Hi, ladies and gentlemen. How are you doing? Welcome to TAM MDC 2014. And let me introduce my good friend, Jamie Ian Swiss. Good evening, friends. Thanks for being here. I have to say, I am truly proud of the fact that we have done what? Four of these now? I think this is the fourth. And we've actually pulled off them successfully. Well, that's what you mean by successfully. And hopefully we'll do that again tonight, right? Yes, indeed. Yeah, this is sometimes I wonder about this. When I think about the million dollar challenge and the challenge part of it, especially when it's done in front of a live audience like this, I often think the challenge is what we have to go through. Yes, there is a much part of it that is a personal challenge every year. Yeah, it's extremely difficult. I mean, we've been through a lot this weekend too, right? I mean, a lot, a lot of hours, a lot of man hours. Yeah, you don't see it. Everybody keeps asking, where have you been? You're not on stage this year really much. Where have you been? Yeah, I think I saw... It's been us locked in a room making this happen. I saw like two talks. That was it. So yeah, that was it. I was kind of busy. But what I know, let's get to the actual challenge itself. So we have a very interesting challenge, as I've already said, a gentleman by the name of Fei Wang. It's actually spelled W-A-N-G, but it's pronounced wang in China. And he admits an energy, he says he admits an energy from his right hand that other people can feel and they can feel it through cardboard. They can feel it through foil. And I'm going to bring Kristen, who is now our associate director, out on stage to tell you a little bit more about Fei Wang. So please look at this. This is Kristen Lambert, part of the Million Dollar Challenge Committee. She got it? Thank you, Banachek. You're welcome. Our claimant, Mr. Fei Wang, is 32 years old. He's from Southwest China. In high school, he realized that he could heal his own pain, such as a muscle soreness or body aches, although he just assumed that it was a coincidence of positive thought. He went to college. He studied math and physics, but eventually received his B.A. in marketing. He started to work in export sales. Not long after college, he attempted to use his energy to heal a friend's shoulder. They thought both shoulders were hurt. Let's give this a go. He performed the healing energy on one shoulder, and that shoulder felt fine. The other shoulder was still in pain. So he thought maybe this is worth looking into more. Someone suggested Qigong, which is very popular in his region. He went to a Qigong master. The Qigong master was very impressed with his skills, saying that the energy that he was able to emanate from his hand takes most Qigong practicers years and years and years to be able to obtain. And Mr. Wang felt that he was not in need to practice, and in fact, he felt that his power was growing stronger as time went on. And that's what led him to decide to move to Boston, the academic hub, because he thought that he might be able to research his power. And while he has not been able to gain audience with any academics or professionals, he has worked with local paranormal group, and he's also worked with a local Chinese alternative medicine organization. And so today marks his first official scientific test. Thank you, Kristen. Thanks, Kristen. Kristen, you can just wait. Yeah, go on. So I'm going to bring out Chip Denman. Chip Denman is on the board of directors for the JRF, but he's also a statistician. We rely upon Chip to come up with the numbers for every test that we conduct. So if I can get Chip out here, please, it's here for Chip Denman. Thanks, Chip. Thank you. When we design these tests, we want to be fair in a couple of ways. On one hand, we don't want to give away the money just for lucky guesses. We have to design the test so that the chances of winning of passing are relatively low. And tonight in the test that we're doing, the requirement is that there will be at least eight out of nine correct. And the chances of that happening are approximately 2%. On the other hand, we want to be fair in another way. We want to make sure that if the person truly has the ability that they say that they have, there should be a relatively high chance that they will indeed pass the test. Tonight, our claimant believes he will be extremely consistent. For purposes of our calculations, we assume that that could mean as much as 90% of the time being correct. So the chances, if that is in fact the case, of passing the test are roughly 77%. So we believe that is as fair a balance as we can achieve in the constraints that we have in the time tonight. Perfect. Thank you. Thanks, Chip. Somebody else who has been extremely important to me and to all of us at the last few of these tests, has been Richard Saunders. And Richard helps actually write up the protocol. We throw things back and forth. So let me bring Richard Saunders out here, please, because you're going to be seeing a lot of him tonight. Thank you, Richard. I'm going to also be bringing up the claimant, because what we want to do right now is we want to go through and show you very loosely what's going to be going on through each one of these. We have what we call a subject. We have the claimant. And we also have Jamie, who the claimant says is definitely not psychic. He's a psychic as a dorenail. And dorenails don't have brains, so that's yes. Get it all out of your system now. But in seriousness, before we call him out, so this is really the right time to talk about this. Here's some of the things that are going on here. We're going to do a little demo. It's not an actual trial, because Mr. Wong won't be actually using his forces yet. But we're going to walk you through a demo of everything here to explain the experiment, because as we've told you and you have accepted so patiently every year now, you are not our priority. We care about you, but the test is our priority, right? And every year, that limits some things and creates some inconveniences. And this year, it means that a lot of the primary action of the trials will be concealed from you. And you will see how this works in a few moments. You won't be able to see it. And later tonight at the bar, whatever we can talk about why that is, you can surmise some of that yourself. But the point is, so in deference to use, we are going to walk through an approximation of what's actually happening here. And that way, you can have the idea in your head of, you'll hear, you will see some of it. You will see some of it. And you will hear the various voices and all the steps. I think it's all going to make sense to you. We're going to explain it to you right now. But there's certain key parts. And what it really comes down to those key parts is that as a control, in order to do this test, Mr. Wong will make an attempt to have an effect on the subject in each round. And I, in the place of a control claimant, if you will, will step forward and do a similar action. And as Banachek said, he is satisfied