News is ongoing coverage of Israel at war, I'm Ariel Levin Waldman. The IDF says heavy fighting has continued overnight this morning and into the afternoon in northern Gaza's Chejaya and Jabalia areas and Hamas' key stronghold of Khan Yunus in Gaza's south. Israel has reportedly turned to Egypt to negotiate a new hostage deal as Hamas signals potential desperation with senior terror official Musa Abu Marzuk signaling the terrorist government could recognize Israel's existence in order to end the war. Who though could still trust them after October 7th is another story. In the north, the IDF confirms striking a number of Hezbollah sites in southern Lebanon this morning and that a projectile was also fired from Lebanon at an area near the northern community of Shamera. Iran has threatened the international community, warning of consequences of a national force being set up in the Red Sea to protect against attacks on international ships, but the Tehran backed back Houthi rebels off the coast of Yemen. This after the US last week said it may establish a naval task force to escort shipping. And now a word from the IDF after a firefight against Hamas terrorists entrenched in a hospital. Over the last two days, fighters from the 460th Brigade have been evacuating the Kamal Adwan Hospital. The hospital had been used as a stronghold for terrorists. Terrorists had come out of here to harm our forces. During the evacuation, many weapons were removed from the hospital. A lot of terrorists were taken out of the hospital and are currently in custody in Israel. Over the last two days, we have evacuated thousands of civilians from the hospital in order not to harm innocent people. And we're going to turn our eye to Israel's south where our correspondent Pierre Kloschenler is standing by on the border with Gaza. Pierre, we just gave a very generic introduction of what the latest developments are. Give us more specific details about what we've seen coming out of Gaza, the fighting there and the latest developments. Right, just behind me is the area of the northern sector of the Gaza Strip, Bet-Khanun, Bet-Lahiyah. And we are here in a stage that could foretell about the future of the war. This is low intensity fighting behind me. There's barely no explosions, no pounding of the Gaza Strip. When the army is calming the area, busy destroying infrastructures such as tunnel shafts, weapons depots, workshop to manufacture rocket launching pads, sniper nests, but also in one separate incident northeast of the northern sector of the Gaza Strip, there's been a siege of the Kamal Adwan Hospital for a few days already. It was reported in the Palestinian media affiliated to Hamas. That has come to an end. With over 70 terrorists, their arms raised with their AK-47 bare chest to make sure that they do not carry explosive suicide vests and they surrendered. And that's one of the instances of where the fighting is going all right. In Jebal-Yah refugee camp, though, and in the Sheja'i town northeast of Gaza, it's a bit of a different ball game. There's been an offensive going on for the past 12 days since the onset of the ground offensive after the pose in the fighting for the release of hostages. In Jebal-Yah, the battalion seems to be on the verge of collapsing. There is no chain of command. And the army is fighting isolated terror cells. And there's a lot of pounding air support, artillery support to the ground forces. In Sheja'i, in the southeastern outskirts of Gaza City, there it's different. The battalion works as a battalion, or maybe as a company. And there's been a lot of deadly attacks on the Israeli soldiers, the last one of them a couple of days ago when nine soldiers fell into a very complex ambush. And that shows the coordination between all the terrorist cells that are fighting in Sheja'i. Well, thank you very much, Pierre, for that latest report on what is going on on the ground in Gaza. And we are definitely going to be coming back to you later in the day for more reports as the situation develops. Now for more though, we are joined in studio by Lieutenant Colonel Daron Avital, former commander of the Special Forces with the IDF, as well as Mark Shulman, Adler-in-Chief at History Chensor and columnist with Newsweek. Daron, I want to open with you. We're seeing a new report that Israel is set to present the United States, a timeline for the gradual completion of the war against Hamas. This timeline includes the idea that intense fighting will be finished by the end of January, and then over the several weeks after that, set to draw down into a more low intensity conflict. Is this a realistic timeline given that we're two weeks, two months into the war already, and still seeing such heavy fighting even in the north of Gaza? It's realistic in as far as the hostage dilemma is being solved. As long as this doesn't solve, I don't see the fighting ends in, or even any ceasefire taking place. So if we have some resolution about the dilemma of the hostages and in terms of military objectives, the two camps in the northern Gaza and Han Yunis, they can be completed in this time, after which we'll have to maybe add an objective, after which we can decide in what positioning to put the army and to introduce those raids, incursions, and so on. I think it's important to have some initiative with the White House in terms of timetable, because otherwise we're all the time under this clock ticking and some pressure that is not clear. So I think the government would not have suggested such a timetable if not the army would have thought about it and came to this conclusion. But this is only real if the hostage dilemma is being solved. I'm going to build on this with you, Mark, because we do have National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan coming to Israel in the next couple of days to discuss this and so many other issues where the American government and the Israeli government are not seeing eye to eye right now. Walk us through what these issues are and how many of them are practically resolvable? Okay, so we'll start with the easiest one, the resolvable humanitarian aid. At this point, I don't see any reason why Israel just cares about how much humanitarian aid goes in. I think we should be taking the initiative, frankly. I think we make a mistake by not bringing our own humanitarian aid and feeding some gossips and much better for our PR than all the PR advertising people we get, do something on the ground, but okay. But so we'll agree with anything in terms of humanitarian aid. The second issue, timetable, we can provide a timetable. Whether we keep to it, that's a whole other matter. But no one expects that in war, the other side has a side in any war. You make all the plans you want, but the other side can mess up your plan.  Whether we keep to it, that's going to depend on how things actually go. I've not really gone that well in Shazerjee and Jabalia based on, you know, collapsing any day now for at least a week. So I'm a little bit skeptical about that. The plan for the day after, that's the biggest problem. Not in reality, but in terms of rhetoric. The United States wants Israel to come up with some sort of plan to say what it wants the day after. The problem is this government really can't because the government will fall if any sort of plan is given that doesn't include annexation or some version they're in. So it has a real problem. It doesn't mean that Israel could give a plan. It doesn't mean it's what's really going to happen because, once again, there's another side to it. But unless we give a plan forward and say, this is what we see happening, if the other side agrees, wonderful. If not, well, we'll have to relook at the matter. But no, we just can't come to up with the plan because this government can't. It's just not possible for this government that when part of the government wants to resettle Gush-Katif, and most of it doesn't want to stay in Gaza because we know what the cost is. So that's really the biggest problem we have in terms of speaking to the Americans. I think those are the three major issues that we divide. We have one other issue or two other issues. I'm sorry. It's a question of Syria, excuse me, Syria. Lebanon, which I'm not sure we have a disagreement about. We want the Americans to push to come sort of the new idea of some sort of new agreement based on the Shabbat farm changes and a few other minor border changes, I think is a workable plan. And lastly, we have the question of the Houthis. We need the United States to take action. We do not want to have to take action against the Houthis. It's far away. We can, but it's really pushing our logistics ability to try to go down there. We need the United States to take its traditional position of Freedom of the Seas all the way back to the Barbary Pirates in the early 1800s. The United States has had that position and done that, and we need them to do it again. I want to bring up another issue with the United States. And that is the United States set of expectations realistic. Because we've seen their demands for revitalized Palestinian authority for a two state solution. And the polls we're seeing coming out of Palestinian territories right now shows that the Palestinian side wants anything but all of that. We just saw a new poll coming out last night showing that somewhere in the vicinity of 90% of Palestinians support the October 7th massacres. And it's even higher in the West Bank that it is in Gaza right now. We have to address some of these numbers. There's no question, but I don't think the Americans really believe what they're saying. In other words, they're saying let two state solutions, they need to say that to all of their allies. They're saying it because they need to say there is some hope for the future. I don't think they believe it. Look, Biden didn't think he could reach any sort of peace agreement before this all took place. He didn't want to touch this because he knew they couldn't reach any sort of peace agreement. So I believe that the United States just wants us to say something so that it can continue saying something to its Arab allies and is the right rhetoric.  But I do want to turn our attention to the northern border first, which is your area of apparitions, actually. Our correspondent, Zach Anders, is standing by on the northern border. Because there have been some recent developments there as well. Zach, walk us through what's happened. Well, we were in the last live hit as I had noticed there was a large volley of outgoing artillery. It turns out there was a red alert as we were on the air. Keryat Shremona under red alert along with other communities around in the hillside. It does not appear, according to McGon Dovedom, MDA, and the IDF, that there are any reports of damage or injuries thus far. However, they are still apparently trying to detect in these areas where exactly things might have fallen. It's not clear if this was a rocket attack or if this was, again, launches from mortars and ATGMs manned by personnel. And fired on positions. And some of these areas are well evacuated. So they aren't going to get the calls to 101 right away to be able to let them know where the damage is because there aren't a lot of people here. So they will be going around looking into these areas to try and see if there were any hits. Once it is safe to do so, this could still be an active situation. We're still working to collect some of this information. Well, thank you very much, Zach. And once you have collected information, we will be back with you for those updates. We are going to return to the studio now, Daron Avital. This is very much your air of operations. You were commanding special forces in Lebanon from 82 onwards. Is there a good solution for Hezbollah? They have their Rudwan forces, their death commandos the same as Hamas's Nukba forces from October 7th, planning the same thing. They have no intention of being pushed back behind the Latani line without any sort of military operation that forces them there, but the cost of that is going to be astronomical for Israel. In terms of a military campaign, you ask.  