Nearest scientist And he's going to talk about optogenetics, so Okay So thanks for the election in Guinea So hi everybody. So my name is again. He is here already. I'm your scientist from Martin Street from the bicentrum. I love you there and Today I'm going to talk about optogenetics so pretty exciting Pretty exciting topic so for many neuroscientists, and I think that I hope that by the end of my talk you will kind of share this feeling as well So that is not my talk with a bit in a weird way So I want to tell you first what optogenetics is not so optogenetics is not optical genetics First of all because it's not second because there is no such thing as optical genetics, you know So just avoid any confusion from the very first slide and before we come to optogenetics So let's jump back to the past to 1997 So those of you who are approximately of my age might remember this movie So and maybe you also remember who were these two guys and what they did with small device here their hands So this device is just a bright flash light What they did today they try to erase memory of other people so that they don't remember at all that they have ever met these two guys Yeah, because there were secret engines logically So pretty brilliant idea For that kind of movies science fiction movie with 1997 now we have 2017 right so and I think you wonder how much you have advanced in that time over the last 20 years in this technique And we control brain is light and I'm happy to say that we do we can't control so since 2005 at least Unfortunately, I have to admit we can't control that only in animals so far and also with this nice idea with this flash light Also didn't work well so that we have to deliver light directly to the brain using optical fibers So in blinding on the animal head, so here we come to the point So what is up to genetics of the genetics so we can say that it's a way to control brain is light But given that the goal of science in general is not to control brain of mice So therefore I was rephrased in the way of the genetics is a tool to study brain to study the brain using light and thumb genetic engineering so Before we before I explain you what that's how it works. So Let's watch the videos which will demonstrate you how much we can influence animal behavior Just by flashing light particular areas in the brain. So the first video, you will see a mouse here Optical fibers and found it to deliver light while this optical fibers to particular brain region Which is controlling aggression and hunting behavior in mice. So mouse will run in this transparent plastic cage and Beside the mouse, there will be this object here just wouldn't stick. So which is unfamiliar to the animal animal have never experienced that So what happens usually animals just try to find out what it is. They just run around check smell touch This post touch with the whiskers. So to kind of check how dangerous the option is And then this corner here, which is we'll see the status of the light source that we use in this case It's either on or off. So let's see what happens. So when we switch the light on So, okay exploration. It's kind of slow down the speed of Just piece of this space for exploration now. So let's see what happens the third was on And animal suddenly changes behavior and start to attack the object Trying to buy this trying to destroy it. It's totally unusual behavior this case. So they never do this At least before they learn the object Okay, that's fun. It's normal. Let's go to the second one. Yeah, we have similar situation animal in the cage So optional fiber illuminating different brain region, which is responsible for feeding the cells to you or for drinking behavior And this metal tube here is just tip of the bottle So this water and the main point here is that animal have absolutely free access to water all the time So there is no any restriction distance So Let's see Again, just breaks the relation of running around smelling around everything as usual now light is on and immediately after that animal starts drinking and it keeps drinking and drinking and drinking while the light is on and just stops When the light goes off and if it is multiple times animals will just drink multiple times So as long as the light is gone So I hope that kind of these two videos Made you a bit curious. So how this technique works in general Of course, if you just speak random animal and light and illuminated with a light I don't know from your table lamp. It will not work So you kind of have to do few manipulations with the animal and use special light So we will talk about this but before we talk about that. So let me give you few Just remind you a few things about brain functions so you can understand what I'm talking about So brain is a very complex structure that we all know So brain consists of multiple regions each region has own function and each region also in turn can consist of multiple Neurons of different types. There are multiple types of neurons a different day shape activity level composition and so on so on This neurons are interconnected with each other and constantly interact with each other One of the main features which differ neurons from other cells in the body is that they can generate electrical pulses which Spread along the bodies from one end to another end So it means that when I say that the neuron is active or the neuron is Activated by something so I mean that the neuron Generate an electrical pulse either single pulse or a series of pulses doesn't matter and If you have pure neurons connected to each other But such a pulse reach the end it can activate the next neuron that you will activate the next neuron next neighbor And so on and we can say that neurons can interact with each other by means of this So which mean that when we say that we can control brain We mean just that we can control neurons in the brain and Controlling neurons just means that we can force them to generate this electrical pulse is when we need that independent from the spontaneous activity and any processes which Happens within the neurons so that we can know now. So what I mean when I say that we can control neurons Good. So now let's come Let's come to the So let's start from the beginning When we how it has been invented As usual this high-tech idea came or was adopted from nature namely from pretty Simple species holds real algae calamity of waters like you can see that this algae algae algae You can figure you can find basically in any pool outside, especially in the pool is not clean properly So it's just single cell organism. They leave usually close to the water surface because I need light for photosynthesis The interesting thing about this organism is that it has special light sensitive organ inside So which helps them to orient towards light and moved towards light This organ like the poor element of this organ is like that the protein called channel of obscene At this point, let me just give you like small command like small side command So this just for the next slide. We don't need that. So this protein is present in this Organ organism just because this organ has a special gene Which was this protein so it means that the organ is can produce the protein on its own using this gene So just keep it in mind. You need it next slide. Let's come back to the channel obscene channel obscene is a light-sensitive protein It means that it responds to blue light By letting positively charged ions to go go through the membrane into the cell You can think about it just as a about simple channel or just gate Which is close to the normal conditions without light so that no positive ions can go through When you shine light it opens and the positive ions go into the cell If that's exactly what neurons need to generate electrical pulses when many positive ions go through the membrane to neurons They generate pulses So therefore no wonder that scientists come up with a fresh idea. They said okay. So neurons usually Have no channel obscene. They're not sensitive to light What happens if you take channel obscene and insure that the official either to neurons traditionally is Can you make neurons sensitive responsive to light by inserting this protein to them? So we can illustrate it by this diagram here. So we have channel obscene insured it To some neurons, let's say it was selected you was because you don't want to activate for brain. We just want to activate specific group Then we shine light What happens then so in neurons, which have channel obscene this channel get open positive ions go into neurons and neurons generate their own pulses or That's why it feels So either they start generating pulses or they just generate more pulses and they would have done so under normal conditions Right or then compared to