tural phenomena you guys do not observe the natural phenomena first you make your hypothesis then you observe the natural phenomena that's not science that's you are so oblivious to science really incredible okay when you had the so-called eddington experiment as you put it was that first observed or was it predicted before what what's your science is that we verify things so it's not science then it's circular reasoning i see the sun come up so therefore the sun comes up because god pushes it up so so a hypothesis you basically make the hypothesis so just say you're trying to find out what is causing something you say hey i observed this i think it might be say the earth is round right okay that becomes the alternative hypothesis right no what yes yes that is how it works tell me the course for round that is how it works then give me the course around if the earth is not round i should see this and go out to falsify that hypothesis you don't understand science circular reasoning you have to you have to manipulate the independent variable to get your outcome how do you manipulate around please tell me how you manipulate yes you are projection no you're completely clueless so you don't manipulate about science you are the best contender for the dunning kruger awards i have ever seen in my life have you it's incredible do you manipulate the iv or not mark do i manipulate the iv i don't even know what you're talking about so you're speaking ignorance projection i do you manipulate the iv do you manipulate the iv how do you manipulate the iv i don't even know what context you're referring to independent variable that's the cause of the effect aka your iv the course which causes the dv the the okay so that's what you're talking about okay and you're telling me i'm the ignorant to science projection no i just iv can stand for a lot of things you you did give me even say the action iv stands for one thing all right let's continue on with our super chats what intravenous we've got all kinds of uh questions here god you're so slow it's it's incredible so we've almost cracked 200 likes i i'm not i was gonna say i speak pretty fast sometimes i gotta be careful uh i won't take that projection on to me or else live chats gonna just tear me to shreds uh abner 999 floris do you believe the moon is made of plasma thanks abner for that super chat your first one you want that flat white you want that possible yeah it could be possible uh we do not know what it is so we're not making claims but it's a possibility what is all what we all like in this sense like i'm yeah i'm sorry all all i guess okay all i know all i know with this the moon is this when it reaches about a quarter or the last quarter or the gibbous uh you know either way after full moon or before four full moon it is looking up at 3 34 it's looking up about 1 32 o'clock 2 33 o'clock and the sun is down at five o'clock 5 30 if it was on the moon if you wait to after the full moon and you get you get a quarter or you get you know you know waning gibbous that that's what it's called that the moon is looking up at 10 10 3 11 o'clock and the sun is down at eight if you go by line of site in your fairy tale outer space you should always have the sun illuminating directly on the moon i have videos showing that it does not and we're coming up to a first quarter here real soon in a few days and i you know i'll i'm gonna do it again but i'm telling you guys the the moon is self-illuminating because line of sight will tell you that if the sun if in your fairy tale the sun will be illuminating the moon directly on that side and not looking up or looking up and the sun lower in the sky but i i appreciate your fairy tale but you know what's we're right before you guys jump in here just to clarify for our super chatter so that is a yes you do believe the moon is made of plasma or you think that's a possibility it's just a possibility the question was the sun made of plasma i think no is the moon is the moon made of plasma the moon's made of plasma no it's a possibility no one's claiming this but again don't you think it's an interesting fact that when you have a new moon you're not able to see it that's what the new moon no no matter how much exposure you put you do not able to bring the moon into view we know that well it's a physical object actually not true um during the last solar eclipse what was it 2017 i took my kids i took photos i had a ton of cameras with me and i did get the face of the moon off of the earth shine reflected directly back at the moon in front of the sun so yeah you can see the moon when it is literally brand new if you do it exactly right do you maybe have a channel i'd love to check this out if you got the video i do not have the video on my channel but i do have a channel awesome so so again ember is speaking something but he can't prove something thank you so again um i just like to point out that they're making all of these statements on sort of how the their model works what what what the model entails but they don't actually even know so what this shows is that the moon can be anything to justify their presuppositions about the world if something doesn't work they can just say hey the moon's not plasma it's this other thing oh well that's not you know this other thing it's then made of cheese is why that they chose what it shows this is the deception that flat earth always does they always will never get pinned down to one description because then they can change it to suit whatever proves them wrong you self-project really well excuse me excuse me this is the path to ignorance um it absolutely is why do you think it's called relativity because you can change it anytime you want to it's not called it's not called special objectivity or general objectivity it's called relativity because you can change it anytime mark you've you self-project at least two or three times tonight and this is the first time i've called you out but i'm telling you right self-project if you believe if you believe that the moon can look up at 10 10 30 and the sun can be down at eight and vice versa before it becomes a new moon and you say well it's refraction or the billion of warp into spacetime or whatever line of sight should tell you that the moon is self-illuminating you go look at it in three or four days look at it after the full moon and you come back with me because i have video that the moon is self-illuminating i'm sorry guys i know you're atheist your faith is in the globe some of us have faith in a creator who created us i mean that's cool how do you get a shadow on a self-illuminating surface okay can i finish off this so i'll give it to the next one jay uh ryan yeah um we'll i'd like the answer to that how do you get a shadow on a self-illuminating surface first of all you're making a assertion that it's a shadow secondly um like we're saying what is it we don't know just like just because your globe tells you it's something doesn't make it so it just means you are gullible and enough to have faith to believe it's what's to be told what's the definition of a shadow again we're closing off here nobody's saying it's a shadow what's not a shadow oh i'm saying it's a shadow so you claiming it to be a shadow that's you that's not me all right let's move on here guys uh ten prior five dollars apparently this is not the one that the flat earthers are going to give evidence for flat earth they are really obsessed with globe earth aren't they uh they're coming at you too so jim and flat so maybe they want to date the globe us model have you ever thought about that maybe they want them maybe they're jealous okay flat so it flat so you go then i have a response okay okay what do you think we presented bodies of water always stay level flat at rest no measured curve unique containment to have gas pressure no rotation of earth aka all flat so i don't know what he's talking about since nine experiments that showed us blood earth since 19 since 1958 65 years ago nasa has gotten 700 billion dollars space force i don't know that they started december 2019 you have other space agency spread throughout the world you have education you have entertainment it is a very good possibility if you adjust for inflation between 1958 and today 65 years that the globe through taxpayer money printing money borrow money ngo's foundations has gotten somewhere between eight and ten trillion dollars with a t and our side from foundations uh ngo's taxpayer money printing money borrow money has gotten zero your science has been bought all right well uh i didn't want to keep this going but you're kind of coming at the other side there so let's not address the question i'm just giving you i'm just giving you facts as far as money that you that your side has gotten that our side hasn't it weird how you fund actual science huh all right let's continue on dr dino two dollars thanks for your super chat thanks to everybody else for their super chat i think i've been forgetting to say thanks for your super chat you know so a big thank you to everybody who has already put in the super chat uh and to those of you who haven't uh no thank yous shame on you dr dino two dollars serious thank you for watching anyway yeah thanks for watching don't don't let my my canadian stark has him jar you right i do i do know uh that i've been i should say i i've been known to say uh that the canadian sorry is usually uh sorry you're so stupid eh um that's why a is usually followed up with that you know we're not actually looking at canadians in a whole new light now yeah exactly that apologies really just like a little tiny uh backhand anyways i'm kidding i'm kidding sorry to the canadians in the live chat let's continue on dr dino two dollars i'll say it again serious hoven flashbacks here having fun e and m are you having fun ember and mark yeah absolutely um i i think i think and and it's funny because you hear the the same arguments that like and hoven kind of goes off flat earth as a stupid and stuff like that easy really is is this really denigrates them completely which i probably wouldn't do um but you know it's odd because you hear the same arguments from these people um about a young earth about flat earth about about all these conspiracies stopping us from learning the fun kind of thing but they yeah but they can't agree on the truth that's the thing like you hear all these conspiracy theories but they can never get on the same page yeah and um you know your thoughts and then i you know jim uh flat so you guys having a good time you have to uh you know oh yeah it's always chill i love our modern day debate how you'd have i love i i i i enjoy ryan he's very very fair and mark and ember first time i've met you you guys are great and i i know flat so it a little bit yeah and jim's awesome it's good to actually have jim on here i mean that's your first debate correct jim yes on modern day debate yes and i want and if i don't get a chance to thank if i don't get a chance to thank james i want to thank james right now oh yes uh oh well it's it's well worth it to wake up at when i am for these things i was going to say yes always a big thank you to uh the modern day debate uh overlord james our lord and savior here uh at modern day debate for uh just creating such an amazing channel where we can have a neutral platform for everybody to share their views uh we're going to continue with the q and a uh once again i want to remind our fellas if you have want an opportunity to use the washroom get yourself a drink uh we can have a little moment for that yay or nay no these guys are professionals i'm good for right now they don't want to go anywhere oh my wife just got home hello wife anyways uh let's continue on hi ryan waifu hello ryan waifu hi oh hi always throwing her jacket on the back of my chair i tell her not to do there you go and there she goes dying superiority clear dominance display yeah dominance to get called out in the live chat now see what have you done to me wife what have you done all right lj 199 mark is a sad oh sorry mark mark is a sad example of what humanity has become um okay well yeah that's a little ad hominy i didn't mean to get i already had it that far so i figured i may as well finish off yeah yeah go for it go for it matthew wilson yeah hello canadian for two dollars no no no i could don't i get to respond to that i mean you want to respond okay you go for it yeah yeah i mean calling someone names isn't a reputation of any of their arguments i could be like a puddle on the floor making an argument you know an absolute genetic nightmare making an argument doesn't mean that i'm wrong like it's not a refutation of what i've said so if all you can do is throw insults then good on you i i don't know what to that i want to do with or to do with your network yeah yeah so like you know based on the arguments not on not on how people look