Namaskaram, Sadhguru. Namaskaram to every one of you. On behalf of the entire medical pharmaceutical fraternity for our country, I'd like to thank you immensely for this interaction and such a short notice. No, no, no. This is not a time to thank me. We all bow down to you for the service that you are doing, all of you, the medical fraternity. Thank you very much. Of course, we have doctors, nurses, paramedics, management from various government and private hospitals, distributors, and many employees of pharmaceutical organizations and hospitals live on this webinar this evening. Sadhguru, as you know, healthcare professionals and scientists around the world are working incredibly hard to defend humanity against this virus. We are today seeking your blessings and words of inspiration at this critical time. We also have some fellow panellists whom you know, many of them. Next to me is Raghuram. Namaskaram. Namaskaram. Sangeetha from Apollo and we have… Hello, Sangeetha. How are you? Fine. Thank you, Sadhguru. Very nice to see you, Sadhguru. Dr. Srinath Reddy has recorded his question for you and we have a sister from one of the COVID hospitals, Sister Kasia Narani, who's working live at a COVID hospital joining us. So I have a question to start this conversation and then we can take questions from the panellists. As a community, we are all approaching COVID as a very serious and a very highly infectious disease with what we know from the medical science and what we are learning every day through the experience of people around the world. We are familiar with the science and developments. However, you know, we are facing an unprecedented situation and to face this situation, we need the science and we need the expertise, but we also need inner strength and what it do. And this is where I seek your perspectives and how each of us can be better prepared in these aspects of building our inner strength or calm to deal with the current situation. Over to you, Sadhguru. Namaskaram to everyone who is… who logged in online. Namaskaram to all the doctors and nurses. Well, it is at times like this what sort of human beings we are becomes extremely important. When I say what sort of human beings, well, we are referred to as human beings, not as human creatures, but as human beings. Because in terms of evolution, compared to all the other creatures, we are supposed to know how to be. Well, many human beings are striving to disappoint the expectations of nature to prove that we don't know how to be. But this is what it means, being a human being means that we can function consciously, especially when challenging situations are ahead of us. These are really challenging times. Probably for this generation, we have never before faced such a global situation where it threatens everybody. So, these are definitely challenging times for every one of us. Well, about how we have the necessary strength to address this. See, it's always like this, if I have to quote somebody, Gautama the Buddha said, when people, you know, his monks came to him and complaining about small things, this and that. Because people on the spiritual path in those days, food was one of the biggest challenges, because they don't organize their own food, they seek it from the society. We fortunately had a society which would always contribute towards this. But still, Gautama created too many monks and there was always a food issue because suddenly three thousand, four thousand monks end up in a new city or a town of those days. So, that would be a stress on the local population. So, there would be many issues. So, Gautama said one thing, which, you know, which I came in touch with very early on in my life and in a way, this one thing stood by me in a huge way. He said, when you're very hungry, if you give away your food to someone else, when you're very hungry and you badly need it, at that time, if you give it away, you will not become weak, you will become way stronger. I think this one thing has stood by me always right through my life. It is not that I live by slogans or morals, but when I look back and see somehow this I came across when I was just sixteen or seventeen, it struck me in a big way.  And because he was in Indian railways and always there would be some emergencies and things, small hospitals with, you know, twenty-five-fifty beds where he was used to be the in-charge person most of the time, any time of the day or night some emergency would come. This was something always we witnessed at home, which had a serious influence on me, that he would be halfway through the meal and the moment the phone rings, he would just wash his hands right there in the plate and just go away. My mother would beg him just two minutes, just finish the meal and go, but he always left. Somehow this thing about leaving his meal halfway and going away became a big image in me that I thought this was the greatest thing about him always, that it doesn't matter what he is doing, where he is, the moment the call came, he just left as if that was the only thing that mattered. There used to be controversies and discussions at home, his mother always saying, this is crazy, why can't you finish your meal and go, why can't you do this and go, but he always left within a minute's time he would be dressed and gone. So, having said that, I'm sure many of you doctors are doing similar things in your life. So this is a time where we must be above our personal needs and requirements. Probably many of you live like this every day of your life. This is how we live here also, though we are not attending to medical emergencies. The strength of life, how strong and powerful your life is, simply depends on this, that you have placed everybody's well-being well above your own comforts and pleasures and, you know, even your own well-being at many times. When you do this, there is a powerful atmosphere around you. This is an atmosphere where I'm saying for many of you with your families, this is a kind of atmosphere that your children should grow up in because that had such a powerful impact on me and I'm sure that will have such a powerful impact on your children, especially at a time like this. You displaying that you're placing everybody's well-being way above your own, I think is going to be the greatest influence that you have on your children and the people around you. Above all, the nation is in huge appreciation of what the medical personnel are doing right now and it will definitely have a huge impact on the nation itself. This itself should be a great strength for you that you know what you're doing is beyond yourself. Thank you very much for that very inspirational answer that you gave us. Raghuram, whom you know is the president of the Association of Surgeons of India and he's a very famous oncologist. He has a question for you, Sadhguru. Namaskaram, Raghuram. At the very outset on behalf of the medical fraternity in this country, I've just seen the video clip which is a touching tribute which shows how the frontline personnel whilst placing their lives at risk are working relentlessly towards treating, serving and saving many lives. You'll be very pleased to know, Sadhguru, that the Association of Surgeons of India, which is the voice for the surgical fraternity in the country over the last few days, we have raised a sum of more than one crore by championing PanIndia Initiative to procure the much needed personal protection equipment which we are providing to the healthcare professionals across the country. Despite rising to the occasion, there have been many reports of violence, abuse and vigilantism against the fraternity. And you must have seen our honorable Prime Minister on at least three occasions in the past three weeks has brought this issue up and asked people to be more responsible. And as the president of the world's second largest surgical association, I'm deeply concerned at the manner in which a section of the citizenry are really becoming insensitive and cruel in many ways. So, Sadhguru, this is demoralized or demoralizing the medical profession on a daily basis. So, at times of crisis like this, this is a time for reflection and change. And what do you think that we should be learning? The humanity should be learning during the troubled times like this. Thank you. Raghuv, I very much understand the concern. And it's most unfortunate that certain sections of people have done this. But I think most administrations have clamped down quite strongly against that kind of reactions from people. Certain religious beliefs and other things has made this happen and some people out of their selfish motives within apartment houses and all they've done a few things like that. But I think as a fraternity, you should not focus on this miniscule population which does these nasty things. 99.9% of the people in the country are right now seeing you as worship worthy. That is where your focus should be, that miniscule population which unfortunately behaves that way. Yes, that also must be dealt with by law, very strongly I would say. Those people who have attacked medical personnel during these times must be dealt with a very strong hand. I think the government is determined to do that as far as I can see. So that will happen anyway. But you must focus on the… for the… probably for the first time in the history of this nation, the largest number of people are looking at medical professionals with a completely different light. They are not seeing you as professionals. They are seeing you as an immense service that you're rendering to the society. So let us focus on that. Let's not give strength to this miniscule population which does these nasty things. Yes, that must be controlled and I'm sure right now largely it has been put down wherever it rolls. There may be some… some small pockets which are still like that, but they have been… entire communities have been quarantined to control and regulate these things. So law will take care of that and right now as you see both the central government and most of the state governments are acting in a very determined way against this kind of crimes. Having said that, if I can… if I can take the liberty of telling you a small story, you know, my great-grandmother was a very good storyteller. She said many stories in great detail. This one story stuck with me and though I remember all of them, but this one thing was kind of… I was probably maybe four and a half, five years of age when she told this story to me. But this story kind of lived with me. There was a man who was a farmer and he had a little bit of land and doing agriculture. Then he got two sons. The sons grew up, they cleared more land and they became well-to-do farmers. And when his time of passing came, he called both the sons and told them, whatever comes out of this land, do not divide the land, but whatever comes out of this land, both of you share it equally, fifty-fifty percent. They agreed, one of the boys married, had five children over a period of time and the other boy never married, but still fifty-fifty it was going. So the elder boy who was married with children, one day I know got a little worm in his head and then he thought, I have a wife and five children, I'm getting fifty percent. He is alone and he's getting fifty percent, but I have my boys growing up. When I get old, they will take care of me. Who will take care of my brother? He should get little more so that he