Good evening. Good afternoon for some of you folks on the other side of the world. Good morning. Hope you all are doing wonderful I hope you all had a wonderful weekend today as always I'm going to be just when I was always I shouldn't say that way but From time to time someone may take issue or an exception or have a different view on One of the things that I might teach or believe and so today Brother JP who also has a YouTube channel you guys go over and check it out. It is just pray NYC And so his issue is of course as the title and thumbnail Suggest we're talking about the issue of eternal security And so I want to go ahead and bring in brother JP brother JP. How you doing today, bro? God bless you guys. God bless you guys. Do you hear an echo as I speak? Nope. No, I don't Much respect to our brother here in ministry for many years So not my respect this wasn't done out of bad blood bumming truth stand and made the word Is there anything you want me to say or add or anything along those lines Well, what I want you to do is to go ahead and just let folks know a little bit about your stance You don't have to go into as we said all all of your issues. What do you what you? You know all the different points that you're gonna want to make later on but just just real brief Why you don't believe that there is Yeah, you're fine now, okay, perfect. So you're asking you asked me why I don't believe in eternal here. Yes Well, that's the that's the interesting thing. I do believe that if we remain in Christ, we are currently secure I don't believe and I saw your video brother for you. There's one beef. I've had with you Not many just one there is a distinction with the panacastal view and The view that I hold and has been grown I do not believe you can lose your salvation like lost your car. There is a distinction In court, okay, the distinction is One you lost like oh my goodness and then the other you will fully turn the way I believe we can willfully turn away. However There are a couple of scriptures that I'd like to go over and explain to me so I better understand your world view Okay, these are not my Have a couple of proof text but there are a couple of ambiguous biblical scriptures that I would like to explain to me Okay, well, you know what that can be our jumping off point. So you said there's a scripture. Which scripture would that be alright? People are saying that I'm jumping in on and that okay, so hopefully we'll just push through it That's all we can do now Yeah, give me one moment. I'm gonna get you the scripture right now If you tell me I can go ahead and also put it upon on the page for everyone to see Yeah, absolutely. I'm a cook. I'ma get it right now so Okay first Corinthians Chapter 3 verse 17. Okay first Corinthians Corinthians chapter 3 you said verse 17. Yes, sir Always I typed it in wrong Yeah All right, let's put on the screen. I'll go ahead and I'll tell you what you go ahead and read it You can go ahead and read it. All right so The overall context here is talking about kids talking about the end times and then there's a warning in Verse 18. Well, excuse me in verse 17 If anyone destroys God's temple and even previously do you not know that you are God's temple? And the God's temp our spirit was in you. So our brother here.  I'd like you to explain that to me. I think the description is very clear Okay, well, let's do this let's to kind of keep it in context because I think this this this particular passage this collection passages Almost well, I don't say almost it does hurt. It hurts your point. Let me show you why Let's go back up a few verses earlier. Now if anyone builds on the foundation verse 12 With gold silver precious stones wood haystraw each one works will become manifest For the day will disclose it because it will be revealed by fire and the fire will test What sort of work each one has done if the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives He will receive a reward if anyone's work is burned up He will suffer loss but look what he says though. He himself will be saved but only as through fire So the person's going to be so now he says Do you not know that you are God's temple and that God's spirit dwells in you if anyone if anyone destroys God's temple God will destroy him for God's temple is holy and you are that temple So your question is is relating to is is is he saying that if someone destroys a temple in this person's a Christian Then God will destroy him. Well, it cannot be it cannot be that this person is speaking about salvation Being destroyed because he just said he would be contradicting himself in less than one passage and lesson one verse He just said in verse 15. He will suffer loss though He himself will be saved but only as through fire So we cannot have a a contradiction at least that soon from verse 15 to verse 16 and 17, right? So now Okay, go ahead. I'm sorry go ahead No, I I understand what you're saying, but there's a distinction That's the problem at hand and in one in one aspects is talking about works It's hope I was in the other aspect is literally saying you destroy God's temple.  That's the distinction one then we So I see what you're trying to do, but I see no contradiction because it's two distinctions Well, tell me why you think that this person will lose their salvation What so now we're gonna get into the caveat of what you can't hear me. I can hear you now You can't hear me. I can hear you now okay Yeah, I think that the scripture very clear when the Bible says God will destroy you I think description very clear and in this case I get it You're trying to say that because previously it was talking about gifts of people who are already safe People who already died, right? He's in the next context. These people are alive So one they're dead the works were tested. They're good and the other one these people are alive They're not dead and it says they will be destroyed If they attack that's them and you are that time So unfortunately your explanation doesn't work for me because I do not see a Now you're a man that reads Greek. Maybe read it in Greek. Maybe it'll say the opposite of what I'm saying It doesn't convince me otherwise but my point is he just said okay, so so How was the temple destroyed you mean it says if anyone kills someone what do you mean? But what do you think he means by? destroying the temple Well, I don't want to get into those small details. What I'm telling you is the Script makes it very clear and this will go to our next point that you can do some Exterior and that exterior thing calls God to destroy you So Right, I mean even the subtitle says divisions in the church So whatever that looks like whatever that is So now what the scripture says what the scripture says so if a person Okay, well Paul is writing to the church of Corinth for what reason his hope his whole point in the church and right to the church Is that there be no division there be unity, right? Okay, so Is Paul still speaking about the overall body or someone individually He's talking about the overall body because he specifically said you are that Okay, so if he's speaking about the overall body So if he's speaking about the overall body, then how could he then be speaking about salvation in here How could you equate that to be salvation if he's speaking about Talking about salvation above earlier, he talks about the people who are Saying who works will perish then down below he talks about the people who are not safe or currently alive Well, in the other words the saints he's talking about the saints and the saints There's a warning and the warning is very clear if you destroy God's temple God will destroy you and so I get it you want to say overall content We could start from the beginning to verse one all the way You're saying it's very clear, but it's not clear to me Okay, well, is there any other passages because this passage is not is not speaking about what you're saying But so but I'll go ahead and let you let you drive a little bit more This isn't this isn't coming across to me in that regard again His whole context is the unity of the church Do what what is right? What does destroy me? It means destroy What does it mean to be destroyed in the context of being a believer getting destroyed? What does that mean? Well, it's not saying All right, let's let's go back to it. You wanted you wanted me to kind of Okay The word is theory but they're a okay now the word can be destroyed or to corrupt Okay, in this context it could also mean to corrupt and in other words to bring some sort of Hairy the problem. I'm sorry There's a problem Corey.  I? Asked you to read the Greek to know if What I'm saying in context here's the word right there now look on the bottom of your screen look at the bottom left-hand corner Don't okay It is the word the word means to corrupt or destroy it is using in matter of fact. Let me just let me do this Let's see if the the translators themselves would have also Come up with a a different understanding. Let's see. We're mad. Oh I'm sorry so this word means and I usually don't go through these just to cause harm To a physical manner or In outward circumstances destroy ruin destroy ruin corrupt or spoil ruin financially So these are now it's given all the different times where it's used In either Greek biblical writings or Greek extra biblical writings, right? So the point of the point is that? Destroy has different different connotations, right? So now the question is are we talking about an actual physical destruction? Some sort of corruption that is not necessarily physical but having to do with the overall well-being Okay, that's a good question. So I can say I just so let's say after this conversation If I felt like I won all my points and I said I destroyed him Do I literally mean that I destroyed do I mean that I destroyed you in terms of physical? No And so how do we know what that is? Well, he's talking. He's talking. He's given the context He's given the context, right? He's given his context. He's talking about the unity of the body Okay So now if anyone brings in some sort of thing that destroys his unity or brings corruption or what have you? How do you want to look at it that person? God will deal with okay But I don't think this is this is a statement that's saying that a person is going to lose their salvation Matter of fact, here's the other thing the person though the word that shoes here for the person is a tease Which is if any person Well, the person that destroys guys temple, why do you naturally equate the bad person as a Christian to begin with? Who say the person destroys guys temple the person does it is a christian I'll tell you why I'll tell you why because the scripture is saying do you not know that you are god's temple and the god's spirit Dwells in you the warning for you because god's spirit dwells in you So what about the word makes you think that he's speaking about any of those same people Because well any one anyone can be equated to somebody this christian not christian but In the context and above it was talking about people who were saved and Works born and then we continue to read here J.P. Oh, let me ask a question Let me ask a question Let me ask a question one of two things here if the person that paul has had has in view here Destroys a temple however we look at how destroy means if a person is certain person Destroys a temple this person is one of two people right this person's either a non-believer A non-believing person who doesn't call himself a christian or a non-believing person who calls himself a christian Either way, he's a he's a non-believer So it's not that a christian is going to destroy god's A temple whoever this person is or wherever these people are they're non-believers So any can include can any can any include believers even if I were to follow your train of thought Does any include a believer if it if it does it kind of ruins it kind of ruins The the previous verses where it says that we are Or I'm sorry that we will not that we would be saved So he's speaking about us as believers and he goes on to say that we are that we are christian christ is and christ is Gods so he says that we are of christ in verse 23 and you are christ you belong to christ And it's in the genitive means that we belong to him and christ is gods. So I don't I don't see you it's a stretch Or it's not a stretch brother. Okay. Here's what it is. Here's what it is We're gonna move on because it's not it's not founded that that that the tease refers to a believer There's no way there's no way grammatically that you can write that word tease someone to a believer And I believe given the context that is talking about believers all the way down and in the scripture Uh, it's saying you are god's temple and if anyone destroys That would also include believers and that would include non-believers Anyone who destroys god's temple and what is the context believers who are causing the vision in the church? So, uh, I I'll leave it with that. Do you want me to go to my next proof text? Or do you want to respond to that? No, go ahead? I thought you're wrong, but go ahead Or I will disagree with you. All right. Well, obviously you would disagree with but that but so What is your next? I disagree quarry. I wouldn't say that I'm wrong just because you cess though I mean, we either went to the greek. All right, james chapter five Wait, wait, wait. Did the greek disprove me or prove me? Uh, the greek didn't disprove or prove you because you try to say that it was corrupt So did you see what so so so you so you read my point? Grammatically, there is no key to say that this person is say bronce That was my whole point when you make that leap you got to have some sort of grammatical basis to say so So like you just said the greek did not prove nor disprove and that's my whole point And so you can't make that to be a definitive text But now you you're you're wanting to go to jane, huh? Quarry quarry slow down not so fast the whole context of the chapter is talking about believers But I you said you want to go on let's go All right, uh, james chapter five 19 you said I believe that you said that Me watching some of your videos Uh, you said that in proper context james chapter five that it is descriptive not prescriptive Aligned many calvinists use granted whether your calculus or not that's fine But I heard your arguments and your arguments for very weak in this term. Maybe uh, read the find or modify your organization But I'll read it real quick james chapter five verse 19 and 20 And if you want to the context we'll start from worst one all the way there Uh verse 19 says this my brothers Who are brothers believe it's in christ? If anyone among you wonders from the truth and someone brings them back Let him know that whoever brings back the sinner Now I know your argument believers aren't sinners But I believe a believer can become a sinner and given the context of this passage it pulls them brothers They wandered away became sinners And it says brings them back from wandering will save the soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins Who are the brothers? Okay All right.  