Thanks for checking out this movie review video. Once again, this is a review So therefore there will be no spoilers on this because this is a movie that just kind of recently came out it's on the shutter streaming service and Once again, I totally endorse this this platform. It is awesome If you like horror, there's no reason that you shouldn't have this at right now And the other thing is this video is coming out before the deadline May 8th May 8th The pricing on shutter is going to increase So if you get signed up prior to that you're going to get kind of grandfathered into the old pricing Which is if you pay a year up front is $4 a month if you're going month-to-month is $5 a month So actually, I don't know how that'll work if the $5 a month like if you would only get that for the first month Since you're paying month-to-month. I don't know you'd have to look and I don't know what the price is going up To I was having a hard time actually trying to research that I just couldn't find it anywhere So I'm assuming it's not going to be crazy, but just to be safe sign up now If you've even been playing with the idea of getting shutter just do it. Trust me It is 100% worth it 100% worth it if you watch one horror movie a month It is definitely worth it. So anyway, that said this is a review for the movie monster party that just went up on shutter within the past few weeks and This movie I'm sorry. I'm looking down because I have notes on my phone that I just put there this movie Hit me in the middle. There are some things. I really liked about it There are some things I really didn't like about it overall It's fine if you like what you're hearing here saying spoilers because I'm not doing spoilers I would just say go ahead and check it out. I'm glad I watched it. It's one of those movies where I'm like I watched it I'm not upset that I spent the time watching it, but I'm not gonna watch it again most likely and it kind of seems more to me like If you do watch it once if you have any Interest in it past that maybe just put it on in the background while you're doing something So you don't have to fully pay attention to it. So anyway, so going off my notes I would say The music like the actual like full-on songs that were used in this film were Integrated extremely well. They went with the movie They added like a cool fun element to it And I really liked how the actual songs like straight-up songs were integrated into it now the underlying music the actual soundtrack Kind of off at times and I say that because like the very first song actually I will say qualifier the very first song in the film is Weird the way with what's going on and how it matches up. It's weird. It doesn't work for me The sound track throughout it gets a little out of control in my opinion It goes overboard because when it has like those moments of dread where it would it would be better to kind of like subtly Kind of add a little bit of dread to the to the moment It's like just hits you and it's just like dread and you're like, okay, let's let's you know, let's Take it down a little bit take it down a few notches like I understand what's supposed to be going on here And then I'm supposed to feel a certain way, but you don't have to hit me in the head with a hammer with this So that just kind of bothered me.  The other thing is there's there's a There's okay It's weird to me because there's the one of the characters has asthma and it's really like focused on but it has no implication Like there's no pretty much no importance to it in the film And it's just kind of a throwaway thing where I'm just like why was that even in there? But my my issue with the portrayal of asthma in films is it's not like a big thing But I actually have asthma so like I've had to use inhalers before Thankfully, I'm on some medication where it takes care of my allergies and my asthma at the same time So I haven't really had to use an inhaler in a while, which is nice But the way people use inhalers and movies are just like And then immediately you actually have to hold it like for a while Because then it's like in your lungs and it's actually like having your bronchia bronchi I think expand so you can get more air capacity More air lung capacity more lung air capacity Whatever So, but it's just a minor thing. It's just like a personal pet peeve I know a lot of people would see it and just be like yeah, whatever done bottom me all just saying that's a small thing So there's a really weird moment in this film that really threw me off and I was like this doesn't feel like it fits You should take this out It's actually comes off as being really stupid because there's nothing else in the film That is like that it's just like this one moment where a character has on the side to the camera and They break that fourth wall and at no other point in the film Does anyone play to the camera or talk to the camera or even look at the camera? So it's like why like why did you do this?  It's dumb. It doesn't make sense. It's just I hated it I thought it was a very poor choice You really just like messed up the flow of the film and and you make audience your audience be like why like why? Especially in retrospect after the film is done. Like why did you put that in there? There was no point. It's like the asthma thing like that character with the asthma no point The aside to the camera no point like why are you doing this and breaking it once you break the fourth wall You need to integrate that into the film You need to make that part of the film because breaking the fourth wall is a big no-no in filmmaking So if you're gonna do it, you need to play to it You need to incorporate it into the actual story and they didn't not one iota and it was just like okay. That's dumb So overall acting a few of the performances in this were really good really well done like You know robin tunny is is like the one like the bigger of the names You know she's from like the craft and she she did a pretty good job There are a few other people who did a pretty good job, but there are also some people that were really over the top Well, actually I'd say between just over the top and really over the top they kind of Fit in the middle of that. I don't know why I did it like this Well, I guess because it's like a graph going up So yeah, like in the middle of it is um, yeah there's some really over-the-top type stuff and it's uh Acting wise and you're just like all right just like the the soundtrack issue You're like tone it down, please tone it down just a little bit for me But overall I thought the acting was pretty solid appropriate enough One of my big issues I always have issues this isn't an issue with the the movie itself This is an issue with people putting out movie trailers period I always have issues with movie trailers Well, not always usually because they show too much of the film Literally, there are times where I go to the theater. I see a trailer and I'm like I just saw the whole movie I don't even need to see that and literally there are times where seeing the trailer will make me not see the movie Because I'm like that's the movie. I don't need to know anything else. I don't care to know anything else That's it. You gave too much away. I'm done. I'm not watching it And this is kind of a little bit of one of those situations where if you've seen the trailer for this movie You pretty much know what's going on. There are a few small surprises that happen throughout the film that I did enjoy So I'm sorry. There's like cat fur flying in the air. It's weird There are yeah, there are some small surprises that ended up working really well And they're fun and it's cool. But the problem is if you've seen the trailer it ruins a lot of the film But it's also I mean it's a fun enough time.  I kind of like to watch a movie with that premise Then I don't think you should Not see it like go ahead and watch it. But like I said, it's just worth watching once in my opinion Although I will say there is a small small payoff to having seen the trailer and then seeing the movie Is there some double entendre that ends up going on in the dialogue? Especially in the probably like first half hour of the film Where if you've seen the trailer and you pretty much know where everything's gonna end up going You see the double meanings in what's being said and you're just like, oh, okay That's clever because there is some clever dialogue writing. There's some Not that like some pretty cliche dialogue in here, but there's I think there's more cleverness in the dialogue than cliche. So it's kind of a mix It's not a super original script to be honest Um, but like I said, I just did a review for an independent film called the fear footage And one of the things I said in that review, which you should check out is um Like we're getting to a point where there really aren't any super original ideas because everyone's kind of influenced by some films Because there's so much film out there at this point So I don't really like fault the people who made this film for it not being super original I'm just stating like going into it. Just no, it's not super original. There's a lot of I I mean, it's kind of a face value premise in a sense, but it's a fun premise like I enjoyed it It's it's worth seeing this premise played out. Like it's good enough in my opinion.  