All right, thank you all for coming. Good to see you today. I'm going to try to plug a couple of books during my talk today, since this is a bookstore and coffee bar. So take advantage of that 20% discount. And they didn't pay me to say that. So. All right, so this presentation actually was originally a paper that I presented at the Evangelical Theological Society last year. And then I was accepted for publication in Biola University's Journal for Spiritual Formation, so that should be coming on in the spring. But it's a topic that's really important to me, sort of an issue and a general topic that's woven through a lot of the classes that I teach. And something that I think is important and helpful for all of us. One of the things I love about teaching at a seminary is that we have integration of so many different disciplines all toward the ministry of the local church. And so I think this presentation, hopefully, will help you think towards that end of integrating our ministry as Christians, as church leaders within the context of the local church, and how corporate worship fits all of that. So that's why I've titled this Practice Makes Perfect, How Corporate Worship Forms Disciples. So in Matthew 28, we find that Christ gave us a great commission as churches. And Christ's commission to us was to make disciples. Churches accomplished that mission through proclaiming the gospel first, and then, according to him in Matthew 28, through baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit, and through teaching them to observe all that I have commanded. And I'll plug a couple books here. DeYoung and Gilbert's What is the Mission of the Church is very helpful on this subject. I think they developed this theme very well, as well as Dave Doran's For the Sake of His Name, Challenges for a New Generation of World Missions, which I'm going to quote from in a moment as well, develops this idea.  And this is why scripture, I think, gives such careful attention to the behavior of Christians. For instance, in 1 Peter, Peter says that Christians' behavior should be holy as God is holy. But the thing is that although Christians are new creatures with new hearts of obedience to Christ, holy behavior is not something that comes automatically. Observing Christ's commands, as the Great Commission explicitly states, is something that must be taught. And that is what is the job of church leaders in the context of a local church. Christian behavior is a learned moral behavior. But in a day in which Christianity has become very personal and individualistic, and corporate worship in particular has become merely an experience or perhaps a time of individual, authentic expression to the Lord, the relationship between corporate worship on the one hand and the church's mission of making disciples on the other hand is often misunderstood. So on the one hand, some pastors believe that corporate worship is something entirely separate from discipleship. It's entirely different. But on the other hand, some pastors who recognize their need to obey Christ's command in the Great Commission turn corporate worship either into an evangelistic crusade or into a lecture hall. And neither of those, I believe, rightly understands the role that corporate worship plays in the making of disciples. So the purpose of this presentation is to argue that corporate worship is one of the primary means of making disciples through the ritual shaping of moral virtue. I want to kind of unpack that and develop that argument. So first, an important question we need to answer is how do churches make disciples? If that is our mission, how do we accomplish that mission? And this is where I think Dave Doran and for the sake of his name, helpfully articulates how that occurs. He argues that since making disciples is the primary command of the Great Commission in Matthew 18, this task involves not only the proclamation of the gospel, but also teaching and nurturing new converts. It, quote, means to make someone into a learner or follower of Jesus Christ. The commission given to us by Jesus involves, he says, the transformation of rebels into followers. This means that, technically, he says, the Great Commission involves more than what is normally called evangelism, by which Doran means only leading a person to a decision for Christ. Sharing the gospel, evangelism is certainly the first step, an important first step towards making disciples, but it's not enough. Instead of understanding salvation to be merely an intellectual assent of certain biblical facts, Doran insists, quote, saving faith sees the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. Saving faith involves a heart response to the gospel, where the affections are turned by the spirit to him in love. Saving faith also involves, he says, the will, that is, the believer embraces Jesus Christ as the only hope of eternal life and entrusts himself to him. So in other words, true conversion is not simply assent to certain facts. True conversion is a life-changing entrance into communion with God. It is, to quote 1 Thessalonians chapter one, turning to God from idols to serve the living and true God. Chuck Lawless in an article about the relationship between discipleship and ethics says, a process of making disciples that ends with only the conversion of the evangelized is incomplete at best, disobedient at worst. In fact, he says, the results of this omission can be disastrous. Untought believers are ill-equipped to face trials, untrained to recognize false teaching and unprepared to teach others. They quickly become easy prey for an enemy who seeks to devour them, and I think he's right. So understanding that discipleship begins with evangelism but involves more than that. The question remains as to how churches accomplish their mission of forming disciples. Certainly, much of what is involved in disciple-making involves the transmission of doctrine. This is why preaching and teaching are so important and central to the mission of the church. Without a proper set of beliefs, one will not behave in a manner worthy of Christ. However, data transmission is not all there is to discipleship. It's not just about teaching the mind. And there are at least three reasons that I believe data transmission is not enough. First, Christian behavior is more than simply a right collection of beliefs. Notice that