Yes. Well, that's my my argument there now Just just for clarification This was one of the passages because there was a time where I believed the same thing as a matter of fact I was a little bit older than you When I stopped believing the way you believed I used to believe that you could lose your salvation I fought it and fought it and fought it. I had one of the best actual scholars professors doctors who would Patiently work with me And I said and I would I would run to passages like James 5 Galatians 5 John 15 Hebrew 6 I would run of those passages and he would just break them down Now he gave me the greek as well at the time at the time. I really didn't understand. I didn't understand the greek, but This was One of the passes that also ran to because I said wait a second He's clearly talking about believers because he used the word a delphi brothers And he's not talking about something other than this person's soul because he says Whoever brings a sinner back will save his what his soul. So to me clearly he's speaking about a A potential christian right about this this is talking about somebody's soul at state well He said this to me. He said quarry read the passage I'm gonna read the passage. He says a delphi move in taste and humane which is Here's my brother. So he's speaking to christians or brethren Although, let me just say this also Guys, it would also be incorrect to think that every time that the word brethren is used does refer to Uh believers, but I won't make that point here because I believe here He's speaking about christians But what I'm saying this not for you jp People for those that are that are uh Want to kind of get a good understanding of the scriptures every time the word of delphi is used It's not always descriptive of christians because even jews use it that way So but here I believe it is talking about christians But look at what he says he makes this statement. He says in taste and humane He says if any if a certain one in you ain't ain't move Right here uh in taste and move among you if this person wanders now Two things to notice one this term here, which is a term Uh, a march alone, which is center is that's never ever ever in scripture ever used to describe a believer But what what he says here Uh in taste movement what he says if anyone among you, you know what he says This is what this passage means if a person who's among you when you go to church this sunday Or any day that you go Brethren if anyone among you Does what I say that or or is the writer saying that all the folks that are among you're all believers No, that's never the case if I go to church for example using an analogy If I go to church this sunday If anyone amongst you among you wanders away from the truth this this this understanding Make sure that you go and what does he say whoever brings back a center from his wandering will save his soul from death So he's saying the person that wanders away is not it's not a believer. I know he's not a believer because he calls him a center Did you like to respond to that core? Sure you can respond to that Yes, so corey unfortunately that doesn't work here. Uh, I know it doesn't stand your your uh, your I understand your speech. However, if we read from even, uh, if we go above And we go from verse 13 It's clear addressing the brothers in christ for as you said he's talking about these dressing brothers Yeah, yeah, but let me let me be very clear here. If I'm in the church Okay, I'm free All right. Okay, there we go if I'm in the church and I say brothers and or till the end I'm talking about the brothers. How would you say? The regular people in the congregation. Let me ask you a question. I address them as brothers Then when you're doing core way to say way say way say jp if we're talking about brothers And why would he use the word among you he could just say if any of you Because he's talking about the because he just used that vervech. No, no, no, no, no, no when you when you When he's used the word, let me respond. Go ahead. Go ahead Cory, he said brothers He's in the beginning of the chapter and then he's addressing the believers Not the randoms in the congregation We can't strip first naked and then say oh, well, this is talking about the general crowd That's not the case read from from the chapter all the way down. It's talking about brothers I'm not of the belief. I'll finish by saying this and I'll let you respond I am the belief that you can be a brother The part be a sinner And return the scripture is making it very clear that someone can reach now There's a difference with there's a difference with becoming apostate But in this case it's talking about the brothers But here's my question though jp if I wanted to say if I if if you were writing this scripture If this were you writing it and you did not mean Christians, but you mean folks who are among Christians. What would you say? How would you say it? How would I say it if I was in a congregation? Yeah, if you were saying if any of those among you How would you say it? if I'm talking about the brothers, then I'm addressing the brothers if If I meant it amongst everybody who wasn't christian, then I wouldn't have said brothers I would have just said to everybody among you But there's no stop stop. You just said what he just said what I just said you just said you would say everyone among you That's exactly what he just said Brethren if any among you why he didn't what he did what he did not have to do was use the word among Why would he use that? Exactly the distinction is he said brothers So he was addressing brothers. He's okay because we read the full chapter. Okay jp He's addressing the literal brothers. James is going to write your question My answer is not gonna No, you didn't your answer is not going to change because you don't want to change but James I mean jp jp jp If he writes to he's writing to christians. He's writing to his brother james is writing to brother And he's saying brethren if any among you Why would he use the word among you when all he had to do was just simply eliminate that word and just say if any of you How how would if if I wanted to say if any of you depart I would take the word among you But if I meant people who are amongst you I would put the word among in that's what he did. He used the word among All right, and we're going in circles here. I already said Distinction and said brothers and the reason he said any the part among you is because If you read the rest of the passage, he's not assuming that all is going to part among those specific brothers So he said the brothers among you if someone departs description is very clear description pull out the greek JP you stop asking me to pull out the greek when I pull out the greek you disagree with the greek Don't do that if you're gonna ask, but guess, you know what?  I was gonna save it now. You said you understood my My uh, no, you know what? I'm gonna hold off. I'm gonna hold off because you you stated that you understood my position And how you presented james five was not my position at all. Okay, I've never stated that that he was never talking to Uh two brothers at all at again for 30 years. I've I've stated Um, but clearly he's talking to brother. My apologies. I misunderstood. It's okay. It's okay. It's okay But my point is so Brother quarry real quick real quick. Uh, just real quick if you don't mind if you don't mind We start with uh, even if we started with verse seven Verse seven says be patient there for brothers until the coming of the lord So even if we're starting verse seven, it's addressing the brothers.   You are exactly where I was almost 30 years ago You're exactly where I was where I just said i'm not going to be wrong on this If I am writing a letter and i'm writing it to brothers to christians I'm gonna write brothers and if I mean to say that brothers if any of them brothers in verse seven Jp we both agree. We're talking about brothers. He's talking to brothers Now he's addressing brothers not other randoms in the crowd. You're not listening. I just said that stop arguing the point that i'm not arguing You're arguing a point that i'm not arguing. Let me make my position clear Let me make my position clear because if i'm if i'm saying something that you already said then we're not making strides here So let me make my point very clear james chapter five verse seven Be patient therefore brothers Okay, say a moment you didn't say anything Then they continue to uh verse 12, but above all my brothers And then when you go all the way to 19 it continues with brothers my brothers If any among you among the brothers one jp jp jp are you listening? I know he's talking about brethren. I just said that You don't have to argue that we're that he's talking to brethren. I just said that I'm saying He's the letter is written to brethren That's clear. You don't have to prove that he's talking to brethren by reading other passages when I've already agreed to that point I have stipulated to that point Okay, now what i'm saying is he's writing to the brethren to tell them of any amongst you If he did not mean any amongst you He would not have used the word for among he would just say to any of you like it's common in greek Here's the thing greek is so simple. It's to the point Okay, and it clarifies a lot of the issues And so when you add like for example, you ask me to read the greek I read the greek and i'm telling you this is what this is the point of this passage This is the point of the statement of any among you So that includes now that could mean any brethren, but also includes any non-brother any amongst you any in the Any other brothers if it's not seen Because when you use the word among I asked you earlier if I were asking you Among the brethren if I asked you jp If you wanted to say if anyone among you like if you were writing it if I said jp If you were writing it and you wanted to say if any amongst you Not you but any among you you said the exact same phrase you would say the community But what was the context of what I said it would apply to the brothers All right jp, I tell you okay, we're gonna let's let's let's agree to move on on this one because you're not you're not getting this point but I get your point. Cory. I just strongly disagree. Okay. Well, that's fine. I'm gonna ask you a question Cory you made another argument Cory Cory you made another argument and then I like to address it You said nowhere in the bible does this call a For a sinner Cory, that's getting the dismissal because no you're a believer because you were a believer Then wander from the truth you bring them back Then they are a believer and if if you don't bring them back their soul will end up in death I think the description is very clear.  Okay Because no Has he had have we ever seen the pastors where he's called a believer a sinner where believers call a sinner That's a fallacy because I just said that they're no longer a believer Therefore, he's not calling the person that walked away from the truth a believer because they're not that anymore Okay. Okay. So here's my here's my contention My contention I won't I'll I'll go back to the genesis of this contention later But you stated before That you have understood my argument. You've heard my arguments, right? Uh, you stated that you've seen some of my videos and you you know kind of have have addressed my points before in the past So are you familiar with my my argument? Uh in john 10 john 11 and john 6 Uh john 10, uh, let me go there probably let me let me go there. Give me a sec. Let me go there. Um, So john 10, yes, uh, I am very familiar Let's not waste our time Because james white even said that was to the apostles if you want to waste time And and show that that's talking about uh, the chosen christians We can do that all human. Oh, you know what? Because james white said now. I don't know if james white said what you said, but I could care less if Frank said Huh, everybody everybody agrees that this is to the apostles. I don't want to even waste time What do you talk? Hold on. Hold on. I haven't even made my point. You have not chosen me. I have chosen you That's to the apostles if you want to waste time. Okay jp jp jp jp. Hold on calm down, buddy That's not even in john 10 number one We're talking about john 10 Not you're in john 15 talking about john 10 Okay, so you so you're so you're you were all of this About james white. We're we're in john 10. Okay Oh, correct continue. Okay. So now well, let's not go let's not go to that argument because I know So jp jp young brother. I'm listen. This is me as a older brother just helping you out You got to calm down, brother.  Yes. Yes for the for the john 15 Okay, but I didn't say john 15. I said john 10. Okay, I assume you were gonna say it because stop That's my point. You are so in a hurry to get to proven me wrong But we only have my point. I didn't you I said john 10 you repeated john 10 I said it again and you went to john 15 my point is this not necessarily in terms of this But I'm just saying just as as as as as an older brother as older than somebody who is who is who is only for your father to say Listen, slow down. Here are the points Ask yourself. Is it possible that I'm wrong now? I know for me I've asked myself in the past. Is it possible for me to be wrong? Again, when I was your age, I said I'm Fully convinced you could lose your salvation Fully convinced and I argued and fought and fought and fought what I did not do was I did not foreclose the opportunity to be wrong And so I'm open to to to change my position. I've done it Okay, now. I'm not sure if you are but I'm going to give you a passage Now and some folks in the chats understand what I'm where I'm going because you said that you you you've understood my point Yes, I heard both of the arguments. Okay, so I'm going to give you a passage That I have asked this passage On youtube since I started I've only been on youtube for just a little over a year I've also asked this passage to be refuted even before I even knew there was such thing as youtube You may or may not understand the passage. I'm not sure but If a person needs to go to a scholar to ask them no one on youtube no one Has rebutted this so so secure am I on this passage? I've stated And there's other videos That if I am wrong if you show me that I am wrong in my interpretation of this passage I will one shut the channel down or give the chapter the channel to someone else The reason why I keep repeating this is because this argument keeps going back and forth And you know what hasn't happened jp The people that have heard this argument that are all over youtube that are making these points You know what they never do they never call me up They never email me. You know what they do they stop by they check out this passage and you know what they do Keep on moving on. You know why because you cannot get past this passage brother. I'm right here, brother I'm right here brother. Let's get to the past. Okay, so I'm gonna read this passage to you. Okay, and then let's see now jp We prayed earlier about it's not who's right. What's what right? What's right? Let's let's see if we can get there in john 10 28 Jesus makes a statement. Let's go ahead and read it. Now. By the way, let me just say this as well This is not just in john 10 28 This is also in john 11 26. It's also in eight john 8 12 and 51 Uh as well as in john 6 we'll go to john 6 a little bit, but here it is Jesus gives three independent clauses in verse 28 He says I give them eternal life clause a And they will never perish and clause b no one will snatch them out of my hand Okay, those are three independent clauses mean they can stand by themselves now Jesus makes a statement in john 10 28 He gives what's called in greek the emphatic negation meaning that Here's how it goes The emphatic negation works this way and if you'd like for me to pull up the uh, I can pull up the actual greek But you could pull it up in chinese if you like bro. I already know your argument I I heard this it's both arguments. I heard about 15 and I heard this one But for the sake of audience if you want to read it in greek you can go on Okay, no since you've heard my argument. How is my greek interpretation of john 10 28 incorrect? No, I didn't let me let me respond to the verse I think that I thought I I agree with the interpreters to interpret it from greek to english I do not deny this interpretation And this interpretation.  