We'll pronounce your kid's name wrong the first time, right? Unless they're from a Gaelic-speaking country, right? Right. I found one that calls him Richard. Richard. Richard. So tell me. I'm like, see his last name. That's disrespectful. Richard Noodle. I'm sure that's it. Kiki, I was reminded today the last time I did anything live with you was a long time ago, like on some, some twit thing or something. Wasn't it? Yeah. It's been too long. Way too long. Yeah. I was very excited when I was like, Scott's going to be on this one. Real quick. Kiki, I just have twiz.org. Was there anything else that I should? Twiz.org. And then I'd love to tell people about my live Portland show next week if they're Portland people. Yeah. Is there a link for it or do you just want to? I have a link for it. Should I put it in the rundown there? I mean, it's, would you post it? Yeah. It's on line 48, because that's where we'll talk about it. Yeah.  Those URLs up in the gray box really shouldn't be there. They don't do anything. Hey, hey. Okay. Those are just, those are left over from when tech news today used to use them to make the lower thirds. Row 48. I think it's Nod. Roger. All the pronunciation websites in Nod. Then we can easily see who's on the show, but the URLs don't really matter there. Undo. Oops, can undo. Undo.  Got it. Thank you. Okay. Well, I think we should pick someone to thank on the show. Who will it be? That's a fun name. Everyone likes a fun name. Who doesn't? I don't. Funions. You don't? No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Anything fun. Fun name. You have the funnest name in science. Big thumbs down. That name's not fun enough, or it's too fun. Too much fun. Sure. I do try to pick these randomly. I cannot do what Kiki does at the end of TWIS. That's impressive. All the names? Yeah, because I listened to TWEX. It's funny, though, because I've had a few people write me emails after, you know, they've signed up on Patreon, and I'm reading their names, and I'm just doing the best I can.  Yeah, I never would have gotten that. Thank you. All right, we're going to break for some Daily Tech News. Everybody ready? Let's do it. All right, here we go. In three, two. Aaron Traffas has supported independent tech news directly for five years. Why not be like Aaron? Become a DTNS member right now at patreon.com slash DTNS. This is the Daily Tech News for Wednesday, March 27th, 2019, in Los Angeles. I'm Tom Marin. And from Studio Theline, I'm Sarah Lane. From Salt Lake City, I'm Scott Johnson. And I'm the show's producer, Roger Chang. Joining us today also, we're very happy to have back Dr. Kiki, Kirsten Rennberg, host of This Week in Science. Kiki, how's it going? It's great. Yeah, I'm calling in from Portland, Oregon. Yeah, how are things in Portland? Fantastic. We've got a little bit of rain because it's Portland, Oregon. You already said it was Portland, so yeah. Yeah, twist.org, if you don't know already, go check it out. And folks in Portland, you're going to get a chance to see you live coming up here in a while. We're going to talk about that a little later too. What date is that? Next Wednesday, April 3rd. On Week Away. All right, so let's start today's show. We actually have prepared artificial intelligence three ways for you today. We'll start with a few other tech things you should know. Apple has acknowledged problems with its third-gen butterfly keyboard. In a statement to The Wall Street Journal's Joanna Stern, Apple wrote, We are aware that a small number of users are having issues with their third-generation butterfly keyboard, and for that, we are sorry. We are sorry. Wow. I love the small number of millions of people, which still means millions of people. I wonder if it affects this thing I'm holding up, which is the butterfly tech in the new desktop version of the wireless keyboard. Goldman Sachs CEO Richard Node, nod, we decided, didn't we? Told CMBC the company is exploring the idea of offering the Apple Card credit card outside the US. Node says, absolutely. We'll be thinking of international opportunities for it, unquote. There is some confusion around wrong vote pressing regarding the European copyright directive. We talked about it yesterday. It passed Tuesday by a margin of 70 votes. That 70 is important to keep in mind. Prior to the vote on the entire directive, there was a motion to make amendments. That motion to consider amendments was defeated by five votes. Amendments could have, but wouldn't necessarily have, resulted in proposals to delete Articles 11 and 17. 17 is the new Article 13. At least two and possibly three Swedish members of the European Parliament pressed the wrong button when voting on whether to allow amendments or not. Two other Swedish MEPs that might have voted for amendments were absence.  