It's hard to describe to somebody that has never had a fast car. It's kind of like trying to describe to somebody that's never jumped out of an airplane what it's like to go parachuting, right? They have no frame of reference. But once you get into it, if that's your thing, then it's very addictive. You just want more and more and more. I started off with a 1990 Civic SI and then had a Super 93 Super twin-turbo and 94RX7 twin-turbo. Mustangs, didn't really like them. And then moved on to 350Z, 2010 Evo. Then bought a GT-R and I'm on my third one now and then went back and bought a Evo that you can see here in the background that's being done right now. This is my third GT-R and I've gone way overboard on it. So it's got intake, exhaust system, fuel system, front-line intercooler, turbos as well, and everything else that's possible to be done to it except for an engine build. And it's making 660 horsepower to the wheels. So it's very, very quick. The next step is to do the transmission and then possibly do the engine in the future. But we'll see. I come to Cobb, have been since 2008. It's more like an extended family here. I know everybody by their first name. They're all really skilled and I'm very happy with what they do for me because of the time and the dedication they put into doing exactly what you're looking for. And of course all their people here are licensed and trained mechanics. So to me that's worth a lot. I don't even let my wife drive my GT-R, but I let Calvin drive my GT-R. So that I'll tell you something. Four years ago, having all these fast cars and having all these friends with fast cars, we needed kind of an outlet to be able to get around together, you meet and actually hang out and do something fun instead of just sitting in a parking lot. The bottom line is that we do an event where people can purchase tickets, hands, and the majority of the money goes to the North Texas Food Bank and I give all sorts of raffle prizes and things like that. And so it's a way to give back to the community. I will never stop modifying cars. As long as there's a car to be modified, I'll always want to tinker with it, make it faster, make it handle better. I'll probably never stop, probably until the day I die. It's kind of an inside joke with my life, I joke and say, okay I'm done, I swear I'm done and then of course I'm not and it's just one more thing. My name is Tom Baird and this is my Cobb Story.


Anyways, one last question before, okay, if the particle is falling back by, it's like this, v is the velocity. I will give you t as a, which is my velocity, that is 1 divided by 2x plus v. Now you differentiate x with the v which is t to get the acceleration. When you differentiate ds by dv, you will also come, that is the velocity, which is inverse of this. Minus of 2h divided by 2x plus v whole square into dx by dt. This is what you will get on this square, right? And dx by dt is also velocity, so the answer is 2avq whole square. 1 divided by 2h plus v whole square is, that is the square. You get minus of 2h divided by 2h plus v whole square. So, that is where dx by dt is coming, that is how it changes.


The League of State Government will leave no stone unturned in ensuring that the state is rid of all forms of domestic and sexual based violence. To this end, the Domestic and Sexual Violence Agency, DSVA, in partnership with the State Police Command staged an advocacy walk in a corridor recently to sensitize residents. Correspondent Love Ikuku Oyedoku tells us more in this report. It is an advocacy walk on sexual and gender-based violence in Ikurudu. It is part of activities to mark gender and sexual violence months. The month of September is designed to further push the advocacy against the vices to all local governments across League of States. The exercise is aimed at enlightening the residents on why they should not engage in any form of sexual and gender-based violence. Titi Lola Viva Adene Yi is the Executive Secretary of DSVA. She warned that anyone caught engaging in any form of domestic and sexual-based violence will face the wrath of the law. In four or five years, Ikurudu has been one of the top five local governments with highest privilege of domestic violence, sexual violence and child abuse. Ikurudu, light has come. We want you to know that there is help for you. We want you to know that you should not suffer in silence. In Ikurudu, we have at least three divisions. We have at least two designated police stations where you can report cases too. You can report to Global FSU, you can report to U2FSU and ultimately you can report to the gender desk located in the League of States Police Command. The most important thing is to break the culture of silence, speak up and speak out. League of States Commissioner of Police Iduwu Uohuma, who was represented by the Deputy Commissioner of Police Salihu Usman, noted that statistics shows sexual and gender-based violence incidences are on the downward trend in Lagos. I've seen that the people of Lagos state in general are now understanding the essence of establishing a very sound family. Family is the backbone of a society. Without a sound family, you cannot have a civilized society. So that is why Lagos state governments see it as a priority to see that they eradicate the issues of gender-based violence. Participants at the work included senior and junior police officers, lawyers, child protection organizations, members of the community development associations, staff of the domestic and sexual violence agency. Love Iduku Plus TV News To address the issue of early marriage and violence against women in northern Nigeria, a group, Global Peace Development International, has urged communities, traditional and religious leaders to rise against this courage. They made the call at a sensitization campaign in some local communities in Kaduna state. To change duty bearers, traditional rulers, religious rulers, community inhabitants, perception and mindset against harmful cultural norms that lead to sexual and gender-based violence in communities. And to also prevent and address cultural norms to local government that will choose Chukuna and Jema local government. And then the four communities under this local government, the sexual and gender-based issue is at the increasing rate. Trying to see how we can create awareness to educate the public, to also know their rights, and to also how in terms of reporting cases of sexual and gender-based in the community. Early marriage, they consider it as an old custom and that they don't want to leave it. Some cultures are affecting women by saying, let the women go to farm. Okay, you actually want to go to farm. She came back, she take care of you, the husband, she take care of the children, at the same time do the needful for the household. Then how do you expect it to go? Somebody cannot just carry. So at least let us show sympathy to a woman. Let's look at those cultures that are not a prover because we are civilized now. But that civilization at least make us to understand that those cultures that are not harmful, let us take them away and do the needful and do the right thing. On their part, the religious and traditional rulers vowed that any member of the communities found violating girls in their society will face the law. Cultures and norms have drawn many communities backward. There are many things that speak against or destroy our life, our wives, our children, the community entirely. There are simple things that we can do to help us move forward. But because of those cultures that we stick to, we don't accept change in our community. We don't want to go with the type of system that is moving today. We're supposed to follow what our Christianity have been taught of because Christianity and Muslims, they never say we should do all this kind of marriage. I shout to my community to let them stop doing all this kind of quick marriage. It is not good. Let their children know when they are immature. It will be a punishment really. Anybody who found in my community by that, I will carry him to my district. After my district, my district will carry the person to the folder, even to the human right. They were able to identify the problems and also give us solutions on how to deal with gender-based violence and also the hardship melted on women sitting at home and the women are meant to go out and provide for the family. Problems they brought up are what we are facing in our community and they brought up also solutions. News Updates


Welcome to Toffy TV, it is the Everton News Daily. Everton have held their ADM this evening via Zoom. A presentation as always was given to the shareholders and just a little few snippets from the evening. Marcel Brands revealed that Hamas Rodriguez was in fact a free transfer. This had been speculated on over the last few months, certainly because one of his clubs in Colombia said they had received no money because it was free. Everton confirmed that tonight. They also confirmed that the combined fees for the Coray, Allen and Ben Godfrey was £60.5 million, so excellent business when you work that out over the three of them. You know just averaging on just over 20 million, so that's really good, really good. Robin Olson was alone but there was no fee involved and Nars and Cunger as well was I think was £200,000 as well, so they've done some excellent business last summer. In terms of, in this window, Marcel Brands said there would be no incomings. He said that they were trying to offload players trying to create new pathways for their careers. He also said the value of the squad had gone up with only 27 players now compared to the 40 million, 40 players we had when he first took over, so 13 less players but the squad is more valuable now. So I suppose as far as he's concerned that's him doing his job, that's what he gets paid to do. So good news on that front. On the stadium it basically said they're waiting on the council and as soon as the council gives them plan of permission, they're hoping to get the spade in the ground as soon as possible. They did keep it quite loose and say 2021 but the expectation has always been that within the first couple of months they would get a spade in the ground. They spoke about funding for the stadium as well and different avenues for that as well but they're still basically just waiting on the council to meet up and give a decision. The process was sorted in October and Evan had just been waiting and obviously with the Covid situation and meetings happen via Zoom rather than in real life, the council found it very difficult to get together and have these meetings. There is a massive Covid situation which is dominating everything and that's fully understandable but I know for Evertonians it's really really annoying and our patience is running a little bit thin because we keep on getting told the same thing but it's the same situation that it has been since October. It is purely down to the council now that Everton have done all their part so they just basically confirmed that this evening in the AGM. News elsewhere, Charlotte Branthwaith has made his move to Blackburn on loan for the rest of the season and that's a really good move for him. Obviously not involved too much with the first team since his injury against Salford and after that Ben Godfrey came in around that time as well didn't he? So it's fantastic because he's too good for the under 23s and it's a really good opportunity to play from a really good club in the championship and try and fight for a playoff spot and hopefully he'll play. I'm sure Evan have put something in the deal so that you know there's a good incentive for him to play on Blackburn's behalf because otherwise what's the point in going there so that's really really good news. Aston Villa obviously you're aware now the Aston Villa game is off this Sunday it was moved to Sunday from the Saturday it's now off Villa still not in their training ground and we'll have to wait and see what happens. There is speculation and I will just say this is speculation just like internet speculation that if Villa if their game with Man City next week is called off that could be Everton versus City that is just speculation that has not come from anywhere that it's just people putting two and two together we'll have to wait and see what whether that happens or not. That means I'd like to call a suspension will now be against Leicester a week on Wednesday at Godderson Park and obviously our next fixture is Sheffield Wednesday in the FA Cup that has been moved to the Sunday so a week Sunday eight o'clock kickoff Everton versus Sheffield Wednesday Sheffield Wednesday have also got their next two fixtures have been called off because of COVID as well so that'll be interesting to see what position they are at when they come to Godderson next week whether they'll have to do what other sides have done and play on the 23 side or you know the side away from the main team but we don't know at this stage there's still a week and a bit to go before that so so I'll have to wait and see on that one and that's it there you go this has been the Everton News Daily make sure to give this video a like subscribe if you haven't already and you want more great videos join us over on page and thanks for watching see you later