that I do not have this ability. I am satisfied I do not have this ability. But in every other way, I'm going to duplicate the conditions, duplicate the actions. So there's a trial and a session. A trial consists of both Mr. Wong doing his action and also of Jamie performing the exact same action. A session is each one of those actions. It'll be Jamie doing it or Mr. Wong. So we'll walk you through it now. We're going to give you the model, we're going to give you the model of the action, and then we'll explain the rest to you before we go on. So I think you can bring them on. Well, we need, yeah, we bring it on for the pseudo subject. I'm sorry, yeah, okay. So, well, he's not there, do you know where? Yeah, Brian's backstage. Brian, are you backstage? Brian, if you can hear us, you could bring Mr. Wong forward. I guess we didn't really allow for this. No, we got it, see? I love it when a plan comes together. Hold on, let me do that right now. Now, as Mr. Wong comes out here, I do want to point out something to you, that he's had the respect for us to come here and perform this this evening and give his demonstration for us. So if you would have the exact same respect for him, I ask that there's no giggling, no tittering, nothing like that, I ask you not to, if you can try not to cough, if you have to cough, you have to try not to cough. He actually requires silence in the course of the trial. So we ask you to comply with that, please. Yeah, so this is Faye Wong right here, and I want to point out that, hi Hal, thank you very much for coming. Thank you. And this is going to be sort of, like Jamie said, an approximation of what we're doing. You'll see the actual thing later on, but we want to do want to get through this. You'll notice that Chip is over there, that he's holding a bag, and inside of that bag, there are two balls. There's a black ball, and there is a white ball. The black ball represents Jamie, as you can see he's dressed all in black. The white ball will represent Mr. Faye Wong, and those are going to be chosen at random. We're just going to use Brian as our subject for now. The subject will have a seat, and we have a cardboard box, and Faye has said that his ability actually works through the box. So there's going to be a point where the subject can be placing his hand in the box. So if you just place his hand inside of the box for me. And according to Mr. Wong's specifications, we have pre-screened the subjects, so that he has found them suitable and receptive. Brian's just playing the role of his subject right now, but the subjects we're actually using, we've spent several days actually pre-screening. Many, many hours finding them, and Mr. Wong agrees that those people definitely are sensitive to his ability. Now I will tell you this, right now Mr. Wong is not going to be putting out any energy when we do this. Mr. Wong tells me that he can always sense his own ability. He knows when the power's working, and he's going to be letting me know that. But for this purposes, he's just going to be going through the actions. What we're going to do is we're also going to place a blindfold onto the subject. The subject will normally place a blindfold on the cells as you will see in the protocol, but you can place it on him for right now. When you see the rest of the test, the subject is blinded actually in many ways. You'll see there's a lot of blocks to feedback, and so we don't need this blindfold or these hearing protectors to be absolute. They're just contributors to muffling sound and helping to seal him in, but this is not the only thing blinding, as you will see. And the earmuffs basically just keep out, just the small sound, the shuffling, the movement. They'll both be wearing socks, as you can see right now, so that will deaden the sound a little bit more. You'll see more about what we're talking in a little bit. When we're actually ready for this, Mr. Wong will need about up to four minutes to get his energy ready. The moment that he tells me that his energy is ready, that's when we'll begin. And at that point, the curtains will be closing so you will not be able to see certain things happening, but I'll explain more about that in a minute. What is going to be happening is this. I will be telling Chip to shake up the balls, to put his hand in there, give him a good mix, and then to give it a good shake, and to reach in and take out one of the balls. And this will be out of view, obviously, of the subject. Now, as I stated, the black ball represents Jamie, so at that point, I will ask the participant that's been represented by the ball to step up. And from the other side of the curtain, I will be telling Richard that the participant is ready to begin, and he will let the subject know that we're about to begin. The first session is about to begin. I will have a stopwatch, I'll hit that stopwatch, and they will have one minute for their abilities. You don't have to take the whole minute, but go ahead. The actual test itself, just so you know, the right hand is kept six centimeters away from the box. It doesn't come past a point that we've marked off. Good. Now, that subject, that participant will step back. The hand will come out and relax for a little bit, for about 20 seconds. Yep. The session one is over. Take the hand out, the hand comes down, and then participant number two will step up, which will be Mr. Wong at this point, go ahead. Hands goes inside of the box. Session two is about to begin. And I say go. Okay, that's good for now. Yep. He's not putting out any energy right now. We didn't want to waste his energy for this evening. And then what I will do is at that point, I'll ask him both to step back. They'll be facing away from the audience, so that there can be no cues given off as this person is giving their response. I'll ask them to remove their hand. Remove their hand now. Curtains will open up. You'll also remove the headphones. You can remove the blindfold. And your blindfold. And then I will be stepping up, and I will be asking very specific questions, and those questions will be, did you feel anything in your hand during the first session? It'll be a simple yes or no. Did you feel anything during the second session? A simple yes or no? Yes. So in that case, a number two for the second session will be placed up there. I will then ask Chip to reveal to you who went second. The claimant said that would be a hit. All right, do you understand? That would be a hit. Now, what happens if the subject says they felt something both times? Mr. Wong has agreed that when he does this, it will be stronger. So I will simply ask which session felt stronger, the first or the second? If they don't feel anything at all, that is considered a no, that's considered a fail. And once again, he has to get eight out of nine for this to work. So do we miss anything? I think we're good, I think we can show them the real thing here. All right, let's do that. Let's open the curtains. Let's go open the curtains all the way, please. Oh wait, no, I need the chair, thank you. Yep, I need Mr. Wong, if you'll come with me, please. I want you to have a seat right here. The most important part is the sighing of the protocol. I'm just gonna read off this front page to you if I can find my glasses as usual. Here they are, that's not glasses, I still need my glasses, but I'll be good, yeah.  