Well, welcome everyone My name is Lisa Sights-Gruel. I am the chief advancement officer at the the wiki media foundation And I am your moderator today for a fireside chat with Marianna is Scander our CEO of the wiki media foundation and Selena Duckelman who's our chief product and technology officer. We have the slides, please. Oh Look at this. It's a fireside chat I don't know whose idea it was to have a fireside chat in Singapore in August, but is there any objections to changing this perhaps to a? Poolside chat Just feels a little little better. Okay. Good. Good. Good. I wish we had some umbrella drinks up here to be sipping But we do have water So how this is gonna work I've got a few questions for Marianna and Selena that have been submitted, but we're also gonna be taking questions from from all of you There's people walking around with cards They'll be collecting those perhaps as you came in someone to handage you a card and there's we also have mics that will be passing around If you are somebody who wants to ask your question in purpose and in person in this really big room So why don't we just with that get started? Marianna my first question is for you You've been here for about a year and a half. We're still counting. I guess in in months 18 months Yeah, I think once you hit two, you know, you no longer counting months So you're getting up there unless we're counting in dog years, then it's been much longer. That's right so can you just tell us what your priorities have been and And how you've been working on achieving them in this this kind of first session or first period of your leadership of the foundation Well first just to say thanks to those of you've chosen to spend some time with us We're gonna try to keep our answers brief so that we have time for questions and to hear from all of you I officially started at the Wikimedia Foundation in January of 2022 and Because I knew that there was gonna be a lot to do at the foundation once I started I actually Wanted to prioritize starting my learning about our communities and our movement and so had an opportunity between October and December of 2021 to engage in a listening tour that involved meeting Volunteers and staff members of our board some of our external partners So that when I started I had a bit more context for the moment that the foundation was in and some of the issues that were on people's minds And so that listening tour really was probably the important Preboarding that started before I joined. I really focused on three things our leadership our Strategy and planning and then our culture as an organization and our values There had been some transition in the executive leadership in the year before that I arrived and the Chief technology officer and the chief product officer were open positions And so really the highest priority given that that is a significant part of the foundation's job Was to really ensure that we brought on the right leader and at that point Having studied a bit of history that it also felt like it was the right time to bring those two teams back together And so I would say probably the most important contribution in that category was hiring Selena She'll tell you more about herself And and joined about six months in that also involved getting the benefit of Our leadership team who have had a lot of experience in the movement Lisa who's I think employee number three In terms of tenure and has been with the organization 13 years 13 years and so really ensuring that we were getting the best of People who could provide context in history and institutional memory and change as well And we've now had an opportunity to really build out that team through both external hires and internal promotions And so focusing a lot on the leadership of the organization. I Would say that strategy and planning is the place we've really tried to reach out again to volunteers and communities doing that Through a couple of ways one increasing the number of languages In which we communicate so we've gone from six to thirty one languages that the foundation does interpretation or translations and Really inviting community feedback and also focusing on multi-year issues Most of the challenges that we have and we'll talk about really can't be solved in a 12 month period And so an opportunity to work with other Both movement entities including the movement charter drafting committee, I know some of you are here today And then the last thing which I'll just say briefly is that it's been my experience that when you have the best Strategy in the world, but the culture can't accept it It's very hard to make progress and so to really also do work on thinking about Our values and the culture of the organization how we hold ourselves accountable How we want to show up how we want to engage and so that's also been really important Thank You Mariana Selena this is also your first wikimania, and you come to us from Mozilla. That's right Yes, this is my Third 20 year old code base that I've worked on post-grascal firefox and now media wiki Given that you've inherited a 30 year old code base How do you make decisions around product and tech work that the teams will take on? Yeah, thanks for this question. Well, first of all, also, thank you so much for giving us this opportunity to Talk to everybody here today. It's really exciting to be at my first wikimania and I'm in my you know, this is this is my first year. It's one year and I think 16 days That I've been here So I'm still you know, I'm now in my second year of onboarding and still kind of learning with you all But I I think you know, I recently I guess not that recently now, but back in March In April I published You know the results of the listening tour that I undertook just following in Mariana's footsteps really trying to learn from the community the staff as much as I could before we started figuring out what the big problems and Decisions that we needed to make in the product and technology space were and the priority areas that I had there You know, they first of all, you know helping solve problems for the volunteers figuring out like our maintenance Situation in backlogs and finally like helping the organization and the volunteers figure out decision-making together those those are the priorities that I have and in terms of the specifics of the decision-making And how we go about that, you know, the center of it has to be you know What are the problems that we're trying to solve together and really what are the user needs and we have a number of different ways that we get input on that, you know, some of them are Very technical ways, you know users will file bugs or community members will like let us know about features that they want to have through something like fabricator we also Have a user research and a quantitative research team that go out and they seek data or they'll interview folks and put Together reports that inform how we take next steps with with product ideas And this year as part of the annual plan We also put together draft objectives all the way back in February And we published those on wiki to have like a really early Conversation about you know is is this directionally what we should be doing? Can we get feedback and input and through that process? We actually changed, you know what what we were doing we went through several iterations of that So so that that's the kind of decision-making processes that that I think you know the department should Should go with and and I think it's it's been a really It's been a really great Process so far just like learning with the community and now we'll see like over the course of this year like what we're able to accomplish together That's exciting now. I know there's one Topic that just kind of is in the news and it's kind of on everybody's mind and that's AI Can you share just some of your thoughts? Does generative AI pose a threat to wikipedia? Well, if any of you were in the session today, we had a couple really, you know fascinating and Engaging sessions about AI and our movement today, and I think that There there's definitely like a You know a challenge, you know a generative AI and I think you know any I think it's quite evident that a system that can generate lots and lots of tax That you know that has potentially hallucinations misinformation embedded in it And the speed at which that can be produced, you know that that's clearly like a an issue on the internet today I think within the You know wiki media projects and wikipedia specifically Those communities have come up with these incredibly robust systems for Generating trustworthy information and knowledge and sharing that with the world And I think that those all those systems they still work You know is is there, you know a series of challenges that we're gonna have to face together? Absolutely, but I also think there's a ton of opportunity in the space, you know the the acceleration of these models they They've given us the opportunity to offer Translations in more languages than any other major You know in Website in the world, you know Software platform in the world, and I think that you know in the future, you know even now, you know We have models that help find Vandalism and you know and help support editors in their work And I think in the future we're gonna find more uses for the technology, you know So so I really see that there's like quite a bit of opportunity right now Yeah, so less of a threat Particularly as we move kind of work out the kinks of a new technology and a lot of opportunity Yeah, I think so and I just also say like using machine learning isn't like a new thing for the movement or the foundation We've had a machine learning team at the foundation since 2017 And you know we keep investing keep learning more and yeah, I I think that I think that there's just a lot of opportunity Yeah, thank you Selena and Mariana what external trends are you seeing right now? I mean, I think that There's a lot to be worried about in the world in general I think we are seeing The general rise of authoritarian governments and censorship We're seeing that technology is disrupting so many parts of human life in some ways not so great and I think that Similar to what I referenced briefly in the opening ceremony I think that's why the work of wikimedia actually feels more relevant and more urgent and more needed now than ever before We have I think work to do to respond to what the world needs from us now I think that the Foundation has tried to reach out and ask for input on what are the key trends and the key threats We all have to be watching together and those have really been about The changing nature of search. I have two nephews. They do not Google things That is not how they search for information on the internet And so how do we think about that in terms of the the habits of more and more users? We have to worry about how our content is Disintermediated and used by others we have to worry about our regulatory environment and what we're seeing really in many different regions of the world the EU The section 230 regulations in the United States things that are happening in this region as well. I Feel optimistic that those are We had I think good consensus Those are the right things to be paying attention