Hello and welcome to the drum history podcast. I'm your host Bart van der Zee and today I am joined by Jeremy Berman and Max Cusor Max and Jeremy welcome to the podcast. Hey, thanks for having us. Thanks for having us. Yeah, this is a really cool one So we're gonna be talking about Q drum. We're gonna be talking about Orange County. We're gonna be talking about drum teching We're gonna be talking about What's been going on with Jeremy and kind of give everyone an update on that which is some some pretty heavy stuff, but I Think for starters to jump in guys Why don't we just go back to the early days and You both were builders at Orange County, which there's recently been two Orange County episodes So we won't go too heavy and a little more They were great. They were fantastic. I've listened. Yeah, they did a better job. They did a better job. Yeah, that's for sure I appreciate that and and yeah, but so that being said Jeremy you came up a lot Obviously of doing some influential stuff and then Jeremy you talked to me a lot about how much you are a fan of what max has been doing So Let's just hop in here, man And I don't know Jeremy talk about how you got involved with Orange County back in 99, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah Well, I was I was working at Guitar Center. I was Freshly learning how to play drums. I started late. I started and when I was like 18 and While I was at Guitar Center in Fountain Valley John Machado who is one of the founders of Orange County drum would come into the shop to buy drum heads and we just became buddies and Nam show of 1999 I believe was in Los Angeles and it wasn't in Anaheim and I was working for Guitar Center I had just flipped a vehicle over a freeway overpass Well, and I and I survived I walked away long story short What do you want to do? I don't want to be a salesman. It sucked It was the worst it was the worst experience, but also the best experience taught me This is not what I want to be so I bugged John for about a month and a half every time you come in Hey, you got a spot He's like you're gonna make way less money and it's just menial labor and I said sweet sign me up So the first time I went down there to meet them I Spoke to John I met the guys that were there and it was maybe three people. It was Josh lamb Rest in peace Robert noise Robert Ortiz who didn't Technically work at Orange County drum because he's a he's a bass tech for Blink 182, but he He was there and he's kind of the one that brought me in showed me the back showed me all the stuff that they do and And I was sold from that moment on and I literally spent the first seven months of my life at Orange County drum Sanding shells on the inside the shells back and forth three different grits Spin it keep going inhaling that sawdust and I made seven and a quarter an hour. I Absolutely loved it. Yeah, and from there, you know, it was one of those things.  That's what started it for me, you know I will say that I worked at Guitar Center as well in the drum department and it was in Kentucky though I'm in Cincinnati. So Kentucky is really close. It was 525 an hour and All right, it was just in that was that was like Everyone on three your employee number, dude 7574 I still got it. No memory of it zero one to the green screen computer 01357. Yeah, man. So we all we all have that in common. We all work to get Yeah, I remember I called a Columbus store trying to get like a price like a discount on something after I quit And they were like, well, what's this store number? And I said 614 and they were like, that's the area code in Columbus. I like I like hung up Yeah All right, Max, tell us about your experience joining up with Orange County and what that was like for you So similar trajectory similar path. I was a drummer. I played drums. I I'm right out of high school. I got a job.  It was aimless.  You know, I was like, I was not good enough to like Try to be well, I'm gonna be a career drummer, you know But I was always working with my hands. I was always like tinkering and like building things So I was like, well, obviously it was like logically I like I want to build drums What's around me at the time it was like DW or this company Orange County drum And I knew of Orange County drum peripherally I knew them because there was like bands that I had listened to at the time, you know like Limpis get and stuff that like played Orange County and I knew who they were and deaf tones and stuff like that and obviously All the other big bands like 311 and stuff But I wasn't I wasn't like a super fanboy, but I knew that they were dope And I knew that they were local and I was like, well, perfect like that's right at my alley I went and checked out their website I think at the time and then like just did a little bit of homework and I was like, oh shit This company is like really cool And so I went and applied Gave the usual kind of you know, like spiel. I was like, hey like I really want to work here Like genuinely it was with John my interview was with John I don't remember much about like my walk-in or anything But my interview was with John and I gave the whole you know, like I'll start sweeping the floors I'll do whatever you want to do whatever and and Yeah, and then he was like, yeah, cool. You could start. I believe I started I think at eight bucks an hour Maybe Upgrade maybe like I might be embellishing now you find out. Yeah, this might be this might be my ego talking But I was you know, I got the job and I was like, oh, this is gonna be so cool I'm gonna be a drum builder and then you know first day of work show up wet behind the ears excited and Very similar to Jeremy and I really appreciated this about the shot back in the day And then I it is it's still something that even in like my current line of work that like I still implement Is it's like building your way up through the ranks not just like feeling a necessity So for example at Orange County, like my first job was polishing we used to polish the bad screws So before bad screws for bad and you would have to polish them with rouge and then buff them out on a wheel And like dude first job.  They were so shiny You know, yeah, my skin was black but and then yeah, I was in like, okay, cool Let's get you standing shells and stuff like that and then Yeah, I was it was very gratifying and then it just kind of went from there, you know Yeah, then building the relationships and stuff. That's hilarious I totally forgot about the polishing of the screws at some point So I'm gonna got the bright idea to polish the washer the seal washers. Yeah Yeah, yeah Whose idea was that bro? You're right. You're right. You're right. I won't throw you under that bless. No, I do remember who's it was But it wasn't yours. I apologize. I'm sorry, but I mean that's a tension to detail that like, yeah No, no, no, no, that's where we're county that Having all your drums the same color that's insanity. Yeah, yeah a little overboard But it was fun. Are you guys surprised of the huge cult following nowadays or does it make perfect sense to you? I definitely am I did it slipped under the radar for me.  I It was devastating to me when it closed down and there's there's a bunch of stuff that I I'm not I Can't talk about that happened towards the end that made it really hard But I will say that that was some of the best times of my life hands down The the camaraderie of the crew even though we had some outliers that you know, eventually got canned or whatever left There was always there was it was always fun Even though there was stress and I think the two people that got the most stress was Max and myself because we were the direct contact with Daniel and When Daniel needed something he needed it yesterday and he needed it done to the utmost Perfection and if anybody will sniff out a flaw, it's that man. He right here. It's uncanny. You have And immediately Immediately first thing you see the other side. Oh, and you're just like I worked so hard on that. How did you know? You know, but but he really made us like so Nervous to build for him that it made us that much better and again It was max not because we were the two that at the point that he could trust us to build all this stuff We were the ones that held all the keys to every aspect of building And that was that yeah that trust and that faith in from him was huge. I think that for me It was I don't know. I'm not for max, but it was huge. It was huge and it definitely Resonated and left its mark on me. So yeah, well Daniel was always definitely the one you wanted you wanted that celebration from you wanted Daniel to Yeah, not in a groveling sense. Like but you wanted his is His merit you wanted his like dude. Good job. And you're just like yeah. Yeah, dude Good job, you know, I did it. Yeah Because for that reason like his bar was so high in the end and he Daniel also too I don't know if he gets enough credit for like being innovative and so John to do like give those guys those guys would Oftentimes throw out ideas and whatever and they were fantastic and then we would run with them We would be allowed to run with them and make them bit bigger or better or yeah worse But they had some great ideas man That just would shoot off the cuff and then they were always super cool Just being like hey dude, like especially that was kind of like the best part when Daniel would say something You knew like when he's like, hey, what if it's like it's gonna happen. Like, you know, yeah, it's a green light It's a green light. Hey make this happen. Like it's yeah, it's fine if it costs money make it happen Yeah, later on John wasn't so fond of that part right because it was always like because Max and I would push So hard on certain things and John just like Dude really Daniel said it was okay. Of course, yeah, yeah, right Yeah, I mean, there's like a Personality type and like everyone's had a job where like their boss is like they ride you But when you get that little bit of like like appreciation It you will like it more because they were kind of riding you so hard Interesting thing about Orange County is like I never felt a timeline pressure ever like ever ever ever What and yeah, I it's funny like even even my time at queue Like, you know, I spent six years at queue and something that I quietly pride myself on is like dude We never missed a deadline not once not once That I can think of we ever missed a deadline or at least I never Like I most definitely have yeah, but like and even then like I It's a different pressure now like now I do, you know, I do different job and like I feel a pressure of like Oh, I got to get this done in time and like I like I had to become 40 to like feel that pressure like at at Orange County. It was always the for me at least it was the pressure of like Have your peers approve of what you're doing and not in not in a sense where I needed their approval is in a To feel self validated or anything But it was like hell. Yeah, like I knew this