isks posed to the wider community at the treatment step it is vital that the treatment process operates well so that effluent and biosolids meet agreed standards if not users on farms and consumers of the farm produce will be exposed to an unacceptable risk the hazardous events may include overloading of the plant breakdowns the processing temperature and time and the presence of flies or mosquitoes or seasonal factors such as high rainfall that may affect performance the risks and consequences of these are high example controls include proper design and construction trained operators and a preventive maintenance program monitoring may include periodic testing of effluent and checks on delivery volumes but even the best treatment processes may occasionally not meet standards in some cases lower levels of treatment may be unavoidable with the existing technology or desired by farmers who wish to access nutrients for reuse that's why barriers at the next reuse step are particularly important during reuse there are risks to farmers using the biosolids especially where intestinal worm infections are prevalent risks will depend on the performance of the treatment plant in the previous step and the way the biosolids are applied in the farm for example manual or mechanical application when produce is sold to the general population for consumption many people are potentially at risk pathogens can be recycled back to the community at large and lead to a disease outbreak this is costly in terms of public health that can also ruin the reputation and operation of businesses that reuse waste water and sludge the type of crop growing and the application method affects the risk for consumers for example crops eaten raw have a much higher risk compared with crops which are cooked or processed before eating these risks are potentially high controls that can be used include selection of crops not eaten raw setting a time between the last application and harvesting to allow pathogens to die off naturally and washing of produce and clean water before sale monitoring may include checking crop types application and harvesting practice as well as hygiene during the packing and sale we have just followed the modules in the SSP manual first describing the sanitation system identifying hazardous events and exposure risks developing and implementing improvement plans monitoring controls and verifying performance coordination amongst stakeholders is needed to implement all controls and monitoring in a safely managed system that's why establishing a team at the outset with members representing each step of the chain is vital to prepare for SSP coordination can be challenging but evidence shows that safely managed systems lead to far higher health gains than improved sanitation alone further using the multiple barrier approach reduces dependence on capital intensive treatment technologies as the main barrier controls can be included at any step and incrementally improved over time as resources permit in summary SSP is a risk based tool for safely managing existing sanitation systems SSP coordinates improvements and monitoring by actors along the sanitation chain SSP does not rely on treatment only it uses multiple barriers including behaviors, management and technology to prevent exposure the SSP manual that includes more guidance and tips is available in several languages on the WHO website along with other resources to help users get started and implement SSP Hello I'm Kate Medlicott technical officer for sanitation and wastewater at the World Health Organization in this video I will give you an overview of sanitation safety planning and we'll look at an example Sanitation Safety Planning or SSP for short is a risk based management tool for sanitation systems a safely managed sanitation system prevents exposure to disease causing excreta at all steps of the sanitation chain from containment through emptying, transport, treatment and to disposal or reuse it can be used together with excreta flow diagrams or SFDs shown in the previous module to make sure that excreta reaches safe rather than unsafe endpoints SSP reduces health impacts while increasing the benefits of reuse SSP can be used for all kinds of sanitation systems both in formal and informal settings the approach is best used for improving existing systems in communities with no sanitation demand creation should be prioritised so how do SSPs work? first we need to understand the system we plan to manage this is referred to as a system assessment phase where the sanitation chain and exposure groups and pathways are identified and expressed as hazards risks are recessed and when they are unacceptable improvements are designed to reduce them this approach ensures action is prioritised according to risk monitoring and management using multiple barriers along the chain ensure that the whole system is operating as intended SSP can be applied in many settings today I'll be illustrating the approach in an informal urban setting typical of growing cities in many countries we'll follow the chain showing examples of exposure groups hazards, controls and monitoring each step to build up a safely managed sanitation system that protects public health notice as we go that not all improvements involve expensive capital investment changes in management and behaviour can also significantly reduce risks also notice that different stakeholders bear responsibility for controls and monitoring at each step here is a simple pit latrine with manual emptying although excreta are contained in the latrine this unimproved system poses a number of health risks exposure groups include the users the workers who empty the containers and the surrounding community children in the elderly are especially vulnerable from contact with soiled surfaces in an unhygienic latrine these groups may be exposed via direct excreta contact through the feet and hands and when excreta is inadvertently transferred to the mouth via dirty hands the risk here are medium to high depending on the exposure group while the goal is a more hygienic improved sanitation technology we can still reduce risks for example controls such as wearing shoes better cleaning of the latrine personal protective equipment for workers and using an emptying system that reduces direct contact will all incrementally improve the system visual monitoring of these measures via community health worker is a simple way to check and respond if these controls are not in place this latrine with septic tank is an improved technology that poses less risk to users than the previous situation let's look at the emptying process motorized emptying and transport is much safer than manual emptying but there are still risks that need to be managed a key exposure group is the workers hazardous events are mostly related to blockages and malfunction of the equipment for example the operators may be sprayed with sludge and also contaminate the surrounding area these risks are typically high here are some controls to protect workers providing appropriate equipment working according to standard operating procedures and ensuring workers with personal protective equipment the organization responsible for overseeing collection and transport can set minimum standards like these and make spot checks to monitor if they are followed in this example all of the fecal sludge is delivered to the treatment plant but in poorly managed systems some may be diverted to dumping sites this can have serious health and environmental impacts SSP should also identify dumping as a hazardous event and include controls and monitoring to manage these risks posed to the wider community at the treatment step it is vital that the treatment process operates well so that effluent and biosolids meet agreed standards if not users on farms and consumers of the farm produce will be exposed to an unacceptable risk the hazardous events may include overloading of the plant breakdowns the processing temperature and time and the presence of flies or mosquitoes or seasonal factors such as high rainfall that may affect performance the risks and consequences of these are high example controls include proper design and construction trained operators and a preventive maintenance program monitoring may include periodic testing of effluent and checks on delivery volumes but even the best treatment processes will occasionally not meet standards in some cases lower levels of treatment may be unavoidable with the existing technology or desired by farmers who wish to access nutrients for reuse that's why barriers at the next reuse step are particularly important during reuse there are risks to farmers using the biosolids especially where intestinal worm infections are prevalent risks will depend on the performance of the treatment plant in the previous step and the way the biosolids are applied in the farm for example manual or mechanical application when produce is sold to the general population for consumption many people are potentially at risk pathogens can be recycled back to the community at large and lead to a disease outbreak this is costly in terms of public health but it can also ruin the reputation and operation of businesses that reuse wastewater and sludge the type of crop growing and the application method affects the risk for consumers for example, crops eaten raw have a much higher risk compared with crops which are cooked or processed before eating these risks are potentially high controls that can be used include selection of crops not eaten raw setting a time between the last application and harvesting to allow pathogens to die off naturally and washing of produce and clean water better and washing of produce and clean water before sale monitoring may include checking crop types, application and harvesting practice as well as hygiene during the packing and sale we have just followed the modules in the SSP manual first describing the sanitation system identifying hazardous events and exposure risks developing and implementing improvement plans monitoring controls and verifying performance coordination amongst stakeholders is needed to implement all controls and monitoring in a safely managed system that's why establishing a team at the outset with members representing each step of the chain is vital to prepare for SSP coordination can be challenging but evidence shows that safely managed systems lead to far higher health gains than improved sanitation alone further using the multiple barrier approach reduces dependence on capital intensive treatment technologies as the main barrier controls can be included at any step and incrementally improved over time as resources permit in summary SSP is a risk based tool for safely managing existing sanitation systems SSP coordinates improvements and monitoring by actors along the sanitation chain SSP does not rely on treatment only it uses multiple barriers including behaviors management and technology to prevent exposure the SSP manual that includes more guidance and tips is available in several languages on the WHO website along with other resources to help users get started and implement SSP Hello, I'm Kate Medlicott technical officer for sanitation and wastewater at the World Health Organization In this video I will give you an overview of sanitation safety planning and we'll look at an example of how sanitation safety planning or SSP for short is a risk based management tool for sanitation systems a safely managed sanitation system prevents exposure to disease causing excreta at all steps the sanitation chain from containment through emptying transport treatment and to disposal or reuse it can be used together with excreta flow diagrams or SFDs shown in the previous module to ensure that excreta reaches safe rather than unsafe endpoints SSP reduces health impacts while increasing the benefits of reuse SSP can be used for all kinds of sanitation systems both in formal and informal settings the approach is best used for improving existing systems in communities with no sanitation demand creation should be prioritized so how do SSPs work? first we need to understand the system we plan to manage this is referred to as a system assessment phase where the sanitation chain and exposure groups and pathways are identified and expressed as hazards risks are recessed and when they are unacceptable improvements are designed to reduce them this approach ensures action is prioritized according to risk monitoring and management using multiple barriers along the chain ensure that the whole system is operating as intended SSP can be applied in many settings today I'll be illustrating the approach in an informal urban setting typical of growing cities in many countries we'll follow the chain showing examples of exposure groups hazards, controls and monitoring at each step to build up a safely managed sanitation system that protects public health notice as we go that not all improvements are expensive capital investment changes in management and behavior can also significantly reduce risks also notice that different stakeholders bear responsibility for controls and monitoring at each step here is a simple pit latrine with manual emptying although excreta are contained in the latrine this unimproved system poses a number of health risks exposure groups include the users the workers who empty the containers children and the elderly are especially vulnerable from contact with soiled surfaces in an unhygienic latrine these groups may be exposed via direct excreta contact through the feet and hands and when excreta is inadvertently transferred to the mouth via dirty hands or flies the risks here are medium to high depending on the exposure group while the goal is a more hygienic improved sanitation technology we can still reduce risks for example controls such as wearing shoes better cleaning of the latrine personal protective equipment for workers and using an emptying system that reduces direct contact will all incrementally improve the system visual monitoring of these measures via community health worker is a simple way to check and respond if these controls are not in place this latrine with septic tank is an improved technology that poses less risk to users than the previous situation let's look at the emptying process motorized emptying and transport is much safer than manual emptying but there is still risk that need to be managed a key exposure group is the workers hazardous vents are mostly related to blockages and malfunction of the equipment for example the operators may be sprayed with sludge and also contaminate the surrounding area these risks are typically high here are some controls to protect workers providing appropriate equipment working according to standard operating procedures and ensuring workers with personal protective equipment the organization responsible for overseeing collection and transport can set minimum standards like these and make spot checks to monitor if they are followed in this example all of the fecal sludge is delivered to the treatment plant but in poorly managed systems it is recommended to dumping sites this can have serious health and environmental impacts SSP should also identify dumping as a hazardous event and include controls and monitoring to manage these risks posed to the wider community at the treatment step it is vital that the treatment process operates well so that effluent and biosolids meet agreed standards if not users on farms and consumers of the farm produce will be exposed to an unacceptable risk the hazardous events may include overloading of the plant breakdowns the processing temperature and time and the presence of flies or mosquitoes or seasonal factors such as high rainfall that may affect performance the risks and consequences of these are high example controls include