and welcome back. I'm just going to assume you've all been here to the nonprofit show before, but if you haven't, we are so thrilled that you found your way to us. The nonprofit show has been going since March of 2020 and today we are thrilled to have with us Joey Goon. Joey is the president at Utopia Experience. Phenomenal story that he's going to share with us, but today the conversation that he's brought to us is the psychology of nonprofit events. And Joey, we talk a lot about events, but we don't often talk about the psychology. So I'm ready to nerd out with you on that. Julia Patrick, I have to say thank you for creating this beautiful, brilliant platform to allow us these high-level conversations. Julia's out today, but she's the CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy. And I am so very grateful to be the co-host. I'm Jarrett Ransom, your nonprofit nerd and CEO of the Raven Group. Day in and day out, we are so very honored to have the ongoing support, the investment, the trust, respect from these partners. So thank you to all of our friends at Bloomerang, American Nonprofit Academy, Fundraising Academy at National University, Nonprofit Thought Leader, your part-time controller, Staffing Boutique, Nonprofit Nerd, as well as Nonprofit Tech Talk. I'd like to remind all of you, myself included, to please check these companies out. They offer amazing services and I like to remind you that their mission is really your mission because they wanna help you do more good throughout your community. Hey, if you missed any of our previous episodes since March of 2020, that's okay friends, you are in luck because you can find them on all of these platforms, broadcast, podcast, latest and greatest as you can download that app on your smartphone. So check us out, binge watch, binge listen, however you like to consume that entertainment. There's a lot of wonderful information to share with you and Joey, thrilled to have you adding to this, I'm gonna say like plethora of content but Joey Goone, President at Utopia Experience, welcome. Thank you so much, it's great to be here. Yeah, I'm thrilled to have you. So yesterday we had Kevin Spikerman with Charity Buzz and we also have Barbara O'Reilly this week. So it's a little bit of a Nashville reunion because you and I met in Nashville for the RAISE conference and so glad to have met you there. I heard your origin story from your wife and your business partner would love for you to share a little bit about yourself Joey and a little bit about how Utopia Experience came about. Could you do that? I'd love to, yeah, so thank you again for that beautiful introduction and for providing us this platform today to have. What I hope is a very meaningful conversation for us and for those listening. So I am a husband, a father, we have a 10 month old baby, I'm a brother, I have a sibling that lives in California, my brother lives out there, my sister lives in Chicago and an entrepreneur, you had mentioned Utopia Experience. And so yes, this is our family business. We live in St. Louis, Missouri, our company's headquartered here, we have clients as far west as San Diego and as far east as New Jersey which is very exciting and everywhere in between which is super cool. And so Utopia was founded by my mom in 2001, she was a school teacher, a gym teacher at that and she realized that she wasn't the most athletic person in the world but she loved kids. So she moved from gym teaching to fourth grade and that's where she stayed but she saw this need in the community when she was planning and I don't know if anybody is familiar with Bar or Bat Mitzvahs but at the time she was planning my brother's Bar Mitzvah and did not have a very wonderful experience with the company that she hired to produce the event. And she was bringing them on to do the entertainment, the photography, the videography and she said, okay, I'm gonna... And so didn't have a wonderful experience with that company and so for my Bar Mitzvah which was two years later and if you're not familiar with Bar or Bat Mitzvahs it's like a Jewish coming of faith where you're stepping into adulthood, Jared, we talked about your son being 13. When you turn 13 in a Jewish tradition you were Bar or Bat Mitzvah and this is like a big celebration where the whole family comes to celebrate your path and your journey into adulthood. So I should have mentioned that for context.  So first timing that all of this is weaving together. Yeah, so for my Bar Mitzvah, my mom brought in a company from Chicago and she's like, oh my God, this is incredible. We don't have anything like this in St. Louis. And so she decided to take a stab at entrepreneurship and I remember my mom said, you know what, we're gonna do this locally because there is no company that's doing this and there's a need, the Jewish community would really benefit from this. And so she started Utopia in 2001. She left her job as an educator and I just vividly recall as a 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 year old watching my mom scale this company from our basement and the kitchen of our childhood home growing up and my dad had a corporate job, he worked nine to five and then from five to nine, he was my mom's employee. And I just remember we had this like 15 degree hill on the side of our house and I vividly remember my dad like carrying large PA systems and audio visual equipment, like lugging it over his back and using dollies and going up and down that hill, loading the trucks, going to produce events and then coming back home and on Sunday breaking the shows down and then going to work on Monday and, oh, bless them. And in 2013, we lost my mom to cancer and so she left this beautiful legacy behind. I get to ride on the shoulders of her legacy every day and my dad and I were sort of climbing the corporate ladder, if you will and we had a decision to make. Do we sell mom's company or do we dive in and do this thing and scale it as our family business and take it to new heights? And so ultimately that's what we decided to do and for the 10 years that I've been involved, we shifted a little bit. The entertainment part of our business is still makes up a small segment of our business but we're much more in the event planning, event production side and since the last 10 years we've helped 300 nonprofits raise more than $50 million for their charities and it's been a gift. It's been an absolute gift. Fantastic, thank you for that. I loved hearing your origin story.   Why does this matter? I mean, why are we even talking about this right now? Because the nerve, thank you for bringing this up. Neuroscience, we nerd out on neuroscience at our company because if you don't understand the neuroscience behind what's happening in the brain when you walk into a space then nothing else really matters. And we could bring the best technology in the room, the best audio visual stuff in the room, the best cameras and tell the best fun to need, mission, whatever you call it, fun to need, mission, moment, spotlight, appeal, video. We can tell all of those things, all those things align perfectly, right?  