Good evening. You're watching NGTV with Meera Shakabarwa. This is a show where we take your questions on the coronavirus. You can dial us in the number of flashing on your screens. We'll be joined by a panel of expert doctors who will answer those questions. But what are we focusing on this evening? A second wave of the coronavirus is inevitable. This is what has been said by US's leading epidemiologist Dr. Anthony Fauci. Now just how bad this second wave is, he says, depends on the progress we make in the coming months. He's of course said this in context with the United States, which is the worst affected country. But let's first listen in to what he's had to say and then we'll ask the doctors about it. If we are unsuccessful or prematurely try to open up and we have additional outbreaks that are out of control, it could be much more than that. It could be a rebound to get us right back in the same boat that we were in a few weeks ago. So that's why we've really got to be careful and very circumspect as we go from a lockdown to a gradual rolling reentry into some sort of normality. All right. So that is what Dr. Anthony Fauci has said. He's talked about the possibility of a second wave of infections. Is that something which is possible? Is that something that we need to guard ourselves against? And what does this second wave of infections essentially mean? Joining us on the broadcast, Dr. K. N. Manohar, he's a consultant physician with the Manipal Hospital in Bangalore. He's also a fitness enthusiast and has participated in many marathons. Appreciate you, doctor, for being with us this evening. Also joining us is Dr. T. K. Venkatesh. He is an interventional cardiologist from the Apollo Hospital in Bangalore as well. Appreciate you, doctors, for being with us on the broadcast. You know, I want to begin by asking you a little more about what we just heard Dr. Anthony Fauci say. He says that, you know, a second wave of the coronavirus is inevitable. Do you think this will happen, Dr. Manohar? Perhaps in the winters, can one expect a second wave? How can we guard against it? What would you like to tell our viewers? Yes, Dr. Shikha as Dr. Anthony Fauci has already told that we will have a second wave. So end of lockdown is not end of coronavirus infection. So this virus is here to stay. So what are the precautions to take for this? Are the five commandments. Clean, washing your hands, cover your coughs, contain yourself. Someone is sick. Please stay at home. Physical distancing, not so much of social distancing. We call it as physical distancing also. And avoid men touching off mouth, eyes and nose repeatedly. These are what we are talking from so long about all these things. But what we are trying to reiterate is end of lockdown or release somewhere we have to release it. And our experts believe that up to 60 to 70% of the population, possibly sometime or the later, will have this coronavirus infection. So why did we do the lockdown is just to avoid the week? All right, very interesting point that you make there. Let me also bring in Dr. Venkatesh. Dr. Venkatesh, would you like to comment on what Dr. Anthony Fauci has said he's also warned against the premature lifting of a lockdown saying it could lead to a resurgence in cases. But he seems pretty confident as an epidemiologist when he says that there will be a second wave. This is extremely worrying. Yeah, I completely agree with what he says. And the fears of a second escalation is always there. This would happen in such time as something called as herd immunity would happen. Now what is herd immunity herd immunity is at least when 30 to 60% of the population have the virus in them and they have become immune to it so that if the other person transmits the virus, they just bounce off these people who have become immune to the virus. And that way the population to a very great extent is protected. So until such time as herd immunity develops, this is going to be a problem where we have to live with. All right, our first caller Vasudevan is on the phone line from Bangalore. Let's go in and get a question and then we'll talk a little more about this. Go ahead, ask a question. Hello, ma'am. I am Vasudevan from Bangalore. It has been in US Ramdesvair is giving a positive treatment. If it is so, when will we get the drug? If it is successful in US because the treatment for 10 days, if you take the drug, it is showing some positive results. All right. I'm not I'm not entirely sure, Mr. Vasudevan, what drug you're talking about because there are several drugs that are being considered for treatment. But let me take that to Dr. Manohar.  How far away do you think we are from it? Yeah, first to answer the caller's question, I think he was alluding to Ramdesvair, one of the antivirals, which we use it for HIV, as we all know from simple medications like vitamin C to anti malarial drugs to plasma therapy to Ramdesvair. A lot of drugs have been contemplated to be useful, but none of them have been consistently shown to have any benefit. So some weeks back itself, we had some reports from CNN itself to say that Ramdesvair may not be as useful. So we need to wait for that. Secondly, to the vaccine, what you alluded generally takes 12 to 18 months to get a vaccine in place. But yesterday, I think in our show, we saw that ICMR is speeding up the process. CRM Institute is hopefully closer by and by the end of this year, if things go well, right, we may have a vaccine. But to add to that, this COVID-19, I call it as an elusing moving target. What we know about it today is not the final thing. So what vaccine problem is, we all know that there is mutations in this viruses. So that could also pose a challenge for any form of therapy, including vaccination. All right, Dr. Venkatesh, is there anything you'd like to add? Yeah, I think as far as vaccines are concerned, it'll take a long time for the vaccine to come. And if a vaccine is found against coronavirus, then this is going to be probably the quickest vaccine which we are going to see in our lifetime. Right. There are so many genetic mutations, which probably would happen with the virus. And so that makes the production of a vaccine a little tricky. And it is now undergoing some human trials. A couple of countries have jumped into it. And once we get the vaccine, well, I think it is an add on to probably the herd immunity that we are going to develop over a period of time. All right. Our next caller, Amar, is on the phone line from Bangalore. Go ahead. Very good evening. My question to the doctors is actually in two parts. I would like to know if this virus is evolving. Does it have characteristics of evolving over a period of time? And second part is I would like to know if the people who are infected and who have recovered, do they have the chance of getting infected again? Okay, let me break it down into into two parts. Dr. Manohar, would you like to, you know, talk about whether the virus is evolving? Yes, coronavirus is a very well known virus being there here for so many decades. So once it got evolved, it became Mars. Later, it got evolved, it became SARS-CoV. Then again, it is a world SARS-CoV 2 has come in. So survival of the fittest, even organisms will try their best to survive. When they evolve, they change their genetic component. In this case, we call it as a zoonosis. They pick up component from, let's say, bad as it is postulated here. And when they develop the beta types of the coronavirus can infect the humans also. So when they infect us, we don't recognize this because our most cannot, our defense cannot recognize this. It's a new virus. Okay. And the problem is this, this type of virus can spread from one person to one person easily. So that's why this havoc is happening. Definitely it is evolving. All right. Dr. Lekates, would you like to answer the second part of that question on whether a person who's been infected once can get the infection again? Yeah, it's too early to actually jump to that kind of a conclusion, because COVID-19 testing is still not very widely available. Secondly, we have to prove the antibody titers of that person who has been infected and shown that it has reached a good value. And in spite of that, he's got infected. So they're still in the preliminary stages of trying to conceptualize this kind of a situation where probably we hypothesize that there is a reinfection occurring. Yes, there are some anecdotal reports in the literature where people have gone and reported a few cases that this patient was considered to be cured. And now they've got a reinfection. All right. Our next caller, MML Verma is calling from Mumbai. Go ahead. Yeah, my question is today, the data of total deaths during March 2020 has come up in USA. Okay. Yes. Yeah, now there is a reduction over the average of last four years, total number of deaths. So what would be your comment on this? All right. Dr. Manohar, would you like to answer that? I'm not clear whether he's referring to what deaths and total mortality is a whole? Yes, with the mortality rate is a