Oh, welcome to the 19th Zoom session. It was hard to believe that when we started a couple of months ago that we would be like, we would have all these incredible playwrights do this. So I'm so happy you're all here. No pressure on Kirby who is our special guest today and because I hope this continues beyond me. And I just wanna say thank you to Kirby for being here. Kirby is currently in the, where are you now? Riverside, LA? I'm in PR, yeah. Theater department at UCR. Riverside, yeah. All right, well I'm a UC product from Santa Cruz. So big ups to the UCs. But I've known about Kirby for a long time. I actually read one of your earliest plays called Black Ballin. Oh, hey, and Khalif, performing in Black Ballin at UCR. No way. Yes. Cool, so I'm really happy to be here because I totally hold you in high esteem as an artist, as a Latinx writer, as a Black writer. And you have a lot of hyphenates going on. So I wanna just wanna welcome you to our casa and pull up a chair. Thank you for coming. This is pretty free flowing. So I'd love to hear what maybe a little, maybe you can introduce a little bit about yourself and then maybe just kind of dive in what you'd like to do with us and then we can go into a Q&A. How's that sound? Absolutely, very cool. First of all, thank you for doing this. As I said, when I first jumped on, this is an incredible way to stay connected to folks. I know how much it must say just thought-wise, organization-wise, to put something together like this. And then once it comes to fruition, us as theater folks, we come to a space and we're seeing a lot of little boxes. And so we have to kind of learn to accept that those little boxes represent actual human beings. I am a strong advocate of turning my cameras on. I taught a class with 84 students about theater classes at UCR, where I'm currently the chair of the theater film and digital production department. And I would always try to get them to turn their cameras on just because, you know, I feed off of that human interaction higher or far away or near it is. So that's your call. So what I'm gonna do today is I'm going to talk about writing the didactic play. I gave it a title. I titled it on writing the didactic play because when you begin something with on, on doing something, it seems more clever than it really is. But we're gonna talk about writing the didactic play because I believe that, you know, given the present state we're in, I know for us as artists, there will probably be a lot of work coming out addressing our present state. And so I'm going to use my play Dreamscape as the narrative tool for us to talk about this. And hopefully the conversation will be free flowing. Some of you have seen Dreamscape. Some of you haven't. And so what I'm gonna do is I'm going to, I always like to have a foundational point of reference whenever I teach or whenever I'm working. And so what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna give you the first four pages of Dreamscape. I'm gonna read the first four pages of Dreamscape. And then we will look at three basic things about writing a didactic play that I learned through Dreamscape and other works. So play Otis Redding just for a second. I'm dreaming of a white, it's white. Otis Redding's White Christmas gently describes the darkness. Chalk outlines of Mayesh Amil's materialized. Lights rise to reveal Mayesh is sitting in the front seat of her aunt's Nissan Center. She dances the 12 mortal moves as the music is spasmodically disrupted by 12 distortions. These are gunshots. Each one finding its target in Mayesh's body transforming her movement into a dazzling life, death dance. She lands in the front seat of the car, closes her eyes for a moment, and awakens with a jolt. Ever have one of those dreams where nothing comes out when you try to scream? She tries to scream, nothing comes out. See what I mean? One of those dreams. Christmas was three days ago. Jingle bells and ho, ho, ho. Oh, just so you know. This ain't gonna be one of them feel good shows. Just so you know. So, Christmas was three days ago. Jingle bells and ho, ho, ho. Today's December 28th, third day of Kwanzaa, Ujima. To build and maintain our community together and to make our brothers and sisters problems our problems and to solve them together. I know you didn't know. I didn't know either until uncle Darnell told me so during one of his blackouts. No, not that kind of blackout. That's just what we call it when uncle D has one of his moments and is compelled to bust you out because of your lack of blackness. You'll see what I mean. It's Ujima though. Umoja, Kujichagulia, Ujima. So me, Shine, my cousin Tony, dying to get our party on. Rolling to LA though. Tide of Club Metro. Oh, for those of you who don't know me, see I was born and raised in the IE. That's the Inland Empire, the IE. 60 miles east of the city of angels. So me, Shine, my cousin Tony, dying to get our party on. Rolling to LA though. Tide of Club Metro. Four dance floors, a hip hop reggae, rock and espanol and retro. So the center starts to rattle and pull to the right. Ah man, I cannot believe we got a flat in the middle of the night, not tonight. Okay, let me just get the fact folks. What is the deal with automobiles and my black folks? For real. And the fact that your spare is always flat, folks. For real. And do not get me talking about a working Jack folks. My black folks. So wind up at a fix at the spirit of 76 that sits on Central and Brockton. Gat in my lap, in case I get rocked on. Waiting for Shine and Tony to get back on the Triple A card, one in the morning sitting in my aunt Gwen's ride. I can't leave my Gwen's central sitting on Central. If it gets stolen, scratched, towed or broken into, soon as I see her, I'm gonna be the one getting broken into.  Well, maybe not kill. But I sure ain't gonna be riding the Central no more, feel? Ever have one of those dreams where nothing comes out when you try to scream? Tap. So I'm sitting in the Central on Central sensing something like rapping, like tapping. Like, who's that peeping in my window? Chappelle, nobody now. Who's that peeping in my window? Tap. I hear the tapping again. Oh, cool. It's Tony. Hold on, girl. Let me let you in. Where you been? I'm lonely. Got me sitting in the station in the middle of the night, one in the morning losing some patience. Something, something, just ain't right. Tap. So this is the beginning. This is the intro to Dreamscape. Dreamscape is what I call a monologue with accompaniment. And that accompaniment is a beatboxer. And so the beatboxer serves as the orchestra, as the backdrop for the rhymes that I just did. But the focus is on Myisha Mills, who is a 19-year-old black woman who is sitting in the front seat of a car where she will be shot 12 times by police officers who are called to rescue her, to help her. Her cousins had called because she was passed out. In writing Dreamscape, there were certain things that I wanted to do, that I set out to do that I thought were very helpful in working on this play. And I backed myself into the situation of having to deal with these issues. So the first thing I did was I did what I learned, I forget who said it, who told me this, but I asked, where should a play take place? You know, where should a play take place? And the answer I received was it should take place in a place that allows for the most dramatic action to occur. And so when I decided that I'm gonna write this story about this young black woman being shot to death, and I asked myself the question, where would be the place that allowed for the most dramatic action to take place? The only answer that I came up with was in the front seat of the car as she is being shot to death. So that's where I put her. And so the play begins with her in that seat and we see her rise up from the seat and she dances the entirety of the Otis Redding song that she heard. And after dancing the entirety of White Christmas, she lands back in the front seat of the car. And what we are going to experience will be 12 scenes. And each of those 12 scenes will represent one of the bullets that hit her. And each bullet will manifest itself in three ways. What that bullet did to her body physically, what memory that bullet triggered, and whether or not the coroner declares that she is dead or alive. And so this was the space, the box that I put myself in as a writer to address the theme that I wanted to address. And thematically what I wanted to talk about was the oppositional, the confrontational relationship that the black community has historically had with the police. And so that is what I wanted to say thematically. I knew what I wanted to say from the get go. The question was, how do I say it? What are the pieces that I put together in order to say it the way I wanted to say it? So the first thing was to put my character in the most dramatic space possible, front seat of the car as she's being shot. So there are a couple of things that I had to think about in writing this play. The first of those things that I want to talk about in writing a didactic play is tell me how I should feel and not what I should think. When you are working on it, when this is not prescriptive, when I'm working on a didactic play, what my goal is, is to tell the audience what they should feel, not what they should think. And so for me, taking that approach, I had to know what I wanted the audience to feel. So when I wanted them to feel the loss of a fellow human being. So in order to feel that loss, I had to let the audience feel the presence of that human being. In order for them to feel the presence, I had to construct a character or person someone that once they were gone from our lives, we would feel an absence. And so I set out to build the character of Myisha Mills. Dreamscape is based on a shooting of a young woman named Tyisha Miller in 1998. Tyisha Miller was a 19-year-old African-American young lady who, as I mentioned, was shot by the police 12 times. When I set out to write the play, I chose not to create a play about Tyisha Miller. The reason I made that choice was because I wanted to have the freedom as an artist to construct a character that I could achieve what I wanted to do thematically with. So it wasn't anything against who Tyisha Miller was. I had a goal that I thought I could achieve more powerfully by building a character with whom, through whom, I can make the points that I wanted to make. The second thing within the tell-me-don't-show-me is you should never speak the theme of your play. You should never tell the audience what it is that you want them to take away from your play. Once you do that, you have stopped me as an individual from extracting the brilliance that you put all the work into. Once you tell me, this is what you should think, then you've constrained me. You've stopped me from being able to do the thing that folks say is the most interesting thing that happens in plays for us as human beings, which are those things that we actually add to the stage. So never speak the theme. However, within the work, the theme should resonate in a way that makes it unavoidable for the audience to extract it. So there's a line in this play very early on where the character says, soon as I heard the cop siren, the first thing that popped in my mind, man, I wish I was a white girl or at least a little lighter than I am. So instead of me telling you what you should think, I haven't given you hopefully enough information so that you can go, okay, this is who the character is and this is what is running through the play thematically. So through a line like that, hopefully it addresses, hmm, I wonder if African-Americans are shot at a higher rate than others. Hmm, I wonder if there's colorism within the African-American community and the darker you are, the less acceptable you are. Hmm, I wonder if she says, I wish I was a white girl. What does that imply about quote unquote, the elevation of whiteness and how that has played a role in both recent as well as other history when it comes to that interaction. We have, you know, the most well-known incident of that is Emmett Till when he was supposedly lynched for whistling at a white woman. So this idea of embedding the themes into the work, I think is extremely important. Speaking the theme, like I said, it oftentimes, for me as an audience member, becomes kind of productive. Because once you tell me, then I don't have to do any work and I can take a nap because I'm done. Dang, that was a little harsh. That was a little too harsh. I'm not bad. Nothing's too harsh here. No, no, no, I felt it in my soul. I felt a little harshness, not that anyone.  