was cool and so do you like, you know type thing and then also too to make Daniel and John happy like when they were stoked. It was like did my job. This feels cool Yeah, like, you know, this episode is brought to you by sweetwater I just got a pair of Sennheiser HD 650 headphones from sweetwater and these things are awesome the HD 650s are hi-fi headphones, which are great for mixing new editing and just really listening back to music is a Really great experience in these. I do editing for hours on end working on drum history But also other stuff for work and I'm usually always wearing headphones And these are so much more comfortable and it kind of feels like a little speaker next to your head that has a very kind of clean And natural sound as opposed to Other traditional clothes back headphones, which are just kind of pushed up against your ear and very tight and aren't great for long Runs wearing headphones. These are extremely lightweight headphones and very high quality on the build And one thing I love is that they come with a 10 foot long Detachable cable, which is always great for drummers because you always need a longer cable. So very cool I highly recommend these check out the Sennheiser HD 650 headphones by following the link in the description And you'll find the drum history gear page on sweetwater where you can find the HD 650s and a bunch of other cool gear So thanks to sweetwater for sponsoring this episode. It's a certain way to get stuff done I mean it Orange County seems like a boot camp kind of like where you guys like got you worked hard, but it trained you to be Master drum builders. I mean really you guys learned a lot. You got heavy-duty real deal experience there There was one of the cool things about it is that there were so many different stations and there's only a handful of guys You if you showed if you if you if you showed that you had what it takes to Move on to another another step Then we would show you how to do that or they would show us how to get and if you didn't show the aptitude for it You you were stuck you were just standing shells my man You were just standing shells or you were cutting out cutting vent holes and sanding vent holes It's I know Corey mentioned the vent holes and stuff and you know what's funny is when I started vent holes or shit By the end of it vent holes weren't shaped anymore And when I say shape hand files, so they had a curvature not a flat hole, you know In it really took skill of hand tools to really figure it out And I think with that that if you didn't have that you didn't You didn't excel at snare bedding You didn't move on to the other stuff of like cleaning scenes and doing all this stuff and you know There's there's only a handful of people that really like understood each and every aspect and what would happen is You would be stuck on that job for six months to a year. I built I built shells Every day for what six seven months at one time it all the twenty five thirty five forty five fifty five You were in that all the body shells. I was a heck I had my station. Yeah, that was my Discman my headphones. I just and I had my little press and I just that's all I did 70 shells in one day was my record Yeah, yeah, that's insane. That was really bad. Yeah, but but like he's got the thunk the show it did Yeah, that those are those are show those are show building thumbs, dude Matt max did it max did it on the wrapping station, which also was the staining station Yeah, which is also the spraying station. All those were combined the edging really only max myself and John Hey, yeah, yeah, it was part it. Well, there's also the fact that like edging was dangerous So there was there had to be an a want to do it, right? Like when you edge the 20 ply it was It was different than like ever using like a router table or anything, but when you did like a 40 ply Dude a sketch like 100 when you're that big thump on the wall Yeah, when you hear that, you know, there's like there's a rhythm We had a router room and there was a rhythm and you would hear meow meow meow and then you'd hear And everybody froze because they knew what that meant dude I meant the router through that drum across the room ripped it out of your hands Geez, dude. It was terrifying. So yeah, you had to want to be like, all right, dude I'll tame this beast, you know or whatever but yeah, and then you just kind of though There's like yeah, there's like there's levels you achieve Yeah, well, and there's definitely some competition to between Who could throw out who could router throw a snare drum the furthest Yeah, yeah, and it was like a big part of it really was like you had to show want to do it for one And then to like we did teach a lot of people We would run them through courses and like we all of our snare beds at Orange County were like hand-filed And and to this day like to this day I can spot my snare beds from Jeremy snare beds without questions like a cincher You know like the profile of the snare bed is the same But there's like a touch and then there's a way that each of us do them That's different much like how you know a mason cuts a stone or something like you could see the chisel marks and it's very similar in in a snare bed and so we would we would teach people how to do a snare bed and It's it's weird It's like the first one always goes actually pretty well because like you're being hovered and like you're very attentive But then it all just degrades and then it's like how fast can you recover from that degradation? And oh my god, you know and we would try and like hey, man You you would have an opportunity and then if you showed repeatedly that like dude You're just not grasping the task that unfortunately it was like we would very nicely ask you to go do something else You know, we would we would do it on scraps first of course Yeah wouldn't do it on yeah, one of my favorites in that story would be our buddy Dave good Yeah Love you Dave The sweetest human I've ever met Dave is one of the most incredible drummers. I've ever seen play in my life And he ended up just becoming like the whole guy. He was the vent guy. Yeah did all the vents But at one point he was like he was out of me. He's like I really want to learn how to snare better. Okay, so I taught him first. I think Max taught him again But in that timeframe one of my favorite things is like I showed him how to do it and he was doing it And I'm like cool. Okay. I'm gonna go over here and do my job. You practice the second the second bed. I come back and We the way our snare beds are they're flat with a couple little ramps You know helps accommodate 42 strand all the way down to 10 strand and it makes it easier to control the tuning of the bottom head to Damp in or or make a little more sizzling the snare wires by adjusting the tension on the head It's kind of it's a cool thing Daniel taught me how to do it It's used it. I've used it ever since and I will never change my snare bed because of that and When I when I tune drums, it's so easy just to just a little half nudge loose We'll just dampen that snare wire so well, so that it's perfect, right? Our snare is a secret weapons, dude They are They're just awesome.  Yeah, and I was like, I don't know what happened. I think I just Did so the biggest the biggest problem is like you always have your dominant side because if you were right-handed or left-handed If you're right-handed typically the right side So imagine if you will like a driveway curb, you know, that's pretty much very similar to our So when you're when you're when you're filing the right side You're very comfortable.   Yeah, everyone first off has been there I'll you say that in our field that would do the snare beds by hand everyone has you know, just Massacre their own snare beds but then that's also how you get super super super good is like recovery and Acknowledging and knowing how to get ahead of it Yeah, but that was our motto.  That was that's just that was Custom-building 101 for us in the beginning because it there were no there were no books. There were no schools There was nothing that we Had to learn from other than well, let's just see if this works and if we mess it up, how do we fix it? Yeah, yeah, there was a training manual and the fixing part you actually learn new techniques by fixing a problem for sure Sure sure sure. Yeah, so I think people also like to hear the stories about like like obviously the building But like the roster of artists was pretty wild with Orange County I mean and Jeremy were you artist relations manager at Orange County. Is that correct? Oh There's no such thing. There's I read it on modern drummer or something It's a phrase that someone gave me When I was doing some sort of interview with them and That is not 100% correct. I dealt with a lot of artists though and I did cater to them as Did max as did job as did Josh as did Daniel that we were like the four people that dealt what with the artists and The cool thing is is like the ones that I dealt with personally they would call me This is what I'm looking for. This is the sound. I want to get blah blah blah blah blah How can I how what can you do to help me get this and that's where I kind of learned the idea of like Don't be afraid to tell somebody what they want is bullshit Because you get well you what happens is you get somebody that wants a specific sound they play a certain way and What they what they want in their mind is not going to Be the best for the way they play to get that sound Yeah, we know we know how to get that sound So I'm always gonna recommend something that may not be what you want, but at the end of the day I can guarantee Yeah, when you close your eyes that is what you want. I know it's what you need. What you need 100% and then yeah, and that was that was really beautiful those like in developing those relationships is like you could Suggest things and then people would very actively be like, yeah, okay, like I trust you and you know, and it's I mean, it's not like You know, it's not like we're handing them a guitar or something. That's completely not a drum It's still a drum, but you know, it's like yeah, somebody like I would always ask people like how do you want? How do you want to feel because like drums are really about how you feel, right?   I know what's cool. I know what's not cool I know this like new thing is exciting, but like dude trust me like this is our staple. This is the bread and butter Go flatback. I mean I mean Yeah, I mean a perfectly a perfect example for me recently of that is you know, I've been working with Don Howard from Muse for the past seven years and When we started his whole idea was a wood and like I listened to the music and I'm like You know what the wood sounds great, but man metals metal is going to Really accentuate the sounds that you you want to produce, you know and it took literally like we built him a copper kid a while back He loved it, but most recently we built him a Galvanized kit, which is what I've been pushing since day one to me galvanized steel is the end all be all for Q specifically the fact and You know, yeah, and when I mean finally he's like I guess I have everything else. So let me let me try one Blue is mine. I mean he's I thought I talked to him recently He's like all I want is that metal kid is that galvanized steel?  