Hey, it's Monday night time for voiceover body shop. We got a superstar with us tonight That's right right here in the studio right here in the studio joining us here in Sherman Oaks in our one little studio Scott bricks gonna be with us tonight We're gonna talk about audio books and some other cool stuff that he's doing right now Which would be really cool very nice tech wise anything interesting going on well I was just at any be so I'm sure I'll come up with some talk about something That I thought was interesting of course all right all that and more coming up on voiceover body shot We'll be right here right now two men Twin sons from different mothers with a passion for voiceover recording technology and the desire to make recording easy for voice actors everywhere together in one place George Whidham the home studio engineer to the stars a Virginia Tech grad with an unmatched knowledge of all the latest gear and technology in voiceover today Dan Leonard the home studio master a voice actor with over 30 years experience in Broadcasting and recording and a no-holds-barred myth-busting attitude for teaching you how easy it is together to bring you all the latest technology today's voiceover superstars and Leaving the discussion on how to make the most of your voiceover business This is voiceover body shop Voiceover body shop is brought to you by voice over essentials comm home of Harlan Hogan signature products Source elements remote connections made even easier Vio to go go dot com everything you need to be a successful voiceover artist J. Michael Collins demos award-winning demo production voice actor websites dot com where your voice over website won't be a pain in the butt and voiceover extra your daily resource for V.O. success And now live from their super-secret multimedia studio in Sherman Oaks, California Here are George Whidham and Dan Leonard Hey, I'm Dan Leonard and I'm George Whidham and this is voiceover body shop or V.O. BS Alright Well, we've reached another Monday night in our seventh year of doing this show and I'm back in the studio. Thank goodness It's good to have you back You know, it's it's lonely one year when you're not here. Of course. We had about 10 people in here last week Tim Friedlander and I made things too low. Yeah, no, I mean we had people stuffed in here It looked like the state room scene for monkey business. It was it was pretty bad in here. Anyway Tonight on our show Scott Brooks gonna be joining us. We're gonna talk about audiobooks and a book. He just wrote Amazing.  Okay. Well, that's cool. All right. Well, let's get the show on the road here It's now time for A New article now on voiceover extra reports that 10 women have charged Rofae With sexual assault in a class action suit that was filed in New York's Manhattan Supreme Court on March 6th Against Rofae's company PDR voice incorporated formally located in Manhattan Rofae moved his company and studio to a nearby Irving New York in 2016 My aim is for Rofae to face public legal repercussions for his crimes Engelman tells voiceover extra news media coverage is helpful But trial by court of law is the way we recognize crimes in our society. She says I want myself and other women to have justice As reported earlier by voiceover extra in recent months many women have revealed being sexually harassed or assaulted by Rofae It was a prominent voice actor producer and trainer in the New York City area during voiceover training sessions with him From the early 2000s to September 2017 his PDR voice website is no longer available Engelman says that the late last year the news about Hollywood's Harvey Weinstein's predatory behavior triggered a suppressed memory of my assault. I immediately told my husband and close friend who both urged me to call a lawyer for the possibility of Pressing criminal charges, she said, but the statute of limitations had just run out for her to charge Rofae personally So Engelman's New York City attorney Jordan Merson took a different tact and filed a class action suit involving Rofae's company We won't get into the gritty details here of what happened during the assault That's in the article But attorney Merson's charge is that the company PDR voice had a duty to supervise Rofae's behavior and did not which resulted in the sexual assaults Merson says other victims of Rofae should know that for the first time there is a path to justice that they can choose to take And as unbelievable as this sounds to most of us There is still ignorance in this world about who's truly at fault in cases of sexual assault Peter Rofae was an incredibly smart manipulator says one of the women in the class action suit And I hope people don't blame the victims because trust me. We've blamed ourselves for long enough for long enough time We don't need anyone else to do it for us Information on joining the suit plus an interview with Engelman and another woman who has joined the suit is in the article at voiceover extra Com PS you want to check the voiceover extra website daily for industry's latest news and resources Well, it's one of the heaviest pieces of news to hit our business boy. I think almost ever. Yeah, you know, it's made me You know think twice. I'm a big hugger.  I don't know. I don't know either I think we all just have to be way hell a heck of a lot more sensitive, I guess to these things than we ever were before Yeah, well speaking about people you were around probably millions of people in Vegas last week while you were at M. A. B It was it felt like it No, I got to head up to NAB and Was able to be accompanied with by Maxine and it was wonderful because she was there to help me shoot video Video I have not yet gotten to produce But there will be video on George the tech and I'll get the best pieces to air on the show But some of the stuff that you might be tuning in to see at some point I had a great interview with Randy Thomas who was there actually representing a podcast and she actually did an episode of her podcast at the show that was pretty cool and I also got to see a few of the broadcast side of things in terms of mixers One of the one of the mixers I looked at was from a company called Arrakis and The reason I I'm kind of gravitating or liked looking at those mixers. First of all, you're not going to see them at NAM Anything for radio broadcast doesn't show up at NAM So I was really focused on seeing what I could find at NAB that I was not going to see at NAM or AS Because the thing is if I get if I went right to the audio hall I'd see the same stuff over and over same booth same guys more months ago three months ago Right, so I hung out in radio and it was great because I did talk to some of these broadcasts board makers And the things that set those boards apart is they're designed for Simplicity first of all, which is I think what draws me to them as a possible board for someone doing a voiceover studio or a podcast Right, you know, they're very simple. They don't have the rows of knobs that this board has for example This has got covered with knobs our board the XB 10 made by Alan and Heath It's this weird Amalgamation between a broadcast console and like your traditional Mackey mixer style thing with Auction sends and EQs and everything right and the boards I was looking at didn't have any of those it had a volume slider for each input Right, it had an on button to turn on the channel and they had three buttons at the top for program Mm-hmm and monitoring or cue cue, right? That's it And so the simplicity of it is one thing that made it really really appealing to me But it was also the fact that these boards are made for extremely heavy-duty use They're designed to be used day in day out and the faders the little sliders the buttons are of a high quality They should last for years and years without any problems, which is the point with broadcast equipment Right, so if you have a studio that does have the likes of a Mackey mixer If that's the heart of your studio and buttons on it are getting scratchy and pots are getting scratchy You feel like you have to replace it every I don't know three to four years It might be worth the investment to go to a board like this.  I'm not it's built right in Bluetooth is in the board So there's some pretty cool features coming down the pipeline and someone that needs to do a little bit more Complicated studios more than a typical voice actor might like something like that. Yeah, and you know and speaking of on the road We have a Harlan Hogan's Set up here. He loves to talk about how an ironing board is your friend in a hotel room I have to agree with that, you know We have made use of those and studios on the road all the time and for ironing shirts, too Which is really important for those big important meetings, but he's got his his The port of Ruth pro this is the plus act as the plus which is a great unit and But we can talk about that a little bit later when we come to Harlan's commercial for voice over essentials The other thing I saw before we run out is a source elements had a new version of their soft software called nexus It's nexus 1.2 and what's cool about nexus 1.2 Okay, again kind of a niche thing but for people that do production like podcasting or engineering and recording You can have any Software like chrome Skype IPTL show up as inputs and outputs in your DAW Hmm, so like in Pro Tools you could have a channel dedicated to Skype And it would have a dedicated input and output that sends audio back and forth between Skype and Pro Tools So Skype in essence appears as like a plug-in right in Pro Tools. Cool. The plug-in is nexus So this is new it used to be you can only have two pairs of Like two channels of audio assigned at any one time now You can have many channels of audio all custom names so you can keep track of what's what what an amazing age we live in Nothing else they had at the show. They were ready to like formally announced like they were two early days But source connect for is in the pipeline and there's gonna be some pretty big innovations there So when there's when we can announce those we certainly will well clearly they're getting traction now with the product with ISD and sort of Slowly crawling off the cliff. It's not falling off.   They were doing it all over cellular modems. Oh So it's the inside that hall. It's like a mile long exactly. It's pretty darn impressive. So everybody on their phone Alrighty, so we'll have some video of that in the future in a future show. Hopefully next week. Great. Can't wait to see it All right. Well, we've got a People have been asking about markers. Yeah, so we're gonna talk a little bit about markers in our next segment So stay tuned. We'll be right back here on voiceover body shot Minus far we at minus 4 DB we're at minus 4 DB on VLBS Yeah, hi, this is Carlos L is Rocky the voice of Rocco and you're watching voiceover body shot Minus far we at minus 4 DB. We're at minus 4 DB on VLBS Yeah, hi, this is Carlos L is Rocky the voice of Rocco and you're watching voiceover body shot Minus far we had minus 4 DB. We're at minus 4 DB on VLBS Hey, what question do we get the most often far and away It's how do I even get started in voiceover? And we have a great answer to that question take VO to go goes free getting started in VO class You heard right Free gratis. Nothing. It's available online 24-7 at getting started in VO dot-com That's getting started in VO dot-com If you've been watching VOBS and thinking that you need to get in gear and start your own voiceover career This is the class you should start with you'll learn about the vocal skills You need the storytelling skills you need the equipment you need and the business skills You need all in one single comprehensive online class taught by VO to go goes David H. Lawrence the 17th This class won the backstage readers choice award four years in a row and again, there's no charge It's absolutely free want to take it? Sure you do getting started in VO dot-com. That's getting started in VO dot-com As a voice talent you have to have a website But what a hassle getting someone to do it for you and when they finally do they break or don't look right on mobile devices They're not built for marketing and SEO. They're expensive You