Good morning once again. Thank you all for joining. Good to see you. Hope you all are doing well. Wonderful to see you. Hi, everyone. Hi, Daniel. Hi, Prad. Hi, Lucy. Sam, Sanjay. Good to see you. Cyril. Hi, hi, hi. I hope you can hear me well and see me well. Okay, let's pray and we'll get started. Jesus, we look to you this morning. Beautiful Savior, the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end, the ancient of days. We love you. We honor you in this place. We welcome you in this place.  We give you complete permission to come and do what you do best. Move among us. Breathe over us, I pray, even as we learn and study about ministering, healing and deliverance. Holy Spirit, I pray that you would fill us, you would empower us and equip us as we study, Lord, as we look into your Word as well. Continue to pour out your wisdom over your children, I pray. In Jesus' name, amen. Okay, great. So we've completed chapter one. We started with chapter two in the last class and in chapter one, we looked at the biblical reasons as to why we need to minister. Why is it important to minister in healing and deliverance? We looked at so many other things that it displays God's nature. It reveals God's power, His glory, His greatness and so many other reasons. And so that's one of the reasons why, not one of the reasons, that's one of the many reasons why we minister in healing and deliverance. The word minister or the literal meaning of that word minister means to be a cup bearer. That means to serve. Okay, the literal meaning of the word minister is a cup bearer to minister. That's what a cup bearer is to, isn't it? Like how Nehemiah was holding a cup. He was a cup bearer standing behind the king. He would serve a waiter basically. And so it's very important for us to serve in healing and deliverance. Okay, so sometimes what can happen is that when we use the word minister, it can sound little complex. Okay, that ministry is only for this person. That ministry is only for that person. But it simply means to serve, isn't it? Like you come and serve tea to me. That's what it is. You see a person in need and you go serve and you introduce Jesus to that person. That's all it is, isn't it? So that's what we looked at chapter one, the importance of ministering in healing and deliverance. We'll do a quick recap of what we covered in chapter two. Actually, let's look into it a little deeper. So, all good? Yes. Right, so chapter two, it talks about God's word on healing. That means this chapter, we are going to focus on what the word of God, the Bible, has to say about. Healing, okay? So we start off by looking at the source of sickness, disease and ailments. What is the meaning of source? Source, what is the meaning of source? S-O-U-R-C-E. What is origin? Okay, what is the source of river Ganga? Where does it start? Do you know? The Himalayas. The Himalayas, yeah. So that's where it begins, isn't it? So the source of the river Ganga is at the Himalayas, at the valleys, right? So that's where it begins, okay? Not in Varanasi, right? It passes through the city of Varanasi but it does not begin there, isn't it? It has many tributaries but the source is where it begins, right? Where it comes from, yeah? So when we say the source of sickness, disease and ailments, that means we are talking, we are looking at, where does it come from? What is its origin? Okay, that's what we're looking at, we started off looking at. And so we looked at when God created the world, the universe, everything He did was perfect. How do we know that? Because God said it was good, right? He didn't need an angel to praise Him or any you and me to praise Him. He created the worlds, He created the heavens and the earth and everything on the earth, the sun, the moon, the stars, the fish, the animals, the trees, everything. And He said, it's good. Perfect, another word for perfect is flawless. That means without any mistake. Without any mistake. It's just beautiful. Perfect. He doesn't need any correction. Okay, I think there's a reason why God made man on the last day. Because if He made man on the first day, we would start giving advice to God. It's like, no, I think you should place the sun just a little bit on the other side. You know, I think you should put the earth after Mars and Mars should come first. And we still do now, you know. Oh, Pluto is not a planet. Okay, but you get the point, right? When God created the heavens and the earth, when He created you, when He created me, when He created, you know, like, everything was perfect unless sin entered. Okay, and so when sin entered, it separated us.  And then there was a black dot. Are you with me? So now that beautiful white wall was no longer just white. It had a mark on it. It was not perfect. It became flawed. Are you with me? And so ever since then, because of one man's disobedience, all of creation, all means all. Okay, all means all. That's all, all means. Okay, all of creation was subjected to corruption. Okay, that means decay. Are you with me? And now when you say decay, d-e-c-a-y, decay is, it's a process, right? What happens? For example, let's take a... So when a person dies physically, okay, that's very important. So when a person dies physically, what happens?  Yes or no? Yes, no? Okay, if we have another answer, then something... Yeah. So when a person dies, we call it as a dead body, isn't it? We don't, we no longer call, you know, a dead body by the name. It's just like in a few hours time, we said, are you taking the body out? When are we burying the body? We no longer give it a name, isn't it? And now what happens sometimes for the ritual or for the ceremony? We place a dead body in the refrigerator, isn't it, in the ice thing. Why? So that it will last a little longer, isn't it? So as soon as death happens, that means a decay process begins. Slowly, gradually, everything is getting rotten. Are you with me? Everything begins to get rotten, and then eventually begins to smell, right? And when you bury it and then you dig it up a few years later, these fine bones, isn't it? So what is happening is when sin entered, all of creation was subjected to a process of decay and corruption. Are you with me? We know that the scripture says that the wages of sin is death, right? And so that's the process set in place. And so it is not a very pleasant process. We looked at in Romans chapter 8, 19 and 23. We see Romans chapter 8 was 19 and 23. For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for the revealing of the sons of God. They're all waiting for a revelation, for an unveiling. That's what revealing means, isn't it? Verse 20, For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it in hope. That means all of creation had become subjects to corruption, to this process called decay. Because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption to the glorious liberty of the children of God. Another verse, what I'd like for us to read, just give me one moment, is 1 Corinthians 15. Let's not do that if you have your Bibles. 1 Corinthians 15 verse 53 and 54. We read this verse last week, but again I'm just going through all of this for our benefit. 1 Corinthians chapter 15 verse 53 and 54. 1 Corinthians 15 verse 53 and 54. It says, for this perishable body must be, must put on the imperishable. And this mortal body must put on immortality. I'm reading from ESV. So the perishable in your... What's the translation of version? Corruption, okay, yeah. So for this perishable body, that means corruption, perishable, it will one day go away, must put on imperishable. That means a body that will not get corrupted. And this mortal body must put on immortality. The other day when we were studying about the Tabernacle of Moses, we saw that the wood that was used to build the Tabernacle was Achesia wood. In other words, shittim wood, right? Now, of all the woods that God could have told people of Israel to use to build the Tabernacle, could have said use the teak wood, use rosewood, whatever. But why shittim wood or Achesia wood? We looked at because that wood is a... It has a healing agent of itself. It is incorruptible. Okay, and it produces a balm that was used for medicinal purposes, a gum kind of a thing. And so, a termites or all these whatever, insects or worms could not destroy that wood. Okay, we studied about it a lot. This is just a sneak peek for those online, just something that we did. But yeah. Okay, let's move on now. So because of man's disobedience, the spiritual process of decay and corruption set in place. And then, so what was... In Psalm 115, I think, I'm not mistaken. I will get to that in just a minute. God told Adam to be