other neurons which do not have channel obscene So the idea has worked out in 2005 Toward this goal scientists had to basically solve two technical problems Problem one how to insert channel obscene to neurons problem two how to do a light to neurons Let's just go one by one So first problem how to insert here. We need technique which is described by the Second half of the name of the genetics. We need some genetic engineering. So what can we do here? So we take with it again extract Gene of channel obscene. So here I just want to stress that We don't take the protein. So we take the gene which was approaching because the only way to insert this protein to neuron In the way that it stays there long enough like few months at least So it's inserting the gene inside of the protein. So to make neuron making producing this proton on its own Right. So we insert gene How to insert gene to neurons we use why they use technique here Which is now very popular in science. We use virus as a transporter insert gene to that virus and We inject virus to the animal brain To specific area, which you want to activate later So what happens then so this vital particles attached to neurons inject genes to that neurons and these neurons start producing Channel obscene for the soul. So it looks like you can see here. So some neurons Inactive neurons have channel obscene and they become light sensitive The last question that we have to fix now is how to make it neuron specific. So it will not own all neurons Express channel obscene So I have no time to go into details here. Please. Just believe me. There are techniques in genetics. So let's call them genetic tricks So using the genetic tricks we can insert channel obscene to particular neurons on there so Next question the next problem that has to be solved is how to deliver light and Here we deal with the first part of the day of the genetics optics, right? So of course we need light source and Channel obscene is sensitive only to blue light. So it means that we need a light of particular wavelengths So therefore we use in the laters or powerful light meeting diet So that's and to deliver the light from the source to the brain We just use classical optical fibers nothing special here. I'd like to see sorry like you see here and Because it's color the animal is not transparent for light and fortunately We have to research it we have to make small opening in the skull like you see here that the skull and Here it's more opening and we have to ensure the Optical fiber to the brain and then we fix everything in the In practice, of course, we don't insert directly the optical fiber But rather we insert the implant special adapter so that we can plug it and plug the fiber So when we don't do experiments animals, we don't we don't connect And then eventually what we get we get the animal which is genetically modified animal So some neurons in this animal in particular area express channel obscene and they become sensitive to light And we have way to deliver light to those neurons. Let's see what happens within the brain of this guy, which so again, so they have Neurons some of them have channel obscene. They're sensitive And in all conditions and we don't eliminate with light so they have just normal activity As soon as we switch light on Here they must be light, so I don't know why I don't see it But anyway, we have light here. So those neurons become active and generate the electrical passes, right? And the main point here is that only those neurons are activated while all other neurons which have no channel obscene just stay Not affected at all. So they just stayed up in the same activity level as before And that basically how the genetics works because now as soon as you have a subset of humans that you can Control is light. You can test your hypothesis. You can test whether they important for that function for that function You can activate them and also we cannot suppress them. I don't mention here, but there is a way to suppress them so Coming to the end let's Overview kind of what kind of application we can do with this technique First of all, let's talk about science because in science optogenetics is applied since 2005 The main breakthrough that the genetics was brought to the science is that we can control Braille activity at a level of individual neurons or small group of neurons And that allowed scientists to identify small brains So it's small brains like small neuron groups, which are responsible for controlling and equal physiological functions So I can illustrate it with this picture here. So let's say that our initial stop stopping point you could say That this brain region is huge cortical cortical vision here is responsible Let's say for just arbitrary decision-making That brain region was critical for memory and what we have now is more or less like this So we go into details in please resolution and we can already identify very small circuits within the brain Which controls different functions? And also it looks like if you want to imagine that think about images of the earth surface done by satellites, let's say four years ago when they would see Only big cities on the images and now you can identify individual persons in the street So that's kind of gives you an estimate of the change that we have now without genetics Good. So the second research direction Which really benefited from genetics is the discovery of new Treatments for neurological disorders using animal models What I mean here is following if you take animals and genetically modified them to simulate a particular human disorder And you say no, which neurons are responsible or which neurons do not work properly? And that's a reason for particular symptoms of that disease You can restore their function and activate these humans using optogenetic technique and kind of cure that particular symptom of this disease and that can be translated later on to the human medicine Because now the genetic is not used in human medicine medicine But to give an idea how it would look potentially already consider this example let's say we have a patient with some disease and Let's assume that we know that this is related to the malfunctioning of the neurons somewhere here. So the modern approach in trying to not help anymore is to Restore the functions of neurons by an electrical stimulation So we implant the metal electrode to that region with past electrical current and try to activate neurons by means of this electrical current It's called so called deep-brain stimulation. So the main disadvantage of this approach is that it's absolutely not Selective with respect to neurons. It activates those neurons which are Malfunctioning and also those humans which have nothing to do with that symptoms in which that with that disorder So it can cause a lot of different side effects where they don't for the person So what can we change without the genetics? Let's say we have a way to Inject the virus safely to the brain and In search of obscene to those specific neurons then we can apply light to restore the function and in this way It's going to be much more selective than just use electrical stimulation But again just to make it clear. It's like our future. Hopefully so at the moment. It's not applied good so now so I hope I can be sure that this technique is pretty cool and It's really simple in the center with extremely powerful therefore it has spread Very fast since 2005 and at the moment thousands of light users in their search, and if you try to pull it So like one of the most popular words that you will find would look like Typological breakthrough or evolution in neuroscience and so on so and basically we can say now that some dreams from That science fiction movie in 1997. So indeed come true. Thanks a lot Someone would like to ask a question So Antical problems and practical also so practical problem is that you need much stricter control how they Gene we should transport is a virus get inserted to the G normal the Person right because now in animals basically it can get inserted to more less random place Main point for us that it works expression heavens, right? We see that we get the child of soon but What can get what we can get in humans? For example that some normal GMO stop working properly or we get this cancerous tech that's you know And creation will not be controlled anymore So it means that we need to develop new virus and new technique which will be like under full control So I think that's the main problem in this Absolutely, so since already a long time people use either Electrical currents is really passing through the metal electrodes or you can also inject some chemical substance We should activate neurons as well But both of them are not specific relative to neurons, right because it