wage general housing military affairs in the house and before we get going we'll introduce ourselves and talk a little bit about about how we're going to proceed. I'm Helen Head, chair of the committee and representative from South Burlington. I'm representative Tom Stevens from Monteverry Vice-Chair. Representative Kevin Coach Christie from Murford. Representative Tommy Walsh from FC. Representative Vicki Strong from Albany, Vermont. I'm representative Dionne Gonzalez from Mititi. I'm representative Mary Howard from Brooklyn City. I'm happy to be here and happy to enter all here too. The committee has taken up S40 which is a bill that would raise the minimum wage over the course of the next six years. It's a Senate bill and it gets us to $15 an hour by 2024. We've taken a fair amount of testimony and this is our only public hearing this year and also a welcome representative Heidi Sherman from Stoke was just joining us on the committee and we have other representatives who are in the room too. I see representative Rodin, Chestnut Handelman, and representative Kirk Taylor, representative Dave Lawrence, and I'm missing somebody. Representative Ryan Gina. Representative Sandy Haas. Welcome everyone. So we've got a pretty full list of folks to testify and there's some folks that we could not sign in because we kind of ran out of room. So what we're going to do is we think that if everyone can pretty much hold it to two minutes, we can get everybody in who wants to speak. And what we'll do is call folks up and say who's on deck so if the next person can prepare that would be great. I'd ask that you hold not applaud but listen respectfully to all the speakers in order to move things along in a fair and balanced manner. So we'll get started and first up is Deb Snell and on deck is Chloe White. And Dr. Gonzalez, do you want to explain the time? Yeah, I'm going to be really fast so it's okay. So I have the iPad here and I will be pressing starts for two minutes and hopefully folks up there you can see the countdown. Good evening. My name is Deb Snell. I'm a nurse at the University of Vermont Medical Center as well as president of AFT Vermont, a unit representing almost 5,000 higher education and health care professionals in every county in Vermont. Our members fight for improvement in higher education and health care for all Vermonters through collective bargaining and by engaging in community and political struggles. One of AFT Vermont's top legislative priorities this year is to support the increase in the minimum wage to $15 an hour for all Vermonters. While most of our members make this, many of our colleagues at the hospital and colleges do not. We see firsthand how hard our colleagues work. At the hospital, many of these workers are providing direct patient care, bathing, feeding, hand holding, all are preserving the patient's dignity. LNA's mental health techs and really all Vermonters deserve to earn wages that keep them out of poverty. I am proud to say that when entering negotiations last week, the VFNHP, representing the nurses at the Medical Center, asked the hospital administration to step up to the plate and raise minimum wage for all UVMMC employees to $15 an hour, starting now not in 2024. It's simply the right thing to do. Workforce development is of great concern to all of us. We need to be able to attract and retain workers here in Vermont and this is simply a step that needs to be taken. Working people have been taking pay cuts for over 50 years. In 2012 it had been estimated that with inflation and productivity growth, the minimum wage would have risen to $21 and $72 an hour. It's time for the right thing to do for all working Vermonters and raise the minimum wage. Thank you. So as you all know, the ACLU of Vermont is a non-partisan membership organization. We work to defend individual rights and liberties guaranteed in our constitutions through policy, advocacy, litigation, community organizing and public education. We have 8,000 members in Vermont and millions of members, activists and supporters nationwide. We believe that access to life's basic necessities is critical in order to enjoy the rights and freedoms guaranteed by the federal and Vermont constitutions. People can't participate fully in society and therefore utilize their constitutional and civil liberties if they are struggling to provide for themselves and their families. Without a livable and fair wage, the basic necessities are out of reach for too many Vermonters. Over 1 in 10 Vermonters live below the federal poverty line, including 14% of Vermont children. Enacting S40 would be an important step towards bringing Vermonters closer to accessing the promises of our state and federal constitutions. A living wage stands to benefit and enhance Vermonters' civil liberties in myriad ways. For example, the impact of a wage increase on our criminal justice system should not be overlooked. The ACLU of Vermont recently launched a criminal justice reform campaign, Smart Justice Vermont, with a goal of cutting Vermont's prison population in half. According to a 2016 White House report, crime and poverty are correlated and criminal behavior is often motivated by a lack of opportunity. Studies have found that wage increases significantly decrease crime. The report highlights studies that estimate that a 10% increase in wages for non-college educated men, for example, could result in a 10 to 20% reduction in crime rates and then also, therefore, cutting our incarceration rate. So raising the minimum wage could be expected to have a positive effect on reducing Vermont's crime and incarceration rates, saving Vermont money, and improving the lives of hundreds of Vermonters and their families. That's why we urge you to join the Senate and pass S40 to lift up all Vermonters and continue the work of building a more equitable and just society for everyone. Thank you. Thank you. Alan Walski and Conrad Beck here in Lafayette. And I'll just mention as I was coming in that if you do have written testimony, I certainly made that without the assistance of no one. Welcome. Thank you. I'm Alan Walski. I live in Franklin County, Berkshire, Vermont. And I'm here to let you know that we're a chief exporter from Franklin County and our chief exporter is talent. It's talent because people can't, once they graduate from high school, find a decent paying job in Franklin County. As a disabled Vietnam veteran, I find it difficult to get any kind of employment or even get interviews to speak of. And as far as the state of Vermont goes, the most benefit I get as a veteran who is disabled, legally blind, is thank you for your service. Transport to the VA facility is very difficult and it's affected my health. Over the last 40 years, the entire middle class has not been given pay increases comparable to the people at the very top. It seems like they have bought off all our politicians. And the reason why they keep getting the big bucks and the people at the bottom get nothing is that they are, to put it plain and simple, they're bought and paid for. Looking on Google, it doesn't take you very much digging. It only took me less than a minute to find out that we had a good minimum wage in 1968. It was $1.60 per hour. And if it had kept pace with inflation, the way everything else seems to, electricity, taxes, name it, prices keep going up. If business wants to stay in business and get more customers, all they have to do is lower their prices. Barring that, which isn't too likely, we need to increase the minimum wage. And I'm embarrassed to sit here and tell you that it should be $15 an hour when everybody knows that it should be at least $20.16 an hour. We don't believe in this country an involuntary servitude. We do seem to believe that it's okay to make people into wage slaves. Thank you. Karen Lafayette and then Dottie Kyle. Good afternoon. I'm Karen Lafayette and I'm representing the Vermont Low Income Advocacy Council. Viliac supports increasing the minimum wage to $15 an hour as in S40 past Senate. We would like to see it implemented sooner than 2024. We are concerned about the benefit cliff as well, but we feel strongly that the move to a livable wage is the best way in reducing income inequality and to help Vermonters move out of poverty. We do urge the committee to strengthen the language around the Child Care Financial Assistance Program and not leave the assistance level or eligibility up to to the extent funds are available. Funds should be appropriated to adjust the sliding scale of the Child Care Financial Assistance Benefit to correspond with each minimum increase. Viliac priorities advocate for economic justice in a fair wage for fair work. Fair wages at a minimum should include being able to provide an adequate standard of living for workers and their dependents, including food, clothing, shelter, physical act, safety, basic health and preventative care and food safety. We believe that moving to a $15 minimum wage will contribute to the overall well-being of our families, our communities, our businesses and state and will help boost our economy by attracting more young talented people to the state and by encouraging young families to stay in Vermont. The basic needs budget, the hourly wage to meet the basic needs budget is $1303, so our current wage of $1050, $21,840 a year does not meet that. Increasing the minimum wage would reduce poverty. In the interest of time, I just want to mention I'm on the Child Poverty Council as well, and children who are born into poverty and live persistently in poor conditions are at risk of adverse outcomes. However, even short-term spells of poverty can expose children to hardships such as food insecurity, housing insecurity, homelessness, loss of health and disruptions. The Child Poverty Council believes that the way to improve the loss of children in the state is to increase the wages and better jobs for their parents. Thank you. When I clean it up, I'll submit it. I appreciate it. Dottie Kyle, follow-up by Renee Berry. Dottie Kyle from Lauren. I'm a retired small business person, Vermont innkeeper, and I have a one sentence, maybe it's a long sentence, comment to make. Particularly to the naysayers, the, oh my gosh, it's going to destroy my business because I can't afford to pay people more than I'm paying them now. I would submit that they are victims of poor planning and poor business practice. I think that any employer can find a way to pay a fair wage to his or her employees. And that's not just raising the hourly wage, but also giving them a paid vacation and some sick days. That's all I have to say. Thank you. Renee Berry, followed by Kelly Cummings. Hi, my name is Renee. I'm 26 years old, and I live here in Montpelier. I want to bring up a topic that my friends and I often discuss, one that intersects with this issue of raising the minimum wage. In the year 2018, Americans are burdened by more student loan debt than ever. Nationally, we are now trillions of dollars in student loan debt, and the average student loan debt for a graduate in Vermont is $17,912. I went to college in Craftsbury at Sterling College, which is in no way an Ivy League school. It's a farm school. And two of my friends and I that graduated from there calculated that together we have a student loan debt of $181,000, just the three of us. The cost of education is higher than ever nationally on average two and a half times more than it was 20 years ago. This is just reality for young people now that pursuing education has a really long term financial impact. One