530 I guess we'll start the public works meeting We'll call who do we have online here? Do you have everyone online? Oh? Marcus and Betty are online Marcus Betty is a rose. Okay Alrighty, we'll start out with the pledge allegiance Under God Well, we've got a pretty big Crawl here, I think we're gonna just do a quick introduction to everyone here. My name is Dean Decker I'm all the person from the sixth district and chairman of the committee Ryan Sorenson Alderman district eight vice chair of the committee District five all the person Make sure it's bright Okay, and Betty actually just messaged the group. She's online as well. Okay, Betty actually is online and we also have Tom's Cameron Chuck Adams Who else and who's and Mark Woodstock from a spotter? Alrighty? We'll start out with 2.1 approval minutes Move for approval with motion in second in the discussion All in favor Motion passes resolution 3.1 resolution 8 8 2-20-21 September 8th 2020 4.6 resolution authorizing enter into a master development agreement with stonebook crossing LLC. I will move for approval Oh, sure. Yeah, I was gonna read the amount. I'm sorry that that's quite all right I basically what you have in front of you is the master development agreement This has been a result of negotiations between Warner homes development as well as city staff and We have director of planning Chad in the audience as well as Ryan myself city administrator wolf as well as I believe city attorney Adams is on the line and I know there's a couple of minor amendments that will be needed to be made this evening in regard to this but this really Basically sets the terms and conditions and the Understandings between the city and and in Warner homes in terms of the master development agreement of the stonebook crossing subdivision Mainly we're from the public work standpoint. We're looking at the infrastructure the roads the sewer system water mains and the storm drainage resulting from this this this development and Disagreement lays out the responsibilities Location and so forth as well as what those final improvements should be prior to the city accepting those So the responsibility will be on the developer to install this build this to our standards and our specifications Ultimately, which will become part of the city infrastructure network So that's just a broad overview and I guess what I'd like to do mr. Chairman if it's okay if if Chad or our city administrator wolf have any further Things they'd like to add Ross from Warner homes here is is here to also be in attendance to add to the conversation as well as I'd like to also Attorney Chuck Adams spent Considerable amount of time Assuring that the right terms and conditions and things would be accounted for in this agreement. So Motion to approve the RO but there should be a second so you have the item on the floor to discuss Is there a second for the motion? Yeah, okay now go ahead and discuss it and then when we get around to it I'll read the amendment for everybody so that rest of you don't have to okay Mr. Wolf, thank you chair I just wanted to let the committee know that this has been a project that we've been working on for quite a while It's a very positive again. It's a great relationship and partnership that we've been working on we need single-family development and if you remember this originally started with a parcel of land there's a park and we were looking to move it and change it and The the group was able to maintain its location. We're actually adding some park to that area and Ross and his team basically were able to adjust the roads and structures of the of the homes to Accommodate and work around it. So for me, this is something that I'm very passionate about I'm I think that it's another good example of how the city is working with businesses and the growth of the city And this also part takes into I believe it's our today team So this is again, it's gonna show some some development that the city needs and the community needs and it's gonna help our our today team So, thank you Jen Thank you. So just kind of mimicking what alder City administrator wolf said Alderman wolf We this is as Dave said this has been a long process the I want to thank Ross for his time and effort Working with us to get through this as Dave said this typically in the past the city has done the infrastructure and this is Putting the honest back on the developer to do so This is a major project for us. It'll be a hundred and thirty four lots It'll provide us with some opportunities for single-family housing in this time in the city probably the first time in 15 years like 15-18 years rolling meadow subdivision on the north side was the last one and then a small addition that they've done with about 10 or 12 homes Maybe or so down on 14 homes down there So this is this is a good step in the right direction as we try to balance out our Apartments and our single family and providing more opportunities to bring people here for jobs and stuff in the community So, thank you already Any other discussion from the Alders I Just want to make it that I want to thank the staff for all the all your hard work in this This is really been this is this is this is a positive This is a real positive for the city that we actually have some single-family homes coming up in that now and In a development like this add to our tax base So I'm really excited about it. So Not for the I guess we have to vote on we have to amend it now or do we have so I'm going to move to amend this document and I will ask City Attorney to read the aforementioned motion So the amendment would be to amend the RO so as to adopt the most recent version of the agreement a Copy of which is included with all changes noted in board docs But with the following additional changes beyond those indicated in board docs A to amend the depth of the asphaltic binder course in article 7 section b paragraph 3 From 1 and 3 quarters inches to 2 and a quarter inches B to amend the depth of the asphaltic surface course in article 7 section b Paragraph 7 from 2 and a quarter inches to 1 and 3 quarters inches B to amend the main or largest paragraph of the legal description and exhibit a as follows First to remove the comment in the fourth line after the word dense Second to remove the phrase quote feet to a point in the easterly extension of the north line of romer ponder state A recorded subdivision in said southeast quarter and quote that is from lines seven and eight third to change the distance listed as 412.97 feet in line 20 to instead read 361.16 feet Fourth to indicate in the 23rd line that the boundary line shall travel along the north line of lands Described in volume 1061 page 876 and 877 rather than the south line Fifth to indicate in the final two lines lines 43 and 44 At the boundary line as it returns to the point of beginning shall rather than traveling east 33 0.00 feet to the point of beginning shall travel North 90 degrees zero minutes zero seconds east along said south line 33.00 feet to the point of beginning And d to amend said legal description so as to append the following language at the end quote together with those lands line between said meander line and the center line of said stream All right, thank you Chuck Did we get a second on that amendment? We need a second on the amendment. I would second that Okay, we have a motion So now I guess a second Both on the amendment first all those in favor of the amendment Hi to Betty said I too Okay, and uh chair boats I motion passes now we'll go back to the original motion uh All those in favor Aye Chair votes aye motion passes Move on to resolution three point or three point two resolution 83 20 September 8th document 4.7 resolution authorizing entering into an agreement with making spirits bright incorporated For use of evergreen park and the core use center for the annual making spirits bright drive through holiday lights display Uh, I believe we have some people here from making spirits bright Um Also, so I'll start out with the chair or sorry sir. Um, thank you, mr. Chairman I'm going to defer to joe kerlin our park superintendent of parks and forestry He's been working quite extensively with the making spirits bright Group but this this this is not new. We've we've had this agreement in place um very successful um event that provides great community support through the food bank and It's been really popular. So what we what we want to do is and I think making spirits bright is here as well That we give them the chance to speak on some of the needs for these changes because of the growth of the event as well as um The the the challenges in terms of trying to move in and out at such a tight time frame and again The department supports this these changes that are in front of you this evening But again, I'm going to defer to joe here and then I think it would be appropriate to maybe allow making spirits bright Have an opportunity to explain themselves as well. Okay. Thank you Thank you. David. Yeah, uh, David said it very well There's as you see on the IFC there's six changes Probably one of the biggest one is is just extending um The the time that they have to to get out of the park and one one thing I really want to stress is And that that in no means means they're gonna drag their feet trying to get out and and the department of public works Is either even made a commitment to work with the group to make sure that um, they get out of the park in the timely fashion um, especially when there's snowfall that we can um, I you know, actually get out and and Groom keep grooming the trails We've we've worked hard for the last seven years. I came into this after the first year and We've been working both with making spirits bright and and and The ski groomers that volunteer their their their time to go out and and groom the ski trails It's every year we go through things how we can make things better Um This agreement is really a five-year agreement Basically with just a few changes from the last five-year agreement First few years. We really try to go through things. We're always constantly trying to improve for both making spirits bright and and providing Skiing during that time and that's a difficult time last year. There wasn't even snow But we are providing areas where they can ski the main concern tonight is just passing this so Um, we have an agreement A five-year agreement with making spirits bright Um, if I have any any questions on these I'd be happy to answer them or we can refer to making spirits bright I guess I'll start out with the first question. It's um, I the one the question that I have is When when it came to us last year We had the issues with the ski and I guess the direction of from from us was that The two groups got together I understand that that has not happened Correct. Um, that was right before so We were like, um They are were already set for last year. Yeah, so when this was brought it was brought in november and then it was Sent back like you said. Yeah. Hey could the the Really mr. Van Akron. Yeah, could you work with mr. Van Akron to to work on some of his concerns? Well, that's november. That's their busy time They really had did not have that opportunity to do anything at that time besides get ready for for the activity itself um Then later on into the year. We all know what happened with co vid, but um, um I do have with me tonight an email that was sent out by gerry plain With making spirits bright to mr. Van Akron That email was never replied to and that was set in april And I sat on it for quite a bit a time waiting for a response And then I actually forgot about it So, I mean we gave him plenty of time to respond and there was no response from him Okay, I guess but just just the one response There was no after no follow-up or anything like that with him But I'll note the no clone calls or anything. No, no, I guess in my opinion that I'm a little disappointed in the committee or For that I really wish he would have because that was what what our from our intention was that we That you that they meet that they that they meet and try