proper design and construction trained operators and a preventive maintenance program monitoring may include effective treatment of effluent and checks on delivery volumes but even the best treatment processes will occasionally not meet standards in some cases lower levels of treatment may be unavoidable with the existing technology or desired by farmers who wish to access nutrients for reuse that's why barriers at the next reuse step are particularly important during reuse there are risks to farmers using the biosolids especially where intestinal worm infections are very rare risks will depend on the performance of the treatment plant in the previous step and the way the biosolids are applied in the farm for example manual or mechanical application when produce is sold to the general population for consumption many people are potentially at risk pathogens can be recycled back to the community at large and lead to a disease outbreak this is costly in terms of public health that can also ruin the reputation and operation of businesses that reuse wastewater and sludge the type of crop grown and the application method affects the risk for consumers for example crops eaten raw have a much higher risk compared with crops which are cooked or processed before eating these risks are potentially high controls that can be used include selection of crops not eaten raw setting a time between the last application and harvesting to allow pathogens to die off naturally and washing of produce and clean water before sale monitoring may include checking crop types application and harvesting practice as well as hygiene during the packing and sale we have just followed the modules in the SSP manual first describing the sanitation system identifying hazardous events and exposure risks developing and implementing performance coordination amongst stakeholders is needed to implement all controls in monitoring in a safely managed system that's why establishing a team at the outset with members representing each step of the chain is vital to prepare for SSP coordination can be challenging but evidence shows that safely managed systems lead to far higher health gains than improved sanitation alone further using the multiple barrier approach reduces dependence on capital intensive treatment technologies as the main barrier controls can be included at any step and incrementally improved over time as resources permit in summary SSP is a risk based tool for safely managing existing sanitation systems SSP coordinates improvements and monitoring by actors along the sanitation chain SSP does not rely on treatment only it uses multiple barriers including behaviors management and technology to prevent exposure the SSP manual that includes more guidance and tips is available in several languages on the WHO website along with other resources to help users get started and implement SSP Hello, I'm Kate Medlikott technical officer for sanitation and wastewater at the World Health Organization in this video I will give you an overview of sanitation safety planning and we'll look at an example Sanitation safety planning or SSP for short is a risk based management tool for sanitation systems a safely managed sanitation system prevents exposure to disease causing excreta at all steps of the sanitation chain from containment through emptying, transport, treatment and to disposal or reuse it can be used together to flow diagrams or SFDs shown in the previous module to make sure that excreta reaches safe rather than unsafe end points SSP reduces health impacts while increasing the benefits of reuse SSP can be used for all kinds of sanitation systems both in formal and informal settings the approach is best used for improving existing systems in communities with no sanitation demand creation should be prioritized so how do SSPs work? first, we need to understand the system we plan to manage this is referred to as a system assessment phase where the sanitation chain and exposure groups and pathways are identified and expressed as hazards risks are recessed and when they are unacceptable improvements are designed to reduce them this approach ensures action is prioritized according to risk monitoring and management using multiple barriers along the chain ensure that the whole system is operating as intended SSP can be applied in many settings today I'll be illustrating the approach in an informal urban setting typical of growing cities in many countries we'll follow the chain showing examples of exposure groups hazards, controls and monitoring at each step to build up a safely managed sanitation system that protects public health notice as we go that not all improvements involve expensive capital investment changes in management and behaviour can also significantly reduce risk risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management risk management I'm not so sure how to get that picture back on. Hey, I think it's yours. So welcome everybody. Okay. So everybody welcome to finalize these sessions on upscaling sanitation at the city level. And thanks SEI for this very good vegetarian food. It was very good. Perfect. I think everybody is ready now for the last 15 minutes of these sessions. We will have one presentation from our colleague Daniel, but before our colleague from Kenya has a few words to say to you. No, just very quick. Thank you so much for listening to our presentation, but I just wanted to announce that you'll know the genesis later, but we have the CEWI equivalent in Africa 20th of November to 25th at KICC, Kenyatta International Conference Center in Nairobi. If you can check out our website, you can register yourself. The idea behind and why I want to announce it here is because we're looking at innovation in both water and sanitation between our entire university. And then we're inviting companies from Europe and North America and also Latin America to come and display their products. There's one thing to have products actually developed here, and they come to us, but I'm asking the companies to come to Kenya and show us, first of all, you have to know our problems, first of all. And then when you go back, hopefully we'll have it yearly. And so I'm just taking this opportunity to invite everyone to look at our website and register. Thank you so much. Karibuni Kenya. Thank you very much. So you're welcome in Nairobi for all of you. So now we will, for the last presentation of these sessions, we will speak about new topics. And this is the question of research recovery from sanitation. So, Daniel, I'll let you introduce yourself and do the presentation. Thank you. Thank you very much. The presentation I'm going to give right now is from work that I did as part of my master's thesis at KTH, Research Technology, prominently displayed right there, but also working within the Sustainable Sanitation Initiative here at SCI with Anu Rosmarin, Kim Anderson, and other colleagues in that team. Now, what is the motivation for us moving into resource recovery? This is basically that we need to revamp sanitation from a sector that is associated with dangerous west flows that is associated with productive resource flows. And this is not just the public health benefits that come from having improved sanitation in all areas and in the context of cities for this session specifically, but also other productive resource flows because when you recover energy, nutrients, and other possible resource recovery or reuse products from sanitation, then you have a multitude of co-benefits that you can get from sanitation rather than just public health benefits. And this is really the motivation for the tool that we have developed here at SCI and KTH. And the tool basically is meant to estimate the reuse products that we can get from sanitary waste streams, so fecal sludge, sewage sludge, you know, wastewater and other waste flows in the urban context and name it. And then also the potential revenues that we could get from these reuse products if necessary investments are made to have technologies that can capture these resources. And this tool also is able to make a comparison between the different resource recovery products that are available. So these are basically the capabilities of the tool as it is right now. So this is what the tool does. But why do we need to have a tool in any case? Global estimates have been made of the potential value that can be captured out of sanitary waste, specifically fecal sludge or sewage sludge. There's already projects that have, you know, attempted to capture the global value within human excreta or wastewater or fecal sludge or whatever form it might be. For example, this is a report that was published last year and I tried to estimate the potential benefits that we could get if all human excreta from the entire globe was turned into some form of energy. So there's the potential market value of 9.5 billion US dollars annually, imagine. There is also another study that has been done to try to capture the global potential of phosphorous recovery. And, you know, it has been mapped very clearly according, you know, to country and continent or regional level with scenarios both for 2009 and then in the future as well. But we all realize that whereas it's good to have a global picture of the potential, the necessary investments, the necessary action that needs to be taken to realize this global potential is at the local scale, at city level, at town level, in the local area. That's where the necessary action needs to be taken for us to realize this global potential, these global strategies. But suddenly the tools that have been developed so far to try to capture, you know, the potential of resource recovery are either focused on one waste stream or one resource recovery option and most of them are geared towards the context of the global north. So this leaves out the countries in the global south where as we know, the majority of our population growth is going to take place in the next few decades. So this is the inspiration for the tool that we are making. We want it to be something that is comprehensive that covers, you know, a wide range of waste streams, a wide range of resource recovery options and fits both contexts, both in the global south and in the global north. How does the tool work? I'm going to demonstrate briefly. The tool, we tested it in Kampala and these are the waste stream flows that we have in Kampala for the different waste streams, as you can see, both for current generation or current collection rates, but then also the potential if the city improved its collection systems in terms of efficiency and coverage. So I will jump right to Microsoft Excel briefly. Okay. Sorry about that. I'm not sure how to get this away from PowerPoint. I tried doing that, but then it just brings up that blank screen. Just to display the Excel. Okay. I think here, right here. Let's bring it out now. You want it? Yeah. Let me try this. Maybe we just have to stop screen. We just have to say don't just duplicate this. Okay. Hopefully they get it there. All right. As a student of technology, I should have been able to cover this. Okay. Anyway, so this is the tool. As you can see in present form, it's in spreadsheets. So we have four spreadsheets. There's some few instructions for the user to follow. There is a model, and this is basically the main part of this tool that we have developed as you can see. So at the top, you can see these different West Streams, FICO Sludge, for example. Sewage Sludge. And at the moment, we also have organic Manispo Solid West. And in the yellow boxes, the user can put in the amounts of the West Stream that they have in their city. So for example, in Kampala, there is 390 cubic meters of FICO Sludge. There is 66 tons of sewage sludge that can be generated every day. And as far as solid waste is concerned, 700 cubic meters. And then you can, tons per day. And then you can see estimates for biogas in terms of the amount, the energy value, the potential revenue, as well as the nutrients content within the residue. And you can see the same for the other resource recovery options. Solid fuel, potential and more feed ingredients from Black Soldier Fly Lava, as well as fertilizer. You know, some of those West Streams are composted. And then the estimates that we see here in terms of minimum, typical and maximum to give a range. And that's why we have called it estimate. It's not the actual values. And these calculations are based on the characterization data of these different West Streams. So we have a worksheet there on characterization data. This comes with the tool, but if there is characterization studies that have been done in the city or in the particular local area, they can feed in this data so that they have a more accurate picture. But most of this is based on literature and it's representative. Then we also have some graphs to give the comparison that I talked about. So we can see in terms of potential revenues. If all these West Streams, for example, we are geared towards biogas and the residues in terms of nutrients, this is the revenue that you could potentially generate. The yellow bit, the orange bit is the typical values and then we have the maximum and minimum estimates. And so we can see, for example, that if you used it for soil, if you were either in form of powder or a briquette form of pellets, then you could have much higher revenue potential there. And there's also estimates for the nutrients and also for the energy content. So a city can make a choice based on do we need to have a more fertilizer generated from within the area instead of importing urea or do we need to create, you know, to have an alternative source of energy or do we need to just maximize revenues. And that can help them make a decision. So getting back to PowerPoint, just to give an overview of the potential within Kampala, as you can see for the three West Streams, for the scenario of what is collected daily at the moment. We could have about 115 cubic meters of biogas every day from the daily collection of these three West Streams. And this is enough to substitute the daily firewood that is used by about 263,000 people. So there's a lot of potential there, as well as, you know, you can see the other resource recovery options and their value as substitutes. This tool is not intended to be used as a standalone tool. It fits within the overall sanitation planning and other, you know, the wider city planning tools that are available. So you can see there is a potential, for example, to fit it up with the tool that has been developed by IRC because, you know, it produces fickle flow volumes and this is the data that we need in Revamp. So you can fit it together with other tools, close, you know, Sanitation 21, the Compendium of Sanitation Technologies and a wide range of other tools. But not only for sanitation, here we are talking about energy, we are talking about food production, we are talking about fertilizer. So it's not just sanitation. There's a wider range of issues that come together and this tool can be a very good complement to the other tools that are already being used for city planning. And it's also very, you know, it fits into the wider sustainable development agenda because if you recover energy, you know, that's, energy is available there. Then if you don't have our excreta flowing into the open environment, then we're having much better ecosystems in the city area. We have, if we recover nutrients, then we have food security. If we don't have west flows, you know, openly in the environment, then we have people having a better public health. Then of course there's revenues that can be generated creating green businesses and opportunities for green jobs and of course water security as well if the water streams in the area are not contaminated by these