Welcome everyone to the self-healing test, the Holy Grail of Test Automation or just a lot of ado about nothing by Mathias Zaks. Now without further delay, over to you Mathias. Thank you very much. Thank you very much for the kind introduction. And yeah, thank you for having me here at Agilindia. It's a pleasure and the honor to be here. Today I want to talk a little bit about self-healing tests. Yeah, and self-healing test, this is a topic which has a lot to do with these buzzwords like machine learning, artificial intelligence, test automation. And these buzzwords are more or less present in each and every IT company. So this is kind of a really hot topic. And I come as an engineer and as an engineer, I always try to search for new solutions. So you could say I'm searching for the Holy Grail. I don't know if you know the movie Indiana Jones and The Last Crusade. If not, they're also searching for a Holy Grail and there are a lot of stumbling stones to come there. So quite tricky to get to the Holy Grail and also if you dare and you see that it's so beautiful. This doesn't mean that it's really valuable for you or that it works. And if self-healing test is the Holy Grail for Test Automation or just a lot of noise about nothing. Yeah, this I will clarify today. But first let me introduce myself a little bit that you know who is speaking. Yeah, I'm Matthias Taks. I am from Austria. So I'm living in Vienna and I am working for RBI. So RIPers and Punk International. They are as an agile engineering coach. This is not to do a lot with Grum or Kanban. It's more about the mature level of software development when we are training because with an agile transformation, we saw that we also have to increase or just work different with different technologies. And I personally focus myself in Test Automation. I am furthermore the organizer for the community of practice for Test Automation, which is an internal community where we foster Test Automation topics. You see, it's kind of my passion. And I also come as a developer by heart because this is kind of what I am. And now switch a little bit into the Test Automation area. Furthermore, I want to share what we are doing on conferences so that also you can benefit from that and also that we get feedback that we see if you're on the right track and doing cool things. And I also contribute to the paperwork. So I'm author for IT Megasins, which is also a nice experience for myself. Yeah, if you want to get in contact with me, please use the contact data preferable on LinkedIn. It's always nice to share and see and contribute. Good. Back to our great topic, self-healing test. So let me give you a little bit of agenda or the storyline of how I structured the talk. It's about first, I want to give you motivation why I focused on this topic. Why I have even investigated on it. Then I will share some numbers. So during my research, I found some cool numbers which fostered also my decision. And I want to share those of course. And then I will tell you what's the problem, what's the solution and what's my product I have chosen to tackle the problem. And then we have Q&A. We have enough time for that because this is important for me that we also that you have the possibility to ask. Good. Motivation. What motivated me why I have even investigated into the topic. First, I want to make a statement. This is software or test automation is software development. Hopefully everyone is in this opinion. If not, we can definitely have a great discussion afterwards in the Q&A. But for now, test automation is software development. This means it needs to be sustainable. It needs to be maintained. It needs to be refracted. It needs to get the same attention as business related code. This is very important. And maintenance especially, maybe you know or that this is, yeah, expensive, sometimes disgusting, annoying. And of course I want to decrease this maintenance effort. And if you get the test reports from the test execution from the test automation from the pipeline, maybe. And you have then you have some failing tests and you have to do that root cause analyzing. And this is very time consuming. And especially if you have done some patterns, you see, for example, my locator change and something like this. Then this is really annoying. And I was like, come on, there has to be a solution outside or why I have to do things. Same repeat myself. Yeah, because I'm really. Automate practitioner something like this. Yes, I really want to automate things where I see I repeated. And so I started to research. And here I found some numbers, some quite well known companies like Gardner and also Telerik. Telerik is a company they did a research on test automation back best practices and also maintenance and they published some numbers. And the first number I found which is maybe the most important one. It's got big 73.5% of all failing tests are caused of bright locators or a bad locator strategy. And this is a very huge number with a huge potential because this is exactly where our self feeling test is working against it. And I definitely want to decrease this number. The next two numbers are more related to automation. The first is 40% until we talk about this is kind of a trend in 2023. 40% of all teams or it teams will use some machine learning or even AI algorithms to get more agility to achieve more agility and scalability. So this is kind of a trend where we see a lot of things will get automated and also some touring will support us here. The next number is even much higher. It's 90% and this is really interesting. This is from Gardner. They say that 90% of all IT companies will have a dedicated job role called automation architect or automation engineer something like this. And then you have a reference number. Today it's about 20%. So this is a big trend there. My topic with self feeling test is really in the automation part of course and test automation. Gardner went even further. It is quite interesting. They invented a new term called hyper automation. What is hyper automation? In my words, hyper automation is the orchestration for the automation. So it's kind of you have an effective combination of a complementary set of tools to so at the end to achieve or to scale the automation. With tactical and also strategic goals. So it's kind of you orchestrate your automation because you have quite a lot of automation tools in place. And at some point in time you have to orchestrate it. And I did a Google trend research on that and you see some peaks in the past. Don't ask me what that this is. But since 2019 you see that there is a trend ongoing. People are searching for that. So this is a hyper automation is trendy. And self feeling test is has to do with hyper automation. So this is what we motivated me. So I wanted to decrease maintenance effort and doing the research. I saw that. Okay, this is a hot topic. So there must be a solution. But before I come to the solution, I want to share the problem and look at this picture. Look how old I look at that picture. And I was just kidding. That's not me, but maybe I look like that. If I again doing root cause analyzes and I find the exception with no such element. Yeah, so the problem what I tackling today is the no such element exception. What is this no such element exception? Maybe you know it, but still I want to explain it. It's a common exception in GUI testing. For example, if you use Selenium and the your automation scripts are not able to to get the element on the website. So it's not visible or it's you have some latency problems or the locator changed. And you know, I mean application changes after each release more or less. And in days where we release very, very fast, the application continuously changes and people change. And they can if you get new people into the team and you maybe have don't have very good common agreements or even that you kind of force it. Then they can change locators. They can invent new naming conventions. And if you have a very mature DevOps team, you can of course predict a lot that in the communication. But you know, sometimes the communication between testers and developers is not that well. Or even you use external software components like you have in your website. I don't know Facebook like buttons and something like this or other plugins. Those locators you don't have in your control and if they change, of course you have to do something. So this is exactly the problem. And for that I searched for the solution. And the solution is of course I spoiled it already on my title. It's self feeling. So self feeling tests. What is self feeling? What do I talk here? And overall you can say that self feeling is the automation for the test automation. So self feeling, there is running a process on your server in your test automation and it fetches data or grabs data. So additional data about the system, about the objects, about your website and stores it. And based on this data, it will learn. So this also means how more often you execute and run the stuff, the more data gets produced. And the better the learning algorithms can work and can then deliver you then solutions or self-healed locators in my area now. And at the end it's kind of a key to build an efficient test automation and test automation maintenance process. So this is very, very important. And this sounds really cool. So you know the problem now and the solution. And then I started of course researching about tools. And as you all know nowadays it's a tool mess outside. If you search for something you get so many tools and somehow it's really difficult to choose one. And so there are several commercial tools like from Marble, Test.IM or Crescentist. This is of course no product pitch here. It's just that you hear some numbers, some numbers from companies. And I as I called myself developer by heart like really like open source stuff. And I found one. And this is called Helinium. It's open source. And you can see here the GitHub link. Everything is published. And yeah, this is really cool. What is Helinium? Well, let me explain it. Helinium is open source as already mentioned. And it's based on Selenium and Java. So this is kind of also a precondition if you want to use it. And it's a real-time engine. What do I mean with that? This is really cool. It runs with your test execution. So nothing has to be installed on any server or something like this. The integration is done on the test automation suite. So it runs with it. It's a library. And of course it needs some infrastructure based on behind. I will explain you afterwards. It has this machine learning algorithm in place. So it consumes tons of data kind of and learns. Yeah, I have not investigated how the algorithm is designed. I also don't care to be honest. It has it in place. And for the developers, which is quite cool, they have an IntelliJ IDEA plugin, which is also easier than for the maintenance. If some healing is ongoing, that you see the results and then you can use them. The integration, how is the integration done? It's really easy. As I mentioned, nothing has to be installed on the server. Also on the test execution servers. The integration is done on the locators. So if you use locators like find buy or buy, I guess mostly common use locators, then you can use Selenium because the integration is done a level higher. So it's done on the web driver. And you can see it here. So in general, you have here your web driver, your Chrome driver. You also use a Chrome and then based on that, you can create the cell-filling driver. And then this driver you can use afterwards for your locators. So this is how the integration is done. Of course, you need some configuration files and so on where you tell the Helinium where the backend servers are and so on. But these are details. This is just what you have to prepare and as I mentioned, this property file. So this is what Helinium is about. Now I want to explain to you also how Helinium is designed from the components that it's really transparent because for me it took, I don't know, one or two hours to install everything. It was really cool, yeah? So