Okay, so normally they um, they grab a little sister here So I've got two like explosives But what you need to do is like you got a armor piercing round through really what you need Electric bucks and Oh god, I'm running out of time here take photos as best you can Here we go. Oh god. It's all going wrong Hope for the best. Oh god, he's angry. He throws things at you. You gotta avoid it There we go, thank you Oh It's like crazy because that was he was so much more interesting of a character Yeah, I agree. Hello. Welcome to part two That was a phenomenal intro once again We'll uh, we'll be checking out both those videos. Um as we go along today But yeah, welcome back Hopefully you guys enjoyed the batwoman that kept you company while we were out by Oh He said I need to go to bed. I'll be back when I wake up Whatever he's gonna try to be in every like all three parts of this He just wanted to count as having bid in part two. It's like there we go Dad Yes, what a it's it's funny.  It's a couple blocks away I want to stretch my legs I went inside and it goes 10 it's like 10 10 15 p.m. At the time Over here. I'm inside. I grabbed three cans of peace tea Raspberry flavored. That's pretty good so far. Um, and there was this guy who was in there There was one other guy in there apart from the cashier And when I went up to to go pay for my stuff, he said hey, um I I need some gas money to get back home Essentially and I was like, uh-huh. How far away is home?  He's like, oh, just whatever you can give me And I can lucky lucky for him. I was in a good mood So I said, yeah, sure. I'll get you. I'll get you some gas money, right So I was I put the three teas up on the on the on the counter And I was just about ready to say these three teas and five bucks on pump two because he had his car Just about ready to say it and he says hey, man. Can I get one more favor?   I knew it He starts looking at like a bunch of like packaged Sweets and things like honey buns and stuff like that that were at the that they were by the cashier You know the cash register and stuff He's like, can I can I get one of these things?       I drank like two liters of water while walking around It just thus seemed like the most efficient way to do it Hmm That man was exposed to you Well, I will say this I guess while it's on my mind if for what I do is I will have the I'll pop out the e-fap chat As its own window You can highlight because it makes its own window when you do that You can highlight that chat And then you could paste that into a normal tab and it will just become a normal tab like the rest of them And not its own little weird proprietary window thing Something you can do didn't you know, yeah, if you if that's yeah, maybe There's gonna be somebody out there. It is it is useful. Yeah. Yeah, that's something Hmm Um, we got some art on screen from Catastropica Right I think yeah It often drives us this way They're very cute. It's adorable and loving. She always draws it that way Really wholesome Um, and yeah, there's there's all kinds of things Well, they're retractable I'm not reviewing a movie right now. I'm just looking at a nice old moon, I guess See you're watching a you're watching an uh An onion flying into the universe Which is very curious at this point My brain nearly died.  What was that thing was It begins with o or p or something Well, the crude drawings out. I don't blame you.   Oh, I had no idea Yeah I did I did not know that there you go. That's the equivalent of what did you say it was toilet paper, right? That's a common one for you guys We call it bog roll bog roll I can't remember anymore. What was tissue paper. Was that something else or was it was that rags? You said tissue paper Kleenex and then there was bathroom tissue So it was like bathroom tissue some people like I guess some people say tissue paper generally toilet paper I've just always called it toilet paper.  Oh, yeah, of course, uh, I always want to keep always going to keep some wet wipes next to the tp So you can end every poo in a in a wet wipe Keeps it looking nice down there Sorry, I'm imagining things. I I just had a few Uh, operational things to do. That's why things aren't moving forward just yet. Just give me a moment That's all right You know, we talk about toilet etym toilet terminology Uh, what else would that be? Well, what do you do that all the toilet itself? Do you guys uh, do you guys use commode?   Hello, we can I was gonna say we have to introduce the warrior The cast the cast has switched out since the prior part. We've now got southpaw meme repository weekend warrior indigo gaming And that is all of the new people right? Yeah, okay. There you go thumbs up Are you well not used to being at the end of the line but not being at the end of the line weekend Do you what um, have you heard of commode? Do you know what a commode is? I've heard of it, but I don't know what it is like. I've seen that word before I've seen pictures. Yeah Yeah Well, if you saw a picture of a commode you might not associate it with what it is typically used as Technically a commode is either a It's what you put the chamber pot in Okay, I've seen it now.  They you know, they could sit on that's more high raised up and It's on sort of stilts of a kind and has a lid It's not technically a toilet, but they are used interchangeably So why do you why do you bring this up then? Well, I mean if you ask and since you asked I can keep going guilt-free We're talking about uh, just etymologies for different words and what words people use for different things Um, like what what do you call the um, what the stuff you wipe with? Um, What do you call that? But paper but toilet paper. Yeah. Yeah, I guess yeah Let's see, uh, what about oh, so like do you call it the The I know you have wc. That's what I'll put in chat a lot over the water closet No one calls it that here, but I just know of it or the washroom. No one generally calls it the washroom here Yeah, it's the restroom. We use restroom Yeah, it's a it's a more I guess polite way of saying bathroom Even though bathroom in and of itself is just a room with the bath People generally don't have to urgently go and remember a sound referred to a toilet as a bathroom Well the etymology in Australia is that there is the bathroom Which is the one that has the shower the bath the sink and then there's the toilet, which is the dedicated toilet room Oh, you guys have a dedicated toilet room A lot of houses. Yeah a lot of houses. Yeah, they have just a toilet and then there's the bathroom that's different I don't know over here That's probably why the it's called that over here so much because all of those things are in the same room the the there's a Maybe there's the sink. Maybe there's the bathroom There's the the bath itself or that in the tub and there is the toilet that is also in that room So the whole room is called the bathroom It's normally when people say I have to go to the bathroom It's for using the toilet not because I just really need to take a bath right now guys So Ned Flanders new house the bathroom is also known as the kitchen Wow, there's a toilet right next to the fridge There are some houses though. That is called efficiency I used to live in a house that had a tiny little Like attached to the master bedroom. There was a very tiny room that just had a sink and a toilet in it And so there are those but those are generally like half baths. Yeah, they call those half baths. Yeah. Yeah, it's a half bath It has zero percent of a bath.  Yeah You can use yeah, you can use it as a selling point and when you sell you say Hey, this is the master because you have the master bedroom and you have the master bath Which is the bathroom and generally the best one. It's just connected to the master bedroom Oh, yeah, that's definitely it's like the en suites. Yeah Yeah, so if you have a room so if you have a like the first house I lived in was kind of small But there was enough room Especially if you're gonna make the house a certain shape like a boxy shape You could work in how this space could be it's just big enough Wait, sorry. I don't want to The the the half bath thing. It's like is it necessarily better to have a half bath that you'll never use rather than just Have the shower and then like I don't know just have more space for all the stuff You won't have a house. That is just a half bath Every house will have a like a a bath for a tub and a proper bathroom pretty much But in addition there might be also a half bath.  He needs them and then one half bathroom or alternatively four bathrooms and one one and a half bathroom What is it gonna do with all that space like I could never buy a house? Well, I just don't know what I would do with all that room It seems to be a thing that people Like that to just have massive houses Especially houses with lots of bathrooms, which always feels really weird to me It's funny because the expenses just carry on because you have to get someone to clean it like permanently Yeah, you don't have to worry about that. Oh, well plumbing. I guess you're right Well and home repair is gonna be way more expensive. I don't know it just feels like and I think getting more than you need Makes it a lot harder to just live Yeah, um, hey, you know, he's happy um The so where we we have covered two whole videos And it's time Yeah, I've provided a link now and so you can all jump into the watch together now Many people would describe us especially as a recently as mcu fanboys.  Monskull says he was right, right Now we've we've made it clear that we don't typically agree with him But luckily for us, there's a video explaining why he was correct and that we need to understand really Yeah, oh I might have I might have seen this video actually if it's if it's older I remember there were a couple videos that came out around times I'm excited because I can't wait for some great arguments for why what he said was true So I gotta want to get by after this. Yes, just strap in everyone Let's say the family wants to go to amusement. It started straight away. Oh rude.  Oh, yeah, I've seen this It's a juicy. Yeah. All right. So here goes Oh, wait, wait, so it's it's 10 minutes. So we'll be here for four hours, right?  You you may come and go as you if no one's forcing anything It's okay. So, well, let's let's see what marty has to say Who is this guy? Let's do it. Let's say the family wants to go to amusement park. That's a good thing You know and at the amusement park. There's these cinematic expressions. They're new art form It's already okay. Here we are. Action films are not new Manipulation just dripping off the screen already. He's showing explosions.  Like there's no emotional moments or no like like deep Moments of like character or anything like of high artistic value inside of that movie whatsoever. It's like that That's completely not true, dude. You're just showing what's bombastic all the money the roller coaster allegory I will save all the marvel films if we were going to say any of them are meant to just be the roller coaster Endgame is probably as close as it gets in terms of just we want to hit these beats and we're going to find Whatever way we can to get there. I I mostly agree with that the problem is just You know, I you know, that's death. For example, if someone went us just a roller coaster. Nothing that I'd be like Yeah, man, they were they were like fighting to see who gets the privilege of dying That's that's the way you are You could also pick the winter soldier as far as like a roller coaster type film I guess Well, he's saying you can say it for all of the model film all the model films do typically have like big bombastic action scenes But I just don't know why that disqualifies them from cinema Yeah, spoilers Morton Scorsese doesn't know what that means. He just said it and then everyone just took his word for it Well, because cinema's like Cinema's like a label that he's trying to keep away. He's like, no, you can't have it You have to yeah, exactly I'm above that my movies like Ingmar Bergman. Like they're the high artists like Marvel movies like whoa Stay away. Well, so then I'd be curious. I'd be like, so he's interstellar cinema And if he said yes, I'd be like, so what about all the big bombastic action scenes? Like, well, no, I can't wait to hear him say like, no, they're meaningful They have stakes. They have reasoning that the exit or you know, whatever else that I should be like Yeah I mean you could do the exact opposite of this You could say you could be critical of Martin Scorsese and say like, oh, yeah His is just like, you know, senseless violence and so and so and just do a quick cut of all of the You know people getting shot in the head and murdered and beaten and stuff like that Like yeah, it's just a poor representation of the entire of the entire film, you know Well, I mean apocalypse now, for example That's one that a lot of people say is like one of the better films of all time And like the first act of that movie is like all bombastic and explosive Like there's a purpose behind it because it's all like kind of about showing like How people were like explosive in the war and like just took it like as more so a throw ride the whole surfing thing But like it's not Just because the movies bombastic or has big set pieces shouldn't like detract from the writing or the themes I don't know why people make that distinction.  I think yeah You know, I oh, yeah Sounds about right. Yeah, I'm gonna put up my my spooky my spooky copyright cover because I'm scared Yeah, put it in. Yeah Oh my god Oh, no, it's a movie with explosions And there's a thing the person who chose to edit this like so you're telling me it's explosion specifically right And then they're gonna be like three hours of explosions Is it because that's all you need to do is counter is Come up with some of the better movies like of all time or at least what people say Even Scorsese says the best and if you find explosions, you've basically defeated what this guy's arguing Terminator, there we go. Good luck. Same. Same. Private Ryan isn't cinema. I'm like, okay. Yeah, exactly Full metal jacket. It's something different from films that are shown normally in theaters It's something different in space. Oh, that's a real film 2001 is a real film But do you hear that though? It's something different from films that are typically shown in in cinemas. It's like No, they're not Yeah, you're you're telling me 2001 a space odyssey does not have an emphasis on like bombastic set pieces and like a grandiose scale Like that's what's deeper It's deeper Well, this is what this is the problem that you run into when you start trying to distinguish between As if there's like this is cinema and this is not even though they're both shot like And run this the length of time and are shown in theaters and have stories and characters and a plot It's all art. You you just have to it has to well. It's all art and it's all You're stumbling on what you're stumbling on what I think the truth is which is they wanted to find a way to Categorize the films. I think are good and bad I mean if you want, I mean if you just made the epic of Gilgamesh and a lot of these mythological stories and The the the mythologies of Greece and things of that nature if you gave them really big budgets They could be indistinguishable from Marvel movies in a lot of ways But all these characters who have superpowers who are Tricking each other who are using their strengths as they can who are on these big quests fighting massive monsters and things I just don't Like it's a nonsense If he wants to say that Marvel films are morally not morally like creatively bankrupt. It's like that's one thing But to say I'm not even cinema at all I think that's a fair statement right now Right now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.   