Let me introduce our second panel. We are privileged to have addressing this topic, the current economic crisis facing people of color, a distinguished panel of people representing, well, all hues of the human mosaic. Our moderator is Jacqueline Paida, who is the Executive Director of the National Congress of American Indians. She herself is a member of the Klingit tribe and has been to Washington for a little while now. She worked in the Clinton administration in the Department of Housing and Urban Development as Deputy Assistant Secretary for Native American Programs. She has extensive experience on lots of national boards and I view her as a trusted and valued partner in the progressive fight for making sure that the economy works well for everybody and that no one is forgotten and we are so thankful that she could join us as moderator for this panel. We have Mark Hugo Lopez, who is to my far left, who is the newly installed as of last Thursday Director of the Pew Hispanic Center, so we can give Mark a public round of applause. Mark's extensive research studies the attitudes and the opinions of Latinos and their views of identity and political engagement. And Mark oversees and directs the Pew's annual National Survey of Latinos, which I know is an incredibly valuable tool for all of us as we try to incorporate the Latino community into a lot of our work. Next to Mark is Mr. William Spriggs, who is the Chief Economist here at the AFL-CIO. And Bill comes to the AFL-CIO after a stint in the Department of Labor as the Assistant Secretary, excuse me, in the Office of Policy. Bill is also a Professor in and the former chair of the Department of Economics at Howard University. Bill, welcome. Thank you. Next to Bill is Ms. Lisa Hasagawa, who is the Executive Director of the National Coalition for Asian and Pacific American Community Development. Lisa has led their efforts to be a voice for the community development needs of the low-income Asian American and Pacific Islander community since 2000. Before that, Lisa was the community liaison for the White House Initiative on Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders. And they have an outstanding report on low-income Asian American and Pacific Islanders, which hopefully you saw at the literature table when you came in. And then we, oh, that's everybody. So without further ado, I'm going to turn it over to Jacqueline to get this second panel started off right. Thank you. Thank you so much. So as you said, our panel is about unfinished March, the panel focused on the economy. And there isn't anybody in this room or actually anybody in this panel who probably couldn't, you know, recite the data, the demographics of the communities that you come from, the impact of the current economic crisis to your community. And certainly the need for economic justice from the communities that we move forward. So I wanted to be able to make sure that at this panel that we talk not only about what the, you know, the economic crisis really is within our communities, but really about how do we march forward, that the focus and the message should really be about moving forward. In fact, I want to just reflect it, you know, about 16 days after the March that we're all here to talk about. But Bobby Kennedy actually came to National Congress of American Indians, a little known fact probably in this room. So that's why I wanted to use this moment to tell it to you. And he made a statement that he said he noted the irony that native people have been denied equal opportunity in the greatest free country of the world. And then he quoted Chief Joseph of the Nez Pierce tribe who said, made the statement in 1877.  And I actually think that statement, although we probably wouldn't use those same words today, the thought behind it is reality, the harsh reality that from access to equal education to financial services to affordable housing, all of those things create real barriers to our economic abilities of our communities today. So today, we're going to join by the right panel of the right folks here with Bill Spriggs and Mark Lopez and Lisa Hasegawa. We're going to have that conversation. So Lisa, I want to start with you. And I want to present it in a way because I'm hoping what we get out of this is that we're all thinking about messaging moving forward, messaging moving forward. And so I want to say, if you were contacted by a journalist and a journalist said, how would you describe the current crisis for our collective community? What would that look like and what would you say? Always the easy question. Well, I've been actually thinking about this a lot because as our introducer and emcee said, we have this report coming out. So let me see if I can take a stab at it. First of all, I think I would frame it as a broader economic justice framework and a conversation. There's a moment, I think, for a conversation about the intersections between race and class. Because I think one other thing I think that's very interesting is the number of immigrants that are here in this country today who were not here in as many numbers in the 60s or even before in the 40s. And so I think I would frame it in terms of an opportunity for a common cause. And the Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders will not be used as a wedge community because I think that oftentimes when it comes to framing a lot of issues related to income inequalities, Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders are lumped all together as Asian slash other and we talk about this all the time and we track with whites or we're doing better than whites. And that's the narrative over and over and over again that national capacity focused on low income Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders and those who are in poverty and those who are the most economically vulnerable, we really try to flip the script and say not necessarily in comparison, it's not this race to the bottom, but really I think that there's a broader common cause and that all people of color and all of society really need to focus on economic inequalities that are impacting all of us. And so I think that that would be my broader frame because I would assume that if they were talking to me, they're probably thinking that