Welcome to what the F is going on in Latin America and the Caribbean. CodePink's weekly YouTube program of hot news out of Latin America and the Caribbean. In partnership with Friends of Latin America, Massachusetts Peace Action and Task Force on the Americas, we broadcast every Wednesday on CodePink YouTube at 4.30 p.m. Pacific, 7.30 p.m. Eastern. I'm happy to introduce to you this evening as my co-host, Joav Elanetsky from Mass Peace Action, our new broadcast partner in addition with Task Force on the Americas and Friends of Latin America. Welcome Joav and thank you so much for joining us this evening. He will be co-hosting tonight and I also want to introduce to you our guest. As you all know, tonight's program is entitled Alex Sob Sanctions and the Extra-Dudicial Reach of the United States. And the case of Alex Sob is a really important judicial subject for all of us to discuss, particularly how the U.S. is behaving in this case. And so let me tell you a little bit about John because I think you'll all be very impressed with his work and his history, his body of work. And then we'll have Joav give us a bit of a background for all of you as to the Sob case and Venezuela and the Venezuelan U.S. foreign relations situation because that has so much to do with the current situation with Ambassador Sob. And then John can give us an update and answer questions and put your questions in the YouTube chat please as to what is currently happening with Alex and where we go from here. So let me tell you a little bit about John. John is an experienced international defense attorney before the International Criminal Courts, ICC, ICTR and in Canada. He has been active in Africa, Latin America and Europe as well as Canada. He's a frequently invited speaker at international conferences and webinars. He's an advisor on international legal issues to governments and non-governmental organizations. He's also a former judge at the Kuala Lumpur War Crimes Tribunal. He's a member of the Free Alex Sob Committee, which we will talk more about this evening as well. He's a member of the Free Alex Sob Committee of the Cross Canada Campaign to Free Meng Wansu, President of the Rwanda Political Prisoner Support Network. And he's also part of the Coalition BDS Quebec. So, and you can find John at johnphillpot.com and it's J-O-H-N-P-H-I-L-P-O-P dot com. So welcome y'all and welcome, John. It's an honor to have you both with us this evening and let's, let's start our conversation. Okay, thank you, Terry, and thank you, John. It's good to be here with you because this is a very important issue that we are dealing with. This story exposed the lawlessness, the hypocrisy of the United States government and the light spread around the world about what it is doing. I just wanted to tell you the story very shortly about Alex Saeb and the historical context to this story. So Alex Saeb is a Venezuelan businessman and a diplomat. He was arrested, he was kidnapped and arrested on June 12, 2020 on the order of the US government while his plane was on refueling stop in Cape Verde. He was forced forcibly removed from the plane in prison and held under torturous conditions. It has been more than 400 days since Alex remains imprisoned. Alex was on his way to Iran for an official visit in search of food, medicine and gasoline to elevate the crisis in Venezuela resulted from the regime, an extra territorial sanction imposed by the United States to punish the people of Venezuela. I wanted to remember how devastating the sanctions are where people have to wait for nine hours on gas lines when trucks cannot deliver food from the countryside because they don't have the diesel fuel. They cannot get medicine to heal themselves. And it cause as we all know, by a study that was done by Mark Weisbrot and Jeffrey Sash, they calculated that between 2017 and 2018, 40,000 Venezuelans died as a result of the sanctions. Well, this is three years later you can do the calculation and you can, we can see the devastation here. It, we must see also that it was the Trump administration that that ordered the arrest of Alex Saib, and I just found out that as a matter of fact, at one point, the US sent navy warships to go to the island to keep an eye on Alex Saib. Now, I just want to give a very brief, maybe one more thing before I talk about the US-Venezuela relationship. I think that maybe John can also discuss this fact that the United States is now planning to build a 350, 400 million dollar embassy in Cape Verde, a country of no more than 100,000 people. So it's a, it's, it's, and then some of this money will go to, to benefit, to benefit some elites in Cape Verde, and this is in return for arresting Alex Saib. Okay, very briefly, historical context. 1999, Chavez is elected to president of Venezuela. Three years later under Bush, there is a coup against Chavez. He was arrested for 47 hours and if it wasn't for the masses in Venezuela that went to the street, went in Caracas to the presidential palace that demanded the return of Chavez, he would be done with in three years after his election. But this was not the only coup. In 2019, as you remember, Guaidó is calling for openly for an uprising against Maduro supported by the United States. In May 2020, 300 heavily armed volunteers invaded Venezuela with the goal of raid military bases, ignite popular rebellion against the government of Maduro. This is something that maybe John can explain to us is the relationship with the fact that Saib is held in prison after the Venezuelan government sentenced to former American soldiers who participated in the last invasion of Venezuela. He was holding Alex in order to swap so-called prisoners. But the coup was not the only tool that the US used. There is military pressure in June, in the summer of 2020, the US sent Navy ships to the coast of Venezuela to intimidate other countries from delivering oil and supply to Venezuela. In terms of the sanction, we need to remember that the sanction started in 2006, supposedly because the government of Venezuela is not collaborating with the United States in the drug war, which is complete nonsense.  In 2015, Obama issued a new executive order declaring a national emergency with respect to the unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States posed by the situation in Venezuela. And then the sanction regime accelerated. In 2019, as we said, when the United States recognized Gaido, they also imposed sanctions on the Venezuelan state oil company, the central bank, and the government. They also imposed additional financial sanctions on Venezuela that prohibited access to US financial markets by Venezuela government, including the oil company. And then in 2018, I'm sorry, 2020, the Treasury began sanctions against company from overseas that are doing business with Venezuela, specifically the Russian state oil company and Chinese oil companies that are doing business in Venezuela. This is the context. And I think that's how we need to look also at the case of Alex side as part of the pressure of the US government to impose a regime change in Venezuela. Thank you, you are for that excellent background and thinking in our next guest is john bill pot and john I think this case, you know you have has explained all the hindrances place via sanctions on Venezuela for participating in the global economy. And Alex saw has been was made an ambassador of Venezuela, so that he could travel and conduct business transactions on behalf of the state of Venezuela. And basically, he was a sanctions work around, and I would argue that's the, that's why he's sitting in prison today. Well, that is the center of it. And let's extradition is not that complicated. A murder, a murderer and Montreal was in Boston. And Alex says for producing a summary of the evidence and having him transferred or surrendered to