afternoon, or good evening, depending on where you're logging in from. Welcome to the Land Dialogue Webinar series, which is organized in partnership with the Ford Foundation, the Land Portal Foundation, the Tenure Facility and the Thomson Reuters Foundation. Thank you for joining us. My name is Thin and I'm a journalist specializing in food systems and climate change. And I'm delighted to be moderating today's session on climate funding and COP28, Turning Pledges into Action. Now, the idea behind sur la consommation des engagements en action awareness on the land rights of indigenous peoples and local communities. Now, these rights, we believe are a prerequisite to achieve national and international goals around forest governance, food security, climate mitigation, economic development and human rights. Now, this is our fourth and final land dialogue for this year. But first, before we start our discussion, I'm just going to go through some housekeeping rules. Now, this webinar is mainly going to be conducted in English, Portuguese and Spanish, but we also have simultaneous translations in French, as well as the other languages that I just mentioned. To access the translation, all you have to do is go to the globe icon at the bottom of your Zoom window, click on it and select the language that you want. Now, this webinar is going to be 60 minutes. We've set aside about 10 to 15 minutes for Q&A. So if you have any questions, please post them in the Q&A box and not the chat box, but do use the chat box as I see others are already using to introduce yourselves. Also, feel free to tweet using the hashtag LENDialogs, which is just one word, LENDialogs, and you can also follow the live tweeting from the LEN portal and tenure facility Twitter accounts. And finally, we are also recording today's session and we will share the link with you later. Now that we've gotten that out of the way, let's turn to today's topic. Now, the past two U.N. climate summits have been big on promises for Indigenous peoples. At COP26 in 2021, governments and private philanthropies pledged nearly two billion dollars for Indigenous peoples and local communities to fight deforestation. Last year, at COP27, there was a creation of a new loss and damage fund to help vulnerable communities respond to the climate disasters. Leaders are again preparing for another round of climate talks at COP28, which is going to start later this week in Dubai. And this time, they're vowing to enhance the participation and visibility of Indigenous peoples during the negotiations. But as we all know, having the funds or just being able to participate is not enough. The funds need to reach the right people and at scale. But is that happening? And if not, then why is that not happening? Can the newly established Indigenous led funds lead the way forward? Well, we have a fantastic group of speakers who are going to answer these questions. And in the interest of fairness, I am going to introduce them in alphabetical order. So first, we have Casey Box, who is the Director of Global Strategy at the Christensen Fund. Casey is committed to supporting Indigenous rights, participatory grant making and grassroots network building. We also have Deborah Sanchez from the Hondura Miskito Group, who is a longtime Indigenous leader, and she recently took on the role of director with Community Land Rights and Conservation Finance Initiative, or clarify for short. We also have Jenny Lopez, who is a land governance advisor, responsible for land tenure rights, programming and policy work at the UK's Foreign Commonwealth and Development Office. And we have Valeria Baye from the Terrio and Castellana people of the Parque de Tomocomarque Indigenous land in the states of Para and Amapá in Brazil. Valeria, I am so sorry if I mispronounce those names. Now Valeria is the head of the Executive Board of the Podali, which is an Indigenous fund of the Brazilian Amazon. And last, but definitely not the least, we have Josimara Maguario, who is from the Bahre people, and she is the coordinator of the Rio Indigenous Fund. This is an initiative from a federation that actually represents 23 Indigenous peoples living in the Rio Negro in the Amazonas. So it's great to have this group of donors as well as Indigenous leaders present to have this discussion. So I think the first question I would like to ask to all of our speakers is to sort of reflect a little bit back on the discussion that we had last year on the donor promises to Indigenous communities. Can we perhaps talk about where, you know, whether those promises have been fulfilled? So I'd like to ask our speakers to sort of briefly talk about perhaps one key win as well as one major challenge or obstacle that have, you know, emerged since last year's climate summit. Deborah, perhaps I can start with you for the discussion. Yes, thank you, team, for the opportunity. And I want to reflect on that we probably have already reached like this key milestone where we all have a common understanding of the importance of the flexible that the funds needs to be like a fewer administrative hordes and then how we need to be in the center of the design of these funds. So now we're talking about effective participation, flexibility and how that can look like and how can we implement? So I think that we are going from that face to the implementation phase. And where are we moving towards that? I think that one of the very important key issues is that we are being reimagining the funding ecosystem, right? We are being creating like these funds by Indigenous peoples, local community for the sentient peoples and how we govern these funds and how we put these funds together and how we start moving forward and working with them. And the most important thing is for me that we are creating actual lesson learns, we are creating experiences. We are doing it and then that will bring us a lot of the knowledge that we need to move forward. But of course, in the obstacles, we are facing that it is it's hard to really implement and recreate things where the system is already set up, right? So we really need to start looking at the more systematic approach and how we can make flexibility, how we can actually demonstrate on the ground. And we've seen that the tendency that a lot of the philanthropists are moving a lot faster on that part, on that way. But then we still seen a lot of the people from the from the the bilaterals that also working on that and looking at how we can have effective participation and how the flexibility can look like. From our side, I think we've been like working hard in developing these funds. And now we have established in global level funds, regional funds, national funds that are working. So I think this is the greatest approach or takeaway that I can have from our side. Thank you so much, Deborah. That's actually very encouraging to hear Valeria and Josie Mara. Can I ask you to also briefly talk about one key win and a challenge? Valeria, could I perhaps start with you and then we'll go to Josie Mara? Good morning, everyone. It's in the it's the morning here in Brazil. We are in Manaus in the Brazilian Amazon region.  It's good to do that about the question. So what could be a key win and achievement for us? The opportunities to be at COP taking part in the process sometimes not directly, but some of our leaders are to introduce ourselves, to speak for ourselves, to be there at a space, to a big public, to a big audience. This is an opportunity to disseminate, to have a broader dialogue. So we see that as an important step and as a challenge to be met. So we still need to build the process that seems to me to be a long road of building trust because the funders must trust, in fact, with trust, the instruments that we created that we manage. And this means that in our perception that this support also isn't arriving in the volume that should be arriving by now. So we still are taking you know, we are still in the talking phase and not in the acting phase. And so that's the first message we would share to reflect on the process so far. Great. Hello. Hola. I agree with what Valeria has just said. My position is very similar. I think something positive that I can say is precisely this opening. So these occupations that we indigenous peoples are carrying out in these spaces of discussion, of dialogue, international spaces particularly. So this process of being listened to is very important to us, is very positive in recent years, particularly since the last COP, going forward to the 28th. So that process of just listening is very important to us in and of itself. And it's something that I, something negative, but not negative, but a challenge is that we need to receive more practical support, not just in speech, not just rhetorical, so true partnership and also to establish this process of building trust of partnership. I think that's the the initial message I would like to leave with you. Great. Thank you so much. Casey and Jenny, I'm coming to you. You've heard from the indigenous groups and leaders or what about you, what would you reflect on? Casey, can I start with you first? Sure. Thank you, then. I think last year I spoke to Toya from Koyab about the issue of capacity building being on the indigenous people side. And the good thing is that indigenous peoples have definitely addressed that. You have the leadership of Pudali under Valeria as now executing grants, receiving more funding and more complex funding. You have Debra Sanchez now leading clarify here on the call today. Indigenous peoples across Asia have founded the Indigenous Peoples of Asia Solidarity Fund that will distribute small grants all across Asia. The first ever women's forum in the Congo Basin has called for the first ever indigenous and local community led fund for the Congo Basin. And finally, Shandia convened stakeholders at the OECD in Paris to talk about better tracking, accountability and transparency when it comes to funding for indigenous peoples. The challenge, unfortunately, still exists on the donor side. We know that in twenty twenty one, only seven percent of that pledge out of Glasgow went directly to indigenous peoples and local communities. And when we dig deeper into those numbers, I'm concerned that it's even less than seven percent. So really, the challenge still exists on the donor side and there's more that needs to be done to create more flexible funding. And we need to allow indigenous peoples and local communities to define themselves, what they view as direct funding and financing. Thanks, Casey. That's a striking number. Jenny, I'd like to come to you for your thoughts. Thank you very much. And I agree with all the comments that have been said. I think the thing I I'm feeling optimistic, though, that some progress is being made. I mean, from what I've seen over the last three years, really, since we launched that, the pledging Glasgow is I have seen progress being made. I think that I mean, what we're we're showing is more IP and LC led organisations are being directly funded than we've ever seen before. I really believe it's not just about the one point seven billion. It's not just about the money in itself. It's about how we're working together as donors, as IP and LC organisations, other partners, civil society organisations. And we've seen a level of dialogue and collaboration and discussions between all of those stakeholders in ways that really had not happened before. It's been really exciting in in Montreal, in New York, at COPs to have leaders from government alongside the stage, alongside discussions, alongside events with IP and LC leaders, with civil organisations in a way that was not happening before to really have visibility of this issue area by prime ministers, by presidents on stage in a way, again, we had not seen before. I mean, particularly in New York last month to have, you know, the ministers from Norway alongside ministers from Brazil, which we didn't even have that minister for IPLC before. I mean, I do see this visibility that the pledge has brought, which again has brought attention to this and now means there's an accountability commitment from donors, which again, we did not have before on this issue. So I do see positive change, but I really do agree with other comments that it is slow, it is a journey, but at least we are on that journey now together and there is that accountability and commitment, which again, three years ago was not there. So I would like to say I agree it's slow, but I am really feeling positive that at least we're having this conversation. Great, thank you, Jenny. I mean, what I'm hearing from everybody, I think it's optimism, right? And I guess the fact that it is happening, the fact that there are openings that didn't exist before. But of course, there's always room for improvement, right?  