The group's flagship news portal, it's JG.com, is open for all those who are the first to receive breaking news in that stream. The passing website not only caused the news, but caused beyond the obvious. In fact, the weekly news magazine for the group is the most widely read business magazine in the advertising trade, within the analysis of the new-based features of the HMAC website. The HMAC Plus is a market leader in reputage of the real estate industry. Today, HMAC is not only the leading publisher in the domain of more than 50 events spread across Mumbai, JG is making up thousands of information and not JG. Exchange for media has curated and launched some of the most successful IPs, including digital print, radio, mobile, OOH, and VR. The impact person of the year, exchange for media content, Indian digital marketing awards, Indian content marketing awards, Golden Mites, and now are some of the group's top-notch events and outtables curated especially for discerning clients. Exchange for media events attracts from lots of speakers along with a loyal audience comprising of leaders, trendsetters, and opinion makers. They are a profit-living platform in the entire media industry. No wonder extraordinary publications and events have decreed beauty and reach. Another destination of transparency, brand, and media professionals across the world. Exchange for media. Well, it's truly an honour to introduce you to our Chief Guest, Sri Uday Mahoorkar, Chief Information Commissioner of India. He'll be joining us later in the day. And, of course, our Chief Guest, Mahoorkar, is Sri Esravi, Chairman, TFCI, past Chairman, BSC, and managing partner, Ravi Rajanilco.  So value 360 and our whole partner, Sri, sell PR for their online support. If you enjoy this, I'm absolutely sure that you will. Make sure that you use your glitter handles and other social media platforms and spread the word out using the hashtag E4M English Journal Zone 40 under 40. And while I'm on the topic, I would also like to get your attention towards tomorrow's Samacha 40 under 40, happening right here in this venue. In the multi-purpose hall, the Chief Guest will be Sri Rajesh Patan, FTCM of UP. And, of course, we also have political spokespersons 50 under 50 happening as well tomorrow. So look out for that. With that, gentlemen, I'll not take any much more time. And we want to on stage Dr. Anwar Patra, Chairman and Editor-in-Chief Exchange for Media and VW Business World for the World Conference. If I get any questions, you can ask together. And welcome Dr. Patra. I just want to say that, you know, I'd like to welcome Mr. Radhich at the site who really doesn't need you. You've read his columns. You see him on news television every day. You see him on Twitter. He has an opinion and who asked for your point. And he is a journalist editor. You know, I remember, I remember many of his show. But during the Kaila election, I saw he went to the Kaila CN's home. And over lunch, he was doing it into, or he did an intro and then there were conversations over lunch. And so I went to Punjab with him. And you know, he was here in the, I think he was shooting maybe in the night, 10 a.m., 3 a.m. And he was there in Madhava. And he was talking to people there in terms of who they think would come to power in Punjab. So he's somebody who doesn't sit in studios and does journalism. He also has a thought on ground. And he's very passionate about journalism. So please give Mr. Rajeev sir the side. How do you find your friends? I can see he's into the other discipline. Every morning I get an update. I'm on his list. And really he is somebody who, after being in journalism for more than 25 years, still look forward to doing his job as a journalist, as an editor, as an anchor, as a columnist, as an editorial advisor. Even in the chain of landscape, from what it is in the chain of landscape, in the environment if you're operating, you know, what you are. I must say, he was also on a very important part of the duty and of the leadership in the 40s and 40s. And over the last 15 years, he's always been very kind to be able to be kind. And kind is the biggest asset that all of us have. And I'm going to give him a very big round of applause. You've been faced to face in this thing where this being streamed on exchangeformedia.com, so much more.  Clearly what he says today will be consumed by a large amount of people who are interested in this use and who are subscribed. Yeah, what? On any given day more than 80,000 people are interested in this. That's a lot of people. We do almost 12 million graphics in a month. That's again with the number one, the last 21. I just want to say why these awards. We are in the 14th nation of the state. We have brought class awards, which are in fact the real, the cheapest issue. We have brought class with the Prime Minister. He has been presided over by the Prime Minister Narayan Singh Ji, who is the deputy chairman of the LADES. Why another award? In fact, Mr. Sardar Jai, he was also the co-founder of CNI. Not just editor in chief of CNI, but he was a co-founder. So he understands business dynamics. He was saying that, you know, there's so much happening in digital impossibility. A digital only addition. And I want to say that I personally, very passionate about you. I do watch your videos every day.  I want you to know that if I'm doing better, I'm going to do news. I'm taking notes and texting people. I'm the news and that's how I am. And I know the role it is. Yes, as media, we can do a better job. That's the debate for another day. But we believe that there is going to be appreciated, maybe to be applauded. In a very tough environment, with very little resources sometimes, they do what they do very well. So it's a way for exchange for media to applaud them. Again, you'll see a journey for a journey process. Mr. Kumar has done a lot of the outreach since that time. We call him the new manager. And Mark, he gave me some of the news in the comments. Mr. Sunil Kumar is the president and my friend. And he has helped us really exceedingly over the last 10 years. We came up with the title of the Festival of News. So if you see the tagline, there is no Festival of News. And this is news next, which is coming up on Saturday. So from next year onward, we celebrate the week in which we do the Festival of News. So this is our first initiative for the Festival of News. Tomorrow, as Ravin said, in the monkey book, we celebrate the Festival of News. In the monkey book, we celebrate the Festival of News. My rhetoric speaks for the Festival of News. And today, out of the 48 winners are physically coming at 2 p.m. 2.25 hours per day. 4.30 or less before that, we get done. So clearly, today is the exchange for media. We celebrate the Festival of News. Tomorrow, we will launch another initiative that we conceptualized in late 2019. And I call, Mr. Sunil Kumar, one thing like I do with ideas. And I said, let's do this. And over the last two and a half years, we've been working on branching political groups. We have been working on the political groups yesterday to invite him, though he got the deal. And he's a very prominent person. He's a very interesting person. He's thrown down almost my head. I don't know his age, but he's very interesting. He's younger than me or I don't mind. He's three-four years old, younger than me. And he asked me, like, what is my energy? And I told him that I thought he was very good at energy. And I told him he's 4th on the list. And he's the only good like-good at energy. I called him, I didn't tell him. But he like-good at energy. Before I told him, I asked him, what would be your energy? And I put that courage to ask him that. And he said, what would be your energy? So I said, I should be number one on the list. And I said, okay, we will try harder. And I thought his number four was very good. And you'll see who the sum of four is. Come on over to me. And then he texted me in the night. He said, send me more tickets. And I said, I'll try and talk to him. But he knows that it's an honest strategy. So again, he said, and again, this year we've done the next team are 7 editors. So there's me and now we've done the 19th. Next year again, we'll bring in the editorial board and the jury. There are many people who are respected across both islands to add another layer of credibility. We do our jury processes honestly. Are they perfect? They're close to perfect. They're not perfect. Are they transparent in all this? 100%. Is this disease done on the road? We got it on camera because my friend is injured. Then someone called me and took my pressure on me. So I have to say to them that it was done in the jury. So I took my hands so that I don't have a road. There are some categories in the jury, which again, we look at the end. In our own honesty, we decide. But 95% are decided in the jury. It's not 90%. A couple of things we love. No in one category. So I just wanted to say that the festival news will also have a media debate, which this year we are doing in June. And I promise you that the media debate will be the best media debate ever happened on us. And how a debate should be. It has eight of the finest spokesperson, community makers, debaters from both. And again, there are, I don't know, again, there are three books he's monitoring. I met 21 plus years back, he was the executive director of the Indian broadcast. Six months into that, we go to the idea of office, I would sit there for two hours and he'll give me last media debate in person, small business economy, political economy issues. But with media debate, the shape of media will be the finest. I don't know, I promise you, it was a lot of effort. We were doing that almost this week. So, I believe he was a big role model. It builds the occasional pressure. It should build more pressure. So, digital is a big opportunity. I don't see what casting is growing. So the new assumption is growing. I remember in the invite, one of the jury members asked one of the English standards editor. The next news is 0.01% of the total I had the reading mechanism doesn't look as good as the previous news. The reading mechanism anyway has lots of issues. It's not the way we can move. And I think it's honestly about it. I think the reading mechanism can be much better. So we look forward to today's deliberations. It's the first year of the initiative and the only reason we're doing it is because in the invite period I didn't want to be my journalist nor did I see any less any media. It's very easily accessible. Well, I really want you to do the same at the period, but this being a very heavy wedding season, there's no money or none for the next 20 days. I also want to, before I sign off acknowledge what's a group because he is going to save the soil movement and I think he needs to be enter it. We don't have commercial deal, we don't have any commercial deal, I have never met him. I have of course, introduced him virtually but I just, when I spoke to him, his energy wrapped up for me and I believe what he is doing is something that we should take for the presence of individuals and as leaders. So, save the soil movement is a very important thing. And when you read about it, you read the papers that the foundation, we shut down the foundation and there is solutions for each country that we service through all of us. So, look at what save the soil movement is and support it on 8th or 9th, I'm not sure. For one of those days, the subgroup is addressing the COP in Europe, I don't know which city, but so, two logon box tax and again, there is a conversation with the subgroup that has been given at NBAS for a short while and sees all the journalists are there, even if five of them get influenced and decide to make that movement on their own, it will help our future generation, it will help us hopefully with the advances in medical music longer than ever. So, I don't want to state it to you and Mr. Aditya at the side, as Savit has already shared, Mr. Uday Mohakar, who is an editor, journalist, author he written many books and he has a certain ideology, but I think on a lot of issues is very valid, he is the chief information commissioner of India, he is the chief currency bearer 245, Mr. S Ravi, he is the general tourism FNAF operationary of India he is an immediate past president of the Bombay-Soviet state and an impact program he is our guest of honor and Mr. Sukumar Ananathan, editor-in-chief of India's time-times present, as I said 38 of them are coming, two are joining us virtually that tells you that journalists need it, they need it just at morning because really I feel when I started in, a lot of my friends said to me, I don't know too many politicians, why are we doing something for journalists and editors, what do we do? So, I think, as I said, journalists need more entertainment, more support, more acknowledgement of the book both they do. So, I rest here and I look forward to Mr. Aditya sir, does I always have something valuable to say, says it in this characteristic side, I look forward to address Mr. Aditya sir, please give Mr. Aditya sir a big round of applause. Thank you Dr. Batra once again, I would like to invite on stage Mr. Sukumar President to exchange for media to kindly say a few words before we bring Mr. Sir to the stage, if you can do the honors of putting Mr. Aditya sir to the stage. Good morning, thank you very much for joining us this morning, I'm sure several of you have had a usual day or evening and despite that you're here at this time of the day, really appreciate that you have worked late like some of us who go home at 6.30, you go to work at 6.30 some of you, so we understand that. Thank you for making the effort to come. Anuragya said what I had to say, all I can say is a few other things that you know we would be doing, it doesn't stop with the awards today, the idea behind 1440 is to showcase the new emerging talent in journalism in the country, both for Indian English, we said for 1440, this is for English, so you know what we will be doing is in the coming days we'll be featuring the work being done by young journalists, you know particularly something which is every country, which is you know, a new country to know, something which has made an impact and perhaps something which has brought about some social change, no matter how small, but has made a difference to society in a certain manner and no matter how local or digital or how small an area where it is work, but that's how journalism is right and what added up together to make a difference and as Anuragya said, it's part of you know, by the same for media, we are report on what's happening in media, so we realize that there's new kind of talent that industry needs employees have a point of view, they need to hire people, but our work is actually independent of the commercial or business institutions, our effort and mission if I can call it that is to bring forth the talent, we have done that with friends, we have done that with television in the past, but then there's a new generation of journalists who is emerging, so I just want to say that you know, we understand what they're doing and you see that there's a responsibility to bring that forward. With those words, I thank you once again and to continue to be connected with us on xintromedia.com, you can also get it on eforum.com, and any feedback, anything you'll think about the process, anything that we could have done better, please share it with us during the break that we have working in your lunch or just in the xintromedia, you need to share everything with that thing and supplies to that, so it's eforum.com So do write to him and you sure would see the response, maybe even better some action on that, so thanks very much and hope you're doing well. Ladies and gentlemen, it's time to invite our first keynote address and of course as Dr. Bhatra pointed out earlier, this is a last day, so this is an advisor, senior journalist, columnist, author and news presenter at India Today Group. If I dive into the introduction, I think I'll have to take half an hour extra for the whole context to be given, but to get it short, 26 years of journalism that has given India the right meaning of what journalism is all about, he has been instrumental in forming the CNI in parallel of course and has been the anchor of a primetime show that we all have grown up watching. So with that ladies and gentlemen, please put your hands together and welcome to the huge honor of our last deep service, I apologize. Thank you very much for the very kind introduction. Thank you for having me here, for Dr. Bhatra and the entire members of the exchange for media and most importantly all the young winners of the 40 under 40 awards, give yourselves a very big hand. Wonderful to see all of you there. Let me say at the very outset that I've seen even older than I am when addressing and gathering, which as I look back in time since it's 40 under 40, is what I would call the post-1983 generation. I'm presuming that almost all of you, if not all of you, are all born after the year 1983 and 1983 is a very special year, particularly for my generation. We turned 18 in 1983 and we watched India win the World Cup. That year a special event, I was lucky to be on the ground but most Indians watched it on the black and white TV which come down just as India looked like winning because it was a field for Rukavat which was a sound on good direction. But it was that India where all that we could see of a live critic match was a field for Rukavat and the entire country was watching Mohamed Rafi's songs during that Rukavat while India was winning the World Cup. So 1983 is a very special year because it is the year some of us turned 18 and some of you were not born. And to think that you are the ones who will now take the media forward while our time in a sense is over. You are the lucky generation, incredibly lucky. And I say that with a sense of pride and the fact that in a way you are the beneficiaries of what happened in 1991 with liberalisation that completely transformed this country in more ways than we would like to believe.  