Jani. ...to the point you're getting to right now. Who makes the designs before you can sew them? I can create my own or the one we work with. And it depends on the customer the way he or she wants it. So the customer sometimes gives you specifications. I want some orange here. I want some pink here. Do you give them your opinion from time to time? Yes. Alright. So I'm trying to understand how it works. The client comes to your workstation at the studio. I don't know if you call it studio or the workshop. The workshop. Or the workshop. Yes. And then they give you the specifications. Do you sometimes have to go to their houses to get to see how the house is like? So you can give it a feel of your own? Things like the seat covers. You have to take the measurements so that it can fit very well. Yes. So you have to travel to their houses? Yes. Alright.  We've gone to Rai. We travel to good places. Yes. Rai is so far. What was Rai, what was Runga, we see you. Alright. So you're working for someone now? Yes. You're working in somebody's workshop? Yes. So you have to grow your own business in this line? Yes. Alright. Before we talk about that, there's so many people who sat at KCSE. They gave me the cut off grid. Yes. And they're probably giving up. Some of them have gotten into lines of work that are not quite dignifying for lack of better words. Some of them have lost hope. What can you tell them at this particular point that you are? I know you're only 20 years old, but you have some experience from going through that stressful period to transitioning to making some money for yourself at the age of 20. What can you tell these people? They shouldn't give up and then they shouldn't be forced to do something that they don't want to. Passion, very important. Passion, they should follow their dreams and passion, yes. Alright. So talking about following your dreams and passions, your parents always have a say in whatever the kids do. My dad is very supportive. Your mum? And my mum too. Your mum is very supportive. Yeah, both of them. Both of them. And her too. Alright. Have a supportive family. You have a supportive family, so it works for you. Yes. Alright. Another thing, what are you looking to branch into? What is something that you've seen happen that you'd like to venture into concerning interior design? I want to go far and travel. And you want to travel number one? Yes. Rwai is not enough? Yes, not only in Kenya. And then I'd love to open my own business and help those who are disabled, those people with disabilities. You feel like you can train them to get some skills, which can help them. Yes. What is driving you towards helping these people with disabilities? Or people who are able differently? I usually see them struggle a lot, their discrimination, yes. So I'd love to help them. You'd love to work with them? Yes. Wonderful. Do you have a social media handle? Facebook for now. Facebook for now. Just share it with the people. Your camera is number four. So they can check you out and see more of your work as we try to line up some of your work on screen. You can give me on Facebook as Masi Elaine. Masi MAWSIE. And Elaine. Masi Elaine. Masi Elaine Facebook. Alright. So we are looking to see Masi Elaine designs sometime soon. Yes. Alright, so maybe we can project the pictures on screen of Mercy's work. If we have them. Why are they lining it up? There's this thing about the youth agenda and the youth being part of governance. And the youth influencing the economic patterns of the country. We are the biggest workforce, if you ask me. But we don't have so many youth leaders. We are the biggest population of voters. But we don't have youthful leaders as well. What is your take as a youth in this country, as a youth trying to make some money? Are you satisfied first? I think the government should support us. A little bit more. Yes. Do you have ideas that we can give President Uru right now? Because he's a very big fan of why in the morning. Maybe he can help people like us get the machines, access the machines. Buy the materials. Be able to import. While we talk about that, I can see some of your work on screen. So maybe we can take it a little bit slow. Next picture please. Alright, this is a cushion for a seat. It's a pillow case. It's a pillow case. Yes. Alright. How long does it take you to make this? This one just like two hours. Two hours to make this. How much does it go for? This one comes with the seat covers. They come with the seat covers. So how does a whole set, how much roughly give or take? It depends on the material and the kind of chair you have. And the set, the number of sets. Alright, so there are so many dynamics that go into pricing. Yes, and the design you want. Alright, alright. I see a seat there. Is this your work as well? Yes. Wow, wonderful. Who picked the fabric? I like the design. We designed it with the one we work with. Wonderful. Maybe we can check the next picture. Wow. So the curtains in the background, did you do them as well? Yes. So you did the curtains, you did the seat, and so you made them like much. You made the colors coordinate well. Yes, they match. The curtains in the seat covers, they should match. They should always match. Yes. They should always be a relation. Yes. Even if it's in the colors. I like this so much. This is some of your work as well. This is some of your work as well. Wow. The curtains are so big. And people are saying you're kind of petite. Is it a lot of work to handle such big fabric while sewing and doing the work? It's quite challenging, but we're used to it. You're getting used to it. Yes. Maybe we can check the next picture. Alright, I like this so much. I like this. This is a good look. And this is done by youths from the 254. A youth from the 254. That means we can work with our hands. And there's a comment the president said some time back. My youth was Funguevinyozi. Did you get a chance to see this? Funguevinyozi to Fanyakazi. You never got a chance to see this. Alright, that's a conversation for another day. Anyway, as we proceed, maybe you can let the people know. You work under somebody now. Yes. You can let the people know why you got these skills and the people you're working with currently and how they can get some of these services. Okay, we are located in Karabangi North Market of Outer Ring Road. Yes. Wonderful. Masi, Mwangi, thank you very much for coming through to Wai in the morning.  I'd like to send some shout outs to my dad, my mom, my brother, and my friends. Your dad, your mom, your brother, and your friends. My young sister. Oh, your young sister as well. She doesn't get a shout out. And her. That is a big sister right there. Thank you very much for coming through to Wai in the morning. Keep doing what you're doing, you're destined for greatness. Keep giving back as well. Thank you. Alright, yes, we had our strength of a woman of the day, Masi Mwangi. We are on DSTV from 10 am today, Channel 376. We are going worldwide, so keep supporting, keep telling the people who have DSTV who have been complaining. We can't access Wai to Fife 4, have the DSTV box, blah, blah, blah. Tell them we are on DSTV right now and will be coming to you live through DSTV. Still on Signet, still on free to air platforms, still on YouTube, Wai to Fife 4 channel on Twitter, Wai to Fife 4 underscore channel on Instagram and Wai to Fife 4 on Facebook. Kalami Vali is coming up next with Galstock, so don't go nowhere.


