indicated that he was going to attend. Sorry, I didn't unmute myself. Yes, I believe he did say he would be attending. OK, well, we'll wait a little bit. I mean, it's not quite 4.30, so we can wait a little bit, too. So let's have everybody turn on their videos and whatnot. And I understand that Board Member Birch is in the process of joining the meeting. So we'll just get everybody turned on and wait for a while. This is one of the hosts is Mike. We have a Michael who I just gave permission to speak. Michael, is this Michael Birch by chance? It is. OK, we're going to promote you one moment. See, told you. Hey, there you go. I've been demoted. I've been promoted in the first minute of the meeting. So yeah, excellent. He should be a panelist momentarily. So we'll wait. So we'll wait for that. I keep on meeting and meeting myself. I apologize. And there he is. All right, so it is 4.31. And I am calling the regular scheduled meeting of the Design Review Board of the City of Santa Rosa to order. It looks like our description of why we're here virtually has changed. So I'm still going to read that so everybody knows. But pursuant to government code section 54953E and the recommendation of the Health Officer of County Sonoma, Design Review Board members will be participating in this meeting via Zoom webinar. Members of the public can still participate in the meeting via Zoom by visiting www.zoom.us slash join. And entering the meeting ID<PHONE_NUMBER>7. You can also call toll-free 1-877-853-5257 and enter the webinar number I just read. I imagine it's still being broadcast on the city's YouTube channel and also on Comcast's channel, whatever it is. It's not listed on my agenda here today, so I can't read that for everyone. And so with that, I will turn it over to the recording secretary and we'll have a roll call. With the record reflect that all board members are present. Excellent, thank you. We do not have any study sessions today. So item number three, approval of minutes. Did everybody get a chance to look at the September 16 minutes? September 16 minutes. Are there any changes or adjustments to those minutes? OK, so hearing none, I guess we'll enter those minutes into the record. And then item number four, public comment. This is where we open up public comment to members of the public to speak on items that are germane to the board's purview, but are not items listed on the agenda for the evening. So I'll turn it back over to the recording secretary to see if anybody has raised their hand in the Zoom meeting to speak on items not on the agenda. And Chair, I am not seeing any hands at this time. Board Member McHugh, can you please mute yourself? OK, so then we're going to go on to the board business here, but bear with me for one moment. OK, sorry, I had to find my zoning code section to read again. And so that's the City of Santa Rosa zoning code 2052030 design review section F2F, which says project review. The review authority shall consider the location design site plan configuration and the overall effect of the proposed project upon surrounding properties. And the city in general review shall be conducted by comparing the proposed project to the general plan, any applicable specific plan, applicable zoning code standards and requirements, consistency of the project with the city's design guidelines, architectural criteria for special areas and other applicable city requirements, e.g. city policy statements and development plans. Sorry, I don't have that memorized yet. OK, oh, and I forgot to close public comment. I'm sorry, public comment is closed. Statement of purpose, any board member reports this evening? Item 5.2, seeing none. We will move to department reports. Amy, do we have any department reports? Yes, thank you, Chair Weigel and members of the board. Just a brief department report. One is on upcoming meetings. So the board will see a lighter October and November schedule. We are canceling the October 21st meeting as there were not any items ready. And we do anticipate holding a meeting on November 4th. However, we will be canceling the November 18th meeting. And this is because the Planning Commission regularly meets throughout each month. And both of their regularly scheduled Thursday fall on federal holidays. So we're going to do a little bit of a switch there. So again, just the meeting on November 4th planned for the month of November. We are still working on moving toward hybrid meetings where in-person participation is possible. And we will be providing an update to the board when possible. And then just lastly, we learned that the Stony Point Flots Project, this was approved by the board on September 2nd, has been appealed to the city council. Staff is anticipating that this appeal will be heard by the council sometime in the month of November. And that concludes my report. Thank you. Thanks so much, Amy. OK, item number seven, Statements of Abstention. Does anybody have to abstain from item 9.1 or 9.2 on the agenda this evening? OK, doesn't look like anybody does. Great. There is no items for item eight, consent items. And so seeing that, we will move on to item nine, which is scheduled items. And we have two concept items tonight. So we don't have any official public hearing. But I would say that if you have talked, so we don't have to officially do exparte disclosure. But if you have met with any of the project applicants for either projects, we'll do that just kind of briefly. And then we'll also open public comment as we would normally for concept items. So saying that, we will move on to item 9.1, which is a concept design review for recess storage at 44.65 and 44.80 Stream Side Drive, DR 21-049. And it looks like Project Planner Susie Murray is ready to give us the staff presentation. That I am. Let's see. Can you see the presentation? Yes, we can see it, Susie. Thank you very much. So yes, the project before you is actually one that might seem a little bit familiar. It was before you a couple of years ago with a little bit different description. So this time around, it's recess storage phase two. And it proposes two new or three new structures all intended for personal storage, self-storage facilities. There you go. Three new buildings. Two of the buildings are single story adjacent to the existing residential neighborhood that would be on the west side of Stream Side Drive. And then a three-story building adjacent to the creek path. This does supersede the previous residential project. The required entitlements include a minor conditional use permit, which will be reviewed by the zoning administrator, design review that will come back to the board. And we're waiting to determine whether or not we need a hillside development permit, which would go to the Planning Commission. But I do not believe that we will require that because of the grading that's already been done in preparation for the previous project. So here is a nice aerial view of what's going on right now. I think it's probably progressed significantly since this picture was taken. You see that the white truck there is driving on the extended portion of Stream Side Drive and the swath of land between the New Street and the residential units are where there's going to be two single story or where they're proposing two single-story self-storage units. And then down in the lower right-hand corner, you can see just a small triangle of the creek path where those two tractors are is where there would be the three-story building, or I guess a little bit off to the left of those. So here's an aerial view of the project before it was, or the project site before it was annexed, before it was subdivided, and before it was developed. So this goes back about three years. This is just to give some context. There's residential uses across Highway 12 and to the west of the project or southwest. And then on the east side, you have commercial running along Highway 12, the creek path, right below the project site, and it actually intersects the project site, I believe, and then residential development across the creek. This is the general plan land use and retail. I'm sorry, I'm zoning for the property. Let me see.  No, I didn't. The subject property is highlighted in the blue. And if you can see my arrow, it's right here. Its retail and business services is the general plan land use designation, which allows both residential and commercial uses. And the zoning district is general commercial, which also allows these uses. And as I said earlier, it would be approved through the approval of a minor conditional use permit. Here's the proposed site design. I'm not going to get into too much discussion on this because I know I took it from the applicant's plans, and that is in their presentation. But I want to point out here on the right side, which is the southern boundary, is the creek path, just to give you some context. The buildings in the right-hand corner, upper right-hand or left-hand corner, is nearing completion. And then the other proposed buildings are below. Again, I'm not going to go into a whole lot of discussion on these. These are the proposed elevation of the three-story building, which would be three stories. We're facing the creek, and only two stories when you're on-stream side drive. And then when I prepared my presentation, I had received a telephone call from somebody that talked about the bait and switch. They felt like they had been baited and switched on the use going from residential to more storage units. And then they felt very strongly that this use was not appropriate near a residential neighborhood and the creek path. Since then, I've received another email, and it was my mistake that I didn't load it up for late correspondence. So I'd like to read it into the record. This is Dear Susan Murray. Thank you for your virtual neighborhood meeting concerning the above-planning application. And I'll add that that neighborhood meeting was held earlier this week on Monday. My wife and I are very concerned that a commercial project in which the city of Santa Rosa originally required housing be included is being modified to exclude this component and replace it with more storage units. Santa Rosa has a chronic shortage of housing. And the city of Santa Rosa has stated priority of increasing the availability of the housing. Why then having identified this site and project is suitable for housing as it failed? At the meeting, it sounded as though the onus for making the project's housing component work was put on the developer, not on the city. Is this the case? What has been the city of Santa Rosa's responsibility to make the housing component a success? How have they exercised this responsibility? I would be grateful for any information you could share, including any contacts and other city of Santa Rosa departments that have been involved in the project. Thank you. And this is from Steven Reiman. I've also received another telephone call from a neighbor that was, or from two neighbors. One was concerned about pulling out of a driveway down at the hardware store that's just to the east of this project site. And her concerns were more related to the construction activities and the trucks that were parking along Highway 12. I forwarded that concern to the applicant and they assured me that that is being addressed. So no more parking on Highway 12, those construction trucks will get out of the view there so that people can see traffic coming eastbound on Highway 12. Other issues that were raised were construction hours, which is something that we can condition and normally do condition so that when a project is being constructed adjacent to a residential neighborhood, we would deviate a little bit from the standard seven to seven Monday through Friday and eight to five on Saturdays to be more appropriate. Eight o'clock Monday through Friday, usually eight to five or six and then nine to five on Saturdays. And that makes it so people can communicate with their children without yelling in the morning, getting ready for school or yelling across the dining room table during dinnertime. There was also a concern from neighbors along the residential neighborhood to the west that now there's gonna be strangers in their backyard all the time. And we talked about that a little bit and I explained that people will be accessing their storage units from the front and there will actually be a lot less people traffic once those units are constructed and occupied. And we know this through the traffic studies. And the neighbor was appeased by that. They were also concerned about, yeah, people being in their backyard. And again, people generally access the storage unit from the front of the building. I don't think there will be any doors on the backside. So that is it on the public comments and just something to keep in mind when you're reviewing your, or when you're giving your own comments. I want to point out that this is not a project in terms of California environmental quality app compliance. There's no action being taken tonight. So with that, the applicant and the Planning and Economic Development Department are requesting that the design review board provide comments and direction for the recess storage phase two project. My name is Susie Murray for those people that can't see this slide. I can be reached by telephone at<PHONE_NUMBER>. My email address is SMURRAY at srcity.org. I will say, honestly, if you want a quicker response, call me, I do answer my phone. So that concludes my presentation. I know that the applicant team would also like to make a presentation. If you have any questions for me, I'll take them now or later. Thanks, Susie. I think what we've been doing is for concept review, we're holding questions till both the staff and the applicant presentation are done and that way we can get all the questions roped up all together. So if we can move to the applicant presentation, that would be fantastic. Give me just a second here to pull it up on my screen and share my screen again. Oh, wait, that's my presentation, never mind. They both look, they have the same graphic on the front. Sorry. While you're doing that, Susie, I did want to note to staff that on the disclosure form, that's part of the packet, it's blank, which I know that there's another disclosure form that I think we were emailed that had the proper stuff. So probably just a wrong file dragged and dropped into Granicus, I legislate there. So I did want to let staff know that that did happen. Okay, thank you. And I apologize, I'm having a little bit of an issue opening up the... Well, we just checked online and it does look like the disclosure form's available to the public and through legislators. So there might be a glitch on the iPad way, but for the public it is accessible. Thanks for checking that, Mike, appreciate you. And bear with me, I'm just about ready to open up their presentation. Yay! Susie, we're still not, if you have the applicant, it's not up, just so you know. It's opening up right now. Okay. Okay, sorry about that. I was having some issues. Tell me you can see it now. Yes, we're good to go. We need to go ahead. So, sorry, I forgot to mention this, applicant team, if when