Computers keep changing the world, but their power and safety is limited by their rigid design. The T2TILE project works for bigger and safer computing using living systems principles. Follow our progress here on T Tuesday Updates. This is the 23rd T Tuesday Update. Let's get into it. This is the third and I guess final wall of science week that I've been focusing on working on this artificial life research paper to be sending off to the conference that will be happening in the UK this summer. And so I haven't been talking about the stuff that I've been working on mostly, which I don't like because I've been trying to be really as transparent as I possibly can, even sort of beyond what's comfortable sometimes, just so to share the process. I mean, whatever it is of trying to build this thing to demonstrate a way to compute and to maybe change the world a little bit a lot, however it works out. So hopefully next week we'll get we'll get back to more normal forms and we'll see how it goes. 23rd T Tuesday Updates. That means three more weeks. That will be the 26th episode. That's half a year just since I've been talking to y'all and it's been quite a ride so far. I would really like it. It wouldn't it be nice if by half a year since the T2 tile project has been in existence we could say the tiles are being manufactured. Wouldn't that be great? I think it's more possible than any previous goal that I've set and failed at, whether it could actually have an I don't know we'll see. Today I'm going to talk more about 3D printing stuff because that's been going on one way or another both the plot and the printing continuously in the background. In fact, it's going on continuously in the background. Now you may hear it singing there were you so often and a little bit about the bill of material stuff and then this will probably be another short one. We'll see how it goes. I got some feedback that the bill of materials is big old boring. On the one hand, it is like it's not like we have a showrunner. It's not like we have a writing room that says what's going to be the interesting bit and what isn't. This is the plot. This is what we've got. Try to go through it as quick as I can. This is a kind of weird, they talk about police procedure roles and legal procedure roles and TV shows and stuff. So this is some kind of weird research engineering activism procedural. So it's kind of like whatever the plot is is what's the plot. But of course the point of the writing is to actually make it be interesting. All right, well anyway, so in the bill of materials we had been working on getting rid of the last bits of red from the spreadsheet. The hex nuts, these were the nuts from Dubai that we actually got in. So those are set and what's remaining is just regular screws, little M3 screws to connect to the standoffs, to attach boards to things and so forth. I ordered a bunch of a sample set of those, a pack of 100. We'll talk about that in a minute. Then J7, which is the header for the displays to connect the displays to the thing. J9, which is for the debug connection, which is not that important until you need it and they're really important. And then P8 and P9, which are these forever aggravating connectors for the Beaglebone itself. So as of now, oh yeah, and so I'd finally pulled the trigger last week on trying to get the P8s and the P9s. Instead of going to Digi-Key, I put an order for Digi-Key for J7 and J9, but for P8 and P9, I just tried to go back to AliExpress to pay $86 instead of $280 in change. We'll see how that went today as well. All right, so I ordered some of these screws from this company Granger that I found that has a store in Albuquerque, a warehouse in Albuquerque, I'd never heard of these guys. They're industrial supply mostly, but they have all kinds of stuff. And I got the socket cap screws from Sample Socket Cap Screws from a while ago. I ordered some little of these M3 screws. They came in, so I went to get them. This is what the place looks like, and this is what I look like at Granger. Whoops, this is what I look at at Granger. Here we are. And once again, I didn't take any pictures inside, although I wasn't actually as threatened by the guys, the repairmen and the workers and stuff. There's always people there who are buying parts or trying to get replacement parts for some incredibly crazy gizmo. And they're generally guys, they're generally pretty grizzled and been seen a lot of that outdoors. And I don't know if they really know what to make of me, but no one's been disrespectful and it's always been fine. And in fact, I even had some chit-chat about what the heck is the part that you're trying to do. And he's like, oh, it's a pneumatic hammer, shifter, connector, inverter, or something whatever. So that was fine. And I got these M3 5mm screws. They are cheesehead screws, which I think is because if you look at them, you can see that they actually have a little bit of... Well, I got it on the next picture. So here's one of the screws again. Sorry about the focus on the actual board screwing down into a standoff as a test. By comparison, though, here is one of the screws that I had just gotten from a kit of standoffs and so forth. And I actually think I like the littler one bigger. I mean, this one you can still see a little bit of the grounding ring around this thing, which is in the cheesehead thing. It's actually the head is bigger, not just thicker, but even bigger around than I kind of was expecting. So I got the cheesehead ones because that's all that Granger had in the M3 and the 5mm, rather than the Panhead, which is lower. And looking at it end on, you can see the difference. There's the cheesehead. And I think it's called a cheesehead because it looks like an entire wheel of cheese that you're looking at it through a very large magnifying glass, back when people knew what wheels of cheese looked like, versus the Panhead, which is quite a bit lower. And I think I need the Panhead ones because this thing is going on the Beagle bone and the display is going to be right on top of it. There's not a lot of clearance there. So I think probably these cheesehead screws are not going to work, but that was six bucks or whatever. So I'm not quite solved there. Once again, these screws are not necessary to pull the trigger for ETS. So these are not on the absolute critical path anyway. All right. On the other hand, the J7 and J9, which I ordered from Digikey, they are on the critical path. They were scheduled to show up on Friday. And sure enough, they did. Here's our Digikey package. And here they are. And I've marked them so that we can tell what their inner packs really kind of need to be marked as well. These are the 2x13 connectors for the display. These are the 1x6 connectors for the debug UART. Somebody, I'm sorry, I don't remember the handle, was commenting on the YouTube channel that you can make these yourself.  And I do know that. And in fact, if one looks at the video where I was assembling a board by hand, a long time ago it seems you can actually see me cutting some of them by hand. The thing is that if I'm going to be asking the ETS guys to do it, they're going to be cutting them by hand at $15 an hour. And they just look better if you get them stamped out actually at whatever length they're supposed to be. So I kind of wanted to get the official ones rather than telling the ETS guys, hey, just chop off however much you need. So we got them. And here's the 1x6 in the J9 thing. They're all nice and gleaming. These pins are bronze, just sort of mix of metals, but they actually have actual gold flash and incredibly thin layer of gold over the entire thing, which is why they're so gleaming and makes them conduct electricity very nicely. Is it super overkill? The general idea is if you're going to be having a connection that you're making and breaking a lot, you want to have something that's like gold. It could even be thicker gold rather than gold flash, but it's a lot more expensive so that you don't get corrosion. And so, you know, we got the good stuff. So there's the 1x6. Here's the 2x13 for the display. Same thing, gold flash over the whole thing. We are done. J7, J9, check. On the other hand, I ordered the... So the lot at AliExpress was a single lot for $43. $43 was $200 of these things. Of the PAP9, we need two of them. So $200 would do 100 tiles. So I ordered two lots to have enough for 200 tiles. That's the $85. And the order went nowhere. It didn't ship on the first day. It didn't ship on the second day. It didn't ship on the fifth day. So, you know, of course, I was, you know, rechecking. And, you know, if they don't ship within something like 7 business days or whatever it is, the order automatically cancels. And I'm like, well, geez, you know, these guys had pretty good scores as far as what people were saying about their shipping speed, what's going on? So I reloaded the next day. And, you know, all right, now it's two days and it still isn't going. So yesterday, I, you know... Is this order going to ship today?  