Oh, hey everybody, hey, hey, hey. Gleb Aleksandrov here and welcome to another very exciting presentation. Today we're going to be talking about 3D Nebulae and the power of the Blender community. So yeah, my name is Gleb. I'm a 3D artist and a Blender YouTuber if there is such thing and together with Adi Burrows we run the Creative Stream blog with tips and tricks about computer graphics, art and coffee brewing and usually we include some kind of a music jingle before our tutorials. So I wanted to recreate this special kind of ambience just for you here. Thanks a lot. Yeah, so why space, why Nebulae? Because space is awesome, of course, but also in 2017 we released Space VFX, the ultimate guide for creating galaxies in Blender and it went pretty well. But one thing that was missing was polymeric clouds and that sort of stuff. Of course, we papered over the cracks and we used various two-dimensional techniques to create an illusion of depth, but in the end it was just an illusion and we've been wanting to play with the same toys as other folks who use proprietary software like massive particle systems with millions and billions of particles, fully volumetric objects that you can fly your camera around, that sort of stuff. And let's say we couldn't do anything like this in Blender. And if you jump back to 2017 with me, you would discover that we can do nothing like that in Blender and traditionally that area of computer graphics was dominated by proprietary software and for good reason. On this pie chart we left just one percent of the Krakatoa-style Nebulae simulations to the open-source software, but unsurprisingly most of the Krakatoa-style simulations and the Krakatoa is the render engine meant for that kind of stuff, was made in Krakatoa. Here you can see amazing art by Tion Vandersalm, Viekoslav Puzovic, Martin Mirol, other amazing artists and like 99% of such stuff was indeed produced in 3D's Marx and rendered in Krakatoa or it was Houdini. And how could we even compete with that? How could Blender catch up with that? So let's take a look. My hypothesis is that we could use the power of the Blender community of the open source, open collaboration to cross the divide, you know? So first of all we've been donating money to make Blender better and I mean all of us, not we, but all of us and some corporations, so we have been donating money, but in 2018 we did something amazing. Basically the Blender user base crowdfunded the CodeQuest project to fly developers to Amsterdam, lock them in the room and make them work for the common good and hopefully that would lead to improvement in all areas of Blender and in volumetric rendering, right? So without the never-ending support of the Blender community it would be highly unlikely that, for example, 16 developers could work on improving Blender and improving volumetric rendering. So for example Clement Foucault could come and single-handedly code something like volumetric rendering system for Eevee for the new real-time render engine. So when I think about it that's insane. Now we have like real-time volumes right in your viewport that's the holy grail of 3D rendering and now we have it. So that I think is pretty damn insane. So since 2017 we got about 120 code commits directly related to volumes and volumetrics like principled volume shader coded by Brecht van Lommel and other amazing features and most importantly bug fixes and stability improvements. So now you can for example have like amazing improvement coded by Kevin Dettrick, cycles volume, fast empty space, optimization, whatever but every improvement like that made Blender render volumetrics a bit faster. So all in all like now we can enjoy about 100% faster Blender in relationship volumes and if we factor in the hardware growth that occurred naturally over the years so we can say that it's like three times faster or something like that which is representative of switching from the video card of the previous generation to the mainstream gaming video card of the current generation plus the bug fixes and the performance improvements coded by the amazing Blender developers. So is it enough for us to render amazing Krakatoa style nebulae? I would say kind of yes but also no something else needs to happen and I want to show you the volumetrics slides of the interactions within the Blender community no pun intended. I want to show how people talk to each other share ideas and generally pinpoint ideas of each other to create something unbelievable and on the right you would see the progress bar at the top there is the Krakatoa mark so the ultimate goal of course I'm a little bit biased I consider myself to be a part of this community but I will try to keep it reasonable. So let's start with 80 euros 80s procedural patterns took us through the initial stages of research I mean the stuff we designed for original space VFX procedural noises in Blender are like generators of everything especially if you combine a few noises together you can quickly create patterns that resemble astronomical objects like like nebulae alright and what I like about procedural noises is that they have built in infinite details so you can fly right into the cloud right into the noise and see the new levels of details unfolding right in front of your eyes the standard Blender noise in other words the pearly noise gives you that opportunity to experiment with all kinds of patterns and to have built-in fractal like details alright and right at that time somewhere in the depths of the Blender artist forum Benny Govert's invented a pretty clever way of utilizing 3d textures 3d patterns to plug it into the emission shader then into the volume input of the material to create a volume light in the most literal sense of the word and it's already looked almost like an emission nebulae if you think about it and so we took it a step further and after playing a little bit with the volume light plugged it into the volume shader instead and that's how it goes so basically you take a cube of volume light and you can play with the density or rather the strength of that light by utilizing three dimensional noises of Blender and you can combine a few noises together if you want to create a slightly more detailed noise and after playing with the color ramp to colorize it you would discover that you created something that looks roughly like an emission nebulae let's marvel at the beauty of the universe for a second and then you just recombine it with the volume shader instead to get juicy features of the volume shader like absorption scattering anisotropy and other physically correct properties of the volume shader of the principle volume shader coded by Brecht van Lommel and inspired by Disney so you will get something like a dust cloud and we knew that we're on the right track when the grandmaster of the nebulae design Tion van der Zalm gave us a top on the shoulder and said that it looked just like particles and I think that was the point because we were aiming for that kind of look bam the B3D factor kicks in the community-generated progress you'll be seeing this a lot and back to particles who on gear optimized the particle generation so we could play with more and more particles on screen and when Gottfried Hoffmann noticed it he just removed the hard-coded particle limit all together and after pin ponging some ideas with Gottfried we invented a pretty interesting way of utilizing the inherent motion of the particle system to apply motion blur and create an impression that there are more particles on screen than there actually are not only that but Gottfried also wrote a script that throws time so we can fly our camera around this constellation and if you think about it that's pretty insane we had a state static nebula which showed motion blur due to the motion of the particles within the cloud that is pretty cool I think and yeah yeah Gottfried is for you but particles are fun only when combined with with physical forces so we watched many tutorials on the blender side of YouTube thankfully you could find anything you want there the blender tutorial business was and is booming so we watched a bunch of tutorials including the tutorials by Yago Mota the best we could find Yago's tutorials were like insanely valuable for us we were able to familiarize ourselves with that aspect of blender like in no time and we were excited to try that out for our own stuff for our own nebulae so I would like you I would like to show you a few demos that we managed to create without actually burning our computer because smoke simulation was fun the shapes that produced looked pretty neat but at the same time it had a bunch of problems like well the biggest problem was the problem of the resolution of the smoke unlike procedural texture you you didn't have built-in infinite details so we needed something to push it to the next level and we thought about stuff like volume