A military campaign, of course, is possible, but the question is timing. You don't go now in the context of the Gaza operation to a military campaign against Hezbollah, while Hezbollah doesn't want to go into this further escalation and we are not sure we want to do it. But if there's a diplomatic campaign that reiterates or declares that the end game is the Latani border, the 1701, then there's a context in which a military operation comes to being, it makes sense in terms of our allies and the whole coalition. And coming back to the words that were said earlier, you have to understand momentum is crucial in the battlefield, but momentum is also crucial in the diplomatic field. And if Israelis think that this huge coalition led by the U.S., standing behind us in the context of this campaign that we're having, won't come at a price in the diplomatic landscape, then we don't get the picture. So I'm saying one of the major questions would be not only what is Gaza after this campaign, what is Israel after this campaign, there will be political far-reaching consequences and some of them pushed by our allies, but sometimes are internal to the context of which Israel is right now living. So it will be very interesting to see what would unfold historically. You're describing a massive status quo shift in the mentality in Israel as well. Do you perhaps see an optimistic endpoint here that perhaps there could be a lasting peace as a result of this? I'm always optimistic and I want to remind our audience that the context of this terrible attack, the context was the Biden initiative. I mean, we talked about this corridor coming from India, Saudi Arabia, normalization, concession with the Palestinians, all the way to Europe, railroads, whatever was in the plan. In this context, this attempt of Hamas was to derail this thing. In this context, I think the Israelis, or at least Bibi, were thinking that they can go along with this plan without any concession with the Palestinians. I think both are wrong. Hamas is often this attempt to derail this momentum or this initiative. And I think the Israelis or Bibi, at least the Bibi's coalition, is wrong in feeling that it can be done without real concession with the Palestinians. So I don't know what does the two states unfold in it. It's not like word by word, but something along the lines of some resolution between us or the Palestinians is necessary. And in the end, as it unfolded, I want to remind the audience, the Yom Kippur War, terrible war, terrible cost. But on the debris of this war, a peace was achieved. Also, the 82 war in Lebanon, PLO is being chased away to Tunisia. But then we come back to the Oslo Accord. So I think a healthy momentum is necessary in Israelis. We'd have to wake up to some healthy momentum. We've paid the price in the campaign then. I'm not optimistic. Just because, I mean, I wanted more than anything in life, but I don't expect to see it in my lifetime at this point. I think it would require us doing a lot of outreach towards the Palestinians over a generation to change their outlook if it's at all possible. I do not think it's possible to reach any lasting agreement under the current circumstances. It's much too raw. We didn't have the same hatred between us and the Egyptians as there aren't currently between Israelis and Palestinians. Nothing to be alone in the 82. Yeah, but it didn't really solve anything. That has been truly resolved. All we did was we were in a process that got prevailed. Historical process, they have this length. So I don't know if it's in our lifetime, but this is the only process possible in the end. As a personal note, my mother is from Sher Jarach in the old city. And she doesn't hold the key for the old house in Sher Jarach. So I think the Palestinians have to go pragmatical and practical. And what happened in the center of October doesn't do good for their image around the world, in many respects. Along, of course, there's a lot of support somewhere. But in terms of the atrocity that we're committed, and they have to wake up and be pragmatical, but we also have to have a new kind of pragmatism along the lines of parties like Kadima, a new kind of pragmatism in the context of moving forward. You can't just hold on to those extreme position. It won't work. It won't work also within Israeli society. I'm telling you, not only with the Palestinians. But this can't go forward at all unless the Palestinian society is reformed massively, as the poll suggests. Mark, actually either of you, is there a practical, realistic plan to make those reforms? I think the Palestinian, from the perspective of the Palestinians, there was a campaign. The Israeli policy was all about telling the world that there's no such Palestinian case anymore. And that you can, if you wish, hold history at bay and not let it move forward. Of course, the Palestinians, they played their hands terribly from 48 on. We played it terribly, as well, throughout the period. We did not put the effort into making their lives really good. Which is what we should have done. We should have made the life in the West Bank heaven, so to speak. Because of the great things the Israelis are doing, we didn't do that either. We succeeded with the Arab Israelis to a very large extent. Look at where they are in society and how well they're doing. We didn't start off well, but we've done pretty well in the last 20 years. But we did not do that for lots of reasons, good reasons, some of them, and some of them bad reasons, with the Palestinians in the West Bank and so on, not in Gaza. And unless you do something like that over a generation, it won't make any effect. It's had an effect over a generation with Arab Israelis. We have to figure something out with the Palestinians. I'll be long gone. I guess we have to pray that it's not. Don't rush. Don't rush. Thanks. Wait. We're going to need you in studios. We're not going around anytime soon. That said, we're all hoping it's not too late, because the stakes of this war are very much apparent. 135 hostages remain in captivity in Gaza, held by Hamas since the 7th of October. Here is more from the fathers of some of the Israelis who were taken hostage, waiting for their children to be returned home. Their stories are heart-wrenching. More in this report. It's now Hanukkah, and we are still stuck in Simchat Torah. When Guy went to the party, he said to me, Dad, tomorrow I'm coming back from the party. I'll help you dismantle the sucker. He didn't come back from the party, and I didn't dismantle the sucker. And it's still standing here, waiting for him to come back so he can help me dismantle it. Guy is 22 years old. The charming boy. Such a charmer. Everywhere he goes, people fall in love with him in a second. He has lots and lots of friends. How are you? It's almost a video game. He's crazy. And he's missing. We miss him very much. Guy went to a party one day. Four friends went, and none of them came home. Two were murdered, and two were kidnapped. At noon, I already saw a video of Guy, who was inside Gaza. They look frightened there, scared. Actually, from the moment the negotiation stopped and the fighting restarted, how did you feel? I knew that Guy was not supposed to be released in that round, because they only talked about women and children, but I hoped that when that round was completed, they would go, let's say, to the older people, and after that to the young people, and it would continue like this until they released everyone. I mean, that's what I imagined. And once they returned to fighting, it was a very big blow. How do you manage to function on a daily basis? With a lot of help. Not sleeping, not eating, in short, not functioning. My wife and I would work two jobs each. We just left everything. We are currently 100% busy getting Guy back. Nothing else matters. What I want to hear is that my child is coming home. I want to see a slide on TV that says that kidnapped have returned. This is what I want to wake up to in the morning, tomorrow. We keep imagining him coming back to us, imagining the phone call we get in the middle of the night, telling us, I don't know. The IDF suddenly found him. They found a room with some prisoners and they call us and the officer tells me, there is someone who wants to talk to you. And I hear Guy. He says, Dad, and we shall Guy to him and run there. And we become a family again. My son's name is Alon Shamariz. We have no new information about him. Our Alon is the third son in the family, 26 years old. A cheerful, happy, kind-hearted boy. Alon, along with Ido and Yonatan, they were a trio. Those three did everything together, spent time together, travelled together. We miss him very much. How does your everyday look like? During the day I am busy with public needs and at night the sadness comes and my wife sat and cried during the day. Slowly we managed to get her out of it. She started doing interviews, started public activities and that's how we spend the day. Do you have a message that is important for you to convey? We are a kibbutz which pursued peace. We are the people who came to the border and took their patients and drove them to the hospitals in Israel. We employed Palestinian citizens in our kibbutz, in our factory and we took care of all their needs. We gave them equal treatment like any other worker. We don't deserve what they did to us. Do you feel that there is someone else there to talk to on the other side? I have no doubt, not everyone is Yahya Sinwar. I want to ask if the return of the hostages during the pause, if it gives you something to hope for or is it a different matter? Look, first of all I am happy for everyone who returned. On the other hand, I am very, very angry with the decision makers in our government. Everyone should have been released already. Yes? Do you feel that the government is not doing everything to bring them back? I don't trust anyone in our government, no one. Ace is son sitting in the tunnel. My son is sitting in the tunnel. My son has no oxygen. My son has half a pizza a day. I want my child here tomorrow. Doron is a veterinary nurse. She has a good girl with friends, many friends. The only thing we know since she was kidnapped is the voice message we got four days later from her friends. We were also in Doron's room and saw what condition it was in. Compared to the other rooms, it seemed relatively intact. It was a mess because they turned it over and searched and rummaged it. But its condition and the voice message she left gave us some sort of hope to hold on to. What does everyday life look like now? Every day we wake up to a new hope with every message on the phone.  