affects the whole tissue which you inject and also the volume that you affect is not well controlled right because you can just Use like trial and error approach to determine how much you have to inject or how much current you need to inject to stimulate so much Right, but in any case within this volume that you can kind of adjust you stimulate all the neurons, right? So it means that you can't really assess Let's say what is a functional that particular subgroups in this volume for I don't know drinking behavior, right? because within this volume there are a lot of different types of neurons and Also axons part of following neurons you activate everything Yeah, so basically you have to plan where you make this opening right to reach Particular brain vision of course you reach like multiple on the way, right, but you cannot really go from here there You will damage too much tissue Let's say it has not been described as a paper, but as I understand that they would just start and stop start reading right It was basically that work So they really identified particular neurons which control the drinking behavior so you activate this animal Stop doing that So in this sense, they will not be a change just to the fact that animal cleaning So we don't have time Unfortunately, but well, they can just come to be your break so you can approach them and ask whatever you like


Roeddwn i'r ddweud y gynnig, mae'n fydd hwnnw i'r gweithio'r ddechrau. Rwy'n gweithio'r ddweud y ddweud ar y gynnig. Doedd yn ddweud, ddweud. Roedd yn ddweud. Yn ddweud, mae'n ddweud y byddwyr, ac mae'n bwysig i'r ddechrau. Mae'n ddweud yng nghymru, oherwydd mae'n collektifydd gyda'r ddweud, ..a gwneud yma ar gyfer ymlaen nhw'n gweithio. Felly, o'r cyfnodd gwaith ymlaen nhw ymlaen nhw. Ond ydym yn ymlaen nhw... ..yna ymlaen nhw, mae'n cael eu cyfnodd... ..yna llyfriddio'n cyfrifio. Mae'n cyfrifio, os ymlaen nhw... ..yna'n cyfrifio ar y llyfriddio. Mae'n cyfrifio ymlaen nhw. Mae'n cyfrifio'n cyfrifio'n cyfrifio. Mae'n cael ei wneud, mae hwn yn gwneud... ..yna'n cyfrifio'n cyfrifio. It's interesting that we see that societies are, I mean, they are groups and they may be made of individuals. But surely, surely you can see though that in these societies inevitably do results in this hierarchical form of like well, governments in group settings. It always delves and devolves into these hierarchies. Is it just that's the natural state of being? Maybe we reason towards groups, maybe we reason towards collectivism. Na'r amfodau yn ymlaen, nawr mae erion yn dwylo yw'r amlunol erion yr hyn fel y rhannu a'r amddun sy'n gweithio'r byd. Dw i'n ffLO Erma'r ddau bod y byd yn ymddangos yn ei wneud. Felly, mae'n gwirio'r ymddangos yn ei gyd. Yn y ffLO, ni'n gweithio'r amlunol oed ymddangos y cwyl y cyfraed ychydig sydd gyda'r cyfraed. Ychydig ychydig yn llwyddoedd y bydd. Mae bod y cyfraed yn deall. Mae'n ddweud ychydig yn y 9e gyda'r Gymru, o'ch ddweud yng nghymru, o'ch ddweud yn ddweud, a ddweud ychydig yn cyfrifiadau yn ddweud, a ddweud ychydig yn ddweud rydyn nhw. Ychydig yn ddweud, rydyn ni'n ddweud, yn olyg, yn y Brwyll, yn y Brwyll yn y Brwyll, yn ychydig yn y Brwyll. I don't remember the order, right? And it was. It was. But we are better than that. And that's what the left... If you'd asked this question 300 years ago, it would have said, you know, maybe. But we've just lived through this amazing period. How much richer are we today than we were 300 years ago? On average. In terms of dollars or pounds with 300 times richer. But that's minimizing their effect. Because how do you measure the value of electricity? Not your electricity bill. The value of electricity is gazillion times more than your electricity bill. A problem with economics is we can only measure things that have dollar signs next to them. We can measure actual utility. What's the benefit of electricity? A plumbing? Indo plumbing? Toilets? I'm pretty... You know, that's more than just a little bit. That's more than 300 times better, right? Having the ability to flush your toilet. The iPhone? I haven't even started describing all the wonders of an iPhone. It's not 300 times better. It's 1000 times better. And what's interesting is that 300 years ago, there might have been 500 million people on planet Earth. The 8 billion of us. And generally, we're all living better. There's, you know, maybe 5 to 10% of the people who are not who are still living the way that we lived 300 years ago, and that's a tragedy. But they can do better. And they will do better if they get the right ideas. If you study history, what you see is that ideas shape history, not, well, human nature. That's what we do.  No, we don't. We don't have to. We do, but we don't have to. And the question always is, will we rise to the challenge? Will we exert the effort? As I said, thinking using reason requires effort. Will we use that effort? And to do that, we have to teach people that they can do it. This is why I really hate these evolutionary psychologists who tell you, you're just a product of your genes and nothing you do makes any difference. But you're not. And you're not a product of the environment either. That's BS as well.  But what's the real factor that determines who you are? You, the choices you make, the free will that you have, whether you acknowledge it or not, whether Sam Harris likes it or not. We all have free will. We are the writers of our own script. Now, some of us choose not to engage the free will. And then we're just products of society. And then if collectivists rise to power, we become collectivists. And if it's collectivists of the right, collectivists of the left, it's just we do what we are told. But you have the ability to write the script yourself.  And you have the ability, therefore, to be an individual. And what does individualism means? It means that your life is valuable to you. Indeed, it's the most valuable thing you have. You don't have anything more valuable than your life. And that you don't want, because you have this mind, you don't want to be told how to live. You want to make those choices yourself. Now, people can advise you. People can recommend. You can read great books about how people have lived. And then you get to make the choice of how you live. That's what individualism means. And if you are like that, then you don't want authorities and coercion and people telling you what's true and what's not, what's right or what's wrong, what to do to marry and who not to marry. We've overcome that. And we're at a turning point right now. Western civilization is. It has leased liberties. It's had these freedoms for a long time, at least to some extent. And we're giving them away. We're throwing them in a rubbish. And we're doing it in the name of what? In the name of ancient reactionary ideologies. I mean, I love the fact that the, I don't know, the modern left thinks they're inventing something new. No, they're just rehashing the same old, you know, failed policies and failed ideas that have destroyed human life everywhere they've been tried in the world. And the new right is doing exactly the same thing. Rehashing the same ideas that have destroyed, you know, there's nothing new here. They're just, we're then, you know, we're trying to save civilization to the extent that we're fighting for individualism. But what else is there to fight for? So I'm not saying groups are not valuable. Of course groups are valuable. Families are valuable. Friendship is valuable. Business? Business is a group, right? But what's the nature of groups like that? The nature of groups like that is the voluntary engagement, except family. You're stuck with the parents who had you. That's the one involuntary thing, right? And hopefully they're good parents, and that's okay.  But so you want to maximize your voluntary interactions and to minimize the interactions that you can't avoid, like family, right? And even there, if your parents are lousy, don't hang out with them. I had good parents and I moved 5,000 miles away. Thank you for listening or watching the Iran Book Show. If you'd like to support the show, we make it as easy as possible for you to trade with me. You get value from listening, you get value from watching. Show your appreciation. You can do that by going to iranbookshow.com slash support by going to Patreon, subscribe star locals, and just making a appropriate contribution on any one of those, any one of those channels. Also, if you'd like to see the Iran Book Show grow, please consider sharing our content and of course subscribe. Press that little bell button right down there on YouTube so that you get an announcement when we go live. And for those of you who are ready subscribers and those of you who are ready supporters of the show, thank you. I very much appreciate it.


