This 10th year of Daily Techno Show is made possible by its listeners. Thanks to all of you, including Chris Smith, Mark Gibson, Reid Fishler, and our brand new bosses, Errol, Ian, Kelly, and Thomas Love. They all just started backing us on Patreon. Welcome to you all. Coming up on DTN As, we unpack iOS versus Android and what really makes people switch. Might Amazon pay your cell phone bill in the future? And Ron Richards tells us why pinball machines are the new hotness. This is the Daily Tech News for Friday, June 2nd, 2023, from a studio that has yet to be named that I am Sarah Lane. From lovely Cleveland, Ohio, I'm Rich Trafalino. I'm the show's producer, Roger Chang. And joining us is Ron Richards, CEO and co-founder of Scorpit, also host of All About Android and former colleague of many of us. Hi, Ron. Yes, hello. Hey, good to be back. After my eight-year hiatus from DTNS, I'm glad to be back. Has it been eight years? We did. Rich looked in the schedule. It was back in 2015, then it was the last time I was on the show. So yeah, good to be reunited. Well, lovely to have you. We're going to talk about pinball. We're going to talk about Android. We're going to talk about all the things. But first, we shall start with the quick hits. We had more shakeups at Twitter this week. The company's head of trust and safety, Ella Irwin, announced that she resigned from the company. She joined Twitter back in June of 2022, succeeding royal YOL Roth in November of last year. No word on who is going to replace her in that role, but that is not all. The Wall Street Journal sources say A.J. Brown, Twitter's head of brand safety and ad quality, has also departed. Bloomberg's Mark Gurman reports Apple is in discussions to open, relocate or remodel up to 53 Apple stores over the next four years. About 40% of those are planned for the Asia Pacific region. Apple currently operates over 520 retail stores across 26 countries.  WWDC starts on Monday. Just a reminder, so we may hear more about that. What is sure to be a jammed packed event? Progress software disclosed that it discovered a vulnerability in its move it transfer software, which manages file transfer software and could also allow for unauthorized access of the file environment. Several security firms, including Mandian, said they saw evidence of data exfiltration from multiple victims. It appears that malicious actors started scanning for the utility on March 3rd and patches are now available. Microsoft updated the free version of Teams. This is the one that's included with Windows 11 specifically to support its communities feature. So, this does things like let users create and manage focused groups. This was originally only available on mobile, although Microsoft now says they plan to bring it to Windows 10, macOS and the web. Not too surprising to see that expansion, but now that we have confirmation, the version of Teams also added Microsoft Designer integration and this lets users create media assets, mainly pictures and stuff, from text prompts. Raspberry Pi's have been in short supply for a while. Pardon me. And now it looks like there might be some relief on the way, perhaps Raspberry Pi CEO Evan Upton said that the company expects to ramp production up of its products to one million per month in July, the goal being to maintain production until clears the consumer backlog. This would be a significant output increase as the company shipped 800,000 units in all of Q1, quite a bit lower than what it would like to do, which Upton called the worst quarter since 2015. The company is working with Sony on this effort and Sony began stockpiling non-silicon elements needed in Pi production. All right, Rich, let's talk a little bit more about how Amazon wants to make more prime. Yeah, it's some prime real estate for Amazon, surely. Yeah, so I mean Amazon Prime, people might forget that at one point it just offered free two-day shipping, but over the years it's expanded to a lot of other services. I'm not going to lie, I had to look it up just to make sure I would even get a representative sample of this.  There's so many stuff, it's surprising every time you look there. It's a lot. It's also pretty successful with consumer research partners estimating there are 167 million prime subscribers in the US as of March. A lot of people, but the research also found this was basically flat growth on the year. The number hadn't really moved all that much. Yeah, so you might be wondering, okay, how else would Amazon possibly sweeten the Prime deal if you're already a Prime member? Well, cheap mobile phone service seems to be on the market, maybe. Bloomberg sources say that Amazon is in talks with Verizon, T-Mobile, and Dish about offering discounted sell service at around $10 per month. It sounds like a great deal.  