At that point, I thought I actually could just cancel it unilaterally, but it turns out since I've put the money into escrow or paid them or whatever it is, actually apparently I can't cancel it unless the seller agrees. So I'm not exactly sure what my rights were. I thought I could just... Because there's a button that says cancel, but actually it's a button that says request cancellation. So I went ahead and did that. Five hours later. Now it's shipped. And now we've gone from a waiting shipment to a waiting delivery. Your order will be closed in 38 days. No, that's just the outside limit for when AliExpress says the thing is blown. You know, the order was 23 days is what the order said, so we shall see. I'm very afraid because I didn't spring for the super expensive DHL shipping and everything. We'll see what happens. So that's it for the bill of materials. Let's talk about 3D printing. You will recall that when last we were talking about this, I had finally managed to figure out that my problem was not down in the nozzle of the extruder, but way up at the top because I'd gotten the end piece of the thing that hadn't gotten backed out by the filament sensor, which didn't seem to sense, and so on. I got this thing out and so forth. For a while after that, things were good. Not so great since then. Who's Prusaari now? All right. So here it is. So we got the thing fixed and then we were printing these great four cases at a time. It took like 10 hours. Start one before you go to bed that's there around noon the next day, whatever it is. But this didn't last too long. I started getting this. It was an error min temp bed that spoiled the print. This is my output.  Ha, ha. PLA doesn't really recycle very well. So I just sort of collect it up and say, I don't know what we're doing with it. Lots of things that look like case tops. Why? Because they were failed prints and most, well, many of these anyway were for this error which apparently means that the bed of the printer, the stuff that you print on looked to be zero temperature or too low. And I started to realize that when the min temp bed error would occur, typically it was in the back left corner of the print bed. And it did seem to be a pattern there. It wasn't all the same number of layers in. This is, I don't know, maybe 20 layers in or 10, something like that. That would vary, but it was pretty much in that corner. And I thought that was a clue. I thought the cable bundle coming off the extruder and the cable bundle coming off of the bed in fact kind of run into each other and push each other back and forth, especially when the extruder is back in that corner. And it seemed likely that there's a flaky connection, a flaky wire from the temperature sensor in the bed to the logic inside the printer and it's triggering this min temp error. Google it. Other folks have seen it. Nothing really all that slam dunk description like what I had. Although similar stuff. I was sort of surprised at first and then kind of relieved that min temp bed errors aren't unique to the Prusa printer because it's using this Marlin based, a code base for driving the printer that other 3D printers use as well. So other folks, the Creality people, they can get min temp errors to min temp bed errors. So Prusa 3D says want to ask something? You can ask us anything. They have a thing. So I contacted them and I got absolutely nothing. I sort of expected to get an email from CCC of the message that I typed into their web browser so I didn't actually catch a copy of the thing. So I was asking them, what did I do about this error min temp bed error? I bought the thing preassembled. I bought it through UNM and so on and so forth. Nothing, day after day after day and nothing. Eventually I sent a follow up. I contacted you last week about error min temp bed. Do you need details on the printer and so forth? And still, nothing.  I bought it as an assembled printer. I really don't want to have to learn how to disassemble the whole thing in order to fix it. What should I do? I sort of did expect to hear something so far, nothing at all. And so I'd given them some more information about when I got it. In particular, I rechecked and it was shipped in May. And we're supposed to have a one year warranty for the rest of the world when you purchase a fully assembled printer. So this thing is like, covered. You know, our support team is ready to assist you with any issues that may appear. Not so much, not so much. At this point, the fact that I can't actually hear from Prusa is kind of bugging me a little bit more than, okay, the thing is sort of falling apart. I mean, I've been using it quite a bit. But I expected that there would be actual support. So that's kind of a bummer. But we'll see what's going on. So in the meantime, since it seemed like it was the back left corner that was sensitive to getting these min temp bed errors, I took the, you know, Dr. Hertz when I do this approach to dealing with it. And I did this. I made a version that only has three up and avoids the back left corner. And this actually has been working quite well. And I've been printing threes. And I got far enough, in fact, that I was getting to the bottom of the next real of Prusament Galaxy Black.  I'm using official company store stuff. I was way too terrified to go ahead and see if it was going to work automatically. But I went and I got my next roll of the Galaxy Black PLA and pulled it out, got it ready, the thing got lower, and then I just did it by hand. I paused the print, unloaded the filament, pressed the knob, pulled the roll off, put the new roll on with its whole special laser printed stuff so that you can track its vintage, just like a championship horse. It does look nice. It wasn't as perfectly flat of wind as my first real was. Load the filament, got extrusion going. Yes, it's correct. And back in business. So I've been collecting up these things in boxes. And that would have been fine, but no, that was just the next issue. Then I started, well, okay, yeah, every so often I would get a bad first layer, but okay, it seems like the calibration shifts or whatever, but I've gotten used to that to check it, but this was not the same old thing. Now I got print fan error. Like that. Go Google that. Well, you know, the print is, the fan is blocked. No, it wasn't blocked. It might be if you used a completely not working note, appears to be working and so forth. If you replace the fan with something that doesn't support RPM sensing, you can turn off the monitoring and blah, and if it stops working, and again, this looks like another flaky connection. So once again, it's damn the torpedoes. Went into the settings mode. Check fans on. No, I turned it off. And now we're back in business and the fan is still working. So bottom line, we're generating these things. This is 36 cases. That's almost two power zones right there. We've got another one like that. Pretty well going. We'll see if the thing holds together long enough to get there. All right. So we're out of time. The paper is going to ship this week. Thanks everybody for asking me why aren't I writing when I was out at that there. We did get the the one week extension, which I've been counting on. That's this week and it's until the end of this week. Now there might be a couple of secret extra days to work on it a little more over the weekend. We'll see if there is. I will be doing so. And that's that. The next update will be out a week from today. Happy birthday to my sister. And thanks for watching. See you next time.