you start presenting, please introduce yourselves, your company and your relationship to the project, that would be great for the design report. Fantastic, can everybody hear me? We can, thanks so much. All right, great. Well, my name is Reed Hamilton. I am the owner and developer of this project. Our company is American Recess. And it's good to see and speak with everybody again. It has been a little bit of a while before we've had another conversation. Back under kind of some unique circumstances, before I just dive into the presentation, just want to give a little bit of a quick background. As we all know, we've met for the storage project as well as the residential project. We took the residential project all the way through and actually had plans completed and permits completed and have just had absolutely no luck either finding a financial way to build this or sell it. As I've stated before, I'm not a residential builder. I explored even kind of going down that path, but I listed the property with a local broker with permits and hands. And unfortunately, I am several, several hundred thousand dollars in the hole by attempting to try to put residential here. So I understand the concern and our desire would have been residential as well. But unfortunately for economic reasons, we weren't able to find a way to make it pencil. I mean, so much so to the point where I reached out to the city and asked the city if they would prefer to buy the residential project from us and turn it into a low-income housing. And unfortunately, because it's only 14 units, it just doesn't garner enough scale to really satisfy the appetite for people who are going after these projects. So quick background, but with that being said, Susie, if we could, I'm assuming Susie, you're controlling it. Yep. I think everyone knows where the property is located over there on highway 12. Go to the next slide. You know, this is a photo that I actually want us to focus on the photo on the top in the middle with the white truck. That is where we were proposed to have six multifamily units and they were going to be about somewhere between 25 to 30 feet and height with a five foot setback from that wooden fence. So the neighbors to the west there, we're going to have people basically looking at each other's windows with what we're proposing now because it's a commercial use, the setback is now 20 feet and the height I believe is maxing out at 12 feet. And as Susie mentioned, it will be the back of a unit that will have a substantially more landscape buffering it than residential wood. And so just wanted to point that out. We can go to the next slide. Here's the bird's eye view. We're probably a couple of weeks away from completing the lot one storage project there and proceeding to work on the storage. And for us, I've never seen a greater demand anywhere on the west coast than I have for Santa Rosa for storage. I'm very aware of the storage facility to our east that has been approved that will be built and to be honest, we based our design for the building lot two that backs up to the creek off the approved designs for storage bro. Next slide, please. These are just inside the units. Nothing terribly exciting to look at here. Next slide, same with that one. Same there. These are just, these are the single level units. Yep, we can go to the next slide. So this is the one that I think we'll probably have the most conversation about. What we did is, when we met a couple of years ago, we really tried to listen to what the design really board requested. And so the front of our current building kind of looks like what you see here on the back of our proposed building. We tried to make everything look uniform and match, I guess you could per se, also mixed in as I previously mentioned with what was recently approved two parcels over. Next slide, please. Here's just a little bit of a nicer rendering, looking at what it would look like backed up against the creek. Next slide. These are the elevations of the two single story buildings that will be on the west side of the property abiding the residential that we talked about at the beginning of the presentation. Next slide, please. This is what it will look like if you're driving into the facility off a highway 12.  And kind of the same thing, just a slightly different angle, a couple more renderings. Next slide. Yep, same thing. This one you can see on the top left photo where, like I said, there's a little bit more of a buffering. We planted lattices or we installed lattices and are planting vines on the front of the building. So we are proposing that we do that on the back end for the property, for the neighbors on the west side. And then yep, just more elevations and trying to design this thing to look uniform. Here's our color board. Once again, everything looks or we're using the same material, so everything looks uniform for what we're calling phase one. And I think for the most part, that's probably it. I try to keep my conversations as short as possible and answer any questions and just wanna take a moment to tell everybody thank you very much for the time and energy to meet with us again under what we consider pretty unique circumstances. So thank you very much. Thanks so much. So typically what I'd like to do now is open it up to the public for public comment. And then that way, if there's any public comments that spur question for the board, we know we can get those wrapped up. So I'd like to open just a public comment at this time. So if you have a comment on your member of the public, you're attending the meeting, you have a comment, please raise your hand in the Zoom meeting and the recording secretary will recognize you and allow you to speak. And we'll let you, we'll allow you to speak for three minutes as we would normally if it was a public hearing. So I'm gonna let that go for a minute here so if we have any public comment. Okay, I am starting to see some hands raised. Monique, you should be able to unmute yourself if you could please start by stating your name for the record. Monique, we are not able to hear you. Okay, I am seeing that you're unmuted but we're unable to hear you. If you would like to call in, I can provide the phone number for you to call in. You can call in using toll free number<PHONE_NUMBER> and enter meeting ID 812-5014-4897. And it looks like, yeah, we still have, she still appears to be having a technical problem. So I'd love, we'd love to hear your public comment. And so I would say possibly calling in is the best option if your computer isn't working. I know at our last meeting, funny enough someone also had a bit of a hiccup and I think they updated their Zoom client and then they reattended the meeting and it all worked fine. So I wonder if that might be an option as well. So seeing that there are no other hands raised, what we can do then is we can kind of maybe monitor the public comment here and maybe go through the board's questions and see if Monique can get her technical situation resolved. Does that sound good, everybody? I know we all would like to hear her comment. So let's go with board member Birch. Do you have any questions of the staff or the applicant? Excuse me, not at this time, I think the, I was looking for, and this could be directed to staff. I was looking for the explanation on the loss of the residential, that was pretty clear, pretty clearly answered by the applicant. I suppose the underlying zoning remain commercial so there's no real changes there, but that was about it. So no further questions at this time. Thanks, Michael. John, do you have any questions? Not at this time, thank you. Okay, thanks John. Board member Sharon, do you have any questions of the staff or applicant? I do not have any questions, thank you. Thanks, Adam. Board member Wicks, do you have any questions of the staff or applicant? Quick question for applicant, the elevations of the one story East and West show a change in material, but your renderings show them as just being metal sighting, is the intent to use a change in materials? Our intent would be to use the same material that we used on phase one. And so if for some reason that we made that unclear, I think that would be a mistake. I also have Christina Navarro, who is our lead designer on, she probably would need to raise her hand and be able to comment on that in more detail. Chair Weigel, just Sarah Ware, Monique Pearl, the member of the public that was wishing to speak, her hand has been going back up and forth, so they may have permission and availability to speak when you're ready. Okay, so let's do Christina Navarro's first to answer Henry's question, and then we'll loop back with Ms. Pearl. Hi, this is Christina Navarro's. And yes, the intent is to change the type of metal sighting, just to provide the variation and the visual appeal. It's gonna be... Thank you, that's enough. I just, it didn't show up on one of your 3D elevations. So when you bring it back to us for the next level, make sure your renderings are consistent with your exterior elevations. Thank you. Thanks, Henry. Let's go staff, let's go to see if we can get Ms. Pearl connected here for her public comment. Okay, Monique, you should have a prompt allowing you to unmute yourself. And again, if you could start by stating your name for the record. Okay, it looks like it did not work and she has left the meeting.  So maybe, I don't know, hands up again and she's back, let's try it again. All right, one more time. Monique, you should have a prompt allowing you to unmute. And if you could please start by stating your name for the record. Okay, she is unmuted, but unfortunately we are still not able to hear you. She's gonna have to, she needs to change her audio. Monique, it's likely that you're gonna have to change your audio settings when you logged into the meeting. You need to have it accept your microphone. If it doesn't, if you don't accept it, it won't be able to register that it works for you. We are showing that you have a microphone selected. So there's nothing on our end that we're able to do, just wanted to let you know. Michelle and Mike, is the number listed here correct? The toll free number in the meeting ID? Yes, there are multiple toll free numbers that can be used as long as the meeting ID is correct, any of the toll free numbers can be used to access the meeting. Okay, so since we seem to still have an issue with Ms. Perl's microphone on her computer, I would encourage, can we leave this screen up for a little bit and we'll, I'll keep going through the questions from the board. Let's leave that up and maybe she can try to call in while we're doing that and let's just leave that up so she can look at that. So where was I? Was I, Henry, you're done? Questions? Okay, Vice Chair Hedgpeth, do you have any questions of staff or the applicant? Back Susie to staff, I just had a question. I know when the 14 residences were generated, there was one iteration, maybe three years back, they were to the larger building, it shifted to the West. And as you were engaging with the applicant with the new location, were there any discussions or ledgerings about housing, was it going to be marker rate ownership? Was it going to be affordable? Was there anything with the housing authority that was being considered or was that not necessarily in the picture through the journey? The housing that was previously approved was all market rate and there were no deed restrictions. Thank you. Okay, is that it? Warren, three questions? Okay. Yes, that's it. So I kind of had a tack on question about the removal of the residential. I can't remember because it's been so long, but was the project granted a streamlined status because of the residential component? Originally, that's kind of part one. And then part two would be, did that offer any fee reduction or was it just a streamlining of the process? I, the first question is about streamlining. They didn't receive, definitely didn't receive a streamlined process. It was a very long, challenging process to get them through the tentative map process. But what we did, what they also gave us with that project was an easement for O'well when several years ago, when we did an assessment of alternative water sources for the city of Santa Rosa for emergency water sources, this site was one that came in, I think it was the top ranking site, if I recall correctly. And we were given an easement as part of the previously approved project. So because of that, we did what we could to streamline as much as possible because that is a huge give to the city. But again, it was a very challenging project because a lot was shoehorned into this one small site. Cool. Thanks, Suzy. It looks like we have a new phone call, a person calling in maybe.  Star nine will raise your hand and then star six will unmute you. Okay, so we're gonna wait to see if somebody presses star nine to raise their hand. And then if that works, then we'll do the unmute. Hey, look at that. All right. Okay, phone caller with the last four digits, two, one, zero, eight. You should be able to unmute yourself now. Hello. This is Monique Curl, David will hear me now. Yes, we can, thanks so much. Wonderful. Okay, it's Monique Curl. I tried one of the other numbers. I couldn't get it to unmute otherwise. So sorry. It's okay. We'll go ahead and start the clock for you here. So Michelle and Mike, can we get her clock started and let her go? Yes, and Monique, just so you know, we'll give you a 10 second warning since you may not be able to see our screen when your three minutes is almost done. Okay, very good. Thank you. Okay, I just wanted to bring up a couple of things and there's a storage unit just west of Missionary's Hardware. And there's a lot of folks parking on the street in front of the storage unit facility and it blocks the view coming out onto Highway 12. So it's a really dangerous situation. I've tried several times to get onto Highway 12 turning right and without any visibility. And I've seen other people also come into close calls of getting hit on Highway 12. So I feel that that whole strip should probably just be a no parking area so that there's visibility for people to get in and out. That was one concern I had. The other is that there's now, this will be the third public storage in Valley of the Moon, which was initially intended to be a scenic and small business and small residential area, emanating from downtown all the way to Sonoma. So my feeling is that it should maintain that charm and small town feel and promote small businesses and small residential areas. And my final concern is the traffic, if there was a traffic study done for Mission, the Mission in Highway 12, so just that area since it's even closer to Mission and then I live on Brush Creek Road on the other end and that road is getting to be over, kind of overburdened by traffic. So I'm wondering if they could do a traffic study on both of those given the increase in people coming in and out of those three facilities now. And that's pretty much the end of my concerns. Do you have any questions for me? No, thanks so much. We appreciate you. Glad we could get you hooked up here to give us your public comment. We appreciate that.  