Great, hello and welcome to Town Meeting TV's coverage of Town Meeting Day 2024. This program, we're bringing you in advance of voting on March 5th, Tuesday. Town Meeting TV hosts forums with candidates and about all the ballots on all the items you'll see on your ballot coming up, that's why you don't read. You can find us here where you're watching either on Comcast Channel 1087, Burlington Telecom Channel 17, or on YouTube.com, backslash Town Meeting TV. If you are tuning in live, we welcome your questions here at<PHONE_NUMBER>. So let's get started. We're here tonight with candidates for the Winooski School Board and we have Isaiah Donaldson, Ilam Pessi, Nicole Mace, and these, you all have three year, two year, and the remainder of a three year seat and you're all running uncontested. So we can have a conversation together about the Winooski School Board and why you are running and we were just talking about why it is actually kind of fun to be on the school board. So we'll start, Nicole, you've been on the school board the longest, is that correct? No, technically. Oh, Isaiah. By one month. Okay, Isaiah, sorry. Isaiah, we'll start with you with kind of your opening statement, why you want to be on the school board and why do you make a difference to the city of Winooski? So for me, being on the school board has been a goal of mine, pretty much my entire life, honestly. Growing up, my mom was an educator and I knew from an early age before I decided I wanted to have kids, but once I had a kid, I wanted to join the school board of whatever district we were living in. And then when my daughter was born in 2016, I was like, cool, plugged, let's do this. I'm going to make it happen. I found Winooski. I've been living in Winooski now for eight years. So my daughter's seven now and she goes to JFK Elementary at Winooski. And being on the school board, so I'm currently on the school board and being on the school board as of last June has really just been, I don't know, just the best experience. I've had such a fun time and being on it just in the district of my daughter's in is a big part of it, but also I love where I live. I love Winooski so much.  And then the school, being in the schools especially because it's a brand new school, we just finished our capital project about a year ago and just being through there and learning how the kids operate and also how the staff operates and just like the camaraderie there is like really phenomenal. Yeah. And the fact that we're so focused on becoming an anti-racist school is just really like that's what hits home for me. Thanks Isaiah. And so, tell us why you want to be on the school board for another two years. You're currently on the school board? No. You're not currently on the school board. So you're brand new. And what will be different for the city of Winooski with you on the school board? For me, the reason I'm joining is because I've always wanted to know how the school was run. Because my kids, they grew up as a new American and I really don't understand the American school system. So I really just want to know, get the knowledge of it. And since I had like a language, a little language barrier, I didn't know like if I really wanted to join or how big it is of a task or the job it is. So they were looking for what do you call a new member to join and we were in the interview process and she got elected. And then we met at like a gathering and she asked me to be her budget body. So I said yes. Oh, great. Yes. So, and being a parent, I really wanted to, in motor cultural, I want to see somebody else on the board who is motor cultural, not just like American, but also I wanted to join also. Great. Bring your perspective. Thank you. And Nicole, tell us about why you're running again to finish this three-year seat. So I was appointed to fill a vacancy, which is why it's the remainder of a three-year seat. And like Isaiah, I love the community of Winnowski. I've lived there for about 15 years. And I feel like the combination of my professional experience, I was the executive director of the Vermont School Board Association for quite a while and have a pretty in-depth knowledge of the education funding system and sort of the role of the school board and how to effectively govern a school in order to achieve results. So, and I also had the privilege of serving as the school district's finance director for a few years. I've since transitioned to a different role, but I feel like I have a unique perspective of having been an administrator in the school district, really understanding how the school works, but also understanding how the board can support the great work that's happening and continue to move the needle in terms of outcomes for students and support from our community. Great. I'd love to get into that a little bit more, just like what is the role, how does the school board function and the role of the school board and, you know, how do you impact the day-to-day functioning?  And so we're going to get to the question of the school budget and how you support or not this year's school budget. It looks like $31.97 million. I don't know what that translates into in terms of a percentage increase for Winnowski. And we're going to start with you, because we'd kind of go around in the circle and you're the next in line. I'm just going to move your mic while you're... Okay, sure. Go ahead, yeah. For me... You keep going, how do you support the school budget and why? For me, being a budget buddy, I got to learn how the process behind the scene of selecting the right budget for the school. And I support it because they focus really on not raising too much tax for the Winnowski residents and also to support the school at the same time. So that's why I support it. What is the increase? What is the percentage increase for Winnowski going to be? So the budget increase is 26%, but because of the changes to the education funding formula that were designed to direct more resources to districts with students who have higher needs, we're projecting a tax rate decrease. We're also happening to be in a reappraisal year, so we can't necessarily translate the tax rate to a tax bill because folks' home values are likely going to increase substantially. But like Aloma, I support this budget because I do think it balances both the need for critical investments that were intended by the new funding formula. We're expanding pre-K into four classrooms, full day pre-K, all eligible. All four-year-olds will be eligible to be served in Winnowski in the program and also retaining a lot of positions in our multilingual department that had been added with ESSER funds that of course are going away. And so really being able to retain and expand in some cases those critical positions while at the same time being able to present a budget that has a projected tax rate decrease feels pretty good. And I would love to explain that to me like I'm in pre-K, so Isaiah, you also you're nodding about the tax increase, but the tax rate decrease to support the school budget, and what are you excited about it? In complete support of the budget, you know, it's like Nicole was saying, it's a weird year for Winnowski itself because we haven't done a reassessment on properties since 2007. So that's kind of crazy. So a lot of folks are, you know, they don't know what their house value is, quote unquote, to the town's assessor, which they'll learn early June, hopefully. And then July 1 is when that switch happens. With the tax rate decrease, I hope that'll bring some reprieve for sure. It's definitely going to bring reprieve for income focused tax bills so that we can say, yes, your tax bill will go down if you're income based. If it's purely just on the value of your home, we can't really tell you where it's going to go because your house value will increase for sure because the times we're in. In terms of the budget itself, I'd say what I'm most excited about is the preschool. So the fact that we can offer ahead of the laws for the state one fiscal year ahead of offering four full classrooms, five days a week, full day is amazing. As a dad who had to seek other preschools when my kid was in preschool age, I just think that's an amazing thing. I wish that my daughter went to Winnieski preschool, but it just didn't fit my schedule, to be honest with you. So that must have been built into the planning of the new school. We built four classrooms. Yeah, built these classrooms in. And maybe one of you just can give me that, explain what's going on to me. There's a new legislation that lifted the cap on education funding. Give it to me like I'm a five-year-old. So as I mentioned, the law that was designed to direct more resources to students who have higher learning needs, recognizing that full implementation of that change would have a negative impact on some districts. The legislature two years ago instituted a 5% cap for districts that were sort of the losers under the law. And as this budget season played out, it became clear that some districts were, the education spending was increasing substantially. And some districts who were benefiting from that cap saw pretty significant increases in their budget. And it sort of disrupted the relationship between your spending increase and your tax rate. And so the change that the legislature made is intended to more closely align the loss in pupils with a tax rate, but not totally insulate folks from the decisions of the budget process. Winooski supports the law that the governor signed today, I think. Because the impact of increased education spending with no ability to raise tax revenue from those districts protected by the cap would mean that our tax rates would have to go up and sort of flip the whole purpose of the law on its head. So we're supportive of this tweak to correct, I think. Yeah, absolutely. And in terms of what you're saying with pupils, the new formula is called weighted long-term membership. And Winooski itself, that formula goes into how much it costs to educate said student, right? Depending on age, what grade they're in, if they're living in poverty, if they're multilingual learners, there's a whole algorithm that they put together and each student equals a percentile, if you will. And a big chunk of our students in our district are really two and a half kids that's how much it costs to educate them the right way. So we benefit from that, for sure, because we have a lot of extra things that we need so we can supply for our community that we have. Great. Thanks for that. I know that it gets complicated. I'm sure it gets complicated for all of us, trying to figure out and brings us to the next question of challenges. What's the biggest challenge facing Winooski schools in your mind? And how would you use your seat on the school board to address this particular issue? Yeah. I'm going to start. You want to go out and spin the call. Yeah. I think. So I think there's external challenges and then internal challenges. And the external challenge that we've talked about quite a bit as a board is housing. And we're seeing a housing crisis impacting all of Vermont, but in particular impacting families in Winooski who are being displaced by landlords raising rent, by the conversion of rental apartments into, you know, long-term rental apartments into short-term rental apartments. And the fact is the new housing stock that's being built is not large enough to house the families that live in Winooski. And so we're concerned as a board about the disruption to students and also just the displacement of families who have a really close connection to the