Alrighty, let's watch this in full here. There is sound awesome action sound. Let's go Yeah That's awesome. All right. Let's put the sound quickly back on the only thing I would say here is that lots of cool stuff, but I Feel like the sounds of the machine gun where we're gonna call this on a chopper. It's just too much for too long goes on and on goes on and on Cuz on and on the guy is falling asleep here in the trigger So to me it seems like a little bit more rhythm where it's almost like you want to start with this not on screen yet And it could be I Mean you could start with this go on. I mean it could also just have No, you want to Maybe that might be up there. I can't be honest. I can't remember what I said last time and I should but I can't I know I had specific comments about the entrance But right now I would say what if you do it like this where or however you want to stage or move these further back So we don't see them and it starts off with shots first And then a dragon comes in the first thing that to me is that it's already All happening at the same time all of this is happening this and this and I think it would be needs to stagger it So you see you can almost have nothing happening then Shots where this is going on so we're going. Oh the eye goes straight to here and Then as we see the firing the eye goes over there Which then you have the dragon appear and then you got the chopper pier So it's kind of a one two three in terms of where to look at that's what I would do But then I would have just put more rhythm in the shooting where am I it shoots Wait a bit shoot again BAM explosion and then no shooting because maybe The people in there to only see fire. They don't quite know what's going on where the dragon is and Then as we go back into like oh, it's there. That's there then shoot again on that turn Here watch out seems to get hit So I know if you want if that's on purpose or if you want to make sure that there's some blood I don't want to do here and Then maybe a pause a bit and as it comes back into frame and it's alone then you can shoot again Because here it's nice, but there's a little break But even here I would time the sound which is this And then when it stops stop the sound of the shooting And even through all of this I would have no shooting sounds That's all for the sound visually a lot of cool things only like two or three moments where I felt like that's kind of weird Subjectively as always all right It would be really cool I don't if you can do that, but imagine the dragon comes through like the head peeks through this Comes through the fire And if you want to do that then bigger or darker clouds might be kind of cool This feels like it's going behind it, but I don't know. I know you have it set up But it'd be kind of fun, especially with this you have a nice silhouette where You know, it's a dragon. It's gonna be used to fire Punctures through this But it's really cool. It really needs the only thing I would say here It starts to feel like it's it wants to go up, but it can't really You think that it will continue to go up so that this point those feet already up here like this one's here This one's here. So this feels like it's suddenly grabbing towards us with this even though it's cool to have all this last minute It just feels path-wise a bit strange It's all cool and at this point Goes up so feet up here. That's kind of the biggest thing here On the dragon. I like the old Flaps are cool Maybe a bit too even in timing here if you watch this you got one two pause and one two three four five It's a bit to where it's I will go When it may be a half flap and then one two Three four five things have something where it's a bit more Say texture in timing, which I'm seeing a bit more some variation in contrast in that But as it happens, it's cool. You got your drag overlap in the tips Go here Broken wings for the up. That's fine And then going in here for a drag on that it seems like you have a back to front Flap you might even go a bit more But I think that angle is a bit hard to see but it all feels really nice Also the influence here It's really neat I don't know what's going on the choppers the chopper have a weird Why rotation in the body was pointing this way it's pointing at us and Then kind of three-quarter watch out for that. That's a bit funky Same thing here watch out. It has a bit of a Right there a bit of a sharp white turn Where I will go a bit more they can craft choppers can crab a lot So at this point if it's still that nose Here ish would be a bit more pointed this way and then maybe Even here you're pointing away from us this way then it comes back a bit this way Bop-bop It's cool though. It's cool to have That there though. I think it's overall very neat This biggest thing to me is just kind of dial thing watch out on that and the rhythm of this This going through the fire whoopie cool It's not a deal-breaker But the biggest thing is this grabbing here towards us It just gets very big and it kind of pops out of frame and you have big shapes You're just gonna pop out over one frame. So we'd have that a bit more gradual Then that's cool like all of this Little adjustment couple flaps there. That's cool And then you got this guy coming up showing the next threat. I think that's a really great change It's really nicely done Happy picky. I would say cheat the texture and put some snow here because we're losing the silhouette It's be cool to kind of have a nicer view They're dragging at that point Maybe that's one thing you can do is maybe put some haze like a hardware fog that kind of very subtle Maybe that's gonna get hazed out a little bit then you can see a bit more of the dragon however you want to do it This one I felt is a bit strong in the up and down And what do I know if that's part of the camera or Not it seemed maybe both camera and dragon, but I would reduce the up and down translate a little bit So the thing that happens here though is as we get into this was this all clear That's cool see the next guy. All right, that's cool Then it gets a bit funky. I would avoid pops like this where stuff just comes into frame So the other thing is let me see that's cool. We see this That's fine again. It's a bit the bummer that this does not happen here for a nice silhouette for that chopper up there Even here rides that line it'd be nice to be just here. So I guess I clean a silhouette then let's be careful the rotor stuff I Guess you're going for action here It just it just feels a bit distracting and poppy. I think it's not reading too well there and Then we have a lot of crazies in the camera. I Think it's a bit too crazy. I would for now just keep it a bit more static So camera really wouldn't have any shake here. It's just trying to frame the action. I would keep it a bit more Conservative in your movement so that you don't have any because if you take this out Maybe the shake was because of that impact here. I would just personally I would for now take that out So you just concentrate on nice clean Framing emotions to be understand what's going on here, but then it's a lot of stuff that goes down this way But then it suddenly changes and then the dragon head has this big move over there It's right at the end. It's a big thing that's only happens at the end gets to be confusing I personally will keep this clean where it comes in here Hits this and then drives it down this way continue this way and not do that and then the other thing is You're going left and right I guess you're trying to tie in that it starts to go this way Looking right to left and we continuing right to that was that was the other thing that comes a bit strange I'll keep that clean I mean what you can do is since we're so close and it comes in and continues that way what you can do is Have this element here. I Careful not too much. I mean, I know we're headed It would be headed this way So the eye goes from here to here So maybe run the center would be too jarring and then the path can be like this So has a slight little bit of a change Into this which is cool. The only thing here is that the stop is a bit abrupt here if I look at the dragon. Wow Really stops Very quickly here. I don't know that seems like either linear key on the dragon Seems like it was I don't see anything crazy on the camera unless the pan and rotation here is smooth But you translate down, but I would feel like you would still see it here. So watch out. What's going on here and Again, I would cheat the texture so you don't have so much darkness here Try to keep this like super white with some streaks like this some blotches there But keep the super white to have a really nice silhouette, but I love this That's great. Yeah, it seems like that sudden stop on that dragon is slightly strange And I would probably just You can the dragon come down right and still flap and do this But you can still continue to fall down it can still go down a bit with some flaps to slow it down But I feel like you want to continue to go down with the camera with the dragon Following this as it goes down. It seems like we have just that sudden stop like I said Then we kind of stay put there, but it's really cool really nice change. I love how All of this happens is very cool. So yeah, that is that thanks All right, there's an email you can sign up you can start whenever you want you can submit whatever you want You get 16 submissions either way like and subscribe would be awesome. All right. Thank you