Yeah, okay, so this is the agreed protocol between the JREF MDC and Mr. Fei Wong, hearing also referred to as Mr. Wong for the claimant, for the preliminary test of the James Randy Educational Foundation's Million Dollar Challenge, hearing also referred to as a JREF MDC or the MDC. To be conducted approximately 7.30 p.m. on Sunday, July the 13th, 2014. At the South Point DeSino and Spa in Las Vegas, Nevada. Claim, Mr. Wong's claim, in his words is, I have some supernatural power that I can send out from my right hand and other people can simply feel it at a distance, not about approximately 30 centimeters away, means he can be 30 centimeters away, he can actually be further than that, he goes on to say. In other words, Mr. Wong's claims that he can project or transmit a power of force or energy, here are two unknown to science from his right hand into the right hand of a subject. The subject will be able to feel the energy by way of warmth or other notable sensation in his or her right hand. It also claimed that this energy, possibly known as Qi Kong, can be transmitted through various materials including wood, plastic and metal and is effective at a distance of 22 centimeters to 100 centimeters, so a vast range right there. It is important to note that this claimed ability still works even if the subject is unaware of the direct actions of the claimant. As the claimant's energy is not within the current knowledge of laws of physics for unknown to science, for the purpose of the J. Riff MDC is considered supernatural or paranormal. It is understood by both parties that this preliminary test is the first part of the MDC challenge and if the claimant passes, he will move on to a formal test to be given at a later date agreed upon by both parties. It is understood by the claimant that if he fails this preliminary demonstration, he will not move on to the formal demonstration and will not be able to reapply for the MDC for a period of 12 months from the date of the signing of this document. Now, I will need you to sign that page but before you do, you've gone through this protocol, you've looked at the protocol and you agree that it's a fair protocol. Is that correct? And we've worked this together to make sure that it's fair to you. Is that correct? Good. Then what I need you to do is to sign right there and I will sign below that and I need you to initial each one of the pages as well. Open my initials right there. Yep. Yep. And these pages are these initialing all the protocol that he's already read and if you'll, and agree to, there you go. And if you'll sign right there please and I will sign below you and if you're just initial the last few pages and the last page, there we go. Thank you very much. Mr. Fay, thank you very much. If you'll step back that way. If everybody would take their positions, I would appreciate it. Just talk about this for a moment. So now that you've seen the demo just to explain the rest of the details, put this here Richard. So this is an approximation of what you saw or I should say that's an approximation of this. So here's the cardboard box, right? And this is just all screening so there's no leakage front to back and that cardboard box is available at the back and that's where Mr. Wang and I will be taking our turns and so once we are ready to bring a subject as you'll see in a few moments we're gonna close these side curtains, we're gonna keep closing and opening them. The side curtains will come all the way up to about here. So what you will not see is everything that happened on this side of the box. And that's so that no one knows who's going first and who's going second. It's as simple as that. And then as soon as the trial is done or the two sessions comprise a trial is that the language we decided on. So as soon as each trial is done and we'll take out the subject, we'll open up the curtains again and so that's really designed quite frankly for your benefit so you can see as much as possible. Chip will tell us who went in what order, Kristen will take the record, we'll move on. We have three subjects that we're going to do three rounds with, each subject will be three times, they'll be walking, they'll be taken in and out, we'll take a few moments. There is obviously, you can see there are cameras on the front, there is a camera in the back here that is not part of the feed, we can't have it part of the feed but it is keeping a complete videotape record of everything that's occurring here. Right. Anything else? I think we just proceed and yeah, let's do it. Okay, so we're ready to go. All right. Thanks for your time and attention. Thank you. Can we get the curtain open further please? Thank you. Good, and if we can get the first subject to come on out and Richard, yeah. Step over here. Brian, if you'll bring the first subject out. Okay, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, leave it open. I actually need it open all the way please, yeah, thank you, yeah. I'll call the closing and open it, yeah. That's good. All right, what we're gonna do is we're gonna have the subject place their hand inside of the box if he would do that for me, Richard. And we'll leave it in there for about 30 seconds just so they get used to having their hand inside of that box. And right now Mr. Wang is going to get ready and he will let me know whenever he's ready. Richard, you can move their hand from the box please. Thank you. All right, Mr. Wang is ready. Richard, please have the subject place the blindfold. Not yet. Please have the subject place the blindfold on and the ear mufflers, let me know when they're done please. Good, place the subject's hand in the box again. All right, now we close the curtains. And Chip, if you'll step over here please. All right, if you'll reach, not yet, but just reach in the bag, give them a good mix. Give them a good shake and the curtains are closed. Are we ready back there, Richard? You okay? All right, move a ball and would you show it to the participants? And can I get that participant to step up to the box? Richard, let the subject know that we are about to begin. Okay, start. All right, one minute's up. Can I get the participant to step back please? Richard, remove the subject's hand and have them relax. We'll take about 20 seconds from here. All right, remove their hand from the box please. Put it back in. Let me know when they're in there, Richard. Okay, second participant, if you would step up please. We're, let them know we're about to begin. One minute has passed. Richard, remove their hands from the box please. Remove the blindfold. Remove the earmuffs. Good, and can I get the claimant in control to please step back and face the wall? Open the curtain please. Thank you. Hi, did you feel anything in your