The National Broadgasting Company and its affiliated stations present the Pacific story. In the mounting fury of the world conflict, events in the Pacific are taking on ever greater importance. Here is the story of the Pacific and the millions of people who live around this greatest sea. The drama of the people whose destiny is at stake in the Pacific War. Here is the tale of the war in the Pacific and its meaning to us and to the generations to come. The Pacific story comes to you tonight from Hollywood as another public service. With drama of the past and present and commentary by Willard Price, noted writer and authority on the Pacific who has visited the Bonin Island. Japan's advanced base, the Bonin Island. Oh yes, oh goodbye Captain. Well thanks for all your hospitality. Man needs that after the long passage here. You are welcome. I'll see you when we call here again next year. Oh I'm afraid you will not, Captain. Are you figuring on something happening to you the next year, Mr. Hunakara? You are not coming back here. Hmm? Why what? Because of the gravity of the world situation henceforth, no foreign ships will be permitted to put in here.  No. Anywhere in the Bonin Island. Well, oh now look Mr. Hunakara, you're taking that situation in Europe too seriously. There isn't going to be any war over there. A lot of noise? Perhaps. Well I've been calling here at the Bonin Islands nearly every year for well, 25 years. This is 1939 and the world situation has changed. Oh yes. Henceforth no foreign ships will be permitted to put in here. What? Yes. Well I'll see you again sometime Mr. Hunakara. Well thank you for everything. Goodbye. Goodbye, Captain. Goodbye, goodbye. I was the last white man to leave the Bonin Islands. As we got underway and stood out to sea, I had a strange feeling. I stood on the bridge and looked back at Port Lloyd and wondered if I'd ever see the Bonin's again. As master of the Lottie D, I'd called at the Bonin's for years. As the islands receded, all that I'd learned about the Bonin's and my years of trading, fell together in a clear picture. The islands were Japanese now and were being closed to the world. We were being excluded. Yet one time the United States occupied them, the British occupied them. And neither country realized how important they would one day become. The Bonin Islands which were bombed against today are the last group of islands between the Marianas where the Americans have landed on Saipan and Japan itself. The Bonin's are from 800 miles north of the Marianas and only 2 hours flying time from Japan. The Bonin's are mighty important today. Some Americans and a few Britishers had the notion the islands were important 100 years ago or more. I am Matteo Mazzaro. I am an Italian. But I came to the Bonin Islands on a British ship. When Mazzaro got there in 1830, some problems had to be settled with an American named Nathaniel Savery. On what basis, Mr. Mazzaro, do you claim these islands many were written? Captain Beachy landed here three years ago on his majesty's ship Blossom and took possession of these islands in the name of George IV. Three years ago? Yes, in 1827. An American whaler, the Clantic with Captain Coffin as master, landed here four years before that in 1823. But the American captain did not claim the islands and the British captain did. The Americans were here before the British? I have orders from the British cons in Honolulu that I am to take over the islands and that I am to be the governor. Mr. Mazzaro, you and I cannot decide which country is to hold these islands. That is for Britain and the United States to decide. If we are to live here, all of us, we must have some kind of law and order. And that is what we should be putting our mind. Well, Mazzaro, the Italian, became the governor in the name of Britain. But Savery, the American, really was the boss. Well, they worked out a pretty satisfactory sort of a government far as I've been able to find out. After they'd been there 18 years, Mazzaro died. Savery became governor. An American citizen, governor of a group of islands, claimed by Britain. Maybe I shouldn't say claimed by Britain because at this stage at least the British in London had no such idea. What do we want with those islands in the Pacific? No one will quarrel with those British subjects who roam over the world and go to unheard of places. But as for Britain supplying them protection and the like, that of course is out of the question. When Savery became governor, he appealed to Washington to take over the islands. No, no, no, no. It's foolishness. If the Americans in the Bonine Islands wish to live under the American flag, they should come back to this country. The policy of the United States has been historically never to accept any lands which would require the Navy to defend them. The United States is not interested in the Bonine Islands. Well, the British flag went on flying over the Bonines. Savery, the American, went on being governor. It was long about in 1853 that another American came to the islands. Commodore Perry came to establish cooling stations at various points across the Pacific. The whole squadron of American warships, he came to open a sea route to China. Commodore ran the American flag up over the Bonines and made a deal with Nathaniel Savery. You see, Mr. Savery, by this document, we're paying you $50. And other benefits for this part of Port Lloyd right here. How much of the port will you require for this cooling station, Commodore Perry? It's this section right here on its chart. Mm-hmm. Set forth here. You see, it reads that our part of Port Lloyd will include the entire and both sides of the creek, which empties into the said harbor called Ten Fathom Hole. Yes. And I propose to set up an American code of government here, and have you elected by the people as Chief Magistrate. But that's the same as the United States taking over these islands, and we've been flying the British flag ever since we came here.  Yes, I was born in the United States. As of now, Mr. Savery, you will be the agent of the United States Naval Squadron. And as such, you will be attached to the Navy of the United States, and have all its privileges. The government of the United States, the people of the Bonines elected Savery as Chief Magistrate, although Savery was the British governor, he also became the agent of the United States Naval Squadron. When the British government in London learned about this, they suddenly took an interest in the Bonines. I say, by what right does Commodore Perry make a deal of this kind with our governor on the Bonine Islands? The islands were claimed by Captain Beechey and his majesty Ship Buffham in 1827. When the word got around to Commodore Perry, he had an answer. The Japanese landed on these islands 230 years before that in 1593. And the Spanish explorer, Villa Lobos, landed there 50 years before the Japanese in 1543. The question went to the American government. Perry saw the value of the Bonines to the United States. Each passing day strengthens my opinion that the large and increasing commerce of the United States with the Far East makes it not only desirable, but indispensable, that ports of refuge should be established in this part of the world. Unless we establish such ports, other powers less scrupulous may slip in and seize upon the advantage which should rightly belong to us. They listened to Perry's arguments in Washington, but that was about all. They disposed of the question once and for all. The policy of the United States is still not to accept any territory that would require the Navy to defend it. The United States is not interested in the Bonine Islands. The dispute brought the Bonines to the attention of the Japanese once more. The Bonine Islands rightfully belong to Japan. Oh yes, the Japanese saw the value of the Bonines. The Bonine Islands were discovered by Ogasa Wara in 1593. They conveniently overlooked the fact the Spaniards had discovered the Bonines 50 years before that. The United States and Britain are now cribbing over the Bonines, but the United States is fighting for its rights in civil war, and the British actually have little interest in the islands. The Japanese saw their opportunity. This is the time for us to move in. They made careful plans. They knew that Nathaniel Savry and a colony of Americans and Britishers were occupying the islands. Well, his daylight was breaking one fine morning. One of the settlers at Port Lloyd came hurriedly to Nathaniel Savry. Mr. Savry, Mr. Savry, down on the beach. What about the beach? Down on the beach, there's a whole party of harm in yourself. What is it? A whole party of strangers as he ever put them off and worried. I can't understand what they say, Mr. Savry. Men and women and children, they're strange. Well, let us go down to the beach and have a look at them. Down at the beach, they saw a ship heading out the sea. Down on the beach was a party of about 25 Japanese families. Had all the belongings with them. They'd come to say, Oh, there are people here on these islands? We've been here for more than 30 years. Oh, we did not know these islands had people on them. You people came here with the idea of living here? The captain of the ship put us off here.  Oh yes, we thought there was no one here. That ship captain didn't waste any time. Just put your party ashore and pulled out right away. Oh, yes. You can show us where we can live. I don't know what we're going to do with you. We'll have to look around and see if we can... Well, Savry had the 25 Japanese families on his hands. He had no vessel to send them away. Had to make some kind of arrangement for them. So he gave them quite a plot of land, told them to work it, raised their own food. They went to work on it and developed it. Probably Savry watched Japanese and knew what they were up to. And maybe he didn't. But anyway, one day the head of the Japanese group came to Savry. We are very happy to have you here on these islands, Mr. Savry. What do you mean, have us here? Oh, there has been a small mistake. These islands really belong to the Imperial Government of Japan. Japan? Well, we've been here for over 30 years. And Americans and British landed here before that. Oh, throw it to misunderstanding. Ogasawara landed here years ago, in 1593. From now on, these islands will be called Ogasawara Islands. But we are very happy to have you here. And under the Imperial Japanese Government, you are now the Commissioner of the Otagawa Islands. Japanese had worked out their plans well. They knew that the Government of the United States was in no position to throw them out. The Civil War was on. And as for Britain, our subjects never had any business there in the first place. The Japanese took over. From that time, they worked to make the bonings as Japanese as Japan itself. As the years went by, more and more Japanese came in. And the White Settlers really became the outsiders. You could see it was only going to be a matter of time, until no more White people would be admitted at all.  No people but Japanese will be permitted to settle in Ogasawara. Only people from Japan itself will have entry. Most of the White Settlers saw what was coming. No. There's nothing here for us anymore. These Japanese aren't going to interfere with you. All the schools are Japanese. It keeps Japanese to everyone. Whites, Japanese alike. Well, when you're in Rome, you have to do with the Romans, too. I don't want my children to go up Japanese. I'm leaving with my family. Wherever you go, you'll have to start all over. Are you going to stay? Yes. In another generation, there won't be one White person in the bonings who will be able to speak anything but Japanese. Everything about them will be Japanese. Even the way they think. No. Taking my family out. They took out a good many of the Whites who left the bonings. On the long voyages, they told me what was happening there. They told me about the people. Some of them even remembered Nathaniel's savory himself. Most of them felt his savory had felt about the coming importance of the islands. They not only felt that they'd lost the home, they'd worked for so long, but that their country had made a mistake. They're really remarkable islands, Captain. Yes. Yes, I've thought that a good many times. Take Peele Island, the main island. The beaches are beautiful. The climate's wonderful. 