Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the procrastinators podcast I am the best guy ever and let's see who else is here. We got Ben St minimum wage Yeah Illegal band we've got Tom Oliver. I was really upset at the death of Steve Jobs It ruined Apple and it's cost them thousands of dollars in revenue from me personally because I will not buy their products anymore Because they're so fucking bad Well, how unfortunate Hi guys, it's me prisoner 308 welcome back to day 238 of my let's play of breaking out of jail the Warner hasn't found me yet But he just might stay to I really I really wish you'd said prisoner 358 because that's Casey Neistat's new company 358 And you would have been the one political prisoner of Casey Neistat, but anyway Maybe just the first prison. Okay, fair enough and welcome to divu. Hey, buddy in the land of ooze There was a man whose name was job. This man was a blameless and upright. He feared God and shunned evil Nice divu I I just need to let it sink in how many like fan girls just Squee'd and Because divu was on this episode I'm very happy. I'm very happy to have the legendary cryptid divu Let's you know cousin of slimmer man divu underscore the is here for another round of procrastiners podcast Yeah, what are we doing today? Welcome Nate?  You're the guy. What are we doing? What are we doing? Why are we here? Listen up everybody? Here's what we're doing. We're talking about Jobs we're talking about jobs. What is a job? Where is a job? Please give me a job For free, I don't have to I deserve job. Just give it to me.  I think I wrote that definition myself I Edited by Ben st. It says there you go. There you go. Ben has had an allergy to job Why would you edit my perfect entry Ben?  Now now now that we're past the water leave my mark I cast limit let me just lay down the law here and say that I am I am post job I am post job my generation is post job. We do not need jobs anymore We are past the point of jobs and that was definitely things on the internet and that Can be where we make money. Well, I mean, yeah, we're in the crowd source and crowdfunding era Well, at least we're starting out. I'll do that And I'm saying my generation is post job Well, okay, the reality of the situation is most people get jobs. What at least in America What are you saying? I am I am one of them.   He's just been out pounding the pavement He's been out pounding the pavement trying to you know trying to work to get his to get his life on Yeah, it's not at all that this person was actually sitting at their computer Refreshing craigslist for one hour a day and deciding that was enough work. Thank you very much and then going back to play hexbox There are definitely people like that but the job market is pretty retarded especially It took me like three years to find a job that I now have and it's a great job. It's a very good job Well, it's funny. You said that I was immediately reminded of a tweet I saw on like the Mm-hmm, you know how like Twitter has like recommended things They have like the UX whatever for some reason it like knows that I went to school for design and like always recommends me all These things and one of them was a terrifying a job posting for a programmer and it's a like required 10 years of Experience in Swift, which is like Apple's programming language and I just like posted a screenshot of that And he's just like Swift has only been around for three years. Oh It's just like Lamar. Oh, no, so yeah, it's pretty dumb.  I mean these are actually really good jumping off point these two definitions because they're really they really showcase What the current generation thinks of jobs and you know what?  We are we are post job We are I don't have a bite in this well Millennials Millennials failed to get jobs and then Gen X is post job They got out scot-free They want to take credit for but really they had no choice because jobs just don't exist anymore clearly.  It's true That that's true.   There's already top 10s dude. Nerdwriters not that far above a top. The last thing you only see is someone standing in your lettuce at Burger King Yeah, this person posted themselves on Burger King standing on lettuce and posted it on 4chats Yeah, so like the thing is basically the only way to be at you.  Why did we do cryptids for the topics? Next time next episode. Sorry dude. Sorry.   I mean just the way that it is like and this is the way that's technically always been It's just the technology is advancing so fast now Like the only thing that anyone will pay someone to do is that they can't do on their own Or they can't like hire a machine to do at a much lower cost than it would take to hire a human So for example, you got like a janitor like yes You could get a robot to be a janitor in theory, but that would probably be really expensive So it's cheaper to just like hire a guy to push it around the fact that we have every job listing for entry-level jobs Requires 25,000 years of experience. I think it's probably because of You know the legal system and employee protection system is kind of being outdated at this point Like we don't have yeah, but the frameworks both legal and colloquial or unofficial That we have as expectations for what an employee employer relationship should be is kind of dated at this point At this point having a job is just sort of filling in the cracks that robots can't quite fill fulfill yet You know what I mean Like yeah, you ain't wrong and yeah, like all the friends. I know who have like regular-ass jobs at like stores They're always worked part-time But given as many hours as you can possibly make someone do without it being full-time. Yeah, right? That's 39 hours a week or whatever.  I have no doubt There is a formula.   We got we got calm up. We got to call up We need this needs to be real Bonus episode, come on the next bonus episode the PCP AI episode. Oh, that'd be a great idea The next bonus is the bot episode. Okay, we got to get working on that. Yeah, please email me Steve Jobs Hey, it seems like it pretty what you're coming down hard on the jobs are good and everyone And if you don't have a job well then my like time to perish Well, okay, listen, I I'm just very hard on the personal responsibility front You know and like if you don't have a job like I I get it There are all these challenges that you face in our you know Like my generation is that all these issues I was pretty lucky because right from the start I was interested in technology and Like computer science stuff and now I'm a programmer professional programmer now And like it's it's a great place to be that is it's pretty much one of the best places to be to get a job And I'm really really sorry to everybody out there who has an intrinsic interest in To use the old cliche lesbian dance theory or like just what it doesn't matter, you know art history Whatever it is.     That's really upsetting to me. That's really upsetting to me And I again I acknowledge all the challenges involved in this But no one owes you anything and nor will that attitude help you to get the things you want I'm interested in helping people get what they want in life and be better people and that means You know not just sitting around and wishing you had a job But like literally going out and like if you go to school for five years And you get your art degree or whatever and then you find yourself flipping burgers and like because that's the only job That's around I get it.    They could or could not offer you you have to make them want to give it to you By providing value I gotta tell you this is one of the only really tall terium rants that I would a hundred percent agree with and I don't Have well, there you go. Fantastic.  I don't even get it. How can you do that? You should go to art college, but I this kid this kid's able to go to yahoo.com. I know an email account He's got computer skills. How does he do it? I just can never know. I can't even turn my computer on I don't know what the fuck's going on But but if I if I were to go to college I would go like hard in to like like like a stem field like like engineering like my go-to is Engineering yeah, and and and my mom's always like well, well, why do you like you don't have an interest in engineering? You don't like engineering. Why why wouldn't you go into something that you like?  What is the point of college? It is to eventually prepare you for a job.     It's like, okay time to work for like five hours making a video now I'm gonna do that now because that's what I want to do and like if you don't do that I question how committed you really are to to this thing.  They feel better.  That's false The real meaning of life is to find something that gives you meaning you have to do something that makes you feel fulfilled And fulfillment is totally different than happiness. Happiness is eating an entire pizza Fulfillment is like doing something that like ten years from now.  I think most people delaying gratification delaying gratification is the most important skill anyone can have It's called life-edging. All right, get into it. That's that's it man.    It was really good. Hey Well, okay. Hey, hey, this is all cool and all I feel like we've gone through a little bit of philosophy Believe it or not. I don't want to like whenever we talk too much about how cool I am I don't want to do it for that long I would rather hear about some specific stories of jobs that we've each had that that are there that I Have a lot in my life. This is the this is the Nate redemption episode where I take back everything that I felt for the Past like three years and it comes around to be like a normal you'd be like, you know guys Let's not get to the philosophy.  I know that's what the people crave So that's what we got to do You talking so you're barred you're barred from entry to talk about stories now Tom.  What what else?  It's been said so far.   So he's like He does like businessy sort of things. He balances like Gillian dollar budgets and stuff. He's a smart guy Um, cool.   We like you a lot We're gonna we're gonna hire you doing design here at the design team Once you're done with school in like six months at this point.    What what was the thing you worked for I just worked for it's a hands-came-air force base. It's a Any any are you commenting there to anything to say on the matter? Well military spending still increased every year. Yeah. Well not for me. I know, right? They can spend a trillion dollars on like the f-35, but they can't throw me like 30 grand a year those fucks Now now I understand why Tom is a communist.  Don't worry about it. And I was like, okay, dad I'll believe I don't mean this to be mean or anything, but your father failed you in this one small thing and my all small thing Well, okay, that that's true. It's like I'm not trying to say the guys evil or anything So much of the generation above us has underestimated and wasn't fully abreast of the situation that we found ourselves in and It's it is fair to criticize. It's fair to criticize for that My my spills were five hundred dollars a month and student well, it's like if I if he had said son You're gonna have to pay five hundred dollars a month. I'd have been like well I'm not going to school He probably didn't actually know cuz none of our parents like grew up in the same economy that we're in right now Yeah, and nowhere like this the if you look at the charts about how I'm sure you have but like the charts of the increases in enrollment costs of colleges and you know housing and boarding and all the stuff that people used to like do themselves But now cuz I'll roll into that you can just you can just fucking take a big out federal loan and just push all Delay the fucking, you know, it's delay the pain as opposed to the Which causes the cost to constantly increase for future generations, you know, and I'll tell you I'll tell you why there's a This isn't really a conspiracy because it's just true.   