fruitful and multiply and then have dominion. It means have authority. This is yours. But because of sin, God gave Adam the keys. Adam gave the keys to the devil. And because of which, he uses all his power and authority to oppress human beings. So Acts 10 verse 38, it says, How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. Who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him. It's very important to notice that all who were oppressed by the devil, right? And his angels did all this demonic work. So he doesn't say that Jesus went about delivering all those who were oppressed by God. Yeah. Okay. So again, we looked at... Now, maybe not all sicknesses are due to demonic spirits. I'll say that again. I said this last week, but I'll say it again. All sickness are due to demonic spirits. Okay. But some of the following that's mentioned in the notes, some of them, not all of it, like incurable diseases, birth defect, deformities, unexplainable diseases, symptoms that get worse after prayer, and ministry symptoms that seem to move around different regions, etc. Those are just five points, but it doesn't stop there. It can go on. Okay. What does that mean? But by not all sickness are from demonic spirits. What does that mean? Man's negligence, right? That's what we looked at. So if not all sicknesses are from demonic spirit, that means there's a certain amount of responsibility on us. Yes or no? Yeah. If you keep abusing your body by drinking a lot of alcohol... What is it? What is the syrup character? Hmm. Okay. Oh, I just want quarter. I just want 90, 30 ml every day. It's 30. I'm not a very regular drinker pastor, but I just, you know, a little bit 30 every day. What are you doing? What is happening? Because your body is already a subject to a decaying process. You're speeding up the process of decaying. You're speeding up the process of decaying. You're speeding up the process of decay. Isn't it? And so you're not taking care of it. And then you can't blame the devil. I was like, no, the devil made me drink alcohol. No, no, no, no, no, no. No. It's the same thing with if you love, if we have no control over our eating, you know, we can't resist Biryani. Sure. He's got a Biryani business itself. So... or sweets without control. You know, that would lead to diabetes or if you don't have a healthy lifestyle, if you don't... We all like to work out, no? We all like the idea of working out. But getting up and doing work out, you know, we all like the idea of going for a jog in the morning every day. But I will sit in this chair. I will close my eyes. I will imagine myself like I'm jogging. Okay. Done. Right? But those are all the natural causes when you don't take care of your body. Right? Yeah. Sorry. Okay. I think that was a mistake. Yeah. You can cut this if you want. Sorry, guys.  Okay, and that means because of my certain habits back then, even though I have stopped all of that and given up all of that, because of the damage that was caused back then, it is very easy for me to lose my voice. It's very easy for me to lose my voice. That means if I... I mean, I could sing for two hours or two and a half hours non-stop, but then now because of all the damage that was done back then, getting across a one-hour set is challenging. Are you with me? And so, and again, now that I know that my voice is not the same as when I was young, it is up to me to take care of it and that's why you see me with this flask all the time is that I keep, you know, is I make sure that my vocal chords are moist, are what do you say, are hydrated all the time because I have to speak a lot and if I scream, I can lose my voice and if I eat so if I'm singing, if I'm leading worship say tomorrow morning, Sunday service, not eating too spicy food the previous day, oily food or fried foods, all of that can damage our ice creams or Coca-Cola. Right now, I can't drink a lot of Coca-Cola the previous night and eat fried food, oily food, everything and then expect my voice to function very well the next day morning. Right because some of us can do that is like eat everything, whatever you want the previous night, I'm taking it from myself and then the next day morning when my voice doesn't work I can't blame the devil, this devil doesn't want me to sing. I rebuke it, you know do you get the point right while not all sicknesses you know can be attributed to the devil but there are natural causes that you and I have to take responsibility of. Are you with me following all this, yeah? Following, right? Yeah, okay, yes. Curiosity just asking this question so on COVID-19 would it be like termed like a grey area or would it be like a man-made thing or a demonic thing? What did you wake up and decide to ask me the toughest question possible? I don't know, I think it's the most controversial subject ever like this topic of the COVID-19 I don't know but according to me in my opinion it feels like a man-made thing that just aggravated everything else that is already in, like I said everything is in a decay process and because what happens when we don't take care of it, we're just speeding up that process it's as simple as that so yeah but that's a man-made whatever, that's my opinion guys okay okay alright, let's move on are you all learning something? are you all with me? are those online? okay great, wonderful awesome, awesome, okay, thank you okay, so now we come to this very important question it's not a tricky question it's not a tricky question does God send sickness? okay, let's answer that question and move on in life does God send sickness? 100% no let's move on I mean the question should be absolutely clear, does God send sickness? no okay, we look at in detail as we move on a little further and then, but there are these difficult passages in the scripture that we come across for us to understand a few things, right for example in 1 John 1 5 and James chapter 1 verse 17 it says, God is light and there is no darkness in him yeah but then there is Psalm 18 verse 9 and 11 that says he made darkness his secret place his canopy around him was dark waters and thick clouds of skies so there's one scripture that says God is light and in him there is no darkness and then there is this Psalm 18 verse 9 and 11 that says he made darkness his secret place this is one of the difficult passages or there's another a passage that says in Titus chapter 1 verse 2 that God is truth and he cannot God is truth and he cannot lie but then there are these other scriptures in 1 Kings chapter 22 and 2 Chronicles chapter 18 that says lying spirits came from God that's another difficult passage before you ask me any questions just hold on just hang on okay okay now there are a few examples of those difficult passages in your notes and there are more okay so how do we understand these difficult passages like what do we do to understand these difficult passages okay so just look at me for a second so God's will okay everybody say God's will and God's word and God's deeds deeds is what God's actions what he does so God's will and God's deeds will always be consistent with his nature okay consistent means same right he's the same yesterday today and for ever right during the time of Abraham he was not a different God during the time of Jacob he was not a different God during the time of Moses he was not a different God and now he's not different he's the same yesterday today and for ever ever right so God tells Joshua that as I was with Moses I will be with you right although your leader may die although everything around you may change everything may seem inconsistent around you but as I was with Moses I will be with you that means he's saying I am the consistent one I am the unchanging one so God's will God's word and God's deeds will be consistent in his to his nature not up and down okay so if we don't understand these difficult passages but if you and I can understand Jesus that is enough can I say that one more time if you don't understand these difficult passages but if you understand Jesus that is more then enough why because God's best his best is revealed through his son Jesus can I say that again God's best is revealed what is revealed revelation or an unveiling right God's best is revealed through his son Jesus okay like one of the pastors says that Jesus Christ is perfect theology okay Jesus Christ is perfect theology that means if there is a theology teaching out there that says something that does not look and sound like Jesus that means Jesus is not wrong the theology is wrong are you with me right so God's best is revealed through his son Jesus Christ are you with me okay alright let's move on I think so let's