All right, we are live it is Thursday night live stream Tonight's topic is how has the man is fear failed men? I've got a great panel, and I've got more coming on for a start We've got Steve the Dean Williams the man mindset Steve. How you doing tonight? I'm good man. I'm good Good. Thanks for having me on for a minute man. Thank you. I'm glad to have you here We got Manna note Jean. How you doing tonight, but I'm doing great all as well and Gonzo Amazing amazing Well, what we're gonna do is we're gonna quick start off with we do have Anthony Anthony dream Johnson We'll be coming on shortly. So just wanted to let everybody know hang in there He's got some technical difficulties, but he's gonna be jumping on shortly So the question that I call it my patent question is how has the man is fear? failed men and My response this a while ago was that I think that most guys that enter the man is fear is through some sort of trauma a divorce a breakup Something that happened in your life and you're looking to other men to guide you and we all know that men It's it's difficult for us to reach out to other guys and as a man It is difficult to Basically invest in yourself and reach out to a group of guys that You think that can help you so I think there's been some issues lately. There was a recent video by Donovan sharp and again, I consider Donovan a friend of mine that Basically said, you know, why can't we all get along and I Have a take on this and my take on this is that no where we are going to disagree and I'm okay with it I don't think everybody's going to disagree to agree Also, I think that it was mentioned that we all have the same end goal and now I'm going to disagree with that a hundred percent. I don't think everybody in the man is fear has an end goal I don't consider myself a man is fear content creator I consider myself a man is very content consumer Even though I've done interviews with some of the some of the biggest managed fear guys as far as steve the dean You name it There's a list of guys that I've done interviews with and it was to reach out and understand their He's about dating lifestyle manhood things like that so Again now we'll go back to a video that was yesterday with bulldog mindset and John Sonmez will be coming on here shortly also So I just want to let everybody know Anthony Johnson John Son Sonmez will be coming on bulldog mindset to kind of go over some of these things So this video was to me Again as a content consumer Okay, not a managed for content creator even though my channel is about masculinity and it is about Being a man, but we we talk about all sorts of things here so Looking at it from i'll say an outsider's view I looked at it as You know people can say it wasn't an attack And I do look at it as it was an attack and and the reason I say that is is because In in the video there's a couple other things in in the video. They talked about migthau dictionary and migthau dictionary is a channel that Actually, I'm not I'm not really about doxing people.  We have all the different factions whether it be pickup style game lifestyle Red pill blue pill. I don't know if blue pill is really a It's really a a manuscript content But you have all these different these different factions and even black pill Is part of the manuscript whether we like it or not I think it's necessary that all these opinions and all these views are Are really looked at and I think it's important that everybody gets a chance to say their peace So but I think that um this recent video with donovan and And with bulldog really raised a lot of feathers in the sphere So i'm gonna shoot off because I know steve's not going to be on here long But i'm going to shoot off to steve and ask him His point of view on that whole situation Well, first of all, thank you for having me on man and uh, I appreciate I love bulldog much respect to bulldog I got opportunity to talk to him Uh, I think the guy's a great man great.    Here's the thing.      I'm letting the road right now. I'm not mad.        We some bad motherfuckers in the game.  I don't I don't play that.    I'm not no threats and nothing like that Just keep it real.   You know me. Donovan. You know me.  You should know and this ain't no threat Ain't no threat. It's all good.  That's none of my business I've always stayed out of it. I I respect anthony I appreciate anthony whatever they do they do But you've never seen me tony ever bring up their situation on any interview You never seen me ever put their business on an interview And all this why can't we had this kumbaya shit?    I am I am not a pickup artist I've never had a pickup artist.  You have brother. Now.    You want to make it like anthony's the bad guy, right? You want to put all that business on the street?  Let's see. That's why I keep telling you man I'm not that dude.   I stay on my motherfucking lane So what I'm saying to you donovan?   I sent you a message call me.  It's it's uncensored here tonight, steven. I can I can feel your passion and and the reason I'm gonna say that I can feel it is because Once you can say something okay now Can say oh well talk to me and I did notice this and and I'm not coming down on donovan I'm not but when you say something like let's be men and talk about it And then you bring that shit up That's why I was I was kind of I was kind of irritated by again as a consumer Not as a creator, but as a but a consumer So I can I can see your um, I can see your passion in this in this I just want to say one more thing for you to finish. I'm not mad at donovan. You got to talk.   You know, that's all I gotta say Well, I want to welcome anthony dream johnson anthony. This is your first time on the stream and it is awesome to have you here, brother Fantastic, I appreciate having me on the show man. It's sorry about being late.    I think band of january a few weeks ago I said nothing. I didn't want any part of it.  I was showing johnson I missed some of this stuff the kandis owens stuff that he denied on air yesterday See a donovan sharp has totally jumped the shark.   It is off a lot of guys behind the scenes It was absolutely fake some of it was defamatory some of it You know donovan sharp for example He was actually campaigning to have speakers removed from 21 convention after he dropped out in 2020 By blaming kandis owens and stifan molyneux and some logically dubious way And I have evidence of this too.  He saw yesterday was totally delusional. It was totally false.  That's my opening statement. So Let me ask you a question. I want to say the same question I think we talked I don't think I talked this but there's a show called migtail dictionary If I found actually I find it very entertaining and I was saying that the the the black pill community is still a part of the umbrella of the manisphere And I think it is a necessary part because everybody has their corner Regardless if people agree with it, it's necessary. Okay So we talked about doxing doxing If anybody doesn't know doxing means when your personal information or your name is put out in public Is that like when rila tamasi doxed 50 guys to the new york times a feminist report? Yeah, and and Yeah, that's that's doxing and I was there. I was there. I was there. I was physically there So I know all about that. So again, if there's anybody watching donovan's watching you want to come on You're welcome to come on. Um, I'm trying to moderate this right now I'm not trying to perpetuate any type of drama But I think that when You're going to go and say somebody doxed you And you give the name of the person that doxed you you doxed yourself even more Because migtail dictionary is a fairly small channel. I think they had they're about twice the size of my channel So it's a thousand subs. Yeah, so migtail dictionary. Would you mind? The just quick comment in migtail dictionary channel like you I find them entertaining my opinion of migtail dictionary is similar to yours, tony Um, you know, I'm not I don't I don't watch all the shows. I've watched very few of them To be honest that's kind of like popping it out when people send them to me the links And sometimes they go too far they went after rollo tamasi's family and I thought that was too far And I tweeted about that.    Can you believe you punched me in the face?  So what do you think's gonna happen? Anyway, those guys are on to There's been for 20 years now. There's been this underbelly deep state of the man's sphere It's very similar to politics And it's very disgusting. It's very manipulative.   It's all like we got each other's backs. It doesn't work like that A lot of these guys are frauds. Rolla tamasi is a great example That dude docks over 50 men in real life to a feminist reporter at the new york times That's not just wrong. That's not just unethical. That's high treason There's nothing worse.     You got anything to say on that? no, no, I I I wasn't there to see what happened and again if it happened Anthony hit it on the head man. I I just stay in my lane man. I just I I'm team a1. I roll with him.   Yeah, much better. Yeah So I've worked with almost 200 speakers in the minister at this point You know psychologists dating coaches authors navy seals like all kinds of people for 15 fucking years now And you know a small percentage of them 97 98 percent of them are amazing men But I have positive long-term relationships with five 10 15 years at a time, right?  These are men I take.      It's a great thing, man Yeah, it's it's like the man of spear cleaning itself, right? It's clean Why is everybody so con? Well, I'm gonna say why is donovan so concerned about Everybody getting along and and he talked about and and he talked about the end goal But I don't see a a unified end goal From a from a content consumer Not a content creator.   It's all just politician talk, right?  They don't want unity.   He's is the newest probably God that's on this panel that has consumed Manisphere content. What do you think of this? What's your thought process? Then we're going to go to man gonzo I think his video is frozen Oh, he's in texas wherever he is well Well, let me go to man then well There he is go ahead. Am I back? Yep All right, I I missed what happened there a bit at the end So gonzo, what's your take on this? You're new to the manosphere. You're new to manosphere content When I say manosphere content, there's a big umbrella of content whether it be pickup game lifestyle Fitness, what is your what is your take on infighting? in the manosphere okay Hang on a second. I missed that again. So what so so one more time What is your take on the infighting in the manosphere in other words? Anthony's defending himself. He's he's put out a product for for a long time since he was 17 years old so What do you think of infighting and attacking another person's brand well, um The way I see it is that And because I've seen this happen in all types of communities obviously like you're not going to escape the the backstabbing in the drama There's always going to be people like anthony said like there's a statistical Basically a constant, you know, there's always going to be these people But the way I see it is that there's always going to be um Ideological differences as well. There's going to be you know conflicting views.  And if they're and if they're you know If there is a problem you know Like that's the thing it's like I don't even I don't even know because because personally With this type of drama stuff with this type of um You know all this uh, you know Backstabbing all this talking behind the scenes all this stuff is like I just You know, yeah, I mean just I just walk away from it, you know um I don't You know like like like what are you gonna do about it?   Uh, so I've thought about that too like I've seen Having been involved uh at an organization level not just as a consumer like I didn't join this community And I was like, I'm gonna lead the man's sphere and build events and do you know, whatever shows and channels I was just some young kid that wanted to get laid Uh, but over time you see the people the revolving door and that's what's most frustrating like some people say like Oh, you should get you know competition competing events blah blah blah out of my video freeze Yeah Uh, well I look retard. Uh, give me a second. I'll fix it Uh, audio is fine and video should be fine a second It's been a fun video night with this stuff Nope almost Boom back Anyway, my point was the revolving door of create.   