Good evening and welcome to the last episode of the private property podcast for the year 2020. Episode 100 from going on live for the first time in March when we're all in level five lockdown, thinking that we're going to be in it for 21 days. And many months later, I think it's nearly 300 days later, we've got not just the private property podcast, but we've also got a whole host of other podcasts that we have across the private property social media platforms.  We also have the farming podcast that Umbalinova brings you to your screens on Tuesdays and Thursdays at 1pm. And of course, Chad doesn't leave you alone over the weekend with the developers show coming to you every Saturday and Sunday at 1pm. Well, this evening we've gotten the whole gang together, and of course, we'll bring you the last installment of the private property podcast. I've got Esther here with me. I've got Chad here with me. I've also got Umbali here with me. I think it's so great to have so many of us on one platform and show so many of you are going to be looking forward to the great conversation that we're going to have. But you're also going to look forward to the tons of cash that we're giving away. We've been saying that we want to give away all this money, and we certainly have it throughout the festive season. And now it's the last time for 2020 that we give away quite a bit of money, quite a substantial amount of money from, of course, announcing the winners of the competition that we've been running questions for the champions. The first winners are going to be walking away with that 15,000 rand cash prize and a whole host of other competitions that we've been running across our social media platforms. Well, let's hear from Esther, from Umbali and Chad. I know that it's been quite great to also tune into their shows. I want to hear from them because we spend all this time in the evening together. I know two of the presenters are not used to being on air when the sun is down. Only Esther and I know how that one is like. So maybe let's hear from Chad first.  You know, Zama, I sat down just before the show started and I looked at all your beautiful faces and the great lighting. And I thought, you know what? I need to pull out the load shedding lamps here to get some light on me because it looked like I was sitting in the dark. And I'm not. I'm at least privileged enough, whereas I'm not to be load shedding us. So I hope the lighting is great. But it is so nice to see all your faces.  It was quite fun sitting down with Estie for the first time home by a show and chatting to her. But it's really nice to see all you guys. And I can't wait to get into the competitions. We are giving away quite a lot of money, like you've mentioned. So I hope it's going to make some people's year just that much better. We're closing off 30th of December. I'm sure all of us are chomping at the bit to get into 2021. And I'm really looking forward to it. And I'm looking forward to what it brings on the show. We've learned a lot this year. We've learned what the fans like. We've learned what the fans want to see. So I cannot wait to bring that to all of them. And I'm looking forward to what all of you do as well. I think Zama, you've been a role model for a lot of us. We all chasing the big boss lady and how she hosts the shows. You've been doing it fantastic. So I'm looking forward to it. It's been great. And I can't wait to carry on with it. Thank you so much, Chad. Chad is making me blush, but we're not going to blush, right? Because we're used to this. We spend all this time together in the evening. Like I said, he's not quite used to it. But I'm going to hear from Umba.  You catch her show on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Oftentimes she's at the farm. I think even yesterday's was from the farm. And I'm sure a lot of people talk about the show quite a lot on the podcast. That if you have green fingers, you have an interest in agriculture, you're still not quite sure where to start. That is the podcast that you want to, you know, watch and certainly learn from. I myself have agricultural ambitions. I tune into the show to learn as much as you can, because you also want to first get a sense of also, what do you not know? Because I think when you look at something like farming while on the one hand, you can have aspirations for it. It can seem so intimidating because it seems as though there's so much that you don't know and you don't know a way to access the information. You know, Mali, how has the show been? I think your show is the newest kid on the block. How have you been finding the viewers at home? Thank you, Zama. Thank you. I think the show has been quite interesting. A lot of people are interested in agriculture like yourself that wanted to know, you know, what to farm, how to make money farming, which crops to farm, where to find land or how to find land, do I buy land? Do I rent land? Do I rent land per season, you know, or per year? So it's been quite interesting to interact with different individuals from different geographic areas that have a keen interest in agriculture and the various types of crops and infrastructure that is required to run a successful farm. So indeed, like you said, I'm the new kid on the block. I think it's also great that private property introduced the farming podcast as well because I know most of your shows has to do about property, right? Whereas I'm in a slightly different sector, but property is quite an integral part of the sector. I mean, we hear today in the news about this whole land issue and so forth. So I hope that the guests have, or sorry, the audience has received a lot of valuable input and feedback and advice from all the guests that have been onto the show and with the guests sharing their experiences of how they found land or how they've gone about acquiring land and making that asset, a viable asset, a commercial entity that is running, that is producing, that is contributing towards food security and also coming up with innovative ways. I mean, we knew that we could rent sheep and farm by renting sheep and making a profit out of that, you know. So I think for me, it's been great to share my industry, which I extremely love, to the private property audience and also to get a lot of some of people that follow me on various social media platforms and say, wow, you're doing something with private property. We never followed private properties, social media platforms before. We didn't know that such an organization would have an interest in agriculture and so they follow the videos and the live broadcast too as well. And also they're also learning from the different topics that each and every one of you are talking onto your show. So I think it's been about three months now and it's been great. I love being at the farm. Unfortunately, technology at the farm is not always the best because you have technical issues, but I really like having to show people my side of the world and, you know, the backdrop or the background and actually see that I'm an actual farmer because sometimes people don't believe it, you know, because they have their own views of what a farmer should look like, but it's been fun for me. I've thoroughly enjoyed it and I know that the audience has too. And yeah, we're just looking forward for what the new year brings. And I actually really love the fact that you raise how so many people have various misconceptions about how a farmer looks like because it is one of those things, unfortunately, that we tend to find as women, especially black women, there is a face of what we perceive farming to be. And as much as that's still the predominant face, in some ways the face of farming is slowly changing. You do find women, black women at that being interested in farming. And I think in the same way you're finding that women and black women are interested in property ownership because it does. Absolutely. The reality is that's also been something where the profile looks a certain way. I mean, if anything, I actually like this that came out. It was last year, I know there was an updated one that looked at the rise of unmarried women when it comes to home ownership, how they are becoming the sort of the biggest demographic of new first-time home buyers, which is quite a great statistic. You know, when you look at it that as women, we are able to now access spaces that we previously weren't able to access, whether it's home ownership on our own terms or certainly going into something like agriculture on our own terms. And I think somebody who's only had a great sense of that is esteem.  You are saying it's large, you're increasing, becoming women. It's one of some of the highlights for you on the show.  