Rydyn yn gweithio i'r cwysydd hiaeth i ffrenydd yng Nghymru, yng nghyrch ynghordd o'u cwysydd yng nghymru yn ysgoldd yn Sw reading ar gyfer ymddangos gyda allwyr gofynnol yn y bwysig, rwyf yn amlwg hynny, oherwydd i chi'n gymryd gyda allwyr gofynnol lle siwr hŷn eich hwyl yn gynghwysgau ac cychwyn ysgoldd.  Rwy'n rhan o'n meddwl i'r cyffredinol i'r sgwyrdau i weithio i'r gweithio, i'r ysbyt yn wir i'r cyffredinol, y ddechrau i'r ddefnyddio i'r cyffredinol i'n gweithio i'r cyffredinol. If I had a lost in Cotwm, I would have never fought again and just retired. 20 minutes before I had to walk to the ring, if I said this somewhere down there, the British Boxing Board of Control came into me dressing room, wouldn't wait till after the fight. Came in me dressing room, 20 minutes before I walked to the ring, I had to take me glove off and they said, if you don't give us a cheque signed now for £10,000 for the £10,000, you're not going to be able to go and get in the ring and fight. T-tract if I thought you were there? Eh, you could say that, look through the court documents and you'll soon see. As I said before, I've done things I'm not proud of, but I don't give a fuck, I've done things to provide for the family that I've got. Me kids don't have to be born, I put them on the planet, so whichever way I've got to provide, I will provide. And that's the distress and the pressure I had on my mind. Victor Lochlan stepped in and he waved his arm straight away, he was asleep. He had to zed it, the floor was so heavy when he banged the floor, he was asleep, he was out for about 5-10 minutes after it. Eh, I remember just collapsing to my knees and thinking you've done it. It's a dream, it's a sort of, like I said, I've lived, I don't know many people in life where they are, and I know how to say things, but you listen, I've lived my dream, I've lived it and every night when I close my eyes, every time I think of boxing, I just really live my dream again, I say it over, and I don't know many people saying now how they smile in your face, how happy you are. It's just, I can't put it into words. Ben, we're on.  Lovely to meet you. How are you brother? I'm okay mate, it's eh, cracking on. Eh? I'd say I'm a lot less busy these days, but I'm not, I'm busier than ever. I know me way in here, it just looks like I've took on another bleeding boxer, so I've pulled up at a carpark and a kid who I've known for a long, long time is struggling to get a fight and just said, can you help me? And I've just been like, I'm late for something because I've got to get there now. I've just been lumped in another boxer 20 minutes ago, so I don't know. Cracking on mate, it's finding ways to remain busy. First of all brother, anniversary yesterday with The Good Wife, so congratulations. Thank you. World champion boxer, one at goodness in part, your boy here with T-Ros. Yes. Good dream, brand rocky films. The people's champ, you're loved all over the country brother. And to have you on the day as a guest mate is unbelievable and thanks to Tony for sorting this out and the boys that only feels bad for giving us. Pleasure. Some opportunity mate for. I never even knew, you know what I haven't been to town for such a long, long time. Just madness happens when I say, I love where I'm from and I'm very proud of Liverpool. I don't think they'd actually get that much trouble in here with the surroundings, I think it looks. It's not the scene for the young boys who are going out to cause trouble. I think there's more of a scene for my age, which is very sad because it's let me know how old I really am. It's bustle. So if I do come to town mate, I will be coming in definitely. And I'll be letting the lads know, you know what? This is a kind of function place as well. So it just, you know what? It takes me back and you won't know. I'm from the south end of Liverpool. We used to go to a pub, one of our first pubs that they'd let us in. I think we were 17, 18, might have even been a bit younger. But we used to go to Grove in Chattey and the Grove was only one tenth of the size of this. I mean that bar was the actual bar in the Grove and this sitting area was the whole pub. It was like a house made into a pub. We used to go there. We could have a baby and I'm on the slide and she was sat behind the bar.  And it was definitely a little life was just beginning. Yeah mate, my life was much easier. I always go back to the start with the guest Tony, where you grew up and how it all began. I was born in Toxfordth and I was raised in Waverty. So it started off. I've got two older brothers, one younger brother. Craig is my eldest brother, Mad Blue, got me following him in football club. Mi arfa is a mad copite, well was a mad copite. My other older brother became blue when he got to about 30, I think, our Wesley. He started being bothered about football after he finished uni. Then there was me and then there's my little brother, our Liam.  I think that's everybody from Liverpool to be fair.    Is that why you became a boxer? I wouldn't say that's why I've become a boxer now. I loved fighting. I was just like fighting. I became a boxer to impress my dad. My dad is a kind of guy who is never going to be impressed by coming home with 10 GCSEs. He'd say, he'd tell you that's what he wants his son to do. He'd say, I want my son to bring home 10 A-levels, all-levels, whatever they were called when he was doing well, put GCSEs to me. But my dad was a fighting man. So my dad ran most of the nightlife in this city that we're in now, the city centre. The nightlife sector was his, the security aspect of it, sorry. And he, you know, he done well and had everything in this city sorted out with the security with the lads. And I suppose he gained that respect because my dad could really have a fight. Wasn't the best boxer, had two amateur fights. First amateur fight he won. This is the story I'm told. And the second amateur fight, he got his face jabbed off in the first round, went back at the end of the first round, picked up a stool and attacked the opponent of the stool. It starts at second. I don't think my dad would have the mentality of an actual boxer by the rules, but me, it's very rare I've seen, well, I've never seen it, and man be able to help fight me off on the street. Yeah, street fighter. Yeah, he could just fight me, so he would never back down or give in to absolutely anyone. I've heard all the stories of my dad over the years fighting with who's who in our city. When it was years ago, when it was just a fight. Years ago it'd be two fellas, they have a problem, so get outside, we sorted out. After it's done, shake hand it's done with. Nowadays everyone's stabbing and shooting each other, but when my old fella was a young man, it wasn't that way, it was have a... Bones to models, yeah. That's it, mate, which I wish we still lived by them model, but we don't. So that's the way I started boxing.  I was a kick growing up, loved me food. And I quickly developed a knack for punching people and hitting people with my fists, and then I went to the boxing gym. How old? When I very first walked in the boxing gym, I started with Terry Quinn, I think I was about 13, 14. I didn't take it seriously, just thought I was messing around with it, dabbled with it. I didn't take it, I didn't even try properly at it until I got to 14, 15. 15, I'd say. Once I got to 15 I thought, I'm not bad at this, I was sparring with grown men at this stage. Sometime professionals. So I remember a guy called Stevie Bristol. Good friend of mine. Stevie's a great fella. I've worked on the door with him, security. I had just a boss, boss fella. And so Stevie was someone who, when I was 14, 15, that boxing age where I didn't know whether I was taking it seriously or how good I was, he was a professional and he was of a good standard as well, could really punch.  And he only tapped me. And so I was sure he always wanted to show Steve what I could do in this and that in the 05-1 gym. It progressed from there and then I used to see the luck me half of the gimmy. When I was in a boxing gym and doing things and as I kept progressing and getting better and better, it just made me dad so proud. So ultimately I stuck at it. At 15 years of age I got expelled from school for believing on my fighting once again. And then up on being expelled from school, I'd left school with no qualifications, nothing to me name. I thought, right, I'm going to pursue this boxing career properly. At this stage I'd had two amateur fights for Stockbridge ABC. The first one and the pretty, I'd say quickly, but it didn't. The first one was against the guy called Rob Beach from St. Ellen's ABC, Martin Morley's Old Gym. And I fought him and he was tough as anything. I remember weighing in and I was a late developer as a kid. So at 15, I was fighting big bullies. I was obviously fighting at 86 kilos, which just cruise away. Dad is 13 stone eight, I believe. And it turns over the way in and I was like to me coach at the time, his name was Mark Kinney from Stockbridge ABC and I said, Mark, you were in my boxing and he went that kid over there and I looked at him and then I was like, looked at him again.  And I was like, I barely had a hair on my bollock's knees. I was like, how can I be fighting him?  And he went, no, that's your opponent you're fighting. You know, he's, I think he was 17 or 18 at the time. When you get to a certain age in boxing, I think it was cadet age. It's your box fighters between 15 and 17.  And he went, I fought him. It's the only one of two fights I've ever been nervous for. It was Rob Beach and we got into basically swinging windmills. Luckily, unfortunately enough, one of my windmills caught him in the third round and put him out. That was my first ever amateur fight in the height and suite. Second amateur fight was Ryan Connolly and Heat Waves Leisure Centre. I absolutely baptized him in 30 seconds. That was a good one. And then he just went on and on from there. And as I say, I seen how I made up with Dad Boss. Like, after I would knock win a fight in the amateur boxing, he literally wanted to cheat me.  Where the fight come home and said, being dead good in school today, Daddy'd be like, yeah, well done. So that's great, I made up. But Dad was just knocked someone out. It's time to score what you want. Fuzzy boots, you know, gear, I thought you haven't solved what you want. Up on me, doing really well in the amateurs with the training. That's when he got me in my first season, took it for everything in the Gladys Street. So I'd say boxing and fighting just went on and on. I always wanted to impress him and that was the way to impress him. Did you respect your dad? I was about to feel there as well. I always respected my dad, yeah. Don't get me wrong, my dad left home when I was 10 years old. He was just, my dad's a brilliant father. He just wasn't very good at the husband thing. Working in nightlife security, working on doors, it's a bit of a temptation that he's constantly faced with all the time with women, young girls.  That was me, Daddy. He was a fantastic father. Did I affect you at any point at school? The free reign to the shackles come off when the dad isn't there as much to get into trouble? He was in me life all the time, but it was very, very tough a face. When he first left and you're 10 years old, I was like, it's a shock to the system. And then for six months, you play that thing of, you kind of play them off against each other. They're not talking to each other, they don't know what's going on between them. So when I'm with my dad, it's like, dad, me mum won't let me do this, or I can't get that. So then you play that for six months and then ultimately, it just sinks in me half. I'm not here anymore.  