There was not enough physical intimacy but great sexual chemistry so there wasn't cuddling afterwards.  And I was like maybe at the time I thought I would like to find someone I could combine the two together but now I kind of think that was part of why it works so well. Today we're here to talk about how to not get f***ed by your f*** buddy and it features my OG f*** buddy, Jared Brady. Let's do it. As the name states which I got you that shirt so I'm very happy to see you wearing it. You did, you did, it feels good too.  Yeah that's true too. It is true yeah but there we go I still love you. I know you guys are listening right now and you want to hear more about how to have sex and not get attached but before we get into more about that here's a message for my sponsor Squarespace. It's a new year and the perfect time to remind you that now is the time to bring your next big idea to life and if you're going to do a big do it with the sponsor of this video Squarespace.  The reason why I thought this topic would be very pertinent right now is I was actually on a podcast talking about this yeah and this is a theory that I have let me know if you agree or disagree that because of the times that we're in right now so the IFS had this study that said that one in four single women have not had one sexual partner in the past two years so that's 25% of single people who are sexually active are deciding the past couple of years I'm not going to be sexually I'm chilling yeah furthermore I work with Bumble I have access to their stats yeah and they found that 53% of users were consciously single right now meaning they're like I am very happy with where I'm at right now I'm very happy by myself I am very happy not having a romantic partner right now I'm chilling so when I put those two things together I look at it like people because of the pandemic might still be figuring out their life they might have moved to a new city or move jobs or move visions whatever it is there a lot of changes happen and as a result partnership is not like at the top of their mind but I feel like we all have sexual needs of course you might come a time where you're like yeah I can't like invest my time and energy in a romantic partner but I could definitely make space on Tuesday at 11 p.m for someone to come by for 45 minutes or so yeah do your thing get it get getting on popping what do you think I'm for it you know as long as you know both people are mutually agreeing to this and like we all know what it is it's gonna be a good time and that's the thing is to make it a good time I feel like you have to be strategic with it right because you're basically recreationally engaging in something very addictive yeah and that can be hard to do yes but I think that in the past I have done it successfully I know that with you I definitely I'm not going to say that because to be honest with you this is where I kind of get caught up in my expertise on this my anecdotal expertise right that you were my first very successful foot buddy right but what's your metric yeah I was gonna say what's your metric because well I've had others in the past but what if what if we didn't full on get into a relationship I don't gauge our success on our progress okay I gauge our success on how pleasurable and reciprocal immutable that time period was and that's what I'm trying to give to other people a pathway yeah or a formula or some suggestions the comment section will also maybe have other people chime in what do you do to ensure that these compartmentalized relationships stay in their lane hey the f-boy playbook I'm just kidding step one step one selecting the right buddy that's tough it's tough only because I find that there's two things that come into to the tears of the toughness one finding somebody who's going to respect that honesty and I think that you're just a wild boy and so when I come into a new situation and I'm like hey I would love to just be fucking around and then most of the time what I would think the response would be would be like no I'm not even gonna do that um because there's society pressures on the man and there's society pressures on the woman the woman inside it's like you don't respect yourself if you're open to this and on the men's side is just you're just a fucking player if you want this and you have issues but finding that balance of like being honest without being judged and vice versa that to me is the magic of any relationship though yeah that there's billions of people on this planet and that you can find somebody who you're like I gel with you we're in the same place in life you know we're attracted to each other we have the same values with the same long-term goals our lifestyles are at least cooperative they don't have to be identical but at least they kind of work together we flow that's the whole point if you're honest yet it can be hard to find but that's what you're looking for yeah you're not setting someone up here's where it was difficult for me okay because I mentioned this to you many times before that I was very intentional about looking for a fuck buddy I think that's actually very helpful too I think when you get into a place where you're clear which is why I'm speaking to the people who are consciously single and who are saying I know I don't want a relationship because if you kind of want a relationship it's almost as if you're like oh man I really need a CEO but I'm going to hire a janitor for now yeah you're like I don't really need a janitor but I knew I just needed a janitor I needed a cleanup crew yeah that I was not in a position I was my immigration's on the fridge I was coming out of a not so great relationship I had a lot of healing to do I couldn't work legally at the time yeah I was not in a position to build with somebody but I did want physical pleasure it was hard for me to find that compatible person though do you think and this is just a question um do you think that we had a successful uh f-buddy relationship because you didn't see me as a potential mate yeah so is there is there something that maybe the other person has to have like some qualities that you know are not in your in your in your realm yeah it's kind of like because I think about it like if you thought somebody was great and you're having great sex would it be hard to you know not want more yeah I think everybody I say this I was auditioning people for the role of f-buddy and my auditioning process was just like have somebody over vibe with them make out receive pleasure I had a cut off point which I was very clear about on terms of like where I was willing to reciprocate I would always let friends know that I had somebody coming over and always create a space of accountability there is danger in doing that so people should be aware of that because I was always bringing people into my space yeah I never went to somebody else's space but yeah I was kind of doing this sort of okay let's just see if I feel like there's something there and I can't even think of anybody who I saw like potential in for more it was mostly that I didn't feel we had the sexual chemistry you and or just other people other people with you I had felt the sexual chemistry I did not feel you had the other compatibility yeah I did so I think that plays a role into it so step one feel fucked up and