Good morning and welcome to the Center for Strategic and International Studies. I'm very pleased to be here with several of my favorite colleagues who are going to give you the lowdown on the President's trip to Latin America and some of the Americas and Mexico City. We have a lot of important matters to discuss right now, but I have to clear up one thing before we even go. My name tag says Mr., but we have a Dr. de Chezzo, a Dr. Mendelssohn foreman and a Secretary Aldonis here, so I should just say that before we get going. And with that, let me throw it to Peter. Good morning, everybody. The Obama administration is off to a good start with its relations with the Americas. Presidents visit to Canada. President Lula's visit to the U.S. Vice Presidents' meetings with regional leaders in Chile and Costa Rica. Secretary of State Clinton, Secretary Napolitano, Attorney General Holder to Mexico, and now the President's trip to Mexico City and to the summit of the Americas. It's really an extraordinary concentration on an area that hasn't gotten quite so much attention recently. The Mexico visit comes at a difficult time for Mexico, a confluence of highly negative factors. The U.S. economy and the Mexican economy are tightly linked, and the turn down in the United States has had perhaps a greater effect in Mexico than most other countries in the region. Mexico is looking at negative GDP. In 2009, its export sector is strongly affected by the downturn. The maquila industries of the northern Mexico and the Mexican automobile sector and auto parts are very, very closely linked to the U.S. Remittances from Mexicans in the United States back home are down. Oil production is falling. Mexico derives about 40 percent of its state revenues from taxes on Pemex, the state oil company, and of course the drug violence that's been spiking as a result of the activities of the drug cartels has captured a lot of attention recently. So Mexico is in a difficult period right now, and part of the task of President Obama's presence will be to reassure Mexicans of U.S. support and cooperation on economic trade and security issues. Summit of the Americas in Trinidad and Tobago, Port of Spain, this is the fifth summit bringing together the OAS member nations. The agenda, probably the key issue, will be the economic crisis and the response to it. Five countries in the region participated in the recent G20 meeting. They're the sort of, they're the countries that have been most closely involved in this, but everyone will be looking at and listening to what President Obama says on the plans to reactivate the U.S. economy. Security, public safety in the region will be an important issue. There's been a crime wave in many parts of the region, and there's a lot of concern about international crime, drug trafficking, and many other kinds of organized crime. Human development, the environment, energy security, those are all on the agenda. One of the important goals of the agenda is to revitalize the summit process after an unsuccessful summit in Mar del Plata in 2005 to give a new emphasis to regional cooperation. And finally, the issue of Cuba, which is certainly not officially on the agenda, but it will certainly be raised. And there will be considerable interest in U.S. positions on Cuba and expression of support from various countries to differing degrees. About reintegrating Cuba into the inter-American process, Cuba was suspended from active membership in the OAS in 1962 and is not a member of, it's not a participant in the summit process. I'll stop there. Hi. It's Grant Haldona. So I'm just going to touch on a couple of the economic points and then some of the trade side briefly before turning it to questions. The first thing is the President came away from the G20, I think, with really strong marks personally. In particular, the G20 itself outperformed everybody's expectations. I think most of the people in the currency markets were shorting the G20 before it happened, but in fact the things that they did produce with respect to the IMF increasing its ability to help out smaller countries, certainly the dedication they showed toward developing countries, all, I think, reflected well on the President's preparation and the goodwill, I think that he's carrying into this. That goodwill is going to carry over into the summit here, certainly got on well with the Latin American leaders that were present at the G20 in London, good bilaterals with the individuals.  In particular, at least in my experience, the mere fact that Secretary Clinton acknowledged the United States' role and responsibility in many respects in terms of the drug violence in Mexico and the economic repercussions of it is helpful in establishing a certain amount of credibility because what it does is recognize the reality of the situation. Question is whether that will carry over into the discussions about trade and recognize the same role in terms of Colombia and actually lead to a discussion about how we move on the FTAs that are currently before Congress, that Colombia and others are still seeking implementation while we're hanging fire. It doesn't appear to be any move on part of the Clinton administration or I'm sorry, on the part of the Obama administration to push the implementing legislation through the Congress at this point. Trade is going to be a low-level priority given the positions that Obama, the candidate staked out, but he will feel obliged, certainly in Mexico, to follow through on the rhetoric of the campaign from Ohio in terms of asking for renegotiation of certain parts of the agreement. That on the whole is not actually a good sign. That's the downside in terms of where we are. World trade is plummeting. Trade in the region is plummeting and despite the sort of black name that the Washington consensus gets, particularly from the political left, the reality is the policies adopted by the countries in Latin America led to a really sustained period of economic growth, about 3% over the last decade, actually the strongest growth in the last 30 years and in many respects have insulated them from some parts of the downturn. Forward-looking countries like Peru have adopted trade strategies that really have embraced the globe and has given them a lot more economic stability in the face of the current downturn in the United States economy. So in one sense, trying to unclog the arteries of trade would actually be a critical step, but it's nowhere on the agenda. And I always feel like going into one of these things, the smart thing to do is just Google the title of the summit and see which articles pop up about when they started to negotiate the declaration. And one of the first articles I saw recognized that they were coming to a conclusion about the declaration last September. And just to point out, the world we're living in economically now, relative to last September, is radically different. And I think in summer's fix that's a measure of the lack of focus on the economic issues that matter, and that, in fact, would push back against rising protectionism, not only in the United States, but elsewhere in the region at this point. So let me stop there. Thank you and good morning. I wanted to add some points about the Caribbean and also the upcoming donors meeting in Haiti, because Haiti will also be a side subject at the summit. For the Caribbean, if Mexico and Canada are land borders, the Caribbean was declared in 2003 a third border of the United States, and that concept was really never carried through because of other problems that the U.S. was having in other areas of the world. But in fact, the Caribbean states all look to this summit. This is the first summit held in the Caribbean, on an island there, to revive a tension on the region because of several points. One, because the Caribbean is still an important energy platform and a potential platform, particularly for renewable energy, and in the case of Cuba for petroleum. Second, it's an environmentally vulnerable region. 60% of all population in the Caribbean live on the coast. And any of us who read from the IPPC report of the U.N. to other reports on environment that in the next 30 to 50 years, most of the Caribbean will increase a three-foot sea level rise, which has tremendous implications for human security in the region. And so we have this environmental vulnerability and energy platform, and then we have a third factor, which is that these islands, many of them are insufficiently diversified small economies that are affected not only by national disaster, but now the global economic downturn. And that has tremendous impacts, and so many of the economies are dependent on remittances from citizens living in the U.S., also in Canada, but mainly in the U.S., and this will have a severe effect on economic growth. Perhaps the only bright side for the Caribbean at this moment is that the reduction in petroleum prices over the last six months has relieved some of a burden, but 2008 overall was a very difficult year for the region because the social safety net monies, which would have been spent on human issues, had to go to pay large energy bills. We can talk a little bit about the subsidies that were given by Venezuela, most of the Caribbean states, with the exception of Trinidad and Tobago are members of Pedro Caribe. But once again, that's another issue, I'm sure that will be an important sidebar in the discussion of energy at the summit because of the lack of sustainability of that program, given the projections not only for oil output of which Venezuela, while having one of the largest reserves, is not able to fulfill the demand that it has created in the region. I'd also like to point out that renewable energy, which was a focus in the Bush administration under the U.S.-Brazil biofuel partnership, which focused on several Caribbean states, is also being incorporated into President Obama's pledge of an energy partnership in the Americas, which is to advance the growth in clean energy and the summit at Trinidad and Tobago next week will certainly bring up this pledge and begin the discussions of a framework for implementation. The overarching goal in the summit declaration, which as Grant said was prepared early on, was certainly to create a renewable and low-carbon energy area. In fact, the goal is 50% by 2050 reduction of greenhouse gases. It's a very ambitious goal given the economy right now. And with that kind of a problem, we're also going to see many other relationships. Their poverty reduction, though, which is a major goal within the summit declaration, may be ameliorated in some ways if a renewable energy system gets started. Renewable energy is one of the best sources of job creations in the Caribbean. I have some data, I don't have to talk about it now, about the number of jobs that would be created in the beneficiaries would certainly be labor force, both in the Caribbean and also the opportunity to bring in other types of industrial bases that relate to the production of renewable sources of energy. Just one final note in Haiti, because there's also a sheet on the donor meeting coming up. The relationship and the renewed focus on Haiti that the Obama administration has placed on it, the high priority that the UN has placed on it, the visit of President Clinton earlier in March with the Secretary General, the famous report that economist Paul Collier did on the potential of Haiti to become an industrial platform to the U.S. through the Hope legislation that was passed in October of 2008, are