Okay, we are going to continue with lecture seven today and finish it up and we're also including in that lecture eight which is really just a couple of things for me to say about salvation. So when you look online for the notes for these lectures, I combine them together. There is no longer a link to separate notes for lecture eight. Okay, so we were talking about neighboring group participation in ionization reactions and we had mentioned things like mustards where nitrogen lone pairs can assist in the ionization of leaving groups like chloride. We had talked about acetate groups bending over with lone pairs on carbonyls making five membered rings when they participate in the ionization and so instead of talking about lone pairs I want to shift over and talk about double bonds and when they can help groups to ionize away and I want to urge you to look for homo allyl groups when you look at ionization reactions and here's an example of that. Let's take a look at the rates for SN1 ionization, the loss of this to give a carbocation for these two types of norbornal systems. They look very similar. The only difference is that this one has a double bond here at this position and when you look at the relative rates for SN1 ionization to make a carbocation, when you have that double bond over there at the two, three position of the norbornal system, the rate is the relative rate, it looks a lot faster. Why is there this huge difference in rate for the ionization of this tosyloxie group over here? Obviously it has to do with the double bond and this is purely an example of something akin to neighboring group participation. It's sort of related to what we had over there with that nitrogen mustard except now this involves a double bond. Let me go ahead and draw out some explicit participation. I'll draw a little bit of arrow pushing to see what would happen if I did use that double bond to help push out the leaving group. What would we see happening here? I'll try to draw some of those structures that you would get and I hope you'll immediately see what's going on here to be something you're already familiar with. Now you can't tell from my arrow pushing which bond I'm forming which carbon atom I'm forming a bond to. You can't tell whether I'm forming a bond to here or here. So arbitrarily I'm going to make the carbocation end up at this position and why is that a special carbocation? It's got that amazing cyclopropyl carbinyl setup right here. These bonds in this three-membered ring are strained. They're donating in to that carbocation. So it's a great carbocation that should form that's stabilized in low on energy or conversely this pi bond is indeed helping to push out that leaving group and it buys you 100 billion fold in rate acceleration. And of course there's another resonance structure I could draw that would put the three-membered ring bond to here and leave the carbocation on top. So this is nothing more than forming a cyclopropyl carbinyl cation. It's just that we didn't have a cyclopropane in our starting material so maybe you didn't see that. When you look at the problem set that I just assigned you all over the place I have these tricks embedded in here because I'm counting on the fact that you're not good at seeing this. And so your job is to try to see that stuff. This is like Sudoku except instead of paying money to buy a Sudoku puzzle I'm giving you free puzzles to work on and you should be paying me money. For why don't I use it? Well this is a reaction we're breaking the tosyloxie group so that's no longer why don't I? Oh there's another resonance structure. Why didn't I just don't have the time. You can draw another resonance structure where this is bonded over here. This one? Oh no because this oxygen is no longer bonded to that carbon that's this is the cation that results from the ionization. Okay so what's another secret way that I've hidden this stuff in your problems? I'm going to ask you to compare the fates of two different and related substrates. This is not benzyl we would refer to this as homo-benzyl. Homo means you've got one extra carbon atom. So instead of having allyl if you have homo-allyl that means you have one extra carbon. This is not benzyl this is homo-benzyl there's an extra carbon atom in there. So let's try to imagine an SN1 ionization in the presence of formic acid is your solvent that's your nucleophile and your solvent we call that solvolicis and so let's imagine if we do a displacement reaction and what we're going to do is we're going to imagine what would happen if I put a C13 label right at that position? Right there is the benzylic position if I had a C13 label carbon 13. What I'll show you is that the end products here depend on the substituent on this aromatic ring. Really you get the same kind of phenethyl substituted product in both cases but you don't know that anything interesting has happened here until you do that C13 labeling experiment. If I label these with a C13 at the benzylic position the nitro group shows you that it's still there at the benzylic position didn't move anywhere nothing special but when I look at the substrate that has the methoxy group there what I find is that that label is now scrambled it's 50% C13 label here and 50% C13 labeling up there and so what's going on with this? Let me just be clear that that's a C13 label at that position. How can you get 50% scrambling at that position? Let's try to draw this out I'm going to draw the substrate in this I'm going to try to imagine what we would see if I looked at that edge on so I'll try to draw this sort of three dimensionally and so here's a picture of that aromatic benzene ring if we were to stand on the side of that and view that edge on and I'll draw that side chain substituent sticking off of here with the tosylate leaving group. So there's that benzene ring side on and if I look at the methoxy substituted system I should be reminded that there's a resonance structure that I can draw in which I engage the lone pairs on the oxygen atom so the lone pairs are nucleophilic we know that so let's draw a resonance structure of this I'll take these electrons right here and I'll donate them into the aromatic ring and I think you've probably done a lot of these types of resonance structures in order to explain the rates of electrophilic aromatic substitution why you favor ortho parasubstitution those are common concepts from sophomore organic chemistry. So when I draw the resonance structure for this hopefully it'll be totally clear why we're seeing this scrambling effect so now when I draw that resonance structure what I can see is that there's a in that resonance structure there's a carbanion located here at the position para to the methoxy group so here's the resonance structure and so you can see why for the methoxy substituted substrate but not for the nitro substituted substrate you can expect this kind of participation like that in other words the aromatic ring the electrons in the pi system of the aromatic ring can help to push out this leaving group and so the intermediate that you generate has this structure that at first looks insane and we call this particular ion not an arinium ion we call this a phenonium ion it's a well-known kind of intermediate this is called a phenonium ion intermediate there's 26 to 27 kilocalories per mole of ring strain in a three-membered ring but this is really just another cyclopropyl carbonyl it's that same kind of cyclopropyl carbonyl I can take that positive charge and roll it over here with a resonance structure and show that it's right next to those very nucleophilic cyclopropane bonds and there's another resonance structure where it's located right here on the other side next to the cyclopropane bond so that's a super stabilized kind of structure and so that's why it's in particular when you have this methoxy group here you really can easily form that type of phenonium ion which is really just a cyclopropyl carbonyl cation and so now when your nucleophile comes in of course you have no way to control whether the nucleophile is attacking the labeled carbon or the unlabeled carbon because these look pretty similar those two carbons there might be a slight isotope effect but it would also work for ortho that wasn't on the problem set was it okay so let's take a look at sigma bonds I don't even know what through space most molecules are mostly empty space electrons are very small so maybe everything is through space what I want to pay attention to here is the effects of conformation and medium sized rings and this is the idea we want to consider is well-aimed carbon hydrogen bonds ones that are poised I want to think about the ionization of tosylates in acetic acid so acetic acid is the solvent and it's the nucleophile in this reaction of course it's a boring transformation but these kinds of experiments really inform us about