you'll be able to work no I'm just kidding no but choosing the right person is a real deal I think you have to also know engage that other person like can they handle this and and really ask that person have honest dialogue with that when I met you were you consciously looking for a consistent sexual partner I don't think I consciously was looking for that I think my lifestyle was looking for that and I think that even prior you like I had one-sided successful friends of benefits because there would always become there always come a point where either they wanted more or I wanted more but I think a lot of that had to do with I was very self-aware of where I was at in life so when I started like you know when you and I started having friends of benefits I knew that I wasn't a potential candidate so I didn't even like put you in the category in my head of like I have a chance with this woman it was like no take what you can get bro be grateful do good at your work and go home you know and if something arises out of that then that's cool but I think that helped me in that transfer was like knowing that I got some work to do and I'm not fit for a relationship right now and so when we actually got to start actually messing around I think that helped my help me manage my expectations step two so you found somebody we have great sexual chemistry with pretty much ends there sexually attracted to as well step two is what setting up some boundaries to really know that hey these are my triggers that make me get into relationship in or relationship mode and so for me it was I never slept over there wasn't like crazy in-depth conversations about life and things that would connect us on an emotional level and we really focused heavily on what is the sexual compatibility part I think for me yeah no I remember we talked very early on about our sexual fantasies like we came together in essence like how do we have the best sex possible yeah but we didn't talk about how do we be great partners for each other or even good friends for each other yeah and I really enjoyed that element of things I had some firsts with you very early on but I could think again because we were so intentional about like we're here to have really good sex together the boundaries thing was huge and I actually had the aha and the idea for this episode because I was on another podcast and I was talking about you know my desire to constantly assess if people are serving me or not and that like kind of cut off backdoor you can always leave mentality I used to have and the person was like oh yeah I guess you didn't have that with Jared at all even when you were fuck buddies I was like no no I majorly had it when we were fuck buddies I was always like was that a good time and is he getting better am I enjoying myself and I hit a place in our connection where there was not enough physical intimacy but great sexual chemistry so there wasn't cuddling afterwards so I mentioned to him after you and I would have sex I would leave and then go to another dude's house so I wasn't having sex with just to cuddle yeah and I was like maybe at the time I thought I would like to find someone I could combine the two together but now I kind of think that was part of why it works so well the thing that drawed us together was the sexual compatibility and then if you start other adding other blocks to that is where things get sticky here's the thing oxytocin which is the bonding hormone actually releases in its highest amount not in orgasm or during sex but in post-sex cuddling so by avoiding that with you and by taking that and cuddling with somebody else I wasn't forming you know other attachments to them so it was a way for me to like compartmentalize the two in a way that might have been difficult if I tried to combine them step three hey don't read into things that's hard to do you've had that response to every step this is hard I think I think we got lucky we got I don't think I got lucky I think I was very intentional and very mindful and I was lucky to find somebody who was in the same space and yeah the reason I that's not even luck to me because the reason I chose you as a sexual partner is because you were curious and open-minded yeah and as I always tell the story I knew you were going to be my fuck buddy because when I looked down at you when we were first fooling around you had the look of like a painter on your face or like a conductor like you were completely in tune like listening like you weren't thinking what's the next five things I'm so used to being with men in particular who are like what's the next step I'm supposed to do what's the next face I'm supposed to make what's next sound I'm supposed to stay like it was all very predictable but with you I was like no he's truly authentically present in the moment and responding to things as they are and I really liked that and I think that actually is reflective of how you were in the relationship and how you still are to this day but overall I think again going back to this podcast it was on it was like well you obviously have to care about your fuck buddy a little bit if you're going to be a good fuck buddy because you want them to get pleasure so that's an indicator that you actually have feelings for that person oof that's where people fall into the trap because what people don't really realize is that sex is an ego boost and a lot of times especially in the f-boy relationship oh f-boy I keep saying that that's not what I mean in an f-buddy relationship that person is coming into the relationship selfishly at some point they really only want this out of somebody and that's where it's at I know for me when I entered the relationship and I really wanted to be good in bed I was coming in wanting your pleasure to be a priority but not because I really wanted your pleasure to be the priority it was because I wanted to feel good about myself I also wanted to learn something and I wanted to just take in all the information that I could and please you to please my ego unfortunately I guess and the good thing is that you get pleasure as well yeah you know but if you read into that you might be thinking all these other guys are just in it for themselves and it's one guy takes really care about what I'm reacting to and he's focused on that he must care about me because he care about my pleasure but if you dive under that and go a little deeper he really cares about his ego yeah I think the same thing from my perspective was it wasn't so much that I cared about you but I cared about proving to myself that I could be a good sexual partner and I talked about this on my episode with kray how it's important to note that if you're not in practice of some doing something you're not going to be able to kill it when your time to perform really matters so if you're being a lackadaisical selfish partner when you meet the person who you actually want to impress because you want to further the intimacy and you want them to know that you care if you only ever looked out for yourself in the bedroom you're not going to magically know how to be in tune with somebody else so it's about taking the skills that you want for when you're in the big leagues yeah and doing that in the practice gym yeah so you were my practice gym and so I wanted to be really really good again