Once I started seeing this girl, I linked up with a group of lads and I never, ever lost contact with them. Really, so we're still all the best of me today. What was that? Yeah, there's about seven or eight of us. And my best mate ended up being a footballer, Neil Danes. And it's mad at work, doubt we just all stick together. And my friends basically became my family. I love my brothers, but my eldest brother moved out. My brother after him, or Wesley, went to university in Wolverhampton. So basically, I'm now the man of the house at about 14, 15. I'm the man of the house and I've got to look after my little brother because he was, you know, Ali is a lovely kid, but he's a feminine guy lad. He's not a guy lad who's going to be like, hello lad, what's happening?  Ali was like, hey, yeah. So that's what caused all the problems in the fight when he was a kid. Do you feel as if you had to protect all the time? Yes, of course, yes and no, but tough growing up, but I wouldn't change it for the world.  A lot of people who make it forget everyone else. People, you know what I mean? People say, oh, you're humble. I don't, it's mad because I don't see myself as being humble. I just see myself as being me. I've not always tried to be me.  So once you've done me, that's it, I'm done. I'm the most loyal person and given and caring person you could ever wish to meet.  I don't do second chances. Trust is very, like I don't trust people anymore because I've been banned too many times. So the reason why I've stayed the way I am, I don't know, it's just, I just see myself as being myself. But I'll say, I'm definitely a product of my environment. Growing up in where we grew up, Waverty is just a boss place I love where I'm from and very proud of where I'm from. Vast majority of where you grow up is spent in Waverty. Another huge part of it is spent in Togstith. So I'm just definitely a product of my environment because I'm a cheeky foco where I want to be and I love having a fight. I can tell you a joke, I still love fighting. I wish I could carry on. Is that your blood? Yeah, I wish I could just fight forever, you know. I used to go and work on the door. So at 15, I found myself on a, in the club of five one, they gave me a security jumper, said stand down the stairs by the DJ box and make sure I know that it's coming to DJ box and there's a radio. So at that 15 years of age and you just, your eyes get opened. So 15, 16 I'm standing there and I'm watching people snore cocaine and I'm watching people take ecstasy tablets. These days, it's just mad and I'm thinking, you know, someone trying to get in the DJ box every now and again, I'll have to give someone a crach. And it's mad that I'd be fighting. I'd like to give a crach to grown men when they were trying to push it away. Because I was, I had a young person's face but I had a big person's physique at 15 years old. I was 15 stone.  So I just stuck to what I know. I'm fighting always keen in Andy when, especially in the environment, you grow up in. As I said, he is built on fight and survival and I feel like I've just been part of it, mate.   It's crazy.  Everyone's. And that genuinely mean that.  Right, Glasgow, Liverpool, places like Belfast at the plant, you know. People, it's like, we're northerners, but it's like, I want to go to London and I've been to some really tough place in London.   A survival mud. Yeah, at some point you've got to be that. A lot of people struggling, a lot of people. Yeah, a lot of people struggling with money and stuff, and if you know that yourself, then you kind of look for the other avenues to make money, and that's where the anger and frustration comes in. Everybody feels hard done by as well, but again, your prime example that you can still make something of your life. When I was a kid growing up, I always knew I wanted the nicer things. I always wanted nicer trainees. I always wanted to have a nice car. I always wanted to have a nice watch. I was going to get it one way or another. Early a part of my life, I've done things that I'm not proud of, but so has everybody else. But yeah, I always knew. I was going to have nicer things one way or another. And that's not down to my parents, because my parents didn't raise me like that, but the more, as I say, my friends became my family. And then there was other people growing up in my street. The lad over the road was cracking on, doing well, doing what he was doing, and I was like, he'd come home and he'd have a new pair of trainees on every day. He had like two or three mobile phones, a nice watch, and he wasn't driving because he couldn't drive, but he was doing everything else, and then people were picking up my cars.  You want a bit of the action, you want to do whatever you've got to do. But it is the way it is. In them areas, there's just no other way out. As I say, there was... In my street where I lived, I don't know, you know, there was a couple of clever kids, but I don't know what they came up with, qualification wise, they didn't know if they went to university or whatever, have you? The way out me was just, if you're not going to be a sportman, what else are you going to be? The aspects and the outlook that I used to have was, I want this, what have I got to do to get it? Go on, do it.  Very lucky. Yeah. Very, very lucky. I'm not someone who, when you say blessed, I wish I could believe in things like that, or not like a person who believes in God or stuff like that, I've seen too many horrible things happen.  I've never been helped by anyone. I've been given a leg up by about two people in my whole life.  And don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking anyone who believes in anything like that, because if that works for you, get it, crack on, I'm not knocking it. But for me, I just can't believe, as I say, and over the years, it's only got one way. Don't get me wrong, I take my kids to church, I want my kids to believe, I want my kids to believe in the mystical figure, but I just can't do it with me, so I just... What age did you get your first fight, professional fight? 26 or 27, 26. Yeah, 26. Yeah, 26, I'm 37 now, fucks sake. Man, I was pro for 10 years, so yeah. 26. How was it, cos that's quite a late start for some? Well, I was an amateur boxer, boxing for the GB, going round the world as an amateur. I loved it, I was three-time ABA champion, something that I didn't think I was ever going to be good enough to do. Achieved that, as I say, boxing for my country. I was on the GB squad, living in Sheffield Monday to Thursday. I just had my first son, Corey. And I didn't get on with the coach, to be honest, totally. He wasn't what I looked back on, man, of his word. You know, he shafted me, basically. But, you know, I wasn't done. I just wasn't cut out for his style of boxing, I suppose, or maybe I wasn't good enough, I don't know, but the fact where I was a three-time ABA champion in this country, lost very few internationals. I think I lost three out of about 14, 15 international bouts. I was very, very successful on the amateur bouts. Never lost a dual international, took part in about six or seven of them. And then, I had an argument and fell out with him. My first son's been born. I'm living in Sheffield Monday to Thursday away from my son as an amateur boxer, which I didn't like at all. Very, very odd, yeah, as I say, Monday to Thursday was horrible in Sheffield and also didn't appreciate the training. You train three or four times a day, when that's just unnecessary.   It's not needed. You know, you can get out in them four sessions in one, what you would need, or in two, if you want to break it up and get a better recovery from it. So I just thought, I got to the stage where at the end there had been an argument and fell out with him.  I was in and £1,000 a month through the Liberal City Council scheme of being an elite scholar. I had an elite scholarship. I was training to be a trainee accountant. I had fuck-all knowledge of being an accountant. I just thought, I can count money, so that's going to be what it's about.  It was about ledgers, profit, loss margins, all that kind of thing. I never had any time for that. So I thought, listen, I'll go pro. And when I first came pro, I thought my plan will be, I know I'll win a British title, I'll piss a British title. I'll defend it a few times, keep that lovely belt and then I'll look to see if I can earn enough money to keep buying houses. At this moment in time, I'm now living in a terraced house in Old Swan on the board of my elder brother. And I'm basically just surviving. That's what I was doing. And it was just, you know, I thought I'm proing a few quid. Did you ever doubt yourself at this time that... Yeah, cos I also had dodgy ants. So I'd cracked my hands in various places as an amateur. I'd never actually completely snapped my hands as an amateur. I'd cracked them, so the breaks, but the man, a little scuffle breaks. So when I came pro, I thought the one thing that might hold me back is my hands. I've got really small hands for a man of my size. So I'm six foot three, you put your left hand to mine and I don't know what height you are, but basically...  I'm five-ten. So same size hands as me.  Probably I'm much washing up. She has me doing in the house. So I always feared my hands would be what would keep me back. They didn't, which I'm very fortunate for, but I had to have numerous operations on them. So I say, I turned professional with a man called Frank Warren and learned the game pretty quick and I had to learn pretty quick because I wasn't a boxer who was going to stand round waiting. My first six contests were four rounders because he didn't want to up me money to the six round level. I think I blitzed four of them inside the distance, two went to 0.05 inside the distance, one went to 0.10, I don't know what it was now off the top of my head. And then I was flying, got into title contention pretty quickly. I'm four for my first professional title, the Commonwealth Belt in, I think, my 11th or 12th fight, won the Commonwealth, everything was flying. I defended it numerous times and then it was when I fought over Mackenzie, I really realized I needed to change things. I had good people around me, so I had my friend. I was in training in Manchester with a fellow called Anthony Farnell. And I just needed to change. I needed to get away and move. And my friends were telling me this for quite a while before I actually moved and they were like, listen, this isn't the best place for you. I don't think you're going to progress here. And I was like, I'm a loyal person, so I want to stay with him. So I went up and I sat down with him. I pulled him to the side and said, listen, can we bring someone in to help us? I think it's a wrong move if we just keep taking this on our own because he was a new trainer, I was a new professional. And he never knew everything that I suppose he knows now. But I didn't know everything that I know now. So was I training correctly then? No. But was I training hard then? Yes. I didn't make weight right. I made weight terribly. And I didn't have no game plans going into fights because I was so powerful at light every weight at that age that we just thought we were going to get rid of everyone. So when I went up to him after the first Old MacKenzie fight where I'm on the floor twice, I remember looking back over the Old MacKenzie fight and the advice in the corner was, think of your wife. Think of your missus and think of the kids. At this stage, I've now got two kids. And that's just not the kind of thing you want to be hearing in the corner at that time. But that's because of his, he doesn't have, that's because of his inexperience. That's all that was down to. I'm sure he's got the experience and also be a better coach. But at the time, it didn't really work.  And it was hard to leave him at the time because he'd become a good friend. And I left, told me reasons why. Said I don't like travelling all the way up home for me all the time. I didn't understand that to having to manage this every day. I want to go on, want to be back at home, be family and stuff. And he said, okay, sound, sound. Everything changed as years went on, but that's how we've ploughed a company.  