I will share. We are recording. Just so you know. Doug, I will be going off camera for a brief portion of the meeting just to grab dinner. But I will turn my video back on when I'm done eating. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Mr. Marshall. We are recording. Amherst media is for this in the house. The attendees are coming in. 632. I do believe we're good to go. Okay. Thank you. Welcome to the Amherst planning board meeting of October 4th 2023. My name is Doug Marshall and as the chair of the Amherst planning board. I am calling this meeting to order at 633 p.m. This meeting is being recorded and is available live stream via Amherst media. Minutes are being taken. Pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 and extended by chapter 2 of the acts of 2023. This planning board meeting, including public hearings, will be conducted via remote means using the zoom platform. The zoom meeting link is accessible on the meeting agenda hosted on the town websites calendar listing for this meeting or go to the planning board web page and click on the most recent agenda, which lists the zoom link at the top of the page. No in person attendance of the public is permitted. However, every effort will be made to ensure the public can adequately access the meeting in real time via technological means. In the event we are unable to do so for reasons of economic hardship or despite best efforts, we will post an audio or video recording transcript or other comprehensive record of proceedings as soon as possible after the meeting on the town of Amherst website. Thank you. Board members, I will take a roll call. When you I call your name, unmute yourself, answer affirmatively and return to mute. We know that Bruce Coldham is absent this evening. Fred Hartwell. Fred Hartwell is present. Thank you. Jesse major. I am present. I dug Marshall and present. Janet McGowan. And Johanna Newman. I am present. And Karen winter. Present. Thank you board members. If technical issues arise, we may need to pause to fix the problem and then continue the meeting. If the discussion needs to pause, it will be noted in the minutes. Please use the raise hand function to ask a question or make a comment. I will see your request and call on you to speak. After speaking, remember to remute yourself. For the general public. The general public comment item is reserved for public comment regarding items not on tonight's agenda. Please be aware. The board will not respond to comments during general public comment period. Public comment may also be heard at other times during the meeting when deemed appropriate by the planning board chair. Please indicate you wish to make a comment by clicking the raise hand button when public comment is solicited. If you have joined the zoom meeting using a telephone, please indicate you wish to make a comment by pressing star nine on your phone. When called on, please identify yourself by stating your full name and address and put yourself back into mute when finished speaking. Residents can express their views for up to three minutes or at the discretion of the planning board chair. If a speaker does not comply with these guidelines or exceeds there a lot of time, their participation may be disconnected from the meeting. All right. So the first item on tonight's agenda are, is our minutes. And we have two sets of minutes that were distributed for review by the board. First one going in chronological order was from March 29th of 2023. I know that was a previous board and that we've had a little bit of turnover of members since then. However, I'm hoping we can approve these tonight. Does anyone on the board have any comments on these minutes that they would like to suggest changes to these? Okay. So in that case, would anybody like to make a motion to approve the minutes from March 29th as drafted by our highly capable planning board staff? Johanna. I moved to approve both sets of minutes. Oh, why don't we just do the first one first? You want to do one? Okay. Great. I moved to approve the minutes from, was it May 30th? March 29th. March 29th. I'm sorry. Okay. And Karen. I second. All right. Thank you. Thank you both. Okay. Board members, any further comments or any. Adjusted changes. Nope. All right. So we'll go through and. See who wants to approve them. Fred, we'll start with you. I want to approve. All right. Thank you, Jesse. All abstains. So it was not. All right. Janet. I guess we're kind of trapped in this loop then because we don't have enough original members from that meeting. We got to get out of. I'm going to cast my faith with Chris and Pam and say yes. Okay. Thank you. Johanna. Hi. And Karen. Hi. And I'm an eye as well. That is five minutes. In favor one abstention and one absence. All right. Now we'll go on to the second set of minutes. Which were more recent, which were from August 30th. Just a couple of meetings ago. Board members, any comments on those minutes? I think we were all part of the board at that time. Although it looks like Janet was absent on that occasion as well. Jesse, I see your hand. Just a motion to approve minutes. Okay. Thank you. I'll go ahead and second the motion. Board members, any other, any, any comments at all? No hands raised. Okay. So. Motion to approve. The August 30th minutes. Starting with Fred. I vote yes. Thank you, Fred. Jesse. I approve. Yes. Janet. I will abstain. Feelings more comfortable. Okay. Johanna. Hi. And Karen. Hi. And I'm an eye. And I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. I'm an eye. And I'm an eye as well. So we have five members in favor, one abstention and one absence. All right. Thank you all. The time now is 640. And we'll go to the second item on the agenda, which is public comment period. I typically. Read the names of public that I see in the attendance list. So I'll do that now. And while I'm doing that members of the public, if you think you are going to want to speak. For a general public comment, which will be limited to subjects, which are not later on tonight's agenda. Then please raise your hand at this time. So first person I see in roughly alphabetical order here. Amber Kano Martin. Andrew Shabbat. Arthur Haskins. Bob. Christopher Connelly. Corey M. from Pure Sky Energy. Eric Bokrock. Jacob Hirsch. Jenny Callick. Lenore Brick. Lily Bruce. Lynn Bruning. Man Jor Bahora. Maura Keen. Michael Lipinski. Renee Moss. Scott Cashion. Steve Loss. Tom Reedy. And WPC teacher. Okay, so board members of the public, do you have any comments on a, of a general nature on things that are not related to night's agenda? During my reading of that list, I did not see any hands go up. I still see no hands raised. All right, going once, twice and gone. So we will consider that there are no public comments tonight. Time now is 642. And we'll move on to item three on the agenda. So this is a planning board review. And a conversation about whether the planning board wants to make recommendations to the ZBA. Of a project that will be under the jurisdiction of the ZBA, not the planning board. So this is ZBA FY 2023 dash 18. From ASD, shoots very mass solar LLC. On shoots very roll road. A request for a special permit under section 3.340. Of the zoning bylaw to construct a 9.35. Mega watt direct current, which is 4.4 megawatt alternating current. Ground mounted solar photovoltaic array. Spanning 41 acres on a 102 acre site. With an accompanying battery storage energy system. With an accompanying battery storage energy system. The parcels of land owned by WD coals incorporated. Identified as map nine B parcels 11 and 12. And map nine D. Parcel 27. Located on shoots very road in the R zero zoning district. Frontage and access to the subject parcels of land is located on the site. And the description and documents for this project can be. Located on the town of Amherst website. I think let's see it's www Amherst mass dot gov slash three seven four one slash shoots very road solar with hyphens between those three words. And the three words. I'm going to start with the, with the first letter. Okay. So. Welcome, Mr. Reedy. Is I think I saw in the attendees, another member. Yeah, we've got a few of them, Mr. Chair. So I'd say, Cory M. If Andrew C is there. And then Steve loss. I think that's another one. And I think we've got a PowerPoint that we'll end up running through and then Steve's engineer on the project. He can answer any of the questions that you might have on a technical level. Okay. Thank you. And Chris, I know you wanted to make a brief introduction. Before Chris, before you do that, Mr. Reedy, who, who was the other person? So it should be. Cory. And then Andrew C. If he's there. Okay. That should all, yeah. And then he's lost, please. Okay. Go ahead. Okay. Yeah.  So this project is being reviewed by the zoning board of appeals under section 3.3. For a zero point zero of the zoning bylaw, which is dealing with transformer stations or other energy facilities or use the planning. The zoning board of appeals on the planning board have approved other projects under that part of the zoning bylaw. The ZBA is being asked to grant a special permit for this project. The ZBA public hearing opened in August and was continued to October 12th. The ZBA expects to hold several public hearing sessions about this project. And the zoning ZBA will be considered considering what aspects of this project may require third party review, among many other things. The planning board is being asked to review the project and make comments and recommendations to the ZBA under section 10.323 of the zoning bylaw. The planning board can ask questions and make comments about the project. And the planning board may make, may take public comments at the discretion of the chair. This is not a public hearing, but a public meeting. We'll have a quick presentation from the chair. We can now invite Tom Redi and his team to present the project. Thank you. Thank you, Chris. All right, Tom. Invitational accepted. Yeah. For the record, Tom Redi attorney with bacon Wilson out of Amherst here on behalf of ASD, Shitsbury mass solar LLC. I'm going to call them pure sky. They'll probably call themselves pure sky as well. It's a much simpler name. I'm going to call them pure sky. I'm going to call them pure sky as well. Good evening, Andrew and Corey from pure sky. And then we've got Steve loss. Chris Connelly as well from. Bird and terror, which is the, the engineering firm, the design firm for this. I think Chris gave a great background. You know, we're here to, to answer questions from the board. Hopefully you can make a recommendation for the zoning board of appeals approval of this project. We've had a lot of questions from the zoning board of appeals once back in August. We just had a site visit this week with them and we're back in front of them next week. You know, we expect this to be a process. And so, you know, we've, we've been fielding comments and questions from the different town departments, fire department, planning department, conservation department, et cetera. Compiling answers. As far as conservation goes, there was a, there was a, there was a, there was a, there was an order of resource area delineation, which essentially affixes where the resource areas are on the site. That was originally issued. I want to say in the 2020, I think maybe September of 2020. There was no tolling because of COVID. It's a three year approval. And it also on its own terms required additional work to be done. And so, you know, I'm not sure if you've heard of it, but I've actually had a wetland scientist out. Looking at those resource area flags, but we have found really no difference from that previous delineation. We are expect to submit that to the conservation commission. If not the end of this week, beginning of next week, and then that, that's its own process. As you'll see in the plans, one of the things that we're doing, which, you know, is to, to, to investigate and, um, to do this, um, pier sky is staying outside of any buffer zones associated with the resource areas. So they made the decision to say, Okay, there's a, a bordering vegetated wetland. It has the lines. There's a hundred foot buffer zone associated with that. than a sufficient distance away. Just one of the things to note as you're kind of paying attention this evening. But those are the other processes that we're currently moving through.  