This was a farmer rancher grant. It ran from approximately 2012 through 2015 through part of 2015 and I do work for the Minnesota Institute for Sustainable Agriculture and also until lately worked for Greenland's Blue Waters as well, which is a related program and I'd like to acknowledge a few people My co-operators are the first three people on the list. There were four of us farmers in this project We all had fairly different types of grass-fed operations. So that was Interesting to see in the project Troy Salzer Carlton County Extension. He presented before lunch on his cover crops project Wayne Martin University of Minnesota extension alternative livestock program My husband and my families who had to help me with dragging around livestock scale and Messing around with animals a lot more than we normally do for working the cattle to get those weights Kate Clancy She had an endowed chair position with the Minnesota Institute for Sustainable Agriculture in grass-fed beef a number of years ago and the information that she generated was helpful My boss Helene Murray who said Yep, great do this project. We like it Chris Johnson who was on the Mesa Board of Directors and sent me the paper that kicked this whole thing off our Minnesota Cerco coordinators Kate Seeger and Betsy Wyland The Midwest perennial forage working group which is under Greenland's Blue Waters And I had a lot of feedback from those people and conversation with them Rich Pirog who was a co-author on the paper that Caused me to do this project and Laura Payne who I should have changed this because she's now with Dairy grazing apprenticeship no longer with Southwest badger Okay so to set this up Many of you since you're from Iowa I'm sure know about the Leopold Center and the research that's done there and Rick Cruz the head of the Iowa Water Center has been working with Leopold funding to look at soil erosion and He has been finding some really interesting and alarming things One of which is that the T value that's used for allowable soil erosion by the NRCS is 5.5 tons per acre per year of soil loss But what Rick says is that? Severely underestimates the actual amount of soil erosion because it does not take into account Ephemeral gullies that happen in spring rains fall rains when the soil is mostly bare and that creates actually a lot of soil loss And Rick also says that the actual rate of soil formation is Not 5.5 tons per acre per year, but more like 0.5 tons per acre per year So there's a tremendous a lot of soil erosion happening And then if you look at the type of cropping system That you have that makes a huge impact on the percentage or on the amount of soil loss And if you look at what kind of cropping system can reduce soil loss corn soybean is kind of the baseline you've got a Pretty severe soil loss with that and then you can reduce it by going to these other things and permanent pasture Reduces that soil loss by more than 90 percent So that's why people are interested in grass-fed beef and in grazing as a way to protect soil Okay, this is a great picture from the Land Institute in Salina, Kansas West Jackson if some of you know him is Just retiring as the director of that, but he's he's a pretty tall guy And they've got these washed perennial grass roots hanging up on a clothes line And they're they're really long right? I mean that's a very extensive root system And when you have a whole pasture of all those grasses growing together and cross-linking the roots and Sending those roots down really deep You are you're practically eliminating soil erosion from that field so perennial grasses are a soil erosion fighter and Grass-fed beef of course is a way you can utilize perennial pasture and make it profitable so so I bought into that I'm a grass-fed beef producer for environmental reasons and Then this paper came out in 2010 comparative life cycle environmental impacts of three beef production strategies in the upper Midwestern United States and Chris Johnson on the Mesa board circulated that paper and I read it and Found this conclusion impacts per live weight kilogram of beef produced were highest For pasture finished beef for all impact categories and lowest for feedlot finished beef They're talking about environmental impacts here and saying that feedlot beef has a lower environmental impact lower equal smaller ecological footprint then pasture finished beef and I Thought how can this possibly be? So picking through that paper some more I started to figure out Why that could be? In their materials and methods they use this standard figure calves weaned pasture in Iowa finish at 505 kilograms That's about 1111 pounds in 450 days on a ration of forage and hay That's a long time to spend finishing a cow or a steer Yeah, so these are the figures used by that pelleteer paper The grass-fed beef finish time 450 days a year plus three months, so That's the time post weaning Okay, so that's like 15 months plus seven months at weaning age they assumed I know grass-fed beef often goes longer, but they were assuming seven months in that paper So you're looking at 22 months Compared to feedlot beef finish time post weaning 10 months and getting a much larger animal out of the deal So that's that's where This paper was winding up with some really negative negative impacts from grass-fed beef because these animals were taking so long to finish and That was feeding into the analysis in this paper of you know Impact acreage the amount of acreage that was needed to carry that animal for that long So where do these figures come from well, one of the co-authors on that paper was Rich Pirag and he Used to be here at Iowa State University Extension. He's now in Michigan But I was you know, I knew who he was through my Mesa work And so I got ahold of him and said Where did you get these figures? Why are you using such a long? Finishing time for grass-fed beef because from my own experience. I knew I could finish an animal on grass quicker than that Maybe not a lot heavier, but certainly quicker So he said well we didn't have published data and so we went with some Estimates put together by beef researchers in Iowa from grass-fed production that they had seen and that's what they told us and Like well, this is a published research journal and you're using somebody's guess, okay So So a couple things I knew about grass-fed production is that a lot of grass-fed beef Production is done with heritage beef breeds and a lot of it is done on pastures that are kind of indifferently managed and so So I knew or I was pretty sure that those numbers were confounded by the beef breed and by the level of management and so What the paper was doing was taking like modern Angus or modern hereford beef genetics in the feedlot system and comparing that to kind of an average grass-fed number that included heritage beef breeds and some Sketchily managed pasture and it wasn't a fair comparison So I wanted to know okay, what would happen if you took a modern beef breed that has been bred for a production and Put it in a very well managed pasture Grazing situation to produce grass-fed beef would you still get that poor of a performance? from the grass-fed beef and That question is where this project starts Rich pierog said yep that could have made a real difference because You know the length of time to finish was something that really Really made the grass-fed beef look bad in that research that they did and Then he said to me if you get a chance to collect the data Do it because we didn't have published data and so that kind of dropped the responsibility right back on my shoulders And I said okay, we'll try to collect this data So these are the collaborators all of all of these people are in Minnesota. They're all kind of in the eastern third of Minnesota Edgar Brown is up in the Duluth area. Jake and Lindsey grass are in Pine City, which is north of the Twin Cities I'm in Palisade, Minnesota, which is kind of northeast central a ways west of Duluth and Bill McMillan is from down by Rochester And we were using some different breeds But I tried to find people who were using modern breeds and as you can see the grasses have Scottish Highlander Which is a heritage breed? But they were They were managing them as a separate group from their more modern genetics Which also included some British white and airshire, so not strictly modern, but they did have the black Angus in there And that was kind of serendipitous I had wanted to use British breeds only but it turned out to be a really good thing that Jake grass had those Scottish Highlanders And you'll see why in a bit Okay, we we had some really different Types of forage that we fed our animals, especially in the winter we did hay testing and So some of these RF fees are pretty low and then McMillan's is really high Bill McMillan is a former dairy farmer and he was using his dairy infrastructure around Rochester, Minnesota to produce some pretty good alfalfa hay and alfalfa haylage and doing bunk feeding and so he was really in a you know a high production type of situation Edgar Brown has a farm in an area that Scott he's using some runout pastures He's doing his own haying all by himself. He's like almost 80 So he had some pretty poor quality hay that he was feeding He was letting his animals sort it so the animals were getting a little better than that RF fee might indicate grass meadows farm were running a bunch of animals on rental property and renting hay ground and Using several different types They were trying to keep three different types of feed in front of their animals at all times So that the animals could kind of sort and then I was using round bales that my brother Hade and I bought from him and it's you know It's not the most wonderful relative feed value on there either But all of us were kind of locked into our systems for various reasons and so this is what we had So here's where we start to see the bottom line We we took weights on these animals in 2012 on the 2011 calf crop and we took weights in 2013 on the 2012 calf crop and in between we did We didn't do birth weights because a lot of us weren't set up to do that. We're calving out on pasture. It wouldn't work but we did Birth dates so that we knew exactly how old the calves were at slaughter then because we could go back to their birth date and We took weaning weights and we took Pre-pasture weights before they were turned out the second summer after they were born and then final slaughter and live weights Live weight and carcass weight and So these show the carcass weights age of animal versus carcass weights and compares the weights that we found on these animals with the figures that came out of that Life-cycle analysis paper, which were kind of a standard feedlot and a standard grass-fed figure so the standard feedlot and grass-fed figures from that paper are shown by the vertical lines and And then the weights From those paper from that paper are shown by the circles on those vertical lines And then all the data that we collected from our farms Are the are the scattered? Dots