Felly, rydyn ni'n ddweud o'r hynny'n cyllidio'r yma. O'r chyfnoddau bod wedi bod yn ymddefnyddio'n ddyn nhw'n gweithio'r gwaith yma. Roedd y gallwn i'n ddweud i chi'n gwneud i gweithio'r gwaith yma i'n ddweud o'r cyflomwysig i gael gael y prosiectau o'r net-zero. Felly, maen nhw'n cael ei wledd yn Gwyl Llyfrgell yn Ygwyllgor Fy Llyfrgell arweithio'r COP 27. Felly, o'r ffordd y gwirionedd yn gweithio'r cyflomwysig, ac mae'n cael ei wneud yn cael ei gweithio'r ffosil ffawr. Mae'r gweithio'r gwahanol yn y Glasgo COP26 ac mae'n gweithio'r Gweithgol a Gath. Yn ymgyrch, mae'n gweithio'r gweithio'r gweithgol COP15, ac mae'n gweithio'r gweithgol yn Llyfrgell, ac mae'n gweithio'r gweithgol yn Llyfrgell. Mae'n gweithio'r gweithgol yn gweithgol i gydag yng Nghymru Gweithgol Gweithgol ac mae'n gweithgol i gydag ymddangos gweithgol i ddechrau'r gweithgol. Mae'n gweithgol yn gweithgol yng nghymru yn ddechrau sy'n hwnnw, a'n mynd i gydag ymweld yma. Dyma yna cysylltiad Cardiol Pwyllnos i gynhyrchol yng nghymru yn 2021. Dyma'n ddechrau'r gweithgol yng nghymru, a pneum ffifthidol a cop15 ywphone bod yn gweithgol. Mae'n gweithgol yn gwneud ar gyfer y ffordd dwi'n gwneud'r gweithgol yn gweithgol yn ddechrau'r gweithgol. Ffifftin is not just an opportunity to create change for the future and to engage global and local leaders. It's an opportunity to show what we're doing here in Wales. I will be able to show how Wales has been tackling the joint nature and climate crisis through, for example, action on peatlands. Also later today, we will be debating the final stages of our landmark bill to introduce a ban on many forms of single use plastic in Wales. As a partner to the Edinburgh process and a signatory of the Edinburgh Declaration, we are proud champions of sub-national governments driving to halt the decline of biodiversity. I will be pressing for the adoption of a plan of action on sub-national government cities and other local authorities for biodiversity, which recognises the vital role we and local governments play in driving and delivering action to reverse decline and deliver a nature-positive future. Now is not a time for complacency. I want now to turn to net zero. You will all know we are committed to reaching net zero by 2050. It's a challenging target and one which we will need the whole of society to work together to make changes if we are to be successful. I want to make sure that as our economy changes, it is fair to everyone. We must not leave anyone behind or anyone out. We must address existing inequalities, not exacerbate them or create new ones. We must ensure the changes planned effectively and equitably, not simply protecting industries and their employees, but strengthening them, developing skills for future markets and ensuring the most vulnerable in society and not unfairly burdened with the cost of change. This week I will be launching a call for evidence on a just transition to net zero in Wales. Our first policy when we launched net zero Wales a year ago was a commitment to transitioning to net zero with social justice at its heart. We are now seeking evidence to identify where both negative impacts and opportunities might appear. We are also seeking evidence of need for our communities, economy and infrastructure so we can see where support can be targeted to ensure a just transition. We also want to gather evidence on best practice so this can be shared. We are committed to moving away from the fossil fuel economy of the past to a new low carbon future. In the present economic and cost of living crisis, we have to work with businesses and communities to do this in a fair and equitable way. In the immediate term, we must find ways of tackling the cost of living and energy crisis, protecting Welsh households, workers and businesses in ways which do not exacerbate the climate crisis. We also need to ensure the UK government plays its part. That means going beyond levelling up and thinking about the wider impacts and opportunities across the whole of the UK. We need your evidence and research to help inform this work and we will be publishing details of how you can get involved later this week. Our climate is already changing as the increasing number of devastating weather events here and around the world shows. They provide a sobering reminder that, as well as reducing emissions, we also need to build resilience to a changing climate. Climate change brings with it risks to our communities, infrastructure, public health and the natural resources on which we depend. This is why this week we will also be publishing a progress report on the delivery of prosperity for all at Climate Conscious Wales, our current climate adaptation plan. We already know the negative impacts of a changing climate are likely to disproportionately affect global and Welsh communities with the least resources. We will therefore continue to develop our climate mitigation adaptation policies to ensure fairness and equality at the heart of our approach. Thank you, Diolch yn fawr. I will take questions next. So the first person to be asked to ask questions is Dan Bevan, who's with us. Thank you very much Minister, good morning. If I could turn attention to other important matters today, the ONS say that the number of Welsh speakers has fallen over the last decade. It has risen slightly in parts of South Wales, but doesn't that show that there are perhaps more traditional communities in North Wales have been neglected by the Welsh Government's programmes to get a million Welsh speakers by 2050? And do these figures not show that so far the Welsh Government is failing on that target? Well, it's true that it's a disappointing figure. I'm sure there are a number of reasons and obviously I'm not the Minister for Welsh Language. But just to say that as a Government we are entirely committed to it, Welsh, as we've just seen in the in the World Cup and with the rugby, is very much a fundamental part of our culture. You know, watching all those people singing Amor Ahid and the fact that everyone I think in the entire world actually accepts that our national anthem and flag are the very best shows the real pride in this. So from our point of view, we're positively pushing ahead with making sure that the Welsh language is preserved and used by future generations. I'm really pleased that we've been able to do a number of things around second homes and targeted interventions in communities which are very beautiful in Wales, but therefore attract people wanting to come and live here so that people who do come and live here can integrate with us, learn to speak our languages, integrate with our communities and make sure that in doing so they strengthen and help us evolve the language. Thank you Minister and also on Strep A we've seen nine children sadly die, one in South Wales. How concerned are the Welsh Government by these figures and the spread of the virus in more general terms? Is it to be expected that we will have more cases across Wales and what is the Welsh Government doing about it? Again, obviously I'm not the health minister, but what we would say to people is don't panic if you think your child has Strep A, seek medical attention immediately, doesn't matter how flimsy you think the evidence is, seek that medical help, either seek it through 111 or go to your GP direct and make sure that your child has the medical help that they need. We will of course have health boards working on contingency arrangements to make sure that people can be covered with that and of course the health minister will be doing public health announcements alongside Public Health Wales to help us with this, but the big message here is don't panic and make sure you seek help. OK, so the next person that we have is Sahaj Jasbal who's also with us. Morning Minister, thank you. What are you aiming to achieve at COP15 and what role change can come from it as opposed to the disappointments you spoke about at the previous COP conference? We're hoping to make sure that we play our part in setting the targets for the 30x30 goal. So these are targets for biodiversity recovery and also we're hoping to make sure that the subnationalists are called governments, so the regions and states of the world with whom we have very good alliances come together and share best practice. So it's really helpful at Glasgow, for example, to make connections right across the globe with different states. So we work very closely with the Sao Paolo government, a government that might look very different to ours because it's a super city on the world, but actually has very similar problems and wants a just transition that we want. So together we can come together to make really concrete things happen on the ground and we can understand from them what they're able to do and we can teach them what we're able to do. So I'm hoping to share our peatland recovery programme. I'm hoping to speak to the Quebec government, for example, about forestry practices and we know that there will be governments from across the world there who we will have a close liaison with and we make the arrangements to speak to them on an ongoing basis, not just at COP. And you've spoken about a low carbon future. Are there any concerns about plants from nuclear plants in Flintshire and other plants across Wales being developed? So nuclear is an interesting one, isn't it? Because obviously we'd very much like what the Wilver plant to be developed properly. But there are some experimental small nuclear reactors, we're looking at some in Transfarnedd and there's a centre of excellence for nuclear science up in North West Wales, which we're very proud of. But the thing there is to make sure that it's only a very small part of the mix and takes its proper place. What we really want is to see real action on renewables like wind and solar. And in particular we want the UK government to work closely with us and the Crown Estates to develop the opportunities in the Celtic Sea to make sure that the people of Wales really benefit from that. Thank you very much. The next person is David Deans and I think he's on screen. David. Minister, good morning. Why do you think Gordon Brown's report into devolution published yesterday ignored the Welsh government's long held view that justice and policing should be fully devolved? So I don't think it did ignore it. I think that's a very glass half empty view of it. We take a very glass half full view of it. The report talks about a symmetrical devolution process, which would of course leave both policing and justice to come to Wales. We thought it was a hopeful report. It spoke well about the need for communities to have the services closer to them for decision making. And that's a sentiment that the Welsh government has long held. A close working relationship with our local authorities shows that. So we think the report is both helpful and a blueprint for the future. So you weren't disappointed by the report then. It didn't seem to have a lot to say about Wales. The Welsh content in the report seemed pretty thin. So we know that the First Minister and Gordon Brown spent some time together. They were very much of one mind. We thought the report was good from our point of view. Obviously it was speaking about Great Britain as a whole and we want to see the kinds of devolution to local areas that we have long called for as part of our constitutional commission. We think it's a good starting point and a place to build. Diolch. The next person is David Nicholson from