And so I think what I'll do is I'll turn it over to Andrew to walk you through just a little bit about Pure Sky, who they are, maybe solar a little bit generally, and then what they're looking to do on the site. By all means, stop us, ask us questions during. If you wanna wait till after, if you have more questions, Pure Sky is really knowledgeable. We've been through one round with the ZBA and like I said, town departments already. So they've been thinking about it, they continue to think about it. So feel free to ask. So with that, I'll turn it over to Andrew. Great, thank you very much, Tom. I am just going to share my screen really quickly. So spare with me one second. So I'm assuming everyone can see my screen now. Yep. Okay, thank you. So thanks to Tom for the introduction, just to kind of talk about Pure Sky a little bit. My name is Andrew Chabot, Development Director at Pure Sky, joined by core Mechanalists Development Associate. We're happy to be here. So thanks for everybody's time tonight. Really appreciate giving the chance to talk a little more about the project. I'm just gonna progress over here. So to talk a little bit about Pure Sky, we are a community solar developer. So we'll be looking to develop and construct solar and typically energy storage projects to provide clean energy to the electric grid. We're actually already active in Amherst, we're on the Hickory Ridge project site now and working closely with town officials there. So we're already active in the town and hoping to be able to move forward with another project within Amherst as well. For our projects, we typically will see our off-takers be, ranging from towns themselves to small businesses, housing authorities, individuals. So we're excited about this project and really looking forward to answering questions you have. I'm just gonna go through a few slides and go through quickly, but then I'm hoping to leave plenty of time at the end for questions. Sorry, was there a question? Yeah, Andrew, is an off-taker like a recipient? Yes, exactly. So it's somebody who will be using electricity. Thank you. Yes. We are supported by W.D. Coles. They are giving us this opportunity in addition to them conserving as working forests several thousand acres of land. They've set aside certain properties that they can also pursue as solar development to further their environmental stewardship in line with their generational business approach. So we wouldn't be here without them today. So this is one of their properties that is perfectly suited for us to be able to connect to the electric grid for where it's located. To further what Tom was mentioning, here's a quick overview of the progress to date from where we are today. I'm not gonna go through every one of these lines, but just to illustrate that we started this process in mid-2020, engaged with various town officials, had several Zoom calls with the butters, the Butter Site Walk onsite, then went to the Conservation Commission to discuss the project. And it was in those initial meetings which was really helpful. We did learn that there was some additional work that needed to be done in terms of some studies. So we went through the application to be able to have sufficient time to do those studies, which did also result in a project redesign where, as Tom mentioned, we are moving completely out of the wetland buffer zone. We kind of, instead of using the existing logging road, kind of are moving into the sides, we're staying out of buffer zones entirely, which did result in the project decreasing somewhat, but we're happy to do it for a better project. Continuing on, we did additional work, did some more site walks. We had a pre-application meeting with the town, did a water quality report on the local drinking well water in the area. And then in submitting our application to the planning department, there were some additional studies that were requested we carry out, which we did. And then submitted our application and was deemed complete in June of this year. And going through the initial ZBA meeting is what brings us here to see you all today. So to kind of step back from that, why we're pursuing this work at all, one of the little-known facts is that on the electric grid, about half of the energy we use today is fired by natural gas on average. That's using ISO New England data for the general region. And when you look at Massachusetts, it's about closer to 80%. The state has set a goal of reaching 40% renewable energy by the year 2030, and we're currently at 12%. So with the time provided, we're very much hoping that this project could be given the approval so we could help the state meet those goals and transition away from that natural gas generation. Some of the benefits of a project like this is that in addition to providing that clean energy over the 35 or 40 year expected lifetime, there is carbon sequestration benefit there that you receive from not having to get electricity from a fossil fuel source like natural gas. So the equivalent of that using EPA calculators shows that it would be the equivalent carbon sequestration as if you had planted 5,100 acres or so of forest for locking in that carbon, from the carbon you're avoiding from that fossil fuel facility. In addition, the energy that this will generate will power about 1,500 Massachusetts homes on average annually. So I think this could be a really strong project for the community. And one of the things we're looking to move forward with on the project itself is that we're going to be having a pollinator meadow underneath that array that won't use herbicide at all. It will be using native vegetation to help support species that are at greatest conservation risk in the state. These are typically areas that can be very minimally maintained due to their native vegetation behavior and the nature of that. So we usually only have to get out there maybe once a year to trim back some vegetation that might be shading some panels just to make sure that the efficiency is still up and going. And not to mention, I mean, these typically look much better than what you might see in other facilities that just sort of leave the ground bare. So we're hoping that can provide additional ecological benefit in addition to the clean energy that the product pool will generate. The town specifically will receive tax payments from the facility without having to, this facility be a burden on the town and it won't be taking water resources or sending anybody to use the town resources anyway. It's gonna provide that clean energy I mentioned onto the grid and some local ecosystem diversity. In addition, we're looking to try to make this a optimal opportunity for a research partnership to be able to stay long-term effects of a facility such as this while also giving the land some relief of the soil fatigue it's experiencing. To speak specifically about the project, here's a high-level image of the proposed project now.  If you can see my mouse, the way it's laid out is this is the access road coming in from the west using this existing logging road that's already there coming down and then hitting the first basin for stormwater features right where I'm hovering now. Then this kind of gray line moving diagonally is vegetative screening that is set up to provide in addition to the forest that will be left intact in this green area to the north and west of that be able to provide additional screening for any of butters so that no one will have to see the facility in the woods there. The access road then continues and this is where we pushed it out of that existing footprint where it was originally within the wetland buffer looping down the south where you hit the second stormwater basin before then going to the east which is where the equipment pad will sit which is where the energy storage, power electronics, the inverter will live and then we'll continue on until it turns into this compressed more footpath type access point to get to that basin three over there. One thing I will note is that from some preliminary feedback since our initial submission there will be a few things that we're aiming to just tweak based on feedback from the fire department. One is a turnaround area that will be before the equipment pad probably about where I'm hovering right now but I don't want to get told no by Stephen Chris but that's kind of where we're working on right now to fine tune that. And then most likely instead of cutting this area where I'm hovering leave that area as vegetation so it can provide connectivity between the wetland and this other wetland here. So we're actually making some of these further tweaks based on that feedback and this facility, the sizing is about 9.35 megawatts DC which is the equivalent of powering up 1500 homes as I mentioned earlier on a footprint of about 41 acres or so of land. So one of the things that's common and which will be provided for this facility is a decommissioning agreement and bond so that at the end of its useful life it will be removed entirely that's standard and something that's a good protection just to have. With that, I am going to pause and turn it over to Corey to speak a little bit more about some more of the project details. So Corey just let me know when you want me to progress the slides here. Yeah, thank you so much Andrew. Can everybody hear me okay? Yep, yes. Okay, great. Thank you again so much for having us tonight and thank you Andrew for the introduction to the project. So Andrew had mentioned side design considerations and one thing that we do consider is distance to nearby butters and folks living in somewhat close proximity to the site. I believe some of those folks are in the meeting tonight but we wanted to showcase, these are quite far away from everybody's property along Shrewsbury Road and I do apologize. I can't see any faces because the PowerPoint screen is taking up most of the room on the screen here but if anybody has any questions as I go along please hit the question raise hand button down at the bottom. That way I'll see your question pop up and I can address it but yeah, so we just wanted to insert this slide on how close is this array to folks nearby along Shrewsbury Road. One quick question before we talk about this is everybody on the board familiar where this property is located along Shrewsbury Road and then where that elbow where the road goes to the northeast, there is an existing logging road from Coles and it goes into the back of the site. So just hoping, I just wanna make sure that everybody knows the general area of where we're talking about. Yeah, Corey, I think it's safe to assume we all are familiar with the general area. We may not be intimately familiar with that with Shrewsbury Road but we know where it is in town and roughly how to get there. Okay, great, excellent. Yeah, so it is off of Shrewsbury Road and we are going to take advantage of Coles existing logging road as the primary access road. The distance from the closest of letters property line to our limit of disturbance and here we define the limit of disturbance as the project boundaries. So where any sort of grading or equipment would be installed anything beyond the fence line and for here it's just where Andrew had pointed out where that line of vegetation is. Andrew, if you could hover over there. Yeah, so that is an example of what is the limit of disturbance. So the closest one is over 200 feet from the closest neighbor from their, from a home from any, you know, on a butter's home is about 245 feet and then from the, you know, from the edge of the solar panels to like the closest neighbor's property line is, you know, 274 feet and then to the equipment pad is from the property line to our equipment pad is over 800 feet. So we did want to take this into consideration and try and move everything as far back into the site as we could. Below here we did see some vegetative screening details. We originally proposed Arbor Vitey. We did get some feedback from the ZBA last month that they would prefer something more native to the area. So we will be changing that to Holly. And yeah, so we, and if you look on the screen here, those green squares, I believe those are the homes. Is that right, Steve? And this is Steve Floss. He's the head engineer with Bird and Tara and Steve and Chris Connolly, they've been helping us with all the site plan and engineering work. Yes, the green objects are the homes and those properties are estimated off aerial imagery. All right. I do see a hand from a board member.  We can go ahead and answer questions as we go along. We just wanted to be respectful of the time. Okay, Corey, then Janet, you have a question. Thank you.  Cause I had heard there was an interim in this at the entrance is an intermittent stream. And so is the concom going to move your road or are you going to make adjustments based on that? Corey, if you don't mind. So there's been no determination by the conservation commission yet. Janet, is that any resource area at the roadway? If you've been up there, you see that there's a culvert under the coals access driveway, which collects water from Shootsbury Road, right? So it's all that sheet flow that's coming down, falling into something like a rip-wrapped swale getting culverted under that existing access driveway and continuing to head down gradient. So it has not been categorized as a wetland at this point, if it is, there's an existing access road there currently. And so we would, for that piece of the project, if it is determined to be a resource area and we're keeping the road where it is because there's an existing access driveway, we would have to go through the conservation commission in a notice of intent for that limited area of access. So just I wanna be careful about the classification of it as an intermittent stream, which hasn't been done yet, and if it is, then it's not like it's in the middle of a field and you've got running water all the time. It literally is a drainage structure that takes sheet flow off of Shootsbury Road. But this, so this is the proposed access. So that hasn't been delineated yet or determined by the conservation commission. So that was our wetland scientists didn't think it was a resource area and a butter thought that it might have been and had it delineated. But as to our understanding, there has been no formal delineation of that resource area on the abutters property, which would impact this project. Okay. That's a complicated answer, but I think I understand. Thank you, Janet.  