Mr. Speaker, in September, I rose in this honourable house to provide an update on the cannabis regime being developed for intrusion. At that time, Mr. Speaker, I indicated to this honourable house that I would be coming in a few weeks to this August chamber to present legislation, get at creating a regulatory body which shall have responsibility for cannabis and other regimes. Mr. Speaker, today I rise as promised to present to this honourable house the Regulated Substances Bill. The purpose of the bill, Mr. Speaker, is to establish the Regulated Substances Authority, Regulated Substances Tribunal, Regulated Substances Fund to provide for the licences of regulated substances and enforcement matters. Mr. Speaker, I am convinced that this bill before us will impact our country. I am certain that the level, the purpose, Mr. Speaker, is to provide solutions, a level of certainty that an adequate mechanism is being created to ensure that people will be safe, that our people will have avenue to benefit from modern advances and opportunities, that our society and economy will benefit from a robust regulatory structure. Mr. Speaker, since the manifesto promise of the Sandrusha Labour Party, we have shown an intent not only to remove their cake and Rakhonian criminal provisions concerning cannabis, but to establish a legal framework allowing for the cultivation, sale and use of cannabis in Sandrusha. Mr. Speaker, what we, like many others in the public, initially perceive as a rather simple undertaking has been a thought-provoking and arduous problem-solving mission, necessitating that we be cautious and meticulous, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we initially believe that a single cannabis bill and cannabis authority will provide a suitable legal and regulatory framework for this industry. However, with time, review, technical advice, introspection, we have decided that broader change was necessary at this pivotal time in our development. We had to broaden our outlook, broaden our scope, broaden our approach. This was not the only substance which required a revised regulatory framework, and therefore it was prudent for our development not to regulate, grow and structure cannabis in silos, hence the justification for the regulatory substance authority and for the bill that is before us. Mr. Speaker, the enactment of that legislation spells not only another pivotal achievement in the process of cannabis reform, but will address the need for the creation of a regulatory authority which will bring other regimes and products into a space of regulatory conformity. Mr. Speaker, the regulatory substances bill creates and provides the legal parameters for a statutory body which will bear that name and will be charged with the regulations and oversight of several regulatory substances, including cannabis and cannabis products. Mr. Speaker, part one of the regulatory substance bill establishes the authority and the board which shall oversee the affairs of the authority. Part two of the bill provides a requirement for license, processes for application, parameters for approval and other similar matters, while part three of the bill establishes a tribunal allowing for persons agree to seek review and redress. A regulatory substances fund is created in part four of the bill. This fund is established with the oversight of a separate board ensuring the funds generated by the authority and the substances which it regulates will be used as specified in clause 77 of the bill. As specified in that clause, Mr. Speaker, the purpose of the fund is to facilitate the operations of the regulated substances authority and for specific matters relating to regulated substances or other matters. Mr. Speaker, we anticipate that the funds generated by the regulated substances authority will finance its operation within the first three years of establishment and as a result, Mr. Speaker, beyond this initial startup period, the authority should be self-sufficient. The funds generated, Mr. Speaker, will also be used to perform critical functions under section six relating to regulated substances and that includes one, review of policies and guidelines, two, specific scientific research and development, three, development and implementation in collaboration with ministries, departments or agencies, eight, comprehensive public education and training programs to raise public awareness, especially for high-risk groups. Mr. Speaker, this is extremely important for us, especially for our youth and for students. As we move towards a cannabis industry, we definitely need public awareness to ensure that we ring funds that cannabis from our school children and our young people. Also, in this section, we provide for social, emotional and mental support programs for persons dealing with a regulated substance. And for me, we focus on procedures for the safe storage and disposal of regulated substances to name a few. The objective, Mr. Speaker, is to ensure that the revenue derived from the regulated industry will be applied to the benefit of these industries by way of example, funds raised from cannabis should be used and benefit that aspect of the industry. Part five of the bill, Mr. Speaker, speak to the enforcement of the provision of this bill and Julian Powers' authorized persons to ensure that provision of the bill are being adhered to. While part six of the bill speaks to confidentiality and oath of secrecy, Mr. Speaker, and that is included in section 90. Mr. Speaker, I have made mention of regulated substances, but so far I have only spoken about cannabis. Clause four of the bill allows the minister, by order of publishing the desire to declare a substance to be a regulated substance, thereby placing it and its regulations within the remit of the authority. Mr. Speaker, as I speak, the office of the Attorney General's chambers is at an advanced stage in the development of legislation for two substances which we expect the regulated substances authority to regulate and assume responsibility for in the very near future. The cannabis bill, Mr. Speaker, is expected to be presented before this honorable house within the coming months. Mr. Speaker, the draft of the cannabis bill, like this regulatory substance bill, have received widespread stakeholder discussion, and this will continue even after the passage of this bill. Mr. Speaker, I want to pause a moment and to present to this honorable house some of the stakeholders and individuals that have assisted in the development of the regulatory substance bill, as well as working on the cannabis bill. And I want to recognize two of those persons sitting in the gallery today, and that is Mr. English, who is a legal officer in the Ministry of Commerce, and my dear friend Mr. Speaker, these two gentlemen have worked among others. Minister, could you mention the second name? I think it was drummed out by the applause. Say that. The second name for the record. Oh, the second one most days. Mr. Andre Dicaris. Elias Pancho. Elias Pancho. I think the whole world knows him as Pancho. But Mr. Speaker, for the records, I would like to mention all the persons that have brought us where we are thus far. And we have the Cannabis Commission under the auspices of Inves and Lucia, and there we have special mention of Miss Menisha Thomas and Mr. Michael Gordon, King's Council. Within the Ministry of Health, we have the CMO, the Chief Drive Inspector and Director and Deputy Director of the Substance Abuse Secretariat. We have members of the Medical and Dental Association. We have the Ministry of Agriculture and the staff of the National Agriculture Diagnostic Lab. And we also have the National Forensic Lab. We have the Director and Staff of the St. Lucia Bureau of Standards. The Ministry of External Affairs. The Ministry of Justice. Special mention to the staff of the Legislative Grafton Unis. The Royal St. Lucia Police Force. The Ministry of Tourism. The St. Lucia Hotel and Tourism Authority. Events and Lucia. The Ministry of Finance. The Bankers Association. The Individual Banks. The Cannabis Task Force. Comprising representatives of the Ionola Council for the Advancement of Rastafari. The Inland Revenue Department. Invest St. Lucia. Bureau of Standards. The Ministry of Commerce. The Ministry of Agriculture. The Cannabis Movement of St. Lucia. And the Recording Secretary, Miss Renata DiSosi. We have the Transnational Institution. The Government and People of St. Vincent and the Grenadines. The International Atomic Energy Agency. The IAEA. The Government of Canada. The Caricom Secretariat. The Canada Expert Deployment Mechanism. And I want to recognize the consultant, Mrs. Trombetti as well as our local consultant, Mr. Felix Finiste. Other consultants, Miss Hedda Azizi and Mrs. Lydia Efrain. All other interesting persons who have taken part in the various discussions that we've had. And Mr. Speaker. The staff of the Ministry of Commerce. Mr. Rosemary Pierre-Louis who has just left us. And I want to recognize the work that was done by the Honourable Member for Shoezele Soltogos when he was the Minister. On this side we do what we have to do properly. Also, Ms. Trisha Sipal-Edward, Mr. Paul Francis. Our Department Secretary, Sophia Alfie Henry. I've mentioned Pancho, Mr. English and others. So, Mr. Speaker, this whole list, the Attorney General looking at it back there and the staff of the AG's office. Mr. Speaker, the list would give one an indication of the number of hours in deliberating to try to bring this industry together. Mr. Speaker, nuclear and radiation sources form the subject of another bill under development which will similarly be presented before this Honourable House in the coming months. That bill, Mr. Speaker, currently being referred to as a radiation safety and security of radioactive sources bill will address our international obligations to regulate and protect St. Prussia against the threats and risks associated with nuclear material and radioactive sources. Mr. Speaker, there is also an intention to revise the current legislative regime for alcohol, petroleum and other toxic chemicals. All of these substances suffer from the archaic and inadequate regulatory framework which this administration recognizes a need to address. As such, Mr. Speaker, committees respective to each substance have begun the process of review of these industries to ensure the development of modern laws which the regulated substances authority is expected to oversee. Mr. Speaker, this government fully intends to continue to engage relevant stakeholders and the general public in the development of the legislation of all the substances which will be regulated by this authority. Mr. Speaker, St. Prussia's attempt at regulation in this context is different, but different, Mr. Speaker, need always not always be seen as negative. As servants of the people, the regulatory substance authority and framework developed is to our mind part of an informed, robust, modern and bespoke approach to legislation. Mr. Speaker, as I indicated in September, our work is far from complete, but our energy, determination and passion to till what we believe is fertile soil will not fail and will yield much fruit in due season. We will remain resolute in our promise to develop not just a robust cannabis industry, but a broader mechanism for regulating substances in our fair land. Mr. Speaker, I present this bill for the consideration and approval of this honorable house.