hand during the first session? Yes. Did you feel anything in your hand during the second session? Which session was stronger, the first or the second session? The first session. So would you mark that as a number one please? And Chip, if you would let us know who stepped up for the first session? The black ball was chosen. Jamie went first. Jamie went first, so that would be a fail. Okay, good. Can we get the subject back please and get the next subject in? Thank you. Richard, if you would have the subject place their hand inside of the box please. Let me know when they've got it in there. Thank you. All right, take their hand out of the box. Okay, Mr. Wong is ready. Richard, place the subject, the blindfold on please in the muffler. Let me know when you're done. All right, place their hand into the box please. And let's close the curtains. Chip, if you'll start to mix the balls please. Place your hand in there, give them a good mix and they give it a good shake. And remove one anytime you want to. Would the participant indicated by the color of the ball please step up to the box? Richard, let the subject know we're about to begin. We start. One minute is up. Richard, remove the subject's hand and have them relax. Okay, all right, good. Thank you very much. Richard, have them remove the blindfold. Remove the muffs as well please. Claiming in control, please step back and face the wall. Okay, good. Richard, put their blindfold back on please. And the muffs please. All right, place your hand back into the box please. All right, hand in the box. Hand in the box. Would the other participants step up to the box please? Richard, let them know we're about to begin. And begin. Time is up. Have them remove the blindfold please. And the muffs, claiming in control, please step back, face the wall. Open the curtain please. Hi. Did you feel any sensation in your hands during the first session? No. Did you feel any sensation in your hands during the second session? Just a yes or no? Yes. All right, so that would be a second session? Good. And Chip, if you would let us know. White ball was selected. The claimant went first. Claimant went first, so that would also be a fail, which means at this point, we are done, all right? Two fails. Yeah. So thank you very, very much. Okay. And I appreciate it, thank you. We need to step down that way. If I can get Jamie and Mr. Wong to come out please. Okay, I'll tell you later. So just to make that clear, but there's one thing that should be clear of Mathematica, but we didn't explicitly explain it. We have as part of the protocol, part of the agreement, part of the claimant's agreement that there was no need to go through all nine trials once there were two fails. Yeah, we spoke to Mr. Wong ahead of time about this because last year when we worked with Andrew Needles as well, it just seemed like it was going on for a very long time. And we checked with him and he was okay with that to agree that if he failed two times, the experiment would then be over. We would not have to go through every single trial at that time, right? Yeah, yeah. Mr. Wong, hi, how are you? Good, yes. So would you step on over here please? Can we get Mr. Wong a microphone? Yes. So Mr. Wong, unfortunately, but I do want to check this was a fair trial, right? Yes. It was a fair experiment for you, yes? Yes, honest to that. Okay, good. And you didn't make it on the first two trials, you failed on both of those. Do you want to take some questions from the audience? Oh, yes. You would like to do that? Okay, yeah. So if anybody has any questions, we have another mic, can't help please? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, we do. We had to. Thank you. So if you just raise your hand if you have a question, yeah. Right over here up front, we'll take a question here. Please, yes. Make your questions questions. Keep them succinct and keep them polite, please. Right. And directly to the point of what's going on here to the exact point of what we've been doing tonight, please. Banachek said that you indicated that you could feel very strongly when your power was working. Did you feel it working? Yes, it's working. Mr. Wong, why do you think this might have failed? As a protocol, a fail is a fail. So, I'm sorry, say that one more time? As we agreed on the protocol, if I failed, it's his fail. Yeah, his question was why do you think maybe this evening your abilities weren't working this evening? I'm still not sure because this, the federal reality is from the subject and even our staffs before yesterday, when we choose the subject, we also do some control test and everything goes smooth. When I am there, the subject fails energy. When other people make the control test, they don't fail. So I don't know why but this is something I cannot control. Maybe it's a platform, maybe it's a day or something. And this test is just by the subject by himself or herself. We also do some other tests in Boston before. That is by equipment. I think that is more scientific. But as we agreed, we just test by the subject today. So today is only a subject test. So everything is under a protocol. But this was the protocol that you did agree on. It was something to discuss. It was one of a couple of things that we could have done but this is what we had to do one and this was the one you agreed on. And that is accurate. Under the conditions that we considered, that he considered the potential subjects. Right. What he's saying is that there were people who without these controls did report that they were feeling something. And so that's how we found these. That's what you're referring to. That you were successful in those, as we were trying to find the subjects. That's what you're referring to. Mr. Wong, thank you very much from all of us for coming here. And yeah, let's do that. Thank you. My question to you is, does this in any way make you question whether you might be mistaken about having this ability? That's it. He wants to know if maybe something, because you failed this evening, if maybe in your mind you might think, oh maybe I don't have the ability or you're still willing to have the ability. No, because I used my left hand to fail very clearly as power is working. So for me, it's working. Yeah. He believes he's feeling, he feels his own power. He knows it's working. We had a question somewhere down here. Yes. Hi, do you think that this only works when somebody has an ailment? Versus maybe these people do not have something and they're looking for a cure? No, because this is the first time we make this test on the platform. So there are many elements, which is different from any test I did before. In all the past tests I did in Boston area, the repeat test is very good. Once we find the qualified subject, in any condition he can fail in the repeat test. Also the unqualified subject. Some people like my friends, they want to try to fail this energy but two times they don't fail. They want to still try more times and never fail. So in Boston area all the past tests I did is very stable outcome. I'm