Hello, Psych2Go viewers. Our guest for today's live stream is Dr. Kirk Honda. You may know him from his amazing YouTube channel, Psychology in Seattle, which has amassed millions of views and over 300,000 subscribers. I'm Michelle Rivas, host of Psychology Roundtable, and we're super excited to have Dr. Kirk Honda here today. Welcome. Thank you so much for joining us today. Thanks for having me. And so could you tell us a little bit about yourself and your background for those who don't know? Well, I've been a therapist and a professor for 27 years-ish in Seattle. And I've been a YouTuber and podcaster for 15 years. We just celebrated our 15th anniversary with a 15-hour YouTube live stream this past weekend. That's amazing. And when did the YouTube channel start after the podcast, right? Slightly, yeah. I had a student at the time who said, you have to put your stuff on YouTube. And I was like, YouTube, why? I didn't know any better, but here we are. Yeah. And so it's different, though, having, I'm sure, a podcasting YouTube. It's like a two different platform. So, but that's amazing. And so just to start off, I wanted to ask, so this is such an important conversation because roughly about 40 million Americans click on porn-related sites regularly. And so I just really wanted to cover this topic. It's kind of all over YouTube. So to start off, I wanted to ask, when does the use of pornography cross the line from healthy to dangerous, such as developing an addiction? Yeah. People often will define any sort of addiction, including porn addiction, as a frequency issue. Like if you do it X amount per week or per day or for this amount of hours, then you have an addiction. And that's not how we clinicians define addiction. And we don't even use the word addiction. Typically, we'll use compulsion or problem use.  And really, we're talking about pornography and masturbation usually. It's not, although pornography addiction can include a fair amount of pornography viewing that has nothing to do with self-stimulation or with masturbation. So but it often does involve that. Anyway, I just want to throw that in there. But the definition of a compulsion or a problem use or a problem with porn is one is that you're obsessed with the pornography, meaning that you're preoccupied, you're thinking about it, you have intrusive thoughts, you have cravings. It's an uncontrollable urge to think about it, even though you don't want to. You also have an associated compulsion to view pornography.  You often spend a lot of time, it interferes with other parts of your life. You're neglecting parts of your life or you could even get fired from a job because you were looking at it at work. I've had people mandated to see me for that. And then there's negative consequences because of the obsession, because of the compulsion to your job, relationships, to your self-esteem, to your health, happiness, hobbies, money, that kind of thing. And in more severe addictions of any sort, the individual will have a lot of excuses because they're out of control for themselves. And they're having a hard time. There's cognitive dissonance where they have this need and they keep acting out that need. There's another part of this like, I don't want to do this. And sometimes what that will mean, push comes to shove is they will actually suppress or have all these internal denial mechanisms that actually will repress that voice that is saying, no, so they might even tell themselves this is natural or everyone is doing this or it's normal to neglect your kids while you're looking at porn, that kind of thing. And then there's a lot of shame often involved for a lot of people with addiction. There's a shame cycle, if you will, of self-esteem, degradation, relationship falling apart. I'm not worthy.  And it is it's a it's a constant monkey on their back.   And you're just like, No, I want to watch this movie. You know, it'd be the same with pornography, you might be in a movie theater.  And it just it's a constant like it's intrusive. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's not like, hmm, what should I do right now?  Yeah. Yeah. And so do you think so you mentioned the shame around porn addiction. And I was wondering, do you feel like it's like a vicious cycle, the stigma and the shame that people often sort of like receive for even just watching porn? Does it like perpetuate their need to watch it even more because it's a way of suppressing their feelings and maybe reality? No, a lot of ways. Like the way we approach it as a society, the way we kind of like villainize people who watch porn, like, no, that's bad. And what'd you say? Yeah, yeah, absolutely.  And there's a lot I could say about that. But yeah, absolutely. It can.  Figure that's included, right? And it can. But when you sorry, I'm so sorry to interject. But like when you think about it, let's just be honest, as a society, sometimes there are some addictions that people deem more acceptable.  Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And the isolation of that, self esteem degradation of that, the need so, you know, creates a cycle of I'm ashamed of myself, I'm worthless. I'm pushing myself away from other people. I need I'm feeling bad. I need some way to cope. I'm going to turn to porn. I feel ashamed of myself. And you know, just keeps going around and around for people. The other thing, though, is that I want to say is that there's a lot of over self diagnosing. We've known this for a long time with porn addiction. There's a number of reasons for this. One is just misunderstanding of what addiction is or what compulsions are or problem uses. But also that for some people, because of religion or culture or sex negativity, any porn amount of watching is considered a problem.  Maybe there's some trauma that he's dealing with. There's widening distance, particularly physically between him and his partner. And he turns to pornography and masturbation as a way of gratifying a need or just something to do. And say he does it once or twice a week, and he gets caught. He gets caught. And according to his religion and his wife's religion and the values that they have, this is considered cheating, which is fine. If that's how people wanted to find this is why you want to talk about these things up front with your dating partners because right, it might come up. And, you know, because there's different values around this, similar to like, should we have kids or not, you should probably talk about that sort of thing before things get too far into the relationship. But so they have this value. And then he says, Okay, I'm never going to do it again. I'm never I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I, I sinned or I broke the covenant of our marriage or, you know, yes, I agree with you. I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. And then he goes for three months without looking at porn and masturbating.   He does it, he gets caught. And then he ends up in my office.  I would not define that as a porn addiction, depending on I would have to ask him questions. But there's a lot of people that will define it as a porn addiction, which, you know, to my eyes, it's someone that has a need that is not being met.  But I have worked with couples of opening it up to the possibility of just like, Well, let's, let's look at that. I would never tell you to change your point of view about pornography and masturbation. But you do have a choice regarding that. And you can still choose to have that value. But maybe you've never even raised the question in your mind of, What do I want to believe about that? And, and or maybe we need to work on your sexuality, you know, it opens up a lot of conversations is the point. And I wouldn't be treating porn addiction in that situation. I'm treating a lot of different issues for that couple. Well, I think that the prompt to sometimes when we approach individuals who have an addiction, I think that the first instinct sometimes for like family members and friends is to villainize them and to label them as an addict. And that can be really hurtful and upsetting to that person. And they don't want that label. But then, you know, maybe it causes depression, anxiety, and it makes them want to watch porn more or whatever that addiction is, it makes them want to do them more because they're being shamed by their loved ones and being villainized. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. And so what are some signs and symptoms that someone can look out for in themselves or in someone else that could indicate a porn addiction? Yeah. So there are various different online screening tools. Many of them are not very good. I did find one. Well, because, well, for example, I mean, if you really just want to get specific, there's a very common, if not the most common screening test is called the internet sex screening test. And it has to do with internet porn. And a number of the items on here, I would not be, I would not consider them to be necessarily signs of porn addiction, what's called that, like for example, logical. Well, right. I mean, it's totally within normal limits to people that people have these kinds of behaviors like, you know, I have one of the items is yes or no, I have joined I have joined sexual sites to gain access to online sexual material. Yeah, that I have joined a website, a porn website that has porn. What, you know, like, that's a lot of people, right? Right. Or I have purchased sexual products online. Yeah, that doesn't indicate an addiction or anything pathological. It doesn't even necessarily have to do with pornography.  So it's but there is one test. I mean, they do have items on there that are more in line. But there's a lot of false positives. And I, you know, there's I could get into the problem with the research and the treatment in this field, because there's a lot of yeah, religiosity that is interwoven in this and sex negativity. But in terms of the, the test that I found that is actually a good one, it's called a porn addiction test. And it's on psychom.net, which is, it's not really something that psychologists use, but but I did find it to be helpful. There are there are a lot of other tests, but anyway, one that's free online.  And so one of the questions is there's nine questions. Do you spend a lot of time thinking about pornography? So that so if you answer yes to that, then that's an indicator. Another is, do you ever lose track of time while you're watching porn? So meaning that you probably think, well, I'll look at porn for 10 minutes or 15 minutes, and then it's three hours later. That's a common experience for people have porn addiction. Yeah.  So that you know, that's a typical addictions question. Do you ever feel restless or irritable when you try to cut back on porn so that yeah, points to a compulsion, a craving, and truce of thought because withdrawal symptoms. Yeah. Yeah, you can put it that way.  