I call on Ash Regan to speak to and move the motion, minister. I welcome this opportunity to open the debate on the general principles of the fireworks and pyrotechnics bill. My thanks go to the criminal justice committee and all those who gave evidence for their work on the bill at stage 1. The bill is a key part of an overarching package of change being progressed through the fireworks action plan and is the result of several years of work, including widespread public consultations, opinion polls, analytical research and engagement with key stakeholders, including the independent firework review group. All that work has clearly demonstrated that people want to change, that they see the unpredictable use as well as the misuse of fireworks and pyrotechnics as anti-social, as unwelcome and causing significant disruption to many people, particularly those with neurodivergent conditions such as autism, animals and communities. However, we accept that there are many who enjoy the spectacle of firework and pyrotechnic displays, and that public displays can offer a safe and fun way for communities to enjoy fireworks. It is our job to proportionately address the clear, consistent concerns and call for change that have been raised while balancing this against allowing the safe, considerate and appropriate use of fireworks and pyrotechnics for celebrations and for other important events. That is what has underpinned the bill that is before Parliament today, one that introduces critical enhancements to Scots criminal law to ensure that it is as robust and effective as possible at regulating the use of fireworks and pyrotechnics. I will outline the five key strands of the bill. Part 2 includes provision for Scottish ministers to establish and to operate a fireworks licensing system that will require members of the public to apply for a licence in order to purchase, possess and use F2 or F3 fireworks in Scotland. That provision seeks to move the purchase and use of fireworks to a planned, well-thought-out transaction rather than a spontaneous occurrence. I consider that a comprehensive licence system covering supply, possession and use is the most robust way to ensure that the policy objectives of the system are met, while mitigating against potential unintended consequences such as the displacement of sales across the border or online. I am aware of the concerns raised by the committee on the level of detail included on the face of the bill, but I believe that the bill strikes the right balance here. It sets out the core principles and elements of how the licensing system will function and the requirements that will be placed on those wishing to apply for a licence. I am very grateful that the minister thinks that it is appropriate that the report appears to have only had one sitting day between being published and being debated today. Before the minister responds, I will make members aware that we have time on hand this afternoon for interventions. I recognise the concerns that the committee raised about timetabling as one of those issues. I thank the committee for its agreement to work to a slightly truncated timetable. Scrutiny is vital in that regard, which I am sure that everyone would agree. That needs to be balanced by the consideration that the public is very keen to see action on that topic. If we will work constructively across the chamber and, for my part, I can commit to going through the parliamentary process to engage with all the concerns that are raised with me and to address them constructively, I think that we will end up with a bill that is appropriate, proportionate and effective at the end of the process. The operational and administrative detail of the licensing system will be set out in regulations to ensure that we can develop an agile and future-proof system that can be updated in a timely manner should the need arise to continue to meet the requirements of society. The bill sets out a duty to consult before making regulations under this part, ensuring that stakeholders have the opportunity to share their views on operational licensing system details. I welcome the recommendations from the Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee, reinforced by the Criminal Justice Committee, to consider whether further provision about the licensing system should be subject to the affirmative procedure rather than negative as it is set out. I can confirm that I will bring forward amendments at stage 2 and I recognise that this will afford Parliament an enhanced level of scrutiny as this detail is being developed and brought forward. I am grateful, Presiding Officer, for taking this intervention. Given the thought that the licensing system and the additional legislative support that it will need, has consideration been made yet as to the likely level of fee that will apply to a licence application? More importantly, whether that will cover just the cost of the licensing system or also inflector on the enforcement that will be needed? We have modelled fee levels and that has been set out and published. It is available for the member to have a look at himself if he wants to look at this. The modelling has been done around a fee level of £20, £30 and £50 with the associated modelling that goes along with that. From my part, I am very keen that it is not prohibitively expensive. We want to allow people to do the right thing, if they like. I am quite keen and we had quite a bit of debate here with one of your colleagues who is on the committee about proportionate levels of fees. I am keen from my part that they remain proportionate. In response to the stage 1 report, I have also agreed to provide the committee with a mock user journey. That is to set out in more practical terms how the licensing system at this stage is planned to work should the bill be passed by Parliament. That will of course be subject to further consultation and agreement of subsequent regulations by the relevant committee at a later date. I hope that that provides the committee with reassurance as to the practical operation of the system and the processes that are in place to ensure that that is developed in a robust and transparent way. Part 3 of the bill includes the proxy purchase and supply offence in relation to fireworks and other pyrotechnic articles. During our consultations, we heard accounts of adults giving children fireworks in our communities. That is very worrying. I am sure that everyone would agree. We need to make it clear that this behaviour is unacceptable. While it is illegal, under existing legislation, to supply fireworks to a person who is under the age of 18, in a commercial transaction, that does not cover the wider settings. That is, as recognised by the committee in its report, a loophole that must be closed. The scrutiny timetable for the bill will enable that important provision to be in place for the upcoming bonfire season. I will cover the benefits of the timetable in more detail shortly. Part 3 includes proposed restrictions on permitted periods of the supply and use of fireworks. That includes restricting the days that fireworks can be sold to and used by the general public. The dates set out in the bill broadly align with existing fireworks periods, where fireworks form an important part of celebrating cultural and religious festivals. I will. Can I ask who the minister consulted with when she came up with these dates? We consulted with all the major faith groups in order to come up with these dates. I can provide the member with more detail on that in writing if he would like more detail on that. We have retained our provision in the bill so that, if it comes to light that there is a celebration that perhaps we have missed, we would be able to update the legislation potentially to reflect that in the future. I have, of course, been mindful for the need of equality during development of this provision, which was updated in light of engagement with equalities organisations during last year's consultation. That measure addresses the concerns that we have heard about unpredictable use of fireworks being disruptive, sometimes debilitating to people and communities, as well as to animals. Being aware of when fireworks might be used will enable people to put appropriate safeguards in place while allowing people to continue to use fireworks to celebrate over existing fireworks periods. I recognise that restricting the days of supply has the potential to negatively impact specialist firework businesses. The bill therefore includes a regulation making power to enable the introduction of a compensation scheme to address the economic impact of the provision if that is required. Can you maybe explain a bit more what the compensation would be? Would it be an annual recurring thing, or would it just be a one-off payment? I cannot give the member any further detail on that at this stage. I will endeavour to bring more detail forward perhaps around the time of stage 2, but we recognise that restricting days of supply might have a small number of businesses that sell year-round. My intention is to engage with the businesses that are affected to further understand the detail of the financial impact that it might have on them. I welcome the committee's recommendation to commence work on the compensation scheme as soon as possible. An important initial part of that will be engaging with those businesses and understanding the financial effects that it might have on them. I note the concern that has been raised by the committee in relation to the potential impact of provisions on people purchasing black market fireworks. That risk has been fully considered during the development of the bill. For example, where any part of the supply of fireworks takes place in Scotland, including the delivery, suppliers will be required to check the licence status of the recipient receiving the fireworks delivery to ensure that they do not commit an offence of supplying to an individual without a fireworks licence. Of course, the illegal sale and purchase of fireworks will continue to be subject to existing well-established enforcement routes through trading standards, the police and the courts. The Scottish Government intends to continue to work with those partners to build on and enhance existing processes to tackle black market sales. Part 4 of the bill provides local authorities with the power to designate firework control zones, where it will be an offence for the general public to use fireworks at any time, including on private property. Communities will therefore have a greater say in fireworks use in their local area with a fair and robust process in place for the consideration of such zones to be designated, amended or revoked. Public firework displays will be exempt from those zones. As I recognise, those events can and do bring communities together and will allow people living in those zones to enjoy fireworks in appropriate settings. Professional firework operators are also exempt in terms of the services and capacity of providing both public and private displays. I note the committee's concerns on those zones and whether giving local authorities the ability to designate a complete no-firework zone would be preferable. I am interested in hearing the views of Parliament on that point today, particularly in relation to the exemption that is included for professional fireworks operators whose services can be engaged for private displays. I thank the member for giving way and for her openness on that point. For example, if the dogs trust in my constituency and whether it is organised or not, they both affect them. I agree with that. That is why I am keen to hear the views of the Parliament this afternoon, particularly on that point. Part 5 makes it an offence to be in possession of a pyrotechnic article, including all types of fireworks without reasonable excuse, while at, in the immediate vicinity of, or travelling to, a designated sporting or music venue, an event, public profession and assembly. A person convicted of that offence is liable, on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months or a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale or both. The bill also extends powers of stop and search, including of a vehicle to anyone reasonably suspected of committing an offence under the bill. That will, in particular, enable the proactive and preventative enforcement of the part 5 provisions in relation to the pyrotechnics at certain places and events, ensuring that police can act early to address this potentially dangerous behaviour. In drafting the pyrotechnics possession offence, we were conscious of our obligation to consider the least intrusive method of achieving our policy objective and the need to demonstrate that new criminal offences and related search powers are proportionate and necessary. I will give away. My question to the minister is as farmers, of which I have one in my register of interest, I declare that, often carry pyrotechnics to frighten birds away from crops, and they could be in possession of these fireworks when they are moving around the countryside. Have you given consideration to them and what protection will you give to farmers as they are moving around the countryside with these exploding rockets as they are, which are used to frighten away things such as geese? It is quite right to raise this, because obviously there are a number of reasons why people might have a legitimate reason to carry a pyrotechnic device, safety flares and so on, marine flares. That was one of the considerations that the Government took into account when we were drafting this offence, and why the offence has been drafted in a slightly narrower way than it had been previously suggested in order that we did not, for any reason, affect people who need to legitimately. We do not want to put people off carrying flares for legitimate reasons, but I am interested to hear the views of the Parliament on that and their consideration on whether they feel that the Government has got the balance right in this provision. I am aware of concerns raised by the committee, Police Scotland and the Scottish Police Federation about the scope of the pyrotechnic possession provisions and their impact on operational enforcement. I agree that we need to address operational challenges to ensure that the legislation is effective, and I am interested to hear Parliament's views on that. While I understand calls for a wider offence of being in possession of a pyrotechnic article in a public place, I also recognise the importance of proportionality in creating any new criminal offence to ensure that individual freedoms and civil liberties are protected and that we are achieving our objective in the least intrusive way possible. Finally, I would like to say that I am grateful to the Parliament for allowing the bill to proceed at an accelerated pace. Moving forward swiftly is important, and we have heard the strong message that people want change and the action taken on sustained disturbance and harm that fireworks and pyrotechnics can cause on their life. This timetable will allow the proxy purchasing events to be in place for the upcoming bonfire season, and the importance of this provision cannot be minimised. As I mentioned earlier, we have heard about the issues that some communities face when adults are giving fireworks to children and we must act to close the loophole in current legislation that allows that to go unpunished. We have also heard from enforcement authorities that a proxy offence is also a useful preventative tool, as it makes clear to all adults that this is unacceptable and that it is criminal. The purpose of the proxy offence is to protect children and young people from harm, which I am sure all members would agree is an absolute priority. The timetable allows the important work to implement other