I wasn't expecting. So thank you um And then You know and I'm I'm doing a rating on this and I was going to rate it higher Until the very very end of the film happened and I was like Okay Because they went from being able to stop it at a logical Uh Like good point To going just going off the cliff and being like, let's just do this instead Let's take it further way further than we need to wait for it further than we should Especially because what ends up happening in the very very end has implications With the one of the main characters where like there's a whole goal There's a whole outcome in this film for this character That would tie things up that would take care of stuff And then what they do in the very end has implications that nullifies all of that And just makes it like and nothing basically mattered in a sense And it's like come on You didn't need to it seemed kind of more like let's get crazy like the filmmakers were like Let's get crazy now because we can like we have a little bit more on the budget. Let's go nuts Let's have fun like those are the moments where as a filmmaker you need to look at the whole thing View it from an audience standpoint and say Do I need to rein myself in on this right now? Do I need to stop myself from doing this or is this okay? Will this be good in the film? And I know there are probably some people who watch it and we're like, yeah, that's what I want because it goes It feeds to a certain Feeling that some people may have and I'm not going further in In defining that because I don't want to spoil anything with it because I think if you have had interest you should watch it but Like I understand there are probably people who are like, oh, I really like the ending of it And if that was you comment down here and let me know why that's fine Um, it's just my personal thing. Obviously all my reviews are just strictly personal opinions. So It's going to be different for everyone and that's good. That's what makes the world go around So, um, yeah for me, it just it went over the top and it It made me not like it as much. So I was going to go ahead and give this film out of three out of five stars With halves included. I was going to give it a three, but with that ending I'm knocking it down to a 2.5 Because I feel like it undid a lot of the stuff I kind of liked about it So it firmly put me in the middle 2.5 out of five is Right smack in the middle. So really that's how I feel about this film. There was a bunch of good There was a bunch of bad and it just put me in the middle on the film and I'm just like It's a 2.5 because I cannot say That I'm more towards the negative or more towards the positive. I just can't so um But like I said, you know, if you've seen the trailer or you've heard about this movie or This review makes you at all intrigued. Watch it. You know, there's no reason you shouldn't experience these films for themselves And here I am giving you my my personal opinions on this. Yours may be totally different Which is why even when you watch these reviews or anyone's reviews or read reviews or see internet movie database ratings or rotten tomatoes or whatever You should watch this film anyway Because you may feel differently about it because everyone experiences film in a different way I'm just giving you my experience my personal opinions. Check it out for yourself. That's what I'd say for everything But anyway, that kind of wraps this up for me Uh People throw out some more recommendations. Um, I'm going to be doing a movie analysis coming up that was um Requested by viewer uncle or subscriber to me uncle pete. I'm going to take care of that Uh, but going forward, I would like people to put down in the comments recommendations for films They want to see me either review or do analysis on uh on shutter specifically because I just want to keep pushing the shutter thing Because I just love it so much. I have nothing to do with them monetarily except i'm giving them my money For the service, but uh, I just like it. I like it a lot and I watch that way more than netflix at this point I used to watch a lot of netflix I watch barely any netflix now because I watch mainly shutter and that's that says something So yeah, so give me some recommendations down in the comments say i'd like you to review this or analyze this And just so you know if it's an older film on there I'll do the analysis if it's a newer film. I'm probably not going to do the analysis I'll do just this review without spoilers because it's newer and I don't want to put You know spoilers out there as much, you know like let more people experience it for themselves But if it's older enough people definitely should have seen it I can do a deep dive and give spoilers no problem Uh, the other thing is please please please if you've seen anything in any videos i've done Hit that subscribe It can mean a lot for my channel as far as growth and it means I can do more and it just encourages me to be honest Hit the notification bell if you want to know every time I have a video up And if you're the person who checks that out immediately or the few people who do It can really help with getting more views on it, which can help my channel out So I love that thumbs ups are cool You can thumbs down if you really feel like it that doesn't do anything because the thumbs up and thumbs down Really don't mean a whole lot to be honest It's mainly subscribing and putting down some comments because I want to interact with you guys But thank you so much for checking this out and until next time keep it brutal


Yeah, I don't want a censor tube. I got days of destruction Days of revolt thanks to your recommendation. Scary eye-opening scary eye-opening gang. What are we picking? What are we picking? All the God says 19 All the God says 19 Let's check it out. It's coming out. It's coming out lonely piggy salutation. Oh All the God you got one of the numbers We got book number nine. Let's check it out. Let's check it out. We got book number nine. What's book number nine? Oh Oh my god, this is the one you were like, no The real Anthony Fauci now This is the one where we're gonna know.  Because of this book because there's no way I'm gonna say it was safe and effective I Don't guess depending on the page we pick right Sensor do my night late us So just the heads up gang just the heads up, right? So we got the real Anthony Fauci the real Anthony Fauci Bill Gates big pharma and the global war on democracy and public health by Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. New York Times best-selling author Children's health defense Right chop chop chop Let's check it out. Sorry. Oh God. Well, it was nice Having you on sensor, too. I mean what we could do as well Really gang You guys let me know Should we end the stream right now on sensor, too? What do people say on sensor, too? What do people say on twitch? What are you guys? What are you guys thinking? Because you know What do you say? God The only thing I'd say end it doesn't risk your channel Everyone put up their big pants roll the dice K K and P master on sensor tube says roll the dice lonely figure says I'd say end it Don't risk your channel howl says. Yeah, don't risk it Sometimes Mike damn torpedoes. Yeah. Yeah. So we got two people saying don't risk it I would almost tend to agree with them, right? I would tend to agree. So K and P master wait Piggy is right. Keanu says Piggy is right. Don't don't risk it. So we got Three people I need those ASMR vids. Don't risk it. Okay Yeah, I had planned on live streaming the whole thing on sensor, too Electric railway sensor to audience needs to hear your other opinions I already got silent silent the reading on to silent silent the reading on to Can I silent the reading if I don't know how to do that sometimes Mike all seriousness probably best not to tempt bait Okay, maybe not. Maybe you don't have to end it but don't say Cov 19 or V use code. I can't do that if I'm reading it. I don't want to do it on that level post rumble link, okay I'm gonna post the rumble link. Okay. It looks like we're gonna end it kank So let me post the rumble link. Oh, yeah, that's the rumble like I gotta grab it like this Hold on a second Okay Here's the rumble link someone wanted to post it Hey, where is it chat? Hey? What's going on? There we go Okay, there's a rumble linking and I'll post a twitch one as well if people want twitch so again Just so people appreciate it. This is the level of insanity that exists on Technocratic sensor platforms. We can't even read a book For those that haven't appreciated how ridiculous censorship is It is what it is gang. Those are the links for those of you watching This lives the video of this live stream on sensor to this is going to be the sensor to segment Oh, I should put this up. You can watch the full live stream on twitch That's where we're live streaming.  You're gonna miss out on the other two books We're gonna read today, but it is what it is. Okay.  Okay, links in the description of this video. I'm gonna end sensor to Okay, we ended sensor to gain so Crazy Absolutely insane like really let me make sure it's ended there. It's still going What's going on? Why is it still going? Is it still going? Oh No, it's a replay. Is it replay? It's a replay Must be let me make sure this is ended or someone else can confirm. I find this absolutely insane Absolutely insane. This says I'm live. I live. What's going on? I'm gonna make it private actually because it just ended so Edits share Edit video because after live streams, I'm making private anyway, so I'm just gonna make it private private done safe Okay, sensor to band it. Okay It's live Is it still live? Oh my god. Yeah, dang It says I've ended it here on my OBS. Is it still live? It shouldn't be live What's going on? Sensor to I Should check chat just because you guys are probably checking as well Okay. Yeah, it's not live anymore. Good Let's see. Okay. Good Hold on. Yeah, good. I'm assuming it's gone. It's not live anymore, right? Oh good. It's down. It's down Okay, it was a minute behind. Okay. Awesome. Thanks all the God. Yeah, it's dead now. Baby night says. Ah, yes freedom at last freedom freedom Random moose brain. Hello to each one chat salutations salutations. I'm gonna kill the Sensor to chat as well Do a little movement up here Crazy can't even read a book you can't even read. This is digital book burning live digital book burning Wow, wow, wow and people think this is cool This is okay.  And we're seeing it happen again Crazy These were great selection of books Okay gang, what page should we read what page should we read? What page should we read?


