I have an interview coming up in a minute with Russ Dizdar. This is gonna be a tough one for a lot of folks for a lot of different reasons. Here are some clips. I was in Worthington, Ohio at the police academy called OPADA, a law enforcement agent named Thomas Wedge who wrote a book called The Satan Hunter for law enforcement. So I'm going through all of this, the very evening that I get home, I get a phone call from a frantic woman who said, somebody gave me your phone number. I have a stepdaughter that's in the psych ward.  Her mother's doing, she goes into all the stores about satanic stuff and rituals and blood rituals and animals being sacrificed. And I sat down with a 13 year old. She's there because she keeps writing over and over and over at the ritual of the flames, the ritual of the flames, the ritual of the flames. When I finally got enough engagement with her to talk about it, she said it's a ritual that she has to do on her 14th birthday to prove her love for her mother, her mother, a satanic priestess.  Again, I'm a counselor, I'm trained, I'm in school, I'm trained to do things. I'm listening to this 13 year old that I'm listening to a male personality that I'm listening to another personality. Why is that so hard to accept for most people and moreover, why is it completely misrepresented in the media? First, I would say the first part of this is the issue of grid. When you talk about investigative journalists that I deal with, psychiatrists, police officers, feds, if it's not in your grid, in other words, if you're trying to deal with MS-13 a gang, they're a real, they're a real gang, they're a drug gang, they're in my city now, up here in Canton, Ohio, they have certain markings, certain hand signs, certain clothing. So there's certain characteristics about a real gang. So when we deal with satanic crimes, very little teaching on that subject. And I wanna make sure we talk about MKUltra. You've thrown it out there. We've investigated it extensively on this show. It was in response to what they thought was a threat from Russia who was engaged in a lot of this activity. But there was also, as you point out, and I'm sure you will, there was a direct Nazi connection where we had just picked up their research and said, gee, horrible thing that you've done, but let's see if we can do it better. Alex, you're a million percent right on that issue. When it comes to side warriors, no question about the United States knew that they had to do something in the 50s to counteract the, what they learned about the Russians, what they were doing.  Where did the Russians get it? Where did the Americans get it?  I mean, you don't have to go all the way there with the Nazis, but you can't deny that they were interested in the occult. You can't deny that those SS uniforms had the little skull and crossbones on them and that they were actively trying to seek all these occult objects in order to empower what they would do. Tell us what you saw and experienced when you were in the castle in Germany. Well, that's, that was the whole issue. Where did it come from? That we just, we kept following the trail, follow the evidence. So I'll say this real quick.  Stay with us for Skeptico. Welcome to Skeptico where we explore controversial science and spirituality with leading researchers, thinkers and their critics. I'm your host, Alex Akeris. And as you may know by now, if you've listened to this show very much lately, you know, I've been kind of into the evil thing. And I gotta tell you, it's not because I have any special interest or attraction to the topic. It's just, it seems to me to be kind of one of the fundamental central questions we can ask about the nature of who we are, why we're here, the whole consciousness question. Evil is something that is fundamental to that. So again, as you know, I've spent quite a bit of time exposing the completely inept materialistic, atheistic, scientific dogma that would have us completely sidestep any of these questions, claiming that evil doesn't exist, good doesn't exist because consciousness doesn't even exist. You also know we've gone a few rounds with 11, like folks who are equally convinced that evil is just something that's understood as a bad idea and can be banished with a couple of good positive affirmations. On this show, you've even heard from magic practitioners who reluctantly acknowledge the existence of evil, but fall back into the idea that it doesn't really matter as long as you marshal those spirits to join your side and ultimately do what thou wilt. But one angle we haven't covered, and that's one that we're gonna cover today, is talking to someone who claims to kind of have insider knowledge about evil in a boots on the ground fighting evil kind of way. And that's what we're gonna hear today because today's guest, Russ Dizdar, is an ordained minister, former police chaplain and a guy who's taught college level courses on occult and satanic crimes. Russ has worked with a number of victims of satanic ritual abuse. He's investigated satanic crimes, occult crimes, a lot of mind control stuff that's gonna be very interesting and dovetail with a lot of the research, if you will, or interviews we've done on this show. He's the author of several books, including one that we're gonna talk about today, The Black Awakening and maybe some of those other books. You can hear him on his long running show, Ragged Edge Radio. Russ, welcome to Skeptico. Thanks for joining me. Great to be with you, Alex. Appreciate being here today. Okay, today I left some stuff out of that intro. We should best start by telling folks more about who you are and how you've really, how you came to this work and then the research that you've done. Sure, we go back 40 years then. I mean, that's 40 years ago in the beginning of this. I was raised in through the 60s, early 70s, lived a wild, crazy life. Drugs, bar fight and all those kind of crazy things. Well, I tried to clean it all up. I went, I got into Buddhism, went to a temple for three years, got to do a lot of other things, occultism myself. Now, in the context of that, I was never raised in church, but just to say what occurred to me in 1975, for the first time I heard the message of Jesus and I heard the message that he's alive, he's real.  Well, all I can tell you, Alex that night when I received Christ in my life and he came in, I've known him now and walked with God, just knowing God and walking with God. That's where it all started as far as just new life for me and you want to call it being born again, being awakened to who God is. That's the biblical picture of that salvation. So in that, I really feel like I recognized what evil really was. There were some episodes of spiritual things, entities, visitations that I had prior to that salvation where I almost lost my life. So when I became a believer in Jesus, a Christian, then I began to get into ministry. Well, from that time in the late 70s on, we've always engaged the underworld. I began to deal with young people in Satanism in the late 70s. Then we got into in the early like 1980, 1981, we got involved with satanic virtual abuse, multiple personality disorder. Can I jump in there with a question? Sure, sure. Because one of the things that straight up, we're gonna have to kind of deal with is even, like I said in the intro, establish the idea that there is such a thing as evil.  And the first 10 pages, first 100 entries are about the hoax. So the satanic ritual abuse as this kind of meme, as this kind of joke. Now, we've explored it on the show in some different ways. But I guess one of the things I was hoping you could do is from your experience in law enforcement in particular, kind of nail down that this is real, this is out there, even without, if you would, without the religious overlay.  