So I think for most of our listeners, having heard your back story, your list of accomplishments at this point seem unreal to them, obviously going through ultramarathon running, logging the miles you've logged, the chin-ups, everything that you've done physically, when most people hear it, they're like, well, that's impossible. That was my first thought, my first exposure to you was your interview with Joe Rogan.   Right. There's video footage. Okay.  And I also wanted to start just by saying that all of us in life hear things, read things and see things that instantly change our perception of things from that point on. And it's rare that we ever get to give thanks to those sources. So I want to thank you. And I appreciate that. Because after that interview with Rogan, the way I had looked at my waking up in the morning and working out and starting the day instantly changed from that point forward. So thank you. Now your lovely fiance's in the room. Yes. How does this relationship balance work when you have such lofty goals for yourself? Physical challenges. You want to chip away at David Goggins every day. How do you two work together so that she can reach her personal goals, but then also as a couple of you guys can recharge? You know, the best thing you got to find someone that is just like you. She has the same kind of ambition that I have. So what we're all about is where do you want to go next? And she's like that with me and I'm pushing her like the same way. So it can't be all about David Goggins. Can't be all about David Goggins.    Has to be. But in this situation right here, she has to know I got her back like she has my back. So it's not all about me. So we work good together that way. The one of the big things that I feel a lot of us have in our lives is the doubters, especially the doubters from family members and people really close to us that we don't want to lose, but are telling us, no, you can't.  That's impossible.  Right.  What is wrong with you?  Well, the honest answer to that question is there's a lot of them out there, but most of them are that way for one big reason. They can't see themselves doing it. They can't see themselves doing it. It's one big reason. The other reason is a lot of it is jealousy.  Let's say we're all a big family here.     How are you going to feel about yourself? A lot of times when you're an overachiever and you have people, that's what I talk about the mediocrity thing. A lot of our family members, a lot of our friends, they're mediocre. There's always those couple of guys who are uncommon, who want to be better.  Whether it's your mom, your dad, whoever, you make him feel horrible. I've been there. I'm speaking from experience. When you get somebody around, you make who's trying to be better and you don't have the drive that they have.  You have to know that that's what it is.  They have a problem with themselves because all you're trying to do is achieve more.  It's much deeper than what you think. It lies deep in your soul. How I was able to fix myself was I saw how ugly I was towards other people who were great.  You're lazy.  That's where it comes from.  You know, it's interesting about that.  That's right. You'll also find out who your true friends are when you're rising. 100%. And that mantra of whatever you don't like doing, do it. Right. Love it.  True thing. True thing. Is jarring for most people to hear because most of us seek out our comfort zone. And for you, your comfort zone with dealing with some social anxiety and introversion is to turn Edward. Right. So how have you been able to rebuild yourself? Because one of the mantras we hear in your videos is I built this motherfucker. Right. So I take a lot of passion in who I am as a person. As you hear, as this podcast gets going and going and going, what you're going to do is you're going to transform me from this guy right now that's kind of chilled out in this room, David Goggins to Goggins. And I had to invent this person. David Goggins is an introverted, soft kid that got beat up growing up and mindset had the lie to create friends, to get friends, to be accepted. So my life has really been about two people. Very scary, but two people. I had to invent a whole another human being to get outside of my comfort zone. And that human being became Goggins. Goggins is like the guy that walks out of the phone booth. He's like that Superman that walks out of the phone booth. And I was talking to my fiance today about it's kind of strange how sometimes I have a conversation between David Goggins and Goggins.   Why are you doing that? That's nuts. So it's kind of this battle between trying to find more of yourself, knowing that the real you is afraid, likes comfort, likes living in a world that likes to pat you on the back, give you the things that you want to hear, not the things that you have to hear to get better. So that's where all this kind of started from. And when people hear this podcast, they're gonna hear a lot of things that they're gonna wanna put a title on me. They're gonna definitely wanna put a title on me to make themselves feel better. I asked them during this podcast, do not do that. Do not look at what you're gonna hear, put a title on me, because basically what you're doing is you're giving yourself a get out of jail free card. Exactly. So all you're doing, you wanna sing this guy was some super freak.  He unleashed it and became this guy.  Because every day I wake up, I dread the day. I dread the day of what I'm gonna bring on myself to get better. So. And when did Goggins' alter ego appear in your life for the first time? Goggins appeared and disappeared several times. Okay. It appeared the first time in our 17 and we'll get to that, but it really appeared when I gained about 125 pounds. I went from 175 to 300 pounds the most.  I was making no money. I was praying for cockroaches and all this stuff was just coming on me. And I'd like, I have to find something and Goggins came out. Like through all my insecurities, all my fears, all my doubts, all my introverted ways. I used to study real bad. Everything I did, I had to find strength in that. And that's kind of what happened about 24 years old. Okay. And the story, if I recall correctly, is walking in to try to become a Navy SEAL until a recruiter's office and basically getting laughed out of the office. That happened about seven times. Okay. So I give people like the quick version, the quick version, I give them one episode. This is about two weeks. And in my book, I go through it. You know, I sit on the couch, saw this show on the Discovery Channel and that started the process of, I think I want to be a Navy SEAL.  He was an observant motherfucker, you know, 300 pounds black guy walking. He's very observant. So that kind of went on for a while. Until I met one recruiter and one recruiter saw something in me that no one else saw and gave me a shot and gave me a shot. And a challenge, right? Come back, lose the weight. Right.   I can't do that.  I just knew something had to change. I had to, this isn't gonna work, man. This lifestyle that I'm living, something has to change. So I went to work that day and I was praying for cockroaches and lo and behold, it was a very bad day at work. I found a whole bunch of cockroaches, rodents, it was a bad restaurant. And I came home, I quit my job that day.   And then from there, the story really begins from that point. And I feel like that's such a crossroad in everyone's life where someone tells you you can't, you're not good enough, don't even try, give up. And when you're staring that self doubt and wanting to quit in the face, can you at least speak to the listeners who are feeling that right now? What would you say to yourself at that point? Well, I understand it, it's a miserable place.  I feel like that moment is relatable to everyone. And a lot of us have multiple moments like that in our lives and most of us choose the easier route to quit. And we'll talk a little bit more about this. Some of us get coaches and mentors and trainers to kind of help us push through that. You're sitting there on the couch, it's you.  And the other thing, and we were talking about this on the way over is we're living in this world where you don't want to upset anybody, you don't want to tell them though, you don't want to tell them they're not good enough, you don't want to hurt them and because they might feel bad. And it's, we already have that feeling within us. And if you stomp that out, what is going to drive you to get better? Well, that's what I realized for myself was I wanted that comfort zone that everybody looks for, that pat on the back.  They want to hear everything that they're doing right. And I realized that's what kept me in this world. That's what kept me in this world of not accomplishing anything.  I became the roughest critic in the world on myself. And that's what changed me. I literally saw myself in the mirror.  My life did this to me.  I took that and said, you know what? Well, some people may help this happen, but now I have to own this. No one's gonna come back to save me.  You're gonna be okay. No, I'm not. I'm not gonna be okay. I had to realize I had to take a stand. I had to make a real stand. And it was painful to look at who I was, what the world and myself created. It created a very lonely, depressed, insecure man that would do anything just to have a friend. And I saw that as very pathetic.  So. So you lose the weight. You show back up at the recruiter's office. Right. He's gotta be surprised all hell. Didn't even recognize you. Well, what happened was, in the real story, how that happens is, I would call this guy up almost every night about 10, 30, 11 o'clock at night and give him an update. Wow.  Cause no one knew what I was doing. I had to have some. So I'm really good at creating an enemy. I'm really good at creating something that I'm against. And I'm also good at, if you ever tell me something that I cannot do, I'm gonna let you know that I'm doing it.  It may not be like in your face. It may, I may make sure that I run across the dad gone world. So then it's on the news and you turn the news on. I said, how the hell did he do that? I wanna do something that you know, I'm here. I'm here. So every, every time I lose like a big significant amount of weight, I call that recruiter up and say, hey man, I'm here. I'm here. And before I knew it, man, this guy became almost like my best friend at that time. Cause he started seeing, I started actually changing his life. You know, I started seeing, you know, he started seeing, wow, man, like, I'm glad I took a shot on this guy. Right. And I, and not only did I lose weight, I had to go back and take the ASVAP test again. It was like a war down in SAT a couple more times just to get in the Navy SEAL. So it was a big process.  