Welcome back. You're still watching The Breakfast on Plus TV Africa, a former Deputy Senate President Ike Iqwerimaru alongside his wife, Beatrice Waneka Iqwerimaru, who have been denied bail and remanded in custody by United Kingdom Court of allegations bordering on organ trafficking. It was early reported that the UK Metropolitan Police, the London Metropolitan Police in particular, formally charged Iqwerimaru and his wife with conspiracy to facilitate the travel of another person for organ harvesting in the United Kingdom. Iqwerimaru and his wife were arrested and charged over their plan to bring a child into the United Kingdom to allegedly harvest the said child's organ. The charges involve arranging and facilitating end of facilitating the travel of another person with a view to exploitation, namely organ harvesting according to Metropolitan Police statement released yesterday Thursday. The victim whose travel was facilitated to the UK by the suspects was said to be a homeless 15-year-old boy picked from the streets of Lagos under false pritons, the statement added that the investigation was launched after detectives were led to potential offenses under the modern slavery legislation in May 2022. The British Broadcasting Corporation reported that when the suspects appeared at the Oxbridge Magistrates Court in West London on Thursday and were asked by the clerk for their address, they both replied, Nigeria. The Iqwerimaru's who were arrested two days ago have since then been remanded in custody to appear at the same court next month, specifically on the 7th of July. The suspects were arrested at Heathrow Airport on their way to Istanbul, Turkey, reports claim they were planning to procure a kidney from a donor in Turkey after the initial plan had failed. Now, we have joining us a lawyer, Justice Huwibu, who will provide some much-needed analysis on this developing story. Mr. Huwibu, thanks for your time. How does someone who is a, you know, a ranking senator has been in the National Assembly for years, you know, spanning almost two decades, if not more, someone who was called to the bar, Nigerian bar in 1987, someone who has a degree and a master's degree in law, someone who has a PhD in law. How does someone like that, who has his own law chambers where it's principal in the law chambers named after him, commit such an error, a blunder, or an alleged crime? Barista, can you hear me please? All right. We have lost our guest, Justice Huwibu, who's a lawyer. We'll get back to him as soon as we can. I'm sure you can understand the network sometimes. No, he's a friend. But I was seeking to understand from the learned gentlemen, like they call themselves, how someone who was called to the Nigerian bar in 1987, someone who has a law degree, who has a master's in law, who has a PhD in law, who has a, who is a principal at a chamber, a legal chamber, or a law chamber named after him, and who has been in the National Assembly, a ranking senator, and who is also a former deputy Senate president to find himself in such a situation, because of course, you don't see fire in walking to it. You don't also expect that somebody who is aware of the legal provisions in Nigeria and different parts of the world, at least globally recognized the conventions and all that, will find themselves in this kind of situation. So that is what I was seeking to understand. I'm sure it's quite a shock to many that someone so evidently qualified and respected with such a standing in society will find himself in this situation, not saying that he is guilty or has committed a crime, but finds himself. So that's why I'm using that particular description. Because first of all, the trial is not a conviction. And we're hoping that the trial, when the trial starts, all the facts would actually be brought together. And if he's found guilty, then he would be made to face the law. A lot of persons have expressed the fact that the reason they're very hopeful, this is not the Nigerian system. They have expressed a lot of faith in the British judicial system. And then there's hope. So if he's guilty, he will face the law. If he's not guilty, he would be all right. But some of the concerns that you have raised is, I mean, he's very learned. He's very exposed. He should understand. He should know better. It's that we sometimes do not understand the workings of the law. And there are some things that are very applicable. There might be universal standards for some basic issues. But in a system where you have things not done properly, we seem to have a very big issue with respecting the law, the constitution, even at the party level.  As simple and as easy as respecting the traffic law, it's a big deal. And so you probably would just, you have the same behavior and character. And then moving over to another climb where things, where you have a system that's very functional and very efficient. And then you think that that might just be the case. And you know, you might be taking, so the things that you probably think that don't mean anything to you, because there are some things that are very basic. Now humans, if you look at the laws in the United Kingdom, first of all, what he's going to be facing, we're looking at the modern act of 2015, modern slavery act of 2015. And if he falls all of that, then it becomes an issue at the end of the day. So what we're being told, I'm not sure if we have a guess now. So we're still trying to get back to a guess. But there's a normal, there's usually a haste for Nigerians to take sides in such matters in which politicians are involved because, of course, for obvious reasons, people are not happy. So looking at the mood of the nation and the comments by most Nigerians in the media, radio stations, TV stations, you have social media, most of them have already passed a judgment on a KQM model. Some are saying, karma is at work, that politicians have not fixed the health sector in the country. And this is as good as happening to him the next time she should fix the health sector. But I mean, I think it's too early to jump to conclusions. We've had a bit of from the Daily Mail, Daily Mail of the UK have put out an article where they gave us the words, the statement by the lawyer to a KQM model and then also the lawyer to his wife, one Neka, a KQM model. She, who the lady representing her, put the word out as well, saying that they have never and will never be part of human trafficking. They've never been part of that and they've never brought anyone to the UK for organ harvesting. That took some time to try to understand why they used the word organ harvesting because, of course, in different parts of the world, including the UK, you're able to donate an organ to someone who is in need. In fact, recently in the UK, they had to come up with new laws, with new laws, they have what we call the opt out option in the UK, which simply means that because of the new laws, they state that if you're 18 and above, when you die, your organs could be donated to somebody who is alive, who is in need. So, for instance, your liver, for instance, your kidney, for instance, your heart. If you die, your organs by the laws of the United Kingdom can be given to someone who is alive. Now, the opt out law or opt out option rather says that you don't need to sit back and allow your family members to decide what should be done with your organs. Maybe when they approach by the government, if they want to say no, or they want to say yes, you know, approach by the health authorities, you should actually take your decision.  So it's called the opt out option. So, I mean, for people to really understand why someone has to be taken from Nigeria to the UK to donate their kidney, of course, the National Health Service is sort of a welfare-based health program set up by the United Kingdom, the government, for the people there. You don't need to pay for health. It's what do you call it again, a welfare scheme. There's a particular thing I'm trying to look for. I think I'll call it social security of sorts. You know, the latest figures, if you check out what the National Health Service is saying, in the case that, I mean, last year the BBC put out a report that it had about 7,000 people who were on the waiting list. It's a big issue when you talk about the waiting list, waiting list. You hear them talking, you listen to their radio stations and stuff. You hear them talking about waiting lists. People who have chronic diseases who are waiting for a transplant may have to even pass on and not get one. As of today, in the United Kingdom, you have more than 6,000 people who are on the waiting list, as are today. You have more than 6,000 people who are on the waiting list who cannot... And it takes, typically, sometimes three years. I think, sorry, the average time it takes is three and a half years. But what they're saying is that it could be more or it could be less. So what we have now, if you permit me to just make that point, is you have, as we speak today, you have 6,414 people who are on the waiting list for a transplant in the UK. Between April 2022 and June 17, 2022, you have 834 people who received the transplant. So it shows how it is a dire situation to the point of government, how to change the rules to say, if you die, your organs can be donated to someone. But you have to take the choice now if you want to opt out. No, so I think that as much as we're also saying that it's important, we know that Nigerians have been very reactive with this issue. Already, what you want to say is that the case is already in public court, and so there probably might just be public trial and media trial. But we're saying, let's not be very hesitant in jumping into conclusion. The facts will be there. In different countries, you have laws that varies. And so that's the issue right now. What's obtainable in a certain country might not be obtainable in another country, but also bringing it to some things that are very basic. We're talking about universal standards and principle now. When you talk about the issue of human being and child trafficking, it's a universal thing at the end of the day. So I'm hoping that when eventually the trial starts, of course, the spin and adjoinment and everything has been denied, July the 7th, there will be hearing for that particular case. It would be looking at this legal practitioner, it would be looking at the issue of intention here. What's the intention? What are the procedures? These are ideas. We'll understand that these are dynamics. But like you mentioned, it's very fundamental that you understand what's applicable in another country. There's always the spiral that they say that if you have a hand or foul gets replaced, you have to take a step first and observe what's going on before you begin to take some kind of action. So it's important that people understand that laws varies in different countries, but there are some basic laws that are very universal. You need to understand that before you understand. So if you also look at the letter that's been made very public, the letter that was put out asking for application of visa, because there's also another thing that's very critical in all of this, and we're hoping that we get the answer. It's