of my friends has a monthly loan payment that costs more than her rent. I'm lucky because I only have to pay $200 a month, but that's on top of my rent, my utilities, groceries, and other expenses. I don't have enough to save for my future, and I have no idea how people close to my age start having families. Of course, raising the minimum wage in Vermont isn't going to solve this issue, but it will help Vermonters who want to pursue education to be able to pay their bills and their loans in this climate. Vermont is an aging state with the average age much higher than the national average. If Vermont had a more just and sustainable minimum wage, it could be an asset which attracts young folks like me who are dealing with these debilitating loans firsthand. And one last note I want to make is that higher rates of mental health issues are associated with poverty, and it's a self-reinforcing cycle. I would hope that Vermont is a state that recognizes the health implications of inadequate wages and takes them seriously. Thank you. Kelly Cummings, and on deck, Anne Zimmerman. Hello, how are you? Okay. My name is Kelly Cummings, and I'm from Fletcher, Vermont, even though I'm originally from Texas, so that explains that. Okay. I would like to start by saying not all businesses operate the same way. I know there are lots of businesses who really do great things for their employees, and I'm appreciative of what they do. What follows is directed towards the individuals who can't seem to find their way to understanding employees have needs to. So I was thinking this morning about the American Dream. The dictionary defines it as this, the idea that every U.S. citizen should have an equal opportunity to achieve success and prosperity through hard work, determination, and initiative. I believe the American Dream is dead, and we all know it. In today's world, you just can't get there from here. I've begun to wonder, in order for business to succeed in Vermont, must the common man and woman fail? I've read the complaints of business owners saying to give a living wage to their employees might force them to close down, to increase prices, or to let some employees go. I've read comments that said employees should be glad to have a low-paying job rather than no job at all. I can't help but think, what? Just why do they say this? Could it be because it might cut into their profits? They argue for protecting their bottom line, yet begrudge the worker who also wants to protect his. So the question is, is a business more important than an employee? One survive without the other. I would argue no. They are of equal importance, and we must recognize this and work toward a more balanced relationship. We've always heard that we should all want business to succeed. We need jobs, and we do, but it is outrageous to ask for monitors to continue struggling with the unlivable wages and work as if slaves for the business owners so the business owners can succeed while they cannot. My husband has his own business, and he pays a very good wage. He could pay less and profit more, but he believes his rise should not be at the failure of someone else. Thank you. Thanks. Ann Zimmerman, and then Professor Cabay. My apologies to any and all of you whose names I've led you to. Set us straight, please. I'm Ann Zimmerman from Guilford. I came up here to testify last fall before the Joint Study Committee and again in January before the Senate Committee. And the reason I'm here again, willing to leave work early and hold myself up here from southern Vermont to testify, is my personal relationship to this issue as a person who has raised kids while working at an hourly wage job. It's really important to me that we begin to address how difficult it is to survive in our low wage state. And my remarks in those two sessions are part of the public record, so I didn't want to repeat them verbatim. And I was going to just speak extemporaneously, but I didn't sleep much last night, so I made some notes. And frankly, when I think about the worst details of trying to survive as a single head of household in Vermont with two kids, it's possible to experience something akin to PTSD. And I'm not prepared to share all of the gory details here, except to say that I lost a lot of sleep when my kids were growing up, contemplating how to keep us afloat from week to week and month to month. And the stress of that for parents can be really overwhelming. The fact that many kids fall through the cracks doesn't surprise me in the least having, you know, lived that reality. I came to Vermont just after college. I fell in love with it. I decided to make it my forever home, and for a little while it was fine to support myself working for Peanuts on an organic farm and living a backwoods lifestyle with improvised system and no running water to be able to afford to stay here. But eventually, through no choice of mine, I found myself single with two kids. That wasn't a viable lifestyle anymore, and I had to face the regular rental market. And that was pretty scary. It was two decades ago, and it's a lot worse now. And what I think about what I want to express to this committee, I want to make sure that you know who it is that is working as an hourly paid employee at the bottom of a pay scale. I want to make sure that you know that it's not mainly kids or young adults who are just biding their time. I work in an independent bookstore in Brattleboro, where I've been for 18 years. My kids were two and six when I began there, and it's been a great place to work. My kids have essentially grown up there. There were numerous times that I had to park them in the kids room when I had a childcare emergency, and my bosses were great. So I appreciated that. Prior to that, I had a little cottage business, but I worked at it in the middle of the night, and at some point I decided that my kids needed a mom who had slept a little before she was driving them around in the car. So I was grateful to have found this job, even at the low pay. But I just want to make sure you know that I work with all middle-aged women. We're all college-educated. Two of my coworkers are over 60. One of those works two jobs, two other jobs to get by, and we all have families who depend on this. Well, my kids are young adults now, so it's not as hard as it once was. They're still my dependents, so I'm not doing all the myriad little, like, how to figure out birthday party presents and field trip money and all that. But what is also different is because I've been there for a long enough time, and with small incremental pay increases, I'm now on the other side of $15 an hour, and I can speak to what the difference is. And there isn't anything particularly magical about that exact number. It still takes a lot of really careful planning. You mostly go to a thrift store when you need things, you forego an awful lot. But it is the difference between standing there in the health and beauty aid section and wondering whether you should buy the toothpaste or the laundry soap, or actually being able to purchase both of those essentials when you need them. And it means if you're super careful, you can mostly get your monthly bills paid without getting too far behind, instead of spending night after sleepless night trying to figure out how to rob Peter to pay Paul. You can even occasionally walk into shops on your main street and make a purchase, or God forbid, sit down and have a bite to eat. So I now have a dreaded car payment, which shouldn't always be hard to afford. I never had one of those before, but I never was eligible for financing before I passed a certain mark in wages. And so when my car died last summer, I don't know what I would have done. I didn't have enough money to buy even a clunker. So financing was essential, and I would not have had that had I not gotten passed a certain point. So the last thing that I wanted to say is just acknowledge that I did benefit from programs like Three Squares and Home Heating Assistance while I was eligible, and I did appreciate those. And as long as people are able to still get that childcare so that they can get to work, I just want to say that I was also really happy not to need those things anymore. People would mostly rather, you know, their work pay for their life. And, you know, raising them in a wage is only one tiny piece of the puzzle to make things better for working families, but it's an important one, and I think it needs to happen. My name is Michelle Cadet. I'm an immigrant from Canada. And I'm a professor of statistics and teaching stats since 1975. Here are some statistics. We have an average weekly wage in Vermont of $788, the 13th lowest in the United States. The cost of living in Vermont is among the very highest in all of the United States. Now we move to some moral issues. It is unconscionable to allow people to be trying to earn a living and not have enough for food and medicine for having no possibility of saving extra money for unexpected conditions. This is outrageous. I have a document which I will submit to the committee, which is a scholarly report on international comparisons of metrics of human well-being versus minimum wages. The regression line is a nice straight-angled line. It's a 45-degree angle. The better the minimum wage, the higher the proportions of people in those countries who report that they are not wracked with worry for their children, worry about where they will get the next meal, worry about comparing the relative importance of what everybody else thinks of as necessities. So I brought the document and I want to finish within the nine seconds left by pointing out that proper wages help business compare Costco to Walmart. Thank you. Thank you. Sharon Moulton. And on deck, Greg Tatron. Hi, thank you. I would like to say that I'm from Wyndhamville, Vermont. I commute every day to Montpelier. I get up at 4.30 every day to find suitable work for a temporary position. I am a mom of two. In addition to that, the area that I come from, there's hardly any jobs, as you know. The Northeast Kingdom is hurting. In addition to that, I also work part-time on the weekends. Something needs to change. Thank you. Greg Tatron and on deck, Greg Tatron. I'm on the other side of the coin here, but that's a good thing. My fear is Amazon. If you take and increase the local businesses way of doing business, Amazon is just going to take over everything. They pay no tax, no payroll tax, no school tax, no real estate tax. And I just, you know, somehow we get a bail to compete with them. I don't like Amazon. I don't like what they're doing. And I think this will hurt our local business even more. We have a little company in Johnson. My brother-in-law owns Johnson Charming Garden. You know, I look at how's he going to compete against Amazon when he's got to pay all these taxes that you have to pay in Vermont. It's just going to handicap him even more. Some of the box stores, I think we forget sometimes. You know, I don't buy anything at Walmart, but you know, there is local people working in there too. And they maybe think it would be nice if they made more money, but you know, they are working and they're doing something, but if we handicap these box stores so much, they're going to be gone. They are leaving. You can see the empty storefronts now. My point is, there's local Vermonters working in those stores, so we need to be able to understand it's not just, you know, big boxes. There's normal people like us working in there. I have a small construction company that, I don't know