Thank you so much. How's everybody doing? Everybody's good Give ABS a round of applause for this amazing amazing conference So it's pretty tough coming after the previous panel. I think my co-panelists would agree so what we Realized is that it's so beautiful that we had this understanding of the theoretical Frameworks that we deal with and we're gonna try to ground it for you a little bit Grappling with how scholars Grapple with these concepts as Baha'is and try to put them into our work as you know Academics is not something that's homogeneous. So scholarship in academics can run the gamut right with methodologies Ontologies, it's all really different. We tend to come from more applied social science fields Economics sociology urban planning public health So there's different perspectives and different ways to apply the conceptual framework So I wanted to put that out at the outset. The other thing I wanted to tell you is this is not Los Angeles This is Orange County. We like to call it the orange curtain There are 34 cities in Orange County. Did you know that? No, they tend to be on the conservative end of the political spectrum So often referred to as the Red County in a blue state Orange County where you're in now in Garden Grove is Northern Orange County. I'm an urban planner. I can't help myself Northern Orange County in the city of Garden Grove actually is home to the ethnic enclave called Little Saigon We in Southern California are blessed with having the largest Cambodian Vietnamese immigrant population outside of Southeast Asia So if you venture out a little bit at dinnertime, for example, you might find some really awesome food Really good food and cheap massages. That's also something good to know Orange County is also the home of the indigenous communities of the ahashaman Tongva and Chumash nations and as Respect for my ahashaman Chumash and Tongva people of this region I want to thank the ancestors for allowing us to be here today it Is really a delight to be here with you this morning as we grapple with these concepts of self-interest and altruism as Our lovely announcer made I already told you my name is Mojgan Sammy. Why am I here? Why are my panelists here? I think the prerequisite was that all of our last names begin with an S So that all of you can go into the ABS booklet and read our bios really easily All in all in the same place I am working at the intersection of urban planning public health and sustainability at the University of California Irvine UCI which I also like to call the University of confused intellectuals My esteemed colleagues on the panel here joining me are dr. Ryan Siegel who is with second muse and an economist That's transitioning to the University of Washington Dr. Sahar Satar Zadeh a scholar of international educational policy in the Washington DC metropolitan area and Mr. Navid Sabet an economist as well who is working as a researcher with UNESCO in Germany again The details are found in the S section of the ABS booklet The theme statement for this year's ABS conference states that our common purpose is to develop the capacity to examine the ideas concepts and theories Operating within the scholarly and professional disciplines and to contribute to the development of a growing body of knowledge associated with Baha'i thought the specific purpose of our panel the way that we conceptualized it was to critically reflect on the taken for granted assumptions in our disciplines and to that that tend to perpetuate a Narrow understanding of individual of human and institutional reality So one of those elements of the conceptual framework of human nature How do we grapple with these assumptions that are rarely challenged in our work? How do we develop individual and collective capacity to challenge these narrow definitions? How can we be part of a vision which calls for a profound change at the level of Individual and structures of society In other words, how can we expand our ontological or assumptions about reality of? Human and organizational nature. How does the revelation of Baha'u'llah help us? critically reflect on the multifaceted nature of reality human nature This discussion will not be purely theoretical You'll see that we're going to be grappling with how we do this as social scientists from more of the applied traditions But hopefully we can get an Understanding that disciplines do this a little differently and we can apply our conceptual framework in different ways This has to do with what I call the three musketeers of research When I teach research at UC Irvine, I actually call my research methods class independent investigation of truth And the Baha'is in the audience are always like the chickens in a room where the heads go up really fast If they they hear a noise that they're like, oh, what's that mean and the reason why I use that framework It's because the concept of the seeker is really important in research The seeker and the qualities that we have the values that we bring into our work are important our Conceptual framework of how we look at human nature ontology is really connected to our understanding of what knowledge is and the processes of knowledge generation production reflection application I Want to give you a little bit of a concrete example from one of my fields of land use planning planners assume At the outright that our relationship with the earth is Grounded in self-interest it is assumed that conflict and land disputes are inevitable wars over land Water resources, that's inevitable So a lot of the training that we give our urban planners a lot of that training is how to mitigate those conflicts How to go about rezoning if your zoning as a developer is not what you want As planners we never challenge the fundamental assumption that land use has been limited to individual self-interest and conflict and adversarial paradigms so much urban planning training goes to Reinforce and perpetuate this model the question that Critical urban planners ask is where did we learn that? Who taught us that land use has to be Conflictual and adversarial who taught us that human land relationships is one of ownership control When we challenge this basic concept it creates such innovation for example I work with a bunch of engineers and since there are Persians here. I know there are engineers here When you challenge the concept of power and engineering it transforms the way we design Yes What I mean by that is Usually engineers are taught to have control over the environment power over the environment Our structures will have power over the environment group of Dutch planners Said huh, what if we switched that up and said we have to have power with the environment? They fundamentally changed the way they design buildings Who's heard of biomimicry? Excellent more of you should hear about this, especially the engineers Biomimicry is a study of buildings Planning engineering design that says a building doesn't have to protect us from nature. It can actually benefit environment So there are engineers and architects who are building buildings to mimic a tree Not just climate neutral, but climate beneficial Not just decreasing greenhouse gases, but actually mitigating them These innovations happened because of a simple switch of conceptual thinking that power is that engineering Planning isn't about power over but power with part of the traditional understanding of planning that hasn't been challenged is For is for good reasons, okay They've gotten to the end of their scope of being able to divide toxic uses from for example housing uses And that's a good thing But the questions now that urban planners in the critical discourses are asking is why does anything have to be toxic at all? Don't we have enough education and knowledge to ensure that we do not Contaminate our world So how can we reimagine these assumptions in a broader perspective just that little turn can help us innovate in such different ways? How will this reimagining impact? The structures of society not just the physical structures, but public policy the planning culture for example How will this impact governance which I'm defining as the relationships in society Relationships between individuals between individuals communities between institutions Between the United Nations who as we heard just past the sustainable development goals 17 of them How do we incorporate more of the voices of the planet in these discourses? Allowing our fundamental assumptions to emerge from the revelation of Bahá'u'lláh Rather than from our respective disciplines may be a place to start What do you think? Maybe For example, we are defining self-interest through the revelation We are defining it as busying ourselves with our own concerns This definition from gleaning's is aligned with dominant discourses for example in economics homo economicus Individualism busying ourselves with our own concerns. Whereas altruism We're defining through the revelation as a world embracing vision Rather than one confined to our own self Not a false dichotomy between individuals and the world a connected Concept of altruism. In fact the work that I do it's helped me to be able to talk about The well-being of the planet and the people a world embracing vision is one that does not Distinguish human health from planetary health for example However, the definition in scholarship in social science is not there So