whole. Yeah, there are lots of interesting things which are coming up. It's too early to sum this up and say that corona has protected lives. There are a lot of people who the lives have saved by less number of accidents, less people are stressed, hopefully, so that incidents of myocardial infarctions are also much lesser. Right. But I can't be too early to analyze that data perhaps. Mr. Venkata Subbaru is calling us from Guntur. Go ahead. Good evening, madam. Good evening, sir. Good evening, sir. Go ahead. Good evening, madam. Sir, my question is asthma patients are prone to coronavirus. Okay. My question is asthma patients are prone to coronavirus, COVID-19. Asthma patients, please answer that. All right. Yes. Is your question... Okay, Dr. Venkata, should I take that on? Yeah, I'll take it on. There are a subgroup of people who are probably more prone to coronavirus and they are usually people who are more than 65 years, patients with type 1 diabetes, those who are on immunosuppressive therapy, patients with heart and lung diseases, chronic kidney disease, and patients who are suffering from cancer. In them, the immunocompromised state exists and so they are more prone for catching an infection. Asthma is also a respiratory illness and to a certain extent, having a coronavirus infection in an asthmatic, can we be a little more mortality probably compared to patients who don't have asthma and who develop a coronavirus infection? All right. Very interesting. As far as patients who are predisposed to a particular condition, Ramana Rao from Hyderabad, our next caller, go ahead. Good evening to all of you. Good evening. Go ahead. My question is regarding everybody is saying, including ITMR, RT-PCR is the only reliable test to confirm the disease. But my question is, how many districts are available? RT-PCR killed a person among the infected districts. How close are they to the test? All right. It's difficult, of course, to quantify it. The ICMR website, I can tell you, has a list of accredited labs. You know, Mr. Ramana Rao, if you want to go and access that list to figure out if there's a lab in your neighborhood, you can do that. The ICMR website has a list. But let me take this question to Dr. Manohar because it's interesting. On the reliability of the test, that's the other point that has been raised. You know, are the other tests like the antibody test, for instance, as reliable as the RT-PCR? Definitely not. The gold standard test is RT-PCR. Even that sensitivity is about 70 odd percent. The antibody test, I think we all know that a lot of news are coming in that what is the reliability? You have to go on to roughly about five percent. Some people are questioning the way it is done and also the kits from where it has come from. So the gold standard test is RT-PCR. All right. Our next caller, Srikanth, is on the phone line from Bengaluru. Go ahead. Hello. Hello. Good evening, Dr. Venkatesh. Good evening, Dr. Manohar. Good evening, sir. Hi, Dr. Manohar. I am Dr. Manohar's patient, actually. So one of the doctors, I know, he's been treating me for diabetes. All right. Could you please ask your question? Yeah, I will be coming to the question. See, basically, this coronavirus has hit us for a very long time. And according to some school of thought, this particular virus can be cured by taking some hot water every day. That's what I believe. So there's some, I've heard about this, that drinking hot water for at least 15 minutes. Is there any evidence to suggest that? Yeah, I don't know the doctor's name. The question is for the doctor. Dr. Manohar, since this is your patient, would you like to answer his question? No issues. Yeah, there are a lot of preventive measures, as we say. General thinking is code, anything code can stimulate the virus. Right. Anything hot is good. That's why even data today's article, if you look at it, Mumbai and Bangalore, they evaluated and say 85% correlation with temperature. So any warm fluids are better than consuming cold fluids. Possibly because the virus can have receptors around the world of firings. It's very interesting that you talk about a temperature correlation because Dr. Venkatesh, very briefly, could I then ask you, you know, the talk of the possible resurgence of the virus in winter, in lower temperatures? Is that perhaps something which is possible? Can we consider? Oh, yes. There has been some kind of a correlation attributed to temperature and humidity as far as the behavior of the virus is concerned at its virulence. They say that any temperature which is more than 25 degrees centigrade or some say 24, whatever, 24 to 25 degrees centigrade makes the virus a little more less penetrative and less virulent. And if you keep up the humidity, it's good for you basically not for the virus. People say that if you decrease the humidity in your room, then your mucosal will dry up and the mucosal barrier, that is the first resistance against this virus is kind of eliminated and therefore people tend to catch an infection much faster. So there are certain papers which say that you have to dehumidify rather than humidify. So this is a little controversial as far as the humidity part of it is concerned, but temperature, yes, definitely. All right, our next column, Vikram Sarkar is calling from Mumbai, go ahead. So my question is on the set-free WAC that is there. And which I understand is working not on the virus, but on our immune system. And basically it is already an approved medicine which is already used. So and I think some of the trials have already successfully done on that. So can't we use it? So what is restricting? I mean, why are we not able to use it? Dr. Manohar, would you like to take that on? I didn't get what medicine was referring to. The drug by the name of Cepcivac. It's a Cepcivac. It's a... Dr. Venkatesh. Dr. Manohar. You want me to take that? Yes. Cepcivac is supposed to be a drug which is mycobacterium W and it's usually used in gram-negative Cepsis. And it's used basically to overcome the cytokine storm. So it's generally restricted to be used in critically ill patients and that has been approved by the DCGI. But we still are just doing clinical trials. We do not have large outcome data as far as Cepcivac is concerned. So we got to wait and watch. Is it true that the drug doesn't actually attack the virus but helps to build the immunity? Dr. Venkatesh? Well, it prevents a cytokine storm. When the virus gets into the body, you know, it kind of initiates a lot of inflammation and a lot of cytokines get liberated. And this cytokine storm is supposed to be subdued by the Cepcivac. That's how it works. All right. Our next scholar, G.T. Suresh is on the phone line from Bangalore. Go ahead. Hi, Reshika. This is Suresh here. I have a couple of questions. No, I have come back from UK. Okay, it's been over a month and I have not had any symptoms or any such problems. But then, you know, the way that they're saying that first wave, second wave, and then in addition to that, you know, that in the initial stages, it was said that the vulnerable people, a lot are basically the older people are the young kids. And then, you know, but in India, it's been, you know, very different. With many people, young, you know... So what's your question, sir? Everybody getting affected. But, and also being a fitness, you know, one of the doctors here, Dr. Madhavar. I'd like to ask him if, in any way, the fitness would help us to keep, you know, away this virus. Right. Dr. Manohar, you know, a lot of worries about the possibility of a second wave and of course, you know, what can one do in order to sort of guard yourself? See, how any organism can affect us based on three things. Agent, host, and environment. Agent and environment, we spoke. Host, it all depends on your immunity, which is not actually directly measurable as general people think about it. And Mr. Suresh, as he was rightly said, we are expecting a second wave and it is true. Why are more younger people affected? Because younger people are the one who are mobile and they go and catch it. If it happens in the elderly population, the risk and the outcomes are much poorer in the elderly population. So as we started the program, if you're thinking of lifting the lockdown, my message is if wealth is lost, nothing is lost. If character is lost, something is lost, if health is lost, everything is lost. Please think over it again. And we expect a second wave because as we discussed again. But Dr. Manohar, then advise viewers because you know, we've had a lot of callers call in and ask what kind of exercises, et cetera, they can do given the fact that, you know, that walks are not allowed.  