How do vaccines help your body prepare to fight off harmful diseases? First, let's start off by introducing a group of sickening germs called pathogens. Picture pathogens the same way as you would the villains in a comic book series. These villains include some viruses, bacteria, fungi, and protozoa. They are microorganisms with a diabolical plan they wish to achieve to take up residence in your body. If they succeed, they could develop into a disease or illness. They achieve their goal by attacking, invading, and replicating inside your body, damaging our healthy cells. In this video, we'll focus our attention on viruses and bacteria, how your body's immune system defends against these invaders, and how we can help train our immune system to prepare it to prevent future infections. All right. First, let's talk a little bit more about bacteria. Bacteria are unicellular organisms, meaning they have one cell and can be found surprisingly everywhere. Thankfully, not all bacteria cause disease. Some are actually really beneficial to your body, like those that live in your intestines and aid digestion. However, there are also dangerous ones that are responsible for diseases like strep throat, tuberculosis, food poisoning, syphilis, and so on. Viruses are smaller than both human cells and bacteria, but where they lack in size, they make up an overall mightiness. Undoubtedly sneaky, viruses come in various forms and pack a punch once inside your body. They were produced by taking control of living cells in your body and using your cell's machinery to produce thousands of identical copies at a mind-blowing rate. Viruses are responsible for causing infectious disease like the common cold, flu, measles, Ebola, Zika, and so on. Sometimes prevention is much better than treatment. If you prevent a disease, you don't get sick in the first place. And if you're not sick, you can't spread the disease to others. How can we do this? By boosting the power of our immune system. The immune system is complicated, however greatly appreciated. It consists of various components that communicate and interact with one another to complete a critical task, keeping us healthy and alive by protecting our bodies from dangerous pathogens. The immune system has three main functions. First, it detects unrecognizable or abnormal material like those pathogens, viruses, bacteria, etc.  And third, it keeps a memory of the pathogen in case it tries to invade again. Our white blood cells, aka lymphocytes, are the heroic warriors that terminate deadly pathogens. Using their power, they battle the pathogens and produce antibodies that help them identify and eliminate foreign material. But sometimes it can take a long time for our immune system to finally clear our bodies of foreign invaders. Fortunately, we are able to shorten this time using vaccines that act as an immune system accelerator. Vaccines primarily consist of a weakened, killed, or fragmented piece of a pathogen, not whole, live pathogens capable of causing illness. Once inside your body, the vaccine triggers an immune response, training your body to recognize and fight off the specific pathogen.


U.S. begins a show of force against China in Asia. The U.S. is flexing its military might in the Indo-Pacific as Washington seeks to downplay diplomatic tensions with China over meetings between U.S. lawmakers and Taiwanese officials this week. The Defense Department began joint anti-submarine drills with South Korean and Japan and prepped for next week's annual Balikartan exercise in and around the Philippines. The largest version of the drill in the 38 years it's taken place. Combined with a proposed U.S. defense budget that bolsters military competition with China, four new U.S. bases in the Philippines and a trilateral security pact to supply nuclear-powered attacks submarines to Australia, the message from Washington to Beijing carries no ambiguity, according to experts. The message is, the U.S. is determined and prepared to deter any Chinese military adventurism against Taiwan. Yun Sun, director of the Stimson Center's China program, told the Hill outlet. The tension between the superpowers this week center around a meeting Wednesday between House Speaker Kevin McCarthy and Taiwan President Sai Ing-wen, along with a bipartisan delegation of more than a dozen U.S. lawmakers. The meetup, part of Sai's so-called transit through the United States, is being viewed by China as a show of U.S. support for a self-governed island. Beijing claims as its own territory and has threatened to soon bring under its control. Chinese officials vowed reprisals against Taiwan, also warning that the U.S. was on the wrong and dangerous road. Beijing also sent an aircraft carrier strike group off Taiwan's east coast in what appeared to be a reaction to the visit.


Hello and welcome to my career in data, a podcast where we discuss with industry leaders and experts how they have built their careers. I'm your host Shannon Kemp and today we have a special episode recorded at Dataversities Enterprise Data World Conference. With a robust catalog of courses offered on demand and industry leading live online sessions throughout the year, the Dataversity Training Center is your launch pad for career success. Browse the complete catalog at training.dataversity.net and use code DBTOX for 20% off your purchase. Hello and welcome to a special edition of my career in data, a podcast where we discuss with industry leaders and experts how they have built their careers. I'm your host Shannon Kemp and today we are coming to you live from Enterprise Data World and the Women in Data Management and Governance Conference. A very special edition here so for this so I'm very excited to have you here and today we're joined by three amazing women in data management and governance, Gwen Thomas, Kelly O'Neill and Ocrety Agrawal. I have had the pleasure of interviewing all three women individually and you can find their full interviews at dataversy.net for such a podcast. But let's start with a recap and introduction of who you are and what you're currently doing. So Gwen, you are the founder and a data strategist at the Data Governance Institute so tell me about the Data Governance Institute. We are currently an online presence located at datagovernance.com. We have published the industry's first data governance framework. It's 20 years old now and has been adopted by programs all around the globe. There are online materials for a while. There were consulting services through them. I left to do other things now I'm back so that's starting up again. So tell us why did you start the Data Governance Institute? So picture this. The year is 2022.  Cameron showed this. The world was not as expected. So Congress in the U.S. created the Sarbanes-Oxley Act which said that not only could executives go to prison if they lied but it was essential that reputable auditors conduct very, very thorough audits of the controls over financial reports. So at the time I was working for a small regional IT company. I was feeling quite lucky to have a job because they build themselves as an IT company and my background was in writing and process design and data management and controls. So the guys, yeah it was all guys, just said, well we're glad to have Gwen around because somehow our work product is a little bit better when she's around. I was a little tired of ghost writing all their stuff. So when the big consulting company said, the big auditing company said we're going to have a big announcement about what the impact of Sarbanes-Oxley is on the industry, I said to my boss, me, me, me, me, me, send me, send me and he said, okay, well, sure. So I show up at a room very similar to this, so proud, wearing my red blazer, my pumps carrying a brand new briefcase, I walk into a sea of expensive Navy suits. And those behind the podium went on to talk about it and then someone from the audience said, so, I know why this is called the accountants, I mean the auditors full employment act, but what's the impact on IT? And these global experts said, well, there really isn't any. So I said, what the heck, I raised my hand, they said, the woman. And I said, where do you think this well controlled data comes from? And there was nervous laughter and we all went home and I prepared my trip report, but boy when the big report came out next week, they had included IT. And I thought, all right, so maybe I have a little bit more expertise than I have been giving myself credit for. I told my boss, personal matter, I need to take three weeks off without pay, a leave of absence. He said, okay, he loved saving money. And I immediately created IP that was mine that I had not created on the company dime. I purchased data governance.com because what I had seen in what they reported is, oh, they made room to bring in armies of IT people to implement this and they still were not paying any attention to the rules that go into it, the controls that need to happen, the allocation of decision rights, all this stuff that I've been doing for years under this bizarre obscure term called data governance. So I created