when we say moving from self-interest to altruism We're not saying self-interest to altruism in scholarship, but from the revelation of Bahá'u'lláh Sahar was kind enough to share an article with me from de Souza who defines altruism as the practice of Unselfish concern for the well-being of others sounds good so far not so much wait wait for it Practice of unselfish concern for the well-being of others coupled with an associated measure of personal loss Why is Our fields why are our fields defining altruism with this cost-benefit? zero-sum dichotomy So when I was grappling with this I thought wow, that's that's on the way to a world embracing vision But we have so far to go to get there The revelation of Bahá'u'lláh challenges this conceptualization of altruism for us In one that is not embedded in a relationship of us and them. It's not adversarial a World embracing vision means just that and not just embracing the person sitting next to you and your family But the other six point nine nine nine billion people on the planet world embracing vision So at the outset as Bahá'u'lláh scholars We need to remember to expand our conceptualizations of what we mean by altruism My own research at the nexus of urban planning public health and sustainability was greatly impacted by this reimagining of altruism That altruism as a latent capacity that is not limited to a cost-benefit ratio For example urban planners take it for granted that land is a limited resource that demands control and ownership as I mentioned and Very importantly in the United States. It includes the right to exclude others Land use is considered contested terrain at the outset. However, there are scholars that because I'm looking for it I find their scholars that challenge this one of them is dr. Libby Porter who is a urban planner in Australia She calls our current land use planning an outdated colonial construct And in fact her work shows that the culture of planning and the process of planning has not changed in over 200 years We're still teaching planners what we taught them in colonial times Her research with Aboriginae communities led to the conclusion that this perspective of planning is Maladaptive to the needs and exigencies of our time The perspective of indigenous communities that she's worked with towards land as our collective mother Provides us an opportunity to expand our relationship with the land as more than Self-centered interested profit maximizing individuals or countries who wish to exclude others and Gives us a sense of the importance of collective stewardship over the land and a Responsibility as our ahashaman nation who is local to Orange County states to heal the land and the water This alternative conceptualization is much more world embracing It helps me when I find these To articulate things differently in my in my discourses in my planning urban urban planning public health discourses biologist oceanographers Ecologists are all pointing to evidence that what happens Over here is going to impact you what happens in Japan in Africa is going to impact the Caribbean What happens in India and China are going to impact the world This frame of altruistic land human relationships has been increasing in discourses of planning public policy physical sciences natural sciences engineering Even medicine and sociology over the last decade Nowhere is this world embracing vision more relevant than in the current discourse of climate change Climate change has been called by the Lancet and the World Health Organization as the greatest threat to human health in this century The institutions of the world are increasingly using a resilience framework to address climate change While most of the institutional response to this is based on self-interest to help communities bounce back There is a transformational social movement that's saying no resilience actually needs to help us bounce forward Which means we have to put the oneness of humanity as a prerequisite to climate resilience It's not a Baha'i saying this these are transformational social movements of climate justice Very important emerging discourse in the field of urban planning ecology climate change Climate change is forcing us as scholars To be more to be ready to talk about the oneness of humanity in our work as planners as public health Professionals because what happens in the world? What happens to our entire atmosphere is going to impact all of us The pivot of altruistic world embracing vision then We can see is the oneness of humanity So how do we further this? Discourse, how do we as Baha'is contribute to this process? I want To turn to my esteemed panelists remember SS SS so look it up to grapple with these questions We've been engaged in kind of an iterative Virtual discussion over the last few months. So this is a very organic conversation. It's not like four distinct presentations We're all kind of it's all organic. Yes We because of time we're not going to be able to accept audience questions But we will all promise to stay here and you can approach us. How's that? Then we can feel like kings and queens up here. That would be great Oh, not self-interest. Sorry altruism. We're all one So I would like to start with dr. Siegel in Thinking through how the revelation Helps us to guide our inquiry into the core theoretical assumptions in economics of individuals in society Being self-interested. How does the revelation help guide us? First, thank you for this opportunity to share a few thoughts a Friend of mine had I was talking with a friend of mine. Oh, let me put my timer on here a Friend of mine had said, you know, it's it's interesting that in economics when we study it There's a proposition that's typically you study in your early undergraduate courses By the way, how many people here have taken an undergraduate or any economics course? Okay, great. Now, how many of you have an undergraduate degree in economics not not accounting but economics Okay, wow any graduate any graduates, okay, so I only see one So I can there's a couple. Okay, so Maybe I can say some things without offending people too much But No, but my friend was just telling me, you know, it's interesting that there's in general Simplified one of the early models that you you learn in economics is this notion that if everybody acts out of self-interest Then this sort of this pie is maximized For the whole and he just commented to me He said, you know, something's got to be up with this because all of the religions Actually, they kind of say the opposite. They say that The organizing principle of our lives should be one of looking after others first So I thought it was a really simple point, but it's very profound. It's a really think that okay, so something's up here I want to make another prefatory remark, which is that economics is a humongous field and I'm not gonna do justice to the to the field as a whole It's studied by people the topic itself is studied by people from different methodological persuasions And and even within the discipline of economics, there's a great deal of extensions of core Theory as well as whole other theories using systems dynamics agent-based modeling all these kinds of new new Methodologies are being applied to it. So what I want to share today is just a few ideas on Standard neoclassical economic theory as I expected most of the people in the audience would have experience with some economics But not have graduate courses. I was thinking okay. What can I share that people can relate to? So I'm gonna start using undergraduate sort of models But the way I'll do this is is in terms of how the revelation has guided my own inquiry is To maybe share some statements from the writings first that maybe speak to one or two concepts Then look a little bit at the theory and see what what insights does it give us? But then it we can go back to the writings and say maybe it suggests some other ideas that we're gonna have to grapple with and That actually many economists are grappling with today so the first the first is this aspect of Transformation so we talk about self-interest to altruism. So I just wanted to read one paragraph There are quotes from the writings sprinkled throughout so I'm trying to create kind of a necklace of pearls With the writings sort of put together. So if it's all right with you, I'd like to read this So the writings illumine our understanding of human nature in relation to self-interest While it is true that self-love is needed into the clay of man We know that for the sake of God he can abandon his own peace and profit and will freely consecrate his heart and soul to the common good Our endeavors should not be spent in promoting our personal interest We should be generous in our days of plenty Patient in the hour of loss Guard against idleness and sloth and cling unto that which profiteth mankind Rather than being busy in our own concerns We must focus our thoughts on what will rehabilitate the fortunes of mankind and sanctify the hearts and souls of men This is best accomplished through pure and holy deeds Deeds cleanse from the dust of self and hypocrisy We must be watchful unless goodly and righteous deeds be performed while actually being prompted by self-interest Only through the knowledge of God the love of God and sincere attention and a great deal of effort Do such deeds become perfect and complete? So when we look at these quotes