here. Hi, after the 12 month waiting period, do you believe that you will apply to be tested again? I think I will apply again after one year. But next time I wanted to do another test which is also I did in Boston before. That is I can use this energy to work on other people's hand but different is, we use thermal monitor to watch the subject head and we can see the subject has the temperature obviously rise about seven or eight or what degrees. And with the control test it's very clear that even the control subject, his head is naturally more hot than my head but the subject has the temperature drops immediately. I have this report from the organization. The name is New England. I only remember it's a short name. It's NECAPS, they give me the test report. So before I come to this platform, I'm very confident with my energy because it never failed before. The thing that would ever convince you that you don't have these powers? Is there anything that might convince you that you don't have powers? Anything that would make you think maybe you don't? No, because we tested, already tested by other groups, several groups in Boston. Everything is like today, but not that big platform. They designed small test and everything I passed. I'm down for on here. Hello Ms. Wong. When you have your hands outside of the box, can you indeed feel the subject's hand inside if the box were empty? Would you know that it was empty and what does it feel like to you? What is the feeling that you are detecting the other person's hand? I cannot detect if the subject's hand is there or not. I can only feel this energy pass through the box and reach my left hand, so I think that, so I say this is working. Yeah, that's a question we did ask in ahead of time. Yes, Jamie? You have helped people with your hands. Have you ever had someone that you tried to help that they said it didn't help? Yes, this is right, because this energy is not everything, it's not God. It's limited, it's something, and maybe it's still mysterious, but it's something, I don't know how to say that, but it's not something like God. So it have some, some area it works, but in other side it don't works, it's normal. All the way in the back here.  I only test on human, because human can give me feedbacks. I wondered if you'd ever found that women were more sensitive than men? Maybe a little more sensitive than men by the past data. Have you done your own tests with temperature?  I only do this temperature once, because they need to use thermal monitor. And this thermal monitor, I only say it once, because when I was in China, there's no such equipment, but in the test with ESAAPS, they find one people who have this thermal monitor and they take into the test. Chairman, I think we'll talk about two more questions. Okay, and the reason we use the wording that was agreed upon is because according to Mr. Wang, people have at various times reported different kinds of effects, different kinds of sensations, heat, magnetism, and indescribable change, vibrations, this kind of thing, so that's variable. So I'll take one more back here and then I'll come up and get that one closer. The detection method that you used was a human being. Did you have a choice to use a device instead of a human? That's something I want to try in the future because today my biggest problem is a lot of people don't believe it. Even I have some report, test report, or introduction later from different associations from Boston, other researchers or association laboratories they still don't believe it. That's one of the main reasons why I come here. So I wanted this platform to help me to know and to the public so I can have access to other laboratory or scientists so we can do more tests with their equipment. Because I know many laboratories, they have many advanced equipment to test different kind of elements, like heat, like some magnet or something. I mean, they're not very good, but you can imagine that laboratory, they have equipment. How do you choose your subjects and what is special about them, what is different about them? Just randomly, because up to today, many of my friends or many of my friends or friends or people, they can fail it. But I don't have any idea why this guy can fail it and other people cannot fail it. There's no relation with education or something. I cannot find any rules, just randomly select and we can find some people can fail it. Even yesterday, everything goes very well. We find the subject and when we do control test, subject cannot fail it. So everything goes very well up to yesterday. You know what, we got one more handout, I'll take that question. If you can, can we get a mic to him? I know I said no, but. You just want to see me run around.  This will be definitely the last question we take. Mr. Wong, if you can feel the energy from one hand into your other hand, shouldn't there be a way to just measure the difference in temperature of your own left hand? Why do we need a subject at all? Say that one more time, please. Can we not just measure the temperature change in your own left hand, caused by the energy you're sending? Good question. You wanted to know if, why do you even need a subject? If you can feel the temperature in your other hand, can we just use a device to feel the temperature in your other hand, would that work? But still, as we already do such tests, then I can use, I can make the subject has to raise the temperature. So I think that way is more scientific. Okay.  All right. And what was the verdict on that? What's the verdict on that? No? Good, good, good. So ladies and gentlemen, let's hear one more for Mr. Fei Wang, please. Thank you. Thank you. And if you could just go with Richard, please. Thank you very much. Thank you. And can I hear it one more time for everybody that helped us? Thank you. Not an easy one to pull off. So if you have any questions, we will be around. I'm sure a lot of you have a few questions. So we'll be around. We'll be at the bar later on as well, correct? Yep, yep, yep, yep. So we can now relax, which is a good thing, I guess. So, and maybe get some sleep tonight for a change. Yet, I doubt very much that he will be around for questions afterwards. So usually the claimants are not staying here on site so they go elsewhere, so, yeah. So, oh, here it is. Yeah, here it is. Hold on. So once again, thank you for coming tonight. Every year you guys are stellar for this. We're always worried that it's like torturous for you. And instead, you always just excel. I'm very serious about this. We talk about this a lot. And it's just like the previous years. We're amazed at how wide and how respectful that is. Yeah, exactly, and how attentive. And the questions and the conversations later that come and all the people who attended the workshop today too. Thank you.  And we really thank you. And on behalf of everyone in the JRAF and the Million Dollar Challenge, it's the last closing moments of this year's The Amazing Meeting. And on behalf of James Randy, thank you very much. Thanks. Thank you tonight. Thank you.