I'm not the person to be building your own At the end of the day, you're gonna get that drum kit.  Here it is. It's just like no you Yeah, this is what you this is what's best for you. It also doesn't hurt though that you know like if somebody really Like the difference between metal types for example They each sonically have like a very different characteristic like tonally Feel everything like some just crush in the studio you know others are just like jack of all trades and it's like You can't just talk somebody out of wanting something and say because So it's like When you know what you're talking about and you can nail somebody down with all the reasons here's this thing Here's that thing And sometimes it's not always sonically sometimes. It's like dude. This is a nightmare to keep clean a nightmare to keep clean Or it stains and people are like, oh, I never thought about that. You know, it's like weird little things like that But so yeah again with experience, you know and trust and then people are Yeah, and we're never like You don't want that we're never so directly. It's it's an arrogant because you know what's the point What's the point, you know it but it is It's definitely a suggestion And sometimes you have to push that suggestion just a little bit harder than you normally would The other thing is is that the people that we deal with Most of the time They they come to us because they want our expertise. So they're more willing to listen Um, but we also talk direct. We don't have like a sales person talking to them. It's us And that this is where this is where the whole like dealer network thing kind of comes into play We have very specific feelers And the dealers that we work with are very drum Central they're very Knowledgeable about drums. They understand drums. They understand our drums So I feel confident that when they get a customer and they're like, I want a 22 by 22 copper bass drum They're gonna say that's not what they're gonna do. I feel confident in them You know, if we went to like if we started selling through guitar center, they would just send us a po We'd have to make it. You know what I mean? Yeah, luckily we have like these mom and pop shops that are So good and so understanding of what we do that they do help the process Um, and also if the client isn't sure call us So, you know, I'm happy. I I talk to people all day long I'll I'll spend an hour and a half on a phone call Going through all the differences of the different metals the different woods Different sizes and how they react and all that stuff and finally I usually get guys are like, okay. I have too much information I don't know what to do with it so Just build me the drums. I mean, yeah, what you're saying is like, but really in the end the like Uh, customer facing part of it is super positive. It's not like Yeah, anything negative. It's very happy and just like, yeah, we're gonna make you an awesome drum set You know, that's the end result that you're gonna like better. Yeah So it's kind of moving towards getting into like Q and talking about Q Just to touch on some other stuff real quick because Jeremy, I know more about you from reading online max as we said before you're kind of a man of mystery on the internet as As we discussed, but so Jeremy, I know you did some tech work And I think I got this off your LinkedIn, which is the first time I've used LinkedIn as a resource for the podcast But I don't know how Queens of the Stone Age Gwen Stefani, 9-inch nails, Katy Perry, Nora Jones, Muse There's probably some others in there Slipknot Yeah, it's an impressive roster, dude Yeah, yeah, that's incredible. There's more in there, but you know Yeah, well, those are those are those are those are my those are my highlights. I'll take those Yeah, those are pretty awesome But so the story I saw online is that you were working with Adam Marcello of Katy Perry in 2010 and like I think it said you built a backup kit for him instead of ordering new drums and then from his primary builder and then That backup kit ended up being the main kit and that what I read on I think shers website Which we had an article there about you was uh, was that the birth of q pretty much That was the birth of q 100 it was all Adam's fault He knows he used to blame we blame him all the time anything that goes wrong is Adam's fault. Um, yeah, you know It was a weird thing the company he was endorsing before built him this Uh acrylic kit that was frosted with led lights in it and The way they had wired the lights was they use uh I don't know if you're familiar with romax Romax romax is is a hard Solid copper cable that you use in the walls of your house electricity They used romax to run cables from the lights out of the drum and then they used trailer hitch As the connectors and then they took they took the excess of it and they Put all the wire ties on it and then they wrapped it in e-tape. So it made this giant e-tape phallic thing and then that went to that went to the light box and I'm like Wow, I can't I can't tour like this I can't go and set up.  He's like hey man. I've literally just done this right It took me three days because I've never dealt with this before Usually when we did stuff at orange county drum, it was a it was a cable with a plug in it We never did le well. We did some le d stuff later. We did some yeah We did some weird stuff using like rope light, but um But with adam this was this is a new thing for me. So I figured out how to do this He comes to me as I finish and I'm like this son Cool. I'm having them build me another kit and then you can do the same thing to that kit I was like, how about this let me just build you the kit from ground up and then I could just Have this already done. So I don't have to pull that stuff out and put new stuff in I don't want to do things twice. So We we talked about what he wanted. He said I want the sling rolling You know clamshell knockoffs. I'm like cool And I built him the kit and it sounded amazing and it looked awesome and everything was clean and tidy And uh, he just he just loved it so much. He's like, okay, cool. You should start your own company and uh, I was just like Not interested after the whole thing with guitar center and and ocdp Especially at the end of it. I just didn't really have it in me to Build drums. I actually when I got my shop in san pedro It had an apartment above so I lived above my shop I wanted to make furniture and I wanted to fix my truck that got smashed, you know And that was about it. That was about it and then Built I built the kit anyway and at some point I was in london Orange County drum have all of their tooling and stuff in a storage unit where we were actually Still building drums out of here and there no actually remember that spot. Yeah and uh And when I had left on tour there was there was nobody to help out That orange can drum so they they locked the door They john stopped paying the bill And I had my rehearsal studio in the same Storage unit. So I knew the manager and she's she's a Brit. She called me while I was in London jeremy What's going on with with john? He's hasn't paid me.   So I know someone in line is gonna say if I don't ask they're gonna say why didn't you ask this? What was in that storage unit? What kind of stuff did you pull out? I mean, was it everything? Was it routers? Was it gold what was in there? Gold bricks There's some there's some very there's some very unique tooling that we have That was built by john machado's brother. Joe. Who's a Freak of nature He he basically His job is making Uh, he's he's a machinist, but he's also an engineer. Um, and he made a drilling machine. He made, uh, What we call our drum lathe, which is which is a horizontal Uh, uh claw that it basically just opens up to hold the drum and it'll rotate in different ways And it is one of the most essential tools invaluable Really? Oh, yeah for us.  Yeah, these tools were legitimately handmade like dude. Joe is an impressive savant like yeah, yeah, wow Man can't spell to save his life, but he can definitely build a machine. Yeah, you don't need to you don't need to spell when you're cool Yeah, exactly. But man, I mean that stuff could have ended up on like storage wars or some like, you know what I mean like one of those tv shows That's what I was worried about. That's that's the main thing I was worried about and like You know, that's that's history right there and it's something that joe put Joe's a dear friend of mine Same with max and like he put his heart into that and the last thing he wanted was for those tools to go so I took him I took him to my shop And awesome and I so you know after talking with adam for a while came up with a name and 110 customs Whoa podcast podcast over Oh Yeah Yeah, that was the first iteration of the name for uh, that was a preliminary name. That was it 110 customs. Okay That was like first on the list. It's kind of like an inside joke. He never really made it anymore Yeah, but it reminds me of like Battlefield and like all these other names that are just like so Namy, I don't know. It's just yeah, it's too it's too much. It's too much for me And q kind of settled in because I was like, oh quality drums, but quality drums sound like your you know, $250 Import with symbols and hardware And so I was like, you know, it's cool. Let's just drop it all q call it a day so q comes from quality and that's That's where it's at I think that's awesome. And I I agree with I mean q is perfect, but yeah the quality quality drums you do get that like Japanese kind of like, you know, here's an American word that sounds good Yeah, but q is awesome, man, and it looks cool Which I think that's a big part of it visually It's like you have to have a logo that looks a name. I mean a couple years ago.   