You can podcast, you can blog, you can be on internet, you can do mobile television, you can be on 24 hour TV, you can be newspapers, you can do all kinds of media communication in this digital world. I belong to the newspaper generation. Even if you ask me today what I would really like to do it would be to edit a newspaper. It's the one sort of gap in a way. I was a young editor at the Times of India in 1991-92 but to my mind, my favourite memories in many ways would be of the early days of newspaper and then the early days of television. But the world of newspapers was very different. That's why I called it KAL AADAR KAL taken from a Hindi film of course. But the KAL was a very different KAL. You won't imagine what life in a newspaper as late as 1988, the year I joined the newspaper was. We still brought out the newspaper manually.  The reason why many journalists got drunk and were alcoholics was because what hot metal could do to you. Particularly the 90 type operators and those who actually go into that hot metal room and put together a newspaper. But there was something about holding a newspaper the next morning that you had brought out the night before which I will never forget and I think privileged in a way to have been part of that newspaper generation. To also tell you just how difficult it was to report, I can only switch back to 1993. There was an earthquake in Lathur in Maharashtra about 200 kilometres away from Aurangabad and an Eka village called Kilali was flattened in that earthquake. I remember travelling there and there was no way that you could tell the story because every communication line had broken. There was one TELX machine that was operating in one corner of Aurangabad. But to go from Aurangabad to Kilali, see what you had come back and through a crackling TELX line that was breaking down and one phone line through which you could actually start dictating your report. Actually get it on air. Get into the next day's newspaper. It took us 10 days to convince this country that more than 10,000 people had died in Lathur. Today you can do it in 10 seconds. You just have to take a live view on your mobile and that app will enable anyone to update what happens in any part of the country. The world has come closer. Ukraine seems like it's our neighbourhood. In a manner that would have never happened even with the Gulf War in the early 1990s. In that sense, you have weapons. You heard of technology that enables you to in a way become warriors of news in a way that perhaps my generation did not have that opportunity. And I am just amazed with how all the young people, many of you in this room, are able to use technology. I mean you just seem to dive into it. I struggle with the typewriter. I remember going to cover South Africa's elections, the first elections of South Africa in the early 1990s just after apartheid. And the struggle was to make sure that my typewriter and written article was copy faxed. And once the hotel fax machine had broken and it was a nightmare to actually get the article across. 1990, doubling the Ratiyatra where I met for the first time someone called Narendra Modi. And I must say Narendra Modi even then was a step ahead of all of us because he knew what communication meant. So he was in charge of the media. Every evening he would make sure that wherever he was in Gujarat, the fax machine must be working properly. And the one thing I remember even then and I wrote it in my 24th book is that he was always wrestling, sparking, right? Whatever it is, now the colors have changed. And I keep saying, we will stay there and Modi will give us the fax machine I would love to it. And I believe journalists must remain what they are because journalists at the end of the day are the cockroaches in the system. The journalist is not the butterfly. And why the cockroach? Because, God forbid, tomorrow there's a nuclear explosion as Mr. Putin is now threatening the world with. Everything will go. The journalist has to be the next day to report the world's worst opening, okay? Nuclear war. Far too many of us want to be the butterflies in the system. When actually the reality is that journalists are the cockroaches. We should be the pesky people that people do not want to meet because that is how journalists build in a sense, I believe, their equity in a crowded market place. Otherwise, you might as well join PR. The difference between journalists and PR is that PR is people who want to become popular. PR is about popularity. Journalists are not for popularity context. Journalists are supposed to reveal and show people the mirror good, bad, and ugly. And therefore, I believe that remains an eternal philosophy of journalism whether it was 1988 when I was joined today in 2022 or 2022 when you are this privileged generation that can in a way have so many other ways of showing the darker side of what happens around us. Let me also say that while you are undoubtedly the lucky generation who has technology as a weapon to in a way send out your stories so swiftly in real time this is also the post-truth and the hyper-partisan generation. Today, WhatsApp is a weapon of mass destruction. It can in a way transmit news in a manner in real time that can destroy reputations, that can spread fake news, that can completely distort the agenda. And I do believe that there is a WhatsApp university out there used very effectively by our politicians including some of the spokespersons that Mr. Dr. Bhatra is going to reward and reward tomorrow. I would advise it to tell them that and don't use it to spread. It is our job, they will spread propaganda. It is our job to break through and cut through that propaganda and expose it for what it is. Therefore, I do believe that we have to be conscious of what a post-truth society can do. How it can damage reputation and more is worrying me for me. How it can divide communities. When you have journalists who will go on air and say that a temple is being raised as revenge for what is happening in Jahangir Kuli you don't deserve to be a journalist. You betray this profession. And you give politicians that an opportunity in a way to point fingers at us. And we are dividing communities.  And the sad truth is we do it night after night at different platforms in ways to mean which are unacceptable. This country deserves better. This is a terrifying country. It is the greatest country in the world to prove journalism. I came back from Oxford in 1988 with the idea of doing journalism in India because if you were in England, you would only report on the media. India every day is a new day. It is a magical country. If I look at just the kind of politicians who I met in 1988 and what I see today, you just get a range of diversity that no other country can. You learn to respect politicians also a lot. I mean, it's the most difficult profession in the world. And I think unless you are passionate about that news and unless you are passionate about news gathering and unless you recognize the responsibility that comes with being someone in the news business you might as well then do something else. The great joy of journalism was that it was not a nine to five job. The great joy of journalism was that every day is a new day and I hope it still is a new day. That you discover something. I was very privileged in one way that in the first office that I sat next to me was a wonderful man. I had a great editor also. I had a wonderful man for Mr. Lakshman. Wonderful profession. I have a lot of misgivings about Mr. Lakshman in other way but as a professional, wonderful. The best cartoonist in the ISC. Remarkable. And I often wonder how did Mr. Lakshman make those pocket cartoons day after day for 45 years? One day I asked him. And he said something which is a lifeless. Which is like jumping by that out. Oh yes sorry in English.  I do it with the enthusiasm that I am drawing that same crow for the first time that same common man for the first time. It is also a lifeless that such a book can be one story. I asked him what kind of thing is going on. He said every day I read. I want to get better while packing than I was the previous time. And maybe that is a lifeless for every young judge. You know you don't really ever arrive. I don't think you are only as good as one other editor told me as good as your last story. Or as your last interview. Or as your last you know edit page articles that you may have written. Or edited someone else's article or produced. And I believe producers are far more important than anchors in TV in particular. Because producers actually give time to their camera. But it is a producer who gives life. The greatest journalists are often producers at least in the TV business. So many young people need to recognize that you don't have to be in front of the camera. You can be behind the camera and be just as good. So let me know you know in a way as I said when I worry about the fact that there is this toxicity in the news that TRP pressures need to toxic debates on TV. News are being pushed to go viral. This is viral. Newspapers are under increasing revenue pressure. Yes, there is a pressure that converts newsrooms at times into sweatshops. Whether it is less times spent on mentoring and indeed less money for news gathering. I was very privileged in that sense that I had people who actually would go through that article that I used to send from South Africa in those directions and actually make connections virtually in every line. There was an old editor called Girek Mukherjee who was a master at how to put together an article. I don't know how many people do that today and how many people sit young people with them in a newsroom and convince them as to how do you get better. That would be a very important part. I was fortunate both at any TV with Kono and Radhika Roy who invested in young people. I hope many more to promote themselves but to mentor others. As I said, we know need to become the better man and if we did that, I think we would encourage another generation to become even better than us. Let me end though on a positive note. While the glass is easily half empty and we can keep being cynical about what we do with news the glass is half full. And it's half full because many of you represent a wonderful pool of talent that we have in this country that I'm sure will redefine the future. And I say this not just about English news but most specifically about Hindi and English news channels. I'm going to talk a little bit more about all the academician booths in the Bharat and Maharashtra. So we'll answer. I expect today matters far more than perhaps our English friends. As it will for most channels, perhaps matters much more than a telegram. And the world has changed. And thank God for that. In that sense, Modiji and I are on the same page. India had to change. It could not have remained in India where the English language elite which came from English language schools really only they knew what journalism was. Journalism has become more democratic. Newsrooms have to also become more democratic. And as I said, I pride myself, my friend Sunya is here on TV journalism and she had joined NETV a few months before me in 1994.  But sometimes revolutions my friend end up revolving there. I only hope that you won't let that happen to you. That you will continue to in a sense abide by a core sense of values about all this. As long as you can do that. I have no doubt that the future is very bright and the sheer power of innovation and intelligence that you bring into news gathering on a daily basis will have an important view of better India. That's what journalists should try to build a better India. It's not about PRP's frankly, it's not about how viral your video is. It's how you made that small difference building a better India. Thank you very much and I wish you all the very best and congratulations. Thank you. Two questions. I know we have way more alright. I thought it was the right one. Yes. 15 years ago this was titled from watchdog to laptop. You had mentioned 2-3 anecdotes in that article a black dog what will kept him on the right 2-3 anecdotes box of mangoes being delivered during Diwali, iPads all of those anecdotes. You only used to come to the business bureau at times. But I think the heart of the article was you said how the system wants to go up to you all the time and what the message that you sent in that article is you should in a sense maintain that distance. Like in all professions as you go up higher the challenge of not getting cooperate becomes even more difficult.  