and triangles and squares and X's So here's the cluster of the grass meadows Scottish Highlander cattle and it overlaps the standard grass-fed carcass performance from the paper But most of these were either lighter or took longer to finish And so that's why it was serendipity that Jake grass had those Highlander cattle because we could you know We could map those out and show that yes the heritage breed Definitely was dragging down the average of grass-fed and here's their Angus Galbae herd, which also Overlapped and was really the closest to the average of that grass-fed average from the paper Okay, and here's Edgar Brown's herd, which was a little bit more spread out for finishing ages He had run into some breeding problems He he was kind of disappointed with the performance of his cattle But it did overlap that grass-fed average and some of them performed better Okay, so those are those three clusters of forms farms that overlapped that grass-fed average from the life cycle analysis paper and then here's Bill McMillan and All of his animals finished sooner and at a higher carcass weight than the average grass-fed You can see that there's that little circle of the average grass-fed and then all of his animals are up and to the left of it and His slaughter ages were right in line with the feedlot average and then there's mine Actually, this project was a really humbling experience for me But bill is clearly doing better in terms of carcass weights And I was I was getting my finishing times right in line with feedlot, but the weights weren't up there Okay, so there are all those clusters of the different groups of animals that we looked at and That's a lot of stuff to look at and if you're feeling like you're just not getting it That's fine because I felt the same way when I looked at this and went You know, okay, we got to make this a little bit clearer so Here's so I came up with an age weight index and these are the age weight Indexes of the feedlot beef and the grass-fed beef in that life cycle analysis study the average age at slaughter 16.9 months carcass weight estimate 840 pounds for feedlot beef and Then you just divide those divide the weight by the age at slaughter and come up with a age weight index of 49.7 and then the grass-fed beef same thing divide the carcass weight at slaughter by the age at slaughter and Come up with that index of 26.5 and then I did that for all of the animals in the study Which we could do because we knew their exact ages because we had their birth weights their birth dates and we had their slaughter dates and so I could calculate their exact ages to the day and Then plotted that and Okay, this is starting to Be a little more clear So these are the age weight indexes and the horizontal lines now are the ones from the life cycle analysis paper We've got the feedlot almost up at 50 We've got the grass-fed at 26.5 and then you can see how all the animals in the study stacked up to it And that circle point up there is one of Bill McMillan's steers that finished out at like 749 pounds in 14 months from birth Okay, so that one exceeded the age weight index for feedlot Okay, and you can see that there are quite a few of the animals that exceeded it for grass-fed Okay So And here's just another way to show the same data. We've got the on the right hand side of the chart there's the Life cycle analysis feedlot age weight index and the grass-fed age weight index and that horizontal line is the grass-fed level from the paper and Then you can see that McMillan's On average was on average was lower than the feedlot, but quite a bit higher than the grass-fed kind of midway between it Mine was a little bit higher than grass-fed that's because of the earlier age, but as I mentioned the weights weren't great and And then browns and grass meadows were either on the line or below it So What do we know now? So now we know that livestock breed matters a lot when you're comparing grass-fed systems to feedlot systems and if you're Looking at doing that kind of comparison you really need to pay attention to what breeds of livestock are in each one And if you're comparing, you know heritage breed grass-fed to modern breed Feedlot, yeah, you're going to see worse performance from the grass-fed, but it's not necessarily because grass-fed is bad a Grass-fed system has the potential to approach the feedlot system in productivity if you're looking at that index of carcass weight produced in a given time frame so You know not all of the animals made it there But Bill McMillan had one that exceeded it and a bunch that were close And so what that tells me is that there is room for improvement of grass-fed beef production systems because there was this whole This whole spread of performance and You know and some of the animals were performing very very well And so there's room within each farm for improvement to get up to the top level of and that farm And there's room between farms for improvement And I think that's something that's really important to keep hammering because what I've heard from some beef researchers is that Grass-fed it takes you 24 months to get an 1,100 pound animal. That's it. That's all you'll ever get You know and it seems really defeatist to me But you look at this data and you can see there's no reason to be defeatist about that There is improvement to be made and if we pay attention and work on it. We can get better Okay, I'm going to quickly go through some average daily gains So these are average daily gains of the McMillan farm and this is 2013 2012 born calves only so data from 2012 and 2013 And So it's not a real big sample size. It's just one year and as you'll see the weather on some of the farms impacted this in 2012 so so Bill McMillan's got 272 days from birth to weaning and 91 days from weaning to pasture and 153 days from pasture to finish and That's you know, he's he's doing a good job grass meadows The average daily gains you know Pretty decent, but he's got a really long time in there of the pasture to finish time frame He's got 370 days on that And here's his Scottish Highlander calves and again the pasture to finish He's got 446 days on that they were taking a really long time to finish and their average daily gains were not so high. Oh And here's mine. This was painful. So This was again 2012 born calves and We had the pasture to finish average daily gains darn near nothing And So what happened here is that I actually had some loss of weight in the days from pasture turn out to slaughter in the first days after they went out on pasture and This is for okay. This shows 2012 and 2011 born steers What was happening here is we had some really tough weather in 2012 especially we were We were in flood conditions the same flood that hit the city of Duluth, Minnesota and You know, I could watch it I could watch the weight melting off my cattle that summer we had six weeks of wet feet and Then three weeks of extreme heat and humidity and I had foot rot It was dreadful. So so that did affect what the animals were able to do and It also looks like there's an adjustment period for going from the winter hay to the spring pasture again, we had that tremendous amount of moisture we had tremendous growth of washy pasture and Perhaps not the best quality winter forage and so Yeah, that's not a good situation Okay, so again looking at the relative feed values here one thing I personally learned is that You know taking those bale rings away and letting the animals sort the hay if you've got some not so High-quality forage is actually a pretty good thing to do and so I've done that now I'm not in a position to get my relative feed value up because I'm not going to feed grain I'm grass-fed and my customers appreciate that and I'm I'm buying feed from my brother. I'm buying hay That's produced within a close area of my farm and I'm not going to change that but what I can change is letting the cattle sort the hay and Actually, I'm seeing better body condition scores this winter from letting them do that Okay, and this is the McMillan farm and you're not seeing any similar pattern of negative Average daily gain when they go out on pasture, but Bill's got that again really high quality winter feed He's keeping the cattle on high quality stuff all the time up until they go out on pasture, and it just seems like maybe He's not seeing that drop because of they're not being such a disparity in quality Comparative economics of the four farms. Okay in the report. I've got a lot more detail on this and how this was all calculated I did not pick through each farmers financial records. I didn't want to have that level of knowledge of their personal finances and And also a lot of us have particular things that we do like Bill McMillan is Doing some sale of hay and buying back other hay and and Edgar Brown has Deals where he's getting really really inexpensive access to hay ground And I'm getting a price break on the hay that I buy so So I standardized all of this based on the prices at the sock center Minnesota hay auction in November of 2014 So this does not reflect the actual finances of each farm But it's a standardized picture of how we stack up if you're looking at what we're feeding how much we're feeding the steers What kind of carcass weights we're getting and then the pricing is also standardized Based on the USDA's grass-fed beef marketing report So it also doesn't reflect the actual prices that the farmers are getting but it's a standardized figure So looking at that The dollars per steer net Actually Edgar Brown came out the winner with an extremely low-cost system where he's feeding Poor quality hay. I mean it was relative feed value of 90. He's letting the cows sort it so he's feeding a lot of it working on very cheap kind of run-down hay ground with old equipment and doing all the work himself and Managing his pastures very very carefully to get the maximum grazing that he can out of those pastures and Keeping animals as long as he needs to to get them up to the weight that he wants to have them at for his sale And he's getting $124 per acre net which I can tell you in his part of Carlton County, Minnesota is pretty darn good Okay, and then grass meadows farm actually was the lowest dollars per steer of net So I was happy. I was not the lowest on one single category here And Bill McMillan, you know, he's a higher cost Operator and he's told me that a number of times. I'm a high-cost operator but he was also getting phenomenal steer weights and grossing high dollars per steer and you know his dollar per steer net was pretty decent and his productivity per acre was the highest and that $332 per acre net is pretty competitive with Corn and bean cropping in his area down by Rochester, Minnesota and more competitive now than it was a couple years ago Okay, so like I said, I've got this long detailed report that goes through all the Calculations that I did to figure this stuff out and if you want to find it It's on the SARE website and you go to www.sare.org And then go to project reports and Then from there search