Is there any way to do that or is it so like off the rails now that there's no point in even like Acknowledging that there's a problem.  They've got 300 million people to control.  I'm really sorry. I wish it wouldn't happen, but wait wait They have to pay for what? Well, they went when we like just for example one crazy example if if we just for example cut welfare 100% it just say it was gone because let's just say America had a revolution where everyone realized that like taxation is theft Just crossed the board.   Is it which is bring back Obama? Yeah Okay, that's not a bad. That's not a bad plan. Well. Yeah, cuz the thing is the opposite of what you just proposed I know but it like to do said it's technically more socialist But it gets us more towards an egalitarian system right because it's you know the thing about well does it though? Well, here's here's my my way. Wait, wait, wait. Let's let's go.   You'd make the same money every single month Well here is why here is why that plan is evil and I'm coming to your house to kill you It's because that system is prejudiced against the less competent That's the problem with that system and we how can we discriminate against people on the basis of competency? How can you make that case?  He's trying. Where are the memes like that joke. Did you like that joke?    So my point is with you be I you sort of cheat the system because everyone Basically gets what they want regarding helping out the poor, right?  Oh, I don't actually understand economics So I don't know exactly. I got it price controls. That's always worked out. Oh I found I'm gonna sound much. Yeah Okay, I might go on a little bit It's just it's just so I there's just a story that I want to tell about me as a young man that might make people think I was always evil, but Here's how you know that I'm not pretending anything that I say now it's because when I was a kid I I my mom is a special education teacher and so when I was in I was in school and like I was doing well And I felt you know, whatever things were going fine I was like elementary school at this point and my mom was telling me about like, you know her day You know, she she worked with like a kid one-on-one, you know She you know She spends her day is kind of like just with one kid at least you know with this particular job She was in at the school that she worked at and I just said to my mom. Um, okay mom Yeah, I get it but like here's my question like why are you paying so much attention to this kid who will never be? You know an amazing shining star Why not like spend your time to like help a kid who's like really good and you know Like could be even better with with one-on-one attention and she was you know, she's just like well, you know He doesn't need it as much like it's I gotta I gotta help the people who who are lacking and need more of a boost To get up to to help them and that has always Confused me. I've never been on board with that system. Yeah, like what you know, what is gained? Like what we feel good. We like like yeah, like like what is gained? Helping someone who is never gonna make significant progress Well, I guess if you want to talk purely like No, I think there's a utilitarian fact of that like, you know, the people the low achievers Like they form like kind of like the backbone of like the service industry and stuff Like you know, they're people So there needs to be like a minimum level of competency and like any sort of employed positions So like you're not wrong Tom. It's it's just I'm talking about like people who are like not even capable of speech For example as like some of these students, you know, so there's I Like we got we got issues. I think I think you're severely alienating most of our audience, right?  Oh god On the high achievement. That's uh, what's I'm saying let it be a baby.  Yeah, let me know that I've hit the eject button on on this train Powering down and I am now outside.  That's all I'm saying. I Think I think the reason that is exactly what your mom has said that that I don't I don't think this is necessarily true Like like at like objective fact well what should happen again?   That's incorrect. That does not in just because someone is rich or successful does not invalidate, you know Like yeah There's a connection here the rich or I mean connection to those with versus those that we have such strong instincts to just want to help those without and On a practical matter.  There's more than just I think okay Let me put this away when it comes to institutionalized Those in power versus those and not who those were not in power Incomes wealth is actually kind of a distraction It doesn't actually have all to do with why certain people remain successful and others don't When we just look at the wealth gap or the income gap and we're like, oh if we just fix that We fix the actual underlying reason why these people are making different amounts of money It doesn't make any sense like if we make it to where it's illegal to pay a CEO more than say $250,000 a year all they're gonna do companies will just give CEOs a shitload of free stuff To incentivize them because there's a reason why see sure they'll work around it That actually and then we just get in the semantics game of like of like trying to criminalize each of these little things And that's a huge waste of time, right Okay, I think we're conflating certain subjects because I know like the rich or people who are like Just don't have the backbone in order to get a job. Okay. I'm talking about like like like mentally like like like birth defect people I'm talking about birth sure. Okay people who I feel like are going like like like their existence is suffering And and that's not necessarily true. I mean it depends.  They're just I know and I know Okay What I'm saying is yeah, I I'm not saying that you should we should just like have all the rest on the people who are just like Underachievers who are just able-bodied and fine, and you know, you know can do whatever They just don't have you know the the fortitude and will pair to do it Those people can fucking die and they don't matter At some point somebody has to start looking out for those people because if we say if we do what you say We should just focus on all of the Successful like people who are going far so they can create things to make the robot butlers Whatever they have to care about those people to want to make the robot butlers if they don't Then they'll never get made and they'll just die The way I see it there should be like there should be like a Skill floor that we should be trying to elevate everyone to and then once they are at that floor We should leave them alone until it depends on in what way but yes Who need our help on like a physical or like mental level Maybe not like I don't know how much money we are dedicating to this in our society I don't like what our priorities are but I think that it's just a humanitarian and just like not entirely against our interest or like Burning money or anything. I think it's it's just a nice thing to do in order to help like our general society You are you are not on like on level with one other and be the same thing the same things as one other You're not wrong And I would never say anyone who wants to do that shouldn't do it like for example Like my mom chose to go into the special education field Exactly what she was getting into and of course I salute her and I'm proud of her and I love her and that's you know Like of course I respect her decisions Of course I like it the problem is when you conflate or not not conflate But like you're mix we're mixing between like individual specific choices people make and then just like broad policy issues like when you when you get between like if you say like You know, I don't believe in That men are Biologically equal to women in every single way like there's a but it's people like but I know women who are stronger than men I mean, of course, like that's true and it happens plenty of times.  It doesn't matter I'm getting lost in the woods here a bunchy Different topics here.   He just happens to look more photogenic and stuff.    We gotta start with the service agreement to Minecraft is the template we should be Rule number one all people were created work equal rule number two do not mine at night The thing about like society and I assume basically every culture but America is definitely no different is that the Average person really views the government as like a magic MacGuffin in like a movie Yeah, it's like whoever can grab the magic lamp and then like rub their wish and do it in the third act Like everything will be fine like at the end of fucking return of the king We're like, you know the ground collapses and conveniently only collapses the bad people, you know, that's what we always want That's how it's always talked about like I remember like when Obama care was like very slightly approved of by the Supreme Court People were like, okay, cool. Healthcare is free right now, right? Like yeah, we're like yeah When conversely if Obama care gets obstructed by like one month people like oh good health care is improved in capitalists now, right?  You're totally right. Like remember that argument. I made a long time ago about like Shit, what was it? It was like that we should like we want to get with on the suicide episode when I said like I want like people to like review people and like approve people before committing suicide You like like it to institute that I recognize takes like a magical level of like bureaucracy that does not exist and can't be Relyed upon but like if it existed and worked perfectly as I envision it that would be nice But it's not real and I think that this mentality comes from sort of childhood where you see police officers as just like Objective enforcers of the law which is this objective power or like, you know You go to school and like the school is this objective force of knowledge and teachers just know things, right? so I think that if we saw not having laws as Not necessarily a problem, but possibly a solution if we always just think of the way to solve problems as more laws Why can't it know the problem is here?  Okay, this is a great example in I shield 21 There is an exact there.  There's never any question There was only one moment in the manga where the issue of the refs is addressed And it's this one moment where like the character looks like he was like he was out of bounds But he had actually grabbed some dirt to be in bounds or something like that and like there's a dramatic reveal As he like looks into the eyes of the ref and the left like stone-faced and perfect Perfectly mechanical and robotic looks back into the eyes of Monta the guy who had made the play All right He was like trying to get out of bounds or whatever to stop the clock and like it should they do zooms on face to face To face and the ref raises his hand and in perfect recognition of all the facts says yes It was out of bounds. You are safe to do another play. You can still win this game my heroes And people think of the government like perfect Yeah, exactly and they think of the government as like perfect and impartial And always but at the same time they're constantly complaining about how bad the government is right. Yeah, that's that's dude No, like I remember okay in 2012 or 2011.  Well, we don't want corporations to do whatever But like why not just actually look at the regulations and look at this on a case-by-case basis and consider which ones are Reasonable I actually for unrelated reasons happened it to check December 20 December 2017 the US government had 61,950 pages of regulations the federal government, which apparently is a 25-year low because of the Trump administration's net negative on on regulations.  