provisions to commence promptly should the bill be passed by Parliament, and it is paramount to ensure that further positive change can be in place as soon as possible. There is no question that there is a strong desire to see a fundamental shift in Scotland's relationship with fireworks and pyrotechnic articles. The bill is just part of our journey towards achieving that, balancing the responsible use and enjoyment of fireworks with the need to protect the public from harm and minimise the disruption and intimidation that those articles can cause. I now call on Colin McNeill to speak to and move amendment 4236.1. Scottish Labour supports the Scottish Government's intention behind the bill and we applaud the hard work of Minister Ash Regan and the stakeholders who created the Fireworks and Pyrotechnics Bill. We have unusually amended the motion to agree to general principles, as we have quite serious concerns that the design of the licence scheme in particular may have interesting consequences and may unintentionally criminalise individuals due to the complexity of the scheme. I refer to one aspect of that. If you look at the section of the bill that deals with the restrictions on the days that, when you can use fireworks, which is an offence if you use out with those days, that is 26 December to 22 January. The three days immediately preceding the first day of the Chinese New Year to the seventh day after the first day of the Chinese New Year. People may know that the Chinese New Year follows the lunar calendar, but you can see that it is quite complex for the general public to know what days they can set fireworks off and in which days they cannot. The low number of prostitutions and none in the last year indicate that there may be a deeper problem with how seriously that issue is taken by the police and the Crown Office. We simply have not had enough time to scrutinise whether the bill will make a difference to that. The lack of scrutiny time in my view now and hence is not justified that something has become so important for our communities. Fireworks, I agree with the minister, have become a serious issue across Scotland, with bonfire season often putting our police and emergency workers at risk. Fireworks and pyrotechnics have also been used in attacks on officers and fireworks have been used as weapons in many communities, such as my own in Glasgow and Pollock Shields, where it appears as though there may not even have been any prosecutions as a result of existing law. I have to question whether the bill will do more to penalise those who misuse fireworks in our communities. Fireworks also distress wildlife, firemanals and pets, particularly dogs, and the SSPC has described the bill as a win for animals, so Scottish Slaver is clear that we support the Government's intentions behind the bill. Fireworks are an issue throughout the rest of the year too, particularly football matches in which fireworks and flares are regularly smuggled in and let off, which endanger staff, players and spectators. The stated purpose of the fireworks and pyrotechnics bill is to support a cultural shift in how fireworks and pyrotechnics are used in Scotland while curtailing the anti-social use of fireworks. Those who intend to risk prosecution with their use of fireworks by taking them to football matches or lobbing them at police will be concerned about jumping through all the necessary hoops to purchase them legally. That is a serious question. What the law will certainly do will make it onerous for people who wish to use them lawfully. In so doing, does it carry risks that we have not had a chance to test because of the design of the scheme and the lack of scrutiny? We need to be careful that the bill does not end up being similar to the repealed Offensive Behaviour Football Act, which was unworkable and inadvertently criminalised great swath of the public. I want to consider it in more detail what the public has to do to use the fireworks legislation and apply for a licence. Anyone who wishes to purchase fireworks will have to apply for a licence to take an unlike course and take a fee. I am pleased that the minister has acknowledged that the fee is a really important aspect of it, £20 or £50, and the licence would be for five years. If the fee was anything like £50, I would believe that that would be a barrier and out of reach for many families. I think that there is quite a difference between £20 and £50, but the person who wishes to use fireworks will need to find out when the 37 days are of the year, when it is legal to purchase fireworks, but then find out the 57 days of the year that they are allowed to be used and it does not stop there. They will need to find out if the fireworks zone in their area is live so that they can check whether it is legal to set those fireworks off. It is an offence under section 4 to set fireworks off on the wrong day, and it is also an offence to set fireworks off without a licence and rightly so, but it is easy to see how a normally lawabiding member of the public might inadvertently break the law because either they set them off on the wrong day or in the wrong area, so more thought needs to be given to the complexity of this licensing scheme. Further more individuals may be tempted to buy fireworks out of a white van illegally because they cannot afford the licence and are unable to apply for a licence because they are online. There are many dangers that we have not had the chance to dig into in this bill, so rather than going to a shop that we were required to present your licence, some people might find another way to do that. That is why I am concerned about the Government's response to the committee being quite dismissive of the potential for the black market to open up, and the Government's response rightly so that they are concerned about that and so am I. It was very strong evidence given by the industry on this, and I do not think that we should dismiss it so easily. In the Republic of Ireland—yes, I will give way—who is that, John Mason? John Mason, right? Okay. I thank the member for giving way, but would she accept that when it comes to alcohol and tobacco and all of those things where there is duty and licences, of course there is a temptation to black market, but it does not mean that we have to not do that. Pauli McNeill? Of course, but one of the considerations when you are setting up a licence scheme that is so complex as I have described, what we need to make sure is that we are not creating the conditions. It is one of those things that has not been tried and tested, but if you look at some of the main aspects of it, I would say that something we need to be very live to. In the Republic of Ireland, the sale, possession and use of fireworks is illegal, but, nevertheless, in August last year, a chairperson of Dublin south central joint policing committee said that fireworks were imported illegally and stored in huge quantities in Dublin, and he continued that these illegal fireworks have been terrifying local residents across Dublin, particularly the old and the vulnerable. I think that it would be wrong to dismiss the potential for the black market. Yes, I will give way. I technically don't understand completely. We are alive to this potential problem of the black market, but does the member accept that the Republic of Ireland is quite different when it has gone down the route of a complete ban? That was at least one of the policy considerations for not pursuing that in Scotland. What was the risk of unintended consequences? I accept that. What I am saying is that the potential effect of such a complicated scheme of the fee is not set at the right level could amount to a ban. It might be seen as a ban, and, therefore, we have to be alive to the consequences of people who go and get their fireworks without a licence. That is something that we need to all be careful about, particularly because the bill has been rushed and it has all the hallmarks of legislation that has not had enough time for scrutiny. Police Scotland has voiced concerns about how it will be able to affect the police parts of the bill. Firework-related convictions are very low, and in 2021 there were 974 firework-related complaints to Police Scotland, in which 29 criminal charges were brought, resulting in no convictions. That is an important point, too. If we are currently not using the current law, how can ministers be absolutely certain that the law will be used to bring a bit more prosecutions? Given that it is important that the police feel that the new legislation is enforceable, I mean that the Scottish Police Federation has voiced concerns over what is going down of section 33, which the minister has spoken about. There needs to be quite serious scrutiny on whether that section 33 travelling to a designated sporting event, music event, procession or assembly is the right one. All the perpetrator needs to say, and this is the words of Police Scotland—sorry, the Police Federation—is that they were going somewhere else and that no offence would be committed, so it is not clear how police officers can prove where somebody is going. Given that this is one of the first pieces of legislation that this Parliament has passed in the parliamentary session, it is so important for communities that we need time to make sure that we get this right. I am really unhappy that I accept that part of the bill needed to be rushed for the proxy purchase, but the rest of it we should have been given adequate time to scrutinise it. Do I have time for an intervention? I thank Pauline McNeill for taking me into the intervention. She may be aware that the stage 2 deadline for lodging amendments is the 19th of May. That is just two weeks away. I do not know about the Government benches, but do other members feel confident that we will be able to fix all the problems that the 70-page report identified in just two weeks? I listened to the minister for business when we moved the point of order last week, saying that we could fix this at stage 2, which is astonishing to find that we are not even going to get the time at stage 2. I have to say that, as a legislator, it is totally unacceptable. I will not come to this Parliament and stand by and allow poor legislation to go through, even if I wholeheartedly agree with the intentions of it, which I do is not one that I came here to do. It is not necessary to introduce the rest of the legislation in such a rushed fashion. In hindsight, hide I know and would be in this position, but I would not have agreed at the committee stage to do this. I plead with the Government to give us the time at stage 2 in order to be able to make sure that this is fit for purpose. With that, I move the Labour's amendment in my name. I now call on Audrey Nicholl to speak on behalf of the Criminal Justice Committee for around 13 minutes. It is my real pleasure to speak on behalf of the Criminal Justice Committee in this stage 1 debate on the fireworks and pyrotechnics article of the Scotland Bill. I would like to begin by thanking all those who took the time to provide evidence to us. As part of our scrutiny, the committee visited Blackburn in West Lothian to hear about their impressive and innovative approaches to tackling the misuse of fireworks in their area. I would like to welcome to the Parliament representatives from Blackburn Bonfer Night action group, St Kentagurn's academy and Bathgate academy, who are joining us in the public gallery for this debate. Welcome all and thank you for assisting the committee. Their successful community approach to finding solutions to the misuse of fireworks and related anti-social behaviour helped to inform some of our recommendations. I would also like to thank the parliamentary clerks and officials for their excellent support throughout stage 1. By no means least, I thank my fellow committee members for their constructive approach to scrutinising the bill on an accelerated and very challenging timetable. The committee fully supports and shares the Scottish Government's ambition to tackle the misuse of fireworks and pyrotechnics. We agree with the need for a culture shift, both in the availability and use of fireworks and pyrotechnics, which more clearly reflects the serious nature of the injuries that can cause to the public, the anti-social behaviour that can arise from their misuse and the impact on emergency services workers. The committee heard first hand about the impact the unpredictable use of fireworks and their misuse can have on local communities, and that is especially true for those who find loud and unexpected noises, particularly distressing. In response to our call for views, there was overwhelming support for greater controls on the sale, purchase and use of fireworks and pyrotechnics, so there is clearly a public desire for greater restrictions. That is why in our stage 1 report we reached the conclusion that the Parliament should support the bill's general principles. However, the committee has serious concerns about whether the bill, as drafted, will achieve its objectives. We recommend that the Scottish Government make the necessary amendments outlined in our report to ensure that the measures introduced by the bill are effective, robust, workable, clearly understood and have the confidence of the public and key stakeholders. I thank the minister for providing a detailed written response to the committee's report, and it would be helpful in her closing remarks if the minister could detail exactly what changes she proposes to the bill at stage 2, as there were several responses where the committee's views were noted, but it was unclear if the Government intends to amend the bill. It is currently illegal for licensed operators to sell most types of fireworks to those under the age of 18. The committee heard from David McKenzie, chair of the Society of Chief Officers of Trading Standards in Scotland, that there is a high level of compliance among licensed fireworks retailers on underage selling. However, a key aspect of the bill, which the Government wants to place ahead of this year's Bonfer Night, is a new criminal offence that would make it illegal for adults who are not classed as economic operators to buy or otherwise provide fireworks or pyrotechnics to children. That is the primary reason for the bill's accelerated timetable. The committee heard evidence that some parents buy fireworks and give them to their children, and at present that activity is not illegal. The bill intends to address the legislative gap that the committee fully supports. However, it was unclear whether the Scottish Government had asked the UK Government to make those changes via secondary legislation or for the relevant order-making powers to be transferred to Scotland. I note that a direct approach was not made. Due to a lack of available statistical data, it is unclear whether the existing law relating to fireworks is being fully enforced. Ensuring public understanding of the new law is essential. Therefore, the committee recommended that the Scottish Government undertakes a public education and awareness programme in advance of the law coming into effect. That needs to inform adults of the dangers of providing fireworks and pyrotechnics to children and to ensure that they are aware of the new criminal offence. Crucial details on two key proposals in the bill are to be provided later in subordinate legislation. Those are the fireworks licensing scheme and the designation of certain areas by local authorities as firework control zones. The licensing system is to regulate the purchase, acquisition, possession, use and supply of category F2 and F3 fireworks by members of the public, and the intention is that it will encourage the safer use of fireworks and reduce firework-related harm and injury. The proposal is that only those aged 18 or over can apply