Yeah, this is Jim Hogue, and this is the House of Poo Corner. And this is the second broadcast at Orca. I think we have a very exciting story today. It's a story about those people who cover up the truth and those people who seek the truth. And I find that one of my favorite themes. And it's also a story of gatekeepers and those who open the gates. It's about a 70-year-old story. It's had its moments of being exposed openly, debated openly, reported openly. Kennedy talked about the wonderful possibilities of geoengineering for agriculture. President Johnson talked about the possibilities of geoengineering as a military weapon to keep the United States safe from the evildoers. And if you go back far enough, which is what we're going to be doing today with Ian Baldwin, you will see how the story gradually became muddied and eventually covered up. And Ian will tell us how that happened and why. Ian is the publisher emeritus of Chelsea Green. He founded Chelsea Green. And he has written nine articles on the subject that we are going to be talking about today from a purely scientific and historical and factual point of view. So we're looking forward to hearing that. And I guess that's all I need. Oh, I did want to mention Cynthia Johnson, who put me onto geoengineering many years ago. And when I had my radio program, I interviewed the visionaries who were covering the topic. And they went, they didn't pussyfoot around. They went right to Chemtrails and explained what the Chemtrails were. And we have one of Ilana Freeland's books here, Chemtrails, Harp, and the full spectrum dominance of planet Earth. And she has another book called Under an Ionized Sky. So that's second half. We're going to be doing two programs. And the first half will be more introductory. And the second half might get into the nitty gritty of what's up there in the sky now. So Ian Baldwin, tell us whatever you think we ought to know in the way of introduction. And we'll go from there. OK, Jim. One small correction. I co-founded Chelsea Green with my wife, Barnagall. But we both started it in 1984. And yes, I got interested in this subject because a mutual friend, John Ford, in 2005, tried to tell me about Chemtrails. And I had enough on my plate, 9-11, other things. And I felt this is overload, stimulation overload. So I held up my hand and said, no, I don't want to hear about it. Then a year later, I had to get up one warm mid-October night. I think that was actually 2005. And John tried to talk to me in 2004 and saw a vast trail in the sky, night sky. It was a full moon, so it was illuminated. It was as far as I could see to the east and to the west, so many miles long and seriously big and nothing else. So I was dumbfounded, frankly.  And I do remember saying to myself, I think I said it out loud even, my God, John was right. But I also thought, waking up the next day, what's this? Am I going to go down that rabbit hole? And I decided not to. But I've always been an observer of the realm above us. And so I just paid more attention. And over the years, I began to see more and more evidence of things that clearly weren't contrails, except if you go into a room filled with liars, you can maybe be persuaded. But so I finally found myself a decade later in 2015 really frustrated. I guess I had visited a couple of sites like Dane Wiggington's site, and you've interviewed Dane. And realized that, oh, the discussion is in a ghetto. It's ghettoized in cyberspace. But it's not touched by academics, by environmentalists, and of course by media, major print media, New York Times, Washington Post, et cetera. So I realized real progress couldn't happen on this issue because, for lack of a better term, the establishment had a solid front. Anything you see up there that is strange is an, in fact, an illusion or a hallucination. It's just normal contrails. And keep it under advisement. And normal traffic. And normal traffic. So I got introduced through a mutual friend, Lin-Margulis, her son, Dorian Sagan, said, well, Ian, I know a scientist who is also pretty excited about this. You said my father. Carl Sagan. Yeah, Carl was his father. Both parents were deceased when this happened. So I called Marvin. We had a very long conversation. We decided to, because he lived in San Diego. And the air there does not permit anything but a very rare contrail. Because it's dry. And Marvin could tell they weren't flying up at 35,000, 40,000. They were flying lower down. And none of the scientific criteria were met for contrails. And the skies were getting whitened. The blue skies, the traditional normal San Diego blue skies were no longer blue. They were getting milky at the end of a day's operations. So he was being a chemist, among other things. He was furious, because what goes up must come down. And if it's metals, good chance there hazardous. So we got talking and said, well, let's at least try to broach this issue, get it out for discussion. And I had various leads to, oh, the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Wall Street Journal, the Reuters, and worked those so that this little op-ed, seven, 800 words could be considered. Got nowhere. Stonewall didn't even get a response. And there he was, a published nuclear chemist, geoscientist, and myself, a publisher, not even the courtesy of a reply. So then we understood, OK, it ain't up for discussion outside of the ghetto. And I don't mean the ghetto as a pejorative term. No, I understand. You mean a dictionary definition of the ghetto. And so we agreed forensic scientific research had to be done. Now, a lot of people were there before us. In fact, the story goes back, as my most recent piece for Vermont Independent traces it to 1997-8, when the first serious reporter covered it for environmental news service. And so we're late coming into this game. But we're the first people, or I should say Marvin is the first person who is doing actual hands-on research. What did this entail? This entailed collecting rainwater from me, snow water from other people, snow water. And there were already existing databases of rainwater. In that early period of spring of 2015, Wiggington and I and Herndon all watched very interesting video. And it showed coal flyhash being taken away in trains. And the videographer, who I don't think ever identified himself, it was a male, said, guess where this is going? So a light bulb went up, because all of us were wondering, including Dane, who'd been in the game for six or seven years, what is it they're spraying and what's the evidence for? Can you clarify the term coal flyhash? OK. Coal burned in, I think it's hundreds or thousands of degrees Fahrenheit, gives off a microscopically small ash particle debris. The Indians are still sending it up into the atmosphere. The Chinese, I think, are still sending it up, although I think they're also trying to come to terms with it very, very, because as an environmentalist in the 70s, I remember fighting for scrubbers. They were called scrubbers, putting the stacks. So electrostatic stuff. So that these microscopic particles couldn't escape into the atmosphere. Now in the United States and Europe, that's the case.  