Okay, great. Let's go on to the next slide, Andrew. Okay, great. So I'm sure there will be a lot of questions about this slide in which we're happy to answer. It is a fairly large project. And speaking with the staff, primarily the ZBA staff, we've been told that this is one of the largest projects that has gone across their desks in the town of Amherst. So we understand the scrutiny that it's come under and we welcome it. We wanna make sure that we have a really great site plan and project. So what we have supplied to the ZBA and the staff has been a phasing plan and that includes the construction of the site. And so all sort of site preparation, site construction, equipment installation, that has all been addressed in this phasing plan. It is a large site at a little over 41 acres. It is treed. Those trees, they will come down, but we wanna make sure that we're doing it responsibly. And if it were up to us, we wouldn't clear any trees. However, we're stuck with very high criteria of siding and where we can and cannot develop projects. Part of that is the smart rules and regulations which are issued by the DOER with the state. Part of it is also with the infrastructure from National Grid and Eversource, where we can go to find power lines that will allow for us to hook up projects like this to the grid and start passing on, generating electricity to the grid. So it is a large site and it will require tree clearing. So we wanna make sure that we're doing this as responsibly as possible. Part of that will include the spacing plan. And so we have designed it per all state and town of Amherst rules and regulations. Our first pass at it has been reviewed by the concom and we have received comments back in the form of the transmittal. It was a very lengthy transmittal with a lot of different comments and a lot of really great ideas. And so we have been working with staff to end Aaron Jake with the concom. I'm not sure if she's on tonight, but we've been working with her to amend parts of the plan that we had sent in and reviewed back in August. And so we just wanna make it very clear what it includes. And so we are not proposing that go out and clear 41 acres in one fell scoop. We wanna do this responsibly. So we're going through it in 10 acre increments. It will include erosion and sediment control measures and perimeter measures to make sure that, nothing, once the trees are cleared, and also they will not be stumped and nothing will be grubbed or the low line vegetation won't be removed unless it is for ESC and perimeter controls. But those stumps will be staying in the ground and the trees will be cleared in increments of 10 acres. And they will also be identified. The workspace will be identified before we go in. And that is to make sure that, we have the 10 acres outlined and delineated as well as all of the natural resources. So you will see that there are several wetlands that we will be going around. And so we wanna make sure that those wetland areas are identified, the buffer zones are identified, and then the limits of disturbance are identified. So we don't inadvertently have any sort of washout or anything impacting those very sensitive natural resource areas. So, so- Yeah, great. Just to add, I think that it's important to note that the way we characterize the way the project will move forward is, I lump it into three phases for conceptual ease. One is what Corey just mentioned, the pre-construction phase, which helps to remove the trees and lay them down to be there and selectively removed in those phases that are usually 10 acres or less at a time. Then moving on to the A phase, which is, as you can see on the screen here, moving from phase one, which is doing the stomping and grubbing stabilization, getting confirmation from the town that that's occurred and that's totally fine. And then once that's approved, moving on to the next phase and then going through phase two, three, four, five. And then as we're kind of going through the site, once we get to phase three during the A phase, kind of following behind with the B phase where we actually start to do actual project construction where we're putting some piles into the ground, the modules and such. So that's kind of how it's planned out since from the collaboration with, we've kind of had with ConCon to date. So I just wanted to quickly add that. So Corey, do you want me to go to the next slide? I think we're here. Sure, yeah. And Lestuck, do you see any raised hands? Otherwise we can keep moving on. I do not. I guess I have a question that I can ask now or later. And that is if you're, I guess the benefit that you're assuming comes from phasing is that you do a section of removal and site preparation and then you pause long enough to see whether that act has detrimental effects downstream or are you pausing long enough to let new plant growth establish itself so that the runoff is minimized or what is the purpose of phasing if there's not a pause in between to take stock? That's a great question. I can take first black at it and then I might turn it over to Stephen Chris to provide maybe more of the technical details. But as you described, it's the benefit is to, so you're not doing the entire site all at one time, you're doing in more manageable chunks, making sure that that area is stabilized before moving on to the next area and it's more manageable to make sure that you don't have to deal with any sort of site-wide issues at the same time. You can focus on this 10 acre or less area, make sure it's established, make sure vegetation has started to take hold. And then that provides pretty strong stormwater mitigation and erosion control. And then once that's confirmed by the town, then moving on to the next area with an understanding that that prior phase is most likely fairly safe and it won't be experiencing any erosion with continual checks along the way throughout the project process. So how long is like, how many weeks or months between phases? Yeah, so each phase and I, our rule of thumb is for the A phase, it's can range between 10 and 30 days for each phase to kind of be completion. And it does vary because it's quite literally watching the grass grow on site. And so it can be a little faster, it could be towards 30 days and then it's verified and then we kind of move on. For the construction phase, each phase is a little quicker. It's a little bit more in control. And that's usually around like 10 to 20 days, working days each phase. And it's also important to keep in mind that we have a lot of temporary erosion and sediment control measures that we can implement. It's just a fancy way of saying, we can use straw bales, sill fences, wood chips. So a lot of those trees that we're clearing will chip a lot of them and we'll use those on the same site to as a temporary means of making sure that the soil stays where it needs to. Okay, thank you. So I do see one other hand. Janet, you have a question? You know, I did, I actually have another question because I'm not, sort of a long Doug's line. So you have five phases there and it's about a month for cutting down the trees on phase one, putting up your straw bales and everything like that. And then planting grass, waiting till it grows. And then you cut down another 10 acres and do that over like, and that takes a month each phase. Is that what you just said? The way that will work is the tree removal is actually in the pre-construction phase. So what will happen is the trees will be cut down and laid and the stumps will, and all the grubs will just remain in place. And then as we're going through, then we kind of go to phase A where then stumps are removed, grubbing happens. And so if you can see what we've listed under here, phases one A to five A, that's sort of when that stump removal will occur and the stabilization of each process of each phase will happen. Okay, so you're going to cut all the trees down and then start, that's pre-construction phase, not phase one, but that's A phase. And then you start grubbing, which is pulling out all the roots of the trees and chipping them and when you're doing that is when you put the barriers in the silt fences. Do you do that after you cut the trees? So when we're cutting the trees, we will first cut the trees and then we'll go through and install the temporary erosion and sediment control features. One of that is also installing all perimeter controls. So that'll be the first thing that's done before getting to stumping and grubbing. Okay, so I assume perimeter controls is another word for fence, but I might be wrong. Okay, and so the question I sort of get that, the question I was going to ask you if you can go back to the thing is can you tell me how water moves across this site? Cause I see a lot of wetlands, there's intermittent streams and bordering vegetative wetlands. There's two streams or Brooks. And so like where does water go? Where does it start and where does it go? If you can just do it general, just you also see different slopes. Sure, I think that's a perfect answer for Steve or Chris if you wanna maybe talk about the water flow. I know that the land generally slopes from Northwest down to Southeast, but there are some variations in wetlands that were made on site. So I'll just let one of you take that. Maybe the cursor, that little thing. Yeah, this is Steve. It's hard to see under the panels I'm gonna be looking at my CAD on my computer to give you that answer. Steve, do you want me to unshare so you can share your screen? I don't know that we'll have to. Let me just get my contours on here. Opening up a CAD file here and now. Yeah, while we're waiting for Steve to get that open, I think the only stream where the water is moving is that cold Adams Brook to the east of our site, Andrew. And then the rest of the wetlands are, those are not streams or creeks. They won't be flowing into any other tributaries or anything like that. It's really just that cold Adams Brook that is flowing to the east. And we are maintaining a 200 foot buffer from there. Corrie, do you mean where on the plan that we're looking at is the brook? So where I'm interested now is to the east is this. Okay, so it's off the property off to the east. Right, and what Corrie is referring to is that this little kind of indentation here, because you can kind of see it a little kind of indent. That's the 200 foot boundary of the setback from that rock. So I think to answer Janice's question is the other wetlands, they won't be flowing into any other wetland areas. And for rainfall that is hitting the rest of the site, any sort of, you know, any sort of rainfall that we have is already accounted and designed for with, you know, stormwater measurement features and erosion and sediment control features that Steve and Chris have, that they have baked into their site plans and designed for. So Steve, do you happen to have that pulled up? Yeah, I'm ready to discuss here. Thank you. Sure. So starting from the top phase to the light site, and these contours are all coming, you know, water's coming from the north, sheet flowing toward your wetlands and streams are going to be your low areas, obviously. Steve, before we go any further, which direction is north on this plan? Directly up. Okay, thank you. Sure. So your water's coming down into this centrally located wetland area, which, you know, all the way area there around it is undisturbed. I can barely see that, but is there a way to focus just on the map and not the text? Okay, we got it. Thank you. Okay. So to the west of the wetland area, all that area is coming down and toward this stream over here. Okay. Just a minute. We cannot see anything on your screen. We can't see any, there's no arrow. Andrew, if you can follow, if you're able to move your cursor according to what Steve is saying, great. Otherwise, maybe we need to switch who's screen. Yeah, I think. I've requested control. I didn't realize I didn't. I didn't have that. So are you able to see my cursor move now? No, not yet. We're still seeing Andrew's screen. Yeah. So, so my, but it should be my. Nope. Okay. So I'm not moving my cursor. That's, that's Steve's. Okay. Good. All right. That's, I'm sure that'll be better for everyone. So yes, coming down from the north. Okay. The drainage is coming right into this, the central area here. As you come over here, some of this is going there and the rest of it is going to come down. Everything's pretty straight. Down. So there's a wet land and then the stream offsite here. This area coming down in this direction down toward this corner. That's why these orange areas are going to be basins. They're going to come down towards that section. As you come over here, it's kind of a ridge that comes through here. So you'll have some of this area going up to the northeast toward this wet land area. Kind of a ridge that kinds, maybe kind of comes through here. The rest of this comes down. You can see this stream here and kind of see a little bit of a valley. It comes down here and then over. Another basin that we're proposing right here. So. And the rest of this side. Hell from the ridge. Like I said, some is going up, up this direction. But most of it. From here is going to come down straight across all this topography and down. Okay, and the rest of this down south is coming just in the southern direction and a little bit of a ridge here kicking over toward the stream and wetland over here and the other side pretty much going down this way in the southeast toward everything obviously getting over to the stream over here. All right. Thank you, Steve. All right. So Andrew and Corey, maybe you can give the cursor back to one of you and continue with your slides. Thank you. So I can go to the next slide now. So, and Andrew, before you go further, I guess I was just going to say that this slide, the way you've structured the way we're talking about this. It feels a little bit confusing because you've got multiple uses of the word phase.  