or you know stuff like that it's pointless all right just hold on one second here let's get back into the q and a i'm just keeping an eye on the live chat there because i knew everybody was going to get all their all their panties in a knot all right so matthew wilson two dollars a fellow canadian if there is a dome where do meteorites come from maybe they break off the dome who knows so it's a nickel iron dome never know interesting we don't very curious concept our side our side doesn't doesn't decide things based on assumptions and things that we cannot measure we cannot observe and that we really and that we cannot test if we can you know what our side does ember and mark is we test the earth the ground we walk on you guys look to the sky to tell us what the ground is we walk on we actually test the ground and that's a huge difference that's a great point uh yeah we do testing but if you're sort of your own experiences all you'll ever test um you'll never understand anything this is what i mean by it's a road to ignorance because you'll never even look up into the sky or you won't cross the mountains and go somewhere else to test you're locked in your own ignorance of hey i'm only going to see what's around me while taking advantage of things that have been built based upon science like the only reason why we're talking on the internet right now is because somebody used scientific principles to come up with with computers the internet um airline travel uh everything that all of our technology is based upon scientific principles and we can well we're not gonna do anything but look at the ground we would never have come up with those those things we can do that on a stationary plane as well rick it's not shape dependent um but only if you're if you're just looking at the ground you're never going to we're all looking at the sky the only difference is you guys already have your belief that the sky you're looking at is a vacuum that violates the second law of thermodynamics it doesn't well it it doesn't and also we don't start from a place of belief we start from a place of skepticism say we don't have a reason to believe this can we demonstrate it and then it gets demonstrated and we go okay we've come this far now let's try to demonstrate something else and where stuff fails like a flat earth then we stop believing in that great so you can demonstrate gas pressure that containment for us go ahead yeah we already did yeah that's that's been that's been asked and answered also altitude as you go up an altitude pressure goes down if there were a container it should be a homogenous pressure also we can see lots and lots of planets including gas giants who don't seem to have domes to hold their gases in sorry again pressure gradients come after gas pressure which comes after the containment your pressure gradient is already in a contained system it's a dynamic system in a her inhomogeneous gas there we go what gas inhomogeneous it's moving around in all directions constantly it's dynamic we got a few variables to contain with which gives the pressure gradients you guys saying we have pressure gradients doesn't negate that they're ready the gas was there with the containment already number step one container it would be the same pressure throughout like whenever we measure it in any container ever hey would you guys disagree mark and ember would you disagree with this comment that that you guys know it's a globe because it's a globe which is begging the question i mean do you go in assuming it's a globe because it's a globe which is the ultimate in begging a question do you guys do that no okay all right let's continue on with the super chats everybody just a reminder to keep your super chats friendly and also keep your live chats friendly because we will remove them unfortunately and if you're spamming in the live chat we'll put you on time out or kick you out of the stream we don't want to do that so let's continue on uh so lisa richardson 999 if i were one inch tall standing on a or sorry one foot tall standing on a ball i wouldn't see a curve on its horizon if i stood on a round plate unless i was in the center i would see a curve why don't we see this on earth if it's flat right you would see it's based on angles so you can't resolve how far so if you're saying you can only see it on a curve which is really nonsensical because we show these demonstrations on flat surfaces constantly because it's just angles you practically see with angles when you rise up you're pushing your field of view out further your angles widely when you're lower you diminishing that angle that's why it gets diffracted and you can't resolve further than what you can see it's not shape dependent it's just how optics work well actually on a flat earth if you rise up because the hypotenuse of a right right angle triangle is longer than a straight line the further you rise up the further you're looking to see kind of thing that's cool so you should be able to see less the further you rise up because the distance actually becomes longer well you said it was due to the distance sorry so the distance makes you see less why would that be that's not what happens that's my point why you making that claim why would that be just one second there fellas i think jim's trying to say something there jim no no i was interrupting it forgive me oh okay sorry now i've interrupted how dare you so you would agree that on a flat plane if you're higher up the hypotenuse of that so it's a right angle no matter how high you are right the right angle 90 degree angle on a flat plane right and you've got something to say 10 meters over here right the further you rise up the longer the hypotenuse the longer the distance to see becomes correct mm-hmm so why does it get clearer and more you can see better the further you rise up when it's long you're seeing a further distance because your baseline is pushing out further it's pushing past that 10 meter object your baseline is pushing past that 10 meter object yes that's why you're not going towards it you're getting further away from it you are widening the whole triangle the whole 90 degree triangle so that object is staying exactly where it is you can now just imagine where the point is the vertex between the the baseline and hypotenuse is moving past that that object and therefore you can see further the object is still in your field of view you're just seeing further than the object that's why when you take for instance like Ozzy in the other day Ozzyon or whatever his name is when he used his drone footage to rise up that's why you saw more of the horizon behind it because he was pushing out his field of view further its perspective well and rising up should make that object smaller as the distance to that object becomes larger through the hypotenuse but that's not what we see in effect we don't see the the effect of them you don't see things get smaller when you rise in altitude you're serious have you ever used your eyes before no not not enough to like not not the way we would expect on a flat plane no the whole idea that things should emerge from the the top up on a on a on a sort of so so when we rise up we see the thing emerge from beyond the horizon correct yeah because the angle was smaller that's what we're saying so as soon as you're rising you're pushing that angle out further at the distance to that object yeah but the distance of the whole triangle is pushing out further than the object the object itself is not changing the object is just getting smaller angrily because your distance from it is getting from it is getting further away but you're seeing more past that object you limiting yourself just to the object by ignoring what's beyond the object all right well so why bottom why bottom up why what's sorry why why why why does it vanish bottom up when you go further down let's try to wrap up because that angle sorry because that angle that triangle you could say it's becoming smaller those that vertex is getting smaller and smaller until it doesn't work yes it's called the fraction limit no it doesn't work because basically there's no if it was to become smaller it would become smaller in total it would become all of it would become smaller it wouldn't it wouldn't half of it get smaller in van no it wouldn't explain how that works okay so explain how that works let's finish up this point though okay yeah we'll finish it quickly it's simple it's just the fraction limit it's like when you take a brick and you stick it let's say 100 meters and you can't see that brick 100 meters away stick another brick on top of that brick you can sort of see a sheer shape add another brick until you pull the wall you can agree you can see the wall but you can't see the bottom brick or any bricks for that matter you can just see a brown structure that's the fraction limit that's exactly how it works on a flat plane of course you can see the bricks under it you could sorry guys I can't I've tried to explain in very simple terms my time's running out I don't get it if you stack up bricks on a flat plane what's what's interrupting your view you can't see each singular brick but you can see the whole wall all right well talking about the fraction limit so if you see individual bricks right and you don't change you change your elevation you won't see the individual bricks if you raise up a little bit when you raise up with individual bricks those ones in the bottom will compress into the next one correct because you were looking at it from a sharper angle yes so and the opposite happens in reality when you raise up you can see more of the bricks I don't what are you talking about so a brick doesn't appear to be compressed when you rise with reality when you're on the earth and something is no let me finish let me finish when you're on the earth and something is beyond the horizon when you rise up you can see more of it exactly the opposite of what you're talking about you can see more of it is my point we're gonna close this out on you yeah all right flatzoid what was it that you said there I think I might have over talked wow I got you to finish 11 I got like 10 minutes left in the past engulf okay let's continue on with the superchats lj 499 uh this is also kind of ad hominy a little bit there mark but I know your uh tough skin so I'll read it anyway yeah this is globe on trial it's almost 2024 and we've never measured earth curvature or earth spinning mark is a lonely loser welcome to flat earth yeah I don't feel lonely I actually you know there's there's awesome people around me but they're sure you know you throw those ad homes that I think it might be opposite day mark well I think it's just sort of you know when somebody can't handle your arguments they throw insults kind of thing well let's it's it's really weird let's not give them any more mental real estate yeah absolutely super chat but as I said we want to keep them friendly so uh and we do want to keep moving because we still have like a good 20 plus superchats there just what was the first part of it I want to say something about first part now it's in my mind all right so yeah I guess there is a little bit of meat there beyond the uh blood slinging we've never measured earth curvature or earth spinning was I think the yeah sure yeah real crux of what they were saying I mean you know rest in peace Bob and Adele he he measured it with a ring laser gyroscope it's being measured by flat earthers and um you know we we can see the effect of the chrome sure a ring laser gyroscope measures a sidera rotation of the sky above us it's a mechanical gyroscope that determines the axial rotation or the ground rotation which doesn't exist Netflix I tell you for all you all you people who believe we live on a spinning space ball whenever you bring up 2018 behind the curve guys I'm sorry I tune out go ahead and believe whatever you want to believe that was a hit piece it's cool it's cool man take it run with it enjoy it all right um yep all the effects of conspiracies it's all good just um yeah I was going to say just because our next question is for you Jim and uh you're on the ball there as far as uh your thoughts and your concerns Dr. Dino two dollars Jim what does topographic mean I'm not sure you know do you know topographic means uh for Dr. Dino my hat says stationary because it's it's uh uh science you know you know shows that we're stationary and and also the bible talks about being immovable I know these two gentlemen don't believe in that but that's okay and then and we are planer planer so topographical basically you know we have hills and mountains we go you know we're told Mount Everest is 29,200 feet we're told the basins of the Pacific Ocean are 36,000 feet that's approximately 13 miles difference top to bottom so so so we we do have topography and and and that's just fine now what does this person