Rochester Stock Road Unified District, Board of School Directors, regular meeting Tuesday, October 5th, 2021, 6.30 p.m., Rochester campus where we are, and Viola Global Meet, where you are. And call to order. Adjustments to the agenda. Do we have any? No, no, wonderful, wonderful. Great. Signed times and timekeeper. Yep. Hello, Amy. I don't feel like I've done my best with this job yet, but I will try again. No, I think it's actually my fault that I'm not actually giving you very good times. But I'm actually gonna hold things tighter tonight. I think just I really want to try and do that. Okay, five, consent agenda, public comment. At this point, it's looking very quiet. Do we have any phone callings on? No. No. Do you have a long speech prepared? No, I don't. Okay, good. We'll say five plus, whatever. Board comment, I do have one. I think five is plenty for that. Reports to the board. And last time we ran to 40. I think we gave it 20, and I think we ran to 40. So let's compromise and do 30. And discussion items. How much do you think? 10 to 15. Let's say 15, just to be, tuition, real affiliated schools, religious. We're gonna take action. Robert's here. Okay, great. Excellent. Robert. Good. Let the record show that's board member, Robert Merrick from Rochester has just skipped in. That's eight, three. Budget presentation, student support budget. What do you think, Jamie, on this? Not, you know, it's the first draft. 15. There's not much change. So maybe 15 minutes, but. 15. Board goals, 15. Board protocols. Thank you, Justine and Bill for that. Let's take a look at that for 15. I think we're gonna probably take our action in 8-2. So we don't need 91. Do we have new hirons or reservations? We do. But that won't take that. Okay. And then a final public comment, which will be, what it will be. Excellent. I think, actually this, pretty good to me. Consent agenda, approved minutes of Tuesday, September 7th, 2021. Can I just jump in a quicker? We only have September 7th. And I will send your Thursday the 16th. I miss sending that video to our note taker. Oh, okay. That's a quick note, but I don't have that taken care of the next day. So we have to do 18. And I'll put together your 18. Okay. So we just have seven to approve tonight. Yep. Okay. I had no problems with it. I really appreciate our note taker in our note transcriber in Tundra's. I'll entertain a motion to 4.1 to approve the minutes of Tuesday, September 7th, 2021. So. So made by Robert. Seconded by Bill. Any discussion is person's last name spelled correctly. Good. It's L A P A L L E. Good. So that needs to be corrected. Yeah. Can we under. Oh, well, hell. Yep. L L E. It's L A P A L E. Yep. L A P A L L E. Good efforts. Okay. So I'm going to change my motion to approve the minutes. Has been. Thank you. Do we have a second on that family? Second. Second. All right. Is that good? It's Ian. Huh? It's Ian. Is that a hi-end for person? Oh, thank you. Let's get her.  No, she's doing. I think her last name is not spelled like that either. I think it's L A P E L L. Yep. We got it. L A P A L L E. No, E L L. No, E at the end. L A P E L L. So I go by the post box. Oh. I mean. I'll return it. I mean, right. I think it is. We got it. L A P E L L. Yeah. And Kristin with an E. Correct. I'm positive. That's it. Well, this is just shooting our schedule. All the characters. People. We got to get. I know. Wait. I just, that's it. Thank you for that. Okay. As amended, we still have it on the floor. Any further amendments to these notes? No. Very good. All of you are signified by saying hi. Hi. Hi. Hi. Hi. You guys have it. Good. We have a public comment. Do we have any public comment at this time? Okay. Tim Pratt. Do you have public comment for the board? He's watching the game. Is it tonight? Oh, yeah. All right. Thank you. I think we can move on. Board comment. Two comments. The first is that I know him. I don't know who listens to this, but the Rochester PTO could really use some new blood. Not that the people who are doing it, they're dedicated, they're hardworking. They're just overwhelmed. There's not a lot of them. And I just would put it out there if anybody knows anybody. There's a lot of young parents out there. Doesn't have to be women. I think that's an old trope. But just let's put the word out there to get some new. People have been doing it. I've been doing it for a while. They've done a lot. I know my wife stepped up for the book sale and a lot of other people have, but I just think it's a time right now that if people could step up, it'd be great. Stockbrook sets an incredible example of what a PTO can do and how involved they can be. And I think we should take that as our model. The second thing is just for tonight, I am trying some efficiencies really from the protocols that we try and keep things moving a little faster. And maybe I, so what I'm going to try is not calling out. Usually I'll call out and they say, do you have a question? Do you have a question? Do you have a question for anybody? And I'm going to leave it up to you to please either raise your hand digitally, Justine, if you're there, or raise your hand here for me to call on you if you have a question during reports or if we're speaking just to keep it moving. I think we're getting efficient and we're a sign of good things for us. Justine. Yes, I just wanted to touch back on the PTO piece. Could you explain how someone could join? What, who they should contact? And if maybe we could post something on Facebook on the district Facebook page for that. There's something getting ready to go home in Thursday folders that Carrie McDonald sent like as an example of what they used in the past. So we're just revising it with new information so they can send it back. And I just don't have it, it's in the works right now. So I can share it with you, Justine, once it's done, if you'd like to post it there. Great, I will, thanks. Thank you. All right, any further board comment? A very minor thing and there's no rush on it, but it would be really great to have a cheat sheet for acronyms. Oh yeah, yeah, that's a great idea. That's a great idea. Yeah, I wish I had that. I missed that, Robert. Cheat sheets. For acronyms. Ha ha, you know. Yes. Oh, and let me just report good news that I just discovered. So most of Rochester's forest, we were worried was on a man's land who was up for sale. And it is not. Most of our forest outdoor adventure land is on town property. According to the map I've seen online, which if it's really true, I need to confirm it at the town to make sure is it just really, really good news. Because it means we have it and maybe we should get some. That property is no longer for sale. Great. But the property is no longer for sale. Yeah, and the property is no longer for sale. I was at the property when they pulled it off. So anyway, so that was good news. Okay, that was probably more than five minutes. Well, three minutes, we're good. That's perfect. Oh, let's have the reports for the board. Superintendent, seven point one. So you all have my report in hand. There'll be, all I really wanted to add is there's going to be some more information coming out for me later this week about surveillance testing for families that start to sign up. That's weekly testing for students that will start in November. And staff is voluntary. And there's a database that you sign up through the agency of education and department of health that registers students. And then we will begin testing. I believe the test date here is going to be on Thursdays. And the other half of the SU will be on Tuesdays. And so there'll be two days every week. But then in addition to that, I'll be sharing information about testing to stay in school protocols and procedures. There's multiple different approaches to that. One is using an antigen test that we would test students who are close contacts not demonstrating symptoms, seven straight days. And they would test before they come into the building or they would test right as soon as they come into the building. Those logistics are still being worked out. And then there's also an opportunity for take home testing for students who are exhibiting symptoms that we can assist families to get hopefully quicker results. So all that is forthcoming. We're still waiting on some of the information from the agency of ed, but we do plan to launch right into that as soon as it's available. So that's good. And I'll take any questions folks have. How are we, I mean, I know the staff is stretched already. How are they gonna be able to handle that? So we were able, part of why we've been delayed in surveillance testing. And I would say that's probably why most every SU has been delayed is staffing. So we were able to get a retired nurse to join our team. It's Marianne, I got it right. That's right. Rosinne, I'm gonna butcher her last name, but I'm gonna say it's Marianne Armand, her husband's actually a doctor over here at the Gifford Medical Center here in Rochester. And Marianne's been great. And so she's gonna be doing this. She's gonna be the surveillance coordinator and she'll also be supporting our staffs with implementing the test to stay protocols. So that's why, how are we able to do it Robert? I would say it's still taxing on our staff in general. And I don't knock on wood. We haven't had positivity at our sub this year, but I've had significantly more positivity in our buildings than we did most of last year. And so what that just means is the contact tracing that occurs is significant left for staff and folks who are working incredibly hard on it. The good news is we still have not had what we've been able to determine is spread love COVID-19 within the actual school. So that means our mitigation efforts are working really well. And again, that's a knock on wood. But in general, the data speaks to masking, washing hands and really making sure we're paying attention to symptoms. And we get the best frustrating for families and we're hopeful that some of these new methods around testing will assist. I'll just say while there was out for two days but we tested right away at Rochester Health Center and the test result actually came back the next afternoon. I was hearing three days, that's what they told us but she came back quite quickly. And the new test is just totally different. It's really great. You're most so much less invasive. And hopefully we're vaccinating our youngest students here within the next couple of months, my hope. And the Health Hub does work on us on that. So those who are eligible age, my buildings that had eligible age students, the Health Hub is providing vaccine right now for our students. So they will work with us continuously across the SU to help us get our students vaccinated here. That's a great partnership for Health Hub. That really is. Yeah, so those are COVID-19 updates. Thank you so much. Thank you. Any other questions? I have a question. Jamie, on the report, second page, you know, I was very hopeful that we were able to deliver on an SUY elementary school report card this fall. I'm abundantly clear that further curriculum development needs to occur prior to delivering this important product. And therefore you're talking about being working on more curriculum development and kicking this out next year. So what, tell us a little bit about the report card. What impact if any would pushing it back a year beyond our students? Well, I would say that pushing it back a year really, it just has to be right now. We tried to pilot one in the WRVSU Virtual Learning Academy and it became clear that there were not consistent ends across the grade levels. And we've got a lot of work to do, frankly, in curriculum development. I think there had been quite a bit of time spent in literacy. There needs to be a lot more further time spent in the rest of the content areas. And so, you know, curriculum is an end. And so what I would say is, curriculum's not bridges, it's not bounces and panel, right? Like those are approaches, but we need to get more solid in what do we expect each student to be able to know, understand and do across each grade level cluster. And I'm not confident that our teachers, that that was done in a really strategic way that was like transparent and we were holding folks accountable to it. So what we're doing now is saying, what is it we really want students to know, understand and do, and that will be a large presentation to the full SU board. Because curriculum comes from the SU level of that board. And then we will then be explicit with teachers. Now it's pretty clear what those ends are. And that's what we would report out on. And so that's the work that needs to happen. And it became clearer and clearer to me as I was able to get more into the curriculum world the second half of the year, not spending time on