It's new.  I know the leaders and other guys on a first name basis who ran these events The dating conference the Morton hacky summit the real man conference Uh, the pua summit cliff's list. There's half a dozen conventions that have been going in the man's sphere What happens to them? Where are they? They're all gone. Where's the videos? They're all gone Where's the speeches? They're all gone. There's no care There's no long-term commitment to building events and building content That part is rare.  They hear for a cash grab.    I don't know a percentage 20 30 percent or something They find it. They get excited.   They don't care anymore, right? So that part just kind of disgusts me because I really care about this community However much I get hate for it and all this bullshit, you know, it's a really important movement It's I think one of the most important movements in the world It's the only real pushback to feminism for men today and for fathers and for boys And a culture where we're hated for being these things are very natural Components of life, you know in our species And ramp Well, let me welcome john sanmez bulldog mindset man. It's awesome to have you on here Um, this is kind of the we'll call it the preamble to this video here I don't want to call it a response video, but it is kind of a response video Kind of a group. We'll call it a group think right now Um, you had a video with donovan and of course if donovan's watching which I doubt he's welcome to come on for sure um, we had steve basically give his point of view um on the situation and john I want to welcome you and Give everybody a quick I guess a quick summary of the video you did yesterday Yeah, so yeah, thanks for having me You know, so yeah, so I just really just want to have a chat with donovan And uh, he had done a little video clip on his channel talking about the whole like the feuding and the mana sphere And I thought that was good because I think that That needs to come out into the air and then and then be dealt with and resolve so when I had him on I thought okay, let's let's talk about this. Let's talk about you know, what uh, what's going on How can we resolve things? How can we work together as as men? And you know what um, what what the future looks like so So yeah, so that's what kind of the the the stream was about was about, you know, what um, are there in my whole Thing was okay. Well, what does it take for us to resolve these issues right? What's it take because The way I look at it is like, you know and again I've gotten text all day from a lot of different people right with you know different messages and stuff I would never share them, you know, uh, so anyone that sent me text you I would never share them with someone else but But what i'm saying is that uh Like if I were to dig into all of that right every single person has a reason why they believe they're justified And and and when I listen to everyone's arguments, I see Why they think that now some of them are weaker than others. I'm I'll be honest, right? I you know, I'm not an idiot But if we were to dig into it and say okay, we in order to resolve these as these issues as men What we have to do is we have to go back and figure out who was wrong and who was right It'll never get resolved because We're that's not the way to go the only way to go forward if we want to as men and you know Is to basically just bury the hatchet to basically just say look, okay You know Forget what happened in the past who wants to make a better future and and who's really committed to this And you know and that's you know in my opinion. That's the only way that that we can do this Because you're never going to resolve the issues in the past because people are always going to have argument And some of them are valid. I mean a lot of them are valid, right? Everyone but but the thing that I learned about life Is that everyone is always going to believe that they're justified in their actions In fact the very first chapter of Dale Carnegie's book how to win in friends and influence people He talks about that. He talks about Exactly that. He says it doesn't matter. He says never never condemn anyone never Basically chastise someone because They will always no matter what what they do They will always believe that they're justified in their actions and and i'm not saying this from any kind of high horse I do the same thing. I always believe i'm justified. It's just human nature. We believe we're justified in our actions So I don't know so so my whole approach with the with the stream and everything And still my approach is to say look I I don't really care what happened in the past like I understand it I've I've heard every side of every story at this point I'm not going to take any sides. I never will I'm not going to start feuds and and hate people just because other people hate people That's not my style But the only way forward is for us to just say, okay Forget about what happened in the past who wants to work together in the future? And and and make something happen and and and in my in my mind The the guys that don't want to do that are our guys that That don't want to do what's what's the best for you because because again People have insulted me. I mean, I I've been quote canceled In which is weird in the hemisphere at by various groups and in people But I don't care. I don't care you can cancel me. You can call me names. It doesn't matter I'm not going to like to me. I look at this as a professional And and I'm here to help men and so I don't I it doesn't matter what you do I'm not going to get angry about it. So I have a few questions for john That are just simple questions. I like to ask them. Tony called it Oh, yeah, go for it John, what's your basic opinion on rollo tamasi blocking you on twitter? Yeah, so I'm happy to address that. I don't like it. I don't I don't think it was was justified But I'll say this since he's blocked me on twitter. I've still recommended his work He's he's written some really good books and I would still recommend guys go and watch his channel He has a lot of good content. I don't agree with all of his content There's lots of stuff that I don't agree with But there's a lot of guys I don't agree with but him blocking me on twitter Does not influence my My professional perception of him. So so to your knowledge, he hasn't extended the same courtesy to you after blocking you, right? I have correct. Yeah, correct. What is your opinion on yesterday after your show donovan was talking about You're basically probing him genuinely. I think how we could make amends referring to me and him Right after the show he got don talking with you on air about that. He went and blocked me on twitter So what is your basic response to donovan blocking me on twitter? After an action that is completely in contradiction to his words Right. I I would agree with you that is in contradiction to his words I I don't like that, right? Yeah, again, um, you know, I I think that doesn't show sincerity now again Donovan if you're watching I believe when we were talking that you were sincere So that that action doesn't indicate sincerity, but again, I'm not gonna. I don't know why you did it, right? Again, I think that the only way to figure that out is for us to have for donovan to come and talk to You anthony and for us to ask why did you do that? Right? What is your rationale behind that? Maybe he has a good rationale in his head again? It's like, you know, from my perspective, I think that's not a good move But but again, you know, we we have to hear from him My skepticism is in the time duration him being on a show live to blocking me was a matter of minutes That is such a tight time frame I mean, he could just be emotional and blocking me and and regrettably, you know, 10 minutes later I don't know, but that's really suspicious to me. But I would ask the question, right? Again, just to be fair Um, I extended you the the link to join the stream from Donovan. I were talking you didn't jump on there You know, he interpreted that he said well, you know And several people said well if anthony really was sincere was sincere He would have just jumped on the stream. Why didn't he do that? So he must be the one So he kind of said the same thing that you said about him blocking So, you know, but you're here so you can answer that but I let me interject here I think that was a good decision on anthony's because what happens is is people can get very In other words, if you're not primed and ready, I think that you can come off You're not going to say what you need sometimes there's a cooling off period I think that is really really necessary where you can talk a little bit more rational But john what I want to go to you with is that You're welcome. John asked me a question. I like to answer it. All right. Go ahead. Go ahead So the question was about not jumping on the show, right? So there's there's a couple reasons for that. Tony is kind of looting to some of them I'm not one to just pop on random streams. Frankly. I wasn't like ready for a stream I wasn't set up the film I have lights cameras and this wasn't like time of day for me. You know what I mean, okay Not woken up On a different day, maybe I would have jumped in but probably not And the reason most specifically I chose I definitively decided not to jump in the stream I was like yeah done was a can of solans issue He he 100% I will Take that to the grave and I've shown you text messages where I discussed with with several speakers back in june 2020 When datum and sharp dropped out of 22 convention and 21 convention He blames to fan molly new and can of solans The can of solans part is retarded and didn't make sense. It didn't make sense then It doesn't make sense now. I thought it was ridiculous I asked him about it and he just kind of mumbled something about retweeting I don't know if it was referring to me retweeting can of solans, which I have Stiffen molly new retweeting can of solans or someone like socrates who we talked about as well He definitively though blamed can of solans and stiffen molly new mostly stiffen molly new for dropping out of 21 convention Particularly he was citing some comments that I checked with molly new about that didn't happen Where he was criticizing george floyd the whole george floyd situation back in you know in 2020 So something molly new said pissed donovan off, but donovan took it way too far I told him I didn't want any fucking part of his beef with an alumni speaker and I didn't care Unless it was really serious if if molly new went on a live stream and started dropping n bombs about fucking george floyd I need to know about it. I need a link. I need a timecode. I need to look at it I need to talk to molly new because I could blow up not just in my face I could blow up in everyone's face all the speakers who have been spoken when in the past You know three years or something. That's a big deal That never happened.   He was intake to the bank.  