We want to hear it all. So, um, so that was the first thing. Second thing in writing a didactic play that I learned through Dreamscape is find the beauty in your story and show it to us. Find what's beautiful in this story and show it to us. The things that I did in Dreamscape that I found beautiful and I still, every time I see the play, I have these moments of like, man, that shit's kind of dope. Is, um, one of them is there's a dance scene at the club. She goes to a club and she's dancing. And she essentially runs through like a, um, different dance moves that I grew up with in the 90s that this character would likely have done. Um, I think she ends up with doing the Humpty Hump, right? But there's this moment where she's on stage. She's dancing at the club with the girl, with her girls. And there's just beauty, happiness, loveliness, like all of those things. I think she did the Roger Rabbit. And for me, every time I see the play, I let myself be in that moment. Probably because the beatboxing is usually dope. Not usually, it's always dope. And it just transports me to a place where, where nostalgia where visually, I'm actually seeing someone do those dances. Some of you are as mature as I am. That's what I call it.  Like I would always fake it. I'd line up with my boys and they would all do it. And then I'd fake it. But every time she does that move, because that's one of the places where she was hit, I immediately go back to me at Club Metro in Riverside going out all weekend. You know, trying to get my dance on. So once again, the beauty in that moment, I think has a parted to be transcended. So the dancing at the club. I mentioned the beatboxing. If you've ever witnessed really great beatboxing in person, there are a few things more amazing that I've seen performant. It's just that skill is incredible. So the beatboxing is beautiful. And then I use comedy for beauty. So within the play itself, there are times when I'm describing the play to folks and I say, yeah, you know, it's about this young lady who was shot to death. And then I find myself saying, and there are moments that are funny. And part of it is the understanding that we don't live in kind of just these static moments in life. There are times when something tragic is happening and something funny or silly happens. And so there's a moment where when she is shot in a scalp, she's shot in the head. And the coroner says, you know, the coroner does the coroner's report. This was only a shot to the scalp, perforating this and that. And she has a little moment with the coroner where she, you know, she lets the coroner know that when you're talking about a black woman here, you never say only, like only. And then when she finishes with the coroner, this is what she says. She says, and since I'm handing out advice, let me give the men a little slice. You know me, I'm going to be nice. She says, brother should always be aware of this fact. But if you're in a brother and you like your coffee black, here's a little insight to help you with your Mac. Do not touch the hair. Perm, relax, crimp, slick, braided, dreaded or fro. Please just let the hair go. Do not grab the hair. Do not stroke the hair. Do not caress the hair. Do not clutch the hair. Do not follow the hair. Do not fiddle with the hair. Do not twiddle with the hair. Do not absentmindedly twirl the hair and not pensively seize the hair. Do not passionately grip the hair. Do not attempt to run your fingers through the hair. Do not kiss the hair.  Did I make it clear? Hands off the hair. So what. What I, what I wanted to do. In having these moments, these, these intensely tragic moments that are occurring on stage is I wanted to find those places. To let the audience breathe. I remember early on, I think when I wrote black ballin, I remember one of the comments in an earlier draft was curb, you don't let the audience breathe.  You know, you don't let the audience breathe.  Yeah, maybe not my state of. Yeah. But so, so in putting dreamscape together, I was very conscious. I was very aware of where we were as far as the set, the setting. What I was doing as far as the intensity of the moment. And I wanted to make sure that that. I wanted to take a breath so that they could sit through 70 minutes, 70 minutes of watching someone, watching their life being taken from them. So I was, I wanted to create those moments of breathing. So the third thing, so first to tell me how I should feel, not what I should think to find the beauty in your story and show it to us, you know, put beauty on stage. And then the third thing is music and spectacle are powerful. I know, huh? Like no kidding. But the reason I say that is so often when I'm working with students and they're working on, on plays, music and spectacle seem to be an afterthought. And so, especially in dealing with and writing, creating work that is, that is intense, that is intended to be didactic, that, you know, will undoubtedly have these moments of, of horrific, you know, these moments of horror. Remember music and spectacle. And the reason I wanted you to hear Otis Redding's White Christmas is because first of all, if you've never listened to Otis Redding, find the anthology and listen to the, just all of it, just all of it. I'm not saying you'll like it. I'm just saying, find the anthology and listen to it. But make sure that you're at a high level of happiness because Otis, Otis to bring you down a little bit. Otis is kind of like James Taylor. James Taylor can sing, you know, happy birthday and you'll be sad. Like damn, James. But there's a, there's a power in his voice that is just to me that is transcendent. And so when I was, you know, deciding what is the song? What's the song? You know, how do I draw the audience into the story? Well, the shooting happened on the 28th of December, and so I knew it had to be a Christmas song. I knew it had to be a song that also served the purpose of creating a narrative. So yeah, it's white Christmas. By the way, I'm from Honduras. So the whole concept of a white Christmas is like, what, what does that make? Because, you know, we had two seasons, like 85 degrees and then 75 degrees.  But I still love, I still love. So here's the thing about Zoom, just so y'all know, like my comic genius doesn't translate in the silence. Anyway, Khalif knows, he knows mine. Or maybe I'm not as funny as I think I am. So, so this is the thing. Choosing Otis Redding's White Christmas was intended to, to bring the audience in as quickly as possible. To let the audience know that this is, this is, this is very, it can be really, really a nice thing happening. It's Christmasy, there's dancing. But, but pretty quickly that there's a juxtaposition of what is happening at the beginning when she dances. And then we see and hear Otis at the very end of the play. And what we realized is that that beautiful dance that we saw her doing at the beginning was actually her death dance. That those moves were actually the 12 shots that were hitting her. So within the beauty of Otis and the movement and the dance was the actual physical narrative of the entire story. So you can actually go through the entire story and just watch your dance and see all 12 of the gunshots hit her. And once again, that's through the musicality. When it came to spectacle, you know, there were a number of things that, that happened on the stage. The one thing that I, that I thought became more spectacular as it evolved in, in rehearsal was the final scene. So in the final scene, the final moment, the beatboxer who has been sitting on stage the entire time facing backwards and at once just getting up and going to different places. He gets up and he stands up on the chair. That's back to back to her. And he stands up on the chair. She kneels down and does says now I lay me down and sleep. I pray the Lord my soul to keep. If I should die before I wake, I pray the Lord my soul to take.  And after her prayer, she begins to do this, do the dance again. While she is dancing and he is as tall as he can be. He is giving us the list of her body parts. Her right lung weighed this much. Her left lung weighed this much. Her heart weighed this much. Her right lung weighed this much. Her left lung weighed this much. Otis Redding is playing in the background.  Her left lung weighed this much. Her right lung weighed this much. And this moment of bringing all of these pieces together is damn. I can't, I can't believe I got emotional. I got emotional. There's something so powerful to me about that moment. Not because I constructed it, but because I believe it was supposed to be. And here's what I mean. That repetition of her body parts happened in rehearsal by accident. The person playing the beatboxer was trying to remember his lines. The actor was dancing. Otis was playing. And just the repetition of what ultimately this human being's existence came down to. These, these five body parts that would be weighed and notated as, you know, the final statement about their existence. And it was just, wow, it's a powerful moment. And for me in looking at how this story was constructed and being able to extract these, just these three things from, from constructing something that was written from, you know, a place of, of, of rage in some ways. I knew that if I wanted the theme to reach the audience, that I couldn't simply tell them the theme. I had to do these things in order to draw them in so that once, once the audience leaves, they're in fact, speaking the theme instead of me speaking it to them. Okay. Man. So let's talk. No, first of all, thank you for that. That was really awesome. And I'm, I'd like to encourage everyone to either raise their hand or write a question in the chat, but I, I only have one question. I do want to leave space for everyone to, to respond and to, to what you just shared, which I really, thank you for that. Thank you for sharing that. It's interesting that people consider didactic theater to be that kind of theater that is like, hit you over the head with a subject or political idea or whatever. But the way that you're describing didactic theater is definitely more, it feels more subtle and maybe it's, can you describe, can you talk a little bit about how do, how do you channel that whatever passion or rage is driving you to write this particular story into something that doesn't like you said, like flip the switch of an audience member to, you know, turn, turn themselves off to you, to whatever story you're trying to tell. Can you, can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah. And I chose didactic, you know, those of you who've been in my classes know that I am not a theatrical definition user kind of guy. But I thought didactic was a way to kind of give a sense of what I wanted to do. I think, I think we use didactic, we can use it in the same way that we use other, other tools in the theater and we can overuse it and we can misuse it. So, you know, there's dialogue. Every line of dialogue that I write, I try to make sure that it is something that serves those purposes. It's moving the plot forward, it's giving you information.   It's the, the, the term that we use for the thing doesn't dictate what that thing is. It's simply a matter of me saying, yeah, I want to write like, you know, I want to write something about this horrific thing that continues to happen. But my job, and I'm going to say this and we'll see where it goes. Years ago when I was, when I was, when I was blacker, somebody, somebody, somebody, somebody was going to say, oh, when you're talking about how to deliver a message, it's not, it's like music. I grew up in a black church, listen to gospel. And you can have a song that hits the same note over and over again, and it just hits that same note over and over again. And then you can have a song that just takes you on a journey. There's a song I want to recommend to you is by B.B. Wine is called This Song. It's like the most amazingly constructed song ever, but it is called The Journey. And it's the same thing with, with, I think with playwriting. We have to be conscious and cognizant of what we're using, how we're using those things to get to where we want to go. It's not a matter of eliminating, it's not a matter of saying, well, I'm calling this, for instance, a hip hop theater piece, but I can't use country music in it.  