Has pornography ever interfered with your work, school, or relationships? That's a good one. Yeah, that's good. Do you ever continue to watch porn even when it had negative consequences on your relationship or your work? Have you ever done anything illegal to access pornography? Do you ever do you ever feel guilty, sad or anxious about watching looking at porn? The last one's a little funny, because a lot of people will shame themselves because of sex negativity. But you get the picture that, you know, are you spending a lot more time than you want to be? Do you have uncontrollable urges about it?   But if they have all their other life aspects going well, and their relationships, their work, finances, their health, you know, it's it's a hobby. It's something that they just really like to do. And there's nothing wrong with that. There's nothing pathological. Thank you. Thank you. I don't think that's clarified enough. The act of watching porn isn't bad. Like you can watch porn. It doesn't make you a bad person or a perv. But it's just when it becomes an addiction. That's when it's pathological. And even then, you're not a perver creeper. And we shouldn't label people that, right? Yeah, most people watch porn, most people masturbate.  Right. Exactly. And so do you think just, you know, switching over to the causes of it? What are some of the root causes for porn addiction in Europe? And do you believe it's like an escape mechanism? It can be. Yeah. So one of the problems with answering this question is we don't really have a lot of robust research around this because one, it's a taboo topic, even within my field to some extent. Because I mean, it's not a, you know, for me to read research about pornography addiction isn't taboo. But when you commit yourself as a clinician or an academic to this is going to be my thing, you know, it raises questions. People are like, well, what's why is he so interested in this topic? Right. So it tends to be really. Yeah. Yeah. I even ran into this when I when I was proposing a research study at my university about cam camming, you know, pornography camming, you know, it's cam people who are cam performers. This would have been, I don't know, 15 years ago or something I was proposing this because I wanted to know the the effect that it had on couples, because it's one thing for someone to watch pornography, right? If you had a partner that watched porn, or you sort of knew that maybe they watch porn. It's another thing if they're actually interacting with a human being across chat across video, you know, live video. Because I wondered if that crossed the line or if it was actually just can sit because it's all internet stuff. I saw so I proposed this. And I had colleagues of mine mentors of mine who told me this is not a good idea for your career because people are going to ask questions as to why you're even looking looking into this. And I'm like stigma. Yeah, I'm like, but so even in my field and I didn't do it for the record because I did it completely the other. Yeah, it makes sense. So that's one problem. Another is that of the people that are motivated to do this research, they're often biased due to religion. So they have a bone to pick and the research studies research studies will look legit. But when you read them, it's skewed. It seems that way anyway.  So you never know. Anyway, but the causes that we can look to that are often, you know, identified with lots of addictions are it can be hereditary, for example, you know, really? Yeah, susceptible not to porn addiction per say, but to addiction and compulsions. You know, you have you're prone to pleasure triggers, so to speak. And having those activations in your brain that are more effective than other people, you know, there's some models that include that. Another is childhood mistreatment is associated with a lot of trauma. Yeah. Including addiction. There's a lot of different reasons to why that would be but moving forward. Another possibility is that for some people that are, you know, it seems like there's some evidence that our initial experiences in sexuality, as we're developing as children and teenagers will imprint on us to some extent, you know, certain fetishes or preferences that we have as adults can be traced back to very early experience. The first time you felt that charge, the first time you felt that, that, you know, that, that sexual feeling, if it was associated with a particular stimulus, then, and especially if that's reinforced throughout early development, you know, you, for example, you have one kid who 13 looks upon masturbates, but also will start dating and, and fooling around physically with peers within reason. And for that individual, there's a variety of things that are being encoded as this is how you meet this need. Whereas another person, the first experience they have is with pornography, and it's very intense for them, and they don't have any experiences with other human beings, then that can lead to problem use in the future and also an inability to find safety or comfort or being turned on by real human beings, because, you know, your brain has been conditioned to respond to a particular stimuli pornography. So it's not pornography, you know, people often because there are, there is research that will point to early pornography exposure can be related to these things. But, but there's other evidence. And the way that I think about it is that it's not that you necessarily did take away pornography, although kids certainly don't need pornography. You know, I mean, there are some benefits to pornography that I should say just of, you know, while I'm on this topic that there is research and it's been around for a long time, that for a lot of people, they discovered themselves, their identity, they, because they might be in a very sex negative culture or church or family. Yeah.  And so for an individual, they might actually be liberated and destigmatized. And so they might really benefit from pornography. And that that research has been around for a long time. Yeah. But, but anyway, so the idea is, is that with teenagers, we really want to help them to not have barriers to actually meeting people in person and developing normally in that way, you know, age appropriate wherever they want, maybe it's later at 18, or maybe it's as young as 12 when they start to hold hands with someone or something, you know, to get that ball rolling, because that's, that's typically seemingly maybe how we evolved, which is perhaps best. Another way of looking at it in terms of cause is that we evolved to, you know, you think about a million years ago, we evolved to, it seems we evolved to respond to stimuli visually and auditory. So when we see sexual wool images or naked bodies or people having sex or whatever, we seem to respond to that. And the theory goes is that we're on the African savannah 200 thousand years ago. And we see an attractive potential partner or even hear people having sex that sort of reminds us of it or something. And it introduces the drive, right? And you you have a motivation. Well, on the African savannah 200 thousand years ago for us, the, you know, the amount of times that would happen in a day would be limited, right? But with the internet and with pornography, it can be constant, right? So similar to the way that Cheetos and Nachos hack into my evolved motivation to have fats and sugars and and and salt to too much degree, which isn't healthy for my body, pornography can hack into your system to give you too much of what you want. And then for some people that can develop into problem use, right?  And do you think it kind of damages relationships? Or what would you say to some extent? It can, it goes both ways. So it can both damage or be neutral or be positive for relationships. It really just it's sort of like the way people talk about social media, they'll be like, well, social media rots your brain. And research demonstrates that, yeah, for some people, there can be some negative effects, but for other people, it actually enhances their brain, their mood. So it just depends on the context on the person on the way they use it on the whole picture. So for one couple, absolutely or for one individual, and we have studied this and found this to be true for some that when they watch pornography, it'll twist their mind regarding what a body should look like or what sex should look like. It could be particularly misogynistic and sexist and in a lot of corners, it's getting better over time. Yes. But and it's particularly bad in some societies like the United States and places like Japan where it is, you know, exaggerated and demeaning to women. But so you could and you could imagine someone being influenced in that way, or a couple that, you know, their relationship starts to cool off and one or both of them watch a lot of pornography and and it creates this distance because there isn't a motivation to bond sexually or it could be hurt and betrayal feelings. But for another couple, another individual, it could liberate them, it could give them ideas, it could be a nice thing to do when your partner isn't around, it can be a way of flirting with your partner. You could do it with your partner. You can talk about it with your partner. You know, there's just it really just depends on on how it's being used. And we as a society have play a role in that because of education and awareness and also helping to guide young people about what they want to put in their brain, right? Because it's going to happen and I'll like that. So the general approach, though, is just say no and abstain or prevent and shame, which, you know, doesn't help. And so before we move to our audience segment, I just wanted to ask in terms of, sorry, just there's so many questions in here right now. Yeah, there's a ton of people in here right now. And so we're going to get to the audience segment soon, guys. But I just wanted to know, do you feel that when it comes to the way it impacts relationships, we need to like learn to not stigmatize our partners for their use of pornography? Like how do people go about conversations around these things as couples? Well, everything hinges on your values. So if so, I would even go further back and say that when people are young, that they are given a venue to explore this for themselves of what are my values regarding pornography and masturbation, for me and for my partners. And if an individual has given enough freedom and space to explore that, and they establish their own value regarding that, then they can enact that. So if they, for example, are free to develop their own morals, and they develop morals saying like, I don't want pornography in my life, because of various different reasons. And you know, and there are legit reasons why someone wouldn't want pornography in their life, they wouldn't want to contribute to the exploitation of the performers because the industry isn't set up currently to be able to regulate that. You know, there are reasons. And so they say, I don't want that in my life. And I don't want my partner to be in that. Okay, so then you got to lead with that when you're dating, it should be in your dating profile, similar to, you know, what sort of age are you looking for? Do you want to have kids? And how do you feel about pornography? You know, that's a that's a matching issue. And then if you have that, then you meet someone with similar values. And then if with that agreement and with, you know, similar to like monogamous couples versus polyamorous couples, if you are polyamorously oriented, you should know that about yourself and you should have the freedom to explore that and you should find other polyamorous people, you should not be with a monogamously oriented person because you're going to have drives to be with other people, someone's not going to be happy in that situation. So, so if you have that agreement, in your relationship, and you've established that, and then someone ends up watching pornography, I'm not saying that you should be shaming the other person, the person that looked up pornography, but you, because you have this agreement, you have the right to say, Hey, we have this boundary, you weren't going to do this, you agreed, you weren't going to do it. Whereas another couple, if they were to establish that that's okay at times, then they would. The problem is, is that there's so many couples where they've literally never talked about it. And they don't even know what their values are, because they haven't been encouraged to develop that. And they don't, they don't have the freedom to even choose themselves because of a high control group or even a cult that they're in regarding some religion.  