Any deal or service is reportedly months away. This is not happening tomorrow. But does Prime Mobile give Amazon a good lock-in feature? Ron, are you a Prime member? And if not, would this make you sign up? I am a Prime member. I'm an OG Prime member. In fact, Sarah, I think I remember when Prime came out. I think we're all at revision three. I remember everyone signing up for it. I vaguely remember that. I could be wrong. But I remember when Prime, I was an original get-free shipping. That's a great deal, 100 whatever bucks a month, and I've never looked back. I do use Amazon Prime video to watch stuff, stuff like every else does. I recommend, excuse me, I recommend the Outlaws. It's a great British show on Amazon. But I don't use anything else. I don't use the music. I don't use the cloud storage. I don't use the photo storage. I don't use anything else. I don't either. I have a friend who swears by the music service, loves it, says it's great.  But I'm like, yeah, no, I have no desire to use it. So I have no desire to have Amazon link to my cell phone coverage, even at $10 a month, personally. I mean, that price, I don't know how they do it, right? Because either they would be partnering with, they would be, you know, Prime Mobile from Dish or T-Mobile or something like that, or they would just be their own MBMO. And the idea that right now, it seems like the market rate that all of these virtual network operators are able to hit is about $25 a month. Like that's what visible is that, that's what Mint has been at for a while. That seems to be like the base level of unlimited mobile and stuff like that. $25 is how they're able to make that feasible. So for Amazon to offer $10, either they're just not paying the carriers enough, which is not going to happen, or they're eating that cost, which would be more than the cost of Primus right now, right? If we just take $15 over 12 months, it's like $180, right? Don't do my math. Just let me know I'm wrong.  That's going to make some stickiness there. Yeah. Exactly. I think exactly. That's the thing. I mean, we're talking, Amazon is the company that gave you the subsidized tablet with ads on the load screen. Like, they were the first people, one of the first people in the domestic market to do that, right? So like, clearly they have no problem with doing that as a loss leader to get the customers. They just want acquisition. Because once you get in on that, on that ecosystem, it is middly, it is hard to get off the train. Like I use, I, I actually have scheduled subscribe things every six weeks. Amazon sends me more paper towels and it's amazing. I live my life that way. Yeah. So, so I'm not surprised they do this, but I wouldn't get my dollar for it. So, gosh, I don't know, Ron. I feel like I'm already so entrenched. I, I don't, I mean, I'm a Verizon user. I don't know if somebody would like to pick up my monthly cell phone bill, which is about $89. But if they were to, and it was Amazon, and I'm already paying them for, you know, dog bags every six weeks, and a variety of other things, I don't know. It's kind of compelling. I think that the company is banking on that. Well, my point of view on this, and I'm, I recognize my old man, Internet stoicism in it. I am still with T-Mobile from when I signed up for, when I got Android, when the G1 came out, I'm still with T-Mobile. I have no contract. I'm on an unlimited, unlimited everything deal that I got in 2008. And I refuse to speak to anyone at T-Mobile because I'm afraid to lose that unlimitedness. So I haven't touched, you think I would sign up for Google Fi? I haven't. You think I try Mint Mobile? I haven't. I'm probably paying more than I need to, but I'm holding on to that unlimited data and all the stuff for dear life for like no, no reason. Like it's, so I'm definitely. Well, it's the reason that you don't want to have a worst deal later on. The one interesting thing about all of this is that this is basically flipping what the carriers are already doing, like the complete opposite way, right? Like when you sign up for Verizon, oh, you get free Apple TV or you get free streaming or whatever like this and stuff like that. This is Amazon saying like, no, no, no, that's not the pack in everything else is the thing you're paying for. The pack in is going to be your mobile service is a really kind of a wild place to put, you know, based on how much of a premium all of the, obviously all these carriers, you know, that's their bread and butter. So that just shows you the presence that Amazon has. And if you're dish and trying to grow subscribers on a fledgling network, Amazon, 167 million people, you know, even if you get a fraction of that, that's a good way to grow your network. Well, Ron Richards being a host of all about Android for some time now, we were very excited to ask you about your thoughts on Boy Genius newest report where you stand on Apple's iMessage being unfriendly to Android users and Google's campaign for Apple to convert to RCS. This has been going on for a while now. Consumer intelligence research partners or SERP reports that between 10 and 15 of new iPhone buyers in the U.S. come from Android. Okay. So of that 10 to 15%. Number one, prior phone problems, that's 53 of them, 53% of them saying, and we just wanted a new phone. Number two, new phone features. Maybe the iPhone has a better camera. 26% said that was the case. Number three, cost. I would like to spend less on a new iPhone than a comparable Android smartphone. 