Welcome back. In the last segment, we discussed the basic primitives for dealing with the heap memory and we used them to solve a particular problem. Now we are going to discuss the issues in using the heap memory and what kinds of pitfalls there are. So, on the face of it, it seems and I guess it is true that the allocation and deallocation is syntactically quite simple. There are sort of simple commands which allow you to allocate and deallocate. Experience however shows that managing heap memory is tricky and lots of errors are made in the management of heap memory. So, these range from some very obvious ones to less obvious ones. Say for example, you may forget to deallocate or delete memory. What does that do? So you allocate a lot of memory. You do not delete it and then if you yourself want more memory, then there is nothing left in the heap. So, although you have some memory which you are not using and which you have not realized that you are not using, since you did not return it to the heap, the heap is unable to give you memory. So, that is sort of a basic problem. So as soon as you are done with the memory that you need it, you should return it back so that you can get it later on when you actually want it. Another problem is the so-called dangling reference problem. This happens if you refer to memory that has been deallocated. So, you got some memory, you are using it, you returned it and you are still referring to it. So, because you returned it, it might have been given to some other request and therefore you might be destroying the data which or you might be reading data which was not really the data that you thought was present in that location and you can also do something called a memory leak which is that you destroy the only pointer to the memory allocated on the heap before it is deallocated, before it is explicitly deallocated. So, we will talk about all these three in some detail. So, let us take an example. Suppose I have n star iptr, so iptr is a variable which contains which is expected to contain pointers to integers. So, I make it point to a new integer, I make it point to a space allocated on the heap. I store 5 into that space, then I delete that, then I write some code which could be a long piece of code but let us say it does not involve iptr and after that I again store 10 into that address by dereferencing iptr. Now this is not correct. So you did have, iptr did have a memory location which was given from the heap but now, so it was given here but you returned it over here and you did not acquire it again and place it into iptr. So therefore the location that you are pointing to is not really what you think it is. It is not your location and so you should really not be using it. So this reference iptr points to memory that has been returned and it should not be used. So therefore it is called a dangling reference and it is wrong to dereference a dangling reference as has happened over here. So let us talk about memory leaks. So again we have this iptr which is a variable for storing addresses of integers. So we acquire memory and get its pointer into, get its address into iptr and immediately we acquire more memory and get that address also into iptr. Now clearly this is wrong. So the memory allocated in statement 1 its address was stored, say let us call it a was stored in iptr but in statement 2 this a got overwritten. So now the memory allocated address a cannot be used by the program because we have, we do not have any address, we do not have its address. On the other hand we did not delete that memory before destroying that address and so the heap allocation functions, the heap manager thinks that address has been given to us. So now that piece of memory has become useless because it does not, we cannot use it and the heap manager cannot use it. Such memory is said to have leaked out of our system and obviously you do not want such leaks. Here is another way a leak can happen. So I have a block inside which I have a variable declared iptr, it is again of type in star. So again I allocate an integer and get its address into iptr. Let us say the block ends exactly at this point. What happens now? So when the control exits from the block all the variables which were declared in the block are destroyed. So after the control executes this and comes out there is no iptr. So that means there are the contents of iptr are gone. So I had written down the address on some piece of paper and that paper is no longer there. So I do not know that address. That is exactly what has happened. So iptr is destroyed and so nobody can use the memory allocated in statement one. So we cannot use it because we do not know the address and the heap manager thinks that it is given to us. So therefore the heap manager cannot use it either. So the memory at address A has become unusable. So here is a simple strategy for preventing memory leaks. So what is the strategy? So suppose a certain pointer variable ptr is the only variable that contains the address of a variable allocated on the heap. So clearly we must not store anything into ptr and destroy its contents because that would exactly be a memory leak. If ptr is about to go out of scope say because control exits the block in which ptr is defined we must execute delete ptr. So these are two rules that we have to keep in mind. So if we keep in mind these two rules then we will be sure that there are no memory leaks. Likewise there is a simple strategy for preventing dangling references. So here is sort of a reason why we get dangling references. So we saw one but this is sort of a more general thing. So let us say there are two or more pointers let us say just say two for example and let us say they are aptr and vptr which point to the same variable on the heap and we execute delete aptr and we do not realize that vptr is also pointing to that same memory and therefore we should not be dereferencing vptr either. So but suppose we do dereference vptr and we get to that memory then that is a dangling reference which we have dereferenced. And of course we could have dereferenced aptr itself so both are not good. So what should we do? A simple way to avoid this is to ensure that at all times each variable in the heap will be pointed to only by one ptr. So there is this case is not going to arise that I deleted the memory using this pointer but I did not realize that some other pointer was also pointing to the same memory. And of course if I deleted the memory using this particular pointer I should also make sure that I do not use this particular pointer and dereference it subsequently. That is relatively easier to implement of course you can forget but at least that seems easier than saying oh there could be some 5 pointers to the same location of the heap and do I really know which those 5 pointers are. So that is a little bit tricky. So to avoid that situation we are going to say that at any time each variable on the heap will be pointed only by one ptr. And this is not the only possible strategy more complicated and more efficient and in some ways better strategies are possible but this is a fairly good reasonable strategy. So what have we discussed? So we have talked about memory leaks and dangling pointers and we said that to avoid these we should ensure that each variable allocated on the heap is pointed to by exactly one pointer at any time. If a ptr points to a heap variable then before executing a ptr equal to something changing its value we execute delete aptr. If aptr points to a heap variable and if control is about to exit the block in which aptr is defined then we execute delete aptr as well. So this is the strategy and this strategy requires us to remember things but fortunately we can automate it so that we do not really have to remember all of these things. So at some point we have to remember and we have to put them into code such that the code will be automatically executed and how that happens we will talk about in the next segment but before that we will take a quick break.


Fran, what's changed at your end since I've been gone? Oh, Roma, almost running around. I'm getting a bit old for this. I've got some aches and pains. But to be honest, I have come to exactly the right place, haven't I, Miriam? Fran, you've come to exactly the right place. So we're developing the first National Rehabilitation Centre for the country. We've never had one before. We're right in the centre of the country near Nottingham and Loughborough. And we will be combining clinical teams with research and teaching and training all in one centre. Right next door to the military centre, which is already there, which was, to be honest, was the catalyst for this programme. Sounds great. Sounds exactly what's needed. Exactly what's needed. So if you have a bad traffic accident or you have a period of illness and you need that rehab process, then we'll be getting people through really early in their journey, giving them that intense burst so that they can then go back into their community and work settings and carry on progressing. And some of the tech that we're developing will help that ongoing process. And by having everything in one place, yeah, it means that the tech that you can use could be things that, if it was just small practices, they perhaps couldn't get hold of. Absolutely. So research sometimes takes a long time to get into clinical practice. So we're doing it all at the same space. Yeah, and I'll hand over to Mark who can tell you more about the tech. Oh Mark, come in. I want to know a bit more. Thank you so much, Miriam. So that's all right. I'm going to start with this person. Oh, a little accidental. The reason this is an interesting creature, because it loses a limb, it can grow on back. Absolutely. And one of the things which we've talked about is if that happened to you, or what could you do about it, and what steps would you need to take, and then what would need to happen after those things had happened. So for example, in our stand, we're talking a little bit about how you might be able to grow new tissues, grow new tissues through your arm or your leg, whatever. Then when you did that, how would you monitor them? What kind of interventions would you need to make sure that the tissue actually worked properly? And integrate. And integrate. Absolutely. What supports, what devices might you need to be able to monitor what you did and how you did it? And I think the thing to say, which is moved on most, I think for the last decade for this work, is we have stem cells, we have 3D printing materials, we have smart materials, we have wearable technologies, we have smartphone apps, and all that stuff coming together enables us to do some of the things we want to do. And Pip's going to demonstrate some of it to you now. Thank you so much, Mark. Pip, it's all about making it obtainable, isn't it? And to be used in your home. Yeah, and what we're going to do is get you to sit on this screen. I was going to say you're gesturing for me to sit down. I'm going to sit on this sensor mat.  That's my bottom, right? That's your bottom on the screen. And you've got quite a nice symmetrical bottom there. Thank you.  And so you're going to lean forward and back and start moving the little black dot on the screen. That black dot there.  And this helps our patients actually do more exercise and get more rehabilitation. I'm going to go this way. People can do it in their own homes. They can do it all at once. I've got one, not the other one. You're going to go for the green one? This is really good fun. It is really good fun. But also, it means that we can actually get lots of people working together at the same time. Doing it across the devices that we've set up. Yeah, because of course it's just a mat with a TV screen. So you could do it at home or you could get people to stall in a room together. It's not just like this one-off treatment that people have just got to go one at a time. And when you have rehab, you need to do it lots and lots and lots. Most of it you should do it not even more. It's the notification of it, right? It's brilliant. This is a lot of fun. I haven't sat down all day, Pip. This is brilliant. Roma, I am going to continue playing this. But in the meantime, it's back to you.  