The National Broadcasting Company and its affiliated independent stations present the Pacific Story. This is the story of the Pacific. The drama of the millions of people who live around this greatest sea, where the United States is now committed to a long-term policy of securing the peace. This is the background story of the events in the Pacific, and their meaning to us and to the generations to come. Tonight's Pacific Story comes to you with drama of the past and present and commentary by Roy F. Hendrickson, Deputy Director General of the United Nations Relief and Rehabilitation Administration who has just returned from a tour of China. For China's millions. Listen to him.  All of us have suffered together. Let us not suffer more needlessly. He is right. Ah, perhaps he has not been away as long as we. I speak to you as one of you. Hear me. We have lived through the war. Let us not throw away our lives now. Listen to me, this one. What is wrong? We have been away a long time. Nearly eight years since the enemy swarmed over our coastal plains and all of us walked out here into the interior. But we here in Sichuan must realize that 60 or 70 million of us migrated out here into the West. We must realize that the cities and the farms we left have been blasted and burned.  The basin of the Yellow River has been flooded. Droughts have scourged Kamsu province. There is less food in the areas we left than there is here. Are we to forsake our home? There is not enough food, not enough clothing, not enough medical supplies to take care of the people who are now there. I speak to you as one of you and say, stay here. Here all of us can make a new life and a better life. You see, Wang, that is what I have said. I am a shopkeeper, my wife. What wisdom can there be to give up all that we work for in Hongkou? Hongkou is a room. It is our home. We have no home except what we have here. A few sticks of furniture, a few meager pots and pans, and a hover to sleep in. But what have we in Hongkou, my husband? Oh, well, I have been looking for you. Yes, Lee. Then how's the cholera? And Chow has it. Cholera is spreading. I am going back to Hunan province once. But the Yellow River has changed its course, Lee, and the whole countryside of Hunan suffered. I must go where my land is. You see, my wife Lee is a farmer. His home is in the Yellow River country. There may be also cholerae in Hunan. But in Hunan, I will be home. Here in Sichuan, I am more than a thousand miles from home. And now they are starting to inoculate the people against the devil of the cholera. The needle has already pierced the skin of thousands. But it will not pierce mine. The needle is evil. Lee is right. We must go away from the cholerae here. We should stay and be inoculated. Never. Lee is a farmer. He wishes to go back to his land. We are shop people. We should go back to Hongkou and start all over. We could run our shop here and Lee could farm here. I am going back to Hunan. And we will go back to Hongkou. Is it wise not to heed the words of those who know? We will go, old woman. We will sell our few poor sticks of furniture, our pots and pans, and we will walk back to Hongkou. I will walk with you. You must walk well. There is the area of China's greatest suffering and greatest need. But there is cholerae here. Yes, but there is not more but less. We are winning our fight against it. Although the needle will never pierce my skin. If all of us should go back to the areas that have been occupied by the Japanese, the suffering our people have endured so long will be prolonged. I must go back. And I must go back. Ed was scattered with people as far as we could see. We carried what we could. My husband walked with Lee. I walked behind. Most of the time they just walked in silence. Sometimes they talk. This is great, your province, Lee. It is not as rich as Ho-Man. My feet itched to stand in the soil of Ho-Man. Ho-Man is far away. We have walked only 200 miles. Soon we will be to Gueyong. Another 40 miles. Look, my husband. There is one fallen by the side of the road. He's a seeker. Do not touch him. Do not touch him. He may have color. We must help you.  He housed the car. Let us hurry. We saw more and more sick along the road. We kept on walking. At last we reached Gueyong. They gave us rice at a waste station. Who runs this station? The Chinese National Relief and Rehabilitation Administration. It is the agency of our government and works with UNR to help us. What is UNR? The United Nations Relief and Rehabilitation Administration. UNR is working in many lands to help the victims of the war to help themselves. Have you been inoculated against cholera? No. There is cholera here. And everyone is being inoculated. Not me. We have inoculated 50,000 in Chungking. The death rate was 40%. Four out of every ten who got cholera died. We have cut the death rate to from five to 15%. I will not be inoculated. No, me. No, my wife. Come. No, no, wait. UNR and the Chinese Relief and Rehabilitation Administration is doing this for us. For the good of us Chinese. We are waiting to control epidemics so disease does not strike us down. I think we should be inoculated, my husband. What do you think, Lee? I will not be inoculated. No. I will. You will inoculate me. No, my wife. Yes. Will you inoculate me? Just step right over here. My husband and Lee looked on as they inoculated me with the needle. What do you say now, Lee? No. Perhaps it is good. Will you inoculate me, too? Very well. They will never pierce my skin with the needle. There. This will protect you. Yes. I am going one. I must leave this infested place. We will walk with you. Come, old woman. Gold wound into Guangzi province. The ragged thousands of us walked from daylight to dark. Lee did not speak for days. Not until we had walked 300 miles from Guayang and were entering Guilin. There is no city. No Lee. Look. Even the trees lining