My name is Julia Panville. I'm the Director of the Future of Land and Housing Program at New York National. And I'm so excited to open this discussion on the topic of eviction record ceiling, which has been sweeping across the country over the last few years. So far, at least eight states have passed eviction record ceiling laws. And eviction ceiling legislation is being considered in several other cities and states across the country. In fact, I just learned today that I'm sponsored is the latest state to be considering eviction ceiling legislation. Eviction ceiling legislation does exactly what it sounds like. It seals eviction records, most often records of evictions that are dismissed. These laws protect tenants by limiting the ability of tenants screening companies to access eviction filing data and sell it to landlords locking tenants, even those who ultimately have their evictions dismissed, out of future housing opportunities. At the same time, eviction ceiling laws can obscure access to court records, which are the primary data source for tracking evictions and informing policies to prevent them. We're hosting this discussion today to shed light on this wave of legislation, discuss why it's so critical, but also talk about how to balance the need for protection of tenants with the need for preserving data officers. We'll start by hearing from two national experts about why eviction record ceiling is urgent and necessary and what they've seen in regards to this national trend. Natasha Duarte from the organization Upturn will share the context on why eviction record ceiling is so urgent and necessary and also elevate Upturn's new guidance for ceiling laws. Marie Claire Tran-Leong will then share more about the momentum that record ceiling legislation has gathered, including common trends across states. After Marie Claire and Natasha present, I'll turn it over to my colleague Sabiha Zainovi who will moderate a discussion between two jurisdictions that have recently passed eviction ceiling legislation. Scott Davis, the public information officer for the Maricopa County Justice Court will share his experience as well as Brittany Ruffin, Director of Policy and Advocacy for the Washington Legal Clinic on the Homeless in Washington, D.C. Brittany and Scott will be joined by Marie Claire and Natasha. We'll have a panel discussion with the four of them and then leave some room for questions and answers. Please submit your Q and A throughout the duration of the event using the slider interface. Welcome everyone and we look forward to a fruitful discussion. I'm Natasha Duarte. I work at Upturn. We are a small nonprofit based in D.C. and we do research and advocacy to advance justice in the design use and governance of technology including in housing. And so I'm here to talk about eviction ceiling of course and in short, I think states need to be aggressive about ceiling eviction records because tenant screening companies are aggressive about collecting and selling those eviction records to landlords. As soon as landlords file for eviction and those filings go up on a court website, data brokers are collecting those records and storing them in databases where they may or may not get updated as the case progresses.  They can hurt your property or your neighbors and you might be forced to evict them which is gonna cost you a lot of money. But don't worry, tenant screening companies are saying to landlords because our reports tell you everything you need to know to make a safe and reliable choice. So it's this one to punch of marketing that tenant screening companies are doing where you need to be afraid but buy our services and we'll tell you if someone's a good tenant. And the so-called insights in these tenant screening reports come almost entirely from eviction records, criminal records and credit information. And as we know, all three of these records are products of systemically racist, sexist and ableist systems. Tenant screening companies repackage this data, they often summarize it so that for example, a dismissed eviction filing might just become eviction record found on a tenant screening report. They often translate it into a numerical score or a risk assessment like a red, yellow or green light so a landlord can do even less of their own analysis. One company for example, called National Tenant Network on their website, they have a sample tenant screening report you can look at and in that report, the hypothetical tenant gets a failing score from National Tenant Network seemingly entirely on the basis of an eviction record. So tenant screening companies are encouraging landlords to defer to these scores and to the records on which they're based to make their decisions. And landlords do defer to them. Won Young So is a researcher at MIT. He recently published a paper showing that landlords tend to follow a blanket screening policy of rejecting tenants based on eviction records even when they can see that the eviction record was dismissed and that they tend to follow tenant screening companies risk recommendations. So tenant screening in general takes existing markers of housing insecurity and injustice, processes them and generates more housing insecurity along the profits for the industry. And while it's very important to regulate landlords conduct, which is being done across the country through what are known as fair chance housing laws to restrict what landlords can use to screen tenants. Unfortunately, we can't rely on those kinds of laws alone. Enforcement of those laws is limited by factors like tenants not being able to see a full view into the tenant screening process, not having the time or resources to pursue a complaint because they're trying to find housing and they just wanna sort of move on and apply to the next housing opportunity. And landlords providing pretextual reasons for rejecting tenants. So tenant screening companies also regularly publish reports of errors which landlords are unlikely to spot and they sometimes obscure or exclude mitigating information like the fact that a case was dismissed or that it happened a long time ago that could theoretically nudge a landlord not to put so much weight on it. So as a harm reduction step, cutting off access to eviction records at the source has the potential to help a lot more people qualify for housing and it's an important compliment to fair chance housing law, so we need both. So how do you write a law to seal eviction records in your state? It depends on where you live, there are local nuances, but I did write a report with my colleague, Tanuola Dada who has now moved on to Yale Law School where we tried to address some common questions that are going to come up pretty much anywhere you're trying to write and pass eviction record ceiling. We were heavily informed by what we learned from local housing advocates in DC who successfully passed a tenant screening and eviction record ceiling law here, including Britt who you'll hear from later on the panel. Our top recommendation is to seal eviction records immediately at the point of filing so they never become public. And we're far from the first or only people to recommend that, but it is key to stopping data brokers from getting their hands on the records before a case can even be decided. We also recommend talking to local courts early in the process so you can find out what kinds of technologies and systems they're working with, how you can craft your law to work with existing systems and where you'll need to push those systems to change. We definitely don't have all the answers and so I'm really glad we're here today to tackle some of the questions about how to seal eviction records without undermining eviction defense work which often makes use of housing court records as well as other housing justice organizing efforts that might rely on eviction data. And as we discuss in our issue brief, these goals don't have to be at odds. Depending on what the needs for data are and how things work in a given jurisdiction, there are policy tools and there are technology tools that we can use to thread this needle so we can have sealing and we can have effective eviction defense and housing justice organizing. So I can't wait to get into talking about how to do that with the others on the panel today and thanks for having me. So my name is Marie Claire Tran Leung. I issue her pronouns and I am the evictions initiative project director at the National Housing Law Project. The National Housing Law Project is a national law and policy organization focused on the rights of low income tenants and housing. And as part of the work that we do is that we host the Housing Justice Network which is comprised of nearly 2000 legal services attorneys and tenant advocates from across the country. And in that work, we have a sense of what a lot of our members are working on both in direct services and also at the policy level. And a number of our members are really focused on eviction sealing right now in their state local local jurisdiction. And we are seeing really the momentum continue to gather around this type of legislation across the states. Natasha mentioned earlier the idea of sealing evictions at the time of filing. And we do have sometimes point to California as being sort of a pioneer in the space. They have had eviction masking for a number of years and in 2016 enacted legislation that would automatically seal eviction filings unless the plaintiff landlord prevailed within 60 days. In 2020, Colorado joined California in passing a law that would seal eviction filings and records of cases where the tenants prevailed. And where the plaintiff prevails, the case information becomes public unless the parties agree otherwise. I think in a lot of ways automatic sealing is part of the ideal, especially at the time of filing. But we also know that in a number of states and jurisdictions, the infrastructure and in some cases, the political will is not widely available. And so we have been working with states and local or advocates in different states and localities who are trying to push some of these in the way that their jurisdictions are set up. And so there is a lot of movement at least towards the broader goal. One sort of broader trend I just wanted to sort of lay out there is I think in the earlier days of the pandemic, a number of jurisdictions enacted at least temporary sealing measures out of a recognition that the eviction records that came out of those early days shouldn't be used against individuals as they try to obtain housing in the future. So in New Jersey, for example, eviction records from April 2020 to August 2021 are sealed. Similarly, Illinois has automatic sealing of eviction records between the two-year period between March of 2020 and March of 2022. And Nevada as well also had, also seals records of summary evictions for non-payment of rent during the pandemic. And a lot of the advocates in many of those places right now are trying to look at how to make some of those temporary measures more permanent and to make them a permanent feature of their court systems. And some of the issues that I think our members have brought up in the course of working on these measures is questions around how the sealing is triggered or how the sealing takes place. We have a number of jurisdictions who rely on petitions in order to have the record sealed. And I think as was stated earlier, automatic sealing is preferred. I think in the long run, there will be less administrative costs to both the tenant and the courts. However, in order to do that, there's a lot of upfront costs and investments that some courts may not currently be ready to make. And that may require additional legislation or appropriations that takes time to gather, I think at the state level. And in the meantime, we have a number of jurisdictions who are trying to make progress with the petition model and using that as a way to open the door for automatic sealing down the line. The other thing I just wanted to note is I think, I think today we'll talk about legislation in a number of places. And I also wanted to note just that for some, in some of the work that we've done, we've also seen places where advocates are trying to make changes, where legislation may not be available because of the political landscape. And so in some places there have been success in trying to rely upon the inherent authority of state courts to enact some sort of relief around eviction records and trying to appeal to state courts where