I'm going to talk about the market potential of the immigrant community or something like that. And I would want to kind of poke at that a little bit because that stereotype of the model minority I think is still very present and I get that sort of assumption when I talk to a lot of reporters. And so immediately I think that my task in talking to reporters is to break that down fast and quick and really talk about the two million, I talk now often about the two million Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders that are living under the poverty level and the fact that that population has grown by 40% in the wake of the economic crisis. And I talk about the fact that as a community, including all the rich, wealthy Asian American founders of Yahoo, et cetera, in our community, we talk about the fact that as an Asian American and Pacific Islander community, we've lost 50% of our wealth. And so I think that those are all things that all of us in the API community should be concerned about and should feel that we have common cause with other communities of color and other low income communities. Okay, so Mark, so if you want to make sure the story is really told straight, what would you add? Well, I would add the story of the Latino community, what's been happening in the last few years. And I think there's a number of parts to this economic story that are really quite interesting. On the one hand, the data shows that we see more Latinos living in poverty than ever, particularly more Latino children living in poverty than ever. We also saw during the recession that many Latinos lost their jobs and a plumber for Latinos was among the first to really rise quickly. And when it comes to household wealth, Latinos lost a lot of household wealth during the recession, particularly because of where they bought homes, that was a part of the story. But broadly speaking, a lot of economic impacts of the recession on the Latino community. After several years of gains, particularly when it comes to unemployment, Latinos really closed in the unemployment gap with non-Latinos at least through 2006. But I'd point to another side of the story, which is when you talk to Latinos and you ask them questions about the future, about what they see for the future, there's a lot of optimism among Hispanics about their own personal economic futures, despite how bad things are right now, that things will get better, and particularly that things can be better for their children in the future. And that's where I think there's some really interesting things, as you mentioned, looking forward, what to do. So far, in the last few years, particularly after the recession, we've seen a real surge in college enrollments of young Latinos going to college. And many Hispanic adults will tell you that education is important, a very important issue to them. When you ask young Latinos, what do you need to be successful in life? Many will say it's a college degree. So as we're looking forward, I think that we see for Latino adults a belief that the future will be better for their children, but also a real belief as well that it's important to have a college education to be successful. So looking forward, I think there's a lot of optimism and potential with the Latino community, but that story is still being written. We aren't done yet. There's a lot still to be done. There are still disparities to be addressed and to be studied and explored. But nonetheless, we see in our surveys a sense of optimism about the future, particularly around the importance of education. Okay, great. So once again, going back to the story that we're messaging, but I really think that not only do we take a snapshot at like what is it like right now, I think it's important for us to figure out what policies, what were the impacts and why did we get here? And of course, Bill, I'm going to give you the tough question. So what were the, what was the situation or the circumstances that actually led in America of the free to be able to become to this place right now that we're at? What do you, you have any thoughts that you'd like to share about that? Well, it's had a couple of policy change in terms of the sea change. How do we view policy? What do we do policy for? Right after the Great Depression, everyone was convinced that was the worst thing that could have ever happened. So after World War II, and we saw employment go up because of the war, everyone was afraid that after the war and the industrial power that had to be brought to for to win the war, that we would go straight back to depression. So Congress had a debate in 1945 and passed an act in 1946 to make it the policy of the United States government to seek employment. Now, in 1945, it was supposed to be full employment. And they actually in 1945 talked about guaranteeing that an American had a right to a job by 1946. It wasn't, but we're not going to guarantee a job, but we're definitely, the policy is employment. And over time, we moved until in 1976 and facing more unemployment. Yet again, we had the Congressional Black Caucus and Congressman Hawkins and then teaming with Senator Humphrey from Minnesota, a debate about full employment. And then you see it's, well, there's full employment, there's price stability, there's fair trade, there's balanced government. I mean, we added these different policy tools. Employment stopped being the center focus. In fact, today, if you look back at 1963 and complain about unemployment, they were very upset because the unemployment rate had got to 6%. This is horrible. The world is going to end. And the march was about full employment with this reference back to a view that even 6% is not tolerable, that we need to get the number lower. And of course, today, we would declare this as victory. So part of it is discussion, part of it is public discussion, part of it is how we view employment as being central to what people have to have, the access to a job. We don't talk about it in the same way. We have Congress and the President debating about deficits.  