for a licence, and they must first undertake a mandatory training course and pay an application fee. The scheme was welcomed by the fire and police services, as well as other stakeholders, who see the potential for it to ensure safer possession and use of fireworks and to help to reduce injuries to public and emergency services workers. However, the fireworks industry raised concerns that the introduction of a licence scheme and its associated costs may lead people to purchase fireworks online or illegally. The lack of detail about the scheme means that questions remain about its workability and whether it will achieve the Scottish Government's intended outcomes. The committee concluded that the scheme will need careful consultation, design, implementation and testing. We also recommended that the Scottish Government take the necessary time to ensure that it is robust and user-friendly, and that stakeholders' views are taken on board to inform the detail. Are the committee confident with the Government's response to that call for better consultation with regard to the subsidiary legislation? I speak on behalf of the committee on the priorities within the bill for in particular consultation. I welcome that that has been given. Members do as well. Consultation is absolutely critical to us being able to take forward this process so that effective legislation is put in place. To address the concern that people may not apply for a licence and purchase fireworks illegally instead, the committee recommended that the licence fee should only cover the costs of administering the scheme. The second area where specific details are to follow is the proposal for areas to be designated by local authorities as firework control zones. Those are areas where the use of fireworks will be restricted. The bill provides for exemptions for commercial operators, community groups and others to use the most powerful and the noisiest fireworks in those zones under certain circumstances. Rob Holland, from the National Autistic Society Scotland, told the committee and a quote, if families were able to make the decision to live in an area where there was no fireworks guarantee as far as possible, I have no doubt that some families would take that initiative. The committee concluded that the term firework control zones, where firework use is controlled but still permitted, has the potential to confuse the public. It may also fall short of the public's expectation that those zones will provide protection for vulnerable populations as well as addressing disorder and antisocial behaviour. The committee asked the Scottish Government to reassess whether the firework control zone provision on its own is sufficient or whether local authorities should also be allowed to establish no-firework zones. The evidence we received highlighted significant operational administrative enforcement and resourcing challenges, which the committee asked to be addressed during the Parliament's scrutiny of the bill. The committee is keen to scrutinise the details of the licensing scheme and the firework control zones. We therefore recommended that the superaffirmative procedure be used, which will allow us to consider the draft regulations in advance of them being laid in Parliament. Will the convener note that concerns were raised in the committee about the lack of detail of the proposed licensing scheme in the primary legislation that has been asked to pass and that we have just been asked to simply hope that secondary legislation will address the many concerns that have been raised by stakeholders? I thank Jamie Greene for his intervention. I hope that we today have reflected all committee members' concerns about the timescales. The final area that I wish to cover this afternoon is the new criminal offence to prohibit the possession of a pyrotechnic article such as a distress or signal flare. It is currently legal for people to carry and possess pyrotechnics except when in certain venues such as football grounds or at certain events such as music festivals. The new offence is to address gaps in the existing law where someone travelling to an event is in possession of a pyrotechnic. The fire and police services support the introduction of the new offence. However, Police Scotland and the Scottish Police Federation raised concerns about the challenges in enforcing the offence as it is currently drafted in the bill. Both questioned how police officers are to prove that someone is travelling to an event and asked for the bill to be amended to introduce a simpler, more effective possession offence. Police Scotland also asked for a presumption of contents provision to be included in the bill. That is to address problems where someone claims a firework or pyrotechnic in their possession is not what the packaging says it is. The committee asked the Scottish Government to address those issues. In concluding, time does not allow all the areas that are considered by the committee to be covered. However, it is clear that there is support across the chamber to address the misuse of fireworks and pyrotechnics. Committee members are keen to engage and work constructively with the minister in order that the bill can be improved to become an effective and workable vehicle to achieve legal, safe and, most of all, enjoyable firework and pyrotechnic use in Scotland. Ms Nicolle, before we call on the next speaker, I have a gentle reminder to those who wish to speak in the debate to press the request-to-speak buttons. We have a fair bit of time in hand, so you are encouraged to offer and take interventions, but you will be required to repress your button if you make an intervention. I call Jamie Greene for around 13 minutes. I would like to pay a huge thanks to the criminal justice committee of this Parliament, our clerks, our spice colleagues and everyone who has really engaged with the process so far in the preparation of our stage 1 report, be it the animal welfare charities, the nationalistic society of Scotland and also the communities who have been blighted by firework use or indeed misuse, some of whom we warmly welcome to the chamber today. I want to make one thing really clear from the outset in my comments. We on these benches both accept and acknowledge that the misuse of fireworks and pyrotechnics is a very real problem for communities right across Scotland, as the convener of the committee stated. There is zero justification for using fireworks as a weapon, whether that is against our hard-working emergency service workers, animals or pets, or it is simply used to terrorise whole communities with anti-social behaviour. I do believe that this Parliament can and will send a strong message that that is simply not acceptable. That being said, the question that has been put to us today, as well as whether this specific piece of legislation as drafted actually addresses that issue. I will be honest when I embarked on this journey, I had some reservations because the so-called ban on fireworks is anything but. Indeed, it almost initially felt quite intrinsically illiberal or even overkill, a phrase that was used by the committee in its report and indeed in our sessions. It came up regularly as if this was a sledgehammer being used to crack the proverbial nut. However, as it happens, we have all been on a journey and we have come to realise that the bill is technical in nature, complex in its proposals, a little bit controversial and perhaps even unworkable. I have worked on a number of bills over the years. Sadly, this stage 1 report is the least positive and most critical I have ever drafted. Its 70 pages are littered with critique, with concern and consternation about the Government's approach to a problem. Before I go into those, though I want to get something else off my chest and it will be no surprise to anyone, the truncated scrutiny that is being asked of us to pass this bill does two things. First of all, I am afraid, it makes an absolute mockery of how we ought to make and pass law in this place, because this 70-page report only came out last Thursday ahead of a bank holiday weekend and the 36-page response from the Government only came out yesterday on said bank holiday and here we are having the stage 1 debate and indeed we are being asked to vote on this matter and the general principles tonight. We are being asked to support the general principles of a bill in a second, a bill that is littered with complications and controversy. I want to ask members on reflection how many of those, perhaps even outwith of the justice committee, can say hand on heart that they have had enough time to review the report and the Government's response to inform them enough to vote on the matter, notwithstanding what their works tell them to do. It's not on and it's not good enough. I'm happy to give way to the member. Morrin Whitfield Very grateful, Deputy Presiding Officer, and I'm very grateful to Jeremy Green for taking the intervention. Would you agree with me that a shorter bill that dealt with the priority element of it, in other words, adults purchasing fireworks or passing fireworks on to those under 18, could be achieved much quicker and perhaps with far less need for concern and reduction in times for parliamentary scrutiny? Morrin Whitfield It would, quite simply, and it should have been. I'll come on to the loot poll issue, because it's an important point. The Government is asking us to rush through the bill because it wants to close that loot poll before bonfire night this year. I support them in that, actually. That's something that we could have done. The so-called proxy purchasing issue is a live one. We discussed it in the committee. However, what we're being asked to do is to bypass what is well-respected, tried and tested robust parliamentary scrutiny of legislation. We need to make sensible law. I'm afraid that asking members to suspend the standing orders and to breach them is no way to legislate if that gives the member any comfort, because what we're been asked to do in the next seven weeks is to truncate that three-stage process. The bill is far bigger and wider than just closing that loot poll. Why? Because it creates a licensing scheme for the purchase and ownership of fireworks. It regulates the sale and the purchase and the use of fireworks. It bans private use of fireworks outside of permitted days, which ministers decided. It gives police stop and search powers, which they don't currently have, and it creates firework control zones, whatever on earth they might be. The bill is big in its impact, but it is surprisingly scant in detail, and that's the problem. So much so that the committee used the phrase, a lack of detail in the bill more than five times in its stage 1 report. The response from the Government that from the brief time I've had to digest its 36-page response says, don't worry, just pass the bill and we'll fix all of this in secondary legislation. Well that's great, but we don't rush bills like this for a reason, minister, because the devil is in the detail. The very idea that we're having a stage 2 deadline, and the very idea that we're having a stage 2 deadline forced upon us in just two weeks, well so let's find for the minister who has a team of solicitors sitting up the back helping her, we don't, and I want to make sure that the bill that we do pass is fit for purpose, I'm happy to give away. I'm not saying I don't understand the members' concerns and indeed the chamber's concerns, I do accept that. However, would the member not accept that it's entirely normal to set out the broad provisions in the primary legislation because that's the appropriate place to put them, and the detail and the administrative details in secondary legislation because that allows them to be amended as the future goes on and that's the appropriate place to put them. I don't know when the last time the minister actually sat as a member of a committee, but she will know that secondary legislation is far from perfect when it comes to scrutinising, and the member will also know that the consultation that you need to pass primary legislation is far greater. The three-stage process is what it is for a reason. We are a unicameral chamber, we need that much needed time and scrutiny. Seven weeks is not enough, we've all been clear about that. The committee itself, on page 63 of our report, says that the committee has very serious concerns about the bill achieving its objective. The committee says, quote, the committee is concerned that there would be no time for these concerns to be addressed at stages 2 or 3 because of the fast-track timetable of the bill. That was the collective view of the committee, and I agree with that view, because this is the weakest and most cautious recommendation for a bill at stage 1 that I've ever worked on. It's no secret that even agreeing the general principles itself was quite a battle in the committee. We wanted to keep the politics out of this, because I think that we do want to demonstrate as a Parliament to the wider public that we want to address nuisance firework use, but that agreement is in good faith to use the language that we used in the report, and the Government's response to our many challenges was equally rushed and I'm afraid quite vague. Let's go back to the beginning. I want to tell you why I'm not brimming with confidence about this legislation, because the overarching principles of the bill does the following. It bans the private youth sale and purchase for defined periods of time. It regulates and restricts the retailers who sell them to the public, and it criminalises members of the public for usage of fireworks outside of randomly selected dates, punishable, apparently, by six months in prison. Not that anyone goes to prison for six months in Scotland as it is, which all might seem well and good to those watching thinking that, thank goodness, the Parliament is doing something about it, but the industry itself tells us, I quote, that this might have the opposite effect, an increase in the number of people who use fireworks inappropriately, the exact opposite of what the minister and the communities of Scotland once. Their words are not mine, because at the moment we really only tend to associate fireworks with major celebrations, Bonfire Night and Hogmanay, but this bill, as drafted now, magically encourages use on 57 days per year. 57 days is a lot, minister, and the chosen days, when we can use fireworks, are rather ambiguous, arguably discriminatory. For example, Chinese New Year and De Valle are in there, and that's great. The minister told me either, of course, there was widespread and extensive, inclusive consultation. Well and good. So I will ask the minister who in the Muslim community said that they were happy for Eid to be left off this list. Who in the Jewish community said that they were happy for Hanukkah to be left off this list? Who in the secular community said that they were happy for Beltine to be left off this list? Because if that consultation was true to its value and its point, then why are those dates not in your magic list of when we can use fireworks? I feel that we've already had this exchange, but I will confirm to the member that extensive consultation was taken in order to address the points that the member is making, and that the dates included in the bill reflect the dates that were provided to us where fireworks are traditionally used as part of the celebration. I've also explained to the member already that we have retained a power within the bill that should any further dates come to light that are not covered, the bill can be updated. That makes my point exactly, is that people will challenge this. It is inevitable that people will challenge this, and more and more and more dates will be added. I'm the view that we shouldn't be restricting to that extent, but people who want us to tackle fireworks in a more restrictive way will be thinking that this bill just makes a complete mockery of the principle of it by simply adding and adding and adding as people challenge the Government for its discriminatory use of when we can and can't use them. The bill also does one other thing, which overarchs a lot of it, and that is this utterly ridiculous situation where you can let off fireworks, you can't let off fireworks in your own garden, but if your neighbour can afford to pay a company to do it, they can do it because they're exempt from the legislation. Who will be able to buy fireworks after we pass this bill? You need a licence, you need to pay a fee, but we don't know how much the fee is. You need to sit a test, but we don't know what is in the test or who will administer it. Only then will you be able to purchase fireworks on the 37 days per year that you can purchase them. That 37 days is not the same as the 57 days that you can use them. Confused? I don't blame you. Of course none of this is even in the bill itself. I need to make some progress. We've been asked to hope for the best that this will all just work out. The other point that we will make in our comments today is the impact on the industry.  