as a whole it suggests that while some part of our nature may have a tendency for Selfishness we can also act for the good of humanity or the community so the capacity is latent But we also know That this latent quality can become manifested through effort that we make at the level of thought intention and Action and that this can actually be nurtured through education and effort In other words humanity isn't in it is in a state of development. It's actually changing over time Abdu'l-Bahá states among the results of the manifestation of spiritual forces Will be that the human world will adapt itself to a new social form The justice of God will become manifest throughout human affairs and human equality Will be universally established So again reiterating this point that we're becoming something new we're in the process of becoming this might seem like a really simple Idea, but it's actually quite profound and has implications for the way that we study social reality So at a high this is a first comment is at a high level in standard neoclassical economic models The approach is typically to describe those universal laws and characteristics that describe the operation and functioning of Markets and sometimes entire economies So they begin usually by certain premises like has been mentioned I think we're very familiar of some form of self-interest at the very leaf self at the very least self-centeredness Which is a different but related concept and then kind of build from there Now these models are they're very helpful in order to Deductively see what are the implication of these premises? That's in fact the power of these standard economic models is they really help us understand the consequences of these Assumptions because we can play with them mathematically and see see what happens But at a very high level When we think about this concept that humanity is in a continual state of development into a new social form It raises two questions for me the first is How do we study social reality in a way that contributes towards a new social form and Do we know what that new social form should be? So the first question is about the approach but the second question is about the ideal form that we have in our mind and This is this is This is another subtle concept. I don't have a word for it So if somebody knows a better thing come to me afterwards, but the word I've been using is archetype That there's some archetype or the ideal Social form that we want to be and so to make this a little bit more concrete in neoclassical model for example We can think about the model of the economy the way that the economy functions through these interactions of self-interested individuals and firms and Competitive forces giving rise to some equilibrium But is that is that the archetype that we have in our mind? So it I think I think what it does is it I don't think it means that the model is just totally wrong And we throw it out. No, there's some benefit to it, but we just have to I Just have to be conscious Mindful of what are the archetypes that I'm operating within and how do I conceive of the ideal social form? The second concept I wanted to talk about is the way that we acquire wealth And I'd like to read a statement about it, but I think I might go a little over time. Do you think? Okay, so again a statement from the writings So first it gives us Insight into why we engage in a profession. Why do we work? Why do we generate wealth? The reason we engage in crafts and professions is to give forth goodly and wondrous fruits That we and others may profit there from The basest of men are they that yield no fruit on earth while the best of men are they that earn a livelihood by their calling and Spend upon themselves and upon their kindred for the love of God Acquiring talents and engaging them in some kind of profession is both for its own sake and for the sake of Earning the means of livelihood, but then there's a lot of insight in the writings about how we engage in our profession So it enables us to increase our physical well-being and provide the body ease and comfort But we are warned that less than thinking too earnestly of the things of the body You forget the things of the soul for material advantages do not elevate the spirit of man Perfection in worldly things is a joy to the body of a man, but in no wise does it glorify his soul Abdu'l-Bahá says that while engaging in an occupation is important He warns that the energies of the heart must not be attached to these things The soul must not be completely occupied with them though the mind is busy The heart must be attracted towards the kingdom of God in order that the virtues of humanity May be attained from every direction and source and at the same time We know that work has been exalted to the rank of worship and is accounted in the sight of God as a good lead deed But Abdu'l-Bahá explains how All these effort if put forth by man from the fullness of his heart Prompted by the highest motives and the will to do service to humanity is worship So there's some conditions on on when it when it actually is considered this So briefly, I mean we can look at standard labor theory the way that we think about the supply of Labor so the standard economic model is that people are assumed to maximize a Problem in which they want to They want to maximize their benefit from generating money from their work in order to expend it in their leisure time So there's the tension in this model between these two things between generating wealth Expending it during your leisure time And then labor labor supply, which is this curve you're probably familiar with supply and demand Supply is is the fruit of that problem Supply represents the minimum acceptable pay that you're willing to accept per hour of labor So we have to be careful when we critique this at the level of the individual because an economist would say This is not meant to describe the fullness of a person's decision, and it's not it's meant to capture the critical Details in order to aggregate up and say something about the functioning of markets in general So there are some useful insights It helps us understand that there is there is a relationship between earning the means of livelihood and expending it. That's true And the theory actually has the virtue of being very easily Extended to for the person to derive joy or benefit from the work itself, which is another aspect discussed in the writings But there are some limitations For example, if to the extent that the theory promotes a way of thinking about work as simply a means to consume This can be demoralizing. This is a point that's raised in the document prosperity of humankind Also, the writings raise other questions about the nature of work. For example If work should be We should strive to be the source of comfort to souls and That for our work to be raised to the station of worship. It must be prompted by the highest motives and the will to do service to humanity How would we describe the pursuit of wealth and profession in our individual lives with these ideas in mind? Another question at the societal level is how does a society need to be structured in order to facilitate that pattern of employment? Where it's motivated by these these ideals Another question that the model doesn't speak to very much is the relationship between the employer and employee Actually, what it does say about it is that it's one of you know Price basically being the mediating factor But what are the relationships need to be between employing organizations and people to promote promote an environment Which cultivates the highest motives? So I realize I'm asking a lot of questions But this is maybe a flavor of how the revelation has been guiding my my own inquiry into this Do you all know that the Dalai Lama was here for three days? And so while the Dalai Lama was here He made a challenge to all the institutions of education and higher education and it said Can we cultivate other virtues in our institutions? So one thing that Ryan I think that you touched on that's always been a critical question among social scientists and economics Is why do we take the values of the market and the individuals a relationship with the market and translate that to all? Relationships what does it mean if everything becomes a cost-benefit ratio?  