I came home, went back to the Thunder to meet coach Mick McAllister. And then that was a kind of rebath to where I needed to be as a boxer mentally and physically. That was the best thing I've done. Mick McAllister was a breath of fresh air for me when I came back. Because all the things that, and now still the pro boxer was just about knocking people out. And I was doing that good. I was, I was Commonwealth champion. I was undefeated. I was 12 and now 13 and now 14 and now after the Old McKenzie first fight. I'm now 14 and now I've come back to Liverpool. I start training with Thunder again.  Everything just went back to basics and it paid dividends. It really did. I got into a rematch with Old McKenzie and completely boxed. I said he didn't like glove on me in 12 rounds. After dropping me twice in the first fight. So you could see the improvement drastically already. Only thing then what happens is I then get thrown to the wolves and into a world title fighting me 16th fight. Can't have that. No, this was Dayton Clavitt in the first fight. Clavitt, yeah, wheels. Don't get me wrong in, yeah, Dayton Clavitt in Wales, we fought in Liverpool. I actually thought I won. I'll always think I won that fight. Still to this day, I thought I'd just got the better of it. One of them didn't really close fight. Don't get me wrong. It's one of them that can go either way. But I thought I showed the better quality in the fight even though he came on strong in the last three rounds. I'm going to train them for it. But I still stuck with me coach. Usually fighters lose them when I blame the coach. I left the fight. I left one coach after being 13 or 14 or no. Sorry. Now this coach I've come across with my first loss. I stuck with him. I knew it was nothing down to him. I stuck with Michael as I stayed with Mark. And everything was going great. Even after the loss, which I didn't think I lost, I stayed their own, built up another impressive things again, done everything right. I think I went the next. How was that defeat, your first ever defeat? At the first one, again, clearly I didn't class it as a defeat. I didn't think he beat me. So it was easy to bounce back from. The next day I went out and now after you'll see the comparison from when I lose again. But every on the Monday I was proud of myself. I was happy. I was out walking down the streets in the town centres. I was proud of myself because I thought I'd won. I thought I'd beat a world champion who's made. Defenders done whatever. I just haven't been given the decision.  I would do some things that were a what's the word I'm looking for?  I would do things that would attract attention.  I would do things that would they would gain attention through media. So I would punch someone. I would throw something at them.  Yeah, you know, commercially it was great. The promoters loved me, promoter loved me. TV stations love me. I would say things and just do some mad stuff. So it was just they didn't like me going in. And when I look back to the referees and the judges for the fight, I also realised why I didn't get it as well. But it doesn't matter. It's all bridges, you know, it's water under the bases.  I proved everyone wrong in the rematch. But I didn't get it.  I won it. I could go on over and over again. Watch the fight again on tape. Can't believe I haven't got that decision. What's going on? Upon doing that, I then had a few issues with me, promoter, which was in the media and went to court and stuff like that, about me getting paid, not getting paid. They ended up getting paid in the end. And I won that court battle with him and then I moved promoter. And then that's when I realised, you know, exactly what I was worth, what I was getting, everything like that came into place. And my career just cracked on. And my first fight after, the cleverest going to my first career, the final fight where if I lose as well, it wasn't my second, because if I lost against Over McKenzie, my career was over in that rematch. Is that what you had in your mind? Yeah. But you go into certain fights and on five or six occasions, I've been in the massive pressure fights where your career is on the land. See, I think you fight better when you're... Definitely. Not the underdog, but more pressures riding on it. When for the Over McKenzie rematch, my career is on the land because I got dropped twice in the first fight. And people said, it was a bit of a harsh stoppage. He jumped in too early to be honest with you. He stole me glory. I was on the verge of putting Over McKenzie fast asleep and the referee just jumped in. Better to be safe than sorry. But he put me in a position and a predicament in the rematch way. I've got to face him and prove everyone that I am the better fighter.  Massive pressure. But it does a great job. So then the next time I've got pressure on my shoulders, I've just come back from the cleverly fight, the first one. And I'm fighting Danny Mackintosh in Echo Arena that's half empty. We struggled to sell tickets.  Because me and Danny Mackintosh didn't really have much banter because I actually liked them. He's the only person I've ever fought who I actually thought I could have a pint with him. He made me laugh, he was funny. So... Is that more difficult to get into a ring and not hate someone?  I hated everyone. When I was fighting, I hated everyone. But with Danny, it was just he made me laugh at certain stages and smile. So he's one of the very few people I've shook hands with before we fought on the scales. He put his hand out and I shook his hand, which I've very, very done for going forward with my creator.  So that fight went into massive pressure. I lose against Danny Mackintosh, my career's over. I come through it, I'm now signing with Eddie Ayn. Eddie Ayn's just starting to build a stable. I think his first sign might have been Dalen Barker o Kelbrug. They've signed with him. I've now left my promotional outfit, it was with Frank Warren. We were in court, in and out of court. I ended up beating him in court and I'm free from, I left him. T-shirt, if you like, you're over? You could say that, look through the court documents and you'll soon see. Look through the court, I say the court transcripts and the papers. I have all the paperwork still to this day. All the old emails I've kept. So I've got it, everything, all the proof of everything there. So yes, I left him, which very few boxes get to leave someone like Frank Warren and come out the other side smelling roses, which I don't. Which was a very, very stressful time. People don't never know the amount of stress I went through at that time of me creating a man who's worth an awful lot of money is trying to sue me and take me career away. If I'd have lost in court to him, I would have never fought again and just retired. Scared of that photo? Rather than fight for him, he was trying to take me career away. Is that trying to break you because they've got the powers off? They call all the shots. Oh mate, it was horrible, it was so stressful. I remember being in the dressing room to fight a guy called Edison Miranda, who was a dangerous puncher at this stage. You know, Edison Miranda, he's on the second half of his career now. He's looked at as an opponent and not the challenger anymore. But it's a dangerous place to be in because he just lost a points decision, lost to someone called Isaac Chalimba. And he said, I don't want you to fight him.  He's dangerous, can punch. He said, it's good TV. I thought, all right, I'll do it. Boxed really coarsely, 20 minutes before I had to walk to the ring to fight Edison Miranda. The British Boxing Board of Control came into me dressing room, wouldn't wait till after the fight. Came in me dressing room 20 minutes before I walked to the ring.  And they said, if you don't give us a check sign now for £10,000 for the £10, you're not going to be able to get in the ring and fight. And I said, you're saying this to me right now. And they were like, you've got to do it. Franks told us to come in and get his percentage for the management fees for this fight.  And that's the pressure the Boxing Board put me under. It don't get me wrong, because the pressure, the Frank Warden, was putting them under. But it was disgusting to me when I looked at. Do you think a lot of other boxers, kiddos, get cut short because the... Oh, without doubt.  And how he got away with it, I'll never know, but it was horrible, very, very stressful time in my life. But then you'd win, the result would take you to another high, but then a couple of weeks down the road, you'll get another solicitor's letter. This is going to happen, this is going to happen. So when I finally beat him, I was in New York at the time in a training camp, getting ready to face Roberto Balanti in the WBC eliminator. And I remember my friend coming in and waking me up. I was in my bed in New York. We're all in a big apartment. And he comes in, he said, it's over.  I was like, it's all over. He said, you've won. And I said, I don't know what you mean. And he said, yeah, look, show me an email on his phone. And the Frank Warden case had been settled. He couldn't go any further in the case because of the evidence, but it's stacked too much in my favour. And I remember just saying, thank you so much. He went out the room. I remember just sitting at the end of the bed crying to myself, thinking, I've beat him. I'm now free. I can now pursue the dream, the things that I want to pursue. The stress level was unbelievable. Because you've got to remember, I said, I lose. He beat me in court and back on the street, literally on the street, because I'm not boxing no more. I'm going out to earn money though, whichever way I can possibly earn it. And I said, when you lose, you've got no qualifications, you've got to do what you've got to do.  I don't think it's to provide for the family that I've got. My kids don't have to be born. I put them on the planet. So whichever way I've got to provide, I will provide. And that's the distress and the pressure I had on my mind. So winning that then, it was like winning a world title basically? Oh, it was great. It was boss meet. Your relationship with the Hearn is very strong. Yes, I trust him. And that's key for you.  I'm the same.  But my intuition is always right. My gut feeling is always right.   But again, it can be a lonely journey as well. But obviously your relationship with him, even at that time, when you're totally blank somewhere. It didn't start like that. With Eddie, it didn't. When I was with Eddie, it didn't start like that. I would leave it all to my friends to deal with him. And my friend would deal with everything for me with him. Was that just... Because it happens that just more trust issues? Because it was happening in the past. So I would say to me, I want this, this, this and this and he'd go right off, speak to him and I'll sort it. And Eddie would never really, I would just give us what we wanted. Because I would never ask for more than what I was worth. I would just want more than worth. So at the start with Eddie, it was just business in all honesty. And then as time went on, and then he stuck by me at a certain point to me. I think the most testing time was when I lost to Don Stevenson. Because when I lost to Don Stevenson, now this was my first proper career loss. He looked massive. That broke me.   That was the toughest part of my career, without a shadow, without. I remember going into the Don Stevenson fight, don't get me on my toes. No excuses, I lost to the better man, but I was fucked at the weight.   