finance and COVID that those documents were not where we need them to be. Okay, follow up our question on that. At the SU board meeting, and made a wonderful presentation about developing results performance result targets that we can incorporate SU wide for our students that at various or all grade levels. This delay on the report card impact that effort at all? No, because what we're measuring the common core state standards and that is what we're teaching to but the report card to me is a different grain size, right? That is what I'm gonna use is a word called performance indicators and performance indicators built to your standard. And so what I would say is, is those performance indicators are the areas where I don't think there's continuity across all of our buildings at this point. And part of that is expectations, right? And so what I'm saying is I don't fully, I don't feel confident enough to know that all of our first grades are calibrated. And that's the work that we need to do. And so a report card should be the communication tool to say this is what we're teaching and this is how the students performing. And the issue we have right now is I don't believe that it's calibrated about what we're teaching where the students performing across all my first grade classrooms. And so that's the work I think we need to do before we go saying, all right, now we're gonna report out on that. So that's the heavy lift there but as far as those skills scores go, I mean, those are reporting out on the Common Core State Standards and that is what we're teaching too. And so it's just the difference in grain size. Thank you. Other questions? Good, just for moving on, please. Principal. Yes, that was a packed report. There was a lot going on. Yeah, that's great. It's a lot of good things, all good things. It does. If you have my report, I wanna highlight just a couple of things and put out another public service announcement. We are short staffed from the substitute standpoint. Like I spent my day in preschool and then as a peer educator and then as the librarian today, which I loved, it was great, but makes it difficult sometimes. So we are trying and it's a range of things and staff are really flexible. I'm trying to help out one, but if you know someone who'd like to be a substitute in either building, we would happily welcome them aboard and start that process. And they can talk to myself or Erica or Janet to get that process started. So we didn't do a full-time sub. Even with the full-time sub in both buildings, we are short staffed in substitutes. Not every day, but just to get a day where one or two people are out and it starts to become a problem. Yeah, our ventures just have very deep past those. So we do have those still in place. I hope it's that long-term sub. I'm not sure. It's floating sub, full-time sub. How does that, is that working well? Very well. And we'll talk about that, man. I did about keeping that in both buildings, but yeah, it's definitely a great thing. I can't imagine the past two days without it. And then we've done lots of assessments. We're up and rolling in every part of our curriculum for the most part. And then just the other piece that I forgot to add in the board report was just about trash structures. And that was my email last night, just that Tara and I worked with Aiden and we have a quote and it's in the S-Sermon needs to be able to expand or extend one of each of the trusses to make them larger on both campuses. And then to add one in Stockbridge, one more in Stockbridge and two more in Rochester to kind of fill the need. Yeah, great. I think that's, till we get to data, that's kind of endless. People have questions. And then having those structures will just keep us outside so much more. Absolutely. That's great. Absolutely. And I don't know if folks know it. We don't even eat lunch inside. We use the structures outside on both campuses. That's great. That's cool. I'd like to experiment a little bit with using some of those previous tense sides on the sides of the structure. Just to see if I'm overlapping. There might be, but if we can get a little wind, you know, the wind tunnel effect, cut that down a little bit. We'll see what that looks like. I think probably I'll see some of the pole pieces too as part of. Just trace my head, though. Of course. Good. Any other questions? For a principal? Anyone? No. Seven three business manager. Hello, Tara. Good evening, everyone. You have my report on the updates. I have the auditors completed their physical audits here yesterday. And now they'll continue to work through doing the rest of the audits virtually. And the projected first draft is the third week of November. And then the rest of my report is in your discussion items. And Tara, can I just add to your report that we will have a projected projection, the two pager in November, right? That's what we talked about. Yes, for the first quarter. Yeah. Questions for a business manager? My guys, we have a reputation of course. We got three hour meetings at least. Oh, good. Great. You're doing great. Thank you so much, Tara. Very good. Moving on to WRVS, RVSU. Thank you. Policy committee draft number five for the information and policy. This is, we missed the last round. Steph was the first time we had talked at a board, full board level about the policy that moved out of the committee and to the policy. And there still seems to be, though, there's some, a small significant energy challenging the policy. The vast majority of the full board and the responses we're getting are pro very positive about this and a lot of feeling like let's get it into place. Let's use it. Let's see how it works. That a policy is a tool and you see how well it works. The motion was to send it off and we're tabling it for October. Bring it in. We're bringing it forward to October to vote, up or down. So that's where we are right now. There were some slight edits. And draft five was, and you should be able to see them. There's strike throes and things. Yeah. And there was some comment too that they felt that some of the things being taken out were possibly weakening the policy. But I think there is also a sense of, come on, but let's do this. Let's do this. Let's push it forward. We've had, there's been challenge about public comment. There's been a lot of public comment. There's been two public sessions that were very well attended. And we have documented quite an extensive responses, written responses that people have put in, overwhelmingly positive about this. So that's where the SU board is now. The SU board is the, or executive. When I have it, I'm going to bring you all together for the full board. And that is the 20th policy. Third, 27th, or is this month, was the 20th? September was the 20th. Anybody? I got a look. That's right here too. Fourth Monday. Fourth Monday, 25th? 25th. 25th. Yeah. The difference. I'm glad somebody, that's good. I would encourage you all to be there.  There's a lot of publicity about it. There's been, other places are dealing with this same issue. And I think we're a bit of a leader in this program right now. You know, I think it's a really strong policy. And I think we've had a good process. Yeah. Good. Any questions? Oh, yes. Yeah, just a question. Are we a leader? I was on the impression that we are the leader. No, other districts have adopted anti-racism policies too. So we're with a lead group. We're with a lead group. Yeah. I mean, I would say some have had it more broadly defined as equity. Like Essex, Westford, that's, I know I'm the title of their policy. I believe it's the same as Brandon. Over here with Jean Tolvance. But, you know, I must say, I think our process has been really strong. I think we've had really respectful debate about it. And I hope that the public has felt heard. And I think we've offered that opportunity and listened. And I think there, you know, if you look at the multiple drafts, it is clear, I think, that the policy committee has taken that feedback and really used it to inform the policy. So. Good. That's great. So if the F.C. Board votes at their October meeting, then they, then the individual district boards to vote there, is that correct? Correct. And if that's the case, we would have it in our November agenda. Good. Thank you. Further questions? They're being done. The VRVSU phone board news. You were there too, Bill. Help me. I think the, as Bill pointed out, one of the biggest things was the presentation by Anda and Jamie about academics. And Bill pays just as, here is that stuff better than I do. I was a little surprised, actually, just that Bill and every other one's present to the whole board. I know. And I really feel like I would love to make a statement somehow that if we're asking our teachers to be out there, we need to be in the buildings. You know, we can't, we got comfortable with COVID and I just think we need to show up. And I know that's, I'm speaking to the church a little bit, or the choir, whatever it is. But I was a little disappointed to see more board members there. What, you probably took a lot more substantial. Well, it was interesting because we had the development director for the Vermont School Board Association, given a kind of a professional development for the SU board. Thank you. And it was interesting because she got herself a little bit into a firefight over the important distinction of the role of the boards as policy and vision. And by the day they managed the schools up through the superintendent, the superintendent's team. The question was she had some ideas about their feelings about if that's the case, then meetings where the school boards meet with, including the school superintendent, that sort of thing could confuse the line of communication, which is supposed to be through the superintendent. You mean meetings and include the principals? Yes. And we really shouldn't actually be talking to the principal at all. Well, that's one thing we want to talk about in our protocol, to kind of clarify that or just to have the same expectations on that. The worst case scenario is, and I've been in situations where boards will, individual board members will go and talk to staff and tell the staff to do things. And first of all, individual board members do not have the authority to do that. The only authority comes through the entire board. And then secondly, the staff members looking at, well, who do I report to this individual board member or to the superintendent or the superintendent? And that leads to stress and some really negative consequences. So I think that's what she was trying to, what we need to do is be sensitive to that, lies to that. So we don't get ourselves in trouble, but at the same time, have good communication between staff and boards. And my short observation here with the team, I think we're very strong in that. People aren't hiding, ducking, weaving. It seems to me we're a strong team together. So that was one interesting thing. The other thing was, and Jamie, you should talk to it. One thing we talked about at our retreat was, we've got the metrics about student performance and we now start, now that we've got that groundwork late, can we now set some goals about where we wanna be in student performance at the end of this school year? And Jamie made a presentation to the SU board and they gave a thumbs up for the superintendent's team to develop metrics and goals for this academic year. And- And that will come forward to the full board this next meeting. So it is an important meeting. And then I would assume if the SU board accepts that, then it goes down and we have a sense of that as well. The power to me is when you've got the full SU board metrics, then you don't have these, part of the problem with metrics is if the sample size is too small, then any change can be overly or misinterpreted. And so to have our metrics be able to do the whole system wide as well as individual schools and grades will help deter that downsides of that. But I was very heartened by that. And as we had talked about that and that's something I think will be a very powerful arrow in our quiver going forward. So thank you. Just to follow up, this is something I'm remembering now that I thought about, I think it's very important that we put out the information that if there is an issue with the school that it goes to the principal. And I think that could go out in the newsletter. I think it could go out because I think that but also protects us a little bit but also just that I think a lot of people just don't know. I know Amy, I don't know Lindy. I don't know her phone number, anything like that. And that we do that. And I think the other part of this is trust. And I think we've just established a level of trust that we're not going to be telling you what to do and that