Thank you very much and welcome to everybody. I'm pleased to introduce this session. We will have several speakers, and I will introduce each of the speakers very shortly. The first one will be my co-chair of the conference, Sharon Lewin. Sharon, as you know, is Director of the Infectious Disease Unit at the Alfred Hospital, and she is Professor of Medicine also at the University. I have the pleasure indeed to co-chair not only the conference with Sharon, but we are also co-chairing a symposium on HIV cure together with Steve Deeks, and myself together with the help of Sharon are also now co-chairing the IAS towards an HIV cure initiative. So the second speaker after Sharon will be Deborah Purso. Deborah Purso is very much involved in the work on the so-called Mississippi baby, who is not a baby anymore. By the way, Deborah will tell us about the latest news regarding the Mississippi baby. The next speaker will be Dan Baruch. Dan is Professor of Medicine at Harvard Medical School, and Dan is working on a new vaccine approach, in particular using a broadly neutralizing antibodies and he will tell us about the last latest data regarding the use of broadly neutralizing antibody in cure. The next speaker will be Ole Sogaard, working at Harris University in the Department of Infectious Disease of the University. Ole will present the latest data that we have using a drug, a medicine, a drug which is able to reactivate the latently infected cells. The next speaker will be Nicolas Chamon. Nicolas is currently working at the Vaccine and Gene Therapy Institute in Florida. Nicolas will present work that has been presented yesterday at the Cure Symposium regarding new assets to quantify and to measure the reservoir. Steve Deeks at the end will tell us about his own vision of the future of Cure. So please, Sharon, first. Thank you, Francoise. So I thought I'd set the scene of where Cure Research has come to, especially given what we've found in the last year, and this builds on a workshop that Francoise mentioned of over 250 participants we had over the weekend here in Melbourne, meaning that we really have the best and brightest Cure Researchers all with us at the moment. And I think there are some big issues that we've learned about. And the first is that we probably are looking at the moment trying to achieve long-term remission when we talk about Cure, meaning time off antiretroviral therapy. How long can we go? And we've realised in the last year that the virus can really hang around for quite some time and then pop up at an unexpected moment in time. It is exactly what we found with the Mississippi baby. What we've learnt from that is that we need much better tools to measure virus while people are on treatment and once they stop treatment. And we need much better assays to really know where that virus is hiding. And that builds that. Nicola Chamour will talk a bit about that. I think the most recent cases of the Mississippi baby and also the Boston patients who also rebounded after stopping treatment, admittedly rebounded late after stopping treatment, also tells us that what we need to do here is not just tackle the virus that persists on treatment but also that we need a good immune response there ready to tackle any virus that emerges. And I think Dan Baruch's work shows us clearly that will help us solve some of those puzzles. Finally, although we know that early treatment most likely significantly reduces the amount of virus that persists in patients on antiretroviral therapy. Most people get treated during chronic established infection and we still need to understand how to eliminate those long lived reservoirs of virus. And at the moment we've talked largely about kick and kill strategies but we probably need to develop other approaches to those long lived reservoirs. And finally, you know, 80% of people living with HIV of course live in low income countries. There's a lot of effort now to try and engage low income countries in the search for a cure as well as greater engagement of the pharmaceutical industry which although some companies have been actively involved in this area, this should be extended and there are efforts towards that with discussions around perhaps developing a public-private partnership. So with that sort of background I'll hand back to François. Thanks, Sean. So as I said, now Debbie will say a few words about the last latest development regarding the Mississippi entrance. Thank you, François. So I'm here with Dr. Hannah Gay from the University of Mississippi Medical Center. She's sitting in the front row and in the past three weeks we've identified that the Mississippi child now has rebound varemia. This rebounding of virus was detected during a routine clinical monitoring visit where viral loads in CD4 T-cell counts were done.  On antutrile treatment the viral load has dropped and her CD4 counts have increased from 28% back to 42%.  So what we've learned from this, I think first is and foremost is this child was indeed HIV infected. The effects we saw were really the effects of treatment, not prophylaxis, as has been discussed earlier. The second is we've learned that HIV can establish latency very early. This child is treated at 30 hours of age and that this latent infection can persist for years. The child is almost four years of age and can persist in a quiescent state in the absence of any HIV-specific immune responses. Dr. Luzyaga followed this child immunologically for two years and we have not detected any HIV-specific immune responses. The ultra-sensitive test looking for traces of RNA did not detect any RNA before rebound veremia. So with rebound veremia, the child has seroconverted and is now HIV seropositive and has control of veremia, is on antradural treatment and doing well and will be followed by her pediatrician. So we think we've learned a lot from this case and it does provide us a strong rationale to move forward with the clinical trials to look towards using very early therapy to achieve virologic remission in perinatal HIV infection. Thanks, so Debbie. Dan, please tell us about your work on the vaccine candidate and vaccine also as an approach for cure. Sure, thank you. I'll first discuss a preclinical animal study that has a remarkable parallel to the recent events of the Mississippi baby that Debbie just described, showing that in an animal model, the vial reservoir is also established very early, remarkably early, much earlier than anyone had anticipated before. This manuscript is published today in the journal Nature. In this study in Monkeys, we showed that early antiretroviral therapy, even very early antiretroviral therapy, is not early enough and was insufficient for curing the vial reservoir. It appears that the reservoir is established even prior to the first evidence of plasma viremia, suggesting that if these data are translatable to humans, then as soon as one is able to diagnose a patient with HIV infection, even with the lowest levels of plasma virus, then the reservoir has already been established, a reservoir that is also refractory to antiretroviral therapy. Clearly early antiretroviral therapy has benefits and reduces the vial reservoir, but in the study that we have published today, it was unable to eradicate the reservoir. The implications are that strategies, in addition to early antiretroviral therapy, might be needed for vial eradication and cure. Such strategies include monoclonal antibodies, therapeutic vaccines, as well as direct reservoir activators. And many groups, including ours, are working on all three of those strategies. I think I'll stop there and head over. Thanks, then. Ole, can you tell us about what is an embargo today? Sure. So, as Stan was saying, one of the strategies to maybe try to reduce the reservoir and potentially eliminate the reservoir in chronically infected patients is to use this kick-and-kill approach where you attempt to kick the latent infected cells. So the cells that have archived HIV within their own DNA to kick these cells out of their resting stage and expose the virus on the surface of these cells so they can be killed and eliminated by the immune system. So this kick-and-kill approach, we tried to test in six patients at Orhus University Hospital. We used an H2H, which is a group of anti-cancer drugs. The H2H that we used is called bromidepsin. Bromidepsin has been shown in cell cultures and in cells taken out of patients to be able to activate these latent infected cells. So that was our rationale for moving into a small clinical trial. In this trial, we included six patients, five males, one female. They were all well-suppressed on individual treatment for a duration of, a median duration of nine and a half years. What we saw, we infused bromidepsin three times over the time course of 14 days. What we saw was a significant release of viral particles from latent infected cells into the plasma of these six patients despite their own antiretroviral treatment. So these viral particles were easily detectable with standard clinical assays. So we could detect the viral particles with the same assays that we used to monitor treatment as runs in patients and also an assay that is used by blood banks to screen for HIV in the donor blood. Next, we went on to see if we could at least find a significant reduction in the size of the reservoir in these six patients and from our preliminary analysis, it doesn't look like there's a significant reduction in the size of the reservoir in these six patients. So what this tells us is that we can activate