what is Helinium? How is Helinium the components are? First, everything starts with test automation code. If you don't have the test automation code, you should maybe investigate the data and invest in test automation. It pays off. Here you have to integrate it with your Helinium client. So it's kind of the Helinium jar. So this is what you have to do. Then you have more or less everything done from this integration perspective. What you have to, of course, install is a Helinium backend. This is a REST for web service. And you can install it by your own or they have a docker support. So you can run it inside a docker, which is very convenient. So you just have to pull the docker image and run it. And of course, it needs a database. So this is kind of the Helinium Postgres database. See, everything is here also free. And this is also delivered by a docker image. So nothing intensive to configure. And for those who are really lazy like me, they also support or deliver a docker compose file. So you just have to download this Yammer file and start it. And both of these docker images get started. And you can interact with it through the REST for web service. So this is from that perspective, two things are missing. On the one side, as I mentioned, the IntelliJID plugin. Of course, you can download from the marketplace. It's integrated with the automation code. Yes, of course. And with the REST for web service. So this is from that perspective, but that's optional. And also for the reporting, they have a Gradle and a Maven plugin because they need to tell the backend when a new test execution is done or triggered that they can deliver a better report. But also that is optional. They don't have to use it. And yeah, so that's the component smallest. As I mentioned, everything very easy, straightforward and easy to use. Good. As next point, I want to, this is now kind of the most exciting one. I prepared an example that you really see various Helinium working, what do you get and so on. And here I prepared the example again with an open source project. Yeah. I guess you see a pattern. And this is a digital bank app also on GitHub. And I just prepared here a test case for the login. Good. So as I mentioned, this is our digital bank running. Yeah. It's a website. You can see here our test automation framework. You can see here, this is the Helinium backend. So very sophisticated now here. And this is defined by a locator. So you can see here, this is not with the password. And you can see here kind of the snippet of the HTML. You can see, oh yeah, that's the input. The ID is passed with that. So everything is fine. Good. Now you know, we have a pipeline. It's always executed. So it gets triggered. The test automation framework tries to find the element. And it has found the element. Cool. Everything is nice. But this status is quite difficult to read. Maybe the successful found gets also transported to the Helinium jar. And this gets also then forwarded to the Helinium backend. There it stores the additional data. So nice. Cool. So in your test execution, you see a green sign. Everything is fine. Good. Now, new version. New version comes. That's usual. And yeah, they implemented new naming conventions. If this is now realistic or not, we don't care. But the new name convention for the attribute ID. There was another HTML time. So password gets password input. Okay. Good. They, of course, deploy everything and the test gets executed. It tries to find the element. Yeah. And of course, what happens now? Boom. Exactly. No such element exception. But this is now in the locks. So you don't get that because Helinium is in place. And this status element not found or not such element gets forwarded again to the Helinium client. This gets forwarded to the backend. There the algorithm starts working. And it delivers new locators. Yeah. And these locators get then forwarded again to the test execution. And it tries to refine the element. You also can define refined counters and so on. How often you should try it. And it founds the element. Awesome. But why? Because it's not in the right box. Yeah. And if you go inside, you can see that it's first it in the red box, it first used the password one. Yeah. So this then it tries to heal. And you see it's used the heal locator now. With a score of 79 something. I don't know what that is. Yeah. Maybe this is the algorithm. Yeah. And it used the CSS selector input password. Yeah. So with ID again. So that's very interesting. Historical data. It also takes the data from the current run. Which is really nice. And of course an ID has a very high value. If I would remove the ID now, it would probably take the name. Yeah. Or I don't know. Most probably. And this is really cool. Yeah. So also if I locate the changes, it tries to take the new one. And yeah. Sorry. And the test screen. Yeah. So you don't see it. The test screen. You're just in the report. You would see that it healed it. But from the execution perspective, everything is fine. Good. Awesome. Two things are missing. As I already mentioned, report and again the ID plugin. First, the report. The report is available also from this rest for web server. But here you get delivered a GUI. And from each execution, you get then the healed report. And you can see here where nicely what was the failed locator. So you can see the password in the ID. And then also the healed one and a nice picture next to it. And also kind of a target where you can see if it's successful or not. I guess this is then that the algorithm learns from it a little bit better. The viewers can tell it that it didn't work. But I have not tested that one. Yes. Cool. From a recommendation from my perspective that this report is a little bit, it's nice, but I would integrate it into your current reporting, whatever you're using, maybe to also implement the new status. Yeah. Because generally you have the green ones and the red ones. Yeah. So the successful tests and then the failed ones. And I highly recommend to implement the search status kind of orange one where it's kind of the heat locators. Yeah. You can get this data out of this series. Server and that you see it. Yeah. Because it's quite nice to have this really. But also it's very nice to use it for a discussion with the developers that is telling it, hey, guys, or in the next grooming or in the rate or wherever you want. Yeah. Hey, guys, why we have 10 heat locators? Yeah. Why have changed them? Yeah. Because of course you want to, you want to use that also not only for the healing, but also as a discussion basement. And how does the IntelliJ plugin look like? This is like this. So you have your source code and you can do a right click on the locators. You have the healing results in the context menu. And if you click there, you have the or locators healed ones from that. So you can see the second one is this ID password input with the score 79. And the other one is, I don't know that one to be honest. Yeah. Good. So self-filling. What is self-filling? Self-filling is the automation for the test automation. Self-filling saves time in maintenance of the automation script. Self-filling. Source. Definitely there is no such element exception. And self-filling with open source means healing. And if you ask me now, is self-filling not this holy grail for test automation? Difficult question. Yeah. I would say, yeah. Yeah. It's the right way. I really like, I mean, you see that automation, hype automation, it's a high trend. It's a hot topic. And with Helinium, you don't have a huge border to get into that. Yeah. It's open source. You can really fast start it. Of course, if you're using Java and Helinium, and you can use it to get first experiences in this area. Yeah. I really like it. It's maybe not the holy grail. Yeah. But it's definitely one of the right steps into the right direction. I really enjoyed it. It was a really nice experience for my side. And yeah, that's what I can say to that. Thank you very much now for your attention. Hopefully it was interesting. Hopefully it was inspiring for you. And now you have time for questions. Good. There's one question. What if Helinium back end provided input conflict with another input field?  Okay. The first question for conflict with another input field. I have never experienced that one, to be honest. All of my healings were always properly done. But I also have to say we don't have it now running one of our production products. It was a PUC, which we have done and we tested, I don't know, yeah, a lot of tests and all of them were really good. Of course, some of them, there was no healing. But for those where healing was possible, it really worked and there were no conflicts with others. I guess this, based on the data, the conflict is really rarely. But in theory, if I think about it, could be possible. But as I mentioned, up to now there was nothing. And the second one, does Helinium back end database prepared or it's just jump rewards? Who? I really don't know exactly the question. I mean, the database is in Postgres in Helinium. It's in Docker. Everything is really nice. You can also query it if you want to do your own researchers. So this is really easy to use. But I have not investigated. I just used it. Another question from Edina. Hello, Matthias. My question, is there any security aspect into this to be aware of? In my opinion, not. I mean, the data which is saved, so the server is in your responsibility. It's not somewhere in the cloud. I mean, you can, of course, it's a Docker container. You can run it wherever you want to. So about this data, you have to care about, of course. If you store it somewhere. But it's only about locators. So you don't store any data off the website itself. It's just about the HTML there. And so I don't see any security issues here. The next question. Does Helinium back and data, sorry, that point we had already, means do we need to prepare database? No, you don't need to prepare the database. Everything is done in this Docker image. So everything is set up. The database is initialized or the tables are created or permissions are set. The database user, everything is done for you. You don't have to do anything. What I did, I downloaded really the Docker Compose Yammerfile. And I just did Docker Compose run or up to come out now. And it provided me more or less an open port, which is a web server and it worked. So this is really, really easy. I really enjoyed that one. Another question. Do we have any self-filling test tool for unit test or cucumber test? Just curious to know. I really don't know. Sorry for that. I really focused here on the Selenium one. I also don't know how it could heal the error, you know, because which kind of tests. I mean, if it's a UI test, yes, but on unit test level, you probably don't test the UI, hopefully. And yeah, cucumber, it's just bit of the year. So sorry. Another question. So self-filling here is finding the missing element, right? So self-filling here is finding the missing element. Yeah, kind of the changed element, yes.  It also was like this self-filling could be used to optimize the locators or and it's like, yeah, in theory, yes. So it's also that, I mean, in one side the application changed. You cannot find the element and it tries to find it differently. But if you have, for example, a very, very complex element and because of a latency, it cannot find the element. So it just, it takes too long and the algorithm is activated. It tries to refind it with a locator which is spread from helium and then it, in theory, could optimize your locators. So the tool itself has quite a potential and it's, of course, in a very early stage. There's quite a lot of ongoing. Meetup project. There's quite a lot of contribution and maybe to mention it's also available for for APU. So you can also use it for your mobile app testing. This I've totally forgot to mention. Sorry for that. So this is, you see it's, there is the tool is evolving. But at the end, self-filling kind of tries to find the missing or the changed element. Yeah. Thank you everyone for joining this session today. Yep. Thank you very much.