It's a world I mean, I remember some people I've heard people who've said that they've heard people who've said that every US Citizen it breaks three felonies a year and that there you go We live in a world where it's really just all about selective enforcement Lawyers are really the ones who control the control freedom in the society.   Let's talk about how I Woken up from my stupor I have I have I have a big I have a big news for everyone I already know this.  Oh I know I know What a what a nightmare that he's betrayed us over well The neat life continues because okay It's a it's a it's a work-from-home thing. I'm basically just answering calls and the reason why I did it Okay, like I used to I used to do online tutoring and I would just kind of be hanging out on this tutoring website waiting for like Notifications come up that people needed help with like math problems And then I would go and like walk them through a math problem And I would just have that open while I was like working on stuff And also kind of split my attention between doing my art and doing my job So I got this job in the hopes that I can kind of do that and just be like Drawing while I'm waiting for calls and then take a call and do a whole thing and then and then you know Go back to doing my shit in the hopes that it'll like you know that I can have money But also be working at the same time, but time will tell time will tell if that if that pans out Yeah, but I'm asking you about physics like why nothing can go faster than light and like your answers sounded like a shitty sci-fi novel Wait, are you when I Like it last year or something. We just because real Real life right?   There he is.   I have today achieved the dream the impossible dream I now command to mega slime Whoa compared to your pitiful one munchie.  It's over my listen Listen, all I'm saying all I'm saying is that you know, not yet. This is just a stopgap measure from when I can make my full-time job Developing endless war by which I mean I mean by which I mean thinking of things to do with endless war trying to do it failing and then asking crack to do Endless war. That's your job. Who are you Donald Trump? Syria am I right? Got him The actual serious question is of course like I assume you plan to still do comics and stuff. Yeah. Yeah, that's the whole That's the whole point.   Let me ask you this.  We don't even know about that Yeah, I'm talking to people right now with that. Why have we been talking about like I know and like governments I don't know that matter. Let's get into where are the memes. We need the memes. He's right Was Davoo saying something I was just thinking you already have such a mess Ionic complex Does I have anything to do with with making furniture out of wood being like a carpenter or some shit? Well, you know, it's like so I guess the job I was referring to there was like I said more working at pier one Worked at pier one for a year or two My job was bait. I did some of the like up front just people buying shit You know your job was basically like push sales of all kinds of Bullshit, but what I what I much preferred to do my favorite thing to do there, which was like my my sort of my main Responsibility was you know pure one is is to some degree a furniture store So we would get these big boxes of furniture in and it would be my job And then like there were other guys who would like come in it was all women who worked there But then like the guys who worked there were the ones who would like build the furniture just because we were bigger I guess And so I would just sit in the back I would open up box after box after box and assemble like Ikea style Extremely simple furniture pieces to put together and I would just I would sit there and I would commune with God and My halo would appear and I would invent the table.  Yes Someone is like What is this weird table you're making Jesus?     Before you answer that I want to teach you to do radcon for Jesus lecture where you explain the history and life of Jesus Christ I don't know. I think I probably could have my dad do that lecture, but What's the fire that's lit under your ass that makes you go I'm gonna make this whole video on this shitty laptop Um, you know what it is It's well, I think for me it's being motivated by fear a lot of things are motivated by fear And there's probably some degree that like fear of like go out being Unworthy in life and like allowing myself to fear of fear of looking back and regretting all the things you didn't do Yeah, that's what motivates me That's a fair. It's a fair thing. It's a fair thing and I think that's fear that I'm living that that's my life Well, there you go I guess Like I don't know a lot of it really does come from like when I was growing up. I just felt shitty About myself it just like I wasn't do it like I don't know like it really I know it's weird as I come back to a lot but a lot of it comes back to I think my issues with women and like how I felt like such a failure and that I was Completely failing when all my friends were like superior to me And then I realized I didn't want to be nor did I have to be inferior anymore Like I could fix myself and then I did and then once I did that I was like, well, let's keep this train rolling I I think like and like I don't want to take all credit like Ben is the one who suggested we even make videos in the first place So he's the one who like turned me on to even the possibility of doing this kind of He was good I'm sure glad it happened and then just when I was in that I discovered how much I enjoyed doing it and then I Don't know man. Like it's like that particular video series or whatever. I just really liked that show I was mad that people were explaining it poorly and I like wanted to correct the record But the real thing at the room or that that particular show whose name must not be mentioned indeed indeed That's what they call it It I guess I just really have things I want to achieve in life Like I these days I spend a pretty large amount of time And it keeps going about like how I admire Jank youger of the young Turks and I know that's a weird a weird guy to pick out of that out of a hat But like apart from the political issues. I strongly disagree with him on I look at this guy Who was like he was some fat virgin like 25 year old asshole who was like a super political nerd But now he's got like a huge network and like a huge successful business Where like he works with all these fascinating people He gets to meet all these amazing people and like do all these cool things He's not as good a shape as he could based on I'm gonna Gonna be working on that but Like I really spend a lot of my time thinking about like the male role models in my life I want to be like and I try to live the way they would I spend a lot of my time thinking about how The penny arcade guys live and how I want to live like them and how I'm closer than I ever thought I would be but there's still a long way to go.   It's called Penny arcade, right? It's just like you showed me what was that show strip search strip search Yeah, that's the kind of thing they can just do on a whim and like if they hadn't spent like a decade or decades or whatever was Like building up themselves to the point where they had the resources to like create that show that they probably never even imagined They'd be making like at the start. It's because they gave themselves power. I'll say it man I'm in it for power. I want the power to control my life Yeah, do fun things. I want to do. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's what I'm in for.  I'm trying to make. Yes. All right This crystal is where have all the memes on I'm doing my best. They have they have no they have Yeah, they've fallen into obscurity. They need to be max-revived.   Yeah, I'm sure they did I have to you have to cast a shitload of stupid Miniature nets to get random people in the audience you see, but you know The the PCB has splintered into minuscule individualized memes for different groups to appreciate Like like the history buffs like the history Sitting waiting when when will my memes come?  Oh, well, there's jasmine. There's jasmine. Yeah Christian wife look look at what she's wearing. Well, okay goddamn back to the topic here This this mentality in myself was finally I jasmine is Islamic. That's the topic of the podcast Okay, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. We could debate whether or not jasmine is a Muslim for ages We can never reach a consensus. Jasmine versus Islam the new bonus episode It's a good one When hippo was saying in a chat earlier that you know when I really think about it Creating a cult around myself like developing hardcore fans is really just exactly the same as Getting the algorithms. You're basically just doing a Humiliating rain dance and tooling your content and persona to get a certain specific result neither one of them is Doing what you want to do as an artist, right? It's kind of the way he was putting it But you get if you've got if you've got a following that gives you power and having power lets you do the things that you want to do And and and doing what you want will lead to success if you just do it consistently and you work Guys, can I I'm sorry, I'm sorry to cut in can I just bring you a brief moment of joy that just happened in real time in my Life while I was on this podcast I get a message from Michelle That who just says it's a father It's just that she says a someone she's at work right now, I picked her up yesterday She she just sent me by saying hey Nate just thought you should know someone just asked me Hey, Michelle, were you here with the big muscular bodybuilder last night and they literally asked if I was a bodybuilder I Know I don't deserve it, but it makes me feel good.  All right Having a kid and one of the moment I thought of Nate having a kid I was reminded of this YouTube barats and Beretta skid where there's this guy who's training his like Year-and-a-half old daughter to be like world-class Olympian and like giving her weights and throwing her all around That's what I will do with all my children. That's what I will do. Yeah explicitly the like Horrific regimen you have planned out. I'm sure your kids can be all they can be well Listen, Ben exactly as you said delay gratification.   That's right aka me I will be their average every day when they come to me. I know they're transcended That's the end goal.   That's what I'll say. It'll be great. You'll say get in the ground There that's what it'll be. That's what it'll be because this is my wife son just to clarify You know That's what it is All right, where were well jobs, right?  That's what I'm doing every day Please don't bully me. It's a real job. Someone has to do it.  I deserve respect. I'm a human being That's it. Someone has to do it. We all know we all know that Tarone can't do it We yeah, I just gotta take up. I just gotta take it. Yeah. Yeah, that's right Ben you've done jobs before you were just talking about jobs. Yeah Um Should I list them? Yeah. Yeah, that sounds fun. Let's go list our jobs. I like our jobs Well, let's see when I was in high school. I worked at mrs. Fields cookies in the mall. Yeah Yeah, I worked I went you drew fancy designs on them. I remember that. Yeah, it was really fun Actually, it was like way fun when I had to decorate cakes I Was a counselor at Astro camp for like six months there. I worked at I was I was a food runner After that was over. I was a food runner at this restaurant called the Chateau that actually we just went to when we were in Boston It was oh, yeah, I was nice. Yeah. Yeah, I worked I worked at that restaurant I actually this was like eight years ago or like seven years ago and I saw people there that I Barely recognized out of the corner of mine. I was like, oh my god.  