displacement like volume displacement in Arnold render engine that could help us to to do that and volume displacement does exactly what it says on the team it takes the volume and it displaces it using some kind of a texture and we even wrote to Tom Rosendahl asking whom do we have to bribe to get this feature in blender and as it turned out Brecht van Lommel would be willing to check on this in the coming days yay but we wanted it now but we wanted it now so after talking to Robert Schutzer we discovered that Robert called it a little blender cycles volume importer that allowed us to import volumetric data from Houdini and other applications supporting open VDB as slices as 2D means the main dimensional images that then got recombined within blender within the shader to create a three-dimensional representation of the smoke or of of the nebula in our case that was pretty cool but we didn't know how to properly install open VDB library for blender to be able to export stuff from blender and then import it back and then do these things like distorting the UV input and displacing the cloud to add extra details so yeah we put it on hold and instead Gottfried proposed to use the point density shader the point density shader indeed worked just like volume displacement when you think about it let's see how it works actually I want to show you so first you run this smoke simulation this one is by the way controlled by the turbulence force field and then you add some particles and you make particles follow the smoke using this smoke flow force in blender and then you turn these particles into tiny volumetric points in space or voxels using the point density shader but it looks cool and detailed only surprise when combined with procedural noises and let's strip it down and actually see how it looks without any enhancements let's get back to its initial form and you will see that it's a bunch of voxel floating in space and then let's get back our resolution and zoom into the cloud just a little bit and you see bam no details whatsoever let's distort it using the noise now you have details right but it was pretty unstable I would say unstable as hell so we decided that instead we would come back to our comfort zone and thankfully right at that moment Simon Thomas node genius a math genius of blender released a procedural noise park which had this amazing advanced noise group which works pretty well when combined with volume shader it had the right balance of big medium and and small shapes and you we don't happen to understand how it works basically it's a bunch of noises combined to create a sort of a mega noise which produced pretty interesting patterns when plugged into the volume shader because every kind of noises in blender is three-dimensional it works perfectly with volumes and this noise in particular helped us a lot and empowered us to keep experimenting with that technique of rendering volumetric objects with procedural noise that is the default cube by the way and let's zoom into it a little bit and you will see that it holds up pretty well because the details given to you by the procedural noise work with with volumes perfectly and Omar Imaro took it to the next level by extending all the blender noises I think I think or was it just the pearly noise to other dimensions namely to the fourth dimension which is time so we could play with the evolution of the noise which would shift over time that is pretty incredible Omar did it during the Google summer of code that is really really great and really helpful boom b3d factor goes up yet again another branch of deep space research was aimed at fractals fractal is a never-ending pattern infinitely complex pattern that could be very useful indeed for simulating infinitely complex formations like nebulae so Jonas Michelle was the one who showed us how to do fractal math in blender and Jonas not only produced absolutely incomprehensible I mean great tutorial but also but also he shared the blend file and we picked that band file did practically nothing with it because our math knowledge wasn't up up to this task but anyway it was great and now everyone can can try can try to render fractal in blender which is pretty neat and Robert Schutze also experimented with fractals basically what he did is he took a webgl playing marble shader or whatever and he recreated using blender nodes so for example we could take this shader and render yeah infinitely complex stuff like tiny universe inside inside the inside the box it's amazing right yeah round of applause for Robert yeah you'll notice the spaghetti monster going on and you don't have to understand how it works it just works it's a fractal but have you ever tried art directing a fractal yeah don't you don't have to answer because it's nearly impossible you know and so incidentally Robert also coded a custom internal volumetric sampler or whatever it is which allowed us to calculate fractals four times faster right out of the box boom community driven progress sweet sweet open collaboration back to procedural noises thanks to the Simon Thomas noise and just to blender default noises and procedural patterns and thanks to the principled volume shader coded by brecht von Lommel we managed to arrive at the patterns at the astronomical looking objects that we really liked that really resembled the real stuff but surprise it was low because volumetric rendering can be slow in general and default blender denoising didn't do a great job with it so the game is the game kind of changed when Grant Wilk released the denoise add-on that brought the NVIDIA optics artificial intelligent based denoising to blender it performed in a much better way than the default 2.79 denoiser especially in such insane cases like the particle system and low resolution stuff like that and we got dramatic performance boost at the cost of insane rendering artifacts especially in animations because the denoiser processed each frame slightly differently so the animation was jittery in the end but we could live with that and thankfully right at that time Stefan Werner also added the Intel open image denoise to blender which wasn't hardware specific because optics only worked with NVIDIA video cards and yeah the Intel open image denoise was as magical as optics it simultaneously appeared in many places including the theory build so hopefully by now you can see how how the blender user base like a hive mind have been making the prospect of rendering amazing three-dimensional nebulae in Blair a bit more real so for example we can sprinkle it up with the creative shrimp magic and render something like that that is by the way cycles a good old path tracing render engine of blender I want to show you a few demos and take a sip thank you so much and then Evie came out and it changed the game once again and if you obviously is the semi real time render engine which supports volumetric rendering now thanks to Clement Foucault and other amazing blender developers and so the blender community rushed to port their space objects to Evie yeah and just within a few months after the official 2.8 release with the support of volumetics we got dozens of renders by Brent Patterson dozens of amazing blend files shared and sharing is at the heart of the Blair community is at the heart of the open source movement it's very useful indeed to have access to all the files like we got amazing breakdowns and resources by Curtis hold under Stephens in went invented clever Z depth hug that paved the way for the smoother-looking animations Mark Kings North released a nebulae generator add on and some amazing artworks Gottfried Hoffmann did something again because Gottfried was pretty active during that research process Stefan Wink Stefan Wink absolutely killed it by sharing real world or rather should I say real universe example of pillars of creation rendered in Evie and on the left you can see Evie render which took three minutes and cycles render took 40 minutes what would you prefer hey and I want to show a few Evie demos now yeah actually if that is not impressive I don't know what is just within a few months after the official 2.8 better release we moved from zero to the pillars of creation type of nebulae seen right in your viewport almost in real time but even though Evie has been maturing very fast boom progress it was yet to be cycles in terms of raw visual fidelity and in terms of details and physically correct light transport and that sort of stuff the best nebulae we created so far were created in cycles with some Evie help but it took a long long time one frame could render for six hours or more on an average video card and eight seconds of animation could easily take 50 days to render and that's made us sad you know because we wanted to render animations and on an average render farm that could take up to four thousand dollars something like that that made the doc really