So I'd rather just instead of doing that, just show you the picture of it. And this is a picture of me when I still had five or so pounds to go. And I was absolutely dry to the bone. And as I say, you can't grasp, but I've got two of them. I've got one when I was in. And that's when you were cutting for the light heavy weight? Yeah, it was fucking. This one was cutting. What's your natural build? What's your natural weight? 15 and a half, 16 stone. Shit. Now that was, I still had five pounds to go on that.  You look as if you're on the crack, man. Yeah. Huh? Show it to the camera. But you look solid, man. The abs, innit? No, I made you. Six packs are overrated. So at that point. But how was your speed on that then? How was your mindset? There was another picture of a centre of picture when I was in camp in Canada. Mm-hmm. I sent me Mrs. the picture.  Yeah, we can throw them up on the screen anyway. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, yeah, this was talking Jay-Z city. Four weeks before the fight, and I've got 11 pounds to go on there. Shit, man. 11 pounds.  11. Give me a minute to send them, so we can... I'll send you the impact. I've got 11 pounds to go on there. No way. 11 pound, mate. So was that dangerous then? Yeah, it's boring on dangerous.  No one ever knocked me out in the gym. I'd been shuggin' rocked. I'd never been on the floor properly down, but I'd been shuggin' hate numerous times in the gym, but never put out like a lighter now. It wasn't, I'd never know looking at them pictures, but being away in Canada was hard, so tough. I'd lived in Jay-Z city for about a month, and all in all, by the time I got home, I hadn't seen the kids for five weeks. That was the first time I'd been proper away through camps in England duty, but losing to a Donnie Steams. I thought, I'm going into this fight. When I made weight, it was like I'd won the fight in hindsight, looking back, I'd just killed myself, and there was no way I'd recovered.  And then after that, I was gooseed.  I think he's the best referee in the world, but he saved me 100%. Donnie Steamson hit me with a left hand on the chain, and I'm asleep on my feet. Boxers end up getting hurt so much, and dying in rings when they don't see the punch coming, and they can't brace for it.   He was one punch away from doing that to me, Donnie Steamson, and now Michael Griffin saved me 100%. So after I've lost to Donnie Steamson now, I've gone back to my hotel room, I've cried myself to sleep, and I'm broken. I'm just... I've put 10 years at this stage, and I've put 10 years into boxing.  Even though people think you're fighting for the world title against Donnie Steamson in Canada, I don't know what I'd like to fight financially, but people didn't see what the camp cost, what this cost, what that cost.  The tax man, like this. Fucking... You're not missing me, mate.  So you pay everyone, and at the end of the day, me does not have that much left. And then you don't fight for an hour long. But at the end, it'd be fairly stuck by me, and that's where he gained me trust after the Donnie Steamson, cos I'm not too sure... I think he definitely believed I could win. Would he have put money on it? Probably not. But what he didn't have to do is, he didn't have to stand by me after the loss to Donnie Steamson. I'd never signed a contract at the end. We always dealt on a handshake, cos after me the end, I'm with Frank, I never wanted to sign a contract, but I promoted again. And that's pretty unheard of. Especially if I was on the verge of becoming world champion. He would've usually wanted me to sign a contract before the Donnie Steamson fight. He didn't ask me to. Now, whether that's cos he thought I was going to win or lose, I don't know, but as we go on fair through the conversation, you'll realise that he trusted me as well. And I don't think he trusted very few at the end. So it is a bond that we both share. And after that, the Donnie Steamson fight, I came back, I reinvented myself. As we went up to Cruiserweight, I started targeting the Welsh fellow again. And I said I want to rematch to prove that. I could never fight him at Llywodraeth, and I knew that I said, but if I fight him at Cruiserweight, I'll bully him and rough him up, and he'll never, he'll see that. The only reason the first fight was close, cos I got tired cos it was weight drained. Eddie built us up slowly. We fought decent fighters on the way back through. He fought absolutely no one. Eddie gave him touches and I have Lithuanians, everything he fought.   I snapped his ankle when I knocked him out. I'm a punchy. Broodof, Valerie Broodof. So Valerie Broodof was the first fight at Cruiserweight for me now. After fighting at 12.7 for all my career now, I've been making light everywhere for about six, five or six years. Was it never on your radar to go up quicker? As soon as I was on the world title, if I beat it on a Stevenson, I was moving to a catchweight straight away. My plan was to beat it on a Stevenson, fight Bernard Hopkins at a catchweight. And that was my plan, but it never come to fruition. So I went to Cruiserweight straight away. Now the Cruiserweight difference between light weight and Cruiserweight is 20 pounds. So 12.7 to 14.4. It's basically the best part of Two Stone. It was an absolute fucking... It's an eye opener. But don't get me wrong. The next day after fighting at Donald Stevenson, I was closing on 15 stone. So I was already 10 pound over the Cruiserweight limit already. I'd gained over Two Stone in a few days. So went to Cruiserweight, fight Valerie Broodof. Valerie Broodof had more knockouts than I had at fights. I think at this stage I was about 21 and two or 22 and two, something like that. Fight Valerie Broodof never been knocked out, been stopped on his feet, but that was about it. Getting the ring and I just rendered him unconscious in the 12th and final round. Till I lie, all that after lie, be done just before me in the fifth round. So we had been stopped. But I said, put him out. Like I lied in my first fight at Cruiserweight. E-fort on the undercard, I think. An absolute no mark. Then we do the joint top of the bill in the Echorina. I fight a guy called Raphael De Santos who'd never been stopped before. I baptized De Santos in the fifth round with one left up. Was that tough for you as well? De Santos was good. He wasn't too bad, so I'd done him with a left up, put him out like a light. He wins his one. The build-up comes, the rematch is coming. At this stage, I'd realised that he wanted to build us up and build us up, but to be fair, it's the only time in my career that the bastard had the kicks off me. The deal that we'd done for the Cleverly fight wasn't very good in my favour. I got paid well, I made the few quid, but I should have made a lot more, so I always rip him about it, so you know, you still owe me.  And I'll always say that to him, but we laugh and joke about it now. Did he save your career? Eddie? He kept it alive. I don't think I ever needed saving because I was always capable of that myself. The thing with me is I'm a promoter's dream. I don't need a promoter to promote my fighting. I'm going to do it for you. I'm going to get in the telly and I'm going to say there's the word I was looking for before. Controversial. So I'll do something controversial.  If you want me to be a good guy, I might struggle, but I'll take you round to me house and you'll see that I'm normal. I'll let you see me family that way, people will say it. If people see the real me, they'll see what I'm about.  How was your belief system, the law of attraction? Did you always believe? Did you always have that belief, no matter from the laws in your life in your career? Did you always believe that you'd hold up a title? Because even when you speak, even in your fights beforehand, you do give the other boxers a lot of credit as well.  I don't know if it's mind games. I always believed I could be world champion with the right fight, the right opponent, the right venue. I thought I could be world champion, but I haven't not got it the first time.  I thought, am I just going to be that nearly, man? Confidence, go on. Yeah, confidence issues, other issues going on. I don't know, you just think. And then in the back of my mind, I just thought, am I a kid who's just destined for street life? Even going through world title fights.  And is my destiny going to be going back to doing whatever you've got to do today and now? And that's what I always thought I thought. I've always thought I might end up in a jail cell one day. Fortunately, I haven't, but it's always been in my mind, so I know. Yeah, it's such a word that I've always thought I could end up, but things have just worked out at the right times, the right things. So as I said, Eddie didn't save me. He just, he can't believe it in me. So he gets a lot of stick?  He thrives on it. It doesn't affect it in the slightest. He loves it.  He really wouldn't.  He just, you know what he is? He's an honest man in a tough business. That's the one thing I will say about Eddie and Matthew.  Never in my lifetime and never in... And I will guarantee this, never in any of the boxers' lifetime where the boxer gets to the heights I got to, the very pinnacle of the sport, the height of the heights to, you know, match box office.  When you're looking at every penny that comes in the door, you've cracked it. When you're in control of the books, when you're in control of the bill, when you're in control of who's allowed to walk in that arena, you've cracked it. And it goes far as to say no fighter in this country has ever had that power unless they were a matchwoman at the end. No fighter's ever had that power before. Well, that's not even over. That's a fact. No fighter in this country has ever had the power to take such control of the career that I had the air and bury in a matching box and have allowed it to happen. Since you went in Nick's Reservate Division, you cleaned up, man. You started just smoking people out, man. It was good, mate. It was boss cos I said I just wanted to approve myself.  That's unbelievable, mate.  I ends up in a Rocky movie. You don't watch it on the drive down, mate. It's unbelievable, mate. Thank you. It's still best for us to go on. Even speaking about you on the red carpet, just as you were a dream to work with. Yeah, it was possible. It was great.  How did that come about? Philophon me. Everton had just been bounced everywhere. 63 against Chelsea. So Philophon me up. You think someone was taking the piss? Maze toes was a wind-up.  I'm not having this.     And me, that silly bastard, I was half believing and half not. I was on my way to my Indian to get my last takeaway before the cleverly rematch, before camp started. And I didn't believe it. I phoned me close friend and I said to him, what you reckon this fella's phoned me about a Rocky movie?    I carried on talking to this fella. I ended up finding out where he got my number from. I got my number from Ross Barkley plays forever.  Ross and I wind up. A week later, I found myself sitting down in a hotel in Liverpool on the waterfront, having a meeting with a couple of Jewish guys. A bar being in a Rocky movie, which I still couldn't believe, and I said to them, no. I said, I don't think I can do it. I've never acted before. After I'd said no, it made me a couple of financial offers and I still said no because I don't think I can do it. I just didn't have the confidence in myself to do it. The director flew in, his name was Ryan Coogler. I met Ryan Coogler and I was like, I didn't know this guy was. Were you a Rocky fan beforehand? I'm always a Rocky fan.   But if the two of you know one, I love Rambo more. More violence, knives and guns. Maximum violence mate, I love it. Sorry. I just, Rambo appeals to me more. So difficult of that, Pylenna. More violence to that. Crazy, it's mad, but Ryan Coogler come in and all the credits has to go to Ryan Coogler. He made me believe I could play the role of Pretty Ricky Conn. He made me think that I could act in a Rocky movie. It was all down to him. You just been yourself when you were doing the stage or just been yourself?  