to work this out because We feel like solemn in here I can I can attest what he's wanting is not something that can be worked out. Okay. He's asking away for way too much um, their main area um area four that I mean they want he wanted them cleared out of that The requests were were not something that we're going to happen on on their part. Okay. Well, I guess I do deserve before they come up. Do we have any? My name is Greg Liebig. I'm a vice president of thank you for his pride Okay, also the co-chair of the production crew that doesn't set up of the event um, I've been blessed with quite sick in my head go for head of hope out of the hole go for hold back in 2010 To be a volunteer for this event and this is prior to we started up into 2011 as my first year was So I've been involved since since before day one The event has always been meant to be a family friendly family event for the entire community and and raise food for the food banks This year due to the COVID stuff. We're probably the only show in town Be honest with you the way this was working out um, I worked Quite heavily with steve char and danie used to be the park's Guy there And we went through the first couple years first year. We had some skiing done There was no groomed trails that time people's kind of skied around we were done by by december 15th second year we were opened the 31st of of of december Because of that intended stay We really want to make an impact and and try to figure out a way to work with the city Work with the skiers and come up with a way that we can do the trail all around At that point in time the third year We ended up putting the boy scouts put a bridge end down by Area six Which allowed the skiers to go The groomer to go across a little little culvert that was there Which was that was cool and uh, so I've maintained the maps of the whole park So I we adjusted everything currently and and our goals were always to allow skiing around the whole park always In hindsight Last year I talked to joe joe or is it we wanted to put all the electrical stuff way back in the early tree line And uh, of course, I can't see me smile because I got a mask But uh, um so we Jim got upset last year because in november he thought Well, you you put cords over our trail. I said no, we didn't you didn't follow the map that we already have set up So he got angry about that but I showed him and and Joe and I met out in the park and I show him where the trail goes from the bridge As it curves through and we make sure that there's no cords around the way There's one area in the park that makes it very difficult to do any grooming. That's because that's from Down by the river between the bridge and butt went or whatever and there's really not what you can do with that part at all Going through the history some more Uh The city's done some good jobs trying to trying to get a trail cut through the up the hill through camp evergreen area Up around canyland and then we can ski that whole area too and we make sure that all of our displays A lot of it the area for for a group trail The uh The thing I found the most thing working with steve char was it was it was pretty good Jim was never showed up at the park with us ever Our hands have been out to him for forever. Um We want to we want to work with him But you have to have to have somebody on both sides willing to work together to hold your hand out to to communicate and What we're finding is is even even through our experiences with his brother who's another fellow vegetarian Um, he told me during christmas time and things every time Most people don't talk about politics to the dinner table He doesn't talk about making sure it's bright with his brother because it's the same problem It's just some animosity has been built up over the years unfortunately Things change and we want to make things you know change for the better And we wanted to thought we thought was a really cool idea and we still think it's a cool idea. They have skiers They'll ski the park safely during the event Now it's not going to be That's like 12 foot wide, you know, you're seeing trail or whatever, you know, but we're going to have areas that can do that And they're talking about the practice areas That's probably the biggest bono contention that we've had with mr. Van Akron And once one solution was you know down by the ball diamond And he doesn't think so much of that then then we thought about area four The grassy area not the parking lot the parking lot is used for staging But there's a grassy area there. There's also a hill back behind there That was part of our proposal we sent to september and april You know, hey, what can we do, you know? When you get zero response And you worked for 10 years Trying to make improvements How much more do you want us to do? To reach out to somebody for help I mean we propose things every year we talk to talk to steve and talk to them And we really try to make a difference We've obviously the show's obviously gotten a lot bigger than we thought it was ever ever would have been it's we're I think Travel, Wisconsin magazine asked like third rate of third in the state last year for events like this For being relatively new We want to make a difference within the community. We want to make an impact for the food bank Which we have And we want to make a place for skiers to ski Safely during the show So, you know They asked me for the additional time Because part of this proposal is just to allow us to get out of there Safely too We've been last year was fine last year and we've never been over our days to be in the park Trust me after eric and I and He's the co-chair of art of my committee for the design setup people We don't want to be there anymore after after december if we don't have to be So we work really hard to get out there safely in a hurry and the weather's been good The problem we have with agreement before was that the contingencies were such that if we had bad weather Ice which we've had in the past Makes it difficult to get out. So we just wanted to have that cushion to allow us to do that flexibility wise And we'll do what we can you know to Uphold ourselves to the agreement and again work with skiers to make sure that we still have what we said We're gonna do Okay Thank you for allowing us to speak a little bit tonight. I'm jerry plane. I'm the president of making spirits bright as well as the steering committee chair You can tell the passion from hearing greg talk about everything that we've done We have tried our best to work With the ski groomers As joe Reiterated he has as well through the city There is no more that we are able to do without compromising our event To joe's comment before Some of the things that that jim is asking for just aren't possible He would like us to totally vacate what we consider our headquarters and where food collection is right now It's just not an option As far as the extension that we're looking for it's just an insurance policy for us greg has already said There's no way we're going to just Sit back and relax every year knowing we have this extra time After spending all but two weeks a year on this event. Yes, we only take two weeks off in january There's no way that we want to take more time than we have to when we're disassembling all of our displays At the end of the year But if we'd have a terrible terrible winter While we're in there, which we did about five years ago Where everything was frozen in We just would like some insurance that we have a little extra time to work to get it all out I think greg just said last year we were out in three or four days Because there was virtually no frost very little snow. So it was very easy Additionally, we have fine tuned our process year after year To the point that it does get more efficient with every year So the extension which is pretty much the basis of this new proposal Is just to give us a little bit more insurance, but we are not going to take advantage of it Thank you I think you should know that proposal that we had given Could you state could you state your name, please further Ken Kim? I'm sorry Ken King making spirits bright The proposal that we had worked out because we needed the starting point to compromise We still plan on implementing and there were some changes that were made we had looked at extending the One display the tunnel To 200 feet instead of 100 feet. This is the 100 feet that the groomer needs to go through Okay, we are not extending that We are You know that was a compromise that we felt Would help move this process along We've also planned to move the porta potties and the dumpsters 12 feet in area four closer so that it allows more ski area and grooming as well So those efforts Have been made on our part as as a point that we would like to start The fact is is we haven't other than crossing at three locations with a groomer have we Stopped any winter recreation in that area snow shooing still available the bikers still go through there And the skier still use it. So it is still being utilized as a public resource and I think that should be Noted as well. So, okay. Thank you. Thank you mayor Thank you very much. Mr. Chairman Mike van der steen may or should boy again the original chairman of the cross-country ski trails And I want to you know, give thanks to all those ski trail groomers that we've had over the years that that donate their time And and made that a popular activity in the park But fortunately the rotary club has brought another entity in Making spirits bright is now part of the way that our community celebrates Christmas And it does some great things to raise funds And for the food banks and food donations So, you know, it's great to have all this activity and interest in the park And I think that the rotary clubs have been very gracious in The things that they're willing to do To accommodate the ski trail activity to continue as much as possible And I think that this contract should be approved and we'll continue to work with both groups The best the city can to keep both of these activities going as much as we can. Thank you. Thank you Alrighty, do we have a motion? I'll move for approval second We have a motion in a second. Do we have any discussion? All those in favor? I I Chair votes I motion passes Thank you all for coming. All right move on 3.3 resolution 8 4 2 0 2 0 2 1 Document 4.8 resolution authorizing the appropriate city officials to extend the existing contract with keel sand and gravel incorporated for the transportation And disposition of class a biosolids from the wastewater treatment plant David or is it Sure, uh, this is as you read, uh, basically entering into a contract is basically extending the existing contract with keel sand and gravel Uh, basically as you you might recall we we Installed and purchased a a drying a dryer of our biosolids at our wastewater treatment plant Previously we used to haul the biosolids sludge to farm fields that would be ejected into farm fields Now that we dry it It becomes a class a product which is a much higher quality product and it's Not regulated nearly to the level of what we had in the past the class b for instance so what we've done is this is can be used on as a fertilizer and keel sand and gravel has been working with us to to manage this haul it off and reuse it this this contract basically Will allow us to continue that and offer obviously renewals moving forward What we're looking at is the new contract will pay us five dollars per ton for the material Which is about 7500 annually that we're getting now as revenue in the past We actually had to pay To haul this from the treatment plant to the farm fields and it was Hundreds of thousands of dollars that was at its expense to the plant So this is a good deal And we still are able to retain some of the some of the biosolids for our own Beneficial reuse So would entertain or have the committee my or our our request would be to approve this contract i'll move for approval Do we have a second Motion to made in the seconded any discussion All in favor Any opposed Chair votes aye motion carries