I know that you've helped or fought a few times in the private property podcast, which has been fantastic. How have you found the show over the past few months? Thank you, Zama. I think, like, I resonate with a lot of what the other hosts have said, but I think my show recently took a turn for the better. And what I really enjoy the journey has been absolutely amazing. And one of the highlights for me is definitely the authentic stories and experiences coming from a lot of our guests, you know, getting to know them on a personal level. And I've gotten to resonate with a lot of these stories because at one point in our life, we're all going to be a first-time home buyer or we have been a first-time home buyer. So that's definitely a highlight for me, just the realness and authenticness of these stories that I get from these guests and that I can resonate so well. And I think it's probably one of those things that, and I say this to people, not just on the show, but certainly across my social media platforms, is that home ownership can seem like such an intimidating thing to get into. And it often is, because you tend to not know what you don't know, and it's a long-term commitment to thinking 20 years, oh my gosh, you know that you're not even going to be in the job that you're in for 20 years. Oftentimes it's a big amount, for so many people it's an amount that's bigger than what they are earning annually, thinking you're taking on all this debt. So there are all these various factors that make you quite overwhelmed when you think about home ownership, especially for the first time. And I think a show like yours certainly caters to people and we hear the real stories of first-time home buyers. We have to hear some of the mistakes that they made, mistakes that us at home shouldn't make because somebody has made them. And I love saying this even on my show that, look, other people have made mistakes so that you and I don't have to make them. I share some of my own mistakes so that viewers at home don't have to make them because oftentimes mistakes and property costs us time or certainly costs us a lot of money. And we want to make sure that we help viewers at home save time and save their money so that they're able to spend it in other things. Before we go into some of the fun bits in this evening's show, because I know we're going to be giving away quite a lot of money, we're going to be giving away awards. So certainly if you're watching at home, we're seeing all the love, we love seeing all the love. I can see the hearts, I can see all of you commenting on our social media page. I want to hear from viewers at home, what have been some of the best episodes that you've watched across the different episodes. So I mean, across the different shows. So whether it's first time home buyer show, whether it is a divisible show, or the farming podcast, or of course, the private property podcast, what have been some of the highlights of the different shows that you've been able to watch throughout the past month. We want to hear from you comment down here below with some of your favorite episodes, because we love hearing from you. And talking of favorite episodes, Chad, what has been one of your favorite episodes? Because I also want to hear from our presenters about what some of their favorite episodes have been, other than some of your favorite episodes. I'd have to say my favorite episode would be the episode we did with Galencia, where we went to one of their developments, went right down to the site itself, and actually toured the house and asked those questions. People are really interested in asking, but I'd really bought a different dynamic to the show to be able to walk through those homes and take a real look at it and describe what makes it a really good investment and what makes it a good first time home purchase. Where the location is, what the neighborhood looks like, you know, what the actual development itself looks like. And I feel like it's those small things that show the people at home, what they're looking for and what that development looks like. I don't think anything can really give you a good overview of something like a video tour, walking through that home with me, and sitting down with the estate agents responsible, sitting down with the developer responsible, asking them that question on site, we actually looking at the different things. It was incredible and going into 2021 it's really going to become a focus to be able to go sit down with those different developers. And tour that unit, tour that show unit, tour the site, and even if they're just breaking ground, we'll go there, we'll walk across the ground. That developer can show us their vision and describe it to us and we can all just be part of their journey and see how that development grows as it's built and as it's developed.  I shared quite a bit, even on my own social media platforms. I've watched I think even from our home, when I was growing up we literally bought the piece of land and then you'd see from when the foundation was dug up and then you're slowly being built. And there's just something about seeing the process through right and being able to have different questions, especially when you're still new to it about what's happening at the different stages. I mean for me it was even a thing of being able to read house plans from an early age. So knowing how a door is drawn how a window is drawn where it goes, because I've actually been part of that process I think for years at home, being able to watch the developer show, being able to get a sense of what the various developers have on offer. And then of course being able to also go to the development because as you're saying I think being able to do more of that gives viewers at home a better opportunity to see what's on offer. And that's something that we don't typically get a taste of. I think oftentimes it's you know you have to physically go there yourself and we are in the times of COVID and we're also in a time where we increasingly want to use tech to kind of you know shortlist certain things. So if I can watch it online, watch that interview watch that, rather do that first before actually physically going there myself. So I'm certainly looking forward to you doing more of that in 2021 I think viewers at home are going to absolutely love it. It's going to be very interesting to give them the taste of you know a development from that perspective. I'm seeing all the love that we're getting on Facebook I absolutely love it. Do you keep us to keep sharing rather what some of your highlights have been what are some of the great episodes that you've watched I'm going to go through some of the comments. I'll start later on on the show but before we get to that let's hear from umbali bali what have been some of the you know best you know an episode that stands actually that you've already had in the past three months. Thank you so much. Well I can definitely say it was with a farmer all the way in case it in fry hate must have been go see Kubeka. He is a forestry farmer, young gentlemen who is doing very well. And typically when we think of agriculture we think cattle, which is goat sheep cows or poultry farming or vegetable farming and food farming, but he's a forestry farmer and as much as people would think that you know I don't look like a farmer. It's also very rare that you find a young black individual gentlemen. He is succeeding and doing very well in forestry agricultural in forest in forestry production and what stood out for me in that conversation is the different times in which you can harvest trees, the different purposes that comes with farming trees. I mean, you could make ties from trees, paper, wood, you know, glue, there's so many things that come from just growing trees and to also understand the different cultivars and varieties of trees. And what we in South Africa generally farm and to also understand the industry, how it's controlled how prices are made, the demand from a global level for trees and yeah I think it's quite interesting I'm a vegetable farming vegetables quite intensive. I mean, you could plant, you can plant today in four weeks you're harvesting. Now imagine having to grow a tree, you have to wait like five to 10 to 12 years. That is crazy so just to understand Musa's story and how he generates revenue and how you make capital and how many hectares etc etc. That show I think for me stood out for me. Yeah, and that's, yeah I think we just definitely need him back onto the show because the time was just too short he had so much to say and so much information to give out so I could definitely say the Musa and Gossi one was the one that came top of mind for me. I love that you know because I think oftentimes one of the things that even hosting the show has opened my eyes to is when we look at certain industries so when for example you look at property. We don't we don't quite know that different kinds of ways people can make money from property so often you think look you must just buy and you buy from you know you get money from the bank and that's it, and you're renting it out. People don't know that you can lease to lease