fickle flows or other forms of waste material. So it fits, you know, within the wider sustainable development agenda, both at urban scale, but even national scale. And then we can realize the global potentials in these resource flows. So what's next? We intend to do further work on this tool, improve the user interface, integrate with other tools for nexus planning, for a nexus approach to planning and also include other variables of course, the costs both for investment at the beginning and then operation and also testing it in a varied range of towns and cities to improve it based on feedback from the users and other stakeholders. And we welcome partners that are interested in joining in this work at all levels. This just to credit people that have been involved in this project. So thank you very much. Presentation. So if you have any questions, any question of clarification or any remarks, it's welcome. Maybe I could try with first questions in your Excel sheet. You speak about sewage sludge. Do you speak about wastewater or unless the sludge part of the wastewater? The sludge specifically. So after some form of either activated sludge treatment or some form of treatment, the sludge that remains. Not the effluent. But of course there is value in that as well. For example, if it's reclaimed water that can be used for irrigation and those are aspects that we intend to include in the tool in further steps in the future. Thanks, Daniel. Great. I think it's an excellent introduction to what I'm going to talk a little bit later. Thank you. But my question is, did you, you know, with these impressive numbers on energy, do you talk to people who are dealing with energy? Do you talk to people who want to have sustainable energy but they never talk about sanitation, they never talk about water? At the moment that hasn't been done to a great extent. When we tried out the tool in Kampala, it was only with the public health and environment directorate within the Kampala Capital City Authority and that was just the first step. And I should also note that this is just work that has been done so far in six months. So there's a lot of, you know, there's a long way to go. And like we realize that this is not something for the sanitation sector only because it involves like I explained so many other sectors and other stakeholders that need to be brought to the table. To discuss together. So I think that's something that, you know, we really need to do going forward. You said you tested the tool in Kampala. What kind of impact did it have? Did it lead to some developments on the ground with some political choices and maybe trials on new energy generation? At the moment no concrete decisions have been made based on this tool. But we intend to engage stakeholders further as we develop the tool and as we improve it. But in Kampala there is a very good political goodwill, you know, from the stakeholders involved. There's a lot of projects that are ongoing. I know some of the people in this room have been involved in projects in Kampala. So I think there's a lot of potential. One example I could give. The World Bank funded lots of projects in different urban centers in Uganda to obtain value from organic waste in the cities. And most of these projects were centered around composting facilities. And money was offered to Kampala. Kampala said no, let other cities do composting but for us we want to do something to do with energy. So this is already something that they are thinking about. So there is of course some synergies between these projects and the ongoing political decisions that are being taken within the city in Kampala. But we intend to do more engagement with the stakeholders there. Because this tool can't work on its own. It's not something to be done at SCIO. It can only have impact really if all the stakeholders and the people that it's intended to benefit on board. Thank you. One last question. You make the difference between income from the energy and for example nutrients. But if you use it for energy there is also a leftover which can also be used to produce fertilizer. So have you been looking at that? Yes. I can't go back right now because of time but those values in terms of revenues that I showed capture both the energy and the residue. So that's taken into account. It was not just the energy. So for example for biogas there is a residue that comes from biogas digestion. So that was accounted for. So that graph includes both the potential revenues from the biogas as well as the residue. So thank you very much Daniel for the very useful presentations. I know that we have a lot of discussions still today so I will try to summarize very shortly the discussions we had since this morning regarding this session on upscaling sanitation at Yoban level. I just switched to recall what Alejandro said to us at the beginning of this session to say that we know all of us that we have a very strong challenge regarding sanitation, Yoban sanitation particularly. And we are ready to go beyond the low collection to go at city level to think about national levels. Really don't speak only about small projects but to really upscale the activities. We have a lot of very interesting presentations so I really wish to thank all of you, all the presenters for your presentation. I think it was very useful. It was I think a broad view but a broad travel in the urban sanitation cycle. So thank you very much. It's difficult to summarize all the elements but I think it was very useful because we had a lot of elements regarding the assessment of the situations on what we could do. We have elements regarding the assessment through the ACFD, the sheet flow diagram. We had also to have an overview of this sheet flow. We have also elements through the SANI path to specifically assess the question of public health risk linked to sanitation. I think it was very complementary. And we just have with Daniel also these questions of resource recovery. How could we consider also sanitation effluence on the potential of resource recovery? So I think it was very useful. Martin gave us also very interesting elements with the FSM tools to explain that we have to take into consideration all these elements regarding assessment. We could work based on that on the aberration of strategy and to implement all these elements. I really appreciate one of the elements of Martin, I like this morning, is also that we have to consider not only in one side the onsite system on another side the sewage systems but really to think always when we are in a city to think of the complementarity between these two systems and don't think about only one. I think it's a very crucial point. I think it was very useful also for us to have the presentation from our colleague from Kenya to say we speak about how to upscale and they show us interesting tools. These trust funds they use, how these trust funds could help the innovations coming directly from the utilities themselves. I think it's a very useful tool and tools that help to elaborate pilot projects at the beginning but also mainly try to upscale these pilot activities. So I think following all these elements we have a lot of elements. We know that it's at the earth of the work of most of us, we have a lot of work to continue to do together but I think it's very important to have this opportunity together and thanks to Susanna to give this opportunity to share all this experience. So thank you very much and I let the... Just have a short announcement. If you want to keep discussing on city-wide sanitation and urban sanitation we have a side event at the World Water Week tomorrow at 9 in which we'll be presenting nine cases so as it's the registration so I kindly ask you to get there earlier to get your badges and be able to be at the side event in time. Okay, thank you. Okay, we're coming to the next session. Session three, we're only like ten minutes behind schedule so it's great. And it's sustainable sanitation in the Agenda 2030 and the International Water Architecture. We have a number of contributions to this. First, as I announced in the morning, Roland will walk us through the background document and maybe a new sort of amendment to the vision or a new document that will bring us towards the SDGs and will share that with you and we'll ask for some feedback from you. We'll further discuss it in the core group tomorrow and we'll share it more broadly than from January onwards. But to keep you in the loop and as well to have your reactions Roland will embark on that. That's the broader picture. We'll have a couple of sort of focused contributions. One is that SEI has produced a new book which is actually very useful for that discussion and Kim Andersen will present that to us. And then I'm very happy that Daniela Krahl from the German Ministry has joined us. And well, it's the first time that the German Ministry is here in this 20-second Susanna meeting. But that's great. I think you trust us, you look at us, you listen to us, what we report to you but you help us going since almost 10 years. So great that you're here. And you'll speak about that business as usually is not an option to fulfill the 2030 agenda and that the global architecture and the water sector, that we did look like to really get things going. We'll have Kate Medleycott. She might still be in a UN meeting but she wanted to tell us about the whole area of monitoring in the sanitation goal in the SDGs and those who sneaked in during lunch and looked at the MOOC that was Kate. So we'll have her here live then as well. And then as India is sort of a bigger part of the game and the Indian president had that switch bar at Clean India and how is it going? We have the Indian chapter. We will ask Vishwanath to give us his perception. How is that going? How does that fit as well into 2030 and really get things done? And I know you'll have your very interesting view on that. So without further ado, I would ask Roland, we are sharing it together to, well, let us know what's going on. Maybe I sit next to you. Yes, thanks very much. Well, good afternoon. I know this good food that you had requires all the attention from your body but I hope that you still can spare some attention of what I'm going to talk about. Actually, we said already this morning that we are in the period of changing from the MDGs to the SDGs. And when we started discussing in Susanna what this might mean or what this should mean for Susanna, we said it's probably a good idea to have a background paper so that we are all on the same level of information. And so we together with Elizabeth Kwanström and Patrick Brocken we wrote this background paper. I hope there are still copies around. Or chairs. They were on the chairs. So I would quickly go through that. What we want to do with this background paper is actually just see what are the main changes from the MDGs to the SDGs. And showing that sanitation is not only related to SDG 6 but basically to all other SDGs. And in my opinion this is a great opportunity. One can regret that there are 17 SDGs but I see it more as an opportunity for Susanna to enter into these other themes as well. So I will talk a bit about that and then of course what that all means for Susanna. And we had already some preliminary talks and some inputs from the core group and we will continue with that tomorrow. And of course everybody is welcome to give their comments. So let me see how do I go here. Okay, just a few words about the development of the SDGs for those who are maybe not aware of what really happened. We would like to remind ourselves that in 2012 at the Rio Plus 20 it was decided to have SDGs as successor of the MDGs and then in 12, 12 till 14 there was an open working group working on this an extremely open process with all the pros and cons. I will come back to that. And I think part of this process we also should be aware of this conference in August in 2015 in Addis Ababa talking about financing. How do we finance these SDGs? And I think for me it was very important if there was a long, very difficult discussion to realize and to say that really new resources are necessary and at the top is domestic public resources. We have to mobilize more domestic resources. Domestic and international private business and finance and of course still ODA. And then as you all know in September 2015 these 17 SDGs were adopted and of course for us the six is the one and I was actually part also with SDC fighting that we have one on water and actually the existing one is about 90% what we actually suggested how it should look like. So if you are not happy with it you can also claim it to us. So what are the main difference between the SDGs and the MDGs? Well first of all this process very inclusive goal setting process and as a result of that also it's much, much more comprehensive. We had eight MDGs, now we have 17 SDGs 169 targets. Well how can we deal with this? Well it is a challenge. I think one of the real big change that SDG Agenda 2030 is no more a development agenda it's a sustainability agenda. So they are universal goals they are applicable for all countries for Zambia as well as for Switzerland. Of course not in the same way. I don't think in Switzerland open defecation free communities is a big issue but there are other SDGs which are a big issue also for Switzerland. Sustainable production, sustainable consumption this is much more important for Germany or Switzerland than it is for Zambia. So I think that is very important and we will talk about what does that mean for Susanna. And then they are much more ambitious. You remember we many of the goals one wanted just to go half way through. Now we have to go all the way through. Zero. And one of the real important one leaving no one behind. Leaving no one behind. And you know I'm very old now. I remember when I entered into this whole sector that was the beginning of the water and sanitation decade. And you know the motto was then in 1980 water and sanitation for all by 1990. You know where we are today. The motto was also some for all instead of all for some motto still very actual as today. So we are not talking about new things basically. And I mentioned the funding. I mean the MDGs were supposed to be funded mainly by ODA. Now it's a different type of funding and I set up that we have to look at. Well related to water you all know MDGs we just had we didn't have a water goal. It was just under under goal seven. The proportion of the population without sustainable water and sanitation should be reduced by half. Now we have really this SDG number six with six main targets and two targets related to means of implementation. And you know these are the two wash how I call them the wash targets. And we have the wastewater management target. And I was dealing this this figure from that publication here because it shows very nicely what's the difference between MDGs and SDGs related to water and sanitation. You see on the left MDGs now we are talking about the whole system when we address the SDGs. And then of course we have the six four finally talking about use efficiency and sure sustainable withdrawals. And I think in the one before of course recycling and say free use. You know and then coming to what what Dania was just talking about that's how how important that is. Now we have then the water resources management target. And of course we have also the target for protecting the ecosystem. So much more much more complex and then we have the two means of implementation targets. Now what are the developments in the in the in the sanitation sector during the MDG period. And I went so for me the most important change is this profile of sanitation which increased really in when I think back in the year 2000.  