have limited or no control and it takes forever to get one built and go live So what's the best way to get you online in no time? Go to voice actor websites dot-com like our name implies voice actor websites dot-com just does websites for voice actors We believe in creating fast mobile friendly responsive highly functional designs that are easy to read and easy to use You have full control no need to hire someone every time you want to make a change And our upfront pricing means you know exactly what your costs are ahead of time You can get your voice over website going for as little as 700 dollars So if you want your voice actor website without the hassle of complexity and dealing with too many options Go to voicehactor websites dot-com where your VO website shouldn't be a pain in the you know what All righty. We're back here on voiceover body shop and uh, you know What our phone never stops ringing and the email just piles up I was troubleshooting something or as we were prepping for the show Part of the reason we're late tonight. Yeah, not the whole reason whoever that was. It's your fault uh anyway, but um But you know, it's not easy if you really don't know what's going on with starting a home studio People are incredibly to intimidated by it. Yeah, and george and I like to make it easy for you And one of the ways you can do that is by contacting one of us And hiring us to help you with your home voiceover studio if they want to work with george, what do they do? Joe they go over and visit george the tech dot-com on the web And uh everything that you wanted to know about my services how to get a hold of me how to schedule me Uh, what types of services I offer my rates Everything it's over there. Um, and hopefully you'll find a service that fits your need and if you don't There's a little little little uh window that window that pops up at the bottom right of the screen The contact area you can send me a note. We'll find you what you're looking for Cool. All right. Have a two dan. Well george, uh, if you want to get a hold of me All you have to do is go over to home home voiceover studio dot-com. Uh, it's only one home home voiceover studio dot-com and uh, and I will uh, I I think both of us are probably the best people in the business when it comes to Turning calls answering emails answering questions And teaching people how to do this properly. It's not rocket science kids But uh, we could at least are the rocket engineers that you Not rocket science for you The idea for us is to have learned the right and wrong ways to do everything so that we can distill all that information down to teach you Exactly the right things that you need to know right a lot of what we do is what's important is what we don't tell you A lot of you know, that's a real important thing You can tend to go out on the web and google this stuff And yeah, you're gonna find a wealth of information But you're gonna find a lot of stuff you don't need to know right and that's gonna overwhelm you right so enough for the plug I think they get the point. Okay. What are we talking about tonight? Well tonight people have been asking about marking their their waveforms and Here we have an example of uh This is uh Audacity don't use the actual marker on you didn't you don't know now I'm at markers where you can see things on the waveform in the dump On on your desktop Now audacity is different from the rest of them. It's kind of different. Yeah, everything a little bit different Right now in audacity the way you do it is you add another track at the bottom here, which you can you can see here And I mean, but once that Yeah, and you can Place and you hit M and create the marker there But the label track it's a label change could actually when they're labeled it as lay them around Yeah, but They're they're designed to work with specific types of other programs. They're not flash cues So they're you know, maybe you can use them to to mark where things are But they're not really useful other than that. They stay within the world of audacity That is a proprietary marker Thing for audacity, right? Whereas if you make markers in soundforge, which is a two track editor or twisted wave and your audition, right? Those markers that you see there right there There are those markers there Those little red markers they're gonna show up in another editor like soundforge or in audition The markers carry along because they're embedded in the wave file itself, right? And so the big difference between the two Learning curve, yes, but the point is is that the another important point is that the audacity markers They stay locked in time with the timeline. So whatever wherever they are in the time The markers stay put So what happens is in audacity if you delete a chunk of audio five seconds of audio And everything moves together, right?  They call it shuffling It shuffles over The markers stay where they were in the timeline, right? So all of a sudden they don't line up with anything On the audio track and it could drive you insane Whereas in something like twisted wave Or audition right those markers are really attached to the wave itself, right? They're actually flash cues And so and a standard thing throughout the throughout the industry that other computers and other software were recognized When you say flash blue cues is that like flashes and flash coding? Yes, like adobe flash exactly. I got you. Yeah, right? Exactly. So in adobe audition They're great and Somebody showed me something a couple months ago where you can actually create a marker and then create a range with that marker And so if you're doing like three takes of a spot or something like that and you do like seven takes you pick the best three You can put those markers over each one of those and so you just export by ranges And yes, and you can name those markers and it's fabulous. Yes And that is markers In a nutshell and in audacity and twisted wave and that's how they all interact with each other and how they all interact. Well scott Scott brick is is sitting patiently by yes. He is a real pro. He is And we're gonna get to talk to him about his career and all the cool stuff He's doing right now and I know all those audiobook people aren't there just waiting with baited breath Whatever the heck that means Just talk to scott here. So he can explain. Yeah, maybe maybe he knows he's a smart guy He's got book learning. All right. We'll be right back here on voiceover body shot Are you confused about how to set up and maintain a professional quality voiceover studio? No wonder the information out there is mostly Mythology This is the best microphone to use. You'll have to have a preamp. You need a soundproof booth This software is the best your audio must be broad cast quality Consult with someone who knows the truth someone who's been there in the trenches doing voiceover for over 30 years Someone with unparalleled experience with voiceover studios Who's worked with hundreds of voice actors and designed hundreds of personal studios? He knows how to teach and cares about your success In one of the harshest environments known to voiceover your home Dan Leonard the home studio master Separate myth from fact and get a handle on your personal voiceover studio Contact the home studio master at home voiceover studio dot com drop off a specimen of your dry audio for a free Hey guys, I'm here to tell you about our wonderful sponsors source connect Well actually source elements That create source connect and their software is the key tool you need to have in a professional voice actor studio Whether it's your home studio A personal studio production studio commercial studio every studio should have source connect at this point Because it's becoming rapidly the standard for live voiceover recording sessions done around the world It's quickly replacing ISDN. I think there's a seed change that we've seen and now source connect is Clearly the one that most of the big time studios and many smaller ones have adapted So if you want to get in on that and be available for more work Your agent may be told you if you don't decide for source connect. You can't get this kind of work Now's the time you can go to source dash elements dot com and get a 15 day free trial of source connect standard You don't need pro for voiceover just standard and you can start using it right away You don't even need one of those little iLock dongly things you've probably heard about So go give it a try and total me sent you and we're gonna be right back with scott dan here in the studio We're back You know scott brick has recorded bestsellers and Pulitzer prize winners for every major publisher over 850 titles including mystic river farenheit 451 one of my favorites in cold blood and helter skelter In addition to over 50 earphones awards and grammy nominate a grammy nomination He also received five audio awards including two for his work on the dunes saga Gee we talked about iraq as i'm like desert planet His work has been profiled in the wall street journal the los angeles times and entertainment weekly And in 2012 publishers weekly named scott their audiobook narrator of the year for the second time In 2015 scott began teaching the nation's first fully accredited university course in audiobook narration At ucla and let's welcome to our show scott brick Welcome. Thank you for having me. It's great to be back. Yeah, we Yeah, haven't seen you since since I was in buffalo. I think Yeah, a couple times at the live appearances at the you know conferences, but yeah, those were those were always fun So you're clearly an accomplished guy, you know with with the audiobook business But where are you from originally? How did you get into that? I'm from santa barbara Okay, just up the shore just up the street a little bit. Yeah about an hour and a half away and uh I went to ucla as a as an undergrad and um the friends I made there we would play baseball every you know Saturday And with all my stage work, they'd come to see me in in a number of productions over the years and uh There was a guy who would play with us named bob westall Blessings on bob westall. Yeah, that that man will drink free for the rest of his life anytime i'm around um, he worked for a company called dove audio and uh Uh, I said, you know one of these days. I should get you an audition an audition for them.  Yeah, so tell him how many books have you done? I don't keep a firm track. Uh, basically I do a book every week. So Every new year I basically add 50 to the title, you know To the official tally I should say so but it's about 850 more or less That's a lot of books. So obviously you like to read and you and you get to read the best literature that's out there Most of the time they pay me to be well read. It's a very interesting phenomenon. Yeah The the audiobook business has gone through some major gyrations in the last few years and of course Maybe we're talking about two different businesses. A lot of people I talk to are like I'm getting into read doing audiobooks and they're they're doing the royalty shares and that's not the stuff You're doing you're doing the stuff for the major publishers and Mostly but I do royalty share books occasionally You just have to be smart about which you know, which ones you want to do but yeah, I get I get approached. Um, sometimes I'll do a Oh god, uh a hybrid deal, you know, they'll pay me the profanished hour, but they'll also offer some of the back end right, um you know At this point in my career, I want to work on the books that I love All right, and you don't always get to do that. You don't get to do that actually Well, anywhere near often enough, but uh Uh, yeah, so I'm open to all of it, but primarily most of the work I do is for the major publishers. Yeah, okay So what is the state of the audiobook business? It continues to expand like the universe or you know, uh Pat fraily one of my favorite people, uh, we I heard him say one several times Uh The current state of audiobooks and the work available in audiobooks right now There hasn't been an opportunity like this for entertainers Since The early days of film when they were still called the flickers right and you had guys walking out to hollywood bolivar It's saying you