how much this is going to affect us because we do quite a bit of, most of our people are close to those wages now. You know, we start guys out at $12 or $13, but once they get moving and they're good help, they get to $15 pretty quickly. So I do worry about New Hampshire and may not paying as much wage. I don't know. That competition is going to be hard for us to, it may get more difficult to get work. We have to bid on all our work, so that's something we have to think about. The other thing that concerns me is the older people that are on a fixed income already, how are they going to pay more for the goods and services? Because it's going to come down to that, and they're already tight against a wall too. So, thank you. Thanks. Kate Rose, Brenda Churchill, and then I'm Deb Kate Rose. Good evening. My name is Brenda Churchill. I'm from Bakersfield, Vermont, and I'm representing the LGBTQIA Alliance of Vermont. It was a good segue that he talked about minimum wage in other states. In 2016, the state of Maine passed a minimum wage law. Mainers today make $10 an hour, increasing to $12 an hour in 2020. Quality Maine, a statewide LGBTQIA Alliance organization, issued the following statement regarding the wages and the LGBT communities. The unfortunate reality is that biased attitudes and discrimination limit the economic opportunities available to many LGBT people as a result. Low wage jobs and limited access to high paying jobs contribute to disproportionate rates of poverty in our community. The impact is staggering. Recent studies have shown that LGBT couples raising children are twice as likely to live at the poverty line compared to non-LGBT parents. And transgender people are nearly four times as likely to have a household income under $10,000 per year compared to the population as a whole. While our work to combat the bias and discrimination that perpetuate these disparities is ongoing, raising the minimum wage would make an immediate and significant difference for members of our community who are struggling. The LGBTQIA Alliance of Vermont echoes the statements of the Quality Maine and views the passage of S40 as being the single most effective and direct step which Vermont can take in response to these pay inequities. Thank you very much. Kayla Rose in our deck, Elaine Steele. Hi, good evening. I'm Kayla Rose. I'm the Financial Futures Program Director with the Champlain Valley Office of Economic Opportunity. We're a community action agency that helps individuals with low and moderate incomes free of charge. And in the Financial Futures Program we help people to learn, earn, save and own. We do this through financial capability coaching and classes. We do this through asset development and match savings and we do this through a micro business development program. So essentially people are coming to us because they are concerned, they are stressed out, they have fears around money, not having enough money. And I want to share with you some of the statistics of the folks who walk through our doors. So as an agency as a whole last year we serve 22,000 people and in Financial Futures Program we worked with over 1,000. 61% of those that we're working with are employed full-time. Many of them working more than one full-time job and they're still stressed out about money. 58% are women. The average age is 40 years old. 51% have debt that is currently overdue. The average credit card debt is over $2,800. That's for somebody with a very low or moderate income. Every three years we do a community-wide assessment. We do partner surveys of other community agencies and we also do client surveys. What our community partners are saying are that people are concerned about the costs associated with housing, transportation and childcare. What our clients are saying is that they need more money. They need more money to pay their bills. That is their number one concern. That is what keeps them awake at night. If we were able to have $15 as the minimum wage tomorrow we know that would help the majority, the vast majority of our clients. If the only option is to slowly and incrementally increase it little by little by 2024 that will still help an awful lot of our clients. Just to share that a couple of weeks ago I was able to take advantage of the invitation that went out to participate in the minimum wage challenge. One of the things that I found out in going to many of the different services within our agency is that as a two minimum wage earner household with one child we were completely ineligible for most of our services through community action and through Head Start and that 50% of people using our food shelf were unemployed. What I heard is that people were ashamed to use the services that are there available to them right now. They walked in through the doors ashamed and we should be ashamed if we let this moment pass us by. Thank you. Elaine Steele, followed by Annie Wolland. Hi to the committee. Thank you so much for being here tonight and allowing us to speak. Could you manage your last name? Steele. Easier than it looks. My name is Elaine Steele. I'm 33 and I live in Northfield, Vermont. I moved to Central Vermont in July 2017 due to a job relocation for my spouse. I hold two Bachelor of Arts degrees, one in French and one in linguistics as well as a T-Saw certificate for teaching English to speakers of other languages. According to my current resume, I've worked six various full and part-time jobs in the past nine months since moving here. Of these six jobs, only two have provided a starting wage over the current state minimum of 10.50 and one offered a starting salary equating to an hourly wage over the proposed minimum of 15. I just wanted to offer a brief overview and I'll submit my written statement to go into more detail so I have some time to finish, but I wanted to offer a brief overview of mine and my spouse's basic monthly expenses so that you can see how impossible it is to live well here in Central Vermont, making $1,640. That's working 40 hours a week at the current minimum of 10.50 an hour. Pura and utilities, 1,300. Monthly food expenses, 500. Monthly transportation costs 1,000. Monthly health care expenses for two relatively healthy adults, 200. Monthly household expenses such as cleaning supplies, clothing, personal items, 200. This is not including the taxes that come out and we now have $80 remaining for the month. This 80 does not come even close to enabling us to pay down our student loans, save for a home or for retirement or even allow us to hope someday that we might be able to afford to bring children into our family. My spouse and I are actually working well over 80 an hour, 80 hours a week, yet making under 2,000 monthly combined. We're incredibly happy to be here in Central Vermont, but it may be years before we're able to purchase our own home or save for retirement. And I hope that the committee will please raise the wage. Hi, thank you. My name is Annie Wolland and I'm the lead organizer of a local initiative in Burlington called Burlington Sight for 15 based on the National Initiative. I'm here to testify on behalf of a constituent who is currently a server. She didn't want me to include her last name, but she did email me her testimony and is sorry that she can't be here tonight. Hello there. My name is Fallon. I am very sorry I am not able to attend this hearing tonight. I will propel my voice through the letter in meaningful ways on behalf of Burlington Sight for 15. I am here today because of my parents, my parents who have struggled and struggled to raise me and my sister. It was not because they had a lack of education or that they were in the military, away, disabled, or mentally ill. It was because minimum wage in Vermont is not even close to the livable wage for an average human. For the last 22 years of my life I have been learning how easy this world is not. I am currently a full-time mommy to a beautiful little girl named McKenna. She is my inspiration just as I was to my parents. I am in college part-time and I work two jobs. I also pick up other jobs on the side when time is obtainable. My parents split when I was about 8 years old. Since then things have never been the same. The stress my mom dealt with just to provide food and clothes for us was too much. I was so young and I knew what was going on. I knew she was tired, upset, stressed, and needed some serious help with money. She worked her butt off in college just to get a title for herself so she can make even more money for us and then when she got the degree she was still struggling. Between the rent of her car payment for the car of her college degrees and my sister and I along with our kitty I look back and I truly have no idea how she we got by with only a little bit of help. These are all normal average expenses and she could barely make that work. How is it that you cannot live efficiently on your own working a full-time job making minimum wage? The answer is that the minimum wage in Vermont is unlivable. The point of minimum wage is to have a minimum amount that people can make working full-time and survive off it. And I didn't say be wealthy and have all this extra money. I said just to survive. I see so many families struggle on a daily basis just to make ends meet because they want because what they make is not enough. It breaks my heart to see these innocent little kids with no shoes on and no coat because their parents couldn't afford it. And to go to an extreme level which is a very valid level think about the homeless shelter. I'll just skip forward very quickly. I know that time is of the essence. She had an incredible quote where she said everyone deserves a chance but if the chance isn't granted how are we supposed to try? And then very quickly in Vermont she talks about being a server. In Vermont the tips are not mandatory so therefore what you make in your check really counts at the end of the week sometimes. I've spent hours and hours contemplating how we can do so much work in so little time and make out with nothing. And she works two to three jobs currently one of them is a server and provides for her daughter. So thank you very much for having her testify on behalf of me. Thanks. Erlen Wright followed by Megan Dithender first. Erlen Tonion. I just wanted to share with you what my life was like roughly between the ages of well mid 30s, early 40s and it was like that for years before but I didn't remember it very well because I was drunk all the time. But after I sobered up I can remember the next seven years or so before I moved to Vermont that I was either unemployed but for the most part just underemployed. Remember all too well what it was like when a check didn't come which wasn't adequate anyway and you were sitting there wondering if the landlord was going to bang on your door and say where's my rent or the utility bill would come in and you couldn't pay it or could only pay part of it. You didn't have enough money left over to go buy good clothes to go interview for a better job and you lie awake at night as some of the other folks here have said and you can't sleep because you're so worried to describe what that does to your mental state, your spiritual state your quality of life is pretty much indescribable and nobody deserves to live like that and I must say that compared to people who have children and have to live like that my story is not that sad at all those people are my heroes and I don't see how they do it but for God's sake give people enough money to live on. Thank you. Thanks. I want