And the question now, there's no question anymore about whether, you know, the IPLCs need funding and that there should be funds. It is now about, OK, how do we make sure that, you know, we can fund them at scale and that well targeted? Deborah, can I just come back to you again? I mean, Casey did a very quick, but super useful rundown of, you know, multiple indigenous let funds that have started appearing. Could you just give a brief overview in addition to what Casey have said and whether there are any other funds that, you know, that have that have come up that that are, you know, really interesting and exciting? Thank you. I will say that we've been seeing like this system of global, regional and national financial mechanism that is being built, led and governed by indigenous peoples, local communities and for the Senate. And I think there is a few of them. And we can see, for example, at the global level, we are talking about the community, land rights and conservation finance initiative that is being incubator on in rights and resource initiative coalition and with the technical support of campaign for nature and basically what we're saying is we are this global mechanism and we are giving grants in all lands and territories. And we are having, for example, grants up to one million. And then we have this fiscal sponsor mandate also two grants that are over 50 million. So we are seeing like scaling up, right? This issue of capacity, this issue of how we scale funds that goes to to the ground. And then we have the regional and national funds. I can I mean, Valeria, my sister, she can talk more about Podali and how it's governed, how it's led. But we see in Pawanka, we see in the iPod, the Solidarity Fund for Asia. We see the Mesoamerican Territory of Fund, Nusantara Fund. Also, Amman has a national fund already. And, for example, we've been collaborating with Amman's national funds and with the Mesoamerican Territory of Funds and Clarify is giving grants to them. So they can actually build their capacity. For example, in Indonesia, with Amman, these grants will go to strengthen the capacity of some of the chapters of some of the members of the organization, the communities that are part of the Amman network. And then in the Mesoamerican, we'll go approximately to 15 projects. And the call for proposal was already launched and finished this month. And they will go, for example, across five to six countries and will go from territorial governance, to conservation, to community entrepreneurship. So we are seeing that this collaboration and these funds and the system that we are building, this network of funds led by Indigenous Peoples and Local Communities. We are actually working together. We are complementing. We are supporting each other to get that scale to bring that funds directly to the ground. Great, Deborah, thank you so much. Could I just also ask the audience, if you have any questions, please use the Q&A box and not the chat box. I see a lot of comments coming in and we just want to make sure that, you know, we could get to your questions. So please use the Q&A box. Deborah, my question, I was going to have a follow up question around, you know, what can be done to make sure that the funds complement each other. But you did actually just now already sort of answer that question on what you are doing to make sure that there's, you know, that there's complementarity. And I just actually wanted to ask, perhaps, to Valeria and Josimara, whether they have any thoughts or anything they want to talk about on this particular aspect as well, to make sure that, you know, all these funds sort of work well together and collaborate and complement each other. Thank you, Deborah. Thank you, Deborah, for this link to be able to talk a little bit about this process ourselves. This construction of the network at global level, we're part, our organizations are part of a broad alliance, of a large scale alliance, which is represented by our organization Deborah mentioned some of them, AMPB in Brazil, APIB, Koyab in Congo, as case he said in the Congo Basin, Hepeleac in Indonesia, Aman, the other partners. So we are here in a big block, mobilizing and building mechanisms. Our processes are the result of debates of our movement, of our organization. So the Podali Fund in Brazil is the result of a discussion of more than 10 years, led by Koyab. Like Josimara, who is next to me, her local fund in the state of Amazonas, the process is the result of a discussion that the Federation of Indigenous Organizations has been having. So we share with you, really, a process of construction of the network from the ground up, the example of the local fund to a regional fund, which is the Podali Fund, and to the macro fund at global level, the AMPB fund. So a concrete example of how we are organizing ourselves and building these alliances. So I want to share with you also, beyond the Indigenous Network, we are talking about the Indigenous Network more broadly globally, but in Brazil we are building and strengthening the network of funds led by social movements, not just Indigenous people, but other relatives of ours. Traditional peoples, quilombolas, peasant communities, so many social movements. Of course, there are many stories to tell. We can continue later. Thank you. I would just like to mention that all that's been said, we can notice that there's a global movement of funds, organizations at global scale with the same objective, which is to save this planet, to save our peoples, to make this world better. As our sister said in the beginning, so there is progress, however slow. Yes, there is progress and we need more and more to strengthen all this network. Great. Thank you very much. Casey and Jenny, the next question I have is for both of you from the donor perspective. Of course, like you said, the good news is that the funds are there now and the money is being dispersed, but Casey, as you yourself mentioned, how they're being spent and targeted still needs to be improved. What do you think needs to be done to change this, to speed this up? Jenny, maybe I can start with you this time. Thank you. I think this is really at the heart of what we're trying to work on as donors with other stakeholders is trying to understand what are the most effective ways of getting that funding dispersed, first of all, more quickly. And then second of all, in a way that we can really build a more effective longer term mechanism. So I think what we're realising, and Casey, I hope you'll also agree, is there's ways we need to be working perhaps with intermediaries and trusted partners to make sure that that can happen at scale more quickly, which means that IPNLC-led organisations can really receive that money, even if not directly, more directly, in a way they can have influence and control over, but building towards actually being able to absorb that directly at scale over those years. I know there's different views on whether what we're talking about as capacity building is really fair, because obviously that's asking IPNLC-led organisations to adapt to donor requirements to some extent, and I think we're also accepting that for some donors, in particularly bilateral donors, there will always be some red lines in terms of reporting and accountability that unfortunately we won't be able to shift, so understanding where those red lines are, but I think what we are looking to do, and I'll speak as a bilateral donor, is trying to dig deeper as to where there are also the yellow lines, where can we shift, where can we adapt as donors, and again that will be a progression, but at least we can actually start to understand that better and see how we can work more effectively, so I think there's also recognition that given we have this collaboration now between philanthropic and bilateral donors, where can we actually collaborate together to understand those opportunities for philanthropic organisations to fund things at different stages to bilateral donors, and there's also work that bilaterals will be funding that perhaps philanthropic organisations may not, so I think we're also realising that as governments we also fund some of the broader systemic reform, we also support work for government capacity building, how can that better complement some of the support directly to IPLCs to be an enabling structure, so I think it's really understanding how we can better have that collaboration, coordination, but also challenge ourselves particularly where donors have those restrictions to actually put in place other mechanisms, even if it may be working through trusted intermediaries and partners to actually make sure that that's as effective as it can be, so I think it's a shorter, more immediate wins, but making sure that's part of a more structured journey towards actually change at a greater scale. Thanks, Jenny. Casey, what are your thoughts? Do you agree with Jenny? Do you have anything that you want to add? Feel free to disagree, Casey. It was a dialogue, you know, as donors we come from different angles, so feel free to disagree, Casey. No, I completely agree with Jenny. I think there's completely a lot of room for private public partnership. At the same time, I think going into COP 28, unfortunately I still think that some donors don't think that by supporting Indigenous Peoples directly, we can achieve climate and biodiversity targets at scale and I respectfully disagree on all fronts on that regard because we've been using the statistic for a long time that Indigenous Peoples are four to five percent