I think that the digital technology has really changed the whole place and the whole game. It's a boulevard of, I really think, real opportunities for the young people in Africa, for women, for people in the rural areas, due to the mobile boom that we have noticed in Africa, which is something almost unprecedented. And I think we need to bring more content and to be more imaginative and more original. And it's really a track to pursue so that Africa can exist in all those platforms. The most important challenge I think is the one of content. Infrastructure is very key, but at the same time content I think is a major issue because we need to show our own stories, we need to show what we can do, we need to get added values for our own content and our culture, our economy, and really we need to be at the same level as the African annual growth, which is going and going and one of the best in the world now. Digital creativity, reimagination for me means more room given to all continents, to all players and so that we bring in the basket as President Senghor of Senegal used to say, in this banquet of give and take we bring the best things we have in all fields and there are many, many things to be shown and I think that the digital area and digital tools enable us to have some kind of shortcuts and get where all other continents and all other people are. I think World Intellectual Property Day is a very, very good opportunity to support Africa and to give really some kind of original and unprecedented platform to all African creators and all African audiences at the same time. Really we need to support it very, very, very strongly.


The federal government suspends fuel subsidy removal and, to me praise, silver, doi diri and others, battle to win the hearts of the people in Bajasa ahead of the government elections. This is PlusPolitus, I am Mary-Anna Cummings. The National Economic Council on Thursday in Abuja said it has agreed that petrol subsidy should not be removed as earlier planned for June 2023. The Minister of Finance, Bodger to National Planning, Mrs. Zainab Ahmad disclosed this to the State House correspondents shortly after the Valedictory Council meeting presided over by Vice-President Yemi Oshibajo at the council chambers of the presidential villa in Abuja. Ahmad said the council agreed on the need to have continued discussions on the issue adding that the federal government together with states and representatives of the incoming administration require more preparatory work. Joining us to discuss this and more is Shagun Shopiton, he is a public affairs analyst and Gospel of Bailey, who is the chief economist at Streetsnomics Ltd. Thank you so much gentlemen for joining us, that's a little bit of a tongue twister. Good evening. Good evening, thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. Great. Gospel, I'll start with you because you're the numbers guy. Mohamed Buhari was one of those who were the leaders of the Occupy Nigeria protests, I'm sure we all remember this. He flanked by several other people who make up his government today, but some of the people who protested against the Good Luck administration saying that they did not want the removal of fuel subsidy and they gave reasons. Years down the line the president is pushing for the removal of fuel subsidy but then the snag is that they've been paying lip service to it but then removing the subsidy in itself seems to be a problem and now it seems to have been kicked down the line to the next government that might be sworn in May 29. What do you make of this? Thank you once again for having me, Mary Ann, great to be here. There are much more complications to the subsidy conversation than what we know. That's the fact that they are very divested interests for or against the removal of subsidy. Again, it's the fact that there's also the drive to be very much politically correct. One of the key elements or patterns of things since the beginning of January 2022, the drive to be more politically correct is from the lens of the current political administration and then the ban to go back to the next. What you have is that the government would rather the next administration take the baggage of whether to remove or not and also that would intensify the expectations going forward. But then again, let's also take the concerns that there is a projection by the IMF that in less than two years it will continue to subsidy payments and obligations that Nigeria will be at the very negative end of the revenue crisis in the context of things where the revenue crisis will technically be very, very negative and will be using our debts to pay for subsidies. Now, should subsidy be removed or not, I think that has a very big question that the next addition would need to answer and likelihood that they may want to remove it. However, I think that the conversation or the argument is much more deeper than the subsidy conversation here. There are new causal elements to the nature of what we are faced with called subsidy.  Now, the lack of those two has led to more Nigerians depending on fossil fuels and as a result of an increased demand side pressure on what should be important to the country as fuel or what we term as, you know, final products on crude oil. And again, that hikes up the amount of money of wanting to take, you know, to import these elements. Again, giving credence to the argument and subsidy, you need to subsidize this payment so that it's much more cheaper by the time you get to the end user, you know, in context. So if you take out the critical elements that both are heavily on demand by fixing those good causal issues, subsidy will not be a conversation on the table to start with. All right, so the economics of subsidy, everything about the economics of subsidy is really wrong. But then again, it's a distraction within the times we're in. And it's been played around the lines of political interest that what is really key to that with Nigerian. Let's talk about the politics of it since you're bringing it up. I mean, at first glance, you know, we would look at this subsidy removal as, you know, something that might contradict what the economic plan that the incoming president has. I mean, I'd like to read exactly. He's promising to achieve, you know, peace and economic renaissance. Also, it could also further, you know, somewhat erase any glimmer of hope for citizens in terms of this, because you see, when you say that you're taking out subsidy, then it means that there are lots of things that we'd have to tighten our belts for. But now you're talking about politics and, you know, the willpower to do it and the can being further kicked down the road, which means that we might just keep playing ping-pong with it until eight years is over. But if we were, if it came down to putting their foot down, what, at what cost will we have to, what will we have to pat with to be able to deal with this subsidy removal? It's going to be a very massive cost to the economy. My thoughts will be a possible removal in phases of this subsidy. However, that may not necessarily be the case, you know, and they were back again to square one. Again, removing the subsidy would mean that a lot of political and commercially stressed have to be met. You know, deals have to be brokered on the table to ensure that there is a relative or, you know, sensible way of being on the table, especially for the key stakeholders as it were. But once the subsidy is removed, what I feel like Nigerians already have a taste of what a removal would look like. You know, in November, December, there was first currency. We were buying a meter as high as 700 naira in a state. You know, that's technically what the reality is going to look like if you leave it to market forces. You know, again, leaving things to market forces is going to function of how much of balancing you have on both ends. All right, there's a strong heavy demand side. Now, if you don't have a solid supply base and you leave anything to market forces, again, just the same with the Nigerian Naira Commission, you know, is really, if you don't have a strong supply base, what happens is that demand will far outweigh supply and then the crisis in the market will keep spiraling in terms of increase over time. And the supplier, we're talking about local refineries or providing alternative energy sources. But that said, that would technically mean that the cost of leaving would rise. Which we technically saw that in November, December. And what we saw is just a tip of the iceberg. It's going to get really bad and really worse. And when cost of leaving rises, cost of food will rise, cost of energy prices will rise. When the cost of leaving will rise and cost of farm to market will rise, cost of doing business will rise. And as a result of the increase in cost of doing business, the cost per unit of an item will be pushed to the average consumer. So what you'll realize is the complex web of cost pressure. And let's not forget the average Nigerian is already faced with the huge cost per energy, sorry, cost pressure as a result of erosion and the current evolutionary dynamics and interest rates we're dealing with. So that's going to further worsen things on the economics of how that demand and supply works. And again, it may not be too held in terms of the first thing that the next administration wants to do. I don't even get what I'm trying to say. So there's going to be a lot of... That's why I mentioned the fact that the political variable is a major variable in this context. Again, it's 50-50. The next president-elect may say that it really hits the ground running like he would always say. I mean, he should take out the subsidy or choose to take it out in faces or buy more time before he does that. So it's still a developing story, but this is literally a time bomb waiting to happen. Either way, he's going to pay the card. Sounds more like a hot pot with boiling water in it.  But let me go to Shagong. Shagong, still talking about the politics of it. We've had to deal with realities and the uncovering of the fact that there's a huge degree of all theft happening right under the nose of Mr. President, who supposedly is the Petroleum Minister. And of course, with the christening and re-christening of the NMPC now, PLC are limited, as it's called. With all of that, we still are not able to have fuel. We have enough oil, but then it's still sent out to re-refine. We still buy it back and we still don't have enough.  