Montreal to Canada. I'm in Canada to stand trial, and it should be routine, but there's lots of exceptions, but you don't study the merits of the case. In other words, whether the person has an alibi. Now, Alex was on a stop over unplanned stop over, and he was arrested on a, what they said was a red notice from Interpol is actually in the wrong name and it came out a day later. But he was arrested and held in Communicado for from June till December. And the lawyers from his lawyers in London, a very good team of lawyers who applied and got him a house arrest in the island of Sal in Cape Verde. And it's not really, he's not, he's not being tortured but he can't move and he's surrounded by police, but he's in house arrest you can't but he can't go anywhere. And he doesn't have the medical treatment that he needs because he's suffering from cancer. Now, he did not want to be transferred to the to be sent to the US to stand trial, and he applied locally to the court to hasn't have himself released. And then he made a legal application to the regional court of the economic community of West African states, which is the court of ultimate jurisdiction, like the Supreme Court in the US for Americans. And this court studied his case very carefully. I've read the judgment and said, you got to let him out right away and you got to pay him $200,000. And it was illegal his arrest that was on March 15, 2020 Cape Verde, who is under this tremendous economic pressure from the US. It's a tiny country, and this all this money and all these jobs available by US is trying to have a new out base on the around Africa because Africa is a US wants to is losing out and wants to try and have a military and economic influence on this part of Africa. So, anyway, this court ordered him release they didn't pay attention to him. And that's member he's a diplomat. Let's just clarify let's just clarify something for the audience that yes he is he's an ambassador is a special envoy ambassador of the Venezuelan government appointed by the president. And so you're looking at the United States putting pressure on the country to detain a diplomat. And just so the audience is clear, he ambassador sob was flying and correct me if I'm wrong john flying from Caracas to Iran to procure food and gasoline for Venezuela and this is where the sanctions work around is involved. Exactly. That's exactly right. And he's a diplomat in transit. He's not accredited to keep Verdi, he's a diplomat in transit. He was going to be extra special representative to the African Union. Now. So, he also applied to the United Nations Human Rights Commission Committee, and he was worried about being tortured or being badly treated in the US, just like Julian Assange his, his sentence was equivalent to torture, we will recall. The Human Rights Committee rendered a judgment on the 8th of June saying to Cape Verde, don't extradite him until we study the case on the merits. Cape Verde seems to be ignoring all these judgments. Even they went to the, they went, they say that the West African court doesn't have jurisdiction, but they went back and argued to change the judgment in in late June. They made an application to this court to try and have it overthrown and verse and it wasn't so they accepted this judgment. The lawyers who are very, very competent applied to the constitutional court to declare it unconstitutional. This court has to render judgments within 30 days, and they kept putting it off and putting it off. And finally, on the 30th of August or 31st, 31st, they rendered a judgment, saying that he could be extradited and we are sort of concerned about his immediate extradition, but I must say that his lawyers are not overly worried, of course, but they're very, very confident in the recourses that remain and the international campaign to have him released. And so we have to look to the future and this is why this kind of webinar is extremely important. I want to address some of the legal issues which are going to affect third world or third world other countries in their relationship with the US. Alex Sab is charged with money laundering, where he's supposed to have extorted money from the Venezuelan government in Venezuela. And they laid these charges in a southern Florida district court. And they apparently are getting jurisdiction because some of the co-conspirators lived in Florida, but it's kind of funny saying, you know, US laying charges for something which, if true, happened in Venezuela. And that's not true because we all know there's a process going on in Mexico right now. And the sad case is being brought into the issues in the reconciliation, which is necessary in Venezuela. Can I just interrupt for a minute, because you just said something that I find fascinating and I've probably heard it before, but coming from you, I heard it quite differently. So the United States claims that Alex Sab was committing criminal activity in Venezuela, where he is a citizen, Colombian born, but now a Venezuelan citizen. And the US is pressing charges based on that. This has to deal with national sovereignty. These are national sovereignty issues. That is exactly the point. Now they have a law that you can't bribe foreign governments, the US does, but that's what they're trying to do. And this relates to the situation of Meng Wanzhou of China. China. She is the chief financial officer for Huawei was on transit. And she was arrested on the first of August 2018 for a fraud case in the same dates 2013 2014. Here's the context. Huawei negotiated with HSBC Bank with the senior executives about contract with Iran for one of its subsidiaries and the HSBC knew everything about it. And the US based on illegal, extraterritorial, extraterritorial sanctions in forbidding anyone to do business with Iran. HSBC's in Hong Kong said she tried by misrepresenting the situation to commit fraud against HSBC. And remember, Hong Kong is part of China. And they got jurisdiction because for a millisecond, the transaction, the payments went through a New York bank. Now, this has been going on. The extradition case has been going on since August 2018. She's just passed her 1000 days. I'm having a webinar on this next week, next, the 22nd, and I will ask Terry to send the announcement around to you, because it overlaps relating to sovereignty. And the case is going, there's something, there's some possibility of winning the case. And it comes down to Canada, trying to act in a sovereign manner with respect to the US. We are in Canada, we suffer, we have bad relations with the US right now, with China right now, because we've detained one of their leading people, leading business persons who are dignified, like Alex Sab, a dignified man, well off, but loyal to the government which he is serving. And there is another issue that is that appears here, because if you're arresting Alex Sab, because supposedly he was involved in bribe dealing with the Venezuelan government, you are also questioning the legitimacy of the Venezuelan government in this way. Another word, you are, because the Venezuelan government is not arresting Saib, they don't think that Alex Sab committed any crime on the contrary, he was helping Venezuela. So by arresting him supposedly for involving in crime against the Venezuelan government, they are delegitimizing the Venezuelan government. So the US in its extradition policies is not really concerned about being fair, they're concerned about weakening and intimidating. Now the Alex Sab campaign, which I joined in with this spring has been doing a lot of activity. It's very important that the people listening to this, and I know Terry Madsen through sanctions kill, they sent an emergency delegation to Cape Verde from the June 3 to June 10. They've got a lot of press and they also have an international appeal with 15,000 signatures