Welcome back everyone to theCUBE and the Dhruva special presentation of why ransomware isn't your only problem. I'm John Furrier, host of theCUBE. We're here with W. Curtis Preston. Curtis Preston as he known in the industry, Chief Technical Evangelist at Dhruva. Curtis, great to see you. We're here at why ransomware isn't your only problem. Great to see you. Thanks for coming on. Happy to be here. So we always see each other events now, events are back so it's great to have you here for this special presentation. The white paper from IDC really talks about this in detail. I'd like to get your thoughts and I'd like you to reflect on the analysis that we've been covering here in the survey data, how it lines up with the real world that you're seeing out there. Yeah, I think it's the survey results really, I'd like to say that they surprised me but unfortunately they didn't. The data protection world has been this way for a while where there's this difference in belief or difference between the belief and the reality. And what we see is that there are a number of organizations that have been successfully hit by ransomware, paid the ransom and or lost data. And yet the same people that were surveyed they had high degrees of confidence in their backup system. And I could probably go on for an hour as to the various reasons why that would be the case. But I think that this long running problem that as long as I've been associated with backups which has been a while, it's that problem of nobody wants to be the backup person and people often just they don't wanna have anything to do with the backup system. And so it sort of exists in this vacuum. And so then management is like, oh, the backup system is great because the backup person often might say that it's great because maybe it's their job to say so but the reality has always been very, very different. It's funny, we're good, boss, we got this covered. Backs up, the fingers crossed, right? So again, this is the reality and as it becomes backup and recovery, which we've talked about many times on theCUBE, certainly we have with you before, but now with ransomware also the other thing is people get ransomware hit multiple times. So it's not only like to get hit once. So this is a constant chasing the tail on some ends but there are some tools out there you guys have a solution. And so let's get into that. You have had hands-on backup experience. What are the points that surprised you the most about what's going on in this world and the realities of how people should be going forward? What's your take? Well, I would say that the one part in the survey that surprised me the most was people that had a huge, you know, there was a huge percentage of people that said that they had a ransomware response in readiness program. And you look at that and how could you be, that higher percentage of people be comfortable with their ransomware readiness program and which includes a number of things, right? There's the cyber attack aspect of responding to a ransomware attack and then there's the recovery aspect. And so you believe that your company was ready for that and then you go and I think it was 67% of the people in the survey paid the ransom, which as a person who, you know, spent my entire career trying to help people successfully recover their data, that number I think just hurt me the most because you talked about reinfections. The surest way to guarantee that you get re-attacked and reinfected is to pay the ransom. This goes back all the way to ransom since the beginning of time, right?  And you're in business, you're a good customer, AOR for ransomware. Yeah, so the fact that, you know, 60, what, two thirds of the people that were attacked by ransomware paid the ransom, that one statistic just hurt my heart. Yeah, and I think this is the reality. I mean, you look back and even the psychology of the practitioners was, you know, it's super important to get back and recover and that's been around for a long time, but now that's an attack vector, okay? And there's dollars involved. Like I said, the AOR, I'm joking, but there's recurring revenue for the bad guys if they know you're paying up.  So again, it works both ways. So I got to ask you, why do you think so many organs are unable to successfully respond after an attack? Is it because they know it's coming?   Why aren't they responding successfully to this? I think it's a litany of things, starting with that aspect that I mentioned before that nobody wants to have anything to do with the backup system, right? So nobody wants to be the one to raise their hand because if you're the one that raises their hand, you know, that's a good idea, Curtis. Why don't you look into that, right? Nobody wants to be responsible. Where's that guy now? He doesn't work here anymore. Yeah, but I hear where you come from. Exactly. Psychology. Yeah, so there's that. But then the second is that because of that, no one's looking at the fact that backups are the attack vector. They become the attack vector. And so because they're the attack vector, they have to be protected as much, if not more than the rest of the environment. The rest of the environment can live off of active directory and, you know, and things like octa so that you can have SSO and things like that. The backup environment has to be segregated in a very special way. Backups have to be stored completely separate from your environment. The login and authentication and authorization