Hello, you guys. Welcome to the live stream. It's Coach Yuri and Melody, Lady Starfish. We're just going to wait a few more minutes so that we can make sure that people are hopping on. And other than that, we'll be starting very soon. So excited to update you guys and have a little chat. Hello, Melody. Where are you in the world? I am currently in Canada. Where are you? I'm in Bali, Indonesia. I feel like we've both been hopping around all over. Okay, so we'll just wait just a few more minutes, but I'm really excited to have this chat today. And yeah, update our people. Hello.  Where are you coming from? Please share with us what city, what country, what part of the world. It would be so wonderful to know who's all here, what part of the world. And we have some amazing things planned for the next hour or so. Join us. Join us. Join us. Hello, hello. Wow, look at where everyone is. Got India, Palestine. Happy Ramadan to those of you who celebrate Ramadan. Hope you're fasting well. Take care of yourselves. That's that's where you are. Hi. Texas, Houston, New York. There's some Americans here, Canada. There's some people from Canada. That's where Melody is right now. So we'll get started in just a little bit. For those of you who don't know, this is actually a pretty special meeting in so many ways. And we'll go into this in just a little bit.  And we actually went live, Melody and I, we went live on psych to go during the pandemic of all time, when we're both in Korea, we got to meet. And so we're going to be sharing a little bit about what happened then what happened since then, and give you guys a little bit of an update and share a passion to really, you know, eliminate stigma around mental health and also advocate for healthy mindset healthy mental health today. And we'll talk about all that today and how in this specific chat is going to be about how to turn pain into power, and also incorporating spirituality, which is kind of a woo woo topic but there's some things are going to be talking about that's going to be really powerful. I love you guys too. Thank you so much for being here. So we'll get started in just a few minutes here. Hey, silly. Good to see you guys. I'm a little bit on the shy side so I'm a little bit quieter but thank you Yuri to for bleeding this discussion and I'm really excited to have a conversation with you and with everyone because we're also watching the comments so don't don't Don't need to be shy like me. Feel free to ask questions if you like or comment on anything that you resonate with or Yeah, that feels relevant to you. Religion spirituality. We're not necessarily diving into religious talk today. I think there's a little bit of a difference between the two.  We'd love to talk a little bit more about just like talking about things can clear up the air world we all wonder sometimes. Hi, are we answering questions we won't be answering just So there's like all these different religions and then people who are like not religious but you can still be spiritual so this is like the whole thing we're going to be talking about your little diagram. Visuals are helpful. All right, so let's get started melody. So melody. Let's talk a little bit about you. So first of all, we call her Lady Starfish because she has a clan that she started. And we'll talk about that today. And sorry, I'm getting distracted by some of the chats here. So I'm looking at this at the same time. So we'll be talking about today, you know, your project with starfish and how you're creating impact around mental health in your own beautiful way and powerful way. So we'll talk about that. We'll talk about what she's been up to in the last year and a half how we met. We'll talk about you know spirituality. And again, this isn't about religion. This is actually about something bigger. It's about being our connection to the universe connection to the world connection to your God. So everyone is, you know, able to participate in this without thinking that this is exclusive to one religion or not. We'll be talking about how that can affect our mental health in a positive way, and you can interpret it in your own way. We'll be talking about we'll be sharing a story, both melody story as well as a cool story that I want to share with you guys today. But we'll start with the introductions and by the way you guys you're hopping on right now please feel free to share where you're hopping in from we would love to know we would love to know where you guys are coming from. And that's actually just like you know one thing I love to do when I do these kind of live streams is just to really connect with you guys on an energetic level, set an intention for the next hour together. And we get to really meet there first. So I would love to set the intention of service to be of service to you guys to melody and the starfish clan and everyone. Also, to be in gratitude. What's your intention for today melody. My intention for today and also I wish I am seeing you guys there. Hi, and hello everyone. My intention for today, I did meditate on this a little before and that's it's going to touch into the spiritual piece that we're talking about today, but sometimes I don't know if you guys can relate if you can relate just comment about it. I can overthink a lot, and I can over complicate things a lot. So, today I just want to be present and be simple and shed light and whatever that means I'm leaving it kind of vague, because being is also pretty vague, but shed light on topics shed light in general and spread good vibes. That's my intention. I am here to connect with Yuri, and I'm here to connect with all of you guys. Yeah, I also struggle with complex PTSD. We can touch upon many things but I see you savage Sam, and I also overthink a lot. So that's my intention I just want to be, I just want to be present and have this conversation with all of you and Yuri. I feel pretty grounded right now, but I don't know if you guys also experienced this when you're really really nervous before you do something and it's like stage fright, and then the moment you're in the flow or you're, you're up there you kind of feel a little bit better and that's kind of how I feel right now. I'm just really happy to be here with you guys and talk about stuff. So thank you Yuri. I also is it all right if I introduce you a little bit. Sure. And by the way, somebody asked will you answer a question in comments too. We will try our best. There's a lot of, you know, comments coming up. So we'll definitely review any questions, comments and showing up to our best ability during this chat and also after so either in this live chat or below so feel free to comment feel free to ask us any questions feel free to share anything that you really got out of this. That would really help us feel connected to you guys so please ask away we'll do our best whether it's now or later or in a later video even so feel free to share what is coming up for you guys as this comes up so And then really quickly before we get started I would love for you guys to just share. If you've been on my life so you know this is kind of a ritual. What are you grateful for today. What are you grateful for today. And what is your intention for today for the next 60 minutes. I love that there's all these people from your clan starfish clan. So, you're grateful for food oh my gosh me too I just ate right before this. I love reading what you guys are sharing. Everything I love it for a best friend. Grateful for my best friends. I see a lot of overthinking relating there over analysis I totally got you anxiety I am not a stranger to either. What else are you grateful that thank you we're grateful you exist to it's a mutual feeling. And grateful we're still breathing that's so beautiful grateful for my family me too. Nice to stay grateful for getting a job okay so instantly notice this. There's been research that really just acknowledging what is what we are grateful for intentionalizing like you know counting our blessings really do should and our mental health in a powerful way. So this is this is good I don't know if you guys feel this but already I feel the energy lifting getting lighter and brighter so I'm excited to meet you guys there. Okay cool so let's get started. And yeah, so did you want to start do you want me to start up to you. Well, I can introduce you, but again, thank you guys for responding and everything. I just wanted to introduce Miss Yuri because I'm really grateful for her that's what I'm grateful for there's a lot of things I'm grateful for. And I also want to share that I've been doing a daily gratitude streak so I'm on day 159 today of finding at least one thing I'm grateful for every day. Miss Yuri I am grateful for she's my life coach and something she's personally taught me that I think was really helpful was how to daydream again. I think we get so stuck in our negativity. We forget to dream and to look forward to the future we just get scared about the future which is what anxiety is right.  She is our life coach, and she works with entrepreneurs and high achievers. She also as an author has written a bunch of books her recent one being creating true happiness. It is a good book. I do recommend I read the whole thing. Yeah, she's also passionate about health advocacy which is kind of where I guess I get pulled in she works with a lot of different types of individuals but here on psych to go we talk about that mental health piece and I'm just really glad to be able to do this with you. So yeah. Yeah, thank you. Yeah. Thank you so much for the introduction. Yeah, so melody is a dear soul sister as well as dear soul client of mine. We met through our friend Leonard a long time ago in Korea during the pandemic. And when I saw her I just knew that we were going to work together not like work together but like I knew we were going to collaborate and somehow I saw this potential in her that I don't think she even saw for herself yet. And I could see that everything that she was going through at the time was going to be such a powerful part of her story. So I'm just really grateful that I got to work with you got to connect you and psych to go. And that was in 2020 right 2020 or 2021 where we got to live stream. And yeah, in the last year and a half you've really just run with your mission to serve the world and create impact positively with your community that you created from that day.   She's amazing. So I'm really excited to share her transformation, and so on. So we'll be talking about all of that today on. So yeah, let's get started with this so I think you know before we talked about this last time that we had a live stream like this we started out with a story. It was really powerful. And today, we actually wanted to start with the story around forgiveness that this is one of my favorite stories in the world.  So with that said how many of you guys have aspects of yourself that you can forgive and let go. If you have something say, I forgive myself in the chat. Forgive myself. There's something that you want to forgive aspects of yourself reading lame. I promise it'll be really powerful. I can forgive and let go. Yes, yes, yes, yes. You don't feel comfortable enough to share out loud or publicly, even if you can think inside yourself or you have a journal nearby if you can write down something that you want to even if you can't forgive yourself. At least identify something that you want to forgive yourself for. Yeah, that's really powerful. And if there is somebody other than yourself. Yes. I found that in my own journey while I see you guys responding here. We are mirrors and we project what we're going through. So if there's someone else in your life that's really difficult to forgive and if you can identify that person. I find that it's hard to forgive others if I also don't know how to forgive the worst parts of myself and something I've been working on, particularly in the last two years, especially since the last live stream was forgiving my father. And I'll probably go into this a little bit more but I just want to share with you guys a large part of why I'm a mental health advocate is because I lost my father to suicide. And so I've spent a lot of time thinking about what drives a person to a place like that. And I've had to forgive him for leaving, right? And then we have abandonment issues and all these things and then anxiety like what is my future going to look like.  