this, I came back to work, I said, I'm back, Tony, and I have an idea we should create an offering for Sarbanes Oxley. I want to create IP for you and I want to lead the program. And he said, yes, yes, prove it to me. So I gave him a much lesser version of the IP that belonged to me. I introduced the program. He assigned me someone to mentor and spent the next few years implementing programs, data governance programs here. Meanwhile, I was very careful to brand myself as the expert, not the manager. Because I knew myself. I knew I would be a terrible manager. So I spent a couple of years building up credentials, building up stories, marquee clients, all this good stuff. And then the day that Cobra Health Insurance would cover me under another plan, I went in and said, OK, I'm done here. And my boss said, but we have seven projects lined up and you're the most qualified, frankly, the only expert we have in this field. And I said, oh, really? Here's my rate and spent years doing that. We actually hadn't published as much online at that point, but eventually got to it. And here we are. You did indeed. And the Data Governance Institute was born. So, Gwen, thank you. That's awesome, right? Kelly, you are the founder and CEO of First San Francisco Partners. So tell me about First San Francisco Partners and what you do. Yes, absolutely. So First San Francisco Partners is a consulting company. It was formed in 2007 after datagovernance.com. And I will tell you how important that was to the creation of the company. But so I'm the CEO. We formed the company about 16 years ago. We still work with clients to help them make their information actionable. That is what we do. And so we work with them through the entire data lifecycle, so from the point of data creation or purchase or acquisition or whatever you want to call it, all the way through to archival retention or deletion to make sure that they understand what's needed in order to help improve and grow the business and address business goals and objectives. So we think of ourselves very business-facing as opposed to technically facing. You know, I don't have a technical background either. I also study literature and English and writing and things like that. And we do have really technical people on our staff, but it's all about ensuring that the work that's done from a data perspective supports and aligns with business goals and objectives and making sure that that's measurable and the impact is understood. Because like Monique was saying, you need to be able to demonstrate the impact. So we help our clients do that. So Kelly, what made you want to found your own business? Well, like many entrepreneurs, frustration and not wanting to work for the people that I was working for. So, you know, it was one of those things where at that time I didn't want to do the job that they wanted me to do. And so I looked around at the competitive companies to do essentially the job that they wanted me to do, but do it at another company kind of. And it was when master data management was still relatively new. I was working for Cyperian, which was the master data management company that was acquired by Informatica. And there were very few consulting companies out there, other than the Accenture, the PWC, Capgemini, the Deloitte, that could help us as a sales team because I was on the sales side. Again, don't have a technical background. And there weren't boutique consulting companies that could actually help us with clients to help talk about, okay, yes, you have a data problem and you're in the IT organization, but what does that really mean? How is that impacting your business? And how can you articulate that data problem in something that they're going to understand because guess what, they own the budget? And so on kind of a whim was walking in Central Park with a friend and he's like, you should do that. And I was like, huh, okay, I'm single. I have no dogs, no kids, no house, no, like whatever. So sure, because I can completely fail and why not? And so I did and I just started thinking about what do I need to do? Who do I need to call? How do I pull this together? I've never been a consultant before. Okay, so all of these things was very naive of me to think that it could work. And 17 years later, it still exists. So I will tell you that it is not a straight line. And anyone that wants to start their own consulting company, let me talk to you first. Yeah, it's not easy. Well, and Kelly, you and I have had a lot of conversations over the years about elevating women in their careers. And I am when Tony said, hey, Shannon, should we start a women's event? Yes, let's do it. And I couldn't imagine doing this without Kelly just because of those conversations. So I'm so grateful for you to co-chair this event. So tell me what this means to you and why you said yes. Well, because you asked me number one, and I was so excited, Shannon, that you did because we are, we're a very female focused company, and I've always been very passionate about uplifting women in the workforce. I unfortunately had a couple, luckily not several, but a couple female bosses that what they wanted to do was remove the female competition. And so they were not supportive of other women in the workforce. And I looked around and I was like, this is not right. Like who does this? So I've always been very passionate about it. And so we do it through our company. We take on interns and we do all of that, but we're a small company. So the scope is limited. And so when Shannon came to say, will you do this with me? It's the opportunity to do it on a much broader scale and to be able to really have an impact on a broader scale. So thank you, Shannon. Thank you. I'm so grateful. And Ocrity. Okay, so you're the manager of data governance at a Fortune 100 company. So what does that mean and what are your responsibilities? Yeah, so really putting in, we have a federated model. So how do we implement policies that are being created at our company and make sure everybody understands the importance of data governance and that they're working with good quality data, right? That's what a lot of us are working on. And it's been really interesting to be a middle manager and work up and work down and work across and really get to know a lot of people across the enterprise and see how we can assist. I love it. Well, in addition to a full-time job, you have started not one, but two nonprofits. So tell us about those. Yeah, this should really be called an entrepreneurship panel. I don't know. But you know us women, we're always out there doing way more than we need to be doing. So my first nonprofit, I started when I was 21 and learning to code. So I actually do have a technical background on the data side, but my first job required me to learn how to computer program. And so I started a nonprofit actually inspired by Rishima's non-profit, which is the TED talk that was just referenced. So we used to be a chapter of Girls Who Code National and then became our own called Girls Code Lincoln out in Lincoln, Nebraska. And we grew from seven girls, so they teach about 100 every week now. And it's been a really cool journey to learn, kind of get a crash course on entrepreneurship because you're starting a nonprofit that you just just don't want these girls to fail, right? So it's been really interesting. I led that for about seven years outside of my full-time job. And then currently I'm in the process of starting a nonprofit that hopefully will get approved soon that teaches other people how to start a nonprofit. So you're doing some entrepreneurship support. I have a podcast that'll come out soon and just helping other founders globally learn how to do it, right? So entrepreneurship is hard and most entrepreneurs don't know how to do it. And that's even harder in the nonprofit space where people have most of the time experience the issues that they're trying to solve. And so I'm hoping, it's called the non-profit org. I'm hoping that the non-profit org will help people with that. So I support about 70 founders globally right now and most of them are under the age of 30. And so they're very young. They're working multiple jobs to support their nonprofit goals. And so it's a really, really cool community to be a part of. And I'm really glad I get to contribute to it. That's amazing. And you mentioned that most of the non-profiters are younger. And I would be remiss if I didn't mention that Agri has been nominated not once, but twice for Forbes 30 under 30 for her work. Yeah, congratulations. Amazing, all three of you are amazing. So now, okay, so now when I was recording the original podcast with these women, we had some side conversations which were not recorded. And Gwen, as part of that conversation I had with you, is what inspired this panel. So previously, we had discussed what it was like for you to spend years being the only woman in the room. And what it was like to see generations of women gain admittance just to get a job. So tell us about that. So, yes, working where I was, I was almost always the only female on these IT project teams. Now, I had come from