system needs to be completely separate from your typical environment. Why? Because if that production environment is compromised, now knowing that the backup systems are a significant portion of the attack vector, then if the production system is compromised and the backup system is compromised. So you've got to segregate all of that and I just don't think that people are thinking about that. You know, and they're using the same backup techniques that they've used for many, many years. So what you're saying is that the attack vectors and the attackers are getting smarter, they're saying, hey, we'll just take out the backup first so they can back up, so we got the ransomware. That makes sense. Yeah, exactly. The largest ransomware group out there, the Conti ransomware group, they are specifically targeting specific backup vendors. They know how to recognize the backup servers. They know how to recognize where the backups are stored and they are exfiltrating the backups first and then deleting them and then letting you know you have ransom. Okay, so you guys have a lot of customers. They all kind of have seen this problem. What's the patterns that you're seeing? How are they evolving? What are some of the things that they're implementing? What is the best practice? Well, again, you've got to fully segregate that data. There are, and everything about how that data is stored and everything about how that data is created and accessed, there are ways to do that with other commercial products. You can take a standard product and put a number of layers of defense on top of it or you can switch to the way Druba does things which is a SaaS offering that stores your data completely in the cloud in our account, right? So your account could be completely compromised. That has nothing to do with our account and it's a completely different authentication and authorization system. You've got multiple layers of defense between your computing environment and where we store your backups. So basically what you get by default with the way Druba stores your backups is the best you can get after doing many, many layers of defense on the other side and having you do all that work with us, you just log in and you get all of that. I guess, how do you break the laws of physics? I guess that's the question here. Well, because that's the other thing is that by storing the data in the cloud, we do it. And I've said this a few times that you get to break the laws of physics. And the only way to do that is time travel. So yeah, so Druba has time travel. And this is a courtesism, by the way. I don't think this is our official position, but the idea is that the only way to restore data as fast as possible is to restore it before you actually need it. And that's kind of what I mean by time travel in that basically you configure your DR, your disaster recovery environment in Druba one time. And then we are pre restoring your data as often as you tell us to do, to bring your DR environment up to the current environment as quickly as we can so that in a disaster recovery scenario which is part of your ransomware response, right? Again, there are many different parts, but when you get to actually restoring the data, you should be able to just push a button and go. The data should already be restored. And that's the way that you break the laws of physics is you break the laws of time. Well, I had never wants to know the next question and this is the real big question is, are you from the future? Yeah, very much the future. What's it like in the future, a backup recovery as a restorer, is it air gapping everything? Yeah, well it's a world where people don't have to worry about their backups. I like to use the phrase, get out of the backup business, just get into the restored business. I'm a grandfather now and I love having a granddaughter and I often make the joke that if I'd known how great grandkids were, I would have skipped straight to them, right? Not possible, just like this. Recoveries are great, backups are really hard. So in the future, if you use a SAS data protection system and data resiliency system, you can just do recoveries and not have to worry about backups. Yeah, and what's great about your background is you've got a lot of historical perspective, seen that in the ways of innovation. Now it really is about the recovery and real time. So a lot of good stuff going on and automated things got to be rocking and rolling. Absolutely, yeah. I do remember, again, having worked so hard with many clients over the years, back then we worked so hard just to get the backup done, there was very little time to work on the recovery. And I really, I kid you not that our customers don't have to do all of those things that all of our competitors have to do to try to break the laws of physics. I've been fighting the laws of physics my entire career. To get the backup done in the first place, then to secure all the data, right? To air gap it and make sure that a ransomware attack isn't going to attack it. Our customers get to get straight to a fully automated disaster recovery environment that they get to test as often as possible. And they get to do a full test by simply pressing a single button.  Yeah, I mean, it's a big part of it. Data's in the middle of it. All this is now mainstream, front lines, great stuff. It's great to have you on, bring that perspective and thanks for the insight, really appreciate it. Always happy to talk about my favorite subject.