This is like way too far. It's fake. Okay Fair enough. I would say I mean there's two things I would say about that One is that uh, I I believe that if we talk to donovan about it Again, this is a possible expression. He might have a different Idea a recollection of exactly what he will definitely will now after this And it could be it could be a misinterpretation. It could be You know, I'm saying again. I'm not saying it is I'm saying that's a possibility Because when things get heated and we you know, we you know One person here is one thing and they they think that that means this and interpretation Especially over text and and things like that But the second thing I would say is this is this is a good example of why In order to move forward We have to really bury the hatchet because think about this situation Let's say that let's say that donovan is lying about this again I can't take sides here because I I don't have firsthand knowledge, right? I can't say Oh, it's absolutely the case. I'm not going to take sides on it, but let's say that he is lying. Okay What is it going to take for someone who's publicly made a lie? to a lot of people to To confess that lie. I mean You know, I the right thing is the right thing is to do it Of course, but and I'm not saying that he is lying, but I'm saying that let's suppose that he is It would take a lot to do that. So to ask someone to do that is is is is not Is not feasible and and I'm just and I'm just seeing this as a microcosm of the of the bigger problem because how many How many few I don't I can't even I need to draw a map on how many guys are feuding with how many guys over Over different things a lot of the feuds are pretty minor like So I think there's different levels to feuds in the atmosphere and some of them are just just shit talking and people make up Coach Greg Adams and George Bruno had a pretty bad fight a long time ago And as as a as a guy in between the two of them the one of both of them to speak I had to email them individually And I was like, hey, can you both work this out? Like I would really appreciate if you gave it a shot Hop on the phone talk it out if you end up screaming at each other Whatever, you know, it is what it is But I'd appreciate if you both gave it a shot and they did and they worked it out.  Again. I love the interview man. You know, you're my dog, man I love you man. You're my dog. You know, we we had a great time in 21. I respect everything you do It's just as many people are arguing in this thing because I'm not a part of the man's sphere Why is my name coming? Yeah, no, I get it. Yeah Of all people Why is my name coming up? You see I'm saying why why is my name coming up because Donovan's a drama marketer Right. I'm just saying that that's I mean see out of respect what I said before you might have missed I said, look, it's one thing if you say, Steve, you know what?  I watched it wasting. Why is my name in this?   He ain't got no brand But he wanted to save me. I'm destroying the brand. I don't even talk about that knucklehead like that to destroy his brand All right, that's that that's why I was I'm sorry, but my last question. I want to ask john real quick um So you you've made it's clear you have a organized structured like intellectual position on this john That's obvious to me and I maintain that you're very genuine sincere in these positions I said they yesterday on the show. I meant it. I mean it now and you're not the only one There's a lot of guys like you kutch greg is a really good example Who's very distant third-party neutral party at all this right, which I think is very similar to your position My question is kind of two-part. Are you familiar with nicolas nasim talib the author? Yeah, yeah, one of my favorite authors. Yeah. Yeah, I love him too.  I'm saying what boundaries Specifically and what lines do you draw with dealing with people? If you Find it, you know Preponderance of the evidence that they're not dealing with you in good faith I believe to the bone to the bottom of my soul a monument lied to your face yesterday And all of your fans and subscribers For his own benefit to pretend to be this nice guy. Oh, I'm just a nice guy. Look at Anthony. Oh, man I'm just a nice guy. I think he's calling me a scumbag. I'm such a nice guy I just want peace in the man is here. Just peace of harmony.   I didn't say nothing.     Just to be candid.  Yeah, I mean there's a couple things I would say about that and then and I'll get to the fraud question but but the thing is You know The thing I think that that's important to understand is different people view things in a different way, right? So again, I can't speak for donovan because I don't know him Like I'm not him right, but and I don't know exactly what he meant But I I like to give him the benefit of the doubt in saying that he didn't believe that he was attacking you Because he wasn't calling you names now My interpretation, okay and donovan if you're watching this is my interpretation And I said it during the stream is I and I tried to hint it during the stream I didn't say it directly, but I'll say it now is I felt like that was an attack on anthony and it would be Interpreter's attack. That's why I said, hey, let's ask the audience if they feel like this is attacked does anthony feel like this attack let's have him on because Because not because see again, he may be drawing the line and saying if you don't call someone a name You're not attacking them But but I would say if you are implying that someone is a shady character You're attacking them right now again different people are going to have different perspectives on that and remember the perspective is always going to be influenced by Where where you're sitting from his perspective? He might have thought oh I'm not attacking anthony because I'm not calling him names because it's easy to justify your own actions Again, we're all guilty of that. Okay. I mean I could call out and I could say well anthony you said that you Weren't gonna, you know, but but in the chat you were saying nasty things to oh, yeah and then afterwards you posted the picture I was like dammit anthony don't do that Well, what did you expect?  You know what I'm saying like, okay I think it's very masculine. I mean it's locker room. It's locker room talking but yeah So why can't we just like if we're gonna rag on each other Can we be men and rag on each other and and just laugh it off and like not have like, you know Super big feuds about this this is like, you know again, but but to address your question about the fraud For me that the line is it has to be first hand Right because because it's so hard because again, I listen to You know, how many people text me or called me after this the stream and they and and and you know, again I know some of these people like for example, I went down and I spent time Uh with with myron and and prince there and those and those guys are sincere. Okay now I know that that there's there's um some uh, you know between steven and them and and I understand I've heard both of their positions on it. Okay, and and both of those positions if you listen to them Both both parties are sincere and they make they make sense. Okay. I'm not the one who's going to judge who's right or wrong Okay, but I'm not going to like say.  I'm not gonna say I hate steve I'm not going to take sides on that because the thing is it's so complicated when people get into feuds is that Everyone thinks that they're right and and usually usually Both parties are wrong in some way.  Hey, we're men. We do stupid shit We fight it out whatever bury the hatchet for the good of of like what we're trying to do Like all the guys that actually want to move forward and actually really Be John Yeah, I think there's an error I and as an objectivist, I don't know if you're an objectivist, but I am I think it's an error And it's an error in your thinking and you're assuming that everyone in the mana sphere Now, no, this is not a literal statement.   It's this industry. It's everything, right? Yeah, right Here's how Yeah, John was just saying real quick. Yeah And you know, we we talked on the back end that my problem wasn't that my problem is see I'm used to men handling men stuff to men stuff. I'm not used to men running behind tattling and threatening Saying that if you don't get rid of this guy, I'm out. See that's some sidebar.  Let's defend molly new All right, then we got a lot of coming because that's what myra did to me Yep, I got the proof. No, I got proof. I mean, I know I got proof But I'm just saying yeah, no, I'm just saying real quick that See you I see what you're saying bulldog, but as a man You don't run to another man and then threaten that man To do something to another man or you're gonna that that's that's bitch shit But see that's the but that's that's the protection again.     All right Like I know that there's bad actors But one thing I've learned in life is that if you give a dog a bad name, you might as well hang the dog so I try To to assume Even when I know someone is a bad actor and in bad faith I try to assume that they're doing it for the good Because sometimes that makes them to start to do it for the good or or they're forced into the situation Where now they have to be a good actor or or what happens is when you do that If I play dumb and I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm just dumb john just accepting of everyone I don't know what's going on and um And I and I and I have a high esteem of them Then they publicly out themselves and prove that you know who they are I retract much or most of what I my question earlier because you're addressing it.    It's like hyper binary It's like feminists are out there and these e thoughts and all these hoes and these soy boys and in here It's like masculine men and content creators and we're all good And it's not that simple, right? Right. Some of these feminists are legitimately as brainwashed And some of them will turn they'll turn tail and we'll go savage against the feminists, right?   DDJ calls it. They're like, oh that guy bashes feminism That guy makes fun of hoes that guy makes fun of thought culture.  Well, I want to go into him because I want to say he's a a newer Manisphere consumer Okay, so I want we had gonzo's take I want I want man's take on this real quick And then I've got a really good question for john anthony and steve the deed Yeah, I just want to say hey john Hey anthony nice to meet you on camera finally and uh steve second time to meet you good to see you man I hope y'all doing well 100. Thank you. Yeah, and uh, Tony. Thank you. Gonzo's always man. Love y'all uh, anyway I just want I keep it short. I'm not a man of many words, but uh Not everything needs a reaction across the board and uh I think to be honest the bottom line is truth talks and bullshit walks And so whatever the truth is Whatever the frauds are They're gonna get exposed.  Let them shoot their arrows. Let them do what they're gonna do Keep pushing the message. Keep doing what you gotta do one day at a time And uh, and and nothing not everything needs a reaction That's it Much love to y'all great comment. I want to address john anthony and and steve When does when does a content creator in the manasphere water down his content and john specifically John you're a wealthy guy. You do well for yourself One thing I I've I've and I've met you in person and I I really believe you are sincere And you are truly out there trying to help guys with lifestyle when I say lifestyle fitness their business And also whether it be game or pick up whatever you want to call it being able to relate to women You're you're financially set when does the when does the message become watered down for revenue for financial gain? Okay, so let's let's start with you Yeah, I mean that's a good question. So so in in my I've already been cancelled before right like I like from my perspective I I guess my perspective a little bit different is because you know, yes Yes, I'm running a business here, but I don't I don't need to run a business site I I have income that's coming in right passive income. So for me I just say what I think now with that said right I I also am careful to not like I don't I've never found any benefit in my life in hating people I've never found any benefit in making enemies, right? So I would rather work together with people even even people who are who maybe Don't have the best intentions And give them the best intentions and so I'm not going to water down my content at all Because you know, like like you're like you're hearing here is because my my motive is primarily that I want to help guys That's why I'm doing this otherwise I could be doing a lot of other things and like I said John you don't have to do this. Let's get that on the table. Right, right. You do not have to do this right So it's it's a passion to you. I'm not going to take away that I think that everybody has the right to earn money Right. What I'm putting to you is you don't have to do this Financially you don't need to do this, correct? Correct. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So so I think that's uh, that's a different angle you're coming at Yeah, and I think that that has to be so, you know to be fully full disclosure Which I I show my finances every every month and what I make I do make a lot of money from bulldog mindset But like I said, I don't need the money in order to to live It's it's it's extra So but I think that that is something to take into account is that some Content creators, right? You know and and I think that anyone who's making their living from it is going to be biased So so for example, right? I think a good example. This is and again, I'm not accusing anyone of lying But if we go back to the whole, uh, donovan thing that I was talking to Anthony about it's like, well Let's suppose that that donovan is it was lying about the the thing again I'm not taking sides on this but I'm saying as a let's suppose that he is Is he you know, if his business is His audience's faith in him It's very costly for him to come out and say that he was lying even if he would like to do it, right? So so that's a factor. So again Do there's the right thing, right? If he's lying, is it the right thing for him to come out and say that he's lying? of course it is but I have a little bit of empathy to say that I can understand why he wouldn't if he was lying Because it would cost financially and he's running a business and so Me as as a man would say, okay. Well, let's allow this person to save face. Let's just move forward, right? And that's why I think it's so important that we don't try and get to the bottom of all of these things because A bunch of people will probably be caught in lies and And in behaviors that would hurt them financially, right? If we try to and we see what happens when people try to expose that, right? I mean, there's there's certain characters that that that we're talking about the other day Who who are just hell bent on just destroying people and nothing else are not even trying to help guys They're just trying to destroy people and they start doxing people and all this stuff And then it becomes a real bloody mess and that's and that's no good So so I think there it is important to consider the financial You know impact on that and that's why, you know, we have to be smart enough to be to be guys to say Okay, well, let's let some people save face Because it it'll cost them a lot of money and in there are there other audience or they're afraid So let's let them save face and let's move forward that that's why I I keep on emphasizing that position I don't want to look at people's past sins and things like that because you're never going to get I mean, it's hard enough to get a man to admit when he's wrong It's 10 times as hard to get a man to admit he's wrong when it's going to cost him money So, you know, I'm saying so so that's why I think pursuing that avenue doesn't make any sense But that's that's my piece on it Okay, Anthony I'm largely in the opposite camp of john on this issue Uh, for example, like I don't I have no interest in uniting with frauds So people have committed real fraud in the community. People have done real harm People have done real doxing like real tomasi Uh, I have no empathy for them. I don't care and another thing too by the way So john I think is being serious and sincere On him not needing the money for his work with bulldog mindset Rola tomasi rides on the coattails of that position by saying a thousand times a year a thousand times a day I'm not in it for the money. I'm not in it for the money. I'm not in it for the money I challenge Rola tomasi to release his tax returns from any year 17, 18, 19 20, whatever I release money Most of his money by far comes from the rational mail. It's been that way since about 2015 2016 He lies consistently to his audience on his blog and on his youtube channels and stuff about this issue He says it to get the moral high ground John is saying it and it's legitimate and it does give him kind of a bump in that regard for credibility Rola does it to leech. Rola does it to lie and does it to manipulate. It's fraud It's absolute fraud and he does it knowingly and willingly because people most of culture is based on altruistic morality So doing things not for the money not for yourself interest Rolo plays on that 48 laws of power should a book he's obsessed with This is one of the primary ways that Rolo manipulates his audience and his guys have no idea A lot of them are codependent. They belong in therapy and not read not coaching calls Not the manosphere. They really belong in therapy like talk therapy. Seriously He prays on these codependent dudes.   He's always the original question exactly. I don't want to go too far off tangent with it, Tony What it was is that the content being watered down Yeah, basically in search of revenue In other words, I have no I have no tolerance for watering it down zero Like if some donovan should own up to his mistakes and lose a lot of money for it For example, dodam and sharp got secretly married to his girlfriend back in 2019 A lot of people don't like that don't want to hear that but that's what happened He even had a one-year anniversary in florida back last year in 2020 But people don't know about this donovan But then donovan goes anti marriage on his channel all day long, right?  He go gets private married behind the scenes.  I have zero tolerance for it Anthony let me give you a quick just real I'm going to put a link in the chat So if there's somebody that is worthy of coming on and worthy I would say if donovan happens to be watching this I'll go ahead. He is welcome to come on but i'm going to put this link in the chat If anybody else that i see is worthy and i'm gonna i'm gonna i'm gonna Judge who's worthy tonight. I'm gonna i'm gonna say this tony If the average manyspherian Manysphere guy knew the level of fraud deception and bullshit that a lot of content creators not a lot Huge amount but like 20 30 percent are engaged in their heads their heads would explode They would have a permanently damaged trust relationship with the manysphere itself They would unsubscribe from half the channels.   Let me stay away from that And that's why it continues just like in politics.  That's what this community needs I'm not advocating for violence in the manysphere of jesus christ But there's a level of savagery. There's a level of that's what that's what the mctaugh dictionary guys Oh, go ahead.  Are you kidding me? I'll give him my address show up in my house.  That's his name. Well, no, he's one of the guys that comes on dippin Um, I do recognize him. I recognize the name, but if that's him, you're welcome to click that link and come on Um, also, let me see some new comments here real quick I don't think this is this is not the real mctaugh.  I don't I'm not saying it's true. I don't know if he's legally or privately married I have a chain of emails where he's bugging me about private marriage I even went on a show and talked about private marriage and he got pestering about it pestering about it Pestering me about it for weeks and months before he got married legally. Uh, I think private marriage He might be legally married now. I don't know.  She has a blue balling him I mean, this is all on his patron.      It's that bad.   They don't know any better. How these guys have zero social skills The migthaw dictionary guys, I think the sum of them probably spurred.  So Yeah, I gotta say this real quick. I gotta go. Um, well, here's the thing that my okay, I've seen it all I mean, I've been I've been in this thing for 30 over 30 years seeing the From ross jeffreys or from doc love to ross jeffreys ross jeffreys at w dating W dating to uh mystery and style. I've seen all this I've seen it all I've seen the squeeze pages I've seen all the ways that they Hook these guys in on words and phrases and catchphrases and my biggest problem is they're just doing a They're doing damage to these young boys. They don't understand They don't understand what they're doing to young men today by trying to trying to create these cults of hate It's all problematic.  How many ways can you complain?  I only roll with real motherfuckers.   I'm not going to name names I don't want to get them any more trouble They have state licenses with the governments in their state for professional shit They almost lost their licenses or on the verge of losing their licensing to do their own jobs That have very little or nothing to do with the manosphere So that almost happened to them But those are the guys I roll with me I could have a bank accounts cancelled I could have lost my youtube channel a colossal websites I could have lost everything with make woman great again, but I believe in make woman great again Because I believe in the manosphere and that to me is a part of it.   I believe I care about it more than money.  It's a tool.  This is what matters. I'm gonna die someday I could get by bus tomorrow the mana sphere is, you know, a big part of my life It's the main it's the main thing that I focus on a mission Along with, you know, 10 of the things involved with it, but and ramp So I have a question and this is for everybody But um, I think anthony is going to have great perspective on this too because I I I think uh What I see is a duality, right? So I see like, you know, we have situ or maybe not a duality. It's it's uh, you have A case-by-case basis where you look at things like you've got a the situation with I think you said coach greg and george bruno And you're talking about uniting them at least for this event Yeah, and then and then you have situations with rollo You know where it's like We got a fumigate We got to get this guy out May exterminate them Yeah Is your final solution Yeah, oh god, uh Watch and take that out of context, but yeah But I guess my my question is so, you know, obviously when you have something like that where it's very aggressive And there's a lot of you know, there's a lot of fire being thrown around It's really obvious. I guess you got to do something like that, but You know where where does the line draw between because you know, I agree. We're not gonna all kumbaya You know, there's no way everybody's gonna be kumbayaing at the end of this, but I think what is the line between uniting people and Uh, I suppose ostracizing them for lack of a better term I exhale rollo. I mean straight up. I mean, that's not a joke like that was done in 2019 That's history at this point. Not everyone's gonna respect that but Uh, hello, john go on my video froze.  John my viewpoint in it. Well, I'm a humanist, right? I believe that no person is irredeemable but My whole idea is like it's sort of okay The thing that I really dislike about leftist feminist culture is cancel culture, right? And the problem with cancel culture is that everyone thinks that they're right when they're canceling like there's just there's, you know It's the majority rules. You you said the wrong thing. You thought the wrong thing, you know wrong thing and so so to me like I don't I don't think that we should ostracize people out of the community instead We should just let them show for themselves, right because People aren't stupid, right? If if we have People speaking about what they actually think about and talking about their philosophies and those philosophies are weak If their guidance is not correct, then they will be sniffed out and people won't follow or listen to them They will they will doom themselves.   Uh, so so and sometimes you have a great influence on those people I was just speaking to a content creator today on the phone who's made a lot of nasty videos about other content creators and I talked to him today and I was like I was like, look, you know, this isn't a good strategy for you You know, this isn't this isn't smart like ostracizing yourself from the community I was like, maybe maybe turn around maybe like do something different, you know I mean in a lot of people don't want to talk to this guy right because because he's burned a lot of people And and said a lot of nasty stuff But uh, but I was you know giving some Some advice to him and he he took it. He said, okay. Yeah, that makes sense like I I'm tired of copyright strikes and I'm and uh, and maybe I should start making friends with other people in the community and and doing this so You know, again, it's not everyone. It's not everyone but but there is You know by having a little bit of faith in people Sometimes you can bring out the best in them and that's the thing that I try to do I mean, heck, I have a guy that I'm coaching right now Um, I'm not going to say any names, but a 21 year old kid. Okay who Who I met on one of the the nasi streams that happened on saturday nights, okay And he was completely bashing me and and and I said, hey, I'll help you man Like honestly like I really will help you and he said, uh, yeah, whatever, right? He he emailed me. I jumped on zoom call. I've been coaching him. I charged $1,500 an hour for my coaching I've been giving him coaching for free. He was suicidal. He's completely turned his life around He's doing good now.  