And we're back with a breakfast in plus CV Africa this point in time We'll be having Desmond magic could do me joining the conversation Desmond. It's good to have you join us this morning Yes, please happy new year by the way Same to you.  They also call for behavioral change among Nigerians in order to address climate change effects now and This is the point where we have magic could do me who is an environmentalist He's also an activist by the way Advocates in the cost of the environment. I'm sure the environment should be very happy to have someone who's speaking for them The birds and the animals and one of you magic could do me. It's good to have you join us this morning Yes, it's great to be here with you. Yeah, not just I'm obviously very happy to hear that but more importantly Nature the essence of nature will also be extremely happy It's it's the biggest issue of humanity has ever faced and that's you know, it's a difficult one for us to really Get our heads around because hey, you know, I have a big issue Employment of a big issue with money stream of a big issue with school fees housing I think we should we should take the conversation from that point now So how can we address, you know the issue of climate change when we also have consent of survival? For instance, we talk about, you know, generating revenue just like you have mentioned For instance, we're very dependent on oil for earnings as a country and we have been constantly told to harness You know the environment and what we have to make sure that we survive So how can we address that when the survival of humanity is also dependent on or the environment as well? No, that's a very good perspective to look at it from But the the reality is okay suppose you're on a on the ship That is beginning to sink And even though you might be hungry And you might have all kinds of problems the reality is that if that ship sinks All those problems will be washed away Because the gravity of the situation is far greater than what you're experiencing now That is the problems you're experiencing now likewise This whole climate change issue the gravity of the consequences of not dealing with it in time You see there's a time limit within which we have to deal with it The gravity of not dealing with it in time It totally overshadows every other Other problem an issue that we have and in the process of that overshadowing in the process of the climate change Establishing itself more viciously on humanity. All of those other problems are going to be exacerbated That's why they're telling us one of the major reasons why There's millions of more people going into extreme poverty into extreme food shortage and so on One of the major reasons is because climate change is affecting the agriculture sector We're finding it more difficult To grow the food that we used to grow especially in Africa and also in Nigeria Which is very much Rain-dependent agricultural country. So climate change problem Totally overshadows all other problems, but the solution to it Will also bring solution To the other problems All right, Desmond. I've just concluded and corp 26. Nigeria committed to net zero emission at the conference by 2060 the how far Is that how is it possible? How far can we really go in terms of before 2060? where we have our energy carrier of 8 1.25 percent bin biomass natural gas 8.2 percent petroleum product 5.3 percent crude oil 4.8 percent hydro power 0.4 percent and others which is less than about 10 1 percent We are committing to net emission by 2060 but with what we have on ground. How possible is it? If we continue as we are It's impossible You know, it's a commitment. I can commit myself to elevating off the floor But I If I don't have the machinery for the process of the elevation then The commitment will not come to the past and it's a difficult one. You know in all fairness To our Government officials who have made these commitments. It's a very very difficult one Because we are a fossil fuel dependent economy We're a mainly fossil fuel dependent for our energy source and to You know transit away from that It's um, it's not going to be easy It's going to take very very definite and concerted efforts and then also there's the You know moralistic aspect of it that hey, you know, we in Africa we in Nigeria are not the name Contributed of this global warming that has caused the climate change It's not us that started the industrial revolution That was burning all this fossil fuel for decades and decades That was causing this massive massive disruption of the perfect atmospheric system And you see that's one thing we need to take Congress and so The system of this earth It's a perfectly made system the creator who created the earth He created it in a perfect way that it is perfectly balanced and because of that balance it is the only obstacle in space and we've been able to observe millions of obstacles It's the only planet in space that I can support life because of this incredible intricate harmony or the balances Of nature on this planet and in the atmosphere and in this particular case We're referring to the atmospheric gases. There's several of them and they're all there the specific Proportion certain amount, but we for the last 150 years have been pouring and pouring and pouring a whole lot of One of those particular gases that's co2 which comes from burning in the fossil fuel So for us to meet our obligations, it's not going to be easy But then, you know, sometimes, you know, a difficult thing Will can be hard to do. That's why it's called difficult, but And we need to get this into our consciousness. It has to be done We still have a little bit of time for the transition process And what will help is if Nigeria The giant of Africa takes a rightful place and starts to lead Africa at least to lead the subcontinent to lead West Africa in negotiation with the industrialized world And telling them that no you must make funds available for this tower transition So that we can mitigate and adapt to this climate change that