the database and search it with that title and And or my name and it'll pop up and you can get the reports and a copy of this PowerPoint And a four-page little summary of the key points from that from that study Yeah, the question is about about carcass yield and then retail cut yield from the carcasses for grass-fed beef and On the carcass yield. I used a 52 percent Yield figure which is lower than you would see for feedlot beef We did the calculations on the animals in this study and Bill McMillan's were he had a few that were up over 55 percent, but but most of them in the study were more in that 50 to 54 percent range and so we used 52 percent And then the question was okay. What about going from the carcass weight down to retail cuts? None of us in the study at this at this time were marketing retail cuts so Edgar was selling to Thousand Hills cattle company I Was selling primarily to individual customers as quarters and halves Bill McMillan and Jake grass were both Let's see Jake was selling to Thousand Hills and Bill was selling to another Local distributor down in southeastern Minnesota, and so we don't know we don't know the retail cutout on that We just know the the carcass Okay, question No, there was a land charge I put in cash rents which Was a little bit difficult because You know there's good data on that for southern Minnesota Rochester area as you go north and northeastern Minnesota it gets a little if-year and Like in Aiken County where I am and Carlton County where Edgar is they're just There were barely figures for cash rent because corn and soybeans are not Are not a thing so we pulled together some estimates and then for Grazing land because you know some of us had crop land that was tillable even if low value and and then pasture land that is what the National air culture statistics service calls pasture land, which is not tillable. It's grazeable, but not really tillable for that figure down in the Rochester area we came up with an estimate of thirty five dollars per acre for A pasture rent and for northern Minnesota Yeah, it's it would be essentially zero We put a small dollar amount on it just to have something there But that pasture land if you're willing to throw a fence around it you can often get it for Nothing, so yeah those figures are in there Yeah, okay question about elimination of the round bale feeders and how many am I feeding and how many had I have a pretty small herd I've got 12 cows that I'll be calving this spring and I'm I'm feeding bales that are like about 1600 pounds 15 to 1600 pound round bales so I'm allowing myself eight bales per cow and This is northeastern Minnesota. We get quite a bit of below zero weather So, you know, I have to allow for more hay than you might think of down here in Iowa So I'm outwintering I've got the bale set up in a grid pattern out in my field and I'm allowing the cows You know, probably three bales at a time so that all of them can get at the hay and have enough to Not be bored and go looking for trouble And You know, it's it's working for me You do have more of what you would call waste but I don't call it waste because it's going back on to the pasture and breaking down and being Organic matter that's applied to the soil and I am Not paying Full market price for my hay. I'm getting it from my brother. I arranged for the hauling of it off the field He doesn't have to deal with any shipping costs. So, you know, it's a it's a cheaper hay price and It kind of washes out with having to have more hay for the cows and letting them sort through it and not eat all of it Yeah, question about whether we evaluated the the grade of finish on the carcass and no, we didn't we just looked at weights because that's all that was in that life cycle paper that irritated me so And you know and a number of us were Direct marketing. I mean I was doing a hundred percent direct marketing Bill and Jake and Edgar were all doing some direct marketing. It wasn't so much of a concern for us with those and The ones that were sold to Thousand Hills or hidden stream the other southeast Minnesota distributor You know, I I don't have the numbers off the top of my head, but they were grading well I'm sure you're right question about The average daily gain for finishing on pasture Yeah, there's there's a lot more improvement to be done I mean this particular group of farmers wasn't hitting that and and yet even so Bill with particular animals was able to approach feedlot efficiency. So, you know and these are These are kind of northern Minnesota eastern Minnesota cool season grasses I think you might be able to see higher gains with some of the Like grazing on big bluestem with higher protein in the fall type of thing Other places where there's a longer grazing season and you can get higher productivity of hybrids grasses throughout the season which We weren't able to do so. Yeah, I mean there's plenty of room for you know, even Getting more grass-fed animals above that feedlot efficiency line What were my pastures like they were quackgrass and Timothy and red clover and some birdsfoot tree foil primarily Yeah, question about whether I'd considered warm season grasses in my mix. No Because where I'm at in northeastern Minnesota, we rarely have a warm season, you know That may change with climate change. We'll see but Yeah, up there. We don't really see a summer slump We don't get the the sustained hot temperatures in July and August We've had frost every single month of the year up there July 1st one year August 23rd, you know So we don't really I think the benefit of warm season grasses for areas where you consistently see that summer slump and that late Summer early fall drought. It would be great. We don't consistently see that and so So the cool season grasses are What we rely on up there


Cassius, you know Cassius Winston Beautiful transition Goins is tough. Nice run here Down the middle lane everybody You can do that. I love his shot. Why not? Yeah, it's gone by they hurt you. So no, that's a tough entry the angle Anything else rejected goings got a hand on it textbook, Michigan State here Nice little angle pass got a piece of the backboard that pushes it up the lane free Little bit late again, he could be a factor Clearly with Michigan State. Tom's guys are right where you want them to be He'll gives it up Singleton from downtown Langford again boy loves that spot Winston for three tastes good He's got a great strength I'll leave with the dump down to spin that was Gets it to go. Let's get him on the box He didn't need any iron that time I like daddy the little use of the right hand on the spin out And not covering because of fatigue Time out six dishes for Winston McQuaid knocks down his first tray. Well, it just got a dose of that physicality right there Beautifully done McQuaid Wilkes pulls up that's a beautiful shot. Nice driving to the lane Great recovery by Brown. Yeah Nice hesitation. How about that boy throws the defender? Quaid clears Nobody back. No, oh brown. How about that late recovery? Orange on the other end of slam. How badly does he want it? Strong move again Wilkes on his own Test the ball or make it a play like this. Yeah, McQuaid gets you out of a zone and a heartbeat Force them to play more half-court pretty beautiful work really rounded into a coach's dream And you know, it was a hot and cold situation with her from when he's been on the floor to spell war McQuaid again. Wow. She doing a job pretty Wilkes That's as open a shot as you're gonna get No man from Nigeria. Yeah, there's a three ball going Wuba wants it. That's why good patience. Yeah For lost tonight Grand names all Basketball How about that help the basket block was winding down so he had the law 87 67 your final


The Pipeville City Police Department will be holding its annual Christmas with the first responder event for some lucky children this weekend in downtown Pipeville. Recently, we caught up with some of the staff at the Pipeville Police Department for more information on this event. We're having the Christmas with the first responder this weekend, which is the fire department, police department. It's an event that we have every year except for the last couple of years. This is the first year we're getting to with all of its full activities, which is we get the kids, they give us a list of children, their likes, their hobbies, things like that, and we go shopping for them. And we spend a good amount of money and we have them breakfast. We have Santa, hold nine yards over there. It's going to be held at the Great School cafeteria, which is a great place to have it. It's great parking and it's easy for them to because they want to play with their toys they get and things like that. So it's making enough space where they can just turn the presents open and get to it right there. It's Saturday from 9am to noon. It's going to be a joint effort between the fire department and police department. All of our corporate sponsors will be there and it's going to be it's always a fun time. It's a great time for us. Games will be played, music. It's one of the few times that you'll see all the firemen and all the policemen together in one spot. And it gives us time to be with each other too. We don't see each other a lot through the year and it's we're all big kids. So when those gifts start coming open, we're going to be playing with the toys too with them and helping them. And it's just an event that will bring you back down to reality of there's some people in this world that are less fortunate and we want to make sure that they have a great Christmas and that's what and we do it. Try to do it every year. So here at Pikeville Medical Center's Heart and Vascular Institute, we have assembled a comprehensive team of cardiac specialists bringing expertise from all regions of the nation and the world. We have coupled that with cutting-edge technology providing them the best equipment and operating rooms available. The result is comprehensive cardiac care for the people of our region that is second to none. The Heart and Vascular Institute at Pikeville Medical Center. We also spoke with police records administrator Elizabeth Thompson. Thompson notes that this year's event will be one of their largest yet. This year we got 40 kids. That makes 22 families because we take in whole families when we shop for kids and that's the most that we have done. This is the largest year we've had. So that is all because the community came back and supported us and they contributed and cheered us on and now kids at Christmas are they're going to have a really good Christmas. We do fundraising all year along. We do it with the dunk tank. We do it with cuffs and hoses our 5k race. My Hami visits the police station that will also go towards fundraising efforts towards Christmas with the first responder or if people just want to come in and bring in a donation they can stop by the police department and they can ask for me or chief riddle or just about anybody and we'll get you taken care of. For Mountain Top News, I'm Joshua Sloan.