you can lease you can buy to to let and all these different ways of structuring your portfolio in a very creative way, and I think that's just even in agriculture. If anything particularly in agriculture, there's so many innovative ways to go about, you know, generating revenue and so many different things that you can do that isn't only crop or livestock farming that I think so many of us probably don't know at home. You know people are hearing about the farming podcast for the first time then this is the opportunity to make sure that you go back on some of the great episodes that umbalia has had so that you can also hear Musa's story about forestry farming because these are some of the things that we often don't know about because maybe you're interested in agriculture perhaps you're not thinking what are some of the ways I can be an investor maybe you're not really interested in being out there often farmers actually looking for their investment they know how to do what they're doing. So how do you slowly get to know and get info as much as possible I'm going to go through some of your great comments that you've shared with us on Facebook and after that, we're going to announce the first winners I know we've been keeping you waiting I did say that this evening we've got quite a lot of giveaways we want to give away this money or maybe we should just take the money guys. We can just take this money and just have a great holiday. If we do announce the winners then we can't give them the money they're okay just like keep it to ourselves and just have a great holiday. But I promise we wouldn't do that we would absolutely never do that because we love giving away money. I think if anybody knows they know that money is one of those things we love giving away. One of the things that some of our top fans are saying on our Facebook page I see Mercedes Malayale saying I love the episode about short term holiday rentals next year I'm definitely renting out my place for holidays. Marta Shinga and one of the top fan gang members saying the virtual property show brought everything together for me podcasts on getting started and structuring your property portfolio have been the most enlightening. I should tell them father also on Facebook saying yesterday's episode has made us understand how important it is to invest in a property which is something I'm planning to do soon. Hashtag team and matched growth. How it more gets on how it haven't seen your comments in a while how it's saying like yesterday's episode where we had able and many other body corporate episodes. I always feel there's far more than we learn. Then we're having you up and even so we still never seem to be any closer to totally comprehensively understanding the many many aspects duties responsibility etc of different body corporates with their multiple policies hashtag team. We see you send me my side say here another top and gang member saying wow I remember the podcast for forestry farming it blows me away thank you. That's of course a comment on the farming podcast and one of the top fans here also to learn a sculpt say my favorite episode was when you had a guest that explained how to go about purchasing a house and what to look at that triggered and gave me a foundation of knowledge on what to look at when buying a house I also learned that the difference between an asset and liabilities I learned so much through you guys that I never learned in varsity thank you so much I thank you guys you rock thank you very much and keep those comments coming. We want to hear from you at home what have been some of your best episodes across the different shows. We love hearing from me and I think also let us know what you want to see more of. I love that Howard is loving the conversations we have on body corporates. Sometimes I feel as though we talk about body corporates too much but I think it's also because when you know so much about a subject matter you think no everybody at home knows it already so it's great to get the feedback because you realize that no people at home still want to hear from it so I think any suggestions for the different shows do let us know what they are we love hearing from you and we'll definitely make sure that we bring those up in the new year. While talking about the new year this is a team that's going to have such an incredible new year I mean it's the 30th of December and they are going to be less than actually with the run ups because instead of doing the winners first maybe she's first do the run up. Of course this is the competition that we've been running on the show because you know we've been running other ones on our Facebook page. This is the one that we've been running on this show and of course it was questions for the champions over the past two weeks we've had a great competition where we asked you to get your friends and family and form a team of five give yourselves a unique name and make sure that you join on on the live in order to stand a chance of walking away with 1500 rand. We did say that at the end of the month which is now we're going to be giving away the grand prize of 15,000 rand and that was based on yesterday's great questions that we hosted that we had on the show and then the runner up we're going to be walking away with 10,000 rand. And I think I'm going to start with the winners of 10,000 rand because those are the runner ups and the show that not the show the team that are the runner ups these others the second winning team and they walk away with 10,000 rand and that prize goes to hashtag magnificent who were the second team I guess that answered really well in yesterday's show so congratulations to team and magnificent you walk away with 1000 rand grand prize and of course you're running up with such a big amount of this five of you so you each get 2000 as I'm sure you're all quite happy to be walking away with that money. I'm going to keep you guys in suspense I'm going to keep you in suspense we're going to go for a quick break when we come back from this quick break we're going to see who the winners of that 15,000 rand grand prize is because this is the big one. So if you've been watching if you know you participated in the competition yesterday as a team make sure that you stay on the live we're going to be announcing the winners of 15,000 rand grand prize. We're going to be giving away more money you're going to have to stay tuned to find out what more we're going to be giving away we're going to go for a quick break and we'll be back just after this. Thank you to the host of the various shows that we have in private property but sd class and we've got Chad we've got umbali, who of course are the host of the first time home buyers show the developer show and the farming podcast, respectively, it is the last episode of the private property podcast for 2020, we are giving away quite a lot of money and we're also hearing from you at home, as we wrap up, not just the private property podcast but also the other shows for 2020, and we'll be back in the new year we want to hear from you, what have been some of the best, you know, episodes that you've watched across the various shows. So do you share with us some of the best episodes that you've watched. Also, perhaps show with us what you've been able to do with watching all of these episodes I mean we talk often about how important and educating yourself and equipping yourself with all this knowledge before you make some of the decisions. We want to let us know if you've been able to move and make a few decisions and we heard yesterday from one of our viewers at home saying that they were going to acquire five property with 100% LTV from Apsa home loans, and they really found watching the podcast quite valuable. That's fantastic we love hearing stories like that from you at home so do share with us some of the things you've been able to do from watching the different podcasts, so that we know that we're on the right track. Well before the break we announced the winners of the 10,000 rand prize those were of course the runner ups for the grand prize and that was team magnificent. We'll be in touch with you to make sure that you get your 10,000 rand in cash, and the winners of the 15,000 rand grand prize and talking about this for a long time so all of you are going to be quite loaded. The lucky winners of the 15,000 rand grand prize goes to this one goes to team YOLO congratulations to team YOLO you walk away with that 15,000 rand grand prize. I wish I think I'm going to slide into your DMs just so you can spread the love and maybe just like you want some money, but congratulations to you. We certainly have enjoyed this competition we've enjoyed the various teams that all of you at home have formed, but we're not done giving away money I did say we're giving away money throughout the episode, going to hand over to Chad, and you'll hear more about some of the money that we're going to also be giving away