That's the nature of the of unfortunately and very fine bureaucrats most of them. I think the pressures are much greater the competition we are in a hyper competition right every Greek you are looking at PRP's and I keep saying I am not Shahrukh I don't have I shouldn't be making terrible films and say look I went 300 crores that's what Shahrukh can't do I didn't join journalism in the box office to be judged every week by on a flawed rating system by 21% higher and then we all say I am not Shahrukh I am Giza you didn't join journalism to become using the board you joined journalism because there was something wonderful about the profession I was a young intern in a place where I have to go dispatch in Korea in the mid-1980s a wonderful editor caught my rap he would sit on his typewriter and produce magic and he had to do the same outside noise and as he told me once if you have to take something from someone if a journalist has to take from a leader and this is the bombay school of journalism because Vinod Mehta also said this once completely take things which are consumable because it's consumable don't take things which at daily school of journalism unfortunately I thought it would be where the co-option is much greater because the stakes are high the bombay school of journalism I mean particularly in the 60s and 70s when some of the finest editors came from Bombay it was very different because you know Bombay had by the nature of the city and the ability to keep distance from the politicians the problem is you want access and this government knows this better than anyone access is power journalists should be telling the truth to power rather than worrying about access to power this is my belief so I think that it has changed the nature of this profession but it should be like Dev Anand by Dev Anand Dev Anand Romance, Kamini Kaushal and Romance, Tina Muneen the Hindi world has changed but Dev Anand has changed it may not have made him as he once told me as successful in the 90s, 90s, 90s but he was a great man and he was a great journalist he was a great man he was a great man Covid should have taught us that in the last few years who knows what the problem is and I say Hindi, songs, Hindi, Sapa, S1 who are we we should be how will I how will I go after that and this is for all the young people it's an impatient generation I see it with my kids you know every day is a new day 45 years a man did the same cartoon but with them wonderfully well there are two anxious who ladle you and then you take the conversation final question yes sir actually you've been inspiring all of us for like 20-30 years 30 years front page story I got in the Times of India was a very interesting one it was an after-event Times of India made long afternoons you know Subhameh, India you could go on loving pages so one afternoon my friend's idea was such an environment was batting so I went to my editor he wanted wonderful band India's first genuine environment to report and really he took an environment seriously and I said sir I have to take an afternoon off I wanted to go and see such an environment he said who is this such an environment I said sir he's 15 years old and he's playing for Bombay today he's breaking and he's for our club we have broken all the rules to get him to play I want to go and see him back he went to see him back so we came back and I said sir I want to write an article on such a dendurkar and I've seen the dawn of a new star he said okay write it you give it to the sports editor I said no sir it's a front page he said you want to put sports on the front page I look at it now because then now you know it's now even Alia and Rambina on the front page maybe they should be but I can't remember that he said I took one hour to convince him why such a dendurkar should be on the front page of the Times of India that gave him the extra time so that was the period in a way it was an age of innocence sorry that was my first front page that was my first front page by that I am so sorry I know can we ask him okay okay but Paati have answered my question please answer it's more like a thing as I said you've been inspiring the real thing was very inspiring but you know in times when you really try to report something you have to be in charge you have so much happening against you you just can't use your film how do you handle that as a contest what you are telling me is when are you retiring no I am saying how do I draw that when I talk to the lawyer and ask him all the solutions and all that can't you do something else why do you have to do this how do you handle it how do I enjoy the solutions and I do coping as well in times what should it be I mean across the board in town the great thing I am not being too nostalgic also I hope you could target Amal Thakri you could question are you going to question Amal Thakri when I remember when he is signings the Daghava credit page or you could sort of question Mr Pawar on alleged corruption he still met you in fact Thakri would then share a warm beer with you I think they respected you more I believe today journalists are respected much less feared more and that's tragic not because of only the fault of the politicians we have also feared that's why I said if you remain a cockroach none of this should worry it will continue to be a sedition it will continue to be I used to say until I get a notice I don't believe I am going to write it somebody should note it you see the worst thing a journalist forget about it the worst thing a journalist can have is the indifference I enjoy it when people troll me that means I am getting under that skin otherwise if you are a routine journalist you have to get under that skin who the hell are they they have everything going for them as neta's the least that we can do is show them the mirror that's the only USP that I have and I will do it you can abuse me you can do it that's why I told my daughter you don't really so she now lives a corporate life she said just make sure that you don't get into trouble so I try to stay out of trouble but I am reaching the same way maybe better to retire so maybe go up nice beach class of phoenix siesta and maybe next year alura is threatening to have a news festival in goa I will be very happy to host all of you in goa nice place not in summer come in the winter and we will start I know he is running late but he is too young people want to ask questions so I will go do that but it's very short tell us your name actually he is trying to do it are the last product I am Rahul Singh I am student of denerjah sir I am going to start my career in journalism sir I wanted to know how to maintain my integrity if my boss wants to compromise for TRP I have a very short question sir I have a question sir I have a question sir I have a question sir I have a question sir I have a question I don't have an answer sir I have a question sir I have a question sir I was very privileged as I said to work with people who have never told me what maybe today's editors may tell their report we didn't have any idea I am saying from the minister how I want to be like baba adham but sometimes baba adham comes honestly we were editing for 2 hours we used to talk about the world except TRP even on NDTV I don't think in all the years we ever talk and you can ask the people who I work with that CNN idea not once did I ever tell them I want TRP if any CNN idea comes and tells you an idea and says I want TRP so look it's up to the editor and as a journalist young journalist it's very difficult to say I don't know but if you do it it will be good and I think that editor will respect you more because that editor if he is a good editor he will also realize what you are going through so I would say I don't want to do this I want to do a good story it's possible it is a balance you can do both and eventually if every other parameter is aligned a good story will also give you the reason so I mean it's not theoretical but it's true as long as the ratings are fair let's put that this way I wrote a column 14 years back but I am not publishing it till in the second May some of my colleagues so ratings have a lot to improve I will leave it at that but read it on the second May so please give Rajiv a big round of applause Rajiv gave me five but I really want to say that you know we had Sonya I personally called her and some of my friends on the other side of the quality spectrum said oh but it's an aciduria so I just listened to them and we continued with our work so you know I think the environment has changed but I genuinely respect Rajiv I am not saying he knows it and I remember one day I was going to and one of my journalists in business world had published something that's the only that Rajiv said to me something at 11.30 he was going out and I was calling you at 7 am in the morning I wouldn't go into what you said what it was but we will leave it at that but you know I have always respected Rajiv for what he does and he is a reporter he is a journalist that he gets excited about a story when he is doing an interview in the story for the first time so please give Rajiv a big round of applause sir I can request you to stay in the stage for just one more second and Naseer I will be driving on the editor at exchange for medium friendly help us to a gratitude to the gentleman for being here with us that might be the bottle that you can consume it's coffee it's coffee it's consumable but it's coffee and I am not a big supporter of the coffee but the coffee is good thank you so much ladies and gentlemen that's it sir ok so that was a keynote to begin the day with and if any of you in the room are wondering what sir Rajiv sir said to Dr. Patra that is not how to grow your hair in a week so that was not really right moving on to our first fireside chat that we have for you and I would like to introduce you to of course Naseer Agri Rahman editor at exchange for media who will be joined by Sonia Singh Editorial Director at NTTV as Naseer already pointed out for nearly 30 years they have worked together and she has interviewed anybody that you can name be it Lailama, be it Malana be it Hillary Clinton or any other name that you can think I am sure there is a tick mark in front of it so ladies and gentlemen she won an ENBA 2015 award for Editor-in-Chief of the Year and also a prominent invite to NTTV board please put your hands together and welcome Sonia Singh on the dais along with Naseer Agri Rahman ladies and gentlemen meeting at 12 it's just endless to dwell so you will have to give us 10 more minutes so I will keep it very crisp so Sonia my pleasure and I can't skip that line it's a privilege to be sitting with you today you have been in this industry for almost 30 years first question that I would want to ask you is how have you been exchanged for us in the last 10 to 3 years and do you believe that there is a lot of polarization and disinformation around this now Thanks Nazia and thanks Tanarag I just wanted to create a bit of the introduction because this year is 30 years in journalism for me so that's fantastic it's a big order and I think the biggest achievement if I look back was of course the interviews or the stories I did because I started as a journalist but the fact that I think that was the first human editor of a major TV channel and I think that was a major class ceiling which I broke and I'm very happy that that is something which I think young journalists should be most proud of today that I think journalism is the only profession which is very gender neutral in the terms of if you are good enough you will make it to the top you can be editor the sky you can vary the limit and more so as an editor because that really to me is the key component because as an editor it is your job to make sure that you represent the editorial values of the group you are editor of so I think what has made me proudest in the last say 10-15 years is that NDTV has stood apart I often don't like to use the words brand or I don't like to use the word profession because for me journalism has always been a fashion and I believe all young journalists you cannot get to journalism because you think you are going to make good money or you are going to have a good life because you are going to have either of that and if a young person ever comes to me and says I want to get an anchor just if you probably won't get the job because anchoring is for us I wouldn't say the lowest rank but not what you should be as a journalist first you should be a journalist you can be a journalist on the newsdeck you can be a journalist on the news producers are very happy that these are what actually looked at producers, directors, graphic designers because I believe there are journalists who are telling the story so I think as editor what is key is that NDTV created I wouldn't say created I think NDTV is the flag bearer of journalism which sadly is extremely wearable I think a young journalist asked Ranjit what happens if I don't want to do a story for the artist I mean I don't know how many of you know it but NDTV actually exists in real we don't even though it's a decision which would cost us for the advertisers right now cost us cause and revenue NDTV said we don't believe in ratings we don't think journalism should be measured by what PRPs are and we think PRPs are bad so we've exited so if you don't want to do PRP journalism you'll apply to it and I think they'll just coming back to the question in the context of that I think a large I mean I decided to ask the room when did we ever before the last 10 to 7 years have you seen so many Moolanas and Malwees and Sadhus on panther television why would you ever interview Moolana or what he feels on anything to do with news you may want to interview him with your religious channel or you may want to interview Sadhu with your some Sadhu TV or a public TV want to Sadhu or a Moolana or obviously to be colonized we know what their views are where the people who you look up to where the inspiration goes that's what I hope that NDTV stands for we believe in people who make news and whatever that may be maybe a politician, maybe a sports person maybe a business icon maybe as I said somebody who's led a movement to talk that's the news maker so you agree that there's a lot of polarization and misinformation around these things I think it's horrifying in fact for the first time I don't know if I know but last week the INV did a speech interview and I actually said to Indian news channels that you can't that the news you're reporting is actually angering our friendly countries because I mean I really want to call it news but it's gone so crazy and you just look at the list of it of the Ukraine completely made up stuff for any journalist it's the biggest insight when the government is your watchdog when and how do you think this deterioration happened I mean it's easy to blame it on PRP but I don't think that's the only fact PRPs have been there for a long time I think that's one of the factors I don't think it's only on PRPs but I think often it was perhaps if you look back at the industry then you had very few TV channels then you had other channels break away which is good but I think they realized that then to catch up you had to create a democracy so first the democracy was used then the democracy came over so what is the next democracy then you looked at Acha May and then when new governments came to power it came about the very same people who would be running out of one group and power and now shifting to the next so then it came about you know we keep saying at least that journalism is the voice of the voiceless but sadly journalism has become the voice of the past and that's happening much more in TV news that's a very dangerous thing and I hope I mean I was actually very very happy being on this TV because you saw so many dumb right journalists who are fighting against that people who have read down television journalism is not journalists I think really it's often been management and corporate influences which have really read down journalism and what everyone has to fight against so because I know there are shortened time I just asked two more questions one how at NDVP do you tap into the situation what kind of training are you giving to young journalists how do you or here we have a lot of young journalists you know how do you tell them to be truthful stick to fact who judges the journalism and yet you know be smart or you know just how do you manage your way you know that you don't have a solution case against you next morning you're not struggling then you know many journalists studios are at stake right now because you know they're trying to report things that we have many solution cases against us thousand cases are reported as a little dark media station so you're