the fact that number one, the police there, is saying that you have the age, age 15. The boy is 15 years old. And on the other hand, there's also a report from this other side saying he's 21. These are issues that are very, very contending. They're issues that need a lot of answer. So how did the police in the United Kingdom arrive at 15 and he's saying he's 21? Now, looking at that letter as well, you would also see a letter. The letter talks about investigating. Investigating, there's going to be some investigation of a donor. I mean, investigate kidney donor or an organ, something like that. I can't go through. Okay, let's see if I can just go through the letter now. Not necessarily the way it is. Yes, this is where E.K. Kweramadu, you know, got it. So I have the letter in front of me. It says I'm writing this in support. It has the Senator E.K. Kweramadu letter head at Pepper. And of course his name and all of the things that you want to see. His date had 28 of, 28, am I saying clearly, 28 of? December 2021. And he says I'm writing in support of visa application made by Mr. Upo David, who is currently having medical investigation for kidney donation to Miss Sonia E.K. Kweramadu. I stay with that first investigation. Now, I think that that's the reason why I have a lot of Nigerians saying, hey, if we fix it, do you even have to, you know, go because at the end of the day, according to the reports and story that we have available, is that the, the kidney didn't match. There wasn't really a match. And that's why he was on transit, you know, to get another donor. But the big question would be, it gets back to the number one question that you have asked, is that should you need to travel to carry out this investigation? Don't we have what he takes in Nigeria to find out if, you know, the kidney actually match? So you need that to, you know, make that journey first outside of Nigeria to go find out. So if he did that within Nigeria, maybe all of this will probably have been, you know, in this particular space and all of that. Yes. But that's an important question. Before we move on to some other aspect of this, it's, it's, it's good that this letter was leaked. I'll be interested in knowing who leaked this letter out. But it was leaked to the to the public and it's in the public space. You can see that indeed, Senator E.K. Kweramadu wrote to the UK visa authorities asking for a visa for Mr. Uqbo and Waminidh David, who is currently having medical investigations for kidney donation to Miss Sonia Kweramadu. Who is Kweramadu's daughter? David and Sonia will be at the Royal Hospital of London, and I will be providing the necessary funding. You know, so it was clear the man didn't hide anything. He was clear. But the reason. So the question is coming up and, you know, one could ask why did Kweramadu have to state all these things in the letter? You know, so the reason why he has to. I'm not a medical doctor, but if you had one, I'm sure they'll say that sometimes you have to have the the recipient of the organ together with the the the he talks about investigation. You see the thought. I'm going somewhere to get out of the donor so they can test to see as much that you can see that he said there was an investigation going on in Nigeria to determine the suitability. Where is that? To determine the match. It's on that. It's on the paper on the page there. All right. So those those medical that medical investigation is what he was talking about currently having a medical investigation. Now, of course, it maybe it could be suspected that Sonya was already in the UK receiving her medical attention. The Kweramadu's have a house as it was had before the court in Oxbridge. The magistrate's court in Oxbridge in somewhere in North London, a place called Middlesome, I think is the name. So they have a house there. So so so it it maybe we don't know a lot about this, but it's possible that Sonya was was receiving medical attention in the UK. I mean, it's not far fetched and it's easy to understand that you may want to have the person who is donating the organ somewhere near the person who is receiving the organ. I would be surprised if they they wearing sure that this guy was a match because those medical investigations going on in Nigeria should help. But but but the reason why Kweramadu had to state all things is all these is that there is there is a visa. You know, it the information is really available on the UK government website. There's a visa called the UK standard vis-ta-visa that can be used to go to the United Kingdom for business purposes. You want to visit on business. You want to visit for study. You want to visit as an academic. And also when you want to visit for medical reasons. Now, one of the the things that you can visit the UK as a standard vis-ta on as a standard vis-ta for medical reasons will be to donate an organ. All right. They have three reasons. The number one is to have a private medical treatment at a hospital or other medical facility, which is what a president does. Number two to have what I think he does anyway. Number two is to have a treatment at an NHS hospital. And the third one is to donate an organ to a family member or close friend. Now, this includes being assessed for suitability as a donor match. So you can actually travel, get a visa, apply for a visa, not just to go and donate, but also to travel to go there to see if both of you match. You will be given a visa for that. You'll be given a visa for that. But it helps strict rules. What they say is that you must, you must, you must be a member of a recipient's family. All right. They say you can only visit the UK to donate organs to a family member who you're genetically related to, for example, your sibling or your parent. B, someone who you have close personal relationship with, for instance, your partner or your friend. All right. So these things exist because a lot of people are asking, why didn't they get the donation from UK? They have a shortage up there. And then secondly, you have this visa, which is available. So the man had to probably state that on the letter so that they could understand the kind of visa they're applying for. I'm told we have a guest back on the line. Justice Uhuebu is a lawyer. Good morning to you, Justice. And great to have you back. Hello, Justice Uhuebu. Can you hear me, please? All right. All right. Since he apologized for that, we'll try and reconnect with him. So there's this possibility, mercy, to have this apply for this visa. So I'm sure that's why he had to. And it's clearly stated on the UK government website that you can get that visa, not just to go donate an organ, but to go test for suitability.  So it's not a surprise that he had to state that. But also, there are criteria. The person must be someone who you've had a close personal relationship with, or a family member, genetically. You know, I mean, that can be stated. We know what happens. But why are they here? Just to make another point, sorry, mercy. Why are they looking out for things like this? The United Kingdom, the people and the government, they are really big on forced organ extractions because of the shortage in the UK. A lot of British citizens, some of them, let me say, have to travel to China and other countries to get organ transplants. Now, the United Kingdom has been a very, very, very concern that you have what we call forced organ harvesting because, I mean, we have to look at also the difference between organ harvesting and organ donation, all right?  Nobody can say that you donated something that you didn't easily or willingly give, you know? So they now came up to say, OK, forced organ harvesting is something we don't want in our country. We have information from people in China that some of them who are prisoners of conscience have their organs forcefully taken from them to be given to people who need them. And there are citizens that are traveling from the UK because of the long waiting list and the expense that you'd have to incur if you're going for private care that some citizens are going to China to get transplants. Now, we don't want our citizens to go to China to get organ transplants if it's possible that those organs were forcefully taken from people without their consent. Yes, yes, the consent. So you have forced organ harvesting. As a matter of fact, a couple of years ago, not less than 40 MPs in the British Parliament had to, you know, support a bill to the effect that such what we call organ tourism should be should be banned. And this year, a bill was passed into law. The UK's health and care bill was passed into law. A new piece of legislation that was said to prevent or will prevent, expect to prevent British nationals from traveling abroad to receive an organ transplant. They want to make sure that whoever receives a transplant abroad got it for someone from someone who willingly gave it. It's like, for instance, having a a T-shirt company, maybe a UK business that manufactures T-shirts in Taiwan or Bangladesh or Vietnam. And then they get to hear that they're using child labour.  I mean, that's why that's why that's why I'm saying that the a lot of faith has been expressed in the judicial system of, you know, the United Kingdom. And everyone is expected that it's going to be as a fair system. There's a lot of trust has been expressed as much as a lot of persons are already jumping into conclusion and, you know, trying to go ahead with giving ruling and judgment just before the trial. It's already, you know, you have a case already. But the point here is this, a lot of persons have queried. And the issue is, if we had, you know, a system where we're able to sort out what we have, we're able to, if you look at the letter that's been made public, that letter that he wrote to the British Embassy or commission, if you want to say, talking about investigating. There's nothing wrong. I mean, I don't think that anybody will be talking about the issue of having. Yes, mercy, sorry to interrupt you. I'm told we have our guest back on the line. Justice Huerbu, can you hear us? Hello, Justice Huerbu, are you there, please? Can you hear us? Fortunately, we can't have lost contact with our guest. So, mercy, this is quite an interesting one. And fortunately, our guest is having some some issues with his connection, but we'll try very best to see if we can we can do that. So the question has been about, you know, investigating. So it was very obvious that the process and which will a lot of persons have said legal practitioners, you want to have people saying that the intention would also be looked at. These are factors that will be considered during the hearing. But we don't want to be very jumpy about it. The issue is the intentions of the parties will be looked at. That's number one. And secondly, you would also be looking at the issue of, you know, the procedure. These are very critical issues. The laws actually varies and fingers across and we're hoping that justice would actually be met at whichever way. Not onto the other hand is the fact that people, Nigerians are already saying, hey, if we had a medical system, you know, sorted out, if we had faith in the medical, you know, structure that we have an institution, then