chemical structure and what I want to look at is how the rates vary as we vary the ring size if you change this ring size from 3 to 4 to 5 to 6 to 7 every kind of ring size in between what you find is that for some ring sizes this becomes much faster and so the question is why should that be faster for those particular sizes of rings so 11 membered rings aren't quite as fast 12 membered rings actually seem pretty normal like it's more closer to a 6 membered ring what's special about these types of ring sizes so in order to understand why you get this rate acceleration for these particular ring sizes we need to draw the confirmations of these kinds of rings and it's closely related the reasoning for this kind of rate of ionization is closely related for why it is so hard to cycle eyes to make 8, 9 and 10 membered rings so I'm going to start off by drawing what you would get if you had 2 chair rings used to each other we call this a decalin ring system it's a 10 carbon bicyclic ring system when you have 2 chairs fused that's called decalin and the first thing that I know here with decalin I'll draw the hydrogens at the bridgehead because it helps me to better see the confirmation of this molecule the first thing that I see is every and this is why chairs are so great every single carbon-carbon bond has a staggered orientation so if I draw a Newman projection for any one of the bonds looking down the axis of any one of these bonds what I would see is perfect staggering between these bonds that minimizes the amount of torsional strain in any system so this type of bicyclic system is perfect but what happens if I don't have this carbon-carbon bond in the middle what happens if I have 10 carbon atoms and no bond in the middle it will not be a comfortable situation so if you want you can just well I don't want to draw that bond in the middle I'm simply going to draw again this this decalin ring system but if I don't have a bond in the middle and I still have these hydrogens sticking straight up and straight down and everything else is perfectly staggered the question is where am I going to put these hydrogen atoms which now have to exist in the middle of that ring the problem is they're trying to exist in the same locations in space this is the confirmation that minimizes torsional strain and so now if I want to replace this carbon-carbon bond with two H's that's a problem and it's exactly this that makes it very hard to synthesize 10-membered rings through cyclization we call those bumping interactions between the two hydrogens we call those trans-annular interactions trans-annular means across the ring so they're bumping into each other and so if you take one of these groups down here and you replace this with a tassel group and you look at it at the ionization of that group the carbocation that exists in this ring actually ends up being stabilized by the electrons in the opposite CH bond I mean these are right in each other's faces and the electrons in the CH bond are reaching across the ring and donating into the antibonding orbitals they're in the cation and they're there in the starting materials and they're there in the transition state lowering the energy for ionization of the tassel group so having that extra electron density and my drawing doesn't do it justice you have to imagine this CH bond poised above the antibonding orbital ready to overlap so you can see the effects of even sigma bonds helping to assist in pushing out leaving groups any kind of donation of filled orbitals into unfilled orbitals is a stabilizing interaction okay so that's all we have to say about neighboring group participation with lone pairs with pi bonds and ultimately if the positioning is just right even sigma bonds can have that kind of effect yes no I mean my confirmation doesn't do justice to this I mean maybe if I put this maybe if I put this other H going downward I mean I again my drawing doesn't do my drawing doesn't allow you to see which of these CH bonds is poised best above sigma star okay so I had originally another lecture that had just a couple of things to it on salvation and it's not really a full lecture so you can consider this to be lecture eight but we just have a few things to say about salvation so I want you to think about the SN1 transition state for ionization of bromide from t butyl bromide in the transition state the bond distance the distance between bromide and carbon is getting longer you're starting to build up more partial positive charge on this carbon more partial negative charge on this carbon and in particular I want to look at the rates for this reaction as we change the solvent the relative rates actually the rate constants so we'll look initially at chloroform and then we'll compare that to formic acid and the rates of reaction in formic acid which is a reasonably polar solvent so if I assign a relative rate of 1 in chloroform for this ionization reaction it turns out that the rate in formic acid is substantially bigger and I want you to remember this difference in rates what if you could accelerate your Ph.D. by a factor of 200,000 right or what if you had to wait over the weekend for your reaction to finish I'm basically giving you a recipe for how to make your reactions faster there's something in here your reactions you don't have to suffer with the reaction conditions you find in the literature you can take basic concepts and apply them to how to make things faster why is this so much faster it has to do with this remember this Coulomb's law or this variant of the Coulomb's law where you say something about charge 1 times charge 2 divided by the distance between the charge but there's also another factor in there either permittivity or dielectric constant or some version of that that has to do with the polarity of the solvent the dielectric constant for the solvent how good is the solvent at screening charges so the charges can't see each other it takes energy to pull a minus charge away from a plus charge that's very very energetically costly to take a plus and a minus and pull them apart and if you could somehow decrease it so those charges couldn't see each other then you'd make it easier to pull the charges apart let's go ahead and take a look at some dielectric constants for some various solvents I'm going to give you a table here we're going to compare everything to the gas phase what's the dielectric constant for the gas phase it's not zero it can't be zero because if it's zero you'd be dividing by zero it's one it's nothing can be lower than that so if you think about nonpolar solvents that are similar to the gas phase hexane is a super nonpolar solvent most things don't dissolve in hexanes but if more things dissolve in hexanes and you wanted a nonpolar solvent you might be inclined to use that there's other solvents that aren't quite as nonpolar but are more commonly used ether diethyl ether has a dielectric constant of only four THF is more polar than ether tetrahedral furan but still it's sort of in this range where it's I wouldn't call that a nonpolar solvent but it's not very polar I would refer to hexanes and ether as nonpolar when somebody tells me nonpolar solvent those are the common types of solvents that use for chromatography or for extractions that you would think is something as nonpolar THF is just slightly polar enough where I wouldn't call it nonpolar dichloromethane also has a dipole moment and it's a polar solvent the two chlorine carbon bonds have dipoles associated with them and that's got about the same dielectric constant bulk dielectric constant as THF and now I'm going to show you a big jump to some common solvents I would refer to these as polar solvents methanol dimethyl formamide acetonitrile dimethyl sulfoxide and they all have dielectric constants are in this 30 to 40 range so I'll give you the numbers here 33 for methanol 37 for DMF acetonitrile and nitrile is 38 I never remember the exact numbers for these but I remember that the DMSO is more polar than the rest of those as a group I would consider all of these polar solvents and DMSO the most polar among them if I try to think about polar solvents to run my organic reactions in DMSO is probably about the most polar solvent that I know of to run reactions in except for one there's one other solvent that I don't have on this list that is the most polar of all water of course and it's totally in a different class here it's 78 so why don't you run more reactions like SN1 reactions in water well most things aren't soluble in water and of course water is reactive as well it's a nucleophile and an electrophile so that's why you don't use water more often okay so in other words if you change from the gas phase to DMSO you could expect things to be how much faster for an ionization reaction not 10 of just 50 if you go from 1 to 50 you can expect changes on the order of a factor