We should exterminate this guy We should he's he's just worthless to society because he's he was just bashing people and and and and trying to stir Up controversy and and cause harm to people But the reason why he was doing it was because he was in pain and he was hurting and by having one person in this world Care about him. It completely changed his life around, you know, I mean and again So that's the perspective that I have is that you know, again Maybe some people will turn out that they're they're irredeemable in the sense because they will reject the helping hand and and and there's nothing but But but I'm never going to just like spurn someone and say that they're irredeemable No, no matter what and again, you know, I mean sometimes there's going to be a cost to that But I think those people always come out and it it always becomes obvious when someone is a bad actor And and and people will will see that but but yeah, I don't know that that's just my perspective on it But I agree with some of that. I mean That's the real dip in from migtail dictionary and you want to come on Come on and and And just hit that hit that stream button that I just put in there the stream link And you are welcome to come on if that's the real dip in I don't think it is But if if that's the real dip in I know who you are So, um, I'll bring you on the stream so Go ahead, Anthony Yes, I agree with someone with John saying and that's and so Uh to put some context to what I said earlier about exiling rollo Role is the only guy I've ever exiled from the man's sphere Uh, seriously, that's literally ever I haven't and I will not exile Donovan sharp I've Richard Cooper and not mld not rhinestone none of these guys that attack me and fight with me And I fight with them. I don't it doesn't matter to me. They're not, uh I have obviously very serious disagreements with them in different ways And that that varies by degree depending on the person Donovan's more recent, but even that is pretty pretty small potatoes Compared to the stuff with rollo, for example, and even what rich cooper got dragged into I don't think it was by his own I don't think you know cooper some Some scheme or some Machiavellian scheme or like rollo is So I think the reason I exiled a rollo is because he what he committed was treason And that's what I said verbatim this guy really doxed over 50 guys He tried to cover it up for over eight months and that's really serious That's not stealing money from another content creator. That's not lying about this.   I will never forgive that. That's irredeemable He could try to redeem himself someday He could try to own up to it take responsibility for his actions He would take a massive financial hit for owning up to doxing over 50 guys So he'll never do it. It's an economic cost in his head.  He's irredeemable by his own choice He chose to be that way.  It's really weird But yeah, there's no I don't see how he can redeem himself to do that He would have to completely change who he is and he's never going to do that And there's nothing comparable to this Donovan sharp has done nothing comparable to that Richard Cooper has done nothing comparable to that Ryan stone has done nothing comparable to that mld who I don't like at all Has done nothing comparable to that none of these guys have I don't know anyone in over 25 years history He was dillman rollo has so I think there is a line you can cross and that's it That's just shy of like a mass shooting or bombing doxing over 50 guys in today's culture 2018 That's not that long ago.     I was there and then he tried to blame it on your brother and I haven't thrown on video He's done this.  He tried blaming it. She's shifting it on I was there at the cigar bar that night. I was there in your hotel room also that night Yeah, and I was an attendee. I was not on staff So I witnessed this firsthand So I I can tell you from my point of view as an attendee And looking at what was going on I have to Um co-sign with anthony I have to I want to only tap tap on this too is that you know, george brunner reached out to your brother reached out to Richard cooper Probably a year ago at this point and just tried to have a debate not a debate like a meaningful conversation with them Because they were friends before I ever I never knew either one of them I found george brunner thwarted through uh, richard cooper and I found tony brunner through george brunner So i'm thankful to richard cooper in some ways for that Uh specifically and genuinely And I don't like have this hatred of rich cooper any of these guys It's rollo's the guy who went way above and beyond to like a sociopathic level to burn guys I have no respect for that.  I don't I don't have any hatred towards these guys a lot of these guys I don't care that much they're just dudes. I have disagreements and I kind of some pretty sharp criticisms of some of them Uh, but in a lot of ways it's still redeemable Like the vast majority of them are still redeemable if they were like, you know There's something wrong here.       I mean granted that like I can totally understand that You know that you would not want to have anything to do with a rollo based on that I think the the issue is that that it's not It's not something that you can absolutely prove without a shout of that again. I'm not saying that you're not telling the truth I'm just saying that that makes it difficult to I think if you if it was very clear And it was absolutely Provable Is it though? Is it absolutely provable? There are text messages from this one that's actually happened Is second that used to nelly?  We have text message from nelly. We have her in writing claiming this You know, she's fake news new york times.  You can't do that. If they're gonna lie and manipulate They're gonna do it. They're spinning and distortion not making up text messages rollo can drop at any point rollo to mossy can drop his phone records from october 2018 That fucking month october 2018 his phone records if he dropped so so prove his innocence all day long He won't do it. He never will Richard cooper asked, you know roll to mossy on rule zero way back in 2019 He was like rollo was on the show and cooper's like, hey, you know So what if rollo did it and rollo just sits there and you can go look at the video rollo's looking at him like Cooper's like, so what if he did it?  Did he do it or did he not do it?     Who the fuck's going to come to 21 convention if they're getting doxed We live in 2021 That's that's getting doxed is like next step to losing your bank account at this point Uh, if you're if you're going to manuscript conventions or whatever, right?  It's got or the former president It's got his bank accounts cancelled Like we're living in wild times, man When I grew up in the 90s people aren't losing their bank accounts, right? You could do pretty much anything short of illegal activity and you'd have a bank account now No bank account for you. Oh, are you gonna found gab dot com and your torba? No visa credit cards for you. No visa debit cards for you.   It was reckless to the point of like, uh, Oh, if these people die, who cares?   I see you back there, buddy You know, I'd love to have you come back on saturday night. I just I just want somebody that's relevant. I know there is one from No, somebody was talking about migtau dictionary and we're really not going there I do appreciate you coming on the stream. Was that a manual that wanted to say something about migtau dictionary? If i'm correct, just nod your head. I see you back there I guess not There's a question in the chat about migtau dictionary and me. Um, they're asking me if he's macavelian. I don't know The first migtau dictionary emailed me today.   I don't know I have ideas about what they're doing. Obviously.   Who knows I don't know Well, I'm a Emmanuel nod your head buddy. You wanted to talk about migtau dictionary if i'm correct. I can see you backstage Well, I don't see him now so Now i'm lying.  I truly don't I've I if if you are click that click that link and come on.  That's all real quick so if you want to come on click the link and uh come on But if that is the real dippin, which I don't think it is I know that's not the real migtau dictionary in there and if uh The Migtau dictionary was in the chat. I bring him on right now in a heartbeat. So um So let let me ask you guys a question. We've been airing this out now for for really an hour and 40 minutes What can we do?  Okay, you do all sorts of content with every different guy in man is fear under the umbrella of the man is fear So what is your what is your? I guess your solution for I don't even I don't want to say the word uniting right now because that's like a trigger trigger word But so what's your solution? Well, this is it.  This is what the feminists do This is what the left and liberals do is a closed dialogue, right? So I so this is my challenge my invitation to to everyone here because and we see it even now, right How many invitations have we extended to people on this on this stream? Because they come on and jump on and they haven't jumped on right and it's like So so and again, I'm not trying to I understand what you said about yesterday anthony. So, you know, you you explain your position, but But but my solution is to say, okay, let's just have more dialogues with people if you disagree with someone And maybe and you know a good rule that I follow again Not everyone has to follow this rule But I think it's just a great a great rule is just is to not talk about someone unless they're present That's just what I learned as a as a kid. That's I feel like that it's easier to not talk about someone when they're When they're not present online Because there's less implications, right? You can make a video about someone you can say something so When someone doesn't have a the opportunity to defend themselves That's where we get most of the months laying happening because then and then people are confused You know, we we have audiences that were split people like go to this schism or this schism They hate this. They don't know, you know, I can make a video smearing any person I want in the hemisphere and And no one can know whether or not what I'm saying is is true. Maybe there's some partial truths in there Maybe there's some stuff I made up. Maybe there's some way that I've spun it again. I'm not accusing anyone of anything I'm just saying that that's why it's so important to have dialogue and have discussions And and when we talk about someone to have them have the chance to to talk back, right? So so that's what I think the solution is is just to is to say, okay, it doesn't matter We don't all have to get along. We don't all have to be friends. We don't all have to agree We have a lot of different viewpoints. That's all fine But let's not ostracize people. Let's let's have different viewpoints on our channels Let's discuss those things even if we're going to debate those things. That's fine That's how things move forward and how we we we discover new and better ideas And part of the reason actually why I like 21 convention, right was because when I was there I mean heck I met like coach greg who's you know, technically migtail, right? And I've made a lot of anti migtail videos again attacking the philosophy not the individual people, okay And I like coach great. He's he's an awesome guy. I had a couple of calls with him after and you know He's he's just a stand-up awesome guy, right? And so but if if me and him dialogue about things we have different philosophies, right? I'm I definitely have a lot of different viewpoints and we have a lot that overlaps But I have a lot that that I would disagree with it would be like no way you're wrong about this And then