you look like you could be a cowboy. I'll make you a star. Come on in, you know Seriously, there are so many books out there that need to be done with self-publishing the way it is Right, there's no way that you can meet the demand the insatiable demand of you know The subscribers on audible.com or on itunes. So there's a ton of work to be ahead Mm-hmm. Yeah, you know good paying work and not so good paying work, you know, that's the thing That's that's why you know a revenue share is going to be a risk because there's no track record Maybe this guy is self-published. Maybe it's a debut novel and they have no way of knowing how much it's going to sell What are you working on right now? You can't tell us. Well, I can I can tell you um, I'm finishing up tomorrow The latest tom klancy Uh, um God a point of contact. I sorry I'm I I kind of they kind of Run together. I've done so many of them over the years I'm starting to get the titles confused, but I'm doing the latest jack ryan and jack ryan jr. Book for tom klancy Uh, I just finished up um six clive kustler backlists And I actually I can't talk about it yet. I'm going to announce it soon on my youtube channel plug um But I just got cast this last week in one of the coolest books one of the best-selling books of the 20th century And I can't talk about it yet, but I am looking forward to this like I haven't looked forward to a book in years Yeah, sounds like you really like these these spy novels and that sort of thing What what is the essence of those books that you like so much or? You know, I what I love um I love two things. I love it, uh All storytelling is manipulation I just and I'm fine with that just Artfully manipulating, you know I like it when when an author is able to do that and mike madden who's writing the tom klancy series now She's really good at that and he's also really good at surprising me Which is again another thing I look for in a in a mystery or a thriller That's what makes me just excited to go to work every day. Yeah It's all about storytelling all voiceover is about storytelling even if it's 30 seconds or 15 seconds You're still telling a story. Yeah In the audiobook business, of course is telling a much longer story Do you I I would imagine you read a whole book before you you start to to work on it There's probably a whole production process to it. What's it like? Well, it's it's different on every depending on the type of book Um, you know with a nonfiction book basically You need to just make sure that you've got all the pronunciations and you know, right because if it's a book about You know a war, you know how it turns out, right? Um, but if it's fiction, absolutely You know read the book first Um, sometimes I'm hiring people to read the book for me who giving you the cliff, you know, sir Yeah, because um, I don't have the time to do all the research myself So I hire a I've got basically and I don't want to say like a full-time staff But I've got a number of vendors that I deal with all the time uh because If it's a who done it, you need to know who done it, you know You need to know who the red herring characters are so that you can make sure that you make them seem like they're the villain You need to know who the real villain is so that you can make them seem milder mother's milk So it's a huge surprise. Um, so yeah, you really do need to research The entire story all the way through. Yeah How do you like to tell a story? What's what's your process for for?  You know, so I know it's the million dollar question, but well, I I do something and and um Some of my colleagues laugh at me But occasionally I will uh try to prepare myself not just with the the hard research and making sure they're okay It's the city of houston, but hauston street in new york, you know, you go for those little details those pitfalls but You have to prepare the text, but I I try to prepare myself I try to prepare my mood if i'm working in a genre that i'm not familiar with I'll try to immerse myself in it Um and the story I typically tell is when I was recording a richard matheson book called stirrup echoes Uh, which I had read when I was in college. It's uh an amazing ghost story written in the 50s And it's told first person and it's just this descent into the terror of an adult who doesn't know how to help his child He like most people he does not believe in ghosts and yet His his four-year-old son starts speaking in the voice of an 80 year old dead woman So he becomes terrified as he tries to find a way to save his son's life and So what I did in order to prepare myself because I don't typically work in horror Um the night I decided to record it at night And at about 9 p.m.  Yeah, um Then I went downstairs and at midnight the very witching hour of the night I started recording in my home studio all alone In the dark because I I knew that if I felt afraid I would sound afraid And uh the next night I did the same I recorded till about 5 a.m. And then um the next night I watched the ring And I started recording again and nobody Who listens to that audiobook is gonna go ah he watched the shining or he watched the ring But audiobooks is It's a type of storytelling where subtlety plays and so you little things like that. I think make a difference Um You were a classically trained actor. You were talking about that earlier.  I've got the desire every day Yeah, I did 10 years in a traveling Shakespeare company. I did a ton of classics. I played serena At a theater in Santa Monica mumble mumble years ago. Um I haven't been on stage in I think it's been 11 years I adapted some uh an orson orson scott card short story for a night of short stories written by by scott and um It's been since then that I've been on stage and I think about it all the time but it's You know you play in a role like sereno. You're you're raising your voice, you know yelling at times for three and a half hours Right going into the studio the next day Problematic. So uh one day soon. I hope to yeah, it's great fun. You know when you haven't done it for a while Yeah, you're backstage again. You go. Oh, this is why I like this is where I feel at home Right. Yeah, exactly. It's like, you know, it's like stepping out into an aquarium. There's just and there's like this magic behind stage It's like yes Yeah, but you know, so maybe I can urge you to do it again. Oh in a heartbeat. That would be wonderful Yeah, great stuff. You can see here in this you in southern california. Oh, I know. Yeah, absolutely So a great production of don Giovanni Over the weekend. Oh, did you yes? It was done in gangst 30s gangsters Seriously, yeah, and they did it at a warehouse in like He's still is this still running. It's uh next weekend. Oh, I gotta see specific opera company. Oh, that sounds wonderful Get it on gold star. You'll sit in the back, but you'll get to see who shares. Absolutely Uh, anyway, if you're just joining us and wondering what the heck is going on We're talking with scott brick who is uh Acclaimed audiobook narrator and if you got a question for him, put it in the chat room bring it. Yeah, and uh, he'll be happy to answer it for us So, uh, just go to the chat room jack daniel is as again as he usually is doing his amazing job As our social media director or social media social media Tsar that's your official title. There you go. There you go. All right And he will relay that question to us and scott will answer that very question that you ask um You're also teaching and uh, how many students you're working with these days? I teach the third year grad students at ucla In audiobook narration. There's a it's a class in audiobook narration. What are these people Finishing up their grad work it that they would be there in it's in the theater department. Okay So it's kind of crazy, especially for somebody who went to ucla the idea that uh, I mean, I never went for an advanced degree I never graduated. Okay, you know the idea that third year grads can't get their diploma until they go through me That's just kind of crazy Um, but it's wonderful and it's inspiring because most of them are you know at some point in their late 20s early 30s They've been in the workforce already and it shows to go back for advanced training Uh, they're motivated and they're so gifted and so I get to work with them Just one quarter a year and I typically get eight students at a time Yeah, uh, and then of course in addition to the the weekend events that I do seminars where I teach or private students But um Yeah, there's always a fluctuating amount. Yeah having been a teacher There's nothing beats if you're if you're a ham to start with You know, if you're really a show business guy getting in front of a class is like well, hey I tell you know, it's a cliche that you You never learn as much as when you're teaching but I can tell you from personal experience When I started teaching with when pat fraily invited me to teach with him the first time I realized this is a man Who has curricularized? voiceover yeah, and and I it's When I started listening to You know the things that he was saying he would point things out about my style And he would say, you know, I've noticed that you do this and I've noticed that you that actually sounds like pat Yeah, um And whatever he would make an observation I would say Of course I do that's exactly what I do and that's exactly why I did it I'm just trying to keep up with them, but since then it's kind of tuned my my ear and my brain to notice that in in myself and in others and Uh, I don't know. I guess I became a disciple of Of at least you know his teaching method and uh, it's really assisted me as I've been working with with students Yeah, who are some of the great people you've worked with that you've learned stuff from?   He we stay in his guest room Typically whenever we head back to new york And there's just something about You know being somebody's guest room where with bookshelves all over the walls And yeah, there's like a half a dozen audio wards the audiobook industry awards And you know, it's nice to see those but then there's also the three Grammys Just hanging around right, you know, he uses a doorstop for his bathroom, you know Not really, but he's just he's just it's just that He's just that laid back about it and he is uh, he's a marvelous teacher and I remember Oh god, it was about uh Five six years ago Uh, he came to la for the first time to teach a class And I'd never worked with him because again, he's new york based and I'm in la and When I heard about it, I came out, uh, I came down there I signed up and I show up and he says to me how many books have you done? I said and I was like 500 at that point.  And I said Because I want to get better You know, I think performers you should never stop learning. Absolutely, you know And any working actor in Hollywood will tell you that they've got classes they go to every week Whenever they're not, you know off on location, right? So it's continuing education and and paul is amazing And a lot of other the teachers that I do that I work with uh fellow narrators colleagues of mine Johnny Heller, Sean Allen Pratt um, I've done events with them and uh You know, Sean Allen Pratt does a uh His curriculum is he teaches only nonfiction audiobook narration And he's broken it down into like, you know, the five voices narrative voices of nonfiction I'm like, you've got to be kidding me. Uh, you know, who comes up with this who curricularizes this kind of stuff Um, I had to slip that word in a second time um But yeah, I really respect and admire that and I learn a lot from them when when we teach together. Yeah It's it's a fun business.  Uh, um apac the audio publishers association conference And then I'll go to be a the book expo america. Um, which is typically, you know starts the next day And I'll go and I'll do personal appearances there. Um Uh, I'm getting flown later this year to, um new orleans, I believe to talk about a couple of eric larson books the devil in the white city and dead wake and those are typically the um The events where I meet fans most of the audiobook conferences that I go to are things like, you know You go to vio atlanta and and that's voiceover and actually johnny heller and I we run a conference Twice a year, uh, just a just a business conference Just the business of audiobooks because like you were saying, you know revenue share. How do you make that profitable? Right, so we put a whole panel together around that around, you know, should you incorporate that kind of thing But that's where you meet colleagues rather than right fans. Yeah, and that that's yeah And meeting the colleagues is half the fun of going. Oh, I know.  