do a quick summary of this section demonic work and man's actions God cannot give or bless people with something he does not have so that means just to address the question the source of sickness is not God okay the source of sickness is not God and there are times where due to divine judgment you know you will come across verses or scriptures that says you know God turned his face away from his people right God took God gave handed them over to the Amalekites have you come across these scriptures it's in the Bible right he it says God handed the people of Israel over to the media nights God handed them over to the Amalekites what does that mean God it's not like God took them and gave them handed them over right it is simply saying that God took away his hand of favor his hand of protection from of his people which allowed the enemy to attack the people of Israel are you with me this is very important for us to understand okay so there are times due to divine judgment or divine encounters you know for example Saul who later is known as Apostle Paul he goes blind now that was what that was a divine encounter and he was not blind for eternity for three days yes or no so you know so there's a distinction between a divine encounter divine judgment where God takes his hands of his people which permits and allows the enemy to attack and inflict our lives right have you heard of stories where and I have heard so many stories of you know these people some people who practice witchcraft what they say is you know I sent this spirit to attack that family it went and attack that family but when I sent this spirit to attack this Christian family it could not do anything there was a wall of fire around that family have you heard stories like that yeah what does that mean that means God is present he's covering them are you with me okay so yeah one of the highlight of this section what I want you to remember is God's best is revealed in the person of everybody say that God's best is revealed in the person of Jesus Christ alright always remember that Jesus Christ is perfect theology okay how many times do you see where you know when people who are sick came to Jesus and said let me pray about it and come back to you did Jesus and we say that Jesus healed everyone who came to him in faith isn't it everyone scriptures say his multitudes came but you know there are certain Christians who get stuck up on this story of this person called Job yeah but what about Job yeah what about Job I don't believe in the theology of Job I believe in theology of Jesus isn't it we will very conveniently forget that Jesus healed multitudes but we get stuck on this one person but what about this one person okay so that's another difficult story passage character whatever you want to call it but again the foundation of your strong foundation will be strong if you understand and know that Jesus God's best is revealed through his son Jesus what did he do what did Jesus do when he was here on the earth and what does he continue to do he heals right he reveals the father right awake now everybody yeah okay so let's move on to this next very important section called the basis for ministering healing and deliverance basis like the basics of what we need to understand like the foundations of what we need to understand to serve in healing and deliverance okay the first basis is very simple it's again going back to the first biblical reason as to why we need to minister in healing and deliverance because it reveals the nature of God right and what is his nature and what was the covenant name that he gave to the people of Israel Jehovah Rafa Jehovah Rafa thank you that was the covenant name he gave to the people of Israel right that means he is our healer isn't it yeah that's his covenant name and I think I've spoken about the word covenant with us isn't it what is the meaning of it okay so his will his what he does his word his deeds will be consistent with his nature that means if his covenant name is that he is a healer that means that's who he is the one who heals is not going to inflict us oh wow let me look at this person you know let me let me watch him suffer he's not going to do that right his desire is to see you walk in wholeness and that is his nature and it is not just for you and for me that is God's heart to all mankind are you with me that is God's heart too all mankind he wants his children to be made whole Jesus did not just die on the cross for Christians there were no Christians by the way when Jesus died became much later isn't it right but we'll get to it in just a second so because the next section is beautiful it talks about the cross the second basis for ministering healing and deliverance is the cross of Jesus Christ oh that wonderful cross of Jesus Christ one of my favorite hymns is oh that wondrous cross have you heard of it might not there's another old hymn called the old rugged cross it's an very old English hymn it says on a hill far away there stood an old rugged cross if you haven't it's a beautiful hymn hundreds of years old where will you and I be if not for the cross of Jesus Christ we need to pause as bible call it students and as Christians people who go to church every week um it is possible for us to lose the wonder of the cross it is possible for us to take the cross for granted are you with me what will keep your love and that fire for God alive is that you have not forgotten what he saved you from and what cost God gave us from it's like that song here I am to worship the bridge that says I will never know how much it cost to see my sin upon that cross isn't it so the second basis or the basic for us to serve in healing and deliverance is the cross of Jesus Christ prophet Isaiah who is known as the prophet of prophets okay he is known as the prophet of prophets almost 800 years ago 800 years before Jesus talks about the cross from Isaiah chapter 52 onwards halfway through 52 was 13 and the whole chapter of Isaiah 53 he is talking about the cross it's almost 750-800 years before Jesus right? Isaiah 53 was 4 and 5 says surely he has born our griefs and carried our sorrows I want you to highlight that because in just a minute we are going to read from Matthew chapter 8 okay where Peter quotes the same scripture but slightly differently okay I want you to pay attention to this verse Isaiah 53 was 4 and 5 surely he has born our griefs and carried our sorrows yet we esteemed him smitten by God and afflicted but he was wounded for our transgressions he was bruised for our iniquities the chastisement of our peace was upon him and by his stripes we are healed by his stripes we are healed okay so it's very important for us you and me to notice that it doesn't say that by his stripes we are saved it doesn't say by his stripes we are saved now if Jesus just simply wanted to save our souls he could have just gone directly to the cross but the stripes that he received was for our healing okay alright so surely he has born our griefs and carried our sorrows I'm just looking at your notes the Hebrew words provide a little further insight for grief so the Hebrew meaning for the word grief is sickness, disease and malady everything and the Hebrew word for sorrow is pain and grief okay so one more time let's look at that verse 4 in Isaiah 53 what does it say he has born our griefs and carried our sorrows okay now let's look at what Peter says in Matthew chapter 8 verse 17 Peter is quoting what Isaiah said but see what he says Matthew chapter 8 verse 17 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet said that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet said which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet saying he himself took our infirmities and bore our sickness Isaiah writes he took our griefs and our sorrows but in Matthew he's saying okay he bore our infirmities and our sickness and so that's what it really means the griefs and sorrow means that he took our sickness that means you can just pray for healing only over cancer or all these major diseases you pray for healing over common cold over viral fever also are you with me yes or no okay so that's one of the basis for ministering healing and deliverance one Peter chapter 2 verse 24 these are all fundamental scriptures that you and I need to remember going back to Sunday school days memory verse all these have to be memory verses that you have to memorize it okay and write it 10 times Colossians chapter 2 was 14 and 15 says having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us which was gone ready to us and he has taken it out of the way having nailed it to the cross let's slow down a little