And yeah, I guess I guess just identify that person and identify pieces in yourself. Those are things that have helped me, at least come to terms with my anxiety and other parts of, I guess, my brokenness and being lost growing up. So, yeah, that's that's a little bit there. I see what you guys are saying here. This is super beautiful. Yeah. So think about that person that you can forgive today. Like another person outside of yourself, and then aspects of yourself that you want to forgive because we all have those aspects, but also somebody that you can forgive. And with that person in mind today, I'm going to read you a story and I promise it's a really powerful story. It's by somebody who wrote on a really beautiful book called Conversation with God. His name is Neil Donald Walsh, but this story is called The Little Soul and the Sun.  So if you're ready to listen to this. In any time during the story, something resonates. I want you to say forgiveness is power. In the chat. Let us know that it's resonating with you. Let us feel connected to you. Thank you guys for reading what you say when you read the story. Once upon no time, there was a little soul who said to God, I know who I am. And God said, that's wonderful. Who are you? And the little soul shouted, I am the light.  That's right. God exclaimed, you are the light. The little soul was so happy for had figured out what all souls in the kingdom were there to figure out. Wow, said the little soul. This is really cool. But soon knowing who it was was not enough. The little soul felt stirrings inside and now wanted to be who it was. And so the little soul went back to God, which is not a bad idea for all souls who want to be who they really are. And said, hi God, now that I know who I am, is it okay for me to be it?  Well, replied the little soul, it's one thing to know who I am and another thing altogether to actually be it. I want to feel what it's like to be the light. But you already are the light, God repeated, smiling again. Yes, but I want to see what that feels like, cried the little soul. Well, said God with a chuckle, I suppose I should have known you're always, you always were the adventurous one. Then God's expression changed. There's only one thing. What? Asked the little soul. Well, there's nothing else but the light. You see, I created nothing but what you are.  Huh? But the little soul was now a little confused. Think of it this way, said God, you're like a candle in the sun. Oh, you're there, all right, along with a million gazillion other candles who make up the sun. And the sun would not be the sun without you. Nay, it wouldn't be a sun without one of its candles. And that would not be the sun at all for it would not shine as brightly. Yet how to know yourself as a light when you are in this delight? That is the question. Well, the little soul perked up, you're God, think of something. Once more, God smile, I already have, God said. Since you cannot see yourself as a light when you are in the light will surround you with darkness. What's darkness, the little soul asked. God replied, it is which you are not. Will I be afraid of the dark, cried the little soul. Only if you choose to be, God answered. There's nothing really to be afraid of unless you decide that there is. You see, we're making it all up, we're pretending. Oh, set the little soul and felt better already. Then God explained that in order to experience anything at all, the exact opposite of it will appear. It is a great gift, God said, because without it, you could not know what anything is like. You could not know warm without cold, up without down, fast without slow. You could not know left without right, here without there, now without then.   Then you will know who you really are and all others will know too. Let your light shine so that everyone will know how special you are. You mean it's okay to let others see how special I am? Asked the little soul. Of course, God chuckled. It's very okay. But remember, special does not mean better. Everybody is special, each in their own way. Yet many others have forgotten that. They will see that it's okay for them to be special, only when you see that it is okay for you to be special. Wow, set the little soul dancing and skipping and laughing and jumping with joy. I can be as special as I want to be? Yes, and you can start right now, said God, who's dancing and skipping and laughing right along the little soul. What part of special do you want to be? What part of special, the little soul repeated. I don't understand. Well, God explained, being the light is being special and being special has a lot of parts to it. It's special to be kind, special to be gentle, special to be creative, special to be patient. Can you think of any other ways to be special? The little soul sat partly for a moment. I can think of lots of ways to be special, the little soul claimed. It is special to be helpful. It is special to be sharing. It is special to be friendly. It is special to be considered of others. Yes, God agreed. And you can be all of those things or any part of special that you want to be. At any moment, that's what it means to be the light. I know what I want to be. I know what I want to be. The little soul announced with great excitement. I want to be the part of special called forgiving. Isn't it special to be forgiving? Oh, yes. God assured the little soul that is very special. Okay, said the little soul. That's exactly what I want to be. I want to be forgiving. I want to experience myself as that. Good, said God. But there's one thing you should know. The little soul was becoming a bit impatient now. It always seemed as though there was some complication. What is it? The little soul sighed. There's no one to forgive. No one. The little soul could hardly believe what had been said. No one, God repeated. Everything I have made is perfect. There's not a single soul in all creation less perfect than you. Look around you. It was then that the little soul realized a large crowd had gathered. Souls had come from far and wide from all over the kingdom. For the word had gone forth that the little soul was having this extraordinary conversation with God. And everyone wanted to hear what they were saying. Looking at the countless other souls gathered there, the little soul had to agree. None appeared less wonderful, less magnificent, less perfect than the little soul itself. Such was the wonder of the soul gathered around. And so bright their light that the little soul could scarcely gaze upon. Who then to forgive? Asked God. Boy, this is going to be no fun at all, grumbled the little soul. I wanted to experience myself as the one who forgives. I wanted to know what part of special that is like. Can you guys hear me okay? Yep, dipped out just a little bit. We're good to hear you. Okay. Not to worry a little soul, who then to forgive? Asked God. Boy, this is going to be no fun at all, grumbled the little soul. I want myself as the one who forgives. I wanted to know what that part of special feels like. And the little soul learned what it must feel like to be sad. But just then a friendly soul stepped forward from the crowd. Not to worry a little soul, the friendly soul said, I will help you. You will, the little soul brightened. But what can you do? Why? I can give you something someone to forgive. You can. Certainly, chirped the friendly soul. I can come into your next life and do something for you to forgive. But why? Why would you do that? The little soul asked. You who are being of such utter perfection.  What could cause you to want to slow down your vibration to such a speed that your light, your bright light would become dark and dense? What could cause you who are so light and you dance upon the stars and move through the kingdom with the speed of your thought to come into my life and make yourself so heavy that you could do this bad thing? Simple, the friendly soul said. I would do it because I love you. The little soul seemed surprised to the answer. Don't be so amazed at the friendly soul. You have done the same thing for me. Don't you remember? Oh, we have danced together. You and I many times through the eons and across all the ages have we danced across all the time. And in many places have we played together. We just don't remember. We have both been all of it. We've been up and down of it. The left and the right of it. We have been here and the there of it. The now and the then of it. We have been the male and the female. The good and the bad. We have both been the victim and the villain of it. Does we, does have we come together? You and I many times before each bringing to other the exact and perfect opportunity to express and experience who we really are. And so the friendly soul explained further. I will come into your next lifetime and be the bad one this time. I will do something really terrible and then you can experience yourself as the one who forgives. But what will you do? The little soul asked just a little nervously. That will be so terrible. Oh, reply the friendly soul with a twinkle. We'll think of something. Then the friendly soul seemed to turn serious and said in a quiet voice. You're right about one thing, you know. What is that the little soul wanted to know? I will have slowed down my vibration and become very heavy to do this not so nice thing. I will have to pretend to be something very unlike myself. And so I have but one favor to ask of it in return. This part always makes me cry. Oh, anything, anything cried the little soul and began to dance and sing. I get to be forgiving. I get to be forgiving. Then the little soul saw the friendly soul was remaining very quiet. What is it? The little soul asked, what can I do for you? You're such an angel to be willing to do this for me. Of course, this friendly soul is an angel got interrupted. Everyone's always remember, I have sent you nothing but angels. And so the little soul wanted more than ever to grant the friendly soul's request. What can I do for you? The little soul asked again. In the moment that I strike you and smite you, the friendly soul replied in the moment that I do the worst to you, that you could possibly imagine in that very moment. Yes, the little soul interrupted. Yes. Remember who I really am. Oh, I will cry the little soul. I promise I will always remember you as I remember. I see you right here right now. Good. Set the friendly soul because you will see. I will have been pretending so hard. I will have forgotten myself. And if you do not remember me as I really am, I may not be able to remember for a very long time. And if I forgot, if I forget who I am, you may even forget who you are. And if you will both be lost, then we'll need another soul to come along and remind us both of who we are. No, we won't. The little soul promised again. I will remember you and I will thank you for bringing me this gift, the chance to experience myself as who I am. And so the agreement was made. And the little soul went forth. A new lifetime, excited to be light, the light, which was very special and excited to be that part of special called forgiveness. The little soul waited anxiously to experience itself as forgiveness and to thank whatever other soul has made it possible. In all the moments in that new lifetime, whenever a new soul appeared on the scene, whether that new soul brought joy or sadness, and especially if it brought sadness, the little soul thought of what God had said, always remember God smiled, I have sent you nothing but angels. That's the story. Beautiful story. Right. Thank you for sharing. I was holding my life. Thank you for listening, you guys. What do you guys think about the story? Oh, this makes you read it beautifully. And I was watching the comments and they enjoyed the story very much. Beautiful story right and light. I'm curious what you guys think as well. A lot of people seem to be resonating. Yeah, it's such a beautiful story. It helps me so much when I just need to let go and, you know, we can just let go any time like that. And I know we promised that we would also bring in kind of the logical scientific, you know, side of this, which is, you know, this is something I talked to my clients about often, whether we are holding onto resentment or fear or anger, it's really about letting go of our commitment to feel that way. And in your science, we call it the refractory period. And that's how long we decide to hold on to these feelings. And that we actually always have power over. So remembering that alone and starting to practice that, even though it might be hard in the beginning, it can be really powerful. So anyway, thank you for listening. And now I've talked enough. I want to hear from Melody. First of all, share with us where you were when we first had the conversation. Many, many days ago, many months ago, I think it was during COVID, so it must have been 2021. And we got to meet, we got to connect and something in my heart was like, please share your story. And you've turned that into something so powerful, so impactful. So share with us where you were, where you are now, and just share with us your journey of turning pain to power. Well, thank you for that. I also just, I think in my, oh, okay, in my own reflections while listening to the story. Sometimes it takes me a little time to digest and I'm wondering if those in the audience are as well. I think the biggest takeaways for me was hearing the word angel stood out to me the most. And I do want to say that I think your presence in my life is a bit like an angel, drops of light. And I could feel the emotion for you in the story, so I'm really glad you shared it.  