15% people said that. And the last one, number four, community connecting, meaning iMessage and FaceTime on iOS is a draw. That's only 6%, according to Boy Genius report, but it's a real thing, isn't it? It is. We actually were talking about this on all about Android recently and actually Jason Howell was really trying to wrap his head around this whole concept because there's been a couple reports recently about brand affinity to Android and to Google Pixel and people jumping ship going over to iPhone. Going through those examples you put out there, I would eliminate cost because I feel like it's pretty much at parity. If anything, a new iPhone is as expensive or cost comparable to the new Samsung Android phone or to the Pixel, whatever, I feel like we've got somewhat cost parity there. The only X factor is whatever discounts that the carriers provide. Sign up for Verizon, get a free iPhone. I don't know, I'm not following those promotions, but there could be carrier-based discounts that are swaying people. The new phone features one, I mean that is just literally, that's a tennis game, right? Like, Android's got the better camera, iPhone's got the better camera. iOS is pulling in features from Android. Now iOS has the dynamic island and all this sort of stuff. I feel like the feature arms war, it just literally, that changes from release to release to release, which phone is better. I do think the prior phone problems is, I'm not surprised to see that as such a high percentage, it's 50%, but I do think that the community connection and the iMessage aspect of it is more of an issue than this is reflecting because the whole green bubble shame is real. I mean, I've suffered it for years. I've literally, literally last week, I had a friend complain, it's like, yeah, but every time he texts me, you have a green bubble. Like it's amazing what culture class war Apple has created, which is very ironic, giving Steve Jobs' view of the world and stuff like that, that they actually created a haves and haves nots kind of scenario. But I mean, it's not so, yes, it's a class war, but it's also, if you're on Android and you're in a group text with a bunch of iMessage people, the group thread breaks. Now, whose fault is that? It's kind of Apple's fault, right? 100%. Ron, my question is though, the shaming is real. That's coming from the iPhone user going to the Android user, or hey, let's throw out the flip phone user there too. We don't want to leave them out either. But the idea that maybe that shame is not effective. We might feel like, oh, I did a group chat and all of a sudden it turned green. But maybe that doesn't actually correlate to much of a change in buying behavior for Android phone users. That's what the study seems to show me. It's like your derision as an iPhone owner does not impact me that much. And I think this is where we get into where you question the methodology of the survey, right? Because I think it was the Wall Street Journal article a couple of months ago. It is a real thing with kids. It is a real thing with middle school and high school kids to be the kid with an Android phone that's not in the iMessage group. I can't believe I'm saying it. But that level of cyberbullying around the color of their thing is enough. I've talked to friends who are parents who've been like, yeah, no, I don't want to. But I had to get them an iPhone because they can't miss out on the thing or whatever. And it's something that I'm personally afraid of with my kids because being an Android person, I want to be like, hey, use the Pixel. Because listen, I've got a box of these reviews that you can use right now. We're going through the survey where at least a few of the people that were surveyed said, we wanted the iPhone because it was cheaper. So it's not as if Android is some bargain basement mobile system at all at this point. I also wonder, it also depends on what people think of Android, right? And go back to the deals. I just quickly searched iPhone 14 cost and the first link I get back is Verizon get an iPhone 14 on us and Apple saying get $200 to $630 off on an iPhone 14 when you trade in, right? So there are lots of aggressive pricing deals that are happening on the Apple side. Whereas on the flip side, if you're just a casual consumer and you see what's going on with Android and you see Samsung touting the latest foldable or Google touting the latest foldable and it's $2,000, is there a perceived perception there? If I'm being told the latest and greatest Android phone is $1,700, I can't even afford that. I'm just going to stick with the iPhone. I'm going to switch over to the iPhone. Not realizing that there's actually a very robust, low, mid, and flagship tiers within Android and you can find a really great iPhone, a really great Android phone in the $300 to $400 range that is on par with a lot of the functionality that iPhone does provide. Maybe not so much on the camera side, maybe not so much on some of the higher level processing stuff, but for the bulk, you know, we talked about class war for the bulk of the middle and lower class, Android is the better option from a cost standpoint, but iPhone is the one that saw it after. Well, yeah, yes, we could we could go on and on about this, but since we're all travelers, we like to think of ourselves as worldly people, it is travel tech on this week's Tom's top five, where Tom shares his picks for personal travel tech to make your trip a little bit more enjoyable.  