Now the same people realize suddenly hey even in our countries maybe that not maybe the way to go and I think this is so now looking at this the systems approach in the year 2000 nobody talked about well some people talked about but very few and I think the big change we still talk about the same things basically but many more people talk about the same things many more bright people about talk because I always said the sanitation challenge is so big and so difficult only the brightest people have to work in it and because you know it's it's relatively easy to design a system Sanité for Zurich it's relatively easy but to design a sanitation system for Dar al-Salaam it's incredible difficult we still don't know yet or in India I mean people are still working on it and very successfully but I think you are far away of saying we know the solution so we are still working but for me it's very nice to see that so many more people and bright people are finally working in this field which was so unsexy for many many many years and that point is for me also very important that even in so called industrialized developed countries people more and more are realizing that we need a paradigm shift also in our systems and people in Sweden have been talking about that for many many years but there were only a few and it really didn't get across and many people gained access to so called improved sanitation no question but and here is the big but but still 2.4 billion are still using and improved these numbers including the more than 1 billion people who are still practicing openification and I think for me this is really also very very disturbing you know it shows the big inequality between urban and rural between poor and rich and also in 2010 it was declared water and sanitation is a human right and now recently even sanitation itself is a human right if you look at this picture we are far away from this human right you know it just shows the poorest quintile to the richest quintile now I think sanitation relates to nearly all of the other SDGs I don't go through it I think we elaborated quite a bit in this paper here how this how these relations are because we wanted to actually motivate people especially other the working groups to open their eyes you know and I take now the energy one and that's why I'm so grateful for Daniels Lombard who showed the clean energy I was participating in some of the energy people meeting before the SDGs and they were very concerned that there will be an energy goal great there was not one word about sanitation about byproducts of sanitation maybe being helping to achieve this target there were many little things about water so I think I feel that this is a great opportunity now for Susanna to get into these different SDGs and to talk to people to talk to energy people to talk nutrition people health people that we did for long education people so I think nearly all of these SDGs are direct or indirectly linked to sanitation and I would like to be people aware of that this is a big opportunity now coming to the what does that mean for Susanna like I said we had already discussions with the core group we also did a survey based on this background paper we asked several questions and how the discussion looks at the moment and we will have it much more discussion tomorrow with the core group this new document which will be either an amendment or a new document and you ask maybe yourself why an amendment well I was involved in the development of a vision paper in 2008 and it's actually the only document that all members all partners of Susanna subscribed there are many documents that Susanna had was involved but it was only the only one and it was a long process that everybody could agree with that maybe it's a constitution of Susanna and we said why reopen this discussion again but it's not decided yet if it will be an amendment anyway but content wise it will look probably very similar so we'll have of course introduction we will have a short description about from the MDGs to the SDGs what I just show you now in nutshell it came out that we really have to have a definition for sanitation in our vision document we never had a clear definition what Susanna means for what sanitation means for Susanna and I think we have to do that especially now that wastewater comes in how do we relate to that some people say well solid waste should be in too I think we need this operational it will be a hard work that everybody can agree we will do that I think we need a statement how target 6-2 the sanitation is related to the wastewater how is that related to each other I think some people were very unhappy that we had 6-3 in because they said well that takes away the attention from 6-2 and there should no competition there to make a clear statement how these are related to each other what does universality and leave nobody behind mean for Susanna these two very important points I think it will it is quite unanimously clear that I think Susanna should still focus on the law and middle income countries but it will also look at newer developments in the industrialized countries and use as showcase that there are alternatives to the conventional wastewater systems it also comes out quite clear that Susanna's work will put more emphasis on the hardest to reach and most vulnerable and the the word here is more not only but maybe a little bit more than in the past and I think it was mentioned already before I think Susanna's working groups shall take up access to all and upscaling as a cross cutting issue and address them from their specific thematic angle so that's how this document probably will look like and I just would like to invite you if you have some strong opinion if you have some ideas please I think in the in the you can fill in this form here at the end or you can tell us so that we can bring it into the discussion with the core group with the heads of the different working groups and then of course we also had these two questions how can Susanna contribute to end open defecation in a sustainable way you know CLTS is sort of the almost the civil bullet now I think CLTS is has a great merit but on the other hand I think when there was just a big book came out on sustainably of CLTS and we said oh great that's now covered sustainable issues but if you look at it it just shows how sustain for them sustainable is just not turning back to open defecation that's for them sustainability for Susanna sustainability is a little bit more than that and so I think I think we probably will have to develop sort of a statement on that a little bit not criticizing CLTS but to show that you know how can CLTS become a sustainable system and then we need interpretation of target 6.2 and 6.3 because you know one of the philosophy of the SDG is really that these global targets have to be translated now into national targets this is very important and I think Susanna could really play an important role in assisting that especially with regard to 6.3 there are no global indicators for recycling reuse and I think this is at the core of Susanna in a way so I think Susanna could really play here an important role assisting governments how to translate these international targets into national targets because you know it's a big agenda 2030 but it's a framework and it's now up to the governments to come up with their targets and the big advantage for me in agenda 2030 is that people have now the right to ask the governments what are you doing about these things I think this shouldn't be underestimated civil society gets a stronger role in this okay I think that's all what I wanted to share with you today thanks very much thank you very much indeed Rodin that most insightful view of the opportunities I think just adding to what Rowan said we really have a golden opportunity now to influence the development agenda and I know from Rowan's last slide that many countries are crying out they're crying out for technical guidance on how to measure these indicators so they're going to be calling on the Susanna group at wide for assistance in this area and it's absolutely critical we have a small window to do this to be prepared anyway I'd like to open the floor up for comments to Rowan or any questions or clarifications that you have so please who would like to kick off the conversation okay Hi Christine Moe Emory University I really liked your presentation and contrasting and comparing the MDGs and the SDGs I think one important aspect of SDG 6 that we've been interested in is the extension of WASH into institutions and particularly healthcare facilities and I think that sanitation in healthcare facilities is more complex than household sanitation and so I just wondered if you wanted to comment on that I think we've been working in this area for the past five years and we realize that we need some better indicators for healthcare facilities WHO and UNICEF is working on this but I think it's an area where there's still quite a few information gaps Do you want to go ahead and I fully agree with you and a lot still has to be done my plea also would be we have the the SDG on education and I think we should also with the education people I mean no school is a good school if they don't have good sanitation facilities so it's not only that we among ourselves and tell people what should be done I think we also have to reach out that these people in the education field they also realize hey that's a problem we have to tackle next comment somebody else yeah I'm Antonette Coma from SNV I haven't read the paper so maybe it's inside of the paper but I was wondering what your thoughts are about the target 6.5 the integrated water resources management and it's relation to sanitation is it possible to divert us or that it will improve where do you have any thoughts well what I can tell you that this was the most controversial target because of the inter between the countries you know the trans boundary thank you very much because that was the biggest issue but I didn't have too much thought and I don't think that it will deviate our attention too much why do you think it will in many of the presentations conversations that we've been having it was about district-wide sanitation with municipal authorities on sanitation in their area because it is their their duty basically of course if we bring in a watershed perspective that is also trans boundary in that sense and it's a whole different dynamic again we haven't been talking about that personally I don't advocate for that but I think we need to think about it what it means because there is this push to look at it on a watershed level good point, good point let's think about this although of course I know water is really water is really an issue of river basin that is no question how far it is relate to sanitation we will think about that hi thanks that was very interesting and there is a lot of interest in looking at synergies across the SDGs but I think it would be interesting to look at the potential trade-offs as well so areas where you have either targets cancelling each other out or just constraining each other so to look at how sanitation might have if we are talking about progressive realization of sanitation are there potential interactions with the goals on aquatic ecosystems for instance so looking at that as well and not just the positive synergies but also the potential trade-offs very good point something I forgot to say actually is that when we have these 17 SDGs some of them completely conflict with each other if we have protection of environment reducing resource use and then economic development you know there are really conflicts there but I think the nice thing about this that I think governments have to start to talk about this when we talk about war I have been involved in water also in Switzerland water always full of conflicts full of conflicts and it's actually the society it has to be a civil contract how this is dealt with how much water goes to energy how much water goes to water supply how much water goes to industry and so I think having these conflicts I think it's very good to open up that they are conflicts that they are synergies but they are also conflicts so that's another opportunity I think thank you very much Roland I think we'll bring this discussion to a close now because we're under time pressure thank you very much again Roland for your excellent presentation the next presentation is from Kim Anderson from SEI who's going to talk to us about their joint publication Kim so it's really great that Roland has kind of set a scene this is a joint effort with UNEP SEI so but also co-authoring from the Swedish Technical Research Institute with Elizabeth Kwanström and Jennifer McCombill Rasek Seder from University of Technology Norway and SEI colleagues on mine on Rosemary Serdicken and Kasper Trimmer our scientific writer so what Roland said what are we talking about is it sanitation, is it wastewater actually that was when we started to discuss this study that became a book that was actually the starting point for the whole thing we were starting talking about showing good examples of wastewater recovery reuse but then we said hey we cannot talk about wastewater without talking about sanitation how can we have a sustainable wastewater management without looking upstream in some countries 90% of all wastewater is coming from households and normal sanitation systems so that equation didn't work really as you can see you're probably aware of this it's diverse issues around the world some leading to more health impacts some more to environmental challenges so we also looked at the sustainable development goal and seeing we need to discuss it around this this is a framework it's something a change that is taking place now so we need to actually frame our discussion in this context but interesting I don't know if it's they are actually divided here you have sanitation in 6.2 and you talk about wastewater in 6.3 so no clear connection here either but the good thing is that as Roland pointed out this is we at least we see that the SDGs really a good base to to start to really work on a global scale on sustainability when it comes to sanitation and wastewater management so the question is how far we will get the MDGs looked a lot about on the toilets the access to sanitation while the SDGs they start to talk about treatment but also mentioning recycling resource recovery so the question is how far we can get but we think we have to try to motivate to go as far as we can to the right so we mapped some of the issues and if you start to look it's sanitation up to the left we have the communicable diseases to the right a water scarcity and malnutrition and you can see that there's some regions in the world that this is actually coinciding and we think that doing sanitation different can at least respond to some of these these issues this yeah so what we did we also tried to map then if you do more with sanitation so it's cut hard to see this we have a poster on the door outside and of course you can look in the book when it's launched but it says waste containment in the first column then it says safe sanitation access and availability pataging control, nutrient emission control and then to the right you have resource management and recovery so we looked at by doing a more going towards resource recovery and sanitation and waste water management how many goals can you kind of address and contribute to and you can see if we go all the way up to resource management and recovery and complete the other functions of sanitation then we can actually address 34 different targets so that's quite impressive but we think it's so important to frame because further what do we really mean by sustainability sometimes it's taken quite lightly and we feel like this we have to go into the different topics