of 50 what's up with that? That's a lot bigger than 30 or a factor of 40 or even a factor of 78 there must be something else involved here that's related to solvents it's not just this is an important part of why formic acid is faster but this dielectric constant thing can't be the whole story so why else might that ionization be so much faster in formic acid I'm going to redraw that transition state where this is where this T-butyl group is starting to become flat and that bromide is walking away and starting to pick up its negative charge if you're in formic acid formic acid is very powerful at hydrogen bonding so let me draw one of the and there's lone pairs on here I'll draw some of them let's just imagine some of those hydrogen bonds let me draw it in a different color so it really gets emphasized here's a hydrogen bond and if this is surrounded by formic acid molecules that can form very powerful hydrogen bonds to that bromide in a way it makes it a better leaving group importantly those hydrogen bonds are stabilizing the transition state as this bromine is starting to walk away as it's starting to walk away with its negative charge those hydrogen bonds are already there assisting they were there in the starting material they're there in the transition state they're definitely there when the Br minus is floating all around on its own helping to stabilize the Br minus so H bonds can stabilize the transition state and what you have to imagine is not just one hydrogen bond I won't draw the whole formic acid molecule here but you can imagine this thing surrounded by hydrogen bonds helping that to leave so the effects of polar solvents are partially due to dielectric constant but they're also due to very explicit effects that involve interactions between filled orbitals and unfilled orbitals like hydrogen bonds okay so I want you to be cautious well not overly cautious there's exceptions to this this idea that polar solvents lead to rate accelerations of course an SN2 reaction doesn't have this degree of reliance on dielectric this is what I'm really talking about here is SN1 reactions to make carbocations maybe I should just make this B of 3 Eth rate so of course you can distill that's a just it always baffles me it's a distillable liquid but it's a common source of boron trifluoride you put it into your reaction and it dissociates to give you a very powerful Lewis acid so there's a reversible dissociation of boron trifluoride Eth rate what's the effect of going to a what's the effect of polarity on this reaction so up above what we said is that if you have a polar solvent that it screens these charges as they're starting to pull away but in this case you're not making ions you start with an ion and you go to something that's neutral and so here polar solvents will decrease the rate of this ionization polar solvents will decrease the rate of that ionization because the polar solvents will stabilize the starting materials and destabilize the more and more you go in the transition state towards those two products so in most cases ionization leads to ions but here's a case where you start with ions or something that's ionic and you go to something that's neutral. Okay so let's look at some other explicit types of solvent effects like these formation of these formation of those hydrogen bonds so THF and dichloromethane have very similar dielectric constants just as a judge of solvent polarity but if you look at THF it's totally different from dichloromethane. Usually when you run reactions in dichloromethane and you add salts, potassium carbonate, sodium phosphate, they're totally insoluble in dichloromethane. They just sort of spin around at the bottom of your reaction flask as this white solid that doesn't do anything. If you put lithium bromide in THF it's totally soluble. It dissolves like it's dissolving in water and you can't justify that based on dielectric constant. The reason why that's true is because lithium is a second row atom and it wants eight electrons just like every other second row atom. So as many solvent molecules as you can fit around there, you will find them attached to THF. I'm just drawing two molecules here attached to THF. If I want to match the charges, if I leave the charges off those are dative bonds and if I want to have regular Lewis structure bonds I have to put a minus 2 on there. Maybe that'll make you uncomfortable but if you want you can just leave the bonds as data bonds and don't put a charge. So lithium will happily take four ligands on it in order to reach that octet. When you look up crystal structures of lithium-containing ions you generally see four bonds to lithium at least or the important thing is you see eight electrons around lithium. So lithium wants those electrons and we'll talk more about lithium and organolithium compounds and this desire to have extra bonds to lithium later. Let me do this over on this other board here because I think I'm going to need a little more room. I want to look at two different SN2 reactions in order to take alcohols and convert them into alkyl chloride. So let's imagine taking this asymmetric alcohol, there's a stereogenic center in here that allows us to keep track of what's going on and if you treat this with thynial chloride with SOCl2 you can replace the hydroxy group with chloride. Ultimately this kind of a reaction goes through a chlorosulfite ester. I'm not going to draw all the arrow pushing for that. I assume you've covered this at some point in your sophomore organic chemistry course. It's a lone pair on sulfur. It's not important for this reaction. Okay so you go through this chlorosulfite ester and then there's a chloride floating around that we've just displaced and I'm going to draw it right here and so when you use thynial chloride on secondary alcohols you generally get inversion of configuration. So what you get is the chloride that's got the opposite configuration because it displaces the leaving group with inversion. So this is just a simple SN2 reaction here. So you get inversion of configuration to get that final alkyl chloride. And now you can use that to make a grignard reagent or do whatever you're going to do with that. So now let me contrast this. Same starting material, same reagent. For whatever reason you decided to use dioxane for this reaction you get a different result. It turns out that in this case the dioxane actually acts as a nucleophile that displaces the chlorosulfite intermediate to give you an intermediate like this. Before the chloride can push out the chlorosulfite from the back there's already a dioxane molecule waiting right there and it displaces the chlorosulfite to give you this oxonium ion intermediate. So now when the chloride comes in finally the chloride makes its way to the other side of the molecule it's like oh I got beat out by the dioxane solvent. Now the chlorosulfite comes in and when it displaces still in SN2 reaction now you end up with an overall retention of configuration because this process involved a double displacement. You displace once in an SN2 reaction with a dioxane. You displace a second time with the chloride so the overall result is retention of configuration. Okay so these, this is an effective solvent. It's not dielectric constant. The solvent is actually participating in the reaction and you have to look out for that in a lot of different reactions. Benzene if your stuff is soluble then benzene. It depends on what your alcohol soluble is. It would be a common one. Well or nowadays toluene because benzene is toxic. Okay so why are solvent effects great? Solvent effects are the reason why chemists will not suddenly all be out of jobs, right? If it weren't for solvent effects just about every transition state and every intermediate we could draw into a computer and hit the button and do ab initio calculations on. Except for solvent effects. For solvents you have to know how the solvents are going to participate and draw them specifically in in every conceivable configuration. And nobody can do that. So electronic structure calculations. Every time you see somebody say oh I calculated this with 8 hard tree, Fox 631G star, B3 lip, LAN, LDZ. You know something like that. When you see electronic structure calculations they are virtually never taking solvent into account. And so these huge differences in reactivity that you can see with solvent factors of hundreds of thousands in rate those will all be absent. When you look at electronic structure calculations. Okay so that's the end of I guess lecture 7 slash 8. And that is the end of the material for the first exam. So when we come back on Monday we're going to start talking about displacements in addition to sigma star orbitals and that will not be on the exam that's on Wednesday. That's this is where we end for exam one material. Okay that's it. I'll see you guys. Enjoy your Friday.