Hello and welcome to this video lecture on RSS. So in this video lecture, we shall be looking at the basics of RSS. What is RSS technology as in XML and how do we use RSS technology and its advantages. So these are the learning outcomes for today's video lecture. We shall learn the basics of RSS and use and manage RSS reader that is feedly.com a free available and usable RSS reader to subscribe to various RSS feeds. So these are the contents of today's video lecture introduction to syndication and RSS technology RSS architecture. How is the technology working and its nature then reader configuration and getting updates from feeds. I shall be showing you a live demonstration as of as of how to subscribe to RSS feeds and concluding with the references and acknowledgements. So basically what is RSS stands for really simple syndication. So you might have come across this symbol while you might be browsing through many internet sites. So this symbol indicates the technology of RSS or it also stands for rich site summary. So syndication basically means gathering of information from various sites of individuals interest. So a particular individual might be interested in say for example sports or sports news updates. So in sports he might be only specifically interested in say for example soccer news. So RSS is a technology to deliver real time updates on newer information available to the user. So any time a website updates itself or the website is updated with a newer content and the user is interested in that particular content. So the RSS feed will get updated and the user will be able to see that update on its screen because of the RSS. So RSS is this updation mechanism which updates which gets updated and keeps the user updated with the current or real time updates. So the choice of the topics that the user needs to be updated or user defined the user can define. So he does not need to get all the news say for example here he has subscribed to some news if he wants a particular news so he does not need to go through all the news but he can just subscribe to that particular RSS feed and then he will get the particular news from the particular channel about a particular sport that he might be needing or news about a particular event that happened say for example a particular catastrophe that has occurred in some area of some country or a continent so he can just subscribe to that particular news and get its updates whenever update is made on a particular website. So there are two parts of this RSS technology one is the RSS feeder and an RSS reader. So the website that the user wants to keep on checking or had to earlier keep on checking develops or has this RSS feeder and the user side has the RSS reader. So the RSS feeder is a web feed that allows to access contents and updates that is at the website side of the website and the next is the RSS reader also known as the aggregator which reads all the real time updates only from the website that the user prefers to and the current RSS version is 2.0. So this was the basic introduction to RSS technology. So how does this RSS work? Every website that the user is interested has an RSS XML file which gets updated and it is stored on the web server. So these are the websites there are n number of websites that the user might be interested in and these are the website which the user desires the updates from it might be news channels it might be podcasts and so on. So these XML files are regularly updated as any update happens at the site website and as these XML files are updated the reader or the aggregator on the side of the user is checked checks for the real time updates like breaking news and so on and anytime an update happens it the aggregator immediately reads it and the information is updated on the web browser that is the web page or the blogger wherever the user is using the aggregator. So basically the aggregator gets updated and the user who is interested in the news who is interested in the latest updates is gets updated. So the user side side is updated through the XML file which is updated at the website. So this is a basic description short description of how RSS technology actually works. This is an example of the RSS file basically RSS is an RSS file is an XML file. So we start with the XML definition showing that this is an XML file and then tag it with an RSS tag and its version 2.0 showing that this is an RSS file and these tags excuse me that you see here are the predefined tags and they are mandatory tags which go in the RSS file. There are also some tags which are not mandatory like publication date and so on but we shall look at the mandatory tag. So the title link and the description are the tags that come here. So the channel is the channel from where we have subscribed the site. The title states for the title of the channel and the site. The link is the link URL where we can find the website. The description is a short description about the same about what news or what particular updates is the link giving us and so on. And it goes on just like that. So title link and description are the tags which are defined when in an RSS file and then at the end we close with the channel tag which we had begun with and concluding with an RSS tag. I shall not describe this file completely here but I shall take it in another video lecture. So this is a reflective spot which of the following provide RSS reader services. So pause the video and answer this question. You are free to use the internet to answer to go across and answer this question. So if you have gone through and browse the internet to search that which of the following provides the reader services. If you have carefully seen all the four services are online services which provide for aggregator services. So feed reader flow reader and blog loving are all four services which provide reader services RSS reader services. So I shall quickly show you how we can configure and subscribe for RSS feeds on feedly.com for getting real time updates from different website. So firstly you need to log log in to feedly.com. You log into that website and create you can create your account. You can also log in through your Google account if you have one. I am going to log in with my Google account to show you how an aggregator works at your site at your site. Excuse me. So these are my feeds I have created a feed I want the news to be updated at my site. So these are the feeds and my news is the name of my feed. So all these news that I am able to see here are from different sites. One is from BBC news. The other is from India news. The other is from India TV and so on. So now I am going to add some more content. I want to see some sports news at my site. So I am going to add on click content and I am going to search for say for example Sky Sports. So Sky Sports news is available here and as you see if you are interested if you are a Manu fan you can subscribe for the Manu feeds. If you are an Arsenal fan you can do so but I am just going to click on Sky Sports news and I am going to follow it. So it will ask me that should it add it to my news or a new feed. So I am going to click on new feed and I am going to add it as sports news. So sports news will be a different feed which will give me just sports news and so on. So in this feed I shall only go through the sports news. I shall not have some different news here but I will follow only sports news here. Similarly say for example if I am also interested in BBC sports football so I can just click there and if I click on follow it will ask me the feed that I want to add BBC sports football to and I will click on sports news and so on. So it will start getting the updates from this website as well. I need not to go to that particular site to look at the news but I can just see it on my particular page single page. So there is this website Times of India that I have logged into this is the URL of that RSS feeds timesofindia.indiatimes.com slash rss.cms where I get all the RSS that I want to from top stories to most recent stories India, world and so on. Say for example sports. So I want these sports also from India Times to be included on my aggregator site. So I am going to right click here and copy the link address and I am going to also add content and I am going to paste the link here and it will show me that this is the feed sports news cricket news latest updates on tennis football and so on and I am going to select it and I am going to follow it and which will be added to my sports news feed and add. So right now it is showing me that I am following the sports news from India Times and once I go to sports news if you see carefully so this is the news that has been added from India Times.com so whichever website you are interested in you can add the RSS feed from that particular website and that update on that site will be immediately reflected on your website. So this is how you use feedly.com RSS reader to read the updates from all the sites of interest. So coming back to this was the configuration and getting updates from feedly.com so these are the references and acknowledgments that I have used for today's video lecture. Thank you.