The Morning Star. Morning. The Welsh TUC has already done quite a bit of work on a just transition and how that impacts on the lower poverty and more disadvantaged people. You mentioned about the evidence gathering group that you're putting together. Who's involved with that? We're asking for evidence from across Wales, from all our communities, from our employers, our third sector, our actual people on the ground, anyone who thinks that they can contribute to us understanding where we are now and what we need to do for that just transition. So we have a whole series of plans in place already, David. Sorry, excuse me. From our net zero skills plan, for example, and our transitional programmes, what we're looking for now is evidence, as I said, of both the disadvantages of moving to low carbon economies and very specifically the advantages of doing so so that we can make sure that we're first movers here on the ground. In particular, as I mentioned the Celtic Sea earlier, making sure, for example, that when we exploit the resources of the Celtic Sea in terms of wind power, that we bring the manufacturing jobs, the green jobs here to Wales, not just the maintenance and supply chain jobs, but actually the manufacturing and engineering jobs so that they're really highly skilled labour that already exists in south Wales associated with the oil terminals and the steel plants can be used in that just transition across to green skills. We have a lot to offer here in Wales and the Welsh Government wants to understand from businesses how we can best present that on a global stage. When you say businesses, you mean trade unions as well, presumably. Oh, absolutely. This is Welsh Government officials seeking this evidence. There's not an expert group being set up to do so for you. We'll be putting out a call for evidence first, and then we'll be looking to see how we take that forward. Just to mention the trade unions very specifically, of course we work in social partnership here in Wales. We will be talking to the social partners, which are our trade unions and the number of third sector organisations. Trade unions are actually at the heart of that to make sure that when we do this transition to a low-carbon economy, the trade unions are front and centre of that. We absolutely have to make sure that we bring our workforce with us and that this time, when Wales becomes the centre of a global industrial revolution, the people of Wales benefit and the resources of that are not exported. Diolch. Diolch yn fawr.


Okay, so welcome everyone today. So this is a CNCF meeting so just reminding everyone that everyone is supposed to adhere to the CNCF code of conduct, which basically means just be respectful and kind to each other so that should be an easy one. And then we wanted to change the meeting time because it's more what we have two people from Europe, so this is not a very convenient time. Most of you are a lot of you participated in the poll, but I think I gave too many options and it kind of like I don't know spread out a little bit so I created a new poll. With the three top options that were just not enough people participated, so I was like okay let's try that again. Again all the links and everything are in the agenda and I will share that again, I can share that again in the in our Slack channel. Okay, then another thing I wanted to mention is that so we're not officially a CNCF working group yet that takes a few things. One thing is we need a charter, I think most content we already have. But we also need a leadership team and so ideally we would want to have two deaf and hard of hearing co-chairs, right. And so if anyone of you is interested and a lot of you are probably new to open source and so on so that's why I wanted to be a little bit more explicit about it so basically. I mean this is a community driven event so it shouldn't be one person talking all the time right anyone can participate and if anyone of you is interested. This is like a chance to kind of yeah just step up engage like everyone can do that not only the people who would like to be co-chairs but everyone can just take you know initiatives and run with things right it doesn't have to be me. Right like just wanted to be really clear and it shouldn't be me so I really really looking for other people who can take on that role and I can say it's a lot of fun and yeah I look forward to finding some people who would like to volunteer so. If you have any questions now you can ask them but also if you prefer via DM as well but first if anyone has any questions now. Sorry I was I was a little late but. So what do you. Is it for this. For this. Yes, exactly so. We're basically so I was always saying we're a working group and so we are. We want to be a working group to be an official CNCF working group. We we need a leadership team right and so we're looking for like ideally I would love to have like to death or hard of hearing co-chairs because this initiative should be driven by. People who are part of that community right and so. Right now the next. I don't know month two months like this is an opportunity for anyone who would like to be to take that role to kind of take initiative participate and and again which. Everyone should not only people who want to so but yeah so I just wanted to clarify that because I know a lot of people are new to open source and it's not really clear how that works and so. Yeah, just. That's what I want to say and like again if you have any questions and you want to do them private or anything like I'm just in me. Okay, so next. Yeah, I wanted to make some speaking opportunities or speaking you so I'm very excited that destiny will be speaking at cube crash, doing a little lightning talk about this initiative and. One of the ideas is really to create like a presentation that anyone can just use so whenever you have a opportunity and a local conference or wherever you know like we want people just to talk about what we're doing. And to raise awareness. So that would be our very first and john and I actually submitted exactly the same talk for keep calm so we'll find out next week Monday by the way, if we got accepted and if we do. We would love to do that with Ian who will be there as well. So we didn't know that when we were submitting so. And then also KCD taxes so for those who do not know KCD is Kubernetes community days, if you're familiar with DevOps days. It's a very similar concept so the CNCF kind of mimicked what DevOps days is doing so these are community driven events. And so in Texas, there will be such an event and they were interested in learning more about this initiative and they're the higher education initiative and kind of asked me if I wanted to submit a talk. And of course I would love to do that with someone who is that we're hard of hearing. I know it is. I mean it like I don't know so I was wondering if anyone is interested in lives close fight to Irvine. I know J Jackson sat that he lives in Houston so that's not super close I don't know, but that opportunity still exists. So that's why I think it's good we're also adding like where we're coming from but I'm not seeing anything in Texas so I guess in this group, probably it's a little far away but if you know anyone that opportunities open. Exactly thanks, Rob, not in California yes. And then also I know it's very far away but KubeCon Paris next year the CFP will open and it's crazy. But we have a lot of time, but I thought like, let's start thinking about it. I would love to submit a talk either either in Paris or wherever the North American is like a panel discussion with you where you talk about your experiences and tech and challenges and so that will be great. Maybe a good opportunity to ask like if you get accepted would that be something that your employer would pay and just like getting that information. We still have time again but that will be awesome and if that's too far away. We can wait a few more months and then we have a KubeCon North America which I don't know yet no one knows actually maybe Amy June actually knows because she works at a Linux foundation when that will be where that will be. So, yeah, oh and we have two French members right Emmanuel and Aurelie. Emmanuel is on vacation in Aurelie. It's obviously very late as well so hopefully we can get them to do something they're a co-presentation or something but I'll ping them. And then again a quick reminder that the CNCF encouraged our deaf and hard of hearing members to submit a scholarship request if you would like to come to the next KubeCon so that's Chicago in November. So there is funds to help you get there right so it will be awesome. I will be there, John will be there, George will be there and I will be there so it would be great to have more people. And then, and again like the links are in the agenda so if you're interested if you can just find it there and and and apply and also feel free. I think destiny applied feel free to share your application with the team you know like if you want any feedback we want to be helped like if there's any way we can help you to like, you know get like a really good application and what that's what we're here for right one of our goals is to support each other. And then we do have our repo folder. So link is there as well nothing is there in there yet except for quick description but like FYI, as we build our resources that's where they were lit will live. And we started with Rob, who gave me like an interesting link a full not a full tracking sheet for relevant organizations, because we're thinking as you come across some organizations that might be useful who could we could partner up with the deaf deaf kids code for instance or there was a conference about diversity and anything that could be interesting. Doesn't matter if it's something we were planning now but it would be great to have like a place where we can add all these links so once we start reaching out and work. And trying to find partners and so on like that we have a place to, you know, find all these these organizations. And yeah, and then let's go to the team updates I think this is Robert. Oh yeah. Hi, this is Rob. I just wanted to add one thing to include includes the NCF. The application for the funds to go to that particular conference in Chicago. The AWS also has a global, a global fund if you will global fund foundation where you apply. If you are deaf or hard of hearing or disabled in some fashion, with less than five years of technical experience. So you can go ahead and apply for that and go to the reinvent in Las Vegas. What that's going to be at the end of November. So there's a lot happening in November. So anyway, that would be fun to get together get these groups together and at Chicago and in Las Vegas. So feel free and encourage everybody to apply for both of those items. Oh, and also, I put together like that list that Catherine was just talking about wanting to add conferences that deaf and hard of hearing folks could have, you know, a good number of people showing up that in conferences that are geared to disabilities. Also, you know, also having discussions about tech. I did find one just a new conference, which is Tapia, which I've never heard of before. The Tapia conference that's actually on a spreadsheet list. It seems that that is a tech focused conference with with a disability bent to itself. They added that to the list and just want to make sure that you all are able, you know, if possible, go to these