We're killing their market, and we need to be aware of that. It's all very well saying, don't worry, there'll be compensation, but don't ask me what it is because I don't really know yet. They need to know that, and they need to know it before we pass this bill at stage 3. There are very valid questions about the black market. How many substandard, dangerous products will find their way into our streets, into our homes, into people's hands and end up in hospital? How many of those white vans that we know already exist in communities will appear or multiply? How many of those will see this as an opportunity to flood the market outside of the defined periods where we can buy fireworks? The committee is not convinced that the proposed licensing scheme will achieve the outcomes that the Scottish Government intends or how it will work in practice. That's hardly a ringing endorsement, Presiding Officer. I read the Scottish Government's response, and it seems to say, don't worry, we will consult on this, but we can't do that in the next couple of weeks. Just pass the bill and we'll fix it. This is my last point, and this is the one that really bugs me the most. It is entirely unclear to us, as a Parliament, if we even need to further legislate to criminalise the use, the sale and the purchase of fireworks, because we already have laws which do a lot of this. Over the past five years, there were 6,000 incidents. Incidences were fireworks recorded by Police Scotland. 6,000 incidents recorded. Of those, 518 crimes were recorded under the Explosive Substances Act 1883 and the keeping the supply of explosive legislation. There were only 136 charges brought about under various offences over that time period, of which only 16 resulted in a criminal conviction. 16 criminal convictions over five years. Let's take a snapshot of last year alone. There were 974 firework-related complaints to the police last year. There were 29 criminal charges brought, and guess how many convictions? None. Absolutely none. It is already illegal to use a firework as a weapon. It is already illegal to use a firework as an antisocial behaviour, or to attack people, including emergency service workers, or to use it to vandalise properties. Let's have a think about this. If we use the laws that already exist to their full extent, maybe we would think twice about rushing the bill through. I want something to be done, even as a pet owner, but that is something that could start now. The Government was presented a 10-point plan by the industry on improving safety and tackling social behaviour, and that has largely been ignored. The bill creates so many exclusions, exemptions and uses permitted of fireworks. It is almost pointless. It is half-baked, half-hearted and it is messy. It does not go as far as a ban, and it regulates to the point of confusion. The whole point is the public want action, and I share that sense of frustration. It is a palpable sense of frustration, but maybe that action should be using the laws that we already have. In conclusion, I will end where I started. We, as a committee, worked hard, positively and constructively together, to agree to a report that did this issue justice. However, we caveated pretty much every single conclusion of the report, which is completely shredded in doubt and suspicion. We want to help the Government to achieve that, but the Government needs to help us in return. I will say that we will support the general principles of the bill, simply to allow it to pass through the next stages of the process. I want the public to know that this is an issue that we really are taking seriously. However, the report fills no-one with confidence. I am afraid—I do not know if we will—to fix it in the few short weeks that we have. This is a mess, and this is a mess of the Government's own making. Bad law will help no-one, Presiding Officer. If the Government is really serious about this issue, it needs to read the committee's report cover to cover and come back to it with a concrete and detailed response, detailed proposals on how it will address the issues that are concerned. We have done our bit, and now the minister must do theirs. They must do it properly and, goodness, they must do it fast. Thank you very much for Mr Greene. We now move to the open debate. I call Fulton MacGregor to be followed by Sue Webber. Mr MacGregor, I agenerate in six minutes. Thank you, Presiding Officer. As a member of the Justice Committee, it gives me great pleasure to speak in this debate today. Like others, I think that I have already indicated it. I think that it is fair to say that I committed the process of scrutinising this bill, believing that it is perhaps most straightforward than in reality has turned out to be and that it is worth putting on the record that I do not think that the time constraints have been particularly helpful, as more questions are always being moved forward in the scrutiny process. That said, I fully understand the reasons for this, to have some provisions around proxy purchase in place to respond fire season. I think that it is also important to say that, while it is important to have on the record the concerns about the timescales all committee members did agree to the amended timetable, albeit with some reluctance. I know that some members have perhaps went back a step in that, for good reason, but I think that it is also important to say that the committee did agree to the new timetables, and I think that we should stick to that, what we agreed to. There are undoubtedly some concerns with this bill, and I will come to that myself, but at its heart, as others have said, is an attempt by the Government to address the serious threats that fireworks and pyrotechnics pose and, indeed, cause to our communities. Although we do not have all the powers tacked in this area, our constituents expect us to do what we can, and it is clear to me that legislation is needed. Fireworks are explosives, and there are risks of injuries with their use. We heard that the types of injuries are wide-ranging, with eye and hand injuries being the most common, and that they tend to speak around festivals and during private displays, so that is serious stuff. As well as causing environmental pollution, fireworks often cause significant levels of noise, and this is particularly distressing for anyone with increased noise sensitivity, such as those with PTSD and autism. Indeed, Rob Holland, acting director of the National Autistic Society Scotland, outlined to the committee the great distress fireworks can cause for people with autism, and that, I think, we all agree, is just not acceptable. Fireworks can also have greatly negative effects on animals too, pets and wildlife. In anyone who owns a dog, I do not, but I know what lots people do, will all be all too aware of the stress and anxiety that they exhibit on the evening, certain celebrations and holidays where fireworks are involved. So the proposed bill looks to address these issues by introducing the following restrictions. The bill will introduce a licensing system for buying, processing and using fireworks. The criteria for a licence being granted are focused on demonstrating that an individual can use fireworks in a safe, responsible manner. There would also be a requirement to successfully complete a fireworks training course before a licence was granted. It will be a criminal offence to buy, possess or use fireworks without a licence or to supply fireworks to a person without a licence. It will also be an offence to give fireworks or pirate technical articles to a child or to buy them on behalf of a child. I'm very grateful. I'm not on the committee and due to the lack of scrutiny time, I'm not over the detail of this, but can the member tell me, is there a risk that by imposing these restrictions on retailers and consumers that the consumer ends up buying online and ending up in the same position as they were before? However, a load of Scottish businesses have been put out of business. I thank the member for that intervention, and he'll be glad to know that it's issues that the committee has looked at in detail and referred to in the report, and I'll perhaps come back to that in a wee bit in terms of the online... If the person is buying online, they will need to comply with the legislation the same as a shop, but I'll come back to, maybe, I think, where the member's going in terms of the black market in perhaps a wee bit. As we have heard, beside not, there are concerns about how effective this scheme might be. Will some people simply not apply for a licence but use fireworks regardless? Will some people be able to better afford the fee than others? We've already heard about that, and those are questions that I would urge the Government to continue to consider in moving forward to stage 2. The bill also proposes to give local authorities the power to designate fire control zones whereby the use of fireworks in those areas would be restricted. That would greatly lessen the risk of firework-related injuries on members of the public and help to reduce the levels of noise-related stress for much humans and animals suffering. The committee has also recommended that how that will work in practice needs to be relayed to the general public. I think that that's an important point. The bill will also look to make it an offence to be in possession of pyrotechnics while travelling to or attending certain places or events and the ministers covered that in great detail. I think that that is a very, very important issue because we're all now quite familiar with pyrotechnics being used at particular sporting events and elsewhere. The bill will also restrict the number of days each year when certain fireworks can be supplied in Scotland. The Scottish Government has prepared, engaged with various faith groups, to ensure that important festivals would not be overlooked. And the reasoning behind this provision makes common sense and seems to have wide support from the stakeholders we heard from, mainly as it allows people affected by fireworks to take action to mitigate any associated harms. However, as my colleague Jamie Greene articulated, the committee did have some concerns with that. For example, the Government deciding what days are important could potentially be problematic in an ethical sense. If the Government deciding what days are important, I'm sure that that's not been lost in the minister, that other people might disagree with that. And also, with so many days scheduled, this is potentially confusing to the wider public as to when police may take action on fireworks use. I do, however, think that this is a difficult question to answer and perhaps more local authority for flexibility around local important dates could be given more consideration by the Government. The restriction on the amount of days that will affect retailers too, as we've heard and the committee have acknowledged that David McKenzie, who is the chair of the Society of Chief Officers of Trading Standards in Scotland, raised the point that these restrictions will have a significant effect in businesses that sell fireworks all year round and noted that the legitimate interests of such businesses should be taken into account. And I do think that we need to do that and we need more information on the compensation scheme. There are also concerns raised about the possibility of a black market growing where perhaps Liam Kerr was going with his question with Ireland being cited to us as an example. However, when the committee asked Irish Government for the response, as he did not seem to raise any specific concern, that said I think it's something that the Government must continue to monitor it very closely. Sorry. I'm very grateful. It's not the black market I'm concerned about. It's the perfectly legitimate people just saying, I'm going to go online and I'll buy from there because I don't need to have any restrictions on me. It's not the black market. Fulton MacGregor. Well, if it's a legitimate purchase, I think it would be expected that online retailers would be subject to the same conditions as in Wales. In concluding, Presiding Officer, the proposed legislation is to clear support to the public as evidence by significant number of consultation gathering opinion polling and engaging opportunities that the Scottish Government has undertaken. Other countries and jurisdictions have taken similar actions often stricter and think it's right that we do what we can within the powers we have to cut fireworks use. The bill is not yet the finished article and there's nobody denying that but I believe that we do have the potential to make it better and more robust at stage 2 with this Parliament working together to achieve that like we've done through a committee. Part of the bill will be about simply taking another step in our journey to changing our relationship with fireworks like seat belts and the smoking ban. It won't change everyone's behaviour overnight but through time it will help to shift behaviour by demonstrating where the Government and Parliament stand on it. With the caveats outlined in the committee report I support the general principles of the bill and would encourage the Parliament to vote for it at decision time tonight. Thank you. Thank you Mr McGregor. I now call on to Weber. We will be followed by Rona Mackay for around about four minutes. Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I welcome the chance to speak in this debate today and we can all agree that more action should be taken to tackle anti-social behaviour involving firework misuse which can cause so much harm to our emergency workers, people sensitive to loud noises and of course our pets. And of those of you that don't know in the chamber I have a lovely puppy that's involved in a competition. Referencing the dogs trust references they've contacted us to remind us that dogs generally feel safer and more secure when they can predict and control their environment. So fireworks which are inherently loud, bright, unpredictable and difficult to escape from can cause them immense stress and has a negative impact on their welfare. Fireworks can elicit undesirable behavioural responses such as avoidance and hiding away, not eating, trembling, shaking, panting, not being able to settle, agitation etc. All as the physical manifestations of them trying to cope with a perceived threat that they do not understand. I don't know how Alfie will react he's only four months old but I will be glad to know that he will not be as stressed in the next time. However just because we know something needs to be done does not mean we should be rushing the decision making process. This bill is being rushed through Parliament so that the SNP Government can avoid proper scrutiny. The consultation showed support for taking tough action on firework misuse and we agree that tough action needs to be taken to tackle the anti-social behaviour with fireworks but this law is being rushed through Parliament and it is poorly drafted. Bad law will not fix the problems that the public clearly want to be addressed. There has not been enough time to scrutinise this bill and it has significant flaws. There is not a single full day between the criminal justice committee stage 1 report and Parliament debating the proposal. Scottish Parliament standing orders state a stage 1 report must be published at least five sitting days before Parliament considers the general principles of a bill which has not happened in this situation. The bill's proposed licensing system has not been fleshed out. The firework control zones are confusing and the impact of the bill on the growth of a black market and the future of fireworks industry online or in person has not been made clear. In the Lothian region, anti-social behaviour involving fireworks has been a long-standing issue in Blackburn. There were fireworks misuse by individuals at various times of the year especially around Bonfernight on 5 November in Blackburn. However, over several years the anti-social behaviour around Bonfernight became more intense and problematic. In 2017 and 2018, policing riot gear was called in to deal with the situation because it got so bad and because of that, the Blackburn Bonfernight action group was formed. However, some in this group were not convinced about how firework control zones would be pleased and could have the reverse effect of intended. It would be good to have measures in place by Bonfernight this year to tackle anti-social behaviour but it is not Parliament's fault that the SNP Government wasted so much time they were unable to present the bill at an earlier date. Police have highlighted potential enforcement issues as well with the bill as drafted and the fire service point out that the firework control zones may simply shift the location of anti-social behaviour. Those issues must be addressed before the bill becomes law and we at the Scottish Conservatives support doubling the maximum sentence for assaulting an emergency worker and under undercurrent legislation the maximum sentence for assaulting an emergency worker is 12 months. I'm actually closing, thank you. It's up to me. Sorry. The SNP's ban on prison sentences of 12 months or less means those convicted under this law will avoid prison. While we are broadly supportive of the intentions of the bill, the SNP Government have failed to provide the sufficient details of the proposals so far. The SNP Government needs to give Parliament sufficient time to scrutinise those changes that need to be made to the bill and they must be addressed before it becomes law. Thank you, Ms Webber. You're right on the interventions but perder rules do prevent campaigning on the Holyrood dog of the year elections in the chamber. I now call on Rona Mackay to be followed by Martin Whitfield for around six minutes. Thank you, Presiding Officer. As a member of the Justice Committee I'm pleased to be speaking in today's stage 1 debate of the Fireworks and Piratechny Cartoil Scotland Bill. The bill is complex with many moving parts so I thank the Justice Clerks and the bill team for turning around the stage 1 report so quickly. It truly was a herculean effort. I thank the minister for responding to the report and time for today's debate. Presiding Officer, we've heard in the opening speeches the challenges this bill presented to the committee and there are challenges surrounding the fast tracking of this bill. But in all honesty I don't believe the general public care is near too much about our parliamentary processes. They just want the noise and annoyance of fireworks going off in their neighbourhoods with increasing regularity to stop. We know this to be true from the public consultation carried out in 2019 which returned 16,420 responses and 94 per cent of those respondents said that they would welcome increased control of the use of fireworks. Very grateful. I don't necessarily disagree with the member's point but she will presumably accept what the public really wants is legislation that has been fully scrutinised and has been shown that it will work rather than just something put in place for the sake of it. Rona Mackay Thank you. Yeah, I mean obviously legislation will have to work and we will have the chance for scrutiny at stage 2. And you know, I think the public just want to see us taking action now. It's quite clear that they do. It's clear that something had to be done about the burgeoning use of fireworks once only set off on November 5th and now being used regularly throughout the year. So let's start at the beginning. The purpose of this bill is to protect public and community safety and wellbeing by ensuring fireworks and pyrotechnics don't cause harm, distress or serious injury because unfortunately Presiding Officer that is all too often what they do. This bill introduces a cultural shift in how fireworks and pyrotechnics are used in Scotland and it's a cultural shift that the people of Scotland clearly want. Speaking personally, I would have preferred the changes to mean licensing for organised displays only but it's not within the Scottish Government's power to ban the purchase of fireworks as consumer law is not fully devolved to Scotland. The bill that we're debating today will introduce licensing, restrictions on supply and use of fireworks, firework control zones, pyrotechnic articles at certain venues, their events and the deals with exemptions and enforcement. There's certainly a lot in there and not really enough time in six minutes to go into detail in every aspect. As we've heard most provisions will be introduced next year but the bill has been fast tracked to plug a gap in current legislation to ban the proxy sale of fireworks or pyrotechnics to young people under the age of 18 this year. Presiding Officer it's crucial for the Scottish Government to respond to the wishes of the public and this is the start of a framework in conjunction with the independent firework review group that will shift the landscape for years to come when it comes to the public buying and using fireworks. The committee asked why it wasn't possible to introduce this year's relatively minor provision by secondary legislation but the fireworks act 2003 relates to commercial supply and again is reserved to the UK Government. But as I said earlier this will be of little or no interest to the general public who just wants us to go on and do something. So the committee heard compelling evidence from Police Scotland, the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service SSPCA and the National Autistic Society Scotland that they supported restrictions on the sale and use of fireworks. And here's why. Neurodiverse people, war veterans, the elderly and of course pet owners and livestock owners dread the noise and disruption fireworks cause. Whole neighbourhoods sound like war zones and the emergency services are on high alert. I vividly remember the terror my dogs went through with each ear splitting bang. Fireworks may be lovely to look at but why do they need to be so loud and disturbing? Is all that noise and distress really worth it? Which brings me on to a line of questioning my colleague Collette Stevenson articulately pursued the possibility of the widened use of silent fireworks but I'm sure Collette will address this in her speech so I'll leave her to expand on that. Presiding officer as we've heard is increasing evidence of anti-social behaviour relating to fireworks which is why this legislation is so necessary. On a committee visit to Blackburn West Lothian members heard of serious anti-social behaviour in areas relating to fireworks something had to be done. However there are aspects of this bill that do need clarification and simplification particularly around licensing the no fireworks zones and enforcement and I'm sure more will come out in all of this at stage too and the minister has said she'll listen to the views on the no fireworks zone. As our report says much of the detail around these aspects planned for next year wasn't available to the committee and the committee asked for these provisions to be proposed under the superaffirmative procedure to afford proper scrutiny and I'm disappointed that the government has chosen not to do that however the affirmative procedure will allow some scrutiny. There are issues around avoiding a potential black market just one of the concerns highlighted by the fireworks industry when they gave evidence. The government have said that trading standards and the new licensing laws will compact that but it still needs very careful monitoring. There may be issues around public confusion and I agree with Pauline McNeill on this about when they can buy and set off fireworks the level of the licence fee and that's vital that that must be reasonable and affordable and the enforcement of the new regulations. I note that the government is committed to introducing a mock user journey for the licensing system to set out in more practical terms how the systems plan to work in advance of stage 3 and I really welcome that. It's essential that a large public awareness campaign should be launched by the government so that people understand the new legislation from the outset. Presiding Officer, as the convener said the committee will work with the government on the next crucial stages of the bill to clarify some of these concerns. In conclusion, the government wants people to enjoy fireworks safely and to reduce the public nuisance element that they're becoming and this is the start of that journey to make fireworks use safer and less intrusive for everyone and I urge the chamber to pass the general principles at decision time tonight. Thank you, Ms Mackay. I now call on Martin Wickfield to be followed by Collette Stevenson for around six minutes. I'm very grateful, Deputy Presiding Officer, and it's a pleasure to participate in the stage 1 debate and indeed to follow Rona Mackay's contribution. And I can say at the outset that I agree with the bill's intentions and I, you know, pass my compliments to the criminal justice committee for a very long and excellent report. You know, myself and Scottish Labour recognise the majority of people want to enjoy fireworks and believe that this should be allowed but allowed responsibly. But we also understand the impact that the dangerous misuse of fireworks has upon the public including those who discharge the fireworks themselves as well as the burden that this puts on our police and emergency workers. And I welcome the preventative measures aimed at addressing the concerns over the misuse of fireworks and especially of keeping people and our animals safe. Yet in line with the committee I remain very concerned that there are gaps, there's lack of clarity in this bill and indeed that gap and clarity might undermine the intentions of this legislation. I'd like to take the opportunity to thank the Dogs Trust for their briefing on the fireworks and pyrotechnic article Scotland Bill because, as they say, as a dog welfare charity, they report the very negative experience of fireworks, dogs generally feel safer as we've heard and more secure when they can predict and control their environment and need not just dogs but also cats and other pets but also children and young people and other members of our community who fear the nights of fireworks because of the noise because of the unexpected environment. And to be honest this bill isn't going to put that right because we are still going to have fireworks and there is still a tension between these two points of principle one how do we protect our communities of Scotland in the best possible way but also how do we allow celebration through fireworks of major cultural events both for some communities but also as Scotland as a whole. There are some areas of concern and the first that I would like to look at is that of supply to those under 18 years of age. In the committee report at paragraph 65 they stated the government's decision to use this bill as a means to address this issue also means the substantial complex new provisions to restrict fireworks receive limited scrutiny in which much of the substantial detail being left to regulations that will follow. And in its response the government have said well indeed the government have not said they were wholly silent on this element of the concern and I would welcome the minister's views on this and whether and probably more importantly how the government intends to develop and allow scrutiny both by this chamber but also as I mentioned in intervention stakeholders outside of here about the proposals that are being put forward and given the short expedited table we do not intend to end up in a census situation running up to November 2022 where we're rushing to get elements of this bill onto the legislature. My secondary of concern relates to the licensing system being proposed and I note the committee's support for the licensing system although indeed much of the detail is lacking. The government believe the system will not lead to a quote black market and fireworks but illegal markets have developed elsewhere and indeed have developed in other products I think in particular of tobacco. In its response the Scottish government said they note the request of the committee for an outline of the steps that will be taken to prevent the potential growth of a black market but the government go on to say that they consider that the licensing system itself strikes the balance between ensuring the necessary safeguards are in place for fireworks purchase and used in safe appropriate ways but the government have not set out the steps that they will take to prevent the development of an illegal market they merely reiterate that it won't happen and I don't share the confidence with the government in this. If the government can set out the steps first to identify the development of an illegal market but then secondly how it will stop that developing I think that would be very helpful moving forward with the bill. The committee specifically asked at paragraph 194 the Scottish government should consider the illegal acquisition of fireworks and pyrotechnics may occur furthermore it is unclear how current legal online purchases will work across the UK. In the response the government has said at paragraphs 30 to 33 that displacement of fireworks sales indeed I think this was mentioned in one of the interventions the displacement of fireworks sales will not happen because of the license system and that the bill covers the entire supply system but illegal markets develop and operate outside of systems that's why they are illegal markets by their very nature and unfortunately I fear that those perhaps if I use the word carefully entrepreneurial skills may see an opportunity to make money at the expense of legitimate suppliers so can I ask what confidence the minister has that the policy will not be invalidated with an increased supply of unregulated fireworks and by unregulated I don't mean in their manufacture but in the whole supply system the licensing system set up by the government and the enforcement of course will rest with police Scotland and local trading standards and given the crisis in recruitment for local trading standards and the cuts applied over the last 14 years to local government what confidence does the Scottish Government have that local authorities will be in a position to enforce this successfully this November within this year's financial