Like all other publications, like this one, rather than this one, present. Tough act to follow, but try my best. Like to inform you that yesterday was the day my book hit the stands. It's called the Publication Day for my book. And this would be actually the first stop ever I would give on the book that I've recently published. And therefore, you have to indulge me with some of the opinions or reflections that I'm going to share with you on this book. I was told by Dolly that I have to share about why I wrote this book. And therefore, in no sequence, I'd like to start by telling you that this is not the first book written on this particular aspect of the Naga Hills, which is the colonial history, let us say, on the Naga Hills. This will not be the first book. However, it will also showcase what has not been addressed properly. And because the due attention has not been given to the narrative of the native, I felt that it was important as a calling to actually write this part of the history that people often neglect or put in the footnotes of everybody's curriculum or the discourse of history in the country. And especially when it comes to war history, colonial history, this part of the region is really foreword. In fact, I've given Chubah Milana and the organizers a recent review which was done by one professor in the country who is also one of the foremost military historians of India. He had written many good things about it, but at the end, the conclusion was something which actually attracted my attention. As a poet, as somebody who studied literature, I another trained historian. Therefore, it was exactly as he pointed out. I would defer from my historian about the conclusions made about this particular chapter of our history. But the point that many people would miss is because they think this is a chapter which is not relevant in today's world. The significance of it is something which I wanted to highlight, and therefore I will engage you in why and how it is significant for me and my people. The title itself is something which starting from my kids to anybody who has heard about it, asked, and usually with a little bit of cynicism and people think what about why you called it East Majesty's heavens. Technically, as a historian, I would say in the chronological order, in 1932, King William IV was on the throne of Britain and therefore when the first foray in the Nagaids by the British Indian companies started, he was at the throne. And again, in 1944, in the Battle of Coima, the throne of England was King George VI, I believe. And therefore, with no particular discrimination, I will say his Majesty's head on the throne, it's a criticism of that here as well, and it starts from the back. The other thing, this is by way of situating the entire framework within a historical context that I would want to share with you. The siege of Coima that shaped our history. There are questions about which siege of Coima. Usually, people in the know of things, especially little about Nordic history, would talk about the Battle of Coima and the Battle of Infa. And it's in 1944. But that is just one of the moments when Coima was attacked. And this time it was the Japanese imperial army. But if you look at the earlier parts of colonial history, especially in the 19th century, you would find that when Coima was made the political administrative headquarter of the British Empire in the Nagaids, there was two attacks on that headquarter of the British Empire by a conglomerate of the Naga villages around India to retake that position. So there are two contrasting stories which needed to be told and which needed to be connected. And the way I wanted to showcase history is through stories. Usually, there are so many scholars here that will tell you. But when we write, especially history, when we write about the past, we work on the shoulder of Japanese. So many people have written. And we are revisiting that particular literature that is available. And this revisiting took place from a native's perspective. And therefore, I felt that because we need to engage the readers, I am of that school of thought which believes that my story should be read by a six standard student and understood by him or her so that our stories are passed on. And if you write too obfuscate and confuse the readers, you will not have achieved the intended ambition or goal that you have in writing. Also because any writer will tell you that it takes time to write. And for me, because I am not a trained historian, I work harder than a historian so that I would be able to present the view and validate my point of view with all the literature available. All the local narratives that I listened to, the oral histories that was handed down to us and also a host of written work that is available on this issue. Having said that, I will now give you some of the details that will sort of illuminate the gist of what this book is about. Let's begin with Emperor Heroin, at that point of time when he was at the height of his power. He wanted, or Japan wanted to replace, after the First World War, Britain as the superpower at least in this region called Asia, and they had this ambition because they were supported by Germany. And globally, the geopolitics of that time was different. And when I tell you this story, I wanted to get back to my main point that the Nagas who were being colonized at that point of time were not aware of this geopolitics. And so happened for more than 100 years. But when the Second World War, and not the Second World War, the Battle of Kwaima was being decided in Tokyo. The powers that we decided that Japan would not attack America or even Europe, but they would come and attack the Southeast Asia, which were ruled by various colonial powers, the Dutch is India Company, the British is India Company, and then the British Empire. The objective was to ensure that the resources available in this region would be captured by them, to be used by them to actually propel themselves to global superpower. And it's an ambition which is well documented. The other factor was that Britain, great Britain, and especially let us use, referred to as the British Empire, had actually, after the First World War, realized that the power was on the wing. And this particular region was then captured by Japan. Burma fell into the hands of Japan. And the fight to retake Japan was a strategy that they came up with, because already Japan as a power was also being challenged in China. So their hold over China was also being challenged. Now, if you look at this global scenario at that point of time, and you look at what was happening in the Netherlands, you would not think of the region in particular about the details within the history of this region. You would only think of the fight between superpowers, and you will miss the point. So in order not to miss the woods for the trees, I wanted to trace back the history of colonialism in the Naga Hills first, before we look at the Battle of Koima. For all of you who are new to this story, many accounts have been put both by British anthropologists or, you know, later-day journalists from the British Journalism, it's about this particular Battle of Koima. But none of them mentions the years it took to first establish a political administrative headquarters in the Naga Hills, which was in Koima. And I hear that tomorrow you are going for a field visit to Koima here only. So this particular region is the first place which in 1832 onwards, when the British came, they established a police outpost. It was this rightly named now, renamed Chumukinima. It was known as Samukini. So at that point of time, when they came, they were not interested in taking control of the Naga Hills, or in fighting the Naga Head Hunters, but they were interested in protecting their farms in the foothills from the raiding of the Naga tribes. The names given were Y, Savage, and Head Hunters, you know, all the names, you see names that you can imagine were given. So I wanted to document all these stories in one book, and I thought again and again about, you know, how best and who should I address this particular book. So all these questions were there when I wrote this book. One, everybody knows the name Koima by now. If you go to Koima, any one of you will know that it's the capital of the state of Mandir now. But in 1832, there was no place for Koima. You know, a lot of names in the Naga Hills were given by the British. And the impact of it is both social and political, given that we simplify our description of what is happening today as spillovers of colonial policies which still today impacts our government and it's our life, our history. But we don't really investigate into how it happened. So some of the stories needs to be told, and therefore I started with what is playing. How was it being? It was actually, there was no name called Koima. Even now there is a place called Koima Village, but that village was also not called Koima Village. So in their own constitution, they will say that the name Koima is derived from the name of a flower called Kevina. So there is a story behind naming of places. For instance, the famous village called Koima. There was no, if you go and ask them, what was the origin of the word Koima? They will say that, you know, when the British came and they took Koima and burned the Koima village several times because it raised the arm of rebellion against the British invasion. And you know, it's known as the, famously, the Anglo-Koima War, because they fought against the British. And the British took 46 years, actually, to subdue another hills at that point of time. Koima, at least derived from a flower called Konuria, is available in abundance in that village. But because the Britishers were very, very, very bad at pronouncing names, they called it Koima. But in the days to come, because they have written about it in official communications and all that and became part of their official parlance, it came to be known as Koima. And the villagers have accepted it as Koima. So a lot of names which are given to us, for instance, I am from the Lotha. The word Lotha is not indigenous to my community. But we have accepted it now also because all these names, there has been institutionalized. I will give you one example. For instance, there is a community called, for instance, the Sumi Nagar. Actually, the constitution of India recognizes the word Sema as a fact. So in your ST's category status, it is Sema. But to them, they want to be known as Sumi and they have accepted that, because that's their original name. Whereas in the constitution of India, it's still Sema. So a lot of things like that exist which are because of the fact that I like to joke about it. I don't want to seriously think about it, but I like to joke about it because it's the violence of naming and renaming people that affects us. It's because they were very bad at pronouncing our names. Having said that, I can also say that their interest was not in getting your name correct. It was not something they were interested in, they were interested in control in power over this particular area. These hills, if you look at it, is seemingly insignificant. But for the Britishers to control the natural resources in Burma and get into trade with China, they had to reach Thamu, which is across Moray and Manipur today. But for that, they'll have to go to Silchar and Maya, Silchar they used to go. They were taking the routes