My Muslim parents disowned me for converting to Christianity from Allah to Jesus by the channel Dennis Falcon The reason why I react to this video is not to mock the guy quite the opposite actually I come from a similar background just in reverse I come from an Orthodox Christian background My parents are Orthodox Christians and I accepted Islam Alhamdulillah And therefore I of course stand firm and believe that Islam is the truth and not Christianity but when it comes down to the parents part as I already said I can relate because at first when I accept Islam my friends broke off the contact completely and unfortunately to this very day I still haven't talked to my father therefore I can understand and sympathize a little bit when it comes down to the family dynamics not so much when it comes down to the religious dynamics after all


YouTube team keep it clean. What's going on the same grave in here with another video and in this video We got another episode of NFL questions from subscribers two questions that came from my boy team Raimi Shout out to my god team right either. He looked out big time, man So I appreciate your team Raimi. Thank you man. Thank you for what you did. I appreciate it a lot man but anyway The question for this video he asked two questions by the way man I and real quick just a side note. I was um, I just finished getting a haircut I felt so bad for it too and um, I parked right in front of this restaurant and I was in I was in the car getting ready to set up the stream and whatnot And this older lady or this lady who looked like she may be like 40 or 50 She came out of the restaurant with this lady who looks like she's about um, maybe 70 80 older lady They were coming out the restaurant and it's raining right now um, so it's wet outside whatever And they were coming out the restaurant And the older lady when she was stepping down on a curb. She showed it like slipped But she uh, she caught a balance because she held on to the um, she held on to the hood of my car so I guess the car did like a good deed for the day. Anyway Back to my boy team Raimi's question his questions Well, the first one let's let's not the first one out the way even though it's listed second on the title of the video Is this he asks is this the most anticipated preseason? in ravens history The most anticipated preseason in ravens team history. I would have to say yes um besides besides their first preseason when they first became a team But I would have to say yes besides then I would have to say yes because There's some seismic changes going on there's gonna be some big shifts going on soon And it's like we know that the changes are coming, but we just don't know when So there's so many questions that we have as ravens fans. There's so many questions that the media has Um, and we just we just want to know when We want to want we want to know when and we want to know how all of this stuff is going down So of course a lot of people are anticipating Lamar Jackson What's he gonna do? How's he gonna look the comeback of rg3?  Is he gonna make the team and then joe flacco Is joe flacco gonna be the joe flacco that they pay an artist money to is he gonna really earn that contract?  Guess what that's only the talk of the qb position We still got all these other positions left That's only the drama that surrounds the qb position So with that being said this has got to be one of the most anticipated pre-seasons in team history Because there's so much talking there's so much uncertainty just about one position alone And that's the quarterback position You got three high profile players at the quarterback position. This is the first time that the ravens ever had that So there's that um, and then his second question was sort of tricky one He said will Lamar Jackson Work out With the wide receivers Away from flacco will he work out with the wide receivers? separately from flacco will he do it before flacco does so But the way that he asked the question I should have got clarification on if he was asking this or not, but we'll go ahead and ask both But my question for him would it should have been I should have asked him I wasn't sure if he was going to be available or not Um, because he asked me will lamar jackson work out with wide receivers Before jo flacco does he didn't specify if he meant ravens wide receivers. He just said wide receivers So one let's answer both of those questions Um, well, we won't know the answer to the question because we don't know we If lamar jackson is to work out with wide receivers Yeah, the notifications always do that jldi. It's it's really annoying after seven never works never works never works Never works I could be streaming throughout the day put out videos throughout the day y'all will get them But once I stream or do a video after seven it won't work. Um, but anyway With lamar jackson if he Will will he work out with wide receivers uh separate from jo flacco That'll be telling if he does that and but that'll tell me a few different things Um, hopefully he'll be a part of the the jo jo flacco thing when jo flacco works with the wide receivers So they can all build chemistry all together um And if not then I would if he works out with his own wide receivers and starts working on his footwork his mechanics um, I think it It may help him a little bit But I don't know how much it would help because you're not working with the receivers that you are going to be playing with in the future Because like you can go play with your boys that went to louisville or whatnot. You can go uh throw passes to them And yeah, it can help you work on your footwork and whatnot, but if you want to work on your timing Uh, you want to work on just your chemistry with the guys that's on the team now You can't get that by working with somebody else who's not on the team You want to get the play calls down now you want them to know how you're going to call certain plays and How you're going to give certain looks to and whatnot and just to really get you guys, uh chemistry flowing You can't do that with somebody else who you're not going to be even playing with So for lamar jackson, I think with him um With him if he does work out with different wide receivers It'll be nice and it will show that he is trying to improve But that's big for him and if he does that in his rookie year And flacco is just doing this. This is not the first time he's done it But he hasn't done this consistently his entire career But um if if lamar if lamar jackson does that his rookie year that will um That'll say something man That'll say something, uh, but we'll see we'll see how it all goes down Now if he works with flacco Now no two questions. Will he work with the ravens receivers separately from flacco now that um That will be interesting Uh, now in that if he did something like that then I think that may Actually be a legitimate story where you could actually say there may be some friction Maybe But we'll see I mean it all depends on the schedules different people got different schedules and whatnot But I would think if he was going to take time while they have this time off to get with the receivers Then the perfect time would be when whenever who Whenever they meet up with flacco and whoever it is that meets up with flacco Uh, whenever they all meet up I'll feel like he should be there too if he's going to take the time And work with the ravens receivers and try to start working on timing and stuff with them. So But if he does it separately from flacco, that would be something That would be something now another question that my boy team raimi asked Is how would the front office look at that? How would the front office look at that now it just it just all depends on which situation it would be um No, I'm I'm it looks like I'm in the back seat Oh, I guess it does because the uh the seat is my seat is covered up No, I'm not in the I'm not in the back. I'm not in the back seat though, man. Um but if lamar jackson I think if the front if if lamar jackson worked with Different receivers than the ravens receivers. I think the front office would look at it like, okay That's nice. He's definitely taking the right steps But we just wish it was our own guys Now if he worked with the ravens receivers and it was with joe flacco They could be like, okay This really this dude is really trying to pick up every single thing about this team and about the offense and about being a quarterback But if he worked with the other receivers without joe flacco, then it could be like, hey man This dude is really looking to pick his game up and whatnot But as far as the team building chemistry, I don't we don't really like that So, I mean, we'll see though. We'll see though. We'll have those questions answered over the next month um Man these guys gonna be going till july. I think somebody told me it was july 18th.  That's smart But here's what it is. So I mean, we'll see what happens We got no choice but to wait and see and we are going to be waiting for a little while So we'll see how it goes. We are definitely anticipating this Anticipating flacco working with his guys. Maybe Lamar will join him. Maybe he won't and well, don't forget about rg3 2 Rg3 got to try to build some chemistry too He could do something No, I mean we don't want that but I mean, hey, who knows That's definitely we don't definitely don't want no news anybody getting hurt while we on this month vacation um, so That's that. But yeah, at least we know once um once this month is over Then this It's full speed ahead man Because once once the month is over, that's it training camp That's july august his preseason. We're back. We're back once this month is over. Um, so yeah Say what you just say he don't see us having three quarterbacks Well, I mean, I think we will That's stupid notification for the battery just came up on my phone But um, I think we will but the way that they trying to ramp up Lamar Jackson. I don't know man Well, I said I said that yesterday um, just the way that they They really trying to get this dude um Get them to know the system and whatnot and how they they hadn't run into practice yesterday and whatnot and I just think just hearing everything about what they're saying about them and whatnot I think it just it says a lot man. We'll see how it goes training camp though because we we got a little wild man We got a little wild So anyway appreciate y'all team rain team ramy big shout out to you appreciate you Um, and again if y'all want to be part of nfl questions from soaps, you already know what to do I'm out. I will see you guys later on. I love you. I'm going