of the world's population and they've been protecting 80 percent of the world's biodiversity, so they've already done it at scale. Now it's the time for donors to really comprehend and understand that direct financing will only help to contribute to achieving those targets. Thank you. Thanks, Casey. Valeria and Josemara, can I come back to you again? Because both of you are leading Indigenous funds for the Amazon. What do you think we need to be doing practically to get funds where they are most needed? And also, you know, very briefly, if you could tell us what the next steps are in terms of, you know, the funds that you're leading. Again, Valeria, perhaps I could start with you? I would invest in Josemara. I think that Josemara is going to answer to your question for sorry. No problem. Well, thank you very much, Fin. Thank you, Casey, for your kind words. Let me tell you something. I think that we need to be recognized as a financial-efficient mechanism able to work that has also a technical role to play, but at the same time a political role to play in our territories, right? We need to know that we are working together with our movements. We are in a very specific manner. We worked hand-in-hand with the Indigenous movement together with the people in the field, with our communities, with our people. And this is very important to know, and that's important and vital in our process. Thus, we need to be stronger. As Casey mentioned, I do agree with this idea. All the support must be direct support without intermediaries. All the research and the assessments must be done. How these existing funds are working and how we are evolving together. Therefore, we will be able to get stronger and stronger all along the trust process and the direct dialogue with the funders. Donors must be able to listen to us. They must look for us, not before the intermediaries, right? When before giving funds and giving support, please, count on us first of all. And then the future steps, well, in a nutshell, I think that the moment has arrived to consolidate the existing funds with all the instruments, with the toolbox that we have that are already set in a proper manner in order to reach all the Indigenous territories, as much as possible, the whole Brazil. And these alliances that has been mentioned by Valeria at the beginning must get stronger. All the ecosystem needs to get stronger and stronger. We are Indigenous people. We are working all together at a bigger scale. Thank you. Maybe just a quick note with regards to this final comment. Once again, we must talk about what we need to do on a practical basis for things to happen. Beyond being present and getting introduced to the main stakeholders, to all the representatives, which is important for the Podali fund, and also we must make things easier and we believe in Podali fund, we need to have a better dialogue to introduce ourselves and also to give tips and hints amongst funders and donors in order to better build these trust processes from the funders side for these resources to get on the field and to reach our purposes. And they must believe that they belong to our projects as well. They are involved in these very important processes that we are living all together in all our territories and all the resources that are getting, in reality, they are reaching to our territories maybe in different ways, in different manners. I think that we have different processes to make things happen and to face these challenges. In reality, well, we are always talking about a pivotal issue that we always try to answer. How all the resources will reach to our hands and how we will be respect indigenous people, local and traditional communities such as the Kilumbolas and many others without disturbing and without questioning the rules. As a global principle that we usually, we see such as a limitation to access. Once we have loads of rules and red tape, it's very difficult to reach to the resources, right? Great. Thank you so much for that, both Valeria and Trusumara. Jenny, did you want to sort of just give a brief example as to why sometimes direct funding, bilateral direct funding is, you know, can be a challenge? Thank you. Thank you very much then. I just wanted to illustrate perhaps where it's not even always a matter of trust or gatekeeping. Sometimes it's purely what we would call, you know, efficiency or effectiveness and value for money, which to fund any program for overseas development aid and taxpayer money we have to respect is say we had the sake of argument, 50 million that we could give to IP and LC organizations and support them. If we were to fund every single one of those organizations directly, that would then place reporting administrative requirements, which would mean it would really not be possible. We would never get the approval to have to work directly with every single one of those, let's say 25, 50 organizations we could fund.  It would mean we could not fund, we could only fund a very, very small handful. Whereas let's say we work through an intermediary who could manage that, let's say 50 million fund for us. That would mean we can work with a much larger number of organizations and that intermediary could absorb a lot of the risk, the accountability and the reporting commitments, which would mean that that intermediary could work in a way with those organizations, which really is suits those organizations much better. You would be able to develop those reporting requirements in a way that actually suits you as an organization, whereas if you're reporting to us, the requirements for administration reporting would be so high, it would mean that realistically it would not work on a practical level. So sometimes it's purely a matter of being able to work more effectively and through an intermediary, it would mean that we're able to support IPNLC organizations and the intermediary if it's a trusted partner, which is really able, someone that we can ensure is working with IPNLC organizations very directly. It really just means that it's able to get that funding to IPLCs more directly, but in a way that removes a lot of that burden. So sometimes I would argue it's a very practical way of just meaning we can support IPNLC organizations in a way that otherwise our requirements mean we can't because of the risk, because of the reporting, and purely because the number of staff that we would require, unfortunately, it would just not be practically possible. So I would just also ask people to come back to let's how do we make practical solutions work? It's not always just about the trust side. Great. Thank you for adding that, Jenny. I appreciate that. I could see that we already have quite a lot of questions coming through. So I'm going to go through the final round of questions now. I mean, it's been a really interesting conversation and, you know, I could continue asking so many questions, but let's go to the final round and Deborah, can I start with you again? I'd like all the speakers to actually very briefly, although slowly so that our translators can do their job. Talk about what do you think we need to achieve at COP28 based on the discussion that we have just had? Deborah? Yes. Thank you. I do want to have a few reaction also to the Jenny's in cases comment. We know that this is being this red flags for the bilateral cooperation. And I think that's what why indigenous people so the community as unresponding with funds, right? So we're creating these bigger structure infrastructure funds that would also make the enabling conditions that we can reach more people and we can do it at scale. So I think the thing about intermediary is the issue where indigenous peoples and local communities are actually the decision makers of the processes. So we need to really think that in a very fine way so the effective participation is the most important part of every system that we can put. So we can actually say that we are doing this direct funding to indigenous peoples, even if through several mechanisms, right? So for us, as Clarify, we've been demonstrated progress. So we have 52 active projects. We have 23 in the pipeline. We're supporting a lot of things from advocacy, tenure security, conservation, organizational capacity, but it's not enough. And you see a lot of the questions in the chat is about how we do get grants, how my organization can access to fund to the ground. So is there is still a lot of demands that funding gap is huge as is case mentioned at the very beginning. So I think that we've been demonstrating the reiterate commitment to the goals of the pledges have demonstrated that there is a common understanding and that we are going to move forward. But now we need to ensure that indigenous peoples, local community and after the senate are heard, understood and respect, and that we are actually in the center of the decision making process for all the initiatives that are coming. Thank you, Deborah. Casey, can I go to you next and then we'll go to Jenny and then just Valeria and just I think you had a bit of a connection issue just now. We're just asking the final round of questions before we go to Q&A asking what do we need to achieve at COP 28. Casey. Yeah, I think there's three things that we need to achieve a COP 28. One has been said loud and clear on this call that we need to let indigenous peoples and local communities define what direct financing means for them, whether it be through an intermediary or not. I do understand the case of governments it's much more complex and I think Jenny is a shining example of someone who's really trying to think differently when it comes to funding indigenous peoples and local communities. The second thing is we need to make sure that the just and just transition is just and that it respects the rights of indigenous peoples and local communities. I think we're seeing the force eviction of indigenous peoples in particular places and the name of achieving the world's most pressing climate goals and I don't think the eviction of peoples means to happen in order to do that. And then I think finally indigenous peoples needed to be included very deeply and meaningfully in the loss and damage discussion. Great, thank you. And thanks for mentioning the loss and damage as well. It's a tricky issue, isn't it? Everybody seems interested in it but then nobody seems to be really sure of what the parameters are. Jenny. I think it is critical to maintain the visibility and to maintain that dialogue and I think we will certainly already be having that at COP. I'd also like to flag that the next donor annual report will be published at COP. If you haven't read the last one, please do look online. Landport will actually host our web page. So please do take a look and at COP you will see the latest figures but also the latest narrative from donors on what we've been doing. And of course I would encourage everybody to challenge, to critique us, but also to do that with the practical constructive ideas of where you would like to see that moving forward now that we're halfway through the pledge. So yes, I think the critical things are visibility, ongoing constructive challenge and using that platform and those