Maybe a muscle. Maybe a muscle, so run out. Run out. You can't sit still, can you, Fran? Well, I'm here with Andrew Caple from the University of Loughborough to talk more about their pioneering work. Welcome, Andy. Now, I have a dodgy hip from, I'm guessing from my pregnancy. It's been there for a long time. How many people are affected by having some kind of aches and pains and injuries that need rehabilitation? Well, at any one time, we think there's about one in three people in the UK are undergoing some form of rehabilitation. I think probably the thing to consider is that when we're talking about rehabilitation, we're not always thinking about prosthetics or splints or wheelchairs. We're thinking about a much broader subset of life-changing events or conditions. So, you're thinking mental health, physical health as well. So, yeah, one in three at any one time. And part of the work you do is growing muscles in a lab. Tell me more about that. So, at the moment, if you want to develop a new treatment or a new therapy, then the process that you have to go through is you have to do some basic laboratory culture works. You then have to test it in animals and then you put it in through to human trials. Obviously, the middle part of that, the animal testing has a lot of ethical issues associated with it. So, we want to remove that. And the human part of it is quite challenging because in terms of throughput, it's difficult to do large-scale studies. What we're trying to do is recreate human biology but in a laboratory. So, we're growing miniaturized organoids, if you like, that can do what a human being does, which allows us to test out lots of new treatments and lots of new therapies in a rapid way. And then we can develop new treatments from there. Looking forward into the future, what we hope to be able to do is actually grow tissues that completely mimic an individual's biology. And then, if a tissue was damaged or lost as a result of an injury or disease, then we'd be able to use that tissue to replace the tissue that was damaged or lost. And when you're testing these drugs or therapies on the stuff that you're growing in the lab, even if you're growing like a smaller organ, does it scale up? Yeah, so that's one of the real challenges of the technology is the scalability. So, there's a biological challenge towards that. In the body, you have a vascular system that provides oxygen and nutrients to the tissues that keeps them alive. So, you need to be able to recreate that biologically. But then there's also a manufacturing scalability as well. So, you need to produce cellular material basically on a large enough volume so that you can manufacture big bits of tissue. But theoretically, there's no limitations. And then you send them to the gym? I hear. Yeah, we do send them to the gym. So, you think how a human being develops, it's obviously born, and then it starts to kind of load itself and goes through exercise. So, it takes a long period of time for humans to get to that kind of physically mature state. We don't want to be growing our tissues for 21 years before we can send them out into the real wide world. So, what we try and do is we try and fast-track that process. So, basically, we put them through a gym protocol. So, what that means in reality is we provide them with either little electrical impulses that recreate the electrical impulses that come from your brain. Just like you're doing 50 crunches in half a second or something. Or we physically stretch them, which again recreates the kind of the biological movement that you might do in a gym regime. And we can effectively change that to different exercise regimes that mimic maybe a kind of resistance training or an endurance training session or something like that so we can tailor the tissues whichever way we want them to go. And are those muscles then being used directly in the human body in some way or is it mainly to do the studies alongside the person? Yeah, so at the moment the kind of state of the art is that we can manufacture tissues that kind of look and behave like human beings and we can use them for clinical testing. As we move forward where we want to get to is we want those tissues to mimic exactly your biology. So, for instance, I could take either a blood sample or a skin swab, get the cells from that and then culture that up into a tissue that mimics exactly what you would do in response to a specific therapy. And then moving forward into the future, then we're looking at potentially implantation of lost tissue. And what would that allow you to treat? Yes, that's a really interesting question. A lot of life-changing events are not expected. So in those instances it might be more challenging to have a kind of a banker tissue sort of stored away but where you maybe have a chronic condition where you're struggling to treat something via a normal process and you're maybe getting degradation of the tissue over a long period of time, then you could look at a route where you actually ask someone to maybe donate some blood or some cells and we'll go away and culture up some tissue in the lab and then come back and maybe surgically replace the tissue that's failing. So it allows it to kind of be rejuvenated and gain a new life, I guess, fresh lease of life. Yeah, exactly. So where there's a defect in the natural biology, then we could replace that defect and kind of look to then go through a normal rehabilitative process with that kind of new healthy tissue. I mean, it sounds like you must be working with a big different range of people, different kind of degrees, backgrounds, areas of research. Could you tell me a little bit about how all of that comes together? I think effective research needs teams of people who come from different backgrounds as well. I don't think it's a great team if everyone has the same skill set. So the team that we have at Loughborough is really diverse. We recruit people from all different facets of life. So it's a really nice balance of people to work with. And what have you been telling all the students that have been visiting your stall? What are the kind of questions and what are the interests? I've not been on yet. You've not been on yet? No, I'm in my first sessions after this. So I'll have to get back to you on that one. Oh, really, well, good luck with that. I think they're a very energetic bunch, but it's been great to talk to you about your research.


Live from the San Jose McCannery Convention Center, it's theCUBE at Open Compute Project US Summit 2015. Okay, welcome back everyone. We are here live in Silicon Valley for the Open Compute Project Summit 2015 or OCP Summit 2015. That's the hashtag, Join the Conversation. This is theCUBE, our flagship program where we go out to the events to extract the synth and the noise. SiliconANGLE Media Production, which includes SiliconANGLE, Wikibon, and theCUBE all under one umbrella, bringing all the signal to you. You can hear all live in Silicon Valley where all the action is. This is where the innovation is. I'm with Jeff Frick, my co-host, our next guest is James Liao, founder and CEO of Pika8. Welcome to theCUBE. Thank you, nice to meet you guys. We were talking on our intro. This is where the action is right now. All the smart monies here. You can see all the smart VCs that I know that what's best in the business are out here. There's real technical innovation going on, but a shift and an inflection point happening at the same time. Software defined infrastructure, right? Everything software defined, and you have embedded concepts, systems on a chip, intelligent software, adaptive like fabric. These are decade old concepts now brought forward open source. So this is greatness. Now everyone always says, oh, that's great, but the network's still the bottleneck. So what the hell's going on with the network? Is it going to get faster? Virtualization, SDNs on the horizon? Give us the update. Where's the innovation of the network? So basically I think that networking is going through a big paradigm shift. In the past 20 years, we have seen a lot of changes in the computing, in the storage part. The hardware is commodized, standardized, and then people bring the software, and then eventually software bring the virtualization. So there are a lot of changes, and now rolling clock forward 20 years later, now with the technology we have in the data center, you can create a virtual machine within 30 seconds. You can attach one terabyte of storage within 30 seconds, but once you are done with the virtual machine and the virtual storage, how do you deploy them? If you want to deploy the virtual machine into your data center, you have to go through networking. And all the networking right now is manually managed, which means you have to create your firewall policy, your security policy, your low banter policy, all your routes, how does traffic go into this machine, how does traffic go out of the machine? So the change itself, by deploying the virtual machine which takes 60 seconds to create, now it takes one day to configure. That's how things slow down. So in order to solve that problem, we just have to think about what we have done with computing and storage. The technology we bring to storage and computing is standardizing the hardware, bringing more software, creating more application, creating more innovation to the software so that we can create a virtualization of the networking. So I noticed you guys did a crowd chat with Scott Rainovich, one of the friends of theCUBE, also a guest co-host, Scott, are you watching? I hope the slopes are okay. It's 65 degrees, you said, up in Bozeman, Montana. Good friend, but he had a very interesting conversation. One of the top voted questions was, who's involved in this white box food chain and what does pika aid do? And hashtag SDN, NFV, NFV implying service provider. A lot of stakes on the table right now in terms of high stakes poker. Exactly. What's going on? What's the white box mean and what's the big prize? What are people fighting for? So I think the networking is good. The paradigm shifting in the networking industry brings a lot of opportunity to all vendors. There are a lot of segregation in the supply chain. So people start to realize, I can separate the hardware from the software. People start to realize I can separate control plane from the data plane. I can separate the physical network from the virtual network. So by doing different segregation, you start to bring in more vendors into the game. And on the white box side, for example, if we talk about white box, now there are a lot of vendors from Asia, from Europe, from US that can create a white box, which is very efficient, very high performance, very low cost, easy to manage, easy to program. So vendors like HP, Dell has already joined the game. Even Juniper is announcing that they want to be part of the game. And besides that, from Asia Pacific, you can see a lot of vendors like Quanta, like Wistron, like Celestica, and Alpha. This kind of networking vendors used to be doing a lot of manufacturing for big name-brain. They are now realizing, hey, this is the opportunity, we can come out to start doing the game. So on the supply chain side, on the hardware side, I think it's very open, and we see a lot of vendors join the party. On the software side, we're seeing a lot of changes on the software side too. Operating system side, you got Pica 8 in the game, you got Cumulus also creating a lot of innovation. But most importantly, on top of that, we see tons of vendors, dozens of vendors trying to create new innovation to change the efficiency of the network. So this aggregation is interesting here, right? So you're basically isolation allows for inefficiencies that take costs on manufacturing. And then the innovation can come in at any vector, software or other hardware component. Exactly. Okay, so let's step back a second. So for the average enterprise out there, who's got some money to spend, they have challenges. What's the core problem that you guys are solving? Is it the scale-out, scale-up combination? The scale-out's been a great thing, but they're used to scaling up, the old school vendors, which locked a little more general purpose. Can they get best of both worlds