the state legislatures may not be a viable source of protection. And others where there might not be as much level, as much success at the state courts, there are some efforts to be made at the local county level. And again, I think all of these efforts in our network I think have been coming together to try to just really find relief on the ground for tenants as where we can find them. Today, we'll spend time talking about the balance between privacy interests and access for research and policy development. And that is very much at the forefront of a lot of the work that our advocates have been doing. And then the last thing I just wanted to bring up is, I think for a number of folks who have worked sort of in the criminal record space for a number of years, there have been a lot of progress there that could potentially be models. It's not apples to apples in terms of the comparison, but I think in places like Pennsylvania where they have been able to create a clean slate initiative where there is automatic sealing of criminal records, advocates there have been trying to see where there might be a potential for building upon that model or modifying that model in the eviction court system where there might already be infrastructure for the criminal record space. And then ultimately, I think with many of the advocates that we work with, eviction sealing is part of a broader infrastructure of eviction prevention protections that Natasha alluded to looking at protection such as anti-discrimination on the basis of eviction records, looking at how this could work with eviction diversion and mediation programs and broader rights of counsel for tenants to help maintain balance of power or achieve balance of power in the court system between landlords and tenants. So just having, I think keeping in mind that eviction sealing I think is just a one, I think tool in the broader toolbox and understanding how that can operate in this infrastructure I think is really important. And so with that, I think I'll turn things over to Sabiha. Thank you so much, Marie Claire and Natasha, that was really helpful context on both why eviction records sealing is urgent and necessary and why we're seeing so many cities and counties and states take up legislation across the country right now. So my name is Sabiha Zainalbhai and I am a senior policy analyst at the Future of Land and Housing Program at New America. And this next panel is titled How to Preserve Access to Eviction Data While Protecting Tenant Privacy. And in addition to Natasha and Marie Claire, we'll be hearing from Scott Davis, the Public Information Officer from Maricopa County Justice Courts and Britt Ruffin, the Director of Policy and Advocacy at the Washington Legal Center, sorry, Legal Clinic for the Homeless in Washington, D.C. And so during today's panel, the goal is really to learn from their experiences both during the drafting process of eviction records sealing legislation and during the implementation phase to gain some insights and learn a little bit more and potentially apply lessons learned from these experiences to other cities and states grappling with some of these tensions. So it's already been well laid out that eviction records are harm, the future housing security of tenants and that eviction record sealing is necessary and urgent to prevent that discrimination. But at the same time, the primary data source for evictions since they're run through our county court systems is can be partially obscured if eviction record sealing laws are not designed and implemented carefully. So today we just wanted to spend a little bit more time talking about the experience of cities and states that have grappled with exactly this. So I'm gonna ask questions to the panel. Everyone should feel all direct questions to specific panelists, but everyone should feel free to weigh in if they have something to share. And just as a reminder for the audience, feel free to drop questions for the Q&A session after this panel into the Slido feature. So to start, I'm gonna start with Scott and Britt. Can you just share a little bit more about the eviction record sealing law that was recently passed in Arizona and Washington, DC and a little bit more about what the sealing regime entails. Britt, would you like to go first since it seems like you all did that before we did? Sure, no problem. So the eviction sealing law in DC actually was coupled with some larger legislation that involved tenant protection rights as well for applicants, but the specific portion of the eviction record sealing law, it makes sure that there's a process that eviction case records are sealed with automatically. So if they're sealed automatically in two parts. So they're actually sealed automatically within 30 days if there's case resolution where there's no judgment for a landlord and then three years automatically if there is a judgment for the landlord. But there's also a set of eight factors by which a person can upon motion request that their records be sealed as well. And so that's the setup for our law currently, but it also allows tenants and their attorneys and their future attorneys to have non-public access to copies of their seal records. And it still includes allowing researchers to access that data with protections there for personal identifiable information. And that was a key portion because a lot of the information as you stated that we have on evictions and even getting to the point of knowing how effective it is to seal and to make sure that people are having the greater access to getting housing. Were studies that a specific study that came out of Georgetown, but in here in DC that looked at the evictions in DC and how problematic they were and the things that they were being filed for and that they were being filed and some of them didn't even go through but it really had a significant impact on the housing market and people's access to housing. That's fascinating. All of the ins and outs of that in Arizona our legislature this year came up with this bill and it passed both houses and was eventually signed into law. It's very simple though in that if any eviction filing is dismissed for whatever reason the case gets sealed. There's no direction on how to seal cases whether it's automatic or whatever it's just seal the case. And there's some other reasons for example if the landlord and the tenant stipulate to vacate the judgment and seal it then it becomes sealed. And some of that wording gets very specific and very tricky but overall it was a very simple law. It's less it's like three paragraphs or something that became part of our Arizona revised statutes. There's certainly provisions for the tenant and their attorneys and court folks to be able to access those records but the word is sealed and that's pretty much it. It was left up to each court system in the state to figure out how they're going to do that. Great, yeah, thank you for that context. So the upturn report that Natasha alluded to earlier specifies that a sealing regime does not need to be a binary system in which records are either completely open to the public or completely closed. And I'm wondering Natasha if you'd be able to just explain a little bit more what was meant by this in the report and then to the rest of you and specifically Scott and Britt, talk a little bit about, you touched on it but how Arizona and DC's record sealing laws think about this binary when it comes to data access. Yeah, so it basically means what you said that a record can be closed to general public access but made available by the court under limited circumstances for specific uses like as Britt and Scott were mentioning for attorneys representing clients and housing cases. A concern that gets raised when we talk about sealing eviction records at the point of filing in particular, so while a case is still moving through the court process is what happens when someone like a tenant in that case or their attorney needs access to information about the case so that they can represent themselves or their clients. One reason this comes up and a reason we talked about that it wasn't so important for us to say that sealing is not a binary is that courts in some jurisdictions do sometimes think of sealing in a binary way where they're putting a record into a sealed envelope forever that can't be opened by anyone. In reality, that's actually almost never true. Even with like sort of the strict just sealing regime you can almost always petition a court to unseal a record if you have a good enough reason. And for example, in the world of criminal records in many jurisdictions they seal certain criminal records they're not publicly available but give police wide-ranging access to sealed records which is a big problem by the way I am absolutely not advocating for giving police access to sealed records but I'm just using that as an example to show that the government can live in that gray area between open and closed records when it really wants to. But more importantly, another reason this comes up is that advocates and attorneys have historically in some cases struggled to get access to sealed records when they need them to represent clients or for other critical uses that they should be able to get access to them for. So in DC where eviction records aren't sealed until the conclusion of the case attorneys still had historically had trouble getting access and had to go to the courthouse in person to get access or the parties to the case had to go in person to get access which could be a big barrier. And so that's why the new DC law requires the court to provide those records to attorneys electronically. I'll also mention that advocates in Connecticut drafted a sealing law that eventually didn't pass but would have allowed any attorney licensed in the state to access eviction records electronically to represent clients or prospective clients. And so that can help cover like the outreach that attorneys or other advocates might do to people who have received eviction notices who may not know that or who are being evicted who may not have received a notice or may not know they've been evicted and don't know when to show up in court or what to do next. Of course, each additional access includes some risk that eviction records could end up in the hands of data brokers but these are trade-offs and needs that can be figured out in the drafting process. They shouldn't be upfront roadblocks to sealing records. Scott or Brett, if you have anything to add. Well, I was gonna say that those, I think in Arizona those things were not upfront roadblocks they were things after the drafting process after the passing process then we had to figure all of those things out which is why I love one of Upturn's points in the report was work with the courts when you're drafting this legislation. It's crucial because legislators don't know court terms and there are words that we use in court that mean specific things. And if you write that into legislation then that's what's going to happen and not what you really intended. I agree, of course. And I think that one thing that we learned in the drafting process this eviction record sealing went out first in a temporary measure. And so we saw thousands of records being sealed then we caught pieces that weren't matching up with what the legislative intent. So the portion that allowed people to seal records on motion they were supposed to be specific and things that the court was supposed to do and it was being who were drafting kind of interpretation it was looked at as where the judge could decide if it was. And so in the second iteration we had to go back and say, oh no, this is a show this is not a permissive statement or structure here in this bill. So we had to fix that and also making sure that we had eviction record attorneys that were worried that they wanted to make sure that they were gonna have access to be able to move forward in future cases. We also have tenants who would try to go to court and access their cases but because it had been sealed they can't find it on the target or they're told that they don't have a case when there's still some ongoing processes in a court case or settlement agreements. And so that was problematic. And so we wanted to make sure that people were able to access their own records and see the information about their own cases but also that their attorneys were able to do that and future attorneys. And I think part of our legislation too of course we expect