conferences and show CNCF the solidarity within the deaf community to ensure that, you know, these conferences are still accessible. And to help with networking as well. Help us out right for our future careers. Awesome. And go ahead. No, I was just going to say, we'll, we'll add that link. And Josh mentioned that as well in the, in the notes so that people can find that I know that you added that in the, in the, in the chat in the Slack channel. It's really great like as you see things like just tell people right all these opportunities we should kind of share those since we're talking about conferences still and Jay joined a little later I was talking about the KCD, Texas. So I know Houston is not that close, but that still stands so I was also going to comment a little later so it's not a tech talk. So basically we would be talking about the initiative so you don't have to be Kubernetes expert you just have to be an expert and, you know, the challenges and why this is important so it's it's more an awareness and like what, because we are a CNCF group and basically we were telling people what we're doing why it's important why we need these initiatives so you're, I'm pretty sure you're totally qualified to participate if that's something. It's not too far away or my apologies, but probably for the interpreter that this is Jay. So I'll be back up to where I got started there. So I'm not very good at public speaking, in general, but my experience, my death experience compared with other folks, you know I do know has been very limited. So I don't really use interpreters I haven't really used interpreters and my accessibility at work is a bit easier, if you will, so I don't know what I can provide but I'm certainly willing to come in and meet people and learn about that and see what I can do if you have to do that. Okay, but let's touch base offline and just FYI, I hate public speaking. I'm afraid of public speaking I still do it, because I think it's important for my career it's important so I push myself to do it I feel not comfortable at all so I'm going to push everyone here as well to do that because it's really good for your career so. I guess you really don't want to but I urge everyone, because I think it is, it is a really valuable experience. I was just going to speak up to like a new company I'm working for is based out of Austin, and it's about three hours away, so I can tentatively looking to doing a onsite during that week and swing up by there for the weekend. Awesome. Yeah, let's chat about that. Yeah, awesome. Okay, I think then we're up. James, I think James said. He takes great pictures of Irvine for your for your book there. I saw your vacation photos on Twitter. Yeah, finally back. So it's like the return promo. Awesome. Yeah, anyway, just again this is Rob just wanted to encourage us to network, not only public speaking but networking, right that's very important, getting the word out about CNCF and the deaf and hard of hearing work group, right getting that word out there and sharing that information. And that way, it makes people think in the increases awareness and more, you know, again, focusing on open source within the deaf to make the open source field I should say, and certainly will allow us more opportunities to show our faces in our hands. Well, of course, so it'd be great to get the word out there again networking and just encouraging folks to do that. And then let's see there was something else. Oh, Catherine, you wanted to discuss the next topic or Yeah, if we're done with this we can move on to David. Yes, so for our team, we have been discussing creating pathways for deaf and hard of hearing individuals and through cloud native and open source. So far we've got a couple of possible strategies on one is partnering with like deaf and hard of hearing colleges, universities, organizations, et cetera, and provide faculty with the tools that they need to teach students the skills. So we were considering on pointing faculty to like the higher ed working group, but it has been pointed out to us that that is a very new working group that probably won't be like your son until it's ready. So that's kind of down the road a little bit. Moving on to cloud native talks from deaf and hard of hearing individuals, which we talked to those professionals and see if they're willing to give talks about that. And I know I know there are people here who have in fact done those sorts of talks. You also have a good suggestion on a little possible tactic of educating the Linux foundation and see on the up on accommodations and recommendations for mentorship program and what just came up today so we haven't really discussed it yet but I think that's great as well. So that's kind of where we are right now after a bit of a slow start but getting there. David I'm sorry to interrupt this is the interpreter. CN would you mind what is what is the words for CN. What does that stand for. Oh, no computing foundation. Okay, thank you. One thing that I was going to say. So, um, yeah, the higher at working group is, yeah is newer than this group. Right, so it's like it's just so it will take a long time to create the curriculum. But one thing that can be done actually I thought about that later is, well the first thing is like finding these people at the universities right and saying like this is going on are you interested would you be interested right like doing that outreach and letting them know that this exists. And I did that I think the first organization person I reached out to was at someone at Gallaudet University. And the idea about doing a talk was actually something that the professor suggested. There's something there are interested in that. So I, because it was early on, we didn't have anyone. So I said like wait, wait, we have this group. So there is someone like so there is that opportunity at Gallaudet University and they're interested. But I said that we're going to reach out when we're ready. So I think it would be great if someone could do that eventually not right away but once we have that presentation kind of figured out and it's basically what is kind of, you know, why is it interesting why is it exciting kind of it's it's more an educational high level entry, kind of entry level talk that gives an introduction to cloud native to students to just see like if they're interested because that's a topic that is covered in universities to universities typically. And so I think Rob you studied at Gallaudet I don't know if anyone else did so I think I thought that was perfect would have someone who was. Yeah. Yes, and also, I'm also an alumni of the Rochester Institute of Technology RIT and the National Technical Institute for the deaf which is a very technically sort of oriented and strong program as compared with Gallaudet so in terms of like science majors and data science at NTID that's a really strong field and the technical competency is very high so everyone is becoming developers and software developers data scientists and the like. When they graduate with that degree from I personally had a degree in economics and finance from NTID but I didn't end up doing anything with software data architecture but you know figures but I would be someone who could potentially go or organize someone to go to either NTID or to Gallaudet to to discuss that for the future and discussing why it's important to have open source available. So I'd be happy to expand on that. As far as NTID I recently joined this group. I'm sorry Brian Traeger recently joined this group have you seen that name. He's a professor at NTID. So you may see that name as well. Yeah. Yeah he joined but like he was I think he's kind of maybe busy now with the since classes that started but yeah so I did actually did hunt him down a little bit and that's how he joined so maybe it was a little early but so yeah I think one thing would be like creating again like one of the things that we want is like have like several presentations right that anyone can use so something that's repurposeable one would be like the lightning talk about our like our initiative another one would be like an introduction into cloud native to to kind of tell students or maybe people that deaf and hard of hearing and tech or who might be interesting who don't know much about cloud native yet and would be interested in learning more so once we have that presentation that could be something that we could actually do in a shorter term right like the curriculum is not something that is available yet and then I think it's the first step anyways because we need to see like are you interested is there interest and then like kind of like the next step would be how can we provide more educational material. Good I think if we don't have anything else I think we could move to Rob. Let me go ahead and share my screen here. Oh will we see. Yeah so I yeah I just did you I may have missed something I was looking at another screen. That's the danger of being deaf and hard of hearing. Right, you cannot multitask in these situations. So if you told me something. I probably missed it. Anyway. So by missing something you want me to start on how to empower deaf and hard of hearing individuals by being more active and more visible within the community right so love some ideas from all of you as a group. A few of us have already presented in some capacity for provide some ideas, going to some conferences, typically will go to conferences to network to give talks. And then conferences advertising being cool hey come in this is a really cool conference see this really cool talk, watch and learn about new technologies, but career wise, it doesn't always help us. Right. We learn from doing most of the time, we learn from our co workers and interacting with them hey there's this new feature in a certain product what have you. So, you know it's cool so that's we learn as we go, or we're reading certain documents trying to come up to speed and learning about new features and whatnot. But I'm always trying to make the point that we need to attend conferences to network, right to interact with other folks outside of just these talks, right, go to happy hour. Have a cocktail or two, get a little buzz right have a good time interact with these these maybe you know if you don't drink that's totally fine too. But the point I'm trying to make here is that you need to find career opportunities, you need to find out what the problems that other folks are facing, and then implement certain technologies. Try to find out what they're doing. What they're doing as far as debugging how they're debugging. So, really, this is like really important information that we are unaware of because we're not networking. So, again, trying to encourage the NCF to provide interpreters outside of these side of the conference hours, right conference hours typically are nine to five generally right, but of course, all the cool stuff happens after hours after five o'clock. So it would be nice if as part of the registration fee or registration package to be able to incorporate the cost of interpreters, you know, whatever they're requested. Typically companies will host it at a restaurant or at a bar, what have you, or maybe top golf. And a lot of deaf folks are like that I want to bother doing that because the interaction is lacking it's very, very difficult that interpreters and everybody's talking loudly there's a lot of it ambient noise and it's very difficult to network in those situations