has more wealth in his old age. But he is very proud, he will not take anything from me. So in the night, he would pack a bag of grains and stealthily go towards his brothers, storehouse and put these grains there every night a little bit. And the same worm got into the other brother's head one day and he thought, I am just alone, I get fifty percent. My brother has the burden of wife and five children, but he also gets fifty percent, but if I offer anything, he won't take it. So he also started packing a bag and putting it in his other brother's storehouse. So this reverse osmosis went on without anybody's knowledge for quite a few years. Then in their old age, one day both of them carrying a bag and coming in the, you know, in the darkness of the night, they bumped into each other. They looked at each other and they realized what they have been doing. They looked away from each other, very embarrassed about their own generosity and anyway dumped the grain where they have to and came back. After some time they died, they passed on. The townspeople were wanting to build a temple and they were looking for a site. After much search, they decided the best place to build the temple is that place where these, both these brothers came with these bags carrying. You know, they were old men by then carrying these heavy bags on their backs. They came and they realized what they were doing and they were very embarrassed with their own generosity and they looked away from each other but continued their activity. They said, this is the best place to build a temple. So when we place, when we place others well-being above our own well-being and we are not tumping our chest about what we have done, we are embarrassed about our own generosity. That's a, that's like a temple. So this is why I said when you place other people's well-being above your own, you become worship worthy. In fact, what people are trying to worship is just this. Why do you think they're going to the temple and calling for gods that they have not seen? Simply because they believe God places their well-being above his own and that's the reason why he's become worship worthy. If he says, what about me? I don't think anybody will go to the temple or any place. So right now you are rising in your stature. Do not focus on these negative things. In many ways, as it should be, a teacher, a doctor or you know, many other people who serve every day, the society, they must all become worship worthy. It's very, very important and it's beginning to happen. Let us fuel that. Let's not focus on this small, miniscule percentage of population doing negative things. Our next question is from Sangita, real leader in this cold battle against this virus and a very charming and delightful disciple. Oh, she can kill any virus, I know. I truly wish I could, Sadhguru. You know, we wouldn't be sitting like this if it were, but thank you for saying that. You give us strength. But what you said earlier also was so tremendous, Sadhguru. And thank you so much for being with us, for inspiring us, whether you're in front of us or not, we always gain strength from you. So in the listing of strength, Sadhguru, I think all of us are faced with some really tough questions these days. And the other day, I actually, you know, wore an N95 mask and went into the COVID hospital. We have an isolated hospital for these patients. Because I said, is it fair to put our nurses and our doctors at risk and take a risk that I wouldn't do myself? And I mean, I know I had no medical role there except to rev up their spirits a bit. But I think it's this kind of decision making for leaders. And now I think the Prime Minister has faced with this decision, do we extend the lockdown from the medical safety aspect, or do we lift it from the economic aspect? And I mean, I'm not seeking answers to these, but a framework for taking difficult decisions, which all of us are facing so much in our lives. About decision making. Well, Sangeeta, you are in a position of leadership for long enough, you know this and I'm sure most of you know this. But anyway, see, when it comes to decision making at the leadership level, this idea of what is the perfect decision, we must keep it down a little bit. We need to understand whichever way we decide, we're going to hurt something and we're going to make something good. We'll do something good and we'll do something bad with every decision we take when large scale situations are involved. There is no perfect decision as such to make. So if we come to terms with this, only then we will make correct decisions, otherwise we'll just get emotional about the situation and inevitably, we will not be able to take the right decisions. So when we take any decision in such a large scale situation, there is not going to be a perfect situation. It's a perfect decision rather. Just now you mentioned about the Prime Minister has to take a call whether to continue the lockdown or not, I think it's been largely decided to continue except relaxing a few activities, which is a good thing to do. And everybody knows the data shows, the science shows that a lockdown is a must in a nation of this kind of density of population. But the economic pain also has to be taken into consideration, you can't just close down the country. So where this is the privilege and pain and power of being a leader that when you make decisions, you know all the aspects and you do what is in larger good. So you know that you cannot do absolute good. This is something that we must come to terms with, otherwise we cannot make the right decisions. Right decision is not a perfect decision. Right decision is the best thing to do in the given moment, but not a perfect decision because there is no such thing. Nobody can make a perfect decision. It is not personal life to make one perfect decision. When so many people's lives are involved, we will have to make hard decisions. When we say hard decisions, many things are against, you know, the fundamental nature. Our own hearts will not agree with it, but we still have to make those decisions in the interests of the larger good. And that's the only way forward and leaders should have the strength and balance and the determination to do what is for the larger good, rather than deciding things by our own sensitivities that we have. Thank you, Sadhguru. Thank you. Thank you, Sarita and thank you, Sadhguru. We have a video message and a question from our Honorable Health Minister, Harshvardhanji. We'll play the video and then we will await your answer, Mr. Guruji. Thank you. Sadhguruji, I would like to seek your kind permission to raise a very important and pertinent issue today at this prestigious forum where I'm told that thousands of my medical fraternity friends are present and they are hearing me. In the context of COVID-19 pandemic and in the context of how lakhs and lakhs of frontline health workers are passionately and selflessly working day and night to save our fellow citizens, I outrightly condemned the recent attacks on them. I consider this most unfortunate, especially since it is happening in a country like India and more so since it is happening in my tenure as the Health Minister of the country. Our doctors, our nurses and our paramedics and all those involved in COVID-19 care and treatment are our real warriors. They are our COVID warriors. They are putting their life in danger to serve the nation and all of us. I also unequivocally condemn the ostracization and stigmatization of doctors and health workers by some selfish people in our society. I must tell you that our government stands fully in support of frontline health workers. Time and again our beloved Prime Minister Shri Narayan Modiji has spoken out against the violence that is taking place against doctors. He has appealed to the nation to protect our medical personnel. Modiji has even equated them with God. The Home Ministry has taken cognizance of such incidents and has advised the authorities to take stringent action under the National Security Act. Now our doctors and health warriors should work without fear as the government is standing in all its strength with them. Doctors, nurses and all healthcare workers deserve our respect, support and cooperation to keep the fight going. We have advised all state governments to take appropriate action against those who are indulging in violence. Be it the landlords who are evicting doctors and their families. Most respected Sadguruji, I appeal through you to the country that we must all stand united in this unprecedented crisis that humanity is facing today. Let us give utmost respect to all those who are working to save our lives. Many thanks for giving me this opportunity, my highest regards. My namaskarams to Harishwar Tanji. Well, I'm really impressed by the resoluteness with which the government is acted. For a nation like India with such a massive population and density of population and the complexity of our population, the decisive way in which the government went forward is very important. The entire world is appreciating this right now. This is a decision most developed countries could not take in time. But we have taken this. So not attacking the doctors is not even a thing. It must be put down with the heaviest possible hand that the Home Ministry or the local administration should. I think that is being done. Having said that, it's disgraceful that somebody even thought of attacking people who came to save your life. It is most disgraceful upon all of us. But supporting the doctors is not only by not attacking them or cooperating with them. The most important thing is to reduce the level of stress that the medical infrastructure in the country is going through is. The most important thing is that all of us maintain social distancing, ensure that I don't get the infection and in case I do get the infection, I make sure it does not go to the next person. Just by doing this, we will be serving the medical community in a huge way that we can reduce the level of load and stress on them by simply making sure that you do not get the virus. And in case, unfortunately, if you do get it for somehow, ensure it doesn't move from you to another person. If we do this, we will be serving the medical community in a big way at this time. There is no nation in the world which has medical infrastructure to handle people at this scale. You're seeing what's happening in United States, which has such a massive medical infrastructure. In spite of that, they become totally helpless simply because no nation is geared to handle a pandemic of this proportion. Definitely India is not there at all, and we cannot do that, that we can prepare a nation to treat 1.4 billion people at a time. There is no such infrastructure, it's not possible to create that infrastructure. It is only with citizens cooperation and involvement that it is possible that we can come out victorious in this war against this virus. I'm using the word war because in a way, this needs to be conducted in a war footing.  