And so we always start when a new client brings us on, whether that's the corporate side or the nonprofit side, we always start by helping them understand the fundamentals behind neuroscience. And so the brain is divided into three parts and we can just kind of briefly go through this because I know we have a limited time today, but I just want people to sort of understand the concept here and we can unpack it a little bit. And so the front of your brain, and this is based on the triune model of the brain. And so there's a lot of approaches and models to help sort of make sense of the brain. This was first delivered by scientists in the 1970s and it's just one of many ways to make sense of how the brain's divided into different systems. So the triune model of your brain basically says this, your brain's divided into three different systems and we need to activate those systems to fully make your community, to make the brain come online. And so right here is your prefrontal cortex. And this is the area of the brain that is, when this part of the brain is online, you get into a flow state. Complex thinking happens.    And this part of the brain is concerned with am I safe and do I belong?  Like we're thinking, is this landing? Like when we're having this conversation, we're on stage and we're thinking, is this landing? Will people accept us? Can we be ourselves up here on stage and still fit in with this group of people? Is this resonating? And so now put yourself in a position where you're walking into a space with 300, 500, 1000 strangers. And so that part of the brain is activated. And the other two areas where deep learning, emotion, empathy, complex thinking, love, belonging, community are, those two areas have to be online for those emotions to happen. Those areas are deactivated because you're thinking, I'm with a group of 500, 1000 strangers and I don't feel psychologically safe. And so what we've learned as an event production and event planning company is we have to help our communities get these other two areas. First, we have to help people feel psychologically safe in a large space. And then these other two areas have the right conditions where they can come fully online. And then and only then do we go into a program. Wow. Yeah. There's so much in that, Joey. And again, we talk about events here on the show a lot. We talk about fundraising a lot, but we haven't really dove and unpacked the neuroscience of the brain. So I love how Utopia Experience brings this into the sector and into raising for the events. Talk to us about the 3C model gathering and community because I'm sure all of this has that baseline of the neuroscience practice at its core. Yeah. So we kind of borrow this approach from our friends over at the exchange approach and their facilitators, they bring in a bunch of neuroscientists, doctors, practitioners, event engineers, if you will, scientists, and they came up with this approach. And so we've sort of taken that and made it our own. And we believe there are three reasons that people come to events. And we really say that there's two reasons people come and one reason that people come back. And so the first C is what we call content or intellectual capital. And that's when people come to your event, they want you to teach them something and make them better. And so what we're learning about information is that it's ubiquitous. Think about like we stopped watching live TV 20 years ago. Right, Jared? We get our TV now from Netflix or Hulu or YouTube or wherever. And so, and we stopped getting our information just the same from Encyclopedia's 10, 15, 20 years ago because the internet became a thing. And so now we get our information from TikTok. So people can get learning on demand anywhere. And so the way people learn or the way people are learning is changing. And so we need to be changing too. So that's the first C is people want to learn something from your event experiences, but we need to be thoughtful about what we teach them and how we deliver that information. Okay. The second C is connection. And so this quite simply is just social connection. You want to connect with other people and network and create rapport with people like yourself. And then typically intentional, purposeful and thoughtful event organizers and executive directors, CEOs, they stop there. And they do those two things well. And they're like, if we teach something from the stage and we give a program and we tell some really great video stories, people are going to be connected to the mission and they're going to want to come back and they're going to want to give. And we think that that is, there's something there that's being missed. And that's the third C, which is community. And so this is the transcendent purpose. This is why are we here tonight? What does this really mean for our community? And that's the C that's often missed. And so we do such a great job of connecting people to the mission, but in terms of psychological safety, what we know about it in neuroscience is if we don't connect people to each other, the full community at your events will never come online. So content, connection, community. Those are the three narrow downs. Those are the three. I love that. I think you're right, Joey. I really see the first two Cs take effect and flight. And then I don't always see the community aspect, but what I do know to be true and also for myself, so much of us, we crave community, right? We really want to be a part of community, however we define that, right? And it could be an online community, it could be an in-person community that geographic space, but community is changing. However, we're still looking for that connection within a community, I'm gonna say that resonates with us. Is that accurate? 100%, 100%. And I'm seeing that more since the pandemic. I mean, I hate to ask that question, but I feel like the blanket answer is yes, but is that just because we're saying it is? Hmm, that's a fair question. I think now, unfortunately, traditional media kind of thrives on fear. And so people are feeling, you turn the TV on, the world is ending. There's a bunch of chaos going on right now all over the world. And so people are feeling isolated, they're feeling disconnected, they're feeling helpless. And so now, more than ever, people are like, I'm gonna cling on to my neighbors. I'm gonna cling on to my family. I'm gonna do what matters most to me and spend time with those that I love most. And so that element of community is rooted into our core, into our DNA structure, because even as primal human beings, thousands of years ago, we thrived in tribes. And so that element hasn't gone away. I think it's only sort of getting exacerbated if you will over time that, you know, we need to be in community with one another to feel connected to a deeper sense of meaning and purpose. And solidarity is beautiful. Well, thank you for that. And I don't know, there's just so much going on everywhere. Let's move into data. We talk about data also, but, you know, being in the room or capturing data during an event, what does that look like? And again, I'm thinking like all of this ties back to neuroscience. So, nerd out with us about capturing data, being in the room, what does all of this mean? Yes, oh my gosh, there's so much to unpack here. Okay, so we are a production company, right? So what we like to do is most of our nonprofits or corporations, before they work with us, they're working with the AV company that sort of comes with a hotel and they don't think they have another option. Well, we're like, okay, cool. You could do that and that's fantastic. Or like, we wanna help you truly understand the difference between AV, audio visual and true event partnership, true event production. And so we take all of the technology in the room and make it work for you. And so one of the ways that we do that, so think about this, because the production in the room is a cost if it's not serving you, right? So we wanna make it