Maybe there is some news, good news that maybe Doron will come back. And what is the hope now? In this round it will happen because if it doesn't, we don't know how to go on. We have an important message to pass on. When Doron returns, we have to take care of her. Hope will recover. We have a mission as a family, as a society to help her as much as possible. To Guy, if you happen to hear me, I want to tell you that we love you very much. We miss you very, very much and we are doing everything to bring you home. We will never give up on you and soon we will be together. We have 30 seconds before I say goodbye to both of you but you've presented an image for a better future for Israel. It's hard to see right now though. I think any military campaign with the blood that it leaves behind, sometimes it also historically opens the venue for a new future and I hope that we can shape a new future after this campaign. I'm optimistic that we'll think a little bit differently. I don't think it will bring us to peace but it may bring us some ways closer because maybe we'll start thinking differently and thinking the same things has not worked for the last 40 years. Maybe that's sometimes the best we can hope for. For everyone else though, we are out of time. We'll see you again in a half hour for our four o'clock local time broadcast. Until then, thank you very much for watching. We'll see you again soon. Is in a state of war. Families completely done down in their beds. We have no idea where we see as our soldiers are fighting on the front lines but the general perception is something that certainly needs to be fought as well. Correspondents throughout the world brings the truth from Israel to hundreds of millions of people in scores of countries. Completely done down in their beds. The state of emergency and war in Israel. Bringing Israel's story to the world. I-24 News Channels. The four news is ongoing coverage of Israel at war. I'm Ariel Levin Waldman. The IDF says heavy fighting has continued overnight this morning and into the afternoon in northern Gaza's Chejaiyya and Jabalia areas and in Hamas' key stronghold of Hanyunas in Gaza's south. Israel has reportedly turned to Egypt to negotiate a new hostage deal as Hamas signals potential desperation with senior terror official Moussa Abou Marzouk signalling the terrorist government could recognize Israel's existence in order to end the war. Who though could still trust them after October 7th is another story. In the north the IDF confirms striking a number of Hezbollah sites in southern Lebanon this morning and was also fired from Lebanon at an area near the northern community of Shamera. Iran has threatened the international community warning of consequences of a national force being set up in the Red Sea to protect against attacks on international ships by the Tehran-backed Houthi rebels off the coast of Yemen. This after the US last week said it may establish a naval task force to escort shipping. And now a word from the IDF after a firefight against Hamas terrorists entrenched in a hospital. Over the last two days fighters from the 460th Brigade have been evacuating the Kamal-Adwan hospital. The hospital had been used as a stronghold for terrorists. Terrorists had come out of here to harm our forces. During the evacuation many weapons were removed from the hospital. A lot of terrorists were taken out of the hospital and are currently in custody in Israel. Over the last two days we have evacuated thousands of civilians from the hospital in order not to harm innocent people. We are going to turn our eye to Israel's south where our correspondent Pierre Kloschenler is standing by on the border with Gaza. Pierre, we just gave a very generic introduction of what the latest developments are. Give us more specific details about what we've seen coming out of Gaza, the fighting there and the latest developments. Right, just behind me is the area of the northern sector of the Gaza Strip, Beth-Khanun, Beth-Lahiyah. And we are here in a stage that could foretell about the future of the war. This is low intensity fighting behind me. There's barely no explosions, no pounding of the Gaza Strip and the army is calming the area, busy destroying infrastructures such as tunnel shafts, weapons depots, workshop to manufacture rocket launching pads, sniper nests. But also in one separate incident northeast of the northern sector of the Gaza Strip, there's been a siege of the Kamal Adwan Hospital for a few days already. It was reported in the Palestinian media affiliated to Hamas. That has come to an end with over 70 terrorists, their arms raised with their AK-47 bare chest to make sure that they do not carry explosives, suicide vests, and they surrendered. And that's one of the instances of where the fighting is going all right. In Jebalah refugee camp, though, and in the Shijaiya town northeast of Gaza, it's a bit of a different ball game. There's been an offensive going on for the past 12 days since the onset of the ground offensive after the pose in the fighting for the release of hostages. In Jebalah, the battalion seems to be on the verge of collapsing. There is no chain of command. And the army is fighting isolated terror cells. And there's a lot of pounding air support, artillery support to the ground forces. In Shijaiya, in the northeastern, in the southeastern outskirts of Gaza City, there it's different. The battalion works as a battalion or maybe as a company. And there's been a lot of deadly attacks on the Israeli soldiers. The last one of them a couple of days ago, when nine soldiers fell into a very complex ambush. And that shows the coordination between all the terrorist cells that are fighting in Shijaiya. Well, thank you very much, Pierre, for that latest report on what is going on on the ground in Gaza. And we are definitely going to be coming back to you later in the day for more reports as the situation develops. Now, for more though, we are joined in studio by Lieutenant Colonel Daron Avital, former commander of the Special Forces with the IDF, as well as Mark Shulman, Adler-in-Chief at History Chensor and columnist with Newsweek. Daron, I want to open with you. We're seeing a new report that Israel is set to present the United States, a timeline for the gradual completion of the war against Hamas. This timeline includes the idea that intense fighting will be finished by the end of January. And then over the several weeks after that, set to draw down to a more low intensity conflict, is this a realistic timeline given that we're two weeks, two months into the war already, and still seeing such heavy fighting even in the north of Gaza? It's realistic in as far as the hostage dilemma is being solved. As long as this doesn't solve, I don't see the fighting ends or even any ceasefire taking place. So if we have some resolution about the dilemma of the hostages and in terms of military objectives, the two camps in the northern Gaza and Han Yun is, they can be completed in this time, after which we'll have to maybe add an objective, after which we can decide in what positioning to put the army and to introduce those raids, incursions and so on. I think it's important to have some initiative with the White House in terms of timetable because otherwise we're all the time under this clock ticking and some pressure that is not clear. The government would not have suggested such a timetable if not the army would have thought about it and came to this conclusion, but this is only real if the hostage dilemma is being solved. I'm going to build on this with you Mark because we do have National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan coming to Israel in the next couple of days to discuss this and so many other issues where the American government and the Israeli government are not seeing eye to eye right now. How many of these issues are and how many of them are practically resolvable? Okay, so we'll start with the easiest one, the resolvable humanitarian aid. At this point I don't see any reason why Israel doesn't cares about how much humanitarian aid goes in. I think we should be taking the initiative, frankly. I think we make a mistake by not bringing our own humanitarian aid and feeding some Gazans and much better for our PR than all the PR advertising people we get do something on the ground but we can provide a timetable. Whether we keep to it, that's a whole other matter but no one expects that in war the other side has a side in any war. You make all the plans you want but the other side can mess up your plan.  Whether we keep to it, that's going to depend on how things actually go. We have not really gone that well in Shazer Zia and Jabalia based on collapsing any day now for at least a week. I'm a little bit skeptical about that. The United States wants Israel to come up with some sort of plan to say what it wants the day after. The problem is this government really can't because the government will fall if any sort of plan is given that doesn't include annexation or some version they're in. So it has a real problem. It doesn't mean that Israel could give a plan. It doesn't mean it's what's really going to happen because once again there's another side to it but unless we give a plan forward and say this is what we see happening then we look at the matter. But no, we just can't come to up with the plan because this government can't. It's just not possible for this government that when part of the government wants to resettle Gush Khatif and most of it doesn't want to stay in Gaza because we know what the cost is. So that's really the biggest problem we have in terms of speaking to the Americans. I think those are the three major issues that we divide. We have one other issue or two other issues. I'm sorry. It's a question of Syria. Lebanon, which I'm not sure we have a disagreement about between the Americans to push to come sort of the new idea of some sort of new agreement based on the Shabbat farm changes and a few other minor border changes I think is a workable plan. And lastly we have the question of the Houthis. We need the United States to take action. We do not want to have to take action against the Houthis. It's far away. We can, but it's really pushing our logistics ability to try to go down there. We need the United States to take its traditional position of freedom of the seas all the way back to the Barbary Pirates in the early 1800s. The United States has had that position and done that and we need them to do it again. I want to bring up another issue with the United States and that is the United States set of expectations realistic because we've seen their demands for revitalized Palestinian authority for a two state solution and the polls we're seeing coming out of Palestinian territories right now shows that the Palestinian side wants anything but all of that. We just saw a new poll coming out last night showing that somewhere in the vicinity of 90% of Palestinians support the October 7th massacres and it's even higher in the West Bank than it is in Gaza right now. We have to address some of these numbers. No question, but I don't think the Americans really believe what they're saying. In other words, they're saying two state solutions, they need to say that to all of their allies. They're saying it because they need to say there is some hope for the future. I don't think they believe it. Look, Biden didn't think he could reach any sort of peace agreement before this all took place. He didn't want to touch this