And it's good to know that everyone buys their drums because uh, I think that's pretty common in In drum building where no one's really unless you're a huge huge mega drummer No one's really handing out free drum sets that much. Um That I as far as I can tell. Well, yeah, I mean you guys would know better than me You'd be surprised. I mean we number one. We just don't have the uh infrastructure We don't have the financial backing to be able to do that also I mean it just it would it would have buried us from the get-go And the thing is is that when you pay for something with your own money You appreciate it more than if it was given to you and and I feel like To me our artists appreciate what they have because they did have to spend money on it and We have lost very very few artists As a matter of fact, we've given maybe a couple kits away and those are the artists that we lost And to me and to me it just it was proof positive And it wasn't even giving them a way to give them away. It was more like they check this out use it and then you know It just kind of fell through the cracks because i'm yeah I'm easy. Yeah, if you don't have any skin in if you don't have any skin in the game You know, yeah, I'd like to get to the point where I can give people free stuff and not care whether they left or stayed but Again, I want people to love what they have not just be like, oh, those are my tools You know, yeah, I want that to be your your favorite tool, you know, yeah yeah Max let's jump over to you and talk a little bit more about when when you came on board and um And just got involved and and what that was like kind of I mean you guys have like I think like all the ocdp builders where like you guys have like a bond that's like Oh, for sure. Only a handful you guys have but what was that like for sure? Well, I mean to speak to like orange county. Yeah, like definitely when you had corion he One thing I take away was like he's like, yeah That is a moment in time that we you did we did share with a handful of people and I don't think at the time like personally I Didn't realize like it's grandeur or not even to say that it was grand but just like I You know, I was hard to separate the force from the trees. It was just like I was living my life I was working at a drum shop. I was doing my thing and it's like, oh, yeah It was like this moment in history that like now as I get older and I realized I'm like Oh, it didn't mean something and it was really cool and it was really cool to be a part of and he's right We do share that together Jeremy and I however, I feel like we have this different bond like one We have these weird like shadowed parallels We have these weird parallels where it's like, dude, we used to BMX at the same spots We went to the same high school didn't know each other. We both worked at guitar center You know, like a lot of these like weird little interesting things like even mutual people that we knew and uh And still to this day, it's like there's always like some circling circulating Connection somehow, you know and all that aside and then there's the side that like we speak a language That one another understands when it comes to drums, you know and into drum building into In essence to problem solving like we understand And frankly, we enjoy the act of problem solving, you know, here's a problem. Let's like get to the bottom of it How do we do it? Here's how I want to do it. Here's how you want to do it.  It's ridiculous.  Well, come on. Come on. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. No, no I at least paid you 825 Yeah, well, you know after my 90 day probation Uh, but you know, I was like Legitimately, I'm eternally grateful and and the day that I left Q. I said this and it was weird because there's like When I left Q kind of happened quickly it was something that came up and I fell apart dude like fell apart like it was weird It was like all of a sudden I couldn't even talk and I was like, oh even now it's like coming back to me You know, but yeah, it's like dude. You got me I was I was like you for six years I bought a house. I had two kids. I got married. We went through a pandemic Dude, that supersedes like everything I had done before You know in my life like that I was just like coasting along and I was like, whoa, this is like really different Yeah, and like we talked to each other every day like I didn't even realize it at the time But I mean we literally talked to each other every day even if it was about work.  I deserve. I always deserve it. Yeah Somebody comes around that corner bad fit is bad, you know Harms him in some way dude.  It's like it's a genuine like love dude when I say like how I love my brother and it's like Yeah, we've developed it through Sports and mountain biking and spending time together and just like yeah, man So it's like that was like probably like the best part about being a cue was like absolutely You know, I love you my man. You know, yeah, I'll do it. I love you too, man You know, that's incredible. Yeah, so you know when he's texting you saying dude Can you finish buffing those screws?  I'm still dude. I have no fingerprints Please let me stop on my core. I'm still a 20 20 year old buffing bad screws waiting to be relieved Okay But no, but yeah, I mean it's poetry. Yeah, I feel it's uh, I mean I legitimately feel fortunate to have like Uh Oh, man, you know, yeah, yeah, we'll stop that's incredible No, you guys have a special, uh, how many employees were at cue?  You're gonna laugh at this and uh, Sorry everybody who thinks cue is massive. Um It was me and max The 85 percent of the time. Yeah, but it was max.  Uh ed ed davis That the number one call it calling strong gravy, dude.  Yeah, no Well, we have this we have the same where you know, we brush the insides of our copper shells after we've done After they're built we do this really nice finished brush and 16 inch floor toms are the bane of everybody's existence in that polishing And when we'd have guys that just wanted to come in and help out and see what it was like to build This this is the job that we would give them and so you reach down inside and you go on You know horizontally because you don't want to lay the drum down and scratch finish He would take his sweaty elbow and bump the side Not knowing that that sweat gets into that freshly opened copper Yeah, it makes it Oh makes it even harder to clean like Geez natural dirty patina is okay to clean whatever but like sweat induced Like acid patina elbow.  Otherwise it just doesn't look the same. Yeah, that's true You know, I mean that raises the question in general though like about in the story of q like How did you guys get into the metal? Drums that you were like that are beautiful and so, you know, you guys are well known for Do you learn it at orange county? All right, this is probably a story. I shouldn't tell but i'm gonna tell it anyway the first snare drum I ever built with wood rereams was a drum By a little a little canadian dude and uh And uh the drummer who owned the drum came in and was like I this thing's ripping heads left and right. I can't tune it. I thought it was gonna be great I don't know what to do with it and me at the time. I'm like Let me see what I can do. So I it's very messing with it I'm like, you know what? I can probably put some wood readings and see what happens Put some wood readings in it cut cut an actual snare butt on it Um, it didn't have an air vent at the time Um, I think that the builder was pushing for this non air vent snare drum thing Like the air would come out where the snare beds are or whatever. I don't know But it was just super choked. So I put an air vent in it. I think max you help you help snare bed it I don't Maybe I don't know. Yeah, anyway, right It was a titanium shell. It was a titanium shell. So we put it together and the thing was ripping It was sick. It was yeah, and and I'm not one to like take Mess with anybody else's build, but this one this this particular drummer, um, sammy j. Watson from apex theory who's Ridiculous Yeah, he was at he was at mi when I was at when I was I think he was doing something at mi while I was there and we just kind of came friends whatever I haven't spoken to him in years, but um Uh, I took that drum Handed it back to him and he's like, dude, it's a brand new drum. It's insane Didn't rip heads anymore because it had a wood edge But it didn't have that that bite that the titanium would normally have it was a little It was a little more subdued. It was a little more controlled because of the wood rearing So we started doing that in a lot of snare drums Like we would take black beauty shells cut the edges off put wood rearing in and it just kind of evolved So the drum kit bang happened in 2008. I was working for nine-inch males Josh Reese was the drummer They had just put out this album called ghosts and it was all this weird. It's an instrumental album And it's got all these weird organic sounds It's not all electronic and a lot of the sounds are like Chains on a pizza platter as a snare snare drum and like super crazy stuff and part of the part of the show was A second drum kit would come out and it was like this weird organic drum kit where I used like a The five gallon water jug as a rack tom.   He's like Let's roll it into a shell. I'm like, okay. Well, then then what he's like, let's put rivets on it I'm like, cool.  It was a 20 inch bass drum, you know, so I took it to the rehearsals And it ended up sounding really good Too good now We needed to sound trashy too good.  Can you make me a whole kit? So that's when we built we built him a 28 14 16 18 and that was like That was the first galvanized steel kit we had ever made. Yeah, he still has that sound. He still has that kit and it sounds so Good that we were just like, huh That was it for that was it forage county drum. Well, no, we did one more for frank zimmer Uh-huh at that time. Remember we had done we had started doing like rolled stainless shells Yes, so we hit we had we had yeah, we done We never did kit but we did like a few different snare drums like I actually made one for myself Hey, I thought we did the one kit that we took for nam that had that was polished With wood marines and maybe Maybe your memory would be better than mine, dude. Nam. Nam is just a blur, dude Yeah, they all blend together Yeah, yeah, but yeah, like you said, I mean we we were just doing like snare drums and stuff for the most part And and the stainless steel stuff And that's kind of when that's about the time orange county drum like Ended up moving into storage unit. I was on tour Max was trying to do something there, but there wasn't much to to do with And it just sort of fell by the wayside when I started q with adam Matt Mitchell again was with he was guitar tech on kitty parry But our playback or whatever And it was just matt and I as the main text for kitty parry at this time And he was still doing pacifer and he's like, hey I want a new kit. You think you could do copper Matt has the first galvanized kit the first copper kit and And they still are rocking to this day. Yeah, um That that really set the bar For what we were gonna do later on and you know We were so new at it. We hadn't perfected it yet. We were just like getting orders I'm like, oh, so it's just building. Yeah But then we found some flaws That's what happens and Max really kind of like took it to here. It was here And they were sounding Fantastic max is like I'm gonna make them better and now they're like now they're here and that it's The formula we use it's they're ridiculous. We're using thicker metal instead of thinner metal But we're cutting the re-rings different fit in properly.  