year I am aware of in the response from the government that they will continue to discuss this with COSLA but I would like assurances that the funding will be in addition rather than be expected to come from other budgets within local authority control the proposed licence system is very complex and it lacks key details and it would be helpful to have those and if I can indulge upon the deputy presiding officer two elements that do concern me with regard to the dates and the power the minister seeks to regulate additional dates have thoughts been made with regard to sporting events where pyrotechnics are used frequently both at the start and the end of games and indeed tournaments and also a thought towards the children garlands on the east coast of the country where fireworks also play a predominant part so finally given the nature of the scrutiny at this stage although the legislation may deliver a cultural change in the use of fireworks at private events it is not really clear how this will address firework misuse and antisocial behaviour which is I believe what the people of Scotland are most concerned and they remain an area of concern with myself I'm grateful deputy presiding officer Thank you very much indeed Mr Whitefield and I call on Collette Stevenson for again around six minutes please Thank you, Presiding Officer As a member of the criminal justice committee I am pleased to speak today in support of the general principles of the fireworks and pyrotechnic articles Scotland Bill There is a balance to be struck between the responsible enjoyment of fireworks and tackling misuse and the negative impacts of noise Many respondents to the consultation asked for more action on tackling the nuisance element and antisocial behaviour This bill will protect public and community safety by ensuring fireworks and pyrotechnics do not cause harm, distress or injury Importantly, the bill will also protect wellbeing for neurodiverse people for people with PTSD and for animals demonstrated by the support for the bill from stakeholders including the Dogs Trust, the National Autistic Society of Scotland and the SSPCA Through the introduction of a fireworks licensing system and new criminal offences the bill will ensure appropriate action is taken over the sale and use of fireworks as well as reducing the misuse of flares In terms of getting the balance right many people of you organised a fireworks displays as fun and important cultural tradition Professional displays are popular particularly at Hogmanay and for Guy Fox Knight By their nature most people in the community are aware when and where this is happening and can plan accordingly For example people with autism and PTSD or care owners can make plans to minimise the potential impacts However, I'm sure other members have heard the sentiments of people that when fireworks start going off randomly from October onwards the impact of the noise can be distressing and antisocial behaviour can be very frightening From a personal perspective I know the effects fireworks can have on dogs I've had to get in touch with the vet to get my medication to settle my dog I believe the steps outlined in the bill will help to tackle this On the theme of noise disturbance I want to talk about about the potential for low noise fireworks When I shared the consultation on my Facebook page a lot of people got in touch asking could we not just silent our low noise fireworks In committee I asked the minister whether the legislation could perhaps incentivise people to buy lower noise fireworks I appreciate the minister's interest in this and that there is scope to include this following further talks with industry In an evidence session with representatives from the fireworks industry we heard that low noise fireworks are not new and are on the market I want to reiterate my line of questioning to those representatives and their answers because it is important Low noise fireworks are readily available and cost roughly the same as high noise fireworks I accept that many consumers do not know that lower noise fireworks exist and that staff can only do so much to encourage people to try them I hope yet happy to take an intervention Thanks Jamie Greene Can I thank the member I appreciate that she spoke about this a lot in committee and it's an important point I mean first of all there's no such things as silent fireworks fireworks all making element of noise to one extent but the problem is is that the shop that we spoke to who came to give evidence said that people do not know that they exist but we offer that information and when people come into the shop we let them know that they can buy those noise fireworks How are they going to be able to do that when those shops close their doors? Collette Seigerson I take on board and I thank you for the intervention There's no sure cert that they are going to close and having spoken to those representatives as well and I believe the likes of bigger supermarkets such as Sainsbury's as the Tesco are actually selling low noise fireworks but I'll come on to this as well in terms of raising awareness so I hope that this debate will help raise awareness of the low noise alternatives and that retailers will be encouraged to stock more low noise products I would like to see more education on this and perhaps it's something that the Scottish Government the fireworks industry Police Scotland and the third sector could jointly work on The Dogs Trust has well made an interesting point in their briefing for today's debate around the labelling of fireworks requesting the decibel levels to be on the packaging to help buyers make informed choices I hope that is something that retailers could consider and I would be interested to know the minister's views on this and whether she could discuss it with the UK Government However, we should also be aware that noise is not the only issue Anti-social behaviour surrounding fireworks is a huge problem Police officers and firefighters are often on the receiving end of attacks which can lead to severe injury Furthermore, just as the noise can be harmful so too can the visual aspect of a fireworks distress for some neurodiverse people The bill's proposal for licensing and firework control zones will help here and will increase the powers of the police In conclusion the criminal justice committee has signalled its support for the general principles of the bill and I hope Parliament will do so today As the minister knows the committee is keen to work with her to develop the proposals and I look forward to continuing that work There is a real opportunity to improve community safety and protect wellbeing so I support the motion Thank you Thank you very much, Ms Stevenson I now call on Maggie Chapman to be followed by Stuart McMillan for around six minutes, Ms Chapman Thank you, Presiding Officer I'd like to begin by thanking the criminal justice committee for all the work that went into their inquiry and for producing a report on the bill that they have published I have followed their discussions and deliberations on this issue with interest I'd like to extend my thanks too to all those who gave evidence to the committee and to those who provided briefings and information in advance of this afternoon's debate particularly perhaps the animal welfare charities as a member of the cross-party group on animal welfare and as someone who is totally soppy about animals it won't come as a surprise that I have very strong opinions about fireworks and their use On behalf of the Scottish Greens I welcome the introduction of this bill to Parliament We support the general principles of this proposed legislation We believe that fireworks ought to be more strongly regulated to ensure they are used by appropriate people at appropriate times for the benefit of as many people as possible while minimising distress as much as possible Although regulation of sale is reserved to Westminster there are steps that can be taken now to achieve this in Scotland This bill takes a step in the right direction by further limiting the sale and use of fireworks and pyrotechnics We would like to see it go further Our policy is to stop public sales to individuals entirely but we will work constructively over the coming weeks to make this legislation as robust as possible We have heard already this afternoon the varied uses of fireworks and pyrotechnics from the spectacular and celebratory to the functional I think most of us will have encountered some of us maybe even enjoyed fireworks around Chinese New Year, Diwali and, of course, Hogmey Fireworks clearly play an important role in cultural and religious celebrations across Scotland in many different communities But we've also heard about some of the negative impacts of fireworks While fireworks displays are traditional at certain festivals in the year they are dangerous explosive devices that can cause significant amounts of distress to many people to pets, their owners and other animals with whom we share our world Many of us dread certain times of the year times that should be celebratory and fun There is a wealth of evidence that fireworks can cause and does cause significant detrimental effects on the health and wellbeing of many people and animals, not just pets wildlife too Some neurodiverse people and those with stress and panic disorders or sensory disabilities are negatively triggered by fireworks and the negative impacts on pets is well understood I know I won't be alone in having personal experience of this When I was a child one of our much-loved family pet dogs ran away from home after being terrified by a nearby fireworks display We were lucky we found really after four days somehow he had avoided physical harm but I know others are not so lucky The briefings and evidence provided by the Dogs Trust, the Blue Cross the SSPCA and others outlined the grave psychological and physical harms experienced by animals as a consequence of both the proper and improper use of fireworks I stress it's all use of fireworks Yes First of all I'm very sorry to hear about the personal experience shared around animal welfare and the use of fireworks Given everything you've just said in the last three and a half minutes why are you not pushing the Government for an outright ban on fireworks if that's your green party position and also given that you sit in the Scottish Government We don't actually have the powers in Scotland to fully legislate for the ban as we would see it so that is why I see this as a step in the right direction but it is only a step Going back to the harm that we know is experienced by animals we understand it very clearly in terms of our companion animals our pets so we can also understand that other animals will be similarly affected and we should be concerned for their welfare too and of course as we've heard the grave concerns around the safe use of fireworks such as sporting events we've seen recently some of the damage that misuse of these fireworks can cause there are important health and safety considerations for our emergency services too they should not be put at risk of injury by the misuse or abuse of these explosives fireworks should never be used as weapons against any living creature human or otherwise I do hear the concerns raised in the chamber this afternoon and others about the timescales for the passage of this legislation through the parliamentary process I too would like to see more information on and details about the licensing system and fees involved the definition and allocation of control zones the training that will be required to qualify to use fireworks and pyrotechnics and more there were some interesting contributions about exploring low volume fireworks and ensuring decibel levels are clearly labelled as Collette Stevenson has just mentioned Minister will comment on this more in closing but to conclude I agree with Rhona Mackay and others there is general agreement that we need to do more to protect public and community safety and the wellbeing of our pets and other animals and that people want the anti-social use of fireworks that is becoming more prevalent in our communities to stop and to stop now I look forward to working with others to ensure the scrutiny of the bill progresses Thank you I now call Stuart McMillan to be followed by Siobhan Brown Around six minutes please Thank you very much First of all I would like to thank the minister for her comments earlier on regarding some of the DPLR committee's recommendations and the stage 2 amendment will go forward regarding the affirmative procedure and the committee will welcome also to touch upon the reply from the minister to the committee regarding its paragraph 107 of the reply section 352b the minister indicated in the reply of that to still give him consideration for a stage 2 amendment on that to go from a negative to the affirmative procedure I welcome this bill and I know that many of my constituents will also hear in the lead-up 2 and also in the aftermath of Guy Fox night my office is inundated with emails and calls about the impact of the improper use of fireworks I say improper because there will always be people who for whatever reason do not like fireworks even professional organised displays better regulation of how members of the public can purchase and use fireworks therefore ensures that those who don't like them or fear them are less likely to be subjected to fireworks being set off at sporadic times of day and often for weeks before and also after the 5th of November the real issue is when fireworks use becomes anti-social behaviour as it can cause huge stress to people, animals and the environment some of which we've already heard in this debate this afternoon but fireworks can raise background noise levels by several dozen decibels and I think that noise levels can cause the stress to those with noise sensitivity to people or veterans and refugees living with PTSD and I know that certainly from people who have contacted my office over the last few years particularly some veterans who have had some deals with livestock started by fireworks can negatively impact farmers as we've already heard as well and pet owners know of the sheer panic that fireworks noise can cause animals to experience I do want to commend the dogstress for their briefing for today's debate that fireworks can elicit undesirable behaviour behavioural responses in dogs such as hiding away, not eating, trembling panting, not being able to settle agitation, urination and defecation and trying to escape a yeast scrabbling at the doors for veterans who have PTSD or refugees who have fled conflict zones fireworks can be that trauma trigger and at a time when Russia continues to bomb Ukraine on a daily basis and some of us in the chamber may have met Ukrainians coming here to survive we can only imagine the triggering effect that fireworks could actually have upon people who have fled conflict zones that's why I do welcome the bill as it will ensure that appropriate action is taken over the sale and use of fireworks as well as reducing the misuse of pyrotentic devices such as flares and it's already been touched upon in terms of some sporting events where pyrotechnics have been utilising and actually an event not in Scotland but in England an event at the weekend where a footballer actually picked up the pyrotechnics and threw it back towards where the crowd and where so that particular incident has been investigated by the relevant authorities this bill is an important step forward an important step towards reducing the burden on emergency services and preparing for and responding to firework related incidents in one constituency there sadly have been incidents where large scale bonfires and that hawk firework displays genuinely have wreaked havoc upon those particular communities and have occupied huge amount of time of