Hi, my name is Chad and I'm the founder and CEO of Scantar. We in 2017 started with generating AR avatars and we're building the biggest library of AR avatars in the world, 110 of our IPs. And the problem in that case was that it takes a lot of time to animate 3D characters, you know, to get every emotion right. Because if you want to create a library, you want to capture each and every possibility that a 3D character needs to resemble. So that's the problem that we found in generating, you know, when we want to generate a lot of content from reality, there needs to be a smarter way. There needs to be a way where we're able to combine technologies like machine learning so that our production pipelines could be significantly reduced. And that's how we see in one space, one micro aspect of this is animation. When we're able to automate the entire animation process and reduce those production timelines, I think that would be a really interesting solution for the market. So what we did was we took a 3D asset and we linked that 3D asset to the multiple different animations that we have. Now, the 3D asset is able to be linked to those animations based on voice command. So the user says, hey, I'm really happy today. It chooses the relevant animation through our network or our model. And through that process, it's able to identify the right animation, right blend shapes, which are expressions and a 3D model in that case and also link it to the relevant environment. And give an output in that case, which is completely in sync with what the user is trying to say. And that's how we see a very interesting mix of how machine learning is integrated on to the automated animation space. And that's how we are specifically leveraging it and we think that the use cases go way beyond AR. It has huge use cases for the animation industry and also content generation in VR as well. We see now that automated animation has already generated a lot of interest and it's really exciting of what could be the use cases for it. One of the use cases that we see right now is AR avatars. And every big ecosystem has their own AR avatars where you can customize and create your own stuff. And our objective is we can make all of those ecosystems and all of those avatars intelligent. Now these avatars are being leveraged as a medium of communication and augmented reality is a natural tool for it. Now let me give you an example of how this could work. You're at your home and you say, hey Alexa, tell John I'm gonna reach at 7.30pm. I'm sorry I'm late. Hey Alexa, tell John I am gonna reach at 7.30pm. I am sorry I am late. John receives this message. It could be either through a smartphone notification within an iMessage or a WhatsApp or whosoever we're able to integrate with or it could be through a smart device. Once John receives this message, avatar pops out and says, hey I'm sorry I'm gonna reach at 7.30pm. I'm sorry I'm late. I am gonna reach at 7.30pm. I am sorry I am late. Now this AR avatars depicts exactly what the user is supposed to say and depict the right emotion. Now this entire process allows the avatar to animate itself based on the voicing course and that gives us liberty to integrate across ecosystems. So we're able to integrate with smart speakers, messenger applications, smartphone manufacturers and also smart glasses manufacturers because we've seen that as also a prospective medium of communication. So there are immense possibilities of how we could leverage this. I've been involved with augmented and virtual reality for the past few years now. I even started Tesla's ARVR group. I'm excited to join SCANTA because of our vision and our direction. At SCANTA we're using artificial intelligence to automate the animation of our 3D characters called picamojis. Picamojis are 3D spatial characters that allow people to add new, fun and interesting things to their conversations with their friends around the world using augmented and virtual reality. The technology behind animating these 3D characters has massive potential. It has the potential of saving filmmakers and animators literally billions of dollars through our platform. There's a few challenges that we're going to be facing over the coming years as we build this platform. One is going to be selecting and building out the right deep learning models. Next is going to be creating and optimizing our pipeline. And finally the biggest one of all is going to be data. Finding the right type of data and enough of it to create compelling animations. I'm looking forward to the coming years as we build out our world-class team to create this incredible product.


You're listening to the Naked Bible Podcast. To support this podcast, visit nakedbiblepodcast.com and click on the support link in the upper right-hand corner. If you're new to the podcast and Dr. Heizer's approach to the Bible, click on newstarthere at nakedbiblepodcast.com. Welcome to the Naked Bible Podcast, Episode 223, our 31st Q&A. I'm the layman, Trey Strickland, and he's the scholar, Dr. Michael Heizer. Hey Mike, how you doing? I'm sweating, Trey. You and me both. What must mean you're actually in my state of Texas? It does. As we're recording this, I am in the Dallas area, and man, is it hot? It is hot. It is that. And what makes it even hotter, Mike, is when your air-condition unit goes out, which is what I'm suffering.  Yes, it makes it even hotter. It's not fun. I'm sitting here right now sweating as we're talking. Boy, oh boy. Just know however bad you have it. Just know that I have it just a little bit worse than you. Yeah, well, I'm in a hotel, so it's not bad now, but out and about, it's hot. Right, right. So you were doing some French pop recording. Yep. I take it. So how'd that go? Anything to report there on that end or anything? Well, we got our full crop of episodes. We got 10 or 12, depending on how we divide things up. So yeah, we had a good week. That's good. Well, I guess maybe since we're talking about other shows, Mike, we ought to remind people about our PuroNormal show. I think we've got a three-part good series about quantum physics and metaphysics. Part one's out now, and over the next two months, the other two parts will come out. So if you haven't checked out our PuroNormal show. Yeah, people are already talking about that. We did two interviews for Fringe Pop this week, and both, again, without giving away too many details, both people we interviewed were heavily involved in the new age and Satanism and just stuff like that. And, you know, they were very familiar with the, to put it unkindly, gobbledygook that sort of gets passed off as metaphysical commentary or theology based on quantum physics. So it's a really timely series. Also, Mike, I want to let people know that last week we opened up the voting for the next book of the Bible that we're going to cover on the podcast. And the voting ends July 12th at 12 p.m. And that's central time. So that's Thursday, July 12th at 12 p.m. Central Standard Time is when the voting will end. So you got at least another week or so to vote. So go do it. Yeah, make sure you vote. There you go. You can get it on Facebook. You can get it on NecrobiblePodcast.com website or DrMSH.com website to vote. And all right, Mike. Well, this episode we actually have about six questions from two people. So we're going to tackle a bunch of questions here. I'm ready if you are. Yeah, let's jump into it. Our first one is from Margo. I have read arguments that Caleb, a prince of Judah, was most likely a Gentile convert. And I've also read arguments that Caleb was most likely not a Gentile convert. This seems to be a lively topic in messianic circles with messianics favoring a Gentile origin for Caleb. Do you take a position on this question? Yeah, we should tell everybody. Trey, let me see the questions here and this fortunate that he did because this question is extremely complicated. We're probably going to take half the episode to address this question. So it was good to get a heads up. And what I decided here was rather than trying to wing it, since it is so complicated, you know, the interest of time and clarity, I'm going to quote at length on and off from the Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary Articles on Caleb, which that one's by Mark Fritz and Raphael Panitz. And the article on Kenaz, which is by a different author, whose last name was Kunz, we're going to have to hit both of those. And I'll make some summary comments along the way to try to tighten things up here. But I don't really know why the messianic movement cares about this. After I go through the material, I'm going to venture a guess here, at least part of the messianic movement. But I really don't see any importance to it one way or the other. And I think in the end, you'll see it's it's a bit of a moot point because does it really make much of a difference is some if someone was born into Abraham's lineage or married into it or absorbed into the the family of Abraham, the family of God at some other point or in some other way. So I, you know, I don't know why it's important, but we'll just just jump in here. The first thing we have to sort of establish here is that there are actually three people in the Old Testament with that are named Caleb. So Fretz and Panitz write this to summarize kind of the getting into the topic here, at least the at least the beginning part here. They say any discussion of the name Caleb and its variant form must of necessity also entail an investigation of the Calebites or the descendants of Caleb. And that's going to become an issue as we'll see it's kind of important because depending on sort of which Caleb you're talking about, it's going to involve geography and sort of towns and things within a certain geographical area that that get absorbed into the tribe of Judah. So sidebar here before we we jump back into the three candidates or the three Caleb's here, the root, you know, someone might be out there wondering if this has anything to do with the question. I actually don't know, but I'm I'm just throwing this out here. But the root of Caleb is KLB, OK, you know, Kaaf, Lamid, Bet in Hebrew, which means dog. And that should not be presumed to be automatically a pejorative or a negative thing. The root occurs in basically every Semitic language and it can indicate either some sort of self abasement or debasement. That would be the negative connotation. Or it can denote faithful servant, like faithfulness as in just servitude. So you'll actually see if you if you ran a concordant search on Caleb of the Hebrew term in the through the Hebrew Bible, you'd get examples in the Bible of both a negative and a positive connotation. So with that sidebar over that, let's go to the three Caleb's here because there are three of these guys and they all this is where it gets kind of kind of convoluted. You have to sort of land on one for the sake of the question. So again, quoting from Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary article on Caleb, the frets and panits, right? The son of Jefuna and the representative of the tribe of Judah among the 12 spies sent out by Moses to reconnoiter the land of Canaan is sort of the first one. That's the one everybody thinks of in contrast to God prohibiting the people from entering the land because they rejected his recommendation. God singled out, quote, my servant Caleb, unquote, and promised to bring him into the land where he had gone and to give it to his descendants as a possession. It's numbers 14, also numbers 26, Deuteronomy 136, so on and so forth. This promise set Caleb apart from all his peers, even Joshua. And it raises the issues of geographical location and genealogical identification of Caleb and the Calebites and continuing the land that came to be owned by Caleb through apportionment. That's the doling out by a lot to the tribes, the land of the tribes, Joshua 14 and 15. So the land came to be owned by Caleb through apportionment, through force. Again, he has to go and fight for it or a combination of the two. But these two means was associated with Hebron and Devere in Southern Palestine. First Samuel 3014 identifies part of this area as, quote, the Negev of Caleb, unquote. If we identify the cities and boundaries of the tribe of Judah, it becomes obvious that the land owned by or associated with Caleb is located within Judah's borders. And the reference for that is Joshua 15, one through 12. Hebron is a key element in this association, in part because of its proximity to other Judahite cities, but in light of the centrality of the Davidic dynasty in the biblical tradition, it was as the first capital city of David that Hebron played an unquestionable and an important role. Note that Naval, Nabal or Nabal, the first husband of David's wife, Abigail, was a Calabite who lived in this region. That's first Samuel 25. Three that will stop the quote there just to say, here's at this point, you know, that's the guy we're all thinking of, OK, that the question is really targeting. But it's actually at this point where things get complicated with the other two Calabs. So going back to the article, we'll read some more. So, quote, in First Chronicles, several genealogies contain the name Calab, and these reflect inconsistencies of lineage and raise questions in light of the other biblical information about individuals named Calab. First, Calab, the son of Jafuna, is only explicitly mentioned in a genealogy of the sons of Kenaz or the Kenazites. That's First Chronicles 4, 13 through 15, which is set within a section concerning the descendants of Perez. The daughter of this Calab is named elsewhere as Aqsa. That's Joshua 15, 16 and 17, and judges one, 12 to 13. While an Aqsa is listed as the daughter of Calab, the son of Hezron. So you got one, you know, you get this daughter of Calab in those references, then you have a daughter of Calab listed as the daughter of Calab, the son of Hezron. So you've got you got the Jafuna guy, the Jafuna Calab. Now you got the Calab, the son of Hezron here. Aqsa is listed as the daughter of Calab, the son of Hezron and a grandson of Perez. Second, the Maseridic text never identifies the wife of Calab, the son of Jafuna.  