not because like I foresaw that we would be where we are today but because I was like well shit I'm here anyways I might as well be as great as I possibly can be final step so you've now had a successful fuck buddy relationship round of applause it's worked out you guys have great sex you're prioritizing communication around what you like what you don't like you're challenging yourself to get better you're learning to that person you're not letting your ego take over and as furthermore your emotions aren't taking over yeah and it's making it a good time it shouldn't be hard to assess whether or not you have a successful fuck buddy relationship because you should just ask yourself do I feel good I'm around this person and when I'm not around them if the answer is yes to both it's great that's like I was talking to cray and he was like when people are around me they love it I'm like yeah but when they're not they hate it yeah so it's not a successful relationship it kind of has to be like all around when I'm not with you I reflect and I'm like that makes me happy yeah and when I'm with you I feel happy and then if I don't this is so compartmentalized and small it's very easy to find somebody else to just swap out yeah my criteria is not so vast where it's good like to find another you at this point would be yeah damn near impossible but to find a Jared Brady when I first met you at the time I could have found somebody else I had sexual compatibility with for sure so there was a swap out mentality there that happened yeah but what if you're in a place where it feels logical to further the intimacy I think it's just the same foundations that you guys came together with with the honesty should be there as well I think a lot of times kind of going back to your first point or the three points ago about not reading into something what people do is they think of it from their perspective so if I came and watered your plants some might deem that as you're furthering the intimacy now and now you want more than just an f-buddy relationship and so just being upfront with what you're feeling and how you're feeling is the best way to go because then you can know like all right I can let myself fall into this because we're on the same page or if the person's like no actually I watered your plants but that's that's it yeah we're not moving forward any other way I like where we are now and that's why you can go okay let me assess this should I continue this because now I kind of am in a space where I want somebody more I think that normalizing this as a healthy style of relating to somebody is a positive thing I think that early on in my sex educator career I was very negative about them yeah and I didn't think that they were possible I definitely think they were favorable especially for women but that's because all of my previous f-buddy relationships and ones that I often heard about so often where people wanted something from somebody they weren't getting it for some reason they had sex with that person maybe they didn't even totally want to not say that it was you know non-consensual but if they fell into a sex relationship with that person it was like ah we might as well just keep doing this because I already did it but the sex wasn't great and they left feeling like less because they were getting less than what they actually wanted from that person to begin with so for that reason I was like these are not positive but now based on the experience I had with you and based on talking to people who've had more positive experiences and then just reading more about the psychology of attachment and evolutionary psychology and why we attach to people and commitment structures I'm like it is very very possible yeah like you've mentioned all throughout it is difficult and difficult it's not a the right work because it makes it sound as if the relationship itself is hard the work you have to put in in terms of putting the parameters up finding the right person and then checking yourself that can be hard work but it can also be super super enjoyable and enriching yeah and and I'm struggling to come up with that analogy but it's kind of like we went to that we're like we went to that universal water world there's a lot of pyro and fire and jumping into water and doing some dangerous stunts and on the outside looking in you're like a average person probably can't do these stunts and they probably burn themselves to death or they fall but they know exactly their marks they know where to go and so if the they know that there's an explosion happening over here I have to be x amount of feet away to know that I'm not going to get burnt you'll feel the heat but you're not going to get burnt and so as just as long as you're going into the relationship with that knowing your boundaries and knowing where you need to stand so you don't get hit with that fire you'll be good are you smiling because you feel like you stuck the landing on this analogy no you really you really put your foot in that yeah yeah that's good I think we should end there okay I'll give you the last word all right deal you look great today do baby is that a compliment from you it's a compliment thank you beautiful thank you so it's 2022 and we are thrilled to continue our partnership with Squarespace a service that we've been using for the past four years so I used it to build my website I used to build my book website and recently Lauren used it to build her website Squarespace is user-friendly even for me who's not a coder I find it really easy to customize you have a beautiful template selection you have blogging tools and amazing in-depth analytics and if you have a mailing list look into switching over to Squarespace because it is way more cost-efficient and has more modern templates than other mailing list providers go to Squarespace.com slash Shamboody to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain again that is Squarespace.com slash Shamboody to get 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain


Hello and welcome to the CCTV Time Machine. This is a new program that we're kicking off here at CCTV in which we will take you back through our archive of over 40,000 programs dating back to 1984 and celebrate and reflect on the moments in those programs that capture the remarkable leadership and unique stories of our communities in Vermont. On this show, we'll invite some of the folks that are featured in these archives, some of which are behind us and many more of which are in closets and other parts of the CCTV studios, invite folks featured in those archives to look back with us, reflect on those moments in our community's history and talk about what's changed since then. So today, we're very lucky to be joined by Gay Symington. Thank you, Gay, for joining us. Gay is a leader in many ways throughout Vermont communities, including as a former Vermont legislator and speaker of the Vermont House. So, Gay, thank you so much for being here. You're welcome. Nice to be here. Awesome. So, okay, we're hopping into the Time Machine here, Gay. So, our first trip in the CCTV Time Machine, we're traveling back to 2005, just after the new year. It's the first day of the legislative session in Montpelier, and you were sworn in as speaker of the House that day. So, before we rev up the machine, pull