse management committee or what I think was the title, but I was the select board liaison to that committee. In this case, we spent a lot of time and does participants some of those discussions, talking about zero waste and talking about trash regulations which is really actually within the purview of the Board of Health. So that it's a complex issue. And, but I've spent a lot of time on it over the years. Okay. It was presented to the Board of Health and they determined it wasn't something that they were had the capacity to take on as a priority for them. Part of that is the Board of Health has very few people. The number of people is what they just didn't prioritize it as a policy. And it's a problem because it's their regulation incorporated into the statutory scheme. And so if they aren't willing to deal with it, then we get into this question as to, can we change who's the regulatory body, which may not be possible state law. If we can, should we so if we think that it needs to be revisited and the body that's charged with responsibilities, not willing to make it a priority. It's a difficult problem that we've got to address. We're getting letters on zero waste, you know, sometimes issues, their moment, their time comes. And I think this is one of the people are thinking of now. But we don't have to do anything until something, we're not initiating it. I was just wondering if we, if it was, if there was anything to come to us at some point. Andy, is your hand still up for another question. So what I'm trying to look for, well, I was trying to look for the, just to see if we'd covered everything in our transition document. And I'm looking at actually Paul I found a map of speed limits so you can take that off your list. Because that was referred to us by CRC that what we just what we just talked about. Anybody know if there's anything that we missed. One of the things on here was the parking follow up from parking study I believe. Andy I don't know if you're, if you've got any insights. Well, there had been the downtown parking working group that had made some recommendations at the time that it dissolved during the terms of the first council. It was a committee that was appointed still back in select board days. And it dissolved in the first council term. And there's some concern that some of their recommendations have not been completely addressed. And we does that report exists in writing. So should we bring that at least look at that and see where we are. I don't mean deal with it, but I mean just look at it and see where we are on this June 16 meeting where we're meeting with tax or should we put that Are you putting are you putting speed limits on the 16th or not because it can't do all this one meeting. Speed limit tack and speed limits because we started it. So then we have. So on the parking and another area we missed is town gown. That's in our charge. And we haven't done anything. Let me just send my sister mentioned tack, tack did talk briefly about speed limit, just to recognize that the issue was on our agenda and they were essentially in their discussion portion of their meeting, saying that they were waiting to see whether we as a committee TSO. We're going to ask them to take that on. And they sort of recognize it and so they put it in their parking lot, but only a pass by our committee. Right then just to clarify, Andy was just there he's our liaison to tack. And he was at the meeting couldn't stay for the whole meeting because we overlapped. Okay, so that's good for the 16th tack and discussing speed limits. Yes, Anika has a question. Oh, Paul. Yeah, come in. So Anna as test. So I guess the. That is exactly the type of thing we want to work out with tack because you know we don't know. We just need for you to ask them for something. Are they supposed to initiate things. It's exactly that kind of question that we want to resolve with them, because sometimes we send things to tax sometimes when we present a road way recommendation, you expect us to have already gone to tack and da AC. So I just want to get those. What your expectations are established. Okay, who. Okay, Anna. All right, so looking I found the memo. Paul, this talks about the automatic carryover of participatory budgeting. Should we be putting that on an agenda to start up to you I mean I think the last council chose not to do anything they got the report and they chose not to do anything with it. Andy, I'm curious Dorothy, it's if it's through you. If I can ask Andy his thoughts on just as the finance person. Well, if you want more information on it. First go to Kathy, because I think that Kathy if I recall was the counselor member of the task force that was charged by the charter, the other person. Well, never mind that I come back to me later but in any event. What was the concern was is that there was and there was a written report and we should get this council the written report and refresh our collection that was presented to the first council and I think it was a good one on PowerPoint. The concern was is that there really wasn't money available to have a meaningful process right now, and they were looking for ways to establish the principle of citizen participation in planning and one of the things that really strengthen the JCPC practice of having citizen recommendations for projects to consider to JCPC, but they were to actually create a budget as was done in Cambridge. And letting, you know, giving it to the citizen board to come up with how do we spend this chunk of money that we have so many capital needs that it was not something we could reasonably expect now. Yeah, I know JCPC is revisiting the resident request process. So maybe that's a good first step. And the only other thing that was on that list that I wanted to make sure we talked about was the community impact process. To look at it was part of the public way review process. TSO had looked at what's the kind of the step by step that we go through when we review public ways request but one of the things that came out of that and CRC was saying that we need to think about if we are, if we want to implement a community impact process for for different projects and what that would look like and CRC said that TSO should do it for like town services, or I think, sorry I lost the document but things like road changes or things of that nature, looking at what the community impact is and what would be measured in that type of report. So I just want to say that the participatory budget. I remember reading reading their report recently, and this is my personal opinion. I did not see that there was a need for that because we have so many forums and ways of getting information out. There is a connection between that and the impacts statement but I think that the suggestion of strengthening citizen participation the JCPC process. That sounds reasonable but having a group do a shadow budget. I just, I just think we, I don't see that as useful to a town which doesn't have enough staff to do all the work that is being required. It comes out of the charter. There's a charter section on this very topic, and it was Meg Gage, who was on the Charter Commission, and then Meg was the, I think chair of the commission that was appointed, because I think what the charter says if I recall is something that the council during its first term, shall appoint a commission to investigate the feasibility of a citizen budgeting process. And so it came out of that and she was the one who was actually, I think the major presenter to the first council on the report. And just to note that and said that she didn't see that we could do it