What I found out in that whole three months, I lived a lifetime in that three months. I started realizing if I can flip, if I can flip these insecurities upside down, if I can flip this fear, if I can flip all this shit that made me this depressed insecure guy, if I can flip it and make it work for me versus against me, I started seeing the power, the power and failure, the power and insecurity, the power and self doubt, because I looked at everybody, it may not be true, but that's how I looked at everybody's being way above me. I thought to myself, if I can be at the lowest part in the world, in the sewer and be able to overcome all this shit, I started using that as power.   I'm catching up. I had nothing. So I started flipping it and using this power. And I feel like we've definitely interviewed a lot of successful people and almost all of them have this chip on their shoulder that they developed from that bullying in school, that one moment, that one criticism that says you can't. Here you are doing all of this just to sign up for then hell week, which is one of the most difficult weeks on the planet to begin with. And you had to go through all of this. And obviously, whenever you're training, there are good days and bad days. Johnny and I were laughing about this, obviously half marathon, nowhere near ultra marathon, but you're tracking, right? You're looking at your time. You're looking at your splits. You're trying to do better. And some days you just don't have it. And I feel like in those moments where you don't have it, you know you don't have it, how do you flip that switch to get that extra ounce of energy? Because once I know that pilot light is lit and that water is boiling, well then you feel like you can take on everything. But a lot of us are feeling our pilot light flicker and that self-doubt creep back in even though we're challenging ourselves. Well, there's something that I invented a long time ago. And when you have nothing to draw from, I was able to find strength in every molecule of this earth. I'm able to be in a room with nothing, with no motivation, no inspiration, nothing and find it. So what I did in those situations was I invented this thing called taking souls.  I'm like, you know what? I want to now make a statement. It's the perfect time to make a statement, to make a statement to let you know where your life ends and mine begins. And so the statement there is I muster up every bit of strength from their looks on their faces and how they feel and how I'm gonna now from my childhood where I came from, how I was the bottom of the barrel, I'm now amongst all these uncommon people. I'm now going to now make you feel like you're common.   I use that for my strength.  And from that look on their face, that feeling of God, man, this God must be something special. It then surges me further and further and faster and harder for a long time. So it's energies everywhere, but the thing is, it's so loud that voice in your head of pain and suffering and discomfort and I don't want to do this, it's so loud that you're unable to really calm it down. It's okay, there's something here. It's a patient calm that you have to bring yourself to say, I know I have something here, but that voice is so powerful that it just wants you just to, let's leave. We're done, we're done.  First it's saying, let's take a second, hang on.  And in that moment, you can think clearly and find that strength out there for you. You know, when you look at the history of the world and you see a lot of hardship that a lot of human beings had been put in and a lot of times against their will, say a gulag or a prison camp or something like this and you hear the stories of things that they had to do in the middle of winter. It's 20 below and they're out building something and they barely have any clothes and they have holes in their shoes and you think to yourself, how are they even surviving in those situations? And I think it's the old adage of if there is a why you will figure out a how. So it's these times that we see what the human spirit is actually made of, but when you're able to flip that around and use something like that to build you up rather than somebody putting you into something like that to break you down. I mean, it's how powerful is that, right? And I don't think anyone gets to truly experience those limits unless, well, it's certainly in today's day unless you're putting yourself in it to get stronger. Right. Well, I know one thing and this is a true statement that I've said several times. A lot of us don't know of a whole nother world that exists. It's on the other side of suffering. Once you break these barriers that you have made for yourself, like the mind is the most powerful thing in the world. In the world. It is so amazing that I used to be a 300 pound guy and I thought that was it. Could barely read, could do anything.  That's how scary the mind is. And that's how I started realizing through this journey is that once I got a taste of, wow, man, I haven't even cracked.   And I talk about another thing called theory and practice. A lot of people are theorists.   It becomes like, this is it, man. This old man who has been studying the mind forever, this is the cap that we have. By being a practitioner, I went out and realized a lot of these guys are so wrong, man, the mind has capabilities that are so unknown. I found that through suffering. And there's a whole other world on the other end of that. And I feel like there's the physical governor that your body kicks in and says, I can't do this.  And a lot of us allow the mental governor to kick in far earlier than necessary. And I've always found that at the moment that that kicks in and you push the other side of it, you actually get this surge of physical energy of feeling that capable of anything. That's super human power. But most of us try to avoid even getting close to the governor. Right. I call that my 40% rule, where like a car has a governor on it. It can go 130. You know, the governor's only going to go 91. And the whole thing about that, it's a true statement. You know, like what you said, our mind wants to protect us. The mind is like, honestly, it has a tactical advantage over us. It knows our deepest, darkest fears or insecurities. It knows where we start to feel, we start getting that doubt creeping. It says, hey, man, you know what, man, maybe this isn't good. Let's go back home to the wife. Let's go back home to the kids. This is not comfortable. So in that moment, the mind directs us.  It saves us for doing bodily harm or it really saves us from discovering that the mind is like, I want to be in charge of you. I don't want you to be in charge of me. So it tells you, let's just stop right here. But once you start breaking through that barrier and start breaking down that governor, the governor that you've put in your mind, because we forget we are in control of our mind. We believe it's the other way around. No, we put in our minds what we should do, but we believe our mind is telling us, it's giving us all this feedback. We have to reprogram it and tell us, no, no, no, we're good. This sucks, but it's okay. And I think one of the remarkable things about the transformation in the beginning was, here after completing over 60 ultramarathons, it seems like you're genetically gifted, miles are no problem, but at the start, getting just over a mile was a struggle.  So for our listeners who are like, man, I can't run that. I can't do this physical stuff. That's great mental toughness, but I'm not even meant for the physical side of things. Talk a little bit to us about that mile marker one, mile marker two, to now looking for unlimited miles. Right, well, the first big thing is, once again, it goes back to open-mindedness. If you walk into any kind of event, whether it be physical or mental, if you walk in with already putting that block on your mind, if man, this ain't gonna happen, people go, how did you run a hundred 35 miles to death, bad, and so on?  Because I went into it not thinking I can't do this, man. I went into it with a strategy. I had an open-mindedness. So until your mind is open to the possibilities that I can do this, you would never be able to do it. Once the mind starts to believe it can be achieved, it then only then does it start to break down tactically how we can do this. Until then, you're gonna always lose. One of the things that we keep hearing recurring and something that we've practiced and we've talked about in our classrooms and on the show a lot is the most successful people are have a very good relationship with the worst parts of themselves where they can have that conversation and they're not hiding from that person, they're gonna work with that person or to get around that person to get that person out of the way rather than pretending that it doesn't exist. And something else that is, is I would think, at least from my own experience, there's always these rationalizations to get you to quit, right? So we have first, you're going out there, it's the quarter mile that's failure, then we're getting to a mile, then we're getting that there's gotta be another conversation with that, the other side of you that says, listen, you went from a 300 pound guy to doing this, we're good, we showed a lot of people. And what's, there's another conversation of, we ain't even begun to finish up what we're doing here. And how many of those conversations, it's like on a daily basis to you have to cast that person aside, let's look out, you're done here. You've done enough damage. It's my turn. Well, it's funny how you say that because it is a true thing. I have so many conversations in my mind because so many times I want to quit. But this is what it is, this is what I figured out. I was so afraid of myself that I had to figure out, I became a master of my mind. People, when you're afraid of something, you have to master it. That's how you start to overcome it. So what I realized, when I get to that point where I want to quit everybody, they get to the point where they want to quit. This is what happens. The mind tells you, let's go home. Let's take a warm shower, let's get some food. This is not right, this is that. If you cannot answer the questions at that moment, because your mind's gonna start giving you all these questions, all these questions. And if you can't answer them, you're going to quit. What I realized when I was going through buds, ranger school, all this 100 mile race, 200 mile races, pull up records. My mind would come creeping in. Like when I was doing 4,030 pull ups at 2,000 pull ups and my hands were ripped open. My mind said, look brother, we've done all these other things. You've proven yourself, you're good. If I didn't have the answer to respond to my mind and say, why I'm here? Why I'm doing this? You will always lose that fight. You have to have the response to what your mind is gonna tell you. And another thing about that is self-talk. A lot of people have like these big four on mental toughness.  