If it was somewhere else, we would have sprayed this chemical, that chemical, all these things. But it is residing in human beings. So the only thing that the most responsible thing we can do is to ensure that you don't get it. And in case you get it, ensure it doesn't go to another person. If we do this, we'll be doing a great service to the medical fraternity and to the nation itself. This is a time where everybody has the opportunity to serve the nation by simply doing nothing. Please make use of this opportunity everybody. Thank you once again. The next question is from Dr. Srinath Reddy, President of the Public Health Foundation of India. He has recorded his question and sent it in, which we'll play it now. Namaste, Sadhguru. While all the people who are heroically battling to save lives in hospitals need our highest praise and gratitude, 85% of the people who will suffer from COVID would need to be treated at home or near home in primary healthcare settings. What's your message to the people who are battling at the front lines? Like Asha's, Oxygenated Nurse with Wives, persons doing the contact tracing, and others performing various public health functions that will actually win this battle for us. So these self-help groups, Anganwadis and others who are at the rural level and small town level who are working on the thing, who are not a fully qualified medical personnel who have more knowledge about these things, such people protecting them, above all giving them the necessary protective gear, gear so that they feel confident to step out, that they don't feel like sacrificial lambs that they're being sacrificed for somebody else's well-being. It is very, very important that we have to ensure that they have the necessary protective gear and their lives should not be sacrificed in the name of service. Service is fine, but there is no need to sacrifice lives for this purpose. So without protective gear this could happen. So if the medical experts that many of you are, it's not necessary only this imported gear should come, I'm sure we can come up with various our own juguards to ensure that it can be produced in large numbers and given to this level of workers so that their lives are not at risk. Providing this is very important because many of them, the Asha's and others are largely women and they have their own families and children so if they are coming out even to serve that at a time like this they're reporting to their duty, itself is a fantastic thing. This must be honoured with the necessary protective gear and the kind of assurance that their lives are safe. The glasses that are needed, the mask that are needed and the protective cover for the body that is needed must be provided in large scale. I know it's a challenge for the country. This is why industry, business and organized institutions like us, everybody should jump into this and do as much as we can to ensure that this, not the doctors and nurses who definitely know much more about these infections but lower down health workers who may not be as medically qualified or capable, they must be protected. So this is the duty of the nation and the citizens to take care of this. We can make an appeal that if someone gives me a number, what is the kind of number of Asha's and others are there, we can make a large scale appeal and maybe somebody, I don't know even Prime Minister can make an appeal, each one of us contribute at least for one person's gear what it takes so that they can go out and serve fearlessly. This is a duty that's upon the country and we must fulfill this. Thank you, Sir Guru. The next question is really from a front-line nurse who's actually in the COVID ward right now and you can see that she's fully geared up. Sister Kasia Rani, please ask her question. I'm Kasia working as a nurse at infectious disease ward of Apollo Hospital Hyderabad and taking care of COVID patients. We are privileged to work in Apollo. We have enough PPE, policies, support and care. We all are ready to fight this battle but I'm extremely sad and concerned what is happening in the world due to this deadly virus. The situation is very scary. The whole world is suffering with the deadly virus. However, your healthcare workers are committed and we will do our best. We understand that there is but still you want to take care of our sufferers and come out as a winner. It is also known many of our colleagues have acquired COVID while taking care of patients which is very painful. On behalf of our team, I would like to ask you one question. My question is how do we keep ourselves motivated and continue with a positive status of mind to fight with this painful scenario? Thank you. Namaskaram, Kasia. First of all, well, we cannot see your face right now but right now anybody who's dressed like this in people's experience largely, I'm saying the largest number of people in the country, if you're dressed like this, they have begun to see you godlike because they know you're standing up for their lives. So, this will not go in vain. By the time this crisis is over, I think the entire status and value of what it means to be a medical professional because slowly over a period of time people have lost this, you know, there was a time a doctor or a nurse was seen as a life saviour but over a period of time because our minds have become so commercial, people think it's just one more profession. What is the big deal? They're paid so they'll do it. But this is a time, by the time this virus situation is over, whatever amount of time it takes, you will see that the medical profession will sit on a pedestal that it deserves to sit and every doctor, every nurse, ensure once we put you up there, don't come down. You must stay there. You must stay on that pedestal because it is needed because a whole lot of things that you do are not absolutes. Medical treatment is not an absolute. What an absolute… perfect treatment if you give to one person, that person will live, the same perfect treatment may kill another person. So it is not an absolute, life is not an absolute like that. So when it is like this, trust and faith in the medical profession is very, very vital so that you can serve fearlessly, not only in these times but at any time. So do not focus on the negative aspect of whatever little things have happened. If you count those instances, hardly it is a dozen instances across the country. So do not empower those people. Please, please respect this that right now people are looking at you. If you're just dressed like this, we don't know who you are, we don't know whether you're a medical professional or not. If you are dressed like this, people are bowing down and clapping their hands in towns and cities. So you must understand the very stature of being a nurse or a doctor is going up in a massive way in people's minds and hearts and this is very important for you to deliver your services not only during this virus period but even later for you to fearlessly do what you think is right without wondering what will be the consequence of this is very important and this situation will definitely render the national situation there that people will respect you and regard you for who you are and for the most significant service in terms of people's lives because every other service is only relevant if people are alive. If I am alive only, then all the other services are meaningful to me. The most important thing is that I am alive and that's true for every human being.  Please accept our respects. Though we can't see you, someday I would like to see you without a mask. Thank you for giving me this opportunity. Thank you. Thank you. Sankuru, we're getting a lot of questions from doctors across the country. I'll pick a few in the interest of time and from the patterns that I see in these questions, they're all about how to manage themselves, their emotions, their helplessness, they're seeing situations where the facilities are inadequate for treating people and they're not able to react fast enough and this is causing a lot of turmoil within them and they want to manage their own emotions. There's something you can help them, you know, in terms of how they manage their tranquility emotions to deal with the current situation, it would be very useful. As I said earlier, this is a war-like situation.  This is a very hard decision to make for anybody because you can… it's much easier to make a decision about my own life, but it's very hard to make a decision about somebody else's life.  But unfortunately, such decisions have to be made in war-like situation. As it has happened in New York City, for example, if you take New York State as a nation, what is happening there, if that happens, that kind of percentage scales happen in India, then every one of you will have to make very hard decisions. Who should live? Who should die? This kind of decisions will come into your hands. It is very unfortunate, but you must be ready for that. You must understand this. You must place yourself in this place. You are not going to make perfect decisions, as I said earlier. You just have to very clearly set yourself up. You will make the best possible decision, always in the interest of what is happening to the patient, always in the interest of what is happening to the larger situation around you, but never in personal interest. If you make this one decision, you will be very clear and balanced and easy to handle these things. Physical hardship and the challenge of day and night work, all these things are there, but at least your conscience will be clear. If you make this one thing clear, absolutely clear within yourself, every step I take, every breath I take, every action I do is in the interest of the people who are there, who trust me and who are there in front of me. If this one decision is absolutely made in your hearts and minds, you will come to some ease, but this does not mean these are easy times. These are challenging times. That's another question, a more practical question. This is Dr. Prabhat Kumar. He's asking me if Sadhguru has any recommendations for a dietary regime which will help us build our immunity and lower the chances of catching this virus and disease. See, there are many traditional things which we can do to, you know, boost our immunity. At a time like this, I don't want to go into much detail, but if you want details, we can send it to you, but to put it very briefly. Those of you who know me know this that, you know, the last thirty-nine years that I'm in in this public life, almost every day I have some public event, some event which I am committed to large groups of people. But in this thirty-nine years, in all this travel, I have not cancelled a single event because I'm not well. This doesn't mean that I'm not well at all, because all this travel you catch this infection, that infection happens here and there, but it doesn't put me down because definitely because of the immune system, in the yogic sciences there are various things one can do to enhance one's immune system. In terms of practices, which are hard to teach right now, but we have put out a very… a simple powerful process called Simha Kriya, which the video of which very simple to do is we will send it to you so that you can put it out to your doctors and nurses. This is a kind of process. One thing is it will boost the immune system. Another thing is it is… it involves your breath in a certain way. Suppose you start doing it today, after a week's time, if you find some difficulty in doing it, you clearly know you have some respiratory stuff, even before other symptoms show up. Even before other symptoms with which you normally medically recognize, even before that you will see you will not be able to do the practice, the moment there is some kind of a respiratory cause. This viral being… you know, being