you people have caused We are demanding that these funds should be made available to the African Sub-represent to West Africa and we have a bargaining card Because one of the things that's going to help tremendously Is nature itself. We are the tropical rainforest. We are the tropical mangrove forest and these entities are part of that incredible Harmonious miraculous entity that we were referring to earlier as the miracle of creation These entities, these rainforest mangrove absorb the CO2 Desmond, I'd like us to speak to policy now Speak to some of government policies as it were For instance, there's also a plan, Nigeria plans to generate 3000 megawatt By, I beg your pardon, 30,000 megawatt by 2030 Now out of the 30,000 megawatt by 2020, by 2030 3000 megawatt of the promised increase or increment will be from renewable energy sources And I'd like to ask you, do you think that we're really ready to As much as it sounds very laudable to, you know, embrace the, you know, clean energy as it were Looking at our policy direction, looking at our capacity We can't, we can't be, we can't be, it just depends on, you know, if we appreciate the seriousness of it The urgency of it So how do you explain, how do you explain 3,000 megawatt out of 30,000 So we're going to be producing 30,000 megawatt, that's the vision, that's the plan And out of that 30,000 megawatt, we hope that, you know, 3,000 of it will be from renewable energy Look at the statistics Yeah, yeah, we can, we can do it because the, luckily for us, the The resources for the renewable energy and tremendous abundance here And if we get the funding, the money, and that's why I refer to Nigeria taking a rightful place and being able to stand up as a Giantist, you know, lying commuters being the laughing stock of the world, which is what we are right now Because, you know, the leadership of letters, you know, to just be the laughing stock But it can be transitioned, we can change from that And, you know, if we can demand for the money, and if the funds are available because The resources are there, we have abundant sunshine All over the country, by the time you get to the north, you have Tremendous amount of sunshine and also heat and both for sunlight and heat can be converted into energy into electricity And also in certain sections of our country, we have almost constant wind on the higher plateaus, on the higher Hilly areas, there's wind, wind, wind going all this time and wind energy is one of the cheapest ways of producing electricity Storage is becoming more and more Viable now and also there's even wave energy So nature has provided us with the blessing of all the natural, all the necessary resources To be able to have our energy transition revolution We could even go more than that once the funds are available and the funds are deployed judiciously And this is part of the challenge that we're having in getting funds released to us because people who have released funds To Nigeria have seen Over time that a lot of those funds do not get deployed to where they were designated to be deployed That's what I understand where you're coming from But I'm also asking that if you look at you know, our policies as it were I'm just stating a policy a vision that we have Well in 2023 2030 is not far from us. And if we're talking about renewable energy We're talking about the issue of climate change. Let's go clean. Right. 30,000 megawatts of power will be, you know, is the vision. And then out of that, 3,000 would be from renewable energy. So it leaves us with 27,000, you know, from energy that's not clean, if I like to put. So my question is, are we really sincere even with the commitment that we make every other time? Are we sincere to achieving this, looking at the policies that we have on ground and also looking at our capacity and what a view. Let's also not take out the, you know, the conversation. I've asked this before. We know that we're highly dependent on oil for earnings and, you know, extracting resources from, you know, the environment, trying to survive. So with all of this, do you think that we're headed towards renewable energy as a country? No, we're not. We're definitely not. We're making the policies, we're pronouncing the policies, but the capacity to do it in terms of the, as I alluded to earlier, in terms of the finances to do it are not available. And unfortunately, some of the finances that have been deployed have not been put in that right direction. But I am very optimistic that the necessary change to do this is going to be forthcoming. It's going to be driven by, you know, the young people, people like yourselves in the media and so on, because of, you know, this dark reality. Again, part of it is because we're not seeing the reality, we're not listening to what is a bit of an inconvenient truth. But when the Secretary General of the United Nations tells you that what we're doing is insanity, his words are mankind is waging war against nature. And this is madness, because nature always fights back. All right, that's the sentence of warning us. All right, that's more, if I have to just chip in right now, we've talked about adapting and adopting renewable renewable energy as it is right now, Mr. Redley pointed out that we have plans, policies for 35,000, all the 10% of it is towards that. Another angle I want to look at is actually accessibility affordability as it's where, you know, most people have transition to solar energy, solar powering, but it is not so popular to the average man on the street because of the huge cost outlay, the finance economically. So if we're talking about adopting renewable energy when it is very expensive, just where are we headed? Yeah, it's only expensive because the profitability factor is still playing too high a role in the process. And this is what has brought us to the crux of this problem. Again, this is the biggest problem that humanity has ever faced. It's so serious. And one of the major drivers of the problem is the socioeconomic system that we've all embraced so wholeheartedly, which has some tremendous benefits. But the downside that's causing the problem is that we are putting profit ahead of planet and people, profit ahead of people, of people's welfare, of people's well-being, it's profit to worship the profit. No matter what, we must make more money out of this. So when we're going to be doing even the solar cells and photovoltaics, we have to make it as profitable as possible. We cannot subsidize it. We must make money, money, money. And this is what's causing the problem.  