and how do you guys help the network solve this problem? Absolutely. I think the real thing people try to solve is that in the past 25 years, networking is basically just one solution. Cisco defines the architecture, everybody follows the architecture, you can replace a couple of top of rack, but you still follow the same architecture. And what we're hearing from our customers is that, hey, I'm not running the same application as other people. I have my unique need. Some of the people are running host service, so they got a lot of tendency inside the network. Some of the customers that run mega-data centers, they have to scale out, right? And some of the customers, they have only a few departments inside their organization, but they got a lot of security policy they have to apply. And some of the customers are telling us that networking is very important to their infrastructure, so they want to make sure it's a zero downtown. And in the past, you only have one recipe. Cisco tell you, I put this big core in the network and then you do active passive, right? And everybody do the same way. However, if you look at the application, everyone is using different applications. So it doesn't make sense to follow the same recipe. So do we want to do scale out or do we want to do scale up? That's actually not the very core of the question. The question now is that if I have my need of solving certain things, do I get the tool? Can I have the freedom to use the tool to solve the problems? This is very similar to the mainframe to PC change. In the very beginning of the change, mainframe has much more computing power than PC, but mainframe doesn't have any flexibility. You want to use IBM mainframe, you go to IBM, ask them to create an application to solve your problem. You want to... IBM System Z has Linux support now. We could argue that for the big banks, they can get best of both worlds. Exactly. In a single threaded environment. Exactly. Not necessarily multi-threaded. But 20 years ago, it was a big change. When people started to realize PC is much more flexible. I can write my own application on top. That's a big change. I think we are going through exactly the same change right now. The networking users start to realize that my need is different from everybody else. Let's break that down. I want to get your perspective, because you brought up a good point. The mainframe kind of triggered me a little bit, because we're covering the Z thing, which we like the IBM new Z stuff, but it's different. It's not your old grandfather's mainframe. Correct. And it's also single threaded, and their workloads very specific. You mentioned workloads. This isolation and this aggregation is interesting because now you can actually have flexibility in workloads. Talk about that dynamic, because whether it's NFV for service providers or something else, workload diversity is a big issue, right? Exactly. Isn't that fundamental issue right now? Workloads? It's a very important issue. So if you look at the workload, a lot of people, they run different applications, generating a lot of different workloads. For example, if I take banks as an example, in the daytime, you're doing a lot of trading.  Latency is the most important thing. But in the nighttime, you have to backup your database.  Now every package is big. And by the way, if you miss your window for opening trade hundreds of millions of dollars are at risk. Exactly, exactly. And if you have some application. Minutes or years in savings, right? Exactly. And if you have an application, for example backup application, they just screw it up and start sending traffic in the trading time. You probably lose millions in minutes. Hundreds of millions. Right, exactly. That's the consequence. So these are the things that you have to figure out. My networking has to support my application. So in terms of workload, when I look at the workload, most of people only see computing, they only see storage. They don't really know how networking is working inside this whole networking thing. So if you have a workload, specific workload, and you can analyze to the level. So here's the important thing. Not only you have to provision your workload on your networking, you have to know how these workload is performing inside your network. So you've got to have a cycle to say I can provision it and I can create, I can collect the data. So you need the monitoring and you don't want to compromise latency because that's the other one, Mitch Byer. Exactly. It's an interesting dilemma, right? Right, and you don't want to create more workload for humans, right? That's another thing. You don't want to say every time I program a network, I have to add a couple of network engineers to program a network. So what is the best way to handle this? Whatever we have done in the past 20 years to virtualize that computing and storage, whatever lesson we have done to reduce the CAPEX and OPEX, those are the things that we can now consider how to do it in the networking sector. So how do customers do it? Obviously they can't just turn off the old system and flick on the new and we do a lot of big data shows and we talk a lot about the journey, right? How do you get there? Where do you start? How do you find some early wins in some success? So within your customers, how are people slowly migrating over to a more software-defined network? That's a great question. We get that question a lot. When people talk about SDN, the first impression they get is that, well, SDN is going to completely change my network. So I got my current network running. I cannot afford to bring down my network and create a new one. So there is no possibility I can migrate to SDN. The fact is that there is an easy way to migrate to SDN. The first thing you want to consider is that through, I just mentioned that there are a lot of disaggregation between the different layers, right? Power versus software, control plan versus data plan, virtual network versus physical network. So most of our customers start to realize one thing. The first step they can easily take is to bring in YBox. You bring YBox, putting a different software on top. Now you got the freedom that you can run different software. However, bringing YBox itself has a lot of challenges as well. So you need some software company, like Pica A, to help you to migrate to YBox. So our first step to our customers is always trying to make YBox easy to use. And is that a carve out based on a workload? Is the carve out based on the data center? I mean, again, getting started when you've got something up and running, it's got to be tricky. It's just easy replacement because you basically bring YBox but all the operation model stays the same. Then the next stage is to look into that's where your workload started to work. Now you have YBox in your network.  A lot of our customers are migrating from scale up to scale out architecture because it's easier for them to expand and it doesn't have the physical limitation. So that's the second step. The third step is that as soon as you determine your architecture, you will start to realize you have to manage the network. Now it's becoming more complicated. So you have to figure out a way to automate the configuration. And these are the things that we help our customer by bringing Linux as our platform into our platform. People can bring the tools to program the platform. And then the fourth step is that once you have this architecture management tool YBox in the place, you can start to bring in the new software or new SDN technology to work with your system. With that, we have a cross flow. We have a certain technology that can blame the SDN open flow architecture with the current architecture. So we basically help us, our customers to go through four steps. First step, YBox. Second step, architecture change. The third step, automate all the configuration and the fourth step to reach the SDN technology. And how long does that take generally, or some examples? It depends on different customers. Some of the customers can go from one to four within one year. That's really quickly. But some of the customers are more conservative. They want to make sure they have every step proven. Every step is no downtime at all. So some of them may take even 18 months, two years to carry out the whole transition. So it really depends on customers and depends on the size of the network. Some of the other customers basically just bring up the SDN into their network. They got a sizable network, but they determined to go to SDN within six months that everything is running. So it really depends on how you want to migrate your platform all the way. And the key issue people try to solve is not CAPEX. I think CAPEX is the important issue they want to solve in day one, but the real issue they want to solve is APEX. The network is becoming more and more important and more and more complicated. If you don't bring in the new technology software to manage the network, you have to continue to hire a lot of people to manage a small size of network. And when you try to scale out or scale up to scale your data center or scale your network, you run into problem of human. Can there be multiple OS's in the data center and how big is the market for white box OS's? I think there definitely can be multiple OS for data center. It depends on how you want to use your system. It's just like everybody is believing that Microsoft is dead, right? Redhead or Linux is taking over the world. But if you look at Microsoft, they still have a big chunk of the market. So definitely we can- And they're using that in the cloud game too, with Azure. You're seeing Windows the sequel on Windows. Exactly. So I think there's definitely a room for multiple OS vendors in the networking sector.  I think most of the big data centers, especially people that come to OCP, you can talk to them. You will start to realize people start to use white box in the data centers already. Even though it's not really well known, not a lot of people come out to talk about it, but white box is penetrating the market. Cisco's revenue is 30 million, right? So just think about white box. If white box grow to 10% within a couple years, that's three billion by itself. That's a huge market. And by bringing more and more people to come to the market and can customize their platform or customize their solution, you've got more and more networking functions migrate over to white box. So my gut feeling right now is that even though not a lot of people coming out to say we completely changed the network, there are a lot of vendors or a lot of customers who are testing white box already. Another proof is that even small companies like PICAI, we have more than 350 customers worldwide. So a lot of people are using white box in their production line. A lot of people are using white box in their test lab already. Talk about your business, okay? Where you guys are, the founding, the story, and what are you guys doing solving your customer problems and what are those problems? Right. And where do you guys win and where are you guys improving? What? So PICAI started in 2009. That was long before the white box idea came up. The open flow kind of market. It was started with the open flow as a penetration point, but in the very beginning, our vision was very simple. It came along with my background. I worked in tandem for about 10 years. And before I come out to start up, I was going through the whole change of mainframe to PC. So I was on the mainframe side watching everything from the down. And that was an interesting experience. Fault tolerance, all those systems, banking, trading. Exactly. We owned about 98% of the banking market. So at that time, we said there's no way. So high availability was your DNA. Exactly. Fault tolerance. Total innovators. Exactly. And we tell people, hey, if you need a huge telecom system, you need tandem database, right? You need a banking system, you need tandem database. Everything is a tandem database. So we look at things through our lens. Everything is a database application. What we didn't realize is that when you go to PC, you don't need the database at all. People try to solve different problems. So in 2009, before I started this company, we're looking at