an investment. So people come into your event, imagine like repurposing the red carpet. And so we just did this recently for a private school and we went to the admissions team and said, what's the most pertinent information that we can gather from your families and your donors as they walk into the event? And they said, well, we can't contact all of the family members at our school, but since they're all coming in through that beautiful step and repeat red carpet entrance, can you ask them how many family members they have and how old those family members are? So we know when we can start prospecting them to bring more of their family members into our school. So we have this red carpet with a video camera and a light and that's like paparazzi and who's interviewing them, the kid's favorite teachers. And so the parents are walking in and they're like, oh my God, Mrs. Smith, Mr. So-and-so, we love you. Our kids love you and they're like, well, what do they love? And they pass the microphone over and they let the families give them the space to tell the admissions and the advancement team everything about what they love about the school, how many kids they have. And so it gives, of course, on Monday we turn all of this video footage over to the nonprofit to the school and it provides them information and a data bank, not, oh my gosh, it's anecdotal data, right? Instead of strict spreadsheet data. And so you're watching those videos back and you're like, now you have more thoughtful ways to follow up with people based on the information that they just shared with you. And that's just the entrance of the event. We haven't even gotten to the meat and potatoes yet. Oh, but what I love about that, Joey, first of all, that is super clever, right? Because you stationed people there that they already know like and trust, right? They're familiar. They're having a conversation that is real life, real time, genuine, right? And not asking them to, hey, could you fill out this piece of paper or let's send you a survey and just hope that these people submit it. Like there's some interaction there with people that they already have a relationship with. Absolutely. And when we talk about like the neuroscience and nerding out in the three C's, when they come into the event, typically we're just inviting them to go to a cocktail hour. You've got 500 strangers standing awkwardly in a room. When you're greeted by people that you know and like and trust, immediately you feel seen, you feel heard, the amygdala is like, we're safe in this environment. And you've set people up to really thrive and sort of activating the other two parts of the brain, the emotional brain, the prefrontal cortex. You've created those conditions for those two parts of the brain to come online. Yeah. What a wonderful opportunity. Okay, you said that's just the beginning. So we haven't even talked about the event itself and the ending. And I know we have one additional key talking point, but could you share another tip of what you did, maybe in the ballroom itself during the event, post event, you know, what did that look like? Okay. I know we're, we only have like 10-ish minutes, right? So I'm going to share these very quickly. Two things during the cocktail hour, instead of doing a traditional cocktail hour, we recently worked with an event, on an event with a nonprofit organization where we color coded people's bid paddles. And we called them in group, in their groups. So like the blue group gathered by the ballroom and we took them through a reveal of the ballroom in groups of 20 intimate donors. Instead of bringing everybody in simultaneously, we put them in groups, right? And we had volunteers walk them through these exhibit stations that we set up. And at these different stations, there were prerecorded videos that our team helped produce and they're on LED walls and there's statistics on the sides of the screen. And people go to these different stations as groups of 20, 25 donors. And they're hearing from the families about how the donations impact them in incredible ways. And so at one station, it was one program, so on and there were four different stations highlighting four different programs for this particular organization. And you're connecting, you're resonating because these stories are being told by families whose lives are being enhanced by the services the nonprofit provides. Now, what's also happening while they're listening to those videos, they're laughing, they're crying, they're turning to each other and they're like, oh my God, this person's crying. No, you're crying. No, wait a second, you're crying, right? So they're all connecting to this very shared experience. Connection and creating community, right? So they're already creating community in that space. Yeah. Okay, keep going. Sorry, I just couldn't help to interject. So after that, they get through those four stations, they're making dinner plans. They're like, I don't know you, but I love you. Let's get dinner together after that. Let's keep our relationship alive. We've created the conditions where people could connect on an intimate level and get emotional together so that they're like, wow, we're really here for this thing to help more families like this together. And now they're bonded with those 2025 people that they went through that experience with. So that's one way. And it was modeled off the Van Gogh Museum if you're familiar with that. Oh, that's fantastic. No, I'm not. Okay, you're gonna have to save the other way because I wanted to, but those two that you just shared truly were amazing. I have never in my 20 plus years of being in the sector, Joey heard of that strategy, right? Like having different bid colors kind of shepherding them through the ballroom before the event even starts. Now let's talk about leveraging and utilizing technology because this is a big piece. And as you mentioned, it could either be a cost or it can be an investment. So how do we leverage and utilize technology to really benefit the mission? Yeah, I think what we just talked about is a fantastic starting point is think about your technology, not as just something in the room that's there because you feel like you have sort of an obligatory program and a video that you're gonna show, but how can you capture information with technology on your most important relationships? So one way you might consider doing this, we just did this at a gala last weekend. I put a QR code up on the screen, we had people scan it, we asked them how long have you been a donor for this nonprofit and we showed the results in real time as the data was coming in. Then we asked the people who had been a donor longer than five years to stand, we acknowledged them, applauded them, we had them sit. And we said, how many donors here tonight for the first time? Wow, look at that. We've got a hundred people here tonight for the first time, can we have you stand? Then what we did is we said, first time donors stay standing.  