So, you know, it's not just religion, it's, you know, culture, but so if you're in a relationship where you never really talked about it, or even your partner might have even said to you, I don't watch porn, I'm never gonna watch porn. But they didn't properly explore that for themselves. And then they ended up watching porn. You know, it just, it there's a lot of conversations that need to happen. And as a couple of therapists, when people come into my office, these kinds of transgressions and I've had couples come in for this issue, it just blossoms into a whole exploration. You know, there could be a lot of conversations need to happen over years. And I agree with that because sometimes people feel like chemistry and like loving each other is enough. And sometimes when you're just not compatible with the person, you have to be honest about that instead of getting into a marriage and then these things come up later.  And I really agree with that, like if you have, you know, opposite views on everything and you don't agree on most things, even if you love each other, it's not always enough, right? Yeah, well, if I said that, that's not exactly the way I think about it today. But, but yeah, we say opposites attract, but in, when we actually study, most couples are way more similar than, than we think of them being similar. Absolutely. But but absolutely, we should be talking about these things up front, you know, these kinds of, but of course because we live in a sex negative culture, people don't even know that they should be thinking about it, let alone talking about it with their dating partners. Well, yeah, definitely in the most successful relationships that I've seen, people usually have like the couples will usually have the same values. And I agree with what you said, we live in a sex negative culture, even here in the US, like we need to open, that's why we're having these conversations here at Psych2Go because we want to perpetuate and promote a more sex positive culture. And so that brings me to our audience segment where we answer your viewer questions. We have tons of fans in here from Psych2Go and psychology in Seattle, over 500 people are in here and there's a lot of questions. So are you ready, Dr. Honda? I am. OK, so first question, Jennifer asked, how do I tell my parents about my porn addiction without upsetting them? I have a very strict religious background, and I don't want to turn my family apart. Wow. To load a question. Well, one, you'd have to truly define us to whether or not you have a porn addiction. Is it that you look at porn and masturbate and it's not really a problem in your life and it's only a problem in your life because of the culture and the family that you live in.  You know, that's a huge distinction. You can have, for example, well, I won't go down that road, but well, let's go down that road.   And they would say, yes, it is. But that's only because of oppression and stigma and hate. So and the individual might even believe they deserve it because they've been told that, right? So just because it's impacting your life, doesn't necessarily mean you have an addiction. It could be that your life and your context is the problem and it's not you. So that's an important distinction to to make. But if you do have a legit addiction and you want to tell you what. So the question is, how do I tell my family? Yeah, that's pretty much in a nutshell. The other question, like, how do I tell them without them freaking out? Yeah, freaking out. Well, one, you don't necessarily have to tell your family you could if you want to. You also have options. You know, if you're in a jurisdiction that the laws are such that this is true, that you can seek clinical help, mental health treatment in a confidential way. And then you feel like some if someone has a porn addiction, they don't they shouldn't have to disclose it to family and friends, because some people have differing opinions on that, like they should tell people, I don't know. Well, there's no like scientific obligation that they have that anyone has to tell anyone about any of addiction that they have. So that's a value statement, I suppose. Yeah. But I would hope that any family would care about their members. And if someone is suffering from porn addiction, that they would want to be helpful. And a big part of being helpful is to not attack them for disclosing that they're suffering from something. So I would it would be understandable if someone, you know, reasonably predicted that they would be attacked, the overall effect would be negative for them that they would conclude that they would not tell them at first, at the very least, you know, I wouldn't fault them for that. You should get help. The help you deserve to get the help that you deserve. You deserve to help. Absolutely. Or that's the bottom line. And if your family can be a part of that, then great. And if they can't, then screw them. Yeah, exactly. Jennifer, I wish you luck with that. And you shouldn't feel bad about being open about your addiction. So moving on to the next question, this was asked by John Leon.   What do you think, Dr. Honda? What if you're in a relationship, you have porn addiction, you're actually trying to get rid should the partner still divorce? I mean, it depends. Obviously, it could be a reason. Well, a lot, you know, there's a lot of factors that could play a role. But I would, I would have clinically, I would not, I can't answer that question, because that's a question that comes from someone's heart. As a citizen, I would have an opinion about that if my friends, for example, they came to me and they were like, yeah, my partner has a porn addiction, they're really working hard on it, but screw them. I don't want to be with an addict. You know, I judge that person for ditching their partner when they're in need and also given that they're trying. So, you know, I think that it depends on the situation. I can also see in a situation where someone is legit trying to recover from porn addiction, but it's taking a long time.  So I think it takes a long time. There's a lot of relapses. There's a lot of suffering. And could I see a scenario where friends come to me and say, look, I know they're working on it, but I just can't take it anymore. And I just can't do it. You know, what I think that was reasonable, perhaps. So it just depends on the situation. And then the next question is from Cloud. They ask, hello, doctor, what do I do if I suffer from a porn addiction, but I'm in a relationship with someone who is asexual?  So it all depends on the compulsiveness and the obsessiveness and the negative effects on one's life. So there's that. But if it's a legit porn addiction, so the question is, oh, I don't see the question. Oh, sorry. So how do I deal with it with my partner when my partner is asexual? Yeah, that's the question. Like, what do you do if your partner is asexual, but you have a porn addiction, which in my opinion would be like an issue of incompatibility, but that's just my take. It depends. It all just depends on what you've communicated about and your agreements. It's all about agreements and it's all about communication. So if you legit have a porn addiction, how does your partner feel about it, regardless of their asexuality? How does it affect them? How does it affect you? That's what I'd say to that. Thank you. And then the next question is from Morgan Levoit. She asked what if and this is an amazing question, actually, it's a really good question. What if porn addiction coexist with a drug addiction? Does one fuel the other and should they be treated separately or both at the same time? Yeah, it is a good question. They often are coexisting, co-occurring, co-morbid. Addictions tend to do that, but with porn addiction in particular, it is according to research associated with drug addiction. Do they fuel each other? They can, yeah. Also, they can generate from the same place. And should they meaning that someone needs to escape in general and they use both porn and substance to escape? Also, but in terms of treatment, could they be treated at the same time? Yeah, you can go to a 12 step group. You can even go to out AA, you know, Alcoholics Anonymous and talk about the if alcohol is the drug of choice and the individual is recovering from alcoholism through AA. You know, AA groups in my experience would will welcome compulsions of other sorts like pornography and that kind of thing. And the same principles can be followed of having a sponsor and, you know, trigger management and setting up a system that is, you know, conducive to success, all the same principles apply to both addiction recoveries. And then this next question is asked by Melissa. This is actually, I think, like a fan question, someone who's like really into psychology in Seattle. They asked Melissa, asked Dr. Honda, when are you going to have Darcy and Stacy on your podcast? I don't think they would ever want to. I would love to talk to them. I have so many questions because I always wonder. I mean, I would love to talk to them off camera really, just just to know I've talked with people in their life off camera. But Paul, right? But I don't think they would ever want to come on my show, as the point I always say, I watch your channel and I always say that I feel like you should be the host of the 90 day, 90 day fiancee reunions or of the Darcy and Stacy reunions, because I think you're that good. I'm not that good. I would screw it up. I look up to Sean a lot. Sean Robinson. Yeah, she's good. But I just feel like you have the insight, though.  And that's what they need. But I would be I'd yammer. I'd ask too many questions. I'd have too many caveats. I, you know, I would I'd probably be too nice because I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings. So I and plus on camera with all the lights and everything I you know, I would freeze. I wouldn't know what to do. So it is a lot of pressure. Yeah. Yeah. So but that would you make an appearance if they invited you because they do that.  