up some of the footage here that we have. What comes to mind for you about that day, if anything, is anything you remember specifically? Well, that day was a blur, I'm sure. But just seeing some of the clip as you were practicing or getting this ready, I'm looking at people who worked incredibly hard. We had worked so hard as a team to regain the majority for the Democratic party that I was part of. So, to see John Tracy, who's speaking and introducing me, and imagine back that day when it was all ahead of us still, and he would lead the effort to reform how we paid for healthcare in Vermont, and to make sure everybody has access to healthcare. And then he became sort of head of Senator Leahy's team in the Vermont office. And there was a clip in passing of legislator then, Shep Smith, and Michael Boski, who had been speaker before me. So, it just took a lot of work for that day to come to pass when we could once again elect a Democratic speaker. And I was, you know, it was just a real team effort. So, it's cool to see some of those faces and hear those voices again. Yeah, you've seen about five seconds of the footage so far. You've already a lot of memories here. So, I'm looking forward to hopping in. Okay, are you ready to kind of travel back? Here we go. It's January 5th, 2005. We have some serious challenges ahead of us. We all know those. We need a speaker that has the dedication and the intellect to face these problems head on, that acknowledges the individual traits that we have, and we'll be able to bring them together so collectively we can bring out good public policy that will make life better for Vermonters. We need a speaker that has faith in the people that sent us here and trust in our abilities as individuals to work together to make life better. With those traits in mind and with the utmost confidence, it is an honor for me to put forth a nomination, the name of Gay Simonton, her speaker of the Vermont House of Representative. Reminiscent of our first cross-haul discussions, I have warned her of the impending headaches of a large majority, looming budgetary problems, and all the rest that she will encounter speaker. And for some strange reason, she still wants the job. I declare that Gay Simonton of Jericho has been elected speaker for the ensuing biennium. I, Gay Simonton, do solemnly swear that I will be true and faithful to the state of Vermont, to the state of Vermont, that I will support the Constitution of the United States of the United States. So help me God. So help me God. Congratulations. Today, you have given me a great honor to serve Vermont and to serve you as speaker. And I know that in electing me to serve as the speaker of the Vermont House, you have given me a gavel, not a crown. I accept this position as one of managing a conversation and doing that with respect, with mutual respect. Also, I would like to just remind you that it is not my job to decide whether you can speak, but rather when, and to manage the timing and the flow, as long as we all are all following the rules of the House. And so I'd like to suggest that we break the habit when you begin to speak of thanking the speaker, but rather just initiate your comments. In this House, power also comes from recognizing that our power is rooted in the trust of our voters. None of us wears a crown. Vermonters have asked us to use our power to strengthen our communities and our families and our businesses by finding a way to ensure that all Vermonters have access to healthcare, by setting a course that provides our homes and businesses safe and reliable energy, by improving the viability and strength and diversity of our rural economy. And by setting forward a budget that lives up to our responsibilities without asking our children to pay the bills for services and infrastructure that we want the benefit of today. Our work in this House requires that we reach outside ourselves, outside our individual experiences, beyond the distinctions that determine our differences and define our uniqueness, to find common values and to strengthen our state community. I am honored and grateful to have been elected to guide the House, to guide our work in this, the People's House. Thank you very, very much. I was, I, so putting this clip together and going through all the footage of your time in the House and your leadership game is really emotionally impactful for me and just made me really grateful for all the work that you did and the way that you approached that work. I know it's kind of bizarre to watch footage of yourself from a while ago, so I really appreciate you coming in and looking back with us. What emotions, what memories come up for you when you're revisiting that day? Well, it is a blur, but I, and it is the people to see, you know, as I mentioned, John Tracy, Carolyn Partridge, who I turned, you know, who I also hugged, she led, she was the majority leader. Floyd Nice was in that picture too as the assistant leader. And, you know, we had, we had big goals and we had worked really hard to try to change the, to be in a position of power. And so it was, it was just day of promise. And then the member from Orwell, who I'm embarrassed to say that I'm, we're getting his name, but he was a Republican and he took eternal grief for having seconded my nomination throughout the two years. But he was very gracious and I really appreciated the fact that there was, you know, that we were making a statement by having a Democrat and a Republican, you know, make those, make the nominations. I believe there was a third, but I'm not sure. So I won't speak for whether there was a progressive who also chimed in. But, you know, it was just a, it was, and then to see my children who are much older now, you know, and Deb Markowitz, who was, had been Secretary of State, but, and Deb had used that role and used her position of leadership to really encourage women throughout the state to run for office. There wasn't an organization that we now call Emerge at the time. And Deb really put a lot of effort into making the point that women really need to be invited into the state house and, I mean, to think of themselves in roles of leadership and to, and consider being in leadership. And so it was very meaningful to have her be the, you know, the, the Secretary of State to administer the oath of office. You know, I remember that very well. And it was packed, the state house was packed, you know. The previous time a woman had been speaker was, the or I was born, which was a long time ago. 1954, you know, Consuelo Bailey was the first woman speaker in Vermont. And, and the year that I was speaker, there were only two women speakers. I was one of only two in the whole country who were in the state house. So, and then my second term, there were six.  The speaker, the majority leader, the minority leader, the chairs of money committees, that feels familiar now, but it was not. So it was, it was an honor. Yeah. So we're in 2005. You have the chance to offer some advice to a gay who's just been sworn in, has a lot of work ahead of her. What would you, what advice would you offer? Well, I had offered myself advice at the time.  