sustainability and provide more evidence and arguments but if we want resource we really care about resources and the management and we think there is actually resource scarcity coming around the corner then we think it's important to really put stress on this so we put that in the middle actually but it's based on the the Susanna sustainability criteria and it's it's all there so what does this mean what does this mean when we come to like practically how do we do that how do we put resources first we think there is kind of a need of a paradigm shift when we do development projects or setting up new projects in a new town for example we actually need to start to look what are the resources there what's the scarcity what's the demands so when what type of resource management options are there to get energy out maybe reuse water in irrigation around the city and then at the end when we know more or less what we want to do then we can start to talk about how do we do it what kind of technical systems do we need is it centralized decentralized is it water born or is it non water born but that each context will have to define that doing this this way we think then we can reach to this multiple potential benefits this is just another way to show it the value of the waste we have a lot of different waste streams in our society human excreta is one but there are others and actually this they are not waste it's energy in some form nutrients organic matter water and we have different options as I said and so in the book we also then look at what's the value of what's added value of the waste in the city and we are doing resource management and recovery and this is just a case of where we where there's a lot of contamination of wetlands in the city and if we start to do different and it's really depending on wastewater not being treated left out there so if we start to collect for example harvest the with the material we get out the biosolids we have a fertilizer it could be combined maybe with urine separation so and then we could have a lot of good benefits water saving we have more sustainable fertilizers reduction of CO2 emissions etc so then we go into the other dimension of sustainability at the institutional social aspects of course what are actually the enabling environment is really important to know what you want to do in the planning but what we thought is important if you really want to do resource management and resource recovery we have to understand also that there are new user group and new spheres of actors that we don't have in sanitation normally or in wastewater management so we have a user group that is the common one but then we have someone doing the treatment we have somebody doing the reuse and then we have consumers buying these products once again so we need actually to consider this as a whole new governance institutional setup that we require and of course trust between these groups in a really small scale in a rural village this could happen in one household of course but when we are talking about urban areas for example then of course we have the health part we dive into some strategies there multi barrier approach recommended by the WHO that you need integrated wash also that you have to really identify where in the system you have critical issues because it will not just as I said with a different use what I call it actors when you want resource recovery it will also be in this case we will have more potential risk points in the system so one tool that could be used and is discussed is the sanitation safety planning was launched last year I guess we have the environmental dimension protecting but also enhancing we can combine wastewater treatment with natural treatment system and provide new ecosystem services for example technical functionality I think I have been into that a little bit the important is that we also think of sustained functions when we design and operate and design the operation maintenance for example when it comes to treatment options we all have to think that now if we are going to review and recover different streams there might be in some cases we don't if we want to reuse for example wastewater as irrigation we have to look at pathogens micro pollutants we are going to reuse as a drinking water then we have to maybe get rid of organic material as well so depending on what we want to have out of the resource and then we are looking a bit about the financial models the importance of cost benefit analysis the World Bank has done a great job looking at the MDGs and also started to look at the SDGs when it comes to what will it cost look at some of the benefit and costs showing that actually doing sanitation improves sanitation will generate economic benefits but then what is still to be do is to actually look at this from a resource management point of view as well and see how this could even provide even more arguments for sanitation and wastewater management and at the end of the book we are showcasing good examples of resource recovery from small scale to larger scale in different areas examples from Sweden for example is black water recycling Bolivia we have more of urine diverting dry toilets and a project in Brazil we have two cases one on grey water recycling another one on reuse of sewage sludge from Namibia we have the reclamation wastewater reclamation to groundwater recharge and recycling for drinking water etc I have to stop now but the idea was to give you some glimpses of our new book that we are launching on Monday 5.45 in SCI booth on the top floor I think in the water week venue and there is the book will be available for downloads so go ahead and share and I hope it's going to be useful for different communities and different actors and also for this discussion that Roland talks about how do we define these terms thank you I saw among the authors as well Elizabeth Kwanström and she's as well in the author group together with Roland so I think she can as well really bring the broader picture as well into the third process of the background document one or two comments while Daniela Kral is getting ready please sorry my name is Chad Brooken from Free Flow Consulting one comment I have is that I'm noticing a lot of focus on energy production and I think that our focus should really be on food production if we're ingesting food in our bodies and it's we're creating waste from it there's a byproduct of course of biogas but do you feel that the industry or the temperature in the industry is more toward energy and more toward food production that is a good point from our perspective we haven't put more emphasis on energy actually we think the food production part is as important or even more important but I guess as you say maybe if you look at the wastewater sector and the industry it is easier for them to start to produce energy from their wastewater treatment plants but to start to reuse then you need to convince the farmers that you have a clean product etc so of course there's a lot more barriers to get to that so I guess that maybe we should therefore we should also emphasize it even more but we see it as energy is important but as well as there's still no energy security you can say so yeah maybe you have to eat first you need energy to eat maybe okay yeah now I just want to emphasize what Jet was saying you know we have made major mistakes in the very fast the past about introducing a linear sanitation system and which we are dealing with the problems today from my practical background it's indeed very easy to talk to industries who have the resources to turn also sanitation resources into energy because that is what I get the profit from and I think that Susanna would basically to call that more into nutrition and food production because I mean the whole issue of phosphorus has shown that this is going to be the major issue in the next century thanks I just want to comment I think there is a climate change I guess that motivates to do more renewable energy and I guess one problem is maybe that energy has become an ad hoc to the wastewater treatment plants already there but I think if you in many cases you will start a little bit more from the scratch and if you have energies as one of the possible resources that you could reuse I don't think that has to be trade-offs with food production but I think it should be on the table when you discuss what's the potential solutions and what do you want to achieve in your specific case last and yes thank you but also very ad hoc Williams from Water 8 also very related to that I think discussion or I think it shouldn't really be which is more important or more urgent right now because I see both of them equally important but I just give a classical example of why for example I personally would be very interested in energy a country like Nigeria that it's huge in terms of population as far as the African continent is concerned but that's a country that is grappling with energy challenges and I can just imagine you know and we all recognize how much energy can just be a catalyst for in the entire development process for that country so it really needs to be taken in context where we're promoting what because some countries just need and then there's a lot of food production that has been wasted because there's no energy to transform those you know food produce to something that the country and the people can continue to use in different basically what I'm trying to say is it shouldn't be a case of which is more important but more of in what context where is what needed the most here. I actually can support that with a case for example Ethiopia I mean in the countryside people are really burning everything they are so I mean it's really getting into an environmental issue getting the energy security in the households so if they can start to process and do anaerobic domestic and biogas production on a household level then they will still have some biosolids that can go back to the field so for example there's a lot of gains there so I think we shouldn't just say we should energy has to come long down the line I think it has to come up front as well and then we have to see in each case what are the most important aspect that we have to take into consideration. Thank you Kim. Yes and I think in the beginning there was a lot discussion in Suzan about food production then it was saying what actually are the different opportunities which are there now we as well see that look first for the highest opportunity and then design the sanitation system that you actually cater to the need of the resource that you might use so I think that's how the discussion develops here and in a broader sense put it in the center of all the STGs Kim and now I'm very happy to announce Daniela Kahl who will bring as well one aspect of the bigger picture we're sort of opening up at the moment the Suzan discussions on from MDG to STG floors yours. Thank you very much. Thank you Arne on behalf of FMZ the ministry I work for I would like to thank you for giving me the opportunity to talk about the ideas on what does it mean to bring the agenda 2030 working to implementation on a ministry level it's not the level you're working on but nevertheless it is very interesting I think for you because in the end it has a lot of impact to all the other stakeholders in the water and sanitation area and well as you have heard today from speakers we had here before water is a central element in the new agenda and it is mentioned in the text in several parts I think I should not go into detail how it's mentioned but as you see protection of the planet and its natural resources there is one point where water comes in the other is human rights to save drinking water and sanitation efficient use of water and energy these are the new outlines excuse me closer okay yes this is another slide comparable to the one you have seen today is what does it mean for the other STGs that water is in it but this is an exercise I think all the other people working for the other STGs are doing as well so you find presentation you know coming from health showing that without supporting health all the other STGs can't be met but here it is explicitly written what does it mean for example water in 15 is reduction of mainland cost pollution to the seas and so on this is more specific where the interlinkage between water and the other STGs are and the interlinkage is all sometimes meant as risks if you go too far to the one goal you will do well it's difficult for the other so it's a contrary goal some are synthesis so you can meet two goals at the same time as we have in water and sanitation sanitation and health here are some more important highlighted in STG3 good health we have a target addressing containment of water bone diseases reducing the infant mortality rate so if you don't address hygiene and toilets you won't reduce the infant mortality rate and it doesn't matter how much you do with good nutrition then sanitation is bottleneck so here maybe the most important highlighted where we have started to do more strategic work but the main topic of my presentation is the global water architecture that means the architecture of the UN institutions we think that one of the main problems in the past in the MDG area in the sanitation area was that the UN was not well positioned and we have started an initiative among some countries on a ministry level doing some analysis and creating a new vision and ideas where the UN system could go to the analysis shows that the global water governance structure in the UN system is highly fragmented with single issued perspectives and in contrast to other STGs there is no dedicated UN intergovernmental body so the high political leaders can't have a voice on water in the UN there is currently very little regular dialogue between major groups and governments on water aspects and the new mindset of the STGs is not reflected that there is where the other stakeholders come in and there is currently no counterpart for intergovernmental bodies of other sectors let's say for health for food security for agriculture they have quite important and well working intergovernmental bodies but there is no talk on an equal level to water because there is no intergovernmental body so water is one of the major risk factors in the years to come and therefore there is a need for such a body so far the analysis and if you try to bring it to a picture but I was criticized by showing this picture because one of the audience said he had counted the little signs in the middle there is just 31 but there are nearly 50 different UN bodies with water so it's not enough there should be more so what does it show? there are a lot of organizations programs working in the field of water with impact to water and they have more or less well established reporting line to the high level how do you say the HLPF and they have more or less defined way to Ecosoc and this is all well organized to the general assembly where comes water in? in the UN we have something that is called UN water it's just a technical organization member states are not member of UN water UN water is just a technical coordination of UN organizations so it's just there and the UN organizations are a member of UN water so they are a bit closer but it's a very weak technical coordination and it has no mandate to bring anything to the HLPF or to talk to member states but since the agenda 2030 was published two new high level panels were created the global high level panel on water and peace and the high level panel and water that was done this year in January and the World Bank and some governance these high level panels show that there is an increasing need for countries on a high political level to express their concerns but these high level panels do not belong