a big group like you can fight it you know you can it's not a big group or small group it's a very hard thing to fight in the process I mean we all know what it's like it's not easy but it is something I think you have to as a journalist it's not an easy job so you have to believe that you have resolved in court so you have to believe that there's still the biggest democracy in the world that times may sit out for now but things will change and we can see that you see the next sharp election is there forever or no viewpoint is there forever I think for young journalists I would say it is just that you tell the truth you report what you see and I think if you're reporting what you're seeing you automatically find that you don't have to make up the kind of stories you see on your life every day there's some dark strategy every day so the yatra is happening because the yatra is the power to create some kind of this harmony you have to just realize that at the end of the day news is what matters if you focus on that thing you have to get a diverted by other things and I think that's one of the reasons that in this 40 under 40 you see that any entity be young do you think as MIB or IDF are doing enough to tackle this issue and give more confidence to young journalists see I think it's not really it's that we don't want the ministries of governments interfering the industry body we have an industry body also we do have an ethics issue which comes to them but I think if it becomes an everyday issue they can't even be complete if it comes out of an editorial policy they can't be complete actually the power lies in the hands of the viewers the viewers you should find with start projecting just a few years ago when people weren't trusting what the television used do you think it has changed because I started trusting again I think what's happening is it's going to differentiate them so as I said when you ask about the entity texting ratings how do we do that because we believe that advertisers feel that people watch us for dust and they come for us so that's something you can't put a rating on isn't it true that there's also too much polarization that if you vote for a particular party you want to work for another political party watch another political channel exchange of news articles are happening on whatsapp this is the view so if you're saying that only people who work for us watch entity TV I'm not sure that's a valid rule but that's the claim that people who do not watch entity TV make but then you have very few viewers and I'm going to show you a youtube video now it should affect that but how do you tackle this kind of polarization and I watch entity TV I think of it actually believing that at the end of the day your journalism will be out even if it's made rumors I can tell you the vtp social media is very closely and I think if you often would see also the most offices whether this is the government or airports or whatever even cafe, coffee day or even other business you'll find the talents in vtp so I don't think that just youtube is one great way to see what people are watching so I often cite this that I usually choose one of our most popular journalists I would say the channel most popular journalist his TRPs used to be zero and we just we all know that his TRPs are not zero because on youtube his views are millions but we have come into this stage slightly that we just believe so the same thing we talk about polarization I absolutely don't believe that people watch entity TV or only believe in one I mean this is how we see even debating so that's that affect you if you debate any more so the same thing on polarization you can repeat a hundred times that these people hate each other that is the sad reality of what they are these days well again I wouldn't generalize but only entity TV does that of course many other and this thing would do so you can choose what to watch you can choose whether I should put on next channel or wide channel and that choice is in every Indian channel what I am trying to say is that why do we have to choose this channel I mean why can't we have most channels talking the same thing I mean why do we have such extreme views or extreme point of views on different channels well I think that is a debate it's also going to a freedom of speech issue because we are free to broadcast if it doesn't violate the Indian law what you want the point is of course that we can't actually read thoughts at least that if you does violate it that people will step in and say X TV say something and not make a way with it but I think that the more people speak out against this I mean it's a shamsi narko but the more people speak out against this I think it will definitely change but I would I mean again use this platform I use every platform and every TV journalist should make sure that they don't forget about making India better India don't make India worse India and I think that is very important that you may be just going to photo what your P2C says happens and you need to be true to your conscience for that and just again tell people that I mean you know if you think that this is I want to get a TV so I don't anyway possible when you go to other organization and see that you come from X channel or Y channel you are going to have many people thinking whether to take you seriously or not so it's not just getting into television in any way possible you have to be very careful what you tweet what you say and what you report because it matters extremely a lot so I just briefly ask you one last question so there was this EIB fact check which was gone do you think it has helped or do you think it has been counterproductive that's the last question I am not asking your question well the BIV fact check is our case we fact check the fact checks and we got back see in journalism everyone make a mistake I am not saying of course TV also make mistakes hopefully learn from our mistakes everyone make a mistake the point is I am making a mistake I am not going to forward a particular agenda whether it be common or whether it be political that's the issue are you an honest journalist or not you can never find anyone telling you to make a mistake so fact checks are welcome everywhere by PID we see so many people on Twitter doing fact checks if they are right good for them and hopefully any organization of any credibility will be able to at their own fact checking if they can get it all so often thank you Sonia I think I finished it exactly because I have been sent this I have been sent that it has to be finished in 15 minutes so you want to make more questions you have time should we ask somebody in the audience just one since you all are absolutely excited about the questions yes just one thank you yeah I am not moving from Indian Institute of Arts Communication my question is this that in today's world post-truth is this rapid and every individual can disseminate their own post-truth and at times those individual or those youtube channels can be more popular in the mainstream media or print pages internet stuff like that so what options do we have at the end of the day if these trends follow will there be any condition in which post-truth will subjugate the real truth that is mostly disseminated by the authentic media no I don't think so at all because I mean as I said that we in fact have seen our viewership whether it's on youtube and we don't have fees anymore about but we have seen our digital viewership and our television viewership work a lot so I don't think at all and I think most of the names you mentioned where is it there is often competition but I don't think these youtube channels where post-truth and post-truth eventually what will be your long game your individual credibility so you know some people will say look at this do it for now and no one will look at it and let it disappear so you need to build on your credibility along with your CD and even the organizations you look for are organizations which you respect don't simply don't answer you yourself respect which you would read for information are the organizations that you should look at we have had a lot thank you and so your time is so so so let's take for being here with us and I would also like to thank Seji for inviting me I actually try to make sure that I give Rastika and Sonia a couple of years off their age but thank you no this is an MTV reunion for girls victim as well so at least Seji created the TV and now the digital industry as well thank you thank you thank you thank you I want to ask you a question what are the solutions for the the world around and you the man out there who asked the question look at the left look at the right and you absolutely and that sentence is always going to be the most honest one so it's the perspective and the truth is always going to be so I think that kind of I just want to add it but this we'd like to move on to our next segment and this is a panel discussion that we truly are all excited about we'll dive into the first final discussion that is moderated by Mr. Uday Pratap Singh associate editor at News X ITV Network and the panel includes Nandini Nayo Deputy Editor at Open Magazine Ms. Preeti Chaudhary Senior Editor of India Today TV sadly we do not have a colleague who is well you Ms. Neha Khanna I can second your editor of India I have used who is joining the panel along with of course Uday Pratap Singh as associate I'm sorry Assistant Editor of News X ITV Network so that's your panel request you all to kindly join us on the diaries and I'm sure all of you know what to do when we're inviting the people on the diaries to come and talk about what is coming Uday Pratap Singh you have a review on media Uday Pratap Singh Welcome to our review and thank you for being with us today and thank you to to be here and to to to moderate this panel It's quite interesting that you see all of them normally asking the questions, but today they will be answering the questions. And very interestingly, of course, the team has also chosen provocative topics to engage with, of course, the media to ask them some of the questions that the viewers and audience debate about or talk about after watching their programs or reading their articles, and we're going to have them answer on some of those questions today. So the topic, of course, that has been chosen for this panel is lack of trust in news TV, reality or hyperbole. And hyperbole, of course, you don't know the exact meaning and exaggeration. So let me begin with the editor for the opening comments on the issue of TV. You're not on news TV. Let's see, we like for a sort of opinion as someone probably likes to use TV, but on whether you believe there is a lack of trust in news television. I've been in print for 15 years. And by the topic of trust in news TV, reality or hyperbole, I think exaggeration, I don't think it's fair to paint everyone with paintbrush. And I think this panel was mentioned. There are all sorts of journalists. There are all sorts of course that different editors have. And I think finally it comes down to the individual story and the individual report. I feel, again, 15 years ago as a journalist, I would be like, oh, that's cool profession. But now we meet people and they make every bathroom. It's like that's often a reaction that you get. And I'm kind of like, something has changed. Something has changed in the last decade. And that is worried because I think now there is a bit of suspicion towards us. And I wonder why that's the case. And so obviously something has gone wrong. But I still feel that I get upset when everyone hates it. All the journalists are the same. I don't think that's true of any profession.  You can't say all the journalists. Certain things need to be done for that. But I think the views panel mentioned it very well. Finally, it's integrity and trust that will distinguish people from the other. Let me repeat what you've told me. Senior editor in India today. For her opening comments on of course the topic, it's fair to say there is a lack of trust in news television. And it's over. Well, you know, I'd like to believe and share what Nandini had to say when she says, you know, that she might really believe that there is this lack of trust in news television. And it's very nice to hear. But you know, Nandini, if I would be a part of news television, I actually feel as a collector, not as a journalist, I think we're facing the worst credibility crisis. I haven't seen what's happened earlier.  Because I always wanted to be a journalist. And there was a sense of credibility that was always attached to the fact that I would be a part of news television. You know, and somebody who would be so often by tomorrow. And these are just personal attitudes that I'm leading you. But there is that, you know, when you're out there, I don't think that you're in the back of the audience or you're in the deep. The fact is, there is a fair amount of content that a television is looked at. And the sad part is that the ones who are trying to do right by their job are constantly fighting against the domain of content. That stands, sadly, not just from the people who are watching us, but from our own credibility, from those who are actively fighting. That's what I think. Okay. Well, we will get to the reason for that. If you go first to Nia, Nia, you believe this is a reality or a hypo goal, that there is a lack of trust in news television. All right. First of all, thank you. First of all, it's a pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me. I am very proud to be on stage. To come to your question, you know, I am a member of this community. I'm very proud to be on stage. But I have to say this to you with a great degree of discomfort and uneasiness, even if I'm struggling with it. I think lack of trust in television news and the crisis of credibility as you pointed out is our biggest reality today, whether we like it or not. I think the time has come for us to shed our ostrich mentality, get our heads out of the sand and recognize the ground reality for what they are. As Nandini, that you pointed out, and I can vouch for this, having been in the industry for 18 years, when I started out and I started my career at MBT, I was there for 13 years. It was a collaborative procession. People looked up to you, people respected you, people had questions to ask of you. They'd walk up to you and say that, you know, they were all so happy to watch your stories, their reputage, and they thought you were making a difference and some young people said they wanted to do what you were doing. Have we taken to some extent a 180 degree term? I think we have because now we ridiculed, we mocked our credibility and intent our questions all the time. The one very unfortunate sentence that you get to hear a lot these days is, you know, became one user to localism. You get to hear this a lot on social media and unfortunately also in the real world where you meet people out there. A lot of times, more than the story that you may be covering, the question they actually want to ask you is, so I'll come to this video right now, please, please, I don't know. I know I've been asked that question. I may have been horrified the first few times but it doesn't surprise me anymore because it's almost as if we are expected to be pursuing somebody's agenda. It could be the party in power, it could be somebody else, but as if it's the most natural thing for the government to do today, it wasn't the case when I started out more than a decade and a half ago and I personally find this very disturbing because into the day I think how crazy is what we do and to our party else, the day we get this aside. And has that taken a huge beating? Yes, it has. Are we in a mess of our own making? I think to a very large extent, yes. Do we need to take a huge part of the game most definitely? Yes, a lot has changed. The political environment has changed. There are more pressures perhaps than ever before. But have we very conveniently forgotten some of the basic elements of journalism that we have thought and the fundamental principles for which we got into the procession in the first place? Unfortunately, I think many of the people we generally have. And therefore I think the loss of credibility is something that we really need to blame ourselves for to a very large extent. Is there a need for cost correction? Yes, very, very urgent. I mean, we need to do a lot of intersection on where we are going wrong, why we are not taking our savings anymore, why we do not demand the respect that our profession wants to. But before I conclude my answer there, I'm sure you have got a lot of questions. It's just one little thing I want to say, even as I am absolutely happy to get into a self-congregation mode and say that we've got a lot of things wrong in the television industry.  