The title was speaker, but actually I, I mostly listened. You know, it was, it was mostly the members of the house who were speaking. And my role was to be a facilitator. So I would, again, use that advice of, you know, listen first and take a deep breath, which would be my father's advice to me. And, yeah, and it, yeah, I think that would still be my advice. Yeah. Your colleagues made the position of speaker sound very difficult, involves setting the table for a discussion and listening and sometimes setting aside maybe your perspective or in some ways the desires of the, you know, district of Vermonters that you represent in order to serve the whole state and set the table for conversations about statewide decisions and investments. How did you, how did you try to accomplish that? You know, did you have to kind of separate your own sort of opinions and, and perspectives as a legislator from the task of setting the table and, and, and sort of laying the tasks out for the, the state as a whole? Well, you can't disengage. You need to respond, you know, in your voting, I would need to respond to myself and look at myself in the mirror and be comfortable with votes. And, you know, I had my constituency of the three, at the time it was three towns that I represented and I had a party caucus to be responsive to and in that position I had the whole house. So, I mean, you know, it's, it's, I remember the, some of the hardest work of the speaker happens in the very first days of the session and there's a lot of power in the position, in the position of speaker in that that, in Vermont, that position is vested with assigning the, the committees and choosing the leadership of the committees. That's not the same in all states. And I, but that's a while it's a position, while it's vested in the position, I don't know of a speaker certainly I wasn't going to do that alone. You know, it's very much conferring with the minority leadership about the desires of their committees.  Do we have committees that's too dominated by one county or another? I know that I was very conscious of, I remember being conscious of being a Chittenden County leader and I had, and there were quite a few leaders who were from Chittenden County. Representative Heath of Appropriations, Representative Tracy, Health Care, Representative Anne Pugh in the Health and Human Services. There were others and so I was, and I was conscious about, you know, making sure that there was a balance and there were representatives from or rural parts of the state. And so, you know, that, anyway, there was, there's, that's, but that all got crunched, gets crunched into the very few first couple of days around the session. And then you need, you know, it's a matter of letting the committees do their work and being judicious about when you step in and say, hello. Do you remember what we promised? Does the speaker visit any, like when everybody goes off to their committees, where do you go? To my, to the speaker's office. And the speaker's office is where, you know, I would, as I recall, there were visitors to the state house would stop by the speaker's office. Certainly lobbyists wanted to understand, you know, where they're, what the process was and who they should speak to about the particular set of goals. There were a couple times when I'd appear at the door of a committee and, you know, the committee chair would go, oops, just a minute. But that was rare, you know. And mostly I was trying to figure out, you know, I'm getting this information from outside the room. I'd rather here, I'd rather, you know, get it. But I didn't, as I recall, sit in committee rooms. I wasn't a member of a policy committee. I was on the rules committee. Yeah, so. Right. It is. But, you know, and I also remember it could, you could feel isolated in the speaker's office. And there was a previous speaker, not, I think it was quite a few years before my time, had renovated the speaker's office and created a bathroom at the speaker's office. And I made a conscious choice to use the restroom, you know, down the hall, because it would allow me to walk through the cafeteria and run into people. And a lot happens in the bathrooms of legislators. They can find out a lot. That's good to know. Okay, so we have one more stop on the on the time machine journey here. We're going four to a few years to 2008. So you had a public access TV show that aired on CCTV. It was called Inside Your Statehouse. And we have all of those shows saved here at CCTV. So let's jump into one of those episodes, March 2008, I think. This is a show you hosted, which often featured your colleagues in the legislature to talk about bills that were moving forward. The episode that we're going to take a look at is a little bit different. You invited a group of legislative interns into your office to share what they were learning. So you're ready to take a look? Okay, great. So we have one more clip here. I'm Gaye Simington, and I'm Speaker of the Vermont House. This is a weekly taping that we do in my office in the Statehouse to help Vermonters have a view into their Statehouse and have a sense of some of what goes on in the Statehouse in Vermont. This is really your Statehouse. And I usually devote each of the half hour segments to one of the major topics that have been moving through. This week, I'm here lucky enough to be here with a bunch of young ladies who have been in the Statehouse, and throughout this session, they are all members of Girl Scouts, and they have been mentoring or shadowing different legislators in the House and the Senate, and learning about what's going on in the Statehouse and what happened, how state government works, and what some of its quirks are, and one of some of its characteristics that maybe we all don't learn in civics classes. And it's just, I think the reason I come back every year is because every year it gets bigger and bigger, it's expanding. The first year I was here, I think we had six times we were here, and this year we have much more than that, and next year it's constantly expanding, and this year we have to go to the UN, which is really big. And I'm sure next year it's going to be even bigger, especially with Carmel, and I'm just looking forward to it, that's why I really want to come back. Right, and like before going to the UN, I thought that gender inequality was completely based on like a person's own unwillingness or inability to fight back, and they were just kind of letting it happen to them, and then I went and I really got my eyes opened to everything that's going on, and it really inspired me because I know there's so many people out there, and then they're like, wait what, gender inequality? It's like no such thing, and now that I know it like really is a problem. It's interesting, that's great that it inspired you as opposed to made you frustrated. Right. Inspired you to really pay attention to it, and try to change things in my community, in my school, and in my community. Yeah, I think I realized Vermont's great, I mean we have a female speaker of the house, and we have the largest percent of females in the legislator, but then you look at states, I remember I was looking through the percents and I was joking with my mom, South Carolina has eight percent females, and I'm like if we could start this program in a state like South Carolina, then I mean we'd really make a difference, and I think as interns we really want to see it grow and expand to other states. So it's great to have you all in the state house to remind us that our obligations and our responsibilities go beyond just the here and now, but also the state budgets that you'll all be juggling when you're elected to serve in your communities in the state house. So thanks a lot for joining me today, and for being in the state house on a regular basis. It's great to have so many girls in the state house. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Okay, so that clip as I mentioned is a little bit irregular compared to the other shows that you typically have. We didn't want to get too in the weeds on some of the issues that you were talking about back in 2008, but this I think conversation exemplified a little bit of the conversation that you were thrown into as the second, you know, woman to be elected speaker, and you know, I know you mentioned some of the progress that's been made in pursuit of gender equity in our state's leadership since then, but you also mentioned that there's a lot left to do, you know, and yeah, I just wonder if this brings up any memories or reflections for you about the experience of being a woman in that position of power and how that experience has changed in the last 20 years? Well, yeah, I mean, it reminds me just again of that effort that so many, this was the Girl Scouts, it was a program they had initiated, and there were other times when women would come and sometimes it was women from other countries, you know, sometimes it was just a family or a mom, you know, it was just a very regular experience to have, to be stopped by a woman who was with her daughter and asked, could she introduce me to her daughter because, you know, it mattered for girls to see women in those roles, and you can't be what you can't see, you know, one of my mentors, Liz Benkowski, used to always say, and, you know, it just was true, and so, and, you know, Senator Doyle then of Washington County would often have students, he taught civics and history at Johnson State and college, which is no longer called that, but he would often bring his class into the State House, and, you know, and I would have the chance to meet with them, so it wasn't always girls only or exclusively women, but it was, it was very much a process, the speaker takes on a role of it in a way of being the ambassador for the state and welcoming people into the State House, and I found one of, you know, I worked hard to be, to help girls and young women see themselves in the roles of the State House, but also that it was important for people to recognize that they don't have to have been decided to be a politician in order to serve in the State House, you know, constantly people would say to me, and of both genders, I can't serve in this, I would never run for election because I don't like conflict, I don't like speaking in public, I don't, you know, I don't know enough, and they would have this long litany, and I would say back to them, one, the role of being in the legislature is mostly about listening and working one-on-one with people. It's not about pounding the table and making important speeches. I mean, certainly there are wonderful speeches that have been made, but it's in the State House, but it is mostly about finding common ground and listening really hard for that common ground and finding a path forward through differences, and if you, if that's, those are the reasons that you and others stay out of the State House or don't run for election, then who does that lead, leave for running for office? The people who do like conflict, the people who love to hear themselves speak, the people, you know, who think they have all the answers, is that who you want as your politicians? I don't think so. Those of us who are turned off by politics as usual, it really matters that we join the conversation and run for office, and so I often found myself in those kinds of conversations with people. Right, yeah, so you had this show and as I mentioned would have legislators on to kind of parse out a conversation that was happening at the State House.  I can't say that I remember. In terms of specifically, you know, speaking in this context, I think the conversation that we were mostly having was around healthcare, that would, you know, and clean energy. Those were, I think, of those as leading. I mean, certainly there were also issues about the rural economy, access to broadband. I mean, there are familiar issues, you know, because balancing the budget, but making sure all Vermonters had access to high quality healthcare was you know, was high on the list. And in that second clip in 2008, that was where we were moving towards advancing from civil unions to consider marriage equality. And I had appointed, we had appointed a commission on marriage at that point, Senator Shumlin, who was the President and Pro Tem of the Senate at the time. And I had made that appointment and begun the conversation to look at, you know, where was it that civil unions were falling short and not serving our LGBT, you know, Vermonters well. And, you know, the legislation wouldn't pass until 2009, but certainly the conversation had begun. And so there's, there's the headlines, conversations, healthcare, clean energy, climate change. But there are affordable housing, you know. And then there's also the beginning to set the table for conversations that really still need to, that we know still need to happen. Right. So you chose to have this show, or you invited folks on to talk about these issues, fast forwarding now back into 2023, we're in a very different media environment. Where, if at all, do you see these kinds of conversations or the current iteration of these conversations that were happening on this show that you had playing out now with respect to the issues, a lot of which are similar to the issues or the same that was the issues that you were working on.  You know, what do these conversations look like now? What takes the role of, because it's frankly as much as I would love for it to be, you know, a robust, you know, a lot of public access TV shows, it's not, the current speaker doesn't have a public access TV show. And so where do you see the, you know, the opportunity for those conversations to take place now? Yeah. Well, the current speaker helped me set up those conversations because she worked with me at the time in the speaker's office. So, yeah, it's, I don't know, you know, I'm not, I do have a Twitter account. I do follow conversations on Twitter. But part of why I had those shows was my nature. I was, I had been a policy wonk. And I, you know, I used to have Peter Frane, who was associated with CCTV, used to constantly, I don't know what the right verb is, but I argue comes to mind or mentor me or, you know, if he could he would have strangled me to say, what's the one thing, you know, what's the one thing and what's the, that you want to have happen. And I would say, and what's the one important message? And I'd say, Peter, you know, there's a lot. I can't boil it down. And I don't know that it should be boiled down to one thing. But Twitter does make you boil it down to one thing. So I think that, you know, people need to be drawn in and hear the breadth of conversation. And I think that happens sometimes it's still there. You can hear it sometimes on public radio, you know, or whatever we're supposed to Vermont public. And, but I also think it whatever is happening is in libraries, at general stores, you know, legislators set aside time to listen to before town meeting or on town meeting.  