So what do you advise, Dr. Manohar? There are a lot of exercises available. Now it is, everyone is tech saving, you get it. Many of these YouTube channels, you get it. Yoga is the best. It comes you down also, improves flexibility. You can do it at home. You can include everyone in the family to join you. There are a lot of exercises which we can do. You can squat and I can go on and on. I think 30 minutes you can do it. A lot of exercise and 30 minutes of good exercise at home. Dr. Venkatesh, do you advise that to your cardiac patients as well? Because it's recommended for cardiac patients that they must engage in some kind of, you know, walking, exercising, et cetera. Very true, yes. It's very individualized, like, you know, it's basically a cardiac rehabilitation program. It would depend on a lot of factors as to whether you are doing it as a preventive strategy or as a rehabilitation strategy. If you're doing it as a prevention against coronary artery disease, yes, a regular physical activity, at least try to catch up of 35 minutes of walk every day and good activity, that's a good one. So important to keep the exercise going, even if you can't get out of your homes, do it within. I think every doctor on every show has emphasized on that. Our next caller, Shobha Srinivasan, is on the phone line from Mumbai. Go ahead. Yeah, hi, doctor, good evening to you. Just wanted to ask you one question. We constantly talk about the sneeze or the water which comes from the mouth as a carrier of the virus. Any other kind of discharge from our body could be the carrier of the virus which is wanted to check on? Dr. Venkatesh, would you like to answer that? Yeah, basically I think it's all about the respiratory hygiene that we have been talking about. The coronavirus is a virus which basically initially affects the bucus membranes, that is, the mouth, the nose, and the eyes, and that's exactly the reason why you should avoid frequent touching of these places. And these are the places from where transmission can occur and let us say there's a person with infected coronavirus who speaks somewhere. Yes, if it is on a fomite surface, depending upon the smoothness of the surface, well, this coronavirus can still latch on to it, maybe for up to 72 hours in case of stainless tea. But Dr. Pannur, very briefly, what about tears or sweat? For instance, that's also bodily fluid. Yeah, see, as I said, every day we are learning something. Again, fecal oral transmission also is the question. Some people are having diarrhea. The confirmed are the respiratory secretions. Right. From the cold and cough, sweat, we don't know. That's all that we know for sure. We are definitely knowing about it. Time will tell if we are knowing everything or not. All right, I appreciate you doctors for being with us on the broadcast, for sparing the time to answer the questions that our viewers have had. That's all we have time for on the show this evening on the other side. It's the 8 o'clock news with Sonia Singh. Stay tuned. Knowledge partner, USB, your reliable health care partner.


Katarina Alexandrova versus Petri Kovitava is the third quarter-final for the ladies Miami Open for 2023. And both players have unexpectedly made the quarter-finals. Alexandrova started the tournament off as the number 18 seed and got a buy in the first round. In the second round she'd take on Towson, the unseeded American, and after a very tough second set she'd eventually get through in 3, 6, 3, 5, 7, 6, 4. In the third round she'd take on the number 9 seed Bencic, who'd been having a very good season so far. And after a close first set Alexandrova would get through in straights, 7, 6, 6, 3. In the fourth round she'd take on Bianca on Drescu, who'd been in great form this week taking out Rodocano and Sakari. And after a very close first set on Drescu hurt her ankle and was forced to retire, allowing Alexandrova to make the quarters, 7, 6, love 2, retirement. Kovitava started the tournament off as the number 15 seed and would get a buy in the first round. In the second round she'd take on the Czech youngster Nuskova in a battle of the generations. This was easy for Kovitava, winning in straights, 6, 3, 6, love. In the third round she'd take on the number 22 seed Vekic. And after a close second set, Kovitava would get through in straights, 6, 4, 7, 6. In the fourth round she'd take on the qualifier Gracheva, who'd been very good in recent weeks taking out Onstraburr earlier in this tournament. And after a very close set in the second, Kovitava would get through 7, 5, 7, 6 to advance to the quarterfinals. These two have only played the one time before, that was back in 2020 at the Australian Open, with Kovitava getting the easy win, but Alexandrova's come a long way in the last three years. If Alexandrova's going to win this one, she needs to be aggressive and take advantage of the baseline. And that's when she plays her best, she's also going to have to serve well. She is sometimes prone to double folds, so she needs to eliminate those if she's going to get the win over Kovitava. If Kovitava's going to win this one, she needs to use that big lefty serve, and she also has to take over the baseline. It's kind of going to be a battle of who can take that baseline and make the other person run more. Kovitava's going to have to do that if she's going to beat Alexandrova. This is a very interesting match, because we didn't expect these two players to get into this stage. Maybe Kovitava, she has been in a little bit of form lately, but not Alexandrova. So a bit of a random matchup, I'm going to go with Kovitava. Based on her experience, of course, she's won Grand Slam, so I'm going to go with the Grand Slam experience and Kovitava to make it to the semis, but let me know down in the comments below, who do you think is going to win this one?


I became Muslim. I was still a Muslim. But I died in a war. We killed the weak people with our lives. Turcinazia Dune is part of the Turkic ethnic group known as the Uyghurs. Chinese Muslims who mostly live in the northwest province of Xinjiang. There are about 12.8 million Uyghurs who live there. And human rights groups say that many have become victims of crimes against humanity of the government. China is accused of imprisoning over one million Uyghurs in re-education camps, sexual abuse, and even foresterlization. Ziya Dun says she spent 11 months in jail for no stated reason. She was sexually assaulted and tortured. Communist Party officials have attributed their treatment of the Uyghurs to the war on terror. In 2008, the region suffered multiple terrorist attacks, linked to the East Turkistan independence movement, which is a faction within the Uyghur community that wants Xinjiang to separate from China and form its own state. But human rights advocates say that terrorism is just an excuse. The Chinese have oppressed the Uyghurs as part of their push for radical conformity. The government describes the camps as focused on re-education and career training. In 2017, when the crackdown intensified, Uyghurs were targeted for wearing headscarves, for abstaining from drinking alcohol, and for displaying abnormal behaviors like purchasing dumbbells. The Uyghur community is accused of Kathmandu's murder. They say it's the right thing to do, especially in the case of the Uyghurs. Some attribute the Chinese government push for conformity to capitalism, and Bijang's desire to staff factories, increase production, and surpass the US on the global stage. But the Chinese Communist Party says its goal is to build a modern socialist country, and that description is more apt. China seeks to impose one identity, culture, and language on all of its 1.37 billion people, erasing that which does not conform. From the policies of Mao to those of Lenin and Stalin, when command and control societies impose uniformity, it inevitably leads to human rights violations. Ziya Dune says that she felt as if the Chinese government set out to eradicate her culture and ethnicity. The Chinese government has ever more sophisticated tools of surveillance at its disposal, and it allegedly provides local authorities with lists that detail how to identify extremists. In Ziya Dune's case, she says she was arrested when she returned to Xinjiang from Kazakhstan, where she had been living with her Kazakh husband. Ziya Dune says she was released after her husband advocated on her behalf. She made it to the US under the protection of the Uyghur Human Rights Project, an organization that seeks to promote the rights of the Uyghur and other Turkic Muslims from Xinjiang. Today Ziya Dune lives in a suburb of DC. She says that her heart aches for her family and the other Uyghurs back home, millions of whom are still being imprisoned, tortured and surveilled in their most private spaces, including their living rooms, dining areas and prayer spaces according to one report. Although the US has condemned the mistreatment of the Uyghurs and government officials are boycotting the Bijang Olympics, in protest, we've admitted zero new Uyghur refugees in the last two years. Welcome in foreigners like Ziya Dune is what has allowed the US to avoid becoming a monoculture, and our diversity of thought and experience is the secret of American capitalism. China is a racing of the Uyghur culture and its decision to surveil, imprison and torture the Uyghur people in pursuit of becoming the leading global superpower isn't just morally abhorrent, it won't work.