a very respiratory related thing, it'll be very useful if you're doing the practice every day twice a day, it'll boost the immune system, but at the same time it will tell you it's like a gauge. If you suddenly can't do it one day, you know there is something wrong with your function of your respiratory system. It is… and also one more thing is right now for all the medical personnel, doctors and nurses, we are offering Inner Engineering online free of cost. So anybody can log in and do this, the platform has been set up for this purpose. Normally this… internationally what we offer it costs about $150 per person, but this is being offered free for all the doctors and nurses. This will also help because this is about the way you think and way you feel you can bring a certain amount of balance and control by doing the Inner Engineering online program. I request all the doctors and nurses to make use of it, it's free of cost. And there are also other processes on our app one can make use of to bring balance. But about boosting the immune system, I'm saying bringing balance and bringing a sense of exuberance in the system is very vital for boosting immune system. I don't know how allopathic system of medicine looks at it, but in the yogic system, we always see the most important thing for you to get healthy is that you are exuberant and joyful in the way you are. So for this purpose there are many aspects and when it comes to food, the simple thing that we do when we see that we are exposed to infections when we're traveling, if there is… if we see there are viral infections or influenza going on, all these years of my visits to United States, I don't catch influenza when it's running rampantly all over. The simple thing is just this, hot water, a little bit of honey, little bit of turmeric and if it is possible some pudina or coriander in it a little bit. And every three hours if you drink it, respiratory infections won't happen to you because first they have a tendency, I'm sorry I'm saying all this to the doctors, but this is how we understand if I am wrong, please point it out. We believe that all these infections first lodge themselves in your throat and then they go into the respiratory tract. But if you drink these substances, warm water with honey, turmeric and coriander or pudina, then that goes into the stomach bag and there they are not very effective. They can't cause much damage to you. So like this every three hours if you… those of you who are in the hospitals like this, if the hospital itself can provide that it'll be great. Right now this is what we are doing to all the police personnel and the medical personnel in our region. We are providing them what is called as nila vembu kashayam, which works very well. We did this across Tamil Nadu when the Dengu fever was on. It made a big difference. These kind of things can be done to boost the immune system. In all the hospitals, if it is kept there with warm water and this that medical personnel can drink every few hours instead of drinking just plain water, if they just drink this as a part of their thing, I think it will definitely help. It has helped me in from the…  But it's worked. It worked for my grandmother. It worked for me. Thank you so much. Practical wisdom and that's why we all admire you so much. You started the talk with saying that we are human beings and we are beings and not creatures. As beings, as we see this situation in which there is an imbalance between nature and us and you see this, we see this virus as something just caused by this imbalance. Do you have a perspective on us as a human race where we have gone wrong? What can we do out of this big lesson that we are being given by nature today? See, it'll be very cruel for those who are infected, who are fighting for their life and those who lost their dear ones. To tell them nature is teaching you a lesson, it'll be very cruel to say that I will not say such things. But this is something I've been speaking for last twenty-twenty-five years. One important thing is the human population. I know a whole lot of people will get against me. All the religious groups, all the major religions are against me because of this one statement and many others. See, the nature of human population, the way it's growing, in the beginning of twentieth century, we were only 1.6 billion people. Today we are inching towards eight billion people. And the amount of things that we can do because of technological capabilities has multiplied what hundred people would do and consume a hundred years ago, today one person is consuming that much in terms of ecological consumption. So, having said that, if we do not consciously control our population, nature will do it in a cruel way. Is nature thinking that it must punish us? No, it is a natural consequence because life is enmeshed into each other. It is not like my life and the virus's life are two separate lives. My life and millions of bacteria and virus and everything is interlinked. Plants, animals, microorganisms, we are all enmeshed as one life. So, when we create too much of an imbalance, naturally certain things will happen that correction is not even a conscious correction from nature or somebody wanting to punish us. Inevitably it happens. For example, this is… I'm not talking science, I'm just talking simple common sense, please see it as that. For example, right now a virus which was living in animal kingdom has jumped into human beings. However it happened, there are many theories, I don't want to go into that. But it's happened. Now, if we want to look at it this way, the virus also wants to live as we want to live. Actually, if you look at our relationship with the planet, we are like virus on the planet causing serious damage to everything on this planet. We are the virus actually. So similarly virus wants to live but its habitat is going down. The number of animals in which it might have been living hundred years ago and how many animals it has to live today, their habitat might have come down severely. So naturally they're exploring new habitat. And because we are the big number right now, it is moved into us. There are not enough tigers, there are not enough pangolins, there are not enough bats, maybe in the world. So it's come to us. And now it has learned to live in us. So it is affecting us severely because virus is just trying to live. Virus is not trying to kill us. Virus is not trying to give us a fever. Virus is just trying to live. But it lives so virulently that we are getting all these symptoms and we are dying out of it. This is because our system is not strong enough as a pangolin system to handle this virus. This is my simple sense about it. So this is inevitably bound to happen because all these other microorganisms that may be surviving in wild animals, definitely their habitat has shrunk very, very badly. So naturally they will have a tendency to jump wherever there is a possibility for them to thrive. And human population is definitely that target. So in that context, see for the kind of lifestyles we are living, the kind of consumption that all of us have, the kind of aspirations that we have in the world, we must try to reduce the population consciously. If we don't do it, nature will do it in some way. It is inevitably bound to happen one way or the other and it will be very cruel. Whichever way it happens, it will be very cruel when it is done to us. But if we do it consciously, that will be a sensible way to do because we are human beings. We are supposed to conduct everything consciously. And this does not mean it is happening necessarily because of excessive reproduction. It is just that people are living longer, which is a wonderful thing. For example, in India, the average life expectancy in this country in 1947 was twenty-eight years. Today I think it's reached some seventy-three or seventy-four, which is a fantastic achievement for this nation. Thanks to all of you also because you have a significant role in this. Thanks to all the vaccines and various other things. Otherwise, most of us who are right now on the screen shouldn't be alive, according to those averages. None of us should be alive actually. But we are alive today thanks to that.  But now when we live a full life, it also becomes important that when we postpone the death, we must postpone the birth. I'm not talking any philosophy, just simple arithmetic. If we postpone the death, we must postpone the birth also. That is also happening. Women who are normally started to deliver the first baby by sixteen, seventeen years of age, hundred years ago, today it's gone to some twenty-four years or something, some average like that. But it needs to move further up. Otherwise, if you put every person of the female gender into education process and their education lasts for twenty-three, twenty-four years of age, then naturally it will get pushed, that needs to happen. Still a large percentage of them are not going into full educational process, which is why the childbirth is happening much earlier. We have to push it. If we don't push it, nature will do it in its own way. Right now it's happening. It is a calamity only for the human being. I'm sure the virus is happy. Maybe the animals are also happy. I can see that's happening all around us. Only human beings are unhappy. So we must do something consciously because we are the only creatures who can rise above our instincts and function consciously. Whether it's life or death, both we can handle consciously. This we must exercise as human beings. Thank you so much, sir. With this we are coming to the end. Any final words for all the people that are on the show and looking for guidance from you? My congratulations and blessings to all the medical personnel because India stands out in the way we have handled it. Compared to any other nation with massive infrastructures, compared to medical infrastructure in India, those nations, European nations and America has massive medical infrastructure, many fold over. In spite of that, we have handled it extremely well. Our fatality rates are very, very low. Thanks to every one of you. As I said, do not focus on those few negative incidents.   Thank you very much for having me with you. In whichever way we can serve you, we're always available to you. Please reach out if there is something we can do for you. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. Thank you very much.


So I don't have rankings right now, but there are some red flags with Nick Chubb. Or I should say, there is a red flag, and it's Karim Hunt. It's hard to make the argument that Karim Hunt didn't affect Nick Chubb last year. He did in kind of a dramatic way. With Karim Hunt, Chubb averaged a target share per game of about 6.8%. Without Hunt, who's a pass-catching back, that number was 11.8%. Chubb averaged 18.9 PPR points per game without Karim Hunt. It was 13 points per game with Karim Hunt. We're working with a small sample here, but those are dramatic differences. So if Karim Hunt is back in Cleveland, which seems like a very real possibility, then I don't see how Chubb can be locked into that type of spot in ranked games. Generally speaking guys, if there's a split backfield, it's never a good thing for the running back who's seeing less volume. You can argue better efficiency, though that's even a weak argument, but we need volume above all else. Karim Hunt really hurts Nick Chubb.