school district and have come to rely on the supports that the school district provides. So we put together, we adopted a resolution on housing a couple months ago and I think we all are committed to continue to advocate for housing policies that support family housing. Internally, I think our biggest challenge and it's again something I think we can work on as a board is measuring how well we're meeting our end statement or our objectives we have as a school district to make sure students are college and career ready. And I think there's a lot of, that's a hard thing to do to come up with how are we going to measure that but I think in the absence of some clear metrics and some benchmarks and progress monitoring, we, you know, we asking community members to make a big investment in our schools and I want to be able to say not only are we producing results but we're producing equitable results. Thanks Nicole. Yeah, for me I'd say the biggest internal struggle that I see and that's something that I'm definitely putting in a huge focus on while I'm on school board and Nicole and I have talked about it a bunch is just overall enrollment. So over the next five years we're projected to see a decrease in enrollment for students in terms and that leans on to the housing, right? That's, these are all connected items and we're projected to see a loss in enrollment for amount of kids and I really want to focus on how do we get more students, right? How do we make sure that we can house those students in that way? Something that is in our mind is we have these amazing facilities, we have this amazing multilingual program. What students from other districts potentially aren't getting what they need at their district and how can we potentially bring them to our district? So we've chatted about that a little bit. What is the status of that? What is the status of exchange students moving from Winooski, Burlington, South Burlington right now? The status in? Like how many students move around district to district? Didn't we just do it, we did the policy change. So I think we've got four students going out and three coming in. We set a new cap for a policy but that's a low number where we have a high cap and we're really only using a small percentile of that and I really want to see what can we do to get more folks in and then what can we do in the future to potentially change that to make it even more fruitful for the school. So that's my measure on what I think is the biggest internal struggle. Externally, I mean I'm gonna lean on what Nicole said. Housing is a big issue. I mean that's what my life is literally about. I'm a realtor. I help people buy and sell homes and it's a huge focus for me to change people's lives in that sense like get them a house that they can afford or have a place that they can live in that does suit their needs in terms of families. And Nicole was saying family homes because we're seeing tons of units being built that are one bedroom, two bedroom. It's not a family. You can't live there. Like if you have four kids, five kids and especially in our community, how diverse it is we have a lot of families that have large families. A whole pro-generational family. Exactly, yeah 100% and that's a huge pin point for me too in what I do in my job but also just me as a community member for sure. Alon, what do you see as the biggest challenges facing Winooski schools? How do you want to use your seat to address this? For me I want to see the biggest challenges for getting the students ready for a sort of school when they finish high school to be college ready and like life ready. Yeah. I know we have like the educational ready and readiness and parental readiness but I feel the school has a bigger role to play in their life and education they receive so they need to, I want to see like the right education to be given to them, to have them prepare for financial, having the knowledge like a mathematics to write essays, to be able to know how to take tax test or quizzes because college is different than high school. You have to be sitting in a classroom and taking notes on your own and try to figure things on your own it's not like high school where everything is a little bit easy so I just want to have them to be strong and ready-minded and have the knowledge to face the outside world when they go out there on their own. Yeah. That brings me, I mean that's a good segue into neurodivergent students so this is the question how can Winooski schools best support neurodivergent students and Isaiah I'm going to start with you on this one. I'm going to be honest with you I don't know what neurodivergent means. Generally it means people who think and process the world in different ways and so everyone. But you know there's a sort of strong feeling that school is built for a particular kind of student learner and we recognize right with mental health challenges especially a group of students that you know really we changed how we understood student learning through COVID. Yeah. So I mean just to speak on neurodivergent you know learning in the Winooski school district I'd say we are killing it but I'm being really honest with you. We have so many different there's there's a whole department for that and we have sensory rooms within you know each school because there's three schools the elementary the middle and the high and I've walked through those sensory rooms and they're amazing like they have different situations for students for every different type of person like a lot of the like all the tables that I've seen in the elementary side which I love and in the sensory rooms every single table is a whiteboard table. They have these really cool chairs that some kids need to sit in that aren't just a normal standard chair like we're sitting tonight today and that now everyone has the the ability to even just sit in a chair like that and then in terms of what some other facilitators are doing in the school it's just they we have a lot of support staff that are really focused on maybe an individual or a couple individual students and really harnessing towards their learning needs but I mean I'll be honest with you I mean I still have a lot to learn about the school my daughter's in first grade and I've only been on the board since June and what I've taken in has been a lot and I you know this next three-year seat that I am looking forward to is like another three years of learning and like I'm so excited about it yeah yeah Thanks. Alom, do you have thoughts on this? For me I think they need to for me I have a strong belief in multistionary type of learning environment to have especially for elementary students because they just they're learning the beginning of the life and I think if they have a set of multistionary environment in the classroom so each child can figure out what works for them like a multi-learning yes multi-learning not just studying like okay you gotta know your ABC your numbers you know not everybody's gonna have that focus so they need to have maybe have more teachers and more training on like maybe some case with more difficult challenges they should have teachers to focus on those children so they know are all mixed in the same classroom so that's for me I think that's what they need to see yeah this is I think where I'm a little bit I benefit from having worked in the school for school district for a few years and I do think the new building and the new spaces are going to serve us really well in the term in terms of better meeting the needs of neuro divergent students I because we have sensory before we used to have to deliver therapeutic services counseling services in closets you know or out in the hallway or it was not a space we did not have a space conducive to supporting a diverse array of student needs or to have you know we we contract with you know the Howard Center outside groups to come and provide therapeutic supports and there's no space so so I do think that and I also think we have a commitment to a comprehensive system of supports for students to really have teachers looking at what are each students strengths one of the things this budget will do is create more planning time for teachers and we also at the school board meeting last week gave the green light to a later start time for the school day so that teachers can meet as per first professional learning communities to really start to look at data and make a plan around each child and I think that that would feed into what Nicole was saying earlier when we know how we're how are we gonna track and have the metrics of how we're doing college ready right how are we doing so that's gonna help that metric teachers will have more time we can't ask for data if teachers don't have time to look at data and make sense of it and do something about it that's a concrete way and maybe just talk about that late start time what does that mean and this is a you know I'm trying to think of like how does the board get involved in a way because you're not micromanaging right what's happening in the school or how teachers are working with students etc but you're really providing a space you're providing the supports that they need to be able to do that work talk about the late start time and then how how does the board get involved on this yeah I'll chime in right away so I mean currently our start time is 8 a.m. we're pushing it to 8 15 doesn't seem like a drastic difference but it's going I hope it's gonna make a difference and it's not like we're extending our day another 15 minutes we're just shortening the day 15 minutes quote-unquote for the students and in terms of kind of how what we do in terms of how we manage the school right really our employee is the superintendent obviously and we're policy governance that that's how our board operates and every board meeting that we have our superintendent gives us a monitoring report and we review that monitoring monitoring port and you know check compliance and see what you know what really the school's been up to how things are going and I think we're very blessed to have the superintendent that we have Wilmer Javarria is phenomenal he's an amazing person but also and a really amazing at what he does and he makes things more digestible and easier to read so his formatting in the way he's presenting it to us is digestible yeah digestible that's the right word so that's kind of how we on a monthly basis you know you would say quote-unquote manage the school if you will through the eyes of the superintendent and then myself I am also the secretary clerk for the board so I mean I'm kind of more involved on a weekly basis if you will so I go in once a week to check the payoffs and where money's going and I love it cool and I'm doing it line by line like Nicole asked me a couple months ago like do you actually read these and I'm like yeah I found a mistake a couple months ago so like me knowing where money's going and understanding it and like you know oh I see you missed something you know so it's kind of cool to be a part of that in a sense great our next question is on public safety a lot of you know a lot out there about police presence in schools guns weapons safety public safety as a whole issue so in your role on the board how do you think the school district is best ensuring the safety of students and teachers in our school and the community is it me yes we're going to have the right I mean you were involved during the process of our change right so first of all I would say in general I think the Winnowsky schools are very safe and welcoming we have had an agreement with the city