I was always creative just because I was dyslexic and I just my dad was creative and so I wanted to I always did that as sort of like an outlet and Project Runway was on TV at the time and I was like, oh, that's cool. I really like fashion But I think what I liked about it was this, you know, I'd flip through magazines and it was like the Overall image was something I was interested in not the clothing or the model or the setup or anything It was like this entire world, you know, I was really interested in that


So I think Silicon Valley and its equivalents wouldn't exist if CEOs were not vulnerable as all of us are to narrow-mindedness. So what I like to say is say thank you to the narrow-mindedness that you use, because it allows us to do a lot of things very well again and again. But it can result in spectacular errors and so we've got to learn to overcome it and we've got to teach our body and our brain and our organizations to overcome our natural narrow-mindedness.


Joe Rogan Experience number 1178, Dr. Rhonda Patrick. This is actually the 8th time Dr. Rhonda Patrick has been on the JRE. I looked this up because I remember listening to a podcast and actually learning things and I was like, that must have been a long time ago, because now I feel like I'm batting in the major leagues compared to these people. But she was on back in like the beginning of 2014 which was around when I was only a year into this diet so I still had a lot of things to learn compared to what I know now. But overall the problem is Dr. Rhonda Patrick isn't really well versed on the carnivore diet especially you know I mean even people on the carnivore diet aren't well versed on the nutrient density of certain animal foods and that pertain to a lot of questions she was asked and couldn't really answer professionally on at least from my experience. And then she just talked about the importance of vegetables a lot but the problem I have with that is the vegetables we have now are modified forms of like one family of cruciferous vegetables and you know they're not the wild plants and wild vegetables we used to buy it's one thing if they were saying oh go to local farmers markets by you know heirloom grains by local fruits local vegetables incorporate those into your diet it's one thing to say that as opposed to say shove broccoli sprouts down your throat which is pretty much what they said and the most contradictory thing was she's kind of against the diet this whole time and then she starts talking about the benefits of salmon roe and DHA and I'm like I'm like miss the salmon roe I've been advocating salmon roe for two like two three years now at least on YouTube and I've been eating salmon roe myself for much longer than that I've been I was taking spoonfuls of cod liver oil five six years ago when I started this diet well let's actually go down the podcast itself and just talk on the point just to give you guys a summary of the podcast for the most part we're not gonna I mean there are like I might say like you know brought up how her baby likes plastic a bottle talks about the dangers of BPA how the water sits in plastic and heat they talk about air pollution and break fumes but this was literally like 20 minutes of those four points I just said and what we're gonna really focus on and talk about are the carnivore diet points so there's probably about half of this podcast we're not really gonna talk about we're just gonna mention the brief points they were talking about for 10 20 minutes at times so the first part of the carnivore I was Rhonda Patrick saying that's crazy no way that was her response when she first found out about this diet but you know she was like oh that's crazy eat that much meat but Joe Rogan probably gets most of his calories from animal foods even if by volume he eats a lot of vegetables and all indigenous groups got 65 to 75 percent of their calories from animal foods and the remainder from wild plant foods or in some cases in after the Neolithic rye bread oats various grains but there are some groups of indigenous people that got almost 80 to 90 percent of their calories from animal foods so it's not unrealistic as she's making it sound with the context of those peoples then she said there's no published evidence I was like what do you mean there's no published evidence there's no published evidence on the paleo diet which is what she follows there's no published evidence on a lot of things so you're just going to dismiss it you know there's no real published evidence on keto or various other diets that you speak about are beneficial you know to the same degree that there's very few things done on the carnivore diet well people can I mean my daddy to loaf of bread a day and I'm sure people have been doing that for many years but there's no studies on that what is like I'm not I'm just I'm getting silly now her two theories to why the diet worked was because people eat less on a higher protein diet and that people eat the same food they tend to eat less of it the first part eating less on a higher protein diet is true because most people are lacking nutrition and high protein foods have more nutrition in them and we're talking vitamins and minerals as well as just protein and fat and people eating the same food they eat less that ties in with and round a Patrick of all people you should know that fat protein and carbohydrate have different satiation levels if you eat only butter and then you know you're only gonna eat like a thousand calories with a butter at most and then if you move on to steak then you can move on to honey your ice cream different foods have different palatabilities I think I have to redo my video on food palatability because it's something people don't understand the importance of eating fat or liver first like the organs and the fat and the satiating foods first and then moving on to the lean protein moving on to sweets because your body has different satiation levels for different foods but for her not to know that and to know why that's the reason when people only eat one type of food they eat less to me screams not too experienced try to compare microbiome changes in fasting to the carnivore diet but the only common thing between fasting and the carnivore diet is they can both remove inflammation from the digestive system and then she said minocycline which is it was an antibiotic use that alternate gut bacteria that wiped out the bad gut bacteria as well as the good eventually people saw benefits short-term so she was trying to say all people are going to only see benefits in the carnivore diet short-term but the carnivore diet your gut microbiome adapts to me it's a permanent thing it's not a temporary fix and it's not like those gut bacteria are inherently bad they're just different and then she said putrification is linked to colon cancer but putrification is just how foods digest in the human digestive system we have a putrificative digestive system whereas herbivorous animals have a fermentation money it's just she's just using words that sound bad then she started bringing up putracene and cadaverine which are breakdowns of amino acids every run a Patrick has putracene and cadaverine Joe Rogan has plenty of putracene and cadaverine they're just framing it as something bad this is almost like almost like propaganda they're just saying things that sound bad to scare people like fear-mongering these are normal what's it called these are normal products of amino acid digestion and they're kind of saying they're bad because of how they sound and it's probably working to some people unfortunately it has nothing to do with you know I mean it's probably higher in carnivorous people because they eat more meat but it's just a process of human metabolism human digestion and you know in you it's Eskimos all these indigenous groups eating these foods in large amounts you know it's just missing that that anecdote and then analogy just seems silly and then if we want to bring up the lifespan it will bring up the lifespan of those people in a minute but you know she really did emphasize that this diet might only be good for a once a two-year window and then they started talking about Sean Baker but guys Sean Baker is an athlete a very high-level athlete he follows a not-good version of the carnivore diet so to speak and using him as an example from this diet even Michaela Peterson aren't necessarily the best examples starts comparing fasting remove inflammation went over that she said the diet was risky potentially dangerous and unstudied but you have people literally eating poison sugar vegetable oils refined processed foods fast food saying meat and the only meat diet is worse than the seren American diet to me seems crazy it's just unbelievable setting themselves up for long-term damage going back to there's no data are the perfect skulls of indigenous Eskimos and Native Americans not data you know our is looking at certain groups of people and seeing their skeletal structure and how physically developed they were compared to us and their larger brain size is that not data come