cells, we can induce the release of viral particles into the blood of the patients, but this may not be enough to actually make a difference on the size of the reservoir. So the next step would be to use strategies like H-Dangan heapsis and combine them with interventions that are targeted towards the immune system. So this could be an HIV vaccine and we actually have that study just starting last month, but it could also be other immune interventions that attempts to enhance the immune system's ability to kill these reactivated, latently infected cells. Yeah, I think those. Thank you. Nicolas has been involved since now many years in trying to identify the cells that plays a role of reservoir and now is trying to find new assets to quantify and measure the reservoir, which is critical for the future. Yeah, thank you, François. As you just said, it is actually a scientific priority of the International AIDS Society to develop novel assets to measure the size of the reservoir and it is important because we want to find ways to monitor the efficacy of eradication strategies and right now the assets that we have are pretty expensive, they require a lot of blood and we're not exactly sure what they measure. So we spent a lot of time during the past few years trying to develop novel assets that could be used in those eradication trials and we came up with this new strategy that we called TILDA, T-I-L-D-A, which is a novel asset that requires only 10 milliliters of blood that is relatively inexpensive that can be run in two days and more importantly, that can be implemented pretty much in any lab in the world because you need very basic instrumentation to use this asset. So using this asset, we've been able to confirm the benefit of early antietroval therapy early in infection. So basically we found that the size of the reservoir was much more restricted in people who start out very early on. Of course the next step for us is to use this asset in clinical trials and again to monitor the efficacy. So the value of this HIV cure symposium was to put all of us in the same room and basically I talked with Oli earlier and definitely we will use some of the samples of this clinical trial and run them in the novel asset that we have developed and eventually of course what we want to do is to make this asset available to the scientific community. Thanks, Nicolas, to hand. Steve, your vision. Yes, I've been asked to talk about sort of the future and just make a few quick comments. I think it's quite clear right now that the international community is fully engaged in cure research. The funders are engaged, the foundations are engaged, the communities are engaged, most of the academic groups are engaged. This meaning that we just had was supposed to be for a couple hundred people but we had a very long waiting list so there's a tremendous amount of interest. I will say that though in the future in terms of potential barriers to success the one major group not yet fully engages industry. We're not going to cure anyone unless we develop new drugs and that's what industry does and so there's a lot of efforts by the barriers that are preventing industry from getting engaged and we think we know what they are and we think we might know how to overcome them. Scientifically, I think there are three big issues that we need to tackle. First, where does the virus live? Debbie's case, the Mississippi baby, suggests that a single virus can live in a single cell living in some reservoir, somewhere in the body and that's all it needs for the virus to take off. So we need to figure out exactly which cell the virus is in and where it resides. That's the first thing. Second thing, as Nicola just mentioned we need to be able to measure the virus better. There are probably dozens of cases around the world now in which people have no detectable virus absolutely no detectable virus on therapy and they may not be cured. We need better ways to measure this. And finally, of course most importantly we need to begin to translate pilot studies into real clinical studies to see if we can actually really advance the cure agenda. And I think this meeting is going to be remembered for two things. Number one Olay's data is the first clear evidence at least to me that we can truly identify the latent reservoir, the hidden virus and shock it out of its hiding place and that is absolutely critical. I don't think anyone has shown that before to the same degree that Olay has shown in his study and so I think actually that is the single most important advance of this meeting and it's going to have a huge impact on the future. That's shock. That's getting the virus out of its hiding place. But once it comes out of its hiding place we have to kill it. And I would say actually Dan's data that he presented on these novel antibodies that can potentially do that is also going to have a huge impact on the future. So that's my vision. I think we need to get industry engaged. We need to find out where the virus lives. We need to know how to measure it and we need to begin to do bigger and better studies in terms of shock and kill. Thanks. So now the floor is open for question. Please introduce yourself, give your name and introduce yourself. Julia Medjou from Fairfax Media the age and the Sydney Morning Herald. You mentioned the barriers, knowing the barriers to industry involvement. Can you explain what you think they are? Well, for a company to figure out whether one of their molecules or drugs might actually contribute to a cure we need to be able to do these small studies in which we give the drug to people and show that it does something. So ultimately we need a biomarker. We need a way to quantify the size of the reservoir. We need to be able to go into a person and figure out how much virus is there so that we can give these drugs in 10, 20 people to see if we can reduce it. We don't have that assay yet. So that's the first thing and there's a tremendous amount of effort going on to identify that tool. The second thing is actually a bit more problematic is how are we going to define a cure and how are the regulators, the people who actually approve drugs are going to define a cure. And I think industry needs to know that. They need to know exactly how it is that they're going to get an intervention that is approved and can be commercialized so they can sell it. And right now the field does not have a definition of how we're going to do that and that's a major challenge. Pam Harrison, Medscape over here. Thank you. Dr. Sogorn, Pam Harrison, Medscape. You didn't see a reduction in the size of the reservoir. Was that possible because you weren't using a potent enough antiretroviral therapy to mop up the release of the viral particles that you did activate? That's a good question. So I think for an effective reactivating strategy to be successful, you need some immune cells that are able to recognize the cells that you expose and to kill them. I think this is the major barrier to actually reducing the reservoir when you have a potent reactivating agent. So I think Roman Dabson in this trial was quite convincing in reversing latency at least in some of the cells, but we don't know if we reversed latency in 1% of cells or in 50% of cells. So there's still a lot of work to be done to know how much you can actually, how much reactivation you can induce, but at least this is a step forward in the sense that you can measure it with standard assays and commonly used assays all over the world. Hi, it's Sophie Scott from ABC. Just another question for Ola. So how significant is your research that you're presenting in terms of moving towards an HIV cure? So I'd rather let someone else comment on that. So I think it's significant in the sense that it's something that now can be investigated in settings that don't have that advanced laboratory assay set up so you can use standard assays.  So it's a step in the right direction, but I think it's just a step. Can I just follow up? I'll just follow up there. I mean, I think the significance of it is that we have always thought once the virus gets inside a cell and goes to sleep, it's stuck there forever. And what Ola's, the first studies of these drugs showed you could wake it up, but you only found a bit more virus inside the cell. And Ola's study has gone that step further to show you can wake it up and make enough virus to leave the cell. And that's quite significant because that means that the cell will probably now be visible to an immune response. So it's the first step to get rid of these long-lived sleeping forms of virus with a drug that's more potent than other drugs we've used already to wake up the virus. And that's actually a big step, but it's not a cure, but it's the first step to make that cell now visible to the immune system or another intervention. Other question? Hello, Elizabeth Finkel from Cosmos Magazine. So I have two questions. The first is just a very naive one. Is it possible with what... Who reported the paper in Science that came out today? Dan. Dan, because of what you've seen in your animal studies, very early infection, and also the Mississippi baby, is it possible the fetuses are being infected in utero? So we know from studies looking at mother-to-child transmission and drugs to block mother-to-child transmission that indeed babies get infected in utero, what's considered in utero infection. That's a small proportion of infants who get infected. So we do have evidence that babies get infected in utero. And in fact, for the Mississippi