Hey, this is Brett, and this 2012 Ram 3500 Megacab Short Box Dual Rear Wheel Laramie Longhorn is talk number 14257Z. I am here at Summit Automotive in Fond du Lac, Wisconsin. You're new and used heavy-duty truck and Ram headquarters. This 2012 Ram 3500 has the 6.7-liter Cummins diesel. It is pre-DEF, so it does not need def-fluid, and it's paired up with the six-speed automatic transmission. This truck has been fully-safetyed and inspected by our service shop, has a fresh oil and filter change. All the fluids have been checked and topped off. It has like-new tires all the way around, and this truck is 100% ready to go. I'm going to go all the way around in this video inside, underneath, start it up, take a look under the hood, show you all the options inside, and just give you a really thorough walk around of this vehicle and give you the most accurate representation that I can of it. Sagebrush Pearl over White Gold is the color scheme. I shoot all my videos in 4K. If you like the video, consider subscribing to the YouTube channel. Click the bell notifications and get updates on the videos that I do each and every day as well as having access to one of the largest catalogs of vehicle and heavy-duty truck walk-arounds on YouTube. This one comes with the Alcoa polished aluminum wheels, and in the front here we have the General Emeritrac TR tires. These are LT-235, 80R17s, and these tires, like I said, are like-new just about all the tread left on them. I would say 90%, 95% of the tread left on those tires. Frame and underbody's got just a little bit of corrosion on it, nothing too bad. This is a one-owner clean title history, clean car fax out of Maryland. Front fender's in excellent condition, didn't see any dents or dings on there, headlight lenses are nice and clear, factory fog lights. Front bumper is in pretty nice shape, does have a couple little touch-up spots on it, but other than that no major dents or dings, and is in really nice shape. You get the chrome-trimmed grille, the hood is in really nice condition as well, I didn't see any dents or dings on there, and you do get the cab lights up top. Passenger side front fender is in excellent shape as well, and the passenger side front wheel, no major scuffs or scrapes on there. Sagebrush Pearl has got a lot of metal flake in it, it's definitely a really cool green color. One of my favorite greens on the Ram trucks, and then you get the white gold on the fenders and lower part of the doors, that's got a lot of metal flake in it as well. You can see just how nice that paint is. As you go down this side of this 2012 Ram 3500 Megacab Dually Laramie Longhorn, take note of how clean that body is, how reflective and mirror-like that paint is. I take these HD videos so if you're far away or even if you're close by and you just cannot make the trip down but you're still interested in purchasing the vehicle, you can see the truck, hear the truck, and have confidence in what you're looking at before you even get here. So when you do get here, there's absolutely no surprises, and you can make a smart and informed buying decision from wherever you're at. If this video helps you make that buying decision, let your salesman know that you saw the video, that it was helpful in that breadth-century. Still has the 3M tape on the Dually tub here and very minimal rock chips or anything on there. Back wheels are in really nice condition as well. Now on the back, we have General Grabber All-Terrain tires, and these are the same size. You can see these tires are brand new, still have the little wear knobs on them. Same in the underbody, much of the same as the front, as all the remaining factory exhaust on there, and all the box rails look really good. Lower rockers and cab corners, no corrosion or anything, and you get the nice factory chrome step bars on there. The only thing I saw to note on the entire Dually tub is there's a little tiny dent there, but other than that, very nice and clean all the way around on this truck. Rear bumper and tailgate are in fantastic condition. You get the rear bumper step, full towing package, of course, with the receiver hitch 4-pin and 7-pin wiring, the backup parking sensors. You do get a very nice ARE truck cap, comes with a spray and bed liner. This one has the winter front in it. The bed itself is in fantastic condition. I didn't see any dents or dings on the box. That spray and bed liner goes onto the tailgate, and just very nice and clean back there. Shuts nice and solidly, and as we go around the driver's side, just as clean as that passenger's side, no dents or dings on this box side. And of course, no def fluid. And for full disclosure, this back wheel is in fantastic condition as well. Those tires are brand new too. Down the rest is side of the truck, cab, and doors all look fantastic. And just really, really nice. Kind of a time capsule, actually. Heated fold-up mirrors. They have built-in directional signals. They fold up like so, and fold in like that. Take a quick look at the back seats. The Laramie Longhorn package gives you the dark brown leather seats back here. These seats are heated on the outboard side. You get the Laramie Longhorn edition patch stitched into the backrest. No rips, no tears, factory all-other floor mat back here. There are your heated seat buttons.  So these mega cabs, they go down two ways. Just the backrest goes down, gives you a nice high load floor. You also get a nice confined storage area back there. There's also bins that you can store stuff in and latch tether anchors. This one does have the power sliding rear window. Really can't believe how nicely equipped this truck is for a 2012. Really got a lot of nice options, and you get a storage bin back there. But the other way these seats go down is they go down completely flat, which is great if you've got pets. They can put both sides down. They've got a nice flat place to lay. Or if you needed to take a nap back here, you definitely could. There's enough space to do that. The all-weather floor mats are in really nice condition back here. Child safety locks on the back doors, and the inside and bottoms of the doors all look fantastic on this truck. These cab corners are in very nice shape. You can see all the rockers. There's no corrosion on them, very, very nice truck here. Here is the VIN sticker. No Canadian trucks here. I'll show you the tire and loading information sticker real quick. Once again, the Laramie Longhorn package gives you the dark brown leather seats. I really like the Longhorn and the King Ranch seats. They definitely get character as they age through wear and everything. You get the light brown piping on there. Very driver's seat with lumbar, factory all-weather format. These front seats are both heated and cooled, which I don't know if 2012 was the first year for cooled seats in these super-duties or heavy-duty trucks or not, but they're cooled, which is cool. Factory brake controller, power pedals, auto headlamps, audio controls on the back of the steering wheel, power windows, locks, and mirrors. You get the woodgrain, the burl woodgrain trim on the doors, which is really good looking. Top and side check out the miles, the radio, and everything that this truck has to offer on the interior. You get that Laramie Longhorn Edition instrument cluster. You can see this truck has 64,014 miles on it, outside temp and compass display. Instrument cluster is very nice and clean. Comes with the heated leather-wrapped steering wheel, cruise controls on the right, Bluetooth and information center controls on the left, audio controls on the back of the steering wheel. Turn dial four-wheel drive, factory navigation system. This is the 430N radio, so there's Highway 41, so you can see that is working nicely. You get AM, FM, and Serious Satellite Radio capabilities, which is really nice. You also have a hard drive in here, which you can save music to, which I always liked on these radios. And you get 20 gigabits worth of storage space for music. Also has the Augs and USB jack right there. And then, yeah, so that's pretty much the whole radio. You can also play CDs on here, and it will play DVDs if you're in park. So that's a really neat system. You also get the Alpine Premium sound system in this truck.  It does have a factory exhaust brake, toll hall mode, hazard lights. That's for your plug-in parking sensors. And then you get the heated and cooled seat buttons and heated steering wheel controls. Here's your automatic shifter on the center console, which was also kind of a rare thing as they all went to the column shifter. You get that cool design on the glove box there and the long horn badge. Your side format and seat are in excellent condition as well. No rips, no tears, smells very clean inside this truck. And the headliners in great shape. You get the power sunroof, map lights, power slide rear window controls, and home link buttons for your garage door security systems and lane systems, and an auto dimming mirror. I honestly am not sure if they offered any other additional options in 2012 to these heavy-duty trucks for RAM. So fully loaded, let's start it up, take a look under the hood. Also once again, look at that steering wheel. There's hardly anywhere on it. Just in really, really nice condition. All right, let's start it up. Well, you can see that design lights up around your battery and oil pressure. But anyways, it starts right up. No check engine lights or anything like that. I would personally like to thank you for checking out the video today. And hopefully from this HD video, you've been able to verify the quality and condition of this truck inside and out. I think it's in really nice condition. All the lights are working nicely, as you can see. Under the hood, we have the 6.7 liter Cummins diesel engine, engine-based, very clean, runs very smooth. Once again, this truck has been fully safe to end, expected by our service shop has a fresh oil and filter change on the fluids having checked and topped off. The lights are doing a nice job holding that hood up. There is the emission sticker. And this truck is 100% ready to go. I would highly recommend it for make quality, condition, options, color, tire, I mean like this thing's in really nice shape and I would highly recommend it for make quality and condition standpoint. And to see more pictures of this truck or one of other 550 new and used cars, SCVs, minivans, Wranglers, halftones, three quarter tons, one tons, you name it, we got to go to the website right there, summitauto.com, full pictures and descriptions of every single vehicle all at summitauto.com. If you'd like to check out more HD videos, go to youtube.com slash summitauto, click the bell notifications, get updates on the videos I do each and every day and have access to one of the largest catalogs of vehicle walk-arounds on YouTube. In fact, in a second, you'll see a link to subscribe to my YouTube channel on the upper left. A link to all the Ram 3500 truck videos I've ever done in the upper right. A link to this vehicle on our website while it lasts in the lower left. Any link to this vehicle or a link to one of our latest YouTube videos in the lower right. Click those, check us out. We're super excited to help you with this ultra clean 2012 Ram 3500 mega cab short box dually Laramie Longhorn and Sagebrush Pearl over light gold and metal. Thanks again for checking out the video. Remember to like, subscribe, and share on the YouTube channel. I really appreciate it. Thanks again.


