Welcome to another episode of the non-profit show. I am delighted that you're here and today we have a really interesting guest, Cindy Kenville, that is one of the leaders in animal welfare across this great country of ours and so we're going to be talking to her about leading an animal welfare nonprofit and what that looks like especially in these changing times of our non-profit sector. It's going to be really interesting to learn what Cindy is experiencing with her organization and we'll kind of tie that in to what a lot of other organizations are doing. I think a lot of times we think animal welfare is on its own but it links to so many other nonprofit sectors and so this is going to be a lot of fun. Again, if you don't know who I am, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy, Jared Ransom, my trusted sidekick, the non-profit nerd herself and CEO of the Raven Group is not with us today but she'll be back with us tomorrow. We want to make sure that we thank all of our presenting sponsors who are with us day in and day out, Blumerang American Nonprofit Academy, your part-time controller, Be Generous, Fundraising Academy at National University, Staffing Boutique, non-profit thought leader and non-profit nerd. These are the folks that have been with us for most of them that you see or have just listened to. They've been with us from day one and we're now in year three so it's quite amazing. Again, if you want to find any of our more than 600 episodes, you'll find them in our very extensive library archive and you can find them on Roku, YouTube, Vimeo and Amazon Fire TV and if you'd like to consume your content via podcast, we just started taking all these shows into podcast form so we have several months, I think we're probably close to six months of podcast episodes so you can join in on that. Okay, Cindy, back to you my friend. How are you? I'm doing great. Okay, Cindy Canville, you're the CEO of Heidi's Village. Yes. Talk to us about Heidi's Village. Sure, great. Well first, thanks for having me on. This is a lot of fun. Well, Heidi's Village is actually a fairly new animal welfare organization. We opened up in the midst of the pandemic in April of 2020. So the best made, you know what they say, the best made plans, right? But that's okay because animal needs, you know, they're always there and there's always a need. So we were very grateful that we could get open and start helping out animals right away. So Heidi's Village is really designed to work with other rescue partners. So the founder, Jenny Jantas, her vision really was to be able to provide a safe place that dogs and or cats could come while they are transitioning either into foster care or into their forever home. So there's huge needs for animals in care right now. And oftentimes it just isn't a space for them. So it's not that people don't want to help them. They just had nowhere to take them and make sure they were safe. So the we work with about 80 different partnering rescue organizations and provide boarding services for up to 250 dogs and over 200 cats. So it's quite quite the facility. We have five acres here. So it's a beautiful state of the art. We have a full vet clinic here so we can provide everything at affordable prices. So really our goal is to provide the rescue organizations a safe place to put their animals for a very reasonable cost like $15 a night. And then we have the full vet services available so they can get them prepared. Wow. So I gotta back up and ask you how long were you in process to get this this nonprofit launched and then to launch it during this amazing crisis? What was that like? Well, I wasn't actually the CEO at the time, but I can talk to from the from, you know, the lessons I've learned from from Jenny and the previous. They actually bought the property back in 2017 at 40th Street and Bamburin. And it took several years of going through City of Phoenix and development and getting that all done and then getting the building up and operational was about another year and a half to two years construction. So 2020 just, you know, the goal was March of 2020. We had our grand opening all planned and all the wine and beer and food order and unfortunately it didn't happen. But we did open when we still opened and we still started working with the rescues and taking in animals here. So but we have seen at that time we had probably 25 employees were now up to over 75 employees. So it's it's a lot to keep the organization up and running. Oh my goodness. Well, you know, how brave of you, the leaders and certainly your founder to, you know, press forward and keep going because that's one of the things that we saw so much with the nonprofit show is that folks that just like hit that pause button because they said, oh, this will be over. This isn't gonna last forever. And then they really ended up shooting themselves in the foot per se because they just they lost time in momentum. So really cool that you you were able to move forward on a new concept and get it going. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, I commend everyone that was there making it happen. And I've been here almost two years now. So it's yeah, it's a lot of work by a lot of fun. Oh my gosh. Well, let's talk about this. We alluded to this briefly when we were introducing you and we also were talking about it a little bit in the green room chatter. And that is animal welfare being tied to human service. And I think a lot of times we think of animal welfare as its own standalone sector. And it's over here. But talk to us about this link that we don't always understand about animals and human services. Yeah, sure. No, thank you. I I think I think the the failure for us to recognize is to not recognize that over 80% of Americans have some kind of animal on the whole. That's wow. So whether it be a cat or dog, it could be a fish or gerbil or rabbit. But over 80% of Americans have some other creature that they love in their home that they think of as family. So when we are when humans are facing different situations, whether it be domestic violence, which is really a big and it's domestic violence awareness month. So I think it's a great opportunity to talk about that, you know, 45 to 60%. There's sort of a little bit all over of individuals actually will not leave their home because of their animals. So having shelter available for animals and for the human is really, really important. And that's one thing I'm very proud of Heidi's village is that we can do that temporary care kind of boarding to for those people and and provide that service. We are working in partnership with some different homeless programs and helping homeless individuals transition from the streets to a home. And through that transitioning time, they have the opportunity to put their dogs or cats in boarding here, which then gives them the strength and the courage to go out find that job, get their apartment, get things going again. So I love love love when somebody comes after 90 days or whatever and comes back up their animals. It just it just always brings tears to my eyes. I'm just like, Oh, my gosh, this worked. So yeah, it's very important. It's really interesting. I mean, do you find that this is a link that you have to educate other folks in the nonprofit sector? Or does everybody kind of get this? No, it's definitely an education that I have been providing. I've really gotten involved with the Arizona Department of Housing and and some of the different homeless communities, you know, the St. Vincent, the Paul's, the cast, the others, and they are all doing some pretty amazing things to start thinking about pets. And sheltering of humans. So I think it's, we're starting to understand that bridge that needs to come together. And I am very excited about that because as we look at our whole economics and what's going on here, I mean, our population is exploding. And you can't find rents for, you know, under over under $1,000, you know, minimum wage is 1280, but livable wage is almost $21. So it's right, there are a lot of things happening in our community, putting people and animals and a lot of stress. So that you can be a part of that solution. I love that that that you are thinking about that and working with, you know, the community in your community alone, you're working with more than 80 other organizations. Yes. That's stunning. That's that's absolutely stunning. And is that statewide or is that more in the urban area? More Maricopa County, actually. We don't really have one or two partners out of Tucson, but otherwise, they're all pretty much here in the metro area of Phoenix. Well, let's move a little bit in a different direction. And let's have you talk to us about your donor demographics and how you're connecting to different demographics. We keep hearing more and more, you know, reporting on how younger donors are much more interested in animal welfare, environmental concerns than their parents or their grandparents. Are you seeing any of this?  So we have seen, definitely have seen a great volunteerism on the younger generation, which has been very, very helpful. You know, people can come volunteer to help with our cats or walk our dogs or and then we've seen the other spectrum, a lot of seniors that really want to come and be a part of what we're doing here. So I it's, it's been an interesting journey for us at Hatties Village and trying to raise the awareness and understanding of how animal welfare and the needs of the animals is so great and looking for those that have their time, you know, their treasures or whatever they can give back. So we have seen the whole spectrum. So it's one way to the other. So when you're looking at these different demographics, are you marketing to these different demographics in a variety of ways or are you, because you're so new, still kind of keeping it all the same? Um, we're doing a little bit of both. I mean, we've really upped our social media game and that seems to be attracting a lot of the, you know, younger generation. We done a lot of kind of asks out on social media, which has been great, great success. Sometimes it's just for goods, you know, in kind stuff, which is really, you know, very, very helpful to us. And then we've done the traditional kind of newsletters, mailings, direct mails, trying to attract all generations and really, again, just raising that awareness of that we're here and we're helping and we need the community support to do that. Now, this is kind of an off the wall question, which just made me, I'm still stuck on that number of 80 organizations that you're working with. Do you have a separate marketing campaign that or communication strategy just for those organizations like the, you know, the internal sector kind of communication? Yes and no.  