So what what do we give up by? Only narrowly focusing on the market values as all Interactions of relationships those values put on there. So I think that What we're hearing more and more is how do we cultivate those other virtues of higher motivations? So moving a little bit away from economics I would like to go to Sahar and ask how does the revelation guide our inquiry into core theoretical Assumptions that underrepresented groups only act out of self-interest That only you know you're we have these groups pitted against one another that want to vie for control over decisions and resources How do we how do we help have the revelation help guide us there? Just to can you hear me? Sometimes I'm so loud. I can't tell if the mic is on or not you can hear me I wanted to clarify this term Underrepresented groups. What does that mean and we were going back and forth virtually as more Mojgan was talking about about What label do we want to use right? So underrepresented groups is a blinketed term of a very heterogeneous group of people's and communities Who have been marginalized oppressed? Systematically unmet methodotically and It could be based on racial ethnic You know minority affiliation religious linguistic indigeneity Gender if you're a woman girl man Ability if you have a disability Class and there's also intersections right of underrepresented groups. You can be a poor black woman And so there's these intersections that we have what is underrepresented groups and the concept of underrepresented groups is Also, it's a social reality of identity. It's not a spiritual reality We understand that from the context of the writings the oneness of humanity The soul is our true spiritual reality, but we got to keep it real So I'm going to keep it real spiritually real and socially real as Ryan mentioned we have to apply this these spiritual tools to look at the social reality in which we live And so we cannot deny the fact that there is inequity There is injustice and there is a large population that is being marginalized because of that and So wherever you are underrepresented groups can be called Disadvantaged in international human rights. It's vulnerable persons in groups marginalized underserved and Then you go to barbaric Uncivilized which the Guardian refers to as misguided terms It's interesting because because of this Group that we have created underserved or underrepresented whatever we want to call this marginalized oppressed population That has unequal social economic reach Discrimination prejudices ensue and I wanted to share a statement from the Guardian in Advent of Divine Justice To discriminate against any race on the ground of its being socially backward Politically immature and numerically in a minority is a flagrant violation of the spirit that animates the faith of Bahá'u'lláh The consciousness of any division or cleavage in its ranks is alien to its very purpose principles and ideals It's interesting because we talk about fragmentation And we think that oh because we have different races classes. We have different hierarchies That's reality because that's what we see What's interesting is it's not only in the writings that this is something that is not considered a reality I'm not sure if many people are familiar with David Bohm. He's a theoretical physicist and there's the interesting Thing that really caught my attention. I was like, hmm. I need to I need to check him out more especially, you know being in sociology, but There's this is what he writes and I wanted to share with you He says some might say Fragmentation of cities religions political systems Conflict in the form of wars general violence Fratricide etc other reality Wholeness is only an ideal toward which we should perhaps strive He's saying that's what people are thinking or believing But this is not what is being said here Rather, what should be said is that wholeness is what is real and that Fragmentation is the response of this whole to man's action guided by illusory perception Which is shaped by fragmentary thought David Bohm was not of a high But he gets it so the social reality is that we have this fragmentation and the social conditions That exist perpetuate our own actions of self-interest, right? So when we look at this con this question of how does the revelation guide The role of underrepresented groups and oh, you know, they only they the other Only want to help themselves and their communities. They don't care about the rest of us So why should we try to help them, right? That's something that's very common in the field So you have these dichotomies that that emerge you have the western versus the non-western You have you know first world and second world versus third world and fourth world, etc And it's interesting because it becomes a cycle in which a Perpetual cycle of self-interest there's the dominant group which is often attributed in critical scholarship as white from the northern has hemisphere predominantly male and very wealthy and so You look at this dichotomy of that then you go to the underrepresented groups and you look at this cycle that's being perpetuated the Dominate the dominant group says I Can serve myself because I am superior To the other and therefore I'm going to keep doing what I need to do in reaction Which is just counterintuitive, but it's a counter nonetheless the underserved response becomes My oppression My victimization is my entitlement to counter and to to and basically address My my voice and my right to serve myself and my people We're perpetuating this This self-interest just through oppression through inequity through injustice It's interesting in in the guidance There's this talk of Fraternity of brotherhood and it also addresses this issue of altruism Abdul Baha in foundations of world unity he talks about four different kinds of brotherhood of you know fraternity There's family association, you know a relationship with family members The second is patriotism. We come from the same land. Therefore, we are united in that in that front The third is racial unity Racial unity in the sense that we all have the same racial origin the same origin. So therefore we are one and the fourth I wanted to share with you in particular directly from From the quote Abdul Baha says there is a fourth kind of brotherhood The attitude of man toward humanity itself the altruistic love of humankind and recognition of the fundamental human bond Although this is unlimited It is nevertheless susceptible to change and destruction So wait a minute the altruistic love of humankind and recognition of The fundamental human bond it's unlimited, but it's still susceptible to change Even from this universal fraternal bond the looked for result does not appear What is the look for result? Loving kindness among all human creatures and a firm indestructible brotherhood Which includes all the divine possibilities and significances in humanity? Therefore it is evident that fraternity love and kindness based upon family native land race or an attitude attitude of altruism are neither sufficient nor permanent Since all of them are limited Restricted and liable to change and disruption For in the family there is discord and alienation Among sons of the same fatherland Strife and interneesine warfare are witnessed Between those of a given race Hostility and hatred are frequent and even among the altruists Varying aspects of opinion and lack of unselfish devotion give little promise of permanent and indestructible unity among mankind So Abdul Baha is saying That we need a spiritual brotherhood that these four forms of fraternity brotherhood sisterhood human Human kind of hood if we if we can call it that He further says spiritual brotherhood which is incandled and established through the breasts of the Holy Spirit Unites nations and removes the cause of warfare and strife. It transforms mankind into the one great family We must forsake all imitations and promote the reality of the divine teachings One thing the Guardian says in Advent is of divine justice when we talked about to discriminate against any race is a flagrant violation He says there's he says if any discrimination is at all to be tolerated It should be discrimination not against but rather in favor of the minority be it racial or otherwise Unlike nations and peoples of the earth be they of the east or of the west Democratic or authoritarian Communists or capitalist whether belonging to the old world or the new who can either ignore Trample upon or extirpate the racial religious or political minorities within the sphere of their jurisdiction Every organized community Enlisted under the banner of Bahá'u'lláh Should feel it is to be its first Inescapable inescapable You can't escape it obligation to nurture Encourage and safeguard every minority belonging to any faith race class or nation within it The revelation does not talk about Underrepresented populations or even dominate the dominant group Focusing on this paradigm of self-interest Even though it is perpetuated in academe and social movements and Social services education health care governance, etc What it does talk about is Altruism in the sense of what we can do for us. There is no us in them. There's only us Racial affairs in this country Are highly polarized very sensitive Not only because social media is reviewing a lot of stuff but The way that racism in itself the fact that it's permeated the social fabric is actually evolving as The Guardian has predicted So I wanted to end with this quote. I don't want to go too much over, but I'm trying to be like Ryan I'm not gonna go too much, but I can't help but share this example of altruism that I found From the Guardian in particular Advent of divine justice regarding the role of the white and the role of the black The black and white behind the believers, but even just community at large And I want to end with this because this is what I think an example of true altruism is That defies any notion of self-interest regardless of whatever group or purse population you come from Let the white Make the supreme effort in their resolve to contribute their share to the solution of this problem To abandon once and for all they're usually inherent and at times subconscious sense of superiority To correct their tendency towards revealing a patronizing attitude towards the members of the other race To persuade them through their intimate Spontaneous and informal association With them of