Actually, it's used for a number of commercial products. It's used for cement, for roads. It's used for agriculture as some kind of a fertilizer. I haven't really figured out how it becomes a fertilizer. And so it has a number of different quote unquote legal legitimate uses. Marvin found some scientific work done in Spain studying coal fly ash in Europe. And when it goes into the atmosphere, the atmosphere is loaded with rivers of moisture, far vaster than the Amazon, OK? So they interact. They coalesce the water molecules, the H2O, around these nanoparticulates and form clouds and rain. In fact, you can manage the clouds. You can attenuate their rainfall and send them further down and let them drop it and dumps later on. What an idea. And you can also cause drought. We haven't gotten there yet. So Marvin decided on the basis of this Spanish scientific work, which identified, I think, 33 elements that leached out when coal fly ash precipitated, collect the water, and then test it. And you had a lot of bad hombres in there. You had aluminum. You had arsenic. You had mercury. You have radionucleides, barium, only a few of which had been tested by people in the geoengineering resistance movement, the ghettoized movement. Shame on them. They found unusual levels of aluminum and barium. Those were the two primary candidates and sometimes strontium. So Marvin then found, whoa, that's not all, and added about seven other elements. You have to get a fairly sophisticated lab to get up to 30-plus, and those labs are run by universities, for the most part. But commercial labs can do up to a certain number. And he took that and wrote a page on it. He took that and wrote a paper for a journal he had written for before, so they knew him, called Current Science, which is the Journal of the Indian Academy of Sciences in India. And he published the first geoengineering paper. Now the editor was hit on. We know that. They tried to get him to rescind the paper. And what was the date? June of 2015, I believe. Then Marvin decided to, Dr. Herndon decided to, let's get this to the health care medical public. And he got it accepted. Everything is peer reviewed that he does. This is a man who's published numerous papers in the Royal Academy of Science in London, the proceedings of the National Academy in Washington. He's not a slouch. So the gatekeepers can ignore him, but they can't attack what he's written. Exactly. But you can be one in 14,000 scientific papers that have been peer reviewed are, in fact, retracted. Usually, because someone has discovered false data, some kind of shenanigans, Herndon had been publishing for roughly 40 years and never had anything retracted. Most scientists don't. So he got it published. I've forgotten the name of the journal. But it was a public health, Western-based journal. And within three weeks, the editor retracted the paper. Now, interestingly, the man who visited the editor, based phase, took the trouble to just show up on his doorstep and interview him, then made the mistake, I think, of boasting about it on Facebook. The next paper I do for the Vermont Independent will have that boast on Facebook in it. Number 10. Number 10. So it turns out the man who did this, a man named Jay Reynolds, had an earlier track record getting environmental news service. Or I shouldn't say getting, because they claim they did on their own recognizance, but he spoke to them in very harsh terms. Hey, apologize to your readers for publishing Will Thomas' stories about chemtrails. Now, Will Thomas never used the word chemtrails. You just changed main characters here. I did. I'm sorry. I went back 20 years because this guy this disinformation agent is still at work on the subject 20 years, not 20, close to 20 years, 15 years later. Now, why does he show up? He doesn't show up if you stay in the ghetto. It's when you get out of the ghetto and you go to an environmental news service, two or three years later, Earth Island Journal, it can't be tolerated because it could creep into the mainstream from there. So it's news management, OK? He may not even be paid. If you've read about the CIA and understand how it functions, there is no formula. People volunteer. That's true. People volunteer. They're patriotic citizens. They believe in the mission. So Marvin fought back. Marvin's a fighter. He's not just a scientist. He's a fighter. He earned it. But they held firm. There was nothing wrong with the paper. He was touching on a forbidden subject that officially had no validity or proof, despite what Marvin said, which is there is very good evidence. It's called fly ash. Not talkable. That interests me because I've never heard anybody argue the point about it. Because as you said, many, many years ago, the environmentalists all lined up for scrubbers in the coal plants. So where are they now? If they were fighting for it then, where are they now? Well, Jim, think about if you're in a street fight. Now I worked in the environmental movement in the early 70s. Yes. Chelsea Green was the leader. It wasn't around in the early 70s. Chelsea Green. Later. So in the early 70s, really smart lawyers who were idealists signed up. When we fought for the Marine Mammal Protection Act, Bill Butler, the EDF lawyer stood up against 30 lawyers and won. But the war was being lost. Battles were won, but the war was being lost right on up to the present moment. That leads into a whole different discussion. We've only got five minutes left. And the next program, which will be coming up shortly, we'll talk about that. Anyway, you're going to have to help me reconnect here because we've strayed over a couple of points. Yes. The Marvin Herndon expertise has been ignored. And the wonderful research by Wilson? Did you say the other guy? No, he wasn't a researcher. He was a dead-on reporter. And his name was William Thomas. William Thomas. I'm sorry. That's OK. So those two are the main characters in the story of the suppression of incontrovertible information. Information, not proof. Information. And yeah, Marvin, he is also besieged by someone at the Hungarian Academy of Sciences, Sigili or someone who comes out of nowhere. Oh, I remember him. Wasn't he one of the 9-11? Oh, he could have been. Deniers? He could have been, Jim. There was a famous Italian who made it. No, this guy is a Hungarian. And