Today I wanna talk to you about disruption. Disruption in your life, the good and the negative. Disruption is needed. I just wanna say thank you for having me. I love this space, Automotive. Our solar guys here, you guys rocked in quick. That was amazing, you guys doing well. Thank you, Andy and Jacqueline, for allowing me to close out this seminar. This is my first seminar where I'm actually closing it out and then going into a little 15 minute negotiation. Say thank you to my wife for 24 years in the Automotive industry. I spent 20 years in this business. And today I wanna talk to you about disruption. Disruption in your life, the good and the negative. Cause disruption is needed, okay? A little bit about myself. Disruptive years, how many of you right now can raise your hand and say we've had disruptive years in your life? The major one that sticks with me like that, you're honest with yourself. So those of you that did not raise your hand, you're living a mundane life in my opinion.  Probably have the blanket over yourself, living a nine to five lifestyle, you're not putting yourself out there.  And it was through a home invasion, a home invasion. Men and women, men and women kicked in the door, calling themselves sheriffs.  I held him until he died. That was 1998. Seven months later, it's 1999. The boy that I ran with, the three of us, my buddy was paralyzed. He had a motorcycle accident, a back tire coming off a triple berm, he was racing.  So in two years, roughly about seven months apart, I knew massive disruption. And they say the only time in your life that you're going to go through things to retain new information is to have disruption happen in your life, because therefore it opens you to take on new information. Well, my new information was a negative one. When I get close to something, I lose it. I would tell myself that. His death was my fault. If I would have been at that race, I was supposed to be racing that night. I couldn't get the night off. I wasn't there. I'm supposed to be with him side by side on that track. Okay, the next disruption for me, 2015. My son was on the open heart surgery table twice. Almost died the second time. And I lost all control of myself.  So for 20 years now, I'm almost in the auto, 15 years at this point, I'm in the automotive industry. My 20s and 30s, amazing, man, I crushed it. I did well, I made a lot of money. I stacked a fortune, got homes, cars. My wife was with me the entire time. I didn't have your typical issues in the automotive industry from the drinking, the drugs. I drank, I had good times, I partied. I was young, but I didn't have disruption like I did in 2015. In 2015, my son, I couldn't bear his pain. I wanted his pain. I wanted it with everything that I had in my life, okay? And I cracked. I cracked emotionally. I cracked physically. I turned to drugs and alcohol to the hardest level. Drinking, pills, cocaine. For three and a half years, I went through savings. My wife was unaware, gambling problems. Wasn't shown up in my life, wasn't shown up in my home. And then the next disruptive state for me was 2019, when my wife and my daughter, my daughter actually, comes up to me and says, Dad, I need you to leave. She was 16. She was, I need you to leave. I need you to go get help. And that day, well, about a week later, after a bender, drinking and drugs, my wife packed her bags and walked out. I made a decision three days after that to change my life forever and recreate. I went into a visualization state. Massive disruption. I had all the information.  People say you care so much with your heart because I've had my heart bleeding for a lot of my life, but I used to associate it with anything that comes good into me, I can't retain it. I'm not built for it. Everything goes away. In 2019, I wrote down who I wanted to become, what I wanted to do, and I have it written down on a sheet and it's total of 36 pages. This new man, this new version of myself to recreate, become elite. I wrote down the boss that I would go to work for because I'm back. I quit drinking and drugs overnight, no rehab. It was intense, an intense seven days of a calm down and getting back to myself, finding myself, reading, going into a zone that I had never known that I could be a part of. And in that space, I wrote down, if I showed you it, I wrote down who I would work for, what I would represent, how I would go into the automotive industry and completely disrupt it. If I gave you that piece of paper right now to read, you would say it is anti-aliot. In 2019, I met anti-aliot in November. This is seven months after sobriety. I watched them for two months and in 2020, I reached out. Our mission began. I want you to write this down. The temporary pain that you go through, if you get through it, that's who you can find who you can become. That's how you find who you can become. The world will never give you more than you can handle and if she does, she will kill you. So your stress and your inability to change is a bulls*** lie you tell yourself because you're comfortable staying where you are instead of the adversity of the unknown. Not knowing where it could take you. How many of you right here struggle? Who are you gonna be real with yourself for? How many of you have struggles in your life? I have struggles, the aliens have struggles, this tribe has struggles, but we have bonded together to form a tribe and a unity through a movement. There's about 200 people in this room. And they said that 2%, four of you send up, please Charlie, send up, Armando, stand up too, you send up, please. And you young man, stand up. 2% of this room, they say will surprise us. That's it, these four. Let's say hypothetically, look around. These four are gonna surprise us.    The rest of your life, where you are, the pain, the insignificance, how you feel about your last name, 98%.  That's what they tell us, why? Because not a significant disruption comes into your life for you to wanna make the change. Everybody can sit down. Thank you for that. Does that make sense? Does that make, is that clear for you guys? Is that something that you wanna hold on to? No, you wanna be the 2%, why does this tribe, how does Andy Elliott train 350,000 men and women? Why do 98% stick rate with us? Because we have a tribe, we're a movement. We move together, we flow together. Danny Klein, come up here please. Jacob Haggerman, come up here please. I'm gonna get some water real quick. I'm gonna show you what proximity looks like. I don't have a lot of time, so I'm rushing. These two right here, these two young men, find them on Facebook. Jacob Haggerman, Danny Klein. These are my first two hires. I hire them for their potential. I was the director for Claire, I was the first one. I love it, he always loves saying that. So when I wanna talk about change, 2%, how do you become the 2%? One, you have to envision it. Two, you have to write it down. You have to get visual with the process. So we're gonna go over that, the proximity. Okay, here in a minute. Proximity with each other. These are the first two hires that I brought aboard in Oklahoma. I came to Oklahoma, they change. If you look them up on Facebook, who they've become is absolute savage warriors, elite sales professionals to serve you at the highest level. They're part of the tribe, they're part of the movement, they're part of the culture moving forward. This is a vision that Andy Elliott had. When I first met Andy, guys, take off, thank you. When I first met Andy, I moved to Oklahoma and I bring into him a training platform. I come to Andy to train.  I came up and I showed up onto his doorstep with 230 pounds, a man completely vulnerable, broken, rock bottom, took a jackhammer and I dug myself a deeper hole before I finally said, dude, I'm done with this. I didn't know where to go, I did not know what to do, but I knew I wanted change. I knew I had enough disruption in my life to where I knew what I wanted. And when I told him my story, I told it to Jacqueline Elliott, I gave it all to him.  I wanted to find truth in myself. I wanted to find a visualization on who I could become and I wanted to know if I could get a chance, get an opportunity to serve you all at the highest level. When Andy showed me his vision, he had a course that was 29 bucks at the time. He's building courses, he's building his automotive sales training and I said I wanted and he goes, not interested, I'm not hiring. I wanted a chance to become part of something special. This is the movement that he envisioned. He has it written down, his wife has it written down, this is written down, this was visualized. Their first seminar was December. I don't remember how many people showed up, 20, 25 people.   They won't show up.  He goes, well I'm not training car salesmen. I'm training automotive business professionals. And when they sat me down at that table that day and they said hey, do you wanna go to war with us? I said absolutely, I started bawling, I lost myself because he hired me for my potential. Not who I was. The man I was was broken, frail. I had lost my confidence. I had buried myself into the ground and I raised my hand and I said I want out man. I wanna change, I'll give you my heart, I'll give you my soul, do anything you ask me to. I will back your name, I will be legitimate for you, I will be honorable in business. And he said I need a man to go to war with me. Jacqueline signed off on the hire. I went home to Oklahoma and I said baby, we're moving to, I went home to California and I said Jennifer, my wife of 24 years, said we're moving to Oklahoma to go to partnership with Andy Elliott and she said we need to talk about this. I said we just did, pack your bags. I knew what I needed. There was no option for her, there was no talking. I knew what I had and I knew where I needed to go.  