we're working together. And I think I can understand where the VSBA was coming from because they certainly are hostile boards and principles that don't get on and superintendents that don't get on. I mean, it could be a mess. And in that case, I think it probably is very helpful but there was some other board members that sort of spoke to, we need to have our principal there especially with COVID going on that we just need to know from the ground zero sort of where to have that going. Good. Anything further on that? Yeah, I was at the portion of the training and the thing that I really did enjoy the possibilities of structuring our meetings and our board protocol that I worked on a little bit with Bill based on the way they suggested. And I think we'll be able to talk more about that in our board protocol section but I think we do have a good relationship with the administration right now but if we establish a solid protocol now, I think if that's not the case in the future we can glean from these trainings a good system to go forward. So I did enjoy, I was there for that part and I was happy to hear all of that information. Good. I think we're moving on. Discussion item. Five under. Yeah. Oh, we need ice cream or something. We each want to get under. Fall 8-1, Fall Academic Data Report, Principal Stetson will share the fall universal assessment report for both reading and mathematics. Yeah. So one I'll print in color from now on. No. So a couple of things. One we never presented out by grade level before. Usually our cohorts have been too small to do that. So this is actually, this is Rochester and Stockbridge together. It's five grade levels. So you can really see a breakdown. So it may seem very dramatic in some differences compared to what you've seen in the past when we've looked like grades, I think it was like four through six together and K through three together. So I just don't, don't go out with apples here. Right, it isn't. But this will give us more. This is how we'll do it. Yeah, we'll measure cohort. I mean, again, I keep wanting to get after cohort growth. Right, right. Over time. And that's what our goals will be focused on. So reporting on grade levels, I thought was just absolutely critical in one of our districts. So, and it's a little more visual too. Instead of just percentages, which is nice as well. So we've seen some great growth in literacy. I think what I will say about this in addition to my report is we still have work to do in our universal instruction. These differences of kids that are not necessarily meeting the expectation yet. That's not always going to be fixed by intervention. That's something that we need to up our game in our classroom instruction for every kid. We did meet today as a staff. This actually was the focal point of what we talked about in our staff meeting today about how we move forward with this and deep diving into individual grade level data. And we talked about how what we have, what we need and what needs to happen to start our goal setting process around this. And our focus in goal setting was truly around student growth. So really digging into that skill score, which is, these are the skill score ones down here. And looking at that to measure our student growth instead of getting fixated on like who made it and who didn't. And this is comparing it to, what's the district? Over Rochester, the district, the dark line is Rochester Star Bridge and the faded line is the state score for meeting expectations at this point in the year. So you'll see that skill score continue to grow as we move throughout the year. Yeah, okay. Just also add, we did up the cut threshold for Star 360 for the scale score. What does that mean? So we increased it. So the scale score now is now aligned to the national average that we're using to measure whether or not our students are meeting the benchmark we're using the state expectation. And so this should be a much better projection of how our students should do on the Smarter Balance Assessment Consortium, SBAC, which is the summative assessment we have in the spring, which the AOE uses to measure how effective our instruction is. And so these cut scores, these scale scores you're seeing in the faded line, that is where we would expect to be for a scale score if we would expect to meet the expectations in the spring. So you're gonna see that faded line continue to increase each report you get. And that's because it's a trajectory toward where we need to be by the end of the year. And let me, hopefully this is useful. This is where I got out of the timing that would end up and Bill and Wendy's, privately. This idea that sort of halfway in between these numbers is sort of, this is the score of the whole class. That you have people up there and you have people down there. Right, it's an average. It's an average. That dark line is an average. That has helped me a lot to put those lines there to sort of think of it as the whole, that's the whole class and that you have people above and below. And that some people are almost in the next grade level in terms of how they're doing. I don't know, for me that just helped visually and it might help other people. And scale score, as Ann was saying, scale score is really what we're focusing on now. That's a term that we should all be familiar with. And we're focusing on it not only for cohorts to measure our effectiveness really in curriculum. So when we look at overall cohort, one of the things I'm looking at and what I've said to the principals and our teachers are is, do we have a curricular issue, right? Like if our students are all performing low on a certain grade level, the first thing we need to do is don't immediately go to pointing your finger and personalizing scores. Should be saying, well, what standards are our students missing, right? So then we analyze the data at that level. And then we realize that in general across the SU and this is why we're bringing 40 educators together to do this data training is if we're recognizing that we're having issues across the SU and certain grade levels and certain content in your areas and standards, then that's a curriculum issue. And we can address that. Now, there also could be instructional issues, right? Like if we're seeing one building is we get an issue and other buildings don't, or one building's performing really well and others aren't over time, then what's that building to see? Like what's the instructional practice that's happening that is really making certain that they're meeting those standards. So those are the things that we're looking to analyze. But also we are looking at these scale scores individually. So my expectation is as we get better with data that we're setting not just goals for cohorts, we're setting goals for every individual student. Well, I was wondering if this could be part of a parent-teacher need. On the student? Yeah, on the student. Because I think the more we introduce this to parents and say scale score, this is where you are in this scale, or this is where we assess. I don't know, I just think then we're, again, transparency, it's all the things we believe in. I think it's the, what I realized is it seems to me that our culture a little bit in the SU is get assessment because we have to. Yes, yeah. And now we get assessment to really use it to inform instruction. Yeah. And so right now we're trying to shift this culture around, like it's not a bad thing.  And it should be used to inform instruction, right? And to have conversation with parents. Right there, that statement is something that should go out on a regular basis because I think it really is a paradigm shift we're asking for. Because I do think most people think assessment is just like, oh yeah. We'll just have to do it. Yeah. And then it's really a tool. And I think a lot of people go MPSS, what's MPSS? And I think this is the heart of it. Yeah, absolutely. It's the heart of it. And so the same conversation is the conversation we have as a staff today. And next week we break into K through three cohorts to dive in more and actually Chris Ward who's running the data inquiry class that several of us are taking will actually be helping us facilitate that conversation for us all to get. He's from the upper valley educators. Yes. So we can move to having grade level growth. The overwhelming consensus today was to focus on student growth. And that we should see some great games and we need to make that measurable for ourselves as a goal. This just all sounds like you guys are going in such an early direction. We are. It's exciting to be talking about instead of some other things. That's really wonderful. Yeah. Like the huge celebration to just share out of all of this is our grade one every single child. And we remember we haven't put a lot of effort into that. I was looking for the shade. There's no, there's no disagreement. The entire grade one is meeting or exceeding expectations in mathematics. We're going to take it as, wow, that's great. I think you said this is both schools. This is both schools. And so even if you look at them on the scale four, you'll see that they're off the chart. Yeah, I think that was it. But it's B, A, two, nine. Yeah. And there's more than one student in grade one. Mr. McPhil, I was going to make that jump again, I tell you. It is a smaller cohort right around 10 together. But we'll take it. That's kind of average. We'll take it. It's a huge celebration. And so we're trying to figure out. I was looking for the gray shading. Yeah. Oh, again, I need to point that out for one full reason. Robert, oh, sorry. Robert. I'm anticipating this is such an excellent work. I'm anticipating in the future that we will won't be surprises. But anyone who has been in education for a long time will know that there's certain classes have certain character. And it's just because of their makeup and their parents and all that stuff. And there'll be certain classes that are harder to teach. And that doesn't mean you're not just going to accept it. But we will watch it as it progresses across this chart over the years and where you have to put your energies. Yes. Right. And that's the wonderful thing about this approach. Yes. Assessment is a guide, not a punishment. That's right. Right. Excellent. I think these graphics are definitely something. This is all a lot of that. I can't take anything. But I'm just saying, annual report. Yeah. And this is a graphic that needs to be in our annual report. And an explanation. Yeah. An explanation for those parents who want to take a look. Great. I just have a question. Yeah, question. These initial assessments is kind of benchmark for the year. When you look at these results and discuss it with your faculty, are any of these results going to or need to change our curriculum or our strategy or our techniques or our focus to move some of these kids faster or quicker or whatever they could do? In other words, are there anything that's in here that you said, well, we don't have to be doing so much here. But we've got to do much more there. Or is this pretty much what you expected and your strategy going forward over the next nine months is basically on course? So twofold. Specifically, in literacy math, it's very early to tell because we have not had consistent mathematics instruction as long as I have been here. It's been a hodgepodge, depending on who the teacher is, what building you're in. In literacy, what I can say is we have implemented aspects of universal instruction with fidelity very well around FNP would be what we now need to do in literacy to add to our instruction is a focus on writing. It is a focal point in how to implement vocabulary. Those are just some of the areas that we're really seeing. That's the next step of our universal instruction that needs to happen. And we know this now. Like we've done it for a couple of years virtually and in person. So we know those pieces. So it's also that concept of what do we need? And as we think about our moving forward and using grant money and writing our continuous improvement plan or updating it, those are things we need to add. I think it's also just strengthening content area knowledge. I think teaching, reading, you really need to understand phonics and the different syllable types and really understand language. And so what I would say is that one of the things we're focusing on why we are partnering with the Stern Center is to better strengthen those phonics teaching skills for our K-12 teachers. We really need to make certain that those teachers have a really strong understanding of the English language and how to teach reading when a student is struggling, right, with the approach we're using. And so that's part of what we're looking to do too. And it's why we are working with the Stern Center, pro-language