that the abhoms took to come to Assam, the Burmese took to come to Assam. So they wanted to use, they were using that route, but they wanted to use a shorter route. So in search of a shorter route, this national highway that you see, which goes to Guaima and from Guaima to Infa, was the route they sort of surveyed. So the initial survey was done by British East India Company army officials. And this started in 18th century. So from Silchar to Infa, from Infa, they came up via all the Nagahil school, this place, Sama Buddhism. This is Chumukheti. So that route that they surveyed at that point of time changed the powers of the history of Nagahil. So sometimes we like to look at, for instance, the practice of headhunting. What was the philosophy behind it? What was the idea behind headhunting? Why was it a practice that defined the Nagahil culture? All those questions that I wanted to ask, I wanted to address by writing about it. I gave you two chapters. One is Guaima and I think the other one is chapter 9, two weeks. And before we go to even the second world war, you have to understand the whole dynamics of this region. A lot of times we read in national media because of the incident in Manipur, because of the issue in Manipur. We read in national media a lot of interpretations by journalists and a lot of political commentators as well, experts, so to say, on this matter. However, one thing that I see which is common in all their assessment and analysis is that we want to remove history from our assessment of the present. And therefore it is important that if you want to actually understand what is this region, what happened in the past, how did it contribute to the greater ideas of nation-state in this region, you'll have to look at all this aspect of our history. One, when the Britishers came, we were still using towels and spears, which is like a javelin and a towel you would know by now. So this was our weapons, the British actually looked at it with amusement because they had superior weapons. And in their quest to suppress and conquer the so-called savage wild Nagas, they used superior weapons. So superior technology over the native technology, something which I write in my chapter 7 where I say, when guns replace the spears. So a lot of fights happened, a lot of raids happened because for the Nagas, any sort of objection to the way of life was seen as a challenge. I say this because when the Angamin and others went to Chile to Chittaco to treat in slaves and sold, which was the two main items that they treated, they were tormented or stopped and arrested or harassed by the British soldiers. And that was something which was not accepted. So for them, any negotiation, if you look at all the negotiations that happened, all the discussions that happened between the British soldiers and the different Nagas which were in this area, you would find that the negotiations were always temporary. It was always top-cap. But there was no intention from both the sides to actually have an agreement which is permanent, also because maybe there was no such thing as a concept of permanent agreement at that point of time. So I'd like to highlight one of the key factors in the entire history at that point. In 1826, there's a treaty called the Treaty of Vietnam, which was signed between the Burmese and the British. I mean, I'm just simplifying it. It actually ensured the control of British empire of this entire region, north of Bangkok and northeast of Bangkok. And at that point of time, they used a lot of the indigenous, you know, the local rulers here. One of the main characters is Kambir Singh, the Maharaja of Manipur. He was actually supported by the British to raise a navy, an army called Manipur Navy. He was also known as Maharaja Kambir Singh here, of about 500 soldiers. And this was because he was used to drive away the Burmese occupation of Iraq or Manipur at that point. So you know, the geographies of every region has changed over the years. Most independence, a lot of things have changed. Before that, during the colonial period, when the Maharaja was sort of armed, he never had this intention of submitting to the British Empire, but he was using it as an opportunity to strengthen his own army so that he could not only drive away the British Empire, these Burmese rulers. The Burmese had come and occupied Manipur for seven years. It's known as the Year of Devastation in Manipur. Because for seven years, the Métis were tortured, were enslaved, were made to work for the Burmese and they were subjected to inhuman living conditions by the Burmese. So to overthrow that, the Manipuri King, Kambir Singh actually took the help of the British to raise the army and drove them away. So in driving them away, they had an arrangement with the British and I actually have three chapters of it. But why I mentioned Kambir Singh is because having said that, he was known for his efficient administration but as a military strategist, he was not only brilliant strategist but he was a brutal, in terms of his treatment of his captured subjects. He was a brutal military general. So when he came to Coimbra around that time in 1833 and when he sort of captured two khales of Coimbra which I document here he, in the tradition of Métis kings, when you conquer a place actually even in Mandalay, you will find his great grandfather who was called Garib Biwas, had after conquering the place put in, you know, they installed a stage, I mean, I forgot the exact word but they installed a stone, sorry. They installed a stone where above the grave of a, you know they buried a boy alive and they put a stone on top of that. So that's their symbol of, you know, having conquered or defeated a place. So they did that in Coimbra. If you go to Coimbra, you still see that stone in the Coimbra Museum. They say that it was washed away, this is a replica and all that I'd send it to the photo a bit before it gets close. And the tradition that we want to capture is that one. So those dates, at the center of every interaction I think violence was the main agency. I particularly, you know, today if we are to comment on the present day situation the concerns of many Nagas, peacemakers, it's about ending factor studies feelings and bringing about permanent peace and all. So, you know, if you look at it, if you just expand a particular concept those dates, it was one village against the other. Brutal, you know, when a village is ethnic, brutal retaliation was executed. And even this king had shown that, but he was used by the British Empire to actually subject, you know, to try and subject the Nagar tribes in this part of the world. I just wanted to highlight this because I felt that in many of the narratives there is a disconnect between that particular chapter of Naga history in the Allah Hills where the British took about 46 years to actually establish a political headquarters because they were finally convinced of the fact that they have to politically control this area because if they don't do their economic interests in the foothills of Assam and Naga land we'd be, I mean, would not be safeguarded because Nagas would attack their tea gardens, attack their, you know, the fledgling pole and all in mining industry. And this particular aspect is very important because it is based on that particular factor that they inflicted a violent and possibly the most, you know, at that point of time for unacceptable to all the villages the most imposing control over the Naga Hills. Most of the scholars today, especially military scholars, war historians as they call it would like to ignore this particular period because it is not a rosy chapter. A lot of British officers were also killed by Naga warriors and I have documented some of it. There's a place called Bangti, I think, in the red in chapter 9. Yeah, so we're engineers. So where you would find that the villagers had killed a Captain Butler. So in the cover of this book is Captain Butler. I have, this is by Arjun, a company team and who went after the killing of Butler, he actually burned down the granaries in the village and the whole village and he punished the villagers by taking them to Kulaka in Assam to actually take water ponds there as a form of punishment. So the history of that colonial period is a history of violence operation and the other aspect which generally, you know, in our school we don't read about our own history. So if we had read about our own history we would have a sense of, you know, what happened and it's a good place to start, actually, but that was a tough part of our history. So I felt that maybe because we don't have books for, you know, people to read and I should write about it. That part of history, if I look at it, is something which is very significant for all of us. Now then later on, after establishing their reporter, they expanded their control and as our moderator has said, Christianity came only after the colonial administration took over the Naga Hills. And later on in 1944 when the Battle of Guema happened people are actually surprised that the Naga's were surprised by the Britishers, took the sides of the British and not the Japanese. Although the Japanese had come with a lot of promise and, you know, sort of support for a flaking cry of the Naga people for that kind of time and the independence from the British empire. So I think the alignment did not take place at that point of time. Today I have partly highlighted the issue of KZP's of another national leader and Suva Sunderbos and how they supported or they supported the Japanese imperial army in this battle. When you read the review, you will find that the fact that the British Museum considered the Battle of Guema the greatest battle in their history is something which the Naga people also take as a patch of honor. Although there is no critical appraisal to that kind of category or categorization. However, we need to critically think about our history, our past and look at all this history from, you know, the present day problems. As a legislator, I faced a lot of issues in the present state of Naga where I felt that all of this were actually a spillover of the colonial legacy and we are still dealing with and grappling with some of the problems and therefore in order to actually address those problems, not necessarily solve it, we need to go back to our history. So that was one of the reasons why I want to bring out this book and show and also tell that our story was like that and today we are in this position because of that particular aspect of our history which we have forgotten or not cared to read because most of the books that are available are scholarly or sometimes only people are doing PhD read about it and in order to bring and engage the masses we need to tell our stories and I have written in a form of stories as a literature student. I'm interested in storytelling more and writing in 20s so we know that's one of the approach I do. Finally, I would encourage you to see if some of the narrative that I have put across because the nuances of history are many, are acceptable to the present generation whether we should actually debate those issues, those stories and relate it with our present generation's problems. So these are some of the challenges I look into my life because I say that this is the dialogue we want to have. I want to leave it and extend more time with the Q&A. So with this I would like to end my presentation. Thank you so much for having me.