Well, maybe it's step a during phase one. Mm hmm. So I think you might want to refine that for later meetings. That's helpful. Thank you. We can certainly do that. And so just to continue on. We have this proposed energy storage of the power centipede modular stack. That is effectively the energy storage that we were looking to use on site. That will be located on the equipment pad. It is unlike some of the containerized solutions you've seen it's a little bit more easier to get more granular with this product because the smart program requires us to have storage paired with solar facilities. One of the ones that has been selected. We've used other sites very reliable and we are working closely with the fire department just to make sure that they have everything they need to make sure that they can respond. If there's ever a need to go on site, which is not expected for the for the facility and one of the transmittals we received as well. Moving on to the actual construction phase. One is kind of conclude this we can get more to the questions side. The construction, you know, optimistically assuming that there's a permit granted the end of this year. We're aiming to go through a process that will take many months to get through till we get to construction up until mechanical completion. So at the earliest, the very earliest, we wouldn't expect to do any sort of construction on the site until, you know, seven or eight even eight months after a permit is granted because we have to work to get through procurement, make sure we do final issued for construction permit designs based on these final approved designs and then go through the process doing civil work on site, mechanical work and electrical until we do reach that mechanical completion event. We would make sure that, you know, per this entire process that, you know, there are this constant monitoring, making sure that any sort of rain event there'd be someone going out there to check on the site to make sure there's been no erosion at all to correct that if there is any that's starting to be seen and as well to just, you know, provide, you know, progress on site. The long-term operations and maintenance of the project is pretty minimal. It's a facility that basically sits there fairly inert and it's really only once a year we have to have somebody come on site to look at the site, you know, make sure that the vegetation isn't overgrowing any of the panels, making sure that storm art features are clear. There's nothing that's in there. And then just making sure that the actual pollinator meadow is still flourishing as we hope that we'll do. Stormwater features is pretty, you know, probably the primary reason to get out there just to check on those along with the vegetation management. So with that, that concludes our presentation when a little longer than I promised, but we'd love to answer any of your questions. So I can, yeah, pause there. I guess, Johanna, go ahead. I've got a question. I'll follow you. Sounds good. Thanks, Doug. You answered a lot of my questions about native habitat. I have, I guess, here are my questions. Have you considered fencing that allows for some habitat continuity for some species? Number two, are there any economies of scale that can be one on the Hickory Ridge project as this moves forward? And what would that mean for Amherst residents? And then I know that there are interconnection delays in terms of integrating onto the grid, even in preferred areas. So I was hoping you could give a little bit of an update on that. And then my last question is, why do you call it natural gas when it's mostly methane? Great questions. I will kick through those and Corey, please let me know if I'm off with anything. So starting in reverse, you're right. I mean, it is methane. It's not natural gas. The common parlance is natural gas. But yes, it's just from the ground. We burn it. Even in these facilities that burn it, it's less than 50% efficient most times. So half of that gas is actually just burned for no reason. And for the electrons that it generates. And then you have the carbon that's offset from there. So that more accurately it is methane. That is correct. To speak to the interconnection delays, again, spot on one of the biggest problems we're facing in the state right now is that the electric grid is almost completely congested. And the state is actually proactively trying to address this now. It's required through legislation that the Department of Public Utilities review and approve submissions put forward by the investor utilities that national grid and ever source for statewide electrical system upgrades, which will be billions of dollars. This is actually what my wife works on. So we were pretty boring dinner guests. This is all we talk about is energy. But keep each other company, I guess. So, but that is not expected to really have any sort of relief for the grid until at the earliest 2028 when they start to upgrade existing substations before they start building new substations to free up more opportunity for land. So with this project, we've actually already gone through the study with ever source. We've gotten our interconnection service agreement, which is required. We've made some of those initial payments. And from ever sources point of view, we're essentially good to go and they're ready to upgrade the associated feeder line for the projects and the substation to allow us to connect. So that is ongoing getting to the Hickory Ridge question. Yes. So that project is actually looking to hopefully begin construction in the coming months. And the way it's set up is that the procurement is a little offset for when we would hope to procure for this project. So right now, there may be some economies of scale for, you know, energy generated, but for actual construction, it's a little misaligned, which is, which is too bad. Otherwise we definitely would have leaned into that to try to to see what we could do to pass that some benefits onto the local community there. And then the last question about fencing. Yeah. So I neglected to mention, sorry, is that the fencing across the entirety of the site will have a six or so inch gap underneath to allow for, you know, small animals to be able to traverse through the site to allow them to kind of move throughout the site outside. It'll be grassland. So there'll be, I think plenty of things of food and interest for them in there and allow them to kind of get between different wetlands and such and forced areas. Okay. Thank you, Andrew. And thanks, Johanna for those questions. I had one question and then we'll go to Jesse. When I look at the site plan, I'm a little bit surprised that the access road for the fire department stops what looks like about two thirds of the way down toward the southeast. And if I were the fire department, should I, should I be the fire department? Yes, I wonder why I don't have access all the way down to your lower right hand corner and whether, whether that is really okay not to have that. That's, that's a good one that effectively if, and I certainly won't try to speak for the fire department, but my understanding of what the fire department cares about is really what's on that equipment pad. And so what's on that equipment pad are some of the power electronics that really are where the fire risk. There's also the energy storage there, which is also primary concern is to make sure that is, they're able to reach that. One of the pieces of feedback that we have received from, from them is to, you know, make sure that there's a turnaround area for that, for a truck, if it needs to, you know, get there, you know, and not pass by the equipment pad. If there's anything going on, on that pad, so it'll actually be before the equipment pad that it's not present here, but it will make some of those, you know, updates, but it will be somewhere where the truck can turn around before getting that pad. Sorry, Doug, I just wanted to also make it clear that they have seen this plan as is, and we have, that was that and adding access for around the array for pedestrian access for, for the fire department or emergency response services. So there will be gates where they can get in and out around the rest of the array, but they have seen this, these plans and that wasn't one of the things that they had asked for was to extend the road. And you will not need a maintenance roadway, for instance, since you'll just go between rows of panels. Exactly. Yes. Okay. All right, we'll go to Jesse next. Thanks. Perhaps this came up with a conservation commission. I'm just wondering, do you have projects of similar size in point two that have sort of wetlands surrounded almost entirely. That you know the before and after they're still thriving with this kind of layout. Sure. We have projects that have been next to wetlands. I think that, you know, in terms of store water flow, that's the primary concern when it comes to wetlands and erosion. I think Steve or Chris, if you want to talk specifically about, you know, anything regarding that and kind of the protections in place to make sure that wetlands are not encroached upon making sure that there's no erosion to wetlands. I think that would be a pretty good thing to dive into specifically because that's certainly a primary area we're working with and trying to make better. I guess I'm thinking more of like, okay, two years after it's built, there's still as many species there that were there before. Has that been studied at all? Is that a factor you think about? Oh, for a species on the site. I mean, our hope is that in transitioning this, this land to this pollinator meadow we're hoping for, it will actually create more diversity for different plants and animals to thrive in this area that the region doesn't have. The entirety of surrounding area, I don't have to tell you this, Google Maps is all wooded. So there will be all the species that are there here on the site will, you know, just still be there just to kind of outside, you know, this kind of immediate area, some within, I'm sure. And the idea is that this will have that benefit of some diversity for that ecosystem for grassland, much like it was in Massachusetts a couple hundred years ago. This is all farmland, for example. Yeah, Andrew, I think that they're, oh, sorry, Andrew, I think there's actually a slide further down showcasing the threatened and endangered birds that have similar sort of habitat, that have habitat similar to the kind that we're proposing to plan. This is where you had my question. Yeah. So I'm not saying that these are the birds that will move in. And I don't know that we have studied the consequences of species settling in on any of our other projects, but we are creating a habitat where they, you know, similar to the ones where birds like this would thrive. Okay. Janet, it looks like you're next. Janet, you are muted. I have actually have so many questions. I think Jesse's question was, does the wetland operate as well after, as it did before, do you go back and say, oh, you know, we put all these panels near the wetland, there's a big buffer zone. There's still as many animals and plants that were there before, not, you know, we understand that grassland would have different species than forest land. So I think that that was his question. But so my question is, or my questions is, this is, you know, I've been working on the solar bylaw, the draft solar bylaw. And this area, part of the, your lot has a local rare species habitat for a locally rare species. It's also core habitat and critical habitat under the state, the state's designations. And so in our current version of the draft bylaw, you couldn't put a solar, you couldn't put a solar array there because of the importance of this land. And so I, you know, one of my recommendations is to do a plant and wildlife study of what's there to make sure we're not hurting something that is threatened or rare or the importance, seeing the importance of that, like what's there? Because it's not just five acres, it's 40 acres. And, you know, it's a much bigger site. And so that I think is an important, my recommendation to the ZBA would be to hire someone to do that kind of assessment. And you clearly have time because of all the issues and delays and, you know, all the length of this thing. I know that a lot of the people, all the people around you are on private wells and they have come to our solar bylaw working group for almost more than a year now. They're kind of our loyal, loyal attendees. And they're very concerned about potential app impacts to the private wells because they're on well water and if that disappears, it goes away. And so I'd be really interested in hearing more. When I ask that question, like, where does the water go? You know, when I look at this site, I see a complicated system of water and wetlands and trees. And I don't know what's happening underground and what's feeding their wells. And so I think that would be a question for me is just someone understanding the water resource area, where does groundwater go? And then the other, so that's an issue. We have our Amherst Water Supply Protection Committee has a white paper about solar bylaws and their impacts. And they have a whole series of recommendations for ways to protect water sources and doing test pits and all sorts of things. And I wonder if you've looked at that and could take on the additional requirements and the sort of testing that they're seeing when you're dealing with water resources that affect water supply. That's kind of a, that's kind of like a, the things I'm worrying about. Specifically in terms of questions, I was, I have very specific questions about do you have an idea of how many trees you think you'll be cutting down? And also how close is the battery storage facility to trees? Because I think we're recommending 100 feet from trees. And we know the battery storage, we know, I mean, either you don't know, but if you read the paper, batteries lithium ion batteries are very volatile. It's part of my husband's business. They are very volatile and they go on fire. And I know there's, it's kind of a learning and manufacturers are working on how to contain those fires. But the recommendation I think from the fire department from our committee is going to be at least 100 feet from trees, you know, because of wind and things like that. And so do you have an idea of how many trees will be cut? And then how far is the battery system trees? And is there actually a way of locating the battery system more inside the panel? So it's really near enough. So one thing I will mention is that there has been a natural resource inventory study done on the habitat for, for the site. It has been included with the ZBA packet and those materials are available, as well as for the drinking well factor. We've also engaged with a hydrologist to do a study that found that there would be no impact to drinking wells in the area, which is also available to the ZBA. For the tree count, I know it's 41 acres. I don't know that we've done a count of every tree on the site. And for the distance from the limit of disturbance for the batteries, I'll turn that over to Steve. If you want to give them an exact measurement of where that's currently sits. Before you go on, I'm not exactly asking how many trees, but you must have some sense of how many will be cut. How many trees on site? All parts, you know, figure. I apologize. I couldn't venture a gas. I wouldn't want to steer you wrong. We are partnering with the timbering company so we can easily get you those answers or at least a general estimate. And what was the distance you're looking for from the, from the battery area to what? To trees. Not the pad, but the, the mechanicals, the batteries themselves. I don't have the exact battery locations on my drawing, but the edge of the, the bottom edge of the pad is 110 feet from, but will be 110 feet from a tree die. Okay, good. All right. Thank you, Janet. And now we'll go to Karen. Karen, we can you speak up or we can't hear you. Now you're muted. You were not muted before. Try it again. Unmute again. Now speak. You, you're muted now. Click it one more time and then try again to speak. Oh, you're not coming through. No. No. Yeah, we can't hear you. Has something changed with your machine and or the speaker? Did you inadvertently mute the microphone on the laptop or something? You are, you are muted from our point of view. Maybe she could call in. Maybe. Yeah. No, we're not hearing you. Okay.  