banking, plenty of women there. I had come from publishing, plenty of women there. But suddenly, I was in the Bros Club. And as I said before, my first couple years there, I was supporting the stars of the projects. I was lucky enough to have a boss, a man, who would bring me into his office and mentor me. Now, back then, I did not realize I was autistic. I just knew I could never read a room. He would help me with that. But he would also praise me, give me the praise that I needed. You are clearly the best writer in the whole company. You are clearly the best quality person. You write processes. So please, please don't deny us your talents. And I fell for that for a long time while I got my confidence and started feeling capable. Eventually, I really embraced I am the secret ingredient that is valued by maybe one or two people. My pay is way, way, way low. But it is more than I was making at the bank or the publishing company. So let's just feel lucky to be here. Eventually, I brought my values to it. I said, I am no longer going to attempt to be a bro. And I am darn sure not going to be that female shark who pushes everyone else out. So anytime someone else came in, I tried to be supportive. Keeping in mind, I'm sorry, I was just trying to make a living. I don't paint a hero here. I was trying to make a living. But eventually, as we said before, I found my opportunity. I found a way to distinguish myself in a way that others could see. And I tried to have a pretty good strategy about getting there. Now, I also got a slap in the face. Can I tell the conversation? I had a close friend who was a cultural anthropologist. And she had no idea what I did. So she kept saying, so you fixed computers? No, no, no. You build software? No, no, no. I would try to explain what I did. And it was in an era where data management was just carving itself out of IT. And data governance was a tiny, tiny specialty within that. And she listened to me and said, oh, I finally get it. Data management is the woman's work in IT. So, exactly. Unfortunately, the next day I came back and said, you're not wrong. You're not wrong if you're talking about the status to which it is held. But I can't do anything about it. I'm just going to make it the best I can. But over the next few years, I mean, it really, really stuck with me. And I met other people at these conferences, Danette, others, and I shared that. And I said, let's reframe this. Let's reframe from a cultural anthropologist's perspective. If the IT work is about being the first on the web, the best thing that will do this, and these bros live on fight and flight and competition, what do the rest of us bring to the table? Well, we tend to things. We defend things. We befriend the people who are working on it. We are so good at blending all of the different efforts together. And that's when I realized my specialty. I'm going to start that again because it applies to most of you. My specialty was being a synthesis. If some of the power in organizations occurs in the boxes, the influence and the quality and these other characteristics that we love, that happens in the spaces between. So let's just build on that. Let's just do that. And I unabashedly recruited women because we're trained to do that. You mentioned too growing up, it was illegal for women to have a credit card. And for you to get a job and want a job, even a wanted job, you were considered not well. Here is why I had to be so grateful in those early years to even have this. The year I graduated from high school, women couldn't get credit cards or bank accounts without a man signing for them. Women in the same job were unabashedly offered much less money because after all, you're not ahead of household. There were all of these obstacles that thank goodness don't exist as much and will never in the future be put upon us again. But yeah, so I just wanted to survive and thrive.  And I'm like, okay guys, I get it. I get it that I'm single and unmarried and purchasing a home, which apparently I shouldn't be doing, right? How dare I want to have one. Nobody else has a claim on it. But things like that, that's not a thing that men have to claim or sign off that they're a single unmarried man. So we've gotten further, but there's still so much further to go. But look at this. Look at it. Look at it. Now, Kelly, you and I have talked about Jen's years and how we are learning so much from even the younger generations, the aha moment of, oh, you mean we don't have to put up with that. Right? So can you explain a bit about that and how is it important that we learn and listen from all generations and work together? Yeah. Well, I mean, I was just thinking I could never have started First San Francisco if I didn't have a credit card and all of that stuff.  I'm sorry. I forgot to mention I had a husband. Well, anyway, I'm going to say luckily I did it. But anyway, so I think that there's and maybe maybe it's just me, but sometimes there's this sense that your experience is, you know, everybody else has had this experience too. Sorry. And what I learned when I'm talking to younger women, it's like, oh, that's it's not like that anymore. And so these things around toleration or tolerating behavior, and I could tell you some horrifying stories, tolerating behavior is not what it used to be. I will tell you that. And I have never been shy. I have never been someone to not speak up. But there was a point in which like you just kind of let it happen or existed and became the water and figured out, how do I just put that to the side and go around it? And now some of those behaviors, I have a 14-year-old daughter. We have, you know, I think our youngest employee, our, well, our youngest employee happens to be a female. No, our youngest employee's male. But our youngest female employee's maybe 22. And some of these things around just tolerating behavior that would be considered inappropriate, it just never crosses their mind. And I'm like, oh my gosh, in which I'm afraid to tell the stories that I tolerated this like crazy stuff, I'm like, I'm mortified that I did that. But it just doesn't even come up. And I'm like, thank goodness. Like you've really, like it's become an expectation that it doesn't matter, you know, really what your gender is, you're going to behave in a certain way. I'm not saying that we don't need to have these forums because, you know, equal pay for equal work, and like there's still a whole lot of work to do. But that perspective of, you know, you just have to tolerate it because you're female is hopefully, hopefully not what it used to be. Anyway, I'd probably, I agree. I mean, I think I tolerate a lot less than you guys have. And I know, I know that based on the conversations I've had with many women in this room. And it's interesting kind of being on the other side of it, right? Because I'm often branded as like feisty and a fighter. And because I don't tolerate bad behavior. But where have we gotten tolerating it? Those adjectives are very different than they used to once it would have been a fight. Well, I mean, that's right. I love it. But like, where have we gotten tolerating it? We've tolerated it and we're still here. And so obviously it's not working. Tolerating bad behavior doesn't benefit us. Being like kind and polite and letting people take advantage of us doesn't benefit us in any way. And so I'd rather advocate for people and advocate for women and particularly women of color. And I'm happy to take some of the front work if that means that somebody else doesn't have to in the future. And I had somebody say to me a long time ago, I came to a room kind of like this when I was much younger. And heard somebody say they always felt like a token and I've always felt like a token my whole life in pretty much every situation I've been in. And it's like a very pressurizing place to be in because you feel like you do have to be perfect, right? And perfection is not achievable, but it's kind of a pressure put on you. And they said that when you're a token in the room, what you need to figure out is how do you make sure no one else feels like a token ever again entering that room? Like how do you leave the door open so that no one feels like a token ever again? And reframing that perspective for me has really helped. So when I'm in a tough situation, whether professionally or personally, like what am I doing so that no one else ever experiences this situation again? And like how am I making sure that this is removed? There's a lot of phrases about that we carry as we climb. Empowered women, empowered women, there's whatever hashtag you choose to use in this current moment. But that's the idea that I think is different from women older than me, because we have a lot more resources and we know that we deserve better. And we're able to have these candid conversations where like me sitting here and saying something or a panelist saying something like that 20 years ago would have like you guys would have all been shocked. And me saying that now, like I've said that so many times before in public rooms. So I think there is a difference and I'm really glad that we're moving to a more candid conversation so that we know that our experiences of being mistreated are not unique. There are overt things that can be done, which you have alluded to. But there is also background stuff. Now, probably the people here don't know. But over the last 15 years, there is a group of about a dozen of us who have worked actively behind the scenes to change the language that is used to describe data governance activities away from competition and authority and control to establishing decision-wise, working for collaboration, making collaborative decisions, engaging participants. And please, that is never-ending work. So continue it. Oh, absolutely.  