This was in May of 2021. At that time, everybody who is listening right now, I was really lost and really processing. That was the first time that I had shared what happened to me in my family, every family, every person goes through their own sets of difficulties. But I guess the one that was hard for me was losing my father. And Yuri had connected to me as well, that she's lost her father as well. Of course, like that, what I'm sorry, you guys, I ramble a little bit. It's the overthinking brain. But that live stream was the first time I shared about his suicide publicly. I had always told people it was an accident because that's what I was led to believe. And so even in the understanding of the truth behind his death, which was a choice, right? And I know a lot of you probably struggle with depression. I've had my struggles. I know Yuri's had hers as well with multiple things. It's really hard to grapple with. It was very painful. And that's why our title for today is From Pain into Power. Because during that time, during that live stream, I shared for the first time what happened to me. And I'm just a human being, like a group in the suburbs, like, I don't know. But that was really hard for me. And I was so sad for lack of a better word. And I shared that story, the Starfish story. That was a story that impacts me. And today we heard what impacts Yuri. And that story is just about how if you can just help one person, that makes all the difference. And where am I going with this? Ah, so then a lot of you guys here in the comments, you guys were just sharing like, we're starfishies.  That's a great idea. So I'm going to make a discord around the Starfish idea and came out with Starfish community. Well, what do you know? Here we are. A year and a half, almost two years later, I've still been working on Starfish.  I don't know you guys. And yes, I am wearing pajamas. I saw you guys' comments. That space has changed my life because I've been able to connect with so many of you. And hear about what your lives are like. And as painful as it is to grapple with what would bring a parent to such a dark place. Or to lose somebody, you know, whether that be death or breakup or anything. And then here and connect with other people through what pains them. That was really powerful. I have found and assigned myself some meaning. And sometimes all it takes is a window of opportunity and a moment of inspiration. And you can write that momentum into a better future. And you don't even know what it looks like. For me at least, I think of it as some days we have great weather. Some days we have thick fog. And on those thick, thick, foggy days, you can only see like one or two steps ahead of you, right? Like you're like, I don't know where I'm going. And then you take one step at a time. And then some days it's a sunny, bright day. You have a lot of energy and you're like, yep, that's where I'm going. I know exactly where I'm headed this direction. But every day changes. And you lose random things along the way. And like most of the time it's people. And that's what hurts the most. Man pets, like low-key pets are great. That's a little bit more about how my life has gone since the last live stream. And I really love connecting with you guys right now. Just seeing what you guys have to say in the comments. And so to bring back the attention to you guys, I wonder what's something really painful for you right now? Because it's like, you know, you look at these things that are so painful and you can't imagine how could that transform into something powerful? Like how can I use something painful and make meaning out of that?  I totally understand. So I'm wondering, what are you guys, what is paining you? Where is your heart? What is weighing you down? Or what is paining your mind, I suppose? And yes, I can be a little derpy. So, hello. The answer that I would love to just address some of these comments here. First of all, I think, thank you for sharing Melody. And I know this is a very vulnerable story for you. And I really acknowledge you for really, this is one, you know, among many things. But one of the things that I really admire about you is you have this ability to really dig deep to speak from what's truly authentic and present for you. And sometimes that's going to look less than quote, quote, perfect. I love that. I think that's most perfect because, you know, we're humans and we're supposed to like, you know, the only reason we strive for perfection is because we think we're not perfect already, which is so silly. And yeah, I'm seeing some of these comments and listen, like, there's so many people who are moving through or have moved through either losing their parents or so or losing somebody close to them. And guess what? If you haven't not to instill quote, quote, fear around this because you shouldn't fear this, we're all going to lose somebody we love at one point. I mean, that's really the cycle of life. I mean, it's silly to be in the solution that we think we're never going to lose someone we love.  And that's why we get to connect and share these human experiences and validate and support each other, knowing that this is so normal. Even one person in this world who's not going to experience grief in some way, I promise you. Somebody just said, and I want to address this because this, I'm not triggered by this, but I don't want people to think, I think there's a stigma when people are moving through difficult challenges like coming back to neutral for some people is a really big deal. And when we talk about power, it's coming back to neutral as well as making something out of it. And wherever you are in that journey, I really acknowledge you because I've been every part of that journey and it takes immense amount of power. And the first place is to acknowledge what's going on. And so I don't think we're confusing our with complacency. In fact, since I've lost my dad in with, you know, from cancer, I've turned my life into a whole different direction. I was in the corporate world, nothing wrong with being in the corporate world. I just knew I wasn't personally aligned with who I was and what I was supposed to do with my life and what I really wanted to create for myself to quit my corporate job. I built a business, actually a few, but one of them being my heart mission driven practice, my coaching practice, and obviously Melody is one of my clients or was and Psych2Go is one of my clients. And I've written books and I'm passionate about what I do and Melody has created this whole community since her addressing her pain and sharing. She's helping a lot of people and she's doing it because she genuinely cares. Because she genuinely wants to create an impact. And I think that's really powerful. So I just want to address that. Here we are creating the safe space, by the way, for support and love. And while all comments are appreciated, I really want to invite all of you guys to be in the safe place to support a place, not for us, but for each other. We're good, but we're here to support you. So no judgment in this. And then also, let's address some of these comments. I know you asked them for what they're moving through. Let's see what they have to say. So many people are moving through something. I hear a lot of loss, friendships, breakups, trauma from parents, family, I'm sure. Perfectionism, then like the struggle with that. Oh yes, friends and families being unsupportive. Being sad is absolutely okay. I'm going up, so being bullied, overeating, under eating, I'm sure as well. Autism, by the way, autism is not a bad label at all. It's a neurodivergent label. And I also attribute neurodivergence to myself. But a lot of people will be able to understand that experience. Difficulty with friendships, rejection, it's all very difficult things. Thank you guys for sharing.  Whether they're scared, they're afraid, they're, you know, shame, guilt, whatever. All of these feelings are normal. Everyone experiences that one point just in different variations.  Let's do an exercise right now. It's an exercise that I help my clients with at times. And it's an exercise around reframing. Because I can look at my hardships in my life, you guys. I almost lost somebody that is very close to me to suicide also. I've lost my dad to cancer. It's been some difficult challenges in my life. However, I had to learn to reframe these as a blessing. And like at first, like some might feel even triggered, like how could you see that as a blessing? But I truly believe that because of those things happen, I get to be who I am today. So I just want to say with whatever you're sharing, we're not sharing that you're holding in your heart as we talk about this, like that most painful thing that you're holding on to. I'm going to ask you two questions. What benefit or what blessing has come from that?  So for example, I know that for me, even though it was so difficult to almost lose one of my parents to suicide, I'm here talking to you guys, being able to connect, being able to connect with melody, being able to connect with other people who either have experienced these mental health challenges and or who are, you know, who have been affected by suicide. I've actually also volunteered and raised a bunch of funds for American Foundation for suicide prevention, helping other people save their lives. I've helped save some of my client's lives with or without knowing.  You've done different things to immediately turn that into practical power as well. Tell us a little bit about that. Yeah, I also want to comment a couple of things here and talk about that and address that as well. I just, I just see you guys being really vulnerable and sharing authentically.  