Would you do it? No, because I threw that one up to somehow and it would end up in the edit and I would never be able to sleep at night again. So no, I want to be here in my office with my own microphone and my as I say, everything's fine. My dogs and my wife are in the other room and everything's good. So that's why I love that. And then someone Mondo asked, how do you tell the difference between porn addiction? And I'm guessing they are referring to other addictions. Well, there isn't a difference necessarily regarding the pattern, you know, the obsession, the compulsions, the the negative effects, the progressive nature, the shame, the hiding, the difficulty controlling it. The you know, it gets worse over time. But the main difference is one involves pornography and the others involve the other behavior or substances.  You can read that on the screen. Yeah, I mean, adrenaline junkies, sometimes in the research will call this like sensation seekers, this sort of thing. But yeah, it does co-occur with mainly anxiety, but also mood disorders, depression, bipolar, also trauma related disorders. I'm trying to think of the thought in my head, mainly anxiety, depression, those sorts of things. Yeah. And then you answer this question, but just like I think that it's really important to our viewers to know this. Angel 777 asked, is porn an addiction if it doesn't affect your social and work life in general? Is it an addiction if it doesn't affect? Yeah. No, it's it's not. It's not an addiction if it doesn't if it doesn't negatively impact your life. It's a very squishy, you know, evaluation. There's a lot of debate there. Also, when you talk to someone who actually we would term as having a problem use of porn, they might be in denial of it and you ask everyone around them, you know, is there a problem there? They might say yes, but the individual is in denial. So, you know, there's a lot of different things that have to be taken into consideration. But yeah, if objectively or as objectively as you can answer this question, there's no negative impact of watching pornography, then, yeah, it's not it's not it's not a problem. This will be our last viewer question. Sailor C asked, is there any way to help my partner overcome a porn addiction? I know it's their choice to overcome it, but I want to help if I can. Yeah, that's a great question. You know, we've been working on this question and people have been working on this question for decades. Both clinically and partners of people who suffer from addiction. Alan on the group is has been around for a long time. There's a lot of wisdom and a lot of guidance that Alan on can provide for people who have partners addicted to any substance or behavior like like pornography, so you can seek their their support groups out and their information. But it is it's difficult because you can watch your partner suffer from a problem and it hurts them mostly, but it also hurts you.  You are even more powerless if you if it's possible to be more powerless over or something. And everything generates from the individual having most of them most of the time want to recover. So they have to want to do it. And there's a lot of research and observation about how people have those those moments where they turn the corner and let's say, yeah, I I've done little things here and there.  They'll take these little measures, but it's never enough with addiction. It defines a way. And eventually they get to a point and they just and how do they get there and when will they get there and how do we get them there? You know, there's a lot of wisdom and experience around this. And if you're a partner of that, you know, getting to know that wisdom and getting that help and having guidance around that is important. But but it depends on your partner. If your partner doesn't want to make that choice, then they don't make that choice. And then you have then you have to make choices yourself about what you want to do about that. Could be a deal breaker at a certain point. You could draw boundaries around it. You know, there's there's a lot of difficulty there is what I'm saying. Yeah. But if but the the breeding ground for that to happen that you do have control over that, I can't say is you don't want to add to the shame is the point. Absolutely. Or the stigma. Yeah, you want to and you also want to speak from your feelings instead of saying to someone. You have a problem and, you know, this is bothersome. You want to say you want to convey to them in a non accusatory and as, you know, compassionate way as you can how their addiction affects you. When when you do this and I see doing this, I have these emotions and maybe I'm unreasonable. But this is how I'm feeling. What that'll do is it alerts the person with the addiction to the negative consequences because they can go into denial of it. Also, it gives them a chance to have compassion and empathy for you, which at the very least in the moment can be helpful to you as a partner of someone with addiction. But also, you know, it that it doesn't have stigma or shaming or conflict. The person with the addiction is free or, you know, people who recover from addictions. Their lives tend to need to go a little better than they were earlier because when you're suffering from addiction, it starts to impact your life. People start to distance, your life starts falling apart. Then you need the the substance or the behavior even more because you need to escape or you need just something to get you through it. If you can not add to that. Now, you don't want to enable. So, you know, there's a lot of things to talk about in terms of but if you can create a space where it's just like, hey, if you want to recover, I am right here for you. And I love you and I care about you. And if you want to talk about it, you know, just an open experience, but, you know, it's hard to do when you're in the moment because you're hurt by it. It can be really hurtful. Well, thank you for that, Dr. Honda. Thank you to our amazing viewers for participating in our fun audience segment. And so that brings me to my last question, Dr. Honda. I want to know what can we do to dismantle the stigma around just the use of pornography and porn addiction?  Like, what can our society do? Yeah, I don't know. Intimidated by the question. Well, in the past, in the past, I would have thought, yeah, I mean, let's increase education. But there are certain movements in our society, in our country that are going in the opposite direction. So and preventing these kinds of things from even being discussed in schools or otherwise. So I don't know. I do know in my lifetime things have gotten better. Yeah, even in the last 10 years. So all of us doing, including you doing this episode is furthering that destigmatization and that seems to be working. So I would say that just everyone keep doing what they're doing, keep talking about it, actually talk to experts, yeah, talk about it in schools, age, appropriateness, just the destigmatization of treatment in general, therapy in general and recovery in general. So I I would say everyone just keep doing what Michelle is doing. Yeah, just do what I'm doing. OK, I'm just kidding. Well, thank you, Dr. Hanna. Thank you for joining us. I'm a huge fan. We had so many fans in here and they're so happy to have been able to participate today. Thank you again. No, thanks for having me. And thank you, everyone, at Psych2Go and Psychology in Seattle for joining us today. Have a great day. Bye.


Hello friends, welcome to another session on Gems of Geometry. So, we are going to discuss another very interesting theorem here. The theorem says let triangles be constructed externally on the sides of an arbitrary, arbitrary triangle, so that the sum of the remote angles is 180 degrees, then the circumcircles of the three triangle meet at a point. So, let me explain this theorem to you. So, what is this saying? It is saying that let us draw an arbitrary triangle first of all and then you construct external triangles like that, like that on the three sides, on the three sides, but the condition is that the remote angles, what is the remote angle I will illustrate? So, let us say this is three triangles you are creating. So, this three angles alpha, beta and gamma, these are called remote angles. What are they called? Remote angles, let us say. So, that is what is meaning of a report angle in this case. It is not a standard, what do you say in standard or conventional way of identifying these angles or report angles, but just in this case remote meaning farthest away from the sides of the triangle, given triangle. So, alpha, beta, gamma, if alpha plus beta plus gamma is given as 180 degrees, this is given. Alpha plus beta plus gamma is 180 degrees, then they are saying that if you draw the circumcircule of these three triangles. So, they are going to meet at a point. So, I am just drawing a rough diagram. Anyway, the challenge is to construct this now. So, they are saying they will meet at, they are going to meet at one particular point. That is what we have to establish. So, understood.  Then the three circumcircles of the three triangles which are drawn like these will meet at one point. That is what we are going to see. First of all, the challenge is to construct this, construct this particular thing because alpha plus beta plus gamma to be 180 degrees is the challenge in construction. So, what do we do? So, what I am going to do is first I will take a random triangle. So, let me take a random triangle. So, here is my point A. Let us say this is point V and let us say point C. And let us make, let me make this more arbitrary. So, how to make it more arbitrary? So, just change this orientation. Yeah, somewhat like that. And let me zoom in.  We can make those triangles very easily without having much of a constraint. So, let us say this is, this is one. So, one triangle I draw. Let me just change the color so that becomes little, which color should I take? Let us say this one. No. Yeah, let us say this is the one triangle. And then the second triangle I will draw. How do I draw? So, A and let us say this point I take. C and yeah, let me change this color as well. So, if I change the color for this one, let us say this one or this one. Yeah. Okay. Now, now I have to draw the third one. Now, here is the constraint. So, I know this angle, this is BDA, some measure it will be. Similarly, I can measure this angle, but I have to make sure that the third triangle which I am going to make is going to be 189. So, let me keep it here so that I will tell you why I am doing this. So, that I can make it easily. Okay. So, these are the remote angles E and D so far. So, let us measure these first. So, let me measure BDA. So, 53.97. I do not want these. So, this is but alpha. Okay. And this one AEC. Okay. So, this is 70.02 and this is beta. I do not need these names. Okay, alpha and beta. So, what I am going to do is I am going to construct all 180 degree angle here. So, what I am going to do is I am going to construct a line passing through E, which is at an angle alpha. So, this one is at alpha. Let me show the label. Let me not show the value or let it be value also. No problem. So, let the value be also there. And let me show this or rather I do not need it right now. So, I am going to construct a line passing through E such that AE and that line has an angle 53.97. How I am going to do it is this. So, I am going to reflect or rotate about a point. So, let us say about E I am going to rotate this line AE by what angle? So, by which angle? So, by clockwise direction? Yes, clockwise direction by what angle? So, the angle is alpha. Here it is. So, if you see this angle is going to be 53 point. So, let me show it here. So, how much is this angle? Let me measure this angle. So, this angle is A dash E dash 53.97, exactly same angle I have drawn that is gamma. Why did I do that?  