I am close with Andy every single day. Every single day he asks me did you go to the gym if we don't go to the gym together? Did you study? Did you train? Did you reach out to your GMs? Did you reach out to your people? Are you taking the calls that you need to call? Are you on the Zoom calls? We are in proximity. Our coaches right here, everybody look right here. See these men and women in the black shirt? The Macklins and the cute oranges. They walked around today looking like a, I don't even know what it's called, a golf ball on a driving range. That's our team. Okay, that's our proximity. We're together seven days a week. We go to church together. People call us a cult. We're not a cult. We built culture around team and unity and faithfulness and honor. You can build this at your dealerships and if you can't, you build it within yourselves and then you become the leader. How do you become a leader? You set the example. Who here can set an example of themselves by getting up in the morning, doing the right things, honoring themselves, honor their relationship, honor their spouse? Who can build culture by becoming a leader? Once you do that, you become the example. If you just do the work. Once you become the example, you become the leader. Once you become the leader, it becomes infectious. They gravitate to you. How many people right now lead by example? We need more hands. You are needed. People walk around saying, we need to wake up the sheep. We need to wake up the sheep. No, we need to wake up the lions. We need to wake up the lions in this room. We need to go to war together. You need to be in close proximity to us. You need to stay close to us. Some of you are new. You're new to, this is your first seminar. You've been training with Andy for a week and you question things. Like this is not for me. This is crazy. This is intense. If you want the lifestyle that we designed for ourselves, you are gonna have to become obsessed. You're gonna have to stay in close proximity to Andy and Jacqueline. My marriage was on the rocks.  I need one more time, Jennifer. I beg you one more time and you gotta move to Oklahoma. She's like, all right, you're crazy, let's go. And we did it. He ground me into the ground. He made me puke, he made me cry. She was not, actually she's harder than he is. And they built my wife up. My wife now works for Jacqueline directly. She's lost 65 pounds since being side by side with Jacqueline. That is proximity, thank you. Thank you. She's watching virtually right now. And this is our standard. That's the standard you have to set. So now you know you're in close proximity. You have a coach. How many of you have a designated coach within the Elliott Group right now? If you do not, you need to reach out to me. You need to reach out to the coaches.  If you come partner with me, I'll just be very straightforward with you.   And we will go build together. I'm the oldest one in the group. Thank you, I appreciate that. But it's real. New young guys, new relationships, new money, branding, opportunity.  We have a group of men and women that you can stay in proximity with because we align. We're different in our ages and in our era and in our times and what we want in this life. I don't want security. I'll risk it all again. But I will not let my wife down. I will not let my people down. I will not let the aliens down. And you stay in close proximity to us. Your life will change forever. But most people, here's what's gonna happen.  You're not gonna have the perseverance to do it. You won't live in a state of gratitude like we ask you to. And then when someone mocks you, makes funny, you're gonna be like, yeah, you're right. I don't need to be doing this.  Or you look at yourself right now and write a couple of things down. Number one, what is your standard? What is your standard? Andy has a very high standard. If we mess up the man's standard, which is number one, we do not do business honorably with you individually. You have a shitload of problems to deal with and it's not pretty. If we lie to you, which we do not, if we tell you we're gonna be somewhere and we're not there, if we schedule a Zoom call and we don't show up and you get back to that man, it's over. You have to have a very serious talk of why you lied because there's a standard. If you say you're going to do it, you will show up in all areas of your life for my people. This has never been done before. Automotive sells professionals, Automotive sells, write it down, Automotive sells professionals and you will graduate to Automotive business professionals. This has never been done.  You love your person? Take care of them. Take them to the highest level with you. Elevate the game and the standard. So a couple of things we do with our standards. We pick a time. What time do we have time for us first to live in gratitude? That's in the morning. First thing you do, how many of you get up 30 minutes before work? Raise your hand. Stop it. 30 minutes before work, you're not giving yourself enough time to breathe. Two hours, that's great. 30 minutes before work, so you're flying out of bed, putting your clothes on, doing your hair and you're flying to work.  You have no game plan, you have no design. Number two, you're gonna be honorable in business.  That'll align with you. How many of you guys promise something? You forget to put it on the do bill and then you sidestep it? Raise your hand. Oh my, come on, don't lie to me now. Come on.  Number three, you show up in a lot of your life.  That is the standard you need to be living by. So if you stay close in proximity with us, with the Elliott group, your coaches, those of you that do not have a coach, get with us. Those of you that did not sign up for the Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday call, Wednesday is my hour. Tuesday is with Ian and Evan Macklin on branding, coaching, high level negotiations as well. And then Andy goes over mindset and closing in negotiations as well on Monday. That is your proximity. That is who you can become. And that is the way of the Elliott group. This is a tribe of men and women. A movement being pushed to the 21st century. Now if you align with us, you stay with us. No matter what comes against you, we will be there for you. And that's the movement. Everybody stand up for me and I'll wrap this up for you. You guys ready for this? But I need to hear it loud. Welcome to the tribe. First we're gonna say it. We say one tribe. Louder, one tribe. One tribe. One tribe. One tribe. One mission. One mission. One vision. One vision. That's the Elliott group, my brothers and sisters. Thank you for your time. We love you all.


Welcome back to Tennis Talk, my name's Cam Williams and the ex-husband of Simona Halep, the recent ex-husband of Simona Halep has come out and spoken about this doping suspension that his ex-wife has been given over the last 24 hours, and it's interesting to see what he has to say. He's actually brought out a pretty big statement. Let's go have a read of it. So this is what the Halep's ex-husband had to say. I'm shocked. I haven't recovered for an hour. I'm shocked and shocked again. I cannot believe that. I've known Simona for three years, of which at least two in the circuit, and I swear to you that this girl, my ex-wife, is obsessed with one thing, honor. You can take anything from Simona, but if you take away her honor, her fairness, you kill her. She's no longer human. I don't know what happened there with that test, but it's probably a mistake. Simona would not have done such a thing, even if you have to cut off her hand to stop playing tennis. Simona Halep would never cheat. Her career is her shield, and I know her best. You know very well that I just finished the divorce. I could have said no comment. There is no way I would do such a thing when I know this woman so well. When I have been with her for so many years, Simona was obsessed with not making mistakes. I'll tell you something for the first time. She never even drank water if the bottle was not sealed. She unsealed it with her hand. She was always careful. I'll tell you something else. She did not take even one vitamin C without asking her doctor. She is obsessed with fairness. There you have it. Strong words from her ex-husband. And like you said, he didn't have to come out and say anything about the situation because they are getting divorced, but he's very supportive of her and very, very adamant that she is not cheating, and she has never cheated, and she never would cheat, and believes this is a full mistake. So let me know down in the comments below what do you think about the response from her ex-husband. It's pretty telling, and you would have thought that anyone who would know best would be the person closest to her over the last couple of years being her husband. And I guess it's good for Halep as well because of that endorsement from someone so close to her who you know really knew her inside and out and all her routines over the last couple of years on tour. So there it is. Ex-husband's come out in full support of Simone Halep, but let me know down in the comments below. What do you reckon about the situation now?