I don't care, but you can catch it at youtube.com slash daily tech news show. All right. Well, the conventional Rismuan pinball, you know, the classic arcade game, you use those flippers, not silver ball around a table to score points. If this is your first time hearing about pinball, you're going to you're going to be amazed by this conversation. But if you've heard about it, you might think it's still a fashion for modern tastes. It's just a thing of the past. Well, a recent article in The Economist notes the resurgence of interest in pinball with sales of new machines rising 15 to 20 percent every year since 2008. And that's according to Zen Sharp from Stern pinball, the last remaining pinball maker. So I mean, they would know where the market's at. Ron, I'm curious, could you let us know about your startup score bit and this kind of concept of connecting pinball machines to the internet? Can you kind of maybe break down the tech that's being integrated into, you know, we think of pinball machines as old tech, but there's a lot of modern tech in these things, right? Oh yeah, for sure. And I'll actually start by well actually you because that quote came from Zach Sharp from Stern pinball. And the last remaining pinball maker is actually not accurate.   I got a mat, you know, like I played my first pinball machine in at Comdex in 1987, when my dad took me to it, I was like 10 years old and played in the in the game room at the hotel. Like pinball has been a mainstay within arcades, right? And what's so much fun about pinball is that there's a technology aspect to it with the lights and the bells and the ding and all that sort of stuff. But then there's a kinetic physics piece of it in that you, you know, you're hitting the flipper to the ball, the ball's moving in a trajectory, you can move the machine and change the outcome of the game, which you can't do in a video game, right? So there's a physicality to it, which makes pinball so much fun. Pinball hit rough times in the late 90s. Bali and Williams, who was the biggest manufacturer of all them, you know, kind of gravitated mortar slot machines and shut down their and video games were rampant. They were, you know, they were the makers of Mortal Kombat. So clearly they're making millions of Mortal Kombat and pinball was struggling, especially when an average pinball machine costs, you know, it can be very expensive. You know, these days, pinball machines cost anywhere from $7,000 to $15,000 per machine, right? So it's a big investment. Yeah, it's a big investment. But and whatever the rate of inflation, that's how much it costs in the 90s. It was still thousands of dollars. So they shut down their pinball division and pinball kind of was like on his last legs, Stern pinball was the last manufacturer standing. They were still making machines in the 2000s, but at a very slow rate, they put out like one or two new games a year for years and years and years. But then some point around, you know, around 2010 or so, things started, you know, kind of taking an upswing. More manufacturers arrived on the scene. The second largest pinball manufacturer, a company called Jersey Jack Pinball was innovative with their first machine in that instead of if you played pinball game in the 90s, you probably remember it has like a very pixel based dot matrix screen. Where is Jersey Jack was the first manufacturer to build an OS based on Linux to run the machine and put a 26 inch monitor on the back box and have like video animation and stuff playing. And like, so that kind of moved the technology level forward a bit. And then you've seen some smaller boutique manufacturers like spooky pinball and pinball brothers and there's a list of them out there now. Chicago Gaming Company, a whole bunch of other companies that have emerged that are releasing one, maybe two pinball machines a year. Stern has been the one that has the real market. They're like the Apple, as much as I have to say it, in terms of market dominance. They release anywhere from four to six games a year new games and pushing the technology forward. But pinball has very much been a you buy the machine, you plug it in, you play it and that's that. And so the idea of connecting it to the internet is somewhat new. Actually, so Scorbit is a company that I co founded with Jay Adelson, who some folks might know might remember he was the former CEO of dig and co founder of revision three where Sarah and I work together and Roger work together, along with Brian O'Neill who worked at dig and then also worked at event Brighton Slack. I was actually living in San Francisco at the time and I was in Molotov's in the lower hate. And there's two pinball machines there and I was playing it and just having a fun time not knowing what I was doing. And notice that someone put up a flyer that there was a pinball league forming in the upper hate. And so I went to the website and I was curious. I'm like, well, I like pinball.  