certainly one of the more promising things that we see in an otherwise rather difficult economic picture on an island that was hit by I can of Gustav and Fay who are not friends on a TV show but are the four hurricanes that destroyed the island and the resurrection of these cities is very, very difficult. So I'll stop there. Thank you. I'd love to take some questions. Mr. Connick. Actually, two questions if I can. Peter, how much does the President benefits at this early stage in the region just by not being George Bush? And I wanted to follow up with Grant on trade. I mean, it seemed like all the previous summits of the Americas, American presidents went there talking about free trade, free trade, free trade. It doesn't seem to be on the agenda here. Is that because, as you seem to suggest, that agenda succeeded? Or just it's not a priority for this president? Is there any pressure on him on Columbia to get that in? I mean, what's happened to that? President Obama's popularity with public opinion in the region is a major resource that he takes into the summit. In some of the polls done during the election, up to 85% of populations and are publics in certain countries in the region supported him. And that will be a very important resource that he has. All eyes will be strongly focused on him, on both what he says in terms of US policy in the region and also the way he relates with other colleagues. He's the top US diplomat. I think his trip to Europe showed was a sort of presage to look for in Trinidad and Tobago and Mexico. George is really good question. On the free trade front, it's not going to be a major issue. In part, it is because it succeeded. In reality, a lot of what we ought to be doing trade-wise in the region comes down to some very practical things of unclogging the arteries. It's things like infrastructure. It's things like transportation. It's things like a better telecommunications network in a region that is shifting towards services like the rest of the global economy as telecommunications is actually a transportation vehicle rather than a way of communicating with each other since you send your services down the wires. And so the sorts of things that would make sense to do right now don't necessarily have to involve the classic things we've done to negotiate about tariffs or quotas or things like that. The other thing is that there's a growing recognition that to take full advantage of the agreements that have been reached on a regional basis, you have to start grappling with the things that lie beyond the border. You have to start grappling with the sorts of things that you face internally in terms of the institutional and physical infrastructure problems that you face. But to be blunt, the economic and political situations changed radically in the United States as well as in the hemisphere generally. You've had a stronger shift toward much more populist politics. Certainly the idea of trade liberalization, you couldn't even mention the word free in relation to markets of the G20, for example. And that was a group of finance ministers in central bankers. You can see it. And what's interesting, I think, you see in the United States in particular that populism really affects both parties. It just comes out in two different debates. It comes out as a trade debate among Democrats and an immigration debate among Republicans. But it's the same insecurity being reflected there. And I think the economic crisis has heightened that. So there's less pressure, I think, on all sides to think about liberalization. The real question is, what can you do to make sure that we don't see a rollback as a part of the process? The irony about trade, of course, is that it's the best defense is a good offense. Staying on offense is really what helps drive the process. That's what's missing. And that's what raises the concern that we're going to be rolling back. That's where Columbia comes in, as is Panama. If the president made the statement that you could get up, move these things, work with a rebate, make sure that we got this through, it'd be an enormous statement in support, not only of American leadership in the region, but a recognition that we were part and parcel of the reasons for Columbia's decline and that offering another economic opportunity as part of the responsibility we share in resolving the crisis that, in part, our drug habits created in Columbia. So he could do that. Unfortunately, what he was doing as candidate in terms of trailing around Ohio with Sherrod Brown and borrowing his brand name as a part of the process makes it very difficult for President Obama to do that. And so I don't expect it's going to come out of the region. And I don't expect it's going to come out of the summit, even though I think it's one of the absolutely essential things the president could do. Does Mexican trucking have them on the country? Sure does. Yeah. Now, this is an issue that Mickey Canner signed the agreement originally, the NAFTA agreement. And President Clinton immediately walked away from the trucking provisions with deference to the Teamsters. So it's an old sort of problem. But this is really what the Congress did, in terms of ending the program at Byron Dorgon's sort of press, really has put him on the defensive. I think what people are seeing is that instead of being a paragon of virtue on trade, which I'm always skeptical that we are, but in this instance, you're sort of down one going into the conversation. So far from actually trying to do something that would promote trade, as a part of this, we are, in fact, on the defensive on trade. I'd like to make just a quick comment about the framework of the summit process and trade. Then at the 1994 first summit of the Americas of Miami, it was determined that the nations of the region, it was laid out as a goal, would negotiate a free trade area of the Americas in over a period of about 10 years. That failed to happen, and the trade issue was almost laid to rest in Mar de Plata in 2005, where there was no consensus on any kind of statement on trade at the event. This time around, if there's any kind of language on trade, and I haven't seen the declaration of commitment, if there's anything, even if it's a placeholder, it would be a step forward. But the idea of the free trade area of the Americas is certainly not moving anywhere. Two questions, please, for any of the speakers. If you could elaborate a bit more about the president's economic agenda at the summit, given all of the issues you've raised, is he going there with any specific asks, any specific request for commitment, or put another way, how would he emerge and judge it as being successful? Well, actually, I think there's a wonderful way to do that with the president's agenda, because the reality is the region as a whole, despite its liberalization and the success of that over the last decade, after 20 years of tough times, we're still left with an income distribution problem skew that's heavy. It is always going to contribute to a more populist politics until you find a way to address it. The president's domestic agenda is one that is designed to address that here, and it is the same set of issues that actually need to be addressed within the region. George and I were talking a little bit earlier about we're living in a world where, if you can reduce a job to an algorithm, it's going to be done by a computer, and that means you have to raise the investment in human capital significantly, and while we have problems at the K through 12 level, we've got great universities. Throughout Latin America, we have some good universities, but overall, the investment in education is well below the norm, and well below what you'd need to remain competitive in the global economy. So in one sense, the president has a built-in agenda that he could extend in the region, and we have real resonance, not only with the political leaders in the region, but also with the people in the region. Let me just add one point. I think what President Obama brings to the summit is the commitment out of the G20 for this $1 trillion that I think the two beneficiaries will be the Latin American region for borrowing and for Eastern Europe. So from that perspective, the carryover will be important. But there is also the reality, as Grant said, that, for example, President Moreno of the Inter-American Development Bank says, if growth stayed stagnant, the number of people that would drop to the extreme poverty level per year would be about 15 million people a year. Now, that's pretty dramatic, and all of us who have lived through the lost decade that we saw in about 20 years ago, 10 years ago, may actually begin to see that. And I think the message has to be delivered, that we don't want to repeat the lost decades, that we want to learn the lessons, and mainly the greatest losers in the lost decade were the education sector, where there was a tremendous drop in literacy, which is a correlate to development. So I think that those are the important things is keeping the perception up and also talking about the facilities that were created at the G20 for Latin America to use in this kind of crisis. Okay. I think people will be looking for the signs that the U.S. economy is going to recover. That's the recovery of the U.S. economy is the key factor, and everyone will be looking to President Obama for his description of how his plans are laid out, how they're going to be working, plus the other issues of avoiding protection and the further funds dedicated to the international financial organizations, the IMF, the IDP for loans. And beyond that, what others have said about empowering people in the region, any kind of announcement on possible programs, cooperation on energy security, education, all of those things would be very well received. The other topic I wanted to ask about was Cuba. If you could help frame that for us a little bit more. What is it that the nations are going to be debating, perhaps privately more than publicly? And just how do you expect that issue to play out and maybe even overshadow some other issues there? There'll be differences of opinion from the different countries. The countries close to Chavez himself, Bolivia, Nicaragua, those, the Alba countries, will be promoting a very vigorous change in policy to allow Cuba back into the summit process to allow Cuba into the OES. For other countries in the region, there may be support for reaching out to Cuba, but not necessarily to that extent. The United States has already said that it will not end the embargo, that this is not in the cards in the short term. Indeed, there's legislation that prohibits the normalization of relations with Cuba as long as Raul Castro is in power and as long as there's no transition to democracy. And in fact, the OES by certain documents and certain agreements that it's signed would make Cuba's full participation extremely difficult. The Inter-American Democratic Charter that was signed in 2001 basically establishes democracy as the coin of the realm in the countries of the OES, and that's a major impediment to Cuba's reintegration, but the issue is going to be, I think, strongly discussed. Yeah, if I could just add on, I think on the economic front, the early moves and the signals about altering the embargo, at least with respect to travel, does play in terms of a change in U.S. perspective about the region, and you would hope that it would be followed with a more thoughtful approach to how you reintegrate Cuba. How do you