Jesus did not say teaching them all that I have commanded them. He didn't say that. He said teaching them to observe all that I have commanded them. Christian behavior, Christian living, is a collection of skills. And a development of a skill set requires more than just a certain amount of knowledge. Knowledge is a first step but it's not enough. Second, making disciples is more than data transmission because the reality is that most of our actions on a daily basis are not the result of deliberate rational reflection upon our beliefs. Some are, to be sure. But most of how we act on a daily basis is due to ingrained habits. A pastor then can proclaim the gospel to someone and see them come to faith in Christ and then he can teach that person biblical doctrines. But that will not necessarily make a disciple who is characterized by moral living, especially if a new convert has many biblical behaviors that conflict with biblical living, that many habitual behaviors that conflict with biblical living. So a drug addict who becomes a Christian will still have to deal with his addiction. A petty thief may find himself unintentionally slipping things off the shelf into his pocket. A lazy husband will have difficulty finding energy necessary to help with the kids. Old habits die hard even for a Christian. But third, whether or not people are acting on the basis of deliberate decision or habitual response, people ultimately will not act primarily based on the knowledge of their minds, but rather on the inclinations of their hearts. We are driven not primarily by what we know, but by what we love and the affections of our hearts. For example, a child who is terrified of dogs will not pet one no matter how many statistics you give her about the docile nature of domesticated canines. A man whose heart is captivated by pornography will continually sin no matter how much he knows that it is wrong. Another way of saying this is that people act more based on their feelings than on their knowledge. And the way that many evangelicals try to combat this reality is to urge people live according to your beliefs, not according to your hearts, but it's really not that simple. The problem is not that we have replaced what drives our actions with our hearts instead of our minds. We cannot help but be driven by the inclinations of our hearts. That's how God wired us. And philosophers from Plato to Augustine to Edwards to Lewis all recognize this. And so if the intellect, what we know and the heart, what we love, if they conflict, we will always do what we want to do rather than what we know we should do. This is the nature of humanity. And so in order to cultivate holy living, in order to accomplish the mission of the church to make disciples, we need to concern ourselves with nurturing moral virtue. Teaching the mind is a first step, but it's not enough. We have to cultivate moral virtue within the people in our pews. So this then leads to the question of how moral virtue is shaped. How is moral virtue cultivated? Well first, it's important to recognize that there is a difference between what we might call the higher and lower inclinations. If we are always driven by our inclinations, the inclinations of our heart, we need to distinguish between the higher and lower inclinations. The lower inclinations or passions are those impulses that respond primarily to the physical appetites. And Paul describes those who live according to these lower appetites. He says in Philippians chapter three, their God is their belly. When set in conflict with the mind, these lower appetites will always dominate since people primarily act in the basis of inclination. But a second aspect to inclinations are the higher inclinations or the affections of the soul. Jonathan Edwards deals with this subject at great length in his book, The Religious Affections, which is well worth your time. And I think he helpfully describes the difference between the higher affections of the soul and the lower passions. He says this, the affections and passions are frequently spoken of as the same. And yet in the more common use of speech, there is in some respect a difference. Affection is a word that in the ordinary signification seems to be something more extensive than passion, being used for all the vigorous, lively actings of the will or inclination. But passion for those that are more sudden and whose effect on the animal spirits, and by animal spirits he means just the physical feelings, whose effect on the animal spirits are more violent and the mind more overpowered and less in its own command. So virtue, moral virtue is the cultivation of the higher affections toward what is right and good. And that leads then an individual to act according to what he knows is right, if his affections are geared toward that. The person still nevertheless acts according to his inclinations, we can't help that. But as C.S. Lewis so famously stated, the head rules the belly through the chest, the mind rules the passions through the noble affections. And so if pastors and church leaders want to produce disciples who are characterized by holy behavior, then pastors must give attention and church leaders must give attention to the cultivation of noble inclinations, noble affections for what is true and good. And yet the question still remains, how do we do that? How do we teach people's hearts? How do we teach people's affections? Well, let's return to the earlier analogy of skill development. I said that Christian living is a development of certain kinds of skills, certain behavioral skills. Well, developing a good golf swing or learning to play the piano or another musical instrument, any skill requires knowing the right information. You have to have the right head knowledge. But it also then requires rehearsing those skills that were learned in a book over and over and over again. You can't just learn these things from a book. You have to practice them. Skill development requires doing, not just data transmission. It requires the cultivation of habits that then become second nature. And the same is true for cultivating noble affections that will produce holy behavior. It takes training. Holiness according to Hebrews 12, 14 is something that a Christian must strive for. Paul told Timothy to discipline himself for the purpose of godliness. Holy behavior, in other words, takes