And then of course, he talks about the politics of it. If we were able to deal with this, plus the fact that we were devoting trillions of Naira to service refineries that are not doing anything and were paying salaries to people who are working in refineries that are not doing anything for us. If we were able to deal with these other problems, could we have made one way or the other the removal of this subsidy a bit more easier for us if we were able to plug all these loopholes? Yeah, Maria and Luke, this conversation is not supposed to be as difficult as it is. I think it is this difficult because just like Gus Ho said, there are a lot of interests at play. So first of all, you say you want to remove subsidy and I think I agree with everything that Gus Ho has said, 100%. It will be a catastrophic disaster. It takes the subsidy away at this time. And I think it's just good that good reason and good sense have finally revealed. I have said this on all the platforms that have had the opportunity to speak that they dare not take the subsidy out. It's very simple. So talking about the political angle to things you have to remember. Whether people like it or not, and I know that some supporters of the current administration and the incoming one do not like to hear this. But this administration is going to suffer legitimacy problems.  You have an administration that is coming into power off the back of a 36% yes vote to a 67% no. It means that the majority of the electorate said no to this administration. Which means the first task they are going to have before any other governance and policy-related issue is to deal with the legitimacy problem and win Nigerians over. How do you win Nigerians over? When the first thing that you do is to make their lives doubly or triply difficult. So from the political side, it would be suicide for a credible amethyst noble to go this way. And I think that the removal, the extension of the timeline for the removal may very well be at his own instance. Because once Boadi has gone back to Dara, he's happy and he's told us that he can't wait to go. And then it's in a way he's going to be left with a very difficult task of managing a policy that the Boadi administration had forced on him. So it's a very good thing that some sort of good sense has prevailed and this has been postponed. But I want to say, coming back to the question you asked, look, removing the subsidy will not be a conversation. These those basic things that need to happen are done in the first instance. And you know, the actual Ebola amethyst noble has been talked up by his supporters at a legendary policy from later strategy developer, implementer and all that. I hope they're right and I hope it's true because the first thing that I would expect him to do as he's coming on board, is to provide for local supply. You cannot remove subsidy if you do not have adequate local supply, local production that takes care of our local demand. If you do not do that, the subsidy question will never go away. Now, consider this and I would imagine that this is one of the reasons that, you know, this has been postponed. When you take the subsidies out, please can somebody explain to me who is going to be doing the importation of petroleum products because NNPC is doing that 100% now. So we let NNPC continue to do that, using the swap agreement arrangement where they give crude and then we collect PMS back and all that. Or will the oil marketers, the major oil marketers or the independent marketers, will they be allowed? Will they then have the depot and the infrastructure? How will they source the foreign exchange? Will they source at official rates? Will they source from the parallel market? Can the official market even meet that demand? So those questions are questions that the government has not answered adequately. Which obviously is why this thing has been postponed. And I would say, and this is just free advice or whoever is listening in the incoming administration, you do not and you cannot take the subsidies out if you have not dealt with the problem of local refining capacity. This thing is not rocket science. If it is what people say he is, then this time next year, we should be able to have at least two, either Greenfield or the current government-owned ones, refineries working. And once you have that in place, then the subsidy question goes away. Then it's not even, it just solves itself. So I think that those fundamentals need to be dealt with before we even come back to the subsidy question itself. Interesting. There are a few things that I would like to, I mean, the average Nigerian would be curious about. Even if we were to agree with to this subsidy removal and the incoming government decides they're going to do it at the get-go. There are a few things that Nigerians will be seeking to see from this government. And you made mention of the fact that already Nigerians are skeptical about the incoming administration. But then the issue of transparency comes to play because of course there's not been necessarily transparency when it comes to our oil and gas sector, whether it's upstream or downstream. Nigerians are also going to be looking for trust. And Nigerians want to see how funds are utilized. Do you think this will be a major characteristic that this administration that is incoming will be able to exhibit in order to be able to get Nigerians onto their side? For what? Why do you set me up with this type of question? Because my opinion is very well known in the public space. Look, I always say that you want to relate with Nigerians based on evidence. Evidence-based analysis, evidence-based logical reasoning. And I tell you, Miriam, the evidence does not support that assumption. I have lived in Lagos for better part of 35 years. I have been in Lagos through the entirety of this foreign republic during which the president left of governor for a two-term period. And up until even after he left. And I tell you that one of the most difficult things that you will get from legal states is transparency, is costs of governance, is cost of projects executed. So a lot of projects have been executed. Fantastic, and we all know this. We can see it. A lot of revenues have been generated. It's also very good and it gives one hope that the revenue to GDP problem that the country has can be fixed by the president's elect. However, in the middle of all of that financial ongoing inflows and outflows, nobody knows the specifics. We have an idea with regards to the internet-generated revenue of legal state government, but how that money is applied is a secret. And I say that with all sense of responsibility. So if you go to the website of legal state government, for example, you will see the published and audited accounts of the government. It simply doesn't add up. I've looked at it, I'm looking for the cost of certain projects, I'm looking for the cost of certain infrastructure efforts and projects on the part of the legal state government. And you just don't find it in a manner that agrees with what you believe to be the reality because the costs you find there are simply extremely understated. But Boshagun, that's not necessarily a legal state problem, is it? How often has the federal government or even other states across the federation been able to make their buttocks open and plain and been able to break down how these monies have been spent? How many? Well, you'd be surprised. You'd be surprised that the amount and the volume of information that is available with regard to the peddragoments finances out there. The Auditor General of the Federation of Nigeria reduces a report, an annual audit report on the federal government finances every year. The content of that report is immediately damning with regards to how the transactions of the federal government have been conducted, but nothing happens. So it's a bit, the federal government is further down the line on that spectrum, on the transparency spectrum, that they are further advanced than legal states currently is. So will things get better at the federal government level or will they regress to where legal state government is now? The question remains to be seen, but you have rightly identified this that if the federal government on that Ashwagibola Metinubu will win the cross of Nigerians, he has to change his ways in terms of transparency, in terms of even his own body language and the way he communicates and the mannerism that he abuses when he talks to Nigerians. There is this tendency to be dismissive and to exude this air of what they call only science. I know what is best for all of you. You don't know what you're talking about.  When you see the results, you will applaud me. That body language will not work at the federal level far. So you have to change this. People must trust you in order to support your policies so that they don't sabotage you. One of the biggest problems that the Bari administration faced when they came on board is that they did not have the trust of the people for long enough. The trust that was there, they were wasted very quickly and before you knew what was happening, there was a lot of sabotage and negative expressions from the populace. So the president, Bala Metinubu and the guest on it needs to deal with the transparency question you have very spot on with regards to this. Okay, gospel back to you. Nigerians have been really perturbed by this $800 million loan from the World Bank that they said they're going to use as some sort of palliative to cushion the effect of, you know, the proposed subsidy removal by June. But then trade and labor unions and some in the oil and gas industry have not hidden their disapproval for this. And we have a clip here by the TUC, I think in Akiti State. Let's take a listen and then I'll come back to you. What I said is that it is not going to be removed now. Which means it will not be removed before the transition is completed. That's what it means. But then we have two laws that have inadvertently made the provision that we should exit by June. So if the committee's work, which will include the representatives of the incoming administration determine that the remover can be done by June, then the plan, the work plan. It's removed also have our own position. The minimum wage will never be 30,000 again. The minimum wage will go to nothing less than 100,000. And we're going