Yeah, well you you have you have to you know You have to and when you have someone as talented as max it really makes you go, okay fine And it really didn't take any more time. Actually it took less time because You're just you're you're spending more time in the calculations and the measurements And less time in the actual like building and this didn't work out to cut another way ring and do all sort of stuff.  I guess I'd say we're like I've built wood drums for such a long time going to metal was super easy Yeah, well, so I thought my drum career was like over like um I had kind of like started a newer chapter of my life, you know, like I I wasn't really playing music as much as I was and I was just like well, you know the drum Thing I was like a cool phase of my life. Like let's see what I'm doing whatever and uh And at the time I was working for a hotel like downtown. I was like valet and cars downtown. Oh, it was awesome I was like a great job. I was a valet. Yeah, dude. Yeah respect man. Like great job camaraderie fun cash in hand And uh, yeah, and then Jeremy like we had met up. He was on tour with Katy Perry. We'd met up to go eat downtown We hadn't seen each other like in a while And yeah years. Yeah, he was like, oh dude like um I started a drum company.  Okay, but yeah, like I kind of felt uh Not rusty but just kind of like oh, I haven't even thought about this in so long You know and the same like people family and friends would be like, why don't you start your own drum company stuff? I just had zero interest dude like zero interest um Because it was just yeah, it was just it was what it was it wasn't this like It was never this like business thing. So it was just like nah, I'm good So I started going down like I went down to queue. We just like hung out a little bit and did whatever and Just to check out a shop and like just to like see what had become and You know, I was like seeing all like old tools from like the to shop and stuff like that and weird things that like I had intimately spent on that note Oh Jeremy recognize this dude, but anyways, you know seeing tools I had intimately spent like thousands of hours Oh my god Oh, yeah, dude Okay, can you describe that for people who were just like this is an inexpensive uh american stainless steel like technically is a butcher knife And we use this knife to cut wrapped material Um up until the day I left queue we use this at Orange county drum. We use this at queue I have cut Thousands of drums with this like so this is you would use to cut off the excess material on it on a shell and Certain materials use different tools But a knife like an eye of found works a lot and you can see like the blade The blade is deformed because I've resharpened it so many times But it was always a joke like when I used it at queue When I used it at queue Jeremy's like dude, you're the only one who uses that p.o.s You know and and then you even said you like dude if you ever leave here, you better take it And I was like 100 percent. I'm taking this knife Like I thought hadn't crossed my mind, but I was like, yeah, this is mine dude This I'm taking it. So anyways, so I go to the shop and that's awesome There's all these old tools and like all my old all my old friends You know like things that I had spent with and it was cool.  Anyways, like Let's like burn it. I'm down to burn it and squirrel some cash So I was started working at the shop and it was like it was cool, dude It was like, um all these things that legitimately were muscle memory like that I had forgotten to do like You know, and it's not I mean, it's not like rocket science But when you're flattening a big shell, we have this really big sanding disc that we used to flatten drums So you have like one cohesive edge And it's like takes you a certain stance and it certainly has a feel to it And then like there's like a rhythm to it and all this stuff and it was cool to just like, yeah I'm like backbuilding drums, but you know a lot of this stuff within To to a certain point I was super comfortable with like wood drums wrapping drums doing things like that and then it was like There's this other side of like metal side that was like more intimidating but I had done a ton of metal work on the side for myself like building things for people like industrial things or metal furniture so I wasn't like ultra intimidated but there was It was like, oh like a big kit is a big thing So the way my mind works is I'm always trying to find like to initially get back to the question You had originally asked me I went on a tangent of like well, I was born No, it's cool to get you in, but No, I like in your own time, yeah You know, so how my brain works is I'm always trying to find the most efficient way to do something and I and I think Like efficiency of movement and still to this day. I I work like that like Uh, I think it comes from working when I was really young I worked in the restaurant industry and I think you have to kind of be like aware of your surroundings and like efficient with your with your movements and I think that's something that carried over and uh, so when I was at q or when I was at oc or I was like Any job I've ever had is like I'm always thinking of like efficiency of movement efficiency of movement and In consistency is like the big thing for me like consistency consistency and obviously I want to make and anything I'm doing I want it to be like the best that I can do And so naturally like when you know, like Jeremy was always dude That was like I think that was like one of our biggest strengths is like Jeremy would always bring me this puzzle that he put together And then it was like hey man like rough edges Yeah, but it was it was but it was a complete puzzle and then it was like hey man like Make this understandable and it's not like he would literally say that to me But it was what would happen Yeah, I would yeah when he would show me how to do something or like how I would always ask How do you do it because I literally legitimately I don't want to know how to do it I want to know how you do it and then I back would backtrack my thinking is to like, okay Well, that seems like a useless step like you know or something like that or like well, there there's an opportunity for error And then down the line, there's like three compounded errors.  Oh god.  Yeah 100% and uh Yeah, and I mean I always logged everything that I did at queue um for that exact reason that I was like, well One there should be like a standard of procedure, which we never had in orange county You know, these were like lessons that we learned it was just like this is what's expected I think and then a lot of the times that I think portion was like, well, that was you interjecting like Yeah, this is how it should be This is how I want it to be and then everyone would basically meet you meet that standard You know and then at queue I Appeld what the name meant like it really meant something to me, you know that And it was like, okay. Well, so then that needs to be repeatable And it also needs to not be this like cauldron of secrets that like I keep to myself in a dungeon I had it written down and I wanted everyone To know it's like it also for myself because like I forget stuff all the time But to be like, hey, like I would make charts for like here's like a ratio chart for like sizes and stuff and and That way anybody could pick up And relatively have an understanding of what's happening. I mean I still use those charts to this day It's still it's just I go to I go over to the binder. I open it up. I'm like, okay This is the setback. This is this is the length for a 14 if I'm doing this material. It's yeah It's invaluable and uh That's you know When I had asked max to help my my goal Was to have somebody I didn't have to babysit number one Here, I mean because you know, we're doing this new thing that I'm still trying to figure out I can't sit there Babysit and teach you what to do If I'm still trying to Figure it out in my own way. So max comes in he's like You shouldn't do that. I'm like, I like it. He's like you shouldn't do it Okay, cut it and then it just kind of evolved and then all of a sudden now it's like Damn, we've got jigs. We've got this we've got that and you lay it out We do the thing still takes skill to build them right but A lot of the guesswork is taken out of it because of these steps that max implemented so Yeah, it's huge and you can repeat and do it and I mean if you had to In it put down a number. How long would you say it takes to build? You can pick brass copper steel whatever it how long does it take you guys to build a kit start to finish One of these amazing drum sets I mean build a shell packing today, but you gotta let the glue rest. So yeah I mean like uninterrupted like work hours without like dry times Like realistically you could build a kit in two days like depending on the the gnarliness of the finish, you know, Yeah, um, but yeah, I mean like awesome. You were just a machine that didn't need to eat like Like 20 hours like 20 hours of just like Smash work, you know Pretty cool. Yeah, and you guys are forming the shells and doing all that stuff In house. Yeah, that's the best part. I mean, that's the main question people ask Which I actually forgot to ask in the orange county episode and people told me in the comments of like you didn't ask Where the shells came from? Which where did the shells come from? Let me let me nip that one in the butt if you don't mind Uh, yeah, they're killer shells and I see online how much people bash killer shells. I'm pro keller Why listen, you get you get a camco from la. Guess what it is. You know what? I mean, it's going to be killer shells You got a dope dw from the 90s the the best dw's are like early 90 pre 90s are Are keller shells? I don't get just because any any kid Can buy it from a website and get a wrap and put it around it. Does it mean you can make a good drunk? No No, it's like being upset when it's smelt our own copper.  