because he knew he could reach any sort of peace agreement. So I believe that the United States just wants us to say something so that it can continue saying something to its Arab allies and there's the right rhetoric. And I'm going to come back to you Duran in a moment, but I do want to turn our attention to the Northern border first, which is your area of apparitions actually. Our correspondent, Zach Anders, is standing by on the Northern border because there have been some recent developments there as well. Zach, walk us through what's happened. Well, we were in the last area, but as I had noticed, there was a large volley of outgoing artillery. It turns out there was a red alert as we were on air. Kyriac Shimona under red alert, along with other communities around in the hillside. It does not appear according to McGon Dovedam, MDA and the IDF that there are any reports of damage or injuries thus far. However, they are still apparently trying to detect in these areas where exactly things might have fallen. It's not clear if this was a rocket attack or if this was, again, launches from mortars and ATGMs manned by personnel and fired on positions. And some of these areas are well evacuated so they aren't going to get the calls to 101 right away to be able to let them know where the damage is because there aren't a lot of people here. So they will be going around looking into these areas to try and see if there were any hits once it is safe to do so. This could still be an active situation that we're still working to collect some of this information. Well, thank you very much, Zach. And once you have collected information, we will be back with you for those updates. We are going to return to the studio now, Daron Avital. This is very much your area of operations. You were commanding Special Forces in Lebanon from 82 onwards. Is there a good solution for Hezbollah? They have their RUG-1 forces. They are commandos the same as Hamas and Nukba forces from October 7th planning the same thing. They have no intention of being pushed back behind the Latani line without any sort of military operation that forces them there. But the cost of that is going to be astronomical for Israel. In terms of a military campaign you ask. So a military campaign can...  I have to straighten my time. A military campaign, of course, is possible, but the question is timing. You don't go now to the context of the Gaza operation to a military campaign against Hezbollah, while Hezbollah doesn't want to go into this further escalation and we are not sure we want to do it. But if there's a diplomatic campaign that reiterates or declares that the end game is the Latani border, the 1701, then there's a context in which if a military operation comes to being, it makes sense in terms of our allies and the whole coalition. Think back to the words that were said earlier. You have to understand momentum is crucial in the battlefield, but momentum is also crucial in the diplomatic field. And if Israelis think that this huge coalition led by the U.S., standing behind us in the context of those in this campaign that we're having won't come with a price in the diplomatic landscape, then we don't get the picture. So I'm saying whether the major question would be not only what is Gaza after this campaign, what is Israel after this campaign. There will be political far-reaching consequences and some of them pushed by our allies, but sometimes are internal to the context of which Israel is right now living. So it will be very interesting to see what would unfold historically. You're describing a massive status quo shift in the mentality in Israel as well. Do you perhaps see an optimistic end point here that perhaps there could be a lasting as a result of this? I'm always optimistic and I want to remind our audience that the context of this terrible attack with the context was the Biden initiative. I mean, we talked about this corridor coming from India, Saudi Arabia, normalization, concession with the Palestinians all the way to Europe, railroads, whatever was in the plan. In this context, this attempt of Hamas was to derailing this thing. In this context, I think the Israelis, or at least Bibi can go along with this plan without any concession with the Palestinians. I think both are wrong. Hamas is often this attempt to derail this momentum or this initiative and I think the Israelis or Bibi at least the Bibi's coalition is wrong in feeling that it can be done without real concession with the Palestinians. So I don't know what does the two states unfold in it. It's not like word by word but something along the lines of some resolution between us or the Palestinians is necessary and in the end would unfold, as it unfolded I want to remind the audience the Yom Kippur war terrible war, terrible cost but on the debris of this war a peace was achieved also the 82 war in Lebanon PLO is being chased away to Tunisia but then we come back to the Oslo Accord. So I think healthy momentum is necessary and Israelis would have to wake up to some healthy momentum we've paying the price in the campaign then I'm not optimistic just because I mean I wanted more than anything in life but I don't expect to see it in my lifetime at this point I think it requires doing a lot of outreach towards the Palestinians over a generation to change their outlook if it's at all possible. I do not think it's possible to reach any lasting agreement under the current circumstances it's much too raw. We didn't have the same hatred between us and the Egyptians as there aren't currently between Israelis and Palestinians that's in the PLO in 82 yeah but we didn't really it didn't solve anything. It has been truly resolved all we did was we were in a process that got the rail historical process they have this length so I don't know if it's in our lifetime but this is the only process possible in the end as a personal note my mother is from Sher Jarach in the old city and she doesn't hold the key for the old house in Sher Jarach. So I think the Palestinians will go pragmatical and practical and what happened in the center of October doesn't do good for their image around the world in many respects along of course there's a lot of support somewhere but in terms of the atrocity that we are committed and they have to wake up and be pragmatical but we also have to have a new kind of pragmatism along the lines of parties like Kadima a new kind of pragmatism in the context of moving forward you can't just hold on to a different position it won't work it won't work also within Israeli society I'm telling you not only with the Palestinians but this can't go forward at all unless the Palestinian society is reformed massively as the poll suggests Mark actually either of you is there a practical, realistic plan to make those reforms I think the Palestinians from the perspective of the Palestinians there was a campaign the Israeli policy was all about the world that there's no such Palestinian case anymore if you wish hold history at bay and not let it move forward of course the Palestinians they played their hands terribly from 1948 on we played it terribly as well we did not put the effort into making their lives really good which is what we should have done we should have made the life in the West Bank heaven so to speak we didn't do that either we succeeded with the Arab Israelis to a very large extent look at where they are in society and how well they're doing we didn't start off well but we've done pretty well in the last 20 years but we did not do that for lots of reasons good reasons, some of them bad reasons with the Palestinians in the West Bank and so on and unless you do something like that over a generation it won't make an effect it's had an effect over a generation with Arab Israelis we have to figure something out with the Palestinians I'll be long gone don't trust we're going to need you in studios we're not going anywhere anytime soon that said we're all hoping it's not too late because the stakes of this war are very much apparent 135 hostages remain in captivity in Gaza held by Hamas since the 7th of October here is more from the fathers of some of the Israelis who were taken hostage waiting for their children to be returned home their stories are heart-wrenching more in this report we're in Al Hanukah and we are still stuck in Simchat Torah when Guy went to the party, he said to me Dad, tomorrow I'm coming back from the party I'll help you dismantle the sucker he didn't come back from the party and I didn't dismantle the sucker and it's still standing here waiting for him to come back so he can help me dismantle it Guy is 22 years old the charming boy such a charmer shows people fall in love with him in a second he has lots and lots of friends and he's missing we miss him very much Guy went to a party one day four friends went and none of them came home two were murdered and two were kidnapped at noon I already saw a video of Guy who was inside Gaza they look frightened there, scared actually, from the moment the negotiations stopped and the fighting restarted how did you feel? I knew that Guy was not supposed to be released in that round because they only talked about women and children but I hoped that when that round was completed they would go, let's say, to the older people and after that to the young people and it would continue like this until they released everyone that's what I imagined and once they returned to fighting it was a very big blow how do you manage to function on a daily basis? with a lot of help not sleeping, not eating in short, not functioning my wife and I would work two jobs each we just left everything we were so busy getting Guy back nothing else matters what I want to hear is that my child is coming home I want to see a slide on TV that says the kidnapped have returned this is what I want to wake up to in the morning tomorrow we keep imagining him coming back to us imagining the phone call we get in the middle of the night telling us, I don't know the IDF suddenly found him they found a room with some prisoners they called us and the officer tells me there is someone who wants to talk to you and I hear Guy he says, dad and we shout Guy to him and run there and we become a family again my son's name is Alon Shomeriz we have no new information about him our Alon is the third son in the family he is six years old a cheerful happy kind hearted boy Alon, along with Ido and Yonatan they were a trio those three did everything together spent time together, travelled together we miss him very much how does your everyday look like? during the day I am busy with public needs and at night the sadness comes and my wife sat and cried during the day slowly we managed to get her out of it she started doing interviews started public activities and that's how we spend the day do you have a message that is important for you to convey? we are a kibbutz which pursued peace we are the people who came to the border and took their patients and drove them to the hospitals in Israel we employed Palestinian citizens in our kibbutz, in our factory and we took care of all their needs we gave them equal treatment like any other worker we don't deserve what they did to us do you feel that there is someone else there to talk to on the other side? I have no doubt not everyone is Yahya Sinwar I want to ask if the return of the hostages during the pause if it gives you something to hope for or