resolution number 3 or 3.4 resolution 85 2021 september 8th 2020 direct referral Resolution authorizing the appropriate city officials to enter into a contract with j and h controls to upgrade the automated automatic temperature control systems at the shilligan police department David, thank you, mr. Chairman this evening I have mike will miss superintendent of buildings and grounds and facilities and traffic control And what I would entertain is having an opportunity to explain this a little more detail but this is basically upgrading the control systems And standardizing and matching what we have at city hall as well as at our service building Building automation system wins the police station was built It wasn't At the time specified that it would be upgraded to this system So mike can explain Some of the details of why this is needed some of the systems there are obsolete and need upgrades So i'm going to turn it over to mike and he can give you further detail Thank you director bevel Good evening committee members tonight. We're seeking authorization for the appropriate city officials to enter into contract With j and h controls to upgrade the automatic temperature control system at the shilligan police department Funding for this upgrade was included in the 2020 capital improvements budget City staff has obtained and reviewed competitive bids for the automatic control system upgrade and determined The only bid From j and h controls meets all the requirements for the bid documents and is within the amount of budgeted The reason for this upgrade is to replace an outdated and failing building automation system installed as david said in 2008 A benefit to this upgrade It will integrate with the systems already installed at city hall municipal service building and the city And the senior center We're also looking to expand as david also Explained to involve more city buildings. So we're basically on one system And with our maintenance personnel, we can basically go to one computer anywhere in the city and actually update and manipulate and maintain the The hVAC systems and the building automation systems including lighting just like this building Are there any questions that I can answer on this on this system? I'll move for approval Motion's been made and seconded Any other discussion on it Mr. Chair, I have one question that I'd like to ask What about security? Um, this is a more sensitive building than say city hall How do we make sure that we nobody breaks in and heats up the police department too high? So there there's there's actually two phases to this capital improvement budget. I believe um, don't quote me on anything It's like a hundred ninety five thousand dollar Complete budget. This is like we're going to call phase one The phase two portion of this is going to include the audio system And the access control system and that access control system will also work work with the cards we're trying to work with When we when we start the access control system, we're kind of looking at using the access control to coordinate with the other city facilities We need city hall, um county pd. We're trying to use that same kind of system throughout the Through the facilities and stuff like that The cctv system, which would be the cameras. That's a standalone system already and does not need upgrading at this time Any other discussion? Yeah, I don't know if we If I got my point across there Is this secure? Is this system secure that no one could hack into it and raise the temperature quite easily? Are we is it on that for us? correct everything will the How do you want to say the the whole scope of this project is to have the server sitting at city hall on fourth floor That way we that way it can be monitored and secured through Our it's a security system Awesome. Thank you Any other discussion? Alrighty all's in favor I Hi Any opposed? Chair votes aye motion passes. Alrighty 3.5 uh general ordinance number 2021 September 8th 2020 document 6.6 ordinance amending section 2 dash 397 sub c Section 1 regarding the duties and powers of the director of public works Uh, thank you, mr. Chairman. I'm going to defer to assistant city attorney. Thomas Cameron I believe this is just updating and cleaning up our city ordinance to be more aligned with the state statutes over the years With the code some things Um, just weren't kept up to date in other words, but I kind of let him explain some of this ultimately it's We're trying to do a streamline some of our processes in terms of Getting bids going on for construction projects Obviously ultimate approval will come to council, but they're in the past. There's been quite a bit of um, what I would say multiple multiple Steps that are delaying some projects in terms of getting them all timely. So, okay, let me if that's okay sure Thomas Thank you director bevel and uh other person decker. Um, yes, so this this resolution it adds Um, sort of a total of four words into the director's powers and it clarifies That when we're saying the duties and powers Prescribed by state statutes, we mean those duties and powers prescribed by state statute for the board of public works And when you hear that initially it might sound like we're taking away the the power of the public works committee and that that's not the case There there's a statutory board of public works that's created And um, it's also possible to delegate those those specific powers which relate to the superintendents of the public works functions, so things like streets And the oversight of issuing bids This was a very specific provision that was included In the duties of the public works director between at least 1955 And was taken out around 1975. So this is not not a new concept. It's sort of a return to an old concept And as director bevel was saying the real real meaningful difference is that this will allow the public work staff to go out to bid on Projects that are part of the the capital campaign that are part of the the capital improvement plan that are part of the budget to go out to that without specific public works committee approval Of those big documents which will allow the the timing of bids to be honed and and potentially lead to better bid results Thank you thomas Any other discussion i'll move for approval Second Motion made and seconded any other discussion on it? All those in favor. Aye Aye Any opposed Chair votes aye motion passes. Thank you uh 3.5 general ordinance 2021 september 8th 2020 Document 6.6 ordinance amending section 134-178 of the municipal code to more clearly identify that identify the 8th street boat launch Dr. Bevel Thank you, mr. Chairman, and I think this ordinance It currently does not include the a street boat launch. Uh, this will allow for us to officially designate these areas One of the issues is that we're starting to get more and more launchings At at the boat launch there, which we do collect revenue Boat launch ramp fees and such the the other area these will also Not allow unnecessarily or basically say that These other areas such as there's an area at north point that people launch at least small water crafts such as a Waverunner jet ski for instance They're really not supposed to be doing that so Therefore if there is a violation a ticket could be issued in such a case. So this formalizes it It puts them in the code that these are the official areas And if you use them, there's also a daily fee or an annual fee that needs to be paid in order to to use these I'd believe joe if you have anything else to add or thomas has also worked on this as well of updating this ordinance But I'm trying to summarize it As quickly as possible. Okay Joe, did you already get one? Thomas go ahead thomas so At present the the launching site Is this section references the 800 block of mariland avenue? Which which is the eighth street boat launch, but no one describes that street that way anymore anymore Which leads to some some confusion in the code So that that's the the real genesis of this Um, and after the the ordinance was drafted it came to staff's attention that The 1300 block of Niagara avenue is no longer owned by the city. So that's no longer a boat launch So we would we would recommend amending the ordinance to remove that Uh provision at the at the same time Okay, did you I'll move for approval. Okay. Did you want to as a as amended? We have to move for approval and then we have to amend it. All right, okay Do we have a second? I can Okay, no amend as Per the the adjustments thomas kranvern No Second Okay, well make uh Any other discussion? Well, the first will vote on the amendment all those in favor. Hi Any opposed chair votes. Aye motion passes on that amendment Uh, then we'll no vote vote on the actual ordinance All those in favor aye Aye Any opposed chair votes. Aye Motion passes Item number four discussion only, uh, butch in butson project update Thank you, mr. Chairman Uh this evening we have some representatives from the butson sports complex. Um the project that uh, we have Have heard before and um, they think they want to provide an update and potentially Maybe have some exciting news of trying to get some kickstart to this project to get some momentum Um, this year I can just say is that with the covet situation It became really apparent with Them allowing their their club activities and their programs to continue. There was a vast amount of Relationship with the school district properties, which now are not available So quickly working with joe in the parks department. We were able to accommodate Much of their fall programming on city parks this year Albeit it's it's it's working. It's it's uh, it's Tight, but it's a great relationship. But I think Tonight you'll hear some proposals That I think are exciting. We do have in the capital program right now We have 590 thousand dollars in in the budget That was earmarked for the butson sports complex at a future time It's just been held in in the capital plan for The opportunity to present itself and I think tonight the gentlemen here have a proposal And um, if you don't mind, I'd like to turn the floor over and let them give you an update this evening Sure, go ahead Thank you, david and uh, thank you, mr. Chairman for having us here tonight And everyone on the on the video as well Thank you for allowing us to have an opportunity to discuss our project with you Well as david has indicated a lot has happened Obviously with covet and obviously with some of the restrictions we've had with regard to School district and properties and and running our fall programming. It's it's been quite a challenge to say the least But I think david has fairly characterized it as we've been successful things are running smoothly for now We're hoping that will continue Moving forward We do have some things that we'd like to update everyone about many of you on this call and many of you here tonight have heard this And uh, I have to share this with you before our meeting tonight Ryan sasma had a had a word and he had mentioned that uh, I remember when we started this process five years ago which struck me as a Somewhat ironic here that we're here to try to get the project kick started tonight. So it was a very interesting comment and uh Here's where we are everybody is is with regard to This will be in your board docs. This is a project overview That was provided to you Uh, just basically to tell you a little bit about our project when we had originally presented this development to the common council and I believe this was some time ago maybe a year ago or so what we had had at that time was kind of a A full build out something that included Building all the phases and things we're going to talk about tonight So where we've adjusted the plan a bit is we've come to the conclusion that we're going to try to get this project underway and continued with phasing of the various parts of it and to to kind of rewind a little bit At the outset the butson family had donated this particular property to The city under a restrictive covenant in the deed That told the city that yes, we're we're glad to deed this to