on you know the 17th century English had a life expectancy of 35 years old hunter-gatherers if they live to 40 tended to live into their 70s but hunter-gatherers did not die from the generative diseases hunter-gatherers got their skull cracked open by grok unfortunately then they brought up Michaela Peterson giving nutrition counseling and yeah I kind of agree she shouldn't because she had diarrhea for six weeks and didn't know that the only reason you would be having diarrhea for that long of a period of time is that you're allergic to the food it's not a good source of food maybe it's tainted with cross-contamination you're overcooking the food sometimes rendered fat does not digest too well or the fat is too high in omega-6 fatty acids or it could even be a histamine intolerance you should never have diarrhea for more than a day or two on this diet if you eat a food her not knowing that just shows a lack of nutritional knowledge in general you know her sticking with diarrhea for six weeks without trying to say maybe I should try different food maybe I should cook it differently is just to me she should not be giving anyone nutritional advice that's a that's a bit of an understatement and then Rhonda Patrick brought up that she follows modified paleo and I was like oh my god this woman is such a hypocrite you know she's saying that there's no data on the carnivore diet but she follows modified paleo which is like the most criticized diet for not having data to back it up then they started talking about fish oil how it gives a dopamine response in the body and how she takes three to six grams per day and that when they do studies on fish oil they usually only do one gram but three to six grams of fish oil guys is like a few hundred calories worth of mackerel it's not actually a crazy amount but then Joe Rogan asked is there a USDA recommendation for fish oil and she said oh no there isn't because you can convert ALA into omega 3s but Rhonda Patrick was kind of you know she was saying oh you could convert it to EPA and DHA she literally said you can convert ALA to EPA and DHA but it's been shown that in men you cannot raise blood levels of DHA with an ALA supplement and the conversion rate is minuscule you'd have to literally drink like a cup of flax oil every day which is completely crazy her not knowing this and then talking about the importance of fish oil and stuff to me is just so contradictory and then what's even funnier is she says the USDA doesn't recommend fish oil but yet she's taking all this fish oil and then we start talking about vitamin C and vitamin E she's like oh the USDA recommendations are important am I losing my losing brain cells right now I think that's this feeling I have in my brain Jesus start talking about micronutrients the RDAs 30 essential vitamins and minerals to various metabolic functions the prop main problem I have with RDAs is D3 is too low calcium is too high magnesium is a bit unrealistic you know just a lot of the RDAs are pretty incorrect she said this diet oh no the RDAs are set for deficiencies not for optimal health she said that people think their glucose levels are so low on the carnivore diet they don't need vitamin C but that is a part of glucose metabolism requiring vitamin C but all animal tissue has vitamin C you know they kind of made a point that oh if you eat certain organs you'll get vitamin C but all animal tissue has it especially if you're eating three to four pounds of meat a day and if you guys haven't read the fat of the land William R. Stephenson I'm gonna do a video on scurvy in a couple days definitely check it out any fresh food has anti-scorbutic properties the importance of preventing scurvy is more about eating fresh food that's not overcooked as opposed to eating vegetables and fruits scurvy is caused by preserved foods and it sets in with about three weeks I remember on one expedition in that book they got scurvy because they disobeyed orders and only eight preserved foods and scurvy was cured on four days of a raw meat and cooked meat diet literally cured in four days completely they started talking about how spleen liver I don't think they mentioned spleen had vitamin C but liver also has vitamin C this girl eats salmon roe every day and she doesn't know what has vitamin C and vitamin E like are you serious maybe I'm just maybe I'm just too smart who knows maybe I'm the only person in the planet who knows that salmon roe has vitamin E and vitamin C maybe I'm the only person that ever looked at a non USDA nutritional database for vitamins I'm getting tilted man you know I mean for all tissues in the animal for the most part it's but if it's a pastured animal will have some vitamin C and vitamin E you know the various indigenous groups eating these only meat diets not getting scurvy but they did eat both raw and cooked they did eat various head tissues organs and more things like that not just grain fed muscle meat if you ate only grain fed well done muscle meat salted I think you might actually be able to get scurvy like if it was really overcooked like if you ate barbecue every day and that was it like slow cooked barbecue I think you might actually get scurvy vitamin E is another thing she brought up as a very potent antioxidant but same thing with vitamin C it's in those animal foods they just don't know about them and then she brought up I believe folate and said you have to eat like 150 grams of beef liver per day for folate and then she was like who does that I do no I'm joking guys folate is I do eat that much liver but I'm just joking in a sense that you don't have to do that because every animal food pretty much has some amount of folate if you eat like a pound of beef you get like I think 20 to 30 percent of your folate and if most people eat two to three pounds a day and pastured foods have more of all these vitamins you know kidney has folate beef liver salmon row all organ tissues in the animal are much higher in folate than the muscle she mentioned like you're damaging your DNA and you have to eat liver every day to prevent that this is just so crazy oh and an hour and three minutes in he mentioned I follow a young man who advocates eating organ meats what can you say against that and then she said oh well you might not get enough magnesium she kind of started around it too she was like her only rebuttal for someone that ate plenty of organ meats was you're not getting enough magnesium and then it's not practical to eat that many organ meats but magnesium is if you ate two to three pounds four pounds of meat a day with organs you're getting I believe a few hundred milligrams of magnesium so you're gonna get more than almost anyone a standard American diet gets so I don't know why you would criticize magnesium because no one gets no one gets their magnesium RDA on this diet and people that think they're getting that their magnesium RDA are getting it from nuts and seeds that actually have phytic acid so they're not getting as much magnesium as they think there are it's bound to oxalate and phytic acid you think eating a handful of Brazil nuts is giving you magnesium it's not they briefly touched on supplementing but guy supplementing doesn't get tricky check out my electrolytes video to see how complicated supplementing gets with all the chelated minerals glycanate mallet citrate citrate mallet phosphate there's just so many different chelated minerals and each of them respond to the body differently I don't want to give anyone ideas but like potassium citrate is the amount the one that occurs in food naturally there's magnesium glycanate there's just too many supplementing gets too complicated I prefer to use natural foods like seaweed they brought up the future for bacteria and saying that you know it's it's bad for the digestive system but it's just so crazy they're just using words that sound bad that are normal processes of human metabolism she started saying that humans ate these vegetables for phytochemicals polyphenols isoflavones for thousands of thousands of years but we didn't eat these modern cruciferous vegetables that you're telling people to shove down their throats like what are you talking about it doesn't make any sense you're saying we ate you're pretty much saying we ate wild plant foods for thousands of years but eat broccoli which is a man made vegetable and the other constant that we ate for thousands of thousands of years is these animal food so why wouldn't you bring that up too they started talking about studies about the benefits of sulfur urethane but it's like studies like oh if you eat X amount of broccoli sprouts per day your chance of prostate cancer lowers 5% like come come on you know they talked about how it treats autism symptoms and I'm like well I don't see cave paintings of children with autism I don't see any signs of autism in you know indigenous people didn't even know there are some indigenous people that didn't know what insomnia was they literally never had problems sleeping ever in their cultural history you know the humans in their primitive state or absent of these problems