Welcome, everybody, to tonight's event Regard Croisé et Moudam on the exhibition of Lionel Antunes, which is currently in the pavilion of Moudam. We are very glad to share tonight our conversation with you, actually on six terms, about an hexagonal pavilion with Antunes sculptures. You might see if you are online or if you are in the audience room, two screens with the exhibition room, or you might attend being in the exhibition. So you will see the exhibition in real time, but only listening to both of us, which will be fine. Anyhow, Milica Topalovic joined our session from Zurich, where she currently works and lives with her family. Milica is researcher and teacher in architecture and territorial planning at ETH since about 15 years, currently associate professor at the ETH Zurich, after having spent for about four years between 11 and 15 in Singapore in the future city laboratory. Welcome. Thank you. It's great to be here. Thank you for being here too. So today, Dora, she's dancing, performing as a response to our conversation by her movements in the pavilion. Thank you, Dora. Myself, I'm Carol Schmidt. I'm an architect living and working in Luxembourg. For 15 years, I have been leading an architecture office called Polaris, together with my partner François. Currently, I am teaching at the university in Luxembourg in the master in architecture, next to my project leading job at the administration of public works. So our conversation should last for about one hour. And it will be packed into six sections, six terms. We will spend approximately 10 minutes on each term. Okay, now we start with the first term, which is about generation. So I just make a brief introduction. Milica and myself, actually we met at the end of the 90s in Amsterdam at the research lab, which was called Belak Institute, where we studied together for about two years, I was belonging to generation nine. And Milica, she was actually belonging to generation 10. In the meantime, they have been 30 generations being graduated. And so we are very happy actually to share today the idea that we belong to the same generation, actually the same as Leonor Antunes, which is also born or at least was a child during the 70s as we were. So maybe Milica, you can tell us a little bit how it was growing up in Belgrade in the 70s. Yes, thank you, Carol. So it was interesting to discover as we met actually, and I think used the opportunity to encounter each other once again and let's say revisit our friendship after many years. And one of the first things we understood was that Leonor basically is the same generation. And I think we began to wonder, is there something that creates a kind of a shared experience among us, let's say. What separates a generation of the 70s and does this experience of growing up in the 70s bring us together or create a kind of similar worldview or a value system that we share to this day. And so we decided to speak a little bit about the 70s and the preparation I started to think back to that time. Well, I can tell you that I grew up in Belgrade in a socialist country called Yugoslavia at the time in a street that was actually called Boulevard of Yuri Gagarin. This betrays a kind of a proximity to the Soviet bloc. So we are also children of a Cold War. I mean, if we are looking at the kind of shared memories and experiences. I remember, of course, modern architecture. This is one of the resonances to the work of Leonor and Tunis. I mean, modern architecture, modern space, which kind of created the framework of the daily lives at the time. New apartment, new appliances, new uncomfortable furniture, new modern school, new children playground, et cetera, new landscape, new trees and so on. I remember technology, good TV, radio that, let's say, dominated our life. I mean, in comparison to Dora, who is tonight with us. No fixed phones, no internet, no computers in the daily life. So let's say we have, we have those memories, right? We have the memories of different kind of communication. I think we were also raised with environmental teams. I think the acid rain, the depletion wasn't there back then. So let's say those are the teams that resonate still, I think, in a different way. Perhaps I would say we were raised with or I remember distinctly economic crisis. I remember power blackouts. I remember rationing. I remember driving on odd and even numbers according to license plate numbers. I remember, let's say, I mean, we would say today probably rising tachrism as a kind of a broad political phenomenon that originates in the late in the times of economic crisis. I remember punk movement very distinctly in that, you know, in that to say so modern space.  So how was it growing up in Luxembourg? Well, I believe that even though I was in in a non socialist country growing actually up in a very conservative landscape, which was strongly run by still Catholic socialist parties. I had a very similar feel about that time. Actually, my, my city was a small city was not the capital and but it belonged to the industrial part of our country where there was steel being produced. And the landscape I saw from my balcony because I lived in an apartment was actually great because the fine dust would, you know, be constantly reproduced. And so I was growing up in pollution in heavy pollution. Of course, I remember very well also the the upraise of the punk culture. You know, but I, when I was small, I didn't really set it back into a historical moment. I just saw these guys, these youngsters, you know, having these funny hair. And, and, you know, these new type of music popping up in the heat and other ways of dressing and it was this new future, you know, generation actually that that we were belonging to. In my particular case, I didn't, I wasn't introduced into a very bourgeois milieu. I grew up actually basically in environment where there were many workers kids, next to kids from engineers, basically. So he was, in a way, colorful and homogeneous at the same time. But it really had a great impact on my perception of cities, because I, I still have a lot of sympathy towards these industrial environments and landscapes they do not represent these classic beauty of historical city centers or something like that but they had these, you know, roughness but also potential, right, which was already there so that that was actually basically the landscape I, I grew up, you know, the same time. It's interesting perhaps to remember our generation at the Berlach, right, so we, we were together in the, in the master studies and I think we, we shaped again a kind of a generational approach to architecture isn't isn't that right. I believe so yes I very much remember that in the 90s. There was these, you know, huge happiness of getting borders open right well this was basically the part in in Western part of Europe, maybe less. But since you were in Amsterdam, I believe you could enjoy this too. And yes, yes. So that that actually raise a lot of hope in our minds. I remember these these border issue became something really, really important on one hand and then the other thing which is I think very strongly related to our generation was about the transdisciplinary the rays of new media and talk not technologies which would, you know, completely reshape our way of designing and thinking architecture basically and so we had a lot of discussions on how to use them you know the ones that were really enthusiastic and the other ones were maybe less enthusiastic you know I remember that was that was that was real that was a real debate right it was like kind of how to approach technology and I think there were kind of kind of let's say tech architects among us you know those that embrace complexity and and you know the kind of aesthetics of this kind of technological design parametric design and those that you know that that kind of held back from all that. Absolutely. Yeah, which we, I remember Pia Vittoria writing and presenting his manifesto against Photoshop.  Yeah, well, maybe we should talk about matter now. Exactly. The second, the second term is matter. Okay. Yeah. So, so, so, you know, it came immediately right so so learners work is about matter about material. It's also about details right so it's in a way it's very architectural it's it's refined in its construction in it's in its making. Absolutely.  It's extremely actually serene in its appearance and I believe that what's what she what she tried to achieve is to show the beauty and the simplicity of all these materials by using craft. So, I just, if you agree, I just would like to read a very small abstract extract of a book, which has been written by Queen Latima, where she made a collection of essays and poems and days one about about Leonor and it's beautiful I can't read it completely but I just offer a very very small insight. It says, in the Kunsthalle Basel exhibition poster for Tunis exhibition, the CP attention image shows a courtyard enclosed by walls and trees and leaves and light. A kind of pavilion. A woman waits, waits there like a traveler might wait for a train. She as a traveler, though. She is also an artist. I do not remember seeing a poster for Tunis exhibition sculptures for traveling at the Kunstverein Haberger Bahnhof in Hamburg. Let's imagine one together. A glass pavilion, a flood of travelers, a sign that reads club. Inside the narrow glass walls, an artist unpacking her suitcase laying out her materials on the floor. Leather, light, brass, wood, rope, silence, distance. She begins to assemble them at last. So this text actually is extracted out of this book and is called the artist in Tunis or last words on the last days of sculptures for traveling. Actually the author visited her pavilion and being there she she got inspired and she found room and space for her own poetry. I have, I am familiar with the text as well and I was really struck with this comparison of artists with the traveler. And I had actually been thinking whether traveling is a metaphor for any kind of artist or traveler is a metaphor for any kind of artist or perhaps specifically to a woman artist. And I was wondering to what extent, you know, I mean traveling certainly is a kind of a, to say so, demand of contemporary art. But I think in the case of Leonor, I am rather fascinated by the kind of transience and the kind of lightness of the gesture, right? And of the, let's say details and the procedures which I relate to the kind of a feminine or perhaps feminist design experiences. It definitely, yes, certainly is. Maybe there's another thing which strikes me a lot is about the fact that she uses pure material in a way, you know, this kind of honesty and authenticity of the material which are reworked, you know, and reworked in a very sophisticated and yet simple way. And almost as opposed to this Western trend in culture to mix and blend materials again and again in order to develop the most sophisticated technologies until they finally become unrecognizable. So, you know, I believe that, you know, these these materials, when they become so sophisticated and that one cannot see really what it is anymore, the chance of getting it back in the news circle of a fuse is very limited. Even though physically speaking, it's always possible, right? So, and I think she has really a stand with it, you know, this is sort of a very maybe female resistance against this trend, you know, of an anti-ecological way of using materials. Kind of composite, composite against composite materials, let's say, yeah. Yeah, sure. I think this is something at least which which comes out.  