It's a new hand. I was, I was going to hope to go after Karen. We're going to have to have Karen see what she can do. Okay. It looks like maybe she left the meeting and maybe she'll come back in. I still see her here. All right. No, Karen, we still can't hear you. No. So Janet, why don't you go ahead and ask your question and we'll check in with Karen in a minute. Okay. So one of the things I've been doing as part of my solar bylaw working group, I've been calling planning directors, you know, from different towns that have had a raise and also, you know, adopted bylaws. And one of the problems almost everybody cited was. Like when, you know, like having implementation because they're often small towns with small staffs. And there's the plan and then there's what the, how it's built and those often don't match. And so I was going to recommend that the ZBA hire a consultant as a construction monitor, which I think is also going to be a, I mean, I know it's a recommendation of some people on my group. But I also wondered like what's going on at Hickory Ridge, because I understand that the implementation of the natural heritage program permit did not, was not being followed this summer. And then the project was shut down because of that.  And then someone recently sent pictures. I don't know if you've seen them over the weekend of, you know, all these flood control barriers and stuff that were breached by the rain over the weekend. And so my recommendation, you know, is not just to look at the site, you know, occasionally or once a year, but to make sure it's, it's working and to, you know, constantly monitor after major rains, which I think would be a wetlands permit requirement also of the town. So if you could just talk about Hickory Ridge and what's, what has happened and mistakes made and corrections made and what you've learned from that, because, you know, you have a few projects or at least your, your project company has some, some bad, you know, the Williamsburg thing was sort of a complete disaster. And I know the neighbors have raised this issue over and over again. And I'd be really good to hear exactly what has gone on and how you've remudied it. Well, I think I'll, I'll maybe turn that over to attorney Reedy. I will very much emphasize that we are not associated with the Williamsburg projects. I, that was an unfortunate circumstance with the erosion on that project, which was very, very terrible. But no, we are absolutely not associated with that project and certainly looking to build projects as safely as we can. But I'll turn it over to Tom for a paper, you're rich questions. Yeah. No, and I think, I think the point Andrew made is probably the biggest point of misinformation out there and whatever sort of characterization. Folks want to try to tie pure sky to Williamsburg. There's just, there's no tie is the contractor who is working on the Hickory Ridge project. The same contractor that worked at Williamsburg. Yes. But pierce guy had no relationship with that contractor in Williamsburg. And as everybody can appreciate the stories a little bit more involved than just, you know, what's your read as. Okay. Dynamic who's the contractor. Did something or didn't do something and then Williamsburg happened, right? So. I'd like to kind of bring focus back to the project that's in front of the planning board, which is technically in front of the zoning board of appeals. Right. Yeah. You know, I talked to the folks over at pure sky about. This past weekend at Hickory and, you know, they've been talking to the conservation commission to Aaron, particularly in just working through it with them. I think the, the location of the trailer and the generator, right? Now they know it doesn't go in that location. And so they're going to move it, but. You know, I just want to be sensitive to not dwelling on. I mean, Hickory is what. It's right along the Fort River. We have had an inordinate amount of rain this summer. I mean, I forget how much we've had, but it's certainly multiple times more than we've usually had. And this is the first instance of something at Hickory range, but I just, you know, through the chair, maybe want to move to. This project on this lot in North Amherst, just so that we can start to ferret out anything for the zoning board of appeals, you know, on this project. Right. Thanks, Tom. Well, I do think that that is appropriate that we focus on. Hickory on. On the shoots for a road project. But I think you, you, you all on the applicant team need to be aware that there is where certainly it's easy to associate mishaps on other projects, particularly other projects in town with, with you as a, as a team and, you know, more broadly as an industry. So, you know, don't make it too easy for people. You know, or be careful when you do. No, and we hear, and we hear you, Mr. Chair, I'm not trying to skirt it. I just want to, you know, we've got limited time. We want to focus on that. If this McGowan wants to talk it, I'm happy to talk about it offline with her, you know, set her up with pure sky if she wants to talk to them. Right. I'd actually like to ask a follow up question if I could. I feel like the question wasn't answered. Well, okay. So, so. Janet, you just click hit the mute. Sorry. It's a, it's a bad night. So you're working with dynamic energy. That was part of the. Yeah. The extreme difficulties at Williamsburg. You're working with pure skies, working with dynamic energy at Hickory Ridge. There have been problems with the natural heritage program that stopped the work because the order wasn't followed. Can someone just say, yes, that was a problem and we fixed it.  And we have an ongoing project with the same. Actor. Actors and with problems. And I think, you know, if I was a person in that neighborhood, if I'm just a resident of Amherst, I'd like to know people, what are the problems? Where they fixed. And what, you know, I don't know what it seems like it's sort of evading the Hickory Ridge. Problem with the natural heritage program. Yeah, so through the chair, I mean, frankly, I don't know about it and we can find out and I'm not trying to hide anything. I just, I can't even tell you, yes, there was an issue. No, there wasn't an issue. And if there was an issue, here's the issue. Who here's who didn't do what they're like, I can find out and then let you know. I just, I still want to distinguish. You know, we also have. Here. And I guess I wondered, Nate, do you have any. Familiarity with what happened with the natural heritage project Hickory Ridge. So you're asking. I don't know if my video is working. You're asking me what happened with natural heritage. Yeah.  I mean, I don't, as far as I'm aware, there wasn't like any, any issues. I could check with Aaron, you know, they have a plan, a pretty thorough plan with the state and national heritage that encompasses the whole property and they have specific areas that they, you know, need to be managed certain ways. There's a conservation restriction involved. So they work through it. I don't, I mean, I'm not, you know, I don't know that there's any like issues other than that. There's a pretty comprehensive plan that has to be followed. Okay. So Aaron Jake is in the audience actually. Well, I don't, I don't want this to become a big review of the, the Hickory project. You know, we're not here for that purpose tonight. And certainly there's other avenues in which the issues that that project could be discussed. So I just assume not do that. I do want to ask you guys, and I think it would be very helpful for the ZBA. The schedule that you show is pretty opaque as far as how the different steps and phases happen. You know, I think you could do a lot rather than using a screenshot from primavera to have something that's a little more legible for the layman. Okay. Okay. And since right now I'm actually unclear as to whether you're going to clear 41 acres of trees. Leave them on the ground. And then 10 acres at a time, you're going to remove the trees and start to grub the each, each zone. Or whether you're going to do 10 acres of tree clearing at a time. Or 10 acres of trees. Then you'll remove the trees associated with that. So I don't need to know all of that right now. But right now I'm just seeing kind of. You know, one, one long line of 245 days of construction and civil doesn't mean much to me as a layman. I want to see what are you doing? I'm going to put the tree tree cut down. The next one is clearing and grubbing. The third one is sowing wildflowers. The fourth one is seeing that the wildflowers have germinated, which you're going to get some, you might have something in 30 days in the spring, but if you do it in July, you know, in 30 days, I'm not going to believe you if you think the wildflowers have germinated. Particularly if you don't have some other water source. And given the rains we're having, it could all wash away in the summer. So I'm, I'm, I'm not understanding really what I, you know, it's hard for me to picture what you've got right now. So that's a comment that doesn't need to go to ZBA, but I think if you want to have everybody understand what I'm saying, you could lay out the sequence and be more clear about that. Sorry about my video here. That's extremely helpful feedback. Thank you. I'm taking some notes. Okay. All right, Janet, I'm, I'm sorry to sort of steer the conversation away from Hickory, but I, that's really not why we're here. You know, I suppose we could ask, are you planning to put generators or construction managers in any swales, you know, so that what we saw at Hickory doesn't happen again. But, you know, is that, that's a question about this project. It's my understanding. No, that, that would not be something we would do on this site. I would, I would definitely want to confirm with our construction manager on that, but we would, we would certainly make sure that there's, there's no impact of that nature kind of on this site. Okay. Okay. Karen, you want to try your video, your verbal again. Ah, no. So Karen, you might try phoning into the meeting. Use your cell phone and come in as another. Participant. And, you know, we can't hear you. No. Sorry about that. All right, Janet, let's try it again. Anyway, so I'm not going to belabor Hickory Ridge. Obviously you shouldn't put things in floodplains, especially in the modern era. I think the issue of following plans and delivering on them is really key. I do, you know, a long kind of what Jesse was saying is, you know, when I look at this site as a plan, I do look at those two smaller arrays that are surrounding the battery storage. And it just seems like you've gone all the way around the wetland and there's water resources and, you know, there's resources to the other, you know, to the West and the North. And I wondered if it would be a stronger plan and have fewer trees being cut. If you just kept the two larger fields, the solar array fields and be kind of less disruption to the habitat to the, to everything. So that was a, that's a piece of feedback. I would like to see before making recommendations, you know, the lengthy comments by the concom because I, you know, I have a lot of respect for that committee and their expertise. So I think that would be an important thing to know. All right. Thank you, Janet. All right. So, Andrew, did we get through the material you hoped to present? Yes, sir. Thank you very much. My, the presentation was essentially a kind of a place, placeholder starter for us and to open up to questions. And so I'm happy to continue fielding questions, but that's the material we wanted to share with y'all. Okay. All right. So it is eight o'clock and we typically take a break around that time. But I, I see Fred's hands.  