of Winnowsky for a school resource officer to be sort of on a hundred percent not a hundred percent but I'll spend a lot of the school day in the school and there was some community conversation about the appropriateness of that several years ago and there was a public facilitated dialogue that led to a set of recommendations for how the school district could move away from having a police presence in the school to having a safety officer and they looked at several models around the country where that was successful and so for the FY 25 budget we're moving to school safety liaison position which is not a law enforcement position and the police department will continue to serve as a you know have a an officer who is a liaison to the district but won't be on-site be more of a support or role which I think is the direction that the community really supports we also have I think a pretty high functioning safety committee who's done taken its responsibilities around emergency planning conducting drills a response to there were a number of new requirements passed by the legislature last year so I think we're feeling pretty good about both continuing to staff school safety but doing so without a law enforcement presence on the school because that's the decision of the direction the community wanted yeah can I chime in on safety so I'm involved with the ARSE which is the anti-racism steering committee so that's something I do as a board member and we meet every other week but something that just got implemented and we're currently reviewing the results and the data of this so we just implemented the survey from made from the students of the ARSE we have about 37 students in that committee and about seven adults so it's student run and it was initially started in 2020 by students which is amazing and I'm grateful to be a part of it but this new survey that we just released is the students we made up this list of questions about 30 questions whatever really related towards how each student feels in the school you know whether it's based on safety just having some of the talk to you know feeling comfortable but then we kind of also tied it in with the city itself comparing how they feel in the school versus how do they feel just in the community so I don't have results of the day of that yet because we just finished that and we're gonna go over that in the next couple weeks so it's I love that you brought up safety because that was a big topic with the ARSE and we're trying to do a big push and how can we adjust as a committee to really tone to what the students maybe aren't getting that they should be getting and get here their voice more so yeah he said because because honestly they're gonna be there for the students and the faculties so I think they need to have the students say in the decision-making of their if they want the officer or safety person to be there and have parents also like they should have a little gathering or meeting to discuss and parents really need to show up because sometimes we have community events to discuss and parents don't show up and it's really disappointing so parents really need I want to see more parents get involved because they do supply interpretation so I want to see more parents get involved in decision-making for the student or the children safety at the school and get and get the students input in making the decision yeah I mean safety has a big it's a big term and we sort of tend to think of it narrowly relating to police but the way you're talking about the survey it sounds like the survey is talking about the bigger idea of safety do you feel like you belong do you feel like you're gonna be listened to do you feel like you're gonna have an impact the social mental aspect yeah interesting so great on that I'm gonna do sorry Jordan I'm gonna switch really quickly just to follow up on a lump's position here about the language access question which is how can the Winooski school district meet the needs of students and families whose primary language is not English because you mentioned that in your thing and I do want to start on that yeah great yeah so for me I think I think Nikola was disgusting and she said they they have some kind of program we do a teaching the parents English and also the students so because for me I have also struggled with being English as my third language and trying to teach my kids our native language and it's really it's been tough to keep to teach them my native language so English is always just like taking right up just coming out of nowhere so I think we need to really focus on that so the kids don't lose you know their native language and also have be flowing in English at the same time it's awesome I mean because immediately I read this and I think like interpretation and supporting people and the way that you're coming at it is support families to maintain their own cultural heritage and their own languages yeah because even the students when they hang out with their friends they end up speaking English instead of their native language and they tend to lose it like for me I was fluent in French when I came here but I have to learn English and I didn't have anybody speaking French for me so I kind of lost it a little bit so yeah that's me to work on that a little bit yeah and Nicole we hear from families a lot about concern especially you know Ellum's English is fantastic and there are some families whose English they really struggle to communicate at all with their students so it's not it's both a loss of sort of the cultural identity for their next generation but also a real barrier in terms of just communicating between parents and children and and between parents in the school and so the program Ellum is referring to is we call the heritage language program so the Winooski School District has been providing interpretation services for years and but what has been new in the last couple years is hearing from families saying actually we need help we need our children to speak our language and so that piloted with a grant and it's being run as an after-school program right now but I do think it's really important that we're balancing the you know the the drive to sort of acclimate to our educational system and our dominant language with the need to preserve folks identities and the connections that they have not just to their parents but to other generations within their families. Great. And Isaiah do you have more to add to that? Yeah I mean I'm just you know not in terms of that but like something that the district does do that I loved you know Cole and I did the our you know first really budget presentation months ago and we invited community members to come out and what the school provides is interpret interpreters so headphones that they're wearing while we're live presenting speaking English but then it's in real time interpreting it into their native language which is amazing and you know I kind of leaned it on when I went to school you know I'm 33 so I haven't been in high school for a long time but I could tell you right now Saugarty's High School in New York definitely would have never done that back then I don't know what they're at today but it that to me is just such a cool shift to say great like you're a community member come to our school let's talk about this and we're gonna make sure you understand it and not just be you know speaking gibberish because English could come as a gibberish yeah and it's it requires a whole new presentations now right we learned a lot of you have to learn to pause after that translation so but yeah and so that was cool let's try and look like the you know the summit when the presidents go to a different country and they wear those yeah that's what it looked like yeah well and I so that same pause like when we try to meet the needs of the many I think we end up meeting needs that we didn't even know we had and so that impact the potential impact of students who are born speaking English in the United States to be able to hear other languages and to be able to learn more quickly other languages is also pretty amazing and also it's good for everybody to slow down right you're talking about the budget course lose most of us it's good for all of us to slow down just in general yeah we live in such a high like fast-paced society and it's you know I've learned in my adulthood to just slow down a little bit and really make sure that you're making the right connection with the person who's right in front of you it's so easy to just get distracted look at your phone and or look at the things that are walk crossing right by you but it's like no like let's focus on literally what's in front of me yeah well we're gonna go back to the measuring success question on that yeah that's where our world speeds up a little bit the data so last year standardized test results suggest that the proportion of Vermont students proficient in math and English and that means doing okay right decreased during the pandemic and has not made significant improvements since is this true I guess one is is this true of when you ski and how do you measure the success of the school district is this a decent way to measure success there's a lot in there yeah and I guess we'll start with Isaiah yeah I mean if I'm correct I believe the test scores were lower than the state average yes correct cool look at Nicole because we looked at the sheet together yeah so the based off of what you just put up there you know math and English math and English yep so the test results for when you see seal district were much lower than the state's average in terms of the testing do I personally think it's the right way to measure things no I don't because like we said before every single human is different we all learn different ways you know when I was asking you what nor of it divergent meant I didn't know but you told me and I learned but like that when you said the example I'm like that's everyone yeah we all learn so differently we're all so different and I personally don't think standardized tests really give you true results of where that particular student really is and aside from just maybe they know the answers but let's say they're test stress you know we all you know portray our knowledge in such a different way and I just think tests personally I know we have to measure things and I know we have to have those results but I feel like at some point we got to figure out a different way to how do you do those things how do you measure the success of the school district what would be I mean how do you know what would be one of your favorite if I'm being honest I mean I'm still learning all this stuff so I know with the Middle High School they've changed the whole grading system and the way students are marked essentially and I know they were going through a big change over the last few years for that implementation I'm still learning a lot about it we had one of the school counselors sit in one of our board meetings a few months ago and they kind of talked about when they made that switch for students that were graduating and you know the college when they're talking to the college counselors like you know understand the grading system even some of the colleges were like you know how do you like explain this to us right but then a lot of them are like oh this makes way more sense than a you know 65% you know 85% scores you know and it kind of it's kind of cool to see that and I really am eager to learn more specifically from Gene who's one of the co-principals of the Middle High School and he really kind of talked about that more like