who um who gave you the super chat believe it is well I was gonna say Dr. Dino if you want to fire another one in the old super chats there I'll read it out yeah let's continue on I believe they have a geology degree so I wouldn't I wouldn't take that on if I were you well but you see that that might let's make it another debate yeah different debate for a different day let's continue on with the super chats uh could be got more relevant super chats that are for everybody uh but you know thanks Jim for answering that question and thanks uh everybody for your super chats Tim Pryor five dollars no field of science or any scientist agrees with flat earthers they should not be allowed to talk about science thoughts for Tim uh we'll hit it over to you flat so aid since we just ended off on Jim ever heard of the word bigotry science doesn't care what a person's beliefs are that's so it doesn't care if they do not agree with us however science does disagree with their pseudoscience so all right thoughts Jim on their borderline assault on yeah there I I had mentioned a few minutes ago that since 1958 the globe side has gotten approximately eight to ten trillion dollars with 12 zeros behind it uh you know in in uh entertainment education uh space agencies and and seriously you know there's this little there's this little saying out there that 97 percent of scientists agree with those who pay them and I even asked somebody who was a who graduated from uh an ivy league just a few months ago in january and I asked him that question I said hey 97 percent of scientists agree with those who pay him I said what do you feel about that and he thought about it for a second he said it's probably 75 cool man all right well um that question is for the globe side so nick for 10 dollars I'm not a flat earther but it's clear they didn't account for controls in behind the curve it's not reasonable to say that test proved flat earth wrong do you really think it did we'll hand it over to you ember first we haven't heard from you in a little bit sure um well I mean it was geronisms test I'm not responsible for his methodology if you disagree with it feel free to construct your own experiment with better controls but I will say that uh certain critics of the flat earth model elsewhere here on youtube did do the math to figure out where geronism went wrong feel free to go searching for those if you really want me personally I'd suggest if you don't like the test do a better one yourself the globe side obsession with maps and models is always astonishing to me to this day and I haven't been doing this a long time but when you guys invoke maps and models I just have to smile okay so um yeah I'll just add something to that so don't you think we should model the human body to understand how it works don't you think we should model neurology don't you think we should model how cars crash to see if they're safe do you think we should just throw all of that see this is the thing this is the thing they don't actually believe in science and that's the projection they're okay so yeah I appreciate your your question mark uh we can actually observe experience see test the human body we can actually do that with cars and vehicles we can look at that and go we can touch it we can test it and we can do those things you can't do that with your spinning space ball in the vacuum of outer space so I appreciate your question but again maps and models just make me laugh I experience I observe and I test a stationary plane I do not see a spinning space ball in the vacuum of outer space perfect well so we this is a great time we can actually see cell development or anything like that we have to model it with instruments which is exactly the same thing it's just special cleaning basically all right well thanks for wrapping that up there quickly uh dead isle for another uh one-year-old no question attached there dead isle if you or idle sorry if you had a question why don't you fire fired into the live chat I'm gonna poke my head in there in a second I'm gonna read this question out and the reason I said perfect is because this is for you flatzoid uh so Esteban uh you back sorry I'm not going to say that correctly I can't hope that pressure is plus even in space the whole universe is the container for that an isolated system within it pressure exists as gradients do gravity or in pressurized systems simple right the difference is earth would be a open system inside that isolated system you call the universe it's like taking a balloon and sticking it in a vacuum chamber what happens when you pop that balloon there's no longer air in a balloon it's now surrounding the surrounding system that's what the same is if you take a box inside a vacuum chamber and you open that box the gas that was inside that in that box disperses into the surrounding system this is why we said violates the second or third dynamics and no gravity does not hold gas down indefinitely this has never been demonstrated and it will never be demonstrated while you show containment all right well let's try to continue on there that's right fellas uh dr dino strikes again for two dollars all right so we'll try to contain these questions for the sides that they're asked for for the remainder of the chat so sorry to everybody uh but you will get your questions answered by the side that you want but we'll try to cap the open discussion a little bit because we're getting into the three hour point and i'm going to stop dilly dallying dr dino strikes again are humans apes and how old is the earth that's for uh jim and flatsoid so you first jim are humans apes yes or no i would i would i was about right i was thinking about some questions i was going to ask you know mark and emmer tonight one is are we descendants of apes or descendants from amoebas or descendants from big bang and i wasn't going to ask them that we never got around to it so now flatso and i are being asked that i'm finding pretty interesting hey and no we aren't descendants of apes that there are those of us who believe in a young earth uh and and we believe in the creation story uh you know both sides have a creation story your creation story is big bang 13.7 or 14.5 billion years ago and that a massive photon can travel on the blue shift and red shift and all that stuff and you deny the inverse square law of light second law of thermodynamics and just to inject your jim i'm sorry to cut you off and how old do you think the earth is just for a super chatter here that was the in a in a personal opinion only okay i go with what the bible says what which which if you take it back generationally in the bible this is my personal opinion only um somewhere around 6000 years all right over to you flatsoid our humans apes definitely not do i look like an ape and how old is the earth uh wow how is the earth i'm the same i'm a biblical flat earth so i'm also going to rather stick to god's word obviously we can't uh validate how old it is but based on my personal preference i'd say around about 6000 yeah all right um well i i i mean for for entertainment's sake we can keep it quick uh ember our humans apes absolutely and how old is the earth ember and uh as far as your concern during your opinion um uh not geology is not my specialty but i believe the estimate is somewhere around four and a half billion all right and over to you mark our humans apes yes and how we have made all the criteria for apes and how there is no criteria that i just don't have to believe how old is the earth uh for yeah i think it's 4.2 4.3 i might be right might be four and a half billion but yes that is that is the correct answer hey i just want to tell my friend flatsoid it may be a bridge too far flatsoid well just for entertainment's sake i figured i would ask the question to continue the conversation here uh so uh beamsy for ten dollars for the flat side as a geologist uh using p and s waves we can draw an exact image of the earth and it comes back as a spheroid we get this same results from sonar and radar not a planar surface why is this well when they use p and s waves to try and go to see what's below the earth's surface 78 of the time they were wrong so i don't know what the hell he's talking about no one's been deeper than eight miles before no p waves and s waves they're seismic waves that i know what p's and s waves are but i'm telling you they were wrong on their predictions almost 80 percent of the time that doesn't matter it's gonna come back as a flatter it does matter on that it no it shows that a circular reasoning again begging the question and affirming the consequence doesn't answer the question and ignoring the data all right well let's continue if if if something's wrong like if we are wrong on medicine at one point does that mean all medicine is wrong false equivalence less no it's exactly the same analogy you're saying that because i got one thing wrong no no you're saying because they got something wrong then all their prediction all of their data that they find is wrong but you won't have the same intellectual standard for other things like just because medicine gets things wrong which we certainly have done in the past doesn't mean everything they have done is wrong this is a this is a all-sequivalence again p and s waves it's called a direct analogy no it's a full equivalence a they're using p and s waves to specifically make prediction of what's below in the ground correct they use the seismic waves and then find it to be medicine to predict what causes disease correct again a false equivalence you don't use medicine just you're saying that doesn't make it so how is it a false you don't use medicine to predict what causes the disease by the way you take the disease and you try and backtrack it to try and uh wow sort out the disease that's how it works let's try to let's try to continue on with our conversation here uh yeah keep the super chats coming in and uh i just want to say this is probably my favorite debate for completely external reasons one i got a kiss and two my wife made me this awesome grilled cheese which i won't eat here on stream oh wow what damn it ryan now i'm now now i'm hungry yeah i know you wouldn't like me when i'm hungry come on like me when i'm hungry instantly mark turns into a big green mean green rage monster hunger monster absolutely flat earth uh fridays uh this is a hashtag from sacred for five dollars so hashtag flat earth fridays at 100 crypto keys globe demonstrate standing at 18 feet and lifting a hole to 23 feet your arms as claimed by netflix behind the curve uh he just elevated himself so he was if i understand the question correctly the the person in the experiment was standing on a an 18 foot elevation above sea level and then raised his arms to 23 feet that's that's a five foot reach if my math isn't if i can do 23 minus 18 yeah so yeah arms move he could have he could have stood on a box as well so that's not really yeah yeah all right you guys want to continue on there i think that's all right just have to say i'm sorry go ahead just have to say my power might go off any minute like i said i'm surprised it's the long i'm sorry i was i was responding to somebody who said my sandwich looked burnt and i was just let them know that i i i've been with this lady for what 12 years now she knows how i like my sandwiches all right yellow banana five euros jim faith is believing something without evidence when you do science all right sorry faith is believing something without evidence when you do scientific tests and get objective evidence it's not faith anymore just for your information for you it's a it's a it's a it's an awesome question obviously you get down to what you observe about the human body unfortunately we can't talk about virology and that's cool and but but you you come back to biblical i know i know ember and mark are going to disagree with this but you come back to biblical cosmology it talks about foundations pillars ends of the earth um four corners um uh footstools uh Jesus said in jen in matthew 535 that the earth is god's footstool says that nasa is 66 one so so you know so i look at that and i look at what i observe what i test what i what i see and it agrees so again that's my personal belief i know ember and mark won't go with that but that's you want to say that the earth is footstool shaped uh when when when when the bible talks about a footstool a footstool is not a ball mark a footstool if you look at it it's got legs does the earth have legs it has it has foundations and pillars now what it actually is comprised of i leave that up to god that's why one of my hats that i that i wear says under the heavens because therefore i don't have to worry about what's you know what's underneath me i leave it up to god i know you guys are atheists fine and i leave i leave it up to god to determine what's underneath me yeah good one