So I guess I think this is like I can understand the sentiment of being frustrated as a filmmaker to like look at the industry And everybody's super excited for like schlocky marvel sludge But again, you can just criticize it for what it is rather than trying to disqualify it as As as odd Yeah, maybe if I try and recategorize the things people like is not art It'll convince them not to like it anymore. Yeah, it'll give more value to the stuff I make The well It's sometimes the things that are the best in terms of quality or the things that are the most sophisticated just aren't going to be the most popular Well, it's like all these old facts.  Um, it can happen Yeah, yeah, it's a little bit of a jealousy and or like Oh, I did it the hard way.  And so they probably feel a little uh, like a little bit betrayed or a little bit like oh, these guys are taking the easy route But at the same time if it if it results in a good movie It's a good movie no matter what medium it's really sun to a degree We have we share like a lot of probably what their issues are as people But our response was we're gonna watch the new shit tear it to shreds and explain where they've failed And where they keep failing and how in trouble we are for new stories and how we should probably push for better Not yeah, well, you know what guys falcon winter soldier is not cinemas, so i'm not gonna cover it Like Not cinema I scoff at your concept of cinema But you know poison the well in order to criticize things I think yeah So i was gonna say this this video is really bad start because it's it's compared explosions to long shots of people It's like, okay, so this seems pretty fucking superficial. I hope you do better than that People in endgame and there are explosions in cinema movies. So you got to do better than that Literally comparing the cg explosions to the Kubrick stare right now You could start I was But you have to be very charitable So is when it didn't have to be this way you could have taken an explosion from endgame and compared that to an explosion An apocalypse now Well what I could literally you'd still be fine But you're just being what you could literally do with with the beginning of this video Is you could edit in clips from scorsese movies with gunfire and explosions And you could be showing how hypocritical he is like like the same effect would be achieved He's just showing explosions from marvel movies saying hey, he's right. I could be like this is from his movies He's wrong You're cracking into the part that we actually need because when you do that they they are forced to be more specific And that's when they'll say Okay, but it's meaningful in those films. You're like, what do you mean? Okay, but it's because the character's journey is okay, and you're like, ah gotcha Thank you Now we can work with it because it's like tell me how there isn't a character journey in iron man, and then they'll be like well I mean And then they'll have to start qualifying and it's gonna sound like shit because it's really hard Of course the big part is like if the criticism is the assembly line process Does that mean that iron man was like exempts? But then the rest of the films don't count a cinema anymore because iron man one was like an experiment No, it's only blade is okay the rest of themselves. Yeah Also, I'm also wondering like does Jurassic park not fall under his definition of cinema Like nobody in the world is going to accept somebody saying that Jurassic park isn't cinema rightly so I was in with Jaws and A lot of movies are like blockbuster movies. The problem is with the blocks Indiana Jones Visual effects that were revolutionary for the time was yeah Because yeah these jones has to count that that scene in the last crusade with the leap of faith Uh, that that shot right there is like That was uh, that was really really nifty practical effect and we'll see among other things that that film got right Maybe that's one of the requirements. You have to have done something filmmaking wise beyond just sitting everyone in a green screen Maybe that's the requirement, you know, but I mean, I guess That would be the interesting part to talk about is like Is there not some sort of value in like how impressive Thanos looks or well, yeah, and not to mention what if I know it? It's a little bit of a difficult hypothetical But what if you know turns out when a tarantino actually Used a green screen for all of reservoir dogs. None of those things are real. How about that? Well, that's something. I don't know if you've seen some of the videos like it's actually insane Just how much green screen and like CGI is in the wolf of wall street like scorsese uses CGI all the time It's not like Yeah, exactly and because of course we're responding to potential arguments here. That's the problem. We can't really work with anything else Well, we'll see anyway because this video this video explains it apparently and it's very well rated this video so You know, it's just a really bad foot to get like started off of because you've just been kind of dishonest when you didn't really need to be Yeah, and vague when you didn't need to be I would this is a form of poisoning the world. Yeah Before we continue though, I I heard some pretty rough words. Uh, you guys said about grace Randolph So I wanted to ask is this the greatest podcast? Sorry We're definitely a misogynist. Yeah, we're pretty problematic.   This was her non-spoiler Uh, her non-spoiler review, which she talks about the ending and it's like, okay. Well, what's the point? I mean, you should give away quite a bit if you think about it that way. Uh, yeah Um, no, right? I'm sorry Dave I'm afraid I can't do that It's quiet But this this this is a labyrinth set design. This is um Now we're at the point where we're like, okay Can you please make your point clear because now I'm not like is it was it this It was the character journey then or is it what it was being dealt with? Or thematically like what you can draw out of the AI having made those decisions like you got to tell me what it is Leave for sponsor video Martin Scorsese's comment that marvel films aren't cinema is making waves again with the release of his opinion piece in the new york times Explaining his position. It's making way. I like the idea that it's not an incredibly controversial thing to say making waves Yeah, you know all of all of superhero movie they're not really cinema. Anyway, bye.   What if someone said hey mulla is black widow a film is it cinema?  Okay. I'll just say that I think they're um They're mixing what makes the movie bad with oh, this shouldn't be a movie or something like that Is that some yeah, is that a fair thing to say? Rather than criticizing it or basically gatekeeping like a definition for like what makes it a good movie or a movie period Like it's not cinema if it if it does xyz, which is just arbitrary labels basically I feel like the conversation they're not interested in whether it's good or bad. It is like it is not Cinema it's not art, which of course it's a film It's shown in cinemas and it's filled with artistic expression I'm directors honestly.  It's like it does do all these things. It's not cinema That's like, oh, what is your definition of cinema and it's like well it excludes marvel films. It's like that's a weird definition of anything excludes marvel films I think you can I think if you can get a piece of duct tape and tape a banana to a wall and call it art I think that the mc was going to count as art It's all art. It has to be it has to all be art. The threshold. Well, that's the thing They've not said anything that it like it's not all art or none of these Oh, yeah, the funny thing is right what he's doing now. It's like the cinephiles like me Who are who feel vindicated and these marvel tards? He's doing the thing Yeah, he's doing it. I was I was right because martin scores say see agreed with me He's validating my position You can't even call us like So that's why this is interesting to me. It's like, yeah, I'm not biased toward marvel.  So i'm pretty sure the pictures move in marvel movies Well, in that case In that case, we just need to know what they mean This means that retroactively this this can be applied to DC movies like the suicide squad like the idea that that isn't cinema with all of the care and effort that was placed into the Characters and their interactions and personalities and how they change and grow like that is interesting you say that Because james gun Was not exactly happy with this comment because he considers guardians one and two to be like You know big efforts on his part and like when this came out He was like, oh man martin scores says he's like a huge inspiration for me that kind of sucks Like your movies aren't cinema. It's like thanks, bro It's so productive That shot of That shot of peacemaker's helmet showing the reflection of the fight between peacemaker and flag if that was cinema Which was apparently practical by the way Oh, I'd like to see like a video on how they did it sort of thing He actually tweeted out today about how he did it like they stitched. Yeah, I read that I'd have to find it I think I wouldn't be able to do everything when her person real because of the camera or whatever But that was really impressive I think they might have had like maybe maybe a couple cameras Maybe like a crazy fish islands or something kind of map it onto something but that'd be interesting to see He said we shot the fighting shot from where the helmet is turning with the action And then shot the helmet turning around at the same speed and then use Visual effects to wrap the first footage along with plates of everywhere else in the room onto the helmet. Hmm Interesting. All right, um quite impressive Well, and I was about to say like we've probably at some point been like I think I do it in the black widow video I'm like this This is cinema and and someone was like wait, so you do have an opinion on what is and isn't I be like no No, I've only ever done it as a joke Gatekeeping the word cinema seems stupid to me, but you know This is the thing as well Even if we were to agree that what he said is true Like what's the point of the label like why can't films that are quote unquote roller coaster movies still have Really good elements that you can learn from even if the suicide squad Isn't cinema. There's still a lot of great things that filmmakers could learn To improve what they have and the other movies could be made from so They want it for the they want fast food to not be considered like a cuisine of any kind They're like fuck fast food. It's fast food, but I mean but now I have the question It's like is superman from the 70s not considered cinema Or like the dark night or any of these films. I guess not a boy cinema I'm wondering like I would be very interested to pick his brain to see just how much he would be willing to throw out because I I think I have more respect if he just goes the whole way throws out every blockbuster ever made and Does he think lord of the rings is cinema So I said you're over focusing on semantics. It is only semantics Oh That's their argument not ours Yeah, it's almost like what he said was super vague and he didn't give any specificity Therefore people misinterpreted what he said and he's gatekeeping in the end because he didn't clarify his position If I tell you guys Dark Souls one isn't tactile, but the second one is you're all going to be like Can you please explain what you mean by that? And then I'm like tactile still focusing on the semantics. I'm just talking about tactile You're like what I I need you to be more specific green. Don't focus on the semantics. The feeling is great. Yeah It is someone's this is only semantics. This whole thing is just cement We need to know what the word means and then we can agree with them or not Yeah, I mean he's done blockbusters too. It doesn't even remember hugo. That was absolutely a blockbuster movie You know family friendly Fantasy action adventure. I mean that I I don't see any more you know, uh artistry or Uh, you know cinematic depth and that Compared to any like marvel movie really what about it's comparable The specifically the quote it isn't this Honestly, the closest thing I can think of them as well made as they are with actors doing the best they can On of the circumstances is theme parks It isn't the cinema of human beings trying to convey emotional psychological experiences to another human being That's the more you learn about the Sorry, like you can't keep saying that's not what he said. That's what he said and that's wrong What he said that's just wrong and for reference. It's just incorrect Just get over your hero worship of martin scorsese.  I was going to establish I think he's awesome.   Come on.  Stop doing semantics It's like saying a 2.7 million house is not cheap. It's not expensive Higher argument isn't semantic to begin with It is that's what I mean Yeah, a certain set of rules do they fall under the classification of a word? It's exclusive. That's what I'm saying. It's exclusively semantic. We have to find out what he means when he uses the word And that's the fucking possible part Well, that's my new hope We were asking that earlier the same for indiana jones Do these count or not because I don't think he'd be willing to throw steven spielberg on the bus So somebody in the chat sang back to the future It's like would you throw robert zemeckis under the bus?  If we're being honest here, he can say it all he wants about the whole Hey, it's not bad to be a theme park ride, you know But he knows the fact you wouldn't want to say that to steven spielberg's face. It's like you make theme park rides I make cinema. It's like, yeah, just try it Surely he'd count like the the sam ramy spider-man movies, right? Some people have been saying that he he liked the sam ramy spider-mans He thought they were good. I don't know if that's in at all. I don't know if it's still theme park rides Wait, wait, I think the problem with martin's carcassius that He he if I may like I think I saw that quote in twitter Like he he likes the fact that spider-man movies are the ramy ones are self-contained But I think what he was trying to say is that he doesn't like the direction of just making movies and then making another one Based on like sequel baiting or whatnot. Just I agree I think that's what he was trying to say But he said it like maybe he said it in like a gotcha interview and he didn't But the problem is he then wrote an article he Then just don't like you still said it if it was a gotcha interview I I don't know how you get martin's core sassy in a gotcha about a discussion It's a surprise Right. Yeah, but yeah, what freaky said is true also Um, and someone in chat said not cinema. You guys are arguing about martin's core sassy's definition of cinema when he never defined it So people are telling us he's correct.  That's all I ask let them compete It's all about basically putting everything on a level playing field and saying like we don't put arbitrary labels on like films period And just like separate them out into groups. It's like everything is cinema if it's a film It's like Yeah, it's an avoidance of the term not the quality because the quality is completely separate Yeah, that's argument is Guys, he's a boomer. What do you think he's gonna say? I don't know.  Is he not? Feel like you'd be the one to talk to this about Yeah, he's got the sponsorship from movie.com Is sanichu not art Is incest not porn So anyway Why don't you return in the dimension? Oh, hey, I'm step in there and all familiar soba's daughter hargames. Like this kind of gatekeeping is frustrating. Oh my god Oh, I'm protecting categories is is basically the message here stopped obsessing over categories when they're not qualitative statements And there's no point squabbling about these labels when it doesn't tell us anything about the story in general Well, that's what you're wrong me because this guy's explaining it now so we can finally understand the value of the category as well Oh But score says he gives marvel films a lot of credit I say again, uh, they're all new art form. He acknowledges the time A so condescending.  