a lot in depth in that meeting and I personally want to learn more about that. An alum how would you met how do you want to measure the success of the school district what's your vision and if you want to speak to the standardized test results in whiskey. I don't know much about the the results but for me I remember when I was a good high school they used to be A, B, C and D grades or minus A so like for my kids they bring the home there or they send home their report I'm like I don't get this 3.2 I really don't understand it so I really want to learn more about how we can have a better understanding of the grade results. So you think there's more that can be done to help families understand this particular grading system? Yes. What would tell you that when you ski school districts are doing a good job? I think having the test for each grade on a certain like you say math and English I think is more really important to see where student are in the level because there's a different you know English a second language they might not do well on those so then if they test them they'll see where they are so they can help them achieve and get better. So a measure of success might be that you're measuring and then responding and fixing or changing and Nicole for you how do you see what's going to tell you when you ski is doing well? So I talked about this earlier I do think you know we're a pretty new board and so with a brand new superintendent and I think we have a great opportunity to really clearly define the metrics that we use and I agree with Isaiah in the sense that standardized tests is not the only way that we can measure student success I do think it's an important metric because it does compare our results across to other schools and students across the state I know we have local assessments that we use like the star reading assessment and some other math tools that teachers really have you know it's more connected to the teaching that's happening in the classroom and the curriculum that we have so those are important for us to see and I agree with Ilom for me it's more about growth as opposed to you know you've met a target or you haven't met a target it's how are we moving students to increase their proficiency and then I think health and well-being is also important that you can't get off of a standardized test and and surveys like the one Isaiah talked about could be an important tool that we use there's like school climate surveys there's other ways that we can get at that question of do students feel a sense of belonging do they feel valued so I think that's the work ahead for this board to really figure that out thank you all for joining us here today and speaking directly to voters in the city of Winiske any last closing comments for folks get out on March 5th I guess yeah I mean thank you for tuning in thank you for having us I really really appreciate it March 5th come like just vote you know at the end of the day it's like we all live in that town we all love it and even if you don't still vote because you have a voice and you should use that voice great that's where I'm at there is a budget presentation on March 4th we also did one here so not only vote but get the information you need in order to cast your vote yeah yeah we will be live streaming that budget presentation I think maybe Jordan can give me a thumbs up on that no we're not doing the last but we have recorded here and so thank you for tuning in to ongoing coverage of town meeting TV forums you can watch this and other forums repeats at cctv.org backslash 2024 or again on YouTube.com backslash town meeting TV and don't forget to vote either you can walk in now to the clerk's office and vote or you can vote on March 5th from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. and we will be doing our local election results show here as well so tune in at 7 o'clock on March 5th and we'll bring you the numbers as they roll in so thanks for watching


everybody forced here rip in 2021 NT football hobby four box full case number 101 101 pick your team style we've got Anthony C Seahawks, Ben L Texans, Brandon J Colts, Brandon R Lyons, Christopher F Cardinals Chiefs, Harper B with the Chargers and the Bengals excuse me Hilton has the Packers and Bills, Jesse O Niners, Joe C Raiders, Ram Saints, Bucks, Titans in Washington, Ken D Giants, Nicholas T Dolphins, Pat L Bears, Peter L with the Falcons, Panthers, Vikings, Eagles, Steelers, Broncos and Patriots, Ronald has the Jets, Scott M Jaguars, Todd L Browns, Tom S Ravens Cowboys few people with quite a few teams good luck everybody thank you very much for joining let's finish the daytime off very well here let's do it this game uh is game four tonight and then you go find the nearest local bar and go actively root against the lightning just because i'm stirring the pod for the sake of stirring it yeah i think we're gonna hit something to use here i just want to match Caleb's level of what he's been pulling lately he's been pulling some crazy stuff that one-on-one mac prodigy rpa got midnight andre reed the 20 for buffalo the base parallel falcons michael victim 99 jersey card seahawk shon alexander to 99 broncos patch card steve atwater to 25 let me hand sanitize real quick i don't see anything on my hands i just feel strange maybe it was on like one of the boxes or something i don't know no i didn't feel like sticky feel like like dust or something i don't know yeah that was fine got bill's dual patch josh allen jim kelly to 35 two colors on the kelly four colors on the allen nice one bill's dual patch bangles the rookies jamar chasen evan mcpherson to 25 nice hit sincey that's a cool one texans rookie jumbo prime signatures book is nico collinson 99 there you go texans jersey auto for the giants jeremy shocky to 25 giants oh these are really cool got to 49 a jim kelly please call again i don't forget what they're called that's the hall of fame bust on there uh jim kelly on card auto to 49 bills good box for buffalo and on the back kyle trash nfl gear rookie dual relic auto 25 of 25 buccaneers there you go bucks noice trash just keep heating up here let's see something bigger got drew pierce in out of 88 cowboys and titans darik henry to 99 seven he's still farmed uh what's his name trade avius white or no is that josh norman jersey card jags james robinson to 99 bill's patch card jim kelly four of 25 jim kelly is all over this break fourth jim kelly card rams rookie dual patch nice patches there jacob harris eight of 87 jersey number red parallel the rams bears dual patch rookie justin fields nice 24 of 25 on the sunday treasures looking relics there true rpa buccaneers jalen dartin to 99 true rpa tampa rams auto as baker mayfield to 25 wait for him to get traded man got jets dual auto zack wilson and cori davis to 49 prime pairings nice hit jets there you go wilson and cori davis we've got prodigy rpa patriots remandre stevenson seven of 10 that is a sick four-color patriots patch it's my stitching on it too seven of 10 patriots that's sick we'll mag that as well all right that is saints tasam hill to 49 sexon's rookie uh nico yeah nico collins to 99 jersey card uh falcons matt ryan to 99 i don't think he's gonna play for the browns you know at least he shouldn't they screwed him over man dual jersey ravens to 99 is uh jk dobbins yeah he didn't play well but he played her get them the first play i've been in like two decades and they immediately give someone with some highly questionable stuff going on with him a ton of guaranteed money jersey card stealers is troi palamalu to 99 and he said he doesn't want to play so got lions rookie dual jersey almond rossane brown to 99 i don't know that's just what he says though rookie auto titan scaled farley to 49 rpa jersey number parallel green for the panthers terrace marshal jr to 88 nice hit their panthers stealers throwback auto here is jack lamberton 99 and redemption goes to the bears rookie glove signatures just in fields man we've been hitting fields all day today congrats bears that redemption mag for your rookie glove signatures i don't think those are super high numbered i think it's 49 or less probably less i'm not 100 sure i forget on the rookie glove signatures it bears it's been a fields kind of day oh yeah baker is easily better than the rock but i don't think the seahawks want to like i think they're they're they're like tanking you know they're they're tanking got kyle trash rookie to 25 for the bucks they might not be too good at it i think they're going to be good enough to win a few games but yeah ronda more rookie for the cardinals to 99 there's a few big names really yeah jersey card for the lions deandre swit the 99 or that's what i hear right house state guy and uh racy young i want to say there's a few others too i think uh patch card for the cowboys is he kill elliott to 10 dallas jersey card green bay is erin rogers out of 99 we've got a treasure chest oh oh boy treasure chest to 25 hall of fame oh it's no not hall of fame it's all quarterbacks joe montana dan marino steve young payton manning jim kelly john elway bret fav russell wilson dak prescott kyler murray erin rogers jaylon herds patrick mahomes justin herbert lamar jackson josh allen joe burrow darrick car baker mayfield trevor lorenz zack wilson tray lance justin fields and mac jones boom 24 patch quarterback treasure chest book card i don't think anyone has more than like two teams so that'll be a random at the end yeah someone has just some people have a few teams right let me let me just i'll check at the end here in a second to see if anyone has majority it's possible it's possible you'd have to have uh 13 of the teams though 13 of us of the spots jersey auto raiders derrick card of 49 the raiders crossover rph she's cornell paddle to 99 ah tom braves not gonna be on that one jersey auto vikings chris carder to 99 go bella check made that card and you've got redemption on the back rookie patch auto jamar chase boom true rpa redemption bangles jamar chase big box on the end of the break there the end of the daytime let me uh double check here because we have some people with a few teams again for a majority it is over 50 percent and on this card that means you need uh it's 24 patches you need 13 of the patches it's possible though i saw a few people have some uh some teams here san francis jesse oh they have three here Dolphins is s t colts renjay ronkos peter l peter l has a few teams i know so i definitely want to check all this guys just take me a minute guys i just want to make sure nobody has because there's a like i said a few people with multiple teams uh seahawks uh ravins tom s again so um let's see what else we got chris f cardinals chiefs eagles sorry guys double checking everything here peter l has the eagles chargers i don't think anyone's gonna have it we're just about halfway i don't think anyone has more than a few some people do have a few though i'm glad i'm checking it was hilton yeah some people have at least three or four here bangles is hard for once that guys will probably random this just to check the last few teams here it's still possible someone has it doubt it though yeah some people are gonna have quite a few chances this one though let's do the random here someone's got a definitely a solid handful though let me type this in guys say what's in victor liners twice i was clearly a joke he gets his own card he's his own treasure chest it's just 24 brady patches cowboys packers again chiefs carnals eagles chargers bills bangles browns jets jaguars niners again and patriots let me just double check those niners niners bills packers dolphins cults broncos seahawks cowboys packers chiefs ravens carnals eagles chargers bills yeah bangles browns can't spell browns jets and bears raiders jags niners patriots okay so random here treasure chest quarterback book big one so again you got i'll go on by columns here we got niners niners bills packers dolphins cults broncos seahawks cowboys packers chiefs ravens cardinals eagles chargers bills um bangles browns jets bears raiders jags niners and patriots to 25 on that one big one there good luck on the random everybody snake eyes is a re-roll we'll go seven times here five and two again whichever team is up top gets it one two three four five six and seven and is going to the dolphins dan marino came through for you just rest the teams in there congrats miami so i'm going to show that one again we just looked at it for like 12 minutes but we'll recap everything else here got a relics erin rogers zekiel elliott deandre swift almond raw saint brown troy pola mallu uh jk dobbins matt ryan justin afield jacob harris jim kelly james robinson chason mcpherson got a bill's dual relic there oh nice sapphire congrats man happy birthday atwater alexander autos chris carter cornell powell derrick car jack lambert terris marshall jr kaleb farley baker mayfield jalen dartin kyle trask jeremy schocke and jim kelly other book in the break was an ego colin's rpa book for the texans the 99 a true rpa redemption jamar chase bangles huge redemption there we had rookie glove signatures bears justin fields on the redemption prodigy rpa patriots to ten is remandre stevensson and zack wilson and kory davis dual auto jets i'll do it thanks again everybody talk to you in a moment