So contingency number one and they follow me The scripture does not say That they will follow me regardless The scripture does not say they're forced to follow me with irresistible grace The scripture is saying what they do and they follow which means if you no longer follow These things will not apply to you. But let's continue reading I give them eternal life. I don't deny that I believe that when we follow Christ We get eternal life what we are debating here is whether we can give it back or not And they will never perish. Correct. If we follow Christ, we have eternal life and we will never perish Uh, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. I'm sure you heard the argument The argument at hand that says is the difference we get being snatched away Uh, I throw Okay, there's a difference we're getting There's a difference we're getting snatched away and you're walking away and to a court There's another scripture that says no one can snatch them out of my hand. No demon. No principality, etc Nothing can snatch the bible's very intentional with its words and I believe in the english translation And the english translation makes it very clear. No one will snatch them out of my hand But the scripture is not saying that you cannot walk out on your own accord It is just saying no one can snatch you out. There's a distinction My father who has given them to me is greater than all and no one is able amen to snatch them out out of my hand JP is that the argument? I'm just you told me to explain the verse. No, no, no, no, no I asked you to refute my argument at verse 28. You said you knew it And you said there was no need to go to it because you knew it So i'm asking you to refute my argument my greek interpretation my greek exegesis of verse 28. You haven't done it yet Well, well, let me ask you do you know my do you know? Do you understand my greek exegesis of verse 28? Do you just say yes or no? Because because you don't know From what? Well, do you want me to say from what I remember or or from what I remember you were saying jp? Well, listen young brother, this is the arrogance that you have you don't even have to say from what you remember I'm getting ready to tell it to you. I was going to tell it to you But you asked me a question the question. I was okay I can't ask you the question unless I go over it because you don't understand greek, right? And that's not a that's not a knock against you I'm just saying And so i'm trying to explain it to you Again, you have made up your mind. I'm not listening. Listen. Let me just pause for a second This is not for you jp This is for all the folks in the in the in the chat and for anyone who's going to watch it It's about 600 folks watching this this is something I stated some time ago. Uh matter of fact, I was talking to uh, uh, Sir Walter Jones, by the way, y'all go and check out sir Walter Jones He's gonna be on here next week though I just wanted to sort it out there But I was talking to him and I was telling relaying a story that I had with the with the brother About 10 years ago And I brought up this argument. No no no matter fact. I didn't get chance to We were talking about one saved always saving. He was hot. He was angry That I could even have the audacity to believe that he made a statement brother. I'm angry. I'm passionate I'm jp. I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about this other guy Okay, oh brother. Listen, this is what we're gonna do. This is what we're gonna do after this you and I we're gonna change numbers We're gonna change numbers. You know why that's for sure because I love your heart and passion But and I'm not I'm not trying to belittle you But you're coming across Uh as a young man, and I'm trying to get you to see okay, even if I'm wrong or even if I'm right There's a way to be right and a way to be wrong Okay, you're not even listening to my arguments to my point No, no, I was just making sure you know that I'm not upset at you. I didn't listen Brother Okay, jp.  I really don't I see you as a young brother in the lord I see you as I would see my son my daughters my my nephews. That's how I see you I'm not and I'm not trying to be belittling, but that's how I see you. Okay If I see a young lady on the street 20-something 30 I see them as my children as as a you know, not that I'm I'm over them, but that's just how I look at them So I'm not going to try to run over you or hurt you or anything like that I could be wrong But I want to talk to you the way Men ought to have been talking to young men all along I don't get in these arguments in these fights back and forth with young folks. I just don't you know why? Because it would be silly on my part. I don't sit and go back and forth with some young lady Um, why because it'd be silly on my part now if you 50 If you 60, we got a problem then we don't we don't we don't talk like me But even then I'm not going to belittle or anything like that or whatever So I'm talking to you as scripture says I ought to speak to young men Now I could be wrong in order to find out if I'm wrong. I need you to hear out my point Now I'm going to show you but not just you because it's not just you and I's having this conversation It's all the folks that are watching plus those are going to watch later And so what I want to do is I want to cover a rule in greek You would agree that the new testament was written in greek, right? Yes, sir. Okay. So now In order to because sometimes there's a reason why if you go to esv In uh, you know, you know, the king james version the asv all these One word they might pick a different word The reason is because trying to Find the right word For another word in different languages can be difficult. Do you speak any other languages or just just only english? spent Okay, so if I ask you for a word, um Uh, matter of fact, pero what's that mean in spanish? I don't know much spanish I know this what does pero mean? No, that means dog. Huh? That means dog does it also mean but Pero no bro. Pero doesn't mean but No, okay. I might be wrong. Are there words that go that that you might have two different meanings for in spanish There could be okay. So now so and so me not knowing in spanish. I messed up But on greek, there are words that we've got to find the right understanding for Someone says yes, uh, yes, it does. But uh, anyway, I don't know pero uh, some folks says pero does mean but I don't know I don't know listen I just heard I had I had one of my make one my main men in prison Was hispanic and he I would say wait a second because I'm trying to you know, learn how he's you know What wouldn't you just say because I want to make sure you ain't talking bad about it But anyway, uh, he would say he said he had means but and means dog. It's just being so anyway, um Anyway Hold on. Are they saying are you saying I need to slow the chat down? Yeah, pero means but like uh, but not but Okay, moderators, uh, tell me though. Do I need to slow the chat down? I see someone saying slow the chat down. So, um, I'm gonna wait to see see for that now. Anyway, so if I am Okay, he said okay. Mr. K says slow it down. All right. Hold him one second. Let me run over here and click this Click that y'all I'm getting better at this I'm gonna slow it down to a 30 second if that's okay with you guys and see how that works all right, cool now When it comes to the the greek or hebru or the few cases of airmake You've got to find the right word that relates win to today Okay, because today words mean the same exact english word might mean a different word 40 years ago See when you were born these words meant that but when I was born. No bad meant bad. That's all it meant was bad Now later on bad became good as well as bad cool meant temperature when I was born, but a little later cool also meant Uh, your preference how you like oh, that's cool, right? And that's how where it's called morphology words morph over time And so the translators have to find a good word to to to convey the understanding and so If I'm just saying that that's just how it is with with languages in general If I'm reading greek, I'm trying to get the best understanding and since it was written greek The best way to figure out what was actually said and I think it also says it in english But there's something missing in the greek I mean the english that the greek Convays sometimes this was called, uh, you know how we say loss in translation You'll say something in spanish, but someone didn't quite get it in english And you gotta may say say it four different ways or add another sentence to explain that one word Same thing happens in greek now that shows up here in verse 28 In greek, there is what's called an emphatic negation There is a way in greek to say this will not happen no matter what you do now or in the future There is a such Uh, there's there's a such usage that you can use in greek to convey that you don't necessarily have that in english Unless you say a whole bunch of words go along with it, but in greek you have the emphatic negation now I'll tell you the rule and if you want to see the actual rule put up on the screen I'll do that as well but This word states this this this this rule states this that if you proceed if you if if a And a subjunctive is preceded by A two negations a double negation then it negatives any future possibilities of this happening Now let's go to the past and see if I can help you out It says kai go did to my out choice zoe and onion which is and I give to them life into eternity also or and kai ume apalontai eston onion which is and No, not Now here's this word apalontai, which is the word for perish It is the subjunctive for perish now for some of you guys that are that are wondering What a subjunctive is we have that in english Subjunctive is a word that conveys possibility or potentiality in other words. They may perish. They might fall They might stumble this word apalontai. Let's go back to the screen Look at the bottom left hand corner and you'll see what it says. It says this is the plural eras middle subjunctive Okay, so this is a subjunctive, right? So that means this word by itself means may perish Okay Apalontai by itself means may perish now in greek the way you negative something is by one of these two words either oo Or may Both of these words means mean no or not or or never or less, right? So how you do this You'll say no not may perish In greek if you do that that literally means that it is impossible impossible For anything in the future To negative what was just stated Okay, now this word is also used when when jesus says that every Every word that god has given that one word shall pass away Okay, he uses the the emphatic negation. He has a double negation in front of a subjunctive Okay, so you listen No, i'm listening Okay, so a double negation in front of a subjunctive the rule is it is impossible For that statement to be negative by anything that anyone does in the future Are you with me? Yes, sir. It's got this statement who made the double negation apalontai now my understanding Is that this is jesus saying it is impossible for anyone any of his sheep to ever perish No matter what they do in the future now what that must mean Is that they're not going to ever stop walking with him that they're not they're never going to turn away They'll never blast and they'll never stop believing That's what's implicit in what he just said because he says no matter what happens in the future That's literally what it means guys. No matter what happens in the future. They can never perish Now here's my question Here's my question Is my greek understanding of that passage incorrect? Absolutely not. Let me tell you why okay because I already said I don't disagree with the passage the passage in english says Pretty much what you said greek the parrot the passage says I give them eternal life And they shall never perish so when you have eternal life and you're living in christ When you have that eternal life You will never ever ever perish contingent You have that eternal life Now christ gives us a security and he said that no one will snatch them out of my own hand But if we go to second timothy chapter two But jesus just said we ain't even gotta go there and jesus just said of these sheep They shall never perish no matter what happens That means you cannot come back and say if they stop following if they stop if they stop that He just he just ended that argument That's the greek point now i state this point that to say that if anyone thinks that john 10 28 in the greek doesn't cover the entire bible i'm shutting the channel down And i'm waiting for people and i get i get you i get you know, but there are some people out there who are scholars Who understand greek? pastor and they never come back to me Pastor this the problem go ahead. That's the problem pastor the problem i'm saying here is this The scripture is very clear I believe once I have eternal life I will never perish right. It's something I have. Oh, I see what you're saying I see what you're saying Well, wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. When is he giving him eternal life? Bokori, can I at least finish my argument? So if we read the full context of the scripture the reason that the Pharisees are not sheep and the sheep are A illustration of the jews the reason that the Pharisees are not sheep Is because they chose not to believe in god not to believe in jesus But the jews that believe in jesus those are the sheep of christ And christ is saying so long as you follow me, right so long as you follow Don't stop wait. Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second Hold on. Wait a second, bro. I'm asking to clarify what you're just saying Where does jesus say so long as you follow? Uh, I was gonna go there second timothy chapter Okay, boys are but in this passage though, does he say that? What is what scripture and scripture line up on line presep upon presep pastor? Okay, so are you going to find a passage that's going to tell me this scripture? This scripture right here is basically giving my insurance of salvation that I have Then second timothy chapter When did you hold on before we go before we go? When did you get your salvation? Upon accepting crisis my lord and savior so you receive salvation upon accepting christ Yes, sir, so if you received it Do you have to wait till the future to get it or do you have it right now? No? I have it right now, but I could always give it back He just okay. See that's one point remember remember the problem is There's 27 it says that I know them and will follow But just a tendency that you've got to continue to follow it doesn't say that Chapter whoa, if we go to whoa, whoa, because that's what I'm saying What you're doing is you're building something off of a misinterpretation of the chapter 10 You keep saying you have to keep following where as he's speaking about these sheep Does he say you have to keep following well? Now I believe I believe you have to keep following and he says that his sheep follow And you know, you know the tense of the verb used for follow is the present active indicative so means they are following So why were you so so so guess what sheep do four things? We know about sheep according to chapter 10 Four things one they will they're following they continue to follow Two they are hearing they continue to hear who are they hearing and who are they following? Jesus? What are the other two things they will not hear they will not future tense will not hear someone else for And if a stranger speaks what do they do they run the other way? So Jesus even makes it even more clear Of those four things he wraps up and says they shall never ever perish because I have Given them he used the word And I kago did am I which is he and I he's present active I'm giving them life into the ages and they will never ever perish So if all we have was just John 10, which is enough Now we can go together passage, but if all we have was just John 10 Would anyone Leave reading John 10 understanding