Good afternoon, everybody. My name is Nancy Limburg. I'm the president of the United States Institute of Peace and I'm delighted to welcome everybody here this afternoon and to those who are here with us as well as those who are watching online. Welcome to USIP's global headquarters and a special welcome to our esteemed guest of honor, Pakistani Foreign Minister Qureshi and Ambassador Siddiqui. We're very honored to have you here with us today. As many of you know, the US Institute of Peace was founded by the US Congress in 1984 as an institution that is independent, nonpartisan, but national and dedicated to reducing violent international conflicts. And we do this by working with partners around the globe in the belief that peace is very possible, it's quite practical, and it is essential for our collective security. Pakistan has long been a country of particular focus for us and our Pakistani program is one of the largest here at the Institute. Even as attention in this town has shifted to other global matters, we have maintained our focus on the importance of Pakistan and continue our presence in country. We've been active in Pakistan since 2013. We partner with a network of civil society organizations, innovators, scholars, and policy makers to support local programs. We conduct research and analysis and we frequently convene local peace builders there. So we've supported programs in cities and villages across the country focusing on tolerance of diversity and using the enormous energy around arts, media, and culture to foster dialogue and peace education. And so our partners in Pakistan have engaged more than 130,000 young people in peace building activities and I've had the great fortune to visit our partners and seen the tremendous impact of the work that our team and our Pakistani partners are doing have had in promoting peace in that country. So we also work with state institutions including the police to promote police community relations and to encourage police reform to improve their capacity to address conflict non-violently. We use our trusted networks in the US government and inside Pakistan to facilitate 1.5 and track two dialogues to offer opportunities for policy specialists and those close to decision making in both countries to think through more creative solutions out of the box ideas to break policy deadlocks. And we've also supported India-Pakistan dialogues where track one procedures have stalled. So here in our global headquarters we bring people together frequently from a variety of perspectives and views and sectors to hear perspectives of perspectives of policy makers and leaders as the way to link research policy and practice between Washington and Islamabad. So today we are very honored to host His Excellency Shama Mood Qureshi, the Foreign Minister of Pakistan. This is his first visit to Washington since taking office. Certainly not your first visit either to USIP or to Washington. He is a well-known partner here having previously served as Foreign Minister from 2008 to 2011. And so it's a wonderful opportunity to have someone able to do the job a second time with the experience and the wealth of knowledge that you bring. The minister is a great friend of the Institute. This year for the International Day of Peace, September 21st, Foreign Minister Qureshi collaborated with Together for Peace, which is one of our partners as well in Pakistan and hosted young peace ambassadors at his home in appreciation of their dedication to tolerance and building peace. So thank you for that. Today the Foreign Minister joins us to discuss Pakistan's foreign policy at a particularly critical time. Following Pakistan's general elections in July of this year, PTI came to national power for the first time. PTI campaigned on change, promising to battle corruption, build institutions, and put Pakistan first. And so as the new government enters its second month in office, the US and the broader community are all eager to hear, waiting to hear what Pakistan's new foreign policy outlook will be. So Foreign Minister Qureshi joins us following probably a very exhausting but hopefully productive week at UN General Assembly meetings last week. You've already, he has already met with Secretary of State Pompeo as well as National Security Advisor John Bolton. So we thank you, Foreign Minister Qureshi, for the opportunity to hear today your insights on the new Pakistan government foreign policy and what we can expect from Pakistan's engagement on the world stage. After the Foreign Minister's opening remarks, USIP's Associate Vice President for the Asia Center, Moide Yusuf, will host a moderated discussion with the Foreign Minister before taking your questions. Excuse me. We have no cards to collect your questions so we encourage you to write them down and pass them to our USIP colleagues in the aisles. Finally, for those of you who want to participate in today's event online, you can follow us on Twitter and take part in the conversation using hashtag Qureshi USIP. Before we begin, I want to give everybody a quick heads up. You probably heard it on NPR or read it in the paper. There will be a FEMA test, an emergency alert broadcast taking place in about 15 minutes. Please turn off your phones, like totally turn them off and then we don't, we'll avoid or minimize the disruption to our program but don't be alarmed, it's just a test and it will be happening nationwide. So with that, please join me in welcoming to the stage his Excellency Minister Qureshi. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. A short comment on the title. New government, yes, we are two months old so we are certainly a new government and change your continuity. Continuity means a stalemate, so change we must for improving lives of people. Thank you Nancy, thank you for the introduction and thank you USIP for the invitation. I've been here before in a different capacity but I'm glad to be here again. You're doing a wonderful job as an institution and would love to work with you. Mitt, Secretary Pompeo, when he visited Islamabad on the 5th of September, that was the first engagement, a high-level engagement after a long pause with this administration. In my view, it was a good meeting. It was a constructive engagement. He had spoken to the Prime Minister a few days earlier when he called to congratulate him on his electoral victory. He also met the Prime Minister and the other leadership while he was in Pakistan. My meeting with Secretary Pompeo and the National Security Advisor, Mr. Bolton, yesterday I think was useful, engaging and forward-looking. We had decided when we met in Islamabad that we will reconvene, pick up the threads from where we left them in Islamabad and at the end of the UNGS session, we will have another round and we did that. I'm going back with hope. One has been hearing about disappointments, failed expectations, exasperation, but then you always have to think of hope and change. And I'm going back with a positive view of hope and change. Bilateral relationship, U.S.-Pakistan bilateral relationship has been, as most of you know, cyclical. We've had our highs and we've had our lows. The last two years in particular, I would say, were difficult. And let's acknowledge they were difficult. And one is here to reconnect and one is here to rebuild. What, in my view, is an important relationship to achieve our collective objective, which is peace, reconciliation and stability. History tells us whenever we've engaged and whenever we've cooperated, it's been to our mutual advantage and both sides have benefited, whether it was the Cold War, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan or estimating al-Qaeda. So, there is a positive side and we should always look at the positives as well. Highlighting, pointing out the negatives is very easy. Building positivity at times is difficult. Is that the alert? It'd be unfair. I've seen, read a lot of criticism and I think it's unfair not to recognize the contributions Pakistan has made to the successes that you've had in Afghanistan and you've had successes despite the challenges. Just to highlight a few, the G-LOGs and the ALOGs and the continued support that we're giving has not only saved billions of dollars, it has contributed to your success in Afghanistan. Just to put in perspective, over 500,000 containers went through Pakistan and the cargo was treated as diplomatic cargo. Dealing with al-Qaeda, our contribution should not be overlooked. 950 of them were killed and over 1100 handed over. Similarly, to blame Pakistan for all the difficulties in Afghanistan, in my view, again, would be unfair. We cannot and should not be held responsible for the failures in Afghanistan, whether it's poor governance, corruption or disunity within the Afghan government. They have contributed to the challenges. We in Pakistan recognize that peace, stability and security, to achieve peace, stability, security, good, neighborly relations with Afghanistan are critical. What do we want to see in Afghanistan? They're a sovereign country. They will take their decisions and we have to respect their decisions. But what do we want to see? We would want to see a democratic, progressive, peaceful and inclusive government in Afghanistan. They will decide who comes them. We have no favorites in Afghanistan. People talk of safe havens in Pakistan and lot has been written about it. But we are concerned about eliminating safe havens that exist today in Afghanistan under your watch. So that is a concern for us. Reduction and violence is our collective objective and growth in production of narcotics, perhaps I was reading somewhere, it went up by 87% last year, is a concern. Being a lower riparian, we share waters. Protection of water rights is also one of our concerns. Border management is important. Border controls and a collaborative approach is, we think, is going to be important. Afghanistan refugees and there are 2.7 million still in Pakistan. Their return in a time-bound manner, we think, will contribute to peace and security in Pakistan. Today, we have a new arrangement in Pakistan and this new arrangement between Afghanistan and Pakistan and this new arrangement called APAPS was launched on the 22nd of July this year. This is putting in place a mechanism, a structured institutionalized mechanism for a continuous dialogue to address all the issues that exist between us. I, yesterday and today, I had the opportunity of meeting senators, members of the House, so my embassy kept me busy in the Congress. I would want to, honestly, I would want to invite members of Congress to come and visit Pakistan and I would like you to go to the areas that were called the tribal belt and see for yourself the difference that we have made in the last few years.  