the market. I got a feeling this is happening again to networking. Actually in 2000, the same thing happened to storage. NetApp and EMC came up, right? And in 2006, 2007, Android is starting to come out and people start to realize, well, there's yet another operating system. At that time, I started to watch what chip company, what ASIC company is doing, and I started to realize ASIC from the off the shelf commercial Silicon is catching up with the big companies like Cisco's internal chips. So if that happens then- Good enough, it comes good enough, right? Exactly. Then you're going to start to see the whole market is going to migrate over to these Y-Box vendors. And we saw that coming in 2009, we started saying that, what do people need when Y-Box is coming? An easy answer is that while we create a software to do layer two, layer three. But that doesn't solve the problem because every box is small, you are going to end up managing a lot of boxes on the- So let's take a step back because one of the things we watch at Silicon Angle and the Cube and Wikibon is networking, you know, Stu Miniman's all over it, Dave Vellante, David Floyer. You know, we're totally watching the landscape. It's not just at the lower level open compute at the cloud game, it's the battleground is in the network layer. You look at VMware, Google. Exactly. You can just read the tea leaves, it's pretty obvious. That's what the battleground is. Past layer, there'll be multiple middleware layers. Okay, buy that, little cloud found you over here over there, whatever. No problem. Network layer. Why is the battleground so hot in network and what are the innovations that have come out of SDN? Just going back since this year was bought by VMware. So if you look into IT infrastructure, there are basically three components. Computing, storage and networking, right? Computing and storage have been virtualized and these cloud, that enables the cloud. However, in the past people basically just covered the eyes and said, hey, networking, as long as we have enough bandwidth, let's just keep it at the corner and say, we don't care. Let's figure out how to solve everything with the software.  In fact, there are a lot of talk about barriers, right? The scalability barrier, the flexibility barrier, deployment barrier, it's all about networking. So people start to realize that, hey, we solve a lot of problem on the storage and computing side, but because of networking, we cannot deploy anything. So now all of the engine is down to networking. And this is 25 years problem. This is not just yesterday's problem. So it takes time to solve the problem. And it takes time to bring new vendors to the market, bring new supply chain to the market. What's the bottleneck? Is it the technology? Is it hurting the cats on the vendors? Is it standards bodies? Is it- I think the real bottleneck is the usage model. People have this mindset that, hey, networking is something I shouldn't touch, right? So if I want to touch the network, I bring the Cisco guys sitting by me before I make the change. So that's- Because of disruptive operations. Exactly. There's an impact. Right, reliability is always the key of the networking. However, the complexity and all the slowness to deploy things is really eating customers right now. So I think the most important thing now is that to start to realize, networking is something that you have to change. And that mindset is the biggest barrier. Once customers get over the mindset, we got a lot of tools out there. We got YBox, we got OpenFlow, we got SDN, we got Programmability, DevOps. All these things can help people to migrate to new networking. So if you- What's the pain point on that? Is it heavy duty, migration?  I got DevOps in my future. I got, I'm hiring a lot of app developers. I got containers being deployed. I want a programmable infrastructure and I want a data center operating system.  Right. The pain point is not really the technology by itself. The pain point is the business model. So people try to solve the pain point that, for example, I'm running a container right now. Cisco is telling me to do it this way. Now I need to add another container. What do I do? I have to hire another guy. So you have to deal with those problems. And by dealing with those problems, you need to figure out an open way to program your network. You need the tools to bring the hardware. You bring the tools to bring the new application. So these are the pain points that people have to deal with. So you said that people didn't want to touch the network. That was, don't break it, it's fine, just add more bandwidth. Once they've made the lead to SDN and they see the value, are you finding customers really see the value? Not beyond just going, getting away from the barrier, but really opening up new opportunities to do things that they could have never done before. Absolutely. I don't know if you can share any good stories with that. We have a customer that runs three data centers. Inside the data center, every time they create a new data center, they have to deal with a couple of problems. You have to put the infrastructure in place. You have to provision your network. You have to bring network engineer. And because the data centers are spreading over the US, you now have to set up the team in US over the global team. And they set up the policy before they develop their SDN solution. They set up the policy, I want a zero touch network because for server, for storage, I can do zero touch, no problem. But networking, I always have to have somebody on site to program the network, to watch the network. So they set up this policy that they want to do zero touch provisioning, zero touch, zero touch, fault tolerance, that kind of things. And you need the software to do that. So once they, thank you. Once they solve that problem, they now are running three data centers. They are looking into the next three data centers they want to start. Guess what? In the past, it takes six months to bring out three data centers. Now it takes days. Okay, yeah. And that's the solution. Once you get through that, from three to six, six to 12, you just don't have any barrier. You just continue to roll out your data centers. That's great. So the question about the market is one final question for you. What do you guys want to do? What's your objective this year? I'll see you guys have been out there. SDN is super hot. Internet of Things is exploding as an application, which essentially means mobile computing and every other connected IP device. Exactly. What's the future for you guys? We want to change the network industry. So that's our mission. Our mission is to change the network industry from a closed environment to an open environment. We cannot solve all the problems, so we have to build up a lot of partnership with our partners to solve the hardware, supply chain problem, to solve the chipset problem, to solve the application problem. But essentially what we're trying to do is that we see software defined data center as the end game. You want everything to be virtualized so that today, if I'm running virtual machine in the US, tomorrow I can run it in Australia. And the day after, if I'm traveling to Japan, they can follow me to Japan, right? So this is the vision. The vision is that we want to enable software defined data center. And in order to solve that problem, you have to solve the networking problem. In order to solve the networking problem, PKI has to be the one, or at least one of the vendors to enable the change. Right now, if you don't have a way to segregate the hardware from the software, virtualized data center to physical data center, or the control plane from the data plane, you cannot get this to happen. So what we try to do is to focus on how to disaggregate those areas and enable other vendors or other partners to solve the problems. James, Leo, thanks for coming on theCUBE. And remember, when you're a billion dollar company, don't forget us, okay? Because, you know, you were once on theCUBE. We're doing our part going out to the stories. Thank you so much. We have a great opportunity. You guys are in probably one of the most important areas in the technology industry right now. This is exciting. There's unicorns in this room. You guys could be one of them. You've got a great product, great team, and it's hot areas, so best solution will win. It's not marketing. You can't market your way in this market. We're lucky, right. Congratulations. It's theCUBE live in Silicon Valley. We'll be right back with our next guest after this short break. Open Compute Project Summit here in Silicon Valley. This is theCUBE. I'm John Furrier with Jeffery. We'll be right back.


old faces and to share some of the projects we've been doing on this also together in collaboration with Joachim's group. So it's really been a lot of fun and some things are coming up now that are new. And I'll be hopefully spending a little time talking about the outlook and less on older stuff. So let's see, does it have the range? Nope. Okay, so nope, yes, slow. Okay, so the group does a bunch of things, fabrication of devices. We also have optics and atomic ensemble experiments. In general, we work on quantum optics and electric circuits, which is sort of a motif in this meeting. So it's really great to see sort of a sub-community emerging of more fundamental research along with the sort of applied quantum computing effort, which is ongoing. We've been studying also coupling to atomic systems similar to TLSs, also some hybrid, more explicit hybrid projects. And in general, I'll be talking mostly today about this sort of multimode photonics approach, which is an extension of the quantum optics scenario. And because time always runs out, I want to say a special thank you to all the people who really do the work. And it's really inspiring to have a small but very, very dedicated group of people who really, you know, they spend the extra hours in the lab and doing the simulations and really thinking about what's going on to get things understood. And there's also, of course, the broader perspective of friends and collaborators and funding, which we gratefully acknowledge. So because time is short, I'm going to just jump in and talk about what is the motivation of this particular line of projects. And it's the story of photonics and optics. They have a very long tradition of routing both fundamental and applied photonics down to the single photon level and turning this very technical capability into both basic and applied research and the beauty of photonics and mode shaping and space and time is part of what is really lovely in optics. But for microwaves, we have superior on-demand capabilities, much better than the optics. And we can design our circuits. We have more engineering freedom than they do. Our sources are relatively more stable in terms of the classical phase noise of microwaves and intensity noise, especially as something that the laser people can just look at in awe. But we have a problem, which is the problem of scalability. And that has to do with some very basic, the very basic and trivial issue with the wavelength of microwaves in free space is about 100,000 times longer than that of light. And when you try to put that on a chip, it just doesn't, not that many modes fit. So you can sort of like wrap things around and you can lump element them. But in the end, if you want to do these sort of photonics propagation itinerant traveling wave stuff, you just don't have that much room on a chip. And unless you want to go really bulky, sort of like the Yale attitude of these huge, insane arrays of, well, they're not insane because they work, but it's really, I admire that sort of direction of these sort of scalable, very low temperature arrays of cavities. It's very interesting and we'll see how that emerges, but extraordinarily difficult. So we want to talk about high kinetic inductance and microstrips as a combination which can really help achieve some interesting things in this direction. And we already saw in the talk a very nice introduction of the idea of kinetic inductance as a useful non-linearity and actually linearity starting from it.  