Good morning to you! Thank you so much for being a part of Y in the morning. Welcome back. We are streaming live on our website that is at www.kabc.co.ge and by Y254. The is Y in the morning and you are just enough of the next conversation of the day. It is all about politics and today, when we are talking about politics, we shall handle a few issues that I have been trending the past few days. isyo maqamu aqaia uo na uwo mwa dunu umadal niki mwae. Imezi wa kwa bata nitu supele mpa jybari hundi galari msa mna umadal niki mwae T shop slowly mga mga mga mwae kwa mwae yuwa kwa ako mvae To help us in this particular conversation. I am with Ndwati Devi to my extreme right. He is the National Chairperson of the Youth Nation, Kenya. Kairu Sanandwati. Thank you. You're welcome. Looking sharp. As always. I love the logo there. The branding. It is a way to communicate our seriousness in this issue. Yeah. And of course, thank you so much for joining me today. And next to me, I am with Charles Tabu. He is the Chairman of Bunga La Wazalendo. Kairu Sanand Charles. Thank you. Kwa Sanandwati ya? Very well. Na shukurusana. Ready to go. Wazalendo, nasiwa ni ni? They are very fine. They are very fine. I know it's been a while since the last host of you. Exactly. I don't know how many years. All is well. Everything at is done in time. Yeah. Exactly. Engage with us. That's why it's one in the morning. At Ramaguko and at Y254 Channel. Before we touch on politics, gentlemen, love is in the air. There's a heart here. What do you think about Valentine's? Do you celebrate it? Do you have any plans? I have plans. Are you under any pressure to deliver? I read the Bible this morning about Valentine and I was reminded by the good book in the book of Numbers 2 and 14. Okay. It says that in the second month of the year, the fortieth day, they took the house. Someone give me that. Valentine's is in the Bible. It is in the Bible. The command is there. Valentine's is in the Bible. You're supposed to take a leaf and bread and herbs. Which one? Numbers what? Numbers 2 and 14. 2 and 14. Was 14. Yes. Valentine is there. Somebody check it out for me. So don't be under any pressure that Valentine brings a lot of, you know. You do things you did not plan for. But most so it's important to have Valentine always in your heart. Love people in regardless of the day. Be there for them regardless of the events happening in the life. It's not just about the flowers. It's about our hearts. We need to have hearts that also go out to people. So yes, Valentine is in the Bible. 2 and 14. Check it out. Numbers. It is in numbers. Or just Google these words. In the second month, the fortieth day in numbers. You'll see it. Valentine, how are you? How are you doing? Was there a problem with your office? Yes, we are just working like any other normal day. Everything has its own time. Valentine comes once in a blue moon. And it is a time for remembering one another to show love. And that love should be always in practice of humanity. So being classified as a Valentine's Day on 14th of February. That's normal. And we should go with it. And we should embrace others. Thank you. Numbers chapter 9 verses 11. Yes, you've seen it. I've Google something here. Yes. The second month of the year. The fortieth day. Numbers 9 11. The fortieth day of the second month. At even they shall keep it. And eat it with unleavened bread and bitter herbs. Yes. Yes. We shall take bitter herbs. That's why I'm focusing. And unleavened bread. So mama we are chocolates. That is the spirit of the fortieth day of the second month. Bitter herbs. Yes bitter herbs. And unleavened bread. So we should go by Valentine's gift on William Boga. No. No. Alovera. Alovera. Alovera. What is the name of this man? It's good of pressure. It's good of pressure. Gentlemen it's a pleasure having you guys today. And of course I would like us to kickstart this conversation on the issue that is taking center stage today. And of course this I know has been a conversation that is a conversation that will not end today. We have an issue concerning the Waipa Lida Kalozo Musyoka. Who is the prospects of Waipa Lida Kalozo Musyoka joining the Azimuila Umoja movement has been rocked by bribery claims. And it is because of this that we have a governor from Ukambani region claiming that he is demanding billions of Kenyan shillings from him to join Azimuila. So with Kalozo remaining non-committal despite recent claims a deal was in the offering. Governor Alfer Mutua of Machakos Charitingilu of Kituwi and Kivuta Kibwana of Makweni starred the Honest Nest at the weekend saying that they were aware of secret financial demands issued before consideration to back Raila Odinga again for presidency in the coming election. So the Kumbani governors are accusing Kalozo of giving too many conditions before joining Raila's coalition. Let's talk about that first. What do you think about that? First we must understand we are in political dispensation as a nation and politics is about interest. When I hear of such sentiments what I want to think because I cannot verify is that probably Kalozo has been backing Raila for a long time politically and he feels that a time is coming that also for him to get to the next level. You know leadership and especially in Africa is not a Kenyan issue in Africa and all over the world is a very when it comes to campaigns and especially elective polls for presidential is very expensive. So probably if I was to look to say that I am interpreting as a layman I will see that Kalozo will be saying okay fine I'm willing to support but of course over the years I've put a lot of resources so probably he wants a bonus for the resources that he has dispensed in the past. But we cannot say or we cannot just settle on the allegation because around this time it's politics everyone can say anything. We've never had such an opportunity where politicians are allowed and permitted to either by ways of convincing or confusing. So it's out there and if it