uh yeah faith is believing in things that i've not seen that's faith so when you do have evidence even science it doesn't make it not faith after you've got the evidence because even based on the evidence it can still change later on that's why they like to say science is progressive so so in a uh theological uh sense even with a scientific uh validation even though it's validated you still have faith that that's actually true so it's still uh on a theological it's still faith based because it's evidence not seen let's try to continue on from there uh so thank you so much for your super chat there yellow banana tim prier strikes again five dollars eight inches per mile square came from a flat earth third ding dong we don't claim that that's straw man oh so 1.22 times the square root of the about observer's height in feet doesn't come up to eight inches per square mile congratulations so no globe uh no it's actually a function of cause it's like a radius times um the distance uh height times one minus cos a i think it is they being the angle yeah 1.22 times the height square root of the height observer's height in feet no no no no no yes so you're claiming you don't have drop them no constant I never said that I said the obscured point of course it has dropped that's what just what I've said I said you're doing the calculation wrong that's your math not mine I'm just reading your math to you uh no you're not that came from a flat earth as the chat said that that's a question that you're talking about came from a flat earth yes 1.22 times the square root of the because you're not even from Samuel robot them yes because because where does the height come into that equation that you just gave where's the height because the height determines your tangents but you just said over a distance it drops but the height will will stop that drop right so so where is height in your equation times the height do you know what times height means observers height in feet you literally throwing your globe math away yeah mates so you're claiming there's no curve then yeah no it's just that drop thing did no chat's right chat's a hundred percent right I don't know why they're just not prepared to you know sort of look up the real equation yeah and Walter business not a flat earth there all the business uh earth calculator uses this all right well let's continue on uh from there uh yeah Hannah there's no debate going on tomorrow every message to Christian anarchist sorry about that uh if I didn't get back to you in the discord there uh thanks Hannah for being here by the way and moderating in the chat uh and you as well uh and the theme uh or surgeon general uh so yeah join us on our discord for modern day debate uh you know we got all kinds of ways that you could exercise your chops and maybe we'll see you here uh you know every once in a while like the other day we had somebody message and say hey I can't make it for the debate tonight and I pulled somebody out of the discord who was ready to go and I think we had a great time uh that was uh last week uh on the flat earth with witsit so uh you know join us on modern day debate discord and uh let's continue on here cool Lambo ten dollars pack it up boys the flat earthers believe in talking snakes uh I think they're and donkeys I think they're saying the actually it's false it was a it wasn't a snake he his snake comes from the serpent it was a serpent or a snake to be what's the difference what's the difference the serpent had legs the snake has no legs oh it was cursed to walk after Roman its belly that's why it became a snake yeah can we can we agree to this that we all both have creation stories we both have beliefs we flat so flat so tonight you know you know toast about our belief system your belief system is that you you came from apes which means you came from amoeba which means you came from a big bang you know 13.7 to 14.5 billion years ago and so you know I you know we all have a belief system I tend to not ridicule yours but I'm sorry I probably have but you know so I I kind of appreciate you know we can have a little bit of fun back and forth but you guys have a creation story we do you guys have a belief system and so do we as I so as I told you flat so it is probably a bridge too far but we'll go from there okay so here's the thing um and I want to I want to really point 15 seconds if you can yeah yeah sure okay so there's no creation story because the big bang only explains rapid expansion of the universe it doesn't actually explain where it comes from and that's a mistake that bees make all the time and I just want to point out that you have an equal like you're you're not using intellectual consistency because all of this stuff that you've just said on the creation story you can't look at the earth and find that out that is a belief system based upon nothing which we said you didn't do you just look at the earth so we see too far mark mark we see too far to live on a spinning space ball of 3959 miles times two diameter times pi 24901 miles and if you do the math you do geometry it's 80 it's 80 per mile squared take it or leave it just to confirm I'm I'll just ask it as a yes or no just because I think that's what cool Lambo is asking is if you guys believe in the story of Adam and Eve uh so Jim do you believe in the story of Adam and Eve flat flat so I do already do yes uh Jim do you believe in the story of Adam and Eve I think is what is the real crux of their conversation here or they're a super chat yes I do okay all right well let's continue on mr monster uh five dollars the Antarctic as a circular current the largest ocean current on the planet proves the earth as a globe it can't exist on a flat model discuss I don't know about this current so I can't just a question again so they're saying the Antarctic circular current the largest ocean current on the planet proves the earth as a globe it can't exist on a model why we have gyres that all works with the thermohelion uh currents that's how the waters move and have their streams just because they're claiming it that it only goes that way it doesn't make it a globe it's just circular reasoning again well in a lot of ways it's begging the question you know I want to be a globe therefore it's a globe so say circular reasoning yeah all right well let's continue on there and I see uh good show modern day debate from secret asian man uh yes thank you and uh just one reminder to everybody hit the like button uh no need to be secret about that let us know if you like this let's continue on uh to do scrolling up through the old super chat Ivan Chaykovsky five dollars jim please explain why gravity isn't real provide citations and show your work oh uh you can uh gravity has never been shown um 9.81 meters per second squared is agreed upon average of white things go I like to use the word boom boom to the ground follow the ground you can easily explain it using electrostatics you can measure electrostatics there's a field meter for it and whether whether Feynman's idea of 100 volts per meter as you and have two Gaussian surfaces is actually the real you know the real thing I'm still up in the air on that but you can easily explain why things follow the ground using electrostatics and and also using density and buoyancy to fill in the the gaps the problem with with problem with gravity is it's never been shown to exist uh Newton had had this you know this apple fall on his head in 1666 Newton never wrote about that experience and so uh you know gravity is a very see gravity holds the globe together and if you give up gravity you give up the globe so so you know we have the alternative everything is electrostatics why does millions and billions of of uh uh water molecules called clouds stay up in the sky don't come down uh there's got you know there's there's questions that we don't have answers for I'm fine with that but gravity has never been proven to exist the effect things do follow the ground 9.81 meters per second squared but the cause is not gravity has never been proved that way all right let's continue on there since that was for you Tim Pryor five dollars seriously until science agrees with you stop talking about it a reason 50 50 why we laugh who's this fool I'm not sure Tim Pryor I don't think it says well yeah he's got another one right after that so Tim Pryor five dollars fine don't google it just learn it off youtube it makes you very very smart or just one very sorry I might have made him sassier than I meant to oh I think I'd have plenty of sass to begin with well I'm sorry Tim Pryor yeah we'll continue on I think he's sort of saying um I think he's sort of saying stop sort of saying speaking for science when you're not agreeing with what the science is actually like the scientists say and and the the institution scientific institutions are saying I would I would certainly agree with them well Tim Tim Pryor yeah he has got another one after here so I mean a total of twenty dollars here uh for your super chats all here in a little sector so we really appreciate it Tim Pryor it helps out a lot uh ten dollars so hypocritical you say observations aren't good enough but you believe in flat earth only of observations without scrutinizing it as much as you do to the globe any thoughts on that we'll hand it over to you flatzoid that's false we say observational and then you demonstrate what you observe that's the difference they don't have any demonstrations for the globe they just claim it to be science and then when asked okay show me the science there is none in fact there's no scientific hypothesis and experiment for gravity Newton never wrote the scientific hypothesis he's gravity thing came out after he died actually so no it's definitely not scientific that's why we are very scrutinized very much even in our flat earth communities we scrutinize each other based on things I mean like Jim he he ascribes to the uh electrostatics I don't I'm a relative density disequilibrium kind of guy okay we have difference in opinions on how things work we have different mechanisms our books the only difference is we actually go out and do demonstrations on this with a globe no scale it's too big how are we going to demonstrate this we just have faith science says so we'll give you a chance to respond to that ember because we get this next question for you from nominal for five dollars ember please upload your footage of the face of the moon during the eclipse I would love to check it out me too yeah I'll see if I can find it all right and did you have any thoughts on what flat so I had just said or do you want to continue on we may as well just continue on I mean the fact that the the the two models don't agree that kind of that says enough right there there you go with the models again man all right well we got more super chats coming in you know we're cool with that we want to keep the conversation going then keep asking questions and we'll keep trying to flush out the the ideas here this is coming in from his minister of fire 499 oh I just lost it there 499 that fish eye argument from the globe supporters was indestructible thoughts on that we'll hand it over to you Jim they add again to me are we saying that the curve is is absolutely a matter of fact is that what I'm picking up it says that fish eye argument from the globe supporters was indestructible so they're in support of what ember and mark were saying about the fish eye oh well yeah I don't know what to say to that I mean you know bum garter in 2012 went up with a fish eye and and and came down and you know over planet new Mexico and came down and said you know hey you know you know it was the curve was beautiful blah blah blah blah and then mr mr astrophysics himself you know came out and said it 24 at 127,854 feet which would bum garter jumped at that that stuff was flat up there you know so that's all I can really say thanks Ryan yeah there's no problem and flat so I don't any thoughts on that the fish eye argument tell me how fish eye works if you're looking in two different directions sure um well um since they're kind of giving a huzz off for the other side um was that something you brought up mark what's that so no the fish eye um it was actually ember brought that up sorry about that ember if you want to reiterate for flat so it and then we'll let flat I already know yeah it's about the selenium that's why saying it's because of the wide angle that we're able to see it because of refraction I'm saying you're looking two different two different directions so that's yes really yeah it's because it's because the way that the atmosphere works as a fish eye lens is what ember said so basically if you imagine the lens as being the entire way over the earth as far as your optical um site can allow then yeah you're looking at one edge and then the other edge there's no problem with that whatsoever