child, in pediatrics the way we stratify children, whether they're infected in utero or not, is based on whether they have detectable virus nucleic acid present in the bloodstream in the first 48 hours of life. So using that definition, this child would have been considered as being infected before birth. Now, how early before birth the child is infected, we don't have a marker to tell us that. And so it is encouraging that if indeed that stratification is correct that even in a child who's infected in utero, very early treatment, and here early treatment is 30 hours of age, we still have a wide wind of opportunity there because kids can intervene as early as half an hour, hour of life in terms of this treatment strategy. So again, I want to emphasize that while we're very disappointed for this child that she requires antiretroviral treatment now to control her virus, this is really unprecedented for the field and a major step forward, that a minimal antiretroviral treatment regimen, three-drug regimen started at 30 hours of life for 18 months, can allow a child to go up treatment for 27 months. So am I right in thinking that most infants are not infected in utero? Yes, you're right. So they would be the category that might still benefit from this early intervention? So we're hoping both categories will benefit from this intervention. And one reason is that the neonatal immune system is developing and it's tolerogenic. So these memory T cells may not form as readily in a developing immune system. And my second question is, picking up a little bit of a paradox because on one hand one of the speakers mentioned, I think it was you that it was possibly just a single virus in a single cell that was enough to reactivate the infection. Given that's the case, why do we even care how much you hit down the reservoir? If you haven't hit it down to zero, it's not going to make any difference. That's actually a great question. You know, I think that the Mississippi case and other cases in the past year or so make me wonder if we will ever get rid of the entire reservoir. So we actually may end up in a situation where we get rid of a big chunk of it and have a little bit left, but we're going to need a way to control that little bit that's left. And there are a number of ways it can do that, right? Therapeutic vaccines, antibiotics and so forth. So the field has sort of in the past been split between those who just want to get rid of everything versus those who don't particularly want to get rid of everything, they just want to control it. And I actually think at the end of the day we're going to need both. The immune system really can't control the amount of virus that people have now. We know that. Most people basically do not do well. But hopefully if we can get rid of 99% of it and boost the immune system, just a little bit of immune power is all you're going to need to control what's left. And that's where the field is going. And that's going to require combination approaches, which is actually complicated to do and partly why industry is not really engaging to the degree they can. Okay, we have another question. Yes. You were the first, maybe? I don't know. I don't know. I'll go. My name is Mark DiStefano from BuzzFeed. I want to know about the relationships between vaccines and the cure and whether the attention, whether it's economic or industry has shifted away from finding a cure to developing really powerful vaccines, especially when it comes to things like the Mississippi baby, I guess, letting down a lot of people's hopes for a cure. Maybe Francois, do you feel as though a lot of the attention at the moment is on vaccines and not the cure? No, I don't think so. I think we need both anyway. We should not oppose vaccine research and cure research. And they are very much complementary. As Steve just said, we will need to combine different approaches and we probably need to strengthen the response of the host by immune-based therapy or vaccine therapy. So that's clear for me that both should be continuing parallel. And by the way, certainly as part of this is something that we will discuss this week, but as part of the IAS HIV vaccine initiative, we will strengthen the relationship between cure research and vaccine research. And Dan, maybe you can say a few words as well on that. Sure. So I'll just reiterate what Steve and Francois have said that in my view there is no tension at all between them because they are complementary. In fact, vaccine research will likely be part of interventions that are being explored for cure. So in fact, they are two sides of the same coin. They are both needed. And I don't see any tension between them. Hi, Jessi Eil from Bloomberg News. So we have heard the news about the Mississippi baby and Ole's research. I'm wondering if from that you could let us know a temperature check in terms of your optimism for a cure. Are you febrile or hypothermic, right? Are you asking me? Everyone. So I'm very optimistic for remission for pediatric patients because, again, I will say this again, it's that 27 months off antidepressant treatment with a strategy that's not the best that we can have to achieve this outcome is spectacular in my mind and really is the catalyst, I think, for us to move forward. I mean, it is a look. Of course, I have to speak about the discontinuation but nobody is speaking about the discontinuation. But you know, some of them, we have 20 patients today that stopped the treatment. It's 10 years ago for some of them that they stopped the treatment and they are still controlling their virus. So it's no reason not to continue and to be optimistic for the future. I think one other key point about the Mississippi baby, he says the 27 months off treatment with the viral under control is unprecedented. And secondly, the Mississippi baby and also the Boston patients had no immunity to HIV. So they had the extreme of very, very small amounts of virus but absolutely no immune response. The baby because the baby was treated very early, the Boston patients because they had received a transplant. So I think that's a key factor about what may have had a play in the remission and the fact that the virus came back. You know, I got a lot of people who asked me about the Mississippi case and whether it was disappointed and whether it's going to affect my enthusiasm. And obviously it's a tragic situation for the baby and the child but I'm hoping, I'm sure the child will get the best care possible and hopefully one day she will know how important she was in the history of HIV in terms of cure research. But as a scientist, these failures are actually often far more instructive than successes. And with regard to this particular case, again, it confirms what we all assumed but didn't really know that it just takes one cell that can live for years to start the whole process over. So we really now know what we need to go after. And secondly, at least for me, it has really sort of focused my research on the need for long-term surveillance that we may never be able to get rid of all the virus but we're going to have to build up the immune system in some way to control a little bit of virus. So I actually perceive the Mississippi case scientifically as a great success and I'm hopeful that the child herself will get the best care possible and will do well. Sophie? Sophie, we're here from Selection, from France. I understand yesterday in your talk, Françoise, that in the Selection satellite that the mother of the Mississippi babies may be a long-time non-progressor or kind of. May that be a part of the reason what we observed with the baby? Thank you for asking the question because it was one question that I wanted myself to ask to Debbie. Because my understanding when the case was presented is that the mother has a very low viral load and I was wondering whether the mother has a strong immune response and during the first months of birth, the baby of course may have the immunity of the mother and may have play a role in controlling the infection as well. So I'll say we've been unable to study the immune response in the mother for reasons that we can't explain at this time. But to the best of our knowledge, we've done HLA typing on the child looking for protective alleles and have not identified that. I think the main part here, and there may be unknown factors, immune factors that confer this sort of control in terms of post varemic rebound. But I will say in the period of sustained remission, the 27 months, there was no detectable HIV specific immune response. So antibody responses are cellular immune responses. So this is a case of virologic control in the absence of an immune response which is not consistent with what we know about long-term non-progressors or elite controllers. Their outcome is based on an immune response. So there was absolutely no immune response and there was no immune response because there was no virus expression in this child. So that's the best that we can answer the case at this point. So perhaps down the line we'll be able to do additional studies on maternal samples, sort of sequencing which we needed to do to confirm reemergence of infection in this child rather than reinfection from a different source. We've not been able to conduct extensive immunologic studies on the mother. Hi, my name is Tabile from South Africa. You will know the situation in my country with so many people infected and affected by HIV and AIDS. There's only just one question from the community. They just want to know when, when are