Mae yn dweud hangogledig i taethw look owners i chi ddemlockwch cancer yng Nghymru dd Yogfoddiag of the initial tactical fire arms commanders in the three regional control centres, using their professional judgement to support local policing as and when required. The new model will allow those highly trained ARV officers to make a valuable contribution to policing in their communities with a focus on vulnerability and speed of response. The proposals were presented to the Scottish Police Authority meeting this morning. The Fy enw gweithdoedd gyda Poliysgolion mewn proposol i gynffordd fenol angwychowadau 50 oes diwrnog y dess. Leitebeth y cyflwyffordd yn gweithio y mynd i dredig, a i gael i ddim o gweithi a fwylltiaid i dd tulid dros autum rhesliad yr oesbyddog. Fy fydd ddif Qiuoghwr o'r anhygoel hefyd wedi ei ddesparu gwaith iaid o gweithbeth more rapidly and reduce the risk of harm to the public and the offender. Police Scotland proposed to begin the selection process for around 500 officers to be trained to carry taser. Those specially trained officers will be deployed at the heart of local policing in all 13 divisions across Scotland, helping to keep their colleagues and the public safe. The Scottish Police Authority and Police Scotland will keep both those issues under regular review. Liam McArthur I thank the cabinet secretary for that detailed response. For those of us who are worried that this policy is part of a slippery slope towards an enforcement model of policing, what assurances can the cabinet secretary provide that consideration will be given to scaling back the deployment of armed police and tasers in the event that the threat to officers and the public reduces? That is not just a one-way shift towards universal arming. Does he share the concern of Dr Nick McEarall, law lecturer at Glasgow Caledonian University, who appears to question whether the force is taking advantage of what he calls a vacuum of accountability at the top of policing in Scotland? With regard to his latter point regarding Dr Nick McEarall, the answer to that is no. This is an issue that she may be aware that Police Scotland has been planning for for a number of months and provided a briefing to party spokespersons, including his own party leader, a number of weeks ago about their plans and their thinking about this issue. It was delayed in terms of the announcement as a result of some of the changes at the head of Police Scotland, namely that of ACC Bernie Higgins. However, the paper then went to the SPA board this morning, and Police Scotland set out the details of that last week because the paper was in the public domain at that point. To suggest that this is in some way to do with a vacuum of accountability, it is simply inaccurate and misleading. In relation to the wider point that the member made regarding the deployment of firearms officers, an increasing number. The member will recall that I set out last year the increase in firearms officers that were required due to the level of threat that we faced as a country overall in the additional deployment that would come about through that. That announcement does not involve an increase in firearms officers. It is the use of existing firearms officers who are presently only deployed to incidents that either involve a threat to a life or to a firearms incident itself. However, where the tactical firearms officer believes that they could be deployed to an incident, whether there is particular vulnerability or where there is a need for speed and an ARV is available to respond to that quickly, then to be able to deploy them to that incident in order to deal with it at that particular point to support local policing. It does not involve an increase in firearms officers as such. The provision of the taser, especially trained officers, is to help to support public protection and officer protection because of the number of increasing incidents that they are experiencing where violence or a bladed instrument is being used, which clearly has a risk to police officers. I am sure that the member will recognise that there is also a duty of care to police officers in making sure that they are appropriately equipped to be able to deal with those types of incidents as and when they occur in order to bring them to an end quickly. On the last point, I certainly agree that I do not think that anybody would dispute the fact that police officers need to have the tools to keep both themselves and the public safe, including the deployment of armed officers. However, that is not the same as accepting that we should have armed police officers attending at all forms of incidents as a matter of routine. The deployment model under SPA scrutiny today proposes that armed officers may attend cases involving, for example, a domestic dispute. The public will rightly be concerned that the presence of an armed officer may heighten such a situation. Does the cabinet secretary share any of those concerns? I think that the member is misunderstanding the deployment model in which Police Scotland is intending to take forward. The member makes reference to them being used for routine policing purposes, which is simply not the case. They are there to help to support local policing and where the tactical firearms officer determines that there is a need to respond quickly and that there is a vulnerability and that they have an ARV able to respond to that more quickly than local policing to be able to do so. The member gives an example of a domestic incident. If we had a situation where a woman was under threat from her partner at home and there was an ARV, quite literally sitting round a corner that could respond to that call but did not do so because of the existing deployment model and they would have to wait for five or ten minutes before local policing could arrive to it, I suspect that most members in the chamber would say, I would prefer that the ARV to respond as quickly as possible if they are able to get there more quickly. That is exactly what the new deployment model is about. It is not about using it for normal routine policing matters, it is to allow the tactical firearms officer to make a decision that if the ARV officers are closer at hand to respond to someone who is vulnerable or where there is a particular issue about responding quickly to be able to deploy those officers, and I would have thought that all members would recognise that that is about making use of the very high skills that those officers have. It is also worth keeping in mind, ARV officers are police officers first who are highly trained in firearms capability as well, and the intention is—and it is this Government's clear intention—that Police Scotland remains an unarmed police force but with a specialist armed capability that can be deployed as and when necessary. That will continue to be the case with this change to its deployment model. Liam Kerr Does the cabinet secretary agree that, where an allegation has been made of improper use of firearms, it is necessary for public transparency, trust in the police and to ensure that learning outcomes are developed that a full investigation takes place? Yes, that is the case. Of course, anytime when a firearm is used by Police Scotland or where a taser is used by Police Scotland officers, the matter is automatically referred to to the Police Investigation and Review Commissioner to evaluate the use at that particular point and whether it is operated within the normal standard operating procedure within Police Scotland. Every time a firearm is used or a taser is used by Police Scotland, it is automatically referred to the Police Investigation and Review Commissioner to consider the matter. Mary Fee Can I ask the cabinet secretary of following the integration of BTP Scotland into Police Scotland? Will those BTP officers who carry tasers be included in the figure of 500 officers to be equipped with tasers? BTP officers only have a very limited capacity around taser capacity, and they have no firearms capacity in Scotland at all. Any firearms capacity that is delivered within a railway system in Scotland is delivered by Police Scotland because BTP does not have that special zone here in Scotland. One of the reasons why I believe that it should be within a single command structure is that the issue about the taser officers is of a limited support that is provided to BTP at the present moment through their overall UK approach to matters. It will be an operational matter for the chief constable to determine whether they continue to be taser officers that are included within that 500 or whether they supplement that 500. What I can assure the member of is that overall, within Police Scotland, their intention is to have 500 specially trained officers to be able to support local policing as and when it is appropriate. John Finnie Thank you. Cabinet secretary, you have told us that existing model is flawed. You are commending a new model. You are seeing a situation where a largely defensive police service has an increasing offensive capacity. The Scottish Green Party does not oppose these moves at all. Briefing or meeting with parliamentarians does not equate to consultation. Will you encourage Police Scotland to publish both risk assessments—the one for the existing model and for the proposed model, if it is not already being agreed—in order that we can have the fullest discussion about what is supposed to purport to evidence the need for those changes, please? Michael Matheson Cabinet secretary, on relation to the policy intention behind us, it was set out in the paper that was published by the Scottish Police Authority last week and was considered by the Scottish Police Authority today, on the deployment model for both firearms officers and for the use of taser. I assure the member that I believe that, if there is an ARV nearby that can respond to an incident where there is a need for a quick response