is it a different matter? look, first of all, I am happy for everyone who returned on the other hand, I am very very angry with the decision makers in our government everyone should have been released already yes? do you feel that the government is not doing everything to bring them back? I don't trust anyone in our government no one Asa's son is sitting in the tunnel my son is sitting in the tunnel my son has no oxygen my son has half a pizza a day I want my child here tomorrow Doron is a veterinary nurse she is a good girl with friends, many friends the only thing we know since she was kidnapped is the voice message we got four days later from her friends we were also in Doron's room and saw what condition it was in compared to the other rooms remained relatively intact it was a mess because they turned it over and searched and rummaged it but its condition and the voice message she left gave us some sort of hope to hold on to what does everyday life look like now? every day we wake up to a new hope with every message on the phone we jump up maybe there is some news, good news that maybe Doron will come back and what is the hope now? in this round it will happen because if it doesn't, we don't know how to go on we have an important message to pass on when Doron returns we have to take care of her help her recover we have a mission as a family as a society to help her as much as possible to Guy, if you happen to hear me I want to tell you that we love you very much we miss you very very much and we are doing everything to bring you home we will never give up on you and soon we will be together we are together maybe that's sometimes the best we can help for for everyone else though we are out of time we are going to see you again in a half hour for our 4 o'clock local time broadcast until then, thank you very much for watching we will see you again soon the IDF says heavy fighting has continued this morning into the afternoon in northern Gaza, Shajaya and Jabalia areas in Hamas' key stronghold, Khan Yunus in the south of Gaza Israel has reportedly turned to Egypt to negotiate a new hostage deal as Hamas signals potential desperation with senior terror official Musa Abu Marzuk signaling the terrorist government could recognize Israel's existence in order to end the war and could trust them after October 7th is another story entirely in the north the IDF confirms striking a number as Hezbollah sites in southern Lebanon this morning and that a projectile was also fired from Lebanon at an area near the northern community of Shamara Iran has threatened the international community warning of consequences if a multinational force being set up in the Red Sea to protect against attacks on international ships by the Tehran-backed Houthi rebels off the coast of Yemen this comes after the US last week said it may establish just such a naval task force to escort ships and for more we are joined in studio by Colonel Grisha Yacubowitz former head of the civilian department of Koga at the IDF and Israel Palestinian relations expert I want to open with an interesting little piece of information that came out less than a half hour ago this being that Israel is now offering financial bounties for information of Hamas senior leadership $400,000 for Sinwar, $100,000 for Muhammad Dave Is it an effective strategy and why are the numbers so low? Well I don't know if that's effective or not I think this is the second time at this war that Israel does something like that something new actually maybe somebody decided to adopt the United States strategy that was implemented the bounties actually new in the Middle East the United States used it in Iraq I think in Afghanistan in other places I think it never worked or if it did work we don't know about it or maybe we do the numbers $100,000 checkers or $300,000 checkers that's big money in Gaza $100,000 it's $360,000 checkers that's big money in Gaza you can provide the family for five years that's really big money but it's more than that it's also promising them that the family will get will be secured so it's not only the money it's also a possible option for a better future for for the family and for whoever sends the information and we're going to continue after a quick look at some of the fighting in Gaza itself our reporter Jonathan Regev has prepared this report on urban warfare the dangers were made clear in Shajaiya but it hasn't stopped the idea from operating in other areas of the strip now that's Jonathan Regev's report right here with the details only hours after the deadly incident in Shajaiya in the Gaza Strip fighting is ongoing in the Gaza neighborhood of Jabalia a bit further north these soldiers knew way before the Shajaiya incident how dangerous street fighting is but also understand the importance of searching every house this is what is found in one of them a seemingly residential home which is also a terror compound the danger awaits in every corner here is a Hamas terrorist hiding behind the bricks waiting for the right moment to act just before he does a helicopter is called in for the hit despite the dangers there's no replacement for boots on the ground that is why it's important to understand the importance of the danger the danger is the danger is for boots on the ground that is why the forces keep entering these compounds understanding the intelligence gathered here may lead them to more terror cells or possibly even to hostages most of the residents may have left but there are still some civilians here posing a challenge for the IDF which aims to reach every terrorist but not the civilian population we are devoting vast resources to minimizing harm to the civilians that Hamas has forced into the role of human shield our war is against Hamas not against the people of Gaza and that is perhaps the story of this war Israel hopes to minimize civilian casualties even creating safe passages for them but for Hamas every civilian getting killed Israeli or Palestinian is part of its strategy and to understand the situation even more we are joined as well by Major Elliot Shodoff one of our political and military analysts as well as Colonel Grisha you could still in studio with us Elliot I do want to open with you with a piece of information that's been overlooked in our show right now so far and that is the statements made this morning by Marzuk the senior Hamas leader saying that the group could potentially recognize Israel in exchange for their own survival and ending the war and honestly trust Hamas at this point is this just a desperate play for time yes I think you hit the nail on the head Abu Marzuk statement tells us a lot and means very little it tells us how much pressure they're under it tells us how close they feel that Israel is to actually finishing the job and crushing them in Gaza and that's important the meaning is minimal first of all you can't trust them and if the prior experience not only with Hamas but with Batak and the PLO if there's anything to teach us then even when they actually say it they don't really follow it up or mean it I think one of the great examples for us is when Yasser Arafat back in the day during the original Oslo chords and then the Washington tree recognized Israel's existence and first of all let's be clear on this so they recognize Israel's existence in other words so now after decades they recognize reality that in and of itself doesn't mean very much but even afterwards Fatah came out with a declaration saying that Arafat recognized Israel as the head of the PLO but not as the head of Fatah so there's very little behind it let me add one other point to it and Abu Marzouk made this clear and I think it was missed the point was missed on most people he said he would do it for Palestinian unity and that's more a sap to the PLO because in order for Hamas to be accepted into the PLO they of course have to accept the PLO's policies and that includes recognition of Israel so once again it tells us a lot but it means very little and we're going to continue this line of discussion in a brief moment so both of you stay with me but first we are going to get a live view of Gaza where our senior correspondent as well as senior editor Guy Azrael is standing by on the southern border right now to update us with the latest developments on that front Azrael it is a very active fighting scene right behind me we're here in the city of Sterot overlooking the northern tip of the Gaza Strip and we are hearing that heavy fighting as we speak I'm not sure how much can you hear in your microphones but we are hearing automatic fire constant automatic fire at this very hour we've been also hearing drones helicopters as well as Israeli artillery so the fighting is very much still active even in the northern part of the Gaza Strip the neighborhoods just behind me and just slightly further away obviously and of course is that spot where that heavy battle between the Ghulani brigade and Hamas took place two days ago with the very heavy loss of nine Israeli troops that lost their lives in that Hamas compound that was booby trapped to senior IDF commanders the head of the 13 battalion of Ghulani and also an IDF colonel from Ghulani both lost their lives in that incident and emphasis of the fact that while the IDF is attempting to entrench itself also towards the southern part of the Gaza Strip mainly through Chanyunis there is still so much that is going on right now also right here in the north still a lot of work to be done here in other parts of the Strip IDF forces in Chanyunis of taking down about 100 buildings took down 120 terrorists over the past 24 hours and in hospital also have managed to push out several like 70 Hamas terrorists out of the compound we heard from one of the IDF commanders there about that operation maybe let's take a listen okay it looks like we're having some technical issues playing that sound bites that you wanted so we'll hold on let's play it now I think it's working over the last two days fighters from the 460th brigade have been evacuating the Kamal Adwan hospital the hospital had been used as a stronghold for terrorists terrorists had come out of here to harm our forces during the evacuation many weapons were removed from the hospital a lot of terrorists were taken out of the hospital and are currently in custody in Israel over the last two days we have evacuated thousands of civilians from the hospital in order not to harm innocent people yes so that is an emphasis of the ongoing battles the effort to take out those Hamas terrorists obviously many of them hiding in civilian infrastructures in schools in hospitals obviously in underground tunnels as well and all of this of course is happening as the U.S. National Security Advisor Jack Sullivan is in Israel this afternoon he has just concluded a meeting with Israeli Defense Minister Yav Galant he's also meeting with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at this very hour the message that we are getting from Defense Minister Yav Galant is his statement to Sullivan saying this war against Hamas in Gaza will take months this is a very clear message I made the ongoing talks about the pressure presumably from the U.S. to cut this this war short perhaps within the next weeks while Israel makes it very clear it is still a very long way to go from eliminating Hamas it is a war that will take months to do and if the U.S. is supportive of Israel of its goal of eliminating