greek thinking that you could lose your salvation Well, well, I don't think this is talking about losing your salvation. This is talking of the assurance of salvation. Wait a second What is eternal life? Except It's it's salvation except in christ So when I read the scripture quarry my father has given them to me He is greater than all no one is able to snatch them out of my father's hand So I already made the distinction that there is a difference when being snatched away And walking away, but previously it says come on brother cross the court I give them eternal life and they will Never perish and no one will snatch them out of my hand So if it's saying I give them you will never perish when you have eternal life I am I am fully convinced that you will never perish, but you have it right now. Don't you have your eternal life You have it right now. Don't you? Yes, I have it right now. Okay, if I give it back. I don't have but if you give it back Then that means clause b is wrong That's the point if you can give it back then jesus live He's wrong when he says that they shall never ever perish That includes if you decide that you want to give it back meaning you will never give it back No, I'm sorry. I don't I don't see that on the text I didn't say you didn't see it on the text. I just that's what listen. That's why I that's why I quoted That's why I gave you the grant the grammatical greek rule That's why I stated what it listened an emphatic negation in the greek negates anything that you can come up with That's the whole point of the emphatic negation in greek. You cannot come back Listen jp Cory, this is the rule if I'm wrong if I'm wrong about this rule jp if I am wrong about this rule This is your channel This is your channel if I'm wrong about this rule the rule states you cannot later on walk away You cannot later on leave his hand According to the this grammatical rule of emphatic negation, which is a basic greek greek rule By the way, according to verse 28, you can never walk away And then perish Cory, I don't I don't I just don't see that in the text. I get it. You're reading the greek But I trust the translators and I'm looking at all If you trust if you trust a translator translator say shall never perish Pass the passage pass the passage Like if I'm reading this translation and all the translations say the same thing There should have been at least one translator that wrote it out the way that you're saying it And which scripture says that you cannot turn away or do the back Okay, what does the word never mean say that pass. Cory. What's the word never mean scripture doesn't say that The scripture don't say never in English Cory the scripture is just giving us our assurance for salvation. All right. Let's stop and look at it again Let's look at it. Let's look at in english. Let's look at in english. I'm gonna make it bigger I'm gonna make this bigger Now if I say they will what is will what does that cano that means future, right? Is that right? Uh, yes. Okay. Will connotes future in the future. They will what never Never what perish? So jp Not just the greek is clear the english. They will never will future tense. They will never perish Now you come back and say no jesus you missed a point. They will perish if they do this No, i'm saying that's that's the implication what you're saying. You're putting a cause of conditioning on what he says Cory, Cory, this is what I'm saying, Cory The scripture is very clear that we have assurance in turned light the script is very clear with that The point that we're arguing here is is this contingent on whether you rip or not? Who said that? Who said that? I mean to get there Now, let me finish Cory. Cory. I'm this couldn't this is all for strats, bro Mm-hmm All right All right, so Cory I'm trying to show the scripture in second Timothy chapter two Right where there is a where there is a caveat here, right?  I don't just go off for just one verse scripture Interference scripture, but how about what jesus says here? It's going us our assurance. All right, can I ask you? So far Yeah, and it goes so far to say Hello, go ahead. Hello. Go ahead. Yeah, you're good Yeah, yeah, and it goes so far to say that no one will snatch them out of my hand So, Cory, I don't want to live on this verse because I already told you I believe this is talking about all the assurance of salvation. Well, what about john six? I don't But now let let the record show let the record show that I stated the rule I stated the rule What's the rule that The greek grammatical construct states that nothing that a person will do Will change you didn't disagree but you're looking for a passage that disagrees No, no, no, no, I'm saying nothing can pull you away out of that I'm not talking about that. I'm not talking. I'm not speaking about that clause. I'm speaking about clause But why are you saying I disagree? Why are you saying I disagree if I say I believe that? If I say if I say that nothing you do in the future will cause you to lose your salvation According to this passage And then you turn around and find something that you could possibly do to lose your salvation then then those two can't be But the passage is saying what you're making the same. So now, okay So my point is so are you saying are you saying my greek interpretation in passage? Are you saying jp? Are you saying my greek in that's the that's the whole question?  Jp does the does my is my greek interpretation that passage me at that economy. Let me explain myself I saying partially because you're trying to make a scene that could say yes or no situation What I am saying quarry is from the passage itself The passage is saying that we have assurance in salvage No one disagrees with that and the description says no one will snatch you out of my hand No one is disagreeing with that The point of contention is we are able to walk away in our own fruition. God will not force us to stay So so long as we remain Nothing will happen. We have assurance me as a christian like never i'm trying to tell you jp Hold on hold on brother. Let me finish and then let me read my passage if you hold on hold on hold on hold on hold on I'm gonna let you finish. We got we got time. We got time But you're not letting me speak right because jp because you because you're saying two different things Corey i'm not saying two different things. Okay Corey I am saying I believe the scripture would speak about assurance in salvation And there is a caveat that nothing can snatch you away Which leaves the door open for someone to walk away. And so what I was trying to explain to you Come on and I'm let me finish by saying this the passage is making them very clear So as you remain in christ, you follow christ, you're good I do not believe I can lose my salvation that way. Corey. I made it very clear to you I believe you can turn away, but I believe I could lose it in that traditional pentecostal way And I said this to you when our private conversation So you're hammering this comp you're hammering this point down when I am telling you I don't fully disagree what you do disagree some degree You disagree some way walk away and that is what I And so so okay now stop I'm trying to get you to understand that you can't even walk away. That is sealed that part is covered as well meaning All right See look look look look look the screen. I want to show you something. I just want to put someone on the screen I want you to read this rule with me Okay, because maybe you're thinking that I'm making this up or I don't even understand the rule So I'm gonna read the rule. Okay, so everyone else can see it as well Okay, can you all see that? Let me make it a little bit bigger This is what's called an emphatic negation of a subjunctive. Okay, let me read it Emphatic negation. Can you can you see that jp? Continue on bro continue on. Okay. All right Emphatic negation is indicated by ooh May plus the errors error was subjunctive or less frequently ooh may plus the future indicative This is the strongest way to negate something in greek the strongest way Now look what it says One might think that the negative that the negative the negative with a subjunctive Could not be as strong as a negative with the indicative However, while ooh plus the indicative denies a certainty ooh may plus a subjunctive Denies the potential the potentiality is that any potentiality of anything happened is denied as foreclosed The negative the negative is not weaker rather the affirmation That is being negative is less firm with the subjunctive ooh may rules out even the idea As being a possibility So what you're talking about that's being ruled out. Ooh may is the most decisive way Look at this last passage guys. Make sure you see this last passage ooh may Is the most Is the most decisive way of negativing something what in the future now there's more to say about it But I won't go into it. So he says it rules out any possibility. You can come up with whatever you want to You can come with somebody walking away. You can come out.  We're talking about the the greek grammar Now my question is is anyone on this planet gonna tell me I said it kind of you know arrogantly right there. Is anyone on this planet gonna tell me That my understanding of this greek rule for does not foreclose What jps saying jps and the person could walk away jps and maybe a person to stop believing whatever Jesus said i've given i'm giving them right now in turn of life And nothing in the future can negative that nothing in the future can cause them to lose their salvation meaning they will never perish Now is my understanding of the rule that I just read incorrect jp Brother, I answer this 15 times, but I said When I read the english I do not see your interpretation Here I Compared the translations, and I don't see it saying that you cannot turn away. So we're Which takes presence the english or the greek Uh, I what takes presence the scholars who uh translate greek to english to get the real meaning and conscience Do you know who do you know the rule this is this james wallace? So wait all I am saying is I trust the translators Yeah, that that brought it from greek to english Daniel wallace is a translator william monstero bob bruce mess these folks So so then why isn't it that way in the description? It is it says they will never perish will future perish never I agree. I told you I agree when you have salvation The point is the reason why you can the reason we bring around the rosy Okay, fine jp because they cannot you okay, so what you're saying is what you're saying is this You're saying they should have put the entire rule in the text That's what you're saying Let me tell you let me tell you what I believe court. Let me tell you what I believe I believe that the scripture is true Upon accepting christ No one can snatch you out of god right in You are secure. You have salvation No one can snatch you out That is very clear. Okay, so you you made a statement. It leaves it open. You made a statement You made a statement with On the video that I watched Force you away Snacks to be forced away And I believe that god Um, I do not believe that god forces you to stay But he won't allow somebody to forcefully remove you And so me walking away Is not me forcefully Um, it's not me forcefully uh, the You know, so so forget so so so forget the greek rule Hello, yeah, so so forget the greek rule Uh, unfortunately, I trust this translation. I'm Reading the esv. I'm reading the multiple translator the way Did you know the man who's what you're saying the book that I'm reading from and bro and bro. Let me tell you something I'm gonna go back. Look at the greek study it myself And there's some inconsistency in what you're saying with some uh calvinist propaganda I will make a response some calvinist. I'm not a calvinist Well, you're using you're using a calvinist argument. How is that? Which calvinist have you heard argue that point? Bro, you don't think you're the first person to use his argument cut it You're absolutely right. I'm not by the way the esv that you're reading one of the persons on the translation committee That's that I'm citing his book Okay, so he he's a translate. He's one of the translators of the book the bible's reading. That's that's fine That's that's fine, but I look at all translations and I just don't see what you're trying to tell me to see You don't see it. You you made a statement then you okay, I don't see it. That's fine. That's fine. There's literally it's it's very clear No one will snap you away. You made a statement You made a statement you made a statement to your friend. I haven't been able to read my my my text I'm gonna let you go. I'm gonna let you go. I'm gonna let you go. I promise you I promise you and I'm agreeing and I'm agreeing with the scripture I believe that we have security and salvation. No one can snatch us away Now I agree with all of that You're trying to say that there's no possibility for us to walk away and I'm saying I don't see that in the text However, I'm willing To uh a different passage that elaborates on my point and I was not able to do that Go ahead. Go ahead. All right You say second Timothy what? Uh second Timothy chapter 2 verse 10 to 13 Uh, and this is talking about saints Okay, the scripture says Therefore I endure everything for the sake of the elect They also may obtain this ambition that is in crisis with the turn of the lord The stain is trustworthy for if we die from we will also reign with him if we endure We will also reign with him if we deny them He will also deny us if we are faithless. He remains faithful for he could not deny himself The scriptures very clearly tell believers Save believers to adore And if they deny christ He would deny Yep, if it's faithless He still remains So I think the scriptures very clear. I think it is too. It is you Christians have to endure. Here's what it is The fundamental miss understanding of people that believe you can lose your salvation. There's a fundamental miss understanding I have it said I hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Cory. I don't believe I can just lose my salvation I'm using the term. I'm just using that term because everyone knows what we're talking about Obviously, you don't just lose like you said a set of keys I'm just the fundamental miss misunderstanding of people that don't believe in internal security One saved always saved perseverance of saints preservation of saints if saved always save however you want to put it The fundamental misunderstanding is What it means to be a christian? You're right christians If if you do listen guys, if you don't endure If you don't abide same thing if you don't bear fruit You will be cut off and go to hell You'll lose your salvation However, I believe according to the passages according to scriptures And according to how every person Personally every person in the in the new testament spoken of as a believer It's a present active indicative or participle. I mean they are believing they have entered Into a state of continued belief once for all and they continue believing But so I believe that a true christian is going to keep believing a true christian is going to endure These you have these warning texts go ahead. I'm sorry Corey can you show me a text that says that if You were a christian and you felt way you were never really a christian Okay, all right before before we go to this first john two pastor where you say this is of it's of heretics um Again, I've I've heard a few of your things. I heard a few like I said the one that I heard today Corey You are for that's respect. Corey. You caught the bait. You caught the bait for it Yeah, listen, we'll we'll go there. We'll go there and we will we will disprove your your point now Every time that jesus talks about a believer it is in the present active participle or the present active indicative I mean