75 degrees all year round. And Port Lloyd on Peele Island could be made into a wonderful naval base. It sickens me, Captain. It's not only Peele Island, but 26 other islands. Probably 60 or 70 islands. Even if there were just Peele Island, it would be a valuable base for us to have. Nearly all of the settlers that I took out of the bonings felt the same way about it. One of them was a geologist. You see, Captain, the islands are high and cold and rocky. That's one of the valuable things about them. Yes, Port Lloyd on Peele Island is a sort of a shelter-cove all those hills around it. It's actually the crater of a volcano. All the bonings are a volcanic formation. You probably noticed that sometimes the sea comes surging up on the beaches. Sometimes it's so low that boats are left high and dry. I've noticed that, yes. That's because of the submarine earthquakes, upheavals and disturbances on the floor of the ocean. I recall at one of the islands I saw one year was missing when I came back the next year. That's happened a number of times. The smaller islands have changed in the passing centuries, but the Japanese have shown that they know the value of the bigger islands. Yes, I remember when they gave all of them Japanese names. They named them after members of the family, father, mother, elder sister, younger brother and so on. Members of the family? Yes. They named Peele Island Chichi Jima, which means father island, and they named another Ha Ha Jima, which means mother island, and still another Ototo Jima. In those last years when I called in the Lottie D at Port Lloyd, I got to know Mr. Hunakara quite well. He was a typical Japanese official, pleasant, a little conscious of the responsibility of his office and sort of always a little standoffish. It didn't occur to me until the day he told me that the islands were there after be closed to all foreign ships, that in the several previous visits he cleverly avoided showing me around the island, as he'd always done before. I am so sorry, Captain, that the pressure of official business keeps me at my best. Oh, sure, sure. I understand, Mr. Hunakara. I'll just take a look around myself, you know, stretch my legs. You will find some of the streets and roads are torn up, if you will be good enough to wait until tomorrow, perhaps I shall have the pleasure of showing you around. When the next day came, there were other excuses why he couldn't spare the time with me. And so it went till sailing time came. I never got outside of Port Lloyd. When the war broke out in the Pacific, the attention of important men turned to the Bonines. Did you notice any changes in the islands in the course of your last few calls, Captain? Well, I remember that the tops of the hills looked changed. Many of them had been graded off. There were installations on them. Did you see any gun mounts? No, I didn't actually see the guns, but now that I look back, I'm sure that those were heavy gun emplacements on tops of the hills commanding the approaches. What about airfields? There were always planes over the islands, but I never got inside to see if there were airfields. They must have made an early start on fortifying the Bonines. I remember seeing quite a number of soldiers in Port Lloyd. That confirms what we've thought for a long time. Japan pledged at the Washington Conference in 1922, not to fortify the Bonines, but she fortified them anyway. Japan knows that the Bonines command her southern approaches. As a matter of fact, Port Lloyd is the only harbor of any importance between Guam and Japan. You've sailed in and out of that harbor many times. Would you say, Captain, that it has possibilities as a naval base? Oh, it's an excellent harbor. They were working on it when I made the last call there back in 1939. They've probably worked on it a great deal more in the years since then. Undoubtedly. How many Japanese would you say were there in 1939? Oh, about 5,000 civilians. 5,000. And there's no telling how many troops were there. It's my guess that we're going to have to keep our eyes on the Bonines. For the next few months, I was so busy that I didn't have a chance to think of the Bonines. The Japanese took the Philippines and Singapore and the Dutch Indies. And the Bonines were thousands of miles behind their lines. And during those months in the Lottie D, we carried war supplies to the southwest Pacific. We kept on carrying them until this happened. Hard-right rudder! Oh, speed ahead, Mr. Martin! Hard-right rudder! I can see how badly we're hit. The meat on the Lottie D, the second torpedo, exploded under the bridge. At almost immediately the focus of most of the tops I had forwarded were in flames. She started to settle. The captain gave the order to abandon ship. But he refused to leave the vessel until every man, all who were living, were in the boats. The Lottie D sank in a few minutes. It wasn't until we got the captain into our boat that we saw how badly burned he was. Well, we talked about everything. During those days we were drifting, about our hometowns, people we knew, going to Sunday school, experiences we'd had, women, places we'd been, everything. The captain told about the many ports he'd called on. On the fifth day, he started telling about Port Lloyd and the Bonine Islands. He talked about the Bonines, all the things I've told you, for nine days, how they looked, the harbors and the hills, about the people, about the savoury and Mazzaro and all the rest, and how the Japs came there and took over. On the fourteenth day, he started to get worse. We did everything for him we could. On the seventeenth day, he died. We slid him over the side. If he could have lived four days more until we were picked up, he'd probably be here now. He made the Bonine Islands mean something to me, something special. I watched the war move back toward the Bonines. The way and truth are being blasted by waves of American bombers. I watched them push westward, through the marshals and over the Carolines, back toward the Bonines and Japan. I traced their progress on the map. There's a storming forward on Saipan in the Malleon, just 1400 miles from Japan. Strong American formations of bombers have struck at Bonine Island. The advanced space of the Japanese is just two hours flying time from the coast of Japan. As the captain said, maybe one of these days we'll find out that that fellow's savory and Commodore Perry were right about the Bonine Islands. As the war closes in on them, greater importance attaches to them. The importance is not only immediate, but also of long reign. To tell the significance of the Bonine Islands and the broad Pacific picture, the national broadcasting company presents Willard Price, noted authority on the Pacific, and writer of Japan's Islands of Mystery, Mr. Price. Japan began this war with one great advantage. She already possessed stepping stones to the equator, the Bonine Islands, Marienas and Carolines. Japan was a small comet with a great tail. California is about the size of Japan and lies in the same latitude. Suppose California possessed a string of islands stretching all the way to the equator, so that no one from the other side of the Pacific could get at Mexico, Guatemala, Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Panama, Colombia, or any other country this side of Ecuador without California's consent. Or suppose New York were a sovereign state plotting aggression against lands to the south and protected by an island barricade extending all the way to Brazil. Then you get an idea of how Japan's Great Sea Wall of 1500 islands reaching to the equator covered her conquest in China, Indochina, Thailand, Burma, the Philippines, Malaya, Singapore, and even shut off part of the Netherlands Indies. So completely guarding Japan's operations that we were forced to go away around Robin Hood's barn to Australia before we could get started toward Japan. The islands are like the spirit screen that stands just inside the front door of a Japanese house. The spirit screen is always plumb in the middle of the vestibule. As you come in the front door, you must turn either to the right or to the left and go around this screen to get into the house. Its purpose is to keep out evil spirits. The superstitious Japanese believe that an evil spirit can travel only in a straight line. So when a devil enters the door, he bumps into the spirit screen and bounces back outdoors. Japan's labyrinth of South Sea islands was a spirit screen that Japan relied upon to keep the foreign devils from getting to Asia. And for two years, it bounced us back. We had to go around it, either on the left by way of Australia or on the right by way of the Aleutians. But now, at last, we are breaking straight through the screen. The foreign devils are at the throats of the suns of heaven. Like Arthur's flames are pulverizing Palau, and yet our troops have landed on Saipan and our task force has shelled the Bonines. It is not likely that we will ever again forget the importance of this screen of islands. We never took them seriously before because we heard little about them. Japan did not encourage foreign visitors. Only through pressure from the League of Nations was I able to arrange passage and then the Japanese tried to make the trip turn out badly. What I saw was, of course, made available to our Navy. One must see the islands to realize the size of the Navy's job. Our newspapers announcing victories may give us the impression that we have almost won the island world of Micronesia. But the hard fact is that we still have just about a thousand islands to clean up. Many can be bypassed. Many cannot. Japan's islands will be a thorn in our flesh for the better part of another year. But after that, they will be a rose in our hair, a plume in our helmets. We shall have them to thank largely for our triumph over Japan. True, the final blow may come from the China coast. But long before we get bases on the China coast, we shall be bombarding Japan around the clock from the Marianas and Bonings. It may begin this summer. As I stood on the ship's deck in the Boning Harbor of Port Lloyd, set in an ancient crater surrounded by low hills and a busy Japanese town from which small boats were putting out to the ship, bearing people who spoke Japanese, but showed in their features American, British, Danish, or Italian ancestry, I thought of Commodore Perry on the deck of his paddle wheel warship in this same harbor, receiving the Samuel Saverian board and saying to him, Savery, these islands are in a position to dominate Japan. I want you to help me hold them for that purpose. Savery did his best, but only now is his dream and Perry's coming true. A few months more, we'll see the Marianas and Bonings become springboard to Tokyo. After the war, the Japanese inhabitants should be sent back to Japan. Those of partly American or European blood may be allowed to remain if they wish. They will no longer suffer cruel discrimination. For years, Boning girls of American descent have been abducted to the Yoshihwaras of Japan. That will stop. The strategic location of the Bonings will make them suitable as a control station for the Western Pacific. The government will probably be American. But whether it is American, British, or international, it will be a government by free men for free men. And the Samuel Savery's ghost will be happy. Thank you, Willard Price. You have been listening to the Pacific Story presented by the National Broadcasting Company and its affiliated independent station as a public service to clarify events in the Pacific and to make understandable the cross currents of life in the Pacific Basin. A reprint of this Pacific Story program is available at the cost of ten cents. Send ten cents in stamps or coins to University of California Press, Berkeley, California. Written and directed by Arnold Marquess. The original musical score was composed and conducted by Thomas Paluso. Your narrator, Joseph Kern. This program came to you from Hollywood. This is the National Broadcasting Company.