Hamas's military capabilities all along the Gaza Strip then this is what it will need to take obviously with the human toll both in the Gaza Strip but also for the idea of forces as we saw throughout this week since the resumption of the war after that ceasefire two weeks ago there is a lot of fighting going on right now and it will take some time before Hamas is completely eliminated for real. Thank you very much for that report from the front guy we'll be back with you over the rest of our broadcast for more now we are going to return to our discussion with Major Elliott Shodoff as well as Colonel Grisha Yucubovitz both with me right now I want to open with you this time Grisha on the topic of the idea of Palestinian unity that Elliott brought up beforehand and Hamas making a play for that with their recent statements it shows that Hamas might have actually achieved that there is a 90% Palestinians want to get rid of the PA entirely, want to get rid of a boss a massive level of support in the West Bank as well as Gaza for Hamas to be the Palestinian government we keep on talking about the world after the war, the day after the war the day after Hamas that doesn't seem very realistic if the majority of Palestinians want if not Hamas the equivalent thereof one comment if I may and then I will give you the answer first of all, Musab Omar Zouk and I'm not surprised already changed his mind and he just declared 20 minutes ago the following my words were taken out of context surprise, big surprise probably somebody told him that he exaggerated a little bit about Hamas and Fatah the unity let's not forget June 2007 Hamas conquered the Gaza Strip from the unity government by force they executed 300 Fatah officials that were thrown from the roofs in Gaza nobody forgot that nobody talks about it but nobody forgot that and since then we are facing two different Palestinian entities that both of them lead two different narratives Mahmoud Abbas, Abu Mazen the president in the West Bank, Fatah leads a narrative of let's negotiate let's talk let's make or let's create international pressure on Israel and this is how we will reach to our goals and what did he achieve nothing, zero Hamas conquered the Gaza Strip and since then leading four rounds this is the fifth round of escalation with Israel this is a war actually but after each round of escalation they hit something they kidnapped a soldier Gila Chalit Israel released 1025 terrorists one of them is Ivo Sinwar from Gaza he is the mind behind the Black Saturday on October 7 but the people on the ground when they look at it and they say okay so who are our heroes who are the ones that really released the sons from prison who are the ones who succeeded the victories against the enemy the Israelis the Jews Hamas so the narrative of resistance the narrative of Muqawama in Arabic is the leading narrative and we Israel actually helped them to empower this equation that Hamas created that Israel understands only power use power launch rockets you will get something the workers who work in Israel after May 2021 the fourth round of escalation 17 and 500,000 workers from Gaza worked in Israel bringing an income of half billion dollars to Gaza in a year that's a lot of money into Gaza so how did we look at it we said to the western world look at us we are amazing we succeeded to create jobs to people from Gaza and to maybe have an impact on their future so they will see a light of the tunnel and they will say this is not a train coming to crash on them this is actually a better future what was the Hamas explanation to that they told their people look at them they were so afraid from our rockets that they opened the borders for you so when you build a narrative and you create an equation that the narrative works and we help them to pour content into this equation people love heroes by the way we all love heroes who were our presidents who were our prime ministers heroes that fought wars and this is exactly what is happening there they also want to see their leaders that are not corrupted as the PA that they are the heroes who are fighting for Palestine if I may say so but they are also corrupted and this corruption will be shown also so this is unfortunately an unfortunate reality that we will have to make sure that it will not exist anymore after what they did and Elliott I want to build on that with you now if this is the backdrop if they are always going to be looking for martyrs and looking for heroes does Israel have a way to prove to them once and for all on the battlefield that that method will never work I don't know if we will be able to prove to them that it will never work but we can show them that it is extremely costly and more importantly in the short term to utterly destroy the organization called Hamas and here I think we need to separate two ideas or two points one is that Hamas is an organization that can be destroyed and the idea of radical Islam, martyrdom those sorts of things are deeply entrenched in the Palestinian population whether that will disappear after the destruction of Hamas in fact carry it out and I certainly hope that we do is something that remains to be seen populations do change after massive defeat Nazi Germany was a very good example of it but let's remember that in May 1945 Nazi Germany was destroyed Naziism was not we still see it around today not necessarily in the widespread German population but in other places so one destroying Hamas is doable it's important it will be a massive setback and will also be a reverse lesson of what Grisha was talking about earlier and that is now they will look and say okay after all these great victories over the last decade or two or whatever they pushed too far and they really they got destroyed and they brought destruction upon us will that have a long-term thinking conscious effect on the Palestinian population only time will tell and I guess the follow up to that is because it's not simply about uprooting Hamas as an organization but the ideologies that have built Hamas you do still have the issue of the UNRAS schools getting ungodly amounts of international funding to teach children to kill Jews from a young age to teach the ideas of martyrdom and eternal jihad how many different tendrils of this ideology are pumping into the West Bank that will have to be paired back even after Hamas is beaten back it's clear that the UNRAS schools were a branch of Hamas dismantling Hamas and all of its institutions is part of this in other words Hamas is not simply a military organization I use the analogy of Nazi Germany advisedly it wasn't simply the defeat of the German military of the Wehrmacht it was the utter dismantling of the Nazi system so this is not just about beating Isadino Kassam on the battlefield it's about going in dismantling all of their institutions replacing them with others whether they're international or UN but observing and monitoring what's going on inside of them clearly if we go back to the institutions as they were prior to this war we're going to be back in the same boat in the year two three or whatever absolutely and I want to follow up on that very briefly though because we only have about a minute to do so when we're talking about Nazi Germany the example used the Marshall Plan which is going to require effectively trillions of dollars to rebuild Europe after the war who has that sort of plan here the world has a plan America is talking about it obviously rebuilding Gaza is not the same thing as rebuilding Europe in terms of geography extent economics if they just take the money away from the leaders in Qatar they can put 12 billion on the ground right away so there's no money for it I don't think there's any question that the Europeans will certainly kick in money the Arab world will kick in money I think that's the least of the problems actually thank you very much for helping us understand all of the various factors Elliott, Bershap, both of you for helping the audience understand all of it and we're going to continue with our coverage our correspondent Eri Shapira toward the headquarters of a sound company in Israel that worked with many prominent artists but they were located in Kfar Gaza on the Gaza border they lost some of their members who died during the attacks on October 7 two more abducted into Gaza this tale of one Israeli company is a tale that shines true for much of Israel right now let's take a look the lights turned off on October 7 in Sincopa one of the biggest lighting and sound companies in Israel the company located in Kfar Gaza border was severely damaged to employees Nitzan Leipstein and Yuval Solomon were murdered in the Hamas onslaught twin brothers Ziv and Gali Berman were abducted Ziv and Gali are the heart of Sincopa family wonderful kids full of energy everyone who looked at them fell in love with them in a second Sincopa was established in 2002 by a member of Kibbutz Kfar Gaza as opposed to other main companies in the Tel Aviv area he decided to set his company in the Gaza envelope area this company is like a family to us we're doing all the big concerts together it doesn't matter when you come to work or what you do there there's always someone here to take care of you what started as a small local company became a prestigious and big sound and lighting enterprise which provides services to some of the top concerts in Israel such as the Rolling Stones in 2014 and Radiohead in 2017 throughout the years the company also knew some challenges especially in times of tension in Gaza and Israel we had times when we had to work under rocket attacks unfortunately it became a routine here that you learn to live with Sincopa was in its peak before October 7 with great plans ahead we were supposed to come back on Sunday October 8 to work here on Friday night trucks came here and brought back equipment from the Tamar Festival luckily no one was here on October 7 otherwise things would have been much worse only a few weeks ago the company returned to work the project Sincopa was involved in was the exhibition in memory of the victims of the Nova Party which recently opened in Tel Aviv it wasn't simple to walk on this exhibition and see their burned cars tens of people it was very chilling I drove the road to Reim you can still see traces from the party it is beyond understanding it doesn't matter how many videos and pictures you saw once you see it live nothing compares to that despite the many tragedies and the heavy rain employees of Sincopa continue to work this time it's preparing a tribute show for the fallen held in the Eshkol region not too far from here Sincopa is my home it's my community so coming back to work after such a long time reminds me of all times that feeling of the community and the envelope area working with my friends it feels like coming back home I have mixed feelings on one hand it's a good feeling to go back to work and to do the thing that you are best at and what you like the most but I also feel bad about the people we lost no matter where you walk here you're looking for Ziv and Gali it wasn't a single day that we didn't catch up with each other everything is very bad some of Sincopa's equipment was moved to another studio in central Israel meanwhile the workers say they'll continue to work here after all the show must go on I'm going to return to Grisha here in the studio in the last minute that we have left because you want to address