the road are burned and dead. The whole city is dead. Every house, every cooler hut is destroyed. Nothing but ash and broken walls. Even the bridges are destroyed. I had thought we might get help here. There is no help for us here. Perhaps there is a way station. We are in rags. Perhaps we can get some clothes. Would you like to work here? Yes. The government is hiring men to help clean up the rubble, to open the roads. Is there food here? Can we get clothing? There is food. Not much, but more than in the countryside. And the Sinra will help you with some clothes. Wang and Lee went to work on the roads. I worked in the rice kitchen. Everyone crowded around the Sinra headquarters to get some clothing. Quiet. Quiet, people. Quiet. There is not clothes for all. There is some clothing, but not enough. Is there none for us? We have no more. Are we to have nothing? We have no more. There are 13 million here in what was occupied China who have almost no clothing. There are hundreds of millions like you who are in rags, but who can still get along. If we are to reach our homes in the north before we freeze, we must go now. Yes, we must go now. We left Guilin and headed for Hengyang in Hunan province. We walked from daylight to dark. Look how this country has been scourged by the Japanese. It is even worse. Yes, from the cities that were bombed and burned. At night we stopped and cooked the little rice we had. The people of Hunan told us what the Japanese had done. They took everything we had on our farms. They burned out tools for firewood. They slaughtered our water buffaloes so that we had no means to pull out plows. The dikes that hold the water were blown up. The earth is cracked and dry. We grow no crops. Is that color? Yes. Will you share your rice with us? My wife and I will share. And I will share. At daylight we were walking again. I shall be happy when I am in Hunan again. Hunan is richer than this poor country of Hunan. You should come with me to Hunan one. I wonder if we shall even get to Hengyang. Hengyang was 300 miles from Guilin. My husband and me walked hours side by side saying nothing. I walked behind them. At last we reached Hengyang. I think I am sick. Your head is fevered. I cannot go on. My husband and I talked of what to do. Hengyang was in ruins. Only five buildings that could be lived in were still standing. Hengyang here was the Stalin god of China. Here our 10th army held off the powerful Japanese divisions for 48 days. 48 days we were shelled mercilessly and the American bombers blasted out the Japanese. I cannot go on. Is there no health for the people? Until Unra and Sinra send help, there's only what you see. This winter there will be little shelter for anyone. Little food, little medical care. We cannot go on my husband and leave Li here alone. What can we do? Could you not make rice cakes of the rice we have and sell them? You go. Leave me. No Li. We will stay until you are better. We scraped clear a small place with some charred timbers we built a lean to and here we made small rice cakes and sold them. With the money we bought more rice. We cared for Li. Go. Go. Leave me. Leave me here. Li had cholera. We will not leave you Li. Day by day the people straggled through the dead city. I must get home to Honour when you go. When you are better Li. I am better. I must get home to Honour. We ask questions of those who knew. Honour and province is hard hit. The Yellow River must be put back in its course. The dykes must be rebuilt. There is little food when the land is devastated. We could start and by the time we reach the cities ahead. The conditions ahead are no better than here. There is Typhus and Nanking. The mills in Shanghai are still. The millions of people in North China and Manchuria are in rags. I will go back to Honour if I must crawl my hands and knees. The countryside ahead has suffered most in all China. What of Hancao? Hancao is in ruins and refugees are pouring back into the city. What they will be helped for is in Hancao. The streets are filled with rubble when the buildings not smashed to the ground are gutted. I am going back to Honour. If you can go back to Honour and Li, we can go back to Hancao. We will go my wife and Li. We will help you as far as Hancao. We had come 1000 miles of the way. We had walked every inch. It was 100 miles to Hancao. We started walking again. The roads were scattered with people as far as we could see. Hancao is a great city, Li. Ships from many lands come all the way up the Yangtze and anchor there. The waterfront is filled with thousands of small boats. Many junks, river people who live all their lives on the Yangtze. And the railroad come into the city and bring the products of the back country. And take away the products brought in by the ships and the thousands of boats. You talk too much my husband.  Help him. No. No. I can walk. At night we slept by the side of the road. In the morning Li could not go on. The people straggled by us. We stayed with him three days. I can go. I can go. I will get well when I reach home. We started walking again. We covered only a short distance each day. At night we asked questions of anyone who stopped near us. No, I know nothing of Hancao. I did not see it. But I have seen Shanghai. The cotton mills are dead. The Japanese stripped the buildings of everything they could take. Machinery. And even heating and plumbing. The people are in rags. So I am going back to Sichuan province. It will be better in Hancao. We will go on. There were more people walking along the road. Even more hungry and sick and dying by its side. We did not even look at them. How far are we from Hancao? Now one. About 50 miles. All now is only 200 miles beyond Hancao. Only 200 miles. We carried these last miles into Hancao. My husband and I. This is Hancao, Lee. Hancao? I knew we would get here. Now it is only 200 miles to Hancao. They are looking