to and the right things to be watching together And so the things we can control Which is how we respond. I think is going to be the work ahead for all of us Yeah, that makes a lot of a lot of sense. We are here In in Singapore in a region of the world that it's been a while since we've been here for wikimedia It has been just amazing to see all of the the work of The volunteers in this region What excites you most about what you're seeing in EC up? Again, I feel like I've really tried to Learn the ethos of the wikimedia movement and the things that have come before that are really worth holding on to and one of the things that is Exhibited even in this wikimedia is to really put like You know function and then form like what are we trying to do? What is the thing that needs to be accomplished? And then let's figure out what the best structures are to be able to do that and so typically Wikimanias are hosted because there's a local chapter and they hosted and this region said no We're going to make a plan to do this differently because we want to bring wikimania to Singapore There is not a local chapter that can host But we're going to pull it together and we're just going to like again bring the collective ingenuity of everybody and what they Have to bring to the table and I haven't been to another one So I can't compare but based on what I have heard just asking people The last few days really demonstrate that that kind of thinking can produce incredible results. Yeah It's kind of a region of doers. Yeah I remember the first time I traveled to Asia as a part of this job was probably 10 years ago and You know, I had the experience of just trying to load wikipedia on my phone And it it took forever just to load the page, but We're here in Singapore where there's actually now a caching center kind of right down the road And now it loads lightning fast. So my my question for you Selena is is what's your plan for? growing servers and caching centers around the world Yeah, it's excuse me So, yeah, it's very very exciting that that we have the caching center here and it had a profound impact on page loads page load times in the region so the wikimedia foundation Unlike a lot of organizations Whether they're nonprofits or for profits we actually operate our own data centers for a number of reasons But one of them is user privacy, you know, so we operate our own content delivery networks and That enables us to have like a lot of control over How information is stored and transmitted, you know between these different data centers that we operate one of which is in Singapore we have another in Marseille and that Data center was was put there because we we also have another one in Amsterdam But the reason why we put one in Marseille was because its location and it enabled us to have much faster Access time in in the continent of Africa. So each place that we choose It's based on data that we have about how fast pages load all around the world And the next place that we're targeting is in the global south It's South America and what we're doing there like the criteria that we have for that It's in part, you know, the page load times like where where can we place it so that we'll speed up those page load times It has to be in close proximity to You know a point of presence like where you know, there's a major for example like fiber optic, you know network connection that you know connects High-speed networks like across a region and also, you know, it needs to be in a place where you know We can uphold our values like as an organization So we're in the process of evaluating that right now and I'm hoping, you know Just in the next few months we'll be able to announce like the specific location But I'm really excited about that, you know in our effect that it will have in that region. That is amazing I'm sure folks in Latin America are excited about that So that is it for kind of the prepared questions that we're given in advance. We are now going to open it up to any of you You can hand if you have a card you can hand it to Nadie over here Guillaume is collecting cards. We also have microphones Margot can take your cards. We also have microphones if you want to ask questions live if you're Brave and want to talk in this really big room Any of that works All right, here comes Nadie with some burning questions. Thank you Okay, Mariana, I think I'm going to give this one to you What do you have to say about the global council? I'm not going to treat that as a trick question So my first conversations about a global council started before I started this job because When I was getting to know volunteers in different parts of the world I remember a conversation With somebody who actually was at based in Europe and they said What's your position on the global council? I at that point did not know actually And enough to give a informed answer. I Think to the extent that the global council represents the idea of how do we Ask the best place entities in our movement to do the right things Everybody's for that and I certainly think that that's the right conversation for us to be having I'm mindful that the movement charter drafting committee hasn't yet produced a document On all of the different chapters that it's been working on and probably folks in the room have had varying levels of engagement with that But I guess all I would say in response to the earlier point that you made about ECAP is that I Think this movement has demonstrated the ability to create any structure that it wants And that is something that we're good at it's just about making sure that we're all aligned on who's doing what and so that they Can do it well Yeah, and and how would you see kind of the the wiki media foundation? working with the global council Well, so one of the thing again, I'm mindful not everybody's on the mailing list not everybody reads everything So I don't want to make any assumptions, but one of the reasons that the wiki media foundation has tried to identify Really important topics for multi-year planning is as I said some things are really important and needed to have a long view And one of the topics that we've identified is really around core Responsibilities, which is what should the foundation do and what should the foundation not do what should others do? How can we partner? How can we support? How can we resource and so for me? I hope that that is Like a very visible signal that we're open We're open to having the right conversations about whose best place to do the things that need to get done and ensure that Everybody has both the support and the resources that they need. Thank you All right, Selena. I think this next one is probably for you. It's about the tech technology wish list And this has been a place where volunteers express kind of their desires for what what they would like to be built and Is there is there a plan on taking it off off hold? What what are we thinking for the wish list in the future? Yeah, great question. So the the wish list The wish list has Some challenges one of the challenges that volunteers have expressed is that it's a very very long list and Only a very small handful of those wishes are Granted, you know on on a yearly basis, so What what can we do about that? You know, and I've over the last, you know, six to eight months been learning a lot about the process that and all the effort that goes into creating the wish list and I've also been learning from the Community tech team and thinking about, you know, what what would be the best path forward for for the list? So there's a team right now that's like thinking about this and and basically the the what we've come to the conclusion You know our conclusion that we've come to is that the wish list is bigger than just like one, you know very small team and really the kinds of things that people are That volunteers are raising in the wish list should be things that come to all of the product and tech teams at the foundation So that's the path that we're on right now trying to determine like how can we best like take these great ideas these, you know Request for help, you know maintenance Issues that are being raised and really just get those to the teams that can best work on them and You know think about it not as just like a one-time thing. So there's a session That's happening this week that the Comtech team and several members of the contact team are here this week If you want to talk to any of them about that But I think that you know that that's the step that we're taking here at Wikimedia and then you'll be hearing more from that team like relatively soon the next couple months. Oh Thank you. Okay, Mariana. I think maybe this is for you I suspect this comes from somebody from Queens, New York. We won't try to identify you but When will the office be moved from expensive San Francisco to a cheaper place? For example, Queens, New York Having been to Queens. I'm very happy to have an office there. So again, maybe just as context the foundation is a Essentially a remote first organization We have staff that are split about half within the United States and about half of the staff Actually that live outside of the United States for a lot of historical reasons. We have had a Physical office in San Francisco Prior to the pandemic there were several teams that were located in San Francisco I don't have to tell this audience how much the COVID-19 pandemic changed all of our lives and our ways of working And so we've been as an organization also coming to terms with some of those shifts in terms of how people Understand where they work and how they work. We've been very open with our staff that the current lease in our San Francisco office comes up for either expiration or renewal at the end of 2024 and I think that is going to be the right time to have an organizational Conversation about what makes sense. How do we want to use our resources? Do we want to invest in giving people an opportunity to gather more? Do we need to keep a space for legal reasons? Which we may need to do and so to really give ourselves between now and the end of next year to have the right Conversation, but we have a lot of staff in New York and in Queens and they gather very regularly And so we definitely do not need an office to be able to hang out in Queens Yeah Wikimania in Queens sometime. Yeah, okay Thankfully, that's not my decision. That's not not our decision. I love Queens, too Well, I'm gonna just pause for a second to see if we have any Before I get back to the cards to see if we have any Folks who want to ask their question in in person. Do we have anybody who wants? wants to take the mic No, okay.  