And to a certain extent, law enforcement, from what I understand in talking to some of these people, they kind of feel constricted in reporting it and talking about it. So they go out to a scene and it's a crime scene and there's all sorts of satanic stuff all over the place, symbols and other stuff. And they feel obligated to kind of not report that. Can you give us some kind of boots on the ground? Evidence that you've had that this is something that's real beyond the Google search of satanic panic, which is what always comes up. Sure, and that's the vital part of all of it. And that was asked that on Coast to Coast years ago when it came to satanic panic. And there was a big battle over that whole issue in the 1990s, actually. And so the big issue is then, what do we do with all the victims? In 40 years, I have worked with hundreds of victims of satanic ritual abuse. Now, when I first began to hear about it, Alex, that's when I said, this is so bizarre. This is, you know, we know about satanism like Anton LeVe and popular satanism, rock and roll satanism. We know all about that, but we didn't understand this deeper level and real ritual. So I formed a team back in the early 1980s, which is now called the SIIU. It's an investigative team, private investigative team. And so we began to hunt it down. We began to go after it. When we had victims come in, we would listen to the stories. We would do what we do to help them and see them help get safety. And we're talking safe housing them, hiding them out. We get into talking about program personalities, triggers, coming people, coming, watchers. So I've got over 38 years of engaging victims, extracting victims, hiding victims out, spending thousands and thousands of hours with victims. So on just a secular look at this, the American Psychological Association, Colin Ross being one of the world renowned psychiatrists out of Canada. He's now in the United States. He wrote a book, Project Bluebird, The Purposeful Creation of Multiple Personality Disorder. And there's a ton of books now. There's a lot of content out there now. Here's what we've got to do. Here's a big question that I scream at at conferences when I did teach a little bit in law enforcement, police academies. The big issue was where did all the victims come from? You cannot have a person have split personality. That come, everybody in psychology knows it comes from massive trauma and usually begins in childhood. So where did all of the numbers like, for example, 1992, Holly Hector from Centennial Hospital in Denver in a book called Satan and Associates, they gave an estimation of 2.4 million victims in 1992. And these are people that have the trauma-based splitting of personalities and the evidence of programming and control abuses. She mentioned in her report in 19, I think, 92 that 87% of the victims they're dealing with come from a satanic ritual abuse background. Well, then jump forward 10 years or so to Colin Ross. Hold on, let's stop right there because I want you to kind of nail that down a little bit more. It's an important, where you're going is super important. And it's backed up by some of the research we've done in this show from a non-Christian perspective. I am not a Christian. Like I told you in the email, I accept the reality of extended consciousness and Christ consciousness only because I'm forced to it because that's where the data leads. You follow near-death experience, people are encountering Jesus, they're encountering Christ. You can't dismiss that in the same way that you can't dismiss the entire near-death experience. But I don't want to get off on my thing. But I also want to kind of say that this trauma-based realization of this extended realm and connection with this extended realm is again, something we've run across again and again and again in our investigations, again from a non-Christian perspective. So there's a lot of overlay there. But I'm hoping you can maybe back up Russ and you've done this for so long. You've been this warrior on the front line helping people. So no matter what people think of the Christian overlay, I want to help people get more of a sense of what you've seen on a firsthand basis. Like you said, maybe from more of a secular perspective where you said, wow, this is just undeniable. No matter what I might think about this, this is really happening. Sure, I mean, again, that's one of the questions we all have to answer regardless of any background. And as much as we've dealt with psychiatrists and psychologists with no Christian overlay, when I'm in law enforcement, they don't want me to talk anything about religion. When I'm teaching the police academy, when they allowed me to, don't talk about that, just deal with evidence and facts and how to investigate this stuff. So the big issue is again, victims. Why are there so many victims? Where do they come from? Why are there thousands in the 80s, hundreds of thousands in the 90s? And I do agree with the assessment that many others in the secular realm, not us, I'm quoting secular content when I say, they now believe Colin Ross, a secular counselor, a psychiatrist, he's world renowned knowing about all this, he's written a lot about this, numerous books. He believes in an assessment of 10 million victims in the United States alone. Now, I could talk about going to Scotland, Germany, France, Poland, Canada. I could talk about how, why are they worldwide? Where the, how's come there in all these other continents also? Where do they come from? The DSM-3, the diagnostic manual, the DSM-4, the diagnostic manual for psychology and psychiatry. It wasn't in there in the DSM-1 and 2. The phenomena began to pour in the late 70s. Victims began to show up everywhere. And that's what happened to us in the early 80s. Victims, my first victim, I had to show up at a children's psychiatric center, a 13 year old girl, she's writing, she has all these drawings that she's showing me. She's there because they're afraid she's gonna commit suicide because she keeps writing over and over and over at the ritual of the flames, the ritual of the flames, the ritual of the flames. When I finally got enough engagement with her to talk about it, she said it's a ritual that she has to do on her 14th birthday to prove her love for her mother, her mother, a satanic priestess. I've engaged her. I looked at all the writings, the pyramid, the languages that we don't even know of, ancient languages. So I'm looking at things that I've never seen. This is like 1981 to 82, 83 in these early days. I'm looking at content and materials that I've not seen that we all of a sudden had to scurry around and scour everywhere for information.  Again, I'm a counselor, I'm trained, I'm in school, I'm trained to do things. I'm listening to this 13 year old that I'm listening to a male personality, then I'm listening to another personality. Can I ask you, what brought you to the hospital? Paint that scene for a minute. Why were you called? Who are you at that point? And then pick it up from there. Sure, I was in Worthington, Ohio at the police academy called Opada. A law enforcement agent named Thomas Wedge who wrote a book called The Satan Hunter for law enforcement, it's caliber pressed, it was for law enforcement. He kind of snuck us in under the carpet to be in the police academy to go through this training, advanced training and oh, call it city and the crimes. So I'm going through all of this the very evening that I get home, I get a phone call from a frantic woman who said, somebody gave me your phone number. I have a stepdaughter that's in the psych ward.  Her mother's doing, she goes into all the stores about satanic stuff and rituals and blood rituals and animals being sacrificed. The two brothers are involved. So she's the one that begged me to go to the psych ward there in Akron, children's psych ward. And I just, so I did, I just went to the psych ward. They had somehow gotten permission for me to come in and I sat down with a 13 year old and that engagement back then has, to this very day I still know that person and we've worked with that person. So I can go into talking. So when you say that you've worked with victims, I just want to make sure that people understand that anyone in that situation, particularly you coming from a law enforcement, that's your training, that's going to be your career. I mean, that's just kind of real stuff that I want people to understand when you say victims, what do you do with that evidence? And I guess that's a follow-up on question. What additional cases did you have? And then now you're coming to the point where you're training other law enforcement or you were in the past, training other law enforcement professionals, how do you deal with this? Number one, what do you tell them? And then number two, I get the sense that they don't really want you to do that training anymore. So how has that all evolved? Well, you're right, Alex, you're actually right on that because I talk about it not being in the grid. Even when it comes to psychiatrists, psychologists, most of them, and for 30-some years, psychologists, psychiatrists have been taking in victims that have, they now call DID, Dissociative Identity Disorder. They all have dealt with this. They have all across the United States, every psych ward, counselor, psychiatrist, they've all dealt with this for over 30 years. You can't deny the numbers, you can't deny the victims. The issue is when they start telling you stories of being in boxes with spiders and being, you know, blood and a baby and an altar and people in hoods and candles and strange languages and they'll talk even about the dark side demons and all that. So the issue is police officers, that includes in the academy you can go through 25 criminology books, training books, forensic psychology books, textbooks, I collect them. There's no grid, Alex, they don't teach. All the officers that I know that when we've gotten into cases and we've taken content to those officers, to federal officers, it's bizarre to them. And the issue is then how do you investigate this? When you take a Jeffrey Dahmer and you do catch him, he didn't kill those people, but nobody brought out the fact that he was multiple personality.   