It's important for you to see, go and see and form an opinion. I think, and our government thinks, people in Pakistan think that we have made considerable progress and this did not happen overnight. Mindsets do not change overnight. They evolve. Time is important. A shift takes place. It's a transition. Let's not forget many of the people that have been challenging you and us. At one time, we're considered friends in Mujahideen. We're trained and supported and armed. Despite challenges that we have and a continuous provocation on the eastern side, on our eastern border within India, we have deployed 200,000 troops on the western side. Our operations have been recognized and acknowledged as successful. As the title says, there's a new government in Pakistan and this new government has an agenda and the agenda is for change, social, economic change and development. A people-centric agenda. That can only be put into practice if we have peace and stability, if we have on both sides of the border and we want peace and stability so that we can concentrate on health and education and jobs and drinking water. That is the priority of this new government. And for that, we have a common challenge and a common objective of achieving or moving in that direction. And fortunately, there is a new approach that I see in the making and that is a new convergence that is taking place that there is no military solution. And we have to look for a negotiated political solution. The NUG government in Afghanistan seems ready for that. The President of Pakistan and the Prime Minister of Pakistan has been advocating that for years. It was called different names because of this advocacy. But today, gradually, everybody is inclining that way, that perhaps this is the most sensible way forward. And the President Administration is also inclined in that direction. So this new convergence, this is in the making, is a great opportunity. And I think this opportunity should not be missed. How did this happen? Because of a shift in public opinion. Why we were successful in managing things on our side of the border? Simply because public opinion shifted when terrorism hit us on the face and when our school children were affected, our investments were compromised, our daily lives were affected. That's where the change came. And that is where a new political debate started. And it evolved into a national action plan. All political parties, different shades of political opinion are now and today agreed that this is the way forward. We cannot surrender to terrorism. We will have to take them on. And we will have to clear our areas. And we have successfully done that. Well, it's work in progress. We will have to continue to build on what we've achieved. But to a large extent, things have changed. I think this shift should be recognized. Perhaps it is not being recognized enough. And disengagement, when this shift has taken place and is taking place, is perhaps not the way forward. That's the last thing you want. Continuation, cooperation and engagement is what perhaps is required. Cutting off training, not giving equipment, precision equipment that could have been used against terrorism. I don't know to what extent that will help. But in my view, it will not help. Collectively, we can achieve our shared objective. Blame game will not be productive. And I have been saying that. You can say that. Blaming and shaming is very easy. Where will it get us? Look at the statements of the last one year. Have they helped? No, they have not. So we have to adopt a different approach. Yes, there is a trust deficit and that needs to be bridged. And it must be bridged. We have a shared objective. The strategy to achieve that shared objective is more or less we're on the same page. So we have to trust each other. There is no other way. There is no other way. Individually, we might not be able to achieve what we want to, but collectively in my opinion, we can. I focused on this bilateral relationship only and by design because I have come to the conclusion that my bilateral relations with the United States are dependent on the situation or the improvement of the situation in Afghanistan. So my road to Washington is via Kabul. And that is why the first destination I chose after having been sworn as Foreign Minister was Kabul. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Minister for that very eloquent, as always, and comprehensive sort of overview of where things are. May I request before I begin, I think every time you turn your phone back on, we will have an alert. So rather than have 250 alerts, if we can please leave them off for a while, we'll get through the conversation. The foreign minister has also insisted that he take questions directly. So we won't have cards. We'll have people who will get you, but let's begin with a conversation, if we will. I did not insist. I have no choice. Over. Matter of perspective. So let me, Minister, begin by asking you sort of put out both the positive and perhaps the challenge here. And you started off by saying that you've got to look at the positive side. Let me perhaps begin by asking you, you must have come here with a goal in mind. Are you going back with that goal achieved? And if so, what exactly is that? I can't say that in a couple of settings, you've achieved your goal. But what I can say is that if I go back with this impression that I've been able to halt the slide, to me, that would be an achievement, first halt the slide and then gradually build the trust. It'll take time. It won't happen overnight because expectations have been different. Perhaps we've expected things from the US and they've not been met and you've expected things from Pakistan and they've not been met. So a realistic, honest, pragmatic approach is required and I'll be candid and I'll be honest. And this is what I said to the Secretary yesterday that I believe that honesty and only honesty is the way forward. There is no other way and we should, we should promise what we can deliver. And if we cannot, then we should sit and see why do we have, what is the reservation? What is holding us back? Let's try and understand that and see how we can help each other overcome that hurdle. Sure, sure. Perhaps let me also ask then, in the meetings you've had, you've been on the Hill, you've met the Secretary, the National Security Advisor, is there something new that you have heard and something from you that they may have heard which may suggest change in the future given the title?  So I was expecting a very hawkish approach, a very sort of, you know, a dressing down approach that pleasantly did not take place. I felt that Secretary Pompeo was ready to listen, which I thought was very positive. I was, I met a number of senators and, you know, the brief that the mission provided, this senator is very hawkish on this, this issue being ready to be mowed. But, but... We have another test for you here coming up, but... Oh, well, that I'm... Perhaps, yes. I spoke too early, too soon. But I thought they were, they were beginning to listen and engagement I think is very important.  So I am slightly more hopeful. Okay. That's, that's, that's honest. I think you talk about what happened behind closed doors and your interaction in the last couple of days. I have a quote which I just picked up before I came here, which reflects the other challenge in this relationship, which is public opinion. Both sides, there's a very negative perception of the other, almost demonization of the other, if you will. Pakistan is clearly not, not the favorite country in this town. And then in Pakistan, of course, there are views. So I just wanted to read to you what I picked up from the Pakistani press this morning and perhaps ask for your reflection on this. While the media expected a joint statement, both sides released separate statements explaining how far this attempt to reset, you talked about the reset, of course, when the secretary visited Islamabad, had gone. The conscious, the cautious silence on both sides, however, indicated that the talks were not as successful as expected. I don't know who wrote this piece. This is from Don. Don. I would love, I'm not surprised to begin with. Secondly, okay, I'm sorry. I would love, I would love the editor of the Don to assist me when I come again. And I'll be sort of wiser if he's there and love to have his input because, you know, nobody is all knowing. It's very easy to pick holes. Why do they not realize what were the statements that were coming out a year ago or a few months ago? And look at the statement that came out yesterday, or today, this morning. You can read it out. Your English is far better than mine. And tell me where is the problem? The problem is there, but there is a realization that we need to resolve it. There is a positive side to it. You want to pick holes? By all means do that. But they'll not determine or sort of put me on the back foot. I could have brought the readout. It would have not been half as exciting to put it out here. So I did that intentionally. But let me then shift to the opportunity. You've also talked about the opportunity. And I personally completely agree with you that this is perhaps the first time that the U.S. and Pakistan positions on Afghanistan may generally converge around the issue of the political settlement, around the issue of a peace process. I guess the follow-up question then is what is Pakistan specifically willing to do to help that process move forward? Because in this town, one very strong opinion is that Pakistan did not move when it was asked to do other things on the Taliban. And now there's an opportunity to bring them to the table. And perhaps there may be reluctance again. I don't know whether this is well-founded or not. We had to get our house in order. We had to get our house in order first in order to be positively engaged with you. There were different views in Pakistan. You visit the area. You know the place well. And you read and you write. There was lack of consensus within the country how to move forward. That has gradually shifted. And that shift helped the military to successfully carry out what they carried out in the tribal belt. That shift helped our movement in one direction in fixing things on our side of the border. One. Two. Number of developments have taken place which should not be overlooked. One. These areas where people thought the state of Pakistan had lost complete writ, writ has been re-established. People thought, and I see Richard Olson sitting here, that they were sort of peeping down the Margala Hills. They are not. That's the difference. And they've been pushed out. Areas have been cleared. And this has happened because of a shift in public opinion. The fact that the government and the political consensus sort of evolved to an extent that we were able to have a constitutional amendment to merge those areas that have never been merged in the last 70 years into the KP province and mainstream them. This is a development. The fact that the laws of the land would be applicable to those areas. They never did. That is a development. The fact that there were elections and people participated and people came out to vote in the tribal belt. That is a development. The fact that today we are looking at a new local government system and we want to introduce local governments in KPK doing away with the old Malik system. That is a development. And these developments are no minor developments. They should be acknowledged. Fair. Let me repeat a question that I'm sure was put to you in your conversations, which often is debated in the think tank circuit here. And let me be very sort of pointed in this. Is Pakistan willing and able to bring the Taliban to the table? Pakistan is willing and Pakistan will use all its influence to do that. We feel that Afghanistan's stability and peace is linked to us. We cannot be peaceful if Afghanistan is not peaceful. This is the realization. This is the recognition. I cannot be comfortable if situation in Afghanistan is not good. It has a direct bearing on me.  We have to have that collective approach. There is no other way. So that is the new shift that needs to be recognized. Yes, we are. But then having said that, let me qualify. And the qualification is it's a shared responsibility. There are other players in the region and they could have their priorities and their priorities might be different to us. Ours is peace stability reconciliation. Afghanistan feels that. Pakistan feels that. The U.S. feels that. But there are others. A, B, contrary to public opinion or to the largely held view here, our influence over the Taliban is diminished. We cannot. We will do our best and we'll do it in good faith trust us. We're doing it because it is in our own enlightened self interest to do so, not to please you, to protect ourselves, to protect our country. We want to do it for ourselves. Not because that is what you want. It will never happen that if you want this, it will happen. No, people have to believe that it is in my interest to do that. It is in my interest to engage. Taliban will have to feel that it is in their interest to come to the negotiating table and you have to incentivize. Then only can you rip them in. Why should they come otherwise? You mentioned others talking about the region. So let me sort of make a shift to that and ask you something about China. Of course, there's a China Pakistan economic corridor, you know, is in the news every day for all different reasons. There's a lot of discussion about that here. One of the feelings in this town, if I were to reflect that, is that there seems to be a bit of a substitution effect in the mind of Pakistan and the Pakistani policy makers. China is going to be the partner and thus the US importance is decreasing and we don't have to sort of deal with that as much. No, I don't think US importance has decreased. It will not decrease. US was, is and will remain an important global player.  