the genuineness of their friendship and the sincerity of their intentions and To master their impatience of any lack of responsiveness on the part of the people Who have received for so long a period such grievous and slow healing wounds This right now is talking to the Dominant group not the underrepresented right Now next Let the Negroes Through a corresponding effort on their part Show by every means in their power and warmth of their response their readiness to forget the past and Their ability to wipe out every trace of suspicion That may still linger in their hearts and minds Let neither think that the solution of so vast a problem is a matter that Exclusively concerns the other altruism is not a fragmented dichotomous process and I think that's something that we're trying to reiterate here and this quote is also Very relevant to native peoples as well and the situation the genocide of indigenous peoples in this country this concept of trust of research It's there's a lot of distrust in real quick. I wanted to share I went to this conference and a very well respected scholar professor who I worked with for many years is very well known in gender and international development and They won this fellowship to do research in Liberia specifically to question and trying to transform this whole notion of why there aren't enough women educators in Liberia and When I found out who was participating in the study, it was all women. It was teachers administrators, you know citizens in the community and At the end of the at the end of the presentation. I said, what about the men? Why how are you involving men into the discourse and The response was They're already respond. They're already represented by default because they are the oppressor So their voice is already out there. So therefore we don't need to include them in the study a few months later. I Found out that men were eventually included in the study But to think that just because there's dichotomies of oppressor and oppressor oppressed I Think it's cladding our judgment of what true altruism is in terms of serving The one is the justice and equity that we need I knew you were waiting to do that for all of us, right just checking Some thing that Sahar mentioned that it got me thinking how much work we have to do to challenge our habits of thought You know as individuals as members as scholars as members of a profession these habits of thought can perpetuate versions of altruism that again are not as expansive and Mind-blowing as the revelations concepts of altruism are and How this changes the discourses of justice How does this change the way that we actually analyze social movements? There is a wonderful I just want to give you an applied Example here on there's an organization in Northern California called social transformation project and they have begun to look at social movements not just through resistance and protest but how Movements are creating new processes new Reimagining human nature community interactions structures Institutions that will lead to a more peaceful just and equitable world It's fascinating how the revelation is seeping into even studies of social movements Which are often just looking at resistance and disruption as we heard in the last panel Thinking about these social movement structures policy law those things are included in these concepts How do we move from self-interest to altruism? Thinking through public policy and law that helps me transition to mr. Navid sabit Asking the question how does the revelation help guide our inquiry into? institutional policy practices that perpetuate that seem to perpetuate this endless cycle of winners and Losers sir pull your microphone closer We were told that So thank you for the question I thought before specifically answering how the revelation might guide our inquiry into these institutional policy practices that seem to Perpetuate this endless cycle of winners and losers that might be helpful to review What some of these practices are and I think we can do this by looking at both theory and practice So if we look at practice, I think the issue is quite clear There's hardly any policy issue today Which doesn't suffer from some sort of deep ideological divide Between those who stand to gain or win from a policy and those who stand to lose from it And I think if you just quickly open a newspaper or watch any news channel You'll see the highly polarized debates that are taking place. I thought just to share a few of them just to make explicit When you say, you know these policy practices so divisive, what do we actually mean? So a few popular ones you just look at for example tax policy if you're a Republican or a member of a Conservative party your your vision of the future as you lower taxes You cut social spending so it's a liberate man to enhance human freedoms to participate freely in the economy If you're if you're a Democrat if you're part of some labor party somewhere you have the opposite view You think well, no, you know, we have to increase taxes increase the role of the state in Regulating the economy so as to provide social welfare and equality for everyone and there's this endless Debate if you just watch Prime Minister's questions in the UK You see it's actually divided in half and they and they bicker every Wednesday for 30 minutes Another closely related policy issue is what's happening in Europe right now One of the things that's that's tearing the social fabric of Europe apart is this deficit problem this debt problem So again depending on which side of the of the coin you are you're either in favor of austerity for the creditors Or you want no you want financial stimulus to kind of stimulate the economy through through more social spending And again, I was just looking at the newspaper last week the the New York Times and you see it's even in the vocabulary Of how this is spoken of It's a it's a professor in the University of Athens He's saying Alex Tsipras is showing that he is able to speak the language of reform and the language of social justice This is a formula that can turn him into a very important leader in Greece the winner and all of this will be Tsipras So you see even you know these things have very clearly defined winners and losers There are there are other examples, too If you look at trade for example these these trade rounds that happen in the world organized by the World Trade Organization These also a very clear winners and losers right now. What's happening this Doha development round? It started in 2001 it's stuck It's like 14 years later, and it's stuck on this very point the advanced countries Are going back on some of the commitments that they gave us part of the Uruguay round which ended in 1994 They promised the developing countries greater access to textiles and agricultural goods in return For the developing countries allowing these things called trips and trends Trade related investment measures trade related intellectual property rights So the advanced countries got what they wanted, but the developing ones didn't and so they started this new round in Doha, which is stuck exactly on this point There's this never-ending divide between these winners and these losers So there are other examples, but I think what's interesting to note is that the rationale behind many of these policies many these Institutional practices is grounded in theoretical insights Some of which or most of which are our economic notions of efficiency Some of these concepts not all but some of them also have as part and parcel of them winners and losers as part of their framework I think it's been mentioned several times this idea of a cost-benefit analysis This is something that has its roots in what's called Caldor Hicks efficiency Caldor Hicks efficiency and it's used in many policy circles today To help governments decide, you know, do we do X or do we do Y and its basic assertion is this that if There's a policy if it increases the net size of the economic pie It should be done and then if we want if we want we can use the Additional economic gains to compensate the losers that that's kind of how it works And it's very unapologetic in its explanation of winners and losers The arguments a bit more technical than that But but that's basically what it boils down to and if you look at many many things like this storm report in 2006 on climate change It was nothing more than a very sophisticated cost-benefit analysis and it continues today More generally, I think what happens with theory is that academics You're going beyond just notions of efficiency that help decide specific policies. I think in general What happens is that academics they look at practice They they observe the world and they generalize it in order to develop their theories And what happens I think is that these theories then cement the notion that there are actually Winners and losers and we get this never-ending cycle of you know winners and losers being repeated And I think I just to just to share a couple of examples from mainstream theory that somehow confirms this view There's a pair of political scientists in America hacker and Pearson They've written a really wonderful book called winner take all politics and it describes the American landscape and how it's this zero-sum game And this is what they say they say the art for policymakers is not to respond to the median voter