Here's what the trainer in the law enforcement told us, Tom Wedge. He told all the law enforcement people, don't worry about whatever you believe, whatever your background, Christian, non-Christian, whatever it is, the point is, they believe it's real. That's what matters. They believe- So that's a really important point. There's so many points to pull apart there. One also, just correct me if I'm wrong, but Dahmer directly said he was in contact with spiritual beings that were telling him to do this. And I think he also said his father had similar contact. And that's the point. That's what I'm saying in the investigative side of this, there's no, what we call, I call a web. If I meet today, if I meet a satanic richly abused person, if they're 21 years old, here's what I know already. They are third generation. It means that they have family background where there's other multiples. They have a grandmother that's probably been multiple also and involved in all this because it's generational. I'm talking 35 years of this. When we meet victims, I don't care if it's an eight-year-old in a psych ward now in a children's psych ward or if I meet a 68-year-old, which is first generation, many of them are the MKUltra, the Monarch. Those are the ones that we have heard about the most on the web and books and things. I could talk about the Fort Bragg Psi Warrior. We're gonna talk about that in a minute.  And I'm not just interrupting you for the sake of interrupting you, but some people accuse that you said something interesting that I wanna make sure people get. From your experience with law enforcement, what I heard you say is that there's physical evidence that they have to deal with. If you walk into a crime scene, there's an inverted Pentagon, there's blood, ritual, circle, all this stuff. You can't get past that. So one of the things you do, this is what you're telling me, is you say, well, it doesn't matter if there's a reality to it. These people think there's a reality to it and I have to deal with that. But then what you said, and I've heard this before too and people have listened to this show, is that if we get past that kind of narrowly minded, atheistic kind of, there's no reality to any of this stuff and we start listening to these people, they say, oh no, it's real in that I have this contact with this extended realm that's telling me to do this. And then there's even evidence of them making contact with that. So what is this whole thing? Why do we get such misinformation and disinformation about this? If this is, if not common, at least understood to be part of law enforcement and we've interviewed some folks on this show, then why is that so hard to accept for most people? Moreover, why is it completely misrepresented in the media? First, I would say the first part of this is the issue of grid. In the, when you talk about investigative journalists that I deal with, psychiatrists, police officers, feds, if it's not in your grid, in other words, if you're trying to deal with MS-13, a gang, they're a real, they're a real gang, they're a drug gang, they're in my city now, up here in Canton, Ohio. They have certain markings, certain hand signs, certain clothing. So there's certain characteristics about a real gang and law enforcement has to learn that. That's why they have a gang unit. They had a drug unit. They got a sex crimes unit.  So when we deal with satanic crimes, very little teaching on that subject. If they go to a location where there's a ring and candles and a inverted pentagram and ancient writing that they don't even know what it is, Malachi and Fabian, Oguam, Delta Shari, these ancient ritual languages at Summon. So again, forget about the spiritual side for a moment. Let's just deal with trace evidence. Let's just deal with forensic, that kind of evidence. So you got a Dahmer. You got dead bodies. You got meat, human meat in the freezer. But what they didn't tell you in all of the documentaries, even the newest one, because I've watched them all. When I learned, when I was at Def Tech, a SWAT team training in Geneva, Ohio, when Tom Wedge, the law enforcement agent, brought in the actual large books from Matter Morse and also from Jeffrey Dahmers inside the house, the crime scene pictures. They didn't know what to do with an altar. They didn't know what that was, like a little table built out of human thigh bones. They didn't know what that triangle was with the skulls. What is that? So here's what I tell them when I met with, I mean, even in the last year, meeting with detectives in Pennsylvania, fed individuals, state troopers. Here's what I tell them. What they believe goes to the motivation of the crime. Forget whether you believe there's a Satan or not. They believe it. That's their motivation to slaughter and kill. We have cases of two girls. I have a Fed billboard picture on our website. We put up a lot of Sarah and Kathy. That's our case. It has been taken over eventually by the feds. They've never solved the case, even though we turned over state's evidence. The Fed, the primary Fed now over that case out of Pennsylvania, out of Pittsburgh, his whole issue was, but Russ, that's bizarre. One of the other cases in Allentown, a little boy went missing. The whole story of a victim we took there after 10 years of cooperating the stories and all that. They could not, when they sat for four hours to interrogate the victim that watched a little boy be sexually abused, richly killed, cannibalized. The boy's never been found to this day, I think some 15, 16 years later, his name's Lewis. The detective, after all of this, said he could not deny what she had to say. Here's what he said, Alex. The detective on the case. It's just too bizarre. So this is why I'm saying that the grid, when you're gonna investigate a crime, what's the motivation? What about Berkowitz, the process church? What about John Wayne Gacy and Ted Bundy, both of them being multiple? Where did they get those other personalities? Hold on, let me just make sure everyone understands what you're saying when you say the grid, because what I hear you saying is that people get locked into a certain belief system that literally makes it impossible for them to, in this case, do their job or take in information just in an objective way. That's what you mean, right? Yeah, yeah, because of an atheist, like when I was in Scotland, not too long ago, this last year, in a ritual abuse conference there, you do have strong atheists nowadays, not a lot of them, but they just discard all of this. None of this is true. So when we say to them, what do you do with the victims? What about the ritual sites? What about the symbolism? Again, in law enforcement, if they don't know what an inverted pentagram is or a pentacle, a pentacle is witchcraft and pagan. An inverted pentagram, that's satanic. Certain writings, if you know the language, if you know the content of the Amalantra working of Alistair Crowley, if you know how to read that, like I don't speak German, I know a couple words, I don't speak Russian, I know a word or so. So if someone gives me a whole sentence in Russian, I'm lost, I don't know what they said, I don't know how to engage that. So when law enforcement shows up with a kid or a dead body that has a tongue cut out or a left hand cut off or a satanic justice symbol carved into their chest, in the context of a ritual site that has candles, blood, symbols, and they can't read any of that. They don't know the language. They don't know what it's for. Until they begin to learn, well, a satanic justice symbol imprinted, that involves the fact that the coven has taken this person because they told the secrets and satanic justice is they've killed them. And part of the issue of cutting off the tongue is because they spoke, they shouldn't have. There's rituals that involve, you gotta understand the language of rituals. Why are certain rituals done? What are they about? What do they mean? So the two girls that I talk about that we have on our site a lot we put up, both of them, for example, I share with the federal officer. And here's, again, just looking at the facts. Sarah Bame was abducted out of Rochester, Pennsylvania. She ended up here in Ohio in a backfield that was known for satanic rituals. Kathy Menendez a month later, Sarah was slaughtered and killed on demon rebels early July. On the satanic calendar in August is satanic rebels. Kathy Menendez, so when you look at the satanic calendar and the kind of ritual that is demanded, blood sacrifice, usually a girl between 717. When you begin to look and when you have that in the mode of operation, in how they operate, what they use, no different than a burglar or a cat burglar or a drug lord. And you see the tools they use. You see the methods they use. Well, we have to learn and have in the grid of our understanding, the ritual dates, the reason for rituals, the types of rituals and the things that are done to individuals that will tell you, was this a satanic ritual? Was this a darker occult ritual in the Carolinian sense? Was this simply a meeting of Wicca and didn't involve blood of human, but it was a ritual site and yet there's no blood? So you've got to know the difference between Pagan, Wiccan and just simply know their