So that just demonstrates how great a need there was to find space for animals and how great a need there was to find affordable veterinary care so that they can take care of more animals and we can save more lives. So I think it's, you know, I have to say that was fairly, we really didn't have to work that hard on that. I don't know what the word is. It was very, it was a very natural progression of getting those partnerships in and involved with us. I would say we have 20 very strong core partners and several others that use us intermittently for different things. And then we have other partnerships that we work with with cities and lost our home. There's a pet project and other ones that are doing, doing animal care, but needed that, again, that place of affordability and that place of secure, safe quality care. Right. It's so interesting. I would imagine that word has gotten out quickly with the other organizations because it is so unique and it's such a bridge kind of service.  We do. I think the, you know, the one thing that, that has taken us by surprise a little bit at Hades Village is not only is all the number of cats. So we also have a neon eight clinic here, meaning there are newborns for newborn kittens. So that's the only part of our organization that we have support 24 seven because those have to be fed every couple of hours. And currently we have about 150 kittens in our care. And it's a lot. So those actually all are Hades Village animals. So that's, you know, the, and we Hades Village is starting to see a lot of more people surrendering directly to us. So they're starting to see us as a resource of a place to surrender their animal. And of course, we're not going to let any animal go without help. But if we can't do it, we'll definitely try to find the resources that can. So that was, that wasn't quite the direction we thought as an organization we were going to go, but it's just kind of naturally happening. You know, a lot of nonprofits, you know, start one way and then their journey takes them somewhere else because you're compassionate and knowledgeable and you have an infrastructure. It's, it's hard to say no. It is hard to say no. Say no. And I show when you're looking in those little eyes.  How many dogs are you currently sheltering? Right now we have about the same amount of dogs right now. That is a massive number of animals on your property. Yes. Yes, it is. Amazing. Well, talking about animals, I have to say this is, I have the sweetest little face coming up here on the screen. And for those of you listening to us on podcasts, I have no idea what this dog is, but he's just so dear looking. And I really want to know what have been your most successful fundraising campaigns? Like what have they looked like? How have they drawn, you know, new donors to you or kept, you know, retained existing donors? What are some of the things that stand out as being successful for you? You know, again, being so new, we've only, we haven't had huge, huge successes. But one thing I'm very proud of is one program we've started as our Hades Heroes. And that's really where someone can do a monthly giving to us. And, you know, whether it be $25, $100, $500, whatever somebody can do, that has been really very successful. I mean, again, we're, we're young, we're just getting started. So we only have probably 60 or 70 people doing that right now. But we started at zero. And we only started about nine months ago. So I think that's pretty good. I think that's phenomenal.  Oh my gosh. Yes. So we have a, we have a nice little t-shirt we give when they are Hades Heroes. So you can wear it proudly out in the community. And it's a dog. I meant to bring one with me, but a dog with a cape on it. It's just really super cute. So that's been very successful. And again, I think our social media, we've done a lot for, we go through dog beds quite quickly here. I can, so that's, so we did a big push out on social media, where to go buy the beds for us. And we probably received close to $4,500 worth of beds back to us. So that stuff is huge for us, you know. And again, we really pride ourselves in having high quality and keeping dogs comfortable and with lots of respect and dignity. So that's so important. Yeah, really, you know, it's one of those things that would have never thought about, but it's like, yeah, duh. So when you're doing campaigns, whether it be for goods or services or money, I would love to kind of tap into what your experience is looking like with services. So for example, people that have a passion for volunteerism versus people that actually are from the professional sector, vet techs, veterinarians. What is that looking like for you in this space? So on the volunteerism wise, we, we currently have about 100 volunteers that are very active with us. And we have several groups that come in weekly that will support us. Some are actually disabled individuals that are coming in and doing different activities for us, stuffing coms, making enrichment toys for for the dogs. And again, all that support is great. On our vet side of things, we've got a few of the different surgeons come in and provide some pretty high dollar surgeries. We had tea cup Annie last year with a very big heart murmur that was expected to maybe live a year. She was a puppy but came in, adopted open heart surgery on her, saved her life. And she's off, off living on a farm, living her best life now. So, so, you know, that kind of stuff is there, it's like, I don't even know how you value it because it's it's the dog's life. And but the gentleman giving his time and the surgeon giving his time was really, really helpful to us. So people give it a variety of different ways. And so does it just supplies in the veterinary clinic that have helped us to through other organizations that typically would supply us, but are also giving in a charitable way. Wow, amazing. It's such an interesting thing to think about your amalgamation of different needs and services that are going to be a little bit different than other animal welfare organizations. How do you