opportunities. Great. Josemara and Valeria, your thoughts on what to achieve at COP 28 before we open up for Q&A? I'm sorry because we are having issues, connectivity issues. Well, you know that we must share with you everything that is happening in the Brazilian Amazonia and how to get access to technology. You know that we have our limitations and we are experiencing these limitations here alive. This is a part of the process of these improvements that we need as well. Well, it is a shame that we couldn't follow all your dialogues and opinions for a while, but let's see what do we need, what we must reach through this discussion and debate during COP 28. Well, I think that the messages that you all shared are very important with this regard and what will be the future steps. I believe that we must place ourselves. We need to introduce and to showcase ourselves. We need to be always constantly working for the future processes. We are on a constant basis, opening spaces, occupying these spaces at different levels and stages. I think that this belongs to these processes that we are building as well. But on the other hand, let me tell you that it's vital and very important and I'd like to invite you all, if you will be during COP 28 and also if you come to visit us in Brazilian Amazonia, I want you to know our experiences, to visit the initiatives that are getting the support and we are contributing for you to better understand our reality in our Amazonia rainforest and for you to be aware about all the processes, to better know our people, to better know our initiatives that have been amazing and everything has been possible thanks to all your support as well. And also to carry on believing in the process, giving the support that we really need to get stronger through all the mechanisms. This is the final and closing remarks that I wanted to share with you. Thank you so much. Well, in order to complete a little bit Valeria's words, I think that Indiana or wishes for COP 28 would be that the promises, funding promises not to be just on paper, black and white. We need to reach a commitment all together with indigenous people to create a realistic partnership, to have a holistic perspective to better understand how we function, so how we work together and not to only have a top bottom perspective, but also to have a bottom up perspective. We want to invite you to know our reality, to know our results and also the impacts that the funds are making possible and we can implement in our territories. It's vital, it's very important the process to acknowledge and to go deeper through dialogue, through listening processes. And we want you to see from our eyes how we are getting a better impact in our territories. This is what we wish for this future COP 28. Right. Not just words that go with the wind. No, we want practical and realistic things on the field. Thanks to the support of donors. Thank you. Thank you so much. Now we're going to move on to the Q&A. We have about 10, 13 minutes. Take on a few of the questions already there. Again, if you have any questions, please use the Q&A box. And of course, if possible, please identify yourself in the organization that you belong to. Now the first question, I think, excuse me, Deborah, I think you might be the best person to answer, but very open for others to come in as well. The first question actually is asking, is there a global database that can show what type of funds that exist to date at various levels for the indigenous peoples and local community organizations? Deborah, would you have any idea? Thank you, Tina. I know there is a lot of partners doing the mapping on the funds, but I don't know if there is a database actually. Thanks, Deborah. Casey, would you have any idea or other speakers? Also, any idea if such a database exists? No, a database doesn't exist, but there are. The Shandia platform is an umbrella in which all indigenous-led funds are supposed to advocate for direct financing as well as international funders for indigenous peoples is also creating its own coalition of funds globally, which I know Pudali is a part of. Okay. And maybe, Casey, since you're here, you could also pick up the next question, which actually relates to private philanthropic donors, is asking how can private philanthropic donors access these global regional and national indigenous-led funds? I'm assuming it is to support them. Yeah. How does the Christensen fund do? And what advice do you have for other philanthropic donors? And Jenny, if you have any advice as well, please feel free to come in. Yeah. So the Christensen fund puts all of our international grantees, including indigenous-led funds, through a process called equivalency determination, which essentially makes them a U.S. charity for a number of years. And Pudali's gone through this process. And the beautiful thing about that process, while it's complicated, then all other private donors, philanthropic donors can access those organizations and those funds as if they were a U.S.-based charity. So that's the case of the Christensen fund. Great. Thank you. Anyone wants to add anything? Or shall we move on to the next question? Okay. The next question is, which organizations are best able to help indigenous peoples with mentoring and assisting in organizational development, financial management, monitoring and reporting, project development, proposal development, and the development of advocacy and lobbying programs? So essentially, you know, which organizations are able to help indigenous peoples with essentially a lot of, I guess, capacity building on running these programs. Debra, Jenny, any thoughts? Maybe I will say that it will depend on each case. For example, as Clarify, we are actually supporting the network, the collaborations, organizations with all these processes. But at the same time, we are also trying to make this exchange where people from the ground can tell donors what are some of the things that are hard for them to comply with and how we can actually change some of these aspects. For example, we've been working in Southeast Africa with the pastoralist communities, and we have, for example, not required on everything report, but we are going to do a gathering. So we have an annual gathering where all the organizations came and they can say what they're learning from the process, what were the constraints and how we can move forward. For example, if we have this exchange, then we can create some flexibility because I think I have to be a balance between creating capacity and the organization but reacting to what is needed with the urgent matter right now and moving funds for that actions on the ground. Great. Thanks so much, Deborah. I'm just wondering if Josemara and Valeria have, you know, have any practical examples as well in terms of organizations that can help. Yeah, indigenous populations with these issues and skills. I'd like to comment very briefly about this issue. Something that we got after reflecting on our daily procedures, we were able to empower ourselves to be more flexible and to know how better exchange different perspectives. We are together with Josemara and she's working to detect more community funds and we do it through sharing experiences. And from then on, we are able to build our own processes through these ideas and exchanges because at the end of the day, we're experiencing on the basis, on an ongoing basis. And also we respect our processes, but also we respect amongst everything our vision as indigenous people. Therefore, it's very difficult that suddenly and a specific organization or institution that we recommend that with the exception if they are our partners that they know us for a while. It's very important to say that our partners must know you very well and how these partners will contribute in a way that will always respect your rights, your self determination processes. This is in the end a vital issue to us. This exchange with these different stakeholders has been very realistic to better adapt our processes and to get adapted to these exchanges and the donors must know very well our realities and this will always help us to consolidate the funds in our territories in Brazil and the Amazon region. Thank you. Well, you know what? I think that it is important to be aware about, to what extent we can work together when we build together something else when we are working on this ongoing basis to get new processes. We are always participating in technical opinions. Therefore, these partnerships, they need to get adapted in this more autonomous way of acting of indigenous people. On the other hand, it's also very important that donors to be aware about it and to investigate about the way we proceed. Our partners, the big NGOs and all the intermediaries are not the single glance that they get the funds today. We can play a much more vital role than the one that we played in the past. Great. Thank you. We're going to have to close in about six minutes. So we'll take one more question. This one has actually two parts. So I'm going to ask all of our speakers to come in at some point. The first part is actually Valeria and Josimara. It's directed towards you. And the first part is what capacity do you have that enable you to access and manage funds directly from the donors. And then the second part is, for those who do not have that kind of capacity that Valeria and Josimara have, is it not necessary to support them first through so-called intermediaries, I guess, to build the capacity, and then eventually enable them to move away from these intermediaries so that they can get direct funding. So for that second part, it would be great to hear, you know, brief thoughts from Deborah, Jenny and Casey. But first Valeria and Josimara, what capacity do you have that allows you to access and manage funds directly? Oh my God. What a challenge to give you a quick answer. Okay, let's try it. You know, we try to organize ourselves and we get a different structure to have these kind of activities. Podali with the action that is implemented in Brazilian Amazon basin. In the end, Podali is a great tool that was created by indigenous people, but also by indigenous stakeholders. Today, we do have our own instruments and our organizations are able to assess ourselves in order to pace the way forward, to show the way forward, to better manage resources that were given by. This is already happening in Podali, in Mato Grosso region, was able to work with the Shabanti people, was able to capture some resources and choose Podali to be the mechanism. In such a way, Podali offers the resources straightforward to the Shabanti people, and this is a way. It's a very specific way. These are very concrete things. We want to become this qualified instrument and mechanisms at the service of our people and organizations. This could be the answer, the experience that we had with Podali. Thank you. Yes, as for another experience that we had in the indigenous fund in Rio Negro basin, we have a very strong indigenous movement, which is the family, which is the federation of indigenous associations that belong to Coyabi as well in Brazil. And our organizations are strengthening these