language. And... So I get that from, well said, and you're saying from a law enforcement standpoint, there's two problems. One, there's the grid problem, the belief system worldview that doesn't let this or doesn't want to allow this in because almost the stories you tell almost suggest like, I don't want to go there, you know? It's not, I just, it's too uncomfortable and we don't expect to hear that from law enforcement, but I'm sure it's there. What game is the media playing in this? Because I kind of understand where you're going in the law enforcement grid slash worldview, but is there something more that's going on with mainstream media, Hollywood media in terms of how they're portraying this? Alex, because of the, everybody has a bias. I can just say my biases, I believe in God, I believe in Jesus, Bible, you know, that kind of stuff. Everybody has a certain bias. And so when it comes to journalists and local news media and there's clearly, again, their grid, their bias, they have no language for some of this stuff. But we can get conspiratorial in the sense that is there a certain level, law enforcement, media, psychiatry and so forth that purposely wants to downplay this? I can tell you about being in a police academy where the trainer said to all the cadets, all the officers, all of the detectives in the whole academy, don't tell the public. If you find pentagrams, pentagrams carved into a chest, if you find this content, don't tell the public. It'll come back. I've heard that before. Well, I was, I mean, we've seen that over and over again. We take the opposite view. That's why I'm not in law enforcement directly. Although we have former law enforcement that work with us, we have particular people that we work with in law enforcement when it comes to crimes and death and even the issue of just sexual abuse. If we touch on the Catholic thing, most of the thousands and thousands of you spokes out of the Catholic system, the courts just wanted to hear about the abuse. What we're not hearing is that many of those cases were satanic ritual abuse, the black rooms, all across multi-continental. And we've engaged it over the years. But when it comes to law enforcement, when it comes to the courts, when it comes to suing an institution, here's what they tell you. Leave out all this religious stuff. Let's just deal with the physical harm, the sexual harm. Let's just deal with those factors as far as litigation. That's just something that happens constantly. Let's go conspiratorial a little bit because I don't know how you can't. To be honest, like I've told people, when I started the show, I didn't have a conspiratorial angle at all. I was just following the data. I was following the data on the science meme that were biological robots in a meaningless universe.  Of course, we're more than that. I don't know what we are. I know my Christian upbringing told me one thing, but I'm open to whatever it was. But why is there this meme in science, this atheistic meme, and why has it survived so long when all the evidence points in the other direction? That led me to believing that there's a conspiratorial angle to that. There's a reason why that meme, why that grid, if you will, that worldview gets perpetuated. I gotta tell you, I just see the same thing here all over the place. I mean, the way this is reported is just absurd. It's just so distorted from the reality that if anyone does five minutes of research, they go, wait, that's not true. Sure, there are, and let's get this out there. There are cases of satanic panic. There are satanic hoaxes. There are the woman in England who is in a custody battle with her husband, even though she's had her kids taken away from her a couple of times because she's not a good mom, she raises the satanic panic flag and it has a certain effect. Those things happen, that's a reality. But it's so, the way that reality gets portrayed in the media versus this other reality that you're talking about, which far outweighs it in terms of number, in terms of importance, and in terms of everything else, how do you not see that as some kind of controlled release of this information? Well, I mean, and again, I think in a law enforcement unit, just in a societal way, look at the drug lords. Do they not operate secretively? Do they not operate in threat of punishment if any of their people would, what about the mafia? Do they not operate in a secretive way? Organized crime does. The drug lords do. Human trafficking of millions of kids and boys and girls, they operate in a deep secrecy and a fear factor. If you get out and telling, what is it, snitches get stitches. So there is this whole issue of the fear factor. So what I keep telling everybody then, just keep dealing with the individual victims because you cannot have split personality without massive trauma, usually sexual, mental, emotional over and over again. Everybody knows that in psychiatry. You can't be DID without that. Then the other question is, why are there so many of them? Why have they all of a sudden shown up everywhere? So we deal with that part of it. If you're gonna engage a child, is there certain indicators? Look at the private parts of a child or a young person or in a rape case with law enforcement. Is there evidence of a rape? Is there evidence of sexual abuse? Are there marks? Are there tears? Are there, you know? So all of the forensic evidences in a rape case and a sexual abuse case, that has to come into play. So if someone comes forward and says, I've been raped, I've been, this happened in these people and my uncle did this and the teacher at the school did this and they've been, I've been raped four times and occurred last night and occurred last week. Well, they go in to get a physical checkup by competent doctors and multiple doctors and they're all saying, this person hasn't been touched or this girl's still a virgin and she hasn't been touched. There's no physical markings. There's no, you know, vaginal tears. You know, none of the characteristics of real physical stuff occurred.  As we say in law enforcement, follow the evidence. The problem is sometimes they don't follow it all the way though. Let me make sure I understand what you're saying because I don't want people to get the wrong impression. You're saying cases that are misreported or intentionally fabricated can pretty easily in a lot of cases when people are talking about physical abuse. Law enforcement has a lot of experience in that. They can get to the bottom of it. What I hear you saying over and over again is what do you do with the fact that they get to all that and they go, yes, this really did happen. And then they're forced to deal with the eyewitness testimony, the experience or the victim who says, and this is how it happened. I was brought into a circle. These people had hoods. They were doing these crazy ceremonies and all the rest of that. And you're saying what they do is they have to accept the physical evidence of, in this case, maybe sexual abuse, but they seem to not be able to deal with everything else, which is kind of a strange way of handling the data. Right, because, you know, let's just say, let's just take like a forensic attitude towards multiple personality disorder individuals. What everybody pretty much knows is that means there's been mental, emotional, and most likely physical and sexual abuses that cause such trauma that it tore the personality. So there's no debate on that subject. It's in the DSM-3s, DSM-4s. That's all secular content. That's worldwide on that issue, on that.  Rape by a coven, this thing occurred. So when we hear these stories, this is what we started doing, Alex, way back in the 80s, we decided we were gonna go after, is there really a location? They gave us a location. Is there really a barn there? Is there a basement? Is there a secret door? Is there a, in a wooded area, in a cemetery area, is there a lid we can lift off and look in there and see what they told us?  You show us where it occurred. So if we, in some cases, blatant evidence, very clear. In other cases, it's not here any longer. They must have moved it. There's no, the pentagram on the floor is gone. So that's when you have to, as an investigator, look at the facts and begin to see, is this a domestic thing where somebody's just trying to get custody and it's, you know, and that's bad enough where maybe one of the spouses trying to tell, get the child to say, all the sexual abuse occurred or satanic abuse occurred, only to get custody and only to have the other spouse put away, it's pretty, it's also a crime to accuse somebody of things they've never done.  