and learning out of Burlington. I do have a question. I'm looking at the math scale. I noticed so for math we are able to do it grades one through six, but in reading we're not. Right. So reading, we use something that's called the early literacy assessment, which just helps identify things like not understanding phonics, things like that doesn't necessarily give you meets for. OK. I'll test out of it. Last school years, kindergarten and first graders, were they together in both schools? Were they a blended group? K-1. K-1 in both schools. Yes. So I could almost see why a second grader could potentially be at the same level as a first grader because they were in the same class together. Yeah, potentially. Yeah. But I would say that that feels like for us. Yes, right. Around multi-aged. Right, that's kind of what I was getting at. As soon as I dug into this data, grade level wise, I said to Honda, we need to peel back that. So when you look at second grade data, for example, most of the need of concern is all in first grade level. Let's go. Yeah. So yeah. Just have a differentiate, right? Like teaching math in a multi-aged classroom is difficult. Yes. It's a content area that really have to work incredibly hard to do it. And so further develop professional development to ensure that we're getting it right. And that's why we're focusing on that. Is there any options for possibly separating grade levels within that multi-aged class so that? So we've done it a couple of different ways in each building. It's been multi-aged here in Rochester. We have done it as content in Stockbridge. What I will say is not currently, because it's been made pretty clear. But in previous years, math is one of the first classes that got cut short continuously. So to be able to think that you're going to get through just what you need to universally when you keep shortening classes was not a realistic expectation. It's multi-aged or it's K1 in Stockbridge and it's 1, 2 in Rochester. So it is multi-aged. But we have been using our floating sub as well as face every to kind of push in to help provide additional support so we can break those groups apart and teach them at the multi-aged problem. But I think it's something that is certainly at the SU level. Because again, it's not just our sub. We're made with these multi-aged classrooms that I'm monitoring to see if we can make. We're in small schools. Yeah, and I just think we need to at some point, the data is not, the trajectory is not good. Maybe it's not what we're doing, but I think we're going to have to make some decisions around doing we need to look at scheduling strategically so that math's not an multi-aged setting that it is in straight grades. And that's great because it's data driven. Now we've got it now. Yeah, I feel like I can pull it apart and it's real data so that we can use it to make some of those informed decisions. Greg. Again. Justine, you look like you have a question. I have just kind of an idea and I don't know if this is a good idea or not, but I do know that a lot of times parents have a hard time teaching their kids math because it's different than what they're used to or what they've learned. And I don't know anything about whether the school has ever offered any support for parents to kind of help the kids at home a little bit more. I don't know if there's any room or possibility for something like that, either from the board or. I don't know. A great idea, Justin. Sorry, Justin. Bonnie did do some nights, did a night or maybe two last year that we recorded and sent out, but I think it is worthwhile for us to do more of those. I think now that with this technology piece it becomes more convenient for parents to be able to watch a video maybe after an actual class. So you can either attend or in the weeks following you can go and look at it. I think the other big thing for us to make certain we communicate with parents too is that we certainly teach more of the abstract approach now to math, right? Like the conceptual understanding behind it. But at the end of the day that all does lead up to standard algorithm, which is what we were all taught, Justin. We all learned in standard algorithm. So I've always said to parents, I don't want you to ever feel like you're going to mess them up. And I think it's important for us teachers to communicate that to our students because at the end of the day, standard algorithm does get you to the correct answer. Yeah. Right? Even though you may not think you might get through that. The conceptual understanding approach around it or the pictorial model around it that leads them through to the standard algorithm. But I think it's important for our families to know and maybe that is something that I will discuss here in an upcoming letter, Justin, now that you say it. Because they don't want families, parents, I feel like they're going to mess their child up and you're not going to mess them up. That's a really good point. I definitely have heard parents talk about that over the years, even when I was working in school where parents felt like they couldn't do anything. And it doesn't really help to have them feel that way. So that's a good point to make for sure. But yeah, just an idea, how we can beef that up. Great, just to be talking about this stuff. Robert. Something that was briefly touched on in our retreat and such is, and I'm wondering where it fits all into the mix. And I've also been introduced to a new term, transferable skills, and you can guess who from. And also one that was mentioned in one of your documents earlier that I first read was crit, which is the same. I'm just wondering, I understand it's going to affect all these scores, but do you assess it how are you approaching it? We need to assess it is the answer. And I think the best way for us to assess it is to start to develop more performance task assessments. And what I mean by that is when you've heard me talk about a capstone project, that's a year long project where a student has to develop a product. I believe that that is a really authentic way to measure something like that. And so part of what I think we're going to be looking to do as we start to develop more of these performance type tasks across the grade levels is to say, all right, what are those transferable skills? And based on a rubric, how do we actually measure them in defined proficiency? I get excited because that's really important work. I will tell you that we are several years behind other districts in this work. But what I would say is that does allow us to learn from some folks mistakes in that regard. And so I would say that we are going to use those lessons learned to make certain that we don't fall into some of those same traps. And what I mean by that is I think a lot of supervisory unions and districts spend a lot of time focusing on how do we communicate our proficiency via report card or transcript. And that hijacked the conversation from how do we use proficiency to actually change teaching? And I want us to be hyper focused on how do we use proficiency to change our instructional approach for kids and our ability for students to demonstrate what they know and understand and can do instead of worrying about transcript. And so that is work that when I talk about the SU report card, it's part of why I felt like we had to put the pause button on. And I thought again, we're going to spend more time on the reporting mechanism that we work quite ready to launch and less about how do we improve our instructional practice, right? The pedagogy for kids. And so that's, you know, the two things go hand in hand, but I think in general at school sometimes we get too caught up in what maybe looks pretty or how we talk about it. And you can focus a lot of time and energy debating that and not actually get to the meat of it, which is the teaching. And so what I'm trying to do is keep our organization much more focused on the teaching and the student outcome that way and not allow this to sidetrack us, but we still do have to do this. I think we got to get this right first. So I don't know if that's helpful. Okay. Again, it comes down a little bit to trust. You know, when you say a word like that, maybe we don't have a way to assess it yet, but I get what you mean and the trust that you're going after it. Is that somewhat the point, Robert, or? Well, yeah, I mean, at this point where if we're, did you say perhaps part of the back that we know that we have to teach it, we have to have some sort of assessment mechanism because we don't know what to measure it because we don't know if we're successful in each. So that's really where, what the big point is is we have to be able to assess it. And I think the communication of that is last. If I understand your communication to the outside world and such and making transcripts is the last part of the primary focus is, is are we being successful in our approach? We're good on this? Yep. How's your time? Thank you so much, Wendy. Where over by? Nine. Control the ice cream back. That's okay, that was a good topic to be over by now. Thank you. We're going to make it up. Well, I had time. So it to tuition or religiously affiliated schools. I thought we had a good discussion about this last time. So yeah, I'll just add still only one board is taking action thus far, which is Granville Hancock. They voted to pay tuition up to the state average. I would say that based on my conversations with districts thus far, I feel like that's the way the other districts are leaning. But again, I don't think there's a right or wrong here in this approach. That's the way I was leaning. I think the point made last time was about liability and that better than liability come at the SU level or we're a little more protected than at the individual level. Well, it would be even more than that. It would be more than SU. It's going to be like, is it state or federal? This was a federal decision. Right. So. Tara, you have something to say. I see you come on. You're just there. Okay, good. Do we have a motion? Yeah, just to remind everyone in McKelley, you weren't here. So there was a Supreme Court ruling that came out of Montana that public funds, public dollars, shall be used to fund tuition at religiously affiliated schools. And since you are a school district of choice, that then requires us to pay those publicly funded tuition dollars to a religiously affiliated school. There's a Vermont Supreme Court ruling that says you can't use public fund dollars for the teaching of the church. And so there's, you could put a procedure that requires each individual school to designate what percentage of that fund is going to the direct teaching of the church or to support the church. And so that, I would say that the one thing with that procedure is if you do that, we do fully expect that there will be possibly a suit brought against schools to do withhold those public fund dollars by probably more of an at a national level. We're gonna challenge that Vermont Supreme Court ruling, right? And so... All right, so you just said that the Vermont Supreme Court said the opposite of what the federal... No, they, no, they don't. Sorry, I just thought I misunderstood that. The Supreme Court says you can't use public fund dollars for the direct support and teaching of the church. Okay. And so that's where this percentage procedure comes in. That's church, not religion though. Whereas the other one is a religious affiliated school. Could be a synagogue, could be a mosque, could be not a church. No, but like Rice Memorial, for example, is a Catholic school. Right. So if you were to implement this procedure, you would have to get from Rice the percentage of the day where they are... Or the percentage of actual tuition. Supporting the church. I understand that. I'm just wondering is it causing us any trouble with what the Vermont Supreme Court ruling is versus the federal if we don't do it that way? If we... The attorney says absolutely not. Okay. Justine. Justine, hi. The answers just keep popping up. That's, I'm on the same page. I was gonna explain maybe what I thought of the Vermont versus the federal situation, but it's all out there now. That's all. There's a decision, a federal decision. And then there are some states that are challenging schools in the same way that Jamie has described. There may be suits brought challenging the schools who are doing this, but it kind of wraps back around to the federal decision in Montana. They're probably gonna get sued either way. In some fashion. There's truth to that. Yeah. I really think that. Can I thank you for the analysis? Sure, why not? I know Menden has been dealing with this, so Rutland, RSUD, that was a big deal in that because Menden, a lot of the children, you know, potentially go to Christ the