sent to the President of the US and Prime Minister of Cape Verde having him released. There's a large archive of materials available. There's a webinar on the 19th of May with the lawyers for Mr. Sab, Mr. Almeida, Mr. Felana, William Kema Carroll and myself, Stan Fultz Smith, and Sarah Flounders. And also Massachusetts Peace Action held a webinar on the 10th of August. There's a strong social media campaign and the Sab defense team is confident of achieving his release. The legal process is far from over. Both of our Baltas are Ghazan, former well known of the Odian National from Spain, the detention of the Venezuelan diplomat is a barbarity. They want to condemn the process and criticize this. I know where I see judgments and when you see a judgment which is patched together and doesn't make sense. This is what this constitutional court did, and Cape Verde is not terribly sovereign. It's very small. You understand that they're terrified and intimidated by the US, can't accept it, they should resign, but you understand the pressure that they did, and they wrote this nonsense judgment, saying it was constitutional. The issue is now an international issue. It has to be taken up even more strongly than ever. And it's in the forum, of course, which is being of discussion in Mexico right now. In our audience, what John is referring to is the Venezuelan dialogue happening that Mexico is hosting between the elected, democratically elected government of Venezuela, and, and the opposition. And they just finished their second round here in Mexico and the third round will be starting in October, I believe. John, I wanted to ask you, can Alex Saib see his family? Can, when the delegation, the international delegation, when they went to Cape Verde, were they able to meet with him? I understand they did meet them, but I'm not sure of all the details of who met who. I understand he was moved to one of the main islands to see doctors, but some people say that was a fake thing because they're getting ready to transfer him. I don't know the answer to that. He's had a very difficult time. And we don't want him to go to the US, because I don't know whether you know the statistics of the federal court system, but they always get there a man. The conviction rate is so high in the US District Court. I've been involved in trial, a trial or two in the US as an advisor, and so we do not want him to go to the US. He cannot have a fair trial in the US, whatever anybody says. Is there a way to slow down the process so that maybe during the negotiation in Mexico between the government and the opposition, a deal will be able to. Well, I think so. I'm not his counsel, so I'm not sure of everything that's going to happen. I know that his lawyers in the US are applying to the court to have the case dismissed because of his diplomatic status. And there's a, I think this is a brief going to be filed in about two weeks on this. So, but second guessing a court and court results and what's going to happen legally when you're not on the case. I'm humble enough to know that I don't know, because I've done enough litigation myself to know that you don't even know what's going to happen in two weeks, but it's certainly far from over. And this is an issue for everybody, every diplomat, every UN person who travels the US acts above the law in trying to get their hands on people they don't want. It's another branch of their aggression sanctions policy hybrid war with. This is another subject of course which we should. I think we have to study it because they don't intervene directly and bomb directly as much as before. But their policy is as aggressive as ever, Sanctions policy. Sanctions kill has just published its report for the Biden government Biden administration, and we actually I co authored it with Rick Sterling and David Paul, and it was distributed yesterday. And we hope to participate in this international debate about sanctions, because it's almost worse than war. I don't think it's hard to say it's worse than a hot war. It's worse than a hot war and Madeline silent Madeline Albright saying the sanctions on a wreck, even though it killed 500,000 children, it was worth it. Who can think that. And we know people. I wanted to ask you about the Y, the Y case in Canada. What is the public opinion in in in Canada about her arrest. Well, there's a lot of support for her. And there's a lot of propaganda against her. And this issues being raised we're having a federal election right now. And they're saying that we cannot let her go because China's arrested the two Michaels to foreign to Canadians working in China, who actually been photographed and they photographed military installations, and one guy sent them to the other guy one of the Michael sent it to and these men are allegedly hostages for Meng Wanzhou, but there is an independent trials of these men. One man's been convicted and got 11 years. Another man's having his trial his judgment quite soon. But these are spies. Canada they criticize these as secret trials, but in any country when there's national security issues, the trials are secret. You know, I mean Canada has secret trials and secret evidence when when there's national security issues at stake so. So in Canada there's a very strong campaign and to get her released and it hurts Canada, Canada in the West they have a lot of business with one of the biggest most important business partners partners for China. We should have a proper relationship as the US should with China, and, and history will tell us where we're going and this is part of our campaign to stop sanctions, as sanctions policy. We are fighting for a multilateral lateral world where you don't have sanctions and the countries deal with one another, according to the United Nations Charters, and not what's called what the US calls or the Canada calls the rules based international order which is the power of the mighty. No, the rule, the international community is defined by the 1946 Charter of the United Nations sovereign equality of nations, do not interfere in the eternal affairs. Sanctions are a crime against humanity when it makes people suffer, and the people impose the sanctions intend the results, which they do. They know very well that people are going to die. And this applies to the Caesar sanctions in Syria. It applies to Iran. It applies to Zimbabwe. It applies to Gaza. It applies to North Korea. It applies to Venezuela, and so on Cuba. This is Cuba for 60 plus years. Yes, of course, and maybe one can say I eat you for more than 200 years. Yeah, yeah. So this is. I shouldn't laugh. I shouldn't laugh at the Cuban. They said to the Cuban all your, your, your, the sanctions and blockade against you is only 60 years. We are suffering from this heavy handed for already 200 years. The US didn't want a black country to be independent. They didn't like that in 1804. That's another issue, but it's still very important, of course. We're in our closing minutes. John, we could return briefly to a comment you made about how the sob case, how there was, however, you know, the result comes, how the situation that has led up to his arrest his detainment and whatever the result of the cases how it's going to you mentioned the third world and, you know, in other countries that are 100% aligned with the United States. Well, when they plan their cases, they do it in the State Department and in the prosecutor's offices, and no one knows about them. The Meng indictment was adopted in January or February 2018 and she got it served on her August 1, 2018, more or less. Okay. The sad indictment related to events five, six years ago, and it came out now came out a year ago year and a half ago. So, there's probably more hidden and coming up. And there are many ways in which countries are trying to bypass sanctions now. And US sanctions are not that strong.  