emergency services this has an icon effect for the rest of the constituency who actually may require the assistance of these emergency services let's not forget something else fireworks, if not handled responsibly can cause serious injury and even prove fatal I touch upon that because I touched upon some sporting events UEFA regularly find football clubs in Scotland and elsewhere because of the use of pyrotechnics in football stereo now in my opinion there is absolutely no common sense of having pyrotechnics in any football stadium to be quite honest because they are dangerous in addition the fireworks can pollute the air with gases and particles that can contain metals and other elements that are potentially harmful for human health at local air pollution the frequency of culture decisions involving fireworks and climatic factors can all influence the impacts of fireworks on the environment the Scottish Government has already moved quickly to introduce regulations restricting the times of day and the volume of fireworks that can be supplied to the public as well as the times fireworks can be set off it is clear that the public want to see more action as 84 per cent of respondents to the 2021 consultation backed the introduction of a fireworks licensing scheme which this bill will deliver the introduction of a fireworks licensing scheme means that members of the public will need a licence to buy, possess or use the fireworks and businesses supplying fireworks will need to confirm that the people getting the fireworks either have a licence or don't need one it also specifies that certain fireworks can only be supplied to and used by members of the public at certain times including Guy Foxtay, Hugmanay, Chinese New Year and Diwali and I think certainly in the report from the committee section 157 the report Alistair Hayes' comment and I'll finish you on this point Alistair Hayes said and I quote I feel that the bill strikes the right balance now I know that there's been a number of comments around when the fireworks can be utilised and sold particularly for cultured events but I think Alistair Hayes comments someone who has got a huge amount of experience and actually trying to protect Scotland and I think certainly should be able to listen to thank you very much Thank you Ms McMillan I know Colshon Brown to be followed by Douglas Lunston around six minutes please Ms Brown Thank you Presiding Officer and firstly I want to say how welcome this bill is I was first elected as a councillor in South Asia in 2017 and the misuse of fireworks has been a constant concern to all my constituents and I think this has been reflected in the response to the consultation in 2019 with over 16,000 people participating and a substantial majority of 94% thought there should be more control over the sale of fireworks now I know that Jamie Greene said earlier that the public want progress and although I do not sit on the committee there has been a lot of questions raised today that I hope will be answered at stage 2 so we can progress this bill due to the appetite for reform I grew up in Sydney Australia where every 26th of January is Australia Day and we celebrate it with family, barbecues and of course plenty of fireworks however in Australia things are done very differently for the majority of the country public possession and use of fireworks is banned to reduce the number of accidents burns injury and also destruction to property only licence organised displays are permitted and plenty of warning is given to allow people to properly prepare themselves the bill that has been put forward to Parliament State takes important steps to make the use of fireworks safer and more enjoyable for everyone across Scotland rather it takes a cautious approach that is seen in other countries throughout the world to create a cultural shift in how fireworks are used in Scotland I welcome that the proposal clearly outlines which time the year fireworks can be supplied and used by members of the public and I note in the widely welcomed this was widely welcomed in the digital engagement study for this bill where it was commented that this would allow members of the public who may be impacted by fireworks to mitigate destruction by having a better idea of which states to expect fireworks use Yes Jamie Greene It's interesting here in the example of the situation in Sydney where members simply can't do them unless they organise displays I wonder why the Government has not taken that report but also outside of the use of individuals public use you can actually pay a company who is exempt from the licensing scheme completely to put on a fireworks display any day of the year How is that actually going to solve the problem of inappropriate use of fireworks? Yes I thank the member for the intervention but I do not think that we have the legislation on Hollywood to ban fireworks Sorry Excuse me No sedentary conversations either take another if Mr Greene seeks to make another intervention or take it or don't No sedentary conversations please As I've mentioned since coming into office I've received many emails from constituents about excessive fireworks use in areas and let's face it Guy Fawkes night usually turns into Guy Fawkes months Over the past couple of years the pandemic has hit hard on people's mental health and the Covid-19 recovery committee has been taking evidence from experts on this and I in no way doubt the excessive use of fireworks will exacerbate this for certain individuals especially with our troops We all know that post-traumatic stress disorder is a real issue for those who return from the horrors of war and that's why combat stress urges the public to only buy silent fireworks because a loud bang might mark a fun night for some people but for some others it could transport them back to scenes they would rather forget Last October there was a horrifying explosion in a house in Kincaidston in my constituency of air Six months on the Kincaidston community is still feeling the horrors of that night Only weeks after that night some people locally decided to let off fireworks with Guy Fawkes and this thoughtless act caused really deep distress to the local community who was still coming to terms with the events of that awful night and as we've heard it's not just the people who are affected by fireworks but also our animals we're a nation of animal lovers and that's why some people have real issue with fireworks we've seen how fireworks can impact on all animals especially dogs and many of my constituents choose to sedate their dogs around November I remember back in 2018 fireworks were being left off around Christmas time and a local rescue dog was so terrified it managed to escape and run to a local park called Balile Myself and other volunteers spent a few very cold days in our cars guarding the entrance to the park in case the dog emerged Thankfully after three days the dog was found safe and sound but was still shaking from the experience The Blue Cross notes that the current system of the easy public access to fireworks and poor enforcement of existing legislation is having a detrimental impact on animal welfare They further believe that if it's administered and forced strictly this bill will bring about a greater appreciation on animal welfare and reduce the number of pets and wildlife that are injured or even killed by fireworks in Scotland The Dogs Trust along with many other groups and individuals believe that fireworks use in Scotland should be solely limited to licensed organised public displays at certain times of the years or for events such as weddings I do agree with this principle however it is largely a reserved issue that does not possess the powers to implement a full ban on the sale of fireworks to the public Therefore I do hope that the Scottish Government will be working closely with our counterparts in Westminster to come to a solution regarding this In the meantime I do believe that the licensing system that the bill proposes would stop careless individuals from obtaining fireworks and causing distress to our communities However I believe Sorry I'm running out of time The Labour member today does make an important note of paragraph 386 of the committee's report which expresses concerns about the fast-tracking nature of this bill which may allow for less time for scrutiny However I believe this bill has been a long time coming and I do think it's important that we progress this legislation As my colleague Rowna Mackay has said previously she believes the people of Scotland want us just to get on with it and I have to 100% agree given the strong feeling in my constituency that we fully support this bill and agree that it will be an important step to creating a cultural shift in how fireworks in Scotland are used Thank you Thank you Ms Brown I now call Douglas Lamson to be followed by John Mason around four minutes please Mr Lamson Thank you Deputy Presiding Officer This is actually a bill that we should and could all be working together on It's clear from the consultation that the public support changes to the regulations that the Government are going about their business is a disgrace Having to suspend stand-in orders to rush this debate through shows a complete contempt to this Parliament The stand-in orders are in place to ensure good governance to allow us to follow proper process and maybe the minister will take the opportunity when summon up to apologise to civil servants who have had to work over a bank holiday weekend preparing reports etc to rush this through for absolute no apparent reason There are many potential unintended consequences to this legislation many of them discussed in the committee report and that is why it shouldn't be rushed rushed legislation will lead to bad legislation that will take more time in the long run The Government need to take the time it needs to get it right first time because this bill has more holes than a sieve but we do agree on so much every year that our communities are blighted by antisocial behaviour with regards to fireworks Probably of greatest impact is on our much loved pets and animals I see many reports and local press and on social media about the impact that fireworks can have and the distress they can cause It is right that the Government take action to curb the use of fireworks and to regulate their sale more effectively but what is not right is to overturn parliamentary process to do so It is clear that the public support restrictions on the sale of fireworks with 94 per cent of those who responded to the consultation agreeing on more controls over the sale of these items Many called for a full ban but I feel that more consultation with retailers and suppliers would have to happen before legislation went further and one of my own constituents in the North East, Norman Donald owner of NGE fireworks display said there's nothing in this bill which addresses the misuse of fireworks All it's doing is punishing businesses putting them out of businesses and punishing law abiding citizens who have enjoyed fireworks in their garden for years If the public can only buy them for that length of time specified in the bill then it's going to encourage hoarding and stop filing which is going to be very very dangerous and the Government must act on the storage of fireworks to prevent this potential dangerous practice He also raised legitimate concerns illegal and unsafe fireworks may become more widespread which of course could have a devastating impact We need a measured approach in this legislation to ensure that we are tackling the antisocial behaviour but also protecting the livelihoods of those who depend on this industry People like Norman have been professionally involved in this industry his whole life with his business providing a livelihood for him and his family that cannot simply be taken away with no compensation at all There has not been nearly enough time between the committee report and stage 1 of this bill to consider the implications of it and to legislate at haste will mean repenting at leisure and it will be businesses who will face the brunt of this rushed legislation The timetable was also condemned by the committee themselves who concluded that the bill has been scrutinised to an expedited timetable where Governments wish to be passed before summer recess only in order to bring in the provisions on proxy purchasing and prohibiting the possession of certain pyrotechnic articles in advance of November 22 The lack of detail, data and evidence has hindered our ability to fully scrutinise some of the key proposals and we therefore have substantive reservations about their workability and effectiveness and this is not the opposition to the committee itself The bill is rushed and I would ask the Scottish Government to reconsider the timetable of this bill to ensure that we get it right for everyone from events companies to producers, to the public to animal rights welfare people anyone who enjoys fireworks and their pets of course We are willing to work with the Government on this but not in this rushed way so in order to develop proposals that we all wish would work by Minister again today if they would withdraw this legislation at this time, allow the adequate time required for parliamentary scrutiny and meet with opposition parties to discuss an agreed way forward that we can all agree on Thank you Deputy Presiding Officer I now call John Mason who will be the last speaker in the open debate around six minutes please Mr Mason Thank you very much This is certainly an important subject for quite a wide range of people to be able to take part in the debate today although I was not on the committee myself Fireworks are very relevant for many people in my constituency including those who set them off and enjoy them and that particularly includes many children young people and I confess myself I do enjoy watching fireworks However others find them more of a problem including human victims when they are used against people and animal owners or rescue centres which includes the dogs trust situated between Mount Vernon and Broomhouse in my constituency My own feeling is that fireworks are inherently a good thing and I would not want a complete ban or even a ban on sales to the public however I agree with the aim of the bill to have further restrictions we need to get the balance right in all this I mentioned the dogs trust and I have visited and spoken to them on this subject more than once They were finding fireworks being set off deliberately close to their premises in their care Many of those dogs have already suffered from a distressing background They had to spend a considerable amount of money adding additional doors with double glazing to try and reduce the amount of noise from the fireworks coming into the kennels The dogs trust would ideally like a complete ban on the sale of fireworks to the general public but at the least they would like further limiting the days fireworks can be sold and used a more robust licensing system a full ban within firework control zones and clear labelling Looking at part 4 firework control zones which the committee looks at in paragraphs 210 to 269 I confess I was a bit surprised that it was not proposed to have a no-firework area I agree that there will have to be good communication to the public as to why any fireworks should be allowed near animal centres It does seem to me just a little bit counter-intuitive I note also that the SSPCA has concerns about the exemptions for example for their largest care centre at Cardonauld There is certainly a question as to why professionally organised displays should be allowed in a control zone I take the point that zones with no fireworks at all might move antisocial issues to a different area but in one sense that is surely what we are trying to do, namely to protect areas