they are believing they are continually believing if a person does not endure Indication that person is not a believer now even though you say james uh james white says that john 15 Does not apply or that part part of part of john 15 does not apply to Is to the apostles I've got i've got uh scholars that that differ because what he cannot cite is he cannot cite a grammatical cre key That demonstrates in john 15. He goes from talking to the disciples to I mean from everyone to the to the disciples But what does god say god says that he will put his spirit in us And will cause us to walk and never depart That part is true. That's what god says jesus says I chose you first before you chose me. I loved you in john one and first john I chose you then you chose me. I mean, I love you then you love me And so when we see these warning passages, it's a warning if you are not enduring Guess what you ain't you ain't wanting in if you are blaspheming. Guess what you ain't a christian Christians do certain things but yes, so you're telling me you're telling me that every christian that's left to faith is no longer Has no longer been it was never really a christian to begin. Well, how do you know they were christian to begin with? Because they said it I'm saying that could be the case How do you know that the person left was a christian to begin with you don't you took their word for it? But bro by that definition, you don't even know That's why he just you know that you're absolutely right. That's why he says you got to be enduring That's how you know are you an elect? Are you elect? I believe so. Are you elect? Yep, and I was lucky And I was elected before the foundation of the earth. I was previously. No, you believe so. Oh, I know so I know so Wait, so, so how do you truthfully know that you're one of those christians? I'm fully convinced Because I can see my work But weren't people that were in your name we said, uh, we casted out demons and we did those things Why are they fully convinced? Nope, they might have been but what did jesus say to them? What did jesus say they might have been convinced but jesus was so you you could very much so probably be Convinced and you're not really christian by your way to say what did jesus say in that passage You're quoting matthew seven. What did jesus say about those people who thought they were jesus said to those people who thought they were He says depart from me. I used to know you Yes, he said I never knew you but how do you know god knows you? Well, we'll find out won't we I'm enduring you know what I know what I what I can put up My crowning achievement so far you know what I can put up of my crowning achieving achieving so far You were never christian.  I do About people that did the same thing and then departed. Here's my point. Here's my point though I can prove so far thus far. I've remained I've thus far Remained and so if I don't Paul says let every man examine himself To see if he's got christ So you better keep checking because some of you guys think you are Some of you are some of you guys are okay with sin Now we're all going to sin. I sin you sin. We all got children sin and non-believers sin The issue is if your heart is truly repentant doesn't bother you See christians have a repentant heart. They've been full of the holy spirit Jesus is talking to nicodemus and jonah three and says that a person must be born again Brother, brother, well all do respect. Well all do respect. I've been buried You know my sermon. Go ahead. The bible says you're told them by their fruit I thought that was what you were going to tell me. I thought that's what you were going to tell me You went on the three hour preacher. Well, I'm supposed to I'm supposed to I mean, I get it I get it. But the the responses, you know them And I know there have been people that do I have good fruit? Sure, if you don't show fruit in the in And in the future and you depart I wouldn't say you will never see you true. I would I would okay then so then what is your proof text that suggests that if you departed from the faith You were never of the faith my proof text and it's not a proof text My text is that when I when I receive Christ at the moment I believe at the moment I go into a state of continual believing at that very moment I begin to live forever Now you made a statement that you said that Somebody asked a question on on your deal. I said the parts that I'm only preaching about the parts that I saw on your On your live stream where you said that the question was asked Who is responsible for keeping the gift the giver or the one that receives right? And you said you said the one that receives I agree. I agree. John 6 tells us clearly who the receiver is Yeah, I get it that as christians we think that we're the ones receiving a gift and we are And we are oh by the way that gift according to uh in Ephesians 2 that gift All of salvation and the very Ability to believe that's a gift given to us by god and he keeps it as but now The true gift though. We've received a gift the better gift is what god the father gave to the son Is that true? So now you said who's responsible for keeping the gift? Let me do you one better not us the person who received the gift the gift is the bride That's us given by the father to the son Is jesus going to lose any part of that gift that the father gave to him? He says no in john 6 bro, bro, bro, bro, bro, bro, please Please courier making a million points courier. I'll never get to respond Respond. No, you know what I learned. You know what I learned from this from this. Go ahead. I Never in my life for my channel Run my show how you run Thank you for that courier. I love you my window.  I would want to listen to one of your sermons But one woman shats bro. You get into preaching moment. Anyways, let me respond to that same The scripture says that no one can come to the father unless it is he who draws him, correct? Uh, let's go to it. Correct. Yep Yep the scripture Does the father draws will come Correct. Yep So the way I see it is the father draws all but not all except Jesus Christ said I lift all men or tone upon myself Nope, you listen. Nope. You're wrong Jesus didn't say I lift all men upon myself. No, you're saying that I'll want you. You said that they all will not come, right? Yes, the scripture the scripture that basically says it draws. All right, let's just Let's let the pastor just say once the brother courier brother courier, please Please brother courier. Thank you So when the father once the father draws whoever he draws he gives those people to Jesus. That's the order of operation What does verse 37 say read it? I'm gonna let you read it Uh, 47 37 not 47 not 44 37 All who the father gives me will come to me Stop read before Stop before that read before. Okay. Let's let's let's go to it then. Let's go to stop Listen, hold on. Wait. Let's see. This is what we're not gonna do You say that you are passionate and when I show passion it's yours. You bother now. Don't do that Okay, let's read it then. Let's read but but but but but calm down a little bit. What pass you want to read 35 The one where it says no one can come to the father unless it is either draw That's 44 Yeah, yeah, go ahead and read it. But but before you get to 44 Isn't 37 before 44 Yeah, but 37 is talking what the father is doing. So if we go to what the father is doing it makes it very clear Okay, who's all all Are those believers core Can you read the passage corey, please? No one can come to me unless the father who sent me draws him correct, so From who the father draws He'll come to jesus And that's the order of operations. Okay. The scripture does not say that all who the father draws will come It didn't just say 37. It didn't just say 37. No, no, no, no, no, no, no corey, please corey, please The scripture that's the father draw From all who the father Come to jesus that's what the scripture is saying the scripture is not saying that all who the father draws will come Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. Listen. Hold on.  You just said that Corey, let me repeat myself. You have a rewinding feature. I'm not live. Not live.  Anyway, okay. I said I said I'm sorry No, no, no, no the scripture says that Uh No can come unless it is the father who draws him, right? So Upon those people who the father draws Right. He draws those people and from the people he draws Then he gives all of those who were drawn to jesus So now So scripture does not say that all who the father draws will come But does he say all that he gives will come? What does the scripture say corey? So you don't want to all all ponder ponder. That's all all that the father gives That is what did I say about the father will Come the one that draws. He's the one that draws So are you saying there's a difference between the one he draws and the one he gives? Yeah, so what I'm saying is the father draws But scripture does not say that all who the father draws will come It's he draws. Okay. Does it say that all of those jp? Wait a second You see this is you trying to trying to get out of what was he says all that the father gives me We'll did you hear what I said? Okay. Yeah leave the drawing there. Wait a second. Hold on. No, no, no, no. Why did you go to 44 jp? Why did you go to 44 because I want you to see the order of operation jp you went to 44 because you thought because other draw Okay, all the draw But the scripture doesn't say that All all will come all that the father gives Who's uh, who's talking about who he drew who's who's all people that the father drew hold on hold on Hold on say it again. Who is all people close to believe in? What who the who is all in verse 37? The all who the father drew Don't wait a second.  You you literally just say I said Who's the all you said all of the father will draw quarry. Did you not just say that? JP up quarry. I'll make sure I heard you correctly. Cory. Did you just say you didn't hear me correctly? All right, you just said all I asked you who's the all Okay, well jp. Don't don't listen.  I'm gonna I'm gonna get on the plane and fly there Jp. Okay. I'll ask you again I'll ask you again. I'm gonna ask you again Who in verse 37 is the all? From the people that the father drew So all those folks that he draws They will come right point is not all that he draws will come to the father Hmm What'd you say? You said you not all wait, hold on JP is what you're gonna do You're gonna get off this live later on you're gonna rewind this I don't know what part what this is in the one memory one hour 28 seconds. You Let me just repeat what you just said Let me repeat what you just said you just said that in verse 44 That there's nowhere where it says that those that are drawn will come I asked you in verse 37. I said that verse 37 speaking about what verse 44 is talking about I asked you who the all is correct You said the all is who those that will be drawn and it says so all the ones that are drawn will come Sure from the father gave From who the father draw do you see? All I can see is all the scripture does not say JP who the father draws will come to the father JP this ain't going this ain't listen you gonna This is gonna be on on youtube forever unless they you know just whatever but it's gonna be on youtube bro I make this argument every time and you fail this argument every time JP I didn't see you went to 44 because you're used to talking to people who don't know scripture When you talk to that young that When you talk to that 20 year old Calvinist kid that you would that that you any other guy we're going back and forth with Okay, fine, but you're gonna deal with somebody who who's about 50 Who understands the script? Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second And I and and so you immediately ran in 644. I didn't bring up verse 44. I went to 37 I said that the greatest gift is the father giving us to the son And the son's responsibility according to you is that it's his responsibility to keep us. I agree I agree the father gave a gift to the son Do you think the son Jesus is that absent mind that somebody can walk away? And then Jesus become alive because they walked away. He lied when he said no one I won't lose any of them I'ma raise every last one of them up if he raises every last one of them up and lose his none That includes the person who thinks like you that you can walk away See the arrogance is this and I'm just helping you out young brother The arrogance is that you are so good.  You won't lose your salvation But everybody else who does they can they ain't got it like that That's that that's what that's the implication of your arrogance. Have you have you ever lost your salvation? Have you ever lost your salvation? Have I ever lost my salvation? No. Yeah Because I have assurance in Christ. I made that very clear. We all have assurance in Christ I ask you have you ever lost your salvation? If I've remained in Christ, so I have not lost it. You've not lost it But other people have other people don't have what jps How no because they didn't make they didn't remain So if somebody gives it back and they choose their sin What is it about jp bottle that bottle that up what you got Bottle that up and sell it to the rest of us christians who need what you have that has kept you so thus far You're saying everybody else can lose their salvation, but but I have it We get possibly no sir, but not but so thus far in around 30 years What I'm saying Corey go ahead. Go ahead. Let's just be cordial here. I'm being cordial We're not Cordial because now you're misrepresent.  I saw your video I believe that we can lose our salvation in that manner cord I believe that if we remain in Christ, we're good. I had a very clear Corey Okay, I made it very clear if if a person lose it. Can they come back? If a person lose it if they don't apostate Which I think j5 is making it very clear that the person that leaves this this is different, right? From apostates and people who just simply wander from the city Okay, so what it what it is is what is this is this is it? Um, I'm not trying to be mean anything like that. What are you now you say that that you you You gave a disclaimer to me about how Um, you can get excited. No problem brother. Listen, I'm I'll never impugn any bad motives.  They who believe this who believe what you believe have never come to me on this on this greek text Oh, by the way, it's also in john 6 as well There's a few passages that give that exact same rule that i'm talking about There's a few passages in john 11 that gives this exact same rule all throughout the scriptures That rule is clear nothing that you can do and there's other passages god says God says the problem with you folks is speaking to israel the problem with you folks is you got this heart This bad issue what i'm gonna do. This is what jesus is relating to The passage that says nothing you can do can you show me the passage? I just read you the rule matter of fact No, no, no, no, no, no. Listen. Listen. Listen. Listen. Listen. I'm not saying there's nothing that you can do What i'm saying is you won't do those things that will cause you to lose your salvation A christian will never depart a christian will never stop believing a christian will never aposize Can you show me? Can you show me in the script? Yep? I'm about to show you the scripture. You ready? You were never Let me let me read let me read the scripture this tells you that you will never walk away that you will always Um keep what he his commandments. You ready? Now this is this is this is god speaking Not no one else. This is god speaking. You ready? Let's go to it. Ezekiel 36 G god says I Ezekiel 36 what? I'm sorry. Ezekiel 36 25. It's on the screen God says god says I notice who's the personal pronoun who's active God or if I say it in my my uh, my southern pentecostal verse voice god I will he says I will I will sprinkle clean water on you and you shall be clean from all your uncleanness And from all your idols I will cleanse you I will give you a new heart god said I will give you a new heart And a new spirit I will put within you So god is going to give us a new heart and spirits going to put a spirit in us And I will remove the heart of stone From your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. Look what he says verse 27 And I will put my spirit within you and do what I will cause you to walk in my statutes And be careful to obey my rules. So what does god just say he just said I will cause you to walk in my statue not walk away But walk in my statue. You're gonna keep them. You are going to keep them. You are going to walk in me That's why god can make the statement that that um, you will never ever ever Parish, that's why I can make that statement. Who was the audience for this? Do what who was the audience for this? It's israel right now. It's israel It's israel so the israel end up not doing this in the future Let's go and see let's let's go and see let's let's let's figure it. Let's let's see if that did happen Go to john three context and who's the audience the what? What's the context and who's the audience and are they still in this today? Yep. Let's go to it.  