sad so what could we do what could we do yeah actually we asked people and the people responded once again and we did our own research as well but the Blair community was unbelievably helpful during that process so I won't be bothering you with all that stuff especially we running out of time but Stefan Werner suggested us to use light path node to kill the details in the shadows and optimize our nebulae this way Derek Barker just sent me the link to the custom theory build that's out of the box gave us one point 30 whatever whatever a huge boost in performance Tiago de Sul shared a pretty clever hack of disabling the ray visibility of every ray except the camera rays because the nebulae doesn't interact with anything else in this scene except themselves so we can disable all the rays and get our much-wanted performance boost we changed that was very clever we changed the aspect ratio to make it slightly more panavision to cut the top and bottom of the image and optimize it this way and we removed seven I know that is phenomenal I know don't clap that is I know that is genius and we also we removed seven light sources out of nine because you can always optimize it a little bit more and but now hold on to your chairs do you know what is cycles add-on is it's a wonderful add-on that is basically a supercharged charged version of cycles and the creator of the add-on Matthew Manue shared a custom build of a cycle specifically optimized for nebulae rendering for volumetrics it had just one checkbox nebulae optimization something like that and it gave us a huge immense boost without altering the quality like think about it and in some scenes it was 30% in some other scenes it was this is a checkbox by the way and in other scenes it was 16 times faster yeah at with some loss in details but anyway and we hoped incidentally the new version of e-cycles is released today we hoped that Linux would bring another competitive edge in terms of a GPU rendering performance as suggested by Steve Lund and other folks from the community but we got a mixed bag of results and we decided not to hurry up too much and crazy stuff we we hoped that Andy aka deep blender would release a super resolution add-on for blender that would allow us to render in 50% of the resolution and upscale everything to their original size without the quality loss but yeah I hope that one day he would he will do it yeah and my brother Roman Alexandrov implemented even more shameless hack basically he coded the optical flow plug-in for blender do you know what optical flow is basically it allows you to slow down the sequence the video sequence smoothly without stuttering but if you can slow it down and it's usually used in after effects and DaVinci resolve you can skip frames like you can render each third or even each fourth frame and speed up your rendering by 400% and then you can reconstruct all the frames using the optical flow algorithm and in some cases you would even get away with it and so yeah we got another another performance improvements which which was about I believe an average type of scene it was we skipped just every second frame but anyway so yeah multiplied by 2 or by 5 bam the b3d factor goes up once again so by squeezing every bit of performance out of blender and by picking the community brain by sprinkling it with the creative shrimp magic by utilizing techniques originated within the community and performance optimization tips custom builds like theory build or e-cycles nebula build we managed to move from six hours per frame to much more much more manageable figures like less than 20 minutes per frame and that meant that we could render this stuff overnight the and the preview animation I want to emphasize in the preview quality but yeah we could render it and that meant that we could submit it to render farm and it wouldn't cost us an arm and a leg because now it became possible. Thankfully such thing as distributed rendering has become a viable option distributed rendering means that people share their computers to do rendering tasks that would otherwise take weeks and months to finish probably the most popular distributed render farm is ship it and to give you some details about ship it 100 million frames rendered since 2012 up to 700 machines simultaneously rendering each day thousand years of blender project since 2012 including our nebulae special thanks to Brent Pearson for helping us out with rendering this stuff on ship it so yeah it could take five months I mean seven nebula sequences to render on 80s PC and it took three days to render on ship it with approximate cost of five million ship it points I'm not sure about the carbon footprint I'm not qualified to talk about that but anyway it was very satisfying to watch how people connect their computers to help us render this stuff out and did I say that I will show the amazing demo reel at the end of the talk did I no not really I will I will squeeze the duck and there is a special button inside and it will launch the demo reel so get ready okay thankfully not only three render farms collaborative render farm have been changing but also commercial ones so render farms like is render which had distributed infrastructure allowed us to have pre-competitive prices like 0.5 to 0.75 dollars per hour thanks to the nodes scattered worldwide it worked kind of like Uber for rendering yeah so we rendered I think it was four sequences on raise 200 hours versus one hour it costed us something like 140 dollars which is not bad I think so with the help of collaborative rendering and commercial render farms we pushed it to 11 out of 10 and I don't want to disappoint you guys but I don't think we quite reached the proprietary software level the Star Trek and credits quality but not that we want it and yeah it's not an arms race and I don't think that's the actual state of affairs is as important as the trend and the trend is pretty clear to me now I want to give you I want to give you a very exciting demo reel indeed so can you count from 10 or let's say from five to one okay five four three two one go wait wait wait hold on a minute glib can you see me oh goodness like the bigger theater this year nice look I don't mean to intrude but since I am captain disillusion worlds greatest blenderer and outer space is kind of on brand for me I think I should be the one to press the button that starts the demo okay it makes sense all right great of course in order from my signal to reach all the way to your laptop from here I had to rewire a few things again and give it more juice so get ready for the ride of a lifetime here we go one two okay how about I just show you the view out of my window instead yeah thank you so much thank you the doc loves you all yeah yeah I'd like to thank so many people who have been helping to push this stuff forward the doc adores you all and yeah thank you very much


All right. Well, hello, everyone. I'm Betsy co and I'm joining me tonight is as co post is Steve Greenwood. And I'm zooming in from Chicago, I've, I've been a member of wiki tree for about four years now. And like, like many people, I, I came and joined I thought it sounded wonderful. And then I got overwhelmed and I fled. And then I met some really wonderful people wiki trees who you know just gave me a little pieces of information here and there. And, you know, I got the confidence to, to re enter and really start building my tree on wiki tree and it's been a wonderful experience. I'm now a member I've gone through the training trails for Canada and Scotland and partially through England. I'm a member of those projects and also a member of the mentors project and the events committee. And yeah, I spend a lot of daily time on wiki tree and it's my happy place. Steve, do you want to introduce yourself. Oh, hi, I'm Steven. I've been a member since 2020. So yeah, my grandmother, who sadly recently passed away, she did get me back into the hobby again. She sent me a really large pedigree chart and it started just went from there and I was searching online. And then I found that one of my cousins in Germany was adding a whole bunch of my ancestors were people I was like researching. So once I connected with him, the ball just kind of rolled from there. And then I found that was just involved in a lot of different projects. And now I'm also in the events committee with Betsy as well. So, you know, we're responsible for putting things together like wiki games and upcoming wiki tree day. And, you know, we want to make this a community for people. We don't want it to just be, you know, you working on your tree by yourself. The idea is collaboration, you know, because we're all working on the same shared world tree here. And eventually at some point we're all going to connect, right? So that's kind of the idea behind it. And we just want to keep supporting that, you know, community atmosphere and that