And it's something that somehow for sure solid-state physicists don't always recognize its importance. And I think it's emerging also, especially in 2D materials, the concepts of how microwaves couple into these things and kinetic inductance as a critical element of describing them and the wave functions of the electrons confined to that extreme make it also interesting. So the standard description of kinetic inductance has to do with the fact that we usually ignore when we talk about the Hamiltonian and talk about the pre-factor of current squared, we talk about the magnetic energy as the dominant representation of that aspect of the Hamiltonian. And that's because it's at least 12 orders of magnitude dominating over the kinetic energy of the charge carriers in almost any normal scenario except in plasmonics and in the superconducting amorphous materials I'll be talking about and we already heard about some. So those are two extremes of nature in which kinetic inductance can actually dominate and it can be even 100 or 1000 times larger than the magnetic energy. And mathematically it's very, very simple. We're just talking about here the linear approximation of current as some sort of average velocity, drift velocity, multiplying a charge density and a mass and you get an expression when you lump it all together which has a kinetic inductance term which could be contrasted with the magnetic B field inductance. And this can be compactly lumped into being proportional to geometric terms L the length of the wire and A, sorry it's not marked here but L is the length of this wire and A is its cross-section and we have here a material property which is just the London depth of the superconductor. And why does this work in superconductors? Because we've basically swept away the resistance and in order to make this significant effect we actually have to work with nanostructures in which L over A or especially A is small so these like nanowires just like we saw in the previous talk but also really lousy conductors in terms of amorphous materials where the effective carrier density is very low and that by being one over raises up the kinetic inductance. And there's also a nonlinearity so let's call this kinetic inductance to have some sort of linear low current sort of linear limit but then there's a quadratic correction which gives us an interesting nonlinearity, interesting and useful nonlinearity. So yeah if someone can move that window away that would be helpful thank you. Great thanks. So here for example is an experiment you just do on a resonator and you measure it's you know as a function of power and you see this sort of duffing like softening and even if you go even higher bifurcation of the response of that resonator. And if you want to ask where this nonlinearity coming from I won't spend too much time on it and there's sort of like a Ginsburg-Landau intuition and actually if anyone's aware of a more in depth BCS calculation I'd be happy to see it it's kind of hard to track down there's a lot of perturbative stuff but when you go to higher power approaching the critical currents to really track down the nonlinearity and the low temperature limit is a little fishy.  So I'd be curious to see a lumped element calculation if anyone has it I'd like to know so please approach me in the break if you know of it. And the short version of this explaining this nonlinearity is that high currents, high relative to or on order of the critical currents suppress the gap. You suppress the gap that reduces the superfluid charge carrier density and if you insist on having the same current that means they have to move faster. In order to achieve the same current with a lower carrier density you have to move faster i.e. more kinetic energy, kinetic inductance is appropriately boosted by this nonlinearity so this I0 is going to be on order of the critical current of the actual wire so in typical regular rectangular wires it's usually a factor of three of the critical current. Again being a perturbative term you can of course drive more current than the actual critical current. And this gives rise to the sort of nonlinear wave equation where the inductance depends on the current and that of course gives the possibility of wave mixing phenomena so initially we started out by looking at four wave mixing where you have a strong pump and a signal which is added to a weak signal will get amplified by the four wave mixing phenomena of course you need phase matching and all the machinery of quantum optics again in a classical nonlinear wave but we're hoping to reach single photon noise limits and there's obviously an idler which is being created by these sort of parametric activity with this sort of dispersion. And the popular implementations by far are Josephson Junction arrays and the so-called Tupas and the significant disadvantage aside from having a huge advantage of actually working and being relatively low loss you have to say something about a disadvantage of being scientists and always looking for something new and being critical people so we have to say what's wrong with them and that was mentioned in the previous talk is the low dynamic range. On order of a few tens of photons going through these things they start saturating and behaving in all kinds of strange and also heating up in modes and it's not a regime you want to go to if you value your qubits. Kinetic inductance and nonlinearities have sort of an engineering limit of being very very impedance mismatched and it's related to the Josephson Junctions but the Josephson Junctions are sort of lumped element and it's kind of easier to deal with them and the kinetic inductance is more of an intrinsic element and it's a bit harder to get a 50 ohm transmission line out of this thing and some attempts were made with coplanar waveguides and just to remind you of especially the theorists in the audience is that when you have any sort of transmission line you talk about a typical impedance which is the square root of the ratio of the inductance per unit length that's the little L here and capacitance per unit length that sort of ratio gives you a typical impedance and our electronics for relatively fundamental reasons is 50 ohms it's sort of an interesting compromise of the impedance of the vacuum and dielectrics and it's an interesting story but 50 ohms is a standard electronics that's what we're coming in with that's what the hemp amplifiers want to see and not having that in these traces is going to be very problematic and for the kinetic inductance amplifiers this is barely feasible to get enough capacitance to make this close to 50 ohms actually it typically fails and what you do is you do these clopsin steam tapers in order to transition adiabatically within a certain bandwidth to much higher impedances and that actually significantly extends these amplifiers to be chips of a few centimeters with lots and lots of coils and a lot of microwave engineering there's all interesting fractal capacitance work that was done in various places also in Chalmers and these are barely feasible it's just very hard to accumulate the proper parameters for this and you get these highly rippled gain curves because of this and we went for something which in the end it's sort of obvious but it has this elegance to it the idea of having this kinetic inductance trace but a very very narrow dielectric gap to a ground gives you a huge capacitance per unit length and we're talking about something quite extreme so this dielectric is just going to be a few nanometers sometimes we even go down to 10 nanometer barriers over centimeters of trace so it's a regime which experimentalists are a little less familiar with because usually you don't have that smaller gap we talk about hundreds of nanometers of dielectric that's a more comfortable regime and we need this because we want a very large capacitance and that's what's going to give us the interesting 50 ohm response of the device now there's another bonus to this is that we get a very very slow phase velocity it's shockingly slow in the sense that the phase velocity is one over the square root of the multiplication of L and C just like a resonant term with per unit length it becomes a velocity and here we have something which is 300 or even more times slower than the speed of light that's a huge effective index of refraction it's not a group velocity it's actual phase velocity and that's an interesting behavior and now going to the non-linear wave equations this is kind of standard envelope equations with the non-linearity added perturbatively you make assumptions of the usual undepleted strong pump you define the phase matching mismatch and the parameters of this sort of non-linearity scaling function and here it's a four wave mixing process and you get these are just classical amplitudes which of course transition into operators with the standard notation so and you see here these are the usual parametric processes with the pump again as a classical amplitude and these idler and signal as quantum operators and the fabrication is relatively simple you start out with silicon you grow this here we're working with amorphous tungsten silicide so this is a sputter target that you order with the proper stoichiometry and you sputter it after optimizing the conditions and the nice thing about adding this aluminum layer here we add the ground on top so it caps and protects everything and it also allows you to have really good launchers because one of the things you realize with these materials that they're kind of thin and nasty and again the experimentalists are nodding because they know what I'm talking about and having this nice aluminum tungsten sort of interface and launching into that and then going into the material is pleasant and we do this one tone how much time do I have? where are we standing? okay that's great that's where we want to be so we do a one tone experiment and we see immediately that we have serious dielectric issues here and that's going to plague us and that's something that will remain till the end that the transmission actually becomes pretty smooth relatively smooth this is after we impedance match everything so there's some rippling but it's not horrible indicating that centimeters of this wrapped transmission line on a 6mm chip are pretty close to 50 ohms but you see that at low power there's significant absorption and that's coming from the amorphous silicon that we deposit so amorphous silicon is a pretty good dielectric but it absorbs and it's TLS is in the dielectric and again we're looking for better dielectrics and the critical current of the wire is in the few tens of microamps that's a nice place to be if you want it to be a weakly non-linear system and we get a huge linear phase going through this device because of the slow phase velocity and a significant non-linear phase which accumulates because of the pump and this is sort of a conclusion slide in the sense that we see that it amplifies on order of 20 something dB and it's a pretty good amplifier even with the loss so it overcomes the loss which is a trivial, uninteresting TLS loss it overcomes that partially because the pump is sitting right there in the middle has a huge power broadening and it's saturating these TLSs we can talk about the heating effects that causes but as a linear amplifier this behaves quite nicely and we end up with a very respectable and broadband and relatively smooth gain of this amplifier it has a nice dynamic range and if you think about how many photons you're sending through so here we're scanning something like 50 dB from the single photon in the wire at any given time out to many photons and it responds quite linearly and here using a signal to noise backtracking technique we can estimate the noise temperature and because of the standard uncertainties of a few dB in the amplification chain we have a relatively large uncertainty in the effect of noise we didn't go beyond that with single photon source measurements of the noise but it's a respectable low temperature amplifier with just a few photon or even close to single photon noise added in a relatively large bandwidth and I mentioned dielectric loss I'm gonna jump over this and this we sort of optimized for it you know it's in terms of you have like a trade-off of length versus