King or MSJ. And there was a big conversation that it was about equity of their students accessing. So the tuition was higher at MSJ, so it put on parents that paid the difference. To pay the difference, and so then was that fair. Because maybe I couldn't pay for my child to go, but the next kid could go. So that was a bit of a. That's certainly what Granville Hancock is. An issue. Yeah. And then the other interesting part to that was, so the fairness, it wasn't so much about the religious, you know, the percentage of the day, but I also thought it was interesting and how, and I'm curious how public funds because over a private school. So we only pay up to the state average? Right, because we don't actually have anything after, right, and if it's a public. So at any independent school, you can only pay based on school choice up to the state average is what we would pay up to. That's our process and procedure for any. For any spending. Private tuition. Yeah, we pay up to the state average. I decided it was interesting to listen to that conversation about if public, so just a religious funded school issue. And they can take a student or not take a student. In some of the. At any private school. Yeah, even the Sharon Academy. Right, I guess it wasn't so much about private religious funds. Private versus public, I think that would be. Yeah, so for any private institution, we pay up to the state average. We don't go over that. I mean, I could see. This would be all possibly paid under the state average. Is this a case of advisory union policy? We will move to a supervisory union policy. The issue is that there, we hadn't taken it up. Nor was there any type of example around policy because this was just came out of the spring. So I'm doing it district by district for this upcoming year. So just to comment on what you were saying. The, the schools were actually billing parents for the balance, whereas other private schools potentially like Sharon Academy are not. They're just, they charge the district for the average cost and they're not, they're not billing back the parents, but they potentially could. That's what it would be. Sharon Academy charges the state average. Right, but at any, any independent school would have the capability to do that if they felt that that was there, what they needed. What we've seen more of is when a family chooses to access an independent school, typically outside of the state of Vermont, Kimball Union, as an example I know of, and we just pay the state average and then the family receives the difference, or I mean Kimball, that's- Sometimes they use scholarship. Yeah, we just get the bill for the state average. So I mean- So the conversation you're discussing, I think to give it apples to apples is, student chooses a religiously affiliated school. They charge the state average. Let's say they charge it. If you put in a procedure that says, tell us what percentage of that money goes to support the church. And let's say it was 20%? Balance would be on the parents. The balance would be on the parents. Where Sharon Academy, you pay the state average, right? Bill comes to the district and that's what you pay. So that's the conversation we're having. Well, the only concern I would have about the, about doing it or not doing it that way is just the Vermont court ruling. What type of liability is that put on us by- It wouldn't probably put any liability on us. I mean, certainly a group could come to ensue the district, not just you, multiple districts were paying up to the state average. And say you're using public fund dollars. There's a Supreme Court hearing on the books. And now we're naming you in multiple districts in this suit. And then there's the other way where if we don't pay up to the state average, I'm pretty certain that there's gonna be, probably not within Vermont, but an outside group outside of the state of Vermont. Because remember, this is federal. They're gonna come in and challenge what's on the books for the Vermont Supreme Court. And they're gonna say, oh, schools, you have overstepped here, right? And you need to pay up to the state average that you do every other independent school. Because now you have a prejudice. So changing the Vermont Supreme Court ruling, essentially, that could go back to the, I don't know. I think the better way, because either way we're gonna kick this to this bit. This is why you pay Vermont School Board's insurance trust. And Pietro Linn's office is gonna represent us and every other district that's named in it either way. And so, it's really, I think the best way for you to make this decision is just about, what do you guys feel? Do you feel like you should require each school to designate? Or do you feel like no, where there's a, what I just said, I'll come back to what Brando Hancock said. That's the only example I can give you. They said, no, there was a federal decision and who are we to say we are a school choice district where those families wanna choose? It's now the law of the land in the country that you can use public dollars, that you have to use public dollars now if you're a school choice district to support even a religiously affiliated independent school. We're not going to then say. Right. That's how they decided. I agree. I think we should. So, I guess I can make a motion. Okay. RSU, the district provide tuition up to the state average for our religiously affiliated schools. Do we have a second? Amy made that motion. Robert, Mayor, seconded. Further discussion? All in favor, signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. I just have a budget presentation. I'm reading them. Good. But I didn't have enough time for it. So. We didn't get the choice. We had five to. Okay, then we're over that. That's a little bit. That's okay. So, this piece, anything that I would like if you can hand it out. Okay. Yep. That's great. All right. Jared, jump in at any point. Can I know what all object codes mean, please? All object codes. So, we're going back to salary and benefits where you'll see where under intervention it says salary and benefits only. Yep. And then all object code is everything that's currently in the budget under that function. So if you think back to your budget presentation, object codes are your 100s, 200s, 300s, 100s being salaries, 200s being benefits, 300 being contract and services, 600 being your supplies, books, that type of stuff. So that's what all object codes mean. Okay. Thank you. And I'm going to jump in. I just because we have Robert and Bill are new with this approach. So, what we did last year, we talked a little bit about the retreat, but I wanted us to get out of the weeds and talking about the small wide items and talk bigger picture.  So that's a big chunk of your budget. But what you have control of about 85% of personnel. So we try to steer the conversation much more on let's talk personnel, the personnel support where you're trying to get in less about $500 budget lines. And so you will get all the budget lines. That will come in December. We talk about the whole budget and then we come back to you off of that feedback in January. And if we have to do two meetings in January, we will. But typically, at least this, well, you guys, you're on a different time. So you guys are even ahead of, you don't go up on that. So. But you got a lot of time. But what I would tell you is, is that in Terra and then you can jump in, but when we talked about student support, this is essentially keeping your staffing the same. And you currently have a student support. Which is called? From 2022 to 2023. And so. So is this regular ed parents? Is that what you're looking at? Yeah, regular ed parents. Yeah, I want to get right there. So you've got a principal and two admin assistants. Yep. And so this is the same as last year. FTE as last year. Yes. All of these are just, you're going to tell them all. I'm going to tell them each line. So you've got a principal and two admin assistants. So they'll be the same. The singular principal. Yep. Shouldn't be, right? So we've got you budgeting the same in regards to intervention, which is 1.2. That's the same that you budget now currently locally. You've got a school counselor at 1.0, which is the same. The nurse we have still at 1.0. You'll see a change in salary there. That's just a different person out person that you have from last year to this year. She asked the change in salary there. And you've got the same in regards to regular at Paris. Three of them. From this year to next year. And then do you want to talk about those three Paris? So two currently support both our preschool programs. And that's a licensing piece, like to fully enroll to each space is licensed to up to 15 kids for preschool both in Rochester and Stockbridge. But preschool is under agency of education as well as child care. So under two agencies and under the childcare licensing piece, if there's more than 10 kids, you have to have two adults. So we support that by having a share educator in each room that supports any preschool program. And the Health and Human Services Division. Yeah. So what overseas? What's our projected population for next year, for pre-care? Pretty close to full. No, yeah. It's super early in the fall. 15. In each? Yep. The way we do that in Rochester is three-year-olds are split up in a half-day situation. So there's a group of three-year-olds to come half-day once a Thursday, Friday and a little more than half-day on Monday, Tuesday and the four-year-olds come five days a week for a full day. And then in Stockbridge, there's some three-year-olds that are half-days right now because they're building up socially, emotionally to be in full day. Okay. And then the other parent educator in there supports a student on a 504 plan. And then the subs we kept at the same level of funding and we still, just so you know, we do look to expand, we use our ESSER funds just because there is more need for substitutes in general right now with COVID and folks being out due to symptoms and things. So we'll continue to pledge it with ESSER additional substitute funding too, but I feel like this is a good number that you could continue to do what you've been doing year to year. So we keep that right in the budget. So you see the bottom line and student support as of right now, but before we go to the math interventionist that you have, you have a full-time math interventionist across the two buildings. That's completely funded via ESSER funds. And we'll apply in 2023. It will continue for the next two years. Two years. Yeah. So that's how we'll look to continue to budget that for now. I think we're, you know, as we start to develop your budget this year, one of the things that we may need to look at, remember this is just first draft one, but as we start next draft, you're going to get all your teaching, the rest of your teaching staff, we're going to be at it plus this. Okay. One of the things we may need to decide is whether or not we want to add some of that math FTE in your budget, even though we do cover it in ESSER, just starting to build. Because yeah, it's going to be eventually. Yeah. ESSER is going to do it then. It is. So we didn't do it today for this draft because I feel like we'll have a bigger picture around what's your bottom line looking like for us. I mean, the big thing that I've heard in these communities is certainly the excess spending threshold, right? Is an area where we're going to try to make certain, we don't go over. So those are all things we're going to continue to have to massage as we go through. They do. I'm very concerned that the CLA's in our towns are going to dramatically change, which takes our budget to actually kill our budget because it, you know, and that is that when, how they're sold at higher price than they were praised at, it drops our CLA down, which makes it so that our tax dollars don't go as far. Think about that. Yeah. So unfortunately, we need to keep that in our minds as well as our own calculations. And yet it's, I don't know, why does it have to be calculations? Why don't you go the other way? You're going to make more. You know, it's so early, we're not even here in any preliminary yield numbers or things of that nature. Although I'd say that last year, this time I was really concerned about, you know, the influx of taxes that we were having coming in from, you know, just in general business. It seems to me that business is pretty good in real time. So I'm expecting that the yield will be positive. So that's good news, but certainly the CLA is a concern. Yeah, keep it in mind. I think we're coming up on a, I mean, in the short term, yes, that could be a problem, but I think we're coming up on having a overall pretty assessment. That was one thing. Just that first. And that's good for stock price. Right, I