or where there is a particular issue of vulnerability, we should utilise the skills of those officers to be able to do that. The new deployment model allows that to happen under the command of the tactical firearms commander who will decide on whether it is appropriate or not. That will not be a decision that will be made by the local police commander, but it is a decision that will be made by the tactical firearms commander. Police Scotland will set out its rationale as to why that is the case, nor to ensure that there is appropriate control and decision making around those issues. It has also been set out very clearly by the Scottish Police Federation about why it is important that its officers have the appropriate protective equipment to deal with issues when it involves violence or weapons, and that tasers can play an important role in helping to address those incidents by bringing them to a quicker end and also in helping to protect officers and the public. Having said that, though that is not about simply using it on a proactive basis or on an on-going basis, it is to support local policing and it will be deployed as and when it is appropriate by local commanders. There is a clear process in determining when they will be used and how they will be used. I believe that the new deployment model in both those areas will help to support local policing in addressing issues more effectively. To ask the Scottish Government what assessment it has made of the findings by the Institute for Public Policy Research Scotland that the budget for day-to-day spending is expected to fall by £250 million between 2018-19 and 2019-20. Cabinet Secretary, Derek Mackay. I first of all formally welcome James Kelly as the finance spokesperson, as appointed today to his new role. In my budget statement last Thursday, I was clear about the detrimental impact that UK Government austerity is having on this Scottish budget, highlighting that over the 10-year period to 2019-20, Scotland's block grant will have been cut by £2.6 billion in real terms. I also quoted from the Fraser of Allander Institute, who said that by 2019-20, the resource block grant will be around £500 million lower in real terms than in 2017-18. Monday's analysis by IPPR Scotland simply reiterates those points and confirms that the Scottish Government is facing significant and damaging real terms cuts to our budget for day-to-day spending as a result of that continuing UK Government austerity. In order to mitigate those cuts, protect our NHS and other public services and to support our economy, we have reformed income tax in Scotland, our only significant fiscal lever to provide growth in our tax revenues. Of course, while we have taken action to protect public services, the best way to stop public sector cuts would be for the UK Government to end the damaging austerity and invest in public services and the economy. James Kelly I thank the cabinet secretary for his welcome to my post and I look forward to constructive exchanges. With that in mind, I am sure that he will be concerned that his budget has begun to unravel since he last spoke from that position on Thursday, because it is not just the IPPR analysis. We know from Spice that there is a real terms cut in local government funding of £135 million, and we also know that there is not funding that has been put in place in order to address the issue of the pay increases. In terms of local councils, it is not just the numbers that affect local areas, the job losses, the closure of day centres, the reduction in library services. Will the cabinet secretary accept that, in effect, he must lead Parliament last Thursday, and will he revise the budget allocations in order to produce a fair settlement for local government? I assure James Kelly that the budget is perfectly intact. I think that I gave it a fair presentation last week over a half hour contribution. I know our worth of questions, there is much detail in the documentation, and I am glad that Members will have had more time to look over it to see what a productive and positive budget it is. It is investing many parts of the public sector, as well as ensuring that it is the right environment for business growth. Why is that important so that we can grow revenues, ensure that employment is at a high level and ensure fair social justice? Specifically, in relation to local government, I set out the figures to the chamber, and those numbers remain the same, which was essentially a cash freeze in resource terms with more in capital. I pointed out that, if local authorities used their council tax powers up to 3 per cent increase, they would put their budgets in the real terms increase as well. I think that James Kelly is right to point to the analysis about the real terms reduction to Scotland's budget. Of course, that concerns us in progressive parties, and that is why we are using the powers and levers that we have to protect the people of Scotland from this right-wing austerity and ensuring that our front-line services are adequately funded. In relation to pay, I set out pay policy, which I think is fair in recognising the cost of living for public sector workers. I do not set local governments' pay, but I believe that local government is adequately resourced so that they can have a fair settlement. That is now for a matter for local authority to engage on. Just as I look forward to further engagement with James Kelly, I also look forward to further engagement with COSLA. The cabinet secretary said that one of the levers at his disposal was tax, but in looking at the Fraser of Allander institute analysis, although £164 million would be raised through the tax changes when account is taken of business rates relief and other factors, there is only actually £28 million available for investment in other areas of the budget. The reality is that the tax policy is all over the place. How can it be fair that some of those between £43,525 and £58,500 pay less tax, but those between £24,000 and £43,525 pay more? The reality is that the tax policy is not coherent and it is not delivering for social justice, so will the cabinet secretary redraft that tax policy to produce a fair and consistent set of rates, which will deliver a proper settlement for much-needed investment in Scotland's communities? If even the daily records describing me as Robin Hood of Holyrood Disciples, I must be doing something right in their eyes, and that is the view of the daily record in terms of the progressivity of our tax system. However, it is true to say that we are trying to create the conditions for economic growth, so our business rates policies absolutely do that. James Kelly referenced one of the elements as part of that package. Taking an example of non-domestic rates allios by not lifting the relief that the allios were receiving was welcomed by local government. In fact, with memory serves me correctly, it was welcomed by the Labour Party. I think that there is a range of decisions that are set in the right context and circumstances, but overall on tax, we are raising more to ensure that the real-terms reduction that we have received from the right-wing Tory Government is essentially overturned by our decisions, good governance in the tax decisions that we have been able to take. That is progressive. In recalibrating and resetting the overall tax structure, it is fairer, it is more progressive. More than 70 per cent of taxpayers, of course, will pay less. Those earning under £33,000 will pay less, while also raising more for our public services. In the documentation that I have published, it shows that it could be described as an anomaly where last year we froze the threshold for the higher rate. We are proposing to increase the threshold for the higher rate this year in this budget, so the anomaly that is created there is just part of resetting the whole system, but overall it is more progressive and certainly ensures that we have turned real-terms decline into a positive that is resetting this in a way that uses our power to absolutely protect front-line services and also properly reward our public servants. Can the cabinet secretary tell us what alternative balanced tax and spending proposals the Labour Party has brought forward? I agree that it is simply not credible for Labour to assert that austerity can be ended by this Parliament without specifying exactly how. To be fair, the economy has faced some turbulence and the Labour Party has faced some turbulence as well over the recent period. There has been a change in leadership and spokespeople, but the last remaining information that I had was engagement from Alec Rowley. There was a proposition that was costed in our discussion paper on the role of income tax in Scotland and we modelled the position of the Labour Party, which essentially would put a penny on the basic rate. Of course, that is not what the Government has proposed. Actually, our starter rate, if you compare that now to the basic rate of what Labour would have proposed, is a 2p difference in the pound. The Government has taken a methodical approach to that. We engaged with stakeholders. We have set out our progressive plans and it has met the four tests that we have set out about a more progressive system protecting lower income earners and ensuring that we protect public services in supporting the economy as well. It stands out in sharp contrast to the chaotic position of the Labour Party. However, that said, with a shadow cabinet in place, maybe the Labour Party will want to come and see me with constructive proposals going forward as we take the budget through the legislative process of the Scottish Parliament. The Fiscal Commission is forecasting continued slow growth with the resultant £2.1 billion decrease in tax revenue. What is the cabinet secretary's preference to make up the shortfall, cuts to public spending or further tax rises? Bill Bowman is certainly the man to ask there because he has to follow the Tories tax policies that would have to find another £501 million for next year from front-line public services to fund the position of the Tory tax cuts for the richest in society, whether it is big business, property owners or those in income tax. My balanced budget will allow us to invest in the economy, deliver tax in a fair and progressive way and invest in our public services, turning it into real-terms growth. On the Fiscal Commission's forecast, I am sure that Bill Bowman has looked at the full detail of the report and identified issues about productivity, working-age population and levels of employment. The greatest threat on all those indicators is the Tory party, the mismanagement of Brexit, the decisions that you have taken, the on-going austerity, the attacks on those with the least. All of that is what has compounded the problem and presents the greatest risk to our economy in the UK and specifically to Scotland. However, in the face of those cuts to the Scottish budget, in the face of that uncertainty and in the face of the mishandling of the Brexit negotiations, this Scottish Government is investing in our economy and in our people through skills, innovation and business growth, through education and infrastructure, to ensure that Scotland is the best place to live, work and invest. Although the Fiscal Commission's forecasts, some would argue that they are a bit cautious. EY, for example, gave far more positive and higher forecasts in terms of economic growth. We will invest in the economy to ensure that we are in a stronger position. Thank you very much to the cabinet secretary and members. That concludes topical questions.