Can you imagine? Because you're just determined to make a profit. So as soon as we have that slight reorientation, which nature is insisting we're going to have, because believe you me, what we're going through this last year, we're going to go through a lot more by the end of this year, the beginning of 2024, because we are going to enter what we call the El Nino season, that is about a year of natural heating, which joins the global woman heating. And they're going to miss some terrible catastrophes. God forbid that we should get too hard hit in Lego. So the solar cells can be made a lot cheaper. They are coming down anyway. People are still making profits because the demand for them is growing. And when you have a tremendous demand and then the technology is accelerating and that's the beauty of it. Very soon, very soon. All right, all right, all right, that's my lesson. Let's go to use paint. You'll be able to paint your car. Okay. So maybe we should talk about this now. Let's talk about this now, because for those who have put out an argument for the adoption, adaptation of renewable energy, just to ensure that we emit less of this, you know, I would like to say poisonous or had that, you know, substance that are not very good for the environment. Now, there are causes that organization and individuals to and should adopt the use of renewable energy sources to reduce gas emissions.  Because of course, Nigerians, and then you're going to classification, you have groups and what have you to address the issue of climate change in Niger? Very deep questions. Well, I think, you know, it can be done. It's just, you know, it's all there as I was saying earlier, you know, the technology is going so fast that they actually have a paint now. Yes, a paint and even glass transparent glass that are photovoltaic sensitive that they can produce electricity. So with just a little bit more push in the technology, you will actually have a situation whereby you can put this paint, you can put this kind of glass in your windows of your car and so on, even in windows of your house, it'll produce electricity and it'll make people more independent because you'll be producing most of the electricity you need right from your premises or from your vehicle and so on. The technology is there and that's what gives us hope. But if we don't deploy it quickly enough, the consequences will be totally catastrophic. And this is where we as individuals, we as people and as Nigerians we are people that do fear God. We know there is a God, there's a creator who was in the beginning before the beginning began a creator who put the breath of life into us. And because of that, all we need to do is just refer to our scriptures. And the scriptures are very clear in terms of the human beings role in nature. My Muslim brothers, they tell me that we are caliphates, that we are stewards of creation. The scripture I'm more familiar with is the Christian scripture which says without any trace of doubt whatsoever that we are here to replenish the earth, we're here to care for the garden, we're here to look after. This is our primary function and it's also one of the most logical admonitions from scripture because we're replenishing what? Our life support system. Our children's life support system. So it's the most logical thing to replenish it. And once we get that into our minds that, hey, yes, we're actually following what scripture tells us and we're expressing love to the creator by following his scripture and love to our neighbors and our children by ensuring that we're looking after their life support systems. So a renewal of the mind will bring us into that paradigm shift that is necessary to care for the creation. Yeah, there'll be sacrifices, there'll be areas where we might not make so much money. All right, thank you so much, Desmond. Thank you so much. We have to really go. Thanks for all the useful insights and that you have shared with the Nigerians this morning about how we need to renew our minds and of course walk towards renewable energy. Would you appreciate your time on the breakfast this morning? My pleasure. Love the creator, love his creation. All right, thank you so much and Desmond. Desmond Magier Kudume is an environmentalist and we've been looking about saving the earth. Merci. Well, not necessarily that, but also moving towards renewable energy and we understand what that means. As a country, we haven't been able to generate enough to sustain us and then there's a need for us to move from a certain kind of energy generation pattern to another type. And the big question is, are we ready? Especially when we have to depend on the other for survival, we're saying we need to move away from physical fuel. Let's not forget that oil was an important oil, petrol and what have you. Are we really ready? Do we have what it takes? Is there political will, you know, to move towards clean energy? It's a conversation that will never end. We constantly have all of this, but it's fine. We need to bring it to an end at this point in time and that's because we're joined in Newsroom at 9 o'clock for the Newsbreak. But if you missed out on any part of our conversation, it will be great and fine to follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram and subscribe to our YouTube channel as a Plus TV Africa, Plus TV Africa lifestyle. My name is Messy Abouk. We'll have a fantastic Tuesday morning. And I'm Justin. I've got many things for being a part of the show. Bye for now.