That's right Yeah, you know, and you get to see the conferences, right? Yeah Again, we're talking with scott brick and you got a question for him throw it in the chat room We're going to take a break right now and when we return we'll get to some of your questions And we'll talk about all sorts of cool stuff. So Skittles taste the rainbow She has fought for those who don't have a voice the national zoo Because sometimes you just need to stroke a llama instagram Downloaded and started embarrassing your teenagers today resolve spot and stain Because the dog's gonna drag his butt on the carpet. He just is That's what the mayor wants you to pay for a new basketball stadium Chickens were made to be fried.  Hey, I'm the cat meme guy. Come on.  Hi, it's j michael collins And these are just a few examples of the first class demos my team and I are producing if you'd like to have something similar Visit jmc voiceover.com and click on the demo production tab to find out more Hey, you know, perhaps some of you recall putting the tie out on your dorm room to keep your roommate out for Whatever reasons. I don't know what you're talking about. I know but when you're doing long form narration like audiobooks Like scott does here. It's sort of the same thing. Keep out. I'm busy And voiceover essentials has the perfect answer the led multicolor recording sign with remote Keeping the joint quiet as priority one and letting the significant others in your space know that Hey, I'm actually working in here is critical By the way, using certain color choices because with this remote you can you can change the modes on it So it can be you know, what? Yeah, you can see it it changes color fast and You can keep it at one color, but here's the cool thing You know, you can you can actually create a code Here you can hold this one. I just got yeah get a shot of two of us here. You can actually create a code where this thing is Telling people stuff like you're taking a nap. You're recording. You're editing You know all sorts of stuff, you know So that's a great point about the led sign from voiceover essentials dot com The multicolor voiceover recording sign just 69 95 only from voiceover essentials dot com And the best way to get to voiceover essentials dot com is to Go down to the bottom of our page here that you are watching the show on right now And find the picture of harlin hogan talking into his wonderful porta booth pro and It will take you right there and buy one of these and then buy one for all of your voiceover colleagues That's it for for harlin hogan this week for seven years. He's been our sponsor, so Thanks again harlin Should be a should be a spot in here. Oh no, you ran it you ran it. That's right. We got questions, sir jack All righty, we're back here on voiceover body shop and we're talking with scott brick Who's been with us a few times before yeah, and you know It's not that we could ever run out of things to talk about because the voiceover business and the audiobook business They they sort of it's sort of like a venn diagram. I guess the best way to describe it, but uh Do you do any other voiceover besides audiobooks? Yeah, I actually did a spot Just after christmas. I got I got to do uh, uh like 12 different spots for arby's And uh, and I remember asking them now The fact that used to be a vegan that doesn't disqualify me. They're like no as long as let's just talk about meat. It's okay. Great. Um, you know Bank uh banks back in georgia do you know spot radio spots for them, right? Um, I just uh did uh Narration for a film. I actually just did it on camera gig both on camera and voiceover For uh an indie feature that uh Those are those are always fun. Oh, yeah, that's that's a whole different world. Yeah, but isn't craft service great I'm an actor. I'd like free food, right? I would line my pockets with rubber so I could steal soup if I could Alrighty, all right. We've got questions from our amazing audience who is incredibly patient george. What are they? I'm still laughing Stealing the soup I remember somebody I know her aunt would carry aluminum foil line big handbag. Yeah fill it up and walk out Right. Um, and the audience questions the first one I see here is from john c And he says or a newbie like me Demo for audiobook. This is I'm just reading how it's written For a newbie like me dot dot dot demo for audiobook dot dot that Use a newer book or public domain Question mark or whatever works What do you think? I think uh, you don't have to worry about about rights When you're doing a demo not not a problem because you're not you're not making money off of this It is understood. Uh, these are publishers. So, um, they understand you're trying to break in You're not trying to make money off of you know reading a minute and a half of It's fair use as they would. Yeah, it's a fair use exactly. Uh, so go with whatever suits your skill set whatever You know demos from demonstrate use Pick uh pick material that where you can demonstrate your best skills Okay, it's interesting to note that you know, here's somebody talking about demos What should an audiobook demo be like, you know, is it like one question? Yeah, I tell you that's a whole episode but uh, It's it's it is a lot different the way it sounds from The typical voiceover demo like an animation demo or a commercial demo You're gonna hear sound effects and music and all that right and I get students who send me their demo And they've done that on their audiobook demo. I'm like, oh, what are you kidding? No, they're supposed to sound different. Uh, so you need to have at least three tracks maybe five um Complimenting genres, you know fiction nonfiction Choose the others at will young adult spiritual inspirational whatever self-help. Um sci-fi The minute you have to have the common denominator of any demo needs to have a scene Uh, contemporary dialogue between a man and a woman. That's the that's the thing that you lead with Because the publishers look they're kicking the tires. You send them your demo. They're gonna kick the tires How does this person, you know, how do they do right? How do they tell a story and the tire they're gonna be kicking is character separation They want to know how you do it and there's no right or wrong way They just want to know how you do it what your way is So show them on that on that selection um That's basically it and don't worry about sound effects. Just just read a minute and a half two minutes per cut You're good. There's no sound effects in audiobooks. No, I mean when I would do them I'm like, you know, this really needs a soundtrack, but they ain't asking for one right? Yeah, exactly going in there Very rarely they'll put one in like maybe one two percent of the time, but don't do it on the demo. Okay Next question All right. Next one comes from thomas mackin and he says do you have a regular sleep pattern? And that's what he's saying. Do you sleep? Also, do you yourself? No, I think he's probably serious about that Also, do yourself get voice coaching still and if so from who maybe pat um I don't have a regular sleep cycle. I wish I did. I have insomnia instead. Um, I uh, It depends on how much I'm working, you know the if I'm under the stress of deadlines. Yeah, it's definitely a lot harder to get sleep Um, I don't do regular vocal coaching. Um, but you're right with pat um I get enough tips and tricks both in terms of just you know Uh, protecting my voice as well as learning how to use it. So, uh, I wish I had time for more, but I don't yeah Okay, uh jack daniel Uh, who's sitting here and having jack. Yeah, he's actually here. I mean, he could actually ask you ask the question He could actually ask the question, but I'll ask it for him since he's he's sitting over there Uh, interesting about using films as a mood prep. Do you do the same with music or other arts? Absolutely. Yeah. Um, as a matter of fact, jack, I do No, I do I do well if I'm not in the mindset You know, I do whatever it takes to get me there. I've done sports bios Uh, I did one about joe nameth years ago. I watched so damn much football, which wasn't hard for me Uh, it was it was great research to do. Um, I've done books about, uh, bae bruth and I've gone and watched a ton of old footage um, I did a book that was It was written like one of the old, uh, um, oh god, you know his girl friday Wacky, you know, uh, screwball comedies, uh, it was written like that It was what makes sammy run by bud schulberg and the dialogue was so rapid fire You know staccato burst rapid paced dialogue He couldn't have been much older than the 16 years old the first time I the first time I met him Sharpen quick sammy glick used to run copy for me always ran always looked thirsty So I what I did in order to to get into that cadence because that's a cadence.  So what I did is I got a ton of old radio shows which I collect And I listened to howard duff playing sam spade the adventures of sam spade on the radio in the 1940s Because he had that, you know bogart-esque, you know staccato bursts, you know thing himself Come along and I'll tell you about the flopsie mobsie and cotton tail caper You know that kind of that kind of delivery and I would listen to it on this in my car on my way to the studio and then again On my way home Just to make sure that that cadence that rhythm was imprinted upon my brain so I could do it for six days straight Yeah, that sounds like a lot of fun. Actually, it really was it was one of my favorite gigs ever That's cool Also, uh scott even the top trailer and promo people have demos Is it the same for someone like you at the apex of the audiobook pyramid? I like the idea of being there. Yes, um Yeah, I absolutely I I put together new demos a couple of years ago my commercial demo my narration demo I don't have an audiobook demo because You know at some point you kind of reach critical mass where your body of work becomes your demo And every publisher understands if if they're not familiar with my work And if they're thinking about hiring me for a specific type of book They can go to audible And or go to amazon which owns audible and click on the book a similar Genre a similar book from a similar genre. They can click on that and hear a five minute sample of me reading that So they can actually they can actually target my quote-unquote demo my body of work They can go look shop for what they want. Do you have like stuff that's booked up from like the next few months or? Yeah, typically um between work that i'm doing for The publishers the the front list books, uh, I'll get back list offers. I just got um This about a year ago. I was asked to do Clive Custler's first six books because they for whatever reason maybe they were only done as abridgments Excuse me originally. So, uh, there was a british publisher Little brown uk Who asked me to do those and I said well, I'll fit him in when I can but I got to do the new Custlers too so Then then of course the third type of work is working directly with authors or doing a you know revenue share So it's like three different types of work front list back list and my own personal stuff that I want to do You know if if things are slow on the front list front I just go to the other two You know parts of the workflow in a nutshell Front list versus back front list is a brand new book coming up front list means it has to be out by May 7th, uh, they give it to you Hopefully a minimum of six weeks before usually 12 weeks before And you can get it recorded edited all the post have it ready to go. Um A back list basically means the author's previous Fiction or nonfiction the titles that people aren't Clamoring for them only because they've been out for a while. They know they can get them any time So, uh, yeah, basically means either new books or Or the author's like in film. It's