the scientists finding a cure for HIV? How close or how far are we? I know it may be a bit basic but most of our people are the illiterate and the poor. They just want to know, is it possible? Is it coming any time soon? Are you able to give us a response to that? I will let the others to give their opinion but when generally people are asking me this question I say no, I will not answer. I don't know. I don't know how long it will take to get a cure or to get a treatment inducing a remission. We cannot really answer that. I personally think that we should not give any dates. We should not make what has been done for vaccines in the past to say that we will have a vaccine in... I remember in 1984 Margaret Eichler said we will have a vaccine in two years. Look, we are now 30 years after that we still do not have a vaccine. So I don't think we should give any hope today. What we know is that we should move on because there is plenty of scientific evidence, plenty of data that are telling us that we can make progress and how many years we need to get a new therapeutic strategy we don't know. Any other... You want to give your... I would say that a cure which is actually applicable to everybody around the world, many very smart people don't think it's possible or will ever be possible. And my personal opinion is that if it is possible and we can do it, it's going to take many, many years. Fred Scheich, I far out Portland, Oregon. Kind of segueing from that and you mentioned earlier about the combinations of vaccine and cure research, whatever that might be, and compounds. How do you see that rolling out? Do you feel like there's the possibility of working with two compounds, one from vaccines and other from other forms of cancer type drugs that you're working with? How do you see that rolling out? Can you do the studies with two things? Because it seems to me like that would be the magic is when you start to combine that you get the real improvement or possibilities. All I might want to answer that because that's what they're doing. I can give you a quick answer. I can say that we have such a study ongoing now and just combining this compound that I mentioned, Romadepsin, together with a therapeutic HIV vaccine that has been tested in more than 100 HIV patients already. So we have that study ongoing. We just started involving patients. So it'll be a while before we have any results, but at least it's the first combination trial. So yes. And just to follow up with maybe a triple combination or are you thinking about that? I think we're thinking about a lot of things, but we need to take one step at a time. So, and this is already a pretty big step just to combine two different compounds. Karen O'Sullivan from Channel 7 News here in Melbourne. Holly, just wondering if you can give us any more detail about your trials. Just the nuts and bolts of how long it went for. You said there were people involved, where they were from. If you can expand any further on the trial itself? Sure. So, as I said, six patients were enrolled and they were all Caucasian patients all from our own outpatient clinic at Oxford University Hospital. All were on effective antiretrial treatment. The trial was initiated in early April this year and we just, we still have just done the last follow-up. This is just literally before we came here. So, we are still in the process of analyzing the data, but the data that I'm presenting tomorrow is what we have so far. And I think that's enough at least to say that the agent was successful in doing the job that they were supposed to and that is to kick bars out of the cells. I'm afraid we have to stop. If you'd like to ask a specific question to a participant, that is possible but outside of the room because they are waiting for the room that will be used for the press conference. I just would like to thank all the participants to this press conference. I'd like also to remind you what has been told to you at the beginning, all the data are under embargo until tomorrow 2.30. Please respect the embargo. Thank you very much.


We've seen kerfuffles over traditional versus social ways to consume news. First things first, a progress at the speed of government. If the United States government wanted to intervene and help save some of these journalistic institutions from the parasitic elements of Facebook, then they would have come in and tried to regulate against the idea of Facebook controlling these groups that they had a lot of these journalistic platforms migrate on and then made incredibly restrictive unless you entered into a pay to play model with Facebook. What I am mostly fascinated by is what happens to these newsrooms and to these television stations as we go forward because you could sell me on a wide variety of possible outcomes that will happen in 10 years. Either that television stations will be radically different or they will be pretty much what they are now. The one thing that I would bank on is free and over the air is something that will remain a very potent and powerful technology even in an era of ubiquitous internet.


where does that go exactly well we have a contingency plan but you know not going to strategically share that you try to be try to have a plan so you're not unprepared yeah I mean there's a lot of different ways you know it's unfortunate obviously I say I can't say enough good things about him as a pro as a teammate really enjoyed you know one of the guys when I got here he's been really it bought in just having a good year it's unfortunate that's the kind of the crappy part about this his game and we all know the risk but it's still very unfortunate and so yeah so he won't be be around the rest of season now there's guys got stuff but there's a lot of ways to attack it not necessarily every time you got to go one-for-one when you have injuries when you've had to deal with them in the past whichever team does there's a lot of ways to do it we can have multiple guys step up there play different roles you may end up naturally evolving in something else and it could be a really good thing for you that's happened to me in the past certain positions when you've had injuries at tight ends guys roll grow and then you find out they actually can do more and you may kind of evolve into something else so we we feel good about the guys we got here and like I said they're gonna kick that ball off at 9 30 a.m. Eastern breakfast at Tottenham and we'll be ready to roll you know every's done a good job he's a guy that's gotten here he's a good football player certainly like all of us you know there's play calls I want back there certain plays I'm sure he wants back but he's a rookie he's very very smart they've got a lot of football instincts and he stepped up you know we stepped up the end of the Giants game when they had cramps and then he obviously stepped up last week and I can say there's room for improvement for all of us but we got confidence in him or wherever whatever way other direction we decided to go sure all options on the table he led every option is on the table and we feel pretty good about the plan and obviously we got to go out there and implement it and see what it looks like in practice sure yeah you know you have a vision you know when you at the thing I think you got to come into these jobs with it you like I said you got to be objective you're going to get a lot of information for a lot of people maybe not intentionally but there's a lot of different motives when people you got to filter all down and then you got to make your own judgment and you really don't know until you actually get to work with somebody and you know I always say this about coaches players you may know people friends in the business or you know you've heard anything about players but until you go through a season you don't really know about somebody that's when you really find out about people players and coaches but say he's one of those guys you found out who he is and he's an ultimate problem yeah it's definitely possible like I said we still got some time with those guys both those guys will practice all week both those guys will travel with us you know we can make a decision you know at any time but yeah that those options are on the table it just depends you know he's played it before different scheme you know obviously with Kendall yeah he'll go out there and practice and hopefully find a role for us yeah you know both teams I think what you're seeing as standard now most teams usually have been flying over through the night on Thursday both teams are gonna do it here in this instance us and the Jets you know in the past some people have treated it like a bull week they've gone over maybe Sunday night from the previous game or Monday and they've been there all week you know there's pretty good science behind it that's what most teams I think have done this overnight get there Friday you know like I was telling Bassidy you know half these games have been 14 plus you know point differential so there's been 28 games 13 of them have been decided by 14 or more for various reasons you can't put say hey well in a day is both teams are handled the same handled or handed the same circumstances we got to adapt we're excited about going over there I think it's a hell of an opportunity when you can showcase the NFL and the game in a market like this I'm excited as hell the teams excited it's a challenge it's a big game for us you know we need to go over there and play well when sure hey talked to a lot of people you know I was a