we would not even have any reason to always want to go out. That's because it was very certain with that letter that he wasn't true. It wasn't going to be a donor. It was also going to be like, hey, we're just going to have a kidney donation, this person is going to be having a kidney donation. It was an investigation to ensure that there's a match. Unfortunately, according to the reports, you know, it feels like the donor wasn't really a match, but a lot of it. It's a concern. I mean, that's what happens when you have a system that functions. So the developed client, you know, you have structures, you have laws and things are not done as you should think. But we're hoping that the facts will be actually brought out. Fingers are very crossed. And let's see how all of this pans out. We're also asking everyone, you know, to relax and allow, you know, these professionals, I mean, the the law itself, the judicial system to do its job without we jumping into conclusions, because the facts would actually be brought out and let's not be very hasty with public judgment on this particular case. But we live to the point I was trying to make very important before we go is that, you know, all these things that we're saying is to help people understand what's going on and why, you know, this is wrong. Also, the questions on the minds of members of the public out there. But the point I was trying to make was that they it is wrong to take an organ from somebody who does not voluntarily give it and their statistics showing that is a growing business and trade in the world. We've had people who have reported in Nigeria that they were almost abducted. I think last month there was a story from a lady in Port Hackett who said she had this one chance experience, or we call one chance in Nigeria, where she was almost kidnapped in a bus. You know, they'll tell you it's only one seat left.  And you get into the bus and then you abducted. She managed to escape. But she said they pointed a gun at her, opened a cooler and showed her body parts, you know, and said, if she moves, they'll shoot her, is what she said. So we've had we've had response, you know, experiences like this. It was in 2017, former Nigerian Aviation Minister Femiq Faniqaydi said, you know, in the height of this whole slavery thing in Libya of blacks, he said that most of them have killed and they have the organs exported to countries like China. So it's interesting to see if the UK authorities are really, really concerned about the morality of their citizens paying their way to places like China, spending their own money to take care of themselves and get transplants. They don't need to be the ones who who extracted these organs illegally. But they just do not want there to be any complicity of any nature. So if you look at that, now imagine having someone trafficked allegedly from Nigeria to the United Kingdom, which means that they were taken there under false pretenses or against their will or without their consent or that appearance allegedly suspect, suspectedly. And then secondly, apart from trafficking, suspected intention or intent to harvest organs as a second one. This happening on their soul, they are going to frown at it very, very seriously. This is a serious case and nobody can can talk them out of this. Definitely, it's not going to happen. But we need to be aware of what's happening in the world. Also, the fact that even if we have the health system working in Nigeria, it will still wouldn't make it right to to to harvest people's organs. So that's not even the case. I mean, we're just looking at the issues now, like you've rightly mentioned. That's not the point. We're not saying that we're very in the know that a lot of you know, organ harvesting is going on in the world. I mean, I'm sure that you're very also conversant with a trend of in Zimbabwe where people are taking out their toes and selling it off. So all of these things I know. We're just saying that if you look at the reactions of Nigerians, you have mentioned the Nigerians have been very critical and saying, oh, if we have the medical sector, which is very key. I mean, let's even look at it. How many times have we had that the president of the United Kingdom came to Nigeria for some medical treatment? How many times have you had that members of the parliament here in Nigeria or here, anybody coming to Nigeria to seek medical treatment? If you look at the letter, the pointers, could we or could he have avoided the situation? If you say you're going to have a kidney transplant, he wasn't very sure. It was going to be an investigation. That's what the letter says. And we're just being very careful. So we don't jump into the case. I mean, we're not lawyers. We have the judicial system already. They will actually follow due process. And the reason why Bill was not granted was because it involves different countries. And so this would actually allow, you know, for the entire process. And this is what a lot of people are seeing. A system that actually works, a system that respects procedures and, you know, respect the law and things that are applicable. And that's what exactly what it is. You know, the issue that is very universal and basic is that lives will be protected. Humanity is number one. And when you also look at the issue of the age that you saw, you have on the one hand, because following the news and the reports, you have the United Kingdom media reporting 15 years old. And on the other hand, you're hearing is a 21 year old whose report do we then believe? Let's not understand that at 15, you're still looking at this child as a minor. They don't have any right to give consent to whatever it is. And so should they have someone who would actually give all of that? But this is not actually our duty. That's the much we can take at this point in time. Mostly before you go, I think it's a very important point you've raised and since we're here to enlighten people, just give me a second or two to say this, that it's a question that a lot of people have asked, you know, about the age and everything. Now, look at the provisions. I mean, the NHS website is very rich and anyone can go there and check it out. They asked, we have explainers for everything. So the question is asked, you know, as far as life, organ donation is concerned, we have to live organ donation and donation from people who have passed on. They ask, is there an age limit to becoming a donor? So the age, each of the age really doesn't come to play in terms of whether the age is a factor in determining guilt or not. But really the the consent, like you said, now there's no age limit according to NHS to be an organ donor. The decision about whether some organs or tissue are suitable for transplant is always made by medical specialists, but children can donate, but it has to be no more on consent. Also, they may need to go to the court to get approval, you know. So we'll get more details, like you said, as time goes on. But we have to move on. We'll be back after this break to talk some more right here on Breakfast on Plus TV Africa. Stay with us.


Thank you. Hi, I'm Erika Brodnog. I'm a mum of five, a serial entrepreneur, a PhD in behavioural science at the LSE, and Sky News' resident parenting expert. I'm also the co-founder and CEO at Cami. Patent pending, AISP support for life's key journeys. Alexa for families. So this isn't my first start-up. I scaled my previous company to more than 15 million preloads. My co-founder Helen holds two PhDs in computer science, and NLP from the University of Cambridge. Our COO Jacob spent 10 years in ops and growing start-ups, and we're flanked by an advisory board, including Googlers, a hedge fund manager, and exited entrepreneurs, all experienced in scaling innovative companies. So we're on a mission to change the lives of millions of families while capturing a multi-billion pound market. So I'd like you to meet Fiona, Jody and Neil. They're from different backgrounds, cultures, and socio-economic classes. The one thing that's uniting them is that either having or being part of a family, whether it's thinking about having a child or working through the hormonal imbalances of the menopause, is turning their world upside down. Family life and all of its micro journeys are tough. We receive no training, and we're expected to balance a number of spinning plates with less support than ever before. And whenever they have questions about either their parenting or the menopause, it takes an average of four hours of searching time to sort through a sea of information. Some of it's accredited, some of it's not, and then they're left feeling confused and conflicted with answers that aren't personalised to their individual circumstances. So employers who fail to support their working families are losing their best talent, and they're bearing costs of more than £8 billion a year, which will only rise as more families are impacted and begin to demand balance. And that's where CAME comes in. Our AISP platform is powered by Human Backend and provides evidence-based answers to users' questions instantly. Our curated content that's sorted by our algorithms ensures that everything that they see is relevant to them, and they get the expert one-on-one coaching that families need to thrive. We provide fully-inclusive care through all of life's journeys, including fertility, miscarriage, divorce, eldercare, menopause, and even the manopause. So our patent pending tech features the emotion and sentiment detection that really is central to maximising employee engagement. So this allows us to build what we call an internal weather report. And what that is is a picture of an employee's mental state from the words that they use and the speed and pressure of their typing. Our content and support are then targeted, making our service hyper-personalised, and once fully trained, our AISP will minimise the amount of human interaction that's needed. What that will enable us to do is both scale without exuberant human costs and provide aggregated insights on organisational wellbeing to the employers that we serve, truly setting us apart from our competitors. So our B2B SaaS subscriptions range from £1 to £9 a month, offering us an average annual contribution margin of £43 per employee. We target companies where equity and equality is a priority, and we have more than £300,000 of contracts in proposal and a growing pipeline of clients who understand the need to provide vital support for their people in these times of unprecedented uncertainty. We've grown from two to eight clients in the last year and will reach 75K in ARR this year. So we're targeting a seed round of between £2 and £4 million, and we have already signed an ASA for the first £360,000 of that money. And you'll be joining investors including Google for Startups and Morgan Stanley, who have recently invested £200K into Cami. So with this investment, we'll be poised to penetrate the £40 billion SaaS employee wellbeing market while helping people like Fiona, Josie and Neil to be more present at home as well as more productive at work. And we'd love to have you on the journey with us. So thanks for listening, and I will look forward to connecting with you after the pictures.