'm satisfied with the EIR and the addendum. Thanks, Adam. John, any comments specifically on the EIR? No comments specifically on the EIR and I support it. Thanks, John, appreciate you. Michael, any comments specifically on the EIR? Nope. Cool, the only comment I had is I wonder about the eucalyptus tree. Could we add a condition to the EIR that that be saved or an arborist be engaged to either relocate it before the construction of North Parkway? Does that make sense, Amy? Kind of what I'm asking there. I think my suggestion would be if there's a condition related to a tree that that would be attached to the minor design review resolution and not the EIR addendum. Okay, that makes sense, yeah. Drew, it's a massive eucalyptus tree. Relocation is not an option. So you can add an arborist. It's not an option. And I think the main concern is that it's also in the footprint of the potential North Point extension. Yeah, that's why I just was trying to, my wheels were spinning like, could you move it as part of the project? Yeah. I'm certain it could be mitigated somehow, but it would take a hundred years. But it would, is that also overstepping our sort of land use planning bounds as well? I think so, yeah, yeah, cool question. Michael, you had a question. Essentially, Amy or Connor? I was just gonna say it sounded like the threat to the tree was the North Point Parkway extension. And it's probably better for us to stay away from that. That's just my point. Yeah, good. Yeah, that's, and I appreciate that. Any other? Yeah, if the tree is not on the site, then we couldn't add a condition. Okay, well, that answers that. Yeah, I thought it was just on the site, but that makes total sense. It's kind of out of our purview. It's part of traffic and engineering. It's, yeah, it's, so I misunderstood, I guess the location of that tree. I thought it was right on the kind of the Southeast corner there. Cool, all right, so seeing no other comments. Michelle, I'd like to do a roll call vote, please. Great. Board Member Birch? Aye. Board Member McHugh? Aye. Board Member Sharon? Aye. Board Member Wicks? Aye. Board Member Wolski? Aye. And Chair Weigel? Aye. The resolution passes with six ayes with Vice Chair Hedgepath recusing itself. Perfect, all right, so what that now means is we'll move to the design review resolution. And so I'd like to entertain a motion from the Board on that to move that forward and then we'll do design commentary specifically on that. So turn it back over to the Board here to entertain a motion on the resolution two listed in your packet. I just want to jump in here and say that when we move this resolution, we wanna make sure to reference that the modifications to the exhibit A that were read into the record by staff today. Correct, yeah, I think we can handle that either in the initial motion maker if they choose to do that or by friendly amendment. So anyway, I'm gonna turn it back over to the Board here to make a motion as they see fit. I'd like to make a motion. I'd like to make a motion that we approve the resolution of the design review Board of City of Santa Grandin, the minor design review approval for Stoney Point flats apartments, a two and three story, 50 unit multifamily affordable housing project located at two, two, six, eight Stoney Point roads, Santa Rosa wave further reading of the text but include the amendments and the addendums that is before in this or follows in this resolution. I got a second from John. Excellent. So let's go to comments from the Board. So Sheila, now you can comment on the design of the project. Thanks. So I already went over the site plan, the eucalyptus, thought about the pool and it looks like there's that, it's a sport court, a half court. I don't know if there's a possibility of even making it a multi-sport court. It's pretty small, but at least finding a way to, I don't know, not everyone's an athlete. So if there's a way, I've seen some with like big checkerpieces on them and things like that. So it's not just, hey, you play basketball or I'm sorry, you don't play basketball, you can't play here. Those are some thoughts I had. The fencing question, I don't know, I understand the desire to maybe keep it natural.  And I would not equate a fence with a vehicular gate. I don't like those at all. So I would welcome more discussion on the fence. I thought from the previous iteration to the current iteration, the leasing office elevation was improved by lowering that roofline. And it was much more aesthetically pleasing to me. The color palette, I prefer this one to the previous one. I still thought the fighting was a little dark. I thought what I read from the previous minutes was that it was going to be a lighter grade, but maybe it's not coming through to me. Okay, those are my comments. Thank you. Thanks, Sheila. We're going to go to Adam now. Sorry, no, Henry, my bad. I too am disappointed that the pool has gone away. I think the trade-off and not disturbing potential land that was in question of having to go through further mitigation might be a good reason for that. But I share for members, Wolenski's, Wolenski's, thoughts on that it's a really nice amenity to have, can also be used for firefighting. And I hope other projects don't just abandon it because of our current drought situation. You know, once it's full, maintaining that and keeping it capped off is good. But I think also the benefit from all age groups, and I think even with that, even seniors can benefit from doing water aerobics. And there's other aspects that are beneficial to pools. And I like to see them, especially added and creates a real nice amenity for all age groups and that are occupying the apartments. Don't have to travel across town to go to another pool, get to the Findlay Center. And I think that's a good thing to do. I think it's a good thing to do. You know, if you're going to walk into the apartments, don't have to travel across town to go to another pool, get to the Findlay Center or somewhere else where they'd have to travel to. So I wish I'd had it a back connection. You know, the circulation and the difficulties of the site. Then I get weighed up by its need and creating more housing I think while it's difficult, now maybe there's a future solution that the traffic and engineering and the owner of the project as it's developed will make it more suitable for ingress and egress. I'm okay with the color palette as proposed. I think that the rep building even I think it's been improved. I think it kind of addressed some of my concerns that it was a little bit ordinary and kind of detached from the look of the rest of the project. I think it's much better integrated in its new iteration. I like the project before. I like the three-story buildings before. I still like it. I think it's a very nice solution and we'll make a nice increase in housing units in Santa Rosa. So that's my comment. Thanks, Henry. Now we're going to go to Adam. Okay. Great. Thank you. First off, thanks for presentations and explanations. Thanks for also, since I've gotten more views of this than the rest of the board. And thanks. I've seen in just in the past week, some of my comments from last week were incorporated and explained a little more detail tonight. So that goes to show that you guys are the applicant team is really thinking about and responding to the comment, the process. So thank you for that. And so for this week with a little more of the design feedback, yeah, I don't have too much because I do like the iteration that you've brought to us. And one thought with the fencing, I'm glad to hear more of the explanation of the hedging that you're proposing and what you, you know, the density and, you know, I'm confident with your sample plant and pallet that you will have dense evergreen shrubs and hedges there to mitigate the headlights on the north side. And my question last week, I don't know if anyone else wondered, but it is a continuous hedge the entire way. So and this week I did go out on site again and was looking around with more of this in mind. And I do think that the hedging will will be sufficient. And, you know, even in some of the, there was a comment in some of the public comment, the emails that we received about how potential with walls for graffiti and issues of that. And I do feel that the hedge is a, you know, talking about friendship walls is very much a softer, better way to, to, to delineate that side of the site. And I think that with your intention and you explain the design intention of providing a thick hedge, I think it'll be great. I think it's a good solution. And I do think that a lot of your choices with these iterations and through these meetings have responded well to concerns. I guess I should reference the pool since everyone's been talking about it. I'm agnostic actually. I do agree with Sheila and her point about making things as much as possible. I do think the basketball court, as it is, is, you know, a singular use. I do think a pool is singular use too. They take up a lot of space, expensive to maintain. Things break down. But they're also really great. So, you know, I think that that's a, you know, I'm confident in your reasoning behind that. But I do think that with the spaces that you have making them as multi use as possible will be great. Moving down to the south side of the property. My comment last week about melding into the existing riparian vegetation. You know, hearing a bit more of the design thinking behind that, you know, satisfies that as well. In terms of fencing on that side there, you know, it is a bit of a sketchy situation these days on that creekway. But I think that having the activated space that you're going to be putting in here, people is going to, it's going to activate the pathway a lot more. There's going to be a lot more eyes on the pathway and eyes on the creek and it's going to be an asset. That being said, I do think that since you're encouraging families and family, you know, uses here with the recreation areas, the instead of having fencing along there, I would want to see the plantings on that south side to be dense enough and layered enough that they are going to provide good separation. There's going to be a lot of people using that path there. I know there's dog walkers there. There's people using it, some that will live in this development, some that don't. And so I think that it will be very useful to have a, you know, a, think about it like a permeable barrier. Having a multi-layered, you know, not like the hedge on the north side, but having a multi-layered both visually, height-wise, depth-wise of that with those plantings on there will, one, be an ecological benefit to the creekway and also be a safety and visual benefit both to the creek and to the to the development. So since it's not specifically, you know, we don't go into the really fine grain on the planting plan there, or else I see some, but I would want to see a really robust planting pallet along that south side, make it dense. It's a lots of variation in height and depth. So in terms of design concerns, yeah, you, the questions that I had last week, I feel like we're answered. And yeah, thank you for responding to concerns and thank you for doing your best to listen to our concerns and to concerns of the public. And I would be very interested to see how the traffic concern is solved. So thank you, and that's all from me now. Thanks, Adam. John. Thank you, Chairman Weigel. I too am sorry to see the pool ago. I, you know, this is a project for