Now, if I have a line let us say A dash E dash like that. If I see this line. Now, this angle here this one which one? Angle between let me measure that as well. So, let me measure this and yeah 56 point this delta. This delta let me yeah. So, this angle is delta here or let me show it here delta is 56.01. Now, I am going to find a point on you know a line passing through B and parallel to this line if I draw then I will get a point where okay. So, what I am going to do is I need a no not passing through B I need a yes I need a line parallel here. Why? Because see if I draw these parallel lines which one? So, let us say parallel line through C. Okay. Fair enough. Now, yes. So, this angle is if I somehow find out okay. So, what I am going to do is I am going to do this. So, I am going to draw a line parallel to B. Yeah, this is but will that help? No. This angle is alpha and I need a point here somewhere such that okay. See if I get a point here, oh no, but I am going to yes, yes, yes. I am sorry. So, what otherwise I could have done I do not need to do all of this. See what I need to do is once I get this 56.01 that is delta I need to extend not this line. So, this line is not needed. I need to actually extend this line which one? E dash yeah, perfect. Now, if I draw a line passing through B and parallel to this line then this given angle will be same. So, what I am going to see is so it says this. So, let me draw a line passing through B and parallel to this line. Yeah, perfect. Now, this angle clearly this one is my desired delta right. So, if I measure let me measure this angle. So, see 56.01. So, this angle is 56.01 and this angle anyways is beta and this is alpha. So, alpha plus beta plus gamma comes out to be 180 degrees. I hope this is understood. So, this is alpha here let me name it. Let me show the name. So, what I am showing is show the label. So, gamma is same as alpha my dear friends right 53.97 C this is gamma and this angle is beta 70.02. So, if you add all of them alpha plus beta plus gamma is 180 degrees right. So, this is remote angle beta this is alpha which is 53.97 and this one is my delta which is equal to here eta right 56.01. So, I hope you understood and we did construct this part where the remote angle sum is 180 degrees. Yep. So, these are the three triangles. Now, I need don't need these lines. So, let me just hide them. So, hide it I also don't need this. So, hide as well hide hide it and I don't need these all either. So, let me just hide all of them I don't need this I don't need this part as well this part as well right. So, let me just a minute this is yeah. So, e dash is also not needed. So, let me hide it. Okay. So, this is the thing and if I just do what I I know the point f. So, basically I need to draw this bf and fc. Okay. And I just need to or rather what I am doing to do is I am going to draw the polygon. Okay. So, polygon is bfc right and let me change the color of this as well. So, color. Okay. So, I will check. Yeah, let it be this color this color also has used to change it. So, let me change this to something like that. Oh, sorry, I have to change this one now. Sorry for the bad choice of colors if at all you think like that. We need to differentiate. So, hence I am doing that. Okay. Yeah, that will be too feeble. So, let me speed this and now oh wait. So, setting once again done. And this one done. Yeah, looks good. And this is let me just take this away and I don't need these either. So, let me so that my diagram is now needed. Okay. So, I constructed something which is now according to whatever you want it right. So, this is but this looks like it is a straight line but it will be a straight line. Yes, it will be a straight line anyways. So, can I randomize it more? How do I how do I randomize it more? So, let me say so this looks like ecf looks like a straight line. So, maybe it is appearing to be a special case. So, see I am going to do this I am going to draw a circle B passing through Bf C. Okay. And then yeah. So, I am now going to take any point here on this point. Let us say and call this as f. Okay. So, the angle will remain the same. So, I am utilizing the concept that angle in the same segment will be same. Okay. So, now let me draw a polygon from here Bf C. Now it looks perfect. Perfect. Right. And now I am going to yeah. So, this is the required third correct perfect. And then I don't need this circle either. So, let me just yeah. And let me switch it off as well. Okay. So, this is the construction guys. So, after all of this lot of work and we got what happens if I see if I change it. So, it doesn't matter. So, the angle is going to be the same. Yeah. This is all together will give will be same. It won't change it. So, I can yeah. This is the thing. Now let me see whether whatever is being said here then the circum circles of the three triangles meet at a point. Let me do and try that. So, let me draw the circum circles of the three. So, let's say the first one is this one. Okay. This is the first circle. Second one is this, this and this. And the third one is this, this and hey indeed it is meeting. Yes. See, this is the point of intersection where all the three are meeting. So, you can see that G. Right. So, the three circles semi-circles are indeed meeting at the point. And does it impact or is the position of the E point E guiding this? No. See, anywhere you take G point is going to be the point G here. Right. See, it's there. Always the three semicircles are, sorry, circum circles are intersecting. That's really cool. That's good. Yep. So, wherever you take these points irrespective of that. Yeah. This is beautiful. So, yes. Correct. Very good. Now, how do we prove it? How do we prove it? So, prove is not that tough. So, you can see. Let me prove it. So, how do I prove it? So, I am saying. See, out of the three, out of the three circum circles, two will definitely intersect. So, let's say AENC. So, this is the circle. This one. A, AEC. This circle. This is circle number one. So, let me write that as circle number one. This is circle number one. Right. This is circle number one. This is circle number two. Let's say. Circle number two. Now, definitely the two circles are going to meet at point C. One point is common point C. And another point is let's say G. Okay. So, let us join few lines over here. What all lines? So, let me join which one? So, let me make some cyclic quadrangles. So, A, G. See. Right. This one. And this one. This one. Yeah. This is good enough. Now, look carefully. What I am saying? I am saying is angle. So, the two, circle number one and two will definitely pass through C. There is absolutely no issues in that. Why? Because C happens to be one of the vertices of the triangle of which the circum circles are drawn. So, C will be the first common point. And let's say they intersect at point G. And at this point, I am not claiming that the third circum circle is also passing through G. So, hence what I am doing is let me do one thing here, which I can definitely do. And let's switch it off so that it doesn't create confusion. So, I am saying these two semicircles, circum circles are meeting at point G. Okay. So, what do I now know? I know that angle CGB, C, rather let me, yeah, CGB, angle CGB, this one, is equal to 180 degrees minus F, no problems in that. 180 degrees minus F. Why? Cyclic, quadrangle are opposite angles are opposite angles of cyclic, quadrangle, quadrangle are supplementary. Supplementary. Is it it? Okay, fair enough. Also, angle AGC, AGC, where is that angle? This one is also equal to 180 degrees minus angle E. Without doubt, same reason. Now let us try to find out angle AGB. Don't you think angle AGB, where is that angle? This one, AGB is equal to 360 degrees minus angle CGB minus angle AGC. Right? Angle at a point is 360 degrees. So, hence this is 360 degrees minus angle CGB. If you take CGB, which will be nothing but 180 degrees and plus angle F. And then this one will be 180 degrees plus angle E from these two. Okay. So, 180 degrees, 360, 360 goes. So, this is all cancelled.  But there is an important information given in this question. And that is angle F plus angle E plus angle D, remote angles are put together is 180 degrees C is over here. That means angle F plus angle E is 180 degrees minus angle D. So, from these two relations, this is 1 and this is 2. You can very easily say angle AGB. AGB is equal to 180 degrees minus angle D. That means it is showing that AGB, this point G and D are, you know, angle AGB is 180 minus D. That means you can write AGB plus angle D is 180 degrees. What does it indicate? It indicates that the opposite angle of a quadrangle, these are opposite angles of two quadrangle. So, D and this angle G is opposite angle of a quadrangle and the sum is 180 degrees. Therefore, we can say that ADBG is a cyclic quadrangle and that proves the theorem. Why? The moment is a cyclic quadrangle. That means the circumcircle of ADG or ADB, ADB will pass through G. Isn't it?  So, hence there is, there can be only one circle passing through any three points. So, hence one circle which is passing through ADB will be the circumcircle of ADB only. There cannot be two circumcircles. So, circumcircle of ADB also passes through G. That is what we need to achieve and prove. And hence we can show this part, this circle activated. See, indeed this circle is the circumcircle of ADB and hence it passes through G as well. So, hence we could prove this theorem which says that if there are three triangles made arbitrarily on a, on the sides externally, on the, or constructed externally on the sides of an arbitrary triangle such that the sum of the remote angles again, what was the meaning of remote angle? ED and F is 180 degrees. Then the circumcircle of the three triangles meet at a point and that is this point G here, right? So, first we constructed this and then we prove this in the same session, right? I hope you understood this. So, if you did not understand I would request go back to the video once again and watch it once more and I am very sure in the second round you will be able to understand the entire theorem fully. Thanks for your patience for this long session and we will meet with another theorem in the next session. Thanks a lot. See you.