Tell them you love them, they're awesome, high five them. We want them to be you. We want them to come back next year and for the next five years, 10 years, 15, we want them to feel part of this community. So we used our LED walls and projectors in the room to throw up that QR code, do an in-person survey, get information about how long people have been donors. We asked them their preferred method of communication also. So it was a two-question survey. So the director of development knew how to contact those people after the event. And then we connected them to each other and then we went into the live auction. Wow. And there's so much neuroscience in that as well, right? The connection, the community building, the positive reinforcement, there's so much that goes into that. Have you seen this at other events or is this something that like, I don't know, Utopia created? Where is this coming from? I think it's just we're learning a lot from being a part of all these different experiences. And we want to take what we call 1.0 events to 2.0 or 3.0 events because we feel like events have been transactional and that we can make them transformational. And I don't mean to throw a cliche thing out there. I genuinely think that there is a huge opportunity here. And here's the thing. Our executive directors, their best friends of mine and ours at Utopia, our directors of development, they have a lot to do. Yeah. It's hard running a nonprofit.  And so sometimes the event is something that it's like at the 11th hour, we're like, oh my God, we forgot we have an event coming up in three months. Let's just do what we did last year. And that's no fault of their own. It's just how it shakes out. And so we're here to sort of say, let us do that part for you so that we can graduate that organization from an event where we're just giving a four hour passive program to one where the community feels like this is somewhere where I really want to be for the rest of my life. That is fantastic. We also talk often or I do about how there's so much that goes into this event, whether you're rinsing and repeating what you did last year or the year before that, because you're like, oh no, it's three months away and we haven't gotten far on this event. But once you have that event, the follow up post event is critical to the success of building that community, right? So again, your three C's, the content, the connection, the community and how do we continue to foster that post an event to create that space where, you know, we do want to foster connections over and over and over and not just a one night thing. Is that right? That's absolutely right. Wow, well, I feel like we're in event season, right? We're in Q4 right now as we're recording this, but you can truly have an event at any time. It doesn't have to be at the end of, you know, the final quarter, October, November and December of the year. So really looking at how are you building neuroscience into your events leveraging and utilizing that technology? Joey, you have been fantastic. Such an honor to have met you in Nashville. Again, thank you to our friends of One Cause, the RAISE conference because Joey Goon, you and your team, my friend, you were up to some big business and I absolutely love it because again, not many times do we hear or even talk about neuroscience in nonprofits, especially as it talks to the psychology of events. So thank you for bringing this to the topic. I really appreciate that. Thank you for having me. I greatly appreciate you. Yeah. Well, again, scratching the surface because in 30 minutes there's only so much we can get in. It's a very truncated conversation, but Joey Goon, president at Utopia Experience, please do check Joey out. The team there, utopiaexperience.com. As you hear, they're up to big things. They're implementing some really big, you know, differences in our community. And I just love the examples that you shared already in this amount of time. So I can only imagine what you bring to the community and really just so appreciative to have your time here. Hey, for all of you that have joined us, thank you. Julia Patrick and I, Jared Ransom, we are so glad that you join us day in and day out. This week, we celebrated 900 episodes and we wouldn't be here if it weren't for our amazing guests like Joey and of course all of you that are watching and listening, but we would be remiss if we didn't extend a huge shout out of gratitude to our partners, which include Bloomerang, American nonprofit academy, fundraising academy at National University, nonprofit thought leader, your part-time controller, staffing boutique, nonprofit nerd, as well as nonprofit tech talk. These companies are here to support you in your mission and all that you do around the community. And Joey, we have been ending every single episode and today is 902, episode 902 with this same mantra. And we wanna use it again today because every day we believe that it changes just slightly even though the mantra stays the same. So I hope that you all will join us again, but until then, we ask you to stay well so you can all continue to do well. Thank you, Joey, it's been a pleasure.


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that's going to be the case. I think the university is is doing an incredible job on all fronts. It's top 25 in the country now it's got excellent leadership it's got the Institute for advanced life sciences that has helped us through coven here locally. The majority of people here in town are directly affiliated with it. And we're very fortunate that's here so we look forward to the university continuing to thrive and get better as it has done. And I think that the sooner we could stop imagining that the housing demand and Amherst is going down the sooner we could start coming up with solutions. So is it true that archipelago is has divested of the Kendrick plays archipelago has never owned these projects archipelago is the development entity, each one of these entered projects is a special purpose entity as it remains today. That makes sense. Do you have, do you have a handle like on under vacancy rate of your existing buildings do you. Is it, is it something 510% or well obviously coven changed that for anybody who owns rental property in Amherst. But it is, it is. The entity is not an issue. If you can ask anybody who owns a rental property in Amherst right now. Vacancy is is not a concern that that we have. Yeah, I sense that just from very well, Jack. Yeah, so I sense that from just the real estate market with, you know, the housing sale prices whatever it just it's it. Shouts historically every, every, every study that has been done in Amherst has talked about vacancy. And that's always been, it's always been extremely low. Yeah. Thank you. Um, Next we have Kitty, state your name and address, please. Hi, kitty. Hi. Janet, I love the way you greet people. It's very nice. My name is kitty axelson, Barry. And I live at 89 Stony Hill Road. In Echo Hill South, which is a planned urban residential development. So, first of all, I'm kind of cautiously happy to see several of you members of the planning board. Supporting what I see as more of a concern about public space more safe more of a concern about safety for pedestrians on sidewalks all the things that I'm concerned about so I just want to acknowledge that and thank you. Um, less architecture. That's so massive. So, okay, I might repeat myself or repeat other people and I'm, and I don't know so much about planning, but it seems to me that the area along the cemetery. The cemetery must be some kind of a historic treasure. I mean, it should be if it isn't. But couldn't it be possible to instead of narrowing the street there and I guess keeping it like five feet wide, something like that, which seems to me to be a fire hazard. But couldn't the walk along the cemetery be promoted as something of interest of value of aesthetic. Attraction. So I'm just, I'm just wondering about whether it would be possible for the design to include making the cemetery walk a feature. Instead of something that's like you can only see from the fourth floor where