It's not certain that there would have been enough to delete Articles 11 and 13. And certainly it wasn't enough to sway the 70 votes that allowed the copyright directive to pass. But wow, make sure you're pressing your buttons right. That's all I gotta say. Got a lot of AI stuff to talk about on the show. But let's start with some congratulations. Jeffrey Hinton, Jan LeCun and Yoshua Benjiro have won the Turing Award, which comes with $1 million, for their work on neural networks from the Association for Computing Machinery, the world's largest society of computing professionals. The Turing Award was first introduced in 1966 and is often called the Nobel Prize of Computing. Yeah, which is confusing because it's not actually the Nobel Prize, but it's sort of like the Nobel Prize. But we've got some other machine learning related news. Right, Scott? Yeah, we do. Let's see if it passes the Turing test. The New York Times reports Google has started an operation called Robotics at Google. It's led by AI scientist Vincent Van Hoak. The department will use machine learning to teach robots things like how to grasp objects and navigate their environment. You teach me a few things. Google's last robotics effort was called Replicant. It died in the rain. Just kidding. Started in 2013 with Andy Rubin at the head. Rubin left Google in 2014. Although he did make the Nexus the name to complete the Blade Runner jokes. Yeah, so this is Google getting back into robotics, but more in a machine learning kind of way. They're showing off a couple of initial prototypes, and it does seem like before under Replicant, they were buying up robotics companies. That's when Boston Dynamics was part of this. And they were making impressive demos, but not rolling out anything in the world. And I think this is Google playing a little bit of catch-up saying, you know what? Actually, we could make some innovative new robotics products also separate from Alphabet's robotics projects that would be part of X or any of their other Alphabet companies. This is a Google effort within Google under Alphabet. Yeah, it seems as though this is a really good effort. I mean, the machine learning stuff that Google's been doing for years has been incredibly impressive. And it just seemed like a mistake for the Andy Rubin robotics effort years back. It was like, let's buy these companies with absolutely no plan. And maybe this is something with more of a plan. Yeah, I agreed. It's not that they can't take advantage of things like DeepMind, which is a separate Alphabet company. They are often called a Google company, but they're not owned by Google. They're owned by Alphabet, but they do cooperate with Google quite a bit. So I expect them to cooperate, and it gets confusing. But yeah, I would like to see some more machine learning type developments out of this, because these are the kinds of things that could show up in your house versus the big dog from Boston Dynamics. I was never going to own one of those. It also goes to show you a company as big as Google to come out with something like this, where all of us are like, were they not doing that already? Oh yeah, Andy Rubin left in 2014. And when a company starts to feel like, all right, we got the team back, now we're ready to get everyone else interested in what we're going to achieve. That's when we hear things like that. I want to contradict Tom just real quick. I will have one of those dogs one day, and I don't care. Good for you, Scott.  Yeah, sure. Why not? Google has also launched the Advanced Technology External Advisory Council of eight people to advise on ethical issues relating to artificial intelligence. The panel includes mathematician Bubacar Ba, former US Deputy Secretary of State, William Joseph Burns, and University of Bath Computer Scientist and Associate Professor Joanna Bryson. Now Bryson's an interesting one. In a thesis titled, Robots Should Be Slaves, Bryson argued that humanizing AI dehumanizes people and encourages poor human decision making in the allocation of resources and responsibility. Those are her words, poor human decision making in the allocation of resources and responsibility. She has also argued that complexity should not be used as an excuse to not inform the public how AI systems operate. Bryson seems to be dedicated to making things less mystical and saying, look, AI is just code. It's not a person. And there's no reason we shouldn't tell people how it works. So Dr. Kiki, I got a question for you. Yeah. This reminds me of the anthropomorphizing of animals or other things in our lives. Mostly animals, though. That's also dangerous for similar reasons. And when I heard you were coming on, I thought you would probably have at least an interesting take on that angle. Absolutely. The thing I'm looking at with Bryson's paper and the ideas she's coming out with, I mean, it's a lot of philosophical work that she's coming from. But there's really no scientific evidence that it's bad for us to humanize or anthropomorphize robots. We don't have that. And in fact, there are studies that show that people accept robots, these rumbas and robotic helpers in their lives, more readily when they have a little bit more of a human aspect to them, that people are able to interact with them more easily. And so there might be a fine line that has to be played moving forward. I do agree that the mystical aspect of these AI that are so intelligent taking over all these tasks for