What does Islam tell us about political engagement? This is a hot topic that many Muslims ask Should we as Muslims living in the West should we engage in politics? Should we vote? Should some of our youth run for office? Should we lobby with certain political groups? political parties Individuals should we financially support political campaigns and contribute To political campaigns This is a question That is posed and we see that there is a divide. We see there's two opposing views one view states that we as Muslims living in the West should abstain from politics We should have nothing to do with politics. We should not vote. We should not run for office. We should not Support or endorse any political Candidates or any political campaigns. Let's stay away from politics. Why? because these governments are oppressive governments they have occupied our countries and They are supporting tyrannical regimes. This is one view This is one camp there's a great percentage a good percentage of the Muslim community and even in the Shi'i community who have this opinion that political engagement is It's forbidden. We should abstain from political engagement. This is one view on the other hand There's another view That says that we live in this country Those of us that are citizens if you live in America, you're American if you live in Canada, you're Canadian if You live in the UK your English if you live in Australia.  You're part of that country.  Who doesn't pay taxes?  Is it that considered supporting an oppressive regime?   Most of us pay taxes That support for these governments.  This is a double standard. Look at the logic of the Quran Look at the logic of the Quran and you will be able to decide which view is Most in accordance to the Quran. You be the judge The view that says let's abstain from political engagement or the view that says we should engage in politics In our countries look the Quran says in Nalla You know You want to sit and complain of Islamophobia that we Muslims don't have our rights in certain states. They want to ban the niqab.  Why do you put the blame on others?  That Allah will not change us unless We make change for ourselves. We change ourselves and then Allah will say I'll give you a push And I will support you The Quran says Say act produce contribute Make a difference Each human is judged based on his efforts The effort that you make to change yourself to change your family to change your community To change your nation to change your country it's based on your efforts A famous hadith by one of the imams. I believe imam Islam doesn't say that you cannot engage in politics engage in politics even if you work for the sultan But there's a cost the cost is that you help your brothers and sisters you help your community Worked for the worst tyrant for the worst dictator haroun al-rashid he worked for him Ali ibn iqtayn was his minister And several times ali ibn iqtayn would ask al-imam al-qadam should I continue working for her for haroun al-rashid or should I stop The imam would tell him continue work Work for haroun al-rashid, but serve your brothers and sisters Work for the shi'a work for the shi'i community Work for haroun al-rashid, but don't oppress anyone but at the same time serve the shi'a community This is a lesson that we have to engage in politics voting is important my dear friends Voting is important. This is a right Why do you forfeit that right when you don't vote when the muslim community don't doesn't vote Political candidates are not going to cater for you.  You sit at home. No one's going to cater for you. No one's going to care for you No one's going to care for your rights They're going to say, you know, who cares about this community because they don't make a difference. They don't contribute to political campaigns and they don't vote We need youth to run for office if we want rights In these countries in canada in america in the uk in europe In australia in new zealand, we need our youth to run for office to fight for our rights To go out and fight for our rights. No one will fight for your rights other than yourself


Santa knows where all the best toys are, and this December, many of the Hunter smartphones are just a penny with service in Appalachian Wireless. Stop by your local Appalachian Wireless to check out all of the great smartphone deals that consistently top the nice lists. This Christmas is truly going to be bigger and better than ever. Better service, bigger savings, that is. That's today's Appalachian Wireless! Kentucky Route 550 in Knot County is closed indefinitely due to a potential mine blowout between the mousy and lackey community. The Kentucky Transportation Cabinet Highway District 12 was notified about 8 o'clock last night of water coming from three different areas along a stretch of Kentucky Route 550. The road was immediately closed and still remains closed to traffic until further notice. According to the Division of Mine Reclamation and Enforcement, the water is coming from a mining operation that has ceased activity but still has an active permit. The Division of Mine Reclamation and Enforcement will cite that coal operator and it will be that company's responsibility to abate or fix this situation. Even though the small waterfall beside me doesn't look like much, officials tell me it has dangerous consequences. There are hundreds of mine shafts in this mountain and millions of tons of water under here. And all it would take would be a wall collapse or a roof collapse or some incident underground to take these little spickets of water that are coming out now and just blow out the side of the mountain. One family was evacuated from their home due to safety concerns. At this time the American Red Cross is paying for their lodging. Detours will be signed in Hindman at the junction of Kentucky 160 and Kentucky 550 and in Lackey at the junction of Kentucky 7 and Kentucky 550. I know it's going to be an inconvenience for people during the holidays, but until Mine Reclamation and Enforcement gives us assurance that there's no imminent threat, we cannot reopen the road. It just simply isn't safe to do so. At this time, barriers are in place and personnel will be stationed at each end of the closure around the clock. Reporting in Knot County for EKB News, I'm Shelby Steele.