you But in order to proceed you're going to have to utilize this particular property for recreational purposes Obviously, I think in most settings everybody's going to characterize soccer and various other sports as recreational so In keeping with that The original integrity that is is what the original Purpose was for deeding it to the city. We entered into a lease with the city over a long-term period and I believe Mr. Adams can tell us a little bit more about the specific date, but We had a window that we needed to develop the project and I think we're we're we're working towards that And that's what this is really about What we're trying to do is to provide and it has always been presented in such a way That it isn't just about soccer Obviously with The formation of boots and sports complex the name in and of itself indicates that it's a complex It's utilized for soccer, of course It'll be utilized for other sports like football lacrosse rugby all various types of uses So that's what we have always envisioned the project to be and the develop to be And that's consistent with what we're going to be telling you about tonight now With regard to our busy seasons, I think there's been a lot of talk about when soccer is actually Played and when the majority of the traffic occurs And for us the club Is basically in a situation where the busiest times of the year Are coming up on us right now the fall seasons from september roughly to The end of november and the spring months of march april and may our very busy times for us The project envisions that and that's why it's been discussed as a multi sport facility The multi sport facility aspect of it is during the not so busy times of soccer Perhaps and I would tell you that it's generally a year-round activity for us as best we can But it provides us with opportunities We can provide space for various other sports for various activities If you use your imagination, there's a lot of things we can do here. So when we look at it on balance, we think that Not only is it a soccer facility, but it's called boots and sports complex for a reason because it is a multi sport type of approach Some of the phases I want to turn to page two of the project overview To keep things moving along here is when we look at the conceptual project plan There are various phases and you see phase zero phase one phase two and phase three i'm going to go over those very briefly and phase zero Dave biebel had indicated to you that there had been some capital proceeds provided earlier. That's the 590 000 that he referenced That original phase zero summary activity was that we were going to provide On our original phase zero as you can see on the diagram that's up on screen Is that we had two grass fields some amenities and some park All right, and that was the original phase zero plan that we had talked about On multiple occasions with regard to previous presentations, whether it be to this board Whether it be to the common council, whether it be to the redevelopment authority That's what we had showed so in phase one was budgeted for 690 000 There are some capital amounts available for us Phase one Obviously when you look at the cost it jumps up significantly phases one two and three Are all expansions phase one as you can see on screen includes things such as Looking for the full 16 fields. It's looking for four turf a dome and various other parts Phase two is an extension of that And that's up on screen as well Phase three obviously is a little bit further down the road and you can take a look at Basically page three or the timeline that you've been provided in your board docs To get a timeline. When is this one of these things going to happen? And the detailed timeline through 2037 is attached to your board docs. All right We're not going to obviously go through those things in their totality but Where we are is we have final details We have a design concept that is pretty close to final We have in phase zero A revised plan that's part of your board docs And that has been provided up on screen now The new phase zero or what i'll call the revised phase zero goes from the two fields that you saw in the original design to the five I'm sorry. I can't see that far, but it looks like one two three. There are multiple fields. Let's call it Much more than we had on the original phase one With regard to the phase zero Our budget hasn't changed and we're confident And once we have the capital outlay that mr. Bebel had referenced Available we should be able to get excavation And work done on those particular sites to get that phase zero into play And we're hoping we can move on that very very quickly How this is significant is obvious We have more space We have more opportunities we have Just much more space and much more playability here And we were out at the site earlier with Administrator wolf to take a kind of get a visual. What did it look like out there? I think mr. Wolf can tell you a little bit about that visit But we're ultimately we are on this is we're at a point now where we are prepared to go forward with phase zero And it's significant everyone because two reasons the first of which is that At some point when we've been into mr. Sasmus comments It's been a long time And talking about concepts and talking about renderings and talking about drawings and talking about things that We look at in flyovers and we look at on maps and so forth Those are great things At some point though People want to see a shovel in the ground They want to see progress. They want to see kids. They want to see sports. They want to see the activity That's part of that concept That's where we are today Is we're prepared to move forward on on that aspect of this Where that also leads us everyone Is when approaching capital campaigns When approaching donors when looking at support for your project I think and I think everybody in this room would agree that it's absolutely critical To get a shovel in the ground to show potential donors prospects people in our community Users people who are on the facilities that progress is being made. It's the momentum It's the buzz It is the things that go with getting a shovel in the ground And that can be expressed to potential donors and prospects So when you look at phase one two and three And you see well each of those reference fundraising sponsors and grants, right? Well, the way to get to point b is to get to point a abc The start of the project is to get a shovel in the ground on phase zero And that's where we are today When we look at the financing summary, I can let you read that for yourself That's not something you need me to explain to you. I mean those numbers. They are what they are However, I think we're ultimately where we are Is now we're ready Also in your board docs is a summary by phase that document Basically lays out phase zero phase one phase two and three Those things obviously you can read for yourself There's a lot of different things that go into each phase Obviously the numbers on those increase substantially But there's no way you get to one or two or three Without first getting that shovel in the ground Getting some momentum Showing people that it's no longer a concept. It's no longer a drawing. It's no longer a rendering It's real. It's there and kids are using it And processing is going to continue With regard to programming for soccer for football for frisbee for rugby for lacrosse for all of those things that availability is here now And we're hoping we can get started on that and we're here tonight to have questions from all of you And what i'm going to do is turn it over to mr. Wolfer moment who probably has a few things to add And then seated to my right is tony cloco the president of our club He and I are here to answer questions to respond to concerns From anyone and answer whatever questions we have. So with that, I'll turn it over to administrator wolf Thank you. Thank you for all of that review of the past five years or 60 months As you guys are fully aware I've actually been involved with rda and public works from the since the beginning of this project The books and property As outlined earlier was donated to the city for a project like this So basically what I want to do is i'm going to skinny down the And not beat you guys with a shovel in the ground As we keep talking about What we're going to do is we're taking four hundred thousand dollars of the 590 And what we're looking to do is this fall we're going to actually excavate if i'm saying it properly We're going to we're going to clean it up. We're going to actually do the phase zero And we're going to get that Shovel in the ground and we're going to plant the grass so that in spring We actually have fields for the kids to play on and I think I support this 100 100 because You know, especially right now with the pandemic we have I think what slowed us down in the past five years Is we kept trying to find out how are we going to find the money To get all the way to the to the finish line And I think what what's happening is we got lost in the weeds because Of the fact that instead of getting it started as it was said before you start with step a and go to b and c Is we need the kids to have a place to go and play and we need the activity we owe it to the kids Especially right now with the pandemic. We need social distancing So we need people to be able to go outside. We need people to have a place to go play and this isn't Excuse me Isn't just for for soccer. It's for everybody So we really need to get people out there using the the facility and getting it actually In use and I think once we get the use and the the public sees what butson complex is This is going to allow These gentlemen to get it from a to b to c to d as the program shows So what what we're basically doing is communicating to you guys is that we've got the 590 590 thousand dollars That's been approved by council for this project And this fall we're going to take four hundred thousand dollars of it and we're going to do phase zero Which should be very exciting for all of us our constituents our kids and and people in the community and and outside our borders And it's going to bring people because this is going to be something that's going to be on the map It's going to help bring additional business to our our community But it's also going to help us in a very tough time, which is you know, unfortunately this covid situation We're right now people need to go outside and have the ability to you know use some of that frustration So in spring, we're going to have that ability for them to actually start playing and kicking the ball or whatever So I just wanted to Bring that to your attention that this is an exciting time and I'll let you ask questions to the group. Thank you If I may add real quickly what what is city ministry or wolf said what we would what we're planning to do is take that plan And actually we'll go out for bids to get competitive pricing On this project once we have that all as a package. We will come back to the public works committee at that time present those results and then Obviously the motion would be to you know get get approval at that time if it meets our budget requirements And then send it to the full council for their final authorization But this evening we wanted to give you a real quick update because things are really progressing fast in terms of the construction season You know this time of the year is is good timing for excavators because they're kind of winding down on road projects And their equipment's becoming available. So I just wanted to share that with you and With if anybody else would like to talk. I just wanted again Just kind of give the committee and everyone an update on this tonight Uh, anyone have any questions for them at all? I don't have any specific questions, but I think you gentlemen did a wonderful job at explaining everything and Um, I know I'm definitely excited about this project moving forward and every time I drive past this site when I go visit my folks How's I'm like Yeah, let's get this going, you know I