us, that knowing more about how they work will help people understand the different levels of AI. So what is intelligence? How intelligent is it? I actually need to read Bryson more closely to say this. But I suspect that she would not disagree with what you're saying. It's not a problem to have faces on robots and to make them humanized in order to make them accepted. Because in the abstract of her paper, she says robots should not be described as persons nor given legal nor moral responsibility for their actions. So there's a difference between how we present them in use versus how we treat them in policy. And I feel like maybe that's where she's going. Robots are fully owned by us. We determine their goals and behavior directly or indirectly in humanizing them. We not only further dehumanize real people, but encourage poor human decision making, etc., like I said before. I don't know that by humanizing robots, that it dehumanizes people. I think that's a jump in logic that doesn't necessarily make sense. And I'd love to see more work on that before we do take that step. But I think with AI that we're working with in our daily lives right now, like Siri and these other very basic intelligences that do little things for us, that nobody's humanizing those. They are tools. They're not like people yet. Whereas some people are pushing forward to allow equal ideology for dolphins and chimpanzees, these intelligent animals, like maybe what Scott's talking about a little bit, these are intelligent animals with intelligences. And at what point are AIs going to be intelligent enough that they maybe have consciousness? I mean, this is the subject of science fiction. At what point does consciousness allow them to be individuals and to have personalities that we do a lot of humanizing? And a lot of it's about how do they reflect our behavior. And recently, my daughter got after me because I yelled at the echo. I was mad at the echo for something.  And she thought that was mean. And I had to say, Carter, it's a machine and there's no feelings on that end. But she's still humanized a little bit. So I don't know how that applies to this discussion. It probably doesn't. But it's going to get really difficult. I think it does because I think it's the difference between saying, oh, we want them to sound human for acceptance. That's right. Yeah. Is it wrong? We don't want them to have the moodiness of actual humans because that's a nightmare. Well, and also as we just, you know, and yeah, where's that middle ground? Yeah. Also, hangouts seem to be wanting to give us an echo because hangouts, the AI that lives within it doesn't want us talking about this. So we apologize for the echo that's showing up on this. But yeah, I think there's room for both of these. I think it's very true that you need to humanize AI to get it accepted and used, especially in robots. But I think there's something to be said for we shouldn't think of these as anything but objects until such time, which I believe will be long in the future, where we get evidence that they actually have sentience or something like that. Right. So yeah. Yeah. And the idea that robots should be slaves, I mean, perhaps there is some good to that as robots, you know, like the car building robots and others are able to be servants in your home, be workers in factories that can allow humans to step above that and not be thought of as servants and slaves anymore at a certain level. So maybe it'll reduce the stratification of society in some sense. Moving on. Reuters reports that China's Beijing Kunlun Tech company is looking to sell Grinder, the dating app that it bought back in 2018. The company had planned an IPO but is now shifting to an auction process. If you wonder why, Reuters sources say that the committee on foreign investment in the United States has expressed concerns that Kunlun having access to Grinder customer data constitutes a security risk. Kunlun is one of China's largest gaming companies. If you haven't heard of it, it's quite large. And part of a consortium that bought Norway's Opera Limited back in 2016 as well. Yeah, this is part of the continuing campaign for US officials to prevent Chinese companies from owning US companies. Grinder is a West Hollywood company. It's right down the street over there. But in 2016, Kunlun took a majority interest in it and in 2018, it outright purchased it. And that's a lot of customer data. And when you're talking about dating data too, it could be potentially compromising data if you were able to see what people were saying to each other and things like that. So I see where this argument is coming from. The bigger question is, well, why is a Chinese company more likely to violate that than any other company? Yeah. I mean, they're like $0.10. They're a gaming company that bought a bunch of other weird stuff. And I can't quite figure out what the end game is other than just to own everything. And I don't mean that. The end game, I mean, Grinder is very popular and has lots of users. Other tech companies outside of its specialty, right? Why did Facebook buy Instagram? Why did it buy WhatsApp? You're right. It's just gaming companies in particular. It's just a new dawn for that. And they're broadening what they consider to be smart acquisitions. Yeah, it's the EA buying Tinder. I get what you're saying. No. I don't know. But if it did, I mean, I think Scott's point is if EA did buy Tinder, we'd all go, well, you will obviously want some user data information. You don't really care about owning a dating app. And I think that that's what a lot of people are saying about this story as well.  