What's the word y'all welcome back to Kenny for real I didn't expect to upload a video to them be honest with you I just uploaded one 12 hours ago talking about how stressed we were as fans and two of the teams that we talked about being stressed made a deal today. Yeah we're talking about Laurie Mark and he was one of the last big I always put that in quotation marks because I like is like marketing a big name for agent and a class of 2021 maybe he's one of the last big free agent dominoes to fall a lot of bulls fans knew that this day was coming but we weren't 1000% sure especially when you look at what's going on with the 76ers where they said they're willing to bring Ben Simmons back and I was just so afraid that the perfect trade or the right trade wouldn't come around for the bulls so they'd be willing to bring Laurie marketing back even though he said to the media I want more money I want to be a starter I want a new look on a different team basically the stuff that Ben Simmons camps are talking about you know I'm saying so I was a little afraid as we slowly get closer and closer to camp that Laurie marketing might been on my team and I'm happy that he's not and I don't mean that in like a negative term I don't mean that I hate Laurie marketing or I don't think is a solid basketball player I legitimately just think like I said with some of the other videos we've uploaded recently the relationship had run its course and it was time for player X to get a new organization and it happened starting off with woes he came out with a tweet Cleveland is required in Chicago to strict the free agent Laurie marketing on a four-year 67 million dollar deal on a sign of trade now I'm be honest with you when this broke I was in the shower I was in the shower and I was like yo all right now the Cavaliers in the bulls have been rumored that they've been talking for the last couple days and that kind of left bulls fans loving the idea of Larry Nance Jr. ending up in Chicago unfortunately it didn't end up that way but I was super excited when I saw Cleveland I was like oh Larry Nance is coming to Chicago let's get it so it for the next two to three minutes while I was in the shower I was just refreshing my phone and then we finally got the full extent of the trade and it turned out to be more than just a two-teamer we got a three-team deal that landed the bulls dare Jones Jr allowed to protect the first matter from Portland a 2023 second round of that is from Denver and then the Cavs get Laurie marketing and the trailblazers get Larry Nance Jr. so no the bulls did not get the Larry Nance Jr. piece that I wanted but I am super happy about this trade but we're gonna talk about that I want to start off with the bigger name the biggest name associated in the straight and it is Larry marketing considering it started off as the Larry marketing designer trade so let's talk about Cleveland's offseason or Cleveland's moves because I am still trying to wrap my head around it as I record this this trade happened about 30 40 minutes ago and maybe it'll start to make more sense as time goes on but at the moment I'm like bro what is happening a ton of front-court players and not even just a ton of front-court players a ton of front-court money tied in now I think as this came out that Laurie marketing this deal is looks a little bit different than 467 where there's like some incentive so technically it's like four years and less money out of but you still you pay you pay Jared Allen won a lot of money like a hundred million dollars to be your starting center makes a lot of sense you drafted the best guy that was available on the board of emblem on every mobility who is a four slash five I don't know much about college players some people say he can run the four some people say he can't I don't know we'll find out soon you still have Kevin Love wrapped up to to a deal I don't know what happened with Kevin Love and then you bring in Laurie marketing who should be coming off the bench to start the season I mean let's be honest you don't you don't draft Evan mobility at number three to have him come off the bench so instead you're paying this guy about 15 18 million dollars a deer depending on how this deal is structured to come off the bench at a position that is competing with two of your younger players that you want to develop it feels a bit weird now I say that and then I realize that Laurie marketing ceiling is higher than Larry Nancy's Larry Nancy's a better player right now that is 100% sure like true but I do believe that Laurie marketing ceiling hasn't been reached just yet I do believe that the last couple years for the Chicago Bulls week we didn't get a full grasp of what Laurie marketing could be will he ever get to the point that me and me and some Bulls fans still believe he could get to maybe not maybe he does so I understand getting a younger