No, no, no, no, no, no You said keep it in context. I'm trying to give it to you He's speaking to israel he's Still like that today for he's speaking to israel He's speaking israel real still like Is it still like some some jew some jews are believers. Look what he says now. How do I know? I can I can I apply this Can I can I apply this to believers today? Hold on This is not talking about the common believer. Okay, okay fine. So if this is not okay fine Corey not okay. No, I'm not saying fine that I'm wrong. I'm saying fine. Let me prove my point Okay, who is Jesus talking about when he said apply a scripture. Why are you trying to apply a scripture?  Why would I bring up this passage? In ezekiel to talk about salvation Why hmm as though I haven't done this as though I haven't been doing this since I don't know since you were born. Let's go back and find out. Let's go to john three Jesus is having a discussion Who's he talking to? JP and john three before I continue. Who is he just having a discussion with in john three? Let me let me let me get there. Give me once Okay, john three. Who is jesus? Who is jesus talking to who's the audience? No, give me one second This is where he says this where nicotine shows up. Who's he talking to? Uh, give me one second. I have to see You haven't put on screen three you said john three. You haven't put on the screen.  Yes same thing in john three, right? He's talking to the jews about the jews same thing in in ezekiel, right? Yeah, but there are some things that are applied to nations and their Yeah, I know I know the things that you want to apply you're gonna apply, but let's see Let's see if these both apply Calm down buddy come down made a scene you just made brother you've been hyped all day today, brother You know why because i'm i'm arrived at this train And I want I want you to go all right. All right. So listen you just said you just said that According to a zeal that applies to us and weak And not lose our salvation based on However We know that when we needed zeal this was a promise But that but we if we look at israel today the nation of israel is no longer walking in them So god gave it to them, but after a while they turned away. Okay, so let's let's let's see this Why now I did it backwards. Hold on Hold on. Hold on. Hold on unless you're prepared to tell me that israel's in this condition right now Okay, who was the very first people who are the very first people and we're gonna figure this out We're gonna look at scriptures jp. Who are the very first people for the god did that too The god did what? Took out their heart of flesh and put in another heart and and poured in his spirit into their heart israel But if we read romans, but if we read romans chapter 11 and romans chapter 11, it says israel got cut off And therefore the genitals reduced. Okay, so so he so jesus is referencing Brother brother brother brother brother brother you've been done In the conversation, but I just gave you my response romans chapter 11. He says that israel Got cut off So they had this previously and they were cut off All of israel. That's what I'm trying to say all of israel Now they could be they could they could further be engraved again. That's what you're saying So all of israel's cut off uh by and large Is all of israel cut off The nation of israel so far. Yes, they're a nation that rejected god now Here's where you got you got a here's where you got to understand scripture Because what promises god has for israel he is going to carry them out He is going to have a literal filling now What he has done is he has placed a time gap as a whole a space a pause a time out if you will On dealing with israel. That's what paul is talking about in romans Okay, and so he's saying the same little arrogance that israel had Don't you be that same arrogant person? Because that would indicate that you are believing in yourself Just like they were believing in themselves and guess what you will be cut off just the same way Wait brother brother brother slow down slow down slow down slow down brother.  Say that again Say that again your your internet popped off. I I didn't hear you say it again. Can you hear me? JP hello, can you hear me? Can you hear me? Hello, oh man.   I'm just picking on you But if that's the case if what I if is what i'm saying, correct Okay, so now, uh, the reason why I did that can you hear me jp? Yes, can you hear me I can now the reason why I say that is because jesus is getting ready to introduce Salvation that he's always meant this is this is further. Um, uh indication of what's called progressive revelation Now he has spoken to them and they weren't getting it Jesus has this conversation with nicodemus now He's going to get a little bothered with nicodemus And says to nicodemus you a teacher of israel don't know this which is what jesus is about to say Or what he has says Jesus says in john 3 He says truly truly and put on the screen truly truly I say to you unless one is born again. He cannot see the kingdom of heaven Okay, no god The word that's used there is the word for born again Is the word ganete anothem? Which means to be born from above to be born of the spirit the spirit comes down and regenerates your heart That's what the word ganete anothem means. Okay, and that has it can be one of two meanings One meaning is to be born a second time Well, jesus nicks that right when he says no no no The other meaning is to be born from above from the spirit Okay, now let's keep reading and see what jesus is referring to He says nicodemus says he's confused. How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born? So jesus says truly truly I say to you unless one is born of water and spirit He cannot enter the kingdom god. Well, wait a second jesus You just said born again. Now you're saying born of water and spirit Well, because born of water and spirit is the same as being born again. Okay, it's exact same meaning Now let's continue He says, um Jesus said truly I say to you verse six that which is born of flesh is flesh That which is born of spirit is spirit now the reason why I read ezekiel earlier And normally what I do is I'll go to to this passage and then go back to ezekiel But I want to I wanted to do it this way now Notice the two elements that are used here water and spirit It's the exact two elements that are also used in ezekiel And this is why jesus gets bothered because nicodemus didn't get in it Which is understandable a lot of these Pharisees these jews Were not We're not teaching correctly. They weren't understanding. But jesus now the only reason why jesus would be bothered Without a ready quarry You hadn't responded because I hadn't said anything about it yet The only reason why someone someone will be will be bothered by this Is because only why jesus would bother this because you must have heard this taught before But you are a teacher of israel you haven't gotten this and so he says You must be born again Now he says matter of fact he says do not marvel that I said you must be born again that you must be born from above He says the wind blows where it wishes and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes So it is with everyone who is born of the spirit. So here's a question that I've gotten I got to ask you now by the way The point isn't just for you jp I need to make this abundantly clear the point isn't just for you jp You may or may not get it the point is for someone else out there who's like, okay That might make sense, right?  To be born again. I think the scripture makes it very clear Uh, want me to read the passage? No, I'm asking you the question.  You are now Uh, a new creature. Uh, I mean, how would you like me to explain? So you said to be born again is to be said it again because I you said a few different things Basically, uh, your it's it's basically Uh, let me put it to you this way It's basically your flesh right taking a, uh Hello, I'm here. I'm here. It's basically your flesh dying, but your spirit is now born So you do the things contrary to the flesh because you're born again. Yes, it's your new man essentially Okay, that is absolutely without question Not what born again means it is I just told you the greek word is ganete anothem Which is to be born above from the spirit. That's that's that's really what it means You're new man. You're new man. No, okay before person can now born again does not mean salvation I never said it I never said it was it's I didn't say you did I didn't say you did Born again, uh means to be your heart is changed first Are you a new man at that point? Well, your heart is That's for sure and then here's what happens Well, I would do a word when I was doing word games pastor. No, I just said first thing Man, whatever way you want to slice it. Well, your theory you well You can't ask me a question that's not here in the past and then ask me to answer a certain way You should have understood what I said. No, I listen you have answered in so so many different ways I cannot even attempt to try to understand what you're saying I'm asked that's why I asked you. What does born again mean? Is the person with a new heart a new man? Do what? Is the person with a new heart a new man? Eventually they will be Okay, then so what did I say born again is My words exactly you said I can't Your your words your words exactly Okay Born again means So don't try to play me like I don't know what born again means Come on. Tell us again because look at the look of the chats Even people are saying you didn't you didn't get it. So tell me again You're saying a new heart. I'm saying because of that you're a new man I said a person is giving a new heart Yeah, and they're a new man as a result. Okay, fine Now if a person is giving a new heart, they become a new man What happens is this person gives gets a new heart They then can make the decision To come to christ they then can make the decision to accept christ as salvation That's why he puts it he puts it in chronological order. He says unless Someone is born again. He cannot see the kingdom god. So before their salvation. There is this being born again That has to happen first and he hearkens back to what was said in ezekiel. He used those same two elements water and spirit Now in ezekiel he tells us god tells us with those same two elements once they're in you once the spirit is in you He says that you he will cause you he will make you cause means to make He will make you walk in his commandments That's what god said. So once he puts the spirit his spirit in you.  He's talking to jews. He's talking naked demons And what he says is he says that uh the believing ones in him shall not perish Now you and the other gentleman were talking about and you agreed with them about the day of atonement yom kippar yom kippar And you talked about what he was doing yom kippar Any jew would understand this I get it. You're not a jew and we're not back a few thousand years ago, but this is how this works if a jew Adheres to all the things that's required of yom kippar on the day of atonement And that you've got the sacrificial lamb whose blood is shed you've got the scapegoat Whereby all the sins are taken put on the scapegoat's head and cast away and mediated by a priest Who's also in right standing then you as that jew would be in right standing How long would you be in right standing? For one year you're in right standing for one year And so jesus understands so the exact same thing that's happening under the day of atonement is happening now How do i know in leviticus chapter 17?  How about that? That's what it is and I want and I want you to see this I don't Disagree with everything that you're saying man. I'm just simply not disagreeing with everything you're saying I don't want to come to this conclusion All the steps of god, we have to be born again. I believe in all of this stuff. That's not the Contention pass. No, my point is that you know my point of condition is that you don't understand what salvation is What it means to be a christian? No, you think a christian can't keep a christian can do what he wants to I'm sorry by words Well, you think a christian can do what he wants to and again I understand that we are not going to at this point in time agree on this. I do believe this I'm not convinced of that. I just kind of hope so I kind of feel this way Um, because I don't think that you're a person that likes to be wrong And what's going to happen is at some point I say, you know, you're gonna say, you know what? Since I don't like to be wrong. I think I better make sure I'm not saying anything wrong Someone said go to zikio 18 zikio 18 talks about the condition of israel whereby they are saying that they are going to be punished And so what guy does he comes with is equal 36 what the remedy to ezekiel 18? That's not real somebody else Cory look, I believe look, Cory. Look, I believe that you're genuine. Cory. Um You preach some good sermons here.  