I mean a good example like your cats and your dogs will sleep all day you know and I mean that's that's probably not a good example so let's move on to something else I'll start talking about E. coli and and they didn't what bothered me was they didn't know anything about E. coli you know Dr. Rhonda Patrick does all this nutrition research and doesn't know anything about E. coli or where it's from and E. coli isn't is an all digestive systems of animals what makes E. coli harmful is cattle that are fed grains have higher acidity in the stomach and E. coli becomes acid resistant what that does is you know when humans get that train of E. coli it makes them sick and it's in manure and that's how it gets on the veg just because if that's very simple to explain that Joe or Rhonda did not know that to me is a concern and they I mean to me this just seems stage that they don't know they have to Google stuff like that off the top of their head and then she said Sulfuraphane is so beneficial read the studies guys read the studies on Sulfuraphane but she talked negatively about heterocyclic amines which are formed when you cook meat I was like there is specifically a study on heterocyclic amines that says there is insufficient scientific evidence that these genotoxic compounds cause cancer in humans which to me showed she's telling you I'll read the studies on my stuff but she hasn't read the studies on the stuff she's talking negatively about Joe Rogan started talking about how he eats more vegetables than me but calorically speaking he probably eats way more meat than vegetables just from the percentage of calories he's getting from meat then they dismissed the anecdotes of the carnivore diet but then they brought up anecdotes of elimination diets fasting keto so they they're just choosing which anecdotes are good in which anecdotes aren't which is in this very hypocritical they said there were positive benefits like hormesis when stressing your body in certain ways with plant foods but the only benefit for that might be to adapt to future structures but again guys the point is they're referring to plant foods that are man-made all cruciferous which is not what we would have eaten in the wild that's to me that's the whole thing I can't really get past in this argument you're saying all the benefits of plant foods blah blah blah blah but you keep talking about cruciferous vegetables you know you're not talking about roots you're not talking about other there's thousands and thousands of probably other vegetables you could be talking about and eating and fruits but you're just hammering home cruciferous vegetables which doesn't make sense to me really doesn't make sense you know you're not talking about you know you know there's six like at least six different types of wheat right there's iron corn wheat which digests much easier on the stomach there's spelt there's emmer wheat there's chorus on wheat there's different types of winter wheats hard red winter wheat spring wheat there's different types of rise there's different types of the Barley's Fauro there's literally dozens of probably heirloom grains that one properly prepared would be safe to consume but you guys didn't know that maybe you should have me on the podcast and ask me instead of just mentioning me without saying my name they brought up the McKayla Peterson had diarrhea for six weeks and I said that earlier she has no clue what she's doing prolonged fast more than 48 hours is what's considered prolonged fast I fasted for up to two weeks guys I have to do a video on fasting they talk about a fasting mimicking diet for a little bit and at this point this was kind of where carnivore went out the window but they did start talking about DHA and and that's why Ronda Patrick takes a lot of fish oil which I think is a problem because of the questionable rancidity of fish oil and she eats a lot of salmon every day for her DHA so for me to her to talk about all these foods and then say I take a crazy amount of DHA because of how beneficial it is I'm like you're literally consuming a high fat soluble vitamin diet from animal foods but you're speaking against it almost so I don't know I really don't and then and then what bothered me was just the lack of general knowledge you know she eats salmon or every day but doesn't know I curra is salmon eggs I know I'm working in a restaurant I know that stuff but to me that was just a little silly and I've advocated salmon roll for your guys for years guys I'm Mr. Salmon Row I've been talking about salmon rows since like 2015 I always recommended it to people when I started this diet and taking it for a while myself uh you know they hypothesize that uh small percentage of the population is allergic to a lot of plants but guys people are allergic to a lot of things they just ignore low level inflammatory reactions you know people go their whole lives farting terrible and having digestive issues and they don't understand that you could have different degrees of allergies to foods drinking raw dairy might give me insomnia for four days when eating unease might make me fart but those are both technically allergies and even if brain fog from eating wheat is considered not considered an allergy you know you can people can tolerate humans are very resilient they just suffer from things that they're so used to that they don't consider that those are allergy symptoms and they suggested using fasting to fix the gut as opposed to a carnivore diet as a band-aid but a carnivore diet isn't a band-aid it's more of a permanent cast because it removes all inflammation and increases nutrient density if done properly uh then they spoke about the ketones effect on the brain for a while and then they talked about saunas for like 40 minutes so a very typical ronda patrick podcast but this is already way longer than i wanted it to be guys thank you guys for watching i got this got a dynamic microphone because picks up too much the compressor mics the condenser mics uh they pick up too much background noises they could literally pick up like my computer fan it's ridiculous uh no i mean you know this has been kind of i had to i did this response because like he literally mentioned me on the last two carnivore related podcast without saying my name which kind of pissed me off to no end uh to be truthful but what are you gonna do uh so thank you guys for watching if you guys would like to support me i feel like a broken record just share the video i do a new thing on patreon where i will do questions answered for certain amounts of money full diet write-ups partial diet write-ups and one-on-one consultations depending on various degrees of patreon support guys you can check that out the patreon links in the description if you guys would like to reach out to me for one-on-one consultations uh related to diet fitness uh cooking uh whatever it may be guys if you want to just ask me questions about myself uh just shoot me an email frank atufano at gmail.com hey maybe you want to ask me frank how do you get your teeth so white frank how do you do your eyebrows how do you put on your makeup things like that how do you get this ridiculous looking afro hair


With action and suspense out of the Old West comes the most famous hero of them all Huffleong Cassidy starring William Boyd The ring of the silver spurs heralds the most amazing man ever to ride the prairies of the early West Huffleong Cassidy the same hoppy you cheer in motion pictures and the same California You've left at a million times Raw courage and quick shooting have built a legend around this famous hero Huffleong is a name to be feared respected and admired for this great cowboy rides the trails of adventure and excitement William Boyd as Huffleong Cassidy and and declined as California Well hoppy what about our story? It's an adventure. We call gambler's luck and it began with a cattle drive This particular drive was one of the roughest and toughest we were ever on but right up till almost the last one of the nicest It was fun because we were on an errand of mercy you might say Our destination was the horseshoe outfit near the headwaters of the Teton The horseshoe was owned by Ham Irish and his sister Emma Ham and Emma were old friends of ours, but we hadn't seen them in years Huh, I wouldn't miss this for nothing hoppy when we show up with all this beef stuff The look on Ham and Emma's faces is going to be a sight to behold Likely as California, but when I see them they're gonna get a piece of my mind, huh? You ain't mad at them are you? Why shouldn't I be they got in trouble? Why didn't they tell us friends can't help when the helps needed What do they think friends are for oh? For a second there. I thought you were serious. Well, I am kind of hadn't been for slim Gillian I wouldn't have known about this at all slim worked up this way last year didn't yeah last couple of years Said last year's die-up after the freeze was almost the worst anyone could remember though Dead cows were lined up for miles anybody else hit it as bad as Ham and Emma was I doubt it They lost every cow they