player to fit the timeline a little bit better but this is this is a a basketball fan that's not in the the city of Cleveland it felt like Larry Nance was the team it felt like Larry Nance was the heart it felt like Larry Nance embody what the Cleveland Cavaliers really are and I technically I think he's like a hometown kid right um because his father of course played for the Cavaliers and he was doing these things where he was wearing shirts and clothing brands of like local businesses he was just doing everything for the city of Cleveland so it feels weird to ship him off when he was the better player on a better deal but again we can look back on this trade in two years be like oh Laurie marketing that four year 60 something million ain't that bad because he might end up being better but now he's competing with five other players for his minutes Laurie marketing came out and said I want the bag I would classify this as a bag for Laurie marketing he came out and said he wanted to change the scenery Cleveland is dramatically different than Chicago but he also said he wanted to be a starter and there's a there's a fly I don't think he's going into Cleveland as a starter and if he is at the moment you can't tell me that mobile he won't end up taking that spot you didn't pay Jared Allen come off the bench and I saw some people thinking Laurie marketing go run some three for them oh let me tell you something about Laurie marketing you don't want that man running the three we tried that oh best believe we tried that a little bit and then it was it was terrible he doesn't have the lateral quickness he doesn't have the defensive upside to guard threes he basically don't really have that much of a defensive outside the guard fours around the league you want to slide over to three it's not happening or if it does happen it's not going to be a successful trip so this definitely feels very weird for them I don't know about the individual players in the Cleveland Cavalier locker room but I I do believe that Cavalier fans loved Larry Nance Jr and let's talk about Larry Nance Jr secondly because I love this deal for the Portland Trailblazers we gave up a guy and there's Jones Jr who wasn't playing for us the guy back Larry Nance Jr we giving up a a lot to protect the first round picking if Damian Lillard is staying there for the entirety of the season they're gonna be a playoff team they're gonna be a playoff team so maybe that pick is what 20th last year I think they had the 23rd pick and that was when Narcissus injured that was when CJ broke his his ankle you know like we talked about a couple days ago we were talking about the Portland Trailblazers they're they're a good team they're a playoff team and they're gonna be a playoff team as long as Damian Lillard is is healthy and this raises I believe that Larry Nance Jr is one of those role players that raise the floor of your organization raise the floor of a good team the man was like leading the league and steals for like the first couple months of the season off the bench leading the league and deflections off the bench you know he is a guy that will instantly come in and steal some minutes away and they need that type of player um the last couple years they've added Robert Coveton who has a great defensive upside or great defensive player and now Larry Nance Jr and that's coming from a team that was like number three when it comes to the worst defenses in the league Larry Nance Jr helps that out um a lot so I love this deal yeah you gave up a first round pick but if you're trying to keep Damian Lillard healthy and you're trying to put together a great team around Damian Lillard which it seems like Neil O'Shea and the team are trying to do who cares about that pick you gave up two first round picks to get Robert Coveton anyway who cares and it is lottery protected so if hypothetically they want to say the office tomorrow said this is it that's all for me hey that pick we can tank and we can still get a lottery pick so I love this deal for the Portland Trailblazers Larry Nance Jr is a really good player and I think since he wasn't clear that not a lot of people really realize that and once he's playing on national tv or it's playing in playoff series a lot of people realize that Larry Nance Jr is really really solid now let's talk about my bulls you see I saved them for last so people can't say oh my god Kenya's a homer he only wants to talk about the bulls but the bulls got a first round pick got a good role player Derek Jones Jr who will legitimately get minutes on this team maybe he didn't get a lot of minutes in Portland but he will get minutes here on this team and a second round pick for a guy that everybody knew was probably done in Chicago for a guy that we didn't even want which is really solid I think one of the major criticisms for this bulls off seasons that are this bulls front