Ever dream of a life of romantic adventure? Want to get away from it all? We offer you escape. Designed to free you from the four walls of today for a half hour of high adventure. You are standing guard deep in the forests of Africa. While around you, closing in on you, are the dreaded Mao Mao.  Listen now as escape brings you John Daner's terrifying story, Lily and the Colonel. I first met Colonel M.O.V. Abernathy at the Rift Valley Club, Keenio Colony, East Africa. The Rift Valley Club being a particular club of particular people, frowned with beatling brawl upon the occasional invasion of its dignity by people like myself. Unqualified, of no particular family or traditional distinctions. Possibly because I was a Sandhurst man. A lieutenant with the Lancashire fusiliers had something to do with my invitation into the hallowed circle. At all events I was invited and I went. Sandhurst, eh? That's right, sir. Sandhurst! I was at Sandhurst myself, 1917. That's her, sir. Still turning them out the way they used to? Not knowing how they used to turn them out, I couldn't say, sir. Capital, at least they turn them out with humor. Anything has kept me alive, a sense of humor. Yes, I can see that. Sent down from Suez, were you? Yes, sir. How has old Suez ever been there for fourteen years? Oh, as it always has been, I suppose. I don't imagine it would change much. And now you are here to save us from the Mao Mao. I'm quite sure you can save yourselves, Colonel. Of course we could if it weren't for the bunglers and the... the bungling. The second time I met Colonel Abernathy, it was under quite different circumstances. My patrol had been called to the farm of one James C. Curry to investigate a murder. On the way, I stopped by Colonel Abernathy's house and brought him along in case identification was needed. He knew everybody in the valley. It was difficult to identify, but on viewing the remains, the Colonel decided that since the boots were of crocodile leather and his friend had a liking for crocodile boots, the sum of the two must add up to the body of James C. Curry himself, lying under the rose bush. Neither I was set a word as I drove him home. Come in for a moment. Oh, thank you, sir, but I really should be getting back to quarters. Lancashire fuseliers won't cease operations because their brightest officers aren't back on the dot. Well, anyway, you need a drink. Well, I could use one, sir. Good. Come in. Colonel Abernathy, you back one up. Tell your mistress. She have blast headache.  Headache? Always having a headache. Oh, sit down, Temple. I'll have your drink in a moment. All right, thank you, sir.  Gubbe? No, he's Jalua. I think he's trying his Jalua. Here, I'm giving it to you straight. Slice through any fog. Thank you. Yeah, you're not sure he's Jalua. Well, I'll ask him when he comes back. Now, young man, a toast to James C. Curry, as fine a man has ever breathed. Dead today at the hands of the mama. James C. Curry. Mrs. Abernathy say headache much better. She will come in a moment. Good. Incomplete. But one, I will have another whiskey. Yes, one. I will fix it. Thank you, sir. Very good.  Oh, yes, yes. Incomplete. What are you? One hour? Try. What tribe you belong to? I am Jalua. Do the Jalua have mama?   What do you say? Mama only keeps seeing he can hear you. I am Jalua. Jalua. Very well. Now give Mr. Temple his drink and then get out. Yes, one hour. Drink one.  I don't believe him.  I do, sir, and the sooner you get rid of him, the better. Every head boy a mama, is that it? If I'm right and he is a cuke, then it's quite possible that he is also a mama.  Weak, sir. Weak. It happened to Curry? It could happen to others. You still want to save me? I'm only here to do what I can, sir. It is my job. Young man, what happened to Curry? It didn't happen to me. But are still those who know how to handle this thing, and alone, if necessary. In my day, we knew how to keep your wag in his place. Full justice, mind you, but also this. That pistol of yours may have seen it today, sir. And our times are changing. Only because men have become too weak to prevent it. I'm surprised that you, a Sanders man, should have failed to grasp the fundamental traditions that gave strength to the empire. But what empire, sir? What empire? Blast it, be empire! Oh, Julian? Julian, have you seen Tavicans? I don't know where that cat can be. It was the Colonel's lady. She stood half in shadow in the doorway with something of a smile on her lips. An attractive woman, I thought. Perhaps 45 or 50. But when she came towards us and the light fell on her, I could see that what might have been attractive was only an illusion of powder and rouge, heavily proportioned and badly applied to an aging, unhappy face. Oh, my dear, may I introduce Mr. Charles Temple. Oh, how do you do? Please sit down. Well, as a matter of fact, I was just leaving. Oh, no, no, please. It isn't often that I have an opportunity to talk to a handsome young man. And from the outside world, too. Oh, well, I... What happened today, dear? Why did you run out so quickly? Julian never tells me anything. I'm always in the dark. Well, I'm afraid that I'm responsible today, Mrs. Abernathy. I need his help. Help? Mr. Temple will tell you where I'm off to bed. Good night. Good night, sir, and please think over what I said. Get rid of your boy.  But as for your advice, I shall handle my affairs my way. Good night. Are you a difficult man, Mr. Temple? I beg your pardon. I mean, I hope you're not like Julian. You know, bouncing about and exploding. Oh, I don't suppose I am. Quite. I should be disappointed if you were. And what was it Julian said you'd tell me? Um, one of your neighbors was killed today. Killed? Who? James Curry. Jim Curry. Jim Curry? Who'd want to kill Jim Curry? Why? Why? Mrs. Abernathy, please. Oh, no. No, I'm quite all right. How did it happen? Mamao. Mamao? There must be a way out. There must be a way out. There must be a way out. Oh, yes. Yes. Here, you drink this. Thank you. Better. Oh, that's better. Yes. Well, I hate to, but I must go now, Mrs. Abernathy. Oh, please. Please don't. Sit beside me. Well, let me call the colonel. He can be with you. But he can't help me. More than I can, I'm sure. Now, please, would you let me? It lay broken at our feet. A cat strung up by the neck to a willow branch. Mrs. Abernathy's cat. And outside, somewhere in the dark, beyond the shattered window, were those who had done this thing. It was the Mao Mao. I heard the colonel behind me as I ran out of the door. The moon was huge in the sky, shining down with a blue, white light, and the beauty of the clearing became suddenly terrifying, because of what we knew was lying hidden in the dark trees. Probably miles away by now. Yes, I'm afraid so. Wait. What? Give me your hand. Give me your hand. There, you recognize him? Never seen this one before. I got him in the stomach to get him to a hospital right away. He's a big devil. Take him under the shoulder. We will carry him to the car. I took him to the nearest clinic at my vassal. All night, he hobbored between life and death. All night, I questioned him vainly, and much of the next day. And then, toward the end, I asked him if he knew he was dying.  It was then that all my questions were answered. Name, Matemba. Tried, Kikuyu. Marmal, yes. Family, one brother. And this brother was Colonel Abernathy's head boy, Gumbi. Colonel Abernathy. Colonel Abernathy. It's Temple. Oh, thank heaven it's you. Come in. I'm all alone. Where is the Colonel? And Gumbi? They've been gone all day. They left me alone. I've never been so terrified in my life. Maybe they'll be back soon. My tabbicans, and the shooting.  I shall wait for him then. He gave me a pistol and said I must carry it with me until he comes back. He's wise.  