What's going on, everyone? Sam here with latent sports cards, ripping 22, 23, pretty contenders-optic basketball hobby 10 box case, number 13, picker team style. Redoubulous, our names are our teams, Alexander M. Kings, Alan J. Warriors, Arcadius P. Nixon, Nuggets, Barry C. with the Hornets, Bob H. Magic, Boway, W. Pelicans, Brad M. Thunder, Brandon S. Celtics, Bowls, Heath, Cheng S. Hawks, Christopher J. Sons, Wizards, Chun Wei W. with the Timberwolves, Daniel T. Jazz, Dave S. Lakers, Harper B. Grizzlies, Hero S. Mavs, Jason H. Rockets, Jordan C. Clippers, Justin M. Pistons, Mark W. Nets, Peyton H. with the Raptors, Rashim H. Sixers, Robert P. Blazers, Singba L. with the Spurs, Todd P. Cavs, Vadim T. with the Bucks, and Vaughn with the Pacers. Good luck here, everybody. Hawks gone in the next one down to 11. 11 to go in the next case, everybody. All right, let's do it. Here we go. No, no, not yet. Black will go. There's two half cases of this, and then one full case, and then we'll do black. So yeah, you're good, Courtney. Got a little bit of time still. Tony Parker, Manu Ginoblis, Sweet Shots, Kyrie Irving. No, you're good, Courtney. No worries. No worries at all. Red Alfa and Shengun, and Silver Anthony Davis. Nice one here to 49. Paul Pierce going to the Celtics. Congrats, Boston. That's awesome. Nicholas M. picking up a dual case spot. Paul Pierce, 39. It's very nice. Good start. Got like 20 boxes of that. 40 boxes, realistically. Pulled a one-on-one. Wow, that's a massive card right now, Courtney. Go, Dolphins. Niggali Okich playing the numbers game. And a Chet first-class ticket. There's to 99. Cam Johnson. Silver, Deandre Aitin. And to 75 on the Green Variation, Malachi Brannum. Yeah, you can just do autos for this one too. You got three and a half. Told my buddy to hammer five and a half. Max Christie, whoop dreams. Whoops. You've got Walker Kessler on the ice. That's so good. Nice one there. Hey, thank you there, Jay Taylor, picking up a mixer spot. We got a gold. It's a Silver Oshai Gbaji. Gold. McCall Bridges going to the Nets to 10. 9 of 10. Nice one there. For the $30 Nets, very nice. And Redemption is Wendell Moore Jr. Rookie Variation Season Ticket Red going to the Timberwolves. Congrats, Timberwolves. All right, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 11 to go in the next one. 11 to go, everybody. PYT of Contender's Optic. 11 to go. All teams on sale again. Hoop Dreams, Paolo, and Tyree Salibur and Uniformity. Base Red of Russell Westbrook and Silver, D'Angelo Russell. We've got two at 99, Nicolay Jovic. Let's go into the heat on the Red. And Kyle over on Channel 2 Rip and Personals. It is a Bot Lobby over there. The 25, Nicolay Jovic. 11 to 25. Walker Kessler. And 275, Sophomore Contenders. Herbert Jones for the Pelicans. Walden Juck of the NBA. These are the D-Backs that give some run support here though too. They haven't gotten a hit yet. That's also part of the issue. Gallant's out there. That is Jalen Williams, Uniformity, and Green Hoop Dreams. Peyton Watson to 25 for the Nuggets. One more time. Thompson. Desmond Bain to 99. Who? What was that? Say it again. And Jabari Smith, Jr. Going to the Rockets. Rookie Variation Season Ticket Red. Congrats on that one. Very nice. Grats Rockets. I believe that's Jason. Rockets. Yeah, you can match that one too. Red Ice. Jeremy Sohan. Got Green. Yannis to 25. Playing the numbers game. Evan Mobley. Rudy Gobert. Red, Jason Tatum. That's nasty. Going to the Magic to 125. He knew Turgaloo. Grats on that. My shooters, they shoot like Turgaloo. Yeah. Kyle for sure. And a Shade on Sharp. Chris, thank you for the kind words. Kent C. Picking up a black personal. What was I going to say? And consider in respect of Lil Wayne's insanely good lyricism. Kauai Leonard. Red Tyrese Halliburton. Silver Shea Gilgis Alexander. And sophomore contenders, Evan Mobley. Going to the Cavs. Nice one there. Starbuck with the Bucks in 9. Thank you, buddy. Wang S. with a spot in Black and Legacy.  And a new song that just came out.  Awesome, dude. Absolutely insane. Insane lyricism. There's Brooke Lopez, Shade on Sharp. Black Pandora, Nicola Jokic on the super short print. Nice one there. Congrats Nuggets. One of the better ones we've pulled there. And Silver Walker Kessler. And nice to 125. David Thompson for all time contenders going to Denver. Congrats Denver. We hit an Evan Mobley sophomore contenders mook. Auto. That's been it really. No big jazz hit now. Yeah, had a Mobley auto, which is pretty solid. But second, like second year Mobley. Last pack here, everybody. Good luck. Sweet shot. Trey Young. Red Ice of Keegan Murray. Bass, another Black Pandora, Cam Johnson. Nice one there for the Nets. Very solid. And a pink KD. Oh, 275. And then redemption. Chet Holmgren. Going to the Thunder. Congrats, OKC. Very nice. How about Arcadius picking up the Lakers and Nicks in the next one? Thank you Arcadius. You can match the Chet as well. That'll be going to the Thunder on the Chet. Quick recap here. David Thompson, Hidu Turgaloo, Herb Jones, Paul Pierce, Evan Mobley, Malachi Brannum, Nikolay Jovic, Wendelmore Jr., Magged Cards. We had Rookie Variation Season Ticket Red going to the Rockets is Jabari Smith Jr. Yeah, you're good. And then Chet Holmgren as well. Rookie Season Ticket Red. Both to 99. I'll do it for the break, guys. Thanks again for the fill. Up next is the next one.