try and provide the incentives that would draw Cuba back in in essence to the family and nations? And as Peter was pointing out, that depends on political change in Cuba, which never been a big believer that anything we do economically is going to alter political choices in a particular country, but having said that, the fact is we've seen other instances like Nicaragua where we've had a change and we've drawn a country back into very close economic relationships with the United States as well as with the rest of the region. There's lots of lessons actually that could be learned and we could spend some time thinking about those in the offing. That'd be a good contribution. I don't see that on the horizon, but I think on the margins of the meeting that's going to be the discussion. Let me just add one point because you asked about framing. There are two things that I think will happen. This is an administration that is looking at multilateralism as an important part of its diplomatic tool. The fact that they're looking at the OAS and they're talking about a process is a change and I think that's going to be important. And the second fact that may come out because officially Cuba is not on the agenda and I think in all the press briefings that I've read, there hasn't been a lot of discussion of that when asked on an official basis. We will be looking for interlocutors on this dialogue as we have in the past and I think we may come out with a stronger set of positive actors within the region. The fact that this is taking place in the Caribbean is important. There are going to be people in countries that are going to be very important to this transition which is happening already. So I would just add those two points. Yeah, that's a very good point. The G20. It did provide those growth rates in some ways, but in other ways it was seen as a way of widening the gap between rich and poor. It lifted some people from poverty but because it relied on trade and export of resources and those kinds of things. And that mix of free trade, smaller government privatizations, low debt is now the exact opposite besides the trade of what the United States is doing. It's taking on huge amounts of debt. The state is taking much more control of things. Will Obama say to some of these governments that are moving to a much stronger state control of economies, yes, keep doing that and those of you that aren't should continue to. I mean, this is obviously Chavez's mantra, stateism. Will we see a complete reversal using the United States example to take for the state to get much more involved in the economy? Well, two thoughts. First, as to our ability to serve as an advocate for free markets and smaller government right now, I was told when I was very young by my shop teacher that she can't reclaim your virginity simply by pulling your pants back up. And, you know, the fact of the matter is going to be pretty hard for us to... Off the record. Yeah? But it's pretty hard for us to, you know, go right now and pretend that, you know, the things that we were visiting or the World Bank or the IMF were visiting on Latin American countries in terms of fiscal discipline, monetary discipline, all those things that go with it is going to play at this point. So that's number one. But more deeply, to be honest with you, for anybody who lived through those times, the idea that there ever was a Washington consensus is just... It's not really a serious proposition. There were a set of policies that the World Bank and a number of economists advocated, including at the IMF, that were broadly consistent with simply trying to free people to have the economic opportunity. I started out in my life as a Foreign Service Officer in Mexico. It didn't take long to figure out that the reason that everybody was operating in the black market was because they literally couldn't afford to comply with the rules and pay the price. And the interesting thing about the dynamic that NAFTA has created is that it has actually liberated individuals in Mexico to pursue their economic interests there. And to the extent that that was the point of the Washington consensus, it still is valid in terms of the region and embracing that creation of that economic space, that freedom to actually engage in exchange, specialize, raise your own productivity, contribute to a rising standard of living, all that's still relevant. To the extent that it reflected a certain perspective of conditionality at the IMF about things like fiscal discipline and monetary discipline, that I think is dead, in part because we can't be terrific advocates of it right now. I'd like to add that the policies that were forwarded by the Washington consensus that were applied in the region, all of the monetary fiscal policies that have led to much stronger economies have allowed them to weather or to confront this crisis in a much better situation than they would have been otherwise without massive currency problems, monetary problems, the fact that the debt is low, the fact that preserves are generally high, it allows them to increase their spending on social programs over at least the short haul to meet the crisis and hopefully when the world economy begins to recover they'll be in a better situation. So I'm not sure that there's sort of a revisiting of some of these basic fiscal monetary policies and the way of conducting the macroeconomic policy in the region, but definitely they're gonna have to adjust to a tough political environment where unemployment is going up and where GDP is being scaled back in every country. Maybe I could just add one more thing, Peter, you reminded me that there's one good, very concrete example. Today in Mexico there is a government bond market which allows the government to borrow and pay so's rather than dollars, so it's not exposed to the exchange rate risk the way it was early on. And there's a corporate bond market. It's unique actually in Latin America, but it is there in part because of the fiscal discipline and monetary discipline the Mexican government showed after the Tesobono crisis in 1994 to restore credibility, but also the institutional policy changes of which their ability to play off the stability in the US market because of the NAFTA agreement was absolutely central to it. So when you think about the constellation of policies of trade liberalization, fiscal discipline, monetary discipline, you can point to a concrete example where it really has paid off from Mexico, so it's not exposed to the risks it was in the 1970s, the 1980s when I lived there in the 1990s. And so in that sense, many of the things that people were talking about that get blamed on the Washington Consensus are just as Peter said, they've become bulwarks against worse economic times. And in that sense, I don't see them being revisited at this point. They've sort of proven the test of time. Just a quick follow on the IMF. I thought it was ironic that the day the Washington Consensus was declared dead, the IMF got about a trillion dollars considering it was the chief enforcer of it as viewed by a lot of these countries. Will the stigma on the IMF be, is it gone now for these countries? Will there be more people borrowing? Will they invite the IMF to come and get involved again or is it still gonna be seen as this sort of interloper? Let me, and I'm sure both Peter and Grant have other views, but the trillion dollar package that was released, and then Mexico immediately went and said they were gonna borrow off this new facility. I think you have to separate the IMF and the Washington Consensus as an ideological issue which fueled the left in Latin America and in the United States on Latin American policy versus the reality of what the IMF does as a global financial police agency and in a crime of crisis is gonna be used. I mean, the serious economists and the serious government officials in all Latin American countries are gonna be looking to the IMF. I mean, I think what you have to look at is this is a region with great income inequality, perhaps the greatest in the world and the sources of those are not from the Washington Consensus. The sources of those have to do with many other issues that Grant and Peter have meant from bad infrastructure planning, poor telecommunications, lack of investment in education, lack of access to different types of programs. Some of them are changing. There are cash transfer programs in some countries like Mexico which have been successful but those are not the Washington Consensus problems and I think there's a tendency to aggregate all of them under one title and I really believe that the IMF is gonna be a godsend both for Latin American for Eastern Europe. I would just say I meant more the perception of it. I mean, I think as you said, the officials and the economists certainly know what the IMF does and does not do but it was such a political lightning rod and people made so much hay out of this I'm wondering if you can roll that back to some degree and now have politicians saying guess what, we just got $50 billion from the IMF isn't that exciting when for years you've been telling people that the IMF is kind of the root of all evil. They don't call economics the dismal science for anything Scott. I mean, I think that nobody gets excited about the IMF. And there's less stigma if the Lulas and others of this world can claim that they have a greater say within the IMF and that in the governance of the IMF the bricks and other countries have a bigger role. Yeah, I guess what I'd say Scott is that you really do have a problem politically to make the turn to suddenly embrace the IMF. The IMF if it keeps its narrow function on balance of payments and has a little bit more heterodox approach to the individual economies is likely to succeed in the region but it's never gonna be embraced. I mean, that's like embracing the dentist. America's culpability in terms of the drug wars and the violence and for again, for those of us watching the campaign this was sort of a surprise. It just wasn't on the table. Can you speak to that number one and two, can you talk about America's responsibility here in terms of the consumption of illegal drugs, incurred fueling the problems we've seen in Mexico and also the transportation or the movement of weapons from north to south because of straw purchases and things like that. I mean, what is America's culpability on some of these issues? The blame game on drugs has been going on for a long time in Latin America. I'm a veteran of Columbia and all of the, for the denial of whose responsibility was what and throwing the casting of blame on it. I think there's a greater sense of sharing the responsibility and that was very clearly stated by Secretary Clinton that indeed if the United States is US demand is driving the drugs, then we have an important role and this is something that on the security side and the arms side, Johanna and I worked on this a lot and I'll let her talk about that. But I think the positions that the US takes on trying to stem the flow of illegal, the illegal flow of guns will be a major factor in reassuring Mexico of our dedication to cooperation and decision. I think to answer on the flow of weapons, it's going to have to take a interagency effort in the United States, not only the State Department but Homeland Security, Justice Department to begin to enforce laws that are on the books. The Mexicans have a very tight gun control law and they are not the source of the problem but certainly they're the beneficiaries