are you looking inside the lens or on top of the lens you're looking from one side of the lens to the other side of the lens on an angle and that's what fish eye does when you look at it um on that angle um that's exactly what okay have you been to any I just want to say have you if you've been on an aquarium before and that's that don't shape the aquarium what happens when you go to the other side of that so-called don't question and you look well you're not you're not moving in this case can you see why would you no no no no no hold on let me finish let me let me all right all right over the mark for 15 um yeah yeah so so you're basically saying well if you move around then you change where the fish eye is in relation to you because the atmosphere goes all around the earth so in that example that we gave you about the cell and ellen eclipse you're not moving I don't know why you would apply something moving to the the subject when it's not moving I'm trying to show you it's a false I'm trying to show you it's a false no no it's a straw man it's just a straw man no all right you don't have a flat toy do you have any thoughts on this for the next 15 seconds or do you want to continue uh quickly yeah uh like I was trying to point out if you're looking left in a large lens and looking right in a large lens you're not going to see the the relationships you're claiming we don't live inside a lens as you put it all right let's continue on electric monk back to you Jim two euros how do you test for a creator Jim I think I think I already I think I already said the the you know the fact that the bible talks about you know those those things that I said immovable immovable pillars foundations and things like that and I could actually go out and test the earth I think the biggest thing that I've learned is that we can test the earth we can test it we can we can observe it and we can experience it we can't test the sky so somebody who says this guy proves the ground you know you know go ahead and go with that but I can test the ground that way I can test what the bible says and then I and they come to an agreement just ontological primitives that's all uh we have uh yeah you got we have a complement oh sorry if you want to yeah if you want to expand on that if you want like 10 to 15 seconds yeah it's just it's just based on the ontological primitives when you walk past let's say a beach and you see a beautiful both perfect sandcastle did nature create it or did someone create it that's ontological primitives based on observation everything's created yeah so this is this is sort of again they project they just you know have a presupposition that they're putting into effect yeah yeah it's just watchmaker we can just move along yeah as you do and as you do mark so the creation proves the creator show me a sandcastle that creates itself out of nature please go ahead um it's not a sandcastle that's our ontological primitives are the creator or not pre-sup it's just pre-supposition fault the induction and then hopefully hopefully hopefully hold on now before we get too off track we have a complement and then hopefully we can get back into the subject just uh bear with me here run boston bear for 999 says jim and fladsoy great job tonight guys you brought a lot of good points and i enjoyed your overall approach to sharing the truth of our stationary topographical plane people are getting it uh so thanks for the compliment there uh you know for our speakers tonight you know they're here on their own time and uh you know like i said we don't want to read too many uh mud slinging arguments uh we want nice cities while we're trying to work through these uh what can sometimes be contentious issues over here at modern day debate you never know nostalgist nostalgic aberoth 499 i didn't come from no monkey i came from biblical incest and 6 000 years of incest oh boy well i read that up loud that's on the internet forever now it's you really should read these before reading about it's it's too late it's too late it's already happened you know what we're three hours in i'm sure no one's gonna care samuel can i just can i just say something quickly maybe flex or do you want to have a debate on who do you want to really we can sometimes it would be great yeah yeah we'll have a debate on the existence of god i'd love to do it yeah and and ryan i just want to say thank i just want to say thank you to to run boston bear to jt he's a he's a he's an awesome human being well you hear that you're you know what you're a fan of our speakers tonight run boston bear they're a fan of you so uh everybody's having a good time we're a big barrel of love let's continue on from there and don't make me say anything else that's too wild on the air everybody all right five dollars canadian from samuel sum 103 12 as i don't know if i'm doing that right far as the east is from the west so far has he removed our transgressions from us yeah so i think that's just a bible verse there's a scripture yeah from there if there's not really any commentary on that well if you want to take it on if you want to take it on globe you could say how do you have as far as east is from the west on a globe this is no bounds all right it's just a just a mythological story like there's no reason to think that that this is actually true unless of course you are presupposing that it's true up front and assuming that it's true to begin with which is why we see all of this you know in a venn diagram the crossover between flat earth and young earth creation it's it's almost one to one because um um you know you have to start with these kind of biblical presuppositions in order to get you through the flat earth and that's exactly what these guys are doing as as you do mark with your atheism and your and your ball i'll say all right nostalgic aberroth 499 says in capital letters i didn't come from no monkey i came from biblical you said it again we're already feeling this time what i thought but exactly in capital letters like i'm not i'm not reading your little oh no okay well we appreciate you nostalgic aberroth you're trying you're trying to get us demonetized and well this comment this comment alone has a whole debate on itself but yeah not something made for the yes uh you know what you seem very very passionate about this subject for like i don't know if you grew up on a mountain or something but you know come over to modern day debate maybe you should talk about it um anyways uh samuel ten dollars canadian uh i think we got more scripture here globe jude one nine about michael the archangel when he disputed with the devil and argued about the body of moses did not dare pronounce should i do this with like a super preacher voice michael the archangel when he disputed with the devil argued about the body of moses did not pronounce against him the railing judgment but said the lord rebuke you you did a good job yeah that was pretty cool yeah thank you i thought so um um yeah but but what what i want to ask is where was the control variable in there yeah i would help if they said anything about size by the one side really let's continue really never thought it i i i i was thinking there wouldn't be too much commentary on just a scriptural quote so i thought we just have fun with it since every once in a while i just get money from people do impressions all right i've been chikosky five dollars gem i said show your work gish galloping isn't showing your work i can't i other than the fact that that the bible talks about a immovable foundations pillars four corners ends of the earth footstool and then i actually go out and i observe it and i test it that's what i do now you know do i show my work i do have uh two weeks ago i was on a practice football field in chester in indiana with my p1000 when i walked approximately 60 70 yards and and i got smaller uh and even though i'm kind of overweight i did get smaller and and i disappeared bottom up and when the football fields open up here for practice in about two weeks i'll do it not on 70 yards but on 120 uh and i'll do that as well so yeah i i've gone out and tested it already um so i don't know what else to tell you on your work all right well thank you so much everybody for your super chats we're gonna continue on we've only got a few more to go so if you got any questions get them in now otherwise we're gonna close out in the next few minutes here cool lambo for 9 11 oh buggers all right flatsoy and jim what caused the two towers to fall oh sorry what caused the two towers to fall that i don't think we're allowed to say on yeah but we'll just say i think i think that's probably a danger just avoid this in general cool lambo you know what that that was tricky all right let's uh samuel for five dollars canadian no more super chats like that because i yeah that's silly uh it takes the most a magnificent carpenter to make a flat plane any dung beetle can roll up a ball witsett gets it chat years ago this is a quote i think from witsett is it okay it takes the most significant carpenter to make a flat plane any dung beetle can roll up a ball i think this is to us i'm i'm pretty sure that yes a little add it seems like an ad hominy type quote uh you know basically saying maybe but you know like i think that that jesus learnt his carpentry after the earth was around even in the bible so i'm not sure how carpentry plays into that one um weird though well done strange um yeah those are our words all right yeah in a certain order they have the abc's in them excellent all right uh i was gonna say i i just see in the the live chat somebody said that i am super amateur i'm sorry uh idea of this um some of that might be a little bit on purpose i i might be reading these preemptively but i just i just think there's enough of a funny flair uh in in some of these super chats um that they're worth reading out if we can just spin them the right way we might not get demonetized tim prior five dollars multi a billion dollar industries depends on gravity existing try again i think that's for you fellows on on a flatsoy myself ember oh okay no sorry mark and ember sorry i was i was looking down but i mean i don't know where you see me yeah multi billion dollar industries some of them do depend on gravity existing so if gravity didn't exist they'd be out of business mm no cavendish experiment was done to prove gravity like it's no no um the where was the down on mark mark where was the down and cavendish it was no down it was two masses like you're misunderstanding how it works and cavendish sorry cavendish was not an experiment first of all at second or i'm just finished if i can just finish like we sort of gave you the time to respond to your questions you're just jumping it over the top of me so basically it shows like incredibly heavy weights next to one another and showed them move towards one another and the torsion away got less and less and less as time went on until they basically um attracted to one another and the cavendish experiment absolutely proves that it's just anybody that says it doesn't doesn't know how the cavendish experiment works because if you're looking for down it's not trying to show that it all everything goes down it shows that masses attract to one another and that's all okay okay quick history lesson it wasn't to measure gravity yeah so i don't know why i don't know why we're sort of going on from from your questions without us responding but you guys are just jumping it at the end i just had to correct you because you get people that don't know this it's not there to measure gravity so it didn't prove gravity it was there to calculate the density of the earth based on torque mechanics so we see torsion twist which is based on torque because of the density of the balls how do you calculate density what's the formula for it we've been through this already yeah what's the formula for it we've been through this already mass what's the form yeah what's mass and what's mass more greed what's mass yeah mass is the so so so to the weight of something is definitely related to mass and not density right what is mass the weight of something is definitely related to you ask me a question i gave you the answer i'm asking you a question yeah well you've been dodging questions all masses the you don't know what masses no it's the combined total particles within something that makes up something they combine neutrons electrons so substance that makes up a physical thing so saying yeah so how do you how do you calculate the weight of something is a density yes it's the pressure applied a pressure applied by the density does the weight change with density or does it change with mass amount the mass the mass yes so the more density changes with mass weight it has excuse me i'm talking so the more more mass it has the more weight it has correct resistance to inertia resistance to inertia