to tell the federal government that you put it side by side. If they cannot accommodate it, go and remove. But a minimum wage will not be less than 1,000. That is it. It is there we'll be able to cope with 500 nera per liter or 600 nera per liter or 800 nera per liter. Another condition we gave was that refineries at least two out of the four should be put into nothing less than 80% use. Internal production, the internal refineries of our crude oil. Don't let me deceive you. Nigeria economy will be going down. Gospel, so this is what they're saying. If you're going to remove subsidy, then of course you're going to have to increase our salaries. And this is detail for everybody. COVID came with its own whirlwind that made us have to chop off some of our take home pay, which did not take a lot of us home anymore. And some companies are still having to deal with that. The cost of living is rising high, but the take home pay is no longer taking people home. And so do you agree with the position of the TUC in a QT state? One of the things I know and am very comfortable or convinced about is that there is a cross on the valuation of many things in Nigeria. Even the GDP is on the value, inflation is on the size, rewards are on the paid or on the value in many cases. So top of mind is that subsidy or not, there has to be an overall review of salary structure and reward structure in the country. And we now contextualize the current events that are happening, the cost of the world crisis and all that. Yes, the arguments by these institutions are actually very much valid because right now it's getting much difficult. I mean, Nigeria to even, I mean, the grade is about 1,500 right now. It used to be over 452 to three years ago. All right, so how do we go from 450 to 1,500? That's to tell you how really bad things have gone, not just about Nigeria in context but actually, globally, the UK has hit 10% in terms of the highest in five decades. So there is a clamor for salary increase globally. There's a clamor for review of revenue structure globally. There's a clamor for more discounts and more, everything that has to help the average Nigerian or average Nigerian gains on form of relief. So on the grounds of that, yes, they have a very valid proposition. The big ticket argument is number one, where do those monies come from? In terms of government paying these guys. Number two, are we making enough money or generating a lot of fraction enough as an economy to be able to meet the expectations? So those are very bad. So as much as you look at the demand side, you also look at the supply side, which is why I think that removing the supply outrightly upon resumption may not be a very good idea. Yes, it could be removing phases but the current impact on the average Nigerian is going to be at strongly high. So yes, it's valid, but the questions heavily bothers on the supply side of that equation. I'm really going to be able to pay 100,000 for each sale a month, monthly, as a normal wage, which I think again is a possibility. You block all the bouquets and you're in great government waste. That's a possibility. Shagal, let me ask a question. Nigeria is believed to, I have spoken to a lot of scientists and a lot of people who work in the oil and gas sector, some who have even worked in oil companies and retired. And one of the things that I've gotten to realize is that Nigeria has some of the largest, if not one of the largest gas reserves in Africa, but yet it is very underutilized. We're not even tapping it. Don't forget the issue of gas flaring. We would rather take money instead of stopping the gas flares and using it for other things. We'd rather not. Do you see the next administration taking advantage of this situation and making more money for us on the side, being that now we're looking for every way, to mop up cash? Yes, I believe that one thing you cannot decorate on, Pala Amit, is that it's a very brilliant mind. It's not a brilliant mind, it's a blessed one. So if we display the political will, then absolutely, you know, during one of the engagements that he had in the run-up to the election, he actually addressed this issue and he addressed it very eloquently. He demonstrated a very good deep understanding of the issue that the oil and gas sector let's not forget that he was a treasurer at the top level for an oil and gas company in Nigeria. So he understand the issues, I believe within the faculty then, he recognized and I remember he's paying for his ability to drive revenues up. So he will be checking out all of these angles and I'm sure that he will make some moves, some right moves in this regard. And that is where I think the conversation needs to edge into two words. How do we increase revenues? Instead of fixating and being of self about the removal of subsidy, look, our revenue problem is a tremendous problem. I said it on air before. Nigeria has the lowest revenue to GDP, tax revenue to GDP ratio in the world except two countries at war and all countries that will not accept it. We are running at 3.7% to the GDP, it's at thresholds. The best countries in the world, in fact we have African countries that have 22% tax revenue to GDP. So that's not to be the area of focus for the government in a manner that will not be punitive and that will not further impoverish the Nigerian people. I think this will be an ongoing conversation guys and unfortunately we're out of time but we will revisit this conversation. I think we have to keep sounding like broken records until something is done. Shagu Shopita is a public affairs analyst and Gospel Obele is the chief economist, I beg your pardon, of Tritonomics Ltd. Thank you so much gentlemen for having this conversation with me. Thank you, I have a good idea. Thank you. All right, well up next we'll be turning our attention to biostasis for government elections drawn near. All those who are flying the flags of the different political parties are gunning for the votes of the people. Stay with us.


Welcome, everyone. This is the Jenkins governance meeting. It's 20th of March 2023. We have a claim to GitHub trust and safety is one of the items on the agenda, news, action items. JIRA license changes, CDF topics, community activity and as a final item, possibly adjusting our meeting time for the European change to daylight saving time. Any other topics that need to go on the agenda. Okay, then let's get started first. Maybe Daniel would you be willing to give some background on this claim from BNC BMC or Alexander whichever one of the two of you. So, late last week, I think on Friday, we, the admins of the Jenkins CI GitHub organization owners, I think is the term received the notification from get that trust and safety that BMC software ink claimed publication of private data. It was posted without consent copyrighted source code or password of BMC software ink. If it's a password if it refers to the string computer where so that's a bit awkward. So, I know that Tim reached out to the committers to understand what's going on at the same time.  I don't know whether the comparison holds but I had her high effort horror stories of YouTube copyright claims. So, then we received a message from one of the maintainers of the plugin in question that they were going to fix it and they did so today by rewriting the repo history.  And I pointed out to them. Well, while the immediate notification from BMC was addressed it would not address the general problem of an organization claiming its own published source code as private information and messing with our organization based on that. We haven't heard back from them since. And Alex printed out like half an hour ago or so that they recently re licensed several of their plugins under a non free free license they were previously MIT and our now some proprietary 100 page thing that I'm having and bothered reading, which is against our hosting guidelines. So now the question is how do we proceed here. My preferred, although, of course, quite disruptive approach would be suspend everything from BMC and figure out how to proceed from there. Whether they even want to remain hosted what's going on with the automated copyright claim to get up trust and safety and so on. Do we maybe even need to delete or move artifacts out of the way. That's another concern. In this case the copyrighted source code location was in tests. And we were to claim source code in production code. While it's not GitHub. I mean our artifactory host source charts. And then they say, well, you're, or might say well you're not supposed to publish that right. Maybe not a lawyer, but I would say it seems safer to just look everything and figure out where to go from there. Let me ask a quick question. And when did we receive the mail what that last week or some sort of Friday or Saturday, I think Friday. Okay, but it was Friday and they stayed three business days and include Friday that would mean we need to act until tomorrow which seems a bit short but definitely in favor of this approach because if this is one of those DMCA claims you can find on GitHub, get up is pretty eager to take down these repositories pretty fast. Right. And so, for full transparency. This plugin is published by a BMC, we get copyright claims by BMC. So, I mean, I would just delete it out of principle and let their customers yell at them and maybe then they change their position. Good timing to join. Great timing. Hi, Oleg. Hi, I commented on the ticket but I guess I agree with Daniel because the station is loud and clear. So the message then is it's a request. The simplest response for us is we suspend distribution of all BMC computer plugins until this is resolved. And unless it's resolved in an acceptable fashion, OSI compliant alliance, they stay suspended. Now Daniel you mentioned deleting more things so Right so what we can also do is we can block further plugin releases until the situation is resolved. So basically messing with the permission files. And the third thing we can be doing is we can delete all previously published releases of these plugins from artifactory. And when I say delete I mean create a private repository and move the artifacts over. They're being non destructive, except it appears gone. And if the situation is resolved, we can always move things back this is not very different from how we published staged artifacts during a security release, where we move them from a private or copy them from a private repository to a public one. That way then they appear. So that would be a more complete removal of all of their stuff. Obviously a lot more or some more effort that we may not even need because so far, as nobody has complained about artifactory as far as I know. So for me, it looks like quite a drastic measure. So, first of all, if you removed on the artifact series license can valuation. Then I am plus one for that. But removing all the versions that are I see I compliant. I think it would be too much. And for me actually, as Daniel said, we have never had complaints regarding artifactory so for me removing non compliant artifacts should be enough. But actually, the trick is that the complaint is filed against the data repository. So, unless we mitigate the data repository. I think we may stay red flagged. Okay, so so we may need to make the repository private. Just to keep from being being sure about what they should be private or what they should be transferred to another github organization for now. Sorry, like, like Jenkins transfer or something like that. Maybe as a holding area. BMC. Who knows.  