It's true, but the thing about self-talk and all these things, they ask me, what do you think about when you're on mile 100 of a 205 mile run? What are you thinking about when you realize you've run for 24 hours and you have 24 more hours to run and you have another 105 miles, what goes to your mind? What do you say to yourself? I wanna know. A lot of people think self-talk works. It does, but it doesn't work without the suffering before your mind starts saying we need self-talk. So what I tell myself is I go back to the months and years of preparation to get to that day. And I'm telling myself the 3 30 in the morning and I'm looking at my shoes and I wanna go out there and run 30 miles. I have to in that second, in that moment of this self-talk, my mind says you gotta find more, you gotta find more. I once again, calm down, go back into my mind in my cookie jar, I call it.  And that becomes my self-talk. Self-talk does not work unless it is real. Most of us lie to ourselves in this self-talk. It doesn't work. It has to be real. It has to be something that you've done to make it really work. Now, obviously gaining that much weight doesn't happen overnight. Bad habits had to form around eating, your interactions with food, obviously your lack of exercise. How did you start to break those old habits so that you didn't revert back to yourself on the couch? It's easy to set a challenge.  Most of us, even with diet and exercise, can start, get to a point and then we tend to revert back to those old habits.  We're not achieving our goals fast enough. So what happens is, you know what? Aw, man, we're very impatient nowadays. For me, it was good. I had a phone, I was out of this world by myself. It was a race against David Goggins. It wasn't a race against God, I wanna look good for this person or that person. It was me. I gotta change myself. So for me, if I lost five pounds in a week, I got a feeling, I allowed myself to feel proud of that. I didn't look, I gotta lose 106 pounds. I'm like, man, I went from 297, now I'm 292. In one week, man, I'm killing it. We're not proud of ourselves for the small accomplishments. What we need is we need this monstrosity of the thing to happen and say, ah, I did it. No, there's a process that you have to go through and patience is the process. And if we don't have patience after a week, I haven't lost 30 pounds and I'm done. I'm over it. So that's why I found out with people, man, they're not patient enough to realize and to enjoy the moment, not live in it. Just enjoy it. There's no finish line in life, but enjoy that moment. Roger that, man, I lost five. Let me go 10 next week. So that's the whole thing about it. That's how people lose it.  And it was, you went to war against that person. Right. And I was, we were just talking about this and about how important it is. And in order for you to find yourself, we've absolutely, there's certainly about suffering or pushing limits as one aspect of it, but also at detachment from all these other influences that are not, that keep you from dealing with yourself. And obviously we're living in this world today with all this technology that supposedly keeps us connected, but also sort of keeps us separated as well. It's a crazy place. And how are you gonna build a relationship with yourself if you're completely distracted all the time? You know what? Being accepted is one thing that killed me and you have to learn, what do you want in your life? We have so much influence coming at us that we are so lost.    The next year, the next year from that. And it takes a lot of self-discipline to be able to do that nowadays because you wanna be so attached to everything.  The world's moving too fast. The world's moving so fast that you're trying to keep up to the point where you lose yourself in the world.   Or do you feel like it's an endless process that you're still building towards? It's an endless process. Endless process.  It is tattooed in my brain. Every day I wake up, I am constantly battling that person that is like, man, you know, back in the day this happened to you, man.  And you couldn't read and the dad going, junior year, all these things start to creep up even now where you're at today. Every day you're having to constantly battle. It's not as bad as it used to be by any means. But that person is still there. That person always lives. And that's the point about you have to continue to always challenge yourself every day. And celebrating those small wins along the way, right? Those small incremental steps also are that fuel. So you have the suffering, you have the past that you're running from. And you have these small moments where, hey, I went 1.3 miles today, two days ago I was sitting on the couch and not even putting on shoes to go out. Right. What are those small victories for you today? Sitting the other side here, right? Because now the feats of strength and physical are just incredible. They're literally, the listeners are gonna be going on YouTube watching this to see it for themselves. Well, now there are really no small victories now for me because what happens is once you transform yourself and even though I'm still, I'm not running from myself, I'm constantly facing myself. I'm constantly battling myself. I'm not running from them anymore. I used to, but now I'm constantly battling them.  Anything I did, anything bad, good, ugly, I will tell you. When you get to that point in your life, that's where your real journey begins. And you no longer have to have a small victory to keep you going. You now realize what your purpose in life is and you realize, oh, this shit's just part of it. But at first you need all these different tactics to keep you going because you haven't figured it out yet. Once you figure out that you're in a race amongst billions of people that live in this world, you're in a race by yourself. You have a purpose and it's your purpose, not everybody else's purpose. It is your purpose and only your purpose and it's your race. So then you're like, hey, man, I'm doing my thing. I'm doing the best of my ability. What's next? There's no longer these small increments to get through life because once you figure out why you're here, it just becomes a process. You know, it goes with something I, AJ and I were talking about this earlier and it was the video of you getting the award from the VFW was posted and obviously it choked me up. I'm sure it choked AJ up. And there was something that you said in there that was, that I just, I loved and I just, I just don't, obviously we don't see enough of it anymore. And what it was, was that there's the paraphrase that a lot of people who live in this world who don't know what they're doing in life, what's going on, they're asked from their elbow and they got nothing and they're confused. And they don't know what it's about. But it's about doing it for the guy next to them. Right. And with so much of all this other influence, it just seems that people or their values aren't being held up to any sort of standards.   And something as simple as do it for the man next to you, do it for mankind, do it for humankind. Right. It's fantastic. I mean, would you be able to speak a bit about that? Yeah, that was a moment for me the VFW where I got the Americanism Award. And what you saw there for me, it shocked me also. I got choked up, teared up. I was trying to thank my mom. And what happened was all the stuff that you all have heard about my life growing up, it's at the surface. That's just real, you know? And at that moment, it flashed through my head about the journey I had to go through to get to that point to do that. And along that journey, I figured out myself and the biggest trophy I'll ever get in my entire life, like I turned on a book deal, which we'll talk about soon, the biggest trophy that I ever got in my entire life was me, was really figuring out me. And when I was up on that stage, I realized that. I realized it's not about money. It's not about fame. It's not about being accepted by your peers and everybody else.  Even though I'm gonna be judged for all these things, being able to put a middle finger up to everybody and say, this is David Goggins. And to get to that point, it felt great. And that was all about, honestly, we have to give back. We have to be able to go through our journeys in life, figure out who we are and help the person beside you.  Figure out how they can do that themselves. Well, let's go get into that a bit. So, I believe you're my 44? 43. 43. All the records, everything that you've been through, all the physical feats, and now we're on a new chapter of the book. Of course, you're now, you could probably say that you're the new it guy on the internet. Everyone wants that. We were a thrill when you wanted to come on the show and everyone wants some of your time.  And so we're in this new world and these new feats for yourself. So if you'd like to talk about what brought you to write the book and to go in this direction now at this time. Well, as you know, I'm a serious introvert and very afraid of people. I got judged so much growing up that this is uncomfortable for me. All these podcasts, that's why I post once a week.   And they're just nasty people. So I stay away from them. But the one thing I realized why I wrote the book is honestly, I have a story to tell as we all have a story to tell. And what I realized on my journey was a lot of us don't believe that we can achieve the impossible.   But along this way, I wasn't like I said, I wasn't a theorist, I became a practitioner. And I was like, my God, I'm busting down so many barriers of like I've learned disability, okay? But I'm catching up with everybody. I figured that out. I figured out all these negative things in my life that were keeping me in this hole.  You don't need great parents. You don't need like a private school.  What you need is the one thing I talked about in my book, which is straight up brutal work ethic. You have to be willing to outwork everybody in the world. And that's the hard part. That's the hard part.  Nah, I'm basically teaching you how to callous over your victim's mentality. I'm teaching you how to, like I did 67,000 pull-ups and training for the pull-up record. I was seriously callous in my hands to protect them. What I'm trying to do with people is teach them how to find more of themselves to where they empower themselves. I'm all about the underdog. So that's what the book's all about, man. It's all about having that step process and I had to share this with people. Well, I also feel, and personally struggling with social anxiety and introversion myself, the hardest part of all of it is being vulnerable enough to admit the abuse, submit the past. Most of us don't want other people to know that and that's the hardest part to open up and be that vulnerable. When did that start to bubble to the surface for you and you start to see vulnerability as a strength?  That was the biggest thing. I had to stop caring what people thought about me.  That's the one thing I realized.  Everybody was better than me.   That's all they've done.    I know that about people. So if you wanna sit back and judge how jacked up I was and how messed up my life was, Merry Christmas, go for it, have a good time. But I'm smiling at you right now, knowing you have a secret that you're not willing to share.  