bit and reread that verse having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us what is it saying that means there was judgment written for you and for me there was what is the judgment what's the judgment death isn't it it was written okay Joseph deserves death Akhil deserves death emotion deserves death okay Komal deserves death everything but what Jesus did it says he wiped out the handwriting he raised complete it says that was against us which was contrary to us and he has taken it out of the way having nailed to the cross and I love the next verse verse 15 says having disarmed the principalities of and powers he made a public spectacle of them prime thing over them in it that is on the cross he made a public spectacle public spectacle means what embarrass them in public are you with me okay yeah it's read the verses in the language that you would understand because those are very powerful scriptures okay and just don't read them and move on you know someone says meditate on the word of God isn't it like meditate on this word okay read it and reread it okay and then reread it and the word meditate that was used there is see the scriptures out again softly right having disarmed the principalities and powers think about it okay all good no Hebrew chapter 2 verse 14 one more scripture in as much then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood he himself likewise shared in the same that through death he might destroy him who had the power of death that is the devil okay he might destroy one who had the power of death that is the devil okay he had the power of death and Jesus defeated him on the cross so cross is powerful for us to understand why do we minister healing and deliverance is because of what Jesus did for us amen why do we minister to everyone in healing and deliverance because the cross is for everyone okay I say that again why do we minister in healing and deliverance because the cross is for everyone no no no the cross is only for me yeah sorry guys the cross is for everyone and then the blood of Jesus as if the cross was not enough he gave us one more weapon take it my blood okay cross in chapter 1 verse 13 and 14 he has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the son of his love in whom we have the redemption through his blood the forgiveness of sins Hebrews 9 verse 12 not with the blood of goats and calves but with his own blood he entered the most holy place once for all having obtained eternal redemption okay the blood of Jesus it speaks a better word than the judgment the blood of Jesus is alive and that's why we partake of the blood of the table of God of communion right every Sunday we all know the story in Exodus 12 I think when people of Israel before they leave Egypt tells Moses that people of Israel are to put the blood of a lamb a spotless lamb on the doorpost of every household you remember that story and so when judgment came it would pass over that household which had the blood that's where we get the pass over from is when the judgment of God came it would pass over the house that had the blood of the lamb on its doorpost now did you notice that when the judgment came it did not check who was worthy behind the door when judgment came it did not knock on the door and said okay you know it didn't do that it only saw the blood on the doorpost right it's the blood of God blood of Jesus that covers us from sin we understand we very clearly understand that God forgave our sins we've been forgiven we understand that really well we've been forgiven but we don't understand or we easily forget or neglect that we've been given we've not just been forgiven but you've also been given the righteousness of Jesus okay it's very important that we understand that alright so the blood of Jesus shed for us on the cross it redeems us okay I think we stop here because if we go on to the next section we move on okay so let's do a quick recap we just looked at the two bases for ministering healing and deliverance basis number one God's nature thank you and the second one the cross and in that we see that the blood of Jesus right and we also see that his in God's nature we see that his covenant name is Jehovah Rapha he's our healer etc okay alright great so we'll pause here we'll take a quick break and we'll resume in the next section okay thank you


Welcome to today's episode of the mindset mentor podcast. I'm your host Rob dial if you have not yet done so hit that subscribe button So you never miss another podcast this episode today We're gonna be talking about some ancient Japanese technique to help you improve yourself Push yourself and grow yourself now What we're gonna be talking about is a practice that you could do once a year if it's really really big You do once a quarter, but I recommend just doing something like this once a month Once every 30 days and see what happens in your life It will drastically drastically improve your life and what it's called is the misogi challenge and misogi Is actually two words in Japanese and hopefully I don't mess this up if anyone speaks Japanese I probably will it's mizu which stands for water and Soggy which stands for to purify or purification and now the misogi is Usually a process that involves cold water for purification But this entire episode will not be just about cold water But if you've been listening to the podcast long enough You know that I love the benefits of having really cold water and using that to push yourself past not you just your physical capacity, but more than anything else your mental capacity and This will be able to this this episode will be geared towards how to use your willpower To do something that's extremely hard and how to do one thing just one thing that will massively grow you as a Person like just think about this for a second All too often we think the process of change is Gradual like oh, I'm slowly going to make my soul I'm improving myself every single day and that can happen sure But there's also a chance that something can happen that just drastically changes you in just one go and the idea behind This is to do something that is so hard that all of the rest of the things in your life that seem quote-unquote Hard don't seem like such a big deal and the more that we can push ourselves Outside of our comfort zone the more that we grow our willpower the more that we get comfortable Finding our edge in pushing past it in finding our edge in pushing past it the less we focus on all the little shit That really doesn't matter, you know the people who think Of the world is so bad and they're complaining the most in the world the people that are and this is a general statement I understand this but the people who are complaining the most right now are the people who are not wanting to do The hard things they want things done for them instead of actually going out and changing the world and changing themselves They'd rather just sit behind their keyboard or move their thumbs around on their iPhone a little bit and complain about how the world is Not what they want it to be versus actually getting their ass up in doing something about it Now if you listen to this podcast you know that you need to change You know that you need to change so you're not probably one of those people that just wants to sit behind a keyboard and Just blame everybody else and blame the government and blame your parents and blame all those people You know that in order to make massive change in the world In order to make massive change in your life that you are the one that needs to make massive change And so the idea of Musogi is instead of taking a month or this year or this quarter to Gradually change yourself. How can you just have one big massive event that changes you? And the original Musogi the way that it works just to kind of give you an idea before I kind of give you what? Tweaks have been made by other people to use this idea the original Musogi it could be a few days long Fast for a few days Don't eat any food be completely away from your phone go out into nature You could do some meditation or prayer or whatever it is And then the Musogi was you would go to cold water and you go to a river Or you would go to a waterfall where the water is way colder than what you are comfortable with and Submerging yourself in staying in there as long as you can without injuring yourself. So this is a you know Is it a physical thing? Yeah But even more than physical this can be a mental a physical and a spiritual practice for your purification Because the only problems that exist in the world are the problems that you're let me say this again The only problems that exist in your