think we all kind of agree on that. I think we feel the same. Thank you. Yeah. Thanks guys Uh, I just have a quick comment myself as um, I think To think about playing in spring. I think is a little ambitious. I know how long it took for the uh horseman complex And they actually I think I think they had to wait See you're probably looking at fall. I've been possibly the spring after by the after that that is a possibility I think you're a little a little ambitious But it's good to see something going I I did have one question. I didn't see anything on there and I don't Um, there was no ball field. No, no softball or heart or baseball fields can be in this complex at all I I thought that originally was part of the plan I think that's a distinct possibility because much of phase one and two includes Artificial turf and artificial turf is readily adaptable to various types of sports, whether it be baseball softball Okay, plus with with the domes that are as part of phases one and two Uh, that also provides opportunity for those sports as well. And certainly we would contemplate You know having that as part not necessarily part of the direct design But certainly all the fields are transitional and able to be readily adaptable to those things. Okay. Okay. Thank you Sure, go ahead One of the nice things about Once this and you don't see the baseball fields at the boots and complexes because quite frankly we use the outfields Uh at field of dreams For for a lot of the activity so by pulling those soccer fields away from that field of dreams Once this complex is built that opens up those facilities for baseball and softball that much more where there's right now There is a little bit of conflict in terms of use But as as as joe was saying You know once they get to the phase one the dome that provides a lot of the winter All year type of training indoor training for baseball or softball or multiple sports activities.  So tremendous opportunities What the group is being presented this evening and moving forward long term in the future Thank you. Uh, anyone else have any comments? Marcus ready I'm good. Thank you. Okay. All right Mr. Chairman, thank you and thank you to all of you Sorry, was there a question? I guess No, okay. Thank you everyone. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for your presentation. I appreciate it all Alrighty seeing we so we've exhausted the Agenda next meeting date september 29th Move to adjourn We'll motion to adjourn Who's second second for marcus all those in favor. I Any opposed? We're adjourned. We're adjourned. Thank you


We really need to rein in these metabolic markers that are fundamentally important for disease resistance for longevity and overall health. All right. Let's dive right in about your exciting new research in drop acid. All right.  Why did you decide to hone in on uric acid of all things?  And what do we share, you and I? We share the idea that metabolic problems are at the heart of the diseases that you are most interested in, those of the heart, and diseases of the brain, the area that I specialize in as well. So that disturbed metabolism becomes a big player. It relates to coronary artery disease. It dramatically relates to risk for Alzheimer's disease, for a disease for which there is no pharmaceutical treatment. So my interest for many, many years and years too has been to look at what's available to help people regain their metabolic health. And these days to kind of offset the metabolic mayhem that is so pervasive, looking at obesity rates, diabetes rates, hypertension rates, problems with this lipidemia, elevated triglycerides. These are all metabolic issues. Sure, they're bad for the heart, but they are so bad for the brain as well. And that's why I'm interested. And that's why, you know, I even wrote Grain Brain now a decade ago talking about stopping the sugar because it's threatening to your brain. Well, we now have a new tool to look at and it is not your grandfather's uric acid. You know, you and I in medical school learned about uric acid and something called gout where people who ate rich food would get a painful problem in their toes and would be unable to walk. This is not your grandfather's gout related uric acid. We now know with two decades of really intense research globally that uric acid is not just a happenstance. It's a central mechanism that is worsening those very metabolic issues that we need to reign in. Matter of fact, an interesting article was written back in 2016 and it was entitled Uric Acid in Metabolic Syndrome from Innocent Bystander to Central Player. So this is a new tool for all of us, for you and me and certainly for all of your viewers today. You know, it's not the end all, but it's a powerful new tool in the toolbox and that is bringing your uric acid first identifying where it is and then bringing it under control. So why do you think like you, I've been interested in uric acid for years because of, you know, fructose metabolism and we're going to get into that. But why do you think that this has been missed by the medical field for so long? Well, it's not for lack of information. You know, as well as I do, as it relates to heart disease, for example, that the messaging was taken off of sugar and fructose in particular and that for years it was all about dietary fat and cholesterol. We know how that all played out and why.  And the second event that related to fructose not getting in the spotlight and therefore uric acid, which is what fructose is metabolized into is because we've known that fructose doesn't require insulin, doesn't acutely involve insulin in its metabolism. So the whole focus was on glucose and glucose metabolism and insulin functionality and then insulin resistance. So we were sort of led to believe that fructose was the safer sugar. Nothing could be further from the truth. And it's heart wrenching that that messaging took place for such a long period of time. The idea that fructose and its downstream metabolite, which is uric acid specifically, is an issue well beyond gout was written about just very recently. That's 1898 by a Dr. Alexander Hague publishing a book about all of these other aspects of uric acid. In 1898 being related, uric acid being related to headaches and mood issues and a variety of other non-gout related disorders. But it really took researchers about the last two decades led by somebody here in United States, Dr. Richard Johnson actually interviewed him just yesterday to really bring to light this notion that here is a central player. It's not just about understanding your blood sugar, where that is moment to moment, which we have the technology to do. But it's all about fructose, not just the fructose that you eat. And we'll talk about that a little bit later on. But this primary metabolite of fructose consumption, which is uric acid, which for more than 99% of our time on this planet, the production of uric acid from fructose was a life-saving survival mechanism, especially during times of food scarcity. Fructose, which was very rare, would allow our bodies to make more fat, increase blood sugar production by making us insulin resistant, even raising our blood pressure as a hedge against dehydration. And for an awful long time, for hundreds of thousands of years, that was a survival mechanism. We didn't have fructose much. These days, of course, fructose consumption has gone through the roof. We eat now more than 1,000% increased fructose consumption going from 1970 to 1990. The average American, it's consuming 55 pounds of sugar a year. And so we are constantly stimulating this survival mechanism that's telling our bodies, prepare for winter, prepare for food scarcity, make fat, store fat, lock it up, make more glucose to power the brain, raise the blood pressure, because you might not be able to find water. So this is what we call an evolutionary environmental mismatch. That's our task. Our task is to first identify that, and then do everything we can to rein in this uric acid production, which is the danger signal to our entire physiology to get ready for winter. Yeah, interesting. With my first book, years ago, Dr. Gundry's Diet Evolution, I had a whole part that great apes only gain weight during fruit season.  And I actually, there's an entire book that I have in my office strictly about great apes depending on eating fruit, which only happened once a year in the jungle to gain weight for the winter, whether that was a dry season or rainy season or cold season. And that was, and you go into that beautifully in your book, and it's nice to see somebody else saying, look, this was our survival mechanism that we inherited from our cousins, the great apes. And you're right. That's right. And if there's anything that could have happened to these primates that could have allowed them to make a little bit more fat, then they would have been selected for in terms of survival. And the difference was a mutation, a genetic mutation that took place about 14 million years ago. A genetic mutation where actually it was a series of mutations in the genes that code for an enzyme called uric case. That's the enzyme that breaks down uric acid. So they lost this function. They lost the ability to break down uric acid, and their uric acid levels went up. And that gave them a little bit of an advantage. It's not that they became obese. They just had a little bit of an advantage, a superpower having a little more body fat. All humans, every one of us has inherited that uric case mutation. Hence, the uric acid levels of humans are four to five times higher than that of other mammals. But let's be clear, this notion of making fat from fructose is seen in a lot of animals. How do you think the hummingbird survives these 1,000-mile epic journeys? There are times when the hummingbird has 40% of its body weight fat. And if you want a hummingbird in your backyard, what do you put out? You put out a bird feeder full of sugar, and it makes them fat. Whales, camels, for example. And the other interesting thing about it, and I mentioned it earlier, is that this body fat is a survival mechanism, not just for the energy store that it represents, but also because when we burn fat, we produce two things, carbon dioxide, which we exhale, and water, metabolic water.  