I mostly just worked it from they would send me assignments I would do them send it back but a bing-butta boom I was like sort of an engineer, but mostly I just like mostly I just like took readings off of an electron microscope at this place called integrity in Belarica Belarica, whatever. I never learned how to say the town's name And I think there's more. Oh, I was the Poland one about Poland. Oh, yeah Yeah, and then I taught I taught physics to two Arab kids in Poland Yes, I think that's a pretty exhaustive list of my jobs Ben the real mental powerhouse behind 9-11 you can thank him for it. Yeah This was post 9-11, okay Um, I can't imagine what it must have been like to be alive during 9-11 and like being able to like like perceive it Oh God true. That's incredible. Yeah, I always said that for me is the dividing line between Like Millennials and in Millennial 2.0's if you don't remember distinctly 9-11 happening then you're I'll tell you right now Munchie you missed a hell of a party. I was just in the plane. I was having to Hey, I'll just run through my jobs real fast because we're all doing it My first job was I worked for our next-door neighbor Ralph and I worked like he had like a big party Like he had a big Fucking bit of land in front of his house or like he would hold like events So people would like have weddings there and they'd like do stuff like that I worked there It's like a caterer and just like a guy would stand around and like watch and like make sure and clean up stuff And I worked there for like a couple months.  That's my favorite kind of pizza to this day Oh, yeah, there will be a stealing your dad on Papa Gino's. I'm very excited. I want to watch that I want to know I want to know an in-depth review of this Papa Gino's pizza, which I'm sure you will do We get deeper in depth than you have ever dwelled before Let me see in in I think that was the last job. I did before college in college I worked as a librarian at our award-winning school library at the College of New Jersey where I went That's my my alma mater I While also while I was working there I got like a small little gig to like make a program for a guy that he paid me for I just didn't do it though That's really the long and short of it.  I this is not you did not do the work and I'm just like no I did a good job. I'm really I'm good. I'm deeply ashamed of it to this day Beyond that I Think after college. I just got a job at I worked at a pizza place for a little while Making some shitty-ass pizzas for this like mom-and-pop place. They were they were a Hoptic Christian Egyptians. They were cool. They loved Jesus. They love Might as that might be the wrong word whatever they were just like super Christ-Faggy Yeah, like touch I would feel them and they would you know respond to my touch in real time. Yeah, that's not the pizza's homemade I I Asked the man to tell me the secret recipe for his secret sauce and he would not tell me So I worked there then I worked at Best Buy for like a year or two That was okay.  I just I was just around these people who were just big weed guys and recognized I never wanted to be around them ever again or anyone liked them 91 Unbelievable good like like good like the experience for me See hey weed time Person hopped up on weed doing bad things. It doesn't matter. There was a fake and not real that doesn't matter No, that's not a problem.   Yeah, yeah, that's true Audience right after we recorded that lecture Munchie took us upstairs and showed us the video where he reveals himself as a fake And then he goes on his diatribe explaining his motivations, and I'm like oh Parkour dude's mission was born out of hatred and contempt. It wasn't just lighthearted poking fun at he's like Really seriously Despises the kind of thing he was parodying and he was just going full tilt propaganda against it.  Yeah, because he is he's like I Feel like both him and Sam hide or like like like like they moonlight in philosophy They definitely is really like yon really has a principle that I really enjoy and I try and do but I'm not very good at I need I've been thinking about I want to do it more where your comedy is rooted in the things that you believe and And like your your comedy is rooted in like like how you want To perceive reality is 100% true, and I think about that a lot when I'm when I'm trying to do stuff Yeah, what I I I kind of think that comedy without that is just inherently less valuable But you know whatever I can I stay just goof for the sake of a goof Hey, let me just finish my last jobs here all I did I worked at pier one and now I got my current programming job And that's it. So I'm done. I'm out. It's all my jobs Devu you you you clone some wandoes, right? What? Yeah, that's all I've done.     I totally forgot about this I was the guy who filed my dad's paperwork for a long time. I totally forgot about it Yeah, I remember filing dad's paperwork. Yeah, I actually kind of loved it because I get to watch Star Trek while I do it And I would listen to all day. I would listen to podcasts while doing it Yeah, I hated doing it because I was like man I could be spending my time so much better because he would pay like eight dollars an hour. Yeah Yeah, my dad would do that stuff that kind of stuff too even before he like business He'd be like, honestly, I would not have done it even though he was paying me But like he kind of like insisted that we do it. Yeah, well, hey, we were living with his house rent-free So, yeah All right, that's it pretty good of him to pay anything true Tom Okay, so my first job was in high school and I got I went to Papa Gino's just like Nate did I worked there just to buy a computer because I didn't have Tom Let's literally open a Papa Gino's franchise. Just you and me. We should we're old-school employees My mom and dad their first Was both Sonic they both worked at the Sonic restaurant as their first job. Oh, yeah No, they met each other like decades later or like 15 years later, but they still like that was that just coincidence, right? But they still work at Sonic No All right, so sorry Tom didn't mean that. No, it's all good Papa Gino's the first job then I went to college and I worked at the Cafeteria at the school for while making sandwiches And then I also did like the the desk thing like where you like sign people in to like the dorms and stuff did that for a while And then I got a job at Apple while I was in school So I would go down the street to the mall to work as the guy who like you talked to you about computers and shit I did that for like Geniuses that's pretty cool. You were an Apple genius. I was like the specialist I was the one who like sold you stuff. I wanted to be a genius But they're like you got to work your way up to that But yeah, I did that it was it's funny because like to this day Everything that I've done like when I've gone in to talk to people about jobs Everyone's like floored that I worked for Apple.  God, I wish dude look at my iPhone. It was this you was this you just tell me I put it together. Yeah, that was me So I did that then I worked during the summers at hands come here for space my dad We're not with him. I was like in a totally different building doing something completely unrelated But I did that for a while Then when I got out of school, I worked at Best Buy for a season and it was hey Are we the same guy? Yes, we are the best and worst ever. That's the dynamic Then oh my god, this runs so deep We need to do our best guy worst guy podcast That's a great. Oh my god. Literally. That should be what happens. I agree the communists on the capitalist finally clash Oh, no Ideologies finally get compared I Don't think the universe can handle it but cold war two begins Um, by the way, oh Continue Tom. I was gonna say after that. I went to Staples for a little bit and that sucked then I went to Whole foods and I was like a sign maker to like graphic design stuff there and that was nice I worked there. We got our legendary groceries for rad con No, no, we did not know we got shaws. Yeah No, no, no the first the first place that me and Tom went to Uh, no, I don't think we went to Whole Foods We went to Star Market, which is like the total opposite of Whole Foods. Hope it's like high high organic food place Um, and that was like the healthiest I'd ever been when I worked at Whole Foods I had to do nothing but eat food there But the only thing I got afforded to eat was Caesar salads because it was so expensive So I ate nothing. I ate nothing but Caesar salad for like a year and I lost a ton of weight and it was great um But I lost that job because I was like too Retarded yeah retarded.   So that people would actually like because I worked I worked up. I didn't work on the floor There was like an upstairs where they made all the signage and stuff because all the signs of Whole Foods are done by hand So I'd have to like write Had to like do a bunch of classes to learn how to do the Whole Foods handwritten font There's like classes you had to take how to do that So I can learn how to do that and then like you just write these big signs Then you had to like draw and cut out on like foam board and stuff like illustrations to like they must be losing so much money by using that System absolutely absolutely It's their goddamn branding though.  She works like a hiring agency Just trying to get people to fill the slot and I needed jobs like do this. It's work from home It's like $15 an hour and you'll be doing like social media stuff like getting your social media brand account set up And I was like, oh, yeah, I can do that in my sleep. Sure. So I like go through all these like Ridiculous bullshit like trying to talk to people to get the job signed up and during that time It changed from work from home to come into our office an hour away and from $15 to $10 So and I was just like I was already signed the paperwork at that point the day before I went into work They're like by the way, you were only giving you a Two-thirds of what we said that the price was gonna be so I'd go in there And I just like it's not social media branding anymore. They just want me to like do data entry So the entire job was a lie and I was like, okay So I was there for a week and then a week the next week They I got an email when I woke up before I was gonna go into work saying we actually decided we don't want anyone to have This position because it's too expensive.  No, let's and like next PCP episode the PCP fucks over Tom and we take him out and we take his money Remember the greatest thing that ever happened to me. Okay, it was when I got fired Well, I didn't get fired. They just like stopped the hire. They just stopped paying me That job where I was like doing document editing for whatever company I did not know I had no idea that this is how it worked, but you know, I did that job for maybe six months This was like kind of during the t-bat days or maybe a little before and So it turned out afterwards that I I didn't know about unemployment insurance But apparently if you work like a real job or a real enough job, you know, they just bank a bunch of money With the government and then if you lose the job under like the right circumstances, like if they lay you off or whatever If they whatever You just get more money like even though you're not working and so like for like several months If we maybe like two months or more after that I was getting like two hundred dollars a week in the mail and I was like, huh?  