No, they're not not dimension. By the way, literally calling it a new art form Was not a compliment.  It's so yeah You might get in trouble for calling it a superhero story Probably make marvels gilgamesh do it. So well, I got bill gamesh is in the internals and I don't like it Or any any like greek mythology that you can read about about heracles It's like Does that not count as a superhero or or samson from the bible? Is that not a super hero? Jesus christ kind of a superhero kind of Yeah What a water base. Well, yeah, so all we need to do to cover rags is ask for him right now Is just say what does it mean to qualify as a superhero? It's like someone who does good things and has a you know, super natural powers Yeah, I'm fine with calling black widow a superhero story and she doesn't have super powers Now that is super indestructibility Fucks like Thor is that man is a super hero Oh, yeah, you know what Thor is probably the best one to make this point actually Yeah That's so arrogant. Also. Let's go back to marty. It's it's its own thing. It's like this other freak mutant It can be fine like like the way he said it man. She's Yeah Yeah Well, yeah, everyone's making their paintings and some guy walks up like this is my painting. It's like no, that's a guine. You can put that in the guine pile What's the thing about it is he's like he's like reassuring, but he's so condescending and backhanded with It's kind of unusual to think about because wasn't this the conflict like at the beginning of the 20th century when you had a Lot more like minimalist and abstract art coming out and it was kind of contrasting against a lot of the baroque and realism that dominated The centuries prior. There's probably a lot of that too. Like this ain't art This isn't art. Like it's not the same thing and it's not the same thing, but it's all creative expression That's the problem that happens when you start saying that's up. That's not who said comic books aren't people said video games aren't Art It's just the same cycle and it only takes like a decade or two for people to catch up Which is all that's going to happen or in this case it's bizarre because superhero stories have been around for decades on film Look at In other forms We should probably read this by the way because I just I just looked at a bit of it. I was like, oh Wow, so I don't know. Do you want to go from the top and it's up for anybody really? uh Some people seem to have seized on the last part of my answer as insulting or as evidence of hatred for marvel on My part if anybody is intense on characterizing my words in that that light There's nothing I can do to stand in the way Many franchise films are made by people of considerable talent and artistry You can see it on the screen the fact that the films themselves don't interest me as a matter of personal taste and temperament I know that if I were younger If I'd come at a later time I might have been excited by these pictures and maybe even wanted to make one myself Here comes, but I grew up when I did and I developed a sense of movies of what they were and what they could be That was as far from the marvel universe as we are on earth as we on earth are from alpha centauri what So Just keep digging.  You are not helping And look at this for me for the filmmakers I came to love and respect for my friends who started making movies around the same time that I did Cinema was about revelation aesthetic emotional and spiritual revelation. It was about characters How does the galaxy not qualify as that? I don't know. Yeah, so Just that's not even true. By the way, if you read into the actual like history of like films back in that time There were plenty of those were like meant for just escapist entertainment. It's not like back then everything was just like Yeah We've always had it born Is he is he trying to appeal to being older and having more life experience? Well, say you find the films juvenile and lowbrow, which is fine. That's fine And in fact, you're not even really wrong like a lot of them are just like pretty pretty shallow But they're still films. Yeah, and shitty films have existed forever Yeah And when I say I also include films that aren't meant to be thought about beyond the explosions They've also existed forever probably said the same thing about looney tins as well.  Stop saying words are entertaining. I can't believe how many people just like accept that as Obviously true thing or like a really astute observation. It's not It's a leadest Good going Sorry, I was just trying to put in a little word to choice. I was going to make a comparison like I imagine if they said like Oh Disney films aren't art, you know, they're made for you know, big audiences They're they're just a you know roller coaster ride they're for kids All kind of stuff like that and then and then you look at a movie like lying king's like no no that that's definitely art but If you find the I like the full article that I linked the full article about martin scorsese in the chat Later on it gets even worse. Here's the line and that was the key for us. It was an art form There was some debate about that at the time.  Oh my god.  No, okay All right, I can give you even a more direct example of it he's specifically attacking marvel probably because it's the most famous the most successful but Uh, one of his favorite films is the korean film old boy. That's a that's a manga adaptation. Oh, yeah. Yeah Oh, yeah. Oh, like where does he draw the line there? It's it's it's kind of fuzzy. What about james bond?  So I don't like it. It's not cinema Oh, we got glib glib in chat saying did anyone actually read the quote So not only did we read the quote? We've got a video advocating that he's correct and explaining it to us We're on so many tears above.   Are you not paying is are people not paying attention? Why are you? I very difficult thing rags to do to pay attention. I don't know why that's why this debate That's why the debate keeps coming around because people keep saying you're taking him out of context, okay? You're not reading the whole quote that's not what he said I'm worried what he said read it again.  Yeah, seriously Just say like if marty's if marty just said It's not for me marvel movies. It's not my thing if he just said that Dude if he said that I'd be like I'm right with you marty. I'm right with you. Yeah Yeah, exactly It's not a movie film. It's a film movie. It's like oh my god I think they'll trust it. They'll trust that we read the quote when you start actually playing the resident evil games ranks You should go One I'll get around to one of these days It'll be weird when I first start playing it and it turns out I'm really good at them just naturally maybe I just have a natural talent for me good at them. I didn't see any streams. I couldn't exist.  What are you talking about exactly what do you mean?  You see I grew up in a different time A different time for video games And um, so let's just say point and click is an older time Point and click is as different from something like doxels as alpha centaurs in terms of Far away is from earth. You understand what I mean now.  Also. It's so far removed from my orbit like oh Yeah, what I make is cinema. I don't want to be in the same category of thing making that marvel is in Yeah, that topic they brought up my large amounts of this thing that uh, total biscuit brought up years ago Um, and it was a really interesting interesting debate actually because there was a lot of people talking about uh games like, um, uh, what was it? Dear ester. Oh dear ester. Yeah, and he was talking about what what what makes it Yeah, where are you saying like, okay, you know, the the argument may be kind of silly, but let's like let's break it down What makes it a game a game has to have some sort of challenge, right? So therefore, you know, the more the most core Uh component you could demand in a game as a failure a fail state so Dear ester didn't really have a fail state. You just moved to the end. It's it's essentially What I think you eventually land on the term of virtual installation So like if you had some sort of objective standard of what means it what it means to be a game I kind of agree with that. I'm like, okay, if there is no actual fail state There's an actual challenge then it isn't technically a game like what would you consider going would you consider, uh, uh, clicking through Like a a virtual tour of a museum a game. No, not really it would be a virtual installation So like something like that if he was arguing for something like that, but like, you know, uh, technically and, uh, you know Constructively there is really no, uh, core difference between something like Guardians of Galaxy in 2001 They're they're the same exact thing essentially Yeah, and you know out of the core, um someone said he's not he's saying it's not art not that it's not a movie He's definitely saying it's art. That's worse. I know that's way worse by the way, but he's definitely saying it's out He's already said it's definitely out. So we got that we're clear on that Uh, glib said how many original films are being made that are made on film for the theater versus how many things A brain dead remakes of things that are being released on netflix or streaming via digital So irrelevant.  You know neil brane shoots on films and his stuff is putting the theaters, right? Just work there. Yeah, but I think they're still movies the quality. It's like They're still you know shot it with your iPhone. Yeah, I was about to say like you know that people do that RLM a bit over this shot on film the the film shot on the iPhone from whenever that was recently um He said it was one of the best films that he's seen in a long time. It was like, oh, well, it doesn't count. It's on an iPhone.  So well. Yeah, I want to get more people Yeah, there's no reason to like exclude in that sense Like there's a there's a time and place for gatekeeping But saying that you have to shoot on a real film for it to be Yeah, cinema is like I don't oh, it's like a pun with real But um, but yeah, I don't want to I don't want to stop that That seems completely arbitrary And so glib is clarified Isn't this what we complain about constantly that everything's a soulless remake film is a medium Not just a tim for movie glib. What about what about iron man? Tell me what you think does iron man qualify or not? Look line the lion king 2019. It's cinema. All right. It is I wish it didn't exist, but it's cinema I I think there should yeah, I think what glib. I think there's a difference between like making a film for like A statement versus a film for like just making more money but they're still both films and the quality will depend on maybe the the The commercialized quote-unquote film might be good also That's a film. It's still a film the quality. I think we're getting clarifications So iron man's great love it, but I think an end game is not great cinema So it's That's literally how we feel about it. It is cinema. It's just shitty I understand the desire to reserve a specific term for like, I guess all I can think of is higher brow content.   Anything that's being said We're being so clear.   They are They are. Yeah, you just don't like them Which is fair because they're not very good And this is the thing if my school says he said no literally anything that doesn't release in theater is not cinema That's my definition.  I can move on but when it says it's not cinema And you're like wait, what's what are you saying? Video games are just not the AAA industry call of duty like black ops 5 or whatever it was.  They require hundreds of people to make in some cases So like you've got to we've got to recoup that and nobody's going to invest in a movie for art reasons They're going to invest the movies because they want to make a buck And guess what guys the artie fartie movies. They still need money to get made.  Like if you don't want more marvel, but don't say it's not odd It is Yeah, just criticize it for what it is. Don't try and So because the problem is I go ahead Someone said we're repeating ourselves a lot So we're constantly responding to many of the same argument and slightly different Everybody's got an idea of what monskull says he said that should be enough to convince you guys This is fucking crazy that we have to do this Yeah, he is being so explicit If there's just one thing to be taken away from this entire thing It's that he was very unclear, which is the problem He needed to be more specific and explain himself in more detail But he didn't and therefore people took it the wrong way and it comes across as gatekeeping And if it were as simple as I don't like this stuff He should have just said that but he didn't And the problem is Yeah, go ahead No, what fernie said like I thought He was just saying it's not for him in so many words But then fernie pulled out the martin's corsese quote that just clarified his position even further and it made it look bad So I was trying to help you bro, but The big problem you run into as well is it's really easy To then move away from just the marvel assembly line stuff to then start Applying it to other things as well like just all superhero movies. Yeah, especially when you're actually Well, yeah, because instantly Well, just that's the lord of the rings thing Like do you think lord of the rings isn't cinema because it is Extremely comparable to marvel movies. It's very accessible. It's got loads of explosion stuff in it. Yeah Yeah So like this is even worse because this is this is the clarification like he he he did the quote some empire Empire interview in october and then he sat down and wrote this And he's a good writer and he wrote this from the from the ground up and and it's This is a direct writing from him directly posted to the new york time. So this is the clarification So he's be even getting even worse and more critical About marvel as not cinema in the clarification rather than just as often comment I'm assuming you're still here, right? I'm here. I'm here.    No, of course. I was going to ask you it. However shitty Modern age comics get I'm assuming you guys are still going to call them comics. You're not going to say no, they're not comics Yeah, we there's still comics. I mean We we have our opinion about them.     Yeah, that's all we just criticized it for what it is. Don't say that And re-categorize it into something else It is what it is and just just get over it. You can you can dislike it. You can hate it You can despise it all day every day. Not a problem Not a problem And don't try and re-categorize it into something that it's not. That's just ridiculous.  It's like Martin you're old.  You're four foot one And that's wonderful.  