office in general when you include the Nicola Bucevic trade too is that they gave up um three first round picks to get a okay slash good team and now we get one back so does that soften or blow a little bit do you look at the bulls front office a little bit different now that we added a lot of your protective pick even though the picks that we traded way might be outside the lottery I don't really know again I would have loved Larry Nance Jr but I like the idea of getting back a first round pick in exchange for a player that we did not want Derek Jones Jr I'll talk to him um on a series that his episode might be dropping on YouTube in a couple days so go to the through through the wire YouTube channel go subscribe because me and Derek Jones Jr talk this is maybe this is maybe in January February you're still in Portland and they were you know still doing this thing and he was just saying like the the way he went from the g league to being an NBA player to getting like a long-term NBA contract was on the defensive side of the ball he really valued defensive possessions like no other and of course he's one of the bouncers players in the league is going to be fun to see him try to jump over people and do crazy dunks um I think we need his defense more than his highlight ability and that would be really solid so I'm loving the bulls man what can I say how how can I not be excited about this bull season if anything it's just different and different is good where you compare it to what we had for the past five years so yeah initial grades just initial grades we can come back to this trade in three years and regrade it I think the bulls walk out of here with like an a first-round pick good role player second-round pick on the Portland Trebleys walk out of here with an a good role player for a player that wasn't playing for you and a pick that you don't really care about for the Cavaliers I'm giving it like a c maybe c plus as initially we got to see what version of lorry marketing y'all really get because I remember his sophomore season he averaged 25 points in the month of February I ain't forgot about that I don't know if that lorry marketing is still alive somewhere deep down in there but it might come out even though he's competing with four other players I don't know I don't know you let me know what you think in the comment section about this trade those are my initial thoughts go watch the video from last night if you missed it I think it was one of the more fun videos it's not news related but it is super fun oh and it relates to this video in more ways than one so go check that out


What's up everybody Jason here from jazby's case breaks.com We're giving away four triple header spots being given away here in this 2020 Bowman Chrome hobby one box break random teams number one So again the way this works guys is first we'll randomize the customer names and teams to distribute the hits out of this Bowman Chrome hobby box remember no veteran commons will ship out of here and then we do the break showcase the hits and at The end of the break will take all 30 customer names and randomize them again and the top four names Will win spots in the triple case break, which again is sold out We just got to sell out one more fellow that's on the website number two and these are $270 spots guys and it's three cases of Bowman hobby a total of 36 boxes So you save yourself quite a quite a bit for 45 bucks. So good luck guys Let's do the break first we roll it and it is a two and a four for six times. Good luck one two three four five and six Zach Paul down to Darren. Now. Let's go six times here one two three four six boom Reds down to the Astros No trades guys, but since this is a box. I'll go through the teams Zach Paul the Reds Giants Aaron with the Marlins Paul Cross with the Orioles Aaron with the Padres John Paul with the Royals Zaki of the Rays Tamer with the Mets Tony with the Phillies Our guard debacks Ryushi with the Phillies Zach. Oh, you have the Nationals Matthew with the Twins and Dodgers and with the Cardinals Mike with the Indians Matthew the Braves Zachary G with the Pirates I call the Rockies Ryan See with the A's Ben with the Blue Jays John with the Yankees Frank of the Cubs DMACC with the Angels Nicobo the Brewers I call the Mariners Steve with the Rangers Zach Paul the White Sox Cameron with the Detroit Tigers I call the Red Sox and Darren Redding with the Houston Astros So stick what you got guys just a little box right here. Although there's potential for fire here, though You never know It's not just a pack. It's just a box, but Let's check it out and see what we got here And then we'll come back around my customer names again, and then we'll see who gets bots in the three case break Three case or the house this that pop out of here. Was that just here? Was it there? Did it pop out of did it pop out of these boxes? What crazy is that? Don't it's on video, so I'll go there before okay. I was like confused right now.   Let's roll it And we got a five and a two this time seven times. Good luck one two three four five six and Seventh and final time Boom John Paul John Paul Ryan and Franklin last spot mojo Congratulations top four get in one more way to win already up guys number two appreciate it. Jasper's case breaks calm