to first start by thanking you all for taking the time to listen to our testimonies today I'm a transplant to Vermont from Ohio I came here to attend school at St. Michael's College and I loved the politics and the community and how much we all support each other enough here that I decided to stay and I've been a resident ever since so when I first entered the full-time workforce a few years ago I made choices based off what my family my mentors, a financial advisor told me would be the smart choices I took a job in the business field even though that's not entirely what I studied because it promised to give me professional growth there was the potential for a raise in my wages and that didn't end up being the case so I now work as a cashier I'm feeling like the skills I gained at school are pretty underutilized and I've made a lot of choices around money that were necessary I've chosen the lower loan repayments knowing that my interest is going to be growing over time because it is literally the only thing I can afford I rely on public transit and walking around Burlington because I can't afford car payments I haven't been back to Ohio in a few years to visit family because travel is so expensive and I can't afford to take time off of work so I continue to live with roommates past my school years because inevitably you can't afford a single room apartment in Vermont living on the wages that I make as a cashier and this is the reality of many people my age we live paycheck to paycheck we're working 40 hours a week we're volunteering so we can build up our resumes and get jobs that we love and care about and so many of my friends and I want to shop local we want to support Vermont businesses we love that culture but with our wages we're just totally unable to we can't live the truth that we want to and so when I envision my future I assume that I'm going to live with roommates until I have a family maybe while I have a family and I just want to end that in 1911 Ro Schneiderman declared the worker must have bread but she must have roses too so I ask us to truly think and listen to everyone testifying today are we really going to continue policy that denies our neighbors the ability to afford their bread let alone their roses thank you thanks me Gene Bergman followed by John Knight I'm Gene Bergman of the First Unitarian Universalist Society of Burlington I'm a former president of the society and a leader of our Economic Justice Task Force ours is a good sized congregation with some 500 adult members many more people associated with us as friends and supporters today at the First UU are guided by a fundamental principle shared by all Unitarian Universalists that all people have inherent worth and dignity this principle compels us to work for justice equity and compassion and human relations and I'm here with the support of our National Association the UUA which sees raising the minimum wage to a living wage as a moral imperative the UUA supports the fight for 15 and I'm here to tell you that by passing S40 Vermont will join the growing number of states and cities who understand that economic inequality is a cancer and raising the minimum wage is essential to the cure the First UU has put our money where our values are three years ago we raised all of our staff to a livable wage level set by the joint fiscal office this was not easy for us since financially we are a small organization dependent on members and friends to make our budget we have a decent sized staff to tend to our members fulfill our obligations to the community and keep that iconic building at the head of church treating good repair we made this choice because it is the right thing to do the public assets institute reminds us that inequality has been rising since the late 1970s the last 30 years has seen typical Vermont households barely inch up while the share going to the top 1% has doubled Vermont is a low wage state in 2016 Vermont lowest paid workers made just 500 bucks more than what they did in 2006 we're talking about real people here it reminds me of when I worked at a skilled job for 10 years at a profitable company I was making just 9 bucks an hour and when we organized and we're bargaining management said to us what does what we make have to do with what we pay you we pay you only what the market says we have to Samantha of St. Johnsbury told me that she's had to work four jobs at once exhausting her to the point that nothing got done around the house or her family the stress caused long-term harm a member of the first you you told me she's worked for years without her wages rising while rents doubled it was her experience that if you don't raise the minimum wage if you don't raise the minimum wage employers rarely give wages give raises I will just cut to the end and give you my prepared marks and I have two other people that I have support of statements of the point is that we depend on you our representatives to protect us from an anything-goes economy like we had in the 1890s the great middle class of this country was built by representatives like you who passed child labor laws, overtime protections social security and the rest of the social safety net including the minimum wage the stagnation of wages for 30 years shows us that the system is broken passing S40 is one of the tools you have to fix it you know we say in Vermont if it ain't broke don't fix it well it's broke and it's well past time for you to fix it thank you please pass S40 thank you Jean John McCoy followed by Karen Casey South Burlington I just want to say that I have tremendous respect for all of you and I'm not going to pretend to tell you how to do your job and I don't suspect I'm going to teach you anything here today but I'm going to share you a personal story if I can get to it okay I live in South Burlington I have lived all of my 53 years in Vermont I once worked for a company in Colchester as a machinist for 15 years I was making $17.50 an hour I got laid off along with 19 others I had to look for another job everywhere I looked nearly every employer offered $12 an hour I finally took a job for 13 bucks an hour I had to cash in my 401K to help my wife pay for our condo I keep a roof over our head 401K money that I put in a bank was going down every week due to my low wage my wife and I couldn't even go out to dinner my boss allowed me to work more hours to stay afloat I have since received many raises and now I'm making $20 an hour I take my wife out to dinner at locally owned restaurants or servers, cooks, bartenders owners, benefit from my higher wage and in the summer we go to Lake Monsters Games while we're there we buy Mackenzie hot dogs and Long Trail beer and again the ticket booth operators vendor booth attendants, groundskeepers announcers, bus drivers all benefit from my higher wage so I think you can see how the raise in my wage benefits many others I have to believe that raising others' wages would have the same effect Thanks Thank you Karen Casey I'm Karen Casey, I work for the Vermont Network Against Domestic and Sexual Violence Thanks for the opportunity to talk with you today The Vermont Network supports S40 The network is committed to creating a world where all people thrive including the minimum wage to $15 an hour would benefit tens of thousands of low wage workers improve the health of our families and communities and help create that world here in Vermont Statistics show that 99% of those experiencing domestic violence also experience financial abuse and poverty is among the root causes of sexual violence We know that for survivors of domestic and sexual violence the economic effects are pervasive and long lasting We also know that the effects are especially impactful for women This is compounded by the fact that women are at an economic disadvantage in our country and in our state Nearly 45% of all Vermont women earn under $15 an hour Of Vermonters earning less than $12.50 an hour 55% are women And the poverty rate for families headed by single women is over 37% What this means in reality is that the fear of falling into poverty and or homelessness keeps victims in abusive relationships and unsafe situations Economic instability is often a great barrier to survivors' healing Policy initiatives that strengthen financial stability for women and other marginalized people are key factors in creating economic independence for survivors This includes raising the minimum wage while also mitigating any negative impacts that may arise from the benefits cliff Survivors that rely on childcare financial assistance and other benefits should not experience a significant decrease in those benefits that are vital as a result of the increase in their wage So that's why we also support the section in S40 that addresses this issue Our legislature has the power to make real positive changes in the lives of the most vulnerable in our state and raising the minimum wage is a concrete and effective way to do just that and so I urge you to vote in support of S40 Thank you Before I start, I just want to say that a little over three weeks ago I suffered the loss of one of the children in our family and I am not 100% sure I can get through this without crying and it's not about this but it's really important for me to be here and that is why I'm here and it might take me a little longer than two minutes My name is Brenda Siegel, I live in Newfane, Vermont I'm the executive and artistic director of the Southern Vermont Dance Festival in the Brattleboro area which is designed as a long-term economic driver for the area as a response to Tropical Storm Irene in which my son and I lost all of our belongings I also run a pre-professional training program for modern dancers teach political classes at Compass School and subcontract at Mount Snow I am also the recipient of food stamps, section 8 housing fuel assistance and Medicaid I want to urge you to vote to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour This needs to be the case tomorrow but a bill that raises it by 2024 will also help I want to begin by encouraging us all to see Vermont where all of our friends, neighbors and family members have what they need I want you to envision a Vermont where our businesses are patronized and our economy thrives This can only happen if we choose to create the policy that lifts all of us up It is not possible in a state where our citizens can't afford their basic needs The impacts of poverty trickle up as opposed to the benefits of wealth trickling down Sorry Those impacts now affect our businesses our schools and our overall state A $15 an hour minimum wage would allow Vermonters, like myself to have stronger purchasing power help build up our small businesses reduce our burden on taxpayers and ultimately put an estimated $240 million directly into Vermonters' pockets I grew up in an upper middle class family I know the difference between the opportunities that my son has versus the ones I had I see the difference between my own responsibilities versus that of a family who is not struggling to make ends meet In my own family in our lowest financial moments we have had to cut corners on necessary household items I have skipped meals so that my son could eat a healthy meal or even so that I could free up enough money to buy my son some shoes when his head holds in them These are just some examples of the sacrifices I have made and what is important to note is that my struggle does not come close to that of some of our fellow Vermonters face every day We have to ask ourselves is this