Well, and Jennings has like a dope sample that I can use. I'll be dropping wailing Jen. So it's how we use the things. It's not just being constrained by, by those definitions. So yeah, I, that's, yeah. All right. All right. Thank you. Beautiful. I don't see any raised hands yet. I'm more than welcome, but I do see something in the chat. I think actually the question is, is the script published? Is there a way to see the script or a recording? Yes. The script is published in two anthologies. It is the Encuentros anthology. Yeah, I was looking for mine. And then it is also published in Daniel Banks's Say Word anthology. Yes. So Dreamscape is an Encuentro anthology and this Say Word. Amazing. And the next one I'm seeing is at what part of the writing process is the Beatbox Incorporated? Ah, so this was, um, when I initially wrote Dreamscape, it was intended to be a DJ accompanying the actor. Um, and I did a few performances with the DJ and part of it was because in the research, I found out that the DJs where the DJ keeps their turntables, that's called a coffin. Um, which I didn't know growing up in hip hop all these years. So I thought that was apropos to have the character exist in that space. Um, but what I wanted the DJ to do was so incredibly difficult and cumbersome that eventually, and I believe it was Daniel Banks who made the suggestion that I think about using a beatboxer. And so I had known a beatboxer for probably five years prior to bringing him into the process. His name is John Merchant. And once I brought him into the process, it also allowed me to have another body on stage without anything else. So this play takes place with two chairs and two mics. That's all we need. Um, and the beatboxer gave me more flexibility to make changes because he was so good that I could say, you know what dude, I think I wanted to sample can you try that one? With a DJ, it would have been a little bit more complex. Khalif, answer me the question. Oh, hang on. We got one from Marilo and then we got. Yeah, we'll jump to Khalif. Hi, my name is Marilo Nunez. I'm from Canada actually. And I arrived late. So I'm sorry if I'm repeating myself by asking this question. Um, when at what age did you decide that you wanted to become a play right? And who are your, do you have any Latinx influences that have inspired you as a writer? Oh, wow. Okay. At what age? I was about 23 or 24. I was at the University of California Riverside. It was Martin Luther King Day. I wanted to do a play that spoke to me and my generation that I wanted to write a play. So I wrote a play. It was a 10 minute play called Children of the King backstage that night.  The next year I wrote another play from Martin Luther King Day. The next year I wrote another play. Um, and that's when I, that's how I started writing. Um, influences. Uh, they're, they're more direct folks like, um, who's my mentor, um, she, she, uh, I think it is still at UCLA. Um, Carlos Morton, uh, who forced me to do my first rewrite because I believed in amuse and I didn't believe in rewriting because I believe the message came to me directly to my mind. And if I rewrote it, I would anger the muse.  Rewrite the play and give me a clearly defined protagonist, please. Um, so, uh, you know, I think there's, there's a lot of people who had very direct influence on my work. You know, of course, um, by this, um, I, at one point I had planned on getting a U-Haul truck, cutting the size of it out and taking my work on the road the way he did with Teatro. Um, hell, I might still do that. We'll see. But, but, but yeah, those, those are some of the folks that, uh, you know, Maria Elena Pones, um, I mean, I can, you know, a lot of the, the, the Star Wars, um, and, and, and in the space have influenced me and my work. Um, when I saw, when I saw, like probably a lot of us, when I saw, um, uh, I don't know why I want to say, but you go, it's not about you go.  So I'm 55. This happens for those of you who aren't 55. It's coming for you. Um, Joanne, what's the name of the play? Um, which play? I was so influenced by zoot suit. I couldn't remember the name. Um, but when I, when I saw, when I saw zoot, I, I believe it was the first play that I saw with a, with a narrator with who, who, who then became embedded in the, in the stories like, oh damn, I can do that. And so, um, yes. Thank you. Awesome. All right, Kelly, what you got for us? Um, I was just wondering, have you seen dreamscape yet produce where you weren't in the room, you or Fawze? And how does that, what does it look like since like he's just so ingrained in it at this point? Yeah, I've, I've seen on video, um, a high school in Milwaukee did a version of it with, with a, um, female DJs. Um, and it was so cool to see it. Done without me present. Um, I am, I'm hoping to, to, to see the work done independent of myself more, uh, to see what, what that reaction is. But yeah, I'm, uh, I'm nervous, but I'm excited because I do believe that there are folks who will bring like amazing things to the work that I can't bring as a director. I always tell people, you know, I perpetrate, I'm a playwright who perpetrates as a director. I direct my own stuff, but that's, that's as far as I can perpetrate that's, that's as far as I can perpetrate, but yes, I'm surprised, surprised Joanne Yadrow hasn't done it yet. Okay. Okay. Careful. Because do you know Chesney Snow? No. Okay, you got to look him up because he's in Syracuse next year and he's my beatboxer. So there you go. See, this is how this is our project. Thank you.  You throw that at me. I know, I know what I was doing. Any other questions or, I mean, I can talk to you. Yeah, we got something from Alexis. Yes. Hi. Um, I've been finding as a playwright, there are a lot of stories like you have said that need to be told. We have to tell. And even, you know, the good, the bad and the ugly, this isn't a feel good story. Do you think that there is a balance that can be found between telling these really honest stories and also uplifting them to have that also didactic feel? Yes. And every time I, so I didn't grow up on musicals.  And then every time I go to one, I'm like, damn, I get it. Like I went, years ago, I went to Oregon Shakespeare Festival and, you know, I'm black. And so they said, Harry, okay, you're going to get three tickets to go see Music Man.  And I walked into Music Man black and they, oh, they said this, you're going to come out singing the song, the 70, hire many trombones that were leading, right? And I'm like, whatever. Oh my God.  And I'm blown away by those things that I was talking about, the beauty, the musicality, the human, the thing that, whatever that thing is that makes us our human thing, do that human thing.  And so I say that to say, we can find those places where we can still address things. They don't always have to be this intense. I've done plays, I did a performance called Uncovered, where we took the, the idea of the pageant of the masters of recreating, using tabloids and took hip hop. So we created hip hop album covers. So we did Run Dem, CLL, Kuze, Biggie and Tupac, Wu-Tang Clan. And it was just, it was all movement and DJing, but the narrative, the underlying narrative of what hip hop is and what those album covers represented and having Biggie and Tupac facing off with each other just by movement. Still had a powerful narrative, but it, it was just so dope cause we ended it with, with doing a stop and pepper push it. So everybody got to dance. So, you know, we can do it. Thank you. Very cool. All right, we got Gina. You are unmuted. Hi. I just had a quick question. I'm sorry, I was a little late. So I'm sorry if this was already addressed, but I'm representing Costa Rica here. I'm curious if Honduras has inspired your work in one way or another and if it shows up, if there's a cultural influence there. Yes. Absolutely. So Hondureño, right?  But okay, real quick. My student Esther, Esther, is also Hondurania. Calif, tiene un poquito de semi British Honduranos from Belize, his family. I'm just calling people out, but here's the thing. I grew up, I was born in Honduras. I grew up, so I was 13 years old. The Bay Islands at first and then Puerto Cortez, which is on the mainland. And I didn't realize this until I realized it. And here's what I realized. We have a thing in Puerto Cortez called La Feria Agostina.  And one year there was a man called El Hombre de Mil Bosses. And he was a storyteller. And he was on a stage making sounds with a microphone. And I remember even at 9, 10, 11 years old, sitting there watching his performance and just staying at the steps while my friends went to play everything else waiting for him to perform again. And this isn't something that I even thought about when I started writing plays, but I realized that that influence, that power of storytelling had gotten hold of me at that age. My formative years of storytelling and of being aware of the stage actually came in church where the performance was reciting memory verses and performing from Mother's Day. But those things, I realized once I came to this country, I would refer back to them. I wrote a play called Birthmark. And Birthmark is a play that takes place, the first half takes place in Honduras, the first half takes place in the U.S. And it's about a young man whose family moves to the U.S. after his father drowns on a merchant ship. And it's my way of talking about the duality of my existence. I was gonna say triality, but that's not a word until we say it over and over again then it becomes a word. But looking the way I look, speaking English, speaking Spanish, moving to the U.S. to LA, looking the way I look, speaking with an accent, having two pairs of parents in three shirts and the two pairs of parents with polyester pants. Anyway, looking how I look, speaking and just what that did for me once again was it forced me to step out of myself and learn how to speak English. So I learned how to say one, two, three instead of one, two, three. Right. So I had to step out of myself and I think that's where I started to observe both myself and others that allowed me then to put myself out of myself. So I went back to Honduras in 2016 on a Fulbright fellowship and we did, I did a translation of Dreamscape to Spanish. So there's a Spanish translation of Dreamscape that we actually did performances at the Una, the University, Universidad Nacional Autónoma. Dang, when you don't say, you lose it. In Tegucigalpa and we toured it to a few other places and went to Las Ruinas de Copán. We went to a couple of other places and did a bilingual version of Dreamscape with an actor from Honduras. She was a student at the university there. That's really inspiring and something that I hope I can do with my career in the future as well. Is there a way to find birthmark? Is it available somewhere? Birthmark is, no, but I will send it to you. Thank you. Can I send you an email? So we did it at UCR two years ago and I actually did a condensed version of it. So I did just a second act, but it's a two act play and the first act, like I said, is I'll take this to Honduras. So I'll send you the entire play. Thank you. That would be wonderful. Absolutely. I'm from Nicaragua, actually. And I've been to the Bay Islands in Honduras. I think it's gorgeous. Such a gorgeous place. And I had a question, but now that you said that there is a Spanish version on Dreamscape, I hope you do share with us how we can get to read it because I don't know. And just so everyone knows, Tlaloc has my information. So if you forget, and I'm at the University of California. I just posted a link to your faculty page. Okay. Yeah. And I would love for you to have the word. What did you have a question? Yes, I do. I have actually two questions. The first one is, so if I hope it's coherent, you say that you No, I can't speak Spanish, but I can't speak Spanish. I'll do it in English just for the benefit of everybody, so here's the question. Yes. When you were writing Dreamscape, you, there was, it was inspired by the murder of Tisha Miller. Yes. Created a character. Yes.  