for the rest of the show. Team YOLO congratulations I think I need to send some of my eWallet details as well sharing is definitely caring, but like Zama said we're going to be giving away even more money. So I've been given the honor to announce another five winners and these winners are going to be winning 1000 rand. We ran a competition on our Facebook page and we asked our fans to comment what they're grateful for heading into 2021 and some of the highlights of 2020. So without further ado, I'm going to read out our first winner of the five and I'm also going to take some time to read out each of the winners comments. So what did they write that got them this nice win here so let me put a nice drum roll in. And our first winner is Kutso Ramuachle and Kutso's comment was so much about 2020 has not felt peaceful at all like the other years. Even though it was challenging stretching and depressing most of the times I'm grateful that I'm still alive and have achieved some of the things like renovating my mother's home. It was never easy, but I made it through God. We have lost so many souls this year and I'm grateful for the life I've managed to accomplish. And I've also gotten a bursary for the 2021 academic year could so congratulations for that. It has been really hard surviving through this pandemic with no job but I'm grateful for being strong. And I'm looking forward to the new year with a positive mind, energy and self love could so I hope this is going to help you keep that positive mindset so congratulations. Now next up winner number two. Winner number two is Colin Lee Collins. Now Colin Lee gave us this comment high private property. Hi, Colin Lee. My highlight for 2020 is that I finished my bachelor's of education degree and passed all my modules with distinction. Congratulations there. It wasn't easy, especially this year, but I pushed through and I will be living my dream soon. I always dreamed of being a teacher as a little girl and making a difference in the lives of other children. 2020 was very challenging year, but I'm grateful for the health and essential workers you guys rock just hope and pray for better 2021. I think a lot of us are sharing those hopes and prayers and again I do hope this thousand range just eases this 2020 and lets you go into 2021 with a big smile on your face. Our third winner. Our third winner is Alanda Combs. And Alanda's comment was my 2020 highlight was definitely being used to make a difference in my community during lockdown by getting involved in a busy organizing run by a lady who depends solely on donations. And I gave out hot meals and much needed food hampers from alert level three. And we put a smile on the faces of many families who seem hopefully hopeless and full of despair during this pandemic and would definitely continue to do it way into 2021. Alanda thank you so much for helping the community I think charity is one of the most important things that we'll definitely be touching on it later, but thank you so much and yeah is a little something for you I think you deserve it. Now, winner number four is Roshika Kassenarian. Roshika's highlights for 2020 are she's having the last family get together on New Year's Day. I hope you can still do that with lockdown level three. Her little boy started great. I'm sure that's very, very exciting. And then her little boys lockdown birthday was their first birthday so I hope there was lots of fun and it's definitely an experience I think all the birthdays going forward are definitely going to be onwards and upwards, and her nephew was born. So congratulations for that as well. She finishes off saying I'm grateful that my family are safe and hopefully to recover from COVID. For the new year I hope that everything goes back to normal and our frontline workers have a rest and get to be with their family.  Now, last but not least is Julianne Morgan. Now Julianne's highlights for the year is that she patched up a relationship with her family members. She was able to work remotely and miss out on three hours of traffic every day. That sounds incredible. I think every single remote worker has been so so happy they get to miss out on traffic. Roshika says she managed to work clean and cook and homeschool her kids every day. My hat off to you. I've got a couple of friends who've been doing that and they've told us just how difficult it is. So I think if you can do that, there's not going to be another challenge that you're going to need a face that is going to trouble you. She also says my youngest boy started swimming all on his own and my older autistic boy has a lot more words in his vocabulary and my best highlight of all was seeing his face light up when he took his first escalator ride. I'm grateful for my health, my home, family and friends and that I'm able to work and provide for my family. Julianne, I 100% agree with you on that. I think it's been one of the biggest worries for everybody going into this and I'm very, very happy that each and every single one of us has been able to continue providing for their families. And I hope this has just eased that burden there. It's been incredible to hear all of your stories and they've put a smile on a lot of our listeners' faces. I think one of the most important things 2020 has taught us is to celebrate and rejoice in our wins. In the things we've achieved, no matter how small they may be, it's another brick in the wall we are moving in that wall of depression or self doubt. And it's each one of those achievements that push us forward into the next day with a healthy mind and spirit. So to all of you winners, I hope this token of our gratitude for you sharing your wonderful stories helps you achieve your next goal. And to all of our listeners, we look forward to hearing your highlights throughout 2021. But with that, I think this is the perfect time to take another short break, unless Zama would like to jump right into the next discussion. I think it's a great time to take that break because I think it's all the great posts that you went through. You know, the five winners shared such heartwarming moments about their lives and I think the highlights that they've shared with us have really been, you know, phenomenal. And we certainly do appreciate them sharing, opening their hearts and sharing with us. We're going to go for a quick break when we come back, we're going to be giving away more money. I think so far we've already given away, I think it's about 30,000 rounds if my maths is correct. But after the break, we're giving away more money, we'll be hearing more from us. I also want to continue hearing from you, what have been some of the highlights of the different podcasts. I know that you've probably watched Chad, you've watched Mbali, you've watched Essie and myself. So do let us know what have been some of the highlights of the different episodes that you've watched. And perhaps if there's any episode that stands out for you, do share that with us down here below. Also, let us know what you want to see more of because this is where we make sure we go to the drawing room and give you what you want. So do let us know more content, the more kinds of content that you want to see from us in the new year. The team is also behind the scenes, catching all those suggestions so that when we go into prep for the new year, we make sure that we give you the best when it comes to the different property podcasts that are on the platform. We're going to go for a quick break and we'll be back just after this. Private Property Podcast, the last edition of the Private Property Podcast. I'm your host, Usamantungwa Kumalo, and I'm with the other phenomenal hosts of our different shows. I'm with Mbali, I'm with Chad, as well as Essie. They of course host the farming podcast, the developer show, as well as the first time home buyers show respectively. We are ending off the year in style in the best way that we know how. That's firstly by acknowledging your community. It's been such an incredible journey being with you throughout the months from the very first episode that we had of the Private Property Podcast. Also the various first episodes of the different shows that we've had on your screen. They absolutely love the love that you have given us. And I really honor that you get to take away a bit of your time to watch the different shows, to engage us, not just live on the show, but also keep the conversation going across our social media platforms. We certainly love hearing from you. We're chatting off air that we should definitely do more of these in the year, maybe once a month or every so often, where we get together as the gang and perhaps see what special offering we could bring on your table. So that's already something that I think as the presenters we're loving. We think we probably want to do that. So do share with us at home. What are some of the things that you want to see more of us doing? What kind of offering would you like to