I think let's hear it once again for the Dharavi project. In fact, this is a project in which, dear friend of mine who's going to be here, Sameer Bangara and his company QQI and the partners associated with that, which is Rehman and Shekhar, who have been responsible. And this is, you know, numerous initiatives of this nature. Really, those two little kids, the young boy and the girl, actually got Anurag sort of nudging and saying, I want to do this. So I said, yes, Anurag, you keep mentioning this is World Music Day. It also is World Yoga Day. So if not for World Music Day, take it up as an initiative for World Yoga Day and go ahead and do that. Delighted to be here and thank you the entire team at Exchange for Media and Anurag, I know I was not able to be a part of this initiative that you all have launched last year. But I was given a topic which read something like this, music, ex-consumer engagement, technology and audience. So to simplify this, I'm essentially over the next 15, 18 minutes and it's going to talk to you about how I see the landscape of music as it exists currently, seen from the prism of the digital world and how it is likely to shape over the next few years. So we'll touch upon some of the components that have been mentioned here, but don't read too much into this particular topic as it were. For starters, our industry with its rich and very, very rich cultural heritage, our music comes from 29 different states, 17 different film producing markets, but it has had a huge association to Indian cinema which is today about 104 years. Indian cinema and music have gone hand in hand and even though from time to time there is an aspect and spurt with regard to independent music as we've seen in the 80s and as we are beginning to see once again in a very significant way in the last five years. You also have tracks of music which is all about faith and devotion which is also a very big component. But the reality is close to about 80 plus percent of it stems from this and hence whatever happens to Indian cinema is also in its own way going to be driving that. So to take a point over the last few years you would have seen the emergence of more and more storytelling in Indian cinema across languages who are not necessarily relying as much as they would say 10 years back or 20 years back on music. There are several films which may just have one or two tracks. There are some which are even attempting only to do the soundtrack and not go with actual music within the film itself. And that with the advent of the digital world the way it's opening up is opening up opportunities for independent music and we'll talk a little bit about that. Today and again just set the context right whilst the music ecosystem globally is about a 17, 17 and a half billion dollar direct economy. We are primarily going to talk about the India market as such. The India market today ranks about 15th. Last year it's made it into the top 15 markets in the world. But when we look at the actual numbers it pales in comparison. Generally the largest market for music consumption driven by digital happens to be the US market is about close to little under three billion dollars. In comparison we are today at just about 125 million ecosystem which is directly the music economy which is built on the back of public performance built on the back of digital business etc. I think over the next 8, 10 minutes my idea is also about to sort of you know just light up the imagination of where this can go and what are the different avenues that it is likely to touch. One of the fastest growing categories in the last three years the Indian market has been a case study anywhere in the world driven predominantly on the back of two things. A massive proliferation of access. We were at a stage three years ago where data costs were about 250 rupees for a gig of data. Today technically for as little as 49 rupees you can actually get 30 gigs of data. We've moved from about 900 MB to a gig of data consumption for about 300 million consumers to now anything ranging from 11 to 17 gigs of data for close to about 750 million consumers. So you move from a market of data shortage to data abundance because on an average a consumer today has a 30 gig kind of pack and they are not yet utilizing that which is why several of you would probably have rollover plans that are happening. I know for one in my Vodafone service I'm sitting on 280 gigs of data you know which keeps getting added up. So you are in that as a phase. Why I mentioned that it's one of the fastest growing digital categories is when you look at the four, five key categories which have driven the digital revolution you look at categories like fintech from wallets to banking etc. You look at e-commerce, you look at transportation, you look at the space of OTTs whether it's video or audio. The amount of time that we end up spending in a category which is linked to the entertainment industry far outshines almost any other category including the quantum of frequency with which we are using this with perhaps the exception of transportation driven services because you're not doing necessarily e-commerce every day, you're not necessarily doing your banking transactions every day. So keep this at the backdrop and I will bring the reference to this. These are numbers which I would say are I would say conservative but definitely very realistic. Today roughly about 250 million users in the country are actively doing streaming. They may be doing it out of a range of about eight odd services that exist in the market. Four of these services which are the incumbent services account for close to 90% consumption and of course one of the biggest marketplaces for this and the discovery of this is continued to be in YouTube. So you have a stage wherein that's the kind of number and where it is likely to lead to in my mind it'll go to close to about 600 million consumers over the next five years. Now let's for a second just do some crystal ball gazing here. 2024, assume a market of about a billion active users. Assume a market which will be closer to about 850 to 900 million smartphone users at that point in time. Now most of us we may end up having you know 80, 100, some of us maybe geeks may even have 200, 300 apps or services on our device but what you actually end up using would not be more than 15 to 20 of these and these as I mentioned would be broken up into five, six distinct categories. So it's my belief that the category of music and the broader spectrum of video centric OTTs if let's say you had 20 services I believe 9 out of 10 consumers would use these services. I believe close to about 6 out of 10 users by 2024 would be using fintech or you know services which are centered around payments and banking etc. I believe you'll probably have about 4 out of 10 users who would use it for commerce and transportation. So in that kind of pyramid funnel bear in mind that the music category is a category which is a catalyst for other digital adoption and that is the point I'm making and you know over the next couple of slides I'll tell you the significance of this and why I see this obviously a big part of this growth is now happening across what I term as middle India and Bharat as opposed to the top 20 cities and that's pretty and that kind of leads the way into the next 250 million consumers are really likely to come from that part of the world and hence again this is a category which will play a huge catalyst role in the adoption of the internet. Just today in one of the leading papers there's a story how the market, the digital market which has seen you know bizarre growth the last three years as I mentioned almost 10, 15x growth in terms of consumption is tending to Peter and one of the reasons why it's petering down is as you're going into middle India the significance of language is becoming a barrier if there isn't enough content in that space adoption is to certain extent getting hindered. Here I think music is going to play a very interesting role because we are already producing you know there are creators, there are singers, there are artists in every corner and the aspect of what we sit here in forums like this and term as regional I believe is going to now become the next mainstream. Already when you look at data regional as we describe it music is already accounting for almost about 48% if you keep in mind the fact that even English is not necessarily a language which is our own language but 35% is stemming out of you know different geographies, different markets and I believe the next three, four years this will go into closer to about 50% consumption as opposed to mainstream Hindi and again it plays a catalytic role in the adoption of other services because just on the back of you know a comfort that you have access to your content on music streaming services you are likely to discover other types of services and that becomes an important critical element with regard to. So coming next to how is the consumer and the audience in this entire space building out? So let's start with some numbers to begin with. On streaming services today consumers are spending between five and six hours on a monthly basis but this actually pales in comparison when you look at a market you know small market in Asia Philippines which is already doing 17 hours per day per month of consumption. 17 hours you know may look may seem large but it actually is just about 30 minutes on a daily basis and the potential for India to grow stems a lot from this next slide which was you know from a report from IMI you know in the Deloitte report which suggests that Indians are already doing 21 hours per week of music consumption. It is one of the largest categories of content that gets consumed. Obviously this is happening on open networks it's happening on radio broadcast it is being discovered on television and digital is a component that's happening in this entire thing and we are in that sense already ahead of the world average. And this again comes from the fact that when you look at it from a pop culture perspective as I mentioned earlier the fact that our music is derived predominantly out of our cinema. Our cinema in 17 different languages 1400 plus films that are produced on an annual basis almost six times that of Hollywood there is a lot of that that is driving this entire thing and hence for an uplift as far as digital is concerned over the next four to five years you're likely to see at least a three to four four jump from those five six hours to potentially 20 hours or thereabouts that Indian Indians will consume on digital platforms. It is also as I mentioned a short while back the highest category in terms of time spent today when you look at any of the categories which are driving the app economy music as a category is one of the highest and that makes me ponder that why are we not looking at avenues other than the core avenue of advertising or subscription and over the last two couple of slides I'm trying going to try and sort of you know just tickle the imagination of all of you here to see that is there a possibility of sorts leading in that. What are the other unique things about Indian music is that I believe India doesn't just listen to music actually India watches music because going back to that same analogy that it emanates from cinema the first look of most movies as we've seen the last 20 plus years from the television days to now the YouTube era the first look is always a music driven promo so you're beginning to discover music not necessarily on the back of audio but indeed on the back of visuals and the fact that video is one of the fastest growing categories and will continue to dominate 90% of digital overall consumption I think you know the music industry is very well placed to capture this and this will kind of lead into a point I have which is pertaining to what's happening with the player and we'll touch upon that in