They're not debating that the world is going to end because of the lack of employment. Despite the fact that for young people in the United States, those under 24, this is the worst labor market in the history of the whole United States. There has never been, in any period, this difficulty for people who are young, black, white, yellow, anything to get a job. Typically, we just finish with high school graduation. Typically, 18 to 19-year-olds, economic history, somewhere around 50, 55% would be employed. They're suffering below 40%. And they've been suffering below 40% for over four years. Fewer than 40% of those 18 to 19-year-olds hold a job. That's not sustainable for our country. And it doesn't get much better as we look at those who are going to add to the population of finishing college and finishing community college. They are still suffering from record low employment opportunities, taking us all the way back to the 1960s when we know many women wouldn't have been in the labor force in that age group. So the fact that we don't have a national conversation about this, the fact that the media doesn't beat up on Congress and on the president and tell them shame on you that you're debating about the federal deficit 40 years from now. This is what they're arguing about. What will the deficit look like in 2050? OK, but today, the deficit is for young people to have a job. Today, the deficit is that we don't have public infrastructure that works. Today, the deficit is that we are still down in public employment. And again, that change in conversation, national defense education act passed after Sputnik was launched. The response in less than a year was for the federal government to step in and promote adding enough teachers to keep the baby boomers from having super crowded classrooms. We've lost over 300,000 teachers in this downturn. Our Congress or the president arguing about where we're going to get the 300,000 teachers in order to keep our classroom sizes the same for this generation? No, they're arguing about how much they're going to raise the interest rate to charge the students to get a degree in the first place. So this misplaced conversation, this misplaced priority, that's the problem that we're facing right now. And in 1963, I think they were astounded that we let the unemployment rate get to this level and let the conversation about the need for employment and the need for investment in our young people and the need for investment in our infrastructure get so lost because we're worrying about 2050 and whether rich people have to pay taxes and act like adults and pay the tax rates of those in 1963 and act like adults and understand that as American citizens they have to support their government. So Mark, you get to come to this conversation that Bill has put on the table and obviously when you're coming to this conversation, you need to bring suggestions and so Bill's pretty, he did a great job laying it out. So what are some of your suggestions? Well, I certainly think that looking forward to the next few decades, and this is particularly for the Latino community, it's really an importance of education and preparing people for the job market. And we see that both in terms of public opinion among Latinos, how important that is, but also just looking at what's happening in terms of enrollment trends and completion of high school among Latinos, there have been some improvements. So I think that the future for Latinos could be bright, but it depends on many different things. About what to do, it's hard for me to make a recommendation partly because of the Pew Research Center and we're non-partisan and non-advocacy, but certainly many Latinos point to the value of a college education and the need to get that college education. How that happens, there's a number of ways that can happen, it could be everything from loans to students to help them get to school, it could be offering or providing more opportunities to get to college by building more colleges and universities, so there's a number of different ways that this can happen, but for Latinos, certainly education is gonna be an important part of that future story. Lisa? I think that I feel like representing one of the organizations here that's an institution, it's you and I, who are heads of these national organizations, I really feel like the infrastructure and the organizational infrastructure that we have now representing people of color at the national level and the number of economists and researchers and technological tools that we have, I was very inspired by the first panel in terms of the history lesson of the March on Washington 50 years and even that it had started in the 40s and my touch point there is that was when my parents and my grandparents were in internment camps and under executive order you were talking about executive orders, I'm thinking executive order 9066, the one that interned the Japanese Americans. So I think that that history lesson was very important and I feel like there's just, and I struggle today knowing my own history, but still even learning more and more at every moment, but with the large number of immigrants or newer immigrants and refugees who've come to this country who still have, I mean I wish I could download this American history into everyone's brains somehow. We can put it in the water or something, it'd be really great because I think that that would be so much, it's so important, right? To be able to figure out how these institutions really are able to move forward, like really knowing our histories. And so I think that in terms of the organizational infrastructure, I was preparing for your question about in 50 years, what next? Okay. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. But I really feel like there's not this sense of a collective cause, of this sort of a people's movement. And I think that it's much more complicated today because there are wealthier Asians, African Americans, Latinos in positions of power, whether they be in the corporate sector or in government, et cetera. And so the sort of consciousness and identity as a people with a common cause, whether it's multi-racial, whether it's by class, race is still very important. It's not important. But figuring out what that frame is that we can all really get behind, I think has been really still a challenge. So I think that that's also part of the solution, trying to figure out what sorts of ways in which we come together, coalitions, because we have a lot more power, even though things are a lot worse, we have a lot more power and we have a lot more access than we ever did before too. So then what is that there? I mean, there's something there. And that's what motivated me was like, Bill's plea to have this conversation, I just felt like he's absolutely right. We need to have this conversation. But then going to your statement, which was if we're thinking about, we're reflecting on this and want to reflect on this 50 years from now, what changes would we have made? What policies recommendations would we have made? Where do we take this leap forward? So we aren't just cycling back to the same conversation over and over again. So Bill, do you wanna give us some ideas of what you would put on the table? Yeah, and I think your question is exactly right. I mean, we're still too defensive. We want to declare a victory from 1963 and still defend that as opposed to take on the challenge ourselves and say, okay, that was good, it was done, what is the logical step and what have we learned? So I think there are a number of things we should have learned. While an outcome of the 1963 March was the establishment of the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, as we heard from the opening panel, it wasn't enough. We know we haven't made many advances. I mean, what people need to think about in the Trayvon Martin case is understand what that jury was saying about young black men. So once you really understand what they're saying about young black men, do you really have to ask, why do young black men have a hard time getting a job? And so in the African-American community, yes, education is important, but we understand there's a lot more going on than whether we're educated or not. And since 1963 in the Civil Rights Act, black educational achievement has gone through the roof. It's a level of education that they couldn't even have dreamed about in 1963, and yet our unemployment rate is worse. Our poverty rate is about the same. So that's not, it's necessary, but it clearly is not the only solution. And so we have to figure out ways to improve on that. We have the anomaly in the Asian-American community that actually they have an inverse relationship with their unemployment rate versus whites. So they seem to do well when they have less education, but the moment they get a college degree, their unemployment rate jumps for young Asian-Americans. It goes the opposite direction. And they have the longest duration of unemployment, even longer than African-Americans, but it's bifurcated. It's both for highly educated Asian-Americans and less educated Asian-Americans. So it's much more complicated than just skills. Well, we're seeing a lot of gaps. We're seeing a lot of gaps, but if those gaps don't get addressed in future policies we go forward, they just create a greater divide. Yes, and so we have to be far more effective in what we do on equal employment, but we have to be committed to the public sector. And we have to understand this downturn that we just had. We insured Wall Street. We said Wall Street cannot fail. There are banks too big to fail. This downturn was the biggest decline in revenue for state and local government ever. And it was prolonged. And the length and the depth of it has resulted in lower public employment. And there is no clear path that it will come back. Yet, we know we still need teachers. We still would like to have police on the beat. We would still like to have firefighters. We still want to have all the same public services. Our demand for public services can't depend on the business cycle. The federal government, just as it realized, said, well, you have to have the investment sector. You have to have a public sector. And so when we have these downturns, the federal government must step in to ensure the revenue stream for state and local government. The problem Detroit faced is that- State, local, and tribal government. And tribal government. Okay. The problem that people forget about Detroit, unlike many municipalities that depend on revenue from real estate tax, their government runs on income taxes. They never recovered from 2001. The black unemployment rate never recovered from 2001. That downturn decimated the revenue stream for that city, and it never came back. If there are banks that are too big to fail, and we have to step in to make sure that they function, there are cities that are too big to fail. We just saw a bankruptcy of one of those cities. Yes. And so it's not enough for the administration to say, oh, we're behind you, Detroit. No. We said to Wall Street, $800 billion were behind you. So that's being behind me. Okay. Okay, so Mark, if you want to get a policy that's behind you, what would be some of those policies you'd be putting forth? So Wall Street caused more damage than what we have put into the budget. There needs to be a financial transaction tax because when they gamble, we lose. And they have to pay for cleaning up the whole mess, not just their mess, not just the mess that let them get their jobs back, get their bonuses back, and then argue for a tax cut after they got their bonuses. And we saved their bankrupt companies. If we saved AIG that was bankrupt, we can save Detroit that's bankrupt. And if AIG, people who caused the downturn in the first place could get a bonus because it's saved in their contract, they have to get a bonus, then Detroit City workers can get a pension just like it's said in their contract. Mark, what would you like to add to this conversation? I don't know what to add. A couple of things I would add, you've asked us to take a look to the future. Right. And I want to add a couple of things about the nation's demographics and how things are changing. Certainly by 2050, the United States is gonna be a very different country than it is today just because of the changing demographics which are already underway. We could already see it among young people today. But you're gonna see a nation that is not majority white that's gonna be different in terms of both the demographic and economic characteristics of the country. Also, it'll be a more foreign-born country than it is today because we've certainly seen over the last 20 years a large inflows of immigrants and it's likely