first run pictures. Right. Yeah very much so Yeah What are you still working in this little tiny studio of yours? What do you what do you have in there? Uh, I've I've had so many people refer to it as the harry potter studio Like literally under the stairs literally under the stairs. Um, I It's so funny because years ago, um Tess and I were hosting a uh A potluck for the union every year we we host for the union We host a a potluck for the whole narrator community in los angeles and people and quite often people will fly in from out of From out of state or out of town if they want to meet the LA producers And so this woman came and she she uh, uh lived up north and she she didn't know anybody there And so she got there and she was feeling a lot of anxiety and she started crying Because she said I don't know anybody and I don't know who to ask and I wasn't around You know tess and I are off playing host right so, uh I I felt bad. I had no idea this was going on Bless this heart pat fraley sees her And they're right outside my right outside my studio And she's crying and pat goes over puts his arm around her and he goes hey, hey No, really it's okay And he tells her there's there's people here all introduce you to and there are plenty people that you can talk to To make her feel better. He goes and look it could be worse And he points to my studio and says you could be recording in there So yeah, it's a bit bare bones, but it gets you know I've had so many publishers who've seen it and they're like stunned when they see it And I say I know I I keep meaning to make an upgrade and they've actually discouraged me from doing it because of the Because of the way that sounds they're like no it sounds Exactly the way we need to do don't don't change a thing sometimes there's just something about a certain space You know you saw you hit the lottery I saw a booth in vegas last week it by all accounts it should not have sounded good For some reason it was just the right dimension size shape box whatever and I said I can't there's nothing I can improve It sounds great. So, you know, you know a broke don't fix it Yeah, exactly and and the fact of the matter is is Except, you know, you've had publishers see it, but most people don't need to see how the size it just may Yeah, exactly. I mean it's uh, yeah, uh, that's accurate. Yes Three more questions. I think I think we have time for them. Scott or how you're doing we're a little late than usual So we can get these in maybe Dvox says we all know about the difficulties and bad habits that radio talents have transitioning to normal vo work because of the differences Um, what are some issues that you've seen reasonably talented voice artists who've done voice acting for you know, um Adjusting to audiobook narration.  I'm like, no, I'm not narrating this. I'm just saying Um, but I work with a lot of guys who came from radio men and women who come from radio and sometimes other types of narration it was a guy who did a ton of nature channel, you know history channel, you know documentaries And he was old school and he sounded like those guys who uh back in the day used to do those disney nature videos Now the beaver takes out his tusks and he chumps chumps chumps on the tree and it falls in the river And he's painting a picture this man.  Yeah, but if you're working with a strong partner You don't have to do a lot.  Don't don't do so much. Yeah, you're right The beaver goes down the stream and I'm like Okay, you know and and finally it was I was working that day with renae rodman and and I was really new at teaching Um, and she had been a lot more experienced teaching voiceover for for years even before she got into audiobooks And she had this great trick. She said, um, well, he's in the studio behind the behind the mic. She says Do you know any, uh, do you do any impressions He says no, she says can you do any bad impressions? Well, and he's like, well, you know, and she goes don't don't worry about the impression Actually, it's it helps if it's bad. Can you do can you do an old?  What are we doing? And she says, okay, read it again now without it And he didn't fall into the cadence. It was like a reset. It was a reset and by going to arnold's cadence And in his rhythm It showed him that there was something else possible. Yeah And I I always I I love that I try to remember that and I and I use it shamelessly and make it sound like it's my idea I have another one from laurence lewis. This one's from the facebook chat. Um, how's your health? I asked since I've been listening to your narration of the ph miracle and it's been great for me I hope you're doing well. I That's so appreciate. I appreciate you asking. I am happy and healthy. I'm cancer-free have been for Uh, I found out a little over two years ago right before christmas So, uh, I am grateful to all my doctors and everybody who helped me through and to tess and to Yeah to be able to get back. Um It was a little you know I had to have surgery. I had my thyroid removed and so it stretched my laryngeal nerves Uh, so for about three months, I couldn't work full time. Um, you know and you're stressed that Those nerves are gonna snap. They're right on the thyroid. They have to move them aside so they can take the thyroid out but Yeah, I'm back at work Back to normal and grateful for every day I get to do this gig. Thanks for asking. I appreciate it Yeah, I don't know how we can follow that one up. No, you're really Well, scott it has been a pleasure having you here. We appreciate your patience with us and I'm grateful to be here Uh, do you mind if I there's an announcement I'm going to be making soon. That's right on my, uh, uh, youtube channel And it's brand new when you go there You're not going to see any videos yet because actually the inaugural video I'm going to do is the announcement of this project that I talked about earlier one of the coolest books of the 20th century um, that we're going to be recording about a week from now and I'm going to take I'm going to take the camera into the studio with me and every day kind of make a Uh, a diary about um a narrator's diary going on this journey on this. Uh, it's a thriller and um But I'm also going to be on the on the channel. You can find it on youtube.  Um, a bunch of ones for free And some paid ones if people want to opt in for that Um, but I I need to build up a certain amount of you know a base of subscribers If you if you would go and hit scott brick narrator and you know click subscribe It would help me immensely because that way I can actually get these out these free videos out I think I'll just do that right now And I actually just joined in uh instagram as well. I think I think I had to go there were too many scott bricks so Uh, my production manager she went with the scott brick and I said you're going to make me sound so self-centered But that's George the tech, right? Yeah, of course. You have to come up with something right? It's a valuable tool with that the Absolutely. Well, that's gonna do it for our interview scott. That's great. I so appreciate it. Are you doing any private coaching or I'm doing. Yeah, I'm doing a um private coaching. Matter of fact, I got a uh, um I've got an in an in person somebody come to my studio on monday. Um I do a ton of stuff online. Uh, people can book on my website It's uh scott brick dot net or scott brick presents dot com either one of them goes to the same spot I'm actually doing a webinar on, uh Open coaches uh coming up. It's gonna be may 19th the uh the page for that actual webinar isn't live yet It's being built as we speak, but it should be should be ready to go in the next day or two May 19th the saturday afternoon if you'd like to come join that's gonna be all about um I've got a thing that I try to teach. I call put yourself in the text Uh, because you know, what what makes your read more personal and more unique than anybody else is these Depends on how much of yourself you put in so that's what we're gonna be talking about that day. Absolutely Thanks for being with us. Thanks for having me. It's wonderful being back. All right. Good to see you guys All right. George and I'll be right back to wrap things up right after this Your dynamic voiceover career requires extra resources to keep moving ahead Now there's one place where you can explore everything the voiceover industry has to offer that place is voiceover extra dot com Whether you're just exploring a voiceover career or a seasoned veteran ready to reach that next professional level Stay in touch with market trends coaching products and services while avoiding scams and other pitfalls Voiceover extra has hundreds of articles free resources and training that will save you time and help you succeed Learn from the most respected talents coaches and industry insiders when you join the online sessions Bringing you the most current information on topics like audiobooks auditioning casting home studio setup and equipment marketing performance techniques and much more It's time to hit your one-stop daily resource for voiceover success Sign up for a free subscription to newsletters and reports and get 14 bonus reports on how to ace the voiceover audition It's all here at voiceover extra dot com. That's voice over x t r a dot com And we're back here at voiceover body shopper. Thanks again to scott brick for You know, it's always great having him out here and and it's fun and it's it's great to learn all this stuff Uh next week on this show on this very voiceover body shop show We have a legendary agent Name is now been announced. Yes ilco drostowski Oh, cool who announced that he's retiring on a way. So that's going to make a much more interesting interview Tell us about what your career was like and what should people be doing and stuff like that That ought to be some great questions. You retired, uh voiceover or any kind of retired agents are great because they no longer They can be a little more Candid yes, let's put it that way. We'll see how candid he can be April 30th christin lennox and her daughter will be here. We have to get her daughter's name So I just don't it's like she's just some generic daughter. She actually is an actor herself may 7th Keith farley will be here may 14th Yeah, cool. All right may 14th dan necktrap will be with us. That one does narration and promo stuff Yep, we're just out of that one. Yeah and may 21st harry dunn promos at the cw All right, uh, who are our donors of the week? Well names i've seen popping up in the last week include maria macchus Andrew kaufman eric aragoni Sarah borges and antlamp productions who is our old pal Uncle roy. Yeah, those are all regular names So all those folks are subscribers to the show using paypal and they they donate on a regular basis And we really appreciate that all righty Um You need help Come to me home studio master. You go to home voiceover studio dot com and for george It's george the tech dot com or george the tech dot com depending on the proper way pronouncing There is no proper way. We should ask You also have a new audio Geek podcast, you know, we've done a handful of episodes now We did our last one at nab Or actually at a studio in vegas about nab It's called the pro audio suite and it's definitely a we focus more on tech All of us are audio engineers or techs on some level geeks To aussies and to americans. It's me daren robertson angio peters And robert marshal from source elements So go find that on your podcatcher app on itunes. It's called the pro audio suite. Alrighty Uh, the show gets popped on to youtube by some time tomorrow morning depending on what time I get up And uh along with that comes the show logs the jack jack degolia continues to write for us and gives you A rundown of everything that was said as it was said at the time we said it It's very amazing time stamped. You can jump right to that spot in the show. That's right Also, oh, and you can access them. I think they're up here somewhere On the on the on the website, you know, we're at we actually have a new website We're going to be putting out very shortly to know we have a little bit more functionality These are to use a little more mobile friendly. Hopefully a lot more mobile friendly Yeah, because I know a lot of you out there want to be able to watch the show live on your mobile phone or Watch the replay We're live every monday 6 p.m. Pacific time If you happen to be in a greater Los angeles area and you would like to join us here at our secret location in Sherman Oaks Um, all right. Well, they cut it down a little bit now Write to us at the guys at v obs.tv and tell us how many in your party And uh, we'll give you the secret handshake and let you come by and watch the show live Which is a lot of fun. We'll raise the portcullis. Yes. Yeah, we can actually put the audience cam on right now Show who's who's actually here. They can wave when it comes up there Um, hopefully it's still working. No, it's it's got to be there somewhere Oh, okay.  