the next couple of slides. So this kind of teased me up to my the convoluted sort of you know topic which was there but I do believe a session of this nature technology and music is an aspect that needs definite and continuous discussion if you go back 15 18 years back one of the first disruptions that happened to the digital economy happened on the back of a music driven service in ecosystem how many of us are familiar with Napster as an example. Now Napster may have shown the path for file sharing Napster may have gotten caught up in huge legal battles and Napster may have folded down but I believe Napster has also triggered the imagination of numerous players in this broad technology arena and those players are who those players are telecom networks who are providing you know access those players are device companies who are creating technology in terms of you know what will be the use cases for this why do I say that Napster happened in an era which was a 2G era in fact not even barely 2G it was really the first phase of the internet today we are already in India in a 4G environment by next year you will go into the implementation of 5G now what is this what is it that this this means why I feel music at times has not necessarily got its due as playing a very catalytic role in the broader adoption of digital media as today if I stream a hundred audio songs it's give or take five six hundred MB of data consumption five six MB per song three years back that was probably sixty percent of the average consumption per month of a user because the average consumption of a user was roughly about nine hundred MB to a gig of data today that is barely four five percent of the average consumption that's happening it's led to a stage wherein data access is almost equivalent to me like electricity or water it's there you don't need to there is no anxiety of sorts that's popping up and I think when you look at numerous companies and the ecosystems that have developed around them before Apple founded the Apple iPhone it actually created the iTunes store way back in two thousand two in two thousand sixteen when Apple introduced Apple pay the background to Apple pay was that they had eight hundred million cards on file those cards on file ninety two percent of those cards on file came out of the sale of digital goods primary amongst that being music of course subsequently leading to things like games ebooks etc so it wasn't that people were you know those eight hundred million consumers were buying phones and books and whatever and that led to them believing that we can actually move up in the fintech space and go into a service like Apple pay and of course being a device entity you have NFC etc in terms of so music has had the ability to inspire different types of industries to branch out and I think that's the backdrop that I'm trying to lead into you know and just keep that it's also we all talk about big data in times like this one of the simplest examples of AI and machine learning which is real which is today happening for close to about a billion and a half million consumers already before we move into other categories etc is again the music industry under I spoke about the death of for instance billboard charts and the emergence of playlists nothing could be true how are these playlists becoming more and more popular because you are now using intelligent AI and ML to curate and constantly update what the consumer really wants dynamic lyrics has become a reality in any case this is now pretty much a hygiene aspect of it I was very intrigued to find out did you know lyrics as a category is the sixth most searched word on the internet it's actually a head of sex on the internet so again you know these are elements and features we are beginning to see in services and that's really where this entire component world is leading to I believe the technology in a music ecosystem in gamification is going to be a very big driver as well gamification has been for the last three years amongst the top ten trends in the broader digital world itself introduced we have two patents pending in the space of gamification so on our service for example there are about 12 different actions which we have gamified what does that mean it means if you like something you share something you downloaded you get points for those you can take those points and redeem those points for the simplest thing being a premium subscription which means you're using that loyalty to buy into a premium service or you can now cross exchange those points for other products you can lead those points into money can't buy kind of experiences and we are now syncing this up with close to 34 different banks because when we went deeper we realized the banking ecosystem today when you swipe a card you either get cashback or you get core points we believe digital goods within which music is a strong category has the potential of being a huge supplement to the cashback economy and why do I say this today I swipe say 100 rupees worth and say okay fine you get this access 500 rupees you may get a monthly subscription size you know thousand rupees you might get a video service or whatever it may be in this ecosystem you don't have a logistics problem to deliver because you're able to deliver it all digitally and seamlessly in the ecosystem of loyalty instant gratification is a big big issue and instant gratification you have a problem which is pertaining to the fact that people don't remember they likely they end up using most of the loyalty programs for big ticket items like you know when you're flying you want to upgrade yourself or whatever and so by the time you get to a certain critical mass of points you've seemingly lost interest I believe the entire digital entertainment economy has a huge opportunity in filling this gap and that becomes a whole new revenue model as well for them going forward I think there's a massive amount I'll spend about 60 seconds in this the video player is make no mistake the next bastion and the next sort of terrain for all digital companies as in that's the next real estate which needs to be conquered why do you think you have global e-commerce companies companies like Alibaba companies like you know Amazon now getting into the production of films TV shows etc the reason for this is fairly simple on the one hand with content you are able to create periodicity you're able to create a consumer coming back to you on a regular basis and therefore I'm sorry I'm seeing two minutes over time so I'm going to just rush this past apologies guys I know you're already running late but the player itself is now the next phase of the player is going to be all about what more you can do can I touch lead to commerce the play the devices are today coming with core technology which whereby it's already analyzing what you are watching and even without an expression all of that is getting captured and hence I'll just leave this as a thought I'm sorry I'm just going to rush this past I think VR is going to drive a lot of this and again music is an industry will be one of our investors and partners the company called Intel Intel has in fact done a fabulous initiative with AR Rahman it's a film called Namask which is one of the first full-fledged films with music as a backdrop but completely shot in VR recently about six months back or four months back it was the 40th year of the of the film called Grease and they got the original director and Intel did a massive VR rendition of the title track from Grease and this was done in a technology called volumetric which had 130 different cameras in a massive dome whereby it essentially makes you the viewer feel a part of that ensemble choreography and be able to experience it and view it if you go on YouTube you'll be able to see those videos and experience it so again I think the music industry whether it is from its aspect of what's going to happen with the on the exhibition and on the concert side or what's going to happen on the phone side is going to be a big driver of the VR I think this is something that I wanted to add you cannot be talking music without the artist itself I think it's been more liberating than ever before for them there is a direct connect that they have with the audience there is a whole new era of original music which is happening right now similar to what we saw in the 80s and early 90s or what we termed as independent music I think there is more and more of this and for those who are interested as artists and they should be because you have an ability not just to reach the millions as it were but you have an ability to know about these consumers through data and information about the artists in the industry and you have a different way to do that and I think it's very fun that you have this right and therefore don't just look at this as a means of getting your music out there apart from that it has a direct linkage into concerts it has a linkage into converted which has been an elusive revenue stream in the Indian context and there will be more and more of those that will happen This is, I mean, for a $3 trillion economy where the cultural significance of our industry is so large, this cannot remain the size of the ecosystem. And we cannot be over dependent on advertising. Advertising at the end of the day is an $8 to $9 billion industry in the Indian context. When it comes to digital, you have about $1.5 billion, but two or three of the international players take away about 80, 85% of that market and therefore don't make the mistake of being over dependent on advertising. I think there is clearly a need to reimagine subscriptions and I'm consciously just skipping past a little bit. I believe music OTT is going to be a catalyst to video OTT. And I think music on its own is not necessarily at the state that the market is right now. The state is you buy a telecom subscription, you'll get music, you'll get video, you'll get newspapers, you'll get magazines, you'll get television, 581 channels, all bundled in. We are firing on the shoulders of content at a price point which the content industry is literally getting pennies on the back of this. I think the music ecosystem will kind of converge with the broader, very rich video ecosystem. And that is where in my mind, there will be new revenue models and I'll leave with the thought for you. So if there are, let's say 2024, 500 million active users of OTT services and OTT has described a digital entertainment driven services, what do you believe could be the size of that market? I'm going to leave a thought in your mind. So bear in mind, our Prime Minister is talking about $5 trillion by 2024. At that kind of an economy, whether that happens or doesn't happen, we're still going to be a per capita income closer to about 3 lakh rupees on an annualized basis. Now if we took 50 rupees per month per user for 500 million consumers, that for the broader OTT ecosystem is a 30,000 crore market. If you took 100 rupees per month per user, that is a 60,000 crore market. That doesn't mean that you will go and pay 100 rupees for a service. You may choose to pay just 5 rupees for a service. You may choose to have 4 or 5 service, but can the average kitty of a consumer be between 50 and 100 rupees as being their enrichment given the fact that data access is there, etc. I fundamentally believe it is possible because today with 50 million set up boxes where the average ARPU is about 170, 175 that you already have with a multiple of about 4, 4.5 as households, these being individual screens, you will look at it and I think if in that ecosystem you have the ability to potentially tag along commerce because if consumers are spending that kind of time and that technology is going to be prevalent which will lead to commerce, then the potential of this ecosystem is much, much larger than even 60,000 crores. With that I'll end, I'm sorry I took a little extra time, but thank you very much.