Vse, češi, češi. Svaj, daj, daj, daj, daj. Sveč sem Darjo, češi, daj, daj, daj, dober, dober. Zelo v pomečenju, naredil na toh, in pa se izgleda na te, da je zapečen, da je zapečen, na vrtu, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, nekaj nekaj, V CPU pining, a then I'm done. I'm not. It's not... That's the bulk of it actually… but there's a couple of more things, at least, in my opinion. Let's start having a very quick look at this… class of processors of CPUs, which are the CPUs from AMD, the so-called Epic or Epic II because it's a second generation of… vstupne,Relena,7.002. Ko lahko je vstupredni modulz in sečenice, z nove, naj zelo, vse če bomo kako tega. En od vsej vsej vsej izdelikovate Vio, in z več nekaj skaliv, v veselce, nekaj vsej vsej v veselce in, One is dedicated to alloys, the iodine. And the other eight ones are the actual compute dies. Then there is the concept of core complex, CCX, which is basically a set, a combination of four cores, which also means eight threads, because these processors have hyperthreading. And we will look into this a little bit more later. Ič core complex has its own L12L3 cash hierarchy. But, yeah, we will see about this later. Let's also introduce the concept of core complex die on CCD, which is basically two CCXs. And so eight cores, 16 threads. Ič CCD, this is the important part, this is the important thing about CCDs. Ič CCD has dedicated Infinity Fabric, its name of the technology, link to the iodine. Right. And so these are processors that can have up to 64 cores, which means 128 threads, and you can have them in two socket arrangements. So, yeah. And each socket has eight memory channels for two-to-to-to-word memory. So, yeah, these are links if you download the slides and navigate them to fetch more information, but you can easily find a lot more information on Google. So, I said that this talk is going to be about tuning, virtualization, and some workload at least, running inside virtual machines. We will, I will say a few things, most of which are going to be general enough, but we will use a case study throughout the talk. And so, I will speak about this effort, this work that we did together, us, Suze, with AMD as a partner, on coming up with a set of tuning advice for optimizing the performance of one of our Suze products, Suze Linux Enterprise Server 15 SP-1, which is pretty much the same as Open Suze Leap 15.1, on this class of AMD processors. So, I will use these as a case study. That's important to say and to remember. Right. So, this is another way to look at a one specific instance of the series of processors that I introduced before, the 7.7.42, whatever. It's a big one. It's one of, it's the biggest setup, the one that I said that has 64 cores, which means 128 threads, and comes into sockets. And this is the one that we used for this guide and the one that I'm going to refer to for this talk. Close up on one CCX. This is what I was saying. So, each CCX has its own L3 cache. And of course, each core also has a dedicated L1 and L2, as usual. But the fact that there is an L3 cache per CCX and, for example, not per NUMA node, it's a little bit, well, it's not weird. But it's something specific about this architecture, something which is at least very different than many other architectures that you find around, at least in the x86 world. And, yeah, tuning the performance basically means if you really want to try to achieve performance in side VMs, which that matches the one that you would get on bare metal, then it also means static partitioning. You cannot avoid doing at least some of that. And that it still makes sense to speak about virtualization. Then if we have to partition resources statically, well, yes, according to me, at least, especially on such a large platform, because you can still use it for server consolidation, because it's so huge that you can put a lot of VMs on it. And then you have the argument about flexibility and high availability and other stuff. So what resources are we talking about partitioning? Well, all the relevant resources, CPU, memory, and IO, these talk will be focusing on CPU and memory. IO, we'll leave it for another one. So the first kind of partitioning is going to be between host and guest, or guests, meaning that you want to, most of the time, want to leave some of the resources, namely some CPUs and some memory to the host, because you have to connect with SSH or whatever to the host to do monitoring or management. And then oftentimes, depending on the configuration, but most of the time, the host has to carry out some activity on behalf or to help, let's say like that, the VMs, for example, for doing IO, running the QMU IO threads, whatever. Requendation, well, it depends on what are your actual goals. One good rule of thumb is to leave at least one core per socket to host activities. Also, on this particular architecture, it will be better if you manage not to break, for example, what we said before, to be the CCX, because otherwise you will have the VMs, or some of the VMs, and the host sharing and the electric ashes, which is generally not something that you want for good performances. If possible, you should also try to not break a CCD, but then that would mean leaving eight core 60 threads for the host, which you may or may not want to do. And the RAMs, how much memory to leave to the host, it really depends, let's say 50 gigabytes, and be done with it. So another thing, huge pages, so whether or not use huge pages and how to use them, typically, and this is one of the general things, this is really general about virtualization, not really specific about this platform, if possible, you always want to use huge pages for the virtual machine, but you don't want to use them in the transparent huge pages way, let's say you want to preallocate the huge pages in the boot time of the host and then use them for as the backing of the memory of the VMs. And you don't want to have automatic numabalancing at the host level because you are going to do static partitioning anyway. In the guest, it depends, it depends on the workload that you run on the guest, it's not different than tuning a workload on bare metal from this point of view. Once you have tuned the host, then inside the VM, you just treat the problem like you would do it on a bare metal machine similar to the VM that you are focusing on. And one word about power management at the host level, of course, again, it depends. In general, it's good to do at least some benchmarks, limiting, for example, the deep sleep states and using performance as a CPU frag governor because it would help you get a first set of results which are consistent and that don't vary too much. Then it depends whether this is okay for you and for your actual goals to keep these settings or if saving a little bit more of power is important and if it is, you have to reassess the tuning and rerun in the benchmarks and so on and so forth. With the proper power management configuration that you want to have, let's say, in production. Then, as I said, pinning the VCPUs, we want to do that and we do that in, for example, libvert, like this. And you want to, if possible, I was already touching on this before, if possible, you want to pin the VCPUs of the VMs in such a way that you pin to the CCDs because in such a way you won't have two different VMs which will have to share the bandwidth of the infinity fabric link from the CCD to the IODI. This means that if you do that, you will be able to, you will be able to configure like that up to either 14 or 16 VMs. It depends on how many CPUs you leave to the host on an F2 platform like the one I showed at the beginning. And if it's not possible to pin at the CCD level, then you may consider pinning at the CCX level because again, yeah, then the VM will share the bandwidth of the infinity fabric link to the IODI, but at least they don't share the electric ashes. And at worst, at least pin to cores and don't make VMs, shares, cores and executes on CVX hyper thread and also share L1 and L2 ashes unless you really want to ask for big troubles. Memory placement, similar to VCPUs, but even simpler probably because if the VM that you want to use is big enough to span to take both the NUMA nodes, then you put half of the memory of the VM in one NUMA node and the other half on the other and then you also, I guess, yeah, I have this in the next slide. So let's, yeah, sorry. And then in the other case, which is when the VM is not large enough to span both the NUMA node and it fits in just one of the NUMA nodes, then you put all its memory in that NUMA node as simple as that. And then enlightenment, that's what I wanted to try to say before, if the VM spans both of the NUMA nodes, then you have, yes, put half of its memory, put, sorry, one half of its memory in one node and the other half on the other, but you also have to provide the VM a suitable and meaningful virtual topology, virtual NUMA topology, actually. If it doesn't, you are fine, you just enforce that the VM, the memory stays on one NUMA node, but you still have to provide, in both cases, a meaningful CPU topology, so virtual socket, threads, cores, stuff like that, and also good, let's say, CPU model. What does it mean, good? We will see in a few slides. Yeah, then secure virtualization, secure encrypted virtualization, AMD and these services processor also provides a feature, which basically allows you to encrypt the memory of the virtual machines and it's transparent to the VMs. It's very efficient, it's very cool. There are instructions to set it up, I'm not going to cover these in details. And security, so the hardware vulnerabilities, which are well known these days, the good thing about this processor is that AMD processor in general, and this in particular are only vulnerable to a subset of them, and in particular the nastier one for virtualization, this is not vulnerable, so we are happy about that. Benchmarks, the benchmarks that I run, I said I wanted to focus on CPU and memory, so I will show results of running stream, which is a memory benchmark, and I will show what I will show right now is going to be the results of running stream on bare metal and then inside one or more VMs, and so that we can compare results. And you can configure stream. In our case we use the OpenMP for parallelization of the stream jobs, and so we use the different number of threads, which was either 16 or 32 on bare metal, in general the real time again is to use as many threads as there are memory channel, but this is not an information that it is easily available via software, that you can easily figure out via software, and so you can kind of approximate it by using one thread per lnc, and this applies to both the host and the virtual machine. So what do I have here? Here I have in purple bars the results of running stream on bare metal, and then in green stream run inside the VM without any kind of tuning, so the performance don't match and you see it very well. Then I applied a little bit of tuning so the VM had a virtual topology, but it wasn't doing any pinning of CPU memory, and so again in the light blue bar, and again the performance don't match, and then magic, you apply the tuning that I described and you see in the last