see more of us from our different social media platforms and also, of course, our different shows. We are taking your questions and comments. I see there's a very cheeky one from Ubong Sabagwen. I'll share it just quickly. I see Victor Sabagwen here saying, I enjoyed episode 23 using technology to get most of your farming venture. And of course, he's referring to the farming podcast with Umbadi that comes to your screens every Tuesdays and Thursdays at 1 p.m. So for all the agricultural needs, that is the show that you want to make sure that you watch. Martha, for ever showing us love, saying that Pada Pabti, we are truly grateful fam. Thank you for the great lessons and the spoils. We love you to the moon and back and we love you right back, Martha. Thank you so much for always commenting, always engaging and always being with us. Ubong Sabagwen, one of the top fan gang members saying, can we do that property masterclass that is a mantra I've promised? We'll see. We'll see what we do in the evening here. Maybe I can be, maybe people will bend my arms and I'll do a few of them. Howard Mogadzane is saying, on the real though, it beats me on how social media has so many people and yet we barely find our friends in here. The knowledge shared since the first episode to this date is just so, so overwhelming and best of all, it's free. Invite your friends, guys, hashtag team SL. And that's a really great one because I think oftentimes a lot of our friends are looking to buy that first property are looking at my into a development. They are interested in, you know, pursuing an agricultural venture and often don't know where to go to find more information about all of these things. And here are the different shows that cater directly to that, but we bring you an expert guests who are able to answer questions live on air. So you don't need to try and call somebody, try and email somebody or try to slide into somebody's DMs. They are live, they are there, they ask, they answer the questions that you ask them. So don't feel shy.  We ask all these questions all the time. So never feel as though, look, maybe if I ask this question, it's going to seem weird, it doesn't. I promise you there's probably somebody who also is wondering the same thing as you. So do make sure that you always ask the question that you want to ask. But I want us to talk about something. And it's a theme that's kind of slightly come out in some of the, you know, post that we received that Chad was sharing some of the winners is, and that's of course the issue of charity. I think one of the things that certainly happened this year, we were faced with the COVID-19 pandemic and the devastating effects that it's had on different people. One of us experienced the effects in different ways, and some were than others. Some people were displaced, many people who saw in social media weren't able to, you know, whether pay for rental, weren't able to buy food for their family and there were different people who rose to make sure that we, you know, help each other out because the reality is we could not have anticipated this crisis, even if we had tried. And we certainly wouldn't have been able to anticipate the devastating effects people losing their jobs and not being able to provide for their families. And more often than not really through, you know, people's charity and making sure that we're able to take care of each other that we're able to get through. I really like to hear firstly from our presenters, you know, around what they, and I'm going to hand this one over to Mbani because I know that there's more money that she's maybe giving away. I told you we're all giving away money. All of us were rotating. So I think be nice. Maybe every time we gather, we'll be giving away money. I think we're nice. This is going to be a regular thing. You know, somebody I want to hand over to you. I think this issue of charity, it's such a, it's such, I think we've seen so many people rise up this year, helping to complete stages. I mean, some people have had GoFundMe pages or PacketBody pages, and you see people donating even if it's the smallest, 20 rounds, and we really is that time where we're saying, look, as much as I'm maybe going through a difficult time, there's probably somebody else who's going through a worse off. I'm going to do my bit to just help out in this one.  Thank you, Zama. Well, I think I'll just talk on a personal level. There's no specific charity that myself or my farm, my business green terrace directly supports, simply because I feel like we give charity, we give away to charity every single month. It's just become a norm. And I think it's just how we as South Africans are.  And I just think that's just the general nature and culture of South Africans. I know for the sake of this discussion we're saying it's charity, but I think people give away the little that they have each and every day. I mean, and you alluded to obviously the lockdown and when we're still in level five and I can definitely say that from a farming family throughout South Africa, a lot of the farmers did their best as well doing food parcels, donating some of their produce through to the nearby communities and so many farmers are just doing going above and beyond. And which is a great thing and it's good to also see the private property family also, you know, nominating some of the charities which is I'm going to mention out here in a few seconds. I think just to close on what you mentioned that, yeah, I think as firstly as South Africans, I think we are a very giving nation and it was great to see us come together and really look out for those that do not have a lot, especially during the lockdown season and that we, you know, we didn't forget that we actually live in communities that other people that are less fortunate than us. And so, yeah, I think what, yeah, what I can definitely recall is that we gave away about 100 of our green bean boxes at the start of, I think it was level lockdown five. That's just about half a tonne of green beans to a church organization who was able to assist the community. But if given your permission, Zama, can I go ahead and maybe introduce the charity giveaway and mention some of the lucky charity organizations that are going to go home with some money at the end of tonight. Yes, please do buddy. Awesome. So I have the pleasure of giving away to Yeah, giving away money to two charity organizations. And this is part of our estate agent charity giveaway where the audience was encouraged to, you know, nominate nominate a charity of their choice, which they felt was close to their hearts and is doing amazing work in their own corner of the world and I will first start off by saying that we got two members who they nominated to each their own charity of choice. And I'll start off with Genevieve Christopher, who nominated smile of joy based in Benoni. So smile of joy based in Benoni, you are going away with 9000 Rand and Genevieve mentioned that this charity organization is obviously close to a heart. It's an MPO. And what they do is that they provide oral care and education to children living with HIV and these are children who are orphans. And so yeah, Genevieve, thank you so much for nominating smile of joy. I'm sure they'll be extremely happy during this time of year. And so thank you for nominating this MPO of the choice. Secondly, I will mention Ben and she nominated Morena Children's Village and she mentioned that what Morena Children's Village does is that they're also an MPO that provides care to homeless and orphaned children. And why this charity organization stood out for her is that they always managed to keep a smile on their face and which then melts her heart quite dearly. And so to the fellow, thank you so much for nominating Morena Children's Village and Morena Children's Village walks away with 9000 Rand today. I know that our team will be in touch with you guys, but thank you to both Genevieve Christopher and to the fellow for nominating these two outstanding charities that are doing phenomenal work to orphan children. Thank you. Thank you so much Mbali and certainly thank you to the, you know, to the state agents on our social media platforms who made sure that they nominate their charities who have now of course walked away with that 9000 Rand cash prize. We certainly understand the importance of not just giving money to different people who enter competitions but also giving to organizations that play a role in making lives of, you know, people in their respective communities just that little bit better. And we do hope that that 9000 Rand is going to go a long way. I know that oftentimes funding to nonprofits are one of the first places that gets cut when people do budgets or when organizations do budgets, especially during difficult times. So we do hope that the money will make a little bit of a difference in your respective organizations. I want us to go for a quick break as we