everyone, all of us that are members of the bar to act in a certain way, right? That is professional and law abiding but eviction record landlords have attorneys too, right? And so we wanna make sure that even in saying that attorneys can access they have to that the court is setting up processes where that people who are asking for these records that the tenants, specific tenants that they relate to are giving the authorization for them to access these records. And so that was important to make sure that at the bottom line that we are trying to do as much as possible to protect the data of the people involved. Yeah, thank you so much for all that that's really interesting too and it reminds me Marie Claire what you were saying too you work with so many cities and states that are looking to make permanent temporary legislation and I'd be really interested to hear or to know down the line if you're seeing people sort of learn throughout that temporary legislation process and then make tweaks to their permanent legislation. But just to follow up on what you started to talk about with DC's process I know that the record ceiling law was the result of a longstanding coalition of community members and service providers and advocates and government representatives who were working to identify and lower the barriers to accessible affordable housing in DC. I believe that began well before the pandemic. So you mentioned that this was part of a package of other sort of tenant protection. So in addition to curbing excessive application fees and strengthening protection from discrimination if this legislation also obviously created a record ceiling regime. And so can you just share a little bit more both you and Natasha on the process used to develop and pass record ceiling legislation and specifically pull out any pieces that impacted the access to data question during that process. Sure, yeah, this was definitely a year-harded attempt to... Oh, Britt, I'm having a little bit of trouble hearing you. I don't know if you, every time I think you lean back it gets a little quieter. All right, can you hear me now? Yes. Thank you. So every time that you know that access to deeply affordable housing is very scarce and in the effort to minimize barriers we had a series of legislation. So this final legislation was actually a combination of a few pieces of legislation that ended up into this one bill. And so there was legislation on strictly eviction record ceiling. There was legislation on tenant protections and mentioned application fees. So part of this legislation also caps application fees at $50 and has a variety of expectations and creates rights for applicants around what they can expect during the application process. And it puts language in there around eviction rights and what landlords have to do and what tenants can expect. And so this legislation covers all of that. And I think in moving the way it did during the pandemic honestly, the pandemic was a big part of how this legislation moved. And I think we focus around the pandemic and there being a public health emergency and the shelter in place and stay at home. There are a lot of people who can't afford homes and don't have access to homes and are constantly being denied housing because of these barriers. And a lot of these barriers, eviction records being one of them that they are seeing landlords, they're having vouchers or not vouchers but it's hard for them to get access whether it's credit scores, not finding out why they're denied. But eviction records, having eviction records was a big part of it. And so the will of our council in addressing it was really, it was spurred by the fact that we were in a pandemic and people needed to be able to access housing and that we were also putting forth the request that the council create additional housing vouchers and subsidies for people having housing. And so in creating these subsidies, they needed to have a way to make sure these subsidies could be used and that the subsidies and the money that they were putting towards vouchers towards creating new housing access subsidies were actually gonna be able to be used because these barriers were minimized. Yeah, thank you so much. And then I wanted to talk a little bit, Scott. You sort of sit at a very crucial position being in the courts and sort of a distributor of eviction data to housing stakeholders across Arizona. And Maricopa County Justice Courts has been known for their efforts to make eviction records more consistent and available for research. Thanks in large part to your efforts. And I'm wondering if you can share a little bit more about how the recent record ceiling law that went into effect may impact what it is you provide to legally providers and other tenant organizers and other advocates and research organizations across the state. So we released data once a month. We have, there are a couple of ways that people can access data. We have subscribers like credit companies and things like that that buy bulk data once a month. And then I send out what I think is a comprehensive Excel sheet of evictions that have happened in the past month or at least cases that have been filed in the last month. We have struggled with number one, releasing data more often than that. But we are at a once a month release schedule. And part of that is because at the end of the month, when we pull and retrieve that data for sending out, there are thousands of cases that have not been to court yet. And so there are no outcomes, there are no judgments yet. We don't even know if the case has been dismissed by the time that report is pulled with 60 or so thousand. For the last 10, 15 years, we've had about varying between 60 and 70,000 eviction cases filed each year in Miracle County. So again, thousands of those just have had no resolution by the end of the month. So when we are talking about sealing cases, the determining factor of when we will release data is, well, when is the case sealed? How long did that case take to get through the system and be dismissed or the landlord and the tenant, again, stipulate to have it vacated, dismissed and sealed? So right now we have held off on putting out our data from October because we know that there are still all of those cases that haven't been sealed yet that are going to be sealed. And if I were to release all of that on November 1st or whatever that would have been, then that's again, thousands of cases with information out there for anybody to use and those cases that are going to be sealed a week or two weeks or maybe three weeks later. And so in my communications to subscribers and other users, I've said, I just can't in good conscience put out this data knowing that it's going to be restricted later on and I can't control what you're going to do with it. I can ask you and tell you that you have to remove these files from your records but I can't count on people doing that. Not that I don't trust all of our wonderful research colleagues but there are always bad actors or inattentive actors in every field. So we are putting a delay on that until we are comfortable that the cases from the previous month have been fully adjudicated in whatever way that's going to be. That still is not going to capture those cases where six months later, the landlord and the tenant come back to court and file that motion to vacate dismiss and seal. So we're just at a point where we're just sorting through how long is that going to take? And our record sealing law just went into effect September 24th, I think. So it's only been, it's less than two months now. So we've had less than just really one full month of data and just one week in September where we are grappling with this. Yeah, thanks so much for walking us through that process and that really teases up my next question, which is that everyone has kind of alluded to this already that the ability to have a system that protects tenants and preserves access to data heavily depends on not just the policy in place but the case management software used by county courts and the guidance and protocols that are provided to the clerks and the system administrators who are in charge of really implementing a sealing regime that is in accordance with the law and the intent of the law as well. And so, we've also heard from you Scott and just others around the country that court clerks will adhere pretty strictly to the laws on the books which really emphasizes the importance of clear guidance when it comes to eviction record sealing laws. So, I know people talked a little bit about engaging court personnel early in the drafting process but I'm wondering if there are any other lessons learned that Scott, Britt, Natasha and Marie Claire you can share from your experiences or what you're hearing from other cities and counties as to what to necessarily engage them on and kind of how to do that as well. Anybody care to go first? I could talk evictions all day long so I wanna give others a chance to weigh in. I'll just make a few observations but definitely let others speak more specifically to state and local experiences. So, one is that I think it would be a mistake if courts or others sort of came away with the assumption that they have to have some sort of particular technology or sophisticated technology to be able to do eviction record sealing. All courts can seal some records or keep records confidential at the most basic level when a landlord files an eviction case, a court can require that they use initials only or a pseudonym instead of including a tenant's full name in the filing. So, it doesn't have to be this like perfectly executed with sophisticated like court records management technology thing to be effective like good enough eviction record sealing. So, I think you can work with what you have to make it work. The second thing is having said that Tyler Technologies is a big technology vendor of records management software maybe the biggest one in courts across the country and they do provide the capability to have a public access portal where anyone can access public court records as well as the system where only authorized parties can get login credentials and access confidential records that the public can't see. So, NDC when we were talking to the court like it was one of the things we did was like do you just do some quick research on like okay what are you working with and what can we find out about its capabilities from just like there are lots of things online like the sort of brochures that court management systems put out there about explaining what they can do as well as contracts or work orders that they have with other courts that can tell you what sort of systems or capabilities they provided to other courts. So, there's a contract, I think it's in California where like Tyler Technologies had promised that they would provide a system in California that would have the capabilities under California law of sealing records automatically at the point of filing and allowing them to be unsealed at a certain point. And then I've learned a lot from watching a video from the Vermont courts website where they made a video just explaining to people how to use. They have the sort of online the public portal which is general access to the records that are public as well as the sort of privileged access login system where people can access records that are confidential but that they are allowed to access for specific purposes. So watch that video, sort of learn how it works and that can help you talk to court personnel about like here's what we understand the system you have maybe able to do is that your understanding because they may not be sure, right? There might be things that the vendor knows that court personnel are not up to date on what's possible or there may be things that they need to go and ask the vendor to implement for them that they just haven't implemented. So that kind of just basic research I think has been really helpful. I think building on that, I think the basic that research but I think also the conversations of engaging with the court personnel was really important and even getting buy-in and what we were trying to do to get that feedback to say, well, what's happening now? And like this is what we are looking for this is the capability and in DC specifically the court was also going through a process of changing out software at the time that all of this was happening. And so to figure out like where it is currently to where it's going and what the