So again, following evidence is very, very key, but if that evidence includes weird ancient languages, maybe you did find this site, maybe you did like we did, find a basement that had blood all over it that had symbols on the wall, what did the symbols mean? What did the language mean? Why are words written backwards? So all of that has meaning to the people that sacrificed an animal or sacrificed a human being or did a sex ritual with tie downs. Of course, if you find pictures or if you find flash drives, that's then you're talking more smoking gun stuff. And that's part of the whole of investigating. So I don't have any problem with an atheist saying, well, I don't believe any of this. I don't think any, it's all like when Kenneth Lanning, the federal officer back in the nineties that went out and say, I've searched this out and I studied all the investigative, there's no, there's no nationwide satanic ring. No, Kenneth Lanning, the federal officer made most of those investigations by phone calls from his office. Kenneth Lanning, the FBI federal officer, and this is where I'll get myself in trouble with this, ended up in the psych ward himself. I'm not gonna listen to Kenneth Lanning. I'm gonna listen to the hundreds of victims that I personally dealt with to the thousands that are across the board. And here's what we have to answer. Who did this to them? What tools did they use? Because you can be brutally sexually abused as a three-year-old and also split in your personality and it didn't involve satanism. Most of the SRA or the DID issues do involve satanism, a very sophisticated kind. So if you think in terms of satanic ritual abuse, think in terms of mafia, think in terms of drug lord terror, if you tell such secrecies, if we can understand that there's drug lords and drug cartels that are global billion-dollar industries that nobody can bring down and they're sophisticated. They even use drones now. Then we know that, you know, and most of the drug pimps, most of the drug lords are not caught. Most of the mafia people, most of the mafia crime, they're not caught. When it comes to your stuff. So you're saying it's not too hard to extend that and say if we know there is this issue of satanic practices tied to crime, why would we not at the very least expect the same kind of activity being performed and I'm with you 100% and I love that you're trying to apply kind of a secular filter to it, which I appreciate because that's not your orientation and you have a particular view on that, which we will hear and we need to hear. But let me switch gears because you brought this up a couple of times and I wanna make sure we talk about the MKUltra. You've thrown it out there. We've investigated it extensively on this show. We've also investigated just the Psi phenomena and Psi researchers, but tell me what you think MKUltra is all about and what these people were doing because there is, I wanna inject a little bit of my overlay, my grid, if you will, is that initially when a lot of this stuff started, it was in response to what they thought was a threat from the enemy, if you will, the enemy being Russia who was engaged in a lot of this activity, but there was also, as you point out and I'm sure you will, there was a direct Nazi connection where we had just picked up their research and said, gee, horrible thing that you've done, but let's see if we can do it better kind of thing. Alex, you're a million percent right on that issue because that's part of the issue of 30-some years of researching it and wanting to have the facts and wanting to have those things because if they're really there, then we need to deal with it. If it's really that content, we need to understand and understand it, what it is. So you're absolutely right. When it comes to Psi warriors, no question about the United States knew that they had to do something in the 50s to counteract what they learned about the Russians, what they were doing.  Where did the Russians get it? Where did the Americans get it? Then when you do a little further research, where did the Brits get it? Where did the Canadians get it? Where did the Australians get it? They all went into some of these projects. So you do go back to the Nazis and I know that some will say it's just pure conspiracy but I could read 200 books on the Nazi regime and all that they did. Everybody knows they taught about a master race. They believed in a master race. Whether we want to believe in the spiritual side of that, forget that part of it again. Did Himmler really believe that they could backbreed to become the great super soldiers or the God men, small G? Did he really believe that? Absolutely, he was a breeder. He believed that. So he believed the spiritual doctrine, I believe Hitler did that too and many of the top SS, they believed in this. So much so, they created Levensborn, the secret birthing centers all over Germany in the 1938, 1939, 1940, where they took Germans that they thought they could prove had the occult version of the Aryan blood, the God men. If they could just make them mate and breed the next generation, the new Levensborn babies, the new master race babies, they would become more powerful. We'll use them as soldiers and they would continue that process. So there's no question about, they believed in a master race that they actually applied that to genetic birthing centers. They believed in it so much so that Himmler said, anybody can find, now you can find this quote on the web. Himmler said, if we could create but 200 million of these super soldiers or these God men, these Nordic hyper humans or hybrid humans, as he called them, if we could do, if we could build but 200 million, not only could we conquer the earth, you know, conquer the world, but we could maintain it, rule it for 1,000 years. Now that's what he believed.  I've been to Auschwitz, I've stood in the gas chambers. We've tracked this to Himmler's castle. I've been in the Hall of the Dead. Tell us about that story, that your trip to the Hall of the Dead and again, the physical evidence that you found, you know, the symbolism, what we know now happened. You know, a lot of people are interested in the Nazi occult link and people have a lot of different spins on it, but it's undeniable. It's undeniable but they were heavily, heavily influenced by that and then we pick that up as you're gonna talk about in a minute with MK Ultra and say, well, gee, golly, gee, just to defend our country, if the spirits can be on our side, if the demons can be on our side, we better get them on our side, which is kind of a bizarre for most of us, is kind of a completely bizarre idea in the same way, maybe we'll talk later about Aleister Crowley in the desert, you know, trying to bring about the Antichrist with L. Ron Hubbard is the guy, he's right there participating in that and creating Scientology and there's also links to Mormonism that maybe we will or we'll not get into but all that stuff is like document. I just interviewed, let me go on for just a second. I just interviewed Dr. Hugh Urban from Ohio State University, comparative religion professor, written a book on Scientology and written a book on cults in general, but he documents very carefully that exactly this happened, this ritualistic ceremony in the desert of the United States to bring about the Antichrist. These guys were serious about that and yet we treat it in academia, even Dr. Urban just kind of blows by that and goes, okay, and here's the next thing to deal with is if we can completely divorce ourselves from the potential spiritual reality, whatever you believe, whether you have a Christian overlay on that or whether you think that you have to look beyond the Christian overlay and I guess I tie that back to your thing about Germany and the Nazis because it's the same thing folks. I mean, you don't have to go all the way there with the Nazis, but you can't deny that they were interested in the occult. You can't deny that those SS uniforms had the little skull and crossbones on them and that they were actively trying to seek all these occult objects in order to empower what they would do. I mean, the Raiders of the Lost Ark, they didn't, Lucas didn't make that up out of thin air. There was a reality to all that. So with that and me going on, tell us what you saw and experienced when you were in the castle in Germany. Well, that was the whole issue. Where did it come from? We just, we kept following the trail, follow the evidence. So I'll say this real quick, modern day, if you want to call MKUltra, it's kind of old, but modern day MKUltra here, modern day systemic racial abuse is nothing less than the extension of the agenda of the master race that the Nazis started in 1939. There's a reason they believed it. There's a reason why, like think in terms, Alex, of the final solution. When the Nazis met in a secretive meeting to discuss the camps they would build, the ovens that would be built to be large enough, the way in which they would gather up the Jews and others and Gypsies and so forth and how they can bring them down to the camps. They sat there in a sophisticated way that involved engineering, that involved moving, that involved so many things. In plotting and planning the final solution and eradicating Jews, Gypsies, whoever else was in their way. So that all occurred. The camps, there's 900 of them or so, actually more than just a few. So the same thing's true concerning, when I wanted to know where are thousands or even millions of satanic richly abused, multiple personality, all this stuff, where's it coming