Who is next businessman there's a businessman from North Korea whose name I don't know, who was extradited a year ago from Malaysia. It's also very serious, because he did business, and he broke sanctions against North Korea and the US got their hands on him. So how many more are there? I don't know, but diplomats are in danger.  We don't, you know, you know, John, we can also add the extra judicial killing that the United States, for example, murdering, killing Soleimani in Iraq or the way Israel is assassinating people. It's this kind of being above the law and taking the law to their own hands. That's certainly true. It's a different issue of it, but it's the same. It's that extra judicial reach. Yeah, yeah, it's that extra judicial reach of the United States and the complete lack of respect for the rights and sovereignty of other nations. Actually, we can even add the killing, the murdering of American citizens in Yemen, which was extra judicial against American citizens. The man and his boy was killed, they were American citizens. So what should, what have we not addressed regarding the significance of the sob case? He's, what's the current, is he, he was to be extradited, that has been appealed and he has not been extradited at this point? He lost his appeal. He lost, okay. What can we do, what can we do, John? What can we do here? The lawyers have plans and they want their other recourses to the UN and to the regional court. I do not know exactly what their plans are because they're, it's a recent event. I know they're going to, there's going to have the, the SAB committee is going to have another conference soon. I don't have the date for it. And people should sign the petition at, I can, I can send the link for the petition to Terry right now in a few minutes. We should mention that. Can you read it out loud for our audience? So they can hear it. It's, it's a solidarity center petition, which is sent to the US president, the president and prime minister of cable cap Verde, and I will have, I will ask Terry to post it in the next half hour. So, I think this is a very ongoing struggle. And we have to strengthen our solidarity strengthen our fight on this case. We've been on this for four or five months now, and it's far from over. How can we help? How can them, how can people here in the United States help? Because they can sign the petition, and they can contact the SAB committee, and we will have that all that information available. I'll post that in the, in the, in the comments of tonight's broadcast. So that all of you can can see it there. Great, great. So, so this is so. It's shocking. I mean, when you talk to US citizens about it, I can't speak for Canada, John, you can. It's, it's people don't even can't even grasp what the case is about because it's so hard for people to understand and or believe this extra judicial reach of the United States, this push for one world one order led by the United States and its principal allies. And that includes everything militarily, economic, global currency, political, all of it. It's very hard. I mean, this case is such a great case study in what the United States is attempting to do. It's very I'm so happy for your time tonight because it's, it's so important to keep, to keep everyone apprised of what's happening and, and, and the significance of what's happening. Is there anything that we should address before we anything we forgotten anything that you know there's there's there's the attempt to bully Africa is a very important aspect because the African Bar Association, which I know well has protested the African Union. He's a delegate to the African Union. Why do they need a $340 million embassy in Cape Verde, if it's not to suit and control Africa. We know about, and this something you should study look at the gray zone on this, the conflict over Ethiopia near Atreia and the Tigray so called rebellion, which is not a rebellion. And the attempt to control that strategic area. These are things which progressives and citizens should try and understand. Look at the gray zone. Look at the tailor report in Canada. It's, there's a lot of material, because the US is not going to give up easily they're losing. They're not as strong as they used to be, but they're not down yet and they have to change their approach to the world. And so, and a lot of people don't realize that this is the, it's an aggressive power, which is trying to control by, I would call them lies. These legal issues are lies. And I mean, obviously we're all concerned about Julian Assange, but that's, and it's extremely important. This is another example of what they what they're doing to this man who all he did is expose us war crimes in Iraq. That's all he did and he's being extra the pushes to extradite him to the United States to stand trial where he isn't even a, where he isn't even a citizen than Australian So that again that extra judicial reach for that US as the world's police judge and jury. It's quite, it's quite alarming. And we really have our work cut out for us and I so appreciate the work that both of you are doing and so I want to just give the audience two websites and then I'll also post it in the comments so that you can easily find things as well. But sanctions kill.org is sanctions kill. You can see T I O N S K I L L dot org and you can find the audience can find the sanctions report that was published yesterday that is on that site. And then also john you mentioned the prior webinar on Alex sob that mass peace action. I posted that can be found on mass peace actions YouTube channel and mass peace action on the internet is M a S S P E a C A C T I O N dot org. I want to remind our audience that you have been watching what the F is going on in Latin America, Code pinks weekly YouTube program of hot news out of Latin America and the Caribbean, you broadcast in partnership with Massachusetts peace action friends of Latin America and Task Force on the Americas. And also, you can now find us on Apple podcasts and Spotify. And I also want to remind all of you that code pink radio broadcasts every Thursday morning at 11am Eastern on WBAI out of New York City and simulcasts out of Washington DC and WPFW. So thank you gentlemen, and I hope that we have a follow up conversation as this as this case proceeds. We'll just keep the audience informed is this very, very important human rights, economic rights, national sovereignty I don't know there's so many, there's so many issues wrapped into into this one man's this one man being basically a political prisoner. I would just like to tell our audience that it's important to spread the word about this case to expose the criminality, the hypocrisy, the line which is involved in this case and the danger that john very well explained to the implication, the international implication of this case as the case of the, the Chinese woman in Canada, in the Y company so thank you john, it was great to do. Thank you. I enjoy listening to you thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you everyone will see you next week on code pink YouTube at 730pm Eastern good night.


While reading the Twitters and I caught a recent David Polk post at discovering a new business that AirPods users could find useful. And it's called PodSwap. After reading the David Polk post about PodSwap, I found their website. And what they do is to replace the batteries in someone else's returned AirPods, clean them, send you the refurbished pair for 60 bucks. And then you return your old pair to them within five days. I did that last week and now have a like new pair that after using for over two hours still has 60% of the battery left. That's pretty cool. Very sweet and much cheaper than buying a new pair or the $98 Apple would charge me to replace both batteries. Yeah. Very cool.