I got asked to play a world champion boxer. I got asked to play a world champion boxer from Liverpool, so, you know, I hadn't been a world champion at that stage, so I had to put on a bit more of a braggadocious kind of feeling bravado thing, but I tapped in quite easy. Coogler was a dream person to work for, Ryan Coogler. He really was, he's brilliant. He motivated me, he helped me when I needed help. Sly was always on hand for the help and MBJ stuck by me all the way throughout. So them three people were massive, massive parts in me taking part in that movie and me being able to do it because I know they've all said, post that film, I would have an actor I actually am, but I just be myself. So, you know, I was taking on the Bond recruit next. I definitely think you're awful. I wouldn't mind a little bite of that cherry. Did you knock that boy out? Scone cold or is that acting? I slapped him.  He's an amazing actor. He is an amazing actor.  I was told he's one of the best actors in the world when I first got there. Just watch his most recent film, Just Mercy. Just Mercy, he's an amazing, amazing actor. He really is. Fruitvale Station, just watch the movie. Fruitvale Station, thank you later.  Yeah, that's unbelievable. I take my heart off to you for even just achieving that. What was your friend's treat you like it was a stick? I was very happy for you. I didn't believe it when I first told him. I actually told him I was due to leave for Philadelphia on Monday. I found a couple of my closest friends. So I found Dan said, listen, let's go and have a little knock on the nine-hole golf course in Bellevale.     If I'd lost to the clavley, by the way, I wouldn't have done the movie. I couldn't have done it, the shame. So I said to them in the builds, I've got something to tell you, but I've got a way to after the clavley fight to tell you.  How have you done that?  I've fluked it in my own mother. And that's it.  Because your career was hitting the peak then that you were going through that transition when everybody was starting to know you were getting well light. How was it? Because usually when they bring people in for films, it's usually they're retired at the end of their career. Your career was... It's mad because people are just starting to get to know the real me because I had the clavley rematch and now it is what happened. It was a mad twist. I fight clavley in the rematch. It's the worst fight ever on box office.  I've never had the last of it out of the air. As you all know, I didn't get much for the fight.   So I was in a bad sticky situation because I just fought clavley. Now, bear in mind, I'm so happy.  I've beat him. Everything I said, I've done, I've backed up everything I've said. I'm no longer the multi-scouter who can't back up what he says. I said to everyone who'd listened, I'll beat this fella, I'll beat him easy. I'll outwarch him, I won't tire. I'll be strong down the stretch. Everything I've done, I've done in that fight. I'm not saying it was a great performance because it wasn't.  The coward. But it is what it is. I beat him. So I was like, right, I'm off to Hollywood to do this movie. I've been missing for five months. I didn't fight. I took me three months to make the movie. I came home and I found there the end. And he was like, everyone's forgot about you. And I was like, well, you're my promoter, you're the manly. And I was like, at this stage once again, now I trust them after Stevenson. But it's at a stage where as now, I've just had a disaster performance on Sky in a box office fight, which is on air doff. So it's now what am I going to do? Come back from making a fair bit of money for making the Rocky movie.  And Eddie's gone to Eddie. I need a couple of eight rounders and now I'll have a title fight. So fair play. He paid me well. He put me in an eight rounder on the Josh Waddonton undercard in Leeds. And he put me up. Sorry, that's a lie. He put me on a 10 rounder in Liverpool Diacal Arena. A heavyweight. I got sick 10 days before the fight and I was on antibiotics. I fought a heavyweight. Dylan, why fought him after me?   Come out for the 10th round and I thought, I'm not blowing. I thought, I wasn't. I was just boxing the fight at my own tempo, putting him on a jab slip and move him, digging him with the odd body shot. I boxed his head off really. I could have stopped him in one or two rounds, but I didn't have the confidence cos I was on antibiotics to put it on him straight away. So I just boxed within myself. I got to the final and 10th round and stopped him in the 10th round. I thought, I can open the gasket now, forget tired.  Put it on him, stopped him in the 10th round. And he paid me well for that fight. And then goes and says, I need one more, one more fight. He puts me on and leads on the Josh Robinson undercard against the Salpo. I take a get rid of this kid in three or four rounds. Does him and then I'm sitting there waiting for an opportunity. And I'm like, I've done the Rocky movie. I'm now known, but bear in mind the Rocky movie hasn't been put out yet, the Rocky movies. It's done, but it comes out in the January. I'm now into the December looking for a fight. Eddie informs me what I'm going to want you to fight this fella. I said, on what bill, he says 16th of December, out to arena, the Dylan White AJ Cardi. I said, I want you to be chief support. And I thought, which names are you going to say?  He said, I want you to fight a guy called Matthias Mastenech. And I just thought, he's stitching me in this concert. So this is the first time I thought this bastard's now against me. So he says to Eddie, why would I want to fight Matthias Mastenech? He went, because it makes sense. And I went, no, it doesn't. I said, I've made the Rocky movie. It comes out in January. Me publicity is going to go right through the roof. I'll get a shot of a title on the back of it. He went, me and me dad have had a discussion. If you can't beat Matthias Mastenech, you're not good enough to win a world title. I said, Matthias Mastenech has just been stopped on his feet off the WBC champion, Gregory George, for the Russian.   He's a former European champion. He's a good fighting event. Do you want to take it on now?  All right, I'll take it, fucks sake.  So I've now took the fight. In the meantime, in the turn and throne between all this, David A. comes out and he's like, he does a Instagram post and says, anyone can get, I'm coming back. Anyone from cruiserway to heavyweight can get it. So straight away, I'm thinking, at this stage of me, I'm thinking, am I ever going to win a world title? I need money now financially I'm not secure. I haven't bought me, owned me first house yet.  So I'm thinking, can I do it? Can I do it? I thought, if I fight David A, financially I'm secure. So I just remember putting on social media.   Would you really fight David A? David didn't think I'd really fight him. He thought I was joking around, put a bit of publicity.  This manager phoned me, what do you think about fighting on? David's bill on the channel Dave. I said, listen mate, all due respect.  Look at what you could have won. So I said, you know, I can't do it. He went, why can't you fight? He said, you fight an unnamed heavyweight, an unknown heavyweight, an your first fighter heavyweight, and then in the second fight, you fight David on channel Dave or on Box Office channel, whatever it is. And I went to cards, I've gave her the Emmy word that I'll fight my sales masternach at the O2 arena. And he went to me, have you signed the contract? And I went, no. And he went, well, why don't you fight? And then he said, how much are you getting? Told me how much I was getting. They offered me double. They offered me double the money to fight an unknown heavyweight.  And I said, no. And he went, why not? I said, because I've gave the Emmy word we shook hands on the deal.  That's what Dave, these managers saying. So I went to- So you're getting less money for a hard fight. But it's a more prestigious belt in my opinion. I love the O2 being title. I always wanted to lifting. So I've said no. I phone's at the end and let's him know. And he was like, really? You're not going to take it? And I was like, no, I'm going to stick with you. David phones me. So David phones me when he goes. Listen to what he said. You don't get much of a chance in this business to make some money for yourself. Take this opportunity. You'll fight an absolute no mark and then a right for you quid in the first fight at heavyweight.  But now talking over a million if you fight me in the fight. And I was like, told me misses me.   And I was like, I gave Eddie me a word of sign there. One said he had got word. He was like, there's nothing I can do. It's on you. I said, be shook hands. He went, I know, but I get it. I understand if you do. So he didn't say to me, I can't. He said, I understand. I said, no, I'm not doing it. I fight Mattias Mastach. I beat Mattias Mastach. I become European champion. Hard fight. Both eyeballs scratched. Both hands fucked.  I could nearly got rid of him in the 12th round. My face heals a little bit. I have the creed premia. He only turns up with the creed premia.  Laffing and joking with us. Me too, so my sons at my side. And I'm there. So he turns up, couldn't believe it. You know what I mean?  But whatever that David's can't do. Is that the next thing? Does he know what he's doing? I don't think he's bothered about me. He just wants to be seen. He probably wants to meet Sylvester Stallone. Everyone wants a nice Sunday next phone. You know what I mean? So it's there. I remember them standing. Me, MBJ, David, I and my little boy getting a picture of my eldest lad now. And I said, Corey, this is the lad who wants to beat your dad up. And he went, yeah, it is. I'd smash your dad. And I just thought, I'd get a picture of my son. I thought, just put me 11th thoughts.  But he meant what he said. David means everything he says. But he just let me know. He calculated? Yeah, he just let me know.  So I thought, OK, though, you just come and watch my premiere that I'm in son. Because David wants to be a movie star. He did, he had a tattoo. So I thought, you come and watch my premiere while I'm sitting there glitzing it with the boys. So it was a little bit of both. And then I'd made the movie. I was waiting them for three or four months. Eddie ain't told me. Barry and Eddie come in the dressing room after the Mateus Mastec fight. And Barry as well.  And Eddie ain't said to me, it's a world title next for you, Tom. He said, I promise you, I'll get you a world title fight. He phoned me after making the Creed movie. Obviously made a bit of noise. Al Haiman's representatives called him Bayer bit Shumanov as a WBA regular champion. And he said, do you want to go to Vegas and fight Bayer bit Shumanov as a WBA title? And I said, with all due respect, I'd rather fight for the Beltale of Matalan than fight for the WBA regular title.  If I want to fight for the world title, he said, just get me the WBC. I've chased it all me career. That's the one I want. I'll fight Gregor, he draws no problem. And he went on, just this is a shot. You're taking it yet? And I said, no, it's not a fight for me. Don't insult me again. Another few months went by. Gets now to about February, March. And he phoned me, he says, I've got good news and bad news. I said, what's the good news? He said, the good news is, I've got your dream shot. I've got your shot of the WBC title. I said, well, there can't possibly be no bad news. And he just said the name in Lunga Macaboo.  He's basically a Donna Stevenson with two stone on him.  