Do you remember, Susie, do you remember if we had a traffic study for the initial project as part of it or was that not something that was required by CEQA at the time? I don't remember off the top of my head. I suspect it was a traffic memo, but I would be happy if you wanna continue your discussion, it's easy enough for me to find that. Yeah, so if we could just look and see if the original project had something done to kind of address Ms. Pearl's question there because that's something that I can't remember either. And I would wonder if the traffic usage is less now without the residential component as well. So I can, yes, I can say yes, the traffic will be less because of the self storage versus residential, that's the nature of the beast. And regardless of what was reviewed before where this is a brand new project, it's a brand new day, we will be looking at a modified traffic. Like I said, it'll probably be a memo because I don't think the trip generation warrants a full-blown traffic study, but if you guys wanna continue your discussion, I'll go ahead and look and see if we had one last time around. That'd be great, Susie, yeah. And then I guess my other question tied to this, I guess there were a couple of questions that were, no, I think that's it. Yeah, I think that's it. Well, if you change your mind, I can hear you. For sure. And then I would reiterate to Ms. Pearl also, that the cars parking on the street sound like they're related to construction activities. And so, and it sounds like we had another public comment that was sent in similar to that. And I believe Susie addressed that in her presentation. Is that correct, Susie? Yes, that is. And it was actually Monique that I spoke to. And I just summarized her comments with everybody else's. Well, awesome, thanks. So is everybody ready to move forward with comments on the project? Thumbs up? Yes, okay. So let's go in the backwards direction this time and we'll start with a board member Wolski for comments on the project. I don't really have too much. This is just fitting in, I guess a couple more pieces with the same storage and use that's already being built there. I was thinking when I saw this that with these self-storage facilities, they don't have a very vibrant impact. And there's usually no one there except people who come very infrequently to visit their storage. So I was wondering if there's any possibility of perhaps getting a caretaker unit or two added to this facility. And that way there would be some human presence on site that could also work for security and maybe get us one or two housing units. So that's something I was thinking about. I was also thinking also in terms of the security for the back portion of the project, how these facilities sometimes get graffitied because there's no one there. So if there are any security measures put in place, lighting or extra fencing, things like that. And my guess is that the neighbors will find this to be a very quiet neighbor versus the housing which we do need. But yeah, that's what I've got for this project. Cool, thanks, Sheila. Henry, your comments on the project. Yeah, thank you, Chairman Weigel. I've always thought that the residential is a little bit of a force on this project. Sometimes commercial projects and residential can coexist on a site. And in this particular case, I didn't think of it. It worked real well. I like the 20 foot setback between the single story units being proposed. It has a 10 foot high eave line backing up to the residential backyards, which I think is pretty low profile. And from an impact standpoint, I think would be less than what the residential units heights were proposed before. I'd defer to our landscaper on the board for his input on how that 20 foot zone was maximized for kind of livability for those backyards. I'd also suggest a fence between the two units. There's two unloading zones. And I just to keep potential visitors to their storage units from meandering back there, I just kind of put in some sort of a break there to keep them not a secure fence or anything, just maybe a trellis fence or something that would keep people from going back there and that in that particular point matching the previously proposed materials. I think it has a nice look. I think for a storage unit it's very well done and wish the applicant success in moving it forward. Chair Weigel, I have an answer for you. Thanks, Izzy, go right ahead. We actually didn't MND. I don't know why I forgot that or it didn't come to mind immediately. We didn't MND. The trip generation was low enough that it would not have required a traffic study with the residential units. And as I said, I anticipate the trip generation will be even lower now with the storage. So, but it will be reviewed and that will be included when the project comes back to the design review board. Thanks, Izzy, appreciate that. And for anybody who doesn't know when MND is, it's a mitigated negative declaration as part of the CEQA process. So it's kind of the midpoint of the CEQA determinations, if you were wondering. So where were we? Henry and we're gonna go to Board of Members Sharon now for his comments. Thank you. Thanks, and just to confirm that this is going to be coming back to us in the future. Yeah, it is. Okay, just wanna confirm that. Yeah. And yeah, Henry, I'd like to answer some of those as the landscape architect to answer some of the questions for you, but that's one of my questions with the concept is that there's not a lot of detail to it. So, and I know that that's, you know, part of the concept that's I know that it'll come back. We had, when this came before us a couple of years ago, yeah, this is, you know, I was looking forward to the housing. So it was innovative to kind of shoehorn it in here. Agree with Henry also that it's a little incongruous to have it with this kind of project, but it was kind of, you know, I appreciate the innovation, it's worth a try. But I do understand that market can dictate a lot of things. And so, you know, unfortunately, it sounds like some of the realities along with some of the timing economically kind of came crashing down on this. And so, as far as the design, one of the things that we, I'm confident when it does come back to us, that we'll have more detail and enough detail. When we talked about it a couple of years ago, we had some long conversations about the aesthetics of the building, about the design, about doing some nice gestures. I've been watching, I have another project out farther out on 12 and so I've been driving past this for the past few weeks in particular and seeing this rapidly being built and longer than that. But today, just this morning, actually I saw that they were doing the plantings, actually, which is great. And one of my thoughts would be with these plantings to do, especially with those areas between the houses and the new buildings there to make certain we have trees of size. And I saw nice big trees being planted. One of our, the board's feedback for the phase one project was the trellising to make the building as visually appealing and interesting as possible and the angular wire trellising on the building faces is really fits in with the spirit of what we talked about, I believe. And I'm confident that that will be carried through by the project team through this phase two and phase three or the two extra sites. So the buildings, I think they, as far as what you have here fit in well with phase one. We discuss a fair amount in the initial, the previous conversation about that interface with the trail and with the area sort of back of house. And so I'd want to, when this does come back, see some pretty good detail with the, that interface between the 20 foot buffer that Henry mentioned when I would like to see how that's being filled in, layers and also heights. And then on the trail side, also seeing that we had kind of discussed a pretty rich pallet, but then also it was a rich pad pallet to mesh with the existing creek vegetation and also to provide some visual separation and some enhanced kind of security along that side too there. So as it is now in the concept, you have placeholder tree, symbols and so, yeah, when it comes back, I'd love to see how that's going to be fleshed out. Remember we had talked in the first go around about fencing with vines on them, shrubs of various height along with larger trees being planted there and going with the larger tree species with that kind of riparian corridor, valley oaks in particular there, bigger ones. I remember we, Henry, I wonder if you remember this. I think this was the one where we talked about bay trees as well. We had a conversation about bay trees and whether or not to plant them on sites.  It's going with the waterways, plan of matching with existing vegetation and it enhances that security and beauty of your back of house there. So I'll be looking forward to seeing that. But yeah, you guys, I've been doing the work and I'm confident that we'll get something back that looks great. So thank you. Board Member Shannon, this is the applicant read. I had one question that I needed to ask you. Sure. Yeah. Is that an outline of an applicant in the floor? He didn't listen to any of your suggestions previously behind you. I just want to be sure that we take everything to heart. But if you're that serious, then we're ready. You can see that over there. Yeah. Yeah. The body outline. Yeah. You've noticed that. So yeah, this is, you know, home office, but then, you know, home and also involved children. So the child, they didn't listen to me. No, it's a, yeah, you see the skeleton over here as well. We've started to do that. That actually was to, we're, we're doing a craft where we're creating a skeleton outdoors in the, in the mold of his body. So you got to think out of that, but good eye. Yes. So, yeah, if you don't want to end up like that, bring back a good project. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, it's great. I think that's great. Yeah. We'll take that and make it a little more of a white intimidating. We will follow all guidelines. Maybe you can see that. That's great. See, this is what we don't get when we're in chamber. We don't get this. It's good. Exactly. Yeah. All right. Board member McEw.  And you're muted. More. So what I would like to do is defer my comments till I hear the rest of my colleagues. Sounds good. Yeah, I think this is there's a lot of as a concept in a very basic concept level of detail outside of the renderings but but really. Need the landscape plan need the lighting plan need those things will be really required because this is a site that's really about being a good neighbor to. The creek trail and to the adjacent neighborhood to the West, which is as Adam said is really should be treated with care. It's kind of funny in a way the creek trail and the neighbors to the West are ultimately the front of the project on some level and they're really there to sort of be screened and disappear as far as the layout, the completion of the storage facility with the new lower scale buildings than the original building. Is really well done to fit on the site and pallet and materials and and colors is set. Do miss the 14 residential units. I was on the board and if I'm not mistaken and it was referenced to it earlier. There was an even earlier iteration of this project that had the residential up on. The highway and it was an interesting concept at that point in terms of mixing residential and commercial and using that residential to. You know, I'm going to say screen the commercial project, but going back to the caller who talked about highway 12 in the Valley of the moon. The idea that the appearance from the roadway was one of residential and the commercial project live behind it. I believe this was the same project so that I that I really like I felt great about. I did not see the piece with the residential in between creative, but it would be kind of a strange sliver to live on between, you know, a tall building to the to the east and backed up to a neighborhood, which is not unusual to the West. So, as much as I miss it, I think they've done a really good job here of squeezing more of the commercial out of the site. And as long as we get those detailed drawings, and there's talk about mature plantings more mature plantings and a really good plan for the creek and the neighbors. I'm supportive of the project so. Vice Chair henspeth you're up. Thank you, Chairman legal guess I I've been contemplating this whole situation about the transition the history and and I think it was said well by Michael birch that it had an intrigue to it architecturally with the housing in front. And the shift to move that housing to create better site plan accessibility and maybe in the end of the day. The bulk and size of the mini storage struggling with residential and families living in the residential had a struggle to it and it was a bit surprised me when I saw this application it was it appeared that things advanced. I understand the economics, particularly in construction pricing. You know, a part of me is torn between well. Many storage is doing very well and they generate revenue. The idea of a security party going about their ways, looking at a large facility versus having. As board member Wolskie had mentioned the idea of an onsite unit. I'm torn between that it's it's kind of like a singular housing unit. Many times we've seen these in the past. They're singular on a where the housing unit is out in front stream side what's interesting is it through street. I don't think there's there's gates that roll across. Maybe the applicant can correct me, but for fire safety fire trucks happily can go down stream side access the units that are there and come in. And in a very interesting way as far as the fruits of the project. Those people that live on stream side and having double fire access best their their life their insurance to some degree so it's it's an interesting way of a capitalization of a project, allowing fire truck access. And it just seems so big for me now I I embrace a lot of what. Board member Wix has said and that is that it's this it's basically a cluster of commercial. Buildings they're scaled and the sensitivity of credit the applicant of trying to have more fighting weight buildings. Nudge against the residential and at this point I'm willing to look at this thing knowing the circumstances it's very informative and helpful and so my points are we have better fire access. I would have loved to seen residential in the front but it's it's not that use. I can't be one or anyone on the board. Taking land use which allows for commercial and prohibiting a commercial use knowing what's happened there. I only wish projects like this were more evident in other parts of town you don't have to drive to destination senior Highway 12 to get many storage is just one sad thing. And so I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I just wish that how close these are to community services. These sites are that I'm saying that the zoning allows for this it's it's happened. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.  