of our own weak problems at the border, the ability to buy guns at gun shows without background checks and we're not the only people who are selling. I mean, weapons that were found in some of the cartel cash came from Hungary, they came from China so it's an arms bazaar in itself at the border and I think the immediate challenge is to reassure with some important symbol and Peter and I wrote about this treaty that has been lingering in the US Senate since the late 1990s, the control of firearms, the CFTA agreement which could possibly become a talking point but more than a talking point an actionable talking point that the President might refer to when he is visiting in Mexico next week and I would certainly be looking out for that but symbols are symbols and actions are actions. I think the fact that the President has announced I think with great courage that he's going to take on immigration policy as a promise that he made to the Hispanic community during the campaign since you asked about the campaign is certainly a very courageous act at a time when he's also trying to solve a global economic crisis, a nuclear crisis with North Korea and a very difficult situation at the US border. Let me just add two things. One is a very practical concrete thing which is I think there's been such an intense focus since 9-11 on what's coming in the country. Rightfully so in many respects that we've neglected what's going on in the country. There is something called the Arms Export Control Act when you send one of these things abroad you are obliged to get an export license. Anybody who's dealt with that bureaucracy at the State Department knows it's undermanned, knows it has to depend on the Custom Service for the enforcement aspects. It's not like you have people to State Department running around with guns. Frankly for those of us who used to work in the State Department you wouldn't want that. But the reality is that we have not done a credible job and because our focus has been elsewhere. And as a consequence now, times change, events change, perceptions change about what the threat is and I think what we're recognizing is that the porousness of the border works both ways and that actually is a very helpful thing to understand because going to Peter's point it is a shared responsibility. The border is actually a third country. It's something where the flow there as Joanna's pointing out is something that you don't see elsewhere in Mexico and you don't see elsewhere in the United States. You gotta come to grips with that together so the steps they've taken so far is helpful. The negative thing I have to say is the utter hypocrisy of assuming responsibility for the drug flow, not actually doing much about the demand side of the equation and oh by the way then sign to Mexico we want to renegotiate the NAFTA with respect to labor and the environment ignoring the fact that we need this agreement in part both to stem the tide of illegal immigration as well as to address the economic consequences of our drug demand. Just a quick follow up the, it just seems like it's been impossible for the United States just to win this drug war in terms of stopping the drug flow from South to North. Should the United States be, what can the United States do in the demand side and should legalization of some drugs be on the table? It's possible option. I think you're aware that's, I think three Latin American former presidents have already talked about the legalization of marijuana so the issue is on the table in a regional discussion, nothing has come from our side and there is a lot of attention being paid to the incarceration rates that are first time offenders that Senator Webb has now created a commission on crime that will look at that as well. So I think there's a recognition that we need to address it. I think what's interesting in this moment is that there's a separation now between the war on drugs which was the mantra of our relationship with the other issues that are socioeconomic based that are related not so much to the drug war but to the economic inequalities, the joblessness that so many youth have, the youth bulge that exists in Central America which creates an enabling environment for gangs. These are things I think and none of us mentioned and I think Peter and I had talked about the public safety which is a key issue in the summit agenda. This is one of the issues that all of the region, Central America and Mexico are looking at but also the rest of Latin America. So I think the ability of President Obama to deliver a clear message that we are concerned with safety and security aside from the drug issue which is important and related but not one and the same. They give leaders of the region a new way to address some of the basic problems that are responsibilities of states themselves. The key goal is to empower the capabilities of the state to be able to deal with the functions that a normal state would and to be able to defend the state against the effects of widespread international crime or organized crime drug trafficking to the extent that Mexico is able for example to strengthen its police force and not have to be able to use tens of thousands of military people to combat the crime syndicates in Mexico is important. All through Central America as Johanna mentioned the need for strengthened state presence. If there's been a lesson from Columbia it's been that and when society and state institutions and the state itself are able to project legitimate authority that lessens the amount of space open to the drug traffickers. Yes I just had two thoughts. One, a growing economy in the United States and elsewhere means there's other economic opportunities that would be one enormously helpful step that everybody could collaborate on. More concretely even I'm a libertarian by instinct because my skepticism of political power it doesn't go as far as the legalization of drugs but how you cope with quote unquote offenders of these sorts of crimes who do incidentally visit negative consequences on people in their own homes in their own communities and in the region doesn't mean you have to do it through prisons and I think that's part of what Senator Webb is talking about. I mean obviously an investment in trying to encourage people off of the substance is far better thing. Trying to make sure that our national parks are home to meth labs would be another good thing. There's a whole host of things but it really does take a different mindset about the problem that we have and thinking of it not purely as an issue of criminal enforcement and that in and of itself actually would be better. I'm always reminded of a friend of mine who actually grew up in the Nancy Reagan years going through school when it was just say no and he said it actually had a profound effect. The irony is that you had a generation where drug use declined. Those are the sorts of things that we had to focus on and obviously where we are in our prison system might have tell us that as well. Just one last point on your question. The opportunity that's before us with creating a national health system and looking at our entire health policy is probably gonna be the place where you're gonna see greater emphasis on treatment. The First Lady has talked about it. The President has mentioned it in the context of treatment. So I think we have a convergence of opportunities both on immigration and on national health to begin to deal with the treatment question as well. Hi, Alexander Duncan with Plats. You touched on this earlier energy and the environment and I was wondering where you anticipate this ranking among solve the many priorities that are gonna be discussed. Not just at the sum of the Americas but in Mexico as well. And also which countries do you anticipate President Obama going to personally offering to extend a hand in terms of development of their resources whether it's oil, natural gas or renewables which is clearly a huge priority for him domestically. Well and I'm sure you're aware that the US biofuels agreement which had four countries initially which were the Dominican Republic, Haiti, St. Kitts and Nevis and El Salvador has been expanded into Honduras and also into Nicaragua and the sense will be that there will be even greater interest because the Department of Energy is following up, in fact there will be a meeting in June in Liba to follow up on some of the implementable components of the energy accord. The other area and of course which is a sore point and isn't going to be resolved at this summit is the US Brazil tariff issue on ethanol but given the priorities my sense is that energy and climate are gonna be rolled into a broader discussion that the President will take not only to the region but on a global basis. There is great progress in the Americas on renewable energy but the amount even that will be produced still will only be 7% of the transport needs over the next 20 years. The real challenge will be whether there is enough investment money for countries like Brazil to exploit the pre-sold oil that it found off the shore in Santos, whether there'll be additional resources to develop oil off in the Caribbean that Cuba already has several international actors seeking those sites in the Caribbean. So I don't know that you can rank it as a priority but it will be folded into the climate agenda and the low carbon goal which is stated in the summit declaration is going to be the driving force. Yeah, if I could just add the, this is one area where people can agree generally. So I think you'll see a lot of focus on the idea of how do we create a more sustainable energy picture as well as move toward energy security but it won't move beyond the abstract level for precisely the reason that you want to describe until you're willing to confront the fan jewels in Florida and the American sugar in the Red River Valley which is currently being flooded. You're not going to come to grips with it. Of course, the congressman who is the chairman of the House Ag Committee is from Detroit Lakes, Minnesota which is right in the heart of the sugar beat part of our country. So if you think about all the other things on the president's agenda economically, the idea that this is the time to cross swords with the farm lobby probably not going to happen. The one thing I would say is that, and this is a much more serious problem, is that for all the things we'd like to do on energy and the environment, in one sense, the decline in economic activity has actually had the biggest impact on reducing CO2 emissions of anything we could have done. It's not a happy state of affairs to be solving your carbon problems by engaging in a global recession but what it also does is drive the price down which means in terms of renewables and the other sorts of alternatives, there's a much less incentive and therefore also higher cost politically and economically to pursue a renewable strategy. So the idea that we'll reach the 7% in light of the very low price of classic carbon fuels at this point, I'm a little skeptical that'll happen. It's not an issue that'll come up but it's one that will hang in the background and it'll inhibit the ability to actually reach a broader agreement unfortunately. Well thanks very much for coming today and our experts will be available while you're on the trip. Transcript will be out this afternoon, late this afternoon, probably close the business and thanks for coming to the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Appreciate it.