And I believe that that maybe leads us to the next to the next term because I think we can make a transition to to chance. Being in Antonis exhibition, I feel relieved, I feel space for interpretation and freedom, actually, freedom of movement, freedom of thought. And this is maybe something which makes me think about the term of chance, you know, because it's it's it's charged as an opportunity but it's also charged as something which you cannot control and which is which possibly can happen. So, I just want to refer maybe to to this physician, you know, as a small provocation Jean Cavalliers. He was a physician who died actually during the Second World War as a resistant, but just before dying. He published a last publication and where he was actually stating that there is no mathematical definition of chance. So for him, there is a scientific certitude of being able to cover all and everything into rules of knowledge. You know, he says, actually, I can, I can offer this quote. It's in French. There is no mathematical definition of chance. The last meaning of chance is ignorance. To say that a sequel is given to chance is affirmed that we will not be able to find mathematical laws for the succession of these terms. And this is typically, you know, a standard Western culture. I believe where there is very strong faith into solving all and everything by rules, by by equations, maybe. And where the knowledge, of course, belongs to the strong and gives a lot of power as well. Whereas, maybe in other cultures, one would find the potential of the hazard of the chance, you know, chance of the unexpected, you know, and maybe I just stop and just refer them maybe to to Stéphane Malarmé, who wrote in 1897, N'abolira le hasard. And where he said, and this is French again, I'm sorry for this, but he says, actually, it's also about numbers and chance. C'était le nombre issu stelaire? Existe-à-t-il autrement qu'allucination éparse d'agonie? Commence-à-t-il et c'est-à-t-il sourdant que nier et clos quant'apparu en fin? Par quelques profusions répandues en rareté, se chiffre-à-t-il? Evidence de la somme pour peu qu'une illuminat-il se serait pire? Non, davantage, ni moins, indifféremment, mais autant le hasard. So, what about chance, you know, what do you think? I mean, it's fascinating, let's say, as designers and architects, right? So I think we are familiar with that creative process that very often involves chance, right? But in ways that are not apparent in the finished product. And I think this is interesting when looking at Leonor's work that, you know, to both of us, the term chance came across very strongly because we wondered about the process and to what extent the kind of, let's say, control or what is the logic? What are, to say, the rules behind it, right? And I also, I mean these kind of creative rules, right? And to explain that I have this example that I liked very much. I remember in the student days. So there was this book published, I think, also in the late 70s by Brian Inno and Peter Schmidt. So it was a kind of artistic collaboration that was discovered accidentally where they developed independently from each other cards to help them, in a way, orchestrate or bring in chance or a kind of possibility to decide in the creative process when things get difficult, let's say. And the cards are fascinating because I think perhaps every designer, to say so, every artist in a broad sense. I mean also architects and musicians and so on work with those, to say so, individually developed rules and some of the cards are very entertaining and I think we recognize them like discard and axiom, no? I remember that. The three of the main idea, right? Repetition as a form of change, right? Race repetition or distorting time, no? Very interesting, also architecturally what might happen or destroy nothing. This is a fascinating one. Nobody will tell you that in architecture school, right? Or destroy the most important thing on the other hand. You hear your teacher so often, don't be sentimental, right? Change your project, right? And so on. Or be dirty and so on. Like pollute the canon and so on. And I think this certain elegance about Leonor's work is there, which it is not easy to say so to read in terms of a creative process, right? So we were to say so both wandering on the element of chance. And I think, I mean, I think of course the kind of chance. I mean, that also extends back to the question of matter and to the kind of a male and female to say so strategies in terms of handling for right and handling material.  I mean, your, your favorite is, is John Cage. You tried to. No, no. Yes, I, of course, John Cage. You know, of course, there is this, you know, his chance, you know, control chance operation mechanisms is something which fascinates me for, for many, many years. And of course, I'm not the only one, you know, there was this beautiful exhibition recently at Woodum about Maurice's work would be also actually who was actually actively engaged with Cage about about these mechanisms. So, no, no, of course, I think that there is another dimension which I think due to time I would like to, to maybe to switch over if he could go and I think you want to say something about nature, which is also very present in Leonor's work, maybe. Well, yeah, I mean, why, okay, let's let me let me try to to explain why why was nature important. Well, I think nature, let's say, as I mean, we've, we've encountered Eleanor restoration and one of the terms was nature and obviously I think there's a kind of certain dedication to nature through material right so let's look at it through the choice of material and also through through the craft or through the through the handcraft. There is a, I think modernism is is let's say present as a kind of aesthetic sensibility but I think also the kind of nostalgia which is, you know, exists nostalgia for the kind of pre-modern craft traditions which are absorbed, you know, in modern architecture, modern art, you know, over over through various to say so artistic trajectories and I, I think that, that the, I mean, I would, I would perhaps refer to in opening this, this kind of wide and I think perhaps a difficult team of nature. I think what is perhaps interesting to say that you know we live, I think in a time when we are perhaps in the moment when we have to reconsider or where we are in the process of reconsidering the kind of wide cultural perspective of on nature, you know, and I think if we talk about Anthropocene, I think we talk about basically about exhaustion of of worldviews and the worldviews imply the kind of relationship of the human society towards the world ecology or or nature, right? And the kind of unpacking the history of nature is is a difficult and I think fascinating exercise and I think this is also where Leonor's work resonates, right?   And there is this, I mean, there are, I think I mentioned, I wanted to open up this topic of the history of nature and one one book in particular was interesting. Caroline Merchant, a philosopher and also feminist writer in the 1980s came up with the book that of the debt of nature, women ecology and the scientific revolution and what is so she precisely tries to do this kind of a sweeping history where where her thesis is that actually the shifting view of nature is a is a historic process and she traces it back approximately 300 years and she says there is a 300 year old roughly in from seeing the earth as a living organism towards seeing it as a machine that was consequently used to justify industrial capitalism and domination of, you know, of both nature and women in her perspective so she says exploration of images and metaphors directly linking nature and women she in this in this book she in fact debates these changing attitudes towards science and technology and the history I think what is fascinating is that history begins with the discovery of the new world, the late 15th century and you know goes through incredible number of examples from Newton to Leibniz through which in her point of view this mechanistic world view was installed and a couple of, I think, you know a couple of, I mean where it where it leads to bringing us today to the present day I think we are still I would say completely entrenched in that discussion I mean if we look for instance on the work of Bruno Latour in facing Gaia we have you know practically the same kind of question mark presented in the book so basically is it possible to let's say reconfigure our cultural paradigms around nature in order to let's say gradually begin modifying other fields of activity you know from politics to economy etc etc and the notion of course which is also implicated is Gaia and there is a link to James Lovelock so let's say is it possible to I think to say it in a provocative terms but these are also Latourian terms is it possible to remember or under our conditions to reinstall a kind of a new natural religion that would let's say inform the kind of shift that we are looking for in the face of let's say global environmental crisis. It's a big question I think it leads us to the idea of progress right that's what we need. We need to address progress now because I believe it's a matter of civilization maybe where we can find some you know you know hints hints also in the history where Western civilization became a kind of one religion for the whole planet in a way you know but it's almost arrogance to pretend being able to conduct society through scientific knowledge certain governance you know the economy which goes with it and of course the I would say the centralization of capital among a few you know which has been now delivering for several centuries whereas when we look you know if you really look to the way how things are built maybe we can learn something. I just you know maybe I can just give you the example of a Shinto shrine you know in Japan which is something which is repeatedly it's a shrine which is repeatedly turned down and rebuilt actually every 20 years and this over the past 1,300 years. So what happens is that the Shinto believe is based on the fact that they believe into the death and the renewal of nature and the impermanence of all the things. And as a way of passing. Building technologies actually from one generation to the other. And this is a whole process, which occurs every 20 years so which means that one single person in this community has most possibly the chance to to learn about rebuilding this shrine for two or three times. So, if we look at Japanese culture. We do discover this, you know, believe into into tradition and the knowledge which goes with it. We see it in the way how they handle craft how they handle certain building materials. But we also see that they have no trouble of going with the new technologies as well. So there is not this dialectical view on either or right. So they have this capacity to embrace the whole history in a way. And stay connected with nature so they don't oppose nature something which is you have the, you have the humankind and you have the nature no actually humankind belongs to nature is nature. I don't know. I, yeah, I love, I love the, I love the example of Shinto shrine and it. It actually reminded me off of john burger and I think most of many, I think probably everybody in the audience will will know john burger for for one or another of his books or the ways of seeing burger actually there is a there is a biographical moment which was deeply fascinating to me so somewhere in the mid 70s so again we're back in the 70s he actually left London where he was born and he moved to French Savoy close to Geneva to a very small village Hamlet about 50 kilometers uphill from Geneva. In his testament in his writing. The motive was to document the disappearance of subsistence farming. So the, the experience of historical experience, let's say of, of peasantry that he believed was drawing to a historical close and he was to bear witness to this vanishing existence and, and there, there are there is a very, very rich writing by him on this period there are there are also films documenting him in this environment. I think the seasons in Quincy. Highly recommended featuring also till the Swinton and so one of the one of the arguments that burger makes in the in this opus is that I think similarly to shine and see we should be looking closely and kind of salvaging these traditions because it's precisely according to him among other things about the notion of progress so he says that with this commitment to to living on the earth peasant has a different world view then urban classes and notably the proletariat so all urban classes also kind of including the bourgeoisie etc etc. So let's say the peasantry cultivates what he calls the culture of survival and that is opposed to the culture of progress. And he describes the difference through the understanding of time. Peasant has a cyclic view of time that is based on seasonality, nature's rhythms and so on that is opposed to the kind of linear time which is which has a kind of a upward trajectory towards some to say so future horizon however it is projected. And he says by contrast peasant is oriented to the past, not to the future, and he says his primary state of justice so this is a quote quite interesting formulation. Primary state of justice is the past before the onset of injustice where that class was was exploited in one way or another so when he and his family are free to work without oppression. And I think it's interesting also that he says that by contrast so the progressive and the progressives the progressive class how he defines them for them for the proletariat the ideal future is the future without work. No, so it's the state of leisure of consumerism of abundance and so on. And he says that this principle of progress oriented toward the future of plentitude without work and so on is the underlying ethos of all modernity so whether socialist or capitalist so ultimately the only difference he says between the socialism and capitalism is in the content of progress right so so how how is this state of plentitude achieved we are we are to say so engagement of artificial intelligence or you know other other forms of let's say redistribution. And so, so it's, it's a quite, quite let's say for me it was, it was a really striking figure and the kind of a striking effort by a person who was also to say so, somebody who who operated let's say in in the in the kind of urban culture and in the in the context of of high art. His entire life so, so I think that that. You know, if if we begin to talk about the kind of cyclic quality here right so I think obviously we are also talking about.  