In the last class we have seen hydrogen production by means of thermochemical cycles where the required energy for water splitting can come from any of the thermal means whether it is from nuclear energy or from solar thermal. And the hydrogen is being produced by splitting up of water by means of cycles where certain chemicals they undergo a series of steps finally producing hydrogen and oxygen. Today we will look at electrolysis of water. This is again a method where we can split water to produce hydrogen and oxygen. This is an electrochemical process and it is important in the sense because hydrogen being produced by means of electrolysis is pure, it can be about 99.999% pure as well depending upon the technology used and it is a major technology. It offers several advantages like we can we know that the renewables power is penetration is increasing, the renewable power cost is decreasing. At the same time the renewable energy systems they have a supply demand mismatch because of the intermittency whether it is solar or wind. Water electrolysis can be integrated here such that the excess of electricity whenever being produced can be stored in the form of hydrogen producing by means of electrolysis and then it can be used as required. So it provides a sort of flexibility with the renewable energy system by either providing options like power to X where this X can be either gas. So the renewable based electricity can be used to produce hydrogen and that can be converted to gas that is hydrogen or can be used for producing methane which can be used for various application or it can be for power to power. So the hydrogen which is being produced can be used in a fuel cell to produce power again. It can be power to fuels where the hydrogen produced can be used for producing liquid fuels or it can be for hydrogen to power to heat, power used to produce hydrogen to produce heat. So it offers a wide variety of possibilities when integrated with renewable energy systems. The electrolysis technology it is not a new technology it is since last more than 200 years the development have been there. If we look at the history of electrolysis in the year as early as 1789 J.R. Diamond and A.P. Van Tootswizek they for the first time observed gases being released when they inserted two gold wire into a tube filled with water and subjected to electricity. This after that in 1800 Alessandro Volta he invented the Voltaic pile. After a week after this invention William Nicholson and Anthony Carlesley they have in fact identified they have performed the electrolysis and producing gases. Later these gases evolved were identified as hydrogen and oxygen. The explanation to the process was first provided with the Faraday's law coming up in the year of 1834 when it was explained that the amount of gases being produced is related to the amount of charge being fed in the process. In the year 1869 Zenobe Grammy he came up with the Grammy machine and this was for the first time economical hydrogen production by means of this route. In the year 1888 Dimitri Lachinov he for the first time he came up with the industrial scale hydrogen production using an electrolyzer and this was about by 1902 that more than 400 industrial water electrolyzers were in operation. So it is said that the 1920 to 1970 was a sort of golden period in the development of electrolysis technology where the most of the components most of the technology they were invented and they evolved during this period their components they came into picture in this particular duration. In 1939 the first large scale electrolysis plant it was commissioned and this had a capacity of 10,000 normal meter cube of hydrogen produced per hour. In 1948 the first alkaline water electrolysis was performed by the Lurgi plant came into picture. Then 1966 the polymer electrolyte membrane waste electrolyzer this was first being commissioned by the General Electric and it was in 1978 the solid oxide electrolyzers they were being considered for electrolysis of water. So there were several large scale installations even as early as 1900 early 1900s like about 100 megawatt in Canada electrolyzer plant was installed then as one they installed 144 electrolyzers with a capacity of 162 megawatt and that could generate 32,400 normal meter cube of hydrogen per hour. ABB the Asian Bowery they developed modular electrolyzers that could produce hydrogen of capacity 4,300 normal meter cube per hour. So the technology weighs back to more than 200 years but it was when the production of hydrogen started from hydrocarbons like steam reforming or coal gasification then this process of electrolysis was the interest in it declined. The reason was the process from hydrocarbons hydrogen production that was economical was energy efficient. So the current status is out of the total global hydrogen production a small fraction is by means of water electrolysis roughly 0.03% of it is by water electrolysis. There are two major industries which are performing electrolysis like chloralkali industry where hydrogen comes out as a byproduct. So on electrolysis of a aqua solution of brine get NOH and chlorine and hydrogen as a byproduct. Also aluminium electrovining industry uses electrolysis technique. There are various applications of electrolysis of water other than these like metal plating and metal finishing. It is being integrated with energy conversion devices production extraction purification of metals synthesis of various chemicals water purification systems. So there are various still the applications of electrolysis of water. Now in order to understand the electrolysis of water let us look at the basics of it. If we look at a simple electrochemical cell which is one of the which is the smallest unit of an electrolyzer. When combined in different ways forms an electrolyzer that how we can combine those electrolytic cells we will see in the later part of the in the late in the other classes. So this is an electrochemical cell having two electrodes and a node and a cathode being separated by means of a separator or a diaphragm. When an electric current is passed through it then the reactions occurs in such a way that the electrons flows through the outer circuit and ions within the electrolyte from one electrode to another. Now depending upon which electrolyte it is whether it is an acidic electrolyte H plus ion flows if it is alkaline electrolyte then OH minus ions flows. The ions flow in such a manner that H plus in case of acid electrolyte they reach at the cathode combined with the two electron and hydrogen is evolved at the cathode side. Similarly water gets splitted and H plus ions are released which pass through this electrolyte through this separator across the electrolyte to reach to cathode. And oxygen in this process is evolved at the anode side. So the oxygen evolves at anode and hydrogen evolves at the cathode side. This is how the basic electrolytic cell works. In order to get a idea about the various reactions that occurs what is the thermodynamics behind the process involved electrochemical process of the electrolysis. What is the kinetics involved? How the cell performs? What is the efficiency? We will start with the basic understanding of the process. So fundamentals of electrolysis of water. So the basic reaction we can write is that water in its liquid state dissociates to give hydrogen, gas and oxygen. Now in this step the liquid water which undergoes the dissociation the enthalpy change of the process is 285.84 kJ per mole. Now this is highly endothermic. The Gibbs free energy change in the process under standard conditions is delta H minus T delta S. Where delta S is given by 163.15 this is 163.15 Joule per mole Kelvin. So we can find out the delta G for this process and this comes out to be 237.22 kJ per mole. These are under standard conditions. By standard conditions we mean temperature of 298 Kelvin and a pressure of 1 bar which is approximately 1.01 atmosphere. Now we can see that the enthalpy change is highly endothermic as such the delta G is positive thus it is a non-spontaneous process. And it requires certain amount of energy which needs to be fed for the splitting up of water. And that required energy comes in the form of electrical energy in the process. So when we supply this electrical energy in that case the water splits into hydrogen and oxygen the constituents. Now this is when the splitting up of water occurs when it is in liquid state. Now if it is in vapor state