Yeah, so it was this unfortunate series of events that led to your current mindset Lowering your standards to adjust to whatever whatever you're currently being given out of them out of the pity of people's hearts It's funny if funny Like this job the racket ball job was actually like amazing because like what a racket am I right? It was it was incredible like I made negative money Working for this job because because of the driving or something because because they I had initially gone there To get a work from home because I didn't my car was broken and I didn't have the money to fix it So so I got the job because there was supposed to be a work at home position So then they said well, it's actually a driving in position So I had to get my car fixed which was six hundred dollars and then I only got a hundred fifty dollars where I was fired So I made negative four hundred fifty dollars working for this Which was Nate I can understand why you're so fucking utilitarian and Objectivist sometimes when like you see I hear people all the time go Oh, it's a false stereotype that there's all these people who just wouldn't work at all if I didn't have to But like your older brother kind of is like that Yeah, Ben did it everyone You just like you're one of these guys who doesn't want to have to work any harder and if someone just gave you money Of course you take it, you know Because you're not you I'll tell you why Ben and it's because you will not have real power over your life You'll always be dependent on people and that's not fun That's very stressful. The only thing that I want power for is to be able to do whatever I want But if I have that if I if I can have that, you know without You know working for it like like if I can have that on like relatively little You know resources then it like what would more resources even gain me Really the only thing that the greater number of resources gain you which I would understand if people didn't put as a priority But it's just a bigger safety net if things go wrong or change That's really what it comes down to I like a big safety net. I do I admit sure sure That's all it's just if I'm all if I'm managing to do everything that I want with relatively little You know, it's not I don't have much motivation to strive for more. I Have big goals for my life because I already because in that situation. I've already achieved the goal I it is it is coming. That is true.  Sure. Sure. I'm not Was not the optimal solution. Well, there you go. That's great. I'm glad to hear that I Guys, I know it's off topic But I just need to say like that came into my life in real time this little bundle of joy That just appeared right now. I need to share with you guys here today. We'll be in the show notes Oh, what's what's this about just just look and see who you see in this crowd shot of this Mila Pony episode Just just go through and tell me who you see. I see the breaking bad guy. Oh, it's Rick and Morty. Yeah, wait This is oh There they are. This is not real. Well, I mean, they've already done dr. Hooves and I mean, no, look at like look at the pixels on Morty's eyebrow. It's real. How do we know? This is real. Where's the confirmation looks that looks fake. I I saw it posted somewhere Oh, I choose to believe it. Is that Heisenberg in the back? I think so Disgusting Okay, but hang on his cutie mark is a pickle like would Rick's cutie mark really be It's a test. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, I see the bottom looks like a pickle Okay. All right. Uh, I don't know. I can't even speculate right dude like Tom.   Here's what it was the guy the husband the dad He's like a legal document writer thing Or something. Mm-hmm. He like was doing negotiations for a thing regarding a casino and basically his company had him write up a list of terms and agreements and Usually they're gonna like reject half of it and you're gonna be negotiating for a while But they just accepted all of their terms.  And it's just like wow. Yeah, that's like a total like out of nowhere windfall crazy, right?   I never thought I'd have that many Really you actually got more subscribers than you imagined yourself having does anyone ever actually done that? Or am I just I don't know.  Um I haven't gone through my list. I haven't gone through my list. Yeah, please please.  I did not have like a schedule or anything I would I would just do odd jobs throughout society and mostly Commissions on the internet. So I I I am post What's that again? It's called the gig economy, right? Right. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I I am post job I you know, I I I I have I have lived my entire life Including now where I I guess you could say that the PCP is a job But like it's it's more fluid It's it's more fluid it's entirely like individual like it's it's basically commission based more or less for everyone including me Mm-hmm. Yeah, so so so so I'm the only job like like like I like if I like The main thing that I've done with my life like the main salary earner I I would say is probably commissions followed by the PCP in terms of how much I've made You're also a lawnmower, ain't you? Well, I I used to I don't really do that as much anymore But I remember you saying that that's how you paid for your flight to rad con too if I remember correctly Well, it was mostly commissions, but like okay. No shade on it. Obviously. I think it's cool. I was just you know No, no, no. No, I I I know it's cool I I like that's why I say what I mean like do a job through it decide where I'll just like Oh, okay, or someone who just needs me to do something for them Uh, this was who just needs to perform some miscellaneous sexual act. I understood Yeah, okay I don't like to do that much anymore because I don't like like most of the people who would be that are like not here And like I don't live in an area that pertains to What I'm saying is I live in a shit ghetto place and I'm not I'm not really in demand anymore Uh-huh Uh, so most of it is online stuff But but I've I've never like like I I didn't have like a like a summer job or anything I've never had like, you know, I need to flip burgers in in a high school or anything my flipping burgers was flipping minds and and and creating psychological revolutions on this podcast I mean because you know, what's what's I that's definitely true And it's like I got my first job at pop of genos or you know It works for my neighbor or whatever like the first one I think it was pop of genos that I did when I was like 16 and a half or like 17 or something. Yeah, that's exactly.  I know that's that's what I'm trying to hammer home We are yeah job. We have evolved past the need for jobs We can just do like like like like like young artists can just do commission work And and and they can get fucking mad dash by mad dash I mean barely more barely any money and then like a quarter of what you need to live Well, you know, this is the fascinating thing though, like maybe I'm not really sure it's a quote unquote good thing For like the people I guess just like for the the worker class of society that things are going this way because things used to be much more Cushy and like comfortable and you didn't really need to worry about it And like the economy has just gotten so much more demanding I guess you have to have like two parents working to support a family and stuff Like I'm not saying that this like there's nothing to be to be done except rise to the challenge obviously, but I'm just saying that like People really seem to be like lowering their standards across the board and maybe at a necessity like I don't I don't know if it's just, you know Not not everyone's a ben out here. Uh, it's just you know, like I was reading like something recently about how like Or you know what it was?   Yeah, what you want to do then I I've said this time and time again Where I don't particularly want to be super rich or anything I just want to be able to do what I want to do which is just to draw forever And so as long as I'm not dead and I'm drawing forever. That's ideal for munchie What you're tapping into is the fact that we're in this transitionary period Like hypothetically well, it won't be that long before robots actually do actually everything Like they could even make novels better than people could and at that point We're just crossing our fingers that we continue to be the masters of this planetary domain That will be the final issue But at that point, you know, we won't even have money. I mean, I don't know This is really high-minded shit, but like we're sort of moving into an area where like If everything is automated hypothetically then you don't even need to pay money for anything because everything is automated, right?  You know, like think about how that's kind of the awkward transitional If you're if we're talking like the baby boomer era, we're talking about like the 60s and 70s We're thinking about like it's all about making lots of money and spending that money to have a good life But nowadays you can sort of have a lot of the same things for a lot less money How much money did you have to spend back in the 70s to have a level of entertainment that you can now have with netflix?  But there are other ways to feel valuable and yeah, I think that like your kd ratio or something Right, so Yeah, yeah Let's we need to gamify real life The only problem is I don't trust anyone to make a system where like you allocate points for the right things Because you're just gonna get a bunch of like spawn camping pieces of shit who just you know That's endless war endless war is the gamification of real life All we need is to make endless war real aka incite gang violence across all the major cities in the united states of america And then we'll have our ideal society We have to irradiate the seas and turn it all to slime We need to flood the grand canyon with slime to make that slime river flow Yes And the violence should follow naturally from there. That's true, but also forbidden Okay, deleted. Uh, I I I've been having doubts myself about about how Uh, the upward momentum of internet Content creation and and and how it will be good for like like me personally And I I've been I've been thinking about you know, I like I really admire and I and I respect the the security that you have Nate of you know, just doing you a job having that safety net and also doing what you love You know make make videos and stuff And I have not fully formulated and you know hard set my opinion I used to be super into like, you know, obviously content creation is just a way for me It in lines with all of my beliefs and like what I want to do and it will allow me to do what I want But the the more I think about the more I think well, you know Like like having more money will be having more money and I will be able to do more of what I want You know, I'm saying if I yeah, yeah wealthy I will be able to go and go more places and do more things which will tie back into my heart Yeah, I mean it does serve the goal of you know freedom Yeah, it gives you the freedom.  But uh, yeah, that's that's the most important thing I'd want people to take away. I think that's really important If you can make it work full time doing the thing you want to do fantastic I recommend you do so immediately, but uh, you know being aware of where future trends are going And I mean these days there's a lot of there's a lot of cracking down on uh, some of the more out there The only future trend that matters is your trend into the fucking grave So there's no time. There's no time.  Like what if you never get good and you never get the money back? Like which will happen to most people who try probably, uh, you know worrisome So you have a motivational crack.com article talking about success and like it's point number six To be successful or to get anywhere in life.  I did that for a long time myself I always I did that my a lot of my life and hated myself intensely for it Uh, and I was just so delighted to look back one day after I'd gone through doing all this t-bap and you know Best guy ever in pcp stuff and now I'm just like I'm so happy every day when I realize I'm not that guy anymore I'm like still that 50% of the time.  