life are the problems that you think are there that the problems that you're creating We create all of our problems And so if we can start to become aware of that and we can have this big Purification process once a month once a year once a quarter. I recommend once once a month How can we use this idea of having something massively change us in one go and it can be cold water We can talk about that and we will talk about that But I'm also gonna give you some other examples of things that you could do that could be Extremely challenging and be a mental physical and spiritual purification process for you So, you know when you look at cold water, there's so many benefits to cold water I always talk about the inner bitch the inner bitch is that voice that's in your head that says don't wake up Don't work out eat that cookie instead of eating something healthy And the thing that's holding you back more than anything else in this world is that inner bitch It's not anyone else in the world It's not anything else in the world it is that voice that is inside of your head and that voice is the thing That's always pushing up against you when you're trying to use your willpower and when you jump into cold water like very cold water 3545 40 degree water It's gonna test your willpower and willpower the beautiful thing about it is it is something that can grow You're not just born with willpower not built with willpower But how can we bring this idea of doing you know a two or three day fast with prayer and with meditation And with really cold water and bring this mental physical and spiritual practice Into our lives because some of you guys don't have three days to fast and to just drink water and to go on this journey But we could do it in one day we could do it over the course of hours Half of a day an entire day whatever it is How can we develop a cadence of misogy and we can use water and we can use other hard things But the idea is to do something once again last time I'll say it so hard that it changes you in one day How can we do something that is so hard for us that it changed us in one day not the gradual process of oh I'm I'm bettering myself. I'm trying to make myself. I'm slowly getting rid of all of my problems No, what if it was just boom one moment? We did something and it changed us because there's been many things that have happened in Your life good and bad that have been one thing that happened and not one thing completely changed your life So why can't we create the one thing that completely changes who you are? And so what do you need to do to feel like a changed person after it and once again?  I don't know your body But you can take all of them and start to think of what your own could be So I'll give you a couple of examples one of them could be like a really intense hike And I don't mean like you go to Sedona and find the most beautiful Easy one that you could do and you take some selfies and you post them on Instagram And you bring a nice little water bottle and you're like, oh, it's kind of hot Let me put on some put on some sunblock and it's like a little hike because you could do a little hike in Sedona I've been there many times, but you can also do some really really challenging Hikes like trying to get to the top of of Like Thunder Mountain, which is the huge mountain that's in the middle of Sedona That is something that takes hours and it will test your willpower and you will want to give up Over and over and over again That's the point. You want to give up. You don't want to do it. You want to give up You don't want to do it. You want to give up. You don't want to do it You're gonna give yourself all of the excuses, but you fight through it And you try to find another version of yourself on the other side It is something though that isn't just like, oh, this is a little bit of a challenge It's something that is almost beyond your capacity Now when I say this is the reason why I gave a caveat I don't know your hiking abilities.  You know your abilities. You know your What your heart can do and what you can't do and you know, there's some people that are listening that are super fit You've been on crazy long intense hikes. Well, then you could do something different Maybe what you could do and I've heard people doing this before Is going to the Grand Canyon and hiking all the way down to the bottom of the Grand Canyon And then hiking all the way back up in one day I've heard of people that decided to use Misogi and Clown Mount Everest. Do I recommend that? Uh, you can if you want to I watched a documentary on Mount Everest two nights ago And they were talking about the others hundreds of bodies that are still up there because they can't remove them So there is that aspect of it. We're not going to be like, hey, everybody here listening needs to go and hike Mount Everest what I'm saying is Find your capacity and push past it So maybe a really long intense hike a day long hike Maybe a couple day long hike that is just really intense for you What do you want to give up? But you don't give up on yourself is what you need That's a pretty good example of something she could do What's another good really really good example? Sweat lodges is a really good example. Once again, I don't recommend any of these But you have to know yourself a sweat lodge is a really good great example It's not like hopping into a sauna a sweat lodge is usually with somebody who is A shaman or someone who is a facilitator That will take you through this hours long journey of purifying and sweat and water and purifying and sweat and water meditation and prayer and all of these things To find what your capacity is And push past it because for me when I go into the sauna, it's about 20 minutes But hours long. Nope never done that before I've never gone for 20 minutes and then taken five minutes off at 20 minutes of five minutes off 20 minutes of five minutes off Five or six times in a row, but that would be a pretty good example of like Finding your capacity what you can and can't do Maybe it has to do with doing some psychedelics. I don't recommend psychedelics to anybody I have done them many times and this is one of the reasons why I think psychedelics actually change people so much Is because it is a version of misogy.  There's mushrooms. There's ayahuasca There's ibogaine, which is a 12 hour up to 24 hour journey that you can go on There's all of these different things where you can do it and it's it is an extremely intense event Where you're going to find the other side of you and all of your demons that are inside are going to come up All of your demons that are holding you back that are ruining your relationships that are keeping you from being the best version of yourself All of those things the point of this is to come in contact with the quote-unquote demons I don't mean like physical spiritual demons that are trying to take over your body I mean the demons inside of you the the devil on your shoulder and the angel on one shoulder All the devils that are on your shoulder that are telling you to sleep in all of them that are saying No, don't do that. Don't work out. Don't eat that healthy stuff. Take a break.  That's going to bring up your doubter That's going to bring up the person that doesn't want to do it That's going to bring up all of the demons that you have inside of you that you want to get rid of I had this happen one time where I had a client And from the very beginning she was a successful woman. She worked with me one on one For a really long time and in the very first month of us working together She's just you could tell she was What I like to call fat and happy not she wasn't physically fat But if fat and happy just basically means like uh I'm comfortable life is okay. I can pay my bills You know, she she made a few hundred thousand dollars a year. So she's good like she can pay her bills She could take some trips. She has a nice car. She does some stuff.     