Are they different? What's going on here? Back to the quote. However, Calab, the son of Hezron has several wives and concubines and his descendants are not easily placed in his genealogy. It's 1 Chronicles 2, 18-24, 42-55. One identifiable descendant, Bezalel, 1 Chronicles 2, 20, a great grandson of Calab, the son of Hezron, was a contemporary of Moses, according to Exodus 31, 2 and 35, 30. And therefore that one, he can't be the great grandson or excuse me, can't be the great grandson of Calab, the son of Jafuna. So, right away, we're getting a confusion here with Calab, these two Calabs and the relatives. They can't be the same. So third, a Calab, the son of Hor, can be identified according to the Maseridic text of 1 Chronicles 250. But according to his genealogy, 1 Chronicles 2, 42-55, this Calab appears to be his own grandfather. Fourth, the names of some of Calab's descendants are place names. In other words, they're not people names. They're place names, Takoa, Zif, Mademana and Hebron, which complicates an attempt to understand the purpose of the genealogies. Now, Williamson in his New Century Bible commentary on 1 Chronicles 2 resolves these problems by assuming that the chronicler pulled together most of the genealogies but was not concerned with the details of genealogical consistency. Rudolph, who's a German scholar, on the other hand, attributes the inconsistencies to later additions, which disrupted the consistencies of the chronicler's composition. It is generally agreed that one section, 1 Chronicles 2, 42-50, derives from a tradition which predates the chronicler, probably from the United Monarchy or shortly thereafter. That's according to Williams' opinion in his New Century Bible commentary. Now, the Anchor Bible article continues and says, the key to resolving the tensions in these genealogies is the fact that Caleb is part of Judah's genealogy. Caleb, the son of Jephuna, is a kenozite who gained special status through his deeds in the wilderness wanderings and the conquest stories. On the other hand, Caleb, the son of Hesron, plays a role only in the genealogies of Judah and Bezalel, the tabernacle builder, seems to be the central character in his genealogy. The chronicler does not attempt to relate Caleb, the son of Jephuna, to Caleb, the son of Hesron, because neither of them is central to his purpose of establishing a royal and cultic origin in the tribe of Judah. And that's the opinion of Williamson on page 52 of his commentary. Caleb, the kenozite, is important, rather, because of things he did. Numbers 13 and 14, Joshua 14, and the associations he had, Joshua 15, Judges chapter one, outside the chronicler's framework. Let me read that sentence again without the verse references. Caleb, the kenozite, is important, rather, because of things he did and associations he had outside the chronicler's framework, although these were not unknown to the chronicler. Therefore, in addressing the questions raised above, Caleb, the kenozite, who appears in 1 Chronicles 4.15, within the lineage of Perez, is to be identified with the individual so well known from the tradition of Calebites in Southern Palestine. Numbers 13 through 14 and Joshua 14 through 15. To ask whether his daughter, Aksa, is the same as the daughter of Caleb, the son of Hesron in 1 Chronicles 2.49, misses the point of the genealogy, at least in chronicles. So, you know, we have to distinguish these two. And to continue, again, with a quote just a little bit more, this introduces the final issue of the function of genealogies. According to Wilson, and a little rabbit trail here, Wilson is one of the recognized experts in biblical genealogies. He's got a bunch of articles and a book on it. According to Wilson, genealogies can be used to delineate social and political ties. Now, catch that social and political ties, not necessarily blood ties, OK, social and political ties between two groups, and in particular, to incorporate marginally affiliated clans into a central group. So I'll stop here just to make the point again. Genealogies are not always about lineal biological descent. They can be about social and political relationships. OK, back to the quote. The genealogy of Caleb is related in this way to the tribe of Judah, that is socially and politically, and was assimilated into the Israelite tribal system thereby. Not only the individuals and groups of people, but the places associated with them become part of the tribe of Judah. Thus, the genealogy provided a means for legitimizing social relations and for defining the geographical domain of the individuals or groups concerned. And here's their conclusion. It would appear that Caleb, the son of Jephuna is the name of a kenozite whose personal exploits became the tradition of the clan which took his name as a patron to the clan is named after. This clan existed independently in southern Palestine, but through political, economic and religious ties, it eventually became part of the tribe of Judah, even within the larger Israelite tradition. The distinctive stories the Calebites were retained into the post-exilic period. Now, that's the end of the Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary article on Caleb. And the thing to take away from this is that you could see why some would insist that Caleb is an Israelite because of this relationship to Judah. But what the article points out is that you can't rely on the genealogies to talk about biological relationships, blood relationships. Sometimes genealogies are about social and political circumstances. And again, the evidence points to Caleb, the son of Jephuna, which is the Caleb that everybody's thinking about with the conquest story, that that Caleb was he and his relatives, he and his tribe were incorporated into Judah, not because of blood relationships, they're not Judahites, but the incorporation of Caleb and that tribe into Judah is based really on geography and political relationships and social relationships that really are tied to geography. So that last paragraph, it would appear that Caleb, the son of Jephuna is the name of the kenozite again, who's from Southern Palestine. That last paragraph means we now need to think about kenozites. OK, what's up with them? And for that, I'll go to a different article in the Anchorage Bible Dictionary, the article on kenoz. That's K-E-N-A-Z for those of you who have that resource. And if you don't have the resource, I highly recommend it. It's very detailed. The kenozites are ostensibly related to kenoz, but there are three kenozes in the Old Testament. So here's how the article or the author of this article, his last name is Quince, summarizes the three kenozes. He says, quote, first, there is Knaz, the son of Eliphaz, the firstborn son of Esau and Adah. That's Genesis 3611, first Chronicles 136, who functioned as an Edomite clan chief, again, according to Genesis 3615 and 42. Though Knaz of Genesis 3611 is ordinarily understood to be the eponymous ancestor of the kenozites, in other words, their remote progenitor. According to Genesis 1519, Quince writes, this connection is not buttressed by hard evidence. Second, there is Knaz, the younger brother of Caleb and the father of Othniel. That's Joshua 1517, judges 113, 39 and 11. In First Chronicles 413, Knaz is credited with a second son, Soraya. Third, there is Knaz, the grandson of Caleb, through Elah. That's First Chronicles 415. The plural gentilic adjective, that's sort of a people, gentilic refers to a people group term. The plural gentilic adjective, kenozites, surfaces but one time in the Old Testament, Genesis 1519, within a promise that Yahweh makes to Abraham in a theophany, listed in second position just after the Kenites. This is one of ten peoples whose land Yahweh intends to deliver to Abraham's descendants. In the singular form, this gentilic adjective is three times attested, Numbers 30 to 12, Joshua 14, 6 and verse 14. In the phrase, quote, Caleb, the son of Jephuna, the kenozite. This predication probably should be associated with the kenozites of Genesis 1519. The kenozites were a non-Israelite ethnic group that presumably penetrated the Negev from the southeast. What little is known about them emerges mainly from consideration of their wider geopolitical context. Though scholars lack the necessary data for reconstructing the early history of these tribes in any detail, it is nonetheless clear that owing to the prominence of David and the increasingly sturdy position of the tribe of Judah from whence he came, these southern tribes were eventually subsumed under the category of, quote, greater Judah. From the narrative in Numbers 13 and 14, we may infer that the Calabites settled into the city of Hebron. And these non-Israelite people settled into the city of Hebron and subjected its quite promising agricultural environments to their advantage. In Joshua 1513-19 and Judges 11-15, which is its parallel, the spotlight falls on the Othnielites. We are told that Othniel, the son of Kenoz, the younger brother of Calab, took possession of the city of Devere, southwest of Hebron. Though the text is too laconic to be of much help to biblical historians, it does attest that the Othnielites, residing in the hill country directly southwest of Hebron, clustered around Devere. To the southeast of Hebron, the Kenites held sway in the vicinity of Arad, according to Judges 11-16. The precise extent of the territories claimed by the Calabites, the Othnielites, and the Kenites is unknowable. Last section here, several biblical genealogies denote that the Kenozites, Calabites, and the Othnielites were closely related tribal groups and that from their tent encampments along the foothills of southern Palestine, all three maintained intimate associations with their eastern Edomite neighbors. Calab and Othniel are both recognized for their genealogical linkage with Kenoz. In due course, the Kenozites and other neighboring southern tribal groups became thoroughly absorbed by Judah. That's the end of the Kunz article, at least what we'll quote from it. So you take all of that and where you land is the best position seems to be that Calab is not an Israelite, but that he and his family or his tribal group were absorbed into Israel, becoming part of Judah. Now, again, as I said at the beginning, I really don't have any idea why this is an interest to messianic Christians. It's no shock that outsiders became part of Israel in the Old Testament period. Rahab did. Job was from Uz, which is Edomite territory. Othniel is one of the judges. He would have also been an outsider. God