without interpreters. So, but by providing interpreters for after hours with deaf and hard of hearing folks would have that access so anybody agree or disagree or aligns with that that's my first point. That's that that's my first tactic, tactical approach. Also, want to talk more about providing talks, presenting conferences. Oh, by the way, feel free to interrupt me at any time. Just wave your hands and get my attention. So again, I want to encourage folks to take out these opportunities in the media opportunities to speak at conferences. I was on CNBC, that a month or so ago. And I got just absolutely a great impressions by people in my company and swallow swallow more aware right. They were like, I show you on CNBC that's so awesome, which was great. AWS containers team. AWS has put a lot of money towards CNCF. So a AWS has just been absolutely fantastic when it comes to, you know, like again with me being on CNBC that was a big deal for AWS, and they knew that so they were thrilled to see that. So that means that AWS will continue to contribute to CNCF because we're they're getting this spotlight right. I mean I think they're always going to be doing that but the point is, the work that we're doing as a group, right brings in assistance from other companies, right. Companies will contribute to CNCF in the name of, you know, diversity, what have you. That kind of thing. So the more we give talks and speeches and the more we show up. Again, I want that's key, more that we show up in our visible. And what makes us show up is having great interpreters and resources with us at that time when we're there on and off, you know, conference hours if you will, before, during and after conference hours. So we need to, again, get your expertise that some of you, you know, working with Kubernetes, maybe you're struggling with a particular issue document that issue, and then make a talk out of it. Right. I've given talks before about, you know, several times. I'm dot net with Kubernetes talks. There's a link. I'll have to find and I'll share that with you all as a group. Like I said with you Catherine so you can forward that out. Anyway, again, that's, that's another tactic. So tactic three, where social media, we can encourage, get the word out via social media about deaf and hard of hearing folks. But saying that we are here, we belong to the technical world, the technology world. And our disability may be hidden. Yeah, as we're walking down the street in the city, nobody would know that I'm deaf until you walk up to me and started talking to me or any deaf person, welcome to start talking to them. So we are here, we have a hidden disability and but we're everywhere. We're still finding deaf folks. Oh, I'm like, Oh, you work at that company. Oh, you work at that company. And there was one deaf person here that works at Netflix right and we have other deaf folks that work at Uber. Somebody else that works at Twitter at least used to work at Twitter and then was subsequently laid off.  So, again, we're not being recognized or noticed, if you will. And I want to change that. So again, it all comes down to giving more speaking opportunities, getting more FaceTime and video, things of that nature. Also wanted to develop some workgroup talks, right, with regard to talking about the work we've been doing all along. I think Catherine has documented, you know, she's made great notes and some great documentation. And I think that's a lot of great material to give talks, using that information to give talks, we could use that to make our own talks, and I would encourage you, all of you to seize the opportunity and do that. I don't want to be the one talking all the time I would love to share that with all of you. So that we all get that FaceTime. I know the Destiny is doing one which is absolutely fantastic. We'd like to see more of those in the coming years. We have CubeCon, CubeCrash. There are a myriad of data conferences, but certainly could add Kubernetes. We could talk, you know, about a myriad of things, anything data related. There's many kinds of conferences with regard to that, AWS. There's Kubernetes everywhere, and we should take the opportunity to talk about that. And, you know, give different kinds of talks. I have noticed that many conferences are interested in people talking about disabilities. Deaf or other disabilities and that space and how we survive in this space. People are very interested in learning about that and it's not just a technical aspect. It's about how we survive in the space, right? You don't have to be a technical pro to present at a conference and that's that's what I'm seeing over and over again. People are talking about women in the technology field. People are talking about POC in the technology field. So these are very, very popular topics to be talking about at conferences. It doesn't necessarily have to be C sharp or a job or anything of that nature. That's really cool. And then of course, if you want to come to CNCF conference, just let us know. Let Catherine know. And we can certainly forge you the application form and try to make it accessibility so that we have more deaf and hard of hearing folks that are visible at these conferences. I don't want to be invisible anymore. That's for sure, right? We don't want to be invisible. What are the strategies and different tactics that I'm working on right now? And I certainly would appreciate your help. Now that you've paused, this is Amy June. I want to echo some of those same sentiments. I am a public speaker by trade. I work in the open source community, but now I work for the Linux foundation. So it's a little bit less available for me. Hold on my phone. It's less available for me to travel because I don't have the funds that I used to when I had the privilege of working for red hat. But what I do at every conference is I'm very transparent with my needs in the open on social media or replying to all that I need accommodations, which opens up conversations to folks. I still go to after events and I make it very transparent that I'm uncomfortable and I'm leaving because I can't hear. So people are aware and then I find the next time I'm invited to speak or the next time that there's something. There's an accommodation there or more of an attempt for an accommodation. So being for lack of a better word vocal about what I need helps me the next time I attend an event. I don't talk about accessibility at every event. I talk about all sorts of different topics. But at the beginning I always ask, because I am hard of hearing, do people need anything for me, and I still use Google slides because they have captions, which are kind of captions, but they're better than nothing. But I alert the people that there's this option that you can use Google slides if the conference doesn't have captioning themselves. So those are a couple of the ways. I help like just bring the awareness of I'm never bitter or angry about it, you know, but I, I, I do not hide my disappointment that I can't attend an event because I can't hear. Thank you so much for that. David, did you want to say something. Actually, I was just going to note that and have a hand up, but I do want to kind of amplify the point that both she and Rob made about kind of, um, after I would accessibility like that post conference events, you know, the evening events, because I have gone to a number of tech conferences as well. And that's always been a problem. For a long time I just didn't have any accessibility for them at all. And I would be completely exhausted just from trying to focus and we'd love to support it ours. And at that point, it's just so stuff isn't happening. And I have, I have gotten a man thought by effectively bringing my own accessibility. Um, I have this Muslim microphone system now that let me get captioning into like to my phone or whatever. But still, it's annoying to have to do that labor all the time. Right. Excellent. Yeah, so what would make. So that would make you avoid going to a conference right in David. You're avoiding going to conferences because of accessibility issues right. And I can see where the funding. Right, we've always been, how should I say, behind when it comes to salaries, because we don't know how to ask people for increase right for we see our hearing peers. They're being promoted faster than we are. They're making more money than we are they're more assertive. So we tend to be much more careful because we want to keep our jobs to begin with right we don't want to be going to the job because we don't have great accommodations where we're currently working. So we're not job hopping and increasing our earning power by doing right we miss out on opportunities so we're behind on salaries, definitely hard of hearing, typically are behind when it comes to stop saying it's the same with minorities, for sure. There are certainly minorities going through the same exact situation so that's why it's great to see CNCF and AWS providing scholarships to be able to attend these conferences. Alex, would you want to say something. You're on mute possibly. Can you hear me now. Yeah. Sorry about that. I was just saying that I echo every everyone, but what everyone said before, but I also wanted to bring up one of the challenges I've been facing with conferences which is the, you know, the funding is obviously a big challenge, but the other challenge that I keep running into is the communication, even if funding is available I found that I often am required to do all the coordination for any of the accommodations myself. And that takes a lot of time and frankly doesn't really contribute to it takes away time from from my job, which I can't always afford to do. And so one of the things I look at when I'm trying to find conferences to attend or speak at is when conferences like strange loop or conferences that all the coordination is already done I can just show up. And I know that everything is already in place without having to explain what I need and explain all of the explain exactly how to do everything. Because yeah, it's always on us. I know how to something I've talked about with Ian before. I'm not sure if there's a good way to have sort of like a central life coordination arm, where, you know, maybe CNCF is the right place maybe it's not. But we can say, you know, hey, reach out to these guys they can coordinate all the accommodations that I need. And that kind of reduces the level of effort on my end for attending conferences. Just thinking out loud there. Hi. So, I think that's exactly what we're trying to do. And also to back up. I think it's great to hear all these stories and I don't know maybe I am naive. But my feeling is that a lot of these things do not exist or are so hard because people just don't know. Like they don't know how to be more welcoming how to make all these things available. At least that's the feeling that I got with my initial kind of interactions with the CNCF about this topic so we'll see.  