indeed was true probably he will be also looking at himself what's in for him in the future. And especially after the elections you know when you support somebody then it means that you set aside your interest politically but economically you can never set aside your interest that is one thing. So what do you think about that and of course I'd like to quote Senator Mutula Kilonzo who is a Makwini senator he said that of course he also stands in as the Waipa vice chair. He said that they were not in a hurry to join Azimio and he termed it as amorphous and I quote we are not keen to be dragged into Azimio for now we do not want to find ourselves in the same situation as NASA. Thank you, thank you. Okay fine, from our own view and also our data collection that we have made as bungalow as Zalendo. We have seen that on the ground per se even that side of Kalonzo most of the supporters are for Azimio direction. So only that our leaders are selfish in a way they are not fighting for the interest of the nation they are fighting for their personal interest hiding behind the common monange. If you look at the way we are going right now let us go back to 2007 election you will find that this is the direction we are going. The leaders by that time they used to talk so that they can face Kibaki by that time Kibaki was Israela. It is just like now the way we are seeing it. If you study the 2007 election and how it happened it is now coming to be similar to that. Where by some leaders are trying to take the other direction for bargaining the allegation of the billions request. I cannot confirm that and I don't want you to talk about that because in politics there is a lot of propaganda and this propaganda is another way of penetration. I know very well the brigade of Kalonzo as much as they talk the people themselves Kenyans themselves who have the heart of the change of this nation because we are looking the leadership integrity here. They are saying they are two horses yes and we know very well Azimio has come up with a structure a very good structure. And if you look at their policies they are coming up to transform this country with. There are some people who are talking and they have been in power and they have not transformed the country in a better way. More so they have made us to have so many debts. What we need to do as Kenyans it is high time now we make decision ourselves individually the voters not the leaders to make us have a direction. Let us make a direction that we know my vote will protect me. I should not but gain with my vote neither should I sell my vote. I am looking at what Honorable Ngilu said during this weekend. He was saying that Honorable Kalonzo Musioka is keeping the people from their region the campers of course hostages and she would allow them to go and support Honorable Raela Odinga in Azimio. And of course this is the conversation especially even touching on the youth because the youth now if this is the case are they kept hostage. Are they being withheld from supporting the person they want to support whether it is Azimio or any other. Aguco you have just explained what I have started with. I said from our finding on the ground the common man inchu is the voter their interest is to vote Azimio. So what Ngilu is saying is true. Is true and that I concur with her because that is what our finding also is there. They are focusing on Azimio it is only there the Kalonzo factor is coming out out of Azimio. So he want to be lured to Azimio but the entire Kamba community they are seeing the vision is in Azimio. I would like to quote Governor Ngilu we said honestly if there is a person within our community who is still waiting for something so that he joins Azimio is not fair at all. And if he wants money let him come to the community and we shall fundraise and give him so that he can release our people because we need to go. Let him stop asking for money forthwith even though we have poverty in our community we still have some pride. First of all we need to understand that this election for 2022 is a different kind of election. First of all the game changing here is about the strategies is about the vision for the nation beyond jubilee administration. When I look at the conversations that are happening like what was happening in Mazawani regarding the Waipa Party because that's now quite political. It is my call to these party leaders and the political leaders first of all to put aside their personal interest because what is coming out clearly is that there are certain personal interest that are making some people to feel like they are already stuck in a situation where us is not about the community is about the individual. But now there is a larger community here. This community is the Kenyan community. That community is represented by majority of the young people. Let us have an understanding that the current statistics of the voters, registered voters. 54% of the registered voters are between 18 years and 35 years. That is quite a number considering these a block of about 7.5 million voters. And that is not to even talk about those who are above 35 years who are around again is a serious representation of about 39% of around 11 million people. Majority of these people are youthful. When you talk about youth, you're talking about 18 to 35. But youthfulness is about 35 again to 60. You understand and in Kenya we hear young people are 50. These demographics now has brought so many debates as to what age can represent what age. Very, very true. But to just cut it loose. It is very, very important for us as young people again to also have our own say. The problem is when we allow the political leaders to speak on our behalf, then when they have their own personal situations and personal requirements, we get mixed up in all that conversation. The truth of the matter is as young people in this country, we need serious reforms, we need economic empowerment reforms and these reforms cannot be done if we don't have a reset of