You got it. Okay, you can open your eyes now That's fine So when I closed my eyes, it was very peaceful. First of all, I was envisioning that that beach scene But I I think I think a perfect future for open knowledge would be one without censorship it would be one where Everyone that wanted to would be able to freely contribute without fear would be amazing and And I think there would be All the bugs in media wiki would be fixed all bugs in media wiki would be fixed that'd be incredible I mean first of all, it's very bright up here. So when you close your eyes, it's still very bright, but You know, I think that the future would look like us Achieving many of the things that have been identified in our movement strategy imagining a world where the things that we worry about You know in terms of people's access to information no matter where they live an Opportunity for people that feel like what they're reading online is accurate and can be trusted and is Verified in a way that they can find it for themselves. I definitely feel like the idea of Knowledge production being something that more and more people can be a part of It sounds a little bit like maybe a dream that's not possible, but again I think if you look back 20 years ago I don't think people would have thought that what Wikipedia has become was possible either and so I Think there is a track record to dream about things that seem impossible Very good answer Okay, this next one. I'm gonna broaden this question a little bit, but and this is this question is about kind of what inspires us other other things in the world that that the perhaps You know Wikipedia the Wikimedia Foundation could take inspiration from now the question specifically mentions in Carta But I'm gonna broaden it a little bit and just think about what in the world Perhaps we in this movement could could take inspiration from perhaps other open source projects And why is there any inspiration from Mozilla that maybe we should be bringing in?  I mean, I'm sure yeah, absolutely There's there's lots of lessons that I brought with me from from Mozilla that that We could take inspiration from but the first thing that popped into my mind actually when you said that was volunteer organization that I participated in and was a volunteer leader for it's this organization called hands-on and And What inspires me about their mission and and what they do it's it's aligned a lot with ours Which is that just really encouraging volunteers to come and in there each in their own individual way to contribute as much You know as they can whenever they can and I think the parts of that that their mission and what they do that I would love to Just have more of that spirit here. We already have this like great individualistic Support network, you know and and volunteer Engagement, but I think what hands-on does is it it creates these These moments where the volunteers come together and they make meaning out of the work that they're doing together And they talk with each other kind of like what we're doing here at wiki meeting actually But they do it all the time and that that's kind of something that I take inspiration from that I I feel helps us grow and sustain the volunteers Over a very long period of time. So so that's that's one of the things that I yeah that I take inspiration from Can I ask you the same question Marianas or something? I mean and you have a really interesting background with your you came to us, you know having led a A non-profit organization on the African continent for a decade. Is there You know perhaps something from your your previous work that Inspires you now here at the wiki media foundation. I mean, I think that the reality is that The world of wiki media is so global in nature like all of the challenges in the world in some ways replicate themselves in Our world which just makes everything on the table and I think when that's the case How do you decide how to prioritize? How do you decide how to move forward and I would say the two things that really have given me inspiration that feel Relevant to to now when you're trying to do things that haven't been done before There isn't a playbook or a rulebook. And so how do you? Decide together what to do because if it's something that's already been done. It's pretty straightforward. There's like a manual There's a guide you just sort of do it and I think that that's why in-person gatherings like this are so important because often It is true that you move at the speed of people and Organizations trusting each other and so what does it take to build that by I hope building relationships being accountable You know doing the things that you say you're going to do and so I feel like I've learned certainly from That work the second thing which was true I mean youth unemployment on the African continent is like in my opinion the seminal issue for an entire continent and We're going to have a generation of young people who really are not Participants in the society and there's there's a lot there to worry about But everybody has a different approach in a different way and sometimes figuring out if we're Disagreeing about why or are we disagreeing about what or we disagreeing about how? And I have found that to be really helpful because often times We're not disagreeing about why we're not really disagreeing about what but we're disagreeing about how and that's a different kind of Conversation then then the others and so I think for me that's been a really important lesson to bring into this I'll just deal with them. Okay. Oh good. We got some more questions here So this is this is a question That regarding an issue that's kind of before your time, but I think I think you you know about it Can you comment on the office action regarding Chinese Wikipedia in in 2021? So if the person in this room asked this question I'm going to give an honest answer because I really don't comment on office actions like from a stage But it's a conversation I'd be willing to have and I just want to point out that Steven LePort Maybe Steven can raise his hand or stand up is sitting here in the front row And I think we'll be able to also provide answers to questions or have a discussion about that as well Okay, so the next the next question These are both kind of kind of around budgets You know this year that the foundation reduced some of its staff Should the affiliates expect to have to do the same in the future? I Don't think that the foundation's decision to reduce its staff has any relationship to how affiliates want to resource Themselves or staff themselves I think what we tried to do and it's all on meta and I think well documented in the annual plan is to really Look ahead and try to have multi-year projections that gave us a sense of what was needed Over the course of a three to five year period and ensure that we were growing Sustainably to be able to be responsible and also making decisions again that could last over multiple years and took the decision after Looking at a number of areas To be able to ensure that the foundation's kind of spending path was gonna get there I don't think that that relates to affiliate staff and their resourcing and their staffing in any way And then this is kind of related How much more money does the foundation need before it has enough? I guess that depends enough to do what right? Yeah, I mean you should also answer that sure so again That's exactly right is I think if we start with what we need to achieve We can work backwards to what resourcing is needed to be able to do that and again resources are money But resources are time and resources are a lot of other things as well And so I feel like we have a community with a lot of needs and in fact I think you know one of the criticisms is the foundation can't meet all of those needs And so does that require more resources for the movement then let's have that conversation I think what often gets in the way is that we might disagree about how? We distribute resources which is very different than agreeing we either need more or we want to achieve more together Or different regions of the world have different aspirations And so they should be unleashed to achieve those aspirations But you've been at this a lot longer than me. So what's your answer? Yeah, I mean I I Think it's a I don't think about it just in terms of kind of what what the needs are today But what the needs are gonna be in the future as well you know I The the primary question right is is do we think? We're we're on a path with with kind of our our our revenue models that we're gonna have a secure future Not just can we you know? Fund the needs that we need to today And you know and then I would say beyond that Are we spending every resource? You know to to its full potential right are we putting it all to to good use and this past year That's really what I've seen kind of the focus at the foundation It really wasn't about growth in fact We kind of cut back in some areas and it was making sure that every dollar was spent to the biggest impact that we Could provide And I also hear you know it just People come up to me in conferences like this Always with lots of fresh ideas things that they want funding for so I I think that I think there's there's a lot of energy in this Movement there's a lot of things that people want to do that sometimes require require resources require investment and So I don't I don't think we are our out of point where we don't know what to do I think it's we're out of point where we've had really rapid growth And we need to just focus on making sure that we're putting those resources to the best possible use and spending every donor Dollar as well as we can well Okay, this this is quite a question Okay, can I mean I guess I don't know if this question should be to me or you or who this question is to you But I'll just read it and perhaps perhaps this will be a question to the audience Can you please scream? Wikimedia loves free and open source and privacy Can you do that? again Wikimedia loves Free and open source and privacy Yes, okay Okay, we're gonna count do you have that it's all it's it's a mouthful. It's gonna be really jumbled Okay Ready? Yeah, one two three Wikimedia loves free and open source and privacy Okay, so yeah, we did that I think that's all the questions we have unless I'll give one last opportunity for someone a brave soul to ask With the microphone. Do we have any any? Oh? Oh? Oh? Oh? I see some some people. This is this is good Okay, I've got two alternative questions for both of you The first one is what's currently the biggest elephant in the room? The second one is what is the piece of puzzle you're currently missing in your walk? What is just the second one? What? What is the piece of puzzle that you are currently missing in your walk? Well, I mean I cracked a joke that this room is so big it might have enough space for all of the elephants and Again, I think what's hard is some of you maybe have been in the Wikimedia movement for a long time And so you know what a lot of the historic debates are and then there's brand new people and they're like what are all these people talking about? I actually have no idea what anybody's talking about. So again, I'll do my best maybe to cover both You know both of those I think I worry the most about what's happening in the world because again I think that we're here to deliver on this like impossible mission that requires things that have never been done before and we have to keep asking ourselves are we Doing what we need to respond to the world and the needs of the world So the trends that I talked about, you know, I think really drive a lot of the things that I worry a lot about I think the question of how do we work as a movement, you know I think I'm learning what some of those elephants are and having also come from Another volunteer led movement many of these issues