slowly start wrapping up the this evening's show we're not done yet. I know that you would have seen the person we said that this is the social media award rendition of the private property podcast while we're getting to that fun bit. So if you want to see, at least get a sense of what the awards are who has won them and how much they're going to walk away then you certainly still want to make sure that you stay tuned because there's still plenty more money that will be giving away just after this break. Welcome back to the last episode of the private property podcast for the year 2020. It's been so quiet. I'm laughing because one of my colleagues is actually making a noise in the background. And so that's why not of us are not laughing. I know you can hear me. It's probably one of those 2020 plan days that you never quite think will go on it because we've actually managed the whole year without having even a single one of them. So here we are, and the very last episode, and that's what we have. And I think if anything that's probably the best way to wrap up the right like have a nice little issue that gets presenters offing on it with a very, very last episode. Well, I did say we're going to be giving away more money after the break. And you know I never lead you astray because I absolutely love giving away money. One of the things that I will say is that we've been on the shows and the respective shows for many months. Make sure that you follow us on our respective social media pages and show you already follow us and make sure you follow private property across the different social media pages that we have, excuse me. You're watching us on Facebook, but also of course on YouTube, also on you, we're on YouTube, we're on Instagram, also on Twitter so do make sure that you follow all of us on our respective social media pages as well as private property across our social media pages. One of the things that we love talking about on our social media pages, especially on our Facebook page, our top fans, you know there was a time when there was the battle of the top fan gang members that I wanted us to have, you know, almost having a Facebook versus YouTube and seeing different members who watch us across the different social media platforms. I know Instagram, we started also broadcasting on Instagram and you saw a few people emerging as top fans on Instagram, which is absolutely fantastic. Well, we want to make sure that we also give recognition to our top fans. All of us did say that we love hearing from you, we love it when you interact with us. And we really were not joking, we really do love hearing from you at home and you know for you interacting with us. But before I announce our top fan members and how much they get to walk away with because this is probably the tail end of the show. I want to hear very briefly from our various presenters, what we can look forward to for the new year from them. I know that it's now that time of the year when we're all reflecting on you know 2021 what we want to do more of. So what can we expect more from you I know from our top fans that we're about to award want them to engage with us more get some of their friends and family to engage with us more because we really do provide valuable content from them but SD what more can we expect from you in the new year especially home, first time home by a show. I think definitely to learn a little bit more because I was going to mention the lessons learned and this is such a, like a long list of lessons learned and just to continue growing firstly the audience the viewers like you said top fan gang is bringing their family in bring them over to the 745 show you know just to learn. And I think there's like I said earlier, we're all going to be or we have been a first time home buyer so no lesson goes unnoticed so me myself as a host I'm learning every show. Thank you to learn more. Absolutely love that is seen I think one of the great things that you pick up when you're doing these shows is, you can never know enough there's always so much to learn, you know, from the different guests from viewers at home I mean I sometimes go on the Facebook page after the show to just see some of the comments from the viewers at home, and the conversation always keeps continuing. Even on my own Twitter page I think it's always so great to see viewers at home, engaging and also learning from each other as they are watching the different podcasts Chad, what can we expect from you in the new year. Well we definitely going to do our best to bring more experts in in the development industry because they hold such a special place in the real estate industry. I love to have more and more people that can share their knowledge and share all the experience they've had to answer those questions and how do developments fitting with first time home buyers maybe we can even start looking at how developments can fit in with mbali's farming show and and see how these tying together and help answer the questions our fans have because everybody's so unique when searching for information. A lot of that information might not be applicable to your situation so I'd like to answer a lot of those questions I'm very keen to interact with the guys online a little bit more, and really bring something special and and hopefully, you know continue to do a couple of these shows so we all get together and maybe give away some money maybe just share expertise or maybe just have a lot I'm looking forward to a lot of this in 2020 2021. Listen, we cannot have a repeat of 2020. I hope that 2021 is better than what we've expressed this year. The goal that has been this year was absolutely traumatic and I'm sure nobody wants to repeat of this one money from your side what can we expect from the farming podcast in the new year. I think we may just be having a slight technical issue with them by I'm going to quickly check on her see if she's still with us. She probably is if anything I always drove that look farmers don't always have the greatest connection it just it's the nature of the game they are out in the field and Definitely more guests. I would love to get more expert opinions from individuals from different sectors. Yeah, I think we've got the tail end of that one by Lee we just lost the first bit so she really wants to bring in various experts from different sectors, because I think when you think of the farming value chain it's so broad. And I think one of the things that you definitely want when your viewer and that maybe part of me also got on self interest want to learn about where in the value chain at best fit in so maybe my role isn't buying the actual farm. But it might be something completely different. So I think that's one of the things that I look forward to being more of in the farming podcast in the year. Well, it is that time of the evening we're going to be giving away for this last leg of giveaways we're going to be giving away a whopping 25,000 rounds so it's different people as you can imagine, because they're quite a few members that we want to give away. And this this leg of the giveaway we've actually called it the top fan giveaway. So if you know that you're one of the top fan gang members you probably might be walking away with some money. And I want to start with the first award because actually have awards. And one of the big things with this giveaway is we want the selected winners to please slide into our DMS so that the team can get your details your banking details and it can give you the money. So if you want, please just make sure you slide into our DMS and we will make sure that we give you your money, literally tomorrow you'll probably get your money so just make sure that you slide into our DMS. Well, it's a top fan giveaway here on the private property podcast on the last episode of 2020. And the first award that we are giving away is the most engaging fan. I feel like this one probably needs, I know people at home are watching and they're just like we already know who the winner is, because they are always engaging just this evening they were engaging us a lot.  