Which is also for me for to restore publication. I would like a resolution of the GitHub trust and safety issue right because if they change the license file around and say yeah we'll we really resolve the situation by rewriting repo history. Although I haven't looked into detail what exactly they did there. That still might mean we have sort of a strike against us or however GitHub tracks these things. So personally, I would just transfer it to BMC. I'm not sure how, how would we do that we don't have permission to transfer to a BMC owned. Yeah, so there are two questions. Firstly, do they own the whole code coming to do that repository.  So what you're saying so what you're saying is transfer the repository to the meat to an organization designated by the maintainers, and they say BMC they say whatever their own personal account. Got it okay to the to an organization defined by the maintainers. So basically it becomes theirs, and then they have to submit to rehost it if we have and we then decide if we want to host it. I think we want to once all the issues are solved. But yeah I'm not sure that it's going to happen, because yeah from what I saw in the comment history. Right now it's not given that they would revert to the license. And if even if so it may take ages because of legal involvement. But what would moving the repository accomplish compared to making it private so github suggests in their email that the sensitive information which is the string computer and the Java doc opening comment start with sensitive information that, well, we can just to make it private right and then go from there. Of course, because in both cases the problem is, it needs to be resolved in some manner, preferably by them telling github Oh, our bad we didn't mean to send this email. Yeah. And then I was thinking if we make the repository private as recommended by github, we resolve github's concern right the their concern is private information as as non sensitive as the word copyware is should not be disclosed so it's the repository private if then we want to transfer that private repository to the plug in maintainers we can do that to their organization we can do that as well. But if we make it private initially that seems like an immediate win. Right. Because, if I understood only correctly, the transfer would also only be temporary unless they resolve their stuff right so. Transfer will be permanent, as well as the publishing if they do not fix the licensing. The computer where flagging. Yeah, for me it's rather less important thing, because it's no brainer that they can reverse this claim because there is no sensitive content except the Java string. For me, the biggest concern is the fact that it's no longer OCI licensed. So maybe I mean to concerns but yeah for me it would be nice if you can just give it to them and then we host. I mean, the OSI thing. A major immediate concern for me as I mentioned the GitHub trust and safety thing because if I don't know how this sort of situation can escalate against us in a manner that affects the larger tank and say I organization. Right. They have like a 10 plugin repose they file a GitHub trust and safety issue against each of them and GitHub says yep we're not going to deal with these criminals anymore and then there has been Jenkins CI organization in the past. And so for me that's sort of the immediate concern now obviously be per our hosting guidelines we don't want to. We don't want to publish OSI stuff which was where the suspension comes in but to protect the Jenkins project, the trust and safety thing seems the more urgent one. So that we could make this one repository private and we've resolved it now computer where may then file a claim against another repository. And we'd have to make it private as well or we could just admit we're going to do all all of the BMC repositories we can detect as private right now. Right. The next problem is if we make the repository private. It detaches everything else from the network. So they lose the fork relationships, which will make development more annoying for the BMC folks because clicking on create pull request becomes more difficult but that's probably going to be their problem. documentation on the plug inside, I guess so. Yeah, because it wouldn't well I think it wouldn't be readable anymore right. Yeah, and it will already be listed as suspended suspend the plug in assuming that Daniels pull request is suspend is merged. I'm sorry go ahead Daniel you should answer all like question not me. No that seems correct yeah so the documentation would be gone, but at the same time we would suspend the plug in so that would those would be gone anyway. The question is in my pull request I suggest the suspension of all of the computer and BMC stuff. Basically I looked at the maintain your email addresses and everyone with a BMC email address got their stuff suspended. But that's more than we need because so far it seems both the license thing and obviously get up just in safety so far as only interested in one plugin. It seems limited to do the things previously owned by computer where whether we should make the scope of this pull request smaller or whether we should just remove everything. I think it's an attempt to perhaps get them to more quickly resolve the situation. So the public shoulder plugins that part seems clear. Remove personally I don't have strong preference. I mean, the amount of work for GitHub work that means is basically the same. You create a repository to private you created team to grant the access. And then you revert everything once I fixed. So for me, just one repository maybe. Or maybe we could act practically if there are strings. So if they are really concerned about computer where string. So we basically take private all the repositories weights mentioned. It's an attempt to protect us because if this was filed by some kind of corporate effort that was hunting down strings and filing these complaints. Then I'm sure that's not the only string in their database they would, they would likely have a large set of passwords that they're searching for. So I don't, I don't think that the single string copy where is the only thing that they would be looking for. Yeah, I think that makes sense. I certainly would not expect that to be the only password to be that would be a problem. So, oh like back to your, your suggestion it was, we could proactively search for, or search for suspect strings in the BMC or BMC and computer repositories and if we detect them then decide to make those private as well. I think so. I mean, the problem with that is, where do we go from there, right? What can the maintainers do to make us make the repositories public again. Right. Well, mostly they revert their own claim, then probably write us written information that they have no legal concerns about the content of these repositories so that we can save it for the future should they both go crazy again. Basically, you want a proactive confirmation that the other repositories they have not yet complained about are fine. Yeah. And that would be a prerequisite to resume hosting. I think so. And I thought I was harsh. Well, if they send complaints. I think it would be perfect. I have three proposals that we could discuss one for GitHub repositories one for future releases and one for past releases. I think those are the three, the three things that we've been talking about. So, here's, here's one proposal for each of those topics, we can, we can modify this proposal but I'm kind of just collecting what we've been discussing so far. Do we no longer consider the artifacts to be relevant, at least for now. Not. I don't know. I guess I get you mean for past releases. Right, because suspension is just a flag in the tool that generates JSON metadata. Right, so the artifacts would still be. I'm in favor of that. Can we let me see. Let me change that then to say, spend distribution of all copyware BNC plugins. Is that does that work Daniel. No, so those are two independent axis so suspend distribution means they don't show up any more in the JSON and on plugins Jenkins IO and different axes is that that implies the first indirectly is remove the public artifacts and Artifactory. So we no longer distribute the maven artifacts of these plugins. Yeah. I think there's, yeah, so for the for. And for each of those two items there's two ways we could go there's removing all or moving only non OSI licensed. So I guess for bullets three and four there's there's two alternatives. We can actually identify which releases happen with the non free license. And just to spend those releases. Now just suspend on the compliant things. Yeah, the same applies for the artifact repository right. The two alternatives. We don't have so many users of these plugins but the remover and everything is going to be a problem. So we don't want to trigger left party with our own infrastructure right. Which of these two things going to be easiest to get agreement on. We'll start with that one. Where do you see left pad happening. This, this, this isn't workflow API. I didn't, I didn't understand your question Daniel could you ask your question again. Right so one of the topics was removing all artifacts and all like mentioned left pad happening in our infrastructure but realistically, we're