And that is a lot of power in that to be able to put your life on a billboard for the whole world to see and say, judge it, man. Judge it. Like just me talking about it makes me feel good. And that's another thing about it.  It just starts to come off. That's why I do it so often. I'm like, hey, man, I'll tell you anything you wanna know. I'm tired of being afraid.  I'm tired of lying about how good I'm not, you know? And in prepping for this interview, I was hanging out with my girlfriend Amy listening to part of the Joe Rogan episode. And what was so remarkable to both of us is most people who get into the motivational coaching space, they just wanna celebrate their victories and show how awesome and amazing they are and paint themselves as the best. And you unabashedly admit that you're not the best long distance runner. I'm not the best guy at pull-ups, but I'm gonna push myself beyond what I deem is the best. And through that process, come out the other side and earn everyone's respect. The motivation when people are losing, all these people who come out here and talk about how great they are, and I see it all the time, makes me sick, man. Get real with yourself. People cannot relate to you, man. You are un-fucking-relatable. When you come out here and say, hey, man, I'm the baddest motherfucker to ever live. Okay, great. Well, what am I gonna learn from you? You learn from people who are willing to tell you, this is where I started from.  This is how bad I used to really be. I still have those moments, because why you're human? We're all jacked up, man. We're all jacked up. And that's what makes my story relatable. I'm willing to let you in to see I'm decently successful now, but I didn't come out like this, man. I didn't come out, that's the story, is you have to give people just a little bit of hope. There's no hope when they see greatness in you everywhere. You have to be able to get yourself down to a level of check it out, man. There's hope for you. That's what I'm trying to give you, just a little bit. And obviously the pain you went through, the suffering and these feats of physical strength, this idea that the body can always heal and the mind can always heal. These calluses can be built.  That's right. Your mind is healed. That's right.  Right. What was the physical healing process like after that first real physical bout for you where you went through, whether it was Hell Week, I don't know what on the scale of what you've done to this point, going through the list? Well, I thought it was my third Hell Week that I went through. When I got through with that first 100 mile race that I did around that one mile track that I didn't even prepare for it, I was considerably, it was horrible. And I'll never forget, I found such peace and beauty.  And I got done and my wife pulled the car up on the, my ex-wife pulled the car up on this little lawn and I got in the back of it and I got up the stairs. I'm not gonna go through the whole story, but I remember laying in the tub and she put the shower on me and I ran 101 miles in like 19 hours. And I was like peeing dirt out of me. And I'm sitting there and I'm jackhammering and my body is just the most broken it's ever been even to this day. And this feeling came over me. Call it crazy if you want, but very few people I guarantee you've ever felt this before to push themselves so far outside of what they thought was even possible, even for me. I laid in that tub and I didn't want it to go away. I had drained myself of every bit of strength, energy I had and it was the best feeling I had in my life. All that pain, it was confirmation. It was confirmation that I had gone through a crucible and I had figured out another level of David Goggins, a level that I thought was humanly impossible for anybody to do.  And I was able to go 31 more miles. In that process of the next 31 more miles, I found out more about myself in that 31 miles than I ever have in my entire life.  Like, but I was able to figure out different tactics. And when I finally got done with that and I laid in that tub and it was over, the feeling of my God, man, you just really discovered a whole new world, a whole new part of the brain that guaranteed very few people have. So it's a feeling I can't even describe.  You chose a different path to self-publish. Well, on that thing right there it didn't do much for me. So the book Living with the Seal, my name wasn't in it and I didn't even know really, I knew it was being written but I had nothing to do with the book. So all that came to me much later, but yeah. Yeah, that's how you appeared on the map once you figured out that you were the seal and people wanted to hear your story. Obviously everything you do is well thought out. There's a plan in place, there's a strategy behind it. You've now chose the path to self-publish this book. We got a copy of the manuscript we've been digging in enjoying the backstory that we haven't heard on some of these other shows because everyone wants to talk about the physical side of things.  Well, I sat back and I had the top five people come at me, top five publishing houses and they're down to the last two and they're offering $300,000. I'm a first time, first time author and I decided to go with one of them and $300,000 for a guy at me. I'm sitting back, you know, that's pretty good money. So a few days before I was going to sign the contract, I sat back, talked to my fiance, my family and everybody's like, you know, hey, this is good, this is great, whatever. But I started thinking about my life. I started thinking about everything that I've gone through in my life. Everything I had gone through and had a chance to reflect and that's one thing I never did in my life long enough is have time to reflect. I was always, what's next, what's next, what's next, what's next, what's next. Now that I'm retired and you have a lot of time to look back on what you've done, where you started, where you're at now and I said, you know what, it's just not for sale. $300,000 isn't even a fraction of enough money to sell this, so I decided not to sign it and I self-published, I pissed a lot of people off. I paid. And I said, I'm not signing this, I'm gonna self-publish and that's kind of how it came to be.  I wrote this book and that's honest to God's truth. I am fine with the trophy I have in my mind. And who is this book for? Who listening is gonna be the most impacted by this book? I'm all about, it's not about the underdog so much. I think we're all an underdog. I think the top CEO on the planet Earth still has that doubt.  Colby Bryant, Michael Jordan, the best on the planet. We're all underdogs. Whether you're an underdog because you put yourself there to be hungry or you're just a real-life underdog. We're all an underdog. And so this is about the mind and people discovering the mind, their own mind. And one thing I know is we all have an equation. We all have an equation like, I'll talk about 3.14 is pi. There's different equations to figure out different kind of mathematical problems. We as human beings are mathematical problems.  That's why my book, even though it's one book is tailored to the individual.   My equation is different than your equation. What's gonna make you tick?   It's okay. That's what this book does. It helps you figure out your 3.14.  You got it figured out. So in coming out of here, which you have a big publicity run, the book's coming out.  Thank you for coming on ours. With that comes a lot of new things. It's for such a no-nonsense guy you have to deal with social media now. And I was having a vision of you having to deal with it. We talk about it's detriment and how it is just nonsense and noise, but of course, you wanna reach as many people as you can with this book and everything that's going on. So I was kinda curious of dealing with social media. I know that you're on it. We were talking about this earlier. Do you have a discipline that's like, okay, well for two hours every night, I guess I'll get on deal with this stupid thing and talk to these people who have reached out or what is your approach to that? Well, my approach is every Monday, you're gonna get one post from me a week. And I take about maybe an hour to hour and a half after, so I'll post it, I'll do it, and then I get away from it. I'm gone. Here's your post. And I make sure that every single post is not about me.    This is about you figuring out, your self-talk has to change.    So let's you look at it after about an hour or two, I'll come back and start answering a few of these questions. Some people say, hey, how you do this? How you do that? Maybe an hour and a half, two hours I'll answer it. And I'm done. I'm off, because why? I'm still, I'm still chipping away at David Goggins every single day. If I spend so much time being occupied by that, I cannot chip away at what's important. What's important is I'm still figuring out this different things. Yeah, I got the equation figured out, but now the real journey has begun. So I'm still chipping away at life. And Johnny and I have started to really throw ourselves into the training for the race and really pushing ourselves physically for a large chunk of my life. The physical was not that important. Right. It was average at everything, not really concerned about hitting the gym, certainly didn't care about what other people thought about the way that I looked physically, because I was average. I've now come out the other side and we talk about this all the time, you know, that Adorphan rush after completing the run. That feeling you get after crushing your PR in the gym, pushing yourself beyond that mental governor that we all have. What are your thoughts on people who are unsure about their own physical strength? Do you feel that everyone should push themselves physically and that's a really important part of making you who you were? I think pushing yourself physically is the number one factor of life. That is the true spot where you can really dive deep into life's about self-discipline, is about self-discipline. We tend to do the things that are easy. And that is, it builds no mental toughness. It builds no mental hardening. It builds nothing. When you work out, working out is where you can build that the fastest. Because it's a constant, it gives you instant feedback. Instant, yeah, you may not lose the weight you want to real fast, but the discipline it takes, it transfers over to all aspects of your life. It's not people, man, why are you always working out? Stop, stop looking at that way. This is the foundation of life. When you look in the mirror, every morning we all look in the mirror to get ready to go to work, to go anywhere. The first thing you see is your reflection. If you don't like what you see in the morning, you lost the war already. It's not about even liking what you see. It's about looking in the mirror and you may start, man, I feel different. That reflection maybe not, that reflection's not everything. It's a feeling you're supposed to get.  