From Sand Hill Road in the heart of Silicon Valley, it's theCUBE, presenting the People First Network, insights from entrepreneurs and tech leaders. Hello everyone, I'm John Furrier with theCUBE. We are here in Sand Hill Road at Mayfield's office here, talking about entrepreneurship, People First. This is our co-created program with Mayfield. I'm John Furrier, host with Mitchell Hachimoto who's the co-founder and co-CDO HashiCorp. Great to see you. theCUBE alumni, you're back on theCUBE. Thanks for joining me today. Yeah, thanks so much. I was here so long ago, like five or six years ago. So we've been really psyched about the program that Mayfield's supposed to be called People First. It's celebrating their 50th anniversary as a venture capital firm, which is historic in the sense that it's kind of still a young industry. Think about it. And love to have entrepreneurs come on because you've been very successful. We talked years ago, I think first year you were formed and cloud certainly has happened. Open source continues to pump more value.  The goodness in open source is certainly driving a lot of great software development.  So thanks for joining. So I got to ask you, you guys are growing right now. You have your venture backed. You got a unique culture. Explain HashiCorp, because you guys have a unique business. You're in open source, you're in cloud. You have a distributed workforce. Take a minute to explain what you guys are doing. Yeah, so we are trying to build, or have been building sort of infrastructure software in the future. We've been saying that since we were founded and what's been interesting is the future has changed quite a bit in the past six years. So there's been cloud, that was the big thing when we founded and then containers and now schedulers and Kubernetes and things like that. And while we're doing that, we're also sort of building what I think is sort of the company of the future, which is over 90% of our workforce is fully distributed. Basically, unless there's legal reasons not to be distributed, we are distributed. We're in multiple countries. We're in over 40 states. We, all of our process is built remote first. So everything happens, Slack, all our meetings are Zoom. Even our all hands, we present behind a camera and things like that. So I think that's all very unique, but only for now. I think that's a big question. How do you do the all hands, that's interesting. Do you have a camera to a Zoom or is it a camera live streaming? How do you do the all hands? Yeah, so we set up sort of an AV setup in our office because we have a few of the executives in the office that often are presenting on the all hands. And we set up a camera feed so that whether you actually decide to go into the office or whether you're at home, we want that experience to be authentic to both sides. We don't want a great in room experience and then one corner camera that makes it really hard to hear and stuff like that. So yeah, you have to walk up to the camera and be part of the Zoom to really be part of the all hands. So people feel present and connected. Right, exactly. And we force questions to come through Slack. There's no in person questions. We have to ask on Slack so everyone could see them and things like that. That's awesome. Talk about the journey as you start. You have a co-founder because of an interesting relationship. How did this all get started? What was the beginning genesis of HashiCorp like and take us through some of the early days? Sure, so I'm very lucky. I have a co-founder who before the company were best friends and after the company or during the company were still best friends. Rich, it isn't always the case. But in terms of Hosh Group itself, we were super lucky because we went to the University of Washington up in Seattle. And this was in sort of the mid 2000s. And this is a good time to be up there because cloud was starting to emerge and we were sort of equidistant geographically across the lake, if you will, to Amazon, Google, and Microsoft. And so we were getting early access to what they thought was sort of the cloud of the time and it was rapidly changing. We're getting access to servers with APIs and all this stuff. And being a university without a lot of funding, my job there was sort of to help us utilize all these resources. And so in the mid 2000s, Armand and I were already realizing, we're on the same team. Armand and I were already realizing that this is not a solved problem by any means. I mean, this is a new problem. And that, eventually, years later, became the genesis. And what was the problem that you saw immediately? It was sort of like multi-cloud resource management, deployment, security. It's funny because it's over 10 years later and it is the problem that enterprises are hitting right now. I mean, thinking about the early days of Amazon, I still have these memory flashbacks of EC2, long URLs. It's like, OK, now how do I redirect my web service to this? So it was easy to stand up on EC2 instance, put a little S3 to it. Then it's like, OK, now what? Yeah, we're at the right scale. I'll put this in there. So again, a little early, kind of build your own, kind of a junkyard. You build the car out of some spare parts. Then it had to mature really fast. Yeah, we're at the day zero stage then and now we're firmly in day two. And so what was the next step is can you peg the journey for us? Because obviously it grew up really fast and then it really kind of hit a tipping point around 2010, 11, 12, 13, it kind of grew like a weed. Yep, yeah, so around that time frame you just painted 2012 as when enterprises started adopting it. And I think a lot of that was single-cloud focused. It was very much like, this is our first cloud so we're going to land PureLan Amazon or something and focus on that. And we're at the point now about six years later, 2018, where the maturity around operating the cloud is sort of well understood and companies are now starting to sort of use what's best for the job and also realize that there's multiple clouds and we're keeping our private data centers. And also there's new things coming on the scene above clouds, sort of higher level like Kubernetes and how we're going to manage all of this. And so we like to describe it as sort of the mindset is like the cloud operating model. It's like you can't operate your resources in the cloud the same way you do on-prem. And people are starting to get that. That's like automation, very like people-focused workflows, things like that. And companies are getting that. And so now the challenge is this heterogeneous environment. So the top conversation in our office and everyone loves when I bring this, I want to get your definition and opinion. It's Kubernetes. Kubernetes is, you know, a lot of people love it. I've been having Kubernetes dreams these days because there's so much Kubernetes conversation happening. You got Kubernetes, you got the notion of service messages right around the corner. Stateful applications, that problem's really hard to work on. This has been around for a while. What's the importance of Kubernetes? What's the impact in your opinion, expert opinion? Why is Kubernetes important? And what's the impact of Kubernetes? Yeah, I think the more abstract thing that's important is the scheduler idea. And Kubernetes sort of builds on that. And really it's the idea of like, let's move away from looking at the individual machine and let's start moving higher level to just assuming resources are there. It's sort of like when you write the transition of when you're writing software from having to know how much memory you had let's just assume it's infinite and put whatever in there and it's, you know, someone else's problem. And we're sort of moving into that data center. It's like let's just assume we always have compute and storage and network and let's just deploy. And what freedom does that give you? And I think that's really what schedulers give you. And also when you sort of take away huge operability challenges of placing the application and giving that to a computer to put it in the right spot you can now deploy so many more applications because So you're freed up. You're freed up in a lot of ways. It introduces a lot of new challenges but that's a good problem. You want new challenges. You want to solve the old one. What are some of the new challenges that you see emerging that keep the evolution going? I think service mesh is a great example we could jump into which is that the challenge of, we like to describe service mesh as three fundamental problems which is discoverability, configurability and secure connectivity. If you have two services, that is not a problem because you could hard code the IPs, you could hard code the configuration and you could just hard code TLS certificates to make it work. When you have thousands of services that are coming and going and people are trying new services all time that has to all be automated. So the idea of service mesh is automating that and making it invisible, automatic, free and that's a new problem. And that's a huge concept. Huge. This is a scalable, scale out, huge concept and super important. Yes, yeah. This changes the game at many levels. What would you see that changing? What would some of the folks who are just now understanding service mesh what does it change downstream or down the road for enterprises and for businesses? I think the biggest change is a mind shift change from sort of perimeter or host-based security to identity and service-based security. So traditional sort of networking and security is very IP space focused is like this rack talk to this rack or no and things like that. And that has to all go away because that's restricting the placement that's not allowing apps to go anywhere. We have to move towards this service can or can't talk to this service, don't care where it is or anything and sort of move from a perimeter to just the perimeter being the app itself. So we have to sort of firewall and protect right at the app layer. And that's hard to transition that that's tooling change with education change, that's team change. I want to ask you, I can talk about this forever cloud automation is I think one of the most important thing that's only going to make AI more powerful and the data behind it and this new data merges. But I got to ask you about some of the new blood coming into the marketplace because traditionally if you think about service meshes oh it's just an awful problem to solve the software. But you actually got to have networking chops. You got to have to have a computer science or computer engineering. A new skill sets developing really fast in this new, I don't want to maybe call it under the hood. I don't know what to call it but maybe it's an engineering mindset where people, there's a huge demand for skills in automating. That's not your classic application developer. There's this great role for that and there's tons of apps being built but I'm talking about a new kind of operator. What's your take on this new skill, this new opportunity for people to learn and develop a career? Yeah, I think the real way to look at it, I like to look at it, is the difference between doing something once and creating a process to do something. And there's two different tasks, right? It's like when you get promoted for the first time from to manager, it's like the big challenge is learning how to teach others process and enforcing consistent process versus actually doing it yourself. And I think that's the difference between someone who's used to slinging, let's go back to even server automation, someone who's used to just manually clicking or slinging bash scripts to do one off task. You could be a wizard at that but then try to do that repeatedly, safely 9,000 times out of 9,000 times and now that's a resiliency challenge. That's sort of understanding failure modes. It's very different and I think that's the biggest skill set to adopt is I always push anybody in their job to just how do you not do your job? How do you move on to the next part? How do you eliminate your job? Yeah, basically. I always like the way you think about it. Yeah, what's the process? Is it possible right now? And if it's not possible, what's sort of blocking that? So I want to ask you a question. I love this. We can move on to some of the business sides in a second but I want to get your thoughts because I've been having conversations lately with cloud folks and engineers and developers around two words, replicating and reproducing. They're kind of two different concepts. Reproducing is doing the same thing over again. Make that spaghetti sauce, do it again. But then I write it down, is there a recipe? Or I could just hand you the recipe and say you make it yourself or automating it. So I think replicating also has scale. Reproducing requires the same components. Do you see DevOps evolving to a point where do it once and it's replicated or is there some reproduction involved reproducing things? Where is that, where do you see the tech happening? I think inevitably you're sort of doing both but my sort of dream world where I think it'll be still but I think it's sooner than we expect but I think sort of like 10 years from now as a safe sort of stage is sort of like every, doesn't matter if you're a Fortune 500 or a new company, sort of the way infrastructure server management goes is you just start with one server. I like to call it the stem cell server. You just start with one server, you say what you want and you just let it go and it's going to either replicate or reproduce. It's either creating something new or it's like creating more copies of itself but it'll turn into any sort of scale, Facebook level scale that you would want in theory. And I think that that's sort of my long fence post, guiding fence post that I always think about the problem. Talk about the culture of your company, you guys have a new CEO, you have a partner you've been best friends with so. I don't think it's that new, the CEO. Okay, he's been around for a while. A couple years.  