capabilities of the new system and discussing that with the court personnel who would be responsible for this I think was really important. Scott, do you wanna weigh in at all as someone who sort of sits on the courts before we move to our last question before Q&A? Let's go ahead and move to the last question we can cover more things that way. Sure. So everyone kind of alluded to this that this is eviction record ceiling is a tool and a tool, a very important tool but in a larger toolbox of eviction prevention policies and from the upturn report we understand that ceiling at the point automatic ceiling at the point of filing is the most likely to protect tenants from ending up on tenant screening companies databases or allowing this data to get into the hands of people who might abuse it but I think a lot of record ceiling regimes in place today are not automatic at the point of filing and so I was wondering if a lot of them as Scott walked us through or sealed at the conclusion of the case and I'm wondering if you all have any thoughts on complimentary policies which are necessary to protect tenants from having an eviction filing on their record. I do but I just go up so I want to give out a chance to go first. I saw you unmute Scott so we can go to you and then Natasha and then Brett or Marie Claire if you have anything to add. Well, I was going to say that yes, our filing process takes place at the end of the case and I know that people always question whether before that eviction records are searchable are they scrapable, are they usable, sellable and the answer is yes and that's a, I think an unintended loophole in the Arizona law that I've been talking to reporters about for months hoping someone will bite on that and get that story out there and I've had one little bit of interest but nothing that went anywhere to do anything about it because those cases are in Arizona and in most of course jurisdictions we post dockets online so you can go on our website and see what cases are coming up today in any one of the 26 Maricopa County Justice Courts. Well, out of 26 Justice Courts on a Monday we probably have 10 that are doing evictions. Well, how many of those are going to be sealed later on? So that information is out there. That's a tough one. We don't have a way to stop that without some kind of policy in place that says we have to do that because the practice for years has been this is what we do and that's part of a battle I think with any court system is going to be well, this is what we do and we've done it this way for years and it's a matter of changing minds and changing people's ideas of what's right and what's not right. The other battle that courts have in that is look, we're a neutral party. We're gonna do our business and it's not up to us what anyone else is going to do with our data. That's up to others. And so, it's kind of like saying if you're gonna change a court form to instead of white have the paper be yellow. Well, I don't care. Okay, if you tell us to do it with yellow we'll do it yellow. That's kind of the thing with eviction ceiling records is on one hand it's not a court system's job to protect the tenant's future. Now, I say that saying, yeah, that's best for society and we get that, but that's not our mission. Our mission is to adjudicate the cases that come to us and to follow the rules that were given by the Arizona Supreme Court and the state legislature and that's where we are with the ceiling records. Sure, we're doing it and we're not unhappy to be doing it but it sure could have been worked out better on the front end instead of having so much discretion of what judges or clerks can do and how they enter those records which determines if they get sealed or not. Which is a long answer more than y'all asked but I thought that was important to add. Yeah, so first I think in terms of immediate harm reduction now is the time for states to pass laws that restrict the kinds of information that tenant screening companies can include in their reports. Over this, Amur, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau published an interpretive rule where they affirm that states have the authority to regulate what tenant screening companies and other consumer reporting agencies include on their records, including they specifically called out eviction records as a prime example of information that states can and should be restricting. So not just as a complement to finding eviction records off of the source in the courts, also making sure that we are deeply restricting the eviction records that actually get included on tenant screening reports if not eliminating them. Also Marie Claire said something at the beginning of the event that I think is really important that sealing is one tool in the broader toolbox of shifting power to tenants. The underlying problem here is housing insecurity and injustice. We need a transformed housing system. We need to support communities that are trying to experiment with and build alternative housing models, start removing housing from the speculative anti-tenant market and make it actually available for people to live in. So I think it's really important that we got down to the weeds of like sealing but don't wanna lose the bigger picture of like as Marie Claire said, yes, this is, we need a whole picture of transforming the system and shifting power to tenants. I'll just add that, you know, in addition to the tenant screening companies, I think broader protections against the use of eviction records by landlords in the future is also necessary because I think, and partially to get the protection in place but then also to engage sort of the stakeholders in a community around the broader conversation about why eviction records really should not keep people from housing in the first place. I mean, again, I think during the pandemic we saw a lot of jurisdictions understand that there's probably limited value in using an eviction record against somebody where, you know, global pandemic impacted their ability to pay rents and taking that broader conversation and bringing it to the obstacles that tenants continue to face today in this climate of rising rents, skyrocketing rents and inflation and seeing all of the barriers that tenants face and the importance of housing security. And so I think, you know, eviction sealing eviction sealing is very critical to make sure that, you know, bad actors don't necessarily get their hands on the records but we also have to make sure that we look at the tenant screening companies who can proliferate that and undermine the overall sealing regimes that courts work very hard to get into place and then also target landlords who might over rely on it and kind of stand in the way of tenants getting safe and stable housing. And I just wanted to add, I definitely incur with exactly what Natasha and Marie Claire just said and that eviction record sealing it's a tool and it's a tool in the toolbox to expand access to housing. But there are just so many things that can be addressed from better regulation of these tenant screening companies but also addressing really how applicants and tenants get access to housing that's very scarce. And that includes looking at using things such as credit score, you know, other things that can be proxies for, you know, other forms of discrimination, racial discrimination, source of income discrimination and addressing all of those things to make sure that we are expanding housing and minimizing all of these barriers. Yeah, thank you so much. I think we'll go to, we have a little bit of time for some audience Q&A and so we have had some good questions come in and I'm just going to start with this one. Someone asked, is there model legislation out there for this? I know that that depends in part on what your goals are but I thought I would pose that to the panel. And Natasha, I know you did mention Connecticut legislation earlier that didn't pass but just an opportunity to uplift any cities, counties or states legislation that you think might be working particularly well or just plug the report again since there's some guidance in that. Yeah, I mean, one of the reasons we did it was because there isn't a sort of one model the way there has been sort of a model emerging for like there are chance housing restricting what landlords do. But there are, there's lots of good work being done sort of experimenting in different states and yeah, I think Connecticut is a good one to look at. Of course, the DC legislation has a lot of excellent things in it. Yeah, nothing else. Great. Someone asked specifically about the role that court CMS vendors have played in the implementation of these policies which we've touched on and they asked how have they hurt or hindered these policies? And I'll just add, I know that in Illinois there was a little bit of the temporary COVID ceiling law was not necessarily made permanent in part because of blowback from the court systems in being able to implement what was in the legislation. And I'm curious if you all have specific types of guidance that's important to share with court staff for judicial leadership or legislatures working on record ceiling policies? Well, I would say to court personnel working on this and the analogy I always use is there are 27 different ways to get to your Circle K or your 7-11 or your Quick Trip or whatever your convenience store is in your state. There are also 27 different ways to process an eviction case and tons of different codes depending on that CMS. And so for any court personnel is crucial to think of everything and then test it after the law has gone into effect and audit and make sure that you're doing things right, that you didn't miss, oh, we forgot that if you enter a dot after seal, then it won't do it or something like that. There are all kinds of little tiny intricacies. Yeah, I would say that our... Oh, British, I think if you, I'm having a hard time hearing you, sorry. Can you hear me now? Yes. In DC, our legislation went into effect in May, at least the parts around the record ceiling. And I think that this is going to be, seeing how it's playing out, seeing how it's working is going to be crucial for any future tweaks that may need to happen in future legislation. But I also think being as specific as you can in legislation while leaving room for court personnel to utilize their own systems and figure out what works there, I think being specific about what is intended, like there are specific provisions in the DC law saying that even sharing data for scholarly purposes or research purposes that they have to have the requests to the court, of course, but it has to go through a certain thing. You have to have a written data use agreement showing how this data is going to be used, showing procedures for data storage and how the data is going to be destroyed. All those things have to be presented in the request to the court. And so I think putting kind of a framework around what the intention is is crucial. Yeah, absolutely. I'm so glad you said that. And so I'll just add this one little thing. There is no provision in our law for anyone other than tenants and their attorneys and court personnel to get those records. I'm in sort of a, well, it's a soft battle with our attorney over sharing something as simple as the zip codes that are with those sealed eviction cases. And I'm told, no, well, I don't like that. So I'm fighting that, but I would love to have seen some kind of provision made for special cases. Yeah, thanks, Scott. It's really helpful to hear about lessons learned even two months in. So really appreciate all of that. I'm just gonna pass it over, pass it back to Julia to just close us out. Thanks so much, Savihah. And thank you so much to our excellent panel. I'll just close by noting that, so for the audience on the back end, we see the questions come in. And I've been noticing that these questions are very specific, very actual, clearly based on the questions that we're getting in. There are lots of folks in the audience who are grappling in real time with eviction ceiling legislation. So we're so glad that we were able to host something on a topic that seems pertinent. We will be sharing back out some information both of the summary of what was discussed on the panel and perhaps some answers to some of these questions that we didn't get to in the coming week. So please look out for that. Thank you again to everybody who tuned in and to our wonderful panel. Have a great afternoon.