families, and I think a pool would have been a wonderful addition. But I understand your situation. I understand the dynamics. I like the design. I liked it before. I like it now. I like the color pallet before, and I like the one we have now. So I'm very supportive of the project. I'm glad you're doing it. With this is a type of project that we need, not only here, but throughout the city. And so I am excited to move forward with this. I think it's a great project. And thank you for your diligence and for the work that you've done to try to meet the comments and objections to the people that surround the project. I think once it's built, it's going to be a wonderful addition to the local community in spite of what some of the neighbors may have suggested. So that was conclude by my remarks. Thanks, John. I appreciate that. I just, Amy pointed something out to me, and I noticed as well. I noticed that there have been a couple of members of the public that have had their hands raised in Zoom here for a while. As much as I would love to hear what you guys have to say, public, the public hearing component has been closed. So I, you know, like I said, I'd love to hear what you have to say. I mean, I think we've made that pretty apparent that we enjoyed public comment. So I'd like to grant you more time, but I can't within the requirements of a public hearing. So that being said, if you do not like what occurred tonight, that we approve the EIR, that we approve the design review, whatever, you can appeal. I believe you can appeal this to City Council. And it's, I think there's a 10-day appeal process. And I'm sure City staff can help you with that if you want to do that. So I did notice the hands raised, but unfortunately we can't take further comment. Do I have that right, Michael? As a former chair of the board, is that correct? Yeah, I believe so in this. Here's the thing. We, the public hearing was the EIR. If there are comments that are germane to the minor design review, that would be, to me, that would be acceptable. I think that the public hearing on the EIR addendum is the public hearing is closed, the vote's been taken, but if there are comments on the design of the project, they may be okay, but that gets tough because we got to parse that in the first 15 seconds of a comment. So that's a really good point, but it looks like Amy's going to weigh in here. I'm sorry I interrupted your comments for that, but maybe go ahead. I just wanted to clarify that the public hearing is actually for minor design review. So normally we don't require a public hearing for minor design review. It typically goes to the city's zoning administrator as a public meeting item. We still always have the opportunity for the public to comment and have the three-minute time limitation, but together this project was noticed as a public hearing. That would include the EIR addendum and the minor design review, and staff chose to elevate this item to the design review board as a public hearing based on public interest to just provide this platform. That's right because this type of project would normally be exempt from major design review as part of the Resilience City ordinance measure because it's an affordable housing project in a priority development area. Am I correct? Because any housing project within our priority development areas of which the Roseland area does qualify for reduced review authority for design review. So what typically would have come to this board now goes to the zoning administrator. However the director has the opportunity to elevate it to the design review board as we did in this case. Which is what exactly happened. Okay cool. So thanks so much for that Amy. Sure. Michael thanks for your comments on that. So actually we're going to come back to you for your design comments on the project now. Perfect. Well I'm going to say that I'm agnostic or about the pool. I do think it's a tough trade-off but I do appreciate the trade-off. I think that the applicant was really responsive to a lot of our site layout comments and I really appreciate that. I do like that the attitude about preserving the space to the east was really something that they took on. It wasn't even necessarily a comment of ours. There's so many great things about this project, the net zero, the solar. I love losing the fences as they were. I love the hedge on the north side of the property. I do think that even as Adam commented and maybe even to Sheila's point about parent comfort, not an impermeable fence but something that does demarcate a boundary is going to discourage a certain amount of people from coming onto the property and it's going to discourage a certain number of people from leaving the property. It does set a precedent. I think one of the really great things about this project even on the tight site is that I think the way the applicant has treated the creek, they've taken advantage of an opportunity to have a natural setting that should, we hope, improve over time with creek improvements and trails and lots of things that we all hope will continue to be priorities for the city and make sure that these kinds of resources are preserved and improved at a level that they can be enjoyed by the public as natural settings. I think that if this was a little pocket site with no open boundary to a resource like the creek, it would be one thing but I think in this case they've taken great advantage of how they've designed the project to use the creek as a really great opportunity to have an open piece on the side. I know if I was a 10 or 12 year old living at this project, I would absolutely love to go explore the creek. Maybe more than I would love to be in the pool. I like the way that they've used the site and I like the way that this has gone. I think that the hedge on the north side will absolutely mitigate headlights across the next 150 or 200 feet of open lot in that direction. Fences, the other thing I would say is fences are very California. It's a bit of a California phenomenon and I think that trying to be open and trying to be permeable and using the site as being able to see in and out of the site is really really good. Other than that, I do have one grumpy comment. I don't know if we could bring up the image of the rendering of the leasing building at the front of the project. My grumpy comment, it's fantastic that we sort of lost that big sort of national parks, large restroom building in the middle when I think that all went really well. But I'm still feeling like these restrooms that are adjacent to the leasing entry are just a little bit of a strange detail and I'm not sure if maybe the contemporary character doesn't want to wrap that corner of the building. It may diminish the views from the second floor apartment, which is what I think that is up there. But I'm just wondering, it just seems a little squatty and dark and I'm just wondering if as the sort of entry point to this project that has this combination of looks, if we don't want to sort of emphasize that character there, the shed roof and the bathroom windows, it does look like those are the restrooms and they're right in front of the project. So I think they could probably be masked or disguised with maybe just a bit of trickery around continuing that contemporary gesture around the corner. It's a suggestion. It's something that I have kind of been looking at since we first saw the project and if there was a way to give that a little bit of, I don't know, sense of entry flair, it might be more interesting. That's my only negative comment, otherwise I think this is a great project. I'm enthusiastic to vote in favor of the minor design review and those are my comments. Thanks, Michael. Yeah, I actually, I keyed up on that, the restroom thing too. I wonder if it makes sense to actually condition it with a shell because there actually is a vernacular that occurs at the stair towers of the bigger buildings with a different panel and a different color. And I wonder if that's the treatment that could happen there because there's also like a mail room entrance, right? So you could play up that little component a little bit, accentuate the mail entrance for those that live here. So it's not like kind of just this thing that's tucked under a shed roof. So I wonder if maybe that's the solution utilizing kind of the parts and pieces that the applicants already given us in terms of the gray, the gray color party panel with kind of the overhang that exists with the bracket. That might, to me, give that secondary entrance feel to the mail area and then also accentuate the bump out, creating kind of a fun corner approach as you as you move into the project. Yeah. So, but beyond that, I don't have any other comments, design comments. I did have a quick question for staff. I while everybody was talking, I was listening and I went down a bit of a rabbit hole in our design guidelines and also the center was a creek design guidelines. So the quick question I had was, is because this a butt's Rosalind Creek, is it the hold-in to the creek design guidelines? Or is that specific? That's specifically for Santa Rosa Creek, I think, right? Either Connor or Amy. Yeah, can you repeat your question? And I might call on Steve Brady to respond to this one? Who? Oh, sorry, Steve Brady, are you available to respond to this? And can you also re-state your question? Oh, yeah, yeah, I was just like, so I was looking at the Santa Rosa Creek design guidelines, which appear to be specific to just Santa Rosa Creek. But it does indicate Rosalind Creek and some other things on some of its mapping, and I didn't have the time to read the whole thing. But there were a couple of things in there that I'm just curious if the project is beholden to those creek design guidelines because it does a butt a creek, albeit not Santa Rosa Creek. Hi, yes, this is Steve Brady from the City's Torm Modern Creek program. And yes, my understanding is the Santa Rosa Creek design guidelines were initially intended just for Santa Rosa Creek. But I think since that time, it has been expanded to other areas. And I don't know if anyone in planning has anything to add or clarify. My understanding is that the proposed project is subject to the Rosalind Creek restoration concept plan. And I am not sure of a Santa Rosa Creek design guideline. And as it relates to this project. So I can't say that the Rosalind Creek, I can't talk about that plan. But if somebody else could chime in for me, that'd be great. I would just add, Connor, you are correct that the Rosalind Creek restoration plan sort of supersedes everything. I think where the design guidelines can sometimes come into play is if there is like an entryway or some of the trash cans, if you were having, if your project included a creekside trail or something like that. But would this fall under the purview of the Citywide Creek Master Plan that the Waterways Advisory Committee is tasked with? Because we looked at it in terms of that last week. Yes, that's correct. Kind of the overriding document, I guess, if there is a document. Yes, and I'm just going to add in that to my knowledge, the Santa Rosa Creek design guidelines are specific to the Santa Rosa Creek. There might be some general principles in there that could be applied to other creeks within the City. But our practice isn't to review this document for projects that are not Santa Rosa Creek. But like Board Member Sharon mentioned, we do review projects for consistency with the Citywide Creek Master Plan and also the Creekside