That's what they do on that whole town meeting week is a lot of listening back in communities and, and try to help and they put out, you know, newsletters. They're not, they do that to invite people in to say this is a little more about what we're thinking about and why I, and I'd love to hear what you have to say. You know, it's, it's people are busy. So it's hard for people to weigh in. But it does when they do it really does matter. And, and I also, I think that when we have issues that are, you know, we had dealt with civil unions, we were moving towards marriage equality before civil unions, there had been, you know, really tough votes about making sure that gay and lesbian homeowners could adopt, for example, and become parents. And civil unions built on that. And then marriage equality built on that. And then gender identity, you know, it's, those conversations need to keep coming and they can feel, you know, we can feel it, what matters in those cases, I think, is for Vermonters to share their, have the courage to share their personal story and for Vermonters to have the courage to listen to stories that are beyond their own experience and that their life experience and realize what, you know, why some of these issues matter to people whose lives are very different from theirs. And that's the kind of listening that legislators do and they, and, you know, finding forums for pulling people in is really important, pulling people into the conversation. And my concern with, you know, social media is it, it enables us to go into our separate camps and speak to an echo chamber as opposed to speaking to people whose life experience or just opinions differ from ours and do it in a way that's civil and so that we can listen, both listen and talk. And that's a tricky battle, you know, that's just tricky balance. It's tricky. We're thinking about it all the time here as well as we figure out how to set up conversations that enable, you know, good listening and dialogue without, without causing anyone to be harmed or perpetuating any sort of systemic violence which there is a lot out there. But great. Thank you so much, Gay, for coming on this sort of experimental episode of the CCTV time machine. I think that's going to wrap it up for this episode. So thank you for tuning in. We hope that you'll join us again next time as we sift through the CCTV archives and revisit the moments and stories that built our communities in Vermont. Thanks so much for watching and have a great night.


that's the stuff right there that's the stuff so i know i'm a little late uh to respond to all your comments from last week but i noticed some of you were still wondering about my oil leak and if it had been fixed almost almost i think we put uh we got a new service done one second here what's going on here we got a new service on the truck right new filters new uh seals and everything and it seemed to do a lot we also added lucas oil stabilizer into it uh this last trip and that seemed to have almost completely eradicated the leak so uh i'm pretty confident that the oil leak is nothing serious nothing too big and grand on scale i was talking to my friend troi whose channel used to be called halloween helmoth it's now called beyond 10 31 he makes amazing quality videos actually uh you guys should go check it out his link is down below in the description of all my videos it's also on the recommended section of my main page he has a amazing like adventure videos with his fiance on the weekends they go hiking up in the mountains of washington state in virgin columbia and throughout the week he makes videos every day he's been doing it for over 3000 days it's it's pretty crazy in a good way he's an awesome guy but he's a mechanic right and so i was talking about my truck and he right away without even asking him he's such a nice guy he went and uh researched it for me for free didn't even ask me for it i guess just my friendship in return is enough he's a really good guy and i we may have figured that it might be the uh the oil separator on the driver's side of the engine that could be getting gunked up like i said this is getting up like this is over six or getting close to 600 000 miles one million kilometers and uh those oil separators can get a little bit gunked up at that time this truck was running semi synthetic oil its whole life so you know it only needed an oil change whatever 55 000 miles or so it may have been done sooner than that or 55 000 kilometers however even if you wait that long in between services and have that long of an interval even though the oil is good for that long it's not always good for the oil separator and sometimes gunk uh can build up in the separator and he said once i uh hit a certain point it could have just you know dislodged something maybe and clogged up that filter so i'm thinking that might be the problem but seeing as the it seems to have corrected now and i'm not losing very much oil at all just like a couple of drips a day which is fantastic compared to what the the two gallons i got in a lost in a day that one week uh but i'm i'd have no white smoke coming out of my truck so i know that uh my piston rings are still doing all right right now because if they were going i would have a lot of white smoke coming out of the truck so i'm it's a learning experience right now right i'm more of a driver than a mechanic but i am learning as i go through my career and as things break and as i have to get them fixed i'm learning what things are so the next time it happens you know i can pass this knowledge on to maybe my kids one day or someone else or you guys yeah my youtube children no no let's not go with that let's not call you that that's weird and uh a lot of you know more about things than i do i'm i'm just gonna be humble and say that there that i i don't know everything about trucking i don't know everything about life i think i got a good grasp on some things i know i got a good grasp on other things but i still learn something new every day so uh when i teach you something or when i tell you something through my vlog here don't take it as fact especially you new drivers don't trust everything i say double check it okay double just to make sure i'm right it doesn't hurt even though i'm pretty confident that i'm right double check it anyways and i'm open to correction and learning if i'm wrong that's the only way you can learn you have to admit you are wrong we have to admit that things are different than you thought they were always keep an open mind and always keep the discussion open you you never want to shut down people who want to talk about things you may disagree with or tell you that you're wrong you never want to shut them down you want to hear them out hear why they think that way because if you don't listen to anybody nobody gets anywhere and you know there's some situations where if you don't let people speak and you don't let them use their words there's only one other thing that things escalate to i don't know that's why i i like hearing from you guys in the comment sections and i don't often remove