I mentioned the camel. Camel can walk across the desert. They have a hump, and what's in that hump? It's not like there's a tank of water in there. It's fat, and that allows them to survive. Whales have so much blubber, because that's where they get their metabolic water, like the hummingbird, and like we do too. So when our bodies have a sense that we're becoming dehydrated, we make more fat. And how do we know when we're becoming dehydrated when our sodium level goes up? That's the relationship then between eating a lot of salty pretzels while you're watching the playoffs and getting fat. Your body thinks that it's dehydrated, and the hedge against dehydration is to make body fat because it's converted into water. Oh, it's so good to know. Now I know why I can put on a few pounds by eating those pretzels, which I never would do looking into the camera. I don't know if they're lectins and pretzels. Well, there's gluten in pretzels. And that's a lectin. I want to stop for a second to point out what many people still do not realize. You and I are kind of talking about fructose. And most people somehow don't equate table sugar with fructose. But you and I know that table sugar is sucrose, which is half glucose and half fructose. Can you elaborate on that? How did we miss that messaging? Not sure how we missed it, but the point is that in that 55 pounds of sugar that we're consuming a year, half of it, as you correctly state, is fructose. And that would be probably not so terrible if more than 60% of foods at the grocery store that carry a barcode didn't have added sweetener, and that added sweetener wasn't 50-50. It was much higher, is much higher in fructose, because it's derived from high fructose corn syrup that has as a minimum 55% fructose, but oftentimes even more. But your point is well taken that when we're eating table sugar, that's immediately broken down to fructose and glucose. And the body looks at them in a completely different manner. We tend to think, well, fructose, glucose, their sugar is pretty much handled the same way. Couldn't be more diametrically opposed. The absorption of fructose and its metabolism are very unique. The consumption of energy molecules in the metabolism of fructose, the fact that fructose acutely doesn't involve insulin, and the fact that fructose is then metabolized to uric acid really differentiated dramatically from glucose. So one of the main missions of drop acid is to identify the sources of fructose and two other things that raise uric acid. Purines, which are the breakdown products of DNA and RNA in certain foods, and also some forms of alcohol are known to increase uric acid. But by and large these days, it's this incredible signaling to our bodies to make ready for winter by making fat induced by our incredible consumption of fructose that is really at the center of the problem. I mentioned earlier that it's beyond the fructose that we consume, that we have within our bodies a mechanism that is also going to help us survive, called the polyol pathway, whereby we create fructose in our bodies even when we're not eating fructose. We convert glucose, blood sugar, into fructose, and what might stimulate that would be things like thinking we're dehydrated. So when serum sodium goes up, even though we're not eating fructose or we may be, our bodies take glucose and make fructose out of it because that's a surefire way to make more uric acid, to make more body fat, because that body fat can be water when our bodies think we are dehydrated. That is the relationship then between dietary sodium and obesity, dietary sodium and diabetes, for example. This activation of this polyol pathway, I'll tell you another interesting way that it's activated. It's activated by something called hypoxia, meaning not enough oxygen in the blood, and it doesn't have to be dramatic. A little bit of lowering of the blood oxygenation saturation will trigger this pathway and make more fructose in the body. Why is that important? Who gets hypoxic? Well, you don't have to climb K2 to get hypoxic. If you have sleep apnea, which is exceedingly common, you become hypoxic at night and you stimulate this pathway, which makes your body gain more weight, which does what? Makes your sleep apnea even worse. So it becomes a vicious cycle. You dramatically increase your risk for obesity, diabetes, and yes, sleep apnea is related to risk for Alzheimer's disease and coronary artery disease, for that matter as well. Now we have the mechanism. Now we understand how that happens. So there are interventions that become available to us at multiple places along the way, like a CPAP, of course, but also recognizing this connection to fructose formation and uric acid. All right. Now, you and I have been concentrating on fructose and sugar, but you did mention purine metabolism and you also mentioned alcohol sources. So let's go into that side of where uric acid comes from. So anything that feeds into the uric acid production we want to talk about. And interestingly, the metabolism of the three things that you just mentioned, the purines, the alcohol, and even the fructose are all enhanced in the presence of higher levels of uric acid. Think about that for just a moment. This is what we call a feed forward cycle. Normally, we have checks and balances in our body such that when things start happening then at the end of the line, there is somebody that happens that tends to turn it back down. This is just the opposite. This is a, this is uric acid raising the alarm saying we've got to keep this whole thing going because we're going to starve or we're going to become dehydrated. Now, alcohol is metabolized in exactly the same way as is fructose. It requires ATP. It depletes our bodies of energy. It challenges our mitochondria because of that energy depletion and forms uric acid. But there are variations in the type of alcohol that I think are very relevant. We know, for example, that at least as we look at what are called food frequency questionnaires, in other words, asking people what they eat, we find that women who drink wine have a slightly lower uric acid. Men, it's pretty much neutral. But beer tends to be a big, big player. Why? Because beer contains alcohol, but it's also very rich in purines because it's made from yeast. So you're getting two very powerful inputs into the production of uric acid. So that uric acid then is causing the body to make more fat. Now we fully understand what's behind the beer belly. The mechanism is that we're targeting the uric acid pathway twice. So the third input, purines are the breakdown products of DNA and RNA. So in that regard, certain, for example, organ meats, liver, kidney, a certain small fish like anchovies and sardines have higher levels of purines. So they, if a person has elevated uric acid, are things to consider to remove from the list, or simply eat less of. It turns out that as it relates to purines, about two-thirds of them are actually produced within your body. One-third come from food, two-thirds produced as you break down muscle fiber when you exercise, etc. So again, the big player is going to be fructose. So incredibly increased in our modern world. We used to say the standard American diet. Then we started to say, well, no, the Western diet because it kind of spread around the world. Now it's the global diet. This change in dietary patterns has become prevalent across the entire planet. And as such, we are seeing these metabolic issues exploding around the planet. And now we have a new tool. And that is measuring your uric acid and getting it under control. And that's something you can do at home. All right. So wait a minute. Do I go into my medicine cabinet and reach for my uric acid monitor? Or how do I check my uric acid? I know I check it on my patients three to four times a year. Here's how you check it. This is a home uric acid monitor. And I checked it yesterday and my level was 4.7, which is really good. So again, this is done with a little finger stick, much as we used to use for measuring our blood sugar. Now many people are using continuous glucose monitor. So we don't actually have to stick ourselves anymore. I'm actually wearing one right now. So using my smartphone, I'm able to determine my blood sugar right this minute as I'm talking to you. And some people may say that's a bit neurotic. And maybe it is. But you and I both know that keeping blood sugar under control and now keeping uric acid under control are really important tools that we have well before we get to the doctor's office. And she or he tells us, hey, you know, your blood sugar is starting to climb because we noted it was such and such a year ago. And now it's five points higher. I want to know long before my blood sugar is five points higher on one simple test. I'd like to know my blood sugar day in and day out and understand how it's affected by my foods, certainly, but also my sleeping patterns, my stress level, how much I'm exercising. We really need to to rein in these metabolic markers. They're fundamentally important for disease resistance for longevity and overall health. Speaking of uric acid levels, I use several different labs with my patients and I am shocked with the variability of what's a normal uric acid level depending on the lab I use. And quite frankly, that also corresponds to triglyceride levels as what quote is normal.  I'll give you two answers to that. I think that was a question. First of all, I don't care what people are defining as normal because normal is not good enough for Dr. Stephen Gundry's patients, nor is it good enough for mine. I don't want anybody to be normal because normal is average and average these days is terrible in my opinion. Only one in eight Americans is metabolically intact. 88% of American adults have at least one of the markers of metabolic syndrome. So I've given up on normal. Typically, the lab will tell you that the normal level for uric acid is seven milligrams per deciliter. And that number, number one, it's way too high. But number two, that number was derived from the observation that anything above seven is when uric acid begins to crystallize in the blood, hence setting the stage for gout. We're beyond that. We now recognize that uric acid is hugely relevant as it relates to metabolic issues. So we're targeting 5.5 as being maximum and anything below 5.5 then being not in the normal range, but in what we call the optimal range. That's what Dr. Gundry's patients want to know about. That's what anyone I work with I think deserves. I think we all deserve what's best, not just what is average for crying out loud. So we've gotten away from that. And as it relates to metabolic issues, a very interesting study was published back in 2009 looking at 90,000 individuals, 42,000 men, 48,000 women followed them for eight years. And what they found was that people having a uric acid higher than seven had a 16% increase risk of what is called all-cause mortality, in other words, dying from anything. They had a 38% increase risk of cardiovascular death, basically dying of a heart attack, a 35% increase risk of dying of a stroke. And what was even more interesting to me anyhow was that for every point increase above seven, every point was associated with a further 8% to 13% increase risk for all-cause mortality. So this uric acid really becomes important to recognize, especially in light of the research in which interventional trials lower uric acid and we see immediate improvements in various metabolic markers in humans. So we know that intervening and lowering uric acid really is important to consider, especially in people who are inching up and having higher and higher levels of uric acid. What do you say, I know what I say, what do you say when you point a uric acid level of 6.5 to your patient and they say, yes, but doctor, this is in the green and why do I want it lower? Do you hand them the book? Yeah, I hand them the book because they were told by their other doctor or by the laboratory that they're in the green. And I typically say, well, people tend to be down on what they're not up on because it wouldn't be the first time somebody, another doctor would criticize me for putting a patient, for example, on a low carbohydrate diet and adding in more fat or telling a person, hey, why don't you try gluten-free and maybe it'll help your headaches? I've been criticized over the years for things like that and I'm hoping that it continues because the day that people stop criticizing or challenging you and me is the day we have to hang it up because we're then just simply parroting the status quo. Status quo Ronald Reagan said is Latin for the mess we're in. People say, well, what you're talking about is really outside the box. That's not my goal. My goal is to make the box bigger so that more and more healthcare providers recognize what we're talking about. And interestingly, I was on a national morning show two years ago now, a network morning show, and they said, it was the revision of grain grain, the five-year anniversary. And they held it up. They said, we spoke to, no, they said, Dr. So-and-so is quoted as saying that your book is nonsense. And I said, you know, that's when it came out. That's exactly what he said. Now he's using that book in his Ivy League University Alzheimer's Prevention Program. So, you know, it does take some time for this stuff to rise to the top. And I'll be the first to say that, you know, some of the things that I think are interesting may not bear fruit moving forward, but it's good to look at what's where the hard bench research is happening and then extrapolate that and bring it to the public awareness. I don't really have to do that so much with uric acid because there's such robust data around the world that is looking at it. And, you know, in Japan, for example, lowering uric acid is a treatment that's being offered for hypertension, for high