how do you calculate that that's what masses according to the definition resistance to inertia you don't know this you have two different definitions for the same word so how do you calculate weight then what's your calculation for weight we're supposed to be measuring weight not calculating it that's how we put it on a scale and it's the pressure which is forced on the load cell because the density of the weight the density of the weight is what causes the density is what causes weight is it show me something without density show me something without density yeah it's called a called a vacuum a vacuum i don't see how density could work without gravity to make things different i know it's called low and low pressure that's what creates a vacuum you know when you use your oh pressure causes the vacuum now when you use your vacuum it creates a low pressure system inside that do you give me the equation which makes which makes the air force itself from the surrounding system into that low pressure system could you give me the equation could you give me your equation for weight please no don't need why not no you do give me the equation for weight give me the weight because the reason i don't give the equation for weight the reason i don't give the equation for weight is because you guys love to uh straw man it and say oh you need gravity which is false you just said that the vacuum can't do without gravity that's why you don't give it out a vacuum of gravity in it is density is density in the equation for weight yes okay so what is the equation for weight then don't need to give it no what is it then i'm not going to get strong and you guys have literally just said no you said density was in it what's the equation with density in it what's the equation with density in it so we so what we do is we get these equations and we see if we can actually put them in experiments to see if they hold any weight or not to see if they hold any water or whether somebody is just talking nonsense and so you won't give it because you're trying to put density in an equation that doesn't inherently have density in it that's why because you basically know that and so you won't answer the question of what is the calculation what is the equation because you don't want to be shown to be wrong you're just basically prevaricating hat dancing away saying i'm not going to give it because i don't want to be tested like it's it's ludicrous no it gets triggered when i'm giving you the equation no you can't you haven't given us any answers at all the reason ignorant the reason i don't give an equation is because i keep getting straw man of this i've been getting this for years now again your own definition remember can i talk can i talk earlier earlier you literally told us what mass is it was the density of the substance in a given volume correct that's what you told us how much substance isn't crammed inside that volume okay no mess doesn't have anything to do with volume that's not what i said that is where you that's what you said did you know i said that density is the mass spread out across volume so what's missing because i asked what's mess and you said it's it is the total amount it is the total amount so if you have a lot of substance in a large area the density can be low but the mass is still i i don't even know why i have to explain this that the mass is still high do you understand what we say you know so without mass you go on a density so what's the equation for weight what's the equation for weight i'm not giving i'm not giving gravity i'll change g to pressure then for you we're going to move on to pressure hold on there flat so if you vary pressure we're going to move on all right if you guys can focus and that cut each other off we can continue i've got no problem with that um but like i said i don't want to have to put you guys on view we've already we've gone for three hours and you guys behaved yourselves actually more than that so uh if you want to expound on that point let's do for two minutes there um between the two of you so mark and flat so aid let's flush it out okay so let's change this change the pressure yeah what's the equation with pressure let's just change g to pressure then pressure pressure of the object forcing itself the object has impulse so therefore object is this another stool does stool have pressure you know what impulse is uh mock no i i don't i want to get back to how solid objects have pressure how is that how is that on a scale you think i object an object doesn't apply pressure on a scale is that what you're telling me no well that's weight that's what you're calculating yeah because of pressure so i'm changing your g to pressure but but that means the amount of g forces i'm just changing hold it hold it okay that's fine that's fine let me let me address that then let me address that then don't just continue on but so if you're changing g to pressure and weight to pressure that means the pressure which is weight equals the mass times the pressure which is what you're calculating no i'm saying your g is based on the force attributed on the scale correct so i'm simply saying but that's what we're calculating weight is the force on the scale this weight you measuring is the pressure from the object forcing itself on the scale because it's denser than the medium around it let's say we're calculating weight correct no you measure weight you don't calculate weight you measured you calculate density okay when measuring weight but the calculation to get weight from the mass right because we agree on the mass right we agree on the mass okay we agree on that part but you're saying to get weight we have to use the weight to get the weight no you have the density no that's exactly what you said again you couldn't even close this one then what's the pressure you couldn't define what mass was and when you did you defined it as the density i'm simply telling you when you measure a weight it's the object's density that is causing a pressure on the scale that's all the pressure on the scale or weight you have to put the pressure on the scale or the weight into that equation do you are lost weight is a unit talk about this equation weight is just a unit mate it's just a unit and it's the pressure on the scale right all right we're gonna we're we're gonna move on with our super chats here guys um yeah i was gonna give me the equation send it over to me give me the equation send the equation over uh so not so so nominal for five dollars i can't find a single video of the face of the moon seen during a solar eclipse using the google's ember you could be famous boy if i had a nickel for every time somebody said i could be famous for something so you're you're not gonna find it doing a video search because video is limited um i don't know how much you may know about exposure but you've got your um your iso your aperture and your um the duration the word for it eludes me at the moment on video you can't have a longer exposure than your frame rate so unless you're doing very very slow video it's just not gonna happen you need a long exposure still photo that's it all righty let's try to continue on there because we do have quite a few more super chats coming in and you know what our live chat is just refusing to let us go because they keep popping little super chats in there to try to prop more discussion i see what you guys are doing and we appreciate it so much uh so um samuel for two dollars says thank you all keep researching the flat earth uh so samuel we're not sure what side you're on but thanks for your super chat nominal for five dollars oh i just read that one duncan right for five dollars if we live in a simulation or a holographic universe i can see earth being flat you don't fall over the edge you just repeat the simulation oh like a pacman model that'd actually be kind of cool well i mean simulation it could be absolutely anything i mean there's yeah simulation theory sort of makes it yeah sure i don't have too much to dig into their i'm in sure yeah i guess um and you know it's kind of in the yeah i'd like a power up hill that would be cool yeah yeah that's right uh bear's worth i think they have that it's called it's called viagra anyways no i'm sorry uh bear's worth they make a bow over that that's right mark why is the full moon a uniform light and does not have a brighter spot like all experiments with light on balls and your head thanks yeah it's because of the the diffusion of the light and the the the um earth surface is actually a sort of force dust it's the way that that it has but we do see shadows on it like on the actual moon if you zoom in with a telescope you can see all of the the shadows on the moon like where the the dips and craters are kind of thing you can see that with a telescope it's not not that hard or a p1 reason why yeah the reason why it's full moon is because when the light shines on it it actually like light doesn't just shine on one small section of it actually shines on quite a large area and the light diffuses around an object it's why you still have light after the sun has set because if you notice the sun sets and you've still got light around it it's that light basically hitting the atmosphere and the the particles in the air and and still being reflected kind of thing so you will still be able to see from light so it actually I did a video on that that the other day 99% of the world's population got some form of light during one day which is just incredible at the same time on the one day yeah at the same time yeah it was it was a really interesting thing but yes it did occur just because of the angle of the sun the angle of the earth where it hit the earth and where population centers are on the it was really interesting but it's also because light doesn't just go to one small bit on a sphere it actually goes round it kind of thing and illuminates the edges as well so yeah that that's essentially why hey if I if I can add to that a little bit go ahead go ahead all right another factor is the extreme distance from the light source because the moon being in orbit of earth is also roughly 93 million miles away if you try something even low scale like a basketball and one of those really powerful flashlights and you put the basketball 100 yards away and then shine the flashlight on it and go look at the basketball because of the distance the side closest to the light is not going to be significantly brighter than the sides it's even more extreme with the moon because the distance is just the difference between the edges and and the closest part it's virtually nothing on that scale hey and you probably do it I just I just heard some dad you can probably do it with it with a basketball or a round object like if you're on a moon do a white round object and use a flashlight you can probably light up where the person on the other sphere would probably see all of it you could you could certainly replicate it hey Ryan can I chime in for a sec do we have 30 seconds there okay I'll make it quick inverse square law of light if you if you have the distance you get four times the brightness so if we're 240,000 miles away from the moon in the fairy tale you go to 120 you go to 60 you go to 30 you go to 15 you go to 7,500 3750 1875 1000 when you get to 1000 miles away from the moon in the inverse square law of light the moon will be 65,000 times brighter than what we see terrestrially on the earth and then you could take Saturn the other way NASA tells us that that the Sun is a little pinprick on Saturn but we can see it real well up in the sky inverse square law of light in 30 seconds thank you all right so let's continue everybody got a lot of luminosity if we don't if we don't watch it there mark we'll we'll be back in the same campus last time we'll be right right here so because I was gonna say our live chat keeps pouring in the questions here and the conversation is flowing so run Boston bear for 499 we have another compliment so they say market ember uh so many compliments here tonight like it's almost like oh I almost lost it there there we go market ember thanks for sharing what you believe to be true ball earth and no creator cool story bro let's continue on I need that I think the creation story is that what's another bro lever for a start but I think the creation story is a cool story bro it is literally a story um there's no way you can test it there's no way you can see it it's just you know if the people do as they claim and they just see what's beneath their feet then why believe in a creator there's no evidence for it there's no you know why should evidence that we came from nothing let's save that yeah I don't believe that so congratulations for the next time everybody because it's more super chat to pour an in my goodness Justin five dollars flat so you mentioned a load cell how does a load cell work