part of the staff that we did this we played at Wembley we played the charges over there in 18 I used a pretty similar schedule you know you talked to people obviously Jacksonville has been over there more than anybody you have people that I know that been on those staffs you reach out to them no different than the Jets I mean they got people that were in Jacksonville too so and you talk around you talk to people in other industries and try to make the best decision for your team well you know it's not necessarily a fixed number it's over time that's why I'm you know you can get frustrated by things we're one of three and you know I just look at we haven't turned the profit yet and there's a lot of ways to look at it and and we feel like that profits gonna turn but right now we haven't turned the profit so we are what we are we're one of three there's there's several reasons and you know we deserve to be because but there is progress being made so I look at it like a business like we're gonna turn a profit and you need to do it hopefully sooner and faster but like would you go with the run game same analogy obviously you get down to Tampa the game can kind of evolves didn't get a lot of carries there but I feel like the run games coming we don't have to have a set number of carries I said we want to be balanced we don't want to be obvious there's strides sometimes there's some painful short-term frustrations that'll eventually pay over long-term games and that's certainly you can see that in the run game some of your protection schemes so week over week we just got to make sure we're turning in the right direction so that's kind of look at it it kind of all goes into play there it's a good question yeah well he's obviously a seasoned veteran he's my age he has got a lot of mutual friends and he went to Tennessee knew a lot of the same same people I was in me being from Memphis he's pointed well for a long time in the league so we expect him to go out there and execute and we got a lot of faith in him certainly helps when you got veterans you know he knows what to expect knows how to prepare to go out there and operate so we're excited let's see what he can do yeah he's got incredible arm strength you go back you look at that Titans game when he got outside the pocket he made him pay he's deadly accurate all scheduled so we know it's gonna be a tremendous challenge that's an era we got to improve you know like I said the guys man it's the NFL is a tough transition that's why you know these hot takes same thing you're dealing with with somebody like Kyle there is growth getting you know it's but you can't make these snap judgments I think a lot of times in society and it's great for the game there's so much hype and everything's in our face 24-7 what a social media whatever it is they can almost the hype can be overwhelming the truth is let's see how this thing plays out at the end of the year you think guys have massive rookie years and then they fall off a cliff you guys have bad rookie years they go into Hall of Fame careers that's why I look at these quarterbacks like I don't get caught up in whatever narrative is after four weeks I mean you go back and look at somebody like Peyton Manning I believe he you know had the all-time interception as a rookie and look what you know he arguably the best ever to do it so it's harder now to have perspective and everything so instant gratification so I guess on the bigger picture a lot of these rookies people want to hammer on things there's some talented players that position the quarterback is really hard to play and you see it I mean you see his talent and we got to be ready to go because he can expose them they're all different you know it's a good question I'm not you know I don't want to get into you know not state secrets whatever but I'm not gonna get into the hay schematically what it is they all present different challenges they're all the same I think that's what makes it laughable to me I'll go back to bigger picture I think this where stereotypes are really dumb the guy where he played for you know you can almost write some of these narratives themselves before they ever play a snap like hey a guy hits this 40 number he looks this way he's gonna be this type of player it's laughable they're all different they all have different talents and and Zach Wilson he's gonna provide a big time challenge for us he's a really good player yeah there is a lot of logistical it's a good question there's a lot of planet goes into it you got to make sure the past but we plan this you know the NFL does a good job with our operation team Brandon Ruth those guys they do a hell of a job and and Sarah and Griff and then you we plan this out I mean I was told pretty early when I took this job that we're gonna go over there you have plans you have contingency plans in case we're not playing and they told us about month ago it's a go but but from the summer in the spring we talked about get your passports in and and when you got to be yeah and that's it's big right you sign a guy this week you can make sure they got their passport so there's a lot of planning goes into it sure that's all we got ahead of it we're not looking I know a lot of times you know people think that you're getting these jobs and there's a lot of glitz and glamour you're gonna skip the line we didn't skip the line anywhere told them a long time ago get your passports and I think more people now have them I think this is probably a bigger deal it seems to me as more people have their passports now it's more common than probably was as I'm sure it was a bigger challenge 15 years ago in terms of just being on people about getting them you know okay here here's how I'll say that I think they made progress every week I wouldn't call to step back I don't know what numbers you referred to I think there's improvement week to week I think we're close in the run game and only reason I ask I don't know you know sometimes you get these questions and they're all every questions fair but I just to answer it simply no I mean that we've been playing some pretty good fronts I think Washington they have one sack we had a miscommunication me optimistically don't think it should happen it's a pretty damn good front they block so we hopefully building conference we got a even bigger challenge these guys are freaking humming up front it's seven sacks last week they play freaking hard so we we got a work cut off the front but no no we're making progress I mean I think you could you know even being optimistic or trying to nobody's trying to cook the books here and you know I'm not trying to send out a shareholder letter you know to pump our stock up with some Wall Street analysts I think you just look week over week obviously in week one it wasn't good enough week two I thought it was a little bit better week three same thing there's always gonna be things we got to correct but we got a challenge it's a life in the NFL good player then disruptive like I said those guys move they don't give up on the rush I got an initial burst up the field I got good counter moves and they got they run games as well as anybody in the league and a lot of you know a lot of his production too that's why it's a coordinated rush you know you know a lot of like you know it's funny because you have people's different takes on sacks you can have some high volume sack teams that are bad teams you know they don't win a lot of games and you know they have a lot of high number sacks you can have some rush groups that can make life hell they may not have a lot of sack numbers this group is about as good as coordinated as an end so you look at somebody like him a lot of his production comes because he's really talented he's a really good player but they got some selfless guys up there they're getting guys open to pick games they run or damn good they don't give up on the rush a lot of times if you get you off your first read and the quarterbacks holding it he's coming around the edge it's all those guys I mean so I said it's as good as a coordinated rush as I've seen so far it's not shut down it's like it's like here you know we get over there we've got a schedule but we you know we believe in you know how to how to do this and travel obviously we'll see what the results are at the end of the weekend but you know where we're staying I mean there's not I mean it's they got a really nice setup for us but it's no different than here you know I think the UK is in a very similar spot as the United States you know I've said been over there a couple years but I don't think it's gonna be it's not gonna look like 2020 I guess it's probably the best way to put it yeah I do I think it's exciting and I think the fact that we can go play an NFL game over there and you're gonna have a full crowd and people are excited about football it helps grow the game and I think that's healthy for the game it's healthy for the NFL healthy for football in all levels our football a lot of those are you know when you're going week to week you've seen we yet it's not been consistent you know we were different matchups different plans and a lot of it comes down to special teams we meet a lot of those guys you know in order to get a helmet on game day they got to have a role you've obviously seen us use Felipe and dirt and different roles Wayne we felt he's he's gotten here he's gotten better he's got a role saw a couple things I liked in the run game we got to make a decision in the week but he's progressing yeah I don't know