the Vermont we want to live in? I think we can do better Some have said that we shouldn't raise the wage because of the benefits cliff issue However, this cliff is a problem today and keeping a sublivable wage does not protect those of us who receive benefits It just prevents us from having a way out I believe that it is with the best of intentions that people are afraid to raise the wage out of fear that people like me will lose our benefits But I am here to tell you that while that problem is very real it is real now, today and was real when the wage was lower as well It is a separate issue that certainly intersects with wage increase and does not prevent any legislators from voting yes as these bills come before you In fact, the increase in local spending caused by higher minimum wage along with a stronger tax base will give you flexibility to address issues just like these We should be fixing the problems of the benefits cliff by properly funding our benefits programs so people like me are not held back from taking raises, promotions, or more hours and we should bring the minimum wage up to a livable wage We can and must do both I want to see a Vermont where our economy thrives I want to see a Vermont where those at the top contribute their fair share and those at the bottom are empowered to participate in our economy in a way that they currently are not able Our state has the power to continue to be a national leader in the movement for economic justice and fairness while building a stronger economy Today I'm here as a low-income vermoner and a business owner to say yes to raising the wage to $15 an hour as soon as possible Thank you for your leadership in this very important issue Good evening, I'll try to be brief I don't have prepared remarks I do want to second the terms I've heard of the injustice and the indignity that we're the problem I have with this bill I signed up on the opposed side because pushing this bill through the governor as much as said in today's press conference that he will veto it The governor is also vulnerable this year because of the gun legislation et cetera I think that by pushing this bill the 15 wage out six years is an injustice to vermoners I noticed that the automatic raises that went into effect for secretaries and commissioners from 100 to 150,000 to 154 104 to 154,000 those weren't questioned those people are not following through doing their jobs adhering to their statutory planning requirements and yet nobody wants to hold them accountable if the fear is that we're going to chase these business owners are going to fold up shop because we raise the wage close to a livable wage I would just assume see those employers leave those are not the people who are going to make Vermont prosperous and attract the new young people here to strengthen this economy so in a nutshell I have a lot more to offer but not in a two-minute slot thank you I'm really going to put you this one um, Teddy that's it that's enough please come um and um and following Teddy um Amy hello thank you very much for having this hearing my name is Teddy Wazizak I live in Barrie City and I work on the Vermont Raise the Wage Coalition before I delve into this I just want to add that um as someone who's been paying my own bills since I was 15 years old um, the student and team exemption that currently exists is immoral and there are a lot of there are over a thousand homeless students in Vermont that need to make a livable wage just as much as any one over the age of 18 I want to respond to two specific pieces of evidence that were put before the committee this week the first is the Seattle the infamous Seattle report which was called by the Washington Post a crushing blow to liberals that is not the case I'd like to cite um, Aaron Duby I believe is how it's pronounced wrote a report in 2016 out of UMass and Hearst um, from 1979 to 2016 there have been 137 increases aggregate nationwide for the minimum wage of if you take all the money that those increases are worth and count that as 100% each individual worker according to Aaron Duby UMass has earned 7% of that money the rest has gone to the top 1% ish I want to that study was a direct response to the Seattle report it argued that the Seattle report focused on the sum the total amount of jobs gained versus the total amount of jobs lost when Duby went further into that report and looked at specific women of color, people of color teens they found that the total amount of jobs created over $15 an hour is approximately equal to the amount of lower level, lower wage jobs that were lost meaning the people who are working 2 or 3 lower wage jobs can now just work one high wage job at a livable wage so that is Duby's argument against the Seattle report and I concur Franklin Roosevelt proposed the minimum wage in 1934 and he said conditions that do not meet rudimentary standards of decency should be regarded as contraband he was referring to businesses whose business model forces their workers to work below a standard of decency he called that business model contraband and I agree, thank you very much thank you Amy thanks I'm Amy Heifer and I'm from Stratford, Vermont and I'm a dairy farmer and from the looks of it there's not a lot of us here probably because this is during the chore time I'm here, I hope you understand that everybody understands here that you're talking about a minimum wage this is a wage for people just walking in the door I have a creamery and a dairy farm employ six people in the creamery and four on the farm side and the mine are not minimum wage jobs there's a lot that goes into what a person is expected to do but my base wage is $15 an hour because in the upper valley it's a pretty tight, there's very low unemployment and that's what we need to pay to attract workers who can do it if you're going to pay that to somebody who's just going to show up and you know, work at a job that's much less demanding then that puts me at a severe disadvantage the only advantage I have I guess is I'm close to New Hampshire and the $15 an hour looks good to people who live there so when you're talking about $15 as a minimum wage you all represent there's a big difference between Albany and Heartland and South Burlington and Winooski in terms of what real estate values are and food and expenses so a sweeping gesture although it sounds like it would be great for the Northeast Kingdom and lower economic things is also going to hit them pretty hard when you talk about if you can't pay this and pay your workers fairly then you should get up and leave you're talking about Vermont dairy farms the state lost 13 dairy farms since January 1st and that's not just the little guys who are maybe on the edge anyway and are going to retire that's 1,000 cow farms went to liquidation and if you say there's going to be an agricultural exemption then that's meaningless why would anyone work on a dairy farm like Donald's and go home at the end of the night and not be bone tired so I assume everybody here eat this morning and probably has some milk in the refrigerator and maybe some cheese so you need to think about whether you're willing to pay 40% more 30% more in your food budgets and if you're really committed to this you should be doing that already thank you I'm falling down in the job okay Kayla Kirkland followed by Jill Sharminen I've never done milk before so I had low wage jobs I worked at a drug store when I was 16 and back then that was perfect my 9 plus dollar an hour wage did nothing other than provide me with spending money I worked at Blockbuster and I've had a few gigs here and there but the only thing I'm really experienced at is childcare and my family with that I have had to settle for freelance babysitting and informal manning jobs there are a lot of ways the instability of low wages affect myself and my family the most obvious being I still live with them it's not easy to see my parents struggle watching my father get laid off from the granite shed after years of hard work and then wind up in several jobs that pay him less per hour in high school is something no one deserves my mother works in HR and could retire but can't afford to and all these experiences are not unique it's happening everywhere and it's no mystery why we see people losing faith in the principle of hard work the best example of how difficult it got working for just under $11 an hour was my experience as a shift manager at Blockbuster and like many large companies these days the low level employees were treated like dogs and constantly had to face unrealistic sales goals having to solve crisis after crisis caused by being perpetually understaffed and often asked not to punch in some of our hours because no one but the store manager was allowed to have a full time position I could work 34 hours and 45 minutes but if I got to 35 I had to give me full time benefits I was often working an 8 to 4 hour 8 to 4 week day shift by myself since there was no one to take over I was not allowed to take any of the breaks I was entitled to and I've had plenty of bad experiences with low paying jobs where you feel taken advantage of without the hope of your work paying off but nothing was as bad as being harassed by a dying company who treated people I never might ask it I'm sorry there's no way to truly understand what it's like to be stuck in a system of perpetual impoverishment until you see it first hand it's easy to look down on the poor sometimes especially with politicians you mostly deal with politically active people and it's fair to ask how often you consider Vermonters who don't have the time or resources to participate in politics because just to pay attention these days is a luxury I'm sure you all do your best listening to calls and comments from Vermonters and they thoughtful choices based on what you hear about the problems getting worse and doing nothing is a political statement if with a livable wage I would be able to save I would be able to use the extra financial freedom to travel and find the help and resources for myself because the professionals I need are often far away instead of being so hindered by the sensory and communication issues I deal with autism staying on stable and in sufficient employment opportunities is sadly typical for adults on the spectrum and if I had the money I'd seek help so I can build the skills and strategies I need to be independent this might not be a relatable answer but if I have steady income I would want to invest in possibly overcoming the things that hold me back while I still can thanks Jill Charvenot Jill Charvenot president Vermont State Labor Council AFL-CIO I live in Middlebury, Vermont we gather here to testify to support raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour on the heels of the 50th anniversary of Martin Luther King Jr.'s assassination the famous I am a man called for social justice was coined during a sanitation strike by black workers they were asking for dignified pay and benefits the labor movement exposes poverty wages and demands jobs becoming livable wage jobs for union and non-union workers we support creating skills systems that enhance careers develop policy strategies to ensure automation enhances human work economic gains from automation are shared broadly employers benefit from workers an employee ought to be able to afford the basic standards of living working full-time when a worker cannot support themselves or their families on a minimal wage there is something askew in the economy today many parents work multiple jobs