And like the whole thing was fun was what was fun is that once you hit the ball and get multi-ball, you're like, Oh, how do I do that again? And so like started talking to other people playing football. And that's what I that's what I discovered that there was a whole competitive aspect to it. And there's actually an internet. It's the International Flipper Pinball Association, which is like kind of like the PGA. And there are tournaments all around the world. And people are ranked at one point I was ranked like 700th in the world as far as competitive pinball players. My I'm now like in the 3000s because I don't play as much anymore. But like this I so what you had was what happened in San Francisco in cities like Chicago, Seattle, New York, LA, you had these small pinball leagues cropping up and competitive pinball players getting into it. And it had a real cool casual kind of bar vibe to it. And it was just a lot of fun. And so you saw more, for whatever reason, culturally saw this upswing of people playing pinball. And that kind of mirrored the upswing of manufacturers emerging. But nobody was doing anything with the internet. So Jay and myself were at California Extreme, which is a arcade game show in San Jose that happens every year. And and I was actually saying to Jay how it would be really cool if I had an app to keep track of my scores. Because a friend of mine that I was playing with, he beat me and he got a really high score on Star Trek on a Star Trek game. And he went, Oh, cool, he took out his phone and opened up a text file and scrolled down to Star Trek and deleted his old score and typed his new score. And I just went, Oh, God, damn it, there's a better way to do that. Right. And so and so. So this is like 2014, 2015. And I'm talking to Jay, I'm like, Yeah, I think I think, you know, be cool to do an app where you can keep track of your pinball scores. And Jay at the time was getting into IoT and was like, Yeah, that's that'd be cool. But wouldn't it be cooler if we made a device that went into the pinball machine that connected it to the internet. So you didn't need to type in your score. You just it just appeared in the app. And I was like, Oh, man, well, that's that's just crazy. And so it took us about five or so years of R&D pandemic in the middle of it that caused that that caused problems. But we launched Scorbit, which is an app to help you keep track of your scores. And there's also like, you can find places to play pinball bars and things like that. But then we created the product that I named the Scorbitron, which is a little board that goes inside a pinball machine and it literally connects it to the internet and allows you to feed your scores to the app and have it more, you know, go to the cloud. And it also unlocked a whole bunch of different things like people who own pinball machines and put them on location. So like they're called operators. So when you go to a bar and play a pinball machine, that owner doesn't actually the owner of the bar doesn't own that pinball machine. There's somebody else who brings it in and they split the quarters like that sort of thing. But now with our device, we have ways to allow that owner to see what's going on with their machine without physically being there. All the perks of actually a modern internet connected device. So we launched Scorbit. It's been been going great. Couple years after we launched, Stern pinball launched their own platform called Stern Insider Connected, which has a lot of some nice to be nice to be recognized and copied. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I will I will I will bite my tongue on any commentary there. No, honestly, they've done a great job. And it's a lot of fun to use. And it's great. The caveat with their with their product is that only works with their their ultra modern machines. So so Stern has made, you know, hundreds of machines over the years, their platform only works with the latest and greatest. So it only works on like 18 games total. So whereas Scorbit works on over 500 games, like it works. Scorbit works on every pinball machine from modern machines all the way back to 70, like solid state machines in the 70s. Yeah. So I have to ask you, Ron, I mean, I think you probably get this all the time, people saying, oh, so like vinyl, it's a nostalgia thing, right?  But how do you reconcile with the fact that they have to go somewhere? Well, I think it's, well, I think it's great because it promotes getting out of the house and being social, right? Like for me, every Wednesday night, I had pinball league and I went and played with 80 other people and I made new friends and it was this whole community. You know, there's and again, it's that physicality of it. There's, you know, it's one thing to sit on the couch and plug in an Xbox Live or PlayStation, whatever it is and play with somebody in Australia. That's really cool for a specific thing.  