and how does a load cell measure weight that's for you flat so simple we appreciate the super chat there Justin the weight of the pressure being forced on the load cell which gives a unit to the motor the accelerometer what's a load cell all right it's like a little in very uh rudimentary terms it's like I almost like a little bad kind of thing almost like uh almost an accelerator pad you could say and it picks up the balance of pressure applied to it all right let's try to continue on uh Tim Pryor uh strikes again I think that's what your fifth strike this time five dollars I'll just make flat earth disappear by logging off social media that should tell them everything I don't know if that's what we can respond to let's continue do do do I read cognitive dissonance there's a lot of pain for him all right Sydney Raptor for two dollars flats on a scale of one to seventeen never mind Sydney how dense are you they ask Sydney you know you just threw away two dollars how dense are you I'm a density I'm a density of 75 kilograms how's that Samuel five dollars Canadian not sure you did that calculation right chief asteroids Sydney we do appreciate your super chat I hope that made you laugh uh Samuel for five dollars flat please explain uh asteroids and meteorites they move across the sky wow they do come from a place that they claim to exist that violates a second or thermodynamics that we still haven't got demonstration for but uh that's about all we know we we get to the fact that asteroids are a creation of imagination astrophysics astronomy it's a creation and again I will say again is we don't look to this guy to prove the the ground we walk on if you want to look to the celestial to prove the terrestrial have at it good so like like the truth like celestial Bible and stuff you know yeah kind of like looking to heaven to prove the earth there yeah um so do you think that um that the meteorites are like people that see them in Siberia and things like that people have seen meteorites coming down and then you know you have the the metallic what do you think they're all lying to you is that what you're saying are you saying meteorites actually hit the ground yes I mean you can visit the Behringer crater meteor crater Arizona you can go see that are you talking about the one outside of phoenix outside of Tucson meteor crater no I'm talking about the one ones that came down in my state as a specific example yes the Behringer crater yeah the the one the one off the interstate oh you're talking to amber okay yeah the one off the interstate 10 by Tucson I guess it's interstate 10 I might be around there somewhere I might be wrong there's no evidence that that's a meteor down there uh none whatsoever that is more volcanic than meteor and so I went there I've been there a couple times you know what my friend ember um I believe it was a meteor too because I went into the you know to the you know the you know the guest uh you know area and they told me it was a meteor but yeah they got a nice museum yeah and they do and they do and the petrified forest is real nice there too and and so um um but there's no evidence that's a meteor whatsoever they called it meteor crater because we want to have our little fairy tale called outer space exactly all yours yeah it doesn't explain why these rocks have such a high level of urethane all right let's try to move on from there guys um but yeah sorry I don't want to cut off the chat here just so we got more super chats pouring in and uh there's a risk like I said that this could go on for a long time if we don't try to rain it in a little bit estaban albaca 5000 clp flatzoid pressure is forced over area weight is just a force dependent on mass not its volume therefore unrelated to density once you learn the difference your cause goes a you know you kept it there but I mean if you know no no I won't keep it going I won't keep it going sorry yeah yeah that's not even a fine mess uh you know I'm sure one of these god like seriously I I be generous and not keep it going and then you just stick your foot in it yeah um for me so I had the closing statement mark that's how it works but my closing statement is you guys can't even you're fine mess come on let's let's move on with shall we well yeah yeah well we've almost launched into a whole mother thing everybody and a couple times right I think these fellas might want to talk about uh christianity sometime and uh maybe just religion so that could be a lot of fun uh you know I don't know how ember's feeling about that sort of topic but you know we've had fun tonight uh thanks uh flatzoid jim ember and mark we are almost to the end of our super chats so after flirts uh so sorry flat earthers if you found absolute proof and accepted that the earth is a sphere would you still be christian by the way the bible does not support flat earth so we'll try to answer this in short format if we can fellas uh first you jim uh if you found proof that the earth was a sphere would you still be a christian if is the big word uh if is the big word if if I was 35 and lifted weights I'd be Arnold Schwarzenegger uh 2.0 and so so if is the big word and and the bible does definitely talk about stationary and movable the the bible is very specific that we don't live on a spinning space ball so it's it's an if question I don't like if questions I'm going to give it to flatzoid yeah no I'm 100 percent of them because uh we already know based on god's word it's not a sphere so if if like he said it goes to okay it's not shown to be a sphere I would have to say no I can't because then that means god's word would be would be contradictory because the bible does teach a flat earth uh but yeah that's a huge if well you've been doing if questions all night if the earth was round this would happen if there's you only like if questions when they do apply to something you don't like these questions actually intellectually disingenuous because when you say gifts about things you want to believe you don't like them okay then where's your where's your demonstrations where's your demonstrations for anything we've asked for tonight I haven't seen one demonstration for all these claims you've made we've brought them up again and again and again like actually entire debate right now is that a demonstration yeah wait you know what maybe you don't understand what the word demonstrate means okay so yeah so flatzoid's just basically saying hey go through the entire debate again no I'm saying you just bring a demonstration that's all I'm saying just bring a demonstration yeah yeah yeah I've said multiple demonstrations like I brought up where the flight flight routes well what do you think I did is that is that gas pressure that yeah hey can I finish can I finish or you just want to walk over the top of me still like seriously just just wait on I brought up the circumpolar stars you had no answer for that whatsoever I brought up the crux the southern cross and how that that can work on and don't forget this is flat earth on trial was the debate don't forget that so you had you had an opportunity to give an answer that you didn't so I've been demonstrating how we know the earth is is round for quite some time it's just you haven't been paying attention okay then Mark this has we haven't got to that topic because you haven't been able to demonstrate gas pressure that containment you haven't been able to demonstrate that topic I'm not allowed to talk but you are wow so you haven't got you flatzoid 15 seconds flatzoid there will continue on okay first of all we didn't get to those subjects because we were busy trying to get you to demonstrate your claims you have not demonstrated it and yes so dishonest while I'm talking while I'm talking just hold on there please yeah so can you demonstrate for me just one of the things we brought up water cool curve you've measured any curve or that having gas pressure containment just one of them yeah okay so there we go okay so so this is the dishonesty of flatzoid like we basically have flat earth on trial I give a number of demonstrations he has every opportunity to address doesn't do so and then say hey because you didn't give me exactly what I was looking for in this this way that you can't provide because I've tweaked it so you can't provide it then I'm not going to answer any of your questions need I remind you it is flat earth on trial and these people haven't even mounted a defense which is ridiculous what a fail so no demonstration no let's go on that's the last word well done well done better let's continue on because we still got more super chats coming than everybody and I do feel like we've hopefully everybody feels like we've gotten a fair representation of both sides of this address here so yellow banana for five euros ignore if already addressed question for the flat earthers how do you explain gps and satellites in general we have onto this yeah it's just based on iss stay in orbit first of all you're making the question for orbit yes and yeah uh second or thirdly again it's all based on cortesian data systems which comes from a flat baseline again measuring and moving off of a data that comes from flats satellites satellites and space satellites and space ryan 99 of all communication is land-based towers cables and underground wires and you know underground wires in the in the water on the land so 99 percent is that way the satellites propagate the spinning space ball in the vacuum voucher space violates newton's third law of motion violates second law of thermodynamics and and you know I we went briefly over the inverse square law of light so if somebody wants to go iss is up there things are in the sky they just aren't what they say they are agreed all right thank you so much for that flatsoid and jim valerie st mary 499 it's truly adorable how all of a sudden mark is asserting fallacious reasoning guess wits it taught you something um we can kind of go on from there but valerie st mary you had your haza and uh mark did you have anything to say to them yeah so fallacious reasoning is just that it always it's irregardless sort of saying hey you brought up fallacious reasoning isn't isn't a refutation or you got it from wits no austin wits it usually uses it wrong like the reification fallacy constantly gets wrong and um things like that so no i didn't get it from wits that i got it from philosophy um but don't forget there's also the fallacy fallacy which means that just because you're making a fallacy doesn't necessarily mean that you're wrong however it means that your argument doesn't have a sound foundation um or a logical foundation depending on whether it is a formal or informal fallacy that you're referencing so no i didn't get it from wits which it wits it isn't the origins of fallacies i'm sorry you know i i know that i know that his followers like to think he's you know invented physics and stuff no no he hasn't thought anything of the source no seriously all right well thank you so much for and which it won't debate me anyway because he's he's really really scared so you know that that is so untrue mark but you but but you go ahead and live in your little really what's that is one of the lost people on a jacar away from a debate by the way yeah and even what i'm asking but i don't give it to i to i hey hey mark if mark if i do it right now we'll do it mark mark if i didn't know you were delusional i do now thank you well why would i say we'll do it we'll do it right now we'll do it right now wits it mark is challenging you to a debate on flat earth uh so you know we need some gunslinger music uh yeah come on yeah that's right i mean i would dual wits said uh mark is challenging gonna be no problem if he's such the amazing you know uh uh fearless person that you say is right there shouldn't be a problem right what would be the problem let's continue on with the superchats we don't want to drag other people in here too much but uh i know wits it is usually uh he's a good sport for that sort of stuff so uh estiband says jim i'm not saying anything about him i'm just saying the challenges there absolutely i'll let him know for sure um that you want to do that jim there's a meteorite museum in the chilean desert there's trackers that go find them after the uh the they are seen falling down how about that oh that's not worded very well i'm trying the best here fellas there's trackers that go find them after they are seen falling down how about that that's the mainstream narrative uh he can't prove it he read it off of google uh nasa um wikipedia and so you know if you know i got rid of my tv in february after having it for you know decades and so it's the best thing i ever did and i got rid of the mainstream narrative and i actually started thinking for myself and this is the reason why i'll be real brief uh the eyes are useless when the mind is blind we are all born into