business savvy I am but you know that's a great question for Rich McKay maybe you can get past to get him to come out here and talk or hit the dell up or no but they the NFL does a really fantastic job with this it's exciting maybe in my mindset I you know I I like it you know I just think it's it's it's really cool when he's about to think about it that we can go over there and there's excitement and it grows the game you know it's a franchise again I got my own thoughts but I'm just speculating so I'm not gonna get out here and say it I think it's it's exciting I think it's cool and who knows what the future holds way I look at it the same way when we got to the vaccinations you know you people got to educate themselves so we have way we travel like I think everything has a curfew you know we educated guys on everything that we tried to and they got to make decisions I mean you're talking about adults here this isn't college football or I don't so believe that you know you I believe in freedom of choice now we were smart about stuff and we're not asking guys to do anything it wouldn't do at home I think we've got a responsible group I think that's why you know like I said I mean these guys there's no mandate to get vaccinated these guys that make the best interest the best decision for themselves and what they thought helped them and their family and that's all we do we don't put the old trips on guys we have a schedule guys have been great about it we had no issues down in Miami I don't expect any issues when we go to London um you know those guys where we'll evaluate them again we'll have to see you know I don't know much they'll really practice today obviously we got to make a decision before we get on the plane if we're gonna leave anybody back if it's the best interest for their rehab or we think they got a chance to play we'll bring them with us yeah no okay guys I'll answer every question you had you held up there for you had your hand up there for a while I don't ever claim to have a whole right answers but I promise you I won't short you guys on the question so Corey yeah no Corey is a really good player he's fearless going inside the numbers and one of the toughest tougher players I've coached happy for CD you know he got rewarded with a with a nice contract and and I see a very physical player I said he's fearless with the football he's he's physical in the run game and he's making some big plays for me in a big big play form last week on a play extension happy Zell for Corey Davis obviously we got a we got a chance we got to stop them on Sunday no different than I saw Adam Humphries last week really like Adam you know but when we come down the game time if you're if I was playing against my family I'm trying to we're trying to whip like beat the crap out of him so but I got another respect for core Davis yeah so CJ really really smart football player obviously Dean coached him in Baltimore gone against him a few times very very smart player so from what I see on tape he looks as good as he's ever looked and he's making plays and looks like he's running the show over there and he's a really good football player and we got a count for yeah there's a lot of ways to look at it you know that's the biggest challenge and that's the thing you like you gotta love about pro football like I said sometimes it's you can't let something linger whether you win a game say you know we want to say we'd hit the Hail Mary right you can't let that you for and think all sudden you've got all your problems solved and have to hang over and get crushed over in London and you're going to by week two and three that way you got to get over wins and losses quick in this league or the real plan in London the sentence of the Maldives you know that's our job we signed up for let's go play a game we got to get prepared to go play it and it is the hardest thing to do oh week after week after week that's why the challenge of pro football is unlike any other thing because the games they're not 82 games 17 of them now season takes on four or five lives of his own as it evolves deal with injuries you have a couple tough losses can you get better can you keep perspective like I said you could be frustrated but you better get over it and if you're seeing things that are signs of progress you can be encouraged but you've got to keep pushing and improving and so yeah it's not what we want to be like I said we haven't turned the profit but it's a you know every week's big and we got to get ready to go certainly yeah it does whether you want to lose going into a buy it feels like it lingers because you got two weeks you're still on it but if even if we win we got to be able to turn the page in next week accomplish what we need to in a buy and then get ready for my you know Miami it'll be the same challenge but it's a good question but winter lose don't let it let there be a hangover you know sometimes players you know they can take a you may think you have a great scheme it goes off schedule and you know the end results really good but you can look back at it and that's we have a jet this because you scored on the play doesn't mean it was some great scheme or some great play call I think a lot of times in a game of football that's so complex there's a lot of variables and if you can shrink it down and just be brilliant in the basics of what you're trying to do it sounds so boring but sometimes a mundane over and over and over again it pays off and then a lot of those repetitions and things we're asking guys to do so in the route craft timing you know with some as little as some of our the action fakes where we set up you know I think you said we feel like we're making progress week over week again we got a turn of profit and what you can't have you know all sudden you feel like you're making progress but you're not turning a profit and then it goes the other way so Matt's as good as anybody is work habits study habits and he works on crap but I kind of call it we got to be brilliant in the basics and a lot of times that's not a flashy word it's not doesn't get a headline it's not fun to write about but that's kind of what it comes down to that's hard to speculate you know I just hope you know say they're going to attack it he'll attack as well as anybody you know that's probably a better question for him and our medical staff you know you never know what the future holds I don't get in predictions and injuries because I just seen it obviously Adrian Peterson was one of the freaks that you know he kind of almost like ruined it for everybody else but but he's he's an outlier they're all different like I said and it doesn't mean it's right or wrong that's why I don't ever give timetable on injuries because it sets up bad you know narratives and that's not fair to the player I'll try to get some sleep I said I probably drink way too much coffee so I need to sleep you know because we're gonna get over there and it'll be about six o'clock in the morning so I'll certainly try on normal domestic flights I really don't growing up I've never been asleep in the car on airplane so yeah it's you're jogging a couple things and we have a schedule we believe in you know I'm not going to great detail about it but you know that's the challenge I mean we got it we got a whole work week ahead of us we're still playing on Sunday yes there is a little bit of the obviously the state in the obvious there is difference we'll get on a plane and flying internationally across the pond so you know everybody the both teams are dealing with the same set of circumstances you know there's things we'll do Friday to try to make sure we adjust that we feel pretty confident in and you hope by the time we you know you wake up Sunday you feel pretty well adjusted I look older though you're insinuating that he's using certain products so there's a shots fired towards Bassidy yeah you know I don't know I don't know if it's a bad look or good look sometimes I really don't care I've got a big enough family like I said that somebody's gonna is gonna make fun of me and somebody's gonna say hey it looks good you don't know what the truth is maybe I'll shave maybe I'm not maybe I'll go for the urine clop look when I get over there so but yeah sometimes I get reminded that there sure is a lot of beer a great going in your beard and there's a lot of gray in my hair too so I don't know I said I don't know what the truth is yeah I mean again because Bassidy's kind of a jackass you know he set us up here again I don't know if he was trying to mess with you or me or both you know I'm a huge fan of the show but that has nothing to do with us I don't I don't view us as the same spot as ASC Richmond that's why I always laugh is it's why you don't pay attention to the noise I mean something as harmless as a joke like that that's what I tell people all the time like get off get off the line sometimes and don't go down toxic rabbit holes somebody's gonna think you're an a-hole somebody's gonna think you're you're smart something I think you're the dumbest person in the world something here you know this or that I thought it was pretty funny I don't like to work with people don't have a sense of humor personally players or coaches and if you can't take criticism or you can't laugh at yourself I really don't want to work with you so I thought it was pretty funny move by Bassidy but I'm not gonna lean into it I'm not gonna get off the plan with a mustache and a visor and an ASC Richmond tracksuit all right. Appreciate it. Thank y'all.