bar that now the performance of bare metal and inside VMs just one VM basically matches, so that's what we wanted, and this is when running stream just in single thread mode, the same when using 30 threads for stream, as you can see there is, we are able to reach very good performance because inside the VM we achieve pretty much the same level as on the host. Here I used two VMs instead of one, so there are a lot of elements of the plot, you would want to focus on again the first one, is bare metal, the red and black ones are, I'm now using two VMs and are the score, the results, the performance that you get from stream and run inside these two VMs, so it's okay that it's slower, it's less than bare metal because now you have partition and the CPU in two, basically you are assigned each part to a different one to one VM, and the important part, the nice part is that as you can see the performance of the VM is quite consistent because they are basically performing the same all the three, the four stream operations, and then this last bar is basically the sum of these two, which again is pretty much bare metal, and so we are happy again. Now, I mentioned secure encrypted virtualization, what's the, I said that the memory of the VM is encrypted, what's the overhead that comes with that? As a matter of fact, at least for this benchmark is very, very slow, in some papers you find that it always stays within 3%. In these cases, at least as far as I can measure, it stayed within 1%. And yeah, another benchmark, this is called NASPB, it's a very CPU intensive benchmark this time, which is what I said, memory and CPU. Also uses a parallelization framework, it's open MPI this time, not open MP, and this time lower is better, before I probably forgot to say higher was better, and yeah, the same stuff, basically first bar bare metal, last bar VM with tuning, and we want them to match and to be very similar, and that's actually the case with tuning applied in all the various variants of the NASPB benchmark. And again, I also benchmarked with encrypted virtualization enabled or not, or disabled with this CPU intensive benchmark, and again, less than 1% performance impact, which is very good. Now the CPU model, in theory, this is QMU that builds virtual CPU for the virtual machine, what flags, how it presents it, what kind of virtual CPU does QMU present to your virtual machine. In theory, if you want to achieve best possible performance, you find in various pieces of documentations that you should use this thing, so ost pass through, but it depends on, for example, the version of your software, in this case, QMU and VIRT. As we said, this effort was about doing this tuning on these particular distributions, distribution, sorry. And as a matter of fact, the distribution went out before the epic platform series of processors was available. And so, if you use ost pass through, turns out that in this particular case, it doesn't do a good job. And the detail is here, and the detail of why it's here, because the threads basically are not exposed correctly. So, this is, as a matter of fact, there is a CPU model called Epic, which is there because it's the previews, it's the one that represents the previous generation of epic processors. And if you use that one, yeah, except I, yeah, except I wasted the basic same thing, but that's a type, what is called it like that, this would have been too, and it provides the VM a better, sorry for that, a better virtual topology. And in fact, this is what happens if you use ost pass through, it's this one. So it's, again, lower is better, so it's tuning applied, but using ost pass through as a CPU model, very, very bad because we wanted to be here. Using Epic, it's here. Of course, if you go, if you use a more updated distribution, a new version of OpenSUSE or Zli or whatever other distribution, or just code from upstream, you will find the Epic 2 CPU model there and you can use it. But this was, I put this part in ER because I wanted to stress the fact that, yes, there are all these tuning advices, but you really should always double check because ost pass through was the natural choice and it wasn't performing well. Now I have other stream benchmarks, but I rather try to leave some time for questions than, yeah, let's see. So, yeah, basically the conclusions are that achieving very good performance, even performance that actually matches the one of the ost inside either one or more VMs is possible, at least for certain workloads and it happens mostly via resource partitioning. If you use KVM, QMU, LibVirt in that particular product, even better if you use them from upstream, you have all the tools of the capabilities to achieve this very good resource partitioning. We at SUSE also support Xen and you can do pretty much the same with Xen, although you will lack, the performance won't be as good as this because Xen still lacks the capability of exposing properly the virtual topology of the guest, a virtual topology of the guest and the Epic 2 platform turned out to be quite good platform from this point of view because they offered great scalability, offered memory encryption with exceptionally low overhead as we see and because they are only affected by a subset of the vulnerability flows related to speculative execution. So with that, yeah, in the slides you will find a little bit more information about myself and while taking question, let me, as we did this morning, say one more time farewell to my very good friend last course with this picture taken at Fosdam a few years ago. And yeah, but really, questions. Yeah. I see three hands, I guess. So we're... Sure. Yeah, sorry. Ah, perfect. Yeah, I will always forget about it. The question is whether the benchmarks, any of the benchmarks that I showed were run in a scenario where a VM was spanning multiple numanodes. So when I showed these results, these ones for, no, these ones, one VM, okay? If you use one VM, one very big VM, then yeah, I have another one slide that I didn't show, but let's use it for that. This was the VM that was used in that benchmark. So it was spanning both of the numanodes. It basically had all the, pretty much as many vCPUs as there are, vcPUs with the exception of the ones that I decided to leave to the host. But this was spanning both the numanodes and so it had virtual topology exposed to it. The question now is about what was the huge-page size chosen, it was one gigabyte. The other questions, let's go there. So this is, the question was about, since I said that if possible, it's better to configure a VM so that it stays inside the CCD, inside the CCX, if it goes outside, stuff like that, whether I have numbers for that. Not yet, again, this was in these slides that I decided to skip, but if you see, this is an ongoing effort. We are running more benchmark, continuing doing our evaluation and so I have, I'm finished, but going over investigation with multiple VMs in cases where I actually fulfilled my own recommendation and so I don't split CCDs and stuff, but also in cases where I violate them and I put VMs across CCDs. Just as a hint, when you start, this, for example, is a case where six VM were used and you see that the absolute level of the performance is the correct one, if you do the math, this is fine, but the performance is also actually quite consistent in this case, this case, this case, but you see some strange behavior here and that's what typically, again, this is an ongoing investigation, so this is just a little bit of speculation, but what we are seeing is that when you start not respecting this recommendation and putting VMs in, pinning VMs in such a way that they share too much resources, then what happens is that you have these not so much consistent behavior in the results. I have other, see here is a, here it is another example where the recommendation were not really respected and you have the performances which are not equally exactly the same in all VMs. Yeah, there was other questions, but I think we are out of time. We are, so I'm happy to answer. I mean. Just the last presentation, so. I mean, I can. It's not recorded, but if you want them. I mean, I'm fine. Go ahead. I'm good. Sure. First of all, thank you for your talk. I very much enjoyed it. I was wondering have these optimizations and tuning things been implemented in, for example, OpenStack already? I have the quest. Well, I guess I repeat it as well. The question was about whether these optimization are implemented in OpenStack or similar software. I have no idea. I have never played with OpenStack and I don't plan to in the foreseeable future, to be honest. I am aware of very few very few efforts and very few capabilities similar to the one that you are saying. So doing resource partitioning and optimization at this level, automatically, either in OpenStack or in many other software. There are solutions, but achieving this level of details in the tuning, it's quite hard. Because after all that, because of reasons. I mean, I don't know myself, but it's a matter of interface that you present to the user for letting him or her able to achieve this. After all, it turns out to be rather similar to the XML itself, because it's a very detailed level of. So I'm not saying it's not possible. I would really hope that the situation was better, but I'm not aware of anything that reaches this level of details. Yeah, go ahead. Die. Yes. Sorry, the last part. Yes, there are. I haven't monitored that part, but the fact is that at least according to me and to my experience in running similar evaluations in even in other platforms, the consistencies of results like these is something which is quite good and that you don't find very often. But as apparently as soon as you like mix things in a not necessarily super ideal way, then this very nice properties start to, like, fade away. So, yeah, I haven't checked that whether what you said also was happening in these cases. But yeah, I have a scenario with 30 VMs, where I am violating the recommendations by using too many basically threads for stream if you count all of them running inside all the VMs. And if you look at the actual throughput that you achieved, that's actually quite good, but it's all unbalanced. If you sum all of them up, it matches or even overcome the one that you achieved on the host. But then it's all like that, up and downs.