uses outsiders and makes them part of his people. If anything, Calab and these other examples show non-Israelites becoming part of Israel, that's not news. I hope that this isn't some sort of quirky argument used by Hebrew roots folks. Again, that's a subset of the messianic category. So I hope it's not some argument used by Hebrew roots people to say Gentiles need to become Jews. And the New Testament says the exact opposite. Gentiles are the seed of Abraham. That's a quote from Galatians three and heirs according to the promise also point blank from Galatians three, not because of circumcision and not because of other laws, but because of Christ. Abraham is the example of faith apart from the law prior to his circumcision and prior to the giving of the law at Sinai. So I don't know how much clearer the Bible can be on this sort of stuff, but if you want to make the Bible say what your group prefers, I suppose you're going to find a way. Unfortunately, this has become sort of routine for this little community in Middle Earth, you know, to prefer your pet position on something ahead of the gospel of the kingdom. But again, I'm just guessing on what might be the motive here and that Hebrew roots is lurking behind this question, not on the part of the questioner, but this real interest in this or this, I don't know if I can even call it a fight since I haven't, you know, I don't lurk on Facebook or anywhere else to find out what Hebrew roots groups are saying. So I'm just guessing here. But if it is some sort of argument that Gentiles have to become Jews, it's a bad one. It's one that, again, just point blank ignores the language of the New Testament, and it ignores the fact that Abraham is the, you know, he is the litmus test. I mean, he is the point of reference for Paul as the example of faith. It has nothing to do with his circumcision. It has nothing to do with the law. Law didn't even exist and Abraham was justified before he was circumcised. I mean, God knew his heart and he believed before he was circumcised again. I just don't know how much clearer this can be. But there are some that just kind of don't really care. So maybe Hebrew roots is behind this, looking for another non sequitur argument. I don't know. It's just a guess. All right, Sean has our next few questions and he wants to know in certain Bible passages, the angel of the Lord sometimes doesn't seem to mean what we say it means in terms of second Yahweh figure. Is the term sometimes used more generally? Also, does Matthew 28 verse two run counter to Jesus being the angel entirely? Yeah, in the Old Testament, let me just preface it by saying this, you know, you can't assume in the New Testament, particularly that when it says the angel of the Lord in an English translation that we're talking about the Old Testament figure, it gets a little bit confusing because of translation. I'll try to explain that. In the Old Testament, the phrase Malak Yahweh is definite. When you see that combination, it's called a construct phrase in Hebrew, Malak, I don't know, Malak Yahweh. It is the angel of the Lord by rule of Hebrew grammar. When you have a noun, Malak, messenger, angel linked to a following noun that is definite and Yahweh is definite. There's only one of those proper names, proper personal names are definite by definition in Hebrew grammar. When you have one noun joined to a definite noun, it makes the whole chain definite. So it's the angel of Yahweh. So that's Hebrew grammar. There's no way in Hebrew to just say an angel of the Lord, just an angel of the Lord, in terms of the construct phrase, you'd have to have literally something like Malak Ladonai. That's Malak, it's preposition Lamed plus the divine name, which never occurs in the Hebrew Bible. In fact, you only get Ladonai and Malak in the same verse four times, but they're never in a possessive construction. So you really don't have in the Hebrew Bible a way to say an angel of the Lord. When you have this construct phrase, it's always definite, the angel of the Lord. That is not the case in Greek, and it's not the case in the New Testament. In the New Testament, you can express an angel of the Lord, just an indefinite one, because Greek allows you to do that. It doesn't have the same rules, syntactical, grammatical, syntactical rules as Hebrews. And Matthew 28, too, is actually an example. There's no definite article, the word the, before angel, on the loss in that verse. And the genitive relationship in Greek does not require definiteness. So a good translation is an angel of the Lord. There's no there's no necessary link back to that figure in the Old Testament. It's just generic. It's just it's indefinite. Now I'm going to read a little a little section from a footnote from my forthcoming angels book where I talk about this. So I saw a commercial here for the angels book. This is just part of a footnote. I wrote the phrase angel of the Lord occurs 11 times in the New Testament. Only once does it occur with the definite article suggesting a translation, the angel of the Lord. That's Matthew 124. It is the angel of the Lord. Again, how on the loss courier definite article before on the loss. It is the angel of the Lord who tells Joseph to marry his betrothed Mary because her conception, which would be Jesus, is from the Holy Spirit. There's no conflict between this occurrence and the idea that Jesus and the angel of the Lord from the Old Testament are the same second person of the Trinity Trinity. The definite article in Matthew 124 is it's there. The definite article is there. It's used to refer back to the angel who appeared to Joseph, a specific angel in a dream, four verses earlier in Matthew 120, where the phrase lacks the article. So in Matthew 120, you have angel of the Lord without the article. And then four verses later, as the story continues, the writer Matthew puts the definite article in front of Angelo, you know, on the loss courier to make sure that you know that that this angel I'm talking about now is the one that I talked about four verses earlier. That is a function of the definite article in Greek. The article preceding Angelo's is in grammatical parlance. Grammarians call an aphoric. That is, quote, it denotes previous reference reminding the reader of who or what was mentioned previously, which is the most common use of the article and the easiest usage to identify. That's a quote from Dan Wallace's book, Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics and Exegetical Syntax of the New Testament. So the presence of the article in Matthew 124 is therefore not to be taken as the language that imitates the Old Testament wording. So that's the end of my footnote. So no, there's there's not a conflict here, but it's easy to, you know, kind of get a little bit confused because of the way English handles the phrases. You've mentioned before that the Trinity view of Genesis 3 was wrong because, among other reasons, why would God tell Jesus and the Holy Spirit something he already knew? But doesn't Jesus say that there are things only the Father knows? Right. First, first of all, my comments didn't pertain to Genesis 3. So I think that that's got to be a typo. My comment was in reference to the plural exhortation in Genesis 126. Let us create humankind in our image saying that's that's that's not a conversation between the Trinity and in part because God doesn't need to announce something to the other members of the Trinity. They're co eternal and co omniscient and they already know. Now the answer to the question doesn't Jesus say that there are things only the Father knows is, yeah, yeah, Jesus doesn't know something that the Father does, like when the Lord's going to come back. But that was spoken when Jesus was incarnate. In the incarnation, the Son surrendered the independent use of his attributes. It doesn't mean he surrendered the attributes, by the way, just the use of them. He surrenders the exercise of them. And that was voluntary. It's limited by the incarnation and or the Father's will. We just think about it. Jesus could also get hungry. He could get tired. He could die. He could get sick. You know, he had to learn things. You know, Jesus grew in wisdom and stature in favor with God. Men lived to 52.  He is limited by being incarnate, by having a body, by being a man. The other two members of the Trinity aren't men. They are not embodied. They're not humans. The second person becomes human. And that changes the circumstances. It doesn't change his divine ontology, but it changes, again, his whole relationship to his attributes in terms of functioning as God in an unfiltered circumstance. And so by comment about Genesis 126 is a different context. It's pre incarnation. The son, the second person in the Trinity was not limited. So it's perfectly fine to say, hey, you know, back in Genesis 126, all the members of the Trinity would have known the same thing. They're co-eternal column mission. There's no limitation on any of them. It's a different circumstance when Jesus, you know, because of the incarnation, when Jesus is incarnate. And so that's when you get this language of limitation, you know, where Jesus doesn't know something that the father knows. So the circumstances are different. Sean's next question is, if Jesus conquered death and his kingdom is at hand, Mark nine, for instance, then why are principalities still called the rulers of this age? First Corinthians to he does say they are doomed to pass away. So is this more of the already, but not yet phrasing? Yeah, let me take the first part of that.  Really, it's because that language is based on or derives from the Deuteronomy 32 worldview. They're described as, you know, it's true that the rulers, you know, you have other terms here as well. In the New Testament are described as defeated, but but such titles, you know, these these sorts of labels are the way to identify who he's talking about in the context of the Old Testament, specifically the Deuteronomy 32 worldview. The fact that they are defeated, you know, moving to the the rest of the question here, the fact that they are defeated and are progressively losing people and losing control is part of the already, but not yet matrix of ideas. So I think Sean is tracking well on this. As the Great Commission is carried out, you know, they're they're going to be displaced. They have lost legitimacy of rule. Again, remember that these rulers, to use, again, New Testament language, had their position by virtue of Yahweh himself giving it to them at Babel with the disinheritance of the nations and assign the nations to the sons of God. But the work of the cross, you know, the plan, God's plan, the plan of the Most High withdrew that authority or nullified that authority or terminated that authority. Their rule is now illegitimate. It's over. So, you know, because when the whole incarnation, the cross event, the son of the Most High comes again, and part of his mission, the effect of his mission is to reclaim the nations. And so their their legitimacy is over and done with. Gentiles are authorized to put it this way, to return to the family of God. God wants them to return. They are included now in the covenant with Abraham, again, back to Galatians 3. You know, if you are Christ, you are Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise. Again, he's speaking to the Galatians. He's speaking to a predominantly Gentile audience there. They're included in the covenant with Abraham, but all of that doesn't mean that the supernatural powers hostile to God are not going to fight back or oppose God's will. I mean, goodness, they've been opposing God's will all along. So why would the cross event be any different? You know, the whole point of the language is that their authority over the Gentiles, over the nations is illegitimate now. It has been removed by the by the Most High who gave it to them. He has withdrawn it and terminated it. But that doesn't mean they're just going to roll over and say, Oh, I guess we better be good now. I guess we better not be hostile to God. I guess we better not oppose God anymore. You know, that's what they've been doing the whole time. So you would expect them to resist. And that's what they do. And that's why, you know, Paul says, you know, our battle's not against, you know, flesh and blood, but against spiritual wickedness and high places and all that language. Is it merely coincidental that first Corinthians six begins with Paul mentioning judging angels and later in the verse discusses sexual immorality, which was the sin of the very angels we will judge. You know, I actually tend to think that it is coincidental here. And I'll try to explain why. The reason is because the context in the context, it's not the only statement like you don't have the judging angels and then only talk of the sexual immorality.  