capabilities. We are still consolidating our organizations and our organization and stakeholders offer new opportunities, opening new spaces for people to be more straightforward when working with the funds in order to develop all the initiatives in our territories. Thus, organizations are the main pillar. Great. Thank you so much for taking that on, despite, like I said, a really difficult challenge of asking you to be brief in your answers. Deborah, do you want to take on the second part of the question? Thank you. I will say that there is a natural allies and partners to the indigenous peoples local community and Afro-descendant in the ground. So maybe we can go and work directly with the people and then they can decide who is the natural ally or who is the person or the organization that they want to be the mentor and work with them to make their capacity. This is one important thing. And I think the other important thing is to really understand that the funds, the most of the funds goes directly to the communities, right? So, and they decide on how they want to actually spend these funds on the ground because sometimes for the capacity building side is a very limited funding. And then, for example, in our case, we are the ones taking, for example, the responsibility of writing the reports and giving that. We don't pass that to some of our partners and some of our brothers and sisters in the ground. So I think looking at these processes where, for example, from me to my partners, we can have a more flexible way of sharing knowledge and reporting and all that. But that actually, as a fund gets the responsibility to write the report and do the other things that can be also a model that can be used. But I think the most important part is letting the people in the ground to make the decisions on how and which person or an organization they want to work with. Thank you, Jenny. And then maybe, in case you will perhaps close with you, any reflections or just to touch on the final at the second half of that question. Thank you. I really echo a lot of Deborah's points just now. I think the most some of the most exciting emerging models, such as the tenure facility of those where IP and LC led organizations can make their own proposals and make their own choices about how they would like to see the money spent and how they can be supported. But where there is still technical support available from organizations to help manage that and in a way that the IP and LC led organizations would like to have rather than that be imposed on them. And I think that really works from the points I made earlier from a bilateral organization as well to mean that they are easily able to be funded because we're able to channel that funding through an organization such as tenure facility. So it's a model such as that that I think we to scale up where it really works for the donors in terms of the reporting the administration absorbing the risks, but it can also really work from the other side also in terms of that really proactive and really empowering model where it's the IP and LC led organizations who get to design how they would like to see the funds spent and they are the ones who are doing the implementation with technical support. So that's the kind of model I would really like to see scaled up. Great. Thank you, Casey. Final thoughts. No, I completely agree with Deborah and Jenny's points. I think it's about indigenous people's right to self determination. Each case is different. Let the communities decide who they want to work with and define direct finance. If the case is to work with clarifier tenure facility and they think that's direct financing. That's absolutely the decision and a great model and in other cases, going directly to communities or funds like Pudali is also a great example. Great. Thank you. Unfortunately, we have ran out of time, so we will have to close this webinar. I would really like to thank the audience for staying with us and do apologize that we're not able to take all the questions. And of course, I would like to thank all of our speakers, particularly, you know, Josimara and Valeria who have joined us despite connectivity issues. We really appreciate you being able to stay for the whole hour as well. Can we give that all of our speakers a virtual round of applause, please. Thank you so much for your insights. And of course, thank you to the audience as well for your participation. Now, if you're interested in taking a deeper dive into indigenous financing and issues at COP 28, the tenure facility will be there and they are sharing a link where you can register for a couple of the hybrid events that they are organizing. Of course, thanks also to our hosts at the Fort Foundation, the Land Portal Foundation, the tenure facility, and the Thompson Royce Foundation. It's been a real pleasure for me to moderate this event. And all the best with COP 28. And I hope that, you know, all of what you hope for will come true and that we can, you know, next year at this time when we have this conversation. It will be even more optimistic and positive than it has been. Thank you so much. Have a great day, afternoon, evening or night. And goodbye.


I'm going to start by saying that I'm skeptical just based on the ingredients I'm skeptical like about how amazing it's going to be for my hair but I fell for the hype I fell for the sale I got it so we'll be trying it out right now. So I'm going to start with the Balmint Moisturizing Shampoo I really need a shampoo and I really hope it's moisturizing so let's see let's just get right into it today let's see what we got. Smells amazing even though I haven't put it on yet I have to say that another midnight wash too actually is probably one of love right now okay no the seal's off now ooh it's actually kind of hard to get out which is good actually maybe I'll be able to spread it better because it's actually kind of thick it's like a cream it's like oh crap that's to be no it is a shampoo for a second I was like is that a lemon because it's like so fake but no it is a shampoo so like the thickest shampoo here but so basically alright but okay be going with it it has the consistency it's like a little bit maybe that's custom because it's not exactly like a it's definitely thick and I'm even leaving it's like a light cream wow okay actually there is a bicep working okay as I was saying like I smell the lemon but I don't really feel it on my scalp which isn't good at all but my shampoos don't have to be an empty I guess it could be an extra plus sometimes it's kind of thick like I want to spread it some more I don't want to put more just kind of want it to get a bump for the back. The back of this spreads easily because it kind of does but like it was still like I needed some on the back and it was a bit of a struggle to get some but I needed it I'm like squeezing off some and then replacing it somewhere else wasn't ready y'all I guess actually I watched some of the reviews like oh I had watched the reviews somehow even though I've seen a lot of reviews I wasn't expecting a fake cream like that at all. I don't even think I need to say anything look at my hair this is kind of wow crazy so it almost looks like I used a clear wash but I didn't. I think maybe the hijack for that little set looks in there so it's like a shampoo gel so I do have some clumping and stuff like kind of like wow okay but yeah I mean most importantly my scalp and my hair feel clean smell clean soft moisturized so yeah I love it I think this is gonna this is up to the top of the list in terms of one of my favorite shampoos. It's still a little weird so I'm still trying to get my mind around it but it's probably one of my second favorite shampoos not my favorite my favorite right now is the anasi wow I'm like what in the world why do I want the shampoo puff my curls just felt like a serious clumps on my hair like my silky section is like okay be popping but anyways yeah I mean my hair feels really clean and moisturized smells amazing and I have like clear definition so I'm just like okay wow very interesting and I love the shampoo two thumbs up wow I'm a believer be reborn I'm skeptical about the deep conditioner still so let's keep going see if that's gonna want me as well gel shampoo okay girl okay move it off so next we have the Balmain deep conditioning treatment and I'm glad it's kind of keeping it in the same theme because I love the scent and everything of this I'm expecting of the shampoo so I'm expecting that just gonna keep the happiness going in terms of scent at least right away I like the texture like it's a nice kind of with looking in there let's get to application very very thick very thick so it's not like hard it's like thick but still kind of light so it's very interesting so let's keep that supply I can understand why people are so like crazy about this not because it's so different because I even this is kind of different but it's definitely feeling more on the buttery side like how much is it gonna penetrate I'm concerned but let's keep going it's softening though it being so thick I'm just wondering about penetration and my shift for my low porosity I mean it's kind of like a natural slip it's not like the extra like slip rail type of slip it's a cream with okay yes a cream with okay slip but a slip isn't gonna be a thing for sure like if you don't have tangles it'll be fine if you have a tango it won't be impossible but it'll just be a little difficult this is how much of the deconitioner I used it's hard to tell in this kind of rounded job but I definitely used at least half of it probably more like two-thirds of it so which is necessarily bad for the size because it's just eight ounces so I guess this is about how much I would use but since it was just thick and stuff I don't know I guess I didn't know but you know okay I'm worried it's not like gonna penetrate but we'll see because you know it feels like something may happen I'm gonna sit for half an hour and then come back but it's not like an instant penetrator that's for sure if you have like low porosity here but it doesn't feel bad either so maybe it's like almost there so let me let it sit and come back up to you guys if some backups letting it sit then work we'll both find out feels good like I said I minted on my scalp deconitioners tingling and my hair feel soft yeah definitely feel soft and moisturized but it didn't fit okay definitely feel soft and moisturized so shampoo is a win and the conditioner is a win so so far so good yeah the only thing I would say about deconitioner you know I would say this it could add a bit more slip that's like my favorite line for the most part except for the few things that have crazy slip but I'm not actually doing a wash and go I think I think I'm gonna try to do a twist out which just means me struggling on camera because I don't think I'd ever get any better at these things but you know I'm just trying to mix it up and to be honest I prefer to just pretty much live in a bridal for quarantine or live in braids for quarantine but I'm just gonna mix it up and do a twist because I'm not twisting a wire and I'm curious and you're curious hopefully to see what