the community room is or something like that. Because also that little view corridor looks pretty narrow and it's helpful, but not enough in my opinion. And also I'm wondering whether that little corridor, the view corridor to the cemetery is public space and how the public would be invited to walk down it if it is public space. I mean, I don't even know what public space means at this point. Because if the public doesn't feel welcome to it, how is it really public. That's a question. Okay, moving on housing crisis. I think that the housing crisis here is much more for family housing for workforce housing for low and moderate income housing. And not so much for students. I wish there was more, there were more duplexes, more owner occupied rentals, more triplexes, I guess it's called, and more, you know, small inexpensive not so expensive condos for a variety of ages or even more apartments that would be suitable for a variety of ages, including older people who there was an article that economist Jerry Friedman wrote in the Amherst Indy last week about how students and old people like me are a good bet for a town because we don't cost so much because we don't have kids in the schools. And we pay pay property taxes or rent, which creates property taxes of course. So, I really think it would be really nice if places like if archipelago didn't only cater to students and because I looked up their websites and it says student housing for every one of these developments it's like student housing. And it's right there in the publicity, or maybe it was for Harrison the owner, innovative living the rental whatever. I think that we whether it's the town or the planning board has the right to insist upon bigger setbacks on all sides, every side, and that I don't understand why the town wouldn't do that. I don't understand. I mean I hope the town would insist on bigger setbacks not reducing the setbacks from 10 feet to five feet from 20 feet to five feet. It's like why not insist on like more setbacks not less where you can't even walk. And finally, well, not finally but they quit. So stop me if I'm over my time, please. I didn't put my time around but I'm sure you're over but go ahead with your last point there. Okay, I completely disagree with Kyle Wilson sentiment that essentially people should go to the mall or order on the internet and not bother coming into Amherst unless they can walk. And I know so many people because I lived for over 40 years and North Leverett I know so many people from Leverett Palom shoots very who used to come to Amherst.  Now they go to Greenfield or they go all the way out of their way to North Hampton. Okay, that's it thank you very much. All right, thank you. And from that comment I think just Chris, I think the cemetery should be clarified. There's nothing. There's no walkway or driveway back there I just maybe you can clean that up with the interaction the cemetery. Do you want me to answer that. Yes. So, the cemetery is a public space and people are invited to come into the cemetery from two places one is next to the toy box and the other one is on triangle street. So there's plenty of opportunity for people to walk around the cemetery. The space between the cemetery and this building is going to be a slope. And at the bottom of the slope, you know, it's going to be grassy and it's going to be. And it's currently a slope is not it's not right. That's not even a walkway. Currently, it's probably going to be wet and grassy. And it doesn't seem like an inviting place to go. It seems much more inviting to be up on top in the cemetery, where you can see everything that's to be seen instead of being kind of down in a hole. That's what that's, you know, right next to a building. Yeah, I don't think that it's realistic to promote public access along that strip, when people could go and walk in the cemetery. Yeah, that's my comment. Yeah, but there is the point is like there is no public access back there anyway, right now, and actually to view the mural on one East Pleasant Street. You can't see it if you're right next to the building. It's meant to be viewed from the cemetery to be viewed from the cemetery. All right, so we have one more. And then, and then obviously there's a lot more. And, but I think we have some other little small projects to clean up so we'll continue the sharing but Janet. Keller said, state your name and address please. Hi, Janet. Janet. Hi, everybody. There you go. I would like. Janet Keller pulpit Hill Road 120 pulpit Hill Road. And I would like to appreciate the fullness and thoughtfulness of the planning board for so many aspects of this project that you discussed tonight. And then I would like to make an ask. The next meeting for the details of the stormwater plans for this development, if you could request that those be discussed in detail, enough to ensure us that 100 year storm would be handled properly and and not cause any danger to outside of the site. And then I would like that triggered also an idea for me about that 20 feet of slope behind the building between the building and the cemetery. And that be retained as part of the storm water storm storm water handling system. So, thank you for this opportunity. Appreciate it. Oh, thank you, Janet. Yeah, so I know you have a stormwater report prepared that we can catch, you know, the next meeting. At this point. Chris, do we need to vote for the continuation or. Chris, you're muted. One of the planning board members needs to make a motion to continue this public hearing for all three of the of the cases, the two site plan review cases and the special permit case. And I would recommend continuing it to June 2 at 730. Okay. So, who wants to make Andrew moves as Chris is. Okay, so we're talking about SPR 2021-07 SPP 2021-02 and then SPR 2021-09 continued to June. What. Second. In second at 730. Okay. And there's a second somewhere. Second. Okay, Janet and any discussion. Do roll call here. Maria. Andrew. Hi, Doug. Hi, Tom. Hi, Janet. Hi, Johanna. Hi, and myself as a, as an eye. So that's a unanimous. And we'll see you. Thank you, Kyle. And thank you. And we look forward to seeing you. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Thank you. And so next, you know, this is, we're kind of like 930. We would like to wrap up. Fortunately, we did the Kendrick part playground. Old business. Topics not reasonably anticipated 40 hours. Part of the meeting. Is there anything? Great. All right. And new business. No new business. Not anticipate. Okay. Great. Form. Form a. Subdivision applications. Okay. I have one and Pam can show the plan. I think she's got two plans. Oh, look at that. That's wonderful. Oh, wait a minute. Oh, you've got. You've got more in the wrong thing. Hold on. So I'll just start off and tell you that it's an A&R that you've seen before. It's property at the corner of Harkness road and Belcher town road. It. The configuration of the property as a result of the previous. A&R was two lots at the corner, which Pam can show you. They have that one in that one. Yep. So those aren't changing at all. And then there was one large lot, which I think was called lot one. And it was a big, big lot with that red line. Yep. And then there was a lot here. So now the landowner. And just to let you know, the areas closer to the. Closer to Harkness road, those two lots that are closer to the corner are in the RN zoning district. The other three lots are a lot of them. A lot of their lot areas in the RLD district. And that's a lot of them. And that's a lot of those two acres or 80,000 