Don't you press every day that don't do what you think. These were deactivated in the 90s when the ADA stipulated that elevators had to be open long enough for everyone to get in. Many office and hotel room thermostats can't go outside a set range, or are not even connected at all. The vast majority of these were disabled when computer-controlled traffic became the norm. That said, you might be waiting quite a while if you get the very rare one that still works.


My name is Karen Hines and I'm the mental health and well-being lead at the Birkenberg School in Tavlin, Reekon. What was the idea you wanted to share today? We do an awful lot with mental health and well-being but one of the things that we've done is that's been incredibly successful is the work that we've done with our student well-being mentors. We are in our third year with our well-being mentors now and we've attached them to our small schools. So we have a small school system and the schools might call that a house system. And our student well-being mentors are attached to a small school. So if a student comes in in the morning and they're upset about something like homework or something that's fairly easy to rectify, our student well-being mentors will go and will work with that individual student. They're attached to specific students that they work with every day. They have supervision once a fortnight with the small schools and they are really part of that small school team. They are the fourth layer of that small schools team and that's worked really well for us. What's been the impact of that? What's happened as a result of that system? As a result of that, small schools find that students that have just got an issue with maybe they feel a little bit awkward telling their teacher they couldn't finish their homework or that type of thing. They will find their well-being mentor and we've had well-being mentors certainly year 10 and 11 go with younger year 7 and 8 students to find a member of staff and say, look Sir, can I just start this conversation? This student has struggled to let you know that things like sitting at the back and they can't hear. Just that sort of thing that they perhaps need a little bit of support with to do if they want to do it themselves, they just want a little bit of support. Those sort of things and also students that are anxious about coming into school they can be met at receptions by a well-being mentor taken to their CLL group. So those things that maybe historically a member of staff would have done appear mentor because they understand the situation themselves, they might have been there themselves. All our well-being mentors are specifically chosen and most of them have had an issue in the past that means that we feel that they're really empathetic to the students' needs. So we carefully choose our well-being mentors. Sounds fantastic and what would be your kind of top tip to someone who maybe wanted to do this and they weren't quite sure, maybe they're worried about the load on the student who's the mentor or something like that. Okay, well we've been really lucky. All our well-being mentors are trained by a campus mental health nurse practitioner. If you can get an external trainer like that obviously that's absolutely fantastic and that link is brilliant for us. But if not, I think basically making sure that you've got some really specific ground rules all of our mental health, every student is attached to a staff mental health well-being mentor. So we have staff mentors as well. They can go to them at any time. If they're on a drop-in duty then that member of staff knows they are and if there are any issues at all they can go to that member of staff straight away during that lunchtime and we make sure that they have full nightly supervision. It takes 10 minutes and I think it's really, really important. Reassured everyone. Fantastic. Thank you so much for sharing, really appreciate it.


I'm really pleased here to announce Oskar Kuro, I pronounce as well. Yes. Oskar is working at KPN, at the Department of CISO, the Chief Information Security Office. Yes, and in there he's responsible for the technology, strategy and policy. He works a lot with open source stuff, but I understood he's always, you know, you'll know that being corporate environments, there are things that you discuss really in a certain way. And other things keep dark matter. But I think he's going to reveal something that shows you that dark matter really matters. Yeah. One applause for him. Please, enjoy. First off, I'm not going to talk off or on behalf of my company. This is a slide deck that I've created myself, so disclaimer, disclaimer. I will only speak about generic problems that exist in all kinds of service providers and infrastructural providers. So you might see things that come along and see and look at the same or have a relationship with what my company is doing. But this is a very generic talk about the technology itself and what can actually come towards these kinds of infrastructural service providers. Playing defense is very complicated. There's a lot of details that go into playing the defense. And one of the things that the service providers and infrastructural providers actually should think about as a baseline is that it's not a question. If you get hacked, but when? A lot of infrastructural providers don't actually take this past year. I think it's a bit of an old fashioned thing that everything should be secured from the get go. Unfortunately, reality kicks in or should kick in sometime and people will get hacked or get a problem to solve. There's a wide variety of attackers that could actually get towards or play around with your infrastructure. You can think of the individual hacker or has a personal motivation to just discover or run a muck or whatever positive or negative. That's not really relevant. To the infrastructural provider, it is of interest. What does actually happen to the service?  We've seen this here on the field itself. If you play around with some of the APIs that are open on our field and through the wireless infrastructure, accidentally provided, you can actually make the things go boom, reboot or something else. If this happens in a real-life environment or in a bigger infrastructure, small problems could actually turn into a big massive effect. Then again, then you have the hacktivists and the hacktivists obviously have a different motivation to hack. We've seen this in 2003 where the DDoS has happened on two infrastructural providers for banks to make a statement. If you cut off the financial lines towards, in that case, WikiLeaks, you will be triggering some kind of effect. In this case, the effect was in the form of a DDoS attack, volumetric attacks, just to flood the pipelines and no activities could actually emerge from those links anymore. It might look like just the front page is not active or not available anymore, but the biggest problem could actually be that something more actually happened when you DDoS the front website because they share infrastructure, because they share the same pipeline, they share the same VLANs perhaps or something else, and these are viable simple effects. Then you've got the cybercrime. These guys just have money in their minds and they will actually try to hack an infrastructure or a service provider for premium services or for other kinds of services, whatever they offer, whatever is of their interest. They could just use your machine for Bitcoin mining or gain access to a Bitcoin mining facility and get all the goods whatever they want. Then you've got the state actor, a very complicated attacker. They have a lot of time, they've got a lot of resources and they can do a lot. They can also influence your supply chain and in that case, all bets are off because if they influence the supply chain, you definitely have a problem already before even you installed the server. That's a very complicated attacker to actually deal with. There are ways of doing this, but it takes quite some effort to get all the supply chain problems into your hands and have a lot of reliable steps after that and procedures in place to actually deal with those kinds of attackers. You see an interesting trend in the cybercrime activities. Also, you see an interesting change into what normal people can actually achieve onto your infrastructure. Individual script kitties could actually launch a very significant flood and have a very interesting effect on your infrastructure. This can make it so that the service providers or the customers of a service provider actually get into the news because there was a breakage of some kind. Obviously, the simple statement that they make is the infrastructure was hacked or the bank was hacked while it wasn't really hacked. It was just occupied with all kinds of other activities. Thank you. The criminals who use digital infrastructure seem to be of a very diffuse range. You have the petty thieves that just want to use simple tools to gain a foothold in your infrastructure and use it for different ways like sending spam, use open relays or do all kinds of other simple things. But the other side of the range of the digital criminal is just organized crime. They are very organized. They have means of getting activities spun up by technical people. They buy exploits. They use exploits. They get people into their community and actually start out to be of equal quality what nascent states could actually do depending on how much time and effort or what kind of goods they can actually achieve and want to achieve. The downside is that sometimes you see that these prices for DDoS attacks go down. This even is an old slide. Prices are down, but the fun part is not everybody is actually paying any money because the DDoS providers, the Buddha server providers will just have you use a test account. You can use a DDoS attack for just five to ten minutes to test and see if the infrastructure of the DDoS facility is functioning according to specs of the buyer. If you are a student and you do not have any money or if you are not even working yet, you can actually look on these kinds of pages, get a free test account and with the free testing facility you can already run amok on a service provider because they will test that you can actually send five to ten or more gigabits a second towards an infrastructure for just a few minutes. If you are on the response team side of a service provider, this means while at a time that you realize that the monitoring is spiking up and you are making the calls, we need to do stuff, it might already be gone. So it is a very volatile attack. But on the other hand it is also very fluent and can actually move away very quickly. So the prices might be low, but not everybody is actually using this en masse. The testing accounts is actually the things that people are using because then you get a new email address and you test again. And students might actually do this on their own school because they don't