Civil Society organizations reject the NBC order telling media organizations to stop reporting in security and we'll be examining the legal issues arising from Matawali's defection. This is Plus Politics and I am Mary Anacom. The Civil Society consortium on civic space has condemned the order by the administration of President Mohammad Abu Hari to monitor the media through the directive by the National Broadcasting Commission NBC to gag media houses, according to them. The convener of the consortium, Mbaseki Martin Obono, said the directive is a further attempt by the government to endanger the lives of citizens and prevent media organizations from reporting in security. According to him, the directive which has its legal base from Section 5 of the NBC code is inconsistent with Section 22 of the 1999 Constitution which talks about the role of media organizations and Section 39 of the 1999 Constitution which also talks about the freedom of expression and opinion. And Article 9 of the Nigerian or the African Chatter on Human and People's Rights which is a right to receive information and free expression without interference. Well joining us to discuss is Femi Diamele. He's a broadcast journalist with Nigeria Info Abuja. We have Shagu Shopita who is a, he is of the ACT Network and we are being joined by Nicholas Ibeque. He is an investigative journalist with premium times. Thank you very much gentlemen for joining us. It's a pleasure to be here. Thank you. Thank you. So I'm going to start with the fact that we know that the media bill or the media regulatory bill recently which was being debated by all and Sanjay has been suspended obviously as a result of the outcry of Nigerians as to why this bill should even be an issue in the first instance. But now people are wondering, suspending the bill or kicking it out entirely why should the National Assembly be suspending it? Shouldn't it be something that we should do away with? Is there fear or a cause for concern that this bill might just find its way back on the floor of the National Assembly? I'll start with you Shagu. Mary and good evening Nigerians. I love where you started from because I think that the issue of that bill is a far more fundamental threat to press freedom, free speech freedom of expression guaranteed by the Constitution and all of that. Simply because the bill seeks to place the practitioners in the media industry under the direct supervision of the government, of the minister of information and regardless of the personalities in government now, regardless of what we might think about them that can never be good. The media must be independent, the media must be able to see things as they see them at all times. So then suspending the bill obviously is a result of all of the pressure and all of the agitation that has happened since that bill came to the light of day. I listened to the guy, the gentleman, that moved that bill and he did say that he was stepping it down because he had heard the concerns of Nigerians and of the media industry. He was on a TV show with the president of the Nigerian Union of Journalists and it was clear that he would see this fully in some of the provisions of his bill. So if they are stepping it down, first of all, I don't even know why the bill is necessary to be honest. I think that the embassy is powerful enough as it is if not too powerful. So stepping it down, suspending it is a good thing, I think it's just junk it entirely. It's completely and utterly unnecessary and unneeded and I would advise the National Assembly that there are a lot more pressing issues for them to address their minds to and their energies to than trying to hyphen the press and trying to put the press under the control of the government.  Remember that they are taking taxpayers' money to do all of these things. So they need to spend their time and our resources on things that will better for the development and the advancement of the common and the average Nigeria. I'm going to ask you one more question before I go to Mr. Peke. Is the media not already regulated as it is because of course we have the NBC code and then we have obviously the ethics, the rules and regulations as to how you should go about your reportage or your presentations. That's the code in itself. But then there have been arguments of under regulation or over regulation if there's any such thing. And really the person who actually pushed for this bill should it be a non-media person, a non-practitioner, someone who doesn't understand how the sector works, should that person be the one actually pushing for a regulation of the media space? Mary Ann, a lot of times it well to answer your question anybody can push for regulation. Whether it's a participant or not. If you believe that you understand the issues and you believe that there's a room for improvement, then by all means, propose what you want to propose. If you're a member of the National Assembly, propose it as a deal from the National Assembly. If you're a private citizen, propose it as a private bill. So it doesn't matter who's pushing it. The problem is the intention behind this proposed amendment and this new deal is very suspicious. It's less than altruistic. Every time that we have seen government people, whether it's in the legislature, the National Assembly, or in the executive, push for regulation, when you look critically at this, you find that they are simply protecting themselves and they are trying to shield themselves from public outcry and backlash that usually comes from a lot of the very, very terrible behaviour that we see from them. So invariably you find them almost like a knee-jerk reaction coming up with all sorts of regulations that are very, very poorly thought through and so when those things come to the public, there's usually an uproar and outcry. So for me it's not about who's pushing it. It's the motive and the need. I don't think there's any need for this whatsoever. Let me come to you, Nicholas. Recently you put out a tweet. You posted something about the fact that the media or the broadcast media is one of the weakest links when it comes to journalism in Nigeria and I'd like to just quote a little bit of what you said. You did say that, let me see. You talked about the fact that the media is the weakest link or the broadcast media is the weakest link in the industry in Nigeria. It's a very long message that you put out. Why did you feel the need to do that? Because I remember last week when the print had all of their cover pages with the same information standing up against that particular bill. We really didn't see that same kind of momentum from the broadcast media houses. Is this the reason why you decided to put out that statement? Well, I really think that the broadcast media is a punching bag of the government. I mean, when the government wants to get at the media it does bounce on the broadcast media because it has used the embassy which is really a military contraption, if you ask me. Nigeria is a signatory to the declaration of principle of freedom of expression in Africa that was adopted by the African Commission of Human Rights in 2002 and that declaration provides that any public authority that exercises power in the area of broadcast and telecommunication regulation should be independent and adequately protected against interference, particularly of a political and economic nature. But what we have seen is that the embassy that the government uses to regulate the broadcast media is an appendage of the Ministry of Information which automatically makes it an appendage of the presidency and it is not independent.  But I mean, isn't that detail for every government agency in Paris-Taito? I mean, literally. These people are all appointed. Even INEC that has independence as an appendage is not as independent as we hope. I just read you a charter that Nigerian is signatory to. You just quoted two sections of the Constitution. There is no other profession in this country that is recognized in the Constitution that is protected by the Constitution. I mean, at the start of the program, you quoted the Constitution that the media is protected. So according to the Constitution, any law, any regulation, any decree that contradicts the Constitution will have to be being because the Constitution is the ultimate law of the country. So no other law, you call INEC, you call none of that. None of these other laws are protected by the Constitution. It's only the media. That's why it's called the Fourth Estate of Iran. That's why it is protected. So when you use the NBC, that is a government appendage. That's a government contraction to recognize the broadcast media. But that is what they do. Where do I start from?  Don't do press release. Don't take phone calls. Don't take this when somebody says this. Don't take phone calls on radio. Decide from the fact that, oh, don't gather news on Twitter. Don't share news on Twitter. Now don't report insurgency. I mean, where are they going to stop? And this is why, because if you look at that, because the NBC specifically regulates the broadcast media. And that's why Lai Mohamed, the Minister of Information, when this bill that Shedden was talking about was read in the National Assembly, the Minister of Information came and said, no, no, no. We should also include all online publications as well. So because he knows that it doesn't have a control, because the government doesn't have that, the newspaper and the online publications are self-regulatory. And the government doesn't have that control. They don't have a niche over that. So he's trying to bring the online, and then all that, let's say, under the NBC, before the bill was suspended, the bill that was supposed to, the NBC that was supposed to... Why do you think that government wants so badly to control the media, especially broadcast media? Because the government is losing it. It's so simple. How so? If the government has failed, if the government is concerned and has failed in doing what it should do, I mean, there is widespread poverty in the land. There is insecurity in the land. I mean, there are all kinds of brigandage, all kinds of outlaws doing their thing all over the country.  