are familiar, right? People have a lot of views on who should do what people have a lot of views on how should resources be allocated and used and spend So in some ways, I'm comforted that those are not unfamiliar Challenges they're ones that have to get worked through and in the Wikimedia way and kind of what the answers are for us But when I because I do I get information about Threats to our volunteers in different parts of the world That's the stuff that that's the stuff that's scary and trying to to figure out How do we ensure that our product and technology can keep up and that we can respond and that we can do those so I Think that if you piled up the elephants into it, you know, we'd be able to sort of figure it out I think the second on the puzzle and again, maybe just as context Because I really don't expect everybody to read all the emails I send But if you go look there is an email that I sent in 2022 I Think I had named five puzzles one was about what the world needs from us The second was about how do we think about? Contributions is it just about edit count or the other other ways of understanding the contributions of volunteers? The third had to do with how do we harness this multi lingualism like Selena said it's incredible to have projects in 332 languages and counting and I'm mindful a lot of these spaces are in English Which is biased for a lot of reason even an ECF and so trying to think about multi lingualism and the fourth Had to do with product and tech and the work that we have to do the fifth puzzle Nobody remembers, but it's the piece that I'm missing and so I want to answer your question which is the reality is that how you run an Organization meaning like an entity with staff is sometimes different than how we run our projects And there's been just historic tension because sometimes things work for projects. They don't work for organizations Sometimes things work for organizations. They don't work for projects and so really trying to figure out that missing puzzle piece of how organizations and projects can actually support each other not feel intentioned with each other is probably the Thing I feel like I'm missing and I'm open if anybody has any ideas. I'm all ears Yeah, so I'm gonna answer a little bit more narrowly because right now what I'd say my my focus is is very much in like the Operations and day-to-day. I just you know I've taken two departments the technology department product department and we've merged them So a lot of my work right now is like solving the puzzles and the problems and the elephants that come out of Bringing, you know, this this large group of extremely talented and passionate people together To do our work, you know, like one of the elephants that I'm working on in in this space right now is You know, what is the next evolution of media wiki as as software that we support You know and the first question that we've raised in that space is how do we sustainably support our apis going forward? So big big question many of you here. I'm sure familiar With that question, but that that's like immediately on the table and I'm lucky enough to have like a really strong leadership team that has made a list of a Lot of these elephants and they committed this year to start working through them So they've picked like for so you'll be hearing more from us about that like the as we as we Go through the year because this is actually one of the objective in key results that we published on meta for for this annual plan In terms of a missing piece of the puzzle, you know, I Think for me, I you know, I have I have so many missing So many questions on my mind so many open questions to answer One of them that I you know, it was actually raised just a little bit earlier is like things like how do we move forward, you know with the community wish list like There there are a lot of other similar questions that have to do with how do we Hear and then do something about all of the needs of the movement, you know like like how do how do we do that very consistently and You know live up to the promise of the organization and the product in tech space So so that that question is is underneath I think a lot of other like similar questions and and that's like a You know, that's a puzzle that I'm gonna probably be wrestling with the entire time that I'm here because we're just such a vast Ecosystem of projects of people languages of the whole world. So so how do we do that effectively, you know? Within the limitations of the the organization that we have and I I think we can do a lot I think we have an incredible community of volunteer contributors technical and as well as you know, every other kind of contributor, but You know figuring out how to harness that energy and apply it in in the best ways like that That's like a you know, it is a huge part of the work that you know that I think about every day And I see a question. Oh, yeah Hello, hi, this question is for Selena. I was wondering if you can talk a bit about them Hey, you recognize me. I was wondering if you can talk a bit about the changes in the annual plan from last year to this year specifically the product and technology part Yeah, thank you. Well, there there were you know, I I'll just like pick a couple things that were important to me You know This year we decided that we really wanted to engage with the community really early So starting in February We took a draft set of objectives and a description of our priorities And we published those on meta to try to start to have like a real engagement And we got a lot of feedback on it that helped us like take with our original ideas about where our priorities should be and where We should focus and evolve them, you know over the course of several months and within those priorities something that was That came out in the conversations that I was having my listening tour the conversations with staff As well as the feedback on our draft annual plan was that we needed to devote some time and resources to working on the problems and the editors with extended rights and where this came from was thinking about the Types of software problems that we have and where there was like a really kind of large maintenance backlog. So And also in within that there was like the known Maintenance backlog, but then like a lot of unknown things because there's a lot of really important Tools that editors with extended rights use functionaries, you know stewards You know folks with check user, you know all all those kinds of folks They have all these tools and we don't always know actually like what the state of those tools are So so that's like a process that we're going through now to try to understand that more So so that that was like a you know those two things just that really early Community engagement and being responsive and thinking through and trying to find the best ways to get feedback And then this this focus on editors with extended rights and you know, you'll be able to follow along We're gonna have like quarterly You know learning sessions where we report out on our progress like each quarter and then we'll be using that to inform like how We do our process next year Thank you. Is there Any other questions? Yeah, I have a question. Okay. Okay First question what songs if any are you all going to sing tomorrow night at the week carrot key and While you pond about I think only one of us is actually committed to going so I don't know that that's a fair question to everyone I said if any The second question was for Selena. You've talked about technical contributions Do you have any specific ideas about how to make it easier to? Tap into the larger technical community to make it easier to contribute to media wiki and tools Yeah, sure. Your first first question. It was heartbreaker by Pat Benatar is the song. Okay. It's a really good song and into the second question, yeah, I I You know my First idea in this space really is what I mentioned earlier I think one thing about like the ideas that I have I try to keep them like relatively simple and straightforward You know so that we actually are able to do what we say we're gonna do and my ideas Around this like start start with the API's, you know so in terms of the things that I think that we can have the most impact simplifying and Making it easier to maintain all of the APIs that we have like that's that's like a critical thing I also think you know, there's a bunch of work that our teams were already doing around the hackathon the technical contributor programs that we had so just continuing with those and then learning you know as we Tackle these API problems that we have Just learning from that and iterating over time. So that that's my idea Any other questions? Yeah. Oh look, we have one here. We have a microphone for you. Yeah. Oh good Thank you very much. So my name is Andrew. I represent one of the two sister project proposals that have been proposed since 2019 and We have been waiting for at least more than four years and it's been stuck in limbo Because and basically we have been punted around like a football We were told that approach this group and then the other group was like well You should actually talk to the other group and it is very likely that we will continue waiting for five six seven years and Currently we reside under a university Kind of like as a placeholder before we could get the approval so my question is would the foundation have like a roadmap for this kind of tiny decision because Honestly waiting for four years just for getting something approved it's a very long time and Enthusiastic volunteers that initially joined their interests start to fizzle out if you if you don't get this kind of timely decision and the second part is Would there be kind of like a strategic support for up-and-coming projects such as this one? Thank you so I think what I want to say is you're right that is a long time and this has been a priority that the board has identified and Yesterday Selena and I both attended a meeting with our board around the task force to really tackle The challenge that you've named let's be very clear what the roadmap is going to be Let's be very clear what it's going to require in terms of Approving projects or not approving projects because people want decisions is I think what I'm hearing you say and so The good news is legitimately. This is in motion. I wish I could say to you it was all solved and we had all the answers It is in motion some of the trustees that are here in the room are the ones leading that initiative in that work with us And so we can in good conscience answer the question There is a roadmap being developed so that people I think in fairness don't have to wait years and years to get An answer, but I do think there's a lot of complexity and how to give people the best possible answer of what support can or cannot be Provided and that's what Selena and the team are working with that board task force to achieve. I don't know I Think that's right. I and to the to the other question That there is an incubator program for new Wikipedia projects That's I think you know focused focused on language incubation But for broader sister projects, I'm not aware of one. I have a question Thank you so much. My name is Ruby from Ghana and