That's what you gotta do Uh, I'm I'm I'm about to get ready to go on my live on my channel Okay, a lot of guys on um on the comments section That are laughing at me and so I want these guys to come on my channel You know what I'm saying and so that I can clarify My stance because I wasn't able to fully do that here granted This wasn't a debate and you made that very clear And I found that the hard way I found out the hard way that this is not a debate Oh, yeah, this is this discussion and and what's that gonna happen? Thank you for having me on Cory. I really appreciate In five minutes in five minutes because I'm gonna I'm JP. Listen. I'm messing with you This is what I do guys if I if I see a person Oftentimes I'll just kind of try to match their style And so when you told me that that you get you know animated and excited Okay, I'm gonna give him I'm gonna give him him And so that's all no no harm meant by it. So but let me say this I I want to give you this so that you can just ponder this you're not I'm not asking you to agree on this But when God makes this statement In Leviticus he is just speaking to the people about the day of atonement And what it happens and that it covers their sin for one year and then God makes this statement Now understand the way it's set up that you could lose your salvation You can be your not I'll say it's salvation But your sins can be atoned for for one year then the following year what has happened It has to be atoned for again and again and again and again But in 17 God makes a statement where he says that I am going to supply the blood On the altar the altar that the blood that gives atonement and he uses this term I need not the team which says I myself God I'm going to supply the blood Well, how does God supply the blood? Well, if Jesus is God we believe he is then he is going to shed his blood on the cross What that does according to John 3 16? All the believing ones in him Shall never perish Oh, by the way, it is the present active participle. How pissed you on the believing ones They have entered into a state of continual belief and since they are believing Unlike under the old covenant day of atonement this new atonement. They shall never perish That's the point if Jesus can come die On the cross and a person could still perish a person can still have their sins unatoned for That was the exact same setup that he had before Jesus got on the cross And so Jesus I'm sorry You might have wasted your time by getting on the cross because folks are still acting the exact same way they did Before you pay the price And so he nailed it on the cross it is sealed and that's why he makes this statement to tell a style on the cross It has been paid for and it's complete Nothing else left to pay. I'm sorry God. I'm sorry Jesus. This is the father talking You didn't pay enough your blood was not enough Well, that's what he routine says that you might have you might not you but you may Be the one who has trampled under foot the blood of this covenant And for that reason a person might find themselves in trouble To think that God did know that you were going to come along. I was going to come along and have this issue He paid the price and paid it fully That's my whole statement brother. I listen. I appreciate you for coming on. Um, I'm a hard person to get around I know that I'm that way intentionally Um, so because there's other souls at stake that need to hear this as well. So Hey, man, I appreciate you have look bro You preach some sermons out here today, bro. I will give it to you bro.   So I appreciate you brother. Uh, Cory Cory, I'll be live on just pray and why see if you want to come over to my home court Man, listen, I'm not going to watch my own live stream after this. So, uh, I got some more I'm gonna talk to these folks in just a little bit and if anyone wants to go over there once or two Hey, man. Uh, amen. So brother, I appreciate you I appreciate you brother. Cory. I I won't go live till you finish it right out of respect No, you go ahead man. Listen. Listen. Do you they they know how to type in uh, just pray and why see just pray and why see guys So they they're good. Um, we're not gonna be live We're not gonna be long. I can promise you that and if you got your own folks that are sitting there waiting Um, don't don't make them wait because of us. So We're not gonna be long. I can promise you that I I'm hungry and I I hear I hear honey bunch in there. Uh, so my wife is home. Um, my daughter's in there. So Uh, go ahead and and and do you we'll be through in just a little bit. Okay I appreciate you. Cory. Take care. All right, brother. Take care So now guys if anyone has any a few more minutes if anyone has any questions, um, please feel free put in a cue or question before and uh hit me if you think I was wrong if you think I was too Um, too mean if I was if if I was running over him. Hey, Cory, you're not letting them talk I'm not gonna let I ask you a question and you keep going around and around around. No So there's a reason why uh, I did so but If I was wrong, I apologize. But anyway, um I'm not necessarily trying to Y'all stop it y'all stop it Anyway Oh, but this is what's funny Question Going back on the master's going going back to john 28. Can you explain what ace town? I only own means following never perish Um means they will never perish into eternity. So meaning that Um, Jesus has stated that A person when when you receive life you receive ironing that that's life or living um Zoey, I'm sorry. Zoey is life and then I only own is it either into the ages Is properly translated people say that doesn't mean eternally, but it it does Um, but it can be into the ages. In other words, you are believing when I mean you're living when you start living now Into the ages you don't stop living. That's his point and so That's what that that passage means following the uh person never the person will never perish into the ages Well, what's the next age to come into what age? Into eternity and so that's what that that that refers to in john 10 28 the latter portion. Uh, oh Was jp really wrong about being born again. I want you to do this around the One hour and 48 minutes 40 minute mark go back and look at look at what his answer was to being born again Um, and you tell me what his born right in ground right all the things that he said and they don't all match up there He was saying different things and so um I still to this moment don't really fully understood what he meant or what he said that being born again is so Sorry, uh, oh hold on Can you give my dad the gospel, please? Uh, send me an email But i'll also say it right now. This is the gospel guys.  It had to be perfect blood You and i you nor i have that perfect blood nor does any animal But he does and so he he gave his blood As payment as the bible says propitiation For our sin the sin debt was paid and because of that god used this word Justification justify which means to be declared right and treated as such and so because of that if you will trust That he did it for you and it was sufficient Key word it was sufficient the bible says because you're trusting what he's done You shall be saved now. Here's what i mean by trust and this is why i wonder if people who believe you can lose your salvation If they're saved here's why trust and i'll use i've used this example before if you say that i trust this chair I can't sit on this chair and then say i trust the chair while at the same time holding on to this desk That means i'm not trusting the chair If jesus is the chair and i'm i'm wanting to abide i'm wanting to rest in him But then i hold on to the to the table Who am i not trusting fully him? What is the table me trusting me to keep me? That means i'm not trusting him that might be a key indication that you are not saved If you think it's up to you and him you and god are not teammates you and the lord you and jesus are not teammates Let's get that clear. You are someone along for the ride Okay, he's driving is his plan That's that So that's the gospel in a nutshell and that's what faith is I heard jp made a statement I didn't get a chance to get him on to talk about it, but it stated that um um, hold on It stated that He believed that jesus was predestined. Well, wait a second. You mean god. So god the sun was predestined That didn't fit. Let's see it sucks Amen truth or talks by the way, this young brother has a youtube channel.  I mean i'm uh Speak about you Simon peter says is this Simon peter? Are you the same Simon peter? You change Y'all keep changing these these uh, uh little thumbnails on me Anyway, if it's the same Simon peter is salvation a process salvation is uh a past present and future event The bible says that we have been saved that we are saved and we are being saved and we will be saving So it's past present future meaning what? Like it not like it doesn't matter. It's not my it's not my rules. I didn't set this up But the lord tells us that we were chosen Before when according to Ephesians before the foundation of the earth Jesus just stated that in john That we don't know where this spirit goes or come who is going We don't know it's his will and so he does the choosing now Does that mean that he chooses because there's this belief that people think that If he chooses those that go to heaven that he must naturally choose those that go to hell hell No second Peter 3 9 is clear in the greek That he does not death than anyone for hell the word Uh desiring or willing is not the word willing not willing that any should perish is not the word the lao Which means that he desires no Though he's not desiring one of the parish that passage says that he has not Ordained or planted or put someone into perishing the word is bulimai Which states that he he's not putting you there. Okay He didn't have to we're on our way there on our own And he looks and sees if I don't if if I don't do anything Nobody's going to choose and he says there's none that choose He stated that okay, and so since none are going to choose How will there be anyone for him to shower his love on him to show his love? Well, that that's where he steps in Okay, and so you were saved from the beginning You are going through this salvation process now and you will experience it you will experience it in the future However, you have received eternal life according to john's matter of fact Let me read this passage guys. This is I think is really cool Whether it be in the english or the greek, but I want to put this up John 6 they're all going to that's not john 6. That's john 3 john 6 47 He says truly truly I say that whoever believes has eternal life Here's what's cool about that guys now. He says the believing one papistuan He says ecke ecke means guys that they present tense. They currently have life into the ages So according to jesus Those that believe you when you believe you currently at that moment have life or you are living Into the ages meaning you start living now forever I think that's so cool. I really do. I think that's that's absolutely amazing Uh Can seiko was come on tell seiko to send me a since I you know, I kind of get down with seiko He all right, even though even though seiko would not rock the ball head You know, he on his uh, send me send me email seiko um since seiko, uh His ball I can't ever seem to find him wearing his ball head. He wants to put a hat on um Didn't find Matter of fact, okay Playmakers in the face of me man. I see I see what's happening now your bike. Okay your bike.  Is there anyone on here?  I can't vouch for your channel. I can't say if it's if it's heresy. Don't know. Um, but Um, come on. Send me it.  Uh, romeo um Seiko baby's baby tech seiko. Tell him come on Matter of fact, I know what I'll do. I know what I'll do Um, if he's not gonna do this well, hold on guys Let's do it like this Can I just let's do it like this Okay, seiko. I am texting you the link by messenger. Oops. No, I'm not that's wrong. Hold on because you seem to be um Taking your own sweet seiko was time So let me put this over here one second guys All right, seiko. I just also just texted it to you on your uh by messenger I think it's what you call it texting or message you whatever or is it I don't know. I'm I'm about to get technical. Um Romeo and and and whoever else uh that I said come on Um rise ministry. Come on.  Um Okay, she says what is a backslatter. Let's do this.  Let's pick a passage And let's do this. Let's let's Let's go over here. What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna type in the word Backslider and let's see if this word shows up Because I want you guys to see uh where it shows up. It says the backslider in the heart will be filled Okay Uh, who we got we got seiko hold up seiko. Um, oh, uh, don't get I'm seiko do it again I hit the wrong button. I'm so sorry seiko push it again. I'm sorry I'm so sorry messed up Hit me again seiko. I don't know what I did. But anyway All right, there he is make sure I don't I don't hang you up All right, you there seiko Says you in the green room. So I'm I'm gonna bring you up in just a second So this term backslider is from the from the hebrew word suke Uh, and it just means matter of fact, let me let me pull it up over here Let me give you the actual hebrew word Uh-oh So this hebrew word right here suke. Um, it means to turn back now So that that's literally what the word Um in a nutshell means to turn back where you at seiko I can hear you where you at you out of seiko seiko was in outer space y'all he I got a black screen I'm sorry, you're right. You're right. I apologize What's happening brother? Oh, it's all right. I'm doing good. I'm doing good I'm doing good. Well Hey, so, um You handed yourself. Well, I wanted to ask that I was on jp's live Uh, when he invited me on the door a love, uh, a few weeks What do you buy me on to talk about during love? But I wanted to know Uh, how old is jp? He's 30 He's 30. Yeah So he's old enough to be outside. Yeah, my daughter's older than him. So, yeah Yeah, yeah, so I mean It's what it's I think it's one thing man for us to have spirit and dialogue and even debate But the disrespect man would just it was just clear It was just obvious it was clear. I was waiting for you to call a boy like we did, uh, uh See how smooth no Let me tell you why let me tell you why let me tell you why because as I said before Because he's younger. I can handle that. I've handled I've handled worse. He's different than sia than uh, uh, searock Yeah, and then I believe I believe he's just high spirited with good intentions. I don't think searock's move is I don't think he is I think I think I think as a as a human being and the lord loves his soul But I think he's a bad person. He just he just really is and so I got to leave him alone, but this might say well, it's core and sicko could be my granddad Yeah, we up listen we up there, but listen david the main thing is we don't look it. You know what I'm talking about But And I saw people saying that hey, you know, he shouldn't call me such and such or you know brother or or you know And I'm cool with that. I really am because you know how it is. So we were we were born at a different time, right? Where My daddy told me I better call everybody. I better call He said yeah, she said did you call him see else move? Yeah, you did call him see else move But see, you know, we were brought up that um You had to respect adults no matter who they are no matter how you disagree And I had to say yes, sir. No, sir. Yes, ma'am. No, ma'am. And I get it. That's that's different now That's different now.  We're gonna talk and we're gonna go we're gonna, you know Romeo some of you email buddy Oh, I'm tripping. I can send to you my bad. Hold on. Uh, my bad. I forgot I got his email But but uh, go go ahead. I'm sorry I don't think that was the the concern I Had was do just, you know Hey, you know, I'm one I'm one for having those barbershop style conversations But it still came off and it still appeared man where the respect wasn't given there And so I just I just wanted to give you your props and you know, your kudos on that Um, because I don't have a problem having conversations with young men but you know We we as men as older men We're gonna have to we're gonna have to teach these younger dudes, bro. Hey man, listen We've been on this terra firma a little bit longer than You guys so there needs to be a sense of a respect because even when it was talking about the core and that I understand it but bro, come on man You you know, you're another man is live you're another man's channel And uh, even when I'm I'm invited on somebody else's stuff. I don't I don't try to you know, uh Bulldoze and bull garden so like that we can have those kinds of discussion But it just I mean it just came off man. It's uh, it's a respect You know, I talk to them. I let them know that me. It's not a problem. But I mean Why why why ask you questions about about the Greek and about, you know About context about this. Well, you're not really interested in knowing and really hearing in the biblically That is really being a fool. The fool does not delight in understanding, but I want to bring it on Yeah, you know what and I will when I talk to him, you know, I'm the kind of guy And I've done this, you know with other guys, you know in the in the streets and in prison I'll give them their leash and say hey, all right now listen If we're gonna have some you know, because after a while after just because that's our first time talking We'll kind of bring it back and I really I really do believe I do believe that that he'll he'll be open to just um, you know some some brotherly correction because let's be honest when you got Uh, a few hundred and then soon to be a few thousand folks that will see you talking The one thing you don't want to do is appear to be losing or not in control or what have you know So I can I can I get that and so I'm not I'm not gonna hold that against him I'm not so you know Um that way, you know, hopefully I can I can win a brother But at the same time I want I want him to show him because you know the few times that I saw him on video You know, they they they kind of pushed back and he told me that's what he's gonna do earlier So listen, uh, this ain't my first rodeo.   