practice. Once again, Lewis I think is helpful here. He describes the chest, the higher inclinations, the affections of the soul as, quote, emotions organized by trained habits into stable sentiments. Likewise, Mark Knoll describes Jonathan Edwards' view of the affections as, quote, habitual inclinations at the core of a person's being. In other words, the disciplined formation of habits is essential for formation of holy living because habit is what trains the affections. And so cultivating holy behavior involves shaping of the affections through habitual practices. That's what it's gonna take. And since habitual behaviors are cultivated by habit forming, I would suggest that this happens most significantly in the context of community. Evan Hock in an article that talks about the relationship between theology and ethics and discipleship, he recognizes this. He recognizes the significance of community when considering the development of Christian ethical behavior. And he says this, he emphasizes the, quote, relational nature of Christian behavior, drawing out explicitly the corporate dimensions of moral responsibility. He continues this way. He says, to foster the corporate nature of life, obviously he's talking about the local church, heightens the awareness of the church as an ethical community. That's where habits are formed and discipleship takes place. He says, our discipleship then must never be abstracted from the sense and duty of membership in the church and participation in that community. In particular, he notes that the development of Christian maturity comes primarily through, quote, modeling virtue, keeping promises, honoring commitments, speaking to edify, showing forgiveness and such examples. In other words, discipleship happens most successfully. This formation of habits, the shaping of inclinations which creates a disciple. This happens most successfully in the context of communities where what it is to be a disciple is modeled and lived out. So my suggestion here that moral behavior is shaped by nurturing the right kinds of habits, it might give the impression that discipleship is purely the work of man. It's just what we do. But this is far from the truth. Scientification, the discipleship process is a synergistic process wherein the Holy Spirit of God works in the life of a believer, to quote Philippians 2, to work out his salvation with fear and trembling.  The Holy Spirit is the agent that differentiates a person who is enslaved to legalistic habits or one who intentionally nurtures habits that will shape his soul. An individual without the Holy Spirit can develop all the right habits but that won't transform his life without the Holy Spirit's activity in his heart. All right, so let me summarize what I've argued to this point and then we're gonna connect this with our worship. I've argued that moral virtue is shaped by the cultivation of inclinations through habitual behavior in community. Let me say that again. Moral virtue is shaped by cultivating inclinations through habitual behavior in community. So another way to put this would be to say that discipleship is concerned with the behavior to use the Greek, the ergon of a people, a laos, the ergon of a laos. And if we consider discipleship in this way, I think it helps to reveal the significance of corporate worship for cultivating such behavior because laos combined with ergon is liturgia. The behavior of a people is shaped by its liturgies. You see, it's primarily through a church's liturgies that pastors shape the behavior of a people. At its root, liturgia is simply a compound word of laos, people, and ergon, work. Etymologically, the term simply refers to any public work. In its older broad sense, liturgia referred to any behavior that was not private, works done in public on behalf of the community. The later liturgia, of course, became the refer specifically to public works of worship to God, primarily due to its use in the Septuagint. The Septuagint translators deliberately chose this word, liturgia, to uniquely denote the formal service of priests on behalf of the people of God, and they used it almost exclusively for that kind of work in contrast to other works as it had been used previously. So this more narrow use of the word liturgia to refer to corporate worship is what we're gonna talk about in a moment. But first, I wanna focus on liturgy considered broadly, not specifically in the local church, but any sorts of habitual behavior. Liturgies have several characteristics that define them. The first two are embedded in the root words themselves. First, liturgies are behaviors. They are works. They are informed by beliefs, and they are reflections of values, but at their essence, liturgies are what people do. And this is why liturgy is so essentially connected to moral behavior. It's what we do. But of course, not all actions are liturgies. So the second characteristic of liturgies is that they are the people's work. They are communal behaviors. But then again, not all communal behavior is liturgy. The third characteristic of liturgies, beyond simply being communal behaviors, is that liturgies are a kind of ritual. In other words, they are habitual practices. Liturgies do the same thing over and over again. Now, this point is likely the biggest reason many evangelicals squirm at the mention of liturgies. For a number of reasons, evangelicals have been conditioned to see habitual, repetitious ritual as inauthentic, hypocritical, and ultimately vain repetition. But it is this very quality that makes liturgies so powerful in cultivating behavior. Consider again, the problem of viewing discipleship as only data transmission. Holy living is a skill set that Christians must develop and such skill sets require practice. What is practice if not ritual? It's doing the same thing over and over and over again. Not as an end in itself, but toward the end of developing skill. Repetition is not a deficiency of liturgy. It's actually liturgy's greatest strength. And why, for example, someone like Don Whitney categorizes public worship as a spiritual discipline. It's something we do over and over and over again in order to cultivate discipleship. Many times the aversion to liturgy is that it's simply going through the motions. But there is a virtue in going through the motions. Going through the motions is not necessarily a mark of