What's up, everyone? It's your girl, Kenzie here from Layton Sports Cards and I'm ripping brand new release day of 2022, top definitive baseball, hobby, three box case break, number 12, random teams. Again, here's a look at the random results. You can always find these at LaytonSportsCards.com underneath the results tab and the link is also in chat for you. All right, good luck, everyone. Here we go. Case number three of the night. First two have been excellent. Such a sweet product. Here we go. Topper card. We got two 15, Giancarlo Stanton. Got a dummy thing up next. That is so cool. Partial logo. It's got to be helmet, right? Helmet, Relic, one of four, Anthony Rendon for the Angels. Boom! Tyler B. That's a good question, Ari. Ari's question. Kid reporter. Look at that. Partial logo on the Angels right there. That is so cool. Again, that is a helmet, Relic card. Very nice. Got Patch Auto to 40, Jeff Bagwell for the Astros on that one. Jeff Bagwell, 15 to 40. Got Patch Auto, Red Sox to 30, JD Martinez. Eight of 30 for the Red Sox. Oh, wow.  How about to 35? Juan Soto and Ronald Acuna Jr. Nationals and Braves. Nationals is Ronald A. Braves is Anthony B. So be a random at the end. Good luck to the both of you on that one, Maddie. Got one. We've got another gold frame, 11 of 30, Don Mattingly. It is coming out of the gold frame, a tad. You can kind of see it. I don't want to push it in or touch it. So we'll send a box here with a Yankees, in case it does fall out during shipping. Or you'd like to get that replaced. Yankees. That's funny, Steven. Got Redemption next. Let's set that down for last. Then we've got Cardinals to 25, Nolan Aronato. Nolan Aronato to 25. Then we've got Redemption here. Rookie autograph of Julio Rodriguez, Mariners. Boom. Nice J-Rod. Michael T. with the Mariners. Heck yeah. Doesn't say what it is number two. So good luck on that one. We'll mag that Redemption. I agree with that, Ramars. So that should technically be a Yankees. Theoretically. Yeah, that was a very nice box, huh? Yeah, most of the rookies that we pulled have been to 50. Good point. Top of the card. We pulled a Wanderer yet. Oh, I don't believe so. Out of 50, Patch of Ronald Acuna Jr. for the Braves. Nice. Yeah, it is. He's a six on the centering there. We've got to 50 for Nando Tati's Jr. Patch. Quadraves. Patch, Stroze, Nolan Ryan. There you go, Stroze. Harper B. Five of five. That's sick. There's a Nike Swoosh I was talking about earlier, huh? Who's got this team? Nice. We've got a one-of-one Nike Swoosh Patch Auto for Kansas City, Salvador Perez. Beautiful one-of-one Nike Swoosh. Game used. Very nice. We'll mag that. Going back to the Stroze to 35. Dual Auto, Jordan Alvarez and Jose Altuve. Astros with two hits in this box. Very nice. Mag that one for you, Harper. Then we've got five of five. Purple, Carlton Fisk. Look at that one. That's an old school photo there. Carlton Fisk, defining images autographed for the Red Sox. Nice Fisk there. We've got Ray's Rookie Auto by now, Bruhan. Nice Bruhan Auto from going not seeing him at all today to back-to-back cases. Wow. I think the same hurt, I think he had him last break too. Wow. Wow. Going back to the Mariners. Two out of five, four-time AL, home run leader, Ken Grippy, Jr. Mariner. Michael T. Beautiful car in there. All right, what a case this has been. My goodness, I still have one box left. I don't wanna pull a trout. Cover car. Got three color patch here to 30. Matt Chapman for the Ace. Matt Chapman. No wonders yet, yeah. We've got one of one. Wilson or Will Smith. There you go, Dodgers on the Jumbo letter. Will Smith, the T. and Smith on that one. Very nice. So Dodgers on that. Mag that, oh wow, this is sweet. We've got Patch Auto, 21 of 40, Sammy Sosa, boom. Cups, cups, cups. On the combo spot, Harper B. Harper having a nice break. 21 of 40, like that. And we've got Patch Auto here. Dodgers, Walker Bueller to 25. Walker Bueller. We've got Dual Auto for the Mets. We pulled this one earlier, but this is a four of five. How about Daryl Strawberry and Pete Alonso? Michael F. Nice one there. Well, we're just talking about how I didn't pull them. So how about we pull them now? One of 15, Gold Frame Patch Auto. Angels, Mikey Trout. Beautiful Trout, three colored patch. Game used, Auto, one of 15. What a case, this has been an insane case. Congrats on that, we will mag that one for you, of course. We've got Rookie Auto to 10. Man, Astros with the third hit of the case, a Jake Myers. Jake Myers, Rookie Auto on the purple six of 10. How about a legend to end it? To 25, nine times Silver Slugger Award winner, Barry Larkin for the Reds. Wow, 12 of 25. Nice big Auto there too. Congrats on that one, Reds. Legendary autographs card. Wow, what a case this has been. Gosh. Again, give me a minute to set up this random between the Nationals and the Braves. One second, Nationals, Braves, Nationals, Braves. One in four, that is five times on the random. Five times here. Good luck to the Nats and Braves. Again, whatever team comes out on top, we'll take home the Duals, Soto, and Acunia Jr. Auto, good luck. One, two, three, four, five. Gonna go Braves with Acunia. Braves taking home the Dual card. All right, let's do a recap here. We'll do our relics here first. We have Matt Chapman, AIDS, Fernando Tatis, Padres, Ronald Acunia Jr. Braves, Giancarlo Stanton, Yankees, non-Magged cards. I want to just say that from now on. Non-Magged cards next. Barry Larkin, Reds, Jake Meyer, Astros, Dula, Strawberry, Alonzo for the Mets, Walker Buehler, Dodgers, Vital Bruhan, Rays, Carlton Fisk for the Red Sox, Nolan Aronato, Cardinals, Don Mattingly, Yankees, again, we will send a box with this as it's kind of popping out of the card on the back. Yankees, Jamie Martinez, Red Sox, Jeff Bagwell for the Astros, and then our Mag Cards. We had the one of four on the helmet relic partial logo angels. The Will Smith, one of one, Dodgers. We had Sammy Sosa on the patch, auto to 40 cups. The redemption of Julio Rodriguez, Mariners, dual auto Jordon Alvarez and Jose Altuve Astros, Nolan Ryan, five of five Astros, Ken Griffey Jr. auto to five Mariners, the one of one, Nike Swooshpash, Salvador Perez, Royals, and the one of 15 gold frame patch auto Mike Trout. Wow. All right, that'll do it for this one. We've got some pick your teams coming right up.