These are the things that we believe you should offer. And then make this available so of course the first conferences that we're going to ask to do this right are CNCF conferences because we're a CNCF group but these all these artifacts that we're going to create are going to live online on a website and they're not only for the CNCF there for any conference, any employer any so we start creating all these recommendations and things of what are best practices if you want to be welcoming for the deaf and hard of hearing right and then. Yeah and just see like what is feasible what can be implemented and so on and hopefully, you know, the goal is that the CNCF kind of leads the way in that sense and then that that becomes the standard eventually so at least that's my hope. It's naive, I don't know but we'll see and find out at least we can. Right, and this is Rob. Yes, I think you're being naive because the first year right. Basically, we have to make it a habit of going to that same conference year in and year out. Right accessibility accommodations will get better and better after every time you attend. Right, we learn from the first year and the second year and so on and so forth. So, you know, AWS reinvented the accommodation right they was not very good I can say that you had to fight for accessibility accommodations and the second year is a little better. So I got a lot of feedback and every year became better and better. I became a data here on AWS exactly access to VIP parties and meeting VIPs within AWS. And then my interpreters couldn't get in the same room that I could get in because they didn't have the right access that I am. Finally, we're able to get the interpreter in so we learn as we go right it's never perfect the first time. So with CNCF in Chicago, right there will be a learning curve there. There will be some growing pains. As I said there will be a learning curve there and growing pains and it's again it's important to show up year in and year out and the accommodations will get better as a result of that. So, as much as like I echo that I don't always want to go to the same conference every year. So that's a challenge to as I find myself attending the same events because the accommodations are better and better at that same event. But I really want to go to Drupal con Asia, you know, but I, but, you know, I think you understand what I'm trying to say it's it's it's it's hard to to when you don't have that privilege. of sponsorship to do that year in and year out. I luckily have at least like sponsors for the tickets because I usually get a talk accepted. But I still have to do the hotels and the, you know, even like the accommodations for for for just getting to the venue is sometimes hard, you know, I'm physically disabled too. So I have multiple things against me when it comes to like feeling comfortable at conferences. Yeah, I'm sure it's not easy right and it's like it. Yeah, but I think in that sense what Rob was saying and I know it's like not best going always to the same conferences but it's also like how do we I'm not going to say force change but kind of encourage change right and I think like the importance of being a group and and and that's why I would like to have as many deaf and hard of hearing people in our channel so we can organize a bigger group because you can. It's much easier to make a case and say like hey CNCF we're going to have 15 deaf and hard of hearing people coming to this conference right like, so there is it's, you can create that's it's much more easier than saying like hey it's just me and then can you make all these accommodation and it's just that one person. There is much more motivation there right so I think I think what Rob was saying like I don't know it's it's not cheap and so on so whoever can come I think it's like being visible right now we're always going to try to have a talk right but like just walking around and seeing people signing or communicating and you know in a different way like people need to get used to see that people that need to see that you know deaf and hard of hearing people belong and then you know like people will start making those accommodations because they know that those are also people within the community right. So they're important and we need to be welcome and so thanks for that kind of emphasis. Rob, because I think that's really important as well. If we don't have anything I would pass it to john. I mean, there is like one resource I think you and some other people were working on I know that not a lot of progress because of vacations and so on but anything you wanted to say about that. Yeah. So one of the things that we're working on was guidance for people who in open source communities that run meetings that hold virtual meetings such as this one and provide them some level of guidance on how they can set up, prepare and coordinate the meetings to be most accessible as well as guidance for people who are deaf or hard of hearing, but are maybe new to joining meetings like this, and how they might want to set up their screens or have their computer organized or, you know, telling people about pinning different accessibility options in zoom or teams or different things like that so we right now we just have like a scratch document with a few of my ideas and I know that Ian has not got a chance yet but I know they have a pretty comprehensive set up over the years and had some guidance that they wanted to share. And so I guess I would say for everybody though, especially if you are deaf or hard of hearing and if you have advice that you would like other people to know about whether they're deaf or hard of hearing or not running the meetings or not. How can we get that guidance out to I think conceptually in my head. We could have a couple short like checklists, or one page reference documents, so that it'll be followed more completely and then we could kind of iterate on that, and share it more broadly and make it a standard resource. So at a lot of the CNCF meetings that I attend. There's a very standard, you know, this is a CNCF meeting we abide by the code of contact, etc etc. It'd be interesting to get accessibility, some sort of an accessibility reference towards the beginning of those meetings at the kickoff, or somehow included. And so I think the way to start is just putting this this reference guide together and getting getting feedback on it. Awesome. So I think that will be super helpful. A very good resource. Meeting notes. Well, but I'll throw a quick link in the chat in case anyone wants to look at it. Yeah, and that is for all resources like we know that different people are kind of leading and different particular resource but like the goal is for everyone to kind of chime in who has like something some ideas and so on like it's one person but then like it just put it in our Slack channel, ask for feedback because the more people look at it and as you mentioned on different people have different tactics that they may have identified that work very well so we want to make sure we capture that. Okay, and then other things that. Well, we have another areas that are kind of like, so basically the areas were broken down by the goals that we were trying to achieve right we're saying that we have these four goals. And then how do we achieve those and we do have three more but I think like for empowered deaf and hard of hearing to become more active members. Visible and active so we broke that down into two because that's very different right we want is like how do you make the cloud need of ecosystem more welcoming so people can participate it doesn't mean necessarily be visible at conferences talks it's like a little that that would be a step further so we wanted to kind of separate that because it will have different strategies. So we encourage and educate employers on hiring deaf and hard of hearing employees, we don't have a particular team yet, which is okay because we, we have lots of things to handle but that's like something that we have as well and. And then the other one is like build deaf and hard of hearing a deaf and hard of hearing in tech community network. So we can learn and support each other and that's like there is no team here either but I think that's going, it's a goal but a thing that will happen naturally, but it's just a good way it's a good thing for us to remember that it's not just creating those resources and so on it's also like helping each other, you know, like if you need advice if you want to like intact there are other people here in tech that have. There's also a deaf and hard of hearing so it's supposed to be this kind of supporting environment where people can just ask questions that are not necessarily necessarily related to the goals maybe that we as we have them stated here. And then I put like just real quick because it's like, I find that really important like and I call it collaboration best practices, because we are not working all at the same company so we don't really know when people are off and so on. Oh Rob saying something sorry. Rob you were saying something. Okay. Nope, go ahead. Thanks. So it's really helpful if you're gone. If you're gone, like on vacation or a few days, if you put and I know David did that which is super helpful like add a little palm tree on your status, like actually slack has that as an option it just helps so much because sometimes I may just be like Sacking, I don't know sacking James like and then he's like oh I was gone it's like. Okay, so it would have been nice to just know that he's not ignoring me so I find that very helpful I know that a lot of people do that and then the other thing is like when someone puts something in slack and you know, like a reaction sometimes because I have been working in different things a lot and I find it sometimes very frustrating when there's no feedback. So, just like a little thumbs up that you saw it or not like it's just really helpful. You know just telling people yet acknowledgement or, and I, it's not something that happened here so it's like I feel like our group is quite responsive but that's something in general that I find it's just kind of nice and I consider it and people sometimes don't do it, because it won't be mean of course but it's just like it just can sometimes feel a little like no one is paying attention. And then I have Rian on here. Yes, I can quickly speak to this. Sorry about camera off I've got internet choppiness. Can you hear me. Yes. Thank you. Okay. There was a lot of talk about being visible in the community and doing work in the community so I'm not so much about the initiatives but I'm coming around to offer work anybody that want to help please come around to contribute to strategy working group meetings, which is linked all the information there. And it is a working group specifically trying to onboard more people get more people involved in the work that we're doing. There's documents to be created and all sorts of things that help you learn your way about this around this tag and around governance and all sorts of other topics. I invite everybody that's looking for and have bandwidth for to pick up things to join us in those meetings. Is the tag working group the tools initiative. Tag. Okay, we speak a lot of abbreviations apologies we should do less of that attack is the stands for technical advisory group. So that is an insight that there is a lot of work how we empower projects to get contributors to join their projects projects. So, if you're interested in that type of work and I think they might be a lot of people in this community that specifically like to help on board more people that's a place to join us. Okay, great and we're already at the hour. So, there's always lots to talk and we never make it through the agenda, which is great because there's a lot of talking. But yeah, we can continue the conversation on slack. Thanks everyone for joining always great to see everyone and yeah let's get some stuff. Thank you.