had They'll have to use this bunch as a starter herd and wait a couple of years before paying us back We're on horseshoe range right now. Do you know that are we sure ever since we passed Willow Creek But I have a real surprise for them before the days out never told him nothing about us coming there Not a word thought I'd get even for they're not telling us anything You'll hear ham you some fancy language. Maybe it's Emma will hear what do you mean look over there see who's coming Well, I'll be that's Emma. Hello there What do you do all renegades doing up this way, but all these cows for not settling here are you know We hadn't planned on that Emma these cows are for you They're what you heard them Emma they're for you the whole darn she bang We drove them clear from the bar 20 clear from the bar 20 Well, I want to know about this you mean ham sent for him and never told me about it Nothing like that Emma. We made up the herd one slim billion tollers about the trouble you're in Don't worry about paying for them though. You can do that when you're back in your feet again Well, I never brought him all the way from the bar 20 just for us and we never even ask you oh Happy this is the nicest thing I ever heard tell of and it's just a shame That's what it is just a rotten dog gone chain a shame What is that you couldn't get here in time? What do you mean? Yep? Yesterday would have been all right Yesterday the horses who still belong to us, but now it don't now belongs to the bank Happy you got here just 24 hours too late To hop along Cassidy and our story gambler's luck It was startling news to hoppy to learn that he and of our 20 trail crew had driven a herd all the way to the horseshoe Only to arrive 24 hours too late When he heard this hoppy pressed Emma for an explanation But true to range custom she refused to say anything more until first she'd taken hoppy in California home And had fed them Now however in the horseshoe spacious kitchen. What are you saying? You haven't lost the horseshoe just as good as hoppy just as good as You see when ham buried that 10,000 years today. He signed a note saying he'd pay it back inside two weeks Now how much chance do you figure two weeks gives us to get any $10,000. What did you put up against it Emma your range and water rights? Yeah, that's right and all our buildings That's all we had left to put up. But well, what was it for Emma? What did ham plan to do with that 10,000 California? I got a brother that was in a heap of ways a darn fine feller But in one way, he's just a plain darn fool gambling. Yeah, that's right. I'll be I can see you remember him Yep, it was a poker game yet. I hankering to sit into See the way he figured was it was either make a killing or go bust And if he didn't take a chance he figured we was bound to go bust anyways, that's too bad Gamblin's a fool's game. He lost a oh wasn't that so much hoppy. It was the way he lost He was cheated out of it.  He's an Easter Amir just a few months back But everybody kind of took a shine to him but ham can prove he was cheated. Oh sure he can he's got the cards It'll prove it. It was marked. Then why don't he go after that Randall ombry and make him give the money back That's what he was trying to do. That's why he ain't here now But I reckon he's got about as much chance of doing it as I'd have a lift in one of them They're bull. Oh why didn't Randall light out sure he did the second he had that cash in his pocket And with that peed horse he's arriving. Wait a second. He was writing a paint. You say that's right. What about it? We saw a man writing a paint yesterday. Remember him california Sure do he was heading down the south bank of the teetan lickety split man in these fifties Was he am I well middle fifties the way I calculated california A real handsome dignify looking feller You really think you saw him sure sure we did. I'm sure of a two emma california We better do something about this. We should hoppy you get back to camp and pick up a two three day supply grub I'll do there All the boys would be gone for a bit but they're to stay here and help emma handle those cowl right and get back here as fast You can I'll be waiting for you. Take me along. I'll be back before you know it Oh hoppy, what are you thinking of you never treat all that feller? He's got a good day start on you I won't have to trailing emma. I think I know where he's going. Where's that fort benton. How come Didn't you say he was an eastern sure I did but hard as that tell you we saw him heading down the teetan The teetan joins missouri at fort benton and fort bentons the head of the navigation in the missouri Hey, you mean you'll go there to grab a steamboat. Of course probably a boat to st. Louis. I'll bet you're right But suppose you do come up with him. Will you know him when you see him? I think so. We got a pretty good look at him yesterday. Well, he's got a day start on you hoppy Maybe you'll miss him. Don't worry about that emma either. We catch him and get that money or or what?  Howdy miss mary Uh, I'll have to ask you to excuse my daughter's veil captain. She's suffered an injury to her eyes. Yes. Yes So my purser told me mr. Randall May I tell you how sorry I am miss Randall. Thank you. That's very kind of you The purser said you wanted to speak to me mr. Randall. Yes, I do captain back How soon do we sail any moment now the pilots just come aboard good Soon over you leave the better You may have noticed captain. I have placed myself here so that I could watch all who came aboard No, no, I hadn't noticed. Uh, you've got some reason for it. I have I'm taking my daughter east so that she may have the services of surgeons Who can restore her sight and as you can imagine it will be expensive. Oh, I don't doubt it That's why I'm carrying this cash box I have ten thousand dollars in here captain And I should hate to lose it If I do Mary must remain blind. Do you see You'd like me to take it for you. No, no, not at all The point is this I have reason to believe that certain men may be following me Who would not hesitate to rob me if they could well I would merely like your assurance that if I find any of them aboard And they try to trouble me I can have your assistance. Of course you can if they try anything. I'll put them under arrest Thank you. That's all I wanted of you captain If that's all then I'll ask you to excuse me. Of course. Goodbye miss Randall It's been a pleasure meeting you. Thank you captain. Goodbye Father we're leaving thank heavens now. We're safe. You're sure of that Randall What who? Who are you the name's cassidy Randall? I'm a friend of ham irish Hey hoppy what are we tying up here for I imagine we're tying up for the night for all night Sure and navigation is too tough on the Missouri to run at night. They always tie up like this And why the wait so long it's black as pitch already imagine the pilot's trying to make time Otherwise we probably would have tied up at that army post we passed Say there's been something I wanted to ask you hoppy You spoke to that Randall fellow right after we started Why didn't you brace him for that money? Why'd you put it off her? Oh, I don't know just what to do, California Notice that young woman with him the one with veil. Yeah, sure. I did. Uh, what about her? That's his daughter I found out about her when I was inquiring after him and ford benton She wears that veil because of an injury to her eyes She's blind. Oh golly hoppy. I didn't know that I imagine that's what he stole the money for Pay for the operations to get her sight back. That makes it tough. We grabbed that money back. She stays blind Huh? Something like that. I guess I can't decide what to do Actually, the money belongs to ham and emma But if we take it back, you can see what it means What would you do? Well Golly, I don't know. I had hoped that you wouldn't know. Oh, uh rando You heard us. I suppose. Yes. Yes, I did When you told me you were a friend of ham irish's I knew of course why you were here Well, you know all the facts now Do you blame me for doing what I did? I wouldn't try to say what I'd do in your place rando The fact remains that you stole money belonging to ham and emma irish What are you going to do about it? Oh, I'm sorry for them, of course Cassidy, but unless you force me I don't intend doing anything about it. No After all to me My daughter comes first Any other question is what do you propose to do? Well, as I told california, I haven't decided yet Still I still let money has to go back here. It should shouldn't it? Well, I thank you for listening to me anyhow, cassidy And thank you for not exposing me before my daughter. I couldn't have done that rando and I appreciate it Now if you'll excuse me, I'll go back to my cabin Perhaps you'll have made up your mind by morning.  