And I was wondering if you could maybe just allow a little bit more for us. You know, kind of like what are like, like the pearls or the, the, the dangers that we should watch for when we're constructing a character that is actually somewhat based in reality. So make sure that it's not diluted. That was the first question. The second question, since you said it, how did you find that the word change when it was translated in Spanish? Because I think languages have, there's so much power and the musicality is different. And in this case, being a play that is music. Yeah, I would love to know about more about that. Okay. So, so, so, so number one, in creating the character based on Tisha Miller, there it was, there've been a couple of things, a couple of questions that folks have said, you know, to have asked what, why didn't, you know, why didn't you build, create the character that was her? What does the family think of the play? You know, and there is the danger of creating a character that's so close to someone who actually existed. The first thing I do, the first thing I did is I made it a point not to learn anything about Tisha Miller that I didn't already know. So my character was a softball player. And she was, you know, she was going to, could have gotten a scholarship to play softball. The reason she was a softball player is because her arm was shot and I needed her to swing her arm and let us know that I'm not going to be able to be a softball player anymore because of what's been done to me. My character, you know, you know, had, she, she had, I can't think of one for some reason, she had other characteristics that serve the purpose of the narrative. And so for me, constructing the character was in a way to honor, but not to replicate. The danger that we run into if we're creating a character that is intended to be possibly an antagonist based on someone else, then, you know, people may have more to say about that character. When Tisha Miller's grandmother saw the play, the thing that blew me away that she said to someone else was, she didn't realize, she had never thought about how many bullets actually hit her. What the play did, which is what I think has caused the George Floyd video to do what it did, is it actually slowed down time? When I wrote Dreamscape, I wanted to slow down time. And instead of the 45 seconds it took to shoot her 12 times. It took me about an hour and 10 minutes to be in that space with her. And so that may not be a great answer on the dangers of, of creating a character, but this is going to, it's going to be a cliche because sometimes cliches exist for reason. If you build a character with love, not build a loving character, but if you build a character with love, the thing that you construct will almost inevitably be powerful. And so when I built this character, you know, every time she dies on stage, I feel that loss. Every time, every time. Sorry. The other question is the translation. So Spanish is such a beautiful language. And English is a beautiful language. And so I've always grown up speaking both. And in working on a translation, because my Spanish, my knowledge of Spanish ends at the fifth grade. So I needed someone to actually help work on a translation with me. So Esther, who's sitting right there, actually did the translation. And then when I went to Honduras and we worked on it, the actress who played the role as well as some other colleagues that I met helped me with some of the nuances. They would say things like, no, you would never say, you would never say that. So for instance in Honduras, we don't say, to, we say, right? So if you say, how are you? And you, what are you going to do? You're going to do it, right? So that's one of the subtleties that strengthen the authenticity of the work. And once again, gives ownership, gives the audience that ownership that this is, this is mine and I can do with it what I need to do with it for myself. Thank you. Okay. I think we have, do we have a little more time with you, Kirby? I'm here. All right. I saw one more in the chat. Okay. Joanne, did you want to ask your question? Sure. I'm not going to go back. Just in terms of you working with, with writers, specifically those who are writing like solo shows very much like Dreamscape, how do you help them frame their work? What are some of the things that you help other writers who are kind of muscling through this when you see, you know, and every writer is different, but what are some of the things that are kind of standard that you're like, think about this, think about that specifically in solo work. Yes. Yes. So the first thing I ask a writer who's working on a solo piece is who's the character talking to? And here's the wrong answer. The audience. Your character in a solo show is never talking to the audience unless your character is talking to the audience. So in Dreamscape, the thing that I learned first was who is she talking to? And who she's talking to is the coroner. She's saying to the coroner, listen, dude, please do not declare me dead because look, I can dance. Please don't declare me dead because look, I might want to go to college. Please don't. So if she's talking to the coroner, there's intent behind everything she says. If she's talking to the audience, she's just saying to the audience, here's the theme of the show and agree with the theme because you should. Don't ever tell me I should agree with something because I should in a theater. You tell me what the story is and I'll let you know if I agree with it. So you have to know who you're talking to. And in the beginning of the show, when you're doing a solo performance, remember that there's a willpower, willpower. If you've never seen him, you probably never get to see the gathering.  So even if you're on stage by yourself, remember that there's a world that you are building or that you have built. And you're saying to me, hey dude, hey, come check this out for like an hour and a half. I want you to come be in this world that I'm building. And here's the thing. This is gonna sound a little more morbid than I want it to be. We all get the same amount of time in a day. I am, Joanne, becoming a little bit more mature in my age, I was gonna cut my beard, but it's like two what in? I have a certain amount of time that I'm given.  Then you need to put in the work to get my time. The way I approach every play that I write is that I'm asking you to give me some of your life. And I have to earn that. And if you don't approach it the same way, then don't ask me to come sit in a dark room for two hours.  That's just, I have those. And then just, let me say the other thing. There's no such thing as throwaway dialogue in a script. There's no such thing as chatter. There's no such thing as, ooh, I've always wanted to write this line of dialogue. Ooh, I've always thought this was a cool phrase.  Is it moving the plot forward? Is it keeping me interested? Is it giving me information that I need? And is it beautiful? And if it's not, you need to do a rewrite like Carlos Morton told me. There's a few more questions I think. I'm here. We got one from Linda. Hi, I just wanted to know what was it like getting into the mind of a female, young female character and what kind of process things that you have to do in order to go there? Yes, oh, thank you, thank you. One of the best compliments that I've gotten as a writer is when I've had people meet me and they say, we thought you were a woman. It's because you should. I did my research. So I'll always begin by saying, I've never been a 19-year-old black girl, but I've met and was turned down on days by a lot of them. And what I learned through that process to be observant.  And the research did not entail, hey, tell me what it was like. My research entailed talking to another human being and just talking to them and absorbing, right? Our job as artists is to absorb, I believe, that what we do, especially as playwrights, is we absorb the spirit of other folks. And then it's our job to take what we've absorbed and put it on stage so that the audience can then get some of the beauty and some of the things that we got from those folks. So it was talking to folks. It was also going back and thinking about conversations I had with, don't touch the hair. Like, Curb, what are you doing? All of these moments that were, I've been to the club when three young ladies come to the club and I'm like, yeah, I'm dancing with you. And then I realized, wait, I'm just a prop because they have a whole routine. And I'm just like, I'm just here. And I try to move up and she's like, she walks me back but when she does it, it's really cool because I feel like, oh, she's pushing me. She's touching like, nah, she's not. I'm just moving you out the way so I can get back to the moves, right? So all of these moments that I lived, I tried to find how those moments would become narrative tools to speak to my ultimate theme and to make you feel that, damn, why is she not here? Well, thank you very much. I think that I'm looking forward to reading that script. Thank you very much. Thank you. I want to take these questions in the chat really quickly, directing your own work. How important is it to you? I have found a couple of directors who, it's not important for me to direct my own work but because I haven't found a fellow director or who lives near me, I work with Joanne, I work with Timothy Douglas, I work with Daniel Banks. But my work oftentimes has such specificity and such nuances that in trying to translate those, being on the radio, giving Los Angeles, who grew up on hip hop, but also grew up on gospel. And when I did birthmark, I had to have those conversations, but what I found is it's easier for me to try to put on the stage what I envisioned I had in my mind and to see if it actually works. I love directors and I wish I had more of them near me that I could work with because what they've done for my work has been exponentially more brilliant than what I've done for the work. But I still feel like it's not mandatory for me to direct a work, but there are things in my mind, even it's so funny because I was reading through Dreamscape and I was looking at the one in Quintra and I'm like, ooh, I need to take this stage direction out. So just so you know, I'm gonna be sending a rewrite and for the Quintra. But there are things that I have to do to see if what's in my mind will work on a stage. I asked that mostly because of how detailed your image of the last moment was and the discovery of that. And is that in the script as a full moment that this person stands on and you have to see this relationship? And yes, so I did what I learned, before when I started writing, I thought the playwright was brilliant and wrote all these amazing, what I discovered, the reality is, it's the ensemble, it's the directors. It's that thing that happens in a room that then we playwrights get and we just translate it onto the page and we seem like we're like geniuses. But that moment, what I describe, I've put it on the page as closely as I think I can to what the intention is. And that's our job. It's not to direct on a page. And that's their nose, like don't direct on a page. Don't tell an actor they're tapping their head nervously. No, just let them know that they're nervous. Let them decide what they do when they're nervous. They may pinch their nose, but you put as much of this on a page and I think it translates. Thank you. Yeah, don't listen to teachers that tell you to direct on the page. It's terrible. You get actor proof. I'm seeing one more in the chat. Do you ever teach or offer workshops that training artists can access that aren't at UCR? No, I'm kidding. I haven't done workshops in a while. Essentially, the workshops that I had been doing had been when people bring my play to their campuses. The last one I did was the University of Michigan. C.C. Costas brought me there and we did the performance and then I did a hip hop theater workshop. I'm so privileged to be able to do what I do for a living. When I was asked to do this, I thought I was all nervous, like damn, like what am I gonna say to people? But I love doing workshops. I love, and this is essentially, it would be this, except more. So there's no magic behind, it's just this and more of this. But absolutely, I love just kind of sharing this. And once again, my background is not theatrical. But once I knew this is what I was gonna do, then I tried to absorb as much from folks. I remember Paula Vogue came when I was in grad school and I sat there and I'm going, oh my goodness, you mean I can change the font in my script so it matches the tone of the story? Like why the hell wasn't I told this earlier on? Anyway. That's so cool. And I just wrote on the chat that you're available for hire.  