want to make an exam. This has happened, this has reached the news even and the service provider is picking up the pieces and needs to do stuff to keep its own infrastructure and other customers available. As a service provider you see also a big change in the attack service. On the one side we have a 19 inch rack facility in data centers but nowadays we see an expansion of the responsibilities of infrastructure into people's homes. People know about all the smart TVs and all the smart facilities but if you are part of the infrastructure providing a video system or settle boxes or routers or other facilities or even an integrated... interesting... or even an integrated solution with webcams and an entire service around that that means that you now just moved your service not just from a telco perspective or service provider but into people's homes. So now you have a responsibility also to take care of the other side of the network which is just attached to yours. You didn't have any responsibility there. Legally wise this is very interesting. You are now already by an okay of the user and acceptance of the user already present in their homes and if your devices get hacked you are responsible... you have a responsibility due to the duty of care rules at least in this country to attain and service these boxes. This is something that we haven't seen before. This will happen more often but luckily we do have all kinds of security measures in place but not everybody has it and we've seen that for instance with the MIRAE effect. This is one of the... this was earlier this year where the MIRAE botnet and made use of webcams and webcams are these days pretty powerful devices. Some of the webcams can actually do 4K video quality or HD. So there is quite some CPU power available and these are very very problematic effects. You have now entered this problem that you are perhaps responsible for the devices or a service around devices created by a manufacturer on the eastern side of the world and in that case and there they have a different quality setting and perhaps you didn't pay attention to the quality of the devices that you've integrated into several services and then this might be the effect that you are now part of the problem because of a low standard of security request to the vendor. This is something that happens a lot. It becomes a bit more dangerous if the same effect happens when it's slightly closer to your heart. In the healthcare industry you see a lot of developments where the service providers are moving into the healthcare activities and make devices for doctors. So the doctors can actually read out Bluetooth low energy equipped pacemakers and make a quality scan and upload the scan or if they have a status scope and the status scope measurements or just measuring your heart and those measurements can also go towards an infrastructure. Now it might always be enclosed and very secure but there's always a moment in time where you fly or you transport your data from the device, from the equipment over the internet or if you are in an enclosed environment it is just that you have a separate offline or it's not really offline but you have your own little network environment this is also possible but the thing is if these kinds of measurements and data fly over the internet what kind of protocol is being used? I've seen devices that were first introduced and used FTP. Think about it, this is technology from the 70s going into your high-tech quality new modern device. A practitioner has a cool new device created in 2016 and can now measure heart rate information uploaded to a service and that service keeps track of the patient's information or can put it back into the patient's file. Now the back-end part can be fully secured because of all the regulations but what you don't always see is what happened with the device towards the infrastructure and unfortunately the oldest protocols are the easiest to implement so you'll see a lot of recurring problems in the newest devices that you see so if you measure them, if you break them open if you actually look inside what's going on in this particular device you might actually have a new problem introduced in the newest device. You also have new developments of infrastructure and service providers moving into a totally new field something that people call either smart cities although there's a bit of a misnomer there are two types of explanations for the word smart cities you've got smart cities where these kinds of interactive moving devices are happening and the other is processing of big data with multiple stakeholders and multiple organizations into one field I'm now focusing on all the smart stuff that actually has interesting things like this what you see here on the picture is just is that the vehicles can talk to each other but what kind of protocols are they actually using here? Again, it becomes very interesting it looks very modern, it looks very sexy but what kind of technology is actually behind this? I'm going to go into that in a few seconds this is a picture of a cow this is the connected cow what you can see here is a band, a necklace on the cow and the cow is connected to a LoRa network low energy high range and it measures what the temperature is of the cow where the cow is located on the field so if you have a huge field now you actually know where the cow is or if she went off field where she went farmers are an interesting set of people where they want to do as much as possible with the least amount of humans so technology moved into farming quite early you've already perhaps know about the earrings that you see on cows those are forbidden if I'm not mistaken due to regulations against animal harm but those already had barcodes and this was in the 90s so now this moved up into NFC chips and now we've got LoRa chips so they don't even have to pass anywhere they just are connected as a hive in a kettle there are different ways of connecting all these kinds of examples you've got Wi-Fi, you've got 5G coming up 5G has a specific low energy spec specifically for a uptake of roughly 40 billion 60 billion devices around the planet in a couple of years at least that's the prospect if I'm not mistaken it was 2025 for that kind of number so there's a huge amount of 5G devices that will move into the IoT devices because now you have the freedom of a phone but now into your fridge or whatever there are different types of Wi-Fi we see the traditional ones that we have on our laptops but there's also another spec and LoRa is also very upcoming and the low energy and the cost efficiency of LoRa makes it very easy to implement the Bluetooth we already saw and obviously we still have old school Ethernet still in all kinds of devices let's dive into the Wi-Fi this is a spec that not everybody knows this is 802.11P my laptop does A, N, B, G yeah I don't have AC unfortunately not on this device and this is the wave spec wireless access in vehicular environments and what you see on this picture is that there is a car and it might be connected over 4G or directly through this wireless protocol which is more or less like a peer-to-peer wireless protocol between the car and the traffic light so the traffic light works we now have a fast binding connection and with that you can send data to the traffic light one of the purpose is for flow control with cars if you have a traffic light and a certain moment of the day you have a cool configuration where everything is flowing efficiently but when traffic jams start and when you have the rush hour time suddenly you have to shift the traffic lights differently and now you can actually interactively speak from your car to the traffic light which obviously is a pass-through to another infrastructure that actually makes the decision then it moves down and gives a hint that at least there's one car, two cars, five cars or whatever or if you're a truck then you have huge occupants and it will tell the dimensions of the truck to the traffic lights so that they know that this truck will take two spaces and there's obviously a priority queue for police and for ambulances so that the green traffic lights will flow perfectly for them why is this relevant especially for the priority devices? Each and every manufacturer of a traffic light system has a different protocol related to canvas or varieties of this on the inside to actually shift it so if you want to have a green flowing environment like okay I've got three traffic lights connected to each other you can chain them up and make a flow of green lights if you stick to the 50 kilometer speed limit unfortunately this only works for one fender and for one installation so now you have the freedom of having this interconnectivity between all the traffic lights and smart traffic throughout the entire country if you wish to do so also if there is a collision somewhere you can actually get a hint that the collision happened further away obviously 4G, nice I mean the 4G protocol good luck with cracking that one that's still a bit big problem if all the specs are implemented properly I must add to that because otherwise 4G can be vulnerable too but in most cases it's not so much but now you have a very open protocol that can speak 802.11p but yeah I could perhaps fake five cars 10, 20, 100 and influence the traffic light in the way that I want so I always want to have a green light I also get annoyed if I stand there too long or perhaps I want to play an ambulance so security in this system is very relevant because it could actually mean that traffic jams could increase or even collisions could actually be triggered by it because if you switch too fast between red and green or you influence it wrongly you still have and require all kinds of control systems so this is getting pretty cool first demonstration is already live in the Netherlands with this system but then only over the 4G not the 802.11p but that will be more scalable and will be rolled out in the coming few years when they actually finish the specification because the specification for this on how the traffic light should actually communicate behind the scenes is partially developed partially not we move up to another protocol Lora or Lora1 because Lora is just a short name long range wide area network if you look at the components on the left hand side you see pads and water meters and vending machines and those can be connected to a gateway to the wireless gateway and it doesn't really matter how the traffic then is moved forward but then it moves into a network service and then towards an application server the actual customer of a group of Lora devices is at the application server it's their application server so you see three application servers in this example this means three typically three different customers so Lora is significantly different than 5G and other IP related protocols because there's a Lora protocol with more or less like MAC addresses so it's something like a layer 2, layer 3 