hypocrisy. Going through the motions is often a mark of maturity. It's doing what we know is right, even if we don't feel like it. Now, it is indeed certainly possible to perform a ritual in a way that renders a vain repetition. That happens all the time. But rituals in themselves are not inherently vain. Rather, they are necessary for the formation of virtue. Anyone can tell the difference between a piano student, for example, who's just running through her scales just because she has to. And one who is performing the repetitious exercise with intentionality because she knows that it is through such a ritual that she will become a better pianist. There's a difference. It's not the ritual's fault. It's the intentionality of one who is performing the ritual. And this is exactly where the Holy Spirit's work is essential. Without the Holy Spirit, liturgy becomes dry, mundane, and enslaving. But with the Holy Spirit's active participation, liturgy becomes God's tool for spiritual formation. You see, the goal is that after practicing the scale or the swing over and over and over again, you'll be able to perform it without even thinking. It will become habitual. And this solves the second problem with viewing discipleship as only transmission of doctrine. As I said earlier, most of our actions are not the result of deliberate choice, but rather they come from the habits that we have formed through ritual. This issue is not whether we will be formed by liturgies, but which liturgies will form us. Much of how we act, much of our culture has developed through rituals. Most people, for instance, have a regular morning routine, right? Unless you get up too late, kid. This routine may have been originally informed by deliberate choices, but regardless, people eventually perform the same morning rituals without really even having to think about it, right? From driving to work, to typing on a computer, to making the coffee, most human behaviors have been shaped by habitual practices. So behavior is shaped by liturgies because, as Lewis stated, human inclinations are organized through trained habits and habits are formed through rituals. And it is the shape of those rituals then that cultivates those habits because the form of the liturgy embodies certain values. This is very essential for what we're talking about. The form of the liturgy embodies certain values that then shape the one performing the ritual. Allow me to illustrate this way. Imagine a dense forest separating two cities. In order to engage in commerce between the cities, merchants must pass through the forest. For the earliest of these merchants, this was a very difficult task wrought with many mistakes and casualties. But eventually though, over time, with experience, the merchants discovered the safest, quickest route through the forest. Once they did, they began to carefully mark the path so that they would remember the best way to go. But even then, each of these early journeys required careful attention to the markers so that they wouldn't stray from the best way. But over time, their regular trips along that same route began to form a much more visible path to the degree that years later merchants hardly pay attention. They doze peacefully as their horses casually follow the heavily-trod path. Here now is a well-worn road cut through the wood upon which travelers mindlessly pass from one city to the other. The path may seem mundane, but in reality, it is embedded with values such as the desire for safety, protection from the dangers of the forest, and conviction that this is the quickest way through. The snoozing merchants give little attention to these values. But those values are there nonetheless, whether they know it or not. Their journey has been shaped by those values, that those values are, as it were, worn into the shape of the path. And so it is with liturgies. Liturgies are developed over long periods of time, at first with very deliberate values in view. And those values are worn into the liturgies through their regular use. And when people practice those liturgies, they are shaped by the values that have formed the liturgies, whether they recognize it or not. So our aim here has been to discover how Christians can cultivate higher inclinations toward what is true and good. But we must also recognize that the reverse also happens, deformation of our inclinations. Again, our actions are not always the outcome of rational choices. And this is also true of sinful behavior as well. Sometimes our sin is deliberate and willful, often. But often sinful action is the result of ingrained habits. And those habits have been formed through the worldly liturgies around us. The rhythms of worldly routines are shaping our inclinations and the inclinations of people in our churches perhaps more than we would like to admit. These are routines and habits that are part of the cultural environment around us. And the problem is that it is because they are liturgies that people have a very difficult time, both recognizing how they are being shaped and even considering living without these things. But if we wish to make disciples, if we wish to teach people in our churches to observe all that Christ has commanded them, then we must do something to counteract the effect of the worldly liturgies that are affecting them in their everyday lives. Part of what will counteract those effects is doctrinal preaching and teaching. That's essential and important. But again, it will require more than merely data transmission. And this is exactly where it will be useful to narrow the definition of liturgia to how it's been used at least since the Septuagint as the work of the people in corporate worship. Many evangelicals today consider corporate worship as simply a Christian's expression of authentic worship towards God. But liturgy, considered now in terms of corporate worship, is not just an expression of authentic devotion. Liturgy is formative. It's not just expression, and this is why repetition is necessary for, repetition is necessary for formation. This connects a church's corporate worship inexorably with ethical behavior. As Hock notes, true worship is not primarily something emotive, but it is accompanied with a moral imperative. He notes, for example, how Romans chapter 12 connects acceptable worship with a consecrated life. You see, who Christian's worship