Does it have to be him? That was my first thing, you know? And he went, yeah, it has to be. I was like, had you not ate Southpawster? Can we not face him in the first defence? He was like, WBC have told me a Tim on no one. Do you want to do it? I said, I've got to. I said, I have to take him home. He said, what do you think about doing it? He said, I've put a block on the Echo Arena. For the date of the 29th of May or the 28th of May at the time. And I said, what about Goddison Park? Goddison will be empty at that time. Let me speak to the chairman, phone the chairman at this stage. And I've been in a rocky movie. The chairman advised me on doing the contract for the movie and stuff like that because he's in pantaman theatres. So the chairman was my friend. I speak to Bill Kenright to say the chairman and he says to me, what do you think? I said, can we do it with Goddison? He said, some we can do it. Met with the people of Goddison. Very nearly didn't happen to Goddison.  He'd the only day left to do it with Goddison was a Sunday.  So we'd done it on the Sunday. So we'd done the fight of Goddison on the Sunday. How was that when you knew you were going to fight it? That's the only fight I've never. That's the only second fight I was ever nervous for. I was not nervous for any other fight. Usick fight, calm as Larry. David ate two fights.  I was dancing in the ring to his walk-out music. I never felt any nerves. I was buzzing. Every fight around me I just don't get nervous. I love fighting. Did you know you would win the fight or were you wary? The McCarby fight.  Yeah. I was on punches as well. I made a snap of my nose there. So I makes the fight. Everything's going well. It's the only fight any of me's children have ever been allowed to attend. My eldest lad Corey. I think that was more pressure on you as well. Massive amount of pressure. O'r Corey was 10 or 11. Well, he's 15, just 10 now, yes, three or four years ago. He was 10 at the time when he got there.  So yeah, in the dressing room. My dressing room, the music is so loud. You can't hear anyone talk. And you think, I have rap music on.  Mother fucker.   Shoot that, do this, gunshot. Everything's happening in my dressing room. That's the only time me whole career. I said to Fran, turn that music down. I went, what? I said, turn the music off. And we, for 20 minutes, we listened to the Gladys Street singing my name, Tony, Tony, Tony, Tony, Tony. Bill, you're under dressing room, shiwch. Just... Did you embrace that moment? I just remember listening to it and thinking, I remember saying to Fran, it's like a dream. I've dreamt of this, I've dreamt this happening. The knock came on the door. You've got 10 seconds. Everyone walks out. I just remember bending on my knees and just... Every time, just before the dressing room, I always speak to Jimmy Albertina. I always say something to Jimmy. Jimmy Albertina was my coach at the time that ABC died before this time. I had an amazing, the best coach I ever known and met. Just a brilliant person. And that's not to say any other coach that I've had, but it was him, not just so much the coach, it was just him. I got him, he got me, brilliant. He was a diamond and he used to always just talk to Jimmy and say, keep me safe and let me perform to the best of my ability. I said to him, I don't believe in all the god stuff in all that, but I would always look and think people are looking down on me, whether it was Jimmy, they're like to Terry Quinn, me Nan, me Granddad. I would say just watch over me and make sure that I come out in one piece. So that's the things I do. I do believe that people are watching people who have lost over the years. I don't know how, but I just believe. You just feel them? Yeah, just certain things that I've done. So there's no other way I could have been helped or by anything else, something's being standing over me, watching me.    But that's to keep me safe. If I have a girl, I'm killing the first contact to me though. So bad boys standing over me. So, yeah, I just walked out to the ring, petrified. I've never been scared, I've never been nervous. I remember walking to the ring, I'm thinking, I've been going to Goodersham Park every other weekend since I was 11 years old, since I first took me. If I had lost that day at Goodersham Park, I'd never have gone to Goodersham Park and never have shown me face. It's the shame, it's the embarrassment. So, it was immense pressure for the years on my arms. It was, the pressure was immense. The most pressure I've ever felt in my life was that night, walking to Goodersham Park.  Bomp, bomb, straight one, two, bang! I hit him with a body shot, and he makes the noise. The noise, you're all, you're here, one day when you're here to fight it. It's sunk in under the ribs and he just sinks a little bit. And then as I stepped out, I thought, right, I stepped back in, nails him with the right hand down the pipe. I thought I stepped back out again, have another little look at him.  And he just seen the shot, it was just there playing his day. Bump, he hit me.  So, my chin actually got the second blunt of it, and that's what put me, he took my legs from underneath. Because you're old? I'm old back, my legs, everyone goes, oh, it's a bit of a balance issue, it's not that bad.  I just went straight down like a pack of cards.  All the judges went like that with a 10 card, because it went all over. I got up, I went back to corner. I'm not going to lie. When this fight finished, I actually thought I'd knocked Mountain the second round. I went back to corner and I always remember little legs, me coach Dave Caldwell. Dave was brilliant for me. He is another person who resurrected me career, taught me new things, brilliant coach. One of the best professional coach box and coach in the world.  He's an amazing coach. As I said, with Jimmy, with Jimmy Albertina, it was different. I was a young man. He was learning how to become a man as well as being a boxer when you're in an amateur gym. Dave Caldwell is a perfect professional box and coach. I've had a few. I've been to many places. I've been to New York, the gyms and gleesons. I've been all round the ghettos in America, spart and training. I've seen how people train them. Dave Caldwell is the best box and coach I've ever came across. I was in the professional game without a doubt. At the end of that second round, I've just had my nose broke. I'm sitting on the stool.  I'm on the floor, I'm in the corner.  You got greedy.    I'm sitting on a stool.  And he said to me, you got greedy. And I went, all right, yeah. That was the last thing I remember. That was the last instructions I remember him saying. I came out for the second round. Whatever he told me to do, he must have just told me to keep him on a jab box, do whatever. I don't know, but I don't know. I came back at the end of the second round. I don't remember a single thing that's been said to me. All I remember is going out for the third round and thinking in my mind, this is where I remember from the start of the third round. I'm thinking, I've studied this guy, he gets stronger as fights go on. I've got to get rid of him soon. We're into a little trade-off. I've just got to cop him with a short left hook. I can get him to walk on to a left hook, perfect. He starts attacking me, digs me body. As he went to throw right hook to the body, because he's a self-blog like this, he left me a little glancing on the hook on his chin.  So now it's this staff bastard's time to start running. He runs back and lung on my carb who never runs away from anyone. And I thought it's completely out of character. I must have ate him bad with that left hook for him to run back. When you study fighters religious like I do, you pick up things, you see these faults. And when they do things out of character, it's cause of the hate. Nails him with a left hook, I'm on him, I'm chasing him. Gets him to the ropes, gets another exchange. Boom, boom, boom, we're exchanging bang, bang, bang again. I can actually hear Jim Watt saying, he's shook him. And I thought, oh, Nick, all him, one of them, I could hear. I banged him with a right hand left hook. This time it's like visibly dipped to me. And I thought, right, nail him to the body. You've just got to get him to drop the hands again. I only knew I needed one clean left hook.    I sunk him with a left hook to the body and he made the noise again. I thought, I've got to get him so close. I just need you to want to hit me back because at this stage he was doing this on the ropes. Tuck, tuck, slip, slip, just tapping me. So as I've gone with the right hand, all camp, the coach had me drilling me. When you throw the right hand, drop to your left, come back with the left hook and connect. I threw the right hand and it missed. And as I threw the right hand and it missed, I dropped to the left. And as I dropped, he'd done the same. Like he threw on a lazy right hand over me. As the right hand came over me there, that was it, mate. It was all she was. I came across him, boom, faned hit him.  I just felt him. It's like he died. He was out, just asleep. So as he went completely floppy, like I told you about when fights go, I thought, I've got to get him. On his way down, I've just got to make sure. I've thrown a jab, missed. And just hit him with the right hand on the back of the head as he went down to the floor. And then Mickey Van, not Mickey Van, Victor Lochlan, Victor Lochlan stepped in. And he waved his arm straight away. He was asleep. He hit the Z, the floor was so heavy when he banged the floor. He was asleep. He was out for about five, 10 minutes after it. And remember just collapsing to my knees and thinking you've done it. Yeah, it's amazing, man. I've got to shake your hand for that. I remember watching that fight. Yeah, I'm thinking, and at that point, I've achieved me a lifelong goal. That's the best way, all my life. Until I had kids, I didn't care about nothing.  I would do anything, whatever I've got to do, I would do. Upon having me kids, my goal was just to become world champion. I'm boxing and do whatever I've got to do. I knew it wasn't about money, it wasn't. I just wanted to be a world champion.    And all the time, all these jobs that I had, working in Next, all these jobs that I had was to substars the dream of one day becoming a world champion. I used to tell people, anyone who'd listened, when I was working in Next, when I was working in the pillar factory, when I was working on the door, when I was working as a lifeguard, I used to tell all these people, I'm going to be a world champion one day, I'm going to box good or some part.   If I had it, you don't have it.  Everything I've said, I've done. Everything. I remember arguing with a fella, and let me finish my story, so I've hit him with a left hook. It's over, I'm world champion. They dropped to my knees and just tears, flood down because I've done it. There's nothing else that I've done. Everything I said I'll do in boxing. I've been ABA champion. I've boxed for my country. I've been British combo with European world champion. The only things left to do after I finished that night go to some park was to financially secure me kids' future. That's all I had left to do. And he says that, your career did really flourish after that. I wish I could have retired after that night. I wish I could have retired after going to some park. If I had of what I made in the next three fights after going to some, sorry, four fights after going to some park, if I could have, if I would have made that at go to some park, you'd have never seen me in a boxing ring again. Is that true? 100%.  Massive. Rate show is it? Yeah. I need to speak to her. That was your last four fights at the end of the fight. I think you did mention her and say I need to speak to her. She calls the shots. And it's scary to think, but you became box office after that. You became mega. It's the dream. Like I said, I've lived. I don't know many people in life where they are. I'm an artist today and go to listen. I've lived my dream. I've lived it. And every night when I close my eyes, every time I think of boxing, I just really live my dream again. I say it over. And I don't know many people. You can see people saying now how the smile in your face. I'm happy. It just, I can't put it into words what it meant. But it was the dream come true. The blues that were in there. Tony was there.  