aspect. Yeah. Wonderful. Well, we don't. Very often for these sessions we have some people who step up in advance and say, yes, you know, I'll be the guinea pig and I'll let you look at my profiles. No one stepped up this week. So Elaine did ask some questions about privacy so we can start. So it's just going to be an open really open true Q&A. And Elaine, do you have the profile IDs that. Sure. So when you say the profile IDs, I give you the name dash and the number is that what. Exactly. And tell you what, why don't I screen share. And get myself to the wiki tree homepage. Move you guys down. Okay. All right, so what is, what is the first and the last name is Switzer SW it ZER. Yep. SW it ZER. And the number is 1843. Michael, I'm going to mute you. There we go. All right, tell me if that does that look right Elaine. Yes. So Arthur David Switzer is my grandfather. And I entered, not only my grandfather but also do you see like, you know it's listed his birth date and then it goes down to father of. My children are listed, but I don't know how I did it. Some of them are ended up with private profiles and they're not necessarily meant to be private. Do you see a few of them are. I do. And do you see on screen I'm looking right at your grandfather's profile. Yes. Yes. Okay. So the key, the key to privacy is up here in the upper right hand corner. So this green unlocked profile icon shows that it's an open profile. And there's no, you know, anyone can come in and make changes and you know, hopefully they collaborate with you at the profile manager, I see. Right. Okay. But now if we click on this. It's going to take us to a page that explains all the different sorts of privacy levels. So, I mean, we can go as restricted as completely unlisted, which would, and each of these has a description. So, you know, private private for. For most living members, these pop private with public family tree, or private with public biography and family tree are what you want, so that so that other people can know who you are and, and, you know, reach out to collaborate. Yes. So now that I know that how do I so for the first one that's listed, which is, I guess, my uncle, Donald Robert, do I click to his profile then and just go into that lock icon and change it. Well, since no, okay, so let me show you. Okay, where you change it is this privacy tab. Okay. You would click on that. And then you would be able to now I, the profile manager has to, or someone on the trusted list has to, but you would, you would select what you want. And then I think there's a save button there, but I can't do that because I'm okay. No, no, that's fine. I just wanted to know how I did it. So, I mean, my grandfather's as you can see is is open it's unlocked right. It's public, but I would need to go into my uncle's then Donald Robert Switzer. Right. Well, it actually looks like because I can see Donald's he is. Well, let's see what is very deceased and so he has a green lock. He's privacy level public. And you are the profile manager. Right, right. We can see him but the person we can't see is this these these children would be listed in birth order. Yes. Does Donald have an older brother. No. Sorry, yes, my father. Okay, so it looks like this. As you can see on my screen, it's listed as private son 1930s to unknown. That's your father. You see, I can't even see him. Yeah, and if he's still living, it should remain like that if he's not a member. Oh, I see because he's not a member. Yeah, yeah, if you invite him as a member, then he can have a somewhat visible profile. He can still control the privacy of that profile. So, you know, if he wants to lock it down to a red, he can do it. But if he wants to be a little more accessible, you know, he can have a orange or yellow like we do. But as a person who's living who doesn't have a profile automatically has to be unlisted for privacy purposes. I see that's the part I didn't understand. Okay, so I guess the system because well I entered the information because he's living. Yeah, that's why it automatically then defaulted to this. Right. So it automatically assumes that if you don't give it a def date that the person is still living, and so it lists them, but it still allows you to connect to the tree, because the great thing about wiki tree is that it has that privacy level for those living people. And then it can cut through to the deceased individuals. So you can do your research. Right. So that's, that's just why you don't see him. And yeah, there's some comments here from Steven regarding that as well in the chat. Oh, yeah, let's see what. You can go to his profile and edit and scroll down to the email, add his email and save. Yeah. Right. And that's how you would invite a person to join wiki tree, and then they would be the profile manager of that profile. So the challenge is my father is 91, his ability to manage this is right. Not there. So, you know, I will be with him in a week's time so I can just verbally go through all of the information with him and if he can sense then I can set it up for him then is that right. Yeah, yep. So it looks like I wonder Steve, would you know, so if it says night 1930s to unknown, I wonder if Elaine really clicked living. Well, I mean, if it's not provided. It just assumes that the person's living. Okay. So the definite has to be entered to create a deceased profile. But there's an option radio button that says still living, I believe. Well, yeah, but you don't necessarily have to click it. Like, if you click it, it's a confidence marker, right? Right. So I mean, that definitely will activate it. But let's look at her profile. Let's just go to Elaine really quick and click on her ancestors. I want to see, you know, we can see what the public would look at when they see her family tree. So go ahead and click on ancestors. And we, yeah, we can see that the private, the father's private, the mother is deceased. So she's accessible. But yeah, this is what people would see from the outside looking in. You can see your father because you created his profile and your profile. But this is what people should be seeing on the outside looking in. Okay, I guess that's what, yeah, that's what confused me. Okay, so that's very helpful. Thank you. Thank you. If I can show you one thing, just from the perspective of here's, here's my profile. And therefore, and you see I have this, I have private private with public biography and family tree. But of course, I can see everything because it's my, but if I want to see what will somebody else see. I will have this little hyperlink. And then I will see, you know, it's no longer going to give my exact birthday. Okay, I got it. Yeah. Anything that you type in the biography is still visible. So you gotta be careful with biographies, you can type information in your biography, but if it's birth and death information, you know, that could override the whole point of the privacy on the rest of the page. So you have to be careful what you put in the biography. Right. And sometimes people will list things like list things in the bio that will totally defeat the purpose of the privacy setting. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, now if someone. So my aunt Lynn Switzer. She passed away in March. And so I added her death date onto the profile but I still notice in what you what you had for my grandfather that hers was still private is it not. Well, she is I haven't memorized the colors yet. I really should. She's private with a public tree. It could be because of how recent she passed away. Okay. There may be some buffer built from the system. But if you're able to, I mean, since you are a profile manager, if you're able to select a different version that shows more information, you know, that that's a little more accessible. You would want to you would select the green options. So the green option would be public. But again, it would not be open because those are for profiles that are old, you know, at least 100 years old and then anybody can get those. So you still want to have some privacy for editing. Okay, well that again very helpful. Thank you. Okay. And again, it's your discretion. You don't have to unlock that you can still keep it to this level of privacy if you choose to because of how recent it happened. So that is completely up to you what you decide to do with that. Thank you very much. Yeah, no problem. Yeah, I think the only other thing let's see if I can get these numbers right. If a person was a person died more than 100 years ago, was born more than 150 years ago. They're quite thanks to them. Their profile is required to be unlocked with just a automatic thing. Okay. And again, that's that's for collaboration purposes because people are not accessible for editing, then the tree doesn't grow. Exactly. Yeah. Great. Any other questions. No, I just, that was the one that just really befuddled me. Otherwise, I've been able