There we go Okay, okay. All right. There there's our there's our voluminous audience. It's the love seat cam I didn't realize it was such a tight shot All right also also, please show us your booths I mean, here's here's here's harlan hogan's, you know, mobile ring on an ironing board We could do better than we can do much better than that. Not that that's not cool I mean, it's uh, but we would like you to send those into us Again, the same address is the guys at v obs dot tv So, uh, you can get your booth in here. Take them Landscape not portrait. That's right. Why is with you people? I don't know Uh, all right, we need to thank our sponsors like the amazing harlan hogan and voiceover essentials dot com voiceover extra source elements V o to go go voice actor websites dot com and j michael collins demos All righty. Well, we need to thank marcie for letting us be out here late into the night Out in the garage. She's like, what's going on out there? Our producer catherine curidan for getting us great great guests like scott brick and the great lineup We have coming up over the next couple of months Jack daniel jack daniel for an amazing job in the chat room tonight And he's also helped us find some guests as well along the way. So that's been fantastic. Like scott Yeah, let's see here. Uh, also our amazing technical director with the patients and an iron will Sumer lino for getting things done tonight Jack de gollia for the show notes and of course lee pennies simply for being lee pennie Well, that's gonna do it for us. You know, this is not an easy business This is an easy show to do but We're here every week to help you out with your home studio stuff and bringing you the best people in the business to tell you what it takes to succeed and Have a lot of fun So that's gonna do it for us tonight. Uh, i'm tan lennard. I'm george woodham and this is voiceover body shop or v o b s See you next week everybody


Okay, so we are welcome back up to break before the break, we were looking at chapter three. Now we'll be looking at chapter four, the inner witness of the Holy Spirit. And we looked at John chapter 16 verse 13 to 14 on the Holy Spirit guide us, he just walks through it, he leads us into the pleasing, well pleasing and acceptable will of God and will also lead us and guide us and show us the things that are going to come in the future. Okay, now we'll take a look at 1 Corinthians chapter 2 verses 9 to 16. And there are a few things that we can learn from 1 Corinthians chapter 2 verses 9 to 16. Okay, 1 Corinthians chapter 2 verse 9 to 16, if you can turn to page number 43 please in your books or the PDF copy. Okay, so 1 Corinthians chapter 2 verses 9 to 16 says that you know, but as it is written, I has not seen nor hear heard nor have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for those who love him. Okay, but God has revealed them to us through his spirit, for the spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. We've already looked at this study, this verse when we were looking at, you know, fulfilling God's purpose for our lives, we saw that God has wonderful great big wonderful plans that he's planned and prepared for us, but how do we know it? Who reveals it to us is the Holy Spirit who reveals it. What's the meaning of the word reveal? The word reveal means to, the Greek word means to uncover, to unveil, to make known, to make manifest, to make, to disclose before us what is unknown. So the things that are unknown to us, the Holy Spirit reveals it to us and so it's so important for us to have fellowship with the Holy Spirit. Okay, in verses 11 and 12 says, you know, a man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him, even so no one knows the things of God except the spirit of God. Okay, verse 12, now we have received not the spirit of the world but the spirit who is from God that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. Okay, so who knows the things of God? The Holy Spirit. Okay, and here it says that we have been given the Holy Spirit, so we are so privileged, we have been given the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit is our teacher, our helper, our guide, our counsellor, he is the spirit of adoption, there's so many other things he gives us, the gifts of the Spirit he produces and as a food of the Spirit, but he also see here that, you know, we have the spirit of God and why do we have the spirit of God so that we will know. Okay, perceive means what? We will know, we will understand, we will discern, you know, the things that God has freely given to us. God has given us, you know, so many spiritual blessings, he's given us freely, we don't know many of them, but how do we know it? It's the Holy Spirit who will reveal it to us.  Okay, you don't have to run here and there, you don't have to wait for people to tell you, but you can just ask the Holy Spirit because he's your guide, he makes known the things of God to us, he makes known the plans, the wonderful things that God has prepared for us, he makes known to us. Verses 13 to 15, okay, it says, the things which our Holy Spirit reveals to us have to be understood spiritually. Okay, so verses 13 to 15 says, these things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches, but with the Holy Spirit teaches comparing spiritual things with spiritual and verse 15 says, but he who is spiritual judges all things yet he himself is rightly judged by no one, verse 14, but the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God for their foolishness to him nor can he know them because they are spiritually deserved. Okay, so we see that the things that the Holy Spirit reveals to us cannot be understood by the natural mind. Okay, it has to be understood spiritually and that is why it's so important for us to feed our spirit man and not feed our carnal nature. Okay, so those who are living in their natural mind cannot understand, cannot comprehend, cannot discern what the Holy Spirit is telling them. We need to be spiritually minded. Okay, and the Holy Spirit reveals the things of God to us in our spirit man and that's why you know we need to be spiritual people and as spiritual people we need to judge which means we need to examine, we need to investigate everything before we accept them. Okay, and verse 16 it says, but who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct him but we have the mind of Christ. Okay, why can we say that we have the mind of Christ? Okay, why do we say that we have the mind of Christ? Because the Holy Spirit reveals the mind of God to us. The Holy Spirit reveals the mind of Jesus to us. The Holy Spirit reveals the plans, the purposes, the decisions, the desires, the directions, the feelings, the intents, the thoughts of Jesus Christ and that is why we have the mind of Christ. Why do we have the mind of Christ? It's because the Holy Spirit reveals the things to us. So what is the end result of having the mind of Christ? The end result of having the mind of Christ is we're able to understand Jesus's plans, his direction, his purposes, his thoughts, his feelings that he has towards us. Okay, and we can know anything in any given matter because we have the mind of Christ because the Holy Spirit takes from Jesus and reveals it to us. Isn't that wonderful? Yes, so you know each one of us have the mind of Christ and because we have the mind of Christ we know the thoughts, we can receive the ideas, we can understand his plans and we can understand his ways. Okay, so I want you all to repeat this after me. I have the mind of Christ. I know his thoughts, I receive his ideas, I understand his plans, I understand his ways. I think you can make this declaration in your life, you know even as you are praying every day, you can say, God thank you that I have the mind of Christ because I have the mind of Christ, I know your thoughts God, I can receive your ideas God, I understand your plans and I can understand your ways. Okay, so as New Testament believers we have the mind of Christ and the Holy Spirit makes known to us the things that Jesus Christ has planned for us even before the foundations of the world. Okay, so there are several ways we can know the mind of Christ or we can know how the Holy Spirit reveals things to us. We will look at some things individually in the chapters to come but we will look at a few things here. We will first understand how the Holy Spirit speaks to us or reveals the mind of God to us. He reveals it to the inner witness of the Holy Spirit, inner witness of the Holy Spirit. Okay, so that is how the Holy Spirit speaks or reveals the mind of God to us, the plans, the purposes, the intents of God to us. Okay, so Romans chapter 8 verses 14 to 16, can somebody read that please. Thank you. So here he says that you know who are we? Sons and daughters of God. Okay, we are the sons and daughters of God. We are heirs of God. We are co-heirs with Christ Jesus. Okay, so we are sons and daughters of God and because we are sons and daughters of God, it means that we belong to God's family. Okay, so because we are sons and daughters of God, we are also led by the Holy Spirit. So we have this awesome privilege because we are sons and daughters of God that we can be led by the Holy Spirit. This is our privilege that we can be led and guided by the Spirit of God. Okay, and the Holy Spirit has another name. He's also called as the Spirit of adoption. Okay, that means the Holy Spirit testifies to us that we are children of God, that you are sons of God or your daughters of God. And we also see here in this verse that the Holy Spirit bears witness without spirit. The Holy Spirit bears witness without spirit. That means there's a joint witness.  Okay, so here in verse 16, it says that, you know, how do we know that we are children of God because of the inner conviction, the inner witness, the inner knowing, the inner assurance that comes to the witness of the Holy Spirit. So when we are born again, we are born again in our spirit man, our spirit man is joined to the Holy Spirit and hence the Holy Spirit can bear witness, it can testify in our spirit man. And how do we know that we are children of God? It's the inner conviction, just inner conviction that I am a child of God, inner knowing, inner assurance that comes to the inner witness of the Holy Spirit. So the Holy Spirit's inner witness actually confirms to us that we are sons and daughters of God and also the Holy Spirit, you know, uses the inner witness as something to lead us and guide us. So two things the Holy Spirit does to the inner witness. The first thing confirms to us that we are sons and daughters of God. And the second thing, it also the Holy Spirit through the inner witness leads us and guides us. So what is this inner witness? How does the Holy Spirit guide us through this inner witness? Sometimes it will just be annoying. We just know in our heart that this is what the Holy Spirit is telling us to do. Sometimes it can be an assurance, sometimes it can be conviction, sometimes we can just sense the Holy Spirit is telling us. We will look at everything in detail, sometimes we can just feel, you know, it'll just be like, you know, somebody's giving you a gentle tap or a nudge, you know, when you experience the inner witness of the Holy Spirit, it will be this way. Okay. So how we need to understand the inner witness of the Holy Spirit when he's leading us and guiding us in the things of life should not be mixed up with our emotions. Okay. We should not confuse the inner witness of the Holy Spirit with our emotions. Okay. Now, 1 Corinthians chapter 6 verse 17 says, you know, we are joined to the Lord in one spirit with him. So when we are born again, you know, we become one spirit with God. Okay. So we are spiritually one with him. And hence the Holy Spirit can communicate to our spirit man. Hence we can hear the Holy Spirit speak, we can hear the Holy Spirit, we can feel the Holy Spirit, we can sense things in the Holy Spirit. Okay. And one way he speaks is to the inner witness of the spirit in our spirit man, he bears inner witness. Okay. But we need to be sensitive to the leading of the Holy Spirit. There are several different ways that the Holy Spirit bears witness to our spirit. There are eight things that are listed here. Now, this is not the, you know, the only the eight, there are other ways. In the next chapter, we look at the voice of the Holy Spirit. The voice of the Holy Spirit is also like the inner witness of the Holy Spirit that bears witness in our spirit.  