at the ruins of Hancao in silence. Rubble. Broken buildings. Jagged walls. Blackened chimneys. When I looked down again, Lee was dead. To where our shop had stood eight years ago. Nothing but wreckage and charred rafters. No. Not a thing left. It has lain like this for years. Maybe since the first day the Japanese came. Is it Wang? Is it Wang? Eh? Yes, I am Wang. I am Siang. You remember me? Siang. I ran the shop next door. You know not Siang. I am Wang. My shop is gone. And my family is gone. And the Japanese destroyed everything. The railroads coming into the city. The waterfront where the ships landed. Factories and the power companies. Even a pumping station. There's no fuel for the waterworks. Uncle has been bled to death, Wang. Uncle. We must get help, my wife. We went to the relief station. The refugees are pouring back into Hancao by the thousands. And back into the coastal plains and the coastal cities by the millions. And these, with the nearly 200 million already here, have made the task of relief and rehabilitation enormous. We listen to the men at the Chinese National Relief and Rehabilitation Administration. Hancao here has become a focal point of this entire area. But our transport has been smashed. Unruh supplies are arriving at Chinese ports. But we must have transportation to get them to China's needy. We have less than one-tenth of the shipping that we had at the beginning of the war. We must have ships and trucks and railroads. And we must have fuel and highways. We must do all we can to help ourselves until food and clothing and medicine can weaken. We walked away. Will we get help in time, my wife? There are too many of us to help. Must we die here? Unless we can help ourselves. There is no food for us in Hancao. We made our way again to where our shop had stood. We looked at the wreckage a long time. The confusion of smashed and blackened bricks. The charred rafters. Let us start, old woman. Yes. We can start over here again, my wife. Yes. If we can build a shelter by winter. If we can get some food. If we do not, does it matter? I wonder if it will come. Clear the way to rubble bit by bit. We built a front with the charred rafters. We covered them with lath and plaster. Now the front is painted with soft colors of yellow and pink and lavender. The refugees straggled through the city as ragged and hungry as we. And as we work, we wonder if the health will come in time. After fighting for its life longer than any other nation on earth, the Chinese are today looking to their partners in victory to help them get back on their feet. To tell the significance and the scope of the work of the United Nations Relief and Rehabilitation Administration in China, the national broadcasting company presents Roy F. Hendrickson, Deputy Director General of UNRWA. The next voice you hear will be that of Mr. Hendrickson. We take you now to New York. On my recent extensive tour of War Shattered China, I saw at first hand scenes such as those described tonight. The officials of the Chinese government took me on a journey, and we visited towns in the south, like Guizhou, Guilin, and Hanyang, which have suffered both from battle and the scorched earth policy. For example, we landed at Hanyang, the Stalin grad of China, which the fighting reduced from 53,000 houses to only five houses. I saw thousands of refugees streaming northward from this region, disease-stricken, hunger-ridden, faced by long foot marches. Guizhou is an example of the inexhaustible recuperative powers of the Chinese people to rehabilitate their land. Patiently, painstakingly, they make use of every available resource. But after 14 years of bitter warfare, they have needs which no amount of courage and ingenuity can overcome without initial help from the outside. The destruction of the inland transport system is China's number one problem. The railroad system, not very adequate to meet the country's needs even before the war, was so decimated that the track ties were cut up and used for firewood, and the rails carried away and melted down for scrap. While we will be able to repair short sections of track in time to benefit the relief program during the period of under-operations, we are concentrating upon other means to defeat the transportation problem. Where can we send in trucks? But here again, the roads in China are in pitiful condition. We are relying principally upon coastal and river transportation. We are in the market for hundreds of tugs, landing craft and barges from the United States Army and Navy so that we can move supplies by boats or craft up the rivers. We hope that many such vessels will soon be available from surpluses in the Pacific area. Finally, we are buying aircraft which we can carry medicine, seeds and other supplies together with UNRWA personnel wherever they are needed. The need for clothing is also extremely great, and we are shipping raw cotton from the United States and from India and raw wool from Australia which we have secured against the contributions of these countries to UNRWA, of course, so that desperately needed clothing can be produced in China itself. But the textile mills depend on coal for power, and the miners require flour in order to work, so UNRWA has been sending shiploads of wheat north to Qingwan Dao for transfer to the mines. At present, UNRWA is sending about one shipload every two days in the Shanghai, consisting chiefly of food which is then distributed by the Chinese government. Moreover, UNRWA and the government working always in the closest cooperation have embarked on an ambitious reclamation program which should prove of inestimable value in increasing China's food production. This project is the shifting of the Yellow River back on its right course. The Chinese National Relief and Rehabilitation Administration is employing about 330,000 laborers for six months and preparing a new channel for the