Can you edit the text of a Facebook ad after it's already run? Well, everyone thinks that you cannot, but there is a mythic workaround that I just tested and it works. So essentially, let's say I just started running an ad for this one. And if I try editing the post, I'm just gonna take away the smiley face just as one simple edit, edit the post. And, okay, publish original post, hosting event, no, publish original post. I'm just gonna publish. See, you do not have permission to edit this promoted post because I started running an ad on this. So the workaround is to change the post that you are running an ad for. So this was the campaign where I'm running this post as an ad. So if I click on change post and I select a different post that I'm running an ad for, then I'm gonna select this other post here, click continue, and I publish the change. Okay, I publish change. Now, when I go and, oops, now when I go and edit the post. So remember I removed the smiley face and it wouldn't let me save. Now if I click save, publish original post, whatever that does here, now I can do it. Now the smiley face is gone. Now that I've changed it, I can go back, all right, change the post and move it back to the original one that I wanted to run an ad for. Okay, and then click publish and it's done. So that is the way, it's a little bit, you might need to watch this again, but that's essentially the way to change the text on a promoted post. You could be something that you ran an ad for a long time ago, you wanna bring it back, but now this, the post needs a different date or something. It already had social proof from the previous ad. You wanna keep all the comments and the likes, but you wanna change something and I just showed you how to do that. So I hope this is helpful. If you have any other tips for others, by the way, regarding this, you can comment below. Thanks.


Today we will hear a personal experience report from the initiative Freifunk, a project of the Chaos-Darmstadt-EV. This is where there are a lot of obstacles to overcome. But a central question to us is what do refugees actually need, what's important to them, how do they utilise network resources, how do they use the internet. And so we are also interested in lessons learned, what have we learned through experience so that the next year can be even better. So I'd like to welcome our speaker, Peter Löwenstein, and we'd like a round of applause please. Thank you. Hello from Freifunk-Darmstadt, that's where I'm from, Chaos-Darmstadt. So we are initiative and project, and we think it's an initiative because it doesn't really have an end so far. A personal experience because I'm going to give some positions that isn't shared by everybody, and I just want to stress that point. So that's the overview over the last 12 months, so that's not necessarily means that we did Freifunk for refugees in this time frame, but this started only in the summer. For me it was different because I was also candidate for the parliament of the state parliament, and Freifunk was one of my political points, and I brought this to the media attention. So then the refugee wave arrived, and there was a question, what do we do about that? The refugee homes are not well equipped with Wi-Fi, and so what do we do about that? It's not easy to discuss or to organize because we do this in a local plenary with everybody. We made contacts to local companies and similar, and we got input from that made us continue and made us stronger. So I'm not going to talk so much about the technical details today. Maybe I can summarize them in such a way that with the Freifunk routers. We did it similar to how we did it at home, but then we did a lot of technical stuff that we didn't even think was possible before. So it's possible to do really complex systems that isn't that much work to do. The only real problem is the load that's going to go to the servers, but that wasn't really my work, so others from Freifunk Darmstadt did this really well. So it's more about pinpointing the decision makers in the administration and with discussions. So how is it possible to do more effective Freifunk for refugees and to streamline this in the future? So this is the area where we are active. The white spot in the middle is Darmstadt. And so the area around it is the district Darmstadt D-Borg and other districts, Christbergstraße and Offenburg, which is south of Hesse. So then there's Frankfurt, Bavaria, next to it like Rheinland-Talz. So it's like a relatively closed area, Darmstadt, and all the areas around it that are relatively different from how they are connected to each other or connected to the internet. So it's like 16 megabit maybe, or it's more in the companies, obviously, or universities. So in the political area it's very different between the districts. Like Darmstadt has a green majority magistrate, a green mayor, and in Darmstadt D-Borg there's an SPD Social Democrat minister with green support. And has around 130 homes. So there's, for example, one place in Bamhausen, which is like 1,500 refugees in a former barracks. So in Darmstadt itself it's like several homes from 350 to 500 inhabitants and many smaller ones. I had asked the different parties and groups of the parties in the parliaments. So it's important because it's an important point in the upcoming elections, local elections. But we try to stay independent of every political spectrum. So I can only recommend this to every Freifunk initiative. But it's not a non-political thing itself, any either. So we just need bandwidth. And in the rural areas it's very important to ask people you know, or ask local IT companies if it's possible to collaborate with them to use some part of their bandwidth. So that then you have to convince them that it makes sense for them to provide bandwidth of a Freifunk initiative. Then second important thing is that Freifunk initiative is no provider. So we're going to help you with installing the router and setting it up. Then the routers are bought and we just give like free support with problems. So it's best to ask it with problems when you're going to our local meetings. But administration and companies not necessarily agree with that. So that's like one of the homes as found in OpenStreetMap that we started connecting in November with the bandwidth provided by some people living next to it that we beamed to the home. So the red dots is one client from the refugee home that's connected to the Freifunk node. It was a small solution that we started with and it repeated at another one, another home. So we just wanted to find a solution at first. And then we have maybe we have 300, 400 with the start. And then you have, so you know, then if you have 16 kilobit for 300 foreign people, it's not very much and you don't get it very far. So we try to expand and we had some success with that. In the lower part, it's a beam from a local provider supporting us that's like to the going to the local barracks. That's 2.2 kilometers. And we set it up like that. And on the left at the green area, it's the that's the first original nodes from the local inhabitants. So soon some time ago from the town of Darmstadt asked, because it working so well, could you maybe provide bandwidth to another home as well that we set up recently? And that's like one of the at the top. We have like quite some bandwidth. That's what you see here at the left bottom left, the different homes, the wave curves, the number of refugees locked in. And at the peak times, there were 1000 981 refugees connected. So the applause doesn't belong to me really, but the Freifunk initiative altogether. So I'm more the publicity person. But the outliers here that you can you can see these that's just the daily regularities because of specific time. Obviously at night, there's not as much going on. But what can you what you can equally recognize quite well here is where we had technical difficulties ourselves. Like from October 1st until until the day before before yesterday, this was the actual amount that we can that we could could provide. So we're still on the lookout for for supportive partners for associations and collaborators. Some of those who who would like to join in with us on a on a political level, but even just on a let neighborly cooperative local very local level. So these this can be the mayors or the social charities and of course politicians. And so the the work you're doing, the the press work, it's a matter of publicity. And I can just tell you that as soon as you have the mayor on your side, the the communal services will support you. The even the fire firemen will support you. And it's a lot easier to reach common kind of goals. And that just by the experience that you know that support comes top down in administration, you can utilize that. So we also try to contact and inform the the local council. And trying to improve things for individual homes. And so in October we basically just started creating reality of three sports training training halls that were made turned into homes. And well, there was an information problem this this had to be returned to the local council office to local administration. And there's a lot of information processing that no one knew. Well, in this in this from these hundred and thirty the places they were not provided or they were well, they were supposed to be hundred and thirty individual connections provided. But it