Yeah, yeah. All right, everyone. My name is Romeo von Herman and welcome to the ward eight. NPA meeting for April the 27th 2023. And I'm going to be today's facilitator for this meeting. I do have Keith with me as well here, Hannah. And myself and Sam in the room. We're going to go through the introduction announcement process right now. So I'm going to start that with myself and then we'll probably just go in a clockwise. My name is Romney. I work for Green Mountain transit. I was the station's customer service supervisor. I am also a member of the steering committee for ward eight NPA. And I'm glad to be here and ready to discuss the business of the day. And expert. I'm Keith. I live on university terrace. And I'm a member of the ward eight steering committee. Hi, everyone. I'm Hannah King. I live on college street and I'm the ward eight city counselor. I'll jump in. I'm Bill. I'm on the steering committee, but I'm out of COVID. Rehabilitation. So Keith and running the money. I'll be. I'm sure I'll jump in. I live on Bradley street. I am Dick grab. I live on hunger for. Taurus. And I'm a resident. I'm Linda. And I also live on hunger for terrorists and. Just attending the meeting. Thanks to everyone for organizing. Gary. Gary golden on the. East district school commissioner. Towards one and eight. And you can go ahead. Hi, my name's Emma. I'm just here and Tim is on vacation. So he can't make it. All right. And that concludes the introduction part of the meeting. I don't have any personal announcement to make, but anybody who has an announcement to make can go ahead now. If you haven't any announcement. Okay. We will move forward. And as always, we will go with ward eight residents to have their say. And. Before I say anything, I'm extending the floor to any ward eight to. Speak this time. And get the first opportunity to speak in the meeting. Anybody wants to take the opportunity to speak from ward eight. Linda, were you saying something? Okay. I'll just go ahead. Sorry. Thanks. Oh, no, that's okay. Oh, that's all right. Thank you, Linda. I saw an article regarding the pods. This week, and I thought it was worth mentioning in this meeting. Where the residents were having concern regarding. Safety issues as well as the neighbors were. Having concern with all the noises and all the. Folks that actually don't live on the pods that show up, although in the middle of the night. And are creating very unsafe situation for the folks that are living in there that are trying to get some help. And members of the neighbors spoke to the folks that live in there. Try to find out what is going on. And the folks that do live in there said that, you know, it's not them necessarily. It's just folks that are coming in, trying to either sell something or trying to connect with somebody who lives there. Who end up overstaying their time around the pods. So all in all, hopefully we'll have maybe someday somebody just kind of give us update on that. But, but that's something that I thought it's worth mentioning. Yeah, that's for me for now. I guess I feel like I should say something. I just came from watching channel three news and the announcement that the university medical center has opened up. Housing units in South Burlington for staff. For their staff. And that's, that's a great idea. But I think it's a real lost opportunity for our, for our district to not house those people. They make great neighbors and hopefully they will walk to work, but I suspect that they may not be able to all the time. And so we will have some more traffic from those people walk coming in from South Burlington. Again, I think it's a, for an issue for our district where we continue to allow the university to use our housing for to house its students, yet staff at the hospital and at the university and the graduate students that are going to be coming in this summer are not going to be able to find available housing. Because it's because June 1st, it'll all be occupied by the new set of undergraduate students that will be moving in. This is Bill church with respect to housing. I had a brief conversation with Bruce Baker. Who is, I believe there's been a, he's got a plan to develop the old YMCA and he's asked to appear at the steering committee in ward eight next month. To present that plan. Apparently the, there was an issue of the homeless people had been, were able to break into it. And there were up to 20 or 30 people living in there. I think that they've, the police has been, have been involved in moving them out. We know that when you walk by there, it can be in pretty rough shape sometimes, but there is apparently a plan. Which is being promoted. And Bruce is going to try to come next meeting to talk about that. And that's basically what I know, all I know about that, but that would be a big help for ward eight. If that property could be rehabilitated somewhat. Thank you. Thank you, Bill. You want me to give updates? Yeah, we'll come to you. All right. So if nobody has any, anything for ward eight. We will move on to. Gary golden to give us any update he might have. Gary. Thanks Romeo. So a couple of things happening at the, at the schools. The. Search has concluded for the new BHS principle. So that person's name and bio will be released next week after the vote Tuesday night. Several really good candidates that we could have gone with any of them. So we were really there at the end. Sort of luck out on who stepped forward. Lots of experience, lots of. Good connections were made during the visits. The second set of candidates. The two of them showed up or were. At BHS on the 13th two weeks ago, toured met with students and staff. And both came away with good reviews. They both spoke that night. For broadcasted webcast. So we were able to do that. And answer the same set of questions. That all went well as, as well. So. That's happening. Going well. There are some. Staff changes that are happening. Throughout the district with a couple of. Administrators. Leaving their posts, but. Probably two will be moving within the district. I'll be coming best. Some of that's been notified to the school. Some hasn't. So. I'll be posting tomorrow, front page form. And I'll. Do links to the information when it's available. Through that source. Construction is moving on. And going well. We had a second vote for. Contracts last week. And we're. Going to move on. Just slightly over budget, but within the contingency funding. So we're doing well for that. We've probably seen notices that the. Our ability to move into the building has been delayed into. The fall and winter of 2025. Rather than summer of 2025. Mostly due to the. Lawsuits. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. We had to give Monsanto. Their own experts to come in. And do. To assess. What has happened. If you're. Do you have access to WCAX? They're running a series about. How the high school. Situation happened. I think tonight was Dr. Levine. Basically have. I haven't watched it yet. Having to defend. The. State Board of Health. I think we've seen. A lot of things happening around and timing. Around getting the school district notice about the change of. Standards that we've gotten it earlier. We might have. Changed some of the. Some of what we did, but for the most part, a lot of the building was. Beyond use. Especially the tech center part. It was not going to be remediated. Really. Extravagant cost. And it was due for remake. It was due for. 21st century skills, not 20th century skills. So. I think it was time to be able to. Redo that. And. Really make some plans for. Upgrading. What's offered. Other than that. Also, though, there was a presentation about the new reading. Program. I'll be posting tomorrow. It's about page four. Read some of that. And then we're going to do. The new. The new phonics based reading program. We heard from. Three of the. Integrated art staff who use it regularly and. Talk about the advantages that this new program has. Too early to get. Too much data, but. Everything looks good so far. Several schools have showed really good progress with it. You really need a couple of years to. You know, You can get this actually it's students included. Getting them trained on how to use the program to their benefit as well. And to get a comfort with it. So that's what's happening right now. Be willing to ask her. You know, address any questions you have. Bill, let me start first. I attended the homeless. Alliance meeting. Earlier in the month and. We were there. We were there presenting and. We'll be looking at some partnerships. Kind of. Look at what's needed and share resources in the future. It's going to be a. Progression of. Planning that's going to happen because, you know, budgets have passed. We'll just have to figure out what existing resources we can bring to bear. So, you know, We've had a lot of coordination. In our case, when I worked in the district. 