network that Lora is composed of it has encryption on two levels you've got a network infrastructural provider protection which protects you from the end nodes to the base stations so it's encrypted with a key of the telecommunications provider that actually provides this infrastructure unfortunately the spec does allow like in other standards and specs that this is optional turned on so if you look at one country's installation or one company's installation of Lora it might be secured and encrypted or not secured it depends on what the infrastructure provider is willing to do with Lora then per application you can have your own application key app key and this may scope the encryption between the devices that you have like if you want to have all your refrigerators from your company be managed over Lora you can have one key for those and one key for the others now this already resulted into another problem key sharing and key management if one of the refrigerators is hacked all refrigerators are hacked so then you can influence the encryption and therefore run amok and play around with all the devices the solution is pretty heavy each and every device will have its own unique key this requires key management it's a lot of upkeep for the infrastructure provider but also for the user this can all be pasted away behind an API but that's what's really running behind the API so if you really want to attack a Lora device without hacking the Lora network with a software defined radio and running amok and you have to have a Lora installation which is not encrypted the biggest attack surface is actually at the application server because that is talking HTTP, HTTPS, APIs, REST APIs or a SOAP API to interact with devices with the infrastructure so if you want to attack or secure an environment then well Lora is pretty secure to be honest but you have to take care about the application server because that's taking the control over your devices so what you have to do is you have to match the freedom of using APIs and using this type of environment and be as reliable towards the customer and the user base as possible this means that you really need to work on hardening the devices and the infrastructure that actually is composing the upkeeping and working with the devices so this goes into the software and the hardware of the IoT devices that you put in the field and then you have to think about okay but what kind of security benchmark am I using here? A fridge is significantly different than a car but they might use the same protocol underneath what type of methods can we share? There are a lot of experiences with subtle boxes for many years and also with routers where they disable or remove certain control pins or management pins I think this community is mostly aware about the existence of certain pins and certain pieces of the electronic boards that actually can reappear and reemerge the serial interface to a device if you have the serial interface to the device you can actually gain access to a console and from the console you can actually play around with the device yourself and hopefully if you want to be depending on what your role is interact with the device in new ways that the infrastructure provider wasn't really thinking of yet like also reflashing the entire images on it and repurpose your device for something completely different which is cool on one hand unless you are the infrastructure provider and you had a hope that the device kept some keys or needed to secure materials whatever it is, identities, APIs, whatever and want to enclose this so this is why infrastructure providers make it in some cases very hard for you to open up a box or interact with the box remove pins not have any emergency repair opportunities or serial interfaces they would probably remove the entire UARTs for this and just send you a new box because that's cheaper but also better for the security of the infrastructure itself so that can also be a motivation on why we just do a device swap or somebody does a device swap and not fix the device might have multiple reasons obviously it's very important that you also secure the APIs and there are API fuzzers for this and you can use tools fortunately enough a lot of protocols are now moving towards HTTP or HTTPS based so a lot of the similar fuzzers that you use for normal websites and normal APIs can actually be used now to secure lots of these IoT devices yourself another detail or totally different angle is there's a push from the EU to think and actually supply device support statements what can a user actually expect on the support for a device if I talk to my wife or anybody else then what's expected from a dishwasher or washing machine you should have at least five to ten years of service or something else for a car that's even longer there are some cars here running around who are still from the 60s, 40s, whatever and is that something that we need to keep supporting for the end of days or when do we stop and how do we tell this to the user this is something that looks like just put it down somewhere but if you take a bad example like Apple for instance who makes a statement of well you have to have additional support if you want to have anything beyond the first year this is against EU law so okay we solve that problem but you only have typical one year everything goes support if you would do a similar thing with a dishwasher and just say okay you only have the support for the first three years or five years then yeah that might be not the thing that you want if the thing breaks down or the service board, the motherboard breaks down right after that different companies take different approaches if I look at my Samsung 46 inch TV features are dropping off per firmware update there are all kinds of features in it and because of the backend infrastructure that needs to be provided at some moment in time some of the APIs will just drop off so my device does not have the ability to tweet anymore I didn't use it but I can't do it again I can't even start doing it while it was on the box as a feature several other video systems and so on are also removed from that device it's a strategy that works and suddenly my smart TV went into a more or less smart TV with slightly cool features but not that much anymore as it was in the beginning so if you don't update it it'll just give you errors on the functionality that were dropped off I'm not really sure what will happen with a dishwasher or a car sorry you can't turn left or I don't know another nice problem that you see on the infrastructure side is how to deal with cryptography developments and we have a lot of talks especially in this community about the developments of cryptography and when certain technologies and methods are not to be used anymore how do you deal with that? you have to deal with crypto agility that really means that you can just update your software or move to a new technology it becomes a bit hard when the technology is that huge overly huge difference or uses more CPU load because it assumes that you moved your hardware with the time and developments of these new methods and technology but perhaps this is not possible in IoT devices a lot of these methods are actually baked into hardware not with nice FPGAs but in hardware itself so if you would ever switch from triple desk or from AES in some time in the future a lot of devices will just have a huge problem because it might actually be baked in the hardware and that was your only technology method that was ever possible you have to swap the motherboard to actually make a change to this so in the future when RSA would be well not so much cracked by theory but quantum computers would be a commodity device let's assume the future is 2025, 2030, 2035 whatever the date is is not so relevant on when the computer quantum computer would emerge but certain technologies would be useless but if you cannot update them you have to throw them away and if this is very relevant to a company that uses these kinds of devices for whatever security measure then it's certainly you have a problem another thing is obviously the trust models how do you deal with fleet control? how do you control them? you have to interact with them sometimes they are offline sometimes they are online what type of technology can you use? what if the technology that you use is going bad as well? and how do you set up a device? the device just got unwrapped you put it on you put it on power it starts, it boots how does the infrastructure know what type of device it is? while you perhaps didn't have any moment in time before this to enable this device into your network so bootstrapping these devices is a complicated thing an example here is written down so this is a recurring pattern that you see in all kinds of services so you have the first stage you don't have a proficient device it becomes all active it discovers the infrastructure on where it is it starts out sending a DHCP request so it could be a completely different technology and does more or less the same functionality it gets an ID and additional information from the infrastructure to do next like a pixie boot or do something else and based on markers which might actually be pretty predictable like MAC addresses, device IDs it starts booting up it moves into a different stage often not used is a hardware enclave which basically means there was already crypto material from the available from the industry and supply chain this is something that you could do with SIM cards for instance SIM cards are actually smart cards they actually have keys in them the secure keys came from a manufacturer in a secure facility and then you have to control over the supply chain again and a unique ID that can even be challenged and checked because if this cannot be challenged and checked you can spoof it if you can spoof it everybody can fake that this device can play around perhaps with the fridge of your neighbor after this you have the provisioning stage and then the application starts working with the secrets that it shoved around and suddenly something else happens and you move into the next stage so if you think about it the application data is actually protected by the application boot process in the integrity control that went into this which started out with the provisioning that might be a dodgy implementation so you can actually if you can influence the provisioning stage you can influence the application boot and what kind of activity is going on on the device and the application data itself so you can look at it like okay it's a bit of a complicated problem then how do you solve this well unfortunately there are a lot of open questions here also in the sense of accountability what is to be accountable for the service provider and for how long and the end user just doesn't really care it just say well I desire and I want to have my product and use it as it was actually sent to me and it's an interesting statement obviously it still