Go to the north-west. Bandits control last swath of the... I mean, they run roughshod at local communities and villages. They kidnap hundreds of people. They kidnap school children. And the government has not had any... Thus, I mean, few days ago, the bandits, so-and-called bandits, of course they are terrorists. That's what they are. They shut down fighter jets. So what are we talking about here? So the government sees that it has lost narrative because it has not been proactive. It has failed to do its basic... I mean, providing strong economy and security are one of the basic functions of government. And this government has failed in that way. So what it does is that it's trying to put a blanket over all of this news so that the people does not... I mean, because in a year or two time, we're going to have another election. This government is scared that with all of this happening that it has lost all of that and the people may punish it during the election. This is all what matters for this government. Nothing else. Okay. Let me go to Fermi. Fermi, when you heard the... or you saw the secular that was released by the NBC, the very good at releasing these secular, by the way. I mean, when I first heard it, I wasn't sure it was real. I thought it was one of those, you know, hoaxes that people post on social media. But when you heard the NBC expressly say, we cannot report on terrorist activity, we cannot name, we cannot give details, what exactly was running through your mind? And how did that make you feel as a person who's very detailed and, you know, as the kind of job that we do, you need to bring facts and figures to, you know, to bear? Okay. So just to say this, to stop it, one of the things I did notice, I mean, I got the good news of the secular coming forward and then after a few hours, you know, just to confirm that if this was going to be something to go by, and that was interesting, but it also gives you room to reflect on what the code is about, what is in the NBC code, for example. The issue of security and reporting issues of security in the NBC code has always been there. The question is, how has that been interpreted by various media houses to an extent? If you notice, one of the things that is now occurring is you are finding a strong dependence between online media, the newspaper and the broadcasters. Before what you used to have is people run their stories almost separately. Of course, every media house, there are stories that is picked up from other newspaper and then you have to now depend on the credibility of that newspaper medium in order for you to be able to say, oh, this is an authentic story, this is it or this is not. That's on one side. But when I really did go through that and I was asking from some of my sources within the same institution about what they had in mind when it comes to this, and they said, well, what we are relying on is to say we are only advising the broadcasters, and I'm saying this explicitly, advising the broadcasters on what is already in the code and how to abide by it even more than ever before. Now here's a scenario that I wanted to point out. The last question you asked me last, and it's interesting because compared to newspaper publications, every 15 minutes you have millions of people listening to you. You have millions of people listening to you. One wrong phrase, one right phrase. Somebody here that doesn't come back to get any other version of that story, who wants with it, had their struggle. Now I think to a large extent we may have donated this service to Nigerians, and I'm not talking about the government now, donated this service to an extent to Nigerians every time we reiterate the strength, possibly the progress, possibly the damage that Boko Haram is doing to Nigerians. I'm not saying the government now. I insist not the government. And it leaves you with room to reflect once in a while to say, okay, so now we just made millions of people aware, but then what are they aware of? Where do they run with such stories? And it depends on the broadcaster now to be responsible, and the choice of responsibility is something that's often varied. Unfortunately, where I strongly thought the NBC is, and by the way, the NBC has had meetings with broadcasters, and I mean some broadcasters in the last three months about twice, and interpretation of what should be continues to be something of interest. But here's the thing, I think to a large extent the NBC could have done a little bit better by encouraging the broadcasters to come forward to say, let's explain what we are saying to you with regards to this. I think you could talk about the fact that social and social people lost their lives. This is the story that happened, but essentially we're not asking you to put the likes of the terrorists in a position where they are glorified, as against glorifying the terrorists or not glorifying the terrorists, doesn't mean the government is doing right. Trust me, I don't want to even go into the bashing of what they do or not do, but in essence, how is the media able to protect the society, the audience that they speak to, the broadcaster, how is he able to protect the audience they speak to? That is a big responsibility. You could talk about the Rwanda Genocide, you could talk about the story in Kano, it was in 2014 when there was a story about oh, if you take this drug, it reduces your fertility and that led to the death of about 42 health workers. Just pick another backstory on that because I also know how irresponsible the person who worked out to say that is. So what measure of responsibility does a broadcaster interpret from the code that he or she is using day by day? That's where the fundamental question is, how do you become responsible for your broadcaster without necessarily coming off as somebody who just wants to ride and just create sensationalism at the expense of Nigerians, not exactly the government. So you're telling me that, and I totally understand where you're coming from especially for radio where you have millions and millions of people listening to the radio on the go, it's very important. You're talking about the fact that we need to be sensitive and responsible in the use of words. But could NBC have also been very sensitive in the words, I mean, because we're talking about what play here, using killed instead of died or slotted and some words that could be very insensitive. I totally understand where you're coming from. But of course that responsibility does lie with the broadcaster. It does lie with the journalists. But if the NBC is telling us not to report, is that not a directive? I don't, to be very candid about the reporting part, I think it's as good as just asking us to do, to play the catch up. I mean, it's literally to say the president was somewhere before you come to say it happened. I also think to a large extent, the speed in which broadcasting is going, I don't think the government understands the speed of that, the speed of what social media does for broadcasting or what broadcasting does for social media or print. It is really, really a challenge that some of our laws cannot catch up with the speed and the effectiveness of what you want to get done. That's on one side. But then I also want to reflect on the idea around when you do say, okay, take the space, for example, whether we say full-on-head smack, for example, it's a whole ethnic tribe you're referring to. Tomorrow, it may be another ethnic tribe you may refer to in terms of what you're saying. But I get killer estimate, certainly, it will take a responsible broadcaster to realize that you do not use ethnic coloration and pushing forward the fact that some group of people within that ethnicity are keen on killing people. So that's something to reflect on. You have the idea of killer heads, man. Imagine when they say Niger Delta militants and the likes of that. What's the difference between having a cause and trying to also terrorize a group without unknown gunmen? These are phrases that, oh, safely would use. And people say things like, oh, okay, why can't the government arrest some key other names or some other group of people? And I often ask a very simple question and I've always candid about this. When it comes to ethnicity and coloration of maybe certain type of crimes, it's a challenge when the broadcaster doesn't even realize it is responsible for that. We don't necessarily get the embassy involved. Yes, the embassy comes in from time to time. There really can be words that can't use on TV. But it is there that to an extent, you should be able to tell that there are certain words that will not come on your broadcast because it is your broadcast that you're responsible for. So to an extent, they may be quoting something from the code that they're asking everybody to remember, but then can they stop anybody from reporting what is going on? I think of it as very responsible not to tell people the fact that, oh, by the way, there's fire outside. Don't pass that pathway. That will be the first element of irresponsibility among Nigerian broadcasters. But we've seen it happen, Therian. And I don't want to dwell. I don't intend to dwell. But we've seen it happen to your sister station and someone was yanked off air because a former CBN governor was on the show and he was stating certain facts that did not sit well with the NBC. And it wasn't the presenter who was stating these facts. The presenter asked questions and these answers came. Of course, the presenter's job is to say, where are your facts? Where did you gather this information? But can you really stop people from saying what they want to say while you're trying to gather information? Because we see the NBC come down on stations, especially if a person comes