know that one. I don't know what. I think we're at the speed of eight or something. That's getting close to that. But I think we're with a couple years. And then you, Rochester Stock Exchange Unified District, does have a school-based clinician from Claire Martin that provides therapeutic services. And that is currently budgeted within SIR. That is one of those things too, though, that we will look to continue to leverage, I would say Medicaid and other grants in general to cover. I don't think that that's something you're going to have to worry about ever, necessarily covering in your local budget. But just know that that is another student support. Can you just join us just quickly with the difference in mental health counselor and guidance? Yeah. So I think we're getting better at defining this within our system, because I think it used to get pretty mixed. School counselors are really not trained to be individual therapists, right? They're trained to help teachers around universal instruction, to help students with a social-emotional curriculum. They're trained to implement social-emotional curriculum. They're certainly trained to around proficiency-based learning and transcripts and things of that nature. Their focus is different based on whether they wanted to focus more on secondary or primary, but the license is K-12s. I think in general at schools, if people get into the school counseling profession because they wanted to be a therapist, it's really easy to have that be a big focus part of your time. The issue that as a system that we recognize what that is, is if you spend your time doing that, you're constantly reacting to the smaller percentage of students that may need that support. And you're now focusing on all those proactive strategies I just talked about, right? Like implementing a social-emotional curriculum. Making certain we're doing PBIS with fidelity, positive behavior interventions and supports. So we're really trying to say to our school counselors, and this is not just an arsenal, it's all over the SU, your focus is on preventative, universal approach to our work. And if someone needs therapy, we're going to get them to be master's level therapists. And so that's the difference. So the mental health counselors are master's level therapists that are going to do that individual therapy work for the student, to treat the underlying issues they may have around their internalizing or externalizing behaviors we may see, but that doesn't take away from the school counselor serving all kids. And this service is provided at location at school, yeah? Yeah. Does she go back and forth? She does. And the nice thing is they do build down and medicate themselves. So we're able to get our school-based clinicians at a much, much, much cheaper cost than it would be if we tried to hire them ourselves. Great, great. And they have the supervision of Claire Martin Center. Great. That sounds good. Yeah, and the system behind them to, so whatever, to be able to prepare. We're trying to strengthen our relationship with Claire Martin. And we kind of, the timing was opportune in the sense of they were doing a ton of work with Hartford School District and Hartford School Districts going with a different provider more closely to them. And so that did open up some resources for Claire Martin. And really under the Claire Martin umbrella, it truly is this districts that they cover are Randolph and us. And geographically, we're a huge, we have a huge area for them and they cover Bradford too. They have an office over there, but we're really looking to try to strengthen that relationship with our community. Well, Rochester in the past had a relationship with Claire Martin. Yeah, I agree. So that was good to be able to reestablish that. Yeah, it seemed like we didn't have a lot going on with them when I arrived. We did not. So I'm glad to reestablish that. Good. Yes. Good. Next month, you're going to get a lot more meat to this. It'll be the rest of your instructional programming. And then we'll look to discuss all right where we feel like we need to massage things because in December, you'll get everything. Yes. Good. But in general, there's quite a few FTEs there. There's, I mean, there's three, six, seven, eight, like almost 10. And we're still at 1.34%, 8,000 to bottom line. So that's a good thing to start with. Right? And it does have anticipated, just so you know, increases in negotiated salaries and projecting benefits of health insurance is that projected at 12%. Tara? I would have been 12%. 12%. This is the first one. Yes, I did a 12%. We won't have the actual rates in from vis-v-vit until January. So based on medical trend, it's what I'm using. And we're, again, just know, we've said that all last year too, we're going to budget conservatively, right? Like we're not going to short change insurance budgeting. Right. Because you can't make, that's really hard to make up for. And then that gets us into a deficit. And you have one person that comes in, you know, as a family and you get budget for it, you just 20 grand right there. And those are some of the gambling that we uncovered that seem to be have been happening. Right. Probably with multiple business managers. Well, it'd be interesting to see once our audit takes place, where that insurance, is what we funded it at higher. We funded the HRAs completely. The HRAs, and so I'd like to see where that line, I'd be happy to see what that line comes in at. That was actually used in the budget for. So HRA utilization, I can tell you, I just got the report from Datapath. Just got to find where I put it. From January 2021 through September 2021, so you are crossing over fiscal years. We were at 48.14% utilization of the HRA funds. Okay. And that's across the entire supervisor union. Okay. Does that compare, is there a comparison number from last year? We were at 46 prior to that. So we had a slight increase in utilization. So you think about what happened last year in the medical field with non-emergency surgeries all being put off as a result of COVID. We will potentially see additional utilization as medical elective surgeries start to open back up. Again, because your HRA is funding your deductibles. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. You're welcome. Yeah. So the budget for the unknowns of the budget are always just in, it's what I really learned being on a school board is how this is a gamble. Okay. Which of it is educated and educated? That's all it is. We look to our experts to figure out what is best. No, the best guess and cover us well.  Excellent. Yeah. Thank you. Any further questions on this? Let's move on. Board goals. I feel like I left our retreat only at the very end as I was literally walking away understanding what a goal was. After we'd spent like 45 minutes talking about it, I realized I didn't think we actually knew. I'm not sure who wants to handle this. I don't feel like we have them yet. We have protocols, but we've got our goals. But I do, I have some too, but I just want to, but I want to get a consensus of how we want to go about this as we could spend hours on this alone. Well, I think that, yeah, in general, I mean, an overview is that we want our meetings to be largely focused on student achievement. On academic excellence that we do not want to spend our time. For this, Robert, no, no, just because actually what do we want to come out of this meeting with is what I'm saying. Do we want to list that tonight? Do we want a list that we come back and talk about next time? What are we trying to accomplish tonight? Because what it is is that we could start talking about goals and we could talk for a long time. Yeah, and I just want to make sure that we have a concrete goal tonight. What do we want to achieve? And that we set a time limit and then that's it. Just so we, and I don't mean to shut you down because I think it's a very good goal. I just want to, is our consensus to come away tonight in 15 minutes, which is what we... No, I don't think we can do that. No, but I think of the first draft of board goals in 15 minutes. I'll be sort of more of an idea throw up. How do we deal with that? I took the liberty of, for my notes that I retreat to try to capture the essential areas, the goal setting areas that we focus on. And there are five of them. And I've got a handout here, which is a super draft, but it seems like one place to start is, are these the top five areas that we want to focus goals on? Okay, and if we can have a consensus just on those areas in 15 minutes, that will be, I think, time well spent. We might find out, no, we don't want five, we need 10, we need not this one, that one. But the focus here is I put each focus area into some language, goal setting language, including measures so that we have some sense of whether we've met the goals at the end of the year. So I'd like to put the chairman's permission. No, do you have any pass on out? I don't think it would. And I wasn't able to get. Thank you. Well, I still want before we even take action, what are we looking for tonight? You said to take this list and when it went down, what do we want to get to tonight? I think that you didn't necessarily hash out all of the ideas that are retreat. And I think it would be helpful if we were to put out ideas that we could then future whittle down in the future. So if we could kind of hung up on a couple during the retreat and I felt like there were more avenues to explore that might be included.  Also, Lili and I started just chatting about the idea of a three to five year plan as far as goals. And there's a bunch of different ways of doing this, in other words. So what is our goal for tonight? What is our goal for tonight? What do we want to leave? Wait, that's what I said, first draft of our overall goals. Well, again, I want to just again put this on the table and we can, the yay or nay is, do we have the right focus areas? And that's a question that this rough draft will help us do because you'll see very quickly what five key areas are that were coming out of that retreat. Well, these key areas are not and should we drop them or add to them? And if we can get the key areas, not the actual language of what the goal shall be having to do with that key area, but at least we have a focus thing that we have. And since it may not be able to do that in 15 or 20 minutes, but I think it really be helped because the first one I've got here is board governance. We talked about setting protocols for how the board conducts its business. And we have a draft of that that Justine and I worked up. That has to do with how efficient and effective, and as Robert says, what our focus is, is a board. And I thought there was some interest at the retreat to develop operating protocols. We don't have to decide that tonight, but that's one key area that came out of the retreat. The second one was, or another one was academic achievement or performance goals. Where should the metrics be at the end of this year for our student bodies? What should we be trying to get to? And the superintendent is taking the lead on that. And that's really the core of why we have a board. The third one has to do with funding. Why do we budget? And how do we define our budget as being successful or not? That might not be a priority. It might be a different word, it might be budgeting, but it's things like we spend a lot of time on budgeting. What should be the outcomes of that process? The fourth one, enrollment speaks to the idea that if we can grow our student body, both of the number of students and the tuition students, the greater our tuition revenue is, that supplements our budget. We don't have to be going to the taxpayer if we can grow that. And secondly, every single student will allow us more flexibility for spending without tripping the state's spending cap. So if we add five students and the cap is $18,000, theoretically, we could spend another $18,000 per student before tripping that cap. Reverses, if we lose five students, it makes our budget even tighter. So the one thing here is, can we do something? Should we do something as a board to try to attract parents to get their kids here? Home schoolers, whatever the case is, to consider us as being the best little elementary schools. I think it's well worth it, but that might not be a focus area one. And then Ethan, you talked about strong schools and what I heard from you was you wanna have something having to do with school structure, buildings. Are we maintaining them? Are we taking care of them? So the educational process can take place. So I stuck that in. I wasn't absolutely sure where you were aiming at that, but that's a very important area. How do you have an education that the school is falling apart around you? So those are just five areas, but