Is it strange?  I just got in from the hospital as you just saw I got some mail so I thought I'd throw that in Must have been to a video that's quite sad and honestly I feel really knocked about by it As you know like my blood pressure was already low I've had the pressure issues for a while My blood sugar dropped and I also took an overdose last night So getting mail it makes me feel a bit better But yeah I got us some badges Some more badges, your story isn't over yet I have six of these so they'll go in six of the empty boxes And to finish the day I'm heading to the pharmacy The amount of stress that it has caused is unbelievable Also I made a thought last night, don't judge me Let's talk about what actually happened last night I didn't clear that up in the video Basically I got really anxious and I got really paranoid I ended up taking a pretty big overdose I then did both for help pretty much straight away after Because I was like why the fuck did I do that? And it's such a bpd thing to do Like to act almost as anyway But not even considering the consequences That's what landed me an A&E And then as an A&E I don't really have much memory of what happened Because I was pretty much on puncture of the medication I did I'm not going to go about what I took Because I don't know what you guys are saying But that's what landed me an A&E And I want the highlight of this to be At least I phoned for help That's a big big step So when I was an A&E I was put onto an IV As I was saying before my phone died I'm going to get my prescriptions going Because yesterday I ate the toast That may be very clear It was very clear in the cysts Overdose if I want to call it It was not And I was first it was not as easy as that I have to put that up there Welcome to my den And if you think I'm kidding I've literally built a fort in my bedroom Sorry about the angling on this video And I'm sorry I don't know how I haven't already done this video Because it's got to be one of like My most requested videos ever No idea why I haven't already done that But I haven't So here we are Hey, well, see you guys Welcome back to my channel If you're new here Hi, hello, my name's Lydia And as I said earlier Today's video We're talking about A&E and mental health So what happens when you go through the A&E doors? A lot of what happens depends on the area Personally, I know in London hospitals They have a separate mental health area Just Manchester A&E department Then again, they're Preston A&E didn't Help with A&E doesn't A&E departments work differently A lot of them have got like Specialist mental health places Others don't Once you do They tend to have you on one to one observation If you're in there for a suicide attempt Or any mental health area Every hospital I've been to I've always been like one on one with staff Every hospital setting I've always been one on one This is just the generalised A&E department Remember, I'm on one to one supervision with staff What that means is to stop it with me 24-7 to make sure I don't go in Trying to kill myself or anyone else While I'm there Or if it's because I'm there With an eating disorder and not eating Then they make sure I eat That is so important I think people are kind of afraid of A&E Because they're not known for being the most helpful Like A&E departments just aren't helpful For people with mental health issues And that is because they're so chaotic There's so much going on I've personally sat in A&E for over 48 hours Waiting for a mental health bed With staff members in A&E And A&E is not set up for mental health But they don't know how to handle it So when I was getting annoyed Because they wouldn't take me to a courtyard To get some fresh air Because I don't respond well I don't respond well to being locked in a room So I just wandered around Like the back part Just like up and down the corridor So I'm out of the way But keeping myself busy And they got pissed off with me with that Because they like you in a room Where they have the control And I like wondering and being busy Because you know, that's not something to run with that Everyone likes having something to do The main issues I've run into with A&E Is they have such limited resources And this was a big thing in Preston When I lived up there They, their funding was so short When it came to mental health And people who work there Didn't want to be there Like they treated patients horribly I remember I was sat in resource After my most lethal overdose The health guy came and sat on the bed with me He was like Well, you're just going to do it again So I don't know what to say But back then it was like I wouldn't keep trying to kill myself If you know I knew how to cope Now I've grown as a person And like suicide just is so far from my mind right now In mental health You never know what to expect Hospital's very hospital to hospital I've logged my experience In some many departments As you've probably seen on this channel You haven't I've got an entire series called Hospital Vlogs And that literally shows Like my whole of the last admissions That I had this year And it just showed what it was like Being in hospital for mental health And he has not set up for mental health So go in there for it My honest advice though If you are in crisis If you feel someone is in crisis If you believe someone is psychotic If you believe someone is at risk to that Take them to A&E And enjoy the eight hour wait Because it's worth it It saves a life And I'm never going to tell you not to see Boys Seek out Especially if you're suicidal And it's If you're right at the end Leave me as someone who has survived a suicide attempt And knows people who have successfully committed suicide And that's all I've got for this video If you are new here Make sure you hit the subscribe button Or if you have anything you'd like to add Let me know in the comments down below Interested in reading or Why guys One thing I do want to add Is if someone recommends to get at A&E Don't take it as a shit way Then getting out of it It is a very legit way of getting support And that is how I've got support this year All my admissions happened through crisis Through the home treatment team And you have to learn to be honest with them Like just bluntly honest And just say everything you think Like yes They might but isn't recovery worth it Getting it all out there And starting the recovery process properly Because it's going to be such a big help I know for me going in hospital this year Has literally been a lifesaver for me Like I wouldn't be here without it I hated it at the time It needed to happen Bad none


Hi, everybody. My name is Gretchen Curtis. I'm a co-founder and CMO of Piston Cloud Computing. This is the Media and Analyst Panel. This is my sixth or maybe seventh summit at this point. A lot of these people on stage have done this panel and have been in the open-sat community for many years. So hopefully we'll learn a lot. So why don't you guys just go down the line and introduce yourselves? Sure. Hi, I'm Lauren Nelson. I'm an analyst at Forrester Research. This is my fifth summit. I write on private cloud and hosted private cloud environments. And I've done a few reports recently on OpenStack. We see an increasing number of enterprise questions on OpenStack. I'm Al Sidowski. I'm a research director at 451 Research. The channel I cover is mainly the service providers. So my interest in OpenStack is obviously how the different service providers are involved. We track a lot of the market sizing. We do a lot of insight on OpenStack and involve for a number of years now. I'm Stephen Elgradian, the co-founder of Redmunk. Redmunk is a developer-focused industry analyst firm. So not surprisingly, my interest is more on the developer side of the equation in terms of how OpenStack is developed, how it's adopted by developers within organizations, how it competes with other developer-focused initiatives, and so on. I'm Sean Michael Kerner. I'm a senior editor at eWeek and Internet News. I write about Linux, OpenSource, and OpenStack. And thanks to Gretchen, I've been on the panel like this three times now. So we'll see how much excitement we can generate this time around. Great. All right, so I have a few questions prepared. And we'll probably go through those. And then around 1130, 1145 or so, we will open the panel up to questions from the audience. OK, so my first question. The topic of a benevolent dictator versus a technical meritocracy has been a hot topic since the beginning of the OpenStack project. And in fact, it came up again this morning in Troy Tomin's talk. So many people have voiced concern that OpenStack is lacking a benevolent dictator. Is this concern valid? And if the process is working and getting better over time, why do some people still think OpenStack can't make it without its own Linus Torvalds? I think this is a question that keeps coming up again and again because in the media, most people don't understand how Linux actually works, which is the bottom line. Mr. Torvalds is not even the maintainer of Linux necessarily. At this time, he issues the releases. He's very vocal on mailing lists, but it's not like it's a go or no go decision on something coming in. If it passes through the code, it's fine. But there's the cult of the founder in the technology world, and that's why it occurs. I think in OpenStack, we have Jonathan Brice at the top level. At the release level, there's Terry who does the same role as Torvalds, essentially. So clinically speaking, we do have a benevolent dictator that pushes things through at the same level. Well, I would also say that I think, frankly, from an open source perspective, one of the things you see over and over is a desire to replicate models that we've seen previously. And as Sean said, the idea that Linux is a benevolent dictatorship is a little bit questionable on substance. But that's the assumption, and we've seen this for years, that the GPL was the most popular license by an order of magnitude for years. And you'd go out and talk to developers and say, why is this? Hey, did you choose this license on its merits? And they'd say, more often than not, well, it's the one that Linux and MySQL use. I'm assuming it's the right one, as opposed to putting a lot of thought into it. So it's not terribly surprising that people look at, hey, this is a different model. There are questions about this. So let's go with something that we think has worked before. The new is always scarier than the old. Actually, to take a little different slant. So I think the question that ultimately is being asked is, can the community-driven model work and the way the foundation is set up with technical leads and PTLs and having elections every release prevent somebody from hijacking the agenda. But what probably needs to be thought about is, as more companies make more money within OpenStack, they obviously have interest beyond possibly just what the community wants. So just as long as the model continues where PTLs and technical community and the board continues like that, it potentially has the ability to succeed without having that one person on the top. But it still remains to be seen if a business that doesn't agree with, do we need to add features or do we need to add stability potentially goes off and does their own thing. But there is a foundation in place to prevent something like that from happening. Yeah, and I'd echo those thoughts. In terms of the foundation today, there's a lot of assurances in place to essentially avoid having one voice carry out across the entire community. But in the same way, a lot of the actual