communicate that? How do you share to the potential donor or the existing donor of why and how you're different? I will say, to be very honest Julia, it's a learning process because it is because we are unique. There's really no other shelter that provides services like we do across the United States because we did a lot of research when we started to open. So it's really it is challenging a time to get people to understand the gap. You know, what we're asking people to pay for boarding and what it actually cost us to run are two very different numbers. So we're working on that and trying to understand how you know how a dollar and what a dollar will do for us here. But to be very transparent, you haven't figured all that out yet. Well, and I got to believe that, you know, how this is structured and how it works in, you know, the pandemic that you opened in is going to shift in the next five years. Oh, I believe that to be very true. I mean, so it's such a fascinating thing to see you navigating this story. I mean, that's one of the reasons why we wanted to have you on it. It's it's so interesting to see the size of your organization that's gotten out of the gate so strongly in a cataclysm of time. I mean, I think it's fascinating. I really do. We have a viewer that's written in and this viewer writes, I commend you on this program back when I was an interim executive director of a largeish cat rescue organization about 2,500 per year. I was very sad to turn away people who would just needed an affordable place to care for their pets while they were in hospital or had to be away. Wish your organization type had been around. Yeah, very sweet. Yeah, cool. But it speaks to the issue of how, you know, you are a unique thing. Yes. I mean, it's again, I think to what you just said, Julia, but you know, over the next five years, we're going to, it'll be interesting to see where it all goes. Animals are definitely a part of our lives. And as the economics and dynamics change for us as humans, there's going to, it's going to be, it may be get harder and harder for people to hold on to their animals. And we want to just be that safety net for them and see how we can support. It's truly if we can find resources to help you hold your animal in your home, we are all ahead of the game. The counties, I mean, the county has grown tremendously. I mean, we're almost 4.5 million people here. It's like, that's a lot of animals. Yeah, it really is. Well, I'm fascinated with that 80%. If you'd asked me that, like, what percentage of Americans have, you know, a furry friend as a family member, I would have never gotten anywhere near near that. So that's pretty amazing. And I shouldn't just say furry, because, you know, to the point of fish and everything that could be around it. There's somebody in their house. But I mean, it's really an interesting thing to think about, because that is a part of American society and, you know, what what that looks like on the outside is pretty significant. So very, very interesting to to have your perspective. So when we when we don't have much time left, Cindy, but when you look at the future, what is it that you see your greatest need is going to be? Oh, gosh, greatest need is probably really truly going to be the funding. I mean, I will say the Virginia B Jauntas Foundation, Jenny Jauntas, our founder and her foundation have been really the backbone of how we operated. But we we get about half our revenue from her and the other half from anything that brings in.  So I love it. Well, I'm really impressed with your 70 Heidi's heroes. And if you've done that in nine months, and what do you think the trajectory is moving forward? I mean, like, do you think you'll get that many next year? Or I mean, do you have a sense of that? I know it's hard when you're so new and it is hard. But I feel like we're great, we're gaining greater support and greater awareness of who we are out there. So really, I'd love by the end of 2023, I'd love to have 500. I mean, that's kind of my goal. Wow. Okay, well, a goal oriented.  Oh, my gosh, well, I say that we book you for the end of 2023. And so we see what this trajectory looks like, because it's such an interesting path. I mean, if you could do that many in a giving society that quickly in a pandemic, I think that's a shocking, shockingly successful. I mean, really, Cindy, that's amazing. So good job. Thanks. Yeah, no, it's it's a lot of fun, a lot of work. But I'm enjoying it. Yeah. Well, here's Cindy Kenville's information CEO of Heidi's Village, Heidi's Village.org. Check them out. Their websites terrific, beautifully done, and it really communicates, I would say the spirit of how you operate and what you're doing and how unique it is. I love that it's a model for other organizations to partner with, especially when you brought up that number of working with almost 80 other nonprofits throughout your community. That is remarkable. And so that in itself is a whole nother kettle of fish. I mean, working in in cooperation with another nonprofit isn't always easy. True, true. But but we all have one thing in common. We have great passion for the animals we're caring for. Yeah, absolutely. They said today. Yeah, well, you have been just a delight to have on. We need to check back in with you and see how things are going so that we can kind of keep track of your successes and hear about your challenges and and how you've overcome them, because it sounds to me like you've got an amazing team that's really coming ahead in a time that's been incredibly challenging for most organizations, let alone startups. So I'm super, super