20 or 15 years ago. What I saw in the North end was a sort of a progression. Not progression. As people. Lost housing in one area. Like the old North and they moved to Milton. Or they would.  So it really was. Kind of a transient community within a. Stable community. So we really should be working with those other districts to try to. Figure out how to. Assist, you know, these families who find themselves in these really dire situation. So I'll keep you posted. The next homeless alliance meeting. I think it's going to take place next Thursday at nine o'clock and talking. Bring back. I'd like to attend. So now a question. Anything I can address. Yeah, Gary. This is Bill. Thanks for the update on that. I. I would like to talk with you more about that offline and I will try to. Attend next Thursday. With respect. With respect to the principal. Generally. Without getting into details of the each of any candidate. I think it's going to be. A set of criteria. Which the school board. Is looking for. Individual, right? It could be, they want an advanced degree. They want. Areas of specialty or something. Can you share. What the. The objective for the hiring was at the school board level. You know, it never is easy. It's just the best candidate. There's, there's an objective they're trying to fill, right? Yeah, it's a, I mean, Keith can speak to this too as a former school board member. In this case, it's. They're, they're having to deal with a, you know, The downtown campus is just, you know, kids will be able to brag to their kids and grandkids. I attended, you know, high school in a mall. So their kids may not know what malls are at that point. Who knows. So that. It self presents a certain. A set of issues. So you're looking for somebody with flexibility. Somebody who can think on their feet. Somebody can deal with. Just the situations that that's not built. To do school in. So that's one piece. The, we are looking for somebody with. Good experience. We were very fortunate. The last three candidates standing. They're all either. Former principals. One's a superintendent. And in the area. And one's an assistant principal down the Hanover high school, which is a dual state. School. So they have Vermont students from Norwich. So that's helpful. They're all three familiar with Vermont. Regulations. With how Vermont does business, which is really. You know, something that's been the downfall of. The, the, the, the. The, the, the, the recent. Administrators. So. And parts. And then also, you know, we have them. Probably the most unique school. And Vermont. With our large, global majority population. Really talking about. Something that. Very few other schools. Are dealing with. who can come to that issue with some knowledge, some empathy and sensitivity, because there's a whole different set of issues for many in that population. Many are coming from very traumatic settings, coming in some cases straight from camps in either Africa or stop-off stops in Europe or other places as they're waiting for sponsors. So many of them have ongoing trauma that needs to be addressed. Your administrators need to be knowledgeable about how to deal with that. And then it's really our passion for deep learning. That's one of those strategic goals that the board has set up and that Flanagan is in total agreement with and speaks to quite often. So you're not just looking for getting by on test, you're not just looking for passing, you're really looking for engagement for your students to become lifelong learners. And that's a whole different process than the stand-in-the-liver teaching that's happened for 100 years in the US. So those are some of the things that we're looking for. In this case, we're very fortunate the superintendent had been of, that was a candidate had been of the principal down Harwood for seven years and was there during that horrific car crash that took five students. So, you know, she brings a wealth of knowledge. Deb Oprey from Hanover is assistant principal there, has served schools in Vermont. She brings an awareness of the black and students of color issues feels very comfortable with that. Marlon from Spalding principal there this last year and has experienced in the S. Westford district. So they're all pretty connected to us. They all bring, you know, the necessary credentials, experience. It really was a wealth of great candidates that I think Tom and the advisory council committees have done a good job of weaning through references and interviews. And it'll be, I think, a great presentation Tuesday night as we learn more about the candidate that Tom has and the council has come up with. So if you want to, I think that'll be early in the agenda Tuesday night if you want to zoom in for that. Any discussion of where they think they're going to live in Burlington? Do they have to live in Burlington? Well, though, I think our former superintendent has made that an ongoing, this is what you need to do. In the past, there's inflexibility like when Jeannie Collins or other administrators have come on, there's an exception that they already lived in the area. So Jeannie lived in Shelburne, made sense for her to be able to just be wavered because of that. But certainly if you're moving into area, the expectation is you're going to move into Burlington and your kids are going to go to Burlington schools. And I haven't heard that said explicitly, but like in Amy Rex's case from Milton, there may be an exception on not sure where she lives, but she may probably already lives in the county because she works there. But if the other two or one of them is the final candidate, I think the expectation would be they live in Burlington, be a taxpayer in Burlington, be a consumer in Burlington with children that they have children attending the schools. Good question. Thank you. Anybody else? Gary, do we have any clarification as to whether we're going to receive some money from the state for the rebuilding of our high school? Do we know how much that money might be? Yeah, 15 million is still on the table through Martine Gulick's efforts. I think if you read her latest front porch four and you'll get as the news that I have, I think the state money is going to be tied up with, you know, if they give us the money we're requesting almost drains what's in the fund currently. So it's going to have to be new legislation. If they give us the funding, they're establishing a standard for everybody else's request can be and what will be honored. I mean, I have thoughts that I'm trying to be relating to Martine about, I think it should be based on severity. I think it should be based on per capita. I mean, we have over 900 students that are affected by this construction, this cost, you know, and you're not even getting into that a lot of that cost and sort of caused by the states dragging their feet to get new regs put out. That's just not going to come into play. The legislature is not going to take that into consideration but we have to go back to some form of state provided school construction money. Problem is, where's that money come from? There are no pools of money sitting up there waiting to be tapped. So something else is going to suffer and that's where the legislature has their problem. They just don't know, I think it's a federal response and I think that's who we're going to miss Senator Leahy because he could tap that kind of money. Senator Sanders is next up, you know, with seniority. I think we have to start looking at money from there. Monsanto, I think has a couple of outs. I'm not sure how that's going to go but that will play itself out over years. They're not going to, they will not go silently into the night. They're going to fight this new through the nail because everyone's affected by this problem. And what I've seen is they will say that this is more because of our department of health than it is their product. Should be interesting, it's going to be a fight. All right, Gary. Thank you very much for the update. We're going to move on to our city council. Thank you. You're welcome. We have Hanuking here in our presence. So Hanuk, go ahead. I'll keep it brief so we can stay on schedule but we had our first official meeting of the new council a couple of weeks ago, we had two work sessions. I just looked at community infrastructure projects funded by ARPA as well as the Moran plant. And then we got a livable wage report from the city. So pretty light meeting. We're going to be meeting on Monday and big things are there's a resolution in support of dedicating the airport to Senator Leahy as well as a presentation on the neighborhood code. So looking at zoning changes and there is a board of finance meeting before it that will look at adding a new position to the police department. And so that will just be a discussion and that's kind of everything. Thank you, Hannah, for the update. We're a little bit ahead of time but I'm going to just go ahead and move on to Linda. Go ahead, please. Just a quick question for Hannah.  