comments not often because i want to hear what you guys say you know good or bad bad if you're just being an absolute douchebag in the comments yeah i'll probably remove it maybe you know block you from commenting in the future but for the most part i i like the interaction with you guys because i've learned a lot through my comment section just listening and reading and it sucks sometimes realizing you're wrong but it happens so double check what i say stress enough is if you want to do this experiment along with me and if you want to try saving money like this don't be an obstacle on the highway for other people make it easy for people to pass and if they can't get around you i would i would suggest you just go the speed limit until they have an opportunity to pass now slow down let them get around you and then continue on with your fuel saving speed there's nothing more annoying than when you're in a hurry and you're on a two lane highway and the speed limits a hundred kilometers an hour 60 miles an hour and there's somebody doing 90 or 55 in front of you and there's no chance to pass so frustrating i totally hear you on that i totally understand that i know you're already in the comment section it's probably yesterday already yelling at me not going to be in your way i promise if i see you behind me i'll i'll speed up i'll do a speed limit and i'll let you pass that's the only thing i ask and also like when you're on like high traffic highways like what is it interstate 62 60 interstate 60 which which interstate is that between like uh gary indiana and indianapolis 60 69 i don't have to look at it i haven't been on that highway in a while i used to go on it all the time all i remember from that highway is that it's a four lane interstate but it is packed with traffic so packed that bumper to bumper all the way from chicago to indianapolis pretty much especially during the busy times in those situations i wouldn't do 55 either i would do the speed limit otherwise you're you're messing up traffic behind you everyone's trying to get around you and there's so much volume of traffic you're just screwing things up then at that point that's not the time to uh do these kinds of experiments use your discretion let people pass some people will uh no doubt get upset that they had to you know move one of their fingers half an inch activate their turn signal and drag their rig all the way across into the passing lane and then all the way back in in front of you it's a lot of work for some steering wheel holders and they might get a little grumpy about having to go around you even if there's no other traffic on the road just ignore those guys just ignore them they're just angry at life all right it's not illegal to go a little slower than the speed limit it's just kind of annoying when you can't get past them totally agree with that but past medicine had already and we are eastbound which means the next thing we're going to cross is the border into the sketch one i'm going to stop in moose jaw later on today uh go to the gym there that's that same gym that we stopped at on the way west that little one remember but it has easy truck access i can park right in there a lot which i really like and go in there lift stuff up put it down and then we're going to continue we'll be in north dakota tonight to sleep we are all we're about seven hours from the border right now we're going to cross from north portals to sketch one into portal north dakota and make our way across i believe on highway two across north dakota through grand forks into minnesota through minnesota and into northern wisconsin where we have to deliver to eagle river wisconsin on monday to sketch one there probably know where i am maybe you need to see these signs first moose jaw just going to go around the corner here to uh our gym the same one we stopped at before i told you that already right stop here for a quick probably about an hour and then continue south towards portal north dakota to our border crossing they're already waiting for a while not waiting for me but the my paperwork is all cleared and i'm good to cross here too long i've gotten a pretty good routine already so that when i do stop at the gym i know what i'm doing i know what machines i'm looking for in 700 meters turn left on that your drive nope we're going this way mandy i usually have a pretty good idea of what i'm doing before i get in there so i'm not wasting time trying to figure out what's going on like when i first started i i was honest with you guys and i told you i didn't really have any idea what i'm doing but i'm getting to the point now where yeah i can be confident so yeah i know what i'm doing when i go in there i know what machines i'm looking for i know how to use them and i know what i want to achieve oh boy these guys all had to park right around this corner here right there making it just tight for me to get in here all right so we're gonna go and uh park in the same spot over there off to the right as we did last time just gotta turn around everything's so muddy right now because it's springtime the gym's just off to the left here it's hard to see with that sun glaring at us there oh yeah everything's so bumpy that felt good that felt good throw that up there that was a good workout chef yeah that felt good how was your time you have a good nap oh you're a good boy you know that you're a good boy do i smell a little sweaty yeah it's okay i'm gonna have a shower later okay we gotta get going whoo you always feel so good after a workout there's a dolphin's pumping i worked myself pretty hard this time i was i was proud of that workout i was happy with it so now oh i gotta get ready to cross the u.s to the u.s gotta get all my paperwork and ace manifest ready all right time to work we were here for just over an hour i find that's usually how long i spend in there unless if i want to do some cardio too spend so much time i have right we're not in any big rush but at the same time i don't want to drag my feet too much i still want to get there relatively early to go tour at the u.s border not sure what we're going to make it to tonight the internet here doesn't reach to the back corner of this parking lot so it was a very good day successful day i think i got just as far as i wanted to and we ended up using very little fuel and i'm fully loaded right up to my max weights and i used about as much fuel as i usually do driving empty this theory of mine and this experiment is working i just don't know if i'll have the time to do this all the time or i gotta weigh the benefits of taking more time out of my e-log as well right because if it takes me longer to get there that means there's less time on my e-log clock to make more money so it's a give and take you sort of decide for yourself either get there as fast as you can or try and save some fuel on the way and possibly not get as far i'm going to continue doing this tomorrow and see where we're at i'd like to do this for a full month wants to see what my what the difference is at the end of the month i'm just taking a walk into the store here gonna get myself ready for bed i'm tired i'm ready to ready to drop like a rock every time i go to the gym and work myself really hard like i did today i always sleep like a rock that night it's gonna be such a good sleep