Fred, you are muted. There you go. Yeah. Am I coming through now? Yes, you are. Okay. I have a question about fencing. I've been through the. The packet. And there's a number of references to fencing, but I. I may have just. Been unable to discover it, but. I didn't see any specification. And I'm wondering if you could comment on. What you're planning to do as far as restricting access to this. All right. Andrew. Yes. Thank you. I will turn that over to Steve or Chris. To speak about the fencing. It'll be a seven foot high with that. Six inch gap at the bottom fence. Around the perimeter. But I'll let Stephen Chris to provide more detail there. Yeah, that's, that's exactly Andrew and the. The details are on. See, she see 5.00 of the, of the plan set. But Andrew. Described it. Seven foot high chain link. Is that a chain link fence? Seven foot high chain link. That's correct. All right. I'm not seeing. C5 was not included in our package, at least as mailed to me. So that may be. Why Fred didn't see it. So maybe that's posted on the ZBA website. Oh, there we go. Yes. And so just sharing my screen. Quickly, if it's, if it's helpful for the board. Great. This is the, the fencing that. Was referenced. Sorry, my computer's. Sorry about that. Here's a little slow. Right here. I can zoom in further. Any aspects that are helpful, but this is the. Of course, my computer. This is the, the, the aspects of the fencing itself. Okay. Fred, do you have other questions? No, thank you for, for that. I. My curiosity is, I think that I'm pretty sure that will comply. With the relevant provisions of the national electrical safety code. Which is the. Relevant document that needs to be applied to this particular work. It does. Okay. All right. So not seeing any hands at the moment. I think why don't we take our five minute break. And come back. I see the time now as 804. Let's come back at 809 and. And resume the conversation. Board members, we should start thinking about whether we want to make a recommendation to ZBA at all. Or whether or not. And if we do want to what we should recommend. So we can talk about that when we come back. Please turn off your camera and mute yourself. During the break. And when you return, please turn on your camera. So that you, we can see your back. Thank you. Karen, did it, was that you? I heard. Humming. Hello. Who is who? Who did I just hear? It could have been Pam. Okay. No, it's not me. There's a Hummer. Karen was the only one that looked like she was not. Muted. You know, I wonder if we can. I don't know if I had, I should I text her the phone number of the meeting. That might be a good idea because it's a lot. When I'm online, it's really hard for me to like switch with my computer and. Let me find it. Actually, it's on the, it's on the, it's on the agenda. Isn't it? No. No. It's on the posting. Okay. And I was terrible that she couldn't. Yeah. We could hear her at the beginning. It's weird. Okay. So. Our phone number is. Six, four, six. Nine, three, one. Three, eight, six. Oh. And then you have to put in a meeting number, right? No, you know what you just, I've done this. I did this when I was in the parking lot in British Columbia.  I'll text her right now. All right. All right. So people are coming back. Wait, I don't have her cell. Dang. I did. Is there a chat option by any chance? Could she type her question in? Does anybody have her cell? Yeah. Corey, the chat option is not enabled on the town of Amherst zoom. Platform. We're a little afraid of that. That way every, everybody has to pay attention to the whole conversation and they can't be chatting between themselves. Oh, I see. That's a better, better. Can I interrupt Janet? Do you have that number that you were going to send to Karen? I do. It's six, four, six. Nine, three, one. Okay. Okay. All right. So it looks like most people are back. I will. Flash my video here just to show everybody that I am back. However, the way. Yes, we can. Yes. Okay. Great. Thanks. So. Now that let's see. We don't have Fred back yet.  Okay. So Corey and Andrew, do you want Steve to be back before we resume the conversation? And Chris. If. If there's a technical base question, I think I'd like to just get their, their answer because I certainly wouldn't want to miss speak. But any other question. I'm happy to field with Corey's help. Okay. All right. Well, Karen, why don't you go ahead and ask your question and we'll see whether Andrew wants to field it without. Referring it to Steve or Christopher. Okay. Can you still hear me? Oh, yeah. Yes, we can. So my question was simply, can you point to. A project of this size, 43 acres, which has been successful. Yeah. Okay. Just, just to clarify. Just so I understand that the definition of successful. Do you mean successfully constructed and operating. On the electric grid. Yes. And without problems, without major problems, erosion. That's just something that's been running for a while that you can point to and say, this is what we've done. It's of this magnitude. And we've done all these mitigation things. And you can look at it and study. What people think of it. Has hit. Met expectations. And if not, what are the major problems? In other words. What, what. What can you show us that. We'll fill us with confidence. Is there, or is this so new that that's difficult to do. That's, that's a great question. A reasonable question. Certainly. Happy to provide a list of projects we've developed. And built that are functioning today. I don't have one to pick off the top of my head, but I'm very happy to provide that. The industry. I'd say it's been around. In force for maybe about. 20 years or so. As you can imagine, started off small. It's kind of branched out from there. But over the last 10 years or so, it's, it's a. There's been quite, quite a lot of. Activity on what we call, you know, community solar or larger solar. So we can, we can certainly find projects that are kind of a similar size as to. To show the board for.  You know, we, we had conversation before the break about another project, which. Has had some issues. Actually a couple of projects got mentioned.  That didn't have major issues with site. And, you know, water quality and, and all the kinds of things we're talking about. I assume that most of your projects do end up, end up connecting. To the grid. So there's success from an electrical point of view. But the board is clearly interested in. Some of the ancillary potential impacts of the project. And I would hope your team has done, you've worked with this group before. And that you've done a project of this size. So that's. I think where Karen's coming from. Sure. Yeah. We've, I mean, one project we've worked with this team on before is, is denying some. Aspects of a project in. In the town of Brookfield, West Brookfield. Certain aspect of that. And not the. Much of the project footprint itself, but some of the, the ancillary features of that project. Which has. Gone very well. And we're proceeding with, but I mean, as with anything as you can imagine, you know, unexpected things come up, especially in dealing with. Construction. So it's, it's. The focus to try to be as safe as possible. And to. Remediate as quickly as possible. If something. Does occur, which is why I think it's. You know, we're fully. On board with. Working with the town for any sort of monitoring. And checking on the project throughout the process. So. I mean, I guess. I don't know that accurately answers your question, but. Yeah, we very confident in the team. And we wouldn't be. Pursuing this project with. Anyone else. We're very confident in the product here. And the design, I think it's. Top notch. Okay. So. Karen, would you like him to send a list of projects that. Maybe just limited to projects in Massachusetts. Or it doesn't have to be a long list. I'd be happy. Just one or two. Of this size where you've cut down 42. Acres of trees. And what, how long has it been running? And. Has this met your expectations and has this gone. Relatively smoothly without any huge things. I mean, when this, this, I realize this is new and it's very controversial whether you want to cut down this many trees. To have solar and I'm no expert on it, but I would be certainly reassured to know that you have done this kind of thing. Cut down 42 acres of trees and met the expectations that, that you're hoping to in a project of this size. Absolutely. I'm happy to provide. Yeah. So Andrew, would you please send that information to Chris Brestrup? Yes. And she can distribute it to the rest of the board. Yes. And. Okay. All right. So. I think at this point, it might make sense to have the public. Comment that we're going to have associated with this. It might influence how, what kind of recommendations we want to make. And so I'm going to. Offer the attendees. I see we have still 17 attendees. And I'd like to have all of them who want to make a public comment. Raise their hands. I'll wait while everybody figures out how to find the raise hand function. So far I see two people who would like to make comments. And 15 people that don't want to make a comment. Okay. All right. So. I see Michael Lopinski and Lenore Brick who would like to make comments. And. Pam, why don't we bring it up? Since we only have two people who want to make comments, why don't we allow them each the full three minutes that we usually. Have for public comments. And you've got your timer up there. Let's bring Michael over. Michael, would you give us your name and remind us of your address. And you have three minutes for a comment. And. Thank you for joining us. Yes. My name is Michael Lopinski. One six seven shoots very road. And. Let's see if we can cover a lot of territory here really quickly.  This is a project in New York. It wasn't done by dynamic, but last winter halfway through the project, solar panels were out there. They left them in the wrong position. And in December, a heavy snow came and destroyed rows and rows and rows. Hundreds of solar panels were knocked down and destroyed due to incompetence. Those solar panels, a lot of them are still laying there. Look it up. There's not a lot out there to find, but it's there. Dwayne's Berg, New York. Real mess. I still don't think they restarted the construction there. Amps in charge of that. Let's talk about the trees being cut down. I asked that question about a month ago to Andrew. I got the same run around the trees. Well, we don't know. We're not sure they're working with a forest tree group. Forestry group doesn't know how many trees are on an acre around here. Come on. It's an important number. Do a quick estimate. Go out in the woods. Look at about an acre. Count the trees. Use 100. That's 4,100 trees. Use 200 on the, on the acre. That's over 80. That's over 80. That's over 80. Use 200 on the, on the acre. That's over 8,000 trees. Those are the numbers you're dealing with in a town that's really proud when they plant 18 shade plants on a main street someplace. The Poland battery that they showed tonight. That same Poland battery burst into flames a little bit after implementation and war with New York last summer. That's a lot of work. At the last TVA meeting, the battery guy showed up. They promised that there'd be a report pretty soon explaining why that battery burst into flames. There's no report that I know of that's been released by anyone. The town of Warwick had those batteries removed. The batteries they had removed are the same ones you saw on the screen tonight that they're recommended both at the end of the year. I know that certain people want to dodge around what's going on at Hickory Ridge and make believe it's not important, but it certainly is a tryout for this project. It's a much easier site to develop. And it's just been one delay after another there. The business about having a generator and the trailer and the floodplain. It's not a mystery that was a floodplain. It's right on the map. Floodplains flood. They put it there. They knew it was going to flood. They knew that it was going to flood. And they wanted to have trust putting together that super complicated phasing map that you saw today. Can you imagine? This is the company that puts a trailer and a generator in the floodplain. And you want to trust in with that super complicated phasing plan. One last thing about the access road. Mr. I think needs to update his information. That is an intermittent stream. You're not going to be able to dodge it. And it's going to have to be part of the access road plan. Okay. Thanks, guys. All right. Thank you, Michael. Okay. Pam, would you bring over Lenore brick? Hello, Lenore. Would you give us. Hi guys. And your address, please. Two five five strong street. Amherst. Thank you. So I do appreciate that pure sky is trying to do this project responsibly. I believe that they believe that and that they're really trying to do a good job. But I'd like to talk about what's responsible. And I have to point out that these projects on forested land are by their nature. Not responsible. If we're actually talking about the climate crisis. We, clearing 41 acres of forested land, no matter how responsibly it's done is going to cause damage to the ecosystem. It's going to disturb the soil microbiology, which by the way is where half the carbon is stored long term. That carbon calculations of avoiding carbon, including the carbon. Equalling the stored carbon doesn't include the true costs of losing the free and valuable echo services that healthy natural systems provide. We're kind of dealing with something we don't really understand because you don't have all the expertise that you need to do a project. Of this kind. It's not just an engineering project. It's not just a solar project. It's not just an engineering project. It's not just an engineering project. It's not just an engineering project. It would make sense if we weren't living in an environment where habitat was already so fragmented. Where we don't have enough forested land. And by the way, when that farmland from years ago that someone mentioned. When we, when the colonists came here and deforested Massachusetts, that's when the problem started. That's when the climate started getting deregulated. We don't have enough forested land now. The severe weather episodes we're seeing are commonplace. Let's be realistic. These floods and the, that we're seeing in recent rains, they will continue. This is the new normal. And we're in this kind of weird time warp. Where we also have to be responsible not only to project ourselves into the future, but to be in sync with what's happening on the state level. The state is finally catching up with the latest climate solutions that's understanding better. The critical need to prioritize ecosystem health. All the studies that are coming out of the state now, all of them, the doer study, the, the study that mass Audubon just did with Harvard forest, the forest as climate solutions proposal, the resilient lands