Did you guys look at you and say, hey, we got to bring a CEO in so people like to have one of the founders be the CEO. Talk about that dynamic because that's a struggle for a lot of entrepreneurs to have the self-awareness and or the need to do that. Yeah, so Armand and I made the decision to look for a CEO if possible, I think three and a half or four years ago. It took us almost two years to find Dave. And our motivation was really, there's a few things.  And like, what do you bring to the company? And for us as founders, our skill set was product vision, engineering, sort of industry strategy, things like that. And it wasn't executive management, financing, building, you know, various teams like sales marketing, building out the corporate structure, that wasn't us. And so we looked at it and thought, we could learn it probably, but we would make mistakes and it would be hard. It's just not our passion, it's not what we want to do. Or we could try to find, someone who aligns with their culture and gets our vision, gets open source, things like that, bring them in and sort of scale to a way where we're giving our startup the best chance it has, which means we give it the value we do, which is engineering and product vision. And the new person coming in gives it that sort of corporate maturity and that's exactly what Dave did. That's awesome, and it's always hard to do that because you know, you got to have real maturity to make that happen, congratulations. Thanks, yeah. You know, a lot of us have that problem. And then one of my starters was like, I need a new CEO of the Ventures, we're guys, we're pushing it on you, but it's a challenge, you know, you got to think about, you know, then we'd have a business model back then, but it's a different story, but that's always a tough one. Now let's talk about the culture around where you started from and where you are now because a lot of the stories around entrepreneurship is team, culture, you know, how you're going to set up your future of work, which you guys have a good structure. Iterating and figuring out where the tailwind is. Are you at the spot where you thought you'd be at a few years ago when we first met? How has it evolved?  Can you share some of the journey color commentary with us? Sure, I mean, as a company size, we're nowhere near where I thought it would be. I think Armand and I came into it expecting failure, most likely, and so anything beyond that was just surprised. So that's great. I think the place we are where we thought we'd be is sort of the company culture and stuff, and that's something we've been very fiercely protective of, and we define our culture sort of as we publish it. We call the principle of Hosh Corp, which sort of revolve around kindness, honesty, humility, things like that, so it's who would we want to work with, and let's put words to it because we don't want it to be this nebulous thing, and so we've held to that really strongly. We're over 300 people now, and something Armand says, which I totally agree with, is I come into work, come into work, go to my remote office, but I come into work, and I'm excited to work with everyone at Hosh Corp, which is, in past jobs we've had, we'd come into work, and we're excited to work with two out of 10 people, and that's not a good ratio to have, and I think that's what I'm most proud of from the culture side, that the ways we've done that is like at the principles, we also have something called the TAO, which has been incredibly successful for us both internally and externally, which is how we view product development and design, and that helps sort of align the type of engineer who could get behind our vision and put some words to our vision, so it's not, again, nebulous, whatever the founders think. So they have expectations of what it's going to be like from a coding standpoint, contribution? Yeah, from how do you, I like to describe it as how do you build product and how do you handle people? We have the two sides totally published and we're pretty explicit about it. That's awesome. Talk about the role of open source and lots of changing, and you're seeing a lot of things like the Linux Foundation's CNCF massively commercializes, tons of money coming in there, but Linux Foundation has done a good job of keeping that pretty pure. Success on entrepreneurship and open source go hand in hand now, it's almost, it's really the perfect storm for creators. But there's a playbook, there's a way that's changed. Share your vision of how you think open source is today and where it needs to maintain and what could be changed for the better. Yeah, I think, so open source today is pretty much a default expected, accepted sort of pattern, which is really nice. It gives you community, so you could groundswell everyone, anyone could adopt your software without having to go through a sales person or something like that, which is really important. Anyone can contribute and make their mark on the software. It's a great way to sort of get career started. I think it brings a level of transparency to software that is, you know, you could hide behind closed source. It's like we like to tell our customers, it's like if you don't believe us, not only try it, but go look at how it works and it worked, we're telling you the truth. And I think that's really important. I think there's still a lot of challenges around how do companies sort of build successful businesses around it? I mean, I think we're doing all right and things like that, but there's still low number of data points. You know, always the challenge is, I want to get your reaction on this, is that as companies get involved, the classic reaction was, oh, we've got the big companies now in this open source project, it's going to be land grabbed, they're going to put their fingers in there, need better governance, things fracture, where ideally it's an upstream project where everyone contributes for the better good and then people pull it downstream. I mean, that's the basic ethos of open source. That's the main, that's the playbook that we want, right? Do you believe that's the ideal scenario? I think that, yeah, I think shared ownership is really important, but I also think that sort of unified vision is equally important. So, that's a healthy tension to me, which is that you have a huge community that wants to pull the project in different directions and I think if you don't, if you have a governance that's totally fair, what ends up happening in my opinion is you end up getting camels instead of horses, right? Like you start pulling in all these different directions, you sort of need a slightly unfair governance model, so there is somebody that says, this is the direction we're going. And that person needs to be someone that's trusted by the community. And Linux was very successful with that too, I mean. Right, and I think Linux is an example of a project that reaches a point where that's, the vision is obvious and clear and it reaches a point where, Linux could step down for a bit and take a break and it still runs fine and it's, but it's a- In the early days you need to be on dictator to say look, we gotta do this. Right, Linux is a 25, 30 year old project versus some of these CNCF projects that are two or three years old and I think that's where you absolutely need strong leadership. Well we'll see, we'll look at the contribution, we'll look at that. We've obviously followed that pretty heavily and appreciate the Kubernetes commentaries. We think that's super important too. Obviously containers, it's pretty much voted, it's open now. Yeah, so yeah. We know that. Okay, so I got to ask you the final question. As an entrepreneur, access to capital, super important. How did you guys go about it? How did you raise money? How should people raise money today? Obviously you're an entrepreneur in the ecosystem, you're out in the front lines building a company. How did you guys access to capital? How should people figure this out? Yeah, I mean you just, you gotta tell people why, you know it's a marketing problem in a way but you gotta tell people why what you're working on matters because it's so obvious to you as a founder. That's easy, it's about how do you articulate that and tell people why it's important and not just to you but to the market and how it's going to help people. And we did that and I think our biggest challenge was we had to do that across six or seven products which is we had a lot of pressure to like why don't you just do one thing but it was because for us what was important was not just what the product did but the greater vision behind why are we doing six things. And that we just, you know, you say that and you find people who believe it and they help you. And as you guys, a great example of you're on a big wave with cloud and open source, how should entrepreneurs and what do you guys do to do this? Maybe it's more of advice or anecdotal observation. As you have the dynamics with investors, advisors, service providers, how do you get the most out of them and how do you manage that board dynamic because when you have an emerging market there's a danger saying we got to lock in a business model. So an open source helps you get a little bit more freedom there because you're open source but that's always a danger and as an entrepreneur you got to balance that. Okay, we got to move the needle but let's not overdrive too hard. How should entrepreneurs handle that and take advantage of their investors and boards and how should they manage them or work with them? Yeah, I think on one side you need sort of like multiple pillars and on one pillar you need a strong vision. So you need what won't you sacrifice on? Sort of what's the fence post in the distance and maybe the journey there is slightly different but you know what you're sort of heading towards. So that always grounds you. I think the second thing is sort of a level pragmatism. Like you need to have that vision but you need to meet your customers where they are and so you need to figure out what you need to give them today but still head towards that vision and when you have those two things you have a board that is on board with both of those things. You have the founders that are dedicated to that and you have employees as well and everything sort of moves in the right direction. You got to lay that out. You have to be pretty explicit about it, yeah. All right, well congratulations on all your success and looking forward to following up and seeing you guys are doing thanks for coming and sharing your thoughts today. Thank you. Appreciate it. I'm John Furrier here at Mayfield for the 50th anniversary. Part of our People First Network coverage. I'm John Furrier, thanks for watching.