he would disagree with me about which is fine But by by people listening to us and hearing what we have in common and then hearing what we what we disagree about That those those men become more educated because they can make decisions for themselves Not not only because they hear different viewpoints and then they can assess for themselves What is correct and and and it helps us to learn as well to have our Our wisdom tested against someone else But also because it shows them how we can communicate as men And not you know, we can have differences of opinion We can have differences and not even like each other But we can get along and and and discuss things and and move things forward So so that's my solution is just to say look let's just have more people come to the table Let's just cross pollinate more. Let's get some different people. I'm happy to have anyone on my channel This is my open invitation, right migtow. It doesn't matter, right? I even you know, migtow dictionary reached out to me yesterday. I was like, yeah, jump on a stream with me, man Like let's let's like as long as you're not going to like jump on there and just start attacking me Let's have a discussion. I want to hear your viewpoint and I want to discuss this, right? So so that's that's my solution is for us to do that. Again, we don't have to get along We're not going to be all you know on the same wavelength But but having open dialogue That's that's the thing that that's the thing that we should be emphasizing because that's the thing that the left and the cancel culture and everything is trying to shut down You know free speech open dialogue is is key I have I agree with this sentiment and I support it. I also have a counter that I think is important Um, and so for example, not not just to say these things but to really walk my walk, right walk my talk Uh at 21 convention. I'm a fierce defender of free speech a lot of the speakers have pointed this out For example, michael foster was really surprised that I let him say whatever hell he wanted On 21 convention. He's he's open to speech talking about that. He was really surprised and impressed at the same time He disagreed strongly with disley peterson who was a fellow pastor reverend of christianity. That was surprising to me So there are disagreements. I do agree strongly with open dialogue What I was saying counter is that there are guys in the manosphere rollo is an easy punching bag on this He preaches consistently about open debate and open dialogue Searches twitter searches blog for those terms open debate open dialogue. What does he do? He blocks guys and excises guys from his sphere of influence who disagree with them The second john samas decided to speak at 21 convention rollo didn't call you He didn't text you or as far as I know. He didn't say anything to you.    He disagrees with rollo Stafan molly is evil. What happened to shawn t smith? What happened to that train wreck show? That shit's gone ever since he debated with rollo rollo can't tolerate it and he pushes buttons Well, but larping in public right open dialogue open debate cancel culture is bad What does he do? He cancels and blocks everybody either literally on twitter Or he exises them out of existence in the manifesto like shawn smith All of a sudden shawn smith is what do they call person non grata, right after he debates at rollo Go watch it. It's song cooper's channel. That shit's gone now rollo doesn't endorse him anymore.  And then he talks about open debate open dialogue.  They really were not getting along.  You need to get along. Let's see if we can work this out and they did thank god That's because you guys are serious. There are guys though who latch on to those buzzwords Free speech open debate open dialogue and they don't mean it. They literally don't mean it They know when they're saying it, they don't mean it. They're not confused.   They just say it to get to virtue signal It's in group micro or niche of virtue signaling not generalized virtue signaling we're used to out in the culture It's targeted and specific to build loyalty It's fucked up And there are examples of it again Like I said with rollo and stafan malinu when stafan malinu interviewed rollo And when shawn smith debated rollo tamasi on cooper's channel Those are pivotal points a rollo turned on those dudes He was cool with malinu to interview with them all of a sudden malinu is dead I have texts from rollo saying don't ever bring malinu to 21 convention. I'm out immediately, right? Trying to dictate to me who's in the speak of my convention not even discussing with other speakers dictating No, mike sernovich knows to find a malinu.  He attacks him in public, right?  Okay, let there are real guys and bullshitters Let's talk about open debate to me open debate when a debate is over Okay, when you can walk away and still disagree it was still a good debate But it shows the character of a man after you debate To me that's really important We had a debate with a vegan guy and I respect the guy the guy was an incredible Debater on vegan lifestyle. I put I put a short video I wasn't wasn't short, but I put a video out just on that debate But I give that guy a lot of credit for sticking in there and debating. I didn't we didn't really we didn't Um Degrade him. We didn't do anything like that. We we debated him And I give him a lot of credit because it showed his character The the character of a man is shown after the debate as far as I'm concerned If you can walk away and still disagree, that's character of a man So when somebody debates something to me, it's important how you leave that debate Does anybody agree with me on that? Yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I got no problem with that. Yeah But I'm gonna we're gonna knock it off here in a few minutes I'm gonna put the uh, put this put the invite in the chat and this is to This is to uh This is to rollo tamasi. This is to anybody that wants to jump on donovan if you're watching Um, you are welcome. We've got a few minutes left I love a donovan lark yesterday that he would buck up to rollo in private that never happened Rolo's or donovans massively his balls and rollo's purse just flat out. I mean, I believe that to the bone That's it's ironic too because uh, you know back in the day cooper and I have texts of this to the nines Cooper was constantly trying to boot where donovan out of the red man group because donovan was a hothead He was screaming you rant and curse and get his own channel Striked and pleaded off youtube and cooper's cooper never liked donovan to try to get him booted Constantly it was me and rollo.  It was amazing It was like this endless waterfall of lies.  It was amazing to watch it was Beautiful Gonzo man, you got any input i'm sure you do I'm just trying to think of uh, you know because obviously like like there's a case-by-case basis when stuff like this comes up when there's beef sizzling um, and there's a nice steak cooking, you know, I I just keep coming back to to that that poem if by rugged Kipling Yeah, I think that's just what you got to do.  There's going to be things happening. There's going to be uh, You know, and that's fine. It's just it's the reaction and the problem we have uh, it seems like with this whole situation that sparked this it seems like um There there's a lot of there's a lot of uh female nature flowing around there's a lot of over reaction there's a lot of uh, a lot of that taking place and so Just as man, I think that's that's what we got to do, you know, uh, we just got to have um, we got to Watch ourselves You know watch yourselves um, and what I mean is that You know, we have to we have to look for for Those things like anger Yeah, and and vengeance and those types of things And see what see them for what they are, which is just you know, their thoughts their their emotions and uh, You know, we need to be able to to control them and not and not overreact Now i'm gonna say something now. I know anthony well personal friend of mine good friend of mine Okay, he was here sunday. He was here on valentine's day Tony is my valentine. Yeah, his mom. I gave his mom a mug. I had yeah The big one mom loves you for that um amazing So So Hey, tony. I want to interrupt you really quick speaking of speaking of merchandise. I just wanted to hit on this Anthony, I want to get one of those uh, the the future is patriarchy. I love the shirt the shirt. Oh, yeah It's on youtube channel the shirts. Yeah. Yeah, that's are harder to get the shirts easy. Go to youtube channel All right, cool, man. Cool. Yeah, man. Yeah anybody else the the future is masculine All that stuff is on the youtube channel. But yeah, you should all have Sure and wear it proudly. That's for sure. So um, so anyways what what I was getting at is I don't look at like I knew I knew the reaction from the video Anthony really didn't react from the video from donovan last week But I knew the reaction from yesterday's video Was going to be it was going to be harsh and it was going to be crude I do not look as I know anthony because I talked to him. He was not angry He wasn't angry at all This is this is his response It's I don't look at as it's anthony's reaction anthony doesn't react he responds and there's a big difference between reacting and responding Okay Donovan, what did you expect? I mean, truthfully, what did you expect? I mean, that's you know We've been you know people have you know, bitched about the rollo thing and you know what I'm okay with it I'm okay with it. It doesn't bother me. It's like being on social media You see something on social media How many people have to comment? Okay, when I see something that I don't like or something that might irritate me, you know what I do I scroll on by I just move on faster so it doesn't affect me but anthony I think is protecting his brand and his response to donovan is going to be to Protect his brand and yeah, is he gonna be tongue-in-cheek at it? Yeah, we know that We know that I mean and and to me that's okay That's my opinion. That's okay. We knew there was going to be memes coming out. It's just it's the response And do we laugh at those? Yeah, I think everybody does Maybe someday there'll be a meme about me and that's I'm okay with it, you know um Again, I'm going to go back to the issue was referring to the doxing on migtow dictionary How about not mention their name? Because what happened you can say a certain channel a certain migtow channel How many guys that watched your video john and watched donovan's video went to migtow dictionary And now know donovan's name now know everything they didn't know about him before To me, that's like doxing yourself What do you think about that john? I'm completely against any any doxing of any kind any kind of Someone doesn't want to reveal Like revealing that information about them in any way, especially if it involves Someone who isn't in the ring right a wife a daughter, uh, you know, a friend family member But um, you know some some people, you know If you have a problem with what someone says This is my whole thing like you have a problem with someone says let's let's talk about what they said Let's not talk about the person themselves. Let's not talk about their family or their you know, let's just talk about what ideas Right, but what what ideas what things are are they saying? That's incorrect. Are they giving bad advice is that That's that's the level That and think about it right.  And so I don't that's the thing I would say it's like if we can Try to keep it more about the ideas and the in the philosophies and not about the people That that's better for everyone and sure. I mean, it's funny, you know, a little meme or something like that I Again, I consider Donovan to be a friend of mine. I would not betray him.  