They're the best at making shells. Let them do what they do best They've been doing it for so long, you know, um, no that's come up a lot on the show and keller is awesome And I think it's it's custom to each brand usually too with with q. We don't use keller anymore After max left. Um, I use it. I took keller with company He took him with we we actually use nordic I don't know if you're familiar with nordic shells. I've heard of them I need to do a history on nordic because I mean that's Wow, all I can say the thing is I was looking for Something more when we were when we were using keller with q we could get 10 ply shells and that's what we would use is our reinforcement rings in our metal shells With nordic, I can use 12 ply and each ply is thicker and there's no There's no cavities where the veneer doesn't meet up properly So it's solid But because it's 12 ply it's more reminiscent of a 6 6 re-ring 6 6 meaning if you're using a maple shell, this was the camco. This was the dw This was the orange counting with re-rings. This is a six ply maple shell with a six ply reinforcement And that is the hands down the best maple shell. I've ever heard or ever played or ever Built messed with whatever I wanted to mimic that edge that that that profile on our metal drums So now that's why I go with nordic Awesome. Yeah, cool. And you know, I I think What you guys have done has clearly worked looking at the artist roster is insane and right off the bat We should say that ilan rubin who is your partner, right? I mean he Describe that relationship a little bit because dear god. He is a monster drummer. I mean he's incredible monster musician. You're right He's not bad, is he No um So alon wasn't an oc artist Uh, I met him when he was 11 had braces short curly hair I mean a twig And he was just he was such a polite cool kid still I mean still is and uh, you know we Max and I both built him a bunch of drums at orange candy drum um I was still With orange county when he came on board with nine inch nails And that kind of solidified our relationship because I helped him get into the fold with nine inch nails And ever since he's just taken it and ran with it. Um And He was an ocdp artist Um, we built him a galvanized steel. He's another ocd oc artist that did that a galvanized That's right. But we built that we built that for him post q where Matt and frank zuma they got there's pre q that makes sense. So q was already going Uh, he wanted he wanted a galvanized steel kit for the drum off when they would do the drum off finales they would have um Artists come up and and like do a clinic or play or whatever and he was he was on that night It was him it was erin spears It was a couple of the people I can't remember and I built him The galvanized kit that had ocdp logos sounded phenomenal Um, and after that, you know, we were going into 2013. I think With nine inch nails and he's like, why am I playing ocdp? I can't even get a kit I'm just gonna you know, I want to play a good point. I'll play what you I'll play q But I want I don't want to just be an artist. I want to be more than that I'm like, okay. Well, I could definitely use some funds and definitely use some help to get this Off off the ground and he jumped right in So that that was that awesome Seems like a very cool guy. Obviously just everything you see on top of being just a musical kind of prodigy But beyond that there's like dom Howard tucker rule. I'm looking at your artist. Uh, chris hornbrook Um, Zach lind. I mean, there's just I don't want to skip anyone. There's just so many everyone is like Hayden scott from ghost Everyone is like a top tier um player obviously Joe schmo can just call and get a kit made as well I mean all day long You don't have to be in a huge band, but the fact that all these like Kind of like very cool and like in guys and girls if that makes sense play it Just speaks a lot to the brand. Um, I feel like you've created. They're similar I mean, it's It's not really surprising but similar to orange county. There's just sort of a similar feel if that makes sense Well, we try to bring that you guys Yeah, we try to break we try to bring that same vibe over where like I said Artists would call us directly be like, hey, this is what I think I want to get and we would yeah We would coach them through what what was possible What would work best for their tour what would blah blah blah blah and we became friends Through all of that and that to me is most important.  Don't post about it. Are you my friend? Awesome?  Yeah, I think that's always been the secret sauce is like we I mean we always say this about cue like tongue-in-cheek, but it was like Dude, it's like our roster is like our family like in that sense where it was like everyone's like a friend like genuinely like if If anything carried over from orange county it was similar It was like a bunch of kids who like love these things and who love making these things Love making these things for people who love to play these things. It's like Fantastic a perfect relationship. You know and you're cool. Yeah, dude. Let's go. Yeah, let's go to the brewery And grab some food and grab a beer and hang out And that's a big that's a big thing too man about cue was like it was very much about the hang Is it more ever than it was about like adding your name to an impressive list so that we could like boast about it. It was like Legitimately, dude. It was like about like dude. You just want to hang out and if you're cool It was like dude, we want to hang out more like, you know So it was always great to have somebody come around and be in town or stop by That's the secret like like the people you work with 100 percent 100 percent And you know what the cool thing is about it too is like the the uh where the line blurs is like Within within touring world I'd be on tour and we would have all these amazing opening acts for whatever band I was working for And they would always be they would have heard of cue or whatever or they'd just be intrigued by The drums the drummer and then all of a sudden we would always get to talking and One thing would they do another and it's like I want to try out a kit I mean, okay, cool. Let's try try something out. Yeah And they would always be like man I've never played anything like this before. Yeah, you know, and I don't think it's necessarily the built quality I think again a lot of it has to do with how You sell the image of what the company is and the company for us is We just we're family oriented. We love each other. We hang out We want that to be part of it and I think when people come on board you're like This is right. Yeah, and I think with that too.  Let me you need to play my drums No, it was always like they had to come ask They had like that threshold unless you were like good friends with them And that threshold was always like you have to ask me in the sense that like I don't want to encroach what I do on you like it has to be natural in that way You know, that's that's what it is. Yeah, we're not pushers, dude. Like and No, and obviously like pushers and we're not pushers Yeah, yeah, like Jeremy obviously like tour tours Way more does way more sessions than I would ever do but like every once in a while I would get when the like ninth guy on the list wasn't available They would call max and I was like, yeah, sure. I'll do it. Whatever. So I would like work these gigs and stuff and like and uh It was kind of the same thing like I would never mention that like like uh, brother work a cue Like I never mentioned it because it was just like it wasn't who I was It wasn't who the company was and then somebody would find out they'd be like, dude, why don't you like that? That's hot. Why did you say something? I could have borrowed some drugs cooler that way I agree. It's cooler when people find out. I don't even bring up I mean the podcast is nothing compared to what you guys are doing But I don't bring it up to people I meet like, you know in my neighborhood or something When they find out about it later, but when they find out about it later, it's cooler And they go, dude, what the you do this? It's like, yeah, dude, your voice is that sexy. Yeah, it is Nice to meet me. I know Thank you. Um, well, I mean, I think this is leading right up to a good point to talk about, um The community that you guys have built and uh, I mean we could talk all day I mean we're like an hour and a half deep right now Uh, and I feel like Jeremy at some point even another one where we could talk about your like drum teching And that world of just like tips and tricks for that But I mean for the sake of time, I think we should just so we we get to it The community obviously has come together in a big part right now. You want you want me to cry? Okay, we did talk about this before I think that uh people people would love to hear from you about what's been going on and just like You know the amazing outpouring of support that's been going on maybe if you're comfortable with it You just want to kind of tell people what's been going on in case they're not familiar with the situation maybe Yeah, it's heavy. Um I was on tour in europe. I was having some I was feeling some sort of way and I needed to go see a doctor and uh I ended up in in a doctor's office in Athens And it was a gastroenterologist and she did an endoscopy And she found a tumor in my stomach She said I had a week left to tour. She said, uh, you need to go home immediately and get your affairs in order Um That's what I did. I threw home and uh You know when she called me the following week when I was at home to tell me the results of the biopsy It came back cancerous. She said his second third stage cancer and I'm like, okay She's like it's beatable, but you got to get on it now so I Found a team down here that down in san diego And uh, I went there they did all the same tests all that stuff and um ended up doing a PET scan which is a little more it shows a little bit more and Come to find out the cancers in my bones in my lymph nodes It's now stage four. It's a high stage four and it was uh Yeah, I mean that's heavy man. No one should have to go through that No, it's heavy man and to come on that fast, you know, like There's no lead up to being sick like that, but No and uh, you know, I I hadn't worked for two and a half years because of the pandemic really And uh, but I'm just so everybody knows I don't make money from q q is just a passion project I make I make my money from touring There was no touring I've finally gotten on a tour.  He's like I want to do go find me and I man.  I just don't and uh and I talked to my doctors He told me what it was gonna cost and I was like Okay, we're we're done So I reach out to roger and I said, okay, I guess I guess run it And he did he's like I'm gonna put it at 250,000. I'm like dude. Why you know what I mean? And when it hit and it started reaching I mean when it got over 70,000 I was shocked and the people Seeing the people that were donating you know like People that I've worked for that heard through the grapevine Putting tons of money down Um, all the drummer friends that I know that were reposting. I mean I cried literally Three four hours a day for weeks and uh, yeah It actually helped me heal a bit. They helped because it gave me this reason to fight number one But it also gave me the means to not have to stress Um, I still have tons of medical bills. My medical bills were up over 200 grand. I do have medical insurance. Thank god I have good news. I had I had a second pet scan after my first six rounds of chemotherapy and immunotherapy My scan showed that it has lessened a lot It's still there. The doctors believe that I will be leaving living with this for the rest of my life The way the way the way they like in it is it's like grass or weeds You can you can pull the weeds from from their root even But it's going to come back at some point So the key is maintenance is basically to get it as minimal as possible um I'm sick I mean I throw up excuse me I'm nauseous. I throw up every day I've lost 60 pounds. I'm really weak. I don't have the energy to stand or work in the shop at the moment I thought that this month I'd be able to but it just hasn't materialized yet and you know, I think I I think the cancer is Least of my worries at this time. It's more the side effects from All the stuff that they've given me to fight the cancer But I'll say like I wouldn't be here right now if it wasn't for the community I I'd already be I would have already checked out um the community my lady my child My friends that keep tabs on me every day, you know and um man, it's it's uh It's a lot and I'm sorry. I've got going on a tangent, but Oh, no, my god. I honestly I can't I can't thank everybody enough. There's roger my friend eric leaderman Tucker geo They formed like this little task force. They call it the berman task force, I guess And they they put together this this auction that came out the auction So the auction that just happened was supposed to coincide with the With the jump of go find me because to be honest I didn't think anybody was gonna donate, you know and uh, they were they were worried about it too. So they had they Hit up all these people and got all this amazing gear and They finally had procured enough of it to put the auction in but the go find me crushed.  