This project from it's an its inception always have the storage facility upfront and the residential in the back along the creek and adjacent to the neighbors on stream side drive. that stream side drive or just assure you that stream side drive is a public street, a through street, and it will not be gated. So, thanks Susie appreciate you. I don't have any comments other than what's already been iterated, except maybe reinforcing Henry's comment about that fence in between the two westerly buildings just to kind of try to create a buffer which and then, you know, robust mature landscaping.  But I think once the applicant explained everything about how they can't seem to get the housing to pencil. You know, I'm sympathetic to that, and particularly because he, you know, it seems like they made a good faith effort to try to go down that path and they just hit a brick wall, it seems like. And so I think ultimately, the new buildings are more diminutive in scale, and will likely just kind of disappear to the adjacent large building and they'll kind of probably flow into the residential neighborhood next door.  Because they're not open at night, generally. So anyway, those are my comments. So board member a cue your last. Well, what I would like to say is I endorse the comments of my colleagues, and I'm supportive of the project. Those conclude my comments. Thanks john appreciate you. So that being said, does anybody have any final comments hearing something from anybody else, Adam. Just one to that I forgot to and was was sort of alluded to by some of the other board members but with plans that do come back. I'm making certain that we have some idea of specifically the fencing that you're going to be doing. So just have some kind of we as a board like to see the fleshed out designs for that materials, you know, general ideas. So it's something that we can approve and also kind of, it's good to have something to push back on, or, you know, give feedback. So no other thoughts. So with that being said, I think it's safe to say that we can move on to item 9.2. And Susie, or sorry, does the applicant have any questions of us, or staff have any questions before we move on. Sorry. This is read I do not have any questions just thank you again for the time energy and effort we really appreciate it. Just thanks for coming back and we'll see you when you have your full package and just make sure you have everything on the checklist that we would normally like to see. Absolutely, we'll do our best. Thanks so much. Consequences if we don't. Yeah, a blue outline. Okay, so we're going to move to item 9.2, which is a concept design review for Colgan Creek design reviews 3011. So DR 21 040. And before we move to Monet, I would just like to disclose that I met with the applicant. We can have to go two weeks ago. And he shared with me kind of the direction that they had taken things and just was asking my opinion about how to better tell the story about the project site to the to the board so they can understand kind of the history of what's happened it's a. It's a fairly old project from what I gathered from the applicant so there's some parts and pieces that I think you guys need to hear that are important and so we talked a little bit about that and so I encouraged him to share that with us and so we'll hear from them. But with that that said, we'll go to Monet for the staff presentation. Thank you chair and good afternoon. I will share my screen and turn off my camera so be me a second. Okay, there you go. So we can see your presentation. Yes, great. So, again, thank you and good afternoon, the Colgan Creek presidential project located at 3011. And you might remember the design of your board review this item on August 19. And it was recommended that the project be brought back for concept design review with additional information to clarify project details. And the proposed concept is our review is for the future development of 65 to story attached single family units with attached ad use on an approximately 4.5 acre parcel within the Roseland priority development area. So here is an aerial view of the project site as it is today, and the site is pretty flat trees. As you can see the Colgan Creek is located along south of the site. And this is a neighborhood context map. There are some large vacant lots in this area properties on the south side of the Bellevue Avenue or outside of the city limits. The residential development was approved on the north side of the project in 2018, you can probably that this map is too old, but if you drive there you can see them constructed. And the LCA Allen High School is located between the walking distance from the site, and there are lots of residential on the east side. So here is a broader neighborhood context map that shows the project site plan with surrounding uses and streets. There are several residential projects on the review in this area and or they're under construction. The project site is on our tree 18, which is consistent with the job land land use designation, which is a medium density residential and multifamily or attached single family dwellings are allowed in the zoning district. Here are some pictures of the existing lot. As you can see the lot is pretty flat and there are no trees on the side. Also, those new constructed houses are on the north side, you can see them in some of the pictures. And here is a site plan that shows the proposed 65 lots with the proposed streets. Each single family unit would be about 1029 square feet. And each accessory dwelling unit will be approximately 706 square feet. The graphic would enter the project site from the middle drive and the project will also include improvements to the trail along the creek. And here is the conceptual landscape plan the applicant will discuss this in greater detail during their presentation. And here is the front elevation for the proposed houses. Here is the color palette and some of the proposed materials. I will defer to the applicant for more detail details. And here are the elevations for all sites. And again, I will defer this to the applicant for more details. And here is the sample of the concept landscape plan for the private open spaces for each residence. And here are the overall emails for the previous meeting. I haven't received any recent ones. And the main comments and concerns were about traffic impacts in the area lack of enough parking spaces between the neighborhood. Infrastructure concerns were regarding water issues and police availability within the area and overpopulation of the area while our limited number of parking or open spaces are available in this area. I have a concept design review and staff will consider these comments during the review when the formal application is submitted for this project. And this concept design review is exempt from California Environmental Quality Act because no decision has been made today. The applicant and the planning and economic development department are requesting that the design review board provide comments and direction for the Colvin Creek project. And that was my presentation. The applicant also has a presentation. And here is my email and my contact number for anyone who wants to contact me. And that was my presentation. Thank you. Excellent night. So we're going to go ahead and just roll straight into the applicant presentation. So if you could bring that up and then applicant team just a reminder, please introduce yourself. When you're speaking so that we know your relationship to the project. And we'll, without further ado, we'll roll through to that. And then we'll do a public comment after that, just so everybody knows. Order of operations. Good afternoon board and board members. My name is David Colombo. I'm the architect on the project. Company and great design located eight or four college and then at this location for 14 years, I've seen a few changes in that time. I have with me also Charlie Travolse, who is the land developer on this project and he will be speaking also. And our landscape architect Parker Smith was unable to be here today so I'll be presenting his portion of the landscape plan on the project as well. As the chairman had indicated, Charlie had met with him the other day to have a conversation because last time we met when we were talking about this project. To be honest with you, my hands were tied. We were not to talk about the history of this project where it's at where we're at currently with the project. And so, in fact, it left you guys at this advantage of that lead with our case in my mouth about how things went. Given that we weren't able to tell you the full history and status of this project towards that currently. So I'd like to just walk through a little bit of the history, the idea of what project is currently where it's been. And where we're out of this project. So if we go to the next slide please. So I'm going to show you a series of images that talk about the Colton Creek Park in relationship to the Colton Creek Village project.  And it ties to the high school to the west and also ties to the community park to the east of that meta. At some point in time. There were some negotiations that went on in Charlie this week is more detail that went on about the city wanting to increase the size of the park and there was some neandering elements. And the only place that was going to come from was this project, the Jason project which probably should have been burdened with it as well. Found out about it before, before the decision for me and then ultimately they weren't burdened with the loss of property as this project was to give creek to create your to the project. So we can go to the next slide. 2015. You can see that the creek has been reconstructed it's in the final phases of being manicured. I went from a straight linear creek to basically a meandering path creek. And there is this mounted area that you see that is to the west corner southwest corner of the property. There's a dedication that was given to the city as part of the negotiation after many meetings with the creek committees. And so they were happy with what they wanted. And that is to start to drive the actual development of this project. Next slide please. Roll forward another six years. You can see now this is actually the delineated finished creek path. There's a bus stop that's located at the entrance to the pathway on the east side on that meadow. The Lantana project to the north of us is under construction. And as you can see the common way which is the most weathered most western street along Lantana. Dead ends both to the north and the south and we will be connecting to the southern side of that. And then to the north of Lantana. There's currently a project that's in development that will also then continue the common ways through to the north of the existing developments and I'll talk about that in a second. So you can see that there's been a loss of land for the project, but in the time that this thing started and towards that now, there's been a fair amount of change. So I'm going to go to the next slide please. So one of the issues that was raised last time we're here was there's a confusion about the community access at the travels and the adjacencies and where things really work so this map shows us a larger detail what's really adjacent to the property. So in the east of us we have the Colgan Creek Community Park, which wraps around that easterly side of the property. We have of course the LCL High School to the west to the most normally portion we have the Southwest Community Park. We also have the Meadowview Elementary School. So this is a protected bike path along the entire length of that meadow, with the exception of the new concrete area from the Lantana project. So there's a full path to travel from that school all the way to this project to the west of us, the common street that starts on Bellevue, adjacent to the high school site goes up and the east of the situation and ultimately ends at the common look property line between the community park and the Meadowview Elementary School. So we, we do have connectors and walking paths to community parks and so one of the comments that was raised that we don't have enough parks in the area and I would count that say for an area that is this size for this project we have a lot of people around this area that actually benefit all the development and the way that it's laid out and our connectivity to them gives us the advantage to use those as adjacent. Next slide please. So here we have a few site elevations just for context. You can see the dedicated bike path that currently exists in the upper image. This is the back yard of the Lantana project with the small single story pieces and then the second stories of their unit. The lower Colvin Creek path location point for this is that the divider between the creek and our project is a split rail fence system. So we're going to do that in a minute when we get to the land state plan as a connectivity and then for reference and for the architecture of the Jason project. I wanted everybody to see what the Lantana project looks like because at our last meeting, there was recommendations or suggestions of architecture, particularly. And this is what the project immediately looks like. So I think it's important to see it in context with our proposed design. Next slide please. So this is the development plan as was mapped in a tentative process that started back in 2003. And it was approved by the city council on the plan commission in 2005. Correct comment 2005. For the unanimous approval by both plan commission and city council. So five years of time it took to go back forward to the creek committees and development. The design of this map property for the tentative map took into consideration the eyes on requirements of the creek. We have an adjacent path on this property that's adjacent to the split rail fence. And if we look at the site you see there's that pink area that's representing the current path in the park itself. And it's a split rail fence. And it's a split rail fence. And it's a split rail fence. Immediately to the north of that it's a split rail fence as a divider between them and this project. We have a connected a gravel pathway that actually runs to the west of the property and goes up through a landscape here to the north along side of the common way development. The parks department so that we can actually have people that are living in this zone and be able to use that park trail as well to the linear access. This is an R 318 project. And I think it's important to know that while the presentation says what our net properties today we actually started with five and a half acres of land and close to about a point for a roughly or fighting fighting. Five eight seven acre was dedicated to the city to allow that articulation of the creek. And we benefit from it of course because we have eyes on to it. But also it was a loss of land that was actually part of the project. On this development plan also you'll see that we have parking this property with the R 318 has a minimum parking ratio of two and a half to one. We exceed that by an additional 14 spaces for total