I've ever known and all of that comes out and it's like I'm gonna do it Anyways, and you keep going and What I told her about was this idea of the law of 40 percent and the law of 40 percent is something I've heard David Goggins talk about David Goggins says, you know, 250 mile runs over the course of 48 hours And just insane things and what he talks about the law of 40 percent Is that most of us will when we get to 40 percent of our capacity We think we're at 100 percent of our capacity and our brain basically has this safety switch inside of it that says, hey You're approaching all that you can do you need to stop you need to stop you need to stop And it's a safety mechanism that our brain has to basically keep our body safe, right? This is why I'm saying to you I don't recommend any of this because I don't know your body. I don't know you Then I want to make sure that you're safe But I also want to make sure that you continue to push yourself and continue to find the capacity of your willpower into to grow that willpower And he says when the when you when you feel like you're at like your last bit This guy's run 250 miles Many times he says when you feel like you have nothing left in your body You're only at 40 percent of your capacity And if you think about that how many times do we actually get To feeling like we have nothing left in the tank Very rarely and if nothing left in the tank and what that feels like is only 40 percent of your capacity What could happen if we decide to push past that what decide what what could we find on the other side of that version of ourself That is on the other side of the 40 percent So I gave this idea to her and I said, you know, you could go for a run You could tell yourself you're going to go for five miles for 10 miles 15 20 whatever it is I don't really care the distance what I care about is meeting That version of you that's holding yourself back Meeting that voice inside of your head meeting that anger that is bubbling under the surface All the time of your entire life that might be from your childhood And you've been caring with it for you caring you with it with Caring it with you for years and years and years and years and years And I was like I want you to find it I want you to push past it and I want you to go further than you think is even possible And she was really hesitant. She's like, okay I'll do it because she was just tired of the fat and happy feeling so it happened She ended up doing it next week. We have a call and she's like that was the most amazing thing I've ever done. She's like, I don't know how long I was going But I feel like I was running for hours and I got to the point where I'm sweating I'm pissed off at you. I'm pissed off at myself.  She's like, this is what he said was going to happen I've got to push past it and she found this version of herself where she felt like she was at her capacity And she ran for another hour and a half after and she just kept going and her body kept going and she realized That there was a whole other side of her that she had never tapped into this animalistic side of her That was just like I'm going to change. I'm going to do this. There is no questioning. There is no thinking There is no something might be wrong Which she saw for a few days. She was But I'm telling you this it was like a switch It was a different person on all of the rest of our phone calls after that because she was able to go through And I didn't know this was misogy at the time But she was able to go through this misogy and a lot of times we are capable of so much But we settle for safe Because we want to be safe. That's the animalistic part of us that wants to be safe and wants to be taken care of But there's another version of us self that we can meet on the other side of pushing past that safe And something like this can really open you up to believing more in yourself Because you did something that was so ridiculously hard and you pushed past it And now you're like if I can do that I can make You know 50 cold calls. I can knock on 35 doors today And what happens is the things that and I said this the beginning of the podcast episode The things that seemed quote-unquote hard. You realize we're never hard in the first place Mentally in your mind You are making them feel like they were hard, but they were never actually hard And so the things that were quote-unquote hard before the misogy are easy after If I can do that thing I can definitely do these stupid things if I can do that thing I can definitely do this if I can push myself past and believe in myself And all of that I can definitely do these things that I do on a daily basis And the things that seem quote-unquote hard you realize are really not a big deal You're making a mountain out of an anthill So the idea is you can do this thing that at this moment it can change you You don't know if you can do it.


Well, looks like it's recording. So we've got get credentials binding project July 28th, 7.30 a.m. India Standard Time. So the hardship we were talking about before he joined, we were just kind of kicking off with this topic of private key support and things that we should check. You had mentioned something in the Gitter about an RSA RSA encrypted keys that you're having problems with with the library or anything. Can you do you want to kick off the discussion on with some detail there? Yeah, so I think that the SSD library is not supporting the RSA encrypted key, which is an open SSH format. I mean, any other key, such as is the CDSA 19, which is encrypted and even in open SSH format is, you know, performing the task very well, but the RSA encrypted is not. I think that the issue is from the SSJ library rather than in the binding code. Okay, but have you tried debugging and Yeah, yeah, I tried to debug. Well, I have not gone through the code of the SSJ library that much. So No, that's okay. Because I can see from there from the lead me they say in the supported I can see RSA. The signature SSH dash RSA. So, Rishabh, could you could you provide a link that we could drop into the document on the Because it may be that we're just talking to different types. Also, I just discovered tomorrow that the VKCS8 encrypted Encoding is not supported that they're not supported in the boundary castle plugin API. Like it's showing an error when I was performing tests. So I think I need to either open an issue or make a PR regarding that. We do have a VKCS8 format private keys open SSH. Any, it can be in open SSH. But I've I've never seen open SSH mention any support for PKCS8 keys. I would assume that if open SSH doesn't support it, we don't need to. Yeah, and I thought that the VKCS8 format is useful certificates. I mean, storing certificate changes sort of format which is used to storing to mediate and Client root certificates. That's what I thought. So harsher than I think what you're hearing is that we're not worried about PKCS8 format as far as I can tell because Not a concern. Because open SSH doesn't support it. And so PKCS8 format unless you've unless you found some way to use PKCS8 to to communicate with open SSH I've never I've never seen it mentioned in any documentation. So I will look into that more because I'm just discovered the issue this yesterday. But if Mark is saying as Mark is saying that open SSH is not supporting it then why would we need to worry about it because if a user is not able to create a key with it then SSH keep it then why would it be an issue for us. Okay, now I'm seeing that. Okay, so open SSH takes a minus M argument for key format and does accept PKCS8 as a public key or private key. So apparently it will accept PKCS8 so we may have to just declare pay not supported. I mean. Yeah, I should go on. Yeah, code is available in the bouncy gas labia for the PKCS8 but it is not performing as expected you know you can say it is showing an error. I think that's an that's a bug for that. I mean the code is there in the plugin but it's showing an error. So there's a bug and it is support it supports when there is an error bug is is not support is available for that in the plugin. So what I was was I was trying to say is that when we're talking about releasing this SSH private key as a binding for the plugin. Should we not focus on encryptions and formats which we know for sure are going to be encountered by 90 or let's see 80% of the user if that is something we can figure out. And if we know that then we should focus on that and first release the plugin with that those many encryption algorithms and we can say that we at this moment we don't support. Let's say PKCS8 or any other algorithm which is a bit outdated. I mean is that a viable strategy we could use Mark just in an internship for me if we support RS if we support the keys that a typical Linux system will generate. I think we're 90% of the way there and a typical when I say typical Linux system I mean a typical Linux system using SSH dash key gen. Yeah, I agree I think kind of try and solve the the broad case and then you know if we need to create follow g-ish use or something like that or just declare them as you know. What's what is supported we could even declare in the doc and then if it's unsupported and someone wants to take great an issue like that seems like an option to generally agree. I mean, there is there is a bug in the bouncy gasoline yes