I just wanna thank you again for this opportunity. The isolation has been interesting for me and I haven't had this kind of exchange with colleagues and with new colleagues and students here. It's just like, dang, that just was so uplifting. I'm just, I'm hyped.  So let's set up a time to do that. But no, I really appreciate you having you being here and for saying yes to doing this because I think you've inspired a lot of folks today and thank you. Thank you all so much. And I'm welcome. Just call me. Thank you. All right. Thank you, everyone. And you know, you can buy the Encuentro where Dreamscape is published and look up Kirby at- I'm looking to tour Dreamscape too. Just so- Oh, great. I'm looking to tour, you know, where the cast is ready, we can tour it as a cast or we can do it as a, you know, as our own production. If you don't have a dope beatboxer, we actually have a recording of all the samples and the play itself. Oh, that's cool. I know, huh? Exactly. Please get on your J-O-B. I'm telling you- All right. All right. Okay, we're gonna say farewell and this is not the last Super Friends, I hope, but we're gonna take a big long break and during this break, I expect all of you to write a play. So do it for me, do it for Thea. Yeah, some good plays. Yeah, you guys, this has been great. It's been inspirational. So thank you all for doing, being a part of this. You will not, this is not the last you will hear from us. Thea, do you have anything to say? Consider this a season finale. We will be back after a brief hiatus. We'll hang out on Facebook in the meantime and I can't wait to see you all soon. That's right. Thank you, Thea, for everything. Thank you, Hal-Round. Thank you. Thank you for the rights. Thank you all for your candor, your, for sharing your inner thoughts and your hearts to us. And I will see you later. There's no, I don't believe in goodbyes. So anyway, gracias Kirby once again and hasta la pasta, baby. Hasta.


What's up guys and welcome to trendy updates upon SPM birth. Now on to the trending news today is the Supreme Court which has ruled that there is no equal sharing of property after divorce. I'm telling you ni story ambayi meza kufanyi kaleo bina January 27th on a Friday. Napade the court has ruled that each partner is going to be living with what they came with. Kwaevo story lia kugawa niya mali nusunusun, it is over and done with.  Na ika se mekana that this ruling is going to act as a guideline when it comes to property sharing between divorces. Sidui kama iini story ambama iski ya na piya sidui wuna se maji e. Wajokun oto amba uli kuwana ingia in marriage just to get a property and to become wealthy. Na iu ni kuma nisha e their dreams are ending today. Na iu ni se mekana e akwa amba the courts had been struggling on this question on whether spouses should split their matrimonio property. Lakin ni sasa they have come to an agreement that there is not going to be happening and kila mtotakwana endana mali yaki ali oku janaio. I'm going to be going through the comments. Kwa sababu ei wana wana kawami fraia wana wake kidogo sidui. What has been going on when it comes to wealth sharing. Na wana tumbilipale na sema na wana watu wakitoka na sleepers peke. Jambia watu vizuri. Alafu klikeri na sema hi she ria tu sasa divorce cases zita ja karibu kenya. Then this tantosh na sema very happy with this. This Jay na sema ye wale wa wababa nikunoma. Me sema they were going there to become wealthy. Alafu kuna Mike Spence na sema the judiciary arm is overworking. Aia ba singyuguna na sema the only thing going right in Kenya. Aia na din Nairobi kid na sema half half achia wa zungu. Clearly this is something that has been received with so much positivity. Especially looking at the boy child. Nikama ili rule yakugawana 50-50 ili kweeme wa umiza. It looks like that is a moment of relief. I don't know what are your thoughts on this conversation. Lakinipia kumbuka kuna storya pre nap which is a document that is signed by two married people. Na india kweena determine what is going to be the equal share or rather what is going to be the percentage of sharing wealth in case of a divorce. That is a prenup. Lakinipia nikitomba inaiza kule tanga trust issues. Wakati one of the partners introduces a prenup in a marriage. Kwaivo nikwanya shana issue. Supreme Court umiza kule taleo. Labda ita isa kusidea because you go home with what you came with. Let us know down on the comments section what are your thoughts about this decision by the Supreme Court. But in the meantime, keep it trendy updates, hapa SPM buzz.


Let's open our Bibles together to 1st Thessalonians. We're in chapter 5. We're continuing our series and Moving towards a conclusion today. We're going to look at verses 12 through 14 As you open up your Bibles and get settled in for the study I'd remind you that as mentioned we do have our baptism tonight and I invite you to be part of it. We're going to have an evening service. It begins at five o'clock I'll be sharing some things related to baptism, but I am giving you an actual study There will be a study not simply a few words about baptism. There'll be a study worship and a study then we're going to go out to the pool and We'll be performing the baptism You will notice that some will be kept under the water a lot longer than others that's because I know them and Some may not make it out and so that'll So tonight we'll have our baptism on Wednesday We pick up and continue our series in the book of Proverbs will be looking I believe at chapter 29 this upcoming Wednesday night invite you to be with us and Fellows we do have our men's breakfast next Saturday We have a combined men's breakfast meaning that we'll be joining with some of the men from Calvary Chapel upland as well as Calvary Chapel Ontario Randy walls from upland and my Curcioli from from Ontario both were assistants to me here and Went out and planted their churches both of them planting their churches over 20 years ago And so I thought it would be nice to get two of the fellas together have a breakfast with some of their men and our men combined and Have Three three teachings we should be concluded before noon or around noon And so I invite you to be part of that and if you're going to have the breakfast We need you to purchase your breakfast tickets before you leave because we have to make our order tomorrow And they need a count and so if you plan on being with us and having breakfast with us Which is a good breakfast then I invite you to go and buy your breakfast before you leave so that we can Order the amount of breakfast tomorrow, and it'll all be prepared So today we're in 1st, Thessalonians 5 We're gonna look at verses 12 through 14 as we continue our series And I wanted to kind of pose the question and and somewhat answer the question What is a church because I believe that there's a need today in our society to once again understand what a church actually is and Paul is giving to us some insight in into what a church is here in these verses And so let's read verses 12 through 14 and we'll get into our study this morning 1st Thessalonians chapter 5 verses 12 through 14 Paul writes we urge you brethren to recognize those who labor among you and are over you in the Lord and Admonish you and To esteem them very highly in love for their works sake Be at peace among yourselves Now we exhort you brethren warn those who are unruly Comfort the faint-hearted uphold the weak Be patient with all Now I want to develop something for you here We're gonna develop a foundation a context because we need a context to view these scriptures through We need to have a foundation that we can apply to this so that we we understand what Paul is saying and how that pertains to the church There in Thessalonica you see what he's doing here in verses 12 Following is actually closing with instructions concerning what has been called life in the church and The instructions are intended to encourage this church to be strengthened especially in their community Now in our day, this is something that is very important for us to remember It's important to remember that the church is a community a community of like-minded believers We need to remember that church is not simply a location and certainly not simply a building And that's something that I think that many have forgotten today As I survey the church, I see that that many Believers aren't even settled into what they would call their home fellowship There are those who refer to multiple places as their home But they're their home church for certain days or certain nights for example if you say what is your home church?  That's new something. That's different. It's a mindset that you actually see Portrayed by the Athenians out there in the book of Acts in chapter 17 verse 21 It was a mindset of certain Athenian philosophers It says in Acts 17 21 all the Athenians and the foreigners who were there Spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell or to hear some new thing And that's kind of like what's happening right now in the church They're looking for some new thing. There are those who question whether it's necessary or even possible to have what would be called a home church Others wonder if it's even necessary to attend church services at all You see the thought of going to church services isn't part of their spiritual quest And they ask the question do we have to go to church in order to be saved? Well, let me answer that quickly the answer to that obviously is no Church membership is not the same as being a Christian There are many believers who desire to be in a church service, but they can't attend There are those who are in isolated locations. Perhaps they're in the military. They're on a mission. They're incarcerated They're incapable of actually leaving and attending church service with other believers There are others who are dealing with conditions that make it difficult for them to be around people They watch online and by the way, there are some right now watching online and we welcome you We love you and we would love to have you with us, but we understand that this is no judgment on you There are those who are physically ill They're unable to attend, but they would if they could There are cancer patients Who can't be around people because of their treatment who would love to be here, but they can't There are those with other kinds of physical illnesses. They do watch online my mom broke her back and Never got out of the bed that she was She was on for the last year of her life and I have a picture of my mom It's one of my favorite pictures of her and she's in her bed and she's got a little stand next to her and she has her Computer and she was watching church services online And she's got a little hand up because my mom was one of these energetic types Would just pump her fist and and I could almost hear her She's watching me as I'm teaching and my sister took a picture of my mom with her hand up and me on the screen And I could almost hear my mom saying shut up David. I don't want to hear that I could almost hear it But my mom would have loved to have been in church services had she been able to she would have attended So when it's possible to be part of a local group of believers, that is something that