initiative, the healthy soils action plan. All of the state plans are concluding and there's data are concluding that we should not be putting solar on green lands, but on built and disturbed landscapes. We're not only that we should, but we can meet the climate goals in Massachusetts by doing that. So that. And the other thing I wanted to mention is, is in terms of water cycle, small water cycles are largely determined by, by far. So they will also will be affected even if the wells, even if you're saying the wells will be safe or water cycles are going to be affected. At three minutes. Yeah. So anyway, there's a lot to think about if you're going to you have to have that big picture also. Thank you. Okay, thank you. All right, one additional hand has arisen and that is from Renee Moss. Please bring her over and welcome Renee. Would you please give us any additional parts of your name you wanna share or just your street address? Yes, it's Renee Moss and 277 Shootsbury Road. And basically, I wanted to say a lot of what Lenore said. I just think, we talk about this 40 plus acre project. And I know for me, it really came alive when I understood that that was equivalent to 30 football fields clearing forest that's 30 football fields in size. And I just think it's the wrong project in the wrong place at the wrong time. And I wanted to speak more to it being the wrong time. And but I think Lenore has already covered that about the state sort of, this state has done a study. The state is changing its mind about where solar should go which should go in the built environment. So we certainly, I'm just concerned that we don't wanna jump the gun with a project this size, this monumental for Amherst when we're seeing the science changing with seeing the state changing its policies. So again, just to encourage you to sort of look more broadly and understand the full context about the world we're living in now and how things have changed and why this is the wrong project at the wrong time in the wrong place. Thank you very much and thanks for the work you're doing. Okay, thank you, Renee. So I don't see any additional hands. And I guess I would like to make one comment which is I've been, I was a little surprised to see that this 40 acre development would only provide power for about 1500 homes. And I assume those are sort of typical homes in New England that have our heating profile and air conditioning profile. And if that math is right, it suggests that in order to power Amherst with its say 15 to 17,000 homes not even counting the colleges and university we would need about 10 times this quantity of acreage of solar panels in order to power Amherst in a carbon neutral way. And so, okay, so 400 acres and if it's not gonna be on forests and it's not gonna be on farmland are we gonna take 400 acres of current single family homes and tear those down and replace those with solar panels? Is there 400 acres of rooftop that's available for solar panels? Those are questions that come to my mind and I see Janet's hand up. Maybe you have answers from your experience on the solar bylaw working group. I'll give the floor to you for a minute, but it's like, okay, we don't wanna do it here. And it's the wrong project in the wrong place. Well, somebody needs to tell me where the right place is. And I haven't really heard that yet. Janet? So I don't know if you've all these things I've been sort of sending around but the state did a statewide solar assessment and it found that it had 15 to 18 times the amount of solar it was looking for in its own state plans and it was all in the built environment. And so that's encouraging news. I mean, rooftop solar is actually the cheapest solar to put in. And so, the previous speakers are right is the state has two climate action plans, huge push to protect natural working lands, forests and farms and grasslands and I don't know whatever is green and to expand the amount of forests and farms that we have to 40%. And for all the ecosystem services it's also to sequester carbon because even if we want to zero E right now we still have too much carbon in the atmosphere. And so, we don't have to say we need 400 acres of solar in Amherst to cover our needs because there's a plan and the plan is looking at different sources but a huge part of the plan one of the, you know, is to expand and protect forests. And the EOEA or EEOA always get that confused just came out with a no net loss of forests and farmed policy. And so there's been this huge, I wouldn't say it's like a shift that just happened but you could see it coming down the pike in all these assessments in climate action plans. And the carp, our own plan is to protect natural working lands, farms and forests and put solar on the built environment. So that's our own town plan. No plan says Amherst has to produce all of its own energy from solar. No state plan or town plan is telling people how to get there but these Duke plans are looking at different sources.  So there is a path forward. And, you know, I think, you know if we adopt the bylaw that's coming out of, you know the solar bylaw working group this wouldn't even be on the table because it's priority lands for the state. It's, you know, critical habitat, core habitat. And then there is a local rare species on a small part of this parcel that we didn't even get to. So, you know, it's like, you know I feel sort of, I feel mixed about it because under our current bylaw if you get it through the hoops, you can get there. I'd like to see this project be as strong as possible and have the least damage, maybe do some mitigation but I don't think this is kind of probably the last one through the gate. That's my impression given what the state is looking you know the numbers they're coming up with. Okay, I can't wait to see where the state thinks we ought to have solar in the emersed. Oh, I could show it to you. I mean, it's all numbers and stuff but we don't need 400 acres of solar. No one's asking us that. Okay. All right, are there other members of the board who want to ask questions or start the conversation about what kind of recommendation we might want to make to ZBA? Don't all raise your hands at once. All right, Johanna, you got there first. Thanks, Doug. I was mostly, and forgive me if Chris said this in the beginning, but I don't remember her saying it of just given that this is a public meeting not a public hearing, what is the value add of the planning board's engagement in the ZBA process? So, I know Chris is a little bit under the weather tonight. Chris, do you want to speak? Go ahead. Yeah, I would say that the ZBA understands that the planning board understands land use issues and, you know, drainage and cutting of trees and just general land use issues and values the planning board's input. Maybe Nate could give a better answer because I'm starting to lose my voice, excuse me. Okay, thanks, Chris. Nate, do you want to elaborate on that? I mean, I think Chris said it pretty well. Oftentimes, boards will seek advisory opinions from other town boards or committees. And so, really, this is something that the ZBA would use as part of their review. So, if the planning board is concerned with, say, the phasing and sequencing of cutting and grubbing and soil stabilization, that's just, that becomes something for the ZBA to be aware of and maybe they want third party review of that or have another discussion with Aaron and the Conservation Commission. And so, to me, it's like what are some major themes that can come out of this meeting that the ZBA would take under consideration? Is it, you know, it could just be in general that is this project of a scale that is something that needs to be looked at as well?  And so, I mean, those are the things I've been hearing, you know, maybe there's a dozen points that would be relayed in a summary memo that could just be a summary of this conversation and that's what goes to the ZBA or maybe members feel like there's specific things to mention now. I mean, that's kind of the way I see it happening. It becomes just a, you know, an advisory memo to the ZBA. Okay. Thank you, Nate. And certainly, you know, staff keeping track, we have the recording, we'll have minutes. So those, you know, those documents could be shared with ZBA without a whole lot more discussion from the planning board. Janet, I see your hand. I think this is a really big project that's complicated. And I was also confused about the fazing and what was happening when. And so, and I'm actually, I know the prophecy but I think this project's gonna change a lot getting through the concom. And I, you know, so I would like to see it again in a month and have a chance to look at the documents that we didn't get, like the long extensive comments from Aaron Jakes or the concom. You know, I understand you're here to promote your project and I just think there's gonna be shifts and changes. And so if we say, oh, we recommend this project but do these things and the project really shifts. So basically I'm not comfortable. I have a list of ideas to recommend to the ZBA but I feel like I wanna see the project again. I think it's really an important one and I think it's gonna change. And I'm not sure I have all the information that's there that I'd like to look at. All right. Thanks, Janet. I guess I'd wanna sort of think a little longer about whether we wanted to bring the project back. I'd wanna have a little more awareness of what else is on our agenda for this fall. But certainly if it does change a lot, we could ask Chris to keep us surprised of how it evolves and whether our input would be of any value farther down the line. Other board members, no hands. Chris, you are still muted. You will have the Jones Library coming in in the beginning of November. They submitted their application. I don't think you've offered recommendations on the Pulpett Hill Road Ball Lane project, have you? To the Zoning Board of Appeals, it's an affordable housing project. We will also be getting an application not too soon but in a few months from the Wayfinders project on Belcher Town Road in East Street School.  And certainly the Jones Library will come to you for a permit. The other two will be where you will be advising me so important. Great. And there's no requirement for us to make a recommendation at all. We can just say good luck ZBA. Okay. Chris. How about if Pam and I write up what we heard tonight and then come back to you at some future meeting and say is this what you want to forward to the Zoning Board of Appeals? Because they're not in any hurry. They have a long way to go before they reach a conclusion of this project. I mean, I think you could put together a list of the dozen predominant issues or themes of the conversation tonight. And the questions from the planning board mostly concerned X, Y and Z. And that's another way of saying we were most concerned about X, Y and Z. And I can't imagine we got on too many things that they wouldn't think of anyway. But so I'm not seeing any more hands from the board. And no reason to prolong this. Andrew and Tom, I guess you could consider this a warm-up.  A lot of the same things. I mean, the phasing is the big one and Erin was very clear for us to think about seasonal starts and what sort of stabilization. So, yeah, this was really useful. Yeah, I mean, I think the fact that you presented it as we're gonna phase it, on its, you know, at first blush, that sounds like a great idea. But when you get into the details of, well, what are the real benefits of doing that? Okay, are you in fact doing, you know, sequencing it in a way to take advantage of those benefits seems to me to be, you know, at least a major selling point on minimizing the potential for damage. And obviously we're all risk averse. And so, you know, we want 100% assurance that it'll be perfectly safe. Yeah, and I think it's just us spelling it out. I mean, that's what we've heard. That's what we heard from Erin. That's what we've heard tonight is just talk about the start and make it so clear that everybody can visualize exactly what this process is going to look like. You know, assuming there is an approval and as it unfolds so that then we can get into the nitty gritty of, is that the best way to do it are there tweaks to make it better. But at least to say, this is what we think for each of these phases. This is the timeline for each of these phases. This is kind of the extent of it. But I think, you know, we've heard that somewhat loud and clear and I think the awesome, even from the inspection services planning department that has been the largest issue for us to tackle. So. Yeah, well, obviously town staff is gonna have a, was gonna feel a substantial responsibility to watch what's going on. So they at least need to know what the staffing demands are gonna be, when you're gonna need them, when you're gonna be ready to have somebody drive by. And so, you know, and that's all aside from the existential question of, is this the right thing to do with 40 acres of land in Amherst, which I think we should leave for ZBA to answer. Okay, I see now a flurry of hands. We've got Chris and then Janet and then Karen. So Chris. So I just wanted to note that the zoning board of appeals is going to be considering what topics they need to have third party review on. And, you know, we have a recommendation, list of recommendations for them that we'll be giving to them before the October 12th meeting. And it includes things like, you know, examining phasing and examining the erosion control, erosion and sedimentation control and examining the plan for stormwater management. So if there are things that you would like to suggest to the zoning board that they hire a third party reviewer and the way that works is that the developer puts up the money and we hold it in escrow and we hire somebody to do a review and that person is not part of the development team but is hired by the town and then they give us a report or give the zoning board of appeals a report.  