square feet of. Of lot area. And a building circle of 200 feet. Now the house, there's an existing house that's close to Belcher town road. That is. Pam, if. If Pam moves her cursor over to. Which lot did you say? That lot that you're pointing to right now, there's an existing house there. And that's a lot of them. And that's a lot of them. And that's a lot of them are in zone. So it's allowed to have a building circle of 120 feet. Whereas the lots where the buildings will go in the RLD. Are required to have a building circle of 200 feet, which they do. So these lots are. Configured. The new version of these lots are configured properly. Each one has over 80,000 square feet. Each one has. Each one has a building circle of 200. Except for that one that has the house in it already. So we're asking you to, and I should say. The new lot lines are the. See the north. I'll have to orient myself here. North is to the right. So. On the western side of lot five. There's a new lot line that's being drawn. Maybe Pam can show that. Yes, that's the new lot line. And if she can drag her cursor over, yeah, that's the new lot line too. So those are the new lot lines. Essentially what they're doing is they're creating a new lot five. They're making a lot for a little smaller. And they're making lot one smaller from the previous iteration that you saw a few months ago. So what you are being asked to do is to. Authorize the chair of the planning board to sign this plan. Making a statement that. This plan, this configuration of lots does not require. Going through the subdivision process. In other words, there's no road here. You're not creating a new road with lots off the road.  So the statement is that this is approval not required. Subdivision approval is not required. So if you would authorize Jack to sign that plan, that would be, that would be helpful. Thank you. Chris, could I ask a question? Jack. So I'm a little. So I was beginning to wonder like, why isn't this a subdivision? But that explains it. So, did you say that in the RO, it has to be two, two acres? Yes. And so I can barely read this, but it looks like a lot five and four are not. Well, it has to be two, it has to be 80,000 square feet, which is almost two acres. An acre is 43,560. So if you multiply that by two, you get 86 something. But the zoning bylaw actually requires 80,000 square feet per acre. So that's the, that's the, that's the, the, the, the, the zoning. The zoning. The zoning. The zoning district. So these slots do meet that 80,000 square feet. Sorry. Sorry, I wasn't clear about that. Yeah, I can hardly see that, but I, okay. That makes sense to me. Okay. Thank you. Doug, you have a question. No, I'd like to move that we. Allow the chair to. Declare that this is not required subdivision approval. Second. Thank you, Janet. Any discussion? I see no hands raised. I'll do roll call. Maria. I don't think we have to vote on it. You don't really need to vote. You can just sort of do it by consensus unless someone objects. Might be quicker to do. No, all right. We started so we should finish. Okay. I see no objections. Let's, let's roll. Upcoming ZBA applications. Oh, I'm very sorry. No, I have nothing new to report tonight. And upcoming SPP SPR. I don't know if you've heard of this one before, but the Emily Dickinson museum is putting in a. Generator and some other mechanical equipment. And so they're doing some work behind the existing garage. And I'll be bringing that to you on. June 2nd. Very good. Plenty board committee and liaison reports. I think I'm just going to. I'm just going to go back to the. I'm just going to go back to the. With regard to the planning. Pioneer Valley planning commission. I did forward you, Chris. There's a housing. Some post in tomorrow. Midday. If you could distribute that email looks interesting. Oh, yep. You remember that. Okay. And. I don't. I'll let other people go. Maybe I'll remember. What was discussed in the last meeting. So it was executive. Meeting. So it was just more. Logistical, but. So the CPA committee, Andrew. Thanks, Jack. Yeah. We met last week. And we finalize the language for the. I think we're going to have the Emerson community preservation plan. So this basically has information, kind of an intro to what CPA is as well as providing some detailed information on how you can apply. That's hopefully going to be loaded this week, but you know, maybe next week. And that essentially wraps up. I think we may still have one other. Not technically meeting, but some opportunity to get together, but I think it's going to be a great opportunity for. For for this year. Very good. Thank you, Andrew. Thanks. Doug. And commission. Nothing to report. We have not met. Okay. And design review board. Tom, you spoke a little bit earlier.  We also had a conversation to approve. Signage for Aspen Heights, which is in the storefront near Bueno across from town hall. It's a new storefront. There's their kind of retail or their apartment. Sales. Location. And that's 40, 40 main street. So it's right down town. And they just have some vinyl graphics in the, in the storefront that haven't, that needed to be approved. So those were approved. And then we have a meeting on Monday, May 10th. Five to seven. With the archipelago group regarding the materials we just reviewed here. Great. Thank you. And then. The CRC. Chris, I remember there's some. So the CRC reviewed. A number of things with planning staff and Rob Mora. We went over. The mixed use building definition and standards. And I think we're going to be bringing that to the planning board. On Wednesday, this coming Wednesday. We also talked about. Apartments and Maureen Pollock is working on. Definition and some standards for apartments. So we'll be bringing that to you as well. We talked to them about the BL zoning district. And that still needs a lot of work. So Nate is continuing to work on that. And I think ADUs, accessory dwelling units is moving on to be presented to. The town council for a referral to back to the planning board and the CRC. So that's moving ahead. We didn't really talk to CRC about that. So next week. This coming week, the CRC is going to be meeting about the housing policy that's being proposed. They're also going to be looking at. They're going to be looking at some of the work that Maureen has done on apartments. And they're going to be looking at. The demo delay by law, which is pretty far. Pretty far on its way to being done. And then we'll be bringing zoning amendments to you all on Wednesday. So we're working pretty hard on those and hoping to move them ahead. And as I said before, the inclusionary zoning by law and the moratorium are going to, I didn't mention the moratorium, but we're going to be working on that. So we're going to be bringing zoning and the moratorium. We're going to have public hearings on. May 19th. On the planning board and the CRC. So we're getting an opportunity to talk about that. At that time. Very good. Uh, report of the chair. I think I don't really have anything. And report of staff. I don't have anything either. None of this time. Okay. So we are meeting next. Next Wednesday. At six 30. To talk about zoning. Okay. And I think everybody said they could come. Okay. Oh, that's right. Yeah. That's, we kind of fit that in. Um, Recently anyway. So, Hey, uh, happy Cinco de Mayo to everyone. Thank you. We, we, we survived another festive planning board. Day. So. We are adjourned. It's nine 45. Just want you to know. Alrighty. All right. Thank you. All right. We'll get that margarita, Jack.