contributions itself are very much slanted on, essentially, some voices are heard more strongly than others. And you definitely get more slants. There's definitely advantages of doing more focuses on essentially hardening of resources versus creating net new projects. So I think there's a good mix today. I don't necessarily think that it's a lacking by seeing a benevolent leader versus meritocracy. But I don't think that it's just a different model. OK. All right, so this next question is near and dear to my heart. So we keep seeing stories, blog posts, and reports bemoaning the lack of large-scale production deployments of OpenStack. Yet the rumor mill and insider gossip tell us that several vendors have a growing number of large deployments either running in production or headed that way. And this, I can confirm to be true. Unfortunately, many of these customers have us vendors under strict NDA. Is this reluctance to talk about large-scale deployments of OpenStack hurting the community? Why are customers so reticent to disclose the details? And how can we break the cone of silence? Well, the thing you hear today about the top question at the last few summits have been, is OpenStack Enterprise ready? There's even a session on it right now. But it's kind of this question of, are you going to be able to run your full production-sized workloads in an OpenStack environment? And if we're not talking about how this is already being done today, is it hurting the community with folks not believing in the initiative itself? Even last week, we had a talk within Forrester on our developer, Mindshare, versus those focusing more on the infrastructure service side, on how prominent OpenStack really is. And there's this kind of debate about, essentially, how pervasive it's going to be, whether it's going to actually extend past just a test-to-ev environment, where it's a fun thing for developers to play around with for a specific application or specific set of resources, but will never carry across over essentially that systems of record, rather than just being a place for those new systems of engagement resources. In a way, it would benefit the movement by having more case studies, more examples. But I think there already are quite a few. There's a number of very large enterprises that have told this story. There's also some public ones that have used vendors to get to this position. I think what's more lacking in the market and hurting the community more is just this kind of lack of information and kind of this need of, well, if OpenStack is going to be enterprise ready, it needs to be a direct distribution that you're using of OpenStack and not through a vendor that, essentially, makes it more consumable. Right now, the biggest thing we hear when we're talking about customers is they want to go to OpenStack, but there's a lack of knowledge on what that will take, essentially. How much engineering power they're going to have to put behind that in order to get an enterprise ready deployment up and going without having vendor expertise or a partner that has gone that journey already. So that's the number one thing I think that is essentially holding back in terms of larger, large scale enterprise adoption. I don't think it's the lack of those coming forward and telling their story. It's more the details behind that. So the short answer to the question is, yes, there needs to be more examples. When people are drawn to OpenStack, what they've told us is that the community, the number of vendors involved and the big names involved and people putting money behind it, that's kind of what has drawn them and created the interest. But they need to see more examples in the wild. There's tons of POCs going on. A lot of people kicking the tires and doing things like test and dev, but to have more at scale production examples from the enterprise community. Everybody knows about PayPal and Mercado Libre and Cisco Webex and the classic examples Comcast presented in a Portland and there's a number of Asian companies at the Hong Kong Summit that presented at scale. The more that can be done with that, where peers can see their competition, Fidelity decides to use OpenStack, Wells Fargo is using OpenStack, so to see more of that will make things easier. Making it easier to consume will obviously make it a lot better as well. Well, and as to the portion of the question that sort of got to why this happens, I think the answer to me is pretty simple. You talk to businesses and most of the businesses that we speak with who are using OpenStack and other technologies, somehow assume that not talking about this is some huge competitive advantage for them, as if by not telling somebody what you're doing, you're stealing some leg up in spite of the fact that this is a publicly available technology. And the irony of that sort of, that fact is that all these companies end up talking to us, the analysts, and then we end up selling them back that information because they didn't wanna talk about it publicly in their first place. So it ends up being this very ironic situation. As to the impact for OpenStack, it certainly has an impact, more of it you can talk about public use cases, the more comfortable customers are. That being said, from my standpoint, the impact is relatively marginal. You have sort of a level of commitment across the board from startups to very, very large incumbents, people who are spinning up very, very large investments on the technology, which tends to give enterprise buyers a fair degree of confidence. So is there an impact? Sure, is it a huge impact? Probably not. From my perspective, just dipping into the historical time banks, the first time I saw Werner Vogels was probably 2003 at a Linux world event in San Francisco. Same time, this is 11 years ago now, people were asking the same exact questions about Amazon. But Werner is an interesting guy, he just doesn't care, right? So with Amazon, I think it was a three to five year timeframe, I think once Netflix flipped it over what 2008 give or take, so we'll call it five years, other people started to jump on, and I know numbers aren't public for Amazon in terms of their financial contributions, but I think it was a three to five year timeframe. When we're talking OpenStack, we're talking now what were three and a half years out from its creation. These are still baby steps. I think the sweet spot is three to five years. So for me, it's just a functional question of time. Large organizations take time to disclose. If we look from the example of Amazon, I think OpenStack is accelerating quicker than Amazon, thanks to the Amazon example. One of you remarked that at every OpenStack summit, you see more and more vendors, and if any of you have been down to the marketplace, I think you'll notice it looks like a real show now. In your opinion, is this a good thing or a bad thing, and is there such thing as too many vendors? Well, I was talking to a colleague this morning and we agreed that the perfect number is probably 42 vendors. Always 42. The hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy, the ultimate question, the answer was 42, so we decided 42 is the right amount. But I think ultimately the market will decide, which is quite simply remains to be seen. To me, I would actually say that it's more vendors is more better, honestly. If you look at historical strength of platform, a lot of that strength has less to do with the actual quality and underlying technology, more to do with the size of the ecosystem that's built on top of it and around it. So it's not to say that more vendors is a sort of unmitigated good in the sense that it becomes more difficult to navigate. It does pose challenges, but the larger the ecosystem historically speaking, the better off the underlying platform has been. Again, just because I think from historical perspective, and you know, open source licensing better than I just do, but there was a period of time about 10 years ago where there was a vast proliferation of open source licenses. Every company and their brother made their own open source license, which was basically a derivative of Apache with attribution or this, that or not attribution, et cetera. There was also a wide explosion of Linux distributions, there still are. What tends to happen though is, you know, the cream rises to the top, et cetera, and there'll be a lot of secondary tertiary vendors and there'll be a core of three vendors, just like there's a core of three licenses and a core of three to five Linux distributions and that'll be it. The other ones will be on the periphery, just like there's the periphery of open source license and the periphery of Linux distributions. I don't think it's necessary, a bad thing, as you mentioned. The market will filter out those that aren't successful at meeting a need within OpenStack. I think the bigger question is making sure that that core is strong and that those that carry the OpenStack label meet a certain certification level. As I mentioned in the keynote today, that is gonna be a key component of moving forward. If everybody's using OpenStack to a certain level and it's very different, it's gonna be very difficult to get to that next stage of having some level of interoperability. So now if you carry that OpenStack label, you need to be able to write to sort of an API connectivity to other resources that are within that OpenStack community. A lot of folks are struggling today in terms of the interoperability question and whether the fact that we have such a huge ecosystem but no two are interoperable and as this label gets more developed, it's going to be a much more connected world where you're going to see that next iteration where it will be a more open space. But I don't think the number of vendors is going to influence whether that's successful or not. What are the top pet peeves of media and analysts? What are the top pet peeves you have when talking to vendors and users of OpenStack? What do you wish we'd stop saying and what do you wish you heard more of? Be nice. Honestly I think, and I'm sure that vendors have their own list of pet peeves in terms of their conversation with analysts, but for me, one of the sort of stupidest and most superficial ones is, everybody wants to come out and say, I'm the market leading this and I'm the best in the world at that, where from our perspective, let the market tell us that. I would much prefer vendors show up and tell us what you can and can't, what you believe you can and can't do, give us use cases and so on. But as far as the world beating and fastest it's just let the, it's kind of like saying, I'm funny, you can't really claim that, you let other people say that about you and I think from a vendor standpoint, I think it's very much the same. My perspective, same thing, like in my inbox this morning, I had I think 21 pitches from PR people saying that they were the first or only in the OpenStack marketplace and it made it seem like it was just them, so that's kind of funny. But my biggest pet peeve when I talk with vendors is in many cases, not in the case of Piston, of course, but a true lack of understanding of how OpenStack works, that there's the various layers and that how there's an upstream and then there's open core and open source. So I think there are some core vendors, I hate using the word core, but there's some core vendors in OpenStack that are core Linux vendors that understand, but then there's a lot of secondary and tertiary vendors who have no clue how OpenSource model works, no clue about licensing and they think just because their API compatible means