our mind. Now let's talk about that particular area that you're mentioning, the reforms. Because among the resolutions endorsed by the professionals and the business community, the focus supporting the Azimiyo presidential candidate included, of course the Honda Borrelo diga, include a commitment to engage Rwaila in tailoring communities, economic blueprint and inclusion of the Kamba community in government through an MOU to be signed. And according to a statement, of course part of the resolution is, we need to end the politics of negative competition and grandstanding among the leaders of the region and embrace teamwork and unity of purpose in the Kamba community in national agenda and politics at national level. Now the national agenda, because everybody has their own voice and manifesto, which way for the youth when it comes to the national agenda, where do we put our weight on as youths and what exactly should be our priority? Let me finish then I come with you. That's a very good observation over there. The first thing that we need to do as a nation and as young people is to appreciate that a lot has been done to build and to set the infrastructure towards economic growth. But now when we look at the next government dispensation and looking at the next government administrator to the presidency, the biggest infrastructure that is remain unattended is the youth infrastructure. Because when we have 7.5 million young voters between 18 years and 35 years and have 5 million of them in CRB, then we are not in the right path. And we have that block of young people, young potential in CRB fast and they represent a serious voter representation. So what does that mean? It means that whoever is looking at taking leadership at the end of the day must invent and reset the economic model that favors the young people. Because you cannot have young people who are against tax and change in CRB and expect again that when you are taking the leadership as a leader of a nation to have this kind of dependency on young people who cannot come out of when you are listed under CRB, your credit rate goes down to 40%. And this is a fact because I am in the youth docket. When you are on CRB, you lose and waste a lot of 7 years of your potential. So if you are 25, then you recovered 32. If you are 30, then by the time you are being elected. You are saying even 50. So we are looking at who is talking our language. Our language is this, we have young graduates who are jobless. We have millions of young people listed. What is the plan first? First of all, we need to get them out of that situation. Okay, thank you. You see, when you talk about the youth, first of all, the youth should recognize themselves. They should not think that people will speak for them. I can remember when I was a youth man, during our time in 97, from that 97 to 2000, the year 2002 election, we came up with a pressure group and we put a policy paper for ourselves from 2007. And I am telling you, we are the people who brought the ministry of youth. Then from that level, we went further to push 2002. And in 2002, we were not just a matter of discussing that the youth are the majority or what. No, we have to come up with a pressure group and debate on the table. We are learned years. We have all the power to do what you want to do. So in 2002 election, we were told to start companies and what have you. That is what the leaders told us to do. We started those companies. But you know the greed of the nation and our leaders. We were not given any contracts, neither tender. So if you talk about job opportunities, these leaders are resigning from the ministry. Leaving the jobs to come to politics, to vote.  You vote this year jobless.  It seems that you are not using your common sense well. You also need to fight for your vote to get a space. As a youth, we need to have what we call civic education. Because the civic education is what will create that awareness. Information on the grassroot level. So that this kind of the structure and 7 million registered voters of the youths you are talking about. You can start from the grassroot. Let's say that you bargain all the MCAs to be the youths. You must also zone yourselves. I am getting it. If you see the government is frustrating youths in terms of civic education. We have been trying to advocate. And we have been also under pressure. Because the same youth you are trying to create some awareness on them. They are the same youth being used to come and destroy. You should unite as youths. Even though me now I am not a youth. By that time we used to unite and push our agenda. And you can see by that 2002 there were some youths elected and there are some youths given some positions. When I look at the national agenda. We have the national agenda that is a conversation right now. But the question is the youth getting involved in this particular agenda. The sustainability of these particular promises that we are getting. The financial implications that are there. The economic state of the country. We are considering all this because it is like some form of Gideri. It is a cobweb of ideas and a cobweb of issues. What is the role of the youth when it comes to shaping this nation and shaping the national agenda? And where should our focus be on? Because at the end of the day there are so many things that need to be handled. Yet we cannot handle all of them at the same time. I think if I can focus on the issue. Particularly we cannot say that. I know people are focusing that the youth don't have finance. But in fact the youth should come with a pressure group. You see the big politicians. They are coming with their political parties on the table to bargain. Even the youth should come with their own party. So that they bargain with their party. You should not just come and support others. You will never be recognized. You have to come with your party. And sensitize the youths about their party. And that in their party they will bargain with. Because all