which are more sensitive for a variety of reasons including further away from animal rescue centres or perhaps veteran centres In paragraph 253 the committee states that it is not convinced that the right balance has been struck concerning having no-firework areas and again they make the point that they may fall short of public expectations I would tend to agree with their recommendation in paragraph 257 that at least local authorities might be allowed to establish genuine no-firework zones and I welcome the minister's comments on that Coming up to date it was noticeable after Sunday's Celtic Rangers game that a fair number of fireworks were set off in the afternoon and evening in the east end of Glasgow If this is to be restricted in the future I do wonder if we can expect the police to clamp down on firework use all over Glasgow at the same time as they are involved in patrolling the major football matches like cup finals or league deciders I suspect that the answer to that is no the police cannot be everywhere at the one time but I guess we can still hope that tightening up the law will have some impact on overall behaviour That links into the whole question of stockpiling that does seem to be happening at present as we see when we get a significant football game and fireworks are starting off immediately the final whistle sounds Clearly fans are not rushing out to the shops after they know the result so stockpiling does appear to be happening now and I can only imagine it would get worse if sales dates are restricted in paragraph 20 Yes, I'll give way I'm grateful to John Mason for taking this intervention Isn't there also a concern with regard to stockpiling as if the stockpiles left over a period of time and indeed the fireworks start to deteriorate and become dangerous in their own right I'm sure he's right in that I think the stockpiling issue I think my main argument is that there are problems along the way and I'm mentioning some of these but I do still support the overall point of the bill and I think tightening things up will improve things In paragraph 204 the committee suggests that there might be local flexibility for local celebrations around sporting successes but to push that to its logical conclusion in Glasgow that might mean four old form league games a cup game and a league cup game so that would be at least six times that a lot of fans would be stocking up half of them on blue fireworks and half of them on green fireworks so half would get used on each occasion and half would be stockpiled which makes Martin Whitfield's point and I'm just not sure how workable all this will be but I would say again that we need to take some action on this and all of these measures are certainly worth trying I just remain a little bit skeptical about the results Moving on to the actual noise from fireworks one of my colleagues has already talked about Collette Stevenson it seems to me that the concept of lower noise levels instinctively seems like a good compromise to me In the categories in paragraph 25 it talks about F1 being negligible noise level F2 low noise level and F3 noise level not harmful to human health However when I read paragraph 106 to 113 consideration of the promotion of lower noise fireworks it seems that there is no recognised standard or specification to identify or distinguish lower noise fireworks there was also a suggestion that by only allowing low noise fireworks for sale to the public people might be driven to online purchases or to the underground and informal markets and that could make matters worse I confess I did not find the argument very convincing no one is forced to buy from illicit or illegal sources any more than they are forced to drive to the speed limit Noise would appear to be one of the main problems we need to tackle it is certainly the complaint I receive most often from constituents although I accept there are other factors as well but I think more work does need to be done in categorising fireworks and potentially limiting the noise in some way educating the public is all very well but I wonder how much education those misusing fireworks will actually want or access As the committee has suggested there is room for amendments not normal with the case for bills however I do very much hope that Parliament will support the general principles of the bill at stage 1 today Thank you Mr Mason and we now come to closing speeches and I call on Katie Clark to wind up on behalf of Scottish Labour up to several minutes please Ms Clark Thank you very much Scottish Labour is at one with the Scottish Government in wanting action taken on the antisocial use of fireworks and the need for a cultural shift but as outlined by Pauline McNeill we have serious concerns about some of the detail and indeed the lack of detail in this bill which of course has been rushed through on a truncated timetable many of our concerns are outlined in the report from the criminal justice committee and Audranicle of course has spoken in detail on that The licensing scheme was introduced through secondary legislation and our concern is that there is a real risk that there won't be proper scrutiny at that stage given that it will not be possible to amend regulation and I would be grateful if the minister could come back on that point not just about the engagement with stakeholders in the consultation on the regulations but the involvement of politicians in this chamber and all that it is to make sure that the detail of legislation is correct and that we do not introduce bad law Of course most people use fireworks responsibly and will want to comply with this legislation but has been pointed out by more than one member could fall foul of this legislation inadvertently The main problem as we see it however is by people who probably will not comply with the licensing system and probably don't comply with the criminal law and I believe that the focus really needs to be on how this legislation will impact with that group We know there are health and safety concerns with the use of fireworks even when they're used responsibly but we also know that it's the misuse of fireworks as has been spoken about by many members and the dangerous impact that has on local communities on specific groups since Stuart McMillan and Siobhan Brown spoke in particular about the impact on veterans and refugees others have spoken on the impact on specific groups such as those with autism Collette Stevenson spoke about the impact on emergency workers and indeed others have spoken on people who discharge the fireworks on themselves sometimes We know that there is a real human health cost of the use of fireworks and one NHS trust board put the cost at £40,000 per year in terms of dealing with injuries and as so many members have spoken about pets wildlife and farm animals are also adversely affected Scottish Labour support many aspects of this legislation in particular the creation of new offences such as that of proxy purchase and that's why we have supported the general principles of this bill but we have major concerns that this legislation is not necessarily going to make the situation better particularly given the lack of enforcement of the legislation which has already in place and a number of members have spoken about that in the debate today Earlier this month we finally received the Crown Office and Procurator service data on that and found out that there have been no convictions last year and despite the fact that many hundreds of far work related incidents are reported each year as a number of members have spoken about there have been very few convictions because Police Scotland and the Crown Office are not giving the enforcement of the existing far works legislation the priority that I believe this Parliament would want them to give it and we need far more detailed information around the contacts of this disparity and how existing legislation is used really I think before this bill should have been brought to Parliament because they stand are complex, bureaucratic and will confuse the public in particular the law abiding public we know that the licensing scheme will require people to carry out a course but we do not need a licensing scheme to require that yes I will give way to the minister I'm listening indeed to what the member is saying would the member accept that one of the reasons why we've had to come up with a scheme is because we're having to operate within the restricted devolved powers that we have indeed that was a point I was going to ask the minister about because a number of members have indicated that they believe that it is outwith the scope of this Parliament to ban far works my understanding is that this Parliament couldn't ban the sale of far works but does have powers to ban and restrict the use of far works but I fully understand that we do not have the full range of powers that could be used in terms of far works but as I say I think the main concern about this legislation is that it is going to bring in very complicated drills that in reality will not work Don Mason spoke about control zones and argued for no far works zones and I agree with him that's something that needs to be looked at and indeed my understanding is that the Scottish Parliament could make the whole of Scotland a no far works zone should it wish to do so but no doubt the minister can come back on that detailed legal point in due course for this licensing scheme to work it must be workable and effective if the public see it as confusing unworkable or uninfordible they will not comply with it as Martin Whitfield outlined there are real risks that a black market in far works will emerge as a result of this legislation the minister has said that there is not much evidence of a black market in Scotland at the moment but we know in the Republic of Ireland where indeed the din did ban far works if a person the member really is bringing her remarks that I suspect I don't have time so I do apologise I would in other circumstances if a person is really determined to use a far work or a pyrotechnic illegally then they will do so and indeed that is the meat of what the criminal justice committee considers regularly we need to ensure that the Scottish Government come forward with something which has the right details that will not create bad law our fear is that the proposals before us today require substantial amendment and that there simply is not going to be time in the next stage to enable that amendment to take place thank you Ms Clark and I call on Russell Findlay to wind up on behalf of the Scottish Conservatives up to nine minutes please Mr Findlay I used to think of lawmaking as painstaking in precise meticulous process of gathering evidence weighing up differing views seeking legal direction and assessing existing legislation however my perceptions have gone up in smoke over these past few weeks Presiding Officer as a member of the criminal justice committee I've learned more about fireworks than I ever thought likely the committee clerks and staff earned our gratitude for their sterling and very patient work the committee's evidence sessions have been enlightening but the more we heard the less clear some issues appeared to become despite having the benefit of the committee process we still don't know nearly enough about this bill some members will be familiar with the committee's stage 1 report into the bill but not as familiar with it as they deserve to be because it was only published on Thursday the government thinks it's fair for members to digest the reports so that members' responses to it to a truncated timetable that breaches the Parliament's own rulebook it was just before 11pm on Sunday when we got the sight of the Government's 36 page response to our committee report and I'd like to thank the minister for my riveting bedtime reading last week my colleague Jamie Green attempted to get ministers to press pause but without success so here we are debating complex legislation full of gaps without knowing what it will mean in practice as our committee report states much of the substantial detail is left to be developed in regulations after the bill is enacted put simply we have not been given time to do the jobs properly the reason for the government's haste is they want to outlaw the supply fireworks to under 18s before this year's bonfire night while children can't buy fireworks they can be given them by an adult the committee established the ending so-called proxy purchases in Scotland could be implemented by the UK Government however and this may come as a surprise to people we've been unable to establish the extent to which Scottish ministers pursued this with UK ministers the committee describes this as very unsatisfactory and I think it typifies much of our frustration one thing that is abundantly clear to which we're all pretty much in agreement is that many people across Scotland want something to be done about fireworks there are two main issues the first is their dangerous and reckless misuse often by younger people and sometimes targeting emergency workers the second is the harm their loud noises have in animals, both domestic pets and livestock and some people with sensory issues so what does the law say now well anyone aged over 18 can buy fireworks they are only sold on specific dates including November 5th Hogmanay and some religious and cultural events but there's an exception licensed retailers can sell them all year round so as things stand there's nothing stopping anyone letting off fireworks every single night of the year the Government's answer to the first problem of dangerous misuse of fireworks is to limit availability via the introduction of a licensing scheme now it's estimated up to 250,000 people in Scotland by fireworks each year so how many of these would apply for a licence if we look at Northern Ireland which in 2016 issued 515 licences for a population of 1.85 million if that same ratio was applied to Scotland then we might expect just over 1500 licences so as the firework industry reasonably asks what will happen to those tens of thousands of people who currently buy fireworks the concern is that many won't bother with a licence costing up to £50 instead turning to a black market this is the last thing we need and will licensing be a financial barrier for low-income families who want to enjoy fireworks the Government has not answered these questions the committee visited Blackburn and West Lothian where the communities worked to counter some issues of fireworks and I welcome them here today and hope that this is not too long and boring we heard of a white van man selling fireworks to children I'm concerned that licensing will be a boon to criminals while shutting down the responsible retailers if licensing and the bills other restrictions are implemented will supermarkets still bother to stop fireworks at least one Sainsbury's is ready again this could create a vacuum for a criminal market yet the Scottish Government has not engaged with the big retailers to establish their position the Government's answer to the second key issue of distress caused by loud bangs is firework control zones while also limiting the number of days fireworks can be used many people who I speak to and indeed large numbers of respondents would love to see areas in which all fireworks are banned but firework control zones don't do that people living in them will be able to hire private companies to stage back garden shows while certain events such as gala days will also be allowed not only that but we don't know the criteria for deciding where the zones would be their possible size, how long they would last I ask what is the point of firework sales on 37 days of the year with 57 days on which they can be used so the Government is trying to reduce fireworks by pushing a bill that effectively gives a gree