They're not e-commerce companies. They're conglomerates. They're in so many different aspects. Same as Samsung. Samsung is a financial company and a chip company and a phone company. These companies get large enough that they're well beyond what they started out as. It's true. Apple's an entertainment company all of a sudden. Yeah, right. Exactly. And there is, go ahead. Oh, go ahead, Kiki. I was going to say, and there is that value in also being able to connect individuals across platforms to actually know who individuals are as opposed to just having bulk data. Right, right, right. Being able to track people. I was going to make a joke about matchmaking there. Yeah. NetNOT Solutions, HireGoals, Marketing, Veterans of America, and Point Break Media are all companies known for robo-calling your mobile phone and have shut down and settled lawsuits with the U.S. Federal Trade Commission. The FTC announced the news Tuesday and said the group's made billions of illegal pre-recorded calls to phones across the U.S. Point Break in particular sent robo-calls claiming to be from Google Data Service providers or authorized Google My Business Agencies, sometimes telling small business owners that they were about to be listed as permanently closed in Google Search unless they paid up. Each company now has to pay several million dollars and cease operations. Oh, it's a good day. Yeah, it is a good day. You know, we were talking about this this morning when we were deciding how much we all care about robo-calls and all of us were like, yeah. Yeah. We all have something to say.  I'm getting upwards of 10 to 15 a day sometimes. Sometimes I get zero. Don't really know what the deal is, but it is, I mean, it's 100% scam stuff. They usually spoof my number to the point where it's my actual phone number, but one number is different for reasons I can't understand.  I know it's a very convoluted issue, but the more we crack down on this, the better. Hedget Pie, I'm looking at you. Well, the more depressing part of this for me was recently, for fun, we decided on The Morning Show to call a number back that was calling claiming to be the IRS and they had all this incriminating information and they had to get back right away. It's one of these total fakers. So we thought, let's call this number back on the air and let's see what it sounds like. And no more or less convincing, it wasn't that.  And all I could think was, oh my gosh, that's the state of this. Like it's a business and they're all talking and all they need is a percentage, some small percentage of people to buy into this and they're good to go. That was the most stark part about this for me because I don't actually get that many calls, but I just heard all those voices in the background and went, oh my gosh, they're all doing it. That's bad. Also, when you respond to these calls, and I know you did it, particularly for a bit, but people should know when they respond to those calls, you verify your number as being one that's responsive and you're likely to get more calls. Yeah. Well, I spoofed a number I should mention. So you spoofed the spoofers. Yeah, I totally did because I did not want increased traffic to my phone by any time. Yeah. No. No, I mean, but there was a period of time where I kind of knew that I was probably not doing it the right way. But I'd hit zero, whatever number I had to get to get to a person and say, can you please take me off your list? Real nice. And they'd either just hang up on me or say, sure. But all that ever did was increase the amount of road calls I got afterwards. So, you know, word of the wise, don't play into their game. Just verify it yourself. Just be like me and never answer your phone. That's what I do too, Dr. Kiki. Yeah. What's that strange thing? What's that noise it's making? Don't touch it. Don't touch it if people are actually trying to get a hold of me. Drew, let's talk about Google Podcasts. Now automatically generate transcripts of episodes and is using those transcripts as metadata to help listeners search for shows. Even if they don't know the title or when it was published, that sort of thing. Not every show on Google Podcasts appears to have the transcription feature yet. So probably some sort of a slow rollout. But interesting. I mean, I wonder how else they're going to use that information because that's a lot of audio. What would a search company that likes to log stuff use that information? Right. It's Google. The company where when I have no idea what that song is, but I know several words in a row in that song, I just type it in and that's the first search result. Would