is, of course, significant for their behavior. John Murray observed, ethics is grounded in and is the fruit of the fear of the Lord. What or whom we worship determines our behavior. That's certainly true. But an understanding of the formative nature of liturgy uncovers the fact that how Christians worship also significantly affects their behavior. Who we worship affects our behavior, but also how we worship. The rituals we perform affects how we live. And this, then, is how corporate worship fits into the Great Commission. The liturgy of a church shapes the liturgies of life. How a church worships, weak in and weak out, forms the people. It molds their behavior by shaping their inclinations through habitual practices. Because, again, the shape of the liturgy transmits its values, like that path through the forest. When people travel along the liturgy that we have provided for them, they will inevitably be shaped by the values and beliefs that have been worn into it. It is in Christian liturgy that a Christian's heart, as Lewis said, is organized by trained habits and destable sentiments, where a Christian's inclinations are discipled and trained, and where the negative effects of worldly liturgies are counteracted. What is important about a worship service, then, is not just what is said from the pulpit or the doctrine of the hymns, as important as those things are. But there are other aspects of liturgy that are important, because there are aspects of Christian piety that are inarticulable. You can't put them into words. Much of Christian piety is learned only through doing. And that's exactly what art is. The purpose of art is to incarnate values, and we experience those values only as we participate in the action. As that great theologian Mark Twain once quipped, a man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way. This is the power of aesthetics. By doing, we are formed, and we learn. And so this extends beyond just the shape of the liturgy itself to also other aesthetic forms employed in corporate worship. Poetry, music, architecture, and rhetoric each embody inarticulable aspects of Christian virtue that through their use express those virtues. A story is once told of when Robert Schumann played a new composition, and somebody asked him what it means. He simply replied, it means this, and he played it again. But if you can't put it into words, you simply have to experience it to understand what it's saying. And that's what happens in liturgy and in the art forms used in liturgy. The liturgies and art forms of Christian worship embody and form certain aspects of Christian discipleship in a way that nothing else can't. This doesn't minimize the importance of putting things into words. It doesn't minimize the importance of the doctrine of hymns and preaching from the pulpit. But discipleship is more than that.  And these liturgies help to both explain the purpose of liturgy and how one should be formed in order to nurture virtue. In particular, the liturgies of scripture illustrate what biblical liturgies should look like. Biblical liturgies shape the people of God through reenactment of what God has done on their behalf. In this way, biblical liturgy really is not human work towards God. Rather, biblical liturgy is God's work upon his people. For instance, God prescribed for Israel a liturgical year that shaped their relationship with him by reenacting the covenant that he had established with them and the ways in which that he had redeemed them. This is really a stark difference between biblical liturgies and pagan liturgies. Pagan liturgies involved rituals designed to attract the God's attention and to manipulate the God to do something for the worshiper. But biblical liturgies rehearse what God has already done in order that the worshiper's affections and life might be formed and shaped. So a few examples in Israel's liturgical year, I think, will help to illustrate this. For example, the Sabbath itself was a regular reenactment of God's rest on the seventh day of creation. And as Jesus later indicated in Mark chapter 2, the Sabbath was made for man in order to shape him into a certain kind of person through that weekly routine. The most holy of days for Israel was the day of atonement. This feast day contained a very carefully prescribed liturgy that pictured spiritual realities through reenactment, the cleansings, the sacrifices, the sprinkling of blood, the scapegoat, all of these things formed the people through their participation into those who recognized the holiness of God, the horrors of sin, and the necessity of atonement. The Passover and Feast of Unleavened Bread also had a carefully prescribed liturgy that shaped the people by their participation in it. It was, of course, a reenactment of the historical event of the first Passover. And this is exactly why liturgies are so powerful. By reenacting these events, a person is formed as if he had been there himself, as if he had been in the first Passover. In Exodus chapter 12, God called the feast a memorial, which is more than simply a passive recollection of something. A memorial is a ritual reenactment by which a person enters into the past event and is therefore shaped by it. And of course, 1,500 years later, while celebrating the Passover memorial himself, Jesus Christ established a new ordinance complete with a carefully prescribed liturgy and commanded his disciples, do this in remembrance of me. This onemesis, this remembrance is an active reenactment of the death of Christ on behalf of his people in such a way that Christians are shaped by the act. So each of these examples serve to illustrate the point that biblical liturgies should reenact God's work for his people and thereby form the people into those whose lives are driven by a recognition of what he has done for them. So liturgies form disciples. They shape and cultivate disciples because they both embody and shape beliefs and values of Christianity. So it follows then that how people worship both reveals their beliefs and values and also forms their beliefs and values. Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi, right? The law of prayer is the law of belief. This is why it is essential that pastors and church leaders carefully consider how the liturgies of their churches and all churches have liturgies by the way, how the liturgies of their churches shape the inclinations and therefore the lives of their church members. These are things that occur every single week. They are habits that are shaping the inclinations and therefore the behavior of people and churches. And so the structure of a biblical liturgy follows the shape of God's work on behalf of his people in the gospel and is thus a reenactment of the gospel. So what's the gospel? Well, the logic of the gospel is of course simple. It's something we all hopefully could repeat fairly simply. God reveals himself to us. He calls us to worship him and individuals respond with adoration, confession of their sins as they recognize their unworthiness to be in his presence. God then responds by forgiving their sins through Christ and welcoming believers into his presence where they hear him speak, they commit to obey him, they bring their petitions to him and they enjoy opening free communion. That's the gospel in a nutshell. And this is the same logic that has informed historic Christian liturgy. Worshipers begin with God's call for them to worship him followed by adoration and praise. They then confess their sins to him and receive assurance of pardon in Christ. They thank him for their salvation. They hear his word preached and they respond with dedication. And the climax of all historic Christian worship has always been an expression of communion with God either through drawing near to him in prayer or more often in historic liturgies to celebrate the Lord's table. To eat at Christ's table is the most powerful expression that Christians are accepted by him through the gospel. And then all of the scripture readings, prayers and songs of this liturgy are carefully chosen for their appropriateness in their particular function within that gospel shaped structure. I think pastors and church leaders today would do well to value this kind of historical liturgical shape because of the power and inevitability of being shaped by liturgy, the value of what this liturgy embodies and the consequential potential for what this kind of gospel shaped liturgy can do by reenacting what they are in Christ week after week after week, Christian worshipers become what they are. So my argument in this presentation has been this. In order to make disciples, church leaders should employ biblical liturgies that reenact the gospel of Jesus Christ and aesthetically embody values consistent with holiness. This is the way disciples reform. The primary way that pastors can shape the inclinations and impact the behaviors of people in their churches is by influencing their habits, by forming their habits. And one of the primary means they have to do this, one of the primary ways that we can form and shape the habits of Christians is through our weekly corporate liturgies. Scripture shaped gospel liturgies will inform people's liturgies of life, will make them into worshipers the other six days of the week, will make them into those who recognize what they are in the gospel, which will then in turn form them into mature disciples of Jesus Christ. All right, a lot there. Any questions, thoughts, comments that you have from that presentation? Yes ma'am? So since we currently live in the culture where Sunday morning is so detached from the rest of the week, do you have any suggestions of how to form the liturgy in such a way that they do carry it out for the rest of the week? Yeah, well, I think at very least what we are doing on Sunday is forming the people. So if however it is we're shaping them, if we're shaping them to live out the gospel on Sunday, then it is having an effect on them. Hopefully if the spirit's working and they're, you know, as I said, it is a synergistic process. So the Holy Spirit's not just gonna zap them, they have to work. But there are other things sometimes our corporate worship shapes them into that perhaps are not so good. And at times if we can shape them to be entertainment-like. We can shape them to be mere consumers. So I think the first thing to answer that question is we are shaping them. Through how we organize and conduct our corporate worship, we are shaping them as I said at the week. However, I think maybe what more what you're asking is is there a way that we can help them to more intentionally do that the other six days of the week? And I think there are several things we can do. Hopefully we can teach and instruct them what we're doing on Sunday and encourage them to do this individually also the other six days of the week and their private devotion with God and their family worship, hopefully. If they're also re-enacting the gospel individually as families the other six days of the week, that would help. So we can provide tools, there's plenty of tools for that to happen. Prayer books and other devotional aids that can help people on a daily basis. Yes. Wonderful thesis. With this thesis, can you speak on the importance of using the ordinary means of grace versus the well-intentioned inventions of man in the worship service? So I think the reason this is important and the reason this works is because this is what God has prescribed. He says in Hebrews chapter 10, don't forsake the assembling of yourselves together. Why? Because that's where discipleship primarily occurs. We tend to think of discipleship on our very individualistic day as something that we do on our own. But that's not how Christians have historically thought of it and it's not how the New Testament displays it. It is a corporate thing. And so it is by doing those things that God has commanded in corporate worship, reading the word, singing the word, prayer, the ordinances given in a gospel reenactment of these things. It is through doing what God has prescribed that we are shaped informed because the Holy Spirit is gonna use what He prescribed to shape informed disciples. If we start to add to that, now we're trusting in our own ingenuity and creativity and I think we're going beyond what God has said. So we may be good intentioned. We may think, hey, adding this new novel element to our corporate worship service is really gonna be relevant and really gonna help them. But I would suggest, and this is again sort of a historic position, especially Baptist by the way, that we should do what God has told us to do. God is gonna use what God is going to use to shape His people, what He has commanded them. And when we go