blood pressure. They're treating high blood pressure with drugs, and we could do better than that, but with drugs to lower the uric acid and getting good results. We know that how the drugs for gout work is by inhibiting a particular enzyme's antinoxidase, that'll be on the quiz, that lowers the production of uric acid. We can target that enzyme with quercetin, with luteolin, and you can buy those at the health food store or eat foods that have a lot of bioflavonoids in them, like onions, for example, and help to bring down your uric acid. So there's a lot of things that we can do to make this happen. And you know what? It happens very quickly. One study out of Britain looked at 22 young men with mild elevations of uric acid, put them on 500 milligrams of quercetin a day, and two weeks later, no dietary change. Two weeks later, their uric acid levels had already fallen by 8%. So there may be a time for a drug. I'm not advocating that or for or against, but there's so much we can do with food and other lifestyle interventions to bring it down where it belongs. So that was going to be my next segue. So why don't you and I take allopurinol, low-dose allopurinol, and put every one of our patients on low-dose allopurinol? Why not? It's cheap. It's free. The reason is that it's not risk-free being a pharmaceutical. It's a very, very safe medication. There are a very small subset of individuals who have a specific genetic predisposition to having a really bad negative reaction. And I would say back to you if why not start with a nutritional supplement that we know is safe, that is something in our food. But I do know of a physician, for example, who is treating himself with allopurinol to lower his uric acid, and has never had gout, but is lowering on the basis of understanding how uric acid threatens metabolic health. Yeah. And quite frankly, I will use allopurinol, low-dose allopurinol with some of my recalcitant patients, particularly in my patients who have declining kidney function. And I am so impressed. And maybe you could talk about that. You and I are not all that interested in kidneys. But uric acid is pretty nasty to renal function. And I've noticed in my own practice, if I can get uric acid levels down in these individuals, and they're usually quite high, that we can not only stabilize EGFR, the filtering ability of kidneys, but really start to see it improve. You know, I would say over the years, your lead-in statement that you say you and I really aren't interested in the kidney. And early on in my career, I was interested in the brain pretty much exclusively. And then began to become interested in the gut of all things. And from there, of course, the liver. And we can't leave the kidney out. I mean, the kidney as it relates to metabolism is playing a huge role, especially with this new understanding of how uric acid affects the kidney, how fructose is metabolized in the kidney as well as the liver. And this whole notion that, well, uric acid is a threat to the kidney because we thought maybe it's forming crystals in the kidney, that's not what happens. It's actually inducing inflammation that is amplifying an autoimmune reaction in the kidney against something called heat shock protein, which then ultimately helps manifest hypertension. And beyond that, that uric acid in and of itself away from the kidney participates in amplifying higher blood pressure because uric acid inhibits the activity of something called nitric oxide. We need nitric oxide for our blood vessels to be able to relax. That's what it does. Well, it actually does two things. I'll cover the other thing in just a moment. But when our blood vessels cannot relax, blood pressure is going to go up. It's the reason that when a person's having an angina attack, they pop a nitro, sublingual nitro to help dilate their coronary arteries. Well, this happens throughout the body. And we need to keep our blood vessels the ability to keep blood supply to our vital organs, of course. So there are multiple mechanisms by which uric acid is a real player here. Why might that have been a selective advantage? Of course, if we're dehydrated, our blood pressure is falling and falling, and finally we cannot send blood to our vital organs, we're going to need ways of increasing the blood pressure in order to survive. That's not the way it is these days. We're not generally getting dehydrated, although it's been demonstrated that patients who are obese tend to drink less water. Hence, their sodium levels are higher. Hence, they're stimulating this fructose production leading to uric acid day in and day out. So as we look at these incredibly pervasive metabolic problems now through this mechanistic lens of uric acid and fructose, man, it really is just a new and exciting way of participating in this research. And it really allows us to take a step back and also ask the question, how was this beneficial back in the day? How was this horrible thing that we all talk about called insulin resistance? Why was it a good thing? Well, it was a good thing for our ancestors because becoming insulin resistant allowed them to make enough blood sugar so they could power their brains so they could find food and not become food. They wouldn't be eaten by other animals. We need to power our high card. Our high card is our big brain. We're not the fastest animal. We're not going to outrun a cheetah. We're not the strongest one. We're not going to beat a bear or a gorilla in an arm wrestling competition. But we have a big brain and we can think our way out of a lot of problems and we've got to power that brain. Hence, becoming insulin resistant in certain contexts is a good thing. The hummingbird is profoundly insulin resistant prior to making these epic flights, storing body fat. 40% that I mentioned earlier, its body weight is fat so it can make water. It becomes insulin resistant so it can power itself with glucose. So it's all really contextual of our current times as evolutionary environmental mismatch with the time of our paleolithic ancestors and certainly our primate ancestors as you mentioned earlier. One other thing that you and I have both arrived at and neither of us probably would have believed it years ago, the gut and the microbiome. Where does uric acid fit in the microbiome picture? Uric acid elevation specifically selects in the gut bacteria for the predominance of inflammatory or inflammation related types of bacteria. So it's changing the array of organisms such that various types of bacteria that are more inclined to disrupt the gut lining and lead to hyperpermeable or gut leakiness or leaky bowel if you will. That increases inflammation. That's what uric acid does. A lot of the downstream effects of inflammation of uric acid elevation deal with inflammation because again, what is the context? Inflammation for our primate and paleolithic ancestors was an advantage because it helped them deal with various types of infection, bacterial infection, parasitic infection, etc. So it changes the gut bacteria. It directly enhances gut permeability. And interestingly, now there is published research showing that in patients who have a disease that is characterized by a very high uric acid level called gout, that doing something called fecal microbial transplant. In other words, taking the fecal material from the colon of a person who's normal, doesn't have gout. Transplanting that into the colon of a person with gout dramatically reduces the number of gout attacks that they have. So there's a lot to learn. There are a lot more interesting connections that we will make moving forward. But uric acid wants to increase inflammation in our bodies by any number of mechanisms, by antagonizing insulin receptors, by increasing fructose production. Uric acid stimulates this pathway whereby we increase fructose production from glucose. What does that do? It increases inflammation in the body through what is called glycation, where sugar is bind to protein and then our immune system gets lit up and increases the production of these chemicals called cytokines, interestingly. And cytokines is a word that a lot of people are talking about now because in COVID, people who have a very bad outcome experience an overproduction of these inflammation mediators called cytokines. It's been called the cytokine storm. And interestingly, we know that uric acid dramatically increases cytokines and new research that has recently been published a collaborative study from China and Chile looking at about 1,800 hospitalizations found that risk of being put in the ICU is increased about three fold if you have a high uric acid level on admission. Risk of being put on a ventilator is increased about 2.8 fold. And risk of death is similarly increased about two to three fold as well if you happen to have a high uric acid level when you come into the hospital. Uric acid increases risk for metabolic diseases, which we know are associated with bad COVID outcome, and uric acid dramatically increases the production of these inflammatory chemicals. So interesting to think about. People are talking about the cytokine storm, but I want to just mention a new term and throw it out there, and that is chronic inflammation or the cytokine drizzle. Not the cytokine storm, but this chronic drizzle, this chronic elevation of these inflammatory chemicals that you and I know are seen with coronary artery disease, type 2 diabetes, and certainly with Alzheimer's, chronic elevation of inflammatory chemicals, which we do see with elevated uric acid. So bottom line, we've got to do everything we can through multiple inputs to bring inflammation under control, keeping our blood sugars low. As you've made very clear, reducing our consumption of lectin containing foods because of the threat that that also poses to gut lining integrity. But also keeping uric acid in check is yet another powerful tool now in our toolbox. All right, a perfect segue. I want you to show us your love, LUV. What's the program to get this in check? LUV stands for lower uric values. So we've created dietary protocols and obviously recipes in the book that can help people lower their uric acid, A, by taking away those things that stimulate uric acid production. I mean, you won't find any added fructose, certainly to any of the recipes, but also focusing on alcohol, focusing on purines and certain high purine foods that are known to elevate uric acid. I mean, we've known that who got gout in the day was the disease of kings and the king of diseases. It'd be eating really rich meat, meat dishes with rich and organ meats, et cetera. The big issue is that we want to avoid free fructose. Does that mean we can't have fruit? Not in the least. It looks like some fruit consumption, though it does contain minimal amounts of fructose, fruit sugar, is good and is actually associated with lowering of uric values. Why might that be? The fiber in the whole fruit slows fructose absorption. The bioflavonoids target fructose metabolism by targeting the same enzyme that the drug you mentioned earlier, allopurinol targets, xanthinoxidase. And finally, fruit contains vitamin C that helps us excrete through the kidney uric acid, all good things for us. Interestingly, we humans, about 10 million, we weren't humans then, but our ancestors developed a mutation such that we don't make vitamin C and, therefore, we have to have it from exogenous sources. Why would that have been a good thing? Why would losing the ability to make an antioxidant be a good thing? Again, survival mechanism is oxidative damage to our energy-producing parts of the cell called the mitochondria. When we damage the mitochondria and they're less able to function, our bodies make more fat and our bodies use less energy.  