So if you expand a little bit more on that. Yeah, yeah. Every job I've ever had, I felt not qualified for when I got it, except for this current one. God, finally, we're in a place where I have confidence. And so I've seen my confidence build from pretty much nothing to a lot. And I think early on, if you feel like you're lacking some of that confidence, remember that no one knows what they're doing, right? Like, we're on this panel. We're not perfect. We've had to figure things out. We're figuring things out right now. And so remember that you're doing even 10% of something is more than what's being done right now. And so your 10% is sometimes good enough, right? It's not great and it's not perfect, but it's good enough. It's something you're contributing in some way. So remembering that. And then when you get into a state of more confidence and you build that up, sometimes faking it does help you make it, which is interesting. But most of the time, people have imposter syndrome. And how many of you feel like you have imposter syndrome? OK, pretty most hands. I've spoken to CEOs that are running big, large companies that are super successful and I look up to that have imposter syndrome. So to some extent, it never goes away. And recognizing that it never goes away will actually help it go away for you. You're on the cutting edge, whether it's for the entire industry, the world, or in your organization. If you are competent, then you're not doing enough. Yeah, there's a lot of growth that comes from fear. And when you're experiencing change, like you're going to experience fear, most people experience even workplace change experience at the same way they would experience grief, which is interesting. So if you're experiencing some of those negative feelings, about what you're doing, that's a good thing.  So yeah, really reframing how I think about myself has helped with how I present to the world. But then also surrounding myself with people that I know are good advocates of me and other people really helped.  Not in those words, but basically, right? So surrounding yourself with friends, whether in your industry, outside of your industry, that understand that you are better than you think you are is really helpful and really does help you build up that confidence. So it's a mindset thing, guys. We can overcome that. If you're on TikTok, there's a big sound right now that's going around that says, it's obviously not that hard because boys do it. And it can't be the heart of boys do it, right? And they're confident. And so we can be confident, too. And we do great work. We know what we're doing. And there's actually a statistic from Lean In org, which is Sheryl Sandberg, that says men will apply for a job when they feel like they're, I think it's 40% qualified, and women will apply when they feel like they're 100% qualified. And we have a lot of imposter syndrome, so we're probably 120% qualified, and they're probably like 30% qualified. That's a big gap. And so we just have to make sure that we're ahead of that. You see a job that you don't feel like you're qualified for. Too bad, it's not your job to decide that. They have an HR department, that's literally what they get paid for. So give them some work to do, right? Apply for the job, put in the application, try the thing, it might not work, and that's okay, we'll learn from it. But it might work. And so what's the harm in trying? And so yeah, that's what's really reframed my confidence. And for some of you that have known me a long time, you've probably seen it grow, and that's been really cool to watch and to be a part of. So I would encourage you all to reframe it, and if you need help with that, I will be your pep talk. So give me a call, and I'm happy to do that. Awesome. So I'm gonna open this up to the whole panel here. So what advice would you give to women looking to get into a career in data management and data governance? So Kelly, let's start with you. Yeah. So I think that you can come from any background and get into data work. And because one of the nice things about data work is that it is so broad. And so what I would say is, don't worry about am I trained? Is my education appropriate? But learn enough to be able to map your strengths to the requirements of some of the roles within the data world. And if you need help mapping them, I will volunteer to help you because there's so much work to be done that I never be afraid to do that. And I think picking up on what you were saying about the applying for the job when you're 120% qualified, that is really, really important. And so reaching out for something that you think might not be achievable because you don't have whatever stamp of approval, you don't have a technical background, all of these things. I think there's ways where you can actually synthesize what you do know and demonstrate how that can add value to an organization around data. So that'd be my biggest piece. Yeah, I love it. Yeah, just piggybacking off that. Transferable skills are really important. So even if you don't have skills in this particular field, you have skills. Figure out how to apply those skills and the mapping out is important. But even those of us that have skills in this area, we are still using skills from other areas and applying them. One of my most useful skills in my data governance job is my nonprofit expertise, which is a very odd connection for most people, but nonprofits do change management on a daily basis. That's my whole job as a nonprofit founder, right? And we're doing it with fewer resources. And that's what data governance work is. So yeah, just piggybacking off of that. The transferable skill connection is really important. And there's a lot of great resources out there on how to transfer your skills from one area to another and you can apply those into data work as well. Yeah. And building off that, try to get to know yourself. What feeds you during work and what style of work matters? Like, I have to work for an organization I believe in. Just have to. I am value-driven, so I cut out three quarters of the world and never look back. Also, I think in metaphors, I think in patterns. By the way, my training for data management was becoming a musical, classical musical composer. Trust me, in my head, it's all the same. But for me, I'm literally in any situation, this idea and this one and that pattern and this one and pull it all together and ta-da! Or pull it all together and where was I? But I have always tried to partner with someone who had complementary skills. Danette and I do so much brainstorming together because she is strong in taking a path down a logical conclusion and applying this and applying this and she is indefatigable. It will not stop until we get there. No matter how many times I say squirrel. So, but work in a way that you are comfortable with, build teams and find partners that one plus one plus one is at least five, maybe seven, maybe nine. I think there was, firstly, I hope you all know how much we love Danette. Can I read it? Yeah, I was gonna say fingers. Danette, can you stand up please, say hi. Yeah, thank you. She's been mentioned multiple times and I love that. But yeah, there's been a lot, there was a lot of great talks, great points in Monique's conversation today about mentorship sponsorship. How do you make sure you're talked about in a room that you're not in? So if you should be evaluating the people that you consider mentors, sponsors, leaders around you and are they talking about rooms that you're not in? Like they should be able to prove that to you and if they can't put your time elsewhere, please. Being able to recognize when someone is pretending to be a good leader or a good advocate for you versus when they actually are, I think that's a really important distinction. You know, we talked about like women that don't support other women. Unfortunately, that's still a thing. And being able to recognize when someone is pretending to support you versus when they're actually doing the work. And that's actions, not talk, right? So we wanna focus on actions. But then for yourself, your personal brand is really important but being able to communicate to people in the room what you need is something that women are notoriously bad at. We are so good at helping, but we're not good at asking for help. And so learning how to ask for help. You're good at advocating for others. How do you advocate for yourself? So if