that they're actually contributing upstream. So that understanding between upstream and this whole marketplace is a definition that certain marketing organizations probably need to learn better. Sure, my big ones on the first or only in one category or another where they've created this very niche market on them being the first and only. The other big frustration is just when they've talked about interoperability as being a key down point of OpenStack, as I mentioned before, as it being whether the actual project itself will be successful and I think that comes from a lack of education on where the initiative, the progress it's come from and where it's going and those are probably my biggest views. So a couple of things, one, everybody should stop using the word ecosystem because it's like way, way overused and it's pretty much meaningless at this point. The second one is using hybrid cloud incorrectly and everybody markets something with hybrid cloud. I think last year at the summit, everybody used software-defined networking like that was the big, every piece of cloud role in Portland had SDN on it and I think I would venture to guess that everybody's cloud role this time has hybrid cloud on it or pretty close. We actually had a briefing once and a vendor suggested that co-location and shadow IT for two completely random separate business functions was hybrid cloud and that is not hybrid cloud but it's, yeah, we did a lot of work around this, got input from a lot of vendors, including Piston Cloud and InterNaps in the audience, a number of people and came, it starts with the NIST definition but it didn't go far enough but it's to deliver business processes seamlessly. It's not just because you have two things. And then finally, the other thing I'd mention is that vendors when they talk about what they have, don't talk about what the product is in the features, but what business problems is it going to solve? It's, you got a distro or you got a turnkey, opens that product okay, but a lot of other people do but what business problems are you trying to solve with that? So I think hybrid cloud opens a big can of worms on what that is because essentially cloud plus anything else. So essentially if you have some sort of SaaS usage and then you use on-premise applications, that is a hybrid cloud of sorts, whether they interact, whether they're connected, push to say that I would say that hybrid cloud is a pet peeve and that it doesn't describe anything because there are so many different definitions on where folks draw the lines on hybrid and not hybrid today. Some folks when they're talking about hybrid cloud, that's fully connected to environments where you can essentially do load balancing between these environments and bursting from one environment to another. Others look at it as unified management, others look at it as two isolated environments that aren't connected but they have the presence of public and private. It just is such a nebulous term that doesn't really quantify to anything yet today. So I'd say that that is a pet peeve and myself just said it is so nebulous and varies so much today. Yeah, I completely agree and most of my confusion is because of VMware's vCloud hybrid service which is kind of sort of both and everything in between. Okay, so this is probably our final question before we open it up to the floor. This is a two-part question, so I'd like each panelist to answer individually and it's okay if there's repetition and overlap. So question one, what is the top reason enterprise customers are drawn to open stack? And the second question, what is the main thing preventing greater adoption? Both together or one at a time? Yeah, I'll go first. First reason is momentum, everybody wants to be on the bandwagon, that's easy. The greatest barrier is a lack of understanding of how it fits in with existing proper enterprise IT systems. Some people are just using it as an overlay but there is more legacy than there is cloud and that transition is something that is a challenge for anybody whether it's open stack or otherwise. Yeah, I would say my answer to the first, I think would be really the open source nature of the platform in the sense that a lot of vendors who originally said they weren't gonna get locked into an operating system, got locked into an operating system, the same customers that said they weren't gonna get locked into a virtualization layer, got locked into a virtualization layer and once you get to the cloud platform layer, they would like to in many cases make different choices. So that to me I think is one of the, when we have these conversations, that's one of the big factors, that combined availability. As far as sort of the biggest, I don't know, what was it the exact wording? The main thing preventing greater adoption. Preventing greater adoption, honestly to me it's questions around compatibility. I came up in the keynotes this morning, it's come up I think every time I sat on this panel, the question of what is open stack? Which pieces do you have to implement? Which pieces can be substituted out? What version compatibility do I need to have to be using the open stack label? That's one of the primary concerns that we hear from folks looking to invest in this over the longer term because if open stack ceases to mean open stack and ceases to mean one thing and you don't have that compatibility, then you're right back down the path of locking that I talked about in the first part of the question. As far as the first part regarding momentum, all the enterprises that we talked to, everybody is drawn to the open stack community based on other people being involved, the ecosystem, the snowball effect of people being involved. Clearly that is why they're drawn, they want to avoid vendor locking the same things that Sean and Stephen talked about. And as far as what's preventing them, I guess so I see open stack kind of like old school oatmeal and bear with me for a second, but in the old days when you made oatmeal, you take that big cardboard canister, you've got to boil water, you put it in the pot, if you cook it too long it burns, it's a mess, you got to add your own stuff to it. What open stack needs to get to is instant oatmeal. You rip open the bag, you throw in some water, it's ready to go. But doesn't the original taste better?  So true. So it needs to get like that, orchestration, automation, deployment, it just needs to work a lot easier. People see how many developers it takes to go and build it on their own and I think with Icehouse there's 1200 different parameters now that can be configured, it just needs to be easier to consume. Rip it open, throw in some boiling water and it works. In terms of top reasons for adoption, they've hit on all the major ones, momentum, excitement within the development group of being involved in this large community and ecosystem. And essentially this, avoiding vendor lock in. In terms of barriers. So it's how you look at open stack adoption. So in terms of enterprise adoption through a vendor partner, there's far fewer barriers to that. They make it a lot more consumable, ready right out of the box. I'd say that the main barrier on that side is in terms of support and compatibility of different hypervisors and a lot of those vendors have worked on that to improve that experience as well. If you look at adopting open stack directly, I think it's a use case. So when I look at the private cloud market, I see different types of private clouds. I see those are these pervasive transformational clouds that bridge across their systems of engagement and systems of record. And I see the biggest challenge there is open stack is slow to start up and those initiatives already very slow in moving. So essentially these environments take three to five years to start up using a vendor directly. They're substantial efforts, they have to do policy process, standardization and optimization and adding open stack to the mix makes it very difficult to be able to achieve the timelines they're looking for. If it's a much more targeted open stack adoption, a much more targeted private cloud, one that's more focused on systems of engagement, that's where we see the most and the most targeted usage of open stack today. Where we look at those that are using or trying to build an enhanced virtualization environment where it's all about improvement of IT for virtual machine management, then that's when we start to see those where open stack is not a fit at all. They're looking for just improved management tools where they can look how their resources are acting and looking how they can better load balance and consolidate resources throughout their environment. So I think expansion across use cases, not necessarily to enhance virtualization, but expansion to be more consumable to target that transformational cloud would increase its ability to have greater adoption. And until that time, vendors have made that a lot easier. All right, thanks guys. We're gonna open the panelists up here for questions from the audience. So I believe there's a mic out there in the middle. So if you have a question, I think you can go up to the mic or... Hello, I'm Rania Moser. I am a development manager at Rackspace over in our public cloud shared services division. And I wasn't able to go to Hong Kong. I was at San Diego and Portland prior to that, but this is actually the first summit where I have heard ecosystem being overused. So as much as you guys are like rolling your eyes at it, I would really like to hear more in the development world, the active technical contributors are actually coming and saying, hey, we don't wanna ruin the ecosystem with all this corporation stuff and all this trying to make money and actually be profitable. So if you could expand more on where you're seeing that overused and areas where it absolutely is kind of already been overdone to death, I would appreciate it as a deaf manager. I'll start first. I like the frontier shirt, that's cool. I don't really know HTML, but I figured that one out. Yes. This is part of one of our diversity initiatives at Rackspace. So I was kind of saying it a little jokingly, but just in terms of marketing, it just seems to be a word that is just so overused, but as far as OpenStack's concerned, I think a lot of people can confuse it thinking OpenStack is a product. And it's not really a product. It's a series of projects that come together to build whatever somebody's looking to build and whether that's an ecosystem or not, but I just was saying in terms of, just from a marketing standpoint, just a word that just everybody uses to describe everything nowadays. I think Amazon was the first vendor that really showed how powerful ecosystem could really be, where their marketplace, their ecosystem provides such additional capability and independent growth beyond what they work on themselves that it all suddenly became a focus for a lot of vendors in this space, where ecosystem can essentially provide added value to their customers that they may not have realized otherwise. And OpenStack, I personally don't think ecosystem's overused, where I kind of wonder the boundaries of that is where essentially you're part of the ecosystem in that you support certain projects or support different APIs, the boundaries of that. So are you providing additional functionality? What is that service that you add on that you can't get from the core system itself? And what base level of compatibility do you need to have in order to fit within that ecosystem? But I personally like that organizations are starting to focus more on this