It just makes you look like a fool Well, yeah, and so glibs just referenced like they took egg right off ant man They switched directors for solos like so you saying that those movies are no longer cinema because they switched directors It was cinema and then it wasn't Like like you do you understand how hard this is for us to take seriously And can we just look at the long term like damaging effect too much Just I cannot take this seriously I cannot it just seems it just seems so arbitrary like placing all these different restrictions on what is and isn't cinema Yes, I think for us and tell us what is the differentiation between cinema and not cinema Just make it really easy wrap this up really quick and neatly. Just tell us what's the criteria He said no No rags Martin Scorsese did that you just have to read this other article where he clarified his position and said what he really meant Okay, you go read more Well, it was clarified again knows about the studio interference So Zach Snyder did not get to have Green Lantern in his film Does that mean it can't be considered cinema because it's not 100% his vision and where is the line? Yeah Everything's there was a reason for it though The studio didn't want Green Lantern in Zach Snyder's Green Lantern because they already have a plan for Green Lantern What's what I'm saying? I don't agree with the sentiment conflict interest Yeah, as far as I'm concerned it is his vision that whole film is everything he wanted But the studio interferes with the film and they act and then they make it like better How do you just don't have enough money to execute your vision? Yeah So isn't like the mcu technically kevin feige's vision more than any of the individual film directors That doesn't count because he's a producer not a director. So apparently that's bullshot any creative input at all Yeah Well, I mean nobody believes this because again a lot of directors are producers as well Or is the is the most important part that they were the directors or the writers like as a producers can't also have input That's worthwhile I'm pretty sure a lot of producers like films Probably why they work in the industry I just I think that there It's this thing where all the people who agree with marty have this idea in their head It's a collection of thoughts and like each one ticks a different amount of boxes But they all sort of just agree and it's like when you look at any individual part It doesn't work But still they will react to the whole like well, nobody's still kind of right though It's just like it's not it's useless fucking metrics made you feel better I get this is what I'm right I think this is what theo was saying but like it I can get how it feels better to look at the movies in the mcu and be like You aren't what godfather is It's like they're both films made and I'm like well, no, but They aren't the same. That's just good. Like the one is not necessarily good. That's the other thing. It's they're both I'm sorry. They're both You don't lose anything by saying that like hot fuzz and ant man are both films It's just one of them is an excellent prestige of the category I'm not even sure Depending on what you bring up like because then you swap from You swap to indiana jones versus marvel you swap to james bond versus marvel You swap to lone wolf and cub versus marvel and Well, I would go one step further. I'd say you look back in time.  It's like does that count of cinema glib glib did have given what I think is a final clarification He's like I don't like listening to people say that a great filmmaker like moises.   Just you know say that that's dumb, right?  What are you doing? And uh, yeah, I I I just think the need to get off this sort of obsession with like Gatekeeping cinema just chill out the arguments are shit, but We haven't gone through this video yet. So we could be wrong, you know Yeah, let's go.  He's publicly stated where some of his favorite films Some of those are like Star Wars spider-man 2002 And so it so like I don't know where he draws line like is he just like oh, that's a fun ride Or does he consider that a good film as you consider cinema? What's the difference? I don't know I think he's I think he's got a point in his head, which is articulating Exceedingly poorly. Yeah, we could we could debate the merits of the The churn when it comes to marvel The the similarity when it comes to their their their movies now And even going into the modern stuff, which we're seeing with phase four we can Discuss the merits of the the interference the the token directors the fact that Fight scenes are already pre-worked out and predetermined for the directors got on set We can we can debate all of that and that that would be a good discussion to have But it's still a film and it's still cinema Yeah, and the suggestion for cinema was plays in theater.  It's like, okay That'd be a cinematic release not cinema. Like if you're going to technical like release Release medium. That'd be a cinematic release. Yeah, maybe Because it's released in the cinemas, but that's something different That's actually interesting because a toy story too was originally planned to be a direct video thing and then it was released So hence my frustration now Like what if someone said like this they said about for the whole existence that is re-released into the cinema It's like, well, I guess you said about now. Nice Is like what an arbitrary label who cares? Oh, he made it I got one An executive decided You're not cinema because you were released to netflix if only you were released in theater Oh, I think that's what you do with the irish men Somebody took One of my batwoman reviews My batwoman rant videos They they cut the lines that I said They put a beat and music to it And uh, we released it on itunes and spotify And all of this And I got to number 75 In the uk itunes charts with that song With ocean man melt with meltdown ocean man Can you tell me are you gonna say to me that isn't that isn't music? That's not music as because I said stop music That's music it wasn't it wasn't recorded in the studio, you know, yeah, yeah As for net as for netflix movies He's just clarified he said scorsese demanded that the the irish man be played in cinema because he wants it to be seen that way That's what he believes cinema is marvel movies play in the cinema glib. What are you doing? Yeah, I don't understand That was that was exactly what I was gonna bring up I think that that movie was originally gonna be just released straight to netflix and he literally wanted it to be in theaters So that it would like kind of count, but it's just like why Why is your film invalid if it's just released straight to streaming? What give us the difference in criteria between cinema and not cinema What does something have to be to cross that boundary? Just tell tell us that and clear this up in an instant. That's all you have to do Wait, wait, can we just like go back to the vid first because I think the glib Conversation is taking over. Is that a fair statement? Well, the problem that the only interesting thing about that is that it's a video that can respond But the problem is like no offense to glib, but we have bounced through like 17 arguments like it keeps changing So hopefully this one's got one strong argument to make Or insult someone who enjoys or makes these movies What he is saying is that these big budget franchise films are different from the kinds of films that made him fall In love with movies or what he calls? They're all so similar to those.  It was drawn on paper. It's two-dimensional. There was no assistance from computers. That's what animation is. It's like, well I'm sorry, but 3d animation is animation and it's its own art story Well, again, like I mentioned But um luck. Sorry junior the the short film the pics are made It was like at that point people are oh, right. This is like an art form like it People eventually catch up like and then accept that it's just another way of telling a story It's not illegitimate. It's not like it's inferior to the one that came before it And it doesn't mean that the first the the one that came before it is like redundant or worse They're different and I was gonna say this is cinema It seems we keep having to come back to it's just not what he likes and it's like, why the fuck didn't he say that? Why didn't he say that? And then why did he not say that's what I meant when he had the option to clarify And when like what free he keeps saying when you actually read his quote He's saying outright that This this marvel films are not movie films. There's some sort of other mutant creature. That's the problem Like imagine that if in his like article he had like clarified he'd been like I understand that a lot of people are upset I understand there were a lot of filmmakers that like I upset who are inspired by my work I didn't mean to gatekeep. I didn't mean to say like place this arbitrary label on there What I meant to say was x goes into detail about that that would have been a way better way to do this But he's never taken back any statements. So yeah An art form that he played a role in legitimizing and creating His concern is not that marvel movies exist. It's not that people like them It's that this new type of film is crowding out the type of film that he loves Okay, so it's entirely his preference man. It's it will he just said it's becoming too popular basically Oh, okay. Well, popular This is what happens when you make something popular Yeah, even back is like The silent era with like Buster Keaton and all that like these types of like blockbuster movies that were big and like focused on like action or stunt work those have existed for like Yeah, those have existed a long time ago. It's just it's just different Like movies that have focused more so on like character or emotion or that type of thing versus action Like that distinction's existed like from the beginning basically I think people just tend to you know prefer to go see Something on the big screen when there is action involved rather than just you know people talking to each other Like the marvel formula It's symbiotic like it it kept crafting itself along with what the audiences were liking That's it just created itself almost right in terms of reaction the marvel And that's why we call it sludge now because it's it's gotten to the point Where you can tell and if someone was like sludge Are you saying it's not cinema? It's like nope calling this sludge though If you want our definition of sludge we can give it to you cinema, but it's also a sludge too.   Absolutely Oh, it's awesome It's but but that's the thing that's like are we gonna say that there is no art in creating a really Intense set piece like a really intense action scene where all of these people are just executing Like flawlessly in terms of hitting their beats doing these crazy stunts like there's an art form in there It's basically both you have just take both sides of the spectrum. You have gene kelly Who is insanely talented? You have Jackie Chan who's insanely talented doing two things that are in a way related But in the you know the way that they act in the film totally different things So Why does one get to be upheld to this incredible artistic standard and the other is just Shlockiness like how come is it just because it's not as old which I think might just is the actual answer One's in which case is the other it hasn't earned just give a time stage through age We'll just stop using the fucking word cinema use someone else Just stop it I still find it funny guys if marky just tweeted out lemma what's not for me.   It's not cinema. It's like well, you've got more than one person another quotes In the past 20 years as we all know the movie business has changed on all fronts But the most ominous change has happened stealthily and under the cover of night the gradual But steady elimination of risk many films today a perfect products manufactured for immediate consumption Many of them are well made by teams of talented individuals all the same They lack something essential to cinema the unifying vision of an individual artist. Sorry james gun. Sorry That's what it has to so that's what that's the thing. That's what makes it cinema It's just to clarify But isn't you not kevin feige's vision Jurassic park that's an adaptation of a michael kraighton book, but there's differences to the movie from the book john hamman dies in the book. He gets eaten by copies, but that doesn't happen in the film So It sounds so good to the people who agree with him, but it's bullshit The lego movie was directed by two people a lot of the disney animated films were directed by Some of them were directed by like six people I can't believe we're saying that lord miller are involved in a cinema now You know iron man isn't john favreau's vision avengers isn't joss weedon's vision Avengers was a risk. It was it was a risk. It had never been done before nobody had done that before it was a risk Just god ends of the galaxy was a risk. Like that was a risk.  Look what happened Well, again, it wasn't a risk at the time. They made it probably but it is now Don't worry about it moller they have cut off the cancer in the disney cinematic universe and They have cut ties with this woman What's her face and she will never darken the halls of making miles ever again Darken the whole Holds it comes in her whole life, but she won't be there Yeah, and I refuse to believe that a scorsese's film are when a hundred percent his vision from the ground up He had painters, you know paint the the matt backgrounds for his his long shots He had actors act in Probably surprising ways that may may have you know said hey, no, that's actually even better Leonardo Caprio You did better or different than I I anticipated but I like that So like it's a group effort like you you can't you can't take 100 credit for A movie you did unless you literally did absolutely everything you were the actor You were the filmmaker you're behind the camera you in front of the camera You did absolutely every single shot like no if it's a group effort you're going to make compromises You're going to you got a calm chat down We're responding to lots of you everyone's saying like why isn't glib on it's like we're responding to him Just like a lot of you don't worry about it. Like it's fine. You'll be okay. I just thought we're talking to everybody in there Um That quote though, I just think it's it was dead in the water now. There's no more interpretation.   Where you know, you have an author that'll have a vision, but sometimes the editor will You know smack down their ideas for their story The bible is written by an unknown amount of authors that has been compiled and recompiled over centuries and Countless different versions So is it not real literature? There's a difference to be found here because literature specifically is referring to like quality I think whereas cinema doesn't If there is a separation between book and literature Like it's all encompassing term and literature is a sub thing It's like the distinction Scorsese wants almost I think Something I don't like here as well though This idea that like A team like that you couldn't even come into a project to make a film as a team Of like three or four people working together to make this film and you all have like input and you're funneling it together Like that you are not capturing the essential elements of cinema That I don't The bible says bats are birds. You need to get higher standards Yeah, like every one of his arguments I can find a hole in it like he among his favorite films He has the 1950s adaptation of the thing from another world, but he also has the 1982 remake the thing Uh, that that's literally a remake of a movie adaptation of a book so like if he his argument about franchises and remakes and and just adapting something that Doesn't exist at that that falls apart especially when you consider that he has the fog which I believe was a Stephen King adaptation the shining which was the Stephen King adaptation Which by the way was Stanley Kubrick's vision which was in direct conflict from Uh to Stephen King's vision of the book that he hates that movie. I imagine getting all these questions to Scorsese What I feel like he'd be tied up as fuck. You have no idea how to deal with this. Yeah Oh, yes, like literally literally. Yeah shining Stephen King hates Kubrick's the shining Despises it. He actually went and made a tv adaptation himself. Yeah later on because he hated the the Kubrick version so much But like really the only difference is that he likes these but he doesn't like the others Oh, also the only difference Also, Martin Scorsese. He made a a movie that I really like the departed that is a remake of Yeah, it's like infernal affairs. Yeah infernal affairs. Yes. Yeah, that's an asian cinema, which is great Korean Could be wrong Uh, japanese He's all Korean one of the two. Mm-hmm. I think I'd start an agency. Well, I thought I was uh convinced from when it was Japanese But then he went Korean and I did see a lot of Korean films around the time I saw infernal affairs Oh Yeah, it's So Glyb said if you made him restate with all these questions You'd eventually get what you're looking for which what I'm looking for is literally just him saying I don't like the new stuff I like the stuff that I was making when I was around and at that point of like so he was just Right, he was just an asshole then he like baited everybody Because like this has caused nothing but like frustration for so many people because so many people agree with him without having thought about any of it And then those people like whoa, what you're doing is really bad like gatekeeping shit So just causes yeah, yeah Why do you think he hasn't taken it back because he's like he like he knows how many people have like stood behind it He's like, yeah, you know, I was right. I was I was right. They're not cinema. Yeah I'm I'm totally on top. I mean, I know. Yeah, I've got look at my film things like this Yeah, I mean, you know, also this is no Knowing what I know now about what he would consider cinema It would be really not that difficult to make a really good porno that he would have to admit As long as it was your vision right behind the green door Hi, and boy, do I have some visions? Oh my Established terms to distinguish between these two types of films So the way he's chosen to label the difference. Um, sorry I I hate to come off so quickly, but like if you were going to establish there are types of film It isn't going to be too Yeah, I mean unless it's literally the dichotomy of film or Cinema and not cinema, which is almost like why are you even bothering?  