non-linearity and it all adds up and then you wanna be here so we thought about loss characterized it and optimized accordingly but let's go multi-mode and this is when we approached Joachim and started asking what can we do together in terms of more complex structures because this is a platform it's a photonics platform let's just put the numbers out there the wavelength is 200 in the extreme case the wavelength is 200 microns at 5 gigahertz that's sure you can put a lot of those inside a usual chip so let's do that so wait I skipped over something I think well maybe not so here for example are these sort of devices we have a bunch of ports going in and I'm gonna be talking about two kinds of traces because what we wanna do is we wanna have basically a linear trace with a very slow phase velocity and short wavelength going through so these are like the broader green curves here and then we wanna add these we call them inductive couplers super inductance but it's a large inductance very impedance matched coupling between these 50-ohm traces so we're gonna call these couplers and those we're gonna call waveguides so it's just a name in the end it's the same material same fabrication just you cut it down here to a few hundred nanometers and here it's say three microns so there's that difference both in capacitance and in inductance make these say just an appropriate mismatch so the main flow is along the waveguides and there's these periodic couplings wherever we wanna put them along the trace and we're gonna be talking about three sort of devices we made with this sort of strategy so the simplest one is just let's call it a hybrid coupler or a two rail system in which you have two input ports and two output ports and coupling periodically placed along the trace and then we went to something more complex with seven coupled arrays and we couldn't resist and we made something also resonant as well something with resonant mode so here this actually if you tilt it and distort is actually a square lattice we have to think about it for a bit what's going on but in the end if you look how many neighbors does each one have that's a square lattice sorry so I'm gonna rush through the results it's in our paper from a while ago in journal physics so here's the coupled waveguides when you look at it with low power so again just as a linear element so it's a remarkably compact hybrid you know if you guys know the microwave element called a hybrid it's this so it's you couple in and there was really a beautiful description that the Ulma guys and all of them put together of symmetric and anti-symmetric modes and the dispersion relation of this multimode structure to describe how the waves propagate and it just works you measure the transmission so the ones without the prime are the inputs the primed ones are the outputs so you measure what goes from one to one prime and you calculate it and even the subtle everything here it all matches really very very nicely and if you go to higher power you start to see it's a transmission amplitude here it's actual I should check that that seems a lot I'm gonna check that that's an extreme number here I should check that it's a little weird I'm gonna get back to you on that okay so if you go to higher power and you start saturating actually the interesting thing is you saturate the the couplers whereas in photonics they usually saturate on-site interaction here we're saturating the couplers so it's an interesting non-linearity theoretically just looking at the seven coupled waveguides we see more complicated transmission patterns again you say injecting in four and looking injecting in four and looking what comes out and then looking at all the related traces we see these oscillations which initially you wanna understand what they are but if you let's just skip ahead so this is just a coherent walk system which the photonics guys have done years ago but now we have it also in microwaves so you inject here and actually this is what's happening along the position a few millimeters and it's doing these coherent back and forth of course nothing quantum here yet but if you start pushing the power and checking exactly what's going on you see that because the couplers are small structures we have significant non-linearity at the level of few tens or maybe a hundred photons so we can push on that a little and go down to potential single photon levels with I guess less pain than the photonics people than the optics and then looking at the lattice of this square lattice we can really see so I get confused I guess this is the data and that's the simulation and again just calibrate the behavior of the traces and then just simulate it from just a simple tight binding model and it really works and it's very nice to see that you can get this complicated structure and each one of these resonances has a duffing like response which is non-linear I'm going to skip over this propagation movie it's a nice simulation of how the multimode states evolve and walk inside this lattice but I want to show you something so this is work in progress I promised I'd show you some new stuff so this is unpublished and we're inspired by work that was done of course in traveling wave parametric amplifiers and published recently but also things with kinetic inductance and in general parametric amplification and Kazimir effects also from Chalmers and even going back to say older history stuff is measurements by the Wellef group of quadratures so the project is to do broadband itinerant two-mode squeezing so that's the bottom line and just reminding everyone that we have these sort of quadratures the I and Q which are you know the combination of creation annihilation operators in the single-mode representation and there's just standard uncertainty relations because it's an electric field and you have a resonant parametric amplifier that's what I showed you earlier and you can operate it in degenerate mode where you look at say half the frequency or you can look at off-resume signal idlers this is what I showed you earlier and actually from the quantum sense they should be squeezed and two minutes away so three-mode mixing is actually a more a better way to work because you have less background so you push the pump you have to add a DC bias but it works and for example classically characterizing this amplifier we get almost 60 dB of contrast between the stretched and the squeezed mode and that's kind of a world record for these things and if you start looking at single-mode and measure the I and Q of an ensemble then you see this nice squeezing and this of course is measured through a hemp amplifier chain so it's convoluted with noise but you see that like the blue stretched one is not significantly expanded actually it shouldn't be much narrow because there's the hemp width it should be very slightly narrower just a few percent so that's all the hard work of measuring a lot of data and very carefully fitting everything in order to check if it's really squeezed so in order to measure these wideband correlations there's a nice trick because it's exactly half the frequency you can use these nice room temperature frequency dividers this is for the experimentalist and then you can just with one IQ mixer 200 megahertz of bandwidth of squeezing just by doing Fourier transform on the heterodyne signal so you don't have to measure just one or two now of course if you want to go broader you need a faster acquisition card but at one gigasample you can see a nice bandwidth of squeezing and simultaneously over many modes and this is the raw data you know so here it's well it's clipped and this is the I plus and the I minus plus and minus are just signal and idler you know the plus frequency and the minus frequency around half the pump and so each mode is just thermal noise but the correlations are strong and in order to see this sort of squeezing the hemp amplifier adds about 30 photons of noise so it's a huge amount of squeezing to see it on a 30 photon smearing but there's a lot of squeezing going on here and so again because time is running out you have to really carefully calibrate everything you have to check you've overcome all the biases there's IQ asymmetries absorption asymmetries phase noise all kinds of drifts and again there's a nice quote Andreas posted that if theorists want to sound smart and impress their experimentalist friends they should ask them have you calibrated your IQ mixers and the answer is always not enough even if it's a commercial system with automatic aberrations we're never happy there's always more to do there okay there's beautiful tests for Gaussian states the Simon's theory of partially transposed modes and just to get to the bottom line we see even with very very conservative error bars including all systematics and having tested this for months and thermal scans we're convinced we see a very large multi-mode, two-mode squeeze state with at least 7 or 8 dB of squeezing and actually it's much more but we're limited we're being conservative in that statement and this is sort of like a correlation matrix so again skipping to the end it's a platform for collaborative sources, couplers and interactions it's an exciting time for microwave photonics and integration with single photon sources is definitely interesting it might open up again options for interesting hybrid systems because of its small dimensions the capacitance can be more effective inductance again there are interesting trade-offs you can think of it as sort of like an impedance transform to atomic systems better than before and the open issues are again these dielectrics, what's going on with quasi-particles and heating in these systems higher order harmonics, non-local effects, there's a lot to talk about and a lot more to do and thank you for your attention, sorry for stealing some of the coffee time thank you Nadev, we have no time for questions Yuan hi, great, thanks this is very interesting try how do you know that it's the dielectric loss, have you checked that's limiting you have I mean I think it's very likely true but have you checked the Q factor of resonators without the ground so because time was short we have a paper in which we just measured coplanar resonant structures and we saw Qs of 100,000 there and that is easily limited by surface preparation of our silicon and some residual stuff there and this was like with the dumbest process possible, you know you do a wet edge and you still get a Q of 300,000 low power, single photon level Q's, intrinsic Q's of 300,000, 150,000 depends on the frequency, we made a really long resonator so we were able to measure multi-mode starting from 170 megahertz all the way out to 5 gigahertz so we got a whole slew of these to measure their Q factor and that was and that convinced us the materials intrinsically pretty good and it was completely comparable with the same aluminum process, we made the same chip with the same physical design of aluminum and it had a different frequencies because of no kinetic inductance in the aluminum but the losses were about the same at the same frequency so again it's the material itself is pretty good I think we have a question in the chat, repeat it so from Thomas Ramos the question is in the setup with coupled microwave wave guides what are the possibilities to couple single photon non-linearities like two level systems so right now the two level systems fabricated two level systems like qubits are a natural implementation to couple into them but maybe atomic systems we'd still need some sort of resonant enhancement just running through the numbers it's still not enough to reach the limit in which photons travel through and you get enough of a field from a single photon to talk to a two level system at that level but with a resonant enhancement we think we can do very nice atomic system couplings we have some preliminary work with actually with all kinds of deposition of cold gases cold crystals growing on the substrate trying to couple them to these wave guides but nothing to show yet the numbers are interesting and different from what's been tried before as far as I know at some point you said that in the photonic devices you could reach the quantum limit I understand well that you can reach the quantum limit even with those electric losses yeah so that's a very important point you're saying wait you're losing all this stuff how can you still be quantum squeezed et cetera interesting because these are Gaussian states and things are being created along the propagation Gaussian states are more robust to loss and along with the fact that the states are not being created at the beginning but also at the end of the wave guide you can get enough squeezing for it to work so you can run through and actually we depreciate some theoretical support on these correlations of both multi-mode and lossy non-linearities et cetera to try and estimate what's the limit of squeezing we can achieve there so the experiments were sort of drove us to a low frequency regime where the losses are less impressive and we think that's ultimately what limits are squeezing you know if you had the classical squeezing of 60 dB 60 dB relative squeezing between the quadratures you should get that much quantum mechanically if it's quantum limited on order of so the losses are bringing it down significantly but hopefully we can push on that and better dielectrics are always something useful okay thank you very much for the very nice talk and for the question session yeah so thanks again I think it's now I think it's now time for coffee break and we should come back at