We're honoured today to have Cardinal Turksen, who's the president of the Pontifical Council of Justice and Peace to talk to us today about reforming the global financial system, which I gather has been a source of some problems in recent years. I wanted to ask the Cardinal first, what's been keeping him up at night recently? What issues have you been struggling with? Have you been dealing with? And why? Thank you for the question. Basically, what our office has been dealing with lately has just been precisely the current financial economic crisis. And although we recognise as a church that we don't dispose of the technical solutions and all of that, but we still have one thing. We still follow humanity. Humanity is basically our area of work. So we follow the present economic crisis and want to consider very many causes of this crisis, the impact that it has on people, especially the poor, and then suggest or engage the G20, the IMF and all who matter on joint reflection for a solution to this problem. Because we think that this present economic crisis is not an experience which calls us to despair of solutions and throw up our arms and despair, but it's a challenge rather to discernment, to find out what we've done and done wrongly, and to identify what the strong areas that we need to emphasise on and develop solutions from there. So we want to stress the part of this crisis being an opportunity for an ongoing discernment about the financial world, economic structures, how the financial market has been operating, how the market has been operating until now. So that's what we want to do. And in doing that, we are encouraged by the fact that for us, this is an opportunity to also recognise that as a church. Our big thing is to call people to optimism. Optimism not because it is baseless, but optimism because it is rooted in the present and the future. And basically, the source of our optimism is basically for us because the future is ultimately gone and we can always seek that. So this is what the thing has been. And we encourage in this regard by two statements that past popes have made. Like Pope John XXIII, who came out on the period of the Cold War with a secretary called Parchament Harris, invited us to be ready, not to be afraid of new ideas, even when they disturbed the established tattoo school of Thames, not to be ready, not to be afraid of espousing new ideas. And subsequently, Pope Paul VI also came out with a message inviting us to be courageous in our imagination of what is possible so that we can modify and change the present experience of the world for the better. For the better, for the realisation of the common good of humanity and all of that. So this is what our office currently is engaged with. And that kind of thinking or feeling fuelled into our production of a small document, which we call a note on the, yeah, I think you're holding a copy out there in your hands. We came out with that last October, just before the G20 met in Cannes in France. And the objective was simply to contribute to the ongoing search for a solution to the economic crisis. And you have the sense that this economic crisis was a moral crisis, not just a technical crisis of too much liquidity in the system? I think it's both. There is a moral side to it, as you probably know. People from Wall Street, if there's any merit to the movie, Wall Street, and if there's any merit to similar products have come, we're even populising the jargon, greed is good and all of that. If there's any validity to all of those, then it just means that it's all not be morally sound in these financial transactions. And for us, it's about time that we realise that and begin to realise in that connection that the real objective of our financial enterprise and market and the doing of business is actually the well-being of the human person or the common good. So we think that the human person should not in any way serve as a tool for market. Market should rather serve as a tool for the well-being, for the common resistance of the common good. And so in this connection, we want to invite people to recognise, for example, the fact that finance should serve decent economics. Decent economics being our way of managing, if you want, the world household in such a way that its resources can take care of its needs. So we want to invite people to etymologically to go to economics. Or you call it a nomos, the laws of the household. And the laws of the household just basically invite us to see how we can manage principle, whatever the two, so that the household can be nourished by the resources available to it. And so for us, this is part of the process of discernment which we should be doing. Okay, going back sometimes to the basics to discover what we need to do and do right. And so that we hold the focus that should be the human person, his well-being, his dignity and his development, the human development. And ensure that everything we do, including the finance market and all of that, they serve to promote good banking, good economics so that the human person can live and live well. So that would be the moral side. The technical side has to do with, fine, everybody knows about the development of the bubble and the development of derivatives and all the other problems that they cause. So it is just, again, in that regard, to an advert, technology is certainly good. Okay, it's part of even God's mandate to humanity and creation to dominate the earth. So it's good. But to dominate the earth for the well-being of the human person. So technology is such that it should also serve the well-being of the human person and the human person also set technology. An interesting example can be, so an auto industry technologically can come out with the most advanced system of automobile with endowed with all the gadgets and everything. But that's not the end of the consideration. Okay, the end of the consideration, it's not the end of the consideration. The sense that what we're looking at is not how much the technical staff can equip that vehicle. We need to think about the driver. We need to think about pedestrians. We need to think about the roads on which, so there are very many other aspects to all of this. And so we want to draw attention to the fact that in all of these, let us not just look at technology and what it can do, finance, economy and the markets. Let's think about culture, let's think about ethics, let's think about society and let's think about the well-being of the human person. That's the basis and the character of our reflection. Did you generate any insights about globalization? Because you have in the financial industry one of the world's most globalized industries and yet the church often directs its words to people who are rooted in particular places, in particular times, in particular cultures. We haven't really thought morally enough, I think, about globalization. Did you have any broad reflections on that? We did. We did. I mean, when we haven't so identified and analyzed the situation, we then have to propose solutions still for reflection. And we thought at one, in the first place, we should rethink our humanism a little bit. What's our sense of the human person? And so generate a new form of humanism. You know, synthetic humanism, that kind of recognize a human person, not simply as a material aggregate of it, they're quantifiable and all of that, but also reckon with the qualitative part of it. Part of it would include his own openness to transcendence. Okay, transcendence which can equip him to ask questions about why. The teleology, as it were, the objective vision of human life and human existence, the nature of the world and its own external existence. Ecology itself as its own program, way and above the use that we make of it. And if, like all Christians would do, we consider ourselves to be stewards of creation. They need for some sort of responsibility in how we make use of it. So all of these considerations came in. And at the same time, you know, so if we thought that we should invite people to, you know, conceive a new form of humanism, how did we also invite people to consider one thing which is with us? I mean globalization is with us. And if globalization is with us, it's basically because it's inviting us to recognize the interconnection, interconnectedness and interrelatedness of the world family. And your church has argued with the oldest global institution in the world. And for that matter, sometimes we say we're experts of humanity. So that's part of it. If there's any fundamental ethic to globalization, it is the fact that the trust towards making us recognize that the human family is essentially one that belongs together. And so if globalization with everything that is happening, invites us to consider ourselves as globally belonging to one public community. Then the question that arises from that is, if the talk is about a global public, you know, political community or family, is it also time to talk about its administration? Right. Okay, and the possibility then that since, you know, globalized, it goes beyond the competence of every single, you know, nation. And so the last situations, in fact, what we call common good, peace, security, food, water and all of these, all of these common goods at this point in time cannot be safeguarded by individual single nations. It's called for the venture, the effort of all of us. So this is also driven us to pose the question, is it time to think about evolving a global political authority of some universal competence? I wanted to ask you, what do we do about this financial problem? Did you generate any new ideas, any new model, any new way of thinking about these problems and some positive suggestions to reform the system for the future? Definitely, okay, we have decent existence in our policies, the Brenton Wood institutions and all of those do exist. Our small thing was simply to, you know, address to them again the small question, okay, that the concern of all of this being the human person, the market and its interest should not be the driving force, it should not be the only thing in the driving seat, okay, but the well-being, the common good of the human person should direct it a little bit. And that, you know, the free use of, you know, accumulation, piling up of credit, okay, which finally bubbled and exploded and got us into all of this, that should also be controlled a little bit. And then also, you know, thought about the possibility sometimes of considering the social scope of the financial market and its business. In this sense, you know, I'm glad to know that some have already thought about, you know, tax on financial transactions to support other sectors of society. Some have also even talked about the Robin Hood tax in the case of Britain, okay, in the United States they talk about the Tobin tax. All of these forms which are suggested by way of, you know, having the financial market respond better to the social, because who makes the fortunes of the financial institutions is a civic society. And it would be good, therefore, to also see what they can also put back into civic society to sustain it. So that's a suggestion that we made, you know. More regulation, more taxes. Definitely. And how would you do that in the global context with capital being so free-moving? Okay, capital most freely. And most freely, that's part of the thing again of, because of its fluidity now, it's beyond again the control, the regulation of a single individual. That's what we're calling for this, you know, global public authority or some universal competence. Okay, it would be a group that would evolve gradually. It's not something to be imposed. It's something that different nations, you know, would come up with and adhere to freely and willingly. And the idea is that this would not be just another type of United Nations. In fact, the United Nations with its spread and reach can readily reform to do that. What is missing in locking the United Nations is that United States doesn't function as a suprapartist body with any protesters, with any authority to supervise, to impose, to regulate or do anything. In that sense, the UN as it is today cannot do what we're talking about because the system will request a certain amount of regulation and authority to supervise, to control and all with even sometimes the possibility and the authority to even sanction. Okay, all of that will be part of this.  