turned out that we couldn't provide that. But we don't really see the problem because if the if the infrastructure is there, if the landline is there, for instance, there shouldn't be the difficulty to prevent us from from giving donation, giving the routers as a donation and just setting them up there. So this is quite difficult and quite frustrating sometimes. So in some cases we had even in Darmstadt there was almost riots broke out between young people in in the home because just the living conditions were so appalling. Just the level of frustration of things that have to be addressed and have to have to be changed. It's quite hard to find a way to reach your goals. But we might be angry, but we can't enforce things just by by pressure. So we're trying to talk about what what we can what we can attain. And what people are basically different organizations, private charities are selected by by the by the city or by the administration to to provide and to maintain these these homes. That's from clothes and from food. And why not include Internet in these just provisions in just the things that have to be included if you organize and set up one of these homes. And I think the Internet is important also because just also giving an access to the culture where where these people find themselves in because if you want to find out something about the society that you're currently being dropped into, the Internet is a very easy access and something that cannot be provided in the same way from administration procedures which take a lot longer. And of course it's a matter of accessibility and communication just being able to speak to someone at home from your home country just keeping in touch. And well, regarding other roles in support in the support community, the fire forces were quite important and especially the coordinators and we eventually did manage to get all these stakeholders somehow on the same page. And will enable this this collaboration to be functional. For instance, just how to get this organized a set up a home for 500 refugees, just the sheer logistics of this setup and also do it in well in advance and not, you know, start when they're already all these people in front of your door basically. So back to the question what what someone individual what every single one of you might be able to to manage and support in this. I think it's a lot more than you think everything any any one of you if you just have a little bit of time if you have a little bit of energy or interest in this in this matter. If you're if you're in touch with with the church charity or with with any of these work circles refugee support groups just go and approach these organizations. It's really important it's and you're sure to find someone and be able to support in various ways. Well, what you can see here is like an already made refugee internet cafe set up basically by one of the Freifunk community members and this Freifunk person was collaborating with with a with a home administration and make or being at least serious and professional enough to to to get along with them or to to make progress. And so they managed to get these three seats these three internet cafe seats approved and now they're so successful with this that they want to extend it to 10 more to 10 more computer places. And so it's rather clear that the the use that this this empowerment and this well these opportunities to to connect and to educate yourself that these are very essential to any integration processes. So talk to your network if they don't have possibility to talk to journalists. If you manage that well then then the media is very eager to actually work with that as well. Like few days after the after our first meeting we had got this this article about our work that we connected the first bearer from a barracks. So then we were contacted by the mayor and other groups. So and yeah OK Darmstadt Freifunk is actually doing something great. That's what they told us so five counties and from Darmstadt we had a lot of a lot of support and requests. So one of one of the groups we actually had to give away because to another Freifunk group because it was not possible for us to support it anymore. Like the servers would have to be extended and it's not easy to do that on a voluntary basis. So we also had resolutions in the council local councils. So yeah they thought OK it's a great idea. Freifunk is great and we want to want to do it want to write it for refugees. My personal opinion is that you can't really rely on that. So it's maybe great for them if it's if it's in the gets in the media or or in the in the party program. But they always have the possibility to change their mind later on. And it doesn't really matter if it's the grains or the social democrats or whoever and most of the time they will even be proud of changing their mind. So with the greens like on the district county level or higher you can work very well. But below that it depends on the personal on the persons involved. And with the Christian Democrats I'm really surprised. I had some some hesitations. But it's like really they really said told me it's a good possibility for them to integrate to integrate refugees better. The pirate party is only in the big cities still active in a little bit so that they that they might help help us. And with the social democrats. Yeah what I said it doesn't really matter. Like depending on whether it was set in the federal or or other levels and then they just change their minds later on. The left the very left and the DKP are very difficult. Do you want to know more about it? Okay that's going away from your from your question time. We have a coalition between DKP and leftists and the basis of Darmstadt Deburg. So we have to ask the questions. If if you're not in the situation that the refugees are set better off than people getting hearts for. So the DKP didn't think that was really funny that's that funny so they the part of the person should be removed from the list. And so the coalition broke apart because of this this person's opinion. But even then I didn't want to I wouldn't join with DKP to try out setting up setting up fry for him. But I don't really think DKP is is like on the position to to go into that. But that's just my personal opinion. So in her service providers and other competitors. So they're not it's not possible for them to to let the people into their net without logging without registration. So all that stuff that we don't do with Fryfunk. And the sales team is also not really set up for that to as a commercial company. And then yeah Fryfunk or like Wi-Fi hotspot OK we don't really know what that is. Then we have first have to ask the server the the persons the the handy workers they can do the cables in the homes. And so it's quite difficult to work with them.  Letters and then it was possible to get the cables in the right positions for the Rogers and that was that. So what's the alternatives. That would be to get the local refugees to help themselves to do their own fry from communities. So that they can connect with that and provide with that. And so for example in one case he had it was like one person who was like very good with that. And in a rabbit set up VPN connections. And yeah provided VPN access for for other inhabitants and to conflict regions. Some really good people and every community shouldn't let them just stay bored in the in the homes but should like try to engage them. Because of their print a lot of they have a lot of potential. So with a look to what the future with a few seconds that I've left. So Freifunk Darmstadt got a lot of support from the mayor. So we didn't have to use a lot of donations to set up Wi-Fi at the homes. But maybe we are like maybe we get we get dependent on on the state support and that's can also be difficult. And then still Freifunk. And yet it's a problem and maybe if the state of Hesse should try a pilot project like how could we set up a solutions that are can be used all over the country. And that scale well and that don't have to be started in every community again. So it's much easier. You don't have to talk that much. There's just you got a bundle of solutions, schooling material and similar. And I wish that we see a lot more of that in the federal also on the federal level in 2014. So I wish to get a camp to to exchange experiences, how to set up communities and not only to set up the first staff but then how to enable people and the power people to help themselves. So I'm at the end. We need an internet solution because it's a humanitarian, humanitarian thing. So we need Freifunk to provide internet solutions for the refugees and let them help themselves. And we can it's easy. It helps to integrate the very, very experienced people with a lot of potential in our societies. And let's not get them bored. Thanks. Well, sadly, there's no more time left for questions. But if you have any questions, Peter will be outside in front of the hall. And you can you can ask him and discuss in in person. And I would like to say thanks in particular because this was a difficult situation today. He left his laptop fell apart just before the talk and this was a borrowed one. And also, of course, I'd like to thank everyone as as who's participating who's working on Freifunk initiative for refugees for newcomers, as they say. I'd like a really big applause for them as well. Thanks a lot.