I may not ever really meet you guys in person or see you or, but I do hear everything you guys are moving through. I do want to say that the things that I hear also I see DJ Bondi said I learned I cannot stop someone I love from killing themselves. I like to raise awareness around like suicide awareness. I'm not afraid to say the word suicide. I know it makes a lot of people uncomfortable. I work for a suicide hotline. I actually have a shift tonight after this. But you hear some really terribly sad and heartbreaking things when and over the phone to in their voice. What people are moving through and kind of sometimes people are calling hotlines at the lowest moments of their lives. You know, you never really wake up and think like, yeah, that's what I want to do today. Call hotline. Like it's people out there were really hurting and I see I see you guys sharing right now as well. Thank you for that. Sometimes just voicing what you're moving through is a release in itself and that's part of that. Transforming pain into power. You need to let things pass through and kind of to tap into also why we're talking about spirituality today. It's not so much. We're not really trying to get into religion, right? It's more the practice of what can you do to improve your spiritual health and your mental health because they are interconnected. Just like you guys know physical health, right? Physical mental health that's those are connected. So is spiritual spiritual. You can kind of link the soul and it's kind of introspection looking into yourself. I have found that when I meditate. And even studies have been done. No, you're more likely to have a calmer nervous system. You're going to have reduced levels of stress. You're going to feel more grounded. You're going to have higher levels of focus. It's not easy, but I just passed 50 days of daily meditation and 50 days of yes. Thank you. See that physical piece important. I made it past 50 days of gym for the first time in my life. 50 days of meditation. That's the spiritual piece. And the mental piece is that gratitude streak. And I know a lot of us here on psych to go want to talk about the mental but a little bit of that spiritual stuff can be helpful. And I know prayer is kind of linked to more like religion. And what is that? Like, we don't like to talk about that sometimes, right? Because a lot of us also have been through religious trauma and I'm not afraid to talk about it. And if you can relate to that, feel free to share. Because it's hard when people press things on to you, right? Like their beliefs. But at the end of the day, it's kind of, it's a very subjective and individual experience of learning. What do you know about the universe? And not to get a little existential, but why are we here? Why are we on a rock in space? You hear that a lot, right? Like why are we doing here? And so kind of exploring that and letting yourself think about it is healthy. And they're all interconnected. And so in the last two years, I thought I was just doing the mental health thing. But while I was going down that mental health journey, I found and stumbled across a lot of spiritual stuff too. And I don't know wherever you guys are here that in the comments, all of you guys, I don't know where you are in your journeys. I don't know you. You kind of know me, but not really. So little you can know about someone based off of like a little bit of an interaction or even just a couple photos, right? Or like a couple of paragraphs. But I know and my intention with Yuri here today is that you're here for a reason and I'm here for a reason in this call for this live stream. And we're all trying to be okay. And it's okay not to be okay. I've been very not okay. So is Yuri. But we don't want to be suffering and we don't like pain. So how can we transform that and transmute it into something better? And those are a couple of my thoughts today, Yuri. I don't know when I pass it to you because I'm going to read the comments now. Thank you for sharing. And in this is one thing I think about you guys, if you aren't sure what spirituality means to you, one thing that you can start with is think about literally like the best version of yourself that could exist. You know, the there's a movie called Every Everywhere Everything all at once. I think that's a movie that won like nine awards this year. I love that movie because it talks about how there's all these parallel universes and how all these different versions of ourselves could exist. What that means is with every action that you take, whether it's a micro action or big action. It really changes the course of your life. And so imagine that there's a version of you like the most divine, most best version of you that could possibly exist. If nothing else, even if you're atheist or if you have your own God and you want to understand what that all means or how this relates to spirituality. One thing I do is I constantly pray and ask and converse with that version of me. The best version of me that somehow exists in the future. The most divine version of myself. For me, it's all about just connecting to that connecting to who I can become. If there were parallel universes, if there's a frequency of myself that I can tune into that is that version. I'm just really trying to tune into that and connect to that through meditation, through prayer. You're literally just praying for your highest self. So it has nothing to do with religion, God, anything. They can coexist. They can exist separately or you don't have to believe in religion. It's actually not even that much correlated. It's a separate thing because I think spirituality at least for me and you can completely interpret this in your own way. But it's about my relationship to my highest self. It's my relationship to the world around me. So it doesn't have to be about God or anything and everything is God, yes. I want to answer some of these questions. Why does kindness and forgiveness push away the feminine? It's not the kindness and the forgiveness that's pushing away the feminine. It's the limiting belief that it is. Listen, like read this statement right here. It says, why does that push away the feminine? You somewhere deep down believe that by you being kind and forgiving, you're pushing away the feminine there for your asking this question. So this isn't so much about your kindness or forgiveness that's actually getting in the way. It's the thought itself that it is getting in the way that's getting in the way that makes sense. Also, it's interesting that you said why does it push away the feminine, not the masculine or not people. So I would be keen to understand your relationship to the feminine. Even if you don't know it right now, there might be some resentment. There might be some unhealed or parts of your relationship with the feminine that you get to actually forgive. So in that way, maybe you're not embodying forgiveness as much as you think you are. Because why are you grouping the feminine as someone or a group of people or whatever, the energy that's against you? So my question is, what can you do to neutralize that and really forgive? I hope that helps. And what else? Do you mind putting pinning the one where someone asked, is it normal to be numb to almost all of the tragic events that happen in my life? Is it alright if I answer that one? Yeah, sure. Okay, keep that one there. Alchemy, I was thinking alchemy as well. So whoever wrote that, green thumb. I just want to address just real quick, Miss Jade, I see, is it normal to be numb? Normal is, again, something you just, different depending on who you ask.  I'm sure you guys maybe have heard those four responses, right? So you have freeze and you just kind of stop in your tracks. You have fight, which you want to fight people, flee, which is when you run away and there's fun, which is when you try to win the other side over. That's like a whole other topic. But in the case where like, imagine you're a kid.   Like, let's just say there's like a scary monster.  You can't run away if you're stuck in the room. The last thing you have left is breeze and you kind of just go into yourself.  So no matter what happens to you out here, it doesn't matter because you've just locked yourself away. And to a degree. I also have seen I think way earlier in the comments. That's a little bit why people self harm. And again, I'm not afraid to talk about these things out loud in this space as a safe container and talking about these things lessens the stigma.  There's actually like just to get a little bit more science.  Your brain can create its own pain relief. So yes, basically, it is possible for you to feel super numb and it's just like a block. So no one likes being constipated. It's a little bit like being emotionally constipated. And it's hard. How do you stop being constipated? That's a whole other topic, but I just wanted to address and validate. It's okay if you're feeling numb. Life is really hard to put it under statement. And we experienced so much pain. Sometimes we just can't take it anymore. So anyway, I want to I want to and I want to, you know, add this in because. There's two aspects of this. First of all, I think it's really powerful to be present with what you're feeling. And this is what therapy is amazing for, right? And sharing in these kind of ways, what's real to you, what's true to you. That's all powerful. I've actually helped people, my own clients who've had self harming tendencies and they stopped. And that's possible. The truth is though, a lot of y'all's who might be self harming. You're present to it. You're stuck in the story that it's helping you. But I will also want to challenge you with so much love. Who would you be with in the plot story? Are you committed to being that person, even though it's no longer serving you? And can you maybe play into the possibility that you were just you?  Just being like, well, who is who am I if that part of my identity no longer existed? Because there's like this escalation of commitment that happens where we would rather hold on to our old identity. Even if it doesn't serve us just because it's comfortable. How many years, months, days have you been telling yourself I am this person who self harms. And then all the input that you get and then your reaction and all the things that you get from that. You've created a system. It's a self soothing system. So I acknowledge you for creating something. However, sometimes we get to look at our habits and negative thinking self harming is also a habit. And I say that with love because once you can see that you have a choice. That's when you can turn that into power. You have to be able to imagine yourself as a new identity. This is and this is what I can do. This is my superpower when I saw Melody when I even saw tie from psych to go or a lot of my client. I can immediately see that new identity for them with all the things that they want and more. So for me, I'm now, of course, I have exercises that work on these micro shifts. But really what I'm committed to creating is a new identity for my clients. And this is also available for you guys. If you really let this land, I promise there's an opportunity for you to shift. Who are you without the thing, the pain, the story around the pain? Like just imagine for a moment. And it's weird because sometimes I feel this too.  I know we talked about books on Melody. One of the books that we love is an Untethered Soul by Michael Singer. And he talks about this being an observer of yourself being an observer over your consciousness and your emotions. When you see this, you'll see that there's like this weird attachment of you wanting to stay mad, you wanting to stay angry, you wanting to stay resentful, you wanting to stay even guilty or shameful. Like it's weird, but if you can really see that part of you and be like, oh, that's there. What would it feel like if I didn't feel committed to feeling that way? And like just let go for a bit. Why do I have such resistance about letting go about being mad? And when you can really start to like notice these different parts of you and say, okay, I'm going to just try on this identity who is not mad ever.  Do you have like, we can't be perfect. You can feel, you know, good all the time. Okay. Yeah, but we can strive for it. Why not? And if that is an inevitable, why commit to feeling bad when you don't have to. I think there's also time and place for you to be present with what you're feeling and let that move through you and be patient. I'm not talking about those times. I'm talking about the times that you know that that time has expired deep down.  