From Hollywood it's time now for Edmund O'Brien as Johnny dollars. Oh good. We'd like it a pencil Okay Eight o'clock That evening yeah, that part of it should be fun the fair one way including taxes Well just have it I guess superstition I don't like to presume. I'm going to get back from many of these trips I make that would really be asking for trouble Edmund O'Brien at another adventure of the man with the action-packed expense account America's fabulous freelance insurance Investigator yours truly Johnny dollar Expense account submitted by a special investigator Johnny dollar to Britannia life insurance company a Hartford, Connecticut The following is an accounting of expenditures during my investigation of the dated rocky matters Expense account item one four dollars and fifty cents transportation from Hartford to New York City Item two a dollar and twenty cents cab fare to the hiring hall of the National Maritime Union I talked with you on the phone mr. Richter dollar. Oh, yeah Well like I told you then your man is in San Juan del Sur or if he left we don't know about it I hope he's there. I've got plane reservations. I called the Edwards in line. That's the outfit He was sailing for I want to double-check on our records and theirs are the same You missed the sailing in San Juan del Sur they signed on a local man as far as Panama the ship was the Lyle Edwardson that's it. Can you give me anything that would help identify him? Well Here's his signature in his last job assignment card Can I keep this? No, I guess so sure See you Here's his membership book number one four six five four four All right, would you happen to have any photographs in your file? No, but the Coast Guard office would on his certificate of identification and certificate of service They'll both be in a file on him over there. Yeah, that's what I need. I wouldn't know if I did find him. I'll fix you up Uh Naturally, I'm curious you flying all the way down to that port. What do you want with this David Rocky? I'm telling me he just became a millionaire What? Well, and Rocky was a kid. He was adopted by a Titus Morgan in Boston wealthy man He just died leaving everything to Rocky and he'll like that a million and a half including fifty thousand and insurance That put me on the case Would you like to get some news like that? I don't think I could take it. Thanks a lot, Mr. That was nothing. Yeah, when you find this guy ask him if he can spare a few bucks for the seamen's home, will you? From the Coast Guard documents on David Rocky, I memorized his picture and the next morning I left New York Expense account item three two hundred ninety seven dollars fair and incidentals for the novel item four thirty five dollars a Charter plane I finally arranged for the next day. They put me in San Juan del Sur at three o'clock the next afternoon I Found hotel accommodations and then looked at the local office of David Rocky's last employers the Edwards and steamship lines Hello, my name is doll. I just arrived from Hartford, Connecticut My name is wall place and wall how they do Why on earth would anyone leave Hartford to come to a place like this? I'm an insurance investigator I was sent down here to find a seamen who sailed on one of your ships David Rocky Remember him. Oh, yes, certainly. I remember him. Did you say insurance investigator? That's right Why did you ask that? Why just wondered what you want with him? He has some money coming from a policy and in the state Oh, I Think I'd go back to Hartford, Mr. Dollar Why? David Rocky is not in a position to hear about money up in the state. Oh He's in jail He's being charged with murder. I See When did this happen? I'm afraid I don't have all the particulars the papers. They aren't famous here for accurate reporting But he missed his ship, you know, that was not quite two weeks ago. Yes, I haven't told that I believe the reason was a drinking bout and as a result of it this employee of ours and Icaraguan was killed That to death I believe why didn't anybody know about this in New York his union or your company things move very slowly down here You must be in contact with your New York office. My communications are of a purely business nature, Mr. Dollar I suppose that sounds rather inhumane. Yes, matter of fact, it does I This office handles many thousands of dollars each year for the company and I I have to protect this position You mean that's why you didn't report this trouble of Rocky and if I had it would have meant interference with the officials And that wouldn't have been good for you It would not one who wants to continue in business here doesn't interfere with the Guadalajara national It is both military and police and like in all countries. They have legal procedures I take it you haven't seen Rocky since he was arrested. No, I haven't and I hope you don't mind if I do I'll be blunt with you as long as the interference doesn't stem from this office I think it's highly in order. I wish you luck, Mr. Dollar, and I'd like to have you tell me how you come out I'm not as heartless as I sound. No sure sure just a good businessman Before I tackled them I learned what I could about the police setup in Nicaragua The Guardia had been organized originally by American Army and Marine officers a lot of what I dug up Would have been good news to criminals a couple of thousand men enforcing laws in the country about the size of New York State At least it looked like I find somebody who could speak English. I did but that was all there was in my favor You cannot talk to him. He's a prisoner and I will not have people talk to him. Why not sergeant Why don't you want me to see him? It's for me to say that is my order. You're an important man I understand that but there are some of them more important. What do you say? You're evidently used to dealing with people who are afraid of you. I don't have any reason to be afraid of you Important I do not understand and then feel I'm here under the proper papers They give me certain rights David Rocky was under papers to he has rights. They have a lawyer He does not want one. That's difficult to believe You think I lie. I think you'd better let me go see him. No He's a prisoner prisoner or not. He has a right to see me I'll go to the American consul in Managua if I have to you must know where he'll go to your superior officers You can't do this because of personal feeling sergeant You said ten minutes no more Thanks Maybe that'll be enough. I Came down from the states to find you that's a laugh. I know how these things go They haven't even heard about it up there. So why should anybody come looking for me Titus Morgan died? I'm sorry to hear that What does that have to do with it? He Left you a little money some insurance Company and wanted to find you so they could clear their books There's a fact. Yeah What about this murder charge? If you've been outside, you know more about it than I do. This is where I woke up and this is where I've been I don't know what's going on. What do you mean? This is where you woke up. I got drunk I don't remember getting here. You know about the murder John. Oh, yeah, they told me about that. What happened I don't know I drank too much Most seems like I got a Mickey Did you kill this guy Are you in the level certainly I am yeah, oh my wall of what I get a night That's my operating license my cards are inside Connecticut It's close to home Sorry, I was so suspicious But you could have been working for the police coming in here to give me some false hope and make me blab What about the killing? I don't remember. I don't know what happened His name was Sakasa. He was forming of the Longshoreman crew that loaded. I know that I like didn't have to stand watch that night So I went with him. I've done it before I knew him There were all these drinks at his place finally with his wife. I Remember midnight, but not much after that Except half remembering going to bed because I was so stiff. You went to bed there I'm not even sure that I think so. I don't remember going any place else and believe me I've been trying to what then I don't know almost like a nightmare I Can remember the police being there in the morning? I was here and that Sergeant Ortega won't tell me what's going on And let me see anybody. I don't even know how he was killed in stand He's lying on the floor in the middle of the front room. I wouldn't have any reason to kill a million.  Yeah, there was his wife as I said. What's her name? Misha Tell me about it. Well, there's nothing about her. She's cigars his wife after I met him. I met her I've made this port quite a few times and got to know him both Who else was with you two other men? One was Dave light. He was a crew member of the ship. So he's gone. The other is Chris Binstead He's in charge of the warehouses here for the Edwards and company Then there was a there was another girl Alicia. I don't know where she came from. I'll find out You're really gonna look into it Yeah, I don't see an American sitting here in a black cell without somebody helping him I won't say I've been praying but if I had been you'd sure be the answer to them. I'll let you know what I find out And mr. Morgan dying. That's right. It's a great man Wish I'd stay home I'll try to see you tomorrow night Hey, hey, let me out when the door clang shut behind me I realized the irony of the situation They air to a million and a half dollar fortune in a jail cell in Nicaragua without rights privileges or even light We will return you to the second act of yours truly Johnny dollar in just a moment Every Saturday night Americans from coast to coast play sing it again. Do you? Well, if you don't you don't know the fun and excitement you're missing Prizes galore plus a special jackpot prize if you can name the phantom voice So stay at home play at home on Saturday nights when over many of these same CBS stations Dan Seymour says it's sing it again Now with our star Edmund O'Brien we return you to the second act of yours truly Johnny dollar Don't trouble me no more. He told me he wouldn't have any reason to kill the man sergeant That's what he said that he doesn't remember killing him. That's what he said to and why he says he was drunk Yes, but he remembers other things like the police being there seems to me. He'd remember killing somebody Why do you think he tell the truth if he do remember it just seems to me that he was telling the truth You are too innocent, and you're maybe I'd like to know what you've got on them I do not understand. Well, what are you building your case on just the fact that he says he doesn't remember He says he'd have no reason to kill a miliano What motive are you using motive their wife? You mean there was something between Rocky and the wife to herself She's a cat and all men they are mice for her. All right, that's something wouldn't be enough in my country. No That's nothing but the vagus kind of Circumstantial