And we certainly do look forward to more engagement from you in the new year. See more of your friends and family coming on I know that you also have your friends who watched I remember you both were sharing your experience with each other and about each other's house. So we certainly do love hearing from you mother congratulations to work with that 2000 round cash prize. And the second award that we're going to be giving away is the most humorous. And this is probably goes to the person when you continue the conversation down below. You know that they're the funny maestro and that is a victim. Our victim is the one who walks away, and he also walks away with that 2000 round grand cash prize. Again, please make sure you slide into our DMs, so that we can give you that money. The third award that we are giving away is our most caring fan and our most caring fan goes to Anelda Everton. Anelda Everton congratulations you walk away with that 2000 round grand prize, not grand prize cash prize. So here's how we always talking about money. And so also do make sure that you slide into our DMs so that we can make sure that we get that money to you. One of the big things that you can take away from this giveaway is that we reward the top fans. We don't just, you know, run up and say engage with us. There are various ways that we certainly want to reward our top fans in the new year, because we certainly do love hearing from you. We love the encouragement that you also carry with each other. We love the sense of community that we formed here on our, not just the show, but certainly on our social media platforms. And that then brings us to our fourth award. And this one, I love this award because we always talk about him slightly or sometimes even call him out. And this fourth prize is our most informative fan. And this one goes to Howard Mugatane. Howard Mugatane, our most informative fan, congratulations. You also walk away with that 2000 round cash prize. Do make sure that you slide into our DMs so you can walk so that we can give you that cash prize. And then another one, and this other one we know this one, these are the top fan gang members, is our most progressive fan. This goes to Sammy Masalzi. Sammy Masalzi walks away with that 2000 brand cash prize. So do make sure Sammy that you also slide into our DMs and we'll make sure that we get you that prize. And then we've got two people who are going to walk away with the next one. I mean, I keep talking a lot about how we've been on for many months from as early as March. And here we are now in December and we're about to do, you know, wrap up the last show of 2020. And the next award is for the long standing fans. And the two winners who are going to walk away with the long standing fans are U-Bongs Savakwena as well as Khosol Chumelo.  So they've been with us all these months. We love hearing from them. We love the texts. We certainly love the various messages and the questions that they ask and they've been consistent in that from the get go. So congratulations to both of you. You walk away with that 2000 brand cash prize. And the next award is also tied with two winners because this one also needed two members. And this one goes to the award is the cheerleaders award. And the cheerleaders award goes to Uklaed Sherinda who walks away with 2000 rands as well as U-Bongani Queen Mabunda also walks away with 2000 rands. If I remember correctly, I think U-Bongani and U-Matha are friends. If my memory serves me correct. Remember those are competition that we're talking about and you made reference to each other's homes in one of the entries. So congratulations to both of you. Walk away with that 2000 rand cash prize. And the next one. And I love this giveaway. This one is the class captain. And we've seen this one because we've seen this member literally being the class captain down here below in the comments section. And also, of course, wouldn't be up on air. And this one goes to Koteko. Congratulations. You walk away with that 2000 rand prize. You are the class captain.  I'm going to give away the next batch of awards. I'm going to hand over to Esi Klasen to share with us who the next winners for this particular award are. So congratulations. Remember to slide into our DMs so that we can make sure that we give you that money. Esi, who are our next winners? Thank you, Zama. So our next winners, this award goes to the daily commenters. Again, as Zama said, thank you for always commenting and engaging. We too, when we read the comments, learn a lot from you. These winners are going away with 1000 rand cash. So the winners are Palesa Selane, Michelle Grisal, Rebecca Crestwell, Esaman Timanghe Kunene and Colleen Janssen. Sorry if I put your name. You are all going away with 1000 rand cash as well. Thank you always for commenting. I am sure I've seen some of these names on my show as well. So well done to you. Thank you so much, Esi. And I think one of the big things that we're certainly getting from this is this has become a community. We've got prefect members, daily commenters. We've got top fan gang members, some of them literally were, we say that they were part of the cabal. I remember saying you guys are a cabal. When you come on air, you're always greeting each other. And it's almost like those cool kids at school who are sitting at the back of the class. And when you join for the first time, you want to impress them as much as possible. We've certainly enjoyed the love from all of you at home, whether you walked away with the prize or not. We always see your comments. We always see you interacting with us. And we simply love it so much. And thank you very much. I want to end off before we wrap up the show this evening. I see here we've got something from Simply Draw Dance who who says good evening all I would like to thank my teammates, hashtag team YOLO for their constant hard work and dedication, the amount of effort you all have put in was exceptional. It was not an easy journey as we had strong competitors, the likes of Team Magnificent who gave us a run for our money. But because of our dedication, we rose above them all. Being part of a winning team is a phenomenal feeling. A big thank you to Private Property for giving us the opportunity to learn through these podcasts and also win these amazing cash prizes. YOLO are so awesome. Thank you so much. And that of course comes from the winning team. And thank you all for getting your friends and family, watching the podcast, but also watching the other podcasts, engaging with the content. One of the big things that we certainly want to hear from you in the new year is get more of your friends and family to be engaging with us, continue showing what you want to see more of us doing in the new year. We're quite excited to bring up something fresher and better. We've certainly learned a lot as presenters in the past few months, whether we've been doing the show from as early as March or three months ago with Umbali being the new kid on the block. We've grown a lot as presenters. We've grown a lot as people in the industry who are also growing their own respective portfolios or in Bali's case running a farm. And I think it's always so interesting to go in with a new community in mind and learn from that particular community. And I think before I wrap up the show, before I wrap up the show, I'm going to ask the gang any final words from either one of you, because I want us to wrap up on the bank. I know that we've kept our viewers at home for quite a while. We're going to wear a lot of money this evening, something we love doing. Chad, Esteem, Bali, any last words from either one of you? Absolutely. I'll run with some last words quickly. I think first I'd just like to thank all the winners, guys. Without you, we wouldn't be able to do what we do. So thank you so much every single time you tune in, every single time you comment or send us questions. We really appreciate that and we're looking forward to that continuing even further into the new year. And again, just to echo what Zama has been saying, we've got some real fresh content coming, some really cool stuff in the works.  So thank you so much. Have an amazing new year, guys. Stay safe and we look forward to seeing you all year in 2021. Thank you, Chad. Esteem, any last words from your side? I can definitely say I felt like Oprah giving away all this money. Again, congratulations to all the winners and just to echo what Chad said, without you, none of these shows would be possible. So really during the second wave and everything that's happening, stay safe, wear a mask, stay at home and just enjoy our shows. Don't go out. We're here for you. I love that. It's the only staying home. I think that's such a big one, especially as we see a rise in COVID-19 numbers with the second wave. Bali, any last words from your end? Yeah, I just want to say thank you to all the viewers, the audience who's been engaging and interacting in every single show. Congratulations to all the winners. I hope you use this money wisely and I hope that it came at the right time because a lot of people have definitely lost their income or have had their income reduced during this time of year. So thank you to everybody who has nominated charity organizations and definitely thought of those who are less fortunate. And then obviously, because we're locked down level three for people just to stay home and be safe. But most importantly, thank you to our frontline workers and our essential service providers or businesses or companies that are really doing the best during these trying times. We are all with you. And just thank you for just keeping the country alive and I hope to see you all in 2021. Thank you to my co-hosts and my presenters. Yeah, thank you to everybody. And I wish you all a very