some of the points that we had made in the discussion before with Elliot well a minute will not be enough I will try to do my best the Marshall Plan the people of Germany with the people of Gaza we are talking about a different culture a different religion different beliefs and we need to understand that any change in Gaza yes I agree that ideology will not disappear so Hamas the idea will not disappear and to change the reality on the ground you need a generation at least so the money that will flow to Gaza when it will happen must flow with conditions it means for every dollar that will enter to Gaza they will need to prove that there's no incitement in schools no incitement in kindergartens it's going to be a tough call Grisha thank you very much for the explanation for everyone else we are out of time we'll see you in a half hour 5 o'clock local time Israel is in a state of war families completely done down in their beds why the hour is she as our soldiers are fighting on the front line but the general perception is something that certainly needs to be fought as well 24 news is ongoing coverage of Israel at war I'm Ariel Levin-Waldman the IDF says heavy fighting has continued this morning into the afternoon in northern Gaza, Shajaiya and Jabalia areas in Hamas' key stronghold Hanyunas in the south of Gaza Israel has reportedly turned to Egypt to negotiate a new hospital for the children in the south of Gaza Israel has reportedly turned to Egypt to negotiate a new hospital as Hamas signals potential desperation with senior terror official Musa Abu Marzuk signaling the terrorist government could recognize Israel's existence in order to end the war but who could trust them after October 7th is another story entirely in the north the IDF confirms striking a number as Hezbollah sites in southern Lebanon this morning and that a projectile was also fired from Lebanon at an area near the northern community of Shomera Iran has threatened the international community warning of consequences if a multinational force being set up in the Red Sea to protect against attacks on international ships by the Tehran-backed Houthi rebels off the coast of Yemen this comes after the US last week said it may establish just such a naval task force to escort ships and for more we are joined in studio by Colonel Grisha Yacubowitz the head of the civilian department of Koga at the IDF and Israel-Palestinian relations expert I want to open with an interesting little piece of information that came out less than a half hour ago this being that Israel is now offering financial bounties for information that leads to the capture of Hamas senior leadership $400,000 for Sinwar $100,000 for Mohammed Dave is an effective strategy and why are the numbers so low well I don't know if that's effective I think this is the second time at this war that Israel does something like that something new actually maybe somebody decided to adopt the United States strategy that was implemented the bounties actually it's not something new in the Middle East the United States used it in Iraq I think in Afghanistan and other places I think it never worked if it did work we don't know about it or maybe we do the numbers 100,000 checkers 300,000 checkers that's big money in Gaza $100,000 it's 360,000 checkers that's big money in Gaza you can provide the family for 5 years that's really big money but it's more than that it's also promising them that the family will be secured so it's not only the money it's also a possible option for a better future for the family and for whoever sends the information and we're going to continue after a quick look at some of the fighting in Gaza itself our reporter Jonathan Regev has prepared this report on urban warfare the dangers were made clear in Shajaya but it hasn't stopped the idea from operating in other areas of the strip Jonathan Regev's report right here with the details only hours after the deadly incident in Shajaya in the Gaza strip fighting is ongoing in the Gaza neighborhood of Jabalia a bit further north these soldiers knew way before the Shajaya incident how dangerous street fighting is but also understand the importance of searching every house this is what is found in one of them a seemingly residential home which is also a terror compound in Shajaya Khayunis, Ramal and Jabalia our troops found large weapons depots and tunnels in multiple schools there was even a sniper rifle hidden inside a teddy bear we found an RPG training facility inside a mosque in Jabalia to name only a few the danger awaits in every corner here is a Hamas terrorist hiding behind the bricks waiting for the right moment to act just before he does a helicopter is called in for the hit there is no replacement for boots on the ground that is why the forces keep entering these compounds understanding the intelligence gathered here may lead them to more terror cells or possibly even to hostages most of the residents may have left but there are still some civilians here posing a challenge for the IDF which aims to reach every terrorist but not the civilian population we are devoting vast resources to minimizing harm to the civilians Hamas has forced into the role of human shield our war is against Hamas not against the people of Gaza and that is perhaps the story of this war Israel hopes to minimize civilian casualties even creating safe passages for them but for Hamas every civilian getting killed Israeli or Palestinian is part of its strategy and to understand the situation even more we are joined as well by Major Elliott Schodoff one of our political and military analysts as well as Colonel Grisha you could what's still in studio with us Elliott I do want to open with you with a piece of information that's been overlooked in our show right now so far and that is the statements made this morning by Marzouk the senior Hamas leader saying that the group could potentially recognize Israel in exchange for their own survival and ending the war who can honestly trust Hamas at this point is this just a desperate play for time yes I think you hit the nail on the head Abu Marzouk statement tells us a lot and means very little it tells us how much pressure they're under it tells us how close they feel that Israel is to actually finishing the job and crushing them in Gaza and that's important the meaning is minimal first of all you can't trust them and if the prior experience not only with Hamas but with Patak and the PLO has anything to teach us then even when they actually say it they don't really follow it up or mean it I think one of the great examples for us is when Yasser Arafat back in the day during the original Oslo courts in the Washington tree recognized Israel's existence and first of all let's be clear on this so they recognize Israel's existence in other words so now after decades they recognize reality that that didn't of itself doesn't mean very much but even afterwards Fatah came out with a declaration saying that Arafat recognized Israel as the head of the PLO Fatah so there's very little behind it let me add one other point to it and Abou Marzouk made this clear and I think it was missed the point was missed on most people he said he would do it for Palestinian unity and that's more a sop to the PLO because in order for Hamas to be accepted into the PLO they of course have to accept the PLO's policies and that includes recognition of Israel so once again that's not what it means very little and we're going to continue this line of discussion in a brief moment so both of you stay with me but first we are going to get a live view of Gaza where our senior correspondent as well as senior editor Guy Azriel is standing by on the southern border right now to update us with the latest developments on that front Arielle it is a very active fighting scene right behind me we're here in the city of Sterot overlooking the northern tip of the Gaza Strip and we are hearing that heavy fighting as we speak I'm not sure how much can you hear in your microphones but we are hearing automatic fire, constant automatic fire at this very hour we've been also hearing drones, helicopters as well as Israeli artillery so the fighting is very much still active even in the northern part of the Gaza Strip the neighborhoods just behind me Beth Hanun, Beth Laia and just slightly further away obviously Sajaea and Jibalia Sajaea of course is that spot where that heavy battle between the Ghulani Brigade and Hamas took place two days ago with the very heavy loss of nine Israeli troops that lost their lives in that Hamas compound that was booby trapped two senior IDF commanders the head of the 13th battalion of Ghulani and also an IDF colonel from Ghulani both lost their lives in that incident and emphasis of the fact that while the IDF is attempting to entrench itself also towards the southern part of the Gaza Strip mainly through Hanunis there is still so much that is going on right now also right here in the north still a lot of work to be done elsewhere in other parts of the Strip IDF forces in Hanunis have taken down about 100 buildings took down 120 terrorists over the past 24 hours and in hospital also have managed to push out several like 70 Hamas terrorists out of the compound we heard from one of the IDF commanders there about that operation let's take a listen okay looks like we're having some technical issues playing that sound bites that you wanted so hold on let's play it now I think it's working over the last two days fighters from the 460th brigade have been evacuating the Kamal Adwan hospital the hospital had been used as a stronghold for terrorists terrorists had come out of here to harm our forces during the evacuation many weapons were removed from the hospital a lot of terrorists have been out of the hospital and are currently in custody in Israel over the last two days we have evacuated thousands of civilians from the hospital in order not to harm innocent people yes so that is an emphasis of the ongoing battles the effort to take out those Hamas terrorists obviously many of them hiding in civilian infrastructures in schools in hospitals obviously in underground tunnels and all of this of course is happening as the US National Security Advisor Jack Sullivan is in Israel this afternoon he has just concluded a meeting with Israeli Defense Minister Yav Galant he's also meeting with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at this very hour the message that we are getting from Defense Minister Yav Galant is his statement to Sullivan saying this war against Hamas in Gaza will take months this is a very clear message the ongoing talks about the pressure presumably from the US to cut this war short perhaps within the next weeks well Israel makes it very clear it is still a very long way to go from eliminating Hamas it is a war that will take months to do and if the US is supportive of Israel of its goal of eliminating Hamas's capabilities all along the Gaza Strip then this is what it will need to take obviously with the human toll both in the Gaza Strip but also for the idea of forces as we saw throughout this week since the resumption of the war after that ceasefire two weeks ago there is a lot of fighting going on right now and it will take some time before Hamas completely eliminated thank you very much for that report from the front guy we'll be back with you over the rest of our broadcast for more now we are going to return to our discussion