ecosystem rather than how much money they can throw at a certain initiative themselves and looking at this innovation that's outside of their own organization. I'm actually gonna introduce some tension into the panel and this is what you're supposed to shoot for as a moderator, right? People arguing with each other. I don't agree that the term is overused and I don't agree that Amazon was the first. I actually like the term ecosystem. I think, certainly in some cases, it's used a little vaguely and non-specifically and that can be a problem. But I think in general, the wider sort of the, as I said before, the collection of projects, both as distributions, but built in and around the platform itself is indicative of success. And to me, it's not, I mean, Amazon certainly is a good example in the cloud world, but as far as I'm concerned, everybody here is still borrowing from Windows, right? All of the lessons in terms of how these platforms play out and the aggregate value of the applications that get built in on top of around the underlying platform. To me, everything is falling from Windows where that was a, it was very, very difficult to compete with Windows for years because you weren't just competing with Windows. You're competing with Windows and all of the applications that went along with it. So even as Linux became more and more technically capable and more and more competitive from a technology perspective, it was still difficult to compete because there'd always be, hey, that's great, but you don't run these five things that I need. You know, they're Windows only. So obviously we don't want an environment in which things are open stack only or AWS only or VMR only or what have you. But by and large, the ecosystem lessons that you're seeing most of these platforms absorb have come from previous iterations of previous platforms. I don't like the word ecosystem because from an open source background, I like the words upstream and I like community because they have real meaning. So if we have an ecosystem partner that is not necessarily open source and is not contributing upstream, are they still really part of the community? The answer is there may be part of the wider ecosystem, but from an active technical contributor perspective, community and upstream are two different things than ecosystem and the technical contributor is absolutely right when they say, hey, that's infecting business and commercial because the ecosystem partners are not always contributing upstream that are always technically part of that open source community. So there's a definitional difference that people need to think about when they're using the words. I'd like to ask, it seems like there's many small camps, small groups of users developing and certainly to implement some of these deployments that I hear about in open stack and I'm kind of curious, does Red Hat's emergence to you help to kind of make this a little bit more of a plain vanilla for folks to kind of more and more folks to really start to use and implement in a broader way? Kind of how do you think about to what degree is the initial adoption kind of fractured little camps and kind of what does it take? Do we need to have something that's more plain vanilla so that you get larger adoption? I'll take a stab at that. I don't necessarily know any plain vanilla, but as I said before, the most important thing to me is, and again it came up in the keynotes this morning, to come up, well hell every five minutes in an open stack conversation that you have, to me comes back to defining what is core, right? Because basically you're gonna want to see different people implementing open stack. They're gonna wanna have their differentiation, they're gonna wanna be different in some way, whether it's services they layer on top or the services they layer on side, but you have to have that confidence to me and this is maybe what you're getting at with a vanilla which basically says, all right, this is open stack. This is the core of open stack. If you implement this, you can use the open stack trademark. This is, you should have some confidence that if vendor A, vendor B and vendor C are running something that they call open stack, that you should have a core set of services and a core level of compatibility that is consistent from vendor to vendor to vendor. And like I said, Red Hat certainly will play a part in that, but all the vendors need to play a part in that in terms of defining, all right, here's the core, all right, everything else, there may be some variability, there may be things that don't necessarily work exactly the same from platform to platform. You look at Java as a classic example here where Sun for vendors to carry the Java trademark had to pass a TCK, a very, very complicated set of test cases and there were things that everybody, WebLogic, WebSphere, everybody else built around it that were different and offered some differentiation from platform to platform, but you had theoretically in some level of compatibility from vendor A to vendor B to vendor C and that's absolutely, in my opinion, what we need to see for open stack over time. It's one of the reasons that we've been pushing for something like a closely defined core for a while. I think where we're gonna see camps emerge is the Red Hat guys have their own world view of how orchestration works. That's why they're talking this morning about CloudForms. If you're a Red Hat enterprise Linux guy you're used to RPM and those kinds of packaging, the Ubuntu's of the world use Juju and Charms and other things, Piston has its own system so I think there's gonna be a couple core systems where people will gravitate based on the tooling that they like. The definitions are all important, but as a user it's the tools that you're used to if you're used to using Red Hat, if you're used to RPM based building tools, you're probably gonna stick with Red Hat. If you're used to Ubuntu and you love Juju Charms which are not a frosty cereal but a really interesting kind of magical treat, then you'll stick with a canonical based distribution and then there's other people that will filter around that. Ultimately the foundation is the one that decides who has a distro. They have a definition, it needs Nova, it needs Swift and some other pieces before it'll bless it as a distro. I think there's eight or nine, the latest being HP Helion last week and they're all a little different. Piston has a turnkey software platform that has some secret sauce in it, it's not 100% open stack. Red Hat says and Mirantis say that they're 100%, but they all at the end of the day fulfill a need for an end user and they want a easier to consume supported version of open stack. So whether it's all vanilla, if that means 100% open stack or not, I think there's a place for everybody and again going back to a question we answered earlier, the marketplace will decide which ones will still be around. Dan Pasek from Red Hat, just an observation because I try to take a real holistic view to the whole space. Given what we've heard from IBM pushing KVM and on Power and KVM on Z and now we have open stack on Solaris, how tightly coupled do you see going forward and don't forget arm and the arm stuff. So how tightly coupled do you think open stack is gonna remain to the x86 architecture and how successful do you think the other architectures may or may not be going forward? My answer to that would be, I think a lot depends on the hardware side as opposed to the software side. And what I mean by that is that arm obviously is progressing towards legit 64 bit chipsets that consume a lot less power than x86 and your sacrificing some performance. IBM touted at, what was your show? Week ago, two weeks ago, Googles come out and made their own power, motherboards and so on. So to me, in other words, I think like virtually every other cloud computing effort, both public, private, open source, proprietary, what have you, it's been all x86 all the time, but that's largely been a function of the success and the performance characteristics and cost characteristics and underlying hardware platforms. So in other words, to give you just an example, if arm is successful at achieving good 64 bit compatibility that can assume reasonable workloads, I think you could expect to see over time, OpenStack move to embrace that, right? Because as more people want to run arm in the data center, I can't see OpenStack saying, the hell with you guys, we're just gonna run x86 forever, right, it's not realistic. But again, I don't think it's, you're not gonna make those decisions in advance of widespread adoption and more importantly, evolution from the hardware side of the equation. That has to happen first, everything follows from there. I think arm in the data center is interesting, but simple reality is Calzada, who is one of the most hyped and probably the most promising, in my opinion. Arm server vendors is now bankrupt, so it's interesting to talk about, but the practical reality is probably somewhat less interesting. I think that might be a function of time though. I think that may have been too early. Unless anyone else has any final questions, going once, going twice, okay, I think that, oh, one more, on down. What is the meaning of life? Hi, Louie de Palma from William Blair. Can you talk about the third party hardware certification process and how that relates to OpenStack? There was something in the news, I think it was three weeks ago, by how Morantis wanted to make the third party process open for the OpenStack community as a whole, to certify third party vendors and I think Red Hat and Rack Space were opposed to having the community as a whole certified because they wanted their individual distributions to certify select hardware. Can you discuss your thoughts on that and how you think that's going to evolve? I'll just give you my two cents. Morantis has their driver log project, which is announced this morning as part of OpenStack Marketplace Driver, so there's third party compatibility for some things and that's open, but you have to remember at the end of the day, OpenStack has to run on top of an operating system, that operating system is either Linux and now possibly Solaris. That operating system should be certified by the operating system vendor on a given hardware, the same as Linux has been certified by the last 10 years. There's no difference, in my opinion, between how Linux has been certified and how OpenStack on hardware should be certified because it's still the same set of distributions. William, that's probably a question more for the foundation to answer. I don't think as media and press where spokespeople for the foundation, but what I would say, though, is that projects that Troy referenced this morning about RefStack and having the ability to have these tests and ability to do better certification on whether it's an API or physical hardware, things like that will help, especially as people look to do federation and be able to use any kind of hardware with OpenStack. I think things like that need to help in, help need to be there and will help the momentum even further. But as far as how it works, that's not really something I can answer. Yeah, and just how the labeling with the certifications go along with that to avoid confusion in the market. I'd say that's the biggest component for those that play in multiple spaces, making sure the certification at each level is clear. Okay, I think that's a wrap. Thank you very much to our panelists and probably see you next OpenStack Summit for another media and analyst panel. Thanks guys. Thank you. Thank you.