It really was like energizing and fun. So like I see the nostalgia piece because it is a nostalgic thing, you know, the happy days with Fonzie and the pinball machine. But the machines that are coming out now are they've got full motion video. Now they've got these internet connected, you know, kind of aspect of it to it, which not only allow you to keep track of your scores, but unlocks like achievements and virtual tournaments and score bit. We have a way where Sarah, I can play a game here in New York and challenge you and you can play me wherever you are on the same game and see who gets the better score. Right. And so it just it's it's just a really cool thing to do. I mean, it's a game that, yes, has an nostalgic aspect, but to me has never lost any of its interest, you know, any of its interesting aspect. It's not like we're playing this old timey thing and it doesn't work like you look at a game that just came out like the latest game that just came out from Stern is called is based on Foo Fighters. Right. So it's got all the music of the Foo Fighters. It's got great animation. You know, the guy who designed a Jack Danger is a friend of mine and it's got a great design and it's just a ton of fun to play. And now the much like when a new game comes out for PlayStation five, there's a lot of excitement in the community is who played a new game, who's going to get it and all that sort of stuff. It's very expensive. It's like 13 grand to get that machine. But but people do collect machine. I mean, I have three machines in my garage. Like it's it's a way to, you know, keep practicing. And then then, you know, like I may go into Brooklyn and play a tournament next weekend and meet up with, you know, 40 other people who want to play pinball. And it just it's it's a social element to it, which I think makes it really special. Indeed, indeed. I'm I'm with you. Well, thanks so much for telling us more about more more about the effort. And, you know, thanks for bringing nostalgia into the modern world. Yeah, and go to scorbit.io. You can see it all on our website. And we're in we have the app is available on iOS and Android, of course. But yeah, it's just it's all about having fun. That's the point of it. So well, Ron, you're also doing a lot of podcasts and stuff like that. Where can we send people if they loved hearing you? Where can they check out your podcast work as well? Exactly. So every Tuesday over over our friends over at twit, I do all about Android, which is a podcast dedicated to the world of Android. And that's with Jason Howell and when to Dow and Michelle Ramon and JR Rayfield. And we got a great crew over there doing a Florence Ion comes on the show. And yeah, every Tuesday about an hour and a half of Android news and reviews and hardware and all that fun stuff. So you can get that subscribed to that podcast, please. You follow me over on Instagram and on Twitter at Ron XO, that's my handle. And every now and then I pop up on iFanboy, my old comic book podcast where I talk about movies and TV shows and stuff like that. You can hear me That's where I first met you. Yeah, still going strong. Speaking of nostalgia, well, Ron, so, so, so glad to have you with us. I know the last time you were on the show was, would you say, eight years ago? Eight years ago. So so 2031, I'll be on. Yeah, well, we'll see you back then. We got you on the books. We're not. Let's not make it another eight years. But, but, but really good to have you and thanks for telling us all about Square bit and and your stuff. But just a reminder, patrons, stick around for our extended show. Good day, Internet. It is Friday in the US. Sometimes we do quizzes, but today it's a proust questionnaire. But just a reminder, you can catch a show live Monday through Friday at 4 p.m. Eastern 20 hundred UTC. You can find out more at daily tech news show dot com slash live. We're going to be back Monday. It is W W D C day and Mika Montford and Terence Kans from the SNOW OS podcast will join us then have a great week out. This week's episodes of daily tech news show were created by the following people, host producer and writer Tom Merritt, host producer and writer Sarah Lane, executive producer and booker Roger Chang, producer, writer and host Rich Truffalino, video producer and Twitch producer Joe Coons, technical producer Anthony Lemos, Spanish language host, writer and producer Dan Campos, science correspondent Dr. Nikki Ackermans, social media producer and moderator Sui Deterding, our Malaads, Beatmaster, W Scrooge One, BioCow, CapCipper, Steve Guadarrama, Paul Reese, Matthew J Stevens, AKA Gidget Virtuoso and JD Galloway, mod and video hosting by Dan Christensen. Music and art provided by Martin Bell, Dan Looters, Gustafa A, ACAST and Lynn Peralta. ACAST adds support from Tatiana Matias. Contributors for this week's shows include Chris Ashley, Scott Johnson and Justin Robert Young. Yes, on this big show included Ron Richards. And thanks to all the patrons who make the show possible. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com.


Okay, alright, hello my name is Theodo and I'm with SETA Company Limited. Over here we have the CO MCT 2.1, actually. It's a multi-crop treasure that basically is powered by an 18-horsepower diesel engine where you can treasure variety of crops like sodom, maize, millet, rice and a number of crops that are found in sub-Saharan, Syria's are found in sub-Saharan Africa. So what the operator basically does is that he just stands here, they give him whatever crop that it is that they are treaching and then he just feeds through here, the treaching goes on here within this chamber which maybe you could just have a look at. So that rotates. Yeah, that rotates actually. Then the chap is thrown out through this end of the treasure and then when you see here the bags are replaced here to collect the grains that actually come out. So basically that's how the machine works. Awesome!