And it's time for you to shift. Do something different to love yourself in those moments. I invite you guys to be courageous because when we talk about turning power, I'm sorry, turning pain into power. There's one thing. I mean, two things actually, I'll say that is absolutely necessary for that to happen. One is courage. It takes courage to say, I don't want to resonate with this person who self harms anymore. That is not me anymore. I don't want to label myself as someone who's mad, angry, sad all the time anymore. And then it takes commitment to this new identity. You know, one thing I saw in you, Melody, I saw your commitment to be a leader. That identity shifted for you massively. And that really changed for you, right? So, I would like to think about that new part of your identity. And this is going to be a little bit challenging if you've been living in the survival mindset for so long in the fight flight, you know, flee, bond, state for so long. But I really challenge you to think about this and this can change your life if you let it. What is that one new part of your identity that you're willing to commit to? For Melody, she committed to meditating every day. She committed to working out every day. This is her new identity emerging every day. It's through these everyday habits. So for you guys, what is that one thing? Do you want to be smart? Okay, then how many books do you commit to reading? Do you want to identify as someone who has overcome the challenges? Okay, then what is the new identity like? Like what is she or he or like, what are they like? Are they happier? Do they smile more? These are little things we can do every day just to tune into who we're becoming. So I want you guys to remember that. I want you to remember or think about what do you get to be courageous about right now today? And what do you get to commit to on your daily basis so that you can actually shift your identity to something else? So that's what I wanted to share, because it's good. It's good to validate. It's good to have a safe place. And now that we've determined that this is a safe place, I also want to powerfully remind you guys that you don't have to stay there. You don't have to feel bad all the time.  Like I am in awe every single morning I wake up and say, Holy moly, whether there's a creator or God or whatever, Big Bang or whatever you believe in or not, like how is it that all of these things were created? It's absolutely amazing.  Look at these bugs. How do they like the eggs? And like, I mean, all these things are actually miraculous. Einstein said that either look at life as if nothing's a miracle or everything's a miracle. That's absolutely... Sorry about that. Yeah, no, go ahead, Melody. So thank you for being here. You guys, you know, some of y'all are leaving. It's amazing to have you guys here. And Melody, what do you have to add today? Oh, tell us about what you've created. This is where we're getting to. Yes, I just wanted to touch. I think there's so many, so many topics that you touched on that we could totally expand on. So unfortunately, I wish we had more time. But I see you guys as well sharing as always. And I resonate a lot. I think the one thing I wanted to fixate on that you, out of the many great things that you shared is, you know, shaping the new identity. And I think a piece of that is letting go, which we've talked about a little bit as well. Releasing up the past, right? We can't, like, for example, if your identity is, I hurt myself. And I want to be honest with you guys.  So I'm just going to hit myself like that's, yeah, she crazy. Yes, I get it. It's all good. But when that's your identity, sometimes you just realize you don't want to be that anymore. And you have to let go. And it's not that easy, right? It's easier said than done. I get that. It also takes time. I've been on a journey for the last two years. I'm still not where I want to be. But I just want to share about letting go, releasing of the past, making room for new things. And that's why I have this plant. And I also want to share with you guys, why is my hair short?  So there's like a, there's like people wondering like, why is there a trend of girls shaving their heads? Well, it's kind of, you know, they say that hair holds memory.  And then that's going to solve your problems. It's not. Okay. But for me, I'm very expressive about what I'm moving through with my appearance. And I think that's a beautiful thing about beauty and fashion as well, by the way, for like also feminine folk. But I shaved my head and now my hair is growing back. And I feel like a new identity is growing with my hair. And even this plant, I came into this little Airbnb space and these plants were dying.  But I saw that it just needed a little help. And I took off all those dead leaves and left just this one at the top. And you can see there's already a little leaf growing here and there's like little baby leaves coming in now. And it is, I'm now attached to this plant. So I'm going to ask the lady if I can take this plant with me because it's beautiful. It's really beautiful when you let go of the past and like all these things that hurt you. Sometimes you just have to shed and then there's room for new growth. And I wish that for all of you as well. I'm really happy to be here to share with you guys how much, how far I've personally come in my personal journey as one tiny human being on this planet since the last livestream. Like, you know, but yeah. And that's why, you know, you guys are welcome to connect with me if you want in Starfish community. And it's a discord server. I created that space so that if you want to be a part of a community that's all about wellness and that being mental health, spiritual health, physical health, all of those things are really important. And that is a space for you if you want to be a part of it. There is no like, I don't really, I just want to be there to talk to you guys. It gives my life meaning. I love watching people grow. I think Yuri feels that way with her clients as well. I was a teacher.  We don't know how long. You don't know how like far reaching or long lasting the impact you make on someone's life is, but I know there's a kid out there that's like, yeah, I had a really weird teacher and she shaved her head. And so I guess I left an impact and I hope it was a good one. And right now I don't know if I'll ever interact with any of you again, but I genuinely care for you as, you know, we're all brothers and sisters as human, like human species. And you don't have to believe me, but I do hope that wherever you are, whoever you are, that you blossom or that you can let go and then continue to make room for new things and shape an identity of who you want to be and learn to dream, which is something Yuri helps you with. Thank you for sharing. And so yeah, you guys, if you would like to join Melody on her starfish journey, which is a discord community and or her patreon, feel free to let us know in the comments and we'll follow up. Meanwhile, I'm just reading some of this. Okay. Yeah, share with us a little bit in the comment if you're still here, so lovely to see all of you. Feel free to share with us in the comment what landed for you.  We talked about on, we talked about our journey and why we do what we do, what this means to us on a personal level, how we have personally turned our powers, I'm sorry, our pain, our pain into power and more talked about, well, I shared the little soul in the soul story, which I love about forgiveness. We acknowledge some areas of our lives, our own lives and other people that we can forgive. We talked about identity transformation, which is what I do, which I support my clients with so that they can really start to dream again, really start to create a new identity again and really let go of all the aspects of themselves that no longer serve them and create magic and create power. We talked about Melody's discord communities, Starfish and her mission to support the world, which is very much aligned with Psych2Go's mission of eliminating mental health stigma around the world, as well as advocating for creating a safe space and connection and so on. So, well, my one book recommendation, so I have two book recs and also Yuri has two book recs and one of our books coincide, but my book recommendation to all of you guys is the Untethered Soul. I just finished reading it yesterday and it's a lot about if you, I know a lot of Psych2Goers, you guys are obviously watching the Psych2Go videos because you want to know more about yourself and that's introspection. The Untethered Soul is about looking in words and about observing those negative thoughts and realizing that they're just like clouds. Oh, that one looks like a horse and then it passes. You get to attach to them. They get stuck, right? And then you get, it's painful. Sometimes the clouds are not nice either. They have like thunder clouds, right? Okay, anyways, I'm going on a ramble. That's my first book recommendation and I also want to recommend Yuri's book, which is Creating True Happiness. I read it last year when she gave it to me. I find that she has a lot of really, if you like, again, introspecting, there she is. There are a lot of really powerful props that she walks through each chapter. And it was helpful for me. So I dog-eared a lot of them because I want to come back to those questions, revisit them. But those are my two book recommendations for all of you guys to leave you with something. There will be a link eventually somewhere to Starfish, but books are powerful, you know? You can reread them. And journal prompts are even better. And you can share them with your friends. So I don't know. Do you have book recs, Yuri? Yeah. One of them, I would say Seven Spiritual Laws of Success by Deepak Chopra. That was a book that really changed my life, the direction of my life. I mean, I've read many, many books. Untethered Soul is one of them. Did I recommend that book to you? Anyway, it's a powerful book. I love that book as well. The Seven Spiritual Laws of Success is a very simple book. Ooh, and actually one more. Two more. Well, obviously, my book, I love my book. If you guys want to learn a little bit more about my stories, there's a lot of journaling prompts here. Stories of other people.  I talk about all that. So that's one. But also, what book was I going to say? This is another book I was going to say. Oh, the Alchemist. Since we're talking about turning pain into power, the Alchemist is a really powerful book. That's also a very easy read, but also one of those books that you read, and every single time you get something new out of it, that by Paula Cualo, that's a powerful book. So as we're talking about spirituality turning pain into power, these are some books that we have recommend they recommend for you guys. So feel free to check these out. We'll go ahead and put this in the link as well. We'll also put the Starfish and we'll pin it. So yeah, thank you so much for being here. Other than you guys, I'm also a performance coach. Like I said, I've worked with amazing humans like Melody, amazing leaders like Ty from Psych2Go who's the CEO of Psych2Go and many, many amazing clients.  You can also book 30-minute consultation below. Serious people only. And I'll go ahead and include that in the caption as well. So if you have any questions for me, let me know. Other than that I want to join Starfishy. I love it. So thank you so much for being here. Yeah. I just want to say that I see a lot of really wonderful book recommendations from you guys as well. So if you guys want to write these down from each other as well, we've got a lot of really great book recs going on. I have a final request. I'm not very good at advocating for myself, but if you guys want to support me on my endeavors in developing resources for people, I also have a Patreon and follow along month by month what I accomplish with Starfish. It's really interesting, but I don't want to go into it for too much. But there will be a Patreon shared as well, and any kind of contribution goes a long way. Half of what I make there I'm stuck into a scholarship fund for students. I'm pretty proud of that. Giving back to the world when you guys give to me as well. That's me trying to advocate for myself, you guys. Advocate for yourselves. Because if no one else will, you need to. Well, you guys, thank you for being here again. Please feel free to comment below. We're going to probably hop off here soon, but do comment what land for you today, what other types of topics would you like us to share either on this channel or on other channels or other streams. I also have a YouTube channel, so feel free to follow me there. Other than that, I just want to share genuine thanks to Psych2Go and all the Psych2Glowers here. You guys are really special, really. All of you guys are here because you want to change. You want to be better. You want to feel loved and supported, and we're here. And I really want to thank Psych2Go as a channel, and I've worked with the leadership team there as well. These are freaking passionate loving people. I've literally never met any group of people like that who are just so passionate about the mission. They don't sleep. One of the things I have to do is you guys get some sleep. They're so excited about what they're creating all the time. My invitation for you is share this channel. Share a video today from this channel. Let's get the word out there. This is one of the most amazing platforms I've come across around mental health, around mindset, around creating a community from all over the world. It's a really, really, really powerful platform. And I'm just so grateful that we get to have a voice this way. So grateful for you, Melody, for sharing your story vulnerably, being authentic as always. And creating this amazing platform, Starfish, as well, will be also sharing the links for that. And I acknowledge every single one of you guys who are here either for now, who are here now, or was here before, or just logged on in any capacity for joining us. It was really, really amazing. One of my visions for the world is to be able to support people from all over the world like this. So what a cool thing, this technology thing we got going on that we can do this.  