from? So we kept tracking and tracking and we've had over the three decades that led us to Germany when we met Fort Bragg sigh warriors, when I met a federal officer's wife. First, here's a point that's important. In the first generation of multiple personality disorder that started in the late 70s, early 80s, when 30 year olds and others were starting to come in, the psychiatric community, psychology community, they didn't know what to do. And they began to hear every psych ward, all the counselors were getting them. So they came up with the DSM3 and they said, here's the diagnostic tests and the evidences for multiple personality disorder, that phrase. So that the psych world began to deal with that. They had to deal with that, but they didn't go tracking it. They dealt with that in an academic way. They dealt with that in the office way. Our way of dealing with it was we're gonna go take this to the ends of the earth and we're gonna search, we're gonna go wherever we need to go, which led us to Germany. So I'm gonna tell you this, modern day MKUltra, the military side is a sanitized version of the development of a master race, an altered human, enhanced humans. That's what Cywarism is all about, whether Russian, whether United States, whether remote viewers at Fort Mead in Stargate, the Fort Bragg goat lab where they were using Cypowers to explode the heart of a goat. Those that were in the program that we dealt with personally, they were there, they knew that, Alex. The folks that knew Sydney Gottlob directly, the folks that know John Alexander, the folks that know Stubblebind, all these folks that we dealt with on that level. There's no question about the research level, the reality level, the books that are involved, but the people that are involved also. David Morehouse, Psychic Warrior, one of the remote viewers out of Stargate.  It all goes back to the Nazis. It all goes back to their belief system, spiritual. It all ended up like Nazi ideology was actually spiritual revelation. Whether we want to, we don't have to say, people say, can say, I don't believe in that. Well, they did. They believed they were engaging non-human entities in the Hall of the Dead in the Himmler Castle in which Himmler was going to turn, the Himmler Castle was going to be turned into the place in which they would rule the world from. So down in the Hall of the Dead is where rituals were done. Down in the Hall of the Dead is where the 13 skulls were put in the indentions. Down in the Hall of the Dead is where Himmler and Hitler villigot the ancient sorcerer that was taken out of the psych ward in Germany. And Himmler had him as the primary sorcerer. They're doing rituals in that Hall of the Dead that I stood in, very charged, spiritually charged place. So from that place and after the war and all the Nazi doctors and all the scientists were taken, here's what anybody can do.  In the early 50s to mid 50s, wherever the rat lines went in all the world, South America, South Africa, Johannesburg, Pretoria, into Chile, to Argentina, wherever the rat lines went, guess what happens? You can now track the emergence, 25 years later, the emergence of the victims of multiple personality, mind control, and they begin to show up. In Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, South America, all over Europe, in Britain, whoever, wherever the rat lines went in the Catholic church system nationwide, wherever the Nazi became fake priests, wherever they went and were not captured, were not dealt with, didn't go to Nuremberg, they continued the project. The project both has a spiritual component that you could speak to, but it also has what you're referring to and I can confirm from everything I've found, has a technological, if you will, component to it. So that's when you say sanitized, you could also use the word perfected. So when they brought it into the lab, Stargate and Stanford Research Institute, and how put off in Russell Targ, I'm not saying that those guys in there, Sidney Gottlieb, the doctor, respected doctor, but many people outwardly say that he's the Joseph Mengele of the United States. So there's an undeniable reality to what you're talking about. How do you parse that though?  I mean, if I can remote view enemy's location around the world, that doesn't seem to me to be Nazi evil, how do you parse the, as you said it, the sanitized version of it that seems to have a genuine intelligence component with what you're talking about, which is really kind of challenging, but I think people have to deal with it, is the super spiritual aspect of this. Sure. Well, I think at this point now, the physical side, the reality of MKUltra, Monarch, you know, Mind Control, program shooters, I think that there's so many victims, so many have been investigating now for decades. I mean, I've been involved 38 years in direct investigation. I've done a lot of it in the direct working with victims and all over the place, including military ones, including MKUltra, including these individuals, and that occurs to this very day. We got cases all around us. We have threats all around us. I was at the Mind Control Conference in Richmond, Virginia when Alan Shefton, Corey Dunhammon, talked about the green bomb, the famous green bomb speech. I was there at that conference. They believed, they were not Christians. They believed that there was a nationwide conspiracy. They acknowledged the CIA's involvement. They acknowledged the CIA presence in that meeting. Corey Dunhammon was getting out of it because of the threats that he got. But let me do this, Alex, let me hold up something to you. This book here, I don't know if you've ever seen this book. I quoted this in my book, The Black Awakening, 10 years ago. I keep mentioning it left and right. You can get it on Amazon probably for about 100 bucks, 150 bucks now. I'm amazed that there's hardly anybody in all the books. I buy every book I can find that's out on MKUltra, every single book on the subject. I mean, that's what we do. That's what our teams do. This book right here is written by GHS Brooks. World renowned psychologist, psychiatrist in the 1950s. World renowned, head of the global, kind of like the World American Psychological Association, the Psychological Association of the World. He's considered one of the greatest psychologists, psychiatrists worldwide. US military hires him. Maybe he begins to work with them. This book is put out in a chapter called weaponizing. Here's what he says in 1947. This is put out in 1947. Here's what he says. Just like you're saying, we in the arms race, in the battle of developing weapons and so forth, we know that we have to do anything to be ahead of everybody else. He says here in that chapter on weaponization, we learned how to take soldiers, create, here's his terminology, create multiple personalities, create an alter personality. We learned how to program those sub-personalities to be active assassin shooters, disinformation agents, spies, infiltrators. We've learned how to program them, give them a trigger and put them down inside the soldier without the soldier knowing what's really there. You know what he says in this book in 1947? He says, I think he spilled the beans and they've tried to cover it up since. Here's the guy that did all the stuff. Here's the guy that did the stuff with Sidney Gottlieb with all those people back in that day. He said what we need to do after he explains details the effectiveness of creating alter personalities, creating the spies, the program shooters, the assassins and so forth and how that works and how successful they were. He also details this. GHS Brooks says, I didn't say this, he did. He says, we need to create these super soldiers and place them in every department of US military so that down the road we can have a hidden fifth column of these super soldiers to call up if we need to. That's in this book under weaponization. He would have been at the very forefront of MKUltra. This book was put out in 1947. So this psychiatry knew this stuff. Psychologists knew this stuff. You know where he got it from? From the Nazis. Russ, this is powerful stuff that you're bringing forward and I love when you reference the direct connection there and I think it helps people because Nazi is such a hard word. It immediately discredits. A lot of people just go, okay, Nazi, I'm out of here. But in this case, as you're documenting, you can't folks, you just have to go and follow the data and say, why did this happen? Why did these guys wind up here? Why people know project paper? Why did that happen? What was the source of that? I would bring it for folks who don't like that England or more into the modern thing. Go watch the video from Darren Brown, famous UK mentalist, atheist. I mean, very outwardly in a way that I think is kind of ridiculous. The atheists just sound kind of silly to me at this point. But he's an outspoken atheist. He's a mentalist, but he shows you how to mind control someone to set him up to do a Saran Sirhan Manchurian candidate thing. He does the whole thing. And the guy goes into a theater and he