twists look like in my hair now now my curls are still high pop and I wear definition things since ever since the shampoo I'm not wearing the battery wedding a good way but I feel like more of that amazing feeling was on the product and after in saying it then go down like at least a point all the time so if I was gonna give it a eight and a half before it might be a seven and a half now so it kind of went on from yes it's one of my top shelf deep conditioners to it was nice but yeah I still do like it though but it just doesn't feel as good after rinsing let me let me apply the lever and get to the rest of it I don't usually rinse usually I mean I usually rinse in sections and then apply even so I don't usually rinse it all but the few times I have rinsed it all I don't remember it necessarily feeling still you know a little bit rough against like I don't necessarily remember it feeling like this so I feel like some of the wow of that deep conditioner and stuff with it then we have the leaving styler and you see what it's like that's gonna apply a bit everywhere and then kind of section it's so thick I'm like not even getting it out I know I took out to see you so again it's pretty thick maybe it should be in a jar like it's super thick I see everything I have with the shampoo where like it's so creamy you expect that a little it's gonna go longer than it does but then you're like but it's just a little so don't be hard on it you know struggle is really getting this out I'm gonna take this off yeah this probably needs to be like in a jar or something if it's gonna be this thick because I'm about to struggle life so she took it out to get it out took out a cap to get it out I'm like trying to find it's gonna fall because of the button it's kind of slippery and then it's hard to get it out and it's just a lot going on we're very much crying if the whole bottom fell while it was uncapped I don't usually have to take a cap out like that but we think it's leaving I have used safe to say so it's actually isn't giving me as much of a minty scent as the other things almost has a nice kind of sweet fruity not she said not she said it's sweet fruity but kind of cakey try to think of which memory it's given me I'm gonna look it in kind of like a leaving only wash and go I guess but then I'm gonna section it and start patting so my hair does actually feel soft again again with the product on so if I was rinsing in sections I probably would have just been like yeah this is awesome minus the fact that my hands almost hit me now I was actually said I lost all my grip strength since not being in a gym so if you're looking for grip strength this is a good leave-in to use just have your pull-ups right and tight I'm definitely worried that this isn't super low for us to be friendly it's more on my head than in I guess not in a bad not in a bad way like it's not the worst my head definitely feels moisturized but it also is kind of on my hair this is for people who like thick buttery products more I would say but it's working it's not like it's not gonna work for me but it won't be my dream like it'll be somebody with higher porosity stream can't even say it's a cream because it doesn't have much hold or anything either it's just I guess a thick here milk a hair cheese yeah butter yeah I don't know because it's not like a butter texture either it's definitely still a leave-in it's just a really thick leave-in I don't know how to classify this and how I would be use it again that's what I'm trying to think of like how would I use it again but it's too thick to really want to put a gel or something over it I'll put like the that styling cream over it because I'm gonna twist if I was doing a wash I wouldn't want to put something over this because it's so thick already so the definition actually isn't bad I don't know that even added definition like the shampoo and the deep conditioner both added definition the definition definitely isn't bad from the leave-in it's just the leave-in it's kind of thick so I guess if you could find a way to like ideally I would just put water in it or like find a way to fill it out but with it being so thick it's hard to really imagine putting a gel on top of it's like because you know how I feel about like double and triple things like I just don't like to feel like a lot of stuff is going on like this leaving is so thick it's hard to me to imagine putting a gel on this since it doing a wash you know I'd have to try to go really light on the leave-in and then I don't know how moisturizing it'll be since it's not penetrating so it's like a whole lot of stuff going on one of the math here but yeah my hair does look good feels moisturized feels slightly coated good slip and the product is kind of heavy my curls are looking good really it's the curvy firing cream this option has honey it has beeswax which I'm not a fan of this is like a real old school formulation with the beeswax so maybe shampoo in the south this is probably the lightest product so far very light it doesn't feel like it's gonna like clump my curls or anything like that so I'm too sure what it's about really in terms of what is it adding to the process I guess it's just more of a sealant than the usual kind of curvy firing cream that usually has like moisturizing buttery stuff and some whole stuff and that's not much whole stuff or defining stuff it just it's kind of like a sealant like the wax so my hair doesn't feel more defined or anything it just feels more sealed maybe that's about all I can say for that cream the curvy firing cream that doesn't define so this is it with the leave-in and curvy firing cream it's gonna do some few quick twists actually actually considering not not brushing it just doing it like this I mean I mean I try to be professional at least use a comb you know I'm not even looking so who knows what that part's gonna come out like but it might be a bit better than using my fingers like years I prefer to write out it's just easier to do simple to do less less like more food proof in other ways but wanted to do some difference I like how the curvy firing cream is a light consistency that's what I like about it maybe has slip and stuff too let's just call out one okay so this is the first three and I guess don't feel like the cream necessarily adds much to the situation I'll be honest besides wax that I'll have to shampoo out but let me add some creams to you guys can see so I'm gonna add some of this here curvy firing cream which I said is the lightest product to light it on the shampoo and everything so I would say the curvy cream I'd slip that's not really kind of whole feeling but I do feel like my twisting I want to say tentatively I feel like my twisting is getting better I know right I'm just saying that but I don't like I feel like my technique you know me I will probably like what you guys talking about the trickiest but that's how I'm feeling like it's getting better well this is it like several hours later I actually thought I did a good job in terms of the roots I'm doing it tight until it's in the mirror but I just want to like trash the whole room but nothing about the pin can fix I suppose but this is why I grade us because it's a lot easier to get it tight or just you know a good amount of tightness not loose at the roots but anyways we're rolling with it and the bottom looks good even though the roots are kind of slack so that's it I'll see you in a couple days I guess to show you the takedown hi everyone I'm back so they're all dry I'm sorry turn around so I'm not gonna really talk to you guys with me taking them down because I really don't think I've gotten any better at that but I'm just gonna take them down and then get to the review and I'm gonna use this oil to take down so at least we can see what this is about I really love the scent of this collection like if I have to say what's my favorite thing about this collection is the scent I love this mint scent and I've a new I love mint all through a collection until she gave me mint all through a collection so let's want to say that it's hard to really review is like it's not it's not very discuss and I can feel my my the parts of my fingertips through it I guess what I mean like it's not very thick you know but it smells great and seems to have nice slip on everything so yeah let's get to it like I said I don't even care right now okay let me try a little bit better so I don't know can you see so that's one and I really well mostly come back and show you guys the rest at the end I'm really trying to determine like my hair doesn't feel dry but it doesn't feel super moisturized either so I was trying to see like okay like how dry how moisturized is this I don't know it feels right down the middle how's it look that's a look sorry so I knew from the time I did these I was gonna have to like use a bobby pin cuz like dudes I thought I was doing it was so tight and then when I finished it was like nope if anybody was following me and hopes that I would get good at twisters and great hours I guess I guess I guess I guess I think I'm forever hopeless I get moisturized I don't want to say it's not moisturized it's just not super duper it's definitely not feeling like soft and you know and all that it's a little bit teeny meeny bit not super moisturized this is the initial take down looking a little over the place I'm gonna say it's holding a little better than Wizcase so that's something because when I saw like pretty much no whole ingredients I really was just bracing myself for potential frizz ball at the end of this this kind of gives me some hold I'm wearing not feeling amazing or anything like that so I think I would just say maybe get the shampoo maybe get a deep conditioner I don't know and the others just get it if you want to try it I guess maybe I still want to try the gel I don't know even like this it's not horrible I mean you know I'm sure I could even fluff in one even I could get a little but I think it all right right so I can just get on with the review cuz I'm not going anywhere anyways let me give you a little bit of the inside okay so this is it but usually I'm taking down I'm usually like ooh my hair feels so soft ooh it feels so juicy ooh definition and this time I could I wasn't saying any or not I was just like get this out because it wasn't super moisturized definition was okay but like not that great it was okay like I mean my hair is kind of cute which is good considering it was me that took it down and I want to say twist outs are easier to volumize so that's something good for twist out cuz like a breakout I feel I would have been struggling to get some more volume so yeah kind of effortless volume is one good thing about twist outs I don't even mind the kill button that much even though I prefer the breakout kill button but I knew in our struggle about that twist out yay yay this is my twist out this is my result and it's okay but you know should I keep trying anyway anyway okay let's get to the review so basically everything I said while I was applying still stands I don't really have to do much kind of post review anymore since I've been reviewing kind of live in the shower but let's just go