the promises we have been given so many promises. Right from 2002, 2007. All our promises. But they are not guaranteed to be done. So the only thing that can help even the youths of this nation. First of all they should identify who can we ally with. And what transformation has he done to this nation. They are talking about the freedom that we have. The constitution. The access to information at Kukat 5 of the Kenya constitution. Who brought it? Who brought the issue of devolution that has at least brought the resources to the ground. We are seeing some things happening. Like Bakweni county. Kitui county. Now we are seeing some changes in other county. We cannot judge all governors that have failed. There are few who have done good. Some have failed. But we cannot talk on that. We look at who brought such kind of changes. That is the person also people should focus on. If he can do this then we can ally with him. Then we push the pressure again to get more goodies. Still the question same. The same question that Avast goes to you. What is your response on that? The first thing that we must appreciate and understand. You can never be gained in life from a place of disadvantage. That is the biggest problem. When you see people bringing demands on the table to their advantage. Now the first thing that you need to discuss and this is my personal and my policy view is the young people are disadvantaged. That's the number one. The kind of young people that we have in this nation as we speak are first of all an economically disempowered. Now we have to think fast. When we are looking at politics we are looking about policies. It's about legislation. What kind of legislations are we looking at? I have been there to push for even the consolidation of the Affamatic Fund, the Youth Fund, the Universal Fund, the Women Enterprise Fund, the Sports and Digital Fund under one basket so that this fund can become more accessible and also can become more effective. But now the problem is this. As we are doing that we have a lot of young people who are saying even if we are to work in a particular direction what happens to the kind of injustice that we are facing economically and those injustices that we are facing are on this point. The young people are accessible to consumer loans. These mobile apps they came to just lower the young people. The betting apps they are just there to make money from the young people and what happens after they make bad choices? They get listed. First of all we need to think critically as we go to the next election what happens to these 5.3 million young people who are listed for 500 chilings. During the time of BBI we saw a lot of political persuasions and giftings. Less than 5,000 people, 5,000,000 years were given car grants for 4.5 billion. 5 million young people. You reminded us of what happened last year. Yes, that was last year. 5 million young people are in Sierra Bia, who is with the CEO because of 4.2 billion. 4.2 billion for 5.3 million young people. So we need to take serious the whole conversation. When you get back to the politics again, the clearance of you to run for office for those who will be running for legislative office above NCA for a fact you need your help clearance you need your CRP you need a lot of concussion of things.  Which pressure? We have to talk from a place of economic empowerment. A young person has no problem who the president becomes. As long as I am able to cater for myself as long as I am a graduate who is able to get an opportunity not employment if we create such an environment for the young people then this country is going to the right direction That's why the basis of the youth nation is to conduct civic engagements and participation. There is an event that took place a few days ago and the president was attending this particular event when he was speaking on the 12th of February at a particular event where we had more than 3,000 youths that were in attendance. I don't know if you were there and the president spoke to the youth and I would like to quote what he said in this particular reason and I quote you must ensure you are fully involved in the political process it is the only way to guarantee opportunities and space to drive your agenda in the next administration. And I think from just the same statement you can remember what I have said about the what do you have as a political party to bring on the table and bring your bargain and I want to correct you my friend the youths must be concerned by the person becoming the president of this nation if you put the head of state to be somebody who has no idea nor that interest of the youths or formulation of the policies that you are talking about I have been participating in parliamentary bills and we find that public participation is too low and these are the areas youths should be created, the awareness of the youths should be there so that they should know what bills are coming up even after they make this announcements on gazettes on newspapers about public participation they don't turn up that's what I'm telling you we need to have first of all civic education then the youths also should understand that power is not given power is taken but the problem of the youth is that there are so many things that they are focusing on so much so that they just say wherever becomes president and that's why they are getting lost they are short focused they like what they can get today issue is not money I can remember people like Tom Boyer they used to work very hard they used to struggle for this nation but they didn't have money per se if you look at the politics of money versus the issue of focusing the leadership the leadership will come with your struggle because you have to come out and speak for yourself and as youths you have time you have energy in fact the youths of today are learned than even some of the leaders here but you see the problem with the youths is one they are waiting to be given women are fighting for their direction