to, to manage. And I am curious when I create a family tree. So if we go to my, my grandfather, Arthur, David Switzer again. Yeah, let me, there we go. Okay. If I wish to create a family tree for him to go back as far as possible because we, I believe it's his like great great great grandfather from 1648 or something or other, but the trees that I seem to be able to build don't go back that far. Okay, well let's see what we've got so far. Just clicked on ancestor from Ireland. That's right. That's the ancestor from the, from Germany and migrated to Ireland and then came to Canada. So if you go up to the far right to Adam Switzer, like there's several. He sounded more of a German or Swiss name because Switzer is Swiss and German. I wonder if they actually came from Switzerland. Actually, we have information that goes back to the 1400s that most likely that came from Switzerland, but then moved to Asenheim in Germany and then migrated to Ireland and then to Canada as well. So they've gone through four countries and they're technically five countries is the United States. It's actually pretty impressive, I think. Let's let me just take a look at them. Okay. Have you been in touch with the profile manager just seems like collaboration. Well, actually, she and Deborah Dirks have done tremendous amounts of work. And so if you see on the right hand side, you'll see. Oh, Deborah Dirks is the fourth cousin I was telling you about that. Yeah. So that's how we connected. So if you look at this family tree now, you'll see it goes back further. And so my, my question is like, how do I create up one full some family tree that goes from Arthur David, all the way up the door hand. Yes. Okay. This lovely pictorial way, not in the list way. Right, right. And I mean, right now, we are limited by the size of the screen. But there is an app that's the dynamic family tree is what we want to look at. So let me, I felt like I should go back to Elaine's great. Arthur. Arthur. Okay. Not here. Go to tree apps. Oh, that's Donald. No. Yeah, there you go. Okay. So you want to, this is a very handy bar. So tree. Yes. Okay. I imagine you want to print this off or something, right? Well, so here there's a pull down menu. So you want Steven the dynamic tree. Yeah. Okay. It uses JavaScript to be able to exponentially expand. So it's dynamic. And this also shows children as well. This can get out of hand really quick. So all right. And I see that I can make it smaller. To. Add more to make it fit. Yeah. Yeah, I see what you mean, Steven. It's getting. The computer might slow down too. Yeah, this is the one where I had clicked on the profile. Exactly. And now we can no longer see all of it. But yeah, I would say that. Zoom out a little bit. There. Yeah. Remember when I had that slide that I showed a Christopher with like everything extending out. Oh yeah. Way back to the Charlemagne. Yeah. I can, I can see how you're building it, but also with my grandfather, Arthur, his children. So do you see on the left there? Yeah. It just says Lynn and Donald. Those are only the ones that are deceased. There are five. Like there were nine children. But those are the ones you're not seeing are the ones whose privacy levels. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And so until I get those opened, I can't really create it, but I, okay. That's wonderful. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You can keep clicking on the Swissers and see how far back they go. Let's see. All right. I've got all of those. Oops. Nope. I missed. Here. Here. I don't expand all but now. I don't think you want to do that.  This is how you cool. Lane, I'm curious. Are you pre-1700 certified? Yeah. Yeah. So wiki tree has a system in place.  There's just like a page that talks about how finding reliable sources. There's a, there's a quiz you take. And once you've passed the quiz, then you're considered pre-1700 certified. Oh, I see. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The one who entered with me is the one who created these profiles that go way, way back. Well, I mean, look at this. I am just not running out of plus signs. And it's starting to run into our research because I'm part of Germany projects. So of course, as soon as it hits Germany and I'm pre-1700 certified myself. So I could go ahead and work on anything up to 1500. I have to have additional certification for medieval stuff, which is pre-1500. But most of our records basically go to about 16 or 1500 anyway. So for my purposes, it's not really that important. But yeah, I would like probably look at your German profiles and want to work on those. Okay. See, it's not even Germany at that point. It's the Holy Roman Empire. Well, we're in still. Oh, there's pedigree collapse. Look at that. You got some autonomy right there because you got some repeating names in Jacob Dolmich. Really? Yeah. Look at that. Johannes is the same. Adam is the same. And then the children, the daughters are different. Dorothy and Elizabeth were the two different sisters. And then they married different men. And then their children eventually married each other. You see that? Yeah, I do. I do. So yeah, you're going to find pedigree collapse pretty easily when you go really far back into the records. And then the name starts to repeat. It's further up the tree that I guess is my direct lineage. So I'm afraid that I'm not as familiar with this that you're looking at right now, but. Can you go to the left Betsy? Go to the. Sorry. Bring everything to the. That's it. Push it to the right. So we can. Okay. So the core nails that that's what's breaking out into these German. Benner's and Dolmages, which became Dolmets. But I think you have to go up. But yeah, then if you follow head north, I guess maybe that's the best way to do this. Go earlier. I think she wants to see the sweatshirts. Oh, okay. There you go. So you still. Yeah. Keep. So your hand. Schweitzer. So the name was. Schweitzer. Switch. There they are again. There's, there's three Jacobs on here now. Wow.  You see that? You can, you can still do you see you have your hand Schweitzer. You're still a plus sign there. That's my kind of more direct lineage. Oh, okay. There. Right. Right. If you were a man that would be like your Y DNA line. So. But your Y, Y DNA wasn't passed to you as a lady. So you wouldn't be able to use that DNA. But if somebody that, you know, if your father could do it, actually your father. If he's still alive. Could do a DNA test with Y DNA and then it can follow that Schweitzer line all the way out. Yeah. Well, he's nine to one. He's still here. Yeah. I got my grandmother in a DNA test before she passed away. So I'm glad she did that.  He can just do the test and mail it off. And then you can be the profile. Well, you can be like the DNA manager for that purpose. Then. Why do you think, why DNA is a swab, right? It's not. Yeah.  I think it was a cheek swab. It's just, it's hard for 80 and 90 year old people to, to provide as much saliva. I suffoled. I don't think about that. Cheap swab is the way to go. Right. Right.  I would recommend that, you know, if you really want to follow this, the Schweitzer line, you know, like that, that's something that could be added to your interest. You know, with your family. Awesome. But yeah, it looks like Johann Schweitzer is the last one. And then it cuts out, but the Kessel rings keep going. Interesting.  And then. Yeah. And so. How is there a way now that we've expanded it with all of the. Expanding all of the plus signs and so on to be able to print this. Yes, I think I've never done it, but I've heard of people. Is there a way to save it as a file? And then you would, you would. That is a great question. We can click on help. Yeah. There's a button right there. No. How to find, no, this is all about tree apps. How to use tree apps. Dynamic tree navigating. It doesn't really talk about printing. No. I mean, there are printable versions of things, but they're going to be a lot more restrictive. You know, I think. You have to take a screenshot of your screen basically. Yeah. Also, if you had like a really big screen, you could fit a lot more into there. I actually wish that we were able to take the top part of the screen and drag it up so that we could see more of the active screen. Maybe I'll recommend that and see if somebody can do something about that and you know, they're always open to feedback. They're always open to new ideas. And other concerns. Yeah. It's interesting that we can, you know, click it to create a PDF or something like that. I, you know, I'm not ruling that out. I just, I don't know how to do it. Yeah. Everything is created by users. We haven't thought of everything. There's always room for opportunity. They also have this thing called a hacktoberfest coming up very soon. This will be an opportunity where they work on stuff just like this and it could be a brainstorming activity