of 177 163 is what's required. So we're actually over parked. And quite honestly, that's one of my biggest pet peeves with development sexy happen so we don't provide enough parking. And in this case we met more than a minimum we haven't asked for parking reductions. We haven't asked for any benefits that will allow higher density on this project. But we are providing parking. And I think it's very important that that's that's recognized the development itself, when we look at the actual units. Each property contains a covered garage has parking on site, as well as the additional parking spaces that are on the street. So that's where the combination of the hundred seven seven from. And at that point before I jump in to the next part of the site plan, do you want to talk about the history of the city? Charlie Troublesy, it's almost a lifetime we've been working on this project. But I'll make a long story short. The reason it took five years from the time the application was deemed complete to the time we went to Planning Commission and City Council was because there were so many different iterations that the city looked at, especially regarding circulation and the creek. Those were the two big issues. So on the circulation, the waterways committee and the engineering department and the planning department concluded the best course of action is to have the road, cold and creek drive running parallel to the creek and thereby achieving the eyes-on concept from the homes looking out onto the creek as well as keeping the creek open to the community and not backing up to the creek like many subdivisions in the past were designed. As far as the curve linear concept, the channel, it used to be a, I worked at the water agency for five years. I was very familiar with the channel network and it was a concrete trapezoidal channel. And as you know, in the last 20 years, the trend has been to go back from the concrete trapezoidal look, rip out the concrete and create as much of a natural recreation, if you will, of what these creeks used to look like before they were channelized. And that included meandering as much as possible, adding landscaping and opening up the creeks to the community by providing nice wide walkways. If you go out there any time of day, you'll always see people walking and biking with their family or with their pets all along that stretch as well as further east and further west. This is a small part of the Coleman Creek linear channel that was started up towards the northeast near Hearn and goes up to Stony Point Road. So we went back and forth. They concluded and we negotiated an area that made sense for all of us. And one of the things they told me was, don't forget Charlie, it's true you're giving up a lot of land, but that would be an amenity to the project. It would be a park that's right there for the residents or the future residents to use. The other circulation element was another what they called also part of the linear park is Common Way. That's the north-south street that runs along our westerly property line and then northerly up through four or five other projects that are located to the north. Ryder Homes, which is under construction now and has opened up their model homes, which is northwest of us. Money perhaps you can go back to the overall circulation plan just so that other members can keep up with us since I haven't memorized already in my head. Anyway, so the conclusion was to keep Common Way as a linear park area and meandering walkway where the street will be incorporated along with other projects north of us. The city also requested that a bus stop be placed just immediately north of our property line in the northeast corner. That bus stop is already installed. We were conditioned, both ourselves and the Burbank project to the north were conditioned to put in the bus stop. Basically the city transit department was saying whoever goes first puts in the bus stop. So Burbank just finished up. People have moved in and the bus stop has been installed along Dutton Meadow just north of our site. So I just wanted to give you some background there and we proceeded after the approvals to get our improvement plans are signed. Our final maps are ready to record and we went to the city and talked to them about the ADU idea about a year and a half ago to make sure that everything that we're proposing is in conformance with both the city as well as the state regulations. We submitted the footprints. We submitted the floor plans. The city took a few weeks to make sure verbally we were told very quickly it's a yes. I insisted on getting something in writing because frankly we're going to spend a fortune on well not a fortune but a lot of money on architecture. Sorry Dave. And we wanted to make sure that what we were designing is indeed in conformance with what the rules and regulations were and the response was yes your setbacks are good. The ADU square footage is good. We decided to stay less than 750. Your footprint is acceptable. Your setbacks are acceptable. Proceed accordingly and we did. We did the working drawings there into the city. We did one round of plan check. We're doing another round now and here we are with concept design review. So there's a lot of things that we'd like to accommodate the concept design review group's comments on. There's a lot of things where that ship has sailed if you will. So with that I'll turn it back over to Dave. Thank you Chair. So here we go to the next slide please. So this is a overall site development plan that will give us context of the creek realignment to the adjacency of the property and the eyes on to the creek as well as the adjacency to Lantan and to the north of us. It's just for context that you can see actually how we are related to the areas around us. Next slide please. I just want to step through the basic floor plans so that you understand what we created here. This is a tight project. The architecture has to be designed such that we could be as efficient as we could. So we optimized the spur footage for living space and not for dedicated hallways and loss of living zones. So what we have on the ground floor and this seems contrary to what you might typically think but all over 80 use around the ground floor. And what's in them? They each have two bedrooms, two baths. They have interior laundry facilities. They have an exterior storage, a trash enclosure area. They also have access to parking and the driveway. They have covered entrance that goes into their unit and they also have access to the common backyard which we'll talk a little bit about at the landscape in front. Next slide please. The second story units which are being referred to as the main dwelling units have again a private entrance if you will. It's shared front porch but they have their own set of stairs coming up to basically a three bedroom two bath. Again, interior laundry facilities, trash in the garage. They get the parking space. They also have access to the backyard shared area. So for a unit that's this size, we have amenities that you typically wouldn't see in apartment type dwelling. As an example, one of the projects I was being saw where the units were two bedrooms for families gave them balconies that were basically 35 square feet. The backyard areas that we have for these units, the common backyard area is about 250 square feet. We'll talk more about that the last day. But the units are designed to be as efficient as we can and a row housing type. There are a lot line property configuration. So this is a four plex. The development has a series of four plex of what are researchers of four plex combination five plex six plex throughout the project. Next slide please. So on the architecture, some of the things we talked about in the last meeting was some of the articulation of the project. And so I went back and looked at it. We've made changes to the patterning, the siding and so forth. The roof lines pretty much were set. I did make a couple minor changes. I'll talk about those in a minute. But as we look at the front of this unit where the garage doors are at, we actually have a large overhang area there and you can see it in the section elevation on the left side where it's a covered area. So that covered roof area so we can provide security for the entrances and so forth. That softened overhang is lit with recess lighting. But adjacent to each of the entrances, we also have a swing arm lamp that identifies the entrance locations. Each unit has a ductile split type heating and air conditioning system in it. So that's something that's not generally given in most cases for smaller units like this. But we've articulated the architecture so that we have in essence the look of, in essence, four different units. The reality is we have two floor plans, some are forward, some are reverse. When we look at the foreplex interior elevations, this would be the interior courtyard elevations. So if it's an A unit, it's always going to have a board and bat. No matter where it exists on the property, it's a board and bat siding combination. If it's a B or C unit, it's a horizontal type unit as far as siding goes. Next slide, please. In listening to what the board had to say last time, I added two things to these elevations. One, after changing the architectural patterning and so forth, this slide was important to put the fence on there and where there is landscaping. And I'm going to talk about the trees that are in those when I get to the landscape plan. But I wanted to see in context the street elevation in relation to the side of the building, the fence line related to the adjacent neighbors to the north, and then also on the side elevation, what's the street elevation applied from an articulation standpoint. We did add some high windows in the back bedroom units that are up high or the transit window. I just added a little more interest to the back of those portions there. But they're high also because we are looking at the backyards that are legally to the north of us. Those windows would only occur in that north lake property. The rest of the project does not have those windows in it because literally they would be sitting face to face with the next building over and so we decided not to do it in those locations. On the corner lot elevation, we increased the articulation of the gable roof sticking out. Otherwise, it would have been an eyebrow. Like we see on the roof plan on the right-hand side, because it's a small eyebrow roof out there. Just add more element of the side of the architecture in that location. Next slide, please. On the landscape plan, we worked with Parker Smith on the landscape design. We talked about how important it was to make sure that we had plantings that were appropriate, given that it is a tight site, but also to be sensitive to the fact that we do have, in a lot of cases, four neighbors sharing an island in landscape. You can see that in the center section of the property where we actually have four units that are back to back and there's a large island area there of landscape. I want to get to the details. She will talk a bit more about that, but also it's important to see the context relationship to the creek as it is currently today. There is an existing path on the creek. We are also putting in a path immediately adjacent to the creek, whereas the entire development has a standard concrete sidewalk, but in the area immediately adjacent to the creek, it drops back to a crushed granite path. Two locations will allow us to step through the split rail fence and connect our crushed path with the walking path of the creek. There's interconnectivity for our residents as well as people who want to use that park. They can actually have access to that direction. When we look at the landscaping in general, the site currently has zero trees on it. When it's finished, we will have over 250 trees on this project. That's important because it means that every lot in this site has anywhere from three to four trees per lot. What makes this unique is that we are actually landscaping the backyards in a standard single family arrangement. It's not required. It's not really demanded in the building process review, but in this case, we are landscaping the backyard as part of this development because it's the common area. It needs to be done that way. One of the things that Parker had articulated on was that in the common backyard, when we look at a, let's say for example in the center section there, we've got 21, 22, and then 27, 28 back to back. The landscaping is such that the trees that are most adjacent to the fence line are actually a evergreen tree. If 27 has the immigrant as the evergreen tree unit, the opposite diagonal unit has the evergreen tree. There's a screening of the evergreen trees between the properties and then a deciduous tree that's inside the actual courtyard as well as some kind of column or evergreen that's in that area as well. So the idea is to create as much of a greening element in those yards, but yet good privacy between between those by the by the fact that they are immigrant catchers. The average corner lot has anywhere from five to eight trees on it on the corner site. So that numbers basically almost a dozen lots have that type of situation. Next slide please. So this is the common corner lot with the adjacent unit. And I think I'm going to ask to go to the next slide because I think the black line needs a little better to describe what Parker has here. So one of the issues that was raised last time was the articulation of the entrance. And so what we've done is we've actually changed the concrete pattern to create a common pathway to the front entrances that go to the covered areas. We've already stepped into the covered portion of each of the units. We've actually added landscaping at the face of the garage between them in that area. So it kind of softens that look as well. And in the case of the trees, if you look at the unit to the left, it's shown with one tree in front of that window. But if you look at the Aster site plan, you'll see that occasionally there are sites where there are two trees in front of a single unit versus just one. So there it is. It is an stagnant design and it varies throughout the front. So we've articulated in the front to identify pathways so people know where the front doors are. That combination with the wall hanging lamps, our street addressing, I think it's pretty clear where the entries are at without having the front door sitting out on the side of one. When we look at the backyards, as I mentioned earlier, we have not only a combination of deciduous and non-dissiduous trees, but there are also some findings that's put on the back in the fencing. The majority of the area in between the units is a concrete surface. There's been discussion of possibly making it permeable, but it's not required as part of our drainage requirements for the project. And then there's Mark Mulch and some other type of landscape cover that's in the back of the units between the fence and the backyards. The average corner lot is, like I said earlier, anywhere between five and seven trees on the side, and they're in combination with