And interestingly, when fruit ripens and its fructose level is the highest, the vitamin C level is the lowest. Vitamin C levels taper off as fruit becomes ripe. So that was in the day a very powerful mechanism for survival. That low level of vitamin C would keep uric acid in the body. We want to let uric acid go, hence taking some vitamin C, eating fruit that has some vitamin C is a good thing. But it doesn't mean an apple a day keeps the doctor away. But five apples a day and the doctor, you will pay, meaning that you can overdo it. You can eat a lot of fruit. But a lot of it has to do with the rate at which the fructose is released in your body. Eating fruit doesn't suddenly bombard your body with fructose, but drinking fruit juice clearly does. Apple juice, orange juice.  Well, it turns out that that's a powerful way to suddenly challenge your liver with fructose and it activates all of these pathways for metabolic mayhem that we're talking about. Certainly, sodas, certainly the foods that contain fructose as an added sweetener, which the list is very, very deep indeed. And beyond that, we focus on high fiber to help slow fructose release, also to nurture the gut bacteria and certain foods like onions, cruciferous vegetables, etc. that do contain these magic chemicals, these bioflavonoids that work to target uric acid production and really help us with excretion or reduce the formation of uric acid. And that's what that love diet is all about. Beyond that, getting uric acid under control is going to be certainly pushed along. If you take some quercetin, which you can buy online or go to the health food store, 500 milligrams a day, a Ludiolan, again, buy it online, 100 milligrams a day. Coffee is reasonable, helps with lowering uric acid, sodas, tea. In women at least, a glass of wine a day is not a bad thing associated with better brain health. Certainly, there is some discussion of cardiovascular advantage and we know that is at least associated with lower uric values, LUV, hence the love diet. Actually, there's a pretty good amount of quercetin in red wine as an example. I have some every day just to lower my uric acid. Well, it's because red wine contains the skins and it's those skins that are really the richest source then of these bioflavonoids. We don't get that in white wine. I try. I really do try, but I have really over the years become so intolerant of alcohol. We try. We want to do this thing where we drink a little wine in the evening, but I barely can get through a glass and I'm ready to hang it up. That's fine. There's other ways to get those benefits as you and I know. Oh, believe me. I hear you. All right. I got to let you go, but I think we've alluded to this all the time. You and I both continually challenge and research or look again at mainstream medical beliefs. I think that's why you and I have become good friends. Writing your new book, what discovery challenged your current beliefs the most? What challenged my current beliefs? I'd say, with all due respect, most of this research reinforced my beliefs about what we should do, but really shed a new light on why we do what we do. Yeah. For example, even back to grain brain 2013, the call there was cut the refined carbohydrates. We want to eat low glycemic index foods because we don't want to bump our blood sugar. Now we know through the new lens of fructose metabolism in uric acid production that one of the issues with this elevation of glucose is that it activates this pathway then to signal the body to make fructose as an alarm mechanism, making us insulin resistant and making us gain weight. Further, other things in our diets that we have talked about before in different contexts like lowering our sodium intake has been talked about because, well, yeah, it'll raise your blood pressure in many people, but when we look at dietary sodium and diabetes risk and obesity risk, I never understood how that could be. Now that we recognize that it stimulates the production of this alarm chemical that winter is coming, fructose making uric acid, oh my gosh, it really fills in a void for me because once you see this pathway, the biochemistry becomes clear, it's so satisfying, especially because we've been talking about this stuff for an awful long time. You have been, right? You've been talking about these good dietary recommendations. We know they were good dietary recommendations because the outcomes would be great when people would adopt them. Their various parameters would improve their blood sugar, their blood pressure, their serum lipids, et cetera, but we never really understood the mechanisms and now we've got that. And that is, it's very satisfying and it really takes away a lot of maybe uncomfortable mystery that we've been laboring through for many years. All right. So now we're dropping acid. What's next? I don't know what's next. I really don't know what's next. I'm going to be spending a lot of time, meaning years and years, with where I am right now on this whole understanding fructose metabolism, understanding the production of fructose in the body from the polyole pathway, what the effects of uric acid are, and there's still parts of that that need to be teased apart. For example, why is it that oxidative stress and damage to the mitochondria activates fat production? How does that work? Well, we know that there's a particular enzyme that's activated cis-aconitase that tends to make that happen, but that part needs to be further teased out and understood. I'm very fortunate that I've become friends with a really top-notch uric acid fructose researcher, University of Colorado, Dr. Richard Johnson, who's done so much incredible work in this area. And moving forward, we'll be working on projects together. He works on projects with researchers around the world. I actually dedicate a drop acid to him because of the incredible research he's been doing for the past two decades. What's next for me is a much, much deeper dive into this. And you know what? I don't know what else could come on the radar, but I'm always keeping an open mind. So there you go. Yeah. I think this was a nice shift for you. And I thoroughly enjoyed it, as you know. Well, and it's always a pleasure to catch up with you. And we'll talk offline. Now, before I let you go, we have an audience question, and you have not been prepped. So I'll let you go first, and then I'll go first from GS256 on Instagram. What if you don't manage to eat all your calories in six to eight hours every day? I'm a pretty small person and I feel too full and end up not eating enough calories in that window. What should I do? Well, first I would ask, why are we looking at calories? If this individual is metabolically healthy and not losing weight, then whatever he or she is doing is likely appropriate. There's a huge fixation on calories amongst people still because of this notion of calories in versus calories out has to do with weight loss. And we really realize now that that just doesn't, you know, though it seems thermodynamically reasonable, it's not really how our physiology works. So I don't think there's really any need to be concerned about the number of calories a person is taking unless he or she is losing weight. Now, let's just suppose that's true. Then I would, if that person cannot tolerate more bulk of food per se, I would shift the food, the diet to one that provides then, if that person's really fixated on calories, higher calorie food, meaning more dietary fat, having more, you know, having twice the calories, gram per gram in comparison to protein and carbohydrates. So I would shift that. Also, if this person is involved in time restricted eating, I would say then bracket the meals. In other words, right at the first hour of eating, do some eating then, then allow whatever the time period is, six to eight hours, whatever that period is to add in at the very end of that, the second meal that is going to provide one would think adequate amounts of food. And finally, if there is early satiety, in other words, if anybody is suddenly noting that they just can't seem to eat the same amount of food in a, you know, all of a sudden it's happening to you as I can't even finish my dinner. That's the time to have a workup from a gastroenterologist because there are certain things that can happen in terms of the digestive tract that can limit the amount of food that a person's able to tolerate or even swallow for that matter. And I'd recommend considering going in that direction as well. Great answers. Yeah, I don't have a calorie count on any of my recipes in any of my books because I agree with you. The calorie and calorie out is wrong. It's just plain wrong. I personally, if I have somebody who can't gain weight and I talk about that in my upcoming book Unlocking the Keto Code, I put them on a fairly impressive dose of macadamia nuts. And it's very rare, speaking of fat, it's very rare that I can't get somebody to gain weight by having them eat macadamia nuts every day, a good quantity of macadamia nuts. And maybe offline I'll share a funny story on how I had a challenge. Actually, I'll do it right now. I had a woman who couldn't gain weight and this was in the winter about now. And as you may or may not know, I go on a one meal a day planned during the winter for six months. And so I usually lose about 10 to 15 pounds every year on purpose. And so I said, I'll tell you what, I'm going to go on a challenge. We're going to eat a cup of macadamia nuts a day for the next six weeks. We're going to weigh in today. I'll see you in six weeks. In six weeks? In six weeks, we'll do a weigh in. And she said, okay, you're on. So this is a time when I would normally lose weight. And I actually gained in six weeks, about 10 pounds. So and I'm proud. I say, yeah, see, it works. It's great. So she shows up and she's the same weight. And I go, what the heck? I said, I'm shocked. You're the first person this has happened to. She's, oh, I thought you were joking. I didn't believe you. I didn't do it. And I'm going, I just gained 10, 10 pounds to show you how well it works. And oh, well, it does work. I can personally attest to that. Yeah, you know, oftentimes people are going to, they want to gain weight for the wrong reason. You know, everybody around them is saying, Hey, what's wrong with this person? Are you losing weight? You know, you have some disease. What's happening? And I would say before anybody wants to jump into a program to actually gain weight, let's look at some metrics. And, you know, most of the time in my experience, people test out as being really in an ideal range. The problem is that everybody else is fat. And, and because of that, this person feels different, feels left out in our modern world. You know, here in America, now a third of adults are obese. And by 2030, which is in the distant future, right, eight years from now, that number is going to be 50% of American adults will not just be overweight, but obese, clinically obese. That said, you know, so we're skewing what looks to be normal, pretty much to the right side of that curve. And a lot of times people need to be encouraged that, Hey, you're in great shape.  But, you know, for almost the entire time of being on this planet, we're pretty lean individuals. I have my patients go watch a movie from the 1940s or 50s. And that's what normal looked like. And even the tourists in Mount Rushmore and North by Northwest, we're all skinny in the 1950s. And not anymore. So I just like, go watch a movie from the 40s and 50s. That's normal. And you're right. When we show them on a biometric scale, there's kind of smack dab in the middle of normal.  And they're normal. Yeah.  And then you show them that, Hey, you're you're in the cat bird seat here. And, you know, the problem is again, comparison to others and people making comments, people make comments because they'd like this person to start to gain some weight. So they look more like they do. So that's very often an issue. Where do we find drop acid? Drop acid is, I have a copy right here, everywhere. It's local bookstores, online retailers, Amazon, Barnes and Noble. And if you know, the best place I think is just to go to drop acid book dot com. And then you can learn about it. I have my videos there linked my various blogs that I've been writing. And it's available everywhere. All right. All right, take care. Stay safe. And good to see you. Look David, take care. Thank you.