pulls a gun. He doesn't know that the gun only has blanks in it. But there it is. There's the demonstration. And again, secular, this guy doesn't have anything about it. And if you go to the Saran Sirhan case, I guess I'm old enough that I kind of remember it, but a lot of people have forgotten it. I mean, this is the murder of Robert F. Kennedy and in LA when he's about to take the nomination. And there's eight bullets. They pulled out of a wall and there's only six bullets in Saran Sirhan's gun. And they go in, when they get Saran Sirhan, he's just, as you're talking about, as I've heard you talk about, maybe you can bring us up to date on these modern day shooters. But it's the same thing. You look into his eyes and you go, something's not right here. And the guy goes, I don't know where I was. I don't know what happened. There's this complete memory eraser thing. And when you look at the documents that were forced out by the Canadian government on MKUltra, they go, yeah, that's what we're trying to do. Basically erase people's brain. And then it's very, it's impossible to deny that they were doing the rest of this stuff. So, oh man, I can only imagine your frustration at two levels. I mean, we haven't even, again, we've kept the spiritual side of this out of this discussion. And I think that maybe helps bring people along. But maybe you wanna speak to either one of those points that I raised in terms of how this is kind of controlled this information in terms of what we know and why it turns people off. What is your understanding of the spiritual component of it? And how do you make that fit into the larger problems that people have with religion, particularly with Christianity, you know? Christianity, a lot of people would say would be the last ones we'd wanna turn to, to try in particularly the Catholic church, which is the original, it is Christianity. And now it's understood to be systematically, institutionally, completely corrupted. Doesn't mean that there aren't good people in there, but as an institution, boy, oh boy, I don't know. Yeah, cause they're all, yeah. Cause like someone's saying, you keep backing up and all the things you're bringing into it, it's important because the facts need to be there. Let me throw one thing out. And here's why, this was what stuns law enforcement, even psychologists, here's what even the psychs know. When you have a first generation MKUltra or, you know, person that says they have multiple personalities and they've been diagnosed and they are and they have personalities. Here's the question I had to come up with. Why do all of them that we've dealt with, all the first generation ones who are now between 55 and 72, it would all began, it began there, the development of splitting them began in the early 50s and they, you know, so they're born in like 50s and up from that point on. So all of those victims, by the hundreds of thousands of them, where do they come from? Who did this to them? Why do, why do all of them, Alex inside have a personality that comes up that speaks fluent German? Every single one of them. Every single one of the first generation all have personalities that speak fluent German. Many of the second generation, even down to the third generation, 21 year olds, they also can do this. So there's a reason why, that's why you take that, you know, it's kind of, it's one thing to web and investigate the outside of everything and then to track where did it come from? Who did this? Grandfathers did this, these mothers did this. For example, if I have a 21 year old, and this is a case, numerous cases we have right now. If I have an SRA 21 year old, 25 year old, here's what I already know. Probably the mother is multiple and the grandmother's multiple and the grandmother and the grandfather came from Germany. We already know this is a generational thing and backs up to the Germans. This is repeated over and over and over and over and over in cases. So you can get at the forensic investigative side of this, you can get at the, you know, where it's coming from, who did this, what the agenda is. Then we can ask them, why did the United States military take this in? My belief, they've been given a Trojan horse. They didn't know, they were given a gift.  They didn't know it came with a lot of other stuff. So that's a, so there's, there is a, in my view, in my personal belief about this, I believe our US military was infiltrated purposely along the way from the end of the 40s, early 50s. And this is where Monarch, this is where modern day remote viewing even came from. And we can get into that issue too, because all of the SRA multiple personality victims that we've dealt with have trained remote viewer personalities, all of them. Where'd that come from? And, and even though many of the early remote viewers, and this is important because we've dealt with a lot. David Morehouse is a direct individual we dealt with.  And though they say, in a sense, hardwired wise, there is a reality that we can do some of this stuff. But Ed Dames has come out to acknowledge what we've been screaming about for years and years and years. Ed Dames came out with it, SciTech came out with it. They're now all acknowledging that the presence, the way they're able to remote view as they go passive, they connect to the Akashic records. They connect to the hall of records. They connect to an outside source. We've said that all along. We said it with Edgar Mitchell when we were in Roswell, when he was promoting Homo Narica, Homo Lumos, the new development of humanity. There's more to remote viewing and it is an advantage. If you could remote view where the sniper is, like when Lieutenant Colonel Shannon in the First Earth Battalion manual that the Fort Bragg Cyborg you brought to me, it's now on the web. You can get that free on the web now. So this manual was to teach US soldiers how to be clairvoyant, how to engage with telekinesis, powers of how to use these super abilities. It's the super soldier manual.  I mean, they're directly talking about super soldiers. And they actually had many, many soldiers, many have been trained in that. So it's not, it's lack of knowledge. That's why I'm saying back in the early 80s, Alex, when we first got to engage this, I know what salvation is, what real demons are. That's me, I know all that stuff. We dealt with that for years and years and years and years. But when it came to the multiplicity thing, when it came to personalities that were programmed, when it came to a federal officer's wife that we dealt with and a Fort Bragg sigh warrior and other military individuals that came in, most all of them victims wanting out of this, wanting freedom, well, we had to ask those questions. Where did he come from? What's it connected to? And there are credible sources along the way that not just going way back to Project Paperclip, but more integrally to see where that led down the road. And so when people say today, well, where did all these victims of mind control or DID, where do they come from? Why do they keep, why have more and more? We have more now than we did 30 years ago. It's still an active issue. Not only in the United States, but in Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Scotland, which I was just there last year for a ritual abuse conference on this very subject, England is saturated, obviously in Germany, it's massively saturated. And the Russians have taken this in too. So we can go back and just stop right there and say, well, the Germans did it because they thought it would give them advantage. The Germans did it because they thought they could create an enhanced or an augmented human or an augmented soldier. That's ultimately what they thought they wanted an augmented soldier. And they used the terminology, not us, they did. They used the terminology God-man or a hybrid almost. So you mentioned the ritual in Mojave Desert by Jack Parsons. It's connected to the Crowley. So Jack Parsons, the American rocket scientist, it's APL, scientist. Here's a renowned scientist out of Pasadena. He's already known to be in the Satanic rituals, dark things and so forth, the people around him, they all know that. But he goes out to the Mojave Desert. Not only does he do the Babylon working, the Babylon... And the guy who's there kind of playing aid or whatever is L. Ron Hubbard, Scientology founder. So yeah, here, and then please continue with the story. Sure. And so there, and whether anybody wants to believe this or not, they're doing a ritual.  So that ritual was not in the sense of a criminal thing. So nobody in law enforcement could come and say stop this. So, but the ritual, what was the ritual all about? The ritual was all about Alastair Crowley's moon child. It was all about the possibility. They believe that in the inciting and the summoning, now they believe that there was the big entity, the whore of Babylon, the entity that could come. And this entity could come in the context of the ritual. The sexual involved a supernatural charging of conception that in the act of that sexuality and in the actual moment of conception, that non-human presence could be spliced in to augment the new being. And the new being would be a hybrid, a human non-human mix. And so it's a ritual.  