if that in in one of the libraries will be using if that is the case that I think that creates a dependency for blocks him right and then he would have to create a PR there and I'm not sure how their development cycle works. Yeah. You've opened up a discussion with them right fashion of pkcs a bug what you're saying. Oh no I just discovered it yesterday so I have a little bit more on that and then I will. Will I think open any sure I should I should I look into the code and solve the is all the sure should I just open any super. My advice will be first you should have you gone through the unit tests so actually I was trying to find the unit test I was not able to write down but I remember that in the unit test they've tested a lot of algorithms. These encryption algorithms and they've shown how to decrypt them so were you able to see an example of them decrypting a pkcs a format. Because I vaguely remember that I saw it but I just I'm not able to find it right now. So what I'm trying to say is just make sure that it is a bug from their side and not because maybe we are giving a wrong input or there's something that they something different than they expected something like that. I guess I'd even maybe go a different way like we could just kind of mark this as you know it may not work for now and just kind of like keep moving forward with the ones that are the standard ones just an interest of time and moving forward. Yeah, I'm, I'm agreed with Justin that if I think if we support RSA and ED 25519 we've probably already supported over 95% of the use cases, just with those two, those two algorithms and passphrase protected or not passphrase protected. Now, harsher, the thing I didn't understand from your, your Gitter comment was, I think you said that RSA is not working for you with when using open SSH format did I understand that correctly. Yeah. Okay, so so that's that would be a red hot one because RSA is the default used on many of the and I think maybe even most SSH implementations. Okay, so if the private key file is encrypted by the RSA format and we're not able to decrypt it right. The SSJ library is decrypting the file and return it in a PKCS format in form of byte array. And I'm using the bouncy castle if you had to convert it into a new format you can support so that it can be used for the authentication purpose because by that is not that much supported. I mean it was showing another because showing an issue that needs to secure the key is not that much secure if you are using byte array because the PEM format uses ES4 base 64 format for the transferring of the key that is more useful and more reliable rather than byte array. So. But I didn't I did not understand what is your issue your issue is that you're not able to use that byte array and then is there an issue with the transmission to the PEM format from PKCS it or is there an issue in decrypting that key. The issue is I'm not able to perform the authentication operation. Well, all others are being performed but the only thing is I'm not able to form the authentication operation it says that the other in the crypto. Okay, so. Okay, the library is not okay okay. So there is some issue with the decrypting key that is what it is. But I guess, are you able to take the byte array and put it down on the file system and see if that works without going taking that extra step. Yeah, I did that. Okay, and that that works right. Or no. No. That doesn't work okay. And so the, you know, the assesses banding is highly dependent on library so it is more slimming for open SSG is 100% dependent on the SSG lab and for other formats it's dependent on the BOMC castle plug in library API. So the bind the asset binding code that I am providing is not much. You know, playing much role that only the bindings are. So, yeah. So as I understand it. If, let's say you're RSA by fastest predict the first it will be. I think it would be encrypted by a cypher like he is something in that he is 256 and then that is decrypted and the second step would be to give you that RSA format format key into a by data right. And you're saying that that is provided to you in a PCC is a format. Yeah, when you're talking about RSA. Yeah, you have opened an issue in SSG. Oh yeah. I mean, if I'm wrong, they could even point me to the direction I am. And then that's great stuff. I just wanted to know, like, if you mean the issue is really in SSG library. So are we still using that, or should we, you know, look for the alternatives. It depends that we have an alternative, which would work for all of the cases. So, so RSE are for me RSA key support is crucial. Without our without RSE, we could, we could ship without it, I guess, but the pain factor would be enormous because most users generate our SA keys by default. So if we truly can't make it work with SSHJ I think we have to look for something else to that would support it. Yeah. Or provide a fix back to SSHJ that allows it to be supported that would be fine as well. But I'm just astonished if it's not supported because I would expect their consumers see it as the most common encryption algorithm. Yeah, and I guess, Harsha, I think you said that you just recently discovered this and maybe some more debugging can go into whether this, you know, there's just something else that needs to be done or something like that. Is that my understanding correct. And the RSA issue. Yeah, yeah. I have debug that on that but I could not, you know, could come to I still think that the issue is in SSJ lab. So, because the binding code is not that much playing role in the in decrypting the key and you know, giving the. In the byte array is just just giving the instinct form and and then out putting the key in basics to perform at even using the policy classes. Yeah. The reason that we're not consuming key, maybe decrypted byte array. So you're saying, first of all, I just don't understand that I'm seeing your code here which you've written in the issue that you get the private key out of the SSHK1 key file and then you get the encoded byte array. Okay, this encoded byte array you, then I would as you decoded base 64, right. This would be a base 64 encoded byte. Yeah. And you're saying that this isn't because he is a format because you, you check the get format from the get format function that this was PCCSA. And then, since this is PCCSA, as far as I understand you are working with PEM format files right so you would be doing that conversion as well. Yeah. So if you have, have you tried using the PCCSA file like converting that into a PCCSA file and then using that to establish a SSHK1. Or are you using the PEM after converting whatever logic you've created and then using the PEM to do that. I tried to byte array but it doesn't work and it didn't work so I'm now using the bouncy class label for that converting to PEM. I mean, that's also not working as well. I mean I tried both the cases. And have you seen in SSJ, is there an example, could you find a test case or something like that. I'm not sure how to do this. In the same example. Because I can, I cannot find that. I mean I have the SSJ. Yeah, that's a good question, Rashab. I think I'm, so I'm sorry I'm looking at the SSJ repo. And it looks like they have integration tests with RSA keys. Yeah, that's that's what I was seeing as well. So we might be able to use that. I mean, this is a PR that came in that actually looks like it recently added the some other keys. Or that's what it says anyways comprehensive support for public key of those certificates. So with certificates, that's slightly different I guess. So when we're talking about RSA, so then I was reading about open SSH is new format, which they implemented. So if I don't provide an encryption algorithm when I'm using SSH key gen, Mark, you were saying that the keys would be RSA keys generated the private key. So I think that's what I had experienced previously let me double check the man page just to be sure. Okay, because wouldn't open SSH default to the new open SSH format now. The encryption and I believe it's open SSH hyphen. But it depends on what system you're on and what you have. Oh, yeah, I mean that's a good point. But yeah, I think some older systems are probably going to have like older versions. Yeah, certainly the I would expect the version of open SSH that's installed on Centos seven to be dramatically different than the version that is installed on open BSD 69. Because one of those was created what Centos seven's original release is probably seven or eight years ago now, and open BSD 69 released in May of this year. So, so there that's that's why the operating system variants thing there is