I should have been working on finishing all the uh, the paperwork for um Like who gets what for the for the rad kind of it instead. I played stardew valley So, you know, not every day I have a lot of money writing on that so I feel free to criticize me everybody. That's totally fair, but I'm working on it. I'm by the time you hear this It'll be done. So I will say like I have figured out I have cured myself of the most base form of procrastination But there's other forms in the crop. He has to leave the podcast now Well, I'm supposed to be working on a the next digi video right now And I'm kind of doing it But I was also kind of just working on selecting dozens of different colors for mannequins in a level In a video game and I'm like, I don't want to make the video. I want to make more colors for my mannequins So I'm like, oh Um, anyway, the point is What's up? Oh, we'll continue continue. I'll do it after you. Yeah So I tend to procrastinate by doing something else But isn't the thing a lot of people do that as a way to trick themselves into thinking they're doing what they should Be doing like for example, when it's time to do your taxes I will like clean my room because one is like less Objectionable than the other Exactly. You know, we do that kind of stuff. Don't fall for that trap people. You got to be aware of that stuff.   It was literally just something in me snapped And I just didn't stop working ever And I don't know Maybe it's just not everyone is cut out for this.  They just think that all these cool internet people are cool So I want to be like that. It's like, you know, I think it might only be for you if not being that is literal psychological torture You know as as the world famous show grounded for life once eloquently put it somebody's got to make the sandwiches Yes, and uh, that's a perfectly reasonable thing to say when the robots make the sandwiches There is a there is an AI burger flipper I don't really put a lot of stock personally in like willpower or like people's like inner strength coming out I really think you're just either predisposed to hear a certain message and then like do stuff or you won't be So, uh, yeah, you know, I just think like some people will just get that but but what I will say is Though like because I am a guy who cares about this kind of stuff I think that the more messages that are out there the higher likelihood That someone might hear it and then be inspired to do these sorts of things Which I would argue is a good thing Oh my god, they just didn't work on me, but they might work on someone else Yeah, exactly exactly.  Do you want to be sad forever?    Oh my god. That's it. Right.  Of course not. Yeah, I know I I I can quantify the issue with this mentality that all these that so many people have That it's a focus on the methods and not a focus on the results You see the thing about all those books for helping you with any walk in life, whether it be money or confidence or sex They they spend so much time complicating the procedures And like adding more and more things to remember and you just spend more and more time thinking about all the improvements you can do Then it distracts you from the fact that it's actually it's pretty easy to know whether or not things are changing You just look and see the results, you know, like you just got to be honest about your situation Books to like get you laid with women You know that I feel like they kind of distract you from a very simple A very simple test. Are you getting laid or not? Right. All you got to do is just keep examining that fact and then change your behavior accordingly You know a great way.  It takes more effort than not doing it.  It's not about your physical habits that you do It's not about what you do with your life and like who you hang out with or the way that you spend your time It's all just like just like readjust how like it's like just think about you know When you put in your debit card to pay for something and it makes the No, it's just thinking about like an eight-bit video game. Just make the amount like an eight-bit video game Yeah, I can see that seems like That mentality is a little bit liberating, but really it's binding. It's basically putting all misfortune onto you Like it's all within you. Nothing about your environment is limiting you and I see that's where like like Someone might be tempted to like really gravitate to that because it allows them to like quote-unquote like be responsible for everything But that's not actually the case. It makes your challenge insurmountable in some cases. Yeah Well, it just it's just you're not fully assessing the problem because like just for example If you want to lose weight and like your whole family is fat and all your friends are fat like the Like yes, you could theoretically just completely change your habits, but realistically we have to recognize We are weak impressionable Foolish creatures and the best thing to do is start hanging around people who eat the way you want to eat And who exercise and to get friends like that, you know, that's the that's that's a huge environment. Yeah Yeah, yeah, I I'm just saying and I have to share my mom because she's a great lady But like she'll she'll listen to all of these books and and she's listening like like Like unbelief like like hundreds of books and hasn't given her a single extra number in her kd ratio has increased at all Exactly exactly because because she'll just do like like she'll just try and like think about the world differently But she doesn't do anything differently. She still does the exact same things that she's always done for years Munchie's mom is the ultimate nemesis of the pcp. She is our art. She's antithesis of If if Nate were to encounter her as like like a child he would have smothered her like Well, listen, I got a lot of respect for for people who raise a kid But but you know still we can still make criticism It is easy to fall into the trap of like listening to and like indulging in things that like tell you That like tell you how to feel better that like that like that like tell you how to think You know, yeah, yeah, like like like it's easy to fall down the self-help rabbit hole And and think and think that it is doing something for you even listening to this podcast fair viewer You may be pushing off responsibilities Maybe you should be applying for that job you want right now instead of listening to this podcast about jobs For a bunch of assholes.  Well, it's it's just you're making a calculation that you know your proximity to these people is more important to you than whatever the Goal is and you can do that a lot of people do that It's actually pretty psychologically easy for me in like 2012 to decide I should start working on youtube or game design stuff Because I had nothing else going on in my life Right.  I don't think there's any reason to do that Like the only reason I do art is because there's nothing else I am interested in doing So it's actually a very easy decision for me Sure. Yeah, what are you gonna do when did she bleeds all of his money for making an avant-garde content that no one understands? What are you gonna do when he bleeds all this money fair fair question? Yeah I mean I'm I mean right now I'm working on going to the road when downloading shitloads of porn That's related to the video and gonna have to figure out how to censor that Yeah What are you gonna do when he bleeds away all of his money?  There we go. We're back on top. There we go bringing it back No, I'm working on video games something even more Okay, David quick question quick question to view. Here's the real okay How much money have you invested in making this game and how much have you seen on returns? Uh Maybe both are maybe both are zero. Maybe both. I am wealthy. I am wealthy beyond Well, I mean that's my point. It's you know what?  I'm just asking dude.  No, I'm just kidding. I'm that's not the sound but like theoretically, let's just say digi dies I mean, you never know like just what if he dies, you know I'm just saying anyone in any situation should be aware of the realities of how things could change and have a backup plan That's all I'm saying The reality I want to live in is where where where du vu becomes unshackled exclamation point du vu Well, I will say I will say I deeply I deeply missed du vu's videos. I would love those back Yeah, I forgot du vu used to make video in a perfect world in a perfect world But you know, hey man, okay digi's patreon did decrease over the winter by a huge margin I've actually continued to get paid the same amount of money Like digi also makes lots of money from agrev that he just keeps sure sure I've actually been continued to be paid the same amount of money So I'm not actually trying. I don't want to criticize you. You don't need to get into if you don't want to I'm not trying to like examine your financial situation.   I mean that is actually why I'm on the pcp right now.  I do need that money Uh, so there you go. Good. I didn't know where your priorities are The barrels was to your head. You just had to pull that trigger and he's done it last.  So once I accomplished that I basically felt like I've been set for life You know now that we found the gold mine that is water park vlogs. There's no going back. We've cracked. We've opened Pandora's box This is a bubble that will never burst There's two there's two major forms of currency in 2018 and going for there is two major source of income across the world Water park vlogs and endless war. These are the two driving forces of the economy Everything depends on them. What if there is gang violence at disneyland? Oh, christ. It'll be a slime park Instead of a water park. Oh my god, that would be we have to make that we have to we have to build Yeah, we have to build a new room. We have to build a new room in endless war the slime park Welcome to slime park Maybe you can maybe you can pay you can like pay a little bit of slime to like go on one of the rides or something You have to pay for admission. Yeah Oh my god. Okay. Okay, bin. No, okay. Okay.  Oh, and here's a quick thought Yeah, both ben and munchy can make competing rides at the slime water park And of course whoever makes the better ride will get the more money because they get paid for the experience Oh my god, like right like we're like tycoons. Like we like this business. We're like your rollers coaster tycoons in real life And it'll be a race to see who can make more rides and like who can make more like designs for rides Like more like running like running this water park racket in the background We're just like making slime hand over fists. You know how there's like like like in normal amusement park There's always like, okay. Who can make the biggest roller coaster begin like who has like the biggest wall of text describing this person's experience with the roller coaster All right, and this war has infinite growth potential. There we go Straight from the mines to the water parks to the tycoons.  These are the questions. Let's let's shift over to say We want to make any final points on jobs jobs suck. I hate them That's fair, correct. Sam I am post jobs me and my me and my fellow 2000 millennial children are all post job hashtag post job. Are you indigo children?   So hooray Yeah Uh, well, there you go. All right, let's let's get some questions jobs are gay Question time Uh, here we go. Here we go. Uh, here is is is a pity question over on the twitter. Hashtag Sbcp follow us at tbcrasnators.  Why are why not? No, anybody does anybody know because I'm a charity at this point I I don't get to charities simply because I don't have the money to I don't think I don't think Charities are like evil or anything.  Well, well, I don't I don't really I'm sure nate's gonna throw some weird utilitarianism, but no, I would donate to charity if I had the money to do so So as long as I believe in the cause Yeah, I don't have enough money. That's an excuse like if you did have the money You would is what munchie and tom are saying. I don't really trust charities But it's it's not even in the equate.   