deciduous and evergreen trees. All of the landscaping is low water use, very important today, and that the, yeah, so that's it for the last day of time. Next slide, please. So on the architecture, we went back and listened to what was said about the heat island effect. We had originally black roofs on this project. We've gone back to a, and I know on my spring, it looks like they're brown, but actually they're both a gray series, two different types of gray and two types of shingles patterning, and that with the four color combinations, these color schemes, they will be mixed throughout the project, to give us as many variables as we can in the architectural scheme. I know last time there was a question raised about it looked like we were missing roofs, and you can see now the roof directly over the garage is the actual covered porch element that I described earlier. So with that, that's pretty much what I have to say, but I know Charlie has something else in the summary about the project in general. So in conclusion, I'll share with you some thoughts and some discussions I've had with many people that have looked at this project. Let's start with what it's not. It's not a single family project. It's not an apartment project. A friend of mine described it as it has the the pluses of an apartment project without the minuses. What are the the pluses? You have effectively one neighbor upstairs and the ADU downstairs. So it's more of an individual kind of lifestyle as opposed to living in a 300 unit apartment complex. Because you have a unit downstairs and a unit upstairs that share that common entrance area, it provides you with an opportunity for extended families, if you will, multi-generational families to be living together, but not under the same roof where there's only one kitchen. There's two separate units. There are two separate homes. The grandparents can be downstairs, or if they're siblings upstairs, downstairs, and still have their own separate homes. It doesn't have the negatives of apartments where you have the elevators, the large hallways, especially during these times of Corona. I've got six friends that are living in apartments and they immediately told me, given the choice with equivalent square footages, they would rather live in a place like this where they basically have one neighbor upstairs and they could say hello to the other neighbors as opposed to being part of a giant apartment complex. Half the units have their own yards. Half the units have covered parking. You don't find that in apartment projects. And again, it's not a single family project where the yards are obviously not as big as a single family home. However, because of the density, you're able to bring down the cost to have them function as a reasonable dollar amount when it comes to renting them. I don't want to use the term affordable by design because lately there's been a negative connotation to that. One thing we can agree on is if you have a 1,500 square foot unit, it's going to rent for more money than 1,000 square foot unit if they both have a three-bed two bath. So you can say more affordable. You can say less expensive. But the bottom line is the market dictates that the smaller the square footage, the less one charges for rent. So whatever expression you want to use, bottom line, it's going to cost less money to rent a unit like that than a unit that's 1,500 square feet, for example, in square footage. Overall, I think this living element is more attractive than living in an apartment complex. Our location helps a lot.  We're lucky that we have the parks nearby. We're lucky that we are walking distance to the high schools. We're lucky that we have a bus stop immediately next to us. We're going to be doing full landscaping in the backyards and making it as pleasant as possible for the people living there. So it's sort of a hybrid. Or as a friend of mine told me after a couple of drinks, a missing link, I don't know about that. But it's a hybrid. It's not 100% anything, but a sort of, I don't know if it's a newer idea, but it's not very common. Let's put it that way. And David and I are here to answer any of your questions. Thanks, Charlie and David, for your presentation. So at this time, I'd like to turn it over to public comment. And so we'll go back to the, we're looking to see if anybody raises their hands here in the Zoom meeting to make public comment. Looks like we have one. And so I'll turn it over to you, recording secretary. Great. Thank you. PalomaW2277, you, I'm getting a prompt saying that you are using an older version of Zoom. So I'm unable to give you speaking permissions. You have a couple options. One, you can call in using the phone number that is posted on the screen, which is<PHONE_NUMBER>. Meeting ID is 812-5014-4897. Or if you log off and then update your Zoom and jump back on, you would be able to have speaking permissions then. So Michelle, I think hearing that, that they've got an old version of Zoom, we're going to let, give PalomaW2277, the opportunity to either call in or update their Zoom or call in. And so I'm going to bring it back to the board here. We're going to do our questions and comments. And actually, could you leave that screen up so the phone number can stay up there in case they want to call? Just like we did before. Yeah, that'd be great. One moment. Board Member Wicks, can you fix your camera angle or, we just want to make sure that all board members, we can see your face. Otherwise, if you need to leave, you can always turn your camera off if you need to take a quick break. I have a feeling Board Member Wicks was stretching. Okay, so let's bring it back to the board for questions of staff and the applicant while we leave this screen up here for the public to either call in or install a new version of Zoom. So while we're doing that, I'm going to go to questions of the board. And so Board Member Wolski, we're going to start with you this time for questions of the applicant and staff. I was hoping to get confirmation for the non-corner units, the interior units. What is that yard size? I thought I heard 250 square feet, which I didn't come up with, but just looking for some clarification on that. Then that's it for me. So you cut out a little bit. I want to make sure I understood this so the applicant can work on it. You're talking about interior, so between the units, the yard size, is either on one side of the fence for the ADU below and the single family on top, that how big that is and not both of them together or both of them together between the Hs, I guess. Right. Yeah, just one quadrant of the islands that I think it was Mr. Colombo was speaking about. Does that make sense, David, to try to get a square footage on that one? Actually, I'm going to take it right now. Okay, cool. Go ahead. So the large area of the square footage is 213 square feet, and the area between the building and the rear property line is now the 45. So this is a 253 square feet. I said 250 earlier, but it's 258. Cool. Thanks so much. Does that answer your question, Sheila? That's cool. Any other questions? All right, questions. Board Member Wicks. Thank you, Chairman. Yes, I was stretching, and I thought if I turned my camera off, I'd get in trouble for not being a part of the meeting. So I let an arm be seen. So anyway, apologies on that front. I think this is the only project. I think I've only missed one meeting as a board member in the last two years and some odd months. And this is one I haven't seen before. And you guys have probably flushed out most of the things that I am going to ask, but sorry for being redundant if it was asked at the prior one. It could be for applicant or staff, but is it my understanding correct in that the off-street parking is two as required by code? One needing to be covered and one can be uncovered for the ADU? So I can try to answer that. Okay, the parking requirement for multifamily is one covered and one for every one half parking spaces. And ADUs do not require parking if they are between half month from a transit area or transit bus stop. Okay, great. So given its location, it's not required to be on-site. So the, but the potential, actually this goes back to the applicant then. The question is, and it'd be helpful in the next iteration if you gave us a parking plan and showed us where the parking lays out on the site. At least it'd be helpful for me. I'm not sure if the other board members need it, but I would like to see a parking plan.  Hey, Henry, I'm going to, before the applicant jumps in, hey, Monet, could you bring up page seven of the, there we go, or you paid your eight. This was, this is the tentative map, right? Which shows the street parking in addition to the, sorry, I missed it too. And then I saw the tentative map and I was like, Oh, it's on there. Gotcha. Recap, yes. We're showing the on-street parking on that diagram. And there's a space and every driveway for a car. And there's a covered garage. And yes, tandem parking is also counted as parking spaces for the city's calculus. Great. Thank you for that clarification there. I'm also assuming there'll be an HOA assigned to this project. There was no requirement for an HOA because there's no common areas for the HOA to maintain. How are you going to maintain the garage is not being used as another bedroom? We'll have deed restrictions prohibiting that use. And who's going to enforce it? I guess that's a rhetorical question. I just, I'll save it. I'll save my last little bit for comments about the project, which is fairly simple. Other projects we've had the requirement to have glass in the garage doors so somebody of enforcement capability could look to see what it's being used for inside. That's my question. Thanks, Henry. So I think at this point I noticed on the participants there that we do have Paloma Williams back. So Michelle, do we want to go to her and see if we can get her to comment for a public comment? Absolutely. Paloma, you should have a prompt allowing you to unmute. Hi, can you hear me? We can hear you. And if you could please start by stating your name for the record and then your three minutes will begin. Okay. My name is Paloma Williams and I attended I was a high school. I just wanted to commend the idea of keeping the nature aspect and all of the projects and the nice wide walkways that were being talked about earlier. I think it's fairly nice that we're trying to keep everything looking nice while keeping the nature aspect of it. And I also wanted to commend the Halloween decorations that were shown earlier. I think you were very creative and that's all I have to say. Thanks so much, Ms. Williams. We appreciate your comment and we're glad that you can get that worked out with your technology. So I'm going to bring it back to the board now and we're going to go to Board Member Sharon for his questions of staff and applicants. I don't have any questions. Thanks. Cool. Thanks, Adam. Board Member McHugh, questions of staff and or applicant? Yes, I'd like the applicant to share with us why they chose a particular color palette that they're using for the complex. David or Charlie, do you want to answer that please? The Binder on the project, which is Synergy Homes, has used this color palette on several of their projects and the occupants and the buyers of those projects thought it looked very positive and that's why they chose to use that mix. Now with that said, when I saw the screen pop up, it looked like I looked at Dave and almost killed them because it looks like we have various shades of pink. So I know I'm half colorblind, but Dave is confirming to me that indeed they are not pink. They're more gray. So I just state that just as a technical observation, I don't know if you guys or your group, when they look at the screen, are you seeing pinks or are you seeing grays? I'm seeing grays. Okay. So it sounds like you have perhaps it's our monitor then. So I just wanted to confirm that. I guess my interest is it's kind of bland to me and I would like a little bit more color. It's just me. I guess it just seems that it's just pretty bland. The other thing is how does it, with the development to the north, how does it match with what their color scheme is? I mean, you don't have to match, but I was just curious if you took a look at that or what you did. Yeah, we did. Actually, the color scheme, if you look back at the site image that we showed from the street side of the Lankana project, at the moment, their buildings are painted kind of this off the white color tan and then kind of a sandy tan on the bottoms in that combination. So this is a different color palette. The lower right hand corner of that site. So they're more earth stone colors on their project to the north. Okay. Thank you. The other question I had, are these market rate or are they affordable or is there a combination? Their market rate, but because of the size of the units, the rents will obviously be lower than many other projects out there that are market rate because of the score of footages, but they are market rate. Okay. Thank you. Thanks, John. We'll go to board member Birch now for questions of staff and applicant. Yeah, I don't have any questions. Cool. Vice Chair Hedges. I had a question of applicant here. Firstly, on the stormwater management system, how are you addressing your groundwater retention in this project? Sorry. We have a series of trenches that are running parallel to the curbs behind the curbs. I would say about 70% of the curb area behind it has a trench system for stormwater storage. Because this project was approved so many years ago, the concept of having individual retention ponds did not apply like it would today if it was a brand new project. So, back then, having your storage trench areas behind the curb was acceptable and that's how we did it and that's how it was approved by the city. I'm going to jump in here. What we're seeing here is, is that the double dotted line? Behind the sidewalk area on this plan? No, no, the plan you had there, Monay. Yeah, that double dotted line there. Is that the trench you're talking about? Yes. Another question as well. I want to go to the ground floor plan in your quads. This question is, how are you addressing light coming into the key living room, kitchen area? It also bodes for the second floor, but the bedrooms have windows facing the street. There's some facing the courtyards, but the question was, in both floors, whether your ADU is above or below, the stairwell in the garage are the wall and that stairwell is being private to feed the next level up. I assume there's no glass there, but what are you doing to address lighting the living areas in the project? Well, that's a good question, Warren. Our good friend and plan checker, Mike Enright, was the first thing that he questioned, how do we meet that requirement? So, we went through and showed the analysis of the adjacent lights, the windows that we have in the lower floor plan, which basically is the front door and side light area at the entry, the back door and side light with the transom window over top of it, your fishing area and part of the requirements to make sure that we have full light penetration from