for them. So, you know, maybe it's something we can submit and say, like, hey, we saw that there were some things that could be improved on with the dynamic tree or are you willing to, you know, check it out. So those guys. At least I mean the other, the other tree that I was able to, to create just like the, the one before you expanded it, Betsy. Yeah. That was a little bit more colorful. Yeah. The other. I couldn't even print it's to actually kind of match it up, you know, like a puzzle. Yeah. What happens when we do basic. Oh, that. Okay. That's the one I mean. So if I tried to print that and then I go to Adam and just print his to try and put them together. It doesn't quite work, but that's really the lovely pieces of information that I would. I would like to put together in a, in one document. Yeah. I usually just draw mine out. I get a poster board. Yes. It's so much nicer anyway. But yeah, I mean, not every piece of technology is going to provide you what you want to see. I mean, the pedigree chart does give us out to second grade grandparents. So you can stack those on top of one another potentially. But, but yeah, like I said, not every piece of technology is going to, you know, work for what you need. You may have to like find a new avenue. Sometimes you have to invent that avenue, which is what those guys are good about doing that. They make new stuff that didn't exist before. Well, we can't, we can't be the only ones to wish to have ever wished for printable trees. Right. If there's enough interest on someone may come up with a solution. I want to correct the spelling on that. But I don't know what this profile is. My, my OCD is a, it's clicking. It's twitching a little bit right now. Let me help you stay there. It's hidden. No, I can still see it. Oh no. Sorry. It's an open profile. I can work on this. Well, I'm sure Deborah would not mind you correcting the spelling. I don't want to upset people, but yeah, sometimes I have to go through. I have a tendency to want to just clean profiles up because they, they can look pretty messy sometimes. I'm going to try to fix some of the formatting for place names and locations, things too sometimes. Let me, since you have a really strong interest research research wise in the Swissers. If you, you can do this here or on the homepage, just search for Swiss or click on the name too. You can do that. Now you're going to get this page, which is going to give you all the Swissers on wiki tree, including Deborah. Both, you know, who married into the family or who were born into the family. And I love this fact that you can, you have all these ways to sort it. Oh, you can see like what, what have people been doing on the Swissers. I see. Okay. Yeah, recent changes. And I like alpha order and date order. Put in date order. It'll show you the oldest one on all of wiki tree, which is probably going to be. Oh, here we go. England, actually. And then bear in Switzerland. And there's Austin. If anybody is participating in the source of time at the end of the month. And you're looking for on source profiles. Then you click on sourced. And then you can be working on your surname of interest. Well, contributing towards the, you know, the activity. There's some small, but isn't there too? Yeah. How did, oh yes, I did notice that that the, the initial hits are the surname that you're interested in. And it goes straight to that. They veer off into closely related or. Well, this is alphabetical. It's taking you straight to that index. So then anything after that is still alphabetical. So switcher, you know, after that is Swazinski, Swos, Swaboda. I have a friend who's got, who's married into Swaboda. So that's a name I recognize now. I see. Yeah. What else is. If you look at all 1.2 million of them. Yeah, you're going to start at a. More orphaned. So these are, these are Switzer profiles where there's no profile manager. Yeah. You might wish to adopt them. Oh, some really cool names in there. Avarilla, Geneta, Switzer, Iris, Avarilla, Switzer. Wow. Just known as that. Oh, and that was a jet. That was a jet com. So a lot of times when jet coms are created, there's not really profile managers associated with them. And there's usually a lot of cleaning up that has to be done on those profiles as well.  And what's this other thing? View the family line. What does that mean? Oh, okay. So these are all the orphans that are attached to. So adoptable profiles are highlighted in yellow. Yeah. Oh, okay. So I can help clean up a list pretty quickly. If you're just looking for everybody in that family vicinity. Oh, Pennsylvania, cool. Lots of. Lots of rabbit holes to fall into. Yes, exactly. Well, you've really. You've already shown me a lot of things that I wasn't aware of. Just lack of experience. Well, that's what we're here for. Yes. Click on Nathaniel. Yeah. So. Was this one of your ancestors or, I mean, because it's a, it's a Switzer who lives in this village in Germany, but they don't have any additional father attached to it. But we know that they go beyond this point. Well, certainly shows, you know, to have been around in the same area. And this is not a name that has surfaced for me before. Interesting, but they still, they went to County Limerick where the rest of them went. So I'm thinking this is a, maybe a brother of your direct ancestor, maybe, or at least someone close to that line. So that's something you can look into, right? Yeah, that's right. Hmm. Well, I'm just fascinated by the whole, you know, moving from Germany to Ireland thing too. It's interesting. He lived in 98. Good for him. Well, that, you know, that's an estimation too. So we have to. Well, that down. Okay. The cat is being very needy right now. Hey, maybe we can show some of the jet com cleanup. Since we're on this profile. Uh, was this created from a jet com? It looks very. To me. Okay. What does that mean? Sorry. What does this mean? Jet coming. Well, jet coming doesn't exist as a word. I just made that up. But again, from the jet com, you know, that usually like ancestry trees, everybody will have their stuff on that site. And they'll import it through a jet com to wiki tree. And it'll create a profile, but it will dump all of this data that doesn't really make too much sense into it. So it's not really so excitable. Again, a lot of these extra characters, like these at symbols and these other notes are in there. So we have the thing called the jet com cleanup. It's automatic jet con cleanup button that we can click. And it sort of takes those sources and reformats the page a little bit. So it's a little bit more legible, like a biography. And then, you know, we go from there and then we start adding like actual sources. It's just that a lot of times it tries to site the ancestry tree, which is not a source. So we can't even use the ancestry tree itself. Right. So what I just did while Stephen was explaining all of that was that I turned on my wiki tree browser extension. So you'll notice that it does change the appearance of the profile a little bit. I mean, this is a free extension that you add to your browser and it really, to say that it enhances your wiki tree experiences is an understatement. I mean, just an explosion of possibilities in terms and you can customize it. So one of the things that I did was, you know, I put, I put the family off to the side as opposed to where you're probably used to seeing it, you know, but the reason that I enabled that and you can see I've got the there. Okay. That's the browser extension. Now if I click on that. Okay. Profile. Steve, where's the AGC? I thought it was built in. I, you can just go to edit and the buttons shows up. Oh, okay. You don't really have to have the browser extension for that. Okay. So you have two of them. Why would there be two of them? Because you must have, you overloaded it by putting on the browser extension, which probably adds the button, but the buttons already there. Okay. You got two buttons. They do the same thing. Yeah. Watch this. Are we ready? Oh, I need a drum roll. Wait a minute. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. AGC did not change the profile due to the error. Yeah. Found line marriage within a note section. This is not consistent with the normal format. So. No. It, it suspects that there's already the fact. So this. Is wiki coding for putting something in bold. Which is something that a jet com wouldn't do. You know, if it's not right. Really? If it's, if it's finding that as a conflict. So do we just. Sure. Right. Well, unbold it. It'll say marriage. And then we'll try to hit the button again. And see what happens. So X out of that first. The X out of the orange. Box. Should I, should I save that? I think I should save that. Yeah. Okay. Fixing formatting. Full save. Okay. Now. We will go try this again. And I'm going to do drum roll. Okay. What happened this time? In the notes section. No. Yeah. Marriage marriage. Why? What is it? Not consistent with the normal format for early jet com import. Maybe we just need to rewrite the entire article from scratch. Yeah. I mean, now, since this is, I feel fine doing this because this is an orphan profile. Let's see. I mean, we are, we are, well, we're not quite into tech seven pre 1700. Yeah, we're still safe here. So. The source S 23 doesn't really apply to anything. Right. It's referring to a database. It's referring to some records somewhere. Maybe it's ancestry. It's trying to reference. Yeah. This is, this is nothing. We don't, we don't need this. Right. Right. So we can still keep his name in there. Well, sure. What, what I'll say. Oh. It shows up in a record for John Switzer. So we might want to indicate that John Switzer was in a record that had Nathaniel Switzer's name in it because it was his father, you know, like a, like a birth record or a marriage record or something. Right. Right. We may have to go to family search. Look, look, look. Okay. Switzer was his son, it seems. Mm hmm. Yeah. Well, that's something you would put in, in reference. There's the URL for the family search. So let's just copy and paste that into a new. Yeah. Well, just the URL itself, I was going to say. Yeah. Cause at least this way then we can get a page on family search that has all the documents associated with that. And then if we want to add stuff from family search to this profile, then, then we can beautify it that way. Mm hmm. Cause they gave us the entire person's page. Oh, of course we're not logged in. I forgot to check. Every two weeks, that's the, make sure they're selected. Right there. I've been in it for two weeks. All right. Okay. No sources. Oh, delightful. One short. Maybe one. One short. One short. No title. Okay. So Nathaniel needs a little bit of help. And let's look. Well, he's got parents. He's got parents. He goes to the Switzers. So this, this is a thing that we saw between the different Switzer kids turning into Switzers. It's got to be the same family. So. We are. We are looking at. Nathaniel Christopher Switzer senior. And then over here. Nathaniel Christopher. He's a Switzer senior. Okay. And his children. Sorry, everybody. Okay. So we think that he might have appeared in the record for John. So let's go to John. Oh, look, John. Ireland. That's a lot of information. Yeah. John has 11 sources. You would think though that if it's connected to his father, it would show up, right? Because if a source has a father name in there and it's indexed. Then it would also show up on the father's profile, right? At least the family search. What is this? I don't know what these sources are. Oh, these are ancestry sources. Okay, Randy. So maybe nothing has been uploaded or identified on family search yet. Historic graves. Hmm. Hmm. John Switzer. So at least we have a headstone. Yeah. I mean, that's cool. And then depending what we have here for information on cemeteries on wiki tree. Yeah. That could be the source for that. One of the five original Palantine families that came to Palantine Street in the Commons is tenants of the Barker Ponson via state of Cochule Abbey in the 1770s. He's also an ancestor of the Switzer family that owned the, that owned the famous Switzer store on Grafton Street in Dublin, now known as Brown Thomas. That's cool. Wow. So, I mean, there were a number that left the Asenheim area and ended up in, in Ireland as part of that whole Palantine. Exodus, right? In the, in the 1700s. And so that, I mean, I have an attestation for again, my lineage, a copy of it that indicates that they, the intention was to go to Pennsylvania. But unfortunately, when the ships left Germany, they went to England and then the queen there was inundated, right? With the, the Palantines, because there was something like 17,000 of them. It was one of the first refugee camps ever noted in history. And so some of them ended up a small portion going to Pennsylvania. Some went to Ireland. And were unhappy and went back to Germany or tried to find their own way to America. But then my family did go directly from Ireland to Canada. And so this is, like, this is a common theme of the Switzers leaving that area and just migrating to, to various areas. Yeah. I mean, the whole thing is fascinating, you know, seeing the Palangrine, the Pound Time migration, and it isn't just as clear cut as going to America, you know, there was these other countries that they would end up in and then they would cycle back and forth until they found the right boat. Yeah. I mean, it's wild. And then thinking about how long it takes just to go from one place to another on a boat, you know, and given the conditions on those boats, this wasn't a nice little cruise. This was an arduous journey in each case. Yeah. No question. Yeah. I mean, they really went through a lot just to get that even this location. So my feeling is that we don't have enough information. Probably not at the moment. Yeah. We can, we can leave it and I'll, I noted the name and that it's, it's an adoptable profile. So I'll see if I can find any more information about. Yeah. What you just want to notice, you know, I'm going to get out without having done anything. Where's my return? So we're coming up. Almost to the hour. I wanted to make sure that we didn't neglect Michael. Sue and Sally. Do. Thank you. Yeah. Of course. Thanks for sharing everything. I know. You gave us really good material to talk about and show, show things. Thank you. Michael, Sue, Sally, do any of you have questions that you want us to tackle? I just came to listen in. Okay. All right. No problem, Sue. And. Steven, I'm not meaning to ignore you. Oh, no problem. I know. Yeah. And Michael and Sally, I don't know if you're. Are you there? Can we answer any questions for you? When they're muted, if they don't realize that. Yeah. If you're going to walk away from your computer too. I am really fascinated by this. What's your line now?  I always get addicted to like a new line of research, even though they're not related to me. It is. This is the wiki tree way, right? This is the way. Yeah. Um, Also, I want to go to this village and I want to take a picture of their sign. Because. Amazing. At this village exists. And my. My mother land. Actually, my people are also on my mom's side for Rhineland palitinate. So it might not even be that far from where my people are set up. Well, there you go. Well, my son was a history major and worked for a year at the Manhattan University. Oh, my. In Germany. And so it just unfortunate that I wasn't able to, to share. I didn't learn about the, the famous, you know, information and signs that are still there for him to go and visit at the time. But some. Yeah. Well, we'll have to make a journey. Yeah.  Yeah, I mean, that's. Same area. Yeah. Cool. Is everybody comfortable on how to add photos to their profile? Would you like a demonstration? Sure. Okay.  So this is one of my uncles. And so as you can see, I already have some, some images. So here's your, the image tag. Tab. I'm curious. How do you pronounce his name? Okay. Yeah. Or Robert. Yeah. So I've already got pictures of him, but I have a fourth one that I want to add. So the way to do that, you go to the image. Page and say, click here to upload. Choose the file. And it's, let's see. On my desk. I don't know. Can, when I'm a screen sharing, can you all see my, my little. Negative. It's probably protecting your private information. That's good. Okay. So I'm going to, just going to select my, my file. Okay. There we go. It went gray, but there was nothing that overlapped it. Okay. I'm always curious about that. You have to, you have to at least say 30 words to the effect of, you know, how you got it. And I'm going to say that. Is that a requirement? 30 words. 30, I'm sorry. 30 characters. 30 characters. 30 letters. I think one time I tried to write. I took this photo and it wasn't enough. So I'm scanned from family photo collection. You do what we're very careful on wiki tree to honor. You know, copyright and ownership. Yeah. So, yeah. Like if I were to have found this photo on family, I would have, I would have, you know, I would have, you know, if I were to have found this photo on family search, I would, or ancestry, I would contact that person and say. Find. Find a grave to make people copy pictures from there and post them. And it's like, no, you can't assume the source. And I also, I also take photos of tombstones. So I know that I don't have to borrow the phone, the photo from somebody else. I can show that I'm the profile. I'm the copyright holder of that image. So when I upload it, then there is no issue. Yeah. So that's in the bad bar elements. What? I saw some of your auto fill from other. Oh, okay. I see. There we go. Actually, you know what I should use. Okay. I'm using the same location type A, and so it all starts auto fill as I'm writing type A. I never know what to do here because. Was it known as Taiwan? I think this would be correct. 