Pink QB the World War 3 map is back indeed and this is This is problematic very problematic This is problematic, but this is Problematic very problematic right and remember Nigeria's Western Clown ruled country Right not the people the people are super smart.   You're saying you're seeing these guys Possibly possibly while they're massing troops along the border Possibly about to do the bidding of Western world to start a war Crazy crazy


I'd like to call to order the 12th meeting of the 2018-2019 Common Council. Would the clerk please read the quote for the day? Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships. Thank you very much. Would the clerk please call the roll? There are eight present. And Alderperson Rosemary Trester is excused, and who else, and Marcus Savoglio is also excused. Please stand and join me in the Pledge of Allegiance. Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Next item on the agenda is the approval of the minutes from our last City Council meeting, Alderperson Wolfe. Thank you, Mayor. I make a motion to approve. Second. Thank you for that motion and support. Those minutes are before us. Is there any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes. The RCS program that was planned for this evening, someone got sick. So we'll be maybe bringing that back at a future time, but let me know presentation this evening. Next move on to public forum. City Clerk. There's no one this evening. Thank you. Next item on the agenda are Mayor's appointments. City Attorney. Those will lie over. Next we'll move on to Mayor's announcements. I just want to let everyone know that the SUP program support our urban projects. They have a meeting on the 20th at Fountain Park. There'll be several people presenting their ideas for funding and the funds raised at that event. Then we'll go to fund that idea that was selected by the community that attended. And the River's Days Festival is coming up this weekend on South Pier. And that's going to be in the 21st, 22nd and 23rd. Okay. Next we'll move on to an election. Tonight we'd like to conduct an election for the Board of Water Works Commissioner. Alderprudsen-Wolf. Thank you, Mayor. I move that the nominations be received from the floor voting to be done by open ballot. And if more than two candidates are nominated, the candidate with the lowest number of votes to be dropped from the list of and balloting to continue until one candidate receives the majority. Second. Thank you for that motion and support. Alderprudsen-Wolf. I nominate Mark Smith for the position of Board of Water Works Commissioner. Second. Thank you for that nomination support. Are there any other nominations? Are there any other nominations? Are there any other nominations? Alderprudsen-Wolf. All in favor say aye. Aye. The motions carry. Congratulations, Mr. Smith. No. No. Todd. You got to read the other one before. Pardon? Thanks for doing my work for me. Oh, I'm sorry. The motion passes. Yes. Congratulations, Mark. Sorry, I got to hit on myself there. Mark has been serving on expired term during this first stint on the board. We welcome to another three-year term and thank you for your service. Okay. Next we'll move on to the consent agenda. That'll include items 2.2 through 2.8. Alderprudsen-Wolf. Thank you, Mayor. I make a motion to accept and file all our O's, accept and adopt all our C's and pass all resolutions and ordinances. Second. Thank you for that motion and support. Those items are before us for discussion. Does anyone have anything to bring up? Seeing none. Would the clerk please call the roll for passage on the consent agenda. It has. Motion passes. Under reports of officers, items 3.1 and 3.2 will lay over. Items 3.3 and 3.4 will be referred to various committees. Moving on to resolutions. Items 4.1 and 4.2 will also be referred to various committees. Under reports of committees, items 5.1 is RC number 133 of 1819 by the Finance and Personnel Committee. To almost refer to our number 109 of 1819 by the city clerk submitting a communication from Rory Dales asking for the city to consider extending the financial deadlines of the Armory Committee project and recommends to file the document and approve the resolution granting the request. Alderperson Renflech. I move that we accept and file and pass the resolution. Second. Thank you for that motion and support. Is there any discussion on the motion? Alderperson Renflech. We had a point of discussion at the Finance Committee meeting about giving the Armory Project additional more time. They indicated that we consider that they haven't met all the other goals that they had set up in the timeline so far. That they had several foundations who were interested who hadn't met over the summer and they were desired to have the opportunity to meet with those foundations. We were very clear that October 23 would be the final deadline for the whole 2.4 million that there was originally due plus some other was due in August. For all those reasonable to not stop the project at this point in time suddenly to at least allow them the time to see if they can get money. Mrs. Lurkey was there and she indicated to us that if they are told no by certain foundations, she'll let us know prior to October 23 so we can get on. And we was pointed out by some city administrators that the other alternative for the Armory's subcommittee was that the other alternative for the Armory's site developer was still interested but may not be interested in October 23rd. We decided to go ahead anyways. Thank you very much for those comments. Is there any other discussion? Hearing none will the clerk please call the roll. 7 ayes 1 no. Motion passes. Item 5.2 is RC number 134 of 1819 by the Finance and Personnel Committee. Toomers referred resolution number 89 of 1819 by all the persons Renflesh and Bourne authorizing the transfer of appropriations in the 2018 budget for CDBG and recommends approving the resolution. All the person Renflesh. I move to accept and adopt and pass the resolution. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. Is there any questions or discussion on that motion? Seeing none will the clerk please call the roll. 8 ayes. Motion passes. Item 5.3 is RC number 135 of 1819 by Finance and Personnel. Toomers referred resolution number 90 of 1819 by all the persons Renflesh and Bourne adopting certain changes to the city's medical benefit plan and dental benefit effective for calendar year 2019 coverage and establishing the monthly premium equivalent rates effective for January of 19 coverage and thereafter and recommends approving the resolution. All the person Renflesh. I move we accept and adopt and pass the resolution. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. Is there any discussion? All the person Renflesh. We had a large number of city employees were present present at our Finance Committee meeting and we had good discussion on the proposed changes. I think in general these are recommended by our insurance advisory people. And while nobody is happy that we kind of reach consensus this was the best move to go. Okay. Thank you for those comments. Is there any other discussion? Seeing none will the clerk please call the roll. 8 ayes. Motion passes. Item 5.4 is RC number 136 of 1819 by Finance and Personnel. Committee to whom was referred resolution number 91 of 1819 by all the persons Renflesh and borne authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 2018 budget fire suppression tools that recommends approving the resolution. All the person Renflesh. I move we accept and adopt and pass the resolution. Thank you for that motion in support under discussion. Will the clerk please call the roll. 8 ayes. Motion passes. Item 5.5 is RC number 137 of 1819 by the Public Works Committee to whom was referred resolution 92 of 1819 by all the person Wolfe authorizing the purchasing agent to enter into a five year agreement for the provision of professional management services and operation of the Harbor Center Marina and recommends approving the resolution and the attached contract. All the person Wolfe. Thank you mayor. I make a motion to accept and adopt and pass the resolution. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. Is there any discussion on the motion? Seeing none. Will the clerk please call the roll. 8 ayes. Motion passes. Item 5.6 is RC number 138 of 1819 by the Public Works Committee to whom was referred resolution number 93 of 1819 by all the person Wolfe extending the special charge for residential garbage and refuse disposal services provided by the city and recommends approving the resolution. All the person Wolfe. Thank you mayor. I make a motion to accept and adopt and pass the resolution. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. Under discussion. All the person Boren. Thank you mayor. When I was looking over the document yesterday and preparing for this meeting tonight. And knowing some of the history of of the garbage fee. First of all, I'm going to support the extension of the fee. And but. The history up to this point is that the council has taken a look at this fee. I believe every two years. Since its inception back in in 2013 or 14 or whenever it was. And I think it would be a good idea. For the council before 2020. The end of 2020 to take another look at the fee. And see whether we want to continue with it. My thinking on that is. Is if there's a new governor or we have the same governor. We have a different state legislature. Our ability to levy taxes may change from basically the freeze we've had for a number of years. And in two years, if that does change the council at that time may consider putting this on the tax levy rather than a fee. Years ago when we started this, I know I heard from a number of constituents, I would rather have this on the tax levy than as a fee. Because if I itemize on my on my income tax, I can deduct that additional amount of my property tax. But I can't deduct it as a fee. I talked to attorney Adams this morning and I asked him about one of the where as is on the document. That appeared a little vague to me about that we had to review it now before the end of 2018 for it to go into effect for a couple more years. And he also agreed that the document from back in 2016 wasn't real clear. So I moved to amend resolution. Number 93 18 19. So it's to add a paragraph to be placed between paragraphs that begin now. Therefore it be resolved and be it further resolved to read as follows. Be it further resolved that the common council shall review the special charge every two years with the first review to take place no later than December 31st 2020. Second. Okay, we have a motion and a second under discussion. Alder person down here. I to along with Alder born was present to when this fee was discussed and discussed and discussed again. And then every time it came up, it was discussed and discussed again. Well, I understand the reasoning behind Alder born's amendment. I think that this charge. Has become part of our government structure. And I don't see the point particularly considering it is such a small fee. In the overall scheme of things. That it really. Is worth our while to bring it up every two years and to discuss it every two years. Unless of course we want to increase that fee. So I'm going to vote against it because I think we should finally just put this to rest. But understanding what Alder born his point. There may in fact be various changes. We know that the current legislature is. Has actually passed. I just read 180 bills limiting local control. And. And that may change in the future, but I think this is embedded in our government structure right now. And we're probably just best to leave it there and not. You know, poke at that nest one more time. You know, I got a little queasy when I saw this on the agenda. I thought no, no, not again, not again. And so I would just soon.  