good new year. Thank you so much in Bali and I want to echo that, that, you know, the, we certainly grateful to the healthcare providers, the frontline workers, the farmers, because the reality is our groceries are always stopped. We have food as much as we may have, you know, yeast that's out of stock for a little bit. We always have food on the table and we know that when we go to any grocery store, we're going to find food and that's because of farmers and various people who are part of the value chain that feeds us. So we're very grateful to all of you at home. I think to end off on my end. And this is probably how this show has been for me. I want to share a post by, you know, somebody who stood into my DMs on Twitter. I think they'd seen something I tweeted about the show so they said it to my DMs because they didn't want to post it on the timeline. So I'm not going to say their name because I said to them, look, I'll share this but I'm not going to share your name because you want it to be private. And they wrote, hey, I just wanted to say a major shout out to your podcast. Wifey and I were able to go through the whole process of buying our first house with the info you shared on your various shows from getting a bond originator negotiating a couple lower basis points from the best banks of questions to ask the state agents negotiating the sending price in the craziest of years. The show made us confident to take the steps we've been planning for months as we felt well informed. Thanks for the amazing show and your passion in property. This is definitely the first of many. And I think for me that is a huge shout out to all of you at home who not only watch the show, you certainly watch it even with your loved ones. You go through the episodes over and over again and you help it inform what is such a sacred, sometimes very overwhelming decision. The reality is home is such a big part of our lives and it's been such a big part of our lives, especially this year with many of us working from home and having to adjust to that new work life balance in the different ways. So certainly grateful to all of you at home for tuning in for sharing with your friends and family, and we do hope that you're going to continue doing so in the year. And all the best for your various property ambitions we love hearing from you and love hearing from them, myself on my social media platforms, and we're definitely looking forward to making sure that in the new year, we continue bringing on expert guests we continue helping you on your journey and making it as smooth as possible so that you don't have any of the headaches that some of us had when we're doing this the first few times, but also that you can enjoy it because I think it's you don't want to do this and not enjoy it you want it to be a fun experience. I think more than anything and this is where I'm particularly proud of the black women who've who always, you know, commenting always talking about their property portfolios and the fact that so many of the winners in the top 10 gang members, also from women from Omar that to Queen be we certainly love hearing from you and I think it's so great to be able to talk about property, or even to talk about farming or to talk about, you know, buying a first home for the first time, as black women, because we come from a country where we would not have been able to own property by ourselves or certainly around farms by ourselves, or on businesses by ourselves. So we definitely don't take it for granted that we live in this moment in history, and we're able to do the work that we do so, certainly for the new year we look forward to doing more of it making the property ownership circle bigger making the first time home by circle bigger making the farming circle bigger as much as possible. And that's it for myself and as a team has said we're hoping that you're going to be responsible it's the second last day of 2020. Do you hope that you're going to be responsible we are still living in very difficult times. And I think more than anything I also want to acknowledge that many of you may have lost loved ones at home. This year throughout the course of this year and we really do send our condolences, if you have lost any loved ones during the course of this year. And we hope that in this festive season you'll be able to recharge as much as possible. And the memory of those who have passed on, but also that the rest of us stay safe will try to know earlier on we're talking about, you know, making sure that we stay at home as much as possible with sanitize and make sure that we stay safe so we do hope that we'll do just that. So we can see each other in the new year. So as usual hoping to stay at home as they say we'll see you in 2021. Jared Siegel, I'm a local restaurateur and the owner of Jared's espresso bar and eatery in Seaport. I'm a Cape Town local, campsite born and bred, and I've been living in Sydney Australia for the last few years. Living abroad, I've always been drawn to the mother city and I've recently decided to come back home. Taking lifestyle factors into consideration, Bantry Bay has been the perfect fit for me. Living on the Atlantic seaboard really resonates with what I'm all about. From the active lifestyle, the amazing food culture, its family friendly environment and amazing natural beauty, the quality of life we have on offer is really unique. The Atlantic seaboard has some of the most beautiful suburbs in the country. With areas like Cams Bay and its world renowned beach culture and the recent refurbishment of Seapoint Promenade, it's no wonder our neighborhood has such a global appeal. After a long day of hard work, there's nothing better than taking a walk along Clifton Beach, sharing a moment and watching the sunset. Trying to offer something authentic to the community, I'm not about reinventing the wheel, just doing the classics really well, and this is my neighborhood.


Silicon Valley and Route 128 and later on Gilson, as long as the probability for any given innovation does not decline more rapidly from the well-behaved innovations, if you're basically imagining that the cost of starting a business is on the access and we're seeing it with red, once you reach a certain point, you can have many, many, many, many low-level innovation. Even if the ones at the higher end of the distribution are more carefully planned and more justified because they were able to be capitalized, they have to be sufficiently more likely to actually succeed than all of these small efforts here, both market and non-market, in order at a system level to perform better. That doesn't seem to be what we're seeing, which is why I think we're seeing this very distributed model generating innovations from where we didn't expect them. Institutionally, that means that freedom to operate is more important than power to appropriate. And this, I think, is the core institutional point about openness. That means commons or symmetrically available freedom to operate, it means open system, which is essentially commons versus non-commons is the legal institutional parallel of open versus closed. That is to say, you build a system where everybody has symmetrically applied abilities and disabilities around a set of resources, as opposed to one that allows one person to say, you may or may not innovate on this particular set of resources. More generally, we talk about it in terms of open versus closed, whether it's institutional technical organization, and again, critically, at all layers and instantiations of platforms, resources, and pathways. So that means physical, both transport and devices. That means logical, that means platforms, that means content. And here, I'll just very quickly emphasize a few points and then spend the last five minutes highlighting a couple of issues on the digital agenda. So again, what we have when we look at transport wired, and this is back to the point of open internet that David was raising earlier. You can have a competitive structure versus a non-competitive structure. The unbundling and open access rules in Europe push towards a more competitive home broadband market, which means there was less pressure on the behavioral regulation. The reason you're getting net neutrality debates in the US and Canada is because there's not as much of a competitive structure as you're trying to impose a behavioral regulation. In each case, you're getting market discipline as opposed to regulatory discipline to achieve the same result. A platform over one particular bottleneck, connectivity to the home, that does not become a point where you have to ask permission whether or not to innovate, which means you don't have to get into a transaction, which means you can try and fail and fail and then succeed. And there's the question of investment, ownership, private versus municipal. Now we're seeing as the move to ubiquitous mobile connectivity emerges, we're seeing the same thing happening.