Thank you, Chris. Janet, you are next and then Lauren. I hardly endorse hiring third party reviewers and experts because it's a huge, it's a lot of big ask on town staff, a project this size. So I was going to recommend to the CBA that they look at the Amherst Water Supply Protection Committee white paper, which has very specific recommendations that go beyond stormwater management. There's also a developing stormwater management for solar arrays that are different from like what we usually do. And there's some sources of that that I think Chris has access to. I would hire third party consultants for review the stormwater management plan, the phasing, the erosion controls, you know, impacts on wetlands, hire a construction monitor to make sure, you know, the problem that these towns had was the plans were, you know, there was a plan and it wasn't followed and the towns where don't have the capacity to go out every week or even the knowledge to understand how things are going. I would recommend more frequent post-construction monitoring, particularly about erosion. And, you know, I do think we need the CBA should have a better understanding of what's happening at Hickory Ridge. I feel like it's become this like mystery novel. The only person who's ever answered that question directly has been from the natural heritage program. But I think the CBA has to understand what has gone well, what has gone wrong.  I would ask the CBA to consider mitigation for a loss of habitat and ecosystem services. And then also I would recommend that the CBA look at the draft solar bylaw requirements for submittals, design standards, you know, things about surety and, you know, bonds so to make sure that the construction goes. You know, it's a big document, but it's what a lot of other towns are requiring. And that would give the CBA a sense of, you know, all the information it needs. So that would be my recommendation, but I really would like to see this project, especially since I think it's gonna change a fair amount after getting through, you know, the concom and the boards. Okay, thank you, Janet. I got you a car and your hand came down. You don't wanna try to talk again? Okay. All right. I guess with that, we'll conclude this public meeting. The time now is 8.47. Tom and Andrew and all your team, thank you for coming. Appreciate the briefing. And I hope this was an illuminating conversation. Okay. Was thanks for your time. Excellent question. Somebody needs to get me more broadband access. So my image doesn't. Keep fritzing out like this tonight. Okay. So as I said, it's 847. We'll move on to the next item on the agenda. That is old business, not reasonably anticipated 48 hours in advance. Do we have any of that? I'm not aware of any. Okay. Chris, I know you're under the weather. Feel free to drop out. I think we've gotten through the meat of the conversation tonight. Just, I don't know if it will come up today, Doug, but you had offered to be the CPA rep. And I wasn't sure if that was moving forward or not. Well, we will get to that when we get to committee and liaison reports. Okay. The next item is new business. Not reasonably anticipated. Anything. On that. No. All right. Form a and our subdivision applications. Anything. Pam. No. All right. Upcoming ZBA applications. Any other controversial projects we want to talk about with. And maybe make a recommendation. I did learn about one. It is not controversial. When I spoke to Rob Lachela today, the planner. Whoops, come on. He told me that he expects this, this project to be like permitted in one session of. Public hearing. So it is a change of views. So the property at 62 Taylor street. It is an existing two family. In 2013, it was. It did receive a special permit. To be a non-owner occupied. Two family. Then in 2020, it was bought by the current owner. Who was primarily using it for family. And then subsequently began to rent it. Not aware of the fact. It's not aware of the fact. That the special permit to use it. As a rental. Didn't just travel along with the property. So. This is, this is really just. Getting it done. It's going to be. Yep. It's going to be sold. It's allowed in, um, in the RG. For this to be a non-owner occupied. Uh, rental. There's two units in it. The first floor has a two bedroom unit that the currently one tenant lives in. And the second floor is a three bedroom unit. Um, and with three tenants. Um, the pack, the application package came in extremely complete. Um, it's actually the seller and the buyer kind of going at it. Together. Um, they've got a. Uh, a letter from in a butter that actually shares the driveway. They have an easement and shares a driveway who supports this. I mean, it really is just, um, it's, it's just getting the homework done. It already operates as a non-owner occupied to family dwelling. This, the, the most recent. Owner wasn't aware that they needed to get the special permit. So they're just taking care of some laundry. All right. Okay. That's all I got. Okay. So, uh, does anybody think we should see this? Uh, I personally don't because it's not really a. Change in the physical environment. Um, Janet. So a friend of mine used to own this property. And I think when we're looking at the zoning changes in terms of, you know, Mandy, Joe Henneke and Pat to Angeles, I kept on saying there's not a great market for owner occupied duplexes. And so she got a job in DC. Um, tried to change it to non-owner occupied duplex was rejected by the ZBA. So she went up moving and then, you know, it was just really inexpensive. Thing until finally she was able to sell it. And so I think this is, I think just, I don't want to see this application, but it's an illustration of. Even if you have an owner occupancy requirement and you think that's going to keep your neighborhood. Kind of more, you know, with more year round residents. This situation comes up and the ZBA, but is probably going to let them out of it. And then actually in my friend's case, it was a hindrance to their ability. To sell. So maybe other ways to control the composition of residential neighborhoods is what we need. Not hoping that owner occupancy occupancy will be the cure that lasts forever. So I just want to make that point, but I've been in that house and it's, you know, it's a nice house and it's a nice neighborhood. Okay. All right. Pam. So we will pass on that one. Okay. Not hearing from anyone else that they were. Intrigued. All right. Upcoming SPP, SPR, SUB applications. As I said earlier, we do have an application from the Jones library. I don't know if we actually put it into. The town clerk's office or Muniz, but that will probably be scheduled for some time in early November. Okay. I don't know if Pam has anything more to say about that. I don't. We did bring it in. It's got a number. It's in the log. It has not been submitted to the town clerk yet. But I, I'm sure that it probably will by the end of the week. So. It is coming. Okay. Nate. Yeah, I was going to say there's probably two town projects that would be coming for site plan review as well. The town is looking at, we have grant funding to put trails on Hickory Ridge. One's an accessible trail loop and one's a connection from East Howley road. Down to the Palm Roy village intersection. And so that'd be a site plan review. We'd like to get submitted. This year. Just because the plans are getting finalized. And then another one might be for. Pickleball court and parking improvements at a Kiwanis park on Stanley street. So again, there's some funding there. The town is working on plans to make some improvements to that recreation area. I'm sure. We'll be very interested in that. Okay. All right. So we'll move on. The time is 8.54. Move on to committee and liaison reports. I know Bruce is absent. So we'll skip the PVPC. CPAC. Nate, I can report. That I received the. The letter of appointment today from Angela. And I need to go into town hall and get sworn in. So that's where, that's where that stands. Oh, good. Yeah. No, thanks. Cause the proposals were due. At the end of the, you know, end of September and they'll be going. You know, probably live later this year. Or later this week or next week for everyone, you know, for the committee to review them. So. Okay. Well, assuming I can get over there, you know, in the next week, I guess I can participate. Great. Oh, wait. Design review board. Yeah. So we met on Monday and there are three. Brand new businesses that we're looking. To put up awnings that we discussed. One is botanica. Botanica homes. On 191 North pleasant with blue marble was. They're going to come back on Friday. They have a beautiful awning, but it didn't quite fit in with the, with the skyline. Of the others. So that's one that's exciting. And I suggest everybody go and check it out because she's already in business and it seems really lovely. The second one is a little. And that's really exciting. And I suggest everybody go and check it out because she's already in business and it seems really lovely. The second one is a little. Takeria. Del. Pup. We blow another Mexican restaurant. A little bit different kind of sophisticated and it's going 31 boltwood walk. They wanted a really plain. And the third is something really special. Julia Nolan jewelry going in 40 main street. And she requested signs. Window signs and then a sign to be on the road. And she's. She's designed or had someone design an absolutely. Beautiful. A round sign. Julie Nolan jewelry. So. It's going to beautify downtown. So it was exciting to be part of that. It's fun. All right. Thanks. It's nice to hear you're having a good time. All right. Janet solar bylaw working group. Allegedly we have our last meeting next Tuesday. And we've been. We've been reading through the changes that are final changes to the bylaw, but we, you know, still have some fair amount of work to do on farms and forests, which means Chris, which I'm kind of worrying about given her situation. So we, and then we're also talking on Tuesday about like what the next steps are. And I, I can't remember if I brought up the issue that the planning board wanted to see. I mean, would it be okay to wait a week or two before you see that bylaw? Or I don't, I don't think we really discussed it, Chris. I think I mentioned it, but I can't remember now if it was this meeting or a previous one, we've met a bit lately. Chris, you are muted. I think the planning board should see it, but I don't know if they need to see it before the solar bylaw working group has finished with it, because they're going to be a number of other groups that will be looking at it. We're imagining that the. CRC is going to be kind of moving it along. So I think the planning board can look at it when the CRC looks at it. Yeah. Okay. And Janet, if that's your last solar bylaw working group, there's still time for you to become the CPAC representative. You know. Just saying, just saying. I think I'll defer. It seems like you, you're already, you're already there. You're already got your letter. It's all happening. Versus out of the bar. I think it's really hard to believe that Tuesday is the last day. So I'm, I'm still, you know, anyway. All right. Fred, I see your hand. Yeah. I made mention at the last meeting of. Regarding the reference to the national electrical code. And the model. Bylaw, which I, it is also in the state model bylaw. And that reference is simply wrong. It's the wrong code. And we, we need to fix that. It's a simple thing to fix, but we need to fix it. And Chris, I remember you were saying you were going to set up a meeting with the electrical inspector inside. And I'm happy to have the national electrical safety code. The relevant requirements printed out. I'm happy to share that with, with you folks. To make that simple, but yeah, that has to get fixed. It really does. I say that as the person who's the secretary of the committee that. Implements the national electrical code in Massachusetts. And the national electrical code does not apply to these. So, okay. Chris, I see your hand. Maybe Fred could email me some times in the next week that he could. Well, it would have to be before Tuesday. Or call me. I'll, I'm going to try to go to work tomorrow. So I'll have a mask on. So Fred can call me and tell me exactly what the reference should say. Okay. I'll do that. I'll do that. And I suppose you could email some of that information at least. That would be fine too. Yeah. And I assume that town staff is not working on Monday. We're not technically working on Monday, but some of us may need to. Some of you may. I'm sorry. Creep into the building and quiet. Extra work. Tisk, Tisk.  Do you want to say anything else? Okay. All right. So now we're up to CRC Chris. Anything else you want to say about the CRC? Oh, no, not really. I haven't been attending their meetings, but I can't remember what they're looking at. They did look at the rental registration by law. There's some other thing that they're looking at, but I can't remember it off the top of my head. My head isn't working as well as it normally does. Is it the new sense by law? New sense by law. Thank you, Pam. That's a welcome. Yep. All right. And Chris, if you're not attending those meetings, should we have this on the agenda? Okay. When zoning by law amendments come up, then I have to go to the CRC so we could scratch it for now. And then when zoning by law, I guess we could just leave it on here and you could say, you know, what you said. You haven't, you haven't been there. There hasn't been any discerning discussions. Okay. All right. Chris, anything from staff or Nate or Pam? I don't have a report. Nate or Pam have a report. Nope. I'm seeing all three heads shaking now. Okay. All right. Time now is nine oh two. Unless anybody has any else. Anything else they'd like to bring up. I think we can adjourn. Thank you all for coming. Thanks for your thoughtful discussion about this. The shoot's very road project. Thank you. Thank you. Hi. Good night, Pam. Good night, Mr. Marshall.