river, which turned off its true course in 1938 after the Chinese blew its dykes to check the advancing Japanese armies. UNRWA has just dispatched 17 carloads of engineering equipment and food to Kaifeng in northern Hunan province as our first step in assisting China in this mammoth project, the most important contribution which we can make to its agricultural rehabilitation. More than two million of China's fertile acres will be reclaimed. An estimated 200 million bushels of grain can be grown annually from the reclaimed land. This is an example of how UNRWA and the Chinese government are working together. Unfortunately, no amount of assistance can completely assuage China's sorrow and suffering. With our help this year to the magnificent millions of that republic, help which will represent our largest single program of aid UNRWA is seeking to indemnify in a small measure the people of China for their inspiring contributions to our common victory. You have been listening to the Pacific Story presented by the National Broadcasting Company and its affiliated independent stations to clarify events in the Pacific and to make understandable the cross currents of life in the Pacific Basin. For a reprint of this Pacific Story program, send ten cents in stamps or coin to University of California Press, Berkeley, California. The Pacific Story is written and produced by Arnold Marquess. The original musical score was composed and conducted by Thomas Paluso. The principal voice was that of Yanadir Luce. Programs in this series of particular interest to service men and women are broadcast overseas to the worldwide facilities of the Armed Forces Radio Service. This program came to you from Hollywood. This is NBC, the National Broadcasting Company.


Right guys, how are we doing?  Although I feel like he's been in there for a few years, you know Look am I gonna pretend to be an NBA fan no but I can at least Appreciate the greatness of the Greek Freak either way guys what we're gonna do today is watch his highlights until I'm impressed But prior to that we're gonna look at his little blurb here. So stay tuned and Call it an overreaction if you foolishly insist But with all the accolades and the company he now keeps after that epic run for the 2021 NBA finals Greek Freak absolutely be gone belongs on this list old heads might cringe at putting a 26 year old after only eight seasons Geez eight seasons is something else still Only eight seasons you kidding me up here over a number of worthy legends But he is in the top the top 30 players of all time, right? So yeah, I'm not quite sure yet, but Gianist But the Greek Freak Let's just call him that is a two-time regular season MVP a defensive player of the year and just turned his first finals MVP Honours after authoring arg will be the greatest performance in a closeout game. We've ever seen I didn't say it He's made five all NBA squads four times he's been named to the to one of the NBA's all defensive teams So he must be a blocking machine He's an all-star MVP was the most improved player of the year in 2017 It was named to the league 75th anniversary squad a guy this young isn't supposed to have so many accolades on his resume No, he's not Unless he's Shaquille O'Neal, especially after he entered the league as such a project From Greece, I'm lead to believe but now that he's earned his first championship Jesus Christ, how do you actually pronounce his name on? and unto Compo What's his first name again? Gianus Gianus unto Compo Antietta Compo and tit and tita Compo I'm actually gonna I gotta wait this out Nick minute. Jesus. He's got some mic'd up moments, didn't he? Oh, okay. Here we go. Here we go Look at this four years ago ESP in 1.7 million views Gianus Gianus on Antietta Compo Explains explains how to pronounce his last name. All right. Here we go I'll say with the D. So it's out there to combo But in the Greek way you say with the NT like I'm Ted to combo and Ted to combo I'll change myself like I think there's a way you guys say the last name Whatever you whatever you guys just say, you know, it's the answer to combo Gianus I take to combo Gianus I take to combo All right, let's continue now that he's doing his first championship I take to combo Has entered Rerified air sure his game has holes and bucks haters will say their run to the title wasn't the hardest who cares You can't deny how dominant of an offensive force the Greek Freakers in the paint How incredible of a defender he's worked to become and how inspiring his journey from a skinny kid in Athens To NBA superstar is to millions of basketball fans around the world Even despite losing in the second round to the Boston Celtics this season Gianus became the first NBA player in history with 200 points 100 rebounds and 50 assists in a single series geez I Suppose you don't expect someone to be 6 foot 11 giving you know dishing off assists like that He's actually become the best player in the NBA at this point few guys in the league have ever affected the game in all facets Like until a compo does even if that three-point shot forever remains a work in progress Knock us all you want, but we'll rest easy knowing a tender compo belongs here as a newly minted NBA immortal Well with that in mind guys, let's go Gianus and tender compo Highlights first video off the block.  What are we doing a bit of a post move? Oh, it's a pass. No, I ain't impressed by that No, no, no, this is 2021 2022 highlights. So it's only one season. Look at him.   I need something else. So I need I need more I need more That was a that was he didn't break the rim like Jack did. So, you know, if he had it Oh, no, that's enough that's enough for me. Thanks for watching and I'll see you in the next one