I'm part of the open foundation West Africa community talking about the future of Wikimedia and looking at the world how people are searching for information differently with same tools like chat TTP and Lots more similar tools that works like chat TTP serving the world with information I'm wondering if the Wikimedia foundation is thinking about having a tool like that that Depends on Wikimedia projects because Wikimedia projects have a lot of data Information that can serve the world with credible reliable information as well for educational purposes Are we looking at creating a tool like that that can serve people from the data that we have Selena, I think that one's for you. Yeah. Yeah, great question. Thank you, Ruby So this this year another aspect of the annual plan was prioritizing Thinking about what we're calling future audiences So these are folks that may not be Served by all of the existing tools or projects that we currently have like what what might be needed You know one of the ways that we hypothesize we can reach new audiences is Maybe by finding ways of integrating and partnering with third parties. So so that's one way but to your Specific question about is there a tool that we could build, you know, you know, I maybe You know, I think that the challenge with any kind of thing that we might build that's specific to the space Is we have to find the right like product market fit basically? So if we were to do that we have to make sure that we're like You know reaching that audience that we're talking about and I'm I'm not sure today but I do have a team that is working on this and You know, they're trying to come up with different ideas to test them quickly iterate on them One of the things that they produce just in the last month was they they publish this chat GPT plug-in You know, it is it is on in open AI's like infrastructure But you know it is it is one of the ways in which we're testing out ideas like this If we were to produce something like this with a user interface like that, you know, like are we reaching that audience? so what you can expect from That team over time is that we'll keep taking ideas like that and testing them Some of that will be in our projects and in our our environments and some of them You know will not and I think through that will kind of like figure out, you know, what what is the best best way forward? Okay Well, I think that wraps up the questions. I know Marianna has one more thing she wants to say before we So I think the main thing I wanted to say is that we've been working really hard to ensure that foundation leadership Are very accessible and so I know we're on a stage, but we can all just chat as well So Lena and I and Lisa will be out at the conference I just wanted to introduce the rest of our senior team so that again if you have an opportunity Or have questions that you just approach folks directly And get answers to those questions So maybe I'll say who they are and they can stand up and just so you know Hi, maybe a Gomez who's our chief financial officer if you want to ask about how we spend our money He's a good person to ask our general counsel also a long-term Member of the Wikimedia movement Steven the port Steven can help answer questions about regulatory or legal matters Our chief communications officer Anush Ali Khan and Anusha's team is the one running Wikimania and she's available It's only day four. So I'll be gentle because our new Chief talent and culture officer overseas our HR and people function is their Courtney Basharizan So she is getting inducted into the Wikimedia movement by being here which is amazing and so all of us are available We're happy to talk directly answer any questions that we can and if we don't know the answers At least do our best to try to point you in the right direction and get help I think on day four Courtney still gets to ask you questions. So That'll change soon But I just want to say thank you to everybody who who submitted questions I want to thank everybody who came both online and and here in person want to thank Selena and Mariana for all your thoughtful answers to the questions and As Mariana said, this is not, you know, we're out of time here for this session But we are available to answer questions For the for there are remaining time here and of course always online. So again, thank you And we'll go on to have an amazing Wikimedia and over the next couple days. Thank you, Lisa. Yeah, thank you, Lisa Thank you to Mariana and Selena and Lisa And just for everybody, we're trying to organize a big group attendee photo here at quarter to five So stick around we'll move you around. We'll hopefully get a really nice shot of everybody So come back if you are moving for for 45


Good day everybody and welcome back to the Thomas Hanley YouTube channel or welcome indeed because this video today we're gonna be talking about who exactly is Thomas what is this channel about this is basically an introductory video to everything me and my channel what you can expect by joining subscribing being a part of this community let us get into it without further ado this is going to be a little bit of a taster for who I am as a creator what content you can expect from me my hopes for the community what I personally want to achieve with my online advocacy work and why I'm actually creating content in the first place let's talk a little bit about who I am versus who I am not I am not a qualified doctor or psychologist I am a lived experience educator and writer meaning that please do not take any of my advice about such medical or psychological things without cross-examining it with a professional however this does allow me to have a little bit more creative freedom to integrate my own sort of theories and ideas about autism neurodiversity and mental health without having to stick to such a stringent kind of medical view I guess my whole approach to creating content is chiefly from integrating my own personal experience as an autistic person with mental mental illness like depression anxiety and such into stuff that I've researched stuff that I've learned about I've got a big background of working in both schools working in the social sort of inclusion charity sector as well as a biomedical science graduate from the University of Manchester so I've got pretty much quite a wide array of insights into lots of different topics and I like to combine them all into one video which hopefully gives you a bit of a both a medical kind of psychological view as well as more of an experiential sociopolitical view of autism I also want to highlight the time of voice and I am not an expert I hope that through my videos you don't copy and paste my particular views or think that my views and my experiences and my sort of ideas about autism are completely comprehensive and completely understood and similar to every single other professional or lived experience advocate out there that is definitely not not what I want to do I want to be a contributor I don't want to be a monolith so I very much encourage anybody who watches my stuff my channels listens to my views and opinions to formulate their own and let me know I won't go too much into my personal like personality profile traits my particular sort of political leanings or thoughts about a wide array of different things but I do want to mention that a lot of my views tend to be very moderate so I tend to sit pretty centreline on a lot of things deviating here and there I like to think of myself as a free thinker so I don't particularly have any camp or any sort of side I'm very much a free thinker I very much take things as they are try and process them understand them see if I relate to them or I agree with them and I either take them on board or I dispose of them so I'm not very radical I would say of course that's going to be in my own subjective opinion but I like to take a little bit more of a sensible kind of mature approach to different topics and not be like this very aggressive sort of militant advocacy type of person I'm very much in with the whole neurodiversity perspective and with sort of the whole disability autism communities but I do also see a lot of the opinions and sides of other people perhaps in the medical community with parents and also people in the mainstream people who aren't autistic who don't necessarily have the sociopolitical and psychological understanding of autism so hopefully this can be somewhat of a middle ground for everybody to come here discuss things share their experiences that would be great so what can you expect from my channel I do want to put a big sort of banner at the top of this because the consistently consistency at which I put out content will vary very much depending on how I'm feeling and I'm not just don't just mean in general I mean I have to deal with quite a lot of mental health conditions depression anxiety sometimes to a very severe degree which means that I can't always function so all of this stuff that I'm mentioning here this is my ideal this is what I can do with my time when my mental illness is at a manageable level you can expect monthly 40 autie podcasts before I used to do them weekly and bi-weekly nowadays I'm wanting to pivot a little bit more into doing a lot more YouTube content but that doesn't mean that it's going to be out of the way you have all of this season one season two episodes live on my channel and I will be trying to put out season three episodes with particular individuals that I find particularly interesting hopefully every month or so you can expect weekly presentation videos just like this where I'm talking here and there's a little window here where I'm talking about a specific topic those are becoming out weekly because they do take me quite a while to edit make record all of that kind of stuff right make the presentations so every week mostly you can also expect me to do weekly live reaction streams these are streams about anywhere from two to four hours where I will react to some mainstream of popular autism community content on YouTube give my thoughts on it the whole idea behind this is that I want to try and challenge a lot of the ideas that are out there in the mind mainstream add in my own lived experience perspective and knowledge about autism to hopefully try and illuminate different aspects of autism that people in the mainstream don't understand it's also about trying to bring up people's voices within the community trying to amplify their message a lot more but also to add different aspects that I understand in terms of my knowledge different experiences that I've seen throughout my time as an advocate in the community try and add that in into something that's hopefully going to be quite transformative you can also expect weekly auto time Q&A live streams which I will do both on Instagram and YouTube it's about an hour where you can ask me anything about the content that I'm creating any particular questions that you have about me mental health fitness self-improvement that is a place to do it not always the best with the comments but I do try can also expect some bi-weekly blogs that I put out both on Instagram and YouTube which are pretty much sort of 10 page sort of detailed kind of blogs about a particular autism concept and