Whether you were here supporting, whether you had contrasting comments or opinions, I love you. I'm sorry, but I love all of you because at the end of the day, I know all energy, all time, all attention that you dedicated to this channel and this hour. You created this with us. So I really appreciate all of you. Love you guys genuinely so much. Any last words? By the way, you guys, I will be actually have something really special coming up next week. We have another live stream coming up. We might be having the CEO of Psych2Go.  We're having with Monica as well. We'll be talking more mindset and different things that I get really nerdy about.  Let's see. I definitely gratitude. I have a lot of gratitude and I also do want to take this time again as Yuri had to compliment the Psych2Go team for generating such a community where I get to interact with you guys and for Psych2Go team and the CEO who I do hope you guys get to meet soon. I do hope he's a lovely individual for giving me the space to share my story. And some of the people now in my life that I'm super close to, I would have never met if it wasn't for that live stream last time. So I don't know which of you I will know now. Like that's crazy to me. Crazy to me. You never know. I also didn't realize that Yuri would leave such an impact in my life. You never know. But I'm so grateful. That is what I feel. And gratitude is a beautiful thing to share and so is love. And it's hard to believe that some random people you don't know actually mean what they say because like how could they but I have a lot of love for this world and for my fellow humans and so I'm really grateful to share this time with you guys. I really wish that we could be answering all the questions. I'm not going to lie. I do see them. Or we see them. But nonetheless it's a blessing to just be able to share and read as well. I hope I get to know more of you. Thank you guys for listening to me ramble and be like and thank you Yuri so much for the way this life streamed for being who you are in my life as well. Seriously. I love you so much.  And you know I think this you know we attract people who have similar emissions, similar visions, similar heart energy and I'm just so grateful to have connected with you. You're such a beautiful soul and I see you so thank you so much gratitude. Love all of you guys as well. I know we're like bleep bleep bleep. Love you guys so much. Feel free to share anything else that comes up. Please feel free to add us on Instagram on YouTube and starfish channel on Melody's Any of those we welcome welcome welcome Love you guys so much. We'll see you later. Take care everybody.


If you're here, I'm introducing him again. But this talk is on the future of social coordination of DOWS, and the talk is being hosted by Chandler Dukok, who does growth strategy at Astaria. Chandler focuses on building the future of Web3 by solving the problems that matter to people that work in the space every day. Please welcome Chandler to the stage. All right. Just a quick shout out before I get into my talk. The previous panel that we had before this was Web3 Adoption in Africa. I really love that topic. It was really great. And a shout out to the fellow Africans. I hail from South Africa. So that meant a lot to me. So really great to see that. Today's talk is really just around why do we need DOWS and why do we need to make them better, right? Many of us here are probably in DOWS. And I think we owe it to ourselves to actually make them design them for more humans and create a more sustainable system for how DOWS work. My name is Chandler. I lead growth at Astaria. And today's lesson, just thanks, why the DOWS experience sucks today. It's a story of things that I've been through in the DOW ecosystem. And really the three main topics I want to cover today is just things around governance, incentives, and the organization around DOWS as we know them today. A little bit about what I've been up to. I've worked in over 20,000 projects at the moment. I used to help implement UME's KPI options. That'll tie quite heavily into whatever we'll be talking about today. I used to work on an optimistic governor module and help spread awareness around just what optimistic governance is. And I've done a ton of research around governance and incentive programs. So we all know what a DOW is. I think this group is a little bit more advanced than most of them. But this is kind of like a very TLDR version of how I see the lifecycle of a DOW start, right? A DOW is created. Everyone joins. They're excited. There's a lot of hype, a lot of participation, and a lot of contribution. This is actually the most formative part of the DOW. And then we kind of move over to when DOWs really start to operate, right? And this is where the dynamics change a little bit. Different types of incentive structures are at play, different types of contribution levels and skills. And then you kind of get to a point where the DOW is in a sort of a happy medium state. And we kind of continue to see DOWs operate in this space. And their lifecycle really is captured in this. So if a DOW is operating, you're in the space. But really then it kind of moves over to when the DOW explodes. And there are many examples of those that we'll kind of like just touch on very briefly. This is where some incentive dynamics are at play. This is where some of the governance frustrations come into play. And then this is also around some of the concepts around like in-fighting and who has rights in the space and who can contribute and who can participate. And some of the reasons why DOWs explode really starts around that, right? So we'll get into some of those in a little bit. But I think the one thing that's, one second. I think the thing that's really important here is the things that don't work, right? So I spoke about community contributions and participation. And those two things are actually fundamentally different. My participation in a DOW is very different to my contribution in a DOW. And I think the way that DOWs were structured at the moment in these big, monolithic, one token, one vote systems don't really work because you're always going to have a suboptimal level of contribution. Why? Why do I say that, right? So participation is not the same. So when I have a token vote or a token in a DOW and I can vote on some of the governance actions, I will always give the bare minimum effort that it takes to be considered a contributor for future rewards and future incentive programs and kind of just be known in the ecosystem. Most organizations actually thrive and do better by individuals contributing above and beyond what's expected, right? Like if you think about your job, you work for an intrinsic value and an extrinsic value, and those values combine kind of give you what your output is. And sometimes, you know, the jobs that you don't like doing, you need some extrinsic motivation. And the stuff that you really like doing, you can kind of just do for free, right? And so if you think about how DOW and incentive structures are set up at the moment, there really is no way to effectively convert people's lack of willingness to participate, sorry, lack of willingness to contribute on things that they might not be so excited about, right? And if you look at the vast majority of how DOW participation work is really around token rewards, right? Not every DOW has this, the majority of the ones that we all know today have like a token reward distribution mechanism that actually just is fundamentally flawed, right? If you think about taking your token that's going to ultimately govern your system and air dropping it, put it out for liquidity mining rewards, rewards maximizing individuals that kind of like just do the very least that they can to get the reward, grant scraping, all of these kind of concepts provide governance rights to people in the DOW that might not actually be there for the best interests of the DOW. And we can kind of see that like the reward mechanism for something like a liquidity mining is not really tied into the longevity of the DOW. Why do I say that in kind of the broader concept? Well, like you're just rewarding capital for your DOW and you're paying an extreme cost for that liquidity, show your protocol needs to function and ensure liquidity is king in most of the DeFi ecosystems, but ultimately you're actually giving away governance rights to somebody that's not going to have a long-term and aligned incentive with your ecosystem. Okay, the things that do work, right? Now, most of the protocols that exist today that are highly successful have this like concept of insert your protocol name labs and that's the foundation that works on the protocol. Uniswap Labs works on Uniswap. I used to work at UMA, we were at UMA risk labs that helped build up UMA protocol. And these are normally highly skilled teams that are well compensated and have both intrinsic and extrinsic motivation, right? And those kinds of concepts have been extremely successful at building really highly effective products and protocols. How do we translate this into the DOW space is actually going to be an important part of what I want to kind of like get towards. But most of the time relative to the size of DOWs is that they're small, highly motivated teams working on a particular problem, right? And if you think about like some of the DOWs that set up this whole conference, the Shelling Point, DOW, small, highly effective team, community organizations, the Ethereum Foundation, again, same small relative just to the level of participation. And most of the people that work on these protocols or these DOWs or these kind of groups are verifiably credible. So if I want to work in a developer DOW, I really need to be able to know how to develop. So what are some of the lessons I learned in my time working with all the DOWs and kind of figuring out some of the dynamics on like what makes some DOW successful versus others? And I think the one key message that I mentioned a bit earlier is around passing the access to the governance within your ecosystem. We do that far too cheaply at the moment. We do it for the wrong reasons and we reward the wrong types of behavior. And I think there's a very big difference between what is effective for your protocol versus what is effective for your governance and your long-term management of your DOW. I also fundamentally do believe that the kind of examples that we have at the moment, I put up here the SushiSwap example. That was like the, it should be pretty much studied in every DOW business school when we eventually get to the size of the ecosystem for us to have like DOW business schools. And SushiSwap will most likely be the core fundamental case study on what went wrong and what are the things that we could do better about that. And again, token reward incentive programs, a governance system that was extremely monolithic and the participation in that DOW was the individuals that had the most context of what they were doing were being stifled by members of the community that really didn't actually have the best kind of input in that particular topic. So the other one is governance is not easy. I think monolithic DOWs as they exist today are a huge issue. I don't think we should be getting rid of big monolithic DOWs. We'll get into some of the dynamics of how I think they can change, but really right now I think they're extremely painful. Context is missing for everyone. I think if you have to vote on every single vote, you're not gonna know everything that you need to do and why this vote is important and kind of like some of the decisions that get made on chain through governance votes are also kind of, they don't actually need to do that. There's a big difference between being able to have a verifiable trusted execution of a particular outcome versus actually something where you can just kind of agree. As long as there's some sort of soft consensus around something, you can kind of move on and I don't think everything needs to be voted on. And I think one of the more important elements here is that attention in a DOW, especially if you're in many, like I've been, is a fading asset.  