they're important areas. They're not necessarily in priority order. And I'm not suggesting these are the only ones or any of these are, well, I think a number of them are essential, but we can go beyond this. We can do anything we want, but I think it would be helpful, Justine, for you to give us a sense and everybody else saying, look at this and say, hey, I'd rather do this or I wanna do this in addition and see how we wouldn't let down with being this. That's my suggestion. This is excellent for me. I guess the idea of goals is broader and really has to do with, as Lindy and I are talking about, what kind of school do we want? Not just running a good school, but what kind of school do we want? What do we want it to have? What do we want it to emphasize? Literacy and mathematics given to me. We've already started this push toward outdoor education. I mean, Rochester Valley Man Arts. We keep saying this, but it's just sort of like, oh, yes, arts and it's not. It's a thing that could make money. It's a thing that could put us on the map as far as what people, why people will come when we got Watesfield and Warren. We have a stronger arts program and then people might even think about coming down here killing the same thing. They'll come to Stockbridge if we have a stronger program. So I see that this is a bit, but this to me is a little nuts and bolts and management where I really want goals to be dreaming kind of stuff. Not just what we know we can do, but what do we want to do? Justine. Yeah, that is kind of similar to what I was gonna say. We came up with these ideas, but I think they're under this umbrella of what our mission is. What is our mission? We did talk a little bit about social climate and our approach to learning. So I think for me, I like hearing these ideas. I wanted to hopefully have us all be able to add a few more and tonight in a brainstorming manner and then maybe come back and hone it down another time. But for me to piggyback on what you're saying, a mission is a big goal. And I think a lot of those things fall underneath that. How are we going to have, how is our board gonna govern itself? How are we gonna approach funding as a mission? How are we going to, how will our mission affect enrollment? How will our mission affect how kids learn in the social climate within which they feel comfortable or don't feel comfortable learning? So that was my big idea, but I wanted to open it up to other people who had other ideas and the outdoor learning portion. What does our school look like and what are other people's ideas that maybe didn't talk at the last meeting as much at the retreat? You kind of said the word mission and the school has a mission statement and maybe even rather than a forward goal, maybe we want to revisit what the mission statement of our district is and see if it needs some updating. I don't know, Robert, you have to go for it. Well, as I was sort of alluding to earlier, I'm really thinking in terms of broader of how do we conduct ourselves and I think an essential part of and the essential umbrella under which we conduct ourselves is how much time do we focus on student achievement on what the student, the outcomes are for the students? How much of each of our meetings do we spend on that? If we're spending all our, I mean, it's all over the map of how much time board spend on budget on trivial details and such where I was very excited that we can be spending the majority of our time of every meeting working on what the outcomes are for the students and then these can come under that, but if we're spending it on trivia, that's not, I mean, the goal is for us to spend time on outcomes for students. And that's an important goal, I think that then you start going down the line of, okay, how do we budget our time to spend on other things or accomplishing that? I mean, that just, you know, student achievement and it's very easy to spend all our time of that looking at these charts. And I just think there's some really interesting ways of teaching well that I'd like to explore. And so that we're giving Lindy not just the goal be a good school, but it's almost, I feel like I want to be a unique school and an exciting school. Because I think that's the big difference, is that this is everything we're hearing tonight and the kind of thing, this is how to be a good school, but it's not for me yet how to be an extraordinary school. Sharon Academy, I have to say, has created a model for how to be an extraordinary school. And not that we follow their thing, but I think in terms of their vision, this is the time finally we've gotten so many of the distractions out of our way that we can now say not just nuts and bolts, good student teaching literacy, but literally what do we want to be as a school? What is out, you know? And that's to me, it's a really big picture statement. And all of this, of course, is a given. You know, and this is why this list is so good because this is a given for me, that this is what we're about. But it's even bigger than that, that we're the visionaries who give this message to our administration. And she says, wow, okay. Here's how we make a three in five year plan to get to that vision. So I think if you're talking that big of a vision, then you need to have all the stakeholders at the table, which includes parents, kids, staff, myself, because that's what you represent. It's that whole group. So if that's the direction that I think we, which is a good, I'm not disagreeing with it, I'm just saying we need to have all the stakeholders involved in building that vision. So it doesn't just become this group of six people plus myself and Jamie. Yeah, and I, you know, I've been so focused in some ways, like the last meeting, it's like I've been so focused on damage control for years now. And I could finally be able to get creative as a board member excites me. And maybe it's not the job of a board member, maybe I should leave, you know, in some ways, because, but I do think it's the opportunity to start. So maybe your goal is a community engagement. Well, your goal may be then to relook at your mission and vision over the next six to eight months. And frankly, if that's the goal, then I would also look for us to bring in a facilitator to do that really important work, right? And because I think there's multiple steps you should take in doing so. So when Amy brought up your mission and vision again, your goal may be just that, that you're going to have recreated and revise your mission and vision, which is gonna drive the direction of your school moving forward, right?   What I mean by that is that they teach all their content through expedition. And it's thematic units of study. That is not how you're set up right now in our approach, but that doesn't mean that you couldn't have that. It also means that the district that you couldn't have a school that even specialized in one thing. And that there was choice within, intro district choice within your schools, right? Around that. So I think that those are the bigger conversations that you may be asking for. And I think to do that, that your goal may be to really dig into that work. And I was gonna, and I would say if we're gonna do that, that we should hire someone that does that work professionally that helps us facilitate that conversation. I think it might be. Well, and I think we can also make a decision we can also make a decision on the board whether we want to do that. I mean, that may be my vision solely. And that's, this is where we have a board and not one person makes the decision is that we need a consensus. You know, maybe just running a good school is fine for everybody. I'd like to push it a little harder myself. So I guess when I read this agenda item, the board goals, I was thinking more as a body what can we can have under three hour weeks? Like, we could be more efficient with our time and, you know, here. And a lot of what we need for these. I think that's the protocols. That's how we manage ourselves. Well, we're not doing, we could have the goal to do our protocols. Well, no. You know, I- Well, I'd like to say, okay, so we have, clearly we have different visions of what goals are. Right. And we have to find a way to come together on what is a board goal. And not sure. We, maybe we don't know how to do that. And maybe it isn't something that happens in five more minutes. Thank you. I don't know. I don't think we should get hung up about definition. I think we should try to air, and this is the great brainstorming time tonight, to air those things that we're passionate about as parents, as citizens, as school board directors. And capture those in some meaningful way so that we can use those as a guidance tool, not just to talk about, but do something over the next six months, a year, whatever your timeframe is. And that's the, the thing about goals is they like to have a result area that's clear.  And, but right now we're playing around what's the most important things we could be going after. And we've got some nuts and bolts things that I think are essential if we're gonna be not only a good school, schools, but a great school. And we're not there yet. You looked at the scores tonight. They didn't tell us we were a great school yet. The same time you're zeroing in and I think that's exciting, the same with Justin. But what about, what could we do to make it exciting and special? And they don't have to be either or. We can, we can, I think we'll probably have to whittle down the number, but if there's a board consensus, we can go after a number of those things. And some will take longer than others. And I agree with Jamie's view. They're gonna take probably a professional help. And if we're talking about vision, we certainly have to involve the community. So that will take some time, but that doesn't mean it's not important. And I think what I'm excited about is that we spend time together to find what's important for us moving ahead and do it in a constructive way where we can go after it. And it could be five, it could be three, it could be 10. And I think tonight's been helpful because we've got some new things on the table. And so we can do some more of this just to find what's important and then try to actually come up with a goal statement with a specific result. And it's in a specific timeframe because when you look at a board goal, it's a goal for six months, for a year. And we are at 21 minutes on this. So all this was just on my draft was the definition with the school year. The test results come out, there's a summer or something. But that doesn't mean you can't have multi-year goals, which is where we hope to be in the first year, but it's gonna be a five-year effort. And our goal is to have a, to review our mission and vision statement and we can have it, you know, that could be a goal. Absolutely, let's finish up with Robert. And when we're not done with this, we'll bring it back next time. Robert. Okay, just, Jamie, you had an example of a goal at their retreat, could you remember it? Then you could just eat that. Because it was fairly limited in scope and I'd like to contrast to what we're... It was, yeah. So for White River Unified District, they've been starting to Uber focus on more personalized based learning and more multiple pathways toward learning. So a concrete goal that they gave the administration was is that all grade levels, seven through 12 will have a rigorous and public display of learning by the spring of 2023. So they gave a year and a half, but they also didn't say what it had to be and what the administration will do will be continuing to provide monitoring reports on that goal of how they're gonna get to that end. The other thing that they wanted was students like conferences, implementing grades four through eight by next fall. And that aligned to our work in proficiency-based learning and pathways, right? So it wasn't an add-on on what we're doing, but those were two tangible goals that the board set out for the administration to then work with their faculty to get to. So specific, measurable, achievable, it was definitely relevant and it was sort of a time on it. Good. Move on. Presume, Will, this will be on, continue to be on the agenda of what it is. I think you guys did a good job on board this. I think four, five, and six all speak to the same thing. So I didn't know if there was a better way that we could combine them. It talks about the path of communication through complaints and just staff communication and different plate procedure. Yeah. So you're under the three, four and five or four, five, six of the proposed RSUD board protocols. Yes, four, five, and six, yeah. Pretty much family, Vermont's School Board of Associations indicators of an effective board. And I get a little word smithing and they had like 21 