And, you know, all those experiences that we could save traditional countryside could handle without any problem whatsoever right and I think to to to recover those experiences. I mean we cannot essentially recover them because we live in urban societies that are at the vastly different scales and I think we are essentially, I believe faced with a new problem right. You know that that needs to be creatively addressed but but certainly let's say those those historical experiences are. You know are are are important than I I also like like a burger I mean in in in a lot of my work let's say countryside is present as as really as a source of. A source of, you know, I think of learning, you know, source of learning, yeah, although we we also understand now that globalization is a process which is not limited to cities so it is not so that that. You know, villages and agrarian landscapes are aren't touched I mean on the contrary right so and I think this is also one of the one of the points that that burger makes right so I think that is kind of a. Let's say. Silent transformation of. Life, I think anywhere through. Through this. Let's say industrial forms of economy is is is is is probably. I think a kind of a widespread European reality right so to kind of searching for the for the remaining spots of the rural I think is really. You know is a kind of a let's say, you know, could become a kind of a special special obsession. Yeah. Well this this brings us to the next and our last term which is domestic. So I was. I was actually wondering why we were discussing this term previously on how to relate the idea of domestic to home which which was maybe something that you were very much attached to as a concept right. So but, firstly, just to get back really to the term of domestic I really wanted to to address something which is important to me as well and and and goes back to the movement of arts and crafts right. Which actually emerged rather into emerged in the countryside, rather than in the cities basically led by by figures such as Maurice war actually not against the use of machines but they. The vision of flavor system designed which to to increase actually efficiency, you know, and to increase production. And which broke all the manufacturing tasks into small separate tasks in these linearity, which we call today lean, you know, the management which is the line where everything has to function in line. And she meant that the individuals had a very weak relationship to the result of what they were actually doing while they work about their labor. And this was basically in his eyes, the wrong direction. Maybe his, his, his way of thinking is still very, very contemporary, you know. More and more, even in intellectual services, which are done by by people that are academics basically so not only you know the ones that cannot go to universities but even the ones that do. They are taught actually at universities suddenly belong to to a line of work where their work is just a little piece of a much bigger one and they can be replaced at any time. So, and this is something which also socially speaking and not only environmentally speaking is huge problem because it the response, it the. The responsibilities, I don't know how you say that the responsibility, you know, the individual. Whether in arts and crafts, you know, you had this, you know, idea of a total interior of a design we should address all different disciplines so you had this cross disciplinarity already very much present where they would be able to to revolutionize domestics, domestic spaces and and give room for the first time also to women actually to to to be part of this design process so not only consuming in some way but also designing it for their own purposes. And, and this is maybe something which is a movement, it's, it's belonging to modernity in some way, but maybe different type of modernity is sort of organic modernity I don't know how I would call it, which would also belong to to artists such as Elin Gray or you know other other figures and designers that certainly never gave up actually trying to to join boy both the idea of abstraction in design and the crafts. These were not meant to be a post never. Of course, and so, so I, I, I think, since we are speaking about the domestic life and and, and we are also, you know, we are we are also architects, of course, and, and I think these, these questions are somehow, you know, following the looming, you know, let's say both through through our, our work on biographies. So, I think it's, it's interesting perhaps to, to, to bring it this for the moment to the personal sphere because architects are and certainly let's say those of our generation I mean, I think that there is a kind of a among all of our friends, let's say, very lucky friends of those that I am in contact with. I mean, those people have have, in a way, try to design and build their own home right and very much along those ideas of kind of believing in and also in a way loving that kind of creativity and ability to to shape one's own space now and I think that that I mean certainly, you know, we live in in cities that are expensive. We live in Zurich, and I think that the kind of reality of of real estate and I mean this is again where where where learners work, I think hits a kind of interesting point right so I think that the the I would say the the the realities of real estate market are in fact, I would say, pushing the way that the kind of either, you know, the possibility now of home ownership I think for many people and then ultimately the freedom of changing I mean this is not not only the real estate but also the let's see the the the various regulations around the home building which I think in the in the Western Europe are rather stifling you know so so let's say this kind of I think a playful need of of shaping and buildings one one on one's own home is is is more and more, you know, out of reach I think for for most urban days that I know right and I think we as as architects we are a kind of a village kind of a small party of those who are who are trying to go against that specific reality right so so so so I think you know if I mean perhaps you you would like to say I know that you are also, you know, designed and built your own house have been are there are there specific are there some some interesting experiences I mean we are still in the process I can tell you Yeah. Well, I think it's, of course, it's a it's a great privilege. It's an incredible privilege if you can start to think about your home, whether you are an architect or not actually it's it's something actually that many people just don't have the opportunity to do so. But indeed, I mean, while doing so for once for ourselves for for our family. We had, you know, these very, you know, essential questions on on what would we expect from our house, you know, and since we designed our house quite late you know as you know as an architect because most of our friends I don't know but many of them you know, managed in some way to do it little earlier.  So, our, our question basically what what what is our home what what will be this kind of point that we would like to create for our family. What would it need, who would it need to serve. And so and actually we realized over the design process that we were constantly changing and shifting rooms. So we realized that actually it's almost unforeseeable what what the needs are. We need we needed flexibility. And we also needed a space spaces which we would like to share also collectively so that was something which really came came up so instead of having very big private rooms at some point we thought maybe it's also nice to have rooms. Together, in order to cultivate this idea of exchange being together playing together. No listening or watching movies together so this is these are all concerns which which finally made up our quest for very simple design in the end so we made a very normal house. But of course trying to deal with these issues of of circularity and materials, you know, how to keep the things in the loop, you know, as long as possible. I mean, all that was really part of our process. I don't know. I would like to share it with you actually in real time. Yeah, it's interesting.  I think that that learner also underlines in in many of her works in in working with the local craftsmen and so on and I think that this, at least I mean, you know, here in our our experiences I mean this this is also an almost utopian undertaking because I think it makes sense in the context of high art, but in the context even of architects building their own house it's almost possible. And I think this is, you know, even even though we would be very very committed to it but you know we've we've built a small, you know, small projects, for instance in in Belgrade and in Serbia where I come from and and now in Switzerland and perhaps also in the Netherlands and in each also believed for for a while in Singapore and I think in each of these countries we are aware in in very different ways how those craft knowledge or experiences to say so have have moved into kind of highly specialized areas and are completely out of reach or let's say everyday use right so let's say I think as as returning to say craft into the domestic sphere I'm afraid has become impossible right then I think that that you know this is this is a kind of a linking back to William Morris right so it's a kind of a it's a kind of a dream, you know, or to or to shine the shine right it's a kind of a dream that essentially we are unable to realize right either for the for the lack of knowledge, you know, which, which is effect or, or, you know, for the lack of money or, you know, for the kind of regulations working against against you or, or, you know, time is a problem you know what one one should have the luxury of time in order to be able and so on. And I think we have also discovered I mean, a team indeed a team of of recycling as a as a very important team that I wouldn't have have, you know, thought back then or, you know, it perhaps, of course, we spoke also in the bear market, you know, 20 years ago about recycling but I think we have discovered it really through the the kind of effort of doing something right and I think that that this kind of now pleasure of really salvaging something from from being thrown away has has become very important. Yes. This is this is also the kind of the kind of dialogue, you know, with learn, not sure if learn or is is is listening to us tonight but it has been a great pleasure and not to to to engage with each other and with her work. Yeah, yes, yes. Yes, thank you, Billy. I think we have to stop now on these beautiful words and we, yeah, we basically thank Leonor for her work, her contribution and all the instigations that followed and this opportunity that we had to reconnect through this talk and all the previous meetings. Which was actually also made possible by Caroline Hoffman of Muddam who had this idea actually to to to make this conversation possible as well. So I, I, I think that we have now to to stop the session. So I say goodbye to you to your family. Thank you so much. All my best greetings. Thank you so much. It was a great pleasure. And thank you, Dora. It was really lovely to share this time with you. Thank you. Bye.