Thank you for those comments. All the person born you mentioned the history and I actually think this goes very well. All the person born you mentioned the history and I actually think this goes back further than what you mentioned in 2013 because it started out as a $7 fee somewhere around 29 or 2010. And the council did reduce it down to the $5 fee that is currently charged. All the person born. The last council that voted on this, then a couple of years ago decided that they wanted to sunset it. In other words, bring it to a complete end. And I don't agree with that. I think it should continue. But I don't think there's any, any harm in having future councils look at it for the reason that all the person down here mentioned to increase it or if, if for the reasons I mentioned before, we may want to either eliminate it or reduce it depending on what we're able to do with what our state legislature lets us do. So I just don't think there's a harm in either going into the public works committee where it came out of or else finance and personnel to just review it every couple of years. And if it still has merit, then fine, let's continue it. And I, and as I said, I'm going to support extending it, but I don't know if I want to, you know, give it carte blanche to continue on forever. I think it's reasonable to take a look at it every couple of years. Thank you. All the person born, you just mentioned that having the public works committee or finance and personnel review it. But I believe the document says that the council has to review it. Which is the case? You had some drafters, notes, attorney Adams. Do you think it'd be appropriate to go over those before we vote on this? I can. So Alderman Bourne did ask me to put something together and I suggested that, because sometimes when things are done from the floor, they can be a little bit confusing as they were the last couple of years that some, that we have something in writing ahead of time. Alder Bourne's proposal, I think he has identified that there is a difference between a sunset clause and a review clause, and this is a review clause. It does say that the common council would review it, the process for the common council to review it would likely to be to send it to a committee. That could happen in a number of different ways. There could be a new resolution extending the special charge, this was done in 16, as is being done now. It could be a resolution authorizing a brand new special charge in a different way. It could be a resolution that amends it or terminates it or extends it, does various things with a biennial review. Or it could simply be a simple report of committee accepted by the common council and then filed that that committee has reviewed it and recommends no change. As to the issue of, you know, this is a resolution. So even if you do not pass Alder Bourne's amendment, it doesn't take away your right to review it at some future date. It just takes off of a schedule and in essence that is what this motion is doing, is putting it on a schedule requiring you to do it in two years and every two years rather than just allowing you to do it whenever you feel like. All the person down at you. Attorney Adams, I just may have this mixed up. It seems my memory is that while there are levy limits, there was the opportunity for municipalities to impose a fee which would not reduce our ability to levy at a certain percentage, but that after, I think it was one of those 180 bills, they took that ability away. So in other words, if we reduce this, if we either reduce or eliminate this fee, it's gone forever. Yes. Under current law, if you reduce or eliminate this, you cannot bring it back. I don't know if that would change, you know, if wishes were horses kind of thing, you know. The scenario that we laid out would actually change, but I just say we leave well enough along. Thank you. Alderperson, Sarnson. I think just to clarify too, in some of the discussion about the reviewing of the fee to increase or lower it, I don't know who's going to answer this question, but I believe in one of those 180 restrictions, we're not allowed to increase the fee. We're able to essentially just continue it or lower it or get rid of it and we're not allowed to increase it. Is that correct? That is correct under current law. Okay. And then just for reference too, could the Director of Public Works just give a good idea about the total number that this fee generates for the garbage service? Alderperson Boren. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we would decide to increase the fee, the penalty would be we would have to reduce our tax levy by a like amount. So in other words, if we're getting $800,000 an hour, and we wanted to raise it back up to seven bucks, that additional revenue would have to be reduced, our levy would have to be reduced by the same amount, and that was another one of the, you know, the brilliant law that Alderman Sorensen just mentioned. Precisely. Okay. Any other discussion? Seeing none, will the clerk please call the roll? This is the motion to amend the wording. Four ayes, four noes. A mayor votes nay. So now we're back to the original motion. Is there any other discussion on the motion? Seeing none, will the clerk please call the roll? Eight ayes. Motion passes. Item 5.7, eight and nine will be referred to various committees. Under general ordinances, ordinance 6.1 and 6.2 will also be referred to various committees. Under matters laid over, item 7.1 is resolution number 88 of 1819 by all the persons down here will officially recognizing the historic grant neighborhood association. All the person down here. I move that the resolution be passed. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. Is there any discussion on the motion? Very good. All those in favor of the motion, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Well, this is our eighth neighborhood association. So we keep on growing these groups. It's good to see. Next item is other matters received after the agenda was published. Turn it over to the city attorney. Thank you. 8.1 is a resolution by all the persons in a different order here. 8.1 is a resolution by the city clerk submitting various license applications for the period ending December 31, 2018, June 30, 2019 and June 30, 2020. That will be referred to the licensing hearings and public safety committee. And 8.2 is a resolution by all persons in a different order here. 9.1 is a resolution by the city clerk submitting various license applications for the period ending December 31, 2018, June 30, 2020. That will be referred to the financing personnel committee. All the persons in a wolf. Thank you, mayor. I make a motion to adjourn. Second. Thank you for that motion in support. All those in favor of the adjournment, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? We stand adjourned. Thank you for your time tonight.


Awkum Athletics. It was probably a year ago as a weightlifter, right? I don't know if you consider yourself a weightlifter. I think if you clean in Jerk 135, at least you put something into it. I got to compete to satisfy you. Alright dude, I'm an internet weightlifter. I'm an internet weightlifter and I'm back at Awkum with the Homie Ben. I fired up my Gills training with Connor and Ryan in LA and then seeing Omar train here so I want to get back into some cleans. Snatches just were weird with my shoulder, my shoulders fucked up and it made my hips move weird which didn't help any back issue I previously had. I told you guys I'm not deadlifting so my back's feeling really healthy so we're going to probably just do our lower body days here really. So we're going to do two lower body days here a week which will consist of some type of squat, some type of clean, whatever Ben tells me to do. Maybe a push press to feel like an athlete again. Maybe a push jerk some nature and then clean poles or whatever the programming says and then upper bodies I'll either do on my own or at untamed strength. So a lot of training footage on the way and we're going to see if we can push this clean to something. My legs are actually really strong right now so they actually weren't that strong even when I was weightlifting with Ben last time. My legs just weren't, I wasn't in that good of shape. So we'll see, we'll see. Cleaning felt fun. Obviously it was only cleaning like 175 or something in LA but I think we can do a little something and it doesn't hurt. That's number one is it's fun and it doesn't hurt and that's the pocket I'm trying to sit in. It's not always about your biceps, it's not always about how much you deadlift or how much you bench. Sometimes it's just about having fun, looking okay and staying in the pocket. So that's what we're doing fam. I guess maybe it's because I do YouTube and podcast stuff I always feel like a performer. So I do like a live audience like that. Musically I've been to musicals, acting, lifting but the internal drive is never satisfied by that. Pause. You were in a musical? I've been in more musicals than I can count. So school I went to was super weird. It's like a little art school but it's like based off this German philosopher so it's private school. Mom was a teacher there for 20 years so I just went there. Kindergarten 12th grade. And there's 24 kids in my class, graduating class, not just like sit down class, right? 24 people. Every subject you do, you would love it. Every subject you do, science to Spanish to anything, all involves art to some extent. They try to teach you through listening, through doing which may be an art or performance or something. Like example we're learning about Roman history and we talk about these things, you read about these things and then my teacher takes us outside and teaches us how to march like the Roman soldiers march. To try to hit different pathways of learning. And that's for every class. So like I'm really bad at traditional art but I've probably drawn more pictures than maybe even like professional artists like art. Because at 12 years, every single class, I had to. I had to. So you won't play? I'll go right off. Little red boy. I'll explain the phases of being old to Marcus off camera but we'll do it on camera day. The same phase as being old as me. Where in the beginning, you feel great no matter what.  Then you get to like a certain age and you kind of warm up or you kind of don't feel good. And that's probably, it's kind of training age. It's not number age and it's probably 20, often 18 to 28 maybe depending on how serious you take things. And then you get to an old phase which is Marcus, Filipino Thunder. And Marcus spends three hours getting ready because he's in so much pain. And then you get to me and Ben where we just don't care. We hurt but we don't have enough time, energy or pain to actually warm up. So we get through things very rapidly to get the pain over with and go back to the resting pain. Yeah, it can't hurt.  But those only combined. So I never, I don't think I maxed clean by itself but that's what I'm doing now. Taking side roast. The goal is to continue to have fun with training lose a little bit of weight, get some mass but I want to feel like an athlete again. And the last time I felt that was cleaning, jerking and snatching with Ben last year. It felt fun to have a variety in my workouts even though I have that now but I'm doing a bunch of cardio as my variety rather than here I can burn some extra calories and do something that is new. Always trying to be a little bit of a beginner. So maybe dunk a basketball again. So if I lose a little bit of weight, get my clean up, keep squatting and we'll dunk a basketball outside for the folks. How close do you think you are to dunking right now? I don't know. I grabbed room real easy December. Like really easy. I was playing basketball a little bit. Yeah, probably not that far to be honest. I feel pretty good. My squats good. This feels good. Cleans actually didn't hurt at all, which is really good. The push press hurt my wrist a little bit just because we're fat and can't get into the position I want to get into, but it's a little chip away. So maybe Wednesday, Wednesday, Monday, Wednesday maybe we come back in. A little bit heavier squats. Clean again. Maybe push press, maybe not. And then Saturday we're going to start to drag Ben to come squat with me and Marcus. So big boy squat day Saturday at Untamed. This week's a little hectic because we're recording four podcasts. So I'll probably get in some back and biceps tomorrow. Off cam. It's boring stuff. You guys don't want to see it. And then cardio. And then now we've got this new whip. Brand new whip. Show them the brand new whip, bro. You weep. All your other YouTubers buying Rarys. I'm about to local made bike. It's right around town. Keep it classy. Sacramento.  And actually Fridays is normally my off day for work. It's time I do like errands or help my mom or whatever. But if I don't have anything or if I do, I'm going to try to take this thing on the road. We'll see if we'll get con air to roll with me. But there's really nice back path here in Sac. So get in something simple. 10, 10 to 20 miles. Just cruise around, turn into some music, listen to a podcast, jam out. Enjoy the spring air. But first I got to get clarity in because we're the city of trees. We've got so many trees.  But easy day. Hour of work out, maybe a little less. Some squats, some cleans, some push press. I got my warm up coming here, which saves my time on the bike. Because normally I got a warm up so my back doesn't hurt. So that feels really good.  Sound of the mic? I'm out of here.