beyond what He's commanded, we're not trusting in His wisdom really and we're trusting in our own ingenuity and creativity and we're sort of thinking of ourselves more highly than perhaps we should. That's what I was thinking about. Yes? So that answer went right there. Would that be a response to, would that deal also would like the idea of Sunday school or life groups or anything like that? Like is there still value in smaller groups meeting together in the study of the word? Yes, but even in those things I would say we're still doing what God has commanded hopefully, right? We're still opening the word of God, explaining the word of God, praying. So we're still doing those things, scripture reading, scripture explanation and prayer, right? God has commanded those things. So even outside of corporate worship, when we gather for small groups or Sunday school or some sort of discipleship training, that's what's happening, right? So yeah, I'm not saying you can't have any other meetings, of course. What I'm saying is what we do in those meetings if we're gonna call it discipleship needs to include and I would say be limited to those means of grace that God has commanded, reading the word, explaining the word, prayer, these sorts of things. Not adding sort of creative, ingenious kinds of other things. So if we're doing what we're supposed to be doing, what is prescribed in our normal worship services, would these other groups be necessary? Well, that's a great point, are they necessary?  He didn't say how many times, it just says don't forsake the assembly. I actually think there's something to Dr. Patterson's interpretation of that. That means we need to get together a lot, especially as the day approaches, right? So he has said if he were a pastor today he would have church every day. There might be something to that. And it's for this reason, right? We are being shaped by the worldly liturgies every day. And so we need to counteract that. So maybe actually getting together more than just once a week is an answer to that. So I don't think we can say definitively about the number of times we should meet. We just need to not forsake that assembly and once a week at minimum. But you're right, if we're doing what we're supposed to do in that Sunday morning event, then maybe we wouldn't meet as much. But I'm never gonna say let's just meet once a week. I mean, especially as the day goes here. So then, Ceci's, what to include in those meetings when you're meeting outside of the gathering. Can you speak to some of the things, one specifically that I'm thinking about that you shouldn't do when you meet in my groups, because if we have phone groups, there's one specific thing that we don't do for a specific reason. I was wondering if you could speak to that.  Yeah, I have a Lord's Supper. Yeah. Thanks for that leading question. Yeah, I mean, there's some debate on this. I view the ordinance, the Lord's Supper and Baptism as ordinances of the local church that should be done in the context of the corporate gathering. So if you're meeting as a separate smaller group, right, I wouldn't personally advocate. Yes, there was an answer in search for questions. This may not be, this might be just a rhetorical question, so it should be. That's okay. But you know, I just, since reading that, Smith, again, and thinking through this and everything, in the world and in the church, the power of habit is, is, is known. I mean, because we have 12 step programs. We have all these programs that emphasize the, even in the church, even like with anger, is dealing with anger or counseling or divorce care and all this stuff, they have steps and each step has a significant role and then they all work together and everything. So I just don't understand why that hasn't translated, especially in some of the Baptists who have this strong focus on inerrancy of the word, why, why doesn't that habit and the energy? I think we instinctively do it, but maybe we have an intentional, and so, right, so maybe we need to get more attention and intentional, intentional attention to it. But like I said, every church has liturgy. Every church, and again, I hope you recognize by liturgy, I don't mean smells and bells and robes and incense, I'm using it in its most basic sense to refer to the things that we do every week over and over and over again for services. So every church has liturgy. The problem is that if we don't intentionally form our liturgies, they're gonna be formed by something and likely they're gonna be formed by external outside influences. So I think you're exactly right, we instinctively recognize the power of habit and this reminds me, let me recommend a couple of books to you on this subject. Lindsay mentioned one of them. James K.A. Smith has written several books on this topic, Desiring the Kingdom, Imagining the Kingdom, and more recently, You Are What You Love, all well worth reading, You Are What You Love is more of a lay version, very, very good. Brian Chappell's Christ-centered worship argues this similarly. Mike Cosper's Rhythms of Grace is a real popular level thing that argues this and that Robbie Castleman's story-shaped worship, which I saw, there's one copy over in the shelf, you can grip on and grab it if I saw over there, is also outlines this. So there seems to me to be a renewed interest in this issue and a recognition that what we do on Sunday morning in the shape of our liturgy will shape us whether we like it or not, and so we need to give intentionality to what we're doing and how it's shaping the people that use it. Yes? So if you're going about, I guess, restructuring or reforming the liturgy that you use in your church, obviously if you want to teach, it's stuff that you would introduce slowly, but also teaching the congregation, so it would be wise to explain, you know, this is why I do this. But if it's the same things that are done week to week in worship, do you think it is good to still explain why confession is an aspect in the same way that you introduced the Lord's Supper through Christ's words and things like that? Absolutely, yeah. Who would do that weekly? So I advocate following the biblical example, historic example of shaping our services by the gospel, and that's the logic. You can do that just in the choices and the order of the scripture texts and hymns. In other words, you can do that without