over everything again I sat up with the moisturizing shampoo and I was just super amazed it was moisturizing it was cleansing love the mint my hair was like laid for some reason like just kind of clumped and flattened define I'm like okay what's going on but most of what I'm leaving my hair was cleansed and moisturized I even had a little bit of I could put my hands true after rinsing so a plus I love the shampoo think it's gonna be my second favorite but it can be my favorite too and it's just like up there in the top two with the Nasi shampoo the reason I'm not sure how to feel about it because I'm not sure how to feel about the clumping I have to figure out like what so I know it has hydroxylethyl cellulose in here so I just want to figure out and sit in process what is making my hair so laid with the shampoo because that's kind of weird to me but it's where it's supposed to be good right it's supposed to be a good thing so maybe this is a good wash and go shampoo I don't know but it smells great cleans great foam great nice lip moisturizing everything this was my favorite definitely from the collection that I tried I don't think I love the gel the deconditioning treatment so this I did enjoy it was definitely a sitter because it was super thick after let us sit my hair did feel moisturized and everything I felt like when I rinsed it my hair kind of lost some of that great feeling so it's kind of like a little bit but then I don't usually rinse my conditioner anyway so I don't want to knock it for that because maybe they all do that the few times I have rinsed the conditioners do I haven't noticed that much of a loss of goodness so I don't know but my hair did feel moisturized and I feel like if you go directly from this section my section to a great leaving that's gonna have a dreamy experience it's really hard to show you the ingredients because it's really teeny-me-me but I'll try so then we went into the leaving grip treatment so if you okay if you like you would then you need to get your strength up don't even bother to buy those fancy things just squeeze this bottle because yeah the leaving is super duper thick eventually I just took this off and even after I took off this cap I still had to struggle to get it out I don't even think I have to be scared it's so hard to get I don't even think I have to be scared right now I can just keep going because this I even move inside here yet so so super thick leaving there was super thick and super heavy so by the time I put it on I really didn't want to put anything else over it just because of how thick it was and how much was on my hair and then also because of how thick it was I was worried it wouldn't be penetrating so even though it has moisturizer going on I was worried that the moisture wouldn't really get in there so you know products can be softening which is like make the outside of your cuticle feel nice but not necessarily moisturizing I was worried this would be one of those which I don't want to say it was because my hair isn't super dry but again it's dry this is two days later and I can feel it is dry so that's a bit of a problem so I wouldn't repurchase to leave it I don't even know how I'm gonna use it out to be honest because it's so thick I don't know what to tell you maybe try as a conditioner like a rinse out conditioner like that's the only thing I can really think of doing with this the only thing I can do is either add water or use it as a rinse out but I think like the slip was okay and everything and for a deep conditioner slip was okay and everything I didn't feel like if it really clumped back curls or anything like that I didn't feel like if it added any wool either so I'm not sure what it's for if it's not for their definition or why is it a styling cream and that's the part I'm kind of lost about I would say this almost felt like it should be the leave-in but it has shape but then these rocks really high up so I wouldn't use this as a leave-in either yeah so I guess I would use a super moisturizing leave-in and then try to use just a little bit of both of these I guess to finish them off or give them to somebody with higher porosity here that's probably the best answer it's hard to review oils it's slippery smells nice and kind of did the job for the takedown I don't have a whole lot of frizz especially like given like how little whole the cream had I was why that I could go really south in terms of frizz but it would help to get it pretty nice if I do this for myself and I do so yeah so nothing bad to say about the oil usually I love when you can throw in a little humectant in the oil it's kind of like a miracle to me I threw in some aloe throwing something but this is just straight oils which you know isn't bad isn't you know but it's not as moisturizing as if you could get some humectants into it so I was super excited to try this line I was so excited I saw everybody reviewing it of course I'm always super late because I gotta it's a whole process I see anybody reviewing it but like I haven't gotten to that yet in my mind really and it just takes me another few months and people are like I do a lot and they're reviewing something else like rice water me and I think everybody's reviewing right now always behind but I wanted to try this because everybody was raving about it and I was like you know what it can't I don't know I have to find the truth like I have to know if this is really as good as people say or not like when I was watching reviews so that's all I was thinking I have to try this for myself and let and figure out and let you guys know if it's really that good or if it's overhyped and my final conclusion on that is that they will not lie to you this line is amazing if you have high opacity here it will totally rock your will because as long as you can get this stuff to penetrate it will be amazing the only problem with this is like the wax the shit butter and stuff is not your friend if your low porosity like me so and I was looking at the ingredients I was like they ain't gonna work for me like the not the shampoo but the moisturizing stuff I was like they ain't gonna work for me but you know hype and sale and everything I tried it plus I just wanted to know you know couldn't be the really that great that everybody's saying and I missed out but the model of the story sustainably and you know it was pure here based on ingredients and just stick to that because if you don't stick to that you'll be like me womp womp and you know I just have to hope this video isn't boring because I'm feeling so uninspired like even when I was putting in like doing the twist I was feeling kind of excited but like today and yesterday all the excitement went I think the excitement died from the minute I realized I didn't do my wrist tight but the excitement really died when I woke up next day and my twists weren't looking juicy and amazing they were looking kind of dry I'm like what's going on here so you know womp womp yeah but I mean I don't want to knock the brand because like I said if I was higher porosity I'd be just like no so the problem isn't the products it's my hair basically it's not you it's me so yeah that's my final review on it I do believe the reviewers will honest but wanting a little porosity probably just get the shampoo I have to look at the gel ingredients and I'll let you guys know in the cup in the description box if I recommend that but if you those of you who follow me and like it low low porosity approved then hmm yeah I think just skip this one that's my that's my recommendation of course if you're curious and you want to try try it love I love the labeling I love the scent and I did have a happy wash day but two days later my hair is like so alright so I guess I'll leave it at that thank you guys for watching I do like my twist out yay and I'm doing a twist out because I haven't done one in forever so let's get in there and you know remember this yeah thanks for watching guys and I'll see you in the next one bye


Hey guys, before we start the review I'm admittedly very embarrassed but I don't know where the video component for this review went. I've checked all of my memory cards, I've checked all of my elements, I can't find it anywhere. Wish I noticed this when I did all these reviews back in February but I hope you guys are okay with just hearing my voice, I'll have photos and everything up but at least to say I did look, I don't know where it went but I do apologize. When the levee breaks and everything comes crashing down, this is a matchup. Ooh, that's a hot mug guys! Hey guys, this is my review for when the levee breaks. This is the pre-season finale for season 4 of Supernatural, episode 21 and this episode is still damn good. Not only is attention between Bobby Sam and Dean at an all-time high, the further conflict that happens between the two is incredibly well done. There's a lot of real good blocking, there's a lot of good camera angles, a lot of effort from Robert Singer which would bleed away in later seasons. Also all of the self-reflection slash hallucination slash self-torture that Sam goes through while in the safe room is really freaking good. It starts with physical torture or at least he's emulating it with Alastair torturing him. And it slowly starts to change into emotional torture with the younger version of himself. Great little kid actor as always, pointing out all of the flaws and all of the mistakes and all of the damage that Sam has done to himself. There's the sympathetic torture in terms of his mother being embodied in his own mind, kind of adding another layer of guilt and self-hate to himself and then it all accumulates together with a vision of Dean interrogating slash arguing with him. And all of this is so good, every single scene in that safe room is male-biting and so deep into Sam's character and to his relationship with not only his brother with Bobby but himself and as well again laying down little tidbits that would eventually become big, big business in the next season as well as the ending of this season. There's also Dean getting another argument slash conversation with Castiel where Castiel again doesn't really mention what a mostly wasn't supposed to be Dean of Wavre Park. But then this is also when Dean signs up for the angel army, gives himself over to the angel so to speak. But at the same time Castiel is ordered to let Sam out of the safe room and he's also used as a means of capturing Anna. And after Sam gets out and has that really emotional moment with Bobby, that part is a little nugget, it's so good. You see all of the pain and the anguish in Bobby's face and Sam's as well because neither of them want to do anything to each other.  