there aren't enough hours in a day to support a family feed them put a roof over their heads afford healthcare save for college retirement Vermont needs workers we hear there's a shortage of qualified workers we also hear that raising the wage will create a loss of low paying jobs the training pool of Vermont workers is a viable training the pool of Vermont workers is a viable solution we strongly support raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour while we work on a livable wage thank you my name is my name is but I've always been called by my middle name Jubilee I live in Bridport with my husband and three children and work as a property manager for the Addison County Community Trust which is a nonprofit affordable housing provider so I work every day with people whose lives will be directly affected by having their pay increased to a livable wage I also have my own experience with earning low wages and extreme challenges that come with it six years ago my husband and I found out that we were expecting twins I had several medical complications from the start so I was unable to continue working to make up for the loss of income my husband began to work six days a week quite regularly and his eight hour days often stretched into nine or ten hours it was impossible to build up any sort of savings so the day after we came home from the hospital my husband returned to work we could only afford for him to miss three days of work for the birth of our children I was catapulted into a new life with our older daughter and our two helpless infants I was largely alone while my husband continued working long hours the baby blues soon took a darker and deeper tone I became so entrenched in guilt exhaustion, sadness and loneliness that it consumed me I developed postpartum depression and anxiety I lost so much of myself that I became convinced that my husband and children would be better off without me and I even planned for how I would end my life the anxiety caused such an extreme fear of sudden infant death syndrome so I held off for the time being knowing in my absence that no one would set alarms to wake up every 15 to 20 minutes to make sure that they were still breathing thankfully before my plan came to pass my husband got a new job with a better wage, a livable wage he was able to return to a 40 hour work week and spend more time at home he was no longer the stranger who left before they woke up and returned after they went to bed he was finally given the opportunity to engage and fully bond with his children laughter and joy returned to our home working so hard to just barely meet your basic needs caused an extreme amount of stress there are no good outcomes when one endures this type of stress long term it can cause complete mental anguish some are tempted to commit crimes to survive, others seek solace or refuge even if only fleeting in life destroying substances it takes a remarkable toll on the body as well memory problems, heart disease it literally changes your brain structure and can cause permanent damage and a reduced ability to connect with one's world it's a narrative in our society that we need to pull ourselves up by our own bootstraps but I can tell you it is impossible to enact positive change in your life unless you have hope and now we have an amazing opportunity to give hope to over 70,000 of our most vulnerable citizens to help them break the chains that have bound far too many generations of hermoners to poverty thank you for taking the time to address this issue I can do this right and for having the courage to stand up for legislation like this is my hope and the hope of many vermoners just like me that we can help bring Vermont's minimum wage to a livable wage thank you is Michelle Fay here? yes I'm Michelle Fay with Voices for Vermont's Children but tonight I am serving as the voice of a woman from Addison County who would like to remain anonymous as a lawyer I've been a contributing tax payer since reaching age 18 in 2012 while I was pursuing my undergraduate education I worked part-time for $7.25 per hour doing everything from staffing my schools dining halls to tutoring peers in my major courses of study I even worked at $7.25 per hour in my university's writing center helping my peers to draft and edit their papers work that private educational groups would charge upwards of $30 per hour graduating I worked exclusively with nonprofits and currently earn in the low teens I struggle to make ends meet I work three jobs and volunteer with two other groups who barter for my services it's only thanks to the community in Vermont that I have warm clothes this winter food to eat each day and transportation to and from my jobs although I have known medical conditions I do not carry health insurance due to financial barriers I know that because I'm only 23 you might argue that all I have to do is to climb the ladder to reach a more sustainable income after all I have a bachelor's degree and I work full-time according to the society we live in I've done everything right yet many of my co-workers have master's degrees and have been in their roles for 5 or even 10 years and they make at or slightly above the hourly wage I do the anecdotes shared tonight and numerous studies show would given the choice unregulated businesses will always choose to pay their employees less my situation may be different than the ones I've made the decision to jump over the benefits cliff this means that I make too much to qualify for Medicaid the gross income per year cut off is $16,500 I can't work full-time even at minimum wage and afford to receive the medical care I need I don't qualify for food stamps heating assistance or any of the other patchwork programs this legislature has put in place to help low income people it seems ridiculous that I've had to make the choice between working harder and staying healthy, fed and warm that's why it's crucial that when you do raise the minimum wage you also raise the cut off that sends people over the benefits cliff if I made a living wage my life would be different there would be small changes I would sleep on a bed not the floor I would eat three meals a day not one and a half there would be big changes too I would carry health insurance and monitor the imbalances in my endocrine system that affect my mood, weight and even my fertility it's impossible to pull yourself up buy your bootstraps if you can't afford the boots to support your existing constituents and attract young, educated and employed people to this state, give them the tools to buy the boots, they will come thank you my name is Christina Paznick I'm a licensed clinical social worker and I work in schools in Burlington I'm also the secretary of the Vermont chapter of the National Association of Social Workers I'm here to share that NASW Vermont supports an increase in the minimum wage from $15 per hour I work by 2022 but really it should be tomorrow social workers know that the best way to help individuals that seek our services is not to solve their problems for them but to empower them to be able to reach their own goals what could be more empowering than being able to work hard and bring home enough money to provide to your family we see the effects that stagnantly with an ever increasing cost of living over the state poverty is undeniably linked to nearly every complex societal issue that we confront daily from mental health and physical health to homelessness, substance abuse, domestic violence child abuse and neglect and yes even the hotly debated gun violence issues if we can directly address the issue of poverty in our state by increasing the minimum wage we can more firmly address all of these other complex problems but more plainly, if we tackle poverty and other social problems at the same time research tells us that poverty is one of the biggest risk factors for children implicating an increased likelihood of cognitive and behavioral challenges and delays we know that kids from low income backgrounds are less likely to be successful in school and more likely to have health problems as they grow we have an opportunity right now to do something about this problem to stop poverty from developing the lives of children the way that it has for their parents we can give kids a more grounded in this world just by giving their parents a bit of a financial break please pass this bill to increase the minimum wage and give Vermont kids a chance to stop being statistics about poverty and failure to start living the better lives that they deserve thank you thanks Agent Souter followed by Paul Schran I'm going to pass Paul Schran Good evening, my name is Nathan Souter I live in Montpelier and I serve on the board of the Peace and Justice Center in Burlington serving the state and the people of the state first for me when we last engaged this topic in 2014 state leaders condemned minimum wage earning working Vermonters to a wage of $10.50 an hour it made those workers wait four years to reach this level we know that that experiment resulted in poverty for 25,000 working Vermonters let's try a new experiment one that honors workers and invests in living wages self-sufficiency and dignity we must not turn our backs on working Vermonters I know and respect many Vermont business owners I know them to be resourceful and compassionate I believe that together we can lift Vermonters out of poverty now in the voice of Matthew LaFleur from Alberg Grand All County I'm here today in support of raising the minimum wage in Vermont to $15 an hour Phil Scott has said publicly that he will veto this legislation the governor says he wants a stronger economy and yet is against legislation that would do just that we all want to build a vibrant local economy help people to provide for themselves and attract young people to our state raising the wage will allow us to do just that I've experienced working poverty wages myself at several jobs both as a fast food worker and as an early childhood educator I've worked in McDonald's in Walmart for years for long hours and for low pay a large corporation that could afford to pay all of its workers a livable wage I've also worked at the Green Mountain Children's Center in Essex Junction the owners are great people who put their community first however, like most childcare centers they pay a minimum wage making the minimum wage is embarrassing and I am struggling I struggle to cover my bills in rent each month not knowing if I can make it through the month with enough money to buy food is very troubling I personally have been underpaid because of this we have to protect people with disabilities like everyone we want to live independently and with dignity people working full time should be able to pay their rent their heating bills and buy food people need a livable wage to support themselves and not have to work two to three jobs though working for monitors need a $15 an hour wage now I find the six year term to be a reasonable way forward to pass this bill the increases each year will allow even small workers to plan and adjust for the yearly incremental increases we know there are a lot of concerns about the business side of this issue I urge you to see the human side of this issue things are not all great in the Vermont workforce my experience and the experiences of thousands of others making low wages in our state needs to be addressed Vermont can lead the way in showing compassion to its workers we are, after all, Vermont strong thank you so that gets us through a list of people who had signed