We recognize that and there's a history of our relationship. Let's not forget that. China. I understand that right now there are challenges between the US-Chinese relationship, but vis-a-vis Afghanistan and that region, I am of the view and Pakistan is of the view that China can play a constructive role and China must be engaged. China has initiated a trilateral meeting, you know, they've had one in Beijing and next month in December we might have the second round of that in Kabul. So, engaging China and China has an interest in stability in Afghanistan. They have economic interests there and they have this economic corridor they are building. So, they have those interests. So, tap on those interests and have sort of when they move as a partner in the direction we want to move and I think we can. The other neighbor, the elephant in the room perhaps, the India-Pakistan relationship. We've heard a lot in the last couple of weeks. I won't let you go without a comment on that, at least. Where are we going to go from it? We saw what happened. Pakistan put out essentially an offer. There was controversy around it. It was pulled back. We understand from the press that perhaps there was success in avoiding the two foreign ministers, avoiding each other at the UN. Where does this go? Because at the end of the day, we are talking of two nuclear powers, most populous countries in the world, constantly at loggerheads. It's unfortunate. That's the way it is. Now, what does this government want? We want normalization. We want coexistence. We've got to recognize reality. Pakistan is a reality. So, is India. We have issues. How do we resolve them? This is what we, when we came in and the first statement, the first speech made by the Prime Minister, Prime Minister Murad Khan, was every step that you take towards peace, we will take two. And he meant it. It wasn't just for, you know, it sounded good. It wasn't to please anyone. It's to blunt the person to please people. He could be very straight and he can, you know, it can be very blunt. But he said that because he feels that way. The very first pressure that I had at the foreign office was, listen, this, this, this stalled, we've stalled the dialogue process. It's not good for you. It's not good for us. It's not good for the region. Now, here, when we, when we ask the US to play a role, a facilitating role, why do you ask? Why do we ask? Simply, we are not engaging bilaterally. And that bilateral disengagement is, is constantly weighing heavy on us. You know, it's a distraction. We want to focus. We want to move on the western side. We're not being able because, you know, you have to watch our back on the eastern side. Now, that is not a healthy situation to be in. Now, can you facilitate? The answer is, no, we want it bilaterally. But there is no bilateral movement. And if that lack of facilitation leads to escalation, and some of the statements that have come out late, of late have not been very helpful, you know, the so-called surgical strikes and stuff like that. Does it make sense? It does not. But that's politics. There are elections around the corner. We were not shy of engaging. I was not shy of meeting Shoshma Ji in New York. They agreed. They backed off. If the Indians have a better option, share it with us. If disengagement, if not talking to each other, will resolve and stabilize the region, fine. Then, you know, if that's their analysis, fine. Let me push a little harder on this because then there is that argument that dialogue and terrorism or alleged terrorism don't go together. So, you know, the question of Prime Minister Modi coming to Pakistan in the previous government, Steno, to meet the Pakistani Prime Minister and then the Pathanan Court attack, and then, you know, some other obviously, and then something else happens. So this, I think in Washington, I would argue shares this view completely, that there's one thing to say there's no dialogue and I'm completely with you on that. But are there certain prerequisites that Pakistan also needs to meet to actually be, you know, really hopeful of that dialogue moving anywhere? Because if after every effort, something's going to break it, we're going to be two steps back. We were not in government. We were still in the opposition. And I accompanied Prime Minister Ambran Khan to Delhi. There was a conclave that we were invited to and he was speaking there. And we were invited by Prime Minister and the Modi. We met and met him. And I'd like to quote what Prime Minister Khan said to him. He said, Prime Minister, they will always be spoilers. They will always be elements that will scuttle the process of peace. But when they do that, let's re-engage to fight them. They will push us back. But we have to see what is in our interest, what is in the regional interest, what's in Pakistan's interest. Now, having said that, they have to realize, and I think they were being simplistic if they feel that everything that's wrong on the Indian side of Kashmir is all of Pakistan's making. That is an unrealistic approach. There is a lot that has happened. You know, they should also revisit their policies and see why and how they've alienated people. Why political elements that were forming coalition governments with them have distanced themselves? Why is there a governor's rule in the Indian Occupied Kashmir? Why? She came to be the largest democracy in the world. Why? Why is that happening? Why is the UN Commissioner on Human Rights presenting this new report came out in June? It's not Pakistan saying that. The others are talking about it. Neutral bodies are talking about it. So recognize that and let's move on. Let me ask a couple more questions and then I know the audience is waiting patiently to ask you questions directly. And perhaps in the vein of preparing you for what will come, a hard question. We again go back to this thing about spoilers. And if the Indian Foreign Minister was here, I would ask the exact same question of her. The growing intolerance for diversity within the region, within societies. I mean, USIP, one of our monikers of our work in Pakistan is to promote tolerance for diversity. When the world looks at, and there's a lot of concern in this town that I heard before the elections, when the world looks at groups like the Millie Muslim League, you know, and then groups who are being mainstreamed, who've had ties, who formally, you know, say they have ties and sort of talk about it, two terrorist groups that have been declared terrorists by the world, by Pakistan, Tariq al-Abaik, Millie Muslim League. Mainstreaming them, what is the rationale and what is the optics that you think the world should take from that? Well, intolerance has grown everywhere. It's not just Pakistan. Look at the Indian intolerance, you know, look at how many minorities within India feeling. And look at the lack of tolerance all over. Today the world is more polarized than ever before. Today people are less patient than they were. Look at the flashpoints that have, you know, that have sort of developed of late. So tolerance generally has gone down. Tolerance in the region is not very high. But a statesman has to look beyond. He has to look beyond the immediate challenge. He has to have a vision for tomorrow. And I think the region needs that leadership. This is the last two. One, you've got a lot of Pakistani diaspora in the audience. Your government has made it a point to talk about diaspora and the linkages and the value of diaspora around the world. Is there a plan behind that? Is there some thinking on how constructively to engage diaspora, as many other countries have done, to improve relations? Because quite frankly, one of the things we look at is that the track one is where it is, think tanks do their work, but there is this track three space as well, that in a lot of times can develop constructive business linkages, economic linkages. Pakistan, of course, is amidst an economic crisis, the question of economic sovereignty. You know, we've heard statements about the IMF. I'm sure that came up in your conversations. But where do you see this track three, if you will, come together between the US and Pakistan? I think we have a very, we're proud of our diaspora. Pakistanis abroad have been very successful. To give you an example, Sadik Khan, the mayor of London. I mean, that also speaks volumes, you know, for the tolerance in that society. And you know, I respect Londoners for having done that. But Sajid Javed, before coming to Washington, the home secretary of Britain, you know, a young man whose parents had moved from a small town called Sahiwal on our way from Lahore to Multan. Now, 11 members of parliament, mayors. And I met a Pakistani, American Pakistani who contested for the house, perhaps in the last elections. And I forget the name, and pulled close to a million votes. Now, they are people who made a mark. And they are the people educated Pakistani in American Pakistani, Canadian Pakistani, British Pakistani, who have been to universities here, who've competed, who, when given a level playing field, have excelled and got recognition on merit. And they've interest in this country. They love this country. They're serving this country. And they are proving to be useful citizens of this country. Yet, because of their relations and friends back home, they care. And they want to contribute. That is the class of, that's the diaspora. That, I think, in my view, initiated the change in Pakistan. This change did not happen all of a sudden. This educated Pakistani American abroad, when they were sick and tired of the corruption and the poor governance and the loot and the blunder, they said, enough is enough. We want a change. We want a new leadership. We want a new party. And that's how PTI evolved as a political party. That's how a sportsman who had no interest in politics was sucked into politics, was dragged, was rude, was asked to come and play a role because the country required a new look, a new leadership, a new vision. So this diaspora is very important. And that is why we want them to have a stake in Pakistan. That is why PTI as a political party has been advocating the right to vote, to be given to overseas Pakistanis. We did that while the Electoral Reforms Committee, the Parliamentary Committee on the Reforms was debating it. We were outvoted, but we persisted, went to the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court has recognized that. And hopefully they will have, in the coming generations, we feel that these eight, nine million diaspora abroad will contribute significantly to change in political behavior in Pakistan. Final question for me. And this one is close to my heart and pains me. So allow me. We have a large population of civil society organizations in the US, in Britain, Germany, in Saudi Arabia, and you name it. And the last three or four years, we have seen nothing short of, quite frankly, a crackdown on the space for these organizations to operate. I'm talking for organizations who do peace building. I'm talking for organizations who do schools, hospitals, you name it. The space is squeezed. Genuine people who are trying to help Pakistan are either packing up or having a very hard time doing what they're there. I've heard all the concerns that there are. But as a member of this community, I can tell you that there are many, many good people and institutions who are doing great work in serious trouble. I think the day before your government took over, maybe right after, there was a new tranche of about 20 respected institutions whose applications for registration were rejected. And I'm sure there are people here, but quite frankly in this town, in other towns, this is the one question I got before I came here with the request to ask you, why is Pakistan going in this direction? And what are we going to do about this? Because ultimately, this is not good for foreign policy either. I hear you loud and clear. And you're not the only person who's raised this question. I've had interaction with congressmen and others who've raised such concerns. This happened before this government came