it splits to give hydrogen and oxygen. For this particular process the value of delta H naught is 241.8 kJ per mole delta S for this process is 44.1 Joule per mole Kelvin. And delta G can be found from this at the standard temperature pressure conditions that comes out to be 228.66 kJ per mole. So this is when the starting water is in liquid state or if it is in vapor state. The difference between the delta H values for the two states when water is in liquid state to when water is in vapor state. And that equals to 44.04 kJ per mole. And this is nothing but the required enthalpy for vaporization of water. Now if we look at the temperature dependence of these thermodynamic functions, these state functions and if we plot these functions then we can see that at 100 degree centigrade approximately at 100 degree centigrade there is a disconnect between the lines and this corresponds to the vaporization of water. So prior to that it is in liquid state and thereafter it is in vapor state. So if we see the values this is the delta H value, the change in the enthalpy of the reaction it remains almost constant in the entire temperature range of study. So the enthalpy change which is required for splitting up of one mole of water to produce its constituent hydrogen and oxygen this is almost constant throughout the temperature range as the temperature increases till even the 1000 degrees centigrade. If we see the value for T delta S again there is a discontinuity in the beginning that is corresponding to the vapor phase and then this discontinuity this corresponds to the vaporization of water. So T delta S we can see that it increases as the temperature of operation increases. The change in delta S is nominally small but the product T delta S it increases. At the same time the value of delta G it decreases as the temperature increases in the process. At a temperature of 25 degrees centigrade it is observed that 15% of the requirement is of heat or the thermal energy the contribution of which comes from T delta S and the remaining 85% is by means of electricity which changes at 1000 degree centigrade however the situation changes that one third of the energy requirement is in the form of heat or the thermal energy requirement and two third of it is in the form of electricity in the process. Now these equations which we have mentioned they have a temperature dependence.  The term T delta S it has temperature dependence and this delta H represents the total amount of energy required to split one mole of water in the process. T delta S term requires the total amount of energy the thermal energy or heat energy which is required in the process while delta G represents the total amount of electrical energy required to split one mole of water. So the total energy wherein certain contribution is from electrical energy and the remaining contribution is from thermal energy. Now what temperature is best for performance of electrolysis can be decided by means of the electrical energy input how much is the energy consumed what is the cost which is required for producing hydrogen. So if we look at the low temperature processes low temperature electrolysis like the polymer electrolyte membrane based electrolysis or alkaline water electrolysis that we will see in more detail later for low temperature electrolysis roughly the energy requirement is about 4 to 6 kilowatt hour per normal meter cube of hydrogen being produced. While for high temperature electrolysis this energy demand is about 3.6 kilowatt hour per normal meter cube of hydrogen being produced. So this is for solid oxide electrolyte electrolyzer or this is for PEM or water alkaline water electrolyzers. So we can see that high temperature electrolysis has advantage of lower electricity requirement. At the same time the energy thermal energy requirement can also be fed by means of the waste heat which is available from the industrial processes or from other processes. But the major disadvantage is that the high temperature electrolysis are still it is not major it is under development and there are challenges. There are materials related challenges operation at such high temperatures and there are certain technical challenges like when we are using pressurized water and the leaks associated leaks with it. So there are several other challenges that still needs to be considered before the high temperature electrolysis or solid oxide electrolysis could be commercialized. Now let us look at the cell voltages the reversible and the thermonutrile cell voltages. Now we have seen that delta G delta S they are the required energies total energy at the same time the delta G is the electrical energy requirement and delta H is the total energy required for water splitting. Certain percentage of weight is coming from the T delta S term. Now the process as we have seen delta G is greater than 0 in case of electrolysis the process is non-spontaneous and we have to supply the required energy in order to accomplish the decomposition. Now if we see the delta G value under standard conditions this is NFE. Now we know that the work required done in order to carry a charge Q across a potential difference E is given by Q into E and that can be written as NFE where N is the number of charges involved. So here it is the number of electrons involved in the process number of electrons transferred occurring during one mole of water splitting. F is the Faraday's constant. This value of Faraday constant is 96485 Coulomb per mole. This is the charge on electron per mole and delta G is the free energy change associated with the reaction. Now for this particular transformation if we see the delta G change as a function of temperature and pressure this is change in the enthalpy as a function of temperature and pressure minus the T delta S term and this is greater than 0 for the process. So if this transformation occurs at a temperature T and P and pressure P then this is the related equation. So this is the net electrical energy input this is the net heat input for the process and then we can write the voltage corresponding voltage as it is delta G upon N into F. This thermodynamic voltage E is also known as free energy voltage or reversible voltage. Similarly we can write for in terms of enthalpy voltage this is N delta H upon N F this is enthalpy voltage or known as thermonutrile voltage. If we represent the cell voltage for an electrochemical cell by U then in that case it has if we relate that with E and V so if this is the cell voltage if the cell voltage is less than the reversible voltage or the free energy voltage in that case the electrolysis will not occur as the system will not have the required energy for the process to take place. If the cell voltage is higher than the free energy voltage but it is lower than the enthalpy voltage electrolysis process will occur but it will require certain amount of thermal energy and that can be taken from either from the surroundings or from the internal energy of the cell and this is not a desired state and as such a cell is not operated under such conditions because the economics does not favour. So this current density will be very low and it is not desirable to operate in this region. However when the cell voltage is higher than this voltage V which is thermonutrile voltage or enthalpy voltage in that case the electrolysis will occur and sufficient current will flow for the process to occur and at the same time there will be certain heat losses involved. So the process will start and the heat losses will be there. So it cannot maintain the isothermicity in the process. Let us even calculate the values for these thermodynamic voltages under standard conditions. Now if we look at the standard conditions the value of reversible voltage under standard conditions is represented by E naught and that can be given by delta G naught upon the number of electrons transferred that is 2 and the Faraday's constant and finally we can put in these values to find out the reversible cell voltage and which comes out to be 1.23 volt. The thermonutrile voltage V naught can be found by putting in the values for delta H naught and NF and that is approximately 1.48 volt. So these are under standard conditions of 298 Kelvin and 1 bar pressure, temperature of 298 Kelvin and 1 bar pressure. Now if you want to see how does these vary with temperature and pressure. How does the efficiency changes? Understanding that we will be able to understand the performance of the