Hello! Well, now that Red Hat has announced .NET Core 2.0 for Linux, let's take a look at something that might be kind of useful. As you know, a lot of people have .NET framework applications, and a lot of people actually express the desire to port them over to .NET Core 2.0.  So here I have .NET running version 2 on RHEL, and I'm going to show you this tool that Microsoft has called API port. It's right here in the GitHub repo, Microsoft slash .NET-API port, and you go down here and you'll see the instructions on how to set it up and run it. You can run it as a standalone app or you can run it as a Visual Studio extension. In my case, I will run it as a standalone app running on Linux. So here are the instructions to build it. I've gone ahead and done that, and instructions how to run it, and I'll show you how that works. So what I'm going to compare it against is the OpenStack SDK for .NET. This is a library that we built at Rackspace over three years ago, and it allows .NET developers to use OpenStack, which is the open source cloud operating system. So I've gone ahead and downloaded that onto my RHEL machine, so I have everything going here. So all I have to do now is run a command. I run the API port in DLL. That's the program. I'm going to analyze it. I picked the file, which is the OpenStack DLL. The output is HTML, and I'm going to write it to my shared folder or directory that I have between Windows and RHEL, so then I can open it very easily in Microsoft Edge. So I'm going to go ahead and run that. This screen gets a little wonky. I think there's some improvements there, but it's done. So now if I go into a shared directory, there's the result HTML, and I bring it up. How compatible will this .NET framework application that was written with framework 4.5, how will it compare to .NET Core 2.0? And there are the results. As you can see, it scored a 100% compatibility rating with .NET Core. That means this framework will run on .NET Core. In fact, it's 99.18% with .NET framework 4.7. If you were going to upgrade that, you would have to make some changes. So in this case, you'd be better off running it in Core than framework, the newest framework. And in fact, .NET standard 2.0, which is now a specification, it's also 100% compatible. So there you have it. That's how you can take your application, run it against this tool, and see how compatible it is with .NET Core 2.0. You might be surprised. Thank you very much.


All right, but why don't we move on to the next? We're now going to move into the first of three concept clearances. And the first one is by Elise Feingold on the future of ENCODE. And I just want to say that DD Meldrum is on the phone from Lyon, France. Is there anybody else who's on the phone? OK. OK, so I'm going to give a summary of the concept clearance we have for three RFA's for ENCODE. Hopefully, you'll have good context for these after my talk this morning. So the first RFA, well, first of all, I want to say that we had input from several planning meetings. The first was on the genomics of gene regulation. Planning meeting as part of the broader planning for the next strategic plan. As I mentioned earlier, we had an external consultants panel in the course review of the ENCODE and modicode projects last April. And then we had a lot of relevant discussion at the Early House strategic planning meeting last July. So to summarize the collective input, there was recognition that after the projects of modicode and ENCODE projects are finished, we'll only have interrogate a small fraction of the cell states in the organism. So the long-term goal of completing the catalog of function L, which still be a priority for NHGRI, we had to think about the fact that the data needs to be generated at a reasonable cost and in a reasonable time frame. And we need to consider what work requires a consortium infrastructure versus what can be done in uninitiated work, investigator-initiated work for the community. There was a recognition that current technologies were not sufficiently robust to really totally complete the catalogs. There were some limitations and reagents. And there was also a need for enhancing data analysis activities. So we use this collective input in developing these initiatives that we're going to be talking about now. I should also say that at the February council, we addressed one of these limitations, the concept clearance in technology development. And Michael Pazin gave a concept clearance that was approved to talk about R01 and R21 pilot projects for improving the sensitivity and cost of being able to identify functional elements and also stimulate development of better methods for high throughput biological validation. So that addresses one of the issues that was raised. So these next RFAs are moving forward with the rest of the program. The first is on expanding the encyclopedia of DNA elements in the human and model organisms. So in constructing this plan, we were taking into account several goals that we thought were important. And the first is that we felt there was a need to balance technology development with continued data production. We feel that in our experience is that it's important to have both technology development and production that fuels progress. We wanted to expand the code projects to generate as complete catalogs as feasible with the current technologies, limitations of current technologies. We really wanted to capitalize on the progress that has been made in establishing high throughput and efficient production pipelines through the support of centralized production efforts to take advantage of economies of scale, centralized management, and centralized coordination. And so in this initiative, we really wanted to focus some of the data production and analysis efforts to really maximize the utility of the resources and thinking about the most useful data sets to collect. So the proposed scope of the expanded in code would be a big emphasis on continuing annotation of the human genome. This was felt to be a very high payoff project useful for the community. There's a lot of new RNA data that's now available that will fuel the continued annotation of the human genome. We also wanted to expand this annotation of the mouse genome since this has proved so important for the human project. We also wanted to expand the repertoire of data types in the code in particular emphasis on more classes of RNA molecules and functional elements within RNA molecules for the human and mouse genomes. It was clearly when the code project started four years ago, we did not have as good appreciation of the different classes of RNA molecules that we do now. And so we feel this is an important area to expand it. Then we also wanted to take existing data sets more deeply in the human genome with more limited studies in the model organisms fly and worm and the mouse. And these deeper studies would include mapping binding sites for all transcription factors using at least two cell types for each new factor. This is a really large, big limiting step in encode is getting reagents to map all the different transcription factors. And so we felt that if we can get at least some information, at least on two cell types for each factor, that will go a long way in increasing our knowledge of the binding sites and finding functional elements. We wanted to go deeper in cell types mapping sites for open chromatin, mapping selected histone marks, and other relevant chromatin proteins also more cell types, and then mapping sites of DNA methylation and additional cell types. In terms of the genomes to be studied, we feel it's important to have a primary emphasis on the human genome, secondary emphasis on the mouse genome, and have a reduced emphasis on C. elegans and Drosophila melanogaster genomes. The fly and worm projects, the monocoat projects, have been very successful, as I discussed this morning. We recognize that they are not complete at this point. We feel that they've provided a firm foundation for the research community that now actually has there's much broader access in the community to the different technologies that are being used. And we feel that individuals can now have the ability to ask more biologically focused questions with these technologies, and so we feel there's a reduced need for consortium infrastructure. And we'd like to actually use the monocoat catalogs and the model organisms to, for the next questions, we want to ask about interactions of functional elements and the regulation of gene expression, and Peter is going to talk a little bit more about that in the next concept clearance. So we still think there's a lot we can use these model organisms for, but we'd like to shift the emphasis of those a bit. So that was the first RFA. The second RFA is a data analysis and coordination center for ENCODE. And we'd like to support a single centralized database to serve as a data coordination and analysis center. So this would be the data coordination involves housing and maintaining the databases to track and store and provide access to ENCODE data. We want to provide informatics resource to ensure consistent data analysis and to facilitate integrative analyses, and to work with ENCODE's analysis working group to identify the types of analyses needed to perform unnecessary data transformations. So what we're doing here is actually consolidating efforts. There was a data coordination center for ENCODE, data coordination center for MODENCODE, data analysis center for ENCODE and data analysis center for MODENCODE. So there's four activities that we're now proposing to condense into one, which we feel should result in operational efficiencies. And one of the things that has been important to us but we haven't really stressed enough is the analysis goal of trying to define what we're calling a minimum set of elements or marks that are needed to identify a unique molecular signature of the cell to optimize data generation by ENCODE, as well as other related projects. There's a lot of interest in disease studies in generating all this omics data. And we'd like to actually provide some guidance as to what are the most powerful data sets that can be generated, because we realize this will be very costly for all the different studies that are going to be undertaken. If there's any way we can help streamline that, we thought that we would like to try to do that through ENCODE analysis. And then the third RFA is computational analysis of ENCODE data. And this is sort of a new idea. We like to enhance data analysis activities beyond ENCODE participants. And this is something that we've heard from our advisors, various working groups that we really want to make sure this data gets out to the community and that people are using it. We'd like to bring additional people into looking at ENCODE data. So we wanted to support individual research projects to use ENCODE data for studies that combine ENCODE data with related functional genomics data to drive new biological insights, to use ENCODE data to improve on the analysis of disease mapping studies, and also develop new methods to improve on the analysis interpretation of ENCODE data. This slide outlines the mechanisms of support and proposed budgets for these three initiatives. The first one under the ENCODE production, we'd like to continue the U54 Cooperative Agreement Center mechanism. We're proposing somewhere between $15 and $25 million in total cost per year for four years. From this contrast to approximately $33 million that we're spending now in modern code and ENCODE, and we're anticipating, depending upon this level of funding, somewhere between six and eight awards. And we'd certainly like your input on this target number. The second RFA, the Data Analysis and Coordination Center, we'd like to support