Development Standard from the Center for it. Well, thanks. The reason I bring it up is I think it's important to note so this bigger document exists for the Santa Rosa Creek, which is a large waterway within our City. And it talks about some different things. And I thought it was kind of one of the items that I thought that the project did well. It says, buildings shall be sited and designed to take advantage of creek views. Views from adjacent priorities toward the creek must be maintained through the use of notch corners or building setbacks. And so the building, you know, it pushes and pulls, it faces the creek. I just, I thought it was important to note that I think even though I don't think the applicant used the creek, Santa Rosa Creek guidelines, they actually did use it in a way in terms of how they addressed the creek. And I think that's important to note that they're trying to be sensitive to that. And so that's why I had to, that's kind of why I went down a little bit of a rabbit hole there and looking at applicability. Because I just heard, you know, comments about the creek. And so of course, being the knowledge hunter that I am sometimes, I just kind of went down that path. And then finally, my last comment would be about the fencing conditions. I think we might maybe do a consider on the fencing. And I think what we could do is the design guidelines under multifamily residential specifically call out a height for solid fencing between private yards and common open space, which is different than kind of the normal height that we have our six foot good neighbor fence height. So the design I would say limit of solid fencing between is four and a half feet in height. If six feet is desired, the top 18 inches could be a lattice or other structure to allow vision in and out. So I think, you know, maybe there's an option there for the applicant to utilize a slightly lower fence so it doesn't feel as as imposing, as they expressed a concern to try to make their project feel a little open, but also kind of potentially create a barrier for security, maybe on the the creek side for the kiddos, you know, maybe, you know, something just give them the option and flexibility to find a solution that works for them and also, you know, potentially the community around them, you know, that that isn't, you know, like, hey, here's an eight foot fence kind of solution. So that's those would be my comments. So just to circle back. So I think that we have a fence condition consideration that will condition the project with a drew just to clarify that specific to the south side. Yeah, yes. Well, I mean, I think you could do it both the north side and the south side and just give them the flexibility to pick and choose with some, you know, we put some bumpers around it, I guess, in terms of, hey, look at the design guidelines that say four and a half feet kind of thing. That's what I was thinking. So anyway, so that if everybody would agree, I think a fence condition is appropriate. It sounded like the building, like we were talking about Michael would be a condition. And then Adam, I was digging down the rabbit hole, but did you have a planting condition you wanted to include that I heard?  But I don't believe that we need to have a condition because I think that they're on top of it. It just mainly to submit my comments that having that robust buffer. Very good. I think maybe we should condition it, but we could do it as a consider as opposed to a shall that way. Again, you're confident that they're providing that. But, you know, just an extra emphasis, you know, consider robust buffering landscape buffering along the south side. You know, or something like that. And then this gives the applicant the flexibility. Yeah, I think it considers fine. And then we can hear what they have to say about that when we consider. Okay, so I'm going to wrap these up again, see if I heard them right. So one, consider robust landscape buffering along the creek corridor. Let's call it that. Does that sound good, Adam? I think that gets the point across, you know, very varied in height, layered in height and depth. How about that? Okay. Robust while layered in height than depth. Layered in height. Okay. And then the second one would be consider four and a half foot high fences for security and safety on the north and south sides of the parcel. Is that cool with everybody? Okay. And then the last one would be shall redesign the corner. North elevation of the north elevation of the of building a using the stairway architecture of the buildings B and C. Maybe does that sound. And I think it could be anything. I think it could be the stairway building or the contemporary. It's just, I just, I think that the corner needs the entry point needs a bit more flair. So any of those materials could be good. And I think it would be some, it would be great if it was something that was not the green kind of contemporary character. And so your stairway comments really good, but it could even just be a different use of roof material. So I don't quite know how to get that in to give them some flexibility and we'll have to hear their comments on it too. Yes. So those are, those would be, I was, I was going to ask, sorry, you're going to get to protocol here. And I was just curious if we could hear from the architect on listening, having listened to our comments, if he could give us his, his or her idea on, on how taking, taking our comments into mind, how you might come up with on the off the cuff solution to this. Yeah, that you just beat me to it. I was going to, I was, yeah, I was just making sure that we, so those are the three conditions that everybody wants. Everybody's cool with them and they're there anymore before we do that. I'd like to, to qualify the fencing, an endem with, because I, I would want to make certain that the I don't basically don't want to wall off any of this site. I want to have something of saying that we're, we're looking for something that is visually permeable. As you know, it's, we're not blocking here. It's, it's a light airy fence somehow, just to rather than to provide, I don't know, to provide a wall, to provide some visual separation. There's probably, well, there's definitely a more eloquent way to say that. So I think you would, I think you would just say consider, consider four and a half foot max height fence on the north and south property lines to provide physical, physical boundary, but visual transparency. Maybe. Okay. I think it sounds good to everyone else. I saw some naughty people nodding when I said that my part as well. I just, I, you know, I'm honestly just, I'm sort of smitten with the idea of the redwood posts and the rope. I just want to, I like the idea of defining a boundary, but keeping it more open. And I start to hear four and a half foot fence. And I, you know, it gets to be a lot about four and a half, four and a half foot max boundary, boundary element. Do we need to, do we need to provide a measurement or can we just say to, you know, provide some, some boundary? Yeah, that would be up to the applicant. Let's, let's, so let's, so they're, let's, we can quibble about that all night. Does anybody have any other conditions they want to add? Or are we good? I just want to clarify real quick one of the conditions that I heard. More robust buffer of landscape on the south side. I know we received a public comment that requested additional landscaping on the north side. Do we want to include that in the consider or are we going to leave that out of it? I think the, do you want to address that? The hedge on the north side is fine. And I think Michael mentioned that as well. Thank you. Yeah. And I would agree. I was confident with the applicant's response to how they were addressing light and stuff. I mean, when they said they're going to put a mature shrub in there, I mean, that's like, that's the answer, right? Because you're going to get the solution that you want immediately. Instead of like, yeah, maybe it'll grow kind of thing. So, okay, so I want to circle back to the applicant. Do our conditions sound doable to you guys? Any changes, adjustments? One second while we elevate them. Thank you. Thank you. Keith, I would ask you to speak on the amenity building with some ideas that you might have. Yeah. My only concern is that I don't want to be pigeonholed into trying to use that language that we have above the stairs. I'm afraid because over there on the three-story building where we've utilized that and in between the windows and kind of all the buildings, it's a smooth like hardy panel. And I'm afraid that that loss of texture between the horizontal siding next to the entry, there's not that wouldn't be that much contrast between the green and that lighter gray color. So I'm afraid I might get a little washed out. Would you be open to maybe trying to achieve something more with a bigger landscape gesture there and turn to some height or like a living wall or maybe even just turning and turning some along that turns the landscape that returns back to the kind of the green entry element? So you don't have that hardscape to building transition there? That could be really good. I thought about landscape. And the other thing is that the composite roof that I think I'm seeing there, it may be more appropriate. And I think Drew might have even referenced this with the stair towers, just what the stair towers look like. I'm seeing what appears to be a standing seam roof on those first level stair covers. And I mean, I just think a couple of little gestures that make that more of a feature point. And I was looking at what were other elements that were already in the design. I think that landscape and a standing seam metal roof and just something that felt more like the front door than the mailroom and the restrooms is good. I don't know how we condition that for you. But yeah, it doesn't have to be one specific thing or specifically the green contemporary form. But any of those things would probably work to just give it that special moment that's attached to the entry point. So we're also I don't think we're not currently proposing any type of signage for the project. Maybe there's an opportunity to put the name of the project on that wall underneath those bathroom windows. And it's a graphic element that incorporates a punch of color along with more landscaping something like that. I think all those things combined might do it. Yep. Okay, Henry, you had a thought, an additional thought? Yeah, I think it's just a shed element of that. It just seems out of place with the rest of the design. And you're going to cringe. And I'm speaking to you, Mr. Architect. The the my my thought was putting a deck over over it. There's there's it could be utilized by the apartment. It could give it just a little bit different form. It doesn't it doesn't add a form of a shed shed roof that isn't supported by your your die. The poster not square with the ground. I forget my terminology here. Forgive me. But I'm just wondering if you would entertain a perhaps a deck element. So it's it's got a flat roof. Or just do a flat roof and put your signage on it and and add the landscaping as as word member Birch was talking. So I think maybe a flat roof there potentially, maintaining the grain and incorporating the landscaping signage might be the answer. I think the deck those are two different units right there.  So that might be a little difficult. But I think I could see a flat roof there. Sure.  