lots of other sort of image and video related content resources you might have seen some of my reels out there sort of different sections of clips from my presentation videos as well as some of my gym stuff so that's pretty much what I'm doing in terms of content creation and I'm still working on it so it may change up a little bit but that is roughly what you can expect from me now I want to highlight that please skip ahead I do have markers down in the comments and I realize that not everybody wants to hear someone tell me tell them about what they're selling what you want them to buy so skip ahead if you do if you don't want to but I do sell memberships as cheap as I can make them I tried tried to make them as cheap and accessible as I can and with memberships you'll get a little neurodiversity badge that levels up every like month for two months or three months or like year and that will be next to your name meaning that you'll have priority in comments and chats particularly in lives or on videos early video access into some things and also long form stream access so you can see a sort of clips and segments of live streams that I've done in the videos that I create but if you want to watch the entire thing sort of raw and uncut that is in the membership section as I'll talk Thomas sessions which are informal 50 minute chats where you can ask me anything about autism it's not medical advice or professional advice but if you do want to talk to me about something related to autism and you want to get my thoughts on certain things then that is a place to go I also do training and public speaking so if you have a workplace who want to do some diversity and inclusion training I can provide that both online and in person can also do public speaking in events schools anything of that nature send me an email hi at thomashenley.co.uk you can find it in the description if you want me to be a part of that in the future I am working on doing a bit more consultancy with different companies particularly around media and charitable ventures basically using my own sort of lived experience to support someone creating something related to autism I'm also going to be doing some courses on certain things of my own sort of personal development what I would encourage other people to do and some workbooks as well which I am in the midst of creating so what about the community like what am I hoping for with our community there are a lot of communities out there and I think one of one of the issues that I found particularly with autistic communities is that there can be a lot of social dogma a lot of sort of flippant throwing around of slurs and a lot of kind of battling like a kind of phrase that is like militant self-advocacy basically people assuming the worst of intentions and fighting and arguing and such this is not a place for that I don't particularly like that kind of behaviour I think we can all have very sensitively approached mature conversations about certain things without throwing around any of this kind of language it's a personal opinion for my page very moderate not very radical I understand not not the most fun but I would appreciate it if people were to have a little bit more conscious of how their words can impact other people make sure you challenge the opinion and not the person if someone has an opinion particularly and you don't like it perhaps criticise the opinion and not the person who's saying about making assumptions and such this is of course a neurodiverse space now people often get that confused neurodiverse means everybody basically everybody is neurodiverse because neurodiverse is kind of like a categorisation for a group of people if people have different neurodivergencies within that group it's considered to be neurodiverse you don't have to be autistic to be part of this community and if anybody tells that you that you can't be a part of this community because you're not autistic don't listen to them because you are it's not a solely neurodivergent space or like a safe space for neurodivergence I hope it is going to be a safe space for people but it's not like a dedicated space for autistic people I want to try and get this weird out get this education out lived experience education be it two people outside of the community in hopes that we can do some real change in our society and the more people that we can get on board the more support that we can get the better so with this if you are autistic be mindful that there may be some people who come in asking questions or saying things which very much counteract go against or upset kind of the socio-political narrative within the autistic community some people might not use the right language some people might assume the wrong thing some people might understand concepts the wrong way try and approach it with an air of sensitivity and an air of trying to understand what they're trying to say and don't necessarily assume the worst because that is the best way of turning people away from understanding the autistic experience what do I want to do long term through the future I want to educate about autism obviously from my own lived experience blended in from my experiences with other people both online and in person from different sectors of the autism world blending in with what I've personally researched too I don't know if I said that maybe I did I also want to challenge and comment on other online content I feel like there isn't a lot of autism voices in the world to counteract a lot of the misinformation misunderstandings or mischaracterizations of autism in the mainstream spheres so I'm going to try as I'm possible as much as possible to try and counteract a little bit of that add in a bit of the autistic lived experience sort of socio-political element of it and also my understanding of autism through the research I also want to give my own personal experiences and knowledge on videos from other autistic people talking about autism not to be an asshole or not to be like a devil's advocate kind of critiquing person but I think the more that we can do to amplify each other's voices sort of teaches each other learn more about autism look at different perspectives the better we will be as a community online hopefully with this I can bring some different diverse voices together onto the channel to stimulate a bit of conversation I mean even just looking at like some of the comments that I get when I'm doing my reaction live streams it can sometimes be really informative for me to understand different perspectives and views on different autism topics I do hope to offer some new insights and perspectives from my own personal self-development journey this will mean some content which is geared towards understanding and moving past certain negative things that we can experience having new perspectives on certain things understanding things in a in a more wide sort of perspective that is going to be something that I want to do but I also want to add in a little bit of my own personal flash so I will show off my special interests which are bodybuilding you know going to the gym strength fitness um combat sports sometimes a little bit of gaming and my music taste and such so if you see some stuff like that don't be like whoa what is this channel about it's just a little bit of personal flair if you don't like it I understand but this is my channel I think lastly I do want to touch on the reasons as to why I started and why I want to do this online work the thing is I have been creating for a long time both on YouTube and on other social media sites it's only recently that I've taken the decision to take it a lot more seriously to become self-employed not only just do YouTube but to do my training consultancy and my workbooks and such for a long time it has very much been a passion project of mine something very dear and close to my heart but I do really want to focus on it a lot more and if I want to focus it on a lot more I need to make it my job to do more of it the ignition for me doing this awareness work doing this kind of educational content is because I saw a university through doing one of my projects as part of my degree my film and sort of the the matching sort of literature review that I did that there are a lot of aspects to autistic people's lives which are not very good meaning that we do have a lot of negative experiences both personally and with other people and I'm hoping that with the work that I do I can illuminate some of the changes that we could make both in employment in terms of protection in terms of awareness in education and also the quality of mental health support that autistic people get I also want to challenge and change the mainstream I want to grow and amplify the voices of other actually autistic individuals dispel some of the stigmas and stereotypes try and insert more autistic voices autistic opinions autistic people into the mainstream I when we're talking about concepts related to autism neurodiversity etc the main reason for me doing all of this work the reason why I started when I started all those years ago trying to sort with my own sort of passion project is because I had a really difficult life and I have had a lot of things in my life which have been great like objectively but I've had a bad experience of life when it's come to my overall kind of life quality and happiness and such and some of that is due to the experiences that I've had some of which is due to my mental health conditions but I don't want to see other people go through similar things to me and so all the work that I do the things that I put out I try to do because I want to help people or I want to add to the conversation about autism add new perspectives help people change their minds help people see some of the very very clear statistics that are out there on life quality but also to understand them as a result of lack of inclusion and not necessarily due to inherent difficulties that autistic people have like this video because it's probably not going to get pushed out a lot and it's just going to set on my channel but like it and that would help me out a lot and if you do want to join me on my journey of everything autism and learn a bit more about the autistic experience from my perspective go ahead and subscribe and consider becoming a member to support me in my self-employed journey so that's a little bit about what I want to do and if you do want to understand a little bit more about my history in my past why I'm doing all of this stuff just this kind of slide in general why I really want to help people I'd really point you to this video which will tell you all about my experience my life with autism from being a very little small child to a bodybuilding adult as I am today let me know