I know there's been some people in our industry that have been They've been affected the same way. Jonathan Cowell of revolution drum Um, you know, I wanted to donate to him. He's he's amazing. He texts me, you know At least once or twice a week just to check up on me because he's been he's been through it before And he's going through it again And he's got you know, it's different than what I have but it's still the same constipation nauseous losing weight Can't sleep because of the pain all these things that you know I guess only people that are dealing with cancer can really fully understand. So it's it's been nice to have someone to talk to I have another Dear friend that also went through it I won't mention his name because I don't think he's Made it public, but he's a big influence in the drum industry and he's Let me know like hey, dude You got a kid fight for that. You have to fight. Yeah um It's been uh, it's been eye-opening. What makes me what makes me really sad is that I've Q was gaining so much momentum and now it's just it's just it's A storage unit currently I go down there once every other week to check mail Stare at the shop and dream big, you know what I mean? um I built a snare drum Recently and it was one of the hardest things I've ever had to do and uh But I did it and the person that got it is amazing and she deserved it and you know It's just it's just a lot down It's just a lot And you know when I when I talk to my friends, you know like this like every time I talk to max and I don't talk all that often right now Because when we do talk it's emotional. Oh, we can't it's just it's just so hard for me like just Yeah Left a little man.  You're just bad It's me right here and I just it's just hard, man No one should have to go through this and you and I literally just met tonight for the first time And the fact that I feel a huge connection to you already and I don't I know it doesn't What is it worth? But I am truly sorry and I think everyone is that you have to go through this and no one Should have to go through this but It doesn't pick Good people or bad people. I mean you're like an incredible guy and it's just there's no it's just It's awful, but I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy My pet my poor parents they They both called me today and they're just like jare I wish I was the one going through this.  I will get through it Again, like just the amount of love that it showed Is yeah, I was gonna say really Is truly lifted me more than anything that I could have ever imagined I'm getting text messages from friends that I haven't talked to in forever And it's it's just Yeah, I've never seen anything like it the amount of people and just no especially in this community In this community, but I mean If that's I mean dude if that's not a testament to the person in itself Then I don't know what is it's like something like this happens and then like In let's be real and somewhat of like a fickle selfish industry You have this turnaround of just wanting to help That in its own right the sickness is like this emotional thing that I can only imagine you have to like emotionally balance And then you have all of this this like and I know like we're like this like Anytime anybody does anything for us. It's super hard. So I can imagine like how how hard it is to like Dude the outreach and the import of love is like unbelievable. It's such a beautiful thing That and like the scale of it, man. So my point is is like if it's any testament to the person itself You know, it's incredible. I love you too, man. It's incredible, you know, and I mean I mean that, you know Yeah Well, I mean the fact that you came on the show and we're like I mean we emailed a while back and just coming on to share your story I knew we had to save this stuff to the end because otherwise then it would be like so tell me about orange county Right, it would be like not the right order to go But I will say without orange county, there wouldn't be us, man Exactly, but then we had to have fun first, you know, of course, of course um I will say something that's pretty funny. I remember When I finally got the nerve to tell daniel that I started q I Needed the nerve. I mean, you don't you don't understand It could have gone one of two ways and it would have gone badly one way and and And I didn't want that because I love daniel the death and I love his family. I love kirsten and I didn't want to um Make waves But I also wanted to build drums Like, you know, oh man, that's what I've done. That's all I know. I'm not a college graduate I've not even a high school graduate Like, you know, I tested out of high school early and all I've ever done has worked And I love tinkering on stuff. I started off in bicycles and I've moved on into drums and it was uh, there's uh There's very much a Tie in with both of those to me that are very important me max and shon barber would go ride I mean, it was like the best that we would we would build drums shon would come from the tattoo shop with his bike We'd go ride we would laugh at shon crash and we would just love we would love it every minute of it It's just the most fun and it would give us just a release from the shop Even if max and I had a bad day with each other we'd get on the bikes we'd ride and then we would laugh and everything went away, you know, but anyway I wanted to continue building drums. So I had to tell Daniel and then it was like Then it was like well I wish you good luck It's a stupid idea Because you're never going to make any money and he was Absolutely 100 clear But at the end of the day it's never been about the money for us It's always just been about making awesome stuff and having people Love it like it was their child You know to me that There's nothing that beats that and with that I think that that sort of spread into the community and I have imposter syndrome right now and it's weird but The love has been unreal and I really just want to get back to making q again and having people be stoked on what We pump out Yeah for sure it will absolutely happen and I think Like you said the community is just unbelievable and uh, this wouldn't have happened to someone who was Not cool along the way and had burned bridges and even the fact of what you said about Daniel and going to him and asking It's just like all these little things speak to your character Of just how the business was handled and even with you max too as well you guys It's just talking about how you know, we might have had a bad day But then you go and do you know go ride together and do this stuff. It's just like It's the community. It's the drum drumming community in general is all very It's it's it's very cool and family oriented. I think yeah Yeah, we're friends we're friends with just about every drum company out there I mean there might be a few that we're not the best of friends with but I've always Thought that you can learn something from somebody, you know what I mean and I'm not one to sit there and Hello, I shouldn't say I'm not one to bash somebody's drums I have You're human. We all we all do it Yeah, but but the community itself is just is incredible. I mean there's there's nothing like it man. I I couldn't Be happier to be a part even just a small part of it You know, absolutely. Well, clearly you're a huge part of it. I mean with the that auction is just insane the amount of stuff that was Real I'm sad. I'm sad.  Oh my god. I decide when Fred wait when Fred posted or when Eric Texted me to tell me that Fred. I actually work. I work for Fred for for a couple shows. He was playing in diva And he had asked me to come Tech forum and it was one of the funniest most fun things I'd ever done he's Exactly what you see on camera. He's quirky and funny. Yeah, and just he's just sweet man And I when that happened, I couldn't believe it. I just I could not believe it All of it. Yeah, all of it. I just Yeah, oh Unreal unreal and thank you every single person that has ever donated to me for I just Hopefully I make you proud and I get through this and can start building drums again. That's all I care about Yeah, totally Yeah, and your friends and family and the very well Very well said. I mean, I think it's just unbelievable. I'll put a link in the description. I mean you're at $234,000 And in some change right now in the go fund me. So pretty unbelievable. I'll put it in the description for people who want to donate because Like you said stuff is expensive. So, um, you can go find qdrum online at qdrumco.com But like social media and all that stuff you guys want to like kind of tell people where to find you or anything qdrumco qdrumco I will I do want to I want to thank you very much Bart. I know you reached out to me early on in june Man, I really appreciate what you've done as far as especially the ocdp stuff. I think it definitely needs to be pushed out there. I I keep seeing drum builders that are that had built orange county drum stuff post orange county drum and You know It hurts my heart to see it because we Were very much Very prideful on us being the builders in it and when I see somebody saying well, I built this Okay, what was the time frame? Was it was it post? Or pre and you know, I yeah, it drives me crazy because I What you're doing is allowing us to clear the air about a lot of things um And you know, I know that we didn't we didn't dive very deep into the ocdp.  Yeah, that was cool. Like I was a part of that But it's also super cool for me to hear it from somebody else's perspective that went through the same thing that In other words is somewhat impossible unless it's Of a scale of what it is like orange county in that sense, you know, like Yeah, I mean, I mean, you're not gonna talk to your valet buddies about what valet was like But this is cool This is like a moment in history that you're a part of that you're unawaringly Unknowingly a part of and it's super cool that it's on record man. I appreciate that you're doing this bro Oh, I appreciate you guys saying that there's something interesting about hearing other people Like I bet in a year we'll watch like a documentary about like covet and we'll be like Oh man, that was so, you know, it puts it in a different perspective to like watch or hear someone else talk about it But um, I appreciate that that's very kind words from you guys, but um on that note Thank you guys for watching or and listening everyone out there and Jeremy and max guys Thank you for being here and maybe down the road. We'll have you back and talk about something else Thank you guys for being here. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you