I think of charities as sort of like a modern day What was it like catholic church, uh, where you just give the catholic church money in order to get into heaven for free I think of charities are basically like well, even if the money Socially that's what they are Even if the money didn't actually go to a good cause I intended for it to be a good cause therefore It's a good thing to do I'll tell you what if I had lots of money like millions of dollars Billion if I had fucking you know notch money I would be like notch, but way stronger like I would just Pay people to do art all the time strong Like I would nobody's stronger than not if I have billion dollars I would go on youtube look at all the people who obviously want to have full-time jobs Doing your videos and I'd be like yo Close your patreon That has a sad like seven dollars a month on it. I will pay you a full-time wage to make this on a contract basis, right?   It doesn't just take all his money.   Uh probably it's like that that's that's what my point like, okay when I think about like Like yeah, exactly as you were saying devout There's like people out there who just aren't making enough money doing what they want to do And you know, I have a little bit of conflicting feelings because I think to myself like, okay I value what this person's doing But if they're so unpopular that like they haven't been able to like capitalize on this and like make it a successful business Like I know not everyone's a great businessman But like will this even succeed long term if I subsidize it so there's like concerns about that It's not about trying to push stuff out the boat that is going to be successful. It's about me wanting certain art to exist Um, okay, sure.  Like so basically he spends his money on very specific things that can very specifically help people in specific ways Like when um, james ralf recently like a couple years back did a charity where he was auctioning off some old AVG and set pieces or like scripts and the money was going to charity But it was very specifically going to the hospital this like this like specialty hospital that like saved his daughter's life Right.  Because they're very specific people who I actually know right Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So that that's why I think about why I think it's bad to like not bad But I think it's misguided to think that if you have money you must give to charity because yes You could have a million times more money than someone else But we all only have 24 hours in the day And doing good takes time not money.  He's doing good work over here with all his money I don't know if I necessarily agree with the sense of mentality of we just have to like put all of our resources into Like like the rich and powerful and and genius. Well I mean in this particular case, it's an argument to like take elan's money to give to like poor people Which of course I am not in favor of But yeah, I Again, it comes down to the individual decision of just I like Poor black kids in chicago Let me give them money if I like everybody I just choose to if there was infinite money and infinite resources, of course We'd want everybody to have it. Uh, it's just a matter. It's a matter of you know distribution Um, I don't I don't think it like like like I don't think it needs to be a matter of Moral ambiguity to just do to just give money to who you want to give money to When and if You choose to do I I disagree I mean to certain degrees because like if I give so much well just like there can be cases Where like if I give so much money that I personally Let's just say I give so much money that I starve to death because I can't buy money for myself Just as an edge case, obviously that is that is not ideal. You don't want to go that far That's too much even if the people they were giving money to Survive only because you gave money and maybe more people survive than you die The question is what will they do with their lives? We have to make these calculations now because we're dealing with these sort of Like that's that's what we're talking about. We're we're trafficking in direct human life at this point Human trafficking and what they'll do with their lives is I'm a human trafficker Is that they will be happy? Uh, correct, correct, but uh, and and that's what people want is for other people I have now completely forgotten and just now remember this is a question This isn't just a continuation of the topic Yeah, it's just do any of you give to charities. Why why not? I'll make one last point in favor of munchie basically in this point Which is just like if I could for if you think about for example Like in the middle in the middle ages like there were probably like super genius kids born to just like dirt poor surf families And like they obviously had like no opportunity to like succeed and we're just like trampled and you know died never getting a chance to succeed I want all those people to have an opportunity to succeed across the world So like yeah, we're where charity where charity can do those sorts of things I absolutely want it to do so though. I don't believe in like extracting money from people if they don't choose I don't What when this when this person said like would you give charity? I I don't like believe in like really like huge big charities or anything I just want to like analyze like just giving two things that I feel deserve Money and slash or attention. Yeah, I don't have any particular like uh standards Or or or beliefs like that I want to give to that I can like think of right now You know, I'm saying like like there's no charity that I that I am like itching to give money to I'm just saying like like the idea of giving money to other people does not repulse me It doesn't repulse me either. It just depends on the like sometimes it does repulse me other times. It doesn't you know Yeah, sometimes repulses me too. Yeah, there you go. There you go Anyone else want to go away on this no Tom would you give Tommy is the charity case, right? I forgot I've been Ben What do you think just real quick? If I had like more money than I knew what to do with then maybe but like I'd have to be really I'd have to like really know like what the money was going to Yeah, like I would just have to be thoroughly convinced that the money was actually making a real difference and not You know, that's it makes sense to me Uh, one other Twitter question here from at Doombox to favorite anime. Okay, moving on we're going to be uh To the piece into the patreon lounge questions over here This is why we have bad comments is because you read them aloud and they think they're really funny That one is funny. It was a joke comment.  All right. We've had that joke. Oh like four I like it every time All right, here's an actual good question Actually, good question here discount gumshoe asks this is a great question for this topic I told everybody that we're doing the jobs topic. Uh, okay Will the chad artist or just you know, or will the artist ever be free of the you don't work hard meme that the virgin wage Cucks have forced upon us.   I'm an artist, you know, I do commissions and they're like, oh What about a real job though? What's your?  Like I think that's kind of reasonable Look, I don't think what the work of an artist and the work of a wage cook is even comfortable Okay, virgin wage cucks They they are of the opinion that work is supposed to be like grueling and hard and bad The word work has negative connotation to them because they are virgin wage cuck bitches.   They're just doing work that they enjoy and and that doesn't make them feel bad Yeah, man. Yeah, man. I like I don't see Like virgin wage cuck comments in my preview much like let's just face Plenty of artists are pretty damn lazy. A lot of people don't realize how I think the real issue here is discrimination Like artists being called inherently like not working hard by some subset of people in my experience might be really skewed or wrong But I just see that if you are obviously working really fucking hard It's gonna show and people are gonna not say that shit, right?  It's like how oh, sorry, my bow.  I feel like that's just that's in the mix here somewhere. You know what I mean That's like me and me and divu me and divu staged one, right?  Yeah, I just sat on it and didn't post it for months and I don't know why Yeah, so it was a perfect example of lazy lazy artists ladies and gentlemen. There they are All artists don't work You see I can feel why why munchy would would be so strident fighting back against this Because we all know how hard a worker munchy is and the crazy stuff. He's always cooking up Uh, I could I feel the same way, you know, like the content that I make is is generally very high effort I'm currently fighting against that. But what was that not sarcasm? Just now I was sincere just now. Whoa What do you mean?  It's really no like because there's this kind of There's this kind of like competition between the two Yeah, because people associate work with like bad unfun stuff as long as that exists, right? There will be this tension here, but you individually can absolutely rise above it by working hard to prove it reputation Deriding those who are stuck in entry-level jobs as being underachievers who coast on minimal You know clock in your nine to five every day and then go home and do nothing, right? So I think though.  Yeah. Yeah.  You just tell other people to do work. Why are you getting paid so much money? That one kills me.  They just don't understand what managers actually do Uh, and some are lazy. Yeah, you know what? Oh, you know what this is actually kind of relevant to this in general because like I think of a lot of the reason people think art is just easy and they assume they're lazy It's because they don't know how hard artists can actually work because they don't understand the process Yeah, it's that idea that like artists are just talented, you know, they just have an innate ability That's true. And just for my realm of experience like when you post a video Bam the video just for the viewer. It didn't exist now Magically it exists, but they don't see the months of work and the editing and the recording and you know all that shit That that that's one of the things mean mean bin starting to compact your efforts cop killers But but we're trying out streaming And that's like the main thing that I think like like we're trying to see if we want to do that full time And it's looking pretty great. And like I think it's well suited to our long-form content But the satisfaction that the reference capitalist fans get from just waking up on some random day And you are just blessed out of the blue By buy a reference cop killers video by six seven hours long Yeah, yeah, but just it spawns out of nowhere. It's great. It's a great feeling. It's a great feeling I think that's a large part of why youtube is so Fun You know, it's just fun to be subscribed to a huge video drop everybody loves it plays off that like slot machine mentality Where it's just like I wonder if it's gonna be something to be here today.  Yeah, youtube subscriptions are loot boxes. Confirm we need to ban online gambling Such as subscribing to anyone on youtube. It's a gamble and we can't allow it. We need harsh regulations That that's why there's such a little Amish population It like demographics on youtube is because it's a form of gambling and they can't do it. That's the reason All right, two more points before we go on the next question. Okay. First of all, uh, just really quick here unrelated Uh, I just realized the other day that we actually passed the two-year anniversary of reverse cop killers on uh, April 11th So yeah, wow Davoo was on that first one. So right. Yeah, dude. The pcp is also passed. Are you not aware? I guess today was homestuck day Yeah, it was right. I know right. I wish I hadn't been so sick.  