Going on everyone Sam here with Lane sports car driven 23 putting the NT baseball hobby 4 box case number 16 random team So there's a looking at it your random results as always you can find these all on the website under the results tab as well as the link in chat So good luck That's now doesn't matter I'm all good. That's that's good It is good That's second half yards 226 Good luck everybody thought he was gone. I thought he was gone I was gonna be like great the only two times they scored yo-yo touchdown They are these two stadiums right next to each other what came then and they're close I don't know if they're right next to each other. I know they're super close Tough Tampa should be 52 and 99 for the Cardinals Ozzie Smith came use bat on the booklet Congrats on that cardinals legendary materials Jersey card is gonna be Kevin Perrata 42 a 49 that'll be going to the Mets on the National Treasures Jersey card Very nice. Congrats Mets. We've got a Kyle Manzardo two-color patch one of ten for the Rays Where's he know Cleveland? He's a volley trade, right? Yeah, so still go to the Rays obviously as he's camp on the card We've got moose scouring for the inks 41 and 99 Grats on that game used at Jersey moose scouring We've got our first auto is gonna be a diamond autographs three color three color three color patch auto eight of ten Go to the Braves gyaritchie. That's on that. Bravo's capturing Bravo. We've got a Mario Soto 49 of 99 the field pass auto that'll be going to the Reds congrats since he got some Chinese finesse and that sounds good Mario Soto Penmanship Kevin Perrata 76 of 99 on the game are not game use but Jersey auto for the Mets on card though It is on card. We've got 19 of 49 retro ink Paul Molliter for the Brewers. That's when they're Milwaukee on card Retro ink and then a 77 and 99 Evan Carter for the Rangers on card Mt signatures congrats on that Rangers. He is a stud man. He'll be one of the big guys going into This one into series one. Yeah, 24 series one. Yeah, you excited for that man. I'm really looking forward to series one To to go everybody. Yes The next break Lamar VP all day long. Oh, yeah, we knew that It's gonna be two for him. Huh? Yeah, no answer right now, dude Not McDonald is making this game very tough. I knew that was gonna happen I had a feeling the second half adjustments. Why didn't go into full-on panic mode yet? I knew the defensive second half adjustments would be really solid Stop Jordan Jordan We've got 93 of 99 Marcello Meyer on the On-card Jersey Auto for the Red Sox at Boston that it's gonna be a Brian Rocchio 15 of 25 three-color patch That's on that one there. I'm guardians. Nice. That's awesome Jordan. Hell, yeah, man We've got five of ten that is two-color patch of Owen white for the Rangers Good stuff there at Tejas got treasured stats 630 home runs Ken Griffey Jr. 24 of 99 Very nice one there for the Mariners Three-color patch ten of ten Bob Feller for Cleveland. Nice one there guardians.  Oh, yeah coach worn. I should say coach worn We've got 22 of 99 drew Roma. That'll be Jersey Auto going to the Rockies Congrats, Colorado 33 of 99 is gonna be Gabriel Hughes for the Rockies again. That is four-colored patch auto Or colored a prospect patch auto good stuff there Rockies now. Oh, this is awesome ten of 25 for the Yankees Chen Meng Wang Who's my guy? That's cool. He was my dude. I love me some Chen Meng Wang back in the day That is super dope super super cool Congrats Yankees Chris M on that one Royal ocean stuff man We've got a how you Lee 53 of 99 congrats on that Phillies on the three-color patch How you Lee and then we've got Eckler's Choice ten of ten Evan Carter three-colored Prospect patch auto good stuff there again Rangers Rangers double up on Evan Carter's now Not bad Chen Meng long. I know I really haven't heard that name in forever man Got 68th of 99 legendary signatures of Harman Killabrew So that's senators. Is that gonna be which senators that gonna be twins? I would think because I would think that's twins Name the killer I love it. Yeah senators. Yeah senator slash twins So yeah, he was part of the senators that moved to the twins, which would make sense Nice one there congrats to the twins We've got Pudge 40 of 49 for the Rangers congrats on that pay us Am I just done it there fourth down stop there? We've got nice Tony Gwynn field pass 8499 for the Padres game used Grats on that slam. Welcome to slam Diego Bobby Whit jr. Three colored or a triple jersey 499 for the Royals. Never gonna excuse me. No Pencap Really? What the slam Diego or the pencap 16 of at 25 19 to 25 Hanley Ramirez. That's pretty sweet That's really sweet Grats on that Red Sox Red Sox Hanley But a Peter D. How about a one-of-one majestic RPA Zack Neto that is gross That's awesome. Congrats on that one there Peter very nice man One of one Zack Neto on the majestic. Love me get the brand tags on these so fire Peter awesome card coming your way, buddy. Get that into a mag for MF run We've got a Tyler Soderstrom 24 of 99 on the diamond autographs for the A's Grats on that A's Tom picking up some more personals Very nice one there We've got midnight that is gonna be Jack Leiter 18 to 25. Wow. It's a good box man Grats on that Rangers filthy patches on that one. We've got a Marcelo Meyer That is gonna be 19 of 25 on the two-colored patch auto for the Red Sox on that Boston and then 6 to 49 to Mar Johnson clutch factor jersey auto for the Pirates Grats on that Pittsburgh Pberg.  Yes, they are there mark down very well Very well mark down. I just went on sale again. Everybody Went on sale again got 11 of 25 superstar scripts. It's gonna be Chipper and Andrew Jones. Oh, wow whoa Brennan are with the Braves. That's sick on card too, man Very nice. There's the two Joneses. Wow, man. That's freaking awesome Didn't know this card existed to be honest in the booklet. Hell, yeah 11 to 25 will take that all day We've got Lance Berkman 21 and 99 for the Astros on the game use Jersey. That's Houston. That's Juan there Next up is a retro materials to Mar Johnson 10 of 99 for the Pirates got a treasured Jersey numbers to 51 Trevor Hoffman Really nice one there for the Padres again really nice patch coming up on this one It's gonna be Luke Appling for the Braves one of one coach worn three colored patch Grats on that one Dan. Thank you, buddy. Appreciate that man.  I would assume Jay Ridd That is gonna be a Gavin Williams rookie auto to 99 for the Guardians That's Cleveland like Dalvin getting some tick. That's awesome Daniel Espino that is gonna be at 46 of 99 on the Patch auto Panama die-cut material signatures Grats on that one there Guardians. We've got Chrithian Veccharo 79 of 99 for the Nationals on the on-card auto Congrats Washington Followed by 2 of 49. It's gonna be a Jose Canseco Game use Bat auto for the A's Grats on that Oakland and then 19 of 49 at Dio Cartaglia at D. Cardi underscore 17 Grats on that Dodgers Do a quick recap in just a sec here everybody Again just two spots to go in our PYT everyone. That's breaking right now Breaking right now, Michigan State in Maryland. That's it. That's all available in our PYT We got a couple of mixers that are all sold out and then down to eight to go on the first Delight pick your team. We got three of those and then sold out in all of our football tonight. So very nice Four breaks for spots tonight everybody. We've got jerseys to Mar Johnson a lands Berkman, Tony Gwynn, Bobby Witt, Junior, Moose, Scowrin Kevin Perrata, Pudge Rodriguez That is Brian Rockio Kyle Manzardo, Bob Feller a Owen White and then Luke Appling She's getting moldy and San Fran now. We've got a Gabriel Hughes, Mario Soto, Howie Lee, Christian Vecchero, Evan Carter, Gavin Williams, Kevin Perrata, Daniel Espino, Drew Romo, Tyler Soderstrom, Dio Cartaglia, Tamar Johnson, and Jose Canseco That is Paul Molliter, JR Richie, Chen Mengwong, Hanley Ramirez, Marcelo Meyer, Jack Leiter, Evan Carter to 10 And then we've got our Mag Cards and Booklets Our Booklets and Mag Cards I should say that is going to be a Legendary signatures of Harman Killibrew That is a Marcelo Meyer Ozzie Smith, Superstar Scripts is going to the Braves. That is Chipper and Andrew Jones And then a one-of-one Zack Neto on the RPI That'll do it for the break everybody. Thanks again for the fill up next is Balmachrome University