into office. A new regulation was brought in. And under the new regulation, some international NGOs have been registered and they are functioning, and some are finding difficulty in working. I have taken it upon myself to go back and do their advocacy, and I will. Thank you. This is a special request quite frankly from the community because I think this is good for Pakistan. It's good for the US and for the world. So with that, let me open up. I know there are going to be many questions. I'll try and get through as many as we can. Let me recognize the gentleman here, and then I'll try and come to as many as I can. The gentleman right here with the hand up. And after that, we can go to the gentleman in the middle in, yeah, right here. Yes, please. Sir, this is Jahanzeh Wali from AOW News TV Pakistan. Sir, just wanted to know that you appointed a minority guy in Pakistan Economic Advisory Council, and even your information minister defended his appointment. But very next year, you asked him to step down. So where were those tall claims for providing equal opportunities to all the minorities in Pakistan? And how can you defend that decision? Thank you so much. He was recognized for his competence. I've never met the man, but one heard that he excelled in what he does. You know, he understands economics better than most of us and could be a useful contributor for an economic change, an economic restructuring in Pakistan. So his expertise was recognized and he was put on to the list of a board of advisors. There was a, we heard that an element wanted to use it as a means to destabilize things at a very early stage. So he was, and I respect him for that. He recognized that and said, I want you to contribute. If my presence is creating a problem, I can advise and pull out, but he pulled out. So unfortunately it happened, but that's the honest answer. Yes. Foreign minister, I found USIP a fountain of knowledge on Kabul, Afghanistan. I want to make two observations I picked up from here and get your feeling about it. Number one, the people subject to crime and insecurity, lack of employment. The Taliban, non-negotiables having NATO in the country and having warlords as part of the government. What are your observations on that? Do you want to quickly repeat the question? I don't think the foreign minister- Perhaps I haven't understood the question. Well, let's just take the Taliban's view on negotiables. Non-negotiable is NATO in the United States, part of NATO being in the country that has to be negotiated. Secondly, the warlords are part of the government now. How to get them out of the equation? That's a question I think I've learned. The Taliban say the US and international troops out. That's non-negotiable for them. And then there are warlords in the Afghan political setup now. How do you get them out? Perhaps a question more for an Afghan audience. I can't speak for the Taliban. I don't carry their brief. Firstly, nor do I speak for the Afghan government. But I think there's a new realization involving, sort of evolving. And that is that even the Taliban recognize that things have changed in Afghanistan. They can at best sort of maintain or stalemate. But those days are gone where they will just go in and just take over Kabul. So that's a new reality. Things have changed. And this change hopefully when people sit across the table, the new realization will dawn upon elements that were unwilling to engage. It was a stage when the Afghan governments were totally against any kind of an engagement. And now they've offered peace talks. They welcomed when President Ghani asked for a period of peace on Eid al-Fitr. And he got it. He was appreciative of that. And he recognized that. Let me come back to the audience. Then I'll ask you, but we have people who've come all the way to listen to you. And this was an oversold event. So I'm in the overflow room. So I want to give them a chance to ask your question. I have them here. The first question is that you've suggested that Pakistan needed time to get its house in order. It has done that. The Prime Minister's administration is inaugurating positive change in the country. Please explain then why earlier this week on Monday, your government's federal minister for religious affairs appeared side by side at a public conference with the head of Lashkar-e-Taiba, a terrorist organization banned by Pakistan. I'll go home and certainly ask him why he did that. But what I'm told, it was an event to highlight the situation in Kashmir. It had nothing to do with Lashkar-e-Taiba. Or there were other political elements that he happened to be one of them. I think he should have been more sensitive. But it wasn't that. He subscribes to his point of view. It's Dana Marshall, the Transnational Strategy Group. Congratulations, Minister. Pleasure to see you again. I was trying to see if I could extend your answer to one of Moïse's questions in somewhat different directions. At a time when both governments are looking to reset their relations, there are other channels where countries can cooperate, people to people, business to business. Are there some specific ideas that are being developed in Islamabad to help with exchanges on business initiatives that could help to bring the countries together at a time until the governments themselves work a little bit more cooperatively? These are areas where the government of Pakistan is very interested in helping to capacitate the population and, of course, on the economic growth side. Well, people to people contacts are important in building bridges. Unfortunately, travel advisories have to be revisited if you want improvement in people to people contacts. There are economic opportunities and we would love to invite investment into Pakistan. This morning I had a very senior delegation from Axon Mobile to meet me and they expressed an interest of investment in Pakistan. Obviously, they must have, they are a very well established organization. They must have done their homework, their spade work. So the interest that I saw this morning was very encouraging. So if they take the lead, I'm sure others can follow. There are opportunities there. There's a huge new area that can be sort of looked into and we would welcome investments into the new economic zones that we are trying to build. There's a long question that I'll summarize for you. The situation in Balochistan. Where are things, the concerns about Balochistan and sort of the restive sort of politics, security issues of minorities and human rights? Where do you see Balochistan and what is your government's vision for the province? If you look at our manifesto, when we talk about strengthening the federation, Balochistan is an important component of that federation. We feel a healing process has to be undertaken and it has, it has, the process has begun. Look at the election of 2018 and look at the turnout in Balochistan this time. Look at the amount of women participating and look at the amount of people participating.  That's a healthy sign. Obviously they want improvement and improvement has taken place. You know, the law and order situation has improved considerably in Balochistan. Hopefully, hopefully, if people are more sensitive to some of the forces that are across the border using or strengthening entities to create disturbance in Balochistan, if that somehow is checked, things can improve further and, and we improve governance. Let's not, let's not, let me not acknowledge the fact that poor governance was provided and corruption, a lot of development money was pocketed. That needs to be fixed. So, I see that men are dominating the questions here and I'm going to break that trend. We have a lady right at the back, yes, with the hand up and as the mic gets to you, we have a mic here. So, why don't you ask your question and then we'll come. So, you're right there. Please stand up and introduce yourself if you don't mind. Thank you very much. My name is Umber Jamil. I'm from Indus. Minister Koreshi, we've seen some early signals that there may be a review and a re-evaluation of the terms of CPEC with the new government. Can you point to any specific or substantive changes that you expect in the project, including economic distribution across provinces, the concessional terms of the loan or opportunities for private sector investment from foreign entities? Ma'am, we are very happy on the fact that this project, which we think is a game changer, has taken off. There are ongoing projects. We want to see early completion of those projects and we are talking to the Chinese on how to focus on areas that are important to this government. And those are areas not just infrastructure. Obviously, infrastructure is required. You need roads and railings and sort of optic fibers and everything of that sort. But you want them to help us in areas like industrial development, agricultural productivity, enhancing agricultural productivity, helping us alleviate poverty in the country. So we're talking about phase two, how to improve lives and livelihoods, how labor intensive industry can be relocated into Pakistan to give jobs. So that is an ongoing discussion and hopefully next month in November, the Prime Minister will be taking his first official visit to China to discuss this further. The gentleman at the back and then we'll come to you. Thank you, Minister. I'm Krishna Devkallamur with The Atlantic. How would you describe current U.S.-Pakistan relations compared to when you were last Foreign Minister in 2008 to 2011? I get short and sweet. A new administration with a new approach, the world different, circumstances different. And frustration at a different level, obviously. The frustration, obviously, when I meet officials, they feel that 17 years is too long a period for settlement and perhaps the appetite to wait another 17 years is not there. The lady here, please. So you spoke about voting and we certainly appreciate that, having the ability to vote as overseas Pakistanis. I remember when I was studying in Pakistan as an American, I sent my absentee ballot here back to the states. Outside of that, and I know there's a lot of, I guess, motion in terms of getting people involved, the diaspora involved, you spoke about that as well. But when we ask for concrete ways to do that, it's always give money to this organization or get involved with that organization. Outside of, and then we also, you raised the point about how those organizations don't always get to operate effectively in Pakistan because of a number of reasons. So what are the concrete ways that we can contribute as diaspora? And what are the ways that your government is engaging with the younger diaspora in Washington and in America because the number of years that I've lived in Washington, I think outside of the 23rd March event, there really hasn't been any outreach to anyone under the age of 40. So what are the ways that you would like us to contribute and what are the ways that you're engaging us? Well, to begin with, we recognize the power of youth. We are in office because of young people. It's the young people in Pakistan that put Imran Khan in office today.  