You were stuck at home and I was so upset You know, I was going to make armish people fan art because I don't want to disrespect homestuck by just like not even Know that it was there. All right, but the real thing that actually is is related to this is the one like like Like the biggest Influence or the biggest positive influence the pcp has had my life Uh, that's completely changed the way I perceive something Was the insistence and and and me realizing that work is and should be good Yes, correct.    I guess I don't need my side job I really can do this full time because you never know if the what matters is to just be working towards it Things that you want to do that aren't economically viable. That's probably a hobby and hobbies are cool. Yeah, so there you go That's true. The ladies love hobbies guys Yeah, ladies love doing it and what it takes is working a job to make it possible Then you know you got to do that You know what I'll say though about this, but if it's what you want then it should be worth it I I said before that a lot of this is motivated by my deep sexual insecurities as a man And I feel like that really did motivate me in in one sense here that was like I once heard advice Uh in my in my old days of researching like how to be attractive and how to be cool and stuff And I I read a thing that just like women just love men with passion And like it's you got two choices one make your full-time job your passion So that you're excited to go there every day and you have something to talk about to like the ladies or whatever So that you you are full of interesting and exciting things that like a woman would want to be a part of There's that option or if it's not your full-time job And if you don't like your full-time job, then you've got to make yourself like your hobby Your your purpose in life. You've got to have something in you that's burning inside as like a desire to reach And yeah, so that you have things to share with people That's what it's all about man and and having that inside me both motivated me to like improve my life So I would like be able you know, just like all the normal stuff of like wanting the things I want having You know control over my life and that and then also it tied into my you know Wanting to like be attractive to women and stuff.      Yeah when I was 15 I realized oh, I should just like not care about like trying to impress girls And I will just make myself impressed with myself And yeah, basically ever since then it's been pretty easy.  Yeah, you gotta do it. We should really have We should really have an entire episode about relationship So so so we can get into this but I much more fall in line with the devout will just improve yourself And obviously people who like the improved you which is to say the you that you want and should be We'll just naturally gravitate towards you. Yeah. I mean I totally yeah That's that's the that's the basic logic find it We've been going for almost three hours. Yeah Question we gotta start we gotta start rapping I've been like the last hour we've been talking about getting hype and doing your work I've been looking at this file that I started before the podcast.  You know what I totally feel I totally feel for that sake. Let's let's just get a question or two We'll bang them out real fast Here's one that I well that I want to answer By one spar bleakly and in the patreon lounge since shitty questions is a big pcp meme now Will there be questioners rules episode? Uh on the podcast Like like commenter and reviewer rules I think that would be funny and possibly a decent topic. I could see doing it I what I would want to do is I want I would want to like replace the question section of an episode with Questioner rules so we can have like a dual topic kind of because because I don't know if we have enough to say That will fill like an entire episode, but I don't know about that Okay, okay to like to like address how bad the questions are. I think we could do that. I'm in favor of doing that I think that would be cool I think that would be such a boner killer to have a whole episode on like questioner rules And then have to take the shitty questions after laying it all out But they be perfect perfect examples of what what how to do it wrong Which I'm sure it will be without a kid without a dad Um All right. Well, you know what? This is okay. This is an interesting question grace.  How can you really stand out fancy your resume formatting interview tips? So, okay, well, if we're the ones to be asking about this Yeah, I like there's a million things you could say about this I just I thought this was a heartfelt question that this person's looking for for information on a little help So just I don't know my my thoughts on this are damn. You already got a master's and you're struggling to get a job Okay, here's my here's my real question. Okay, like what's the master's in? I assume there's not a lot of demand for it. I mean, I suppose you could be shit and you could be like bad That's entirely possible Okay, like there's no cheat to like one one weird old tip to like stand out or anything I would say what what people want is just competency That at the at the end of the day, they're going to take whoever looks like their best at the job So like how do you demonstrate that? Here's what I would do I don't know what your feel is for me Like one thing that really impressed people when I was applying for programming jobs was the work I did on my own outside work just the side programming stuff I had going on So, I don't know.  We're just we're beating around the edges. The core issue is have be able to tell them Why you're great and how you're perfect for this and all that shit Like you want them to believe that you're worth the job Do you believe that you're worth the job? Yeah Yeah You gotta you gotta impress him uh a little peacocking in terms of what you can do does not hurt peacocking never hurt Never hurt anybody. That's right K step in the questions bar asked thoughts on the tigwateig doc. We were actually playing on doing I thought we should do that as the topic today. Nobody wanted to do it because they didn't want to get into the weeds of the drama I didn't even want to talk about the drama. I just thought it would be cool to talk about it Well, okay tigwateig Bringing it up is inherently linked because it's popular right now. It's a popular talk about right now because of the drama. I mean No, no, I just figured it out. Here's how we can do an episode about it. The episode will be called internet content creator group incompetence Or maybe somebody shorter that way we can compare and contrast our own competence or lack thereof to tigwateig Because there's a lot of times we're thinking man. We sure are a lot less Disagreement Here's my I mean there are many differences and I guess there's some similarities But like right out of the gate here here are my thoughts on the tigwateig doc k step I have not read it and I am not a lawyer. I have I don't trust anyone who just says I had x experience. I demand evidence before I think anything about anyone and to do otherwise Anyone in the world is immoral So I hope that like everyone we could what are you supposed to say right now? Like oh, they're all bad because a lot of people said they were bad Is that true? Where's the proof like were the police involved? Like there was like sexual allegations Is any of that substantiated?  I have no grounds to make any assessment whatsoever And frankly it pisses me off that people just take the word of people when they just assert things without evidence agreed No, Nate to me, dude, don't you think it's fucked up that like we were Like this culture now is just like an allegation can tank an entire business That's the problem. That's the problem But and I read some of that stuff most of it is people being awkward and just not communicating clearly Like some people have sexual crime allegations literally go to the cops and tell them everything and work it out It's not the court of public opinions job to judge if you were like abused at your job It's your job to figure it out. Yeah. Yeah, why am I involved? I don't care at all about the um The issue of like whether or not they should like it should be sued or some shit like that or defamation Like what is tig would take actually tanking right now as a result is channel awesome Like actually like financially. I I believe that as a note like basically none of their fans gave a shit and that it didn't matter Right exactly for me.  But for me what I take away from it is it's an interesting case study in incompetence and hubris Basically, imagine if you listening at home, have you read it to have you read? I skimmed a shitload of it and I read all of Lindsay Ellis's part because she's the one good writer in the group So, okay, so be aware. That's what we're working with. That's the information And I only have a second hand reports being referred to by devu now. Okay, not only have I skimmed most of it And a lot of it was the same complaints listed over and over again So I saw the gist of it. Yeah, but also I am the one in this group who's seen the most tigwateg with like hippo at a close second I believe right so I do have a lot of understanding of this group I've been I mean I've started following them like 10 goddamn years ago, right?   Right, like oh, I read that so that's so Retarded that like this is like the major issue. They didn't even give us food or water on the set This is the big issue. This is what you've got. This is the damning evidence. Oh my god.   No, I think it's absolutely appropriate I'm not mad what takes fans don't care and they continue to watch the videos. Yes I don't think okay. It does sound like mike mccod might be kind of a bad person dug and robber Just sort of like oh, why would he be a bad person?  You don't get to say that right where you're fired, right?  I don't even agree with that.     I'm just focusing on the stuff that I'm biased toward That's exactly why no one should listen to me either. No one should care to anyone on this issue But I'm sorry, please go on. Hey, I actually like kind of have to go So like if we don't wrap up soon, I'm gonna have to leave The thing is the reason why these people were kicked around is that they're all talentless fucks Like almost all up to you take is just non entities, right?  So like they didn't really have any power They didn't have the ability to like strike out and do their own thing They were completely leaching off of Doug's popularity.  It was just an embarrassing situation.   I believe all of that.   Yeah I love this fiery Nate, but we should leave now Escape my right before I turn it against you.    It's always been a total Was right divu wins divu wins this episode. All right wins. I'm satisfied so divu wins All right, I think we're done everybody.   We stuff. It's great. Uh, beyond that We pledge five dollars. You get all the bonus episodes munchie. What was the last bonus episode? The bonus episode that we last recorded was rad con three. Yeah, that's the one. That's the one Yeah, rad con three Explain in depth it may have been a step by step process I think we I think what we should be have done is put the bonus episode clip at the beginning of this episode But I don't know. I'll figure it out later. Uh, that's it.  Yeah, it's it's not anywhere close to done I've released any of my stuff ben. What the hell is going on the ball, but it'll come it's coming Okay, all right.  Oh my god now I'm cooming just thinking of it. I know Uh, what else we got? And I'm a nevrigerus copulas and I've already put out those two vlogs yet.  There's big stuff still on the horizon here and uh, it's gonna be great It's gonna be great.  I'm on the case. You'll get it pretty soon Uh, all right. I think that's it.