But you know, but but again, it's too funny I know we take some of those things light-hearted right? I think you know, I mean I think I think if we all just take a little bit of things a little bit light-hearted someone throws a jab at us Okay, ha ha funny not a big deal then things will get better And if we just avoid talking about people but talking about ideas again, that's and I try to again I've I've made mistakes in the past but for the most part I try to say, okay You know this this channel or this person said this thing or I talk about choosing signals I don't talk about the person who promotes choosing signals right when I disagree with choosing signals I think that's better because that that's that's just it avoids the thing because someone Here's their name, right? And even when it's not even meant in a bad way They say why is my name drawn into this and then it starts the whole cycle up again So how happened is Steve Steve got on here because his name was attacked Like why did Donovan go after Steve? Like, I don't know Steve was pretty pissed about that. I think You know Donovan's thing with me is a separate thing. I don't know is why was he going after Steve? I don't know Like, you know, I think he's I think I have ideas about why he plays this way He tries to kind of create a cloud of uh context. That's like very artificial Like oh MLD went after joker riding to prove with that.  I think a lot of that was a smokescreen to spend the next 45 minutes bitching about me to be honest He kind of did the same thing on a smaller scale in his original video back in january about three weeks ago four weeks ago That's my opinion on why he does that stuff Um, I did have a follow-up comment for this. I wanted to make about what Tony was saying earlier Uh, I'll get back to in a minute brain fart. It's getting late John what what is your definition of philosophy? A philosophy is uh the way that you you live your life Right so a guidance for for living your life for making correct decisions in life. Let's say that It's the search for truth search for wisdom is really what philosophy is It's your view now. How many philosophy debates are there? Okay a lot. Yes, so When you know when I've done all sorts of interviews and conversations with you ams coach greg Sean t smith it's a philosophy. It's it's their thought process on whether it be dating or lifestyle, so How does a guy like grasp on to the philosophy that that that he He will embrace. How does a guy do that? Well, the the key thing and you know senica talked about this actually A lot is that you have to listen to other people's philosophies, but then Your duty as a man is to form your own To to not just parrot what you've heard not to just adopt someone else's philosophy But to come up with your own philosophy in life right to to synthesize your own Thing and so that's that's the critical thing and and this is where again, right? We talked about this I think at one time on on a stream on your channel about About the about the kind of the the cultish nature right the brain or Where a lot of the problems that I have with some of the schisms and philosophies that are being preached out there You know things like mctown black pill and things like that Is that it is a it is a group think that that it's encouraging men to not think for themselves to just use a bunch of rehashed vocabulary a lot of hatred towards towards women or calling guys simpson cox and stuff like that that is It is all just like a a script and these guys are just wholeheartedly Adopting this philosophy instead of becoming independent thinkers and again, that's why again I fall back to the idea of open dialogue and debate this prevents us from having these monocultures And and and it causes people to think because guess what if you're if you're like a subscriber to my channel And you're like yes bulldog minds that that's a philosophy for life 100% agree and then I have someone on on my channel who has a slightly different philosophy and their shit makes sense And we're talking together then you're like well wait a minute. Hmm. I'm not sure Maybe I don't just maybe I don't agree with everything that bulldog mindsets says maybe you know This guy's got a point too, but if you didn't hear that guy then you're like, oh no no bulldog mindsets says the truth He's the gospel. It's nothing else. It matters. It's not correct these other guys on these other channels I I don't need to listen to them because they're wrong Right, you know what I'm saying So that's why open dialogue is so important is because it stops us it it causes men to to hear Conflicting philosophies and to hash it out and then to form their own from from that so Another man's philosophy will eventually fail you Eventually, yeah And I wanted I wanted to touch on one set pro fex Pro fex says why are you posting the stream yard and then kicking me when I joined? Well because I asked it was specific people that I was inviting on the stream tonight So it's nothing against you. You are welcome You are welcome to come on saturday night in debate But this is a specific topic and there's only specific people that I welcome to the stream That's why I put it in there, but you are welcome to come back saturday night So go ahead and Yeah, I was just saying I wanted to address the the point of cutting people from When they need to be cut and yes people need to be absolutely That there's a certain point that that you have to remove people out of your your business You know anything But I believe in going about it in such a way that it's uh quiet quietly removing people Because uh, it can get it can fall back on you if you're not careful in a lot of ways And anger is something too that I like what ganjo said about anger We have to we have to evaluate ourselves as men that we're not coming from places of anger Because anger as we all know a lot of these young men out here are dealing with anger their their mothers are angry Against you know their fathers and so all they hear is this anger stuff all they see is this retaliation kind of thing Um, but anger is something we have to be very mindful of and I just want to throw that out there I have uh two follow-ups. I remember my thing from earlier It was uh following up on when something john said john was talking about the memes and you know the stuff I put out Uh, which is really par for the course, right? I mean he really didn't see that coming come on One of the reasons I post the memes though. It's a very small amount of what I post people get I think it's like reticular activating system activation system kind of stuff The memes are emotionally charged and they either love them or kind of hate them.  I don't want them I don't want them as subscribers. I don't want them as fans.     That's the point. That's just men being men It goes too far sometimes sometimes it doesn't end just funny sometimes it goes too far and it's not funny This is part of being men. That's part of conflict That's part of men with testosterone engaging with each other as conflict It's very natural and healthy and normal And the constant suppression of it is because the mana sphere is filled with betas or conflict avoidant Psychologically conflict avoidant as a lifelong strategy for living life.    They don't want to breathe with you.    I don't care.  They push people away and they build loyalty. I think too The the only thing I'd say about the locker room thing is that the difference here is that it's public And so people see it like in the locker room, you know, we get into a rumble We push each other around we like, you know, it's not but here we're kind of representing Men and and it kind of you know, there's a lot of men watching us Yeah, I mean trump grabs woman by the pussy and they love it and he says that and that's that's locker room talking guess what that's also real life But see there's a connection there Trump's a good example because as much as I I like trump He would have been more effective had he toned down some of that right because it's maybe The same exact principles that he has because he I believe he was a really good president I believe a lot of what he wanted to do great stuff Would he have gone further had he not Not been as aggressive as far as like If you use different words if he's a little bit more tactful, right? And again, and I think the same thing with avoiding conflict, right? You could accuse me of avoiding conflict. I don't avoid conflict I'm I'm happy to have conflict, but I try to have it in a way in which is Which does not bring Attacks and an emotion into it and instead let's let's let's have conflict like I'm not afraid I'm not going to steer out of it. Believe me if I want to avoid conflict. I want to come on this stream I've only done this stream like I'm you know, I'm jumping on wherever because I you know, but But my way of dealing with it is to say that let's have discussion This let's debate let's have right, you know, I'm not pulling in punches I'm telling you what I think you know Anthony and and because I I trust you as a man can respect that and handle that and the way that I'm saying it I trust that you know that I have a high degree of respect for you And so I can disagree with you Just like I'm pushing back now Which is not avoiding conflict, but I can do it in a way that you still know that I Respect you and I think we make more progress that way. That's all I'm saying. I do think the memes are funny I I will say that that's That's I'm down. I'm down with your position. I have a slightly different style. I'm much I like to be more bombastic I really like trump style you have a fair point then I think you can make a fair argument for that position Whether or not in the end, it's right a lot of you're not the only person to say that Maybe if you had toned down this and that and done things a little bit differently That's one of the ways that I think there's a more legitimate argument argument to be made rather than the generalized Armchair quarterback. Oh, I could have been a better president than trump. Trump had done this and that no Some of this stuff is way too specific. But yeah, the tone is a generalized thing that I actually think I actually think he could have been a lot more vocal about a lot of things a lot more polarizing Trump i'm talking about. Yeah, he could have done a lot more It was words with words. Yeah words and like uh getting getting re you know saying things that gets a ton of reactions He could have done a lot more than what he did But who's more polarizing than trump? I mean, that's technically possible But there's no man alive that's more polarizing than trump that I know. Yeah, yeah Wait now, how how did you go?   I'm just I'm just stating the comment. I mean, I'm just recapping is all I'm doing. I'm recapping And and you know, I mean what was said what was said? um President dr. Michael McGrath again, baby. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, you are the president of the man's fair just so anybody knows anthony dream johnson Is the president of the man's fair and I think john samez would be a great vice president Okay, so I think I'm not a buzz. I prefer coach craig though. I want to be the uh, the diplomat like what what is it the uh, foreign I'm more of the diplomat I'd say but well, I'm gonna call john the real rational male, right? There we go. I'll take it And and and the reason I say that john because you do you always have a great angle at where you approach things and And and that's why it was really important for you to be on here tonight You do approach things from a rational Rational angle and again, you know, you're somebody who is very successful. I know that personally It's something you don't need to do But I think it's something that you want to do is to help people and to me. That's really important I think the same thing about anthony anthony is something that it's a passion for me Is there is there many people that have Done done something since they've been 17 years old and pushed forward the whole time So there's a lot of respect to guys like anthony and john So I I respect you guys coming on here tonight and kind of hashing it out and this this video and this This stream was not for drama this This this stream was for sanity clarity and reason like my brother says And I really do mean that I have no I I don't have hate in my heart for anybody and I truly don't Do I disagree with somebody? Yeah Do I care that rollo blocked me after we had a disagreement on twitter? Absolutely not. It didn't affect me in any way shape or form So I think that this kind of discourse is important in the manifest to get it out and disagreements are going to happen No matter what nobody is going to agree on everything, but I think the philosophies