it into a prison system and participate in a prison system we cannot see that's the problem most times when we're in prison we know we're in prison but we're actually in a prison system that we cannot see but once we see once the veil is lifted there is no turning back the greatest gift we can give ourselves is the ability to think for ourselves and people like flatsoid and myself and those that know we don't live on a state of a spinning space ball in the back room of outer space have decided to throw off the chains and think for ourselves yeah i haven't been able to continue on since i was 18 so i don't know what your point is yeah well let's try not to expound too much um but yeah i i agree not not too much tv going on in my life i just used my computer and youtube and i enjoy that duncan right for ten dollars how do we really know the age of the universe if light bends around planet stars etc how do we know creation time isn't real haha just food for thought love you guys excuse me and i just love debate like you guys well duncan we love a lot of debate here so um you know i don't really have an answer for that um you know that's kind of an interesting hypothetical maybe we'll talk about that idea so uh the next time we have a conversation about creationism in the age of the universe but let's continue on here and thank you duncan uh for that uh but we do need to try to close this out joe brandon for five dollars how close is the sun to the earth if there is no outer space well that's all you want take that one um first of all we we don't know exactly if it's even physical but uh based on the belief of the bible it's in inside the dome do we know how high this dome is or whatever no we don't so i'm not really going to make claims on the height but um that's why we just say what we can we try to keep to the ground we can validate on the ground on the earth what we can but can we validate the height of the sun no we can't put it be outside the dome no inside how do you know if you don't know based on our belief based on our belief how do you know the dome won't just be further than the sun how do you check that that's what we're saying you can't an interesting question what if what uh our our noble opponents think of as the dome is what we think of as the edge of the universe what if they're the same thing and they're just really far away it's an interesting question ember but it's all speculation oh for sure and off topic yeah and i'd rather stay away from speculation i all i can say is i think we know the sun gives us heat and light and i think we can agree that it moves approximately 15 degrees across across the sky other than that i don't touch it yeah all right well let's try to continue on adjust in five dollars a small meteorite literally crashed through someone's house in suburban new jersey in may of this year like two months ago and it's well documented lots on the gym and flotzoid something fell from the sky and it wasn't a meteor and it's fine yeah just like we see satellites fall from the sky that have balloons attached to them and not attached all right last super chat last super chat and then everybody um let's go to bed right you know except for you mark because you're in osi and you probably don't want to go to bed right now do you but apparently i can't yeah that's the band i'll probably be going to bed off yeah off the body of my place going good to bed uh but i'd love to join you for an after party and uh chit chat and all that but uh no i better uh i better join my wife and the uh not there for uh for some good old good old cuddles and stuff like that so so so mark justin we're sweet like that you know you know we got i was gonna say i got to keep up on my uh keep up on my dad's status there and my husband's status so uh let's continue on we got two from estaban 2500 clp jim i've worked out on the desert and seen meteorites falling people go find the meteorite trackers trackers there's a museum for them denial at its finest cool cool story bro uh you know or cool story dude or cool story man or you know you know whatever uh you're not your buddy guy i'm not your guy man if you if you want to you know go ahead and believe that that's fine uh let's let's see some proof of it actually falling down from outer space things do fall from the sky and so it's all cool you know it's fine you know if you want to do a if you want to come on modern day debate youtube in the chat section and say something happening cool all right uh that was for you and jim last one's for you from estaban again estaban's got lots of questions for you jim so uh maybe you guys want to have your own conversation estaban join us on modern day debate discord maybe jim's going to join us there and uh you guys can uh you know hang out over there and see what you disagree about and you know maybe we'll uh link back up here in a couple uh couple weeks 2500 clp from estaban jim it is not speculation the universe is the isolated system that's the container for all pressure and matter in a volume everywhere and he probably believes he's the descendant of apes as well so that's cool well that's not exactly true we're still apes in in the evolutionary model if you want to be in the bush i can tell you that's false because then my cousin didn't evolve with me but we're still mammals it's apes still around yeah it's imagine it's weird how it's very selective we're still vertebrates we're still prokaryotes your career it's very selective don't you think what's tell me tell tell me when uh dolphin started coming from when the cows stopped uh do you want an evolution debate as well i'm more than happy to have an evolution debate it's ended with all kinds of things today it's ended with how long does it take for a cow to uh stop breathing and able to have gills under water and become a dolphin stop breathing do i have a bullet yeah no i don't friends don't have gills throw it throw a cow throw a cow in the oceans yeah no no no dolphins don't breathe under water they breathe air i don't yeah does a cow swim uh if you put it in water it can swim it might how long until it drowns we're away the hell off topic i'm so sorry i'm sorry this this was a little more a bit we're at evolution to another subject i'm so sorry i i don't want to say for some odd reason flat so i'm sure there was a reason for the conversation there but we should move into our closing statements here uh we're gonna we got two minutes per side uh i i want to go back and forth here to close it out uh a little unorthodox jim uh one minute uh your thoughts on the discussion we just had tonight oh it's all great mark ember it's great to meet both of you uh flat so it's my pleasure and um ryan you were great i want to thank you i want to thank james again and everybody who listened um it's been it's been fun and so i wish everybody a great stationary topographical plane weekend all right jim thanks for being here we appreciate you so much uh let's kick it over to emmer for your closing statements up to one minute all right uh also appreciate everybody coming by uh jim flat so i'd uh good to meet you both and uh yeah it's it's been a it's been a fun debate it's been it's been interesting and um you know that's the thing with science is we we actually keep hoping to have our our views since we don't like the word models our views challenged because when we can be shown to be wrong about something that means we learn more we like that that's the best thing in the world and so we we keep coming around hoping something like that will happen unfortunately i can't say it did tonight we didn't really get answers to any of our questions but it was still a fun time talking with you folks it did oh all right uh over to you flat so i'd you got one minute to close uh your thoughts there uh also i just have to say thank you it was well worth waking up so early um it was awesome meeting you ember and jim yeah it's also good to have you on mate and as always the for more of a mock read thanks for having on i know we get very triggered along with each other mock because we definitely don't see eye to eye we're like a negative and a positive pole so we definitely have their things but i have to point out note that not one thing was demonstrated only faith and pushing on insults that was about it all right well thank you ember for your closing statement and also thank you flatsoid for your closing statement there we appreciate both of our speakers for being here mark uh you got one minute to close us out the floor is yours okay so thank you all for being here and engaging with me and thanks ryan fantastic job thanks for modern day debate james and of course the audience for joining us thanks for your time and hearing us out um so the whole point of this thing was flat earth on trial so we're putting the questions to the flat earth of how it works how they know it works how how everything is described and we don't get answers for it all we get is a well you've got to describe this thing about your model before we even answer any questions now keep in mind that this is flat earth on trial and you're sort of asking the prosecutor did you commit the crime kind of thing it's not really doesn't make a lot of sense um all it is is sort of a dodger deflection that they don't have answers for any of those things that's why flatsoid won't give equations for for any of his stuff it's because he doesn't have something that will meet up with reality so instead they say well you've got to explain this and we really promise we'll explain our thing afterwards me explaining the model of the globe earth shouldn't depend on them explaining anything i should be able to give that information without asking them anything whatsoever but unfortunately they can't do the same and you've got to ask why is that why is their answers dependent on me explaining something first doesn't make any sense and they didn't really give answers to anything thank you all right well thank you mark for your closing statements there uh once again uh big shout out to jim flatsoid ember and mark we got one last question coming in from craw daddy of five dollars flat earth reminds me of herald camping cultists the difference is when they were presented with reality they stopped rejecting it um you know cry daddy that's that's a little bit on the ad hominy side uh you know and maybe not relevant to the conversation so we appreciate your five dollar super chat to close this out i thought maybe it might be something there where it started with flat earth but uh we're gonna close out our debate thank you everybody this was flat earth on trial uh we hope you keep on sifting the unreasonable from the reasonable or maybe the opposite however james says it you know uh let's uh let's hope to see you again next time for more modern day debate and i think uh i think i'm gonna put on some of that live performance that i had on before uh because i don't feel like playing guitar where my wife is right there so uh you can listen to my live that i played from months ago uh enjoy everybody and we'll see you next time cheers bye thank you turnies mixed with self-oppression what am i to do but tear away when i'm boiling at the top try to find a way to fight the fires smother the rap from the minds of liars with all the shots to your bare heads the marchin' never stops cut the strings before your life starts to decay from tears of blood regret subtle laughter turn around and i'll be faster your hollow shape as the faith begins to drop everybody that was our debate tonight on flat earth on trial so uh i see a couple of you in the super chats there i just want to remind all of you that uh you know earlier we were i was talking to james and uh we were having a conversation about the uh the people that were messaging about the upcoming debates uh it's not a lie those debates aren't like super postponed or like you know in the future or anything like that it's just that we're trying to remind everybody that we are on the podcast apps so uh if you have time to check us out on podcasts or share it from your favorite podcast forum we'd appreciate that so i actually have i think another song from that same night so i'll close you guys out with that but i do appreciate you all being here i care about the music well thanks jeff sol i you know i appreciate you being here but we appreciate the people that are here for the debate as well of course but the the music that i wrote of course is free to be used so on modern day debate so i do what i want um thanks everybody for being here and cheers we'll see hopefully in a few days here we're trying to set up some juicy debates so stay tuned and cheers i'm fractured was it all too far never mount the rest while i'll be off it all like a spill you're forever feeling over filled tired of sitting here all broken mind broken bone it's a symbol Just an occasion, but it's one