that area into the dynamic location is that we have no upper cabinets or anything that, you know, impedes more than 50% of the wall area in that location. And in that case, it takes care of the lower floor. The second story is exactly the same thing. The difference is that we have extra windows on the second story over top of where the entry door is currently. There's a window in that location, as well as the windows over where the rear door is next to the kitchen. So, we ran through both the analysis. We actually exceed the minimum 4% of ventilated area. 8% were actually closer to the 5 and 10, which is a little code for light ventilation. And we've satisfied the proximity of the light into those open spaces. Is that skylight band you have on the second floor? You can see the roof plans. Is that skylight? Okay, I'm sorry. Maybe I was so much hungry for light that I was turning solar into skylights on a personal well-being level. Since you're talking about Michael Inwright, I know there's a quest for trees and creating trees. In the overall site plan, those interior, if you go back to the site plan, the captured, yeah, I guess you could use the landscape one, but the captured units that you're having a courtyard in, if you're in any of those bedrooms up there and there's a fire, apparently there's just enough squiggle room in between these units. You're doing standoffs. Instead of zero lot line, you're trying to between fire codes and setbacks. I'm almost concerned if you plant trees in what I consider the side yards and the trees get big, I just I'm feeling comfortable in a bedroom facing out to the public street, but those interior plans, it's a bit of a conundrum on how those bedrooms that share the court are able to feel comfortable with such cozy neighbors. So that's a question. It's in the review of the plan check that hasn't been raised as a concern. It is a tight space in those backyards. I understand the windows. You're basically you're capturing that rear elevation is almost 100% lined out except for facing up to DeBurbank. I'm almost looking at the entire ability or execution here of all north elevations. He don't have the window slots almost anywhere. It's only facing Burbank as you say. So as you say, the whole situation about fire separation, it's not really a multifamily. It's kind of single family that somehow in climbing roofs and getting it out of places, there is a standoff area in that the main you notice your zero lock lines have a bit of a standoff. I definitely find the units that are facing outwards that have the windows. I would certainly increase windows whenever you're facing out and not being I'll use the word tandem with anyone else. To my comment about windows that that should be an area to really create breathing that I just want to comment here is that there's a couple of you have these kind of four packs and there's a bit more separation. So I'm only commenting here that that separation for easements, drainage, whatever is I can see perhaps why trees weren't used in there because going back to Charlie's comment about drainage and susam, those kind of a biscuit yellow colored areas that don't show trees in the landscape plan. It could very well be a drainage area and an area for accessibility is afforded there that I could jump out of a couple of courtyard second-story bedroom, somehow get down there and not that I'm carrying a chainsaw with me like firefighters cutting through fences, but there's a there's a way in between this where it's not completely relentless that break is there maybe it's about seven or eight feet. So I'm just thinking of it on that level that maybe the city's kind of had the same I'll use the word examination. Yeah with the exception of the units that are actually back to back I'll refer to every other unit as being an end unit and that effectively is about a third of the project is actually has the same window configuration as on the side elevation that we presented in the actual architecture. So they're two-thirds of the buildings back to back the windows meet the minimum requirements for light ventilation. The other one-third has way over that when you look at the side elevation with the extra windows. The bedroom configuration is always a challenge if they don't have an actual side yard. You know we do have one, two, three, four different locations where where as you referred to the the tanned areas between buildings those actually have windows in those areas as well. In the interior the four plexes we do have some areas there that are that are snug there's no question on. Okay those are my questions. Thanks Warren. I the only question I had was about bedroom three pretty much on the second floor. It seems kind of awkward dimensionally to me and I'm wondering I'm wondering if you guys looked at I don't know like the an entry to the bedroom like on top of the staircase north of the water heater. I don't know what the head clearance would be at those steps but I'm wondering if that made sense and then I don't know or half of it's a storage room or something like that it just it seems really like you talked a lot about efficiency of spaces and that's the most inefficient room in the whole project so that would be my question. Well to be honest with you it's an oversized bedroom there's no question about that but given that if that is truly the primary I kind of see it being an extra family room versus a bedroom but for a marketing standpoint actually have an extra bedroom you know somebody could look at that say that's the master even though they don't get to use the bathroom the same as the other room but you are right is it is actually a bigger space than unusual but it has the ability to be multi-used right then. And then I guess did you think did you think about you know locating the closet in a different location that would allow you to have glazing on both sides as opposed to I think that would really probably neck it down too much wouldn't it probably make it like eight feet wide or something. It would actually be less than 80 wide if we did that. Okay yeah so then I guess I wonder I wonder if you could put a Clara story like you know you put a cap on the I don't know it's just maybe that's a comment not a question but anyway I was just saying a Clara story on the courtyard side but you'd have to limit the height of the closet and that becomes problematic so anyway okay I think that's done about anybody other final questions staff and applicant before we go to comments. Sheila what's up? My question is would the rear yard setbacks be different for this zoning district if the ground floor was not an ADU? I think staff could answer that but I guess my tie-on question to that would be since the plat map was approved before the inclusion of ADUs did that necessarily apply right because it was a small lot subdivision that was just a an H shaped unit right before the ADU component got added if that makes sense did I get that right Warren I saw you nodding your head you're muted. I'm sorry yes I'm familiar with similar projects which have a lifeline they have a cycle where extinction isn't there there's a saving of the map the map is accepted and then when you have policies on top of that the post tubs fire which has become more or less permanent about what I call a ghost ADU what that means is that you can implement the ADU status and the reason my questions were centered on life safety was that if the the ADU that is born given birth to on a site merits life safety is allowed is that too long the answer I think it's worth staff maybe hunting down Sheila's question but within the confines of because the ADU was a like you said it's an addition to what was already kind of set in stone when it comes to the to the tentative map so I will try to answer ADU requires four feet setback right now and the site zone R318 I'm looking at our zoning code right now it says the button if you are next to R3 also zone the site interior setback for one story portion five feet but if you are next to R318 it's going to be zero so mainly it says if you are next to R318 zone your setbacks can be zero it seems based on what I'm looking at right now I need to pay more attention but if you are next to a multi-family zone your setbacks can be reduced to zero so then I guess maybe maybe the applicant can answer this uh David what's kind of a baseline setback across most of these small odds I'm going to interrupt David Forsack that was the exact question uh that we went and asked the city a year and a half ago which is the footprints that we're proposing are they acceptable and what Monet said is exactly what we were told by Bill Rose and Mr Connor since we're an R318 district and we're surrounded by R318 whether you have ADUs or not the setbacks are zero the forefoot goes into effect if you have let's say an R1-6 project where the typical backyard for example is 12 or 15 feet then the ADU trumps that and says you're allowed to go within forefoot of the property line of the neighbor versus the 12 or the 15 but since we're R318 different set of rules again whether we had ADUs or not you could go to zero on all sides back so except on the front because you have PUEs and minimum setbacks from the sidewalk go ahead Warren I would only caveat that zero is allowed except the building code and life safety will trump that you cannot zero zero if all your bedrooms have to face out to escape and right away and life safety so you must comply with accessibility and livability um over superior over zoning yeah so that's so that's why I guess that's why I was asking the question of David I mean it doesn't look like there's a like actually zero lot lines it looks like there's maybe four feet five feet on most of these so I'm curious what I'm just curious what the actual setback is for most of the scenarios that we're talking about aside from like the party wall that's separating units you know what I mean right so the standard rear setback is three feet okay does that answer your question Sheila or did we dance around it enough okay cool um so I think we'll go to comments now on the project and I'd like to start with board member Birch this time so you get the hot seat Michael great well you know the lot a lot of context added in this presentation and I appreciate that there was uh and there's there's an much more adequate amount of detail um much more clarity to the drawings and and I will share that uh between the transom windows the driveway paving scheme the the the the siding combinations the color combinations this presentation really rose to a level that it is easy to assess and understand and it's much appreciated by at least this board member so um I think the context that you're able to set the the creek project and its impact on this project um was was was really good context for us the um I continue to feel that the I understand the affordable by design or affordable by size but I'm still the unit the project is so tight in terms of these units I know I know it's not necessarily our purview to look at plan layouts unit layouts but I think we're in looking for superior design as part of our you know really charge with um as the design review board it you can't help but have the exterior bleed into the interior so some of the comments around fire life safety those are going to certainly be addressed by by but in permitting in building permits um it's still the the unit plan still feel tight to me but I will say that the exterior of the project and the friendliness of something that's this tight in trying to bring housing to San Rosa I can understand the level of quality you're looking at and I feel much better about being able to give the project a positive nod and a push down the road than I could from last presentation so I appreciate all the upgrades to the materials I appreciate the gestures toward breaking up some facades with finish uh with with varying siding and um I would hope that you can uh sail forward from this and get this project built well thanks Michael um board member McHugh you're next but do you want to wait to the end again okay no I got you you want to wait to the end you're good we'll do you at the end uh so we'll go to board members Sharon now thank you um and uh um yeah thank you uh mone for um great presentation and for the applicant team for coming back and showing us again and um I don't know if uh Paloma is still here um on the the call but um also just wanted to give her a little bit of a shout out um great to hear um one on the ecological perspective and speaking for the Greek and um I appreciate that perspective and then also um just kudos for um having um a high school student coming and being engaged in the process and being here um the this is a forum for everyone we all get a voice um so really appreciate that and uh um I will also tell my son that you like his Halloween decorations and what he's doing to our house so appreciate that as well um and he will appreciate that seven-year-olds like getting little shout outs and um for adults to take themselves a little less seriously so thanks um uh and uh it's good I'm going after um Michael because my comments are very much in in the vein um of his comments um yeah I feel like the the context that you've given the story that you've told this go around um is very very much appreciated and really gives um good context to the the journey that you've been on um with this project um and it's been a long one um and uh yeah really appreciate um you sticking with it and I do think that this this gives um me much better uh view on your thinking your design thinking um I appreciate um the changes you've brought us and I appreciate the um tweaks um and little addenda that you've had to that your um designs um and uh yeah just the the only um criticism is also just feeling the tightness of the layout and the tightness of the design but it's partially um knowing the story that you've uh lost some of your square footage of your lot and I know that you're trying to um to get as much out of the site as what you have now and that's changed from when you originally um started with what you have um but I do feel that you're being sensitive to the area um yeah they appreciate the context both for us and for the public of uh talking about the surrounding area the parks on the parking um the access points and um uh yeah I look forward to um approving this and um I do wish you well and uh I do think that um some of those livability concerns will come through in the permitting process so um thanks that'll do for me thanks Adam and just heads up this project will not come back to us unless uh staff elevates it because it's a residential project so did I mean did I say that it was coming back I didn't I didn't you said you said you go forward to approving it and I was just gonna reiterate that it doesn't come back to us yeah oh sure you know I just spent tonight of giving giving it a yeah we don't have a vote on anyway it's fine I'm just I'm playing uh oh yeah and it's it's true it's true um yeah so we're gonna go to you board member thanks Adam yeah uh we're gonna go to board member wicks now so Henry you're up thank you chairman um I you know I the the