Please do accept your part of the blame or responsibility, whichever way you may want to put it, because what I see a lot, both in my one-on-one interactions with people and how social media is, that people grip so much about what they hate, you know, watching on TV, the content that a lot of television channels are putting on air. They crib about it, they test it, they abhor it, and yet they're watching it. So many of them go back and watch the same channels and the same content that they came to abhor and strongly disapprove of. So let me just remind you, nobody is learning to dump your head and asking you to watch this channel or that. That is a choice that you need to make, and in your own choice as a viewer. You could be consuming your news content on TV or on your smartphone or any other device. It is ultimately your choice. You get to decide what you want to choose. So please reward those who are making an earnest attempt to still do a good journalism and instead of just endlessly whining about what's going wrong with our industry, maybe support those who are trying their bit in their own small way to, I don't know, keep the integrity of the profession intact. Let me go back to Nandini, though, at this point. You know, interestingly, as you pointed out, you're the only one who's not strong TV news on the planet. But I have to ask you about why this lack of trust is being spoken about not for the entire media industry, but why particularly for the TV news industry. It's that, you know, this label is not being put on print journalists like yourself. Why is that? I mean, we can watch more than maybe. I mean, that's a social reason. Well, I mentioned about who we gave away. Prestige was another phrase that is kind of torn about. And it's a gassy phrase. And it's not just about who she is. Yeah. I mean, it's a gassy phrase. And also I'm kind of like, who do these are for? What do you think this profession is? But I think, maybe, I think print is just, it has less, I mean, people get very less. And I think just it's not as entertaining as broadcast.  But I don't, I mean, I don't think print is above it. I don't think print is superior in that sense. I mean, I am a print journalist just because that's what I enjoy. But I think the system is as full of faults as broadcast. It's like, but I find it interesting that both broadcasts don't dispel, there is a crisis of confidence. And I was sort of curious about what are the reasons for this, right? And we'd like for it to be, it's literally happened in the last decade. And that's really worrying, you know, and how we sort of go back from that model to kind of just change the perception. I think, I think, of course, the viewers, the solution does lie a lot with the viewers as Neha mentioned earlier. But Pidhi, on the rationale now, the reasons, let's try and report that a bit on why it happened. Is it about one bad apple, you know, spoiling the entire basket? Is it now that there are many bad apples? Is it the TRP race, something which, you know, Rajdeep Tatthasai was referring to earlier on the TRP race and this quest for TRP. Sonia Singh says one solution is, you know, get out of the TRP race that will improve journalism. What's the reason for it? I actually differ a little from what Neha has said. You know, I think it's a very easy route for a journalist to pick this route because it was easy to blame it on the viewers. You know, the viewers will watch A what you give them and of course, if they want to watch something because your barcode is the TRP. But I believe just because people are consuming a type of news that you cater to that type, your job is not that. You know, we sit in studios and criticize politicians all the time and say, you know, these popular schemes that they keep coming up with because people are putting for them, they'll keep coming up with all of this. They shouldn't be doing it. Our job is not to people please. This is not our job, right? Yes, and this is an appropriate way of putting it but we are not supposed to give people on what they like to see or what suits their agenda because it gives us the opportunity. Sadly, our job is to speak truth to power. Sadly, our job is to just purely report facts. Now, whether five of these people will watch me by stalking, you know, the truth or 20 of them watch me, I'm just giving example because she's saying something that suits their agenda, you know, is different. I need to still have these five people believe in what I'm saying and maybe that's how I will build credibility. So, you know, it's a big discussion that we keep having in newsrooms. It's what we come to. Like I said, maybe it's just a token but I stand on the divide where, no, you know, just because people are out fishing out trash. On the other hand, what I, you know, I do feel why most people are watching us now is for sheer entertainment sometimes mostly not for facts, for deep-rooted biases, agenda-driven. You know, it's sad because most people will even watch a particular news channel if they're talking about channels that suits their political identity or agenda. Still don't buy that news. They're caustic, you know, so if they're breaking news going on a particular channel, they will, they agree with it but they don't believe it and that's the sad part of the news. Like, you know, the last thing I'd just like to say is I think our biggest, the most telling commentary of our tragedy right now is the news pieces or the stories that we choose to run with, those we underplay and those we decide to give. I'll give you a very small example of this because I think one of the biggest tests for any news room, be it English or Hindi, was the very, very recent process of balancing large news pieces. And we got a lot, like, across the board as a unit, television industry, we got a lot of lag for it. Some of us did try to stick to our grade. And the perfect example there is when, you know, with the English group, did the RIA, now that was the time when RIA was the winner of the piece, you know, I kind of, kind of marked that as being thrown around this younger and I remember, is it a scope of process, but having said that, first of all, he needed to be told but already she was painted as somebody who murdered, you know, the person she was with. She was painted as, you know, I don't even want to get into the kind of scope, you know, what went down there. And we did that interview. And the kind of backlash we faced, the day we aired that interview, I think it was the one he did it and I don't think so, since the morning when we were working on that interview, you get it on air, it hit air. Within 20 minutes, you had two rival channels, English. How many English channels are there, you know, it's for our audience to actually think about it. Two rival channels, the top two rival channels, their editor in chiefs actually sat down at 9 p.m. prime time and completely missed a particular channel who was airing a murderous interview and not listening in to the voice of the people. And this is why our interview was good. I guess what, when the PRPs came, those two channels were great today. We had a re-aggressive interview, we got nothing. Did we not tell that story? Yes. Well, we pressed volume that people refused to watch the interview because the PRT said, no, you watched it. But in now, you know, now that, you know, we're on the outside, they're one year away from that incident. Now when we look at it, aren't we proud that we did what we did? We got no PR. But we stuck in, you know, if they're done in our news and we put it out there, nobody watched us. We were boycotted. A friend on social media ran for weeks as boycotted in there today. And we played it over and over again because of what is needed to be heard. So I think it's about what we choose to do and just report facts. Let me take that back to Deha on the reasons for it all. You of course did fix a lot of responsibility to the viewer as well earlier. Preeti says, you know, you've got to, you know, not just the viewer but blame oneself as well. How can it be changed as well now? How can it be changed for it and a possible solution as well on how it can change so that, you know, news TV does not face an existential crisis going on. All right. I will begin by showing a clarification on what both Preeti and Uday have just said. I think everyone in this room would agree that I began my remarks with the Mia Falpa. So if there is anyone to blame for the mess that we're in, and I have no doubt in my mind about that, I am not going to run away from that responsibility for the second. I promise you that. However, just to clarify, what did I mean when I said that you, the viewer also have a decision to make to decide what you're going to watch again is the day where and how you're going to do your most. All I'm saying is, I'm not blaming you. All I'm saying is, be a part of our journey. Join us, be our allies. Some of us who are still trying to keep the candles to journalism, the ethics of the profession, and the integrity intact. Please join us on our journey and be our allies. That's all I ask of you as viewers. There is no blame game happening here. We're in this together. Coming to the question that you specifically asked, Uday, what has gone for hardly long. My God, where do I start? How much time do we have? I could be here already talking about what has gone with our profession. But if I had to encapsulate it in a couple of bullet points, a few years ago, we used to talk about how sensationalism really sold and was the bane of our profession. Indeed, it was, but I think what's replaced near sensationalism in the last few years and become much bigger being of our existence I think is toxicity. To my mind, that word really sums it up the best. I think a lot of the television booths that's discharged out, especially in the name of primetime television debates. And I do a lot of primetime debates myself. So what's discharged out in the name of debate or discussion or news, I think in a lot of cases is not just the downright trash, but an insult to the television viewers. But it is downright dangerous for our society, for our country, for our profession, for where we are headed, for young people who watch us and think maybe this is what journalism means. So I really want to sit here and say, no, a lot of what you watch is not journalism. A lot of what is being passed off as news is only about news.  There is a lot of journalism on primetime debates. And there is a lot of toxicity that is kept true. We in the media, I think, are more polarized today than ever before. We've been talking about political polarization for a long time, many years now. Do we realize how polarized we are as a fraternity today? I think we can give a very good example of that. How editors-in-chief think nothing was going on primetime and distinct of another time. Fine, they think they're doing it in this race, but I mean, seriously, what are you doing to your own credibility and to the credibility of the process? For example, are you setting for young people who are watching you who probably look up to you and think they're working? Where you are, maybe you are setting a very dangerous example. And I think Rajni, very, very lightly pointed out, we are on a very difficult slope. I mean, we're going to do hate and agenda-pending every night and we're going to do something with mollanas and sardines to have these ugly, robust doubts. God help us. God help our profession. God help our industry, which is why I honestly think that we in the television industry, particularly, and I know Vikram, who's here, my follower in the TV colleague would say, thank God I'm on the TV. I know he said that many times on Twitter. Yes, I follow you on Twitter. So I know he said that so often. Thank God I am on the television because, yes, many people say that. And I think we need to do a lot of self-interception on that. Okay, well, the final word to you, Nandini, and we've completely run out of time, so I'll give you just a 30 seconds rebuttal as a viewer yourself. Of course, you're part of the industry, but as you said earlier, you're not on news TV. So as a viewer as well, where do you see the solution? How do you believe things can change with that? I mean, again, as a person on the outside, I feel the problem in a lot of TV news is there's no distinction between opinion and news. And I feel like maybe the 9 o'clock discussion has kind of tuned that. But again, I want information. I don't really care about what someone's news are. And I think that's where opinions are what are most polarizing. I think the facts, hopefully, if people get the right facts, people can sort of come to a sensible conclusion themselves. But I think it's when you fall into the category of opinions, that's where you're going to write frog and heat and antagonism. And I think that's where I wish we could sort of step out of that cesspool because people want information. They want to know what's happening. They see they want to know what's happening down. That's why we don't choose statements. That's why we forgot the television. But I think this sort of outdoing each other in rhetoric and in fidelity, that's where the danger actually lies. Thank you all once again for joining us. I know we've tried to keep it very brief as a topic we can talk about already, I'm sure. But interestingly, I'll just point out at the end, I'm also someone who, of course, is a stakeholder in all of this, but when you're the moderator of a debate or an anchor, you're supposed to allow the panelists to air their opinions, not sometimes give your opinion too much. But that's something we're doing a lot of on television where some anchors and some other journalists are giving you their opinion, rather than allowing you all the panelists have to sit. So I've tried to stick to that through my debate today and small panel discussions. But thanks again for joining us all of you and back in the morning. Thank you so much. I'll just go ahead and stay back on the stage for a bit while I invite Anshar Red Praveen Chauhan, celebrity astrologer and author to help us solicitate the panel for being here with us. And just before that solicitation happens, I want to be clear that it's a special panel for me since I started off my career in front of PT at Headlines today and of course, Nia has seen me my formative years in music. I'll have them on my panel in a week and three of us. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Take a round of applause. Anshar Red Praveen Chauhan, if I can request you to first show our gratitude to the panel. Well, to add on to it, social media is doing something amazing when they're forcing people to show that it's an opinion by the person. I think we should put that on the television as well. And that should really, really matter in terms of the news size and whether we can see it. Thank you so much, Man. Thank you so much. You want to know, yes, let's get a picture. Thank you. Thank you, everyone, once again. And if you're enjoying this, if you're watching this from the room or from the live that you're doing on our website, please use the hashtag EpoRamaEnglish just as a 40 and a 40 to spread the word around. With this, we'll move on to our five-side chat the second chat of the day, decoding the changing nature of video news. We have Mr. Vikram Chandra, our founder, editor, G.I. Technologies, Sugri Mishra, managing partner at Trust Legal. And it's truly an honor to invite both these gentlemen, the intellectuals, that we are truly truly honored you have on this side. Ladies and gentlemen, it's time you all put your hands together and give a proper welcome to both the gentlemen. Everybody, this is an honor to meet Vikram and this way we have been watching him. In my opinion, you all have asked so many times about why did he leave television and why he started the digital edition. But in my understanding, and most of you would agree that for us, he's one of the finest tech journalists which we have in the country. And that's true where he will miss you a lot. So one of the first questions which comes to my mind and I'm somebody who represents new channels for all the regulatory authorities, I'm a heavy consumer of views. So for me, it's like not seeing anyone on TV is a personal loss. But when you are talking of a huge disruption on video platform with AI being one of the main hallmarks how we will go about it. What is this disruption which we are likely to see now? Oh my God, I could answer that question for 35 minutes and I frequently do so. I'm going to try and keep it brief. By the way, it's been about five years or five and a half years since I've been 10 years with the amount of time since that happened. The real reason why I left TV news is because it was increasingly clear to me that we keep comparing about all the problems that are there in television news. Unfortunately, I don't see them changing in a hurry. Multiple reasons for that. Linear television everywhere in the world is facing a substantial challenge from OTT and streaming. So that format itself, I think I've kept it inside for a few different reasons. That format itself, I don't know how long that's going to last. Television news in addition in India has problems that we all know and we can keep on complaining about the fact that why is it that everyone yelts and screams so much and you're shouting and you've got your opinion there and you're getting pleased to shout at each other and you're getting thumb tricks on to your show, the anchors are thumb tricks, whatever it is. That's the reason why people do it. The reason why that happens is because that's where the PRPs come from. And in India, you've got television news where you're not getting subscription money. You're paying cash fees. You're entirely depending on revenues. And the only way you make money is by PRPs. You've said it a couple of times earlier also that 30,000 boxes decide our fortune. The set of boxes. 30,000 set of boxes will decide the fortune of 130 crore people from there. Before you were watching British news, you kind of do some detailed analysis on something. It's very possible that your audience is the Amino. People with the Amino media are safe to understand it. But if they would understand somebody speaking in a rather high pitch tone. So television news is not the answer. The real question to me has been for many period of time. Why is it that digital video news is not working on India? That's a more interesting question. We know all the problems with TV news. And to me, I can come to the solutions that you want, but the real problem for me and digital video news is the form factors are not correct. There's so much information. Water, water everywhere, but not a drop to drink. Information everywhere, but you're not informed. That's the problem. How do you find the information? How do you still fake news from authentic news? How do you separate? How do you separate news? What is fact? From what is opinion? How do you do all of that? And most importantly, if you want to be informed, I need to take room, but I'm going to say that there used to be a time in use to say, I could watch the YouTube top of the 9 o'clock news. And in 25 minutes, I get 30 news stories and walk away and have to say, I'm informed about all that happened. How do you replicate that today? Digital form. You have a Twitter working. You have print also working to some extent. People have started reading some of the print traditions, which are only in print. They are not coming in our homes any longer. But which are the digital video platforms, so when news is concerned, do you think that they are going to change the model in coming months or maybe a year from now? I mean, like, look, I have the answer to that, but I'm obviously a little bit biased, so I hesitate to say that I think editing is on some of the points. Actually, I'm biased to that. But the effort to set up heritage was essentially because four years or five years ago, I said that, look, I'm now 15. I can either spend the rest of my working life complaining about how bad the systems are or actually go out and try and do something about it. So I spent two years between the basement of my house trying to figure out platform theory, AI theory, how these things work, how they construct other businesses and figuring out how those could be potentially utilized and disrupt, redo news and information. And that's where the ideas came from. By the way, the pandemic was, from that point of view, it helped us in evangelizing that change is coming. Linear is going digital is everywhere and redo streaming is everywhere. But for us, it was a bit of a handicap because we didn't get a chance to do things like this. How do you get a chance to come out and meet people in evangelize and sit in a rug, walk right down and say, you're not paying attention to what you should be doing to understand what is happening. Those things were, have not been possible to do in the pandemic. Now, we're liberated. We're getting the chance to go out there, talk to a lot of people, and hopefully start accelerating. So each of these shows on this platform, which would be the, like, people will actually go and see them. Is it, again, tech or something, sports or literature or time-time, like, what they will go for? Actually, my answer is a little bit more radical than that. What we are trying to do is a little bit more radical than that. It is not to create shows where people will come and watch. In fact, it's even more radical than that. We don't want to be a destination where somebody comes. If somebody, we don't necessarily want you to come and come to a detergent. We don't want you to download the app. Please go into it. It's a great thing. Better than everything else. But that's not necessarily what we want to do. We are a technology company. So what we are doing is, we believe that the era of the pipeline is over. And that's a major statement that I'm making, which I think deserves a little bit of clarification. What do I mean by the era of the pipeline? In video news and information, we are still, this is my destination. This is my television channel. This is my website. This is my app. Come and watch me here. What's my YouTube channel? Come and watch me here. That's pipeline India. Closed. It's closed. It's a pipeline thing. My content, come and watch it on my destination. That's what we think about. But that's not the way industries are moving in the new in 2022. Everything is open. The architecture is open. Content comes in from multiple places and the output is in multiple places. That's why if you're going on Airbnb, nobody's asking Airbnb how many hotels do you own. So same Facebook and Twitter also has nothing to do with it. Exactly. The logic of technology in the year 2022 should mean that your models don't have to be decided by the model of television news that operated in 1950. 1916. Today's television news is following the same technology and formats as was there in 1950 and 16. Why can't you apply modern thinking, platform theory, AI, all of this stuff into the way video news should be consumed. But how the viewer will be educated about it. Like Twitter, I don't know how it happened. How people migrate even from villages to small towns. How your nuanced viewer will migrate. So the way it happens, our first of all, our theory our thinking as of now which could continue to evolve. We are following a very distributed, early open architecture. We follow a very distributed stream. Any organization can use our technology to create their own business. Anybody can do it. Any individual can do it. But certainly any organization can do it. If you change the media, once it's on video news channel or video information channel, you create it and that's the way it works. Therefore, it's open. The distribution is open. You're not trying to put people into lock boxes. And somewhere along the way, I think it is in these sort of areas where the change will come because what that also enables us to do is separate. These are facts, these are curated facts. This is your opinion which you can layer on top of the facts that are being preserved. And then at least as separation. So the time is not important. You can watch it whenever you want to watch it. But that's a huge change from TV. You know that you want to watch either people or anything like gone wild. We choose to come early. We watch a lot. It was at 9 o'clock some stations which you have. So you have nothing to do because, you know, appointment, viewing and having to switch on linear television is to say that that is going to change is not particularly dramatic or exciting that you all know. That's not necessary for 10 years now. The fact that I can have a show that you can come and watch on your own, then of course that's the best solution we do. I think some of what we are trying to say is an innovation more radical than that. And because it's more radical, it will almost certainly take some time for that message to sink there. Why do you even need this? So I will ask you once we were researching, we realized you went for a patient for your AI the entire AI processes. What was that about? Like it's something which is common in India or something which others have done in some part of the world. No, I think some of the things that we have we are not just one, they are two, three and four. The fundamental question that was the core why did I spend those two years in the basement was not to say I can get an algorithm to create the news to put together the news that Neha wants to see or somebody else wants to see. Very simple to do that. That's why I said we think we have the story to one and that any algorithm can do it. It did happen like 20 days ago. The challenge for us was how do we get an algorithm to work together with humans which will keep what the algorithm knows your preferences are plus what the humans believe is important to use both those factors and to create a newscast on the fly. That will be the sort of a newscast that Neha will remember we used to watch during our early days of journalism that headlines in national news, international news, business, night stand, entertainment and I am going to watch this for 20 minutes and it will be personalized for me and it will give me news that I would like to watch and news that I should watch and it will all be created for me how do you get an algorithm or an AI entity to do that. It was a news for me when I was looking at all this it looked as a very futuristic where it's going to happen and also these influences were being so much of journalism or any kind of stuff they are also setting a tone for this kind of conjunction which is going to increase Yes, but I think one of the things that is very much on the heritage is to start working very closely with influencers because one of the things that we can help influencers with you see a lot of people want to do their own news and they don't want to do their own things now doing the debate and having their opinion it's very simple for them to do it's not a problem to interview somebody to do a debate they struggle with finding the news stories the factual news stories now part of our open source and this way just doing it because our attention is more to start the world then to do anything else even allow them to just take out technology just take it and take all of our stories also and put them into your whatever you are using as an influencer now that starts to happen and for any influencer that suddenly becomes a value actor I don't have to worry about the headlines I don't have to worry about the peace stories I don't have to worry about the technology I just do my debate do you find it all boring in comparison ask me the number of times I have related the fact that I am not a generation anymore because the answer will be a nice one for all the wrong reasons sometimes we watch deep right now that you will see somebody falling sick or something will happen I just because this is probably the influence I shouldn't be saying why are people falling sick while they are entering television news it's the same reason people fall sick while they are watching television news it's probably back for your head that amount of the television news now something is going to happen something is going to happen this is something we really want to understand from you that how much future you see about the tech in a world like India is now emerging as a tech superpower and in every possible way you have shown so many things to us in the last 2 decades about it what are the tech enable to show you that people should go and watch which are the other platforms where something like that is happening I mean just for your interest we do have a very powerful tech channel so we do a lot of shows there is a bunch of reviews that I do them all and I keep seeing some of this other stuff because we would love to get back into it and catch a good night show stay in my retirement that's the last question would be for me is how difficult it was to raise money for your enterprise and do you think it will become easier and easier now with the initial rounds happening we were actually quite fortunate we followed a somewhat different path and we never went down the VCP other route and that's fundamentally because I think we were trying to do something that was slightly more radical and therefore would have a slightly longer incubation period at least is what happened overnight I was quite fortunate that I got an ATL and in the same time it was coming to the first round which was quite unfortunate and then the RTCGP so that's good so they're all very big reviews Alan Maas you haven't spoken till now I was reading about it yesterday because I did actually have a very when you were doing this I did that I did have that conversation and I said this is what British should become I'll let you know thank you we are done okay I'm trying to figure out how much I should and I can say because some of the things that I'm talking about are not really fully launched look what are the problems that journalists are facing why I genuinely have so much respect for all the their challenges you're constantly struggling with the business models with the PRPs with what editors or owners or others are going to do because of the ways that there is journalists are also going to need to find ways of skilling themselves of learning the new digital technologies and hopefully we will find ways of giving them tools by which they can do journalism by breaking out of the state jackets that the present models are imposing upon and that's what in an