they ever do something like that? Is it going to be like, I mean, let's say it's this show. Are they going to transcribe an entire episode and then go, we now have four individuals we can target with new ads because we were the hosts? Or do they look at it as something? I don't know what they gain from it. I mean, I'm sure there's some ad sense magic that can happen to say like, oh, if someone's listening to this, they like AI or they're listening, they're interested in AI. So let's target them with some AI stuff. Right. I mean, that's the kind of thing that can happen. I think it's also and probably majority for finding podcasts to say, oh, if you use our podcast engine, you'll have an easier time finding cool stuff. Yeah. Yeah. And it would be interesting. I know a lot of podcasters do transcribe their podcasts and spend money doing that with services. So if Google's doing it for free, what does that mean for that side of the industry? Oh, but they're not making it available to people. Right. Easily. So yeah. But if you can find it, this may already exist. I don't know.  And I've got it. I don't know if anyone does that, but I'd like that. And I don't want to pay for it. That's the other thing. So I'm sure someone does this for pay and that's probably how they're doing it. But I would rather just, you know, somebody out there's got some open source thing. Hit me up on Twitter and let me know. And if you're in Google podcasts, just search the word disclaimer to find this week in science. Folks, to get all the tech headlines each day at about five minutes, be sure to subscribe to dailytechheadlines.com. Oh yeah. One more story that wanted to give us a little extra time to talk about today because we're getting close to that time of the year. Coming up on this Sunday. Wait, is it Sunday or Monday? I think it's Monday. Oh yeah. It's Monday. Monday is April 1st, April Fool's Day. Now, The Verge reports an internal Microsoft memo from marketing head Chris Capocella read, and I quote, I'm asking all teams at Microsoft to not do any public-facing April Fool's Day stunts, which implies they could do it internally facing. I appreciate that people may have devoted time and resources to these activities, but I believe we have more to lose than gain by attempting to be funny on this one day. Marry me, Chris. Could not agree more, man. Yes. Hey, we're a business. Can we just do that? Well, and you know, if you want to pick this apart a little bit, it's like, by Chris saying, I appreciate that there might be some jokes that have been, you know, resources have been dedicated to this. This was probably sent because he knows that that's true. Yeah. Right, and done in the past. He says, data tells us these stunts have limited positive impact and can actually result in unwanted news cycles. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, unwanted news cycles in lots of senses. People being confused and being like, whoa, this is a crazy story.  People thinking that you're just corny. And so they're like, Microsoft is lame. Like, what are they all doing there? Why am I a shareholder? We're tongue-deaf, right? Yeah. Where they're like, they're making fun of this, but they're the ones who perpetrate that, you know, because you didn't consider that interpretation of what you're doing. It's just not worth it. And honestly, the internet, we don't do jokes. It's not a joke anymore when people do. No, when it's expected. Just a lie is what it is. And so I understand like, ThinkGeek does this great thing every year, where they'll come up with some fake products and they're amazing. And oftentimes they are so well-received that they will parlay them into actual products and sell a ton of them. And people go there and know that A, it's fake. And B, you can't buy it anyway. So what was the point? And they know that it's a quote, unquote, April Fool's joke. But a lot of companies, a lot of sites, a lot of services, just straight up tell lies. That's not a joke. That's not even funny. It's not a lie. It was enough of that on the internet to go around already. I don't need a special day to amplify the lies from otherwise legitimate sources. Well, anybody who's sort of like, just in the mix, right, is going to be like, her, her, it's April Fool's. Like that was so lame. And everyone else who is actually duped, it's not really funny to laugh at somebody that's actually duped on April Fool's Day. You know what I mean? I think we've gone beyond where that is actually funny. It's like borderline mean. And at its best, a waste of time. And when it's not really risking fooling anyone, it's tired. Right. Let me just say right now, in 1999, I was leading the charge at ZDTV.com. I was saying, we should do some April Fool stuff. Come on, let's put funny stuff on the front page. And there was resistance and people saying, I don't know if that's such a good idea. I was like, I'll loosen up everybody. Let's have fun. And we started to do things at techTV.com. And even at CNET, we do a few little things here and there. And we watched as these big tech companies, that weren't even that big yet. We're doing fun stuff. And we're like, oh, this is so cool.  