that we're gonna see more immigrants coming to the United States which of course makes the United States very unique and different from other countries in the world with 40 million immigrants now and no other country even comes close. But looking to the future, it's gonna be a very different picture demographically. Now that doesn't mean of course that everybody is gonna have great economic opportunity in the future. We don't know where all of that will be and everything that you've just mentioned are gonna be important parts in shaping that economic future. It'll also be important to see how young people today come of age. And what type of economy they come of age in. So when you ask us to take a look to the future, I think there's a tremendous number of opportunities. There's a tremendous number of challenges as well. I think everything you said here of course plays into shaping that America for the future which will be a very different country than what we see today. Great, great comments. Lisa, would you like to? Sure, I have a whole list. Okay, good. I wanna hear your list about the future. Well, my first thing was multiracial people's movement for full employment would be really awesome in 50 years to be able to say that we started somewhere in the 2020s maybe. Are we gonna work on this? I just wanted to just also talk about the fact we are in the House of Labor and there's been a long history of Asian-Americans and Pacific Islanders in the history, in the labor movement, in the union organizing. And I feel like there are many, many causes that really could be framed as things that Asian-Americans and Pacific Islanders could get behind, whether, you know, so then it was, you know, Philipp Veracruz and the strikes with the, in California with the grapes. And, you know, there's Carl Yoneda, there's Art Takei, there's so many labor leaders, but I think that the large rates of, high rates of incarceration and racial profiling, I think that the South Asian community and the Native Hawaiian communities very much relate to that. I think the issues with voter ID, you know, you've got older African-Americans and immigrants who are like, you know, really that's something I think we could mobilize around a lot more, living wages and jobs. I think that, you know, the work on a lot of the safety net and anti-poverty programs, nobody really talks about that anymore. There's not an active, I think, advocacy movement that particularly has both a racial justice land as well as an economic justice lands. Where is that infrastructure? I think that labor has been amazing in trying to really bring together African-Americans and immigrant communities around immigration reform and saying this is about all of us, the future of this country. I think that, you know, the work that a lot of us up here on the stage have done around housing and what's gone down with the financial crisis. I think that those are some of the things where we need a much more robust conversation about how all of those things come together. And I think that particularly communities of color and knowing some of this history, we need to claim it and really move forward in a much more direct and intentional way. So Mark talked about the fact that the demographics of our country are changing. And certainly that we will see in the near future where the minority is now the majority. And if you think about something Dr. Martin Luther King said in one of his speeches when he talked about the fear and the fear of not knowing each other. And sometimes that creates a crisis for working together. And so we have a changing demographic. We still have a gap in our economies and the fear of not working together. How do we as organizers or how do we as leaders and champions bring together the kind of collaborative environment to have this conversation that Bill has now put on our table that we want to have about moving forward? And what can we do to help organize or message that or bring that forward? Anybody have any thoughts that you want to add? Let's say events like this are an important part of this. They have a conversation where we all talk about all the different experiences of all these different groups. But events like this I think are very important part of that movement forward. Well and I think we have to be right about where the problem is coming. We looking back in 1963 to today would see a much smaller labor movement in terms of the share of workers who are organized. When workers had a voice, they had a way of making sure that the pie was going to be divided a little more fairly. Since the 1970s, the pie isn't divided more fairly. More and more goes to profit, interest, less goes to workers. And as we shrink the pie for workers, then of course it turns into a fight among ourselves about a smaller and smaller pie. We're not creating a smaller pie. We have to point to the right people who are creating the smaller pie. We need government to take the side of those of us who are earning our pay versus those of us who are speculating on Wall Street and betting on horses. And I think when we do that, then we can understand and my fear is that we won't reach that soon enough, but we can understand that rather than workers picking on each other, it's really how do we get a voice back to workers? How do we get a voice back to those of us who get up and actually earn a paycheck and make something? And how do we then re-divide the pie and make policies that are fair for everyone? Just one comment. I think that maybe you can help me out here but there are cities that are going to be majority, minority, sooner rather than 2050 or 2020 whenever the country is going to turn. 2040, there you go. I knew it was somewhere in there. And so I think that it could be really interesting to go a lot deeper in a couple of those places where there's a pretty diverse demographic and also where there's going to be that tipping point because I am concerned of what's gonna happen. And I think that as national leaders we should be figuring that out. I agree, but I think one of the challenges is that we seem to be somewhat cyclical which means that we all say the right things about we want to be the, about employers and getting a job, employment and getting a job, but then when, and I'm not