So I think we'll just kick it off here now We've got a number of people in the session and we have a half an hour here. So Let me go ahead and just kick it off by introducing everyone that we have for this great panel discussion today and so I'd like to introduce you to David Boswell and David joined us from hyper ledger. He's the director of the ecosystem We have Jodi Panipali and And she is with DTCC and she's working on the distributed ledger's technology there We have Alfonso Govella from hyper ledger Latino America And we have Jim Mason From the Brock who's the blockchain practice leader from Paramount and the sky web team So thanks everyone for joining today, and we're gonna have an exciting discussion today about really, you know Welcome to the new normal. We've all seen what happened I think that, you know, that was a discussion by Brian at the very beginning of the global forum about, you know How things have changed over the last 15 months Since we last gathered in person in Phoenix or the hyper ledger global forum And I know that was the last in-person conference for me, and I'm sure it was for a lot of you But I think that this team on here has really done a great job of embracing the digital transformation that we've been kind of forced into here and What I want to do today is just kind of talk about some of the wins that we've had from the cutover to the new normal and You know how that transition has affected both us and the hyper ledger community in general So at this point, maybe I'll kick it off with David and David You know you've really been the champion for leading the hyper ledger meet-up community and Really been the tip of the spear and we appreciate all your wonderful help So maybe can you let us know what you think? You've seen as far as the transition during this last 15 months here Well, I mean I'll have to thank everybody, you know So we are a community and you know the what happens in a community is what people choose to do So, you know this was you know I think everybody who is an organizer who opted in to try to figure out what a virtual meet-up strategy Looks like because that's certainly not what we all signed up for when we started meet-up groups So, you know, it's been a year almost a year and a half of Experimenting and seeing what works and what hasn't and then you know I think my role is to have that holistic view and if something worked well for one meet-up group You know try to share it out with others So, you know anything that I'm going to share is all based on just seeing what As there has done and then me trying to you know amplify that so thank you to everybody who's you know Tried things out in your own meet-up group And then you know helped roll that out to others But you know, I think this has really been the silver lining of the whole Experience for the last year and a half, you know moving to virtual meet-ups has had some really unexpected pluses a couple of challenges and Things that have been difficult, but you know, it has really been great in a lot of ways I think it's fostered a lot of a regional collaboration that wasn't possible in the past You know, for example, I had tried to encourage, you know different meet-up groups to work But when you have a physical, you know, Jim before we started talked about, you know Even within a city commuting can be a challenge if you're in a big city like Boston or Los Angeles It's even hard to get across but you know and be an event in person But if you're talking regionally if you're in Bogota and somebody else's in Mexico City How do you collaborate and on an in-person event? But the virtual event, you know gets around that and so, you know I've just been really encouraged to see the regional collaboration happening, you know before the pandemic We only had one regional chapter now we have six, you know That's something that's really come out of this experience and then, you know We've run virtual meet-ups in 13 different languages. I was adding it up just recently, you know Since the pandemic started so that's 13 different, you know, you know Language groups that have come together and chosen to work together, you know And that's not based on location. It's based on language with so it just allows a whole different Set of collaboration opportunities. So I've been really excited about that. So Okay, perfect Jim I'm just kind of going across in order I see on the screen here What have you seen as some of the biggest challenges from the transition from your in-person meet-ups in Boston to Now the virtual meet-ups that you've been very successful with So The challenges I think it sounds crazy are smaller for me with the virtual meet-ups For a variety of reasons and I think as I said earlier I think the challenge may be that Boston might be unique I understand lots of cities have what I call commuting issues and challenges But we literally had no good location. So, you know, somebody who wanted to attend my meet-up that was Physically maybe 20 miles away would be stuck with a three-hour commute In Boston to get there no matter where I picked a lot of the attendees would be Looking at an hour and a half, you know, they're in that kind of the thing as a drive And when we went to the virtual meet-up model that helped everything and I had actually tried virtual meet-ups You know on my own sort of and found that Half the attendees were showing up at my physical location and half were coming in virtually And we tried to uh, I didn't have the same technology we do today with Zoom So when I was in a virtual meet-up, it was more of just a broadcast kind of the thing of the meeting You couldn't actively participate if you were remote like you could if you were on site But the model and the technology we're using now is so much better um, I don't see those handicaps and It'll be interesting to see if we can go back in Boston to physical meetings Because of the fact that we don't have a single location in a sense that sponsored us So we used to have to go around from one in a sense sponsored to another for me the the big tragedy of You know the meet-up thing ending physically was when we had the shutdown of the pandemic Was the fact I had a big one scheduled at Harvard and they literally had to pull the plug at the last minute with the shutdown So, um, you know glad that's open over now and everything's open up here But um, it looks like the virtual meet-up will probably be for us a big thing and back to David's point I think the concept although I can see improvements needed I think the concept is what I call the regional model is tremendous I think that brings a lot more content to meet up members in my case in Boston When they can get content from your your group in Denver Jody's group and Dallas and so on when we bring those groups together And say oh look, we're having all these sessions then in a sense all the members in my group benefit from that greatly So that's a huge way from this thing perfect And then Jody from your perspective, how has Dallas changed? I know we had talked some about Speaker recruitment was a challenge for you in Dallas But maybe give me your thoughts around how things look different now From where they look before and what's going to happen going forward So I second a lot of what Jim has mentioned although Procuring of physical location in Dallas was never a challenge for us given Texas has you know, no space issues but Most of the projects, you know more than three years ago were Happening in the labs and the companies it was it was not that hyper ledger wasn't being implemented a whole lot But all the projects that were happening in the labs They were not very comfortable coming out and sharing their lab initiatives So securing speakers and securing prop, you know the presentation of the projects was a bit of a challenge and I may add another challenge personally what I have seen has been a win is a Female participation because we used to have the in person Meetups after the business hours Um during the in person meetups. I've seen very Barely three to five percent Sometimes even one percent, you know, I've been the only female in the room many times But now I'm beginning to see the last one year more female participation. So to me that's a huge win I think we are broadening our horizon. We are the outreach With respect to regional participation Has gained more adoption And in fact, we are also getting requested from austin and houston the other texas cities to to continue hosting this even post Pandemic in a high-flix fashion So as to not lose that connection between Dallas meetups and you know, the other cities meetups Yeah, that's perfect and I do know, you know, if you listen to brian's discussion or even david's treats from eccentric's discussion You know making sure that we have that diversity and inclusion in hyper ledger is really a core You know precept of it And i'm glad to hear that, you know, this engagement has improved for you And I think whatever we can do to foster that going forward is really what we should focus on for sure absolutely And uh, alfonso great to have you join us today And the latino-american chapter is really taken off and you know, your help and support for the community is greatly appreciated So why don't you tell us a little bit about, you know, some of the challenges you faced and some of the wins you've gotten from this transition Well, uh, thank you. Thank you john for the invitation and the rest of you for Well Allow me to be here In this in this conversation. Um, I agree with with what all all of you Dave jim Jody have have said For latino-america it I would say it gave us strength Okay, our our meetup groups were small And it took a lot of effort not only to find the locations, which was the case in many that where I started But also even in mexico city But also the fact of finding out themes speakers So the fact that we could do it virtually As yoti said it really broadened our horizons But horizons were brought in in different levels geographically Because now we could have two meetups together Okay Thematically Because what we couldn't find a speaker in one area there might be this that theme in another area And after working This way, uh, we brought in also networking Which is very important for for latino-america because we share a culture But we are fragmented over a huge region Okay, so the fact that we can share interests and be together in a simpler um I know not as nice as as being One to one together But it increased networking a lot So, um We've had not only new friends, but we've had new teams For new projects being formed Okay, and Something very interesting is it it brought My feet spain It was not included because apple was called latin america not ibero america Okay, but we share the language. I mean we have the language because of them Okay, so, uh We now we go from, you know, something in argentina to chile to colombia To to madrid in spain to mexico city So it it's really broadening horizons in geography and themes and in human networking perfect The thing i want to go back to with david is just talking about how the community has evolved from his perspective And i know david we've talked some about, you know, some of the chapters that were really active when, uh There were in-person meet-ups have kind of gone dormant And i'm wondering if any new chapters have really sprung up.  