And then he moves on to sexual immorality and some other things. You know, the you've got theft, drunkenness, reviling, swindling in first Corinthians six, 10. So there's a lot going on there. It's not just the judging and then the sexual immorality stuff. Now, if you had only the statement of first Corinthians six, three, you will judge angels and then, you know, coupled with the sexual stuff, then if that was the pairing, that was the two sides of the coin, so to speak, then I think a connection back to the transgression of the watchers might be in view. But since we don't have that sort of exclusivity, I tend to think it is coincidental. Sean's last question is maybe counter to the last question. And Genesis six, God doesn't seem to wipe out the Nephilim for merely being born. But for the corrupting of humanity, subsequently, would God have been angry had they not corrupted man? Is there a distinction to be made here, or am I inferring something that isn't there? Would does Jude one six through seven indicate that the two are not this distinguishable? Yeah, well, we have a problem here with conflating two related but different things. Jude one six and seven talks about angels who, you know, left their first estate. I think that's King James language. The angels that sinned is the parallel, you know, second Peter to ESV has angels who did not stay within their position of authority but left their proper dwelling. They're the ones who end up in chains again, second Peter to the angels that sinned end up in chains in the abyss. So you have angels who sinned can the Nephilim are not angels. They're not the angels. You get two different things here. It's the watchers. Again, that's the Second Temple Jewish term. The watchers, that's the Second Temple Jewish, the Enochian term for the angels that sinned for the sons of God of Genesis six. The Nephilim aren't those guys. The Nephilim are the byproduct. So, you know, the Nephilim are only in view in the biblical story in terms of their being a lethal threat later on, you know, their descendants being a lethal threat to the people of Israel during the conquest. And then they're also important because of the origin of demons, you know, when you when you killed a Nephilim, then the disembodied spirit, that's what becomes known as a demon. And you get hints of that in like Ezekiel 32, Isaiah 14, when you have the Refaim, you know, the disembodied Refaim in Sheol in the underworld in the realm of the dead. So they're little vestiges of in the Old Testament. And it gets more developed in the Second Temple period. The whole idea of where where demons come from, they're the disembodied spirits of the giant clans, specifically the Nephilim, but the Nephilim are the ones who are the progenitors of the other ones. So we need to keep separate the angels that send or the sons of God, you know, who transgress or the watchers. Those are all three terms that refer to these heavenly beings, okay, in Genesis six, the Nephilim are not those guys. So, you know, I really don't know what else to add. I think that answers the question because the elements of the question sort of presume that the Nephilim are the angels, which is not the case. Alright, Mike, that's all the questions we have for this episode. Again, I want to remind everybody to go vote on the next book of the Bible that we're going to cover here on the podcast voting ends Thursday, July 12th at 12pm central time. So get your vote in. Alright, Mike, well, we want to thank you again for answering our questions. And I want to thank everybody else for listening to the Naked Bible Podcast. God bless. Thanks for listening to the Naked Bible Podcast. To support this podcast, visit www.nakedbibleblog.com. To learn more about Dr. Heizer's other websites and blogs, go to www.brmsh.com.


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Hey there friends thanks for checking in today we're going to look at three budget shotguns I realize there are a lot of budget shotguns out there I wanted to feature these three I currently own them and I wanted to bring them out to show that you know you can get a real nice shotgun for not a lot of money right here we've got the Mossberg Maverick 88 this is a security model this shotgun has a very fine reputation for years people told me that this is not only a budget shotgun but a very well performing shotgun that has stood the test of time synthetic flat dark earth furniture you can see it does have a about a half inch recoil pad on their aluminum receiver corn cob forend a 20 inch barrel with a fixed cylinder choke a bead front sight hold seven in the tube of two and three quarters it will accept three inch loads and a barrel clamp right there also has a cross bolt safety and the release lever is on the left side of the trigger guard it has a wonderful reputation it really does and I have owned this for about a year now and I've always enjoyed it I ran a ton of loads through it and it just works it is a working man's shotgun at least that's what Mossberg calls it and I couldn't agree more let's go ahead and take a few shots take that safety off and there we go runs like a champ the Mossberg Maverick 88 this is a security model they also make this in 20 gauge and 410 this here is 12 gauge and they also make it with a shorter barrel 18 half inch barrel this is a 20 inch model I have no regrets purchasing this and I'm proud to feature it on this budget shotgun review within the past year Rock Island Armory began to import the all generations 12 gauge shotgun from Turkey it's located on the import section of their website but here it is it's also known as the Karina it is feature loaded with an MSRP of 299 check out back here we've got a rubber recoil pad a cheek riser in which you can raise if that's your choice I keep it at its lowest level and spacers and I removed a spacer to decrease the length of pull a sling mount on the back of the stock as well as on the magazine tube aluminum receiver 18 and a half inch barrel it does come with three chokes currently I have a modified in there but they also include a full choke and an improved cylinder five shells in the magazine tube and it does accept three inch loads and a mag pull like forend in which you could run a strap but it does have that lip right there that allows good hand placement a cross bolt safety right here and the action release is on the left side in front of the trigger guard 299 for all that I think that's a pretty good deal I imagine during normal times you could pick it up for 250 maybe even less but I ran a lot of loads through this too and it performed very well let's go ahead and take a few shots take that safety off here we go yeah the Karina getting it done all generations I don't care what you want to call it but it's a budget price shotgun rock islands known for budget price firearms and this Karina is no different and I think with everything that it has to offer it's priced really well I had to bring out a break open shotgun I could have brought my single shot 20 gauge that I picked up off a friend about seven years ago but I decided to go with a coach gun now this is a stoker coach gun with an msrp of 450 and you say well that's really not a budget price well actually it is in terms of coach guns a couple months ago I featured this against my cz sharptail with an msrp of $1100 this is 450 and that's the msrp cost if you look it does have very nice walnut furniture throughout I wish it had more of a recoil pad this just has a polymer piece but it does have the single trigger now they also offer this with a double trigger I like the single trigger resets really quickly and to me it's just a little less confusing 20 inch barrels the right side fires first that is an improved cylinder choke fixed and the left side fires second and that is a modified choke it does have a serrated rib there and a bead in action lever right here and it does have extractors not ejectors I primarily see extractors a lot of people want ejectors but I just don't see them too often I'm sure they're out there so the stoker coach gun has performed great for me I've run a lot of loads through this one as well and it is pretty nice I even ran turkey loads through this with not much of a recoil pad handle them quite well the one thing it does is puts it in safe each time the action is closed easy disassemble and reassemble process no problem coach guns real simple also known as a scatter gun used on the stage coaches many years ago to protect goods and people let me go ahead and move that thumb safety forward because that's what you need to do with this model and we'll take a couple shots and there we go you can see that it does have extractors you have to manually pull out the shells I've got two more here basic target loads here seven and a half shot target loads is what I'm using with all these models once again I shut it I will move it forward and here we go just like that people love the coach guns I never realized how much until I got this one you know I also have the stoker double defense I love that same MSRP I could have used either but I went with the side by side coach gun instead of the over under double defense and I'm real happy with it it's been great for about a year that I've owned it and I enjoy it I was able to take it apart and transport it real easy in a side pocket of a soft rifle case or long gun case and it offers that type of flexibility stoker coach gun you know during normal times I imagine you can pick this up for under 400 bucks and believe it or not that is a budget price those are my choices for budget shotguns I know there are many others out there go ahead leave a comment let me know what you think is a budget shotgun and we'll get the conversation started if you like videos like this please subscribe and share I always appreciate thumbs up button thanks for watching and you guys be safe


Do you think that young progressives in the United States will ultimately rally behind Joe Biden in November or has he seriously damaged his standing? Look, I think we will see what happens in November because the choice is pretty clear. Running against Donald Trump, I suspect, will be the Republican candidate. It's one of the most dangerous political figures in modern American history. So I think people will end up rallying around Biden. But there is no question. It is very hard for young people, I think, for most Americans to be excited about what is going on right now. President has got to change course. He has been very clear. He has expressed his concern about, quote, unquote, indiscriminate bombing. He has asked that now over and over again to change course. Now just yesterday said, no, we're going to continue doing what we are doing unacceptable. You cannot give billions of dollars to a country that ignores your wishes violates international law. So I would hope that the president follows through on his concerns and says from that now this is unacceptable. You're not getting a nickel more from the United States unless you radically change course. We're not going to see hundreds and hundreds of thousands of children starve to death. Look, I have my disagreements with Bernie Sanders when it comes to Israel. He somehow still is not calling for a ceasefire, which is so disappointing to me because he actually recognizes the severity of the humanitarian crisis created in Gaza specifically because of Israel's war crimes. So it's mind boggling to me that he can't say the word ceasefire. But despite that, he still is using his power in meaningful ways. And I think that he deserves credit for that. For example, he's forcing a vote on a resolution that will force the State Department to report on Israel's human rights abuses. And if they fail to comply and don't release said report within 30 days, then aid to Israel is automatically cut off. Now that's not going to pass. But I think that the effort overall is still good. It's