density and the the tightness of the units for some reason um I think I'm okay with it I think I think the I think the um I think it just fits a need it's kind of maybe a little bit of a niche market that it's gonna gonna um appeal to um the the the cost of the units by the square footage being what it is is obviously a a a market driven uh could be a market driven success um agree with my fellow board members that spoke before me and won't won't go over those but I like most of everything that they said and would uh wholeheartedly agree I think I think Warren's um quest and hunger for more light in the units is my only actually I got two two kind of comments that I would like the architect to consider um you know working some skylights on the upper level units for the family room to give some natural light or where Drew was going I I think that that bedroom number three you could shorten it doesn't that outside wall doesn't have to line up with the outside wall of the garage it could pull in four feet in either direction you could relocate the water heater you could use a you know tankless water heater for that matter and capture that space and be able to move the door location going into number three and making it a little bit more of a proper conventionally proportioned bedroom and what that would gain you is the exterior light on either end of it I'd prefer to see it try to creep towards the family room and rather than the kitchen end but I I just encourage you to consider taking a a strong look at that minor little revision to the plan by either skylight or by um increasing the window area by shrinking that bedroom number three the other thing is I think it should be even though we're not voting it on it and condition it I think the the windows into the garage doors should be a requirement of the project and if it could be worded in the sales that it's to be garage only so somebody just doesn't doesn't start using it it's going to inevitably probably going to happen but since parking is critical in this and the street parking is fairly small the tandem parking with uh making sure those garages are being used as garages would be uh something I'd like to kind of drive home and make sure that it gets carried through the life of the project and wish you success with it thanks Henry um board member Wolski comments so um I'm still struggling with this project um with with the layout of it it's as the other many other board members have mentioned um it's tight and you know I think there's there's a difference between you know meeting zoning code standards and and then what we're doing is trying to you know make it work well in the neighborhood and create a sense of community and with having you know two units for these really small lots and in the very minimal yard space I'm struggling with that I'm not going to you know try to hold this project up or anything like that but for me I have a difficult time with that um I do appreciate the um efforts that were made to design all four sides with the transom windows and adding some pavers I think that will help the project um but yeah that's that's where I'm at this one thank you thanks Sheila um I'm going to go to vice chair Hedgepath now and then we'll go to you John sound good okay uh so Warren you're up yes yes I'm going to thank you um yeah I really appreciate all the comments board members have I don't think there's anything here that wouldn't enhance the project um remember McHugh was spot on about the colors I think a project this big is beyond bland with gray it's just a sleeper I think the colors should be more vibrant they should be more lifelike they should cue you sorry for the pun to a creation of a bit more of identity these these four plexus if it's going to feel like an adu and sell like an adu singular you should have five to six different color arrays and and the hues should really jump jump don't give me a dust gray and a cold gray and an ice gray please um let me get some some colors here I love the the comments about skylights above from uh board member whips the the other comments in general about the fact that it is tight we're leaving it that are all on deck and this whole question about stairway chairman we know that you would come up with our apropos and that they were taken in so with that um chairman liable I think I'm I'm pretty much complete I think the more glass and bedrooms are great I almost thought it'd be great to have glass garage doors keep them tidy and glaze it all the way into the darn kitchen I'm done bye thanks Warren uh board member Brinke you're up yes my singular issue is the color I just think that the the the color palette is just bland and you know I I agree with uh you know my share heads heads best that you know we ought to spice that up a little bit and and be a little bit more uh be a bit more creative with uh with the colors I also endorse the comments that my colleagues have made with respect to other aspects of the project and the particularly with the third bath bedroom upstairs doing something to make that uh maybe just a little smaller and you know to to make it not as for lack of a better term uh uh bear as it is and so those are my comments so thanks John appreciate you um so I I have a couple of different comments I think then from what I've heard from everybody um I'm I'm gonna I think I made these comments last time and I actually also told Charlie this one I met with him um but if you're using hardy siding or a fibrous cement siding there's lots of options available other than horizontal siding and board and baton and so um I I think that maybe on some of these that have the have the waist belt of the you know the band maybe the siding changes above the board and baton maybe there's there's an option that just has board and baton you know vertically um and so I think there's you know I I understand you have an A a B and a C so you know by saying the A's are this the B's are this and the C's are this I think it's fine but from what I'm seeing it looks like A and C are the same and and B is different or whatever and so if you have an A B and a C the the palette of the material on the outside should vary between the three unit types whether that's board and baton siding on the bottom on the A transitioning to a fibrous cement shake on top at the at the waist and then on the B's maybe you have just board and baton siding that goes all the way up which I understand there's a transition problem potentially they might have a line so I get that because hardy siding only comes in like eight foot lengths so I get that um and then maybe like you know C is this the horizontal siding so I'm wondering if that is a potential way to also add some some variation without changing or really adding cost to the project um then another thing that I've noticed that I noticed is while I think there's efficiency in the fenestration on the front of the four plexus I actually think there should be some variation in the fenestration so for instance the uh you know like the two windows in the middle are double windows what if you went to triples on the outs that come forward that are on the bedrooms to add more light to the bedrooms right and that also breaks up the massing a little bit of the front elevation to create some variation in window type even if you're utilizing you know uh you know vinyl windows or something like that probably are so I think that might be something you need to explore in terms of you know triple windows versus double windows you know what else did I have and then I also agree about the color I think Warren's right I think you need about six colors not four and they need to be more vibrant I do appreciate I did tell Charlie this too when we met I appreciate the change to a gray asphalt shingle roof I think long term you're going to be glad you did it because that black asphalt shingle is just the worst on the planet in my opinion let me see and then I guess the other thing that I wish we could have seen and I should have mentioned this to Charlie when we met was a design of kind of some of the fences between some of the the properties and things like that I don't remember really seeing this other than you know Dave's kind of just shown us kind of a vertical wood fence here but I wonder if there shouldn't be something a little bit more interesting maybe it has a lattice on it I don't know but it would have been nice to have that as well and I know that's going to be required for final design from the zoning administrator so that's it from my oh and I agree with the skylight thing too I was thinking of my wheels were spinning on skylights and how how can you actually run a solar tube from the roof in a wall all the way down to the first floor I was kind of wondering how you could do that yeah so I'm going to summarize what I heard from everybody else as well so generally I think everybody understands the context of the project and the history and I think we appreciate that and I think that helped it definitely helped me when I heard it so I'm glad it sounds like it helped the board as well I think we all agree that it's tight but there's not a whole lot we can do because of the tentative map being in place and also plan check kind of happening happening concurrently I also heard skylights for family rooms windows into the garage and then more vibrant colors you know so that's primarily what I heard from everybody yeah good morning you just muted yourself you were I'm sorry I just I I know chairman you've you've seen this yourself but when you have a single occupancy residence and you don't have another property above you you can relight you can take glass block and other things and you can go literally from the second level and relight the ground floor through that level there there can be a scrim or you can have obviously frosty glass but it's it's literally possible in the firecoat living living on living because you're on the whole enchilada to relight the downstairs you've seen it it can be done yeah but you know since they're going to potentially be too yeah I was just that's why I was scratching my head I'm like what if they rents it to two different families or what if you sell the 80 to one person you sell the top unit's valid for anyway yeah just it becomes a challenge I think so so summarizing the comments does anybody have any additional comments they'd like to make tack on anything I said that was a little bit different a disagree with something I said because you're welcome to if so just give me a little hand raised no we're all good okay so so typically what we do at this point is ask the applicant if any of the comments seemed outside the realm of possibility to address and then double check with staff to make sure that they've heard all the comments to make sure that that gets incorporated for the zoning administrator so um David and Charlie do you guys have any questions about what you heard from the board uh first of all I'd like to thank you for listening to our presentation because there was a lot of history that needed to be told about the project I think to bring everything into context and and and writing down two three four five said the eight different items um into consideration uh the colors certainly we will have a conversation with the synergy group and talking about adding more colors I don't disagree with you at all warrant about uh then being more vibrant um and certainly that's something that we can look at and having more combinations is not a bad thing so I don't think there's an issue um on the siding I we can take a look at some of those things I don't have any issues with looking at the more articulation on the siding aspect of it um like your comment about being southern mixes of combinations so I'm certainly open with that uh windows I do not disagree with you at all I think we can you know articulate maybe some of the windows but adding skylights will actually bring more lighting into the other units with that question um and so I will be looking at that I'm not going to give those guys that choice on that option you know since I'm the architect I get to decide that right um but um and then in regards to bedroom three uh I'm going to take into consideration what you said I mean even though we're in plan check we have an opportunity to do something with that there yet um maybe the closet changes maybe we're able to you know throw out the water heater and and put the closet partially over the stairwell or something and more windows there so I'm I will definitely be looking at that that aspect of it and skylights certainly um cannot be a bad thing for like interior bathrooms and some of the other living spaces whether it be a full skylight or sun tubes um I like the idea of being able to do for like the ground floor more unfortunately the fire codes would make it extremely presbygistic I think to put in fire fire glass wall fire glass floors but I do like the idea that it's pretty cool and then the windows in the garage door certainly that's something that could be a consideration um again it's we'll have to have the discussion with the uh with the synergy group to make sure that you know they're okay with something like that um just I know we don't typically apply those type of standards to just stand up straight out single family dwellings but um when you got a group that is managing projects like this and taking care of you know bringing the tenants in and managing that I don't think they would ever let the garage conversions happen um a project like this that would be really odd to me if that happened uh give it the type of project that it is but certainly I think that's uh David you just said something that uh reminded me of something I asked charlie and maybe you can confirm this for me this is a for rent project entirely it's not a for sale project correct that's correct it's going to know that they're yeah does that answer your question a little bit better henry good since it's is there and is there going to be an onsite manager as part of the deal in one of the yes by law it's not required sorry by law and onsite manager is not required but they're already discussing which unit they want to put the onsite manager in they want to have an onsite manager there but all units will be rented yeah that helps and I and I wasn't envisioning a you know firehouse glass doors uh David I was I was thinking just a row for monitoring so I I just wanted to say thank you for your comments and this has been quite a therapeutic experience for me so you're much cheaper than the regular therapists out there so I appreciate that too well we're happy to help charlie appreciate um monay and uh do you have any questions of us in terms of what we've outlined do you think staff is good to go in terms of the comments to for the zoning minister awesome uh any any other any comments about what we outlined yep very clear okay cool awesome so uh let me double check here okay uh it looks like that concludes item 9.2 being a concept item and so that means we are on item 10 which is adjournment so uh everybody have a great evening and a good weekend and we'll see you next time thank you very much happy morning bye everyone