the Hungarian Academy of Sciences. And he shows up out of nowhere. Marvin, having had 40 years of publishing scientific papers, some of which were highly original, got his second and third paper on this subject retracted. Statistically impossible. Politically possible. So at that point, because the third paper was also a medical paper, also published in the West. Again, I've forgotten the journal, but it's environmental medicine broadly speaking. So at that point, we gathered together around the Skype campfire and agreed, can't pursue this subject in Western journals. Must find non-Western science journals. So he has been publishing since then, mainly Indian, not exclusively, journals. They operate under the same rigors as a U.S. journal. But they're not located in the U.S. And they're not subject to the political pressures of fiction or unspoken that are exerted on scientific journals. So since then, we have published, I was a co-author on one, he picked up a doctor, an MD, who actually works for the government, who has co-authored the medical aspects of using coal fly ash as an aerosol to do a variety of purposes. We should get into the purposes at some point. We will do that. So in case those of you have missed the second half, it actually warms the planet. That's the net effect, and that should be the subject of the next part of the next segment. It's too complicated to start now, but we'll do that in the next half hour. Good. Anyway, we've now got 15 or 16 published and non-retracted, peer-reviewed scientific papers. The best repression is silence. It's much the best. So far, in Western media, I'm talking mainstream media. Well, also Amy Goodman in that crowd. I include, she's in that. She's mainstream media. Yeah, she's mainstream media. Western media, Western academia, Western environmentalists, and of course, politicians. Well, that goes without saying. Completely verboten to even talk about the possibility. So it goes back to who is your adversary?  Well, it might have been McDonald's or it might have been Union carbide. The adversary now is called the Pentagon. Okay, because they need it. Well, we have to wind this up. Your guest has been Ian Baldwin, publisher emeritus of Chelsea Green, which built its reputation on environmental literature. Environmental and agricultural and food and healthy living. And here we are at home plate with one of the leaders in the movement and thank you for watching and we'll see you in the next half hour.


Hi everyone, did you know that augmented chords, if you take C augmented and then invert it, you pretty much get other augmented chords. So C augmented, E augmented, G sharp augmented are just inversions of each other. And if you put this together in the circle of fifths by mapping them out as they form an equilateral triangle, if you observe, what's going to happen is you can make some very interesting chord progressions just by using major and minor chords separated with this augmented intervillic relationship. So C major going to E major going to A flat major or else you can even do C minor going to E minor going to G sharp minor very movie theme like if you ask me.


Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the anxious truth. There is no intro music this week. There's actually no intro this week because this is not a podcast episode. It's a podcast update. So today is September 18, 2023. Normally, I would release a new episode of the anxious truth on September 20, which would be Wednesday. But this week, there is no podcast episode will be back next Wednesday. And then for the foreseeable future, at least the next four or five months, and I'll reevaluate the anxious truth will come out every other week. So we're going to go biweekly for a little while. It's a decision I haven't made lightly. It's been a little bit of a tough decision to make to be completely honest with you. And there are two main factors here. I'm I mean, this podcast is incredibly important to me. So it was hard. It's hard for me to cut it back to every other week. Because when I started recording to nobody in 2014 into a $5 app on my crappy iPhone at the time, I had no idea that this podcast was going to change my life the way it did. But it has changed my life. And part of that is I'm now nearing the end of the coursework part of my grad program. I start to do clinical work soon. That takes up a huge amount of time. And the second part of this is something that I'm both it's hard for me to say, because I'm going to cut this podcast back to every other week, which is a tough choice for me to make. But I'm also super proud to say this. About five months ago, Josh Fletcher and I started producing the Disordered podcast, which you can find at disorder.fm. And I'm super proud to say that I think at this point, that's just a better podcast going forward. So the anxious truth will still be here every other week. But Disordered will be my weekly podcast and doing that with Josh has been a lot of fun. Having a podcast partner is something different. I've never done that before. It's given me a little bit more energy and some new life into podcasting, which I'm really enjoying. And it's just a good program. There's just a lot of good information there. And I think we're a good combo. So every other week, there'll be a new episode of the anxious truth. That's my thing. I'll keep doing that. And on the weeks where there's no podcast episode on those Mondays, I do a recovery Monday live stream on my YouTube channel. It also streams to Facebook. So you can certainly check that out. All the other social media content on Instagram and YouTube and TikTok is also going to be there still producing that sort of stuff. But the anxious truth is going to become a biweekly podcast every other week starting September 27 2023. So half the number of new episodes, but I hope each one is going to be just as good as it always is. And this gives me a little bit more time to accommodate all of the different projects they have going on all the different things that are happening in my life. So I'll be back next week with a new episode of this podcast or video if you're watching on YouTube. Thank you so much for your support over all this time. I could not have done it without you. And yeah, go check out disordered if you want a weekly podcast disordered FM or search for us on any podcast platform. We don't have videos yet. Disordered will have a YouTube channel. We have recorded all the episodes that we've recorded. We have the video just have not had the time to edit them and turn them into YouTube videos, but we will at some point. So anyway, all right, guys, thanks for listening. I will see you next week with another episode. Thanks for your support. Have a great day.