now. Paul, please go ahead and just know that the charter requirement was met. There was supposed to set up a charter, participate budgeting commission do its due diligence, give a deal report to the to the council and then the council could do it could ignore it can throw it away can act on it can do whatever it chose. So there's no requirement for the council to act on it if they don't want to. Thank you that's very, very interesting information now, the community impact process seems to have two points to me. One is we have open forums and people can speak, but I think it suggests that that some of the town staff do some of the work isn't that right Anna, because not necessarily I think so what it is is basically it's it's not an open forum. It's, it's basically like a set of questions we would ask for any project to determine what some of the impacts on the community might be. It, what it does is it does take out some of the elements that you miss when you only have public comment in terms of gathering ideas of the impact right because not everyone can participate in public comment so you miss a lot of really important input. So what a community impact process can do is say, alright how many houses are within the vicinity how many like is it within a school I'm throwing random things out there but it's more of a metric. In my mind, it's more of a metric that we could look at. This is a bigger project like I want to be very clear this this feels in my mind is like a bigger project, but it would mean that they were quite they would be questions that we would ask of town staff or counselors who were proposing changes. I'm happy to hear Paul's input on whether or not he thinks it's necessary but in my mind a set of a set of questions that we use to determine elements of community impact that we might not otherwise hear about would be helpful. I would like to make comment I was on CRC when that was done. I remember that so many of the questions were very good. And that there were many aspects that seemed valuable I guess it just kind of dropped because the set usual question of who's going to do it and who's got the time. But I agree that there were a lot of excellent questions. It just wasn't clear how it was going to be implemented. Paul, should you want to speak first or shall I have an ECA. So this could give give a push towards what the CPOs were just talking about, you know, some of the platforms that they were talking about allow folks to participate in live time whenever it's convenient for them. You know, so this is something to keep in mind when you want to reach out with, you know, questions or gather information from the community this allows people to, you know, submit their information at whatever time works for them without having to utilize staff to do so. Right so you're saying I'm using the internet. I find that interesting but not representative but. Yeah. I mean I don't think any any tool is I mean public comment certainly isn't perfect in terms of being representative based on data to say I think I an ECA to your point I really like the idea of opening, continuing to open avenues. When I talk about a community impacts. It's kind of kind of checklist though. It's not actually. I'm going to try to phrase this. It's not. It's not impact that we are seeking out input on which we do and we want its impact on things that we can tell from data, right so it's, it's about like, it's about population it's about age it's about things like that aren't necessarily reliant on people being able to access whatever means of input we have, which I agree should be expanded right so I think it's a yes, in my mind it's a yes and right. Expanding the opportunities for engagement so that it's not kind of two tracks either email us or, or be there for the meeting. But it's also saying, even if you're not, even if you're not checked in at all, we're taking you into account right and we already try to do that but if, and then I'm speaking in hypotheticals here but if there were a way to design a community impact assessment right a community impact framework that we use. We'd be able to do that a little bit better, or at least try. I understand that wouldn't be there but Dorothy, you know, keep in mind if we're going forward and there's other reasons to use this platform that it does allow for live engagement as well. Right, right. Right but a lot of so as I was saying a lot of these things we're looking for our facts, which the town would have which staff would have. No, I didn't understand. I'm going to tell you after the fact I understand what what you what you were saying now. And Dorothy, I don't know the answer to that right and I'm not trying to create more work I think we what I want to do is kind of explore it as a committee so that we could say, is this feasible. Is it data we have is it you know is this too big of a lift with our current staffing, would it be too big of a lift if we asked for this for each project right but I think discussion on it would be. I think it sounds like something that to me it sounds like a good thing to do so now I'm going to put Paul in the spot. I'm curious, I'm curious for Paul's take on it. I'm sorry to interrupt folks but it feels like we're getting into the meat of this topic and I want to be aware of. I have one more thing on the agenda. So I, I want to interrupt a discussion that sounds really good but this sounds more like just scheduling upcoming agenda so I just want to put it. We put that for June 30 discussing community impact. Okay. Yeah we do need thank you Athena. Okay. Okay, so we have June 2 water and sewer and appointment June 16 tack and speed limits June 30 community impact. We didn't put zero waste down we didn't put town gown down. So that's exactly what we're going to talk about with town gown except that it's in our charge. And it's something that people are talking about, in terms of cooperation and financial and otherwise between the university. So I'm going to just ask Paul so because we're going to wind up here for July 21. No, no, not talk about what town and gown. That's sure. Yeah, I mean I think you don't know what's coming down the road so I would suggest that you've got the next two means mapped out that's pretty good and then be prepared to adjust the next two means we have some things penciled in. That's good. Okay, I keep thinking, oh there's going to be nothing more to talk about so. And if not, then we just won't have to meet for the summer which would be really great. We'd all enjoy that. Okay, we have to approve the minutes, which we have of the May 5 meeting. I believe is that correct Athena. Okay, and I have read it seriously when it first came out I skimmed it again today and I don't see anything that I would need to change or add did anyone have any additions or comments on the minutes for the fifth of May meeting. Okay, then. Do I have a motion to approve the minutes. The movie approved the minutes of May 5, 2022. Okay, and a second. Second. Okay, motion has been made and seconded and I'll call the roll. Anika Lopes. Yes. Andy Steinberg. Yes. On a devil and go to a. Yes. Dorothy Pam. Yes. Okay for yes and one absent. That is that. Do we have anything else that we are supposed to do or does anyone have something they want to bring up, or shall we entertain dismissal. What do we call the word adjournment. Okay. We all set that everybody happy. Paul, would you like to have the last word on whatever you want to say. Good night. Last word. I offered it to you I gave you the chance just remember that. Okay, then good night everybody. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you Paul.