discussing computer where plugins and not, you know workflow API or mailer. So I don't really see left pad happening and the additional problem is the plugin repository with the claim was computer common configuration, which is the dependency of a lot of the computer where plugins. So there's already a necessary mini left pad happening because of that alone. I forgive my not knowing what left pad is, could you give me a high level summary, I, I, it was. A package on npm that half of other npm packages dependent on. Basically to let to various kinds of built issues, even, and also dependency issues for those pulling campaigns. I think the impact that one of the companies starting. Okay. Got it. Thank you thanks for the summary. So back to back to Basel's question which of these is the easiest one for the most likely for us to get agreement on let's, let's talk to that one first. Well I think, I think it from my point of view it's the first one because we only have three business days to deal with it. So it seems obvious to me that we need to address that as soon as possible. So I hope that we could agree on that. Also three business days is for the one repository they complained about. Fair enough. Yeah, so I guess I guess we've got another which would be even even smaller and they're make one comp you are BMC repository private. But it's the common that you said Daniel has multiple dependencies above it, multiple things that depend upon it. Dependencies are realistically at the level of maybe not effects or okay. plugins rather than get up repositories. Yeah, one could be done fairly easily with little side effects. Got it. Thank you. Thanks for the clarity. Okay. It feels like we do have these, these proposals for discussion agreement that the first is the is this likely the simplest one for us to get agreement on what show how we show process how shall we proceed. Any further discussion needed on this one I'm prone to say let's call for a here people's objections or vote. Technically there is alternative three check whether there are offending clients in plugins and take private all of them or that have the same computer where reference. But. The problem is that the complaint looks the complaint looks invalid. To me, and the other problem is that one of the maintainers said they fixed it so they rewrote repo history to do something. And I don't know whether what they did is sufficient because the complaint is so bad. So, at this point we can take it private but if the maintainers says it's cool we've done the thing. We basically have no way of confirming it. And if we tell a GitHub trust and safety a we did the thing but we took the repo also private they will tell us well we cannot look at it if it's private. So, seems like a catch 22 situation, if we make it private and then tell the maintainers to figure it out. Okay. Transferring to be MC. Because after that, they basically own it. And we don't care. But the it requires action from their side, which is not given. So transfer the plugin repository. To the maintainers. One or more of the maintainers. We can make it private now and then move. So that we that it's never public in our org. Right. Yeah. Alternatively, we can make it private and then do the thing below where we say, oh, well, it was mentioned earlier we need a confirmation from them that they have no objections to the repositories that they maintain. It could also be a next action so that we can basically say yeah it's cool that you rewrote history, but it's not good enough we need you to get us official confirmation that we're okay hosting this otherwise it's never going to be restored. Right, that might also be a position we can take. Okay, so are we ready to call for. I'm sorry I'm still not seeing exactly the path forward so Daniel do you have a recommended path forward it's make just the specific repose private make them all private. I don't think these alternate seven of detail for me to vote on them yet because they don't, they don't specify. They don't have a pending clause to talk about when we would undo the action. Maybe get to talk about the other three things back to this. The second proposal about blocking future releases pending restoration of OSI compatible license, are there any is there anything to discuss there, or is that proposal pretty clear. We only block releases for the plugins that have adopted a non free license or do we plug everything. There's no alternative it would be it would be just future releases of non OSI. I could add that word to it. Right, but then we also need to monitor there are plugins because if they change the license then it's kind of a mini welcome all situation. We assume that people aren't going to act in bad faith so I think if we do it for one it should be. I don't feel I need to monitor. We block one will give them warning in the pull request. So I think it should be enough. When you say one, do you mean that there are four plugins that currently have a non free license 405. So, basically that the repository permission update request that blocks all of them. So basically this is the warning for the rest of the plugins. Okay, anything that anything else to change in that second bullet point. Okay, so I think that was ready to that was ready to vote on or whatever. What about for the last two as the are the are the last two proposals either with including both alternatives. Are they are they clear enough or do we need to clarify it and do we need to clarify them further. One question. So what was the license before they changed it. MIT. Okay, so with MIT we are fine because we are not committed to providing the code and demand. So even if they wrote the history it's not our problem. But I think they're rolling a phrase. Go ahead Daniel, excuse me. What was your point with MIT. So basically the point is if the plugins were distributed under GPL. Like it happens for a few plugins within our system, that the fact that they wrote the history, means us to remove all the artifacts because we cannot be remain compliant with the GPL license. But for MIT license. I think that alternative to would be enough. No, because the source jar still have the sources. It doesn't matter whether the repo exists or not so yeah you're right. Alex that's related to one of your open poll request to update sender to. We have a few plugins that have no SCM. And but there are source charge so as far as I'm concerned that's no problem but you know just a side note. Anyway, we have only a handful of GPL plugins. Great. So back to back to Basel's question. Are the alternatives as phrased for suspend distribution and for remove copyware from remove from artifact repository are those sufficient. Are they well enough to scribe for us to decide which one we want to do to mute myself sorry I forgot to mute myself while I was typing. I think I've clarified the first one enough for me to be able to understand it. So there's actually six few consider the idea of transfer of transferring because it would be transferring. But in addition to making it private. I think that's what I was saying earlier. And I think my complaint was invalid because I forgot that I wrote up at the top that would be pending blah blah blah so above all those six alternatives there is a pending statement so I think I think these are all I think these proposals are all sufficient for me. They all seem complete in my mind. Okay, so in this case then the pending clause here is saying that the way for them to undo these changes would be they have to provide us confirmation that the claims have been rescinded and future claims won't be made. Yeah, I think that would apply to all six of the alternatives. Right. Okay. The point is that this is not pending an OSI license because the issue of marking the repositories private has nothing to do with OSI and purely to do with GitHub trust and safety, whereas for the bottom to the distribution and removing from Artifactory. The confirmation is dependent on both the trust and safety issue and the OSI compatible license at least for alternative one. Right. Yeah these proposals look complete to me. Are we ready to go ahead with which which which one does each of the each person recommend or prefer for a vote are we ready for a vote. Do you want to vote on each one or do you want to do we want to write down first which ones each person prefers doesn't matter or maybe doesn't matter. No, I think that's a good idea so if there are preferences. I'm, I'm certainly easily swayed for Daniels preferences in many cases so I would love to hear preferences from others. I have a strong preference for alternative to on the repositories private and as far as blocking future releases. I'm in favor of that. I guess this would be my vote if you want to consider it that for the second bullet point I'm in favor of that. And as far as suspending distribution, I'm in favor of alternative one. And as far as removing from Artifactory I'm in favor of alternative to so for what it's worth. Thanks, Daniel. Are you willing to share you have preferences. I do nothing is a valid alternative. Yes. Okay, or it is an alternative good. Let's note that thank you. Good. I agree with basil on suspending distribution. Suspending distribution so the okay got it. Thanks. Block future releases. Yep, definitely because otherwise they just create more trash that I need to delete. I would like to abstain on the artifact repository one because I would vote for alternative one because alternative to is way more annoying to implement. I'm the one who needs to click the buttons. I vote for clicking fewer buttons which is perhaps not the purest motivation. But that's a motivation. I like it. So you're saying alternative one is fewer button clicks for you. Yeah, I can basically move over all of the top level artifact directories rather than the versions that we don't like individually. Okay. And do you have a preference on the make repost present private alternative one until we get a second complaint and once there's a second complaint everything. So alternative 1.5. Okay, unless okay so 1.5 is is I get it is halfway between one and two in the sense of somebody else is typing a good. Yeah, I'm okay with that as well. Right that makes that that says hey if they don't fix it. It has more severe consequences. Okay. You can say I'm, you can put my name down as being okay with that as well. Yeah. Okay. All right. Fine with me. So, well, basically I take everything except alternative zero. Okay, so you're okay with any one of them. Yeah, so I lean towards. 