Ok, c'est bon. Merci d'être venu. C'est le programme pour ces 45 minutes. Je suis un développeur de bandes depuis 2010. J'ai toujours été intéressé par les solutions de hostings. J'ai créé un peu de mien. J'ai un business d'hosting. J'ai été faisant la packaging de l'open stack depuis le début. C'est toujours de faute. La faute était l'ABCD 5e. Maintenant, c'est en train de créer plus de 150 packages. La plupart des dependencies de Python sont importées dans Ubuntu. Je suis un de les uns qui a été payé pour la packaging. Je suis très heureux de ce que je fais. Je vais commencer par un update sur l'open stack. J'ai fait deux talks sur l'enjeu de la fin. Je ne vais pas le répéter. Si vous voulez comprendre ce que l'open stack est pour, vous pouvez voir le archive et regarder les vidéos. Aujourd'hui, je veux vous donner un petit update sur les nouvelles features de l'open stack. La première chose de la bad news est que j'ai packaged Zena API pour Weezy. C'est un Weezy, mais on a dû le retirer parce qu'il y avait des bug de RC. Il n'a pas supporté les versions de OCaml. Ce qui s'est passé est que Citrix a créé le fork de leur solution de Zena API. Ils n'étaient pas capables de continuer à utiliser leur version 2.0. Ils savent que c'est une situation inférieure. Ils travaillent sur ça. C'est comme si j'avais mis JC. Il n'y aurait pas de support Zena API. Il n'a pas de support Zena API pour l'open stack. La deuxième bad news est que c'est difficile pour quelqu'un qui s'occupe de Weezy pour upgrade la version qui va être en JC. Ce n'est pas supporté à l'extrême pour upgrade d'une version. Il y a donc 4 versions. Vous allez être sur votre propre version. Ce n'est pas comme si l'extrême ne veut pas l'adresser. Parce que tout le monde dans le cloud s'adresse à l'extrême depuis 6 mois. Si vous voulez l'adresser, je vous présente la version d'open stack. Vous pouvez aller sur SX, Grisly, Havana, Icehouse. Vous pouvez upgrade d'une version à l'autre. Ce n'est pas possible. Personne n'est dans la production. Les gens voulaient qu'ils aient le travail, mais ils n'avaient pas. Vous pouvez upgrade d'une version à l'extrême. Vous pouvez l'adresser à l'extrême.  On a fait ça pour qu'on puisse s'adresser à H. Vous pouvez aller à H via le genre de termes. Ok. Il y a beaucoup de changements. Oui, c'est correct. Il y a aussi des changements. Si vous avez utilisé le volume Nova avant, maintenant c'est cinder. Si vous avez utilisé le Nova Network, maintenant vous utilisez Neutron. Si il y a des moyens de convertir votre database de l'un à l'autre, vous devez changer le projet et le upgrade sera compliqué. Ce n'est pas pour les mauvaises, mais pour les plus intéressants. Il y a de nouveaux projets qui sont en préparation. Je l'ai utilisé dans OpenStack. Je l'ai utilisé pour ceux qui pensaient qu'on était à la vitesse. Il y a un Trove, qui est un service de database. Vous utilisez un API et vous avez un database que vous pouvez utiliser. Il est designé d'un service de DNS. Ironique, il est un service de paramétre, où vous pouvez provisioner le hardware en demande. Vous utilisez un hardware délicat, comme si c'était une machine vietnamienne. Il y a un Triple O, qui est OpenStack et OpenStack. Tous ces projets sont très nouveaux. Exceptions Trove, qui peut être déjà préparée pour production. Les dernières trois sont en test et cédure, mais je vais demander de rembourser la table, parce que c'est difficile pour moi de faire un support de sécurité. Si vous voulez utiliser ça, c'est possible, mais n'hésitez pas à le trouver. Si vous avez un invité, avez-vous des packages ironiques ? Oui. Est-ce qu'il y aura un support de sécurité pour 3 ans ? Je vais demander des packages ironiques. Je vais voir si je peux faire ça. Ok. J'ai aussi construit... Un an plus tard, un collègue de mine m'a dit « Ok, pourquoi ne fais-tu pas un script pour des images de Debian ? » J'ai commencé à faire ça, mais finalement, c'est un packages que vous pouvez downloader. J'ai essayé de le designer très petit, pour que c'est facile à hacker. Il y a 400 lines de scripts, qui ont des hooks que vous pouvez aller dans. J'ai utilisé ça pour donner des images officielles sur le cloud HP, sur un cloud KVM-based OpenStack. Mon plan est aussi d'avoir l'utilisation de la création CD. C'est Steve McIntyre. Il m'a dit qu'il va essayer d'ajouter un collègue d'un script d'image de Debian dans le processus de créer des images de Debian. Le but serait d'avoir l'image de QCOO pour le cloud, à la même temps que les images de CD. Tout fonctionne bien dans ça, d'excepter que dans OpenStack, vous avez besoin d'alloguer sur le console serial, TTYS0 et le console normal TTYS0. Il y a été un bug depuis 2005, avec un patch attaché, en avril 2006. En avril, j'ai l'ampli sur les consoles, à la même temps. J'ai patché depuis 5 minutes pour avoir l'aider de supporter ça. C'est maintenant en CD depuis 4 jours. Avec l'aide de la réelle Steam, j'espère qu'ils vont s'adapter à ce patch. Peut-être, il y a un moment. Je ne suis pas sûr de ça. Mais je vais essayer. OK, de nouvelles features. Nova a support pour RDB. RDB, je suis désolé. RDB c'est... Who knows Chef? OK, il y a un storage distribué pour qu'il soit installé sur beaucoup de services. Il y a object storage et bloc storage. C'est, selon beaucoup de gens, moi-même, l'une de la plus mignonne pour donner storage pour l'OpenStack cloud. Nova, qui est l'OpenStack compute, a perdu des packages qui étaient nécessaires pour soutenir Chef. Et depuis Ravana, j'ai maintenu la main sur les packages d'Adebian pour Nova. Donc, c'est encore dans les packages pour IceHouse, qui sont currently dans JC. Et currently, avec IceHouse, directement d'un Chef cluster, vous pouvez streamer directement l'image sans aller dans le volume cinder. Donc, ça spécifie beaucoup l'accès à ça. Nous avons Pertenant Coda, parce qu'avant, nous pouvions installer Global Coda, pour que un tenant ait tant d'instances, tant de RAM, etc. Nous avons Dockersupport, une très bonne chose, c'est que nous avons agrogate filters, c'est-à-dire que si vous avez ce type de notes compute, ce type de hardware, ce type de SSD, ou SATA, hard drive, etc., vous pouvez filtrer et dire que je veux utiliser cette machine sur ce type de notes compute. Donc, oui, j'ai comparé tous les nouvelles features ici, c'est de deux releases, c'est du Grizzly, parce que mon dernier talk était un an, c'est pourquoi c'est de ça. En Grizzly, nous avons sales, mais ils ne sont pas vraiment utilisables. Maintenant, c'est un bon et utile. Donc, un sale est un groupe de notes compute, c'est un groupe de large deployments avec des milliers de notes, c'est maintenant possible de les diviser en sales, pour que vous ayez un workload distribué. Horizon now supporte beaucoup plus des projets. Ça supporte des features auto-scaling, pour que vous puissiez dire que quand mon web server n'a pas beaucoup de requises, je veux avoir plus de machines il y a beaucoup de moyens pour dire quand vous avez besoin de plus de VMs, c'est up to you to do it, so you would write that in a heat template. Horizon has support for heat for accelerometer, which does the mettering in an open stack cloud. There's Trove, which is database as a service, that you can also manage in Horizon. On the Neutron side, Neutron does the network. There's a lot of new features like VPN as a service, Firewall as a service, Load balancer as a service.  Load balancer as a service is kind of HAProxy as a service. So that you don't have to run HA in your own instance, you would run it on the cloud itself, it would do that for you. And there's some interesting things that happened in the network core, I'd say. So a year ago, the only solutions we had to provision a cloud without some specific hardware was to use GRE tunnels. So GRE tunnels is made between all the compute nodes. So like if you have 10 compute nodes, what happens is that you would have a mesh of tunnels between all compute nodes. It's quite CPU intensive and if you have a lot of network activity then it's kind of hard for the hardware to keep up. So we have a new feature which is there since the Linux 3.12 and really usable since 3.13 and on, which is VXLAN. So VXLAN is you take a packet and you had roughly 50 bytes header that's supported by the kernel itself and in there you have the VLAN information. So it's quite new even in the kernel and it's really nice because you don't have all the overhead that you would have with GRE tunnels. So there's some, the thing is that your hardware needs to support the size of the packet plus these 50 bytes. So if you use jumbo packets of 9Ks, it has to be 9K plus these 50 bytes. So when you buy some hardware you have to make sure you have the feature most recent hardware like Cisco and such have it. So for cellometer now we have alarming so that it can tell of issues you have in your own cloud. Glence has multiple location capabilities for images and it has a cinder back end so that you can store an image on a cinder volume. Another thing is that I worked on the documentation so what you see in docs.openstack.org is the official documentation plus some patches that I added for OpenStack in Debian and I don't maintain much the wiki though this may may be some information you may find interesting over there the process in OpenStack is very open so if you want to contribute to the documentation I very welcome you to do so checking the