electrochemical cell. So if we look at the temperature dependence of the process for one mole of water being split into to get hydrogen and oxygen in that process the change in the delta H and at say one atmospheric pressure can be obtained as delta H at a temperature of T pressure 1 is given by the enthalpy voltage V upon 2F where 2 is for N the number of electrons transferred and this is given by the change in the enthalpy by my subtracting the products from the reactant side enthalpy. So the enthalpy for hydrogen under the same condition for oxygen minus that for water. Same can be done for finding out delta G value which is the reversible cell voltage or the free energy voltage divided by 2F and this is again subtracting Gibbs free energy of products minus that of reactant which is water here. This change in enthalpy for species I where this species can be hydrogen or it can be oxygen can be obtained as there are certain constants A, B, C and E which are given by this table. The coefficients multiplied by the difference in temperatures T minus T naught T square minus T naught square another factor 1 upon T minus 1 upon T naught and similarly 1 upon T square minus 1 upon T naught square with different coefficients. Now there are different correlations available. Similarly the change in the entropy can be written A ln of T minus ln of T naught B 10 to power minus 3 T minus T naught minus C by 2 10 to power 5 1 upon T square minus 1 upon T naught square E by 3 10 to power 8 1 upon T to the power cube minus 1 upon T naught to the power cube. T naught is the reference temperature being considered and this is the table for these coefficients A, B, C and E. So there are different correlations available and if we substitute all these values we can get the value for the enthalpy voltage substituting the value of A, B, C and E. Similarly we can get the value for the free energy voltage. This is a curve showing how these voltages vary for different temperatures. Now again there is a discontinuity observed in case of the enthalpy voltage corresponding to the vaporization of water at 100 degree centigrade. After that these changes in the voltage these are similar to what we have seen the changes in the thermodynamic potentials and these are correspondingly similar as the variations in the delta H and delta G with temperature that we have seen earlier. So if we see here the V of T it is almost remaining constant however the E of T that changes as the temperature of the cell changes. As such the total required energy which is sum of the Gibbs free energy or the electrical energy input and the required thermal energy input remains almost constant. However if certain amount of energy is fed by means of the thermal energy by the term delta S then the required electrical energy input reduces as such still the total energy input requires same. This actually has a benefit when we come when we look at the high temperature electrolysis. Now if we also see the pressure dependence of the thermodynamic voltage then del E upon del P that is the thermodynamic voltage variation with pressure at a constant temperature is given by 1 upon Nf del of delta G upon del P and this can be written in terms of the stoichiometric coefficient epsilon i RT upon Nf into pressure of species i whether it is hydrogen or oxygen and this gives this can be summed up for the different species whether it is hydrogen or oxygen. So i is the individual species involved in the process so del D upon del P i at a constant temperature. Now this can be integrated such that E is equal to E naught plus summation over the species i stoichiometric term RT upon Nf R is the gas constant ideal gas constant coefficient at a temperature T Nf upon Nf ln of P i upon P naught. Now when we put the different species when we consider the different species involved both hydrogen and oxygen in the process. So E is equal to E naught plus RT upon Nf summed over i ln partial pressure of hydrogen P H2 upon P naught and stoichiometric coefficient is half. So P oxygen upon P naught to the power half. Now in this case let us say if the pressure of hydrogen is P and that is also the pressure of oxygen. So we can rewrite this expression as E is equal to E naught plus 3 RT upon 4f ln of P however if in the process the pressure changes from P1 to P2 then we can write the change in the voltage thermodynamic voltage as 3 RT upon 4f ln of P2 upon P1. And if let us say the initial pressure P1 is 1 bar then we can write the delta E as 3 RT upon 4f ln of P. This can be plotted as the variation at different temperatures. Let us say the temperature being considered at 25 degree or 100 degree centigrade. We can plot this ET as a function of pressure till 70 MPa or 700 bar. We can see that with the increase in temperature the voltage reduces. Now these expressions that we have derived we have considered the ideal gas equation. We can apply ideal gas equation for pressures usually less than 10 bar. However to get more accurate expressions the state equations needs to be considered and these state equations needs to be applied for higher pressures than 10 bar and then we can get the accurate relationships for the variation of pressure. To summarize this part we have seen the thermodynamics associated with electrolysis. We have seen that the process of electrolysis is a non-spontaneous process where the energy is required for the process to take place which can be supplied by means of electricity. Under standard conditions we have seen what are the different thermodynamic voltages and we have also seen how these thermodynamic voltages they vary with temperature and pressure. In the next class we will see what are the different components involved in the electrolyzer, what are the different barriers to the flow of current and how that affects the efficiency of the electrolyzer. Thank you.


If you're looking for expert legal answers to all your property-related questions, then stay tuned. It's lovely to welcome you back to your Property Rights Podcast. Hello, I'm Paul Rotheram and this show proudly brought to you by Private Property. I'm joined in studio once again by the lovely Silna Stain, who is an expert when it comes to property law. With a specific focus on rentals and evictions, Silna is the MD of SSLR Incorporated Attorneys. Nice to have you with me, Silna. Hey Paul, nice to be back. Thank you very much. It's a wonderful topic today. Are you a pet owner? Are you a pet lover? I am. I am. I think sometimes I'm more Noah than an attorney. I'm definitely a super pet person. Do you have a farm at home then? I do. Oh boy. I'm that person with the three cats. I'm willing to admit it and a dog. Well I must admit you fall short because with something like 50 koi, seven cats and two dogs, I take the cake for this one. In fact, I don't. The person who takes the cake is you because we got your question. We thought this was a fabulous question to include in your Property Rights Podcast. The person writes as follows, I am at my wit's end. My next door neighbor has a large breed dog which barks and howls nonstop throughout the night. Been there, done that. I've tried reaching out to the owners but I've been told that the dog is deterring intruders and for that I should be grateful. However, writes this person, it is very hard to be grateful when you've only had two hours of sleep. And so the question that kicks off our second episode is this, please help. I am an animal lover. I cannot live like this anymore. What do I do?  