live for October is pinktober day nine that's correct day nine okay so we're going to set up the camera as per usual like this and like that and like that and uh okay so this was yesterday's inktober piece which came out great still here hi afternoon afternoon great to see people in here at this time of day hi hello local vampire hi rain cloud i love you are so much thank you so much still here good morning hello where are everyone tuning in from i'm here in my cellar in saalhus outside of bergen norway where are everyone watching from let's uh begin by removing yesterday's piece england main east coast you say okay florida the dickstar sydney just watching a bunch of your videos and the live stream went up excellent good timing maryland chattanooga oklahoma vermont texas a lot of americans what time is it college dorms college dorms college dorms love your nail polish today thank you brazil now it's early early in the morning for some half past two in the afternoon for me okay so what we've been doing this is the inktober is pinktober stream number nine and what we've been doing is we've been starting with writing the uh almost signing the image writing them thingamabob uh the keyword for today oh for some it is night time i almost put the yeah the ink monster number but this isn't an ink monster drawing and today there will not be any ink monster on the live because i've already done one and hey hey spooky season and i've um i i don't have a lot of time today so i need to be quick in and out and i'm going to solve this very simply so you like dnd can you please draw dnd monsters i like dnd i can't draw dnd monsters because i release all my art for free use so anyone can download and change and even sell my art and you can't do that with intellectual property that others have the right to um but i but most of the dnd monsters are just monsters and i can do that i draw monsters that fit into um that fit into dnd let's do it some more where did i put that thing that thing the thing thing thing all i know is how to make stink monsters oh happy stream thank you for dropping by and saying hi i didn't know you streamed i've been streaming every day of october and you know i'm going to stream more regularly after october as well but not every day but this has been a nice change of pace for me it's been hard start for on the month but uh lovely as well thank you any questions while i work on this thingamabob have you ever done sculpting not much not much i'm my mind isn't rigged for sculpting so i've tried it and but i don't i don't think in terms of sculpture i do think in terms of in terms of um 2d pictures and story mostly i think in terms of story and sculpture is a tough storytelling medium what kind of ink to use right now i'm using eco line um liquid watercolors and then i'll be switching to uh regular indian ink for the for the the the black lines you i've been trying some of your techniques to get my brain from painting with oils to watercolor thank you for listening listing requirements here i feel i can move more freely now excellent i struggle with watercolor at least with using watercolor as watercolor so right now i'm using watercolor as if it was ink and it is for all intents and purposes this is still an ink drawing even if some of the material i use is watercolor it's not the watercolor painting loosening up requirements uh that makes more sense i was like did i list require i i don't remember listing requirements but uh that wasn't that wasn't it was it i do too i find i got a lot better layering watercolor as if it were oil yeah so i learned to work in oil only a few years ago hmm and that sort of cracked the code for painting for me because i am primarily a drawer a draftsman not a painter um and painting and drawing are not the same they're kind of kind of the opposite so when you're i've talked about this before but when you're drawing when you're drawing you are uh you're are constantly playing with negative space um so the most of the lines you put down are not supposed to represent anything at all they are not really in the world you're drawing they are lines that delineate the negative space where the where the viewer the beholder can imagine the picture so um drawing is about drawing things that are not there to make people see them there and then painting is about laying down uh blots of color that represent things in the world so it it is sort of exactly the opposite that doesn't mean they don't go hand in hand because they absolutely do but but in terms of mindset it is completely different and but that doesn't mean you have to use you know if you paint and draw with the same mindset that's fantastic great for you and uh you do you but uh how can i say it um hi mona uh let me see i lost my train of thought hello okay did you have to learn how to see in negative space or did it come naturally i mean negative space isn't a concept that exists in reality it is not something you see in reality it's not something you're born seeing it is a way of um structuring the drawing i can show you quickly after i've done this one because this is going to be the whole damned drawing i don't want to do anything more than this i need a cherry tree so very simple very very minimal but i can show you very quickly afterwards black ink is um indian ink from talons i buy it because that's the brand that the local store sells liter bottles of that's uh that's the reality of why i use that specific ink and it's good i love it but there's so many other good inks some are too thin for me some are too thick for me a lot are just right the goldilocks ink okay so that was today's inktober piece that went well and go to a dentist jared okay so let's find another piece of paper you can use this one okay so let's say we're going to draw um let's do two quick pictures so here is a picture of a person and another person and some clouds okay now when you're drawing a picture of people the negative space is a couple of places okay so first of all there's negative space here that makes up the face but you you'd think of that as positive space even though it's not supposed there's nothing there and there's negative space here and there's negative space here and of course there's negative space here the main negative space in this drawing since it's a drawing of faces is all the background area that's the negative space in this one okay then we're going to do almost the same uh drawing we're going to change color we're going to do the same drawing except this time we are painting the sky with two people blocking it and some nice clouds here so in one of the pictures the background was the negative space in the other the foreground characters becomes the negative space and that's the thing about negative space it's all the space that you don't want the viewer the beholder to think about it's space that's the function of that space is to lead the eye to the interesting points so if you do a sky painting with some figures the point of those figures is to lead the eye into interesting stuff happening in the sky and if you do a portrait of two people with skies in the background then the function of the sky is to draw the attention to the faces the negative space is whatever is not supposed to be in focus so you that's not something you're born naturally seeing it's not something you have to have talent to see or to use it is it is something that it's a trick you use to to structure a hierarchy of importance in your drawing the negative space has another function and the positive space is the primary function so if we do another i'm just going to show you a way to practice negative space we're going to draw a face and we're going to draw the standard face like this like this this and this this is a face perfect okay um now with that face we're going to do some heavy shadows we're gonna shadow in the ears i'm gonna have some dramatic shadows in the eyes okay and then this we're gonna make it even more like this even something like that so the way to practice your negative space skills is to draw something like this and then once it's dry and i don't have the time to let it dry now just erase the lines and see if it still works okay and you can overdo it for instance and for instance if i was to create this shape like that it's not necessarily enough to see what it is but if i add a little like that you see it more clearly so it's about finding the balance of what outlines do you need to interpret that space as positive and what outlines can you can you just remove and the brain will still sort the negative and positive space um i don't know if it's the gestalt principle i've never gotten my head around what the gestalt principle is except that it's got something to do with that what i do um i'll show you a little thing more because okay we'll continue on this one even though even though there's no outlines here you still see that this is a different color from this both are white but your mind sees this as a different color from this okay but you know your mind reckons that this is probably some sort of skin color so it can't be a light skin color it can be a dark skin color it's some sort of skin color but your mind has no idea what color the background is that's just white now okay and now we're going to color the background using black and white what color is the background now it's blue because that's clearly a blue sky and that's everything important in this drawing it is done with with how can i say it it's done by manipulating negative space and it would be the exact same if i did an outline around it if i did an outline around him and this is his head i'm just messing with this outline your brain still interprets the drawing in the exact same way these lines don't exist in your brain and this is skin color and this is blue okay so when wanting to learn negative space do exercises where you can see how many of the outlines you can remove and the brain still makes sense of the image okay good luck luck with that i have to end the stream because we did today's pink pinktober and i inktober is pinktober picture using steward samples pinktober prompt list the prompt for today is i need and i do need a territory if you like my art and you want to get some of it then you can go to den unge had holm and use the discount code inktober 23 for 20 of all october if you want to support but don't want to buy my art then please do go to patreon.com slash kim holm patreon is where you can pay one dollar a month to support or more a month to support and patreon gives me a hope of financial security that is very hard to get other through other means as a independent artist and if you don't want to use any money or don't have any money to use and you still want to support then you can share my art you can download it copy it you can change it make it your own you can even sell it as long as you put my name on it and even if you're selling it and don't share a dime of profit with me you are supporting me through spreading my art and spreading my name and that was today's live stream and i'll be back with another one tomorrow tomorrow tomorrow a live stream tomorrow