He can reveal things to us in many different ways. But we will look at these eight. The first one is the quickening of scripture. Second one is assurance within. Third is the desire. Fourth is the knowing. Fifth is the prompting. Sixth is the steering. Seven is the foreknowledge. And eight is the warning. And all this is happening within us, in our spirit man. Okay. So we need to make sure that our spirit man is aligned to the Word of God. It's submission to the, to the Word of God. It's obeying the Word of God. And that is when we can hear the Holy Spirit. So sometimes they say, you know, I have people, sorry. Sometimes we say, you know, people are saying they can hear the Holy Spirit, they can sense, they can feel, they are seeing things in the Spirit, but I am not, you know, it's not that the Holy Spirit is partial. God is not partial. Okay. He wants to reveal things. His only thing is we are not training our spirit man. We are not communicating to God, to our spirit man. We are not just reading our Bible and praying. It's becoming like a ritual. They're also not communicating with the Holy Spirit. We don't know him. We are not relating to him. So it's important for us to even fellowship with the Holy Spirit and relate to God in our spirit man. Okay. So the first thing we will look at is to the quickening of scripture. Now, before we look at all of these eight ways that the Holy Spirit you know, bears witness in a spirit, we need to know, accepting for the first one, that is a quickening of scripture, all the other seven, assurance, desire, knowing, prompting, steering, foreknowledge and warning within, you know, all of these others, you know, must be validated because sometimes it can even be our emotions, accepting for the first one, which is scripture, scripture speaks for itself to us, but accepting for scripture, all the others have to be validated. That means you have to go back to scripture and find out or you need to depend on the Holy Spirit to make sure whether it is the Holy Spirit that is leading you and guiding you. The first one is quickening to scripture. We've already looked at it in detail in the previous chapter, so we're not going to look at it. So, you know, how is the quickening of scripture happens?  We need to be safe in our spirit man to see that. The second one is assurance within. Assurance within basically comes to the peace, experience and unharming peace of God. And this peace of God serves multiple or in several different ways. Look at Philippians chapter 4 verses 6 and 7. It says, do not be anxious for nothing, but in everything with prayer and petition, you know, with thanksgiving, make known a request to God and the peace of God that passes all understanding will guard your hearts and minds in Christ, Jesus. Okay. So here we say, we see that, you know, what happens when we are not anxious and we submit everything to God in prayer, what happens? We experience the peace of God. And what does it say? The peace of God that surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds.  Isn't that wonderful? You know, when we are anxious, when we are worried, we go to God in prayer, we submit everything immediately to God's peace comes upon us. And not only that, God's peace is guarded so that, you know, those things that are troubling us does not bother us, that does not trouble us. And you know, if it's troubling us and bothering us, that means we have totally not surrendered to God. Sometimes we can say, you know, it's nothing to God, but we can still be anxious and worried and we don't have that peace. Then you need to remember, well, this is not what God's word says. When I submit it to God, I have to experience this peace because he guards that peace from anything else that come against it. Okay. The second thing we read is in Colossians 3 verse 15, it says, let the peace of God rule in your hearts to which you also were called in one body and be thankful. Okay. Sean, you can share with him the textbook. Oh, you have a textbook. Okay, great. Okay. So both of these scriptures are teaching us that believers should be walking in the peace of God in their hearts and in their minds. Okay. So, you know, one way the Holy Split bears witness is through the peace of God. Okay.  That means the peace of God will be like an empire. You know, not an empire hotel where we go and have good food, but it's an empire for, you know, when you play some games, football match, ball match. So it means that the rule means an empire or to decide, to determine, to direct, to control, to cover. So the peace of God in your heart acts as an empire. And the empire, what does he do when he's empiring a match? What does he do? He directs, he's making sure that everything is going the right way. You know, he's a deciding factor, right? Whether the game is being played rightly or not. So the same way, the peace of God is like an empire for us. Okay. So which means that if you're saying God, this is the right thing for me to do. You can't hear an audible voice. You can't see an answer. You can't get a vision or dream, but you will experience this amazing peace. That peace is an inner witness in your Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is saying go ahead with this. Okay. This is the right thing to do. Or this is the right way to do it. Or this is the right person for this. But if you don't experience the peace of God, then it's a red signal. Don't go. You know, if you're anxious, worried, there's disturbance, there's doubt, that means the Holy Spirit is saying, don't go ahead with this. Okay. So that is how the Holy Spirit is an empire, means the red signal and the green signal. When you have the peace of God, the empire is saying what? Green signal means what? Go, do it. Whatever you're decided, go ahead with it because that's a peace you're experiencing, a peace of God. But if you're not experiencing the peace of God, there's a lot of difficulty, turbulence, anxiety, then the Holy Spirit is actually revealing to you that you don't go ahead with this. Don't meet that person. Don't include this person. Yes, Sean. Yes.  That's your conscience, Sean, that's telling you that, hey, what you did is wrong. What you saw is wrong. What you said is wrong. What you thought is wrong. That's your conscience. Okay. Okay. So you're able to understand the assurance within, see the assurance, peace, go ahead. It's a Holy Spirit giving the green signal. There's no peace. The red signal, you don't go ahead with it. Okay. So, you know, relationship to five was 16, 18 and 25 says, if we live in the spirit, we will walk in the spirit and be led by the spirit. What does it mean to walk in the spirit? It basically means you're yielded, submitted under the influence, under the direction, under the leading of the Holy Spirit. Okay. So when we are led by the Holy Spirit, we will bear the fruit of the Holy Spirit. Okay. Okay. The third one is desire within. Okay. Now, this desire is not an emotion, but is a Holy Spirit bearing witness in your, in a being, in your spirit man. Okay. It's Psalm 37 was four. Can Rin read that please? Psalm 37 was four. Yes, it says here, delight yourself also in the Lord and He shall give you the desires of your heart. It means, you know, what's the meaning of give? Give here means to put, to make, to cause, to bestow. So, you know, when we delight in ourselves in the Lord, then there are two things that happens. Okay. God puts His desires into our heart and also what is our desire? If it's according to His will and plan, He will bring it out. But when will God put His desire in our heart? When will He cause our desires to come into being, to make it, to bestow it, to see it into fulfillment? When? When we delight ourselves in the Lord. So remember I said, every promise has a command. What's the meaning of delight yourself in the Lord? How can you, how will, when will God be delighted with you? You obey God. When you walk in His ways, when you walk in righteousness and holiness, when you read His Word, you delight in His Word and His Word becomes life. Okay. And you abide in His Word and abide in Him. So when you delight in Him, the two things happen. What is the first thing? All your plans and purposes will, He will bring it about. He will give it to you means He will make it, He will cause it to happen. The second thing is He will also put His desires into your heart and He will bring about those desires. He will cause it to happen and He will cause those desires to come into fulfillment. Okay. So when we desire ourselves in the Lord, that's when He also births things. He puts things in our spirit man. He births things means He can birth things that are having a greater impact for His kingdom, for the church, for the body of Christ. He will birth in you.  He will birth it in you. But when will He birth it in you, when you are a one who is delighting yourself in the Lord? Okay. Look at the Proverbs chapter 10, verse 24 in your book. Okay. He says, and the desire of the righteous will be granted. Whose desires will be granted? Righteous. What's the meaning of righteous? Right with God. When you're doing the right things that are pleasing to God, you will right with God, right standing with God. And look at John chapter 15 verse 7. What does it say? If you abide in me, yeah, when will the desire will come about and when will it be done for you? When you abide in me and my words abide in you. So when we abide in God and His words abide in us, we follow it, we obey it, it becomes light our guide. You know, that's when the Holy Spirit will birth the plans and the purposes and the things of God. So sometimes when you're saying, hey, you know, here God has promised that He will birth things, He will tell us things, He will guide us, the Holy Spirit to His word, but I'm not getting any guidance is because we are not delighting ourselves in the Lord or we are not being righteous or we are not abiding in Him and His word is not abiding in us. Okay. So what are the things that qualify us for God's, our desires to be fulfilled and God to purchase desires is these three things which I just said. So the Holy Spirit through the inner witness in our spirit man, you know, fashions, puts, designs, brings about God's plans and purposes for our lives and also fulfills his desires and our desires that we have. But we must recognize that these godly desires are birthed in us by the, by whom? By the Holy Spirit. And then we follow God to see these things happening in our lives. Okay. So, you know, I'll just give you an example. Pastor has given a couple of examples here on page number 51, 52 and top of page 53. You can read all of those examples, but I'll just give you my personal example, desire within.  So when I came back to buying low, you know, I was again working in organization that we're ministering to families. And then I, as I said that, you know, the director, he looked at me one day and said, Hey, you're so good with children, why don't you start a project for children. And so we started a project for children. We started in schools. We took it across to Kerala and Mumbai and Tumkur and other places.  