And he was.  My family was there. And I must also say there was a lot of Liverpool fans in their thousands of them. And I thank them as well. They showed me unbelievable amount of support.  We're at each other's throats constantly, but some things surpass them. So everyone knows about Hillsborough and stuff like that. I'm a scouser before I'm an Evertonian. I'm a scouser first. And that comes first to me. It always has, it always will. I'm an Evertonian second.  I'm fighting with you. When a scouser's arguing. I'm arguing with you. I'm backing you up. And that's how I believe that's how people should be in communities and in life.  So I have to thank them in there as well, but it was just me. Me dreams came true. I must have made everybody so proud, man, to come from where you are. Your story, brother, gives people inspiration. If you can do it, I can do it. Do you know what I mean? That's always a great thing. I don't like going to places where I'm not really, so I always get asked to go, will I do a talk here? Will you go to a school? And I always say no, cos I say to people, I'm not, don't paint me out to be something. I'm not this inspirational figure. I'm not this big fucking, I'm not special. I'm exactly the same as you. Honest to God, I'm just the only differences. I fucking, I get buzzers out of fighting. I thrive on fighting. That's the only difference between us. I'm no different from anyone else. So when they ask me to talk to people, talk to kids, I only feel comfortable doing it when I go back to where I'm from. Because I get, I come from where I'm from. Yeah, I come from where you're come from. And when they see me come and turn up, and I've got a nice watch on, or I've got my bed's car's nice, or I've got a nice pair of shoes on, or they're in a nice suit and they go, where did you, and I go, I come from that street there, my master lives there. I come from where you come from. You can do it. You can do whatever. You can be whatever you want to be. You just have to believe and be willing to sacrifice and dedicate yourself enough, and you can do it all. And all the kids that meet, the lads who are managing on, they come from similar backgrounds to me. Single-player families, tough times, fighting. You're being in trouble at the police, you've done whatever I have here. I want to help them. Some kids have been who I help out and they're being selling drugs.  That's all they've known from growing up, seeing their own parents doing it. So I want to help them and I feel like I can help them people because I've come from a similar background to them. But when they asked me to go, I got asked to talk at Oxford University and I declined. Why?   They saw you mate, but you can't buy your belief.  So you've got something special? I just couldn't. It was Cambridge or Oxford. It was one of the big, it might have been two of them. They went to the club and I've declined both of them. And I said, what am I going to speak to? What am I going to say anyway? And they were like, just tell them how you've done what you've done. I said, there's no secret of how I've done what I've done. I've just believed in myself and I've never give up. Why do you think you never felt forward?  But why do you think you had the blinkers on when you just stayed in your lane and you just always believed? What was that? Rachel and the kids. Your misses? Rachel and the kids. She's your rocker. Do you think what's your relationship? It's not that she's my rocker. It's not. Do you think you wanted to work on that relationship so much as well because your dad left at a younger age? Possibly, massively. That's the reason why I want to make me. Make it work? Yeah, 100%. Because your dad always in your thoughts. 100% everything he's always behind me in some way or another. I always want to better him in everything I do.  I love my dad, I adore my dad, he's one of my closest people. He's not just my dad, he's my best mate. I look after him, I help him, I do everything I can for him, I love him. And that's not to say I don't love my mum because she loves your mother but I've got a different relationship with my mother.  It's just what I thought you were. Men, I love me dad and I just, I don't know. I just, I want my kids to better me. I want my kids are better than me already. They've been born into something that I could only have dreamed of. So I just, that's what it was. And I could never, I never give up. I never, but 100% the way you say, why did they give up when I've had to be once on the way, Rachel and the kids. If I didn't have Rachel and the kids, I 100% would have been locked up in jail. You speak about them, for what I know that I asked five or six weeks, it was always about them, make your money and retire. I know without them, I'm definitely on the street because I wouldn't have stuck with boxing. There's easier ways in life to earn money than boxing. There's much easier ways. After they had done, up until they had done a Stevenson fight, my career was hard, but it wasn't impossible. So dealing with the highs and the lows, I got through it.   And I've had friends and people who I know, where you can really do well, financially.  I've always wanted nice things. After the good distance fight, you were saying you were thinking about retiring, but then obviously the box office was closed. She wanted me too. So one day morning, I fought on Sunday, Sunday night in the bank holiday Sunday. So Monday morning, the kid stayed near my house. I called and he came home with us. I'm sitting in my kitchen at this stage, after the movie, everything that I'd earned, every penny from the movie, from my career, I put into my house in where I live now. I don't live there now, I've just sold it, but I live in a different house now.  And I finished the fight Sunday morning and I said to Rach, she said, right, you've done it, I'm looking at the WBC belts on my kitchen counter, I'm looking at it and I'm just, I'm sitting there and I just said, girl, we've done it. Everything I've set out, we've done it. That's a beautiful feeling man. It was boss and then she went, well, you're going to stop now then? And I just went, have we stopped now?  After the taxes paid, after everything's paid, it's probably a manager's salary in McDonald's.  So a year's worth of salary for the McDonald's manager or executive manager, whatever it is. And I said to her, I said, I can't stop now. I said, but what I'll promise you now is, there's not many fights left and every fight from now is about one thing and one thing only. I said, money. I said, the career is now about money. It's the only time in my old career that I mentioned money to her. Rachel never knew one of the places I got for any of my fights. She's never asked me. But when I said that to her, she said, OK, I'll agree with that. You know, she was happy for that, for me to do that. So I said, we just got a financial security. I've got to buy this house that we didn't now own on this house. Once we own this house, it's good to go. I can die tomorrow.  I don't know why, but I've always planned if I died there safe and secure before the first day of the fight, I made the sign of will because we weren't married at that stage in the will. I put everything single down where every single thing was going to go from the houses to cars. Everything I added in place, it goes to here. So it was... I don't know why I've had this thing I'm going to die before me time, but I just think I am.  Something's always told me that. So I said I've always planned. So once I become world champion and the money started building up now, I made my first events against BJ Flores, made a good few quid that fight, done a good crowd in the accordina, eddyd un gwybod by mi, paid me really well. But I was now in control of the fight I owned, the venue I owned on the show.  So that was the first time I'd seen the books.  I'm now world champion. And I get a phone call off a man that won't say his name. But this guy calls me and he says, tone, he said, what is a fight day-by-day on box office, on BT box office. And I went to, how'd you work that out?  He said, and I'll give you a huge amount of money. And I went, I had to work with Francois. And by the way, that was one of the stipulations. And I went, well, number one, I can't work with Francois. And he said, no, don't worry about the money. I'm personally guaranteeing you the money. Now this man could personally guarantee me the money. I knew who he was. I know him. He's an honourable man. He's a lovely, lovely fella. I'd get on great with him. And I said to him, I can't. And he went, that's how you are. I'm going to give you a couple of days to have a think it over. He said, but if you speak to someone over this, agreeing that you've got, can you please not mention that it's me who said it to you? I said, no problem. And I'm on with me. What I say, if I can do, I stuck it to me weird. I phoned Eddie and said, I've had a call off a man and he's offered me an enormous amount of money. Did I just say the amount he'd offered me? No. Well, it was an enormous amount of money. Millions? Yes. I'm now talking about millions of pounds. I'm world champion. I'm getting paid well for the fight, but I'm not into the millions bracket, yeah. This man's phoned me up and offered me millions of pounds to face David at an box office. I phoned Eddie. Bear in mind, I'm now world champion. Still got no contract with Eddie, yeah. We're still dealing on a handshake. And believe you mean. I'm believable. I can't believe that. No one does believe it. And he says to me, how I never made you sign a contract now. I said, I always gave you me weird.   I said, I gave me weird. After Donna Stevenson, I'll finish my career with you regardless of whatever happens.  I'm perfect marketability-wise. I phoned Eddie and he says, tone, you've got to take it. David had these words. And he said, I'm not taking it. He said, I can't give you that money. I can't guarantee you that money. You are now cruiser at world champion. There is no money in this division. Remember what I'm saying to me? And I said, well, we can generate it. We can create it. So the office knocked back. I says to Eddie, now that I now know David wants to fight me. I said, but David, I've spoken to David before this.  I'm not dealing for, I can't fucking, I don't like Eddie and whatever. They did that problem before. Eat full sort of, they had us in Eddie's.  So I said to David, I'm happy to fight, to speak to David's management team, whatever. I said, but make no mistake, you have to deal with Eddie here if you want to fight me. Now I now have power in my hands now because I'm now top in bills. I'm now a name, I'm a world champion. I'm not the A side with him because David's such a massive name, but I'm a world champion. You're fighting on channel Dave, let's get one thing straight. I'm on Sky Sports, I'm with Sky Sports and I have been throughout my whole career besides one fight. So, David says to me, well, what do you mean? I said, I'll fight you. I'm happy to fight you, but this is the terms. You deal with Eddie in. Eddie loved it.  