works on touch I already mentioned that the key management is a very complicated problem I would like to introduce the crypto turtle approach I don't know if you know it's turtles all the way down statements if not look on Wikipedia it's an interesting story where you see the following pattern happening that if you have a key to secure or to manage because you have encrypted data you want to encrypt the data you have to deal with the key now but if you do it properly you would have the key on an encrypted storage device now how do you encrypt the storage device you yet again have a new key and how do you deal with that key and then if you just use it with just solve it with technology and don't stop somewhere and make it a procedural problem because people make it a procedural problem after this you will have turtles all the way down this key is protected by this key protected by this key and it all runs amok you can see this happening in databases and hardware security modules and if you secure everything to the max you will have to think about business continuity management if the key server goes down if it dies it's the hardware security module broken if you are lost worst case it's not just your service provider bit but also the entire fleet control is lost so if you in the most absurd weird effect could mean that you just lost control over the support of millions of devices at home it's a bit of a challenge to actually make sure that that doesn't really happen and that you have a reboot feature but it really sucks if you have to send an email to a million people or 2 million or 5 million or 10 million to ask please kindly reboot the device because otherwise we can't service your device or work with your device anymore another problem is all the keys in one basket if you have one location, one device well guarded but yeah if this one, if fire happens in this location you have the same problem again this also relates to public key infrastructure where we have a lot of faith into just a few root CAs but that's a different topic and I will not move into this people would say you could solve everything with quality control unfortunately quality control is very complicated and then you have to deal with your suppliers and have to manage them so if you actually have suppliers you actually have to do active management because otherwise it will be a garbage in, garbage out situation if you don't ask them please make secure devices please make secure services please create secure code please do something with this often not used enough is that we could actually have influence active influence on this and we could actually do more and some of the companies do more and really challenge the suppliers unfortunately the suppliers are still using legacy protocols this is just a statement on logjam from a while ago and there are a lot of websites but also APIs that are still using very old technology because somehow they couldn't really update it and a bunch of these statistics aren't just Apache services that you can just update some of these results from logjam are not just websites that you should be able to just update with up get update or anything other tool but would actually be devices Apache embedded in devices which can only be updated by firmware update which is a very tedious and specific problem to do and yeah not everybody is doing it unfortunately not all vendors have created an update feature into their software another funny little thing is zombie vulnerabilities yeah I called it I just thought about it yesterday zombie vulnerabilities vulnerabilities that you have solved but reemerge how the hell did that happen I had an update I patched it I got it into the infrastructure I moved along and after a few months or years suddenly exactly the same problem reemerges how does that happen let's assume you have a few companies but the amount of companies is not really relevant but you have to look at the main branch development of a piece of software it develops over time it improves over time but the first company had revision number one of this tool but didn't say anything about it company B gets the same revision of the tool what happens in very large software packages and software environments is that the company the supplier will branch off the source code for your company that in your case they can customize it for you because you might have a slightly different infrastructure than the other guys you have different needs and they can tailor make it the problem of this tailoring is so is that if company B states ok but we now need to do a patch on the software the patch might be done and fixed in their revision so their revision number one is actually revision number one for company B not for company A so all the other companies don't actually get it because they didn't complain so they didn't really have a problem so why should we change it then the patch goes back into the main branch but only appears way after it was deployed in many other cases and might be re-emerging into for instance the so it can actually happen that company B gets a revision number two and still doesn't really have the patch while company C moves into revision number one again and only that company could actually get it so they're now only in this entire picture only company B that actually had the update in that branch and only company C has the fix so if you are company A and you got a newer version like for instance company B who actually made a effort into the security testing and it got a new revision over time it was only patched on the company B revision one branch so you update but unfortunately the update actually re-emerges the same bug again or whatever it was this is a windows in a forest picture so in this case you see an infrastructure of windows systems in a forest of other devices I found it a really cool picture because it is a lot better than this one this is where you have the typical windows forest and segmentation situation if you're an infrastructure provider you have to deal with this as well this basically means that if you have a branch office you have one user environment and people can just use single sign on to log into different pieces in areas of the infrastructure it also makes the chain of HR to the identity and access management to the account management and to your infrastructure very seamless very nice but there are downsides the single sign on is very positive but it connects all kinds of machines to one particular active directory and multiple types of users can be organized into multiple units if you don't really merge them or if you merge them you can't really distinguish between different users so you really have to deal with those kind of situations because in some cases you only want to be logged on have the single sign on active in this part of the company and not in that part of the company so if you think about not petia or other activities where logon actually was part of the spreading of malware or an attacker that actually moves into your network and then tries to do lateral movement you will have to deal with this and if you can segment your windows environments properly then the attacker has less attack surface to deal with and cannot jump from the office environment into your production environment which happened in some companies another misnomer is that if you have different domains and the system administrators are different if you have the domain administrators between the two domains they could actually influence the domain that they have a trust relationship with so if you have the single sign on into multiple domains yeah, I've got my users, they can use your resources I've got my users, they can use your resources that means you have two administrative domains and these guys can actually influence each other's activities and influence each other's resources and logon well, the phone is going off another danger is that you have perhaps a system that actually has a hybrid setup for password storage so the old landman, ntlm, ntlmv2 if you have a domain that is top notch suddenly you can't even uphold this because you might need to facilitate the single sign on to an infrastructure piece of area that only has a different or older system of windows running it might be patched, it might be secured but you still see that these kinds of effects happen in a large infrastructure when you have to combine multiple multiple systems, multiple domains and without filtering of SIDs you can also control the other domain again because you have these rights because you make these trust relationships between these areas of the company yeah, so it's quite an architectural challenge and a technical challenge on how to separate this and still keep everything working because if you have your resources in one domain and you have to logon to this in your account then it might actually work in one way but you want to have a segmented environment as possible but sometimes they didn't really implement it properly and then you can't actually do the best thing for separation of your windows systems so things left out so this is the final remarks that if you do vendor assurance and you have to think about the security posture of these so if you have a supplier and it doesn't really matter if they're big or small I've seen all of them single people that can actually be very excellent in what they do and they're working in a company and they do tremendous stuff and you've got a big company of which you would think that they would have 100,000 people behind this one engineer to assist him that doesn't really work suddenly reality kicks in they're just... the engineers are mostly just groups of people assigned to a particular company and depending on the culture they would actually ask out of the context of one company that they work for and there to ask how do I solve this technical problem and then it becomes a cultural thing what kind of culture do you have do you stick to the plan and will you just and only interact with your peers surfacing this company or are these people actually having a help desk to actually ask how do I deal with crypto problems for instance that's something that I have to deal with a lot like how do you deal with cryptography in practice and it amazes me that people don't use Google often enough or don't just ask the colleague that already had to do the same thing in another company for another company sitting only one or two rooms next to them interaction and how people interact seems to be related to what kind of culture they have and what kind of sense they have on how to interact with people so you can actually try to change the world if you want to influence this and yeah, thank you


Breast implant illness, BII, is a condition characterized by a wide variety of symptoms, many of which are also seen in other diseases. It is important to consider other potential causes of these symptoms before explantation. This article was offered by Stephen D. Bresnik.