impressed. Again, if we haven't met, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy. Here at ransom, the nonprofit nerd will be back with us tomorrow. Hey, again, thank you to all of our presenting sponsors, Bloomerang American Nonprofit Academy, your part time controller, be generous. Fundraising Academy at National University, Staffing Boutique, Nonprofit Thought Leader and the nonprofit nerd. These are the folks that are with us day in and day out. And because they're here, we've been able to have this conversation with Cindy Canville of Heidi's Village today. Cindy, thank you so much. Oh, thank you. It was my pleasure. It was a lot of fun. Keep up the good work. And as we like to end every episode, we want to remind ourselves, our viewers, our listeners and our guests to stay well. So you can do well. We'll see you back here tomorrow, everyone. Thanks, Cindy. Thank you. Bye.


glue is still wet here but I love the way this page turned out as I'm loving all of them but did anybody notice anything in particular? So evidently as I've just discovered I have the word magical in the positive affirmation deck of cards twice because not only did I already pull the card and sticker on a prior page here, did you catch that card and sticker? I pulled the card again because I evidently I thought initially I put it back in the bowl but then I had a spare sticker. I had another sticker with the same word on it. I only printed one set of the words on stickers so it's in there. Evidently I really needed to see that word and I needed it in the deck. I don't know why so anyway it's in there twice. That was interesting. I do like this snowflake here but I've got to fix my L. There we go. And if you watched the page I as soon as I pulled the word and as I was realizing I'd already done the word and so it must be in there twice before I even found the quote or did anything to the page I knew what needed to be said over here. So that's a little different. Good! Just different. Anyway I'm loving this and I'm really loving this paper which is out of the other deck of scrapbooking paper I had or pad which is from Simple Stories. It's a 6x8 paper pad and it's called Winter Farmhouse. I'm loving this particular paper. It's got those snowflakes with sort of the cool wintery tones on one side and then the sort of beigey whitewashed woodwork on the other side. We're working with cool tones this month over in my creative year so I'm really this is really appealing to me. Well I'm trying to do this journal in mostly cool tones and work. I've stuck in the occasional page that is not cool tones at all. There's one in here. There's two couple in here but yeah. But I'm trying to stick with mostly cool tones but I'm also trying to listen to my instincts so anyway that being said I love it. So I hope you guys had a fun time with that. If you want to see me doing a page with me talking through my thought process for everything that I do on these pages which is basically the same thought process for all the pages. You have to be a member of Patreon which is a very low-cost thing and the link for it is down in the video description. There is a talking video for page 6 I think this one over there in Patreon. You can see me doing page 6 here on YouTube. However it is a speed through video without the talking. So if you want the talking video you have to be over on Patreon. Anyway I hope you enjoy the process. If you're inspired to do anything from this video series in a similar fashion I sure would love to see what you're doing. Please private message me or tag me in a post or something like that so I can see it and hopefully comment on it. Don't forget to leave any questions, comments or concerns in the comments down below or again tag me in a post in one of the Facebook groups or something and I'll make sure to get back to you as soon as I can. That being said please like share and subscribe. Don't forget to support the free content however you can here on YouTube or over in the Facebook art groups not just for me but for all your favorite content creators. We're all struggling this year especially and I know many of them that are barely making ends meet and they need the support. So whether it's shopping in our Etsy shops or joining our Patreons or PayPal tip jars or whatever it is it doesn't matter. Mike Deacon I know has his angels that support his free content whatever it is it doesn't matter. If you can support that would be most welcome this holiday season especially this year but always don't forget to like share and subscribe. I said that already.  Bye guys.


Hello, so it's 1 past 3, so we are in Switzerland and I'm German, I've been wandering after 3 o'clock. So, hello, my name is Sotka Rigger. I want to tell you something about migration, migration or issue which was coming up in the concrete study we made for customers, I'll tell you later a little bit around.  Because they took the security for a political discussion. If they should, or could, migrate to the office or not.  