you should do It's where it is made possible for you to use your spiritual gifts to pray to serve to have fellowship to be accountable To receive communion to receive baptism It's a community the church is a family interestingly enough the church The word church never speaks in the scriptures of a building It doesn't speak of a special place that people would meet The word church in the greek is ecclesia It's used around 49 times in the new testament The word ecclesia literally means the called out ones It would be speaking of a congregation It would be speaking of an assembly and very often would refer to a synagogue And so the church is really called Is really spoken of as the called out ones the ecclesia In first peter chapter 2 verse 9 the apostle tells us what we're called out of Because if you're called out Ones you must be called out of something and so in first peter 2 verse 9 He says you are a chosen generation A royal priesthood a holy nation his own special people That you may proclaim the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light So we have been taken out of spiritual darkness and translated into the kingdom of god's son When you read your bible theologically the word church can be used in various ways The word church refers to all believers who have ever lived and those who are now in heaven And in that capacity that would be referred to in systematic theology as the church triumphant You also have what is referred to as the church universal The church universal speaks of all genuine believers throughout the world Paul refers to it in this way in 1 Corinthians 12 when he says in verses 12 through 14 The human body has many parts, but the many parts make up only one body So it is with the body of christ Some of us are jews some are gentiles Some are slaves some are free But we have all been baptized into christ's body by one spirit And we have all received the same spirit. Yes, the body has many different parts not just one part It's the church universal people throughout the world made up of many parts It's also called the church militant It's referred to as the church militant because we engage in spiritual warfare There used to be well-known hymns that were sung in the church About being god soldiers god's army And and that's because it was a recognition that we're engaged in warfare spiritual warfare We fight against sin the world system. We wage warfare against the devil In 1 Peter 5 8 and 9 the apostle said be self controlled and alert Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour resist him Standing firm in the faith because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same Kind of sufferings you're talking about spiritual warfare and the enemies on the prowl to destroy You also have what is called the church visible Which refers to a visible community? It speaks of members of churches often attending and serving in a church But in the church visible not everyone is a believer Though people may think that they are in services just like this and throughout the world There are people who are There amongst the congregation that then that's what it's referred to as the church visible But then you have what is called the church invisible And the church invisible is the genuine believers They were the ones they are the ones who are in the church visible, but are known by god as genuine Like it says in 2 Timothy 2 19 the lord knows those who are his Or what jesus said in john 10 14. I'm the good shepherd. I know my sheep and am known by my own You know before I was a christian. I did go to church. I sat in church services I wasn't a christian. I would have been looked at theologically as being part of the church visible But those around me who were believers in christ known to god as his who follow jesus They are the church invisible and so you see that the church is spoken of in a variety of ways throughout scripture So in the new testament the church the word church can also be used to refer to believers who meet in a certain location and that is referring to what is called the church local Now I said church local on purpose. It's actually the local church But I was afraid I'd say the local church in in salt a bunch of locals But the local church or the church local you see it in in scripture acts 11 22 Speaks of the church in jerusalem If you read the book of romans or first and second carinthians the book of galatians Ephesians philippians or colossians You look at first and second thessalonians first timothy philemon Hebrews james third john the book of revelation. They all mention that the church was meeting in certain cities or locations The church of corrent the church of rom the church of Ephesus or philipi Well the church Can meet in local areas But the question what is a church is important in order to understand what paul is saying A church is made up of believers in jesus christ Been born again Who regularly meet to worship god through jesus the church is a community That will proclaim jesus christ as lord and savior The church worships jesus sings praise to him gives thanks to him The church are those who are taught god's word through devotions as well as in studies and services The church celebrates baptism and celebrates communion together The church recognizes the need of and respect the role of spiritual leaders in the fellowship And the church serves one another financially supports the work that is performed for the lord And that is where there's confusion and a growing weakness with the body of christ Because christianity has become fragmented Individualized and depersonalized We all know the term jesus is my personal lord and savior And that is a term that has come through uh through up to us historically through a variety of means including Through billy grams a wonderful ministry where he would speak about receiving christ as your personal lord and savior And in his ministry as well as the ministry of many others who use that term It was intended to communicate that it's not enough for a person to attend a location But they need to have a relationship with god through christ It's not enough to be water baptized and say thus i am a christian. That's that's not what made you a christian So you need to have an individual personal faith in christ And that's why billy graham would say that we need jesus as our personal lord and savior Who was simply emphasizing the fact that we needed to have a relationship with god through christ on an individual basis Unfortunately, what has happened Is people have said well, that's my personal faith and thus i don't need other people and that's simply not true And that has caused a fragmentation of the church and the church has become almost selfishly individualized It certainly is depersonalized Paul does say that we need a relationship with christ But we also need to remember that faith is lived out in a sometimes messy community I mean let's face it You got saved and you're entered into a a group of people who are still in process None of us have fully arrived. It's a messy community You know, I was born into a family. I was raised in a family and and frankly My mom and my dad had four kids and and they didn't ask me permission to have the other three They didn't they didn't say, you know Would you mind if we went on to have a couple more kids a couple sisters, you know because I just I had a vetoed that idea and I was said no and you can get rid of my big brother while you're at it, you know You know, they didn't ask me permission to add to the family. I didn't select those who were part of my family I didn't select them. I didn't have the choice. They simply were born into it And and this church as you look around this group of people who believe in christ You know, you didn't necessarily choose the person next to you or in front of you or behind you You didn't say necessarily that's the one that I want. Maybe you did maybe You didn't but god chose them and they're your family. They they belong to you and and uh And and you belong to them and and that's what we need to begin to understand in this day Is we actually really do need one another We need to understand that the church is a gathering of like-minded believers Believers who who love jesus christ and who are learning to love one another We need to understand that and and by the way this loving one another's like the song that you sing We are known by uh by our love christians are known by their love Well, that's the mark of a believer and and and the loving of one another is what makes us different than any other organization You can be on a baseball team. You don't have to love your fellow Baseball players a softball team football team. You don't have to love your fellow Athletes and all you're part of a team, but it doesn't require that you love one another You can be in a fraternal organization or a sorority if you will and you don't necessarily have to love your Fraternity brothers or Sorority sisters you don't have to in order to be part of that organization You can be in a lodge and a variety of other organizations and there's no requirement You don't sign up and say I will love these people. You don't have to do that But to be a believer requires that you love one another That's what jesus said by this shall all may know that you're my disciples If you have love one for another and so love is what makes the church what it's supposed to be It's what makes us a community It's what makes us a family in the lord jesus christ and and this family meets at various times in various locations We can have large meetings on sundays or a wednesday We can meet in people's homes or community centers for that matter We can meet together in a resort or beach or a backyard Because church isn't an event It's a family that gets together and knows one another The apostle john wrote five of the new testament books in third john verse 14 He wrote I hope to see you shortly And we shall speak face to face Peace to you Our friends greet you greet the friends By name In other words, we know each other. We see each other. He didn't say, you know, prophetically text one another, you know instant message one another He said greet him face to face by name. There's this reality of the need to be with other human beings The one thing that god says in the beginning of scripture The first thing that he says is not good is that the man should be alone We were not created for isolation. We were created for community And we need to understand that it's interesting when paul closes the book of romans And you look at his last chapter of the book of romans. He mentions around 36 people in that chapter by name So that helps us to understand the importance of being part of a church fellowship Because of the relationship you can have One with another the relationship that you're supposed to have As people It is not a good thing for the church to become Isolated from one another We need one another As uncomfortable as I can be and I do get uncomfortable sometimes when I'm being squeezed somewhere, you know, my people I don't really know As uncomfortable as that can be I also realize that that's very human and that's a great need that I have I need to be around other people human beings. I don't want the isolation I need the accountability the relational things that go on when I'm with the church family And so paul is speaking concerning what a church is and and church life And and that brings us to verse 12 as he here in first asolonians chapter five verse 12 says We urge you brethren to recognize those who labor among you and are over you in the lord and admonish you And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake And goes on to say be at peace among yourselves So verse 12 notice how he says we urge you brethren that word brethren In the greek language is adelphis The word adelphis literally speaks of being born from the same womb So he's saying you are the church the church is the family of god You are brethren again. We need to understand that today He emphasizes this some 17 times in this letter seven times in the last chapter alone Each member of the body of christ is not only an individual each member is a family member And families need leadership