So we're here at the SID display week and hi, so who are you? I'm Elise Alcafagi, I'm the marketing manager for Nova Centrics. Today we're displaying our new pulse forge and vent system. It's a highly configurable photonic curing system for R&D and academic budgets. So this is a new product? Yes, this is our newest tool. The base configuration starts at 59K, as I mentioned before it's highly configurable so you can add additional lamp drivers to increase the power of the tool for different kinds of material processing. It's like a rack down here? Yes. So what kind of things do you put in there? So each one of these are the lamp drivers. The base configuration comes with one lamp driver system. And how does it compare with the other products you have shown before? Sure, so it's actually very similar to the pulse forge 1200 and 1300, but it starts out at, I would say, the pulse forge 1200 level. So if you're working with conductive silver based inks on low temp substrates then a base configuration would be well fitting for meeting those needs. An event sounds like it could be suitable for students or universities or something like that? Yes, so we've been working with a lot of students and going out to a lot of universities and working with them to get one of these systems in their labs. So how many did you get so far? How many? There's like thousands more you should reach because there's lots of labs, right? Sure. And everybody needs to get involved with this. This is the future, right? This is the future of print electronic applications. So I think we are close to nearing our first sale in Spain. And then we're working on a couple in the US as well, but we've visited now I think over 20 different schools, so we're working with several colleges and universities. And the way that people do print electronics, is it basically your way or does it other ways too? Do you cover most of the different ways people want to do this? Yes, so there's a lot of different things you can do with the tool more than just curing. There's also soldering. So Michael Parker Vahid is actually going to introduce one of the new techniques for using the tool, which we call photonic soldering. Soldering. Usually people have a machine and they solder stuff. Is it what you're talking about? So this is a soldering process that happens in a matter of milliseconds or using traditional soldering paste, but processing it on low temperature materials. All right. Thanks. So let's see. So hi. So who are you? Hi, I'm Vahid Ahavan. I'm one of the applications engineers at Nova Centrics. And as my colleague Elise has said, we're here at the Hitachi Boot at the SID display week conference. And we're part of their portfolio of processes that we provide for the micro electronics and the print electronics world. So you partner with Hitachi? Yes. Hitachi is one of our partner organizations that we work with. Like helping you achieve more things, do more stuff? Right, exactly. We're trying to increase our bandwidth to get into different markets and provide capabilities that are currently lacking within the ecosystem that they have here at the conference. So can you show how this machine is working? Right. This machine works very similarly to our other machines in that we have a very high-power flash lamp. Yeah. We have a set of capacitor banks that get charged up with our power supply, and then they discharge it in a very digital format across the flash head. And that discharging process enables us to create a very high-power flash of light in a very controlled fashion. And we place our samples here on the sample tray and we'll be able to process it. Our bread and butter still remains the printed electronics processing of silver and conductive traces on plastics or paper, but we're also getting into more advanced applications whereby we're able to do new things. Some things that come into play for the display kind of ecosystem involve we do some work on delamination, but the work that I would like to demonstrate today is soldering. And the process of soldering is very similar to what you described earlier in that we have the ability to go ahead and use a little soldering iron to solder, but really that's not feasible when you want to do something on plastic, and that's not really not feasible when you want to do it in a very high throughput environment. So what we have here, we have a plastic sheet, right, so this is a PEN substrate, and we have actually printed, screen printed silver traces on top of it, so you can see the silver traces going across the top. And what we have here, we have stencil printed solder paste, and that's similar to the solder wire you get. This is SAC 304, which is a very standard lead-free solder that is used. And then we have pick and place LEDs onto this format. So as you can see, these small bumps are LEDs.  