that means you have to like switch your mindset into like, oh, I'm advocating for myself because I wanna support my family or because I wanna advocate for these other people and having a higher paying job allows me to do these other things that are better for the community. Do that, make that connection if you need it. And then the other thing I will say is, we are really often thought about as a women's job. And the reason for that is because we are helpful people, right? Data governance and data management is their helpful roles. How can you make this a little more tactical and change that conversation in the rooms that you're in? If that means you need to go get something like a CDMP certification so that you can show that, yeah, this is a helpful field, but I have expertise in it. If that means you need to go to some trainings, you're here, I hope all of you will make a LinkedIn post after this about what you learned during the conversation. Make 12 of them, like they're free. Make as many as you want. LinkedIn's algorithm's weird and people see things at different stages. So I get told all the time that I post too much, I post less than once a month, which I think is interesting. So you should be using those platforms to advocate for yourself and to put your name out there and also sharing expertise, right? How do you take this back to the teams that you're on, to communities that you're in for people that weren't able to be here and how do you kind of give them these tidbits and mentor them as well?  So those are some things that have really helped me in my career and I hope that all of you are thinking about, even if you're not an expert in this area, how you can give back and kind of get more women and more people from diverse nature into this field because that's what's gonna grow it. Any scenario you're in, know who you need to impress and know are they impressed by metrics, by, if so, grab those metrics by credentials, by stories? I once got a data governance gig for a top five bank in the US that was having trouble with their mortgages. Can we guess when that was? Because while we were waiting to go in, I'm talking to the very expensive suit next to me and I said, oh yeah, I cut my teeth on mortgage banking. As a matter of fact, for a while, my nickname was Tildy, Truth and Lending Disclosure. Oh my goodness. I think lowest of the lowest of the lowest task in my department, but he said, so you know how it really works, even without computers. I said, yes, sir, you're not gonna be able to hide anything from me. The job was mine. Know what impresses people. Absolutely. Oh my gosh, so I do wanna thank you all so much for being on this panel. I'm gonna open it up for questions. Does anybody have any questions? Yes, we've got one over here. We've got some mics going around the floor here. Yeah, I was curious, what qualities do you look for in an ally helping women empower women or what's things that we can do in when there's things that we may not be aware of? Yeah, asking that question is the first thing I look for. Oh, good job there. Being able to show that you care and then being able to step in and step up when you're needed. So something that really often happens in rooms is like we're in a meeting and a woman is cut off. Like what are you doing to bring her back into the conversation or women's ideas are very often taken by a man in the room or somebody with more power in the room. And so it could be another woman, right? Taken with somebody with more power. How do you like give them credit again? So that's a big one for me. And then I also look for like, are you talking about me in rooms of opportunities? Like that's my biggest gauge for just life in general.  And that's true for not just supporting women but like supporting really any community and allyship. Like being knowledgeable, being able to step in, being able to use your voice for advocacy because we all have certain powers, right? Like I have certain privileges that I can use and I'm able to. So yeah, what would you guys add? Yeah, I mean, I would absolutely say all of that for sure. And I think truly knowing why you want to help that person. And yes, we're here to uplift women but it's important that you really want to do that and you're not, and it's not charity. So I'm just gonna say it because it needs to take action like Akwari was saying. And it is something that I think you need to be very thoughtful and consider what is it that is unique to you that enables you to help this other person who is also unique and are you able to have hard conversations, right? Because sometimes that's necessary. Are you able to provide direct feedback in a way that they can hear it? So those are just some of the things that I would say is just, you know, make sure that you're really, you know, you're in it for good reasons and that you're really willing to take the time and take the steps. Great question. Danette. My name's Danette McGilvie. I am the Danette, the David McCree. So I appreciate all the compliments but you know it's all back at you and many, many other people in this room that I've learned from. So I'll pose another thank you to Tony and Shannon, Kelly, everybody putting this together. Yeah. There's no way I would be able to do what I do without the support of people like all of you and you might find your next best friend or your next best mentor or your next best mentee at the table with you. So I'm gonna pose a question. I think you guys have kind of talked around it but I'm gonna ask you because I think sometimes as women it's hard for us to just go and I'm really good at this but you've even kind of done that.  I love it. So whoever wants to start, Gwen, yeah. I see patterns. I see life cycles. I see things that ought to be connected and I am undroundable in trying to connect them. Ah, I love that. Kelly. Oh, God. Honestly, I'm not a, I think one of the things and I was taking those during Monique's presentation, I'm not a very self-reflective person. I don't do that and I probably should do that more often. I think that one of the things that I do well is I help other people see their value and what they're really good at and I'm really, I'm good at encouraging people to take the risks and the steps and there's somebody in this room that works for me who could probably tell me something else. I think there's something else. Brandy. Oh, thank you. That was impressive. Okay, I'm the first new works for Kelly. Yay, me, I'm so lucky. So Kelly has an amazing superpower. No matter what has happened 10 minutes before any given meeting or anything, that it could be cruddy, it could be amazing, every meeting she is completely in that conversation with those people for whatever they need. It could be super tactical, it could be talking about your cats, which is often me, right? And she's right there and knows my cat's names. Like Kelly, that is Kelly's superpower is really every person that she talks to feels seen. I love it. Thank you, Gretchen. I should have just deferred to you. I was really impressed by Gretchen's very loud speaking. But also like we should be doing that for all of our friends, right? You should be telling all the women around you what their superpower is if they can't say it themselves. So thank you, Gretchen, for doing that. I'm a really good intruder and so I'm really good at bringing people in and I'm a very positive person, so that helps putting a positive spin, not like toxic positivity, but a good healthy amount, I'm realistic too. And then being able to really talk to anybody about anything, I feel like I have a very wide range of topics that I'm interested in and that allows me to make relationships quickly, which has been really cool for me my whole life and I've used that for a long time. But if you're like Kelly and bad at coming up with word, I would recommend something like the Strengths Finder. Gallup has something called the Strengths Finder. Myers-Briggs is okay. It's not really great at giving you words that you can talk about. My top five strengths are Includer, Developer, Positivity, Communicator, and Learner, which are all words I can use in a regular conversation, which I really like. So there's a lot of personality tests out there that you can use to help you kind of give you those words if you don't have them already. But what's your superpower? My superpower? What's your superpower? Including things, not sleeping? I don't know. Volunteering for things? I agree with that. I think my superpower is- Getting stuff done. I'm actually not perfect at that. I'm really good at starting things, not the best at finishing things, but I'm good at handing them off when I know that I can't make any more progress. I think my superpower is caring. I care a lot about what I do. I care a lot about the people I talk to. And that works in every area of my life. Oh, I love it. Well, thank you all so much. I'm afraid that is all the time that we have for everybody here. Oh my gosh, you guys are amazing. Thank you for listening to Dataversity Talks, a podcast brought to you by Dataversity. 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