You got a hat on now, don't you? All right. No, sir. I do not. Okay Okay, let me go. All right, so let me go and bring his other brother Bye, man All right, let me do Okay, brother. How you doing? Oh, what's going on Cory? Oh You all right Say it again, brother. Huh? Oh, I just said how are you? How are you today? Oh, bless and thankful, man. Hold on. If you if you wanted to come come on, brother Send me send me your email so I can so I can uh, see you the link Go ahead though. I'm sorry Okay, so I wanted to go This is for To 46 said again, which passage Luke 12 Luke 12. All right, let's go to it Luke 12 what uh, what happened? Are you there? Hello. Yeah, I have no audio, but I mean, I can hear you though. You said Luke 12. What oh, okay. There we go. Luke 12 what? Verse 42 42. All right, let's go to it And the Lord said who then is the faithful and wise manager? Whom his master will set over his household to give them their portion of food at the proper time Okay. All right. You got one of them. Um Okay, so now after having after having read that passage Uh, what I do Dog going hold on. I don't I don't yeah, it keeps kicking me off Well, no, that's not me on this one. Hold on one second. Hold on one second Okay, dog it Hold on I don't messed up my dog on thing. Hold on one second There it is. Okay. Let me lock that because what I pulled you up on that screen All right, so I read Okay your uh Your internet keeps knocking you off So, uh, I'm trying to figure out what is his his point. So what I'll do is I'll ask him Um, what he what he means by that. All right, Michael. What um So I read this passage. What does what it what do you get out of this passage? What would you want me to okay? Um Let me try to go on my google phone because it keeps kicking me out. Okay kicking out again All right. Um while you're doing that, let me see if there's any other questions No, we're not No, we're not. No, we're not Okay All right, let's try it again. All right All right, praise god, um So luke 12 I got to pull up on my phone real quick. You been reading again Yes, sir, if you can Okay, let's go to it And the lord said who then is the faithful and wise manager whom his master will set over his household To give them their portion of food at the proper time Okay, so what what do we Oh, so it's all the way to 46. So let me go ahead and finish reading. Um, it says blessed Yeah, blessed is that servant whom his lord when he comes shall find so doing First 44 says of a truth. I say unto you that he will make him ruler over all that he had Um first 45, but and if that servant stay in his heart My lord delay and shall begin to beat the inservant and millions And to eat and drink and to be drunken The lord of that servant will come in a day when he look at not for him At an hour when he is not aware and will cut him asunder And will appoint him his portion with unbelievers Um, so the first thing I wanted to ask you is the bible ever referred to An unbeliever as a servant Well, he's not calling them a servant of of god, but a servant of his of his master He's not saying that he's a servant of the lord. So So uh, he now he's using an example But so so you can use an example of a sinful person or a secular setup To give a to give a a biblical or spiritual example Okay, so In this case, I wouldn't say this that this person is that this servant is a servant of of the lord and that the master He's just using a master Okay, so my question is because the bible always refers to A servant as a believer or a christian Because if you look at verse 46, well, why do you why do you say it always refers to a servant as a believer? Okay Okay, so do you have any evidence that it doesn't okay? Let's see. Let's just type in and play play with this software a little bit And let's go up here and let's just type in the word servant Let's see. All right. Here's one a servant. He shall be of his brother speaking of uh, kanan. Well, clearly that's not um That's not a believer, right? Let's go further down into another book Uh There's a bunch of servants on here. Hold on. Hold on back up back up to where The verse that you were just talking about the very first verse Curse be kanan a servant of his of servants Yeah, but what we're talking about servants here when jesus is using parables So if can can you find where jesus is using a parable? Saying that a servant is an unbeliever. But wait, okay But you can also also say that a servant is a believer He's just using the term servant the servant is just generic right, so Look at matthew 8 13 You see it and the centurion said uh And to the centurion jesus said go let it be done for you for for you as you have believed and the servant was healed That very moment. Do we know if that servant was a believer? No, but as far as with parables concerning when jesus is speaking of The lord and servants any type of parables that i'm referring to does jesus ever refer to a servant In parables as an unbeliever. Well, how many times a servant come up in parables? I mean the word doesn't the word doesn't just change his meaning because it's a parable, right? Okay, well the the purpose of me asking the question is because Um, we're looking verse 46 and look chapter 12 It says that the lord of that servant will give him his portion With the unbelievers and we know in the greek that's apithos, which is the unlawful We know the revelation 21 8 that the portion of the unbeliever is the lake of fire So just you know looking in the beacon and we see exactly what jesus is saying here because What's what's key here is jesus says but and if that servant so in the beginning in verse 42 and 43 he says Who is that phone while steward whom his lord shall make rule over his household to give the portion Hold on second brother. Hold on Sorry about that. Yeah, but see what? What you're doing is and then I'm sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead. And then jesus says in Verse 43 he says blessed is that servant whom his lord when he come and shall find so doing And so we know that as believers if we are faithful until death we shall All right, that's as part of the inheritance that we shall receive but then um In verse 44 he says of truth I say into that he will become ruler of all that he had We see this in the parable matthew chapter 25 right the talent, but also, uh, when he separates the sheeps and the goats Verse 45 I think is really key here, bro Because the lord is saying but and if that servant so he's saying the same servant But and if that servant say in his heart So this servant made a choice and we can clearly see here that will but And if that servant the same servant that jesus says if he's faithful if he says in his heart My lord delayeth his coming and shall begin to beat the men's servants And medians and to eat and drink and and to be drunken So basically what he did was he the same servant made a choice to so to the flesh instead of the spirit Okay, you made a statement you made a statement that um When jesus speaks in parables and uses the term servant that's got to be referring to a believer Now I wouldn't do that. I wouldn't I wouldn't make I wouldn't extrapolate that to say that That's what a servant has to be but I'll give you an example of a parable that jesus is speaking and it's clear This person is not a a servant of christ He just used the term servant because that's the term that he has to use but in mark 12 one. Let's go there Mark 12 one and he began to speak to them in parables So he's speaking in parables a man planted a vineyard and put a fence around it and dug a pit for the wine press And built a tower and leased it to tenants Uh and went into another country when the season came He sent a servant to the tenants to get from them some of their vineyards. Okay now This man Again, he sent to them another servant and they struck him on on the head now Are we sending all these servants that are these all believers? Are they just servants of that person? You cannot say that because if we look at this You cannot say that because a person is a servant that he's a servant of christ He's just using example because if we don't if we think that's what it is What other word would he use if a person isn't a servant of christ? He's just a servant period Well, brother, what's the context of mark 12 because it seems like you know how when jesus is given this parable He's saying how an old testament the lord sent prophets unto the people and they would Stone the prophets they would kill them and then finally he says I will send my son They should receive him but then they don't so we we know exactly what Okay, okay, so my point is so so He's hold on. He's he's using his passage and he's using the term servant Actually what I did was I put it on one Okay I see remember but all I'm trying to hear brother is is just uh, you know get clarity on this man because you know This is very important. Um, you know praise god So I just you know want us to get clarity on this man. Praise god, okay Uh, let's see. This is when I pulled up mark. She wants to do Matthew. Uh, where's that? Hold on Okay, I thought you okay, uh Don't go on it Okay, here it is photo therefore the kingdom of heaven may be compared to the king who wishes to settle accounts with his servants Now we know one servant is is a good one ones wicked, right? When he when he began to settle settle one was brought to him who owed him 10 000 talents And since he could not pay his master's His master ordered him to be sold with his wife and children and all that he had and payment be made So the servant fell on his knees question. Is that servant? Uh, uh, a believer would you say the best servant is indicative of a christian? Well, we can say that because he has a king, right? And so he came to the king No, no, no, we see how where does he have a king at? Well, he said he came to the king because you're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right Amen But because a person so so the term that that's throwing you off is his word servant It's not throwing me off, but you're giving it but you're giving it the word more meaning than it actually means though You're giving that term more meaning than it actually means No, no brother because there's a clear distinction in luke 12 46 where the lord of that servant will give him his portion As we know for a portion, I think it's meros in in the greek He's was due or assigned to him with the unbelievers epistols Which is the unfaithful The unbelievers and so it's a clear where he says if this servant is faithful if he's obedient, right? Then he shall become ruler over all that he had so you're saying and if that servant says in his heart So this servant made a clear choice in his heart My lord delay it and I begin to beat the men's servants and the maidens And to eat and drink okay, so when he's so he says the term my lord is that my lord also See what's going to happen is words just mean what they mean, but we we can give them added meaning So if you're going to say that a servant, I think that's just that that would be That would be dangerous I'm treading to say that every time we see the word servant use or in a parable that that has Me that the person is a believer. I don't see how you would get that I just I just I think that's making it that would be you making it mean Something that the word just the word servant is what it means. It's just do-loss. It's just somebody who is Who's just working for that person that that's really all it means It doesn't mean that the person was a believer or anything like that or whatever now. He's using he's using examples that they can all relate to to make a A biblical point a kingdom point But don't take the fact that he used the word servant to mean that this person is a believer and that this person could possibly have his Salvation tossed away because he did wrong. That's that's the word just simply means a slave And so you can be a slave to anything or servant of anything. Okay, so I wouldn't That's a stretch and the thing is I now I've never heard anyone else make that stretch But I don't see I don't you can't give me a reason to say why I've got to say that that servant means a person Who was a believer and then falls away I just I'm I'm missing that and what it is is this is so obscure that Now I've got to go ahead and throw away everything else. That's not obscure To take that servant means um That servant must mean that actually I'm sorry go ahead. Can we act? Can we actually go up? More verses and when I make a statement go ahead. So we'll go to um luk 12 35 so verse for 35 But um, don't know if you ever heard of a god named simon green leaf ever him Simon green leaf Oh, yeah, he was that yeah, so he was the guy who started the harvard school of law Um, he was the one that instituted substantial evidence. So anytime we make a statement about something there has to be Um substantial evidence backing your statement Um, and so we can look different scriptures We can see parables that jesus has and that he's given And we can actually make a statement based off of evidence evidence that we have here so We can look at full context of this it says Let your loins be girded about and your light to bring And you yourselves like unto me that await for their lord So he's clearly here speaking to his disciples when he will return from the wedding that when he cometh And knocketh they may open unto him immediately Blessed are servants whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching Barely I am to you that he should be girded himself and make them sit down to meet and will come forth and serve them And if he shall come in the second watch or come in the third watch and find them So Blessed are those servants and this know that if the good man of the house had known what hour the thief would come He would have watched and I have suffered or allowed his house to be broken through Be there for ready also for the son of man cometh at an hour when you think not Then peter said unto him lord speak it out as parable unto us or even to all And then the lord said who then is the faithful and what's the word? So we know that jesus is clearly speaking to believers. He's he's uh speaking To the point you just answered it. Okay, if certain always means that then why would they ask him? Who are the faithful servants? For why so no so so no peter asked he said lord you speak it out as parable unto us or even to all So this now he doesn't specifically say exactly Uh, but you can see he said and the lord said who then is that faithful and wise steward Whom his lord shall make can ruler over his house to give them their portion of meat due season We know that unbelievers do not have any type of inheritance in the kingdom of heaven They have no part associated right second chrithian chapter six talks about what does uh light have in common with darkness, right? And so we know this is clearly here talking to christians Blessed is that servant whom his lord when he come and shall find going of truth I say unto you that he will make ruler or all that he had But if that servant so clearly we see he's saying but if that same servant the same servant who has the