All right, this is a quick walkthrough of how to install Vesper, Vesper is an open source software for monitoring nocturnal bird migration developed by Harold Mills it's programmed in Python and easiest installed using the Anaconda programming environment so to install Anaconda you can just head over to their site and Choose your installation In this case, I would install the Mac installation And once you have the software installed you can open it up and Go to environments and what I've done here is just create an environment called it Vesper and Vesper relies on Python 3 it doesn't work in Python 2 So I've just chosen Python 3.6 and created this archive I haven't I've just left all the defaults here on the right In my environment, so once you've got that going you can hit this green arrow choose open and terminal That will automatically activate your environment and open a terminal window with that environment enabled Okay, so once we've got that going We can Install Vesper in this environment. I want to first change to the directory of all of my files So I'm gonna copy all of this Move it over Now you would just clone this repo onto your hard drive. So once we've got that let's Change into that directory. I'm just gonna do that by typing CD and then dragging this folder from my hard drive Now you can see I'm in this directory. I've got all my files here Just as a quick walkthrough of what all's in here on a high level Archive data 2018 is gonna be a sort of settings file for where our recordings were made and What detectors were used things like that will walk through it in more detail in a second You can see it here on the left Anyway, and then once the database is created you'll see a SQLite database here Clips are the clips that Vesper detects so once you have recordings and you process them it will automatically create this directory and Separate your recordings out into short little clips that it feels are Potentially representative of nocturnal blur migration then your preferences.yaml file is a file that you can use to sort of customize the interface of Vesper itself Presets I haven't dug into too far yet, but these are all sort of further configuration Files that you can manipulate key bindings for the interface and things like that and recordings is just an arbitrary Location where I have chosen to put full-length recordings that Vesper can process into clips So I'm gonna put all my sound files in here Okay, so these are a bunch of recordings that were sent to me by Gregor and I got and He was using an old bird detector to make these recordings. I recorded them for 30 minutes to an hour or so each time Someone here Forest Grove we're gonna use Forest Grove as the station name here And these files in order to be processed properly by Vesper need to have a particular naming structure so in this instance Again Forest Grove is the station name and we have an underscore and we have the date separated by dashes where it's in the format of four-digit year two-digit month in this case April Two-digit day in this case the 19th then an underscore and then the time and the time is In UTC format, so this was recorded in Pacific daylight time Which is seven hours ahead of UTC time here O5 is the hour Dot 5 1 is the minutes dot 2 1 is the seconds and this underscore Z stands for Zulu time and Then we have the file extension. So all the files need to follow that format in order to be imported properly This file. I'm not going to copy because we have already got it in our System here the clips have already been processed. That was done by Harold Mills in order to make sure everything was working So I'm just going to copy these over See there's about four gigs worth of data in here and Once these are processed we can clear out these recordings files Okay, so now we're back in our terminal and make sure we're in this Vesper environment You can see here on the command line as Vesper The next step as we can see from these instructions is to create a super user An admin user for the software and so I'll just call it Vesper Admin Adjust and then I'll do our password Okay, so I've got a user for the system and Now I just need to run the server Do that with Vesper Admin run server and that Vesper underscore admin by the way It's just a shortcut to the manage.py Python file for this project It's just an alias and you can see our server is up and running. So we should be able to copy this address paste it into our browser And see our clips So again these clips were already processed so we have Circle on the date for the 25th where some recordings were made We have our station here. We have the detectors that are used so seep and thrush The two that have been enabled for this project and then all of these are classifications for types of birds As well as some other random ones like noise tone These are all classifications that can be assigned to our clips and we can filter What we've detected here by these different? abbreviations It's different call types and noises Across the top here. We've got our menu This is the clip calendar The important menu is where we can bring in new recordings. We'll do that in a second Archive data is that archive.yaml file that I mentioned earlier and we'll go through that in a second detect Once our password and so once we have recordings We can process them with this detect menu go through that in a second After we've detected we run our classifier Once we have clips that seem useful when they've all been classified then we can export those for further processing Here we can delete clips and recordings So back in the clip calendar, let's just take a look at what we've already got and Looks like Harold has run through all the clips that were detected as potential Nocturnal migration calls and narrowed it down to one useful call now. I think From the old bird detector we started it with around 240 clips those were narrowed down to about 120 through The detectors within Vesper and of those 120 there was only one significant Nocturnal migration calls. So you can see this band here. This is when all of this happened So you could see it was happened somewhere between 430 and 530 in the morning and this is now in Pacific Standard Time so Extend that conversion for us to our local time based on this YAML file, which I'll go through in a second and Click play you can hear that call So before I get too far into Vesper itself, let me just go through these YAML files now this was a Kind of starter YAML file provided by Harold Mills that we modified to fit our Stational kitchen and types of detectors that we use etc. So Here we have information about our recording station Forest Grove We've got our time zone, which is Pacific We've got our latitude and longitude elevation This is an old bird recorder. So you'll see that here You've got some start and end times here the types of detectors that are available I think the only ones that are being used right now are Thrush and seep. So these are the two Detectors that will try to Listen in certain frequency bands for Something that sounds like nocturnal migration and these are you know about 25 years old So they're not the most accurate advanced detectors, but they are simple to get up and running via old bird They're pretty affordable so That's what we're using then the classifiers are These sort of machine learning algorithms that run in order to try and classify the noise that we hear as Nocturnal bird migration within the software itself so MPG Ranch and Then we've got all of our different classifiers here and we could add to these Subtract a lot of these species where are not Pacific Northwest native birds, so they might be irrelevant. We might want to do that at some point But at any rate once our project is set up, we would do that through the database and not through this YAML file This is only kind of to get up and running Okay, so now that We've gone through the files. Let's go ahead and import some of these recordings. Remember I put them in this recordings directory name them all appropriately so in our interface you can just say recordings and If there were sub directories, we would want to check recursive, but they're not so I'll just say import and It's not going to automatically update this interface. We have to kind of check back in and we want to make sure We're not navigating around the site while it's Doing any importing or classifying or detecting We do want to keep a live status. We can look over here in our terminal window and see And we're looking for this job complete, which I see so if I refresh the page I can see That same status within here So now if we're looking at our clip calendar We can see all of these recordings in the interface and The one on the 25th was already processed. So that one is Orange, but the rest are gray So let's do that now we'll go to detect sector detectors sector date range and I'm just going to pick one day just in case there's problems If there is an issue with any of our recordings, it will cause the whole thing to not work So just do one day at a time click detect Much this thing around here. So there you go job complete Now we want to classify the same thing Great. So now if we go back to our clip calendar You can see we've got two dates here that have been classified You can see the dot is much bigger here because we have a lot of clips notice, you know In on the 25th we reduced it down to the one significant clip But that hasn't been done yet on this date So here are all of our calls and we'd be looking for nocturnal migration calls and getting rid of anything that wasn't So I listened to this first call Sounds like some noise if I hit the end key on one of these clips. I could just classify it as noise That's some No, it But it looks like here. We've got something that looks like it could be A nocturnal migration call and I'm not an expert. So I'm not gonna do anything with those right now But this is the process by which we would classify or call out things that seemed Like significant birds off and that's basically how you use this interface