they have their lobby groups here and there have you had any lobby group of youths? youths I know that they have political party leadership the only thing is that they should come out vibrantly with the energy they have we have youth leagues exactly those are just we call them in itisweli vugu vugu zaki siya lakini hafizi fikishi manenu umbele what I want to see with the youths what I'm trying to advocate for the youths per se from the level I left because ours we were so vibrant and wherever we were we must be had but here is the situation whereby you want just to debate no you cannot get it through debates you have to go even during the time of the past years you see when things are bad it comes to the street mobilize the people to put pressure to the government then he has to come to the table with the government to say oh what can we do around even yesterday during the gubernatorial campaign declaration by Radis Wanga in Homa Bay Homa Bay sorry those were there I could see I can even say 100% youths say that's true and I appreciate your sentence the thing is this there is a way of engaging depending on the times the what you guys are fighting for and the organization you are making under pressure groups what quite organized that's one thing I appreciate 90s and 2000 it was different as opposed to now the kind of pressure group if you talk about pressure group to me as a youth leader and I call for that then I'm calling for goods why? because when you are putting pressure you must observe just like physics on whose side are you putting weight now here at the event on Friday the president made a good call he said we need a package we need to organize ourselves so that even the government understands our political intentions in this election now when you look at that kind of conversation it means that you need to understand your challenge and come with a solution to partner for a suitable word participation now one of the key things that we have in this dispensation we are in the dot com millennia dispensation that's a different one that's why if you call for people to go out here nowadays even after the handshake no one has come out but now you see it's quite clear that the issue and of course this has been made so many different people the issue is not about the policy you don't have a constitutional issue there are some leaders who say it's about a leadership issue they say it's a leadership issue so we are not implementing what we have and therefore when you say that we do not really need to consider who the president is doesn't that affect the implementation part of the constitutional that we are trying to fight for let me rephrase so that I don't get misquoted or out of content my philosophy is going forward as a nation when young people are adequately empowered when they are now they are not when they are adequately empowered then it becomes of no interest as much because anyone can become a president but of course only that who can sustain the empowerment but doesn't the presidency affect economical empowerment it does for now it is not for my friend let me inject something before you see when you talk about the presidency is the head of the state and all the resources he has the power of all the resources of the nation and as in reflection to the youths you must know who is going to be the president what kind of qualities of leadership and transformative aspect of leadership does he have the youth themselves have issues that they are struggling within the ground on the ground how do you expect them to focus on the things above yet the things I was talking about the civic education because they don't know what they want they are more vocal listen to me my friend let me finish and then I come back to you let me enlight ourselves as youth nation we have a representation of young people across all political divide that's the truth we have representation of all young people from all political divide that's why we are youth nation that to me means I am able to accommodate the opinions of a young leader or a youth who has a different mindset the only thing that I get concerned is the outcome of the decision of that kind of of a mindset now when we come back to who becomes the leader I think personally I have the conviction of who is going to become leader of this great republic I know when the next time comes I will speak of that but now to come back to the real issues when we discuss about young people not knowing what they want we know what we want the only thing is the opportunity is not given to us that's the truth and that is a call that we have to keep on fighting I try to I am trying to bring things clear here because there is nothing we are going to be given first of all you must sit down and have an agenda and in that agenda you cannot be spread to each and every party each and every party have different ideology so if you say that those who are saying bottom up they are saying I don't know Kenya, Kwanzaa, Kenya what so means slogans very very kani especially the old gods in politics and don't think that even them by the time they were youth look at the time of youth they were not given any space with the old constitution what do you mean they were not given any space they were not given any space they had to struggle youths who are now old gods in politics they had to struggle they used to form rallies they used to go to the street in the old constitution the youths of today they like to be used they like to be called given money you have said it here in Homa Bay the majority of the people there were youths why can't they come with their own because politics or election is there, they vote it I am being told that our time is up oh why don't let's finish can I give you 30 seconds each so we won't continue from there thank you we start with Charles we as Kenyans we should be peaceful to the coming election there are so many words are coming up our allegations and what have you should not care about those things we know