to the UN and there are only a handful or two handful countries of member there so Germany is not member of one of them for example Swiss is but it's not really representative and it does not really help they do not any work and then we have the monitoring organizations so that's the way it is what would it mean to have a fit for purpose architecture the most important thing that the new body should be mandated by all UN member states so it should be mandated by the general assembly so there must be some countries to write a resolution that the mandate can be given this is up to the states stakeholders cannot write a resolution to the general assembly but it is important that the multi stakeholders and the networks are engaged in the new body so this has to be addressed in the resolution even though the multi stakeholders cannot write the resolution it's not meant to be the task and the functioning has to be described but there are paper work done already on that so the vision is quite clear what they should do then we have discussion on the role of UN water we have the Wenscup final report Wenscup recommends that this report is recommending that UN water should be strengthened so that it can be secretary for this new body but there is a lot of discussion right now going on and it will be discussed here on the water week for example on Monday on the high level panel on water architecture especially the role of UN water or the role of other UN bodies that is the main discussion the recent discussion right now should the new secretary be linked to existing UN bodies should with UN water be created a new UN body there are pros and cons and I would say if you link the secretary for the new body to one of the existing then the existing always comes from a special side it's not the holistic approach it can't cover the holistic approach and only a new body could be independent and cover the complete vision of the agenda but there are discussions going on so I leave it to the conference and it's not decided yet well maybe some last words to the integration of major groups and other stakeholders representation and participation of major groups have to be essential elements for intergovernmental body the whole agenda has been developed and adopted so it's fundamental in it it's the essence the participation of major groups will help stimulate and energize its work and give publicity to it and after all the states cannot do it alone implementation needs all actors to work together the private sector and the civil society and as long as we had the UNSCOP the UNSCOP was acting as the independent voice for all the border sectors but UNSCOP has finished it's work end of last year so it's not there anymore the final report we think is a good guideline how we should address the problems in a way that we can solve the challenges and I think the last thing maybe a sharing experience learning from each other is key for the successful implementation of the STGs so we have to be there in the UN at a very high level and bring all the different perspectives together I hope I'm still in time there are much more points but it's an ongoing open discussion that is what it's of most importance right now in the ministries so this is my insight I would like to share with you thank you thank you Daniela for giving us an insight on that level you showed the yes that one we can consider to put Susanna somewhere I'm not suggesting it but if people are saying there are not enough logos on it we always could offer one but more serious I invite some voices from the floor Roland and maybe others to comment please thanks very much I'm wondering are you also considering I mean we have UN organization health we have one on food we have one on many different issues I know we talked about in the last several times that it was defeated but I think maybe that's the moment did you are you talking about or is that basically the end result of the whole exercise and maybe another comment about UN water I think as long as UN water is just a coordinating agency we saw it in the development of the STG extremely weak because extremely weak because they always say we have to take care of all these 40 plus organizations and so they never came up with it well at the end they did come up with some position but it was basically not their own there was another voice I guess the question is it seems common sense that there shouldn't be this disconnect between water and wastewater it's in the name so why do all these water organizations do they not realize that wastewater is the resource and there is clean water and then we shit in it why are we shitting in our drinking water is another question I have well at the UN level that doesn't happen no but these organizations they are covering food, energy, health and not the difference between water and sanitation so this difference is not reflected on this level so the new body should cover the complete STG6 and the water related targets to the other STGs while we have maybe one or two more questions we can get the presentation of Kate ready? Yes? Yes but your question was is the you didn't finish really do you? You would like to have an answer the future of UN water? In this discussion is it also discussed about having a UN organization on water? Yes that is and well we are the thing is about mandating, resolution and finance and we have to bring together the finance of member states the finance the UN system has by its own then it is very different if you go on the resolution on the general assembly to address the general secretary or to address with the resolution directly an UN organization so these are the tricky question that follow directly after that I did not go into these details so we work on different alternatives which are realistic Okay thanks again Daniela Okay we had a glimpse on what could be the vision document too or whatever it is we had the book on SEI we had now the UN level and the architecture around it and Kate will enlighten us now about monitoring I always think that however it is something will come out and the question will be then how are you doing it on the ground and I don't know Kate what you will tell us what comes out or how are you doing on the ground what the floor is Thank you Is this working? Okay so that's actually kind of a nice segue because I've just come from the UN water meeting where all of this architecture was discussed and to quickly respond to your question there, as in the agency for health I can tell you we absolutely do look at water and wastewater together in fact we have health based guidelines for all parts of the water cycle on drinking water, on wastewater and recreational water and also the links to nutrition, to neglected tropical diseases it's kind of all there so we are very much trying to take an integrated look at this For those of you who don't know me, I'm Kate Medlikot and I'm the sanitation team leader at WHO I'm not part of the JMP team but I work alongside them with a focus on 6.3 together with Graham Alabaster who's here with you today and so we're going to go from this very kind of broad discussion we've just had about the monitoring architecture which is not just the monitoring architecture but the whole UN architecture around water I'm going to zoom in now on just a really specific piece of this which is a proposed methodology for monitoring target 6.2 and 6.3 and to really highlight that this is a draft and we've got a very long way to go, we're looking at building a monitoring instrument that will serve us for the next 15 years but also understanding that we've actually got some really short timeframes ahead of us, we need to get baseline reports out soon and that involves a lot of complicated things dealing with huge variability in data big data gaps and also the whole interact with countries so as the global monitoring instrument we of course are recipients of the data, we need to respect the processes and data availability in countries so with that in mind I just want to present to you some of the thinking that has been going on and with thanks especially to Andy Peale and Luca DiMario Barbara who presented this yesterday at the SFD meeting and Graham and I have been working on it as well so I think it was Roland that was saying several people have said that we can't separate out wastewater and sanitation and the approach taken for global monitoring is sort of respecting that idea as well so looking at this really in two parts the wastewater from households so building on the JMP and looking at wastewater from economic activities or industries so we'll talk about the two of those slightly separately but I just wanted to quickly step out how they, I don't think anybody here really needs a lesson in this year old sanitation practitioners so know it well but essentially we're looking at the combination of wastewater from households from industry the combined effect on water quality ambient water quality that is and recognizing that there are huge flows from agriculture but they're very difficult to monitor at source so really trying to pick up those in the monitoring of ambient water quality and of course if we're able to get these two indicators working together then we will have a nice metric on the on the sources of pollution and their combined impact on ambient water qualities and by extension drinking water quality so these are the two parts we'll talk about I think many people are very familiar with this now so I'm just going to be talking about 6.2 and 6.3 and these indicators which you probably also know and not 100% finalized yet but the the concrete is starting to set around them and hopefully by March we'll know for sure what the indicators will be but you'll see there's a new terminology safely managed sanitation and safely treated wastewater so I'll just skip to the sanitation part and what the definition of that means so this is an extension of the MDG period definition so we're talking about sanitation services that are not shared and where excreta is safely disposed in situ or transported and treated offsite which seems straightforward enough and still you start digging into it a little bit more so again I think we're all very familiar with the MDG sanitation ladders and this new run this safely managed sanitation is really proposed as a new run on the ladder so going it's not that we would stop monitoring basic sanitation or improved sanitation but looking at the proportion of those that have improved sanitation who actually have a safely managed sanitation service so essentially what we're talking about is monitoring the full sanitation chain which has been shown in other presentations and to make sure that we capture the specifics of the sewage and onsite systems from a global monitoring perspective of course the sewage is the easiest data to get at from utilities but I think we all know that the vast majority of sanitation is actually onsite so we need to kind of get our hands dirty a bit and try and capture this data on what's happening with onsite systems so what this is really kind of a back end tool to look at how you actually calculate this amount of safely managed sanitation and just a way of trying to organize the data in a way that kind of makes sense and makes sure we're capturing the complexity of what's going on so what you'll see here is the sanitation ladder as we know it open defecation unimproved sheared and then these other categories are on improved on and off site facilities and trying to see if we plug in the JMP data to the left side what percentages of that is really safely disposed in situ and how much is treated either at a people's large treatment plant or a wastewater treatment plant and that would give us a calculation of the proportion that's safely managed but I think we all know that unfortunately it's not quite that simple that there's losses along the sanitation chain and we'd like to progress eventually to be able to kind of capture these as well so understanding that a lot of what is emptied or goes into a sewer doesn't actually make it to treatment that there's again and then a lot of what is which goes into a toilet is actually not contained either sewers that are going to open drains for example I'll skip through that so here's just kind of an example versus from a country in Latin America we're just seeing what this might look like as we would go from the MDG period to the SDG period so on the far left there you can see that the JMP ladders this is actually for Peru where they have currently 74% improved sanitation when we transition to safely managed sanitation using you can visualize it using a SFD style approach which is one way of presenting this to see where the losses are but essentially the output would show you that just actually 30% in Peru is actually safely managed so this presents an enormous challenge a communication challenge as well as an implementation challenge for everybody in the sector I think we're seeing a lot of countries but frankly but shocked thinking they've done so well in the MDGs and going what we suddenly gone down from 4% to 30% others think well that's great the MDGs we'd sort of finished that work and we're happy to have a new challenge so there's a couple of ways of looking at this but what we can be sure of is there's a huge communication challenge around this for all of us about how we integrate this into our work how we explain it to our partners and what that means in the kind of implementation we're doing so I think the MDG approach of talking about improved sanitation sort of drove us not entirely but more towards infrastructure style projects how do we get more improved facilities out there when we talk about safely managed services I think it forces us to think about and much more about the kind of service delivery so it's a different mindset that we need to kind of get our head around and I think Roland I just caught the end of your presentation and you said oh there's no indicator for reuse and you know you're right there's no specific indicator for it but we're doing a little bit of thinking with some of the people in this group about definitions around treatment and what is safely treated because essentially from a data management perspective you kind of somehow that's safely treated that's not and it's a complicated thing to do so this is kind of a think piece that we're working on essentially looking at and this is for wastewater treatment there's a similar one for fecal sludge but essentially trying to think about that in terms of what is the level of treatment that's provided so that's the treated part of safely treated and then a public health dimension sort of saying well how fit for purpose is that treatment that's been given and looking at just some very simple exposure scenarios so for example the easy one here would be to say well if you've got primary treatment with a long ocean outfall you can probably call that safely managed if you've got primary treatment that's been used for food production then you wouldn't so it kind of gets this notion of reuse in there even though we don't have a specific indicator on it but again getting the data for this is really our challenge so essentially what we're trying to do is make sort of a simple graphical overview of the sources and sinks of unsafe wastewater water and sanitation and sort of building on what's become very commonly used now I think with this SFD kind of representation it's trying to be a little bit intervention neutral I don't think we want to be driving we don't want global monitoring to be driving investment in any specific technology but more to say well look here is the situation at a national level and it's blunt because it's national level of course and to drive a policy level discussion on allocation of resources and priorities