In your house, you have some control. And that reflection in that mirror, you have to control that reflection in the mirror. That's how you start your day. If you leave your house feeling like, okay, I can fight, I've established the mentality to fight. And all that comes from working out. It's not just from, you can't find that in the office. And what we've discovered and chatted about on the show with a lot of our guests is morning and nighttime rituals to prepare yourself mentally for the day, for that war outside the door. Obviously you're controlling your environment in the morning and same with night. I think, especially when it comes to feats of strength and physical ability, you gotta recharge, you gotta recover. So how you wind down at night and getting a full night's rest scientifically has proven to change everything, physically, mentally, emotionally. What are those habits you built up around your morning and nighttime routine? Well, my morning routine is every day I get up and run. Every single day. Because why, I hate that the most. So that is where I- You share that feeling. Yes, I hate that the most.   You've overcome yourself already. So now you're ready to battle. I go to the gym about four times a week. But my biggest thing I do is my nighttime routine. I stretch out anywhere from two to four hours every night for the last five, it used to be a lot longer than that. And I talked about in my book why I started doing this thing. But I had, through my whole life, as you see, I was using my fight or flight muscle. I was under severe stress as a child, growing up, my job, whatever. A lot of stress. Just sitting down right now, Raj using our psoas muscle, your hip flexor muscle. And I give you a two second on that. That muscle attaches to your T12. And about five or six years ago, I got really, really sick. Doctors would give me all kinds of hormones. Take this, take this, take this. And it's in the book real good, so I won't go deep into it now. But I laid it back and I literally said, you know what, I'm dying. The doctors can't figure out what's wrong with me. My blood tests were coming back fine. I just said, I can't even run a block. I went from running 205 miles, I came running a block. I made my bed, sitting there. And I started realizing I had these humongous knots on my hip flexors and back in my head. And I said, I'm just done. So I started slowly stretching out. I couldn't do anything. Over a period of a couple of years, I got off this medication, that medication. I was on like 15, I was on several medications. Now I'm on one. And honestly, what I believe, no doctor has said, this is what happened to you. I was literally so tight, I was cutting off blood supply in different places in my organs. The more it opened up my body. So now I went from running 830 mile on a training run to now running a 715 to 7 minute mile on a training run. At the same heart rate. And it's not because I'm trained any different. It's just because my body, my body's opened up. It's a lot more blood flow.  Like I couldn't sit in this chair for this long. I was like, I could get out of here, man. Maybe I go. It's totally changed my whole perspective of life. It's changed everything. So stretching out, yoga, all those things has put me in a whole different state of mind. And I'm the healthiest I've been in my entire life, mentally and physically. With everything that you've accomplished and you still have a lifetime to go. Right. Is there something that you want to be known for? The one thing that you want to stand out through all of these accomplishments and be remembered for? Honestly, I honestly want to be considered one of the hardest men to walk the planet earth in the history of the world. And what I mean by hard, I'm not talking about the guy who just the most pull ups, the most sit ups runs the most. Just a person who's able to overcome any adversity in front of them to figure out a way. Hardness isn't about all this physical shit, man. Yeah, it helped me get to where I'm at. But all I was doing in the whole process, the process wanted to be ripped.  That wasn't it. I knew through the physical challenges, through the physical suffering, my mind was getting stronger. I was literally doing that for a reason. I had a weak mind. All the rest has happened to come with it. I was trying to strengthen the mind to handle all the judgment that's passed on me, perceived and not. Sometimes you make it up in your own head. You know, I just want to be able to handle all of that. Everything, physical, mental. I want to be perceived as that. Like an old school barbarian, old school guy that's like, God, man, nothing can hurt the guy, which is why the book is titled, can't hurt me. I want people to have that mantra in their life. Take that with you. Take it.  And if you believe that and you work towards that, callus in your mind, strengthen yourself, can't hurt me as strong.  I'd be the first one to get them to say, can't hurt me, motherfucker.  But you say that enough to you.  What's the next big challenge for you? What's the next thing you're tackling? Honestly, the next big challenge right now is what I'm doing right now. Like, when I was in sixth grade, I started real bad, severely bad. Fifth, sixth grade, fourth grade, horrible.  So, me talking about myself as much as I am on stage, on a podcast, I'm still overcoming, you're still battling, because it's comfortable for me to say, I'm off a soda meeting and don't talk to me, I'm good. Go back to being my hermit. This is very uncomfortable. So I'm constantly coming outside my comfort zones and doing this stuff. Now sharing my story with people as much as I can. And do you do any coaching of clients in terms of physical or mental, obviously motivational speaking, opens up these opportunities to take on one-on-one or group coaching clients? So I do take on clients, but a select few. Cause what I realized is, I'm not a cookie cutter type of guy. I'm not here to take your money. I don't, you know, I'm here to help you. If you're coming in to work with a guy like me, who knows that you have to have thick skin to get better. You have to call yourself out.    And a lot of people don't want to go there. They don't want to talk about the childhood. They don't want to talk about their path. They don't want to get to the root of the problems. And then they go, why am I not getting better?  You know, people go to the gym, like for instance, going through any kind of special operations school.  But the only thing they're doing is they're coding over the mind. All you're doing is building a bigger, stronger quitter.   What's wrong? Your mind is still soft. So I work on the mind. What's the application process like to work with you? Well, speaking.  Speaking on, on that application process. So, you know, Jesse's been out there in his book and we know from his perspective of seeing you and him thinking of how, and he could give it his story of how you guys met and what he was thinking when he had saw you. But we don't know your side of it of what Jesse coming up to you and talk to you and asking, I don't even know if that was the plan at first, but what you must have been thinking with this, this crazy guy who's out there with the circus running around in this ring. Yes, Sue. The chair and the trainers.  This is a lifestyle. You can't temporarily dive into it, sprinkle it around, sample it out and roll out. This is something, man, that you have to acquire as a part of your everyday grind. But when Jesse came up to me after this race, I was, so like back then I was very like, don't talk to me, mother fucker type of person. It was very weird, you know? Cause my life, especially then, I didn't know any soft. And I looked at everything in his life as very like, you can't get hard, man. It's impossible. Why? Because you have your refrigerator in your mind. It's so full. You've arrived.  Now we're gonna figure out. So imagine that guy who has, you know, maids, drivers, masseuses, chefs.  It was very, it's tough. Yeah.  And see, it's hard for me, and this is no cut on anybody. I had to mature a lot. Not everybody's David Goggins. It's hard for me to respect people who are able to come in to that world and leave. Sure.  And people wonder, why am I not achieving more?  And we wonder, why don't I have drive anymore? Where's it all at?  Yeah.  If you live in your victories for so long and say, I'm gonna go challenge myself for 30 days or for two weeks or run this one marathon, and it ends, I did one marathon, okay? That's why it leaves you. It leaves you because you haven't set up the next obstacle. Obstacles is how you grow. You must continue to have friction. Friction is where growth is at. With no friction, there's no growth. I love that. No growth. So where can we find the book? Where can we pick up a copy and apply for this coaching? Those listeners, do you feel they have it in them? Well, everything with Can't Hurt Me the book, the audio, everything for Can't Hurt Me is on Amazon. So you go to Amazon, it's just a book about the mind, better than yourself, finding that 3.14, finding your percentage, finding your equation. And removing the theory. Removing the theory. And bringing it into practice. Theory, we cannot listen to theorists. So what theorists do is they take a hundred people and they study the normal people of the world. They're all studies. There's a whole bunch of people outside the normal that haven't done studies on. They haven't done studies on the people who are seriously great, who are seriously great. They take studies off of normal people. You cannot live in that normal mindset. You must be your best on your worst days. And how you do that is you cannot think of a normal mindset. You cannot have a normal mindset. I love it. Thank you. Thank you very much. It's been a fantastic conversation. I appreciate you taking on this challenge because sharing this stuff and this viewpoint, right? It's easy to get the trophies these days. It's easy to be coddled.  And that message, we're happy to spread and it has impacted both of us. It's why we took on the challenges that we continue to take on half marathon. We're gonna shoot for marathon next and let's keep moving because what else is there to do in life? That's it, man. There's nothing else to do. Life is one big head game. It's one big mind game. And it's only one person playing it yourself. So you gotta learn to win the mind game. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Fantastic.


This study investigated the effectiveness of a manual metal arc process for obtaining coatings with improved abrasion resistance. The coatings had a hyper-utectic microstructure consisting of austenite, NBC, and M7C3 carbides, which were 91 nanometers in size and accounted for 5.3 percent of the total volume. These coatings exhibited low mass loss during abrasion testing, likely due to their high hardness value of 1029HV200G, 15 SEG. Microfracturing and detaching of carbides from the matrix were identified as the primary wear mechanisms. This article was authored by Franklin Paz Trivano, Robison Buitragosiera, and Juan Felipe Santamarine.