The number of people are not the most important thing in your DOW. The attention that you can garner from people and of particular types of skill sets is the most important. And then I kind of also briefly touched that not everything needs to be a blockchain vote. Like really, there are many elements around like how we can, what gets put towards a vote and gets discussed is sometimes a bit over the top. Bigger is not better, size, size isn't really that important in terms of DOWs. If you look at some of the most effective teams, remember how I drew parallels to like highly effective teams building out something. If you look at the size of Uniswap, their team is famously small. Yet they're the biggest asset swapper in the DeFi space. And if you look at a team like Coinbase, famously large and they roughly do the same amount of volume. Sure, they've got differentiating products and sure it's not apples for apples here, but really the concept here is that bigger DOWs are necessarily better. The more people that you introduce into the DOW, the more elements of like having a stifling force in your DOW starts to become prevalent. And these like mass airdrops and these mass token distributions kind of just go out willingly. They typically kind of like help perpetuate that these large DOWs. And it's not really designed for humans, right? We as individual humans only can have X number of contacts between ourselves, right? I'm sure you might have 10,000 Twitter followers, but you actually only talk to five people on your Discord or five people in your Telegram and then you ignore all the rest of the group chats, right? So DOWs are built by humans and are for humans and we should always kind of keep that as like a core premise of how we design our interactions even in the DOW space. So I've had some experience with some tools. I'm gonna go through three of them. This is just from my point of view on some of the things that worked and what never worked. So the first one was KPI options from the UMA protocol. What a KPI option was was basically a conditional payout token where let's say for example, I was a DeFi protocol that wanted to increase my TVL instead of just distributing liquidity mining rewards or doing an airdrop to kind of help promote this, you built in a conditional metric and you gave that token to your community members or the stakeholders that could actually improve that. And then depending on how that metric got achieved over a period of time, you could get more rewards and you can kind of think of this as a really powerful primitive to incentivize people kind of in a decentralized way, right? It was really great for community compensations because you compensated people for an outcome that you got and so that outcome really, really helped motivate the each individual kind of on an extrinsic level. So you kind of gave that reward for a total outcome. Token rewards and outcome based results were really, really useful for that. So let's say you as a DOW really wanted to get something done and you would give a reward or a bounty out for it depending on how well that outcome was achieved, you would end up getting a better result and we found this to be quite a powerful like primitive mechanism. But then in my experience, I found that there were a lot of issues with these conditional tokens. Firstly, in DOWs, no one actually knows in a DOW what your most important metrics are and this was the most shocking thing I ever experienced. I'd walk up to a team and say, hey, they would come to me and say, hey, do you want to do KPI options? And I'd say yes, great, I'm here to help and they would end up, our first question I'd ask is what's your most important metric and they're kind of like just stood there and didn't know what exactly how to answer that, right? And then they were competing discussions amongst team members and so finding a core metric in terms of what you could do in a DOW might not necessarily be the most valuable thing for that DOW because there's a wide array of things that DOWs can target but really when you have too big a DOW or too big an infrastructure, it's really hard to figure out what's that core premise of what that DOW is ultimately achieving. And then on the other side of this is that these KPI options were smart contracts and tokens, there was a lot of effort to put into place for like smaller incentive programs and in the case of like something like Sushi where the community really mistrusted the team and there was this conflict, KPI options made sense there because it was kind of like an on-chain guarantee whereas most DOWs and most community members really do trust their DOW. So just saying, hey, we can do this and we'll give you a reward out if we achieve these results is actually something that is a lot more efficient and I think taking that out of the smart contract side and putting it in the social layer actually proved to be a little bit more effective. The other topic that I worked on for a while was optimistic governance.  Optimistic governance for anyone that doesn't know is most actions of governance get executed by multisigs. Multisigs are a legal liability for the signer and also a security hole and so what you can then do is instead of actually submitting everyone sign that and again, attention is the most important thing. The multisig signers ultimately really struggle to keep up with the context of everything that they're signing, right? Just like every vote, you don't have all the context, every signature for a multisig executor is the same. So what you can then do with an optimistic governor is basically submit the transactions that would execute on the wallet and that execution can be vetoed by someone in an optimistic sense. So transactions can be submitted and all you have to do is have one person disagree with it if there's anything wrong, right? So less votes, less on-chain actions, so great idea, right? There was actually a talk on this stage yesterday by someone called Isaac that went into a lot more detail. So if you wanna know more details of how that all plugs in from Snapsap to reality.eth and the configuration of one of these are, that's a great idea, but really these are extremely new and untested and one of the biggest issues that you can have is you could actually submit a transaction and if no one is watching, steal some funds, right? I remember how I said like attention is the most important part of governance even in a tool that allows you to govern in a more optimistic sense. There's a security hole there because the security is based on the assumption that everyone is watching these transactions. So optimistic governance I think also induces a lot of anxiety for individuals. When you as an executor transaction on a multi-sig, you know when you have to do it, you can see that transaction and you know nothing's gonna happen if you don't do something. The dynamic with optimistic governance is flipped around where if you don't look at something, something might happen without you kind of like paying attention and that's hugely scary, right? You're now gonna be sitting here going every single time, checking your multi-sig if there's a new proposal for a transaction coming through and so conceptually I think optimistic governance doesn't really sit so well for those that are lacking in attention or super monolithic and maybe they can be a bit more effective at the smaller scale and also smaller treasury size. So Isaac yesterday spoke about how he stole seven ETH ethically he returned it because the safe snap team weren't paying attention, right? And they even paid attention, tried to catch them out and so they blocked the transaction, he reinitiated and then they forgot to pay attention again and then he ended up draining that small honey pot and so optimistic governance again kind of an interesting dynamic on how you can improve just that monolithic governance size. But really the most important thing that I think I've seen be a lot more effective in my time is this concept of pods, unit to cores, there's not a clear vernacular on exactly what we're gonna call this but these small, highly effective teams that fit together within a larger organization and these effective teams basically are focusing on one core element, right? Maker does this in their kind of units breakup and that's somewhat, has somewhat been effective and they largely live within the maker ecosystem but if you look at something on how you can kind of compose these core units into something that's far more effective, you can actually start moving your core mini-dial or core mini-units or pod to other dials, right? So not only can you live with the dial within isolation, you can start having this hub and spoke mechanism where you get dials within dials and those dials help out other dials and you can kind of see a far more interconnected world. The teams are far more efficient and far more effective because they're smaller, they govern themselves, they choose the tools that they wanna do it and the tooling that exists right now can kind of help input them into a lot more of the ecosystem. They can govern themselves whether they choose that to be optimistic or not or if they do it on a contract layer with a multi-sig or they just trust someone intrinsically but we can kind of see that these core units become really, really effective and I'm sure many of you have been to some of the side events that happen at this conference and many of those side events actually are done by core units and those core units can actually be helpful to other teams. So the one example is that Divinity event last night I went to it for a little bit and that team really highly effective can do side events for a bunch of other dials or projects if they so choose. Yeah, highly effective core units that govern themselves that fit within a larger organization or can be part of multiple organizations is extremely far more effective and a better return to scale. And so ultimately what I kind of get towards is what does the future look like with the kind of lessons that I've learned and some of the things that I've seen? So what does the future look like to me? I think any sort of dial structure needs three core elements, it's incentive, it's an incentive program, it's governance and it's organizations. You really want a small team of highly effective and motivated individuals to work on a particular project or a particular problem that they all agree is the common goal that they're wanting to work on and that the smaller your unit or the more effective your unit, the more you can do in a daily basis. And the other side of that is you can even have these small units fit within a larger organization, right?  