So in that sense, you know, that's a direction it can reform to.  But, you know, they have the character of like a club. Okay, people come together. It doesn't, it lacks the representation, okay, of the world community. And if that also opened up to representation, what representation of the world community that could also be, you know, function in that, in that, in that direction. So both regards can, both institutions or institutional structures and very many like them, can function in that regard. And when we call for this on the international level, we can, on the regional level, advise the same term. Okay, like, you know, the European Bank. Okay, the African Development Bank.  And what would the relationship of this public authority be to the World Bank or to the IMF to established institutions? A big thing is that they would all be regulated, all of this to ensure the common good. Right. Of the human family. The human family being the objective. All of this is to ensure that this body that we're talking about, it's a body that should serve the common good. Not by imposing anything, because it will have to function by two principles. The principle of solidarity. Okay, showing concern for the weak and their, you know, taking care of them. And the principle of subsidiarity, which makes room for the national bodies, the local groups to function and to pursue their own common good. So on the two principles, what will be required to guide the operation of this body. So while it accepts the mandate then to exercise protest that will ensure the common good of, you know, global humanity, it still would make room according to principle of subsidiarity, recognizing the competence of local national governments to pursue their own common good also on their level. Okay, so these two principles will be very crucial in the relationship that will be fashioned between the two bodies. And would it have a redistributive role, a Robin Hood role of taking from the rich and giving to the poor, or would it be more... That's the Robin Hood type of... That's the Robin Hood type of... You know, that is already practiced in some states on a very, very, very local level. So some of these are already practiced on very local levels. In France, for example, there is a practice called, you know... Per... Yeah, I think it's per equation, per equation in French. And that practice on a very local level is something that exists among the priests in France. Recognizing that some work in rich parishes and some work in poorer parishes, they pull their income together and split it so that whether you work in poor parishes or working in rich parishes, it doesn't make a difference for you. That per equation, which can easily be rooted in scripture and be justified out there, it's one way of also taking care of such needs. So the Robin Hood tax is there. Taking from the rich and taking from the poor, it's not by way of exercising any coercive power of force. In Italy, for example, there's a practice called the patrimonial. And it's a system of taxation, which also recognizes that people who are in doubt beyond a certain level are allowed to be taxed by the state in support of some other group. It depends on their patrimony. Some of them even pay their taxes. What is the relationship between your church and other Christian churches and other religious denominations? In this regard. Yes, in this regard. We're very glad to know that when we came up with a node, for example, with the Agbishop of Canterbury, at that time, as you probably recognize, there was a big group besieging this cathedral. He called us and wanted to make use of the node. Although the vision of a global public authority with universal confidence didn't immediately appear to be feasible, but the other details and other sides of the financial technological analysis, all those things that he bought into and so made use of the node already then. So we're glad in that regard. I also had a chance to receive communication from several other groups. The latest being a group of engineers. That calls itself a group of Christian engineers. But the node came from the southeastern part of the United States so I have a reason to suspect that. They're from the so-called Bible Belt of the United States. It's calling for inclusion in this consideration. They have about 2 million registered chartered members, engineers all around the world, and they are the ones who are foremost in their design and impacting directly on nature. They design the roads, the stadiums, the buildings, and all of that. So what happens to the environment is a large extent the work of their thinking and all. And so somebody should think about bringing them together to also see how they could also have their profession inspired by some of these discussions that we're doing. So I think it's gone to places, but it's not always been positive.  It's just Goldman Sachs. So that's it. And what are the next practical steps with your document? Where will you go from here having published this? Having published this, which is meant to invite ongoing reflection on the situation. We've directed our tender attention specifically to Catholic businessmen. And they are now working with them to us, producing what initially, at a seminar we conducted with them, we called the 10 Sullivan principles. Sullivan principles refers to 10 principles which were evolved by a pastor in the United States in the case of apartheid. So we've evolved similar principles to direct the operation of a Catholic businessman. And we hope that by May we'll be able to present those principles to the public. So we engage in doing that as a follow-up on this. So it's just as I just talked about. It's shaping public opinion. Yeah, especially challenging Catholic businessmen to be inspired by some of these principles. And we don't expect the financial system to be crisis-free in the future. So I'm sure there'll be lots of reason to be debating these issues. I think we've now actually come to the end of our session, but that was a wonderfully stimulating conversation. Thank you very much. Thanks to you.


Welcome to Learning English, a daily 30-minute program from the Voice of America. I'm Ashley Thompson. And I'm Dan Novak. This program is designed for English learners. So we speak a little slower, and we use words and phrases, especially written for people learning English. Coming up on the program, Katie Weaver reports on an ingredient in cold medicine that experts now say is ineffective. Gregory Stockle has a story on how France has ordered Apple to end sales of the iPhone 12 over health risks from electromagnetic radiation. Belgium also has plans to study the radiation released from the phone. Brian Lin has a story on whether green hydrogen is a clean burning fuel. Later, Brian and Faith Perlow present this week's everyday grammar lesson on phrasal verbs using the word along. But first, here is Katie Weaver. American government experts who studied a popular medicine used for colds say the drug is likely not effective and should not be taken by mouth. Sixteen experts for the U.S. Food and Drug Administration examined the drug phenylaphrine. The drug is in many medicines that treat nasal congestion, a condition also known as a stuffy nose. The medicines include Sudafed, Allegra, and Dayquel, among others. The experts read a scientific review released by the FDA before they met. The scientific study said there were many mistakes in earlier tests of phenylaphrine's effectiveness. It said the FDA no longer accepted the earlier testing results. One of the experts was Dr. Mike Dykowitz. He is an allergy specialist at St. Louis University School of Medicine. Dykowitz said modern studies, when well conducted, are not showing any improvement in congestion with phenylaphrine. Phenylaphrine is an over-the-counter drug. Anyone can buy it at a store. A doctor's order is not required to purchase it. Phenylaphrine is the most popular decongestant in a market valued at $2.2 billion. If the FDA follows the advice of the experts, companies that make the medicine will have to remove it from stores. These companies include Johnson & Johnson, Baer, and other leading drug makers. The drug would remain in medicines taken through the nose, however. The nasal spray form of phenylaphrine is considered effective, and there are no plans to review it. But offering higher amounts of the drug by mouth is not possible, because it can increase blood pressure to dangerous levels. Researchers at the University of Florida first requested that the FDA remove phenylaphrine from a list of approved drugs. The same researchers questioned the drug's effectiveness in 2007. They said they found no difference between using the drug and using an inactive substance called a placebo. Phenylaphrine has been sold in different forms for 75 years. Dr. Theresa Michelle leads the FDA's Office of Non-Perscription Drugs. She said, anytime a product has been on the market that long, it's human nature to make assumptions about what we know about the product. The FDA reviewers said the studies they examined showed how quickly the body processes phenylaphrine. The research shows that too little of the drug reaches the area of the nose when the medicine is taken by mouth. Forms of the drug sprayed into the nose appear more effective. The reviewers said barring the drug from medicine taken by mouth would avoid the unnecessary costs and delay in care of taking a drug that has no benefit. The FDA has not updated its list of approved drugs to treat nasal congestion since 1995. The process for changing the list takes years. But Congress passed a law in 2020 that would speed the process for drugs that do not require a doctor's permission to use. I'm Katie Weaver. Belgium says it plans to study possible health risks from electromagnetic radiation released by Apple's iPhone 12 smartphone. Belgium's move comes after French regulators ordered Apple to stop selling the iPhone 12. French officials said the phone creates more electromagnetic radiation than the European Union permits. Apple disputes this. The company said the device meets all requirements. The French government agency that oversees wireless communications frequencies said it issued the order after the phone failed one of two tests. The tests are related to the amount of electromagnetic waves the body can absorb. Apple released the iPhone 12 in late 2020 and is not the latest model of the smartphone. It is unclear why the phone did not pass the agency's latest tests or why only the iPhone 12 is affected. France's digital minister said the iPhone 12's radiation levels are still much lower than levels that scientific studies found could harm users. The French agency said its tests do not test normal phone use. The national frequency agency on Tuesday called on Apple to use all means to fix the problem for phones already in use. It said it would study updates