time ok yeah so I already explained what self is so as I said I continue to to take the patches from Dimitri who is in the room who contributes the back ports of the patches for Sefinnova so it should still be working even though it's not supported upstream this year red hat bought in tank so we have a good hope that it's going to be maintained in a much better way meaning upstream with some testing in the gate of OpenStack so that we make sure it's always there in the stable extremities so we have already support in DevStack so DevStack is a huge not so how can I put it in nice words it's a bit not so clean shell scripts that would set up your OpenStack locally and it's used by what we call the gate so the gate will check that your patch doesn't break the rest of OpenStack thank you yeah so that's for development and testing so we have now self support in DevStack which was the first step so that DevStack is able to deploy stuff and the next step is going to be adding self functional testing in DevStack once we have that then the world is great sun is shining and self will be supported forever in OpenStack yeah and not broken yeah that's the point oh yeah I'm sorry I should have replaced the interrogation point by your name I'm sorry yeah so we have solved as well the problem with our BD I do it support in QMU so hopefully that problem is solved for JC our BD is how to CDR Ray I can never say yeah thank you so hopefully QMU has the support for it in JC so I've been running the Tempest functional testing in OpenStack for about a year so to prove that the packages are working correctly so I'd like to thank a lot all the people from in advance especially Emilia who helped me a lot to do all these testings and others so what we have in WISI in my WISI back port repository is tested I hope to be able to test it for JC before the freeze to make sure everything is working as expected it should be roughly the same because it's the same packages so I do not expect big surprises so the security support for SX has been kind of sloppy I'm really not proud of what I did in WISI though there were there's a consensus that it was not really for a public cloud provider and for private use I don't think you were affected by any of the CVEs that were reported so it's kind of fine but I don't want this to happen again for the JC release the good news is that Red Hat announced 3 years support for security of Icehouse so they will produce patches for it I hope to be able to maintain these for the life of JC but I'm not 100% sure people will use JC and Icehouse so it's up to you to tell me if you think you will use that so I'm very much welcome your comments and feedback about it so if everybody tells me no I won't choose what's in JC the latest version of OpenStack all the time then it's not worth the trouble and I can ask removal so you tell me ok there's a colleague of mine who told me oh you did so many Python packaging so you should share and you must know a lot about it the thing is I don't pretend that I do I know so much about Python packaging even if I do a lot I think that people like Barry or Poetry in this room must know a lot more than I do but I think we don't do enough packaging experience sharing in Debian and I think it's probably one of the things that Debian people are the most interested about which is why I wanted to share with you the way I do so I hope that if you think I'm not doing right then you tell me and if you are doing in another way which you think is more efficient then please tell me as well that the goal is to be to have a kind of buff because I it's always the same kind of packages that I do OpenStack is made 100% of Python it's very repetitive so I try to find ways to automate that process 100% of the packages of OpenStack are coming from PyPy it's a requirement you cannot add a new module if it's not on PyPy so I created a small script which is called Deppypy that downloads the dope.xml from PyPy extracts information from it using XPath on the command line it's a small template for me then after I have a bit of manual work so I have to review the dbian copyright of course make sure that there's build dependencies correct and dependencies correct so I do that by griping the import basically and then because I want to have Python 3 and Sphinx most of the time it's not there so I just remove it and then manage the test shoot and that's about it so in roughly about an hour or so I can have a Python module package working so you can have a look to that script and customize it do what you want feel free to stop me anytime what's the reason for not doing that work inside the Python modules team because I I use Git and up to two days ago we were using SVN that's what I use a workflow which is different and what's the reason for not using the existing Python helpers I'm not familiar with Python helpers I use the Python helpers are you mean to create the dbian folder yeah maybe there's Python STDep package which probably does what what you try to accomplish using this Python script it takes a module from PyPi and generates dbian directory from it so it's already there must be very similar just my stuff you know I started to do it like very slowly and then it grows and then oh I have a script things like that so once I have that I use the Git repository from upstream which so I download it from github like for 95% of the packages I do it does a Git repository so I use the tags from the packages and then just merge the tag or that Git reference so some upstream don't like me to do that because they say that in their process of doing Python setup.py disks they do things which I may miss which is sometimes right but most of the time it's not to my experience with such a thing then I can figure it out I like this way because it's very efficient I don't need to even think about a table, I know it's there my Jenkins generates it from Git I don't need to care where to download it because I already have the Git repository which is defined in my dbian rules file so I just do fetch upstream remote and then it fetches it I don't have any trouble with Pristintar I don't have one single branch as well which self contains and have everything so I'm aware that upstream may not like it but I find it so much more efficient that it's very hard for me to do any other type of workflow I will try though to use what we have decided into the Python team and try to push more packages using Pristintar or search in the Python team we'll see how it goes so we had the discussion in a place which I can't name about the fact that we shouldn't treat the BTS as a to-do list on the opposite mindset so I've I try to lower the bug count as much as possible and anyway possible because I have so many packages to maintain if I don't do that then there's just too many bugs to care about and it's overflowed and I can't manage it every 2 to 3 weeks I try to go through all of them and try to close as many as I can so in roughly 2 to 3 days I can kill I don't know 20 bugs so I do some sessions like that and yes, for the moment it worked I hope I won't ever have too many bugs for so many packages because I do maybe 4 or 5 new packages new packages in Debian every week or so I had some I had to deal with the fact that there's a long waiting time in the new queue I have no magic solution for that the only thing you can do is just upload as fast as possible so in Debian, in OpenStack there's that requirement repository so it's I update it often check that there is new things and try to be as reactive as possible so I was also insisted upstream so that they don't add too many new dependencies before just before the Debian before the next table of OpenStack is out the other thing I've been working what's the same so I did lots of Python 3 things there's a consensus in OpenStack that we want to move out of Python 2 but there's some things that are keeping us there like memkhd eventlet and more hopefully we'll be there in a year or two having Python 3 only things so like the rest of the Python team is doing, I'm trying to add support for Python 3 in all my packages so hopefully we'll be there at this point for jc plus 1 so up to now on all the packages I maintain I also make them back portable for Weezy means I have Python 3.2 to support which is kind of annoying because there's all this unicode thing which is not supported in Python 3 upstream is not interested in Python 3.2 as well so I'm pretty much on my own but I still find it more easy to do it like that for example for Python Babel I added a big patch for 3.2 I'll be very happy to drop it as soon as we have jc out but that's quite bad example because most of the time the patches are very very small maybe a year and a half ago I didn't know about Python 3 at all and as I'm doing it and I know more and more about Python 3 I still don't consider