Whether it be the black pill the red pill mig tau What other factions pick up? Gold pill gold pill is the new one. Yeah, I think it's really important that Everything stays under that umbrella and it is a philosophy. It's a thought process It's they're searching everybody that has a philosophy is searching for something You're searching for the wisdom that you I think the I think I think when we talk about an end goal I think the end goal is to help men but guys approach it from a different a different angle I think that's that's one of the things that we have to recognize, you know black pill guys are really Realistically, let's face it. They're trying to help guys I mean they I think one of the most important things I think one of the most important things about the manifest is that it's a gang It's a group of men You know what I mean regardless This is a gang where where any guy can can come into and find something and enjoy and he can stick with it and feel part of a brotherhood They don't have you know, these guys don't have that and uh, they can find mentors in the process some good some bad But nonetheless, it's a gang, you know Yeah, true I want to chime in and just say that you know John's echoed uh, he says he has respect for me and all that I appreciate that and I respect him too immensely And I would say also the more specific comment that I get like a level of emotional maturity out of john That's honestly like a Interpretation or observation that I sense just talking to him Known him for I don't know a year and a half an hour or something like that And I really appreciate that and I think there's a lot more that needed in the manosphere and guys like john samas and coach Greg And george bruner bring that to the table like those the guys that uniquely bring that in ways that other guys don't You know, I'm 32 like however emotionally mature I am I'm nowhere near as mature as I'll be 10 15 20 years from now And you guys are a little bit older and then have your shit together you bring that to the table And I wish more guys had that at your age In general and then even in the manosphere and that it helps move the community forward towards a real unity not a fake conformity That is posing as a unity, which I'm not a fan of I want to uh pat pat anthony on the back a little bit I I found out a couple months ago that you your first convention was in 2008 7 2007 that's uh, that's incredible man to know that to know that uh It's it's been going this far and growing. That's good. That's great. That's impressive. I was impressed about that Thanks, man all over the world to florida, texas, poland, sweden, england, australia I think that's it. Yeah, like five six countries now Yeah, I kind of that sincerely blew my mind when I found that out. I said man, this guy's uh He's really been keeping these convenience conventions going successfully. So good job on that appreciate that. Thanks, man Well, I think we'll wrap it up and I hope that I hope that everybody who watched this Got something out of this and tried to understand that when men get together Yeah, there's going to be some ball busting and that's part of being a man If you can't take it. Well, you know buy a box of tampons.   You have a great channel Um, anthony, I know with the conventions There there hasn't been anybody that I know that wouldn't want to go back or hasn't repeated going back It's an incredible Incredible four days. So again anybody that is watching or watching this in the future get your ticket to 21 You'll you'll enjoy it. It's not it's the speech. It's not just the events are too, tony We publish the speeches we film them super extremely professionally and publish them free to the world It's the TED talks of the man sphere and it gets Strangely gets a lot of recognition and views, but like people don't remember this these videos don't have to be free I could just keep them on a paywall and definitely Well, I don't believe in that I'd be I believe in publishing them for free and leveraging the internet to reach millions of men We've reached over a million men just in the past few weeks on our channel and I love that I love putting out the speeches are free. It's a big it's a great business model The speakers love it. They benefit from it immensely, especially in the videos go viral 100,000 500,000 million views 2 million in some cases And I love that and I don't have to do that and a lot of guys don't do that There's been no other conference in the history of the man sphere that does that either And that's probably I think an important point that isn't get stated enough These speeches are filmed at very high expense and then published for free And I don't have to do that. I just believe in that and I've had speakers as well as shareholders to try to push me to Not do that and for 15 years I've pushed back on that I keep doing it over and over and over again And I think that's a big part of building the man is building a library of content From guys who in some cases are dead now like Stefan Arneo and the private man I'm gonna get out of the guys too. I think we're getting really um, you know as much as a hate roller like I've talked about I think he's just massive fraud scumbag blah blah blah I'm really glad he spoke with 21 because someday he'll be dead. He's kind of old. He's in his 50s 20 years from now He could easily be dead I'm in a in a strange way in a paradoxical way proud that he spoke with 21 So that there's a public speaking record of him speaking at a conference for this community And the same is true for the guys who are dead private man It's Stefan Arneo and the same is true for the guys who have yet to speak that I want to get to speak Ross Jeffries is another example. He's old. He's in a dice some day. I'm glad he spoke I want to get Warren Friel to speak because he's in his 70s. He's not going to live forever Paul Elum another guy these guys are going to be dead someday and they're legends of this community And I really want to get them on video and then publish your free to the world And that's a big part of what 21 does too not just the events Right Well, I think we're going to wrap it up. I just want to go real quick over the panel I'm tony bruno. You can find me of course on this channel Everybody watching come back saturday night and I will let you on the live stream It's get it off your chest saturday night. You're welcome to come on get get it off your chest talk about whatever you want to talk about You can find me on apple podcast google podcasts Spotify anchor lifestyle Philosophies with tony bruno. I've got great interviews on there with john sanmez ams That's alfamil strategies steve the dean williams john t smith Coach Greg adams. Um, I know i'm forgetting somebody but there's a lot of them on there, but check me out Like this video share it subscribe to this channel gonzo Uh, yeah, uh, you can find i'm an artist and A musician but you can find my uh My hot takes on youtube right now. I'm covering the uh, the texas freeze As we're right in the middle of it. So you can find that at at a gonzo school on youtube So that's just a gonzo school and then of course you can find my art You can find all that stuff on instagram and gab at midnight author And uh, I think that does it. Yeah, this has been awesome Cool. So Yeah, so as you see on the screen it says primal man. That's where you can find me on youtube monday night We do monday night man hour and so uh, come check that out It's 8 p.m. Central time on the primal man youtube channel Also, you can follow me on instagram at man to dope like an adult And uh, john back to you Uh, best place to find me is bulldog mindset.com if you go there There's a bulldog mindset quiz to see what your bulldog score is just take that quiz I'll send you a score from 0 to 100. There's 10 questions And then i'll give you some videos and stuff how to raise that score and improve yourself So bulldog mindset.com Awesome, and I do everybody. Yeah go to john's channel. It's an awesome channel great content fantastic content I couldn't recommend anybody More than john right now for sure besides anthony also, but let's go to anthony Yeah, just uh, you know 21 studios.com 21 university.com also go to the app store on your android or apple phone or ipad And search for 21 university download the app leave a review. I appreciate it And other than that just youtube type 21 studios or youtube.com slash 21 We're closing in fast on 300 000 subs. Uh, maybe a month from now or so So fuck. Yeah. Thank you been great stream Great stream guys. Appreciate it. You guys want to stay for the after party real quick We'll end this everybody come back saturday night, and I'll see you. Thanks for joining us. Good night


Welcome, this is Melissa Armo with a Stock Swoosh, and I'm here to invite you to a free webinar, Monday, November 12th. It's about how you can earn a living day trading, and if you're willing to risk an advance amount of your trades, you can earn $400,000 a year or even more trading. The sky is the limit when you're trading because it only has to do with the amount that you're risking. The strategy itself is the same, whether it's your beginner, intermediate, or advanced. If you'd like more information, you can email me at melissathestalkswoosh.com. You can also call me at 929-3200 Gap. So it's November 12th, 430 Eastern Time Monday. Just click on that link, you can go. It's a free webinar. You do have to download the software. It is hot com. If you do not know how to do that, you can email me for instructions. It's melissaathestalkswoosh.com or email hot com for instructions if you've ever heard of them. But the best thing to do would be to email me if you'd like instructions to be there. At the end of the day, time is money. A lot of people have so many things going on in their lives, family, friends, their job. Sometimes people are even taking care of their parents, elderly, people have so much going on. And so they really have to find the right thing that they're doing, that they're spending the correct amount of time with to get the most bang for their buck. And I find that gaps as a trading method really is that specific thing. They have volatility, they have momentum, and they have big moves. And really it's about results. So 2018 has been a strong year, but if you're interested in day training, you really have to have a system that produces results in order to make money. Or you're gonna lose. And you need a system that produces results to trade gaps. So I teach a method, it's called the golden gap, and the golden gap trading system teaches you how to produce results. Because again, time is money. And we focus in the morning. Occasionally I'll hold something later, but really I'm focusing on just that morning time period. So if you have an hour a day to trade the market and be your desk between nine and 10 a.m. eastern time, you can prep in the morning, and then we look for the setups between nine and 30 and 10. If you wanna make extra money, if you wanna trade for a living, or if you're looking for a new career, you've gotta find a consistent strategy. And what you're doing right now in the market is creating losses for you, then you need to change what you are doing in some regard. October was a very good month. These were all the ticker symbols for October. And again, if you notice, I'm focused usually in one a day, maybe two. And if I'm doing two, it's either a retake on the first ticker symbol, so the same ticker symbol, or I'm looking like the MMM and ACANN were the retakes, and IBM even too. There was a couple retakes that month, spy as well. But all in all, I'm usually focusing on one thing a day. And those are the best days. Quite frankly, we're in and out very quick in the morning. So if you're interested, come to the webinar. It is November 12th, or 30 eastern time. The next golden gap class was only two more left this year, November, one in November, and the November class is November 17th, 18th, and 19th. From nine to five eastern time, cost of the class is $5,999 US dollars. If you're interested, email me at Melissa at thestockswish.com. You must email me in order to sign up, in order to register to get the forms, and come to the webinar if you wanna learn more about what I do. Thanks everyone, have a great day.