But you know, living roof potentially to make making the roof actually have your signage in the face of the building. The flat roof is a living roof that has, you know, some of that riparian vegetation, you know, native vegetation, you know, riparian, of course, is not going to survive on the roof. But, you know, you your landscape architect confidence palette, you'd be able to figure it out. It's, you know, that could be also another visual real striking entrance, something like that. I think I've got a way to maybe condition this that Keith that gives you guys some options. Okay. So we'll say, we'll say shall. Because we want it to happen, right? So we'll say shall redesign the mailroom and bathroom bump out exterior elevation on building a and so we're telling you redesign and then we and then we can say uh possible, possible alternatives are changing cladding, changing roof type, addition of vegetation either on the roof or on the wall, addition of building signage. And then boom, that gives you lots of flexibility. It gives staff something really concrete that they can go, Oh, well, here are some options. Here's what they did. It doesn't look like what was done originally. And then that gives you the flexibility to play with it to make it work within your budget and what the client desires. Sounds good. Cool. All right. So while Connor or Amy are writing those up, anything else further? Applicant, anything else? Either the fence or the vegetation comments or you guys consider me if you'd like to take a look at it. But you know, if you don't do it, it's not the end of the world kind of thing. Absolutely. Out of respect, we'll take a look at everything. I think the fence, I hear the concerns on the creek side. I don't know that we would get there on the northern boundary with that hedge, but certainly happy to look at it. And the robust landscaping, you know, certainly that is absolutely something that we will be considering within our final landscape plan. So it works. It works with where we're going. Perfect. Yeah. Awesome. So Connor slash Amy, do you guys have the conditions ready to read back so we can get them read into the record and approved by the motion or the second or before we vote? Yeah. So please correct me if I misrecorded anything. So we have a shawl redesigned the exterior elevation on building a and the options are changing of cladding, changing of rooftop, introduction of new landscaping and introduction of building signage. And then I would just call it specifically north elevation. Thank you. Yeah. And I would say instead of just landscaping, you know, living roof, living wall elements. Thank you. Okay, please continue Connor.  I don't remember if we kept the height determination or the that included in the consideration. Yeah, we said no on the height. Okay, so a boundary on the north and southern property project boundaries, visually permeable and that also provides vision, visible separation. I would say physical separation physical physical. Yeah. So that again, that gives that gives the applicant the option to do the redwood posts with a rope because it's physically separating, gives them the option to do whatever they want. Basically, if they want to do something. Cool. Thank you. Really appreciate that. And then the final one is a consideration of more robust landscape buffer on the southern project boundary. And Adam, did you say something about more robust varying in height and width? Layered is in height and and layered in height, layered in height, varied and layered in height. I would, does that, that, that better? Depth and height. Yeah, I'd say layer. Layered and depth and height. Okay. So, so would someone like to propose a friendly amendment to night dad? Sorry, everybody does see my pie today. She's going to bed. So I'm sorry. I'd like to entertain a friendly amendment to our motion from someone who was neither the motioner or the seconder as big friend. I wish your daughter could make the friendly amendment. I really do. I know. Yeah. I will propose a friendly amendment to the original motion or the conditions read into the record by Planner McKay. And I believe Henry made the motion. Do you accept the friendly amendment? I accept the friendly amendment. And I believe John was the second. John, do you accept the friendly amendment? I accept the friendly amendment. Cool. So guess what that means? Friends, we get to have a roll call vote. So Michelle, I'd like to have a roll call vote, please. All right. Board Member Birch. Hi. Board Member McHugh. Hi. Board Member Sharon. Hi. Board Member Wicks. Hi. Board Member Wolskie. Hi. And Chair Weigel. Hi. All right. The resolution passes as amended with six I's and with Vice Chair Hedgepath having recused himself. Perfect. Thanks so much. So again, I noticed that. Oh, go ahead, John. Did you have another comment there? Yeah. Okay. Just adjusting. Yeah. It's so hard to tell on Zoom, you know. Okay. So I still notice that we have two members of the public with their hands raised. That item is closed now. So again, you know, it would have been great if we had, within the confines of our rules, been able to take your additional comments. Unfortunately, we cannot. In addition, you know, what we have done in the past, considering, you know, Zoom and everything is we have allowed, you know, public comment on items not on the agenda kind of as well also is not applicable here. Unfortunately. So I would encourage you both. I know you have additional things you'd love to say. And I think city staff and I think the board would love to hear them. But, you know, like I said, within the confines of the rules of our meeting, we cannot hear them. So I would encourage you to email city planner McKay or the board liaison Amy Nicholson with those concerns also, you know, so that they can be part of the project file. Obviously, you have the option to appeal the decision that was made tonight and voted on through city, through city council, which Amy is a 10 day process correct that there's 10 days for an appeal. Is that correct? Yes, that is correct. And I'm sure that our lovely staff at planning and economic development would be more than willing to help you navigate that if you so choose. We really appreciate all your comments and the fact that you guys put a petition together. We really, really, really appreciate that. But I think, you know, this was the process and the outcome was the outcome. So we encourage you to do what you feel is right as citizens moving forward. And please again, don't hesitate to reach out to members of staff. And also, you know, all of us have city emails as well. If you'd like to reach out to us, we obviously could potentially talk to the council members as well, if you'd like. So I will leave you with that. Any final comments from the board on this? So without further ado. Oh, Amy, go ahead. I just wanted to add in, I didn't want to mischaracterize anything about our time frame for the appeal process. So I was pulling up the language from the zoning code. So those need to be submitted within 10 calendar days from the date of the decision. And in this case, the an appeal of this board would go to the city council. So the actual form is available in the city clerk's office, but we have that available. And if you send us any Perfect. And I think also important to note, you said 10 calendar days, not business days. So calendar days again. So again, if you're super concerned about this, I would encourage you to email city staff to make sure you can get the process started if that's something that is important. So without further ado, we are at item 10 on our agenda, which is adjournment. So everybody have a great Labor Day weekend.  And we'll see you in a couple of weeks at our next meeting. And with that, we're adjourned.


I am Shankar Madasamy from HISTRAD and I am the charity manager and we are taking care of the overall arrangements of the PMC and overall Chandranthri activities in Sri Lanka. So today is a great full day for us, we have a great day actually for us. So the PM has come here and honourable Prime Minister has come here with us and congratulated and wonderful talk and inspired us his talk. And he has expressed his emotion also to all our scientists of HISTRA. Those who have worked very hard with the Chandranthri mission successful and the landing Vikram, lander Vikram it was landed in the soft landing with the precise soft landing. So everything has declared to the nation of the rover images also and the rover movement whatever he has done till today. So really thankful to our honourable Prime Minister. The wonderful land he has pointed out that is the Sivasakthi point on the whatever he landed the point. So he has emphasized that. So he has encouraged all of our HISTRA scientists. So thank you so much for the Prime Minister of India, long life Prime Minister. Thank you so much sir. And on behalf of our HISTRA director and all our centre directors I thank you so much. Thank you sir. Thank you so much.


This is TFNN, The Tiger, Financial News Network, update. Good morning everybody, I'm Samuel Bryan, coming to you live from TFNN, Tuesday morning, 10am Eastern time, 30 minutes into the trading day and we got right across the board, the Russell. How about it? Last week, you had the Russell getting pummeled to the negative side this morning. The Russell is up half a percent at 17.67, S&Ps are off 31 points right now, we have a hot CPI number, excuse me, we have a hot retail sales number, we got CPI last week, we have a hot retail sales number, CPI was a little hot too last week, hot retail sales number this morning, that's spooking the markets a bit, retail sales come in at 0.7%, the market was looking for 0.3%, why don't we get over to that headline right now, there you go, retail sales top forecast in a sign of durable consumer demand, putting it lightly, getting down to the numbers, 0.7% versus 0.3%, if you take out gas and autos, 0.6 versus 0.1, and the control group, 0.6 versus 0.1, hot numbers right, to put it lightly man, hot numbers in pretty dramatic fashion, now that's not the only thing we wanted to talk about man, where is the Nvidia one, there it is, so this news was teased yesterday with those restrictions coming alive, but we actually had the notes and bolts this morning, and it looks like everybody was waiting for the details, and they don't like the details, man, Nvidia, we've been talking about it during the program, down more than $30 off 78%, US restricts, Nvidia made for China chips in new sales rules, more chips and equipment will be covered by the new restrictions, they exempt most consumer semiconductors from the controls, but nonetheless, this could be the one that really spooks this market, man, off $28, off 6% right now, Nvidia's got 2.5 billion shares outstanding folks, you're talking about almost a $75 billion market cap wipe out, still just over $1 trillion of market cap, wow, but even Apple, off 1.7%, Microsoft shares off 1.2% right now, you jump over to some of the companies with their earnings, Goldman with their numbers this morning, off by 1.4%, you jump over to Bank of America, their numbers as well, slightly in the positive, and we jump over to yields, the 10-year right now, off by 28 ticks, you jump to the 2-year right now, off by 5 ticks, almost pushing 5.2% on that 2-year, pretty remarkable. Folks, stay tuned, Basil did his program live at 8 o'clock this morning, that's coming up right now, we got live programming, coming up after that, I'm at Steve Rhodes at 11, Fast Market at 12, Larry at 1.