It is to minimize the trade-offs when the desires of powerful groups and the desires of voters collide so you can see that that theory is beginning to internalize this idea that you know policy practices always have Winners and losers and the role of our institutions is just to lessen the social impact of that clash when it inevitably takes place Just to give one other one other example a very prominent example that somehow Internalizes this idea that there are winners and losers in policy It's an influential paper by political scientists and economists Darren achamoglu and James Robinson It's called paths to economic and social development written in 2006 And they provide a really nice theoretical framework to to provide an explanation of how democracy emerges and Their framework it's very simple. The theory is very nice It's very intuitive and easy to follow and I just thought to share very briefly some of its elements with you So they start by saying look economic institutions matter in determining the distribution of resources in a society That's the first element. They say that economic institutions in turn are determined by political Institutions whoever has control of political institutions can can establish economic institutions to his or her interest and the third element is conflict So they say implicit in the notion that political power determines economic institutions is the idea that there are conflicting interests over the distribution of resources and therefore indirectly over the set of economic institutions So there's other elements as well But basically what they say is look there's two groups in society elites and non elites They have this never-ending fight until the non elites gather enough power To pose a credible threat to the elites and the elites see this credible threat And they they give a democracy as a compromise and so society becomes democratic So so now the question and I think it was asked very beautifully last night, you know Given this landscape given that this is how many policy decisions are made, you know How do we how do we interact with that? How do we inquire into these fields of human endeavor that have principles so different to what the revelation contains and You know at first we could be led to believe that, you know, well, we should just dismiss it You know conflict and contention are not are not in line with the higher nature of man So whether or not it exists in the long run the one exists so we can just ignore it or or another way is just to yeah, just completely Not taken to consideration at all. They're not religious. We don't want to consider it You know the faith has all the answers But I'm not sure that that's that's the way the revelation will guide our inquiry into these fields of human endeavor And I think the examples have been given very beautifully by others I'll just maybe share a little bit of what's already been said But I think this framework is really what helps us and Julia was mentioning earlier it acts as a sort of lens through which you can see the world and As I was thinking about it I was thinking about a 3d movie because I've been sitting on planes a lot the last week and I've been watching a lot of movies And I was thinking about the 3d movie, you know, if you go there without the glasses You still see something and that's something isn't some fictional Image that you're making up in a room you go you see it and you describe something that resembles the movie The point is when you put the glasses on what was distorted before becomes very clear What was what was confused before becomes less confused. So I think in that way the revelation helps us Inquire into these fields. We see the same world that others see we do see conflict We do see material interests, but somehow the lens of the revelation Helps us to see underlying causes and principles which helps us to go beyond just these explanations Which which very influential social scientists offer? So I guess that the short answer to the to the question is I think the framework is is how the revelation guides our inquiry Into these fields of human endeavor in particular institutional policy practices And I think again many many examples have been said of what this framework is and how it does that But I could just share just a few more a few more thoughts with you About this thing. I think the first thing to acknowledge is that whether we're aware or not Everything we do takes place in some sort of a framework. It's not like we think and act in a vacuum And you know the example that helps me think about this is is playing soccer You know, you can't just play soccer in a vacuum.  There's there's a field There's positions. There's a referee There's rules and when those things come together then you can do all the things that you were trained and practiced to do So in the same way, you know, we think and act in a framework There's things that guide our our thinking and our acting and the question is to what degree is Our are the elements of the conceptual framework of the faith guiding our thinking in action as opposed to elements adopted by by society or other places so Just in terms of now How may be practically the framework can guide our inquiry? I think the The talk last night very beautifully gave examples of very concrete elements and how they can how they can elevate our Contributions to discourses and just to follow however humbly those comments I thought to think further about this framework, you know It has different elements and those elements can be organized into different categories So for example our fundamental beliefs About about the nature of existence would constitute one category of elements So we believe that man is noble that we have a dual nature that God exists and that God Loves us and because of that love he guides humanity So you can see that these elements would really lead to to perhaps very widely different policy conclusions And someone who doesn't have those beliefs as part of their their framework So the framework gives us clarity as to the purpose of what policy should be But I think the interesting thing is that this isn't these aren't the only elements in our framework And I think to be effective in inquiring into fields of human endeavor institutional policy practices or otherwise It's good to become conversant with a number of elements from a sufficiently diverse Range of categories so that we can address issues at the level of depth that they require Again, it's like going back to this Or sorry For example if all we have to say about the world is that man is spiritual if that's the only contribution we have Or that you know, there is a God I think we could find participating in discourses a bit difficult You know, we could run into a lot of walls very quickly and I think that's the beauty of the framework It's different elements don't express themselves uniformly Depending on the circumstances we're engaged in different elements will come to the forefront of our thinking while others will kind of hang to the back Again this example of soccer I think is is useful forgive me if it's superficial But you know when the ball is an attack your your strikers are very active They come to the fore they're busy your defenders are still there They're not they're not sitting on the side taking a break. They're still they're giving defense But you know the strikers are there But then when the ball comes back and you're being attacked and your defenders come to the fore and it's all about it's all about their activity So I think in the same way the elements of the framework have this dynamic Interplay that kind of come back and forth that make us flexible fluid when we when we go to discourses And that we don't show up as this insistent person that always says, you know, God exists God exists Even though he does So so what are some of these elements? I think they were explained very very beautifully last night So there's other categories. I think one important one as it comes as it relates to institutional policy practices is the role of knowledge So, you know, we've heard previously that you know We believe knowledge comes from science and religion that these two sources of knowledge are in harmony And that knowledge is central to social existence. That's a statement of the House of Justice I believe in its 2010 Reson message now if you think of the gravity of that statement, it's huge There isn't an economist today who wouldn't who would agree with that for them You know what drives social existence is capital accumulation and technological progress It's not to say economists don't think knowledge is valuable they do But in the best of cases they view it as Instrumentally important so it's it's important in so far as it drives forward Technological advance and capital accumulation Whereas its intrinsic value is not perhaps as great as its instrumental value So now imagine we're in a policy space and that element comes to the fore, you know The centrality of knowledge how that might inform or contributions to a policy decision That's being made about education or whatever it might be the centrality of knowledge, you know other other categories Include, you know fundamental principles like justice and oneness, you know in development economics There's this somehow, you know taken for granted beliefs that there's an intrinsic divide between the