inventing our future on Tink Tech Hawaii. The subject today is geothermal. What would our kupuna do? I'm your host Richard Ha. I'll be joined by Dr. Nicole Laozi, co-founder and director of the Hawaii Groundwater and Geothermal Resource Center. Today we will review the different types of geothermal energy, current state of knowledge in Hawaii, who is talking about geothermal and other interesting topics. So Nicole, can you give us a briefing on what the different types of geothermal energy that's out there? Geothermal electricity production has different types, but the only one we know today that works to produce electricity is traditional geothermal where warm fluid is brought to the surface to turn a turbine, warm natural fluid to turn a turbine and generate electrons that go out onto the grid. There's new technologies called enhanced geothermal EGS and advanced geothermal AGS that are being looked into in different parts of the mainland U.S. and globally, but those are not yet producing electrons for electricity. Maybe you can give us a rundown on what the status of Hawaii geothermal is. In Hawaii, I say I started geothermal research about 10 years ago, and one of the things that really surprised me is how little Hawaii knows about this extent of the resource statewide. So we really, really know very little. There's one electricity producing plant in Puna, Puna geothermal venture, and we don't know for sure whether or not there's geothermal resources outside of Kilauea's East Coast Zone, which is where Puna is. There was a study published in 1985 by Don Thomas where evidence was gathered of heat on all of the main Hawaiian islands, including Kauai, the volcanically oldest, and I worked with Don on another project that was completed in about 2020. So, a few years ago, that also concluded that there may be geothermal resources statewide, and that data gathered is just basic groundwater data, so from existing water wells across the state, and then sometimes we do geophysics, but we believe that there might be geothermal resources or are likely geothermal resources out of that one location where we have proven that geothermal electricity production is viable. Yeah, you know, and this is such a current topic nowadays. Today, you know, what's going on in Israel? They're saying that in a triangle, a 700-mile triangle, maybe 50 to 65% of the water resources in the world is located there, and we have, how long are we going to be sitting over the geothermal hotspot? Kind of a long time, huh?  Like, we're not going to take away the heat from the mantle, a mantle plume that's producing heat in the Hawaiian islands by using some of that heat to generate electricity. So typically, the geothermal kind of lags behind the intermittent renewables, solar and wind, because it's expensive to discover the resource, but once it's discovered and the plant, the power plant is in place, it can continue for decades and decades as long as the plant is, or the resource is managed sustainably. Like, Lauderello and Tuscany started developing in the 1900s, early 1900s, and is still producing with expansion of their megawatt production a century later, a century plus later.  Coming out of the hole free? Yeah, yes and no. You know, we need to drill down into the resource to tap the heat, and so that's costly, but, and then in Hawaii the state owns the resource, so the developer will need to pay royalties to the state or to Department of Hawaiian Homeland, in the case of development on DHL land. But yeah, the high cost is in finding and then building the power plant, and then the price of geothermal goes down a lot. So over time, it has the lowest, what's called levelized cost versus the other renewables, because just the maintenance once the power plant is in place is low. Yeah, so I understand what you're saying. So basically, you've got to drill, and then you've got to have a pipe, how long the pipe lasts, and but basically the steam, because we're sitting over this hot spot and there's water underneath the island, the steam is coming out free, and as I understand it's going to be free a million or two years? Anyway. If the resource is managed right, so yeah, the fluid that comes up, we need to put back down, that's what you do in traditional geothermal, and there can be some complexities like certain minerals will precipitate out of the fluid that comes up due to the decrease in temperature, so that requires some maintenance that costs the money, but I understand what you're trying to say in principle to you. The heat is there, so. Yeah, you know, and relative to other places in the world, the US may not just start off with. We have a based power resource, whereas oil and all the other sources are not based power, you know, they run out and get more expensive, and take a lot of, you know, rare earth metals and minerals to maintain batteries, etc. What I'm asking is, how much of an advantage do we have for most places? Well, I think that development of more geothermal is traditional, and the traditional development sense of geothermal for electricity production is very low hanging fruit for the US. I mean, the USA, basically, there's a lot of money by the federal government being invested right now in these new technologies, so that geothermal electricity can be produced anywhere. But I try to convince the federal funding agencies that Hawaii is very low hanging fruit, because it seems that we have heat to produce using a technology that's been in place for over a century. And I think what you were getting at is that, yeah, oil and gas is considered base load, meaning consumers consumption or communities consumption of electricity changes goes up and down throughout the day. And the utility needs to make sure that the amount of electricity that they're supplying on the grid matches what a community or an island is using at that point in time. And so solar and wind don't have the advantage of matching necessarily what the island's needs are at a point in time. Geothermal can, so it can provide a steady amount of