You wouldn't believe the contract that I got for the first fight. I took, I took 60% of what I'm really worth because I knew I'd beat him. 60%, if I would have fought me way through, I would have ended up getting the better deal on what I deserve, but I didn't. I just thought I was massive underdog. Remember Eddie Ains words to me once, I think you should hold out to think I can get you more than this. And I said, no, I'm not taking anything less. So I'm not fighting for less, he said to me, if you're old out, I reckon I'll get you to the percentage that you want. I didn't, I took the slightly lesser percentage than I should have. And as I said, don't forget, I was bringing Skybox off to the table because without me Eddie, David, they weren't getting on Skybox office. So we ended up doing it. We're fucking, we're at it mate, I've cracked it and fighting David A. Everyone, David thinks I've only took the fight for the money. The money's a big feat there. You thought that did it? No, he doesn't. He watched me fight BJ Flores on my first defence. BJ Flores is his mate. So when I fought BJ Flores, this is my first defence of the title. I didn't want to fight BJ Flores, by the way. I think he's, well I used to think he was a knob. He just fell to follow me round everywhere. When I moved up to Crewside, he was calling me all the names under the sun. I'm a blown up light everywhere. I haven't got a clue. I'm shitting this and that.  And the two of them just ridiculed me. You know, the basically.   So, he said to me, BJ Flores says, I said to him at the end, I want to fight Dimitri O'Cuture. Dimitri O'Cuture had just beat me meythans o Machanelli. And I said no, he said no. He said that's not a good fight. He said Dimitri O'Cuture's a good fighter. I said well I'll tell you what. I said let me. He said why don't you fight BJ Flores?  He's a typical Yankee's own mouth, no substance.  He said he's David A's good mate and it'll build up the fight between you and him. This is before this. This is how it made this phone call to me.   Cat with a bowl of wool. It was boss. I done him and then me one stipulation was fighting BJ Flores. I said David A's got to be ringside commentating. I said to Eddie make sure he's there working. And he went to me why and I said don't worry about why. It's the only fight in my whole career. I've gone into the ring with an agenda. I was going to do. I was going to cause me to be David A after the fight. She kicked all this stuff. Cos I kicked the total out of it. I have a thousand total blown out of myself.  I'm going to do this and that. I was never going to get my hands on. Let's be totally honest and do that. And people say well that's pantaman. It's not. Because if them scoots got it wouldn't have jumped in the way. Then I would have been forced in a position to crack him.  By jumping out of the ring.  He throws punches.  He must be a top big guy. He's not soft man. My David can have a fight. David can have a fight in the street. And he can have a fight in the ring.  And you've seen it which is all. He's game is fucked. Yeah he cracked him with a bottle. Does it not have a cut? He had a bottle and he punched him and the bottle came out and smashed. But so when I jumped out of the ring to get him. I knew the scuers he'd get there before me.  Because I'm so hyped up. But I put myself in a position where I've got to do something. And I knew by doing that. Everyone would want to see it. So I knew like I said it before. I don't need a promoter. I'll make the fight for you. You just do the negotiations. I'll make everyone want to see it. I've done it. I beat up a BG for hours. I caused me to a David Day. I got over eggs. I got over what's it called. I went too far with the fucking. I got over excited. I got over excited in the post fight press conference. In the post fight interview in the ring. I called him SpongeBob SquarePants. I was meant to call him Sideshow Bob. I'm fucking. I just must have watched too many cartoons.   Anyway, the fight got made. Did that with that at the end?  It was ridiculous, mate. You must be seated when I walk into the press conference. You must do this. You must adhere to me as this. I must be there at that. I must do this. I remember saying to her the end, just two things. That's all I'm asking for. Can I pick my shorts? Yes. Can I pick my gloves? Yes. Just sign the contract. I think I can get you better a bit more on this, bit more on that, get it. And I had just signed it. I said, is there a rematch clause in there? He went, no, I said, are you sure? And he said, there's no rematch clause to him. I said, just make sure you sign it. There's no rematch clause. I remember signing it. There was no rematch clause. I knew I was going to beat him. Everyone was looking, mate. Absolutely. And to be fair, man, no matter if he comes across as a bit of a dick, he was still a world-class fighter. Everyone always says to me, nah, David, he shot a bit, he was finished.   Yeah, you're at the peak of your game, man. Styles make fights. Don't get me wrong. The best part for me was, I'd become a full-blown cruiserweight after me come working out of five, six, seven fights, wherever it was a cruiserweight. I'm now full-fledged cruiserweight. Going up to the heavyweight division to face him was perfect and no longer had to make weight. And it allowed me bodies to just train and eat clean and what a beer, a beer. So I was 15 and a half stone all the way through the hay camp. I lost four or five pounds the week of the fight just to lose a bit of weight to check that. What weight did he go in? He came in at 16. We're going at 17, I lost under 17. 16, eight or 16, nine. So how was it when you... Cos you absolutely, you have a boss in every round. How was it for you, for a trainer?  It turns into an absolute battle. The first fight where he gets injured, so... Did you hear anything, click or anything? Not in the first fight. It was going five rounds in.  So I'm in the fight and my plan was making a mess for three or four rounds. Keep nailing them to the body, zap them and then after five, six, seven rounds you'll be on them. In my opinion after five rounds I think he's winning three, two after five rounds. I think he's up three, two. Cos purely cos he's putting pressure on he's not landing much of any note but he's coming, he's walking at me, he's walking me down. Five rounds pass at the end of the fifth round. Just go back, anyone watches the fight and you see me at the end of the fifth round.   I said you are finished and I've got the picture on my phone of where I said it to him.   The exact, the way I performed in the rematch that's how the first fight where they went for the next two rounds I knocked them out at round six or seven I think seven or eight, sorry. Six had a broken down slowly, more body shots but I just, I could, as soon as a kill he's went I lost my mind.  But Dave Caldwell kept whinging at me, whinging at me, moaned at me and I wasn't listening to him all through the fight to be fair. It was one of my worst displays from round five, from round one to five was a very good display. I was defensively brilliant making him slip, slide, roll, digging him with body shots, coming back with the old counter. It was a very Bernard Hopkins-esque performance from me. Slippery, clever. Using the rounds, breaking them down into small sections and just making him slip, slide, roll. In the second half of the fight it's probably the worst six rounds in my career, round five to eleven. And so I stopped. It was only around eleven where I nailed him with a left hook heavy on the top of the head. Really heavy and it hit him on the tumble and he just falls through the ropes. Now people think I pushed him through the ropes his legs collapsed underneath and it hit him hard on the tumble. Did you not want the fight stopped at some point after that? But that shows you as a fighter not just as a boxer but a genuine person that you had seen someone being hurt by that. I never hated David I. I never hated David in all the build-up. He went too far a couple of times when he said he was going to put me in a coma. That's bad. He said he was going to visit me in hospital but I look back, I understand why he said it. We were having banter constantly and it got a bit nasty when he punched me at the first press conference but I never took it personally.  You can say anything to me it won't get to me but he broke me kids up and he thought I'd get on for the first 20 minutes after he said it I was it did really get to me and I thought you are wonderful. And then my mum were coming away and speaking to me Mrs and I came home after he'd said it and I said to her you've got to go away for this fight and she said what do you mean she'd never done it before so you've got to go away or you want to just go on holiday.     I was happy it was over I'm in one piece I haven't died in a boxing ring don't as I said to you before no no keep touching I've always thought I'm going to die before me time massive parts of me I thought that might be in a boxing ring I've dreamt of dying in a boxing ring so it wouldn't be a shock to me if it did happen but when I drew a line under it and said that's it it was like I've done it I've clocked the game and I've got out alive I've completed it yeah I've completed the game so a part of me was happy don't get me on I'm not going to lack a city and I didn't go I don't miss it at all I fucking miss it every day I love fighting I don't miss the training so excuse me I don't miss the training at all I do still train five days a week or six days probably keep me sane keep you happy yeah I don't know about keep me happy I don't know what's ever going to make me fully happy I'm trying to just understand the meaning of becoming happy now I've been someone who's lived my life where I've never been asked about being happy I've always punished myself to get what I wanted to get where I wanted so whether that was training camp whether it was doing whatever doing things I didn't like doing the things I didn't want to do to get to progress me self I don't so now it's just more of the time and it was it was great at first cos you know you can just start playing footy again when you meet you can have a baby whenever you feel like you can do this you can do that all the things I've missed out on for the last 20 years I've done but then what you don't see coming is the party that lived so much that part of the bus that part of being part of something that part of having a goal to strive for to push yourself for every day the other part to miss you need that you need some structure, some goals watch your plans just before we finish up brother watch your plans for the future then from now moving forward I don't know what I'd do I invested all of the money that I earned back into this city so that's going okay I do things to not to pass down but I try and pass on some of the knowledge that I've got I keep getting asked to train people and I've got so many things that I should pass on but I'm not putting my family second again I'm going to put my family first throughout the rest of my days yes I'll still do my works for Sky and Iron again but I'm not going to training camps to train fighters for months and weeks at a time I'm not going to do that yes I could probably help someone out and do it maybe once but I'm not doing it again and again and again it's just not viable I don't want to miss me kids growing up I've only just getting to know after all these years the last couple of years I've got to know me 15 my eldest lad's 15 and I'm just getting to know him but I'm coming stronger so it's just I'm spending more time with him my little baby we've recently done not long had Carson is it's been the best time he's six months the other day congratulations thanks and he's just I've realised how much I've missed out on with the others because I've spent it with him I've been there every day this lockdown period has made us stronger as a family it really really has so spending so much time with the little fella I'm just watching him literally grow day by day the little greedy fucken never stops eating but he's beautiful mate he looks like his mother so he's just everything's perfect and the man life's good I've always I don't need to say a show where everyone's been on to me about how was it but it was tough it was really hard but John Fashin you were talking about that one in the ring was that serious?