it builds on the JMP data so at least at the start of the left hand side of the approach we have some statistically representative data as we go to the right hand side the data becomes a bit more shaky and I've covered that last point so I just wanted to cover the second part now and Graham you're very welcome to speak up or let me know if I'm getting this wrong but talking more about the industrial part of it because I think here is sanitation people we're quite comfortable with saying sanitation and wastewater are the same thing but there's other wastewater people who understandably want to to make sure these other components of wastewater are properly addressed so essentially the approach that we're looking at here is an inventory so capturing all of the inventory types trying to get a metric on the approximate size of the industry looking at where it's discharging to and it's hazard classification and finally whether it's in or out of compliance with its discharge permit so that part of the indicator would be a combination a proportion of hazardous effluent over the total hazardous effluent generated so we have two components of the of the safely treated wastewater indicator so I think that's all I have to say on that and I think there's probably lots of questions so maybe I'll open up for that if there's time Thanks very much Kate so I think we've got, I know we're running a bit late but this is such an interesting subject if there's any questions or comments you'd like to make try and be as brief as you can because we are a bit tight on time so so very quickly I'd like to make a link between Roland's presentation and your presentation I thought it was very interesting to see that now the goals are universal and now the goal is sustainability and if we keep the disposal as one of the options in the end then what do the developed countries have to do because on all the other steps they are good it's probably close to 100% yet the sanitation is not sustainable because in the end it always ends in a water body so I think the real goal is absolutely the reuse and as long as the loop is not closed then it's not sustainable I again saw the flush toilet as a symbol and I now start to be a little bit obnoxious about it and I think we should at least I mean drop the flush from the toilet because the symbol of household sanitation is a flush toilet and I think you're getting the wrong message across and you in the water has that and now see that you are using it again and now I'm getting a little bit and the other question is we had long discussions on shared toilet facilities and I see again that it's kind of a limbo and for many many people I mean that's the only option and I wonder I'm actually surprised that it again came up as a kind of not so good kind of thing one more comment well the segue is directly into mine is I appreciate that it's interact or intervention neutral and that the end goal is safely managed sanitation whether it's a shared or not shared toilet this the ladder sort of indicates that there's a progression where in fact you might have a very good safely managed shared option that we need to be recognizing do you want to respond to those no I can do that I mean they're all really good points I mean on the sustainability one unfortunately to some extent for richer countries how they interpret that indicator I think they can build a lot more nuance into safely managed and sustainable and I hope they do the flush toilet yes we will try to use this point taken absolutely shared is a much more complicated one and I think you're probably going to see the terminology for shared and transitioning to what's called a limited service and I think we're waiting to see a bit stronger evidence of some of those shared facilities with the safely managed service chain that's an interesting combination that hasn't really come through on the data yet but unfortunately the epidemiological studies for sharing are still pointing to that it's bad for health unfortunately so from a simple perspective of is this meeting criteria of preventing human contact with excretia that the epidemiology is not really supporting that shared provides that but we understand that there's a really really intense debate around this yeah okay continue or you add something hi this is Sarah Dickens from SCI I forgot to say that my last question I'm going to be starting some research looking at gender vulnerability related to wash and I was wondering how that is going to be monitored or how data will be collected to look at gender differentiated access okay a couple of other interventions I start here and then I come to you in a minute yeah something that I asked Barbara yesterday but how will you address the issues in monitoring for the remaining part of the service chain because that cannot be captured by household surveys something that we've discussed but I know what you're thinking of doing and what has happened in the POC countries that is what my interest is sure one more comment just a small comment to the shared I thought it was not a question about shared or not shared but shared by how many I think recent studies have shown that if it goes up to I think six families or I don't remember now or five yes five then it's okay so I think it's not shared or not shared but they have to differentiate it more yeah I'm but hesitant to get deeper into the shared one except to say that yes or no on the gender differentiated data so what the JMP is really looking to do now is thematic reports that capture some of these specific issues there's lots of things that the household surveys can't do very well like migrant populations like getting into gender disparities intra-household there's a number of things and they're trying to capture those a bit better in thematic reports but at its core the JMP uses household based data so that's the kind of the lowest level of disaggregation we can get and there's kind of the wealth quintile some things around age but you're probably not going to get the kind of granularity of gender disaggregated data you might be hoping for there in terms of your question Mira about the getting the data so there's there's kind of two ways of looking at this if we look at what we have to do in the next year then it's going to be a bit rough and really and whatever we can get frankly a big data drive just pulling in whatever we can and trying to get a sense of it for a baseline but over the longer term what we're doing already is testing new questions that can go into household surveys you're right you can't get the whole sanitation chain from households but you can get a bit of information about emptying and transport perhaps from households and so they would be looking at testing those and transitioning them into the large household surveys slowly over time and then linking that with better service provider data acquisition so for example IB net is looking at adding new questions that would pick up on the treatment that would be aligned with STG monitoring purposes but as always the big gap is how we get service providers for onsite services and we have some questionnaire tools we're working on with that and I think you've seen them and how we kind of start getting that done at scale I think is our big challenge I think we'll call it I know there's lots to discuss but I think in interest of time we have one more presentation and I think we should move on so if you've got any other questions come see Kate or myself afterwards so the final thank you very much Kate so the final presentation we've got this afternoon is about regional political processes you know the floor is yours that's the Twitter handle and the Facebook and Zendrainment so to be in communication and in touch just a sort of a snapshot and a quick view and an abstract view of what's happening in the Indian context with toilets so I think for the first time in India we've got the Prime Minister backing a sanitation right standing from the Red Fort on our independence day and the target set is phenomenal 110 million toilets to be built by October 2nd 2019 we're far ahead of the STG goals in terms of the toilet construction so 20 million toilets have been built in the last two years from August 15 to 2016 it's a phenomenal number you've got to get another 90 million toilets very quickly so to put it in perspective before India could not achieve the million MDGs in terms of sanitation it did not achieve the MDG target for sanitation but in terms of the STG at least in terms of toilet construction it set itself an ambitious target so this is what it says the government statistics and figures all government schools are now covered with toilets separate toilets for boys and girls about so many toilets built and in crushes which are for children between the age of 0 and 4 this is the kind of toilet construction that seems that's happened all this is sort of live and it's on the website of the ministry of drinking water and sanitation it's updated almost hourly the figures are updated hourly with the technology choice it's the pour flush squatting, twin pit toilet that's the technological choice and 110, 120 million toilets will be built which will be pour flush not UDT not the toilet challenge toilets not the twin pit toilet and I think at some point one of times Susanna has to come up with a specific recommendation of what it thinks about the twin leech pit toilet and what it thinks is sustainable or not sustainable about it and how will it go subsidy driven, completely subsidy driven there will be a CLTS model in the beginning to drive demand, generate demand and then there will be a subsidy that follows some states and India operates differently for each state some states have enhanced the subsidy also performance has been different for many states and that's it this is the toilet model unfortunately in many states only a single pit is being built the hope is that a twin pit will be added no evidence to show that people have built a second pit later on so it stays at a single pit some states are building twin pits and so that has its implications as you will all know the positive factor is that there is this huge political push behind it and the prime minister pushes the message it gets listened to right now with the new prime minister especially it's a great deal of advertisement drive communication in the mass media everywhere people are going there's a separate team sort of a third party inspection that's also going on by the ministry of rural development for the toilets national level monitors as they are called and they go and check and report on the progress being reported by the state governments there's been a huge amount of confusion there because the data's have not tallied with what's been reported on the ministry's website and when the national level monitors go and when the national level monitor goes in April and then it goes again in August there seems to be a mismatch between those figures too so a whole amount of reconcilation is happening because the numbers are huge corporate social responsibility funds are coming in companies have to devote 2% of their profits social responsibility and this year the balance money which was unspent by the large corporations was transferred to the government fund for toilet construction so that's what's happening there's a 1.5 billion dollar loan from the World Bank which is coming for the Swach Bharat the mission therefore the current budgetary provisions may not seem to be enough but it looks like it's going to be supplemented by the World Bank loan the challenges are of course the delivery of subsidy to the household huge bureaucratic delays usage as opposed to construction shows a figure of 50% so you can count the toilets but how do you count usage and that continuously remains a challenge how do you count usage drought last year was phenomenal was very profound it affected 360 million people and which means that if you have a poor flush toilet it looks like there's a huge implication on that there's no data or evidence to suggest what it is but anecdotal evidence and reports from various habitations have suggested that people have shifted back to OD because they do not have enough water to drink and that will be a continuous challenge as things go forward getting to twin pits from single pits emptying of pits and safe management of pit sludge manure remains to be addressed so that disposal system mechanism is still not in place what has to happen with it and of course the alternatives for flood affected areas hard rock terrain typical areas where the utility you think would work that's not been explored enough in large numbers to suggest that it's a good alternative and that will naturally come but what we will do what suspect is that we'll build the twin pit poor flush toilets we'll find that they don't work in the flood affected areas and then we'll replace them with other alternatives as things go forward so we are condemned to sub-optimality and therefore the thoughts that have been hearing is that we seem to be aiming for the ideal with the SDGs and with what we want as nutrient recovery but I think what people want first is access to toilets and then comes the reuse part and then comes the nutrient recovery part so in the hope of getting the ideal toilet to people do you deprive them of the first choice of accessing a safer sanitation rather than safe or completely safe sanitation that will be the issue that will be with us again the role of the informal sector all these toilets are being built by masons, by labor but not by formal companies not by formal businesses it's being done locally as local as you can get now they're simply not recognized in any format I think there are now some training human resource capacity building exercises but that's for more officials and implementers but those who are actually building they don't seem to be getting any help and this is the question that remains so when SEI puts up its framework and leaves out the legal framework you talk about institutions, social frameworks, technical frameworks but the legal framework is crucial in the Indian context because the key driver for sanitation is still the abolition of manual scavenging people going down manuals, people going down to pit toilets they're booming it manually so the question is even with the twin pit if we do not have a legal framework and a standard to say when is it shit and when is it manure we don't have a definition so far I haven't read any definition anywhere which suggests that when is it that you so is this a biological construct we talk about hookworms, protozoa or bacteria is it a social construct when you see human waste as shit and therefore untouchable because the untouchability in the cast comes from a social construct it doesn't come from a biological construct or a physical construct as to where it's arriving from how do we encompass all three because if we want to make nutrient recovery and application as manure unless we address these cultural, social, biological and physical aspects of human waste I don't think we'll be progressing very far I think that's all about I had to share Snapshot Thank you very much Yes I think we have the Indian chapter on the Susanna website I think that's important guidance help us that these things are thought there I had a feedback that every school has a toilet means every school has now a plan to have a toilet It's a completed toilet It's a completed one That's online hourly updated That's really great and good news Questions Comments please Is there a second mic we can move around? There's the second mic Thanks I'm really curious to follow up on your comment about that you think these toilets are going to be put in to place and then down the road go whoops we need to replace it My first training that