And how we tried to solve this issue. And I think it covers all the issues in the discussions for migration which when you face when you come to a customer. They put everything in this security. So let me put a look on the slides. Cox is a website, a platform we are trying to promote for information to get around. Even for a free office. So, first of all, as Carlo mentioned yesterday, there's methodology for migrations. And to frame a particular part of it where we are going. It was very in the front of migration methodology. We were in the feasibility study which is in the front of every migration or rollout deployment. Where we have to define targets, what do you want in the migration. Where we have to do inventory for software and hardware. Which applications are integrated with the office to define migration strategy. What you are doing with the old documents. Should they go on to the new document format. What's another tool or automation to calculate total cost of ownership. Is it really for financial benefit for the customer to migrate. And bring this to the decision maker in the company. Which decide hey we go to the office or we go to another office. So, in this story we are in the very first part where we do software and hardware inventory. And as you see in the next slide it was not such a big customer. It was 250 clients in a tool manufacturer for automotive industry. What they are doing is they do physical tools with which cars are combined or produced. So it's a manufacturer. So not all of 250 clients are daily office users. But around 120 of them they are doing their work dealing with the office of others. Just for filling in some forums for the personal department for the administrative department. So we were doing such interviews with different people. We have an interview and we came in in late April I think. It was mid or late April.  Hey there is a particular alarm. And I've heard upbeat for this interview day. But I was not bringing this together with migration to people. As you know upbeat was the leak which was found in the open SSL algorithm made by a German student in it. And it made them sensible for security issues. They were feared about the fact that they could get an open source office suite where such a thing like heartbeat could also be integrated. So this was the main issue and the discussions going around. And they took this issue to say this could not be an office suite which we want in our company. Of course they could be risks, security risks when we use it and so on. And it was used by maybe by sex persons where we have the interviews on that day. And what we later understand was that these discussions came from a very specific point. But this we will understand later. They don't tell us this the day. That people were scared due to the experience of document issues in Microsoft Office. By one big customer it is a huge German automotive producer. And they have to give their offers for their product in a defined form. In a defined document. Every thing in this document is defined. They are the formats and so on. And they had huge discussions with them to bring it into Microsoft Office. And what they fear was if they get a new office suite. They have to discuss this with them again. New discussions, new work to do a new form. And perhaps that all of this will be.  If there is something between me and deal it must go aside. So this was the real fear, the real issue which was behind. But it was the mid of April and there was upbeat. So as everybody should know who do migrations in this area. You have to take care about this fears. Don't say this is not a security issue. Go away, you have technical problems in the industry. You have to care about this. So what did you do? You went to the IT guy and asked him, hey, we need two more days for the physicality story. He asked me why. Because we want to go with you in a workshop. Not just in days, but what we work on most of the days. And define something, one of the security demands for you. We have an office suite. What are your security demands on it? And spontaneously agreed and said, okay, how do we do this?  And asked them to give some inputs for the workshop we later made with other key persons. One of the same advice was with it. And here is what they formulated as security issues with the office suite. First of all, they know that's a technical issue. So I have to formulate. No technical vulnerability. So the real security issue, well, that's a wide range of issues. And no response. Another answer is coming later. Something to do with creating. Second function of completeness even in the future. Or the feeling of trust that I have the right to even for future demands. Even if I don't know it now, I need a specific function. It will be in the future. Someone was informed about intellectual property issues. So when everybody could throw them in this code, there could be a content drawing or something. Where we get forward to the call. This is not a security movement. The first one I write, you will not be able to prove it's a bruiser. What he meant was if I go to work with other people, even outside of the company, I want to handle that. So my initial question was, hey, wasn't he the secure man in the world? Yeah, the IT leader said, hey, costs and follow-up costs. Costs I can estimate or whatever follow-up costs. I'm insecure or want to have trustworthy about follow-up costs. Zero and so on. And this is a support theme. If I get a job, who could help me answer? So this was a list of the main issues of this. Which was made initially on that day, where the inventory interviews were originally planned. And beside that, you have to go a little bit more in detail. And we arranged, nowadays for the workshop, with five people to go in detail. We managed that we could have another technical guy with me. And that we could take some issues of that and show them directly what is the answer to the bruiser for that. Not all of these are technical issues we have seen, so we have discussions. But especially some of it should be shown directly to them that they are secure. They could have trust. So in the real technical security issue they formulated, well, they could have some source proteins. What am I doing