This is The Lou Rockwell Show. It's great to have Stefan Kinsella with us today. Stefan is an attorney in Houston, Texas, specializing in patents and trademarks. He's a writer. If you take a look at his archive at lourockwell.com, also his archive on mesis.org, also the author of many, many legal books published in this country and abroad in his area of specialization. And today I want to talk to him about intellectual property about the whole concept of government patents and government copyrights. He's really enacted a revolution in this area among libertarians. But Stefan, before we get into that, you're in Houston. You've just had that horrific hurricane. Talk to us a little bit about how comforted you are by Mayor White of Houston and other government officials taking care of you. Well, let me just say I'm here in Baton Rouge waiting for power to be restored. And nice to be with you, by the way. But from one of the things I've heard is the curfew that the government is imposing to make their job easier, of course, to just automatically suspect anyone who's roaming around being a criminal automatically. So it's amazing that people think the government's doing a great job there. I saw Mayor White on television reminding everybody that the electric lines were all owned by a private company. And therefore, of course, the government, which was entirely in control and up to snuff in every other area, couldn't restore people's electricity because that was some of those awful private firms. Right, yeah. They try to blame any failure they can on the private sector, even if their fingers are all over it. Stefan, talk to me a little bit about intellectual property. I think you've pointed out that not only is it not property, but the concept is used by the government and by private interests in order to infringe real property rights. Yeah, this is to me the most striking thing about it. A lot of libertarians and economists sort of come to the table presuming that IP is a legitimate type of property right. It's one of these strange things where leftists oppose it because they assume it's property and conservatives and libertarians endorse it because they also believe it's property. And in a sense, both are wrong. The leftists seem to sort of sense this. I'm not sure if they sense it really because of any perspicacity or because of their general hostility towards industrialism and commerce. And there's some sense that this is part of it, but they sense something is wrong with the oppressive way these laws are used. But when you step back and think about it, as I did a long time ago when I started practicing IP law around 92, 94, when I assumed that it was legitimate, having read Rand and other free market thinkers who sort of took it for granted, their justifications really didn't make a lot of sense. And the more you think about it, you realize that to enforce these property rights, these so-called property rights, you have to basically set up an intrusion, a system that intrudes into legitimate property rights that already exist. It's almost like the libertarians fall prey to this, the notion that liberals fall prey to where they believe you can just create more and more positive rights with no penalty without realizing that these rights dilute real rights, right? Like welfare rights are not free. They come at the cost of property rights because they require us to invade people, bank accounts and paychecks and pay for these welfare rights. And it's the same thing with intellectual property rights. The more you proliferate these type of rights, the more you enforce against physical property that already exists. So the primary case against intellectual property, in my opinion, is moral. It requires an intrusive state, state bureaucracy. It's basically a socialized redistribution of wealth from existing property owners to another class of people favored by the state, class of innovators or basically people that register appropriate documents with the federal government. Stefan, I know that Murray Rothbard thought that patents were illegitimate grants of government monopoly, but what about copyrights? You've shown that copyrights are as much an illegitimate grant of government monopoly as patents are. I believe Rothbard's intuitions were heading in the right direction. What he was trying to do was he was trying to say that you could use some kind of private contractual regime, regime that would be legitimate to create some of the benefits that people point to in a copyright or patent system. In the example he gave, he gave an example of a mousetrap. Now, under typical IP law, that's an invention which is covered by patents. Murray called it a case of copyright because he was thinking the pattern of a mousetrap could be copied by, you know, the buyer of a mousetrap. Basically, his idea was that if you stamp it copyright, you're putting the buyer on notice that he can't use it in certain ways. And I think actually that's correct as far as it goes. I think he did misstep a little bit where he extended that to cover the case of third party because to do that requires requires the assumption that knowledge is also property because the third party has the permission of the second party, the buyer or the seller, unless knowledge was property. If he's merely using knowledge, he gains from state observing the purchaser's mousetrap. So I think that is the mistake he made there. He was basically trying to construct a contractual system. And I do believe that more work can be done in that area and more contractual mechanisms could come up with a pretty advocate point to. Part of the problem, of course, is that the government outlaws a lot of the mechanisms that the free market would adapt or adopt to address these problems with antitrust law, for example. If many companies got together to form a cartel to have some kind of protection or a way to address the free rider problem, for example, in a given industry, it would be a cartel and illegal under the antitrust law. So we can't see right now exactly what contractual mechanisms people would come up with. But certainly, I think contractual regimes would be perfectly legitimate. And to push your monograph on intellectual property is available on Misesorg at the Misesorg store. But it seems like this is one instance in which the libertarians, the consultant libertarians have really got the people with them. Is there anybody, is there any young person, is there anybody under 30 in the United States who takes the RIAA side against copiers of music? I mean, it seems, and the Motion Picture Association similar activities.  They, of course, work in cahoots with the government to try to suppress copying of music and copying of movies. I agree. It's actually striking how uniform the libertarian sentiment is about IP at least among those that are younger or that are tech savvy or that have any familiarity with Austrian economics or Rothbardian type libertarianism with that as principle, property rights based libertarianism. And it appears to me that the RIAA is viewed almost like the IRS. You know, it's like no one knows that he went to work for the RIAA or that it's maybe some obscure third cousin or something and they don't talk about it at cocktail parties too much. It's universally seen as being illegitimate. And not only that in practical, the RIAA is widely condemned by almost everyone in the industry, even people that don't have a strident or a principled deal on IP, they think it's crazy what these guys are doing. They're going after their own customers. 20,000 people. It looks like the flailings of a dying beast. I remember there was one point in which Congress was preparing to adopt and maybe they did adopt a plan the Republicans were pushing it to allow the movie industry, the record industry to actually destroy people's computers to be able to reach into them with in effect their own viruses if you had music or movies that they claimed you shouldn't have or that they would be able to for example erasure a hard disk. Yeah, I think that was, I think Orrin Hatch actually advocated that. That was the evil Orrin Hatch. Yeah, a good Republican supporter of property rights, correct? So here's what is obviously a criminal act. The sort of act that the government is otherwise hysterical about people who are hackers and spammers and that sort of thing. And yet of course the government is advocating to use these tactics itself in defense of the interest that it approves. Yes, I agree. I mean, I think this is what you get when the government tries to outlaw essentially peaceful non-criminal activity. If there's a demand for something then there is clearly a demand for the ability to copy. I mean, copying is a natural thing to do. This is how we learn, right? This is how we transmit information. The entire creative process even in technology or in the art relies upon copying. That's what it's about. Adapting and building in plots from well-known novels and plays and ideas that have been circulating in society for dozens or hundreds of thousands of years and building upon them. So copying is natural and as I think Corey Dockrow points out in a recent really insightful piece, copying is not going to get any harder. Copying is going to get even easier. The Internet is the world's greatest copying machine. The attempt to suppress copying is going to require draconian measures that are going to suppress people's liberty. And are it ultimately going to be impossible? I think it will be impossible, especially as cryptography and encryption techniques become more readily available and widely used. Which is going to result, of course, in selective enforcement and posing draconian penalties unless it's people until hopefully the perspective of this will be so dramatically seem to be unjust that it will just wither away or not be enforced too much. Steven, just one last point. Where did Rand go wrong? I can remember her arguing that if I can paraphrase in a sense that he was some sort of mystic of the muscle of the U.S. Constitution's view of patents and copyrights was exactly right, that you were a communist. But it seems to me she had very little argument for this. Well, yeah, I think there was a couple of missteps that she made. One was, as you know, her sort of religious adherence to the American scheme of government. Which was almost perfect in her mind and only a few. So she sort of took for granted her slavery and a few other matters. And in fact, one striking example of that is, on Rand tried in her weak attempt to defend intellectual property she tried to defend the practice which is called first to a file. Which means the first inventor to file a patent application wins and gets the patent. So she had this tortured argument for why this makes sense. Because she mistakenly believed that was the American law. Of course it's not the American law. The American law is the first person to invent would win in the case of a contest. Unlike the rest of the world. So that's just an example of her sort of reverse engineering, I believe is just trying to justify whatever the Constitution said. But I believe the central mistake is the sort of confused notion that creation is an independent source of property rights. Probably stemming from the mixture of the idea of creation with economic prosperity and productivity and homesteading and all these notions. Unless you carefully sort them out, you might be mistaken for thinking that creating things of value is one source of property rights. But if you think about it carefully you can only create value with property that you own. And if you own the property you already have the property rights. So the creation of value is just a way of transforming goods that are already owned. So I believe that identifying creation as an independent source of property rights is similar to the idea, similar to what liberals do when they try to create positive welfare rights. It's just an additional right they believe, but it has to undercut the already existing rights. And the same with basically attaching property rights to creation as a right. Basically, if you understand how the system works, it cannot work without a state, a legislature to create these schemes and a huge massive government bureaucracy to administer it. It cannot. So anyone advocating patent and copyright is in effect advocating bureaucracy, the state and legislation which are clearly libertarian in my opinion. Steven Concello, thanks so much for being with us. I want to urge everyone to take a look at his archive at lourockwell.com. Take a look at his archive at Mises.org. Read his book on intellectual property that's for sale in the Mises store or you can read it for free online in a PDF. Indeed, you can just put Concella, K-I-N-S-E-L-L-A and intellectual property into Google and you'll find out all kinds of great things. And let me also mention his own site. Stefan is a pioneering libertarian theorist and doing great work and Stefan, thanks so much. You've been listening to the Lou Rockwell Show. Produced by lourockwell.com the best read libertarian website in the world. If you'd like to advertise on this podcast or on the website email advertise at lourockwell.com and thanks for listening.