electricity that the utility can rely on 24-7. And so that's a big advantage of geothermal. Oil and gas can do that too, but it's by burning fossil fuels and emitting CO2. And then we need the fossil fuels, which have very volatile prices, right? We can't control the price of oil and gas, that largely comes from the Middle East, right? And so once we have geothermal, we can decouple that from the cost of fossil fuels. And so that we have both a steady electricity supply that's reliable at a steady price. When did you folks form the HGGRC? Was it 2016? I think it was January 1, 2015, that I, with a team of students, launched the website. And the conception of HGGRC was actually with a team of students where we had, Don Thomas and myself had several different projects going on. And we wanted to publicize the results of our projects in kind of a unified website, because the science was linked. And for example, Don was drilling on the Big Island, and we were posting daily drilling reports on a blogspot.com. And then I was feeding a lot of data that the team of students was digitizing to the federal government, but we wanted to have a local hub for that information for the local public and policymakers. And so kind of the students said, we should found a center, a research center, and put this information locally online. So HGGRC was actually founded with no money. The website was put together by passionate students and myself with no money. And I think it's been a pretty good success. I get emails from the general public that send email to hdgrc at higp.y.edu. They come straight to my inbox. And so I see that people are utilizing the information that we've posted online. Yeah, it's pretty incredible, because it's like 12 years ago. That's just like nothing. But then it's so important today, because everybody knows that we're running short of fossil fuels. And it's just a matter of time. And anyway, it's just wonderful what you folks did. It was pretty, pretty incredible. How does water fit into drilling, you know, what is the relationship there? Yeah, and actually all the methods that we use to better understand our groundwater resource will help our geothermal discovery and vice versa. So yeah, I mean, as a starting point to look for geothermal, we look at groundwater data. The second thing that we can do to better understand our groundwater or our geothermal resources is to do some surface geophysics, which kind of provides a map of the subsurface. And then to really understand the quality, so how saline or how fresh the water is, and what the temperature of the water is, we need to drill, as you've just said. And for geothermal, we need to drill fairly deep just to tap into fresh groundwater in some locations in the state. We don't have to drill very deep, but now in several locations of the state, we found deep fresh groundwater below salt water. So I really advocate that for statewide, you know, very little about our deep resources. And so more deep drilling and by deep, I mean, two to three kilometers would be very informative for the state. And a new research arena of mine is carbon storage. So injection of CO2 that's captured from the atmosphere or captured as it's being emitted into the atmosphere would be injected into the ground where it turns into rock and is permanently stored. And to do this, we also need to understand the deep subsurface environment, which we can only do through drilling. Yeah. You know, talking about the Hawaii island, we've got five volcanoes here. And the youngest one is Kilauea, of course, and it's live lava, up lava, which is, and I'm getting at risk of reward, you know, where would you go look? And monologue, you know, we just saw what happened. Monologue just erupted. It wasn't very long ago. But monocam, monocam, last erupted 4,000 years ago, I understand. Is that right? Yeah. So it's relatively safe, it would seem so. And there's still Huala Lai, as well as Goa'an, yeah. You know, staying on that track about the risk and reward. You know, if we were to explore on Maui and Borukai and Anai and Oahu and Kauai, and just get a source of base power, that would make all the islands relatively secure and secure for a very, very, very long time as energy prices rise and rare earth metals and minerals that go along with the batteries, etc. Yeah. I think, yeah, I tend to say I think understanding my ideal way to go about this would be to drill these slim holes, a lot of them. And by slim, I mean very slim. I probably have a piece of rock core, so 3 to 5 inch diameter, very deep and then understand. So invest, say, 100 million dollars in this statewide, which sounds like a lot of money, but we spend 7 billion, I believe, it's number now per year importing fossil fuels. So once we could understand where the resource looks like, we can have an informed and intelligent conversation over where we would want to develop and how big the resource is, right? We don't know that at all now. I often get asked the questions, how many megawatts is possible on Oahu? Somewhere between 0 and 500. I don't know because we have no deep wells, we have no temperature data. We can't answer that question, but I really think it's a worthy investment that's also going to, as we mentioned, tie into a better understanding of our fresh groundwater resource, which is also very precious and understanding our carbon storage potential.  