Right, there's a whole bunch of LEDs that you put them on, and that's actually this limiting factor on the process. You put those on, and then through one flash of light, we're able to heat up both the component and the solder, and reflow the solder so that it actually attaches the component to that circuit. But to put all these little lights on there, you do it manually or? It's a pick and place machine. There's another machine. Yeah, so pick and place machine takes, so these components come commercially available, and the pick and place machine just takes one component and we tell it where it needs to sit. And once you program that machine, it can do maybe 60 components a minute. So one component a second, and then it can place it wherever we tell it to price. And then you put it in your machine to make it fix? Right, and then we put it into our machine and we flash it, and it actually heats up the component and the solder paste and reflow the solder paste, similar to that little iron that reflow the solder paste, enabling us to actually attach the component to the circuit. Is this something you've been doing for a long time, or is it new? This is a new application for us. The Photonic Soldering application, we started it late last year. We are still expanding upon it and our ability to do it. We think it fits very well with the display ecosystem because in the display ecosystem people are starting to move away from LCDs and OLEDs into actually LED-based displays, where you have actually each pixel is a combination of red, green and blue small LED package that needs to be soldered in a matrix together, and then that enables us to make a big display. So you're going to be part of the micro-LED world? We are hoping to be part of micro-LED world. We think that this kind of capability can be miniaturized to enable us to process micro-LED displays. Alright, so what else is next? So let me light this up for you so you can see it actually in action. So there's no mistakes in it? There's no mistakes. Reliable? Yes, exactly. So this enables us to really do quite a lot of work related to it. The other application that we are targeting at the show is called delamination, where we use our high-power units to delaminate polyamide substrate from the carrier glass. This is currently done in the OLED manufacturing designs with lasers, where they take laser from behind it. Once the OLED material is built, they take laser and they shine laser at the interface between the glass substrate, the polyamide substrate and the glass carrier. And that releases that layer from the carrier. And then you have a freestanding, flexible display material. One of our aims with doing it with our tool is that there are a couple of drawbacks when you use laser. One of the big ones being speed. You have a very low speed because you have a very small illumination area that you have to raster in a very continuous format to actually delaminate the display from a glass. And that creates a very expensive delamination process. The other issue is that you have a very low yield because if you, for example, have a defect in your polyamide material, the defect acts as a lens. It can actually burn out that part of your OLED material. And so you get a defect in your device and then you have to cut it out. The other issue is that when you are using laser, you get an ashing process where there is some decomposed polyamide remaining behind your release layer. With this process what we do, we take the carrier glass and we deposit the absorber. We deposit a very thin metallic layer on top of that that enables us to take advantage of the absorbance of the metallic layer and heat up the interface between the deposit polyamide and the metallic layer. And then once we cure that, we can easily release that as well. Release the polyamide layer from the tungsten absorber layer. That process has some advantages. One is that because of our high illumination area, we can process a much faster rate. We can process up to 100 meters per minute if necessary. The other advantage is that the light never actually shines on the polyamide substrate so that what happens is that you don't get any ashing. You don't have an issue with defects. And so as a result of both those issues, your yield could be higher in the process. So there's a lot of people in the industry, in the industry, in those solutions you have? We have had quite a lot of interest, yes. We are working with several partners very closely to be able to bring those applications to realization.