And then the years went by, and it became less and less funny. And it became more and more tired. And you couldn't even read slash dot anymore because it was just all fake stuff for the entire day. And I myself became the person saying, you know what? I'm done. I'm done. I'm just done with this. It's not, it was funny when no one was doing it. And it's not funny when everyone's doing it.  And we don't need to paper the entire internet with it. Yeah. Hey, man. You heard it here, folks. Tell your sister there's a spider on her shoulder and see what she does. Her reaction. Fell for it every year, by the way, my older son. Oh, that's good stuff. My eight year old wants to put a fish in the toilet. Nice. And prank his father. All right. Move forward. Why is that a prank? It's great. You know, it is a prank. It's like, well, it's a bad one. What's the prank? Because you open the toilet, there's a fish in it. You open the toilet, there's a fish. Whoa, where did that fish come from? That fish came out of the surprise. Yeah. Nobody gets hurt. It's more of a. Yeah, but Sarah. I'm in a surprise. Sarah, who will think of the fish? Who's Sarah's thinking of the fish? That's what I'm talking about. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, who will think of the fish? This guy. Who will? I'm glad you're here. Thank you, Kiki. I'm also glad for everyone who participates in our subreddit, you all are the best.  Submit stories and vote on them at dailytechnewshow.reddit.com. All y'all on Facebook, you're the best too. Facebook.com slash groups slash Daily Tech News Show. All right. Let's check out the mailbag. Let's do it. We got an email from Rob who says, I've been an avid texture user for the last number of years. You might recall that Apple bought texture prior to its recent developments. Rob says, I was excited about Apple buying it and approving a great product. After signing up for the trial, my excitement level has lowered. From what I can tell, only the current issue of each magazine is viewable on News Plus. On texture, I could have the app automatically download my favorite magazines and they'd be all ready for online or offline viewing when I got around to it. Usually I'll read a couple of months of issues at a time, binge reading. And I might be mistaken, but I haven't been able to figure out how to download and read issues other than the current month's issue. That would be a real deal breaker for me. Yeah. Well, I've got some good news. First of all, from the Apple press release, it says Apple News Plus subscribers can access current and past issues. So it seems like the reason we're not seeing past issues right now is that it just launched and they didn't put in any back issues in it. So hopefully going forward, you'll see past issues. Also, iMore.com says that if you pay your monthly subscription to texture through iTunes, it appears that your magazines automatically will come over to Apple News Plus once you sign up for Apple News Plus. Links to the magazine show up near the top of the Apple News Plus page in the news app. It says My Magazines.  If you pay texture through their website, then apparently it doesn't work. Interesting. Okay, but it's not like they've got miles and miles of back issues and content for you to go dig through right now. And no, that's the thing. Like, right now it's just this month. They didn't put any back stuff, but the press release implies that next month all of the current stuff will still be there for you. Okay, so then just keep moving forward. And if that all becomes highly searchable, then it becomes a really interesting resource. Like, that excites me. And for $10 a month, that's a pretty low bar to get in there. So we'll see how that goes over time. But you're gonna have to wait like a year to get a 12 issue backlog, I guess. Well, I mean, that's just like becoming a new subscriber to a magazine. You don't get access to all the past issues. That's true. We just, we live in a modern time, Tom. I want everything in my fingertips now. Yeah, modern time. Thank you, Rob, for the mailbag entry. And thanks to Dr. Kiki Sanford for being on the show today. We missed you, Kiki. It's been a while. Let folks know where they can keep up with all of your other work. It's been so much fun. Thanks for having me back on the show again. You can find me at twisttwis.org for our weekly podcast episodes. You can also find me at Dr. Kiki, DRKIKI on Twitter. And next Wednesday, April 3rd, you can find me in Portland, Oregon, at the Alberta Rose Theater, doing a live twist broadcast. We've got a special guest of a scientist we're going to be interviewing. She studies hearing and fish. And we've got musical guests, local geeky musicians, the PDX broadsides. It's going to be a lot of fun. Oh, that's awesome. And there's even a student discount. So check that out. Yeah, student discount. So if you're in the Portland, Oregon area, come say hi. Go check it out, folks, twist.org, T-W-I-S dot o-r-g. And we'll have a link directly to the event in our show notes. It was well at DailyTechNewShow.com. Also thanks to