global north the global south Between the poor and the rich and as the object of policy It's to somehow convert the poor into the rich and I think again This is a topic that's been that's been discussed at length So our sense of oneness doesn't allow us to make those those false psychotomies and it guides our inquiry Into these fields in in different ways So I think you know these examples Hopefully what they've shown is that maintaining clarity on the elements of our framework is not such a trivial matter It's not as easy as just sounding principles might be so for example How confident are we to say that knowledge is what drives social and economic development and not capital accumulation? How able are we to draw on insights from both science and religion to address policy issues? How convinced are we that oneness is Intrinsic to creation and how able are we to correlate the implications of that insight to modern policy discourses? So you can see that the elements of the framework really give us a depth that help us to inquire into these these practices He asked so many questions. It was as though he was the moderator Just joking. I know that we don't have much time between you and lunch I understand that and I'm wondering we have till 12 30 though, right? Okay, so Navi, thank you for calling it full. I mean soccer and not football. That was very kind of you No, no, no, I just saying because you know in this context we sometimes confuse football But I want to bring another analogy that we often use in academia as a way to think through our Governance structures and how adaptive they are and how they meet the needs for today's today's world and that's zombie apocalypse really one of the humanities critiques of the resurgence of zombies and vampires in media is that this happens at a time in society when our systems seem to be dealing with Being maladaptive to the needs and exigencies of our world. So the question comes up What happens if there was a zombie apocalypse and you realize no one ever tells you that they how the apocalypse happened, right? We just start the show what it's already happened and zombies are there The questions if you pay attention to these programs these movies these shows are what kind of world do we want to live in and I think that's a very important question because what ends up happening in most of the shows is that they Repeat what had already been done, right? It's still conflictual. It's still fighting. It's still Power hierarchy and structures and how do we change that? Do we want to live in a world that the economic dominant discourses of efficiency of Cost-benefit analysis guide all of our relationships or are there other? elements of the conceptual framework for example values that we can bring to these discourses and as Navi so eloquently said this isn't an easy task So I want to ask my panelists if they can keep their next comments very brief like three minutes TK TK I Wanted to transition a little bit To thinking about how the revelation the conceptual framework helps guide our inquiry into alternative systems So for example, I'm going to just go one by one and they can all follow one another how? Dr. Siegel does our revelation guide into our inquiry of for example collaborative economic systems Dr. Satya Satya How does the revelation guide our understanding of solidarity different ways to conceptualize solidarity and Mr. Sabit, how does the revelation guide our inquiry into collective governance for example are there? Values or principles in the revelation that might be useful in this regard and if you don't mind keep your Comments brief three four minutes, please Yes, so maybe following the same structure as I shared before here's a brief statement from the writings about Wealth so this is one dimension of an economy of course like we said about knowledge So just how do we conceive of material wealth? So material wealth is commendable provided the entire population is wealthy in Fact if a few have inordinate riches while the rest are impoverished and no fruit or benefit accrues from that wealth And it is only a liability to its possessor Wealth is praiseworthy in the highest degree, but it must be acquired by an individual's own efforts and the grace of God and Be expended for philanthropic purposes such as the great undertaking of initiating measures Which would universally enrich the masses of the people in? In addition those measures adopted by the individual in generating wealth must serve to enrich the generality of the people So in when we look at standard economic theory again your undergraduate courses It's talking about this combination of three forces of self-interest of individual self-interest of firms and Competitive forces which yield this maximization of the pie that Navid referred to and The the model is helpful when a society is dominated by price signals when that's the way that it primarily Organizes itself it does much to explain that we need to include other costs into the prices It also highlights the importance of ownership if the world that we live in is primarily driven by price But the theory is agnostic for example about the kinds of things that are being sold So when we think about a collaborative economic system, we would have to pay some attention to this It also limits the conception of social welfare to a monetized conception of value Navid touched on this So we have to be cautious about using that that model as an archetype for society and the quotes Raise other questions like if wealth is praiseworthy if acquired by an individual's own efforts We might ask how much of our economy is generated by individuals own efforts and How much of the wealth that's generated is done in such a way that it enriches the generality of the population Rather than impoverishing certain segments of the population Another question it raises is how do we structure the economy so that the means of generating wealth actually do enrich The generality of the population if wealth is praiseworthy if expended for philanthropic purposes How do how do we make sure that the way that we expend our wealth that we even know that it's enriching the masses of the people so questions In response to this concept of solidarity when we think about solidarity what does that mean especially within the context of the revelation in the social science or the critical discourse context solidarity a lot of times is affiliated with social movements and so to look at revelation or To look at social movements from you know the perspective of revelation in century of light universal house of justice attributes social movements to colonialism and Economic exploitation in particular. It's an economic exploitation field colonialism, which is why? Naturally most movements that resulted had a socialist liberal agenda, and so Looking at social movement. What are they? How are they characterized? You know, it's a collective body of people who have a common goal purpose, you know It's a it's a unified entity of sorts, right, but there's also these Contentious aspects attributed to social movements, right? There's contention. There's sometimes civil disobedience right Doing things against the law just because you know and it's also like fists up. It's a very fist up a radical kind of Perspective when we think about social movements. It's also short-term. It's not sustainable It's sometimes surface level. It's not getting at the core of the issue It's addressing one particular issue not looking at the route to solve something But let's challenge this, you know, let's take down take down the flag, right? Like the recent discourse with the Confederate flag It's good to take down the flag which is a distraction of what's the core? What are the core roots of the problem is the flag the problem? I think it's way deeper than that, right? So These are also the critiques of what solidarity is in the social reality context But we are the universe also justice and in the writings It is true that we have this affinity to want to bond with each other to have this sisterly brotherly bond to be in solidarity for Constructive social change, right? Not just social change and universe also justice in a letter dated December 8th 1967 says Because our love for our fellow men in anguish at their plight are essential parts of a true Baha'i's life We are continually drawn to do what we can to help them It is vitally important that we do so whenever the occasion presents itself For our actions must say the same thing as our words But this compassion for our fellows must not be allowed to divert our energies into channels Which are ultimately doomed to failure causing us to neglect the most important and fundamental work of all and the house concludes that that fundamental purpose is To is the spiritual awakening and regeneration of mankind and so it's interesting That we have this guidance about Make sure you if you want to participate in movements that promote solidarity make sure they're apolitical They do not promote, you know, dissension disunity, but also don't go to the other extreme and say I'm not going to participate in anything That is relevant for example like racial affairs, right or racial unity The element of independent investigation of truth is something that I thought was interesting that the Guardian highlights in when you choose to participate in a solidarity movement and I just wanted