and god-ordained leadership is needed in the church And this leadership is to be valued by the church, which is what he is now emphasizing Notice again in verse 12 here. He says we urge you brethren to recognize those who labor among you We urge you He urges them because our natural tendency is to take people for granted We also have a tendency of being suspicious of any spiritual authority that may be placed over us and That's easily understood in light of how one person's failure can Impact so many people it only takes one failed church leader to undermine thousands of faithful people Just one all it takes is one pastor to to To do something that is printed and it goes national and before you know it People from every state in the united states is aware of what that man has done it undermines Credibility in a terrible way one person's failure can impact many people But the fact is it is also easy to fail to appreciate those who have given so much It's it's not that we're not thankful But often it's something we simply take for granted There is an attitude that we americans have an attitude of consumerism and it can exist in the church We can have expectations of ministry and and forget the work that goes into the ministry So paul writes we urge you brethren to recognize those who labor among you Now in what way are they to recognize those who labor among them? Well They're to acknowledge them first as messengers of christ and the gospel acknowledge them as genuine shepherds and Realize that they are they are entrusted with god's word Now he had already pointed that out in chapter two in verse nine When he had said you remember brethren our labor and toil For laboring night and day that we might not be a burden to any of you We preach to you the gospel of god In the same chapter verse 13 he went on to say for this reason We also thank god without ceasing because when you receive the word of god which you heard from us You welcomed it not as the word of men But as it is in truth the word of god which also effectively works in you who believe And so he is regarded he's saying you regard them as those who've been entrusted with god's word It's like what first peter 125 says the word of god endures forever Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you Now why are you to regard them? Well, he had always stated in in chapter two verse four that they had been tested in And have been approved and they have been entrusted And so those who have been faithful should be honored He's saying treat them with love and treat them with respect for their work's sake Well someone says why? Why should we do that? What's the big deal anyway? Why should I do that? If we show them too much attention Won't they get proud and won't they get arrogant if we show them that we care about them? Won't they take us for granted and use us? Why should we do that? Well If that were the case then paul would not command us to respect and honor them The fact is they do what they do because they love you And they care for you in the lord Ultimately the leaders of the congregation give an account of their ministry Not just to people but to god In hebrews 13 17 the writer said obey your leaders submit to their authority They keep watch over you as men who must give an account Obey them so that their work will be a joy not a burden For that would be of no advantage to you So the writer gives two reasons for them to be obedient to spiritual leadership one He said leaders watch over your soul When he says the leaders watch over your soul that speaks to their spiritual oversight the word watch over It speaks of being sleepless or being awake to be on watch to be attentive or ready He's saying that their leaders lose sleep over them Their concern for them is so great Leaders love them deeply Exercise great concern for them and even protect them And that's the heart of a shepherd But he also said in hebrews 13 17 that leaders give an account for their care for god's sheep You see james chapter 3 verse 1 says not many of you should presume to be teachers my brothers Because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly Spiritual leaders aren't perfect Nor infallible And people obviously will disagree with them Yet The attitude god desires is sincere appreciation for the leadership of the church He says let them do so With joy And not with grief When members of the church refuse to obey and disrespect their leaders It is painful And the work of ministry ceases being a joy. It becomes a burden. It's filled with grief Through obedience and submission They give their shepherds a great joy in their heart and that should provide them with the motivation to live properly for the lord Somebody once said you'll never find a happy pastor apart from a happy congregation And so He says respect them Recognize those who labor among you and are over you in the lord and admonished you Now when he speaks of labor Recognize those who labor labor speaks of growing weary or tired exhausted with toil burdens as well as grief You see ministry very often is hard work. It's physically tiring and it's emotionally tired Ministers labor long hours grow very tired as they labor Now long hours. Well, that can be difficult But long hours are not unlike any other work in terms of hours The true difficulty of ministry is that the labor being performed is spiritual And the minister works on something that is never finished in his lifetime I mean you can go out and you can be a contractor You can be a construction worker You may be building a home and all and you you have your plans and everything you lay the foundations You go and you begin to do work on it Eventually you build a house and and you're through building the house or whatever it is that you're building You walk away and you say it's done, but ministry is never through Ministry is not ever over Ministry continues through the lifetime of that minister And and that minister will will minister through the word of god and prayer in order that he might build up the body of Christ and and as he labors his work as opposed every step of the way by the enemy You see satan desires to undermine god's work in a person's life And that that minister does get tired. He does undergo a taxi. He does Get a maligned and he's often second-guest. He's injured. He's taken for granted. He can be threatened He can be stalked. He can be criticized for his messages. He receives hate mail He endures his children being judged He's mocked for the way that he speaks his wife can be harassed The board can tell him he's not worth his salary He can have his staff undermine him people casually disrespect him In today's church people comment on what he drives where he lives how he dresses how he looks His temperament the way he ministers all of that's under close scrutiny and he can get tired he can get tired And the minister labors and he and not only is he drained physically, but he's also drained emotionally Often they're not appreciated And often they're unloved by those that they love the most in 2nd Corinthians 1215 Paul said it like this. He said I will very gladly spend and be spent for your souls Though the more abundantly I love you the less I'm loved And so the minister's greatest desire is to see the church mature in their love and faith in Christ Galatians 419 my little children For whom I labor and birth again until Christ is formed in you Or 3rd John 4 where John says I have no greater joy than to hear that my children walk in truth And that's why we bathe the church in prayer And that's why we do our best to teach the word So because of this work There to be respected treated properly In 1st Timothy 5 17 let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor Especially those who labor in the word and doctrine And he says in verse 12 again there to be esteemed because they're over you in the Lord The word over you means to care for to protect they guard you they love you they lay their lives down for you There are ministers who have been given authority that comes from God they use it for the well-being of the church And he goes on to say and they admonish you When he says they admonish that word admonish means to warn or rebuke Elders are there to love the sheep But elders don't get the roles confused An elder remembers what the role is that they have in the church And that allows them to correct someone when necessary The lines haven't been crossed My own pastor's name is chuck smith And pastor chuck was my pastor for many years And I got close to him. I I spent time with him. I served on a board with him I traveled with him went to israel with him Todd at pastors conferences men's conferences went on on Ministry cruises with him. I spent a lot of time with my pastor got to know him fairly well And uh, and uh, he was very important to me I loved him very deeply and his memory still is very deeply embedded in my heart and soul I loved my pastor very very much and And all and I got as I said I got fairly close to him and um I still remember him saying even when I was speaking to him on one occasion You know, he said I like to be called chuck, but I always called him pastor I never called him pastor I never call him chuck without the name pastor or the title pastor before And I remember when my father died prior to my father dying I had approached chuck at a conference and I had spoken to him and I had said to him Pastor I said I want you to know God has been good to me. He gave to me my father And he gave to me you I said I have the best of both worlds I have a pastor that I love as a father and I have my own father That has been a great man in my life and and then my father died And when my father died I was at a pastors conference and I was seated next to pastor chuck And I turned to him and I was speaking to him and I said to him I said, you know pastor, I said, uh, the lord took my dad to be home with him My dad said home with the lord now I said, but I still have you you're still my father You're taking the place of my dad. I mean, that's how deeply I love this man pastor chuck I got close to him, but I still remember on one occasion I was speaking to him and he said something to me and I said, yeah, man And when I said, yeah, man to him he looked at me like You know, he did not like that He did not like that. I thought, man, I thought we're friends. Give me five, you know No, he didn't like that, you know, you know, I crossed the line without realizing it I didn't know it and I mean, I wish I could have drawn back those or yeah, man But I learned my lesson and I realized, you know that as close as I could be to this man He he deserved my respect and and that's how it how it works in ministry And so elders elders know who they are You see one of the problems that churches sometimes have is when the elders forget That they're spiritual leaders and they try to become like the people in the church in the sense of saying Oh, yeah, I do that. I say that and I'm this way and all of that And they can lose the respect of the sheep and I and I think that's not a good thing at all You know, sometimes there are those who want to be so close to the sheep that they fail to realize that the sheep doesn't need a buddy The sheep needs a pastor the sheep doesn't need another friend The sheep needs somebody that can be spiritual leader in their life And and though that pastor may love them in a friendly way and we do we have friends in the in the church We love very much. We have coffee with and we visit with I never forget who I am I know who I am. I'm I am not just my name David Rosales I am the pastor of the church in the pastor of that man across from me or that woman. I'm speaking to I know who I am And I'm not going to be somebody's buddy. I'm going to be somebody's pastor I will be the friend in the sense that I can be but I always remember who I am I want to retain the respect of that person Because I you know, this is true That people will love their their their shepherd When they start seeing things about them that they think are much like them Sometimes they can lose respect for them. No, I don't put things on.  