Scott Johnson for being on the show today. Scott, what's been going on since we saw you last? Oh, lots of all kinds of cool stuff. You can check it out at frogpants.com. I'm looking forward to this live twist where I can learn what the fish actually hears when it enters the toilet for April Fool's Day. So I also will be paying close attention to the results of that live show. Also, find me on Twitter at Scott Johnson. If you disagree with any dumb thing I said today, that's the place to hash it out. Again, that's Scott Johnson on Twitter. Listen, folks, there is more than just what happens at DailyTechNewShow. If you'd like to hear us loosening up before the show, extending our conversations after the show, picking the titles of the show, if you just want to spend more time with us, and I know some of you might become a member at patreon.com. And signed up for the Good Day Internet Feed. It is our extended 90-minute show or 70-minute show, depending on the day, where you hear us talk about all kinds of other things, extended conversations about technology, discussions of Marmite peanut butter, all kinds of other stuff. It's all available through patreon.com. If you like Marmite peanut butter, I want to know about it because I want to fight with you. And our email address is feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. We're also live Monday through Friday. If you can join us live, we'd love to have you. It's 4.30 p.m. Eastern, 2030 UTC. Find out more at dailytechnewshow.com. Back tomorrow with Justin Robert Young. Talk to you then. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. Thank you for letting me come in, join you. Thank you for letting us have you. Rent you, I don't know. Rent the Kiki. Thank you for my Kiki lease. I will respectfully turn you back in. We got some suggestions for titles at showbot.chatrealm.net, happening live. Microsoft are no fools, is one. AI wish. AI wish. Oh, like I wish. I don't, I think that one is a little tough stuff. Spoofing the spoofers. AI isn't real and it can't hurt you. I like that one, all right. Please no more April Fools on the web. This just seems like a plea rather than a title suggestion. I like it though. Direct and to the point. Please stop doing it. Please. Don't be funny. Be your friends and be pianos. Marry me, Chris. Sarah invites the nation of Australia to take her on because of the Marmite. That's a Marmite though. Marmite is a British thing. Yeah, Vegemite. Vegemite. Yeah, now the nation of Australia is going to take you on, Kelly. Yeah. Yeah. Pre-show. Kelly. We can't do that anyway. Blade Runner jokes. I don't know. Microsoft are no fools. Please no more April Fools on the web. I mean, I like the April Fools part because it's very clear what it means. AI three ways. Google bots. It died in the rain. It died in the rain. That was the Blade Runner reference. Are you next to six? I make your eyes. Rutger Hauer. Rutger Hauer. Yeah, Rutger Hauer died in the rain. Supposedly he had libbed that. Yeah, that's what I heard. It's an amazing time to die. I don't know. I don't know. But do you guys care? I don't have a pref. I like the one that said April Fools. Microsoft are no fools or please no more April Fools on the web. Please no more April Fools on the web. Down with April Fools has also been suggested. I actually prefer that one for brevity's sake. Down with April Fools. Barriot. I'm going to not include the apostrophe on purpose so that we can defend ourselves and saying, no, we were saying down with the Fools. Mm hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fake news. Yeah. April has nothing to do with this. No fake news. April is innocent. Kelly says, I'll take them. They're very polite. Harding the Australians. They are very polite. I'm not as polite as they are. Wait, are you? Yeah. I thought Canadians were the polite people. Yeah, Canadians are the politest, right? Yeah. Yeah, Australians. Where'd that come from? I don't remember Australians being and not like they were impolite, but like not. They had strong opinions on this. Abnormally polite, if that's what you're getting at. They were average. I'll just try really hard not to say. Australians are so not polite. Well, they are polite. Yeah, they are. But I would say more outwardly friendly is what I would say about it. People in Melbourne, though. I've never been there, but I have no opinion. My experience was different. Speaking of Canadians, though, my husband and son were talking this morning and they were talking about a French band.  