Yeah, we'll be uh, we'll be Dancing through the the field of flowers arms locked And you'll be dead Hanging out with us talking about how shudder island was a really cool Yeah, I'd love to talk to him about his movies that'd be great Because he makes good stuff Well again shut around What's easy for you? There we go films So the way he's chosen to label the difference is by calling the side of film He loves cinema and saying that franchise films aren't cinema It's a difference of what he loves and then Now we're in trouble Franchise films aren't cinema It's like dude, that is not what scorsese is saying at all. Jesus christ get out of that one and that's worse That's way worse. He's he's totally putting words into his mouth to like make him look better. Basically It's because people probably actually read the quote for themselves. They're just buying what this guy's saying So, well, the razor franchise film is indiana jones a franchise film It has to be a broken a franchise film has to be they all have to be It's anything can be a franchise film if you add another film to it And it can be shit and then they can make another one in the second one's really good So really the lost arc was alien Yeah, so the Raiders of the Lost Ark was cinema and then Temple of Doom came out and it was no longer cinema It's no longer cinema Incredible Father part two the god All right, let's see You have to be a standalone film. You have to uh be released in cinemas You can't have to be a unifying. Yeah a unifying creative vision by one individual My god Well indiana jones can't be because uh harris and ford he he would ad-lib and that made it into the movie So He chose to he chose to shoot that Cairo swordsman instead of close the distance with his whip Lucas had lots of a hand in in those films too. He made George Lucas. Yeah, he is So like This is so lame. Why would you make this argument? Because he hasn't thought about because we I have to defend the I have to defend the authority Have I missed anything in this list?  What is it productive? Yeah, he was talking about productive conflicts were like And the idea that somehow magically no marvel movie production has ever ever had any conflict between any of the skaters Which is ridiculous to think that You know directors have dropped off. They've been fired. You know, they've left, you know It's of course that there's conflict. It may be they're a bit more Maybe they're a bit more streamlined. Maybe not maybe not quite as uh You know as his productions, but Yeah In um apocalypse now had like a notoriously horrible production with all kinds of oh, yeah, like yeah Is that no cinema because I think it is Yeah Production is that another one Well, I think his thing is that if there is a seamless production, then it isn't cinema almost So it must have a strenuous production. Yeah, godfather was the same way too.   Like uh by by definition to have a a risky and conflict filled production It would not no longer be a unified vision, right? Well, I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna reference it again Mission impossible fallout They did not have a completed script when they started filming that one and they had to do several rewrites After tom cruise broke his ankle during a stunt Like the film that they were going to do was not the same film that they ended up doing after tom cruise broke his ankle For that's awesome Cory took some time to rewrite it and they still managed to make it like an about airtight story And the first Iron Man was mostly improvised so yeah Yeah So marty said something stupid Well, it's yeah, I guess it's this guy at this point bullet points a lot of the um like the criteria here It's very meta. It doesn't actually have anything to do with the content of the thing itself. Yeah, we pointed that out, right? The film comes out You say it's good. It becomes a pot of a franchise and some are like, wow, it's not good anymore. Is it Retroactively is now You know, the funny thing is right this the the categories that the qualities that we're listing down I just I just went to the wikipedia page of martin's cursesie and they all fit all of martin's cursesie's films so Only martin's cursesie movies are cinema guys Wow We solved the problem. We solved it. Has he ever made anything as a part of a franchise? Has he ever made anything as part of a franchise? I don't think so. I haven't seen it But it's it's funny to me because the only films that martin's cursesie like supposedly are Martin's cursesie movies. Oh Someone's asking i-man was mostly improvised. I don't know maybe not mostly But it's certainly improvised like that's famous about that film. There's a lot of it was improvised by jeff bridges and robert dany jr Yeah, like robert dany jr had to teach jeff bridges how to improvise because he wasn't that good at improvisation before iron man Um, they didn't ever finish script So a lot of the dialogue was like you will go into this scene and do this now make up the dialogue as you go We just got i'm a score scaly directed color of money, which is a sequel to the hustler. Uh-oh. Oh my goodness. Oh, no Oh, no, what? He's producing a movie called the souvenir part two, which is indeed a sequel to That's produced does producing though. Yeah, it's fine if he produces it. Oh directing. Okay. Yeah This is corrected.   I'm triggered I want to clarify. That's what this guy said. It wasn't what scorsese said, of course, of course This film's No, i'm just annoyed that they can't say that it's a bad film to say it's a bad film Muddying the waters with this pretentious hu ha bullshit. Yeah, exactly franchise film Can't get over cinema and a lot of people seem to be offended by this. I love long form tv I think it's a powerful art form that is often underrated because you know the video essay voice by the way It is often underrated Why do you talk this way? Really annoying.  They do they do the reverse and we yeah Long form tv. I think it's a powerful art form that is often underrated compared to cinema Scorsese also happens to say that I thought for a while. Maybe long form tv is cinema.  What do you do? Water you old man. Jesus Christ. I just like breaking bad. Not cinema. It's not Why manner not cinema it's at what point does cinema just not mean anything anymore? When when he decides he's the arbiter of what's cinema not he's like I thought it was and then I decided So just to clarify right like if someone wanted to say Hill House wouldn't count even if it played in theaters Because of how long it is like he made it like a four hour plus movie So what would be the cutoff point like please don't make these arguments. It makes my brain bleed What if the godfather though instead of being like a two-parter It was like the first film was split into episodes as part of a like a mini series like 20 minute episodes And then every at the part at the end of like each act it's like to be continued Like would that suddenly reduce it like I mean you guys Have you guys ever heard of a film called logistics? No Walking in at a total runtime of 35 days and 17 hours. Oh, yeah. Oh, I know about this one actually Oh, yeah, I've heard of that, you know that is cinema It's like a it's like a movie about a freighter, right? Like a freight car being brought on like a ship to a like a different place or something, right? We jazz you it it's like The argument just to show a weird one like yeah, maybe it hasn't they tv doesn't release on in a theater, but like Would if you took the first season of Daredevil and cut it down to two and a half hours and released it in theaters Would it be better to be worse? I think it'd be considerably worse Scorsese Simp and chat you never finished this thought you reflexively got emotional and defensive before a point was even made I'm laughing at what he's already said. You don't understand. Yeah, his premise is broken before he says anything else So we're laughing at him guys. He's deciding whether or not a tv show is cinema.  I run ironically in the go. I think that if you took the second season of Daredevil and cut it down to Two and a half hours. It would be a significant improvement Yeah Cut out everything else I might agree with that actually Yes Experience three episodes two four ten But that doesn't offend me because he isn't saying long form tv isn't valuable. He's just saying it's a different thing I know he didn't say that. That's not what yeah, why would we think he said these? I might disagree with him and think that the cinema label isn't the right way to make that distinction Between franchise films and the films Scorsese loves he hasn't said it's franchise films So why are you saying that he did stop it?  What are you talking about? Oh, what is he holding in his hand? Does it mean like oh no so now we're on godfather Okay These are so different Yeah, so so he showed hawkeye battling the creatures against these two waiting to see whether or not they're gonna get ambushed Yeah, they're different films. What what what does the context are so it like they're different films Man, he's getting away with a lot of footage here. Both. Well, don't worry. I've got it covered up Both scenes involve like some form of suspense Yeah, the very different scenes Suspense suspense. Yes I'm tired.  Oh back to endgame. What are you proving here? Why aren't you showing the scene? All right, you guys go one at a time I think the fact that they didn't go all one at a time proves the point even better.   I don't know at least try, right? Yeah, and don't worry about the music as well. I've got it muted as long as he's just you guys let me know if he says anything Yep, no worries No risk he almost got killed by a giant alien. No, no risk refers to the production. I think not the narrative Oh, okay Is this there will be blood? Yeah, that's right Yeah, so I could have done this too. This doesn't help with anything. I already know this is kind of explanatory I know this is the vague separation. The problem is there's no line It comes across as just what he likes and what he doesn't like. I'm sorry We already know which movies he's gonna put into the good movie section and which ones he'll put into the rollercoaster section It'd be a lot more in your Black Widow video Between the like interrogation scene avengers and like the much worse interrogation scene in Black Widow And you actually explain what the difference between those two scenes are while this is just like I am playing scenes from two different films And you should just know what the difference is Now we're doing and there will be blood I could be showing like the oil explosion where like it's just this bombastic huge set piece rather than this Quiet moment between two characters and make the films look similar So it all depends on what you choose to show basically Yeah, he's showing falcon escaping all the flak damage from the bazillion bazooka When he's not going to show the scene Where natasha realizes that despite everything in her life being a constant struggle of betrayal after the whole organization She tried to clean her record with is actually hydra.   We can't count that. Look at the explosions. No, that will Oh, that wonderful scene where a whole guy in black widow was talking together in avengers No, look at the explosions where she tells me that she's been compromised No, guys, shut up. You destroyed his narrative. Shut up So is that action is bad like I don't know Theme parks, man. No, this is roller coaster ride. This is like oh theme park. Yuck. How movies aren't about having fun It sounds like a challenge doesn't it? It's like try and maintain being cinema while also having a big action set piece. You're like, okay Someone open modern scorsese world Tickets are $2.99 a pop get your martin scorsese pop and go on the marty scorsese coaster All for the low low price of 10 95 in cinemas now To the right of this video, I just throw james bond indiana jones star wars even again Yeah, all of those. They're all roller coasters. Like what what do you think? Yeah, I would go and roller coaster as well I would look to see an analysis like comparison Comparing to Side-by-side two of the most similar scenes from like a marvel movie and a movie that he approves of like You know, like you said interrogation scene from marvel movie interrogation scene from one of his movies A slow somber scene where somebody's doing a long Uh diatribe about something in both films like doing a side-by-side comparison and seeing like what makes this one more emotionally appealing or cinematic if you want to call that which is kind of a BS term, but like he's he's purposely going out of his way to find the most Contrasting clips. Yeah extremely uncharitable like that. There's Yeah, there's nothing to be learned here And like this guy isn't doing a good job because he's always showing his action versus scenes where there's Spencil things happening involving characters and it's like this isn't helping at all and he thinks it's making it clear No Arcana interrogation scene Low IQ Now that's that's uh, that's a rollercoaster don't count Daredevil and punisher rooftop argument the rollercoaster shut up. Oh, it's here I like this movie stop using it for your argument Low key in black widow interrogation Don't count her involved like a science fiction element. That's not cinema This is so manipulative and he just keeps repeating this Back to winter soldier Okay, this one this one's an interesting choice. This is yeah This is this is really important to the characters this moment.  That's not that's not the experience of people communicating psychologically like what they're feeling to each other It's it's cap putting his friend that he lost in world war two and hasn't seen Well since getting out of the ice Trying to save the world You know, it's definitely not a call back to when they were you know friends back in the war and he said that exact same thing Improving that his words meant something Well, if they would let you just take out the action scenes and yes, you can have the cinema label. Okay, you can have it back There you go. You may have it back. Is diehard not cinema No, sir. No, I mean, I'm pretty sure there's action in it.  