And you guys have done that, and we really need to pay attention because after all, we're their ancestors. When they look back at us, they'll ask, what did you folks do? What are you just saying? Imagine 100 years from now, they'll say, oh, you guys knew all that and didn't do anything, except for Nicole folks? But that's what it is, you know. So anyway, I get on it so well. We're not actually doing anything right now because there's no funding. So I'm talking about it. We're a lot of talking about it, but some funding to actually figure out the answers to these questions would be really nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. You know, what are people talking about geothermal? What's, what's the compensation is like going around if, if I can ask you that? Yeah, you know, maybe it's just the circle that I'm working within these days. But I think most of the most, there's big interests. I mean, people are talking about hydrogen production. And if we can make hydrogen, I'm not a hydrogen expert, but then it's transportable. So we can not talk about an underwater cable anymore to link the islands, although that's a viable potential as well. But we can talk about using hydrogen to move. I think of hydrogen as a battery, so to move energy stored from island to island. Sort of we backed into needing geothermal to make the hydrogen because making hydrogen is electricity consumptive. So there's a lot of excitement that I'm feeling around geothermal right now, which might counter a fear factor that has been discussed over several decades. So Don Thomas did a lot of the exploration in the 1970s, where there was a lot of pushback rate, indigenous pushback, but not only indigenous pushback. And so there's still an element of that, I think, and a fear factor around that today. But most of my conversations are actually with Hawaiian homesteaders, so native Hawaiians and Department of Hawaiian homelands that want to better understand the resource geothermal resource potential on their land. So I'm less fearful about that this day and age. And I enjoy giving presentations to Hawaiian homes associations of Hawaiian homesteaders about potential on DHHL lands. And then the Hawaiian homesteaders talk to DHHL. DHHL has come to Don and I. And there's funding right now that's being most of the geothermal funding being discussed will go to resource discovery on DHHL lands. So I have that sense as well, you know, that there's a lot of folks that are looking at it from a scientific point of view, looking at how this is going to help the keiki when they grow up. And so the pushback that used to be even five years ago is much, much less now. Yeah. So that's a really good sign. And you know, if you were to develop, let's say on this island, you develop geothermal on Hawaiian land of the slopes of Mauna Kea. Now, several things would happen. One is you would be able to identify water because they need water because and you need water for you drilling your slip holes. And because the Hawaiian people own the resource, they don't have to pay royalties. They're paying royalties now to all the different departments. But any new discovery, they can take some of that and lower the rates of their beneficiaries and make that a commitment into the future. So it doesn't depend on whenever the next governor comes in, then it's a long-term thing and they'll have more trust. Yeah. So win win for everybody. I agree. The conversations I've given to DHHL. So we don't know for sure all the data that we have points to the presence of a geothermal resource on DHHL's largest parcel of land east of Mauna Kea. That's their largest parcel of land statewide. And I think that you would know better than me, but there's conversations around building homes there. Yes. And that's going to require both fresh brown water for the homes and then an electricity resource for the homes. And so investing in the drilling of basically to identify where is the water table? How do you do we need to pump the water up from? And what is the temperature of the water as we go down? I think is a worthy investment, even though that will be an expensive place to drill because there's not a water resource nearby. So we do need water to drill. Oh boy. That's really encouraging. Did you, any particular other thing you wanted to talk about around the geothermal subject? Well, I mean, related to my complaint, which it's no funding to try and understand the subsurface in Hawaii. Right now I do have one carbon storage project, but I was thinking maybe of mentioning the legislation that has been floated the last two years. So that would provide some funding for geothermal exploration, ideally the UH Manoa or to White State Energy Office. But I really do think the University of Hawaii here, we have like a million dollars worth of geophysical equipment and owner drill rig that can get to two kilometers. So I think UH is well poised in the HRC to perform the exploration that needs to be done. And, you know, Don and myself have led the two most recent statewide resource assessments. So anyway, the past two years, there has been legislation floated by I think the House in the first year in the Senate in the second year that we're trying to get a portion of the royalties that PGV pays to the state to the University to do some some research. Because right now none of the money that goes that is paid to royalties does anything to help expand geothermal discovery or knowledge in the state. It goes to OHA, DLNR, and Hawaii County. But I think last year, so the first year it pissed the House in the Senate was vetoed by the governor because it was going to cut the portion of royalties going to DLNR, so to the state itself. Last year it passed the House in the Senate but didn't come out of conference committee. This year, I hope that there's going to be some legislation that maybe the governor sponsors that won't cut the percentage of royalties so make the four agencies that or the three agencies that get the money kind of fight over because they're trying to get you a portion of that wedge wedge in kind of and then just sponsor that there'll be some funding dedicated to looking into like firm energy resources. Because I think even the utility has realized that solar and wind aren't going to get us to 100% renewable. We need a firm renewable energy and geothermal is the only one. Yeah, more and more people are