And then Marshall went, oh, you mean comedians. Oh, I was like, I've never heard of, you know, Canadians being real joke tellers. That's, oh, well, you know, it's in the hall. Well, think of all the think of all the funny Canadians that ended up in the U.S. John Candy, Peter Jennings, Mike Myers, Mike Myers picked one. I had a funny, yes. Canadian comedians. Alanis Marr set. She started a sitcom before she hit. She had. What a funny hour. She was she was in a sitcom before she became a musician. Oh, yeah. Right. She was she was a show. No one knows because they do know. It was called isn't it ironic? No. It wasn't it? OK. No. No, it was it was like Nickelodeon level. Keeping up. Yeah, there was it was. I'm so in trouble right now. It's like the Moffits. Yeah, that's one of the funniest channels on TV is. You can't do that on TV. Yes, that was it. That was the show that she was on. Oh, it was like it was on Nickelodeon, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Mike Myers is on a Canadian sitcom before. Wait, the the Halloween guy? Yeah, the Halloween guy. No, the unfunny one. The murderer. It kills me all of it. Ah, knife to the heart. We're so in trouble. Oh, is Queen Elizabeth considered Canadian? She is the Queen of Canada, but she's British. But she's not Canadian. OK. I don't know if she's a Canadian, classified as a Canadian citizen. She is she is considered the Queen of Canada, separate from being the Queen of Britain. Right, right. That's what I mean. Like this is that also make her also Canadian. I know I know that she's like dual citizenship. Yeah, right. Is she a citizen of Canada or just the Queen of Canada? One would think she's probably a citizen. But I don't know. Maybe not. Citizen is a different class. She's the Queen of wishful thinking. Well, that was a big West. Also on the Pretty Woman soundtrack. Along with Roy Orbson's comeback. Well, I don't know. I'll get over that movie. I know I will. One day. Also Rock said must have been love. Also on the Pretty Woman soundtrack. It was a great soundtrack. That one's that's. Yep. That's the one. I was Swedish for rock before. What was the other band that came? My card against Abba. No. I saw the sun. Oh, it's a base. This is why they got their voting buttons mixed up. Sweden. They got horrible music. And it made. What? Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no.  Let's just all distance ourselves from Scott right now. Yeah. I only remember the Ace of Base. That's it. Ace of Base. Not a fan. The rest of it. I mean, if you if you used the Rednecks as an example, yes, I would agree. They were a terrible, terrible drop in the bucket of one hit wonders. But I mean, Billy Vanillie is American, Scott. Yeah, no, I know. Millie Vanillie. Aren't they German? They were German. They were German. They were German? Yeah. Well, one of them. Oh, those lip-sinkers. Some of them are both German. It didn't end well. This is terrible segue. Somebody's American. But they're not very good. Some of them. Oh, there's lots of bad American bands. Oh, yeah. You understand, though, great harmonizers. Who? Swedish bands. Oh, even Ace of Base, you'd say. Even Ace of Base. Like, I mean. Swedish bands are good for dance music. You don't like the song, the sign. No.  Nope. He hated me. He hated me. No? I don't like Ace of Base. Everything else. I give them the app. The app is great. The app is great. They got some cool music. Abba's like, like, absolutely good with harmonizing. And if you haven't heard Robin, I like Robin. Robin is good. Oh, yeah. Oh, Robin is good. Oh, I actually saw, I first heard of her on SNL when she was the musical guest. Oh, yeah. I didn't realize she was Swedish. I thought she was British. I thought she was Danish. Tom's going to make a Batman joke. Oh, I thought she was Swedish. Maybe she's Danish. Maybe I need to look that up. All I know is I can't confuse him anymore because my former Swedish intern set the record straight on a lot of that stuff. Former Swedish intern. Remember, as Sarah knows, Camilla, right? Remember Camilla? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She was very like, no, not Swedish. Swedish, not Swedish. Call your girlfriends. Sounds very good. Oh, that's a great song. That's the song that we should all dance to in our robes every moment of our lives. I just don't wear robes. So I do. Wikipedia entry for Robin has a section called Associated Acts, including Snoop Dogg. Wait, to Ace or Ace? No, she's not. She just went with him. Did he do something with him? He had a brief U.S. tour with Snoop Dogg. She has a song on an album of hers that he's featured on the Fire Department remix of Sexual Eruption by rapper Snoop Dogg. There we go. OK. Wow, Sexual Eruption. Provided backing vocals on Britney Spears' Piece of Me. Wait, so he's not Snoop Lion anymore? No, he's back to Snoop Dogg. I am so behind the curve on all that. Welcome to 2008 or whenever you change back. I've learned so much about Robin today and Millie Vanilly. Robin is wonderful. Millie Vanilly, that was a luxury, yes.  That was a good one. You know what? They were just really ahead of the curve because right now it was the day where the producer took, like was behind the scenes and slowly they crept up and now they're just kind of front and center. By the way, Snoop Dogg's change back to Snoop Dogg from Snoop Lion was October of 2013. So I'm not too, I'm six years off. Yeah. It's all because of the children. I'm only six years off. You should be an entertainment reporter, Roger. Hey, it wouldn't be bad. I'll tell you. Video folks, thanks for watching. The best musician to come out of Sweden is in fact Ingve Momsdien. Thank you, Kelly. Audio folks, stick around for the debate about that point. Nice.