Hello, welcome to the Prosperity Alchemist channel. I am David Wong and in this video I will talk about how to become force sensitive just like in Star Wars How to become one with the force how to feel the force how to use the force in the shop We're gonna talk about that in this video. So stay tuned So before we can learn how to become force sensitive We have to understand what is the force in first place. So according to Obi-Wan Kenobi from Star Wars He says it's an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us It penetrates us and it binds everything together or binds the galaxy together So that's what he says in Star Wars, but you know what the force is not limited to just science fiction so Nikola Tesla he said that if you want to find the secrets of the universe think in terms of energy Frequency and vibration Now that's Nikola Tesla, but let's take a look at some ancient religions For example Christianity in the Bible says that in the beginning was the word And we translate what the word means it is the word logos and logos literally means Frequency or vibration So that's from the Bible and if you study some other religions such as Buddhism Hinduism you have a concept of Prana and you have the concept of the universal field and in Chinese culture and traditions we have the concept of Chi and Even Taoist and Zen they all talk about the same thing. So we have different religions from different times even different different Beliefs all talking about the same thing talking about the universal field now there's been a lot of research and development in the quantum physics area to explain how the world works with Particle accelerators and particle colliders and from that research we found that most of us is just empty space So you think that existence is made up of something hard You have you have rocks that are hard you have metal that's hard your bodies that are physical but actually most of reality is just empty space and most of it is just particles spinning around each other and in just a Calculation and equations of probability of Waveforms, so what is that? That's also a frequency So you come to think about it the world as we know it the life that we experience the reality that we perceive It's just all frequency Your body is a frequency health or disease is The frequency Your mind your brain operates with brain waves, which are also frequencies and So think about it pretty much everything we know in existence is frequency and vibration Electromagnetism is frequency and Whole even the visible light that we see is frequency. So The more that we look into it the more that we research we find that the world is just a Big symphony of frequencies okay, so Now they understand what this force is Now you can start to realize and be more aware of it How can you be more aware with it? Well start to be more aware about what frequencies you are allowing to Fetch you and what frequencies you are projecting out So if you think in terms of that Start thinking about how your body is An instrument think of it as an instrument just like a guitar or piano when you pluck the strings of That instrument it will vibrate and it will create a sound wave that projects out So in the same way our bodies are like instruments Instead of having strings that we pluck we have our nervous system Which are also like strings if you think about it because they extend throughout our whole body And if you line up all our nerves from end to end it will go around the whole planet That's how many of these nervous these nerves are in your body So think of your nerves as strings of your instrument of your instrumental body How can you tune your nerves so that they vibrate at different frequencies? So with that being said you're probably asking well if there's so much force around us If it really exists and how come I can't feel the force how come I can't see the force I can't experience it What a problem is that imagine that all the strings on the guitar are made of rock Made out of something that doesn't move. Well, how can you vibrate that you can't vibrate it if it is all solid It's stiff and stuck So the first thing you need to do is to start to tune your nervous system Start to tune your nerves themselves and your brain waves The entire nervous system includes your brain and your brainstem and all your organs and all the nerves too So in order to tune them and soften them and make them more pliable so that they can actually vibrate That's the first part is you cannot play a guitar with strings made of rocks You need to play a guard or you know, you need to play an instrument where the strings can actually be plucked and actually can vibrate So first is to be able to vibrate those things In your body be able to vibrate in your nervous system And there's a lot of exercises you can do for example the meditation in Qigong and in exercise Even to a certain point But it has to be a combination of training of your mind and your body at the same time And that's why martial arts is a very good way of tuning your nervous system You need to combine your breathing your intentions in your mind your body what you're doing in your body and and Do that over a long period of time and you'll be able to start to loosen up and relax Those parts of your nervous system to allow you to be able to start to feel their vibrations Because with a loose more looser more relaxed nervous system a looser string will be able to also receive vibrations as well as Resonate vibrations that brings us back to the analogy of the tuning forks again. So if you ring one fork Okay You ring one of these forks. You can feel the other fork vibrating here Because it's getting closer and because the sound waves from this fork is actually affecting the sound waves or this for so the same thing happens with your nervous system is that if you are Loosening up your nervous system relaxing it and tuning it then you become more Sensitive to vibrations and frequencies that are all around you all the time And at the same time you'd be able to manipulate those frequencies and vibrations in yourself So that they will project out Whatever you want. So I'm going to explain that in the prosperity pyramid how you develop that life force I call that life force because that is the source and that is the foundation or Building your life force being able to have a nervous system With your mind your nerves and your body and organs that allow you to project out and also receive and It takes a lot of training. I've been doing Qigong for many years. I've been meditating for many many years In order to be able to become sensitive But once you get to that point then your whole world just opens up you'll be able to experience so many more things and Recently I discovered and been developing technology that will help anyone be able to speed up and shortcut that process of being able to become more force sensitive just with some technology that I've discovered of something that combines frequency vibration and Yeah, based on that so it's very exciting We want to learn more about that just come to my webinar and we're going to share with you how that technology works All right, so if you like this video make sure you comment like and subscribe to this channel But you get all the new discoveries and new lessons are coming up all the time and make sure that you share with your friends So until next time I'm the prosperity alchemist David Wong. So use the force and prosper


Hi, everyone. This is Strategic and Tactical Roadmaps for Product School, and I'm your host today. My name is Alexandra Milton. I've been working as a product manager for six years, and I came to product management for marketing and telecom tech. My experience in product spans from aspiring startups like AdSperd to well-established big tech companies like Yelp, where I work right now. I've been lucky to learn product processes from industry leaders, as well as to form them myself. My passion is to build new products from scratch, especially when it comes to creating value and solving real-life problems with machine learning and artificial intelligence. Today we will talk about product roadmaps. I will start by sharing why I think you should consider listening to this webinar before or even instead of looking for product roadmaps templates online. Then we will put on our product manager heads and look at roadmaps as if they were our products. We will discuss who needs product roadmaps, what they need from them, and why I think you might need more than one roadmap to be successful. I'll try to make this part practically useful by showing you some examples. Now let's dive in. First of all, why do I want to talk about roadmaps and why should you listen? If you've been in product for a while, you probably feel that you know all about roadmaps and also have a strong opinion on the matter. If you're new to product, you'll catch up quickly with all the information available online.  And do you think, wait, is this what a roadmap looks like? Was I doing it wrong all the way? I don't know about you, but I'm no stranger to impose the syndrome. And it's no surprise that happens because this is a roadmap by InVision. And this is also a roadmap by AHA. They're quite different, aren't they? And not only in fonts and colors. Doesn't mean that one of them solves the problem better than the other, or do they perhaps solve two different problems? Well, here is the roadmap definition by product plan. A roadmap is a strategic plan that defines a goal or desired outcome and includes the major steps or milestones needed to reach it. It also serves as a communication tool, a high-level document that helps articulate strategic thinking, the why, behind both the goal and the plan for getting there. The definition highlights two distinctly different goals on degree, reaching the outcome and communication. We can also say that it targets different audience, the teams implementing the plan, including you, the product manager, and your stakeholders. This reflects the dual nature of the product manager's job, strategic planning and stakeholder management and communications on one side, execution and delivery on the other. This is how I came to believe that when it comes to roadmaps, one size simply doesn't fit all audiences and purposes. Since then, I was created two different roadmaps, one strategic, one tactical, or to put it otherwise one external and one internal. We start from high-level strategic roadmap that expresses your product vision and helps you sell it. This is an external roadmap. You can show it to anyone and everyone within your non-disclosure agreement. Don't forget to present it to your team. Everyone likes to work towards a big and shiny goal. However, you're not building it for everyone. You're serving the pains and interests of very specific groups of people. Let's list them and the questions they might have for you. Let's start from executive management that probably wonders, what is that you're building? Do you have a plan? Are things under control? Do you know how to monetize it? Does it make sense? Is it realistic? And is it aligned with the company's mission and overall strategy? Then come key customers and partners that want to know, what am I going to get from my money now and in the future? How do you compare it to competition? When can I expect the capability I need? How should I adjust my own strategy if I use your tool? Marketing, your friend and support probably wants to know, what are the milestones and key messages for my marketing and communication strategy? Do I have any valuable knowledge that will help to validate and polish the product strategy? Finally, there are investors. Here is, am I getting returns from my investments? One approximately, does it look profitable in the long term? Now these pain points help us flesh out the principles of strategic road mapping. Your stakeholders tend to and definitely should see the features from the perspective of customer value. In the strategic road map, make sure to emphasize the value over the functionality that enables it. The purpose of this document is to obtain approval for the outcome of the product strategy. It is important to convince the stakeholders that you're building a good product and identify any misalignments and misunderstandings. That's why it's vital to guide the stakeholders through the thinking process and show them why this product idea is so brilliant. Remember that every milestone that appears on the external road map turns into a commitment, so be defensive and generous in your estimations or consider dropping the timeline altogether. Once the direction is set, getting from point A to point B is a tactical plan and largely a responsibility of the product team. In most of the companies, there is no need to concern your stakeholders with complex technical implementation details. Instead, use major milestones to reassure your audience that they won't be kept in the dark and you will provide them with regular clear and consistent progress updates. Our goal here is to gain the trust of the stakeholders so that they collaborate with you on the vision and judge your success by results. Everything that happens in between is your personal magic. Working on strategic road map is also a great opportunity to shape and polish your actual product