Welcome to Finding Respect in the Chaos on ThinkTekHawaii.com. I'm so happy to be back with you all. It was a little bit of a hiccup there where I was out for the last couple of months, but I'm really happy to have you all back with us here. We've got all kinds of stuff going on right now in this world, too. A lot of chaos, right, especially in Washington. All this stuff with Judge Kavanaugh. We know we're looking at so many different things, and we've got important stuff happening here on this island, too, and in these islands. And I'm here today with Justin Murakami. Justin, thank you for coming. Welcome. All right, thank you so much for having me. It's really nice to have you here. Justin writes policy for the Sex Abuse Treatment Center. And he was here one other time. And we talked about the bills that we're going to be going through the legislature. And so now I've got him back here. And we're going to talk a little bit more about what happened with those bills. Of course, it was a few months ago, but I've been out for a couple of months. So I'm happy to be back, though. You know, this stuff with Judge Kavanaugh, I think really sheds a spotlight on the gender inequality stuff that we've got going on. Cuz especially with him, specifically, Judge Kavanaugh just recently, was adjudicating a case for a girl who had come in, she was a minor, 17. She was an immigrant. And so she wanted to get an abortion. There was bad circumstances involved in the way she got pregnant. And Judge Kavanaugh kept delaying it and delaying it and delaying it. And he is on record as saying that 17 year olds, well this girl anyway, who was 17, was responsible for her behavior. And now here we are fast forward to what's happening now with Dr. Ford coming forward with these allegations of attempted rape. It's what happened to her. And now what we're hearing from all the Republicans is, they were just 17. Well, 17 year olds are held accountable for what they do. They're tried as adults. If a 17 year old rapes somebody, they go to jail. They don't just go to juvenile hall, they go to jail. And so this is a really big thing that it seems to me anyway, like the Republicans are just trying to push it under the carpet. Oh, it just happened a long time ago. And that to me is just wrong and unfair and really shines a light on how messed up our system is in this sort of stuff. And I think that it is a story about inequality, gender inequality, economic inequality, racial inequality. Insofar as there are special rules for certain people, whereas everybody else is held to a certain standard where age 17, you're almost an adult, you're responsible for your behavior. So we see a lot in how there are classes that are treated differently and given the benefit of the doubt and how it even works within those classes. So keeping in mind that both Professor Ford, Dr. Ford really, and Judge Kavanaugh were part of the same elite private school community and how we're seeing the idea that a 17 year old boy, man, is not responsible for their actions, whereas a woman would be held accountable for everything that happens. And there's a lot of victim blaming going on. Oh my gosh, there's so much victim blaming going on. It's crazy. Why didn't she come out before now? What took her so long? You know, and that is a standard normal thing for people that have been sexually assaulted, that they don't come out ahead of time because public shaming. And look, what's happening to her kind of proves that to be right. Absolutely. So how on the one hand can you say a person has an obligation to come forward immediately, which completely misunderstands the entire concept of what trauma does to a person when a person has been sexually assaulted or sexually abused. So on the one hand, it completely misunderstands that dynamic. But at the same time, it answers its own question. Why don't victims come forward earlier because of the victim blaming dynamic? Because people automatically don't believe them and say as much. And in the case of Dr. Ford, it goes beyond that.  Now, she is engaged in an act of courage to come forward, say what she will. There is credibility behind her allegations. There were letters from her community. I think there was one letter with a thousand signatures and other with dozens of her classmates from her school saying that this is the environment that they grew up in, that there were these sort of, you know, so whether it happened to her, it is a believable sort because it happens. Right. Right. And in 2012, she also reported to her a therapist. Right, in 2012. Absolutely. So years before this appointment was even, you know, out or thought of. Right. So that makes a big giant difference. And then when you consider the way the Republicans are trying to just rush this guy through the whole appointment process anyway, and then now continuing on that whole track of rushing him through so fast, when he has come out in the past about being against pro-choice, he's very pro-life, but he doesn't want to talk about being pro-life when he's being interviewed by the senators. And I watched some of his, the interviews that they did with the senators interviewing him. And you could just tell he was so evasive with every answer almost when it came to direct questions that the Democrats put before him about women's issues specifically.  And then when I sat down and actually listened to the guy, I'm like, whoa, he's dangerous. He's a dangerous guy. But so we just have to talk to our senators, right? Get our voices out there, really make our voices heard about how we feel about what's just happened. You know, I think it, yeah, and I'm not here to comment on the politics surrounding what's happening. No, and I'm not. I'm just, you know, the point being that there are certain social inequities and dynamics that are playing out here, and that there is a, there continues to be an intractable misunderstanding of how trauma impacts victims and a misunderstanding of how victims can and do rationally react to abuse and assault, sexual violence. Right. Yeah, to hide and to shame yourself even, and all of that so that you don't end up coming out sooner, right? Yes. Well, all right, let's talk about some local stuff that's happening here with some of the bills that we talked about before. Of course, I don't remember all the numbers, but I know you do. So I would love it if you would give us some of the results of some of the things, give us a little bit of a recap of the bill itself and then let us know what happened with it. I think it's important for all of us to know. Sure. So as we had talked about in our previous meeting, SATC, the Sex Abuse Treatment Center, was really pressing for three main legislative agenda items. The first was Senate Bill 2719 from this past legislative session having to do with the civil statute of limitations. We were seeking both the reopening of a window period so that old cases could be brought in court, as well as an extension of the underlying statute of limitations. And we were going to increase that from age 26 to age 40 for child sex abuse cases. gosh, and that's what it should be. You know, as knowing my own experience, I didn't remember until I was 30 years old when I had my first memories. And so I think that bill was so important. I know I was calling my senators and you, ah, come on. So what ended up happening? Yes. And to acknowledge what you were saying, studies have found that really adult survivors of sexual violence and childhood often don't come forward with their stories or are able to disclose their abuse until well into their 30s or 40s. Even if they do remember. For me, I didn't remember until I was 30. But for people that, even people that do remember, because there's so much other social trauma and social mores that get put on it that you don't want to say anything. There are a lot of pressures not to disclose. Right, absolutely. So what happened with that bill was we were successful in getting a two-year extension to the window period. So, you know, in effect, there is no civil statute of limitations for the duration of those two years because old cases can be brought and newer cases are still within the existing statute of limitations. But we do need to change that underlying statute of limitations in order to address, you know, there is this concern for these older cases, right, people who had been victimized decades before. But what about more recent and future victims? The world has not changed. And I think we see this, you know, in the Cabinet case. The world has not changed so much that the dynamics are there that is easy for childhood victims to come forward and disclose their abuse themselves. I mean, me too is helping, but it's not changing it completely. So, when you say two years, wait, I'm trying to understand this. Does this mean that you've got, even the old cases now, have two years to bring their old case forward? Is that what it is? So, there was a previous window period. It was a four-year window period. It actually expired in 2016. So, we have now reopened it for an additional two years. So, those cases can be brought in. You know, the cases that were brought into that included the Kamehameha Schools case against the psychologist out at St. Francis Hospital. Right, and you hear on the radio, I hear on television, all these lawyers now that are running ads for, you know, they're talking about the fact that this bill has changed and that we are able to bring forward old cases and they're trying to drum up support, so to speak. I don't know, get the word out. I like that that is at least, because they're taking out commercials. So, that means that's getting the word out to people a little bit more. And the hope is that people do come forward and are able to seek justice for themselves and hold their founders accountable. And it's, you know, we talk about changing the culture. We, again, you know, the Me Too movement has brought a lot of this to light.  Right, exactly. And I love that those things are changing. You know, when you say how important it is for victims to be able to come and hold their abusers accountable, I was able to do that in the late discovery. I don't know what you call that, umbrella. This is way back in the 80s. This was long before anyone did this stuff. But it made all the difference in the world for me to have him stand accountable, to have him have to, you know, be in court and say that he did it. He did admit to his guilt. I was really lucky. It was an easy fight. But what a difference it made for me for him to have to pay a fine and to stand in the courtroom, right? Well, listen, right now, all this is great. And we have so much more to talk about. We have to take a break right now. And I hope that everyone will come back or stay with us. Please find your respect in the chaos. I'm Cynthia Lee Sinclair here with Justin Murakami. And I know you're gonna be interested in what we talk about next. So stay with us. Hey, this is Andrew, the security guy. I'm here in the Think Tech Hawaii studios. And we do security matters every Wednesday at 1 p.m. We're talking access control. We're talking intrusion. We're talking video. We're talking voice. All the things that are important to security, things that you should know, things that you should think about when you're out there in the community, things that you should look for to keep yourself safe because security matters. Thank you. Hi, I'm Bill Sharp, host of Asian Review here on Think Tech Hawaii. Join me every Monday afternoon from 5 to 5.30 Hawaii Standard Time for an insightful discussion of Contemporary Asian Affairs. There's so much to discuss. And the guests that we have are very, very well informed. Just think, we have the upcoming negotiation