It's more reserved. That's not a unified vision.  You should have just the voiceover was needed throughout because apparently someone in chat Just said he goes on to explain this you shouldn't be laughing. It's like he told us that we could get it from these clips He said you can see it. Oh, yeah You can see it. Yeah, don't try that argument I can see what he's trying. I see here is one is exciting one is not exciting Contemplative that seems to be the difference Yeah, I mean, I think we're trying. I think we're we're on to his his thing I just I'm just curious if he has any semblance of good arguments for it Like we see that he's being completely Manipulative with this editing, you know choice of clips and everything like that just to see if any arguments looks like Yeah I mean, yeah, he's using a lot from other I'm sorry chat chat person, but he's very manipulative though Also, if you don't know the context for a lot of the scenes then like this is worthless Yeah, yeah, I was actually thinking now If you just don't know what he's trying to convey here, then you're looking at the screen going what it's just different scenes from movies It's Oscar, right? Yeah singing that's all you're all you're left with is one often has action scenes one It's just people thinking or doing things that are much more subtle and quiet So Characters then the dialogue isn't going to have as much weight So it's like what's the point of showing like the dialogue with scenes out of context if we don't know anything You can compare this to the you can compare this to the scene with red guardians singing to uh, Elena in black widow. Yeah But that would be a fair comparison. Well, you know, like well, what's funny? Well, no, no, no that doesn't count because that was david harber's idea and not the So if oscar isaac starts he has a scene in dune where he pulls out in the coaster guitar and starts singing Is that going to be cinema or is all the action sequences in dune going to disqualify it from being cinema? And what you've highlighted there is he would be like no, it's not about just singing It's about what this scene means.  So oh well, we might not in the rise of skywalk He should be showing a clip and saying for context this this this this Whereas in the marvel movies this this this this but he's not he's just showing Not only is he just showing random clips. He's showing random clips from Different movies and then dispersing with marvel movies. So if I was watching this I'd just be confused to hell what his point was even was Well, apparently he is going to explain this one the clips then so i'm excited. All right, okay It's just a manipulative expectation that you'll just take the face value differences and latch on to that Well, yeah, that's all i've gathered so far Oh, no on the soul That's a pretty dramatic moment also Well, at least it just leaves us confused Oh No, well, I don't you're comparing the scene from the control room from captain america the winner soldier to the final duel from Barry linden. Are you kidding me? It's the same thing come on It illustrates the difference doesn't it you see this is cinema And again that scene is so good if you have the context, but if you know nothing about those two characters it's it's worthless Yeah, there's Oh, no what was the distinction Yeah, so Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, sorry, he started speaking. When did he start speaking again? Oh Like 30 seconds. Yeah I gotta hear what this guy is trying to say because I had a muted. Sorry.  Sorry. It's your pistol cocked Big cock I'm assuming it's after this clip Oh, we're doing that game after this fight it yeah, this one guardians that one is better than the other But that there is a distinction between the two Okay, the core of this difference rests in the themes that these two types of films explore and the way they do it It's rest on the difference of the themes these two types of movies. So a type of movie can only have Certain kinds of things. That's a very awkward sentence to say. I don't think scorsese said this Types of movies can't any theme that is in a martin scorsese movie You can probably find a superhero movie that has that theme in it And all those movies that he showed they have vastly different themes I suppose you could put them into like a category, but like also they all have very different themes.  Let's just carry on People films do explore emotional themes, but those are often the filler moments between the climactic battles The filler moments At the end of the day, mauler, I think what all of these people are trying to say is they're gonna justify A martin scorsese shifting on marvel for their own reasons. I think that that's here At the end of the day Wait, wait, is this guy is this guy trying to argue that the the character moments in the mcu are just string scenes They're string scenes between trying to strain together the the the action scenes Is that what he's trying to say?  Seriously when whatever people cite when they watch like phase one certainly is like, what did you enjoy about it?  I love tony I love thorn It's like, well, no, you didn't you like the explosions and stuff like the fight scenes, you know, like no, I mean, they were fine. Yeah Yeah I am there for the character payoffs like it's not it's not the fight in civil war that the fight is exciting But what makes it meaningful like you can just get fight scenes and action scenes that don't have any meaning in a lot of stuff Um, I don't know why you're gonna make this argument about godfather everything that isn't the action scenes Just stuff stringing to the action scenes. Well, right because the big you'd be like well the big payoffs are like, you know The the the scene where is it the church and then all of these executions are happening. That's like that's a bomb Except that is a payoff that definitely is a payoff um And same with the the the car bombs same with um, I just forget his name the guy's sunny sunny That's right.  Oh, no, wait. Yeah, you almost dump.  Yeah Yeah, and then this is basically making a differentiation between like popcorn films and cinema and Considering, you know, scorsese's done both And you know, he loves movies from both categories. It just it really falls flat like there isn't really no difference You could say it's a different genre like, uh, this guy's picking Primarily dramas and comparing them to action adventure films. So yeah, if you compare, uh, your you know average action scene from indiana jones to something from You know a long a long dialogue sequence from the godfather. Yeah, you're gonna have a bit of a difference I want to ask this guy that like does indiana jones count? Yes or no? Yeah, and he could say yes, it does count because there's no way in hell that he wouldn't Yeah Exciting fights character introductions In what scorsese calls cinema these moments are the climactic moments. They are the ride that the movie So what we're referring to is marvel movies, but you're that but this is marvel movies.  I was like, whoa, did you just establish that Characters discussing things is like better than action Do you just want to get me from the the common person who might not like enjoy that?  Well, yeah Think of him.   Um, would be another one. Would it not I guess that That was Like it's near an action scene, so I guess it doesn't count Here's a good example at the end of Avengers when tony flies the the bomb through the wormhole You could be like, oh, well the payoff is the big explosion of the the the the chitari base It's like, well Really the big payoff is like seeing tony's reaction to all of this When we cut to him in the helmet. Yeah, I'm knowing that Ainside knowing steve watched him do it as well Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's the most the most important part is the really focused on the character Not the big action set piece and all of these chitari guys dying It's not really the payoff Another good one was uh, even age of ultron the when they're at the party all talking and and sharing stories and stuff and you and Thor gets like a little bit scared when you see his cap Nuts his his hammer.  He's like, maybe he's not the only one is worthy kind of thing, you know. Oh, no, no, no, no Um, that though. No, no, no Steve could pick up that hammer. I don't I don't agree with that. Sorry He could pick up the there's a whole thing about this. He could have picked up the hammer then and when he realized he could pick up the hammer That he stopped. This is what um Thing would you be said? Yeah, there was so yeah, but james gun also said what he said about polka dot man true true true true, but uh But I get I understand his theory of you know, you can you be partly worthy? I kind of understand that theory So I think it's a decent theory I think there's weight there's weight behind it No, I appreciate it dramatic steam characters and stuff. Yeah. Um, well, so now we're at the point where it's like it's not about having them their position in the timeline They have to be it. They have to be the payoff. It can't be an action scene. Just like man, that sucks Isn't this more restrictive and aren't they like trying to argue that it should be a singular vision Which would imply a certain level of freedom Can you argue the shining is a huge payoff is him chasing them through the house and the things like isn't that an action? Yeah, yeah It ends with like a big. Yeah, taxi truck Cutie. Yeah Full metal jacket is like a huge shootout. I mean in vietnam Yeah Yeah, exactly The third active heat is one big long like chasing and shoot out and and it's it's really really good It's very visceral, but I'm yeah, it's one of us here films too. It's on this list Okay Michael man's heat 95 that that last entire act is is yelling and Shooting and and it's like a dying. Yeah, it's like a 10 minute extensive action sequence following like the bank robbery It's like basically urban warfare. So yeah, I mean rip Quentin Tarantino It's a it's a it's a oh yeah jango and chain No I love that film.  Is that is that not cinema then because Tavern from inglorious bastards with the Man that that like ends with the big ol shootout But that's like what a lot of people think is one of the best scenes in the movie So people say that was like one of the best scenes in movies ever and that's a fair choice It's a great scene Once upon a time in Hollywood isn't cinema anymore after a leo de caprio kills someone with a flamethrower. Yeah And Scarface ends with that famous famous shootout and craziness and cocaine and stuff That anybody is gonna say that Scarface isn't cinema There's no way that anybody's gonna say that but like have you noticed that we've had I'm sorry. Have you noticed that we've got a couple of like um A different different criteria that's flippin around And like none of them succeed. They just don't but if you just say them all vaguely it's kind of like yeah, you're right. Yeah I don't like it Oh my god has to What happened in the end In the end I'm just gonna Music Sorry, I didn't hear him Explorations of emotion are decoration for the ride of exciting action showpiece How could you argue the reverse that the action And then people like they're actually seeing the substantive part which is the care like how can you say it's set piecing? It's the character development. That's like what we're talking about Isn't that kind of the whole idea of a kind of blockbuster the action that leads to this So isn't that kind of the whole idea behind a blockbuster like jaws like like you got the Bombastic stuff with like them going after the shark But what a lot of people say is the best scene is we're quints talking about like the uss indianapolis And it's just a quiet character moment. So you could be like it's all those character moments are like decorated by the action That's like maybe it's maybe it's not This is the realization i'm having it's like oh man you dinosaurs you get so frustrated watching action scenes You can't even tell that there's character work going on anymore. You don't know you can't see it For example, i'm not a i'm not a big fan of something exciting happens and you just shut down I'm not a big fan of age of ultron, but like do you know why it's meaningful that um Uh scarlet witch is with them there right now. Do you know why that's meaningful? I'm better not Yeah And you know, it's it's it's frustrating actually because it's like man all that work that they put in to characterize these people gets ignored Because they had too many action scenes like damn And he's he's not the only non action scenes he's shown he's talked over He's like not even giving a single Marvel movie a a talking Because you'd probably Under minus point by showing that hey there is acting there is emotion there's character work in these movies as he just said He's malicious as he just said the emotional parts of the decoration That's real how is that not insulting by the way it's almost like The quieter points of the movie are almost like the character building and then and then at the end if you want An exciting ending you can have something dangerous like at the end of jaws where they're fighting a shark Or at the end of heat where they're all shooting at each other and robbing a bank It's like once you've been introduced to these characters and their motivations And you can raise the stakes and now you're worried for their lives because you've now met these characters You now know about them And it happens with every single one of these types of movies like you now fear for them at the end so comparing the final fight in age of ultron to Uh a couple people talking in grand buda best hotel.  If you still have it message me, we'll try and get you on. Okay, buddy I haven't been able to get through to you It's been a long time since he's been on hasn't it. Yeah the pikeman. Nice to see you. Hope you're doing Please read form. I'm about to hop off if he wants to come on. I'd be happy to create a platform So Oh, it's up to him.  Well, no, he's he's admitted there are character things, but it's all decoration I find that way more insulting than removing them.  Yeah Yeah, I think he's malicious even Because he's seen it and he didn't show it but he can't not have edited that Without seeing it. Let's see the difference. Oh my god. You did it again.   Probably not. We're gonna just it's gonna be the ice. I drink your milkshake. Let's give us a little bit We'll have to disagree, but I'd encourage you to expand your film palette and maybe Yeah We'll have to agree to disagree, but I'd encourage you to expand your film palette and maybe This is the revert you're just doing the reverse of what you're complaining about You're not opening your film palette to something that's maybe a tiny bit more bombastic than that is to your taste So how is this any different to what you're complaining about with people not appreciating the slower moments in the emotion Is decoration he's seen these films. It's just decorative emotion. It's not real emotion. Okay. This isn't car This isn't me saying one's better or worse by the way. I'm just saying one of them has more value Does he think he's helping He's so arrogant. Jesus Christ. It's I'm sorry. It's it's triggering me quite a bit.    I don't understand like not only does it have to be bad. It also has to be not the thing they love Like like it's not it's not the hobby thing they love Like I have no problem.   Like The room would count under this criteria So it just said you guys are being genuinely malicious here, man. It's like he just said you've got to You've got to see more movies to understand by argument.  