indicators. Safford had like 21 or something and I will it down to one page. You're right. I think our chair was to that one. So to the extent that we can, if we're duplicating or we can, if we're being unnecessarily repetitious, we can certainly change that. Oh, yeah. It says all staff communication with the board and board requests of the staff should go through the superintendent. All personnel complaints and criticisms received by the board or its individual members are directed to the superintendent. The board will encourage others to follow the board's policy on complete procedures concern and probably address the issue. I just, I mean, it's fine if we can keep it like that. I just felt that it was kind of saying the same thing over and over again. Would you give it a good edit? My father was an editor and it's a very wonderful skill. You can make it clear and shorter and reduce the verbiage and still convey what we're trying to do here. They're important things. One is kind of a chain of command. That's number four. And that we go through the superintendent so that we're not having independent ex parte communications without his knowledge. So I think that's important. The fifth one has to do with when there's incoming tomatoes being thrown at our staff or at the board or at the staff that we got to make sure that it flows through the superintendent. And then the individual parent or something having a problem in the classroom, the recommended procedures is you go to the teacher. If that doesn't solve the problem, you go to the principal. If that doesn't solve the problem, you go to the superintendent. If that doesn't solve the problem, it goes to the toss. What's the difference between four and five? You have the staff communication with the board and the board of directors of the staff. You should go through the superintendent. And five is all personnel complaints. Could it be all personnel and staff communication, complaints and criticisms? I'm not wedded to, this is our kind of, this is our, it's like the Boy Scouts Creed, you know, you get your 10 things and you look at it, that's the principles above. And again, I didn't do any of this. This came from a wonderful book called Governance Core, School Board Superintendents and Schools Working Together. I think four and five should be differentiated between maybe staff and or personnel and community because community people provide complaints and criticisms. Maybe we could change those two in that way. Yeah, and maybe some of my stumbling here is the fact that we use staff and personnel, aren't they the same people? Staff is in four and personnel is in five, aren't we talking about the same people? But we're giving them two different names. I think so. I thought one was about communications and one was about dealing with. Let's redo that. Let me go. One thing that, one of our goals in approving some sort of operating protocols and governments is that we all understand the same understanding of what they mean, what the words mean. Right. And what you pointed out is there's a shortcoming in two or three of these things that need to be either clarified or simplified or combined. And so, I'll, you know, Justin and I could go after those. Yeah, I think you guys did a great job though, with coming down to this. It really, I think it's great. What I love is number seven. The effect of longboard meetings should be avoided. And, but it speaks to, and we do a lot of those things now about setting time limits and probably speaking to have so many minutes, all those sorts of things. And Robert talks about focusing kind of like the policy sort of things. And we can show those get a fair and complete hearing. If that's the case, then anything that can be basically considered operating items remains with the superintendent and the principal and that sort of thing. Well, if I can, I really like that you guys have the principles and the protocols. That those are distinguished from each other and the principles to me really guide how you do your business. Yes, you know, like it's like, this is what's really important to us. So I like how you differentiated those. And Robert, number one is you speaking, I hope, under governance principles. And number two, this is what I've learned and seen from our board chair, the importance of teamwork and working together as a team and a focus and purpose. And that's gonna help us achieve what we wanna achieve. I gotta say, I get more out of the principles than I do out of the protocols. Yeah, yeah. I don't know, maybe it's the kind of person I am, but I mean, principles tell me and it's so easy to take that in, the other part of the six. And I just think the other ones, the protocols are the weeds a little bit that are useful to know about and go to refer to, but really the principles for me are the useful tools. Well, let me just give you a, I think we need both. I think the corporate level, broad principles are absolutely, I mean, that's where it gets down to. But then you can get, I'm a new board member.  Why can't I just go see Lindy? Tell her what I think or what I want her to do. I've got plenty of ideas. We're not supposed to operate that way. Well, if so, it helps to have something specific so I don't stumble. I don't know. And there's so many ways to stumble, meaning good. Another good way is having a strong opinion, having a vote, you lose the vote and you don't support the vote. Oh my gosh, that's the opposite of being a team member. So there's some things I think, and these don't have to be, this isn't the Magna Carta, but I think some things have to be clear so that whether you're a 20 year board member as far as experience or just coming on like myself, we understand better what our expectations are. I think this is helpful for the community as well to understand what the expectations are and what the role is specifically the protocols and to not expect more than that of an individual person. So I took away being kind of glad to see that that would be something that other people might see and maybe treat us differently in certain situations. Yeah. Well, I think if we can just clarify the, I guess the wording of four and five and maybe in six, we specify, I mean, do we wanna specify the person who can expeditiously address their issues because we're telling them to go to the superintendent and to the, I don't think we even say in here to go to the principal anywhere. Let's take a look at those. We also have the Stafford as much longer a number of protocols. So you can refer back to that which Jamie passed out at the tree. And then all of us should have copies of essential work of school boards on page 65 or 66 is the Vermont School Board Association's take on this as well. So, and I took some of this language out of that and you're pointing out very wisely that it's unclear and it's possibly due to, well, that means it isn't working. Do you think maybe we could all take this and bring back our suggestions of rewording certain pieces? Yeah, I think that would be good at this point. I think that's a good idea. Because, you know, I've looked at it quite a bit. I would to Ethan's point of speaking about our broader goals. That number 12 in the Board of Protocols, there's a lot of number 12 that I think should be in the governing principles, especially with regard to vision. So, I mean, that's something I think we should consider when we come back and look at this. Because with this, I think this is excellent governing principles, but it's, I would I say, it's a how, but it doesn't say where we're going. I agree, I agree with that, that seems right. It doesn't have to be big, but it's to be up there. Yeah, thank you, Robert. But I'm sure if we all spend a little more time with it, we might come up with some more adjustments that might ring true and we can kind of hash it out next time and finish it. So bring it back, that we bring it back with more notes. Excellent, great. I'll just add to you guys, I think this work is like zero-based budgeting, right? Like you're going to work really hard to get this right now and then you'll be able to tweak it as you move forward and sort of feel your boards. Yeah, and this wasn't even a possibility in the last three years, just wasn't even a possibility. There was huge scoring goals right in front of us that we didn't pick, but that had to be dealt with. So this is all lovely stuff, really. It's just great. Good. You've done nine, haven't you? Yes, we've done nine. Nine, we did nine. They're under 10. We've hired some resignations. We have one resignation, Elwin, which was signed effective this coming Friday. And so we're going to be searching for a custodian for our schools. We may look, just as the board knows, possibly at trying to use investor money, specifically when we think about capital improvement and just delayed maintenance. We may focus our energy on looking at someone who's more focused on being the new maintenance work. Again, service and money. Yeah, it would save us some money, I think, across the building right now, I get really concerned. Like I've went and the maintenance guy distracted comes into things like fix your change sense. And we just have to have someone with staff that can do that. You're, you got two buildings. Really need someone with a maintenance background. So I think that what we will look to do is leverage ESR funds to do that. What's the FTE as you're leaving? Part time. 0.5. 0.5? Yeah. Okay. So we're looking to make that up to a full. Yep. I think we need to. And then you will come up with a strategy of how to pay for that in the future. Moving forward. Both in the near term and in the long term. Great. That sounds good. But yeah, it just, your district is, you know, we still have a couple other districts where we don't have that type of level of position, but your district needs it. And so if we have the opportunity to do that. Do you think we'll find the other head? You know. I'm hopeful. I got it.  I mean, what we will do is we still have custodial work that needs to happen in the meantime, right?  This is where the SU can really help out. But, you know, I think that just as we look to again, take your district to the next notch, this is a position that, you know, we really need to. And then what you look at the master agreement and what that's going to cost, it's not significant enough that we shouldn't be doing it. Great. And I think in general, we'll probably save enough to pay for it almost. Do we need to have a motion to accept this resignation? Just to accept it. Yeah, for your policy. It's a strange thing. Can we move to accept the resignation? I'll say you accept that. With appreciation. I make a motion to accept Ellen tWitchell's resignation with appreciation. Hold second. Robert second. Motion made by Justine. All in favor. Hi. Hi. Hi. Very good. All in the comments. You're here. Tim. No, it's actually game. Tim! What's going on? We're here. We're going to be gone. Oh, there he is. We can't hear you. You're muted. And it looks like you have a hat on.  And maybe he disappeared when we lost him. That was the score. That's all we care about. All right, tune up. What? Tune up, you know what he said. Oh, great. That's the public comment. For that level of public comment. Great. Thank you, Tim. Michaela, do you have any problem with that one? Great. Thank you so much. All right, future agenda items. I've got, we're going to be doing a presentation on your outdoor education program that will include students and faculty. And the next draft of the budget, of course, will be on the agenda. You've got your policy. Sorry, your goals and protocols, the anti-racism policy will hopefully be there for adoption. So I have all those things. And whatever else folks want to look to add. And if you don't know now, email Ethan. We'll work to get it on. Yeah. Cool, anything else? The only other one thing I want to say is I called for the first time this beautiful generator in place at Stockbridge. It's gorgeous, it's in place. Almost there. Okay. It's just waiting on the insulation of the propane tank. Great. That's what that thing is, that big plate. That's wonderful. That's my understanding. Okay, good. But it looks amazing. That's why we're using an instructor, right? It was like, I wasn't expecting it. I was expecting another 10th and I walked around the corner and I was just thinking, that looks great. Yeah. And I liked that it's out proper for people to see it. That's great. Good. Thank you. I think the neighbor would be good. Next meeting date is Tuesday, November 2nd, 2021. The day after my birthday, as you all know. Regular meetings at Stockbridge campus and by Google Meet. I'll entertain a motion to adjourn. Seconded? I guess. All in favor? Aye. Good night and thank you. Good night. Yep, thank you, sir. Good night.