ideal world will happen because journalists are crucial and journalists are important but we know that they are struggling with the present models so yes that is I think something which is very important that we as an industry need to do broader at a society level than there are other issues that we do have to deal with such as freedom of press issues such as the fact that we don't understand the fires that are constantly against you for work that you are doing for us you know I acquired business for 8 years by a cloth somewhere here that I had but the fact is business is becoming video I am in the business of brand and content in audience and then being able to want to select the right will not necessarily I mean I remember Bhupi was on my left he started doing the Facebook lies maybe 6-7 years back he was the one who educated me 6-7 years back you know so clearly we have to go more journalists which is video which is social media intertwining you know distribution is happening through that but from you know in the way they are made in the way they come up in the way the kind of stuff they do before they get to being edited what can journalists do better not only journalists but as a you know a business professional as platform as technology how should they reorient themselves step number one I think is that they have to become a lot more excited which they are becoming simple things like the era of that television camera the era of having a camera person the era of having to have equipment which is accompanying you and going everywhere that era is gone that era should go it's not required it's not necessary even in the present time so the more you become the more you understand the mediums of the present the more of the mediums of the future the more you acquire that the more valuable an asset you are going to be in any media organization and that should be my responsibility and then of course about an advantage because she is both her sister company so she has access to all of her content that's cool thank you you know all these people you may ask me a question I will tell them all his dark ways for secrets I think you should read more of them but anybody want to ask somebody who is a journalist anchor then became the CEO of NETV and now as an entrepreneur he is really I mean there is a book in this room pretty much I had the similar journey any questions to become Dr. Surbhi is a prolific writer she is a professor of English journalism my time she is the head of department and she is written three books that I know of but more than that thank you so I am writing a book on journalism in India so I just wanted to ask you a very simple question do you think the entrepreneurs like you or other entrepreneurs are they a result of India starting entrepreneurship in the digital journalism or some other reasons I think whenever there is a problem wherever there is a vacuum that is any area which would immediately attract a rush of entrepreneurial interest because you don't go and try and set up a company to solve a problem where no problem exists it's only in areas where anybody can look at it and say this is broken that you suddenly say well some solutions are needed and you need to find solutions so I think we all recognize and understand the reasons which we are like all through the day that there are things that are fundamentally broken in a lot of media and with your views and information in particular so it's not surprising that you will see all of it when you are saying there is a vacuum here let me guide you like Shikhar Gupta he resigned from that Indian Express then he opened the bar so that wasn't any design from then he knew and then opened the bar and similarly Raghav Behal when he sold the network 18 then he opened the coin so that was my real question that you know what is the future of entrepreneurial digital journalism in India I mean I think digital journalism will almost certainly that's the absolute doubt in my mind that digital journalism will doubt me everything already that trend is not going to stop it's only going to continue to accelerate now the question if you are asking whether somebody should take that equal to that to compare a couple of issues around that whole issue and one of the problems is that unfortunately sometimes when you are starting a new entrepreneurial journey the BCs and the others are going to still measure you by the metrics of the past they will try and compare you with but this is what XYZ has done for the past and that sometimes can be a problem if you do something really crazy really wild then that becomes a problem because they will say but that person who are you comparing yourself with and if you are saying no one means something that nobody has ever tried to do then that sometimes with the expansion they had that's the problem which will happen I think in journalism and entrepreneurialism in this field because I think a lot of the solutions have to be solutions that are not out of the box but that demolish the box which means by definition it has to be something that you need thank you, thanks a lot I think it's time you show an appreciation to both these other guys who are on the block and I would like to thank you for the opportunity to show our gratitude by participating with Mr. Chandra for the value of time and of course the wisdom that they share with us thank you to the two more people who tried to blast it so I would like to continue our conversations for the day and for the next segment we have a fireside chat between Mr. Bhuvendra Chaubey editor-in-chief and CEO at India I had used and he rejoined in conversation with Mr. Rahul Prumil senior editor exchange for media it will revolve around rebuilding trust in news TV let's welcome Mr. Chaubey and Mr. Arvind with a huge round of applause I'll try to say as much coffee as needed because we have many as partners so if that's needed let me know and I'll also expect applause in the coffee tradition from all of you, can we do that please so much, I'm going to do what TV journalist do, I won't let you talk I'll try to do that so I'll quickly dive into the topic we have something very interesting that you often read about we have it on Twitter we discussed and we have got it to this forum which is rebuilding trust in news TV first of all what made us even think of this topic is itself a story what is wrong that we have to even discuss this it will not be long enough for us to start really dissecting what you're saying but I guess in fact this topic is a reflection of what is news television what is national television I think just yesterday I read somewhere that how for the international press for the international media the Indian media has become a joke the Indian television media has become a joke in large parts into the certain steps and certain moves which have been undertaken by the Indian media there are many who would argue why do we need any justification or certification from the global press I think that argument has also been in parts but to say that everything is absolutely above or nothing is broken in Indian television all in Indian print today I would say I think would be missing the most so I guess the topic is right it's a topic which needs to be debated extensively and in India I made a point on a daily basis I reiterate this that the choice ultimately is of the view what do you want what do you want in more proportions is what anyone can do So at India ahead what is the story how are you trying to fix this in your whatever is in your control how are you addressing that part Well that's the most important question that you raise other than all the other trusted questions which I'm sure you may have in a nutshell what we really need to do at India ahead is on the basis of the collective experience that my team and I have had over the last two decades across various television newsrooms and it gives me great great pleasure and pride that today at India ahead you know we have the best and the brightest from multiple newsrooms across the country digital television print and the story that I hear from everybody is the same that we want to grow it's not as if the people don't want to put in the extra work or really try and push the bar but it's just that legacy media has ended up becoming a platform where the question of raising the bar becomes very difficult so what do we do what we do is we've identified a weakness or a vacancy which existed within this very crowded television ecosystem the first vacancy was if we said that why should all the national television coverage be restricted to what's happening between Delhi, Mumbai maybe Lucknow and in parts and in parts of as and when the story goes bigger is India just restricted to these centres which typically contribute to the outcomes I've often said this is the past and I have absolutely no problem in repeating this once again I think the entire geographical map of India has been changed because of the desire to chase the admins there are stories which happen in the southern parts of the country there are stories which happen in the eastern parts of the country sometimes they just don't spend enough time I have taken it upon myself because I said let me lead by example a lot of my colleagues don't necessarily agree with me and some of my colleagues are here you see it's very easy to fall for the story which is unfolding on the table but how would look for something which may be somewhere there but we may be unwilling to identify the story squarely turn the spotlight squarely on that story that's what we do at India between 1 o'clock to 4 o'clock on a daily basis 3 hours Monday to Friday special focus on the southern states 8 p.m. on a daily basis Monday to Friday the top story is not what is happening in Delhi not what's happening in Malabar not what's happening elsewhere it's not what's happening the top story I am now going to be competing 2 years now in July and I kid you not I have never ever struggled to identify the story which means that there are enough stories it's just that we won't be willing to look for the stories we are now looking for the stories it's giving us great goodwill it's giving us great joy and I must share with you that on the 19th of next month we are now going to be the first major Indian national television news entity that's the entire exercise of Dubai we are now expanding in the Middle East parts of the world and the kind of feedback and the kind of response if we are getting there is this just an opportunity to speak we often when we try to understand why news has been reduced to shopping matches at times so the idea the problem lies with the business model you need to get attention what we have seen like a lot of new channels that have started applications they start with an honest the motive is honest to change the things and bring in a change but they end up becoming the same so do you fear that sooner or later this might happen to some the noble cause like you have started and you want to change the ecosystem I'll tell you why that happened when Anurag and I have talked about this I think the fundamental problem with television I'm only talking about television right now the fundamental problem with television is the over dependence of ad agency ecosystem if I start sharing with you the stories which have been narrated to me and in some cases I don't know maybe there are people here from agencies as well some of the top of CEOs in this country of being broadcasting organizations I'm often at these conversations with these CEOs and I ask them like how is it possible in a program which is being recommended for an anchor who is being scrutinized by pretty much every court in the country again it gives me great pleasure that India is the only entity only 1 million news network right at the beginning of my modern journey here sued me for 150 crores and I was very happy I wore it as a guide of pride you know on my on my steve that they value us with the only entity which is not which has not been wrapped on our mother by some arm of the judiciary you name one national television entity which has not been accused of spreading fake news spreading regulatory looking at a story from an angle which perhaps deserved a different look at the fundamental problem is the ad agency ecosystem because a person who is fixing your ad date your price at which you say yourself is not interested in your content I had conversations with those people about what basis are you fixing this price is it name would be your charge channel after a dissolution after a take off authority box 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 10 boxes if you take 7 okay fine then my relationship with you you know I like you if I like you your price will be 5x I don't like you but you still take the boxes your price will be 3x there is a complete disconnect between the content which is being produced and the price which is being offered by ad agencies because nobody is wanting to fix it everybody is a beneficiary so that's why you fix the ad agency so I am dying for 10 more minutes I am dying for 10 more minutes you are also part of the psycho system this debate is also somewhere it is a there is something you have contributed earlier you have been part of the system when you look back is it something you feel that I could not have done I would have done it differently the only thing I must say that I think I should have taken the step in my life earlier there were opportunities but everything has a time and who would not like come for it you know I don't come from a business family I mean Vikram and I had the pleasure of working with each other for a while you know I still look at myself as a consensual reformer I love adapting to technology my other grouse with my own colleagues is that I am the only one who is taking care and often others are shy I would love to share with you they are on twitter spaces again this is the only entity I would urge all of you who are here please watch these programs it is the only entity which has blended audio content with video content on a daily basis we have roughly 1000 people who are joining us via this audio town hall live on our platform live on our television channel on a television camera there are 1000 people you know we are all there live there is a great conversation which is happening if I am an audio I am on mobile phone I can ask you a question I generally believe I generally believe that these kind of initiatives over a period of time will end up finding this agency within this ad agency ecosystem as well is fixed by TRPs I do not subscribe to the TRP model I don't care whether my TRP is right at the bottom which it is by the way because I don't have the money to work on the institution platforms but are we not doing reasonable business we are doing reasonable business can we do better business I think there is enough opportunity for that as the agency start to recognize this kind of content my final question we have been hoping that news TV will change over the last few years but what we have seen it has become the following some of the news anchors I won't name they go all the way they dance on the screen where is it headed from here on don't you want to honor some of those anchors I thought it is some of those anchors look I mean to wish their own and I wish everybody well but I think the time is now coming before Indian television media if it is not already come where some of these people will have to ask these questions that is this how long can this to be really last you would ask yourself what does it matter to you that I am giving you information which should be of importance to you or how many push ups you know on the news floor does it matter to you 10 times am I boxing or I am doing something I am screaming but I think that model is broken