I think we all know, even though we love animals and sometimes the neighbors' pets are a little more pricky than what we would like them to be. So in a case like this, unfortunately, from the question, it seems to be a normal suburban sort of setup, so not necessarily a sectional title setup and I'll get back to why that would be relevant. If we look at just a suburban setup, you stay in this house, number 13, I stay in number 15, look at my lawyer mathematics, keeping up with skipping a number there. Because number 14 wouldn't be next door to be over the road. Exactly, look at us, we know property. So Paul, a lot of things can happen and this is actually a specific part of law called neighbor law. I kid you not, there's an entire section of law dealing with neighbor law. What should neighbors be doing? How should they be interacting? And how is this enforced? And the problem with neighbor law is very often the governing body is the municipality. And essentially, if we struggle sometimes to get rates, clearance certificates, can you imagine how surprised the poor municipality would be if you rock up to the municipality's office with a complaint about the neighbor's dog? You're wasting your time. You definitely are. And potentially a bit of frustration that would go wasted for absolutely no reason. So the way this listener handled the situation is unfortunately the only way you can to try and approach the neighbor and negotiate. The truth about neighbor law is there is a very purposeful litigation avoidance. Even though it's the end, you're entitled to litigation with your neighbors. I personally discourage this simply because you live next to each other. And litigation, very often when I start talking about litigation, I realize people one day if I am in fact an attorney because I discourage litigation as far as I can. Probably because I see firsthand how litigation affects people. It's damaging. It's damaging. In every way, financially, emotionally, it's damaging. So to litigate with the neighbor might not be the best emotional choice. If you think that the barking dogs keeping you up, the stress of litigation and not to mention the financial stress that goes with that, will keep you awake much more. So I'm not saying let the dog bark, get yourself some nice earplugs. I am saying avoid litigation with your neighbor at all costs unless it's really necessary and it would make financial sense and you are willing to go into a three, four year legal battle and I am not exaggerating. At this stage our court rolls are massively contested. So to get into court with something like this is going to take quite a lot of time. Practically what do we do? So I'm not going to give a legal answer here, I'm giving a practical answer. Practically do a letter to the neighbor, do a kind letter. And a friendly letter. Exactly. Not an aggressive, threatening letter. As you said, be neighborly. Exactly. And for the moment really my advice is avoid attorneys. The moment that letter comes on an attorney's letterhead, gloves are off and the fight is on. So you're saying don't use an attorney's letterhead? Not yet. Just use that pretty paper that you've got on the kitchen counter, like you're writing a sick note for your son or daughter at school. A hundred percent and say I can't sleep because of the dog.  It's not that you have issues with pets and this is, even if you do, just tell this story. I am the biggest fan of Ubuntu. This is my other part of the law that I really enjoy and I present seminars to the Law Society on the topic of Ubuntu as well. And with that in mind approach the neighbor with a conversation, try not to be antagonistic.  Wait for your second cup of coffee until you calm and properly awake. Walk across the street, knock on the door, ring the bell. You can't knock on doors. Ring on the bell and say this is the problem or write it down. Like I said, push the letter, you know, stick it to the gate or whatever and ask for conversation. Don't make a lot of demands because this neighbor is probably as frustrated with the situation as you are and probably seven times more embarrassed about the situation. So to confront this person, now I'm sounding more like a psychiatrist in a... They've hired you for all of your capabilities stillness. So keep it coming. So rather approach with with an open conversation and say, how can we help? Maybe the problem is they do want to keep the dog outside, but he wants to be able to go in and out and maybe suggest a doggy door, a big doggy door. Something like that to to practically address the situation. But the truth is if the dog is going to bark and howl outside and they want a dog outside for protection purposes, maybe they should rather consider cameras or laser beams or something outside. The dog in fairness will probably enjoy sleeping inside more as it is. But unfortunately in law, in the context of a normal suburban area, there isn't really something that we can do other than having a discussion when it comes to pets. If it was, like I said in the beginning, when I started answering, I started giving my very long answer. When it comes to sectional title, it could be very different. Okay. Suddenly with sectional title. Living in a townhouse complex where you're literally a meter away from each other's bedroom windows. Yeah. Exactly. And even more importantly, where we have conduct rules. So the conduct rules of the complex will deal with things like this. Are you allowed to have pets? If you're allowed to have pets, what kind of pets? And if you have noisy pets or loud pets, you must control it. So you have to bring the dog inside something like that. In a case like that, and where the conduct rules does allow for action by the body corporate in a situation like this, they will take action and here as a tenant can either request your landlord to approach the body corporate to deal with this situation or if you're an owner in the body corporate approach the managing agent say this is the problem. Once again, even though you have that extra layer which you don't in a normal suburban area, I still recommend just go have the conversation. Most people are nicer than what we give them credit for. Sectional title law almost gives me a little bit more of a safety net and more protection than if I'm living in the suburb. If I'm in the suburbs, are you saying that there's not really anything I can do unless perhaps we're bordering on abuse? In which case that could be an issue for the SPCA, I'm guessing. Yes, 100%. So unfortunately, if the dogs are really going mad, like you said, maybe getting the SPCA involved or if there's abuse, definitely get the SPCA involved. But intersectional title complex, if the conduct rules does not deal with this as an owner and then as a member of the body corporate, you can raise it and ask the body corporate to make a rule around animals and barking and noise. And that will be raised at an AGM or an annual general meeting. Or if it's very important to deal with it quickly, a special general meeting to amend the conduct rules to cater for that. My final question, Silna, because we're almost out of time with this, our second episode, it is your property rights podcast brought to you by private property. Is there or are there any bylaws? I'm sure I remember arriving in this country from the UK in the early 80s and there were actually restrictions on how many animals you could have in, I'm talking about the typical suburbs. Now, to your knowledge, which hopefully you have lots of being a legal expert, is there a limit to the number of cats, dogs or whatever animals there are that you are allowed in a home? So our bylaws are very specific when it comes to these kind of things. But every single municipality's bylaws would be unique and different. So we don't have a one standard set rule. I remember what you are talking about. There was a limit. I think it was actually two dogs and two cats.  There was a license. Yes, there was a license fee. And that's been done away with. But you do have rules around pets. And that's why we're not allowed to keep like cows and stuff in this suburban area. It comes from the same bylaws. So maybe check your bylaws. Maybe you're lucky. But unfortunately, I haven't seen recent bylaws that is clear enough. But maybe I just limited to, say, city of Johannesburg, city of Cape Town, bigger metropolitan areas. So maybe I don't know there could be bylaws that could assist. Well, there you go. There's something that you could chat about in the comments section. Start the conversation. What are the bylaws in your area? Are your neighbors upholding those bylaws? Because if they're not, there is obviously a room for you to take some sort of action. Although we are suggesting, as you've heard from Silner, be kind, be courteous, be neighborly, be polite. Remember that the same person who you are potentially swearing at today and cursing could be the same person who's helping you fetch your child from school next week. So be neighborly, be nice. And we'd love to hear your story. And thank you very much. Barking Mad, episode two of our Property Rights podcast. And I thought that was a really wonderful question. So thank you for submitting that. I think we've given you the answer there. Do join us for episode three of this show, Your Property Rights Show. And it's brought to you by Private Property. I'm Paul Rotheram, and thank you for listening.  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