A lot of you guys are dumbo and you need to expand your palette if you want to accept Lovely long time.  Like seriously, holy shit So this is the pin comment and it kind of addresses what we were just talking about Okay, so I know the number one criticism I'm going to receive is for comparing action scenes from marvel movies to dramatic moments from other movies Here's my justification as I say immediately after that section It's not that marvel doesn't have those kinds of moments is that those moments aren't the dramatic core for any of these That's because you and you're wrong He just reiterated exactly what he said He said You haven't shown me why one thing is a dramatic core in this movie And this is the dramatic core in another movie because I totally disagree that the character moments in marvel stuff isn't the dramatic core Everyone disagrees with that people always said like the thing they really like about the mcu back when it was not All ass was the the characters. They really like the characters. Yeah a great example Captain america if we were to have seen him fighting some red dude throughout their through You know those scenes completely out of context. We'd be like, okay, it's fun I guess but at the end when the ship's going down He just wants that dance and that's what we care about. Yeah So like without that dramatic without that dramatic, uh, you know character building and that relationship We want to see you know possibly spark into something and none of it really hits you But when he's like, I'm sorry. I'm gonna have to miss that dance. It's like, oh, man Really really hits you in the gut and without that it would just be meaningless action So I I completely disagree with his sentiment there. You even reminded me I always remember the fact that tomaley jones like notices what's happening and he leaves the room because Gonna let them talk as he dies sort of thing They have a moment. Yeah, it's it's really really sad and Yeah, if you take all this action out of context like like thomas has done it's like, yeah, it looks like mindless garbage But the the the characters and their relationships and their desires are what make it interesting and compelling So it's just really really uncharitable To back up as well fringes initial reaction there if you just said the exact same thing So when he says as I say immediately after this action, it's not the marvel don't have these moments It's that they're not the dramatic core all we say in responses So why did you have the clips that way when you only chose them that way? Like we're back to square one again It's like you didn't help anything when you just said that and then he was on to say for any of these cinema clips I could have chosen dozens of other similar moments from those films illustrated similar emotional exploration Any given marvel film might have one to three of those scenes and dozens and dozens of action clips It's not about whether or not the marvel films have such moments. It's about where the heart of each movie is That the heart is in the action scene Wait am I just saying about Iron Man? The whole thing about like proof that toadie stalk has a heart It's like what do you think the heart of that movie is?   Why is the argument for why is it not cinema? Where's the argument for why is it not cinema? Where's the argument for why is it not cinema? Where is it? We all know it as you see he just said we all know So he's just he expects the audience to kind of understand Yeah, like it's like meme just said What's the point in making the comparison If you don't need to be accurate Because people know what you mean If people know what you mean You don't even need to say anything That's it No comparisons You don't need to do that at all But why would you need to make erroneous comparisons Of two scenes that aren't like Because that's the problem It's like why need these to make my point It's like well Maybe you don't have a point If you need to compare two scenes that aren't the same You could You could scrub through the timeline of any of these Marvel movies at random And find more dramatic And character building moments Than he has He specifically picked nothing but action Nothing but action And comparing it to nothing but drama It's like it's not exaggeration It's like it's night and day It's really like It's like deliberate too soft a word Well the problem is it's like Go ahead Sorry So like I know that's technically not MCU But you know sort of the same Spirit's the same DCEU the Suicide Squad You know a couple scenes like the bus scene Or the scene where King sharks with the climax And the fish tank And like is that not comparable To what he's trying to draw From the scenes from movies That he's calling cinema here Yeah honestly somebody Somebody had a really good comment Yeah somebody had a really good comment In one of these videos where they said I couldn't imagine Martin Scorsese Actually sitting down for a Marvel movie And I'm like maybe that's the problem Maybe he just watches the trailers And it's like it's garbage Well he hasn't actually watched them Yeah Okay so that's probably the problem He said that he's tried to watch them Ah yes he's tried Yeah so he's tried and kind of I got a feeling like has he seen Guardians of the Galaxy for example And all the rich character moments locked within Like doubt it I don't know and I mean And also by the way I don't even agree with this idea That's like well Marvel movies only have one to three Of those scenes and dozens of action scenes It's like well I feel like if we weighed it up The scenes were just people talking to each other Versus the action scenes that the scenes Are people talking to each other Outnumber the action scenes Wait how many action scenes are in Iron Man Usually the amount of character discussions In that film there is a lot Yeah Iron Man has what Like three major Four I think three or four major Action set pieces There's the one where he skates the cave The first flight the Gomero terrorist one And then the final battle Yeah three Yeah and in the desert like all the stuff with Jensen Alone I don't think him flying Oh no Oh no he died again He flew away for certain You might randomly come back Saying the argument I like it when it brings him back and it plays the argument In like three times speed because it all comes through Yeah It's your mic Fringy Or you might just be gone I'll just take this moment to say Thanks for having me on the stream I gotta hop off here cause it's like 2am And I'll leave it there He's been flocks like Vox just hasn't slept Either so I guess he's not gonna come on He's helping you come on He's always a fun guest Yes we'll catch Around Nice I've been you as well See you guys later Bye bye Later Yeah he has a shit ton of Meaningful conversations with so many people in that movie Cause we would say like Jensen alone Like there's so many All the shit he says with Pepper All the stuff he says with Obadiah And then of course Rody There are a lot of character building scenes throughout the whole movie That don't have to have him shooting people with lasers Remember What like initiates him going To like that town And then like in the Iron Man suit And then like basically killing all the terrorists It's because he sees like the pictures What is it Christy It's a character building moment It's a character building moment That brings you to an action set piece I think that's what The MCU does a lot of the times Especially inside of like phase one Especially when he arrives He does this little superhero landing And then he like punches that dude And then for the second part of the building You liked that because it was a theme Talk ride though Yeah No I liked it because I liked it because we saw Kind of like the Almost like sort of the Climax of an arc Involving a guy going from being a self absorbed Arrogant playboy to He really cares about these people In this Middle Eastern village That are being victimized by terrorists That are using the weapons that he himself Made and now he's going to use his own Iron Man suit and he's going to fly over there And kick their asses himself I don't know I think there's more to it than just I like seeing guys get punched Into buildings Not to mention most of the conflict In that movie actually comes from Him basically trying to dissolve the weapons Like industry of his company That like changes everything against the board Against him like that's what makes Of most of the conflict It's him fighting himself It's him wrestling his previous Nature of destruction His retribution now He's trying to find a soul He's soulless, he's empty He drinks, he womanizes He doesn't think about The repercussions of his actions Selling his weaponry And then he's compromised And then when he comes back He's a person that has suddenly got this Realization of who he is And it's eating him up It's killing him I mean that's why we literally That creature is the heart It's the only thing that's keeping him going It's a great conflict of character And this should explain why people get frustrated When you say like Yeah but it's not like my movie where there's an emotional core It's like fuck off Some might say there's a literal heart In Iron Man I feel like it's just operating off Of a stigma of it's a superhero movie Yeah Iron One is one of the It's a great film Period Regardless of Where a man gets in a suit Yeah it's great cinema Yeah well said To offer outside of franchise Movies, the Marvel films do occasionally Go to some interesting places And I'm not denying they hit some emotional beats Very effectively But I don't show in this video essay Oh my god He's showing one right now right Yeah but he's like He's just missing it Like okay I'm gonna give you this one clip I'll give you some of these clips If you drew Like a life drawing that was really bad He's like it's not a life drawing Parts of it are kind of like a life drawing though Oh thanks In the entire Decade of the MCU Altogether has as much revelation And emotional risk From individual movies What are you even saying So the amount they managed to achieve I don't know The amount they managed to achieve across the MCU Up to Endgame apparently He's been showing clips of it In terms of emotional risk and like depth Is about as much as just one movie From the era he was referencing Do you wanna eat a bag of dicks I was gonna say like how do you I love how he says all this stuff while simultaneously being like Hey I'm not saying they're bad I'm just saying that you don't have as much depth I'm saying that you eat McDonald's For breakfast, lunch and dinner I'm just thinking about all of those movies If you combine all of those Quiet character moments together It's like surely that would outweigh at least one of them And it's like I think you could I think you'd even argue that some of the MCU Movies are better than what they've He's presented, an argument could be made At least There are several marvelous scenes Isn't that right guys Oh it's nice Why not why Why does the difference matter And why make the distinction at all Well Martin's point ultimately Is that as this new thing As these theme park films gain more And more popularity It's a film Just call it a fucking film It's a film right Shut up I'm stopping people from making the kinds of The proper cinema that you like No one, it's never going away Why doesn't he fund the fuck out of a whole Bunch of them then, just do that Yeah exactly I'm sure he's got a little Dragon pit where he's got lots of his Gold coins Little bit of gold coins There's a finite amount of Screens and showtimes In theaters And the more space Why theaters It has to be in theaters It has to be in theaters That's so stupid Well honestly the movies that he's Looking for and that he's talking about right now They still get made and they still get shown in theaters They just don't tend to draw in as big Of an audience because there isn't as big Of an audience out there but you just have to look for these Types of movies Which means that those things will often be relegated to just streaming services Or there'll be indie films that are only You know put together And shown the only way you could see him Is on a digital screen at home Or they have like a limited release You gotta watch him like a week after Which is weird because I wonder what YMS Would have to say about this classification Of cinema Oh yeah Space is taken by larger franchise Experiences the less room There is for the cinema that Scorsese Loves dearly I don't give a fuck what Scorsese Likes it's not This is not relevant What's his name again Almost I have something to say to you On the flight Mr. Flight Mr. Flight A lot of movies that a lot of people Like aren't necessarily what Marcus Scorsese likes That's it That's the tweet and that's going to be In cinemas because at the end of the day Movies need to make money if they want To be displayed that's it I'm just stuck back at like whoa But there's still really good stuff That's made Yeah exactly Does Joker count or no Is Joker a roller coaster That's bullshit or what Well I think the Joker thing might have been One of the things that set all this stuff off Or at least like fanned the flames after this Because I think it was 2019 that he Said the take right and then a lot of people Questioning Joker So after So it took a year From the debut of the father To the film festival To get to theaters I mean like how close Was that movie to not being cinema Hmm I think it originally had like a budget Like a box office of like a couple thousand Dollars just because so few people Saw it it wasn't until like later on That it like got more attention because Like they basically distributed it Like COVID kind of killed it And is it not an adaptation Of a theatrical play Which by definition is not cinema So where do we draw the line There are adaptation cinema Like it doesn't have to be Completely Um wholly made Cinema because that I don't know the The problem with semantics right Like this is the problem with trying to Narrow it down to these narrow Fucking definitions rather than talking about You know what the thing Actually is on its own narrative Well someone just said at least he's being honest now And just saying Well in fairness he's not got a lot of Experience in writing Rex Does he not?  That's what he wants It's like the movies aren't sophisticated It's like I want to keep The rabble away from what real cinema is Let me eat my steak Well you could have your burger I need to be above The kind of folk Yeah And this focus on like Oh I don't want to watch my movies on streaming I don't want cinema to shift To streaming or whatever Think about all these Indie projects and stuff that don't often get theatrical releases And I'm just thinking like You do know that streaming is allowing More filmmakers to get their work Seen because cinema is a Because fucking streaming is a much more convenient way To get your thing out there There's not as much thought having to be put into The cost of distribution and All of this like you can just sell your film To a distribution platform And they'll put it on there They'll do a marketing campaign for it Will be there alongside the big boys Like this elitism is not being thought through And I would dare say It can be actively damaging To the very thing they're trying to promote Exactly exactly And what about the guy who's like Marty I'm watching it on my ultra wide You know 4K monitor I have like surround sound built into my desk And surroundings, the headset that's like Going to provide all the necessary blah blah blah Lights are off, the chair is hyper comfortable I have like the full screen in view And it's just like trust me Like if they told him it's like this I experienced taxi driver this way It's like what do we do now? Like what's going to happen now? Oh shit Yeah the experience of watching a movie Is almost always better when I'm at home Watching it on my computer I was going to say I can force to take a piss There's a lot of benefits to not watching it In the theater and I appreciate That the theater is a particular experience But I'm just saying like why do we keep pretending Like it just beats out any other experience All the time Like I remember My cousin getting into a fight with some guy In the theater Because he was so noisy And commenting about what's happening in the movie And my cousin just went Sir can you please be quiet And then they got mad The theater experience is not this holy grail Okay They started doing it recently Before the pandemic hit But like bringing in hot food And then like Some people would have pizza And some people would bring in like A hot salsary dip And you just smell it all and you're just like This is just annoying Why is this happening?   