What do they understand about politics? But they changed politics in the country. So we recognize the strength and the vigor of the youth and we need to engage with them in a more effective manner. On people who want to do things and feel frustrated, where to go, yes. Unfortunately, there's interaction and there's goodwill created and there is no follow-up. There is no follow-up. And people are at a loss who to contact and where to go. Now, what I have suggested, and this is not the sole responsibility of the foreign office, but I have suggested to our finance minister and to our advisor on commerce, two very capable individuals that the foreign office is willing to facilitate the role of economic diplomacy. But they have to come out with the projects. We won't. I mean, we can't. It's not our forte and we don't understand that. But we can facilitate. We can bring the diaspora, them together. So they should come. I would be very happy. I engaged when I came, I engaged with the diaspora here in Washington. You know, people travel from far distances. Almost 125, 130 people came from different parts of the country. And then I engaged with some of them in New York as well. What needs to be done is a follow-up, you know, and the concerned ministers need to engage with them. What we have now also in the pipeline are a number of task forces, you know, on specialized work. We have the Prime Minister is appointed a gentleman who would be looking after overseas investments, you know, a focal person who was lacking in the past. Because what we've seen is when we come, since the bureaucracy dealing with the issue has no direct interest. So, you know, they do the needful and they write the report and they forget about it. So we need people who are interested in the follow-up, you know, the two parties that feel they would benefit from this engagement. We need to find a way. We are looking into it and hopefully we will find one. There's a gentleman in the yellow tie here. Matt, could we get the gentleman in the yellow tie here? David. And let me ask you a question from the overflow room. The Prime Minister offered citizenship to Afghan refugees born in Pakistan. But you mentioned the safe return of the refugees. And there seems to be a contradiction according to the question. See, how did this come up? He went to visit Karachi and he met people there. And he met a lot of Biharis and Bengalis who had moved to Karachi for obvious reasons. And they were living in Karachi for the last four decades in slums, in deplorable conditions. You can't push them out. You can't send them away. They've not been given a fair treatment. They do not have the same rights as others because they don't have ID cards to get a job. And they're discriminated. So how do we help them? We have to accept this is a reality. And they are living here. Many of them were born here.  So how do we deal with them? That's how it started. And then there were some who were born, Afghans who were born in this country and have grown up here and are living here and are engaged in different kinds of economic activity. So what we're doing is studying what law permits. What is the citizenship law? Does that permit us to do so? And if it does, and on human terms, we want to consider it. We'll have a question here. And I apologize. I know there are a lot of hands. We have a hard stop at 3.30 and I'm trying my best to diversify as much as possible. I have a plane to catch. We can stay an all evening if you want. I'm sure. David Sadney formally with the US Department of Defense. You mentioned, actually stressed the importance of negotiations. One new thing that the administration did about two weeks ago was appoint a special envoy for reconciliation for peace in Afghanistan, Ambassador Salome Halazzad. The Pakistani press at least has been scathingly critical of that appointment. What is the view of the government? Are you going to be able to work with Ambassador Halazzad on this in this very important area? Ambassador Khalil Zad is well known diplomat. He's well known in Pakistani circles as well. The appointment was made by the US government and obviously we have to respect that judgment that they've exercised. I've had the opportunity of meeting him twice on this visit and he will be visiting Pakistan soon. Now, there's a background. The reason Pakistani press has been writing what they're writing, there is a background and the background is that Mr. Khalil Zad has made statements in the past which have not been put it mildly, very friendly towards Pakistan. So he's been given a new role and I hope and I hope I would urge him to be more sensitive to the opinion in Pakistan and obviously as individuals we can say what we want to but once you have an official position then you have to be more restrained and you have to be more sensitive because then only can you be an honest broker. So let me ask the last question and then I'm going to invite our President Nancy Lindbergh to come up and present a moment to you. I'm not one for written questions but I thought this was particularly pointed and would reflect the sentiment of the town. So even you, Brutus? Yes. And I apologize in advance for playing that role but I thought this was very well worded to give you a sense of what quite frankly the conversation on Pakistan is. And as it came to me Mr. Minister Pakistan is one of the most negatively perceived countries in Washington. What do you say to the policy community that argues that Pakistan's policy in Afghanistan has directly undermined US efforts to bring peace there and that Pakistan simply does not deserve to be a US partner? Why should the US show leniency towards Pakistan? Look at me, do I look negative? You can get him, that I can tell you. Well this, but this is really the, unfortunately yes, image is negative and that's why I have been encouraging greater interaction. My own readers, the people who visited, who have served there, who visited the region, the area are more sensitive and are more in sync with ground realities.  So we need more interaction and we also need to put in a greater effort to engage and improve our image. There's a lot that can be done from our side to fix it. Mr. I want to thank you for doing this, for visiting USIP again and and we hope to have you back here with that Nancy if you would please come. Thank you very much, please join me in thanking Mr. Minister. Thank you. Thank you.


Are you a student looking for ways to make extra money in 2024? Ah, the age-old struggle of juggling academics and the desire for some extra cash. Enter the world of side hustles, a fantastic solution to this conundrum. We're talking about opportunities that are flexible, profitable, and most importantly, doable. In this video, we will delve into four promising side hustles you can consider, freelance writing, online tutoring, dropshipping, and affiliate marketing. In the next few minutes, we're going to explore these four side hustles that you, as a student, can start in 2024. First up, we have freelance writing. A side hustle that flexes your creativity. Freelance writing is an excellent way to earn some extra cash. But what does it entail? Well, it's all about crafting compelling content for various clients. You could be writing blog posts, articles, product descriptions, or even social media posts. The beauty of freelance writing is that it's flexible, allowing you to work around your class schedule. Now, you might be wondering, where do I find these writing gigs? There are numerous platforms out there. Upwork and Fiverr are just two examples where you can start. These sites connect freelancers with clients who need their skills. Just create a profile, highlight your writing abilities, and start bidding on projects. As for potential income, it varies. It depends on your skill level, the type of writing you do, and the clients you work with. But with consistent effort, it's possible to make a decent income. So if you've got a way with words and you're willing to put in the work, freelance writing could be your ticket to a profitable side hustle. With a knack for words and a bit of determination, freelance writing can be a lucrative side hustle for students. Next, let's dive into online tutoring. This is a fantastic opportunity to capitalize on your academic prowess.  Online tutoring allows you to share your knowledge with others, all while earning a tidy sum. You're not just helping someone else grasp complex concepts.  It's a win-win situation. So where can you find these tutoring gigs? There are numerous platforms out there. Websites like tutor.com and CheggTutors are excellent places to start. They connect you with students from all over the world looking for help in your area of expertise. And the best part? You can earn a pretty penny. The rates vary depending on the subject and your level of expertise, but rest assured it's a lucrative side hustle. Remember, tutoring isn't just about the money. It's about helping others, fostering a love for learning, and contributing to someone else's academic journey. So if you excel in a particular subject, why not share your knowledge and make some money along the way? Our third side hustle is dropshipping. Now you might be wondering, what is dropshipping? Well, it's a retail method where you don't keep products you sell in stock. Instead, when a customer makes a purchase from your online store, you then buy the item from a third party and have it shipped directly to the customer. Sounds intriguing, right? Here's the best part. You can start a dropshipping business with minimal upfront investment. Platforms like Shopify and Aliexpress make it even easier. Shopify is your virtual storefront. While Aliexpress is your supplier, you list a product on your Shopify store and when someone buys it, you order it from Aliexpress. The supplier then sends the product directly to your customer. You never see or handle the product. This model allows you to focus solely on marketing and customer service, the core aspects of retail. And the potential profits? They can be substantial. You set your own prices so the sky's the limit. But remember, it's not a get rich quick scheme. It requires effort and strategic planning. With dropshipping, you can dip your toes into the world of e-commerce without the usual risks and costs. Last but not least, we have affiliate marketing. Now, what exactly is this? Well, it's a brilliant way to earn online where you promote other people's products and earn a commission on any sales made through your referral link. It's like being a digital salesperson, but without the hassle of inventory or customer service. So, how can a student get started with affiliate marketing? Platforms like Amazon Associates and ClickBank are a good place to begin. These platforms have a vast array of products you can choose to promote, depending on what aligns with your interests or the interests of your followers. Now, let's talk potential income. While it depends on the product and the commission rate with consistent effort and strategic promotion, it's entirely possible to generate a significant income stream. You might be thinking, but I'm just a student, I don't have a large following. Well, that's the beauty of affiliate marketing. You don't need a massive audience to start earning. You just need the right product and the right audience. With affiliate marketing, you can turn your social media or blog following into a money-making machine. So, there you have it. We've explored four promising side hustles. Freelance writing, where your words turn into cash. Online tutoring, sharing your knowledge and getting paid for it. Dropshipping, where you're the middleman in a profitable chain. And affiliate marketing, where promoting others' products can yield a tidy sum. Each of these offers unique opportunities. So, take your pick based on your interests, skills and availability. Remember, the key to a successful side hustle is passion, dedication and a willingness to learn. So, go ahead, take that first step and start making money in 2024. Before we wrap up, don't forget to follow us for more tips and tricks on how to make money as a student in 2024. We know how challenging it can be to balance studies with a side hustle, which is why we're here to help. By following us, you'll stay updated on the latest side hustles, trends and opportunities to earn while you learn. So, hit that follow button and let's make 2024 a profitable year together.


Save soil. Save soil. Save soil. Save soil. Save soil. Save the soil. Let us make it happen. There are women, there are women, we face rains now, now there are the winds. When I enter India, it's going to be the peak of Indian Monsoon. So I'm getting the whole works.


This paper proposes a new method called voxel-based marked neighborhood searching, the MNS, to detect and measure street trees for mobile laser scanning, MLS, data. The method consists of six steps, voxelization, calculation of values of voxels, searching and marking neighborhoods, extraction of potential trees, derivation of morphological parameters, and elimination of pull-like objects other than trees. The method was tested on two case studies and showed high accuracy and completeness. The derived morphological parameters, such as tree height, crown diameter, dbh, and cbh, were found to be in good agreement with field measurements. This article was offered by Hongxing Liu, Jianpeng Wu, Yan Huang, and others.