Hi everybody! Happy Sunday! Joe for Jaspy's CaseBreaks.com coming at you with Salo Pack number 186 to give away 10 Immaculate Basketball spots. If you're watching live, we just have to do one more of these and then we're in Brakesville on that last box of Immaculate Basketball from that case. First, the break. Big thanks to this group for getting in on it. Those of the teams right there, let's do the break. Roll it, randomize it three times and then different dice roll for the giveaway part. One, two, and three. And then three times one and two for the teams. One, two, and three. Alright, there's the first half of the list right here. There's the second half of the list right over here. Let's just print this out and rip up in this pack. It could be a surprise in that pack, you never know. Rookie silver? No. But rookie green. Anthony Edwards, insert. Red, white, and blues. Let's see what we got here. Eric Bledsoe, Ben Simmons, and Evan Fournier. So no surprises there, nothing crazy there. But let's flip back here. The main point of this is who's going to win those Immaculate spots? Let's grab everybody's names from top to bottom. New dice, new list, and good luck. Randomize that list two and a four, six times. One, two, three, four, five, and sixth, and final time. After six, so from eleven on down, sad times, but I appreciate everyone getting in on it. We do have one more of these we have to do to unlock that break, so please feel free to try again. Jaspyscasebreaks.com. We'll get it next time. Top ten happy times for Brian, Jose, Dale, Dale, David, Brian, Nicholas, Chad, Brian, and Sean. Congrats to the top ten. After six, we'll see you for that Immaculate Break. Hopefully you later tonight. Jaspyscasebreaks.com.


The State of Edge is a vendor-neutral platform for open research on edge computing as is kind of dedicated to accelerating innovation for the edge. There is now a new State of the Edge report that looks at today's edge computing ecosystem. And to discuss this report, we have with us two guests, Matt Trifero, State of the Edge Co-Chair and CMO of Viparayo and Jacob Smith, VP of Bayon Metal Strategy and Marketing at Equinix. Matt, Jacob, it's great to have you on this panel. Great to be here. It's great to be here. Thanks for having us. I kind of gave a rough idea of the State of the Edge, but I would love to hear from you folks. Jacob, you can start and tell me what is it all about. And then Matt, after that I would love to have your views also. Great. Yeah. So the State of the Edge report has a long history, almost four years now. But it's all about bringing people together around a shared vision and a shared consensus around the edge. What does it mean? What are we talking about? What's going on? And so we've produced an annual report for the last few years, but this is the first one under the auspices of the Linux Foundation and the LF Edge project. So like you mentioned, it's a vendor-neutral report.  Matt, how do you look at the State of the Edge? Yeah, so I came out of, come out of a slightly different point of view. You know, I grew up in the formation of cloud and the sort of transformation of an infrastructure. And one of the things that frustrated me as a marketer was how these terms that are very important for us to understand and define and interact with get co-opted by marketing people. And I'm a marketing person, right? So we felt it was really important to put the stake in the ground and really define what are we talking about? What edge are we talking about? Are there lots of edges? If so, do they have different names? And that was just the start of a journey. And it became, you know, really three projects. It became the open glossary of edge computing, which is a, you know, a dictionary of all the words that's open source. It's in a GitHub repo. It's the annual reports. And it's also the landscape, which is the projects and companies that are in the edge computing world. And now we're part of the Linux foundation.  Thanks for explaining that, Jacob. And now, before we talk about the report, I do want to hear from you because when we do look at edge people would define it in whatever way they want to define it, you know, those terms, you know, when you're talking about cloud computing. So I want to know from you, how would you define this computing? Are we talking about IoT devices? Are we looking at Tesla as IoT on wheels? Or are we talking about edge data centers? So let's talk about just demystify that term itself. Yeah, so there are lots of edges and lots of ways to define edges. The Linux foundation, they have a white paper that's to be downloaded for free at LFedge.org. And it has a very good taxonomy of the different edges. You know, the edge that we're mostly interested in is the edge of the last mile network. There's two sides to it. There's a service provider side. And then there's a user or device side and both are really important. And with the financial model, we did take a different approach than most of the models that are out there. It's not a total market sizing. It's a sizing of the data center infrastructure required to implement the applications and use cases on both sides of the last mile network. And I think that was just a bias that, you know, Jacob and I brought to it because, you know, we're data center people, but it turns out to be a really interesting number. Yeah, yeah, I'd add to that and that the there are lots of edges and it's kind of evolving all the time. But the one that we've always described edge computing at is where we're putting computing closer to the data or to the experiences. And so obviously there's a wide range of what that means, depending on your use case, whether it's like you said, mobility or industrial IoT or an oil rig. But where we find is that the shifting going on is around the edge of the network where the internet is kind of in its next iteration or trying to get there and pushing out further and closer to where those experiences in the data are being created. And that's the edge computing that most people are curious about.  I think you'll see in the report that it's going to keep growing and changing even more quickly than it has in the past few years. But we noticed a lot of action related to, as you can imagine, the last year of being, you know, pandemic, pandemic, pandemic size. Is that a word where everything kind of got changed and turned on its head in some ways just accelerated and and edge computing is one of those things that we all felt, you know, in our lives as we kind of interacted over the zooms and went to school and did all those things. And that's kind of accelerating the conversation. And I think helping people bring around a more common understanding. Right. So what's the focus of this report on this specific use case? And what are some of the key highlights?  Great. Let me kick us off. We decided to structure this report. You know, first of all, we got together as a committee and, you know, kind of wrestled with, well, what is this, you know, what's important this year? Right? What's important? What's going on? And what we ended up was four different main sections plus a refresh of the model that we did last year, the financial model. The four different sections that we did were based upon hardware, software, networks and critical infrastructure, sort of the main components of edge and edge computing. So we asked four different authors and had them come in and help give their perspective and research to each of those sections. And that's kind of the main structure of the report. In terms of some of the takeaways, maybe Matt, you want to speak to the highlights? Well, I also want to point out one of the things that we did last year that we did more deeply this year, it was a feature called postcards from the edge. So what we did is we invited contributions from leaders in the edge community, and offered the right of, you know, a small essay, a point of view, and we published those as kind of interstitials throughout the book. So you could actually download the white paper and just read those points of views and come away with a really interesting perspective on edge computing. Yeah, absolutely. The forecast model is the other part of the deal that I think, you know, most people pay attention to because there's a big number. And I think Matt always says it right, we know it's wrong, you know, it's just it's a forecast. And so understanding the future of, you know, what's the size of the edge computing markets, you know, we had an interesting case study here because we did a full bottoms up model last year. And then we had a year to see well, you know, what's right, what's wrong about that and kind of, you know, steer the ship in a new direction, which ends up being a pretty big number. Yeah, 180 billion dollars of data center infrastructure to support edge computing. And the big change from last year to this year was just the acceleration of edge use cases driven mostly by COVID-19. So that's that was really and the number is, again, it's built up from the from the ground up, it's built up, we look at, you know, all the different use cases and segments and the amount of compute that be required for them. And then it creates an aggregate amount of processing power in order to drive those applications and then converts that into, you know, basically kilowatts. And then that that you can use sort of standard formulas for converting kilowatts into dollars of infrastructure required to house that compute. Yeah, another big highlight was around hardware, right. So that was an area that I was particularly interested in. In 2020, we had a lot of big mergers and acquisitions announced, things like AMD buying Xilings or, you know, Nvidia buying or trying to buy ARM.  So we saw a lot of, you know, interesting hardware being produced and then being driven more and more by the influence of open source software. So open hardware too is becoming a trend. And that whole kind of, you know, physical component of how to how to deploy at the edge is a really big problem that that you can see being attacked from a number of different sides. Because it's kind of the opposite of what we've been doing in the cloud, you know, for the last, you know, 10 years putting a lot of things in a in a few places. Now the edge kind of pushes that model to a new place, which is how do you put a lot of different things in a lot of different places, especially when they're changing quickly. Right. Well, I'm also curious that what rule is because I didn't last year, if I'm not wrong, the government, you know, they released some spectrum for 5G. So what how is that helping the industry? Because that also allows you to build a lot of local networks. At the same time, I think you mentioned that, of course, acceleration because of this pandemic was there. And, you know, also focus on open hardware, open source technologies there. So can you talk about some more factors that are driving this adoption or any other kind of a specific highlight that you saw, which kind of, you know, they are like feeding into each other? Yeah, 5G is a really good example. Because 5G is not only an enabler for edge computing, it is also a consumer of edge computing. One of the big transformations in this, this G from the last G is virtualizing the network functions, which means that you can run significant parts of the telephone network, the cellular network on white box servers sitting in a data center. And those servers can do other can have other workloads running on them. Those servers could be owned by somebody else like a cloud provider. So there's a whole sort of interesting set of dynamics that are created by just rolling 5G out. And then the capabilities of 5G enable, you know, much faster communication, connecting to much a larger number of devices out