starting to realize that this is very serious. Now who's doing the legislation? And the reason I'm asking is if there are people out there who want to support legislation like that, how would they know what's happening? How would they find out? You could email me or you could email White State Energy Office. How are you funded? How much money do you get? My position as faculty at UH Manoa is funded 82% of funded by the state. So state funding comes into the University of Hawaii but all my projects are funded through grants that I apply for and win. Oh, I see, I see. So all your staff and everybody is funded by grants and stuff that you've initiated, yeah? Is grants donations or can just be funding that comes from the state? At the moment I have a little bit of donation funding and I have a large grant to work from Department of Energy to work on carbon storage. I have very, very little funding to do anything related to geothermal, which I do come through DOE to National Renewable Energy Lab to me, but it's not funding staff. I have little staff right now do the little funding. You know, the subject is so important. It takes energy to do work, period. And then ancient Hawaiian history is all about water. So you gotta do the two things.  And that's not right. You know, I mean it's so, so, so important and nobody knows who you are because you lost weight on the chain. And then look at what you guys are doing. I mean, it's incredible. Anyway, is it fair to, you know, you hear this argument that, you know, when you do geothermal, the ground will sink and then there's all kinds of bad things are going to happen. Does that, how legitimate or scientifically based on how legitimate is that and how would that change, you know, if you move from say PGV because that's what is the question is, you know, mostly PGV to another location. Can you alleviate that kind of risk? Okay. Yeah, so traditional geothermal does bring natural fluids from the subsurface to the surface. And if there's not appropriate reinjection of the fluid, the ground can sink. PGV, the fluids re-injected and to my knowledge, subsidence sinking of the ground has not been a problem. In New Zealand, actually, that was a problem. And the developer realized that they were not sustainably managing the resource. And so I think even foreign waters was brought in to be injected to the subsurface and that fixed the subsidence problem of the ground. Most of what I've heard being complained about at PGV is the kind of rotten egg smell, which that comes from Kilauea volcano naturally, but when bringing some of the magmatic or the fluids that are associated with the southeast rift of Kilauea to the surface can bring some of that sulfur dioxide smells like the rotten eggs to the surface. But that's more of an aesthetic issue. I think that would probably not be the same, an issue of the same magnitude moving to an older volcano. So I would think that that rotten egg smell would not be as prevalent if we move off of Kilauea to a less volcanically active zone of the big islands. And again, as long as the re-injection of the fluid brought to the surface occurs, I don't expect subsidence would be a problem. You know, I was part of a group that went to the Philippines to look at the geothermal over the area. And when I came back, you know, the first thing I noticed while I was there was they were on the side of a volcano that at last erupted a hundred thousand years ago. And there was a whole bunch of energy coming out of the volcano. And what they did was they made a deal with the company to the company would develop the resource. And in 10 years time, they committed the state government there committed to buying back the whole operation with the condition that they trained everybody from the highest level person to the janitor to be local people. And when we went there was pretty amazing, you know, you look all around, yeah, well, it was all Filipinos. Yeah. Yeah. So it was quite a thing to see that. We could apply a similar model here. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. And it goes along to what would our Kupuna do? Yeah. And we are Kupuna now. No, you're not. You don't have the age. But for those of us that have done what we needed to do and we can just see what you folks are doing. It makes so much sense to put a lot of effort into this. And I myself, I think, you know, everybody should get to get behind you guys and see what we can do to help the next generation. Did you have anything that you wanted to talk about before we close up? You know, I have maybe a final comment is that I have been getting emails from groups or companies that are interested in being vocal and supportive geothermal and in supportive HGDR to kind of form an alliance of folks that do. So perhaps to anybody watching, if you haven't made a connection with myself or Sustainable Energy Hawaii, please do reach out. And, you know, I'm working kind of behind the scenes to build that alliance and organize. And so the more the merrier, I guess, you know, so. Yeah, that's terrific. It's just a last name at Hawaii.edu. I don't think it's been up there, but. Okay, well, thanks for sharing with us, you know, with everybody, what you folks have been doing. Again, I got to say, hardly anybody knows what you folks have been doing in the last 10 years by yourself with no money. You know, it's it's pretty incredible. Money for some of the time, but the money is run out. So it'd be nice to have a replenishment of money. Yes. And that was federal funds. There hasn't been much state support. So I think if one or the other we could get one or the other state funding would help demonstrate to the feds that the state really wants this. And we'd have a bigger in to get more money there too. So. Okay, well, thanks a lot. Yeah. So. This has been a tremendous educational thing for everybody. I'm sure. Thank you. Thank you.