evidence don't you have anything real the the murder weapon for example. It was no found What about the fatal wounds then what kind of a knife made them do you think it was a wide knife? There's a seamen rocky could have been carrying a knife, but it would have been a small one You think of that we search him. He did not have a knife. He pulled away. How do you know he threw it? He did not have it You believe in his lies. I tell you what the people say who were with him I don't want to hear your version of what they said. I'll talk to them myself No, you do not you do not in your fear as far as you're concerned. He's guilty until he can be proved innocent And you don't want anybody to try and do that. I don't try to stop me sergeant If you don't want your superiors on your neck you'll be in trouble too. You want careful My first move was to get a cable off the heart that advising the company of the situation and suggesting that the Titus Morgan estate and the lawyer to San Juan del Sur as quickly as possible By then it was 5 p.m. Through Clayton wall in the Edwardson office. I found the address of the Sagasa widow one in a section of houses that the Company had improved for their employees Mrs. Sagasa was an attractive unusually fair-skinned woman of maybe 23 or 4 Who was outside enjoying the moist wind of evening when I arrived she too spoke English The company thought me I work seems to be a good company does a lot for its San Juan people Sometimes I think it is good But then sometimes I think it would be better never to know any Americans But they bring me many presents from America David Rocky and who else the other sailor from the ship the one named David light Yes, that one too and one called Robert. What did your husband say about all these presents? They mine only sometimes he was angry He would say you are my wife. You don't take these things. I say yes, Emiliano I'm your wife and these things don't change that He would smile The angry about David Rocky You know he's in jail, aren't you? Did you see him killed your husband? No, I understand you were here. Yes, I was here with Alicia. We came out here It was hot inside and the men were still inside Dave light and rocky and your husband Yes, and there was one other wasn't it? What was his name? Binstead? Yes, Chris Did you hear anything from out here? All of them talking I think David Rocky thinks he remembers lying down while he was here. I think he stood up He was up when you came out of your house. Yes, I think it was Well There was a lot of rum. Yes, I know Have there been any trouble any arguments? No, I don't think don't you remember there was only trouble when Chris ran out Then Emiliano What did Chris say? Dave who only Dave could he have meant Dave light. I don't know was Dave light still in the house No, he was going to bring the guardia Look, it's very important that I learned all the truth about what happened The guardia have made up their minds that David Rocky killed your husband if he did he'll be punished But if he didn't that's got to be proved I came here to tell him that well that he had a new life to live David Rocky is a rich man in America now You know how much a million dollars is Well, it's it's more than you or your children or your grandchildren could ever spend here in San Juan David Rocky has more than that now He doesn't know I came here to tell him about it, but when I found out about your husband I didn't You understand now why I have to learn the truth, don't you? All right, and would you take me into your house and try to remember everything that happened Before you and Alicia went outside Another Edwardson ship had docked that evening and I found Chris Binstead on the wall Supervising the placement of the cargo that was screaming into the warehouse He didn't want to but he turned his job over to a helper and led me up some stairs to his office in the loft of the building I don't quite get your bin down here. You say Dave Rocky came into some money Yeah, a little from an insurance policy somebody in his family. He didn't have any family That's what I thought he never talked about having a home or anything Yeah, you get her to see him. Yeah, I saw him. It's a whale of a spot he's in. Yeah, I feel sorry for him But what else can you expect?  Yeah, and I don't want to see anything like that again What happened exactly? Well, the whole thing was that everybody had been drinking too much He passed out and laid down on a cot.  She had to go over and try to wake him up He said something that got her husband started. What do you mean started? Yeah, riled up, you know something personal So he goes over and dumps Rocky on the floor and tells him to get out and not come back Rocky hit him once and then went out in the kitchen got the knife came back Misha told me she was outside. Yeah, she was I sent both the women out when the trouble started She said there hadn't been any trouble She knows better than that Yeah, I guess so I can't see why she'd lie. I never figured them out any of Anyway, Rocky came back with a knife and they called each other some names and all of a sudden I was the miliano on the floor then what it was the end of it Went and told me sure what had happened Dave light went after the Gordy of what did you say to Misha?  Maybe I did say Dave, but I met Dave Rocky What are you pressing me for? Just trying to find out what happened. I told you what happened. How about this Dave light? How come he was able to climb aboard his ship and leave he reported the thing mr. Ward the main office talk to the Gordy and they let him go What is all this dollar you got the facts it was funny that David Rocky doesn't remember killing him Is that what he says he doesn't remember a man who does a thing like that when he's blind drunk is usually following his Subconscious mind that would mean that when he's sober he probably would have thought about killing a miliano So that would mean that the motive might be the elimination of the husband Now I can't figure a seaman who's here in San Juan only a few days at a time Even thinking of going to these links to get rid of Misha's husband What are you driving I tell him I'm thinking out loud I guess Why? That'd better be all I Guess you have to get back to work Yeah, okay Thanks a lot for seeing me It was cold black when I left and made my way on foot back to my hotel a message was waiting for me at the desk Please phone mr. Clayton wall You to call yes, mr. Wall. What is it the widow Mitchell came to my house She wanted to get in touch with you. It's funny. I gave him my hotel. You are out and she couldn't find you I'm maybe that's it. What does she want? She didn't tell me but she'll be at her house. I would like to have you come there All right, I'll go right over Don't come before me and I was busy asking questions. I thought Chris been said what he say Hard to tell the lies from the alcoholic confusion I don't understand it either me should Well, why'd you want to see me? I found a knife Where behind that? That chest I didn't touch it. Why wasn't it found before? How did you happen to find it? Now tell me the truth Misha you want to help David Rocky if I can help And don't say anything about finding the knife not to anybody. I don't tell you didn't tell mr. Wall He asked me but I don't tell all right leave it that way Don't say anything to anybody I slept after that almost the first sleep I'd had since I left New York the first thing the next morning I arranged for another charter plane to Monaco in it I sent the murder weapon and the only other thing I could think of that carried David Rocky's fingerprints My wallet that he'd held while I showed him my identification After a meal that passed for breakfast. I went back to see him I haven't going crazy in here. What have you found out? I'm not much some of it good some bad We'll have to wait till his afternoon to do any more seems like this is a hangover. I'm never gonna get over The times I hadn't been going crazy. I've been thinking to mr. Morgan How did he die? heart Wasn't very old I keep remembering what he said when I left that there were two worlds and that I was picking the wrong He adopted me and yeah, I talked to his lawyers, but I didn't get the whole story Doesn't make any difference I guess except that I could have made him a lot happier than I did He had a son of his own that got killed in an auto accident when he was 14 the mother too I didn't know that I was the same age and I'm supposed to take his son's place Mr. Morgan found me in a state home took me in Gave me everything put me through school high school Why did you leave him? Yes, I'd lived too long in the other world or something I always felt like an outsider And the war came along and I went into the merchant marine. How old are you now rocky 27? I went back after the war, but I wasn't cut out for it. I guess Took to see those and formal dinners and dames. I didn't understand Rest of the people who never seemed to say what they were thinking. They're funny though I tried because I knew mr. Morgan wanted me to It was just something rough in me that I couldn't hold down And there were a couple of things with these stuff shirts, you know fights Finally a few years back. I got up and left without saying anything to mr. Morgan. I got no sermon to preach I know it wasn't the way to do it He left me some insurance anyway How do you like that guy? Have you been thinking about the sagasa thing rocky? I've been trying. You can't remember any more. No Does it look bad? I can't tell about these other people. I wouldn't have killed him Misha's trouble. I know that but I wouldn't have killed him I didn't have any reason to It's been my approach, but I haven't proved anything with it You sit tight until I come back Oh here Rogers and cigarettes I got an answer that morning on my cable to Hartford the Morgan estate was sending a lawyer Then I waited until the middle of the afternoon when the charter plane came back from an aqua with the results of the fingerprint tests There was only one place to go Give me a straight story at the beginning rocky. Oh, what do you mean?  No, I swear. I don't I don't remember You mean that don't you I don't remember mr. Dollar. I don't remember Did I kill him? Didn't you ever think of getting sagasa out of the way? Yeah, he was in the way Did I kill him? I've been looking for evidence that would say you didn't What I found says you did What? Your fingerprints on the knife and no other fingerprint at all They couldn't have been faked There was only one way to get them there What? I'm sorry So am I I didn't mean to it. I had no reason to it Why did I things happen? I guess Could happen to anybody you who doesn't have any more sense than I do I got nobody to blame Nobody Expense account item five same as items three and four transportation back to Hartford item six miscellaneous $235 expense account total $840 and 75 cents remarks I'm sorry. The mission wasn't more successful The estate lawyer arrived before I left and although he wasn't familiar with nicaraguan courts He felt that David Rocky had a chance on a second degree murder plea None of us knew what the terms would be But we did know that a million and a half dollars was worth waiting for yours truly Johnny dollar Yours truly Johnny dollars stars Edmund O'Brien in the title role and is written by gill dowd with music by wilbur hatch Edmund O'Brien's latest picture is the paramount pictures production the redhead and the cowboy Featured in tonight's cast were lily and bioff bill conred Taller mcvay edgar barrier jane novello and jack moils Yours truly johnny dollar is produced and directed by heimei del valle This is dick cutting inviting you to join us next week at this time when edmund o'Brien returns as yours truly johnny dollar They're saturday night fun with a young married set when lucille ball and her favorite husband come along later this evening on most of these Same cbs stations You'll enjoy the laughs with lucille ball as she tries to help But more often hinders the man she calls my favorite husband And now stay tuned for von munro's caravan, which follows immediately over most of these same cbs stations This is cbs. We're hop along cassidy rides every saturday night the columbia broadcasting system