through the U41 Cooperative Agreement mechanism and putting in approximately $3.5 million total cost per year for four years. And we anticipate making one award. And lastly, the computational analysis of ENCODE data. This will be a U01 Cooperative Agreement mechanism. And we've set aside $3 million total cost for three years and anticipate six to 10 awards. Belia, that was it. Yes, so I forget those numbers. It's about $5 million now, I think. For a year, it's about 1.5 for the Data Coordinating Center, about 1.3 for the Data Analysis Center. That's for a year. That's for human, right, Peter? That's for human. Right. And about the same for mouse. Mouse is covered by the human. No, I'm sorry. Modern code is about the same. Modern code is about the same. That's total. So one question, certainly, is whether this is enough. I mean, we'd certainly like your input on that. Can I just ask how you envision the distribution of responsibility or activity between the data analysis and coordination center and the computational analysis of the encyclopedia? So there's an overlap between the charges for the second two groups. And I'm just curious how you're going to manage that overlap. I'll start, and then I'll let Peter correct me. So the RFA for these U01s is really meant to augment the analysis activities are going to be supported through the Data Analysis Center. The Data Analysis Center does a lot of activities that really organize the analyses, that organize the data. It helps working with the analysis working group to identify what analysis should be done. But I'm going to turn this over to Peter, and he could expand on that. I view the data analysis and coordination center as responsible for doing the work that's required to generate the encode product, being the derived data that the community will use, and an initial integrative analysis of this data to show that the power of what it's being used. And this is going to be run not necessarily by the Data Analysis and Coordination Center, but it will be part of the analysis working group. And it's the analysis working group, which represents all of the production centers and the DAC, the DACC, that will do these types of analysis. Whereas I view the third part, the other analysis centers, as not being as tied necessarily to being responsible for generating a product, but to do analysis of where you can take that and go further with it. Either by combining it with disease data sets or by just methods development, which may feed back into the analysis working group, but it may not. They're not as tied to this idea of generating a product of what we think that encode should be. Claire? I'm assuming that the $15 to $25 million that you have under the first initiative there is what you believe you need to complete this project and use complete a couple of times in your slides in quotations. And so it would be helpful, I think, if you could clarify what you mean when you say complete. And do you think that the technology has reached a point where it would be necessary to have this amount of money devoted for four years? Or is there the possibility that you could get to completion sometime before the end of four years and shift some of that money into the computational analysis? Because I see that as being a particularly exciting aspect of this whole concept clearance in that. And it just looks like if you're contemplating six to 10 awards, $3 million per year, that's not a whole lot of money. I think it's very hard to predict how close to completion we're going to be in four years from now. I think that we're certainly working towards that. But I think we're going to have to come up with a working definition of complete and know that we're not going to really get there. I think the big challenge for encode is probing enough different tissue types, really getting to single cell analysis, which is something we're pushing in the technology, RFA. But I think it really depends on the scope of what we end up funding. I think you can be as wide as you want to be with all of these different elements. And that's why we're hoping the analysis will drive down and give us this idea of what a minimum set might be. What are the most important elements to be probing? But I think that's something we're going to be working on, is trying to define a reasonable endpoint. Rex? So as I understand, you're trying to roll the human and model mod encode together. Could you just talk a little bit about how you imagine that to scale proportionally? And could you talk about whether there are any sort of cultural differences between the two communities that might make that more complicated? Yeah, so I think part of our nonspecificity of how we're going to do that right now depends on how much money we have. That will certainly determine how much we're able to fund in mod encode versus encode. Our feeling is that there's so much biology that the model organism communities can now do with the technologies and with the data that they have that's really reduced the amount that we're going to fund for these large consortium activities. We haven't put a specific number on it, but it's going to be a very small fraction compared to encode, which will be unpopular, I'm sure. And I would say that I think that we need to find those activities that are best done in a consortium and focus on those very high priority activities. And then, as Elise's point out, I think that the model organism communities, they actually want to do a lot of this in their own lab, because they want to do it on their strained background. And this data may help to some extent. But in the end, they'll become limited. And just to expand on that point, I think the types of data we're thinking about being very useful would be those that can increase the quality of the data set and also fill in gaps. Mike? So Elise, as following up on Howard's question, the total it sounds like is sort of a 40% cut for data analysis and coordinating center activity. And so I was curious, do you think that's going to come from the efficiencies of going from four down to one? Or are things sufficiently reduced to practice for the two projects that there's less to sort of develop in terms of approaches? Or where do you see that as coming from? Because this does run counter to some of the things we've been saying earlier on today in terms of more funds for analysis and computation. Great. We do worry that that might not be enough. And Peter, do you want to respond? So I think there will be some economies of scale, because if you think about what modern code and encodes support, they support somewhere on the order of 20 PIs. And they also support, I don't know how many co-PIs. And you talk to the DCCs, and they struggle. It's the slide I showed earlier on the data management talk. It's this submission process that is really time consuming and which is driving a lot of their costs. So by having only six to eight producers making sure these are large producers and not fragmented, I think we'll drive the number of submitters down. Shera Lee says, you, that we are concerned about this and we seek counsel's advice. Given that no matter how much effort is put in, this is still, in some ways, just scraping the surface. And you mentioned that the communities around model organisms are interested in taking this up. To what extent will there be an emphasis here on packaging the knowledge of how to do this in a way that makes the methods more accessible to these communities so that it can be taken up very efficiently? It seems to me the technologies themselves now are so scalable, it is feasible, as you mentioned, for smaller labs to do this. To what extent will the aim here be to enable that? Well, one of the activities that are ongoing now with encode and modern code working together to develop community standards for RNA-Seq, for ChIP-Seq, and really describing what our consortium's experiences have been in testing out different sequencing depths, peak collars, those types of things. And so that's a very important part of what we want to accomplish here. And I think certainly by this last RFA, by bringing in additional people using that, we think this will be one way of disseminating at least the analysis of the data. If you have any other suggestions of how we can make this data more useful to the community, we'd be very happy to hear that. Dave? Elise, you pointed out in your talk this morning how many GWAS hits hit into these areas. And that makes me wonder if you're going to be able to do cost sharing. Could you do cost sharing with disease, with other institutes that have their suite of diseases? In terms of doing normal tissues then or? Well, in terms of funding additional work that makes it clearer how all this regulation works. We certainly can have dialogues with other institutes for this. I mean, what we're hoping to do is actually to, as I said before, help those researchers figure out what the minimum set of data would be. And that should help cut down the costs in some respects for these disease studies. But we can certainly have dialogues. I know that Terry Minolia and other people have been talking with other institutes about possibilities for partnerships. We can explore that further. My guess is that we are not going to be able to get other institutes to contribute to the development of a fundamental resource. But that if there are projects that they want to initiate, disease-specific projects that they want to initiate, that use these approaches and want to apply these approaches in their particular situation, then we could either collaborate, maybe even cost share, but certainly help advise them. I'm doing that. Does anyone? All right. This is Dede here. Can I ask a question? Go ahead, Dede. Can you hear me? Yeah, go ahead. OK. I didn't know if it was a good time or not. The video is lagging behind. So when we discussed this in February, Initiative 1 was about technology development and seemed to include the opportunity to have technology development and innovation. Although it did say one possibility under consideration is that there would be to do the completion of the ENCODE with limitations of current technology. And it seems that that's what has been implemented here in this concept clearance in the first one listed. And I'll state it at the beginning to do it within the limitations of current technology. So will you entertain innovative new technology development projects in this, or they will be excluded? There's going to be a separate initiative for technology that we discussed in February, Council. But the grantees for that will certainly be encouraged to work with the grantees under ENCODE. I see. OK. So I realize, yeah, that's a different world. OK. I just wanted to make sure about that. Thank you. OK. Now we're in the dark. Dave? The other point I'd like to make is I just think it's a great idea to push the mouse in this, as it sounds like you are going to do. Because you can just do a lot more perturbations in the mouse than you can. And it's in vivo rather than in some cultured cell. So I think it's great. Does anyone have any other comments about the budget level for the first RFA? Do you have ideas about how you want to distribute that between human and mind? I think we're going to really have to see what applications we get in. But as I mentioned earlier this morning, the primary emphasis will be on human with a secondary emphasis on mouse. Howard? Please don't take the silence as we're happy with that amount of money. It's just that we listened when Eric talked this morning.  