Hello everyone, another NARC Survivor Live video. I'm out here tonight in the middle of the jungle. Just done quite a bit of a drive exploring. Got the new BMW 320i with this sports body kit. Can't really see it too well in the dark. I just picked it up today and I'll give it a clean and showcase it in my next video, hopefully. It's a nice car, quite fast too. But yes, and this one I'm going to be talking about something that we do not talk about too often. And that is how you are actually not as significant as you think to the narcissist. Because a lot of you are thinking, I've been with this person for a very long time. You may have been with them for 10 years and you may feel like they know you.  And although they did some things sometimes that you did not approve of, you felt like they cared about you, they loved you. Because they weren't always bad. I mean yes, there were a lot of arguments, there were a lot of fights. It's when it seemed like they actually cared. And I know what that's like, I've experienced it many times myself. And it makes you doubt all of the negative experiences that you had with them. It makes you feel like maybe you got it wrong, maybe you weren't dealing with a narcissist after all. But actually narcissists, a lot of them do have empathy as well. It's just that their narcissistic tendencies override it a lot of times. But then other times, if their day is going well, if they're happy, then they can treat you right, even if it's only for a short time. So it leads you to believe that you're something significant to them. The reality is that you are not. Just look back through the amount of time that you spent with them. When was the last time that you actually sat down with them and had a conversation? And I don't just mean a conversation about the weather. What about a conversation about your feelings and needs? About what is or what is not OK for you? About what matters to you? About what is important to you in life? When was the last time you had that with the narcissist? Just think about that for a moment. Because you've got to look at it like this. You found my videos because there was a problem. And you were looking for a solution to that problem. And if you look at it, the problem was you felt invalidated. You felt like they couldn't hear you. They weren't listening to you. And many of you, you watch my videos because you feel like I'm filling in that space. Like I am hearing you and validating your experience. Which is something that I can do in such a short space of time. And it's so easy for me to do it. And yet you may have been with this narcissist for 10 years. There was never a time where you sat down and had a conversation like that. Which is how you should know that you're actually not significant at all. And in fact, it could have been anyone. It could have been anyone in your place.   You decided to give them a chance. And if it wasn't you, then it would have been someone else. I don't know, with a lot of you, you're already aware that they have or they had other sources of supply on the side. They were entertaining other people. And you may know about the Rex's. They didn't want to put up with them. The narcissist may have said that they were crazy. They did them wrong. But maybe they just didn't fall for the illusion. Maybe that's what it was. Because you're actually not that important to them at all. They don't even know who you are. They don't know your likes and interests. They don't know what makes you tick. What turns you on. No, they don't know any of that stuff.  What makes them upset or angry. What they want. And unfortunately for you, what they want doesn't typically align with what you want. That's why you find you're having so many disagreements with them. So much conflict where it's like they can't even understand you. Because you're not significant to them. And you've got to think about it like this. If you are so significant to them, then why would it go from the love bombing to the devaluation? And in some cases they end up discarding you. You've been discarded already. Why would that happen? If you were so significant to them, if they cared about you. Why would they triangle it with someone else? Why would they replace you? I mean if you are very significant to someone, it's not going to be so easy for them to replace you. And in fact it might take them a long time, it might take them years.  They're not going to be able to do that so quickly and easily. Which is how you should know. And how you should be aware that no, you're not significant to them at all. But yes, there may be certain qualities and traits that you have that are significant to them. Things such as your love, your joy and positivity, your innocence and purity. All of these things that narcissists do not possess. So they've got to get that from you. They've got to strip you of your qualities and virtues. Because it fulfills them, it gives them supply when they're able to take that away from you. But that's the thing. Could it be in anyone? It didn't have to be you. They could have got that from someone else. These qualities and virtues that you possess. They got it from you because you were willing to give that to them. And honestly, if they could just strip you of that, take it away from you. They'd probably just do that and leave you. They wouldn't need you around. And it's the same thing if they can find that in someone else. It's so easy for them to replace you because you're actually not so significant to them at all. You're not important to them. And it's not just you, it's everyone. People are disposable objects to the narcissist. They're expendable. They can get rid of you without notice. Because you don't matter to them as much as you might think. They don't really value your individuality. They don't value your quirks and mannerisms, all of these things that make you. You. They don't care about your passions and interests. They don't care about you having a purpose of your own. When did they ever support you in any of that? When did they ever encourage these individual things about you? When did they ever do that? And in fact, by being with a narcissist, you may have found that you've lost yourself. They raised you at a core level. Remember all of the things you were doing before you met them? You had all of these hobbies and interests, all of these passions, these values and virtues, these things that mattered to you. What happened to all of that? Where did that all go? And that's when it should hit you. That's when you should know you should recognize that they never valued you as a person. They saw you as an object that existed to meet their needs. They saw you as an extension of them. And then it was all about just molding you into whatever they wanted you to be. Whatever would serve them. It was never about developing the person that you are. We're encouraging you to become the best version of yourself. No, it was never about that at all. It was all about what they were going to get from you, that they never actually cared about you, they never valued you as a person. They never saw you as a separate person with your own feelings and needs. And I know this may be difficult for a lot of you to hear, but I do believe that it is very important. It's something that you need to understand and it will help you to detach from them by knowing that they never actually cared about you at all. If they cared about you, they wouldn't have been able to do those things to you. They wouldn't have harmed you if they really loved you. You don't harm something that you love, but for them it was all about sabotaging and destroying you, holding you back in life. But guess what? You may not have been significant to the narcissist, but you can be significant to yourself by practicing self-love and self-care. Recognizing your value, because a lot of you are very intelligent and attractive people. You have these qualities and virtues which they did recognize. Yes, they recognize the value of that and those things belong to you. That's what drew them to you. That's what made them target you. And these things are a part of you, but they didn't see them as a part of you. It was all about stripping that away from you. As though it was something that could be detached from you, because that's just how they think. So, yes, I want to end this on a positive note by encouraging and inspiring you to develop yourself, your identity, your passions and interests, the things that matter to you. Even if those things didn't matter to them, they can matter to you. By doing that, by practicing self-love and self-care, then in time, you'll be able to attract someone who does love you for you. Someone who recognizes your value and appreciates you. Yes, you will find that for real. It all starts by loving yourself and forgiving yourself for being involved with them. Got Nala jumping around you. As I said, we are traveling, exploring the jungle. Going to have a lot more videos now in the jungle over the next few days. Got quite a long trip. Been in the city for quite a few weeks, so we decided to go exploring Nala's tale here. But yes, it's sad I know it just feels like you wasted all of your time with this person and you could have spent that time doing something else. But this is just the reality of it. You were not significant to them. You were just the one who gave them a chance.  And they know a lot of other people would not have tolerated that. A lot of other people are not empaths. They wouldn't even try to understand them. They would just walk away in the very beginning. But you didn't do that.  It was difficult for them to find someone like you. But that's just it. It was never about you, it was a person. Which of course is why they dehumanized you. They crucified you. But yes, as I said, you can move on. Practice self-love. Value yourself. And you will find someone who values you. Someone who shares the same qualities and virtues as you do. Instead of someone who's only looking to strip that away because they don't have that and the envious of it. Because that's what this is about. Yes, of course, they are envious and jealous of your qualities, virtues, abilities and achievements, all of these things. The very envious and jealous of that, that's why they become so competitive. But you can take that and find someone who will appreciate you as a person. And they will recognize that these things belong to you. And they will respect your individuality instead of trying to tear it down. So yes, that's what I wanted to say tonight in this message. And I hope it was helpful for you. I'm going to continue now with my journey. Got another hour of driving through the jungle. So I'm going to enjoy that. And yeah, until next time, thank you all for watching. Please give it a thumbs up down below. Share and subscribe. And as always, I'll talk to you in another one very soon.