what we want as a country let us focus on the aspect of good leadership and the leaders are there, we know them they are not imported and the ideology we know for those people who have struggled for this nation we should give them chance of leadership and we see what can happen if we love our constitution then this is the time we should follow that people who struggle for this constitution to the letter my special attention is to the young people who are struggling the agenda for the youth nation is youth economic empowerment and transformation agenda we must come to a place where we reform and reset and revive the participation of the youth in as far as leadership is concerned economic inclusion is concerned and also the political discussion so we have to be on the table thank you so much and Charles ladies and gentlemen it has been a pleasure being with you from the beginning to the tail end of this particular conversation and gentlemen thank you so much for coming I appreciate it chairperson, chairman, youth nation and of course chairman Bungalaw Zalendo today we are talking to chair persons and of course it is upon you to choose and the chairperson of your particular region and the voice is given to you as a youth ladies and gentlemen we have come to the tail end of this particular conversation but we still have more coming up for you right here on why in the morning my name is Ram Aguco keep engaging with us the hashtag is why in the morning


and sing that song or use abusive or offensive language, which caused offence, would the police be able to prosecute that? If somebody stood in a shopping centre in the middle of an afternoon, on Tuesday afternoon, for example, when there is not any football taking place and they were hateful and abusive towards somebody's religion, they would be prosecuted under section 74 of the 2003 criminal justice act Scotland. And would they be able to be prosecuted if they used sectarian language? Yes, under that same provision. That concludes our line of questioning. I just make a connection to something that Mr Kelly said earlier. Just with regard to the comments about the act being incompatible with the ECHR, the appeal court considered a challenge under the ECHR and it was rejected. So the Government, the Presiding Officer and the Parliament passed this act as being compatible with the ECHR, so I just wanted to correct that. I believe that you said that it was incompatible. No, no, that's not what I said. Yes, please, please, Mr Kelly. Sorry? What's your response to that? Yes, what I said if you listened carefully, and I apologise if in any way I misled you, but what I said was, if you look at the Scottish Human Rights Commission submission to this committee, which is based on here in the evidence that the committee has taken in relation to this repeal act, they had concerns that there was a potential breach of ECHR, particularly in relation to legal certainty, and that was a serious issue, and that could potentially be a future challenge in relation to— Your concerns have not been upheld because it wasn't accepted? No, I don't think—I think what you're trying to point out is that when the legislation was originally put before Parliament, it requires a compatibility certificate from the presiding officer, and it got that compatibility certificate. I understand that. However, there's nothing to stop once a law is—once legislation is in place and it's been enacted, somebody can bring forward a challenge saying that ECHR has been compromised or undermined, and that's the point that the Scottish Human Rights Commission was making. That was rejected in the appeal court? Yeah, that was one case, but that doesn't stop other people from bringing forward challenges, as both the Human Rights Commission has pointed out and also the Law Society, and I think that that's the point that I'm making, that there continues to be uncertainty on this legislation. It could be open to further challenges. Except what you're saying about previous challenges, that doesn't stop somebody from making a further challenge. That clarification was helpful, and there are no other questions definitely this time, so that concludes our questioning, and I thank James Kelly and the officials for attending. Agenda item 8 is feedback from the Justice Sub-Committee on Placing on its meeting of 7 December 2016. Following the verbal report, there will be an opportunity for brief comments or questions. I refer members to paper 6, which is a note by the clerk. I will be giving that verbal report as the convener of the sub-committee, Mary Fee, was unable to attend. The report is as follows. The Justice Committee on Placing met on 7 December 2017 when it held an evidence session on Police Scotland's custody provision. The sub-committee took evidence from Police Scotland, the Scottish Police Federation, Unison Scotland and Positive Prisons Positive Future. The sub-committee heard about the role and work of the custody division, which was established when Police Scotland was formed. During a previous evidence session on the Police Service's financial planning for 2018-19, the sub-committee heard that, due to a reduction in the geographical locations in which prisoners can be held, prisoners were routinely conveyed over longer distances than would seem acceptable. The sub-committee scheduled the evidence session to consider custody provision in more detail, specifically the impact on the welfare and care of prisoners in custody and during transportation. The sub-committee will next meet on 18 January 2018 when it intends to hold an evidence session on HMI Inspectorate of Constabulary's report on undercover policing. Do members have any comments or questions? There are no comments or questions. We now move into private session. Our next meeting will be on Tuesday 19 December when we will consider petitions and undertake scrutiny of the Scottish Government's draft budget for 2018-19. We will suspend briefly to allow the public gallery to clear.