But I think if there is a general opinion that this is a modest amount of money for what's been outlined, then that's worth having on the record whether we can implement it or not. Like a modest amount of money for what's been proposed. But then you can ask the same question about the second RFA. So we've alluded to the fact that there may not be enough. Would the recommendation of council be that this be increased? I am worried about you're putting four groups, I mean, in principle, four groups together. You said maybe the model part of it's going to get sort of de-emphasized. So maybe that's OK. And if you try to think of this as a bucket of money and you're just moving things around, it does worry me that you're putting a lot of emphasis for the success of this project on one group. And you need to make sure they have the resources, especially as you think about the problem that you alluded to earlier in your first presentation about data coming in. There's still a lot of connections that are going to need to be made, presumably. And especially since this has been handled by four groups in the past, there's going to be the fundamental problem of how do you bring those four groups into alignment. Ross? So along those lines, we were talking earlier about trying to get other institutes to buy in. And we've all recognized that individual labs can do the kind of work that's outlined there in the first part. And many, many are. To be really useful, all those data need to be available. And it's better if they're in the same place. It's really better if they've been subjected to common standards and quality controls and all of that. Now, was there the thought, or at least it seems to me, in an ideal world, the data analysis and coordinating center could handle not only the in-code stuff, but the in-code relevant things from other investigators. And if that were to be part of the idea, you'd definitely need to dial up that money big time. One more comment? Well, I think you mentioned it. Just to follow up on that, in your earlier presentation, there was three presentations from in-code and 20 from non-in-code at one of the representative meetings you put up there. And so it sounds like there is a lot of potential for a lot of data to be generated out of R01s, out of foundation money, out of whatever other source. And so if that becomes one of the goals, which I think it is a good one to have, then that will have to be dialed up appropriately. I think having one place, certainly we've seen in other networks where one place allows you to allow them to say no a little bit easier. And so certain types of data just don't go in the database anymore, because if mom says no and you go to dad, if there's two, you know, whereas in this case, there's only one parent. But I think you also do need to be able to accommodate all the other aunts and uncles or cousins or whatever you want to, and how much you want to make. So is it fair to summarize this discussion by saying that as we move along in developing this and as we, the resources that might be available come into clearer focus, if we ended up with deciding to put more money into the production RFA or more money into the DACC or a different proportion of the two that we've outlined here, council would not be field betrayed. I'm not sure I understand what you said, but let me try this. So I think what I heard was maybe if you needed to move some from production into the coordinating center in order to get an appropriately meaty activity there, I think council, my sense was that council would be behind that. I'm not sure council would be behind going the other direction. No, but also if more funds were to become available so that we could or we decided to put a larger proportion of extramural funds into this activity, increasing both, within reason council wouldn't, there was the opinion that maybe 15 to 25 million for the production RFA might not be enough. So I heard the indication of certain amount of flexibility there too. And in parallel is there some plan for maybe not an RFA, but an RFP kind of thing to bring in more R01 requests for some of the smaller groups to participate? Is that part of the, could that be potentially part of? Well, I think that's what the third. That's a more focused on analysis. So we've always opened. You're talking into production? Yeah. We've always opened in code up, but it's, there's a question of what's the benefit to the small users to join and to provide their data. So that's the challenge. I guess what I'm saying, I guess what I'm saying Rex is that it's always difficult to make good recommendations about funding levels when you're talking about programs in isolation. So that ultimately we're gonna have to do this in terms of the overall program and addressing all priorities, but I just didn't hear strong feeling that we should necessarily be constrained precisely by the numbers we gave here. Mark, can I just say that it would be helpful for me and I think a few of us to see some of these numbers in the context of the extramural program in general and if you're complicating shifting numbers to know a little bit more about how that affects maybe our ones, et cetera. Right, we've sort of periodically presented that kind of analysis to council. We haven't done it probably in two years maybe. So we should do that. Right, I just want to say that I mentioned that this, even the $25 million is a considerable decrease from what's currently invested in code and monocoque production. Ross, do you want to say something? Well, back to the fact that many institutes in their extramural program are funding research along these lines and we see the papers coming out and we'd love to have the data as easily available and actually subjected to quality standards as was going on in in code. And I know that these concept clearances didn't really get into it, but I just as we were talking about what that could be doing, we do, it would be very beneficial to the community to have a repository for the data being generated from many other investigators. And I was really expanding the umbrella. And it actually harkens back to a lot of discussions we were having earlier today about the data handling, data storage and so forth. And this is, if it is, if this initiative could, oh yeah, maybe we'll get to another one of my concerns, but we've used the term completeness more than once. And I think this next project will get, I don't want to talk about it until he's gone through this, but everyone would love to have completeness. And if you have more data coming in from a wider community, you're much more likely to approach something that might be considered complete or at least useful. So I would really love to see support for bringing in the data, making it easier for people to submit their data. Oh Peter, you were saying, why would anybody want to join the ENCODE consortium if they aren't funded by it? And that's true, but if we made it easy for people who are generating these data to get the data in and people use it, we are judged also by how well our data are used. I think it would be a real positive. At any rate, that more information you can get into one place, the better your analyses can be, the more complete that the integrative analyses will be. So it's a long-winded way of saying I would really like to see that second initiative expanded and with plenty of support for it. Going back to my earlier talk, what you're basically saying is you want this ENCODE DACC to be a data broker for all functional genomics. Related to ENCODE. I would check it a bit, that concise, thank you. But I guess now I'm slightly confused because you also showed in your talk, you emphasized the fact that the operational cost of interacting with large numbers of groups could make a lot of these things. As a data broker, you would have to. Very expensive, and yet the reason we were trying to do it this way was to reduce the number of production groups to reduce the cost of intaking all that data.  I mean, you would have to give them more money, but also, since they're dealing with the same type of data, they, the data broker would be easier than just saying, it's my first response to Ross is, isn't that what GEO is for? But you're right, you do need a certain amount of data brokering to make sure the data is in the right format. The quality values are clearly indicated, et cetera. The added complication is all those other R01 projects are not under the same data release standards as the ENCODE projects are. But even if they, even if the data are not put into the repository until they're published, it's still a good thing to have the data in the repositories. Yeah, I mean, I think Peter said it, isn't that what GEO is for? So then the decision as well is GEO, are the requirements for putting your data in GEO sufficient in terms of metadata and other things, would this be a better way to distribute the data? That's a whole nother discussion, but I think you're right that what you're talking about is son of GEO or child of GEO or GEO part de or something. And that's not a bad thing, but we all know what the quality of some of the data is like in GEO and that's not what you'd wanna replicate. Oh yeah, so to follow up on Ross's point, I think that if you were to go down that path, I would suggest you really couldn't do it in a very, in a reasonable way without allocating some of that production money to the controls, the standards and so on so that other data producers know what to do and know that their data are of sufficient quality to be submitted and accepted. Otherwise the DAC part of the job will scale out of control. It's better to publish standards for people to be able to validate against those standards and it's not just published standards, it's the appropriate controls that they can get and test and then know that their data are going to be of sufficient quality and in the right format that they can be accepted and appropriately annotated so that it doesn't create a lot of extra work for everyone. Are there any other comments about this concept proposal? And if not, I need a motion to approve the concept? Let's ask, what are we approving? You're approving this as a concept so that NHGRI can then go ahead develop funding, develop grant application solicitations and publish them and receive applications. So if this vote will be approval for NHGRI to go ahead, proceed to issue this as a program. With the current budget as it was described or with modifications that we discussed in council? With the budget that was discussed as a guideline as a fairly strong guideline but contingent upon what the actual, the institute's actual financial situation is when the awards are made. But what about some of the other kinds of modifications which were not necessarily budget modifications? I mean, there's the concept in principle and then there's where the rubber meets the road and the last five minutes or so of discussion were slightly of a modification nature I thought. I'm just trying to understand which is I think what Jeff was trying to do. I think as we develop these, we take your advice into consideration and we have a reality check of the budget numbers or the reality of what other activities are going on at the institute and in other institutes and we factor all of those things in as we develop these initiatives. We can't go too far in telling you what specifically is gonna be in the solicitation because that will potentially disqualify any of you who are interested in applying. So this has been a public discussion. It's the concept. We've heard the issues that you've raised. We will take those into account in writing the specific solicitation. I don't think you'll be particularly surprised by it when it comes out, but it may be better because of this discussion. I'll move approval. That's a great pace initiative. I'll go second to motion. Is there any further discussion? All in favor of approving the concept? Anybody opposed? Dee Dee, do you want to weigh in? Yes, I approve. Thank you.