I just am who I am But I at the same time know What I'm supposed I'm supposed to be I'm the pastor of this church I'm not I'm not Somebody who bounces around plays around teases and things like that in weird ways I know I'm supposed to be because at any given moment somebody may need a prayer somebody may need A scripture somebody may need an ear to hear somebody may need somebody to cry with them or to laugh with them That's what they need. They don't need a buddy. They don't need a pal And they always need to remember that spiritual leaders need to remember who they are And because they sometimes have to admonish as he's saying here and again that means a warn or to rebuke We need to remember So that we may have to correct and do so And the lines have not been crossed He says in verse 13 esteemed them very highly and loved for their work's sake esteemed them very highly Love them very deeply because of their spiritual work among you Don't take them for granted value them And then he moves on and he says and be at peace among yourselves Be at peace among yourselves Division will always undermine effective ministry Division is one of the basic tools that satan uses to undermine works in matthew 12 25 Jesus said every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation Every city or house divided against itself will not stand So unity in the Lord is to be pursued and guarded Ephesians 4 3 says we're to be endeavoring to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace And so that's something that we work for and work at We need to remain at peace amongst ourselves and because of this he moves into verse 14 And says now we exhort you brethren warn those who are unruly Comfort the faint hearted uphold the weak and be patient with all So he gives four orders here in verse 14 to the elders This is intended to safeguard the unity and the peace in the church One, warn those who are unruly The word unruly is a word that was used in greek society concerning those who wouldn't show up for work It would also be used of soldiers who are out of rank And so what he's saying there are those who are unruly there are lazy soldiers who are not pulling their weight So he says warn them encourage them exhort them They need to pull their own weight. It's not right for somebody else to do things that they could be doing It's not right for somebody to be exercising their spiritual gifts when this person's not exercising theirs We're a body of Christ. We should be working together. So encourage them In Galatians 5 13 for you brethren have been called to liberty only don't use liberty as an opportunity for the flash But through love serve one another Then he says comfort the faint hearted These are those who think that the the enemy is too great. There's no way we're gonna make it The enemy is just he's gonna he's gonna win. So he's saying remind them remind them remind them You can do all things through christ who strengthens you Remind them. We are more than conquerors through jesus christ Remind them. God has given to us power from heaven the ability to do that which he has called us to do He didn't give to me a command that he doesn't give me the power to to obey Command them remain strong. Don't be timid. You can do it. Don't give up hope hold fast. Don't let go God is on the throne.  He's with you. He'll never leave you never forsake you He will be with you You will have victory in christ because he gives it to you remind them the battle is the lords You can fight your own battle if you want or you can have somebody on your side who has never lost a battle Choose who you will have fight your battles and trust him in it Because the lord doesn't lose In romans 8 31 what then shall we say to these things if god is for us who can be against us? Remember that the battle is the lord's great problems gives god great opportunities He shows himself strong if i did not trust the lord to do what he knew I knew he could do if i didn't trust him to do that i'd still be in a home somewhere in norwalk doing a home bible study for six people But i know god is able i know god is capable I know god can do abundantly above all i ask or think all i need to do is get on the same page with him And begin to move in his spirit and then i get to see him as he unveils himself step by step Victory after victory and i see god glorified So hold fast Don't let go He's there for you He's there for you You also uphold or support the weak You strengthen the spiritually weak you do so by the word you do so by by by love you you have fellowship with them I've been given the opportunity in september to go to colorado to speak at a regional calvary chapel pastors conference And the assignment that has been given to those who are going to be teaching relates to endurance And uh my dear friend uh randy walls and his wife janette uh are my wife marie and my closest friends and we Spent a week just this last week together. I took a week off and and we spent time together And i was sharing with them about the assignment And it relates to endurance And i said you know i'd like to talk to you about it a little bit And it's something i can share briefly with you i said it's something i'd like to ask you guys about I said because the assignment that we have is to speak on endurance And i said and there's so many things that you can say concerning that i mean just look at this church 37 years That's a model of endurance my my ministry has been going since 1973. That's a model of endurance people have asked What has kept you strong? How do you continue to minister over? You know one decade over another decade over another decade into another decade How how have you ministered for 45 years? And remained faithful how and so i have ideas of that of course the lord gives you strength in this and that But as i was speaking to them i said you know what it is and i want to share this with you This is important. I hope it makes sense and i and i do so Trying to be as real as i can and There have been many times when i have I've just said i can't do this anymore somebody once asked Have you ever quit the ministry? And i said yeah every sunday But there are times that that that That people who are not in pastoral ministry That it's just not something you can understand anymore than than i can understand if you're a police officer I don't understand your job. I don't know what you go through I can never understand a housewife or a woman in any way. Can i understand a woman?    It's that you think you're not There's something wrong with me Why what have i done lord and i've gone through so many things not the this isn't a solve story I'm trying to be real. It's just that happens right and i was talking to my friend randy And i said randy what has kept me strong all over these years is my god is able my god works in me I know that but it's you and janette and friends like you that have helped my hands up In times when i couldn't hold them up myself Paul says comfort the weak guess what sometimes i'm weak too And sometimes i need someone who'll put their arm around my shoulder and say You'll be all right God's with you. We'll see this through together. Listen if you don't have a friend Pray that god gives you one. I have friends that have helped me through the valley of the shadow of death more than once And i've been in this pulpit Broken-hearted, but you wouldn't know it because i have people praying even right now There are men praying for me as i'm preaching this message I have support They comfort me when i'm weak You can comfort others I need you And you need me Like barnie said we're all one happy family But we need each other We need each other That's real That's real not that's not the man on the screen the perfect man who never fails That's not that man the wizard of oz We all need each other God made us Fearfully and wonderfully and we need see i have weaknesses you have strengths in And i need your strength And i have strengths that you have weaknesses in and you need mine We need each other. I'm not over you. I'm with you. I'm your brother I love you, but i'm also the pastor of this church And i will not ever lower myself to be anything less than that You didn't come for a buddy you came for a pastor I will be that in your life if you want it And i will do that And we will comfort one another And finally he said be patient with all You know in other words don't give up on the church Some of us are very difficult to be around I call them stinkers And some sheep are stinky little sheep. They're stinkers And we can be hard. We can be difficult. Who's to say we're not? I mean come on If you if you had a family at all, you know that if you had more than one brother or sister, you know You know that even dad and mom could be stinkers. I mean we we we can cause each other families cause each other problems That's just a fact. We do but we don't give up on one another We hold fast to one another you can be arguing with your brother But if somebody steps in it's like you and your brother now against that guy Because this is my brother You know and leave us alone. You know we'll deal with this and that's how you can be And I really need the church and I haven't given up on it. I'm not why would I Why would I don't give up on the body of christ? We can be difficult we can be But be patient He says be patient with all hold fast trust the lord Encourage them I have seen some people that I'll be honest with you. I thought oh this person. I don't I don't know. I'll give you one example and then I'll close Many many years ago. I I was teaching a pastor want to be class Guys who want to learn pastoral minister. I'm talking 25 plus years about 25 years ago at least And there's a fellow and I said at the beginning And I do this periodically I'll do these classes and I said at the beginning listen if you don't do your homework and And and the reading and things then just I'm going to release you. I'm not going to have you a pastor has to be Somebody who is actually disciplined to to do the things that are in front of them And if I give you an assignment, I'm expecting you to have it done And this one fellow who is in in my class Wasn't doing his assignments and there were minor assignments and and so he didn't do them like two or three in a row and that was it so, you know grace goes so far and then the law and so At the end he walks up and I said, you know, this is your last day in the class Why I said you don't do your assignments He says that I've been busy. I said so am I And you don't do your assignments. Well, I know I'm called by God. I said you may very well be But I know I'm called by God to be in this class and that's where you're wrong You're out I smiled. I wasn't mean Get out. No, I I was nice, but I'm firm I said, no, you're not in class anymore But I know I'm called well, we'll see And he he's the only person that I ever had to Say, you're no longer in this class because I'm firm about those things If you can't do your homework and your assignments, what gives you the idea you can pass through a church You have to be disciplined and you have to learn it here and I'm real firm about that Well, anyway, he left and he was hurt and he moved out of town And uh, now he passes a Calvary Chapel ministry You know, he he's a pastor in a church. I failed him But God didn't Because it awoke him It awoke him. I need to be disciplined. I need to learn these things I need to and he became the disciplined man. He needed to be all along And so even then You don't give up on people You just encourage them to do the right thing and then trust the Lord To work in their lives and guess what if that person is sincere God does a work If that person wants God God shows up. He does show up. It doesn't he he does show up God is there and he and he doesn't abandon you So don't Don't give up on the church In Colossians 3 12 and 13 As the elect of God holy and beloved put on tender mercies kindness humility meekness long suffering Bearing with one another and forgiving one another if anyone has a complaint against another Even as Christ forgave you so you also must do That's not a suggestion. That's a command Did Christ forgive you? Yes forgive others forgive others Live at peace with all men And watch what God will do in your life. Don't give up On the church Hold fast