is on the test ideas is because those different versions of SSH may generate different different things that users will paste into the form. So I just tried SSH key gen and it's generating a public and private RSA key. So I just tried the same thing on open BSD 69 and it is offering to when I run SSH SSH key gen with no arguments it offers to store it in dot SSH slash ID underscore RSA. So I think it's still defaulting to generate an RSA key. So that means that this since the RSA key would not be the new SSH format then I think bouncing as it would be able to do it right because RSA is relatively open SSH was new and fault and they don't support the direction of past phase protected private keys when they're in open SSH format but RSA, I think will be supported right. Not even SSJ bouncing. Yeah, so I'm afraid I don't know which libraries support which, which formats and that's where I think harsh it's investigation is the is the harsh it's implementation is the real answer. If it's not working for him, then it probably won't work for the users. I've seen that I clearly remember that the bouncy castle Java repository that contains test where they show the show various formats how to decrypt them. Have you seen some of the examples there, do you see, could you find examples how they're doing it when it comes to RSA. RSA encrypted using bouncy castle encrypted without encryption. I would expect both. So the format will be different. Yeah, yeah, I think that's a good exercise. I think that's the easiest way to find it. And the correct way to do it as well. And maybe, maybe it's that we end up using bouncy castle directly instead of SSHJ. If you can because you'll have the bouncy cap castle API is already imported. So maybe it's that we use SSJ for the 25519 and bouncy castle for RSA. So if you show up, I think you're kind of also saying that maybe that'll unlock using SSJ to use RSA. No, I'm just saying, I would say, if, if we don't have to the issue where we have to switch from bouncy castle to SSJ started from point where open SSH private keeping their format that that is where bouncy castle is supporting us. But since RSA is when we're creating keys which are in RSA that should be supported by it is supported by bouncy castle. Open SSH they said that it. So I'm trying I'm assuming that we can find some place where they've done it. Decrypted RSA in bouncy castle and not sure why SSJ is not supporting it. Any other thoughts on that one or any other concerns that we need to talk about besides the big one. I'm trying to catch myself up to speed just reading the SSH key gen man page and I think I've got more, more things we need to put in the formats in the key, or maybe less things to put in the key formats. I have three key formats that are listed here I'm going to update that just because I was being imprecise it looks like they've got a thing called RFC 4716 slash SSH to public. Okay, that one we've got Pam, and then pkcs eight. So, those three seem to be the key formats that it can that SSH key gen can both import and export, and can change the passphrase on them. So, so for me I think Justin to your question. I've just got, I need to do more, I didn't need to test the code that harsh it has submitted as part of the poll request, and see, see confirm that doesn't support RSA keys that I've generated. But if it does, which kind of RSA keys does it not support that sort of thing. Yeah, that makes sense. Do we have any other topics that we should cover now. I think this is our big one right now. Yeah, and I apologize my capacity to do testing right now is pretty limited the next chance that I'll be able to attack this is probably this weekend. So, were there any other topics that you wanted to cover in today. Well, I'm pretty occupied by this. There's not much to go over. Only the, the two things were there only the SSJ regarding this and then the bouncy castle, and we have discussed on that. Yeah, so I guess from here maybe we, I guess are we maybe done for today and then offline we kind of like people can take a poke at the RSA stuff see what we find out. I'm happy to continue talking about this to I'm not trying to close down the subject early. I just, I just went into a smart like off topic. So mark the issue that I encountered when the, you know, are looking at the fat version was 4.19. So it was all when you change it to 4.21 so tell me what was causing that. Unfortunately, I don't have any guess at all. What was causing it because that was I couldn't, I couldn't duplicate it and and I think what you're saying is now you no longer see it either. Interesting. Yeah, so I've, I don't, I don't know what what would have caused that that was. I mean I guess it could have been something corrupted or mangled in your maven repository cash that's on your in your dot m2 directory. It could be some other surprise I, I apologize harsh it but I just don't know that that was completely perplexing to me. And it was not, you know, reproducible by by you. It was not. No. I have to, I have to system so on both the system before showing the other so I was sure that it was. Interesting and, and yet. Okay, so then if it was showing it on both systems and it certainly should not have been anything related to local corruption on one system and not another. That that's really strange and but are are either of the systems still showing the problem. No after you know changing to 4.21 then it was gone. Interesting. If you, if you switch back to 4.20 does the issue return. I think it will. So that may that yet that might indicate some real problem in the parent parent version 4.20 4.20 but I have not seen any mention of that kind of problem. I don't know where in the Jenkins mailing lists. Let me see if let me see if I can read the releases to see if there's some hint in the release notes. Okay, so 4.21 was released to remove the spot bugs upgrade to 4.3.0. So that to me doesn't seem like doesn't seem like it would be likely to do any damage to your ability to compile. And, oh no 4.20 though requires Maven 3.8.1. What version of Maven are you currently running. I've dated about first for that. I was learning 3.6.1. So it shouldn't as I updated to 3.8.1 or zero. I think 8.1. Okay good so you're running the correct version and so that's not the problem. Okay so unfortunately I don't have have any guess what could be going wrong and and just would suggest hey let's continue and if it if the issue appears again we'll ask on the developer list to see if others can give us any help. Yeah, I've had. Yeah, the two systems thing is interesting. I've had similar local Maven cache sad times before that sometimes magically fix themselves after clean but yeah with two systems. Interesting. Hopefully we're happy now. Yeah. Okay then I've I've exhausted my topics. So you're just generating those keys when you're testing so you're just you're not providing a specific algorithm right you're just generating then using SSS key gen. Yeah. No no I'm providing. Well it depends on which for which algorithm I want to use and for my. Yeah of course and you're giving RSA as the algorithm. And the private key when you open it, you're seeing open SSH private key or you're saying RSA private key. Open SSH. Yeah so. So then the problem then I was saying that RSA should be supported and we should definitely find a solution for bouncing acid problem. So this is not the RSA algorithm right this would be open SSH. Yeah we would need to look at SSJ because SSJ is able to decrypt open SSH the newer format with different algorithms. You've tried with different right but with RSA you're saying it's not. I'll try doing it as well. No harsh it you'll continue your investigation of key support and we'll we'll talk further on Friday if I've had a chance to submit or active testing. We can look at the results and otherwise it may be next Monday before or next Tuesday or Wednesday your time before I'm ready to talk about test results. I will be submitting some you know tests for that. Oh you can go through that. Great. Excellent. Yeah but yeah I also like our shops idea about looking to see if there's any, if you can find any unit tests for bouncy castle anywhere really maybe there are even another repositories for RSA. Yeah, and I definitely see RSA based tests in the SSHJ repository. If you look at the data files, they don't look. They look like they are one of the variants of of files that are understood by open SSH, but I haven't haven't proven I haven't confirmed that by interactive test.  Yeah.  All right, well I guess we have nothing else we can close her up. Thanks everybody. Thanks everybody. Bye. Have a good one. Take care.