to the phones. If they do not work, Apple will have to recall phones that have already been sold, it said. The agency recently tested 141 cell phones. It found that when the iPhone 12 is held in a hand or near the body, its level of electromagnetic energy absorption is 5.74 watts per kilogram. That is higher than the EU requirement of 4 watts per kilogram or less. Watts per kilogram is a measure of the rate at which energy is absorbed by the body. The phone passed a separate test of radiation levels for devices kept in heavy clothes or in a container, the agency said. Malcolm Spurrin is director of medical physics at Britain's Royal Berkshire Hospital Group. He said the radiation limits are set well below the level at which harm will happen. He said a small increase above those limits is unlikely to affect a person's health. Users of the iPhone 12 should be able to download an update that prevents the radiation from going above the limit, Spurrin said. It is not clear why this model appears to release higher radiation, but it might be related to when the phone is seeking a connection to send or receive signal, he said. The World Health Organization says it has not found any harm to health caused by the use of mobile phones. Apple said the iPhone 12 has been approved by many international bodies and meets requirements for radiation around the world. Belgium's latest action on the phone raises the possibility that other European countries might ban the model after France. Italy said it would take no steps for now. But Germany's network regulator, Benetza, said that the work in France could act as a guide for Europe. The agency said that it might reconsider the smartphone for the German market if the situation progresses in France. A Dutch digital organization said it was looking into Apple's phone and would ask the US company for an explanation. But it said that there was no immediate risk. Britain has not announced any plans after France's decision. But a buyer's organization in Spain asked officials to follow France and stop the sales of iPhone 12. I'm Gregory Stockle. Being hydrogen has been presented around the world as a clean energy solution. But is this fuel truly clean-burning? And what does it take to produce it? Hydrogen is the lightest chemical element. It has no color, taste, or smell and can combine with oxygen to form water. To be considered green hydrogen, the production process of separating hydrogen from other elements must be powered by renewable energy. Hydrogen has been produced and widely used for more than 100 years, mainly to make fertilizers and plastics and to process oil. The gas has mostly been produced from fossil fuels, especially natural gas. Industry estimates predict the worldwide market for green hydrogen could reach $410 billion by 2030. This would double its current market size. Green hydrogen can be used in several industries, including steel making, concrete production, and in manufacturing chemicals and fertilizers. It can also be used to produce electricity as a fuel for transportation and to heat homes. Supporters say green hydrogen could be used to make these processes better for the environment. Francisco Boshell is an energy expert at the International Renewable Energy Agency in Abu Dhabi, the United Arab Emirates. He told the Associated Press that he is hopeful about green hydrogen being able to produce more clean energy. This could especially be true with energy from renewables like sun and wind power which cannot easily be stored for later use. Boshell said one problem with hydrogen is its unpredictability. The gas is highly flammable, meaning it can easily catch fire and requires special pipelines for safe transport. This means most green hydrogen will likely be used close to where it is produced. The Energy Transitions Commission is a research group based in London. Its experts said in a 2021 report that because hydrogen is highly flammable and difficult to transport, its use for heating buildings and other uses is limited. The Commission is calling for net zero emissions by 2050. The report said hydrogen is also less effective than direct electrification methods. This is because some energy is lost when renewable resources are changed into hydrogen and then that hydrogen is changed again to power. The report suggested that the gas could be used as a way to avoid storing electricity in batteries. Some studies have questioned the high cost of hydrogen production as well as its investment risks. There are concerns linked to a greater need for water than other clean power systems. Critics have also pointed out the lack of international guidelines that make it difficult for a worldwide market to develop. Robert Howarth is an environmental expert and professor of environmental biology at Cornell University in New York State. He told the AP he thinks green hydrogen is being praised too much, in part because of lobbying efforts by the oil and gas industry. But Boshell of the International Renewable Energy Agency disagreed. His organization has projected hydrogen demand will grow to 550 million tons by 2050. That would be up from the current 100 million tons. The International Energy Agency says production of hydrogen is responsible for creating around 830 million tons of carbon dioxide per year. Boshell said just replacing this so-called gray hydrogen, hydrogen produced from fossil fuels, would establish a long-term market for green hydrogen. The first thing we have to do is start replacing the existing demand for gray hydrogen, he said. And then we can add additional demand and applications of green hydrogen as a fuel for industries, shipping and aviation. I'm Brian Lin. Learning English has launched a new program for children. It is called Let's Learn English with Anna. The new course aims to teach children American English through asking and answering questions and experiencing fun situations. For more information visit our website learningenglish.boanews.com. Sometimes the Learning English program Ask a Teacher receives questions from learners that we are not able to answer on that program. The question might be more advanced and the answer longer than we have time for on Ask a Teacher. But the questions are worthy so in this week's everyday grammar we will explore Nora's question about phrasal verbs with along. Nora writes that she does not understand why we add along to such words as come, send and tag. She says that she does not see any changes to their meanings when along is added. Let's answer Nora's question about these three phrasal verbs. Along as a preposition means a line matching the length or direction of something. It could also mean points on or near something. We drove along the coast of Maine. We use along in this sentence to say that we drove on a road that runs next to or near the coast. We saw beautiful beach houses along the drive. Here we use along to mean points. The beach houses are the points. Along as an adverb has many meanings. We can use along to describe the forward movement of something. It can also mean to be in the company of or in addition to. When we add along to a verb we get these more exact meanings. Phrasal verbs are groups of words made up of a verb and another short word or words. Together these groups of words mean something different from what the individual words suggest. As a result you can think of phrasal verbs as kinds of special expressions. There are many phrasal verbs in English and often each phrasal verb can have different meanings. Let's try to simplify Nora's three phrasal verbs come along, send along, and tag along. Come along is our first phrasal verb. It means to go with or accompany someone. Usually that person is the one who leads the way. So the person that is coming along is the secondary person who is okay with someone leading them. Do you mind if I come along to the store with you? I just need a few things for dinner. Come along is a phrasal verb with other meanings too. It can mean to make progress. Your painting is coming along nicely. It is almost done. And lastly come along means to make an appearance. Blue moons come along every two or three years, usually. The next phrasal verb with along is send along. It has two meanings. The first meaning is to send something additional with something else. My sister mailed me a gift last week and sent along a letter from my parents. In addition to the gift, the letter was also sent. Send along also means to dismiss. Usually we can separate this phrasal verb for this meaning. The teacher sent the children along to lunch. Tag along is like come along. It means to follow someone else, but with an added meaning that the person tagging along might not be so welcomed or is just following the other person. It has a more negative association than come along. Sam's little sister always tags along when he plays outside with his friends. The verb tag by itself can mean to attach as an additional element or to follow closely. While both meanings share similarities to tag along, the phrasal verb has additional meaning tagged on. Today we looked at three phrasal verbs with the preposition along. Phrasal verbs have their own separate meaning apart from the original verbs and preposition, adverb combination. Come along and tag along are similar, but tag along has a more negative association. You might want someone to come along with you, but tagging along probably not. Send along has two meanings, to dismiss and to send something together with something else. Thanks for the question, Nora. We hope our exploration of come, send and tag along has cleared up some of the mystery around phrasal verbs. I'm Faith Perlow. And I'm Brian Lin. You just heard Faith Perlow present this week's everyday grammar. Welcome back to the show, Faith. Thanks, Dan. Today we learned three phrasal verbs with the word along. Are there other phrasal verbs with along? There are many more phrasal verbs with along. Two more that we often use in everyday conversation are get along and go along. Both of these have many meanings. One meaning of get along is to have a friendly relationship with someone. If two people get along, they like each other and they may have things in common or they just like each other's company. I get along with many different types of people. Other meanings of get along are to manage to live and to go away. How about go along? Go along also has multiple meanings. One definition of go along is to agree with someone or cooperate with them. For example, she goes along with her friends' ideas all of the time. She rarely makes decisions for herself. Other meanings of go along include to move on or proceed and to travel together or go with someone. Is that why phrasal verbs are so difficult for English learners? Because they have many different meanings? Yes, that is one of the reasons. We call these types of words with many meanings polycymus. Poly meaning many. There are many polycymus words in English. Even simple words like water have many meanings. Multiple meanings make learning the word harder because it is not a one-to-one match. One word, one meaning. Also the two parts of phrasal verbs take on a whole new meaning when combined. This adds to the difficulty too. Well Faith, thanks for helping us sort out a few of these phrasal verbs. I see what you did there Dan. Sort out is a great phrasal verb. That means to resolve a problem. I'd be happy to help sort out phrasal verbs anytime. Thanks for having me back on the show. And that's our program for today. Join us again tomorrow to keep learning English through stories from around the world. I'm Ashley Thompson. And I'm Dan Novak.


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