with Major Elliott Shodoff as well as Colonel Grisha Yucubovitz both with me right now I want to open with you this time Grisha on the topic of the idea of Palestinian unity that Elliott brought up beforehand and Hamas making a play for that with their recent statements according to recent polling it shows that Hamas might have actually achieved that there's a 90% Palestinians want to get rid of the PA entirely want to get rid of a boss a massive level of support in the West Bank as well as Gaza for Hamas to be the Palestinian government we keep on talking about the world after the war day after the war the day after Hamas that doesn't seem very realistic if the majority of Palestinians if not Hamas the equivalent thereof one comment if I may and then I will give you the answer first of all Moussab Omar Zouk and I'm not surprised already changed his mind and he just declared 20 minutes ago the following my words were taken out of context surprise big surprise probably somebody told him that he exaggerated a little bit about Hamas and Fatah the unity okay let's not forget June 2007 Hamas conquered the Gaza Strip from the unity government by force they executed 300 Fatah officials that were thrown from the roofs in Gaza nobody forgot that nobody talks about it but nobody forgot that and since then we are facing two different Palestinian entities that both of them lead two different narratives Mahmoud Abbas Abu Mazen the president in the West Bank Fatah leads a narrative of let's negotiate let's talk let's let's make or let's create international pressure on Israel and this is how we will reach to our goals and what did he achieve nothing zero Hamas conquered the Gaza Strip and since then leading four rounds this is the fifth round of escalation with Israel this is a war actually but after each round of escalation they achieved something they kidnapped a soldier Gila Chalit Israel released 1025 terrorists one of them is Ivo Sinwar from Gaza he is the the mind behind the Black Saturday on October 7th but the people on the ground when they look at it and they say okay so who are our heroes who are the ones that really released the sons from prison who are the ones who succeeded to achieve the victories against the enemy the Israelis the Jews Hamas so the narrative of resistance the narrative of Muqawama in Arabic is the leading narrative and we Israel actually helped them to empower this equation that Hamas created that Israel understands only power use power launch rockets you will get something the workers who work in Israel after May 2021 the fourth round of escalation 17 and 500 thousand workers from Gaza worked in Israel bringing an income of half billion dollars to Gaza in a year that's a lot of money into Gaza so how did we look at it we said to the western world look at us we are amazing we succeeded to create jobs to people from Gaza and to maybe maybe have an impact on their future so it will they will see the light and the end of the tunnel and they would say this is not a train coming to crash on them this is actually a better future what was the Hamas explanation to that they told their people look at them they were so afraid from our rockets that they opened the borders for you okay so when you build a narrative and you create an equation that the narrative works and we help them to to pour content into this equation people love heroes by the way we all love heroes who were our presidents who were our prime ministers heroes that fought wars and this is exactly what is happening there they also want to see their leaders that are not corrupted as the PA that they are the heroes who are fighting for Palestine if I may say so but they are also corrupted and this corruption is shown also so this is unfortunately an unfortunate reality that we will have to make sure that it will not exist anymore after what they did and Elliott I want to build on that with you now if this is the backdrop if they are always going to be looking for martyrs and looking for heroes does Israel have a way to prove to them once and for all on the battlefield that that will never work I don't know if we'll be able to prove to them that it will never work but we can show them that it's extremely costly and more importantly in the short term to utterly destroy the organization called Hamas and here I think we need to separate two ideas or two points one is that Hamas is an organization that can be destroyed and the idea of radical Islam and martyrdom those sorts of things are deeply entrenched in the Palestinian population whether that will disappear after the destruction of Hamas in fact carry it out and I certainly hope that we do is something that remains to be seen populations do change after massive defeat Nazi Germany was a very good example of it but let's remember that in May 1945 Nazi Germany was destroyed Nazism was not, we still see it around today not necessarily in the widespread German population but in other places so one destroying Hamas is doable, it's important it will be a massive setback and will also be a reverse lesson of what Grisha was talking about earlier and that is now they will look and say okay after all these great victories over the last decade or two or whatever ultimately they pushed too far and they really they got destroyed and they brought destruction upon us will that have a long term thinking conscious effect on the Palestinian population only time will tell and I guess the follow up to that is because it's not simply about uprooting Hamas as an organization but the ideologies that have built Hamas do you do still have the issue of Unra schools getting ungodly amounts of international funding to teach children to kill Jews from a young age to teach the ideas of martyrdom and eternal jihad how many different tendrils of this ideology are pumping into Gaza are pumping into the west bank that will have to be paired back even after Hamas is beaten back it's clear that the Unra schools were a branch of Hamas dismantling Hamas and all of its institutions is part of this in other words Hamas is not simply a military organization I use the analogy of Nazi Germany advisedly it wasn't simply the defeat of the German military of the Wehrmacht it was the utter dismantling of the Nazi system so this is not just about beating is a DNL Kasam on the battlefield it's about going in dismantling all of their institutions replacing them with others whether they're international or UN but observing and monitoring what's going on inside of them clearly if we go back to the institutions as they were prior to this war we're going to be back in the same boat in the year two three or whatever absolutely and I want to follow up very briefly though because we only have about a minute to do so when we're talking about Nazi Germany the example used the Marshall Plan required for decades it required effectively trillions of dollars to rebuild Europe after the war who has that sort of plan here I am the world has a plan America is talking about it obviously rebuilding Gaza is not the same thing as rebuilding Europe in terms of geography extent economics if they just take the money away from the leaders in Qatar they can put 12 billion on the ground right away so there's money for it I don't think there's any question that the Europeans will certainly kick in money the Arab world will kick in money I think that's the least of the problems actually okay well thank you very much for helping us understand all the various factors Elliott Bershup both of you for helping the audience understand all of it and we're going to continue with our coverage our correspondent Eri Shapira toward the headquarters of a sound company in Israel that works with many prominent artists but they were located in Kfar Azza on the Gaza border they lost some of their members to died during the attacks on October 7th two more abducted into Gaza this tale of one Israeli company is a tale that shines true for much of Israel right now let's take a look close to the Gaza border was severely damaged to employees Nitzan Lipstein and Yuval Solomon were murdered in the Hamas onslaught twin brothers Ziv and Gali Berman were abducted Ziv and Gali are the heart of Sincopa family wonderful kids full of energy everyone who looked at them fell in love with them in a second Sincopa was established in 2002 by a member of Kibbutz Kfar Azza as opposed to other main companies in the Tel Aviv area he decided to set his company in the Gaza envelope area this company is like a family to us we're doing all the big concerts together it doesn't matter when you come to work or what you do there there's always someone here to take care of you what started as a small local company became a prestigious and big sound and lighting enterprise which provides services to some of the top concerts in Israel such as the Rolling Stones in 2014 and Radiohead in 2017 throughout the years the company also knew some challenges especially in times of tension in Gaza and Israel we had times when we had to work under rocket attacks unfortunately it became a routine here that you learn to live with Sincopa was in its peak before October 7 with great plans ahead we were supposed to come back on Sunday October the 8th to work here on Friday night trucks came here and brought back equipment from the Tamar Festival luckily no one was here on October the 7th otherwise things would have been much worse only a few weeks ago the company returned to work one of the projects Sincopa was involved in was the exhibition in memory of the victims of the Nova Party which recently opened in Tel Aviv it wasn't simple to walk on this exhibition you see there burned cars tens of people it was very chilling I drove the road to Reim you can still see traces from the party it is beyond understanding it doesn't matter how many videos and pictures you saw once you see it live nothing compares to that despite the many tragedies and the heavy rain employees of Sincopa continue to work this time it's preparing a tribute show for the fallen held in the Eshkol region not too far from here Sincopa is my home it's my community so coming back to work after such a long time reminds me of all times that feeling of the community the Gaza envelope area working with my friends it feels like coming back home I have mixed feelings on one hand it's a good feeling to go back to work to do the thing that you are best at and what you like the most but I also feel bad about the people we lost no matter where you walk here you're looking for Ziv and Gali there wasn't a single day that we didn't catch up with each other our feeling is very bad some of Sincopa's equipment was moved to another studio in central Israel meanwhile the workers say they'll continue to work here after all the show must go on I'm going to return to Grisha here in the studio in the last minute that we have left because you want to address some of the points that we had made in the discussion before with Elliott well a minute will not be enough I will try to do my best the Marshall Plan the people of Germany with the people of Gaza we are talking about a different culture different religion, different beliefs and we need to understand that any change in Gaza yes I agree that ideology cannot be just will not disappear so Hamas the idea will not disappear and to change the reality on the ground you need a generation at least so the money that will flow to Gaza will not disappear