Yeah, so I serve on CDNR, HR and TUC. And so CDNR met for the first time tonight and we looked at our big discussion was looking at changing the camping policy. That's kind of been a big thing that's been going on for the last couple of months looking at public camping. This was just trying to build a resolution that essentially will send the policy back to CEDO so that way they can do more research on it. So no big changes there. Oh, sorry. So HRs look like you work with city employees and they're meeting tomorrow and we're just looking at policies about city employees and that will be the first time we're meeting. TUC is Transportation Energy and Utilities. We're meeting in May. We don't have the agenda for that yet. And then CDNR is Community Development and Neighborhood Revitalization. Thank you, Hannah. Anybody else that have a question for Hannah, please go ahead. All right, seeing none. I'm gonna go ahead with an update that I wanted to provide the ward 8 NPA. Are we talking, sorry, are we talking, are we gonna do the YMCA? Oh no, we're not gonna do the YMCA or the library. Can I do an update then about the Y? So I've had quite a few folks reach out to me that live in the Y's neighborhood about the traffic and parking situation. And so I don't know, I don't think anyone on this call has reached out, but I know that there are Bradley Street folks and hunger for tourists folks that have and I'm working with the city and the Y to try to figure out a plan if we can somehow change what the parking requirements are and traffic there, which would hopefully lighten the load and stress on the neighborhood. Kyle Dotson who runs the Y has agreed to do a listening session with neighbors if you're interested in that. And so him and I could do that together at an NPA if we think that would be helpful to kind of brainstorm ideas and figure out ways to improve that. But that's the Y update that I had. Thank you, Hannah. I just have to report that Mary Danco did respond to our request to me tonight. And unfortunately at the last minute she had to go out of town, but she is really excited about being asked back next month. So she will talk to us about the library next month if we want to have that. Thank you Keith as well. All right. And if there's any additional questions or statements regarding the YMCA of library we're happy to take any from anybody as well. All right. Seeing none, we'll move on to the next item of the agenda which is the update from the police commission for this month of April that we're still in. I attended one of them. I haven't had a chance to attend the other one but I looked at the agenda that was on file on their website, the police commission and it more or less encompassed what they've discussed the prior meeting in this month of April which pretty much covered the department directives for fair and partial policing reviewed. The Burlington police department adopted cultural sensitivity training as well as additional language for the police public communication section. The Maya Scholls president of NA NA NA NAACP for Rutland rather spoke to the training materials that the police department here in Burlington uses and the need for the police to be held accountable statewide. Jeffrey, former African-American Vermont state police officer shared his experience during this meeting that the department and how PDP Brown to police department needs to seize the moment as well as any changes in the recommendation under the policy section such as gender, gender identity, sexual orientation, those definitions within department training policies. Public forum was extended which I spoke to the need for the Burlington police department to expedite the hiring of public engagement and community officer and why that is important to the department to have that so they have somebody who's from the community that can help rebuild the trust between the department and department unions as well as the community and the current acting chief. The acting chief chief Murat, John Murat rather spoke to or rather shared the chief's report regarding the Brown to police department and the current state of the city, safety plans, trends, the police's response and training and that of course can be found on the website at berlington.gov slash chiefs and hyphen reports. Input on civilian oversight ordinance has been discussed as well and timeline as well as process of members of the chatter and ordinance committee are also working on changing the oversight authority of the police commission. Discussion was also included regarding the mayor's memo that was directed to the commission as well as the acting chief to exchange information such as the use of force and other police actions against civilians. They've also spoke to the police review for reporting corruption and as well as misconduct included a better response to police officers who want to respond to any corruption as well as misconduct within the department. They've also discussed any additional recommendations that was on file and I think that more or less encompasses what the meeting was all about. If you have any questions feel free to ask and also it can be checked on the TV as well on YouTube. Can I make two comments? Yes please. I met with the acting chief for a couple of hours on Tuesday and just a few notes on Romeo's presentation. The department's training that was part of mandatory training that happened over the course of two days and so they split up the department so that way they could do that and they watched a Netflix series that looked at different types of policing as well as how different marginalized communities are impacted by communities and then the chief puts out a report every month and so that's what the chief's report is and that's where they outline all of the data of if you're interested with how many car thefts have happened in Burlington which I found to be a really alarming number. I think we're at like 103 for the year compared to the normal which is like 15 so you can find all of that data in there but that's kind of those were just my two comments. Thank you, Hannah. Any additional comments regarding the police commission's report? Can I ask you a question regarding that? Sure. So I work with the disabled community, people with intellectual disabilities, they tend to speak up. I work with people with intellectual disabilities but they are adults and a concern that my coworkers and I tend to have revolve around policing because we're not always with them. When you talk about police reform I often think about people of color but I know people I work with have had run-ins with police because they act a little different. Is any of the police reform? Because I know it's not the majority of what happens but I know that there are times that if someone doesn't act the status quo they're gonna be questioned by the police for not. Has there been any of that within? I know I'm just curious if that's inedible. Yeah, so from what I was told from the acting chief in that training it looked at how the police interact with different groups in general. Okay, perfect. Like historically like LGBTQ folks like situations like that I can ask though if like what their policy is because I feel like we hear a lot about how the police interact with folks that are having a mental health crisis or whatever it may be but that's a community that I'm not sure we focused on and so I think we're just curious. Thank you. No, it's a really good question. This is Bill, can I ask a question about that? Hannah, it sounds like there are other communities that may need to be brought into the discussion with the police. I think it's hard to put all the onus on the police department to understand all the different segments that really they affect but by inviting these groups into talk to the police then they can hear directly. So that's a different approach. I worry that there's so many people who maybe don't feel comfortable coming to the police but how do we identify groups such as the intellectually disabled who can now come in and have a conversation with the police at some level or even at maybe an NPA meeting where their point of view can be heard and understood. Yeah, I think that's part of a lot of the work that the CSOs are doing just because they're unarmed and unsworn and so there I think four communities that don't feel comfortable around sworn officers they can be more approachable but I think that there have been avenues to try to get different types of communities into the same room to talk with the police but also with the understanding that like as you mentioned there are so many groups of people that don't even wanna be in the same room as a police officer because they just don't feel comfortable based on their own experience or other folks. And so I think that different offices in the city such as REIB are looking at ways to have those discussions without and doing it in a format that is comfortable for everyone. Thank you, Hannah. Anybody that has questions or anything? All right, fantastic. Again, like I said, we're a little bit ahead of schedule by two minutes on our next item of the agenda which is basically the next meeting agenda. One topic that I wanted to bring up that I've discussed previously with Keith and I believe Bill and Linda our steering committee members was the what we can do with our NPA budget or the funds that we have and if there's any discussion can be put forth right here on the floor any idea suggestions would be welcomed. So the floor is open to anybody that have ideas on what we can do with the existing funds that we have right now. I would say we need to get creative about how we are advertising the NPA. I feel like we've had a relatively steep decline in engagement over the last couple of months. I think people are probably just tired of going to meetings but I think as a group we should think about, do we flyer in the neighborhoods? So paying for printing, like ordering more lawn signs kind of what that looks like paying for Facebook ads to reach a larger audience but I would say that would be my number one suggestion. So all those things have been talked about do we need a proposal, a natural proposal Romeo to just vote on these things or do we need to present estimates from