You know, are there communities that are more vibrant now because of the virtual meet-ups? And how's that kind of changed? Yeah, with without question. It's things certainly have shifted and here i'm going to drop a link in the chat We're referencing these regional chapters So i just want people to be able to find them if they're not already familiar with them We have a page on the hyperledger wiki the list the different chapters You know, there are currently six With the most recent having just created been created in japan So yeah, things definitely shifted, you know, there were groups that were very active You know, i'm based in the bay area, for example, and we had a very active in-person A meet-up culture we were meeting almost every other month and that really ground to a halt with the pandemic So, you know, it and it has not been one of the more active virtual I think we've only run one virtual event through san francisco meet-up itself So it definitely, you know things that were active are not and things that, you know Hadn't been active have really jumped into the virtual mix. So it's definitely Changed things around But you know, I think overall, you know the the meet-up community as a whole is just as active as ever If I remember the details correctly I was doing some Analysis so the year before the pandemic we ran almost a meet-up a day So it was very active community But ever since then we've run, you know every week There's almost never a week where we don't have at least one if not several virtual meet-ups So the community as a whole, you know has really embraced the whole idea of virtual And and dove in although any one individual meet-up group may have been, you know more or less active during that transition Okay, the one thing I'll say that I also want to get everyone's opinion on is the networking side of meet-ups So, you know as we've transitioned from in person to virtual You know, that's definitely been a culture of change for me because Usually at our meet-ups in Denver, we've been very much about the networking side in addition to the speakers And so, you know, I've tried a few things with David like air meet We tried one time to try and foster networking And zoom has actually improved their networking functionality to drive that But maybe I'll start with Jim and let me know your thoughts around how the networking piece of meet-ups has changed since the transition So you're right. That's a big difference for me with the virtual and it is a challenge. There's no question of that Um, I've belonged to multiple of the groups not just the hyperledger meet-up group So I wouldn't compare the hyperledger meet physical meet-ups. We had We're not what I call the ultimate model for networking. I belong to a different group called me mug, which Probably was a phenomenal model for networking so strong. In fact Yeah People would religiously show up for the meetings Just for the networking More than the speaker in most cases They occasionally, you know Occasionally find a speaker that drew an audience But for the most part it was really more of a networking kind of a thing. They have a meal They'd have You know, I'll call it networking before the speaker Then you'd have a speaker then they'd have networking after the speaker kind of thing And so it was a very rich kind of a network model And it is true that that's a bit of a challenge and I certainly haven't solved it in the boston meet-up at this point Or in the public sector wiki Meetups that we do as well for hyperledger, but I have thought about it I thought of opening up a gym's bar in zoom And inviting everybody into something along those lines, but to have a casual You know, whatever 15 minutes before you get organized and kickoff your meeting We really haven't done that but it is worth trying out I will say that In boston a couple of the meet-ups did well that way and some of the other block boston had done an excellent job of building A quote the networking part as a major major focus not just the speakers So there's some major conferences much like hyperledger when we have the physical conference We have tremendous networking opportunities there You know different than how I've organized the meet-ups, but I certainly look for other people to give me better ideas on that as well Yeah, so let's uh have jody let us know her thoughts around How the networking piece has really changed in dallas so, um I have honestly the transition to uh the post-covid, um, you know the virtual meet-ups um has More connected more people brought more people together because texas um, you know the the Scale at which, you know the startups were budding is equally distributed x-laws austin houston and dallas So when we were doing dallas in person meet-ups, we were only Getting an opportunity to collaborate amongst the dallas business community specifically focused on dlt projects or you know, um In some form or the other, you know is dlt is incorporated into their day job But having the virtual Meet-up the the networking expanded over into the other cities, which You know in in my if you ask me personally, I think it has only has an added advantage to us. So I I may be personally skewed in this but I would say that We are benefiting more over virtual and in fact Um over the past a few months in fact during the last year when we once we switched to virtual I've also been requested by multiple folks to continue post-covid Even when dallas resumes in person to see would you please continue this in some form of a high flex model And not go completely in person because we don't want to lose that connection with the dallas community So to my point, I think we have just expanded our connections It hasn't limited us by any chance, but again, like I said, you know, it's it's personally to me from What I have heard from my community or from my neighboring communities is is is my point It may be different for different cities, right? Yeah, and I think that's perfect jody and I agree with you a hundred percent. I think that Prior to covet I think that dember was a little bit more siloed As far as you know hosting our events and being focused on our own community But now I feel like when we've had this, you know change There's definitely a lot more cross collaboration regionally Between all the different meet-up groups and I think that that's really helped the community And I think that what I want to do is make sure that we continue to foster that cross community collaboration going forward Even as we transition back into more of a in-person and I know david mentioned in the chat here hybrid model But let's get alfonso's take on the networking side here real quick To make sure that we see how that's affected the latin american american chapter well, uh, claudio sevillos who is from the argentina Co-founder of hyper legend latin america just wrote in in the chat And he says it helped us to get the chapter Up and running for sure So without this Condition, okay It would have been a big big effort with probably little little result We have not explored yet Okay, the potential of networking Around this this technology what I found is that Showing the list of of participants Helps getting direct contacts in the chat Okay, so that is that that has been used um We follow a strategy some some of the other Uh co-founders have have defined for for linkedin, okay, and that has really Exploded for instance my network Okay, but that has happened For persons Then we went to have something for the chapter So we we got the chapter in linkedin Okay, and so we are just beginning to to explore How to network through this new tools And and social media I think there's plenty of work to to be done there But again, I coincide with all of you it it has to do with broadening The network effect Perfect I just want to add real quick build on a fun zone He's talking about new new tools and I totally agree that that I think you know it will be what it's happened You know we've we've certainly struggled with recreating the in-person networking so far, but I I remain optimistic I would encourage everybody here to try gather town for example I think that's a much more interesting networking experience that we've played around with for global forum and it is available now You know it's It seems like that could you know we'll need to test it But I think it could you know really recreate The networking in-person experience virtually in a way that people actually enjoy You know we've tried the zoom breakout rooms. We've tried air meet none of those Really did You know a great job, but I think there'll be some really interesting innovations that will I think you know Be worth trying so just to give a plug try out gather town this week If you haven't had a chance and see what you think and share share your thoughts Perfect. Yeah, David, you know, I'm always about being the tip of the spear So we got some new tool for us to try. I'm always glad to jump in there first and gather Gather town is fun. Yeah Okay, good. So the thing I want to talk about now is just You know looking forward here. We're getting into the reopening now and I want to know just how each one of you feel about Looking at doing maybe some portion of your meetups in person and some portion virtually Or what is your perspective around time trying to tie the two communities together For a specific meetup and I guess I'll start with Jim on your thoughts On how this looks going forward as we reopen now Well, my challenge again comes back to the school meetups. We never Even if I had a sponsor that stood up and said, hey, you can use my facility fidelity has a downtown facility As an example, they gave it to us. It would help, but I could never get big attendance You know the only model I think can work Going forward for us because of the commute problems is that we would honestly need to do Mix virtual with An actual physical meetup. That's the best we could do If we had a sponsor location, which we don't so I'll I'll take another look and see Again, we'll have sponsors offer like Microsoft is in Cambridge IBM is in Cambridge Fidelity's downtown Boston, but none of those are locations that are going to really draw anybody to make those kind of commutes So even if we get them, we probably won't use them I certainly am going to follow up on ideas that all of you have had Around trying to build a stronger networking component to it And I will go back to that other group That I had mentioned that I belong to that is very good on networking and what they did is they actually planned Networking specific events not like we're going to have 20 minutes and whatever They actually had activities organized kind of the thing and That tended to work out pretty well and I'm interested in seeing if I can do that So they would have little breakout groups and we I think we might be able to do that in zoom with the breakout meeting rooms And you know kind of that there's a way to try to organize that so I'm looking forward to Seeing if something like that might work a little bit better So in a sense members can meet members share ideas easier that way than just hear a presentation Okay, perfect Uh, Jodi, what are your thoughts around how you're going to look at this going forward as You know reopening and you know being able to do some in person or What is your plan going forward here? Well, it'll definitely be in um Collaboration with the community. Um, I think it's a good time to start throwing out some surveys and To see what the community feels like because you know, we are more regionally connected For the for now and we have grown our community as I said and And we have only benefited from the virtual Meetups more So I'm going to reach out to my community and see what my community proposes But at the same time, you know as humans we Um, we enjoy meeting people in person. You know, that's that's that's a human tendency, right? So I think going forward it may be some sort of a hybrid model, but at the same time I would You know do my best not to lose that connection with my extended community that we have built relations over the past few years so We'll figure it out. Just like we figured coming into the pandemic, you know, how do we Transform I think it will be an evolution process Perfect. Nope. I get it and I like that extended community Philosophy jody and I think that's exactly what we've encountered here and we need to continue to foster that So Alfonso, uh, let us know your thoughts around the transition back to the you know in person again and how that'll affect your community Well, I think that you know the hybrid can be go can go having persons meeting Virtual meetings, but also something that that we explored is why don't we present In the presentations go through soon or through A computer so in that way Whomever can be reached? Would be or it would be record In a simple way. So we have people meeting and networking We could even show them in the room. Okay, but the presentation itself Always is recorded and broadcasted. So the presentation is always virtual We call that the ranchero the ranchero style Okay, it's it's very simple. It's just you know, use your computer and make a ranchero Hybrid Yeah, that's perfect Alfonso. I know you brought up the ranchero philosophy before And it's something we should definitely continue to promote So, uh, at this point, I think we're getting close to the very end David, you know, we're all about growing the meetup community for hyper ledger If there's anything that you'd like to share to really, you know, anyone attending this session get involved I think that would be helpful Yeah, thanks for that. Um, I mean as we've been saying this is an evolution and we welcome any input thoughts ideas questions comments, you know From anybody here on the call. I just dropped a link to the meetup organizer mailing list. It's an open List that even if you're not a meetup organizer, you can still post to so I think if you're interested in this conversation and want to continue the discussion Why don't you please join us there and uh, if you want to get involved with meetups, you know That's a great place to you know Subscribe introduce yourself ask questions raise your hand and you know, we'll all be there and can you know talk with you more there Okay, well, thanks to all of our wonderful panelists and everyone for joining us today And I hope you have a great rest of the global forum. Take care. Thank you Thank you