Meeting news and information needs in rural communities is more important now than ever before. False or inaccurate information, especially that which is deliberately intended to deceive, is a concern. At a time when overall trust in media is steadily declining, a study from the Washington Post-Kaiser Family Foundation found that 60% of rural Americans believe the media respects them only a little or not at all. The fact that they're covered less only makes the problem worse. Here with us today is Dana Kester. She's an associate professor at West Virginia University, editor-in-chief for the Collaborative Media Outlet 100 Days in Appalachia, and director of the Newstart Fellowship Program. Her work focuses on technology and community media with special interests in audience building and new economic models for sustaining journalism. Thanks for being with us today. I want to start with some of the research that you look at and that is how social media is being used to target particular populations in Appalachia. Who's doing the targeting and who are the targets? Okay, well, there's a couple different things going on there. One is we very specifically are looking at white supremacist activity targeting. Our particular research is looking at youth and who are highly vulnerable to misinformation and disinformation. And there's an interesting ecosystem in rural where there may be an over-reliance on internet access devices and gaming for youth when there is a lack of extracurricular enrichment. There's geographic remoteness in rural communities. So when a kid is spending upwards of eight hours a day in a space, you can see how readily, how easily they can be manipulated in that space. But I will also speak to adults in communities where what you mentioned about rural having a lack of trust in particular in national media or what we would call elite media, that is warranted. I mean, I'm a member of these communities and I see how Appalachia or rural communities are represented. So it's not just that we're not covered. When we are covered, we're covered wrong in a way that doesn't represent a truth that we feel or know, our lived experiences. And that's partly why we did a hundred days in Appalachia, but there is a lot of work to be done to rebuild trust in not just Appalachia, but in rural America at large. And I think it's going to be a decades-long challenge. And I will say, since right after the election there was a lot of well-intentioned effort by national and international media. People were doing their rural bus tours. And, but as we're gearing up for another election and I see the coverage start to happen, not a lot has changed. So what is, that unpacks a couple of things for me. One, so you say basically that the targets are kind of in a rich environment because there is a lack of trust in the large-scale media. There's not other enrichment programs and they're stuck on their phones or wherever. And so that's actually makes them more susceptible to alternative sources of information and including racists that might be trying to target them, right? And recruit them really into the cause. Is it, A, is it working? It's a very complicated grooming process. I will say that in the research that we've done, excuse me, all right, let me say it. I will say that in the research that we've done, we are looking at upwards of 60% of youth being impacted in some of these communities. And it's really, really important to understand. It's not just a lack of enrichment programs. It is also a lack of alternative, I mean, these are not youth that are, they're not watching television. Their primary, their entire form of media entertainment is through gaming and social media, a space that is largely unreculated. It is largely absent of, just by nature of its design, absent of parental engagement or other oversight. And it's, we kind of call it raised by wolves, raised by wolves, but the wolves being AI, bots, trolls, and organized groups that are targeting those youth. It's a public mental health crisis, some of our experts have said. So then the other part that you were talking about, which was interesting to me, is also how should the idea of elite media or whomever cover these communities better? What are ways that they can, is it about building partnerships of existing media that's on the ground, instead of parachuting in, you know, how do you do it? Yes, so I think the most important thing is, I mean, part of the reason we are a collaborative media outlet is that we are trying to rally local and regional orgs to report together and to work together to do that. And we consider partners in that, these external media outlets. We're actually in the process right now of creating a document for the 2020 sort of election reporting period on how to and how not to cover Appalachia and to create and to provide a database of the very talented reporters, photographers, media makers in the region as well. They already have the Rolodex, they already have the relationships, right? And they have the crust of some of their kids are on the same softball teams, et cetera, right? And also working directly, it's not just working with journalists, it's also working with community members who help vet context because it is, and not when we say community members at that context, we don't mean officials, we don't mean mayors and community organizers. We mean, you know, like the soccer coach or the folks at the fire station or people who are in the community who understand particular issues and who can help make sure you get it right. And I know journalists fundamentally want to get it right, but there's some work that needs to be done on the part of the journalists to do that listening. Are you optimistic? I mean, some of the challenges that these rural communities are facing seem pretty steep and they've seen pretty long-term. How do we fix it? I am optimistic because the Newstart Fellowship Project is about working with viable local news outlets that are still profitable, that have trust in their community, that have a legacy, some going back many decades. And I think, I often like to say that it's not a rescue operation for local news, I actually think local news is what's gonna save us and that's where we should be putting our energy, our resources, our support because that is a system that's not broken. And I'm talking about, I'm not talking about metropolitan dailies and sort of suburban-sized news outlets, I'm talking about micro, mom-and-pop weeklies and dailies that should be sort of our frontline of building trust in rural Appalachia and America. Good notes, Anna. Dana Kester, thanks so much for joining us. Thank you.