up and I'm going to do something that's maybe a little risky here but are there people who came after we closed off the testifying list who would like to speak if you could raise your hands anyone and to please come forward I recognize a couple of things I want to acknowledge members of the Legislature who have come to me Representative Connor is here Representative Christiansen and Representative Tolino who am I missing Representative Luch Representative Rwinsky was here Representative Donovan and Ansel was here I yeah so thank you Legislature in there I also recognize people in the room who have testified earlier who care enough about the situation to come back and I appreciate that hi there thank you so much for being here tonight I know how busy all of you are very nice of you to take this evening thank you so much yeah alright good evening my name is Eva Krukowski I'm speaking tonight as a college student from Bennington College originally I'm from San Francisco California but I've chosen to come to college here in Bennington like many Californians this is a very nice place I recognize many of your faces from earlier this winter because I worked as a legislative intern with Senator Ryan Campion for January and February and I actually focused my work on this bill while I was here and so I'm very happy to come back to get a chance to testify on it the bill S40 a bill to raise the minimum wage came out of senate economic development and general affairs Senator Michael Sorokin the chair of this committee truly did his work and this bill can make it all the way through there was a study group complete with senior economists like Tom Kovett and Joyce Manchester and support from legislative council by Damien Leonhard among many other people I interviewed senior economist Tom Kovett and asked him about the pros and cons of this bill and I was very happy to hear that he is in support of this bill I'd like to represent the majority of the students from Bennington College who are in a minimum wage from our federal work study positions Bennington College is unfortunately located far away from Main Street in downtown Bennington which means that it's not easy for us to get downtown and the high prices of local businesses make it even harder for us to shop there the main places that students shop to buy groceries and books and everything is Walmart Shopper and Hanifers those are also the closest stores to our college unfortunately it's harder for us to shop at farmers markets the local bookstores everything even though students want to have that Vermont experience and fall in love with the state and shop in those places we don't have that opportunity or you have to make an effort to have that opportunity I'm in support of this bill because hiring the minimum wage to a living wage will bring more shoppers more student shoppers to these local businesses and get a chance to buy their products and actually envision ourselves being the shop owners someday as everyone knows we have an aging workforce in Vermont so the people that you should be encouraging to stay in this state is me and my classmates Vermont has so many colleges and yet many of the students that go to our colleges leave the state to find jobs that will pay them more it's really easy for me to go home to San Francisco after I graduate I can easily earn a $15 minimum wage back in San Francisco please help me stay here please help me become a living working person here in Vermont and as it is right now it's not possible for me to do that because I earn my spending money from a minimum wage position on campus contrary to popular belief I do think that this bill will support small businesses in the long run and I am the target demographic that Governor Spill Scott wants to stay in this state so please help me make this a reality an economic reality for me and vote yes on S40 thank you Steve May thank you Madam Chair thank you for the opportunity to speak on this minimum wage bill you are considering my name is Steve May I'm from Richmond I'm also a clinical social worker I'm here because I enthusiastically support the bill for a variety of reasons as you're aware the unemployment rate in Vermont has hovered around 3% for many months now the Federal Reserve considers anything below 3.5% to be full employment wage suppression is hurting our economy while we have become enamored with the moonlighting in Vermont ethic of hard working Vermonters our current economy has moved well beyond this reality people have gone from industrious to desperate two jobs doesn't sustain a family anymore and everyone seems to have a side hustle or is working two, three extra shifts something is fundamentally wrong downward pressure on wages in one part of the economy creates the circumstances which promote large scale flight of human capital workers will abandon Vermont if wages are not competitive our economy is global it's not the workers in New Hampshire you have to worry about it's the ones in New Delhi that may mean paying a market rate for labor metropolitan areas like Boston and Washington Seattle San Francisco paid workers doing the same thing, the same work Vermont workers do at a considerably higher rate we seem to be helping on treating workers as a stranded cost while they treat labor at worst an asset should be thought of as in that context many in this building spend a considerable amount of time thinking about the next generation of Vermont workers where they are going to come from and where they're going to go nothing is more certain to short circuit efforts to bring workers here or keep them here than the low wage reality that awaits them if we don't act to support this bill as we sit today a $15 minimum wage is reality in Quebec and is being considered in New York and Massachusetts similar bills are being heard around the country Vermont has led in the past but in this case Vermont will have plenty of company as this bill moves from golden dome in Sacramento across the country to Annapolis the ramifications of increasing the minimum wage will ripple across our economy most importantly it should create some pressure on middle income wages which is in desperate need of growth for all of the reasons stated I encourage all of you to support this measure thank you anyone else this has been incredibly impressive I think we've covered the state we've had people from Bennington, Brownboro the Northeast Kingdom Northwestern Vermont, Central Vermont I know many of you worked today before coming here and maybe working tonight and you've had impressive stories to share very much appreciate you coming out and sharing them with us we promise to do our best for this bill and wish you a safe journey thank you


فشرف بالشتغالي بالعلم ولا تبغي به ما عشت يا دا دا دا لا وياله من شراف عظيمي الحمد لله رب العالمين له الحمد الحسن هو الثناء الجميل وأشد أن لا إله إلا الله وحده لا شريك له يقول الحق وهو يهد السبيل وشدوا أن نسينا ونبينا محمد صلى الله عليه وعلى آله وأصحابه والتابعين لهم بإحسان إلى يوم الدين أما بعد وإن شرح هذا كتاب النسهة النظر في توضيح نقبة الفكر في مصطلح أهل الأثر رتبع الإمام حافر ابن حجر العسقلاني رحمه الله نتحدث about the statement of the author وهي يقول في جميع عافة للتردد في النقيل حيث تفردوا وإلا في بأتبالي سناديني ما نكتبه هو حافر ابن حجر نفعل ما صحيح يعني ونتحدث عن التخلين فلنسألوا عن حسن ولي داتي so we talked about the two types of saheeh و كنا نخبرنا about the difference that they are ثم قلت لنا أننا لدينا أشياء هنا و لذلك لدينا أسكولة بمعلمة ترميدي الذي أخذت هذه الثلاثات التي تفعيلنا و أنه أهلتها و أهلتها لكي أصدقائها لذا كنا نرى أحد حديث يقول هذا حديث هو حسن و صحيح لذا نحن now in a position of higher confusion لماذا؟ لأننا نقل أن حسن يعني شيئا و لذلك سحيح يعني شيئا كيف يمكنه أن يخبرهم بأي آثار و كيف يمكنه أن يخبرهم بأي آثار هناك شخصين مختلفة و يخبرونها لحد حديث أعظم الثلاثة إحاول أن أخبرها في كتابها و أنه يقول لهم دلاثة و أنه أول هو إذا كان هديت only one chain then فليد ترددي في النقل إذا كان هديت only one chain then ترميدي is in a state of confusion لن يكون لديه فرصة لكي يجب أن يعطيه احد من الواقع انه لا يستطيع ان يقول انه صحيح أو لا يستطيع ان يقول حسن لذا ترميدي هو في حالة الله تردد انه يقول انه افتحديت لديه احد سنة جيد لكنه سن وإلا افتحديت لديه احد سنة فبير اتباري اسناديني فأصحم رحلني انه Now Tiri is trying to say one سنة or one narration is حسن and the other narration is ما صحيح That's the explanation And that's the final conclusion given by Hafeb Ibn Hajar العسقلاني وعحمه الله That's his response last lesson I said that the statement of Hafeb Ibn Hajar لا يشفين منعلتين ولا يروي من Woolة The statement of Hafidr of Nader does not really answer this issue. And as he himself in Nader has tried to criticize those previous scholars that came before him who tried to answer that statement of Tillmi Li Hassan and Saikh. And he, Tillmi Nader, he refuted everyone else's argument. If you look at his Nuzhat Nader, he proves their understanding to be wrong. And this is what he came with Tillmi Li Hassan. His one now is also under the question. And it's not sufficing for the following reasons. Let's take each answer that he gave. Let's look at the first answer, which is if the hadith only has one Senate. Or if the hadith has been narrated through one chain. Then Tillmi Li is in a state of what? But Tillmi Li is talking about. There's a narrator in there who some scholars have what? Have given him the what? His precision. Remember we said the Hassan and the Saikh, we said what's the difference? It's only the precision, it's the love. It's the memory, right? So he's saying Tillmi Li is here. Are we all together? That's the first answer I had to give. Tillmi Li is in a state of confusion. If the hadith comes in one chain. Then there's an individual in that hadith whose precision, his memory. Some scholars are saying it's a level of Saikh. Some scholars are saying his memory is not to that level. If the memory is not to the highest level, are we all together? Then he becomes what? Hassan, it becomes Hassan. And if it's to the top, what does it become? Saikh, that's the only difference between Hassan and Saikh. Remember we said that, right? So Tillmi Li when he's saying, so this hadith is only one chain. Tillmi Li's saying that this person's memory is where the Khilaf is coming. Some scholars are saying that his memory is in it. So Tillmi Li is in a state of what? He can't. Now we're going to show that that's incorrect for Ibn Hajar to think that. And these objections come forward regarding that concept of Imam Ibn Hajar. It is found after following Sunnah and Utilmi Li. If you follow up Sunnah and Utilmi Li. And you look at the answer that Ibn Hajar is given. You see that Tillmi Li actually uses Hassan and Saikh for a hadith which are متفق على صحاتها. Which are متفق على صحاتها. And it's authentication. That this hadith is right. It's unanimously agreed upon. And he's still using Hassan and Saikh in it. And you guys all know that a hadith. There are some a hadith that chains that it consists of a cold thewat. إراقص يزينيز ألفية. There are a hadith which we consider to be what. أصح الأسانيد. أصح الأسانيد means what. This chain is one of the most authentic chains there are out there. And from the chains that are considered to be أصح الأسانيد. They are considered to be one of the most authentic chain of narrations are. نافع عن ابن عمر. Sorry. مالك عن نافع عن ابن عمر. مالك عن نافع عن ابن عمر. Are we all together? That silent is called أصح الأسانيد. No one differs that this chain is authentic. No one disputes the authenticity of this. Is this disputing? Is it the most authentic chain or is it not? But they all, this is متفقون على صحاتها. Scholars unanimously agree upon that. Also one of the أسانيد that are متفقون على صحاتها. That this chain is the most authentic is unanimously agreed upon. But it is different. Is it the most authentic or is it not? Is Muhammad Ibn Shihab as Zuhri if he narrates from Salim. And Salim narrates from his father. This chain is also أصح الأسانيد. It's from the most authentic chains that are out there. Scholars do not differ that this is Salim. This is authentic. They only differ. Some are saying no. Are we all together? Some are saying what? مالك عن نافع عن ابن عمر. Are we all together? Are we all together? Are we all together? Are we all together? Are we all together? Some are saying what? مالك عن نافع عن ابن عمر is أصح الأسانيد. The most authentic chain. And others are like that. And others are saying others. There are many. Like in Iraq he doesn't like the idea of saying this. This Salim is he said إنساقنا we withhold. إنساقنا عن حكمنا على السند. We hold from this statement of saying that this chain is the most authentic. But he said إنساقنا عن حكمنا على السند بأنه أصحه مطلقا وقد خاضبه قومون. But a group of scholars they indulge into this. And each one started to give. بقاري has a view. Which one is the most authentic? أحمد رحم الله has a view of what is most authentic. And others. Are we all together? Are we all together? Are we all together? Are we all together? 