Hey everyone October is in the book so I wanted to share with you our closed trades for the month of October starting with our dynamic calendar spreads. Really good month for calendars this month booked almost 15,000 in profits on 12 trades just two losers with a win rate of 83.33 so calendar spreads continue to do really well even in this volatile environment that just goes to the methodology of how we trade these things. Good stuff for calendar spreads. On iron ducks we had seven trades seven winners no losers a little over $2,100 in profit on our ducks our biggest one was in SPX about a 33% winner. Butterfly spreads had six trades three winners three losers a just small profit there $235 for the month in fact one of those losers was an exact scratch zero but I counted it as a loser because you do have some commissions in there most likely then options selling we had 10 trades only one loser a little over $2,000 had our very first loss on our short strangle strategy in ZN I mean that market just kept pushing lower and lower lower in fact if we had waited two more days before we close that out that actually would have been a positive P&L but can't do that that is hindsight we show all trades winners and losers still a nice positive month in our option selling strategies a little over 2,000 day trading continues to do well Dr. Chad is running our live stream he booked over 6,700 in profits in October I only day traded two different days 527 one day and 660 the next so a little under $1,200 for the month on day trading for myself by the way for day trading one of the reasons I have not been day trading these strategies as much because I've been testing a new days trading strategy that we're going to be rolling out to our community very soon so pretty excited about that NTT which has been one of our staple consistent profit puppies a little bit down this month down 7 7k this is the account that I opened last August with $20,000 had a run up to about 73,000 it's in a little bit of a drawdown right now it's at about 67,000 as we speak so still profits overall but in a drawdown right now if you can see the the win rate this month was pretty atrocious about 30 a little over 30% it's usually between 55 and 60 our average winner still bigger than our average loser but that win rate was was the was the problem there so look for that to bounce back here over the next couple months and then lastly I did take one what I call an other trade because it doesn't really have a category this was an earnings vertical I took a shot with tiny trade in meta meta dropped about 20% after earnings so that didn't work out well so just took a $410 loss on that one I usually do this once a year but figured I'd just key you in on where we're at for the year here's where we're at on calendar spreads we're up over 53,000 for the year which is our most profitable strategy we use the most capital on that one as well iron ducks are actually in the red a little bit down 3000 butterflies have been our worst down almost 12,000 and not to excuse this away but you know with uh June and September there's definitely some trades that I let get away from us in fact iron ducks as well especially in January had too many positions on and let some losers get away so part of that I just blame on me not necessarily the strategy but we show all winners and losers so it is what it is NTT up almost 39,000 for the year so that's been our second best as far as overall profit goes options selling we've had very few losers all year in this we do use a little bit smaller position size but almost 9,000 in profits on those trades day trading almost 30,000 profits by the way I'm showing zeros here we were day trading but I stopped tracking my performance because we were transitioning over to Chad run in the live stream I know there were there were profits in there but I didn't I wasn't really tracking them so I just put zeros here so in fact that's that number's probably a little bit light but but that's okay and then other a little over 3700 so up over 119 for the year total profits for the month with all strategies almost 20,000 so two more months left in the year we'll look forward to continuing that momentum and finishing strong if you're interested in following what we're doing just go to navigation trading dot com slash pricing or you can click on the pricing button at the top of any page at navigation trading dot com we've got a few different membership options number one we've got a free membership if you're just starting out we give you five core strategy courses excuse me um our we've been told our free membership is better than a lot of paid membership so if you're interested you can check that out if you're really serious about getting access to all the different strategies that that I went over here in real-time trade alerts access to the live stream room all that good stuff you can get that with pro all access or if you want to just focus on one strategy at a time you just want to join one of the strategy memberships we have one we have an individual membership for calendar spreads one for butterfly spreads one for ntt one for day trading one for iron ducks and one for option selling so if you just want to focus on one of those keep in mind all of those are included everything's included in the in the pro all access so if you're serious about becoming a professional trader or consistently profitable trader to see exactly what we're doing a lot on all of these strategies pro all access is the way to go so navigation trading dot com and click on pricing to get here uh look forward to having the uh next couple of months to end the year be good one so look forward to having you join us and we'll see you on the inside


What's going on guys welcome to a brand new video game review today? We're discussing spider-man for the ps4 game just came out. I'm loving it I hope you guys are loving it too, but maybe you haven't picked it up and made yet And maybe you stumbled upon this review wondering should I pick up this game? Well, my first answer to you is yes, you need to get this game now if you need a little bit more convincing That's what this review is for I've been planning on doing more video game reviews and content on this channel And I'm so happy that I get to start with spider-man because spider-man for the ps4 Touched me in a lot of different ways and Not types of when you're touching yourself types of ways, but some of the stuff where it really affected me And we'll get into that a lot of that's what the story one of the things I do want to touch on first before we get into a lot of my prose is my nitpicks Some my nitpicks can be with the combat and some of the boss battles feeling a little bit repetitive Just in a sense it never gets boring in a sense where you're bored But it can be a little bit too easy once you get the hang of it now the game is tough beforehand I think this game is very tough at times. It's not one of the easiest games I play but When you do get the hand of the combat, I felt like it just got a little bit too simplified And I would have liked a little bit more from it besides that let me tell you guys about my big prose Those are really just my nitpicks, but one of the big things I'm sure you guys are wondering is how was the web So how was swinging around New York City? It's spectacular. It's ultimate and it's amazing. Yes I just did some spiders swinging stuff and yeah, it's web-tastic. Yes I'm done with my puns now from spider-man, but it really is perfect. I cannot express enough how much I love the web-slinging I I've never used fast traveling. I used it once when it made me besides that I love swinging around New York City Exploring it finding all the little different Easter eggs in here, especially the collectibles I'm not a collectibles guy get these bad packs and when you find them it opens up a different piece because obviously this takes Place eight years in the down the road after Peters through college after Peters through high school He's a he has a job. He has a relationship that's kind of falling He has to deal with balancing between Peter Parker and spider-man, which is something that we see in the movies But the movies touch on it and touch on in a very good way But I feel like this is the best interpretation of it But again going back to the collectibles the collectibles are Unique because you pick up a backpack and it might have a business card from say Murdoch and You might know who Murdoch is if you guys know that's an Easter egg But they have little Easter eggs in here with that where you pick up different type of bad packs And it's memorabilia through the world where it flashes out the world where it fleshed out spider-man's character And there's so many Easter eggs like that where it flashes it out in a very unique way where I was sitting there going man I want to explore this world even more And that's where I really hope that we get a sequel and it that even some add-ons to hold me over because man I cannot wait for this game sequel especially with the story in here the story is a 20-hour story around so well That's where it took me along to beat it the story again You play as Peter Parker and spider-man since such a unique light that you understand who he is and what he is and Balancing his life going to his job worrying about eviction notices worrying about your relationship crumbling with MJ It all works on a fashionable light and it at by the end of the game It got very emotional in such a unique way that I was so impressed with how this game worked in that Because I always thought in the beginning of your God of War is gonna win game of your hands down best story best gameplay It still has the best gameplay in my opinion. I don't it's kind of tied for my favorite story being told this year I got again very emotional and kind of almost cried towards the end Maybe you guys will see when I when you see it But it's really just a payoff at the end and I love that part of this game All the side characters in here really much are placed in here and perfectly none of them fill shoe in Mary Jane's a wonderful charming girl you get to play as her in some stealth sections I could have been a little bit better, but never dragged out They were always short enough to the point where you got through them And you also get to learn about Miles Morales in here who again I was worried he was gonna be shooting him when showing him the trailer, but no he works perfectly He's not just an Easter egg He is particularly good to the story and is needed for the story to be essential again Maybe you can take him out and maybe change around through things and everything will be the same But it was a nice fleshing out thing for the world again overall spider-man the game is perfect It's probably I would even go as far as say one of the best superhero games ever made right up there with Arkham City even better Maybe I got to sit back on this and think about it Let's say I'm gonna spider-man the game a nine out of ten. Absolutely love this game cannot wait to be played I'm almost done with a hundred percent completion with all the trophies and everything other that sense the game so open world It's so so much stuff to do so much stuff so many side quests so many side missions so many side crimes I love this game. I cannot wait to get your guys CP back on this Tell me guys have you guys played out this game yet?  Do you plan on picking it up? Let's talk about it down below in the comments And of course if you guys are new here hit up sandwich on films right down there because right down there you Can get into advanced movie screens and also check out some movie news and also some movie reviews But guys of course until next time yeah, I'll stay classy