talking we collected, I'm talking we Americans, and we get to the position where we actually are a little bit taking care of more than our needs by what we're earning and our earning mechanisms. Sometimes the values change. And I guess my next question to you is how do we think about the American dream and reiterate the values that once again put all of us at an equal playing field level? How do we then go back to the, whether it be the Martin Luther King I had a dream or the Bobby Kennedy, you know, equal rights, equal opportunities and how can we ourselves within our individuals with groups, within our groups but how can we once again tie ourselves to those principles of equal opportunity? What I was gonna say, EPI actually has a really good website on what policies drove this level of inequality between the 1% and the other 99% of us. And I think looking at those series of policies whether it's the deconstruction of the safety net for workers and taking away their rights to organize, taking away their pension, taking away their healthcare and retirement, whether it's free trade agreements that end up decimating the wages of American workers. I mean, all of these things are policy choices that we have made and it's really empowering us to say, no, we understand those outcomes, no matter how you gloss it up, we understand what they did to us as the American people and as American workers and lets us then talk about fighting against those kind of policies, the kind of policies that Congressman Ellison kicked us off with saying that we had to stop. And I think that that's a useful tool if you go to the website and sort of look at it as broken down in a way that I think most people can follow. You know, I think even in my own community, and Mark maybe you might be able to speak to this, but when we start talking about complex financial terms or understanding certain interest rates and impact or even talking about the national debt in a way that doesn't just relate to their immediate home situation, it's difficult for people to understand these pieces and the impact with federal policy. And I think as a community, community of color, this is our challenge. We tried to have a conversation before about when we talked about wealth gap or when we talked about asset building, we've had conversations and yet we still haven't gotten the traction, I believe, that Bill you were talking about in the dialogue that we need. Mark, do you have some ideas? Well, certainly when you take a look at data for Latinos, many Latinos don't, for example, have a bank account. A recent report from the National Council of La Raza covered this particular point. And when you take a look at wealth building in Latinos, even prior to the recession, while many owned homes and the home ownership rate for Latinos was rising to a record high right before the recession, one of the things that's interesting to take a look at is where Latinos are building their wealth. In many respects, oftentimes the asset that many Latinos would have, sometimes it would be the only asset that they would have would be something like a vehicle as opposed to some sort of an asset like a 401k. They're less likely to have those assets. So when you talk about financial literacy and then being able to connect that to what's happening in Washington, what's happening more broadly in the financial community, one of our surveys a few years ago, there's sure that many Latinos were unaware of the connections on where the credit crisis came from and how that may have impacted them. So certainly I agree with you that in many respects, this is one area where focusing on financial literacy and also drawing those connections might be very important. And Lisa, if you're thinking about marching on Washington because Bill has now motivated us and we're gonna march to Washington so we can change the future, I mean, how are you gonna rally your folks? And good question. I was just thinking, I feel like we have to do a lot of political education. I mean, it sounds really basic and not super sexy, but there's so much just like history telling and storytelling and information sharing, translation, like when I talk about translation, my work of translation is translating the crazy language of this city to the rest of the folks outside of this city. It's not about any Asian language of which I don't speak any. So, but I've been, I've learned the DC language a little bit and then that constant work of having to translate to the rest of the world, I feel like we need to do that in a much more deliberate way. So I think it is about the grassroots organizing, it is about the local kind of political education and having a larger conversation. We keep saying we need to have a larger public dialogue or conversation about it. I think Trayvon Martin, everything that happened around that, everything with the blogs and everything that was happening amongst particularly amongst young people I thought was encouraging because I felt like there's a connectedness there that we need to tap into and a consciousness of the importance of race in all of this. So something, I don't know, it's not so sexy, but organizing in a lot of political education, I don't think we do enough of it intentionally. Thank you. Thank you. So I'd like to conclude our panel by making the saying this quote, and what about the future? I believe there are signs of change, clear signs of turning the tide. America today is moving forward more rapidly and in more ways than ever before. Moving forward, the fulfillment of its destiny and the land of the free, a nation in which neither Indians nor any other racial or religious minority will live in underprivileged. These are the words of Robert F. Kennedy in the address at 50 years ago to a National Congress American Indians. And he saw a bright future then. We are making progress for achieving that future. And I want to, and I think that these panelists have shown us that the march is not done. We have much more work to do because we want to engage this conversation that Bill put forward. We want to organize like Lisa said and get a message forward. And we want to be able to make sure that we bring all of our people forward. As Mark said, thank you panelists for joining in this conversation.