10 different chains which are called أصحه الأسانيد. Are we all together? Some of you might ask yourself here What's the benefit of knowing that I had the chains which are the most authentic. What benefit do I gain from it? It's beneficial. Why is it beneficial? Because when it happens that there's a chain and this chain it opposes each other إن ترجحوا to benefit you and you want to strengthen one over the other. Are we all together? Strengthening one narration over the other. This would help you because this is unanimously agreed upon its authentication. Are we all together? And it's only beneficial when you're trying to strengthen between the narrations that are out there. Anyways, I'm getting sidetracked. Coming back again. So we found ترميدي يستخدمه a Hadith which is narrated by ملك عناف عالي بل عمر. He's saying ساليم العنبي و ساليم العنبي we find ترميدي using this for حسنة صحيح. Are we all together? Can this be translated from ترميدي? When this is authentic by the scholars they're not different on it. And a majority of it he uses حسنة صحيح for that. Rather a Hadith which it's found in بخارية المسلم. He still uses حسنة صحيح. So حافل الحجر is here. This is a problem. These are from the things that these are matters that come forward. These are from the things that come forward. The second thing that comes from it. ترميدي is ترميدي is a what. He's a scholar who has reached in علم الحديث he's a what. ترميدي is he has reached a level where he's going to strengthen opinions. How is he going to leave the majority of his book in the state of doubt? Can we read? ترميدي is a scholar who has reached He's not a مقلد. ترميدي would not blind follow some scholars have strengthened it some scholars have disputed it. ترميدي is another scholar who reached that level of ترميدي they don't look at what other scholars have said. They don't. They look at the evidence themselves. So here the question is is that it's as though حجر is stripping away from ترميدي this level that he has which is that is the Imam which is مجتهد so if he's a مجتهد ترميدي he's going to have to give his own personal independent reasoning regarding this particular حديث and he's not going to look at ترميدي ما عند النقات what other scholars have taken into consideration he would choose from within that he would choose from within that even then which is still the second point if ترميدي is trying to bring the خلاف in this issue because if he says that this حديث is صحيح and some are considering it to be حسن which is what محاجر is saying then why does he bring the خلاف in the حديث which he only say صحيح some of the حديث that he uses that he brings only صحيح some scholars have differed in his authentication as well why doesn't he bring also خلاف in that one why is he only bringing this خلاف in some of their generations are we together also the other question at that particular point is that if he's bringing حسن صحيح then why do we not ever find him bringing حسن ضعيفن why doesn't he also bring some scholars some are saying it's ضعيف so why is he only bringing the خلاف صحيح and حسن and why is he not bringing صحيح and ضعيف as well are we all together brothers these are matters that are coming to إبن حجر now responses are needed from him number 2 point number 3 so that's all of the خلاف that he bring that he say محاجر that's all falls under the second point number 3 what happens is that from the statement of إبن حجر is that إبن على إمامه وجلالته في هذا الفن إبن إمام in this particular field and how noble he is in his field لم يترجح عنده nothing has become clear to him in many of his places in his own book by bringing these two descriptions which is حسن and صحيح so tell me that he has no position in many of the hadith in his صحيح in his مصرن number 4 why has he not even once at least brought the term wow why didn't he say حسن و صحيح or why hasn't he said حسن oh صحيح which can shows تردد oh why not once has he not brought that why has he always left it like this that's also that's إشكالات that has come regarding the first answer he gave that if the hadith is one chain ترميلي is in a state of what ترميلي is in a state of talent the second point of the had book the second answer he gave which is that if the hadith is more than one if the hadith is more than one then he is talking about باعتبار إسمادين and then باعتبار إسمادين آخر when he says حسن حسن he means one chain is حسن and صحيح he means the other chain is the other chain is what صحيح that's the second answer that he gave right also يريد عليه أمراني two matters come forward I'm going to focus on these two points insha'Allah the first one is ترميلي's real definition of حسن are we all together ترميلي's definition of حسن and what he defines حسن is that the hadith has to be more than one chain أصلا the definition of ترميلي to be حسن is not the definition that we understand to be what حسن he's got his own definition of حسن for أمام الترميلي حسن has to be more than one chain rather ترميلي حديث is حسن when three things are combined in it or three characteristics are in it number one اللي يكون في إسنادي من يتهم بالتديلي number one is that it is not in the chain a person who is suspected of lying that's the first characteristic that is needed for the حديث to be حسن according to ترميلي اللي يكون في إسنادي من يتهم بالتديلي that there should not be in the chain of narrations anyone who is suspected to be a liar number two is و اللي يكون الحديث شادم and that the hadith should not also be opposing another حديث it can't be what it can't be shagging it can't be shagging and number three is و أن يروا مثلوا مثلوا ذلك الحديث أو نحبه من وجه خارفة صاعدا number three is that that this حديث this particular حديث a حديث like it has to be narrated from another chain with those three conditions أحديث الحسن to ترميلي are we all together so when إضحادر is saying that if the chain is more than two more than one then he's looking at one to be حسن and the other one to be صحيح أسلن حسن to him is what more than one أسلن it's actually what more than one so that's the point number one point number two is that based on ترميلي's definition of حسن based on the definition that أليمان و ترميلي brings forward it necessitates that the حديث in which ترميلي is describing to be حسن is itself not reached حسن because of itself in other words it's not حسن it reached حسن by what إنضم بعضون إلى بعضن other generations came together and so it pushed it together so it cannot have come the حسن but it being حسن is not حسن it didn't come from حسن it didn't come from حسن so now that we've shown that إم لحاجة الله is response is not what is not لا يُسمِل و لا يُغني من جُع لا يُسمِل و لا يُغني من جُع it's not a good response رحمة الله و رحمة و سعة إن حجر statement is not it's sufficing it doesn't suffice us so what do we do here we need an answer so last letter I asked if you guys research and found an answer I asked if you guys can go check out find out who's found out when we question إم لحاجة الله based on what he said first of all what I want you guys to understand is that I want you guys to really ponder on it is that you might find one or two a group of hadith which fall according to to the way of looking at it but that doesn't mean that's what it means because if it was then it would have gone through all of the book then you wouldn't find any discrepancy so we're talking about the overall the overall what observation of the whole book but I advise you all to ponder on this point as أليمام الشافعي و رحمة الله he said he refused to leave anything in perfection other than the Quran only person whose perfection is who the statement of Allah if everybody who spoke or everybody who wrote something their book was 100% are we all together then what value would the Quran hold the value in the Quran is that there's no book like it that there is no book like it nothing is like it the best in the Quran and every person who speaks their statement is not outside the discussion كائنا من كائن whoever they are صح whoever it may be however high he may be what he says is open to be looked at other than Allah his messenger everybody else is open for discussion and dialogue لذلك أليمامو مالك و دليسي كل يؤخد من قوله everybody's statement is either taken or it is what كل يؤخد من قوله و يرد every person's statement is either taken or it is what rejected and then he said except the man or the individual of this grave the prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم the only person whose statement is only taken no ifs no buts is who the messenger صلى الله عليه وسلم و لذلك أليمامو أليمامو ذهبي when he spoke about the biography of Ibn Utamya and ذهبي was amazed with what he saw from Ibn Utamya صح so he said any hadith any hadith that what that Ibn Utamya does not know is not a hadith any hadith that Ibn Utamya does not know is not a hadith يا إخوة إلا أنها الحقطة لله the only one who's actually encompassed everything who knows everything is Allah نعم الله تعالى قال was litus something might slip from him are we all together there's a place in مجموعة فتاوة once I was reading it Ibn Utamya is narrated a hadith he said he mentions a masdar he said I think it's a narrated book he mentions all the other places but he said I think it's narrated there I went and checked it now Allah are we all together that's it even when he thinks he's right are we all together and when we're 100% sure we're wrong sometimes but even then we say لله only Allah is the one and his messenger everybody else ابن حجر this field of hadith it's no one else's field it is this is his field of expertise I say this many times ابن خلدون said صحيح البخاري صحيح البخاري صحيح البخاري has established a proof against us when he combined this authentic book for us he has placed a debt on everybody's neck that they need to pay back and then صحاوي came and he said لو رأى ابن خلدون if ابن خلدون was to see ما صناع ابن حجر which ابن حجر has done لرأى أن دينة أوفي حق الوفا he would have realized that the debt has been paid on our behalf by who ابن حجر how has he paid it off for us by explaining it the explanation he has put on it has paid back بخارفه is that a light matter to say that بخارف has been paid back are we all together there is no book like it