Okay. And I left that place and then, you know, it was in the month of April. And in the month of May, I just rested because I was very exhausted and tired. And, you know, when in June, schools begin here in, in Bangra city. And, you know, June and school was the first of June, I realized, Oh my God, schools are going to be beginning.  Okay. And he's birthed this desire in my God, nothing God, no, I'm not going to go to be going back to schools. I'm so sad. I'm so disappointed. What do I do?  And then I go to the, you know, I get that website and I go online and check.  I was unmarried. I'm still unmarried, unmarried. No, and, and none of those things that I fitted those criteria was not my area of expertise. I'm saying, God, I don't fit in anywhere.  I said, God, if I go for the interview, they call me and I'll be the first fool going for an interview saying, I don't know which post I applied for God just told me and I don't fit in any of those posts. They laugh at me, God. I'm going to say, send your resume. And I just obey. I send in my resume. They call me for interview. That's the first interview they had with all the pastors. And I answered all the questions and I said, God, if they're going to ask me this question, which post you applied for, I'll be the first fool.  Please. And, you know, they never asked me that question. I was way too shocked. They never asked me that question. After the interview, they found me good. And they said, as she said, you know, we have an opening in, in Ryan International School. You need to teach scripture. Are you willing? I just said, they're shocked. You know, I just could not even, even answer. And I'm just looking at him. He said, we have an opening in Ryan. And, you know, would you be willing to take it? And I'm just looking at him because I was way too shocked. He said, would you be willing to take it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, yes. You know, and I came back with tears in my eyes.  He will guide you. He will tell you what to do. And they're actually in that employment page in APC website. They had not put this, this thing, you know, this employment open for scripture teacher assembly to start this whole project. So it's just amazing, you know, how God, the Holy Spirit leads us and guides us. So you can read pastors life examples, page number 51, 52 and 53 later on, we'll move on. The next way the Holy Spirit bears inner witness in our spirit man is the knowing within. We just know. Okay, to the inner witness, the plan's purposes, their direction and assignment of God is revealed to us through the knowing. Okay, for example, here is given acts chapter seven versus 23 and 24. You know, when, when Moses was 40 years old before he was near the burning bush when he's 40 years old, it says it just came into his heart, you know, to visit the children of Israel. It came into his heart to know that, you know, he was called by God to somehow deliver the Hebrews, the Israelites. He did not understand how it's going to happen. He does, he did not know how he's going to do. You know, he's not, he did not know how it's going to take place. But he knew that this was his assignment from God. He just knew. Okay, there's just this knowing inside. Just like I said, you know, when the Holy Spirit was guiding me into children's ministry, I just knew this knowing. This I just knew that this is where the Holy Spirit is guiding me. This is what God wants me to do. Now, I better not keep running away and ministering in counseling, drug addicts and alcoholics. He wants me to minister to children. So there is a knowing within. So the inner witness, the Holy Spirit, you know, he creates a knowing, a rising up within, just like for Moses. Moses just knew in his heart, this is what God has called him to do, even though he was the palace, even though he saw himself as a future pharaoh, you know, he was willing to identify himself with the slaves, the Israelites. And he knew that God is calling him to deliver his people. Okay, so sometimes the inner witness of the Holy Spirit, we know for sure this is what the Holy Spirit wants us to do. Okay, again on page number 54 and top of half of page 55 pastor, he shared his experiences so you can read that. You know, the fifth one, the Holy Spirit bears witness that spirit is to a prompting within. He just prompts us. Yes, there's a strong, this is stronger than the knowing. You know, we know the knowing within. Okay, the prompting is stronger. Okay, why is it stronger as a strong urge, with a strong, nudge in your spirit, not just to know, but to do something about it. Okay, and only when we are sensitive in our spirit, you know, the Holy Spirit prompts us to do some things to take immediate action. I'll just give you an example. In 2017, I went to the US to visit my two sisters. And I didn't plan anything, what I'm going to do, I just went there because I was totally exhausted. I just wanted to rest. And my, my sisters just planned everything. And my oldest that we do read in California, where Bethel churches and I love Bill Johnson. I was quite excited. She drove me all the way up from, you know, Seattle, Washington, where she stays to, to read in California. And I was very excited because I'm going to Bethel and I never imagined and never thought it was just God's orchestrating everything for me so beautifully. And we went on, we were not supposed to be there on Sunday, but they have a service on Friday evening. And then we were going to attend the healing rooms that they have on Saturday with people from all over the world come for healing. And so Friday when I went, I was so much expecting to see Pastor Bill Johnson, but I was totally disappointed because there was another lady from the prophetic school that they have Bethel prophetic school who came up and she was speaking about how to creative art through music to dance to drama to kids and, you know, just serving coffee tea or, you know, registration desk, how they can release a supernatural. I was like, no way God, you know, I wanted to hear Pastor Bill Johnson speak and this is this lady and I'm not this creative person. I have nothing to do with creativity. I was quite disappointed. And then she asked this first question when she came up, you know, who's come from the furthest part of the world. So all my people sitting around me, they, they, you know, started speaking to us before service started and my sister said she's from India. She's visiting. So they always shouting in India and then she said, who is the person who came from India? Can you stand up? So I stood up and she said, can you come up in front? So I went up in front and she gave me her book. And when I saw that book, that was all about creative, how to release a supernatural to creative ways, you know, to dance and to playing instruments and I don't do any of those. Okay. I'm not even good with the drawing and writing and all of that. I was like, God, if you can give me one theological book of Pastor Bill Johnson, I would have been very, very happy. I just took that book and she said, come back later. I'll sign on it and I went back and sat in my place. And then when she started speaking, she was just talking about how to creative things just to dance, how the supernatural is released to a painting.  And I just saw, you know, how people were healed. So, you know, one girl had just drawn brain worship time. She had drawn this white head eagle and she was releasing a prophetic word to somebody and also to all of them who were suffering with their stomachs, womb and I still stood up because she suffers with acidity and, you know, they just prayed and she said, I felt to release something, go out of my body and she was instantaneously healed.  And then I'm sitting and listening to her and then, you know, the Holy Spirit is just prompting me and saying, take this back and do it with the children. You know, start something called Kingdom Building Clubs and, you know, do this with the children. And I went back and I shared it with the children. I read this book, I was so excited. And, you know, the children caught it on and they led service one Sunday and it was just so powerful. You know, children painted and to the painting, they released a supernatural dance through the worship, they shared the word and it was just such a powerful move of God. And I didn't have to do anything, it was just supernatural, just by the Spirit. And yeah, there was this prompting within the Holy Spirit saying, take this back, do the same thing with the children and children's church. And we started, I started the Kingdom Building Club and it was so powerful, children just thoroughly enjoyed. And how it all started was just a prompting. The Holy Spirit said, take this and do it in the children's church, that's it. See, and it was just so powerful. Okay, so he can lead us to a prompting within, he can lead us with a stirring within. Okay, a stirring is when you really feel led to do something. Okay, so for example, here, we look at some biblical examples in Exodus chapter 35, verses 21 and 26, and in Exodus chapter 36 verse 2, you know, God was telling Moses to build a cabinacle. And you know, people just felt a stirring in their heart, they just started coming and giving all their gold and silver and clothes. And, you know, the women started using all these goats hair, they started yarning, stitching and making curtains and making all of those tents.  And how did it happen all to a stirring? If you look at your book page number 57, Exodus chapter 36 verse 2, it says, you know, they were stirred in their heart, you know, Basil and Allotip. And also, you know, everyone who came whose heart was stirred and everyone whose spirit was willing, they brought their Lord offering for the work of the cabinacle. Okay, another example we see here is in 2 Chronicles chapter 36 verse 22, in Ezra chapter 1 verse 1, I was talking about this, the Cyrus, Cyrus who was the Persian king, who's a heathen king, he's not a Jewish king, he doesn't know God, he does not have any relationship with the true and living God. But here we read in these two passages that his, the Lord stirred up his spirit. Whose spirit did he stir up? Cyrus, the king of Persia. Why did he stir up his heart? He stirred up his heart to send back the Jews back to Jerusalem, to build back the city and to dwell in their own, in their own promised land, because they were brought as captives to Babylon. Babylon was taken over by the Persians, King Cyrus came and God stirred up his heart after the 70 year period. This was a heathen king who did not even know God, but God can even work in the hearts of leaders, authorities to carry out his purposes. Okay, so he can stir up their hearts. Look at Nehemiah chapter 1 verses 1 to 4. What happened to Nehemiah? Who is Nehemiah? He's a cup-bearer to the king, he also builds the walls of Jerusalem. Okay, when he was a cup bearer to the king, some of his friends came back from Judah and Hanani, one of his brothers, told him the walls of Jerusalem is broken down. And what happened to Nehemiah when he heard that? He was so broken in his spirit and his heart, he started weeping and mourning and fasting and being in sackcloths and he mourned for so many days. And what did he do? He got stirred up his heart. How do we know God stirred up his heart? Because it says in Nehemiah chapter 2 verse 12, he says, I told no one what God had put in my heart to do at Jerusalem. So the stirring in his heart to do something about rebuilding the walls of Jerusalem, who put it in his heart? It's God, it's the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit put the plans of God in his heart and it stirred him up to an extent that he could not stay still till he did it. So sometimes we can experience the stirring in our hearts and we don't stop till we do what the Holy Spirit wants us to do. So we'll just stop here, we'll pause here, time is up. We will continue with this chapter but you can read the examples, real life examples of Pastor Ashish. What has been the questions of anyone who are on the students' side of the questions? Sorry for the inconvenience in having to break the questions for that. Okay, no questions then we will end here. Thank you all for joining us and I will see you all next week.