so youtube team keep it clean i am not going to tell you like i said last time i'm not gonna tell you not to be hype be as hype as you want to be be excited as you want to be you know before we get into this whole thing let's read the tweet ver baton from jeremy fallow from espn on one jadevian clown it says i saw it's close to jadevian clown he says he's been mauling off us from the titans and saints since friday and raven's a wild card they made a serious push a few weeks ago seahawks not out of it but more monitoring now remember when we did the video i don't know if it was yesterday the day before yesterday i don't even remember man it's been a lot of videos over the past couple days but when we talked about the teams that were monitoring jadevian clowny that was the seahawks and the jaguars monitoring is a lot different than interested in monitoring means oh i'm just gonna sit back and see how things work out or don't work out with the other guys it's no big deal to us it don't matter one way or another we'll keep an eye on it but that's about it but interested means hey you clowny come join us clowny let's make this thing happen now i do just to get this out of the way from the beginning the team that i expect him to go to would be the new wall and saints that's what i expect him to go to so if he does end up going there it will not be a shock or anything like that i actually feel like the raven's uh they have the third best chance in signing him the reason i say that is because with the saints they are already making moves in order for them to sign jadevian clowny and now it doesn't guarantee that he goes there nothing guarantees anything until he actually signs there i know some people like engraving man he's not going to the ravens man he's not going to go there well a uh assault well the guy wasn't wise who told me this but an unwise man once said it ain't over till it's over and he's been saying that for years and it's true so until jadevian clowny actually signs with a team then anything is possible but i i do really feel like the ravens have the third best uh chances of signing now with the saints they it got reported this morning they were showing all the food that they brought to jadevian clowny's house they had a a chef come through and they went to houston they went to where jadevian clowny lives at they went to houston shan peyton went there they had a chef come through make him some food they had a beautiful uh fruit salad he made them crab cakes maybe taking a little shot at the ravens right there uh creole crab cakes uh they made them steak they had all sorts of stuff it was a pretty little lineup but let me tell you something that guarantees nothing now again i think it's the most likely that he goes to the saints but at the same time it guarantees nothing now one thing that it was said that with jadevian clowny that he wanted to continue to wait until it came out it was a report last night again don't know how true it is or not but i mean with the way that this offseason has been it seems like it may be true but a report came out last night that said jadevian clowny wants to wait until the roster cut downs are finalized because he can get even more money so this thing there's a big factor when it comes to jadevian clowny and that's money he wants to get paid he wants to get paid a lot he wants to really get the most that he can possibly get at this point in the offseason but it's about more than money too it's about success as well jadevian clowny he he seems to have a couple of objectives laid out in front of him three to be exact number one money he wants to be paid number two success he wants to go to a winning team hence why he turned down the browns hence why the jaguars they may be monitoring but that's all they're gonna be doing because there's no way that jadevian clowny goes to the jacksville jaguars unless everybody dropped out about two or three times and then maybe he'd go to the jaguars but it ain't happening but then number three was training camp or actually avoiding training camp so he's he's gotten he's gotten one out the way well he got number three out the way he's got one out of the three out the way that being avoiding training camp that's done you ain't got to go to training camp no more and that's again that's something that's a little concerning because the the report said the report that we just read it says that the ravens they made a serious push a few weeks ago at least by the way that it's worded because he did word it kind of funny and he kind of worded to where you almost have to like really wonder like is this supposed to be a comma here period there or a semi colon there but i'm no english teacher y'all know that i can barely speak english myself but anyway because again he says a source close to judevian clowny says he's been mulling offers from the titans and saints since friday see right there that that's where he could have put a a comma right there maybe he was running out of characters i don't know but i said he'd been mulling offers from the titans and the saints since friday so the titans sent him a contract and that report came out yesterday i believe that the titan sent him a contract oh yeah yesterday was friday i don't know why today feel like sunday anyway it's just it was been a crazy weekend well it's not even a weekend yes the weekend now anyway been a crazy couple days so the titans they sent judevian clowny offer and the saints they sent judevian clowny an offer so with both of those teams sending him an offer it's like okay let me look at these let me look at the money and let me look at the team now my god nitred he made a very good point and he said that the saints will probably be a better fit uh than the ravens for judevian clowny why that's because and i'm paraphrasing so i know he's gonna clear himself up i'm sure but i believe he said because with the saints uh his he would be more valued there because he will be more of a necessity with the saints than he would be with the ravens now the saints are no bad team at all they're not but as far as defense if you gotta pick the saints defense or you gotta pick the ravens defense currently where they are right now i don't know anybody including saints fans and that's no offense to saints fans because saints fans they already know it's all love but i don't know anybody including saints fans that would take the saints defense over the ravens defense right here right now and that was even before the uh they both teams got to 53 men on the roster i don't know anybody who's taking the saints defense over the ravens defense therefore judevian clowny going to the saints he would be a more valuable piece there because he could give them something that could he could help them out even more judevian clowny with the ravens would be nice i would love it but it would be more of a luxury judevian clowny with the saints it'd be more of a necessity over there and again that's not a shot at the saints because know some people like well man that's a shot what are you taking shut no it's not but he is not needed with the rate he'll be nice and he would upgrade the ravens but he is not a necessity for the ravens to get to where they need to go but he would certainly help and it'd be very nice and i want him on the ravens but again i do feel like the ravens have the uh the the third best chance to sign one uh judevian clowny but let's get back to the um to the tweet to the report the tweet whatever uh but again mauling offers from the titans and saints since friday and ravens a wildcard they made a serious push a few weeks ago so a serious push because it's been a lot of ravens fans that i've been seeing in the comment section i've been seeing on twitter i've been seeing on instagram i've been seeing in dms i've been seeing in group chats i've been seeing on facebook i've been seeing literally everywhere it's been a lot of ravens fans who have been very frustrated with the ravens they're like man if if he were if judevian clowny was going to be a raven they would have signed them already they would have got them already man why they ain't even did they even make him an offer or they're even really interested in judevian clowny well there you have it they tried they tried they tried and it says they made a serious push a few weeks ago so they really wanted judevian clowny hey come on man that means they offered him something because there is no serious push without a contract offer because that's the that's the only thing that a serious push means a serious push does not mean hey judevian we want to talk to you that's just interest a serious push does mean not does not mean hey judevian what do you think about becoming a baltimore raven no a serious push is judevian clowny here's a contract offer judevian clowny let's talk some numbers judevian clowny let's talk to bust cook who you just fired your agent but judevian clowny let's make this thing happen what do we need to do how much you're looking for this is what we can offer you and see what the ravens again a bidding war with the saints even though saints ain't got no money but saints don't care about no salary cap y'all know that but a bidding war with the saints ravens will lose saints they know how they know how to maneuver that salary cap now ravens do too now but the ravens that's not their style man they're not one of those teams that okay uh going six mil six mil anybody six mil six mil four us ravens okay seven mil seven mil seven or six seven mil four saints eight mil eight mil eight ravens you got it no we're done that's who they are they don't get into bidding wars for players except jordan reed but they got out of that because the the 49ers were like hey we'll pay you a little bit more and then he just got to reunite with kyle shanahan too and they were with together with the redskins on the redskins but so so that's not ravens game that's not the game that they can play the money game is it won't be played by them man but um ravens if they are to sign jadevian clowny this is why again i said they got the third best chance third best chance does not mean it's impossible it just means that i think it's they're the third most likely team that jadevian clowny goes to because the ravens the ravens are not gonna they're not gonna kill their roster for one guy they're not gonna do all these restructuring and all that for one guy saints are trying to do that because they they really want jadevian clowny and the titans i'm not sure how much money the titans have currently but i'm sure they got more than the ravens i'm sure i'm sure they certainly do uh but with the ravens what they would need to do in order to land one jadevian clowny and i thought i don't mind hey y'all y'all got my number and if you don't i can give it to you shout out to the team keep it clean phone case but anyway what ravens would need to do and we've talked about this before they will need to present jadevian clowny with success because that's the best thing that they can offer him they cannot offer him the best contract they they they can't they can offer him success though success jadevian clowny look at what we did last year look at how our team was last year look at how successful we were last year and tell me you don't want to be a part of that look at what we've been doing you know lamar jackson the guy you couldn't catch last year when when the ravens played the seahawks now if you can't beat them join them look at his defense you could be a missing piece you could and again he's not a necessity to the ravens but ravens they could present it to him like he is they could say jadevian clowny you're the missing piece we got matt jude on on one side jadevian clowny on the other kaleis cambell derg wolf brandy williams madabook and they they could present so and then they'd be like jadevian look behind you look at his secondary you got marlin humphrey all pro marcus peters all pro jimmy smith tayvon yon's coming back one of the best slot corners in the game then you got your clock one of the smartest players not only on our team but in a league you got to present it the right way man and then the sean elliott up and coming young safety ready to take over this is the team that you want to be on man and then look you signed with us for this one year hey we're so close and we know you could help us get over the top come on come get your ring here and that'll boost your stock even more so whether you remain with us or you end up signing with somebody else jadevian clowny this is a win-win for you man this is a win-win for you for the immediate future and for the long-term future too so let's talk but apparently again ravens already had those conversations with them whatever they talked about i'm not sure the details we don't know the details but again he says they made a serious push for him so they had to have offered him a contract they had to have made an offer for to jadevian clowny and really tried to get something done so that's for all the people that felt like the ravens uh those guys weren't doing anything it's always something those those dudes always up to something behind the scenes and we don't find out till weeks later like this so again we'll continue to wait we'll continue to watch and we'll continue to hope that your davian clowny becomes a raven again i think he'll end up going to the saints but dinner trust me dinner does not guarantee anything visits do not guarantee anything it's a start though it's a start but there's no guarantee and for for ravens fans just to make that point a lot clearer for you for anyone that might be confused on and think oh man he visited with the saints and they had dinner and all that oh yeah he going to the saints he might but remember um i forget his name the deep jerry mccoy remember jerry mccoy jerry mccoy this guy he came he came to bartimore he went uh they went out to eat they went to a vegan place because he's a vegan he even was part not part of but he sat there and watched lodi nada's uh retirement press conference live he really got to see the culture the vibe how how the ravens do it he ended up signing elsewhere he signed with the panthers so again he went through the motions he went through an entire visit and i mean personally i was thinking oh yeah ravens gonna get him for sure nope they sure didn't they sure didn't so again what jadevan clowny went through with the saints it is not a guarantee that he will end up being the same i still think it's most likely but it is not a guarantee nothing is set in stone until you see a video because you have all your youtube notification set to all for team keep it clean but nothing is set in stone until you see that video says jadevan clowny signed with such and such whoever that team may be hopefully well y'all know the rest i love y'all we out


Research efforts to provide cleaner energy through sustainable processes and utilization of renewable resources are increasingly important due to the continual desire to reduce human activities' environmental footprints, mitigate climate change effects on present and future existence, and shift to more environmentally friendly alternatives. Bioenergy accounts for over one-third of all energy used in Sweden, with biomass providing about 60% of fuel for district heating and a significant role in the transport sector. The Swedish bioenergy sector's state-of-the-art is presented based on literature and current statistics, discussing overall production and utilization in different sectors, potential challenges, and environmental considerations. This article was authored by Steven O. Amiandaman and Nij Kumar, Sturgeos Adamopoulos, and others.