1.5. And okay and good lock future releases do you have a preference there. I hear one, of course, and for everything else. I think to, I would prefer to take it safely. But yeah, so did I did I represent that correctly. Okay, Alex. And for the first one, I go with alternative 1.5. Okay. Yeah, for the second one. All that alternative one. Okay. Artifacts as, you know, suspend distribution, I go with alternative one. And for artifact re removal I have no strong preference. Okay. So you also do not wish to exclude one option like, like Oleg did with not alternative zero. Alternative zero. You can include me into alternative one if it's just less work but I have no strong preference there, given GitHub doesn't control that part. So you like both one and two. Yeah. Yes, I'm fine with both ones. So we need to add Alex to number two right. Oh yes, got it. Okay. All right and for me. Yeah, I think alternative 1.5 lock future releases yes, suspend distribution. Yeah, I'm alternative one I think there. And then I'm prone to alternative one here as well and I admit it. It's because I like it easier. So what we've got then based on that is we've got a split Bruno did you want to give voice to any of these items. Yeah, thank you Mark. So for the first part alternative five. I'm sorry I'm the only one. Okay. Next one alternative one. And then alternative two for this one. Okay. All right, next and for the last part alternative to do so. Thank you. All right. Okay so let's go from top to bottom I think we've got some that are clear winners. So here, that one wins, right. Sounds good to me. Okay. And Daniel I assume you're the person who would actually implement that, or is this what do we need to talk to somebody else. I don't know who the org admins are for that one. I think I can do that. Okay, great. All right, the next one. This one we have. Oh, I should put the action item here just a minute. Daniel back. I'm taking the note further down. Oh, good. You're taking action. So I don't have to put it there. Thank you. Thanks very much. Perfect. Okay, good. Next block future releases pending restoration of OSI compatible lion license that one's a clear winner. I think that's already expressed in your know it's not expressed in an artifact permissions update or yet but is this one that you would get the action of Daniel or is it something else. Any one of us could do you have a preference alone. Just read. Okay, great. All right. Suspend distribution of compiware BMC plugins we've got a four, four to two preference for alternative one. Oleg and Bruno, would you be okay with alternative one. Yeah, sure. Oh legs. Okay. Yes. Okay. It should at least get their attention right. No, I was paying attention attention actually. No, I mean, it should get the attention of copyware and BMC if we do alternative one. Yeah. I agree that it would get the attention. Yeah, I'm not sure what, well, it may happen that they move out and hosted the plugins on my own but let's see. Yeah. So, like just to be for sure confirmation you're okay with alternative one that I make this one bold and we set an action. Yeah, I'm okay. If I wasn't a decision just on my own, I would rather go for two. Because it's less destructive. But yeah, taking the votes. Okay, we go with one. So just for the record, these plugins have a combined total of around 200 installations that we are aware of. So it's not, again, this is not workflow API. This is not major email X anything like that. So it's rather important to have a common process and policy for cases like that in the future. So taking the votes. Yeah, it seems to be the choice of one. Okay, great. And then the last one has a much more a split for three in favor of alternative to I'm not volunteering to implement this. I would be okay with alternative one given that it's easier to implement so I don't want to make things more difficult for the implementers. Okay, I will I will attempt let's say I will attempt alternative to and if it becomes a non unreasonable mess. I'll check in with you again. I would like to check in with me I'm okay either way. Yeah, yeah, I would think if you find alternative to is an unreasonable mess. I think we should call for alternative one is an acceptable fallback. That makes sense to me. Okay, thank you I doubt I really doubt that becomes necessary. But it's nice to have that safety net thank you. All right, any other any other comments or discussion on the topic we've got the four actions Daniel thanks very much for capturing those got it. Okay. How do we reach out to maintainers and explain the situation to them and what we expect from them as follow up. So I sent email to the maintainers earlier this morning I sent email to Dave dresser one of the maintainers and I think I was going I had assumed somebody from the board and I'm happy to volunteer sends them an email saying, here are the decisions we've made based on this. Here you're you're, you're, you're pending these actions. This is what we've done. And, and you need to take actions, or this will be the ongoing state. Right so based on what we decided. We are now about to suspend distribution of around 10 plugins. So there's probably a few more people who inform should be contacted and informed about this and where you can also request further action be taken. So the way I would, the way I'll, I think I would do that is, I will look in repository permissions updater for the, the maintainers of those plugins. Look in accounts dot Jenkins that I offer their email addresses I'm an administrator there so I can read those and send email to those email addresses saying this is what we're doing. This is what we have done. But does that does that seem sensible so mark to send here I'm going to put it here mark, just to notify maintainers of the approximately 10 plugins, what actions we've taken, and we'll take. And how they can have us restore distribution. As a, as a quick side note, when I've previously reached out to maintainers about security vulnerabilities I've always also, I've often also checked the account up. I don't know whether a desync of conduct information is still a problem based on the current jira configuration but it was in the past. So that the jira email address was invalid and they would not get information emails from there, but they had a correct contact address in the account. I was intended to only use the account app because that's the one that they have to use for password reset I wasn't even going to look at jira. Is that okay that's that was my thought because that's where I frequently go if I need to convert a Jenkins account name to an email address. Seems seems fine now. Okay, based on email. And if they have a bogus email address. Well, address in accounts dot Jenkins that I own. Okay, good. All right. Daniel, could you gently provide the list of the specific plugins. That way I'm not guessing which ones are owned and you and I risk having. Oh, perfect. It's already in the poll request. Okay. I just propose to spending everything and have them figure it out. Okay, excellent. All right, so that's, that's perfect. If you've listed them. I can just use your list and I'm set. Great. Which also goes beyond for the record also goes beyond computer. There are also a few the BMC plugins specifically that look maintained by BMC folks. And I mean that was just, you know, not immediately related but same org. So, right. And that that makes sense to me. Okay, thank you. All right, so I think we've got those five action items any objections or concerns about those action items. Okay, thank you. Thanks for the work Daniel is driving to preserve our access to the GitHub organization. That would be disastrous. We got locked out of GitHub. Anything else on the on this plugin suspension topic. Okay, we're up against only four more minutes till our hour. I propose to skip news and action items. Unless there are items that you want to specifically highlight in them. Okay, next then your license changes are complete. Nothing else to say there except thanks to Atlassian and thanks to the Linux foundation. For the topics, I'm going to I've scheduled to do a presentation to the CDF technical oversight committee April 12 on the status of the Jenkins project. I'll create the presentation share with all of you so that you can see it, give comments, etc. And I specifically asked in the last meeting for confirmation they're okay with it being a wider project review not just a technical topics review and they specifically wanted it, a wider help to the project review. Next item then was LFX tools working group, Oleg and I both attended an exercise session there today. Next meeting in a month. LFX insights is the next generation of what we use today as dev stats. And sorry about that. There we go. Next topic then was on community activity just to be have people aware. Artifactory bandwidth reduction project keeps going I finally gave up and publicly disclose the abusing IP address. And still not made significant progress on it but artifact is going to attempt to block at the IP level. Google summer of code we've got 22 draft proposals now up for review. Thanks everybody. April four is when proposal submit. And the last topic for this group was the one that I most wanted to be sure. Usually in the past we changed the meeting time for daylight saving so that we would keep a consistent time of day for our European contributors. Is that is that a preference Oleg for you, Alex for you Daniel for you Bruno for you or would are you okay with a staying at UTC and really isn't here so I can't ask him he was the one who had the biggest challenge with it I think. For me, it's okay. So plus or minus one hour for Mondays is okay. Okay, Alex. Oleg here, plus or minus one hour doesn't affect me too much. Okay. Daniel, any change for you in terms of if we stick to a time of day or stay with DST. I'm not around enough to get an opinion on this. Okay, great. So I'll double check with Uli Hoffner consider the question opened and not resolved at this point. Daylight saving is invoked in Europe a week or two from now is that right next Sunday, next Sunday. Okay. Alright and Bruno, do you have a preference that you wanted to know as Daniel I don't come often enough to have a voice on this. Okay, great. Any other topics before we conclude for today. Alright, thanks everyone.