I feel sorry for more reporters sorry for very bright I was in a conversation the other day of the research and he was telling me that the number of people who are now quitting media altogether news media apparently it is at its highest in the last two years so something will be stated about this model of entertainment what is the question thank you so much we don't have time for a question the woman as we have the pleasure of having you and you know while I need to become and I can do whatever I can with you now when you do journalism now you said you would do this yeah you said that easy I love you now I love you too yeah you know of course I know you are here and so on and so forth now you are an entrepreneur you are first an entrepreneur I can't be an entrepreneur if I am not a journalist in my business but the skills for being an entrepreneur is another set and that's why I have asked a similar question to different what are the new things that you added on as a professional that you are discovering something you got to look at distribution you got to look at business aspects like recruitment of business people you got to look at revenue you got to look at the brand of course in news the journalism you do this to give us a sense of what have you been able to focus on and balance the first thing I learned when I started putting on the tag from an entrepreneur was the sheer appreciation of those who were doing sales marketing all this while it's not as if that in our in our previous avatars in my previous avatars it's not as if I was not associated with the world of business let me also bring this huge phase which a lot of editors would give that there is this great wall which exists between editorial and marketing no such wall exists and anybody who tells you those things no matter who that is including me I'm lying to you so I'm lying to you I think the time has changed completely the first thing I learned was greater appreciation of creating content which would bring value value not just of the content about the viewers watching but also about the content would be willing to back that kind of content branded content people who would feel that they could be beneficiary of a certain kind of content or people who would feel that okay fine this is an information I think healthcare sector you look at the kind of innovations which are taking place please watch our digital series which is called innovation starts with E we are spending a lot of our time looking at the great tools which are being made in healthcare setup just a short file back before I came here healthcare startup was creating something which is information based for something which I have said that is what I think is a huge skill which I have acquired the other hero games of distribution these are all products which have been there these are all tools which have been a part of the business getting the past a little appreciation of what works and what doesn't work in my earlier update I don't have a big price to send 5 people on a journey across the world because I want to display but today I do think price I do think I myself I am a big exponent as you know of using the mobile phone as a processing technology we will try to see whether an iPad and a mobile phone working together can you tell us my last question young students from ISE some of the winners who are being recognized in the afternoon in the audience what is your advice to them as they move to the next phase in the editorial and journalistic career just focus on storytelling if you have a story it will be told let me show you some of those but that story in today's day and age will come out no matter what story universe will tell that story see when I started off my career we used to have something called meeting where you come back you shoot through the day, you come back you write a lovely script, someone else said it sit for you there's an anchor who then comes out doesn't like it, the story gets paid out 30-15 seconds you don't need to see it those days are gone it was replaced by a stand up which was all driven by business models I think those days are gone as well today we have a former vice chief again another great initiative that we've done former vice chief of the Indian army today he's an exclusive videographer he does a big series for us what does he talk about it's not a television show it's a show which is shot on mobile phones and it's a show which talks about foreign policy it talks about war from a strategic point of view what does India have what should India need to look at Russia, Ukraine, all kinds of things so more focus, more awareness and more recognition of technology is what has set you apart from the world of the past thank you Gopin please give Gopin a round of applause thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you Gopin for saying what you believe in and doing what you do please give Gopin a round of applause thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you So, it's like a mix of things here and you have a fireside chat session up next with Mr. Rahul Shriab Shankar editor, director and editor-in-chief times now, Rohil Arvind once again joining in this year during the exchange program here. This session has no more topic as such is unfit so that's what it is so expect some, we don't get chance to catch it or use anchors often so here is the part of the day to do that. We are grilling all of them today. So first, so thank you so much for joining us and I want to start with this context, you know, you saw some new talent. First of all, give me a sense of where is journalism headed when you saw those profiles and presented, where are we? I think journalism is headed in absolutely the right direction. The young people, you know, I'm young too. So I'm not going to exclude myself from that list but some of the people that we saw, we heard and the work, it was just phenomenal and I think that it was very, very tough to distinguish between their capabilities. I feel that we're in very safe hands with this generation as long as we maintain the distinction between, you know, fact and fiction. I think that's really fundamentally the most important part and I think that all the individuals that, in fact all 80 or 90 individuals that were shortlisted were phenomenally well versed in what they were doing. So it was very tough but on just the basis of that, I think, you know, articulation, the use of language, perhaps even the point of views and I would try away from expressing them. I think this was a fabulous bunch and it really inspires a lot of confidence. So which brings me to my next question about, okay, all that is fine but what they're watching is a certain quality of discourse that has a lot of critics. What do they do? The journalism that's been practiced, you know, a lot of critics are around and we have this promising growth. So are they torn between something? I'm married to a critic. My wife is my biggest critic. She comes from the United States. She worked with the BBC Reuters, very far removed from the sensibilities of the times now and she finds some of us extremely valuable and I don't blame her. But as I said, I think every culture has its idiom of expression. We are a, I don't want to use the cliche argumentive democracy, this that the other but we are a society that appreciates some amount of, I suppose unfiltered to use your word commentary. The problem and this is where we need to be extremely focused. The problem is when our rhetoric gets the better of us. I think that is an issue that needs to be looked at very closely especially the debate media because if that is happening then you can't build a good argument or at least a convincing argument. The basis of every good argument is hard facts and you can interpret hard facts. Just look around you, we are today competing with, I think Hubein used that example of digital or what have you and I'm not even on social media, I'm just about managed to start treating on my own. I'm not on Facebook, I'm not on Instite, I don't know what to do with them. A bit of a crocodile but nonetheless appreciates the fact that people have got a voice in this media when came today actually put out a lot of things that mainstream media would miss. Now when you're competing with that you're looking at a very different piece because they're commentary, extending points of views and also remember there is very little formality so a lot of us process the news first on whatsapp, a lot of stuff is sent to us on whatsapp. And Hubein our daily lives as normal citizens. We don't even switch on the TV, we don't even pick up the newspapers. The first thing we get are forwards from friends, exception, we're looking at them and we don't know if they're fact, they're fiction, if they're a mix of two. And sometimes some of us are impressionable, less skeptical, we'll take them as our school. At least mainstream media has some sort of regulation. It is self enforced of course, we govern ourselves, we do, we are held up to certain standards which are set of course for us through a process which is quite intrusive. And therefore there is a bit of a formality in what we're doing that there's an expectation that we verify facts and we don't put out fake news. As long as you are actually sticking to those basic rules, you can be as opinionated as you want. Newspapers are opinionated, various digital websites have the news and they're opinionated, they have opinion columns, we swing between or, great thing about a paper for example is that the first thing you look at on a paper is the news. Increasingly news is also becoming editorialized because they're looking at not obviously being, they're competing with digital which is reported to the news the day before or hours before they have. So in your writing you're going to editorialize a lot. I remember working in a BBC newsroom where we couldn't even describe the person you were conversing with because that was an editorial comment on their, you know, their partitude or the demeanor, etc. And that good bias in some ways and influence the conversation today.  I think that, you know, you can build atmosphere into your piece and that's, I'm just taking up, because I think open eye, for example, has more extreme one. But the fact is that I don't see why an anchor can't be opinionated. In fact, if you, like I do in my promo, I put out an apologetically that I have a point to give that you can choose not to watch my show. I set myself up for that. So I think, you know, we need to evolve with the manner in which we're also interfuting with public. We've got Twitter now. So we've had Twitter, I've woken up to its reality in the last three years. And I find a lot of people want to converse with you and you can choose to engage them. Or you can put out your point of view as long as it's responsible and as long as it meets certain criteria, which is fact based. But isn't mixing news and use a dangerous cocktail at the same time? Now, again, I don't think it's a dangerous cocktail because you are looking at television from a very, very prime time perspective where anchors sometimes with signature shows come on. And if you look at the West, I think not to say that the West is any ideal. But if you look at what is happening in the West, where perhaps this style has been experimented with more in different formats, this is quite derogatory. The issue is when an anchor oversteps the mark.  When you mix fact with fiction. So I can sit there and start cooking facts and then basing my opinion or my view on that. I must come up with a expose of what are the facts? It's like being in a court of law. The two lawyers arguing pretty much the same charge from different perspectives. I'm not talking about cherry picking. I'm talking about establishing the facts. You put the facts out there and then you say, well, these facts lead me to deduce this. What do you think? And as long as you're not muting the other side, I think television shows are a lot more democratic than a large number of publications. I wouldn't be a publication for my sort of conservative point of view in a large number of publications in India. They wouldn't want to be right because there's consensus there. One of the biggest problems with American democracy for a while, and you saw people like Norm Chomsky completely out of the pale, was because it's a consensus between society. That politics is now consensus given that the vast, vast middle in the last five years, we've seen a move away from that and they don't know how to deal with it. Here in India, we find many shades of opinion and it's important to reflect them. And if for 20 minutes or half an hour, 45 minutes, one hour show, can bring together several strands of the conversation, I think that's a great thumbs up to our democracy as long as I say. You don't mute our people. We were short on time. I want to ask my last question and then take a couple of questions from the audience. I thought they are really waiting for it. One is, news looks same, right? They look similar everywhere. Why is it so good? What are you doing to change it? Number two, somebody in the morning said that he doesn't bother what the trolls say. Does it bother you as well as the neighbors? Look, I'm a bit new to this game. I'm a guy who absorbs sort of personality and doesn't really interact with a lot of people. I don't meet politicians at all. On the rare occasion when there's a background briefing, I go in fact, not particularly fond of meeting politicians. I'm not somebody who greets his fans. I don't even meet fellow journalists. You've probably never seen me at any journalist parties, et cetera, et cetera. So obviously I live in a cocoon and the only feedback I get is from friends, family and of course now increasingly through Twitter. I barely ever look at what the so-called trolls are saying. It doesn't matter to me because if someone can't meet an argument with another argument, I don't even consider them worthy of being bothered about. What does bother me is when someone points out that on a particular show, I might have transgressed some of the lines that I hold dear, which is fact. If I put out the wrong fact, then that bothers me because I think that all of us as journalists have souls and we all try, at least in the public interest, to do stories that can change the discourse.  Now I put a ban on stings which don't serve the public interest. So as long as a sting serves the public interest and manifestively so, we won't do sting journalism. We don't even have an SIT team. We have a bunch of people who are editors or journalists who go out and we want to, you know, perhaps carry out some sort of an investigation and that sort of dovetails into our sort of, you know, SIT, for the lack of a better word, just to differentiate ourselves from the usual context in which we report. So I think that is something that is important. And so as I said, feedback, I get from people who are close to me and I value those associations because I think those people in touch just want to say that India is growing in Toronto not so much because we have greating views which we shouted each other. I think we're growing in Toronto because we're not accepting of another point. So there's a massive cancel culture which is, and I can tell you from my own living example, I've written several pieces and I have a column in the TOI and I know for sure that some of the stuff that I write raises hackles of the establishment and journalists take the establishment of a particular set of people and they don't like it and they would rather not have me writing for those pages. And I find that appalling because sometimes now we invite, we go out and say to political parties, they're representatives, people on the other side of the spectrum come. There's a top intellectual in the co