Like I said, folks, they will have already heard. People in the show will have already heard Dr. Hugh Urban from Ohio State University who doesn't really have any skin in the game. He's just saying, this is the history of Scientology. This is what we know. So yeah, that's pretty stunning. And this is why it's of interest to me. And I'll just throw this in real quick. On a biblical side and a biblical prophetic side in the concept of what will, if Satan's real, what is he gonna do? Just on that whole side of the fence, here's what I believe about the so-called Antichrist. He is counterfeit to the real incarnation. In the incarnation, you have God. The Bible picture is God Almighty causes the conception in a woman, Mary, that's bloodline genetically all the way back to Adam. So a real pure human being. So you have that at the moment of conception, something miraculous occurs and you have in the biblical picture, the God man, God in human flesh, the Logos becomes human flesh. So that's just a biblical picture.  How's he gonna come about? Now here's what I believe and we know over the years, Alex, and this is where we're getting into the spiritual side of it, I guess. All those ritual things and manuals that we confiscated, all the discussions with those who knew how to summon and explained in detail these kind of rituals. Whether we wanna believe this or not, here's what they say. The reason that in the creation of multiple personality disorder, which is just, that's just a secular term. If we wanna use the Luciferian terminology or Aleister Crowley's or Jack Parsons concept, they were creating Babylon working babies. They were wanting to see their belief that all these SRAs all over the planet right now are Babylon working babies. They are the attempt to go backwards to recreate and bring about a splicing in and an altered human, if not a direct hybrid human. That's what the Babylon working was in the Mojave Desert. That's what the actual rituals done in order to select, cause conception and produce an SRA split personality, mind control. That's not where it stops. Whether we believe it or not, they believe they have possibly altered DNA or spliced in DNA. Just like geneticists believe they can take a gene from a panther that enables it to see at night, splice it into a soldier's DNA and the soldier being able to see. You know the studies on the frog that can grow up and glow. You take the gene from the firefly and you put it into the frog and now the frog with that gene spliced in, now that frog can glow. There's science behind this. There's physics behind this. There's physics concerning the incarnation. There's physics concerning the, what do you want to call it? The counter incarnation of the Antichrist. Not only has Crawley tried, not only has Jack Parsons tried, but I think that I was at the 2045 meeting in Lincoln Plaza, New York when Dmitry Itzkov, the Russian billionaire, Google's head guy, Ray Kurzweil, all the genus, I was at that meeting of the transhumanists. Did you know that the transhumanists all believe in a, they're trying to develop immortality, to wipe out death? On that same stage with the geneticists, scientists and veners, with gene splicers, with Ray Kurzweil and all the rest of them, they brought in Russian cosmists who put on the screens, the big screens that we saw on the stage. This is what they said is not what we said. The Russian cosmos said that the ancient gods of the skies are guiding the modern day inventors and scientists and guiding them to help bring about immortality for man because the ancient gods desire a return of the god net. So there's motivation even in the deep science of transhumanism. There's elements of what we saw in Nazism in the 1939, 1940 development of Leibnizborn. You know, that's incredible. And I have confirmation that we did a whole show on the whole CERN ritual, you know, the Large Hydron Collider. I've been there. Yeah. And you know, the ritual that they performed at the opening of that, it blew people away and people like, why are we doing all these pagan rituals that have all these entities that we're bringing in? What is the connection there? And there's something deeper coming on. You've been incredibly generous with your time. You mentioned in the email that we might have another chat. There's a lot more to talk about. I'd love to talk to you about near death experience because I think that plays into this. And in particular, there's some crossover with people like Joseph McMonicles, psychics by number 001, who has a near death experience. And when he shows up at Stanford Research Institute, lo and behold, they pull the Raymond Moody book out of his file, Raymond Moody being the guy who coined the term near death experience. There's a number of people who've had a near death experience who see that as a Christian experience. I have a couple of them up here on the screen if you're watching this on YouTube. But there's a lot to process there, but I'm not sure we could get to all of it and do it in a way that really does it justice. So will you come back and have another talk about some of that stuff? Alex, you're fun to talk with. I would love, we've only scratched the surface of this content. And again, we can bring out, track the evidences, evidences, evidences. And then we can get to the, is there a spiritual backdrop? Is there a spiritual motivation behind all this and what does it ultimately lead to? We can get into that also, but I would love to come back and I appreciate you having me on. Okay, that's great Russ. Tell people more about what they can do. You produce a tremendous amount of content, very high quality content. You're doing real investigations and you're talking about those investigations. Tell people how they can follow your work and learn more about what you're doing. Sure, well, the main website we have is shatterthedarkness.net. And there's no question. There's a Christian backdrop. I have no question about who I am. But you gotta understand me. I'll talk with anybody, any place, anywhere, anytime. And we're engaged with all this information. So we put out a lot of information. I wrote a 601 page book on the subject matter that deals with the factors we're talking about, but it deals with the spiritual side of it called the Black Awakening. And that term came off the lips of a Fort Ragsai warrior. They ripped my shirt open to see if I was wired that if I was recording them. And they said, you have no idea what's coming. You have no idea what's gonna happen to the United States. You have no idea of the undercurrent and the coming chaos. So part of the, I put that term there purposely to discuss, you know, if there's really worldwide over 50 million of them, why are they here? Who created them? We know what the Nazis wanted, but right now modern day, who wants to use them? And so that has to be addressed and looked into. So www.shadowthedarkness.net, that's the main site.  We touch on all of these things and we'll be glad to try to respond to anybody that connects with us. Well, fantastic. I'm super impressed at your ability, like you said, Russ, that anytime anywhere thing impresses me to no end because the number of people who say they can do that and then can't do that, can't handle the questions that people really have because they're outside of their grid, as you say, or their worldview. And you certainly stand up to that. You, I'm very impressed with the way you handled all the questioning. And I look forward to talking to you again. We'll have a great follow on conversation. So thanks so much, Russ, best of luck. Thank you. Blessings. Thank you. Bye-bye. Thanks again to Russ Dizdar for joining me today on Skeptico. The one question I'd have to tee up from this interview is, Nazis? Really Nazis?  Haven't I always said whoever says Nazis first loses? I don't know. I said it in the interview, I'll say it again. I'm super impressed with this guy. I don't care about the Christian evangelical kind of stuff. Somebody's gotta grab the reality of these extended consciousness realm and try and tackle it. And I don't have to agree with his entire overlay, as we kept saying, but we will go back and talk to him again about that as well, to say that at least he's confronting some of the data. Really interested to see what some of you think about this show. Of course, my favorite place to do that and to connect with you is the Skeptico forum. I'm hoping we'll get some good conversation going over there about that. And be sure to check out the Skeptico website where you can get all these shows for free, for download, no paywall, no ads. How do we do it? It's really not that expensive to run a podcast.  And we have a lot of them up there. You can see some on the screen, but you already know there's over 350 at this point. But please check out more episodes and share them as you will. I got some good ones coming up. Stay with me for all of that. Until next time, take care. Bye for now.