myself Python 3 Python programmer but I know about them so here's the kind of cool things that you may find in a Python package so Python 2.2.1 I've checked on the internet was released in 2001 and I still the same kind of things you have to do so you just remove that ok some things I do in Python packages so I find now that to do this way is nice because you don't have to deal with the clean target and here as well instead of cleaning the egg which always will have differences with upstream is very annoying so doing that is efficient like you just add that in all packages and then you're never bothered I also disabled some dh dh targets to make the package building faster yeah I had to deal with lots of version issues upstream sometimes says ok there's a package that needs this version or that version and I just add the patch upstream and then they reply to me yes but in the requirements.txt we have another version why do you want to be compatible with that so I have to explain teach them that they are not alone in the distribution that their package must integrate with the rest of Debian sometimes it works it doesn't I have many kinds of reaction but mostly it went alright if you take the time to explain to them one very nice things that happen is that is with Python Migrate so this was maintained by a Debian developer who decided to stop working on it it has been taken over by the open stack community and support for sql alchemy 08 and then 09 has been added to it so that worked quite well for that package upstream has been very comprehensive with sql alchemy support so now there is sql alchemy 0.9 support we have a person who is upstream for sql alchemy he is now a red hat employee and he is doing stuff specifically to support open stack in sql alchemy and alambic so the future is bright and then there are some other issues like upstream would like to use a new version of jQuery which is incompatible with what we have in Debian so they have been very comprehensive too and they stick with the old version so there is going to be a new version for jc plus 1 i guess we are trying to push for Django 1.7 but like with many other packages in Debian there is issues with it so we will have jQuery we will be able to deal with it and have Django 1.7 in Debian so there is a lot of upstream who like to do vendorizing so the word vendorizing means yeah Barry does like that yeah this sucks I agree and so vendorizing is a nice way to say whatever version of any package I put in my source code so they embed a lot of other projects in their source code and then just release this way if you do APT file search 6.py we will find many versions of 6 in many packages so we still have some things to address in Debian and ok explaining to upstream why it's a bad thing to do it it's kind of hard they always have some wrong reasons to do it and it has unpredictable consequences I had one with WSGI intercept which was kind of funny so first they try to use mechanize which is in Debian and has a lot of embedded other project things as well so I'm not even sure this one should stay in Debian but they was dealt with and they removed it and after we had a funny issue with request and URL3 WSGI intercept is a software that is there to test request on the internet when you have no internet to do some tests so it uses request and request embeds URL3 in its source code yes Barry yes I'm going to it you will see it's funny so in Debian because we are smart people we removed URL3 from request this is nice and fine except that WSGI intercept expected to have the vanderized version of URL3 in request it took a long long time to find out what was going on so it's a problem and we have to convince upstream not to do it because otherwise you will run into all sorts of issues yes so I do all what's the time so I do all of what I do is back ported I thought about uploading everything to back ports but it's kind of complicated so I hope that it's going to be PPA main somehow ok my last slide and after it's open for questions is how OpenStack can help Debian so we had talks about CI in Debian one of the things we have in OpenStack is that when you send a patch then you have a batteries you have lots of tests that are done and then after only the patch is sent to upstream we could reproduce these kind of things within Debian so we have a Garrett or another patch review system if you find something better but I haven't yet connected to the gates so that we make sure you have git packages and then somebody would send a patch using git review it would be built tested with Pupart, Adequat and so on we could even build reversible dependencies and things like that add some specific package functional testing then we'd have some review from anyone, not only DDs that could say ok this thing is bad this thing is good etc and then depending on the ACLs we would have I don't want to define them because we could discuss about it later then somebody could approve that change on the package then the package would be automatically rebuilt and uploaded to Debian so where OpenStack could help would be on the build Pupart, Adequat test and package specific test we could run that on a VM and it could provide an infrastructure as a more general generally speaking we could provide OpenStack for our own developer use and that's it so yeah great talk, thank you one of the things that I run into sometimes is our Python packages that are within the OpenStack team and so I joined the OpenStack team so I could help out with that but it seems like arbitrary whether some general packages in the OpenStack team were in the Python modules team and I wonder if we can maybe not hear but offline have a discussion about how we can you know, not divide and conquer but work together the two teams work together my problem was that I wanted to continue my workflow and git and if that is accepted I'll move them all to the Python team I know we have some differences around exactly the workflow but for most Python modules it doesn't matter much for me if we use Pristintar or something else what matters is for the bigger projects where you have hundreds and sometimes megabytes of tables and then because problematic if it's tiny it doesn't matter Regarding your earlier question whether or not we want to keep OpenStack in Debian I think it would be unanimous hell yeah and thanks very much for doing that this far and one more question is what do you think about packaging upstream master aka currently Juno for experimental yeah so I have that already nice to experimental so I always package the beta releases so I have the latest was B2 so I have B2 currently on my Jenkins repository so if you want to use that and provide feedback I am very welcome you to do so yeah the same question or more or less the same thing he just said with my Debian system administrator's head on I would like to eat my own dog food when installing the OpenStack cluster which is planned for the development stuff so I would like to see the packages in Debian jassie to have OpenStack packages in Debian jassie ok I'll do my best at least 2 presents so you mentioned using Garrett you Debian packages have you already done that so I am asking because I tried to do that it works because Garrett doesn't deal very well with the fact that in Debian we usually maintain packages with many branches it's quite easy to get confused in the workflow because you need to validate to submit commits in a particular order for it not to break which is why I think it should be connected to Deget because if I'm not mistaken I never use Deget but as I understand it uses only a single branch right I don't know I've never used it yeah I use Garrett with Debit packages yeah Deget would use only one branch if I'm not mistaken and therefore it would be easier and then we will have a Git repository for all packages by default so to clarify if we do get OpenStack in jassie it will be Icehouse not Juno yes because Juno will be released in October on the 16th of October that would give me like 20 days before the freeze and if I do that yeah no comments and yeah and also there won't be LTS support for Juno so I don't want to be on my own for doing the security support I hope that on the next summit on the next OpenStack summit in Paris we will have a discussion with the security involved people so that instead of giving 15 months of security support since there are some people interested in doing security support for long term then we will have integrated security support for Icehouse for like 3 years so I don't know if you'd get that officially approved by the TC but I think probably there are enough different distros that we could find the people to do it so the consensus was nobody's interested in doing it but this has just changed is there any other question or discussion time is over ok perfect then