vendors or I mean, we've been talking about these things for many months. What's the next step to take action on this? You have to put together a budget. I think what I was looking at was having at least maybe four or five up to six ideas that can be put to vote for the next meeting or the meeting after that we can decide on that we can do. I think Sam has information on the process. Yeah, so the process for your budget is really simple. We are, CEDO is very like lenient with whatever you want to do. So you don't have to like put together a budget. Honestly, if you just find something they want to do for advertising you send me an invoice and I can send you a couple more forms that you fill out and then we can kind of get the ball rolling that way. One thing I will say is that our finance team is trying to have all of our purchase orders in which is what you'd be kind of basically setting up in by June, I think June 1st. So you have a month to kind of work on it but I believe you guys have your entire budget but yeah, there's no like process you have to do for voting. If you want to do that in the NPA, that's great but if you want to just start getting things done the steering committee members can just start sending me invoices or receipts and stuff like that and then we can kind of get the ball rolling on that. So what we've done in the past is we the steering committee would put together a list of like five ideas or whatever it was and then at the next meeting which normally was the main meeting presented to the group and then we would have a vote with the group is everyone okay with this after discussion and then that's how it was decided but you can change it obviously. Thank you, Hannah. So about this, so there's two things. First of all, the way the steering committee does it in some of the other wards is we basically keep our eyes open for things that we'd like to fund. Now, if other people just come off the street or just come to us and say we have a proposal then we obviously take that into consideration and give that a heavy emphasis but generally what happens is that almost all the ideas are generated by steering committee members. So you see something you wanna fund like some of the like some examples are some of the festivals that happen in the summer or people who are doing like like there's a food giveaway program in Pomeroy Park there's a repair cafe on North Street that helps people repair this. So we find things that we think are a good fit for that money and we propose those. So again, if someone comes from the public we don't get very many of those. So almost all the money that we spend comes from the steering committee. We talk about it ourselves and then we bring it up at a neighborhood planning assembly meeting to give the public an opportunity to talk about it and then we just approve it. Now you guys are behind the, you guys are in trouble because this money's running out real fast. So if you've got something that you can decide right this minute like say there's something I can't think of anything but if there was a festival or something that happens in Ward 8 that you wanna fund you could do that probably tonight and you could just say but you haven't contacted anybody so it's impossible to do but I'm just saying that that's how it works. So you guys figure out what you wanna do and take it from there. That's how most of the wards do it. So the steering committee comes up with the ideas and sometimes we'll approach groups and say would you accept funding? Can you think of a good way to spend the NPA money that promotes the NPAs? So basically it's up to you guys to go out there and aggressively spend your money your time is getting really thin here. And see we allocated our money back in like October and so they've had all this time to spend their money and so we know if they're spending it or not and how much we have left over. So we're way ahead of the game and you guys are way behind the game. So I just thought I'd mention that. Thank you. Thank you Charlie for your support. I think we have, we know. I think we know the people here know what we should be spending it on. For example, we need to support front porch form because they support us. We need to support Tom meeting. We need to give some donations to them. Facebook, definitely. I think we already know. And then we do need to do signs and Vantage has given us a quote. We're ready to go. It's just that our steering committee has to take the bull by the horns or whatever you wanna call it and just do it. And I think Charlie has given us that told us, yeah, first of all, we didn't really know that we had $2,500 until a couple of months ago. So we're still learning, I guess. Perfect, perfect. Will it be $2,500 next year? Do we know? Yeah, we're getting into budget season. Okay. It would be nice if we were told that maybe in the summer, whenever we, or September, what our budget was. So that we would, yeah. All right, perfect. Anything from Rob, Bill, Gary, Linda? I'm sorry, I was talking to Ann. You were asking about ideas or are we gonna move on? Yeah. Yeah, go ahead, Bill. So Keith, you were on this weekend.  Okay, good. I'm around, yes. And basically all we need to do is take the one we had that had one and eight on it and take the one out and we have one. Because they want to design and that's another expense that they have to have. So they'll do- We don't care about that anymore. We got the YMCA, we want to have a party with them and we'll throw in some money with the YMCA. Okay. We'll get a big banner to hang in front of the library on nights of committee meetings. We can spend the money. Perfect, perfect. Okay. All right. Any additional comments on that in the meeting at all? No. Okay. I wanted to bring up which that I was hoping that I could put as part of the next item agenda is considering that Ward 8 has a heavy student presence to have hopefully way to reach out to students. I would say it's a little bit tricky for like undergrads just because they will not be here. Okay. But there's probably other ways to engage the student government. I'm happy to connect you or just connect with the contacts that I have. Okay. And then other ideas for next meeting, obviously the why that doesn't have to happen right away, obviously. If you want a presentation from the acting chief, he said he'd give it. I think it could be cool to have the CSOs come in, CSLs talk about their experience in the Ward 8 neighborhoods. Gail from Oscar, Office of Student and Community Relations at UVM. She can talk about like the work that they've been doing. Could we have the, ideally the CSOs as well as the acting chief that be possible? Let's just get CSOs that are available. Yeah, I can ask. That's just gonna be long. That will probably be the meeting because he talks and then with the CSOs too, just like keeping. I wouldn't like to have, I don't know if we ever had him here. What? The acting chief. Oh, yeah, we have. Actually, we've had him twice. Oh, okay. He's very, he's very... If he's open to it. Flexible. Yeah. We're happy to have the CSOs. Yeah, so if that's something you decide you want, just tell me and then I'll reach out. We had a resident of Ward 8 in the newspaper seven days today had a comment. So it seems like it's on Ward 8 people's minds. So we probably should have him back. And I like the fact that you've got some, more than just the chief. Yeah. We don't need to hurry reaching. I'm hesitant. I know we're not.  No, no, go ahead. I'm hesitant to, the police chief, I hope is a really busy guy. And to have him to a third meeting of five people in Ward 8, I'm not sure that's really effective anymore. And just from his standpoint, everybody wants to talk to him, but nobody wants to come to the meeting to talk to him. So I'm just hesitant to inconvenience him to talk to me one more time. Or if anybody feels that way or differently, we can do it that way. But that's kind of my take on it. I think it would be our responsibility to do some really good outreach to make sure people come to the meeting. True, true. But I hear you. Yeah. Right. We'll have a discussion at the steering committee meeting, right, Bill? Absolutely, Keith. Best place to go. Thank you, Bill. All right. So any additional suggestions for the next meeting item agenda? If you want to library, if you want the librarian to come and say a few words. Yeah. I think we have a long list of ideas that Hannah's given us. Okay. If we're going to keep it in the hour that we're... Yeah. All right. Fantastic. Yeah. Okay. And if there's nothing else on any ideas or any suggestions, I think our meeting adjourns much earlier than normal time. Thank you for everybody being here and we're signing off. Thank you all. Thank you. Thank you, everyone. We're in this area. Thank you, Linda. I live... Thank you, Romeo. Hannah. Thank you. Bye.


The following video shows guide dog's client Graham talking to the camera, pictures of Braille devices and footage of various people reading Braille. Braille is the script of my life. I started reading when I was about four years old. First on paper, either printed or produced on a machine such as this Perkins Braille writing machine. Then I read Braille many times every day of my life. I use Braille for reading everything from the phone number or address that I scribble down, usually on my Braille display, to the manual or book I consult, to the book I read for leisure, and for the books I read for my children. Reading to my children was my favourite use of Braille, I guess because it allowed me to pass on the love of words and language which Braille gave me throughout my life. Guide dog's logo, fading to Braille dots that read guide dogs.