to Share this he says after careful scrutiny When they feel satisfied is free from every tinge of partisanship and politics and is wholly devoted to the interests of all mankind then is it Okay, you know to join so don't be just joined in a movement because it's the fad on Facebook or it's something exciting to do But what do you actually know about what's going on in that movement, right? and Lastly, I just wanted to close with this Quote from the University House of Justice when they wrote to the Baha'is in Iran the Baha'is students in Iran About the Baha'is to for higher education and I think this is an example of solidarity It wasn't it's not only limited to the situation of the case in Iran, right? This has been a transnational movement The house says call to mind heart-rending episodes in the history of the faith of cruel deceptions wrought against your forebears It continues it is only appropriate that you strive to Transcend the opposition not to mirror or reflect it but to transcend it Against you with that same Constructive resilience that characterized their response to the duplicity of their detractors You two seek to render service to your homeland and to contribute to the renewal of civilization They responded to the inhumanity of their enemies with patience calm resignation and contentment Choosing to meet deception with truthfulness and cruelty with goodwill towards all You to demonstrate such noble qualities and holding fast to these same principles You be lie the slander pervade against your faith Evoking the admiration of the fair-minded Just a few things I want to share. I hope I can keep it within four minutes. It might go to four and a half but bear with me, so I think it's a very it's a very helpful question and To be honest, I don't have a very crystal clear answer, but I think one thing Which again is another element of our framework that can help us specifically to quiet the collective governance processes or imagining alternative systems of social like an Social organization is this idea of being in a learning mode And I think that's just so crucial to this area of activity of the Baha'is are engaged in inquiring to fields of human endeavor and I think it has its Origins really in the words of Bahá'u'lláh himself in the gleaning Bahá'u'lláh says warn O Salman the beloved of the one true God not to view with too critical an eye the sayings and writings of men Let them rather approach that sayings and writings in a spirit of open-mindedness and loving sympathy So I think as we try to create alternative You know systems or contribute insights towards Moving alternative systems this idea of being in a learning mode being very open-minded being very flexible in a in a mode of Conversation and dialogue is is very important and if you lie I just wanted to share one example that somehow tries to illustrate all these principles Or all these ideas that I was sharing earlier is from my experience at grad school And it's it's not an experience that ends with like a resounding success But nonetheless, I thought it was very insightful for me. Anyway, it was a very very helpful example I thought just to share it with you So during the first year of my of my program the OECD came to campus and they sponsored a policy challenge They wanted a competition of students to help the OECD think about new ways to measure education The end this is what the the our Document said the OECD is aiming to critically review the organization's basic assumptions about development as well as its ways of Working and measuring development in light of new concepts of progress beyond GDP So I was very excited and I got selected for this team There was four of us and our task was exactly that how can we help the OECD think about new ways of thinking about development and education beyond Just just GDP so initially with my team I tried to introduce ideas of moral and spiritual empowerment as they relate to education because we were for the education director These ideas fell on on really deaf ears. And so I tried once more a bit harder. It didn't work So then I said, okay. Well, well, well, let's put, you know, moral spiritual education aside. Let's just work with existing Theories in education just to see if there's any insights from the field and If you allow I'll just read briefly from a journal entry that I wrote reflecting on this experience And I hope just some of the questions that I grappled with might be helpful to others as they as they as they carry on these sorts of efforts So in the end our group created a model Its basic premise was that education is like any other machine. It requires inputs and it generates outputs The inputs are uncontrollable. We can't really control on ethical grounds Anyway, the children or youth who enter the educational system We can however change the emphasis and content of education and hence its outcomes And although we were asked to challenge the basic assumptions of the OECD and to provide suggestions for new types of education Our group simply designed indicators to measure certain social outcomes Which it thought were sufficiently distinct from the traditional approach of the OECD to measuring progress in terms of GDP These outcomes included the six pillars of innovation social cohesion environment political encadment socio-economic mobility and health What was interesting was to note the OECD's response the lady was deeply impressed if not moved by our work She even offered our team summer internships on the spot She said that the ideas if approved would be immediately incorporated into a forthcoming flagship publication from the OECD and education And that our ideas presented quote a leap forward in thinking about development beyond just measures and GDP Needless to say everyone was caught up in a frenzy and there I was sitting amongst the crowd feeling a bit drab, but trying my best to act at least somewhat enthused At one point she asked in brainstorming your ideas Did your group come up with non-measurable factors that you considered important, but that you ultimately dropped? I thought here someone would at least acknowledge some of the points raised about moral education empowerment But the two answers were happiness and self-esteem I Then started to feel whether I was being a bit too rigid with everything I wondered if I would have been better off from the get-go not mentioning anything about what I really thought and To instead simply go along with the group and help it improve its work After all education should help people to achieve better health to attain greater awareness of their political environment And to learn how to improve the environment although I was certainly not opposed to these ideas I simply made clear my view that addressing these issues was not deep enough and that We ought to offer real alternatives Moral education aside, what are the prevalent theories in education? What are their assumptions and are they adequate for the day in which we live? Needless to say these ideas which seem to be more of a nuisance for the group rather than a stimulus We're brushed aside quickly the group was single-minded It wanted indicators and it wanted to measure those indicators educational theory and curriculum Content were considered extraneous and as it turned out what our group prepared was exactly what the OECD was looking for The questions I have then is how does one interact in these situations? Clearly the aim is not to thrust on others children's classes or anything like that How do we work with these entities as they currently are and help them to advance within their existing framework? While at the same time learning from them in this instance I felt I neither contributed anything useful and the only things I gained were examples of prevalent ways of thinking Which could be critically examined for our own benefit, but is this enough? Developing the capacity to bring the revelation into discussions of this nature is very hard I am learning but what challenge can be more exciting than this? There's other things, but that's I'll leave it at that So by way of conclusion here's what you need to do ready you're gonna take notes number one be in a learning mode Number two ask questions lots of questions and ask questions may be differently number three challenge your own assumptions your disciplines assumptions and Then challenge them through the revelation through the conceptual framework Go back to asking questions differently Finally ask yourself. Where did we learn this? Where did I learn this? Where did my discipline learn this? As a way to end I want to end with a quote from Abdul Baha About one way to tell if we're actually making progress It's from selections from the writings of Abdul Baha page 69 Abdu Baha points out every imperfect soul is self-centered and think it's only of his own good But as his thoughts expand a little he will begin to think of the comfort and welfare of his family If his ideas widen a little more His concern will be the felicity of his fellow citizens and If they still widen he will be thinking of the glory of his land and his race But when the ideas and views reach the utmost degree of expansion and attain the stage of perfection Then he will be interested in the exaltation of humankind He will then be the well-wisher of all lands This is indicative of perfection. May you all achieve Perfection. Thank you