strategy. This is not the topic of today's webinar, but here's a quick overview of principles that help me frame my product strategy. First of all, strategy before tactics. Figure out your strategy before planning your tactics and tools. Strategy is a high-level plan for how you will achieve your objectives which requires knowing your audience and the value you want to offer them. Think of a strategy as the big picture of what you want to accomplish. Then we don't deliver value once, we deliver value incrementally. Each element of the strategic road map should express what value is being added to the product. Finally, the elements should be prioritized according to the value and the effort required to develop them. Now that we know what we want to achieve, it will be easy to choose the right format. We are looking for a way to emphasize the value and resist the temptation to go into details of the execution master plan. Also, visual aesthetics goes a long way towards making a good impression. So here we go. Make your road map look sleek and beautiful. Pay attention to the phones, colors, and consistent styling. Gladly, there is an abundance of tools that can solve this for you unless you want to flex your design muscles. Choose free design tools, over rigid templates, content the skin here, and it's unique to your product. Don't fall into the trap of tailoring your road map to a template. Finally, tell the story. Draw a big picture, not a schedule. Consider replacing the actual timeline with fuzzy terms like current, near term, and future, or use large time intervals like quarters. But here's an example of such a strategic road map built using Miro. You can see quarters and columns and the value delivered by different teams. Alternatively, you can drop the timeline altogether and use horizontal axis to display an ordered list of large customer value slices like this. This is a theme-based road map. Okay, this is delivery time. We go on stage our main implementation facilitator, the tactical or internal road map. Let's repeat our problem-defining exercise and outline the audiences and their key questions that can be answered with this tool. And let's start with our key customer, you. That's right. The main stakeholder for the tactical road map, just as for the delivery in general, is a product manager. The teams execute on the PM's tasks and submit them for your review and approval. This doesn't mean that for the delivery time, you can kick back and open a beer. As product managers, we prepare user stories, acceptance criteria, spring goals, epics, and anything else that helps the teams deliver value. We also track and coordinate the progress towards the milestones. And the tactical road map is a tool for that. It's just as instrumental to the overall success as the strategic one, because product managers are ultimately responsible for the product results.  Okay, it's not only for you. Depending on how product management and technology departments are structuring your company, the tactical road map can have other stakeholders. All of them would be directly involved in managing product delivery. Let's make a list of audiences and questions. First comes your engineering partner, your engineering manager, the manager of the product team. The questions would be, do we have the right qualification for those tasks? Should we hire more people or help some team members develop necessary expertise? How to make sure that the work is distributed fairly in the team? How to plan for absences? How can the new direct management in product and technology probably wonders? How can I track progress? When is my help and feedback needed and how to make sure that the different teams are aligned? Then of course you care about PMs and EMs of other teams. How do we align the team's efforts and benefit from each other's progress? How do we surface dependencies and avoid blocks and bottlenecks? Finally, how do we avoid work duplication? Then of course come the wrong questions. And that's not an exhaustive list, that might be a long one. Of course you will ask something like, is my team on track? What are the risks? What is likely to cause delays? How can I plan for an electronic route? Where are my tickets needed now and where later? How the expertise of the team and availability of the team will affect my timeline? What can I do about it, if anything? How do I integrate efforts, estimations and uncertainties into my prioritization? How do I align with other teams? Take advantage of their work and avoid the work duplication? How do I surface dependencies? How and when should I adjust my communications and manage stakeholder expectations? And when's the right time to validate the MVPs, collect feedback, analyze data and adjust all through our maps, including the strategic map. Now that the list of the audiences and the panes, let's summarize what the tactical road map should be. In value versus functionality, we need both. I usually use value increments to group the features. They are the milestones and they serve to align strategic and tactical road maps. However, it's the functionality that you need to release for the milestones. The tactical road map is the visual actionable plan of the how, he features and implementation steps. Naturally, tactical road map units are much more granular than those of the strategic road map. The why, as interesting as it is, simply won't fit the scale and should be communicated by other documents. Now time estimates. Take your average team velocity, a calendar with public holidays and paid vacations and a deck of tarot cards. And produce your very best and most honest time estimate. You need to be realistic in order to identify dependencies and overlaps between the teams. Eliminate bottlenecks, avoid jamming and manage stakeholders' expectations in a timely manner. As said before, the tactical road map is your tool and you perhaps with your engineer manager, decide what format you take. I'll just share what works for me and what key features I find beneficial. For the strategic road map, we talked about using horizontal blocks for themes and cells for actual road map units, for value increments. You can use a similar approach for the tactical road map and use cells for features. However, I prefer to swap the rows and the cells. In this example, the features are grouped by value increments and each feature takes a separate row. You can read this road map in different ways. From top to bottom, you see the ordered list of tasks. From left to right, the time and resources needed to deliver them. I also like to group the rows so that you can collapse them and basically zoom out and get a better overview. The tactical road map is like a table of contents for sprints and user stories for months to come. It informs both the content of the tickets and their order, the optimal granularity of the road map units and their mapping to epics and stories can vary from team to team. What's important is that one look at the road map should tell you what the next big thing is. There is an opinion that the time-bound feature plan contradicts the Agile methodology and limits the team's maneuverability because that's not really true. Agile doesn't have anything against planning. However, it does require regular reviews and adjustments of the plan based on the new data. The trick is to be able to change the plan that is already in action without wasting the work already done. This can be achieved by delivering value in small incremental slices. And nothing serves this goal better than the tactical road map. It visualizes the value slices, their building blocks and the resources required. You can easily add, remove, replace or reprioritize the features while keeping the resources constant and simply reallocating them from one task to another. It helps you see what you gain and what you lose in time and resources if you proceed with your changes in full compliance with the job principles. A good tactical road map should surface interdependent blocks of functionality. Ideally, it should help you discover the problem and figure out how to minimize the dependencies together with your team. If it cannot be done, you'll be able to anticipate the bottlenecks and prioritize the tasks in order to avoid them. Cal according of resources is handy when you work with cross-functional teams. And a final note, technical debt exists and it affects the timeline and overall capacity. The tactical road map should surface it. I like to use this opportunity to empower the team and ask them to explain the value of the technical tasks and infrastructure work to me. If I can then include it in the road map in a way that's both correct and easy to understand, the team has done well. Let's summarize what we've discussed today. A road map is just another product you build and it's tailored to the needs of the audiences. One size doesn't fit all here. A road map for your stakeholders communicates your product strategy and gives you a great opportunity to polish all the vice and the ones. A road map for you and your team drives execution and helps you deliver the product on time. That's all I wanted to share today. Thank you for being with me here and happy road mapping.


Live from London, England, it's theCUBE, covering .NEXT Conference Europe 2018. Brought to you by Nutanix. Welcome back to theCUBE's coverage of Nutanix, .NEXT 2018. Here in London, England, we're going to be talking about developers in this segment. I'm Stu Min and my co-host is you, Piscar, and happy to welcome to the program two first-time guests. Bala Kutibotla is the general manager of Nutanix Era, and sitting next to him is Greg Muscarella, who recently joined Nutanix as the vice president of products at Nutanix. Both of you have been up on stage. Greg was talking about Carbon and CloudNative, and of course, Era is the database as a service. Gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us. Thank you. Good to be here. All right, so look, developers. We were thinking back, I love the old meme, developers, developers, developers. Balmer had it right, his style might not have been there. Microsoft, company that does quite well with developers. My background is in the enterprise space. I'm an infrastructure guy that goes to cloud, and the struggle I've had a little bit is developers really work from the application down. It's like, that's where they live, and as an infrastructure guy, it's a little uncomfortable for me. So maybe to set that stage, because I look at Nutanix and its core, infrastructure's a big piece of it, but in its distributed architectures, it's built from the architecture from really the hyperscale type of environments. So help connect the dots as to where Nutanix plays with the developers, and then we'll get into your products and everything else after. Balmer, you want to start? Cool, okay. So as you know, Nutanix is definitely addressing the IT ops market. We kind of simplified storage, compute, networking, and build the infrastructure as a service. Obviously, if you look at the private cloud, the IT operators are becoming the cloud operators, and then giving them to the developers. We are basically trying to build a cloud for IT operators so that they can present their cloud to the developer. Now that we have this infrastructure pretty much there for Quartz and Tom, we're now expanding the services to other things, the platform as a service, now going back to the developer community, you will have the same kind of cloud-like consumption that these cloud operators, the IT operators are providing the cloud to you. You as developers get the same kind of public cloud consumption like ability, that the way that you are trying to do EC2s, AWS, and S3s and kind of stuff, EBS, you have the same kind of APIs for on Nutanix that you can spin off a VM, spin off a database, spin off a storage, and then do what you want to do, kind of stuff. So that's a natural journey for us, kind of stuff. Yeah, I have to agree. Look, the world has changed quite a bit for developers and it's gotten a lot better. If you look at the tooling and what you can now do on your laptop and spinning up, it would be a pretty complex environment from a three-tier application with a robust database, an app tier, and anything else you might have on the storage side. Spin it up, break it down, and with your CI-CD pipeline, you can have it deployed to production pretty rapidly. So what we like it doing is recreating that experience that the cloud has really brought to those developers and having the same type of tooling for those enterprise-grade applications that are going to be deployed on that infrastructure that is needed in private data centers. So looking at one of the reasons why developers love cloud services so much, it's easy for them. They can just consume it, it's very low friction. They don't even really need to go through a purchasing process other than credit card may be paid for themselves in the beginning. So low friction is really the keyword here. So I'm wondering, looking at the Nutanix, the ITOps perspective, how are you kind of bringing that low friction into the developer world? Yeah, so I'll take the question. So essentially what I'm seeing is the world in the enterprise world is very fragmented. People do in silos kind of stuff. As you rightly