special guest Jennifer Yancey, Becky Byrne, Sandy Eskrich, Brian Rainey, and Jay Ranny along with Catherine Clouette. The vision of First Unitarian Society is growing souls, connecting with one another and embodying our Unitarian Universalist values in our lives, in our community, and in our world. We look forward to greeting you all at Coffee Hour after today's service out here in the Commons. It is also where you will find our activity for all ages, that we are going to begin creating together in our service in just a few moments. And if you're visiting us today welcome, we're so very glad that you are with us. And if you'd like more information about First Unitarian Society, please stop by the welcome table located outside the center doors. And for those of you connecting virtually with us today, we are very glad that you are with us as well. We hope that you'll be able to join us for our virtual Coffee Hour immediately following today's service. The information for joining can be found on the homepage of our website, fussmattison.org, as well as on the slide that will be seen again after the postlude. Our announcement slides will also be shown briefly after today's service. We encourage you to take a moment to watch those and learn about our upcoming programs and activities. And now I invite you to join me in a moment of silence as we center ourselves and bring ourselves fully into this time joining together once again in community. Sink into this chair, breathe into this body, the very body that will be you till your very last day. Come into this day. Raise your gaze into this light, this one steadfast sun who watches over all growing beings, even you, even now. Come into this heart and break into the boundlessness of wild beauty, no beginning or ending in you, but flowing through you like white water, reaching toward all that ever was, and all that ever will be. And if you will rise now in all the ways we do to join in our words of affirmation as Becky lights our chalice, day breaks on our gratitude for family and friends, for the freedom to find our own truth, for the company of those who gather here, and the promises we offer one another. Let the light of day bring the grace of faith into our lives, age service each year. And so for our service today we have turned the tables and we have asked them to deliver their statements for us. So what we would like to do now though is to bring all of you into this activity of thinking about what it is that we believe. And so this board here, we're calling it our belief board. It's got some statements on it already. Things like the holy is found in nature. Laughter is healing. Rituals help ground me. Creativity feeds the soul. Each person has worth and dignity. Life is messy. We need to be here for each other. There is a spark of divinity in each of us. Our relationships with others help us know the divine. Life is better with a pet. We are each called to do the work of justice. Eating can be a sacred act. So I ask all of you, I'd love it if you would yell one out, what is a one sentence belief statement? Something that you believe. Live in awe. Thank you, Dave. You all know that voice, right? Without justice. Thank you, Kelly. Love is universal. Thank you. Spread kindness whenever you can. Thanks, Leslie. Faith is a verb. Thank you, tree. Live compassion. People will be people. Those are some true words, Barb. People will be people. Make me think of one. There is very little that I actually control. Thank you, Rene. There are powers. In fact, right now powers greater than me are these labels. Okay. I can do it. There are powers greater than me. I got you. Just give me one second. Fighting with my labels. Kindness is transcendent and transformative? Okay. I love it. Kindness is transcendent. Can I fit it on our label and transcend? I'm caught up. Yeah, Judy. All right.  How are we doing on Nail Sandy? These are great. Thank you all for making this work. Gene, live today. Imperfect is perfect. Thank you, Winnie. I'm going to write that really big. Is there another hint? Yeah. Patience is important. Two more. Okay. Tell me. Tell me. Tell me, Clio. When you feel sad, think of something that makes you happy. Thank you, Clio. I'm getting it. One more nail. Do we have a last one out there? Yeah, Emily. No meaning but the meaning we make. Y'all look good at this. I had the four of them on standby. No, are beautiful. So this activity comes to us from, I saw it at the Unitarian Church in Kholishvar in Romania many years ago, and they had a board like this. And now what you do is during coffee hour, if you believe patience is important and that love is universal, find two that resonate with you. Take a piece of yarn, tie it from one nail to the next. And so when we're all done and this board is full of yarn and you have found things that resonate with you, it will be a visual reminder for all these different beliefs that we hold. And though our beliefs may be different, how much we truly all have in common. Thank you all for making this work. And I now invite you into the giving and the receiving of today's offering. We give freely and generously to this offering to sustain the ongoing work of this community. You'll see on the screen that you can donate directly from our website, fussmedicine.org. You'll find the text to give information there as well. And in addition, there are baskets for cash or checks at the back of the auditorium. We thank you for your generosity and your faith in this life we create together. Good morning. My name is Becky Burns. I was born and raised here at FUS. In fact, I offered my coming of age faith belief statement back in the 1980s. Currently, I serve as a co-chair of the FUS racial justice ministry team and am a member of your healthy congregations team. And I'm looking forward to teaching coming of age again this year. I believe our behaviors reveal our true beliefs. That's how I approach this opportunity. I looked at what I do, how I present in the world, and then I explored the value or belief that was behind that behavior. After all, actions speak louder than words. And here's what I came up with. I believe as humans, we must care for each other. Like all living beings, some are weaker, others stronger, some are healthier, some are smarter, some are wounded. And no one's at fault for the way they are. And no one is superior to any other. Every person adds value to our world. So why wouldn't we all care for each other? If someone needs help, I like to help. If someone can be self-sufficient, then I like them to take care of themselves and lend a hand towards others. It's likely this belief that has led to my career in helping families who have children with disabilities, being a pen pal and a friend to inmates in our prison system, and happy to lend a hand to friends and family members in need. I've always aligned with the story of the starfish. One day a man was walking along the beach when he noticed a boy picking up something and gently throwing it back into the ocean. Approaching the boy, he said, what are you doing? And the youth replied, throwing starfish back into the ocean. The surf is up and the tide is going out.  Son, the man said, don't you realize there are miles and miles of beach and hundreds of starfish? You can't make a difference. After listening politely, the boy bent down, picked up another starfish, and threw it back into the surf. Then smiling at the man, he said, I made a difference to that one. I believe in treating each other with dignity. All of us are born with inherent worth and value. I even go so far as to believe that if everyone treated others with dignity, we wouldn't be plagued with issues like racism and homophobia. Rather than treating others the way that we want to be treated ourselves, try treating others the way they would like to be treated. There are huge benefits for all humans to simply accept each other's identities and be accountable for our own words and actions. If we focus on those behaviors, I believe we would live in a world with more joy and peace. I think humans are responsible for the world that we've created, and its future is ours and ours alone to change. I believe in respecting oneself and others. I treasure healthy boundaries. If I'm expecting someone to express gratitude for what I have done for them, then I've crossed a very important boundary, and it serves as a sign to me that I've overextended myself. The heart of volunteerism is not in the recognition you may or may not receive. It is the satisfaction one receives from the mere act of contributing to the better outcome of others. I think it's essential to establish and uphold healthy boundaries as a measure of respect to oneself and those you love. Finally, I believe in the rejuvenating power of music. Thank you. Of silence. Of good friends and laughter. I think we could all use a bit more of that in our lives. Thank you. I believe in silence. I thought it might be funny if I just stood here in silence for five minutes, but I don't think that sound is a bad thing. I love talking with people. I think it's important that somebody can speak up when they see an injustice. Personally, I also like to make music, but there is a saying that I heard a lot playing in big bands. Jazz is about the notes you don't play. Sound is important, but what's more important to me is the space we leave between. When I was little, I was sensitive to noise. I would wear ear protectors in movie theaters. I was at my best in quiet places, and I still am. Silence helps me calm down. It helps me process everything that's going on. Silence is also an important tool for me day to day. When I play contract bridge, it helps me concentrate so I can do my best. When I'm at work and I disagree with somebody else, if I silence my own opinions first, it gives other people space to share their own opinions, and usually that's really helpful. Like most tools, though, if we use silence wrong, it can be dangerous. Like a very sharp knife, it's extremely useful if we use it carefully, but it can also do a lot of damage if we're not careful. One example of that today is what's going on in Russia and Ukraine. There's a lot that I find sickening, but one of those things is the way that Putin uses silence as a weapon. In Russia, the freedom to protest is only a facade. You can't write a newspaper article about what's truly going on. The silence makes it almost impossible for people to work together to stop the evil. Silence can be damaging. Silence can be eerie. Silence can be awkward. But at its best, silence is an essential part of my life, especially my spiritual life. I've changed a lot since I grew up Catholic. One thing that has not changed is the importance of silent prayer and meditation. Here at FUS, we often start services with a moment of centering silence. Something feels very natural about that to me. When I think about the whole universe, most of it is very quiet. When we sleep, we are silent. For the many years before we're born and after we die, we are silent. It's only for a fleeting flicker of time that we can cut through that silence. Silence reminds me of how precious an opportunity that is, and it reminds me to make the most of this life. 1008. When our heart is in a holy place. Unitarian universalism as a teenager, more than 50 years ago when my family moved from Illinois to Madison and I joined First Unitarians Youth Group. During the course of my life's journey, I've attended UU churches in other places, but I've always considered First Unitarian Society of Madison my spiritual home. I was once married