All right, and then the other one was being clear on participation versus contribution, right? I can participate in the Ethereum ecosystem, I can also contribute to the Ethereum ecosystem. Those two things I think are really, really, really important to be very clear on when you're kind of working in a doubt, right? I'm part of the many, many discords, sometimes it gets a bit noisy and so I don't necessarily contribute to every single one, but I do participate in many of them and keep up with the news. And as a participant in many dows, I know what my role would there be. I have a vested interest, whether it be intrinsic or extrinsic, to want to make sure that that dow survives and grows and becomes a vibrant ecosystem, but then the contribution side should be an active decision from my side to contribute in that space. And I think that right now, a lot of people mistrude being a contributor versus a participant, and you get a lot of armchair commentary from participants pretending to be contributors, and I feel like that often is quite a stifling force with any sort of governance issue in action. Now, being a participant that raises a valid concern and a valid issue is not kind of the point I'm touching on here. The point is when a participant that has no understanding of the problem that the contributors are working on is a big issue. Like, I can't tell you how many times you've seen, like, these long, well thought out forum posts, and you just see two, three people go, no, this doesn't make sense to me, I don't like it in forum posts. And that governance happens on a lot of these forum posts, and that's sort of like disheartening to the actual contributors. That leads to the inviting and the ultimate explosion of the dow. Cool, so that's mainly what I want to do and talk about today. I have one last shout out to do not really related to my talk, but my ex-colleague, Clayton at Uma, sent out this tweet where he is asking everyone for laptops, phones, you know, for everyone that's got, that's Alpsec secure, that bought a new phone, bought a new laptop for Columbia, you can actually put that to use, that these are going to students for an education path to basically learn, have the access to the internet to kind of just learn, and it's going to be web three focused, so it's basically onboarding more people in the web three for people that are in need. He's already collected over 20 devices, I think actually, I checked with him yesterday, it's closer to 50 at the moment, so if you have a new phone, or if you have an old phone or an old laptop or an old iPad, any internet connected device downstairs in the, in the vibes room with the chair and the music, there's a guy there that's called John, you can drop your device there. If you do want to still contribute to this and you don't have your device here, I also recommend handing it over into someone in Miami, they do have an office there, so if you're in the US, you can also contribute to this. And this I think is just a really great way to say thanks to the team in Bogota and the entire city for hosting us, it's been a really exciting experience and I've really loved my time here in Bogota. So thank you to Bogota, this is a good way, I think that you can say thanks to the Colombian people for hosting a really awesome DevCon. I've got a bunch of time for questions if you'd like. One question? Yeah, one question. You mentioned, you know, small teams working towards a common goal, but I didn't see you talk much about how you come up with that common goal and how all these small teams could agree on that common goal because that's in my experience has been a big problem and a couple of hours where they don't agree on the common goal and so then they break apart in their own ways and the arguing starts happening. Yeah, I think naturally when like-minded individuals get in a room, they're often like, oh, this is the problem that we're working on, this is the kind of solution that we're working on, let's go do that, right? Like I'm gonna use the Schelling Point example again, they're fundamentally there to like help public goods and the conversation, the discourse and the whole like dynamic around public goods funding and so they all work towards that common goal, right? And if you no longer wanna work on that common goal, you can go in and out. So that was like an organic formation based on people just coming together. I think dows that come together that aren't part of a common goal, they just kind of wanna get together, I think that's more like a social club and so I think being intentional about what you wanna do with a group of individuals is extremely important, right?  Cool, thanks guys.


Well, Spain has always been very very committed to the European Union and European integration since it joined the European Union, so it's a very pro-integrationist country. Its vision is that Europe needs to hold together in the face of Brexit, for instance, so the main ambition of Spain is that Brexit has not been itself in other countries. And to do that, of course, it has some balanced feelings, I would say, about Brexit because of course the bilateral ties are very very very deep with the United Kingdom, between Spain and the United Kingdom, but also the most important thing for Spain is to keep the U27 together, so in that regard most probably the position of Spain on Brexit will be not to promote very much its bilateral ties with the UK after Brexit, but rather to make sure that the 27 remain together. I would say that Spain has mixed feelings about the about the multispeed Europe in the sense that of course as I said it's very pro-integrationist, so that means that in that sense anything that divides or that makes Spain think that different speeds of integration might happen is not really seen as a good opportunity in the sense that it would like everyone to be on board from minute one and move together towards more integration, that's the more common position in Spain, but at the same time it sees Brexit and multispeed Europe as an opportunity in the sense that of course there is a refurbishment of alliances in the U after Brexit, that means that the big three is gone of the picture of course with the UK, even we only have France and Germany in the lead and that's not enough for Spain, Spain would like to be involved in this core group of countries and that's what Versailles told us, the conference in Versailles where Italy and Spain joined France and Germany in defining the future of Europe, this makes the Spain thing that it can be back on the core Europe, so it has to play on both dimensions, on the one hand keeping the EU together, the EU 27 together and multispeed then poses a problem in that regard in a certain sense, but at the same time it wants to take advantage of the opportunity of playing big in European politics and this is something that we've seen from Versailles onwards and that the current Spanish government is fighting for in a set of being involved in our major decisions of reform, be that Tesco, Eurozone reform, Schengen, any kind of big files about that in the negotiation now Spain wants to be to be be. Of course Spain the first one is recovery from the crisis, the crisis has hit Spain very hard, it has turned Spain into a bad pupil of European integration since it has suffered a lot from the crisis, but the truth is that it has tried to catch up pretty quickly, it has followed really the main guidelines of Eurozone austerity policies, so it has been very pro-austerity and this has created big problems in the political internal situation, but of course it has tried to show to Germany in particular that it has to remain a good pupil and as such that it can play in the table of the big guys and be there in the end front, so consolidation of economic recovery for Spain is a must and once this consolidation is achieved then it will want to kind of have a benefit from this being a good pupil that I mentioned now. So first is Eurozone reform of course it will play big on that accompanied by a social dimension not to lose the idea of a social dimension of economic integration and also second security and defense security and defense for Spain is very important and it has always been very committed to the CFSP and the CSDP for instance. The alliances of course of Spain will be natural in a sense, I mean it knows that with Italy although it has a lot of hate relationship with Italy of whose biggest or whose most important in new integration it understands Italy to be a central player after Brexit, it understands of course France to be a central player of the Brexit same for Germany, so Spain will try to be a balancing act and get along well with all these countries in a sense to consolidate its own position within the big forum, not playing alone but rather trying to have all these countries together for the future of the new integration EU 27 molding together. So that's the big line for with countries such as Ireland for instance are busy with regards Brexit of course Spain as Ireland is very exposed to Brexit, Spain is very exposed for tourism reasons, number of expats of UK expats living in Spain is the largest number in Spain there are the particularly pensionaires and how people living in Spain so the bilateral ties are very important not to mention the Gibraltar issue which is also very important for for Spain but as a Spain is very exposed to Brexit so is Ireland so I assume I assume that both countries will try to have the same position as they've had during the withdrawal agreement that is putting all the way behind the commission and the commission leading the negotiations and of course supporting the role of the commission so I see a lot of scope for cooperation between Spain Ireland


The National Anti-Money Laundering Oversight Committee, NAMLOC, presented certificates of participation to stakeholders involved in reviewing the recent amendments to St. Lucia's Anti-Money Laundering, Terrorism and Proliferation Financing legislation. These amendments are critical to St. Lucia's application for re-rating to be removed from enhanced follow-up. One piece of legislation which will impact several service providers is the Virtual Assets Business Act which was recently passed in December 2022. Natalie DiSosi, Executive Director of the Financial Services Regulatory Authority, FSRA, explained that a Virtual Asset is a digital representation of value that can be traded or used for payment or investment. Most Virtual Assets that you would have heard of would be like crypto currencies or virtual currencies such as Bitcoin or Litecoin and today it is reported that over 20,000 of those are in circulation. She said a Virtual Asset cannot be equated to a fiat currency. What do I mean by that? A fiat currency is a legal tender issued by a government while a cryptocurrency or a virtual currency is backed by a blockchain technology that is not, I would say, overseen or overviewed by any central authority. DiSosi added that blockchain technology has the ability to allow the transfer of value around the world quickly and efficiently with law enforcement authorities reporting that illicit traders are using such technology to trade in cyberspace to conduct transfers between multiple accounts in multiple jurisdictions using virtual identities where the owner of the asset isn't always known. So you can understand how difficult it is for law enforcement to trace a transaction and due to that emerging risk the financial action task force which you have heard is called FETF have issued recommendations to deal with such emerging risks and they have issued recommendations 15 out of the 40 recommendations that have been issued by the financial action task force. These recommendations provide guidance to national authorities such as NAMLOK, Virtual Asset Providers, Financial Entities and the like to better understand the risks and potential exposure in relation to money laundering, terrorists and proliferation financing. It calls for institutions to conduct effective and continuous customer due diligence. That Virtual Asset Business Act would provide for anyone wanting to provide Virtual Asset Business from or within St. Lucia would have to be licensed. That means they would have to submit an application to the financial services regulatory authority to be approved as a Virtual Asset Service Provider. The Executive Director stated that NAMLOK is aware that Virtual Assets are a burning issue for many stakeholders and the intent of the legislation is not to stifle investment opportunities. We as Prudential Regulator and even as the money laundering or terrorist financing regulators such as the Financial Intelligence Authority we understand that the objective is not to stifle the growth of Virtual Asset but rather to make sure that we remain compliant. A number of key stakeholders have volunteered their services to NAMLOK to address gaps in St. Lucia's anti-money laundering legislation and the ongoing national risk assessment. For the National Competitiveness and Productivity Council, Glenn Simon reporting.