said, developers really want to be liberated from all this bureaucracy, right? So they really need a service kind of world where they can go click on it, they get their come to kind of stuff. There is a pressure on the ITOps to give that experience, otherwise people will flee to public law, as simple as that, right? So to me, the way I see is the ITOps, DBOps, the traditional DBOps engineering, they are understanding the needs that, hey, we got to be service-ified. We want to provide that kind of service-like interface to our teams who are consuming us kind of stuff. So this software, Nutanix as the enterprise cloud software, lets them create their own private cloud and then give those services to the developers kind of stuff. So it's a natural transition as a company for us. We got to start from the cloud operators. Now we are exposing the cloud services from the cloud operators to the cloud consumers, essentially the developers. Yeah, Greg, up on stage, you talked about cloud native and your premise is that cloud native is a term for a methodology, not necessarily that it's born in the cloud. Maybe help explain that a little bit and we think Nutanix is mostly in data centers today, so why isn't this just saying, no, no, no, we can be cloud native too? Yeah, fair point. And I think we're not alone in that as well in being an enterprise infrastructure company that was looking at enabling cloud native applications, out of cloud native architecture within the private data center. So hey, look, it's really it's a form of doing distributed computing, right? And that's the core to it, right? So you have a stateless ephemeral infrastructure, you're not upgrading things, you're blowing it away and rebuilding it. There's some core things like that that will move across whether it be in the cloud or on-prem. And of course you need tooling for that, right? Because that's not the methodology most enterprise developers or operators have really gone through, right? So everything's pets, not much cattle. And we're really trying to change that quite a bit and that's both enabling technology but it's also the practices that people will deploy. And we're actually seeing is it's not so much us trying to sell this, it's more like, hey, we're used to this in the cloud, why can't we do this on-prem in our private data center where we have all of our data and the other services that we need to interact with, like that's where the demand's really coming from. So it's that massive data they want to interact with with the type of architecture that they've gotten used to for rapid development and deployment. So one of the things, so you mentioned pets versus cattle, one of the things I've been seeing from an IT ops perspective is, you need a good ecosystem of management products around your pets or your cattle to be able to make it cattle, right? If you don't have the tooling, you're going to do manual interaction and it's going to become pets. So I'm wondering in that cloud native space, how are you helping the IT ops to actually make it a cattle experience in terms of management or monitoring or backup, stuff like that. So a lot of that is surrounded around Kubernetes as a center of mass. So it's not just us doing it, it's us pulling in a lot of the support and ecosystem that is being built by the community for that and leveraging that piece. And then we have other things we'll either add on to that as it integrates with our platform and some of the capabilities there or things that we may do, just again, pure open source. Give you a couple examples of that. So I mentioned epoch on stage, right? So it's sort of something that brings additional metrics to Prometheus, right? So in addition to CPU and memory storage consumption, you're actually getting latency and other more business metrics that you might be using to trigger things in Kubernetes like auto-scaling, right? I don't necessarily always scale on CPU or memory, maybe it's a customer experience that's difficult to measure. The other thing is because we have the storage layer underneath, we look at doing things like, again, it's early in Kubernetes but snapshotting from within Kubernetes, right? So if we have a CSI provider, why not from within Kubernetes let an application or a container trigger a snapshot underneath our storage layer, we'll take that snap and then it becomes an object that's available from within Kubernetes. So there's a whole lot of things happening. I just want to add a couple of comments to that. This PetSources candle is standardization, right? Like we're talking about it, right? In typical old legacy enterprises, there are, let's take the example of databases. Like every application team owner has their own databases, they are trying to patch, they are trying to do management around it, kind of stuff. But when we do a couple of surveys, like we looked at around 2,400 databases for a typical company, they have 400 different configurations of the software. It's like this is one of the biggest companies that we're talking about kind of stuff. With that kind of stuff, they cannot manage cloud, obviously. This is not no more a cattle kind of stuff. But how do you bring that kind of standardization, right? That is where the era as a product is actually coming into this. We are trying to standardize, but when you try to standardize this database environment for on-premise enterprise cloud, you have to do it at their terms. What I meant to try to say is, when you try to go for public cloud, you have this catalog 11204 or 12202 or 12102 PSC5, you can only create databases with whatever the software that public cloud guys are doing it, but on-premise needs are slightly different. So that is where Nutanix era and these products will come into. We allow people to create the cloud, and then we allow them to create their own catalog of software that they can standardize. That is what I call standardization at their customer terms. That's what we're trying to do. And let me add to that though. It also brings in this convenience because not only is it coming up with standardized, but we made it even more convenient, right? Because now a developer can go provision their own database, they're going to get a standard configuration for what that is. And so you've made it easier for developers and you're getting something that is more cattle-like. Yeah, Bala, I think you're in a good seat to be able to actually give us a little bit of independent commentary. The movement of databases is one of the hottest topics in the industry. I haven't seen whether Andy Jastee was sparring back with Larry Ellison at a re-invent this week, but we've been watching the growths of things like Postgres and a lot of these changes. Eris sits clearly in that space. So what do you see from customers? The modernization of applications is what I call the long pole in the tenant. It's the toughest thing for me to be able to do. I've said we usually want to first, you modernize your platform, Nutanix helps with that, Public Cloud helps with that, and then I can modernize my application. Database tends to be the stickiest application that we have in the industry. So what are you seeing? Yeah, so there are two classes of applications we see. This is completely greenfield.  People love cloud-like experience and cloud-native databases. That's where the public cloud can kind of try to kind of help them. But if you see 70 to 80% of the money still is with all the traditional apps. You're trying to now cloudify them. The cloud-native stack that we talk about, the cloud-native database is not going to be the game. Like, you really need to think about how do you kind of take this big giant databases that are there with Oracles and DB2s and kind of stuff, but give the cloud-like experience, right? So that will be a very difficult game for any public cloud vendor. That's why you don't see rack provisioning and AWS is still not there, or even if GCP, natively. Oracle does that with little bit difficult. Data gravity forces people to come to on-premises. That's my humble take on this, right? But how do you build, how do you make this gray area, I call this a brown field, and convert them into more of a consumer-centric kind of stuff? That's where ERA actually tries to play it. It has two roles that if you have existing databases, we turn to kind of convert them into more of a cloud-like databases for you. Or if you have a greenfield, then we can get you directly onto the cloud-native experience. Or if you're trying to migrate from one technology to other technology, definitely we would like to help you. These are the three things that we try to do through ERAC. So looking forward, we're starting out with databases, making that simple, making that small, so that there's less friction in that. So maybe a question for Greg. So what's the future for Nutanix in enabling other services, other cloud-like services, on a Nutanix platform going forward? In addition to databases. Exactly. Yeah, so we're a big proponent of standard APIs, as I talked about, right? So we have that in storage for a long time that makes things easy. With databases, we have a standard client talk and a standard database backends. As we see other core building blocks, those are the kind of things that we're going to want to build and deliver as well. So S3 is a de facto standard for object storage, for instance, so people are following that. You look at PubSub with Kafka APIs, Druid. I think there's a whole bunch of things, especially from the Apache project, that have become sort of de facto standards. So really it's like, okay, well which building blocks are needed by developers to build these applications that they want, and so we really work with the community to establish those as open standards. Because we really want, I talked about the portability quite a bit. So we don't want anyone locked into our stack or anyone else's stack. It's like, hey, let's build with the best toolkits, let's use standard open APIs, and then developers get what they need, which is portability, or run the application where they want to run it. So that's our strategy of going forward. To sum it up, we have EC2 equivalent, which is AHV. We have EBS equivalent. We have our called Acropolis Block Services. We have S3 equivalent, which is called Buckets. We have Database, RDS equivalent, we have Era. Now we are going with containers, which we call Carbon. So we are trying to kind of look at those critical services for anyone, especially for developers to say that, man, it's all ecosystem. It's not like one piece, single piece. It's not just compute, it's not just storage, but it's the ecosystem of services that we need to kind of put it. Want to just come back to what we were talking at the beginning, the relationship with developers. How much of what Nutanix does is really kind of the IT ops that then enables developers. How much direct developer engagement is it? Is there development activity here at the conference going on that we should know about? I know that Nutanix goes to a lot of the developer shows, but maybe if you can give us some commentary on that. Yeah, I can start. It's a path, right? So currently, we certainly have the bulk of our interactions are going to be on the IT operation side. And so it's only through them, because their customers are the developers that we really interact primarily today. But you should see that changing quite a bit. And I think that you'll see that with the tools that we're providing directly to developers to interact with through the APIs like they have with ARA. So for instance, if IT is deployed ARA internally, then if I want a database, I can go straight to those APIs or command line to grab those things. You'll see that continuously be a trend as we let developers interact directly with our products. Just to give you the example, within the company, within Nutanix, we are drinking our own champagne. So we are operating a private cloud and we're exposing our APIs to all our developers today if someone wants a database. In Nutanix, they go to a control plane and say, I want a database, right? That's the API. How the infrastructure is getting, it's a means to an end for them, right? So that's how we are going with our customers too. Hey, here is how you build your private cloud. Here is how you expose all your service endpoints for different services. And your developers just need to enjoy them. And then there's a billing aspect of it. That's the nuance that private clouds need to deal with. How do they charge the developers? How do they charge meter and kind of stuff? People will know how to work through that. Yeah, so I definitely heard when I've talked to all the product teams, especially everything in this iCloud, extensibility with APIs is built into everything you're doing. So we're going to have to leave it there. Greg, we're going to be catching up with you and the Nutanix team in two weeks at the KubeCon show in Seattle. So thanks so much for joining us, Bala. Pleasure, thanks for giving us all the update. And thank you, we're going to be back with more coverage here from Nutanix.NEXT 2018. In London, I'm Stu Miniman and you, Piscar, is my co-host, going to be doing a Dutch session in a second. So be sure to stay with that first foreign language interview on the Kube. And thank you for watching.