important. Nonetheless, Bernie's overall position on Israel to me just seems completely incoherent because he's only calling for a humanitarian pause, which makes no sense because the humanitarian disaster that he's describing continues to unfold after there already was a humanitarian pause. So another one isn't going to make a difference. If you genuinely want the violence to stop permanently, you would call for a ceasefire and he hasn't done that. But two things can be true at once. He's bold enough to attempt to cut off aid to Israel, that matters, but he's not bold enough to address the root cause of the humanitarian crisis that he's against. But when it comes to what he says about Biden, he is absolutely right, even if he's using kid gloves to handle the situation. Biden is continuing to express concerns about Israel, but he's not making actual demands. He's not doing what he needs to do to stop the genocide. And in the absence of actual demands and threats to cut off aid, nothing is going to change. But don't take my word for it. Let's actually listen to what a Likud party member of the Knesset said on Israeli television. Now, this clip is from December 8th and it recently gained traction. So it's a little bit old, but it's still true as of today. Quote, we have no American ultimatum. There is no deadline from the U.S. Therein lies the problem. We've all been saying it, Israel is admitting it now. They're not facing pressure from Biden. Therefore, you know, these disagreements don't really amount to much. Now, I've shared this article before, but this particular paragraph is worth repeating. So in an op-ed for the nation, Trita Parsi explains, in 1982, President Ronald Reagan was disgusted by Israeli bombardment of Lebanon. He stopped the transfer of cluster munitions to Israel and told Israeli Prime Minister Manishem Begin in a phone call that this is a Holocaust. Reagan demanded that Israel withdraw troops from Lebanon. Begin caved. Twenty minutes after their phone call, Begin ordered a halt on attacks. So the Reagan administration made a demand and they cut off weapons to Israel. And guess what? They were forced to acquiesce. So the question is, why won't Biden do the same? He's not powerless. So he's making a choice. The Biden administration's decision to allow this to continue is a choice. He is choosing to be a willing participant in the ethnic cleansing and genocide of the people of Gaza. And that choice may cost him the election. Because as Bernie Sanders correctly put it, young voters aren't excited to rally around a candidate responsible for the deaths of 24,000 civilians, including 10,000 children. And the polls currently reflect that. The Hill reports in an ABC News poll conducted January 4th through 8th. Only 33% of those surveyed said they approved of Biden, a drop from the previous poll in September of 2023, when 37% approved of his performance. Biden's disapproval rating is 58% up from 56% in September. ABC News said it's the lowest approval rating since former President George W. Bush from 2006 to 2008. Biden, who is running for reelection, has a lower approval rating than former President Trump, who is leading the GOP nominee for presidents. Disastrous. Disastrous. And this is one of many polls indicating Biden is losing support. In other words, there's an iceberg dead ahead and the Biden administration is sailing right into it at full speed, not even trying to steer away from it. And this isn't happening because the demographics who voted for Biden in 2020 have suddenly become red-pilled and they're all Trump supporters. It is because they are disillusioned with Biden and they plan to forego voting altogether, which is a huge problem in particular when it comes to young people. Teen Vogue's Fortessa Latifi explains, after a record-breaking youth turnout in 2020 helped decide the election for President Joe Biden, a recent poll released by Harvard Kennedy School shows that young Americans seem less likely to vote in 2024 than they were in 2020. According to the poll at this point in the 2020 election cycle, 57 percent of Americans between ages 18 and 29 were planning to vote. That number has since declined to 49 percent, though Gen Z voters prefer President Biden over his likely challenger, former President Donald Trump. Only 35 percent of this demographic approves of Biden's performance as president. Now let's just pause right there and address the implications of this if it's not already obvious to everyone. If this stands, if these numbers don't change and we actually see an 8 percent decrease in youth turnout and not an increase from 2020, Biden loses this election. I'll repeat that. Biden loses and Donald Trump with Project 2025 in mind and with him promising to be a dictator, but only for a day will win this election. Democracy as we know it will be over. So this cannot stand and you can try to blame young people. You can say it's irrational for them to hand the election to Trump, but ultimately many of them are going to stay home. So Biden is the one who has to make the change. The onus is on him and it's not like he doesn't have enough time to change course. Teen Vogue actually spoke to young voters and I think that these anecdotes are really important, but they're not representative of all of Gen Z and millennials, but here's what they're saying nonetheless. Elias, who was a Palestinian American, has a laundry list of issues with the current administration that have pushed him to this point of not voting, including sales of new oil and gas leases and Biden's support of Israel. For Elias, the deciding moment came when Biden cast doubt on the Gaza health ministries reported death tolls. Quote, I found that to be truly monstrous, he says. It's something I cannot co-sign with my name and my vote. Lillian, a college student in New York, is undecided about voting this year. She's been disappointed by the Democrats on so many issues, including Biden's promise to forgive $10,000 of student loans, which was ultimately struck down by the Supreme Court, the parties neglecting to further efforts to codify abortion, and the president's support of Israel. London 24 doesn't want to hear a guilt trip for not planning to vote in the 2024 presidential election. It won't work, she says, and stop telling her that Biden is the lesser of two evils because she's tired of that argument. Every four years, we're told to choose the lesser of two evils, and things will get better, she says, and it just doesn't get better. Leah voted for Biden in 2020, but is considering withholding her vote in 2024 because of what she sees as the disappointing outcomes of his presidency. She doesn't agree with Biden about funding Israel's war on Hamas, and she's saddled by student loans the president said he would forgive. Quote, it felt like kind of a con, she says, about then-candidate Biden's proposal to forgive $10,000 of student loan debt per borrower. I don't want to vote for Biden, I want a better option. Now, for the record, I hope that young people don't stay home. I hope they actually do exercise their right to vote because I think that voting is important, and I don't agree that there's no difference between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. I do think that there are discernible and important differences between Democrats and Republicans, and really my thoughts on voting in general was perfectly articulated in this video by Olaimi. I'll link to that down below, but you don't have to agree with their reasoning, but you can't pretend as if their votes don't matter. They do matter, and vote shaming them isn't going to be an effective strategy, otherwise it would have worked in 2016. Many young people said they were going to stay home then, and many did, but their votes matter, and they must be won over. And if they're not going to be won over, then different young people must be mobilized, right? Young people were already disappointed with Biden after the Supreme Court struck down his student debt cancellation plan. He said that he would pursue cancellation through the Higher Education Act, but as far as we know, that's just in limbo. He's kind of nibbling around the edges with small amounts of cancellation here and there for anyone who qualifies, but the overwhelming majority of us still have student debt, and even his SAVE Act, which is good in theory, hasn't benefited a lot of us till this point because applications that we've submitted have been stuck in limbo for months.  So you've got that. You've got all these reasons why young people were, I think, reasonably and rightfully disillusioned with Biden, but then you add a genocide to the list as well, and you begin to see why young people feel so frustrated with the Biden administration and why so many of them are just saying, I'm out. I'm not going to vote. What's the point? It doesn't feel like my life is changing meaningfully, so I'm just going to choose to stay home. Now, again, I don't agree. I think that who's in the White House does matter, but you can't just write these concerns off and hope things get better and cross your fingers because that's not a gamble that I'm willing to make, especially when democracy really is on the line. But I mean, it's not just young people. Biden has lost support of Arab Americans in key swing states and his attempt to repair that relationship hasn't been going well to put it mildly. Abed Ayub of the American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee tweeted this, quote, Biden is scheduled to travel to Michigan at the end of the month to meet with Arab American voters. There is a problem. Many are rejecting the invite to meet while others have rebuffed outreach efforts. The meetings are in jeopardy and currently looking like they won't happen in Dearborn, which was the Biden team's first and preferred choice. Don't be surprised if this trip is quote, postponed due to scheduling. Reality is starting to set in for many that our community won't forget about the genocide. Yeah. Now, I get that it's still early and things can change, including feelings, and I'm guessing that a lot is going to change between now and November. But the question is, will enough things change? And that's debatable. There's going to be a lot of people, especially Arab Americans, who's not going to change their mind because this is personal to them. They have relatives that died in Gaza, right? And Joe Biden has tuned them out, not listened to their concerns up until this point. And I'm glad that he's at least aware that now he needs to make an effort to reach out to the Arab American community because he needs their support to win states like Michigan. But he kind of waited a little long, right? He's still allowing the genocide to go on. So it might be a little too late. But at least he knows that there needs to be an effort made. When it comes to young people, the administration seemingly doesn't even have a strategy in place to address their concerns. And I say this because in an interview with Joy Reid on MSNBC, Illinois Governor JB Pritzker, who is an advisor to Biden's 2024 campaign, he really did not have a strong answer when he was asked about Biden's weakness with young voters. So let's listen to what he has to say. And then there's a follow-up that's even worse. But first, here he is. I think that there is some significant anecdotal evidence that President Biden does have some issues in terms of parts of the younger electorate that are not in a good place with him on things like Gaza, on the bombing of Yemen. There were just protests outside of the White House this past week. There is some energy that's building, particularly among Arab American voters, Muslim American voters who say they will not vote for him because of his stance on Gaza. Is it bedwetting or is the White House maybe not paying enough attention to real passionate objections to its policies by younger voters that they need to turn out? And I mean younger voters, including younger African American voters. Well, when you're a responsible leader, when you're in office, you have to make tough decisions, no doubt about it. And every time you have to make a tough decision, someone doesn't like it. The truth is that we've seen Joe Biden underestimated all along in his entire career, and especially in 2020. In 2024, I think what we're going to see is a real focus on the things that