I really hate to say this, but I think America has finally gone tyrannical against its own citizens. Yesterday, Proud Boys leader Enrique Torrio was sentenced to a whopping 22 years in prison for his part in the January 6 protest in a trial that started out with leaked chat logs from an FBI special agent that showed she had been ordered by her boss to destroy evidence. And yes, I'm calling it a protest because if you go back and look at media reports of every left-wing Democrat riot over the last 10 years, what you're gonna find is that no matter how violent they get, it's always called a protest. Moms of Democrats violently attack innocent people at a Trump event in San Jose while carrying Mexican flags, and they're still called protesters. Moms of Democrat voting communists launch a full-scale attack against police protecting a statue, and somehow it's still called a protest. Calls for violence from prominent BLM leaders and the ensuing rallies that lead to actual riots, destroyed neighborhoods, towns, businesses, and deadly ambushes against cops and innocent people. Protesters! They can threaten Supreme Court judges at their homes before they make a major ruling that results in an attempted assassination of three judges. And yet they are still called protesters. Attack the White House with the goal of taking Trump out of it that results in Trump being rushed to a bunker around 60 injured Secret Service agents and a historic church that was set on fire. All charges dropped and they're still called protesters. So as far as I'm concerned, January 6th was a protest, especially since out of 120,000 people, only around 300 actually fought with riot police, which is a drop in the bucket for the Democrat mobs. So I'm gonna do my best as a stay-at-home dad with four kids and very little free time to break down what I think about this insane sentence. So stick around and check it out. Real quick, I want to let you all know about a friend of mine, someone many of you know as Let's Be Frank from YouTube, who's in need of help after Hurricane Adalia nearly wiped out his home that he shares with his wife and children. It's not a total loss and the house can be repaired, but they don't have insurance and need any help they can get. I know you're all a very giving audience and so I'm gonna share a link to his Gifts and Go campaign that was started by Sarah Kane, the Crusader Gal. If you can help, please do. Thank you. Okay, so for a moment, let's just set aside all the suspicious crap around January 6th, like Ray Epps, the lack of security and the fat Capitol Police just let people in. What exactly did Enrique do to justify a 22-year sentence? According to NPR, he got 22 years, which is more than rapists and murderers sometimes get, for quote, conspiring to stop the certification of the 2020 presidential election results in Congress. Tario was also convicted for obstructing an official proceeding, conspiracy to prevent an officer from discharging their duties, and obstruction of law enforcement during a civil disorder, and destruction of government property with a value over $1,000. That first one sounds very nefarious, but I could say the exact same thing about Democrats in the year 2000 and again in 2004. In 2000, Democrats hatched schemes to stop the certification of Florida, and then Ohio in 2004. These efforts failed, but if simply conspiring to stop the certification process is worth 22 years, then it seems like the Democrats have some explaining to do. The second list of charges there all sound like things that happen at every single Democrat protest. Democrats stop official government proceedings all the time, like when they tried to stop the certification of Brett Kavanaugh on the Supreme Court, or the numerous theatric stunts they've carried out in Tennessee recently. It was a storming of the Capitol on the state level. They shouted out lawmakers who were going about their business in the building. Oh, that was different. Preventing police from carrying out their duties? Again, classic Democrat left-wing BLM and Antifa stuff that went on for years, and with all the charges dropped. Destruction of government property? Do I even need to? And oh, by the way, almost none of those cases are being prosecuted. But wait a minute, was Enrique even there? I'm actually not sure about that, and I've tried to find out, but I know that he had been banned from DC for the high crime of burning a BLM flag, albeit someone else's property. But come on, I've been told my entire life that the most American thing you can do is burn a flag, but as usual, that standard only applies to them, not you, not me, and not Enrique. What makes this conviction and sentence even more alarming is that there's apparently no evidence for any of it. What? Number one, there was no plan to storm the Capitol. Two, there was no plan to stop the certification. And three, one of them was in prison in a different city at the time. Apparently, this conviction is based on something called an unspoken plan. According to the New York Times, in a series of searches before the trial began, investigators collected more than a half a million text messages from the Ministry of Self-Defense and other Proud Boy group chats. While some of the messages were overtly violent and hinted at action at the Capitol, none set forth an explicit plan to storm the building or to forcibly disrupt the election certification taking place inside. What? Even if there were no explicit orders to attack the Capitol that day, he said, members of the group believed there was an implicit agreement to band together and to take lead in waging an all-out revolution to stop Mr. Biden from entering the White House. Judge Kelly's ruling allowed prosecutors to introduce damning evidence about the violent behavior and aggressive language of members of the Proud Boys who had only limited connections to the five defendants? What? What did I just read? You're telling me that these people were convicted and given up to 22 years based on the assumptions and testimony of people who the court even admits had limited connections to the five defendants? It goes on. The rulings also permitted jurors to convict on conspiracy even if they found there was no plan to disrupt the certification of the election. All of these guys are being convicted and sentenced up to 22 years for what amounts to rioting because there's literally no evidence of plans outside of that, which again blows my mind considering that Ray Epps is on video for multiple days and nights telling people to enter the Capitol and is even on video at the forefront of the protests when those riots started. Yet was never charged and was presented as a victim by the media. The very same media that was integral in creating the false insurrection narrative that from the very beginning was built on lies. But you don't even have to take it from me. Just listen to Nancy Pelosi's daughter who was caught on video admitting what is very plain for everybody to see. Considering that the shaman who did not... I mean, what did the shaman do? He stood there, right? I told you, he stood there. The shaman got how many of us? 41 to very eight. So when I saw that, and I think that the government is going to go for... that they're going to walk to get bigger but people are criticizing some of the... Alright folks, that's all I have for that one. If you enjoyed it, please hit that like button, share, subscribe, hit that bell notification and let us all know what you think about this in the comment section. I'll see you all in the next one.


What's going on y'all Chris from Jasper's case breaks.com. I got a 2015 a Mac good collegiate multi sport one box break number 29 RnB Bennett was nice enough to buy every spot in this break. So Bennett. Thank you very much just for the practice like we've been doing all day I'm gonna do the R&B break anyway. You'll all get all cards all spots I just need to keep doing it to get better at it So here is our names Bennett 1 to 10 our last spot in mojo at the bottom there and then 1 to 0 We'll do a dice roll for both 6 and 1 is 7 so 7 times 1 2 3 4 5 6 and last one 7 So there it is Bennett down to Bennett with spot number 5 being that last spot in mojo And then same thing 1 to 0 6 and 1 7 times good luck 1 2 3 4 5 6 and last one 7 right here So you have in this order 9 7 1 2 last spot mojo a spot 4 rnb number 4 8 3 5 0 and 6 This all sell up and printed Are we talking g-man like football giants to oh tim well i see your name I respectfully disagree As obviously i'm a big twins fan big twins fan While we're switching over and getting our our sheet printed out we're gonna do a little dice roll So we have two boxes One of these will be for a future break, but we'll roll for our box now So 1 2 and 3 we for the top box 4 5 and 6 would be for the bottom 4 so bottom box We'll grab this box and put it back on a locker that should be on the website soon That'll be our 30th of the immaculate collegiate Here we go Bennett SF giants of all the people who work here. I don't think any of them are giant fans not yet at least So here's Bennett zero to nine. Thanks again Bennett. Good luck Let's have some fun Crazy checklist very weird checklist.  They must have Me I can't even unironically joke. They're like, oh, maybe I'll show up next week with my giant's jersey on that would never happen It would never ever happen I'll wear a rocky's jersey You know, I'll wear a Delaware, you know Brandon Webb debacks jersey. I'll wear a tag team squadron's jersey I'll never wear a giant's jersey. All right, Bennett. Thanks again Nice Joe All right Bennett, good luck. I had to write the first light. Excuse me. I don't even use the box card one Michael Carter Williams 28 out of 99 former rookie of the year He had his greatest game and game number one of his NBA career against the reigning NBA champion On almost a quad double And then one could be an average NBA player next one Bobby Portis NBA champ nine out of 99 That goes to spot nine Bennett I'll that's the only time I'll do that joke. Yeah, but the Rockies are bad Uh JT snow I don't know man I don't know The only one I would kind of think about is Tim lincegum or willy mace, but willy mace feels like cheating It's more like jt. No, exactly That's a nice one though man There shouldn't there's an altered universe where Kersh Jared Weaver Tim lincegum jpv Brandon Webb are like Dominating pitching the world still I'm gonna be sad. All right back to the break first hit Nice 17 out of 99 from the cow golden bears mark canna Still playing now in new york met But it was an oakland day for a while. He's a good one 17 out of 99 would do the spot. So next one wow Different product same guy eric dickerson patch on a 13 of 49 We saw him earlier. We did from that nt football. This is a cool looking patch It looks like not a jersey Any thoughts on what this could be fellas? looks like I don't want to say cleat, but Something crazy. I think that is part of the jersey Just oh, oh, it's just from the mesh old school mesh jersey. Yeah, it's the old school mesh on those jerseys. Interesting next auto Another guy's still playing kevon looney still with the uh golden state warriors big immaculate jumbo's patch 91 out of 99 ucla fight fight fight Next hit Clive wallford from the university of miami 71 out of 99 next one Devin funches. Wow another throwback 85 of 99 devin funches bunches of funches 85 of 99 on card auto Go blue michigan wolverines And our last card for bennett. Thanks again bennett. Good luck duke Patch auto of ties jones three color patch a little bit of white a little bit of black a lot of bit of blue On card ties jones patch auto 35 of 99 All right, that is gonna do it bennett. Thanks again for giving this break filled out. We should have Uh break r&b number 30 on the site now or very very soon. Thanks again y'all appreciate it. We'll be back very very soon Jasper skates breaks.com