You see there in the background a little bit that the angels are actually just letting it happen, that the facade is over. But obviously we'll find that out in the next episode. And then when Sam and Dean meet in the hotel room and they have that conversation, that argument that starts with them trying to reason with each other and then eventually they have this really good fight scene. But it's so poetic that it ends with Dean saying, if you walk out that door, don't you ever come back? That's what their father said to Sam when he went off to Stanford. In that mirror reflection of the catalysts of the Winchester family in this episode, just an amalgamates together. The only little thing that I get a little bit at is Bobby going out to speak to Sam by himself rather than saying, hey, Dean, wake up, your brother's trying to escape. I think it's because Bobby can see what's happening with Dean and that he doesn't entirely agree with what's happening. He himself can fix and help Sam on his own. So that's my excuse for that part. Otherwise though, when the Levy Breaks is a fantastic preseason finale, it is such a great setup for what is about to come. And it's nuts. To give you guys a perspective, I've been watching all of these episodes to build up for myself because I'm going to be going back to work soon. I haven't watched Supernatural this fast since I did the first five seasons on my radio show, Eons Back, which I will have to talk about one day. Either way, when the Levy Breaks gets a 7 out of 7 for me, I enjoy this episode immensely and it has some of the best moments in the show's history in terms of the brothers being adversaries to each other. Obviously, this would be reflected back in season 5, right up until its finale.  Give Sarah Gamble a fantastic credit that is deserved because she does a fantastic job with writing this episode. And then Robert Singer does a good job of directing it too. I'm not going to have a short list in here either because he did a good job. So now I ask you guys for your comments about this episode, so let's read those off now. Alright, so starting off here, when the Levy Breaks is one of my top five favorite episodes of Supernatural, it's not the deepest or the most nuanced dive into the subject matter of drug addiction, of course, but it did a pretty good job of what the show was. The lengths of which Sam was willing to go through to get the demon blood, the hallucinations, the desperation and the agony, knocking Bobby out, I'm honestly a little surprised that they went so dark for the episode. They never do something like that with the shows in later years. When Mary shows up and justifies Sam's actions to himself, it hits closer to home than most might expect. As an addict, you grasp for anything to make yourself feel better about yourself, usually contrasting yourself to other people, verse off or seeking validation from something important to you, no matter how small or insincere it may be. Hurting people close to you, begging when faced with the panic of realizing you're boxed into a corner and about to withdraw, the confrontation between the brothers was the icing on the cake after it all. Actually, you do a pretty good means of describing it, that's dead on. I love that Supernatural wrote a serious story about addiction and self-destruction, yet filed it, veiled it within the context of angels versus demons and the apocalypse to get all the teenagers who love the show to watch and digest it. Somewhat akin to that of what Todd Phillips did with Joker, I'd like to think that at least a few kids decided against trying the line of Coke or Oxy after watching this. Now, actually, I think funny enough, talking about Todd Phillips and the Joker, that movie, honestly, if you're actually looking for the production of that film, is a complete nothing mirror. He is on such a goddamn high horse, he did not have that vision, like the movie was put together like complete shambles, but I get where you're coming from, and yes, the fact that it has such a serious view on drug addiction, our addiction in dent general is really well done. I 100% agree with you on that. The Angels storyline is good enough, but it's all secondary to Sam, Dean, and Bobby aspect of the story for me. Although Castiel's inner conflict and tension with Anna is a taste of what's to come, right along with Dean's oath. It's just an absolutely fantastic episode and not many people seem to love it as much as I do. Maybe it's just a little closer to home for me personally. Nope, I will agree with you, man. I love this episode too. It was very, very well done. I thought the blood drinking was similar to how addiction worked in real life. The sudden revelation about it being similar to a drug, to a drug made it a bit more relatable to us audience in my opinion. Plus it shows how addicts attempt to hide their addiction. I can kind of see where you're coming from there. More so for me, it's just because we're watching the characters or watching them grow, we've been there for pretty much everything and the fact that Sam's addiction kind of comes out of left field is a little bit sudden, but when you put it like that, I kind of get it where you're coming from. When the Levy breaks, Harkins back to when Dean was told by his father that if he couldn't save his brother and if he couldn't, he'd have to kill him. Actually, that's a good point. That's a good drawback there. The hallucinations were so well acted and I love how they really mess with Sam's psyche. The Bobby hallucination was something I picked up upon a re-watch because it was so intense that it felt like Sam really knocked Bobby out. Plus it has one of, wait, what? You think that that's a hallucination? What? No, that's actually Bobby. I thought that was actually Bobby. Plus it has one of my favorite demons returning ever so briefly. Sarah Gamble has done a fantastic job writing the pre-nuptial episodes of the seasons in Supernatural. Yeah, she actually has. You're right. Also interesting backstory on Lilith so suddenly that she is the first demon which ties in heavily with a lot of Judeo-Christian mythologies. When Sam and Dean fought each other and Sam walks out on Dean, I remember watching this live. Oh, you mean the other way around. Oh, no, no, you're right. I'm feeling emotionally wrecked. This exactly ties in with Lucifer and Michael in the latter season and how they relate to the archangel. I don't know what else to say. It's just a really good second to last episode and one of my favorite episodes in the season. I guess I can add that Castile letting Sam go again adds to all that mystery and buildup of the season finale after Dean swore allegiance to the angels. He is setting up the chess pieces for the apocalypse essentially and I love that. It's his character that's in a way forced to do. Do it. You can tell by his body language he does not want to do it but he knows he has to. Yep, no, that's a good point. Again, adding the intrigue and all the levels of deception and whatever's going on in this episode definitely show a different side to these guys and it's really cool to see. When the Levy Breaks is my favorite Sam-focused episode, the hallucination segment is just so well executed.  Some great guest appearances too. Alastair, Mary, and the kid who previously played young Sam. Yep, those are some great hallucination bits. I especially love when the kid Sam confronts adult Sam with a childish sense of betrayal towards him harkening all the way back to his guilt over Jessica's death. I always get chills when the kid says maybe there's no escape. After all, how can you run from what's inside you when your eyes turn yellow? It makes me wish Sam's eyes had gone yellow instead of black in the season finale too. I'll admit, I'm not upset because I feel that the yellow eye thing only works for certain people and I'm actually kind of curious if they actually tried that, but I like that they made his eyes go black because it just like that full envelopment in the darkness of evil kind of how it was going. The dialogue is also really good in this episode. I love when Castiel asks Dean, do you swear to follow his will and his word as swiftly and as obediently as you did your own fathers? One of my favorite underlying themes of season four and five is the parallel between God and John, i.e. God being the absent father, just as an absent father becomes a godly figure in the children's eyes. Ooh, good point, don't hurt. It worked so well at the time, probably because it was an underlying theme and not super heavy-handed. Literally one-to-one comparison. Sorry, I'm just in disbelief at how much Dad fumbled the bag with this one. Yeah, later on, yeah, obviously, but no, all of you guys have made really good points.  And then we got one criticism here, much like the Rapture when The Levy Breaks is not a bad episode, but I definitely want to skip it every time I re-watch season four to get this really surprising. I'm sorry, man, I can't skip this one.  This episode of more of a plot-driven story in The Rapture with Sam and Dean's conflict finally reaching an emotional breaking point. However, the rest of the episode, honestly, feels kind of dull. I don't know what it is. I just not as invested in the episodes as the episode wants me to be. I just find that hallucination episode is a cheap way to bring actors back and save money as they mostly happen in one year. I don't know, I don't want to sound negative, but I don't hate this episode and I agree with your point about being a three-part buildup, but it could have been done better, at least more exciting than what we got with some new performances episodes to the exact reason why she's a horrible actress when I ran about that in the next one. Honestly, man, I can't really agree with you at all in this. I think that everything's so well done. It's not harkening back. It's like everyone else has said, kind of talking about people and important in terms of addiction in terms of going through your own stripes, you're going to rely on and essentially betray those closest to you, those who mean the most to you. And it's not a cheap way to, I don't know what else they've been done, because otherwise you've just been having like effects and that's visually, I guess that's cool, but these are really hard-hitting bits. The kid, like seeing Sam talk to his younger self was one of the best bits. Seeing his mother die again or just talk to him about the failure of him, the only one that they could have brought back, the one that they could have cemented it with is just having John there, but Jeffrey Dean Morgan would be way too expensive at this point. But yeah, no, I love this episode. I love the ending. Thank you guys all for such good comments. Like, these are really good. All right, thank you guys for your comments. Now we're heading in to Lucifer Rising, which if I'm correct is the 100th episode of Supernatural in its history. So that's pretty crazy. So give me a guy's comments about that. This is obviously the season four finale and I will see you guys next week when we review that episode. If you liked this video, leave a like and if you're interested in more, subscribe. Otherwise, see you guys next week. Thanks for watching the video. My name is Knitz and you might remember me from the animated cult classic TV show, Undergrads. It's been a while, but I'm happy to say the click is finally getting back together in an all new movie thanks to a successful Kickstarter campaign. But we are still asking for your support. To see any and all updates about the upcoming Undergrads movie, be sure to check out and like the Bring Back Undergrads Facebook page. And with any luck, we'll see you guys soon.