on the edge, which again, will help fuel a lot of edge computing applications. When we do look at edge, how much concerns do you have, especially when we talk about networking, whether you talk about the first mile or the last mile, that people, if they don't have access to broadband, what's the point of having all these technologies around us? Well, to some extent, I, you know, that's what's the point of having a smartphone if you don't have access to spectrum. And there is, you know, a digital divide, not just in the United States, but worldwide. But one of the things that 5G is driving and some of the other innovations driving, I mean, you know, unlicensed spectrum is really interesting because it's bringing a whole new set of players in. There's a lot of open source now being contributed to edge computing. A lot of, I mean, you look at the magma project from Facebook, it's a multi-tenant evolved packet core that's open source. So I think that a lot of the things that are, the innovations that are that 5G is driving will accelerate the rollout of wireless broadband to areas currently don't have it, whether it's rural US or, you know, some other country. Yeah. And I would add that open source is a big driver of, you know, creating solutions to hard problems that are maybe niche. You know, some mass market solutions going to cover the very profitable ones where people have all the connectivity and all the reasons. But we see edge computing going in lots of different places. Matt mentioned, you know, new kinds of unlicensed spectrum. It's being deployed in disaster zones and in, you know, Native American Indian reservations and in rural communities where it's not profitable to service in normal ways. Also satellite, new kinds of connectivity. So it's definitely shifting, but I'm always fascinated, you know, by the role of open source and kind of open governance, allowing those kind of innovations to find their way into new use cases and fill in the cracks, which we're seeing, you know, low powered devices and open spectrum creating new kinds of, you know, experiences that previously, you know, you had to have major equipment and, you know, telecom deployments for. So certainly, you know, the more open that we can make certain parts of the stack, the more likely we are to bridge that digital to five. Yeah, you mentioned Native Americans and I interviewed MoralNet. They are using FreedomFi and all those open source technologies to bring connectivity there. One thing more is that you mentioned, and I sometimes feel that Linux Foundation now happened to be at the right place at the right time. So what role do you see LF edges playing? Number one is by bringing all these players who might also happen to be competitors under the same table to collaborate on these open source technologies. Number two is that since it's a big umbrella foundation, there are a lot of other projects that you leverage. Kubernetes is a good example, you know, I mean, there are Linux is there. So it also make it easy for cross pollination between industries who would not interact otherwise in the normal world. So talk about the role that LF and their LF edge is playing in in kind of furthering this adoption of open source in this space. Yeah, so I mean, open source in general, you know, everybody thinks they understand it, but they really understand the business function of open source and the reason that large companies are contributing to open source now is because there are based technologies that if we decide not to compete on, but all contribute to something that's in common and freely usable, then we can differentiate our business and products on top of that. You know, one of the great examples is like the 35 millimeter film, right? That the camera companies, you know, innovated on the cameras and the shutters and the lenses and the film companies on the emotion process and the developing process, but nobody tried to compete on the distance between the sprockets. And I think that this is just an example of that, but in much more complexity. Now, the Linux Foundation, one of the most powerful things it brings to projects is a really great governance model. So it's it's very hands off, but it's also very opinionated. And so projects that move into the Linux Foundation have an openness to them that is irrefutable. It really is a powerful governance model. And I think that LF edge in particular does two things when it helps to bring a lot of these projects together and create those cross pollinating conversations. But it also almost from a marketing standpoint, it helps bring these kinds of conversations to the top of the stack, because they're important conversations to be having because I mean, this is the next generation of the Internet. Yeah, I would agree. I think the edges and is one of the great examples of, you know, where you need an ecosystem, right? It's complex, it's specialized, you know, where you differentiate, like Matt said, is important. And so finding common standards and, you know, incubating technologies that are useful to all is a way to accelerate and to lower the cost of differentiation. So I think the ecosystem kind of culture that the, you know, Linux Foundation and the broader open source ecosystem brings is going to be especially critical to how the edge evolves, you know, and how open it is. And, you know, that's really kind of the springboard for innovation. Right. And it can also talk about if I'm not wrong, the state of edge was kind of anchor project for LFA, just the way Kubernetes was anchor for CNCF. Yeah. So the evolution, it's kind of a fun story how how the state of the edge. So when we wrote the very first state of the edge book, the first download, we had six or seven writers all working on it. And we decided that we should use the terms exactly the same way every time we use them. And that's simple things like, you know, should you capitalize it? What is, you know, what is, is there near edge and a far edge and IOT edge and a telco edge and all of it. So we built a style guide just for the guy. And I sent it around to peers of mine, saying, you know, give us some feedback. And I got overwhelmingly, oh, can I use this? Oh, here's a word you forgot all of it. So, so I called up the Linux Foundation. I said, I have a crazy idea. I don't think it's ever been done before. But what if we put the glossary into a GitHub repo, and we made it a project. So the very first, the entry point to the Linux Foundation with the open glossary of edge computing, which is exactly that. And then when the, the, the LF edge form, the open glossary was a starter project. And that's when they said to our organization, why don't you, you know, would you be willing to bring the entirety of your intellectual property over to our community and we'll help it grow and, and steward it. So we did that. So that became the, the open glossary project became a working group underneath the state of the edge. And that's the state of the edge got officially its landscape working group and its, its research working group. And Matt says organization for the state of the edge in a very broad way. We were really a collection of like-minded, you know, companies. And, you know, I think we had great traction. But it was like, like we talked earlier about the governance of, of, of the Linux Foundation and the culture there. That really injected a sense of, you know, maturity, frankly, to the state of the edge report that we were sustaining through a lot of passion for the project. And I think great shared values for it. But it's easy to have those things go away.  And so getting it into the LF edge at the ground up, I think it's going to be, you know, not only important to the LF edge project, I kind of give it a sense of, you know, you know, velocity around shared language, like Matt mentioned, but also to kind of keep true to like looking at the ecosystem in an open way, instead of a vendor specific way, which I think that that's pretty, pretty new for the Linux foundation. I mean, I wish I wish every LF umbrella group had a state of the, you know, state of the of the CNCF state of the Kubernetes ecosystem or something like that, because I would go I would read those every year. Initially, you also mentioned the predictions that were made earlier. So I want to, you know, put you as part of it. So looking at this report, what kind of predictions you are going to make, and you'll be brave enough, because I don't know if anybody said it back in that there will be pandemic and the whole world will change. But I'm sure a lot of people who said, you know, we will be doing a lot of remote work, we will be moving the cloud. See, I told you so it happened. So, so let's talk about what prediction do you have for for the next year or the coming months? Okay, well predictions are always hard.  But I think there's a few a few things about edge computing that you can kind of count on. One is that there's going to be more stuff and more places that are going to be more different and more specialized. Partially, like our mama was built on, you know, Matt said, like kilowatts and power. There's just not enough power in the world to power all the experiences we want. We have to get more specialized and more, more efficient. And so I would expect to see a lot more specialized hardware, call it the, you know, mega trend of mass customization. You know, that's going to happen over the next couple years for sure. And the edge is going to be a huge place where that happens. The other prediction I'll give you, and I stole this from a good friend of mine who said, if you're excited about 5G, wait for 6G, which the whole idea is like the use cases for the infrastructure that we build are hard to know in advance. But once they once they hit, then it kind of compels the maturity of the technology. And then you move to the next thing. We're building for the future.  But I think we'll, we'll find that sort of 5G use case, just like we found it with 4G with the, you know, the app store from Apple and the iPhone kind of made 4G relevant. And I think we'll find 5G is like killer use case over the next year or two. But then we'll be talking about 6G. Well, I'll make two predictions also. So the first prediction, I think we're already seeing the signs of, and that is this, this, this incredible acceleration of the work that's happening at the edge. And I think it's driven largely by the the awakening we all got with COVID-19 because every company that had, you know, a 10 year automation plan now has a three to five year automation plan. And so my prediction is that the companies that accelerate their automation plans will be the ones that are most successful. The other prediction I want to make is I'm going to say five years. I think in five years we're no longer to be talking about edge computing. I mean, maybe in like mining disconnected environments. But but it's just going to be the cloud and the internet. Just a new one? Or the extension of the old one. Yep. I mean, you know, it's when we get we had fiber to our homes, we didn't call it something else, but it was something else, right? So I just think I think the edge computing, the reason we talk about it as a thing today is because we need a place to gather where all this innovation is happening in a way to talk about it. But eventually I just be part of the cloud and the internet. Matt Jacob, thank you so much for a very interesting discussion about edge. And also the story behind the grocery and I'm pretty sure that soon, Matt, you will have a lot of job at your hand to for all the links, foundation projects. Now that I volunteered myself, thank you. All jokes apart, Jacob, Matt, thank you for talking to me today. And I look forward to talk to you folks again. Thank you. Thank you. This is really great. Talk soon.