with the source proteins? But this was not the example which we could give them in the workshop. But I took that because it's a very good example of the last week. Even though it's not the source proteins, but it handles CSB issues, I think. There is a backverted security fix for version 4.2.6. So there was the first version of 4.2.6 and they had a backfix in it for CSB filters. So we can show LibreOffice community and others, or their part of the community, are aware of security issues. And they are reacting. Then they asked about Microsoft, Microsoft killer macros, macro viruses and so on. And we showed them the security center of LibreOffice showed them, hey look, we have the same security levels with macro handling as in Microsoft Word. Passwords on documents or parts of it. And this was even a funny point because first we discussed, hey, passwords could be dragged and are not safe, are not safe encrypted and they are doing rumors that you can break Microsoft Word passwords and so on. So is it a good encryption algorithm in LibreOffice for passwords? And we showed them in LibreOffice there's the same or quite better encryption rules with it than they have in their old Microsoft version. Okay, to a final minute. In other words, hey, what's the point when my guy is done with the password? I want to know the content of the document and we decide that this is not the issue which is differential, Microsoft people always allow for speed, but it isn't the issue. But it is security for them. Another big point was the online update. Every activity going via the internet to someone else, giving data or something like this for update for these, they know the UI, feedback system what they are doing and so on. And they don't have any shock in the options that you could say yes or no and you could give a level of what is going out of my client to a person. And even we showed them that they can use it for their own. That they can use the online update process in LibreOffice on their own server. That you can link these automatic online updates to a source in your environment where you can decide now I want to update my version that they couldn't take it out from me. This was the first time they said, oh, there's more that they have before. So this question we were hearing two or three times is another question about Microsoft with these permanent catch demands what you have to do. What is the binary document format? You don't know what is in there. With the password agreement I've had to explain which runtimes and DLNLs are in the Microsoft Office which we use, the control and transparency about the data which is storing over the internet and so on. And this was the first time they get interested in it. There was a little much more of such details. I've mentioned feedback pressure reports, the registration process. When they started to work with the quick start theme we showed that they can turn off it. There was a few what it was that the process was doing on my computer. So I turned it off and there were four problems. Those of data in my office very strong. This was a functional issue because of the architecture of repo office. If one module of repo office grays, the whole process is graced. So the other modules are graced. We have to do the document recovery process for all kinds of modules. And now we are studying a little bit away from the technical security issue and coming to the soft parts of it. Just the duration of the life cycle of a suite. It means that they use office much longer than one version of Microsoft Office longer than five years. And they want to have this decision to set it sustainable. This is an absolute right decision point. With this question there was how often do I have to have a new training? How often is UI changing? This is one of the big arguments for repo office. About the duration of the life cycle, is there a sustainable software development process behind repo office? So are we getting bug fixing and support? How is it organized? Could I see some fog lists and see the process in which the issues are fixed? And we showed them a little bit of the organization of the TNAF engineering team which decides about the release cycle. We showed them that there is an engine version engine for still and for fresh to get new functions and to be secure with stable versions. And so on that there are hunting sessions and so on. And we discussed the duration of the open source engines. They asked if the community is ready what will be with the product. And I asked, okay, even if it's not very, probably, a problem, that Microsoft will go away and don't deploy a new Microsoft. But what is if Microsoft says no, we are doing no more office suites. And this is what I call the open source. And it is shown by repo office. There will be, because of the open source issue, there will be another community or supporter and so on, which takes the open source and made it a value for them. And it goes off. So this is an issue which is positive against Microsoft. So the question, what about Microsoft? Just the function and completeness is the question, do I get all modules functions in the faces? I mean, if you try explaining this in the fourth screen, what did we show them? We showed them the modules. We showed them that they get desktop database for free for all clients because they have a two version strategy in the company. Some guys have access. They did have access and some not. And they get a free for all clients. Besides this version, which is good. We showed them that the face is okay. The UI, that is similar to what they know. That there is a fall down to the