49. Yeah. Well, I mean, before it was Taiwan, it was for most. Actually, what happens if I type for most? Argentina. Yeah. I don't know if there's any other places with the name for most. Yeah. Maybe you have to put in type A for most. Okay. So there's no options. It's probably because we just don't have much built up. For Taiwan on wiki tree. I mean, I know that other projects like Germany project, make sure to have all the different variants. You know, in the database. So like if we put in something older than 1806, it should show up as Holy Roman Empire and not as. You know, the German confederation. That's an example. So I'm thinking that it's just not as developed yet. And you don't have to go with those dropdowns. Like you can type in anything you want, honestly. Yeah. Okay. I'm doing math. My father's age, therefore his age. And so I'm going to say this was. About 1953. That's interesting too. Because usually when we select a date, then the locations are based off the date. So you would think that they would do that on the photos and, you know, where the date comes first and then the location. So I don't know. All of this, you know, if I were to get more. Confirm information. It can be edited later. You can go back. It is a photo. Yeah. And so I'm going to upload it. The old photo has photography studio name on it. Can we still count it as scan for family collection? I don't know. Do you not know? Question. Yeah. Well, but that's a good, great question. That's something that we may have to redirect it. There's a genealogist that focuses on just copyright stuff. So. Oh, you're talking about Judy Russell. Maybe Judy Russell. Yeah. Her website would probably talk about that. That's, that's a really good question. Yeah. I mean, I'm sort of wondering. If people are living, they could still claim a copyright to it. If they've been dead for at least 80 years, then there's a little bit more leeway with that. Yeah. I mean photography studios, it's very difficult to tell them, you know, and who's going to go after you for uploading something like that from 80 years ago. But what about, what about if your great grandparents, they paid the photographer, they hired the photographer for a session. They get paid for it. Right. Then the transaction's been performed. I mean, I would have to assume that there's like, making those decisions. Well, we can. It becomes very complex, isn't it? My mother was a professional photographer, but she was also a colorist. So as an example, she would take this particular black and white photo and. And ask for a cloth sample of his suit, if possible, his tie, whatever, and, and use oil paints to create a colored image. And, and so again, she has another layer of copyright. Because of artistry. She created a new thing now. So she made art on top of it. It resets copyright, or it's a derivative of an existing work. Yeah. That is so complicated. I don't like to get into those conversations. I know. I know. But that's just an example of, you know, while she worked for a particular studio, the studio's stamp would be on the back of the, you know, but not necessarily her name as the artist. As I mean, at that time, they were called color technologists or color technicians. That's what it was. Yeah. It's like those, those Thomas Kincaids or something, right?  Yeah. Yeah. Anyways, I didn't mean to derail, but it does come very complex. This is great. This is very open ended. And I mean, I love talking about just anything. Yeah. And yeah, Stephen had a good comment too. That he found the photographer linked with the studio. But who was no longer living. So, but that, that must have taken a bit of detective work, I'm sure. Yeah, we are detectives effectively. I occasionally put on a bad suit and fly in the night. There's my photo. And if you wish to make that the primary photo, which I don't, you could do that down here. You could check it and set as primary. If you wanted to make it his, the background image, you could do that all. And that might be a little obnoxious to have a repeating images of background, but. Yeah. Well, I sort of wonder with, with a photo like this, you wouldn't see him. You know, it would be cropped off too. Yeah. We, because you get the edges. So you'd see it looks like the Taipei 101 on his left hand side actually. Good. Good. Yes. Oh, is that what that is? Well, yeah. The Taipei, Taipei 101 looks like that. Yeah. It's the skyscraper. I mean, I'm impressed that you know that. I know skyscrapers. I'm a kind of a infrastructure nerd. Yeah. Lego, of course. Yes. That's, that's one of the things. Yes. But, but yeah, I mean, if you have an image like that, if it's a elongated image, yeah, it's going to cut off. Yeah. Yeah. So generally the background images are more of like patterns. Like somebody wants to put up a tartan because it's a Scottish person. Yeah. Then the tartan profile or the tartan image will repeat. And so you'll see that as the background against the edges. Right. Pretty much the only thing I would use background for. I can show you. Where I've done that. Oh, it's a green wood. It's a green wood. We can't figure where's, where's her background. That's weird. Cause I had, I had given her that background. From one of those photos. Yeah. She was very passionate about the men's tartan. Well, I don't see a tartan to establish with that profile. Just shows the four. See, that's one version of that. Oh, okay. Yeah. Maybe you still need to actually upload that one to her profile directly. Yeah. Yeah. I thought I did. Well, anyway. We all think we did things in late night. You know, editing, right? My wiki tree. I'm back to it like six months later. Like, wait, this looks different. Well, did you do it too? Nice. So, and if I, if you wish to, to put the photo within the bio as, you know, if it's pertinent to what you're saying and instead of having it on the side, you want to see it right within the text. You just copy this. And you paste it within the bio. So, yeah, lots of, lots of flexibility. Yeah. And there's ways to thumbnail that you can see below that, that there's like additional captions, you know, or sizes can be changed or alignment can be changed. So if you want to make it left aligned instead of right aligned or centered, you know, you can do it that way. Yeah. Here it is. Any other questions? Yeah, I'm not for myself. Thank you. You've been incredibly helpful. So if I was to wish to connect with either of you. Yes. Let's let me, let me just get out of screen share. And I am. This is my profile. This is my profile. I'm 31. So you can just send me a message through my profile. Yeah. Yeah. Mine is a little bit longer. I am green with three, six, six, seven. Yes. And if, yeah, are you on discord? Oh, I'm sorry. What's that? Discord is like a chat. A chat platform that wiki tree uses very heavily. No, I haven't used it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, this will work just as well. It's not required, but we do like communication for major events and. Our thongs. Thank you, Steven. Awesome. Yeah. Thank you so much to everybody for coming tonight. It was. I thought we'd, I said to Steven, we're going to have to tap dance alone tonight because we don't have a lot of time. We're going to have to tap dance. We're going to have to tap dance. We're going to have to tap dance here's, but it. Well, thank you again. Good night, everyone. Good night. Bye bye. See you soon.


What is up everyone? Happy Thursday, April 8th, 2024. Three trades today, a Mighty 90 and Netflix that turned into a downside volume runner, so I bailed on it. And then a Roku Mighty 90 and a nice Microsoft Mighty 90. So plus 322 on the day. So Netflix, let's go to Netflix here. So I got long Netflix here and it ended up, the bar got bigger than the first, so I just bailed on it. But you can kind of see it never really went lower. So, but I was in that for maybe a minute tops. Microsoft had a Mighty 90 and this bar is throwing it off. This bar is not like that. Let me see if I can, you know. It was right here, Mighty 90. This big bar is wrong, so it's not showing this. It did have some really nice volume pop. And I ended up getting, I ended up getting long right down here after this second push down. And then just scaled out of it, real nice push up here, held a couple of contracts, got two consecutive, let one continue. So, rode it up to here and then got out right up here somewhere with my last contract. So, I wish I went a little bigger on Microsoft there, but I'll take it plus 322. And I was looking, I've only had one red day in 2024 on these trades. So, I haven't had the biggest profit loss, but I've had some, I've only had one red day. So, I'll try to update you on my, what I've done so far on Friday tomorrow. So, I will see everybody at power hour or in the live stream tomorrow morning. Peace.