drawing a whole lot of attention to it. And I would suggest that's a good first step. How do you choose the songs if you plan worship? How do you choose the scripture reading? Some people it's based on mood or key or, you know, maybe it's topical. Why not instead start with scripture readings and songs that are calls to worship, that are expressions of praise, then lead to scripture readings and songs that are an acknowledgement of our sin and pardon in Christ, right? Then we've got the sermon and we have scripture readings and songs that help us to dedicate ourselves to him. And then we conclude with prayer and the Lord's Supper. You can do that in a very simple way, just with the content. But then I think what you're getting at is it's helpful if you do that and if you're teaching the people to help them intentionally know why we're doing what we're doing. And they're both in separate teaching times. So in my church, for example, in our new members class, we take two weeks and we walk through this so that the new members joining our church know why we structure our services the way that we do. And so they're intentional about what's going on. And then regularly reminding your people can be important too. And then, yes, in short statements you make to introduce each section, you can help to continually remind the people we are here in God's presence at his invitation and now let us confess our sin before God because we recognize we're not here on our own merit. And we are here because of the sacrifice of Christ. We are here because Christ's atonement makes this possible. Just short statements like that can continually remind the people of the gospel. And the beauty of this is that regardless of the topic of the sermon, the gospel is proclaimed in every service. So that Christians are formed and unbelievers are exposed to the gospel even if the sermon doesn't happen to be evangelistic. The service itself is evangelistic and powerfully transformative for Christians. Yes, sir. Okay, let me frame my question. Okay. New Testament rose in a Roman empire that was definitely pagan. The United States, 24th century, we see a significant shift in our morality. Can a liturgy be disciplinary to congregate to a congregation? What do you mean by disciplinary? Because as you said, the secular liturgy that affects our lives, is it possible for the liturgy to reform the morality of the congregation? I believe it can at very least if we are providing for our people an opportunity to confess their sins before the Lord. Now we should be confessing our sins every day. But how many people actually do that? If we're giving them this opportunity to sit for a moment and think, let me think about my week. How have I been shaped by the world in such a way that I've been displeasing the Lord? Here's an opportunity for me to acknowledge that to him and then rejoice in the gospel because I'm not condemned because of this. That in itself, I think, can be disciplinary and help to reform a person who has the other six days of the week that's shaped by sinful influences. And then again, I think the way that we are, the way that we become more like Christ is through the gospel. The gospel is not only for salvation, it's also for sanctification. So if our service is every week reminding us of who we are in the gospel, we are acting this out in the service, that is going to shape us because the gospel is the power of God's salvation. And quote, quote, as a Titus, the same grace that saves us, teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lessons to live so worldly and racially in this present world. So this is why I think it's so powerful when our services are shaped by the gospel, then participation in those services will make us live according to the gospel and counteract all of those sinful behaviors that have influenced us through the week. Yes, ma'am? Hi, you know, I spent my whole career in the army. And in the army, they give you an M-16 and you have to learn how to live with that. You have to carry it with you. You have to eat with it, sleep with it. You have to know everything about it. And you know, I was a nurse. I kept saying, I'm not in the real army. I don't need this, you know. I'm not gonna go about shooting people, but I still needed to go to battle with that. When I went to Iraq, I was glad that I had that training. Well, to me, I think it should be the same way on Sunday mornings and everything we do as a church, we need to know everything possible about the word of God. We need to be able to break it down. We need to be able to eat with it, sleep with it, you know, everything with it. So that, and believe me, we go to battle every day that we enter into the world and do anything. But so that we can be prepared when we are, when you know, you run into situations which you always do where maybe you could, you know, share the gospel. And one other thing is, what the word, what that repetition does is when you're under stress, when the bullets are flying and you're not, you know, you can do it without even, you know, thinking about it. And I think that's what gathered together as believers should be about. So that we're prepared for battle. Right, that's a great analogy and does not the New Testament call us soldiers in exile. Right, right. Exactly right. When the bullets start flying, we're not gonna have time to think, okay, what do I believe, and how should it affect my actions? We have to have that training before the bullets start flying so that we instinctively do what is right. We'd be ready with an answer. That's exactly right.  So then coming out after 20 years out of that environment, for me to be around Christians, it was like, man, I don't even know how to talk to these people and not say something that's outrageous, which I said a lot about outrageous things, but it's the whole patterning, your patterning thing. The habits that they're forming. Yeah, the habits and it helps me, well, I'll just give one quick example. My sister was arguing with me about the fact that I had become a believer and instead of graciously trying to show her the way, I said, well, I'll tell you what, you just need to be born again, then you wouldn't argue with it. Yeah, and she was offended by that. That's a great example, great analogy, yeah, thank you. I think we're probably in our time. Thank you very much, Dr. Angel.