The thing is A remake Gotta be careful when you say this stuff It's bad if it's a remake, a reboot or a franchise The thing is a remake The original Wizard of Oz Is a remake of a black and white film The thing is a remake of an adaptation To make it worse Yeah The iteration-y stuff I know where you're coming from You're being specific enough You're accidentally shooting at many targets That we all agree are really good Stop it, you gotta be more specific You get it right I know many people have this sentiment right now I don't even know what this is I know But You still do have to see this stuff And then break it down as to what the problem is Instead of simply going It's a superhero franchise movie Therefore it's going to be bad It's not cinema Not cool bro Personally not very excited about One of the greatest living directors Is speaking up for a portion of his art form That he loves That he sees Speaking up for it Do you understand the reputation of the films he's been referencing have They are like You can't criticize them People get upset They're very cold and in people's eyes Yeah they're very well respected They're like the Oscar contenders That are always recognized at the end of the year And people say they're the best of that year And whenever they're brought up If anyone has a bad thing to say about it Everyone's like whoa Careful I'm pretty sure these movies don't need your help We gotta stand up for these films These films are beloved As disappeared Gentle and nuanced criticism Gentle and nuanced Gentle and nuanced Gentle and nuanced It is the opposite of what I was describing It's It's not nuanced it's fucking vague It's a muddy swamp of vague And then it's like how gentle is it It's pissed everyone off or at least a lot of people And then you say like you shouldn't be pissed off I'm just saying you have less emotional depth That's all What does that mean? What does that mean?  What is their character, Lasers? Okay, those are okay too, I'll put that in the okay part. Okay, okay. Yeah. Cinema, or at least the kind of cinema that captured the heart and mind of Martin Scorsese. Ultra close-up means cinema. Oh my God. It captured the heart of Martin Scorsese.  Man, that's some fin mongering right there. There's no way that we're gonna lose these types of films. Of course there's always gonna be all types of films because there is still a demand for the types of films that Martin Scorsese likes. I mean, a lot of them are great films, like the people are receptive to good content ultimately, like good movies. Yeah, and you'll have a new guy who wakes up one, gets born, looks at these movies, like I wanna make one of these. I don't really care about the Marvel stuff. And then he does. Exactly, it's not. Do you have a feeling of like, you know, let nature run its course? In a way?  And you're literally down to like one person. It's like, I mean, that's just the way the wind's blowing, I guess. Sorry. For us, we try and push back and explain what's wrong. For them, I'd just be like, guys, you just gotta hope that more and more of the people who like your stuff come and start making it, I guess. I'm like, this video was not well thought out. It has to be one of the most condescending videos that I've ever seen. It really is the perfect companion for me to discuss these quotes, man. I know everything. You should listen to me. Expander the palette. Yeah, that was the quote, man. I am his defender and I am also an authority on these things. Watch more movies, just believe me. I'm not gonna actually make an argument, but just believe me. That's the thing. Also, I can't believe he's going to diminish like a child who could be the next Martin Scorsese that was inspired by a Marvel movie. That could happen. That could happen. Yeah, it could, yeah.  I'm just thinking- What if he liked all those films, serials from like the 30s and 40s, like those would be the equivalent of the Marvel films of those areas that we're saying that. There has been shitty films forever. I'm sorry. Maybe if you want to argue it's more caked than ever right now in terms of the bad. The funny part to me is like, explain your argument to me. I want to know, how do you break it down?  We're like, the whole cause and effect thing. Everything falls apart from all these movies and particularly in phase four where in a dire circumstance it's destroying everything they've built. We go over all that stuff and we're just like, we want you to do other things. We know you probably won't. Like that's our conclusion.  You guys can carry on. But it ain't cinema. Like, okay. Yeah exactly, he doesn't explain anything. Oh my God, you're right. Not constructive at all. No one is gonna get any value from this. There's no one, like, how is anyone going to, like, what if, dare I say, what if someone really likes the genre of superheroes or speculative fiction, but they just don't like the sludgy direction it's going in? Like, is he gonna consider that maybe, you know, you can create meaningful, like, dare I say, scorsese-like films with characters that happened to dress in bright colorful costumes or something like that? I don't get this man beyond he doesn't like things that aren't released in cinemas. He doesn't like action scenes. He doesn't think character moments are meaningful if there is action. And I'm utterly bewildered by everything in this video. And it's only 10 minutes long. Well, yeah, there we go. We've officially covered this topic now, okay? So when people in future tell us, you guys have misunderstood Scorsese's comments completely. I'd be like, no one understands his comments. I'm sorry. No, we covered a lot of people who do. Yes. Hopefully we set them on the right path. So I'm happy to say it. I'm more than happy to say, until he makes more comments about how things he doesn't like don't count as movies, I'll, we'll just, we'll close the book on that one. It's done and dusted.  Pretty throw. Pretty dumb.  He still makes good films, though. No, absolutely. I like Scorsese's films. I've got a shit ton of respect for that, man. He makes some great stuff. If Scorsese just said, I don't like superhero films, they're not for me. Yeah. I find them very disposable. Fine. No problem that's your prerogative. It's the way he tried to remove it from cinema. No, you can't do that. No, you don't have the right to do that just because they don't fit with your remit of what you like. And then when you get a sick of fans like this pillar here, who comes along and is like, no, I don't got a bit of Scorsese, man.  Featured things which he absolutely knew weren't comparative. Then said, well, actually there are comparisons, but I don't agree with them. Then lied about international cinema. Then just said things which I don't even know what point he was trying to make. He was just words souping.  Well, you know what? I'm gonna make you especially ask, feel better, but we'll check out some different videos for a little bit. Some might just call them meme videos. I'm very grateful. I just kept having them. Hey. Check out some meme videos. Here we go. I just kept having busty Asian dreams. It was great. That's awesome. Way better than what I was dreaming about. I was dreaming about asteroids destroying the Earth. Oh, no.  I had a movie dream. I'm jealous. Oh, there was ambient sounds of spookiness. I don't know what the drink was, but I was holding something. You hold in the cup and it breaks off at the handle, but the cup doesn't fall because you're in a spooky mansion with ghosts or whatever. Wow, my hand just got really light. And then you look at it and this is what happened. I was looking at it and I was like, what the? And I looked around and I was like, everything was dark. And then a hand appeared holding it and I looked up and there was like a spooky ghost. And I was like, whoa, someone else happened. I can't remember. I was like, oh, that could be a good movie actually. I can just see the reviews coming through. Sham horror film tries to scare people with coffee. You know what? I feel like it's an untapped spooky market. That's great. Good time. Good times. That puts a smile on my face. That does. Yeah. That puts a smile on my avatar, which I'm using for this stream. They knew to use the right ghost imagery there. They did indeed. Let's try another one. Let's try this one. It's the only one I've seen. I've not seen any more. Oh my God. Oh, no. Perhaps it's what is our experience there. That's something that I say. This is quiet. Just like I got to turn this way up. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, we can put it back again. I've got a volume booster and I've never put it on full. It is currently on full. It's just like, yeah, I got it on. You better remember that I'm comfortable for the next one. It's going to be quiet. If everyone's got their respective abilities to be able to hear this, hopefully we can continue. Yes, I think I do now. This should work. Oh, I'm in cognitive. Well, rip me black. Sorry. That's something that I say when I go to Waffle House and they're putting syrup on my pancakes and they say, is that enough? And I say, name more. Name more and more and more and and more and then it's just syrup. Everywhere it floods all over the plate and it goes all over the table and it starts to drool down the size of the table under my lap, under the person across from me and it seeps down to the floor and she's pouring and pouring and pouring and I haven't said I'm done yet and then the syrup just spills out. It goes further and further and it hits the back wall and it starts filling up the kitchen then it clogs up all the drains and she's still pouring. She's still pouring all that syrup and I'm just watching, waiting because I'm not satisfied yet. She's pouring syrup slowly but surely. It gets higher and higher and higher and after a few. Not gonna lie, this is pretty weird. She's pouring that syrup and pouring and pouring. Oh my good God. Oh no. It gets even higher and it starts to fill up. Bring me the penis. The whole Waffle House. And it gets to the door and you can't open the door anymore because of all the syrup.  And then by the time. This is cinema.  This is higher is what this is. Everyone is just soaked in this sticky and they're gonna have ants but that's all right. Cause. Ants, that was cinema. You know, but then I'll call it. You know what? I would like to check out the syrup cinematic universe. Yeah. Yeah. I would say so. I was really kidding a lot to watch myself throughout that. I feel there's a lot of characterization to be done that. Yeah. Yeah. Let's see what it is. None tap market. Oh, you know what? This is not a classic right here. It's the maple cinematic universe. Also, tenure volume is back down now I think. This is a warning. Oh yeah, that's right. Would you fight a horse-sized dog? Oh my God. I can't believe that's the question. Is the concept serious like when I drink out of it or would I get in there? Cause like I wasn't on board with this fight. I was like, what? I don't want to fight this thing. It's an innocent creature. Okay. You're out for a nice stroll on the long man forest. Oh. And you're just minding your own business, picking some member berries. When a horse-sized duck No. You in the clearing and it starts to charge you. Well, so first thing I want to do is probably try and get away from it. Yeah. I don't know if I can take this thing on. I don't know. What's the lethality of a duck? I don't think ducks are very lethal. But like at that size, you wouldn't think a lot of things are lethal until they get all big and stuff. What if the duck breaks into your house? Cause they want it to run. Oh my God. The duck skin. I don't know. See in that case. Breaking windows. The duck, please. After that, we're going to do the squad neck. I'm assuming the duck is still in the house cause it's going to have trouble getting around. And now he's going to break in, steal your bread and he's going to break out and then you're never going to see your bread again. Runs in, grabs the TV, rubs out. The duck is not the TV. It wants the bread. I don't know. The duck is not the TV. I don't know what the TV wants the bread. They don't eat what proper foods they should.  Wait, wait, wait. The stew's duck is black. The duck is still in the house because it's going to have trouble getting around. Now he's going to break in, steal your bread and he's going to break out and then you're never going to see your bread again. Runs in, grabs the TV, runs out. I know. The duck doesn't want the TV. It wants the bread. I don't know. If I'm forced to fight it like for whatever reason maybe it's it's got my family at gun point it's like strange conversations happen you know they just do I feel again in my heart yeah I like wait actually Mueller and company I have to jump I have to drop off now is I still have work for tomorrow and I have to prepare for that I hope we didn't hit you too much you didn't hurt me guys the video hurt villain of the piece of the video very well thanks for joining us and thanks for having me guys it was fun to rag on a really bad video as we usually do on you that weekend it's always good to be here my guy it thank you for having me for one city 150 more episodes that's right on 300 hell yeah oh well hmm you know I'm tempted for this one this one amused me rags you'll remember this very well he's struggling he's struggling lots everyone could yeah you had a fire sword at one point because a kid gave him it that's neat I bet a number of mid yet could kick Loki's ass one the time about the fire sword say that one more time the one thing he does have is the fire sword but that's when a kid gave him Taran so Taran is the the protagonist based on the predain Chronicles by someone whose name I what the fuck but in the books I think Dernwynn was the name of the the fire sword and in the books what what the fuck see books that I read as a kid growing up Dernwynn was insanely dangerous and that was interesting as a kid to hear about a fire sword that wasn't just a cool incredible weapon but it was so dead no obviously I had no idea what was happening it's and I really did have just a so bite moment so powerful that you had to you know resist the urge to use it and you couldn't just whip that out and have it solve all your problems and that was one of my first introductions to that kind of magical potent item that it was just that deadly and it was about discretion a lot of the times when you used it and super different from back no yeah I remember liking those don't come back or as young adult fantasy novels go it's pretty nifty I like that actually having a stroke I think you heard something very different than what I said maybe that plane chat I'm sorry this old man was reminiscing what was the what so someone too much had the Loki could probably be beaten up by like anybody and I said yeah probably all he has at the fire sword that a kid gave him you said some other things I agree I agree I think you're great we were like nine hours into streaming so I