here. I've attended too many memorial services for departed friends here. And for many years, I've taught religious education classes under the superb leadership of Leslie Ross and Kelly Crocker in order to help first my daughter and then many other young people decide whether UUism is right for them. What do I personally believe? There are many paths for each of us, but here are three of the milestones along my personal path. The first is the challenge. Over the years, I've heard regularly from time to time a stream of cracks about Unitarian universalism, including some from people who otherwise have very liberal values. Those cracks were to the effect that UUism is a mushy religion, kind of a collection point for people who want some connection with religion but don't want to put too much energy into it. I don't believe that. Many years ago at a UU service I attended in Milwaukee, a congregant got up and said, you know, people think UUism is easy. It's not. If you do it right, it's the hardest religion there is. His statement struck home with me and it's been an essential guide and a goad I should say for my personal path. I think our religion is hard because it doesn't come with a built-in roadmap. It provides options and suggestions, but every UU must find their own path. It's hard work, but I've found it very rewarding, much more so than being confined to a doctrinal route planned for me by others. The second milestone in my path is what I would call enlightenment. One of the basic questions we talk about in our religious education classes is, is there a God? I've thought about that a lot over the years and I think my answer is that I would consider myself a mathematical deist. Let me explain what I mean by that. Many years ago when I took physics in college I learned about the laws of gravity in planetary motion. I had an epiphany in class one day, the day that we studied a law discovered by the Bohemian mathematician Johannes Kepler. Kepler's secondary law of planetary motion and that's probably the last time you'll ever hear anybody say their faith was inspired by Kepler's second law of planetary motion. Now what is that law? Kepler's second law is basically planets do not orbit the sun with constant speed. They orbit the sun in an ellipse and their speed varies so that the imaginary line between the sun and the planet as it goes through its orbit sweeps out equal areas in equal times as the planet orbits the sun in its ellipse. For some reason when I heard that that day I thought you know that can't have happened by chance. These laws of motion and gravity cannot have happened by chance. The universe can't be random. It can't. There must be some higher power out there that created this beautiful mathematical order. Now I may never figure out probably never will figure out the deeper nature of that higher power but I do feel a calling to think about it and to relate it to my life experience. Particularly when we address other questions that we address so often at first Unitarian. For example if you do believe in a higher power how do you reconcile that with the existence of evil with the tragedies and with the loss that life inevitably brings? What is true goodness and how can one achieve true goodness? Working through these questions is very hard. I am grateful to Unitarian Universalism for reminding me to keep at it and for providing resources that I can use to look into and explore my path. The work of exploring this path itself brings comfort and sometimes and I have to confess only sometimes a little bit of progress. The final milestone in my journey is community. In the many years that I've been here I've put most of my energy into religious education and as a result I have to confess I don't know some members outside of that area very well but I will tell you that seeing people even those I don't know very well gather as I walk into church on a Sunday to get ready for class or as I walk in on a Christmas Eve for the Christmas Eve service or other days for other services this gives me a real feeling of being at home. That feeling sustains me outside of church as well and it helps me know always that I am in the right spiritual community. I am grateful to you all for helping to make that happen and that in a nutshell is what I believe. When Kelly asked me to consider doing this I thought sure I've already I'm all set for this because when we ask our ninth graders to finally sit down and and put a pen to paper and write what they believe I mean Brian and I were sitting there with them for 45 minutes or an hour in silence while they wrote and I thought well I got to do the same thing so I pulled out my what I was writing in and I wrote my belief statement so when Kelly asked could we do this I thought sure I've already done this and then I didn't pull it out to look at it until just the other day and I thought well yeah you know that's mostly still true and and and as as Brian and I said I think I've edited it every day since then in just a little bit there's pen marks all over it. I believe in living an intentional life. I believe we as humans are social beings we benefit from our relationships and from belonging to community. During the pandemic our assumptions about our own agency were and I think continue to be severely tested. I was fortunate to be part of a family pod we could be in each other's homes share meals share fears and share relative successes it required honesty and living not just for oneself but required constant decision-making for the benefit of that small valued community. I think we've all learned from that and are continuing to learn from that lives are short fragile and maybe all we've got. My experience in community is varied here at FUS a wonderful community in my neighborhood I feel in community with circles of friends and previous professional colleagues some for more than 30 or even 40 years ago. We've developed long-term relationships that are important parts of us throughout the years. To do this requires focus and patience to really know people over a lifetime know and care about individuals over a lifetime. I benefit from each of these communities and these relationships and I believe I have something to offer that's valuable to each. Intentional living requires a physical body. Our bodies need to be fueled and moved and rested to truly be well involves the physical self and without physical self-care we don't have the focus energy or endurance to live fully. I think about the presence that we experience in meditation I notice the presence they experience when they're producing music. I feel like to me I find presence sometimes in physical activity and whether that means you know swimming where breathing is everything you have to breathe you have to keep breathing or whether that means hill climbing on a bike where your whole brain and your whole body are acting as one to move up that hill without falling over sideways. Clearly our bodies don't last forever and neither do our lives of conscious living. Is there more than intention and physicality? Yes I think so. Intentional living requires reflection empathy and perspective taking. We choose how to invest our resources our time and our energy and from what basis do we make those decisions those choices. All of us have values drawn from lived experience and maybe from vicarious experience. What are my values? Kindness honesty the natural world empowering myself and empowering others and physical presence and exertion. Everyone draws their choices from their values expressed or silent acknowledged or not. When I retired a couple of years ago from public education I did it with some intention and I decided I wanted to grow a few things in my life I wanted to grow my spirituality I wanted to grow my civic engagement and I wanted to grow physical wellness as well as continue to take care of family and friends. I believe without considered and applied values we're only a very sophisticated animal driven by behavioral conditioning less than an intentional spiritual human.  Thanks to our four presenters today we gather each week creating a community of love and support a place and a time where we can share the celebrations and the sorrows of our days. Anne asks us to light a candle of gratitude relief and joy for the re-establishing of a long relationship that was broken by emotional and geographic distance. There is great joy for taking small steps on this journey together. And we light a candle of concern and hopes for healing for Rebecca Blank who received news of an aggressive cancer. We send our prayers for support for hope and that she is surrounded by those who love her on all the days ahead. Alyssa Ryan Joy asks us to light a candle of concern for the Lee Now family who are struggling with COVID in their home with the illness itself and with the disappointment of two little ones who were supposed to be at a sleep away camp this weekend. And we send Mike and Anya our best and hope that they are on the other side of this very soon. Bev Dusso asks us to light a candle for the new National 988 number for those struggling with mental health issues. May we celebrate the lives that will save those rich or poor from this day forward. And a candle of joy, gratitude, hope and prayers for Amanda and Oliver Kiefer and their twins who were born at 29 weeks this past Wednesday. They welcomed Simone May and Weston Henry into this world. Both are struggling in the NICU. So we know that this will be a long journey for all of them. We're holding all of them in our hearts as well as grandparents Henry and Barbara Nelslow as that family loves and supports each other so very well. And I light a candle of deep sorrow for the passing of the Reverend Mark Ward. Mark passed away suddenly this past week. You may remember Mark as our ministerial intern way back in 2003. From here Mark was called to the UU congregation of Asheville, North Carolina. He went there in 2004 and he served them until his retirement in June of 2021. Mark was a brilliant human being with a curious mind, a hearty laugh and a heart filled with compassion. We hold his wife and their family in our hearts as they begin a journey of deep and abiding grief. And we light a candle in solidarity with the people of Ukraine both in their suffering and in their struggle. Together we yearn for peace for them and for all people for an end to all wars of conquest anywhere and everywhere on earth. And if you'll join me in a moment of prayer spirit of compassion enter our hearts be with us in the hard hours the lonely hours the times of loss and pain help us to remember the kindness that dwells within spirit of belonging help us see the pain of those around us the ones we know and the ones we know not yet let us be with them in their sorrows that we might speak a gentle word along the way spirit of love enlarge our heart so that our compassion may embrace all let us be generous of heart that we might forgive and be forgiven spirit of life let us be together in our humanness in our vulnerability that by traveling the path together we may be made strong spirit of it all help us to face the mysteries of this life ground us in trust in openness in hope and in love may these hold us and heal us bless us and all in our care this holy day bless it be and amen some additional verses you can follow the words on the screen taught you may you question everything and when you have changed the world and the world has changed you may you return again to this place and share what you have learned with us blessed be go in peace and please be seated for the postlude