really matter to people's individual lives, to their families, to their communities. And that's the economy. It means their freedoms. We talked about choice. In a lot of places in the country, people are deeply concerned about gun violence. And we know that Joe Biden has stood up for a ban on assault weapons, and he has stood up for violence prevention programs. In a way, the Republicans just want to let go and, frankly, let people shoot each other wherever they may be with as many guns as they may want to have. So I do think that a focus on the issues that really matter to working families across the United States is going to matter for Joe Biden in a positive way. Now, they're always detractors, right? There are people even that vote for Donald Trump who don't like things about Donald Trump. But in the end, when people are going to see the two visions for the future of America, that young people and people of color across the United States, not to mention the vast majority of American workers know that it's Joe Biden that's fighting for them and Joe Biden that'll do better for them, Donald Trump will be a disaster for those groups. Incredibly naive. Again, the young people Joe Biden needs aren't voting for Donald Trump. They don't support Trump. The risk is them just not voting altogether, and tepidly signaling support for gun safety laws and abortion rights is not going to sufficiently mobilize young people. Biden needs a concrete action plan that he talks about nonstop to mobilize these voters. And even if he has that, it still might not work because they can't put aside the fact that he's supporting a genocide. But Joy Reid to her credit, who's been excellent lately, she asked a follow up question since she seemingly wasn't convinced and it gets so much worse. And you don't think that the White House needs to adjust or that the Biden re-election campaign needs to adjust in any way. It's messaging on issues of war and peace because these are issues. I mean, we are on MLK day and we do know that one of the things that Dr. King did later in his life was to oppose the Vietnam War. And this was an important issue to him as important in the end of his life as fighting for living wages and for racial justice. Issues of war and peace are passion issues. They're voting issues. And for a lot of younger Americans, not even just younger Americans, but a lot of progressives and a lot of just people are the humanist view of the world, the Gaza issue is a voting issue. So you're saying that people will ignore that. You don't think that the White House needs to in any way adjust its messaging on that? Well, look, here's what the White House has been doing. They're fighting what has become a mortal enemy of the United States. And that's Vladimir Putin. They're standing up for democracy in Ukraine. They're fighting against terrorism in the Middle East. Those are the things that I think the message is that the Biden administration needs to make sure they're getting out to people. But look, nobody likes war.  And I know the president wants that, right? But you have to have a careful foreign policy expert in the White House who understands how to manage all that in a very difficult environment. You think Donald Trump has shown that he can do that? Do you think Donald Trump would handle this better than Joe Biden? The answer clearly is no. We're doomed. We are doomed. She asks him about Gaza and he pivots to Putin and ends with, well, at least Biden's not as bad as Trump. I promise you that is not going to resonate with young people who want him to stop doing a genocide. But they don't, they don't get it. But what that answer does tell me is that the Biden administration doesn't actually have a plan to meaningfully address young voters concerns. So the question is, how exactly does Joe Biden plan to win back the White House without young voters? I mean, there's two responses to this. First, he either assumes that they'll acquiesce in November, and that's a possibility. But I mean, it's a big if, and it was a gamble that Hillary Clinton also made in 2016 that didn't pay off. So I don't know that I'd want to make that gamble if I were Joe Biden with how much is at stake. But second, he maybe thinks that he doesn't need young voters. He can just use negative partisanship against Trump again to win over voters, in particular voters that Trump is losing, moderate voters, independence, and that seems to be his game plan, right? So after Trump won the Iowa caucus in a landslide, here's what Joe Biden tweeted, looks like Donald Trump just won Iowa. He's the clear frontrunner on the other side at this point. But here's the thing, this election was always going to be you and me versus extreme mega Republicans. It was true yesterday and it'll be true tomorrow. So if you'll notice, he's making a really interesting distinction here. It's us versus extreme mega Republicans, meaning not all Republicans are bad, just the most sycophantic Trump supporters. Now, I think that this is naive to an extent because the Republican party is the party of Donald Trump.  So the intent behind this though is to signal to moderate Republicans that they are welcome in Joe Biden's coalition. And this is what Joe Scarborough hinted at as well. We're running, he says, against extreme mega Republicans. Mika, it's not in us versus them. Joe Biden's not saying all Republicans are bad guys.  All Republicans still are going to Chinese religious cult websites to get their information. Oh, he's talking about extreme mega Republicans. It makes a difference because there are a lot of Republicans out there that again, this is about conversion. There are a lot of independence out there that Joe Biden's going to get voting for. I think that Joe Scarborough is correct to assume that converting moderates and independence is Joe Biden's strategy here. And in some ways, it could pay off, right? I think that his position on abortion is going to help him with independence, for example, and maybe some moderate Republicans, although not much. But with that being said, it's wishful thinking to believe that you're going to make up enough ground with moderates and independence to account for the hemorrhaging of young support. I'm not saying that you forego the strategy of courting moderates altogether, but it's not a binary choice. And it's not something that should be your main strategy. It should be supplemental to your existing strategy of mobilizing young people and your core base, people of color. You still need young voters to win, even if you win a lot of moderates and independence. That really doesn't change the reality of electoral politics, regardless. So Biden has to make a direct appeal to young voters. And it just seems like there's no message there. There's no attempt there, aside from Trump bad, which is obvious. And you might not want to listen to an extremist radical lefty like me, but take care from Obama alum who also feel like Biden's campaign strategy up until this point has been inadequate. This Politico article talks about a real divide between the Biden and Obama camps and the Obama camp is sounding the alarm about Biden's reelection campaign because they think that it's two bare bones and Biden needs to announce key staffers in swing states immediately so we can make up the ground that he's lost. So everyone can see that Biden is in danger. Biden knows that Biden is in danger based on reports that we're seeing. The question is, why isn't he taking action to address these deficiencies? Why aren't we seeing him course correct right now? Is he honestly waiting until June to make these changes? I mean, when things are this bad, you need to start right now. And yes, things can change and I hope that they do. But in order for things to change, the time to actually take action to make it change is right now. You have to stop the genocide. You have to stop it. Not just because of electoral reasons, but because genocide is bad. On top of that, you have to promote specific policies that appeal to core demographics of the Democratic Party, young people, Arab Americans, black voters, and you have to take the threat of Trump seriously. Not just say Trump is to democracy but act like it. Biden has been campaigning on Trump's threat to democracy and he's right to do that, but simply pointing out Trump's dictatorial ambitions isn't going to be enough. You need to give people a reason to vote for you and Biden isn't doing that.


Hi, welcome to my channel. It's Hila, your hostess here from Hilaura Home. It's a lifestyle channel so I just cover lifestyle stuff with a big dose of positivity. Today we have another rose unboxing, which is really exciting. This is the very last of the roses that I have planned for planting out this year. I won't be planting out more roses for at least another year so that I can spend the time to focus on getting these ones, to establish themselves and train them before I move on to the next phase of my overall rose plan. So this is what we have here today. It's from Peter Bills and they focus on classic roses here in England. They are based in Norfolk. They're based in Norfolk so this rose has come a long way to get to me here in the north of England. So we're going to open it up and have a look at it. There we have it. This is the rose and this is the Zephyrin druhin which is a climber rose. So I got a bear root one which I have in a pot waiting for it to establish itself before I dig it into the ground and this one is a pot grown one which is ready to go straight into the ground. So it's going to be very exciting to plant this out. So the thing with this one is that it's suitable for north walls, for north facing walls, which means that those are the sides of the house or your garden or sections that don't get as much sunlight as the south facing. So it can be quite challenging to get color on that side of the house because a lot of the more bright colorful things need a lot of sun. But this is a gorgeous beautiful pink type rose and I cannot wait to see how it's going to look in about. I think it will take about three years for each to reach the vision, the full spread that I want from it. But that's the joy of gardening. You have to be so patient with gardening. You have to think and plan ahead. You're not thinking just about next week or next month. You are thinking in years, you know, in terms of like three to four years from now what will this look like. And I like that. I like that because that's what life should be. It shouldn't be about short term instant gratification all the time. So welcome to the house. I'm not going to get to plant this out until this weekend. There's a lot of stuff going on which doesn't mean that this is going to be sitting out in the patio for the next couple of days. So that's it, guys. I was very, very happy with Peter Beals. And I like the fact that the rose itself comes with a tag that has the label. And this is a with a proof tag. It's a sort of tag that seven, 10 years down the line, you'll still be able to look at it and see what type of rose it is. And they also have this label that you can stick into the pot. And these are where the resistant labels. And I really do like and appreciate that. I think you can easily forget what the plant is. So having the tag is really very, very helpful. The delivery was spot on. They delivered exactly when they said they would deliver. This was my first time ordering from them because they were the only place that actually had this in stock at the time that I was looking for a pot grown, um, zephyr and rose, because I am ordering them out of season. Normally you would be getting them around the November, November to April, November to March time. So I'm a little bit late, but it's better late than never. And with pot grown roses, you've got a good chance of planting them out throughout the year. So yeah, I will definitely be going back to Peter Beals because I was very happy with the service. And I was very happy with the price. I thought that it was quite competitive. And yeah, I've been looking forward to showing you the progress of the garden as it goes over the next few years. Hopefully create a lovely little floral paradise. Thank you so much for watching. Please remember to subscribe and to like. It helps to support the channel. And until I see you next time, I wish you all peace, guys. Help and happiness. Bye.