to say something that is not really welcome by the government. So when you say that you're not sure if the NBC can stop people from doing or reporting, yes, they can. That's the answer. So how do we stop the NBC, or rather should we come to a table to have this conversation with the NBC as to how to do their jobs? Should we be telling them how to do their job? It's a big deal. But let me just move on back to Shagong. Shagong, you are part of the CSOs and the guys who are asking or kicking against the latest coming from the NBC. And you've heard what Fermi is saying. We all have a responsibility, whether we're broadcast journalists, whether we're print, we do have a responsibility. We have codes and ethics that we run this business by. But when you have a government department that seems to be doing the bidding of the master, where does responsibility come in for both parties? Okay. Okay, so let me say this and I'll say it very quickly because I know that we're beginning to run out of time. I know and we all know there's no doubt about it at all. But our government, not just this government as a matter of fact, our government for as long as I can remember have been high-handed, would always look to stifle public opinion and dissenting voices. It's normal. When I say normal, get me right. I mean, it's not unusual in Nigeria and therefore we must resist that. It's our duty and our responsibility to stand against that as proudly as we can. What we must not do, however, is to allow that desire to stand against oppression to rub us of our sense of objectivity and responsibility, right? So now, in this case, I have looked at the letter from the NBC like a million times and I tell you, Miriam, I still don't understand why we say it's an order not to report on terrorism. I'm sorry, there's no such order. What the letter has said is very simple and I think feminine hits the nail on the head. Be responsible with how you report. Choose your words carefully because if you are not, then you quote inadvertently and I think in some instances deliberately further the cause of the enemies of Nigeria that is the insurgents and the terrorists. Let me give you a simple example. If you will allow me, I'm going to name two platforms, two online platforms. Reporting the same story. Premium Times says Nigeria Army kills six terrorists and repels attack. Sahara Report says Boko Haram, Iswab, Oberon, Nigeria Army base. The same story. So it's a very simple thing. I think what we're saying is we must present the facts as they are so that the public knows. But because we know we have a platform and we have millions of people listening to us and the wars that we're fighting are largely battles for the minds of people. Let's not forget this. It's an ideological war. That's why they're called terrorists. So when we report news in certain ways, what we do inadvertently is we spread terror. So if something has happened and it's bad, say it's bad. You don't have a choice because you can't lie about the truth. But in saying it's bad, you can choose how you say it's bad. And I think that's what the NBC is saying. If they try to gag anybody as they have seen, they will be strongly resisted and they will be refused and they will not get away with it. So I think for me it's a simple case of let all be responsible, let all be accountable as we've always done and we'll continue to do whether they like it or not. But let's also hold each other accountable so we don't further the cause of people that are fighting against our interests. So for me I think I'd like to keep it short that way. Okay. Back to you Nicholas. I see that premium times was cited in that analogy. But going forward, how can Nigeria play on the same level with international media because we still seem to be playing catch up with the fact that our governments, past and previous, present and previous are bigger part. And I still yet to come to terms with the power of the media and how the media should work. I also see that most of the media houses in Nigeria are somewhat owned by governments and the few that are independent have a problem with being extremely objective or, but there seems to be some freedom of course in Nigeria compared to other African countries where we see the media not being able to state things the way they should be stated. Yes, we see stories coming but those stories most times are watered down. So how do we going forward, how do we as the media become more responsible and also still stand on both feet to stare government down and let them understand that we also have a role to play in service to the people who are looking to us as the final hope or the hope of sorts to give them proper information and we're also a conduit of sorts for the people to be able to air their views especially for radio as concerning the leadership in the country. So going forward, what do we need to do? Are we supposed to meet each other halfway and I'm talking about the end we see the government and the media? I really don't think that the media role is to meet anybody halfway. I mean, our role is specifically stated. I mean, we are washed down. We are the world down. We mentioned that governments do not, I mean, we keep the government in check about what does the media do? I mean, the media speaks truth to power. So you cannot speak truth to power by meeting somebody halfway. It's an uncompromising job by saying that we should meet somebody halfway. Then we are compromising. So this is where I stand with that. I don't think the media should meet anybody halfway. I think the media has its role to play and we should inform the people. I mean, what's the government's... I mean, getting worried over some of these issues. I mean, if you ask me. Largely, go back and look at the reporting of the insurgency. The media, the media I think has been fair. There are one or two oddballs. I mean, blogs and all of that. And this is everywhere in the world. Everywhere in the world that we have media you're going to have some kind of media... Is it anti-government? Yeah, anti-government. And the French media group that does their own thing, you know, they always are the fringes of the old media industry. That is what they do. Go anywhere in the world to see this. That should not be a problem that the government should, because of it, be issued a decree and directive over and over again. Go back. Take 10 stories about banditry. Take 10 stories about Boko Haram report and ask me from credible Nigerian newspapers and ask me if the media has not reported them well. Of course, people will go with traditional headlines and all of that. Those can be handled with... I mean, individual... Some newspaper, some online media do all of that. But largely, people are able to separate the weight from the charge. That's why people say, oh, this is a credible media organization. Or are we wrong with it? This is said by the guidance. Oh, this is from punch. Definitely, it has to be credible. Oh, people have done this. Oh, not these X and Y people that we are already known to do sensational reporting. Now, what is dangerous, what the government is doing? I absolutely disagree with Sherwin when he said, oh, the media can resist the NBC. Hell no, the media cannot resist. The broadcast media has shown over and over and over and over. Are you saying that the NBC is just extremely powerful that we cannot stand up to it? With the code that we have and the constitution that covers us, what are telling us that a group of persons are more powerful than the constitution? I'm coming to that. Look for a word stronger than extreme. That is what the NBC. The NBC has a noose around the name of all broadcast media. If the NBC says jump, all broadcast media will ask how I should be jumped. There's no way up. That's not, I mean, this is what I said about this. We're out of time. And this is what I advocated. Now, it's a good thing you talked about with the constitution. And this is what I have been pushing on my traditional media platform. Have any media company in this country try to test that constitutional right that they have. Go to court and say this directive contradicts this constitution. Let the court decide if indeed that directive contradicts the constitution.  And let's see if we can talk about testing the waters of the constitution. But finally, Femi, a last word from you before we go because we're out of time. Well, one of the things I think is very important that the media broadcast media come to realize this to explore some of the tunes that which they would use to engage the NBC going forward. We've not really had the longest your many moments of engaging as such. There's been few occasions where broadcast stations do take NBC to court. But that is not something we want to go on to over and over again. It's all about propaganda. It's all about the use of words that comes in from different places. The government needs also to tell its own side of the story if they choose to tell their own version of the truth. If the one is to be covered and not just the other side being covered as much as it has already been covered. They need to speak a little bit more. Not even so much as balance. But we will be able to tell what are the sides of the story whether opposing or on the same side. The military needs to say more about what they're doing and why they're doing it why they're doing it so so that we don't just look like every day it's like it's disaster, disaster, disaster. But if there's a good story to tell I'm sure that the press will tell it. On that note guys I want to say thank you. Nicolás Bécois is a premium times Fermi Diamele is of Nigeria Info FM of Boudja and Sheryl Chopitin is of Act Network. Thank you very much gentlemen very interesting conversation. Let's do it again. Thank you so much. All right. Well thank you all for staying with us. We'll take a short, short break and when we return we'll discuss the legal aspect of the defection of Zamper Estate Governor Bélo Matawali. Stay with us.