You may be sure of that Tough spot, huh, hoppy. It sure is. I don't know what to do I'd like to think it over a little longer You want to run along and see if they've fed the horses. Sure. Sure. Well, where they got them? Well, they always keep horses wagons and things like that on the main deck just below us Going down have a look. All right. I'll do that. Uh, you coming down. I'll see you in our cabin, right? California What happened? Where are you? Hey What is it california? You hurt what turn around cassidy? Why you take it? Oh Sorry cassidy, but you and your partner were becoming troublesome I'm afraid you'll have to die Back to hop along cassidy and our story gamblers luck Only a few minutes have passed since hoppy answering a call for help from california Found himself attacked from behind by jefferson randall A moment later depending on the heavy spring tide current to carry them to their death Randall dragged hoppy and california to the rail and dropped them overboard the sudden plans restored hoppy to consciousness. However now We're almost ashore you've been waiting out here. Hold on to me How you feel rotten? I feel like I've got my head half split open How you feeling mine was split open the other half Ah here we are Let me take a look at you. It's a dog on dark. I don't think you can see anything. Ah, you see a little Ah, it's not bad Skin's broken.  I think that fella really tried to kill us Sure, he did. I think he'd have taken a chance to shot see to use these gun Probably is afraid to risk it and I wish wasting my time being sorry for that scum. I didn't I was sorry for his daughter. I still am. Well, what are we gonna do now? I think we'll stay right here where we are for a while. We Well, what for? Well in the first place if randall wants us dead I think it'll be a good idea to let him think we are what goodle that do It may make it easier to get that money back Getting it back shouldn't be hard All we have to do is to go to the captain and tell him the truth about it He might not believe us, but he'd have to investigate wouldn't he sure Then mary randall would know that her father is a thief Well, well, well indeed, of course he is Well, he only became one in order to help her didn't he? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. You're right What's your idea then? Well to stay ashore so randall's convinced. We're not coming back Then go back aboard the bottle. Just stay there till morning. Sure. It will And when we're bored, we'll see if we can't get into randall's cabin and get that money box Won't he be guarding it thinking us dead? I don't think so It's our best chance at any rate Then he can tell his daughter the money was stolen or anything he wants to She won't have to know the truth at least it still bothers me about that money being meant for to fix her eyes, hobby Ah, it does me too But it belongs to ham and amma doesn't it? What else can we do? Hurry it up. Here's our cabin All right, open it up. Go on in we can get off before they start up I don't think so sounds like there was given orders to start up when we came in Yeah, yeah, we're starting now. That's all right. Then we'll get off the next landing Come on. Let's get our gear together. We can What was that somebody now, but who saw us come aboard? I didn't think nobody did Right here randall. How did she know we were in here? I don't know She couldn't have seen us. Hey, she can't even see Let me in mr. Cassidy. I've got to talk to you. If you don't I'll go for the captain No use keeping her out. Just a mullet. Good morning, mr. Randall Come in Here, I'll give you a hand There There's a chair here Thank you. I wonder how you knew we were here. Why shouldn't you have been? But anyhow, I heard your voices You see that's one of the advantages of being blind mr. Cassidy It heightens your other senses. Yes, of course, but what did you want? I happen to know that you and your friend are thieves, mr. Why they ain't a way to know he was denying it.  Cassidy and that is To appeal to your better nature. Oh if you're prepared to steal now I have no doubt that you've often stolen in the past I would like to think that you have the strength of character to reform But at any rate I appeal to you on this occasion to let my father alone If you don't yes, I promise you you'll regret it. Perhaps I will that's all you have to say Yes, I'll be going now But there's one thing more What is that I'll be dining with my father at noon today. I would like you to join us In fact, I'll be expecting you. Thank you. Maybe I will.  Cassidy You see, I know you've already stolen If you don't I'll have to inform captain Beck I'll be she knows about the money. Yeah, I know she does california This changes things This changes things a lot Rather surprised to see us Randall. All right.  Thank you. We will I'm very glad that you and mr. Carlson have accepted my invitation. Mr. Cassidy You've brought the money. No miss Randall. No, I haven't I have decided to keep it. I see You leave me no choice. I've already spoken to captain Beck, mr. Cassidy Now I shall have to ask him to arrest you I don't think your father would like you to do that miss Randall. Why not? I don't think he'd care to have you know. He's a thief. Hey hoppy hoppy. You're telling her I thought we agreed that you'll have to let me handle this california But don't call it as I said I'll handle it. Yeah, miss Randall I've told you the truth. I am not the thief Your father I don't believe it captain back.  You'll prefer the charges. Yes. I know Just a moment captain. You better let me explain. No explanations needed Cassidy. No. No, don't try to draw I have you covered I'd suggest that you surrender without making trouble Once the people aboard this boat know what you've done You'll be lucky not to be lynched Now back to hop along Cassidy Poppy the captain wasn't kidding any about this bunch being ripe for a lynching. Do you mean business? And so do I but you shouldn't have Hey, wait a second. This is trouble All right, you fellas get back the whole pack of you get back now get back Just one of you come a step closer and he'll get drilled. No trouble now. No trouble I'll handle this hoppy. Come on. Why don't we get the chance? I'm staying here.  Why they'll just keep captain back here covered. Don't let him interfere All right now miss Randall This is between you and me. I want the truth. You stop him. He's fighting his gun with me Stop him. Stop him hoppy. You're gone clean shot crazy. I know what I'm doing I thought that might work miss Randall Now tell me something How did you know I was pointing these guns at you? You're blind. You claim you are anyway How could you know when I was doing with these guns? I think we'll find out just what is wrong with your eyes miss Randall Let's see what's behind that failure wearing. No, don't Ha ha ha just as I thought your eyes are as good as mine You were only pretending to be blind. That veil was a fake No, no, no just a moment just a moment, please Who are you? Well, my name is pete peterson cap. I'm a miner from up denverway and uh And who did you say this young woman was? Frisco sal except now couldn't recognize her as long as she was wearing that veil you You know her a nor oh, I should say so I was there when they run her out of julesburg Just give me a couple of minutes and I'll round up a dozen of the boys that used to know her You go ahead and do that peterson in the meantime captain. You'd better keep an eye on this pair. Yeah Yes, yes, I do believe I had Draw gone hoppy when you pull that trick on her with your guns You know she could see but what I don't see is uh, how you know I've known it since she called on us this morning. If she couldn't see How could she have known that we already had her father's money box? Well, well, I'll be during the course course and I never got it What do you got to say now miss randall or whatever your name is what I've got to say is to this sucker I was working with so you told me I couldn't get in any trouble. Did you You've worked this trick a dozen times on the mississippi had you I don't say anything sal. Don't say anything. I'll say plenty Pacity all this was was a trick to play for sympathy. He called it an insurance If the fella he stole from caught up with him. He figured he'd be so sorry for us. He wouldn't do anything I thought so better take him away captain. Keep him under guard. All right. I'll turn him over to the authorities at the next landing Come along you I Got our apologize You know, I figured that was a dirty trick you was doing when you started telling her about her power being crooked I just wanted to see how far she'd play along with him. I had an idea that sooner or later She'd do some talking. She did plenty. That's right plenty Enough to send her and randall to jail and us back to the horseshoe with ham's money Ha ha Even a clever gambler hasn't a chance when hoppy gets on his trail So hop along cassidy brings to an end a gambler's luck In their next story hoppy in california become involved with a band of border outlaws and it is called danger wears two faces Hop along cassidy starring william void is transcribed and produced in the west by walter white jr Gambler's luck was written by gibson scott fox with original music under the personal direction of albert glasser All stories are based upon the characters created by clarence e mulford. This is a commodore production