between President Trump and Kim Jong-un. The possibility of Xi Jinping, the leader of China, remaining in power forever. We'll see you then. Welcome back to Finding Respect in the Chaos. I'm Cynthia Lee Sinclair, and we are talking about some really important bills that have just gone through our legislature about a month and a half ago, two months ago, I guess it was over, huh? At the beginning of May. Oh, gosh. No, it's okay. It's such a good little bit of a summer break. So I was sick for a while. Not at all. I think I got behind the curve here. But we're doing it now, and I think it's important for people to get the message out there that... Okay, so give us the next one. What's the next one? We're gonna talk about it. So just before the break you had mentioned, you know, the delayed disclosure. Right, right. It's important to note just that Hawaii also has a provision in our civil statute of limitations that we would also be seeking to extend. You know, that was part of the reform to extend the delayed disclosure, statute of limitations window, because it's not all, even after discovering injury, it's still, you know, you don't know where that person is in their life, and they need to be given the opportunity to deal with whatever they may be dealing with at the point of life, but still be able to bring their case forward. Right, a little bit later. Yes. For me, I just jumped right on it. As soon as I found out I could do it, I'm like, yes. But I know that most of the people that I talked to at that time were like, oh, how are you doing that? Why? I could never do that. And I realized with most of the, even in the group, because I was in a 12-step group for survivors of incest, and all of the people in the group, you know, overwhelmingly said they would not be able to do it. They would not be able to go forward with it. People do need that time to heal first and get some strength back to themselves and to get past some of the shame and everything to be able to move forward. So that didn't get to go through on that bill then. Is that what you're saying? It's just the two years, huh? Just the two years for now. So we will be coming back and asking for that underlying statute of limitations. We don't want to lose momentum on this because if the justification is there for the two-year window period, it's hard to see why the justification doesn't exist for the underlying statute of limitations. So is that what they said? They said it wasn't justified and they couldn't justify doing that? You know, there was never a clear, least stated reason why they would opt for the option of the two-year window as opposed to the underlying statute of limitations. You know, it could just be a matter of this issue doesn't come up all the time. And again, you know, the way to do advocacy around these issues is to educate, educate, educate. And obviously, you know, that message resonated with the legislators because they did pass the two-year window extension. So we can only hope to build on that going forward. Right, now educate, educate, educate. There's a bill that was about that, right? Prevention, education. There was. For the teachers and for in the schools, right? That was a really important one. So Senate Bill 2368, which was our errands law legislation that progressed. That's what it was called, right? So in previous years, we had been seeking a working group where a task force to sort of bring together the stakeholders and figure out how to implement a project, a program for the state of Hawaii in our Department of Education and Public Schools. What this bill would have done, and it was introduced by a number of the women's legislative caucus members, had a lot of good, strong support, would have, it was that it would have mandated the department to implement a program. Would have. Would have. So in other words, it didn't go. So the department- I don't understand how they could not vote for that. That's, and prevention is nine-tenths of the cure. How could they not vote for that? That I don't understand. Well, I mean, the Department of Education, as we know, is one of the largest school districts, functional school districts in the country, and they've undergone significant leadership changes with the incoming of a new superintendent. So the hope is that we're able to show them that they should be prioritizing the health and well-being of students, and the impacts of sexual violence on Hawaii school students are clear. The Department of Health has engaged in a youth risk behavior survey of middle and high school students, which actually shows that children and youth in Hawaii experience rape at a higher rate than their national counterparts. Oh, wow. They experience more intimate partner sexual violence in their national counterparts. And that effect is actually disproportionately shown in certain counties, Hawaii County, for instance. For example, has a higher rate than the rest of the state. So we can make a really strong case. As I said before when we previously met, the experience of the sexual assault centers is that regularly on a year-to-year basis, maybe 50% or more of the survivors that we treat are abused or assaulted when they're younger than the age of 18. Wow. So these are what the statistics and the surveys and the facts are showing. Hard numbers that youth in Hawaii really do need a program. And where is one of the only places you can reach them and make a cultural change but in the school system? Right, so I know we have the respect program that's here locally. And those are all programs for the schools to go out and teach kids what respectful behavior looks like. Yes. There's the no more, and I think, well, that's in colleges anyway. I don't know if that's in high schools and middle schools. So the respect programs actually are a product of the Sex Abuse Treatment Center. It's a curricula-based prevention program. And so it has components where we go out into the community and do community group education. But the Department of Health is actually funding a project right now and has done so for several funding cycles where there's a train-the-trainer model with respect to Department of Education educators, where we teach them about the curricula. And they take it and they apply it. Some with more fidelity, some may use it to inform their practice. And to date, I think that we've trained maybe 7,000 educators. Wow. I'm sorry, maybe 700 educators. Okay, 7,000. I apologize. Is that like every teacher in Hawaii? I apologize. 700, still 700 is huge. That's a huge number of teachers. So in your opinion, what would you say was the underlying reason why this didn't go through? Is it just that they are not, I mean, they still can, but they're just not required. Is that the way that, am I understanding that, right? Yes, so the curricula exists. There are other curricula as well. So the Department approves the curricula for you. So our curricula, are approved for use with it as a health curriculum. So schools can select it. They can teach it to different degrees. Right. Hawaii has a big huge respect program that has like radically changed domestic violence and sexual violence and assault in that school. Or actually, apparently, on the whole island, what the kids at that school are reporting anyway, that has completely radically changed things. Just instituting that program has radically changed more. Yes, it is. It's just exciting. Part of the Department of Health project is that we are trying to demonstrate those attitudinal changes, that sort of cultural change that will make a difference and hopefully create a generation of students who do not sexually abuse and who know what sexual abuse is and understand concepts like consent. Right, right. I don't know if you've seen some of my other shows. I had my brother on one of my shows who is a doctor who has a program over in Africa. And that's what he's doing, is he's teaching young boys, the name of the program is Ujima'a, and it's Together We Can Heal. And that's what he's doing is he's going into the schools and teaching these programs about respectful behavior, what it means to set healthy boundaries. And so it has changed the rape culture in areas where they have done this. He's been doing it for about 20 years now. So he's really able to get some good numbers and really get some good statistics. And he's been studied by Johns Hopkins and Stanford and they all have put a stamp of approval on his program. And it's all about teach kids young. If we can teach them young, we can change the way they grow up. And they can even help their parents in the process. And that's the only way we're gonna change this whole messed up inequality that's going on. Yeah, but isn't that cause for optimism that it generally demonstrates the global nature of this movement? Absolutely, there you go. That's just where I was going with that, thanks. Okay, so we had one last bill that was on our agenda, which was Senate Bill 2342, which was clinical victim support services. We were seeking insurance coverage for these services by a psychologist or a therapist, a four sexual violence survivor, where they would connect them to services. They might work with their employers or their schools among things like safety planning or reasonable accommodations so that a person wouldn't lose their job or drop out of school as a result of having been victimized by sexual violence and decompensating psychologically. Right, now did that pass? Unfortunately no, so. Oh gosh, so we really need to get people out there engaged and motivated to really talk to their senators, talk to their representatives. Let them know what needs to happen and that we need to make these changes, right? Yes, and so in that case, there was a question about the appropriate procedure for passing a revised insurance mandate. And so we're gonna be going in with a resolution as well as a bill and hoping to get that pass within the next couple of years, within the next legislative biennium. So when is the next legislative session gonna be? It'll start in January. It always starts on the third Wednesday of January. Third Wednesday of January, okay everybody, you heard it. Third Wednesday of January. We've just got a couple minutes left. Do you have one last thing you'd like to maybe share with everybody? No, just that we're gonna have a very busy year. As always, the Sex Abuse Treatment Center runs this public policy program to really institute system change and we invite members of the community to engage with us. So my number is posted on our website. I'm available by email and if anybody wants to become engaged in this movement, receive alerts about important bills that are moving, then I'd be happy to outreach them or engage with them. All right, yeah. So remember that you guys out there, the Sex Abuse Treatment Center is available. If you are a victim and you need help, go see them, they are amazing. And even if you are not a victim, if you wanna get involved in the public policy that needs to change so that we can really make some significant changes to our culture, then I ask that you please get hold of them. Let them tell you exactly what you need to do and how you can approach your legislators to try and make the changes that need to happen in our society. Okay, so it was great to have you, Justin. Thank you so much for coming back. Well, thank you. I hope you will come back again. I'm gonna keep having you come back and keep us posted on what's happening. We'll have an exciting year, definitely. Yes, we will. Okay. Well, I wanna thank everyone for being here with us today. This is thinktecawaii.com and I am Cynthia Lee Sinclair, finding respect in the chaos is back. I will see you again soon. So I hope you'll come and join me again.