They're for killing. Oh, do, do sit down, Mr. Temple. I, I must look a fright. No makeup, and this old gown. You, you must think I look a fright. Oh, not at all. You look very well indeed. Well, thank you. Kind sir, she said. Um, may I make you a drink? Oh, no, no, thank you Mrs. Abernathy. I think I shall have one. If I don't look out, I shall become a drunkard. A solitary drunkard. Oh, I, I'm sure you're much too sensible for that. Julian doesn't think I'm sensible. He calls me silly. That'll make me feel much better. You're awfully nice. You're not like the other men. You seem very kind. Oh, I, I'm not really, you know, quite the opposite. I beat children the second Tuesday of every month. I gather you're, you're married then? Somebody in England? No, I'm not married. Mrs. Abernathy, I have something to tell you. I thought of waiting for the Colonel, but since you should know about it too. If it's anything unpleasant, I won't hear it. It concerns you very directly. You should listen. No, no, no, no. We shall talk of everything, but not about Kenya or Africa and kernels and poor unhappy black people and, and everything. Very well. I'll wait for the Colonel. Oh, now you've been wounded. The handsome soldier has been wounded on the battlefield of the sexes. He had drink from my glass here. Oh, not, not just a sip. All right then. Just, just, just a sip. There. Jim Curry thought I was attractive. Am I attractive, Charles? I, yes. Yes, of course. I mean to you.  Well, you know... No, no, no. Sit quietly and listen.  Mrs Abernathy... Would you take me away with you? Would you, would you put me in your pocket and, and take me? Of course. Right in my pocket. No, I, I don't feel very well. I, I think I shall lie down. Oh, Temple. Oh, sorry I couldn't be here when you came. Where's Lily? She's not well, sir. I think last night was a bit too much for her. She's resting. Well, tell me, what happened to the beggar you shot? The man died this afternoon. Incidentally, I was right about Ngumbay. How do you mean? He questioned the native all night. And just before he died, he confessed that he belongs to the mama. Well, what is that to do with Ngumbay? The brothers. And he is a Kikou, after all. Yes, sir. Get rid of him. But quietly, we don't want to aggravate the situation. Dying devil. Don't worry. I know what to do. One more thing.  Oh? What for? Well, we should be patrolling the valley tonight and we'll have a clear view of your home most of the time. Should anything happen, you turn out the light. We'll know then that you're in trouble and we'll go along in a jiffy. What you are? Yes. Well, uh, time must be off now, sir. Good night, Colonel. And please be careful with Ngumbay. Well, goodbye, Tepo. Now, I must piece together the remainder of the story from details related to me by Ngumbay himself. I thought of it many times and although Ngumbay was punished for what he did, I cannot in good conscience hold him totally responsible for what went wrong. Ngumbay! Yes, Buona. Come here. Buona.  Buona. What do you mean? You know very well what I mean. There was a man shot here last night and he was your brother. No. My brother and the reserve. He died this morning and he said he was your brother. My brother died? Moreover, you belong to the Kikuyu tribe. No. Jalo.  No, no, no, maybe some Kikuyu, but I could headboard. I do not tolerate lying by anyone. Buona, please. You shall be punished for this. I hope you can at least stand up your medicine. Medicine? Put your hands to your side. Your side, I said! Stand straight! That will teach you to lie. Now, get your things together and get out. I shall pay you when you leave. I said, go! If you hit me with hand-coast, it's good that I am a man, too. But you hit me with open hand. That makes me not a man. Gav! Tell your mom, our dogs, that if they want the same medicine to come to me, then I'll give it to them.  All creatures love the whole lot of them. Shoot the whole lot that we can do to them. What are you doing, Junior? Oh, you startled me. I'm moving this lamp over to the window. What for? What's the lamp for? Temple wants it to remain on all night. Oh, such a lovely young man. Will you listen to what I'm telling you? Mr. Temple wants it to remain on all night, I heard. Why? If, for any reason you need, Mr. Temple's helped you to turn it off. He'll see it and come to you at once. How nice. Turn it off and he'll come to me at once. Did he really say that? Yes. Now, another thing, I've dismissed him with. I know. I was watching through the door. Well? I saw you strike him. Bravely. Colonel... Don't say it like that. It's the only way to make him understand. It's the only way to understand who's master. There's too much Molly coddling with these people. Is there? Oh, no matter. Where's your pistol? I don't know. I don't care. Oh, in the name of heaven. I told you to carry it with you at all times. Can't you understand it for your own good? Here. Take mine. I expect you to keep it with you all the time.  I won't have it, Julian. It's for your safety, Lily. I don't want it. It's hateful. Everything here is hateful. Lily? I'm leaving. I'm going away. Far away. From this house. From Kenya. From you. Been drinking? Yes, I have. And I'll have some more. Stop it, Lily. Give me that bottle. Sorry? Sorry. You're sorry. You don't know what it is to be sorry. I've been sorry for 25 years. I'm sick. I'm sick for living with you.  That's right, run away. Go on, you'll never talk to me. You never did. Who's there? Who's there? You hear me? Bastard, you hear me? Bastard, you hear me? Where are you? You hear me? Is that you? I'm armed. Come closer and I'll shoot. I can see all of you. I can see you. I can see you back. You're not armed. Look, you forgot pistol. Bastard. Ingumbé? Listen to me. I forbid you to do this, do you hear? Stand out in the open where I can see you.  And I don't deal with cowards. If you have grievances, we shall talk them over as men. You hear me? Today you hit me. You make me not a man.  Now stand out in the open where I can see you. Be a man, bastard. Ingumbé? Ingumbé? I say, come out of here. And I know you're out there. I mean what I say. I'm going away. Julian? Oh, very well, don't answer me then.  You could have kept me. If you are kind. I only wanted kindness. Mr. Tempo's kind. I... Oh...  The lights. Julian said he'd come to me if I turned off the lights. Now he'll come to me. Charles Tempo? Is that you? You must have been waiting just outside. It is you. It is. I can see you. Oh... Oh... You've come for me. Did you come to take me away? Give me your pocket. Ingumbé? What? No. Charles, the house was dark. My men found the Colonel lying dead in a phone bush. I found the Colonel's lady, poor unhappy woman. At the screen door to the veranda, there was a strong smell of whiskey about. I turned my head away. On the direction of Anthony Ellis escape had brought you Lily and the Colonel by John Boehner starring Ben White as Charles Tempo, Paula Winslow as Lily, and Ramsay Hill as the Colonel with Dave Young and Luke Rubin. The special music for escape is composed and conducted by Lee Steven. Next week, on a paradise island, living in happiness and freedom, of the woman who lones you for what you are, is planning to take away your freedom and forever put an end to your happy life. So listen next week, when escape brings you Somerset mom's unusual story, vessel of wrath. Suspense are putting on two of their top shows of the season. Suspense presents William Shakespeare's Othello with Richard Whitmark as the star. And Lutz Radio Theater brings you Wait till the Sun shines Nellie with David Wayne and Gene Peters. Remember, that's on Monday night, Suspense and the Lutz Radio Theater on most of these same CBS radio stations. This is Roy Rowan speaking. And remember, America now wakes up to 3 million clock radio and listens most to the CBS radio network.


During this week of operation number two, we not only carried out the check in the Novi International Airport, we also cooperated with the other relevant authorities and relevant agencies in Hanoi and we also cooperated very well with the colleagues in Laos and the other countries. I mention Laos because yesterday we have one hit which is from a fly from Laos to Vietnam and based on the information provided by Laos Police we checked and found that this German man used the lost passport but we after we stopped him at the airport and we found out that he used his lost passport in 2012 but he found it later and at least we allow him to enter Vietnam and we suggest him to contact with his Germany embassy in Hanoi to report about his status. Thanks to the half the assistance from the CCC we have the response very quickly from the NCB Wiesbaden in Germany.