add-on on the Microsoft website with extensions. There are sources to get extensions for free or for paid license. The only thing that was a little bit problematic that the, technically the main client, the example of the main client, that this was not bundled in the repo office suite. But you know the answer. Take from the word that you have two different admin search processes to install. So this was one point we said, okay. In the pure repo office suite, there is no main client. I asked about for the future of the browser office. We could give them some hints. Especially in the get now, you know that there is something going around the country. All the tools, which are based on the repo office with the same look and feel in Lola.com and so on. We gave them a feeling that there are solutions like Microsoft Office 365. Another big point was collaboration. Collaboration features. Yes, we discussed a little bit about SharePoint protocol. And that repo office is already able to take the SharePoint protocol. Even with other Microsoft Office suites. But if you're honest, you have to say this is 60 to 70% of the functionality which SharePoint is giving in the Microsoft Office suite. It's a little integration issue. So, even in this point, the question, and what about Microsoft Office? A lot of property variations. Packaging of Microsoft Office inversions. You have different look and feel. The answer to the rest of the database. What is about the changes in the PBA object model? You have to migrate even if you go to another Microsoft Office suite. You might call, you might propose your application spirit on the PBA object model. What actually will be the user interface? Ribbons and so on. We will know these issues without finding it. Trusts in inter-authorability and connectivity. Well, something out of this slide. You have even heard this. This is in the talks yesterday in the professional business talks. I do not want to be honest with you though. Can I collaborate with external suppliers, customers, effectively? It's really about document formats, layout, fidelity to see the same and the same layout. Even in the exchange of functionality, one of the main ports, formats and modules, that we can do both on both sides. And the convergence synchronous and asynchronous. And what we did is that we showed them. There was another part of the story that the managing director was using heavily his tap and keyboards and so on. Working with the e-box format, document format, and we showed him a document with e-box and he was flashed about this. So we showed them the e-filters, the in-end export filters of e-box and proof that this is a clear advantage in comparison to the next one. Clear advantage. Behavior in the front window, I don't have to say a lot of it, but this is the part where that's even what Vitalyom mentioned, that you have to tell something about the organization around e-box. The document foundation, how it works, that there are no dependencies to main responders, the license issues. And there is a foundation around the TDF, especially for this kind of fears that somebody could take it and take the new processor, the project or the product and bring it to another way to bring up follow-up costs and so on. So here was some information about TDF and some technical issues, common interfaces and using of common interfaces and formats and the send-outs. I think this is the worst to compare this with Microsoft, this is a clear advantage of e-box. And so on, by time and so well. So, if you get the job, I can... From summary, there were three clusters of fears which they summarized around the worst security, the real technical security issues, security of the product care, how the product is developed and some convention, security, fears, total cost of ownership, which I mentioned in this talk, not so much. So, security and trustworthiness is present and possible if you use e-box. This is a passage that we get. There's no proper mark, there's no proper to ask for. So take the fears of the users, give information, information, information. This is the key point here. But in such discussions, be honest. If there's something not quite comparable with Microsoft Office, tell it and you've got to trust it. And yes, afterwards... 4.2 points, I think it's 5 or 6. The lag is 6. They have to do the security checks, but... So, this is the amount that you have to pay for security. I want to give you a hint to our products. This is the least one recap and I won't get it, there's a conversion. Another point, I want to show you something out of my home country. This is what I've pushed up in talks with the people, not for fees. This is the RSB social and 3.19, what they are doing is hardware refreshing. They buy from the customer hardware, laptops, servers and so on and refurbish them as disabled persons. There's a tariff that they have 50% of the hired people who are disabled persons and they also have access points for laptop and work. I think most of you will know that you can do such a similar thing for pure schools. They do it here and there. Now, if you buy as a private person or a company, if you buy hardware by then you can say, no, I don't want to turn off Microsoft Office Suite, but I don't want to have to leave Microsoft Office Suite. The argument behind this, the most hardware things they are selling are laptops, laptops around 150 and 200 euros and it's quite the same above for a Microsoft Office Suite. A lot of people say, no, I'm not right to buy for the same price so I can't buy or I can't get any more. I want to promote this little thing, so if you have to buy it. Thank you.