I provided in India was in 2004 and I was toured around to all of these UNICEF constructed and other organizations constructed toilets were being used for other purposes and so to echo comments earlier about the 80s were the decade of water and now is this the decade of sanitation with the risk of exactly the same sort of things cycling through curious on your comments And what we might do to maybe the next two questions Kim Anderson My question is I visit one of these government projects in India it's interesting how these system are often built just next to to water wells in the villages I felt that there was no like understanding about the risk of I mean before the people went out to the field to defecate but actually now they're defecating in the village being flushed down the material and there they have to take their water just next to it actually they can create new health hazards if you don't have that notion and that understanding I think You comment? I think the sub-optimality question is what I think we're condemned to that I don't think we have the skill set or the speed because the targets demanded by the Prime Minister and by the government of India is driving us to count numbers irrespective of whatever happens so you're going to count that first and you're going to take it off and say okay this is got constructed and then you'll worry about how to retrofit it and how to make it cleaner but will there be money's available, will there be subsidies available for that that'll be a question mark the question of groundwater contamination 85% of India's rural population gets drinking water from groundwater and you're building twin pit toilets and especially in high water table areas it's a huge challenge Is anything being done about that? Nothing I think we could go on long but I would like to warn you that you have no gap after this session and we dive into the emergency session I think it's the appropriate title which will lead us into the coffee break we've added another 15 minutes delay and then you have a coffee break and then we'll talk about school sanitation so I would suggest that you take your questions until the coffee break at least but thanks again very much we have the thematic discussions and you're the one helping us with that yes I think the chair of the next session is Arno Kuever and it's Sanitation in Emergencies the floor is yours okay good afternoon everyone I think we can start okay my name is Arno Kuever, Maltese International and a member of German Wash Network sharing this session with Winnie Adam who also will co-chair this session on the emergency sanitation in emergencies which is quite a topic that got a lot of attention recent years and if we look at the issues that are at stake at the moment is that there is really a changing environment in which we have to work there are massive needs also in the Middle East there are different and other approaches to how to work and in the agenda of today we have tried to reflect that a little bit that there will be a kind of update or new innovative actions mentioned in this section on the outline of the compendium on sanitation and vehicles management in emergencies there will be a presentation on sanitation for millions also just showing more or less the magnitude of the issue at stake and then we will talk in detail on Susanna and the regional chapter in the Middle East and then Winnie will present a topic on sustainability assessment of productive sanitation a case study from South Darfur and in the end I will give a brief presentation on market based programming in the wash sector which is also a kind of new emerging sector so I would like to invite Tilo to start with a presentation on sanitation and vehicles management options in emergencies the outline of the compendium thank you thank you Arno and I think I'll be able to make up a little bit of time because I will be speaking with a quite short intervention I have to say that I'm speaking not on behalf of myself but on behalf of Robert Genschen our team who's leading on this from the German toilet organization side and Amy Jennings who's leading on this from the border side there's an initiative this is part of a project that we have financed by our Office of Germany to engage in wash in the humanitarian field this is part of the German national strategy making wash is one of their focal areas of intervention for humanitarian aid and this is part of their implementation of this strategy and a focal point of that is capacity building and knowledge sharing so in the predecessor project that we had there was basically a training course wash in emergencies that we're still carrying out in Germany and in different regions of the world and basically there was a by-product from this course because we compiled information on fecal sludge management in emergencies and it just turned up to be a product that was so great that the ministry then said well in the next phase you should please try to turn this into something greater and I guess it was found that no is always a difficult word there was very little sort of information on no I guess coherent up-to-date compilation of existing or emergency sanitation options for emergency settings and the existing publications that we have normally or to a very limited extent focus on the entire service chain so the idea now is to create an expert peer-reviewed overview of the existing options and also looking specifically at fecal sludge management options in emergencies covering the whole sanitation service chain so it's very doing this of course for the very different range of scenarios that you might have in different types of emergencies and so we approached EAVAC because the idea sort of formed that it would be very nice to basically have a counterpart to the compendium on sanitation systems and technologies for the emergency context so the next steps that have been undertaken is that an advisory board an advisory group has been assembled just the way that we've been embraced or this idea has been embraced by different actors really seems to show how much people feel that this is a piece of work that needs to be done there will be a kickoff meeting here in Stockholm which I think takes place in a room of people and we have 17 already but we'll fit and at the same time even if we have those sort of limitations do approach me if you feel that this is something that you would like to be engaged with also the first draft the goal right now is to present it at the FSM 4 in next February and we see who's been such a close and good sounding board for the piece of work that Eavak has done for the developmental context we feel it's essential to have and very useful to have Susanna play that critical role for this publication ideally if everything goes to plan we'll be able to launch this in a year's time so I think a very specific concrete piece of work that Susanna has a critical role to play in and that I think the working group that Arno, Jan Spitt and Stefan Simon those are the three, no who's this? AJ Paul from Weltunga he is the lead a critical piece of work that I think that working group will also be engaging with its members to work on now everyone's aware that the SSWM toolbox by SAVAS does a great job of delivering tools available online so the and Michael Kopak will speak in a second about sort of the work that we're doing together on this but the ideal scenario would be that later all these tools would then be made available by them also so them taking that work one step further thereby making it available online. The advisory group just to run a few names by we have people from the Red Cross ECHO different universities Quasulonatal we have UNESCO IHE, UNICEF we have the Global Wash Cluster Leads, Oxfam, ACF the list continues so it's a great thing I think that we're embarking on and like I said this is basically the hasn't really started yet this paper outside for anyone who's interested it outlines it there and yeah please do approach me or do approach the others I just mentioned looking forward to working with you on this. Thank you. Thank you very much for the presentation and I think it's a great thing that we have now a specific version for emergency from the compodium and if there is anybody have any question? Hi sorry right at the back I'm from Oxfam we're going to be talking about this in a few presentations time around market based programming but I think it would be very interesting to see when you're drafting this compendium how you potentially look at integrating market based programming and understanding local market systems when emergencies happen and how you integrate whatever sanitation service response with those systems as well instead of just looking at stand alone solutions Thank you Thank you for that question I think you'll find another flyer outside that's laying right next to this one that then talks about that specific session that we're doing and I think you'll find that many of the actors involved in this are also involved in that so I think the difficulty will be the challenge of juggling it in a way that it doesn't become so complex that the tool can later not really be used because there's oversight in using it but you're absolutely right I think Arna will speak about sort of the shift that's taking place in the humanitarian field that development actors should be aware of that has to do specifically with markets so like I said I'll leave it there because I think Michael will speak to sort of their role in this as well Any other question or we go to the next presenter Sanitation for Millions Access to Sanitation in Countries Facing Large Migration by Danila Yes I'm Danila I'm Danila in that Yes Danila is excusing herself she has another high level meeting and now we know what she's going to do but she asked me to jump in so I haven't seen the slides but I know the idea Yes sustainable wash services in the context of fight and migration, Sanitation for Millions it's actually taking out what the wish winners were saying you can discuss what's the ideal solution and go on discussing but there might be an urgent need and there's a need as well especially in the emergency context and the German Ministry is trying to go into that direction and to see that actually what can we do and that's actually the main idea around this and it picks on the human right to Sanitation it picks on the big need it picks on the international attention is shifting there's more conflicts and violence there are more refugees displaced people and there are as well many of those in the countries where the German Development Corporation is active often we have host communities which already have difficulties to provide services to the people which live there and then they might have double the inhabitants suddenly so to think about what could be the infrastructure they have is a no regret measure so let's start thinking about that and really bringing access to people basic services I think that's where we are going yes and that's that's why there's a conceptualization of a Sanitation for Millions program and it tends to start it has sort of the starting funds from the ministry and but it as well wants to show how it works and then invite others to join well it goes towards Sanitation Hygiene Promotion in Schools provision of public sanitation services sustainable sanitation management and then as well that mobilizing additional finance to really follow Vishwanath's advice act now and become better than it's a tricky thing because we are always saying that we shouldn't build something that actually contributes to the problem we should build something that is sustainable so it's exactly in that sort of in that area but yes we'll do an attempt yes I think I more or less set that sentence already so I think I know the idea the main objective of the program is to improve the water sanitation hygiene situation and also to improve the sustainability of the communities and the communities of refugees through improved sanitation facilities and the maintenance background is easy there because as German technical cooperation often works with utilities often works close to the ministries often works with host communities so to come from that point and then if there ever ever community has that's it it seems so thank you thank you Arne any questions or feedback I think the focus of the program having on something so I think the focus of the program on public places and schools is really I think a key thing because often in host communities that's where problems also are so I think that is a very good linkage between development and emergencies any questions or any feedback related to the presentation Maren from Borda, hi maybe just remark that it gives us a great mandate to not only work in the camps but also work in the host communities and I think this is a huge opportunity to expand services and get different ways to implement yes I think the humanitarian aid is not with the ministry of development cooperation but to improve the infrastructure in host communities so that's why this is the starting point okay I think we can cover some time any other further questions if not then we can move to the next presentation as currently one of the areas in the world where a lot of emergencies are going on and humanitarian work is the Middle East so we have a presentation now related to Susanna regional chapter Middle East on how Susanna can contribute in that context so Michael Kropak please Hello my name is Michael Kropak the microphone is working okay I'm from Cevas and I'm happy to be here with you Michael Tilo told us a bit about what he wants to do because I also can only tell you what we want to do or what we in the process of doing so I don't have any results so if you have questions fine but maybe I don't know the answer yet yes we all know that the Middle East is the most water scarce region in the world and this one is going now on for five years and we have by now nearly five million people which are displaced or refugees in different countries or internally in Syria so we have here a huge issue and a huge problem also when you talk about water and sanitation providing for those people in those countries now if you look at the Susanna partner map in the Middle East there are only three little dots so I think there is some room for improvement to actually do in this region because we need more capacities we need more people we need more local organizations here that can really tackle the problem and can bring actually the whole idea of sustainability into the field of sanitation and water management management so that's a bit the starting point what we want to do in our program the say was Middle East program we can say in the broad sense we have three things that we want to do or we are in the process of doing the one thing is really trainings in sustainable sanitation water management in regard to humanitarian crisis and the other one is what we really want to develop is an ecosystem of businesses of NGOs of new startups that are actually working in this field that can offer solutions to the government to other to the people to the host communities so we have there really a model that we can tackle the situation in this area now very important for us is what we really want to do is also to create a whole network of people of organizations that are working on the same issue and that's why we want to create the Susanna regional chapter for the Middle East maybe just a small word to the toolbox Tilo was mentioning what we are working on right now we are not inventing anything new what the toolbox really is is the compilation of existing material that is being written right now and put it online we are currently calling it sustainable sanitation water management toolbox for humanitarian crisis